From: Hirsch, Bruce R [mailto:Bruce.R.Hirsch@bge.com] 

Sent: Monday, October 24, 2011 10:20 AM 

To: 'Mahesh P. Sampat'; Richard Parker; Kenneth Winder 

Cc: phopkinson@hvolt.com; Aaron.Meyers@cooperindustries.com; adelaski@standardsasap.org; 

ahofmann@publicpower.org; Aris Marantan; artrosenfeld@gmail.com; august.esch@gmail.com; 

BermanEconomics@gmail.com; Brian Coffey; bsmith@federalpacific.com; Chris Boulduc; Caitlin Johnson; 

carlos.gaytan@ge.com; carlosgsiqueiros@eaton.com; chad.kennedy@us.schneider-electric.com; 

charlied@uus.org; chuck.simmons@pgnmail.com; clark.silcox@nema.org; cstephens@neea.org; 

Daniel.Cohen@hq.doe.gov; dave.millure@metglas.com; DYoung@energy-solution.com; 

eduardorobles@eaton.com; Eric.Petersen@aksteel.com; gbf1@pge.com; gjrosenquist@lbl.gov; 

greg.coulter405@gmail.com; James.Lass@cleco.com; Jennifer.Tiedeman@hq.doe.gov; 

Jeremiah.Freeman@ee.doe.gov; jerry.corkran@cooperindustries.com; jerry.schoen@aksteel.com; 

jhodge@howard-ind.com; Jim.creevy@nema.org; Jim.Raba@ee.doe.gov; jmauer@standardsasap.org; 

john.caskey@nema.org; john.cymbalsky@ee.doe.gov; jrossetti@mlgw.org; kcoughlin@lbl.gov; 

mark.stoering@xcelenergy.com; Matthew Nardotti; maxinesavitz@aol.com; mhyland@appanet.org; 

Michael Rivest; mwaltner@nrdc.org; Paul.Ryan@hitmet.com; phil@pjharter.com; 

pkumar@publicpower.org; Raymond.Polinski@atimetals.com; rgreeson@federalpacific.com; 

richardparkerdc@gmail.com; rick.anderson@faypwc.com; robert.saint@nreca.coop; 

robert.vanbuskirk@ee.doe.gov; rroy@nrdc.org; ScottB@lvmetals.com; snadel@aceee.org; 

srosenstock@eei.org; tballo@earthjustice.org; Teckman@nwcouncil.org; thomas.patzner@us.schneiderelectric.com; vijay.tendulkar@onyxpower.com; Zhimei Luo; Ken Winder 

Subject: RE: Replacement Cost for Transformer Pole 

Mahesh,

The answer to your question will probably be all over the map. In reality, utilities are governed by the

pole loading standards as set forth in the NESC. WE build our system to meet wind or ice loading

requirements. The area of the Country we are in determines how much loading we can put on a pole

and still met the standards. Company practices including third part attachments and storm hardening

requirements will also affect when a pole needs to be changed. Essentially anytime a change is made on

the pole (either a change in equipment or an addition of equipment) the pole loading is checked to

make sure it does not exceed the Code requirements. Thus, changing a transformer with a heavier

transformer will trigger a review and possibly a pole change‐out.  

Because we were purchasing transformers on a TOC basis (A/B factors), the 1‐1‐2010 DOE requirements

had minimum effect on the size of our single ratio transformers. Our dual ration transformers (13kV/4kV

primary), however, were greatly affected with respect to weight and size. The majority of cases where

we need to replace a dual ratio transformer, require us to change the pole. The issue is compounded on

“lot line” work where we cannot get a truck to the location. In these cases, men must manually pull the

transformer up the pole to set it. This class of transformers is where we have started doing more

refurbishment of used units to help resolve the replacement issues.  

We are also concerned of the increase in weight with respect to our truck capacities. Our

Digger/Derricks which are used primarily for pole replacement but can also be used to lift a transformer

are rated at 1,590 lbs. max. Our bucket trucks, which we buy equipped with a jib for lifting equipment,

are our primary truck used for lifting transformers. They are rated from 660 lbs to 2,000 lbs. max

depending on how far the jib is extended. As transformers get heavier, the ability to use of a truck to set
transformers is lost thus driving up transformer replacement costs to “lot line” type levels as discussed

in a previous email.  

Finally, I would like to restate my concern with transformer size. When we talk size problems most

people think of the vault and network type transformers. While these are a concern, my main concern is

the size of pole type transformers. We in Baltimore (and I assume most large cities throughout the US)

constantly battle to maintain safety clearances from other utilities on our poles and also from public

infringement on the safety separations set by Code. In a congested city like Baltimore, even minimal

changes in the size of a transformer can lead to major work to ensure the safety clearances are

maintained. I know the goals are to improve air quality, but the certain death from electrocution is an

even more ominous affect that could result from the changes being proposed.   

                                                                                                                                                                Bruce  

From: Mahesh P. Sampat [mailto:maheshsampat@bellsouth.net] 

Sent: Thursday, October 20, 2011 1:10 PM 

To: Richard Parker; Kenneth Winder 

Cc: phopkinson@hvolt.com; Aaron.Meyers@cooperindustries.com; adelaski@standardsasap.org; 

ahofmann@publicpower.org; amarantan@navigant.com; artrosenfeld@gmail.com; 

august.esch@gmail.com; BermanEconomics@gmail.com; brian.coffey@navigant.com; Hirsch, Bruce R; 

bsmith@federalpacific.com; Chris Boulduc; Caitlin.Johnson@navigant.com; carlos.gaytan@ge.com; 

carlosgsiqueiros@eaton.com; chad.kennedy@us.schneider-electric.com; charlied@uus.org; 

chuck.simmons@pgnmail.com; clark.silcox@nema.org; cstephens@neea.org; Daniel.Cohen@hq.doe.gov; 

dave.millure@metglas.com; DYoung@energy-solution.com; eduardorobles@eaton.com; 

Eric.Petersen@aksteel.com; gbf1@pge.com; gjrosenquist@lbl.gov; greg.coulter405@gmail.com; 

James.Lass@cleco.com; Jennifer.Tiedeman@hq.doe.gov; Jeremiah.Freeman@ee.doe.gov; 

jerry.corkran@cooperindustries.com; jerry.schoen@aksteel.com; jhodge@howard-ind.com; 

Jim.creevy@nema.org; Jim.Raba@ee.doe.gov; jmauer@standardsasap.org; john.caskey@nema.org; 

john.cymbalsky@ee.doe.gov; jrossetti@mlgw.org; kcoughlin@lbl.gov; mark.stoering@xcelenergy.com; 

matthew.nardotti@navigant.com; maxinesavitz@aol.com; mhyland@appanet.org; 

mrivest@navigant.com; mwaltner@nrdc.org; Paul.Ryan@hitmet.com; phil@pjharter.com; 

pkumar@publicpower.org; Raymond.Polinski@atimetals.com; rgreeson@federalpacific.com; 

richardparkerdc@gmail.com; rick.anderson@faypwc.com; robert.saint@nreca.coop; 

robert.vanbuskirk@ee.doe.gov; rroy@nrdc.org; ScottB@lvmetals.com; snadel@aceee.org; 

srosenstock@eei.org; tballo@earthjustice.org; Teckman@nwcouncil.org; thomas.patzner@us.schneiderelectric.com; vijay.tendulkar@onyxpower.com; zhimei.luo@navigant.com; Ken Winder 

Subject: Re: Replacement Cost for Transformer Pole 

Hello Ken: 

 

 Thank you for developing this info... It looks like DOE wasn't too far off in assuming cost of 

$2000/per pole change out... 

 

 The only other remaining question left that needs addressing is... 

 

 "When" does pole need to be changed? IE: What are "Engineering Rules/Limits" that 

result in pole change out...

 

 Once we know that, we/DOE can estimate change-out frequency... 

 
 Thank you. 

 

Best Regards, 

 

Mahesh 

 

--- On Wed, 10/19/11, Kenneth Winder <kwinder@mleainc.com> wrote: 

From: Kenneth Winder <kwinder@mleainc.com> 

Subject: Replacement Cost for Transformer Pole 

To: "Richard Parker" <richardparkerdc@gmail.com> 

Cc: phopkinson@hvolt.com, Aaron.Meyers@cooperindustries.com, 

adelaski@standardsasap.org, ahofmann@publicpower.org, amarantan@navigant.com, 

artrosenfeld@gmail.com, august.esch@gmail.com, BermanEconomics@gmail.com, 

brian.coffey@navigant.com, bruce.r.hirsch@bge.com, bsmith@federalpacific.com, 

cabolduc@lbl.gov, Caitlin.Johnson@navigant.com, carlos.gaytan@ge.com, 

carlosgsiqueiros@eaton.com, chad.kennedy@us.schneider-electric.com, charlied@uus.org, 

chuck.simmons@pgnmail.com, clark.silcox@nema.org, cstephens@neea.org, 

Daniel.Cohen@hq.doe.gov, dave.millure@metglas.com, DYoung@energy-solution.com, 

eduardorobles@eaton.com, Eric.Petersen@aksteel.com, gbf1@pge.com, gjrosenquist@lbl.gov, 

greg.coulter405@gmail.com, James.Lass@cleco.com, Jennifer.Tiedeman@hq.doe.gov, 

Jeremiah.Freeman@ee.doe.gov, jerry.corkran@cooperindustries.com, 

jerry.schoen@aksteel.com, jhodge@howard-ind.com, Jim.creevy@nema.org, 

Jim.Raba@ee.doe.gov, jmauer@standardsasap.org, john.caskey@nema.org, 

john.cymbalsky@ee.doe.gov, jrossetti@mlgw.org, kcoughlin@lbl.gov, 

maheshsampat@bellsouth.net, mark.stoering@xcelenergy.com, 

matthew.nardotti@navigant.com, maxinesavitz@aol.com, mhyland@appanet.org, 

mrivest@navigant.com, mwaltner@nrdc.org, Paul.Ryan@hitmet.com, phil@pjharter.com, 

pkumar@publicpower.org, Raymond.Polinski@atimetals.com, rgreeson@federalpacific.com, 

richardparkerdc@gmail.com, rick.anderson@faypwc.com, robert.saint@nreca.coop, 

robert.vanbuskirk@ee.doe.gov, rroy@nrdc.org, ScottB@lvmetals.com, snadel@aceee.org, 

srosenstock@eei.org, tballo@earthjustice.org, Teckman@nwcouncil.org, 

thomas.patzner@us.schneider-electric.com, vijay.tendulkar@onyxpower.com, 

zhimei.luo@navigant.com, "Chris Boulduc" <cabolduc@lbl.gov>, "Ken Winder" 

<kwinder@mleainc.com> 

Date: Wednesday, October 19, 2011, 8:36 PM 

Richard and Committee: 

 Attached is a spreadsheet showing the cost to replace an existing pole in a three-phase 

distribution circuit with an existing single-phase distribution transformer mounted on it. This 

information was developed to estimate the cost to replace an existing pole with a new, higher 

strength pole required because of the increased weight of the distribution transformer. This 

estimate represents the cost to do this for my Cooperative. 

 Other Utilities will be furnishing this information for their systems. 

Kenneth A. Winder, PE 
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