e_ 16 NOMINATION OF WILLIAM B. CAMP

GOVERNMEN1-J

Storage

HEARING

BEFORE THE

COMMITTEE ON BANKING AND CURRENCY

UNITED STATES SENATE

NINETIETH CONGRESS

FIRST SESSION

ON

THE NOMINATION OF

WILLIAM B. CAMP TO BE COMPTROLLER OF THE CURRENCY

JANUARY 18, 1967

Printed for the use of the

Committee on Banking and Currency

U.S. GOVERNMENT PRINTING OFFICE

73-562 WASHINGTON : 1967
COMMITTEE ON BANKING AND CURRENCY

JOHN SPARKMAN, Alabama, Chairman

WILLIAM PROXMIRE, Wisconsin WALLACE F. BENNETT, Utah

HARRISON A. WILLIAMS, JR., New Jeisey JOHN G. TOWER, Texas

EDMUND S. MUSKIE, Maine BOURKE B. HICKENLOOPER, Iowa

EDWARD V. LONG, Missouri EDWARD W. BROOKE, Massachusetts

THOMAS J. McINTYRE, New Hampshire CHARLES H. PERCY, Illinois

WALTER F. MONDALE, Minnesota

GALE W. McGEE, Wyoming

WILLIAM B. SPONG, Ix., Virginia

LEWIS G. 00011, Jr., Staff Director

MATTHEW HALE, Chief Counsel

JOHN R. EVANS, Minority Staff Director

II
CONTENTS

WITNESSES

Page

Brewster, Daniel B., U.S. Senator from the State of Maryland 3

Camp, William B., nominee, to be Comptroller of the Currency 4

Yarborough, Ralph, U.S. Senator from the State of Texas 3

DATA SUPPLIED FOR THE RECORD

Camp, William B., biographical information on 

Tower, John G., U.S. Senator from the State of Texas, answers to questions

he submitted to Mr. Camp 

U.S. Code, excerpts concerning the position of Comptroller of the Currency 

1

5

2

NOMINATION OF WILLIAM B. CAMP

WEDNESDAY, JANUARY 18, 1967

U.S. SENATE,

COMMITTEE ON BANKING AND CURRENCY,

Washington, D.C.

The committee met at 10:40 a.m., pursuant to call, in room 5302,

New Senate Office Building, Senator John Sparkman (chairman)

presiding.

Present: Senators Sparkman, Proxmire, Williams, Muskie, Long,

McIntyre, Mondale, McGee, Spong, Bennett, Tower, Brooke, and

Percy.

The CHAIRMAN. Let the committee come to order, please. We

have a quorum present. Some of the members are not here yet, but

I understand they will come in later.

In the beginning I should like to welcome the new members to the

committee.

Senator Spong, of Virginia, we are delighted to have you. I am

sure that you will enjoy the work on this committee.

Senator Brooke, we are glad to have you, sir, and I am sure you

will also enjoy the work on the committee.

Senator Percy is on his way. Have you heard from Senator McGee?

STAFF MEMBER. He will be here shortly.

The CHAIRMAN. The first business before the committee is to

consider the nomination of Mr. William B. Camp of Maryland to be

Comptroller of the Currency.

The Chair would like to insert here a brief biographical sketch of

Mr. Camp, together with excerpts from the United States Code concerning the position of Comptroller of the Currency.

BIOGRAPHICAL SKETCH OF WILLIAM B. CAMP

William B. Camp, selected by President Johnson today to succeed James J.

Saxon as Comptroller of the Currency, is a veteran of nearly 30 years' service in

the Comptroller's Office.

For the past three years, he has been first deputy Comptroller, the highest

position to which a career employee can be appointed.

Born in Greenville, Texas, November 25, 1913, Mr. Camp was educated at

San Jacinto High School in Houston, at Texas Military College in Terrell, and at

Baylor University in Waco. He joined the staff of the Comptroller's Office in

February, 1937, was named an assistant National Bank Examiner in 1941, and

received his commission as a National Bank Examiner from Secretary of the Treasury Snyder in September, 1949.

Mr. Camp served as a National Bank Examiner in the Fifth National Bank

Region and, for several years, was responsible for the examination of the larger

banks in the District of Columbia, Baltimore and their related metropolitan areas.

On numerous occasions during this period, he was assigned special duties in other

areas of the United States.

In January 1961, Mr. Camp was promoted to Assistant Chief National Bank

Examiner in the Washington office and, in April 1962, was named Deputy Comp1.
2 NOMINATION OF WILLIAM B. CAMP

troller of the Currency by Secretary of the Treasury Dillon. His promotion to

First Deputy Comptroller followed in October 1963.

Mr. Camp is an elder in the Bethesda Christian Church, Bethesda, Maryland,

and chairman of its Board of Trustees. He and Mrs. Camp, the former Miss

Eileen Conner, of the District of Columbia, reside at 9518 Kentstone Drive,

Bethesda.

For the past four years, Mr. Camp has served on the faculty of the Stonier

Graduate School of Banking at Rutgers University.

His principal hobbies are fishing and hunting.

COMPTROLLER OF THE CURRENCY

Title 12, United States Code, section 1 (U.S.R.S., sec. 324; Fed. Res. Act, sec.

10, par 8).—There shall be in the Department of the Treasury a bureau charged

with the execution of all laws passed by Congress relating to the issue and regulation of a national currency secured by United States bonds and, under the general

supervision of the Board of Governors of the Federal Reserve System, of all Federal Reserve notes, the chief officer of which bureau shall be called the Comptroller

of the Currency and shall perform his duties under the general directions of the

Secretary of the Treasury.

APPOINTMENT OF THE COMPTROLLER OF THE CURRENCY

Title 12, United States Code, section 2 (U.S.R.S., sec. 325).—The Comptroller

of the Currency shall be appointed by the President, by and with the advice and

consent of the Senate, and shall hold his office for a term of five years unless sooner

removed by the President, upon reasons to be communicated by him to the

Senate; and he shall receive a salary at the rate of $15,000 a year.'

OATH AND BOND OF THE COMPTROLLER OF THE CURRENCY

Title 12, United States Code, section 3 (U.S.R.S., sec. 326).—The Comptroller

of the Currency shall, within fifteen days from the time of notice of his appointment, take and subscribe the oath of office; and he shall give to the United States

a bond in the penalty of $250,000, with not less than two responsible sureties, to

be approved by the Secretary of the Treasury, conditioned for the faithful discharge of the duties of his office.

INTEREST IN NATIONAL BANKS

Title 12, United States Code, section 11 (U.S.R.S., sec. 329).—It shall not be

lawful for the Comptroller or the Deputy Comptroller of the Currency, either

directly or indirectly, to be interested in any association issuing national currency

under the laws of the United States.

Mr. Camp is here today to testify and to answer any questions

that the members of the committee may wish to ask him.

Mr. Camp has a distinguished background, having most recently

been First Deputy Comptroller to Mr. Saxon. He has had long experience in the office, and he comes to us with the recommendation of the

Senators from Maryland; where he now lives, and the Senators from

Texas, where he was reared.

Mr. Camp has a big pair of shoes to fill. Mr. Saxon, the previous

Comptroller, as we all know, was a most vigorous and imaginative

comptroller. He did much to reorganize and revitalize the national

bank system and, in fact, the whole banking industry. We trust

that Mr. Camp will be able to preserve the benefits of Mr. Saxon's

reforms and improvements and at the same time to bring about coordination and smooth operations with the financial agencies in the

financial world.

We are glad to have Senators here from both of Mr. Camp's States.

He now lives in Maryland. We have Senator Brewster here from

1 The Comptroller of the Currency's compensation is now fixed by the Federal Executive Salary Act of

1964 at $28,500:

0
NOMINATION OF WILLIAM B. CAMP 3

Maryland, and we have Senator Yarborough representing the State

of Texas. We should be glad to hear from you two gentlemen.

Observing the rule of seniority, we will ask Senator Yarborough to

speak first.

Senator YARBOROUGH. Senator Brewster's constituent and Senator

Brewster have graciously consented to waive in my favor for a moment,

since I am working on another committee, so I can go back and

relieve the chairman, who must go to another committee. There are

only two of us there.

I do want to say since we lost Mr. Camp to Maryland some years

ago, his wife is from the District. There are many people from the

old Sam Rayburn district in Washington. He came to Washington

on the recommendation of the late great Speaker, Sam Rayburn,

and like so many people in America Sam Rayburn has recommended,

he has done well and has won many promotions through his diligent

work. And as I say, we lost him some years ago, but the people

still remember you down there, and we are very proud that you

have justified, in your service, all the fine recommendations that

Speaker Rayburn made back there in the 1930's.

Mr. Camp is a former student of San Jacinto High School in

Houston, Texas Military College in Terrell, and Baylor University

at Waco and, I believe

'

has taught at the Stonier Graduate School of

Banking at Rutgers University and has had wide Government

experience that this committee knows of.

It is a pleasure to come before this distinguished committee for a

moment here before going to other duties, to see a person who left

my State and rendered extremely valuable service to this Government.

thank the chairman and the committee.

The CHAIRMAN. Thank you very much, Senator.

Smator Brewster?

Senator BREWSTER. Mr. Chairman and members of the committee,

allow me to thank you one and all for the privilege of appearing

before you this morning to recommend the confirmation of a fellow

Marylander. I do this with great pleasure.

Mr. Camp is a respected member of the Rockville community

in Maryland, and though he comes from Texas, we consider him

one of ours now, because he has lived with us so long, and we are

very proud of him.

My colleague, Senator Yarborough, has mentioned the colleges

he went to, so I will not dwell on that, but I do want to comment

on the promotion of career employees. Mr. Camp has been in the

Government for a long time. He is a professional. He knows his

job. He was the Deputy, and now he is named as the top man.

This seems to me to be very fair and very proper and also, in the

long run, conducive to high morale among our Federal employees.

So as one who has known Mr. Camp, and speaking for my colleague

Senator Tydings also, we would strongly recommend to this committee

that his nomination as Comptroller of the Currency of the United

States be confirmed.

I thank you very much for allowing me this privilege.

The CHAIRMAN. Thank you very much, Mr. Brewster.

Senator TOWER. Mr. Chairman, would you yield to me to make a

supporting statement?
4 NOMINATION OF WILLIAM B. CAMP

The CHAIRMAN. Certainly.

Senator TOWER. I should also like to associate myself with remarks

made by my distinguished colleague, Senator Yarborough and my

distinguished colleague, Senator Brewster.

We, in Texas, are very proud of Mr. Camp, and we know he will do

an excellent and selfless job, and I would like to join my colleagues in

heartily recommending and favorably reporting his confirmation.

The CHAIRMAN. Thank you very much, Senator Tower.

We have a biographical sketch of Mr. Camp available to the members. There is one before each of you.

May I say that Senator Percy has now come in.

Senator Percy, we welcome you to the committee and look forward

to very pleasant relationships with all the new members.

Senator Proxmire, do you have any questions of Mr. Camp?

Senator PROXMIRE. I do not have any questions. I am highly

in favor of the appointment for the reasons given by Senator Brewster,

but also I understand, Mr. Camp, you have demonstrated the same

kind of vigor and imagination and force as your predecessor has demonstrated, and I think we greatly need that in the position which you

are assuming. This has been an industry in which there is some

tendency to observe the status quo and not look for new or imaginative ideas, and I think Mr. Saxon, though he was controversial,

brought a blast of zooming, fresh air to the office, and I think you are

the kind of man who will continue that. And also, as the chairman

said, you will do your best to work for coordination and smoothness

in the operation of your office. So I am delighted to see this nomination.

There is one question I have, a perfunctory question. In view of

your previous position, I believe you have no problems as to conflict

of interest, that your holdings would not in any way contradict your

job. One of the difficulties in your job is that almost anything you

hold is likely to make it somewhat sensitive.

Mr. CAMP. Senator, I have no conflict of interests in that regard

whatsoever. As a former National Bank Examiner, we are precluded

by statute from owning stocks in any bank which we are authorized

to examine, and we have to give a sworn statement to that effect,

and that continues throughout our career with the office. So there

is no conflict whatsoever.

Senator PROXMIRE. I see. You are covered by title 12, U.S. Code,

section 11, as Deputy as well as Comptroller?

Mr. CAMP. That is the view that our office has taken; yes, sir.

Senator PROXMIRE. Thank you.

The CHAIRMAN. Senator Bennett?

Senator BENNETT. I just want to add my voice of welcome to

Mr. Camp to this committee and his new position. I am sure he is

going to carry the responsibility of that position with great credit to

himself and great benefit to the banking industry that he has already

held for so many years, and I am happy to say that I will be delighted

to vote for his confirmation.

The CHAIRMAN. Senator Muskie?

Senator MUSKIE. Mr. Chairman, the support which is mobilized

behind Mr. Camp is so overwhelming and I am glad to accept it. I

have not had the pleasure of knowing Mr. Camp, but I had a very

pleasant and satisfying talk with him in my office. I appreciated the
NOMINATION OF WILLIAM B. CAMP 5

opportunity to discuss some of his thinking about the problems with

which he is faced, and I am happy to wish him luck on this occasion.

Mr. CAMP. Thank you, sir.

The CHAIRMAN. Mr. Tower?

Senator TOWER. Mr. Chairman, I have only two rather lengthy

questions. I should simply like to submit these in writing for Mr.

Camp to answer for the record, if I may.

The CHAIRMAN. You may do that.

(The questions and answers referred to follow:)

THE ADMINISTRATOR OF NATIONAL BANKS,

Washington, January 28, 1967.

Hon. JOHN G. TOWER,

U.S. Senate,

Washington, D.C.

DEAR SENATOR TOWER: I thank you for your courtesy and consideration at

my confirmation hearing on January 18, 1967. During the hearing you submitted

two written questions and requested my written response thereto. Your first

question was as follows:

"It is my understanding that you have expressed a policy of following at least

to some extent the program of your predecessor.

"I noted two interviews, one with you and one with Mr. Saxon which appeared

in Banking Magazine recently.

"In the December issue Mr. Saxon said, speaking of the need for additional

bank mergers—

"'There is a crying need for larger aggregates of banking resources and bigger

pools of capital. In Florida today there is no bank big enough to meet a mere

fraction of the state's banking needs. Houston is another case in point; it hasn't

a single billion-dollar bank. The biggest bank they have there is totally inadequate

and must draw capital from Chicago and other distant centers. Dallas, too,

lacks a bank of adequate size. We need more larger banks.'

"In the January issue of Banking Magazine you seemed to agree with Mr.

Saxon's statement when you said—

"Some metropolitan areas need bigger banks in order to attract and retain

valuable business which is presently going to other financial centers.'

"Could you elaborate somewhat on your thinking and perhaps Mr. Saxon's

thinking on the Houston and Dallas situations?"

Answer: Major metropolitan areas require banks which are capable of satisfying the financial requirements of local residents and businesses. An ideal

structure would allow all such requirements to be satisfied locally. The degree

to which local banking needs can be met by local banks varies substantially from

area to area. Some cities, however, have no bank which has the capital and deposit structure necessary to meet most or all of the credit needs of every class of

bank customer within their trade areas. Many of these banks are further handicapped because they cannot afford to hire trained and experienced personnel to

service specialized customer requirements. Consequently, much valuable banking business which originates in these localities goes to other cities, often hundreds

of miles sway.

Assessing the reasons why certain metropolitan areas have not produced

larger banks is an exercise which usually results in heated discussion of the merits

of branch, group, and chain banking. Whatever the reasons, however, it is undoubtedly true that some localities have an urgent need for some increase in

concentration of banking resources.

Whether or not there is a need for increased banking concentration in a particular

area and whether or not a proposed bank merger will respond to such need are

inquiries not easily answered. Because each merger application presents unique

questions, every decision to approve or disapprove requires careful investigation

and deliberation and, not infrequent, some prognostication.

I believe I should not attempt to speak for Mr. Saxon or to explain or interpret

to you his thinking with regard to the Houston and Dallas areas. Also, since I

may be required to decide future mergers which may come from these areas, I do

not think it would be appropriate for me to prejudge any application by speculating

as to the condition of any given market.

Your second question was as follows:

"In December mention was made in a periodical issued by an important element

of the financial industry that the FDIC has continued to refuse the Government
6 NOMINATION OF WILLIAM B. CAMP

Accounting Office access to Federal Deposit Insurance Corporation bank examination reports, whereas the Federal Savings and Loan Insurance Corporation has

given full cooperation to the GAO in connection with the files of the Home Loan

Bank Board.

"I read the explanation given by Joe Barr of the FDIC position, but I thought

perhaps you might give us your thinking about the issue as a new member of the

'FDIC board."

Answer: The FDIC does not give the GAO access to reports of examination of

open banks because the FDIC believes that preserving the basic concept of

absolute confidentiality of such reports is essential to proper bank supervision and

to the functioning of deposit insurance in the public interest. The FDIC's

position is based on its total experience, its understanding of the intent of Congress

and the special nature of bank examination and supervisory processings. Only

recently a judicial decision upheld this basic concept, stressing the latter point.

The GAO, on the other hand, believes that it should have access to all FDIC

records, including open bank examination reports, because the financial condition of the FDIC is inseparably linked with the banks it insures. Apparently,

this viewpoint also extends to independent verification of examiner findings

through separate bank examination.

We can appreciate the desire of the GAO to carry out its mandate to audit

the financial transactions of the FDIC. We concur, however, in the FDIC's

position.

The FDIC, in performing its functions, acquires a very large body of data

about banks and bank management. This information traditionally has been

freely furnished by bankers on the underStanding that it would not be made

available to anyone other than those agencies directly concerned with bank

supervision. By its very nature, much of this information could not be obtained on other than a confidential basis, for it is necessarily a mixture of fact,

judgment, and personal opinion. If the Federal and State supervisors of banks

had not clearly treated most of this material in strict confidence through the years,

the sources of essential information would be denied them and effective bank

supervision would be severely inhibited. In that context, a public interest and

public confidence issue of some magnitude is at stake, rather than the sanctity of

the FDIC's records during an audit limited by statutory language to records

pertaining to financial transactions.

Sincerely,

WILLIAM B. CAMP,

Acting Comptroller of the Currency.

}The CHAIRMAN. Senator Long?

Senator LONG. No questions, except like Senator Muskie, I have

had a very pleasant and satisfying visit with Mr. Camp in my office

this morning. I agree with the chairman in the hope that he does

continue to be progressive and advancing in view in this position,

but certainly not quite as controversial as his predecessor. I would

certainly be delighted to vote for him.

The CHAIRMAN. Senator Brooke?

Senator BROOKE. Mr. Chairman, I only know Mr. Camp by his

excellent reputation, and I am pleased that one of the first duties I

have in the U.S. Senate is to vote affirmatively on his confirmation.

Mr. CAMP. Thank you.

The CHAIRMAN. Senator McIntyre?

Senator MCINTYRE. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I have no

questions except to say I have had a delightful conversation with

Mr. Camp, and I would just like to add my congratulations to his

nomination and say I have no hesitancy in voting for his approval.

The CHAIRMAN. Senator Percy?

Senator PERCY. I have no questions, other than the comment that

as a son of a former assistant national bank examiner I am happy

to see promotions come from within the organization.

The CHAIRMAN. Senator Mondale?
NOMINATION OF WILLIAM B. CAMP 7

Senator MONDALE. I have no questions, Mr. Chairman. I am

delighted to support him.

The CHAIRMAN. Senator McGee? By the way, Senator McGee

has come in since we started. He is a new member of the committee.

We welcome you to the committee. Glad to have you.

Senator McGEE. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I would question,

with the low voting order that I operate under here, that it would be

to the witness' advantage to be endorsed by me, but I do endorse

him in spite of that position.

I think that we look forward to a very constructive administration.

Mr. CAMP. Thank you, sir.

The CHAIRMAN. Senator Spong?

Senator SPONG. I have no questions. I am very pleased to support

Mr. Camp's nomination.

The CHAIRMAN. I would say the committee will probably recommend you. Thank you, Mr. Camp. We are very happy to have you

and look forward to working with you, and wish you the greatest

success in your job.

Mr. CAMP. Thank you so much, all of you.

Senator BREWSTER. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

The CHAIRMAN. The committee will go into executive session.

(At 10:50 a.m., the hearing was concluded.)

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