From: Scott Brown <sbrown@cleanair.com>

Sent: Tuesday, April 23, 2013 3:43 PM

To: Garwood, Gerri

Cc: Green, David A.; Putney, David

Subject: RE: Method 428/429 glassware soak

Contamination issues and difficult to get tare weights on soxhelet rinsed filters.

On Apr 23, 2013 2:38 PM, "Garwood, Gerri" <Garwood.Gerri@epa.gov> wrote:

Scott, 

Out of curiosity, why the extra M5 train? 

You are current; the sample volumes were selected to ensure adequate detection 

limits. While it 

would be nice to have all of the data collected the same way, we are okay with 

decreasing the 

sample volume/time, as long as you can detect something in the shortened timeframe. 

And you 

must report all test runs. 

Sincerely, 

Gerri G. Garwood, P.E. 

-------------------------------------------------------- 

U.S. Environmental Protection Agency 

OAR/OAQPS/SPPD 

Measurement Policy Group 

Ph: 919-541-2406 Fax: 919-541-3207 

-----Original Message----- 

From: Scott Brown [mailto:sbrown@cleanair.com] 

Sent: Tuesday, April 23, 2013 2:04 PM 

To: Garwood, Gerri; Putney, David 

Cc: Green, David A. 

Subject: RE: Method 428/429 glassware soak 

Gerri/David,David, 

We are in the midst of testing this week and I need a quick answer to the following.

 The 

428/429 testing requires a sample volume of 3 dscm so we are doing 3 hour test runs 

(I assume 

this is for detection limit purposes). At a few of the locations we are also 

performing M5 

(FPM). To keep from having port conflicts we are doing 3 hour M5 test runs as well.

If we have to do an extra M5 test run does it need to be 3 hours in duration? 

I know the combo Metals/FPM train in the ICR calls for 4 dscm test run volumes but I

assume 

this is for metals detection purposes since FPM detection is not a problem. 

Is it possible to get a quick answer since we will likely be doing an extra M5 run 

today? Would 

a 1 or 2 hour run suffice? 

Regards, 

Scott Brown 

Project Manager 

CleanAir 

847-654-4544 

847-612-0561 (cell) 

-----Original Message----- 
From: Garwood, Gerri [mailto:Garwood.Gerri@epa.gov]

Sent: Friday, April 19, 2013 2:52 PM 

To: Scott Brown; Putney, David 

Cc: Green, David A. 

Subject: RE: Method 428/429 glassware soak 

Scott, 

This is treated as a minor modification to the method. I discussed with our methods

group, and 

because of the expected low moisture, this should be okay. 

Sincerely, 

Gerri G. Garwood, P.E. 

-------------------------------------------------------- 

U.S. Environmental Protection Agency 

OAR/OAQPS/SPPD 

Measurement Policy Group 

Ph: 919-541-2406 Fax: 919-541-3207 

-----Original Message----- 

From: Scott Brown [mailto:sbrown@cleanair.com] 

Sent: Friday, April 19, 2013 12:12 PM 

To: Putney, David 

Cc: Green, David A.; Garwood, Gerri 

Subject: RE: Method 428/429 glassware soak 

To all, Thanks for the response. 

I have had extensive conversations with the lab. These are low moisture sources so 

the extra 

knockout is not needed (1.5% or so). We are planning on soaking the condenser as in

Method 

23. The lab has no problem with us combining the acetone and toluene rinses since 

they would 

do that themselves if we did not. Thus the fractions will be: 

1) Acetone / toluene rinse (probe, filter holder, jumper (if used), condenser and 

any other 

connection glassware - Basically everything before the XAD trap 

2) Filter 

3) XAD trap 

4) Impinger liquid 

5) Impinger and connecting glassware acetone / toluene rinse 

Regards, 

Scott Brown 

-----Original Message----- 

From: Putney, David [mailto:putney.david@epa.gov] 

Sent: Friday, April 19, 2013 11:01 AM 

To: Scott Brown 

Cc: Green, David A.; Garwood, Gerri 

Subject: FW: Method 428/429 glassware soak 

Mr. Brown, 

Please see below for the response to your questions regarding Methods 428 and 429. 

Thanks, and have a great weekend. 

David Putney, Environmental Engineer 

U.S. Environmental Protection Agency 
Office of Air Quality Planning and Standards Sector Policies and Programs Division 

109 T.W. Alexander Drive, RTP, NC 27711 

Mail Drop D243-02 

Ph: (919) 541-2016 Fax: (919) 541-3207 

Email: putney.david@epa.gov 

-----Original Message----- 

From: Garwood, Gerri 

Sent: Friday, April 19, 2013 10:16 AM 

To: Putney, David 

Subject: RE: Method 428/429 glassware soak 

David, 

This is the response I got from MTG: 

This plan is acceptable, though the tester may want to add a knock out in front of 

the first 

impinger if water condensation might be an issue. 

Furthermore, the tester should verify this approach with the lab. In the field, 

they should keep 

the fractions separate (front half/back half with the XAD sorbent trap as the 

dividing line). The 

back half should only be analyzed for the PCBs/PAHs. 

So the fractions would be 

FH - acetone 

FH- toluene 

FH - filter 

XAD 

BH - impingers 

BH - acetone 

BH - toluene 

Rereading the original email, I realized Scott only mentioned soaking the connecting

glassware. The tester should also soak the condenser. 

Gerri 

-----Original Message----- 

From: Putney, David 

Sent: Wednesday, April 17, 2013 4:37 PM 

To: Garwood, Gerri 

Subject: FW: Method 428/429 glassware soak 

Gerri, 

Sorry, but I'm coming back to the well again. Would you please take a look at the 

request below 

and let me know if the tester's plan is acceptable?

Thanks, 

David Putney, Environmental Engineer 

U.S. Environmental Protection Agency 

Office of Air Quality Planning and Standards Sector Policies and Programs Division 

109 T.W. Alexander Drive, RTP, NC 27711 

Mail Drop D243-02 

Ph: (919) 541-2016 Fax: (919) 541-3207 

Email: putney.david@epa.gov 
-----Original Message----- 

From: Scott Brown [mailto:sbrown@cleanair.com] 

Sent: Wednesday, April 17, 2013 1:07 PM 

To: Green, David A. 

Cc: Putney, David 

Subject: RE: Method 428/429 glassware soak 

Mr. Green, 

One more question regarding the combination of CARB 428 and 429 and the designated 

impinger trains. 

428 calls for 4 impingers, all modified Greenberg Smith with the first impinger 

being a knock 

out impinger, second containing 100 ml DI H2O, third empty and fourth silica gel. 

429 calls for 4 impingers, all modified Greenberg Smith with the first two impingers

each 

containing 100 ml of 3mM NaHCO3 / 2.4 mM Na2CO3, third empty and fourth silica gel. 

I have been planning on combining these by using four impingers: knockout, modified,

modified, 

modified with impingers 1 and 2 continaing the NaHCO3 / Na2CO3 solution, the third 

empty 

and the fourth silica gel. 

Is this acceptable? 

Scott Brown 

CleanAir 

847-654-4544 

-----Original Message----- 

From: Green, David A. [mailto:green@rti.org] 

Sent: Monday, April 15, 2013 7:03 AM 

To: sbrown@cleanair.com 

Cc: putney.david@epa.gov 

Subject: Method 428/429 glassware soak 

Mr. Brown: 

We recommend doing the five minute soak to ensure the best quality data. 

Even though CARB 428/429 don't require it, those methods also use different solvents

so it 

makes sense for the procedures to be somewhat different. 

David Green 

RTI International 

919.316.3412 

www.rti.org 

-----Original Message----- 

From: Scott Brown [mailto:sbrown@cleanair.com] 

Sent: Thursday, April 11, 2013 1:51 PM 

To: Green, David A. 

Subject: RE: solvents for M428/429 

Thank you for your quick response. 

To verify. CARB Methods 428 and 429 call for rinsing all components of the train 

three times 

with the recovery solvents but do not require a 5 minute soak (in triplicate) of the
connecting 

glassware with the final rinse solvent as Method 23 does. 

Since we are using CARB 428 / 429 per the ICR should we follow the 

method(s) and not soak, just rinse? 

Scott Brown 

Project Manager 

CleanAir 

-----Original Message----- 

From: Green, David A. [mailto:green@rti.org] 

Sent: Thursday, April 11, 2013 12:43 PM 

To: Scott Brown 

Subject: RE: solvents for M428/429 

Mr. Brown: 

The use of acetone/toluene for recovery is acceptable. Basically, you should follow

Method 23 

recovery but may skip the methylene chloride step. 

Please let me know if any other questions arise. 

David Green 

RTI International 

919.316.3412 

www.rti.org 

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