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### 1

_______________________________________________________ REPORTER'S TRANSCRIPT

_______________________________________________________

PUBLIC HEARING

FOR

PROPOSED AMENDMENTS TO NATIONAL EMISSION STANDARDS FOR HAZARDOUS AIR POLLUTANTS FROM COAL AND OIL-FIRED ELECTRIC UTILITY STEAM GENERATING UNITS AND STANDARDS OF PERFORMANCE FOR FOSSIL-FUEL-FIRED ELECTRIC UTILITY, INDUSTRIAL-COMMERCIAL-INSTITUTIONAL, AND SMALL INDUSTRIAL-COMMERCIAL-INSTITUTIONAL STEAM GENERATING UNITS

EPA REGION IV OFFICE SAM NUNN ATLANTA FEDERAL CENTER (AFC) 61 FORSYTH STREET SW ATLANTA, GEORGIA 30303

26 MAY 2011AGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 2 1 MR. CLARK: We'll go ahead and start the 

### 2 hearing on time if we could just because we've got so 

### 3 many speakers today. Excuse me. 

### 4Good morning. Thank you all for attending 

### 5 this public hearing. It's one of three that the 

### 6 Environmental Protection Agency is holding to take 

### 7 comment on our proposed emission standards to control 

### 8 mercury and other air toxics from coal and oil-fired 

### 9 power plants. 

### 10 We've held hearings already two days ago in 

### 11 Chicago and Philadelphia and this is our third hearing 

### 12 on the matter. 

### 13 My name is Jeff Clark. I'm the Associate 

### 14 Director for the EPA's Office of Air Quality Planning 

### 15 and Standards, located in Research Triangle Park, North 

### 16 Carolina. 

### 17 And joining me for this hearing is Kevin 

### 18 Culligan. Kevin is an Associate Director for the 

### 19 Division that is responsible for developing this 

### 20 regulation, Bill Maxwell, who's the primary author of 

### 21 the regulation, and Beverly Banister, who's the 

### 22 Director of the Pesticides, Toxics, and Air Division 

### 23 for EPA Region Four, which includes the surrounding 

### 24 eight states. 

### 25 As many of you know, on March the sixteenth,AGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 3 1 the Environmental Protection Agency proposed these, 

### 2 these air toxic standards for coal and oil-fired power 

### 3 plants. 

### 4The Clean Air Act Standards, these standards 

### 5 proposed would reduce significantly emissions of toxic 

### 6 air pollutants, also known as hazardous air pollutants. 

### 7 These are pollutants that are known to or suspected of 

### 8 causing cancer or other serious health effects. 

### 9 In addition, in addition, EPA has proposed to 

### 10 revise standards that are known as new source 

### 11 performance standards that would reduce emissions of 

### 12 particulate matter, sulfur dioxide, and nitrogen oxides 

### 13 from new coal and oil-fired plants. 

### 14Power plants emit mercury, arsenic, chromium, 

### 15 nickel, organic air toxics, acid gasses, and other 

### 16 harmful pollutants. The power plants are the largest 

### 17 domestic source of mercury emissions into the air. 

### 18 Once mercury from the air reaches the water, 

### 19 microorganisms can change it into methyl mercury, a 

### 20 highly toxic form of the pollutant, which works its way 

### 21 into fish and people are primarily exposed to mercury 

### 22 by eating contaminated fish. 

### 23 Children's developing brains are especially 

### 24 susceptible to damage from this exposure and the 

### 25 effects include reductions in their IQ and ability toAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 4 1 learn. 

### 2 We estimate that by the year 2016, our 

### 3 proposed power plant Mercury and Air Toxic Standards 

### 4 would prevent between six thousand, eight hundred to 

### 5 seventeen thousand premature deaths annually, as well 

### 6 as provide many other health and environmental 

### 7 benefits. 

### 8 The portion of these benefits that can be 

### 9 quantified total more than fifty-nine to a hundred and 

### 10 forty billion dollars annually in 2016. These benefits 

### 11 far outweigh the costs, which are estimated to be ten 

### 12 point nine billion dollars. 

### 13 Implementing these standards would also 

### 14 create jobs for American workers building, installing, 

### 15 and operating equipment to reduce these emissions. 

### 16 One thing we wanted to note was that since 

### 17 proposing the rule, in response to a comment, we've 

### 18 updated some of the mercury emissions data that we've 

### 19 used to develop the proposed standards. We do not 

### 20 expect the update, which corrects a calculation error 

### 21 with a small amount of the data to change the types of 

### 22 pollution controls necessary to comply with the rule 

### 23 for its tremendous benefits to public health. 

### 24We have made the corrected data available for 

### 25 public review on our website and in the docket assignedAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 5 1 to this rulemaking. 

### 2 Currently, there are no existing federal 

### 3 requirements for power plants to limit their emissions 

### 4 of toxic air pollutants like mercury, arsenic, and 

### 5 other, and metals. 

### 6 The prior -- EPA, in our previous 

### 7 administration finalized a rule to cut mercury 

### 8 pollution from power plants, but the DC Circuit Court 

### 9 struck that rule down as illegal and required EPA to 

### 10 develop standards that follow the law in order to 

### 11 protect human health and the environment. 

### 12 So today, we are accepting oral comments on 

### 13 all aspects of our proposal. Written transcripts for 

### 14 all three of these hearings will be available as part 

### 15 of the official record for the rule and EPA will 

### 16 consider them as we move forward to complete a final 

### 17 rule in November of this year. 

### 18 We are also accepting written comments for 

### 19 the proposed rule until July the fifth of, of this 

### 20 year. 

### 21 There's a handout available in the 

### 22 registration area with detailed information for 

### 23 submitting written comments by mail, fax, or 

### 24 electronically. 

### 25 So now, what I'd like to do is talk about howAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 6 1 we're going to run the hearing. I'm going to call the, 

### 2 the speakers up in pairs and ask the two of you to come 

### 3 up and sit down here at the, at this table across from 

### 4 us. When it's your turn to speak, we'll ask you to 

### 5 state your name and actually spell it for the Court 

### 6 Reporter who I, I want to mention over here, Rich, is 

### 7 the most important guy in the room. As long as he's 

### 8 happy, we're happy, so I'll be reminding folks 

### 9 throughout the course of the morning and afternoon and 

### 10 evening to, to spell the name for, for Rich and, and to 

### 11 speak into the microphone for your statement as clearly 

### 12 as you can. 

### 13 In order to be fair to everyone, we're, we're 

### 14 hoping -- we're asking that folks limit their testimony 

### 15 to five minutes and we have a, a -- if, if in addition 

### 16 to your written -- your oral statement, if you've got 

### 17 written comments that you want to submit to the, to the 

### 18 record, we're happy to take them and you can leave them 

### 19 either with us here or preferably with the folks out at 

### 20 the desk outside. And we'll, we'll include those in 

### 21 the docket as well. 

### 22 We've got a little time keeping system here 

### 23 that will essentially -- you'll have a green light for 

### 24 four minutes and then when you've got a minute to go, 

### 25 it will turn yellow and then goes red at five, fiveAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 7 1 minutes. It's much more subtle than we had in Chicago, 

### 2 where we had a big sign like this -- a bit thing set up 

### 3 like this. It was fairly offensive to people, but, 

### 4 but -- so you'll, you'll just watch this light here in 

### 5 front of you. When it turns red, your, your five 

### 6 minutes are up and we would ask you to wrap up at that 

### 7 point. 

### 8 Again, we've got speakers scheduled all day 

### 9 and all night as far as I know and so, we want to be 

### 10 able to be fair and get as many people in as possible. 

### 11 This hearing is scheduled to go from nine 

### 12 this morning and will continue until eight, but we'll 

### 13 go as late as it takes tonight, depending on the number 

### 14 of speakers. We're going to go into recess during 

### 15 scheduled lunch break from twelve thirty to two and 

### 16 we'll shorten that break, that break if necessary 

### 17 depending on speakers, so if -- it, it might actually 

### 18 end up being a bit shorter than, like maybe sort of 

### 19 like twelve thirty-ish to one thirty-ish, but we'll, 

### 20 we'll, we'll, we'll kind of play that by ear as we go 

### 21 along and there's also a dinner break from five to six 

### 22 thirty, which we also have a little bit of flexibility 

### 23 there, depending on number of speakers, to, to shorten 

### 24 if necessary. 

### 25 We intend to stay, as I said, into theAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 8 1 evening. If you would like to testify, but have not 

### 2 yet registered to do so, please sign up at the table 

### 3 outside. A lot of people signed up beforehand and 

### 4 think they have a rough time, but they -- if you, if 

### 5 you missed these folks outside, they're -- the name's 

### 6 not going to come to me, so just be sure that you check 

### 7 in with them. 

### 8 And we ask you for your patience as we 

### 9 proceed through the list of speakers and we will 

### 10 definitely be making adjustments as the day progresses. 

### 11 We want to thank you all very much for taking 

### 12 time out of your busy schedules to, to come and speak 

### 13 today. 

### 14So with that that, I'd like to go ahead and 

### 15 call up the first two speakers, Josh Galperin and 

### 16 Jennifer Rennicks please. And Mr. Galperin, if you 

### 17 could start, you know again, by spelling your last 

### 18 name; stating your name and spelling it and then. 

### 19 MR. GALPERIN: Good morning. 

### 20 MR. CLARK: Actually let me just say one 

### 21 other thing too, when you guys finish up, if you could, 

### 22 if you could -- both of you stay at the table until 

### 23 both of you have finished because it's very possible we 

### 24 could have a question for one or the other of you. So 

### 25 okay? Thanks.AGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 9 1 MR. GALPERIN: Great. My name is Josh 

### 2 Galperin, it's G-A-L-P-E-R-I-N and I'm a Policy Analyst 

### 3 and Research Attorney with the Southern Alliance for 

### 4 Clean Energy and conveniently, I get to be up here as 

### 5 one of the first two speakers with my colleague, Jen, 

### 6 who's also with the Southern Alliance for Clean Energy. 

### 7 So, while I think we'll have distinctly different 

### 8 substance to our testimonies, I think it's safe to say 

### 9 that I -- that the next thing I say about our 

### 10 organization will apply to both of us. 

### 11 The Southern Alliance for Clean Energy is a 

### 12 regional, non-profit conservation and energy consumer 

### 13 organization with members throughout Georgia and the 

### 14 southeast. We are focused on energy policy, including 

### 15 pollution from coal-fired power plants since 1985. 

### 16 The Southern Alliance for Clean Energy 

### 17 strongly supports EPA's proposed Mercury and Air Toxics 

### 18 Standards and we are grateful that EPA has finally 

### 19 acted on these legally mandated pollution limits. 

### 20 On the other hand, our support of this 

### 21 proposal comes with some trepidation. As I'm sure each 

### 22 of you are keenly aware, the Office of Air and 

### 23 Radiation has made a habit lately of proposing 

### 24 compelling, composing compelling rules and then 

### 25 delaying time and again rather than implementing andAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 10 1 enforcing these rules. And of course, I'm speaking 

### 2 about the updated ozone NAAQS and the boiler MACT rule 

### 3 and then there's also the coal ash rule out of another 

### 4 EPA division. 

### 5 All of these rules are necessary to protect 

### 6 human health and the environment and to promote a clean 

### 7 energy future. Whether it's political pressure or the 

### 8 weight of so many rules that have fallen to this EPA 

### 9 after lying dormant under the previous administration, 

### 10 the delays are a troublesome sign and we implore you to 

### 11 please follow through on your obligations with 

### 12 deliberate urgency. 

### 13 Swift action on this proposed mercury rule is 

### 14 uniquely important in the southeast. This region is 

### 15 home to approximately two hundred and sixty-seven coal 

### 16 units at eighty-seven plants. In a single year, these 

### 17 plants can emit over twenty thousand pounds of mercury 

### 18 into the air, so it's no surprise that every single 

### 19 state in this region has mercury-based fish advisories. 

### 20 Considering that it takes only a very small 

### 21 amount of mercury to poison an entire lake, these 

### 22 advisories must be particularly worrisome, not only to 

### 23 environmentalists or mothers and their young children, 

### 24 but to the six point seven million anglers who recreate 

### 25 in southeastern waters, particularly the subsistenceAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 11 1 anglers who rely on the bounty of these waters to 

### 2 survive. 

### 3 Within fewer than seventy-five miles from 

### 4 Atlanta, there are seven coal plants with twenty-seven 

### 5 units. Some of these units were built over sixty years 

### 6 ago and in all that time, have not gotten significant 

### 7 environmental upgrades. 

### 8 Five of these seven plants are among the top 

### 9 mercury emitters in the entire region. One is inside 

### 10 the perimeter, and for those who aren't from the 

### 11 region, I'm speaking of I-285, which is a perimeter 

### 12 around the City. One plant Scherer with 

### 13 nearly nine hundred pounds of mercury in 2009 was the 

### 14 second largest mercury emitter in the southeast. 

### 15 In total, these plants released over four 

### 16 thousand pounds of mercury and this is just the seven 

### 17 plants within seventy-five miles of Atlanta. Four 

### 18 thousand pounds of mercury, right here, within seventy

### 19 five miles of this city. 

### 20 Critics, some especially loudly right here in 

### 21 Atlanta, are begging for the utility MACT rule to go 

### 22 the way of ozone and boiler MACT. Hopefully these 

### 23 numbers show that delay would have serious 

### 24 implications. 

### 25 Moreover, given the history of this rule,AGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 12 1 there is simply no excuse for delay. This proposal has 

### 2 roots going back over twenty years to the 1990 Clean 

### 3 Air Act Amendments. Over the previous two decades, it 

### 4 has become obvious that mercury regulations were 

### 5 approaching. From the 2000 necessary and proper 

### 6 determination to the 2005 Clean Air Mercury Rule. Over 

### 7 twenty years ago, utilities got their wish and delayed 

### 8 any mercury regulations on coal-fired power plants by 

### 9 adding special hurdles to the Clean Air Act. 

### 10 Since then, the writing is on the wall and 

### 11 it's become even clearer, but still critics are 

### 12 pleading for more time. If you take these pleas at 

### 13 face value, then we have to infer utility managers are 

### 14 simply not capable of preparing for the inevitable and 

### 15 if you look deeper, we maybe can presume that coal 

### 16 plant operators simply don't want to spend money, more 

### 17 than the bare minimum, to protect human health and the 

### 18 environment. 

### 19 Is spending money pleasant? Of course it's 

### 20 not, but it's necessary. Not only to comply with the 

### 21 rules that have been a long time coming, but to protect 

### 22 our health and to lower our cost of living. 

### 23 When coal plants continue to pollute, the 

### 24 dollars come out of our pockets in the form of doctor 

### 25 and hospital visits, missed work, and lowerAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 13 1 productivity. 

### 2 As I already mentioned, coal has an 

### 3 especially strong and significant foothold here in the 

### 4 southeast. One seminal study from Steubenville, Ohio, 

### 5 demonstrated that locally emitted mercury was 

### 6 locally -- was primarily locally deposited, so this 

### 7 means that the neurological impacts of mercury or 

### 8 respiratory impacts of other -- of particulate matter, 

### 9 all of this pollution is falling on us right here. This 

### 10 is Atlanta's water, it's Atlanta's air, it's Atlanta's 

### 11 children, and it's Atlanta's health and it obviously 

### 12 isn't just happening here, which is why this nationwide 

### 13 standard is so desperately needed. 

### 14Thank you. 

### 15 MR. CLARK: Thank you very much, Josh. 

### 16 Ms. Rennicks. 

### 17 MS. RENNICKS: Good morning. Thank you. My 

### 18 name is Jennifer Rennicks, that's spelled 

### 19 R-E-N-N-I-C-K-S and as Josh said, I am also a Policy 

### 20 Advocate with the Southern Alliance for Clean Energy. 

### 21 I am based in Ashville, North Carolina. 

### 22 And I come today to offer my strong support 

### 23 for the Environmental Protection Agency's proposed 

### 24 Mercury and Air Toxics Standards to regulate this 

### 25 harmful pollution under the Clean Air Act.AGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 14 1 This rule, as I see it for the first time 

### 2 ever, will establish national standards for mercury 

### 3 emissions from coal plants requiring that even the 

### 4 oldest, the dirtiest, and the least efficient plants to 

### 5 clean up operations to comply with these new standards. 

### 6 Establishing national standards for mercury 

### 7 and other toxic pollutants is long overdue. The 

### 8 original Clean Air Act was passed when I was born and 

### 9 the amendments were passed some twenty years ago. 

### 10 Public health and environmental communities 

### 11 alike support this rule knowing that coal-fired utility 

### 12 power plants produce more hazardous air pollution in 

### 13 the United States than any other industrial pollution 

### 14 source. This accounts for ninety-nine percent of all 

### 15 U.S. mercury emissions from the power sector and it 

### 16 results in upwards of thirteen thousand deaths per 

### 17 year. 

### 18 By your own agency's estimates, the proposed 

### 19 rule would require coal-fired power plants to prevent 

### 20 ninety-one percent of the mercury burned in coal from 

### 21 being released and reduce emissions of hydrochloric 

### 22 acid by ninety-one percent, and particulate matter by 

### 23 fifty-five percent. 

### 24I believe some people will take comfort in 

### 25 the economic benefits that result from such reductionsAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 15 1 and emissions as asthma attacks, heart attacks, and 

### 2 hospitalizations may be prevented. I, personally, will 

### 3 take comfort in the possibility that my asthmatic child 

### 4may be one of the twelve thousand who avoids emergency 

### 5 room visit, or one of the one hundred and twenty 

### 6 thousand who avoid an asthma attack. 

### 7 I brought with me today my daughter's 

### 8 Albuterol spacer because what I want to do is, in a 

### 9 very personal way, I want to illustrate how very sad 

### 10 and how very scary a pollution induced disease like 

### 11 asthma can be for a child. 

### 12 Some children, like my daughter, for example, 

### 13 are so very young when they are first diagnosed that 

### 14 the standard medical procedures and equipment are very 

### 15 scary. And we try to make treatments friendlier by 

### 16 putting a silly face; there's a duck face on this, but 

### 17 a happy face does not change the fact that coping with 

### 18 asthma is scary for a child, it is expensive for a 

### 19 family, and it's worrisome for a parent and I will say, 

### 20 it's beyond worrisome. I've, I've held my child and 

### 21 rocked her at night and hoped she wouldn't stop 

### 22 breathing. I hope no parent ever has to go through 

### 23 that. 

### 24Some critics will loudly protest and complain 

### 25 that these health-based standards will have to be metAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 16 1 in what I call an "unreasonably short time frame" and 

### 2 this is hyperbole at its best. 

### 3 Twenty years have elapsed since Congress 

### 4 passed the 1990 Clean Air Act Amendments directing EPA 

### 5 to consider whether it was appropriate and necessary to 

### 6 regulate these toxic air pollutants. Utilities could 

### 7 have begun preparing their coal fleets at that time. 

### 8 Then another decade -- decade -- passed 

### 9 before EPA first confirmed that mercury would be 

### 10 regulated as a hazardous air pollutant setting into 

### 11 motion this proposal we have before us today. 

### 12 If the skeptics or utilities were waiting for 

### 13 a court-backed directive, then that came three years 

### 14 ago in 2008 when a Federal Appeals Court agreed that 

### 15 the so-called Clean Air Mercury Rule issued in 2005 

### 16 violated the Clean Air Act by not requiring the maximum 

### 17 available control technology to reduce these harmful 

### 18 and very toxic pollutants. 

### 19 I believe it is possible that my daughter and 

### 20 hundreds of thousands of children like her may have 

### 21 been spared a decade of illness if utilities had 

### 22 started reducing their toxic air emissions twenty years 

### 23 ago instead of stalling for time. 

### 24I do applaud you. I applaud the EPA for the 

### 25 substantial research and analysis that has gone in toAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 17 1 setting these strong evidence based pollution limits 2 that provide flexibility, but also ensure enormous 3 health, economic, and environmental benefits. 4 I thank you for your efforts and I urge you 5 to finalize this rule as quickly as you can. These 6 benefits cannot come soon enough for our children and 7 for our communities and I thank you. 8 MR. CLARK: Thank you both very much. I'll 9 see if anyone has any questions? I did just want to 10 ask -- it's all right. Are you submitting -- is 11 Alliance for Clean Energy going to submit written 12 comments for the record, do you know? 13 MS. RENNICKS: Yes. 14 MR. GALPERIN: Yes. 15 MS. RENNICKS: We are. 16 MR. GALPERIN: We'll be sending two 17 different comments, sets of comments. 18 MR. CLARK: Okay. Any, anybody else? Okay. 19 Thank you so much. 20 MS. RENNICKS: Thank you. 21 MR. CLARK: Next two speakers then please. 22 Katy Preston and Colleen Kiernan, Kiernan. Are you -- 23 MS. PRESTON: Katy Preston. 24 MR. CLARK: Katy, okay. Is Colleen Kiernan 25 here?AGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 18 1 MS. KIERNAN: [Indecipherable]. 

### 2 MR. CLARK: Okay. Ms. Preston. 

### 3 MS. PRESTON: Thank you. Katy Preston. I'm 

### 4 with Georgia Interfaith Power and Light, or GIPL. We 

### 5 represent over five hundred congregations across the 

### 6 State of Georgia, as well as over two thousand 

### 7 individuals across the state as well. 

### 8 As a person of faith, I am here today to 

### 9 speak in favor of the proposed mercury and air toxics 

### 10 rule, which significantly cuts toxic air pollution from 

### 11 power plants. 

### 12 In the beginning, God created the heavens and 

### 13 the earth, the land and the sky and called it good. As 

### 14 people of faith, we have been entrusted to care for 

### 15 this creation and to keep it good and the children of 

### 16 God, all people, should be able to breathe clean air 

### 17 and drink clean water without worrying about mercury in 

### 18 their bloodstream, soot in their lungs, or lead in 

### 19 their water. 

### 20 Yet coal-fired power plants spew hundreds of 

### 21 thousands of tons of hazardous air pollutants like 

### 22 these into our air and water every day. 

### 23 These pollutants are linked to cancer, heart 

### 24 disease, neurological damage, birth defects, asthma 

### 25 attacks, and even premature death.AGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 19 1 When coal-fired power plants emit mercury 

### 2 from their smoke stacks, rain, snow and dust particles 

### 3 wash it out of the air, onto land, into waterways, and 

### 4 ultimately into our food chain. 

### 5 Mercury pollution poses particular risks to 

### 6 children affecting their ability to walk, talk, read, 

### 7 and write and it is so widespread that as many as one 

### 8 in six women of childbearing age has enough mercury in 

### 9 her blood to put her baby at risk should she become 

### 10 pregnant. 

### 11 Coal-fired power plants are the single 

### 12 largest source of mercury pollution, arsenic, and acid 

### 13 gas and it counts for twenty-five percent of all toxic 

### 14 metal emissions in the United States. 

### 15 Furthermore, coal-fired power plants are 

### 16 responsible for ninety-nine percent of all mercury 

### 17 emissions from the power sector in the United States. 

### 18 Here in Georgia, we have eleven active coal

### 19 fired power plants and three more have been proposed. 

### 20 I feel I must support this rule as a resident of a 

### 21 state that relies on such dirty energy. 

### 22 For decades, the coal industry has used its 

### 23 undue influence on decision makers to delay 

### 24 implementation of strong standards to cut this 

### 25 dangerous toxic air pollutant from its facilities.AGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 20 1 However, we can no longer sit idly by and allow these 

### 2 dirty politics to dictate the air quality we breathe. 

### 3 As tillers of the garden, as people of faith, 

### 4 we have been charged with a moral imperative to care 

### 5 for the creation that God has entrusted to us and we 

### 6 are called to keep it good. 

### 7 Therefore, it is vital that we fully support 

### 8 this standard that will, for the first time, cut 

### 9 mercury emissions from power plants nationwide by 

### 10 ninety-one percent, reduce arsenic and acid gasses by 

### 11 ninety-one percent, prevent twelve thousand, two 

### 12 hundred trips to the hospital and save up to seventeen 

### 13 thousand lives each year once it is implemented. 

### 14I urge the EPA to support and endorse this 

### 15 proposed mercury and air toxic rule as soon as 

### 16 possible. 

### 17 Thank you. 

### 18 MR. CLARK: Thank you very much. Ms. Kiernan. 

### 19 MS. KIERNAN: Thank you. Thank you for 

### 20 having this hearing here today. 

### 21 My name is Colleen Kiernan. I am the Georgia 

### 22 Chapter Director of the Sierra Club and -- 

### 23 MR. CLARK: Do you think you could spell your 

### 24 last name for the -- 

### 25 MS. KIERNAN: Sure.AGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 21 1 MR. CLARK: Thanks. 

### 2 MS. KIERNAN: It's Kiernan, K-I-E-R-N-A-N. 

### 3 The Georgia Chapter of the Sierra Club has over ten 

### 4 thousand members in the State of Georgia. We have at 

### 5 least one member in every county in Georgia. All one 

### 6 hundred and fifty-nine. And as you probably know, 

### 7 Sierra Club was founded by John Muir in 1892 

### 8 and our mission is to explore, enjoy, and protect the 

### 9 planet. 

### 10 And in that spirit, I'm here today to support 

### 11 the rule as it's currently written; it's been a long 

### 12 time coming. 

### 13 My comments today will address both my 

### 14 professional perspective and my personal perspective of 

### 15 why it's important to me that EPA gets this right. 

### 16 To give you a little bit of context of my 

### 17 professional perspective, I was an organizer for the 

### 18 Sierra Club on the National Field Staff from 2001-2006 

### 19 here in Atlanta, Georgia, working on air pollution and 

### 20 energy issues. And I left the Sierra Club in 2006 to 

### 21 get my master's in City and Regional Planning and at 

### 22 that time, as you may recall, we were in the process 

### 23 here in Georgia of muddling through the Bush Era Clean 

### 24 Air Mercury Rule or CAMR and it seems as though coming 

### 25 back to the Sierra Club in August as Chapter DirectorAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 22 1 that a lot of things have changed, but a lot of things 

### 2 have stayed the same. 

### 3 And in fact, I don't know if you've had a 

### 4 chance to read the paper today. I'm sure everyone's up 

### 5 very early, but you know, there's a piece by Chris 

### 6 Hobson who will testifying later on behalf of the 

### 7 Southern Company and the arguments continue to be the 

### 8 same. 

### 9 You know, the rule is going affect our 

### 10 reliability and the availability of our 

### 11 electricity. They claim that it's going to be 

### 12 extraordinarily expensive and that it's not going to 

### 13 deal with -- and that their mercury -- or mercury from 

### 14 coal-fired power plants only accounts for one percent 

### 15 of all airborne mercury emissions. 

### 16 However, then at the end of the piece, they 

### 17 talk about the work that they've been doing at Plant 

### 18 Scherer where their pollution controls have -- 

### 19 will result in a ninety percent reduction of mercury, 

### 20 so we know that it can be done and you know, we're 

### 21 paying more in our electric bills right now for the 

### 22 nuclear power plants, not the pollution controls and we 

### 23 will be paying for those nuclear plants into the 

### 24 future. 

### 25 So anyway, as I was preparing for what IAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 23 1 wanted to say here today, I dug through some boxes and 

### 2 I came up with my -- all my notes from these CAMR 

### 3 negotiations from 2006 and it was sort of instructive 

### 4 of you know, that we're having the exact same 

### 5 conversation all over again and so I pulled out just a 

### 6 couple of things that I will leave with you here today 

### 7 to show you how little has really changed. 

### 8 So, the first document I wanted to talk to 

### 9 about was Southern Company's environmental compliance 

### 10 strategy. This was published in March 2003 and 

### 11 there's a section on hazardous pollutants and mercury 

### 12 and, you know, they're saying the same things that 

### 13 they're saying today; that it's going to be way too 

### 14 expensive and that they don't think that it's, it's 

### 15 appropriate and necessary, but they've known, you know, 

### 16 for the last twenty years and certainly have been 

### 17 thinking about it seriously for the last eight that 

### 18 strong mercury -- that EPA does have the authority to 

### 19 regulate mercury in a strong way on every unit, at 

### 20 every plant across the country. So I'll leave that 

### 21 with you today. 

### 22 When the Bush Era Clean Air Mercury Rule came 

### 23 out, the Georgia Environmental Protection Branch 

### 24 actually submitted great comments. In 2004, June 29, 

### 25 2004, where they [indecipherable -- left microphone)AGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 24 1 that mercury deposition from coal-fired power plants is 

### 2 a really big problem in the state. They noted all the 

### 3 rivers that have mercury fish advisories and they noted 

### 4 that based on what EPA does research that twenty 

### 5 thousand babies are born in Georgia every year with 

### 6 high levels of mercury or at risk of mercury 

### 7 contamination. 

### 8 And so, they concluded at the time that 

### 9 trading was a bad idea for Georgia and that we really 

### 10 needed control on every single one of the units and, 

### 11 you know, the result of these negotiations that we had 

### 12 were that Georgia Power agreed to put the best 

### 13 pollution controls on the larger of the units in 

### 14 Georgia and leave the smaller ones uncontrolled. 

### 15 And so, it's my feeling -- it was my feeling 

### 16 at that time that it wasn't fair for the folks who 

### 17 live near Plant Yates, Plant Mitchell, Plant Kraft, and 

### 18 Plant McIntosh the smaller units to bear the brunt of 

### 19 the -- you know, they have the smaller and older units 

### 20 and they don't get controls. And so I'm really pleased 

### 21 that EPA is here and that we're working with section 

### 22 one twelve and that we're actually going to deal with 

### 23 the entire problem. 

### 24The last document that I'm going to leave 

### 25 with you is this presentation, EPD [phonetic] duringAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 25 1 his negotiations brought this guy that does pollution 

### 2 control technologies. This, this presentation was 

### 3 April 8, 2006, so five years ago this guy said that, 

### 4 you know, SCRs and flue gas, 

### 5 desulfurization was going to get us to ninety percent 

### 6 reduction. 

### 7 Georgia Power is already well on their way to 

### 8 doing that to large air units. All we need to do is 

### 9 figure out what's going to happen to the smaller units 

### 10 and, you know, adding activated carbon injection was 

### 11 going to get us the rest of the way and this was all 

### 12 Georgia specific information. This is -- this could 

### 13 have been done five years ago and it's time to get 

### 14 busy. 

### 15 Okay. Shifting my perspective to my personal 

### 16 reasons of why this is important. Okay. So, I put 

### 17 together very short slide show. So that is me and my 

### 18 nephew, Trace. And Trace lives in Omaha, Nebraska, with 

### 19 my little brother and my sister-in-law and now he has a 

### 20 little brother and a little sister and another on the 

### 21 way. 

### 22 So two years ago, in June, 2009, my dad 

### 23 turned sixty and we all went to Omaha to celebrate and 

### 24 in -- to mark the occasion, my dad did sixty can 

### 25 openers off the high dive. You can go to the nextAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 26 1 slide. 

### 2 And we all had a really fun day that day, 

### 3 except for Trace who screamed the entire time and no 

### 4 one really understood why and, you know, his parents 

### 5 didn't understand why. They were like, yeah, we must 

### 6 be terrible parents. We take our kid to the pool and 

### 7 try to have a fun day, but he screamed bloody murder 

### 8 the entire time he was there. 

### 9 So about six months later, I was visiting for 

### 10 Christmas and my sister-in-law and I, you know, hit the 

### 11 after Christmas sales and she confided to me that a 

### 12 good friend of hers who watches Trace sometimes told 

### 13 her that, that Trace had all the same signs of autism 

### 14 that her son exhibited at that age. 

### 15 And so, you know, my sister-in-law was 

### 16 distraught and she didn't know how this could have 

### 17 happened to her, but it turns out that Trace has autism 

### 18 and he has echolalia and he repeats things and, you 

### 19 know, he watches movie and he -- he can say the entire 

### 20 say the entire movie. You know, he could count to a 

### 21 hundred at the age -- I mean, he's like rain man. So 

### 22 this was him at Easter and he was organizing his Easter 

### 23 treats in a pattern. 

### 24And fortunately, they live in Sarpy County, 

### 25 Nebraska, and Social Services there are great and theyAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 27 1 send a speech pathologist out there to work with him 

### 2 and they send a bus out to get him to take him to a 

### 3 special preschool, but it -- but knowing Trace and 

### 4 knowing what my brother's family is going through and 

### 5 the fact that they're going to have to deal with this 

### 6 for the rest of Trace's life means that, you know, 

### 7 these twenty thousand babies who have been born in 

### 8 Georgia every year with risk of this kind of thing 

### 9 happening and, you know, this is a disaster. 

### 10 And I -- even -- my brother and sister-in-law 

### 11 are not environmentalists. They are Christian 

### 12 conservatives and I think they would stop at nothing to 

### 13 make sure that this doesn't happen to another family. 

### 14And in fact, my sister-in-law, for autism 

### 15 month last month, put together this huge event where 

### 16 she was training first responders to deal with a 

### 17 problem -- you know, Trace had to go to the emergency 

### 18 room and the, the EMT's didn't know how to deal with 

### 19 him and she didn't know how to explain it to them and 

### 20 this problem is multiplying everywhere across the 

### 21 country and we need to take immediate steps to reduce 

### 22 mercury and reduce the contamination that's affecting 

### 23 thousands of families. 

### 24And the last picture is just Trace today. 

### 25 He's good at telling time and he's great with numbers.AGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 28 1 Thank you. 

### 2 MR. CLARK: Thank you very much. Let me just 

### 3 ask if anyone has any questions? I did have just a -- 

### 4 Ms. Preston, if you could just say a word or two more 

### 5 about the Georgia Interfaith Power and Light, what -- 

### 6 just a little bit more description of them. 

### 7 MS. PRESTON: Sure. Our mission is to engage 

### 8 communities of faith and stewardship of God's creation 

### 9 as a direct reflection of our faithfulness. We do this 

### 10 through worship, education, and a sustainable 

### 11 generation and efficient use of energy. 

### 12 MR. CLARK: Thank you very much. 

### 13 MS. PRESTON: Thank you. 

### 14 MR. CLARK: Thank you both. Next speakers 

### 15 are Peter Bahouth and H. James Gooden please. 

### 16 I will say I was weak with the last speaker 

### 17 on time, so if, if folks could do their best to stay 

### 18 within the five minutes, we'd appreciate that very 

### 19 much. 

### 20 MR. BAHOUTH: Good morning. 

### 21 MR. CLARK: Hi. 

### 22 MR. BAHOUTH: My name is Peter Bahouth, 

### 23 that's B-A-H-O-U-T-H. 

### 24 I am the Executive Director of USCAN, the 

### 25 U.S. Climate Action Network and I am here to expressAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 29 1 the support of USCAN, its member groups and allies for 

### 2 the EPA to promulgate strong, maximum, available 

### 3 control technology standards for power plants. 

### 4With over eighty member groups USCAN is the 

### 5 country's largest network of organizations focused on 

### 6 climate change and energy. Our mission is to support 

### 7 and help coordinate these organizations efforts towards 

### 8 effective, equitable, and sustainable strategies to 

### 9 reduce carbon pollution and promote a clean energy 

### 10 future at all levels of the debate, local, national, 

### 11 and international. 

### 12 And we all agree, Clean Air Act standards to 

### 13 protect our nation's communities from the threats of 

### 14 toxic air pollution from power plants are long overdue. 

### 15 In fact, twenty-one years in the making. 

### 16 Mercury emissions from power plants have been 

### 17 an unresolved issue for too long and we still do not 

### 18 have a national standard to protect communities and the 

### 19 environment from mercury and air toxics. 

### 20 Power plants are the largest source of toxic 

### 21 air emissions in the United States and yet absent these 

### 22 proposed standards, no national standards exist to 

### 23 protect communities from toxic air pollution from these 

### 24 sources. 

### 25 Strong action to reduce harmful pollutionAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 30 1 from power plants will improve the air quality and 

### 2 public health of local communities. Fulton County, 

### 3 where we are now, alone has seventy-nine thousand, 

### 4 three hundred and eighty-three documented cases of 

### 5 asthma. Over one quarter of those cases belong to 

### 6 children. Fulton County earned an F from the most 

### 7 recent American Lung Association's state of the air 

### 8 report. 

### 9 Continuing down the path of under regulated 

### 10 air toxics will continue to drive these numbers up, 

### 11 increasing costs to families, communities and tax 

### 12 payers. 

### 13 As one of the leading producers of 

### 14 NOx, SO2, and mercury, the resulting health 

### 15 impacts of Southern Company's reliance on coal are 

### 16 extensive and costly. 

### 17 According to Clean Air Task Force data, 

### 18 Southern Company's coal-fired power plants cause one 

### 19 thousand, two hundred and twenty-four deaths, one 

### 20 thousand, seven hundred and ten heart attacks, twenty 

### 21 thousand, seven hundred and seventy asthma attacks and 

### 22 seven hundred and fifty-two cases of chronic bronchitis 

### 23 per year. The total annual cost of all of this damage 

### 24 is over nine billion dollars. 

### 25 In additions to cost to human health, theAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 31 1 National Academy of Sciences found that sulfur dioxide 

### 2 emissions, nitrous oxide emissions, and particulates 

### 3 from U.S. coal-fired power plants caused sixty-two 

### 4 billion dollars in economic damages in 2005 alone. 

### 5 That averages out to one hundred and fifty-six million 

### 6 in damages per plant in a single year, with the 

### 7 dirtiest five percent of plants creating harm, costing 

### 8 between five hundred and seventy-five million and one 

### 9 point three nine billion, depending largely on their 

### 10 SO2 emissions. 

### 11 There is consensus within our network for 

### 12 robust and meaningful regulation of these air toxics 

### 13 and the support for strong standards goes far beyond 

### 14 those commenting in person here today and from all 

### 15 corners of the country. 

### 16 For example, as of May 24, one hundred and 

### 17 two organizations representing health, environmental, 

### 18 and faith groups have endorsed the comment to EPA 

### 19 stating, "Our families should be able to breathe clean 

### 20 air and drink clean water without worrying about 

### 21 mercury in the bloodstream, soot in their lungs, or 

### 22 lead in their water. We applaud you for this strong 

### 23 standard and urge you to keep it just as strong in the 

### 24 final version of the mercury and air toxics rule." 

### 25 On May 11, the National Latino Coalition onAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 32 1 Climate Change representing fourteen prominent Latino 

### 2 organizations issued a press release announcing the 

### 3 launch of a campaign urging the EPA to mandate 

### 4 reductions in life threatening air pollutions, such as 

### 5 mercury, arsenic, and other air toxics that are 

### 6 currently released by power plants without limits. 

### 7 The EPA's mercury and air toxic rule is 

### 8 critical to protect Latinos and other communities of 

### 9 color from disproportionate exposure to air pollution 

### 10 linked to a litany of health problems from asthma to 

### 11 strokes, cancer, and premature death. 

### 12 On May 10, the American Academy of Pediatrics 

### 13 and five other health organizations sent a letter to 

### 14 Representative Joe Barton stating, "Mercury and other 

### 15 air toxics have serious health affects that compel EPA 

### 16 to act. Some toxic air pollutants, such as lead, 

### 17 mercury and dioxins degrade slowly or not at all. 

### 18 These pollutants bio-accumulate and other animals at 

### 19 the top of the food chain. Children can be exposed to 

### 20 toxic air pollutants through contaminated air, water, 

### 21 soil and food." 

### 22 On January 24, sixty-eight religious groups 

### 23 sent a letter to the House of Representatives stating, 

### 24 "We believe that the United States must take all 

### 25 appropriate and available actions to ensure the healthAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 33 1 of its communities. We therefore urge you to oppose 

### 2 any efforts to undermine the authority of the Clean Air 

### 3 Act and allow the EPA to use the full strength of the 

### 4 law to ensure that God's creation and God's children 

### 5 remain healthy." 

### 6 In December -- 

### 7 MR. CLARK: Let me ask 

### 8 MR. BAHOUTH: -- more than sixty thousand 

### 9 firms -- I'm finishing up. 

### 10 MR. CLARK: Excellent. Thank you. 

### 11 MR. BAHOUTH: It's the last example. 

### 12 MR. CLARK: Thank you. 

### 13 MR. BAHOUTH: Sixty thousand firms and U.S. 

### 14 business groups sent a letter to Congress and the 

### 15 President stating, "We urge you to support EPA's 

### 16 mission to reject efforts to block, delay, or weaken 

### 17 implementation of the Clean Air Act. Owners of both 

### 18 small and large businesses want real solutions that 

### 19 will create long-term economic growth and ignite a new 

### 20 era of American innovation." 

### 21 These examples show the EPA has the backing 

### 22 of a strong diverse set of voices calling for action 

### 23 under the Clean Air Act to reduce harmful pollution. 

### 24For these reasons, I applaud the EPA for your 

### 25 proposed mercury and air toxic rule and urge you toAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 34 1 swiftly implement a strong final rule in order to best 

### 2 protect public health, the environment and promote a 

### 3 safer, cleaner energy economy. 

### 4MR. CLARK: Okay. Thank you both very much. 

### 5 Beverly, go ahead and ask your question if you want. 

### 6 MS. BANISTER: Just a quick question. On 

### 7 some of the earlier statistics that you gave in regards 

### 8 to the impacts, what was the basis of those statistics? 

### 9 MR. BAHOUTH: They're all footnoted in my 

### 10 comments, which I've inserted. I, I've sent two 

### 11 copies, yeah. 

### 12 MS. BANISTER: Okay. 

### 13 MR. CLARK: Thank you. 

### 14MR. BAHOUTH: Thank you. 

### 15 MR. CLARK: Mr. Gooden. 

### 16 MR. GOODEN: Good morning. My name is James 

### 17 Gooden, G-O-O-D-E-N and I'm the Chairman of the 

### 18 National Board of Directors of the American Lung 

### 19 Association. 

### 20 The American Lung Association is the leading 

### 21 organization working to save lives by improving lung 

### 22 health and preventing lung disease through education, 

### 23 advocacy and research. 

### 24We've been fighting for air for over one 

### 25 hundred years. The American Lung Association stronglyAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 35 1 supports the action by the U.S. Environmental 

### 2 Protection Agency to finally take action first promised 

### 3 in the Clean Air Act Amendments of 1990. A promise 

### 4 that has languished unfulfilled for far too long. 

### 5 We support the proposed Mercury and Air Toxics 

### 6 Standards and urge EPA to take action immediately to 

### 7 put them in place. 

### 8 The American Lung Association believes it is 

### 9 time to end the toxic loophole that has allowed coal 

### 10 burning power plants to operate without any federal 

### 11 limits on emissions of mercury, arsenic, dioxin, acid 

### 12 gasses such as hydrogen chloride and other dangerous 

### 13 pollutants. Frankly, we think it's long past time for 

### 14 these plants to be cleaned up. 

### 15 Twenty-one years ago, a bi-partisan U.S. 

### 16 Congress and the Republican President joined together 

### 17 to strengthen the Clean Air Act. Even then, the Clean 

### 18 Air Act was already one of the nation's most important 

### 19 public health laws. With strong bi-partisan support, 

### 20 they added provisions to protect Americans from a long 

### 21 list of hazardous air pollutants, including eighty-four 

### 22 that come from coal- and oil-fired power plants. 

### 23 Coal-fired power plants product electricity 

### 24 for the nation's power grid, but they also produce more 

### 25 hazardous air emissions than any other industrialAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 36 1 pollution sources. The quantity is staggering. Over 

### 2 three hundred and eighty-six thousand tons of eighty

### 3 four separate hazardous air pollutants spew from over 

### 4 four hundred plants in forty-six states. Their 

### 5 emissions threaten the health of people who live near 

### 6 these plants, as well as those who live hundreds of 

### 7 miles away. 

### 8 These plants are concentrated largely in the 

### 9 Midwest and southeast, but their toxic emissions 

### 10 threaten the air in communities nationwide. The people 

### 11 of Georgia breathe pollution from power plants not only 

### 12 from those in Georgia, but also from farther west, 

### 13 including Louisiana and Texas. 

### 14And the pollution from plants in Georgia 

### 15 blows into the rest of the south, including South 

### 16 Carolina, where my wife and I live and further north 

### 17 into the mid-Atlantic and northeast. 

### 18 We, at the American Lung Association issued a 

### 19 report last March called Toxic Air, the Case for 

### 20 Cleaning up Coal-fired Power Plants. In that report, 

### 21 we provided strong reasons for the actions EPA is 

### 22 considering today and I'd like to cover just a few of 

### 23 them now. 

### 24First, burning coal creates pollutants known 

### 25 or reasonably expected to harm human health or theAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 37 1 environment or both. The process of burning coal 

### 2 releases chemical into the atmosphere that threaten not 

### 3 only the air Americans breathe, but the water they 

### 4 drink, the soil they live on and the food they eat. 

### 5 Just a short list of the harm to human health 

### 6 should be enough to persuade anyone. These emissions 

### 7 can make breathing difficult and can worsen asthma, 

### 8 chronic obstructive pulmonary disease, bronchitis, and 

### 9 other lung diseases. They can cause heart attacks and 

### 10 strokes, lung cancer, and other cancers, neurological 

### 11 damage and birth defects. They can kill. 

### 12 Second, people who live nearest the smoke 

### 13 stacks have historically borne the brunt of these 

### 14 hazardous pollutants. For example, acid gasses, such 

### 15 as hydrochloric acid tend to settle out within a day 

### 16 or two posing high risk to neighborhoods and towns 

### 17 nearby. Mercury and sulfur dioxide emissions from 

### 18 power plants also have an immediate impact on the local 

### 19 area. That burden often falls greatest on the poor. 

### 20 Study after study shows that poor people suffer more 

### 21 from the impacts of air pollution. 

### 22 For the southeast, at least, these plants 

### 23 have long been in communities where high percentages of 

### 24 low-income people, both whites and African Americans 

### 25 live.AGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 38 1 Attached to my testimony are maps of the 

### 2 southeast that show census tracks where whites and 

### 3 African Americans with incomes below the poverty line 

### 4 are expected to reside in 2016. These are maps that 

### 5 EPA developed in their assessment of risk. 

### 6 The Lung Association added the location of 

### 7 the power plants in the southeast and the results are 

### 8 stunning. The power plants are scattered throughout 

### 9 the southeast following the same pattern as the 

### 10 concentration of poor people. 

### 11 EPA developed these maps because they wanted 

### 12 to show that these people may be at higher risk because 

### 13 they are more likely to depend on fish from nearby 

### 14 rivers and streams, fish that contain mercury. 

### 15 We think the evidence also shows that they 

### 16 face higher risk because of the air they breathe. 

### 17 Finally, cleaning up these toxins save lives. 

### 18 According to the EPA's own analysis, cleaning up these 

### 19 toxic emissions will result in 2016 in multiple annual 

### 20 benefits. Just to name a few, cleaning up these 

### 21 emissions will save seventeen thousand lives each year 

### 22 and eliminate twelve thousand two hundred admissions to 

### 23 the hospital and emergency room visits each year. 

### 24The American public has waited long enough; 

### 25 more than two decades. We are counting on EPA toAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 39 1 protect all Americans from the health risks imposed by 

### 2 these dangerous pollutants once and for all. 

### 3 Thank you for this opportunity to comment. 

### 4MR. CLARK: Thank you both very much. Any 

### 5 questions, guys? Thank you. Appreciate it. 

### 6 Our next two speakers please, Robert Capalmin 

### 7 and Ann Mellenger Birdsong. Mr. Capalmin. 

### 8 MR. CAPALMIN: Thank you. My name is Robert 

### 9 Capalmin. I'm here representing the Florida Municipal 

### 10 Electric Association. I'm an Energy and Environmental 

### 11 Policy Consultant for that group. 

### 12 The Florida Municipal Electric Association, 

### 13 sometimes referred to as FMEA, is composed of thirty

### 14 four municipally owned electric utilities serving over 

### 15 two and a half million Floridians. 

### 16 All of these utilities are run by local 

### 17 governments, either City Councils or independent boards 

### 18 appointed by Mayors and so. And consequently are very 

### 19 concerned about air quality as well as low electric 

### 20 rates. And we feel that there's no reason you can't 

### 21 have both. It just takes a little bit more time and 

### 22 thinking to do it right. 

### 23 Our utilities primarily have coal and natural 

### 24 gas generation. Our coal units all have FGD flue-gas 

### 25 desulfurization scrubbers. Most of the units eitherAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 40 1 have SCR or SCR is being planned. These were made -- 

### 2 are being added primarily to comply with the old CAIR 

### 3 rule and the CAMR rule. 

### 4We have been reviewing the rule, all the 

### 5 technical support documents that we can go through and 

### 6 quite frankly, we're overwhelmed. There is a lot of 

### 7 material in there. We've just gotten over construction 

### 8 programs to meet the CAIR rule and the CAMR rule, which 

### 9 both will have significant reductions in, not only the 

### 10 traditional air pollutants, but the, the toxics, so we 

### 11 think people need to take recognition that there's been 

### 12 a lot of reductions that have already taken place and 

### 13 this rule is to have addition reductions. It is not as 

### 14 if no reductions have been taking place. 

### 15 Right now, we're trying to evaluate what 

### 16 controls are going to be necessary to meet the 

### 17 interstate transport rule that replaces the CAIR rule. 

### 18 Now we've got the utility MACT rule to replace the CAMR 

### 19 rule. We really would respectfully request an 

### 20 additional sixty days to complete our reviews and 

### 21 analysis on this. This is a tremendous amount of 

### 22 material. I, I think you're probably going to get 

### 23 requests from other organizations, but we think that 

### 24 this is important enough that we need to do this right 

### 25 and it may take more time for us to review this and getAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 41 1 helpful comments back to EPA. 

### 2 And I thank you for the opportunity to speak. 

### 3 MR. CLARK: Thank you very much. Ms. Mellenger 

### 4 Birdsong. 

### 5 DR. MELLENGER-BIRDSONG: Hello. I am Dr. Ann 

### 6 Mellenger-Birdsong, a Pediatrician Epidemiologist and 

### 7 parent of two children growing up in Atlanta. 

### 8 I am proud to speak today on behalf of the 

### 9 American Academy of Pediatrics. The AAP is a non

### 10 profit professional organization of more than sixty 

### 11 thousand pediatricians, pediatric sub-specialists and 

### 12 pediatric surgeons. We are proud to have a long 

### 13 history of supporting the work of the EPA in cleaning 

### 14 up the air we breathe. 

### 15 Children do not choose where they live, where 

### 16 they go to school, or whether the air their breathe is 

### 17 polluted or not. Adults and their family and community 

### 18 and business leaders make these decisions for them. 

### 19 However, children bear the consequences of decisions 

### 20 adults have made in the form of illness, 

### 21 hospitalization, missed school days, and even their 

### 22 lives. Some of the affects continue into adulthood. 

### 23 Children have a higher minute ventilation, 

### 24meaning they breathe more air per pound of body weight 

### 25 than do, even at rest. They spend more time outdoorsAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 42 1 and they also run more and breathe harder when they are 

### 2 outdoors. For these reasons, at any given level of air 

### 3 pollution, children are more exposed and get a higher 

### 4 amount of air pollution per pound of body weight than 

### 5 adults. 

### 6 Our current federal standards requiring power 

### 7 plants to limit emissions of hazardous air pollutants 

### 8 are weak and outdated. Polluted air makes people sick, 

### 9 particularly infants and children. Toxins in the air 

### 10 which can accumulate in our water and food supply cause 

### 11 numerous health effects, including birth defects, 

### 12 neurological damage, asthma exacerbations, other 

### 13 respiratory problems and heart disease. 

### 14Some forms of air pollution can also reduce 

### 15 or stunt lung growth. People who grow up in polluted 

### 16 areas have smaller lungs as adults compared to people 

### 17 who grew up in non-polluted areas. Lung growth and 

### 18 remodeling continues through the adolescent years, so 

### 19 this is not just an issue for young children. 

### 20 Coal-fired power plants are the largest 

### 21 source of mercury emissions in the United States. This 

### 22 is of particular concern since mercury can accumulate 

### 23 in the water and food supply. Power plants which burn 

### 24 fossil fuels release mercury into the air, which then 

### 25 deposit in the water where bacteria convert it toAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 43 1 methyl mercury and it is taken up by the fish. 

### 2 Methyl mercury is readily absorbed and 

### 3 readily crosses the placenta and blood-brain barrier. 

### 4 Children can be exposed to methyl mercury by eating 

### 5 contaminated fish. Fetuses are exposed in utero when 

### 6 their mothers eat contaminated fish. 

### 7 Many states have issued advisory warnings 

### 8 about not eating fish from contaminated water. Georgia 

### 9 has issued health advisories for over half of our lakes 

### 10 and rivers and estuary systems. 

### 11 Methyl mercury is most toxic to the 

### 12 developing brain of the fetus and young child. It can 

### 13 also effect the kidneys and immune system. The damage 

### 14 it causes is permanent and irreversible. In the 

### 15 developing brain, methyl mercury causes focal necrosis 

### 16 of neurons, destruction of glial cells, and interferes 

### 17 with neuronal migration. 

### 18 In studies of areas with high exposures, 

### 19 mothers gave birth to infants who appeared normal at 

### 20 first, but they went on to develop problems such as 

### 21 blindness, deafness, and seizures. 

### 22 In utero exposure to lower levels of mercury 

### 23 has been associated with more subtle affects on memory, 

### 24 attention, and language. 

### 25 Fine particulates are very complexAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 44 1 structures, being mixtures of polycyclic hydrocarbons, 

### 2 heavy metals, such as arsenic, chromium, and lead, and 

### 3 other chemicals. Because they are so small, they go 

### 4 deep into the lung carrying all the chemicals and heavy 

### 5 metals with them. They are known to increase 

### 6 respiratory problems and contribute to a range of other 

### 7 disorders. 

### 8 Recent studies showed that children with 

### 9 asthma, increased air pollutions are associated with 

### 10 increased symptoms as well as asthma exacerbations. 

### 11 Even short-term increases to elevated levels of fine 

### 12 particulates were associated with a significant 

### 13 increase in all causes of mortality of one point two 

### 14 one percent, and respiratory related mortality of one 

### 15 point seven eight percent. This may not sound like a 

### 16 lot, but on the population level, it is very 

### 17 significant. 

### 18 Reducing air pollution can have life-saving 

### 19 effects at a population level. A 2009 study found that 

### 20 reducing air pollution by a decrease of ten micrograms 

### 21 per cubic meter in the fine particulate concentration 

### 22 was associated with an estimated increase in life 

### 23 expectancy of over half a year. This is a remarkable 

### 24 impact and reinforces the need to reduce the levels of 

### 25 fine particulates in our air.AGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 45 1 The American people have been waiting for 

### 2 many years for this important rule and we cannot afford 

### 3 any further delays. In 1990, the Clean Air Act 

### 4 Amendments raised the need to assess power plant 

### 5 emissions. Ten years later, the EPA determined it was 

### 6 appropriate and necessary that these hazardous air 

### 7 pollutants, particularly mercury, be reduced. Now 

### 8 another eleven years later, we still have yet to take 

### 9 appropriate action. 

### 10 People who were born at the time the 

### 11 amendments were passed in 1990 are now in college and 

### 12 have reached the age of legal majority. Insufficient 

### 13 action by the EPA and pressure from polluters has 

### 14 delayed needed action, allowing levels of mercury and 

### 15 other toxins to continue to accumulate in our water and 

### 16 bodies. 

### 17 The AAP fully supports the EPA's new 

### 18 standards for reducing toxic air pollutants from power 

### 19 plants. The AAP supports using the standard of maximum 

### 20 achievable control technology to obtain these 

### 21 reasonable goals. We also support requiring the 

### 22 implementation of this technology within three years as 

### 23 proposed under the rule. 

### 24While some may argue that this rule will 

### 25 impose costs upon power companies, the AAP wouldAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 46 1 respond that the high cost of pollution are currently 

### 2 being borne by our children and other vulnerable 

### 3 populations and by all of us in the form of higher 

### 4 insurance premium and taxes to pay for medical 

### 5 treatment from those suffering from the health affects 

### 6 of pollution. 

### 7 MR. CLARK: Ann, are you pretty close to 

### 8 wrapping up? 

### 9 DR. MELLENGER-BIRDSONG: I have -- yeah, I'm 

### 10 just on my last -- 

### 11 MR. CLARK: Okay. Thank you. 

### 12 DR. MELLENGER-BIRDSON: This rule will lead 

### 13 to cleaner air and better health for millions of 

### 14 American children and families. We ask the EPA to 

### 15 insist on timely implementation without further delay. 

### 16 Each day, children are at risk of being born with 

### 17 preventable birth defects, suffering asthma 

### 18 exacerbation and bearing other health consequences of 

### 19 air pollution. 

### 20 The tools and technology exist. We need to 

### 21 use them to protect our children and families starting 

### 22 today. 

### 23 Thank you. 

### 24 MR. CLARK: Thank you very much. Thank you. 

### 25 Any questions from guys? Okay. Thank you.AGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 47 1 Next two speakers are Janice Nolen please and 

### 2 Charles Jones. 

### 3 FEMALE: Next two -- 

### 4MR. CLARK: Yeah. 

### 5 FEMALE: First and second. 

### 6 MR. CLARK: Okay thank you. Hi. 

### 7 MS. NOLEN: Hi. 

### 8 MR. CLARK: Ms. Nolen. 

### 9 MS. NOLEN: I'm -- my name is Janice Nolen. 

### 10 I'm Assistant Vice President of the American Lung 

### 11 Association. 

### 12 As a Board Chair, Jim Goodin stated earlier, 

### 13 the American Lung Association strongly supports the 

### 14 proposal by the U.S. Environmental Protection Agency to 

### 15 clean up mercury and air toxics from coal-fired power 

### 16 plants. 

### 17 I appreciate the opportunity to testify 

### 18 today, particularly because today has been so long 

### 19 coming. We at the Lung Association look forward to the 

### 20 day when the air in our communities is free from the 

### 21 plumes of arsenic, mercury, dioxins, lead, cadmium, 

### 22 benzene, formaldehyde, acid gasses, as well as the 

### 23 particulate matter and other hazards they produce. 

### 24The twenty-one year delay is -- a generation 

### 25 was born, grew up and has reached maturity breathing inAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 48 1 toxic emissions and eating mercury in their fish 

### 2 despite the promise that we, as a nation, made to them 

### 3 in 1990. 

### 4To put it another way, young adults entering 

### 5 their junior year at Spellman College or Emery 

### 6 University this Fall are still without the protection 

### 7 that Congress voted for them to have in the year they 

### 8 were born. That is wrong. 

### 9 As EPA has noted, cleaning up these emissions 

### 10 will save lives and relieve the burden on the health of 

### 11 millions of people. 

### 12 We are pleased that in 2016, if this rule is 

### 13 put in place and the electric utility companies clean 

### 14 up these plants, seventeen thousand people won't die 

### 15 early. A hundred and twenty thousand people won't have 

### 16 their asthma made worse. Twelve thousand people won't 

### 17 have to be admitted to the hospital or make a fear 

### 18 filled trip to the emergency room. 

### 19 Some opponents have pretended that their 

### 20 electric utilities have not clearly known what was 

### 21 coming for twenty-one years. The industry has known 

### 22 for years what the requirements would be. In fact, 

### 23 many electricity providers have prepared well in 

### 24 advance and made the changes that reduce their 

### 25 emissions in anticipation of this requirement.AGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 49 1 Even the Georgia legislature knew because in 

### 2 2005, the state legislature passed a law requiring many 

### 3 power plants to make the same kinds of clean air tools 

### 4 that we're discussing today. 

### 5 EPA has provided nearly three months for 

### 6 comments. Even today, forty days remain until the 

### 7 comments are due. Plenty of time. 

### 8 Further delay, even to extend the comment 

### 9 period is not only unnecessary, but it would extend 

### 10 the burden of breathing toxic pollution on top of the 

### 11 delay -- decades of delay so far. 

### 12 We will be submitting in-depth comments in 

### 13 writing later, but I'd like to call special attention 

### 14 to the role of acid gasses and the absolutely need to 

### 15 include controls to reduce acid gasses in the final 

### 16 rule. 

### 17 Acid gasses make up the bulk of the volume of 

### 18 toxic emissions coming from these power plants. Acid 

### 19 gasses are highly irritating, corrosive gasses, 

### 20 inflaming the eyes, nose, and throat, as well as the 

### 21 delicate tissues of the respiratory system. Because 

### 22 they are highly soluble in water, acid gas vapors can 

### 23 react readily with the moist tissues in the upper 

### 24 airways. 

### 25 Water bound to microscopic particles can actAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 50 1 as a delivery system for acids to the alveolar regions 

### 2 of the lung. 

### 3 Acid gasses have been found to cause asthma 

### 4 attacks. 

### 5 The biggest burden of these acid gasses falls 

### 6 on the people who live closest to the plants, downwind 

### 7 and along the plumes. 

### 8 As our Board Chair, Jim Goodin described 

### 9 earlier, the people exposed most to these gasses, to 

### 10 these acids are those who can bear the harm the least. 

### 11 Research has shown that people who have the lowest 

### 12 income face higher risk from pollution than wealthier 

### 13 people. Part of the reason is that they are also more 

### 14 likely to have diseases, such as asthma and chronic 

### 15 obstructive pulmonary disease, which make them more 

### 16 vulnerable, but a big part is they live closer to these 

### 17 sources of pollution and are more exposed to more 

### 18 concentrated levels. 

### 19 Limiting the acid gasses provides a vital 

### 20 added benefit by cutting down on acid gas not formally 

### 21 listed among the air toxics, sulfur dioxide. Make no 

### 22 mistake, SO2 is hazardous. A trigger of asthma attacks 

### 23 and respiratory inflammation. Sulfur dioxide reacts 

### 24 chemically in the atmosphere to create sulfate 

### 25 particles.AGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 51 1 Consequently, one of the most important co

### 2 benefits of reducing acid gasses is that by reducing 

### 3 sulfur dioxide, we can reduce sulfates in the air and 

### 4 save lives. 

### 5 We cannot afford not to clean up these toxic 

### 6 substances. We cannot permit another year to go by 

### 7 when seventeen thousand people die early, when workers 

### 8 miss eight hundred fifty thousand days at work because 

### 9 they, or someone in their family, is sick. When twelve 

### 10 thousand people end up in the hospital, in the 

### 11 emergency room because we failed again to act. These 

### 12 are things we truly cannot afford. 

### 13 The American Lung Association supports this 

### 14 mercury and air toxics rule. We need this to protect 

### 15 our health and the health of our families. After 

### 16 twenty-one years, these utilities will finally be 

### 17 required to follow the law. This rule will hold power 

### 18 plants accountable to the same standards that other 

### 19 industries have been held to nationwide. This is a 

### 20 huge step towards cleaning up the air we depend on and 

### 21 giving us back the air we deserve. 

### 22 Thank you. 

### 23 MR. CLARK: Thank you very much. Mr. Jones. 

### 24 MR. JONES: Thank you. Good morning. My 

### 25 name is Clay Jones. I'm the Vice President and GeneralAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 52 1 Counsel of the Georgia Traditional Manufacturer's 

### 2 Association or GTMA. We represent the interest of 

### 3 Georgia manufacturers in legislative and regulatory 

### 4matters. Thank you very much for the opportunity to 

### 5 share our thoughts. 

### 6 Our association was founded in 1900 with its 

### 7 roots in the Georgia textile industry. We recently 

### 8 merged with the Georgia Industry Association and in the 

### 9 coming weeks, we'll be known as the Georgia Association 

### 10 of Manufacturers. That's enough alphabet soup. 

### 11 We are now the voice of all manufacturers in 

### 12 our state, but with members also still from the textile 

### 13 and carpet industry, but also in other industries such 

### 14 as agricultural equipment, steel, and other metals, 

### 15 chemicals, medical sutures, geo-synthetics, 

### 16 refrigeration, and other industrial equipment and a 

### 17 host of others. 

### 18 I want to emphasize the importance of 

### 19 environmental stewardship of our membership. One of 

### 20 our most active committees is the Environmental Quality 

### 21 Committee, with volunteers from member companies who 

### 22 meet regularly to discuss and share information about 

### 23 the latest in environmental compliance and 

### 24 environmental excellence. 

### 25 Many of our companies are nationallyAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 53 1 recognized and rewarded for their sustainability 

### 2 efforts including reducing their energy usage, 

### 3 drastically reducing their water usage and water 

### 4 consumption, reduce landfill usage and other, and other 

### 5 pro-environmental achievements. 

### 6 We support a clean environment and 

### 7 responsible policies that promote environmental 

### 8 protection and economic growth. 

### 9 The proposed utility MACT, however, would 

### 10 impose significant costs on utilities that supply 

### 11 energy, electricity in particular, to our members. 

### 12 Although the cost impact of the proposed MACT 

### 13 will initially fall on those utilities, it's not secret 

### 14 who ultimately pays the bill. Ultimately, it is all 

### 15 consumers, including industry. 

### 16 Energy costs are a substantial cost for 

### 17 manufacturers nearing, and sometimes even surpassing, 

### 18 labor costs. These costs have skyrocketed in recent 

### 19 years. Whereas it might have been a lesser factor in 

### 20 prior years, energy costs now are often one of the 

### 21 determining factors in where a manufacturer locates, 

### 22 whether it's in this country or another country or 

### 23 which state, whether it expands to add production and 

### 24 jobs, or indeed, whether it can continue operations at 

### 25 all.AGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 54 1 So we urge you to be especially careful, not 

### 2 to adopt rules that impose unreasonable cost burdens on 

### 3 utilities and their customers because those -- we will 

### 4 ultimately be paying for those. 

### 5 You know, the preliminary analysis, this MACT 

### 6 will effect virtually every coal plant and require the 

### 7 operation and construction of scrubbers. It would 

### 8 impact plants responsible for nearly fifty percent of 

### 9 the total electricity generation at a cost that 

### 10 even -- EPA estimates, my understanding, to be over ten 

### 11 billion dollars per year and with a three-year time 

### 12 line for compliance, if there are labor shortages or 

### 13 material shortages that cost will only increase. 

### 14Georgia Power is a major supplier, a 

### 15 subsidiary of Southern Company and a major supplier to 

### 16 many of our members. They recently spend three point 

### 17 seven billion dollars in environmental controls and 

### 18 expect to spend another two hundred and ten million 

### 19 dollars to comply with existing environmental laws. We 

### 20 didn't oppose that expenditure. It was approved for 

### 21 recovery in the most recent Georgia Power rate case 

### 22 which was last year. 

### 23 But nonetheless, those costs have 

### 24 significantly increased already electric rates for all 

### 25 consumers, including manufacturers and other businessesAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 55 1 key to Georgia's continued economic growth. And if 

### 2 this is adopted, there will be increased costs again, 

### 3 so we ask you just to consider that impact on rate 

### 4 payers, because ultimately the utilities may pay for 

### 5 it, but then we end up paying for what the utilities 

### 6 pay for. 

### 7 So we ask you to take into account the 

### 8 interest of manufacturers and other consumers. We 

### 9 understand and respect your mission to protect the 

### 10 environment, but we also believe you have a 

### 11 responsibility to consider the impact on consumers of 

### 12 utility service and the economy as a whole. We can ill 

### 13 afford to face increased expenses that are burdensome 

### 14 and stifle economic growth. We have to find a balance 

### 15 and we are very skeptical that this proposed rule does 

### 16 that. 

### 17 The public opinion polls that have been 

### 18 published lately and political leaders on both sides of 

### 19 the [indecipherable] in recent years have emphasized 

### 20 the importance of manufacturing to our nation's 

### 21 economic future. A healthy manufacturing base creates 

### 22 wealth, jobs, and opportunities here in our country. 

### 23 This nation has been through an enormous economic shock 

### 24 over the past few years. 

### 25 Manufacturing jobs, which had already beenAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 56 1 decreasing over the past decade suffered extensively. 

### 2 I can tell you that in Georgia, ten years ago, there 

### 3 were over six hundred thousand manufacturing jobs. 

### 4 Today, there are about three hundred and forty-five 

### 5 thousand jobs in manufacturing. 

### 6 So we ask you to please consider the fragile 

### 7 nature of the economic recovery, to remember that the 

### 8 costs imposed by this rule will fall upon the backs of 

### 9 consumers, including on industries which are faced 

### 10 already with increasing costs and intense 

### 11 internationally competition. 

### 12 We urge you to reject any rule that will 

### 13 impose unreasonable costs that threaten the health of 

### 14 manufacturers and of our economy in general. 

### 15 Thank you very much for the time to speak. 

### 16 MR. CLARK: Thank you very much. Any 

### 17 questions guys for? No? Okay. Thank you so much. 

### 18 MR. JONES: Thank you. 

### 19 MR. CLARK: Next speakers please. William 

### 20 P. Brown and Roger Mills. Okay, we have one of our 

### 21 guys here -- you are? 

### 22 MR. BROWN: I am William P. Brown. 

### 23 MR. CLARK: Yeah. So Roger Mills? Is Roger 

### 24 here? I take that as a no, so Representative Scott 

### 25 Holcomb. Thank you, Mr. Brown.AGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 57 1 MR. BROWN: Yeah. And my name is spelled as 

### 2 in the color, B-R-O-W-N. 

### 3 I think I'm the first one to appear as an 

### 4 individual on the roster, but that does not mean that 

### 5 I'm isolated or exist in a vacuum. I am an Ordained 

### 6 Minister of the Presbyterian Church, U.S.A. I'm a 

### 7 founding member of Earth Covenant Ministry and I also 

### 8 have connections with the Evangelical Environmental 

### 9 Network, but I don't represent any of those 

### 10 organizations. I come simply as a person of faith, a 

### 11 Christian, who is greatly concerned about our God given 

### 12 responsibility to care for creation, which would include 

### 13 our care for the health and well-being of future 

### 14 generations and that begins with the health and well 

### 15 being of our children; those already born and those yet 

### 16 to be born. 

### 17 That's why I firmly believe that the EPA's 

### 18 proposed rule to reduce emissions of toxic air 

### 19 pollutants from power plants is critical and vitally 

### 20 so. 

### 21 Coal-fired power plants emit lead, dioxins, 

### 22 acid gasses, mercury, and arsenic to name only a few. 

### 23 They are all known threats to public health. Mercury 

### 24 is particularly harmful. It doesn't go away, but 

### 25 instead builds up in the environment and in the form ofAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 58 1 methyl mercury in fish, it is especially dangerous to 

### 2 pregnant women and their unborn children. Exposure, it 

### 3 has been shown, can cause brain damage. 

### 4Mercury contamination in the United States is 

### 5 so widespread that at least one in twelve and as many 

### 6 as one in six women of child-bearing age has mercury 

### 7 levels high enough to put an unborn child at risk for 

### 8 mercury poisoning. 

### 9 Coal plants are the largest source of 

### 10 unregulated mercury emissions in the United States 

### 11 pumping out forty-eight tons of the toxin every year. 

### 12 Regulations that enforce drastic reductions of air 

### 13 toxics are long overdue. I consider the protection of 

### 14 our children as a nonnegotiable and the great irony is 

### 15 that inaction on this issue now will only get costlier 

### 16 for our society later on. 

### 17 Jesus was and is known for many things and 

### 18 among them, he was known to love and genuinely enjoy 

### 19 children. He once asked rhetorically is there anyone 

### 20 among you who, if your child asks for bread, will give 

### 21 a stone or if a child ask for a fish will give a snake? 

### 22 The answer is, of course, no. That would be 

### 23 unthinkable. Would we give our children food laced with 

### 24methyl mercury? 

### 25 Jesus once placed a child in front of hisAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 59 1 disciples and said, "Whoever welcomes one such child in 

### 2 my name, welcomes me." If any of you put a stumbling 

### 3 block before one of these little ones, it would be 

### 4 better for you if a great large stone were 

### 5 fastened around your neck and you were drowned in the 

### 6 depths of the sea." 

### 7 I suspect that our children and our 

### 8 children's children are going to condemn us after we 

### 9 are gone for having jeopardized their health and their 

### 10 planet on which they will have to live, or try to live, 

### 11 if they are able. 

### 12 Future generations will certainly not look 

### 13 upon us with gratitude or respect for what we are going 

### 14 to -- what we are doing to this planet. And sometimes 

### 15 I think it would be better to be wearing that 

### 16 large stone. 

### 17 To ensure the beauty of this earth and its 

### 18 sufficiency as a habitat for generations to come, that 

### 19 for me is a major part of our responsibility, whether 

### 20 as Christians or simply as good citizens and I believe 

### 21 that our ethical responsibility will ultimately be 

### 22 measured in terms of what kind of earth we are able to 

### 23 leave as a legacy to our children. 

### 24This is the legacy I hope for and pray for 

### 25 and work for. As one living in Atlanta, specificallyAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 60 1 in Decatur, I share God's vision for a safe, secure 

### 2 city as expressed in Zachariah Chapter eight. "Thus 

### 3 says the Lord of hosts. Old men and old women, women 

### 4 shall again sit in the streets of Jerusalem, each with 

### 5 staff in hand because of their great age and the 

### 6 streets of the city shall be full of boys and girls 

### 7 playing in the streets." May those boys and girls be 

### 8 secure in their health, as they are safe from violence. 

### 9 Therefore, I urge the proposed EPA rule be 

### 10 implemented swiftly and without delay. 

### 11 Thank you. 

### 12 MR. CLARK: Thank you very much. 

### 13 Representative Holcomb. 

### 14REPRESENTATIVE HOLCOMB: Thank you very much. 

### 15 My name is Scott Holcomb and I am a State 

### 16 Representative for District eighty-two in the Georgia 

### 17 House of Representatives. 

### 18 I appreciate the opportunity to address some 

### 19 issues that are very important to my constituents in 

### 20 terms of their health and well being, as well as issues 

### 21 that are important to me as a father, a citizen, and a 

### 22 veteran. 

### 23 I support the EPA's proposed standards to 

### 24 limit mercury, acid gasses, and other toxic pollution 

### 25 from coal and oil-fired power plants.AGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 61 1 These standards would keep ninety-one percent 

### 2 of the mercury in coal from being released into the 

### 3 air. 

### 4The benefits of these new standards are 

### 5 obvious and immediate; better health for our citizens 

### 6 and cleaner air and water. 

### 7 I find it difficult to understand why anyone 

### 8 would oppose these goals, although I know the immediate 

### 9 and most common refrain is that change is expensive. 

### 10 This may or may not be true, but operating under the 

### 11 existing standards has been, and will continue to be, 

### 12 far more expensive. 

### 13 Clean air, water, and a safe food supply are 

### 14 the cornerstones of a sustainable future. These should 

### 15 be non-partisan goals for our country and I think it's 

### 16 important to note that the Clean Air Act and the Clean 

### 17 Water Act were enacted during the Nixon administration. 

### 18 I also support the proposed standards for 

### 19 another reason. I believe that these standards will 

### 20 help spur innovation and help lead us away from our 

### 21 dependence on fossil fuels, particularly oil. 

### 22 As a U.S. Army veteran who served as a 

### 23 Captain from 1998 to 2004 and deployed overseas three 

### 24 times, I have a firsthand understanding on why it is 

### 25 so important for our country to pursue alternativeAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 62 1 fuels and to wean ourselves off of fossil fuels. 

### 2 We import fossil fuels from nations that are 

### 3 either hostile to our interests or that support our 

### 4 enemies, for example, by supporting terrorists. 

### 5 Our reliance on fossil fuels impacts and 

### 6 impairs our national security. 

### 7 It is for these reasons that I encourage the 

### 8 EPA to adopt these new standards; to limit mercury, 

### 9 acid gasses, and other toxic pollution. I believe 

### 10 doing so will spur innovation and help the United 

### 11 States have a stronger energy infrastructure. 

### 12 It is the right thing to do for our health, 

### 13 for our security and for nation. 

### 14 Thank you. 

### 15 MR. CLARK: Thank you very much. Let me just 

### 16 ask a quick question. You may have said this at the 

### 17 beginning of your statement, but what -- your District 

### 18 represents is where? 

### 19 REPRESENTATIVE HOLCOMB: I represent 

### 20 northeast Atlanta in DeKalb County. 

### 21 MR. CLARK: Thank you. 

### 22 REPRESENTATIVE HOLCOMB: Thank you. 

### 23 MR. CLARK: Any questions folks? Okay. 

### 24 Thank you both very much. 

### 25 Okay. Is -- let me just try Roger Mills, areAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 63 1 you here? No Roger Mills. Okay. Then if we could do 

### 2 Dale Kemmerick please and Stanley Saunders. Thank you. 

### 3 Yeah. Hi, Mr. Kemmerick. 

### 4MR. KEMMERICK: Yes. I'm Dale Kemmerick, 

### 5 it's K-E-M-M-E-R-I-C-K. I'm retired from the Georgia 

### 6 Environmental Protection Division and I worked there 

### 7 for thirty-four years. 

### 8 I support the power plant Mercury and Air 

### 9 Toxics Standards proposed by EPA on March 16, 2011. 

### 10 As an Air Pollution Meteorologist working at 

### 11 EPD, I know how vital emission reductions are to a 

### 12 healthy and sustainable atmosphere. 

### 13 As proven by the improvements in the acid 

### 14 rain and ozone problems, it, it shows that emission 

### 15 reductions work and have been successful and should be 

### 16 the first step in any implementation even before the 

### 17 final extent of the problem is known. 

### 18 You can never have enough emission reductions 

### 19 unless you get down to zero, actually. 

### 20 I'm an environmental conservative and 

### 21 concerned that the power plant owners want to burden 

### 22 the air with the waste without any reductions or paying 

### 23 for it. 

### 24I concur with EPA's fact sheet on, on these 

### 25 standards that it will provide health benefits and saveAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 64 1 lives, improve productivity, and increase jobs, and 

### 2 provide regulatory certainty and a fair market for all 

### 3 energy providers. What more can you ask for than that? 

### 4At this time, power plants are causing health 

### 5 costs that they are not paying for and transferring 

### 6 those health costs to the public. I'm sure that if you 

### 7 ask the CEO of these power plants to ingest a fraction 

### 8 of the mercury or toxic pollutants, they would refuse. 

### 9 I know that there may be a minority of the 

### 10 public that are submissive to the wishes of the power 

### 11 industry, but the majority of the public believe they 

### 12 are right to clean air and object to having toxic smoke 

### 13 blown into their face. 

### 14EPA, as a regulatory, must be a referee 

### 15 between all the differed groups and not be intimidated 

### 16 by the political considerations, but act on the 

### 17 scientific facts. 

### 18 However the timing of the implementation for 

### 19 these standards is too long. We have proven 

### 20 technology that it has been installed in other industry 

### 21 types and power plants have been aware of the problem 

### 22 for decades. At EPD, we have -- the power plants have 

### 23 submitted toxic emission reports detailing, you know, 

### 24 the problems that they have for decades. They have -- 

### 25 let's see. A good CEO would have planned for thisAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 65 1 implementation knowing the problem. 

### 2 At the very least, if a power plant asks for 

### 3 the extra year to complete the installation of control 

### 4 equipment, they should be charged a fee equal to one 

### 5 year of the state's estimated health cost due to those 

### 6 emissions. 

### 7 The power companies have said that they don't 

### 8 have -- if they don't have to control these emissions, 

### 9 they will create jobs, but I've never known a company 

### 10 that will hire someone to do nothing. They fail to 

### 11 mention that the only jobs created by these emissions 

### 12 are increased healthcare workers and undertakers. 

### 13 Thank you. 

### 14MR. CLARK: Thank you. Mr. Saunders. 

### 15 MR. SAUNDERS: I'm Stanley P. Saunders. I'm 

### 16 a person of faith, an Ordained Minister with the 

### 17 Christian Church Disciples of Christ and a founding 

### 18 member of Birth Covenant Ministry. 

### 19 According to the EPA itself, emissions from 

### 20 coal-fired power plants produce some three hundred and 

### 21 eighty-six thousand tons of hazardous air pollutants 

### 22 annually. More than that of any other point source 

### 23 category. 

### 24These emissions include eighty-four different 

### 25 pollutants that pose threats to human health and theAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 66 1 environment. 

### 2 We are here today primarily to talk about 

### 3 only one of these pollutants, namely mercury. But the 

### 4 implications stretch far beyond that one substance. 

### 5 The risks associated with mercury are well 

### 6 known. In all of its forms, mercury is toxic, but 

### 7 especially damaging to the most vulnerable, to fetuses 

### 8 and to newborns. 

### 9 You will hear many times today, and we 

### 10 already have heard that one in six babies is now born 

### 11 in this country with harmful levels of mercury in their 

### 12 blood stream. 

### 13 Coal-fired power plants constitute the 

### 14 largest single source producer of mercury, but a source 

### 15 that we can control if we so choose. Roughly forty 

### 16 percent of Georgia's total electric energy comes from 

### 17 coal. In fact, we are the most coal dependent state in 

### 18 the country. The Southern Company is the biggest 

### 19 producer of coal energy in the United States. 

### 20 In 2008, coal-fired power plants in Georgia 

### 21 reported emitting three thousand seven hundred and 

### 22 seventy-six pounds of mercury, probably conservative. 

### 23 Six Southern Company plants in Georgia and 

### 24 Alabama rank among the top fifty emitters of mercury in 

### 25 the United States.AGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 67 1 Twenty years has passed since Congress 

### 2 revised the Clean Air Act mandated the EPA to clean up 

### 3 toxic substances and to protect Americans from airborne 

### 4 hazards. We are now finally on the verge of enacting 

### 5 policies that would fulfill that mandate and require 

### 6 substantial reductions in the release of the airborne 

### 7 mercury from coal-fired plants. 

### 8 We have had the technology to accomplish 

### 9 these reductions for some time. In fact, many power 

### 10 plants today already have these technologies in place. 

### 11 As far as I can see, there is nothing to prevent us 

### 12 from fulfilling the law and doing what is right. 

### 13 Although the environmental costs of burning 

### 14 coal to produce electricity are enormous from start to 

### 15 finish, we probably need to recognize in this country 

### 16 that we will continue to burn coal into the foreseeable 

### 17 future. But it would be both immoral and suicidal to 

### 18 continue to burn coal without doing the very best we 

### 19 can to put into place the technology that will limit 

### 20 its negative consequences. 

### 21 The energy corporations that burn coal have 

### 22 had twenty years to provide leadership, but have 

### 23 instead persistently drug their feet, usually citing 

### 24 costs and the need for more study. 

### 25 There will always be things to study, but theAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 68 1 facts about the dangers of mercury do not change. 

### 2 There will always be costs to be borne, but the long

### 3 term costs of inaction, whether financial, social, or 

### 4 environmental far outweigh any short-term costs. 

### 5 We need, therefore, the EPA to implement 

### 6 strong new mercury standards and require maximum 

### 7 achievable control technology now. 

### 8 We also need the energy companies themselves 

### 9 who's rights as citizens, the courts have recently 

### 10 dramatically confirmed and expanded to act like good 

### 11 citizens. First by providing consistent concrete 

### 12 evidence of their concern for the common welfare of 

### 13 their fellow citizens and customers and for the 

### 14 creation itself, which is not only the source of all 

### 15 the energy that we consume, but of our life and the 

### 16 life of generations to come. 

### 17 We also need the energy companies to invest 

### 18 their substantial financial human and technological 

### 19 resources in proactively preparing for a new cleaner 

### 20 energy future rather than reactively clinging ever 

### 21 tighter to inadequate and outdated technologies that 

### 22 drag us all ever closer to the edge of the abyss. 

### 23 Thank you. 

### 24 MR. CLARK: Thank you both very much. 

### 25 Questions guys? Okay. Thank you.AGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 69 1 Our next speakers please, Juliet Coen and 

### 2 Rebecca Watts Hull. Thank you. Ms. Coen. 

### 3 MS. COEN: Good morning. My name is Juliet 

### 4 Coen. I'm the General Counsel for Upper Chattahoochee 

### 5 River Keeper, but I'm also here to voice the concerns 

### 6 of our sister water keeper alliance members from the 

### 7 Flint, Ogeechee, Sabine, Yadkin, 

### 8 Upper Watauga, Waccamaw, and Apalachicola River 

### 9 Keepers. 

### 10 Our organizations support the proposed 

### 11 Mercury and Air Toxics Standards for power plants and we 

### 12 strongly encourage EPA to adopt these standards. 

### 13 Power plants have largely avoided emission 

### 14 limits on mercury and other air toxic emissions. Power 

### 15 plants, however, are the single largest source of toxic 

### 16 air pollution, and coal-fired power plants are the 

### 17 largest source of mercury pollution in the nation. 

### 18 Mercury and air toxics released into the air 

### 19 fall into water bodies near and far contaminating 

### 20 water, fish, and plant species within. These 

### 21 pollutants do not break down when introduced. Instead 

### 22 mercury circulates and eventually accumulates into 

### 23 living organisms including fish and humans. 

### 24 Mercury is a potent neurotoxin, which can 

### 25 damage the nervous systems as it is consumed throughAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 70 1 the food chain. 

### 2 There is significant mercury contamination in 

### 3 the Chattahoochee River basin, as well as throughout 

### 4 Georgia's other water bodies. State-issued advisories 

### 5 against the consumption of fish due to mercury 

### 6 contamination have been issued for fish in the large 

### 7 lakes in our basin. For example, in Lake Lanier. The 

### 8 state recommends restricting consumption of striped 

### 9 bass, spotted bass, largemouth bass, channel catfish, 

### 10 common carp to only one meal per week. 

### 11 Our rivers and streams also show mercury 

### 12 contamination as almost fifty percent were found to 

### 13 have fish with sufficient contamination levels to 

### 14 warrant a state advisory 

### 15 Our sister river keepers tell us that their 

### 16 water bodies in Georgia, North and South Carolina and 

### 17 Florida also suffer from mercury pollution. In fact, 

### 18 all the rivers in North and South Carolina have fish 

### 19 consumption advisories. In Watauga Lake, which has no 

### 20 point source of pollution and whose shoreline is 

### 21 primarily undeveloped national and state forest, the 

### 22 fish suffer from mercury contamination and are subject 

### 23 to fish consumption advisories. 

### 24It is thought that the source of the mercury 

### 25 contamination in Watauga is from airborne mercury.AGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 71 1 Likewise, EPA has estimated that ninety-nine percent of 

### 2 the mercury in the Ogeechee River basin is due to air 

### 3 pollution as well. 

### 4The promulgation and implementation of the 

### 5 Mercury and Air Toxics Standards for power plants, 

### 6 however, can achieve reduction of mercury contamination 

### 7 in fish tissue quickly and go a long way to protect 

### 8 public health and prosperity in our region. 

### 9 Because power plants are the largest source 

### 10 of air toxics and the current standards do not address 

### 11 these pollutants, we need these strong standards. 

### 12 Without strict emission limits on mercury, particulate 

### 13 matter, and hydrogen chloride, power plants will 

### 14 continue to poison our air and water, reduce our 

### 15 enjoyment of these public resources and harm prosperity 

### 16 in our region. 

### 17 So on behalf of Upper Chattahoochee River 

### 18 Keeper, Flint, Ogeechee, Sabine, Yadkin, Upper 

### 19 Watauga, Waccamaw, and Apalachicola River Keepers, we 

### 20 strongly encourage EPA to adopt these standards to help 

### 21 clean the air around our waterways and protect the 

### 22 public health of our communities from mercury and air 

### 23 toxin pollution. 

### 24Thank you. 

### 25 MR. CLARK: Thank you very much. If, if --AGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 72 1 also, Rebecca, if you could spell your name as well. 

### 2 MS. WATTS-HULL: Yes 

### 3 MR. CLARK: Thanks. 

### 4 MS. WATTS-HULL: Good morning. My name is 

### 5 Rebecca Watts-Hull, W-A-T-T-S, second word H-U-L-L. I 

### 6 represent Mothers and Others for Clean Air, a non

### 7 profit partnership of seven leading public health, 

### 8 children's advocacy and environmental organizations in 

### 9 Georgia. 

### 10 I'm here today on behalf of Mothers and 

### 11 Others for Clean Air to support EPA's proposed mercury 

### 12 and air toxics rule, a rule that is badly needed and 

### 13 long overdue. 

### 14 There are many reasons why public health 

### 15 advocates and concerned moms and dads support this 

### 16 rule. The neurotoxicity of mercury and other heavy 

### 17 metals controlled by this rule, as well as the danger 

### 18 of toxics such as arsenic and formaldehyde, especially 

### 19 to unborn and young children are clearly understood. 

### 20 Setting limits on these air toxics from power plants 

### 21 just makes sense and is long overdue as these limits 

### 22 were required by the Clean Air Act Amendment passed 

### 23 twenty years ago. 

### 24 I'm going to let others, however, go into 

### 25 more detail about the importance of mercury and airAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 73 1 toxics today and focus my comments on an additional 

### 2 important benefit of this rule; namely achieving 

### 3 further reductions in fine particulate matter or PM2.5 

### 4 and its precursors from coal-fired power plants. 

### 5 New limits for acid gasses under the proposed 

### 6 rule will provide significant health benefits with by 

### 7 reducing the gasses themselves and also by reducing the 

### 8 secondary fine particulate matter formed in the 

### 9 atmosphere as a result of their presence. 

### 10 Too many Georgia citizens are breathing 

### 11 unhealthy concentrations of PM2.5. Twenty-two metro 

### 12 Atlanta counties, as well as the Macon area in 

### 13 northwest Georgia fail the annual standard for PM and 

### 14 that standard does not yet reflect the most recent 

### 15 science revealing harm at lower concentrations. 

### 16 With Atlanta, Macon, and northwest Georgia 

### 17 still failing an outdated standard, and Columbus and 

### 18 Augusta very close to the old limit, Georgia needs to 

### 19 achieve PM2.5 reductions from every major source it can 

### 20 control, including every single coal-fired power plant 

### 21 in Georgia as well as those in other states who's 

### 22 pollution is carried into Georgia. 

### 23 Fine particulate matter of all kinds is 

### 24 harmful. The respiratory and cardiopulmonary affects 

### 25 of fine PM are well documented by decades of research.AGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 74 1 I would like to describe one such study in 

### 2 order to address a claim made repeatedly by industry 

### 3 groups that the type of fine particle pollution from 

### 4 coal plants is not a serious public health concern. 

### 5 A 2008 study led by a team of scientist from 

### 6 Emery University and Georgia Institute of Technology 

### 7 used fine particulate source apportionment methods to 

### 8 link different types of PM2.5 differentiated by source 

### 9 to negative health outcomes. Contrary to industry 

### 10 claims, this study revealed a clear association between 

### 11 respiratory emergency department visits in Atlanta and 

### 12 sulfate rich fine PM, the kind of fine particles formed 

### 13 in the atmosphere as a result of gasses emitted by coal 

### 14 fired power plants. 

### 15 In addition to their role in the formation of 

### 16 harmful fine particulate matter, many of the gasses 

### 17 controlled by this rule are directly associated with 

### 18 negative health outcomes. The proposed rule would 

### 19 result in reductions in sulfur dioxide emissions of 

### 20 fifty-five percent or more. 

### 21 SO2 is a power airway irritant that is 

### 22 particularly dangerous to anyone suffering asthma or 

### 23 COPD. Even very brief spikes in SO2 from a coal-fired 

### 24 power plant can trigger a severe asthma attack. 

### 25 Georgia's 2010 asthma surveillance reportAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 75 1 estimates that approximately twelve percent of 

### 2 Georgia's children, almost three hundred thousand, has 

### 3 asthma. 

### 4Our state needs EPA to use every federal tool 

### 5 at its disposal, including the proposed mercury and air 

### 6 toxics rule to reduce both SO2 and fine particulate 

### 7 pollution so we can all breathe easier. 

### 8 Finally, I would like to support EPA's 

### 9 position that the limits in the proposed rule and the 

### 10 time table for meeting it are very reasonable. The 

### 11 proposed rule is based on careful consideration of what 

### 12 the cleanest twelve percent of plants already have been 

### 13 able to achieve. 

### 14Many of the units at Georgia's coal-fired 

### 15 power plants have already installed controls for acid 

### 16 gasses and particulates as the result of a state rule 

### 17 prompted by the 2005 Clean Air Mercury and Clean Air 

### 18 Interstate Rules. 

### 19 In neighboring North Carolina, Duke Energy 

### 20 recently announced it expects to achieve a consistent 

### 21 ninety-eight percent removal efficiency for SO2 with 

### 22 wet scrubbers at its Cliffside Coal Plant. 

### 23 Effective controls have been available for 

### 24 quite some time. The proposed rule will force the 

### 25 clean up or conversion of some very old units inAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 76 1 neighboring states whose emissions reach our state. It 

### 2 also will result in a tighter timetable for emission 

### 3 reductions at some of Georgia's coal plant, including 

### 4 Plant Yates right here in metro Atlanta. 

### 5 The flexibility written into the rule enables 

### 6 Georgia Power to decide the best way to meet the 

### 7 emissions limit at each plant, whether it be control 

### 8 technology, plant conversion, or a decision to generate 

### 9 or purchase electricity from cleaner sources. 

### 10 This is good news for Georgia's children who 

### 11 should not have to wait any longer for emissions 

### 12 reductions that have been attainable for decades and 

### 13 I'm going to wrap up. 

### 14We would like to thank EPA for its efforts to 

### 15 reduce air pollution in Georgia and throughout the U.S. 

### 16 and thank you for the opportunity to speak today. 

### 17 MR. CLARK: Thank you. I had -- Beverly 

### 18 probably knows this, but could you just say something 

### 19 quickly about Mothers and Others for Clean Air, just 

### 20 about, about the organization and then also you 

### 21 mentioned the 2008 Georgia Tech Emery Study, I was 

### 22 wondering if you have a citation for that? 

### 23 MS. WATTS-HULL: Yes I do. The citation is 

### 24 included in my written comments -- 

### 25 MR. CLARK: Great.AGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 77 1 MS. WATTS-HULL: -- that I left at the desk. 

### 2 MR. CLARK: Okay. 

### 3 MS. WATTS-HULL: And the seven partner 

### 4 organizations of Mothers and Others are American Lung 

### 5 Association in Georgia, Children's Healthcare of 

### 6 Atlanta, Georgia Conservancy, Georgia PTA, Morehouse 

### 7 School of Medicine, Physicians for Social 

### 8 Responsibility and Rawlins School of Public Health at 

### 9 Emery and those are also listed in my written comments. 

### 10 MR. CLARK: Okay great. Thank you. Thank 

### 11 you both. 

### 12 Our next two speakers please, Joe Hudson and 

### 13 Chris Hobson. Excellent, thank you. Thank you. 

### 14 Mr. Hudson, if you could start and if you could spell 

### 15 your, your -- if both of you could spell your last 

### 16 names, appreciate that. 

### 17 MR. HUDSON: Good morning. I'm Joe Hudson, 

### 18 H-U-D-S-O-N. I was born and raised in Eatonton, 

### 19 Georgia, Putnam County, which is a small community 

### 20 about seventy-five miles southeast of Atlanta. 

### 21 I'm not a public speaker, but I'm honored to 

### 22 speak with you because I know how important these 

### 23 hearings are. 

### 24I've not come here today to promote anyone's 

### 25 political agenda. I don't affiliate with any politicalAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 78 1 party and none of my children work for Georgia Power 

### 2 Company. 

### 3 I've come here today because I love my 

### 4 community, my state, and my country. I try to keep an 

### 5 open mind about things and I think the best decisions 

### 6 are made when we use a healthy combination of acquired 

### 7 knowledge and common sense. 

### 8 Our community is blessed to have two 

### 9 beautiful manmade lakes in our county, Lake Sinclair 

### 10 and Lake Oconee. These two lakes have caused many 

### 11 wonderful new families to move into our, into our area 

### 12 which has been good for our banks, our churches, our 

### 13 civic clubs and our business people. It's not easy to 

### 14 attract newcomers to rural Georgia. They want a good 

### 15 school system, a good healthcare facility, good 

### 16 recreational facilities, good churches, and other good 

### 17 people. 

### 18 One of the reasons we have been able to have 

### 19 these things is because last year, Georgia Power paid 

### 20 thirteen percent of our county's ad valorem taxes and 

### 21 fourteen percent of our sales tax. This means our 

### 22 county can afford the good hospital, the good school 

### 23 system, and those other things that are so important to 

### 24 any community. 

### 25 I don't know anybody in our community thatAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 79 1 has been harmed by anything Georgia Power has done in 

### 2 the last fifty years, but I know of a lot of people 

### 3 whose lives have been extended or saved by Putnam 

### 4 General Hospital. 

### 5 I know of a lot of people who have graduated 

### 6 from Putnam County High School and have gone on to 

### 7 become productive citizens. These young people who 

### 8 grow up in Putnam County need local jobs so that they 

### 9 can stay at home instead of moving to Atlanta or some 

### 10 other metro area to find a good job. 

### 11 I've got two brothers. Two of us remained at 

### 12 home and found good jobs in Eatonton. One brother had 

### 13 to seek employment elsewhere. I've got three children. 

### 14 Unfortunately, only one of the children were able to 

### 15 stay at home and find a good job. The two others had 

### 16 to move to other communities to find a good job. 

### 17 Our community has been hit hard by the 

### 18 recession. Business has -- businesses have closed, 

### 19 people have lost their jobs. The national news says 

### 20 that our graduates are going to have a more difficult 

### 21 time than ever finding good jobs. This isn't good. 

### 22 Georgia Power helped to provide the kind of 

### 23 jobs that our high school and college graduates need; 

### 24 good paying jobs with good benefits. Georgia Power 

### 25 employees like Lynwood Lindsey [phonetic] and Wes LewisAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 80 1 are leaders in our community. Lynwood serves on the 

### 2 Putnam County Development Authority and Wes serves on 

### 3 the Chamber of Commerce. They make our community a 

### 4 better place to live. 

### 5 Without industries, like Georgia Power, small 

### 6 rural communities like ours will disappear from the 

### 7 landscape of our country. Georgia Power is one of the 

### 8 most important if not the most important economic 

### 9 engines that helps run our county. 

### 10 I'm an avid hunter and runner and I like 

### 11 spending time outdoors. I want clean air and clean 

### 12 water, not only for me and my family, but for all of 

### 13 our children and grandchildren for generations to come. 

### 14Before the Lake Oconee was constructed, my 

### 15 friends and I canoed the Oconee River numerous times 

### 16 each summer. I had eaten fish out of those rivers and 

### 17 lakes in Putnam County for fifty years and the only 

### 18 negative thing I can tell you is that my waistline has 

### 19 probably gotten a little bit bigger. 

### 20 I was a Boy Scout and I was an Explorer 

### 21 Scout. I realized at an early age what a beautiful 

### 22 creation that God has given us and I want to do my part 

### 23 to make sure it stays that way. 

### 24I've worked for forty-one years at the 

### 25 Farmers and Merchants Bank in Eatonton, a localAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 81 1 independent community bank. I'm keenly aware of how 

### 2 difficult it is in a rural community to attract new 

### 3 businesses and industries. I loan money to individuals 

### 4 and companies so that they can start a new business or 

### 5 expand an existing business. 

### 6 Energy costs are a big part of any 

### 7 businesses' budget and if energy costs continue to go 

### 8 up because of new rules and regulations, pretty soon, 

### 9 they're going to price themselves right out of 

### 10 business. 

### 11 We need to make it easy for a businessperson 

### 12 to succeed and expand and hire more employees. Believe 

### 13 me that when I say that the Georgia Power Company is 

### 14 the kind of business partner you want to attract 

### 15 because they are good corporate citizens. They 

### 16 compliment every other business in our community and in 

### 17 2010, they were selected citizen of the year by our 

### 18 local Chamber of Commerce. They could just have easily 

### 19 received this award for the last half century in Putnam 

### 20 County. 

### 21 I was fortunate to serve on the Eatonton City 

### 22 Council for ten years. I was in charge of water and 

### 23 waste water systems of the city and parts of the 

### 24 county. We treated our waste water sufficiently so 

### 25 that we could allow the results to flow right back intoAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 82 1 the rivers, streams, and lakes in Putnam County. 

### 2 Now if Eatonton in Putnam County can purify 

### 3 its waste water after it has traveled through places 

### 4 that we don't even, won't -- don't even want to think 

### 5 about, I guarantee you that Georgia Power has the 

### 6 affordable technology and equipment to treat the air 

### 7 and water that go through their coal burning plants. 

### 8 I believe that we must be pro-business when 

### 9 that business helps the majority of Americans. 

### 10 I believe that any rule or regulation which 

### 11 hurts business, hurts Americans. It is imperative that 

### 12 you have the facts before you make decisions. If 

### 13 necessary, please visit our Georgia Power plants and 

### 14 see that they are doing what is necessary to keep our 

### 15 environment safe and clean. 

### 16 Please do not pass rules or regulations 

### 17 without knowing the consequences of those rules and 

### 18 regulations especially when it comes to hurting the 

### 19 creation of new good jobs. And please, please, do not 

### 20 allow yourselves to get caught up in a political agenda 

### 21 which disregards the facts and ignores the truth. 

### 22 Please allow these plants to function at 

### 23 their greatest potential and employ the largest number 

### 24 of people possible for the good of our citizens. 

### 25 Come to Putnam County and ask our localAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 83 1 people just how they feel about Georgia Power Company 

### 2 and their employees. 

### 3 We are all keenly aware of the energy costs 

### 4 and energy needs for America. We import so much of our 

### 5 oil from foreign nations that cost us billions of 

### 6 dollars each year. Electricity is still a source of 

### 7 energy that we Americans can control and can afford. 

### 8 MR. CLARK: Mr. Hudson, are you getting close 

### 9 to concluding? 

### 10 MR. HUDSON: Excuse me? 

### 11 MR. CLARK: I'm sorry. Are you getting 

### 12 pretty close to concluding? We are well past the five 

### 13 minutes. 

### 14MR. HUDSON: Yes sir. 

### 15 MR. CLARK: Okay. Great. Thank you. 

### 16 MR. HUDSON: I'm not a rich person, but I 

### 17 manage to pay all my bills each month. I believe that 

### 18 increased energy and power costs will hurt the poor and 

### 19 less fortunate citizens in America more than anyone 

### 20 else. 

### 21 Ladies and gentlemen, if, if our country is 

### 22 to remain the most envied country in the world because 

### 23 we have the most desirable standard of living, we must 

### 24 be a nation of producers and not just consumers. We 

### 25 must be manufacturers. We must take advantage of theAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 84 1 energy resources we have right here at home, the energy 

### 2 that's affordable to everyone. We must provide jobs. 

### 3 Lieutenant Governor Casey Cagle said 

### 4 recently, "A country that makes nothing won't be great 

### 5 for long." U.S. Representative Tom Graves from Georgia 

### 6 believes that over regulation is costing our economy 

### 7 one point three quarters of a trillion dollars, one 

### 8 point seven five trillion dollars a year, over 

### 9 regulation. 

### 10 We're extremely blessed to have Georgia Power 

### 11 in our community and, and they're a great corporate 

### 12 citizen and a great business partner. 

### 13 Thank you. 

### 14MR. CLARK: Okay. Thank you. Thank you very 

### 15 much. Mr. Hobson. 

### 16 MR. HOBSON: Thank you for holding this 

### 17 hearing today. My name is Chris Hobson, H-O-B-S-O-N. 

### 18 I'm the Chief Environmental Officer for Southern 

### 19 Company. I am also the Senior Vice President of 

### 20 Research. And in our research portfolio, Southern 

### 21 Company operates the Mercury Research Center. It's the 

### 22 only center in the United States aimed at trying to 

### 23 find technological answers to the control of mercury 

### 24 emissions from power plants. We've operated that 

### 25 facility for about five months -- I mean five years,AGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 85 1 I'm sorry. 

### 2 We're also the leading energy supplier in the 

### 3 southeastern United States and one of the largest 

### 4 generators of electricity in the nation. 

### 5 We work hard every day with all of our 

### 6 stakeholders to make sure that we provide reliable and 

### 7 affordable power and at the same time, do the most we 

### 8 can to protect the environment. 

### 9 That's why Southern Company has, in recent 

### 10 years, invested over eight billion dollars in 

### 11 environmental controls and intends to spend, to expend 

### 12 four -- four million dollars over the next three years 

### 13 to comply with existing and revised clean air rules. 

### 14The proposed utility MACT is one of the most 

### 15 burdensome, far-reaching, and expensive rules that EPA 

### 16 has ever put forward. 

### 17 If adopted, the rule could put the 

### 18 reliability and affordability of electricity supplying 

### 19 our nation at risk. It would impact plants responsible 

### 20 for nearly fifty percent of the electricity generated 

### 21 in this country at a cost that EPA estimates at over 

### 22 ten billion dollars a year. 

### 23 Furthermore, the proposed standards for new 

### 24 power plants would take coal off the table as an energy 

### 25 supply in this country.AGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 86 1 Such a profound decision should be a part of 

### 2 a national energy policy, not made by a regulatory 

### 3 agency. 

### 4While we're concerned about many aspects of 

### 5 this proposed rule, what I'd like to focus on today is 

### 6 timing. At the outset, I would note that there are 

### 7 still substantial questions about EPA's legal authority 

### 8 to promulgate such broad standards. 

### 9 Congress treated the electric utilities 

### 10 uniquely by requiring EPA to follow a utility specific 

### 11 provision in the Clean Air Act, and access the 

### 12 potential public health concerns associated with 

### 13 emissions and only regulate as appropriate and 

### 14 necessary to address those concerns. 

### 15 EPA's December 2000 regulatory determination 

### 16 only identified public health concerns associated with 

### 17 mercury emissions from coal-fired EGU's and nickel 

### 18 emissions from oil-fired units. 

### 19 Despite its previous determination, EPA is 

### 20 now expanding the proposed rule to all hazardous air 

### 21 pollutants. Justifying this erroneous rule based on PM 

### 22 benefits, which are properly addressed under the other 

### 23 provisions of the Clean Air Act is inappropriate. 

### 24Southern plans to offer more detailed written 

### 25 comments on the scope of EPA's authority during theAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 87 1 comment period. 

### 2 My first point is that the rulemaking time 

### 3 line is unreasonable. Under the consent decree 

### 4 schedule that EPA agreed to, the utility MACT rule must 

### 5 be finalized by November of this year. But that consent 

### 6 decree schedule is severely inhibiting the rulemaking 

### 7 process. 

### 8 To support the rulemaking, EPA issued an 

### 9 information request that required the utility industry 

### 10 to submit extensive information on emissions and 

### 11 required more than one hundred million dollars in stack 

### 12 testing on units around the country. 

### 13 In response to this request, EPA received an 

### 14 overwhelming amount of data at the end of last year. 

### 15 However, the rushed promulgation schedule limited this 

### 16 review to only a few months. Initial assessment of the 

### 17 proposed rule has shown that EPA needed to take more 

### 18 time to evaluate the data before issuing the proposed 

### 19 standards. 

### 20 As I pointed out in a letter to EPA earlier 

### 21 this month, we have identified numerous errors in EPA's 

### 22 technical analysis of the emission data, which are not 

### 23 limited to widespread errors involving EPA's proposed 

### 24mercury standards. 

### 25 The consent decree should not be an excuse toAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 88 1 deny the public an ample opportunity to understand the 

### 2 proposed rule and provide comments. Sixty days is 

### 3 plainly inadequate for a rule that would cost well over 

### 4 a billion dollars a year. 

### 5 When Judge Collier granted EPA's motion to 

### 6 enter the consent decree, she noted that if the science 

### 7 and the analysis require more time, EPA can obtain it 

### 8 and she added, "If EPA needs more time to get it right, 

### 9 it should seek more time." 

### 10 Given the serious stakes, why would EPA not 

### 11 take such prudent step. We urge EPA to re-propose the 

### 12 rule, provide a one hundred and twenty day comment 

### 13 period and ask the Court for a reasonable amount of 

### 14 time to finalize the rule. 

### 15 EPA should take note of the unintended 

### 16 consequences of the rushed rulemaking schedule for the 

### 17 industrial boiler MACT and not repeat the same mistakes 

### 18 here. 

### 19 My second point is that the three year MACT 

### 20 compliance time frame could put the reliability and 

### 21 affordability of the nation's electric generating 

### 22 system at risk. 

### 23 A study conducted by the Edison Electric 

### 24 Institute for the electric -- Edison Electric Institute 

### 25 by ICF concluded that for the U.S. by 2015, the utilityAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 89 1 MACT and other regulations require over eighty thousand 

### 2 megawatts of generation to install scrubbers and over 

### 3 one hundred sixty thousand megawatts of generation to 

### 4 install fabric filter bag houses. 

### 5 Almost eighty thousand megawatts of current 

### 6 coal capacity will retire and require replacement 

### 7 generation. 

### 8 As the Chief Environmental Office of Utility 

### 9 that has installed more pollution controls than any 

### 10 other, I tell you this simply cannot be done in three 

### 11 years. 

### 12 The proposed rule comes at a critical 

### 13 juncture for coal-fired power plants as EPA is 

### 14 currently developing or implementing multiple other 

### 15 environmental regulations which have independent or 

### 16 overlapping requirements. 

### 17 We do not have the luxury of making decisions 

### 18 on these rules in a vacuum. We must consider all the 

### 19 requirements when making technology investments or 

### 20 retirement decisions. 

### 21 A major challenge for complying with these 

### 22 rules is ensuring adequate reserve margins. That is, 

### 23 generating capacity that is available during times of 

### 24 high demand and during interruptions of service. 

### 25 According to Bernstein Research, the impactAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 90 1 of the Utility MACT rule on smaller plants will cause 

### 2 regional capacity margins to plummet by seven to 

### 3 fifteen percent into the single digits in some regions. 

### 4 Other studies have reached similar conclusions. The 

### 5 result will be a greater risk of power outages. 

### 6 Construction of the massive number of 

### 7 controls that I mentioned, plus the cost of replacing 

### 8 the coal plants that will retire will require utilities 

### 9 to spend as much as three hundred billion dollars by 

### 10 2015. Doing this in a compressed three year time frame 

### 11 will result in even higher cost, which will certainly 

### 12 show up in customer's power bills and will threaten 

### 13 jobs and any economic recovery. 

### 14In conclusion, we believe the, that the 

### 15 utility MACT proposal on its current schedule and in 

### 16 its current form puts the reliability and affordability 

### 17 of power in the United States at risk. 

### 18 IF EPA continues on its present path, the 

### 19 result would be to harm power consumers, which is to 

### 20 say all Americans and threaten jobs and economic 

### 21 growth. 

### 22 EPA should take the necessary time to seek 

### 23 stakeholder input and develop workable standards for 

### 24 all regulations. And let me say finally that having 

### 25 represented Southern Company for thirty-eight years onAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 91 1 environmental issues, I have never before seen a suite 

### 2 of regulations facing one industry that I think could 

### 3 have more profound impact, not only on our ability to 

### 4 provide energy, but also the economy of this country. 

### 5 I would urge EPA to work with utilities. 

### 6 Figure out a way forward. There must certainly be an 

### 7 answer to giving the environmental benefits that we all 

### 8 want, but at the same time not risking our ability to 

### 9 supply energy, the affordability of that energy or our 

### 10 economy. 

### 11 Thank you. 

### 12 MR. CLARK: Thank you both very much. Any 

### 13 questions guys? 

### 14MR. MAXWELL: Yeah. The two, the two reports 

### 15 you cite, are you going to put those in your comments? 

### 16 MR. HOBSON: I'm sorry. 

### 17 MR. CULLIGAN: The two reports you cite in 

### 18 your -- you're going to have those in your written 

### 19 comments? 

### 20 MR. HOBSON: They will not be in the written 

### 21 comments for this, but they will be in our written 

### 22 comments, yes. 

### 23 MR. CLARK: Right. That's fine. 

### 24MR. CULLIGAN: On those reports, were they 

### 25 completed before or after the rules were proposed? DoAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 92 1 they, they conclude the assumptions of what was 

### 2 actually in the rules or assumptions about what might 

### 3 go into the rules? 

### 4MR. HOBSON: I, I'm sorry -- 

### 5 MR. CULLIGAN: The Bernstein report and the 

### 6 EEI -- 

### 7 MR. HOBSON: Oh yeah, the Bernstein report 

### 8 MR. CULLIGAN: Were those done before or 

### 9 after EPA proposed the rules? 

### 10 MR. HOBSON: Those numbers were probably 

### 11 before the proposed rule. 

### 12 MR. CULLIGAN: Thank you. 

### 13 MR. CLARK: Thank you both very much. 

### 14Let me just remind people that have come in 

### 15 because I haven't done this for a while. We, we do 

### 16 have a five minute limit and because we've got so many 

### 17 speakers today that will be going on over the course of 

### 18 the day. And I'm trying to be a little bit flexible, 

### 19 but, but again the way the timing system works is you 

### 20 got -- the green light is on for four minutes. You 

### 21 have a yellow light that says you've got a minute to 

### 22 sum up and then when the red flashing comes on, if you 

### 23 could finish it up then, we'd appreciate that very 

### 24much. 

### 25 Next two speakers please, Woody Bartlett andAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 93 1 Robert Bullard. 

### 2 FEMALE: Here's the next round. 

### 3 MR. CLARK: Thank you. And again, if you 

### 4 could -- when you state your name, if you could spell 

### 5 it for the court reporter that would be helpful. 

### 6 Thank you. And Mr. Bartlett, feel free to start. 

### 7 REVEREND BARLETT: I'm the Reverend Woody 

### 8 Bartlett, B-A-R-T-L-E-T-T. Co-founder of Georgia 

### 9 Interfaith Power and Light and a continuing member of 

### 10 its Board of Directors. 

### 11 We, at Georgia Interfaith Power and Light, 

### 12 are pleased to testify about the quality of our air as 

### 13 permitted by federal regulations. 

### 14 Testimony from Georgia IP&L and other 

### 15 advocates of clean air at these hearings will 

### 16 concentrate on the amount of allowable emissions of 

### 17 mercury in the proposed regulations. We would all 

### 18 support at least a ninety percent reduction in 

### 19 allowable mercury emissions. 

### 20 However, Georgia Interfaith Power and Light 

### 21 is a faith, faith-based organization as well as one 

### 22 concerned about the quality of our environmental -- of 

### 23 our environment. So today, I'm going to speak for the 

### 24 faith side of our partner congregations. 

### 25 We represent a wide variety of faiths, manyAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 94 1 of whom recognize the sacred nature of water and 

### 2 incorporate it into their central rituals and 

### 3 traditions. For example, many Christian denominations 

### 4 have baptism as one of their main rights. In the 

### 5 Christian tradition, baptism goes way back to John the 

### 6 Baptist and to Jesus. Both were baptized in the Jordan 

### 7 River and John particularly made baptism the central 

### 8 part of his message. Most of Christendom follow this 

### 9 practice. Some baptizing its members as adults and 

### 10 others as infants. 

### 11 In my particular church, the Episcopal 

### 12 Church, we practice infant baptism. Baptism is one of 

### 13 our two principal sacraments. 

### 14In the last few decades, we have been faced 

### 15 with the dilemma of baptizing our infants in water that 

### 16 has been laced with mercury as a result of the 

### 17 emissions of our coal burning power plants. Our 

### 18 dilemma; how do we symbolize cleansing and a fresh 

### 19 start with water that we know can contain deadly 

### 20 amounts of mercury? 

### 21 Of course, it is not just mercury in the 

### 22 water that is the problem. It is the fish ingest this 

### 23 mercury and become bearers of the poison to women and 

### 24 the children they bear. Mothers, particularly nursing 

### 25 mothers, eat that mercury-infested fish and the mercuryAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 95 1 is passed directly into their infant children's brains 

### 2 where it can severely retard brain growth and impair a 

### 3 person for the rest of their lives. 

### 4Have you seen the brochure put out by the 

### 5 Georgia Department of Natural Resources warning us not 

### 6 to eat fish from certain sections of our State's waters 

### 7 because of mercury contamination? It is frightening. 

### 8 Do you think that John the Baptist ever worried about 

### 9 mercury contamination? Did Jesus ever warn his 

### 10 fishermen disciples not to eat the fish they caught 

### 11 from the Sea of Galilee? 

### 12 Water is life giving to all of us. We cannot 

### 13 do without it. Speaking as a citizen of the world, as 

### 14 well as a person of faith, please do all you can to 

### 15 limit the amount of mercury that comes out of our power 

### 16 plants and goes into the brains of our children. 

### 17 Thank you. 

### 18 MR. CLARK: Thank you, Reverend. Mr. Bullard. 

### 19 MR. BULLARD: Good morning. My name is 

### 20 Robert Bullard, B-U-L-L-A-R-D. I direct Environmental 

### 21 Justice Resource Center at Clark Atlanta University 

### 22 here in Atlanta. I'm also a member of the National 

### 23 Black Environmental Justice Network and the 

### 24 Environmental Justice Climate Change Initiative. Both 

### 25 groups are organizations that are found in -- withAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 96 1 member groups found in thirty-seven states in the U.S. 

### 2 For the last thirty years, I've worked on 

### 3 environment health and justice issues. I've written 

### 4 sixteen books on the issue. 

### 5 I'm here to support and to thank EPA for 

### 6 holding this, this hearing. This hearing is long 

### 7 overdue. Time for the standards long overdue. Two 

### 8 decades is definitely reasonable. 

### 9 Cleaning up pollution from power -- coal 

### 10 fired power plants is good for Georgia, good for this 

### 11 region; the south, and it's good for this country. It 

### 12 makes good economic sense, environmental sense, and 

### 13 health sense. 

### 14If you look at the issue of the health 

### 15 impacts of coal-fired power plants and the emissions. 

### 16 We've talked about mercury and the other pollutants. 

### 17 These impacts do not fall evenly on all populations. 

### 18 Because of the siting issue of where power plants are 

### 19 located, coal-fired power plants are disproportionately 

### 20 located in or near environmental justice communities; 

### 21 low income and minority communities. 

### 22 If you look at the fact that all of us use 

### 23 electricity, but all of us do not have to bear the 

### 24 burden of where these facilities are located. 

### 25 Over half of the coal-fired power plants inAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 97 1 this country, the dirtiest ones, are located in or near 

### 2 environmental justice communities. As a matter-of

### 3 fact, sixty-eight percent of all African Americans in 

### 4 this country live within thirty miles of a power plant 

### 5 compared to fifty-six percent of whites. 

### 6 If you look at the region that has the 

### 7 largest disproportionate share of dirty power plants, 

### 8 over half of the one hundred dirtiest plants are 

### 9 located in the south, region four. There's something 

### 10 about this region that somehow makes us dirty. Our 

### 11 dirty little secret. 

### 12 If we look at this whole question of 

### 13 remedies, I think what EPA has proposed is reasonable 

### 14 and it goes a long way in addressing the issue of 

### 15 disproportion impact of pollution on vulnerable 

### 16 populations and we've had the executive order one 

### 17 eight -- one, two, eight, nine, eight that was 

### 18 passed -- that was signed by President Clinton in 1994 

### 19 and I think this particular rule standard, improvement 

### 20 will go a long ways in reducing the disproportionate 

### 21 impact of environmental pollution on low income and 

### 22 minority populations. 

### 23 And as I said before, generally low income 

### 24 and minority populations live with more pollution and 

### 25 so when we have stronger standards and we clean upAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 98 1 dirty power plants, the added benefits will accrue 

### 2 greatest to those populations that are 

### 3 disproportionately impacted. 

### 4If we look at this whole question of the 

### 5 burden and the benefits, it is time for us to basically 

### 6 start to approve more benefits and so at the, the 

### 7 outset of, of these standards -- the onset of these 

### 8 standards, cutting emissions, getting the, the, the 

### 9 pollution down, these are things that I think will fall 

### 10 under this whole issue of fairness, equity, justice, 

### 11 and health and therefore I strongly support, along with 

### 12 the organizations that I represent, Environmental 

### 13 Justice Climate Change Initiative and the National 

### 14 Black Environmental Justice Network, support EPA's 

### 15 proposed standard for mercury and other pollutants from 

### 16 coal-fired power plants. 

### 17 Thank you. 

### 18 MR. CLARK: Thank you both very much. Any 

### 19 questions, folks? Okay. Thank you. 

### 20 Our next speakers please, Yolanda Whyte and 

### 21 Mike Kennedy. Ms. Whyte, feel free to start whenever 

### 22 you like. 

### 23 DR. WHYTE: Yes, hello. My name is Dr. Yolanda 

### 24 White, W-H-Y-T-E. I want to thank you Environmental 

### 25 Protection Agency for this opportunity to speak withAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 99 1 you today. I support your hard work and I'm also an 

### 2 Atlanta-based pediatrician, environmental advocate and 

### 3 I speak on behalf of myself and all those who suffer 

### 4 from or care for someone with a disability. 

### 5 I support the strictest regulation standards 

### 6 for mercury emissions with the most expedient 

### 7 enforcement that is free of loopholes. This proactive 

### 8 approach focused on prevention supports the most 

### 9 effective and fiscally conservative way to reform 

### 10 healthcare and reduce health disparities. 

### 11 In medieval times, mercury was used by 

### 12 Paracelsus and other European healers to treat lice, 

### 13 worms, syphilis, and other ailments. It is no 

### 14 longer -- it no longer has a therapeutic role or health 

### 15 benefit. Mercury, instead, has known toxicities. 

### 16 For every action, there's an equal and 

### 17 opposite reaction. The action of emitting mercury into 

### 18 the air eventually leads to adverse health effects. 

### 19 For this reason, methyl mercury is my focus today 

### 20 because we're more likely to be exposed to this more 

### 21 toxic form. 

### 22 The National Academy of Sciences acknowledges 

### 23 mercury as being toxic to the nervous system, the 

### 24 immune system, reproductive system, the kidney, and 

### 25 cardiovascular systems. It's also a teratogen, causingAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 100 1 birth defects and it's also an endocrine disrupter 

### 2 causing hormonal problems. 

### 3 In addition you, the EPA, as well as the 

### 4 International Agency on Research of Cancer, classified 

### 5 mercury as a Class C possible carcinogen. 

### 6 Mercury also increases oxidant stress by 

### 7 binding to sulfur groups including that of our bodies 

### 8 natural antioxidant glutathione system depleting it of 

### 9 its antioxidant protection. And this latest fact is 

### 10 supported by the article in pharmacological reviews, 

### 11 molecular interactions with mercury in the kidney. 

### 12 Adverse health effects caused by mercury are 

### 13 more common, more severe, and more permanent in 

### 14 children who are disproportionately affected from the 

### 15 time of conception. Mercury crosses the placenta and 

### 16 is found in umbilical cord blood. As a teratogen 

### 17 mentioned earlier, it causes birth defects including 

### 18 cerebral palsy and miscarriages. 

### 19 Toxins of any kind exert their most 

### 20 devastating damage during the first trimester where 

### 21 organs are just developing and many pregnant women may 

### 22 not be aware of their pregnancy. 

### 23 Through the emergent field of gene

### 24 environment interactions, we're learning that even 

### 25 trace exposures, undetectable by laboratory testing,AGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 101 1 can affect the integrity of your genes and cause 

### 2 mutations and other genetic alterations. 

### 3 Mercury crosses the blood brain barrier, 

### 4 which is a protective sheath that surrounds the brain 

### 5 and spinal cord, resulting in neurotoxicity and 

### 6 associated neurological, physical, behavioral, speech, 

### 7 and visual signs and symptoms that follow. 

### 8 As mercury is metabolized by the kidneys, it 

### 9 bio-accumulates there and concentrates causing local 

### 10 damage and potential to cause kidney failure. 

### 11 As mentioned earlier, other organs are also 

### 12 effected. 

### 13 Another reason that explains the disparities 

### 14 seen in children is because they receive a higher dose 

### 15 of mercury compared to an adult with the same exposure 

### 16 when adjustments are made on a per body weight basis. 

### 17 I have no children yet, but I do have a dream 

### 18 that one day I will have a healthy child, one that will 

### 19 one day say, "Momma, I love you. Thank you. God bless 

### 20 you." A child that will have all their functions and 

### 21 faculties and be able to feed themselves and use the 

### 22 toilet properly. A daughter or son that will run, 

### 23 play, grow, learn, and one day become president, but 

### 24 that dream may never be realized for some parents who 

### 25 have children affected by toxic emissions of mercuryAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 102 1 and other hazardous air pollutants that result in 

### 2 disease and disability including impairments in 

### 3 hearing, vision, intelligence, memory, attention span, 

### 4 visual spatial orientation, as well as physical, 

### 5 neurological and mental development. 

### 6 Setting limits on emissions of mercury and 

### 7 other hazardous air pollutants keep children in school 

### 8 where they're expected to be attentive, focused, and 

### 9 well behaved so they can learn the tools to become 

### 10 productive citizens and it also reduces the need for 

### 11 and expense of special needs services like early 

### 12 intervention programs, which are currently facing 

### 13 severe budget cuts. 

### 14 States like Georgia and recreational anglers 

### 15 are also at higher risk. According to the U.S. 

### 16 Geological Survey, one in four fish contain mercury 

### 17 levels that exceeded recommended EPA criteria. Some of 

### 18 the highest mercury in fish were found in tea-colored 

### 19 or black-water streams in North and South Carolina, 

### 20 Georgia, Florida, and Louisiana. 

### 21 Recreational anglers also have higher hair 

### 22 mercury levels as indicated in the February 2011 issue 

### 23 of Environmental Health Perspectives article entitled 

### 24 Fish Consumption and Mercury Exposure among Louisiana 

### 25 Recreational Anglers.AGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 103 1 There are also environmental justice concerns 

### 2 where African Americans are disproportionately affected 

### 3 by mercury emissions due to the greater prevalence of 

### 4 kidney disease and more likely to reside in closer 

### 5 proximity to industries that emit mercury and other air 

### 6 pollutants. 

### 7 Laboratory testing of mercury is not routine. 

### 8 Screening questionnaires are not employed. Exposure 

### 9 levels are not estimated. Nor are mercury levels 

### 10 disclosed on food label packaging and, therefore, 

### 11 citizens are not informed. They are unknowingly 

### 12 consuming this toxin and are not aware of the need to 

### 13 protect themselves. The only way to avoid mercury in 

### 14 air, water, fish, is through prevention by regulating 

### 15 emissions. 

### 16 Setting limits on emissions of mercury and 

### 17 other hazardous air pollutants saves lives and reduces 

### 18 disease and disability. 

### 19 This will require the installation of 

### 20 upgraded pollution controls which will not only prevent 

### 21 mercury pollution, but also the other dangerous 

### 22 pollutants. Together, these pollution reductions may 

### 23 save between forty-two billion dollars and one hundred 

### 24 and thirty billion dollars in 2016 by preventing twelve 

### 25 thousand, two hundred hospital and emergency roomAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 104 1 visits, eleven thousand non-fatal heart attacks, 

### 2 forty-five hundred cases of chronic bronchitis, and up 

### 3 to seventeen thousand premature deaths and provide 

### 4 other health benefits. 

### 5 MR. CLARK: Ms. Whyte, are you getting pretty 

### 6 close to concluding? 

### 7 DR. WHYTE: I'm almost done. 

### 8 MR. CLARK: We're pretty much over time. 

### 9 DR. WHITE: It reduces the expense of 

### 10 pharmacal -- pharmaceutical rehabilitative and 

### 11 accommodative therapies as well as side affects 

### 12 associated with some of the pharmaceuticals. 

### 13 And I would also -- in conclusion, I just 

### 14 want to leave you with the image of a cute little baby 

### 15 because if you can imagine a baby right here, right 

### 16 now, you'll see something so precious, tender, and 

### 17 fragile that you just want to cherish it, protect it, 

### 18 and implement all safeguards to preserve the quality of 

### 19 its survival. 

### 20 Thank you. 

### 21 MR. CLARK: Thank you very much. Mr. Kennedy. 

### 22 MR. KENNEDY: Good morning. Thanks for 

### 23 having this hearing. I know it's a very long day for 

### 24 you folks. 

### 25 My name is Mike Kennedy, M-I-K-E,AGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 105 1 K-E-N-N-E-D-Y. I'm an Environmental Specialist and Air 

### 2 Pollution Meteorologist -- excuse me -- working for 

### 3 Progress Energy which is a regional energy company 

### 4 located in the southeast. We have more than twenty-two 

### 5 thousand megawatts of electric generation capacity and 

### 6 we operate regulated utilities in North Carolina, South 

### 7 Carolina, and Florida. It serves more than, more than 

### 8 three point one million retail customers. 

### 9 Just to make it clear, I just want to 

### 10 emphasize that we've been very active over the past ten 

### 11 years in reducing our emissions. Company has spent 

### 12 three billion dollars during the past ten years on 

### 13 emissions reductions and will spend an additional 

### 14 hundreds of millions to perhaps billions on additional 

### 15 controls and re-powering of our coal-fired units. 

### 16 We have over the past ten years reduced our 

### 17 overall mercury emissions by sixty percent, SO2 or 

### 18 sulfur dioxide by approximately seventy percent and 

### 19 since the same technology that reduces SO2 also reduces 

### 20 acid gasses, there's a proportionate amount of 

### 21 reductions in acid gas emissions and our 

### 22 NOx emissions have also been reduced by 

### 23 about seventy percent with additional reductions to 

### 24 come. 

### 25 I wanted to echo some earlier commentsAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 106 1 regarding the period provided for comment and it's not 

### 2 just because the MACT and associated documents that 

### 3 were -- have been posted are a lot to review, but 

### 4 there's the -- it's really two rulemakings combined 

### 5 into one because there are the proposed new source 

### 6 performance standard changes, which is another large 

### 7 component of regulation that affects the electric 

### 8 utilities. It also must be reviewed and commented on 

### 9 in the same comment period. 

### 10 EPA posted an additional several thousand 

### 11 pages of data and other documentation to the web page 

### 12 earlier this month, so again, that's just a lot to go 

### 13 through, although there was some delay in posting -- 

### 14 in, I'm sorry, in getting the proposal into the Federal 

### 15 Register, the additional materials posted at the 

### 16 beginning of the month, is just a lot to go through in 

### 17 sixty days. 

### 18 You know, we discussed the -- on both sides 

### 19 of the table, discussed the error that occurred in 

### 20 EPA's calculation of the MACT floor for mercury. To 

### 21 me, this illustrates that an ambitious schedule for 

### 22 completion of rule making can, and often does, result 

### 23 in being counter-productive as it was for the 

### 24 industrial boiler MACT which is being reconsidered and 

### 25 has been stayed until the reconsideration is complete.AGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 107 1 We think the EPA should take whatever time is 

### 2 necessary to get this rule making right or correct the 

### 3 first time. 

### 4So that we echo the request of other 

### 5 stakeholders, such as the National Association of 

### 6 Regulatory Utility Commissioners, individual State 

### 7 Utility Commissions, State Air Regulatory Agencies, and 

### 8 members of Congress to provide an additional sixty days 

### 9 for review of, of, of the materials that have been 

### 10 provided for -- in association with the rule making 

### 11 package. 

### 12 Get into a little bit of some of the 

### 13 technical aspects of the rule now. And I want to 

### 14 discuss some perspective on the electric sector's 

### 15 mercury emissions as a component of overall emissions. 

### 16 Emissions of mercury from coal-fired power 

### 17 plants have decreased by nearly fifty percent over the 

### 18 past ten years largely due to the types of controls I, 

### 19 I discussed for our company earlier, to the current 

### 20 level of approximately twenty-nine or thirty tons. 

### 21 Now, this is not to overlook utility mercury 

### 22 emissions, but to put some perspective on the overall 

### 23 global circulation, atmospheric circulation of mercury. 

### 24 These, these emissions of twenty-nine or thirty tons 

### 25 represent about one half of one percent of totalAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 108 1 natural mercury emissions that are -- that contribute 

### 2 again to the global circulation that results in 

### 3 atmospheric deposition of mercury and about one percent 

### 4 of worldwide human cause emissions. And again, it's a 

### 5 global circulation, not just here in this country. 

### 6 So this is airborne mercury that is deposited 

### 7 to the, to the environment and the, the, the difference 

### 8 in the, in the amount of, of overall emissions will be 

### 9 actually rather small if we reduce these twenty-nine or 

### 10 thirty tons down to say ten tons or, or five tons, 

### 11 whatever that ninety-one percent represents. 

### 12 So that it's -- the -- in fact, the natural 

### 13 amount of mercury emissions is approximately two thirds 

### 14 of the total. 

### 15 In addition, our sector's emissions will 

### 16 continue to fall even without implementation of the EGU 

### 17 MACT, just so that folks keep in mind that 

### 18 we have other regulatory actions out there; the Clean 

### 19 Air Interstate Rule, the Proposed Transport Rule, and 

### 20 changes to the ambient air quality standards. 

### 21 And I'll be quick here. A couple of items on 

### 22 some of the technical aspects of the rule. We support 

### 23 the proposed use of sulfur dioxide as a surrogate for 

### 24 acid gas emissions. We already monitor SO2 emissions 

### 25 continuously under the acid rain program and the sameAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 109 1 control technology that reduces SO2 reduces acid 

### 2 gasses. 

### 3 The proposed mercury limit of one pound per 

### 4 trillion, it will be difficult to meet on a continuous 

### 5 ongoing basis. We reviewed mercury CEM data from two 

### 6 of our well-controlled coal-fired units, which 

### 7 incidentally were in the top twelve percent and the 

### 8 thirty day rolling averages from those monitors often 

### 9 range above the proposed standard. This is because the 

### 10 standard is based on a brief snapshot stack test and 

### 11 that doesn't take into account on a continuous basis, 

### 12 the operational variations that occur when you're 

### 13 monitoring CEM's. 

### 14And then finally, the particulate matter 

### 15 standard is also of concern because it employs a method 

### 16 of using an additional stack test on an individual unit 

### 17 to set the filterable PM limit and again we have PM 

### 18 CEMS data on several of our units that show 

### 19 that establishing a unit-specific MACT standard in 

### 20 that, in that way will make it difficult to meet on a 

### 21 continuous basis using a snapshot, so instead we think 

### 22 that EPA should establish a single category wide 

### 23 filterable PM standard. 

### 24Okay. I'm finished. 

### 25 MR. CLARK: All right. Thank you. Thank youAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 110 1 both. Again, I appreciate time wise, the point I'm 

### 2 trying to make is just -- we have a lot of people. And 

### 3 it's not for us, it's for them so that they have an 

### 4 opportunity to speak. But thank you. Any questions 

### 5 for these folks? Do you have anything? No? Okay. 

### 6 Thank you both so much. 

### 7 Brian Burrows and Allison Amyx please. Okay. 

### 8 Mr. Burrows. 

### 9 MR. BURROWS: Hello. My name is Byron 

### 10 Burrows, last name is B-U-R-R-O-W-S. I'm Manager of 

### 11 Air Programs at Tampa Electric Company in Tampa, 

### 12 Florida. The company's a regulated utility with 

### 13 approximately forty-four hundred megawatts of 

### 14 generating capacity. We have a two thousand square 

### 15 mile service territory in west central Florida and more 

### 16 than six hundred and seventy-two thousand residential, 

### 17 commercial, and industrial customers that depend on, on 

### 18 us for reliable power. 

### 19 Tampa Electric Company is a leader installing 

### 20 reasonable emission controls, having completed in, in 

### 21 2010 the final phase of a ten year, one point two 

### 22 billion dollar emission reduction initiative. 

### 23 The result is a ninety percent reduction in 

### 24 SO2, NOx, and mercury pollution, as well as 

### 25 substantial reductions in other emissions from 1998AGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 111 1 levels. 

### 2 We believe the ten-year period that it took 

### 3 to implement and achieve these reductions was critical 

### 4 to minimizing the economic impact to our customers, as 

### 5 well as allowing for proper control optimization and 

### 6 during the deliberate, but measured implementation 

### 7 schedule. 

### 8 EPA has proposed aggressive new standards 

### 9 that will likely require further optimization and/or 

### 10 operational adjustments at Tampa Electric and we're 

### 11 concerned about the unreasonable time frame allotted to 

### 12 evaluate EPA's proposed rule and we, we want to provide 

### 13 thoughtful and practical feedback. 

### 14Therefore, we request EPA extend the comment 

### 15 period at least sixty days to allow for a productive 

### 16 rule making process. 

### 17 I'll give you some specific comments that we 

### 18 want to emphasize here to augment our forthcoming 

### 19 written comments. 

### 20 With regard to fuel diversity and electric 

### 21 reliability, although we applaud EPA's objective 

### 22 providing compliance flexibility, the rules proposed 

### 23 would limit our ability to purchase coal that properly 

### 24 balances, impacts our customers' bills, as well as 

### 25 operational optimization opportunities andAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 112 1 environmental impacts. 

### 2 We understand EPA's conducted modeling and 

### 3 concluded that modest impacts to price and availability 

### 4 are expected on average, however Tampa Electric is 

### 5 concerned that our service territory could experience 

### 6 substantial cost impacts, which are passed through to 

### 7 our customers with questionable environmental benefits. 

### 8 More specifically, compliance with the acid 

### 9 gas limits may preclude the use of coal from certain 

### 10 regions due to its chloride content. Therefore 

### 11 additional sub-categorization may be appropriate, but 

### 12 to provide meaningful comments and to help guide EPA 

### 13 and determine the best approach to achieving the clean 

### 14 air act goals, we need more time to evaluate the impact 

### 15 this could have on, not only our industry, but the, but 

### 16 the coal market. 

### 17 Fuel diversity is critical for electricity 

### 18 reliability in Florida, particularly during emergency 

### 19 situations, particularly during extreme weather events, 

### 20 like the recent period of historic cold snaps and, and 

### 21 hurricanes when adequate supply of natural gas may not 

### 22 be available for sustained periods of time. 

### 23 Proposed rule may have an unintended, 

### 24 unanticipated impact on electrical reliability. 

### 25 The proposed emission standards will beAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 113 1 difficult to meet on a continuous basis, despite the 

### 2 company's one point two billion dollar project to 

### 3 install and upgrade environmental controls. As stated 

### 4 before, the standard is based on a snapshot from the 

### 5 most stringent data and doesn't accurately represent 

### 6 the continuous operation on a daily basis. In essence, 

### 7 EPA's proposed standards are not commensurate with the 

### 8 proposed compliance methods, so EPA should further 

### 9 evaluate the errors in the limit calculations and 

### 10 propose ones that can be reasonably applied on a 

### 11 continuous basis. 

### 12 Another example is the rule requires 

### 13 particulate matter to be performance tested for 

### 14 filterable and condensable and it must meet a point 

### 15 zero three pound per million BTU standard and a well

### 16 controlled power plant using a particulate emission 

### 17 monitoring system could achieve that standard on a 

### 18 filterable basis, but the proposed rule requires that 

### 19 the filterable fraction be established as an operation 

### 20 limit and, and which is unnecessarily restrictive. 

### 21 So we suggest the EPA establish a category

### 22 wide filterable PM emission limit as a surrogate 

### 23 indicator and, and, in lieu of the condensable plus 

### 24 filterable. 

### 25 In addition, the work practice standards areAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 114 1 overly broad and will significantly restrict operation 

### 2 of the wet scrubbers and precipitators making it 

### 3 difficult to achieve the proposed limits. We're 

### 4 evaluating alternatives to propose to EPA that, that 

### 5 would, we believe, may more reasonably allow us to 

### 6 demonstrate compliance in a manner that, that's 

### 7 required, but we need more time to provide productive 

### 8 comments. 

### 9 So Tampa Electric encourages EPA to focus on 

### 10 properly balancing environmental, economic and energy 

### 11 policy considerations. It's important for EPA to 

### 12 refocus the basis of the rule in light of more current 

### 13 scientific findings and we believe that if you do so, 

### 14 you'll be able to exercise discretion allotted by the 

### 15 CAA to achieve those goals while providing the 

### 16 flexibility. 

### 17 Thank you. 

### 18 MR. CLARK: Thank you. Ms. Amyx, is that 

### 19 close? 

### 20 MS. AMYX: Amyx. 

### 21 MR. CLARK: Amyx. 

### 22 MS. AMYX: Yeah. Hi. My name is Allison 

### 23 Amyx and I'm the Communications and Outreach Director 

### 24 of Georgia Interfaith Power and Light. 

### 25 MR. CLARK: And you'll spell Amyx for theAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 115 1 court reporter. 

### 2 MS. AMYX: A-M-Y-X. 

### 3 MR. CLARK: Great. Thanks. 

### 4 MS. AMYX: We are an organization that's 

### 5 dedicated to helping communities of faith care for 

### 6 God's creation. And we have almost five-hundred, member

### 7 Congregations, across the state. 

### 8 I'm here to support the proposed Mercury and 

### 9 Air Toxics Standards for a very simple reason. I know 

### 10 we can't really see it from in here, but we live in a 

### 11 beautiful world. It's an intricate and sustainable 

### 12 ecosystem created by God and we get to be the stewards 

### 13 of this world. We're called to be the caretakers. For 

### 14 better or worse, it's our responsibility to leave the 

### 15 earth cleaner than we found it. We're the ones who 

### 16 have to ensure that future generations can enjoy 

### 17 creation as much as we do. 

### 18 The problem with pollution is that it 

### 19 disturbs the balance of this beautiful world. If 

### 20 they're not regulated, toxins like mercury, they get 

### 21 into our air and into our water and they really start 

### 22 messing things up. The ramifications are clear and 

### 23 we've heard about them all morning. These pollutants 

### 24 are making us sick. 

### 25 They're especially dangerous for vulnerableAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 116 1 populations, for children, for senior citizens, for 

### 2 unborn babies. These are the people who are most 

### 3 effected by exposure to toxins like mercury. 

### 4We've also heard a lot this morning about how 

### 5 low income communities are also disproportionately 

### 6 effected. 

### 7 That's why for me, and for the members of 

### 8 many of our congregations, this is also a justice 

### 9 issue. 

### 10 Everyone deserves clean air. Everyone 

### 11 deserves a chance to live a healthy life. If 

### 12 finalized, these standards will save lives. They will 

### 13 prevent disease and avoid hospitalizations and they 

### 14 will protect public health. 

### 15 Our congregations -- we have people of all 

### 16 faiths -- are doing all they can to reduce their energy 

### 17 consumption. They're getting energy audits and they're 

### 18 reducing their energy use by up to twenty percent by 

### 19 implementing a number of energy conservation measures. 

### 20 They're -- we -- but we cannot do it alone. 

### 21 We need power plants and industry to cut 

### 22 their emissions if we want to make a significant 

### 23 impact. 

### 24So that's why I'm here, as a person of faith, 

### 25 in full support of the proposed Mercury and Air ToxicsAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 117 1 Standards for power plants which would reduce the 

### 2 amount of mercury and other pollutants in our life 

### 3 sustaining and beautiful ecosystem. 

### 4Thank you for your consideration. 

### 5 MR. CLARK: Thank you both very much. Did 

### 6 you guys have any questions? No? Okay. Thank you. 

### 7 Next please, Bob Donaghue and Clark Efaw. 

### 8 Okay. 

### 9 MR. DONAGHUE: Good morning. 

### 10 MR. CLARK: Yeah. Thank you, Mr. Donaghue. 

### 11 MR. DONAGHUE: I'm Bob Donaghue, 

### 12 D-O-N-A-G-H-U-E. I am the retired Director of the 

### 13 Sustainability Division for the Department of Natural 

### 14 Resources and currently the Program Director for 

### 15 Georgia Interfaith Power and Light's Power Wise Energy 

### 16 Conservation Program working with churches across the 

### 17 state and other congregations to reduce energy use. 

### 18 The renowned conservationist and writer, Aldo 

### 19 Leopold once wrote, "A thing is right when it tends to 

### 20 preserve the integrity, stability, and beauty of the 

### 21 biotic community and is wrong when it tends otherwise." 

### 22 The proposed Mercury and Air Toxics Standards 

### 23 would reduce emissions of heavy metals including 

### 24mercury, arsenic, chromium and others, acid gasses and 

### 25 these are toxics that are known or suspectedAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 118 1 carcinogens and are also responsible for a wide range 

### 2 of health ailments. 

### 3 Power plants are responsible for fifty 

### 4 percent of mercury emissions, over fifty percent of 

### 5 acid gas emissions and twenty-five percent of toxic 

### 6 medical, metal emissions throughout the United States. 

### 7 Power plants are the largest source of 

### 8 mercury emissions to the air and its presence is found 

### 9 virtually everywhere as a result of emissions over many 

### 10 years. It is found in waterways throughout the United 

### 11 States and round the world and as an environmental 

### 12 investigator in south Florida in the 1980's, early 

### 13 1980's, we discovered elevated mercury levels in the 

### 14 biggest cypress swamp -- throughout the Big Cypress 

### 15 Swamp in south Florida. 

### 16 Many fish species then and now have elevated 

### 17 mercury levels from bioaccumulation in local rivers, 

### 18 lakes, and streams and as a result have restrictions on 

### 19 a number -- on the number that can be eaten. 

### 20 Additionally, we are all aware of the 

### 21 restrictions on eating canned tuna, particularly for 

### 22 pregnant women due to the potential damage to the 

### 23 fetus' developing nervous system. 

### 24The proposed rule would reduce these toxic 

### 25 chemicals and many, many pediatricians and doctors haveAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 119 1 spoken today about the health benefits of these rules 

### 2 and I won't go into those. 

### 3 Basically therefore, reducing the level of 

### 4 toxic chemicals emitted into the air we breathe and the 

### 5 ecosystems in which all life and we exist is right. 

### 6 Not reducing our exposure to these chemicals is wrong, 

### 7 particularly when the cost -- when cost effective 

### 8 measures such as energy efficiency and technologies are 

### 9 readily available. 

### 10 Thank you for allowing me to offer my 

### 11 thoughts on the proposed standards for power plants, 

### 12 which I support. 

### 13 Thank you. 

### 14MR. CLARK: Thank you much, Mr. Donaghue. 

### 15 Mr. Efaw. 

### 16 MR. EFAW: Yes, that's correct. My name is 

### 17 Clark Efaw, E-F-A-W. I am here as a private citizen 

### 18 and also as an associate from my church of Georgia 

### 19 Interfaith Power and Light, a faith based organization 

### 20 that promotes the responsible care of all of God's 

### 21 creation. 

### 22 I have come to request that the EPA follow 

### 23 through on strictly enforcing the proposed rule to 

### 24 reduce toxic pollutants from fossil fuel burning power 

### 25 plants.AGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 120 1 As a consumer of electric power in Georgia, I 

### 2 understand that strict enforcement of these enhanced 

### 3 rules will likely raise my rates and the price of 

### 4 things I buy that are energy intensive in their 

### 5 production. 

### 6 As a citizen, I also understand that 

### 7 pollution is already a part of the cost of energy 

### 8 production. It is just not accounted for in the price 

### 9 we pay directly for electricity. It is being 

### 10 subsidized by the general public and in particular by 

### 11 the victims who suffer from environmental poisoning. 

### 12 Those least able to afford it and least in a position 

### 13 to control it. 

### 14It means I have to restrict the amount of 

### 15 fish I eat. It means that some children will be slower 

### 16 learners. It means an added incalculable burden to the 

### 17 healthcare system at both private and public expense. 

### 18 It means we have a less productive economy. 

### 19 It's much cheaper to contain the damage at 

### 20 the source. Reduction of pollutants at the source puts 

### 21 the cost where it belongs. It provides an incentive 

### 22 for cleaning up the mess to those in the best position 

### 23 to do something about it. 

### 24It also reflects American's social values of 

### 25 taking responsibility for one's own actions and notAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 121 1 putting your cost of business on the backs of the rest 

### 2 of society. It allows us to more accurately account 

### 3 for the real cost of our environmental responsibility 

### 4 and it shows the love and respect we each have for our 

### 5 neighbor by erring on the side of the safety of others 

### 6 and protecting the interest of those who share our 

### 7 environment. 

### 8 And finally, if regulation makes it more 

### 9 expensive to produce dirty power, it gives cleaner 

### 10 alternatives a competitive advantage. 

### 11 In a state like Georgia, which is naturally 

### 12 rich in sunshine, agriculture and technology, but 

### 13 poorer in coal and petroleum, it makes no sense to foul 

### 14 our own water and air in order to keep fossil-fuel 

### 15 based energy production cheap. We need to give as much 

### 16 advantage as possible to clean energy produced by our 

### 17 own natural resources. We need those sustainable jobs 

### 18 here for the future. 

### 19 Thank you. 

### 20 MR. CLARK: Thank you both very much. Any 

### 21 questions folks? Thank you. 

### 22 Next Dr. James Rust and Thomas Pearce please. 

### 23 And just a reminder folks, we're -- as the Chair, I'm 

### 24 just trying to remind folks, we have a timing system 

### 25 that you'll have a green light for four minutes and aAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 122 1 yellow light that will just ask you to sum up and a red 

### 2 light. Thank you. Dr. Rust. 

### 3 DR. RUST: My name is James Rust, R-U-S-T. 

### 4 I'm a retired Engineering Professor from a local 

### 5 school. 

### 6 I was born in 1936 and lived in times that 

### 7 most of you have never experienced. The pollution was 

### 8 unbelievable by way of soot, mercury, and lead. Our 

### 9 homes were heated with coal. All our "choo choo" trains 

### 10 were coal-fired. The power plants did not have 

### 11 electrostatic precipitators. When you have stove 

### 12 [indecipherable], the next day the stove was black. It 

### 13 was ugly. My parents didn't have a dryer, so my mother 

### 14 hung laundry out to dry the clothes. If the wind 

### 15 changed direction from a power plant, all our sheets, 

### 16 everything white, turned gray and we had to do the 

### 17 laundry over again. We finally just dried everything 

### 18 in the basement, out of disgust. 

### 19 We played with mercury as little kids. They 

### 20 made pennies, turned them into silver because mercury 

### 21 was available through thermometers and little gadgets 

### 22 in the home. Lead was around for lead poisoning. We 

### 23 used it in gasoline. It was in paint, all the paint in 

### 24 our house. And we used gasoline as a household 

### 25 cleaner.AGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 123 1 So I graduated in 1954 from high school. I 

### 2 was quite good in mathematics, reading, and writing and 

### 3 all my other two hundred and seventy classmates also 

### 4 were quite good as a graduate and could go out and 

### 5 successfully take jobs without going to college. I did 

### 6 go to college. 

### 7 The times have changed. The soot problem has 

### 8 pretty well been eliminated because when you don't use 

### 9 coal in our houses, the trains are diesel electric and 

### 10 all power plants have electrostatic precipitators on 

### 11 them, so you don't see this dirty snow due to burning 

### 12 coal. 

### 13 Lead has been eliminated from paint, about 

### 14 1970 or so and the same thing from gasoline. I was 

### 15 told pollution we have from lead is pretty well 

### 16 disappeared. Mercury would be the only thing, I guess, 

### 17 we might say is still left as a pollutant. 

### 18 But mercury is in gasoline too as a 

### 19 pollutant, with people I don't think are paying much 

### 20 attention to in these proceedings here. All petroleum 

### 21 has the same level of mercury in it as coal does, so 

### 22 when you want to eliminate the mercury from burning 

### 23 coal by using abatement techniques, the next thing 

### 24 would be putting scrubbers on the exhaust pipes from 

### 25 your cars.AGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 124 1 Now I look at today's children and those that 

### 2 are going to college, their abilities to read and write 

### 3 and simple mathematics is somewhat impaired compared to 

### 4my generation and I'm trying to think -- they 

### 5 eliminated pollutants for this group, why had it 

### 6 possibly could eliminate pollutants cause enhanced -- 

### 7 less enhanced brain activity? And this, I realize this 

### 8 is convoluted thinking or so, but this is the type of 

### 9 thinking the EPA is proposing to you. 

### 10 The mercury being discharged from our power 

### 11 plants is negligible. It's maybe twenty-five tons per 

### 12 year in the United States, but the worldwide output of 

### 13 mercury is about nine thousand tons. If we eliminate 

### 14 all the mercury from the discharging power plants, you 

### 15 will never detect it. 

### 16 Mercury is a natural pollutant in the world. 

### 17 These volcanoes that blow, have huge amounts. It's in 

### 18 the ground. It comes through the trees and through the 

### 19 leaves. When you burn trees, you're putting mercury 

### 20 out. 

### 21 So we have to have common sense. All -- it's 

### 22 a huge expense to eliminate the mercury. No gain, the 

### 23 poor are going to pay when their electric bills go up. 

### 24Thanks. 

### 25 MR. CLARK: Thank you. Mr. Pearce.AGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 125 1 MR. PEARCE: Well, I had a prepared speech, 

### 2 but my name's Tom Pearce. I'm with the Sierra Club. 

### 3 I'm an Organizer in the State of Kentucky and I work 

### 4 with communities in western Kentucky, in Louisville to 

### 5 try to combat a lot of the things I've heard in the 

### 6 last five minutes. 

### 7 I guess I would like to start off by saying 

### 8 thank you for allowing us to come and speak before you, 

### 9 as you allowed us to come and speak before you in 

### 10 Louisville last year, the EPA hearing on coal ash. 

### 11 I'd like to start off by saying that it was a 

### 12 little disheartening this morning to find out that at 

### 13 the federal building here in Atlanta, when residents 

### 14 and citizens decide to hold a sign in a public plaza, 

### 15 for some reason that's a threat to Homeland Security 

### 16 and officers came out and forced people not hold signs 

### 17 in a public plaza. I'd really like to see the statute 

### 18 that says that you don't have the right to assemble in 

### 19 the State of Georgia. 

### 20 I know that Georgia's had some issues with 

### 21 the right to assemble, going back all the way to the 

### 22 Civil War. I'm also a former resident of Georgia, for 

### 23 ten years. But I just wanted to mention also that 

### 24 having a hearing in a place where parking can run as 

### 25 much as twenty dollars for the day can limit the amountAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 126 1 of accessibility to working class residents that might 

### 2 have wanted to come down and talk to you all. I'm 

### 3 lucky that I have been able to come and talk to you. 

### 4I'd like to start off by pointing you to your 

### 5 own facts. 2016 these proposed rules would avoid sixty

### 6 eight hundred to seventeen thousand presumed deaths, 

### 7 forty-five hundred cases of chronic bronchitis, twelve 

### 8 thousand, two hundred hospital and emergency room 

### 9 visits. I'm pretty sure you're acquainted with your 

### 10 own facts. 

### 11 You know, if, if -- when the tobacco 

### 12 industry, we decided that tobacco caused cancer, we 

### 13 just went ahead and did what it would take to reign in 

### 14 the tobacco industry and now tobacco's left Kentucky. 

### 15 Those are also a lot of jobs. But we decided that we 

### 16 would choose health -- you know, we try to implement 

### 17 policies that would protect the public good and I don't 

### 18 mean to be overly dramatic, but if a murderer goes out 

### 19 and kills a bunch of people, we throw them in jail. 

### 20 When I sit and listen to -- and I'm really glad that 

### 21 Tampa Electric Company proceeded me, when I sit and 

### 22 listen to people from Tampa Electric Company get up 

### 23 and, and talk and, and Georgia Power talk about being 

### 24 good public citizens, I'd like to invite them to come 

### 25 to eastern Kentucky and, and see what they're doing toAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 127 1 our state. 

### 2 Kentucky is sixth in the nation in mercury 

### 3 production and Indiana, our neighbor, is fifth and we, 

### 4 for some reason, we bear the brunt of everybody else's 

### 5 problems with energy. People in Florida enjoy a life 

### 6 in virtual paradise and in order for them to do that, 

### 7 they have to come to our state and pollute our 

### 8 communities and destroy them. It doesn't just, it just 

### 9 doesn't seem quite right. 

### 10 I'm here with some folks from Cane Run 

### 11 community that I work with. The little gas and 

### 12 electric plant there has a coal ash containment and a 

### 13 power plant that's fifty yards from residents' front 

### 14 doors. We've recently obtained tests from that 

### 15 community that show that there's fly ash on their homes 

### 16 and soot. I hear people say that the soot issue is 

### 17 solved. I, I invite them to come to some of the 

### 18 communities we work with in Kentucky and, and do 

### 19 samples off their houses and it would show positive, 

### 20 obvious positive results for soot, but also mercury in 

### 21 that, and heavy metals in that soot. And I would 

### 22 challenge, I would challenge everyone to consider the 

### 23 fact that most of the health impact assessments that 

### 24 have been done in communities around the country where, 

### 25 where coal-fired power plants exist have shown thatAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 128 1 people die. There's one just done in Louisville, show 

### 2 that people that live around coal plants die ten -- an 

### 3 average of ten years before everybody else in the 

### 4 community. Why is that? There's a reason that's 

### 5 happening. 

### 6 So, you know, I would just -- I support the 

### 7 ruling as written. I want to thank you for writing the 

### 8 rule, but I would, I would urge you to please consider 

### 9 turning a blind ear to people who say that they need 

### 10 more time to kill us. They need more time to come to 

### 11 our communities and, and, and, and, and kill our 

### 12 children and create cancer-causing agents in our 

### 13 communities, autism, learning disabilities. If I said 

### 14 to you, could I have, could I have another six months 

### 15 to continue going on a rampage and creating an unsafe 

### 16 condition in your community? I don't think that would 

### 17 be allowed. So I'm asking you to come to Kentucky and, 

### 18 and reign in a, a lawless state when it comes to the 

### 19 environment. Reign in a lawless state that will not 

### 20 regulate any of these things. We need you. 

### 21 And I said this at the coal ash hearing last 

### 22 year. They won't regulate coal ash in Kentucky. Coal 

### 23 ash also contains mercury and so the last thing I want 

### 24 to say is finishing up is that we also want to implore 

### 25 you while we're here today that what we all came downAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 129 1 to the EPA hearing in Louisville to tell you that we 

### 2 wanted you all to regulate coal ash and we thought we 

### 3 put in a pretty good showing in the state of Kentucky. 

### 4 We had over three hundred people march from the EPA 

### 5 building to LG&E. They had -- they all marched in 

### 6 silently and, and, and, and in a peaceful fashion and 

### 7 sat down in the room. I think we pretty much showed 

### 8 that the community was overwhelmingly in support of 

### 9 regulation of coal ash. And, and we're still waiting. 

### 10 Kathy Little, who I'm sure you're going to 

### 11 hear from tomorrow, she was fifty yards from a mercury 

### 12 spewing, lead, arsenic, selenium contamination and -- 

### 13 fifty yards from her front door and still we have to 

### 14 listen to the power industry come up and talk about how 

### 15 they gave money to the opera. And that's just really 

### 16 not acceptable to us. It's just really not acceptable. 

### 17 And we really -- we support the rules you're 

### 18 trying to write and I understand you all are under a 

### 19 lot of pressure from industry to back off, but the fact 

### 20 of the matter is, is that I don't see how you can't put 

### 21 these regulations into place. 

### 22 Our economy in the State of Kentucky isn't 

### 23 dependent on coal any more. Our economy and our health 

### 24 is being destroyed by coal. 

### 25 MR. CLARK: Okay.AGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 130 1 MR. PEARCE: It's about that long? 

### 2 MR. CLARK: It's up. It sure it, it sure is. 

### 3 Yeah. 

### 4 MR. PEARCE: Thank you very much. 

### 5 MR. CLARK: And thank you very much. Any 

### 6 questions for these folks? Thank you very much. Robin 

### 7 Mann and looks like Jaffer Khimani and you can correct 

### 8 my pronunciation please. 

### 9 FEMALE: [Indecipherable] signed up before we 

### 10 got the people, so this is the last round. 

### 11 MR. CLARK: This is it before -- 

### 12 FEMALE: And I'm going to squeeze in a bunch 

### 13 of folks before hopefully, so we'll see. 

### 14 MR. CLARK: Okay. Robin, feel free to. 

### 15 MS. MANN: You were fine on Robin Mann. 

### 16 MR. CLARK: Okay. 

### 17 MS. MANN: Thank you for the opportunity to 

### 18 testify this morning. My name is Robin Mann. I'm 

### 19 president of the Sierra Club. I'm very proud to be 

### 20 here on behalf the club's one point four million 

### 21 members and supporters to speak in strong support of 

### 22 the proposed EPA standards to reduce toxic mercury and 

### 23 other hazardous air pollutants from coal and oil-fired 

### 24 power plants. 

### 25 This long overdue proposal would establishAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 131 1 the first ever, national limits, on power plants 

### 2 emissions of heavy metals including mercury and 

### 3 arsenic, acid gasses, dioxin and other air toxics. 

### 4As the EPA has recognized and many of the 

### 5 experts here today are testifying, these chemicals are 

### 6 a special class of pollutants that are extremely 

### 7 harmful to human health. Air toxics are linked to 

### 8 cancer, heart disease, neurological damage, birth 

### 9 defects, asthma attacks, immune system damage, eye 

### 10 irritation and even premature death. 

### 11 By an overwhelming bi-partisan majority, 

### 12 Congress passed the Clean Air Act Amendments of 1990 

### 13 and directed EPA to regulate toxic air pollution from 

### 14major sources, yet today, more than twenty years later, 

### 15 there are still no national limits on the amount of 

### 16 mercury and other hazardous air pollutants that power 

### 17 plants can spew into the air. 

### 18 And power plants are among the largest 

### 19 sources of toxic air emissions in the United States. 

### 20 In 2009 alone, power plants generated more than a 

### 21 hundred and thirty four thousand pounds of mercury. 

### 22 For decades, however, the power sector has 

### 23 managed to fight off clean air act requirements to 

### 24 reduce the toxic air emissions from their facilities. 

### 25 It was not intended to be so. As EPA recognizes in theAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 132 1 draft rule, older, higher polluting units were exempted 

### 2 from the Clean Air Act at its inception on Congress' 

### 3 assumption that their useful life was near an end, but 

### 4 the power sector has kept many old plants online 

### 5 because it is more profitable to do so, they are 

### 6 cheaper to operate. 

### 7 Even now, while the technology is readily 

### 8 available, the costs are affordable, and the public 

### 9 health benefits are so clear, big coal is mounting an 

### 10 intense campaign to resist cleaning up the oldest and 

### 11 dirtiest power plants, but it has already been too long 

### 12 a wait for these standards and the overwhelming 

### 13 benefits to public health they afford. 

### 14The health risks associated with mercury 

### 15 emissions have long been known. Mercury is a potent 

### 16 neurotoxin. It washes out of the air into the water 

### 17 bodies, is transformed into toxic methyl mercury, a 

### 18 persistent pollutant that builds up in the food chain, 

### 19 especially in fish tissue. Everyone who eats 

### 20 contaminated fish is at risk for harmful health affects 

### 21 and the mercury problem is pervasive. There are fish 

### 22 advisories against consuming certain types of fish due 

### 23 to mercury contamination in all fifty states. 

### 24Pregnant women who consume mercury 

### 25 contaminated fish put their children at particular riskAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 133 1 for brain damage and developmental disabilities 

### 2 including learning problems and lower intelligence. 

### 3 EPA's own studies indicate that three hundred 

### 4 thousand to seven hundred thousand babies are born 

### 5 every year with dangerous levels of mercury in their 

### 6 blood. 

### 7 EPA indicates that the proposed Mercury and 

### 8 Air Toxics Standards will, when fully implemented, 

### 9 result in preventing ninety-one percent of the mercury 

### 10 produced by burning coal from being emitted into the 

### 11 air. The rule would also cut emissions of other heavy 

### 12 metals and acid gasses and reduce fine particulates. 

### 13 By EPA's own estimates, the proposed standards -- 

### 14 safeguards will result in preventing as many as 

### 15 seventeen thousand premature deaths every year and 

### 16 additional very substantial health benefits, including 

### 17 as EPA indicates eleven thousand non-fatal heart 

### 18 attacks, a hundred and twenty thousand cases of 

### 19 aggravated asthma attacks, as well as eight hundred and 

### 20 fifty thousand additional workdays that would have 

### 21 been lost. 

### 22 To weaken or put off the adoption and 

### 23 implementation of these strong protections would cost 

### 24 thousands of more people harm to their health and 

### 25 shortened lives every year.AGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 134 1 Finally, the EPA urges the -- the Sierra Club 

### 2 urges the EPA to follow its own guidance on 

### 3 consideration of environmental justice and cumulative 

### 4 risks. It is incumbent on EPA to give full 

### 5 consideration to the disproportionate exposure to 

### 6 health hazards from power plant emissions among low

### 7 income communities of color and to the disproportionate 

### 8 susceptibility of those populations to toxic air 

### 9 pollutants. 

### 10 The EPA must also give full consideration to 

### 11 the correspondingly greater degree of health benefits 

### 12 that would accrue to these more vulnerable populations. 

### 13 These considerations will add weight to the 

### 14 urgency of adopting the proposed safeguards without 

### 15 delay. 

### 16 Also, we must draw the agency's attention to 

### 17 the fact that none of the three hearings on the 

### 18 proposed standards have been scheduled west of the 

### 19 Mississippi and in Texas, in particular, the state with 

### 20 the highest level of toxic power plant mercury 

### 21 pollutions -- I'm sorry -- toxic power plant mercury 

### 22 emissions. We urge EPA to remedy this oversight. 

### 23 Sierra Club strongly urges EPA to proceed 

### 24 with finalizing and implementing the proposed standards 

### 25 for the benefit of all Americans.AGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 135 1 Thank you. 

### 2 MR. CLARK: Thank you very much. 

### 3 MR. KHIMANI: Good morning. My name is 

### 4 Jaffer Khimani, spelled J-A-F-F-E-R, last name Khimani, 

### 5 K-H-I-M-A-N-I. 

### 6 I'm pleased to be here today on behalf of the 

### 7 Clean Air Task Force. Clean Air Task Force is a non

### 8 profit organization dedicated to reducing atmospheric 

### 9 pollution through research, advocacy and private sector 

### 10 collaboration. 

### 11 Since our founding in 1996, Clean Air Task 

### 12 Force has been deeply involved in efforts to reduce 

### 13 toxic and conventional air pollutant emissions from 

### 14 electric generating industry, which includes the 

### 15 largest domestic sources of these emissions. 

### 16 As part of that work, we represent client 

### 17 environmental groups and the deadline case leading to 

### 18 the proposed maximum available controlled technology 

### 19 standards under discussion today, which will be the 

### 20 first national standards for air toxics from this 

### 21 industry. 

### 22 I will confine my remarks today to the larger 

### 23 picture and Clean Air Task Force will provide detailed 

### 24 technical comments on this rule making by the public 

### 25 comment deadline.AGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 136 1 First, Clean Air Task Force is pleased that 

### 2 the agency has put forward a MACT standard for this 

### 3 industry, which is applicable to all the air toxics 

### 4 emitted by coal and oil coal-fired electric generating 

### 5 units. 

### 6 These toxic air pollutants include mercury, 

### 7 acid gasses, benzene, dioxins, in addition to lead, 

### 8 nickel, arsenic, and other metal compounds. 

### 9 EPA's analysis shows that if finalized as 

### 10 proposed, the standards will prevent seventeen thousand 

### 11 premature deaths, a hundred and twenty thousand asthma 

### 12 attacks, and over twelve thousand hospitalizations and 

### 13 emergency room visits every year and that the public 

### 14 health benefits of the rules will far outweigh the 

### 15 costs of timely implementation. 

### 16 But that is only part of the benefits, 

### 17 picture for these rules. The EPA has not calculated 

### 18 all or even the majority of the expected benefits of 

### 19 this rule, including benefits to wildlife, the benefits 

### 20 of reducing or even eliminating mercury related fish 

### 21 advisories or benefits to public health and property 

### 22 from acid gas emission control, to name a few. 

### 23 Indeed, a recent study of the overall 

### 24 benefits of the clean air act since 1970 shows that the 

### 25 Act's public health safeguards implemented to date haveAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 137 1 contributed two trillion dollars in economic activity 

### 2 to the economy; a thirty to one return on investment. 

### 3 With that in mind, we encourage the agency to 

### 4 stay on track with the schedule for finalizing and 

### 5 implementing this rule. 

### 6 Work done by the Clean Air Task Force and 

### 7 others, which we will provide in our written comments, 

### 8 demonstrates that all the standards proposed can cost 

### 9 effectively be met in a timely fashion by the industry, 

### 10 despite the protestations -- the protests of big -- big 

### 11 utilities, dirty coal companies, and their 

### 12 congressional allies. 

### 13 Indeed, we are concerned that the agency is 

### 14 not going far enough to achieve much needed 

### 15 deep reductions in both toxic and 

### 16 conventional air pollutants from this sector. 

### 17 While we are pleased the agency has taken a 

### 18 multi-pollutant approach here, recognizing the 

### 19 synergies between possible control strategies and 

### 20 considering greenhouse gas emissions, implications of 

### 21 various options still, the proposed standards are 

### 22 disappointing in some respects. 

### 23 For example, the statistical approach EPA has 

### 24 adopted in its MACTs floor setting process results in 

### 25 standards that do not truly represent the bestAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 138 1 performers in the industry. 

### 2 We also note that the agency's proposed new 

### 3 source performance standards are disappointing -- 

### 4 disappointingly not based on a forward-looking 

### 5 technology-forcing approach. But rest on what can 

### 6 already be achieved. 

### 7 Indeed, EPA's proposal to include commercial 

### 8 demonstration exemptions, in the way it has -- is in 

### 9 waffle and it not only picks technology winners, but 

### 10 oddly holds them to a lower standard than those for 

### 11 existing technologies. 

### 12 Put differently, rather than encouraging 

### 13 innovation, this provision creates disincentives to 

### 14 further innovation by providing an off ramp from the 

### 15 new standards. 

### 16 In summary, we applaud the agency's efforts 

### 17 today in issuing this proposal on time. And in 

### 18 conjunction with the new source performance standards 

### 19 with the industry. We strongly encourage EPA to remain 

### 20 on schedule in both finalizing the rule and 

### 21 implementing it and we urge the agency to ensure that 

### 22 the final rule is consistent with the statute authority 

### 23 and certainly not further weaken it. 

### 24Thank you very much for the opportunity to 

### 25 speak today.AGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 139 1 MR. CLARK: Thank you. Thank you both. 

### 2 Folks, do you have anything? Questions? No. Okay. 

### 3 Thank you. Oh, I'm sorry. Yeah? 

### 4MR. MAXWELL: Ms. Mann, were you suggesting 

### 5 that we have another hearing west of the Mississippi or 

### 6 was that? 

### 7 MS. MANN: Yes. 

### 8 MR. MAXWELL: Okay. I couldn't tell if the 

### 9 sentence -- you were hurrying I know to make the -- 

### 10 MS. MANN: Yes. No. West of the Mississippi 

### 11 would be great. I flagged Texas in particular. 

### 12 MR. MAXWELL: Okay. 

### 13 MR. CLARK: Thank you. 

### 14MALE: [Indecipherable] air tester for 

### 15 mercury at fifty-seven [indecipherable] right now and 

### 16 we're going to [indecipherable] walk over to one of 

### 17 the -- 

### 18 MR. CLARK: In the meantime, Mark MacLeod and 

### 19 John Hammond please. Mr. Hammond, you can start if you 

### 20 want. 

### 21 MR. HAMMOND: Sure. My name is John Hammond, 

### 22 H-A-M-M-O-N-D and I'm the Southeast Regional Executive 

### 23 Director for the National Wildlife Federation. On 

### 24 behalf of the National Wildlife Federation and our more 

### 25 than four million members and supporters nationwide, IAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 140 1 thank you for the opportunity to comment on proposed 

### 2 mercury and air toxics rule for power plants. 

### 3 For over a decade NWFS pushed for strong 

### 4 regulations to limit mercury pollution from all 

### 5 sources, given the grave threat mercury contamination 

### 6 poses to both people and wildlife. 

### 7 After years of unnecessary and unacceptable 

### 8 delays, we applaud the Environmental Protection Agency 

### 9 for finally moving forward to require coal-fired power 

### 10 plants, the nation's largest source of toxic mercury 

### 11 pollution to cut their emissions. 

### 12 We strongly support EPA's proposed, proposal 

### 13 at issue today. 

### 14 Seven years ago, the Bush administration 

### 15 proposed a very different mercury rule for power 

### 16 plants. NWF strongly opposed that flawed proposal and 

### 17 called on EPA to go back to the drawing board with all 

### 18 the stringent requirements of the clean air act for 

### 19 dealing with hazardous air pollution. 

### 20 After years of legal challenge, I am both 

### 21 personally and professionally relieved to see EPA's 

### 22 strong proposal today. Sadly, readily available 

### 23 technology to control mercury pollution has sat on the 

### 24 shelf collecting dust all these years while massive 

### 25 amounts of preventable toxic pollution has continuedAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 141 1 unabated. 

### 2 Decades of delay and inaction to address 

### 3 toxic pollution have resulted in thousands of premature 

### 4 deaths, heart attacks, birth defects, and incidences of 

### 5 disease like childhood asthma. 

### 6 Additionally, while several states have 

### 7 stepped up and set strong toxic pollution limits for 

### 8 power plants within their borders, the lack of a 

### 9 national standard has led to severe contamination of 

### 10 our lakes, rivers, and forests from both acid rain and 

### 11 mercury pollution. 

### 12 Today, every state in the country has some 

### 13 form of mercury advisory warning people to limit or 

### 14 avoid eating certain species of fish because of the 

### 15 dangers of mercury exposure. 

### 16 As a federation founded by hunting and 

### 17 fishing organizations, NWF is particularly concerned 

### 18 about the threat this poses to those of us who fish and 

### 19 to our outdoor heritage. 

### 20 Mercury even in small amounts, is a potent 

### 21 neurotoxin especially dangerous in the early stages of 

### 22 development for both people and wildlife. 

### 23 While people have the benefit of fish 

### 24 consumption advisories to help limit their mercury 

### 25 intake, wildlife do not have the luxury of choosing aAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 142 1 food source that has lower mercury levels. They are 

### 2 not able to avoid the dangers lurking in their 

### 3 contaminated habitats. 

### 4And it's not just fish. Historically, 

### 5 scientists have believed that mercury only threatened 

### 6 species that live and feed in aquatic, in aquatic 

### 7 habitats, however recent research shows mercury is 

### 8 accumulating at dangerous levels in terrestrial species 

### 9 as well. 

### 10 No longer is the threat of mercury exposed, 

### 11 exposure to fish eating wildlife, such as loons and 

### 12 eagles, scientists are now finding mercury is building 

### 13 up in insect eating species, such as forest songbirds. 

### 14There is truly no link in the food chain 

### 15 untouched by mercury and as a result, mercury pollution 

### 16 is a far greater threat to bio diversity than 

### 17 previously thought because a wide range of wildlife 

### 18 species beyond fish that accumulate mercury including 

### 19 aquatic birds, forest birds, mammals, reptiles, 

### 20 amphibians, in vertebra and marine wildlife. 

### 21 There are varying health impacts associated 

### 22 with high mercury levels in these different species, 

### 23 but primarily -- but the primary consequence is 

### 24 increased vulnerability due to reproductive and 

### 25 neurological problems and immune system deficiencies.AGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 143 1 For example, fish with high mercury levels 

### 2 have difficult schooling and decreased spawning 

### 3 success. Birds lay few eggs and have trouble caring 

### 4 for their chicks. Mammals have impaired motor skills 

### 5 that affect their ability to hunt and find food. All 

### 6 these effects combine to create severe threat to 

### 7 wildlife survival. 

### 8 But there is some good news. Research shows 

### 9 that once sources of mercury pollution are cleaned up, 

### 10 mercury levels in nearly -- in nearby water go down in 

### 11 a matter of years, not decades. 

### 12 Coal-fired power plants play a major role in 

### 13 contaminating local fish and wildlife and once this new 

### 14 role goes into effect that will change. 

### 15 EPA must move forward and finalize this 

### 16 strong mercury air toxics rule in order to protect 

### 17 public health and our treasured wildlife from toxic 

### 18 pollution. It is time for the owners and operators of 

### 19 these facilities to be finally held responsible and 

### 20 accountable for their preventable toxic emissions. Our 

### 21 children, wildlife, and future generations should no 

### 22 longer be sacrificed to satisfy polluters special 

### 23 interest. 

### 24Thank you for the opportunity to testify. 

### 25 MR. CLARK: Thank you very much. Mr. MacLeod.AGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 144 1 MR. MACLEOD: Thank you. My name is Mark 

### 2 MacLeod, that's M-A-C-L-E-O-D. I'm the Director of 

### 3 Special Projects with Environmental Defense Fund, a 

### 4 non-partisan, environmental organization with more than 

### 5 seven hundred thousand members nationwide. 

### 6 I appreciate the opportunity to testify 

### 7 before you today. EPA's proposed mercury and air 

### 8 toxics rule for power plants will provide long overdue 

### 9 health protections for all Americans. 

### 10 EDF supports EPA's proposed rule, yet given 

### 11 the availability of cost effective, made in America 

### 12 technology solutions, we urge the agency to strengthen 

### 13 the standards for coal-fired power plants to secure 

### 14 even greater health and environmental benefits. 

### 15 Now, many speakers today have already spoken 

### 16 of the years that have passed since the 1990 Clean Air 

### 17 Act Amendments. People have spoken eloquently of the 

### 18 devastating health impacts of mercury and they've 

### 19 spoken of the tremendous benefits that the proposed 

### 20 rule would provide, so I'm going to skip over these in 

### 21 my remarks, but they're in my written remarks and I 

### 22 have additional copies if anyone so desires. 

### 23 So I'd like to take a minute to talk about 

### 24 electric system reliability because unfortunately, many 

### 25 in the electric industry are raising the specter of aAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 145 1 national reliability crisis as it means to weaken or 

### 2 delay EPA's long overdue rules. 

### 3 The first major report in this campaign was 

### 4 the Edison Electric Institute's report, Potential 

### 5 Impacts of Environmental Regulation on the U.S. 

### 6 Generation of Fleet. But just recently, a peer review 

### 7 of the EEI report was conducted by Susan Tierney 

### 8 and Charles Cicchetti. The peer 

### 9 review authors conclude that the EPA -- the EEI report 

### 10 was based upon worse-case assumptions which have not 

### 11 materialized. They continue, "The EEI report does not 

### 12 adequately distinguish between the non-environmental 

### 13 drivers of changes in the electricity industry and 

### 14 various EPA rule makings. There is also inadequate 

### 15 discussion of initiatives underway to strengthen the 

### 16 resiliency and reliability of the electricity network." 

### 17 Similarly, in recent public testimony before 

### 18 the House Energy and Commerce Committee, Tom Fanning 

### 19 , CEO of Southern Company stated, quoting, 

### 20 "The reliability of the nation's electric generating 

### 21 system is at risk because of the number of new rules 

### 22 and regulations applicable to power plants." And, 

### 23 continuing to quote, "EPA appears to not take this 

### 24 problem seriously." Yet, in a more private conference 

### 25 call with investors, when asked what's the penalty forAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 146 1 not reaching the time line and do you need to shut down 

### 2 or are there fines? Mr. Fanning said, and I quote, 

### 3 "Lisa Jackson, she I think recognizes that the EPA, 

### 4 last thing they want us to create a reliability 

### 5 crisis." And, quoting again, "I think what you would 

### 6 do is enter into a set of individual consent decrees 

### 7 with just as company by company." And those are exact 

### 8 quotes. 

### 9 Some utilities often site a 2010 report by 

### 10 the North American Reliability Counsel, Corporation, 

### 11 failing to mention that that report assumes no industry 

### 12 actions in the near term to address compliance issues 

### 13 or market response. Utilities also fail to mention 

### 14 that that 2010 NERC report lists a suite of tools that 

### 15 regulators, system operators, and industry participants 

### 16 should employ to ensure reliability and that list is 

### 17 included as an appendix to my written comments. 

### 18 Well what would cause an electric reliability 

### 19 crisis? What would cause a crisis is if we have the 

### 20 realization of a self-fulfilling prophecy. If 

### 21 utilities fail to order equipment on a timely basis. 

### 22 If they fail to work with planning councils to 

### 23 coordinate outage schedules to install retrofits. If 

### 24 utilities -- some utilities I should say -- continue to 

### 25 spend their time seeking wholesale regulatory reliefAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 147 1 rather than identifying the small set of plants in 

### 2 specific geographic locations that may need special 

### 3 treatment. Happily, other utilities are stepping up to 

### 4 the plate, interested in more progress than creating 

### 5 fear -- interested more in progress, than creating 

### 6 fear. 

### 7 Eight utilities wrote a letter to the Wall 

### 8 Street Journal where they say the electric sector has 

### 9 known that these rules were coming. Many companies, 

### 10 including ours, have already invested in modern air 

### 11 pollution control technologies and cleaner, more 

### 12 efficient plants. 

### 13 Our experience, over a decade, -- my 

### 14 apologies -- shows that experience complying with air 

### 15 quality regulations demonstrates that regulations can 

### 16 yield important economic benefits including job 

### 17 creation while maintaining reliability. That's from 

### 18 those other eight electric power companies. 

### 19 So Environmental Defense Fund urges EPA to 

### 20 finalize the proposed rule in a timely manner and we 

### 21 urge utilities in Georgia and across the nation to stop 

### 22 stoking fear of a national reliability crisis and 

### 23 instead, work with the regulators and local citizens to 

### 24 ensure that we provide for reliability and healthy 

### 25 Americans.AGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 148 1 Thank you. 

### 2 MR. CLARK: Thank you. Thank you very much. 

### 3 Any questions? Thank you. Appreciate it. 

### 4Okay, we're going to do six more speakers 

### 5 here, I think, before the lunch break. 

### 6 FEMALE: [Indecipherable] couple more -- 

### 7 MR. CLARK: Apparently, they're going to be a 

### 8 couple more. 

### 9 FEMALE: There is going to be a couple more 

### 10 and then we'll do lunch at one. 

### 11 MR. CLARK: And we're going to take lunch at 

### 12 one o'clock, so we'll see if you guys can survive that. 

### 13 Are you okay time wise? Are you? Okay. Well, it's 

### 14 okay Beverly, we can -- if you need to, yeah. 

### 15 Okay. Jack Thirolf please and Dabney Dixon. 

### 16 Actually Carol's here if you need to switch out, so. 

### 17 Oh okay. It, it's okay. Go. Whichever would like to 

### 18 start, please do and if you could spell your name, that 

### 19 would be great. 

### 20 MR. THIROLF: Thank you. I'm Jack Thirolf, 

### 21 it's T as in Tom, H-I-R-O-L-F. 

### 22 Thank you for the opportunity to participate 

### 23 in this public hearing. I'm here today speaking on 

### 24 behalf of the Business Council for Sustainable Energy. 

### 25 We are a coalition of companies and trade associationsAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 149 1 from the energy efficiency, natural gas, and renewable 

### 2 energy sectors. Our coalition also includes 

### 3 independent electric power producers, investor owned 

### 4 utilities, public power, commercial and users and 

### 5 project developers and service providers for 

### 6 environmental markets. 

### 7 The Council was founded in 1992 and advocates for 

### 8 policies that increase the use for commercially 

### 9 available clean energy technologies, products, and 

### 10 services. 

### 11 Our diverse business membership is united 

### 12 around the revitalization of our economy and the 

### 13 creation of a secure and sustainable energy future for 

### 14 America. 

### 15 Before speaking, I'd like to note that as a 

### 16 diverse coalition, not all of our members endorse or 

### 17 take a position on these comments. 

### 18 We wanted to communicate four things to you 

### 19 this morning. 

### 20 Number one. We support EPA's stated time 

### 21 line for finalizing and implementing the proposed 

### 22 mercury and air toxic standards for the electric 

### 23 utility sector. 

### 24 Number two, we commend the agency for 

### 25 offering an output-based compliance option as part ofAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 150 1 these standards. This is something the Council, our 

### 2 Council has supported output-based metrics since its 

### 3 founding in 1992 and we feel they encourage and reward 

### 4 energy efficiency. 

### 5 Third, there were two specific points that we 

### 6 wanted to highlight within the rule that we thought 

### 7 were opportunities to incentivize and reward a clean 

### 8 and efficient combined heat and power and I'll speak in 

### 9 more detail on that. 

### 10 And number four is a general point that, in 

### 11 our view, shifting to lower emissions technologies and 

### 12 resources will upgrade our nation's electric generation 

### 13 infrastructure, will help drive economic growth and 

### 14 create jobs. 

### 15 Maintaining the current time line. We 

### 16 support EPA's stated time line for finalizing and 

### 17 implementing the proposed Mercury and Air Toxics 

### 18 Standards for the electric utility sector. As 

### 19 businesses operate in the energy industry, we value 

### 20 predictable, science based rules that provide the 

### 21 certainty needed for sound, long-term capital 

### 22 investments. These proposed standards, as we've heard, 

### 23 have been more than twenty years in the making. 

### 24Multi-billion dollar investments have been 

### 25 made in control technologies and clean generation inAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 151 1 anticipated -- in anticipation of implementation of the 

### 2 proposed standards. 

### 3 Billions more will be invested as our 

### 4 nation's electric utility sector modernizes and works 

### 5 to comply with the finalized standards. 

### 6 Businesses and investors need certainty on 

### 7 air emissions policy. The lane regulation will keep 

### 8 capital on sidelines and further delay investment in 

### 9 America's energy infrastructure and in innovative 

### 10 technologies. 

### 11 We urge the EPA to continue moving forward. 

### 12 Encouraging energy efficiency. In crafting 

### 13 the standards, we urge EPA to put an emphasis on energy 

### 14 efficiency where possible. We commend the agency for 

### 15 authoring an output based compliance option in the 

### 16 proposed standards and strongly encourage you to 

### 17 maintain this option in the final rule. 

### 18 The Council has long supported the 

### 19 development and use of output-based emissions 

### 20 regulations as effective ways to promote long-term air 

### 21 quality and to encourage cost effective emissions 

### 22 reductions. As EPA itself has noted, output-based 

### 23 regulations better reward and drive energy efficiency 

### 24 improvements than do input-based approaches. 

### 25 We commend EPA's work in recent rule makingsAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 152 1 that acknowledge the benefits of using output-based 

### 2 standards and thank the agency for following suit again 

### 3 here in this rule making. 

### 4Accounting for the benefits of combined heat 

### 5 and power. The Council believes that combined heat and 

### 6 power has an important role to play and we feel that 

### 7 there are two opportunities in these rules where we can 

### 8 incentivize, we can incentivize CHP. 

### 9 The first derives out of the NSPS 

### 10 changes included along with the rule. In accounting 

### 11 for onsite generation's avoidance of line losses from 

### 12 the transmission and distribution of electricity, we 

### 13 feel the proposed five percent benefit is too low and I 

### 14 would encourage you to look at the comments made by one 

### 15 of our members, Recycled Energy Development at 

### 16 Tuesday's hearing in Chicago, for a full account of the 

### 17 studies detailing the appropriate benefit level that 

### 18 should be given to CHP units and I'll be happy to drop 

### 19 that off at the front desk with our comments today. 

### 20 Second, for those facilities seeking to 

### 21 switch to natural gas-fired systems and who want to 

### 22 include combined heat and power, we urge EPA to allow 

### 23 those units an additional year to design, permit, and 

### 24 install a CHP system. Three years may simply not be 

### 25 enough time for this process.AGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 153 1 Recognizing the potential for delays and 

### 2 additional time, EPA regulations to allow boiler owners 

### 3 to petition for an additional year to install add-on 

### 4 pollution controls. The Council asks EPA in the final 

### 5 rule to clarify that CHP be deemed controls and be 

### 6 allowed this extra year if needed. Our concern is that 

### 7 absent this option for a fourth year, facilities may 

### 8 forego installing CHP systems and lose out on the 

### 9 associated benefits. 

### 10 Our final point. On electric grid 

### 11 reliability and economic growth. These standards for 

### 12 the electricity sector will, in our view, not imperil 

### 13 the reliability, civility, or strength of our nation's 

### 14 electrical grid. Some recent reports and studies are 

### 15 based on assumptions that, in our view, under estimate 

### 16 the ability of America's electric sector to invest, 

### 17 adapt, and construct new clean generation and to also 

### 18 install control technologies and we also feel that 

### 19 those reports over estimate the severity and rigidity 

### 20 of EPA's regulatory approaches. 

### 21 America has available clean energy resources, 

### 22 including the broad collection of natural gas, energy 

### 23 efficiency and renewable energy technology and services 

### 24 have a major role to play in our nation's energy 

### 25 future. Their continued and expanded deployment fromAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 154 1 clean energy -- from clean and efficient combined cycle 

### 2 natural gas units to demand response to distributed 

### 3 renewable energy generation will strengthen the grid's 

### 4 reliability and resiliency. 

### 5 We feel these technologies and fuels will 

### 6 help regulate and city's achieve compliance at lower 

### 7 costs. 

### 8 Again, shifting to lower emissions 

### 9 technologies and resources will upgrade in our nation's 

### 10 electric generation infrastructure, will help drive 

### 11 economic growth and create jobs. 

### 12 Thanks for the opportunity to speak today. 

### 13 We'll be working with our members over the next month 

### 14 to sort out comments that we'll hope to submit before 

### 15 the July 5 deadline. 

### 16 Thank you. 

### 17 MR. CLARK: Thank you very much. Ms. Dixon. 

### 18 MS. DIXON: My name is Dabney Dixon. My 

### 19 first name is D-A-B-N-E-Y; last name Dixon, D-I-X-O-N. 

### 20 I'm a Professor of Chemistry at Georgia State 

### 21 University, but I am, in fact, speaking as an 

### 22 individual here today to support the proposed mercury 

### 23 standards. 

### 24Mercury has a bio-geochemical cycle such that 

### 25 mercury produced in a variety of ways from burning ofAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 155 1 coal and medical waste, from bleaching and cement 

### 2 production, and gold mining, goes up into the 

### 3 atmosphere. It's returned to the earth and often in 

### 4 precipitation and then it makes its way to the edges of 

### 5 rivers and lakes and streams where it's converted by 

### 6 bacteria to a compound called methyl mercury. 

### 7 Methyl mercury is a very potent toxin. It 

### 8 impairs neurological development and the developing 

### 9 children and infants up to elementary school are at 

### 10 most risk. There are impacts on cognitive thinking and 

### 11 memory and attention and language, fine motor and 

### 12 visual spatial skills. These have all been seen in 

### 13 children and including those where the exposure comes 

### 14 through the mother. 

### 15 Incidents of methyl mercury poisoning are 

### 16 also clear in adults and I speak from personal 

### 17 experience because a colleague of mine, at another 

### 18 university, went in -- a professor -- to run some 

### 19 experiments over the end of the year holiday with 

### 20 methyl mercury and a couple weeks later started to have 

### 21 neurological symptoms and in two months, she was dead. 

### 22 And what she had done was to use the wrong gloves and 

### 23 methyl mercury had gone through the gloves. So this is 

### 24 truly a potent neurotoxin. 

### 25 It ends up in us by bioaccumulation, that isAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 156 1 the bacteria are eaten by animals and plankton, then 

### 2 smaller fish and larger fish until we finally get it 

### 3 into the food chain. 

### 4There's an increasing amount or increasing 

### 5 number of places where one can no longer consume the 

### 6 fish because of mercury pollution all through the 

### 7 United States. 

### 8 The EPA has a cute take off on Dr. Seuss 

### 9 where children and women of childbearing age should not 

### 10 at all eat shark, swordfish, king mackerel, and tile 

### 11 fish and a maximum of two weeks per meal even of things 

### 12 lower in mercury such as canned tuna, catfish, pollock, 

### 13 salmon, and shrimp. This extends to Georgia. 

### 14On the left, a Georgia aquarium advisory, the 

### 15 southeast seafood guide 2010 and on the right, a 2010 

### 16 update from guidelines for eating fish from Georgia 

### 17 waters. It's a long document. The Georgia waters 

### 18 document. The left shows the river basins of Georgia 

### 19 and the right shows, just to take a single example like 

### 20 tuna, where largemouth bass, spotted 

### 21 bass, and hybrid bass, bass one can only now have one 

### 22 meal a week if they're over sixteen inches, so this 

### 23 mercury pollution is here with us in Georgia. 

### 24Looking over the years, this is a slide from 

### 25 Ben Gibson's -- a few months ago, you can see thatAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 157 1 between 1990 and 2005, the amount of mercury decreased 

### 2 in the United States. In particular, municipal waste 

### 3 combustion decreased mercury and also medical waste 

### 4 incinerators, but the amount of mercury coming from 

### 5 coal-fired power plants continues and that's the 

### 6 subject of the current proposed legislation. 

### 7 In mercury in Georgia, data from 2004, again 

### 8 a majority of it from the coal-fired electrical 

### 9 generating units. 

### 10 When I ask people why are things not 

### 11 happening, why are we hesitating, people tell me three 

### 12 things. One thing they say is we can't be sure of the 

### 13 data. And I would say as a scientist that the data are 

### 14 excellent, particularly the data on neurological 

### 15 efforts -- or neurological affects, we do have good 

### 16 data. 

### 17 People say the situation is so overwhelming 

### 18 that we cannot do anything, but we are here today 

### 19 because we have a clear solution available and we can 

### 20 push to adopt this solution. 

### 21 And then people say, and it was argued this 

### 22 morning, that this will be costly. But I would say 

### 23 that not doing anything is even more costly for us and 

### 24 for the generations to come. 

### 25 Our children are at particular risk. This isAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 158 1 a picture of a current class of children. This is a 

### 2 picture roughly of my son's generation. This is a 

### 3 picture roughly of my generation. This is a picture of 

### 4 my mother's generation. And this is a picture of my 

### 5 grandmother's generation. I show you all those little 

### 6 girls, none of them is actually my grandmother, because 

### 7 my grandmother is about that age at the time that 

### 8 picture was taken. My grandmother had a huge affect on 

### 9 our lives. The kind of decisions she made, the 

### 10 sacrifices that she made reverberated down through the 

### 11 generations and we still tell stories of her power and 

### 12 the wonderful affect that she has. 

### 13 I would say that we need to take the 

### 14 responsibility now for the generations that will come 

### 15 beyond us and we need to support the EPA and its 

### 16 proposed mercury regulations. 

### 17 Thank you. 

### 18 MR. CLARK: Thank you both very much. Any 

### 19 questions guys? I guess not. Thank you. Appreciate 

### 20 it. 

### 21 Okay. Next two speakers please, Lance Brown 

### 22 and Steve Earle. Okay. I thought we were further 

### 23 down. That's all right. I just want to be sure 

### 24 [indecipherable] time. Bless you. I hope you're not 

### 25 getting [indecipherable] sit next to me, Pal. Mr. Brown.AGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 159 1 MR. BROWN: I'm Lance Brown, Executive 

### 2 Director of the Partnership for Affordable Clean 

### 3 Energy, or PACE. That's Brown like the color, 

### 4 B-R-O-W-N. 

### 5 Thanks for the opportunity to testify here 

### 6 today on behalf of the electricity consumers, 

### 7 businesses and agricultural interests that PACE 

### 8 represents. 

### 9 Among the various consequences of the 

### 10 regulations being discussed today, we believe none is 

### 11 more important than the affect on electricity 

### 12 customers. 

### 13 The cost estimates are highly various, with 

### 14 the EPA itself claiming the rule will come with a 

### 15 compliance price tag of ten point nine billion dollars 

### 16 making this regulation one of the most expensive in the 

### 17 agency's history. This is twice the cost of current 

### 18 regulations that reduce sulfur and nitrogen oxide 

### 19 emissions. 

### 20 We've seen cost estimates as high as three 

### 21 hundred billion dollars, which would exceed the 2008 GDP 

### 22 of thirty-six of the fifty U.S. States. 

### 23 Who will ultimately pay the toll for this 

### 24 compliance? As always, it will be the families and 

### 25 businesses of America. The electricity, reliabilityAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 160 1 coordinating council estimates price increases between 

### 2 twenty and twenty-five percent or been four hundred and 

### 3 five hundred dollars in annual buying power for the 

### 4 average family. 

### 5 But the truth is that increases in 

### 6 electricity costs are not felt equally by all 

### 7 Americans. The Affordable Power Alliance released a 

### 8 study showing disparate cost impacts of the EPA's 

### 9 regulations on minority families and of course, there 

### 10 has been discussion today about the effects on 

### 11 minorities. 

### 12 The study showed that these families spend 

### 13 disproportionately more of their income on electricity 

### 14 bills. For the millions of struggling low income 

### 15 families, discussions about higher energy costs are not 

### 16 political rhetoric, they're tough reality. 

### 17 The people PACE has spoken to across the 

### 18 southeast and beyond are sending a clear message if 

### 19 we're willing to listen. Now is not the time to saddle 

### 20 Americans with families, and businesses with higher 

### 21 power bills. 

### 22 In this struggling economy, these regulations 

### 23 also endanger jobs and threaten to stall economic 

### 24 growth. The forced early retirement of coal-fired 

### 25 power will result in tens of thousands in the energyAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 161 1 sector alone losing their jobs, as well as thousands 

### 2 more in supporting industries. 

### 3 Perhaps this is why the IBEW supports a 

### 4 longer window for compliance with these rules. In 

### 5 fact, IBEW President, Edwin Hill states that as many 

### 6 as fifty thousand workers in the utility, mining, and 

### 7 railroad industries could lose their jobs. According 

### 8 to President Hill, reasonable and realistic standards 

### 9 will only be achieved through legislation, a position 

### 10 with which PACE agrees. 

### 11 EPA's response on the topic of jobs has been 

### 12 inadequate, if not flippant. During a recent interview 

### 13 on the Daily Show with Jon Stewart, Administrator 

### 14 Jackson commented that these new rules will actually 

### 15 create jobs since the economy -- since someone will 

### 16 have to build the required technology. This 

### 17 explanation falls well short of reality. It might have 

### 18 been a good sound bite for the Daily Show, but it's the 

### 19 daily lives of Americans to which we should be paying 

### 20 more attention. 

### 21 NERC states that these rules will impact 

### 22 nearly four hundred thousand megawatts of generation, 

### 23 which is about half of our nation's current generation. 

### 24NERC also predicts that by 2018, nearly fifty 

### 25 thousand megawatts of generating capacity will beAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 162 1 forced into early retirement by these new regulations. 

### 2 With such swift and sweeping change, there's 

### 3 no doubt that the most severe growing pains will be 

### 4 felt by American consumers. People on fixed incomes 

### 5 and with low incomes. Consumers who are depending on 

### 6 the government and the EPA to get it right. 

### 7 We believe these rules will make American 

### 8 electricity less reliable and less affordable and will 

### 9 render American businesses less competitive. 

### 10 We ask the EPA not to implement this rule, or 

### 11 at the very least to allow a greater period for public 

### 12 comment and a longer time window for compliance. 

### 13 Thanks for the opportunity to share our 

### 14 perspective. 

### 15 MR. CLARK: Thank you very much. Mr. Earle. 

### 16 MR. EARLE: I'm Mr. Earle. 

### 17 MR. CLARK: Yeah. I'm saying, Mr. Earle 

### 18 please. 

### 19 MR. EARLE: Thank you. I'm Steve Earle, E-A

### 20 R-L-E, District Twelve International Vice President, 

### 21 the United Mine Workers of America and I'm here today 

### 22 to tell you I appreciate the opportunity you give us 

### 23 to, to talk to you. 

### 24Our members are concerned that EPA's proposed 

### 25 rules for maximum achievable control technology, newAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 163 1 and existing coal based generating units could lead to 

### 2 tens of thousands of job losses at utility plants, coal 

### 3 mines in the real sector. 

### 4We agree with several aspects of the proposed 

### 5 MACT rule, such as alternative compliance standards for 

### 6 acid gasses. 

### 7 These kinds of flexibility measures will help 

### 8 to minimize adverse impact of the rules on our members. 

### 9 Due to the complexity of the rules, we urge 

### 10 EPA to provide an extension of the current sixty day 

### 11 comment period to ninety or a hundred and twenty days. 

### 12 Their proposed new source emission limits will not 

### 13 allow any new coal plants to be constructed because no 

### 14 single unit can meet all of the proposed emission 

### 15 limits. 

### 16 The new-source limits are based on emission 

### 17 data from many different coal plants with widely 

### 18 varying in fuel and pollution control characteristics. 

### 19 We urge EPA to take coal sulfur content into account in 

### 20 setting the alternative acid gas, SO2 standard. 

### 21 Coals from many Midwestern states cannot meet 

### 22 the alternative SO2 standard even at units equipped 

### 23 with scrubbers removing ninety percent of the sulfur. 

### 24We do not believe that this rule should 

### 25 require coal switching at scrubbed units.AGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 164 1 We do not agree with EPA's estimate of ten 

### 2 gigawatts a coal plant closure do to the rule. Several 

### 3 independent estimates of impact of the proposed rule 

### 4 are in the range of forty to sixty gigawatts reflecting 

### 5 the hundreds of smaller and older coal units that are 

### 6 non-economic to retrofit. 

### 7 We are skeptical about your job analysis. We 

### 8 agree that thousands of construction jobs will be 

### 9 created, but believe that the agency is under 

### 10 estimating the loss of permanent jobs if hundreds of 

### 11 coal plants close and utilities switched to natural 

### 12 gas. 

### 13 The UMWA has estimated that more than fifty 

### 14 thousand direct jobs are at risk in coal transportation 

### 15 and the utility sectors. 

### 16 If three hundred workers lose their jobs at a 

### 17 coal plant, the new jobs created at a natural gas plant 

### 18 would make up only a small fraction of the losses. 

### 19 Community impact such as loss of tax basis 

### 20 and support for local school systems need to be 

### 21 addressed in the EPA's analysis. 

### 22 We support the construction of, of controlled 

### 23 technologies to enable coal to be burned cleanly, but 

### 24 requiring multiple new emission standards for many 

### 25 older plants will drive investments away from theseAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 165 1 plants and their workers. 

### 2 A major problem with this rule is its 

### 3 thirty-six month compliance time frame as set by 

### 4 section one twelve of the Clean Air Act. We urge EPA to 

### 5 provide across-the-board extension of at least one year 

### 6 as it did in the marine MACT rule. More plants will be 

### 7 shut down and more jobs lost with a short three-year 

### 8 time table impacting more than one thousand units. 

### 9 Thank you again for the opportunity to speak 

### 10 to this panel. 

### 11 MR. CLARK: Thank you both very much. 

### 12 MR. EARLE: Thank you. 

### 13 MR. CULLIGAN: When you submit your comments 

### 14 -- I assume you're both submitting comments. When 

### 15 you're citing -- when you provide the numbers like the 

### 16 three hundred billion dollar cost, it would be really 

### 17 helpful if you could actually include the study. It 

### 18 sounds to me like you're actually comparing apples to 

### 19 oranges and you're looking at an annualized cost versus 

### 20 a total capital cost and without providing that kind of 

### 21 detail, it's really hard for us to evaluate what 

### 22 the -- where the numbers come from, so that would be 

### 23 very helpful. 

### 24MR. EARLE: We'll have [indecipherable]. 

### 25 MR. CULLIGAN: Thank you.AGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 166 1 MR. EARLE: Thank you. 

### 2 MR. CLARK: Okay. Next, first of all, I 

### 3 understand I misspoke earlier. We're actually going 

### 4 to have eight more speakers before the break, so the 

### 5 next two are Virginia Galloway and Kevin McGrath. 

### 6 Are you okay? If you need to go, feel free. 

### 7 MS. GALLOWAY: Good afternoon. 

### 8 MR. CLARK: Good afternoon. 

### 9 MS. GALLOWAY: You ready? 

### 10 MR. CLARK: We're ready. 

### 11 MS. GALLOWAY: Okay. 

### 12 MR. CLARK: Fire away. 

### 13 MS. GALLOWAY: I'm Virginia Galloway. I'm 

### 14 the State Director for Americans for Prosperity Georgia 

### 15 and I would like to comment on the proposed utility 

### 16 MACT regulations. 

### 17 I'll start with a question. How much will 

### 18 ten billion dollars cost us? That's the cost, the 

### 19 direct cost that you guys at the EPA say it will cost 

### 20 to implement these MACT regulations. Some in private 

### 21 industry. We've heard all kinds of ranges today, but 

### 22 the one I heard was a hundred billion dollars, may be 

### 23 that. But I don't want to fight about whether it's ten 

### 24 billion or a hundred billion. Either way, you're 

### 25 talking about real money; in my, in my economy anyway.AGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 167 1 But let's back up first to the things that we 

### 2 all agree on and what, what do we want -- there we go. 

### 3 Got ahead of myself. Boy this is an excitable clicker. 

### 4We all want to be like the old childhood 

### 5 rhyme, right? Healthy, wealthy, and wise and obviously 

### 6 clean air is a part of that. 

### 7 There aren't many news stories about good 

### 8 news. You don't see much of that, but people need to 

### 9 know that because of innovations and technology, there 

### 10 is good news. With all of our population growth, with 

### 11 increases in miles traveled by car, with increases in 

### 12 the energy consumption, increases in GDP, over an 

### 13 eighteen-year period, from 1990 to 2008, air pollution 

### 14 in the U.S. went down forty-one percent. 

### 15 The bad news is, every time a reasonable 

### 16 standard of air quality is reached, the EPA changes the 

### 17 standard. That's one of the reasons Georgia highways 

### 18 are in the mess they're in and I hope you were in our 

### 19 traffic this morning to experience that. 

### 20 Kind of like -- well, let's just say that the 

### 21 federal highway funds were denied because we had new 

### 22 tougher air standards as soon as we reached the old air 

### 23 standards. It was kind of like the peanuts cartoon, 

### 24 Lucy and Charlie Brown when she holds the football for 

### 25 him and he runs up to make the kick and what does sheAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 168 1 do? She moves it out of the way and he falls flat on 

### 2 his back. 

### 3 And so, in Georgia, we met the standards to 

### 4 get the highway funds back in the `90's, but then the 

### 5 ball was moved. 

### 6 Speaking of funds, we have an estimate of how 

### 7 much this will cost. Ten to a hundred billion. Any 

### 8 chance that the utility stockholders are going to bear 

### 9 this burden alone? 

### 10 With a ten percent unemployment rate and one 

### 11 of the highest foreclosure rates in the nation, 

### 12 Georgians are already struggling financially. When the 

### 13 price of electricity jumps to make up for this ten to 

### 14 one hundred billion dollar regulatory cost, consumers 

### 15 will pay. 

### 16 Let's say they tighten up on their 

### 17 electricity use at home. Many will have to. But then 

### 18 the cost of goods produced goes up also. They adjust 

### 19 again by cutting back on purchases. And more jobs are 

### 20 lost, maybe their own job. 

### 21 Meanwhile, the cost to government at every 

### 22 level continues to rise because governments are also 

### 23 consumers of electric power and the government doesn't 

### 24 have a reputation for efficiency in much of anything. 

### 25 But who ultimately pays for that? We do. WeAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 169 1 pay for the government's increased cost as well, either 

### 2 through our taxes or through our debt going up. 

### 3 I travel throughout this state. Many Georgia 

### 4 business people and many individuals are holding on by 

### 5 their fingernails. Holding on to their homes. Holding 

### 6 on to their businesses. Holding on to their financial 

### 7 situation. Holding on to their piece of the American 

### 8 dream. Don't kick them off the ledge, please. 

### 9 Now, let's talk about lives. Wisdom 

### 10 correctly assesses the problem and comes up with a 

### 11 reasonable plan to solve it. On a cost benefit 

### 12 analysis, these regulations are a fail. First of all, 

### 13 the amount of pollution caused by all utilities and 

### 14manufacturing plants is less than one percent of all 

### 15 air pollution. So if all that went away completely, 

### 16 which is not likely, we'd reduce air pollution by one 

### 17 percent. 

### 18 Realistically, this regulation would reduce 

### 19 air pollution by a small fraction of one percent, so 

### 20 that's what ten to one hundred billion dollars buys us. 

### 21 Americans for Prosperity represents over one 

### 22 point seven million members nationwide. We are for 

### 23 prosperity, therefore we are against more unnecessary 

### 24 regulation. We ask the EPA to listen to the President 

### 25 on this issue. By Executive Order this January, heAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 170 1 laid out the new review process for regulations stating 

### 2 that any agency should and I quote, "tailor its 

### 3 regulations to impose the least burden on society, 

### 4 consistent with obtaining regulatory objectives, taking 

### 5 into account among other things, and to the extent 

### 6 practicable, the cost of cumulative regulations." 

### 7 The EPA should rethink this proposal based on 

### 8 the unreasonably high cost compared to insignificant 

### 9 benefit. 

### 10 MR. CLARK: Thank you very much. 

### 11 MS. GALLOWAY: You're welcome. 

### 12 MR. CLARK: Mr. McGrath. 

### 13 MR. McGRATH: My name is Kevin McGrath and I 

### 14 reside in Roswell, Georgia. My name is spelled 

### 15 K-E-V-I-N, M-C-G-R-A-T-H. 

### 16 I represent Georgia Trout Unlimited as 

### 17 Chairman of its Back the Rookie program. Part of the 

### 18 National Fish Habitat Action Plan, eastern brook trout 

### 19 joint venture. And as President of Upper Chattahoochee 

### 20 Trout Unlimited in Roswell, Georgia, the largest 

### 21 chapter for Trout Unlimited in Georgia. 

### 22 Our mission is to conserve, protect and 

### 23 restore Georgia's cold water fisheries and their 

### 24 watersheds. I thank you for opportunity to offer 

### 25 comments.AGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 171 1 Now my, all my comments are short, but I 

### 2 promise to keep them brief as well. 

### 3 Realizing the proposed rules will cause 

### 4 utility rate increases, we believe the mercury, air 

### 5 toxics, sulfur dioxide, and nitrogen oxides regulations 

### 6 are reasonable and measured emissions restrictions that 

### 7 will provide tangible benefits, positive benefits for 

### 8 our health and the legacy we pass on to our children. 

### 9 Georgia joins with our national office in 

### 10 support of the proposed rules. 

### 11 Others have offered comments on health 

### 12 issues. We share their concerns, but due to time 

### 13 constraints, I'm going to direct my comments directly 

### 14 to natural resources. 

### 15 The gap in national standards for mercury 

### 16 emissions should and needs to be addressed. Power 

### 17 plants are the largest single source of mercury 

### 18 emissions period. 

### 19 Mercury is a poison that people are primarily 

### 20 exposed to through fish consumption and is the most 

### 21 common fish contaminant in the United States. 

### 22 Every state has at least one waterway that is 

### 23 under a fish consumption advisory and twenty-four 

### 24 states have statewide advisories warning against fish 

### 25 consumption. Here in Georgia, we have forty-fiveAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 172 1 streams, fifty lakes, six estuaries, the Okefenokee 

### 2 Swamp, and even the Atlantic Ocean with consumption 

### 3 advisories as issued by the Georgia Environmental 

### 4 Protection Division primarily for mercury, 

### 5 overwhelmingly for mercury. 

### 6 Depending on the level of exposure, wildlife 

### 7 and fish exposed to mercury and they die, have reduced 

### 8 fertility or complete reproductive failure as well as 

### 9 slower growth and other vulnerabilities. Research has 

### 10 linked mercury to decreased olfactory senses in trout, 

### 11 negatively effecting feeding, navigation, and spawning. 

### 12 That means less fish in our streams and game for 

### 13 sportsmen who contribute one point eight billion 

### 14 dollars to Georgia's economy annually and one hundred 

### 15 and sixty three billion dollars annually, nationally in 

### 16 revenue, taxes and jobs. Those figures are from the 

### 17 Congressional Sportsman's Foundation. 

### 18 Sulfur dioxide and nitrogen oxides are the 

### 19 leading cause of acid rain. Acidified streams damage 

### 20 fish and habitat both directly through acidity and 

### 21 indirectly through increased aluminum toxicity. This 

### 22 is one of the primary causes for reduced brook trout, 

### 23 the native fish in the Appalachian Mountains from Maine 

### 24 to Georgia and part of what the, the joint venture that 

### 25 I chair in Georgia is about.AGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 173 1 The technology that controls mercury and 

### 2 other air toxics effectively reduces sulfur dioxide and 

### 3 nitrogen oxides as well. It comes along with the deal. 

### 4The Great Smoky Mountains National Park 

### 5 receives the highest sulfur and nitrogen deposits of 

### 6 any national park from acid rain, acid fog, and dry 

### 7 particulate fall-out. 

### 8 The average PH of rainfall there is five to 

### 9 ten times higher than average rainfall. Forty percent 

### 10 of the sulfate deposition in the park has been sourced 

### 11 to Georgia. That comes from a Southern Appalachian 

### 12 Mountains Initiative, S-A-M-I, and Visual 

### 13 Improvement State and Tribal Association of Southeast, 

### 14V-I-S-T-A-S, Reports and directly from Steve Moore 

### 15 [phonetic] who's the fisheries biologist that I spoke 

### 16 with last weekend -- or two weekends ago. He's at the 

### 17 Great Smokey Mountains National Park. 

### 18 The Park receives acid deposition from as far 

### 19 away as Ohio and throughout the Midwest. Nitrogen 

### 20 levels in the park streams are approaching public 

### 21 health standards for drinking waters. And you would 

### 22 think the crown jewel in the east of the National Park 

### 23 system would have water that you could freely drink of. 

### 24While it will cost money in the future to 

### 25 implement the proposed standards, there is an economicAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 174 1 cost today in healthcare expenses, missed workdays, 

### 2 quality of life, diminished natural resources, and the 

### 3 legacy we will leave our children. 

### 4According to the EPA, the proposed standard 

### 5 would prevent ninety-one percent of mercury emissions 

### 6 from oil and coal powered plants and reduce acid gas 

### 7 and sulfur dioxide emissions from power plants by 

### 8 nine-one and fifty-five percent. The benefit -- this 

### 9 would benefit everyone, including both neighborhoods 

### 10 near power plants as well as communities, parks, and 

### 11 forests hundreds of miles away from a power plant. 

### 12 Georgia Trout Unlimited supports the proposed 

### 13 rule. 

### 14Thank you very much. 

### 15 MR. CLARK: Thank you both very much. Any 

### 16 questions guys? No. Carol Kemper, by the way, I 

### 17 should point out, has joined us on the panel, so from 

### 18 EPA Region Four. It's about -- okay. Thank you. 

### 19 The next speakers please, Alan Toney and 

### 20 James Capp. Mr. Toney, please feel free to start. 

### 21 MR. TONEY: Thank you. My name is Alan 

### 22 Toney, T-O-N-E-Y. I am Chairman of the Local Sewer and 

### 23 Water District. We're in -- you're in the Fulton 

### 24 District now and we welcome you. 

### 25 I'm not going to go through all the technicalAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 175 1 stuff that everybody -- that has been hashed over ten 

### 2 times already, but as far as I know, at least half of 

### 3 the mercury in the world comes from burning coal and 

### 4 forty-percent comes from power plants and Georgia has 

### 5 more than its share of power plants. I think we still 

### 6 sell power up the east coast. 

### 7 The winds here blow from west to east so all 

### 8 the power plants -- Southern Company's power plants, 

### 9 they all roll across Georgia. The -- and that's the 

### 10 reason for the bad numbers when you look at all the 

### 11 rivers in Georgia and the coast. 

### 12 Recently, my son who is an avid 

### 13 fisherman -- I am too -- caught a thirty-seven pound 

### 14 Cobia in the Savannah Fishing Channel. He called me up 

### 15 proudly to talk about his Cobia and how he had cooked 

### 16 it up for he and his new wife and all their friends in 

### 17 the neighborhood and how proud they were of it, and 

### 18 then he kind of casually said, "And by the way, we're 

### 19 trying to have a baby." I think great, you know. I 

### 20 didn't -- I -- he was totally unaware that Cobia had 

### 21 made the list for toxic mercury and you know, this is 

### 22 sort of an anecdote, but it just seems to me that 

### 23 there's something wrong in this world when you can't 

### 24 have something like that be joyous. You have to go back 

### 25 and say what about the mercury in the fish.AGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 176 1 And for those of you who don't know, Cobia is 

### 2 probably one of the best eating fishes on earth. It 

### 3 has great oils for your heart. It should be a 

### 4 wonderful thing, but now it's got mercury in it. 

### 5 And let me just -- I don't want to make this 

### 6 too long because you guys have been through a lot 

### 7 already. But I just want to respond to some of the 

### 8 economic things that have been said here that I found 

### 9 very troubling. 

### 10 I mean, I'm a capitalist and a businessman. 

### 11 I understand the cost of production pretty well, but I 

### 12 also understand that if you take an unfair advantage. 

### 13 If you're a polluter and you're not properly regulated, 

### 14 then you have an unfair advantage over other forms of 

### 15 production. And that's what Southern Company has done 

### 16 very effectively over the years, they have fought this 

### 17 tooth and nail for twenty years. And they've been very 

### 18 successful at it, but they're supposed to clean up 

### 19 their own mess and they're not doing that. And that, 

### 20 that's -- you know, they're a capitalist. That's what 

### 21 capitalist are supposed to do. You're supposed to 

### 22 bring your crony scientists in here and their business 

### 23 numbers that are kind of suspicious and all that kind 

### 24 of stuff and throw them at you, but that's what 

### 25 capitalism is. It's trying to lower the cost ofAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 177 1 production. 

### 2 But it's your job, as regulators, you stand 

### 3 for the people to protect us from that sort of thing. 

### 4 And to create a level playing field. 

### 5 The good thing about capitalism is it creates 

### 6 competition; fair competition. And when you have a 

### 7 level playing field because we have all the forms of 

### 8 production and they all get to compete fairly. When 

### 9 you, when you allow a polluter to pollute and when you 

### 10 make people who live downstream pay the price, high 

### 11 medical bills, so on and so forth, to subsidize that 

### 12 pollution, that's not what capitalist are supposed to 

### 13 work. 

### 14Just as we have regulations, that's the 

### 15 reason we have an EPA. That's the reason we do things 

### 16 in a civilized society to protect our citizens from 

### 17 unwarranted pollution. 

### 18 That's basically all I'm going to say. Thank 

### 19 you. 

### 20 MR. CLARK: Thank you. Mr. Capp. 

### 21 MR. CAPP: James Capp, C-A-P-P. Good 

### 22 afternoon. My name is James Capp. I'm the Chief of 

### 23 the Air Protection Branch of the Georgia Environmental 

### 24 Protection Division. 

### 25 I appreciate the opportunity to present someAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 178 1 preliminary thoughts on this very important proposed 

### 2 rule. I'm also appreciative that EPA is holding this 

### 3 hearing here in Atlanta. We hope that EPA will make a 

### 4 habit of holding hearings in Atlanta for important rule 

### 5 makings. 

### 6 Georgia EPD has a long and successful history 

### 7 in addressing air quality issues in the state and is 

### 8 proud of the improvements that we've made in the 

### 9 quality of life for our citizens. 

### 10 Georgia EPD has already done much to reduce 

### 11 emissions from coal-fired electricity generating units 

### 12 within our state. In an effort to ensure that these 

### 13 EGUs would be proactively reducing their emissions, 

### 14 Georgia EPD negotiated with stakeholders a very 

### 15 successful multi-pollutant rule for coal-fired power 

### 16 plants that requires significant reductions in key air 

### 17 pollutants including sulfur dioxide, nitrogen oxides, 

### 18 mercury, acid gas, hazardous air pollutants and 

### 19 particulate matter. 

### 20 These pollution controls are being phased in 

### 21 between 2008 and 2015. As part of this program, the 

### 22 two coal-fired EGUs at Georgia Power Plant McDonough 

### 23 located just northwest of downtown Atlanta, are being 

### 24 retired within the next year and are being replaced 

### 25 with state of the art natural gas-fired combustionAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 179 1 turbines. 

### 2 The net reduction in emissions resulting from 

### 3 this project alone is approximately twenty-eight 

### 4 thousand tons per year of sulfur dioxide, four thousand 

### 5 tons per year in nitrogen oxides and a hundred pounds 

### 6 of mercury. 

### 7 With regard to EPA's proposed rule, Georgia 

### 8 EPD believes that effective national regulation of 

### 9 hazardous air pollutant emissions from EGUs is number 

### 10 one required by the Clean Air Act. 

### 11 Number two from an environmental and public 

### 12 health perspective. 

### 13 And three, technically feasible and cost 

### 14 effective. 

### 15 The proposed rule will substantially reduce 

### 16 emissions of hazardous air pollutants from EGUs. In 

### 17 addition, the rule will result in significant 

### 18 reductions of sulfur dioxide and particulate matter 

### 19 emissions. 

### 20 Coal-fired power plants are the largest 

### 21 emitters of air toxic and criteria pollutants in the 

### 22 United States. Accordingly the benefits to public 

### 23 health and welfare that will result from a well

### 24 considered rule are substantial. 

### 25 The initial reductions from this rule willAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 180 1 help states meet their obligations under the Clean Air 

### 2 Act for the sulfur dioxide, national ambient air 

### 3 quality standard. The fine particulate matter national 

### 4 ambient air quality standard and regional haze. 

### 5 The final regulation must meet both the 

### 6 letter and the intent of the statute and strike the 

### 7 appropriate balance in protecting public health while 

### 8 avoiding the imposition of unnecessary cost on a 

### 9 regulated community. We sincerely hope that EPA has 

### 10 learned a valuable lesson from its missteps on the 

### 11 industrial boiler MACT regarding the achievability of 

### 12 emission limits. 

### 13 If EPA is unable to adopt the standard in a 

### 14 timely fashion, or if it fails to adhere to the statute 

### 15 and the rule is overturned, the public health benefits 

### 16 will be delayed and states will be at a significant 

### 17 disadvantage to meet their clean air act obligations; 

### 18 most notably for the sulfur dioxide national ambient 

### 19 air quality standard. 

### 20 Again, I would like to thank EPA for holding 

### 21 this hearing in Atlanta, and we will likely be 

### 22 preparing more detailed comments for the docket. 

### 23 MR. CLARK: Great. Great. Thank you very 

### 24much. Questions guys? Thank you. 

### 25 Joy Kramer and Thelma Heywood please.AGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 181 1 Excuse me. Ms. Kramer, feel free to start. 

### 2 MS. KRAMER: Good afternoon. I think it's 

### 3 afternoon now. My name is Joy Kramer, K-R-A-M-E-R and 

### 4 I am the Director of Programs for the Georgia Solar 

### 5 Energy Association. We are membership supported non

### 6 profit that represents over two thousand small 

### 7 businesses, entrepreneurs, and concerned citizens in 

### 8 Georgia who are benefitting from the deployment of 

### 9 renewable energy and who care about clean air and 

### 10 water. 

### 11 Nationally, the renewable industry is growing 

### 12 at twenty-six percent annually, while the overall 

### 13 economy remains at a scant two percent growth rate. 

### 14 Research has shown that the majority of those in 

### 15 Georgia who are employed now full-time in the solar 

### 16 industry come from sectors that were hardest hit with 

### 17 the downturn in the economy; construction, engineering, 

### 18 electrical, and HVAC. 

### 19 These are not just sound bites. These are 

### 20 real jobs. 

### 21 You heard earlier about jobs in Putnam 

### 22 County. While we applaud Georgia Power for creating 

### 23 jobs in one county alone, solar energy produces jobs 

### 24 all over Georgia and it produces more jobs per megawatt 

### 25 than coal and nuclear by far with no environmentalAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 182 1 risk. 

### 2 There are no solar spills. There are no 

### 3 solar explosions and no solar leakage, solar leakage 

### 4 into our waterways. 

### 5 Here in Georgia, solar farms are being new 

### 6 revenues to middle and north Georgia farmers. These 

### 7 are dollars that would otherwise have gone to big 

### 8 utilities. 

### 9 The U.S. military has recognized the use of 

### 10 fossil fuels as a national security risk and is 

### 11 deploying solar throughout Afghanistan and Iraq. You 

### 12 don't have to believe in climate change to want clean 

### 13 air and water and to recognize the nationwide economic 

### 14 benefits of energy [indecipherable -- coughing]. 

### 15 Whether it's big utilities, big oil, big 

### 16 insurance, or big government, there seems to be a 

### 17 universal belief that big is bad. It inhibits real, 

### 18 true competition. New business opportunities, which 

### 19 are the backbone of our economy and it has a limited 

### 20 social conscience. 

### 21 You've heard people call this a political 

### 22 agenda and are encouraged 

### 23 to look at the facts, yet big utilities have hidden the 

### 24 true cost of coal for decades. The facts are indeed 

### 25 hard to find and this is by design.AGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 183 1 We know what mercury and SO2 can do. I too 

### 2 played with mercury as a child. I also developed 

### 3 lymphoma in 2005 and nearly died. Can you relate the 

### 4 two? Who knows. But through tighter and enforceable 

### 5 restrictions, the EPA can take a giant step forward in 

### 6 counting the true cost of coal as an energy generation 

### 7 source and propel the renewable energy industry forward 

### 8 towards a healthier and more vibrant future for our 

### 9 children and grandchildren. 

### 10 One last note about affordability. With big 

### 11 investment comes big rewards. It will be costly to 

### 12 implement these new standards, but with two billion in 

### 13 profits last year, we feel like it's an affordable 

### 14 thing for Southern Company to do. 

### 15 Thank you very much for your time. 

### 16 MR. CLARK: Thank you very much. Ms. Heywood. 

### 17 MS. HEYWOOD: Good afternoon. My name is 

### 18 Thelma, T-H-E-L-M-A Heywood, H-E-Y-W-O-O-D. 

### 19 I'm looking at these lights, these tracks of 

### 20 lights and apparently the message from President Lyndon 

### 21 Johnson -- well, the sticker's missing over the light 

### 22 switch to turn out the lights. There are other ways we 

### 23 can cut, you know? I'm learning all kinds of ways. 

### 24 I'm one of those hangers on by the fingernails. I'm 

### 25 learning all kinds of ways to save.AGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 184 1 The room feels like a meat locker in here. 

### 2 We can cut it ten degrees. 

### 3 MR. CLARK: I'm, I'm with you on that. 

### 4MS. HEYWOOD: Thank you. I am a substitute 

### 5 teacher in five elementary public schools. And I came 

### 6 here -- I was compelled to come here when I learned 

### 7 about this hearing and I thank you for having it. 

### 8 I want to tell you about a scene that I saw 

### 9 in a public elementary school in which there were nine 

### 10 little children sitting on benches outside a school 

### 11 clinic and they were, all of them, using nebulizers, so 

### 12 that they could breathe with less pain. So that they 

### 13 could breathe deeper and I have to tell you that, I've 

### 14 never seen that many children using nebulizers before. 

### 15 For those of you who don't know what a 

### 16 nebulizer is, it's a device that has tubes and it has a 

### 17 hose for you to put to your mouth with a mouth piece so 

### 18 that you can mist air into your lungs with medication. 

### 19 I did not know about nebulizers when I came 

### 20 here. Neither did my daughter. She happens to be a 

### 21 Type I juvenile diabetic. She's also a certified 

### 22 educator in the State of Georgia. 

### 23 After we came here, she started to cough. 

### 24 She coughed and hacked, and coughed and hacked for 

### 25 three months that summer before she started teaching.AGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 185 1 She finally cracked a rib. 

### 2 Today, we know about nebulizers. We use 

### 3 them. We know about inhalers. We had to learn to use 

### 4 those too. She can't have the standard, the usual 

### 5 treatment for asthma. She can't have cortisone because 

### 6 of her diabetes so she truly suffers. 

### 7 Along with the other children who miss 

### 8 learning time, sitting outside that clinic on those 

### 9 nebulizers. 

### 10 I, I'm going to be mercifully brief and I'm 

### 11 going to leave you with one thought. You might, if you 

### 12 are a healthy individual, you might survive for a month 

### 13 without food. You might -- well, your kidneys might 

### 14 scream about it, but you might survive for a week 

### 15 without fluids, but you will be brain dead within three 

### 16 to four minutes without air. And that's the message 

### 17 that I really wanted to get across to you. 

### 18 Thank you so much for your time. 

### 19 MR. CLARK: Thank you very much for coming to 

### 20 speak to us and I guess no questions, so thank you. 

### 21 Okay. Then our last two speakers before the 

### 22 break would be Roger Mills and Sean Hutchins, please. 

### 23 Are you Mr. Mills? 

### 24MR. MILLS: Roger Mills is my name, 

### 25 R-O-G-E-R, M-I-L-L-S. I'm just a living breathing humanAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 186 1 being. I don't represent any organization, any 

### 2 industry, any interest group, but only my children and 

### 3 grandchildren. 

### 4As the EPA has pointed out, the existing 

### 5 coal-fired and oil-fired electric utility plants, at 

### 6 least until now, have been the largest unregulated 

### 7 industrial source of air toxics. 

### 8 You've determined that forty-four percent of 

### 9 all of the coal-fired plants lack adequate pollution 

### 10 control equipment. 

### 11 The proposed toxic rule would, if 

### 12 implemented, reduce emissions of mercury in burned coal 

### 13 by ninety-one percent and therefore methyl mercury as 

### 14 well, and reduce concentrations of fine particles as 

### 15 well. 

### 16 The technology to meet these standards is 

### 17 already widely available and economically feasible to 

### 18 meet on a continuous basis. 

### 19 Please do not allow the standards to be 

### 20 weakened. Do not allow further delay based on flawed 

### 21 EEI reports or based on PR efforts by scare tactics of 

### 22 utility companies and other lobbyists. 

### 23 We've heard today things, for example, like 

### 24 arguments that well this will only regulate a small 

### 25 amount of the things that need to be regulated in theAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 187 1 air. That, that the amount that's an immediately 

### 2 environment compared to the amount in the whole world 

### 3 is minuscule, but that's not a reason not to regulate 

### 4 the amount that's here. 

### 5 We've also heard speakers that have made 

### 6 soul-searching pleas on behalf of low income people, on 

### 7 behalf of consumers, on behalf of the unemployed, and 

### 8 on behalf of persons of color. Who are making these 

### 9 arguments? They're not people who themselves are low 

### 10 income or who are unemployed or who are persons of 

### 11 color. They are instead persons of private industry 

### 12 falsely trying to use these sub-populations to further 

### 13 delay and stop what's going to be good for everybody. 

### 14I ask you to go ahead, get it done, get it 

### 15 done now and no further delay, no watering down. 

### 16 Thank you. 

### 17 I'd like to also request permission to revise 

### 18 and extend my remarks -- 

### 19 MR. CLARK: Absolutely. 

### 20 MR. MILLS: -- in written form subsequent to 

### 21 the proceeding. 

### 22 MR. CLARK: Absolutely. 

### 23 MR. MILLS: Great. Thank you. Mr. Hutchins. 

### 24MR. HUTCHINS: My name is Sean Hutchins, 

### 25 H-U-T-C-H-I-N-S. I'm from Berea College, well that'sAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 188 1 where I drove from, from Kentucky. I was born in 

### 2 Bardstown, Kentucky. I'm majoring in technology and 

### 3 industrial arts and I have a minor in sustainability 

### 4 and environmental studies. 

### 5 I grew up the son of an avid outdoors man and 

### 6 he loved to fish, even if it were the dead of winter, 

### 7 he would go out and cut a hole in the ice and he would 

### 8 still fish. So naturally, we ate fish pretty much year 

### 9 round as I was growing up; me, my mother, and my 

### 10 father. 

### 11 And it disturbs me, being a fisherman myself, 

### 12 that I can't eat many of the fish that comes out of my 

### 13 state's waters because our state ranks sixth among 

### 14mercury levels in our environment. 

### 15 My mother had another son by my stepfather, 

### 16 and his name is Alex. He has severe autism. He's 

### 17 thirteen years old. She believes that this was caused 

### 18 by mercury contamination from the fish. It could be. 

### 19 It could not be, but it's already known that mercury 

### 20 causes neurological development issues, memory 

### 21 problems, and a slew of other health effects of which 

### 22 you've heard very much of today. 

### 23 She's a single mother of three and she's been 

### 24 a strong advocate for autism awareness in Kentucky and 

### 25 if these regulations were put into place, over ninetyAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 189 1 percent of mercury and much other highly toxic 

### 2 chemicals will be removed from industrial output and 

### 3 these regulations will also create a good number of 

### 4 jobs both temporary construction jobs, and more 

### 5 permanent utility jobs. 

### 6 Profits should never take priority over 

### 7 public health, over human lives. Mercury is being 

### 8 pumped into our air and into our water. It affects us 

### 9 all. 

### 10 Thank you very much. 

### 11 MR. CLARK: Thank you both very much. Any 

### 12 questions guys? Okay. Thank you for your testimony 

### 13 and thank everyone that has testified for taking time 

### 14 out of your busy days to come and, and be with us. We 

### 15 appreciate it very much. Especially those of you that 

### 16 have come long distances and apparently paid high, high 

### 17 amounts of parking, so anyway, we will reconvene the 

### 18 hearing at two p.m. I'm being told. Okay. Two p.m. 

### 19 Thank you. 

### 20 (Lunch break from 1:00 p.m. until 2:05 p.m.) 

### 21 MR. CLARK: All right. As soon as Rich is 

### 22 ready, we'll go. Okay. I'd like to reconvene the 

### 23 hearing and thank you all very much for coming and 

### 24 attending public hearing on our proposed regulations to 

### 25 reduce toxics -- mercury, and other air toxics fromAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 190 1 power plants. 

### 2 I have a written statement that I read this 

### 3 morning. I'm not going to go through the whole thing 

### 4 here today. There's a copy of it out, out on the table 

### 5 for those that would like to see it. 

### 6 But I would like to talk a little bit about, 

### 7 just very quickly, about the rule and about how we're 

### 8 going to operate here. 

### 9 This is the third of, of three public 

### 10 hearings that we've been holding around the country. 

### 11 We held one in Chicago and one in Philadelphia on, on 

### 12 Tuesday and, and this is the third of the -- with me. 

### 13 My name is Jeff Clark. I'm the Associate 

### 14 Director for the EPA's Office of Air Quality Planning 

### 15 and Standards which is located in Research Triangle 

### 16 Park, North Carolina and we're the lead office 

### 17 responsible for developing these rules. 

### 18 Kevin Culligan is going to join us in a, in a 

### 19 bit. He's been called away to do a Congressional 

### 20 Briefing so, so he'll be back in a little bit to, to 

### 21 sit with us as well. Bill Maxwell, from my office, is 

### 22 the lead author of, of the rule and has been working on 

### 23 this issue for at least, at least twenty-one years. 

### 24 Certainly since the 1990 amendment. And then Carol 

### 25 Kemper is Deputy Division Director for the, for AirAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 191 1 Toxics and Pesticides here in EPA region four which 

### 2 includes the surrounding eight states. 

### 3 Again, short, short of reading the entire 

### 4 statement, let me just say that currently there are no 

### 5 existing federal requirements for power plants to limit 

### 6 their emissions of toxic air pollutants like mercury 

### 7 and arsenic and metals. 

### 8 And the prior administration, EPA, in the 

### 9 previous, prior administration had finalized a rule to 

### 10 cut mercury pollution from power plants, but the DC 

### 11 Circuit Court struck down that rule as illegal and 

### 12 required us to develop standards that follow the law 

### 13 and the science in order to protect human health and 

### 14 the environment. 

### 15 So we're accepting oral comments here today 

### 16 and certainly if you have written comments that you'd 

### 17 like to include, leave with us as well. We'd be happy 

### 18 to take them either here for preferably leave them with 

### 19 the folks out at the desk. 

### 20 The public comment period for, for additional 

### 21 written comments is -- goes until July the fifth and 

### 22 these transcripts from these hearings will be included 

### 23 in, in the docket for that -- the record for the rule 

### 24making as well. 

### 25 We're scheduled to, under a consent decreeAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 192 1 with the Court, to issue a final rule by November the 

### 2 16 of this year. 

### 3 The way -- just for folks that 

### 4 weren't here this morning, let me just how we're doing 

### 5 this. We have a fairly full schedule of speakers and 

### 6 so we're trying, for fairness to everybody to try to 

### 7 hold folks to, to five minutes if we can and so we have 

### 8 a light system here that you'll have a green light that 

### 9 will last for four minutes while you speak and then it 

### 10 turns to yellow which basically says you've got a 

### 11 minute to sum up, and then it will start flashing red 

### 12 which means if you haven't concluded, if you could 

### 13 conclude then, that -- we appreciate that very much. 

### 14 Most people were pretty good about that this morning, I 

### 15 think. 

### 16 With that, let me say we'll go ahead and 

### 17 start and our first two speakers are already here with 

### 18 us. I'm asking that you come up two at a time and, and 

### 19 that both of you stay through the speak -- through, 

### 20 through the other person's testimony as well, so that 

### 21 way if we have any questions, we can do it in as least 

### 22 disruptive way as possible. 

### 23 Our first two speakers are Seandra Rawls and 

### 24 Eriqah Foreman-Williams and they're here and if you -- 

### 25 when you state your name, if you could spell it for theAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 193 1 court reporter, Rich, who as I said this morning is the 

### 2 most important man in the room and if he's happy, we're 

### 3 happy, so thank you. So Ms. Rawls. 

### 4MS. RAWLS: Sure. Good afternoon again. My 

### 5 name is Seandra Rawls, S-E-A-N-D-R-A, R-A-W-L-S and I'm 

### 6 the Diversity and Community Partnership's Coordinator 

### 7 for the Southern Alliance for Clean Energy based here 

### 8 in Atlanta, Georgia. 

### 9 As my colleague stated this morning, we are a 

### 10 regional organization representing citizens across the 

### 11 heavily coal dependent states of the southeast. 

### 12 I am here today in support of EPA's authority 

### 13 and decision to set strong national standards for 

### 14mercury pollution from coal-fired power plants that 

### 15 will protect public health and environmental health 

### 16 especially for low income families and communities of 

### 17 color who suffer more from mercury impacts than others. 

### 18 Mercury is a potent toxin and exposures can 

### 19 cause a variety of health problems from learning 

### 20 disorders to heart attacks. 

### 21 A research summary by EPA shows that mercury 

### 22 exposure can have even greater impacts on certain 

### 23 groups of recreational and subsistence anglers, 

### 24 including low income southeaster white populations, low 

### 25 income southeastern African Americans, low income womenAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 194 1 across the country and Hispanics across the country. 

### 2 Low income southeastern African Americans are 

### 3 particularly at risk losing as many as twelve IQ points 

### 4 due to mercury exposure. 

### 5 Humans are exposed to the most toxic form of 

### 6 mercury pollution when it accumulates in watersheds and 

### 7 enters our bodies through the fish we eat. African 

### 8 Americans are avid fishermen and low income African 

### 9 Americans, in particular, are more likely to eat what 

### 10 they catch, eat more of it and be less aware of health 

### 11 advisories than others. 

### 12 Consequently, African Americans have higher 

### 13 exposure to mercury. According to a report written by 

### 14 a coalition of environmental justice leaders and 

### 15 advocates, titled Air of Injustice, in 1996 there were 

### 16 one point eight million licensed African Americans 

### 17 anglers who spent over eight hundred and thirteen 

### 18 million dollars on fishing trips and equipment and this 

### 19 number doesn't include the millions of African 

### 20 Americans fishermen who may not have registered for 

### 21 fishing licenses nor reported their expenditures. 

### 22 But exposure is not restricted only to those 

### 23 who fish and consume the catch. According to a recent 

### 24 report from the American Lung Association, coal-fired 

### 25 utility power plants produce more hazardous airAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 195 1 pollution in the U.S. than any other industrial 

### 2 pollution sources, accounting for ninety-nine percent 

### 3 of all U.S. mercury emissions from the power sector. 

### 4 People living near coal-fired power plants 

### 5 have an increased risk of exposure and children, 

### 6 seniors, pregnant women and those who have chronic 

### 7 diseases face even higher risks. 

### 8 What's more, African Americans are more likely 

### 9 to live near coal-fired power plants and power plant 

### 10 waste sites. 

### 11 The Air of Injustice Report also states that 

### 12 sixty-eight percent of African Americans live within 

### 13 thirty miles of a coal plant as opposed to fifty-six 

### 14 percent of whites and that African Americans comprise 

### 15 thirteen percent of the U.S. population, they account 

### 16 for seventeen percent of the population living within 

### 17 five miles of power plant waste sites. 

### 18 EPA Administrator Jackson has made 

### 19 environmental justice a priority and current -- and 

### 20 encourages all EPA staff to focus efforts that will 

### 21 help people in underserved and highly vulnerable 

### 22 populations. 

### 23 A quick complete approval of this draft will 

### 24 one of the most significant moves she can make to truly 

### 25 protect at risk individuals from undue environmentalAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 196 1 harms. 

### 2 For these reasons and more, we urge EPA to 

### 3 establish a strong rule to set limits on mercury 

### 4 pollution and to ensure the best standards become law 

### 5 to protect all of us from life threatening pollution 

### 6 that power plants currently spew into our air and 

### 7 water. 

### 8 I'd like to thank EPA for convening an open 

### 9 comment process to involve all stakeholders impacted 

### 10 by this rule and for the opportunity to provide input 

### 11 into the rule making for new mercury standards. 

### 12 Thank you. 

### 13 MR. CLARK: Thank you very much. Ms. Williams. 

### 14MS. WILLIAMS: Thank you very much. My name 

### 15 Eriqah, Foreman-Williams. First Eriqah, E-R-I-Q-A-H, 

### 16 last name Foreman-Williams, F-O-R-E-M-A-N - 

### 17 W-I-L-L-I-A-M-S. 

### 18 I am the Georgia Coal Diversity Organizer for 

### 19 the Southern Alliance for Clean Energy. We're an 

### 20 organization that focuses on advocating for clean 

### 21 energy choices that will ensure clean, safe, and 

### 22 healthy communities. 

### 23 The Clean Air Act Amendments, which are 

### 24 almost older than me, are supposed to do just that. 

### 25 Keep me and all other young people safe and healthy.AGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 197 1 However, twenty years later, I find myself here today 

### 2 fighting for my right to breathe clean air; a battle 

### 3 seemingly fought and won with the Act and the 1990 

### 4 Amendments, but still up for debate. 

### 5 Now as a woman and looking forward to one day 

### 6 having a family of my own, I have grown more concerned 

### 7 about my well-being and that of future generations. 

### 8 Working for the Southern Alliance for Clean Energy has 

### 9 given me a first -- has given me firsthand experience 

### 10 on the impacts that mercury pollution has on public 

### 11 health, especially for lower income families and 

### 12 communities of color. 

### 13 I've learned that African Americans are 

### 14 disproportionately impacted by pollution from coal 

### 15 plants and suffer from many environmental injustices. 

### 16 A study by Energy Justice dot net shows that, 

### 17 as Seandra said, in 1996, one point eight million 

### 18 African Americans were licensed fishermen. When coal 

### 19 plants deposit this dangerous toxin into waterways, not 

### 20 only can it endanger the lives of fishermen, but the 

### 21 lives of their families as well. 

### 22 Mercury pollution also extends beyond the 

### 23 fishermen. When mercury is deposited in the water, it 

### 24 accumulates in fish tissue, so it isn't just fishermen 

### 25 who are in and around the water that are at risk, butAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 198 1 anybody who regularly eats fish, particularly young 

### 2 children and expectant or breast feeding mothers. 

### 3 Just by stopping at a local diner for a fish 

### 4 dinner on a trip from Atlanta to Savannah can increase 

### 5 your exposure and your risk. 

### 6 As a future mother of hopefully a big, 

### 7 healthy family, I support EPA's decision to regulate 

### 8 mercury disposal. 

### 9 I don't want to have to worry about my 

### 10 children's safety or deny them the opportunity to swim 

### 11 in a local lake near our house or eat the fish we catch 

### 12 there. I want to someday be able to breast feed my 

### 13 children and not worry about whether or not the 

### 14 nutrition I think I'm giving them is actually dangerous 

### 15 to their health. 

### 16 This all seems very surreal at times and 

### 17 sometimes I feel hopeless, but being here today reminds 

### 18 me that you, the EPA, has the authority and the power 

### 19 to act in the best interest of my and everyone's 

### 20 health. 

### 21 By putting a cap on mercury emissions, we can 

### 22 all be protected against excessive amount of exposure 

### 23 and therefore have one less environmental issue to 

### 24 worry about. 

### 25 Thank you very much.AGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 199 1 MR. CLARK: Thank you very much. Any 

### 2 questions, folks? Appreciate your testimony very much. 

### 3 Thank you. 

### 4Next two speakers please, Emily Enderle. I 

### 5 hope that's close, and Danny Schweinhart and you can 

### 6 correct me on the pronunciation, so. Thank you 

### 7 ma'am -- because how would I know? Okay. Ms. Enderle, 

### 8 if you'll feel free when you're ready. 

### 9 MS. ENDERLE: Thank you. My name is Emily 

### 10 Enderle, last name spelled, E-N-D-E-R-L-E and I'm here 

### 11 to express my support for the EPA to finalize a 

### 12 reducing toxic air emissions from power plants standard 

### 13 and ensuring that it's at least as stringent as that 

### 14 has been proposed. 

### 15 On behalf of the two hundred and twenty 

### 16 thousand supporters of Earth Justice, I am here to 

### 17 thank the EPA for hosting a hearing in Atlanta, 

### 18 especially in the heart of EPA region four. 

### 19 The burden of coal combustion and ultimately 

### 20 the threat of diseases and death brought about by air 

### 21 pollution is borne unequally by people of color and low 

### 22 income communities and that can clearly be seen in 

### 23 region four. 

### 24I'm here as a legislative representative in 

### 25 the Washington D.C. office of Earth Justice, theAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 200 1 nation's largest non-profit environmental law firm, and 

### 2 also as a concerned citizen, that has seen the impacts 

### 3 of poor, poor air quality on the people that I love. 

### 4I spent much of my formative years in a rural 

### 5 town in Ohio. My two constant companions were my 

### 6 sister and her inhaler. 

### 7 I also spent two years teaching severely 

### 8 behaviorally handicapped students in Loraine, Ohio, and 

### 9 what we've seen is autism, ADHD, and other intellectual 

### 10 and developmental disorders are on the rise and there 

### 11 have been increasing peer reviewed studies that 

### 12 demonstrate the linkage between exposure to toxic 

### 13 chemicals and those particular ailments. 

### 14My sister and a lot of my students suffered 

### 15 from chronic asthma even though we lived in a rural 

### 16 part of Ohio. Our air quality was definitely 

### 17 negatively impacted everyday from pollution coming from 

### 18 coal-fired power plants throughout the state. 

### 19 As many of you know, and many have mentioned, 

### 20 power plants are the largest source of many and 

### 21 dangerous air pollutants. They are responsible for 

### 22 fifty percent of mercury emissions, over fifty percent 

### 23 of acid gas emissions and about twenty-five percent of 

### 24 toxic metal emissions in the United States. 

### 25 Pollutants like arsenic, chromium and nickelAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 201 1 can cause cancer. 

### 2 Exposure to fine particulate pollution leads 

### 3 to premature death, heart attacks, bronchitis and 

### 4 asthma episodes. 

### 5 Despite the availability of proven control 

### 6 technologies and more than twenty years since the 1990 

### 7 Clean Air Act Amendments were passed, there's still no 

### 8 existing federal standards that require power plants to 

### 9 limit their toxic air emissions for things like 

### 10 mercury, arsenic, and other metals. 

### 11 Watching a loved one suffer through an asthma 

### 12 attack where their life relies on access to an inhaler 

### 13 is harrowing and something I would never wish on 

### 14 anyone. 

### 15 The mercury air toxics rule that has been 

### 16 proposed by the EPA will prevent as many as a hundred 

### 17 and ten thousand asthma attacks every year. That is 

### 18 countless people who will not have to struggle to 

### 19 breathe. 

### 20 Other health benefits include saving 

### 21 seventeen thousand lives each year, preventing up to 

### 22 eleven thousand heart attacks each year, eliminating 

### 23 twelve thousand, two hundred hospitalizations and 

### 24 emergency room visits every year. That's eight hundred 

### 25 and fifty thousand days when people don't have to missAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 202 1 work every year to either take care of themselves or 

### 2 their family members and it's also five point one 

### 3 million days where people must restrict their 

### 4 activities that will be avoided. 

### 5 These health benefits amount to a savings as 

### 6 large as one hundred and forty billion dollars or 

### 7 thirteen dollars for each dollar invested each year in 

### 8 savings to the public. 

### 9 Additionally, EPA estimates the proposed rule 

### 10 will provide employment for thousands by supporting a 

### 11 thirty-one thousand short-term construction jobs and 

### 12 nine thousand long-term utility jobs. These include 

### 13 jobs, manufacturing, installing, and maintaining the 

### 14 emission control technology. 

### 15 I have particular interest in seeing power 

### 16 plants being cleaned up in region four, as the region 

### 17 is now the home for my asthmatic sister who is pregnant 

### 18 and my nephew. 

### 19 It's also a region where power plants are 

### 20 disproportionately impacting communities of color and 

### 21 low income communities in even higher numbers than the 

### 22 national average. 

### 23 The air pollution from coal-fired power 

### 24 plants pose a considerable threat to many communities, 

### 25 but especially those where they're already overAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 203 1 burdened by pollution. 

### 2 As we've heard today, coal plants are 

### 3 disproportionately located in areas with high 

### 4 percentages of people of color and low income 

### 5 communities. We have sixty-eight percent of the 

### 6 African Americans population living within thirty miles 

### 7 of the power plant. 

### 8 Earth Justice has done a pretty significant 

### 9 environmental justice assessment of where coal-fired 

### 10 power plants are located and the different types of 

### 11 populations that are around them. 

### 12 One of the things I will be submitting with 

### 13 my comments and then also with our more substantive 

### 14 comments are several maps, which show these are 

### 15 specific to Atlanta, where the coal-fired power plants 

### 16 are in the Atlanta area and then also where you see 

### 17 things like hazardous air pollutants and so you can see 

### 18 there's a direct correlation between where those are 

### 19 located, where low-income communities are, where people 

### 20 of color are and where the pollution is. 

### 21 Ultimately, region four, I think is a 

### 22 particularly site to host a hearing like this because 

### 23 it definitely illustrates exactly this point; people 

### 24 that are below income and are communities of color are 

### 25 definitely being disproportionately impacted by thisAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 204 1 air pollution and I'm here again to signal the support 

### 2 from Earth Justice, our two hundred thousand plus 

### 3 supporters and ask you guys to finalize a rule that 

### 4 really is health protective. 

### 5 Thank you. 

### 6 MR. CLARK: Okay. Thank you very much. 

### 7 Mr. Schweinhart. 

### 8 MR. SCHWEINHART: My name is Danny 

### 9 Schweinhart, S-C-H-W-E-I-N-H-A-R-T. I'm from 

### 10 Louisville, Kentucky. I live in a neighborhood called 

### 11 Riverside Gardens. It's adjacent to a power plant, 

### 12 Cane Run Power Plant. 

### 13 The stuff that comes out of the stack, comes 

### 14 over our neighborhood and drops on our, on our cars, in 

### 15 our pools, on snow, everything. That's something our 

### 16 parents told us when we was kids, don't eat that brown 

### 17 snow. Also told us not to eat yellow snow either. 

### 18 But, but we're plagued with problems down 

### 19 there, especially from the plant. We've got enough 

### 20 pollution down there. 

### 21 LG&E -- Kathy Little lives right 

### 22 across the street and they have a sixteen story 

### 23 mountain of that coal ash that they piled up. It's 

### 24 almost full. Now they've applied for a permit to put 

### 25 another coal ash on their property, which is right nextAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 205 1 door to our, our neighborhood and you know, we've got 

### 2 enough pollution down there. We've got rubber town to 

### 3 the side of us, nothing but chemical companies. 

### 4At the end of our neighborhood, we've got 

### 5 Lee's [phonetic] Lane landfill. Way back in the 

### 6 sixties and seventies, illegal dumping was put back 

### 7 there. The owner would charge a hundred dollars to 

### 8 open the gates at twelve o'clock midnight and a hundred 

### 9 dollars, truck after truck, after truck come in and 

### 10 dump barrels. 

### 11 In 1985, they -- the Superfund 

### 12 came in and clean these barrels out. They still find 

### 13 them barrels back there. 

### 14We used to fish the Ohio River. We used to 

### 15 bring home the fish that we ate. We used to hunt 

### 16 squirrel, I mean shoot squirrels back there and we ate 

### 17 the squirrels. As a kid growing up, I had learning 

### 18 disabilities. I didn't do good in school and a lot of 

### 19 the people in the neighborhood also. My dad, a super 

### 20 smart guy, book smart, common sense smart, made 

### 21 straight A's through school and college. I made 

### 22 nothing but C's, and D's, and F's. In fact, one time 

### 23 he talked--he was helping me with my homework and he 

### 24 got frustrated with me and he said, I can't believe a 

### 25 son of mine is so damn dumb. You know, that'sAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 206 1 something that a, that a kid don't want to hear from 

### 2 his parents. 

### 3 There are several deaths in our neighborhood 

### 4 of cancer. My sister just died of lung cancer a year 

### 5 ago. My uncles died of lung cancer. His son died at 

### 6 age of eight of brain cancer. It, it's -- we've just 

### 7 got so much pollution, we don't need any more. 

### 8 And that's about all I got to say. 

### 9 MR. CLARK: Okay. Thank you. What, what is 

### 10 the power plant that you said that's, that's near you? 

### 11 MR. SCHWEINHART: The nearest one nearest me 

### 12 is Hexion. 

### 13 MR. CLARK: Hexion. 

### 14MR. SCHWEINHART: That's right next door to 

### 15 our neighborhood to one side. 

### 16 We've already gotten them to clean up some of 

### 17 their problems that we've been having with them. We'd 

### 18 just like to see the other companies do the same thing. 

### 19 MR. CLARK: Okay. Okay thank you. Thank 

### 20 you, thank you both very much for coming. 

### 21 Okay. Alexei Laushkin and Reverend Richard 

### 22 Cizik, Cizik. Cizik, thank you. Both good candidates 

### 23 for spelling, I think. 

### 24MR. LAUSHKIN: Thank you and good afternoon. 

### 25 MR. CLARK: Sure.AGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 207 1 MR. LAUSHKIN: My name is Alexei Laushkin and 

### 2 I'm speaking to you today, today as a citizen of the 

### 3 State of Virginia. 

### 4MR. CLARK: And you will spell it for, for 

### 5 the court reporter? 

### 6 MR. LAUSHKIN: Sure. 

### 7 MR. CLARK: Thank you. 

### 8 MR. LAUSHKIN: Alexei, A-L-E-X-E-I, Laushkin, 

### 9 L-A-U-S-H-K-I-N. 

### 10 MR. CLARK: Thank you. 

### 11 MR. LAUSHKIN: Again, I'm speaking to you 

### 12 today as a citizen of the State of Virginia and a 

### 13 Senior Director of Communications for the Evangelical 

### 14 Environmental Network, an organization of Christians 

### 15 who advocate care for God's creation. 

### 16 I live in Alexandria, Virginia, with my wife 

### 17 Cassandra. 

### 18 Thank you for giving me the opportunity to 

### 19 testify today in support of EPA's proposed standards on 

### 20 mercury emissions. 

### 21 My home state of Virginia faces 

### 22 disproportionate impacts from mercury deposited from 

### 23 local sources. 

### 24In some parts of the state, over half of all 

### 25 the mercury is coming from local sources of emission.AGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 208 1 Of this number, over fifty percent of domestic 

### 2 anthropogenic mercury emissions come from coal burning 

### 3 power plants making them the largest source. 

### 4The proposed mercury rule would reduce over 

### 5 eighty percent of mercury from said power plants and 

### 6 over half of the sulfur dioxide from those plants. The 

### 7 good news is that some power plants from around the 

### 8 country already have this sort of technology that would 

### 9 allow them to comply with this proposed rule. 

### 10 The industry working together with local 

### 11 communities can do better, and indeed we all must do 

### 12 better to ensure the health of our children. 

### 13 As a local issue, Virginians have a vested 

### 14 interest in lowering the amount of mercury pollution in 

### 15 our local environments. In fact, our fellow 

### 16 southeastern states would stand to benefit the most, 

### 17 from my perspective, from the EPA's proposed rule. 

### 18 Mercury turns up in the fish we eat. Almost 

### 19 every state in the nation has a mercury catch warning 

### 20 restricting and limiting the amount of fish we can eat 

### 21 from our local streams. 

### 22 In a business as usual approach, can you 

### 23 imagine that the very activity your grandfathers, my 

### 24 grandfather, all of our grandfathers took us out 

### 25 towards, going fishing and then cooking that fish, thatAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 209 1 we won't be able to do that with our grandchildren and 

### 2 that our children's children won't be able to do that 

### 3 either in a business as usual approach. 

### 4Will we, as Francis Schaeffer, famous 

### 5 evangelical apologist, once said in his Pollution and 

### 6 the Death of Man become a society that has killed its 

### 7 very soul in pursuit of things that will never satisfy 

### 8 him? Who are we willing to sacrifice for our own ways? 

### 9 I want to explain for a moment why the 

### 10 evangelical community is here and engaged in this 

### 11 important issue. 

### 12 One of the issues that is very important to 

### 13 the evangelical community is the matter of life. Each 

### 14 year, over one point two million babies are terminated 

### 15 in the United States. As a pro-life evangelical, our 

### 16 community has been epitomized, but also polarized by 

### 17 that issue. 

### 18 We have become disproportionately political 

### 19 in our response to this local issue of life. In turn, 

### 20 we have polarized many communities against our witness. 

### 21 We have not sought to counsel and console as much as 

### 22 lecture others. We ought to have taken stock of our 

### 23 private response before speaking so vehemently in the 

### 24 public square on life issues. 

### 25 I say all of this because it's important forAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 210 1 you to realize that as a pro-life organization, EEN 

### 2 takes an additional approach. For us, our advocacy in 

### 3 speaking out on mercury is outflow of this life 

### 4 perspective. 

### 5 In our perspective, up to one in six 

### 6 children, over seven hundred thousand a year are born 

### 7 with unsafe amounts of mercury toxin in their blood. 

### 8 Even one unborn child being impacted by 

### 9 mercury pollution is enough for us to act as a society. 

### 10 Life is precious. Life is sacred and should be valued. 

### 11 Evangelicals are engaged on this sort of 

### 12 issue because it is a life related issue. Several 

### 13 prominent groups and ministries are, are joining with 

### 14 us and they'll be part of the statements we submit, to 

### 15 ask the EPA to do what it long ago should have done; 

### 16 reduce the amount of mercury toxin in our environment. 

### 17 Mercury is unlike some toxins. Once it is 

### 18 released, it cannot be easily cleaned up in the 

### 19 environment. It is a cumulative toxin, therefore the 

### 20 urgency to act is clear. 

### 21 I want to close with this. Our scriptures 

### 22 often teach us that in His justice, God has a special 

### 23 concern for the poor, for the widow, the orphan, the 

### 24 [indecipherable], the oppressed and for little 

### 25 children. In other words, Christian justice demandAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 211 1 that we give special attention to those whom Jesus 

### 2 calls the least of these brothers of mine. Those least 

### 3 able to protect themselves. 

### 4In fact, in our tradition, we believe that we 

### 5 do -- what we do unto the least of these, we do unto 

### 6 Jesus himself. 

### 7 We cannot, as a community, pass by while our 

### 8 fellows are harmed. We cannot pass this problem on to 

### 9 another generation. For the sake of our children, we 

### 10 at EEN urge you to act to defend those least able to, 

### 11 to defend themselves. 

### 12 Thank you. 

### 13 MR. CLARK: Thank you very much. 

### 14REVEREND CIZIK: Good afternoon. My name is 

### 15 Richard Cizik, it's R-I-C-H-A-R-D, C-I-Z-I-K. Thank 

### 16 you. It's a privilege to be here. 

### 17 I'm representing the New Evangelical 

### 18 Partnership for the Common Good, the President of this 

### 19 organization which is a faith-based, non-profit 

### 20 offering of renewed Christian public witness for the 

### 21 sake of the gospel and the common good. 

### 22 As an Evangelical Minister, I began speaking 

### 23 out against mercury poisoning in 2002 when I first 

### 24 became aware of the issue. At the time, I was Vice 

### 25 President for Governmental Affairs of the NationalAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 212 1 Association of Evangelicals, the largest organization 

### 2 of its kind in the United States. 

### 3 But I was in that role for twenty-eight 

### 4 years. Most of that time, almost all of it, I was 

### 5 completely unaware of the impacts of coal burning 

### 6 utility plants upon the nation's public health and for 

### 7 that I am sorry and I apologize to my constituency. 

### 8 Something changed and I would like to explain 

### 9 why; what changed. In 2007, I was approached by my 

### 10 friends at Rachel's Network, an environmental group of 

### 11 women in leadership, to participate in the Human Toxome 

### 12 Project. It was a study conducted by the Environmental 

### 13 Working Group in collaboration with Common Will, on the 

### 14 toxic chemicals in the human body. 

### 15 In agreeing, in agreeing to participate in 

### 16 the study, according to its final report, I became "one 

### 17 of only a small number of people in the world to know a 

### 18 portion of my personal body burden of industrial 

### 19 chemicals, called the Human Toxome." 

### 20 Using five state of the art laboratories 

### 21 around the globe, the human project performed analysis 

### 22 of my blood and urine, reviewed it, synthesized the 

### 23 data from scientific literature on the toxicity and 

### 24 possible exposure sources for the contaminants studied. 

### 25 Well, the results of the test, as I indicatedAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 213 1 changed me and my thinking because it found that of the 

### 2 eighty-four industrial compounds that I was tested for, 

### 3 I was found to have varying levels of thirty-nine of 

### 4 those eighty-nine industrial compounds; pollutants and 

### 5 other chemicals tested, in my body including chemicals 

### 6 linked to reproductive toxicity and fertility problems, 

### 7 brain and nervous system toxicity and hormone activity. 

### 8 For purposes of this hearing, my levels of 

### 9 mercury were in the highest levels possible. According 

### 10 to national studies of the sort, eighty-seven 

### 11 percentile nationally, which means only thirteen 

### 12 percent of the public has higher levels of mercury in 

### 13 their body than I do. 

### 14Methyl mercury levels were also high, but not 

### 15 as high as that set for pregnant or nursing women and 

### 16 young children to protect against damage, damaging 

### 17 their developing brains, but high enough, according to 

### 18 the National Academy of Scientists, for mercury, 

### 19 "mercury driven risks for immune disorders and 

### 20 cardiovascular diseases." 

### 21 Now as a whole, I had all kinds of chemicals 

### 22 in my body, I found. Almost a human toxic waste dump, 

### 23 if you will. Pretty serious stuff. Low levels of 

### 24 alkylphenols and surfactants, moderate levels of lead, 

### 25 teflons, perfluorochemicals, plasticides, mostAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 214 1 importantly high levels of bromide fire retardants, 

### 2 mercury, and methyl mercury. 

### 3 According to the Human Toxome Project, "We 

### 4 know the impacts on unborn babies of mercury poisoning, 

### 5 but we are less aware of the mercury impacts that coal 

### 6 burning utility plants have on non-pregnant adults." 

### 7 And the scientist in the report wrote that, "We are 

### 8 only beginning to study the health effects of chronic 

### 9 exposure to chemical mixtures and while studies 

### 10 strongly demonstrate the role chemicals play and a host 

### 11 of health problems. Risk to an individual are largely 

### 12 unknown. Genetics, timing and dose all play a role. 

### 13 Now for me and my family, when I put together 

### 14 what were the known risk from all of the chemicals and 

### 15 the like in my body and what we ourselves had 

### 16 experienced over these many decades, it all began to 

### 17 add up. Infertility, auditory processing problems, 

### 18 other forms of disability, developmental disability by 

### 19 my children. 

### 20 And so I ask, how many other families are 

### 21 suffering unknowingly because their government has 

### 22 stalled action to protect the public against a known 

### 23 threat to public health? I ask. How many other 

### 24 families are similarly being impacted? 

### 25 And I find it appalling and almostAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 215 1 incomprehensible that it's taken so many years, two 

### 2 decades, to get to this place. 

### 3 And finally, compliments to the environmental 

### 4 leadership of President Obama, a courageous 

### 5 administrator who is the head of EPA. We are now set, 

### 6 I believe, to take action and I urge you to do so 

### 7 because it's not just the unborn that my colleague and 

### 8 friend Alexei Laushkin has witnessed to today that are 

### 9 impacted. It adults such as myself. 

### 10 To repeat, the National Academy of Sciences 

### 11 found that, "Mercury driven risks for immune disorders 

### 12 and cardiovascular disease occurs at even low levels of 

### 13 exposure." 

### 14In sum, we've waited way too long for EPA 

### 15 action. In fact, it's just astonishing, appalling, 

### 16 we've had to wait so long, so I urge you to rule on the 

### 17 mercury poisoning rule without delay. Implement it 

### 18 without delay. 

### 19 And I thank you for being here. 

### 20 MR. CLARK: Thank you. Thank you both very 

### 21 much. Appreciate it. 

### 22 Our next two speakers please, Glen Hooks and 

### 23 Katherine Cummings. Okay. Mr. Hooks. 

### 24MR. HOOKS: Good afternoon. Hi. My name is 

### 25 Glen Hooks. It's spelled G-L-E-N, H-O-O-K-S and I workAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 216 1 on coal and clean energy issues for the Sierra Club. 

### 2 I'm not from Georgia, but I hope you'll 

### 3 excuse me because I'm also from the region. I'm from 

### 4 Arkansas and I've driven up here or come up here to 

### 5 express my support for the mercury rule. 

### 6 I don't know how many people in the room have 

### 7 had the opportunity to go to Arkansas. We're known as 

### 8 the natural state, that's home to fifty-two state 

### 9 parks, two national forests, one national river, and 

### 10 four coal-fired power plants. 

### 11 I'm a lifelong southerner and born and 

### 12 raised in Arkansas and we've heard a lot today about 

### 13 statistics that the number of lives that this rule 

### 14 would save. I don't want to repeat that. I want to 

### 15 talk a little bit more personally. 

### 16 I grew up fishing with my grandfather. I 

### 17 grew up fishing on Lake 

### 18 Conway with both my grandparents really, then my 

### 19 father. And now I have two sons and when we go to Lake 

### 20 Conway, we see signs that say be careful about the fish 

### 21 that you eat out of Lake Conway because of the mercury 

### 22 issue. It's unhealthy and dangerous levels of mercury 

### 23 in our fish in Lake Conway and most of it is from power 

### 24 plants. 

### 25 This region, the place I call home, thisAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 217 1 region, the south, is home to an astounding amount of 

### 2 dirty coal-fired power plants and because my children 

### 3 and I live in the south where most of the coal-fired 

### 4 power plants like effective mercury controls, we are at 

### 5 risk. 

### 6 And let's just be straight about it. I think 

### 7 frankly that's a ridiculous situation to be in. Why 

### 8 should children in the south be poisoned more than 

### 9 children in other parts of the country? Well, frankly 

### 10 they should not. 

### 11 We need a standard rule to dramatically 

### 12 reduce the amount of mercury pollution from power 

### 13 plants and that's why I'm here supporting this rule 

### 14 today. 

### 15 We do have the technology to reduce this. 

### 16 This is just not something where we're all hoping and 

### 17 praying that we develop it someday. Some mercury -- 

### 18 some power plants have it, some don't. They all should 

### 19 have it. We have the technology to make a dramatic 

### 20 improvement in people's lives. 

### 21 It really comes down to a public policy 

### 22 decision. I think everyone in this room agrees that we 

### 23 need energy. The question is how many deaths will we 

### 24 allow in the product of that energy. Stopping or 

### 25 dramatically reducing poisonous mercury pollution is aAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 218 1 no-brainer. 

### 2 Now, I want to respond to some testimony I 

### 3 heard before the break from someone who was sitting at 

### 4 this table, like I am, who made the observation via 

### 5 power point that air quality in this country had 

### 6 improved dramatically over the last fifty years. I 

### 7 agree with that. 

### 8 The speaker credited largely that air 

### 9 improvement, air quality improvement to technological 

### 10 innovation and I think that she left one incredibly 

### 11 important piece out, which is effective regulation. 

### 12 It's kind of a truism or almost a clich, that 

### 13 nobody ever does the right thing just because it's the 

### 14 right thing to do. I think that applies a lot to the 

### 15 power industry. Unless there's effective regulation 

### 16 that forces industry to clean up its act, it doesn't 

### 17 happen in an effective way. 

### 18 Every major environmental law in the history 

### 19 of this country has been fought tooth and nail by 

### 20 industry and when the regulations pass and the power 

### 21 companies are forced to comply, four things happen. 

### 22 One, they are able to comply and do it well. 

### 23 Two, the sky does not fall. 

### 24Three, public health improves dramatically. 

### 25 And then four, industry pats itself on theAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 219 1 back for how environmentally minded they've been even 

### 2 though they were required to do so, and that's why they 

### 3 acted. 

### 4I think and I believe that effective 

### 5 regulation is the way to clean up the environment and 

### 6 the air in this country and I applaud the EPA for 

### 7 coming forward with this very courageous rule. 

### 8 The bottom line is the coal industry and the 

### 9 power industry in this country should be forced to 

### 10 everything possible to clean up its, clean up their 

### 11 emissions. This rule will force them to do so and I 

### 12 think we'll all be a lot better off when that happens. 

### 13 I support the rule and I really applaud you for putting 

### 14 it forward. 

### 15 And I thank you for the opportunity to speak 

### 16 today. 

### 17 MR. CLARK: Thank you. Ms. Cummings. 

### 18 MS. HELMS-CUMMINGS: I'm Katherine Helms

### 19 Cummings and it's Katherine, K-A-T-H-E-R-I-N-E, Helms 

### 20 is H-E-L-M-S and Cummings, C-U-M-M-I-N-G-S. 

### 21 I am here -- I was the founding President of 

### 22 an organization in my community called the Fall Line 

### 23 Alliance for Clean Environment and that group will be 

### 24 submitting comments as an organization, but I'm here 

### 25 today just as a citizen.AGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 220 1 I appreciate this opportunity. I'm glad 

### 2 you're here in Atlanta and I commend you and thank you 

### 3 for taking this critical step to protect the health of 

### 4 the families in our country. 

### 5 As a grandmother, I think it's wrong to tell 

### 6 a four and a half year old child that the fish that she 

### 7 and her three year old brother, if they're lucky enough 

### 8 that day to catch in the Ogeechee River that runs 

### 9 through our family's farm is so full of pollution that 

### 10 they can't eat any of it? No child should have to be 

### 11 on a catch and release program just because they like 

### 12 to have fun outside with their family. 

### 13 And it's wrong for me to not say that I think 

### 14 it's wrong. 

### 15 As a mother of a child who grew up with 

### 16 asthma, there's nothing more horrifying than being 

### 17 helpless and watching your child struggle for a full 

### 18 breath of air. 

### 19 And about eight weeks post cancer treatment, 

### 20 as a new survivor, I have an obligation to be proactive 

### 21 in my own healthcare and maintaining my health, but the 

### 22 air that I breathe everyday is already laden with 

### 23 mercury and other cancer causing toxins. 

### 24These national standards to address mercury 

### 25 emissions will reduce twenty thousand pounds of mercuryAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 221 1 that are puffed into our airways in the, in the 

### 2 southeast as a result of almost three hundred coal 

### 3 fired power plants that we currently have. 

### 4We need to bring those existing plants into 

### 5 the fold and, and require them to operate under higher 

### 6 standards for emissions. My friends and my family have 

### 7 everything to gain by having these standards in place. 

### 8 Our home is about eight miles north of a 

### 9 proposed coal-fired power plant. The seventh 

### 10 generation family farm that we have, where a black 

### 11 water river runs through the property, is about eight 

### 12 miles to the east. 

### 13 That plant right now would, would release 

### 14 sixty-three pounds of mercury into the air every year 

### 15 if it's ever built and put online. What doesn't land 

### 16 in our lungs, or on the trees and the plants in our 

### 17 gardens, will end up in our water, in our streams and 

### 18 in our rivers. 

### 19 Our streams are already so polluted, at least 

### 20 the Ogeechee River is so full of mercury now that a 

### 21 woman of childbearing age is advised not to eat any of 

### 22 the fish that come from that river. 

### 23 That's a significant portion of a woman's 

### 24 life. And there are lots of people in rural Georgia 

### 25 who rely on what's in those streams and rivers as partAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 222 1 of their food budget. 

### 2 Cleaner safer air to breathe will also serve 

### 3 as a significant means of cleaning up the mercury laden 

### 4 waterways that we have in the southeast. Cleaner, 

### 5 healthier fish, meaning that every child learning how 

### 6 to fish, can look forward to eating that fish at the 

### 7 end of the day. 

### 8 We cheat our children and we also cheat 

### 9 ourselves from sharing the traditions and the knowledge 

### 10 that we value if our children are unable to do that 

### 11 with us. 

### 12 So without reservation, I urge the adoption 

### 13 and enforcement of strong national clean air standards 

### 14 and I appreciate the opportunity to share my concerns 

### 15 with you. 

### 16 MR. CLARK: Thank you both very much. And no 

### 17 questions so thank you. 

### 18 Next two speakers please, Midge Sweet and Lyn 

### 19 Redwood. 

### 20 MS. SWEET: Good afternoon. 

### 21 MR. CLARK: Hi. 

### 22 MS. SWEET: My name is Midge Sweet, 

### 23 M-I-D-G-E, Sweet, S-W-E-E-T. 

### 24Thank you for holding these important 

### 25 hearings to gather information from people regardingAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 223 1 the proposed rule to limit mercury and other toxic air 

### 2 pollutants from emissions from power plants and thank 

### 3 you to Mr. Maxwell for working on this for so long, 

### 4 Mr. Clark for supporting that work and now it's time to 

### 5 close this project out and get these rules passed. 

### 6 I come here as Director of Georgians for 

### 7 Smart Energy, a Coalition of Community, Business and 

### 8 Environmental Groups and as a mother and recent 

### 9 grandmother, and I support stringent limits on 

### 10 hazardous air pollutants such as mercury. 

### 11 I applaud your efforts and urge you to 

### 12 establish and enforce rigorous mercury limits that are 

### 13 protective of our health as best -- especially the 

### 14 health of our children. 

### 15 Decades ago when my husband John and I became 

### 16 parents, we made sure that our children ate healthy 

### 17 food. We ate fish at least twice a week during most of 

### 18 the year because of its nutritional benefits and at the 

### 19 time, great low cost, and in the summer, John, an avid 

### 20 fisherman, took the kids fishing both in Georgia and in 

### 21 Michigan where he hails from. 

### 22 When they caught fish, we ate them happily at 

### 23 all times of the day. As Katherine pointed out because 

### 24 when you're lucky enough to get some fish, you want to 

### 25 eat it.AGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 224 1 In Georgia they caught and ate many fish from 

### 2 the wonderful rivers crisscrossing our state and when 

### 3 they were very young kids, caught fish from the small 

### 4 lakes and rivers in northern Michigan on our annual 

### 5 summertime visit. And as you can see on the attached 

### 6 photos that I was sharing with you, their joy in 

### 7 catching these fish was really stupendous. 

### 8 At that time, I had no idea that mercury 

### 9 posed the danger that I now it does. I am very 

### 10 concerned about mercury in our fish, and it affects on 

### 11 our children's physical and mental health. 

### 12 Working with Georgians for Smart Energy, I 

### 13 have learned about the significant threat posed by 

### 14mercury, particularly in Georgia's uniquely highly 

### 15 acidic black water systems which convert mercury to the 

### 16 highly toxic methyl mercury which is absorbed aquatic 

### 17 organisms and then accumulates in fish tissues 

### 18 poisoning them and the animals that eat them and 

### 19 causing all sorts of problems including reduced 

### 20 fertility and reproductive failure. 

### 21 The State of Georgia has issued guidelines to 

### 22 limit the consumption of at least one fish species in 

### 23 every section of the Chattahoochee River, right outside 

### 24 our door here, due to mercury contamination and the 

### 25 Flint River where my family paddled very often andAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 225 1 caught fish is contaminated from stem to stern. 

### 2 On the Satilla River, a black water river in 

### 3 south Georgia, catfish over thirty inches are under a 

### 4 do not eat at all advisory regardless of age or gender 

### 5 or reproductive status. 

### 6 It's shameful that here in America, the land 

### 7 of abundance that we find ourselves unable to eat the 

### 8 fish that we catch without worrying about their 

### 9 toxicity of all things. And find ourselves concerned 

### 10 about the fine particulate matter in the very air that 

### 11 our children breathe. 

### 12 It is shameful that this preventable 

### 13 situation, dirty air and toxic water from dirty air, 

### 14 exists. 

### 15 We can and we must change. 

### 16 This summer, you will see on that picture, my 

### 17 deliciously chubby granddaughter of six months will 

### 18 join us on our summer fishing trip and I am counting on 

### 19 you, the Environmental Protection Agency, to set 

### 20 mercury limits so that she may eat fish freely and 

### 21 splash in the waters without concern. I ask you to 

### 22 summon the courage to look beyond the short-term 

### 23 complaints that I'm sure that you will get from 

### 24 industry and to prioritize our health. 

### 25 As I traveled Georgia talking about pollutionAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 226 1 free economic opportunities that solar and wind energy 

### 2 can bring to our state, I have sadly wondered at our 

### 3 state's leaders reluctance to set renewable energy 

### 4 standards and to embrace the American ethos when it 

### 5 comes to energy policy. 

### 6 GSE sees answers to our energy problems in 

### 7 the very American values of innovation and creativity 

### 8 and hard work. However, I find that I must rely on 

### 9 independent science-based federal policy and rule 

### 10 making to ensure that families are protected from toxic 

### 11 pollution from the ten current coal plants in Georgia 

### 12 that are causing asthma attacks and that limit the fish 

### 13 we can safely consume. 

### 14We ask that the U.S. Environmental Protection 

### 15 Agency regulate mercury and issue strong rules to 

### 16 reduce emissions of toxic air pollution, pollutants 

### 17 from power plants. 

### 18 Thank you very much. 

### 19 MR. CLARK: Thank you. Ms. Redwood. 

### 20 MS. REDWOOD: Hi. Thank you. My name is Lyn 

### 21 Redwood, it's spelled L-Y-N, last name is R-E-D-W-O-O-D 

### 22 and I'm here representing the Coalition for Safe Minds, 

### 23 Sensible Action for Ending Mercury Induced Neurological 

### 24 Disorders. 

### 25 Today, America faces a crisis of epidemicAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 227 1 proportions. One that threatens the livelihood of our 

### 2 country and the core of our future and it involves our 

### 3 children. 

### 4They are sick. I see them every day in the 

### 5 grocery store, in the post office and in my son's 

### 6 school and as the parent of a child who suffered with 

### 7 mercury toxicity and autism, I instinctively recognize 

### 8 their illness and their disability. 

### 9 Autism has increased dramatically from one to 

### 10 two per ten thousand when I was a teenager to one in 

### 11 every one hundred and ten children today. 

### 12 Since autism affects boys more times, more 

### 13 frequently than girls, that equates to approximately 

### 14 one in every seventy U.S. boys today having autism. 

### 15 Better recognition of the disorder or a diagnostic 

### 16 substitution fails to explain this dramatic increase. 

### 17 ADD, ADHD, a completely new entity from when 

### 18 I was a child has also reached epidemic proportions and 

### 19 currently effects approximately three point five 

### 20 million children. 

### 21 Asthma has increased three hundred percent 

### 22 over the past two decades and kills four thousand 

### 23 individuals per year and is the leading cause of school 

### 24 absenteeism. 

### 25 Allergies have increased four hundredAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 228 1 percent. 

### 2 When you add up all these numbers, it comes 

### 3 up to twenty million children, almost one third of all 

### 4 American children being sick. 

### 5 Genetics alone is not capable of causing such 

### 6 a dramatic change in our children's health over the 

### 7 past few decades and scientists today agree that it 

### 8 must be a combination of both genetic susceptibility 

### 9 combined with an environmental trigger that's causing 

### 10 our children to be so sick. 

### 11 Recent research by Dr. Jill James of Arkansas 

### 12 Children's Hospital Research Institute documented that 

### 13 children with autism were more vulnerable to 

### 14 environmental pollutants because they have lower levels 

### 15 of glutathione, which is the body's natural defense for 

### 16 excreting environmental pollutants so they don't cause 

### 17 injury. 

### 18 Research conducted by Dr. Raymond Palmer of 

### 19 the University of Texas Health Science Center in 2006 

### 20 found that for every one thousand pounds of 

### 21 environmentally released mercury, there was a forty

### 22 three percent increase in the rate of special education 

### 23 services and a sixty-one percent increase in the rate 

### 24 of autism in the surrounding communities. 

### 25 Dr. James Adams reported in 2007 thatAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 229 1 children with autism were found to have more than 2 double the amount of mercury in their baby teeth 3 compared to normally developing children and another 4 study by Windham in 2006 reports that there 5 was a fifty percent higher risk of autism associated 6 with the upper quartile of exposure to heavy 7 metals like mercury. 8 Environmental exposures like the one I just 9 mentioned are known to be associated with autism and 10 occur from coal burning power plants. 11 These exposures are especially damaging to 12 infants and children because their biological systems 13 like the brain are still developing. 14 During fetal development, even exposures to 15 minute levels of environmental toxins during critical 16 windows of development can cause -- have lifelong 17 adverse neurological and health effects. Therefore, 18 the Coalition for Safe Minds urges the EPA and the 19 Obama administration to protect our nation's most 20 valuable resource; our children, by standing firm in 21 their efforts to reduce toxic mercury pollution from 22 coal burning power plants and other utilities. 23 Thank you. 24 MR. CLARK: Thank you very much. The 25 Coalition for Saving Lives, can you just say a littleAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 230 1 bit more about that? About the organization? 

### 2 MS. REDWOOD: Our organization was formed in 

### 3 the year 2000 by a handful of parents. We're not a 

### 4 membership organization. You could probably describe 

### 5 us as more a think tank or do tank type organization. 

### 6 I'm sorry. It stands for Sensible Action for 

### 7 Ending Mercury Induced Neurological Disorders. 

### 8 MR. CLARK: Oh thank you. 

### 9 MS. REDWOOD: I'm sorry. 

### 10 MR. CLARK: Thank you both very much. 

### 11 Appreciate it. 

### 12 MS. REDWOOD: Thank you. 

### 13 MR. CLARK: Next two speakers please, Jenette 

### 14 Gayer and Dave Muhly. 

### 15 MS. GAYER: Good afternoon. 

### 16 MR. CLARK: Hi. 

### 17 MS. GAYER: Thank you all for being here 

### 18 today. My name is Jenette Gayer, an advocate with 

### 19 Environment Georgia. Environment Georgia is a 

### 20 statewide citizen based environmental advocacy 

### 21 organization and we're part of Environment America 

### 22 which is a federation of twenty-nine state-based 

### 23 environmental advocacy groups that have been very 

### 24 active in advancing state and federal policies to cut 

### 25 mercury and other toxic air emissions from powerAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 231 1 plants. 

### 2 I'm here to testify in strong support of 

### 3 EPA's proposed mercury and air toxics rule. Once 

### 4 implemented, this rule will save as many as seventeen 

### 5 thousand lives every year, will prevent tens of 

### 6 thousands of hospitalizations and will significantly 

### 7 cut some of the most hazardous pollutants known to man, 

### 8 such as mercury, lead and arsenic. 

### 9 For decades, power plants have been a 

### 10 significant source of toxic air pollution in the United 

### 11 States, and especially here in the southeast. 

### 12 Coal-fired power plants are the single 

### 13 largest source of mercury pollution, arsenic and acid 

### 14 gasses in the United States. Power plants spew dozens 

### 15 of other toxic pollutants into the water and air 

### 16 including chromium, nickel, lead, and dioxins and these 

### 17 toxins have been linked to cancer, heart disease, 

### 18 neurological damage, birth defects, asthma attacks and 

### 19 even premature death. 

### 20 Georgia's utility companies have likely made 

### 21 the case to you that this rule is unnecessary and 

### 22 perhaps have insisted that Georgia's current multi

### 23 pollutant rule is satisfactory, but this is not so. 

### 24First, the current Georgia rule is the 

### 25 technology standard. Most, but importantly not all, ofAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 232 1 Georgia's power plants are required to install control 

### 2 technologies and I'll add that during the development 

### 3 of this rule, Environment Georgia and many of our 

### 4 allies advocated for an actual emissions cap, similar 

### 5 to the rule that we are considering today. 

### 6 In addition to the current required 

### 7 technology standards -- oops sorry. In addition to the 

### 8 current required technology standards. 

### 9 In testimony back from 2006 which I actually 

### 10 opened up and looked through, we explain that a clearly 

### 11 defined emission cap will make citizen enforcement 

### 12 possible while the existing reporting which is based on 

### 13 technology operation standards will set hurdles that 

### 14 even savvy citizen activists, media, and other 

### 15 interested parties will find daunting. 

### 16 We also thought it was obvious that an 

### 17 enforceable cap would help to assure the reductions 

### 18 that are intended with the proposed technology 

### 19 requirements. And that's one of the reasons I -- 

### 20 really strong reasons that I think the rule that we 

### 21 have in Georgia is not sufficient and we need to go 

### 22 even further. 

### 23 And another reason is that we're discovering 

### 24 that our current rule has some potential serious 

### 25 loopholes, so for example, Georgia Power has recentlyAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 233 1 announced that they will be shutting down units one and 

### 2 two, at Plant Branch, which is a coal-fired power plant 

### 3 in Georgia and they've announced it, so this means that 

### 4 they may delay installing those pollution controls on 

### 5 units three and four. 

### 6 We need a guarantee that all plants will 

### 7 reduce the toxins they're releasing into our air as 

### 8 quickly as possible. 

### 9 And finally, we need a rule that protects us 

### 10 from our neighbors, so it seems obvious to me that 

### 11 mercury -- well, Georgia's multi-pollutant rule does 

### 12 not extend beyond our state line and unfortunately 

### 13 pollution from power plants in Alabama certainly does. 

### 14I'll add on a personal note that I was 

### 15 diagnosed with cancer in October of 2010. I'm told I 

### 16 have a very nice head and after several surgeries, and 

### 17 multiple rounds of chemotherapy, some really whopping 

### 18 insurance bills which I think really drives home the 

### 19 cost of some of these really important protections and 

### 20 then many missed days of work, my prognosis is good. 

### 21 And I'm the first to admit that this is certainly a 

### 22 genetic issue in my family, so my grandmother was 

### 23 diagnosed with breast cancer in her sixties, my mother 

### 24 was diagnosed in her fifties, and I, now I've been 

### 25 diagnosed in my thirties and I would observe as a newAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 234 1 member of this club, it is certainly strange the 

### 2 increased rates of disease that we're seeing in my 

### 3 family alone and if you could remove carcinogens from 

### 4 our environment, why wouldn't you? 

### 5 The problem is, we've delayed already for two 

### 6 decades. Mercury and other air toxic pollutants were 

### 7 first listed as hazardous under the Clean Air Act in 

### 8 1990 and coal-fired power plants have remained the 

### 9 single largest source of mercury, arsenic, and acid 

### 10 gasses in the United States since then. 

### 11 Coal companies have successfully fought 

### 12 requirements to reduce toxic air emissions from their 

### 13 facilities for more than two decades. In fact, during 

### 14 the Bush administration, polluter lobbyists held the 

### 15 Bush EPA write an illegal and severely flawed standard 

### 16 for mercury pollution from power plants, which was 

### 17 struck down in Court. 

### 18 In EPA's currently proposed Mercury and Air 

### 19 Toxics Standard, we are excited about the strength of 

### 20 reductions and the estimated health benefits from the 

### 21 rule. 

### 22 The rule will cut mercury, arsenic, acid 

### 23 gasses -- acid gasses from power plants by ninety-one 

### 24 percent. 

### 25 Furthermore, EPA submits that the healthAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 235 1 benefits associated with this rule will exceed its cost 

### 2 factor by about ten to one. 

### 3 To me, as I mentioned, those numbers have 

### 4 become a lot more than just statistics. And we really 

### 5 applaud the administration for the strength of the 

### 6 proposed standards and urge you to pass the rule as it 

### 7 stands without weakening as soon as possible. 

### 8 Thank you. 

### 9 MR. CLARK: Thank you very much. Mr. Muhly. 

### 10 MR. MUHLY: Good afternoon. My name is David 

### 11 Muhly, last name M-U-H-L-Y. I want to thank you all 

### 12 for this opportunity to comment on the proposed mercury 

### 13 air toxics rule. 

### 14I'm a Senior Field Organizing Manager for the 

### 15 Sierra Club, the nation's oldest and largest grassroots 

### 16 environmental organization, a hundred and twenty years 

### 17 old next year with one point one million members and 

### 18 supporters in communities across the U.S. 

### 19 I live in southwest Virginia. Not far from 

### 20 the coalfields of far south West Virginia or those of 

### 21 southern West Virginia or eastern Kentucky. 

### 22 Regularly residents in these areas are 

### 23 terrorized by thousands of tons of high explosives 

### 24 detonated to rip the tops off of mountains and push 

### 25 them into adjacent streams, forever turning these onceAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 236 1 majestic temperate forests rich in bio-diversity into 

### 2 wastelands in order to get to the coal underneath. 

### 3 In south Georgia, in west Georgia, in 

### 4 Washington, Ben Hill Counties, as you heard, residents 

### 5 were threatened by the prospect of the construction of 

### 6 two new coal-fired power plants in addition to the ten 

### 7 already existing throughout Georgia which will turn 

### 8 your communities into industrial sacrifice zones 

### 9 suffering in the shadow of coal burners belching toxins 

### 10 into the atmosphere above their homes, in kids' 

### 11 playgrounds for the next half century. 

### 12 In Louisville, Kentucky, as you've heard, 

### 13 residents live in the shadow of sixteen story 

### 14 piles of coal ash, which are whipped by the wind 

### 15 to the toxic plume that coats their home with layers of 

### 16 dirt, heavy metals, and mercury and threatens ground 

### 17 water in the Ohio River on which this toxic dump sits. 

### 18 John Muir, a famed American environmentalist 

### 19 wrote in 1911, one hundred years ago, 

### 20 "When we try to pick out anything by itself, we find it 

### 21 hitched to everything else in the universe." It was 

### 22 true then of nature and it's no less true now. It's 

### 23 also true of trying to unravel and regulate a complex 

### 24 set of environmental and economic impacts that are part 

### 25 of the full cycle of coal.AGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 237 1 From the cradle to the grave. From the mine 

### 2 and destruction to the combustion byproducts, to the 

### 3 mountains of toxic ash and tailings left for future 

### 4 generations. 

### 5 I commend the EPA for in many ways attempting 

### 6 to untangle this Gordian knot. 

### 7 Let me be clear for I and we in the 

### 8 environmental community have been accused of it and 

### 9 painted by it, as is by industry so often, I may as 

### 10 well own it. I represent a special interest. 

### 11 For all the families and communities 

### 12 threatened by the full cycle of coal, we have a special 

### 13 interest. 

### 14For the women of childbearing age, as many as 

### 15 one in six whose unborn babies are at risk for mercury 

### 16 poisoning caused by coal-fired power plant emissions, 

### 17 we are especially interested. 

### 18 For all the Americans, children, and adults 

### 19 who are at elevated risk of brain damage, learning 

### 20 disabilities, birth defects, heart disease, cancer and 

### 21 premature death because of mercury, arsenic, heavy 

### 22 metals, acid gasses, and dioxins emitted by coal-fired 

### 23 power plants, we see a special interest. 

### 24And for all those Americans who believe its 

### 25 their God-given right to breathe clean air into theirAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 238 1 bodies, we represent their special interest in this and 

### 2 other rules that the EPA is currently promulgating to 

### 3 protect American's health and well being from the 

### 4 willful disregard by the coal and electric utility 

### 5 industries. 

### 6 Like a bully on the playground or a tyrant in 

### 7 the neighborhood who spoil it for everyone else, these 

### 8 industries have wantonly and persistently shirked their 

### 9 responsibility to the American commons. 

### 10 To that area, which we all share and which we 

### 11 all should live reasonably assured and comforted that 

### 12 our rights as citizens, and as members of the human 

### 13 family will be respected; our right to clean air and 

### 14 clean water. 

### 15 For decades, these industries have 

### 16 externalized their operating cost by passing along the 

### 17 cost of doing business and maximizing profits as a tax 

### 18 on the health and well being of American families, in 

### 19 affect forcing Americans to make a choice between 

### 20 [indecipherable] of their own health in exchange for a 

### 21 few kilowatts of electric power. 

### 22 And to further dare to challenge, this 

### 23 presumption that God's creation was not the sole domain 

### 24 of the coal and electric utilities to [indecipherable] 

### 25 and desecrate for profit. They're accused of beingAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 239 1 dreamers in practical or worse that they were special 

### 2 interest. 

### 3 The MACT standards proposed by this 

### 4 proposed rule are a good first step to holding these 

### 5 industries accountable for the poisons they are 

### 6 releasing daily into our air. That they have for the 

### 7 last twenty years, since the passage of the landmark 

### 8 Clean Air Act Amendments, avoided, evaded, and dodged 

### 9 this responsibility is no justification for abetting or 

### 10 excusing such corporate irresponsibility on into the 

### 11 future. 

### 12 The MACT standards are and will be based on 

### 13 maximum achievable minimum emissions that are practical 

### 14 and achievable based on state of the art plants that 

### 15 have and already do meet these expectations. 

### 16 I suggest the rule as promulgated is a good 

### 17 first step, but it could be better. If this segment of 

### 18 American industry is chosen for a fifth of a century to 

### 19 avoid at any cost cleaning up these emissions, no 

### 20 further extension should be allowed beyond the three 

### 21 year implementation plan. We have compromised our 

### 22 health and our environmental for decade after decade. 

### 23 No further compromise is either warranted or 

### 24 reasonable. 

### 25 We should seize this opportunity to changeAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 240 1 direction. To grab one end of the knot and pull it, 

### 2 full knowledge that in unraveling this mountain, we'll 

### 3 emerge with a new, albeit challenging, clean and green 

### 4 energy feature. 

### 5 I commend the EPA for its courage in tackling 

### 6 these issues on behalf of the American people and our 

### 7 environment and support a strong and comprehensive 

### 8 mercury air toxics rule. 

### 9 Thank you. 

### 10 MR. CLARK: Thank you. Thank you both very 

### 11 much. And thank you. 

### 12 Next two speakers please, Eddie Ehlert and 

### 13 Lindsey Moseley. 

### 14MR. EHLERT: Good afternoon. 

### 15 MR. CLARK: Go ahead. Hi, hi. 

### 16 MR. EHLERT: I'm Eddie Ehlert, last name is 

### 17 spelled E-H-L-E-R-T. I'm here representing the Atlanta 

### 18 Group of the Georgia Chapter of the Sierra Club as well 

### 19 as oddly enough the Automotive Service Association. 

### 20 Twenty years is a long time. An especially 

### 21 long time to know there is a poison in our midst and to 

### 22 pretend it's something we can accept. 

### 23 We've known of the existence of mercury in 

### 24 emissions for coal plants for a long, long time. It 

### 25 was obvious for many years the levels of emissions wasAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 241 1 endangering our food web, our children and ourselves. 

### 2 The methods for reducing and eliminating this 

### 3 growing hazard from all that suffer were apparent, yet 

### 4 those methods were deemed too expensive. So we put it 

### 5 off for another twenty years. 

### 6 In that time, our coal burning utilities have 

### 7 demonstrated the importance of their primary goal. 

### 8 Guaranteed profits and investor dividends. The excuses 

### 9 were the same worn and tired homilies; it will kill 

### 10 jobs, it isn't feasible, we're providing a utility at a 

### 11 lower cost than many of our competitors and our 

### 12 customers will not absorb the higher cost. So they've 

### 13 done nothing with the exception of consistently 

### 14 attempting to expand their polluter base. 

### 15 Yet in our state, the coal burning utilities 

### 16 have demonstrated an enormous capability of having any 

### 17 and all additional costs transferred directly to the 

### 18 consumer. They've even been able to do so while 

### 19 bypassing the standard regulatory structure. It must 

### 20 just depend on what they really want to do. 

### 21 Would it be a leap of faith to assume that an 

### 22 industry so powerful they can pass the construction 

### 23 cost of an unneeded nuclear generating plant directly 

### 24 on to the consumer, that they would be unable to 

### 25 accomplish the same magic in providing enhanced safetyAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 242 1 of air and water emissions from existing plants? 

### 2 In the time that has passed since the need 

### 3 for regulation became settled, remediation could have 

### 4 occurred at a tiny cost per ratepayer and shareholder. 

### 5 Did we allow the extra time and hope that 

### 6 they would move into safer and more sustainable form of 

### 7 energy generation? If so, those hopes have been 

### 8 broadly dashed. 

### 9 Burning coal and getting paid to do so 

### 10 appears to be the only unyielding goal. This is an 

### 11 understood peril. While listening carefully, I don't 

### 12 hear discussion of safe exposure. Nobody's still 

### 13 pretending the risk is ethereal. I personally like 

### 14 fish. One need look no farther than the over twenty 

### 15 fish species on the generally accepted avoid list to 

### 16 find clear evidence of this poison. 

### 17 The measurable level of contamination in each 

### 18 of us is frightening. This degradation was long ago 

### 19 identified as a probably result and we have dithered 

### 20 while it has come to pass. The need for strong, clear 

### 21 regulation and stiff enforcement for violations is 

### 22 obvious. 

### 23 It has been established that the polluters 

### 24 will abuse any flexibility in interpretation. To solve 

### 25 this problem, a roadmap based on the ample science isAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 243 1 required. Clean it up or shut it down must be the two 

### 2 available options. No other level of tolerance is 

### 3 likely to produce the necessary result. 

### 4Failure to achieve removal of this poison 

### 5 will result in neurological damage, developmental 

### 6 disorders and permanent organ damage. 

### 7 While being slowly poisoned, the public has 

### 8 been tolerant and patient. We've been subjected to 

### 9 focus group tested public service announcements related 

### 10 to the benevolence of the coal burners and our 

### 11 environment has been negatively impacted while our 

### 12 children have been put at substantial risk. 

### 13 The time for such acquiescence has passed. 

### 14 We American citizens demand and deserve that maximum 

### 15 achievable control technology procedures for removal 

### 16 and remediation of mercury contamination are put in 

### 17 place. 

### 18 The permissible exposure limits are set. 

### 19 There is no reason to quietly allow our population to 

### 20 blithely approach the PEL while going about their daily 

### 21 business. 

### 22 Twenty years is long enough. It's obvious 

### 23 that there's no intention on the part of the polluters 

### 24 to act in good faith. They're not going to stop this 

### 25 poison from spewing daily into our air and falling intoAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 244 1 our water and onto our topsoil, without clear orders 

### 2 and substantial penalties. 

### 3 On behalf of those at risk, I implore you to 

### 4 establish a strongly protective final rule and a swift 

### 5 implementation plan for remediation. 

### 6 MR. CLARK: Thank you sir. Ms. Moseley. 

### 7 MS. MOSELEY: Good afternoon. My name is 

### 8 Lindsey Moseley. I work on federal policy for Sierra 

### 9 Club, specifically on toxic air pollution. 

### 10 MR. CLARK: And you'll spell Moseley for us? 

### 11 MS. MOSELEY: Oh, yes I can do that too. 

### 12 MR. CLARK: If you don't mind. Thanks. 

### 13 MS. MOSELEY: Moseley, M-O-S-E-L-E-Y. 

### 14MR. CLARK: Thanks. Sorry. 

### 15 MS. MOSELEY: No, no problem. So as I 

### 16 mentioned, I work on toxic air pollution for Sierra 

### 17 Club in Washington, D.C. and I want to thank you very 

### 18 much for having this hearing here today in Atlanta, 

### 19 outside the beltway, and having the opportunity to hear 

### 20 from a lot of people who do not have an opportunity to 

### 21 travel to Washington D.C. and elsewhere where a lot of 

### 22 these decisions are made to make their voices heard. 

### 23 So thank you very much for that opportunity. 

### 24I am here in part because coal-fired power 

### 25 plants are hazardous to our health and I believe you'reAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 245 1 beginning to hear this theme again and again from 

### 2 people in this hearing room and around the country and 

### 3 the comments that are being generated and submitted. 

### 4Coal plants emit, as you are well aware, 

### 5 toxic mercury, arsenic, dioxin, acid gasses. They can 

### 6 travel significant distances, polluting communities far 

### 7 from the source and ultimately end up in our food chain 

### 8 and polluting our bodies. And as, personally as an 

### 9 individual, as a woman of childbearing age, I worry 

### 10 about the potential for mercury contamination in my own 

### 11 body and the possibility of any children that I may 

### 12 want to have in the future. 

### 13 And coal plants are a major source of soot 

### 14 and smog pollution, also. You're well aware of this. 

### 15 Coal plants may bring electricity which is a 

### 16 good thing in our lives, but not without exacting a 

### 17 very high price from our communities in the form of 

### 18 premature death, heart attacks, asthma, learning 

### 19 disabilities, respiratory distress, cancers, just to 

### 20 name a few. 

### 21 These health costs are often particularly 

### 22 borne by children, mothers, the elderly, people with 

### 23 respiratory problems and disproportionately so, as 

### 24 you've heard in low income communities of color located 

### 25 near power plants and low-income communities of allAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 246 1 backgrounds located near power plants. 

### 2 I recently had the opportunity to meet with 

### 3 some people who traveled to Washington, D.C., to raise 

### 4 their concerns with air pollution; a nurse from 

### 5 Missouri came and was pleading with her Senator not to 

### 6 get in the way of the work that you all are trying to 

### 7 do under the Clean Air Act and she was making the case. 

### 8 She said, "I have worked in the emergency room, in the 

### 9 operating room, I watch young adults in their twenties 

### 10 come in with asthma attacks and leave in body bags." 

### 11 She said it's the most terrifying, heart breaking 

### 12 thing. 

### 13 To which her Senator said, "Well, I agree 

### 14 with you. Air needs to be clean, but how clean does it 

### 15 need to be?" How clean does it need to be? That's 

### 16 kind of what we're fighting over here. That's kind of 

### 17 what this issue has been about. It depends on whether 

### 18 you have healthcare. It depends on whether you can 

### 19 afford to pay medical bills if you don't have health 

### 20 insurance. It depends on whether you profit, whether 

### 21 you can afford to live near the coal-fired power plant 

### 22 or not near the coal-fired power plant. 

### 23 It depends. But in my worldview, it should 

### 24 not depend. Across the country, we need strong 

### 25 standards that limit mercury emissions, acid gasAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 247 1 emissions, arsenic, dioxin, from the known sources, 

### 2 from the known threats. It should not depend on 

### 3 whether you have healthcare. It shouldn't -- there 

### 4 should not be someone sitting in Washington, D.C., with 

### 5 the power to interfere with this rule saying from his 

### 6 place of privilege, "How clean does it need to be?" 

### 7 So why is it that despite this compelling 

### 8 evidence we don't have a rule? Why has it taken twenty

### 9 one years? I don't know the answer to that. I have 

### 10 some ideas. You guys probably have a long history that 

### 11 you could share with us about why it's taken this long 

### 12 and we have heard and continue to hear people urging it 

### 13 to take longer. 

### 14We need a longer comment period. We need 

### 15 more time before you finalize the rule. We need more 

### 16 time to implement this. No we don't. We've seen it. 

### 17 We know it's coming. The problems, the cost of delay 

### 18 are far too high, by your own estimates; seventeen 

### 19 thousand people a year could be saved? Let's do it, 

### 20 let's do it as quickly as you possibly can. 

### 21 Let's bring our friends in the coal industry 

### 22 along with us into a clean future if that's possible. 

### 23 And if it's not, let's keep moving anyway. 

### 24We deserve clean air and deserve clean water 

### 25 and not to live in fear.AGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 248 1 Thank you. 

### 2 MR. CLARK: Thank you very much. Appreciate 

### 3 both of you. 

### 4Next two speakers Imran Battla, it looks like 

### 5 Battla. You'll have to help me out. I, I'm sorry. I 

### 6 can't read this and, and David Richardson. So. 

### 7 MR. BATTLA: Battla. 

### 8 MR. CLARK: Battla, okay. Oh it looks like 

### 9 there's an I in there, but I got you. Thank you. 

### 10 MR. BATTLA: Good afternoon. 

### 11 MR. CLARK: Hi. 

### 12 MR. BATTLA: My name is Imran Battla and it's 

### 13 spelled I-M-R-A-N, B as in boy, A-T-T-L-A and I am here 

### 14 today to thank the EPA for having this hearing as well 

### 15 as thank the brave men and women out in the audience 

### 16 today who are here to advocate and to protect and to 

### 17 fight for our rights for a clean and healthy air to 

### 18 protect our pregnant mothers and our children. And to 

### 19 advocate for more just, equitable, and sustainable 

### 20 society. 

### 21 We are here today to ask the EPA to stand 

### 22 firm. To stand firm. To stand firm against industry 

### 23 pressure, as well as a political ideology that seem to 

### 24 suggest to put profit over people and to put profit 

### 25 over our planet. When, in actuality, we should beAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 249 1 advocated for the equitable distribution of our 

### 2 resources in our environment, as well as within one 

### 3 another. 

### 4And so, there has been pressure on the EPA as 

### 5 well and we ask that the EPA to stand firm against 

### 6 pressure to delay the rulings for ozone rulings, as 

### 7 well as for boilers for MACT, and to advocate and to 

### 8 push forward and implement those rulings as needed-- 

### 9 as badly needed, in addition to our mercury rulings. 

### 10 And we ask the EPA to stand firm and to 

### 11 understand that there are local community based 

### 12 organizations fighting for our right for clean air and 

### 13 healthy justice. 

### 14I happen to work for an organization called 

### 15 Let's Raise a Million and our goal with Let's Raise a 

### 16 Million -- it's an -- it's an environmental justice 

### 17 organization based here in Atlanta, Georgia, and we 

### 18 outreach to communities of modest means because we 

### 19 understand that communities of modest means are those 

### 20 most impacted by toxic environments, yet least likely 

### 21 to have a voice and to have agency and to talk to them 

### 22 about the health, economic, and environmental benefits 

### 23 of energy conservation because no one else is doing it 

### 24 and it's so vital that in order to produce the change 

### 25 that we need, we need to have everyone on board and soAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 250 1 we ask the EPA to stand firm with us. 

### 2 Now, there are industry advocates who will 

### 3 come in and say oh you know, these, these costs, you 

### 4 know, these pollution control mechanisms, they will 

### 5 produce a non-measurable reduction in risk. Well, we 

### 6 will have people out here today to suggest otherwise 

### 7 and studies have been done and we will hear from 

### 8 others who will say that actually these cost reduction 

### 9 measures will actually improve our lives. And there 

### 10 are studies that will show that real cost saving 

### 11 measures to the tune of forty billion to a hundred 

### 12 forty billion by the year 2016 can and will be 

### 13 introduced to our society in regards to healthcare 

### 14 costs. 

### 15 Now I don't know about you, but forty 

### 16 billion, that's, that's a good amount of money. If I 

### 17 had that in my bank account, that's more than just non

### 18 measurable. 

### 19 So I appreciate the EPA for being here and to 

### 20 stand firm and understand that we really cannot put a 

### 21 monetary value on human life. 

### 22 And so therefore, we need to fight and 

### 23 advocate for clean and healthy air. 

### 24 So thank you very much. 

### 25 MR. CLARK: Thank you very much. Mr. Richardson.AGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 251 1 MR. RICHARDSON: Good afternoon. I'm Dave 

### 2 Richardson. I'm associated with nobody. I'm retired. 

### 3 I have been listening to people talk all 

### 4morning and part of the afternoon and I'm really 

### 5 concerned. The EPA, over history, has done a great 

### 6 job. They are really to be congratulated on what they 

### 7 have accomplished. 

### 8 I'm seventy-five years old. I can remember 

### 9 when it was a lot worse than it was now. I'm one of 

### 10 the few people -- I think I'm probably the only person 

### 11 in this room that has ever seen Sid Richardson's carbon 

### 12 works in Texas when it was in full operation and you 

### 13 could see the plume of carbon going up in the air from 

### 14 probably twenty, thirty, forty miles away and within a 

### 15 mile of the place, the ground was black. 

### 16 The power plants, the industry paid no 

### 17 attention to what they dumped out and it was really 

### 18 bad. And the EPA has done a tremendous job forcing 

### 19 them, because they wouldn't have done it without it, to 

### 20 clean up their act. And they really should be 

### 21 congratulated. 

### 22 They -- what I have heard today about mercury 

### 23 concerns me simply because in ten years, people 

### 24 expect -- will expect that the mercury in the air to be 

### 25 reduced and it won't be. The mercury in the water willAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 252 1 not be reduced simply because human beings can't 

### 2 control it. 

### 3 The studies in Cambridge University have been 

### 4 out. They've been looked at over and over again and 

### 5 basically ignored. They estimate that nine thousand, 

### 6 one hundred tons of mercury are put into the air every 

### 7 year and that's simply from volcanoes. 

### 8 Now, all volcanoes do not dump their 

### 9 pollutants into the air. In fact, most of them dump 

### 10 their pollutants into the water. Just look at the ring 

### 11 of fire. Look at the mid Atlantic ridge. There's a 

### 12 huge amount of volcanic activity under water. All its 

### 13 pollutants are going into the water. 

### 14So there's no way we can control it. If you 

### 15 take the amount of pollutants from other sources, from 

### 16 all industry sources and look at them, and then compare 

### 17 them to the amount of mercury that goes into the air 

### 18 from forest fires annually -- forty-four thousand 

### 19 tons -- forty-four hundred. Boy I'm getting mixed up. 

### 20 Forty-four tons of mercury per year. That's roughly 

### 21 half a percent of what volcanoes put in the air. 

### 22 Power plants in the south supposedly put in 

### 23 twenty-four tons per year. Maybe throughout the United 

### 24 States, they put out fifty tons per year, so if you 

### 25 combine the power plants and the forest fires, you'dAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 253 1 get maybe one percent of the mercury in the air that 

### 2 could be controlled if we stopped all forest fires and 

### 3 stopped all mercury in all power plants. 

### 4That means that in twenty years, the 

### 5 detectable amount of mercury in the air will not 

### 6 change. Now this is not to say that I think the power 

### 7 plants should be immune. By the way, that's all power 

### 8 plants, not just coal, all fossil plants, even nuclear 

### 9 power plants. There's no reason why the radiation -- 

### 10 they couldn't be responsible for the radioactive stuff 

### 11 that they generate that's going to be around for the 

### 12 next thousand, ten thousand years. Somebody's got to 

### 13 pay for it. 

### 14What are we going to do to control all that? 

### 15 This is the stuff that the EPA has got to get a handle 

### 16 on and let the people know what they're talking about. 

### 17 There are going to be no changes in health in the 

### 18 United States from mercury contamination in the air for 

### 19 the next twenty years. It will not happen. 

### 20 We cannot detect a change of one percent. 

### 21 Look at -- how many people have seen the plumes of ash 

### 22 going up in the air from that last Icelandic eruption 

### 23 that's going on? How many tons are going up in the air 

### 24 every hour? 

### 25 This is the sort of thing that we've got toAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 254 1 get a handle on and we should know what we're talking 

### 2 about. If we don't, there's going to be people in ten 

### 3 years, in twenty years that are going to be furious at 

### 4 the EPA for not doing their job and they're going to be 

### 5 really upset because nothing was accomplished and we 

### 6 really should get it accomplished. 

### 7 Anyway, I've got a red light. 

### 8 Thank you. 

### 9 MR. CLARK: Thank you. Thank you both very 

### 10 much. Any questions? 

### 11 Next two speakers please, Ron Shipman and 

### 12 Seth Hutchins. Yeah, yeah. 

### 13 MR. SHIPMAN: Hi. 

### 14MR. CLARK: Mr. Shipman. 

### 15 MR. SHIPMAN: Good afternoon. Good afternoon 

### 16 and thank you for holding this hearing today. 

### 17 My name is Ronald Shipman, S-H-I-P-M-A-N and 

### 18 I'm the Vice President for Environmental Affairs at 

### 19 Georgia Power Company. 

### 20 Georgia Power is the largest operating 

### 21 company of the Southern Company and is the largest 

### 22 electricity supplier in Georgia with over two point 

### 23 three million customers. 

### 24We are committed to providing reliable and 

### 25 affordable electricity to our customers whileAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 255 1 protecting and preserving the environment. 

### 2 Through 2010, Georgia Power has invested over 

### 3 three point seven billion dollars in environmental 

### 4 controls and estimate, we may need to spend another two 

### 5 point six billion to comply with existing environmental 

### 6 rules over the next three years. 

### 7 The proposed utility MACT rule will have a 

### 8 significant impact on our customers and the economy of 

### 9 Georgia. We own and/or operate up to thirty-five 

### 10 boilers affected by this rule. Those units supply two 

### 11 thirds of all the electricity produced in -- by Georgia 

### 12 Power Force customers. 

### 13 We're concerned about many aspects of the 

### 14 proposed rule, but today I will focus -- I'd like to 

### 15 focus on why the three-year MACT compliance time line 

### 16 is unreasonable and can put, and can put the 

### 17 reliability and affordability of Georgia's electric 

### 18 generating system at risk. 

### 19 Based on our experience, this time line is 

### 20 unworkable given the stringency of the proposed rule. 

### 21 Georgia Power has installed scrubbers at 

### 22 eleven units selected catalytic reduction systems at 

### 23 eight coal-fired generating units and fabric filter bag 

### 24 houses at four units. 

### 25 Under our current planned constructionAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 256 1 program by 2016, we will have nineteen units with 

### 2 scrubbers and fifteen units with SERs. 

### 3 When it comes to installing emission 

### 4 controls, we have a wealth of experience. Our 

### 5 experience tells us that the installation of multiple 

### 6 controls at multiple facilities cannot occur in three 

### 7 years. Even if we are able to obtain a one-year 

### 8 extension for some units, there is not enough time to 

### 9 design and construct all of the controls. 

### 10 Furthermore, our experience tells us that the 

### 11 more compressed the time schedule, the higher the 

### 12 impact on the feasibility and cost of the projects and 

### 13 greater the impact on electricity rates. 

### 14Our technology experts believe that the 

### 15 proposed rule would require virtually every coal plant 

### 16 to operate scrubbers and most likely bag houses to meet 

### 17 the proposed emission limits. 

### 18 Georgia Power is currently analyzing planning 

### 19 cases that involve construction of eight to twelve 

### 20 additional bag houses on our largest units in addition 

### 21 to scrubbers that are already planned over the next 

### 22 three to four years. 

### 23 And this aggressive plan does not cover our 

### 24 entire fleet, yet we have concluded that even 

### 25 controlling this subset of our fleet cannot be done inAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 257 1 three years regardless of the cost. Even if we are 

### 2 able to obtain a one-year extension and looking at only 

### 3 this subset of our fleet, compressing the work into a 

### 4 four-year schedule will escalate the required costs 

### 5 significantly and unnecessarily which will directly 

### 6 impact our customers. 

### 7 Plant Scherer near Macon, Georgia, is 

### 8 an example of what can take -- what it can take to 

### 9 install multiple controls at a single facility. 

### 10 This plant is the largest coal-fired 

### 11 electricity producer in the United States. We are in 

### 12 the midst of an ambitious environmental retrofit 

### 13 program that will equip each of the four units with SCR, 

### 14 scrubbers, and bag houses in addition to the existing 

### 15 electrostatic precipitators. 

### 16 Upon completion, this site will be one of the 

### 17 best controlled coal power plants in the country. The 

### 18 baghouses alone for the four Scherer units 

### 19 took approximately five years from start to finish to 

### 20 design, install, and start up. The cost was five 

### 21 hundred and fifty million dollars. 

### 22 Retrofitting an existing facility, that was 

### 23 not designed for equipment, presents unique challenges 

### 24 that puts pressures on costs and schedule. 

### 25 As an example, at Plant Scherer, the unitAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 258 1 three baghouse had to be constructed nearly one 

### 2 thousand two hundred feet from the electrostatic 

### 3 precipitator because there simply wasn't enough space 

### 4 to install the equipment any closer. 

### 5 To span that distance, the duct work alone 

### 6 cost twenty-two thousand dollars per foot, totaling 

### 7 tens of millions of dollars. 

### 8 With the addition of scrubbers and SCRs, the 

### 9 design, engineering, and construction program for all 

### 10 of the retrofit environmental control -- environmental 

### 11 controls at Scherer will take about nine years. 

### 12 We're not taking our time with building these 

### 13 controls. This is a very aggressive schedule that 

### 14 involves nearly two thousand skilled workers, sixty 

### 15 thousand tons of steel, and hits nearly every usable 

### 16 space on site. 

### 17 Throughout all this construction work, the 

### 18 plant also has to operate. Our experience tells us 

### 19 that to complete the multiple control installations 

### 20 requires careful planning and execution and importantly 

### 21 time. 

### 22 Finally, our experience tells us that the -- 

### 23 that requiring the entire industry to control -- to 

### 24 install controls within the compressed time frame will 

### 25 result in material and skilled labor shortages andAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 259 1 dramatic -- and dramatically escalating the cost EPA 

### 2 has not accounted for in this proposed rule. 

### 3 Georgia Power is committed to providing 

### 4 reliable, affordable, electricity to our customers 

### 5 while protecting and preserving the environment. 

### 6 We simply ask for reasonable equip -- 

### 7 reasonable requirements and the time to meet the 

### 8 requirements at a pace that does not cause undo harm to 

### 9 our customers and put the reliability of Georgia's 

### 10 electric system at risk. 

### 11 Thank you. 

### 12 MR. CLARK: Thank you very much. 

### 13 MR. HUTCHINS: Hi. 

### 14MR. CLARK: Mr. Hutchins. 

### 15 MR. HUTCHINS: All right. Hi. My name is 

### 16 Seth Hutchins, S-E-T-H and my last name is 

### 17 H-U-T-C-H-I-N-S if you needed that information. 

### 18 And I am an elementary education major from 

### 19 Berea College and I'm originally from Berea -- 

### 20 Lexington, Kentucky. 

### 21 The amount of children with learning 

### 22 disabilities have increased exponentially over the past 

### 23 decade. Research shows that this rise in -- that the 

### 24 rise in learning disabilities among children are due in 

### 25 large part to the exposure to mercury and other toxicAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 260 1 chemicals. 

### 2 So as a future educator, this hits really 

### 3 close to home because it effects the students and their 

### 4 developing minds that I will be teaching in the future. 

### 5 When I was in elementary school about ten 

### 6 years ago, I remember maybe being about maybe one or 

### 7 two children with learning disabilities in our class. 

### 8 And now in the work and volunteer work that 

### 9 I've done with other schools in the county and around, 

### 10 and around my state, I've seen as many as six to seven 

### 11 children with learning disabilities in a classroom. 

### 12 And the thing was, the interesting part about 

### 13 this is that each, each child has a different learning 

### 14 disability and they're very unique and they are full of 

### 15 life and full of love. But it takes a lot of love and 

### 16 creativity on my part, as a future educator, to educate 

### 17 these children. 

### 18 And so, we have a very unique opportunity 

### 19 here. One that I find very, very great and I guess and 

### 20 just wonderful is the fact that we have a chance to 

### 21 ensure that my future students and future students from 

### 22 here have clean water to play in and have that, that I 

### 23 guess, that essential, essentialness to be able to do. 

### 24And so, and so I feel that we can reach our 

### 25 full potential as, you know, citizens of this planetAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 261 1 and help others and help our children and our future 

### 2 fire fighters, and our future children and our future 

### 3 politicians and our future college kids to help them to 

### 4 reach their full potential and help them not have 

### 5 this -- be hindered by a learning disabilities as an 

### 6 affect of the exposure to mercury and other toxins. 

### 7 And so as a result, I support strong mercury 

### 8 regulations. 

### 9 So thank you. 

### 10 MR. CLARK: Thank you very much. Any 

### 11 questions at all? 

### 12 MR. HUTCHINS: Thank you. 

### 13 MR. CLARK: Appreciate it. 

### 14MR. HUTCHINS: Thank you. 

### 15 MR. CLARK: Thank you. Next speakers Thomas 

### 16 Hutegger and John Walsh please. 

### 17 MR. HUTEGGER: Could afternoon. My name is 

### 18 Thomas Hutegger, that is spelled H-U-T-E-G-G-E-R. 

### 19 Thank you very much for going through the 

### 20 country and having these hearings so that people all 

### 21 over the U.S. can come and share their thoughts about 

### 22 this thing. Thank you very much also for your hard 

### 23 work and all your efforts. It's really greatly 

### 24 appreciated. 

### 25 The recent law that says one should not beatAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 262 1 up one's wife, husband, or children. This seems pretty 

### 2 obvious to you and me, but there are some people who 

### 3 think that this is appropriate behavior. So we put the 

### 4 law in place to protect basically the general 

### 5 population. 

### 6 Now it is pretty obvious to you and me also 

### 7 that it is not really a good thing to put that much 

### 8 pollutant into the air. 

### 9 Unfortunately -- especially at these high 

### 10 quantities, right? However, I think some wise person 

### 11 once said, it is very difficult for somebody to 

### 12 understand something if their job depends on not 

### 13 understanding it, so I think in order to protect the 

### 14 general population, it seems quite necessary to help 

### 15 the coal burning industry and other polluters to 

### 16 understand that this is not appropriate. 

### 17 And we can probably do that best by putting 

### 18 appropriate regulation in place. 

### 19 We have a -- we put a remote control dune 

### 20 buggy on Mars to collect rock samples and bring it back 

### 21 to this world. I cannot believe that if it is high 

### 22 enough a priority to us, we couldn't find a way to 

### 23 produce electricity without producing all this 

### 24 pollution. 

### 25 Thank you.AGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 263 1 MR. CLARK: Thank you very much. Mr. Walsh. 

### 2 MR. WALSH: Thank you. Yeah. My name is 

### 3 John Walsh, that's W-A-L-S-H and I wanted to thank you 

### 4 also for being here. You are my favorite government 

### 5 agency out there, EPA. 

### 6 MR. CLARK: We, we don't often hear that, so. 

### 7 MR. WALSH: You hear it fully from here and 

### 8 I'll [indecipherable] think that. 

### 9 I became aware of the connection between 

### 10 power generation and the environment while at Georgia 

### 11 State University. It's just a few blocks from here. 

### 12 When I, I wrote a paper called Solar Energy 

### 13 in the Home. And it talked about tapping into the 

### 14 largest source of energy available on our planet. 

### 15 Living here in the sun belt is, is -- as this part of 

### 16 the country was once known -- made me assume that this 

### 17 would be a logical ongoing movement, tapping into the 

### 18 sun, but it was not the case. 

### 19 I found that the combustion of coal was the 

### 20 main procedure of power generation. 

### 21 Then heard about the amount of emissions that 

### 22 were produced by the coal plants and, and that those 

### 23 emissions contained a large amount of mercury. 

### 24The poisonous affects of mercury present in 

### 25 coal emissions made me see a very simple to understandAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 264 1 process of cleaning up the atmosphere. 

### 2 If we would tap into the solar energy that is 

### 3 available, we could maintain our standard of living 

### 4 that we have grown accustomed to without major changes 

### 5 required. It just takes a small amount of action by a 

### 6 large amount of people to have effect. 

### 7 The burning of coal as a source of energy is 

### 8 a continuation of the process that was widely used 

### 9 before that, which was using firewood to heat homes. I 

### 10 realize that firewood wasn't used to generate 

### 11 electricity, but it helped to raise our standard of 

### 12 living at the time. 

### 13 We must move forward in ways to power our 

### 14 society that does not involve producing steam that 

### 15 turns turbines to generate electricity. 

### 16 There are cleaner ways to turn turbines. 

### 17 Decentralizing power generation is a step in 

### 18 that direction. This must be a gradual and continuous 

### 19 movement that is limitless and makes more economical 

### 20 sense or it is more widely used. 

### 21 Again, this is a gradual, but continuous 

### 22 effort. 

### 23 Using coal to generate electricity was very 

### 24 helpful for progress made in the twentieth century and 

### 25 to expand on its use is a stagnation of the way weAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 265 1 power our society when reliable alternatives are 

### 2 available. 

### 3 Expanding the use of coal reduces a 

### 4 sustainability of our planet and it's a very simple 

### 5 equation. We know the process of generating 

### 6 electricity is a necessary component to make our world 

### 7 healthier and livable for all of us. 

### 8 Most of the life on our planet uses the sun 

### 9 directly to live. We could not live without it and 

### 10 expanding the use of the sun and wind to generate 

### 11 electricity is limitless. Coal and oil fuels used to 

### 12 boil water, to produce steam, to turn turbines that 

### 13 generate electricity is not moving forward. Not when 

### 14 limitless clean ways of generating electricity are out 

### 15 there. 

### 16 Thank you very much. 

### 17 MR. CLARK: Thank you. Thank you both. 

### 18 Okay. Next speakers please, Robert Fletcher 

### 19 and Elizabeth Crowe. Mr. Fletcher, feel free to start. 

### 20 MR. FLETCHER: Good afternoon. 

### 21 MR. CLARK: Hi. 

### 22 MR. FLETCHER: My name is Robert E. Fletcher, 

### 23 that's R-O-B-E-R-T, E., F-L-E-T-C-H-E-R and I've been a 

### 24member of the Sierra Club for over forty years, but I'm 

### 25 here primarily to speak as a long time citizen of theAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 266 1 State of Georgia. 

### 2 I strongly urge the U.S. EPA to finalize and 

### 3 promulgate the proposed rules for Mercury and Air 

### 4 ToxicStandards. 

### 5 This action is needed to adequately protect 

### 6 the health of the American public, safeguarding the 

### 7 health of children and other vulnerable segments of our 

### 8 population is of paramount importance. 

### 9 Previous speakers have brought to you 

### 10 statistics and facts concerning the health benefits 

### 11 that would arise from the actions that you've proposed. 

### 12 It is entirely appropriate to target fossil fuel-fired 

### 13 electric generating plants for this action since these 

### 14 facilities are responsible for half of all mercury 

### 15 emissions in the U.S. and large percentages of other 

### 16 toxic emissions. 

### 17 Air emissions of mercury change to methyl 

### 18 mercury when they enter waterways. As the EPA has 

### 19 pointed out, "Methyl mercury exposure is of particular 

### 20 concern for women of childbearing age, unborn babies, 

### 21 and young children." 

### 22 Knowledge of the danger of methyl mercury to 

### 23 human health goes back to the 1950's, 1960's and 

### 24 1970's. 

### 25 Mercury pollution of Minamata Bay in JapanAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 267 1 was one of the worst environmental disasters on earth. 

### 2 Many of the local people died or became deaf, blind, or 

### 3 insane. 

### 4So that first surfaced in the 1950's and was, 

### 5 attempts were being made to resolve the problem by 

### 6 compensating the victims through the 1970's. 

### 7 Mercury contamination of water via air is 

### 8 indirect, but it also will result in significant long

### 9 term adverse consequences. 

### 10 I note that regulations for mercury emissions 

### 11 were proposed by EPA in early 2004, but never 

### 12 finalized. 

### 13 Further delay is not acceptable. 

### 14The proposed rules also cover other toxic 

### 15 substances that are emitted to the air, such as 

### 16 arsenic, chromium and nickel. These substances also 

### 17 have their own arrays of threats to human health and 

### 18 they should be controlled as well. 

### 19 Revision of new source performance standards 

### 20 for particulate matter, sulfur dioxide, and nitrogen 

### 21 oxides will produce substantial public health benefits. 

### 22 I therefore urge EPA to make these essential regulatory 

### 23 changes. 

### 24When I consider environmental threats to our 

### 25 nation's health, I think about my grandchildren inAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 268 1 Georgia and Pennsylvania. What kind of future are we 

### 2 leaving to these ongoing generations. Aren't they 

### 3 entitled to an improved, more healthy environment? We 

### 4 should see that they are provided with an enhanced 

### 5 legacy in this regard. 

### 6 Thank you very much for your time. 

### 7 MR. CLARK: Thank you very much. Ms. Crowe. 

### 8 MS. CROWE: Thank you. My name is Elizabeth 

### 9 Crowe, that's C-R-O-W-E and I'm here representing the 

### 10 Kentucky Environmental Foundation and the hundreds of 

### 11 Kentuckians we work with to promote good health through 

### 12 a clean and safe environment. 

### 13 And I'm here today to support the EPA's 

### 14 proposal for more protective standards for mercury and 

### 15 air toxic emissions. 

### 16 KEF promotes the precautionary principle 

### 17 which calls on us to use common sense and a 

### 18 precautionary approach when setting policies and 

### 19 practices that will impact our health and the 

### 20 environment. 

### 21 The damage to our brains and to our 

### 22 developmental systems from mercury has been well 

### 23 established by the scientific and medical research 

### 24 community and the cost of chronic disabilities and 

### 25 lower IQ from this pollutant or exposures to theseAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 269 1 pollutants is enormous. 

### 2 The utility, coal industries and 

### 3 manufacturers should show responsibility to protect 

### 4 public health, but when they do not and it's clear from 

### 5 current contamination levels that they are not, it is 

### 6 the responsibility of you, the EPA, to impose these 

### 7 standards that would reduce our exposures to mercury 

### 8 and other toxic chemicals. 

### 9 I've heard earlier today, many times, that 

### 10 the industry feels it can't possibly comply with safety 

### 11 standards in three years. And I really don't know 

### 12 where they've been. An industry performing in the best 

### 13 interest of the public would have realized years ago, 

### 14 like many in the general public, that mercury emissions 

### 15 are unacceptable and they would have already been 

### 16 implementing the best pollution controls realizing that 

### 17 the costs of coal are already being paid by this 

### 18 country with ill health. 

### 19 I suspect that the "difficulty" of the 

### 20 utility to meet these more protective standard is 

### 21 nothing compared to the difficulty of a parent with a 

### 22 child with autism or someone with autism or someone 

### 23 with a lifetime, experiencing a lifetime of learning 

### 24 and developmental disabilities. 

### 25 And I urge you to resist the arguments fromAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 270 1 the utilities manipulating the plight of low income 

### 2 communities and people of color paying their utility 

### 3 bills. 

### 4These utilities are responsible for providing 

### 5 energy efficient solutions to the people they serve and 

### 6 if they are not, then shame on them, but it's not the 

### 7 reason to continue to allow disproportionate impacts of 

### 8 power plant pollution. 

### 9 KEF believes that we not, not -- need not 

### 10 suffer jobs for protection of our health. Protective 

### 11 health standards are not job killers and rather they 

### 12 could generate a lot of jobs. In February, 2011, a 

### 13 report by the Political Economy Research Institute 

### 14 found that clean air act rules could create one point 

### 15 five million jobs in pollution controls, retiring less 

### 16 efficient power plants and the like and some of the 

### 17 people who testified earlier, counting out the number 

### 18 of jobs and the people that are employed and making 

### 19 these types of improvements really helps make that 

### 20 case. 

### 21 This can be our future. No fear mongering 

### 22 from the utilities necessary, just a common sense shift 

### 23 to cleaner production of electricity and more efficient 

### 24 use of what we already have. 

### 25 While I'm here representing my organization,AGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 271 1 I'm also the mother of a fourteen-year-old daughter. 

### 2 She's been blessed with good health, and we have, as a 

### 3 family, made a choice to limit our intake of mercury 

### 4 contaminated foods. But too many other children are 

### 5 already suffering from debilitating illnesses linked to 

### 6 mercury and other toxic power plant exposures. This is 

### 7 not the kind of legacy we should be giving our children 

### 8 when we know we can do better. 

### 9 I encourage EPA to stand strong in its 

### 10 position on mercury and air toxics and encourage the 

### 11 industry and legislatures that supports your authority 

### 12 to make and enforce these standards. No more excuses. 

### 13 We need clean air and clean water right now. 

### 14Thank you. 

### 15 MR. CLARK: Thank you very much, both of 

### 16 you. Assuming we have no questions, we'll move on to 

### 17 the next two speakers; Robert Ukeiley and Kathy Little 

### 18 please. Sure. Thanks. Mr. -- well, 

### 19 MS. LITTLE: Either one? 

### 20 MR. CLARK: Yeah. Kathy, go ahead. 

### 21 MS. LITTLE: Hello. My name is Kathy Little, 

### 22 that's K-A-T-H-Y, L-I-T-T-L-E. 

### 23 I am from Louisville, Kentucky, and I live in 

### 24 the shadows of LG&E Cane Run Power Plant. 

### 25 This power plant is fifty-seven years old.AGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 272 1 There is a high hazard pond fifty yards from my home 

### 2 which means most likely if the pond breeches, my family 

### 3 and many others, including children and the elderly, 

### 4 will die. 

### 5 I also live two hundred yards from a mega 

### 6 story coal ash landfill, almost filled to capacity. 

### 7 Fugitive ash full of concentrated heavy 

### 8 metals, including mercury, are on the properties 

### 9 immediately adjacent to this landfill. Three 

### 10 particulate samples taken from my house by the air 

### 11 pollution control district tested positive for fly ash. 

### 12 This power plant has applied for a permit to 

### 13 build another sixty-five acre coal ash landfill on the 

### 14 other side of the property. 

### 15 I have statistical information from a study 

### 16 commissioned by the Clean Air Task Force regarding 

### 17 death and diseases attributable to fine particle 

### 18 pollution from the Cane Run station. 

### 19 They assigned a value of seven thousand, 

### 20 three hundred dollars for each life lost; in 2010 that 

### 21 was twenty-three lives. 

### 22 Within the report, they indicate that the 

### 23 smaller the particles, the easier they can invade a 

### 24 person's blood system through the lungs and on to the 

### 25 vital organs. It's particularly more severe toAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 273 1 children, the elderly and those with lung diseases. 

### 2 It goes on to list the incidences of 

### 3 illnesses such as asthma, chronic bronchitis, hospital 

### 4 admissions, asthma attacks, etcetera for the Cane Run 

### 5 area. 

### 6 These are all statistics though and do not 

### 7 evoke much anger or much emotion or much, or much 

### 8 conscience. 

### 9 The reason that I am here is that I am scared 

### 10 for my little girl, Brianna, who is eight years old. 

### 11 And for all of the other children and the elderly in my 

### 12 community. 

### 13 Brianna is a little redheaded, soccer 

### 14 playing, full of life little girl. She makes my life 

### 15 worth living. She is probably worth much more than 

### 16 seven thousand three hundred dollars to me. 

### 17 If fly ash is on my house, and it is, then 

### 18 it's in my yard where my little girl plays. She is 

### 19 intelligent and she does well in school, but I am not 

### 20 sure what is happening inside her small body as a 

### 21 result of this exposure. That's why I'm here. That's 

### 22 why I've ridden six plus hours from Kentucky and face 

### 23 the same trip back. 

### 24The State of Kentucky is not protecting my 

### 25 child from exposure to mercury. I am here asking, noAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 274 1 pleading, that you do so by no longer exempting power 

### 2 plants from the same regulations that other businesses 

### 3 adhere to in regards to mercury. 

### 4It has to come from the federal level. 

### 5 Kentucky will not vigorously regulate coal companies or 

### 6 coal power plants. Case in point, even though we have 

### 7 particulate samples that are coming back positive for 

### 8 fly ash, the APCD, Air Pollution Control District, has 

### 9 yet to fine or ask LG&E to remediate by cleaning 

### 10 adjacent properties. 

### 11 Another example, Joanie Jenkins [phonetic] 

### 12 introduced a Bill and legislation that got stuck in the 

### 13 Natural Resources Committee. It was a safety issue 

### 14 that LG&E run, Cane Run, provide an emergency 

### 15 contingency plan in the event of the breech of the high 

### 16 hazard pond. 

### 17 Because this Bill -- pardon me -- did not 

### 18 pass, the children and the elderly are being put 

### 19 needlessly at risk in my community. 

### 20 I am too close to the pond to matter, but 

### 21 those that just live a block or so away could have 

### 22 gotten a warning that might well have saved their 

### 23 lives, but because the Bill had the word coal in it, 

### 24 was reason enough for it to get stuck in committee. 

### 25 Kentucky politicians are swayed completely byAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 275 1 industry instead of science. We are poisoning our 

### 2 environment in order to keep costs down and profits up. 

### 3 The corporate bottom line for LG&E Cane Run 

### 4 says that they can't make money on this plant if they 

### 5 can't poison the local committee -- excuse me -- local 

### 6 community for free. And that's why they're here to 

### 7 fight efforts to reduce toxic pollutions. 

### 8 That's why the above statistics that, that I 

### 9 mentioned are not factored in to LG&E and other power 

### 10 plants bottom lines. 

### 11 Mega wealth opposes change which will, for 

### 12 sure, cut into their pockets. They worship at the 

### 13 altar of profit. 

### 14I'm here because I want you to know that we 

### 15 are paying a disproportionately higher price for cheap, 

### 16 cheap electricity, with our health and our lives. 

### 17 Remember Brianna when you ponder your 

### 18 decisions and do not allow this fifty-seven year old 

### 19 power plant to continue to spew toxic mercury and other 

### 20 heavy metals into the environment for her to ingest. 

### 21 We've waited enough time. She deserves to live and be 

### 22 happy just as my neighbors do. 

### 23 Those of the, those of us that live in the 

### 24 shadows of these power plants, please protect us. You 

### 25 are our only hope.AGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 276 1 Thank you for your time and God bless you. 

### 2 MR. CLARK: Thank you, Ms. Little. Mr. Ukeiley. 

### 3 MR. UKEILEY: Thank you. Hi. My name's 

### 4 Robert Ukeiley, it's U-K-E-I-L-E-Y and I'm here on 

### 5 behalf of myself and my comments are going to be 

### 6 basically limited to the, the train wreck argument that 

### 7 industry puts forward, which is if the, the MACT rule 

### 8 and the other rules go forward, the industry will face 

### 9 insurmountable challenges and basically the lights will 

### 10 go out or as, as one of the commenters put it, the sky 

### 11 is falling argument. 

### 12 And my comments are going to be basically the 

### 13 kind of, what I'd call the traditional response to why 

### 14 that argument is false and then I'll provide a, a 

### 15 vision of why it should be false. 

### 16 But before I do that, the -- I did want to -- 

### 17 in that similar vein address one of the Georgia Power 

### 18 arguments about that the construction for the pollution 

### 19 controls can't be done in time and I, and I find that 

### 20 ironic. I find it interesting that a lot of the 

### 21 technology that we're talking about installing actually 

### 22 was pioneered by Georgia Power, including at Plant 

### 23 Yates, they used Plant Yates for experimental 

### 24 technologies and then what typically happens is they, 

### 25 they demonstrate the technologies Georgia Power andAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 277 1 U.S. utilities and then, and then they say that they 

### 2 can't apply them for some excuse and those technologies 

### 3 are brought to commercial level in mainly Japan and 

### 4 Germany and then twenty years later, after they're done 

### 5 oh, it won't work on our coal. Like for years, they 

### 6 said SCR won't work on U.S. coal, even though Germany 

### 7 had SCR for twenty years. Then finally, they admit 

### 8 that, that it will work and they acknowledge that -- 

### 9 and they eventually do it. 

### 10 But anyways, responding to the, the general 

### 11 argument about the sky is falling. In December 16, 

### 12 2010, Charles River Associates, which is not -- it's a 

### 13 consulting firm, does not -- it's not on the 

### 14 environmental, non-profit side of the ledger, released 

### 15 a report, a reliability assessment of EPA proposed 

### 16 transport rule and forthcoming utility MACT rule and in 

### 17 the -- you can Google, get it off of Google. 

### 18 In the executive summary, they say, "When 

### 19 considering both the current planned six gigawatts of 

### 20 retirement and, and those driven by the utility MACT, 

### 21 CAIR, NOx standards, we project a total of thirty-five 

### 22 gigawatts of coal retirement in the eastern 

### 23 interconnect and thirty-five gigawatts nationwide and 

### 24 here's the point. 

### 25 After projected coal retirements, all fiveAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 278 1 eastern RTO's, regional transmission organizations, had 

### 2 sufficient capacity to maintain without additional 

### 3 resources beyond those already under construction. 

### 4Similarly put, Bradley produced a 

### 5 report in August 2010 called Insuring a Clean Modern 

### 6 Electric Generation Generating Fleet While Maintaining 

### 7 System Reliability. Again, they're not a non-profit 

### 8 environmental group. And they said and this is 

### 9 basically a quote, "Each NERC reliability region has 

### 10 excess capacity totaling over one hundred gigawatts of 

### 11 excess capacity nationwide." And that's an important 

### 12 figure because Bradley predicted that the shut

### 13 down of coal would be more than a hundred gigawatts and 

### 14 they continued, "Therefore, considering only the 

### 15 projected level of coal units attrition relative to 

### 16 existing capacity resources, it appears there will be 

### 17 no capacity shortage, even if projected retirements 

### 18 narratives prove accurate." 

### 19 In other words, the sky is not going to fall. 

### 20 One of the reasons why is because a lot of 

### 21 the coal that units that are going to be retired have 

### 22 very low capacity factor. 

### 23 I recently had to visit a coal unit that I 

### 24 visited last year and now it's retired and I was 

### 25 dressed like this when I went to visit it and theAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 279 1 utility -- the people that worked for the utility are 

### 2 like, "Are you sure you want to go visit them?" I'm 

### 3 like, "Yeah, I need to go see it." And they're like, 

### 4 "Okay." So I walk up to the coal unit and it's covered 

### 5 in cobwebs because it hadn't been used and that's one 

### 6 of the units that they're saying that if it gets shut 

### 7 down, the lights will go out and the sky will fall. 

### 8 But obviously permanently retiring a unit 

### 9 that does nothing or practically nothing is not going 

### 10 to have any effect on our, our electricity reliability. 

### 11 I appreciate your time. 

### 12 MR. CLARK: Thank you. Thank you both very 

### 13 much. Any questions for? Okay. Okay. 

### 14Okay, next. This is going to be different. 

### 15 There's five folks that are going to come up or maybe 

### 16 six even; Chelsea Carroll, Matt Callo, Sean Hutchins, 

### 17 Alex English, Austin Delph, and Seth Hutchins. As I 

### 18 understand, you guys are coming up together. I've been 

### 19 in public hearings like this before where the rooms 

### 20 been taken over, so. 

### 21 FEMALE: [Indecipherable]. 

### 22 MR. CLARK: Yeah, that would probably be 

### 23 great for our, our friend the court reporter, so, sure. 

### 24MS. CARROLL: I'm Chelsea Carroll, 

### 25 C-A-R-R-O-L-L from Louisville, Kentucky.AGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 280 1 MR. HUTCHINS: My name is Seth Hutchins. I'm 

### 2 from [Indecipherable], Kentucky. 

### 3 MR. ENGLISH: Alex English, E-N-G-L-I-S-H 

### 4 from Bardstown, Kentucky. 

### 5 MR. DELPH: Austin Delph, D-E-L-P-H. I'm 

### 6 from Berea, Kentucky. 

### 7 MR. HUTCHINS: I'm Sean Hutchins, 

### 8 H-U-T-C-H-I-N-S from Bardstown, Kentucky. 

### 9 MR. CALLO: I'm Matt Callo, C-A-L-L-O from 

### 10 Knoxville, Tennessee. 

### 11 MS. CRONE: And my name is Natalie Crone and 

### 12 I'm from Detroit, Michigan. 

### 13 We are all Berea College students. 

### 14 MR. CLARK: And Crone is -- I'm sorry -- 

### 15 spelled? 

### 16 MS. CRONE: Sorry. C-R-O-N-E. 

### 17 MR. CLARK: Thank you. 

### 18 MS. CRONE: I'm so ready. We're all Berea 

### 19 College students from Berea, Kentucky. I'm speaking on 

### 20 behalf of the Kentucky Environmental Foundation on 

### 21 behalf of educators that have seen a seven hundred 

### 22 increase in children diagnosed with learning 

### 23 disabilities due to exposure from mercury from coal 

### 24 powers EGUs. 

### 25 I am also speaking for expecting mothers whoAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 281 1 have a one in six chance of passing mercury poisoning 

### 2 on to their children and most importantly, I am 

### 3 speaking for thousands of Kentucky communities whose 

### 4 economies and health, who have suffered due to a lack 

### 5 of regulation on air toxics. 

### 6 When I was fourteen, I lived in Somerset, 

### 7 Kentucky. It sits on the beautiful Lake Cumberland 

### 8 that is at the foothills of the Appalachian Mountains. 

### 9 I would swim in Lake Cumberland with my friends. I 

### 10 would fish with my family and we would carelessly enjoy 

### 11 the beauty of the nature around us. 

### 12 People always ask, do you know what's beneath 

### 13 the surface. Well, I thought I knew what was beneath 

### 14 the surface of Lake Cumberland. I mean, there was 

### 15 sand, fish, and seaweed. I checked. I have goggles. 

### 16 Well, little did I know that down there, 

### 17 beneath the surface and even in the air, there were and 

### 18 still are, health-damaging toxins. People in this 

### 19 country have fallen into a false sense of security. We 

### 20 are under the impression that our government officials 

### 21 are serving us with our best interest at heart. 

### 22 As the saying goes, protect the people and 

### 23 not the polluters, but clearly as of late, legislatures 

### 24 have been protecting the polluters or as defacto, their 

### 25 pocketbooks rather than serving the people who haveAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 282 1 entrusted their well-being to these legislatures. 

### 2 We Berea College students have traveled here, 

### 3 the long seven-hour drive, to demand that legislatures 

### 4 and the EPA be held accountable to the people they 

### 5 serve. 

### 6 You, you officials in front of me have the 

### 7 power to save lives. Through the EPA, you guys issued 

### 8 a scientific legal documentation that it said it was 

### 9 appropriate and necessary to control mercury emissions 

### 10 from power plants in 2000. Well I sit here eleven 

### 11 years later listening to the representatives of energy 

### 12 companies arguing against the already established 

### 13 science. 

### 14Research presented, presented by 

### 15 representative of energy companies that do not want to 

### 16 see their profits effected will obviously be presenting 

### 17 bias numbers. 

### 18 I call these companies to explain to mothers 

### 19 and educators another reason for the shocking rise in 

### 20 learning disabilities. 

### 21 I would like to see a reason that is backed 

### 22 by science already found in proving the affects of 

### 23 mercury contamination. 

### 24We call on the EPA to end this eleven year 

### 25 stagnation. Do you want to be the ones responsible forAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 283 1 allowing the poisoning of our future generations? Set 

### 2 the strict standards, please. 

### 3 In the EPA report, you can avoid seventeen 

### 4 thousand premature deaths. You can avoid eleven 

### 5 thousand heart attacks, a hundred and twenty thousand 

### 6 asthma attacks. That's huge. We ask you to stop this 

### 7 air pollution. How dare you allow minority communities 

### 8 to suffer. 

### 9 Please protect me. Please protect us. 

### 10 Please protect the people who cannot protect 

### 11 themselves. Do not sit back and let energy companies 

### 12 ravage the environment and poison our air. Please 

### 13 protect us now. 

### 14 Energy companies say it will be costly for 

### 15 them to conform to your proposed regulations. We, 

### 16 Berea College students, we would like to make it very 

### 17 clear that we would rather see our energy bills rise a 

### 18 few bucks than spending millions of dollars in public 

### 19 taxes to aid innocent people, especially children who 

### 20 suffer from these water and air toxins. 

### 21 Thank you. 

### 22 MR. CLARK: Thank you very much. Anybody 

### 23 else want to? Okay. Thank you guys, appreciate it. 

### 24 Okay. Simon Montelongo and Benita Dodd 

### 25 please.AGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 284 1 MR. MONTELONGO: I'm Simon Montelongo, 

### 2 M-O-N-T-E-L-O-N-G-O. [Indecipherable -- another 

### 3 language]. 

### 4MR. CLARK: I'm sorry? 

### 5 MR. MONTELONGO: [Indecipherable -- foreign 

### 6 language]. Hello. How are you? [Indecipherable -- 

### 7 foreign language]. I am Simon Montelongo. I am a 

### 8 [Indecipherable -- foreign language] Cherokee from the 

### 9 [indecipherable] boundary in North Carolina. 

### 10 I grew up fishing with my grandfather in 

### 11 [indecipherable] River. I like to go fishing a lot in 

### 12 a lot of different places other than the 

### 13 [indecipherable]. 

### 14One day, I asked my mother if she would take 

### 15 me to the Fontana Lake because I really love to fish 

### 16 and she told me that I couldn't because of the high 

### 17 mercury content in the lake. My mother explained that 

### 18 the power plants put mercury and other chemicals into 

### 19 streams and rivers that flow into the lake. 

### 20 In, in my school, I study the effect of 

### 21 pollution in rivers and lakes and how mercury gets into 

### 22 the water and the small fish may eat it and then a 

### 23 larger fish will eat the smaller fish and an ever 

### 24 larger fish will eat that fish and then that larger 

### 25 fish is eaten by the predatory birds like the hawks andAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 285 1 everything and the hawks are the most affected by the 

### 2 mercury pollution because it needs to eat so much. 

### 3 And people also go fishing and they eat the 

### 4 fish like my family and my people in my tribe. I would 

### 5 like to have clean water everywhere I go, so I could 

### 6 try to fish for different kinds of fish without mercury 

### 7 and other toxic chemicals. 

### 8 And finally, I want to fish in cleaner water 

### 9 where my people have had for hundreds of years. I want 

### 10 the EPA to protect the health of my family and my 

### 11 people by telling companies to stop releasing harmful 

### 12 chemicals from power plants. 

### 13 [Indecipherable -- foreign language]. Thank 

### 14 you. 

### 15 MR. CLARK: Thank you very much, Simon. 

### 16 MS. Dodd: How tough is it to follow a cute 

### 17 little boy like that? 

### 18 MR. CLARK: Sure. 

### 19 MS. DODD: Good afternoon. My name is Benita 

### 20 Dodd, B-E-N-I-T-A, D-O-D-D and I am Vice President of 

### 21 the Georgia Public Policy Foundation. We're a 

### 22 Georgia-focused market oriented public policy 

### 23 organization, sometimes called a state think tank. 

### 24At the Foundation, my focus is on 

### 25 environmental issues, which includes energy,AGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 286 1 transportation, land use, water, and air. 

### 2 The Foundation is extremely concerned about 

### 3 three aspects of the proposed MACT rule. 

### 4The cost to industry and consumers in 

### 5 Georgia, the time frame, both in the limited 

### 6 opportunity for analysis of the pages of regulations, 

### 7 and in the compliance deadline and thirdly, the basis 

### 8 for the EPA's tougher regulations. 

### 9 First, the cost to industry and to consumers. 

### 10 The utility MACT, of course, is the most immediately 

### 11 threat. The rules would affect power plants 

### 12 responsible for nearly half of the power generation in 

### 13 the nation. 

### 14EPA says that this rule will provide 

### 15 employment for thousands by supporting thirty-one 

### 16 thousand short-term construction jobs and nine thousand 

### 17 long-term utility jobs. But IHS Global Insight 

### 18 estimates that every billion dollars spent on upgrade 

### 19 and compliance costs will put sixteen thousand 

### 20 dollars -- jobs at risk and reduce U.S. GDP by as much 

### 21 as one point two billion. 

### 22 When production gets higher here, industries 

### 23 will lose their competitive edge and they'll begin to 

### 24move offshore and more Americans will lose their job 

### 25 while the cost of living will get higher.AGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 287 1 The EPA says that the rules will cost ten 

### 2 point nine billion a year. Industry estimates are much 

### 3 higher. Estimates for the utility MACT alone are as 

### 4 high as one hundred billion in some quarters. 

### 5 Meanwhile, the cost to rate payers as in the 

### 6 southeast region are expected to increase as 

### 7 much as twenty-five percent. 

### 8 Already, nearly one quarter of Americans have 

### 9 reported difficulty in paying their utilities according 

### 10 to a recent public opinion on poverty study. 

### 11 Second is the time frame. The EPA has asked 

### 12 for comments to be submitted by July 5. This is a one 

### 13 hundred and seventy-one page proposal with nineteen 

### 14 technical support documents and the more than five 

### 15 hundred page regulatory impact analysis. 

### 16 While EPA is operating under a court ordered 

### 17 schedule, the judge noted that the consent decree 

### 18 allows for a change of schedule and that she was more 

### 19 than willing to allow EPA more time to get it right, as 

### 20 she put it. 

### 21 These are some of the most significant and 

### 22 costly rules that EPA has ever proposed. That enough 

### 23 should motivate the agency to allow ample time for 

### 24 industry experts to analyze the EPA's conclusions and 

### 25 to comment on their impact, especially the cost versusAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 288 1 the benefits. 

### 2 The compliance window for these rules will 

### 3 also burden industry. Utilities have three years to 

### 4 comply and I believe that they have a legitimate 

### 5 concern about this compressed time schedule, especially 

### 6 given that it applies to the entire industry at once. 

### 7 The third is the basis for the, the EPA's 

### 8 tougher regulations. Given that the air quality is in 

### 9 fact the best in forty years, that power plants account 

### 10 for less a half percent of mercury emissions and that 

### 11 this is a global issue. We already have regulations to 

### 12 cover particulate matter. 

### 13 Since 1970, coal-fired electricity generation 

### 14 has increased about fifty-seven percent and at the same 

### 15 time, particulate emissions from coal-fired power 

### 16 plants are down ninety-three point one percent. Sulfur 

### 17 emissions are down fifty-six point six percent and 

### 18 nitrogen oxide emissions are down thirty-eight point 

### 19 seven percent. 

### 20 Utilities have cut emissions of mercury by 

### 21 about forty percent. Today even, the nation's power 

### 22 plants are responsible for few than fifty tons of 

### 23 mercury emissions per year. 

### 24I mention that it's a global issue. I know 

### 25 fifty tons is a lot. Chinese power plants emit fourAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 289 1 hundred tons. Natural sources produce up to ten 

### 2 thousand tons. Mercury, as the hazardous, the issue of 

### 3 greatest concern is just not the hazard that it was. 

### 4Today, there's certainly no indication that 

### 5 mercury is increasing in Georgia's environment. In 

### 6 fact, it's just the opposite. Mercury in large mouth 

### 7 bass, for example, has dropped by half since the 

### 8 1960's. 

### 9 Eighty percent of the advisories against 

### 10 eating fish from U.S. waters are based on mercury and 

### 11 the number of fishing places with those advisories have 

### 12 increased over three hundred fifty percent since the 

### 13 early 1990's. 

### 14Increasing the number of advisories would 

### 15 lead one to think that the danger of mercury pollution 

### 16 is increasing, but mercury emissions overall have 

### 17 decreased sixty percent since 1990 and there's no 

### 18 documented case of harm from mercury in fish ever in 

### 19 this country. 

### 20 Burdensome and costly regulations are no way 

### 21 to encourage competition, investment or job creation. 

### 22 Georgians are struggling to recover from the 

### 23 economic downturn and they don't want intervention in 

### 24 returning to a more secure lifestyle. That includes an 

### 25 affordable cost of living and a thriving job market.AGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 290 1 Taking money out of American's, American's 

### 2 pockets needlessly to implement air, air quality 

### 3 regulations that are unnecessary in order to force this 

### 4 country off reliable, affordable, and cleaner than ever 

### 5 fossil fuel power generation is no way to a better 

### 6 quality of life. 

### 7 Thank you. 

### 8 MR. CLARK: Thank you very much. I was 

### 9 curious, you mentioned a study saying that large mouth, 

### 10 in largemouth bass, mercury levels had dropped by one 

### 11 half in Georgia since the sixties. Is that correct? 

### 12 MS. DODD: Yes. 

### 13 MR. CLARK: Do you have a citation for that? 

### 14MS. DODD: Not with me, but I can -- I'll be 

### 15 happy to email that to you. 

### 16 MR. CLARK: Okay. That would be great. 

### 17 Thank you. 

### 18 MR. CULLIGAN: Yeah, similarly, if you could 

### 19 include the citation on the hundred billion that -- 

### 20 hundred -- 

### 21 MS. DODD: Yes. I'll be happy to, but -- 

### 22 MR. CULLIGAN: [Indecipherable -- talking 

### 23 over each other] the number, number of -- 

### 24MS. DODD: -- I will, I will, I will submit 

### 25 my comments and I'll --AGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 291 1 MR. CULLIGAN: Thank you. 

### 2 MS. DODD: -- add footnotes. 

### 3 MR. CULLIGAN: Thank you. 

### 4MS. DODD: You're welcome. Thank you. 

### 5 MR. CLARK: Thank you both very much and 

### 6 thank you, Simon. 

### 7 Jessica Spruill, it looks like, and Sheila 

### 8 Tyson please. 

### 9 Okay. Great. Thank you. Go ahead. 

### 10 MS. TYSON: Hello. My name is Sheila Tyson -- 

### 11 MR. CLARK: Sheila. 

### 12 MS. TYSON: -- I'm from Birmingham, Alabama. 

### 13 I am here representing the Citizen Advisory Board and 

### 14 that's all ninety-nine neighborhoods in Birmingham and 

### 15 we are very concerned about our environment in 

### 16 Birmingham because we really, we don't have anyone 

### 17 there that is actually able to stand up to the big 

### 18 wheelers in, in our city that is going to protect us 

### 19 with the environment. 

### 20 We have a very -- we are the second in asthma 

### 21 in the United States and our, our city is now here even 

### 22 bigger than ours, nowhere bigger than New York. 

### 23 We have a high rate of delayed learning in 

### 24 kids. We have like number fifteen in respiratory 

### 25 problems in our city. We have, we have a lawsuit goingAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 292 1 now where they had tested the soil in the parks and 

### 2 it's full of mercury, asbestos, and all kind of 

### 3 different chemicals and we're trying to fight that on 

### 4 our own. We need you all to regulate these things that 

### 5 is happening because in the small neighborhoods, and 

### 6 it's always in communities of color. You know, Pierce 

### 7 County in the State of Alabama is 

### 8 dealing with that ash problem down there where they are 

### 9 dumping it. Anything that's bad that people do not 

### 10 want, it always ends up in our neighborhoods. That's 

### 11 including storage, the holding tanks with the gasoline 

### 12 and everything else. 

### 13 But we have no one in spot, you know, even 

### 14 the people that we elect. You have people that is 

### 15 actually feeding them money and they're not looking out 

### 16 for us. And we're expecting for EPA to do that because 

### 17 we do not have the money or the ability really to 

### 18 actually go in and actually fight these type of issues. 

### 19 You know, we have been fighting this issue 

### 20 even with the lawsuit that we have in now for five 

### 21 years and it still hasn't came to any conclusion, but 

### 22 still the problem with the mercury and all of that is 

### 23 growing bigger, bigger, bigger and they turned right 

### 24 around and built a brand new school on top of it. A 

### 25 brand spanking new school and so our kids has to haveAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 293 1 to play with that. They're on the playground equipment 

### 2 putting their hand in their mouths and everything like 

### 3 that. So we are just hoping that you all will regulate 

### 4 and you know, do not let them get away with anything 

### 5 because we have to live in these neighborhoods and we 

### 6 want a sustainable neighborhood and community also. 

### 7 And we do not need all of these health 

### 8 problems. And that's all you find in our school 

### 9 system. You can go in any, any community in Birmingham 

### 10 and pull the statistics on our students in our schools 

### 11 and how high the rate of delayed learning, all these 

### 12 other different problems that is coming up even with 

### 13 the, the pregnancy rate. Even with the parents with 

### 14 the, with the early birth rate in our city. It's so 

### 15 very high. 

### 16 And we're just having those types of problems 

### 17 out here. We need some help and we need, we need the 

### 18 EPA to make sure that this doesn't happen anymore and 

### 19 actually come down there in Birmingham and actually do 

### 20 something also about the problem that we are having. 

### 21 MR. CLARK: Thank you. 

### 22 MS. SPRUILL: Hello. My name is Jessica 

### 23 Spruill. I'm from the University of Georgia. I just 

### 24 finished my freshman year there and I'm here on behalf 

### 25 of the UGA Beyond Coal Campaign and the Sierra StudentAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 294 1 Coalition. 

### 2 Every since I was a little kid, I've always 

### 3 really enjoyed nature and playing in nature. It was 

### 4 always, you know, my sanctuary, my safe haven where I 

### 5 could go and I felt at home and I felt relaxed and you 

### 6 know, every day when I was little kid, you know, in 

### 7 third grade I'd go with my friend exploring into our 

### 8 creek everyday and it was a little adventure and it 

### 9 was, it was fun and that was, that was where I felt 

### 10 safe and secure. 

### 11 And as I got older, I realized that not 

### 12 everybody felt the same way about my, you know, my 

### 13 sanctuary. A lot of people don't respect the 

### 14 environment and a lot of people pollute without 

### 15 thinking and they pollute -- they, you know, they 

### 16 choose you know money over human health and a clean 

### 17 environment and to me that was a big moral debacle to 

### 18 me. I felt that that was ethically wrong. 

### 19 And as I grew up, I shifted my studies 

### 20 towards the environmental sciences and now I'm an 

### 21 environmental engineering major and I just went to 

### 22 power shift in Washington, D.C., where ten thousand 

### 23 young people just like me went. We're fighting for, 

### 24 you know, climate change and cleaner energies, 

### 25 renewable fuels.AGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 295 1 And in saying that I know that it's not, a 

### 2 switch to renewable fuels completely isn't going to 

### 3 happen very soon, but the least we can do is make sure 

### 4 that these, you know, power plants are safe to human 

### 5 health and I feel like that is the EPA's like 

### 6 responsibility and one day I would like to work for the 

### 7 EPA. That's my goal is to work for the EPA and it's a 

### 8 -- I've done three shadow days here and at the SCSD in 

### 9 Athens. I've really enjoyed it. I've really enjoyed 

### 10 the people and I know that they are all trying to do 

### 11 the right thing and they, I feel like the EPA should 

### 12 have the ability to protect human health and these new 

### 13 standards, that is exactly what they do because you 

### 14 know, mercury pollution, toxic air like chemicals is a 

### 15 problem and I believe they should be highly regulated. 

### 16 And I understand also that this would you 

### 17 know, this isn't like an easy thing to do for all these 

### 18 power plants to, you know, fix their machinery to abide 

### 19 by these standards and that it costs a lot of money. I 

### 20 very much understand that, but if we're talking about 

### 21 costs and benefits, you know, what's the cost of human 

### 22 health? You know how much do we value human health and 

### 23 you know, besides the abstract cost of human health, 

### 24 there's also hospital bills and medical bills and 

### 25 doctor bills that we have to take into account and IAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 296 1 believe that these regulations would save, you know, 

### 2 save us thousands probably millions of dollars in the 

### 3 future on hospital bills and I feel like that's 

### 4 something we also need to take into account because you 

### 5 know, the pollutants from power plants are causing 

### 6 premature asthma and all different sorts of health 

### 7 problems in our communities. 

### 8 And you know, I'd like to know that when I go 

### 9 out for a run on a hot summer day, I'm not going to be 

### 10 wheezing and that you know I can breathe the air and 

### 11 not have to worry about it being unsafe because I 

### 12 believe and I think most Americans do believe that 

### 13 clean air is not a privilege, but it's a right; it's a 

### 14 civil right. So. 

### 15 Thank you. 

### 16 MR. CLARK: Well thank you very much. Thank 

### 17 you Sheila for coming from Birmingham and Jessica, be 

### 18 careful what you, what you ask for because -- I won't 

### 19 speak for Carol, it looks pretty good, but you know 

### 20 this could be -- in your future, you could look like 

### 21 Bill, me or [indecipherable], so. And we're only in 

### 22 our thirties, you know, so. 

### 23 Anyway, thank you, thank you both very much. 

### 24Okay. Elizabeth Lopez and Joan Lindop 

### 25 please. Ms. Lopez.AGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 297 1 MS. LINDOP: My name is Joan Lindop, L-I-N-D

### 2 O-P. Unlike your listing there, I don't live in 

### 3 Georgia. I live in Louisville, Kentucky. 

### 4MR. CLARK: Okay. 

### 5 MS. LINDOP: About a mile up river, up the 

### 6 Ohio River from me, there's -- I live a mile from the 

### 7 Ohio River and upstream from me is, is a coal-fired 

### 8 power plant. Upstream from us and from our source of 

### 9 drinking water in Louisville. 

### 10 We have two such power plants also 

### 11 downstream, in the midst of residential communities; 

### 12 Cane Run and Mill Creek that you've been hearing about. 

### 13 They should never be that close to residential 

### 14 communities. It's -- that's just not right. 

### 15 Louisville Gas and Electric has put modern 

### 16 controls on the Trumbull County plant that is -- but 

### 17 there is still a mountain of waste on that site and 

### 18 it's right next to the river. Every time we get a 

### 19 flood, there's going to be stuff in the water. 

### 20 We, in Kentucky, have more mercury and 

### 21 particulates in the air than a body should have to 

### 22 tolerate. Last February and March, two of our state 

### 23 representatives introduced a bill that would provide 

### 24 emergency plan when there is coal waste and another 

### 25 bill to promote clean renewable jobs in our state, butAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 298 1 neither bill got to the floor of the legislature. 

### 2 Kentucky will not protect our air and water 

### 3 as you heard from Kathy this afternoon. Our children 

### 4 are in even greater danger than the adults. 

### 5 The neurological damage to our organs and 

### 6 especially the brain is not acceptable. The people 

### 7 more affected are the, those least able to attend these 

### 8 meetings. 

### 9 I beg you, until we get more solar power and 

### 10 more lead buildings, please restrict the amount of 

### 11 toxic chemicals that these coal plants are allowed to 

### 12 inflict on us. 

### 13 Thank you. 

### 14MR. CLARK: Thank you. 

### 15 MS. LOPEZ: Good afternoon. [Indecipherable -- 

### 16 foreign language] Lopez. I'm a Columbian biologist 

### 17 and I'm here today to talk about the mercury impacts 

### 18 on, on the Hispanic community. 

### 19 So to do so, I want to submit for the -- I 

### 20 want to read and submit for the record a couple letters 

### 21 from two political leaders here in Georgia. 

### 22 So the first one is from Sam Zamarripa. 

### 23 He's a former member of the Georgia State Senate and he 

### 24 wrote the EPA today this: 

### 25 "I write to applaud you for your proposedAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 299 1 mercury and air toxics rule which I believe will 

### 2 significantly cut toxic air pollution in our 

### 3 environment while also improving our quality of life. 

### 4As you are to finalize this rule, I urge you 

### 5 to keep the final rule just as strong as the proposed 

### 6 version. 

### 7 As you know, mercury pollution is threatening 

### 8 our health and especially the health of pregnant women 

### 9 and children. This threat is pervasive, but it's 

### 10 especially present among the Hispanic community due to 

### 11 their proximity to toxic waste sites and due to the 

### 12 recreational fishing in polluted streams and lakes that 

### 13 have high concentrations of mercury. 

### 14The data from the first ever, national study 

### 15 of Hispanics on environmental issues, demonstrate that 

### 16 Hispanics in the United States are more likely than the 

### 17 overall population to catch fish themselves in local 

### 18 waterways and to eat the fish they catch. 

### 19 This puts Hispanics at greater risk for 

### 20 getting dangerous mercury into their bodies and makes 

### 21 them, new proposed mercury, mercury and air toxics 

### 22 protection from the EPA critically important. 

### 23 I'm writing today to urge the EPA to pass the 

### 24 new proposed rules to benefit all of our communities, 

### 25 but especially those that are most directly impacted byAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 300 1 the dangers of mercury pollutants. 

### 2 Thank you for your efforts toward lowering 

### 3 mercury, mercury pollution. 

### 4Respectfully from Sam Zamarripa." 

### 5 The second letter I brought here with me 

### 6 today is from Pedro Marin. He's Hispanic 

### 7 state representative of the Georgia House of 

### 8 Representatives. 

### 9 He wrote: 

### 10 "I'm aware of the EPA public hearing 

### 11 happening in Atlanta on May 26 on the proposed air 

### 12 toxics and mercury rule. I would like to express my 

### 13 commendment to your agency as I believe this kind of 

### 14 regulations will benefit the Hispanic community, not 

### 15 only in Atlanta, but also along the United States. 

### 16 Mercury and air pollutants have an enormous 

### 17 threat over the Hispanic community. Indeed, 

### 18 on a study, a study that Sierra Club commissioned from 

### 19 Bendixen and Amandi, a professional polling 

### 20 firm, warns us of these threats. 

### 21 The problem is that the Hispanic communities 

### 22 really enjoy outdoor activities and habits such as 

### 23 fishing and even what, what we fish and these places us 

### 24 in a very vulnerable situation concerning the 

### 25 environmental impacts and the effects on our health.AGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 301 1 Previous studies of Hispanic fishing 

### 2 patterns in California have established that 

### 3 for Hispanics, this is a mostly a subsistence activity 

### 4 with two fundamental goals. One is to obtain high 

### 5 quality protein to compensate for economic inequalities 

### 6 and the second is to pass cultural traditions onto the 

### 7 next generation. 

### 8 In most cases, the angler shares the fish he 

### 9 catches with his family including young children and 

### 10 women in childbearing age; the two sectors of 

### 11 population most vulnerable to mercury poisoning. 

### 12 The survey by Bendixon and Amandi also 

### 13 revealed that Hispanic anglers fish close to their 

### 14 urban communities because of lack of transportation 

### 15 options. 

### 16 The fish caught in the urban areas tend to 

### 17 contain the highest concentration of, of mercury 

### 18 contamination. 

### 19 This means and shows that Hispanic community 

### 20 is at higher risk than any other community and that we 

### 21 are consuming levels of mercury per fish than what 

### 22 eating safely allowed. 

### 23 According to a Shilling study of 

### 24 subsistence fishing conducted among several ethnic 

### 25 groups in California, the consumption of HispanicAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 302 1 anglers exceed the EPA safe limit of mercury per day. 

### 2 They consume almost twice that safe limit, which is, 

### 3 which are seven micrograms per day. 

### 4 For this and other reasons that I can't 

### 5 address here, I want to support the EPA proposed air 

### 6 toxic and mercury safeguards and I want to urge you to 

### 7 keep these safeguards as strong as you proposing and 

### 8 even more enforceable and I wanted to thank you for 

### 9 your work, protecting people in America, including the 

### 10 Hispanic community. 

### 11 With that, I want to submit this for the 

### 12 record and I want to, I want to thank you for 

### 13 considering the, all the communities and considering 

### 14 the impacts of mercury and air toxics on the Hispanic 

### 15 community." 

### 16 And thank you very much for having this kind 

### 17 of space providing this for us to come. 

### 18 MR. CLARK: Sure. Thank you. And thank you 

### 19 for bringing the letters there. Thank you. 

### 20 Okay. Next speakers please, Patti Gettinger 

### 21 and Rel Corbin. 

### 22 Great. Thank you so much. 

### 23 MS. GETTINGER: My name is Patti Gettinger, 

### 24 P-A-T-T-I, G-E-T-T-I-N-G-E-R. I'm a tax payer and 

### 25 concerned citizen.AGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 303 1 The locust swarm of EPA regulations is 

### 2 descending like a plague on our energy industry. These 

### 3 regulations will decimate our access to reliable and 

### 4 cost efficient energy. They will create financial 

### 5 misery for citizens, particularly our most vulnerable. 

### 6 They will strip out thousands of jobs and wipe out 

### 7 business growth in a fragile economy. 

### 8 To promote this destruction in terms of 

### 9 health benefits that are dubious at best and outright 

### 10 fabrication at worst is an insult to the tax payers who 

### 11 pay your salaries. 

### 12 Claiming specific numbers of health incidents 

### 13 implies a level of certainty and precision that simply 

### 14 cannot be scientifically supported, although the EPA 

### 15 claims that particulate matter causes tens of thousands 

### 16 of premature deaths, to my knowledge, not a single 

### 17 medically documented case exists. 

### 18 EPA researchers acknowledge that health risk 

### 19 estimates are based on numerous assumptions with major 

### 20 uncertainties. In other words, the EPA is generating 

### 21 hypothetical, not actual values. 

### 22 EPA claims mercury is a threat, particularly 

### 23 to children, yet Japanese and Hong Kong citizens have 

### 24 substantially higher blood stream mercury than in the 

### 25 U.S. and their children routinely outscore AmericanAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 304 1 kids on standardized tests. 

### 2 The Seychelles Island study showed no 

### 3 evidence of adverse affects from prenatal methyl 

### 4mercury exposure that is ten times greater than in the 

### 5 U.S. 

### 6 A recent study funded by the National 

### 7 Institutes of Health found no evidence of any 

### 8 clinically relevant adverse affects of mercury exposure 

### 9 on heart disease or stroke. 

### 10 Why is the EPA ignoring these studies? Power 

### 11 plants are not the largest source of mercury emissions. 

### 12 A recent study estimated that two thirds of global 

### 13 mercury emissions comes from natural resources, natural 

### 14 sources; the ocean, vegetation, volcanoes, and forest 

### 15 fires. 

### 16 North American power plants represent less 

### 17 than one percent. 

### 18 A broken compact fluorescent light bulb emits 

### 19 mercury vapor at one thousand times EPAs referenced 

### 20 concentration. Hypocritically, EPA encourages the use 

### 21 of CFLs while attacking coal-fired plants which provide 

### 22 forty-five percent of our nation's electricity, our 

### 23 very low cost providers and don't rely on foreign 

### 24 imports since coal is an abundant American resource. 

### 25 EPAs regulations will impose one hundred andAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 305 1 fifty billion dollars in electric plant compliance 

### 2 costs. In addition, the electric reliability 

### 3 coordinating council says annual operating costs will 

### 4 increase by one hundred billion dollars; ten times more 

### 5 than the EPA estimates. 

### 6 The results, plants close, energy supply 

### 7 falls seven percent and energy costs rise up to twenty

### 8 five percent. 

### 9 Georgia gets half of its electricity from 

### 10 coal-fired plants, so EPA's regulatory attack hurts my 

### 11 community. We will pay more for basic necessities. 

### 12 Home electricity, food, and clothing. 

### 13 The public opinion on poverty says one in 

### 14 four Americans has trouble paying electric bills. 

### 15 Blacks, Hispanics and seniors are especially hurt by 

### 16 higher utility prices and it won't be healthy if we 

### 17 don't have the power to wash our clothes or wash our 

### 18 dishes or to have heat in the winter. 

### 19 The international brotherhood of electrical 

### 20 unions stated that fifty thousand workers in the 

### 21 utility, mining, and railroad industries could lose 

### 22 their jobs. 

### 23 For the EPA to say jobs destroyed by these 

### 24 regulations will be temporarily replaced by new jobs is 

### 25 like having one person dig a hole and another personAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 306 1 fill that hole. 

### 2 With unemployment at nine percent, gas at 

### 3 four dollars a gallon, and high foreclosure rates, it 

### 4 is obscene to implement regulations that further 

### 5 destroy our standard of living. 

### 6 In summary, EPA over regulation is a threat 

### 7 to our economic health. What needs to be curbed is the 

### 8 intellectual pollution of pseudo science, flawed 

### 9 models, and guesstimates. 

### 10 The EPA must indefinitely suspend these 

### 11 regulations. Our citizens deserve better. 

### 12 Thank you for your time. 

### 13 MR. CLARK: Thank you very much. Mr. Corbin. 

### 14 MR. CORBIN: I'm Rel Corbin, a sixth 

### 15 generation central Arkansaser [phonetic] [sic]. 

### 16 MR. CLARK: And, and you -- I'm sorry, your 

### 17 name is -- 

### 18 MR. CORBIN: First name, R-E-L. 

### 19 MR. CLARK: Yeah okay. 

### 20 MR. CORBIN: C-O-R-B-I-N. Sorry. 

### 21 MR. CLARK: Thank you. No, no that's -- no 

### 22 worries. 

### 23 MR. CORBIN: Okay. I spent one summer paving 

### 24 roads in south Georgia. Stole a few sweet peaches 

### 25 beside the road. I also spent a summer paving theAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 307 1 roads in east Kentucky, in a holler so deep, they had 

### 2 to pipe in sunshine and I saw some miners that were 

### 3 greatly enlarged lungs from working in the mines. 

### 4But mother was born in Appalachia, Wise 

### 5 County, Virginia, a coal-mining town. I 

### 6 grew up in Lee County west of there where 

### 7 in the thirties, my grandfather would go over the 

### 8 mountain on Sundays to mine coal all week in Harland 

### 9 County. I know a little bit about coal and I've 

### 10 studied about it too. 

### 11 Now, we need more and more energy and most 

### 12 think the only way to get it is by burning hydrocarbons 

### 13 or nuclear; both create much waste. We store more and 

### 14more of. Or our concern here, release it into the air 

### 15 thinking it's just going to disappear. It's not 

### 16 disappearing. Analysis of emissions from electrical 

### 17 coal-fired plants show many heavy metals and other 

### 18 poisons in those emissions and ultimately almost all 

### 19 living organisms are exposed to and ingest those 

### 20 poisons. 

### 21 Now -- I'm sorry. Okay. Now our 

### 22 government's going to tell us we must control or stop 

### 23 producing those waste. The terrible, terrible 

### 24 government telling us what to do. They don't know what 

### 25 they're talking about.AGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 308 1 Well this is our government, actually. A way 

### 2 we work together and cooperate for the good of all. 

### 3 Senator Dale Bumpers and his biography tells 

### 4 about rural Franklin County Arkansas said during the 

### 5 Great Depression, the federal government introduced 

### 6 pit privies. Before that, they just gone to the 

### 7 bushes. And it was really very nasty before those 

### 8 pit privies. 

### 9 Now we've all seen the pictures in National 

### 10 Geographic of bicyclists in China in masses riding to 

### 11 work wearing their mask and you can see the smog. 

### 12 That's not from volcanoes. That's from power plants 

### 13 and heavy industry, but China is an ecological 

### 14 disaster, but they know it. They don't have concern 

### 15 for the individual, but they do have concern for the, 

### 16 the country as a whole. They are the number one 

### 17 researcher in renewable energy now. 

### 18 Now, I don't understand why our power 

### 19 companies don't hire people who are trained to design 

### 20 plants that would generate energy in a sustainable way. 

### 21 Florida Power and Light has had a thermal 

### 22 power, thermal -- solar thermal power plant in the 

### 23 southwest; Arizona and New Mexico. For twenty-five 

### 24 years it works. Now they are planning on, about to 

### 25 start building a plant forty miles from Miami, aAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 309 1 thermal solar power plant. 

### 2 Now we can do better. Our power plants can 

### 3 do better. It may cost. We may have to raise taxes if 

### 4 you do some of this. Subsidize creating sustainable 

### 5 energy sources. 

### 6 Profits make it crimped a bit. We will have 

### 7 to adapt and change, but ultimately we'll 

### 8 make a lot more money. 

### 9 America's always done well, but when we've 

### 10 changed because we had to and it's time we change. 

### 11 Thank you. Oh and I now I'm preaching to the 

### 12 choir here, but thank you for what you all have done. 

### 13 MR. CLARK: Thank you both. 

### 14Okay. Thank you both. Cassy Hobert, I 

### 15 probably slaughtered that one, so and Michael Churchman 

### 16 please. Cassy, right? Cassy. Ms. Hobert. 

### 17 MS. HOBERT: My name is Cassy Hobert, C-A-S-S

### 18 Y, H-O-B-E-R-T. 

### 19 I'm a Kentucky native and a senior at Berea 

### 20 College. I recently became an intern for the Kentucky 

### 21 Environmental foundation. Since beginning my 

### 22 internship, I've done a fair amount of research on the 

### 23 adverse effects of mercury in the human body and though 

### 24 I'm still far from being an expert, after reading one 

### 25 startling statistic after another, I found I could notAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 310 1 pass up this opportunity to give testimony because the 

### 2 pollution of our water and fish affects me. It effects 

### 3 my family and community and it will affect my daughter. 

### 4According to a recent report on mercury from 

### 5 Environment America, Kentucky ranks sixth in the nation 

### 6 in mercury emissions from power plants. Kentucky is my 

### 7 home. It's where I grew up. It's where my parents 

### 8 live and my kid brothers, and now it is so polluted 

### 9 that the Department of Fish and Wildlife has advisories 

### 10 limiting fish consumption from every waterway in 

### 11 Kentucky due to unsafe mercury levels. 

### 12 These are the same waterways that my older 

### 13 brothers and I swam and fished in. And now my younger 

### 14 brothers can't experience that, neither will my child 

### 15 or my brothers' children if we don't do something about 

### 16 this pollution. 

### 17 The EPA standard that has been proposed is a 

### 18 commendable start. And it is imperative that it be 

### 19 passed as quickly as possible because it is the most 

### 20 vulnerable people in the country that are being put at 

### 21 the highest risk by mercury. The unborn children still 

### 22 in their mother's wombs. 

### 23 In the same report on mercury from 

### 24 Environment America that I cited earlier, I found that 

### 25 as many as one in six women in the nation has enoughAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 311 1 mercury in her bloodstream to put her child of risk of 

### 2 adverse health effects from mercury exposure if she 

### 3 should become pregnant. 

### 4I'm having my first child in August. A baby 

### 5 girl. And I can't help but wonder if she will have 

### 6 birth defects or developmental delays due to a 

### 7 neurotoxin running through my veins and my baby's 

### 8 umbilical cord that I never gave permission to be put 

### 9 there. 

### 10 My body has been invaded by these emissions; 

### 11 contaminated by coal-fired power plants and my child 

### 12 has been put at risk. This is not justice. It is not 

### 13 just that an innocent child should be born with autism 

### 14 or learning disabilities and it is not just that power 

### 15 plants should get away with releasing poison into our 

### 16 environment and our bodies. 

### 17 So on behalf of my little girl and all of the 

### 18 boys and girls in her generation and the next, I 

### 19 implore the EPA to please do not back down from the 

### 20 proposed standard. Hold power plants accountable for 

### 21 cleaning up their emissions and safeguard the future of 

### 22 our children. 

### 23 Thank you. 

### 24MR. CLARK: Thank you. Mr. Churchman. 

### 25 MR. CHURCHMAN: Yes. My name is MichaelAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 312 1 Churchman, C-H-U-R-C-H-M-A-N. 

### 2 On behalf of the Alabama Environmental 

### 3 Council, the Alabama Rose Alliance, GASP, and other 

### 4 environmental organizations in Alabama and citizens 

### 5 across our state, I speak to you today to strongly 

### 6 support EPA's decision to regulate mercury and other 

### 7 air toxics under the clean air act. 

### 8 This crucial step has been delayed for far 

### 9 too long while human health and the environment has 

### 10 suffered. 

### 11 I appreciate the EPA taking this important 

### 12 step to safeguard our health and to level the playing 

### 13 field across the electric generating sector. 

### 14As of 2009, four of the nation's top fifty 

### 15 mercury-emitting power plants were in Alabama and three 

### 16 of the top twenty-five were in the Birmingham metro 

### 17 area. 

### 18 As Alabama's largest city, it is also one of 

### 19 the areas in Alabama identified as not attaining 

### 20 certain air quality standards by the EPA. 

### 21 Some of these plants are still using 

### 22 pollution control technology from the 1950's and `60's 

### 23 that does not address mercury emissions. 

### 24In 2009, power plants in Alabama emitted 

### 25 nearly three thousand, one hundred and seventy-fiveAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 313 1 pounds of mercury into the environmental. To put that 

### 2 into scale, one seventh of a teaspoon of mercury 

### 3 dropped on a twenty-five acre lake can make fish unsafe 

### 4 to eat. 

### 5 Though emissions have decreased in Alabama as 

### 6 a state, we're still the sixth highest emitter in the 

### 7 country. 

### 8 We need the EPA to regulate mercury and help 

### 9 protect the public and the environment. 

### 10 We bring the message today that Alabamians 

### 11 demand healthy air and water and we will no longer 

### 12 stand for being a state with some of the dirtiest air 

### 13 in the nation. 

### 14You've probably heard others from Alabama and 

### 15 across our region say that it would be too costly to 

### 16 add additional regulations to energy production in 

### 17 Alabama and that it would cost jobs. 

### 18 Should the cost of doing business 

### 19 as an electric utility come from the bottom 

### 20 line or our health. 

### 21 The truth is, it is too costly not to 

### 22 regulate mercury and installation of new pollution 

### 23 controls would be a job growth opportunity across our 

### 24 state. 

### 25 Some say we have some of the cheapest energyAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 314 1 production in the country and that industry often stops 

### 2 in Alabama on their way overseas because of our energy 

### 3 costs. 

### 4However, the true cost of that energy is not 

### 5 reflected just in the rates that are paid in our energy 

### 6 bills. Healthcare costs directly attributable to air 

### 7 pollution, missed work or productivity because of air 

### 8 alert days, a lack of the ability to consume locally 

### 9 caught fish, as well as other environmental impacts 

### 10 like CO2 emissions, coal ash, and mountaintop removal 

### 11 are all costs that are not reflected in our energy 

### 12 bills. 

### 13 Throughout the day, you've heard how mercury 

### 14 emissions from power plants pollute our air. Let me 

### 15 remind us all that mercury doesn't just affect the air. 

### 16 One of the real dangers is when particles from air 

### 17 pollution are absorbed into the water and become toxic 

### 18 to fish and humans as it enters the food chain through 

### 19 fish tissue. 

### 20 Alabama is blessed with an unbelievable 

### 21 biological diversity. We're number one in states for 

### 22 the number of species that live in our rivers and 

### 23 streams, yet we rank third nationally for imperiled 

### 24 fish. We also sixty-one water bodies on the Alabama 

### 25 Department of Public Health's fish consumption advisoryAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 315 1 list for mercury contamination. That's an increase of 

### 2 fifty-six percent in just five years. This list is 

### 3 released annually, but there's very little effort by 

### 4 the state to publicize the list and no signage on 

### 5 listed water bodies. 

### 6 According to a 1994 study conducted by Auburn 

### 7 University, Alabama anglers consume an annual estimate 

### 8 of forty-two to forty-six grams of fish per day. This 

### 9 is much higher than the EPA recommended dose of twenty 

### 10 grams per day or less for the general public and its 

### 11 likely that with the current recession and increase in 

### 12 food prices, fishing and fish consumption among the 

### 13 general public is increasing. A 2008 study, state 

### 14 outdoor recreation study in Alabama showed that over 

### 15 half of Alabamians fished in fresh water over the 

### 16 course of a year. Remember, many of those fishermen 

### 17 are subsistence fishers who depend on that high source 

### 18 of protein for their diet. 

### 19 We don't want to have to tell Alabamians not 

### 20 to fish and not to eat the fish they catch. Our 

### 21 fishing industry on the gulf coast was already 

### 22 devastated by the recent oil disaster, however mercury 

### 23 is impossible to clean out of our waterways and fish 

### 24 tissue once it gets in there. We must stop it at the 

### 25 source.AGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 316 1 Mercury emissions and air toxic are 

### 2 particular concern to Alabama Citizens and 

### 3 Environmental Community. We support the EPA's efforts 

### 4 to regulate mercury and air toxics from power plants 

### 5 because we support the health of Alabama citizens and 

### 6 visitors, Alabama's outdoor recreation industry, 

### 7 Alabama's fish and aquatic life and Alabama's water 

### 8 resources. 

### 9 MR. CLARK: Thank you very much. Michael, 

### 10 let me just ask one thing. The study you were talking 

### 11 about, and I'm sorry I was writing as fast as I could, 

### 12 but I, I didn't catch it. Alabama catching, consuming 

### 13 forty-two to forty-six grams of fish per day higher 

### 14 than -- do you have a site for that? 

### 15 MR. CHURCHMAN: I can get it to you. 

### 16 MR. CLARK: Okay. 

### 17 MR. CHURCHMAN: It was a study that was 

### 18 performed by Auburn University [indecipherable]. 

### 19 MR. CLARK: [Indecipherable]. Okay, if you 

### 20 could, if you could do that, that would be useful. 

### 21 FEMALE: [Indecipherable]. 

### 22 MR. CHURCHMAN: It was produced for, for the 

### 23 Alabama Department of Environmental Management. 

### 24 MR. CLARK: Okay. Well if you, if you could 

### 25 source it, that would be great. We'd appreciate that,AGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 317 1 so. 

### 2 MR. CHURCHMAN: Sure. 

### 3 MR. CLARK: And congratulations Cassy, so. 

### 4 Okay. 

### 5 MS. HOBERT: Thank you. 

### 6 MR. CLARK: Okay. Thank you very much. 

### 7 Next speakers please, Molly Embree and April 

### 8 Ingle. Eighty-five, eighty-six. I must, I must say, 

### 9 I, I, I asked -- they're very good. Sarah's very good. 

### 10 She's been doing this, but I asked her to phonetically 

### 11 spell some of these names if it's really strange and 

### 12 April Ingle comes back I-N-G-L-E and then in 

### 13 parentheses I-N-G-L-E, so it's like okay. I must 

### 14 really be slow, so okay. Anyway, Molly. 

### 15 MS. EMBREE: Okay. My name is Molly Embree, 

### 16 that's E-M-B-R-E-E. 

### 17 I'm speaking for at least a hundred and 

### 18 eighty-four of my friends, family, neighbors and 

### 19 colleagues who want the EPA to enact stringent 

### 20 regulations on emissions of toxic air pollutants. 

### 21 I'm a developmental neuroscientist at 

### 22 Yerkes National Primate Research Center and 

### 23 Emory University, but I want to make clear that I'm not 

### 24 speaking to represent Yerkes or Emory, but to 

### 25 represent my own personal view.AGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 318 1 However, my professional work informs and 

### 2 strengthens my personal view as you will see. 

### 3 First, thank you for proposing to regulate 

### 4 and drastically reduce emissions of mercury, lead -- 

### 5 I'm sorry, can you hear? Mercury, lead, arsenic, 

### 6 chromium, nickel, hydrogen chloride, hydrogen fluoride 

### 7 and other toxic air pollutants. 

### 8 Second, I hold you responsible to the 

### 9 American people to deliver on this protection of their 

### 10 health. 

### 11 I study brain development and it is an 

### 12 exciting time in neuroscience. New technologies allow 

### 13 us to study the structure and function of the, of the 

### 14 brain in healthy people throughout development. For 

### 15 example, go Gogtay, Giedd, and Lusk et al., 2004. 

### 16 This image shows the pattern of brain 

### 17 maturation from about age five to age twenty and as 

### 18 healthy kids mature, their gray matter decreases as 

### 19 white matter volume increases and the connections among 

### 20 neurons strengthen. 

### 21 Normal brain maturation in humans continues 

### 22 well into our twenties, as anyone who has raised 

### 23 teenagers can attest to. 

### 24New imaging research is beginning to identify 

### 25 the differences between healthy brains and thoseAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 319 1 affected by various pathologies, but we already know 

### 2 more than enough to remove toxic air pollutants from 

### 3 our environment. Decades of peer reviewed published 

### 4 science data and that's not pseudo science, but science 

### 5 data in reference to earlier commentary, -- published 

### 6 science data are referenced on the EPA and CDC 

### 7 websites. 

### 8 We know that lead and mercury are potent 

### 9 neurotoxins. They bio accumulate in fatty tissues of 

### 10 animals and humans including the brain. 

### 11 These chemicals are passed on from mother to 

### 12 infant in breast milk. Exposure, even at low doses, 

### 13 has its most profound and irreversible affects on the 

### 14 development of fetuses and young children. 

### 15 The serotonin system is disrupted by lead, 

### 16 mercury and other chemicals and I will also say in 

### 17 reference to previous commentary that controlled 

### 18 experimental science in the lab can cut straight 

### 19 through issue of whether -- of cause and effect, so we 

### 20 know that the serotonin system is directly involved in 

### 21 the development of not only brain and cognition, but 

### 22 lifelong immune, digestive, and reproductive function. 

### 23 I expect that industry will push back hard, 

### 24 fighting for less regulation and conditions that favor 

### 25 their bottom line. They will no doubt argue thatAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 320 1 requiring them to cut emissions will cost too much and 

### 2 hurt the economy, but with recent headlines like the 

### 3 CDC report out this week that one in seven U.S. 

### 4 children has a developmental disorder such as asthma or 

### 5 ADHD and increasing healthcare costs and with these 

### 6 chemicals implicated in chronic diseases such as 

### 7 diabetes and auto-immune disorders, we know more than 

### 8 enough now to require industry to phase out toxic 

### 9 emissions. 

### 10 Oh and we should have gone to the -- sorry. 

### 11 Back to our controlled experiments. So, we, we know 

### 12 from controlled scientific experiments that introducing 

### 13 these chemicals has not only an impact on the 

### 14 developing embryo, but can effect longer lifetime 

### 15 conditions. 

### 16 So we know enough to require industry to 

### 17 phase out toxic emissions now. 

### 18 Scientists will eventually spell out the 

### 19 mechanisms that cause many chronic illnesses and devise 

### 20 treatments, but as people with effected loved ones, we 

### 21 would prefer to prevent developmental problems and 

### 22 chronic illness. 

### 23 Prevention is what is really cost effective 

### 24 and most humane. We owe it to our children and their 

### 25 children.AGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 321 1 The American people are busy. They're 

### 2 working. They're trying to take care of their families 

### 3 and scrabble back from hard times. They need the EPA 

### 4 to act on what it already knows. 

### 5 Let our future scientific data not show that 

### 6 we did not act and that illness increased as a result. 

### 7 Let our future scientific data show instead that the 

### 8 EPA stood up to industry and that as a result decreased 

### 9 the incidents of illness and the cost of healthcare in 

### 10 the United States. 

### 11 Thank you for proposing this rule and we hold 

### 12 you accountable to deliver it in full. 

### 13 MR. CLARK: Thank you. Ms. Ingle. 

### 14MS. INGLE: Good afternoon. I'm April Ingle 

### 15 and that's I-N-G-L-E. I'm the Executive Director of 

### 16 the Georgia River Network and we are a statewide 

### 17 organization that works here in Georgia to protect and 

### 18 restore our rivers all the way from the mountains to 

### 19 the coast. 

### 20 We represent over seven hundred members and 

### 21 thirty river organizations throughout the state of 

### 22 Georgia. 

### 23 As is clear, summer is here in Georgia and 

### 24many of us are now taking to our lakes and to our 

### 25 rivers and our streams to enjoy time with our friendsAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 322 1 and family, to play in the water or just relax and 

### 2 enjoy the peace and quiet of these really special 

### 3 places. 

### 4I know for one that I'm looking forward to 

### 5 doing that this holiday weekend. 

### 6 Unfortunately however, hundreds of miles of 

### 7 Georgia's rivers and thousands of acres of our lakes 

### 8 have fish advisories due to the amount of mercury found 

### 9 in fish tissue. These standards will help fix that. 

### 10 These standards will provide the protections that we 

### 11 need to continue this legacy in Georgia of going to our 

### 12 rivers and lakes as families and friends that we've 

### 13 been doing for generations in Georgia. 

### 14Actually, each summer Georgia River Network 

### 15 takes three hundred and fifty people from all ages and 

### 16 walks of life on a weeklong educational canoe and 

### 17 kayak trip down a different Georgia river each summer. 

### 18 And through this trip we raise the awareness of 

### 19 thousands of Georgians about the importance of 

### 20 Georgia's rivers and encourage people to get out and 

### 21 enjoy them. 

### 22 This year is our seventh trip and we sold out 

### 23 in just over a month this year and in fact, there are 

### 24 several people in the room who have been on the trip or 

### 25 who are going to be going on the trip this summer.AGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 323 1 And the success that we've seen in Paddle 

### 2 Georgia has had impacts on the communities that we've 

### 3 traveled through each summer and this has lead to a 

### 4 burgeoning water trail movement in Georgia where we 

### 5 have communities all across the state that are putting 

### 6 plans into place to increase our access to our rivers 

### 7 in Georgia and we also, in our state, have invested 

### 8 millions of dollars in a program called Go Fish which 

### 9 is a program to lure huge fishing tournaments to our 

### 10 state as a means of economic development, so when you 

### 11 see communities and our state government really 

### 12 investing in this idea of getting people out on our 

### 13 rivers and our streams and our lakes. 

### 14And our families and our communities and our 

### 15 state rely on these rivers and people's ability to 

### 16 safely recreate on them as a means for economic 

### 17 prosperity and quality of life for our citizens, as 

### 18 well as the well being of our citizens and visitors of 

### 19 our state and we really see the benefits first hand for 

### 20 people in Georgia as they reconnect with their love of 

### 21 rivers and water and wildlife and nature and take time 

### 22 to bond with their family and friends while they're out 

### 23 there and connect to healthy lifestyles by being 

### 24 outside and being active. 

### 25 So we support these standards for thoseAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 324 1 reasons because they protect this legacy and our 

### 2 ongoing investments to do even more to provide people 

### 3 access to our rivers, lakes and streams. 

### 4And we -- I, you know I'm biased, but I 

### 5 really think that they're unrivaled and these 

### 6 protections are really great to protect that 

### 7 spectacular beauty and grandeur that people get to 

### 8 experience while they're out there. 

### 9 These protections, these standards will 

### 10 provide the protections that we need for this resource. 

### 11 So thank you. 

### 12 MR. CLARK: Okay. Thank you very much. Any 

### 13 questions anyone? Okay. Thank you both. Okay. 

### 14Natasha Herbert and Arthur Gibert, Gibert. I 

### 15 got it. Gibert. I was about to say Gilbert. Gibert. 

### 16 Who would like to begin? 

### 17 MS. HERBERT: I'll start. 

### 18 MR. CLARK: Okay. 

### 19 MS. HERBERT: Hello. My name is Natasha 

### 20 Herbert, H-E-R-B-E-R-T and I am a Georgia citizen that 

### 21 is concerned about the hazardous air pollutants from 

### 22 coal-fired power plants. 

### 23 I support the EPA's proposal to clean up the 

### 24 harmful toxins that are emitted from the power plants 

### 25 both locally in Georgia and across the nation.AGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 325 1 I have a public health background in 

### 2 individuals as well as the larger society will benefit 

### 3 from this proposed standard. 

### 4 The chemicals that are released affect all 

### 5 individuals including children and the elderly that may 

### 6 suffer from respiratory illnesses. 

### 7 These toxins pollute local water sources that 

### 8 are then consumed by humans and animals and manifest in 

### 9 our bodies. 

### 10 The soil, which produces vegetables and fruits 

### 11 for consumption, is littered with by-products that then 

### 12 enter our bodies. 

### 13 Our government set strict standards so that 

### 14 citizens, like me, have access to clean drinking water, 

### 15 free of harmful chemicals and we should take the 

### 16 necessary actions to ensure all citizens have clean air 

### 17 free of harmful chemicals as well. 

### 18 The health benefits cannot be emphasized 

### 19 enough. EPA estimates that by 2016, seventeen thousand 

### 20 lives will be saved annually. From a prevention 

### 21 perspective, heart attacks, eleven thousand and asthma 

### 22 attacks, one hundred and ten thousand, will be avoided 

### 23 by taking action now. 

### 24 In general, an emphasis on prevention methods 

### 25 saves the largest society economically compared to theAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 326 1 cost of treating asthma attacks, cancers, respiratory 

### 2 illnesses and other chronic conditions, such as birth 

### 3 defects that these toxins can cause. 

### 4It is important that our government act on 

### 5 behalf of the greater good and protect those that need 

### 6 it most such as children and the elderly by cleaning up 

### 7 the air. 

### 8 This air that we take for granted on a daily 

### 9 basis is polluted by these coal-fired power plants. 

### 10 These facilities generate electricity so that we can 

### 11 enjoy our air conditioning, television and other modern 

### 12 day amenities, but it should not be at the cost of our 

### 13 health. 

### 14I value my health, including my lungs, which 

### 15 provide the necessary oxygen for our muscles and 

### 16 tissues. These lungs should be free of chemicals, such 

### 17 as formaldehyde, benzene, mercury, arsenic, and many 

### 18 other byproducts from these power plants that are in 

### 19 our air. 

### 20 Studies have shown that heart -- studies have 

### 21 shown the harmful effects these chemicals have on 

### 22 human, human health and it is, it is unacceptable to 

### 23 allow these companies to release them into the air. 

### 24These companies have the means to impact 

### 25 health by cleaning up their plants and the technologyAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 327 1 for use to reduce toxic pollutants. 

### 2 As a public health professional, I believe 

### 3 the benefits of this proposal would have an immense 

### 4 positive impact on the health of our society, including 

### 5 individuals who suffer greatly from various respiratory 

### 6 illnesses. 

### 7 We cannot continue to take the air we breathe 

### 8 for granted. These toxins are harmful and actions 

### 9 should be taken to reduce the pollutants and the 

### 10 emissions from the plants. 

### 11 We must act now to ensure that citizens have 

### 12 clean air to breathe, free from debris from coal-fired 

### 13 power plants. 

### 14As a citizen, I value my health and I want to 

### 15 breathe clean air and thus I support this proposal. 

### 16 Thank you. 

### 17 MR. CLARK: Thank you. Mr. Gibert, Mr. Gibert. 

### 18 MR. GIBERT: Hello. My name is Art Gibert 

### 19 and that's spelled G-I-B-E-R-T. 

### 20 I'm Chairman and CEO of Art Gibert Landscape 

### 21 Architecture and Photography, which is a very, very 

### 22 small business. 

### 23 However, my livelihood does depend on a clean 

### 24 environment and my health. 

### 25 I'm also here as a member of the GeorgiaAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 328 1 Solar Energy Association, the Sierra Club, and Green 

### 2 Roofs for Healthy Cities. 

### 3 I'm a licensed landscape architect here in 

### 4 Georgia and have been for over twenty years. I'm a 

### 5 former member of the Chamblee City Council and I'm a 

### 6 planner. I worked with the State of Georgia for two 

### 7 and a half years before budget cutbacks got me laid 

### 8 off. 

### 9 I'm a native Georgian and I watched in horror 

### 10 as our air has gotten dirtier and dirtier along with 

### 11 our water and our land and I spent a summer in 

### 12 Louisville, Kentucky, by the way, back in 1979 and I can 

### 13 promise you that their air is often filthy. 

### 14 In response to some of the comments from 

### 15 apparently industry spokes-people, but perhaps they 

### 16 were well meaning tea partiers or whatever. I don't 

### 17 want to get into too many politics, but the competitive 

### 18 edge will be lost. I don't think so. Actually if we 

### 19 don't get some clean air and water around here, we're 

### 20 going to run out and everybody will go somewhere else 

### 21 and find a better place to live. 

### 22 Our economic recovery is threatened by 

### 23 imposing some pollution controls. Well, we still have 

### 24 a car industry. We still have an oil industry. We 

### 25 still have developers and believe me, all of thoseAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 329 1 other groups have faced regulations and have been 

### 2 forced to make changes to improve their impacts on 

### 3 environment. 

### 4I would question the industry estimate of ten 

### 5 times higher than the EPA estimate for the costs to 

### 6 comply? Based on what? If they would go ahead and get 

### 7 started, they will find that the compressed schedule of 

### 8 three years is not a problem. Where there is a will, 

### 9 there is a way. 

### 10 I would ask that the EPA not give more time 

### 11 for industry to review these standards. In fact, I 

### 12 would propose to you that they could have been planning 

### 13 for this eventuality for years and in fact, that they 

### 14 have been planning for it for years. They know that 

### 15 the standards will come and they have a plan in place 

### 16 and they will do what is required and only what is 

### 17 required. 

### 18 Therefore, I strongly support your proposed 

### 19 standards and I thank you very much for doing that. 

### 20 Speaking of the costs that they say, some say 

### 21 will go up twenty-five percent if these rules were 

### 22 implemented. Folks, our power bills just did go up 

### 23 almost twenty percent. Here in Georgia, Georgia Power 

### 24 Company, a subsidiary of the Southern Company is one of 

### 25 the strongest special interest groups in our stateAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 330 1 legislature. They contribute campaign money to 

### 2 everyone. They donate money to all the local 

### 3 communities and guess what? They expect a return on 

### 4 these investments, so people do not go down to the 

### 5 capital and speak up when they need to. 

### 6 I'm here because I'm not beholden to these 

### 7 special interest groups. 

### 8 As an elected official from 2002 to 2006, I 

### 9 attended several lavish receptions at the Georgia 

### 10 Municipal Association Convention in Savannah. Georgia 

### 11 Power officials told me to my face, Georgia does not 

### 12 have enough sunshine to produce solar power. 

### 13 Please. Okay. Since 1996, by the way, 

### 14 Georgia Power has owned the largest single solar panel 

### 15 array in the state and it's on the Georgia Tech 

### 16 campus. It was built prior to the Olympics. 

### 17 They got ample data and they're now beginning 

### 18 to approach solar power, but you know what, they want 

### 19 to make a profit on it and they don't want anyone else 

### 20 to. That's where they're coming from; money. 

### 21 So Southern Company, Georgia's Power's 

### 22 corporate panel has spent millions of dollars lobbying 

### 23 in the halls of federal government as well. This book, 

### 24 Big Coal, on page eighteen of the introduction details 

### 25 that you know, between 2000 and 2004, over threeAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 331 1 million dollars were spent by Southern Company donated 

### 2 to the Republicans and overwhelmingly to Democrats to 

### 3 influence federal legislation. I don't see a need to 

### 4 point out as many others have that we've been waiting 

### 5 for meaningful rules for years. I see my time running 

### 6 out. 

### 7 I will say in closing, I find it disgusting 

### 8 that here in the U.S., we have hundreds of 

### 9 organizations seeking cures for our ever increasing 

### 10 diseases while we do not take better care of our 

### 11 environment. 

### 12 Again, please stand strong for these rules. 

### 13 Thank you very much. 

### 14 MR. CLARK: Thank you. Okay. 

### 15 Andrea Lyle and John Krueger please. 

### 16 MS. LYLE: Me first? Okay. Hi. My name is 

### 17 Andrea Lyle and I live in Fayette County, Georgia, and I 

### 18 did not know where else to come. I heard about this 

### 19 and I thought this would be a great chance to speak up 

### 20 for what's going on with the air in Georgia. It's not 

### 21 about the coal, I'm sorry. So I'm a little off, but 

### 22 it's about the air that we're breathing and it was 

### 23 April, yes it was April of 2010. I'm sorry. You want 

### 24 me to stop since it's only about the air? 

### 25 MR. CLARK: Oh no, no, no. It's justAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 332 1 [indecipherable]. 

### 2 MS. LYLE: Okay. All right. This is not 

### 3 about the coal. 

### 4MR. CLARK: This is an air pollution 

### 5 regulation so it's fine. 

### 6 MS. LYLE: Okay. All right. 

### 7 MR. CLARK: And actually, let me just say 

### 8 Lyle is I'm guessing is L-Y-L-E. 

### 9 MS. LYLE: L-Y-L-E, yes sir. 

### 10 MR. CLARK: Okay. Thank you. 

### 11 MS. LYLE: And, and I would also tell you, 

### 12 everybody in the room, Andrea from Fayette at gmail dot 

### 13 com (andreafromfayette@gmail.com). If you want any 

### 14 information, I have gobs of government documents. 

### 15 Anyway, in April of 2010 on my way to work, a 

### 16 friend called me from Fayette County and she says, 

### 17 "They're spraying stuff in the sky." And I'm like, 

### 18 okay, you know and I blew her off. And she kept 

### 19 telling me about it and I blew her off. 

### 20 To get to the point, finally in July, I was 

### 21 working at a hospital on the south side. I've lived 

### 22 here since I was six. I'm fifty-three, so I know 

### 23 commercial airliners versus military. 

### 24A friend called me outside the hospital and 

### 25 she says, "You got to, you know, see this." There wereAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 333 1 four huge military aircraft on an incline, not a 

### 2 decline, so I guess they were going to Dobbins and they 

### 3 were plumes on each one so you had four, four, four, 

### 4 four, sixteen plumes of brown disgusting pollution 

### 5 coming out of them and that's when I became a believer. 

### 6 So I started watching and paying more 

### 7 attention and I noticed that every day, if I would just 

### 8 look up instead of just straight ahead as I drove and I 

### 9 would start looking up like out in my yard and stuff, I 

### 10 would see X's and T's in the skies and eventually at 

### 11 the end of the day, the sun would be blocked, so I have 

### 12 been to my congressman. I have been to Saxby 

### 13 Chambliss. I have been to Johnny Isakson. I have been 

### 14 on the news. I have talked to Allison Weiss at the 

### 15 EPA. I have wrote to Lisa Jackson. I, I have done so 

### 16 much. I have so many government documents where the 

### 17 government admits the Air Force, in 2004, that they are 

### 18 doing this. 

### 19 Some people call it cloud seeding. Some 

### 20 people call it they're trying to deflect the sun's 

### 21 harmful rays back up, you know, away from us, but what 

### 22 happens is, it becomes a people, EPA problem. It 

### 23 effects the air we breathe and it does. When I am out 

### 24 in it for just a little while, I start coughing and 

### 25 wheezing and I've never had asthma in my life and it'sAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 334 1 not pollution and I've seen the planes. 

### 2 I've seen foreign writing on one, on one 

### 3 wing. If you look on YouTube, you can see it for 

### 4 yourself. They're call chem trails and I couldn't see 

### 5 the manufacturer. I don't know if it's Boeing or 

### 6 whoever, but I've seen the planes. I've got lots and 

### 7 lots of pictures and videos that I've made and they go 

### 8 straight down, they straight up. They, they go so 

### 9 close together I used to wonder why they didn't crash. 

### 10 Now I know they're guided by NASA after going to 

### 11 US 

### 12 Research Global Change dot gov, basically. 

### 13 But no one will help and it's not just coal. 

### 14 It's not just pollution. Because this happens in the 

### 15 wintertime too and it's really horrible, but an attack 

### 16 is being made on the people and they, they don't even 

### 17 realize it because they don't look up. It's just not a 

### 18 normal thing to look up at the sky. 

### 19 And blue is not blue anymore and yes, I know 

### 20 I'm talking fast, but I'm just that way and it could be 

### 21 what I'm breathing making me that way. I don't know. 

### 22 But thank you for listening to me. I hope 

### 23 that somebody would please email me so I can send you 

### 24 some of these government documents I have and articles 

### 25 from the Washington Post where the U.N. is trying toAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 335 1 ban this, which is probably a joke, but that's what 

### 2 they say and I have proof that NASA's involved, but so 

### 3 I, I bombed on your all's parade. 

### 4Thank you very much for listening to me. And 

### 5 I'm just going to like get up and go try to find my 

### 6 car. So have a good day. 

### 7 MR. CLARK: Thank you. 

### 8 MR. KRUEGER: Hi, my name is John Krueger, 

### 9 spelled K-R-U-E-G-E-R and I appreciate the opportunity 

### 10 to come before you today and certainly your willingness 

### 11 to, to hold this hearing and give us all a chance to 

### 12 speak our views. 

### 13 I handle policy development for the Georgia 

### 14 Chamber of Commerce and I should state that I'm also a 

### 15 nearly forty-year asthma sufferer, so I'm sensitive to 

### 16 air regulations. 

### 17 The -- just to explain as background. The 

### 18 Georgia Chamber is a statewide organization for 

### 19 business in Georgia. We have nearly three thousand 

### 20 members representing five hundred different types of 

### 21 business and industries from nearly all of Georgia's 

### 22 one hundred fifty-nine counties. Our member also 

### 23 include almost four hundred local and international 

### 24 Chambers of Commerce and other business associations 

### 25 whose combined membership represents over half ofAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 336 1 Georgia's workers. 

### 2 And I say that because sometimes Chambers of 

### 3 Commerce are accused of being, you know, 

### 4 representatives of big business. We aren't. 

### 5 Nearly sixty percent of our members have 

### 6 fewer than fifty employees and two thirds of those are 

### 7 located outside of metro Atlanta. We're proud of our 

### 8 membership. Our membership, you know, employ the 

### 9 people in this state and, and so on behalf of our 

### 10 membership, I appreciate the opportunity to speak to 

### 11 you today. 

### 12 But now the Georgia Chamber monitors proposed 

### 13 legislation and regulatory rules before both state and 

### 14 federal legislatures and agencies on a variety of 

### 15 issues in an effort to educate and certainly, you know, 

### 16 get our members to advocate on, on issues of importance 

### 17 to the business community and I think it's important 

### 18 today that, you know, even though we represent 

### 19 business, this isn't about, you know, lack of respect 

### 20 for the environment. This is about public health, but 

### 21 this is also about reasonable regulations that are 

### 22 thoughtful and you know, achieve the desired impact in 

### 23 a reasonable way. 

### 24Our members, many of them are leaders in this 

### 25 state and the country on sustainability initiatives andAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 337 1 certainly one of the priories for our chamber this year 

### 2 is to grow that and, and you know, educate our members 

### 3 on, you know, the desired impacts of being sustainable 

### 4 and understanding, you know, the way streams and their 

### 5 processes and in being sensitive and being, you know, 

### 6 good stewards of the environment. 

### 7 But, you know, as we've heard, you know, today air 

### 8 quality has improved significantly and so as we look at 

### 9 these rules, we are concerned with the impact in, in 

### 10 essentially a threefold ways. 

### 11 First is the cost benefit impact. Again, 

### 12 this is on, you know, the economics of the cost of 

### 13 these rules and what the desired public health benefit 

### 14 will be. We've all heard and certainly you, you know, 

### 15 spent what, maybe almost ten hours now listening to 

### 16 data from different sources and I think we'll all agree 

### 17 that, you know, there are significant costs associated 

### 18 with this. And we're concerned from, you know, again 

### 19 our membership providing many of the good paying jobs 

### 20 in this state, what the impact of this will be on their 

### 21 ability to remain competitive and certainly the impact 

### 22 on their bottom line. 

### 23 The truth is our utilities in this state have 

### 24 already invested billions of dollars in environmental 

### 25 controls and it's built into their plans to keep doingAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 338 1 that, but the impact of what these proposed rules do, 

### 2 there are concerns on what that would do for their 

### 3 profit, you know, their, their ability to continue to 

### 4 function and to continue to provide jobs. 

### 5 That leads to certainly the economic impact 

### 6 on rate payers. You know, we've heard estimates from 

### 7 anywhere from twenty to twenty-five percent growth in 

### 8 utility costs. I've, you know, in my career, I've 

### 9 served on staffs in Congress and at the state level and 

### 10 you know, for years have looked at and, and tried to 

### 11 weigh the, you know, the members I've worked for have 

### 12 tried to weigh the economic benefits of regulations and 

### 13 you know, in the matter of utilities, you know, I've 

### 14 seen it study after study from, from ratepayers. 

### 15 Everybody wants, you know, green technology and 

### 16 certainly, you know, we in Georgia continue to expand 

### 17 renewable technology when it comes to utilities, but 

### 18 they're not willing to pay that price and so certainly 

### 19 that's a, that's a tremendous impact on the citizens of 

### 20 this state. 

### 21 And then finally, you know, looking at the 

### 22 compressed time line of, of the implementation of these 

### 23 rules cause us some concern as well. 

### 24Really in, in, you know, closing I'd say 

### 25 that, you know, it's interesting that the title ofAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 339 1 these rules are maximum achievable control technologies 

### 2 and I would just caution you that just because 

### 3 something's achievable, doesn't mean it's, it's 

### 4 worthwhile. You know, we could outlaw all these 

### 5 sources of, of emissions from, you know, all power 

### 6 plants or you know, fossil fuel power plants to 

### 7 gasoline engines to anything and still not control the 

### 8 prominence of some of these toxins in the air that 

### 9 occur naturally, so really on behalf of the Chamber, I 

### 10 just would request that the EPA be diligent in their 

### 11 analysis in, in the impact these regulations on 

### 12 businesses in the southeast. 

### 13 Thank you. 

### 14MR. CLARK: Thank you very much. Any 

### 15 questions or anything? Thank you. 

### 16 I think this is our last two speakers for 

### 17 the, before dinner anyway, so let, let me just say if 

### 18 you've signed up to speak and you haven't -- I'm sorry. 

### 19 I have two more speakers, June Deen and Flora 

### 20 Tommie. I, I -- okay. Those are you guys, those are 

### 21 you guys, great. If, if there's someone else that has 

### 22 not yet spoken who is either thinks they're signed up 

### 23 to speak or is planning to speak before dinner, please 

### 24 go out -- just let them know outside. Otherwise, these 

### 25 will be our last two speakers before the dinner break.AGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 340 1 And so June Deen and Flora, is Tommie, I 

### 2 think is the way -- is that right? 

### 3 MS. TOMMIE: Tommie, yes. 

### 4MR. CLARK: Tommie. Okay. Is June here? 

### 5 Ms. Tommie if you could, you could go ahead and, and 

### 6 you know, state your name, spell it and go ahead and 

### 7 talk and, and she may join us here in just a minute. 

### 8 Okay. 

### 9 MS. TOMMIE: For the record. My name is 

### 10 Flora, F-L-O-R-A, M. Tommie, T-O-M-M-I-E. I am here 

### 11 today on behalf of myself as well as representing the 

### 12 Perkason [phonetic] Civic Association and it's located 

### 13 in southwest Atlanta and we have a system called NPUs, 

### 14 neighborhood planning units and that's within NPUX in 

### 15 the City of Atlanta. 

### 16 One of the reasons I am here today is my 

### 17 concern that we have not yet enforced these 

### 18 restrictions upon the industry. Currently, we have sat 

### 19 here and we have waited while more people have problems 

### 20 with respiratory diseases and illnesses as well as 

### 21 develop more problems with our environment, with our 

### 22 rivers, our streams, and our lakes and Georgia is one 

### 23 of the states that does have a problem. 

### 24Personally, I'm going to give you a story as 

### 25 to why I'm so passionate about this issue.AGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 341 1 Number one, I have to push down to hear 

### 2 myself talk sometimes because I have severe respiratory 

### 3 problems. I have been hospitalized in the past of lung 

### 4 disease. I have also been hospitalized with heart 

### 5 condition related to breathing problems as well and 

### 6 that was documented through Grady Hospital as well as 

### 7 Emory Hospital, Crawford Long, Crawford Long at Emory 

### 8 University midtown Atlanta. 

### 9 First time I experienced a problem breathing 

### 10 was, I was outside walked through a severely congested 

### 11 traffic area, right there in midtown on Ponce de Leon. 

### 12 Got there, passed out, developed lumps in the throat, 

### 13 could not breathe. Had to have emergency operation. 

### 14Next time, they told me I had developed 

### 15 pericarditis, severe inflammation of the heart and lung 

### 16 sacks. 

### 17 All of this stuff happening, all the while 

### 18 they told me I had developed asthma to the point that I 

### 19 could not just go outside anytime I wanted to exercise 

### 20 or to walk. 

### 21 Now my issue is this. Industry says that we 

### 22 should just wait continually. I don't have that luxury 

### 23 of waiting. I have to have clean air. Before, I 

### 24 couldn't take a job in California because the air 

### 25 quality was so bad there that they had to begin workingAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 342 1 on it, then there were other states where the company 

### 2 was going and I worked in corporate planning and budget 

### 3 for insurance corporation at the time. 

### 4Now so I have to make a decision as to how I 

### 5 will make a living or even be able to exercise to stay 

### 6 healthy based upon the air quality of any place I go. 

### 7 Next, I had the issue also of passing out and 

### 8 having Atlanta Fire Department rescue me before we had 

### 9 an air monitoring system in the City of Atlanta, 

### 10 whereby the state would tell people whether it high, 

### 11 unhealthy air days. 

### 12 I discovered then that I could not breathe 

### 13 because the air on those days were unhealthy as they 

### 14 told me and I had to have oxygen and everything to help 

### 15 me breathe and getting it out of the atmosphere. 

### 16 I, therefore, began the issue of going ahead 

### 17 and filing a lawsuit against the State of Georgia to 

### 18 develop a monitoring system whereby people would be 

### 19 told when we had unhealthy air days. 

### 20 Industry still has never been -- I call it 

### 21 friendly to us as human beings living with them. We're 

### 22 not separate from the industry. All of us have to live 

### 23 and have air. Our children have to. 

### 24I don't think anyone should have to wait 

### 25 until it gets to this point and say, okay we can't fixAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 343 1 that yet, let's hold off on the regulations. I say 

### 2 they can. I say they can because number one, I was 

### 3 there as a child when EPA was established and industry 

### 4 was saying they couldn't meet those regulations then. 

### 5 I was there as a child when we had President 

### 6 Carter bring up the regulations for the Environment 

### 7 Regulations to being across the country. My family 

### 8 raised, helped raise President Carter. I was born in 

### 9 Plains, Georgia, in south Georgia. Our home is still 

### 10 there, so creeks, rivers, streams, I grew up around 

### 11 fishing people. 

### 12 I remember the day when people went to fish 

### 13 and they couldn't eat the fish. I remember when the 

### 14 subsistence of the signs began to be put in place in 

### 15 Georgia and we could no longer just go fish in creeks 

### 16 and streams. 

### 17 These are places that are basically, 

### 18 predominantly African American, native Americans, poor 

### 19 whites, and they are the type of people who -- they 

### 20 don't have the jobs or the health insurance to be able 

### 21 to go and get their problems taken care of. No one 

### 22 took care of them. Everything they do, they have to do 

### 23 on their own. 

### 24I think we have to say that these regulations 

### 25 are needed finally to help us begin to have a healthyAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 344 1 society so that we don't bury people in the ground 

### 2 early because of heart attacks caused by lack of access 

### 3 to clean air and be able to eat our fish in our creeks 

### 4 and streams. 

### 5 I want to definitely let you know if industry 

### 6 come after your scientists, you should all surround 

### 7 your scientists and EPA people and say we are going to 

### 8 look at U.S. EPA is the one agency that is here to 

### 9 protect, help the people, as well as help industry know 

### 10 how it can become better. It should not be this battle 

### 11 that's been brewed between people by political parties 

### 12 with people wanting to have power. It should be about 

### 13 the issue of the human life and helping our children 

### 14 not to be born with developmental disabilities, so that 

### 15 we can therefore take the next generation, they can go 

### 16 fishing. 

### 17 I have places where people go fishing that 

### 18 people have to catch them and stop them from eating the 

### 19 fish because it's contaminated and I don't know how I 

### 20 can get any clearer. 

### 21 Industry said they couldn't meet the 

### 22 standards and we had Chattanooga, Tennessee. The worst 

### 23 place in the country and one of the worst in the world 

### 24 and look at what we had to pay to clean it up. We 

### 25 can't clean up human bodies. Our children can't getAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 345 1 their minds back from mercury pollution, so we have to 

### 2 start stepping up to the plate and saying move ahead so 

### 3 that you can help industry become one of 

### 4 the best in the world and not compare ourselves to 

### 5 China, who has sub-zero standards for environmental 

### 6 pollution. We should not ever compare ourselves to 

### 7 such a society because I thought we all valued our 

### 8 citizens and your ratepayers are human beings. They 

### 9 have to have clean air. They have to have food and I'm 

### 10 glad that our former state senator also submitted a 

### 11 letter to you, Senator Zamarripa represented our 

### 12 district and I'm one of the people who helped to get 

### 13 him elected because we have a diverse population of 

### 14 people who can't come to meetings because they can't, 

### 15 feel they can't speak correctly. They can't write 

### 16 because they have limited writing abilities. They 

### 17 don't have access to technology to know what's wrong. 

### 18 But I do see, when I see children walking 

### 19 around with nebulizers, inhalers and all of this, that 

### 20 that's wrong. That's not what we should leave our 

### 21 children as Americans. That's not why we set up our 

### 22 national park system or any of these agencies that are 

### 23 there to help us preserve and look after our next 

### 24 generations. 

### 25 And I'm sorry, but I lose wind.AGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 346 1 MR. CLARK: Okay. 

### 2 MS. TOMMIE: Thank you. 

### 3 MR. CLARK: Thank you very much. Ms. Deen. 

### 4MS. DEEN: Thank you for allowing me to speak 

### 5 today. And thank you for your remarks. I appreciate 

### 6 that. 

### 7 I'm June Deen, J-U-N-E, D-E-E-N and I'm here 

### 8 to speak on behalf of the American Lung Association in 

### 9 Georgia. 

### 10 Toxic air pollutants emitted to the 

### 11 atmosphere by coal-fired power plants threaten not only 

### 12 the air we breathe, but the water we drink, the soil we 

### 13 live on and the food we eat. 

### 14This pollution harms the health of people who 

### 15 live adjacent to the power plants and hundreds of miles 

### 16 away. 

### 17 Georgia laws propel some Georgia plants to 

### 18 move further along in meeting the proposed 

### 19 requirements. It's time to level the playing field for 

### 20 all plants by making national rules. 

### 21 EPA's proposed standards are based directly 

### 22 on emission levels already achieved by electricity 

### 23 producers across the nation. 

### 24The limits would provide equal protection to 

### 25 people across the country, including protection fromAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 347 1 toxic emissions crossing state lines. 

### 2 The American Lung Association recommends that 

### 3 all coal-fired power plants cut emissions to meet the 

### 4 limits under the proposed standards. 

### 5 Additionally, the American Lung Association 

### 6 firmly opposes any attempts to reduce EPA authority to 

### 7 regulate these emissions, as there have been significant 

### 8 strides in cleaner air nationwide since the Clean Air 

### 9 Act was passed in 1970. 

### 10 Thank you. 

### 11 MR. CLARK: Thank you very much. Thank you 

### 12 both for taking the time. I believe we are going to 

### 13 postpone until -- or I'm sorry, Carol. Yeah, yeah, 

### 14 yeah [indecipherable] no. Is it -- 

### 15 MS. KEMPER: Is it Ms. Tommie? 

### 16 MR. CLARK: Tommie, Ms. Tommie. 

### 17 MS. TOMMIE: Yeah. Flora. 

### 18 MR. CLARK: Flora. Actually -- 

### 19 MS. KEMPER: May I ask -- 

### 20 MR. CLARK: -- Carol had a question for you. 

### 21 MS. KEMPER: I'm sorry. What community in 

### 22 southwest Atlanta did you say you were from? 

### 23 MS. TOMMIE: Perkerson, P-E-R-K-E-R-S-O-N. 

### 24 It's the Perkerson Community and it's named for one of 

### 25 the settling families of Fulton County.AGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 348 1 MS. KEMPER: Thank you. 

### 2 MS. TOMMIE: You're welcome. 

### 3 MR. CLARK: Thanks very much. 

### 4MS. TOMMIE: You're welcome. 

### 5 MR. CLARK: We are going to suspend the 

### 6 hearing until -- and reconvene at six thirty tonight. 

### 7 Thank you all very much for your time. 

### 8 (Supper break from 5:39 until 6:31 p.m.) 

### 9 MR. CLARK: -- only, only three here so far, 

### 10 as far as I know, but let me go ahead and start with 

### 11 the opening statement so. 

### 12 Hi folks, we'll reconvene the hearing. I 

### 13 have an opening statement which I will -- there's a 

### 14 copy of it there and I'll just do a very short summary 

### 15 of it. I think many of you have heard this already. 

### 16 But, as you know this is a public hearing 

### 17 that we're holding on Environmental Protection Agency 

### 18 Rules to reduce emissions of hazardous air pollutants 

### 19 from power plants and also new source performance 

### 20 standards to reduce emissions of particulate matter, 

### 21 SO2 and, and mercury from power plants as 

### 22 well. 

### 23 My name is Jeff Clark and I'm with EPA's 

### 24 Office of Air Quality Planning and Standards and on our 

### 25 panel tonight Carol Kemper who is the Deputy DivisionAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 349 1 Director for the Division of Air, Pesticides, and 

### 2 Toxics for EPA Region Four. 

### 3 Beverly, I don't know if you're going to join 

### 4 us or not, but Beverly Banister is yeah, will be with 

### 5 us as well. Beverly is the Director of that division 

### 6 and that division covers eight southeastern states. 

### 7 Bill Maxwell who is one of the primary 

### 8 authors of, of this proposed regulation and has been 

### 9 working on utility toxic issues for at least the twenty

### 10 one years that I've known him and, and then myself. 

### 11 So, we proposed these rules on March the 16, 

### 12 2011. We have a consent decree to finalize the rules 

### 13 by November the 16 of 2011. 

### 14 We're in the middle of a public comment 

### 15 period and are looking for public comments through July 

### 16 the 5th. 

### 17 The transcript from this hearing and from two 

### 18 other hearings that we held; one in, in Chicago and the 

### 19 other in Philadelphia, those transcripts will all be 

### 20 part of the public record and as you give oral 

### 21 statements tonight, if you have written comments that 

### 22 you'd like to give us now or later, we would certainly 

### 23 welcome having those. 

### 24 These are the first, there first federal 

### 25 requirements for power plants to reduce toxicAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 350 1 emissions. There are no existing federal requirements 

### 2 for power plants to limit their emissions of toxic 

### 3 pollutants like metal and -- metals and arsenic and, 

### 4 and mercury. 

### 5 And the prior administration, under the prior 

### 6 administration, EPA finalized a rule that cut mercury 

### 7 pollution from power plants, but the D.C. Circuit Court 

### 8 struck the rule down as illegal and required EPA to 

### 9 develop standards that follow the law in order to 

### 10 protect public health and the environment and that's 

### 11 what we're doing with this proposed rule. 

### 12 What, for those few of you that were not here 

### 13 earlier, let me just say that as far as giving comments 

### 14 tonight, we're going to stay until eight o'clock. 

### 15 We'll stay later if more people show up and want to 

### 16 keep going, we'll stay, you know essentially as long as 

### 17 it takes. 

### 18 We've been generally holding people to five 

### 19 minutes mainly because we've had so many people and we 

### 20 wanted to be fair and get everyone through the process. 

### 21 It might be a little more relaxed tonight if there's 

### 22 not very many people here, but generally, there's a time 

### 23 keeping system that we have here that -- you have a 

### 24 green light that comes on when you start talking that 

### 25 lasts for four minutes and then a yellow light kicks onAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 351 1 to sort of say it's time to sum up, and then a red 

### 2 light will start flashing after the five minutes is 

### 3 over. 

### 4Again, generally I, I think we should 

### 5 probably be okay with that given the, the number of 

### 6 people tonight. 

### 7 As I said, there are three people right now 

### 8 that I know of that are signed up to speak and we're 

### 9 bringing them, bringing you up two at a time and ask 

### 10 you to sit at the table there and so let me call up Lev 

### 11 Guter, Guter. Is that right? 

### 12 MR. GUTER: Yes. 

### 13 MR. CLARK: And, and Jenna Garland. 

### 14MR. CLARK: And also you if you could spell 

### 15 your name for the court reporter who again, Rich is the 

### 16 most important guy in the room here so as long as he's 

### 17 happy, we're happy so. 

### 18 MR. GUTER: All right. Well my name is Lev 

### 19 Guter and that's spelled L-E-V, last name Guter, G-U-T

### 20 E-R. 

### 21 MR. CLARK: Great. 

### 22 MR. GUTER: And I'm an Associate Organizing 

### 23 representative with the Sierra Club's Beyond Coal 

### 24 campaign. 

### 25 Thank you for the opportunity to comment inAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 352 1 support of these historic standards to protect our 

### 2 communities from mercury and air toxins. 

### 3 I live and work in Little Rock, Arkansas, and 

### 4 I have traveled here today to express my support for 

### 5 the proposed standards that will reduce mercury 

### 6 emissions by ninety-one percent from coal-fired power 

### 7 plants and soot by fifty-five percent. 

### 8 Coming from Arkansas, I would like to give 

### 9 you a little perspective on the degraded air and water 

### 10 quality that we experience from coal plants there. 

### 11 Air and water quality are, of course, 

### 12 interconnected because the fallout of heavy metals and 

### 13 air toxins from tall smoke stacks rain down into our 

### 14 rivers and streams. 

### 15 Methyl mercury winds up in our fish for 

### 16 instance, and in Arkansas, hunting and fishing are an 

### 17 integral part of life and culture in many parts of the 

### 18 state. 

### 19 Protecting the environmental and public 

### 20 health in Arkansas is fundamental to lowering health 

### 21 care costs as well as safeguarding the quality and 

### 22 longevity of the lives of all Arkansans. 

### 23 Yet, because of air toxins and mercury spewed 

### 24 out by coal plants, many of our streams and rivers have 

### 25 advisories against eating fish. In fact, according toAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 353 1 the Arkansas game and fishing commission, twelve out of 

### 2 the seventy-five counties are under fish advisories and 

### 3 twenty lakes and rivers in Arkansas are impaired for 

### 4 mercury. 

### 5 Just a couple of those rivers include the 

### 6 highly popular and recreated Ouachita River and Saline 

### 7 River. And it's not surprising that mercury is such a 

### 8 problem because the four operating coal plants which 

### 9 are in Arkansas, Independence, White Bluff, Flint Creek, 

### 10 and Plum Plant and they collectively emit over one 

### 11 thousand and two hundred pounds of mercury every year. 

### 12 Arkansas has no mercury controls on its coal 

### 13 power plants and without federal protections, there not 

### 14 going to be. 

### 15 The American Lung Association, on page fifty, 

### 16 of its 2011 State of the Air report sites that in 

### 17 Arkansas, over seventy one thousand adults are at risk 

### 18 for asthma attacks and twenty-six thousand children are 

### 19 at risk for pediatric asthma attacks. 

### 20 And since an estimated sixty-five thousand 

### 21 children in Arkansas don't have any health insurance, 

### 22 that means that their parents can't afford the 

### 23 expensive pediatric visits for their children and since 

### 24 the parents can't afford the necessary preventative 

### 25 care, they end up taking them to the emergency roomAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 354 1 only after there's a full-blown asthma attack. And 

### 2 only until the absolute worst symptoms are present do 

### 3 they have the ability to go to the emergency and then 

### 4 who pays for that visit? It's not going to be the 

### 5 poverty-stricken parents. It's going to end being the 

### 6 tax payers and the hospitals. And so that cost burden 

### 7 gets shifted onto the taxpayers. 

### 8 And who doesn't have to pay the brunt of 

### 9 those costs? It's the very industry that are 

### 10 aggravating the symptoms in the first place and that 

### 11 industry is the coal industry. And they do not have 

### 12 the necessary protections to keep them accountable. 

### 13 They are spewing out coal dust, and mercury, 

### 14 arsenic, heavy metals in the environment, yet they do 

### 15 not have to internalize that cost into coal. Those 

### 16 costs are externalized and that is why it is the public 

### 17 who is paying for the dirty coal industry and in fact, 

### 18 in a way they are subsidizing the externalities that 

### 19 the coal industry is forcing upon the public by 

### 20 breathing dirty air and eating the dirty fish in the 

### 21 mercury laden water. 

### 22 So, in, in summary, implementing reductions 

### 23 in toxic mercury and air pollution will lessen the 

### 24 health cost burdens that the public has already been 

### 25 shouldering. Today's proposed mercury and air toxinsAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 355 1 protections will place accountability on those 

### 2 industries who reap the greatest profits from burning 

### 3 coal and only once they have accountability will we, as 

### 4 a society, be able to move towards a cleaner burning 

### 5 sources of fuel, and a clean energy economy and I would 

### 6 urge the EPA to finalize these proposed standards. 

### 7 And I thank you for your consideration. 

### 8 MR. CLARK: Thank you very much. Ms. Garland. 

### 9 MS. GARLAND: Thank you. Okay. I, I thought 

### 10 this might tilt. 

### 11 MR. CLARK: It should tilt a little bit. If 

### 12 you force it, I think if you push it. There you go. 

### 13 MS. GARLAND: I had to put some muscle behind 

### 14 that. 

### 15 MR. CLARK: Yeah. 

### 16 MS. GARLAND: All right. Thank you. Good 

### 17 evening. My name is Jenna Garland. That's spelled 

### 18 J-E-N-N-A, G-A-R-L-A-N-D. 

### 19 I want to first thank you all for being here 

### 20 in Atlanta and thank you for your unwavering attention. 

### 21 I know this has been a long day for you three as well. 

### 22 I am a native Georgian. I was born and 

### 23 raised in Woodstock, Georgia. I now live and work in 

### 24 Athens with an organization called Southern Energy 

### 25 Network.AGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 356 1 We are a non-profit organization that works 

### 2 to combat climate change, advance renewable energy and 

### 3 promote a smart, just energy economy by building a 

### 4 diverse movement of young people in the southeast. 

### 5 And we organize grassroots campaigns and 

### 6 provide education and training to empower young leaders 

### 7 and cultivate regional progress. 

### 8 So I, I work with young people whose lives 

### 9 have been directly affected by mercury pollution. I 

### 10 primarily work with high school and college students 

### 11 and the students I work with are, you know, ensuing the 

### 12 traditional party atmosphere of college and they are 

### 13 choosing to spend their time and energy on 

### 14 environmental activism. Some of those students have 

### 15 been here today. Some of them spoke earlier and I 

### 16 think the, the fact that they dedicate such time and 

### 17 energy to environmental activism rather than being at a 

### 18 bar or a beach, is really indicative of the passion 

### 19 young people for our planet and our people. 

### 20 So I, I want to say that overwhelmingly the 

### 21 community that my organization works with supports 

### 22 EPA's proposed mercury regulation and on behalf of 

### 23 myself and our students, I want to echo Katherine 

### 24 Cummings words from earlier and say that we both 

### 25 support the regulation and its enforcement. I thinkAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 357 1 that part is critical. 

### 2 I know that I am very lucky and very 

### 3 privileged that as far as I know, I personally have not 

### 4 been directly affected by mercury pollution yet. 

### 5 Neither my sister nor myself suffer from any 

### 6 neurological disorders, so I'm reasonably confident 

### 7 that my mother did not have elevated mercury levels 

### 8 when she was pregnant, but I don't have that same level 

### 9 of confidence about my future. 

### 10 And when women become pregnant and choose to 

### 11 have a child, they take on a huge responsibility. 

### 12 They're taking on, you know, changes to their bodies, 

### 13 changes to their behaviors, and their lives and they're 

### 14 doing all of this to increase the likelihood that their 

### 15 babies are going to born healthy and happy and to be 

### 16 very frank, I'm very tired of the fact that it's an 

### 17 individual's Responsibility to protect ourselves and 

### 18 our children from neurotoxins. I don't think that's 

### 19 the way it should be. 

### 20 You know, by continuing to rely on coal, and 

### 21 by fighting regulations like this very one proposed by 

### 22 EPA, power companies are telling us that our lives do 

### 23 not matter as much as money in their bank accounts. 

### 24To the same individuals who testified this 

### 25 morning on behalf of Georgia Power and SouthernAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 358 1 Company, represent corporations that have spent tens of 

### 2 millions of dollars lobbying to de-fund the 

### 3 Environmental Protection Agency. These are the same 

### 4 people who put money in the pockets of politicians, who 

### 5 wrote legislation and then cast votes to try and 

### 6 de-fund the Environmental Protection Agency. And these 

### 7 are the same people who work to strip the Environmental 

### 8 Protection Agency of its authority to regulate 

### 9 hazardous pollutants under the Clean Air Act. 

### 10 So, you know, when they get up here and, and 

### 11 do their kind of dog and pony show about oh its going 

### 12 to cost jobs and everything. You know, frankly I just, 

### 13 I don't believe them and Georgia Power, Southern 

### 14 Company and I want to add in the Georgia Public Policy 

### 15 Federation because one of their folks was here earlier. 

### 16 You know, they do not represent people. I am a 

### 17 customer of Georgia Power because I have no other 

### 18 choice, so I can't vote with my dollar the way I do 

### 19 with a lot of other services and goods I buy. 

### 20 I send Georgia a check every single month, 

### 21 but they do not represent me or my interest or my 

### 22 opinions. And I want to make the case that that's 

### 23 especially true with the Georgia Public Policy 

### 24 Federation. They're not a membership organization. 

### 25 The woman who spoke on behalf of them said oh GeorgiansAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 359 1 don't want more regulations that will cost money. I'm 

### 2 sorry, I've been in Georgia for twenty-six years. I do 

### 3 want the regulations that are going to protect our 

### 4 health. I'm okay with paying a few extra dollars of my 

### 5 power bill if it means that me, my children, women who 

### 6 are pregnant right now, the babies that are being born 

### 7 every day in the state of Georgia are going to be 

### 8 healthier. 

### 9 And in fact, my rates already did go up 

### 10 because Georgia Power wanted to guarantee a twelve 

### 11 percent profit margin for its shareholders and the 

### 12 Public Service Commission voted to approve that. So 

### 13 I'm already paying Georgia Power extra to make sure 

### 14 their shareholders have a little bit of money. I'm 

### 15 one hundred percent okay with a few more dollars to 

### 16 protect the health of my, my neighbors. 

### 17 I believe that this is why we have government 

### 18 because we need individuals and communities for it to 

### 19 be protected from those who would use our lives, our 

### 20 health and our children's health in order to make a 

### 21 buck. 

### 22 So I just want to close by, you know, once 

### 23 again saying thank you to the three of you for being 

### 24 here. Thank you for writing this rule. Thank you for 

### 25 giving myself and others the opportunity to comment inAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 360 1 support of it and I want to say that you know, you are 

### 2 doing the right thing. This is going to mean a huge 

### 3 difference to the lives of millions and you know, thank 

### 4 you. I appreciate it. 

### 5 MR. CLARK: Great. Thank you very much. Any 

### 6 questions or comments from anybody? Thank you. 

### 7 Two more speakers, Michael Wall and Bill 

### 8 Cunningham please. Go ahead. 

### 9 MR. WALL: Hi. My name is Michael Wall. 

### 10 It's M-I-C-H-A-E-L, W-A-L-L. I want to sincerely thank 

### 11 you guys for sitting here all day and listening to a 

### 12 stream of folks arguing for and against this rule. 

### 13 Thank you for your endurance and your willingness to 

### 14 listen to all of us. 

### 15 I'm a seventh generation Georgian. I grew up 

### 16 in Tale County around the creeks and tributaries of the 

### 17 Flint River. I live in Atlanta now, but when I was a 

### 18 child, my grandfather would take me fishing and we 

### 19 would bring home strings full of fish. And those are 

### 20 some of the fondest memories I have of my grandfather 

### 21 and it disturbs me deeply to think that kids today, 

### 22 fishing with their grandfathers, bringing home a string 

### 23 full of fish or taking home poison and I look forward 

### 24 to the day when Georgians can have faith that what they 

### 25 harvest from the rivers and streams here are safe andAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 361 1 poison free, so please enact this rule. 

### 2 Mr. Maxwell, thank you for your hard work on 

### 3 this rule, decades of service. Thank you sir. I 

### 4 appreciate it. 

### 5 MR. CLARK: Thank you. Mr. Cunningham. 

### 6 MR. CUNNINGHAM: Yes. My name is Bill 

### 7 Cunningham, B-I-L-L, C-U-N-N-I-N-G-H-A-M. 

### 8 I'm speaking on behalf of the Unions for Jobs 

### 9 and the Environment, UJAE for short. UJAE represents 

### 10 twelve labor unions whose members total over three 

### 11 million. These organizations include manufacturing, 

### 12 transportation, electric utilities, and mining. 

### 13 These unions support the expansion of 

### 14 renewable, as well as conventional energy sources and 

### 15 all recognize the importance of coal generation and 

### 16 keeping electricity production reliable and affordable, 

### 17 as well as reducing the U.S. dependence on imported 

### 18 energy. 

### 19 Our members are concerned that EPA's proposed 

### 20 rules for maximum achievable controlled technology, 

### 21 that new and existing coal-based generating units could 

### 22 lead to tens of thousands of job losses at utility 

### 23 plants, coalmines, and in the rail sector. 

### 24And the question isn't whether PM, mercury, 

### 25 acid gasses, and so on should be regulated. TheAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 362 1 question is what those regulations should be. How 

### 2 they -- how much -- how they should be improved. 

### 3 We agree with several aspects of the proposed 

### 4 MACT rules, such as alternative compliance standards 

### 5 for acid gasses. These kinds of flexibility measures 

### 6 will help minimize the adverse impact on the rules on 

### 7 our members. 

### 8 We urge EPA to re-propose the rule to address 

### 9 statistical errors in the calculation of the proposed 

### 10 emission standards for mercury. 

### 11 We cannot comment meaningfully on the rules 

### 12 until we know what standard the agency ultimately will 

### 13 propose. 

### 14Alternatively, we urge an extension of the 

### 15 current sixty-day comment period to ninety or one 

### 16 hundred and twenty days. In the past, more time to 

### 17 analyze and comment on rules that are much more complex 

### 18 than the one being here considered were given. 

### 19 The proposed rule's source emission limits 

### 20 will not allow any new coal plants to be constructed 

### 21 because no single unit could meet all the proposed 

### 22 emission limits. The new source limits are based on 

### 23 emissions data from many different coal plants with 

### 24 widely varying fuel and pollution control 

### 25 characteristics.AGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 363 1 We urge EPA to take coal sulfur content into 

### 2 account in setting the alternative acid gas SO2 

### 3 standard. We do not believe that this rule should 

### 4 require coal switching at scrubbed units. 

### 5 We do not agree with EPA's estimate of ten 

### 6 gigawatts of coal plant closures due to the rule. 

### 7 Several independent estimates of the impact of the 

### 8 proposed rule are in the range of forty to sixty 

### 9 gigawatts. 

### 10 EPA should analyze the cumulative impacts of 

### 11 this rule and proposed transport rule together for SO2 

### 12 and NOx emissions because utilities will 

### 13 be required to meet both rules in the same time frame. 

### 14We are skeptical about the jobs analysis done 

### 15 by EPA. We agree that thousands of construction jobs 

### 16 will be created and that's a positive benefit for these 

### 17 trade unions, our trade unions, but we believe the 

### 18 agency is under estimating the loss of permanent jobs 

### 19 if hundreds of coal plants close and utilities switch 

### 20 to natural gas. One of UJ's members, the United Mine 

### 21 Workers of America, has estimated that more than fifty 

### 22 thousand direct jobs are at risk in the coal, 

### 23 transportation and utility sectors. 

### 24If three hundred workers lose their jobs at a 

### 25 coal plant, the new jobs created at the natural gasAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 364 1 plant would make up only a small fraction of the 

### 2 losses. Community impacts, such as the loss of tax 

### 3 basis and support for local school systems need to be 

### 4 addressed in EPA's analysis. 

### 5 We support the construction of control 

### 6 technologies to enable coal to be burned cleanly and we 

### 7 see that much progress has been made in the past 

### 8 because of EPA regulatory initiatives, but requiring 

### 9 multi new emission standards for many older plants will 

### 10 drive investments away from these plants and their 

### 11 workers. 

### 12 A major problem with the rule is its thirty

### 13 six month compliance time frame as set by section one 

### 14 twelve of the Clean Air Act. We urge EPA to provide an 

### 15 across the board extension of at least one year as it 

### 16 did in the marine MACT rule. 

### 17 More plants will be shut down and more jobs 

### 18 lost with the short three-year time table impacting 

### 19 more than one thousand units and we are reviewing the, 

### 20 the possibility of doing the kind of construction that 

### 21 would be anticipated under the rule and to think that 

### 22 basically the three-year time frame is much too short 

### 23 for that construction to be done. 

### 24Thank you for the opportunity to comment. 

### 25 MR. CLARK: Thank you very much. Thank you,AGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 365 1 both of you. Any questions guys? Okay. Thank you. 

### 2 I think we will suspend the hearing for a few 

### 3 minutes. It sounds like a crowd might be coming down 

### 4 the hall, so we'll see. 

### 5 (Hearing suspended from 7:03 p.m. until 7:07 p.m.) 

### 6 MR. CLARK: Okay. I think we're ready to 

### 7 reconvene the hearing and our next witness will be Mark 

### 8 Woodall please. Apparently, they're popular. 

### 9 MR. WOODALL: Thank you. My name is Mark 

### 10 Woodall, M-A-R-K, Mark, Woodall is W-O-O-D-A-L-L. 

### 11 I'm the chairman of the Executive Committee 

### 12 of the Georgia Chapter of the Sierra Club and on behalf 

### 13 of our ten thousand members here in Georgia, we 

### 14 appreciate you coming to Atlanta and hearing about this 

### 15 very significant public health issue, the toxic air 

### 16 pollutant standards. 

### 17 As you folks are probably aware, you're in 

### 18 the middle here of some of the biggest coal-fired power 

### 19 plants in the world. To the northwest, we have Plant 

### 20 Bowen on the Etowah River and directly south would be 

### 21 Plant Scherer on the Ocmulgee River north 

### 22 of Macon and actually just a few miles from here is the 

### 23 old Georgia Power Plant Jack McDonough, which is still 

### 24 burning two boilers of coal, I think, but will soon be 

### 25 three large natural gas-fired boilers over two thousandAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 366 1 megawatts, so I would say to the gentleman from Georgia 

### 2 Power that spoke earlier, there are alternatives to 

### 3 their dirty old coal burners. 

### 4 We are currently fighting three proposed coal 

### 5 plants in Georgia and having been down to Early County 

### 6 numerous times and over to Sandersville to hear the 

### 7 Georgia EPD talk about this. the best I can get out of 

### 8 the EPD branch chief, the multi-pollutant rule, 

### 9 they don't care how many pounds of mercury or tons of 

### 10 mercury are emitted. It's whatever the technology is, 

### 11 best I could tell listening to Mr. Capp. I don't know. 

### 12 I'm sorry I missed his earlier testimony, but obviously 

### 13 this is not a tolerable situation for the people here in 

### 14 Georgia and we believe it should come to an end. 

### 15 I'm also a shareholder in Southern Company 

### 16 and I was at the annual meeting over at Kellerwood 

### 17 Gardens earlier this week and got a copy of their new 

### 18 history big bet and currently I just started reading 

### 19 it, so I'm all on the dams they built, the bets they 

### 20 made on hydro power, but they certainly made a big bet 

### 21 when they built the big coal burner down there north of 

### 22 Macon, Plant Scherer, and as some of you may be 

### 23 familiar, they went out there and graded off a part of 

### 24 that proposed site and got themselves grandfathered in 

### 25 before the -- I believe that was the 1977 amendments toAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 367 1 the Clean Air Act. So all you heard that discussion 

### 2 about the millions of dollars they're spending now to 

### 3 add scrubbers and bag houses and SCRs and all the 

### 4 things they're adding should have been added twenty 

### 5 years ago and we shouldn't have had all this mercury 

### 6 loaded up on the people and the environment of Georgia. 

### 7 So they certainly got a ways to go, but for 

### 8 them to plead that they need more time after delaying 

### 9 and creating and jumping through every loophole 

### 10 possible, we don't have a whole lot of sympathy for 

### 11 that and as we have heard there are alternatives to 

### 12 some of these dirty coal plants they got, so they need 

### 13 to clean them up and we would appreciate you not 

### 14 allowing them to place any more big bets on the safety 

### 15 and the health of the people in Georgia. 

### 16 I don't know, I haven't gotten to their -- 

### 17 the discussion of first two units at Vogel. Those of 

### 18 you that follow nuclear may be familiar that when they 

### 19 built the first two units, they planned to spend eight 

### 20 hundred million dollars for four units there at Vogel 

### 21 and then Three Mile Island came along and they spent 

### 22 over nine billion dollars for two units which almost 

### 23 bankrupted the entire Southern Company. 

### 24So now they are betting again on nuclear 

### 25 power, so that apparently is their alternative, alsoAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 368 1 another one of their alternatives. We don't think much 

### 2 of that one, but they are spending many, many billions 

### 3 of dollars over there, so I believe they can scrape up 

### 4 a few million dollars to protect the people of Georgia 

### 5 from mercury and other toxic air pollutants, so we 

### 6 appreciate you all doing this rule. [Indecipherable] 

### 7 as fast as you can. 

### 8 Thank you. 

### 9 MR. CLARK: Thank you, Mark. Appreciate it. 

### 10 If there's no question for Mark, next is Tony Anderson, 

### 11 please. Mr. Anderson. 

### 12 MR. ANDERSON: Thank you. First off, let me 

### 13 please start off by saying it's an amazing pleasure to 

### 14 be able to be here on this beautiful, yet rainy day to 

### 15 offer I think what will be a pretty involved -- pretty 

### 16 amazing opportunity for me. This is my first time 

### 17 actually participating in this activity and I think 

### 18 that I'm pretty blown back by what this means. 

### 19 I'm not a scientist. I'm not a professional. 

### 20 I'm not an expert. But what I do know is that one of 

### 21 the most toxic and most persistent heavy metals in the 

### 22 known environment is mercury. 

### 23 And what I do know is that I was born -- I'm 

### 24 -- I was born and raised in Detroit, Michigan, where 

### 25 there is a known -- it's a known fact that heavy metalsAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 369 1 are in our water. Heavy metals are in our, our land. 

### 2 Heavy metals are in our lungs. 

### 3 My kid sister, when she was less than one, we 

### 4 discovered she had asthma and the asthma, the type that 

### 5 she needs steroids. The ones that blow your body up. 

### 6 By the time she is ten years old, she is not where her 

### 7 weight says her height -- or her weight is where -- 

### 8 meets her height. And that's a problem. 

### 9 Coal-fired power plants produce particulate 

### 10 matter including in that is, is mercury, that gets, 

### 11 gets thrown up into the air and puts into our lungs and 

### 12 we breathe that in. 

### 13 It's a known fact that coal-fired power 

### 14 plants are most of which, thirty percent are, are in an 

### 15 area which people of color, -- excuse me. Eighty 

### 16 percent are in communities where people of color live 

### 17 and there is a disproportionate affect on that. 

### 18 David Boyd Haley [phonetic]. He's a 

### 19 Professor and Chairman at the, of the Chemistry 

### 20 Department at the University of Kentucky, made this 

### 21 connection. He said, "Hey, mercury toxicity is a 

### 22 causal affect in autism." And directly is vaccines and 

### 23 dental amalgams and basically the idea was we know that 

### 24mercury enzymes alter brain tissue. And the gist, 

### 25 that, that -- I think, what I took from that is that,AGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 370 1 you know, the degenerative process of what mercury does 

### 2 to the brain makes people dumb and if we continue not 

### 3 to allow for this, for mercury, among other heavy 

### 4metals to be regulated, we are actually, we're allowing 

### 5 tacitly the dumbing of the future generations of us. 

### 6 There's a reason why the healthcare, 

### 7 healthcare world ruled out mercury in developed 

### 8 nations. In Sweden, zero mercury usage in health. In 

### 9 America, it's almost impossible to buy anything with 

### 10 mercury in it. Why have we not done so as it relates 

### 11 to single source -- as it relates to coal-fired power 

### 12 plants and other -- and other power plant generating 

### 13 facilities. 

### 14Coal -- or excuse me, mercury is bio 

### 15 cumulative. It bio magnifies in our food chain and we 

### 16 must be environmentally proactive as it regards to 

### 17 regulating this. 

### 18 This -- I work with an organization called 

### 19 the Let's Raise a Million Project where we connect 

### 20 communities of modest means with energy efficient light 

### 21 bulbs, as a way to start the conversation about 

### 22 sustainability. It's a known fact that those people -- 

### 23 we've, we've already introduced sixty -- excuse me, 

### 24 thirty thousand CFLs and water kits into communities of 

### 25 modest means and we ask a survey before we, we, we, weAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 371 1 begin the retrofit and a whopping sixty-two percent of 

### 2 the communities in which we engage cannot recognize the 

### 3 energy star logo. We show them the energy star logo 

### 4 and we said what does this mean? Sixty-two percent. 

### 5 And so what's happening now is that there is 

### 6 a different, there's a -- the need for this ruling that 

### 7 you're protecting a group of people that don't even 

### 8 know the harm that they're faced with. That's 

### 9 extremely telling and so I'm here conversing and 

### 10 sharing my thoughts with you, but there's a whole host 

### 11 of others that don't even know what this is about. And 

### 12 being that this is my first time doing that, I think 

### 13 that's telling in itself. 

### 14So, on behalf of Let's Raise a Million 

### 15 Project, a few other organizations that I'm 

### 16 representing; Sierra Club, Environment Georgia, thank 

### 17 you and I hope that this comes -- I hope greatness 

### 18 comes out of this and EPA stands up to and, and walks 

### 19 into its authority. 

### 20 MR. CLARK: Thank you very much. Sarah are 

### 21 we? 

### 22 SARAH: [Indecipherable]. 

### 23 MR. CLARK: Okay. So we're not exactly -- 

### 24SARAH: No. We're not [Indecipherable]. 

### 25 MR. CLARK: Breaking. We're just in slowAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 372 1 motion here for a minute. 

### 2 MALE: Well, we didn't expect hail. 

### 3 MR. CLARK: Really. Yeah, when we were 

### 4 [indecipherable]. 

### 5 VARIOUS VOICES: [Indecipherable -- talking 

### 6 amongst themselves]. 

### 7 MR. CLARK: So Erin Glynn is next and I take 

### 8 it this is Erin here? 

### 9 MS. GLYNN: Yes. 

### 10 MR. CLARK: Okay. Just need for you to be by 

### 11 a microphone. We can, we can take it to you over 

### 12 there, if you want to sit there. 

### 13 MS. GLYNN: No, I'm [Indecipherable]. It's 

### 14 just a video. 

### 15 MR. CLARK: Okay. [Indecipherable]. 

### 16 MS. GLYNN: So my name Erin, E-R-I-N, last 

### 17 name Glynn, G-L-Y-N-N from the Georgia Sierra Club and 

### 18 I don't have a comment today, but I'd like to submit 

### 19 this comment from the Upper Wautaga River Keeper and 

### 20 it's their official comment to be entered into the 

### 21 record. 

### 22 Thank you. 

### 23 MS. SAVAGE: [Video narrator] My name is 

### 24 Erin Savage and we're here representing the Upper 

### 25 Wautaga River Keeper. We're on the Wautaga Lake whichAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 373 1 is a pristine mountain lake; seventy percent of its 

### 2 shoreline is surrounded by state and federal land. 

### 3 There is no point source of pollution. 

### 4Nevertheless, in 2007, the Tennessee 

### 5 Department of Environment and Conservation added the 

### 6 Wautaga Lake to the list of fish consumption 

### 7 advisories. This advisory is aimed toward children, 

### 8 pregnant women, and nursing mothers because mercury 

### 9 consumption can impair the neurological development of 

### 10 children. 

### 11 MR. CLARK: Is your microphone still working, 

### 12 Sarah? Is it still working? Your microphone, right? 

### 13 Okay. 

### 14SARAH: It's loading. 

### 15 MR. CLARK: Yeah. 

### 16 MS. SAVAGE: [Video narrator] Since the 

### 17 Wautaga Lake is a pristine mountain lake, no point 

### 18 source of pollution, there's only one place that this 

### 19 mercury can be coming from and that's atmospheric 

### 20 deposition. The largest anthropogenic source of 

### 21 mercury in our air in the United States is coal-fired 

### 22 power plants. 

### 23 So that's why we're here today with the Upper 

### 24 Wautaga River Keeper to support the EPA's regulation of 

### 25 mercury, acid gasses and toxic air pollutants fromAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 374 1 power plants. 

### 2 MR. CLARK: Thank you very much. And by my 

### 3 count, you were witness number one hundred. So. 

### 4FEMALE: So she gets the prize? 

### 5 MR. CLARK: She gets the prize, yeah. Our 

### 6 next two speakers then would John Noel and Burt Lesnick 

### 7 please. 

### 8 MR. NOEL: I might have spelled my name, is 

### 9 that right? 

### 10 MR. CLARK: Please do, yeah. 

### 11 MR. NOEL: Okay. My name is John Noel, 

### 12 J-O-H-N, N-O-E-L. I'm a Tennessee native and a Georgia 

### 13 resident of fifteen years. Former state legislature 

### 14 and own a business for eleven years doing energy 

### 15 efficiency work. 

### 16 I come as a citizen today because I live in a 

### 17 neighborhood of northwest Atlanta that is literally in 

### 18 the shadow of Plant McDonough, the coal-fired power 

### 19 plant across the Chattahoochee River. 

### 20 And I had recently moved my offices and I 

### 21 noticed that our conference room window has a beautiful 

### 22 view of the coal-fired stack and when it is blowing and 

### 23 going as it is doing right now, it is a sight to 

### 24 behold. And all that, all that pollution just finds 

### 25 its way right into the Atlanta air shed. I understandAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 375 1 that plant may be closed in the years ahead, but 

### 2 there's plenty like it that are still subsisting. 

### 3 And so, I see firsthand. I live under its 

### 4 ash cloud, if you will, and I understand that's 

### 5 troublesome and I know that it's dangerous and 

### 6 difficult, but I also know that there are solutions and 

### 7 they are, they are energy efficiency solutions and they 

### 8 don't cost a lot of money and they have wonderful pay 

### 9 backs for people and they don't have to -- it doesn't 

### 10 have to be and this is the wonderful thing the power 

### 11 companies succeeded in doing is, if you do this to 

### 12 coal, the electricity rates are going to go up and 

### 13 one -- one point to that would be, so what? What's more 

### 14 important to your health or slightly lower electric 

### 15 rates, but I counter that argument and say that in fact 

### 16 they won't. That if we, if we were aggressive about 

### 17 energy efficiency, our utility rates would be stagnant, 

### 18 perhaps even go down. And we certainly would be doing 

### 19 the planet a favor and we would be doing our 

### 20 pocketbooks a favor. 

### 21 So having been in that business and 

### 22 understanding everyday when we do things for customers 

### 23 that it matters and you can just watch their utility 

### 24 bills drop significantly and I could go into depth 

### 25 about examples of that, County Courthouse, well BigAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 376 1 County Courthouse, this large facility, this whole 

### 2 facility used to be an energy hog. If you look at the, 

### 3 the, the billings for it now after a lighting retrofit. 

### 4 It just goes like this. And that is what but one 

### 5 building in a, in a, in a fairly large metropolis in 

### 6 Georgia. How many more could that be done to and other 

### 7 things, other than just lighting. 

### 8 So there's an energy efficiency component 

### 9 that we need to think about that are solutions to 

### 10 stopping this, helping stop this coal pollution and I'm 

### 11 delighted you all are here to take our public comments 

### 12 and I really appreciate it. It's, it's overdue. We're 

### 13 literally killing our population and it's not, it's not 

### 14 right. 

### 15 Thank you. 

### 16 MR. CLARK: Thank you. 

### 17 MR. LESNICK: Burt Lesnick. Hi. 

### 18 MR. CLARK: Hi. 

### 19 MR. LESNICK: I'm representing the American 

### 20 Thoracic Society. Imagine yourself as a child with 

### 21 asthma. You might have trouble breathing every day, but 

### 22 today the air pollution count is high. You're having 

### 23 much more trouble. You can't force the air out of your 

### 24 chest and as a result, you trap more air. Until your 

### 25 chest starts looking like a Michelin Man. Now youAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 377 1 can't get air in or out of your chest. Your inhalers 

### 2 are not working and you're desperate for air. You're 

### 3 on the way to the emergency room, maybe to be admitted, 

### 4maybe to get a breathing tube placed in your windpipe. 

### 5 Your asthma has changed from a chronic illness to a 

### 6 life threatening moment. You may see me, your 

### 7 pediatric pulmonologist. A lung doctor. 

### 8 At the hospital, we would use medicines to 

### 9 open up your airways and reduce the swelling. We'll 

### 10 get to work and we might get you off the breathing 

### 11 machine and home again. 

### 12 So I'm Burt Lesnick and I'm a pediatric 

### 13 pulmonologist and I treat kids with lung disease. The 

### 14 kids I treat generally have severe lung disease. 

### 15 We know air pollution is really bad for your 

### 16 lungs. Years of research and literally thousands of 

### 17 studies have made clear that air pollution can make you 

### 18 sick and if you have a chronic condition like asthma, 

### 19 it can make you sicker and in some cases it can kill 

### 20 you. 

### 21 When I see kids with lung disease, they're 

### 22 often in pretty bad shape. Usually through medicine, 

### 23 education, trigger avoidance, I can help kids and their 

### 24 families do a better job at managing their lung 

### 25 disease, but it's tough to protect yourself from theAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 378 1 air that you breathe. 

### 2 I know air pollution has an impact on kids' 

### 3 respiratory health. Every time there's a high ozone 

### 4 day in Atlanta, I know the office and hospital will be 

### 5 slammed with kids who are having an asthma 

### 6 exacerbation. 

### 7 Well, my casual observation is anecdotal at 

### 8 best. There are several carefully designed research 

### 9 studies that back up my observation; one of them 

### 10 occurred here in Atlanta during the 1996 Olympics when 

### 11 there were fewer cars on the road and we had fewer 

### 12 emergency room admissions for asthma. 

### 13 So when it comes to air pollution, I spend 

### 14most of my time rescuing patients from the bad affects, 

### 15 but today I'm here to do something different. Instead 

### 16 of waiting for the air pollution to make the kids sick, 

### 17 I want to be here and support the proposed rule that's 

### 18 trying to stop the air pollution from making the kids 

### 19 sick to begin with. 

### 20 The proposed rule will remove tons, literally 

### 21 tons of pollution from the air that we breathe. The 

### 22 rule will reduce acid gasses and particle pollution, 

### 23 both of which are known triggers of asthma attacks. It 

### 24 removes powerful pollutants like mercury, lead, and 

### 25 dioxins, dioxins all which can build up in theAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 379 1 environment and compare -- can impair a child's growth 

### 2 and brain development. 

### 3 The good news is we know how to remove much 

### 4 of this pollution from the air. There are power plants 

### 5 across the United States that have already installed 

### 6 the equipment needed to remove much of the pollution 

### 7 from their smoke stacks. 

### 8 Today's proposed rule will require all, yes 

### 9 all power plants to install pollution control 

### 10 equipment. This is how we will get cleaner and 

### 11 healthier air to breathe. 

### 12 Reducing air pollution will have significant 

### 13 health benefits for the U.S. especially for kids. EPA 

### 14 estimates the rule when fully implemented will prevent 

### 15 a hundred and twenty thousand cases of asthma symptoms, 

### 16 eleven thousand cases of acute bronchitis and twelve 

### 17 thousand emergency room and hospital visits every year. 

### 18 In my world, that means far fewer sick kids. Fewer 

### 19 anxious parents and a whole lot healthier America. 

### 20 As a member of the American Thoracic Society 

### 21 and a Pediatric Pulmonologist, I am please to support 

### 22 EPA and its proposed rule to reduce air pollution. 

### 23 While my comments today do not go into depth on the 

### 24many technical issues raised by the proposed rule, the 

### 25 ATS will submit formal written comments during theAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 380 1 public comment period to provide EPA with further 

### 2 input. 

### 3 Thank you and I would be happy to answer any 

### 4 questions. 

### 5 MR. CLARK: Thank you. I don't know that we 

### 6 have any questions for you. So, yeah. So thank you so 

### 7 much. 

### 8 MR. LESNICK: Thank you. 

### 9 MR. CLARK: We appreciate your testimony. I 

### 10 think we are suspending again for a few minutes, so. 

### 11 (Hearing suspended from 7:31 p.m. until 7:34 p.m.) 

### 12 MR. CLARK: I'm sorry. Oh that's right, we 

### 13 got our man Bill. We are ready to reconvene. We -- 

### 14 who's, who's -- okay. Brandon Sutton and Carly Queen. 

### 15 Hi, how are you? And if you could also -- when you say 

### 16 your name, spell it for the court reporter too please, 

### 17 that would be great. 

### 18 MR. SUTTON: My name is Brandon Sutton, it's 

### 19 B-R-A-N-D-O-N, S-U-T-T-O-N. 

### 20 I'm here to respectfully ask the EPA to 

### 21 fulfill its mission of protecting human health and the 

### 22 environment by following through on plans for 

### 23 tightening standards for mercury emissions. 

### 24 The standards will benefit public health and 

### 25 have long lasting positive impacts on the environmentAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 381 1 and economy for decades to come. 

### 2 I've seen the impacts of the lack of adequate 

### 3 regulation in the energy sector in my Spirit of the 

### 4 Gulf Coast documentary work over the past year. 

### 5 Today's I'm not just bringing my voice, but I'm 

### 6 bringing the voices of people hundreds of miles away 

### 7 that are still suffering from the tragic oil spill 

### 8 disaster last summer. 

### 9 What I learned in multiple visits to the 

### 10 region over the past year is that there is still an 

### 11 ongoing impact not being widely reported in the media. 

### 12 In following this unfolding drama, what I want to 

### 13 express to the EPA is that the impacts are not always 

### 14 visible to you, may not always visible to the media. 

### 15 The real consequences are in stress levels, the 

### 16 depression cases, doctors office visits, broken local 

### 17 economies, dwindling bank accounts, shattered dreams 

### 18 and the very real life from many people who live in 

### 19 communities throughout the gulf region. 

### 20 On the surface, oil and mercury don't have 

### 21 much in common, but the lessons I learned in the 

### 22 aftermath of the oil spill apply directly to your 

### 23 decision to adopt stronger mercury emission standards 

### 24 now. 

### 25 You can't always see the impacts of toxicAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 382 1 pollution, but they are real and they're serious. You 

### 2 can't always see that a pregnant woman walking down the 

### 3 street, has mercury contamination by looking at her, 

### 4 just as you can't see that there is an oil spill impact 

### 5 in coastal Alabama by looking at the white sandy 

### 6 beaches. 

### 7 Mercury pollution adversely affects public 

### 8 health across the U.S., yet the regulation of this 

### 9 pollutant can actually create jobs in the same 

### 10 communities that are impacted by this contamination 

### 11 today. 

### 12 The decision to tighten standards on mercury 

### 13 emissions is indeed vital to creating healthy 

### 14 communities across the nation. 

### 15 I ask myself how I could help you reckon with 

### 16 the delayed consequences of this toxic contamination 

### 17 when immediate consequences are not necessarily 

### 18 dramatic. I can show you economic impacts, distrust of 

### 19 seafood and frustration with the spill clean up 

### 20 overall, but I only have time to share a few voices 

### 21 with you today. 

### 22 Although not widely acknowledged and largely 

### 23 invisible to the rest in the country, these stories are 

### 24 real. From Mobile, Alabama, to Grand 

### 25 Isle, Louisiana, I've personally spoken to citizens whoAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 383 1 continue to struggle even now. I hope their stories 

### 2 will help you in your decision to tighten standards on 

### 3 mercury emissions. 

### 4You have the opportunity to take preventative 

### 5 action on behalf of the people who live in sensitive 

### 6 areas where mercury contamination is an ongoing threat. 

### 7 I hope you'll take it. 

### 8 FEMALE: [Narrator on video] My daughter said, 

### 9 "Momma, why does it take a tragedy for people to wake 

### 10 up?" 

### 11 CHILD: A lot of the people are naive to 

### 12 what's going on in the rest of the country. 

### 13 CHILD: And they believe that the oil isn't 

### 14 here anymore, but it is. It's not gone. 

### 15 FEMALE: It's no longer winter time so the 

### 16 doctors can't say that the cold air and the heat inside 

### 17 house, the flu, and the upper respiratory. That can't 

### 18 happen anymore. The pollen is gone now so they can't 

### 19 blame the pollen for all the asthma and people, now 

### 20 here it is, you know, springtime and people are -- 

### 21 it's the same thing they had at Christmas, they have 

### 22 now. It hasn't gone away. 

### 23 MALE: This fall and this winter, we seem to 

### 24 be suffering more from respiratory type illnesses. 

### 25 CHILD: Talking about the health is prettyAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 384 1 much in the same attitude towards talking about the oil 

### 2 spill. People still try to act like they don't talk 

### 3 about it, they don't think about it, it's going to go 

### 4 away, but it's hard to ignore. 

### 5 FEMALE: And there's not been anybody, any 

### 6 media, any doctor, any surgeon general, any government 

### 7 saying okay citizens, if these are your symptoms, 

### 8 please let us know so we, we can, you know, see what we 

### 9 can do to, to find an answer. 

### 10 MALE: We need to get the government really 

### 11 to take responsibility on the behalf of people. That's 

### 12 what we, we vote them in there for. That's what we pay 

### 13 them for. That's why you got them up there for. So 

### 14 help us. Help the people down here. 

### 15 MALE: You know, I think we really need to be 

### 16 sensitive and, and conscious to how our technology can 

### 17 harm the environment and ultimately harm ourselves and 

### 18 all of nature as well. 

### 19 MR. SUTTON: Thank you for letting me share 

### 20 those stories with you today. 

### 21 MR. CLARK: Thank you. 

### 22 MS. QUEEN: Hi. My name is Carly Queen. 

### 23 MR. CLARK: Hi. 

### 24MS. QUEEN: C-A-R-L-Y, Q-U-E-E-N. I grew up 

### 25 in western North Carolina near the Great SmokeyAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 385 1 Mountains National Park; one of the most beautiful 

### 2 places in the country if you ask me and we tend to 

### 3 think of ourselves as having the best, cleanest water 

### 4 in the southeast region. 

### 5 I grew up with asthma. I moved from North 

### 6 Carolina about seven years ago to come and get my 

### 7 Bachelor's Degree from Georgia Tech in Mechanical 

### 8 Engineering and I currently work for National Wildlife 

### 9 Federation as their southeast field coordinator for the 

### 10 campus program. But I'm here today as an individual. 

### 11 I actually wasn't going to comment today. I 

### 12 came as an observer because I didn't really feel like I 

### 13 had a good story to tell about mercury and toxics. And 

### 14 then today when we were getting our mercury hair tests 

### 15 done over lunch, I started to think, you know, I'm very 

### 16 privileged to have grown up as a vegetarian. I've 

### 17 never eaten fish, so I probably have not been exposed 

### 18 to any kind of high levels of mercury or other toxics 

### 19 in that way, but then I started to think, you know, the 

### 20 part of Atlanta that I live in and where I grew up in 

### 21 North Carolina are both very close to industrial sites; 

### 22 paper mills, train yards, all sorts of chemical plants 

### 23 that I don't even know what they do or what they're 

### 24 emitting. And so it would be really interesting to see 

### 25 what my results are.AGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 386 1 But I started to think more about the people 

### 2 I'm connected to in my family and so, I'm really here 

### 3 because I'm concerned about my friends and my family 

### 4 and my mother and my father and future generations and 

### 5 the impacts that this constant emission of toxic 

### 6 pollution into our atmosphere and into our water could 

### 7 have on them. Impacts that we don't even completely 

### 8 understand. I worry about my mother and father who, 

### 9 you know, my step-father goes out fishing in North 

### 10 Carolina and Georgia all the time, catches trout and 

### 11 you know, they eat it and I know in North Carolina, 

### 12 there's a statewide advisory about mercury and I'm sure 

### 13 that it's probably just as bad here in Georgia. 

### 14And so I worry about that and then I know my 

### 15 mother did experience some minor neurological damage 

### 16 from mercury poisoning some years back from a filling 

### 17 that leaked and so they're definitely very visible 

### 18 impacts. She went to the doctor because she was sick 

### 19 and finally they figured what was going on, so it does 

### 20 have health impacts. I know you know that, but it has 

### 21 been called into question today, which is just crazy. 

### 22 I've also seen children with severe autism 

### 23 and how impossible it is for them to even communicate 

### 24 or function as a human to another human being. This 

### 25 child just screaming and crying for no reason andAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 387 1 there's nothing you can do to calm them. 

### 2 Also at the beginning of this year, my father 

### 3 was diagnosed with leukemia and he passed away in 

### 4 February. My step-mother also has been diagnosed with 

### 5 multiple sclerosis and when I talked to my physician 

### 6 about this, you know, she was, she asked well was he a 

### 7 chemist or something, you know, because she suggested 

### 8 that his disease could have been linked to some kind of 

### 9 exposure to toxic chemicals. 

### 10 When I did a little more research about it, 

### 11 no there's not definitive answers out there that this 

### 12 is definitely causing all the leukemia in the world, 

### 13 but there have been numerous studies connecting mercury 

### 14 exposure to both multi sclerosis and leukemia, and so 

### 15 it just makes me wonder, you know? Even though we 

### 16 don't know exactly or have the evidence just laid out 

### 17 in front of someone from the laboratory tests that yes 

### 18 this causes leukemia in humans, doesn't mean that it 

### 19 doesn't. And it doesn't mean that it's not causing all 

### 20 sorts of other adverse health effects that we don't 

### 21 understand, so I just think it's really important and I 

### 22 urge you to use the precautionary principal and enact 

### 23 the strongest possible protections for the public 

### 24 health against these toxic emissions. 

### 25 I just want to say a few things about some ofAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 388 1 the comments from industry representatives earlier 

### 2 today. I want to say that I do not feel that they 

### 3 speak for me or for the public. I'm disgusted that 

### 4 they claim to speak for low income communities and 

### 5 communities of color because they don't. They speak 

### 6 for a very small handful of elite rich people who, you 

### 7 know, even if they do get sick can pay for all their 

### 8 health bills and whatever and they don't live near the 

### 9 coal plants. They don't live, you know, where they're 

### 10 exposed to these astronomical levels of toxic pollution 

### 11 and the people that they're claiming to care about, you 

### 12 know, in, in keeping the power rates low are not people 

### 13 that they actually care about and they don't care about 

### 14 jobs. They're trying to get rid of your jobs by de

### 15 funding the EPA, so I just urge you to please don't 

### 16 listen to them, they're lying. And please protect our 

### 17 health and enact the strongest possible rules. 

### 18 And thank you for the opportunity to comment. 

### 19 MR. CLARK: Thank you for the comments. 

### 20 Okay. Melissa Nummink. 

### 21 MS. NUMMINK: Good evening. I can imagine 

### 22 that you guys are ready to go. I'm going to make this 

### 23 short and sweet. 

### 24MR. CLARK: If you could -- let me just, 

### 25 before you make it short and sweet if you could --AGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 389 1 MS. NUMMINK: Yes. My name and spell it. 

### 2 MR. CLARK: Thank you. 

### 3 MS. NUMMINK: My name is Melissa Nummink -- 

### 4MR. CLARK: I'm a bureaucrat, you know, after 

### 5 a while you just -- 

### 6 MS. NUMMINK: That's okay. I got it. I'm a 

### 7 teacher. I know how rules are. M-E-L-I-S-S-A, 

### 8 N-U-M-M-I-N-K. 

### 9 MR. CLARK: Thank you. 

### 10 MS. NUMMINK: I teach science here in Atlanta 

### 11 in the public school system. And I ride my bike to 

### 12 school every day and I encourage my students to do the 

### 13 same for exercise and the environment. 

### 14Air toxics like arsenic, mercury and dioxins 

### 15 make this healthy exercise questionable. My students 

### 16 aren't fouling their own air, these eleven, twelve, and 

### 17 thirteen year olds are not the reason that we have 

### 18 toxins. It's coal-fired power plants and I don't 

### 19 understand why we're poisoning ourselves. 

### 20 With the data that I was able to look at; you 

### 21 know seventeen thousand premature deaths, eleven 

### 22 thousand heart attacks, eleven thousand cases of acute 

### 23 bronchitis, and a hundred and twenty thousand asthma 

### 24 attacks being the toll that air toxics take on our 

### 25 society annually.AGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 390 1 With our government refusing to place safe 

### 2 emission standards on energy companies, I'm floored. 

### 3 Our government should be for the people, not 

### 4 corporations including air quality through fair 

### 5 regulation is for the people. Inaction is unhealthy 

### 6 for the people. 

### 7 Science has provided us methods to diminish 

### 8 these air toxics. It requires effort, but it's 

### 9 reasonable effort. I can tell you that looking at the 

### 10 little faces that I do every day would convince you too. 

### 11 Until we move towards better alternative 

### 12 energies, we should make our current energy safe. Air 

### 13 toxics, they can be controlled. Inaction by our 

### 14 government and all of us allow us, allow them to exist 

### 15 in the air so, you know, the energy companies, I'm sure 

### 16 say that this, you know, rule will mean layoffs, fewer 

### 17 jobs. That is truly inconvenient. I understand. But 

### 18 it's also inconvenient that people get sick from power 

### 19 plants. It's also inconvenient that children develop 

### 20 neurological disorders that they have trouble learning 

### 21 in my classroom because of these chemicals. And that 

### 22 pollution causes heart attacks and premature deaths. 

### 23 So the children in my classroom are relying on the 

### 24 adults to make their world safe. 

### 25 I wouldn't expose my child to air toxicsAGREN BLANDO COURT REPORTING & VIDEO INC

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### 391 1 willingly. I'm here on behalf of my students, my mom 

### 2 who has asthma, and the future to ask you to consider 

### 3 please to stop it. The EPA needs to do anything 

### 4 necessary to provide toxic free air. The solutions are 

### 5 available to make life better for us all and we don't 

### 6 need to poison ourselves any more. 

### 7 Thank you so much. 

### 8 MR. CLARK: Thank you very much. We will 

### 9 suspend the hearing again for a few minutes. 

### 10 (No other speakers present. Hearing adjourned.) 

### 11 (Off the record.) 

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