U.S. GOVERNMENT PUBLISHING OFFICE

27–017 PDF WASHINGTON : 2018

S. Hrg. 115–372 

NOMINATIONS OF BROCK LONG, RUSSELL 

VOUGHT AND NEOMI RAO 

HEARING 

BEFORE THE

COMMITTEE ON 

HOMELAND SECURITY AND 

GOVERNMENTAL AFFAIRS 

UNITED STATES SENATE 

ONE HUNDRED FIFTEENTH CONGRESS 

FIRST SESSION 

NOMINATIONS OF BROCK LONG TO BE ADMINISTRATOR, FEDERAL 

EMERGENCY MANAGEMENT AGENCY, U.S. DEPARTMENT OF 

HOMELAND SECURITY, RUSSELL VOUGHT TO BE DEPUTY 

DIRECTOR, OFFICE OF MANAGEMENT AND BUDGET, AND NEOMI 

RAO TO BE ADMINISTRATOR, OFFICE OF INFORMATION AND 

REGULATORY AFFAIRS, OFFICE OF MANAGEMENT AND BUDGET 

JUNE 7, 2017 

Available via the World Wide Web: http://www.Govinfo.gov/ 

Printed for the use of the 

Committee on Homeland Security and Governmental Affairs 

( 
(II) 

COMMITTEE ON HOMELAND SECURITY AND GOVERNMENTAL AFFAIRS 

RON JOHNSON, Wisconsin, Chairman 

JOHN MCCAIN, Arizona 

ROB PORTMAN, Ohio 

RAND PAUL, Kentucky 

JAMES LANKFORD, Oklahoma 

MICHAEL B. ENZI, Wyoming 

JOHN HOEVEN, North Dakota 

STEVE DAINES, Montana 

CLAIRE MCCASKILL, Missouri 

THOMAS R. CARPER, Delaware 

JON TESTER, Montana 

HEIDI HEITKAMP, North Dakota 

GARY C. PETERS, Michigan 

MAGGIE HASSAN, New Hampshire 

KAMALA D. HARRIS, California 

CHRISTOPHER R. HIXON, Staff Director 

GABRIELLE D’ADAMO SINGER, Chief Counsel 

MARGARET E. DAUM, Minority Staff Director 

ANNA LAITIN, Minority Policy Adviser 

LAURA W. KILBRIDE, Chief Clerk 

BONNI E. DINERSTEIN, Hearing Clerk 
(III) 

C O N T E N T S 

Opening statements: Page 

Senator Johnson ............................................................................................... 1 

Senator McCaskill ............................................................................................ 4 

Senator Portman .............................................................................................. 16 

Senator Heitkamp ............................................................................................ 19 

Senator Hassan ................................................................................................. 21 

Senator Peters .................................................................................................. 23 

Senator Hoeven ................................................................................................. 26 

Senator Daines ................................................................................................. 28 

Senator Carper ................................................................................................. 30 

Prepared statements: 

Senator Johnson ............................................................................................... 39 

WITNESSES 

WEDNESDAY, JUNE 7, 2017 

Hon. Orrin Hatch, a U.S. Senator from the State of Utah 

Testimony .......................................................................................................... 3 

Prepared Statement ......................................................................................... 41 

Brock Long to be Administrator, Federal Emergency Management Agency, 

U.S. Department of Homeland Security 

Testimony .......................................................................................................... 7 

Prepared statement .......................................................................................... 43 

Biographical and financial information .......................................................... 45 

Letter from the Office of Government Ethics ................................................. 59 

Responses to pre-hearing questions ................................................................ 64 

Responses to post-hearing questions .............................................................. 88 

Letters of support ............................................................................................. 105 

Russell Vought to be Deputy Director, Office of Management and Budget 

Testimony .......................................................................................................... 8 

Prepared statement .......................................................................................... 111 

Biographical and financial information .......................................................... 113 

Letter from the Office of Government Ethics ................................................. 135 

Responses to pre-hearing questions ................................................................ 138 

Responses to post-hearing questions .............................................................. 160 

Letter of support ............................................................................................... 171 

Neomi Rao to be Administrator, Office of Information and Regulatory Affairs, 

Office of Management and Budget 

Testimony .......................................................................................................... 9 

Prepared statement .......................................................................................... 173 

Biographical and financial information .......................................................... 175 

Letter from the Office of Government Ethics ................................................. 195 

Responses to pre-hearing questions ................................................................ 201 

Responses to post-hearing questions .............................................................. 221 

Letter of support ............................................................................................... 233 

APPENDIX 

We’ve done 81% of Simpson-Bowles chart submitted by Senator Johnson ........ 246 

(1) 

1The prepared statement of Senator Johnson appears in the Appendix on page 39. 

NOMINATIONS OF BROCK LONG, RUSSELL 

VOUGHT AND NEOMI RAO 

WEDNESDAY, JUNE 7, 2017 

U.S. SENATE, COMMITTEE ON HOMELAND SECURITY

AND GOVERNMENTAL AFFAIRS, Washington, DC. 

The Committee met, pursuant to notice, at 10:02 a.m., in room 

SD–342, Dirksen Senate Office Building, Hon. Ron Johnson, Chairman of the Committee, presiding. 

Present: Senators Johnson, Portman, Lankford, Hoeven, Daines, 

McCaskill, Carper, Tester, Heitkamp, Peters, Hassan, and Harris. 

OPENING STATEMENT BY CHAIRMAN JOHNSON1

Chairman JOHNSON. Good morning. We will call this hearing to 

order. We are going to be waiting for Senator Hatch, who will make 

an introduction. 

I want to welcome the nominees. I want to thank you for your 

willingness to serve this country. Coming from the private sector 

myself, and this is absolutely true, I have been very impressed 

with the quality of individuals that work for the Federal Government. This nomination process is not easy, as you are well aware, 

but the fact that we have so many patriots that are willing to step 

up to the plate, subject themselves to this process, and serve in the 

Federal Government for probably a whole lot less than you can 

make in the private sector, says an awful lot about your dedication 

to this country. I truly want to thank you for that. 

I know, in your opening statements, you will introduce your family members. Specifically, I want to welcome all of them, and I will 

leave it to you—do not forget to introduce your family members. 

For my opening statement, all I really want to do is to quick read 

a description of the jobs, basically, you are going to be filling, what 

the agencies do, and then I will turn it over to my Ranking Member, Senator McCaskill, and then hopefully Senator Hatch will be 

here to make an introduction. Otherwise, we will proceed. 

We are considering three nominations, one for the Administrator 

of the Federal Emergency Management Agency (FEMA), one as 

Deputy Director for the Office of Management and Budget (OMB), 

and then the third is the Administrator of the Office of Information 

and Regulatory Affairs (OIRA). 

The FEMA Administration serves as the principal advisor to the 

President and the Secretary of Homeland Security on emergency 
2 

management. The Administrator’s duties include the operation of 

the National Response Coordination Center (NRCC), the effective 

support of all emergency support functions, and more generally, 

preparation for and protection against, response to, and recovery 

from all hazard incidents. 

The Administrator is also responsible for management of the core 

Department of Homeland Security (DHS) grant program supporting homeland security, and for providing an annual estimate of 

the resources needed for developing the capabilities of Federal, 

State, and local governments necessary to respond to a catastrophic 

incident. FEMA is 22 percent of DHS’s overall budget. A pretty 

simple job. I mean, not much to it, so I appreciate you are willing 

to take it on. 

The Deputy Director of Office of Management and Budget, the 

role of that individual varies from Administration to Administration, but is viewed as a general deputy to the Director, assisting 

the Director in carrying out the President’s budget and management agendas across the Executive Branch. The Deputy Director is 

primarily responsible for budget development and execution. In addition, the Deputy Director oversees eight OMB offices: General 

Counsel (GC), Legislative Affairs, Strategic Planning and Communications, Economic Policy, Legislative Reference, Budget Review, 

and Performance and Personnel Management. The remainder of 

OMB is overseen by the Deputy Director of Management. 

From my own standpoint, the reason I came here is we literally are mortgaging our children’s future. We are $20 trillion in debt. 

The projected deficit over the next 30 years is $129 trillion. These 

figures are incomprehensible, so, Mr. Vought, you have some real 

challenges ahead of you as well. 

Finally, the Office of Information and Regulatory Affairs, was 

created as part of the 1980 Paperwork Reduction Act (PRA), a law 

intended to curb the amount of, and duplication in paperwork requirements imposed by regulatory agencies on the public. The Administrator oversees requests from agencies for any new information and collections in paperwork requirements. The Administrator 

also oversees and coordinates proposed regulations from agencies. 

OIRA also conducts a regulatory review of so-called significant 

rules, ensuring the analysis and legal basis used to justify proposed 

rules is sound and consistent with criteria established in relevant 

Executive Orders (EO) going back to 1993. This may include ensuring that cost-benefit analysis uses well-established methods, that 

the agency considered potential non-regulatory alternatives like 

market mechanisms, and that the agency clearly identified a problem which justifies regulatory action. The Administrator ultimately 

may decide to either approve the rule or return it to the agency, 

with recommended changes. 

From my standpoint, I think the number one component of a solution of whatever problem we are talking about within this Nation 

is economic growth. I think the number one impediment to growth 

is overregulation. A $2 trillion per year regulatory burden, almost 

$15,000 per year per household. Ms. Rao, you have your challenges 

ahead of you as well, making sure that we only issue regulations 

to provide certainty to the private sector. Hopefully we can start 

rolling back overregulation that harms economic growth. 
3 

With that I see our esteemed colleague, Senator Hatch, has arrived. To be respectful of your time, Senator Hatch, I think you 

would like to make an introduction and we will let you do so right 

now. 

OPENING STATEMENT OF THE HONORABLE ORRIN HATCH, A 

UNITED STATES SENATOR FROM THE STATE OF UTAH 

Senator HATCH. Well, thank you so much, Mr. Chairman. It is 

my distinct pleasure to introduce Professor Neomi Rao at today’s 

hearing, and to fully commend her confirmation to the Committee. 

I have known Professor Rao for some time now, ever since she 

worked as a counsel to the Senate Judiciary Committee. Since 

then, Professor Rao has distinguished herself in private practice, 

government service, and academia. Her experiences have prepared 

her well for what will be an important and challenging task ahead. 

The position of Administrator of OIRA may not receive as much 

fanfare as other nominations but it plays a critical role in modern 

policymaking. This Administration has said that it would get serious about regulatory reform. Republicans in Congress have said 

the same. Professor Rao’s confirmation will be an important step 

forward in fulfilling that promise. 

Professor Rao’s qualifications speak for themselves. After graduating from Yale, Professor Rao attended the University of Chicago 

Law School. She then clerked for Judge Harvie Wilkinson III on 

the Fourth Circuit, and Justice Clarence Thomas on the Supreme 

Court. After spending a few years in private practice, she served 

as an Associate Counsel and Special Assistant to the President, 

and then began a career in academia. She currently teaches at the 

Antonin Scalia Law School at George Mason University, where she 

is also the Founder and Director of the Center for the Study of the 

Administrative State. 

Mr. Chairman, there is little doubt at this point that our present 

system for formulating and implementing Federal regulatory policy 

is simply unacceptable. For years, citizens and businesses have 

complained about an administrative process that is opaque and unresponsive, and for years this process has produced results that too 

often harm economic growth while rarely improving public health 

and welfare. 

Accordingly, over the span of several past Administrations, a consensus has formed that an important step in streamlining and improving the administrative process is to empower an OIRA administrator. Professor Rao is supremely and uniquely qualified to step 

into this role. Under her watch, we can expect OIRA to carefully 

scrutinize rules to assure that they satisfy cost-benefit analysis. 

But, of course, as Professor Rao gets to work, we cannot take our 

eye off the ball here in Congress. We will need more than just exceptional candidates like Professor Rao at OIRA. The Legislative 

branch must do its part. That is why I was pleased to co-sponsor 

the Regulatory Accountability Act (RAA), along with Senators 

Portman, Lankford, Manchin, and Heitkamp. The Committee reported the legislation to the full Senate last month, and I am hopeful that the rest of our colleagues on both sides of the aisle will join 

us in making it law. 
4 

1The prepared statement of Senator Burr appears in the Appendix on page 105. 

2The prepared statement of Representative Hensarling appears in the Appendix on page 171. 

The RAA is a carefully negotiated bipartisan effort to codify existing policy that streamlines and improves the rulemaking process. Further, I will be introducing legislation later this month, the 

Separation of Powers Restoration Act, that will begin a conversation about the growth of Federal regulation enabled by the Chevron 

Doctrine and abetted by broad legislative delegation. 

Just like the confirmation of Professor Rao, these efforts at regulatory reform are not about politics. Regardless of which party controls the presidency, regardless of which controls Congress, our administrative process is broken. The time to fix it is now. 

In conclusion, Mr. Chairman, I will say one more time that I am 

very pleased to be here today to introduce and recommend Professor Rao for this important post. The Federal policymaking process and Federal policy, generally, will stand to benefit from her 

leadership. I want to thank you very much for this opportunity to 

testify today and for your kindness in allowing me to go forward. 

And I wish you the best. You will do just great. 

Ms. RAO. Thank you, Senator Hatch. 

Senator HATCH. Thanks, Mr. Chairman. 

Chairman JOHNSON. Thank you, Senator Hatch. We certainly appreciate that. 

I do want to recognize the fact that Senator Burr had a conflict 

so he is unable to attend, but he wanted to introduce Mr. Long, 

and I will ask consent to enter his written statement and recommendation into the record.1 Also that Representative Hensarling 

was going to introduce Mr. Vought but also had a conflict and we 

will enter his written statement and recommendation into the 

record2 as well. We also have some other letters of recommendation 

for the nominees, which I would also ask consent to enter into the 

record. 

With that I will turn to our esteemed Ranking Member, Senator 

McCaskill. 

OPENING STATEMENT OF SENATOR MCCASKILL 

Senator MCCASKILL. Thank you very much. Thank you, Mr. 

Chairman, and thank you for the three of you, and it was a pleasure to meet all of your families. I am painfully aware that public 

service is a family affair, and so I want to make sure that they get 

the recognition they deserve. 

At today’s hearing we will consider three nominees for three very 

different jobs, but they are all three very important, to our country 

and to our government. 

I will start with Mr. Long and the Federal Emergency Management Agency. Mr. Long, we are holding this hearing 1 week into 

hurricane season. So far this year we have already had several 

floods in Missouri and surrounding States, as well as devastating 

tornadoes across the country. We have seen an uptick in the number of serious disasters in our State, especially flooding. I do not 

think the pace of response to natural disasters in this country are 

going to slow down. I think that pace is going to increase because 

of what is going on with our environment. 
5 

You have had a career in emergency management, seeing the 

process from all sides, at FEMA, at a State emergency management agency, and consulting for cities, counties, and private entities. I think you bring a wealth of experience to this responsibility. 

If you are confirmed I look forward to working with you as Missouri continues to recover from flood damage, having very recently 

guided the disaster declaration submitted to the Federal Government for the many counties that were devastated by the recent 

floods. 

Mr. Vought, you have been nominated to serve as Deputy Director for the Office of Management and Budget. You have been at 

OMB since January as a member of the beachhead team and as a 

senior advisor working on the development of the budget proposal. 

Without knowing as much about you as I may in the future, that 

alone raises concerns for me. The budget released by the President 

2 weeks ago is highly problematic. The core assumptions underpinning it are financial fantasy. Representative Sanford, a conservative Republican from South Carolina, put it kindly at the first 

hearing following the release of the budget, stating that ‘‘it presumes a Goldilocks economy and is based on assumptions that the 

stars perfectly align with regard to economic drivers.’’ And since 

the budget was released, key members of the Administration have 

been unable to agree on exactly how it accomplishes the growth 

and the revenue that it projects, the very underpinnings of that 

budget. 

On top of that, the budget cuts key programs that dramatically 

impact rural Missouri and rural America. It slashes Medicaid, 

which will hit rural hospitals and limit access to nursing care for 

the elderly poor. It targets cuts to programs that have paid for infrastructure development in small cities and towns across Missouri. 

And it cuts the budgets of Inspectors General (IG), the front line 

for identifying and eliminating waste, fraud, and abuse in government spending. 

Mr. Vought, the most essential role of a budget officer is to get 

the numbers right. This budget simply does not do that, and I 

speak as a former auditor, and it is not honest with the American 

people about the impacts it will have. I would like to hear that you 

will bring a new level of openness to the budget process, but knowing that you were closely involved in the drafting of this one, it 

causes me great concern. 

If anything else, I would hope that there would be a reconsideration of some of the fundamental assumptions in the budget where 

numbers seem to have been counted twice, where assumptions that 

are made have no evidentiary backing, and where, if you actually 

believe what is being put on paper, it still has devastating impacts 

to the rural areas in my State. 

If you are confirmed, I will continue to watch OMB closely. Particularly, I know my colleague is going to talk about this, but we 

are particularly frustrated that we worked hard on a bipartisan 

basis to get a permitting bill passed that will ease permitting regulations for projects across the country. The Obama Administration 

failed to stand that up. So far there has been no inclination of the 

Trump Administration to stand that up, and the irony is the President has called a press conference for Friday, talking about how 
6 

they are going to ease permitting in public projects. And we are 

wondering, ‘‘Hello? We passed the law. Stand it up. Make it happen.’’ 

I know, along with my colleague, who was in this Committee, 

who got that bill passed, we will be watching closely to make sure 

that law is implemented quickly and efficiently. 

Ms. Rao, the Office of Information and Regulatory Affairs, is an 

extremely powerful office that tends to stay out of the public eye. 

OIRA has a significant and determinative role in the rulemaking 

process for most Federal agencies. It coordinates agency work and 

ensures that regulations are properly developed, is responsible for 

reviewing regulations to ensure they do not put an undue burden 

on the public, and ensures that agencies’ rules reflect the priorities 

and policies of the President. 

As we discussed yesterday, I am the first to say I am supportive 

of reforms of regulatory process, to make it work better for both 

consumers and businesses. I am proud of the efforts that I have 

made, along with my colleagues, to clean out some of the silly regulations that caused so many problems, or to stop other regulations 

from coming to pass. And I will not argue that the process in place 

today is not anywhere near perfect. I know that many Americans, 

especially small business owners and farmers in my State, feel like 

regulations keep getting piled on them and making it harder every 

year to make a living. Community banks fall in that same category. 

That being said, I have deep concerns about this Administration’s efforts to simply dismantle regulations in ways that do not 

seem to have underlying policy considerations, and to disregard the 

importance of consumer protections and public safety. Your academic writings display a healthy distrust of regulatory agencies 

and disregard for the complex reasons why regulations can be necessary in a market-based economy. 

I hope that if confirmed as the Administrator of OIRA that you 

keep an understanding in mind that public safety and consumer 

protection is very important, as you examine and scrutinize regulations that come across your desk. 

Thank you, Mr. Chairman, and I look forward to questioning the 

nominees. 

Chairman JOHNSON. Thank you, Senator McCaskill. It is the tradition of this committee to swear in witnesses, so if you will all rise 

and raise your right hand. 

Do you swear the testimony you will give before this Committee 

will be the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth, so 

help you, God? 

Mr. LONG. I do. 

Mr. VOUGHT. I do. 

Ms. RAO. I do. 

Chairman JOHNSON. Our first nominee is Brock Long. Mr. Long 

has more than 16 years of experience working in emergency management at the local, State, and Federal level. Mr. Long is currently the Vice President at Hagerty Consulting, an emergency 

management consulting firm in Illinois. From 2008 to 2011, he was 

the Director of Alabama’s Emergency Management Agency. He also 

gained experience serving as FEMA’s Region IV Hurricane Planner 
7 

1The prepared statement of Mr. Brock appears in the Appendix on page 43. 

and Response Team Leader, and Georgia’s State-wide Hurricane 

Program Manager and School Safety Coordinator. Mr. Long. 

TESTIMONY OF BROCK LONG1 TO BE ADMINISTRATOR, FEDERAL EMERGENCY MANAGEMENT AGENCY, U.S. DEPARTMENT OF HOMELAND SECURITY 

Mr. LONG. Chairman Johnson, Ranking Member McCaskill, 

Members of the Committee, it is truly an honor to be nominated 

by the President for this job. 

First I would like to take a minute to recognize my wife, Mandi, 

of 14 years and my boys, Jonah and Isaac, 11 and 7. I do not know 

if sleeping is allowed—— [Laughter.] 

Senator MCCASKILL. It happens up here sometimes. [Laughter.] 

Mr. LONG. Thank you. I have almost two decades’ worth of experience in emergency management, and it is a unique experience. It 

is not just in the public sector. It is also in the private sector. I 

started with Georgia Emergency Management. I excelled. I proudly 

served with FEMA Region IV previously. I saw the agency at its 

best time and at its worst. I also served as the Director of Alabama 

Emergency Management Agency, which allowed me to actually visualize and see how Federal resources can be maximized at the 

State level and passed down through to our State partners who are 

dealing with disasters. 

I also hold my private sector experience very valuable. For the 

last 6 years I feel like this experience has truly helped me to put 

my fingers on the pulse of emergency management in the community, and not just emergency management but the first responders 

which we serve. 

Not only have I been a part of teams to help communities design 

emergency operations plans, test, train, and evaluate those plans, 

I have also helped them to interpret FEMA guidance, whether it 

is on the preparedness side or helping them to navigate disaster recovery. 

This agency has one of the most important missions inside the 

Federal Government, and I believe the staff inside that agency are 

the most important assets. I look forward to working with them. 

I think they are very service-oriented individuals, regardless of the 

criticism they may receive. They get up, dust themselves off, go to 

work, and try to truly protect America, save lives, and help people 

in time of their greatest need. If confirmed I look forward to working with them very closely, leading them, and helping the Nation 

to achieve resilience to a much higher standard than where we currently are. 

With that I will stand by for your questions. Thank you. 

Chairman JOHNSON. Thank you, Mr. Long. 

Our next nominee is Russell Vought. Mr. Vought is currently a 

senior political appointee at OMB. Prior to joining OMB, he was a 

Vice President at Heritage Action for America, and prior to that 

worked as the Policy Director for the House Republican Conference, 

the Executive Director for the Republican Study Committee, was a 

staffer for several Members of Congress, including, most recently, 
8 

1The prepared statement of Mr. Vought appears in the Appendix on page 111. 

Representative Jeb Hensarling and Senator Chuck Hagel. Mr. 

Vought. 

TESTIMONY OF RUSSELL VOUGHT1 TO BE DEPUTY DIRECTOR, 

OFFICE OF MANAGEMENT AND BUDGET 

Mr. VOUGHT. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I want to thank you, 

the Ranking Member, the Members of this Committee for the honor 

of appearing before it. I also want to thank and introduce my family, who has endured this process with me and the long hours that 

come with serving your country in public roles. My wife, Mary, is 

here, my daughter, Ella, my two sisters, and many friends are here 

in support. 

It is a joy to come home to the U.S. Senate. I worked for my first 

4 years of my career in this distinguished body, mostly for Senator 

Phil Gramm. I spent hours on the Senate floor, in committee, and 

at my desk, learning how the Senate works its will, how an institution protects the rights of a minority to be heard, and how statesmen ought to debate their colleagues to move the vote and shape 

public opinion. It was here that I developed a love for public policy, 

seeing how it could be used to help the people of this country live 

freer and more prosperous lives. 

It is an honor to be nominated to serve as the Deputy Director 

of the Office of Management and Budget. It is a job that comes 

with great responsibility, and I am humbled that President Trump 

and Director Mulvaney asked me to serve. I know the quality of 

the men and women who have previously served in this particular 

role, and I want to contribute to that long line of distinguished 

public service. 

My career has readied me for this moment. I spent over 12 years 

working in the House and Senate, with a specific emphasis in 

budget policy. I was the Republican Study Committee’s (RSC’s) 

Budget Director, writing its budget resolutions and advising on 

budget policy. I went on to be the Executive Director of the RSC, 

and then the Policy Director of the House Republican Conference, 

under then Chairman Mike Pence. 

All of these roles afforded me an opportunity to handle a wide 

range of policy issues and to manage policy development processes 

that ensured a wide variety of viewpoints were heard. That is very 

much the job of the Deputy Director of OMB, to build and further 

a policy process that ensures that the President and his advisors 

receive all of the best analysis so that the best decision can be 

made. 

I also have experienced managing a large organization. I spent 

the last 7 years managing many aspects of Heritage Action for 

America, including staff and 17,000 volunteers across this country. 

Volunteers are, in fact, volunteers. They have their own viewpoints 

and ideas and you do not get very far working with them if you 

do not have an appreciation for them as leaders in their own right. 

That experience has prepared me well for managing the men and 

women at OMB, who are career experts in their field and have 

years of institutional knowledge for this new Administration to 

draw upon. 
9 

1The prepared statement of Ms. Rao appears in the Appendix on page 173. 

As for the job to be done, it is immense. Our country faces a $20 

trillion national debt. That debt will wreck our country if it is not 

tackled. That burden will fall on my children and grandchildren if 

today’s policymakers do not change the current path. It will mean 

a lower standard of living for them and less time for the truly important things in life, such as family and community. That is not 

the American way. 

I have spent my entire career caring about taxpayers and families. I have fought to save them money and ensure that their tax 

dollars are well spent. I come from a blue-collar family. I am the 

son of an electrician and a public school teacher. I know what they 

went through to balance their budget and save for the future. My 

parents worked really long hours to put me through school, but 

they also worked long hours to pay for the high levels of government in their own life. 

My old boss called them the wagon-pullers in our country. Others 

have referred to them as the forgotten men and women. They have 

always been my test for Federal spending. Did a particular program, or spending increase, help the nameless wagon-pullers across 

our country, working hard at their job, trying to provide for their 

family and future without the luxury of watching C–SPAN at that 

particular moment to know that we might increase their burden at 

that minute? How would they vote—yea or nay? I believe that as 

a country we have too often failed that simple test and it is the reason that we are facing a $20 trillion debt. 

If the Senate confirms me, I am ready to take up that work 

again. Thank you for considering my nomination and I look forward to answering your questions. 

Chairman JOHNSON. Thank you, Mr. Vought. 

Our final nominee is Professor Neomi Rao. Professor Rao is currently an Associate Professor of Law at George Mason University. 

She founded the school’s Center for the Study of the Administrative 

State, and serves as the center’s Director. From 2005 to 2006, Professor Rao served as Associate Counsel and Special Assistant to 

President Bush, and prior to that was an Associate at Clifford 

Chance LLP in London. Professor Rao worked as a Counselor for 

Nominations and Constitutional Law on the Senate Committee on 

Judiciary, clerking for the Honorable Justice Clarence Thomas on 

the U.S. Supreme Court. Professor Rao. 

TESTIMONY OF NEOMI RAO1 TO BE ADMINISTRATOR, OFFICE 

OF INFORMATION AND REGULATORY AFFAIRS, OFFICE OF 

MANAGEMENT AND BUDGET 

Ms. RAO. Thank you very much, Chairman Johnson, Ranking 

Member McCaskill, and Members of the Committee. It is an honor 

to appear before you as the President’s nominee to be the Administrator of the Office of Information and Regulatory Affairs. I am 

grateful to the President and Director Mulvaney for their trust and 

confidence. 

I would first like to thank Senator Hatch for taking the time to 

be here and for his generous introduction. Working on the Judiciary Committee for then Chairman Hatch I learned about law-mak-
10 

ing, and music-making, and living a good life. It means a lot for 

me to have the support of such a distinguished and respected member of this body. 

I would also like to thank the Members of the Committee and 

their staff for taking the time to meet with me. I appreciate your 

graciousness and the chance to connect and to discuss issues about 

regulatory policy. For those of you I did not have a chance to meet, 

I hope that we may have an opportunity after the hearing. If confirmed, I look forward to working closely with Members of the 

Committee on issues relating to regulatory and information policy. 

If you will indulge me, I will take a moment to recognize and 

thank my family. I am here today with my husband, Alan 

Lefkowitz, and my two children, Isabella and Ezra. Alan’s unwavering support has made it possible for me to even consider the demands of public service. 

My father, Dr. Jehangir Rao, is also here, and has believed in me 

at every stage of my life. I remember also my mother, Dr. Zerin 

Rao, who died too young of cancer and I wish she could have been 

here to share this day. 

Leaving India in January 1972, my parents arrived in Detroit in 

the middle of a snowstorm, without winter jackets, but with their 

medical degrees, $16, and the optimism of the recently married. 

They always imparted by example the importance of integrity, perseverance, kindness, and a commitment to service. 

I would also like to share some information about my background. For the past 10 years I have been a law professor at the 

Antonin Scalia Law School at George Mason University, where I 

have taught constitutional law and legislation and statutory interpretation. My scholarship has focused on the framework of constitutional accountability for administrative agencies. About 2 

years ago I founded the Center for the Study of the Administrative 

State. The center commissions academic research and hosts public 

policy conferences that bring together scholars, practitioners, and 

government officials to analyze and debate difficult questions of administrative law. 

Prior to my academic career, I worked in the Office of the White 

House Counsel, where I oversaw the legal work of a number of 

agencies and helped to coordinate interagency discussions of law 

and policy. I have also served on the Senate Judiciary Committee 

as a Counsel for Nominations and Constitutional Law. 

My other experience includes working for several years at a law 

firm in London and clerking for Justice Clarence Thomas of the 

U.S. Supreme Court, and Judge J. Harvie Wilkinson of the U.S. 

Court of Appeals for the Fourth Circuit. 

My academic background and practical experience in all three 

branches of the Federal Government have helped me to understand 

the regulatory process and the respective roles of Congress, the 

President, and the Courts in Administration. 

Since Congress established OIRA and the Paperwork Reduction 

Act of 1980, OIRA has operated with a consistent mission to improve the quality of decisionmaking in administrative agencies 

through regulatory review and the coordination of information policy. OIRA plays a vital role within the Executive Branch to ensure 

that administrative agencies follow the law, base their decisions on 
11 

the best possible economic and technical analysis, and fulfill Presidential priorities. 

Within the requirements set by Congress, OIRA works with an 

overarching goal of creating the greatest benefits for the American 

people while minimizing regulatory burdens. Reading through 

OIRA’s statutory authority, as well as Executive Orders and OBM 

guidance, I have been struck by the consistency of the principles 

guiding the work of the office across Administrations. Perhaps this 

is one reason why so many talented professionals work at OIRA 

and often stay for many years, serving Presidents of different parties. 

I am humbled to be nominated for this role. If confirmed as Administrator, I would work to ensure the continuity of OIRA’s principles, updating and refining when necessary, but maintaining the 

integrity of the process that has developed. I would also look forward to working with Members of this Committee and other Members of Congress on legislation relating to regulatory reform and 

other issues within OIRA’s purview. 

Thank you for your consideration. I look forward to answering 

your questions. 

Chairman JOHNSON. Thank you, Professor Rao. There are three 

questions the Committee asks every nominee, for the record. I will 

read each question and then ask for a verbal response from each 

of you. 

Is there anything you are aware of, in your background, that 

might present a conflict of interest for the duties of the offices to 

which you have been nominated. Mr. Long. 

Mr. LONG. No. 

Chairman JOHNSON. Mr. Vought. 

Mr. VOUGHT. No. 

Chairman JOHNSON. Professor Rao. 

Ms. RAO. No. 

Chairman JOHNSON. Do you know of anything, personal or otherwise, that would in any way prevent you from fully and honorably 

discharging the responsibilities of the office to which you have been 

nominated? Mr. Long. 

Mr. LONG. No. 

Chairman JOHNSON. Mr. Vought. 

Mr. VOUGHT. No. 

Chairman JOHNSON. Professor Rao. 

Ms. RAO. No. 

Chairman JOHNSON. Do you agree, without reservation, to comply with any requests or summons to appear and testify before any 

duly constituted committee of Congress if you are confirmed? Mr. 

Long. 

Mr. LONG. I do. 

Chairman JOHNSON. Mr. Vought. 

Mr. VOUGHT. I do. 

Chairman JOHNSON. Professor Rao. 

Ms. RAO. Yes. 

Chairman JOHNSON. Good. I appreciate it. I appreciate your anxiousness to answer the question. [Laughter.] 

Let me start with you, Mr. Long. Last Congress the Committee 

passed legislation known as the Integrated Public Alert and Warn-
12 

ing System (IPAWS), that would authorize and enhance the public 

alert warning system. The key parts of the law have not been implemented and deadlines have been missed. This includes the requirement to create a mandatory training program on how to use 

the system and to form a subcommittee comprised of Federal, 

State, and local agencies to consider improvements to the system. 

This responsibility falls under FEMA. Will you commit to the 

Committee that if confirmed you will ensure that these provisions 

are fully implemented? 

Mr. LONG. Thank you, Chairman Johnson. I am very familiar 

with the IPAWS program and I believe that making sure that we 

have clear lines of communication and multiple ways of communicating and redundancy is the key to getting through response in 

disasters. I have also, with my previous experience as the State Director of Alabama Emergency Management worked through a couple of pilot programs with the IPAWS program. It is an incredibly 

important program. Obviously, at this point, respecting the nomination process, if confirmed I would be happy to evaluate where we 

are, but I am not familiar at this time about the deadlines that we 

are missing. 

Chairman JOHNSON. OK. Well, one of the reasons I am bringing 

it up is I was with Chairman Pai in Wisconsin on Monday with 

broadcasters and they brought this up. Obviously they are very 

supportive of IPAWS. They want to make sure it gets implemented. 

Again, I realize you are the nominee but I just want that commitment that you will follow the law and implement these procedures. 

Professor Rao, in President Trump’s Executive Order regarding 

the ‘‘one-in, two-out’’ rule—this Committee has held two hearings 

on it, one in conjunction with the Budget Committee. Certainly 

what I have seen coming from the private sector, and talking about 

that regulatory burden, everything in Washington that you see is 

basically additive. You have regulators; they regulate. You have 

legislators; they legislate. Everything is additive. The problem we 

have is layer upon layer of rules, regulation, law—we spend billions with procurement procedures so we do not waste a buck, and 

it just does not work, and we were unable to update our computer 

systems. 

Can you speak a little bit in terms of how you would view the 

‘‘one-in, two-out’’ rule and how that would be implemented? 

Ms. RAO. Thank you, Senator. I think the ‘‘one-in, two-out’’ is an 

important step for considering how to reduce the overall regulatory 

burden that you are speaking of, and I think it can work. OMB has 

issued guidance on this matter, and the way I think it will work, 

in practice, is that agencies will identify regulations to eliminate, 

and those regulations might be ineffective ones, or excessively burdensome, and those regulations will have to meet a cost-benefit 

analysis for deregulation before they are going to impose any new 

regulatory burdens. 

Chairman JOHNSON. This would actually be a subtractive process. I do not know how many regulations I see on the books that 

are just, basically gathering dust but doing real harm to our economy. I would think every Senator on the dais here, at almost every 

meeting we take with constituents, the number one concern on 
13 

their minds is, one regulation after the one that is putting them 

out of business. 

We had the Chancellor of the University of Wisconsin-Madison 

come in and testify. They issued a study. Forty-two percent of researcher time at research universities is spent complying with Federal regulations, the paperwork, which is just an unbelievable burden. But again, I really encourage you to take a look at that seriously and utilize that executive authority to remove two regulations for every new one, and hopefully the new one overwrites some 

of the bad ones as well. 

Mr. Vought, I appreciated, in your testimony, how much you con- centrated on the $20 trillion in debt. As I mentioned in my opening 

comments, the projected deficit over the next 30 years is $129 trillion. You spoke of your responsibility primarily providing the analysis for good policymaking. 

I have been here 6 years, going into year 7 now. It is depressing how very few people are focusing on and talking about that $20 

trillion debt burden and the projected deficit. We budget for now 

less than 30 percent of what the Federal Government spends. Seventy percent is completely out of control. 

Can you just speak to, how you intend to convey that to the 

White House, to the Administration, so we start getting serious 

about not mortgaging our children’s future? 

Mr. VOUGHT. Thank you, Senator. I think this budget is a great 

example of this Administration’s commitment to dealing with deficits and debt over the next 10 years and into the future. This budget has more reductions in entitlement savings, which are the type 

of savings that you mentioned in your question, than any budget 

that has ever been proposed by a President, from a nominal standpoint. It has more reductions in the rate of growth to entitlement 

spending, as a percentage of the base, than any President’s budget 

since President Reagan’s. 

I think it shows that this Administration is very serious about 

tackling the debt and dealing with the deficits that are projected 

to rise greatly over the next 10 years, if nothing is done. As an Administration, the fact that it balances—we have begun to get back 

to having a conversation, as a country, about what it takes to balance our books, and I think that is another aspect of this as well. 

I have noticed, being a participant in compiling some of the options for the director to decide upon presenting to the President, 

that the whole focus on balance leads to a commitment to finding 

savings and reductions wherever you can, and then finding a way 

to justify them and to be able to think through what are the tradeoffs with a given policy proposal. I think that is healthy and I think 

that is one of the ways that we begin to tackle the debt. 

Chairman JOHNSON. As my closing thought to all of you, what 

we are trying to do, this Committee, is through a hearing process 

lay out realities, is the first step in this problem-solving process, 

which starts with gathering information, defining the problem, do 

a root cause analysis, things like strengths, weaknesses, opportunities and threats (SWOT) analysis, that type of things. Lay out that 

reality. Based on that reality, set achievable goals, and once you 

have done all that work, then you start working on the regulations, 

the rules, the legislation. 
14 

If confirmed, in your roles, I really want you to utilize this Committee to help lay out those realities that you are seeing within 

your agencies. I want to be a real partner with you here, and I 

think all of us do. We have enormous challenges, but it starts with 

that information, and laying out those realities. 

With that I will turn it over to Senator McCaskill. 

Senator MCCASKILL. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. My background 

is as a prosecutor and an auditor, and so when I came to the Senate I began doing what has been the meat and potatoes of my work 

here, which is oversight. I was really moved, frankly, Mr. Vought, 

in your opening statement, that you expressed such affection for 

the Senate. It was appreciated that you talked about what makes 

the Senate so important in our constitutional framework, which is 

the way the Senate protects the rights of a minority to be heard. 

So you can imagine, if I have done oversight from day one—and, 

by the way, talking about saving money, billions and billions of dollars in wartime contracting, that we worked on and accomplished, 

in terms of changing the way we do procurement within a contingency operation in our military—I can give you lists and lists of examples of where we have ferreted out billions of dollars being 

poured down rat holes in the Federal Government. You can imagine my concern when I hear that the White House is telling executive agencies to not respond to ranking members’ requests for information. 

We ask that question of all of you, and we ask, do you agree, 

without reservation, to reply to any reasonable request for information from a ranking member of a duly constituted committee of 

Congress? Mr. Long, you said yes? 

Mr. LONG. Yes. 

Senator MCCASKILL. Unequivocally. Thank you for that answer. 

Mr. Vought, you said ‘‘subject to the discretion of the director and 

advice of legal counsel.’’ As a lawyer, do you agree with legal counsel’s decision that just because I am a Democrat I am not entitled 

to information that allows me to do oversight as a member of the 

U.S. Senate, and as the Ranking Member of the Government Oversight Committee? 

Mr. VOUGHT. Thank you, Senator. I have not actually read Office 

of Legal Counsel (OLC’s) opinion on that, but as an Administration, 

it is controlling right now, in terms of the guidance that has been 

given out as to how the agency should respond to oversight requests and having them go through the Chairman, and to have the 

oversight process flow that direction. 

Senator MCCASKILL. Are you aware, in the history of the Senate, 

that there has been an Administration that has said, ‘‘We will not 

provide information to the Ranking Member of the Committee on 

Government Oversight’’? Are you aware of that ever occurring before? Did you ever work for a Senator that was in the minority? 

Mr. VOUGHT. I did work for a Senator in the minority. 

Senator MCCASKILL. And do you think that Senator would have 

taken that sitting down, if an Administration said, ‘‘I am sorry. 

You cannot request information from the government to find waste, 

fraud, and abuse if you are a Democrat, or if you are in the minority? ’’ 
15 

Mr. VOUGHT. Senator, I look forward to working with you in a 

transparent manner. I am looking forward to working with you in 

ferreting out waste, fraud, and abuse. In terms of formal communications that are sent to the Administration, I am merely reflecting the Administration’s policy in regard to the OLC opinion. 

Senator MCCASKILL. Well, we have had one nominee say yes, unequivocally. I have had the Secretary of Homeland Security say 

yes, on the record, unequivocally, in this Committee hearing room, 

and to me personally, and his rank, frankly, is higher than yours. 

So if you cannot give me a straight answer, do you think—let me 

ask you this. Do you think it is right that an Administration would 

say that the Ranking Member of the Oversight Committee in the 

U.S. Senate is not entitled to oversight information? Do you think 

that is a correct decision? 

Mr. VOUGHT. Senator, I think the rule of law is important and 

if OLC has—— 

Senator MCCASKILL. So you think it is the rule of law. 

Mr. VOUGHT. OLC has an opinion, Senator, in which it has put 

forth a position for this Administration as it pertains to responding 

to oversight requests, and that is merely what I am responding to. 

Senator MCCASKILL. OK. Well, we have a huge problem, if you 

cannot even say out loud—even though the Secretary of Homeland 

Security has unequivocally said, ‘‘Absolutely, we will get you information,’’ and does so on a regular basis. We have a huge problem 

if you cannot even say whether you think it is right or wrong. You 

cannot say whether you think it is right or wrong? 

Mr. VOUGHT. Senator, again, I have said I am looking forward 

to, if the Senate confirms me, working with this Committee in an 

open and transparent way. Again, I am reflecting the fact that this 

Administration is under an OLC opinion that has instructed the 

agencies on how best to engage with formal oversight requests from 

the various committees. 

Senator MCCASKILL. Well, the people that elected me did not 

send me here to take that answer lying down, and I have to tell 

you, I will punch above my weight on this. If this Administration 

thinks they are going to withhold important government information from the Ranking Member of the Oversight Committee of government, because they want to make sure we never find out anything—by the way, I did oversight in the Bush Administration and 

I think the Chairman will back me up; I know Senator Portman 

will back me up—I did aggressive oversight of the Obama Administration. The notion that we are going to our partisan corners on 

oversight is disgusting. 

I am disappointed with your answer, and let me ask you, Ms. 

Rao, how do you feel about providing information to the Ranking 

Member of the Oversight Committee of the U.S. Senate? 

Ms. RAO. Senator McCaskill, if confirmed I would do my best to 

provide information. The Office of Legal Counsel memorandum 

that was spoken about I think speaks to whether there is a requirement to do that but it leaves discretion within agencies, and 

I am committed to working with this Committee on their requests. 

Senator MCCASKILL. I would love your analysis, as somebody 

who has spent a great deal of time with the law, as to the underlying legal basis for that opinion. I think it is hogwash. I have 
16 

looked at it. It is just trying to shut off information to people who 

want to find problems. Welcome to the big leagues, administration. 

This is what happens. You get oversight. It is the function of the 

Congress to do oversight. 

I am hopeful that—so far I have not—we have had a few problems, but not to the extent many of my colleagues have on other 

committees, and it would be really bold for this Administration to 

cutoff information to this Committee, no matter whether it is a Republican or a Democrat. 

I know I am out of time. I did not expect that to take as long 

as it did, but I will come back to ask you about FEMA and the 

budget cuts and then some more questions for you, Mr. Vought, 

about the budget. 

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. 

Chairman JOHNSON. Senator Portman. 

OPENING STATEMENT OF SENATOR PORTMAN 

Senator PORTMAN. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I appreciate the 

nominees’ willingness to serve and distinguished backgrounds, all 

three of you. 

Just a brief comment. I have not looked at the OLC legal opinion 

and I probably should not speak, but I will. As Associate Counsel 

in the first Bush Administration and then as OMB Director in the 

second one, it was often frustrating dealing with Congress, but I 

felt it was my responsibility to provide information. The branch 

that you are now before has the opportunity to confirm you or deny 

your confirmation, and that is because that is the way the founders 

set it up. They also set it up so that we would have the opportunity 

to do oversight, and the elected representatives, each of us representing, in my case over 11 million people, expect us to do that 

oversight. 

I do hope that the information will be forthcoming to this Committee, and I know the Chairman feels the same way, that, this is 

our responsibility. 

I have so many questions, but let me just start, if I could, with 

you, Mr. Vought. Again, you are stepping up to take on a very 

tough job. I relied heavily on the deputy at OMB when I was there. 

As you know, there is a deputy for management and also one more 

for the budget functions, and you have a lot of interaction with 

OIRA, should you be confirmed, so it is good you guys are sitting 

close together. That may not be true in a couple of years, after you 

have some clashes. No, just kidding. I am sure you will get along 

great. 

But let me focus on one thing that was mentioned earlier, and 

that is infrastructure. Today the President is in my hometown of 

Cincinnati talking about infrastructure. I am delighted he is doing 

that. He is going to talk about locks and dams on the Ohio River 

and he is going to talk, I hope, about broader infrastructure questions. On Friday he is supposed to be talking about permitting. 

I know you are not there yet, and when you were at Heritage Action you guys actually opposed the highway bill that passed the 

Senate. I hope you did not oppose the permitting reform. I do not 

think you did. I think, in fact, you would have been supportive of 

that had you been asked to opine on that separately. 
17 

But Title 41 of the FAST Act has the permitting reform that was 

talked about earlier, and it is absolutely needed. We have projects, 

on the Ohio River, as an example, including some of our dams that 

have taken 6, 7, 8, 9, 10 years, and capital is not that patient anymore. It goes somewhere else, and it does not just go to other State, 

it goes to another country. 

Our reform effort, and Senator McCaskill and I did this together 

on a bipartisan basis, for 5 years worked on it. We had the Chamber of Commerce, the manufacturers, and others with us. We also 

had the AFL–CIO Building Trades Council with us, because they 

all wanted jobs, and they saw what was happening. We took the 

statute of limitations, for instance, from 6 years down to 2 years, 

after a National Environmental Policy Act (NEPA) review. Our 

original bill, actually, was even shorter than that, but that is a 

huge change right there. We have this dashboard now where citizens are able to get transparency to be able to see what the status 

is of a project, and it puts one agency in charge, which is really important because the right hand often does not know what the left 

hand is doing. We have energy projects in Ohio where 35 different 

permits are sometimes required, sometimes sequentially. So the effort is just to make it more efficient. 

We set up this thing called the Federal Permitting Improvement 

Steering Council (FPISC). It sits at OMB, and I fought hard to get 

it to OMB, and not to Council on Environmental Quality (CEQ), 

where some other folks wanted it, because we believed OMB had 

some leverage. I think Senator McCaskill will tell you—we went 

back and forth on this quite a bit and she took some heat on it, 

but we wanted to put it somewhere where you had part of the government, OMB, that actually has some leverage over the other 

agencies and departments, partly because of the budget function 

that you will be very involved with. 

Are you, one, aware of this issue of the permitting reform, the 

need for it, and the legislation that we have already passed, and 

are you aware of the fact that this FPISC organization has not 

been stood up, that we do not have an executive director. There is 

an acting person there now. Do you have thoughts on why that is 

and why we cannot get this going? 

Mr. VOUGHT. Thank you, Senator. I am aware of the Permitting 

Council. I am aware it is a priority for the Administration. Funding 

was included in the President’s budget for it, specifically in regard 

to the impact that it has in order to leverage the types of reforms 

and spending that we need, as an Administration, to be able to get 

$1 trillion of investment into infrastructure spending. 

I cannot speak to why there has been a delay in setting up the 

council, but from a funding aspect, it has been a priority of the Administration. 

Senator PORTMAN. Well, I am glad to hear you say that, and I 

hope you personally will roll up your sleeves and get involved in 

this, because I do think it is incredibly important, as we are trying 

to figure out how to spend tax dollars more efficiently. The dollar 

is going to be much more valuable if it is in the context of a permitting reform effort, where we do not have to go through these long 

delays and additional costs. 
18 

Are you looking for any additional authorities on this, do you 

know? Any other thing we need to do, in Congress, to be helpful? 

Mr. VOUGHT. It is not something that I have inquired on yet, because I have not been confirmed, but if confirmed, Senator, it 

would be something that I would want to inquire upon and to seek 

advice within the OMB as to ways that we can improve the statute. 

Senator PORTMAN. OK. I appreciate that, and what I am asking 

for today is your personal commitment that should you be confirmed that you will be supportive of getting FPISC set up and 

using the authorities we have already given you, on a bipartisan 

basis, which is rare around here, to actually make a difference, and 

not just talk about it but actually implement it. 

Mr. VOUGHT. You have that, Senator. 

Senator PORTMAN. I appreciate that. 

Ms. Rao, thank you very much again for your willingness to 

serve. Wow, what a background. You have been involved in regulatory affairs for a long time. Senator Heitkamp and I have legislation that Senator Hatch talked about—he is one of the original cosponsors—called the Regulatory Accountability Act. I assume you 

are aware of the Regulatory Accountability Act. Have you followed 

that? 

Ms. RAO. Yes, I have. 

Senator PORTMAN. I know that there is a lot of interest in trying 

to find some way to get the independent agencies into a more systematic cost-benefit analysis, like the Executive Branch agencies. 

Do you support what we are trying to do there, to tell the independent agencies they, too, have to go through a cost-benefit analysis? 

Ms. RAO. Thank you, Senator. I think that the question about 

the independent agencies is a very important one, and has been 

considered over the years, pretty much since the inception of OIRA, 

should we be including the independent agencies. I think that, in 

principle, it makes a lot of sense to have the independent agencies 

follow the same cost-benefit analysis as other agencies, and that 

was a position reflected in the Obama Administration, and it is a 

position, that is in the Regulatory Accountability Act as well. 

Senator PORTMAN. With regard to lookback, Senator Heitkamp 

improved the legislation by putting a retrospective review in, requiring agencies to review the most expensive regulations they already have on the books at least once every 10 years. How do you 

feel about that? 

Ms. RAO. Senator, I think retrospective review is a really important issue, because at the outset, when a regulation is proposed, 

even with the best analysis there is only a prediction about costs 

and benefits. Being able to look back to see how a regulation has 

actually worked, what its actual effects were, its costs and benefits, 

is very important, especially to reducing the regulatory burden of 

ineffective or out-of-date regulations. 

Senator PORTMAN. My time is up. I have already stolen Senator 

Heitkamp’s question, so she is already mad at me. But my question 

to you—would you commit to working with us, on a bipartisan 

basis, to try to get this Regulatory Accountability Act though this 

process? This was marked-up by this Committee, Chairman, what, 

2 weeks ago, with your support and help, and thank you. It is com-
19 

mon-sense stuff, and we need help from the Administration to ensure that we can get this done. 

Do you make that commitment today? 

Ms. RAO. Senator, I would be happy to commit to working with 

the Committee on your regulatory reform proposals. 

Senator PORTMAN. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. 

Chairman JOHNSON. Senator Heitkamp. 

OPENING STATEMENT OF SENATOR HEITKAMP 

Senator HEITKAMP. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Mr. Vought, I am 

going to give you a second chance here, and I think we all kind of 

sat stunned because we certainly expected a different answer to the 

question that Senator McCaskill asked you. You heard Professor 

Rao’s response to the same question, saying, in her opinion, that 

legal opinion gave her discretion and that she was going to use 

that discretion to be cooperative with this Committee. Do you want 

to restate your position? Is your position you are never going to 

deal with the minority and that that legal opinion prevents you 

from dealing with the minority? 

Mr. VOUGHT. Of course not, Senator. That is not my position at 

all. I look forward to working with this Committee if confirmed in 

an open and transparent way. Senator McCaskill was asking me 

specifically with regard to response to formal oversight letters, and 

as it pertained to the OLC memorandum, and that is what I was 

referring to. 

Senator HEITKAMP. Right. Let us get to that. So you are saying 

that as it relates to formal requests from the minority party, from 

this Committee, that you have no intention to responding to those 

requests? 

Mr. VOUGHT. Senator, I am going to look to the direction of our 

legal team and the director in how we respond to various oversight 

levels, and one of the things that we will be looking to is the OLC 

opinion. 

Senator HEITKAMP. My question is, do you think that yesterday, 

when Secretary Kelly gave us an unequivocal answer that he intends to cooperate with the minority party, respond to any requests, that he is violating that legal opinion and doing something 

illegal in making that commitment to us? 

Mr. VOUGHT. Senator, I do not know what Secretary Kelly said. 

He is running his department and agency—— 

Senator HEITKAMP [continuing]. Under the same legal guidelines 

from the Office of Legal Council. Correct? That opinion applies 

equally to you and Secretary Kelly. 

Mr. VOUGHT. Correct. 

Senator HEITKAMP. Is that correct? 

Mr. VOUGHT. Yes, ma’am. 

Senator HEITKAMP. Then why is your distinction different than 

Secretary Kelly’s? 

Mr. VOUGHT. We have been given direction from OLC, in terms 

of how we should deal with formal oversight requests. 

Senator HEITKAMP. The opinion itself, as outlined by Professor 

Rao, gives you discretion. We are asking you to make the commitment today that in your discretion you will deal equally with the 

minority and majority party of this Committee. 
20 

Mr. VOUGHT. Senator, I would be willing to commit to working 

equally in dealing with you to cooperate in oversight as it pertains 

to certain formal oversight letters. If confirmed, in my responsibilities as the deputy director, I am going to seek our legal team’s advice and the advice from the director. 

Senator HEITKAMP. I think anyone, on either side of the aisle— 

because I have been both in a situation where I have served where 

the President was of my political party. Now I am serving where 

the President is—I think what you are saying is absolutely outrageous. I just have to tell you that it is very troubling, and it 

should be troubling not just for the minority party today, but that 

party that could be minority party in 2 years, 4 years, or 6 years. 

I am very troubled by your response to this line of questioning, and 

find it almost disqualifying in supporting your nomination, quite 

honestly. 

Now I was going to ask you a series of questions on cost-benefit 

analysis. I will save those for the Office of Management and Budget. But I do not think that you can come here and say you respect 

the Senate and take the position that you have just taken as a 

matter of law, when other people, as Senator McCaskill said, who 

outrank you, have taken a different position. 

I am going to turn to Professor Rao. We had a very enjoyable 

meeting and I have to tell you, I cannot see your families but I certainly could see your family on this side. The pride and love that 

they have for you is so overwhelming. As somebody who lost her 

father at a very young age, I want you to know I am pretty sure 

your mom knows what a great success and what a great pride she 

has in you also. 

I am going to run through just a series of questions, because I 

do not have a lot of time, on cost-benefit analysis. As Senator 

Portman has said, we want to continue to work on this effort. As 

I have told you in my office, I believe that the gimmicks of ‘‘twoin, one-out’’ are not going to be particularly successful. We need to 

be more surgical. I also have told you that I am very concerned 

about ongoing regulation that has to exist as a result of outdated 

law, that we really expect you to come to us with a list of statutory 

changes that need to be made to eliminate burdensome and unnecessary regulation. We have to be in this together. 

In your personal opinion, do you believe that cost-benefit analysis 

is appropriate for deregulation actions? 

Ms. RAO. Yes, Senator Heitkamp, I do. 

Senator HEITKAMP. Thank you. Do you believe that cost-benefit 

analysis for deregulation actions deserve the same level of scrutiny 

as if you were enacting a major legislation? 

Ms. RAO. Yes, Senator, and that has been the position that OMB 

has taken in its guidance on the new Executive Orders. 

Senator HEITKAMP. Correct. Do you believe that indirect costs 

and benefits should be taken into consideration when conducting 

cost-benefit analysis? 

Ms. RAO. I do, and that is, again, part of the long-standing practice of OIRA and the agencies, to take those effects into account. 

Senator HEITKAMP. Do you believe that there is a role for qualitative and non-monetized benefits in cost-benefit analysis? 

Ms. RAO. Yes, I do believe they can play a role. 
21 

Senator HEITKAMP. Thank you. Do you believe in the principles 

set forth in Executive Order 12866 should be reaffirmed by the Administration? 

Ms. RAO. Yes. I think that those principles are very solid and 

have, in fact, been reaffirmed by this Administration. 

Senator HEITKAMP. The same thing with Circular A4, given that 

the circular is only guidance and not technically the law of the 

land, if tasked with drafting a new guidance to instruct agencies 

on how to conduct cost-benefit analysis. Would you reaffirm the 

same principles that are in Circular A4? 

Ms. RAO. Again, I think those principles are very solid and, may 

require some updating, but I think the basic core of that is solid. 

Senator HEITKAMP. I have just one more question, and this goes 

to the very important work. There is no one on this dais who does 

not rely—we have great bipartisan interaction with former heads 

of OIRA. You are really stepping into a critically important position. I have long maintained that you are understaffed. Can you 

tell me what you are going to do to try and either manage this important job with the staff that you have or advocate for a few more 

folks who I think could actually save you money in the long run? 

This is the push-pull of investments. 

Ms. RAO. Thank you, Senator. I think the President’s budget 

does call for an increase in resources in OIRA. 

Senator HEITKAMP. Do you think it is adequate? 

Ms. RAO. I am not sure as to the precise resource needs. I understand that former administrators believed that the office could use 

some more support, and so I commit to looking into that. 

Senator HEITKAMP. We commit to helping you. Senator Lankford 

is not here but we certainly commit to helping you in the future. 

And just so you know, we expect that we are going to see you a 

lot in our Subcommittee. We are very excited about the expertise 

that you bring to this job and excited about getting to work with 

you going forward. Thank you so much for agreeing to accept this 

position. 

I have a lot of questions for FEMA. I will reserve those, maybe 

if we get to a second round. Thank you. 

Chairman JOHNSON. Senator Hassan. 

OPENING STATEMENT OF SENATOR HASSAN 

Senator HASSAN. Thank you, Mr. Chairman, and thank you to all 

the nominees for being here, and also a special thank-you to the 

families who are here, because it is a family affair to serve and we 

are very grateful. 

Just at the outset, Mr. Vought, I will add my concern about your 

answer on the OLC’s guidance. We were elected to represent Republicans and Democrats, and it is my view that the Administration serves members of both parties in their oversight role, and I 

am hoping that you will rethink your response. 

I wanted to spend some time on issues concerning FEMA, and, 

Mr. Long, it was so nice to meet with you yesterday. I want to talk 

a little bit about pre-disaster mitigation, something we touched on 

yesterday. I think we can all agree that the frequency and intensity 

of natural disasters are on the rise. If we are going to blunt the 

effects of these disasters we are going to have to make effective and 
22 

sustained investments in our infrastructure prior to the disasters 

happening. 

As Governor, I often found myself dealing with the same flooded 

areas in New Hampshire, year after year. We would clean it up 

and then it would flood again. Federal support came only in the 

aftermath of these crises, leaving it up to our State to address the 

front-end investments in infrastructure that would have helped to 

mitigate the crisis in the first place. Consequently, we took steps 

to launch a hazard mitigation initiative in New Hampshire that 

would help us to inventory our most at-risk locations during natural disasters and help us to develop a way to target our limited 

resources more effectively. 

From my experience, our Federal programs may not be properly 

incentivizing our States to make the necessary investments in our 

infrastructure that will help to mitigate the long-term consequences after these disasters. I should note that one of the key 

FEMA programs that actually does encourage this kind of investment, the Pre-Disaster Mitigation Grant Program, was cut in half 

in the President’s Fiscal Year (FY) 2018 budget. 

Mr. Long, can you talk to me about your approach to pre-disaster 

mitigation investments and whether you support a Federal role for 

incentivizing these kinds of investments? 

Mr. LONG. Thank you, Senator. I believe that mitigation is the 

foundation of emergency management, or let us just say the cornerstone of emergency management. If we ultimately want to reduce 

costs in the future for disasters we have to do more mitigation. I 

believe that mitigation is a community effort. It cannot just be 

upon the Federal Government to supply funding to our State, local, 

and tribal partners. We have to all take action as the whole community. 

From my own experience as a former Director of Alabama Emergency Management Agency, I was director of a State that continuously seemed to be hit with disasters, and we had several disaster 

declaration. For us, mitigation funding came in the form of postdisaster, 404, 406 funding as we call it in the field. We had much 

more post-disaster mitigation funding, which seems regressive to 

me, than really we wanted on the pre-disaster side of the house. 

We focused mostly on the post-disaster funding to put that to work, 

according to the mitigation plans that we have designed. 

If confirmed, I would like to work with the Committee to evaluate all of the mitigation funding, not just pre-disaster mitigation 

funding but how do we possibly budgetize, all of it, up front, to do 

more work to reduce disaster costs, rather than basically have to 

get hit to be accessing the mitigation funding that is there. 

Senator HASSAN. Great. Thank you. We talked a little bit yesterday, as well, about employee morale at FEMA. In 2016, the Partnership for Public Service released the results of its annual Best 

Places To Work In the Federal Government survey, and FEMA 

came in 284th out of 305 Federal agencies. We talked a little bit 

about it, but could you just briefly touch on what your thoughts are 

about how to improve the morale there, because, obviously, the employees at FEMA do such critical work for our country and we 

want them to have high morale. 

Mr. LONG. Thank you, Senator. Yes, they do. 
23 

First of all, with my own experience within FEMA, previously 

working for Region IV and reflecting back on that experience, I believe that we have to be able to immediately, upon on boarding and 

hiring with staff, to make sure that they fully understand the mission of the agency but where their job specifically fits in. They also 

need to be able to see a career ladder, and I also believe that the 

agency, over the past 8 years, has done a great job of not only providing a blue sky day job when they are not responding but also 

the response job. I believe that the response piece is very important 

to making people feel a part of the overall mission. 

If confirmed, my type of leadership is very diplomatic. I like to 

get out, be out with the staff that is there, to understand how we 

can open up lines of communication from all parts of the agency 

to make sure that, if confirmed, my team would be able to understand how to improve the agency from all parts of it. 

Senator HASSAN. OK. Thank you very much. And Professor Rao, 

again, I enjoyed our conversation yesterday very much and I appreciated you taking the time to meet with me, and I appreciated very 

much your answers to Senator Heitkamp’s line of questioning, and 

particularly your affirmation of Executive Order 12866 as good 

precedent for OIRA. 

I want to turn, in the little bit of time I have left, to something 

we talked about yesterday, which was, we spoke about the importance of allowing agencies to be agile and more quickly if the needs 

arise, and that is one of the great challenges as we talk about regulation, and when we look at bills that, in some ways, perhaps could 

increase transparency but could also slow things down. An example 

I think of is in terms of the ongoing opioid epidemic. We need to 

be sure the public health and safety rules can keep up, for instance, with the entry of new synthetic drugs into the illicit marketplace, and ensure that old rules are not holding us back when 

it comes to responding effectively to other public health challenges. 

If confirmed as OIRA Administrator, how will you ensure that 

agencies are able to move quickly to change or implement needed 

rules as the need arises? 

Ms. RAO. Thank you, Senator. Yes, I think one of the ways that 

OIRA can do that is to provide its review process in an expeditious 

manner, so when agencies bring their rules to OIRA to make sure 

that we are moving through them quickly and appropriately, based 

on the need for the regulation. 

Senator HASSAN. Thank you very much, and again, thank you all 

for being here today. 

Chairman JOHNSON. Senator Peters. 

OPENING STATEMENT OF SENATOR PETERS 

Senator PETERS. Thank you, Mr. Chairman, and Ranking Member McCaskill for bringing the meeting together, and to each of 

you, it is good to have an opportunity to ask you some questions, 

and I am happy to say that if you are confirmed by the Senate I 

look forward to working with all three of you on some very important issues that you will be confronted with. 

But I serve as the Ranking Member on the Subcommittee on 

Federal Spending Oversight and Emergency Management, so, Mr. 

Long, I am going to start with you for my first question, because 
24 

we will probably be interacting more than with the other two. I am 

sure you are well aware of the ongoing crisis that we are experiencing in my State, in Flint, a water crisis of really unimaginable 

proportions, as a result of some very bad decisions made by the 

State of Michigan that led to lead contamination throughout the 

city, and which children are going to be suffering from for the rest 

of their lives. 

While I was pleased that Michigan received an emergency declaration, I was very disappointed that they did not receive a major 

disaster declaration from the President, because the disaster was 

‘‘not a result of a natural catastrophe nor caused by fire, flood, or 

explosion.’’ But certainly by any other definition, this was major 

disaster, looking into the eyes of a child who is suffering from lead 

poisoning and will be dealing with that their whole life. That child 

does not care whether or not it was man-made or natural. It is a 

disaster. The parents and grandparents of those children do not 

care what caused it. It is still a disaster. 

I know you note in your written statement FEMA is charged 

with helping communities recover in times of their greatest need 

and major disaster declaration could have been critical in certainly 

getting more timely help for the people of Flint. 

I was just curious, what is your view on allowing the President 

to issue a major disaster declaration for man-made disasters not 

caused by fire, flood, or explosion? I bring this up because we have 

actually proposed some legislation that I have co-sponsored in the 

past, dealing with lead in drinking water, and that is an extraordinary situation and we may find other communities across the 

country that are going to be faced with this type of crisis as well, 

going forward, which will have unimaginable impacts, just as it has 

had in Flint. 

I know you are concerned about opening up the floodgates to all 

sorts of assistance, which is always an issue that we have to be 

concerned about, but I think if we set some strong parameters and 

perhaps craft it in a way to help folks like future Flints, or in cities 

like Flint, we may be able to make sure that the American people 

stand behind other Americans who are suffering their greatest 

need. 

So what are your thoughts? 

Mr. LONG. Senator, thank you for your question. I have a lot of 

thoughts about this. First of all, I believe that the Stafford Act is 

a very general document that was designed to be very scalable, 

zoomable to help communities overcome many different types of 

disasters. Regarding this specific situation with Flint, I was not 

privy, obviously, to why the decisions were made for just an EM 

declaration, or why the Department of Health and Human Services 

(HHS) was put in charge as a public health emergency. Regarding 

that, I would be happy to sit down with you, if confirmed, to be 

able to understand your concerns more deeply, but also to work 

with the staff within FEMA to understand the decisions that were 

made, ultimately, that you have received, the EM declaration. 

Personally, I have been through several non-Stafford Disaster 

Acts events, one of those being Deepwater Horizon, one of those 

being an H1N1 public health emergency event, and I have grown 

to realize that at the local and State level, that emergency man-
25 

agers and first responders cannot afford to sit one out, just because 

we delineate whether it is Stafford Act or non-disaster Stafford Act. 

So, if confirmed, I do have direct experience with similar events 

that were not caused by nature, and I would be happy to evaluate 

the situation and meet with you. 

Senator PETERS. Well, I appreciate that. It sounds as if you do 

have concerns with the way the Act may be written now, to respond to some extreme emergencies. 

Mr. LONG. Senator, yes. I would be willing to sit down with you 

to understand your concerns. 

Senator PETERS. Right. I appreciate that, Mr. Long. 

Mr. LONG. Yes. 

Senator PETERS. Mr. Vought, I will concur with some of my colleagues who are very concerned about your comments in terms of 

responding to requests, Senator McCaskill’s questioning, that if we 

really are doing our job, as oversight, and my job as Ranking Member of the Federal Spending Oversight Subcommittee is to make 

sure the taxpayer money is being spent properly, that the appropriations made by Congress are done in a way that makes sense, 

and in order to do that we need information. So I am extremely 

troubled by comments that if you are in the minority party that 

questions related to specific documents that I may need in order to 

do my job, and my colleagues need to do our jobs, in Federal spending oversight or technical comments, briefings, for some reason 

would not be made available to us. 

I represent the entire State of Michigan. My colleagues represent 

the whole country. The people of this country expect us, and rightly 

so, to work in a non-partisan way when it comes to overseeing the 

Federal Government, asking the tough questions, making sure that 

money is being spent appropriately. 

I am extremely troubled that you believe if a minority member 

asks those kinds of questions you are not under any obligation to 

give that information. Is that accurate? 

Mr. VOUGHT. I do not think it is accurate, Senator. I believe 

strongly in the oversight process. I believe strongly in working on 

a bipartisan basis and transparently to reform programs and find 

waste, fraud, and abuse where we find them, and to participate in 

as many of these processes that the Congress sees fit to initiate. 

What I was merely responding to was the question about OLC’s 

memorandum as it pertains to certain forms of oversight requests, 

in which I would seek legal counsel within our agency about how 

to respond to those. 

Senator PETERS. I hope, if confirmed, that you fully appreciate 

the need for us to work in a cooperative way. The only way we are 

going to do this job appropriately for the American people is if we 

work in that manner. I am also concerned about a statement made 

by Director Mulvaney, recently suggesting that one of the agencies 

that we have always looked at in Congress as being a non-partisan 

policy analysis shop is the Congressional Budget Office (CBO), and 

I believe that Director Mulvaney suggested that ‘‘the day of the 

CBO has come and gone,’’ and that he may not be looking to analysis done by the CBO. 
26 

In your role as deputy director, would you consider the CBO 

scores as an integral part of the OMB’s toolkit in making policy decisions? What is your view of CBO? 

Mr. VOUGHT. CBO is a very important institution within the legislative process. OMB works very closely with CBO. It relies on its 

information. I think the director’s comments go to when there are 

very big legislative packages in which the CBO’s non-partisan analysis ends up causing political ramifications based on some of its 

conclusions that, in this case, we disagree with as an Administration. But that is not in any way to suggest that CBO does not have 

a valuable role in the legislative process. As a congressional staffer 

I relied on it heavily to assess a bill’s cost and the impact of what 

the bill would do if it was enacted. 

Senator PETERS. If I hear your comments correctly, the CBO is 

a valuable, non-partisan policy analysis organization, unless you 

disagree with their conclusions and therefore it is illegitimate. 

Mr. VOUGHT. No, sir. I do not think that is what I said. I think 

that CBO, like any other organization and institution, needs to be 

able to defend its methodology and its analysis, and what this Administration has been engaged in is a conversation with the American people about what CBO’s conclusions are with regard to the 

American Health Care Association (AHCA). This Administration 

feels that those conclusions are wrong, and have put forward its 

analysis for why that is the case with regard to various coverage 

numbers and some of the other impacts that CBO has said the 

AHCA would have on our health care system. 

Senator PETERS. If confirmed, I hope that you treat facts as facts 

and not being merely inconvenient and not supporting your opinions. Thank you. 

Mr. VOUGHT. Yes, sir. 

Chairman JOHNSON. Senator Hoeven. 

OPENING STATEMENT OF SENATOR HOEVEN 

Senator HOEVEN. Thanks, Mr. Chairman. Mr. Long, I want to 

commend you on your service in Alabama, and your work on behalf 

of the people there. I look forward to working with you at FEMA, 

and it is great that your family is here. They look pretty awesome. 

In North Dakota we have a number of flood projects. We flood 

up there pretty regularly, although this year it is looking like 

drought, unfortunately. And in the Fargo-Moorhead area, which is 

North Dakota/Minnesota, Red River to the north, we have Roy 

Wright up there who directs the FEMA insurance operations and 

he is very good. We really coordinated the flood mapping and the 

FEMA insurance with building the flood project. 

Mr. LONG. Right. 

Senator HOEVEN. In Minot, where we had a flood in 2011, and 

4,000 homes were flooded, so that is a lot more people—we are 

building flood protection in phases. We need you all to work with 

us on the remapping, so that people do not really get hammered 

with increasing FEMA premiums. I am asking for your commitment to work with us. I understand you have a job to do and you 

have to do it by law and regulation, but we need a problem-solver. 

We need your help now to do kind of the same thing that we have 
27 

done in the Red River valley, in the Souris River valley, to help 

those people. OK? I am asking for your commitment to do that. 

Mr. LONG. Yes. I can commit to working with you to understand. 

Senator HOEVEN. Good. Then you are going to get off easy. 

[Laughter.] 

Ms. Rao, We are now doing P3 projects—public-private partnerships. The President wanted to do P3 projects. We have been working on this for a while. We have passed into law P3 projects. Again, 

for the Red River valley, this is a $2.2 billion flood protection 

project that affects both North Dakota and Minnesota. It is underway. The Federal share was originally $900 million but now it is 

$450 million. How does that sound? Does that sound good? In other 

words, the cost to the Federal Government now has been cut in 

half. Does that sound like a good thing or not? 

Ms. RAO. I think that sounds like a good thing. 

Senator HOEVEN. Particularly when the Corps has a huge backlog in projects. Right? If we could cut that backlog in half like that 

would be a good thing, would it not? 

Ms. RAO. Yes, it would. 

Senator HOEVEN. We need some help to do that. Right now that 

$2.2 billion project is $450 million to the Federal Government, and 

the State and local financing is in place, because it is a public-private partnership. But, OMB still scores projects. When they come 

up from the Corps, even projects the Corps really wants to do, like 

this one, they still use the benefit-cost ratio without taking into effect, or account the P3 benefit. 

When they score our project, they are scoring it as if the Federal 

Government has to come up with $900 million, when they only 

have to come up with $450 million. Do you think that makes sense? 

Ms. RAO. Senator, that is an interesting issue. I am not familiar 

with that particular form of scoring but it is something that I 

would be happy to look into if I am confirmed. 

Senator HOEVEN. Good, because both the OMB Director and the 

White House have committed to me that they will do it, and the 

Corps, in fact, is working on it, and I want your support for it. 

Ms. RAO. Yes. I am happy to work with OMB. 

Senator HOEVEN. Again, I commend you on your outstanding experience and look forward to working with you, and thank you for 

coming by to visit with me. I appreciate it very much. 

Ms. RAO. Thank you. 

Senator HOEVEN. Mr. Vought, thanks for being here. I appreciate 

it. I just want to ask you about the Consumer Financial Protection 

Board (CFPB). I have serious concerns about the CFPB. I am on 

Appropriations, and we do not have jurisdiction over their appropriations. That makes no sense to me. I cannot fathom why we 

would not have authority when it comes to appropriating over the 

CFPB. 

Can you give me your thoughts on that? 

Mr. LONG. Thank you, Senator. I agree with you. I think that the 

CFPB is something that should be subject to the appropriations 

process. I think one of the reasons why it has the perception of 

being unaccountable is that it is not accountable to the annual appropriations process. That is one of the reasons why the President’s 
28 

budget calls for that specific reform, and I think it is a very important issue that you raise. 

Senator HOEVEN. I want to thank all three of you for being here 

and I look forward very much to working with you. Thank you. 

Chairman JOHNSON. Senator Daines. 

OPENING STATEMENT OF SENATOR DAINES 

Senator DAINES. Thank you, Mr. Chairman, Ranking Member 

McCaskill. Thank you to each nominee for your testimony. Overseeing the budget, management, regulation, and information policy, 

OMB is a cornerstone of the Trump Administration’s ‘‘drain the 

swamp’’ initiatives. I hope you are all investing in very large 

pumps. There is a lot of swamp that needs to be drained, whether 

it is the government reorganization, or rolling back these Obamaera regulations that are truly inhibiting economic growth. It is a 

boot on the neck of small businesses across this country. 

No less important, the FEMA Administrator will be responsible 

for assisting those in times of crisis and serve to get our communities back on their feet when a disaster strikes. We saw that happen, in fact, in Southeast Montana last summer, June 2016, when 

a tornado came through Fallon County. We are not known for our 

tornados in Montana, like Oklahoma might be, but it was devastating to our community and we were grateful for the support of 

FEMA. 

It is my hope that each of you will receive speedy confirmation. 

I want to start and talk about the budget process reform. I spent 

28 years in the private sector before coming to Washington. In fact, 

the last election I won prior to winning the congressional election 

in 2012, was as student body president of my high school. I am the 

only MSU Bobcat in Congress. I am also the only chemical engineer. I spent 28 years managing businesses held accountable for 

producing a budget each year, and then ensuring that we did not 

spend more than we were taking in. In fact, in the private sector, 

you have to take in more than you spend because that is called 

profit, but we are a long ways from that here in Washington, D.C. 

There is a growing sentiment in Congress that the congressional 

budget process is broken, from start to finish. I think using the 

word ‘‘broken’’ is a kind word. According to January 2017 CBO report, by this September 30th, well over half of our discretionary 

spending, $648 billion, will be appropriated to unauthorized programs. Congress has not passed all 12 appropriation bills since 

1996. For those of you playing at home, that is 21 years. In addition, the process leads to brinkmanship, with do-or-die passage of 

an annual, if we are lucky, omnibus bill, that does not allow for 

targeted congressional oversight. 

Thirteen of my 28 years I spent in the private sector was with 

a company called Procter & Gamble. In fact, I was part of the 

shampoo operations for a number of years. On the back of a bottle 

of shampoo, it oftentimes will say, ‘‘Lather, rinse, repeat.’’ It sure 

feels a lot that way here in Washington, D.C. I will put a lot of 

money on the table that we back to a CR kind of discussion here, 

coming soon, as we approach the end of our fiscal year, and we go 

through this repeated cycle of insanity in this country, and the people of our great country deserve much better. 
29 

Mr. Vought, you have seen the shortcomings of our budget processes first-hand in Congress. Do you agree that congressional budget process is in need of an overhaul? 

Mr. VOUGHT. Yes, Senator, I do. 

Senator DAINES. Where will budget process reform fall in your 

priorities at OMB, and can we count on OMB to actively participate in these reform efforts? 

Mr. VOUGHT. You can, Senator. It is a very important issue for 

OMB to think through. Typically, the OMB Analytical Perspectives 

has an entire chapter about budget process reforms that it intends 

to propose. This year our budget process reform chapter was smaller because the Administration was so new and the priority was 

Senator Rounds getting the budget done. But next year, if the Senate confirms me, I really do want to have a much broader conversation, internally and with this Committee, about ways that we can 

reform the budget process, ways that we can remove 

brinksmanship from the budget process, ways that we can get at 

unauthorized spending, which is actually banned in the House but 

they waived the rule almost on every appropriations bill. It is a 

major problem and we need to have new and creative ways to address it. 

Senator DAINES. I was struck by D.C.’s continuing ineptitude, 

and this institution’s failure, just this last budgeting cycle—I am 

on the Appropriations Committee—we were 7 months into this current fiscal year before an omnibus was passed. I just cannot imagine. In my days of working for a Fortune 20 company and then I 

worked in a family construction business, then I was part of cloud 

computing startup. We took the company public and grew a lot of 

jobs. But I cannot imagine. Imagine the Chief Financial Officer 

(CFO) showing up at the board meeting and saying, ‘‘Well, first, we 

do not have a budget,’’ and we are 7 months into the fiscal year 

before you even basically authorize the funds. It is ludicrous. This broken process has produced $20 trillion of 

debt and the projections are, frankly, ominous as we go forward 

now, in terms of the fiscal condition of this country, because of the 

inability of this institution to let alone balance a budget, but to 

even pass one in a timely fashion. 

I want to shift gears and talk about the debt ceiling reforms. Recently, Treasury Secretary Mnuchin indicated that Congress may 

need to lift the debt ceiling by the end of July. I am a strong believer we need to continue to consider budget reforms with any 

debt ceiling increase to get to the crux of the issue, and that the 

next Administration will play an important role in making that 

happen. 

Mr. Vought, do you believe we should pursue budget reforms in 

the context of lifting the debt ceiling? 

Mr. VOUGHT. Senator, thank you for that question. I do believe 

that that also tracks with history in terms of many of the times 

that we have raised the debt limit, we have included budget process reforms, other spending reductions over time. My old boss authored Gramm-Rudman-Hollins. That was attached to a debt limit 

increase. 

We certainly do not want brinksmanship in the legislative process, but in terms of using the debt limit increase as an opportunity 
30 

to take account of where we are, fiscally, as a country, when we 

are $20 trillion in debt and we are being asked to, once again, raise 

the debt limit, the debt limit needs to be raised but it does not 

seem smart, at the same time, to then not take account and try to 

fix the problem. 

Senator DAINES. Yes, and I am going to squeeze in a quick question to Ms. Rao. You are going to spearhead the Administration’s 

deregulatory efforts, rolling back some of these Obama-era regs. 

We have got a gross domestic product (GDP) growth of under 1.5 

percent during the tenure of the last Administration. 

Specific question—would you support legislative efforts to 

streamline the retractions of regulations? 

Ms. RAO. Well, Senator, that is an interesting proposal and it is 

one I would be interested to consider working with you on. 

Senator DAINES. All right. Thank you. I am out of time. 

Chairman JOHNSON. Senator Carper. 

OPENING STATEMENT OF SENATOR CARPER 

Senator CARPER. I just want to take a minute. I was not going 

to mention this. I just want to go back in time, if we could. Harry 

Truman used to say the only thing that is new in the world is the 

history we forgot or never learned. 

Let us just back up a little bit. We actually had balanced budgets 

about 16 or 17 years ago. In fact, we had four of them. We had not 

balanced budgets since 1968. We had four balanced budgets in a 

row, and one of the ways we did it, we matched—I am a recovering 

Governor, OK? I governed in Delaware from 1993 to 2001. We had 

8 years of balanced budgets. We cut taxes 7 out of the 8 years. We 

paid down some of our debt. We got a triple-A credit rating. I know 

a little bit about balancing budgets. I was State treasurer for 6 

years before that. 

The last 4 years of the Clinton Administration, what did we do? 

We balanced the budget. We matched revenues and we matched expenditures. We grew the economy. More jobs created in those 8 

years than any 8 years in the history of this country. We did exciting things on environmental reforms. And we did a number of 

things in terms of regulatory reforms that some of us may not have 

liked, but we sure grew the heck out of the budget. 

The guy who helped drive the budget deal, during those years 

was Erskine Bowles. President Clinton asked him to do the deal, 

and to negotiate with the Republicans, and he did. One of the key 

Republicans was the Chairman of the House Budget Committee, a 

guy named John Kasich. He was a personal friend of mine. I was 

elected, came to the Congress with him, served with him for many 

years. He is still my friend. 

What happened there, you had Democrats and Republicans 

working together who are determined to balance the budget, and 

they succeeded, because of bipartisan support. 

This Administration, I will tell you, and I know that some others 

have been asking questions about responsiveness, this is the worst 

responsiveness I have ever seen. If we had a Democratic Administration and Republicans were trying to get information through 

oversight over this Democratic Administration, and got the kinds 
31 

of responses that we have been getting, non-responses, you guys 

would shut the place down. We probably ought to do that as well. 

And so talking about draining the swamp, give me a break. They 

are creating the swamp. These folks are creating the swamp, and 

that is not a dispersion on the people that are before us today. But 

I just cannot sit here and listen to what I have just heard and say 

nothing in response. 

Barack Obama—everybody makes mistakes. What did Richard 

Nixon used to say? The only people that do not make mistakes are 

people who do not do anything, and the last President, whether you 

like him or not, he did a lot. One of the things that I am proudest 

of, that they did, you can look at 8 years, almost without a scintilla 

of scandal. He is a very moral person, tried to make sure that the 

people around him understood that and behaved accordingly. 

One of the big mistakes that he made, he did not embrace 

Bowles-Simpson. If he had embraced Bowles-Simpson, I think the 

rest of us would have fallen in line, and finally, when it got to the 

point of actually negotiating on a Bowles-Simpson with John 

Boehner, Speaker of the House, and they negotiated basically a 

Bowles-Simpson deal—restraint on spending, entitlement reform, 

and revenues. Those are the three corners of the agreement. The 

Speaker took the deal back to the House—you were probably 

there—and could not sell it. He came back, tried to renegotiate it, 

and could not sell it. I give John Boehner credit. I give President 

Obama credit. But if we had somehow been able to do that deal, 

we would not be having to negotiate this situation now with $20 

trillion in debt. 

I just want to say again, and I do not know who to direct this 

to—Mr. Vought, maybe to you—if this kind of lack of responsiveness continues, I hesitate to think what we are going to do in response. It is just unacceptable. I am a big believer in the Golden 

Rule—treat other people the way we want to be treated. But if we 

had a Democratic House, a Democratic Senate, and we had a 

Democratic President, and the Republicans were trying to do oversight from the House and the Senate to oversight on a Democratic 

Administration, and you got no responses, the Republican Congress 

got no responses to their inquiries, or lack of responses, pitiful responses, you guys would go nuts, and you should. Maybe we should 

as well. 

I guess it is a message that I would share with you. I do not 

mean to take out anything on you, but my friend from Montana 

has got me excited this morning, more excited than I usually am. 

Senator DAINES. Would the gentleman yield? 

Senator CARPER. I am happy to yield. 

Senator DAINES. I am grateful for Governors who serve in the 

U.S. Senate, on both sides. 

Senator CARPER. And I am grateful for business leaders who 

serve. 

Senator DAINES. Well, I will say, I think the—— 

Senator MCCASKILL. How about auditors? [Laughter.] 

Chairman JOHNSON. Not so much about auditors. 

Senator DAINES. I would just say I think our path forward here, 

and the swamp here has been created over years and years and 

years, and you cannot, I think, point to any one Administration. 
32 

We are at where we are at. But Governors that come to the Senate 

I think bring a very pragmatic approach, and I think our solution 

forward is going to be to get our Democratic and Republican former 

Governors in the Senate to work on some of these budget reforms, 

because you have had to produce a balanced budget, truly. And I 

appreciate the comments from the gentleman. 

Chairman JOHNSON. First of all, I want to stop the clock so we 

do not take any from Senator Carper’s time, but I need to respond, 

because the truth is we have done about 80 percent of SimpsonBowles, and it barely made a dent. 

Senator CARPER. No. With due respect we have not done the entire reform. We have not done that—— 

Chairman JOHNSON. But not—— 

Senator CARPER [continuing]. Through revenue increases. 

Chairman JOHNSON. We have done about 80 percent. 

Senator CARPER. I just do not agree. 

Chairman JOHNSON. I will give you the figures. About $700 billion in tax increased the fiscal cliff. I think Simpson-Bowles wanted 

$900 billion. Then we got $2.1 billion with the Budget Control Act. 

I think Simpson-Bowles was calling about $1.9 trillion for discretionary. We did not do the quarter of a trillion dollars on entitlement reforms. That was about the only thing we left off the table 

there, and again, it has not even made it down. I just wanted to 

challenge that. Simpson-Bowles barely made a dent. We have done 

80 percent of it. Now we do need to do entitlement reform, but 

Simpson-Bowles barely did anything. That was about a quarter of 

a trillion dollars. 

Senator CARPER. I want to reclaim my time. 

Chairman JOHNSON. We have kind of done it. We did not call it 

Simpson-Bowles but Budget Control Act, the fiscal cliff, we got the 

revenue, we got the discretionary spending. We actually reduced—— 

Senator CARPER. Let me reclaim my time. 

Chairman JOHNSON. OK. 

Senator CARPER. Those 4 years when we had balanced budgets, 

spending as a percentage of GDP was about 22 percent. Those 4 

years that we had balanced budgets, revenues as a percent of GDP 

was about 22 percent, maybe 20 percent, and today revenue as a 

percent of GDP is 17 or 18 percent, spending is about 22. And that 

is part of the problem. 

In any event, somewhere down the line we will have a President 

and a Congress that want to work together, leaders of the Congress 

and the Administration will want to work together, and I hope that 

is sooner rather than later. 

I will say this. One of the things that we, as our to-do list around 

here, is the GAO High Risk List. I do not know how familiar you 

are with it, Mr. Vought. Are you? 

Mr. VOUGHT. I am familiar with it, Senator. I have read previous 

reports. I have not taken a look at the latest report, but, unfortunately, one of the problems with the GAO High Risk series—— 

Senator CARPER. I was just asking if you were familiar with it. 

OK? Hold your fire. 

They give us all these ways, ideas of saving money, and some of 

them are defense spending, some of them are non-defense spend-
33 

ing. But I will say, I spent 23 years in the Navy, retired Navy captain. I loved the military. I loved the Navy. But we spend more 

money on defense than the next six, seven, or eight nations combined, and the Administration’s President is asking for an enormous increase, over $50 billion more for defense spending. 

Meanwhile, you have one of the GAO recommendations, on the 

High Risk List you have $400 billion cost overruns in major weapons systems. Department of Defense (DOD), after all these years, 

after, what, 70 years being around, they still have not gotten a 

clean bill of health on their audit—70 years. The Department of 

Homeland Security, they did it in like 6 or 7 years and they are 

still at it. Three of them now. Is not that right, about three of 

them? And Defense—what you cannot measure you cannot manage. 

We need to do some work there and I hope that this Administration will say, rather than just giving the Department of Defense 

another $55 or $60 billion, maybe we should go to that GAO High 

Risk List and see how we can save some money while we do this 

kind of thing. 

But I wanted to mention the High Risk List. I think there is a 

lot of interest here on this side, Democrat and Republican, to work 

that list, and save a ton of money. 

I will ask you this question—one of the recommendations they 

made is—from GAO—and, Mr. Chairman, just cut me off when you 

are ready. But I would like to mention this because we have discussed this before. We had John Koskinen in before the Finance 

Committee. We had him there several times. They tried to impeach 

him in the House, and as Commissioner of the Internal Revenue 

Service (IRS) I think he is one of the most decent people I have 

met in government. He is honorable, smart, business person. He 

spent a career just basically taking businesses that were wrecked 

and making something of them, and I think he is doing a workman-like job into the IRS, and a thankless job. 

But one of the recommendations of GAO, is we could actually 

raise some revenues if we would give IRS the tools that they need, 

the people, the budget, and the technology that they need, and for 

every dollar that we would spend in that we would get back $5, $6 

or $7, and we would provide a lot better customer service for the 

people that we are serving. People call our offices all the time and 

say, ‘‘I cannot get anybody in IRS to help me.’’ Your thoughts on 

that? 

Mr. VOUGHT. I think in the grand scheme of the budget, the IRS 

was basically protected in terms of the amount of reductions that 

it was asked to live under for fiscal year 2018. About 95 percent 

of all filers are now doing it online, and this budget increases operation support by 6 percent. Now, obviously, there are reductions 

elsewhere, but we felt that trying to modernize and continue to 

make efficiencies to move people toward filing their taxes online 

can help. We certainly agree that the IRS is crucial in being able 

to collect the necessary amount of revenue that people owe in paying their taxes, and it is one of the reasons we were very careful, 

as we were with the rest of the budget, to allocate reductions where 

they made the most sense. 
34 

Senator CARPER. All right. Thanks so much. Let me say, in closing, Mr. Long, very nice meeting you this morning, and was that 

your daughter I met? 

Mr. LONG. No. My wife. 

Senator CARPER. Oh, I am sorry. 

Mr. LONG. She would appreciate that comment though, right? 

[Laughter.] 

Senator CARPER. And I met your two sons. They are handsome 

guys. He went to Appalachian State University. My father-in-law 

taught there for 40 years. My wife grew up there, on the campus, 

so it is kind of a home game. Good luck. We are anxious to get to 

work with you. 

Ms. Rao, I do not know you well. I appreciate the time that we 

spent together and if you get confirmed I look forward to having 

a chance to work with you down the line. 

Mr. Vought, thank you so much. Thank you for your kind note 

as well. Thank you. 

Mr. VOUGHT. Thank you. 

Ms. RAO. Thank you. 

Chairman JOHNSON. Thank you, Senator Carper, and I hope you 

do not think I cut you off. I was just responding. I stopped the clock 

and gave you extra time. By the way, what I would love to do, and 

we will do this, I want to hold a hearing, and we will go through 

the budgetary history of what all has happened, where spending 

was as a percentage of GDP, where revenue was, why we were able 

to balance the budget for a brief moment in time, what has happened since that time. We will lay out the facts, lay out the reality. 

I am happy to do it. I think it is going to be crucial. 

I know Senator McCaskill has some more questions so I will turn 

it over to Senator McCaskill. 

Senator MCCASKILL. Yes. Before I get to my FEMA question, I 

was struck, Mr. Vought, on your comment a minute ago where you 

said ‘‘we are being asked to raise the debt limit.’’ Who is asking you 

to raise the debt limit? 

Mr. VOUGHT. Senator, I know the Administration has asked Congress to raise the debt limit. 

Senator MCCASKILL. So you are asking us to raise the debt limit. 

Mr. VOUGHT. Correct. The debt limit—— 

Senator MCCASKILL. When you say ‘‘we are being asked,’’ it is 

you. You, Mr. Vought, are asking us to raise the debt limit. Correct? 

Mr. VOUGHT. The debt limit does need to be raised, Senator. 

Senator MCCASKILL. OK. 

Mr. VOUGHT. I think there is—— 

Senator MCCASKILL. I think there seems to be a little bit of disconnect around here, in that, for years the debt limit was something that nobody wanted to raise, and it was being used as a political two-by-four, even though everybody understands. Now that you 

guys are in charge, it is painful, but you have to face the reality 

that this is an inappropriate political two-by-four. The debt limit 

has to be raised. The President of the United States is asking us 

to raise the debt limit. The Republican leadership is asking us to 

raise the debt limit. I want to make sure that is on the record 

clearly, and if anybody has somebody else who asking them to raise 
35 

the debt limit, they need to let us know, because the only people 

I know that are asking to raise the debt limit, at this point, is your 

Administration and the Republican leadership in Congress. 

Are you aware of anybody else who is asking to raise the debt 

limit? 

Mr. VOUGHT. No, Senator. 

Senator MCCASKILL. OK. Mr. Long, on Friday, President Trump 

issued a major disaster declaration for 48 of Missouri’s 114 counties—so that gives you some idea of the massive amount of flooding 

that we had, and the real problem that we are facing in Missouri, 

that is way beyond the capability of State and local governments. 

What we had, we had a number of bridges completely wiped out. 

We had roads washed out. We had homes completely washed away. 

By the way, let me give you these statistics. 2016 was a major 

year for flooding. Nationwide flood losses last year were six times 

greater than 2015, and the number of Presidential disaster declarations has tripled over the past decade, compared to 20 years prior. 

So your business is going to be going up, not down. 

Given that statistic, and given that reality, are you concerned about the $600 million in budget cuts that have been proposed for 

FEMA in 2018? 

Mr. LONG. Ranking Member McCaskill, thank you for the question. First, I fully support the President’s budget, but, if confirmed, 

I do realize that as FEMA Administrator I have to make sure that 

the agency can meet the demands, particularly when it comes to 

saving lives and sustaining life after each disaster. I have to be 

able to work with my staff, once confirmed, to go in and evaluate 

where we are, measure out the increasing demands placed upon 

the agency, and if I do perceive a problem I look forward to diplomatically working with this Committee to address those issues. 

Senator MCCASKILL. I think you are going to get a lot of support 

on a bipartisan basis for the FEMA budget, because all of our 

States, I will never forget. Whether it was Hurricane Katrina or 

whether it was Hurricane Sandy or whether it was flooding, there 

are actual examples of people who voted against funding for those 

disasters until their State had a disaster, and then all of a sudden 

it was like, ‘‘OK, we need more Federal money.’’ I am hopeful that 

we can work on that budget because I do not think it is realistic, 

in light of the uptick that we see in the data. 

Mr. Vought, I hope that—and I do not mean to be—I know I am 

coming on very strongly with you this morning but I am frustrated, 

as you can probably tell. I am particularly upset about a lawyer in 

the Justice Department telling the entire Executive Branch I have 

no authority to do oversight. I think it is outrageous, and so I am 

also ginned up about the fact that we have two important people 

in the government saying exact opposite things about the budget. 

Director Mulvaney emphatically asserted that ‘‘the budget assumes a deficit-neutral tax plan that does not rely on economic 

growth to achieve that deficit neutrality.’’ Secretary Mnuchin said, 

in a Finance Committee hearing, ‘‘We are not far along in tax reform to have modeled the impact. Again, just to be clear, when the 

budget came out we overlaid the Administration’s plan for growth, 

which were incorporated, and that is what is shown here. We do 

not have tax changes so we did not model tax changes.’’ 
36 

We now have, on the same day, at two separate hearings, the 

Secretary of Treasury stating, unequivocally, that the tax cuts in 

the budget were not offset by tax policy changes, but instead by 

economic growth, and on the same day the Director of OMB saying 

we went through a list of exclusions that are reduced—loopholes 

that are closed and deductions that are removed, and calculated 

that those would offset the tax cuts in the proposed budget. 

So, under oath, I have the Secretary of the Treasury saying that 

this is just economic growth and I have the head of OMB saying 

that it is the tax policy changes that are, in fact, neutralizing the 

revenue losses. What is going on here? Are they not talking to each 

other, because clearly they are saying 180-degree, polar opposite in 

hearings about the same budget. 

Mr. VOUGHT. Thank you, Senator. I do not think that is the case. 

We have been very clear, as an Administration, that this budget 

does not double-count the revenue increase from economic growth 

twice. You can either use it once, for deficit reduction, or you can 

use it to pay for the tax cut. This budget uses the revenue from 

economic growth and contributes it toward deficit reduction. 

The tax cut is assumed to be deficit-neutral, and what we did in 

the assumption that we made, with regard to the tax proposal, was 

to take the guidelines that were put forward by Secretary Mnuchin 

and Director Cohn which included, in those guidelines, or paying 

for the tax increase, or the tax decreases with getting rid of special 

deductions and credits and loopholes, broadening the base. That is 

what is meant to pay for the tax cut. 

Senator MCCASKILL. So, the Secretary of the Treasury is wrong. 

This is not revenue growth that will pay for the tax cut. It is revenue growth that will, in fact, reduce the deficit. So what I need 

from you, Mr. Vought, is where is the money coming from in the 

reduction of loopholes that is paying for the tax cut? What are 

they? 

Mr. VOUGHT. Again, that is where we get to the fact that the tax 

proposal has not been developed yet. 

Senator MCCASKILL. Wait. You are saying it is going to pay for 

itself but you have no idea how it is going to pay for itself. 

Mr. VOUGHT. The tax proposal has—which is based on a number 

of guidelines that were put forward by Secretary Mnuchin and Director Cohn—— 

Senator MCCASKILL. Give me one example. Give me one example 

of how you are going to pay for this tax cut with closing loopholes. 

Mr. VOUGHT. Again, I would go back to the guidelines in which 

they said—— 

Senator MCCASKILL. Well, give me an example. You have to 

know it. You drew up the budget. What are they? 

Mr. VOUGHT. Again, the policy development process is not at that 

point where we are ready to say specifically which deductions and 

credits are proposed for elimination. It is part of—— 

Senator MCCASKILL. OK. So you do not have any idea how you 

are going to pay for the tax cuts then. 

Mr. VOUGHT. Again—— 

Senator MCCASKILL. You are going to pay for it within the tax 

cut bill by closing loopholes, but you cannot give me one example 

of a loophole that you put in the budget is having made—and that 
37 

1The chart referenced by Senator Johnson appears in the Appendix on page 246. 

is what makes it balance? You are willing to stand by that, that 

you are going to tell the American people you are balancing the 

budget and you cannot give me one example of how you are paying 

for the tax code? 

Mr. VOUGHT. Senator, the budget is a set of assumptions. The assumption that we had when we wrote the budget was based on the 

policy development process that was where it was at that point, 

which was a set of guidelines and specifics as it was reflected in 

those guidelines. The rate reductions are obviously something that 

the President wants—— 

Senator MCCASKILL. Well, those are specific. 

Mr. VOUGHT. Correct. 

Senator MCCASKILL. The only thing that is not specific is how 

you pay for it, and you are telling me now you do not have any 

idea. 

Mr. VOUGHT. I do not have any further specifics on the tax plan. 

No, Senator. 

Senator MCCASKILL. You do not even have an idea about what 

one might be, what category it might be? 

Mr. VOUGHT. Not at this point, Senator. 

Senator MCCASKILL. Yes. How can you expect us to take this document seriously? It sounds like a novel. 

Mr. VOUGHT. It is a set of policy assumptions based on what we 

know currently. Obviously—— 

Senator MCCASKILL. You cannot say something balances on policy proposals when you are not even willing to say out loud what 

the policy is. How can you have the straight face to say to the 

American people, ‘‘We balanced the budget,’’ when you cannot even 

step up to the microphone and give me some idea of how that happens. 

Mr. VOUGHT. Senator, the policy development process is underway and I understand your desire to have clarity on that point, and 

we hope that it materializes soon. 

Senator MCCASKILL. OK. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. 

Chairman JOHNSON. Thank you, Senator McCaskill. I would ask, 

or give you a sheet here, and ask consent to enter this into the 

record.1 I did a little spreadsheet on what I was talking to Senator 

Carper about, and we will give his staff a similar chart showing 

that, in fact, we have done about 81 percent of Simpson-Bowles. I 

was pretty close to the $700 billion in the revenue from the fiscal 

cliff, $2.1 trillion of discretionary savings. Simpson-Bowles had less 

than that but they also had about $795 billion of savings in terms 

of health care savings, mandatory savings, and some Social Security reforms. Total difference, $3.4 trillion of savings under Simpson-Bowles. We have done about $2.8. The rest is savings on interest. 

I will enter that into the record, but again, my point being is we 

have done 81 percent of Simpson-Bowles and we still have a massive debt problem and a massive projected deficit. 
38 

1The information for Mr. Long appears in the Appendix on page 45. 

2The information for Mr. Vought appears in the Appendix on page 113. 

3The information for Ms. Rao appears in the Appendix on page 175. 

The nominees have made financial disclosures1 and provided responses to biographical and pre-hearing questions2 submitted by 

the Committee. Without objection, this information will be made 

part of the hearing record,3 with the exception of financial data, 

which are on file and available for public inspection in the Committee offices. 

I want to thank the nominees for your willingness to serve. As 

you can see, we have enormous challenges, some divisions. We 

want to work through those things. I want to really thank the families. I know, unfortunately, you will see probably less of your loved 

ones here, so this is a sacrifice for the entire family as well. Thank 

you for your willingness to serve. 

With that the hearing record will remain open until noon tomorrow, June 8th, for the submission of statements and questions for 

the record. 

This hearing is adjourned. 

[Whereupon, at 11:53 a.m., the committee was adjourned.] 
(39) 

A P P E N D I X 
40 

Brock Long has more than 16 years of experience working in emergency management at the 

local, state, and federal level. Mr. Long is currently the Vice president at Haggerty Consulting, an 

emergency management consulting tirm in Illinois. Prior to joining Haggerty Consulting, he was the 

director of Alabama's Emergency Management Agency from 2008 to 2011. While heading 

Alabama's emergency response, he coordinated 14 disasters and 8 presidentially-declared events. 

He also helped develop Alabama's response to the Hl-NI int1uenza, and served as the on-scene 

State Incident Commander during the Deepwater Horizon oil spill. 

Prior to heading Alabama's emergency agency, he spent years as FEMA's Region IV 

Hurricane Planner and Response Team Leader, and Georgia's statewide Hurricane Program 

Manager and School Safety Coordinator. Mr. Long received a Bachelor of Science and Masters of 

Public Affairs from Appalachian State University and an Executive Leaders Certificate from Naval 

Post Graduate School. 

Russ Vought 

Mr. Vought is currently a senior political appointee at OMB. Most recently, he was a Vice 

President at Heritage Action for America, and prior to that worked as the Policy Director for the 

House Republican Conference and Executive Director for the Republican Study Committee (RSC). 

Prior to joining the RSC, he worked as a congressional staffer to several members of Congress, 

including Rep. Jeb Hensarling, Senator Chuck Hagel, Senator Phil Gramm, and Senator Dan Coats. 

Mr. Vought received his J.D. from George Washington University Law School and his 

Bachelor of Arts form Wheaton College. 

Neomi Rao 

Ms. Rao is currently an associate professor oflaw at George Mason University. She 

founded the school's Center for the Study of the Administrative State, and is now the Director of 

the Center. From 2005 to 2006, Ms. Rao served in George W. Bush White House Counsel's oftice 

as Associate Counsel and Special Assistant to the President, and prior to that was an associate at 

Clifford Chance LLP in London. Ms. Rao also spent a year working as a counsel for nominations 

and constitutional law on the Senate Committee on the Judiciary. 

Ms. Rao clerked for the Honorable Justice Clarence Thomas on the United States Supreme 

Court, and Judge J. Harvie Wilkinson Ill on the United States Court of Appeals for the Fourth 

Circuit. She received her J.D. from the University of Chicago Law School and her Bachelor of Arts 

from Yale University. 

I'd like to thank the nominees who have volunteered to serve in these important positions, and I 

look forward to hearing their testimony. 
41 

Introduction of Professor Neomi Rao 

Homeland Security and Government Affairs Committee 

Senator Orrin G. Hatch 

June 7, 2017 

Mr. Chairman, it is my distinct pleasure to introduce Professor Neomi Rao (Nay-o-Me 

Raow) at today's hearing, and to fully commend her confirmation to the committee. I've known 

Professor Rao for some time, ever since she worked as a counsel to the Senate Judiciary 

Committee. Since then, Professor Rao has distinguished herself in private practice, government 

service, and academia. Her experiences have prepared her well for what will be an important and 

challenging task ahead. 

The position of Administrator of OIRA may not receive as much fanfare as other 

nominations, but it plays a critical role in modern policymaking. This administration has said that 

it would get serious about regulatory reform. Republicans in Congress have said the same. 

Professor Rao's confirmation will be an important step forward in fulfilling that promise. 

Professor Rao · s qualifications speak for themselves. After graduating from Yale, 

Professor Rao attended the university of Chicago Law School. She then clerked for Judge 

Harvie Wilkinson III on the Fourth Circuit and Justice Clarence Thomas on the Supreme Court. 

After spending a few years in private practice, she served as an Associate Counsel and Special 

Assistant to the President, and then began a career in academia. She currently teaches at the 

Antonin Scalia Law School at George Mason University, where she is also the founder and 

director of the Center for the Study of the Administrative State. 

Mr. Chairman, there is little doubt at this point that our present system for formulating 

and implementing federal regulatory policy is simply unacceptable. For years, citizens and 

businesses have complained about an administrative process that is opaque and unresponsive. 

And for years, this process has produced results that too often harm economic growth, while 

rarely improving public health and welfare. 

Accordingly, over the span of several past administrations, a consensus has formed that 

an important step in streamlining and improving the administrative process is to empower an 

OIRA Administrator. Professor Rao is supremely and uniquely qualified to step into this role. 

Under her watch, we can expect OIRA to carefully scmtinize rules to assure that they satisfy 

cost-benefit analysis. 

But, of course, as Professor Rao gets to work, we can't take our eye off the ball here in 

Congress. We will need more than just exceptional candidates like Professor Rao at OIRA. The 

legislative branch must do its part. That's why I was pleased to co-sponsor the Regulatory 

Accountability Act, along with Senators Portman, Lankford, Manchin, and Heitkamp. The 

committee reported this legislation to the full Senate last month. I'm hopeful that the rest of our 

colleagues, on both sides of the aisle, will join us in making it law. 
42 

The RAA is a carefully negotiated, bipartisan e!Iort to codify existing policy that 

streamlines and improves the rulemaking process. Further, I'll be introducing legislation later 

this month. the Separation of Powers Restoration Act, that will begin a conversation about the 

growth of federal regulation enabled by the Chevron doctrine and abetted by broad legislative 

delegation. Just like the confirmation of Professor Rao, these efforts at regulatory reform are not 

about politics. Regardless of which party controls the Presidency, regardless of which controls 

Congress, our administrative process is broken. The time to fix it is now. 

In conclusion, Mr. President, I'll say one more time that I am very pleased to be here 

today to introduce and recommend Professor Rao for this important post. The federal 

policymaking process, and federal policy generally, will stand to benefit from her leadership. 

Thank you very much for the opportunity to testify today. 
43 

Introduction: 

Opening Statement 

W. Brock Long, Nominee 

Administrator, FEMA 

United States Senate 

Committee on Homeland Security and Governmental Affairs 

June 7, 2017,10:00 a.m., 342 Dirksen Senate Office Building 

Good Morning Chairman Johnson, Ranking Member McCaskill, and Members of the Committee. 

My name is Brock Long, and I'd like to start by thanking Senator Burr for his kind introduction. 

I'm a North Carolina native, a dedicated husband and father, and a passionate emergency manager 

that has worked in the field my entire career. I am honored by the President's nomination, Secretary 

Kelly's support, and thankful for the Committee's time and consideration of me to potentially serve 

as the Nation's next Administrator of FE;>.!J\. 

I believe that FEM:\'s mission is one of the most important within the Federal govemment, and it is 

a privilege to be considered to lead this agency ultimately charged with saving and protecting lives, 

and helping communities recover in times of their greatest need. Americans rightfully have high 

performance expectations of FEMA, and I desire to help the agency further our Nation's collective 

levels of readiness and resiliency for future disasters. I realize leading FEMA is not an easy task; 

howe,·er, I do not fear the challenge ahead, but rather welcome the opportunity to work with you 

and our partners to transform our field and make America safer. 

Background/Experience: 

I'm a diplomatic leader that has dedicated nearly two decades of service to helping communities and 

organizations prepare for, respond to, and recover from disasters. My career experience in 

emergency management is unique. Not only have I held leadership positions in both the public and 

private sector emergency management organizations, I have also served at the State and Federal 

levels of gm·ernment within the field. For the past six years I have been working in the private 

sector helping communities and private organizations across the Nation achieve a variety of 

emergency management, public health, and Homeland Security, goals and project initiatives. As a 

result of my evolving experience, I have my fingers on the pulse of local and state emergency 

management needs and issues. 

I began my career helping the Georgia Emergency Management Agency craft one of the Nation's 

first innovative school safety programs, and assisted local governments across the state with 

hurricane and emergency operations planning. I supported statewide response efforts in the State 

Emergency Operations Center during one of the nation's largest evacuation and mass care events as 

a result of Hurricane Floyd in 1999. 

On the morning of 9/11, l interviewed with FEMA., and eventually was selected to serve as the 

Region IV Hurricane Program Manager in charge of helping states and local governments design life 

safety evacuation plans and working directlv with the National Hurricane Center to help jurisdictions 
44 

interpret risk and vulnerabilities when threatened by tropical systems. I was a part of FEMA when 

it was at its best in 2004, responding to four major hurricanes in six weeks. I was also a part of 

FEMA during its worst moment in 2005 when the agency learned that it is only as good as its 

weakest link and its last disaster. 

In 2007, I was appointed by Governor Bob Riley to serve as the Cabinet level Director of the 

Alabama Emergency Management Agency. During my tenure, the agency responded to 14 disasters 

(8 of these were Presidentially Declared Events). In 2009, Alabama had more Presidentially declared 

disasters than any other state in the Nation, and the agency successfully responded to an average of 

one disaster e;-ery three months during my tenure. In addition to natural disasters, I also helped 

lead Alabama's response during the Deepwater Horizon Oil Spill Event of National Significance, 

and was charged with establishing and maintaining the State's Forward Emergency Operations 

Center and leading Citizen Individual Assistance disaster claims operations. As Director of the 

,\gency, I also served on the Central t'nited States Earthquake Consortium and as a member of the 

National Advisory Council's Robert T. Stafford Act Subcommittee. Finally, I was in charge of 

making sure key state agencies developed Continuity of Operations Plans for pandemic events, and 

managed logistical movement of vaccines to regional distribution sites during the H1N1 Public 

Health Emergency. 

In 2011, I entered the Private Sector as Executive Vice President of Hagerty Consulting, a nationally 

recognized emergency management and homeland security flt111. My private sector experience has 

been im·aluable. Specifically, I was provided an opportunity to roll up my sleeves and work side by 

side with local, state, and federal emergency managers and private organizations across the Nation to 

develop and evaluate concepts and planning solutions for, but not limited to, the following areas: 

Complex attacks, cyber security, Public Health emergencies, evacuations, mass care, Access and 

Functional Needs, special events, school safety, disaster recovery, mission ready packaging, and 

program accreditation. This experience has helped me to witness firsthand the issues challenging 

emergency managers, and exposed ideas for improving our profession from a \Vhole Community 

perspective. 

Conclusion: 

I understand the complexities and expectations involved with serving as FEMA administrator. 

believe that the staff inside FEl\L\ and emergency managers around the countl)' ultimately enter the 

field as a great form of service to their country. Despite the unfortunate and constant criticisms 

emergency managers often face, [ have witnessed them working diligently to collectively strengthen 

national preparedness and resilience while organizing capabilities to ultimately save lives and help 

people in time of their greatest need. If confirmed, l look forward to working closely I hope l'm 

given the chance to lead this extremely dedicated community and improve our field. 

Should I be conftrmed, I commit to being the agency's biggest champion and to work with 

Congress, state, local, and private sector partners to innovatively support our first responders to 

ensure we work together to build, sustain, and improve the Nation's capability to prepare for, 

protect against, respond to, recover from, and mitigate all hazards. Thank you for your 

consideration and I look forward to answering any questions you may have. 
45 

REDACTED 

HSGAC BIOGRAPHICAL QUESTIONS FOR 

EXECUTIVE NOMINEES 

1. Basic Biographical Information 

:Please provide the foUowing information. 

Sln('eBirth o Present 

l 

0 
46 

Never Married Married 

X 

2 
47 

.2. .Education 

List an post-secondary ~cbools attended. 

: <\J'ype ofSebool UateB!tll;!il ·.',Date Ended : 

... School ("oca\ionaVtechnlO!>lltrade school, ·'School--: .· !!li.!Jl · Name.of coll!'!leiuniversitylmiUtoey oollege, · {~ruitlilyear) (mon1)Jiycar) (check · Dwree Awai-de 'School box if es.titt:late) ~ '!!. . ·;,:Y:<,."" co~l'o~~~e/distance./e)tt~~~-io~o (check bo.< if (c~cc~ "'"present"·boX ...... · · · nline sC;hooJ} . : · · estimate) . if Still in scbooll ·.: 

Appalachian University £tt Ellt Present BS S/1997 81!993 511997 State 

U»iversity 

Appalachian Universiiy "" £it ·pr~t MPA 5/l999 

State 811991 5/l999 

U»iversity 

Naval Post Post Graduate School, Center for £n En Pruent Certificate Z/20!0 

Graduate HomeU!nd Defense and Security, 5/1:009 211otn 

Schoo! Executive Leaders Prqgram 

3. Employment 

(A) List all ofyour employment activities, inCiudiug unemployment and self•employment. 

If the employment activity was military duty, list separate employment activity periods to 

show each change of military duty station. Do not list employment before your 18th 

birthday unless to provide a minimum of two years of employment history • 

. :Type or Employment 

WiiiveMilitat)':~uty ~l:i!iion, _ 'Nl\tiP~l Q:~<)Scrve, · 

U~H~ CeJrlmis~i;;meq Corps, 

Clt~l"l'cdcra) ,;n1PlQ)'1ll<;nJ, 

cSta;e_Govo:rn-_t.(Non, 

l:~lEmploY~~>ent); Self·. 

·'el)lpl9yment, Um;riy,IQymen!, 

f..;IIOril.l Contractor, Non- , Govemmo;nt Emp)QY111J'tlt (excJ~d.i(tg self·entpl~Yn·i~~). ·- · 'Other · ' 

Non- Governmental 

Employee 

State Government 

Non-Governmental 

Employee 

Federal Government 

Alabama Emergency 

Management Agency 

Beck Disaster 

Recovery Inc, 

Federal Emergency 

Management 

Agency, ~gion IV 

Director 

Southeast 

Region 

Director 

National 

Hurricane 

Program 

Mana er 

3 

Carolina 

Clanton, 1/2008 212011 est. Alabama 

Hickory, 2/2007 112008 

North 

Carolina 

Ailanta, I/2004 2/2007 

Geofgia 
48 

Fedetal Goverhment Federal Emergency National Atlanta, 11/2001 112004 

Management Hurricane Georgia 

Agency, Region IV Program 

Specialist 

State Government Georgia El!\ergency Statewide Savanna 9/1999 I 112001 

Management Agency Hurricane h, 

Program Georgia 

Manager and 

School Safety 

Coordinator 

City Government City ofAshville Budget and Ashville, 611999 9/1999 

Personnel North 

Intern/Analyst Carolina 

(B) List any advis!lry, consultative, honorary or other part-time service or. positions with 

federal, state, or lOClll governments, not listed elsewhere. 

National Advisory 

Councii/FEMA 

University Corporation 

For Atmospheric 

Research- NOAA: 

NCEP, OPC, TPC 

EvaJuation Panel 

Department of 

Homeland.Securiiy, 

Science and 

Technology Directorate 

Central United States 

Ear!bquake Consortiulll 

IS THIS.A GOV 

AGENCY? 

·Date Set11lee 

·'BS:iin . · (moi!1;bly$) 

',' (cllccklx>x if , ·-- ~ _..._eslim~lt:J:_ 

Response and Recovery Subcommittee 4/1/2011 

Member 

Review :PaneliSt/Evaluator 

First Responder Research Development 

Testing and Evaluation Working Group 

Member 

Board MenJber 

4/2009 

712010 

112008 

4. Potential Conflict of Interest 

Date Service Ended 

(ll1imt)i!yiar) (check lx>~, 

;)f<'S!.im&t~)(ch"!'k ·' 

"pres•!!t" boX if Slill ·" sCrving) ' · ·· · 

4/1/2012 -·--

12/2009 

712011 

1120ll 

{A) Describe any business relationship, dealing or financial transaction which you have. had 

during the last 10 years, whether for yourself, on behalf of a client, or acting as an agent, 

that could in any way constitute or result in a possible eonllict of interest in the position to 

which you have been nominated. 

ln.connection with the nomination process, I have consulted with the Office of 

Government Ethies and the Department of Homeland Security's Designated Agency 

Ethics Official to identify potential ~onflicts ofinterest. Any potential conflic~ of 

4 
49 

interest will be resolved in accordance with the tertns of ;in ethics agreement that I have 

entered into with the Department's Designated Agency Ethics Official and that has been 

provided to this Committee. I am not aware of any other potential conflicts of interest. 

(B) Describe any activity during the past 10 years in which you have engaged for the 

pilrplJSe of directly or indirectly influencing the passage, defeat or modification of any 

legislation or affecting the administration OI' execution of law or public policy, other tii1UI 

while in a federal goverllDlent capacity. 

Norte. 

5. Honors and Awards 

List all scholarships, fellowships, honorary degrees, civilian service citation$, military 

medal.s, academic or professional honors, honorary society membeJ;Ships and any other 

specialrecognition for outstanding service or achievement. 

FEMA Region IV, A wards "For Outst;inding Contributions and Dedication to the Region during 

FY 2002, 2003 & 2004 

Presented a"Key To the City" Heflin,AL for tornado support by the Mayor (2009) 

Inducted into Pi Gamma. Mu, Honor Society, May I 999 (Top 20% of Graduate School Class) 

Appalachian State University 

6. Memberships 

List all memberships that you have held in professional, social, business, fraternal, 

scholarly; civic, or charitable organizations in the last 10 years. 

Unless relevant to your nomination, you do NOT need to include memberships in 

charitable organizations available to the public as a result of a tax deductible donation of 

$1,000 or less, Parent-Teacher Associations or other organizations connected to schools 

attended by your children, athletic clubs or teams, automobile support oJ"ganizations (suCh 

asAAA), discount.s clubs (such asGroupon or Sam's Club), or afimity 

memberships/consumer clubs (such as frequent flyer memberships). 

Name of Ornnlzllti!!!! Datss of Your Membershill Posltlon(s}.!!e!d (You may approximate.) 

First Presbyterian Church, Hickory, Dec 2012 to Present Member 

North C:!rolina 

5 
50 

Lake Hickory Country Club May 2015 (estimated) to Present Member 

Catawba Valley YMCA 9/2012 to 5/20 J $ (estimated) 

Friends Of Hickory 10120.14 toll/2014 (estimated) Board.Member 

Appalachian State University Local 1/2014 to Present (estimated) 

Government Alumni Association 

Catawba Country Club 7/2013 to 2/2015 

Sigma Phi E~;>silon, A~;>palachian Inducted I fl995 

State University 

7. Political Activity 

(A) Have you ever been a candidate for or .been eleeted or appointed to a political office? 

None. 

(B) List any offices held in or services rendered to a politiclll party or election committee 

during the last ten years that you have not listed elsewhere. 

None. 

Name of Partt!Ele<tlon 

··':committee " · · 

··6tfice/Services Rendered , ........ ,;-- ,.,,., .. ., • .. ,,·, .. ·.• ·, 'Responsibilities ., ~ i':· 

(C) Itemize all individual politic;ll contributions of $200 or more that you have made in the 

past five years to any individual, campaign organization, political party, p!llitkal action 

committee1 or similar entity. Please list each individual contributio~t and n!lt the total 

amountcontdbuted to the person or entity during the year. 

None~ 

6 
51 

8. Publications and Speeches 

(A) List the titles, publishers and dates of books, articles> reports or other published 

materials that you have written, including articles pub&hed on the Internet. Please provide 

the Coinntittee with copies of.all listed publications. lit lieu of bard copies, electronic copies 

can be provided via e--mail or other digital format. 

;·,·.:·• ', ., . ·,·, .·· ' . 

·;~ Publisher Date!•l ofPnl!Iicatlon 

Facing the Nation's Largest Active Hagerty Consulting, Inc. March l, 2017 

Disaster: Liquid Asset Poverty 

Repost- The Recovery Timelirie: Hagerty Consulting, Inc. February 2, 2017 

Short. Tenn Decis.ions With Long 

Tenn Effects on Community 

Recovery 

Revisiting Sandy Hook: Three Hagerty Consulting, li!c. December 22,2016 

Considerations for Reunification of 

Schools after an Active Threat 

Event 

Five Practical Recommendations to Hagerty Consulting, Inc. OctOber ll, 2016 

hnpr<Jve Hurricane Evacuation 

Governor's Guide to Mass National. Governors Association November 24, 20!4 

Evacuation 

School Safety EssentialS: LRP Publications November4. 2002 

Perfonning Daily Safety Sweeps 

2002 

Encyclopedia of Terrorism, "School Cbeckmatk Bool<:s September 2003 

Site Analysis" (Contributing ' Author) 

After the Next Sandy Hook GOVERNING Magazine December 13,2016 

(II} List any formal speeches you have deliverc\1 during the last five years and provide the 

Committee with copies of those speeches relevant to the position for which you have been 

nominated. Include any testimony to Congress or any othe1· legislative or administrative 

boP,y. These items can be provided electronically via e--mail or other digital format. 

TitleiTo!!ic Plaee/ Audience ··.·-Da~s} of§l!ecsh 

Alabama Emergency Management Savannah, GA December 5, 2014 

Agency, Chatham County 

Presentation 

~ster of Mass Evacuation" Keynote Speaker artbe National February9, 2012 

Evacuation.Conference 2012, New 

i 0rle8lls, LA 

7 
52 

Evacuation Planning, ''The Disaster 2015 National Homeland Security June II, 2015 

of Mass Evacuation" Conference 

''The Disaster of Mass Evacqation" 2016Amencan PUblic 

TrllllSportation Association (APTA) 

Risk Management Seminar, Albany 

June 2016 

NY 

Keynote Address The Fre(lch High Committee for July 5, 2012 

Civii·Defense, Mass Evacuation 

Planning Meeting, Paris, France 

'"'Rave Presents: Hurricane Rave Mobile SafetyWebinar May29,2014 

Preparedness & The Disaster of 

Mass Evac.uation" 

1) BP Deepwater Horizon Oil Minnesota Deplll'tment of Public February 12 ~ 14,2013 

Spill Safety, Homeland Security and 

2) Mass Evacuations- Emergency Management, 48,. 

Improvements In Evacuaiiqn Annual Governor's Homelancl 

Planning and Sheltering. Security and Emergency 

Capabilitv Management Conference 

"The Disaster of Mass Evacuationn Emergency Preparedness & Hazmat October 29,2014 

Response Conference, Sponsored 

by Southeastern Pennsylvania 

LEPCs, U.S. Depart111ent of 

Homeland Security/Infrastructure 

Protec.tion 

"Transportation Decision Making" The State of Massachusetts July 17, 20!4 

Functional Needs Support Services 

Workshop, New England Regional 

C~atastropbic Preparedness Initiative 

"The Disaster of Mass Evacuation" Rave Mobile Safety, Fiftb Annual May6-·7, 2014 

Whole Community Preparedness 

Summit 

Moderator: Business Emergency 4th National Conference on October 15, 2014 

Operations Centers- Maximizing Building Resilience through PublicCoordination at the State and Local Private Partnerships, U.S. Chamber 

Level of Commerce Association, 

Washington DC 

(C) List all speeches and testimony you have delivered in the past ten year~ except for 

those the text of which yon are providing to the Committee. 

:,. ~ ;Title .. '· .. 

' · ; Place/Audience '.•. ;uat!l(s} of Sl!eecb 

"Building a Stronger Rliode Island: Keynote Speaker at the Rhode May 31,2011 Hll1Ti¢ane Lessons Learned & Best Island Emergency Management Practices~· Agency 2011 Hurricane Conference 

"Ensuring Strong FEMA Regional 111"' Congress, Hearing before the March 16, 2010 

Offices: An Examination of House Committee on Homeland 

Resources and Responsibilities" Seeurity, Subcoinmittee on 

Emergency Communications, 

Preoaredoess. and Response 

8 
53 

9. CriminalHistory 

Since (and jncluding) your 181

b birthday, has any of the following happened:? 

Have you been issued a summons, citation; or ticket to appear in court in a criminal proceeding against you? 

(Exclude cilatiol)S involving traffic infracJions where 1l1e fine was .less than $300 and did not include alcohol or 

drugs.) 

No. 

Have you be~ arrested by any police officer, sheriff, marshal or any other type of law enforcement official? 

No. 

Have you been charged, coqvicted, 6r sentenced ofa crime in any court? 

No. 

If ave you been or are you currently on probation or parole? 

No. 

Are you currently on trial or awaiting a triili on criminal charges? 

No. 

• To your knowledge, have you ev(!r been the· subject or target oh federal, state or local criminal investigation? 

No. 

If the answer to any of the questions above is yes, please answer the qnestions below for 

ea~h criminal event (citation, l}rrest, investigation, etc:) •. If the event was an investigation, 

where the question below asks for information about .the offense,. please offer information 

about the offense under investigation (if known). · · 

N/A 

A) Date of offense: 

a. Is rbi.s an estimate (Yes/No): 

B) Description of the specific nature ofthe offense: 

C) Did the offense involve any ofrb~ following? 

1) J)omestic·violence or a. crime of violence (such as battery or assault) against your child; dependent, 

cohabiian!, spouse, fonner spouse, or someone with whom Y<lli share a child in common: Yes I No 

2) Firearmsorexplosives: Yes/.No · 

3} Alcohol. or drugs; Yes /No 

D) Location where tbe.offense occurred (city, county, state, zip code, country): 

9 
54 

E) Were yo)larrested, summ<:med, ciled or did you receive a ticketto appear as a result of this offense by any police officer, sheriff, marshal or any other type of Jaw enforcement official: Y~s I No 

1) Name of the law enforcement agency that arrested/cited/summoned you: 

2) Location of the law enforcement agency (city,, county, state, zip code, country): 

F) As a result of this offense were you charged, convicted, currently awaiting trial, and/or ordered to appearin 

· court in a criminal proceeding against you: Yes I No 

l) Ifycs, provide llte name of the coUrt and the location of the court (dty, county, state, zip code, 

country): 

2) If yes; provide all the .charges brought against you (or this offense, and the outcome Of each charged offetise(such as fotind gl!ilty; found not~guilty, charge dropped or "nolle pi:os," etc). If you were found guilty ofor.pleaded guilty to a Jesser offense, list separately both the original charge andthe lesser 

offense: 

3) If no, provide explanation: 

G) Were you sentenced as. a result of this offense: Yes I No 

H) Provide a description Of the sentence: 

I) Were you sentenced to i:rnprisonmentfor a term exceeding one year: Yes I No 

J) Were you incarcerated as a result of that sentence for not less than one year: Yes fNo 

K) lf the conviction resulted in imprisonmen~ provide the dates that you actually were incarcerated; 

L) lf convi.::tion resulted in probation 91' parole, provide the dates of probation or parole: 

M) Are yeu currently on trial; awaiting~ tria~ or awaiting sentencing on criminal charges for drls offense: Yes I No 

N) Provide explanation: 

10. Civil Litigation and Administrative or Legislative Proceedings 

(A)Since (and including) your 18th birthday, have you been a party to any public record 

civil court action or administrative or legislative proceeding of any kind that resulted in (1) 

a finding of wrongdoing against you, or (2) a settlement agreement for you, or some other 

person or entity, to make a payment to settle allegations against you, or for you to take, or refrain from taking, some action. Do NOT indude small claims proceedings. 

10 
55 

No. 

(B)In addition to those listed above, have you or any business of which you were an .officer, 

director or owner ever been involve.d a~ a party of interest in ·any administrative agency 

proceeding or civil litigation? Please identify and provide details for any proceedings or 

civil litigation that involve actions taken or omitted by you, or alleged to have been taken or 

omitted by you, while serving in y!lur official capacity. 

No. 

(C) For re$p(}nses to the previous question, please Identify and provide details for any 

proceedings or clv!l litigation that Involve aetlons taken or omitted by you, or alleged, to 

have been. take~,t or omitted by you, whUe serving in your official capacity. 

N/A 

H. Breach of Professional Ethics 

(A) Have you ever been disciplined or cited for a breach of etbics or .unprofessional conduct 

by, or been the subject of a complaint to1 any coUrt, administrative agency, professional 

association,. disciplinary committee, or other professional group? Exclude cases an<! 

proceedings already listed. 

No. 

(B) Have you ever been fired. from a job, quit a job after being told you would be fired, left 

a job by mutual agreement [ollowing dlarges or allegations of misconduct, left a job by 

mutual agreement following nQtice of unsatisfactory performance; .or received a written 

warning, been ofliCially reprimanded,. suspended, or disciplined for miseondact in the 

workplace; such as violation ofa.security policy? 

No. 

12. Tax Compliance 

(This information will not be published. in the record of the bearing on your nomination~ 

but it will be retained. in the Committee's. files and will be available for public inspection.) 

REDACTED 
56 

REDACTED 

13. Lobbying 

Ill the past te~ years, have you registered as a lobbyist? If so, please indicate the state, 

federal, or local bodies with whi.ch you llave registered (e.g., House, Senate, California 

Secretary of State). 

No. 

14. Outside Positions 

X See OGE Fonn 278. (If, for your nomination, you have completed an OGE Fonn 278 

Executive Branch Personnel Public Financial Disclosure Report, you may check the box here to 

complete this section and then proceed to the next section.) 

For the preceding ten calendar years and the current calendar year, report any positions 

held, whether compensated or not. Positions Include but are uot limited to those of an 

officer, director, trustee; general partner, proprietor, representative, employee, or 

consultant of any corporation, firm, partnership, or other business entet'prise or any non· 

profit organization or educational institution. Exclude positions with religious, social, 

fraternal, or political entities and those solely of an honorary nature; 

fosition Held :'Fram .. ,,, ·· ·(~o.~~~ar) ;···~ . '·~ c:: :, ; ' ' '.'·;·_.,_ ... 

15, Agreements or Arrangements 

,;-,,, ., ,_ .• _._ ·>::.:-... '· 

X See OGE Fonn 278 .. (If, for your nomination, you have completed an OGE Fonn 278 

Executive Branch Personnel Public Financial Disclosure Report; you may check the box here to 

complete. this section and then proceed to the next section.) 
57 

As ofthe date of mlng your OGE Form 278, report your agreements or arrangements for: 

(1) continuing participation in.an employee benefit plan(e.g. penslon, 40lk, deferred 

compensation); (2) continuation of payment by a former employer (inclllding severance 

payments); (3) leaves of absence; and (4} future employment. 

Provide Information regarding any agreements or arrangements you have con~erning (1) 

future. employment; (2) a.leaveofabsence during your period of Gnvernment service; (3) 

c<mtinuation of payments by a former e!Dployer other than the United States Government; 

and ( 4) continuing participation in an employee welfare or benefit plan. maintained by a 

former employer other thim Unite<l States Government retirement benefits. 

\'~tatus and Terms ofAny , 

. ;~t~eet.or Aiil?!~~~m~ ~::_ 

16. Additional Financial Data 

All information requested under this heading must be. provided for yl)urself, your spouse, 

and your dependents, (This information will not be published in the record of.the hearing 

on your nomination, but it will be retained in the Committee's files and will be available for 

public inspection.) 

REDACTED 
REDACTED 

SIGNATURE ANDDA'fE 

I hereby state that I have read the foregoing Statement on Biographical and Financial Information and that the info

provided therein is, to the best of my knowledge, current, accurate, and complete. 

~ ,------ - - ~ ······--···· . ·-

This 

6LO~ day of M~..r ' 2011 

21 
59 

UNITED STATES OFFICE OF 

GOVERNMENT ETHICS *·---

The Honorable Ron Johnson 

Chailman 

Committee on Homeland Seeurity 

and Governmental Affairs 

United States Senate 

Washington, DC 20510 

Dear Mr. Chairman: 

REDACTED 

May 19,2017 

In accordance with the Ethics in Government Act of 1978, ! enclose a copy of the 

Gnancial disclosure report tiled by William B. Long, who has been nominated by 

President Trump for the positi()n 9f Administrator, Federal Emergency Management Agency. 

Depattment of Homeland Security. 

We have reviewed the report and have obtained advice fi·om the agency concerning any 

possible conflict in light of its functions and the nominee's proposed duties. Also enclosed is an 

ethics a&'l"eement outlining the actions that the nomin.ee will undertake to avoid conflicts of 

interest Unless a date for compliance is indicated in tl1e ethics agreement. the nominee must 

fully comply within three months of confinnarion with any action specitied in the ethics 

agreernetit 

Based thereon, we bel"ieve that this nomine.e is in compliance with applicable laws and 

regulations governing conflicts of interest. 

Enclosures REDACTED 

Sincerely, 

WALTER 

SHAUB 

Walter M. Shaub, Jr. 

Director 

--------·-·----~------

1201 NEW YORK AVENW·SUl'fESOQ·WASH!NGTON DC·20005 
60 

ATTACHMENT A 

I. Atlanta Urban Area Security Initiative 

2. Chatham County Emergency Management Agency 

3. Chelsea, MA Public School.s 

4. Cook County Department of Homeland Security and Emergency Management 

5. Center for Transportation and the Environment 

6. City orFort Worth, TXOffice of Emergency Management 

7. Georgia DeJ»ll'tlnent ofNatur11l Resources 

8. Lee County, FL Emergency Management Agency 

9. Long Beach, CA Department of Health and Human Services 

10. Houston, TXMETRO 

11. New England Catastrophic Planning Initiative 

12. Prince William County; VAEmergency Management Agency 

13. Rhode.lsland Emergency Management Agency 

14. San Diego County, CA Emergency Management Agency 

15. Santa Barbara County, CA Emergency Management A,gency 

16. Tarrant County, TX Public H~lth Department 

17~ City of Danville, VA City Manager's Office 

18. Brantley County, GA County Manager's Office 

19. Horry County, SC County Manager's Office 

20. NYC Office of Emergency Management 

21. Brunswick/Glynn County, OAWater and. Sewer Commission 

22. Rhode Island Department of Environmenta1 Management 
61 

Joseph Maher 

DesigJiated Agency Ethics Official 

Departnient of Homeland Security 

Washington, D:C. 2052$-0485 

DcafMr. Maher:. 

April24. 2017 

The purpose ofthis letter is to des<;rjbe the steps that l will take to avoid any actual.or 

apparent conflict of interest in the event that! am confinncd for the positioii of Administrator oft.he 

Federai.Emergency Managem<elit Agen,;y. 

As required by 18 U.S. C. § 208(a), r will not participate personally and substantially in any 

particular matter in which l know that 1 have aJinancia! interest dii-ectly .and predictably affected by 

the matter. or in wl1ich I know that a persoil whose interests are imputed ·to me has a financial 

interest directly and predictably affected by the matter. unless I fi1~st obtain a wriuen waiver, 

pursuant to 18 U.S,C. § 208(b)( l ), or qualify for a regulatory exemption, pl)rsuant to 18 U.S.C. § 

208(b)(2). l understand that the interests of the following: persons are imputed to me; any spouse or 

minor child of mine; any generaf partner of a partnership in which I am a limited or general partner; 

any organization in which l ~erve as oflicer, director, tmstee, ge1ieral partner or employee; and any 

person or ot·gaiJization with which I am negotiating or have an arrang<!ment concerning prospective 

enip!oyment. 

Upon confirmation, I will resign from lily position with Hagerty Consulting, li1c. If Hagcny 

Consu.ltil\g, Inc. decides to pay.me a bonus for work r performed during 2017, i will not accept the 

bonus and will forfeit it, unless I receive the bcJms before I <)ssumc the dl)ties of the_ position of 

Admii1istt'ator. Tfi receive the bonus. I will not participate personally and Substantially in any 

particular matter inyotving sp<-dfic parties in which l know Hagerty Consulting. fnc. is a party or 

represents a party for a Jieriod of two year~ from the date on which l receive the bonus, tin less I first 

receive a written waiver pursliantto 5 CF.R. § 2635.503(c). If! do not receive the bonus, Twill. not 

participate personally and substantially in any particulannattel' involvingspe<;ific parties in 1vhich l 

know the Hag!!rty Consulting, Inc., is a 'party pr represents a party for a pel'iod of one year from the 

date of my resignation,. unless tan\ first authorized to participate, rursuant. to 5 C.F.R. § 

'Z635.502(d) .. ln.addition, l \Vi!! 1iot participate personally and substantially in any particular mnne_t· 

involving speCific parties in which l k1iow a formet.clicntofminc is a party or represents a party, for 

a period of one year after !last provided service to that 'Client, unless I am first amhorized to 

partiCipate, pursuant to 5 C: F;R .§ 2635.502(dl. 

I will have a "qovered relationship" Li!ider 5 C.F.R. § 2635.502 with the state and municipal 

qntitics that were my clie11ts \vhil.c l was eniployed at Hagerty Consulting. Inc. Sec AttachmcntA. 1 

will have a c<ivered i-c!!ationship with each entity for a pe1'iod ofone year aftet· r last provided service 
62 

to that entity. PurSuant to 5 C.P.R. § 263S.S02(d), I will seek writtt)n authorization to participate in 

particul~r matters involving specific parties in which any of these entities is a party or represents a 

party. 

My spouse .is employedbyViewmont Pharmacy iria posiiion for which she, receives a fixed annual 

salill)'. For as .long as my spouse continues to work for Vicwmont Pharmacy, I wm not Participate 

p~rsonal!y and substantially in anyparticular,mattcrinvolving specific parties in which I know 

Viewmont Pharmacy is a party or represents a party, unl~ I am first \luthorized to partiCipate, 

pursuant to 5 C.F.R. § 2635502(d). 

Within 90 days of confirmation, I wi)l divest my interests Merck &. Co., Inc., Pfizer Inc., and 

AbbVie Inc. With regard to each of these entities, I will not participate personally and substarttiaUy 

in any particular matter that to my knowledge has a direct and predictable effect on rhe financial 

interests of t{ie entity until I have divested it; unle5s l finit obtain a written waiver, pursuant to 

l'i!U.S.C •. §208(b )(1 ), or qualify for a regulatory exemption, pursuant to 18 U.S,C. § 20S(h)(2). 

I understand that I may be eligible to request a C!;lrtificate of Divestiture for qualifying assets 

and tha,t a Certificate.of Divestiture is .effective only if obtained prior to divestiture. Regardless nf 

whether{ receive a Certificate of Divestiture; I will ensUre that all divestitures discussed in this 

agreement occur within the agreed upon timeframes and that aU proceeds are invested in non" 

conflicting assets. 

If I rely on a de minilni.s exemption under 5 C.F.R. § 2640.202 with regard to any of my 

financial interestsin securities, I will monitor the value of those interests. If the aggregate value of 

intel'ests affected by a particular matter increases and exceeds the de.mir(imis tlmoshold,l will not 

participate personally and :;ubstantially in the particular matter that.to my knowledge has a direct and 

predictable effect on the interests, unless I first obtain .. a written waiver pursuanfto Ul U$.C. 

§ 208(b)(l). 

lfl have a managed account or otheJ;Wis~ use the s~rvices of an invesl:tnent professional 

during my appointment, I will ensure that the account manager or investment professional obtains 

my prior approval on a case-by~casc basis for the purchase of any assets other than cash, cash 

eqUiV<!Ients, investment fuilds that qualify forthe exemption ;It 5 C.F.R. §. 2640.20 l (a),.or 

obligations of the United States. 

r will meet in person with you \luring tht: first week. of my service ih the position of 

Administrator in order to complete the initial ethics briefing reqUired under S C.P.R. § 2638.305~ 

Within 90 days of my confirmation, I will also document my compliance with this ethics agreement 

by notifying you in writing when I have completed tlie steps described in this ethics agreement. 

I und.erstand thllt as an appointee I will be required to sign the Ethics Pledge {Exec. Order no. 

13770) attd that I will be bound by the requirements and restrictions therein in addition to the. 

collltllitments I have made in this ethics agreement 

2 
63 

I have been .advised that. this. ethics agreement will be posted publicly. consistent with 

5 U.S.C. § 552, oil thewehsiteofthe u;s. Office ofGovetnmentEthics with ethics agreements of 

other Presidential nominees who file public financial disclosure reports~ 

Sincerely, 

William 

~ B. Long 

3 
64 

U.S. Senate Committee on Homeland Security and Governmental Affairs 

Pre-hearing Questionnaire 

For the nomination of Brock Long to be 

Administrator, Federal Emergency Managcmt•nt Ag('ncy, 

Dcparuuent of Homeland Security 

1. Did tlu: President or the Secretary of tht• Departmcllt of H(mwl:wd Security (DHS) gin• 

you sp<'dfic reasons wby you wt•re nomi11ated to be the uc.~t AdministrMoroftht• 

Federal EmcrgellCJ' Maw•gemem Agellcy (FBll-fA), :md, if so, what wen• thL:v? 

l)uring rht: inn:n·lcw process for tn~· nntninarion tu this position v:ith ~t~cretary Kdly 1 he \Vas 

clearly intcrestt·d in my knowledge, t·xpencnc(:, and abilitit> to lead he for,·, during, and ;1fter 

di-:-;astcr:-., I bdic-n.~ tny proven track record experience in both the and pr.ivate sector, 

coupkd \Vith strong l(:aJcrship in times of t:ri;.;.is \Y<·r~;.: the pritnar:· in fnY non1uutio1l t() 

the position of FE.\L\ .\dmini,.trator. 

2. lf1crc ;my conditions, express or implie4 :Uhlehcd to your nomination? If so, ple;;sc 

cxpl:dn. 

No . 

. \ Hm·c you nwdc ;my commitmt'IUS with respect to the policit•s ;;nd principles you will 

mtcmpt to implement ;~s AdmiiJistrutor? If so, wluu are they :u!(/ to nlwm !un·e t!Jc 

comn1itnWllts been m;~dc? 

4. Are you :m·arc of ;my business rd<ItioJJship, de«ling, or financial tr:WS<Jction tlwt could 

result iu a possible conflict ofiute·rest for you or the appearance of a collfliet of'illtcrest? 

If so, plct~se explaill wht~t procedures you w:illvse to recuse yourself or otherwise 

t~ddress the couDkt. Aud il)·cm will recuse yourself, explainlwwyou will ensure your 

respon~ibilities are not t<flt:ctcd by your rt'clJsaL 

l have eonsultc>d with th<: ( lfike of Co,·crnmcnt l ethics and The Department of I fnmdand 

Securir) Desi)..'l1atcd .\gene) Fthic;; Official to idcntif:· am and all pot<.>nrial cont1icts oi interest. 

~\ny potcntJal conHict<:> of intl"n.:st \ViH be reso1Yt'd in accordance wirh the t(~nns of an ethics 

agrc·emc!lt that l haw cntcrcd uno with rhc DH:; Designated. \gene\' Fthic> Official. Uut,idc 

<If J ht· items provH.led in rhi:-. agn.;erw.:nt, 1 atn not <!Ware nf an;: !Hlditinn:d conHlct of intcrc~t(.;;). 

What specific backt,>t-oumf, experience, ;md flrtributes qw1Jifv you to be Admini>tmtor of 

FEMA? 

i :an1 pro\·t•n leader wi1 h ntcnrl;. nvo d~'CJH.:1c"- of scn·lct' helping conH11ttnit1e~ and organizMion~ 
65 

prepare for, respond ro. and rt·coycr frntn dt.;;astcrs, and tnirigafe future d1~asrer dmnagt>. Since 

beginning zny career in 1 99~J~ 1 have held pusitions qf inrreasing rc-spon::..ihility in both public 

JrH1 pri-vate sector erncrgcnc~· tnanagetncnt organi7.arions, proudl~· sernng a~ an cn1t:rgt·ncy 

management proic·s,inmll ar both the state and federal kvck 

Throughout mv career-. I han success full\· and crhicallc exccutt:d tlw authontics associated with 

each leadership position, including but not litnitcd to, sen·ing as <1 < ;o\Trnor~s ,\uthonzed 

Rt:prcscowtive, Jncitknt Commander, and/ or State Coordinating ( )fficu fm 14 disastt:". My 

experience includes managing both Robert T Stafford ,\ct and non-Staft(>td \ct disastcts of 

national ~ignificance. 

li. PlcHsc describe: 

,,_ Your le<~dersbip ;mel 1wumgcment style. 

I bdiev·c in upholding ;t !ugh ctbkal ;;t.mdard and surrounding m1·sdf with :;trnng, 

capable~ and principh:d a(ki.snrs who are not afrald to chaHt•ngc tny :~~s1m1ptlons or 

those of the .. \gency. l believe it is imperativ·e to build rdarion<hips with cinzcnc; and 

leaders at all levels of gmcrnmcnt, and if umtinncd, I will continue the work of the 

\gl'ncy in this space. 

~~. Your experie11ce rnanagin,g ptfrsOntlcl. 

Throughnut 111~· c1reer~ 111y lnanagem<..·tH t'cspon~ibilltics progrc~:-;iH.'Iy incn:a~ed. _\s ;,~ 

!T.\L\ Hurricane Program .\tanager, l supcrdscd and mallltaincd twP opcorational 

:;,upport tc:-un:.:; and tn:tnaged pr1·*jccr tc;)rn~ chnrgeJ \\:ith l'XCcutlng Hurnc;U1t.' J·:\",1CU:ltHm 

Studies and Post Stonn \sH·ssn1cnrs. The brgcst tcan1 J tnanaged \\as 1hc 1 hHTIC:HH.' 

Liaison Team, which forward deplu:-ctl to the \:,uional Hurricane Cemer an: time a 

ttnpical '·'·stem rhr<·mencd rhc \:arion . 

. \s the Director of rbc .\Iab,tma Fmergcnn \lanagcmcnt ~ \gcncy (:\L\L\), l managed 

all t.by-tt..J-day opcr<lfions, pro~r:lln staff. grant prognuns, and dis;P.::tct n_·...;ponse/n-co\·cr: 

tnis:-.ion activitl(~S for the .\gene~·· ln this role, I ah:o S(".lTCd as an JncH .. k·tu c(lt11t11~H1li<:r 

in charge of coordinating HI1 ..;tate hurnan capiral :-l~S<:'ts to support lucal tespnn~e efforts. 

:\s fhc ExGcutire Vice President of I Iagcrty Consulting, a tlarintbd cn1crgl'ncy 

nlaH~lg:ctnt.:nt finn, f pronde :--tratl'gic dirtction and leadership to the finn's full 

complenH·nr of pro.e;ran1::: and proft:·s--ionab. 

lf'7wt is the larg-est number of'pcoplc that /J;u·c worked under you? 

,\, tlw l·:xecutin: \'ic<: l'n·,,,Jcnt of l!:Jgl'l't\, I han' proYidcd leadership direction to ISO 

fuH t1n1c and part t1JTH: staff in rc~pons<.,' to client ~tandby reo ;\~tTy Cllntracrs< Jn aJJnion 

rp ilCtin: :::.taff, I also nlan~1pt.' independent consultant cadrl'. \'l.:hKh n )n"i:'ts of 

-..cn.~ral hundred su!ff who (In: on fur Jcployn1cnt a:' nt:cdcJ . 

. \s Dirc·crut of .\F:'IL\, l m:l!hlgc·d JO(l full-rime emplo\'ccs. During the State's rcspnnsc 

tn the Deepwater fJ.,twon tncidcm, I s<:rn:J '"the State Incident Commander m·cr the 

2 
66 

1··orw:trd Lrncrgcncy ()pcraticH1~ <:enter that wsts ch:ugcd \\·irh cnordmating hundr<:th.: of 

~taff n1emher:; representing ntHnt·rou~ :-.tate •tgcncit:s and vnlunret"r;:>. 

PleHse describe your experience working in federiif Ilnd/or SUite emergency 

nlafl:tgetnent. 

In 19'19, I was initiallr hired l>y the G<:nrgia Emergency :\lanagemcm \gc·ncy ((;E:\L\) 

to help dcO'ign <111 innoYatiH and comprehensive 'chooi and univc·"ity safety program. 

\V~ls ptornotcd to th<..~ po~ition of :\rea ~chool"Safet~· Coordinator ~nd I Jurricanc 

Progmm ,\lanage-r. During nw tenure with CE\L \. l supported one of the "arion's 

largest n1ass evacnanon and n1:1~~ care C\ ('DIS ;.tS :l result of I lurricanC' HoytL 

1 inrerviewcd \\'ith FE.\1.\ on the moming of the 9/11 terrorist ;Ht;!Ck. 1 was hired as a 

Region f\r Hurricane Pn)gr:1n1 ;:-::pccialt"t, :1nd tjulckly tt1 Hurricane Pn)gr<ltll 

.\lanagcr. In this capacity, l led FE\J.\'s I lurricane Team, helped doign the 

!·eden\] Highwa\· .-\dminisrr:uion's Fvacuarion Liaison Team. charged with monitoring 

rnulti-statc e\·::tcuation issue"'. led c\ acw1t1ul1 training cbs:sr:s at th<' '-':ulonal Hurricane 

Center for local cn:1stal en1t:r~cncy tn:Hlilger:;, :1nd rn.an::~gtd both 1 Iurricane I ·~\"i!nlation 

Study and Pos1 I)i:-;..astcr :\~st•:-snwnt prnjcct efforts. 

In 2il0il, I was hired to"'"'" as the Director of ~\E\1-\, where J m:111agcd the ''blue ski 

day~~ opci'~Itjon", prof:;ran1s, :u1d grants ;:h authori7cd for the State. I :d:-o seiTl'd as the 

Governor Riley's .\utborizcd Reprc'<·ntativc. State Incident Commander, and/or State 

Ct'lnrdinaring ()fficcr fnr 14 di:-\rhters. 'f\yo of these disaster~ t\'('rc non, :-:.tafftn·d ,\cr 

event> of national >it,'llitlcancc: tlw [ 11 :-.;I outbreak and the Dc~pwater I [nriloll oi.l >pill . 

. \s the Fxccurin: \'ice l'n·sidem of l !agcnr Consulting, l han been'" :l subicct matter 

expert or Project I ·:xccuun· helping states. I· 1 c:--1.\. and numerous local W''·crnmcn<.s 

with de~igning and executjng L'rnergency manag:enH.:nt project:,~ pbns. t·.xercises, tmining 

das><:s. and conc<cpts rhm inn>lvc all h"zards. 

a. How have you succcssftJI~v nwrwged :md responded to large-.~c;lle dis:~$tcr.> 

during your C;Ireer? 

While I have had a meaningful role in numerous disasters throughout tnY career, the 

followmg cxan1plcs highhght :"orne of tny n1osr 1ncn1orahk experiences: 

I .\s FE\1.\"s Region IV Hurricane Program :-.Ianager, I successfulh led the ~\gcnn\ 

l furricanc I .laisnn T('an1 during rht· 200-t hurricane st.·nsun when the :.:arJon 

su~tained fuur tnajnr (C:atl'gory ,) or higher) hurriclne in1pacts in a :-;i:-;_"wt:ek r(•fiod. 

ln 20(18, as Dirc-crnr of.\ E'.L\ ! kd tbc State's effort tn nacuate cittl<:m from the 

\labama coast during f lurricanc ( ;nstav while simultanc.,mh' hosting and 

repatn:tttng appwximatdr l.'\,0110 "'·acuccs !rom rhe "c" ( lrleans. Th!S was one nf 

.\bban1a's hugest hun1aniL.-trian mas~ care tnlssion:-.. and the Srarc opt.·nltl'd o-.::t.~r ...,\) 

shdters for displacc·d residents. 

h Di.n:cror of .\1 ),f.\, l st'!'\Td '"a Statc lncidtcnt Comm:mdn in charg<: nfCi1izcn 

Claim Outreach Tcan" and the State's !-'om·;ud Emcrgcnc1· ( lpc·rations Center 

3 
67 

(wirhm the l 'nificd Incident Command) in rcsp<)nsc to the BP Deepwater Horizon 

oil spilL 

k_ Holl' bus serving as Director of the Al:tbumu Emergency }W:m:tgement Agency prcpured 

you to serve :;s FEiHA Administnaor? 

:\s Drrcctor of :\l :_\l:\, l wot'ked closclv with ()"i county agencies and helped to orp,:mizc 

-approaches to achic\T their ptcpan:.dness~ response, recovery, and n1itig~1tion goab, Thi~ 

t:xpcricncc allowed me to lcam bow to cffccti,·ch- coordin:Hc state aS'cts down to the local 

incident command lcYd, and tlw importance· of propcrh" calling npon and utilizing the support 

prnYided b,- FF.\L\, the Department of Homcbnd SecuritY, and other l -_s_ Federal :\gcncics, 

This po~trlnn cxrJo:-ed n1c to all t~1ctt~ of etncrgtncy tlhtnagt:ment u1cludlng, but not lirrlit(·d to: 

public health ~:tnergencles, strat(·gic natinn:tl ~rockpik~ n1as-!' tTacuation and mr1ss care~ 

functi<H1i\] and access need$. Cl~isi.s conltllunjcarions. di::::.a~ter C(>:-lt n;-~.::r)\·cry t11anagcn1cnt, 

arbitration ;md appeals, pr<·~ and po,t· disaster mitigation pro!,'"'"'"· the importance of 

Yoluntt:er/non~go\Tn1n1ciH~ll org-anizations~ and all a~pccts of terrori':'l11 .. \Jditionally~ it taught 

rnt ho\\ to implement sp:1!1 of control and effecuvclv utilize a nmlridisciplinc workforct- tn :t 

tnanner ro prntect EYes and property. 

9. 117hy do you ni.~h to scrre a8 _FEMA Admim:>trator? 

Sitnply ~ratt:J, l am p:assinl't.are :1hour setTing n1y nntnrr:. ;:lnd doing whM 1 can to rran..:;fonn ~lnd 

the ficJd of emt.:rgcncy rnanagen1cnr in~~ rn;1nncr rhat nltinl~Hdy ~JH'S liYt-..> ·.:md 

helps citizens 111 rin1c~ of d~c1r greatc~t need. I bditTC rtu~ w~al can be achtcvL:d by 

commuing much of the work H-::\L\ i:: already undertaking, wl11k also incrcasmg our 

cngagcmut1 and partnership with local, tribal. state, and fedcrnlleadc·t·s who li\'e in, and know 

best rhc nct:J~ of tht·ir in1pacn.:d con~ununitic~. 

10. fflhat do you considu to be the mission of FE1HA? H'1Jat do _vou set' "s FE,\ fA's 

pritrcipal ,9trcngths and wc:;.k11csses in its ability to "ccomplish tllilt mission? 

In addition to the stated Post~ Katrina Emergency ;\bnagcmcnr Reform .\ct (1>KE:XIR.\) of 

200(; .'\gcncy tni:)sion, I bdicn: FL;\L\~s role is to unify local. trib:ll, ~late, federal. non 

goV{'fHtnt.·ntal, and prinuc st~ctor efforts to prtparc for, pren.':rlt~ rnitigatc, re~pond tn, <tnd 

recoYcr from disaster>. I bclici'C FE.\L \ has a dut1 to hdp idcntif\ and soln· nanonwidc 

pn:pareJnes~ and rc-spon~c :a~ well <lS to :'.CITe as an ennbkr fur St<-ttc, tribal. ::1nd local 

partn(T:' tn ~lchitv<.· their goal;.:. Heros-.: ;lll ph a~(.'~ of erncrgcncy rn::magcrncnt. 

11, IV7utt do you anticipate I<111 be your role 'md responsibilities as FE~!A Adznillistr:uorP 

In addition to being r~adr to execute all authorities as established b: the Robert T. Stafford .\ct. 

PKL'-!R_\, the :-;andy Recovery lmprm·cnwnt :\ct (SRI\ l of ::'UJ.l, ;ltld Fl -:;\L\ ·,other ctl:lhling 

authuritlt's, if confirmed, I hdie\e 111_\ role will be to aLkance tht.• \gene(-.. mis~ion ;1nd In 

con nnw: tn 1.:nahlc 5tate. rriba1 and loc::1l p:trrncrs. whik building true <.:uhurc of pn.:pan .. 'dne:--:~ 

\\·!thin our ~:1tion '.;, con1n1unitie..;. 

4 
68 

1 n addition rn cnstmng that the :\gcncy is ready In rt'spond to all\' disaster, l hdieYc the roll- of 

the Adrninistrator i~ to set the vision, goals, and tone ('ach yeai for how rhe Agency will idcntlfj 

and tackle internal and external issue" relating to all cydes of emergency managcnwnt. ;\loot 

importantlY, the :\dministnltot must build and maintain solid rdationships with Federal leaders 

included within the ~a tiona] Response Plan Framework and make sure that each agency fully 

understand;; its role and is readY to cxcwtc iL I'F:'\1:\ is strongest when it maintaim cffectiw 

partnerships m nlllcvch of gov~,rnmcm and comisrcmh: seeks feedback from state, tribal and 

local partners as wdL lf confirmed, my primary wk is to build, nwintain, and fost<·r m:twork 

of key partnerships that prepare the nation to resp< >tld to and n•<,'over frnrn disasters, 

12. What do you :mticip:w.· •rill be your greate.<t challenge.<"-' FEJHA Admini.<trator, :md 

what do you expect will be your top pn'oritiesP What do you hope to accompli~h during 

your tenurcP 

1 f contirmed. l look f<,nYard to receiving detailed programmatic 

manner th,,n allows me to fully underst:md the greatest ch:1llengcs and 

current~\-, 

from l'C\I:\ staff in a 

Ercing the ,\genn 

.\sa consul rant in the field supporting primanlv stall' and local diems, I bdin-c l h:l\·e my 

fingers on the pube of the fidd of en1crgencv i11.<Ulagen1t:nt. .\san outsider loo.king into the 

.\g~nC\", I initially bdicn· that the grear<·~'r cl;,qllenge; facing FFi\1:\ are, bu! not lin;ited to: 

I. Re:mthnrizin,e: thl' 1\:Hional Flnnd lnsut'i\nc~ l'mgram (?'FIP) in :1 manner that provides a 

sound financtal fmmcwmk, nffers >pace fc>r priYatc market gtO\\'th, and continues the 

imponant work of mitigating risk, 

2. Rising Jii'a~tcr cn~ts :1r1d a lack of consi~tcnc~ in custotr1er :-:1..·n·icc when executing tCCf'l\'t'ry 

1)n,g-rmns. 

3, Quickly and cff<'ctivdy supporting our >tilfc, tribat and local partners when tcsponding \<1 

tbc increasing risk of )ow ro no-noucc tn~~n-tnadc :tnd technologi-cJI C\·erus. 

4. ()ather a fresh per..;pt:Ttln: on ho\V to best projec:l a t1·ue cuhure of preparedrH.>:'.:-; 

nation-..vldt". 

5. Lffcctiveh recruiting, rc·tnining, and utilizing FE\l ·\ 's workforce 

Civcn the scope of l'E~L\'s mission, 1 expect other m:-ty be identiftcd br 

Congressional and othet srakehnldcrs, . \ mong the principles l would bring to addressing the 

challenges I've lioted as wdl as those I will come to understand if confirmed: reducing 

cnn1pldxity of Ff-:::\L\ progran1s and orit:nting thcrn tO\V<Ud n1ecring custcnncr necds;,pushing 

authorlt~· and capabillry ~.:xt•t:ute the tni:.:sio-n out uf\\'a~hJngtnn. f}C., and do-;:cr to our state, 

tribal itnd lncal partners: and ~eeking efficiency, effl:crin:ncss, and accountabilir~ across our 

prognuns ttl rnaxin1izl' FI·:~vL\'s ayailablc n:~ourccs. 

i} H:1s the President or the Sccrcwry of DHS discussed his priorities for PH!I1A with _vou? 

If so, wbilt n-crc the}'? 

~o. but it h:IS been made· nrr cieat to me that the' Department of Hnmeland 

t1s a cohc-..:;i\'c unit to prnrcct :\tnt:rican~ anJ l bdic~:c that J;E:\L\ hf1~ <1 n .. Tr 

wHhin the Dcpamnent to :1chien' that goaL , 

5 
69 

IV. Policy Questions 

14. How do I'Oll t·iew the role of the federal government in funding the re.9ponse :md longterm rec~vety to major st:lte :md loc.71 disasu•rs, and what st<ps would you wke to 

decrease the federal g01·ernment's fuwre fiscal exposure to disasters :md extreme 

weather? 

I bdit•\'C the J·cdcral (;un:mmcnt should bring rcsourc<cs and capabilities in response w 

disa:::.tt~rs that statcs/rribes do not h~nT M tl1l'it dbposaL HowcYer, the co~t t)f recovery ;;.:hould 

be shared acn>>> all !cYcls ofgonrnmcnl, and while 1·1':-..L\ should pb\' a strong supporting 

toll.~ in f('COYt:-ry. state. tribal, anJ local go\'crn:ment:-> should he in tht' lead :1!" they know best 

\Vhat their cornmunitit:~ need. 

1 an1 aware of and ~hare concerns ahottt rf..,ing dlsa~fcr cost:- and if confirrncd. I wiH bl~gjn a 

holistjc review of F_F\L\ 's wlth the hopes of n:ducing then1 through n1irigation, planning. :Ind 

cng~lg<:rnent \vith our locaL tribal, and swtt: partner!' .. \ddirionaH;;~ n·co"' ery co~t:: arc generatt:J 

brother fc·deral agenci<'S outside of Fl·:\fi\, such as Ht·n, SB:\, l"S.\C!·:, HilS. ~nd Hl\Y'·\. 

Redncing disa~rer cosr wiH reyutn.: working across the federal govcn1111ent to l.:nUccrivdy rcdun: 

irs ovcrhc:Hl and find ways ro dficicnl h· usc funds in concert with one another to best help irs 

local partners impacted bY dis<htc·r. 

IS How c'm FEAfA effectil·e~v work with stare, local, and tribal gov<·rnmeot.< tv ensure 

they ;~re prepared to meet their emergency awnagemem responsibilities? 

If confirnwd. I will work to ensure rhar alllcn·ls oi gun·rnmcnt arc prepared to cu-ry ourrhur 

n·sponsibilirics in response to mizc·n m:eds during a disaster. I largch· bdicn that l·J::,f.\\ rok 

is to support ;lnd enable, r'lOt supplHnr or dictate those 

~tate_, loco1.l~ and tribal gun.:t11t11cnt~ n1:1y han: difft.•:n:nt goals based upnn tlu:ir geographical 

location, existing human capital, and phvsical c•pahilitit"- ( "ndersranding this. I belie\"<' that 

I:E:-.1. \ Rc~-,>ional offices and staff should be used more proacrin:ly to identif,- spccitk needs and 

thcnws within their Jurisdicrion, and bt: ctnpowered fo intluence how thJ.: ~·\gt:ncy as a whole 

adminbttrs future grnnts, technical assistance, and develops gmdancc. Fl-::V!:\ should ultimatchorganl;,rc effort~ to addrcs::> nationwide gap~. but n1on.: itnpnrtantly cnabk our ~tate) local} and 

trih:ll parlncr!"' to achieve their goab. 

ln addition ro putentialh· c\·aluanng and 

the .\genc:·'s partners curr<:nth, J·l :\1.\ 

the acti,·e pto,grarn~ and init.iatt,·c~ thnt 

consistenrly be workir1~, pbnnlng~ and 

If confirmed. 1 \\'Ould like to c·xplon: side bY side with out panrwrs on " dailY basis. 

rnulti·disciplined integration te<\tns 111 state 

integration, incrca~c custorntT ~ervic._-, ;;;peed up 

t•) enhance 

COl11111UtllGttlfH1. 

I (J. Tflc farge.H $b:<re ofDHS~-; budget :wthority is pro<'idcd to Fb~:VA to c:m;r out it8 

adssion But rile DHS [n$pector General and other watchdogs have identified problems 

wirb FE.MA 's m:mBgcmcnr ofits gram progmms. 

6 
70 

o. If con finned, wlwt initial actions would you take to improve FE.iiL4 's 

m:magement of its grant programs? 

If conlinnetl. l will commit to working "ith the DHS Inspector ( ;cneral tn fulhunderstand their t!ndings ami recommendatiom. '"well as work \\'ith FE\!.\ leadcr;hip 

to understand rhe issues from all siJes bt'fnrc in1pktnenring in)pron .. •nwnts for gnlnt 

program managt:ment and oversight. 

/;. U:'hat qualities vdllyon look fi.u in those that n-il! mm111ge FEJYfA 's disaster 

<1ss.ist:mce and prep<lrcdness grant progmms? 

Strong working knowledge of etnt·rgency tn~nagcn1cnt and FF\L\, large gtant program 

rn3nagen1enr experience, ethlca.I leadership, S<l\'VY businc~s ~t:11Sl', and the abJJity ro ~t;t!· 

neutral to aYoid conflicts of in teres!. 

If con/inned, will you commit to doing a full reFiew of open DHS Office 

Inspector General (O!G) recommendations :md directing program offices to 

work Hith the DHS OIG on closing outstanding recommendations? 

Yes. 

I-:_ 11ow would you strike a balance betn"eeJl cffixtiF¢' working p:;rtncrsbips with st:rtc :1nd 

loc:lf goFemments and bt:ing a good st<·w:mf of taxpayer dollars by holding tbem 

accountable for n1onitoring subgranf.t}t.>S.:> 

This is a complicated issue and one \Yhich ! han a strong inrercst in. l f confirmed, I will rake ;t 

fresh look ;tt how grants arv miliu·d w buy down risk with an en: towards identifring clear. 

tncasurabk mcrrics and c·nsuring grant clolla" arc spent approprintch· and ct hically. 

I k. FEAfA has had cballengcs closing out disasters. What do you think contributes to 

disasters not being closed out in a time~!' mmmer? lf confimwd, fum· would you ;uldrcss 

this problem? 

Cio~ing out <1 disaster rc~...Juircs ft•detaJ, ~tate~ rrihal. and Jocallevds of govermnc.nt to work 

together, and indi,·iduallv. to trw<:~ deadlines and project \n>rkshccr rc<juircmcnts. lf 

confirmed~ l \Yould llke to t:lkc n fresh look at ho\\ to sin1plif~ dt~~!stcr arhnlni~ttatlnn and 

doS('OUt pr{ )C(':"!'<:S. 

l 'l. If confirmed, will you commit to updating the P1'iiHA website so ir includes usc/hi ,md 

usable infiJmwtion regarding disaster and preparedness grams funding? 

20. The Robert T. Stafford Dito;aswr Relief:md E"rncrgen,:v Assist;mce f1ct authorizes tbc 

President to issue "m:Ijor disaster" or "emeq.;-cn<:v'·' decl<1ttitions before or after 

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71 

catastrophes occur. Are there any clumge.< you think Congress should n1ake to the 

Staffi>rd Act? 

I bdj~,·c the :'raiford .\ct prm·idcs the Pn:sidelll the approprime lnd of !lexibility to usc their 

be~t )udgcrncnt when it Gwncs tu declaring an area as a "rn.ajor disaster" or "ctncrgency ·~ 

21. The SudJi>rd Act pro noes for federal assist<mce when the se•·cri~v of an incident is 

beyond the capacity of state and local governments. 

a. W'hat weight, do you bdicvc, should be given to the estimated per capitu damuge 

costs in a state or locali~v when determining whether a disaster dec!a.mtion 

should be issued? 

If confirn1cd~ I \\"ill ensure that the factors used to infonn n~con1tncndations arc 

routindy rcYlcwcd for :.Kcuraq and cfft'CU\·cncss, 

b. Do you belit·re th:~t enough weight h:~s been given in the p:~st to tile loc:~h'zed 

impr~cts ofil disaster when determining whether .7 di.~asterdeclarntion should he 

issued? 

1 \\ nuld support the regular review of tlw t~1Ctors usl'd fot dctt·rtnining a disa~tt'r 

declaration on a local k,-d tn ensure they accnrately rdkct rlw region to which tlwr 

apph. 

22. The Nmional F1ood lmwr.~ncc Progrilm (NF1P) bas been on tile Gm·emment 

Account;lbili~v Oflict' ~. (GAO's) high-risk li.<t since 2006. If confirmed, what steps 

would you t<lke to :~ddress this problem? 

Tht: :\:Jtinnal n,md !nsuranet~ Program is not fin,mcialh· ,·iahlc in it> current form. If 

confirmed, 1 \Vould t'ngaf,tt' stakeholders on way::;. to increase the priY<.Ht' sector's partiupatwn 

in the flood insurance prograrn, 

a. lf1mt steps would you take to address tbe fr.ct that structure's in designated 

Special Flood Hazard Areas are required to have flood insumnce, yet o.o{r 

:~ppro.>:imatc~v 53 percent do? 

l ;H11 :nYarc of thi~ i~:-ue nod jf confirnwd. I will t<lkC a h~trd look at kn:rag1ng pri\·att' 

Jn,urt:rs and gtn'cnHrH:nl partner::> ro addrcs;-. thjs Cf1nccrn a~ well ~1~ eng:1glng \\·irh 

Cong;res:-: if any lcgi~btion is required to assist in this effort. 

h. Do .vou belie•·e tllcr<' :1re problems with tbc ;mwunt of;VF1P premimns collected 

from polk-yholdcrs? ll.m, wbilt steps would_vou take to address them? 

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I bdic,·c the 1\'H I' in its current form is mlH:rcntlv flawed, hnwcvcr it is a critical 

rc:>:ourcc for indiYidual~ living ln flood :totlt.'s .. \n:: refonns tnust be thoughtful ant.! 

con:-:.idtr unintended conH·yucnce:-s as a rcsuh of any changes to the prognun. 

c. li'1Jat steps would you wkt' to eJJsure the Fiood InsumJJCt' .ra:,k Maps :~t·e updated 

to properly inform buyers and st~!Jers of the risk? 

lf cunfitmcd, I would t•ngage stakeholders fwm the· puhlic ;md pri' ate sector to examine 

where ~FIP can be improved. I bdie,·c that ,;ccuratc mapping is a ccmntl part nf 1\:l'!P 

refort11. 

~3. How could FEJ\.1A better desit,"'l pre-and post-disaster mitig<nion grant programs to 

incre,lse inct·ntives for states, localities, businesses; and individuals to invest in di.~aster 

resilience? 

:..Ittigatinn i~: central ro reducing costs of future disastt·rs. FE\IA rnnst first understand wh~tt 

ri~ks wiH cau~c the mo;;:t atnounr of Ji\-t'S lost anJ property damagt~ and work \\-ith ~tate, trib<~l 

and local partners to suppnrt itnpletncnt:ation of whole cmnnwniry tnittgatinn srraregics 

desigm'd ro buy down rhns.' risks. !\litigation is a shared rcsponsibilitv, and if conflmwd, l 

would like to take a fresh look regarding how H·:i\L\ can inccmidzt· pre-disaster mingation 

acti\·irks proactively initiated hy :-late, local. and tribal partner~. 

l- nfnrrunatdy, tnitigatinn has largely becon1c <..h-sH:-ter n:co\-ery cffnn ha'$cd upon hn\V 

and wh<.:n a JnaJorit~ nf fund~ ;ln.: rnadt' t() ~tate. local, and tribal guYcrnnwms. ~in1ply 

put. C<)Jnrnunit.ies rnust l·xperienct' a declared di~astt.'r to acct'ss signiflc~1nr anHrunt::- uf 

mitigation funds to make a difference. If confinned, I would like to work with Congn·" to 

increase opportunities for prc"thsastcr tnltigarion and 1 will rev it.'\\' all rnitigation progmtn~ 

administered by FF\1.-\ ro help communities reduce disaster Ins""· 

2-t What ilctions would you mke co help FEMA k"d m1d impkmcm the dcvdopm<•11f of 

consistent und meaningful irufexcs across the whole-of-community ro measure tbe st<lte 

oldis:~ster r'•silicnce :md prcp.uedncss :md tbc refllm on im·eMJnent fi:Jr specific hazard 

n1itigation actb-·ities? 

If confirn1ed, J would engage stakchokkr~ fnr n•con1tncndmion.s on how to maintnin 

nw:amngful indcst':- and othct" 111etrics to measure di~a:-;tct rc:'ilit~ncc. 

25. IVbar role do .vou think b:1zard mitigmion w111/wve in ;1ddre.ssing feder"l di.s:~stcr cost 

issues? 

. \s slat<:d earlier, I believe thM pte-disaqcJ' mitiganon coupled with educ1tion is the kt·y to 

rcUucmg flnun: disaster cost:-: <tnd~ tf con finned, I wiH focus nn ways to n1c-asure the 

return <Hl mv<"stnwnt. 

26. W'b:~t could FEMA do ro help suites, localities, :md indidduals better :~ssess their own 

disa8ter ri.>k? 

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I belw\·c ~tatt:~ local~ and tnba1 go\·crnmcnts understand thctr own t.hsnstcr nsk better than 

1 :E:'>L\ in many cases. \\'hile FF,\L\ can flf<l\·idc loss estimation tools and technical cxpntisc 

to its partners, .I bdicYc that the Rcgronal.officcs must be empowered ro communicate their 

territorial risk up to headquarters in a manner th~t helps the Agcnn as a whole bettt:r de·sil-,'11 

and adtninistcr grant and technical a:-:sistancc programs. 

"· Do .vou believe FEJI.IA should encoumge the use of crediblt: science infommtiort 

to assess future ri.~k? If so, how could FE'AJA help ensure that such infi:umation i.~ 

accessible, undersumdable, :md us:rble by ;tll interested ptrrtieH? 

l bdie,·e credible science· and accurate infom1at1on is tbc !0 informing p!Jnrrrng, 

mitigtnion, and preparedness initinrn·s. l f continued, 1 explore making the credible 

science FEi,L\ use:; accc%ihk "' tht· pubhc in a digestible and informarin: m:mncr. If 

confirmed, l will enlluatc how F l :.\!.\current)\' makes information ilCCessibk and tmrbk 

lw ;tll inrcre>ted parties. 

[)j.!r1Jitr Pnprllt:'d!!t.Li 

27. U?lwr is your asHessintmt of our muion's prep.?redness today, both :If the fedemllevel 

:wd at the state, local, and triballe•·el? WlMt arc your top priorities in improving our 

nation's preparedness, :md wh:u me.~surcs nill you rake to impf<>ment those priorities? 

1 bdicv.·, as a nation, om public awarcnc" campaigns ha,·c fallen shon of crearing a true 

cultun· ,,f prcparcdncs;; within our cirizcnrr. Citi£cn preparedness is tlw kn m nmm: disaster 

rC':-:.llil'ncy ~ anJ serves as th<: prunary Jrivcr of hnw d1c ctncrgency tnarLtgcn1crn community 

dc~igns and itnplcn1ents gn:,ater overardung pn.:pan::dnes~ effort;-;. SpccifkaHy~ we 111ust reah%c 

rhat cltin:ns :ue often the uFir~r True Rc:->ponder'' for any c'~:t~nt, and we need to 

lnodcnt ( :ornmancl proo . .-~s-c~ to n.::lsonably include cnizen:s rather than iust a~:-;utning arc 

\·ictims or sutYin>rs. If confirmed I would like to tc\·isc existing "Rc:1dy ( ::unpmgn ., efforts. I 

would also like to c;;~duatc and it11plcmcnt \\'::ty:-' to get citizt'n~ ~u1d bu~int·ss. owners mutt· 

lnvoh·cd tn our daily training and cxcrci~c cfforr~ (within rc1son). f·inally. \\'t:' n<.·ed to further 

tmth·.r~t:-md ho\.\' to effectively conununlcatt· our campaign effort~ in a tnantH.·r that creates 

puhhc interest and excitement. 

Rtgardless of our nation's levels uf preparedness, I realize that FE"-1:\ must be n·~el\· to "'f'flOH 

our partners for any type nf event, and I will do n1y bt''::.t rn ensure the ,\gcncy is n.·rH.l:· if 

om finned. 

2i:\. lfllwt is your positioiJ 011 the efi'i.•ctil'enes& of preparedness gr:mt progmm.'l to state, 

loc:ll, und tribal govemmcrus to help prep:ue for terrorisiJJ :md other huz:uds? 

lfconfim1ed, I would like to eng.,.gc in more derailed conYersntiom \\ith l'F\L\ smff regarding 

how tht: .\gene~, do<::-. or dn~s not nH:a~un: grant rcrurn on inn.~strncnl before ducrmining 

effecti·n.~nes:-;.. r bdien.' grant..; t'hould bt: dt·~igned as an initial hr1Jgt: to hdp cntnmtUllt!e...; 

Jump stan preparedness initiatives and/or bm· down risk. l do nut bdie,·c that fcdend grant' 

~hould be u~cd to supplant entire progtarns. 

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29 To ..-lwt extent do you bdicve more qmmtit:uke assessmerJts ofprepuredness und 

gr:mts are possible? 

If confirmed. l \\·ould like to take a fresh look at 

consid{'red when m-easuring grant cffectivcnc-;:..;. 

30. lf'llat are your plans to strengtl1en FEldA's feder.1l coordination etTorts and 

parme.rsilips on the development tmd implementation of natiomlf preparedne.~ll efii>rtll? 

.\, J prrviou>k noted. l·EC.L\ Regioml officc·s need the authoriry to make critical n·>pomc and 

recon:•rv declslon:-; in rhe {'Yt'tH of :1 disaster, FE\L\ ~hould con::-lder its regional offices 

n1ore ~t,Jtonomy to tnanagt· l·'cdcral grants and to cn::.:urc fund::; supPf"Jt't the 

:->pcciiic needs and prlorirics of a ~tate/ tribe or 

I be lien: it is abo i1nporta11t ro engage our partners regarding future irnproYetnents tf) the 

\:<1tinnai Incident :\bnagcnlctlt Sy~tcrn guidance to underHand If cnrmnunitic:-:. can n:a:-oruhly 

achicn: or attain u higher lcYd of compliann·. 

,\ddition;tlly, corntnunittC$ s.hould be incenridn"d ro achien~ l·~n1ergcncy .\fanage1nent 

:\ccrnl.itation Program (E\L\P} accrcditatitJll (with regular eYaluatinns of those standards as 

threats and nrlnerabilitics change). l would engage stakeholder> for input on how these 

incentive,-; should be stn1cturt>d to be n1ost cfftcrivc, 

.) I. Recent snrn:vs han: continued to show thM m;my citizens tlrL' unprep:.red for 11 

disaster. 

Do you believe it is important for FE'l'r!A to promote personal preparedness? lf 

110, how would you do so if confirmed? 

Y cs .. \s prcdouslv noted, I bdie,·c l'f '.\! .\ 's public :m·arenc" campaigns could and 

>houkl be impnwed. 1 am not confident that the majority of people arc aware• of the 

significH1t lmp<:tet tlhH in\'t:~ting in 1nitigatlnn ;md resiliency h~ts nn reco\·ery eH(nt$. 

If confirmed l would like to rnicw existing "Rcad1 Campaign" c·fforts and explore 

\vays tn better utilize ;;oclal media ncrworks in Ff -:\L\ 's public aw::trencg.~ catnpnlgns. 

/;. P/e,Jse describe uny efforts you eng:1ged in as Director of the Alabama 

Emergency 1\.fanagement Agen<:v to encourage personal pr<ptuedness . 

. \s dtrceror of .\l :!IL\, l was rcspun>ibk for all of the Ready .\labama program 

and oftl:n served ;:ts dw State\ public Yoice about prcparnlness. ,\ddition~1n), 

l led the creation' of an mnoYatin· set of tools to provide citizens wirh a digital nsk 

analnis rhrougb our public website. The· roo! '"" Jcsi~,~Jcd to hdp them undc·r<tand 

tlwir ,·ulncrabrliric·s basc·d upon location. alrn tlwm of re:d rime warnings, and cduultc 

them about kq contacts within tlwir commcuut\. If confirmed, I would like to 

conSJdcr adapting H·:\IA.go,· to h:n·c sinular hut expanded capahilities. 
75 

.'\2. Jf/hat do _vou see as FEMA 's most import;mt !WlWlgemeru challe11ges, a11d what steps 

will you take to address these challenges? 

I bctlt'\-{' ernployee recruitrnent and rett'ntion arc n~ry real concern~ that n1ust be a.ddn..>s~(:·d fur 

H:?\L\ w operate to ;~t full capacirv. If confirmed, I would make it :1 priorin· to meet with stafT 

from,lll the :\t,><:nc(s programs tn hear their pc·r>pccti,·c· on where there""' opportunities tc> 

increase {:"tnployee engag<'n1ent artd job sari~faction. 

BcfPrc tnaking decisions n.·g~n·ding ho\"> tn corn·ct tbc5e percctYt:d problems, I 1nust verify 

them. If confirmed, lphtn to tran:l to H :'-l:\ Regional offices tu meet with staff and state, 

tribal, and loc:~l agcnc1· leaders to collect idea,; for improving upon all facets ofl'E;\L\. It i> 

also itnpnrrant to rneet wirh the leadership rcpn:.scnt.int~ \·arlou~ ~ls,ociadons nnd non 

go\/trntrl(.'t1tal organization~ that support the en1t'rgency tnanagcrncnt cornn1unity to ut1dcr~t:\nJ 

i~~ll('S and solutions to bcttt·r { Hlt fichl 

illost importantly. 1 will insrill within my senior le>1dership team that, as" whole. we \\'Ill be 

approachable and double down un intcrnai t:-01Tln1tl11it:ilt1on. \\'c wiJI clearly n>ice dw \:isi()n 

and of the _\g{.·ncy to our st'~lff ;tnJ parttH.•r:;, h(.:Jp cn1ploycts unJ<:rstanJ the important(' 

rnks aucl where thcr fit in, and make· incrcmcnral, bur effecri,·c, changes to soh-e 

problems that we identitj·. \X'c will a1·oid makmg decisions in \'acuum and collect ideas :tnd 

solution~ to i~sucs from tnany good ~uh-isors and aU kTcl$ of staff 

.H. W1wt cluwges, if any, in culture and le:ulership tone at FE111A are needed, and wlmt 

would you do to make progress in these areaii? 

lf confirmed, 1 will fir>t \Trif: exi>ting cultwT and leadership tones, and will then implement 

any nceth:d changes. 

34. In the most rcce11t Best Plac<'S to U7ork in tbe ~Federal Gm·emnwnt sun·-:v, .FE~li! was 

ranked 284 oat of 305 ft:deral agCJ1cies far t•mplo)i<'C morale. In _vour vi en~ what factors 

drive momle ;md employ-ee c11gagement at FEAIA? What steps ure 11eeded to make 

progress i11 this area? 

Staff n1ust understand whete their role fits in to the entire ~-\gcncy'3 mission. :\dditionall~', 

etnployccs ntu:St be able ro t'tWision a career bdder within the A gene~-, rcccin.::' con::>trucuve 

ft~t~dback. :tnd bt· able to Yoic(.' idens and i..;::;ucs up tht..: chain of cotnrnand. \1oH 

they mu:-:t feel connected tn . \gene;." lt•adcrs, 

55. If/hat clmnges, if an.v, in FEiHA ~~ existi11g workforce ;zrt• needed, ;md what would you 

do to llUJke progress ifl this area? 

)6. Coordi11ation bNween r'l'.'MA ~~regional of'fJccs ;wd headquarters has been rept';Jtcdfy 

idcmified <~sa rmmugemem issue bv th<' GAO ami others ;md has sometimes crc;ut•d 

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intemal conflict and inconsistent Hpplication of policies and procedures to stares and 

locals. 

a. To what extent ;ue you :IWilre of this situfltion and what steps do you plan to 

improve coordirwtion between FE1\1A 's regional offices and het~dquarters? 

l bchcYc in fo>tcring strength m the Fl·:'IL\ Hxgional offices, and the phtlosnpln that 

Incident Command d(·cisions >hould be nude closl'st to the incident. Regional staff arc 

tlw c1 cs and cars of the ,\gency, and should he cmpnwercd to make decisions with 

srrategtc oversight fi'<)ln Headquarters. lf contirmcd, 1 would like to c·oluatc optinrl' fnr 

~t n:ngtht:ning Fl ·~\f.\ Region!" incrementally and allow thcn1 H t as~urnc n1orc response 

and reco\"ery authorities without cotnprornis.ing the Agl'ncy'~ ability to support our 

partners. 

/;, Do you believe FE1UA 's curn·nt regiowli structllre is the most efficient and 

etlective way to org:mize tmd imp/emt•nt FEllfA's variouR tnissions and 

progmms? Pleat;e explt~in. 

lf confirmed. I would like to c·xplorc extending the reach of region~tl offices b1· 

etnbt·tkhtig full tin1c integration tl·anl~ insult' :-:.r:H<: agcndc~ to in1pron.• pn:-disa<>tcr 

coordlnm.lon and po~t disaster rcspnnse. 

l~luu do you s~·c a-9 the uppropritlte role of the regiomll oflices with respect to 

headqw1rters? 

Rcgiunal <>fticcs arc a key cap;tbilirl· for coordinating and maintaining t·dationships with 

starc~. rritH:s. itnd l< 1ca1 leaders and co1nn1unitic~. 

; - Protecting whistlcblower confidcntiHifty is of the utmost importunce to tbis Committee. 

"· How do you p!Hn to impkmeJJt policies within the ag<'tJCy to encoumge 

emplf~n·es to bring constmctke suggestions fonnud witlwut the k:ur of reprisal? 

If confmncd, I would suppon and encourage employees ro slhll:e their ideas ;md 

suggc"iom with 1'1'.,\L\ lcackrship on when· rhcr sec oppommu:y for impronmcnt 

withm the .. \gene,·. 

!J. if continne~ w/wr #Venues will be Ul'aih•blt• to emplo,n.:cs to rcpon waste, fraud, 

or abuse nithin FE1l1A? 

l would make certain FE\L\ polic1 full\' pro1ccts whistkblowcrs, and make am· changes 

nt:cez..sary to the current pPlicy tr, achit:n: ~uch pro teo ion_:.:. 

Do you cmnmit without reservation to work to ensure tlua uny whi~tlch/owcr 

nithin FEMA docs not face retaliation? 

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d. Do you commit without reservation to take all appropriate action if notified 

ab,;ut poteruial wbistleblower retaliation? 

Yes. 

38. Do you agree without reservation to comply with any request or summons to appear 

and te.~tity before any duly constimted committee of Congress if you are confim~ed? 

Yes. 

:\9. Do you agrt'e without resen•ation to make any subordinate official or employee 

avallable to appear and testifj· before, or provide information to, any duly constituted 

committee of Congress if you are confirmed? 

Yes, in accordance with all Administration policies and laws. 

~0. Do you agree lfithout re.9ervation to comp~v ful~v, completely, and promptly to at~y 

request for documents, comnwnications, or any other agency material or information 

from any duly constituted committee of the Congress if you are confimwd? 

Yes, in accordance· with all :\dministration pohcie;: and laYvs 

~ 1. Are these ;mswers your own? Hm•e you consulted with DHS or any other interested 

p<lrtics? If so, please indicate which entities. 

Yes. In an cfk>rt to !Jc' forthright and responsive to the Committee, I han participated in a few 

high level pre-conftrmation bric·ftngs with Fb\L\ staff and the Department of Homeland 

Security. These consultation,; were generalh- used to inform my answers at a high len·l, but 

tht'S{_' answers an.~ tny O\Yn. 

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U.S. Senate Committee on Homeland Security and Governmental Affairs 

Supplemental Minority Pre-hearing Questionnaire 

For the Nomination of Brock Long to be 

Administrator, Federal Emergency Management Agency, 

Department of Homeland Security 

I. Background of Nominee 

1. U''hat improvements has FEMA made since you last worked at the agency? 

T!w ,\gency has made significant changes since I was bst employed there ove.r ten vear> ago. 

1\losr signiticanrly, FEM:\ ha;; made great strides to fulfill requirements set forth by the Post 

r.:.auina Emergency Management Reform ;\ct and the Sandy Recovery lmpmvcmcnt :\ct. The 

. \gcncy has also tremendously increased its comprehensi,·ely trained workforce and worked to 

implement a nmional preparedness svsrcm. !'FMc\ has also concentrated hca,·ily upon its 

ability to respond and aS>ist communities with preparing for cata~trophic c,·cms. 

2. Please describe the nature ofyour work in tile prit•ate sector, including your experience 

with Beck Disaster Recat'ery Inc. a11d Hagerty Consulting. Who were your top live 

clients at Hagerty by contract amount? 

Since 2011, l han sc.tTcd as the ExccutiYc \'icc President at HagertY Consulting, where 

I prm·idc strategic direction >tnd leadership to the firm's full complement of emergency 

management programs and professionals. I directly mpported approximateh· 50 projects as <l 

Project Exccutirc/Subjcct \latter Expert, ranging from complex :Ittack sn·nario exercises to 

designing multi-jurisdictional, all--hazard C\'acuarion plans. :\ majority of Hagerty's clients are 

state and loc>l govcmment agencies; however. the finn h'" supported IT\!:\ and several 

pri\'atc scctor/non-gorcrnmcntal organizations since inception 1t1 2001. The firm':; top five 

clients during m1· tenur-e include: 

1. Nt:w York City Office of Management & Budget 

2. Chicago Bridge & Jron Company (CBI) 

3. Nationwide Infrastructure Support Technical :\ssistancc Contractors (joint Venture). 

FF\!A 1':\T:\C: Support 

4. City of Longmont, Colorado CDBG-DR flood recovery management :;upport 

5. Cook County Department of Homeland Sccurin· & Fmergenc1· i\lanagcmcnt 

Regarding Beck l)i,asrer Rcconty (BDR) Inc, J briefly setTcd as the :c;omhcasr Regional 

Program Director over cmcrgt·ncy managcmcm programs. BDR was :required by S:\IC, and 

sold again to Tetra Tech. l do not recall BDR's top fi,·c dimts during my tenure nor do I ha\·c 

accc" to this information. 

1 Ple:1se give ex;unples of times in your career when you disagreed with your superiors 

and aggressA·ely ;,dvoc:aed your position. 

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79 

As Direct< ll' of the Alabama Emergency 1\lanagemcnt .\gcncv, on a small number of occasions 

I made recommendations regarding how the stare should d1>mgc scn:ral processes to imprm-c 

large scale evacuation respome plans to the Governor. ;v!y rccommt'ndations were nor 

accepted despite several effort~ to advocate tny position. 

4. Please list and describe examples of when .vou made poliricaUy diflicuft choices that 

.vou thought were in the best interest of the country? 

During tnY career l have ncn·r been in a position that impacts the best interest of the country 

as a whole; however, n1~· e:xpedcncc in cn1crgcncy n1anagctncnr has taught tnc to retnain a~ 

apohtical as possible and always focus upon hfc-saving and life sustaining missions. Never in 

my career haYc made safety deciskms based upon pobtics. Protecting all ,\mericans is my 

priority, 

5. Do .vou seek out di~senting viewb~ and how do .vou encourage constructive critical 

dialogue with subordinates? 

I am a diplomat by nature and 1 bel inc in sunounding myself with capable ad,·isors, :\ly 

leadership m·lc includes regularly engaging staff members at allJe,·cls of any org,mization. 

be lien· in establishing sound lines of communication and building an approachable leadership 

team, During my career, l dcsit,rned and implemented numerous "discove1~- change'' listening 

sessions to ide-ntify internal issues, solutions, and the best path forward tbat includes staff 

representing all parts and Je,-cls of the organization. 

6. Provide us with examples of a few changes or improvement.~ _you heh'eve need to be 

made to F6~/WA 's existing regulations, policies, and practice.<, 

If confmned, l would like to porc·ntially cYaluarc or address the foll<m·ing, but not limited to, 

:itern~; 

L lmplcm,·nr a "Reduce the Complexity of Recovery" campaign designed to 

reduce disaster costs, impron· FEl\L\ recovery customer scn·iccs, and help 

communities understand how to usc ~ll federal drsastcr funds in concert with one 

another to increase resiliency. 

2. Su-engthen FEJ\L-\ Regions and incrementally allow them to assume more 

response and rcco\·cry authorities without compromising the Agency's ability tn 

respond. ,\!so, increase regional irwnh·ement with an ongoing dialcJf,>1W on their 

gram priorities and initiatins. 

3. lncrcas<" customer sen-icc to constimenrs bv potentially positioning FL:-L\ 

personnel on a tcn1pnrary or sen1i· pern1aneru basis inside state agencies and 

CAS! jurisdictions (in coordination with those jurisdictions). 

4. Re,·icw and transform the "ReadY Campaign" in manner that prm·ides citizens 

with simple skill sets designed to increase imliYidual resilience and Ci'tablish a tmc 

culture of preparedness. 

5. E,·aluate and potentially improve the existing disaster workforce structure. 

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G< [':nsurc that communities arc building sustainable capabilities and bunng down 

risk with existing grant programs, rather than relying on grants tn supplant dav< 

tO·-day operations. 

7 Take a fresh look at how to guickly and cost effectively close out existing 

disaswrs that received FE'\f:\ disaster funding< 

According to FEMA, there were 252 federally declared disasters in the United States 

from 1980 tbrough 1989 and 558 disaster dech1rations i11 the 1990s. During the next 

decade, from 2000 through 2009, the number of declarations increased to 1,265. 

Already, betweerJ 2010 and 2017, there have been 822 federally declared dis;1sters. U?bat 

hccors, in your opinion, are drh·ing the increase, and what actions, if any, would you 

take as tbe Admi11istrator of FEM.4, to address the risi11g number of disa.oter 

declarations? 

There are many comributing factors for tht• increasing number of disaster declarations< First, l 

belicn that many citizens are increasingly facing asset ponrty (a household's inability to acce5' 

\Walth resources that are sufficient to overcome small emergencies) and have less financial 

means to overcome di>:l'ter events, which increases the need for lndi,·idual :\ssistancc support< 

Second, various climate variability cycles, such as Thcnnohalim' Circularjon, have conrrihuted 

to the increased numbn of disasters declared< Third, a lack of propc'r building codes coupled 

with inade<JUatc insurance policies has played a significant role< These are just a few of many 

contributing fact<>rs. 

Pr<'<<disastc'r mitigation and <:ducation is the key to reducing the future number of disaster> and 

;~>sociatcd costs< l would like to review how FF'\1:\ c:m better incenticize state, tribal ;Jnd local 

goYcrntnents to takt' rnorc pre-disaster rnitigation actions as well as tt'\"ising publlt: awareness 

campaigns to educate citizens and business owners about the importance of insurance and how 

tnake proper preparations based upon the uni<.Iue risk::; they face. 

8< In 2010 tc.otimony before the House Homeland Sccurirx Committee's Subcommittee on 

Emergency Comnwnications, Preparedness, and Response, you were critical of the 

lengtb of time, in some case.<, that it took for tbe President to issue a disaster 

declaration, and you criticized FEMA:< regional offices for being unable to provide 

detailed information on tbe status of requests for assistance. 

a, Do you believe, generally, tbat it takes too much time for the President to decide 

wbetber to issue a disaster declaration, and, if' so, what would you do as the 

FE!I.fA Administrator to expedite the process? 

I bdicn- that disaster declaration decisions should be made as <Juickly as possible so 

FEM.\'s state and tribal partners han' a better understanding of how to mm·c forward 

to address disast<:r impacts with, or without, federal support< If confirmed, 1 wtll assess 

l'IC.\L\'s internal process for cnluating these r·cgut'sts and work to impron: the clarity 

in response pnn·ided ro ( ;o\'etnnrs when a dt·c1::1fation n:tfLH.:st is denied. 

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/;. How do vou rate commum'cations betTveen stflfc emergency management 

'1gcncie; and FEMA ofiices currently, and, what, if an_vtl1ing, would _vou do to 

improve communication? 

Having ~erved as a prinHe COil$-Ultant fot the past 6 years. I am not in a position to 

:-lccura.telv rate cnnununications bct\veen stntc agencies and FEl\ L \ offices. } Io\i/CYer, if 

confirm~J, I hrlly plan to assc,:s existing relationships to understand if the :\gency is 

communicating effectively with states on a daily basis. One initiative I hope to explore· 

and implcmcll!, if confirmed, is to expand tho: regional offic<'(s) reach by embedding full 

time staff, in coordination and discussion \vith these entities within state agencies. to 

rruh· increase integration levels within all phases nf emerg<"ncy management. 

9. What, if an.v, changes do you believe need to be m:1de to FE'.ll1A 's response and 

recovery programs? 

1 think FE;\J;\ has made ,t,'l:ear strides to increase its ability 10 support its state, tribal, and local 

partners during the tesponse phase. If confirmed, 1 plan to continue to build upon the existing 

foundation and mon· thc· needle f(,rward. I would like to explore incrementally increasing 

respome/incidem command decision making authorities \\'ithin the Regional offices if 

confirmed. 

Reg:uding l"ccoYery, if confit.n'lcd. I would like to exatnine W;-1ys tn n:Uucl' tllsaster co~ts <1nd 

improve FE:.L\ customer scn·ice to partners throu11:h the. cnrire recover process. 

I 0. In 2011, FEMA began rc•engincering its Public Assista.nce (PA) program, which 

provides gr.11lts to state and local agencies for repairing, replacing, 1md restoring 

publicly-owned damaged facilities. In 2015, program officials launched a new model for 

deliH•ring PA to increase the simplicity-, accumcy, and efflciency of the process and to 

make it more accessible and timely. To what extem do recem proposed changes 

address xour understanding of'the longstanding cb:ulengcs associated ~tith PA? 

I bcJic,·c the current rccngim•cring cffmt is a necessary and bold mon b\' FF:.L\. It is my 

understanding that the PA Reengincering program is currentlY being piloted for the first rime rn 

\·ar:iou~ con1111l111ities. 1 ha,·e not been btlefed regarding the initial succes~es or failures 

experienced "" a result of this ongoing pilot. If confirmed, I plan to full\' evaluate the 

t~ffcctiYcness of rhis dTorr, and tnake changes to uldrnnlely itnpro,-c how rhc .-\gency 

adrnini,;tcrs all facets of the l':\ program. 

11. FE?IfA is currentl_v resting the new PA model in selected disasters before .Ycaling it up 

prior to full implementation by 2018. Wh:~t etidence of success would you want to see if 

conlirrned as FE111A Adn1inistrator before implementing tlJC new process nationwide 

for aU future disasters? 

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82 

Initially, I would want to make sure rhc recngineered process ultimntdy helps our state, local, 

and tribal partners achieve their recovery goah~ that it provides consistent cu~ton1er .sen·ice~ and 

that the streamlined effort reduces overhead operating cost comparatively. In the long term. I 

would want to make sure it results in a reduced number of OlG negatit•e audit findings and 

quicker closeout times. !\lost importantly, l would want to ensure the process strengthens state, 

tribal_ and local abilities to manage disasters with decreased support from FE!\1:\ in the future. 

12. FEA-IA ."tlso provides Individur~l Assistance (IA) to victims of disasters. W11at do you 

see as FEMA 's role in providing lotJg-term lA to families tmd individuals? 

The t·arious forms of lndi>·idual :\ssistancc arc vitally important and should scttc as an initial 

bridge to reconry. The program is not designed to make people whole and if confirmed, I 

would like. to evaluate how FEi\L\ informs recipients of the entire scope of support they may 

be c•ligiblc for, to include Other ::--;ccds :\ssistancc, and what those programs art' intended to do 

for them. 

13. The six primaiY factors FEMA uses to assess the seFeri~y, nmgnitude, and impact of a 

disr~stu in e•·aluating whether /A should be provided hr~ve not changed since 1999. The 

current .factors include concentration of damages, tmunm, spedru populations, 

volw1ta1J' agency r~ssistance, insurance, and m'emge amount of !A by str~te. In 2013, 

Congress passed the S:wdy Recovery lmprovemellt Act, which required FEllfA to 

revien; update, and re•,ise fr~ctors considered when cvailuting the need for IA. In 

response, FEMA issued a proposed rule with new fr~ctors. 

a. How have your experin1ees shaped your ~eiews of the effecdveness of FEkfA 's 

!A program? 

I have nor been directly inn>lvcd with FEM:\'s L\ progri1tn execution since entering 

the private sector over 6 years ago, and cannot in good faith pro,·idc my dews 

rct,>arding the effectinne>S of the 1:\ program. lf confirmed, l will take a fresh look at 

ho·w the new objectiYe criteria is irnpat.~ting our st:He 1 locaL and tnbai partnt..~rt'. 

/J. To what exterJt do you agree with the poterm/li benefits of more objecdve 

criteria, the need for clarity in the threshold for eligibiHty, and the need to speed 

the declaration process? 

Increased transparency reganling how FE:\L \ establishes its decisions on a declaration 

rccp..test in any capacity is good custotner service. Increased transparency·~ coupled \Vith 

dear guidance, helps our partners to unJerstand how to hf•tter cotntnunicaw their ne1.:d 

fm supp< n·t and to understand when their capacitv has rrulv been exceeded to respond 

to an ev·ent. lndiYidual ;\ssistancc is designed to help Americans suffering after a 

disaster. A decision to provide (or not) this type of assistance should be made as 

<juick!y as possible so that < >Ur partners understand how to best mmc forward to 

support their citi7ens with or without FE:'IL\ support. Regarding the new objectiYc 

criteria proposed, J'E\L\ needs to work with its partnctl' to lx:ttct undersrand how to 

t•ffccti;·d)· measure a ,;tate's fiscal capacrtv and resource capahility. 

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83 

To what extent do you think PEilfA 's proposed changes «ill help or binder tht• 

lA declaration process? 

1 bclicY<..: that it rn:ty bt.~ too t·arly m tlw p.rnn·:-:;:- ru assc~~ the <..ffcctiYcoess nf thc~t: 

changes; however, if conflrmcd l will eY~luate feedback from our stare and tribal 

p11rrncrs. 

14. Fh"MA has a number of grarJt ptogrums to 11ssi.~t Jocttl fire depttrtments with stalling 

and training resources and ro ensure communities have adequate ptott•ctionlrom fire 

hazards. 

c~. lfconfinned, how n71lyou cnsurt.• th;u FE1l1A, through the U.S. Fire 

Administration and Grullf Progr:mu; Dirt·ctorate, widely disseminMes 

infrJrn1<1tion about gmnt opportunities, so the likelihood of procuring grant 

funding does not depend on <1 dep<~rtment's access to a !idl-time grant writer? 

,\t rhi:< rime 1 have nm lxcn briefed regarding how Hc\L\ curremlr di"eminates 

infnr1nation or providt·~ gran: wrmng support. ff continned, l corntnH to inoking at 

this i":'<:~ue further, 

b. How can FhMA 's U.S. rYrc Administmtion ;md Grant Progr.1ms Dircctor:ue 

better coordirwte with local fire dcp;trtJneJJts to ensure tlu:y b'<'l tilt' grant 

administration trainiilg tlt,:v need? 

,\t this time l have' not been briefed regarding how the Directorate currenth 

coon.hnarcs grrtnt adn1inisrranon U<:1intng< Jf contirtncd, l cc;n1tnir to at rhi~ 

l~~uc further. 

lflhat do xou see ;ts tbc uniqut.' needs ofwJlunteer :md rural fire dtp:utnwnts in 

tlw context of PEiHA 's fire gr:mr progr:tms? 

ff confirrned, 1 wiH \\:ork with the 1 .S. Fire .\t..hnini:-:tr:ltor and assnz:lanon-.., ~u-ch :ts 

1.\FC and the N\'1'<:, to better undc·r,t:md need' and issues. I bdit"'e that volunteer 

and rural fire Hglncrs in mam p:u-rs nf the l"nired States are the backbone of a 

conu11unlty'~ abihry to n .. '~pnnd~ and [ n.'cognizc that dcn1a11th being plact..'d upon thcn1 

arc incrca:->ing. 

15. According to tl1e Pew Clwrit:Iblc Tntb'ts, fiifllre losses arc n·duced by tiS much as $4 for 

crcty $1 tb:It is spent Ofl mitigation, lf!Jwt do you see as the proper role of PE.""lA in 

mitif;(.qfion against disasters, bath m:m-rrwde and natural? 

l hdien' FF\f:\ plars a ,·iwl role that enable' st:ll<:, !neaL and u·ibal pni"tner' to execute their 

sttatL'gK·s for building n:silicncr. l a!so hl'hc\'t' in1plcrncnting cffccti\'l' tnitig;H]on :-;tnnegie~ is a 

'\d1ule C< Jt11n1unit~·'' rc::'pon~ibilir_\, 

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84 

Pre-disaster mltlgation is the key to reducing d1sastet cost and potentia!lo» of life in the long 

tern1 for tnan-tnadc and natural disa..-rers. 

!6. GAO reported last year that tbe U.S. Army Gorps of Engineers and FE!f1A have made 

little progress in implL·menting key national levee-.<ilfe~v activities required in the lf/ater 

Resources Reform imd De•'eiopment Act (W'RRDA) of2014. The Corps has been 

working to develop a nationallt•vee inventory, bm the agencies have taken 110 '1ction 011 

other levee-safeo/ actidties for whicb they are responsible, i11cluding tbe det•elopmem 

of 11ational st;mdards for levee safety and tbe building of state oversight capabilities. 

What "ctions do you beliet•e FEMA should Mke to fimd and implement the levee safeo/ 

program as laid out in tbe 2014 W'RRDA? 

If confirmed. 1 will rniew and en.Iuat.e this issue. 

l ~. What do you liew as FEMA 's role in promoting state, local, and tribal pteparedne.ss, so 

tlwt d1ere are no weak Jinks in our national preparedness for terrorist 'lttacks and 

11atural disasters? 

I agree rhat FFl\l.\ '~role in preparedness is to s(·rvc as the ?\ation\ principal coordinator as 

clearly articulated by statuton authorities and the National Incident :'llanagement System and 

Preparedness (;uidelines. 

1 H. !11 your opi11io11, should tbe federal gorernmem shift more of the /lJJaJJcial responsibility 

for prepan•dness to state ;md local government.~? 

Proper preparedness is a shated "whole community" responsibilin·. 

19. Accordi11g to the .Post-Katrina Emeq,,.tmcy ,lfaJJagemL•nt Reform Act of 2006, the 

Administrator of FEMA is required to have "a demonstrated ability in and knon1edge 

of emergeJJCJ' maJJagenlellt and homeland secudt,Jj "iJJcludi11g at least five ye:<rs of 

executive leadership and management experie11ce. If confirmed, will you commit to 

only recommendi11g to the .Preside11t Regio11al Administrators who meet the sanw 

criteria? 

If confirmed, 1·cs. Regional.\dminisrrarors must be strong communicators and familiar with 

the rcglon)s hazards as \\it'll as all a~pccts of etnergcncy tnana.ge1nenr. ).lost lrnportantlyj the 

Regional. \dministrator should ha1-c a pmrcn track record in cmergenc~· management and be 

respected by our state and tribal parrners. 

20. FE!f1A has one of the old'"~t a11d most outdated fi11a11cial managemeJJt systems in the 

Department of Homeland Securi~v (DHS) ,md is also 1111dergoiJJg a grants managemem 

modernization effort to better integrate nun1erous and fra{f1ne11ted gra11t ma11agement 

systems. Given the amou11t of gra11t dollars that FEMA manages, implemcJJtation of 

these systt·ms will be critical to effectil'e ageJJCJ' oper.uions in the future. 

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85 

"· Jiow ha••e you pursued the implement.uion of these kb1ds of >~}•stems in your 

previous positions? 

.\s the Exccutin· \'icc l'rc,;idcm uf llagcrty Cnnsulring. l indirecrlv worked with chems 

to implement dis:1ster Financial \bnagement Systems w track disaster fumb ;md 

providt• total asset ,·isibiliry. \fost importantly, we helped chents implement systems to 

help them undcrsmnd how to prioflt!Zt' rcco\'cn· proJects based upon cash Onw factors 

and the timing of reeeidng funds from ,·,nious agencies within the fe<kral gm·cmnwnt. 

These systems helped to fullv account for all funds, forecast pr<Jjcct cnmplNion, alert 

for is::ucs anJ problc1ns, and cn"iurc grant con1pliance. 

21. Tbe Nadom1l Flood Insurance Progmm (lVFIP) is a key componcm of tbe fcdcr:ll 

government'.~ efforts to finn't tbe dam.~ge :md financial effect of DoodY. ffowcvcr, it 

Jikc~F will not generate suflidcm revenues to repay tbe billions of dollars borrowt·d to 

cover cl;dms trom HIJrricanc K;ttrina in 2()03, Hurricane Sandy in 2012, or potcnti11l 

claims related to future cat,stropbic losses. 

a. A.re you concerned about tbc long-ft'rm solvL•n<)' o.ftbe NPIPP 

Yes 

b. Wh;lt do you sec as tlw proper b:Jlancc between NFIP solvency and property 

ou7wr affordabili~l'? 

hom the mmide looking m, tt appears that the S\'Stcm is our nf balance in rhis ~rca 

~oln:ncy of the J.ltogran1 i::;. critical ~Hlll 1 bdi{~Yt' it c.an be :H:hicn.·J in a mea~ut-cd wa) 

thilt doesn't caus<.: peopk to lose their pran~1ry hotncs. 

22. The JVFIP is not just an insuraru::c progmm. It is also 11 mitigation, m<tpping, :md 

sound floodpl:lin manageineiJt progmm. How will you ensure that FE!I1A prioritizes 

these <1spects of tbe NFJP to promote Jess risky development <1nd to <'ncoumgc more 

rnitigarioiJ ;1ction bef<Jrc flooding occurs? 

·n,e \: HP program can no longer reward risk b1· writing new business in ntlnemblc areas under 

the <.·xisung bu:-incss fetm<.:work I:E\L\ tnU)'\t work diligently with the private in~urancc 

industry to :n1ap out the bc:-:t Wa} forwarJ for insuring rhe uninsured. If con finned. 1 \vill \l,.'ork 

with the prinnc >ector and FL.\!.\ \:I'll' 'takeholdcrs to cYalu:nc and priorinzc efforts t<, 

rcdu(C nsk Proper tniugation 1:- the foundation of an Ct11l'r~cncy 11\mlagcnH:nt 

2.1 Ple:tsc cApl:;in tbc ilnport<1nce oip<lrtncrsbips nitb non-go•·ennncntHl org:mizations to 

Fh1\1A ~~overall misHion 

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86 

l'iGOs and l'iational Voluntary Organizations .\ctivc in Disastt·r arc the cornerstone for 

supporting ,\rncrica11s unpactcd b~· dlsaster, These organizatiotls arc tard:· bound hy dt.:tatlcd 

regulations, alluwing them to adapt their support in a supplemental manner to goYcrnmcnt 

assist:wn·. If con finned, 1 would also like to cvalunrc how FE.\L \ em bcner private· 

;;c•ctor tirms in a meaningful manner to incrca,;c• the agc:ncie;; staff and technical 

capabi!itie::;. 

24. What role do you believe the pri•·ate sector should play in emergt•nc_y management? 

How C{Jf1 the privilte sector best 11ssist fed1.>ral, stutt•, and Joctd gon•rnnwnt.~ in 

emergenc_v 111ill1ilgenJent, <md what specific steps will you t:tke, if confirn1ed, to foster, 

improve, and/or expand public-pri••flte p11rt11erships? 

1 hclit:n.' thar priYatt.~ sector t.:tncrg:cncy n1anagt·n1erH, cngine,:rlng. accounting. and technolog~ 

finn~ arc the unsung heroc~ wil"hin the etnergency nutnngt.:rrlCn1 conununiry. These firrns are 

often charg<·d bv communities across the country 10 help them understand, implement, and 

follow all FL\1:\ guidance, j)lllicics, and best practice concept>. \lost import:uuh·, many firms 

::ts~il'-r con1n1unitics \vith understanding what they ~1rc entitled to :Ifter a di-.:~ster ~lnd how to 

pr·opcrlv tl:l\·igatc dts:1st<•r polin· while maxirni7ing funds. 

Jf contlnncd, I \'.'ould like t1} inlplctnt·nt an t:ffcctin.· pruct's.~ to proactiYdy in\":itc our priv:1te 

:;ector parmcrs to share ic·edback, ideas, and iB<ncs directly with rhe .\gcncy (l!l a regular basis. 

1 hm·(· fonnJ current processes ro introduce tht.· :\g-enr~ In ne\\' !t·chnoiogy of" alet't them. o( 

i5~ue:- ate not entirely cffccrivt. Private ~ector finns nftt.:n create best practice~ and han.' idea~ 

tn better policic,;, and I bdicn· thnt Hc.\L\ has an nblig:nron ro collect this informarion to hdp 

inform tlw \gene' 's future ,,ff<>rb. 

H.I. Relations with Congrt':sS and the Puhlic 

25. If confim1ed, ho><· will you m:1ke cert11in thM ,vou wilf respond in " timely n1a1111er to 

ltfembcr requests for inlormation? 

Yes. 1 .un cnnuHlttcJ to rt'~ponding in a titnel~ n1~u1ncr and wiU cxpn::'~ tht..' in1portanc<.· of 

rcsponsi,·cnc·ss to the kadcr;;hip \\'ithin the .\gcnc1 

26. If confirnu:d, do you ilgl'l:c without reservation to reply to ;my re{Json:tble request for 

infon11ation frwn the R:mking Aft'mber oft~11y du~v constituted committee oftlw 

Congress? 

Yes. 

27. If confirmed, do you agree without resen:llion to rep~v to :my re:lHOJwble request for 

inlbrmation from menrbcrs of Congress? 

2ft If confirmed, do ,vou commit to t:1ke :1ll reiSOtUJble steps to ensure that you and y·our 

a{[CtlL)' comp~v with de:Jd!itws est{Jblisbed for requested informmion? 

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87 

Yes. 

29. If confirmed, do you commit to protecting subordinate ofiicials or employees [rom 

reprisal or retaliation fi>r any te.itimony, briefings or comnwnications nith members of 

Congress? 

30. J[ confim1ed, will you en~ure that Tour .<mit nill ful~r and prompt~!' pf(J>·idt· in[ormarion 

and access to appropriate documents and offid;~ls in rr:.<ponse to rc·quests m;~d¢• by the 

Govcmment Accountt~bili~v Office (GAO) and the Con!fr<'ssiorml Research Service? 

Yes. 

\1 /[ confirmet4 will you direct your stt~f[ to ful/f <lt1d prompt{v respond to Freedom of 

Information Act requests submitted by the Americ:m people? 

:12. Are these iiTJswers your own? Ha>·e you consulted with DHS or :my other itueresrcd 

p:utiesP lfso, please indicatt' the indi•·idu.1ls or entities with whom you h;we consulted 

und the nawrt· of the a.vsi$t:mcc th<:v prmided. 

Yes, l titke fuil rcsponsibtlity for all responses. ln an effort to be forthright and ,. tu 

the ConHntttt<: 1 I have panldp<ttcd in high kYl'i pre ·Contirn1atiun briefing;-. \vith 

and th(· Dcpar1n1cnr of Honwbnd Sccurit: These consulu.tlons wcr(' gcncraHy used tu lnforrn 

n1y an':'wcr:-: at a \,t.'t}' high le\·{i 

L ~'~: <.w'\ ~oL~""' l""~· ht:reb,· state that I h'"T read the foregotng 

t~uestionrhlirc and Supplen1erH::tl (_)ue~t1onnaircs ~ind thnt the infnrnwrwn prrw1ticJ 

hC'st of 1ny knowlt·dgc, current, ~l.t:curatc, and cornpktt-. 

i..:;, t1t the 

24 
88 

Chairman Ron .Johnson 

Post-Hearing Questions for the Record 

Submitted to Mr. Brock Long 

Nomination of Brock Long to be Administrator, Federal Emergency Management Agency 

U.S. Department of Homeland Security 

Wednesday, June 7, 2017 

As we discussed at your confirmation hearing, last Congress the Committee passed legislation 

known as the Integrated Public Alert and Warning System (IPA WS) that authorizes and 

enhances the public alert warning system. 

Key parts of the law have not been implemented and deadlines have been missed. This includes 

the requirement to create a mandatory training program on how to use the system and to form a 

subcommittee comprised of Federal, state, and local agencies to consider improvements to the 

system. Some have suggested that this shortcoming is due to requirements that fall outside the 

IPA WS Program Management Office and rests in others offices within the Federal Emergency 

Management Agency (FEMA). 

1. If confirmed as Administrator, do you commit to fully implementing IPA WS? 

Issuing timely critical public alerts and warnings is vital to protecting people. If 

confirmed, I commit to gaining a better understanding of the issues confronting 

IP A WS, and to helping the agency comply with all requirements. 

2. How will you coordinate throughout FEMA to ensure that the IPA WS legislation is fully 

implemented? 

If confirmed, I will need to be briefed on all outstanding requirements, and will 

work with FEMA staff and stakeholders to design and execute a corrective action 

path forward so the agency is in compliance with the law. Should I identify 

shortfalls and need support to implement all facets of the program as required, I 

will also inform and work with the Committee to address them. 
89 

Questions for the Record 

Senator Rand Paul 

On the Nomination of Mr. Brock Long to be 

Administrator, Federal Emergency Management Agency 

June 8, 2017 

I. FEMA has historically been resistant to criticisms and needs for change. Last year, I held a 

hearing to assess FEMA's progress. performance. and preparedness, where I highlighted IG 

findings that, despite hundreds of recommendations for reform to the grant programs at 

FEMA, only four permanent changes had been made over the time these recommendations 

had come forward. 1 

a. If confirmed, how will you be responsive to recommendations for improvements 

to FEMA, and what changes will you make to FEMA 's grant programs? 

First, I believe the IG has a critical role in ensuring that the federal 

government protects the tax payer. If confirmed, I will carefully evaluate 

all the IG's recommendations to improve FEMA's grant programs and 

make necessary changes to better the Agency's business processes. 

If confirmed, I will work with staff to fully understand how the agency 

currently administers, tracks, and measures return on investment for all 

pre-disaster and post-disaster grant funds and work with stakeholders on 

any potential changes to ensure FEMA is fully aware of any unintended 

consequences to program changes. 

b. Which recommendations will you prioritize? 

Out of respect for the nomination process, I have not been fully briefed 

regarding the IG findings in regards to recommendations for reforming 

FEMA's grant·programs. If confirmed, I will review and evaluate the findings 

and meet with you and other members of Congress to better understand 

concerns in this area. 

2. FEMA is more than $20 billion in debt because of the National Flood Insurance Program 

(NFIP). In fact, GAO determined that as of March 2017, FEMA owed almost $25 billion to 

the Department of Treasury for money borrowed to pay claims and other expenses, including 

over $1.5 billion that FEMA borrowed following floods in 2016 alone. This year, even as 

FEMA has noted its debt is becoming so large from NFIP borrowing that it is looking to buy 

down the debt, FEMA has also made one of the highest NFIP requests in history. 2 

a. How do you reconcile these, and what will you do to address this problem? 

If confirmed, I would welcome the opportunity to work with Congress to 

transform NFIP into a more sustainable program that minimizes the reliance 

on taxpayers to finance recovery costs from future floods. I realize it will not 

be an easy task to fix the existing business framework and to design a way 

forward to cover new policy holders. 

I believe FEMA should provide the private insurance industry with a 

mechanism to clearly voice their ideas and potential solutions for improving 

NFIP. If confirmed, I would like to quickly engage private insurers to collect 
90 

ideas regarding how the NFIP and Congress can potentially expand the private 

marketplace. 

If confirmed, I would also like to work with Congress to make sure the NFIP is 

consistently reauthorized in a manner that avoids potential disruptions to the 

housing market and to consider options to improve compliance with existing 

mandatory purchase requirements. Additionally, I would like to investigate 

incentives for residents to implement mitigation measures. Finally, we must 

work together to formulate a sound financial structure that helps drive down 

existing debt but in a manner that upholds affordability. 

3. In general, what is your position on federal funding, both pre and post disaster, to state and 

local governments? 

a. What is the proper role of the tederal government in disaster response relative to 

state and local, as well as private stakeholders? 

I believe the federal government plays a vital role in supporting state, local, 

and tribal partners before, during, and after disasters and that it should 

continue to do so while finding ways to help its partners become more selfsufficient. 

b. What are your plans to ensure that federal funds are utilized when necessary, and 

conversely, that federal taxpayers arc not given a bill for services that are more 

appropriately performed by state and local jurisdictions? 

I believe the federal government should bring resources and capabilities in 

response to disasters that states/tribes do not have at their disposal. 

However, the cost of recovery should be shared across all levels of 

government, and while FEMA should play a strong supporting role in 

recovery, state, tribal, and local governments should be in the lead as they 

know best what their communities need. If confirmed, I will work with 

Congress and stakeholders on how to best utilize federal funding. 

c. Please identify any functions currently performed by FEMA that you believe 

could be performed by a state/local government or by a private entity. 

If confirmed, I would like to work with FEMA staff and the Agency's 

partners to identify areas of the collective mission that could be 

performed by state, local, and tribal governments as well as the private 

sector. 

Initially, I believe state, local, and tribal governments should explore 

private consulting to help them navigate FEMA disaster recovery 

programs and manage large grants when impacted by disasters. 

Additionally, I believe there are numerous "off the shelf' information 

technology products that could be utilized to manage disaster grants, 

produce maps, and conduct risk analyses. However, I would need to be 

further briefed on the regulations that may stand in the way of using 

these private capabilities. 
91 

4. According to GAO, FEMA has provided well over $40 billion in homeland security grants 

through the preceding 15 years. 3 All too often, state and local governments are using federal 

dollars to purchase things they would not otherwise, including past examples such as snow 

cone machines and armored vehicles. 

a. Do you believe that the list of allowable costs and equipment is too expansive? 

If confirmed, I will fully review this list and make recommendations for 

refining it. Out of respect for the nomination process, I have not been 

involved or briefed regarding how the list is currently evaluated, expanded, 

or reduced. 

b. How will you approach any future additions or subtractions to the allowable costs 

and equipment lists? 

I believe the list should remain dynamic and be evaluated year to year as 

threats to the country can change, thus changing readiness needs. If 

confirmed, I will work with DHS and FEMA's state, local, and tribal 

partners to understand their needs, but also, how we can collectively 

measure return on investment for grant expenditures. 

1 https :1/www .gpo.gov/fdsys/pkg/CHRG-114shrg21181/pdf/CHRG-114shrg2118l.pdf 2 GA0-17-425, Comprehensive Reform Could Improve Solvency and Enhance Resilience, Apr 27, 2017 

(~://www.gao.gov/products/GA0-17-425) 

3 GA0-16-560T, Progress and Continuing Challenges in National Preparedness Efforts, Aprill2, 2016 

(https://www.gao.gov/products/GA0-16--560T) 
92 

c. What will you do to better prioritize grant funds and ensure that expenditures are 

for the most appropriate and needed acquisitions') 

If confirmed, I must be fully briefed on bow FEMA and DIIS measure 

return on investment. The prioritization of grants involves many factors 

including the frequency of actual disaster events and changing threats. If 

confirmed, I would also be happy to meet with you and other members of 

Congress to understand your ideas. 

5. FEMA has historically been criticized for poor planning and mismanaged priorities. At a 

recent hearing of the House Oversight and Government Affairs Committee, there was a 

discussion of evidence that FEMA officials designated negative publicity-or the 

suppression of negative information prior to the last election-as the number one priority, 

while FEMA's lowest priority (down in "Tier 3") was a case of housing and medical care for 

disabled children. FEMA was asked to stop focusing on political motivations and to instead 

focus on the people. 4 

a. What will you do to recalibrate priorities and prevent such misguided or 

mismanaged priorities from ever happening again anywhere within FEMA? 

If confirmed, saving lives, protecting the Nation, and helping 

communities in the time of their greatest need will be my top priority. 

I will reconfirm this position with FEMA staff and I commit to being 

as transparent as possible about the Agency's actions and direction. 

Disasters do not discriminate, and the agency must diplomatically and 

expeditiously support its partners when called upon. 

6. Last year, GAO found deficiencies in the governance and oversight of the review board 

FEMA created to review its Information Technology (IT) investments, including that the 

board had not fully defined roles and responsibilities of key members, working groups, and 

individuals; and, does not have clearly defined procedures for selecting and overseeing 

investments. It concluded that, as a result, FEMA lacks adequate visibility into and oversight 

ofiT investment decisions and activities. 5 

a. Given these deficiencies, do you believe it was wise for FEMA to move forward 

in requesting funding for, or on the acquisition of new IT investments, and what 

will you do to ensure that the right plans and decisions have been made up to this 

point, prior to encumbering federal dollars improperly or unwisely? 

I believe protecting taxpayer dollars and using them wisely is of upmost 

importance. If confirmed, I will look into this issue and evaluate the best way 

forward. 

7. FEMA has advised its plans to create a new grants management system. However, cost 

savings that will result are thus far prospective, aspirational and unknown. 6 

a. Please advise how this acquisition and program will increase effectiveness and 

save money, and what you will do to ensure such. 

I have not received a full briefing on FEMA's plans to create a new 

grants management system and therefore do not have adequate 

information to answer this question. If confirmed, I will work with staff 

to learn about the proposed system and the potential cost savings 
93 

associated with it. 

8. As I have noted in previous hearings, I have heard concerns that flood maps are not clear 

enough for local officials to make fully informed decisions. 7 

a. What will you do to increase the efficacy and usability ofFEMA's flood maps, 

and ensure better buy-in from communities? 

I believe accurate mapping and analysis is necessary to properly assess 

risks, and the system currently used must be user friendly. If confirmed, I 

will need to be fully briefed by staff regarding how the existing platform is 

designed versus how it should be designed to promote efficacy and 

usability. I would like to explore how we can bring down the cost of 

mapping and analysis by allowing states to seck lower cost "off the shelf' 

mapping solutions that meet industry standards and requirements. 

Driving down the cost of mapping and analysis may reduce fee rates 

necessary to reduce the debt associated with the existing NFIP 

framework. 

b. How will you address community map disputes? 

If confirmed, I need to come up to speed regarding how these disputes are 

currently managed; however, I believe that the Agency must do all it can to 

render timely decisions and diplomatically find common ground in a manner 

that accurately reflects the life safety dangers associated with a policy 

holder's potential flood exposure. 

9. What are your thoughts on the ability for homeowners to satisfy flood coverage requirements 

with private t1ood insurance policies (if approved by a state), to satisfy the mandatory 

purchase requirement under the Flood Disaster Protection Act of 1973? 

While I believe that policy holders should pay rates and fees for insurance that reflect 

their true flood risk, I'm not interested in a reauthorization that would cause 

Americans to lose their homes due to affordability issues. The right balance must be 

struck. I believe J''EMA, Congress, and the private insurance industry must come 

together to fix the existing framework and create a reasonable path forward that 

reduces debt, but allows affordable coverage for existing and new policy holders. 

a. What about other reforms to improve access to otherwise expensive flood 

insurance coverage, such as community bulk plans or high-deductibleplans? 

If confirmed, I would need to come up to speed regarding all sides of 

the issue. I am committed to working with Congress and the insurance 

industry to reauthorize NFIP in a meaningful way that helps the 

program resolve solvency issues. 

4 HOGR Hearing, Oversight of FEMA's Response to the Baton Rouge Flood Disaster: Port II, April 5, 2017 

(https://www. youtube.com/watch ?voEiBv4-dONBM) 5 GA0-16-306, FEMA Needs to Address Management Weaknesses to Improve Its Systems, May 5, 2016. 

(https: I /www.gao.gov/products/GA0-16-}06) 6 FY18 Budget, and FEMA Budget Briefing to HSGAC, May 30, 2017 7 !JltQ>_:liy,t_ww .gpo .gov I fdsvs/pkg/CH RG ·114 shrg21181/pdt I CH RG-114sh rg21181. pdf 
94 

b. Would these help this program financially or improve coverage in your view? 

If confirmed, I will look into various ways to improve coverage and NFIP's 

overall business framework and effectively communicate these to the 

Committee. 

10. Please provide an update on FEMA's efforts to reform its practice of paying legal fees for 

private insurers participating in NFIP-particularly as it pertains to claims denial. What is 

FEMA's long-term plan with regard to government assumption of private legal tees? 

I have not been briefed on FEMA 's policy regarding this issue. If confirmed, I will 

investigate this issue. 

11. On January 12, 2017, FEMA published a Supplemental Advance Notice of Proposed 

Rulemaking (SANPRM) in the Federal Register with a model of an updated Public 

Assistance deductible concept. It was reportedly designed to incentivize greater state 

resilience to future disasters, thereby reducing future disaster costs at all levels nationally. 8 

a. Please advise your plans for this. 

I believe disaster response and recovery costs are a shared responsibility at all 

levels of government. I am aware of the proposed deductible concept. A this 

point I believe that more work needs to be put into the idea as well as more 

outreach to partners to understand whether the concept will ultimately 

reduce disaster costs. 

If confirmed, I would like to work with FEMA's stakeholders, such as the 

National Emergency Management Association, to fully evaluate the merits of 

the program, changes that need to be made, and whether or not the program 

in its entirety is the best way forward. 

12. In FY17, FEMA moved major amounts of money from the DRF to its general operating 

expenses, and even FEMA apparently recognizes that it should not have taken millions of 

dollars from the DRF that it did. 9 

a. Do you believe it appropriate to use DRF funds in this manner? 

I believe that funds should be used efficiently and effectively according the 

rules and regulations that accompany them as set forth by Congress and the 

law. I have not been hriefed regarding this exact issue and cannot answer the 

question at this time. 

b. Please advise your position on moving money under FEMA's control, and what 

you will do to ensure fiscal compliance and accountability in FEMA. 

If confirmed, I will do everything in my power to uphold fiscal compliance 

and accountability. 

13. Not only is the NFIP on GAO's 2017 High Risk list, but the IG recently released the report 

of a major accounting firm who they contracted to audit the NFIP's internal controls for 

financial reporting. As a result of that accounting audit, nine observations relating to internal 
95 

controls and other matters were noticed. These included: internal control deficiencies and 

the need for improvement in calculating written premiums; reviewing paid claims; 

monitoring third party service providers; and recording investments. Though the IG advised 

that ·'these deficiencies were not considered significant", any remediable mismanagement of 

federal spending is of significance. 10 

a. What will you do to remedy these and other related deficiencies? 

IG plays a very important role on behalf of the taxpayer, if confirmed, I will 

evaluate and consider all recommendations and work to make meaningful 

changes to internal FEMA business processes. 

14. FEMA has been criticized for Public Assistance policies which have allowed burdensome 

changes to communities or outright waste. Recent reports include everything from 

permitting schools to completely relocate and purchase new land and facilities they did not 

have before to building many miles outside the locality in which they were located and 

damaged. As a result of practices like that, citizens might have to travel to completely 

separate cities, and local communities or their economies might be devastated by the loss of 

facilities or infrastructure. 

a. What is your position on such usages of Public Assistance funds? 

Each disaster and the communities they impact are unique and I believe that 

local, state, and tribal governments should be in charge of their own disaster 

recovery and that FEMA plays a support role. FEMA should make sure 

Public Assistance funds are allocated and utilized in manner that is compliant 

with all laws and regulations, while allowing local communities to guide how 

they will reach a "new normal" after disaster. 

b. What will you do to improve or change these practices, to mitigate or eliminate 

negative effects? 

Again, I believe that FEMA should be an enabling agency to help local 

communities achieve their recovery goals. If confirmed, I will work to 

support local and state priorities within what the law allows. 

15. Following lltmicane Sandy, the New York City (NYC) Department of Environmental 

Protection received $537.94 million in FEMA Public Assistance grant funds. Despite that it 

8 bl!J2iJ/www.gpo.gov/fdsys/pkg/FR-2017-01·12/pdf/2017-00467.pdf 

9 FEMA Budget Briefing to HSGAC, May 30, 2017 10 01G-17-53, NFIP's Management Letter for DHS' FY16 Financial Statements Audit, May 8, 2017 

{1]~/ /www .oig.dhs.gov /sites/defaul t/files/assets/2017/0!G-17-53-May17. pdf) 
96 

has been over three years since the funded work was completed, the IG recently advised that 

FEMA still had not identified and recovered Federal funds NYC spent on repairs to 

commercial residential properties. The IG found that not only were FEMA's records 

incomplete, but FEMA has no procedures to independently identify commercial residential 

properties NYC had assisted with Federal funds. 11 

a. What will you do to remedy this, and prevent further issues from such systemic 

deficiencies? 

If confirmed, I will look into this issue. I have not been briefed upon 

specific disaster programmatic management issues at this point. 

16. In late 2016, the IG released its report on FEMA's 2014 and 2015 grants and programs. Of 

particular concern, the IG found that of the $1.55 billion disaster relief funds they audited, 

there were $457 million in questionable costs, such as duplicate payments, unsupported 

costs, improper contract costs, and unauthorized expenditures. The 10 concluded that the 

approximately 30 percent questioned-cost rate indicated that FEMA continues to fail at 

adequately managing disaster relief funds. 12 

a. What will you do to remedy this, and prevent further occurrences of waste and 

mismanagement by FEMA? 

If confirmed, I will meet with internal staff as well as the IG to 

understand all sides of the questionable expenditures before 

recommending corrective action remedies. 

17. Last year, GAO found that FEMA and the U.S. Army Corps of Engineers made little 

progress in implementing key national levee-safety-related activities required in the Water 

Resources Reform and Development Act of2014. 13 

a. What will you do to address and remedy this failure? 

If confirmed, I will first meet with internal staff familiar with this issue. 

will also meet with the USACE to understand all side of the issue before 

recommending a way forward that helps both agencies collectively avoid 

similar failures. 

18. There have been complaints from numerous sources that FEMA intervention slows down 

state, local, and private responses because of all the extra bureaucracy, and much of this was 

highlighted with Hurricane Katrina. 14 

a. What are you perceptions regarding this, and what will you do to reduce the 

bureaucracy both, within FEMA, and for disaster response and recovery by State, 

local and private stakeholders? 

If confirmed, I plan to make it a priority to review all business processes 

related to recovery management programs. I believe there are several 

potential solutions for reducing program management complexity that will 

result in less bureaucracy and needless administrative burdens to our 

partners. 

19. If confirmed, what will you do to make FEMA a better place to work; one that is more 

compliant with law, and one that does not retaliate against its own employees for reporting 

unlawful activities to you, the IG, or Congress0 15 
97 

If confirmed, I will first assess how the agency currently responds and addresses 

whistleblower complaints. Whistleblower policies are critical tools for protecting 

staff and external stakeholders who report activities believed to be illegal, dishonest 

or unethical. I plan to review and uphold these policies to the fully extent. 

20. Please advise your positions regarding adjustment of the per capita indicator cost share 

adjustment, given that it has not been adjusted since 1986. 16 

If confirmed, I would like to review the per capita indicators to understand if the 

indicator is truly a clear marker for state capability to deal with disasters in its 

entirety. It is my understanding that the indicators have not been adjusted on an 

annual basis since inception to account for inflation and therefore the indicator 

may be lagging way behind. Despite this, I do not believe that simply raising the 

per capita indicator is the only way to reduce overall federal disaster costs in a 

meaningful manner for the future. 

Based upon data from a House Transportation and Infrastructure Committee 

hearing in 2016, 25% of all disasters cost more than $41.8 million and account for 

93% of federal disaster spending. While raising the per capita indicator may 

reduce the number of disaster declarations, it would most likely not have a 

meaningful cost reduction impact overall since a quarter of the disasters 

experienced each year are typically so far above any realistic or proposed per 

capita limit. 

I believe pre disaster mitigation is the key to reducing future disaster costs. 

11 OIG-17-38-D, FEMA Needs to Improve Its Oversight of the Sheltering and Temporary Essential Power Pilot 

Program, February 10, 2017 (https://www.oig.dhs.gov/sites/default/files/assets/2017/0IG-17-38-D-Feb17.pdf) 12 01G-17-13-D, Summary and Key Findings of Fiscal Year 2015 FEMA Disaster Grant and Program Audits, 

November 29, 2016 (https://www .oig.dhs.gov/sites/ default/files/assets/2017/0IG-17 -13- D-Dec16.pdf) 13 GA0-16-709, Army Corps and FEMA Have Made Little Progress in Carrying Out Required Activities, July 26, 2016 

(1_1..!.\:R.:JLwww.gao.gov /prod ucts/GA0-16-709) 14 Hurricane Katrina: Remembering the Federal Failures, CATO Institute (~/www.cato;..QigLQlQ.glfwrricaneBudget Briefing to HSGAC Staff on May 30, 2017, and Partnership for Public Service ran kings 

(h\tR.:ilQ.e,?JJll accst owork. o rg/BPTWf ran kings/ deta i 1/H S 18) 16 h!tps ://www .fcderalregister.gov/documents/2017/02/01/2017 -02071/notice-of-adjustment~of-statewide-percap!ta-!nd 1cator for -recommending -a-cost -share-adjustment. 
98 

21. Secretary Kelly has mentioned to the Committee in testimony that it might be prudent to at 

least rethink DHS/FEMA grants, going so far as to say "we are in a different .place" today in 

terms of needing federal grants to build capacity at the state and local level. 1 

a. Please provide your perspective on where preparedness (e.g. UASI, etc.) grants fit 

into the larger set of federal priorities, given the significant funds invested since 

9/11. 

I believe grants arc vitally important for helping state/tribal/local 

governments to protect America. Grants should be designed as an initial 

bridge to help communities jump start preparedness initiatives and/or buy 

down risk. I do not believe that federal grants should be used to supplant 

entire programs. If confirmed, I look forward to working with the Secretary 

to maximize and administer all grants in a meaningful format. 

b. How will you measure the effectiveness of these grants? 

If confirmed, I need to understand if and how this is currently being done by 

DHS and FEMA. I'd also like to review the risk formula as well. 

c. Is there any quantitative measure to determine whether these grants are 

successful? 

I have not been briefed regarding quantitative measures actively 

being utilized by DHS or FEMA to measure success. 

d. At what point is it appropriate to reassess our capacity-building posture, given the 

follow-on costs to maintain equipment that the communities must now bear? 

I'm not sure I understand the root of this question. I'm happy to evaluate 

reassessing capacity building posture if confirmed on an annual basis. 
99 

17 HSGAC FY18 DHS Budget Hearing with 51, June 6, 2017. 
100 

Senator Heidi Heitkamp 

Post-Hearing Questions for the Record 

Submitted to Mr. Brock Long 

Nomination of Brock Long to be Administrator, Federal Emergency Management Agency 

U.S. Department of Homeland Security 

Wednesday, June 7, 2017 

I. As you know, the Federal Emergency Management Agency (FEMA) administers grant 

programs to help states prepare for and mitigate potential disasters. By investing in 

mitigation efforts, communities are more resilient and better prepared, which can mean 

significant cost savings to the federal government in future disasters. Unfortunately, the 

President's budget request calls for the elimination or reduction of a number of FEMA 

grants designed to help states prepare for future disasters. 

a. During your nomination hearing, you recognized the importance of investing in 

mitigation. If federal investments in mitigation are reduced, are you concerned 

that communities will have fewer resources to prepare for, respond to, recover 

from, and mitigate against emergencies and disasters? 

I continue to believe mitigation is the foundation of emergency management. 

Mitigation efforts implemented before disasters will ultimately be the key to 

reducing future impacts and disaster recovery costs. 

Currently, FEMA provides a tremendous amount of mitigation funds in the 

post disaster phase to states that receive major disaster declarations. I have 

often felt that offering states mitigation funds after a disaster is a regressive 

approach. In many cases, post disaster mitigation funding offered to states 

impacted by disasters is exponentially higher than existing levels of predisaster mitigation funding. 

I believe that as a community, we need to evaluate how we can budget all 

mitigation funds reserved for Stafford Act 404 and 406 activities for predisaster activities for all state, local, and tribal partners to access. I realize 

this is a significant shift in how the agency structures mitigation funding, but 

doing so would increase opportunities for pre-disaster mitigation and reduce 

some of the complexities of managing disaster recovery. 

Currently, mitigation is a recovery function, rather than a proactive process 

to save lives and reduce impacts to communities. Moving post disaster funds 

into a pre-disaster realm would increase mitigation opportunities for all 

nationwide. 

b. If federal investments in mitigation efforts are reduced, what steps can FEMA 

take to encourage states to continue investments in mitigation efforts? 

In addition to my answer in part (a.) of this question, mitigation must be a 

"Whole Community" effort and cannot completely rely upon federal 
101 

funding. If confirmed, I would like to work with this Committee and state, 

local, and tribal governments to understand how the agency can inccntivizc 

pre-disaster mitigation activities. 

2. In your questionnaire and during your staff interview and hearing, you mentioned your 

interest in embedding multi-disciplined integration teams in state agencies to enhance 

planning, integration, increase customer service, speed up the approval process, and 

double down on communications. 

a. Could you elaborate on the role multi-disciplined integration teams would play at 

FEMA and what steps you would take to imbed teams in state agencies? 

I believe FEMA can provide better customer service to its partners by being 

onsite on a daily basis, and not waiting until the response and recovery phase 

to work side by side with its partners. If confirmed, I would first work with 

our state and tribal partners to design a scaled team concept that can 

support all facets of pre-disaster technical assistance needs, and initial 

response and recovery liaison support. For example, I would like to explore 

the possibility of a pilot program that would move existing staff out of 

headquarters and regional offices into state and tribal emergency 

management agencies to support active emergency operations planning, 

training, and exercise efforts and to expedite mitigation plan approval 

processes. I would also like this team to provide response and recovery 

technical expertise onsite to help with both pre-disaster plan development, 

and real-time operational support should the partner agency be impacted by 

a disaster. 

3. The National Flood Insurance Program (NFIP) has failed to generate sufficient revenues 

to repay the billions of dollars borrowed from the Department of the Treasury to cover 

claims from the 2005 and 2012 hurricanes, and it is unlikely that sufficient revenues will 

be generated to cover potential claims related to future catastrophic losses. As a result, 

some have called for a private sector option for flood insurance. 

a. Could you elaborate on the steps you would take to address the solvency of the 

NFIP and what role, if any, private flood insurance would play in this effort? 

If confirmed, I would like the opportunity to work with Congress to 

transform the NFIP into a more solvent program that minimizes the reliance 

on taxpayers to finance the recovery from future floods. NFIP needs a sound 

financial structure that drives down existing debt in a manner that upholds 

affordability. 

I believe FEMA should provide the private insurance industry with a 

mechanism to clearly voice their ideas and potential solutions for improving 

NFIP. If confirmed, I would like to quickly engage private insurers to collect 

ideas regarding how the NFIP and Congress can potentially expand the 

private marketplace. 
102 

If confirmed, I would also like to work with Congress to make sure NFIP is 

consistently reauthorized in a manner that avoids potential disruptions to the 

housing market and to consider options to improve compliance with existing 

mandatory purchase requirements. Additionally, I would like to investigate 

incentives for residents to implement mitigation measures. Finally, we must 

work together to formulate a sound financial structure that helps drive down 

existing debt in a manner that upholds affordability. 

4. The NFIP developed its flood mapping and rating methods in the 1970s and 1980s. In 

order to continue meeting the growing challenges, those systems need to be modernized 

and brought into the 21st century. 

a. Will you provide the new NFIP administrator the full support and resources he or 

she needs to get the job done? 

If confirmed, yes. 
103 

Senator Gary Peters 

Post-Hearing Questions for the Record 

Submitted to Mr. Brock Long 

Nomination of Brock Long to be Administrator, Federal Emergency Management Agency 

U.S. Department of Homeland Security 

Wednesday, June 7, 2017 

1. You may know that Michigan has the longest freshwater coastline in the United States. 

As a result, my constituents are particularly affected by flood risk mapping and the costs 

of flood insurance premiums. For example, one of my constituents in Clay Township in 

St. Clair County, Michigan pays $2794 for his annual flood insurance premium for a 

$300,000 home. I am concerned that the President is proposing to add a surcharge for 

mapping flood risks and a surcharge to pay down the NFIP debt, which will be added to 

flood premiums. While I am also concerned about the $24.6 billion debt of the program 

and plan to support reforms that will address it. I do not agree that we should shift the 

cost of mapping from all taxpayers to just policyholders because these maps are used by a 

wide range of public and private stakeholders. What are your plans for getting NFJP on a 

sound financially footing while not drastically increasing premiums for policy holders? 

Do you think it is fair to place the entire burden of flood mapping on policy holders when 

maps are used by public and private stakeholders alike? Do you believe that surcharges 

are a sustainable way to raise funds for mapping or to pay down the debt? 

If confirmed, I would like the opportunity to work with Congress to transform NFIP 

into a more sustainable program that minimizes the reliance on taxpayers to finance 

the recovery from future floods. I realize it will not be an easy task to fix the 

existing business framework and design a way forward to cover new policy holders. 

While I believe that policy holders premiums should be reflective of their true flood 

risk, I would not support a reauthorization that would cause Americans to lose their 

homes due to affordability issues. We must work together to strike the right 

balance. I believe that FEMA, Congress, and the private insurance industry must 

come together to fix the existing framework and create a reasonable path forward. 

Regarding flood plain mapping, I would like to explore how we can bring down the 

cost of mapping and analysis by allowing states to seck lower cost "off the shelr' 

mapping solutions that meet industry standards and requirements. Driving down 

the cost of mapping and analysis may reduce fee rates necessary to reduce the debt 

associated with the existing NFIP framework. 

Regarding surcharges, I'm not fully familiar with the existing or proposed structure 

and would need to further explore the issue, if confirmed. 

2. In June 2016, DHS's Office of the Inspector General released a report that found that 

Disaster Recovery Centers were not properly handling Personally Identifiable 

Information (PI!) as Federal guidelines require. The report also found that some FEMA 

officials are not fully aware of Federal privacy standards and that FEMA management 
104 

lacks an effective method to track employee compliance with privacy training. I 

understand that FE:V!A is still working on closing out the recommendations in the GAO 

report. What arc your plans to ensure that GAO's reco111111endations are fully 

implemented and that FEMA takes appropriate steps to protect the privacy of those 

relying on the agency for help'' Will you agree to update me on the steps you implement 

to ensure that I'll is protected? 

If confirmed, I will review the GAO report and recommendations. I believe FEMA 

must do all that it can to ensure PII is properly protected and if confirmed, I will 

update the Committee on the steps the agency is taking. 
105 

Written Statement of Senator Burr 

Nomination Hearing to Consider Brock Long to be Administrator, Federal Emergency 

Management Agency, U.S. Department of Homeland Security; Russell Vought to be 

Deputy Director, Office of Management and Budget; and Neomi Rao to be Administrator, 

Office of Information and Regulatory Affairs, Office of Management and Budget. 

June7,2017 

Chairman Johnson, Ranking Member McCaskill, members of the Senate Committee on 

Homeland Security and Governmental Affairs, and other distinguished guests, I'm pleased to 

appear before this committee to voice my strong support for and introduce my fellow North 

Carolinian William B. "Brock" Long as the nominee to be Administrator of the Federal 

Emergency Management Agency (FEMA). I believe that after careful examination that this 

Committee will come to the same conclusion as l have that he is an exceptional nominee. 

Mr. Long has had a distinguished career in emergency management in both the public and 

private sector. He attended Appalachian State University in Boone, North Carolina, where he 

earned both his undergraduate and graduate degrees. 

Following completion of his academic work, Mr. Long worked for the Georgia Emergency 

Management Agency where he served as the statewide school safety coordinator. After his 

tenure in Georgia, he continued his emergency management work with FEMA Region IV in 

Atlanta. While at FEMA, Mr. Long was a Regional Hurricane Program Manager and Hurricane 

and Evacuation Liaison Team Leader. 

After leaving FEMA, Mr. Long was selected by Governor Bob Riley of Alabama to serve as 

Director of Alabama's Emergency Management Agency. Mr. Long served in that position from 

2007 to 20 II, where he led the state • s eff01is to respond to 14 disasters. including eight 

presidentially declared events. Mr. Long was charged with leading the state· s response to the 

Deepwater Horizon oil spill in 2009. 

More recently, Mr. Long has worked as Executive Vice President at Hagerty Consulting where 

he provides emergency management advice and expertise to the firm· s clients. Mr. Long has also 

served as the private sector chairman for the National Emergency Management Association and 

as board member for the Central United States Earthquake Consortium. 

Let me again reiterate my support for Brock Long and thank him for being here today and his 

willingness to serve his country in this important role. I hope the committee will agree with me 

that that this a well-qualified nominee and he will be confirmed swiftly as the Administrator of 

the Federal Emergency Management Agency. 

Thank you. 
106 

Alabama Association of Emergency Managers 

May 10,2017 

Honorable Ron Johnson 

Chainnan, Committee on Homeland Security and Government Affairs 

U.S. Senate 

340 Dirksen Senate Office Building 

Washington, D.C. 205!0 

Honorable Claire McCaskill 

Ranking Member, Committee on Homeland Security and Governmental Affairs 

U.S. Senate 

340 Dirksen Senate Office Building 

Washington D.C. 20510 

Dear Chairman Johnson and Senator McCaskill, 

The Alabama Association of Emergency Mangers is very pleased to let you know of our support for Brock 

Long as the next Administrator of the Federal Emergency Management Agency (FEMA). His long and 

commendable experience in emergency management at the tederal, state and local levels will serve the 

nation well. 

Brock Long's distinct and straightforward leadership style as Alabama's Director of Emergency 

Management was clearly demonstrated through eight Presidential Declarations and as the On-Scene State 

Incident Commander for the Alabama Unilied Command Deepwater Horizon Oil Spill. Brock 

Long's sole mission is to save lives and assist the citizens in 

As the state association of emergency management professionals we are deeply committed to preparing and 

ensuring our citizens are prepared for future threats and disasters. We are pleased that an experienced and 

nationally recognized emergency management is being nominated by President Trump to lead 

this nation's emergency management agency. leadership, technical knowledge, practical skills and 

strong emergency management experience will lead this nation's largest emergency response agency. 

lt is my honor to provide the support of the Alabama Association of Emergency Managers for the 

nomination of Brock Long as the FEMA Administrator. With hurricane season just around the comer, we 

respectfully urge a speedy confirmation of Brock Long as the FEMA Administrator. 

Sincerely, 

Jonathan Gaddy 

President 

100 N. Jackson Street " Montgomery, Ala. 36104 

(334) 263-7594 • Fax (334) 263-7678 • www.aaem.us 
107 

June 14, 2017 

The Honorable Ron ,Johnson 

Chairman 

Committee on Homeland 

340 Dirksen Senate Office 

Washington, D.C. 20510 

The Honorable Claire McCaskill 

Ranking Member 

and Go,·ernmental Affairs 

Committee on Homeland Security and Governmental Affairs 

340 Dirksen Senate Office Building 

Washington, D.C. 20510 

Dear Chairman Johnson and Ranking Member McCaskill: 

Office of the President and 

Chief Executive Officer 

National He<!dquaners 

430 17th N.W. 

Washington, 20006 

It is my pleasure to represent the American Red Cross in supporting President Trump's 

nomination of Mr. Brock Long to serve as the Administrator of the Federal Emergency 

Management Agency (FEMA). 

The Red Cross works closely with FEMA, state and local emergency management 

to carry out the mandates of our Congressional Charter and our core mission to 

human suffering in the face of emergencies. We have worked extremely well 

with Mr. Long for many years - not only in his capacity as the Director of the Alahama 

Emergency Management Agency (AEMA), but also in his earlier service as FEMA's 

Regional Hurricane and when he began his career as a School Safety 

Coordinator in Georgia. am enthusiastic about the possibilities of now working 'Nith 

him on a national level as the FEMA Administrator. 

Mr. Long has a proven history in public safety and meets the skill and experience 

requirements for FEMA Administrator as prescribed in the Post Katrina Emergency 

Management Reform Act (PKREMA). Throughout his career he has been involved in 

numerous disaster response operations. During his tenure as the Director of AEMA, he 

provided executive leadership in 14 disasters, 8 of which were Presidentially declared. 

He also sen·ed as the State Incident Commander for Alabama Unified Command in 

response to the Deepwater Horizon Oil Spill. 

Additionally, Mr. Long has a private sector background. He understands the 

importance of public-private partnerships and will encourage greater integration of the 

private sector into disaster response and recovery given the vast amount of resources 

and expertise that can be brought to bear - oftentimes beyond that of government. His 

established relationships with state and local partners will be critical in helping FEMA 

effectively fulfill its mission of providing federal assistance when needed. 
108 

Mr. Brock Long is a regarded management professional. The 

American Red Cross in support nomination and encourages Congress to 

confirm him as FEMA Administrator as swiftly as possible. If you have any questions, 

please do not hesitate to reach out to me or to the American Red Cross Government 

Relations unit. 

Sincerely, 

Gail .J. McGo,·ern 
109 

May 17, 2017 

The Honorable Ron Johnson 

Chairman, Committee on Homeland Security and Governmental Affairs 

Dirksen Senate Office Building 340 

Washington, DC 20510 

The Honorable Claire McCaskill 

Ranking Member, Committee on Homeland Security and Governmental Affairs 

Dirksen Senate Office Building 340 

Washington, DC 20510 

Dear Chairman Johnson and Ranking Member McCaskill: 

IAEM Headquarters 

201 Park Washington Court 

Falls Church, VA 

22046-4527 USA 

Ph. 703-538·1795 

Fax 703-241-5603 

E-mai!iaem.com 

www.iaem.com 

www.EMEX.org 

The U.S. Council of the International Association of Emergency Managers (IAEM-USA), the nation's 

largest emergency management professional association with approximately 5,000 members across the 

country, is pleased to strongly support the nomination of Brock Long to be Administrator of the Federal 

Emergency Management Agency (FEMA). IAEM-USA represents THE profession dedicated to protecting 

America's local communities from all hazards and threats, natural and man-made. 

Mr. Long brings extensive leadership experience assisting and supporting local, state, and federal 

governments with building robust emergency management and public health preparedness programs. 

His areas of expertise include strategic planning, exercise, evacuation, public safety, school safety, 

recovery management, and response logistics. Throughout his career, Mr. Long has managed the 

response to numerous natural disasters, including eight presidentially-declared events. As Director of 

Alabama's Emergency Management Agency, he developed Alabama's response to the H1N1 influenza 

and served as the on-scene State Incident Commander for the Alabama Unified Command during the 

Deepwater Horizon oil spill. 

Of great importance to IAEM-USA, Mr. Long recognizes the value of all the emergency preparedness, 

response, and mitigation grants administered by FEMA. In addition, he has the statutorily-mandated 

experience and credentials required under the Post Katrina Emergency Management Reform Act for a 

FEMA Administrator, and he understands and respects the role of FEMA as a partner with state and local 

stokeholders. 

Mr. Long has built his career in helping local, state, and federal governments prepare for, protect 

against, respond to, recover from, and mitigate our nation's natural and man-made disasters. 

Therefore, we strongly believe Mr. Long's experience qualifies him to be confirmed as Administrator of 

FEMA, and IAEM-USA urges a speedy confirmation. 

Sincerely, 

J)~d~d 

La nita Lloyd 

President, International Association of Emergency Managers 
110 

June 5, 2017 

The Honomble Ron Johnson 

Chairman 

Committee on Homeland Security 

and Governmental Affairs 

United States Senate 

Washington, DC 20510 

Dear Chairman Johnson and Senator McCaskill: 

The Honorable Claire McCaskill 

Ranking Member 

Committee on Homeland Security 

and Governmental Affairs 

United States Senate 

Washinf,>ton, DC 20510 

On behalf of the nearly 12,000 fire and emergency service leaders of the International Association of Fire 

Chiefs (IAFC), I express our support for the nomination of Mr. Brock Long to be Administrator of the 

Federal Emergency Management Agency (FEMA). Mr. Long is an experienced emergency manager, who we 

believe would be well-qualified to lead FEMA. 

Mr. Long has more than 16 years of experience in the tield of emergency management, including serving as 

the director of the Alabama's Emergency Management Agency (AEMA) from 2008-2011. As the AEMA 

Director, Mr. Long served as the state coordinating officer for 14 disasters and served as the state incident 

commander during the Deepwater Horizon spill. He also has previous experience working at FEMA as a 

regional hurricane planner and response team leader. 

Mr. Long has demonstrated experience in responding to all-hazards. Besides his roles in planning for 

hurricanes, he also has experience in planning for school and response to complex coordinated attacks. 

He also has worked with jurisdictions covered by the Urban Security Initiative to develop multijurisdictional, all-hazard evacuation plans. In addition, Mr. Long is a graduate of the Executive Leadership 

Program at the U.S. Naval Postgraduate School's Center for Homeland Defense and Security. 

The 1AFC looks forward to working with the committee to ensure that Mr. Long's nomination is considered 

in a timely manner. As the nation prepares to respond to an escalating number of natural and human-made 

threats, it is important that FEMA is led by someone with Mr. Long's experience. He understands the 

importance of building up morale at FEMA and developing a trained and experienced core of disaster 

management experts within the FEMA staff. He also understands the roles of federal, state and local 

communities during a major disaster and how they should work together for an effective response. America's 

fire and emergency service arc on the front !inc of disaster response, and we know the importance of having 

a nominee with Mr. Long's experience leading FEMA. 

: kpl 
111 

Testimony of Russell T. Vought 

To Be Deputy Director, Office of Management and Budget 

June 7, 2017 

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I want to thank you, the Ranking Member, and the Members of this 

Committee for the honor of appearing before this committee. 

1 also want to thank and introduce my family who has endured this process with me and the long hours 

that come with serving one's country in public roles. My wife, Mary, is here, and my daughters Ella and 

Porter. .. if you can't see them it's because they are coloring on the floor ... I'm also thrilled that my sisters 

and many friends could be here in support. 

It is a joy to "come home" to the United States Senate. I worked the first four years of my career in this 

distinguished body, mostly for Senator Phil Gramm. I spent hours on the Senate floor, in committee, and 

at my desk, learning how the Senate works its will with great deliberation. How an institution protects 

the rights of a Minority to be heard, and how statesmen ought to debate their colleagues to move votes 

and shape public opinion. And it was here that I developed a love for public policy, seeing how it could 

be used to help the people of this country live freer and more prosperous lives. 

It is an honor to be nominated to serve as the Deputy Director of the Office of Management and Budget. 

It is a very important job, and I am humbled that President Trump and Director Mulvaney asked me to 

serve. I know the quality oft he men and women who have served previously in this particular role, and I 

want to join and contribute to that long line of distinguished public service. 

My career has readied me for this moment. I spent over 12 years working in the House and Senate, with 

a specific emphasis in budget policy. I was the Republican Study Committee's Budget Director, writing its 

budget resolutions. I then served as the Executive Director and the Policy Director of the House 

Republican Conference under then-chairman Mike Pence. All of these roles afforded me an opportunity 

to handle a wide range of policy issues and manage policy development processes that ensured a wide 

variety of viewpoints shaped a final policy proposal. That is very much the job of the Deputy Director of 

OM B ... to build and further a policy process that ensures that the President and his advisors receive the 

best analysis possible and that everyone is heard so that the best decision can be made. 

I also have experience managing a large organization. I spent the last seven years managing many 

aspects of Heritage Action for America, including staff and 17,000 volunteers across the country. 

Volunteers are in fact volunteers. They have their own viewpoints and ideas, and you don't get very far 

working with them if you don't have an appreciation for them as leaders in their own right. That 

experience has prepared me well for managing the men and women of OMB, who are career experts in 

their fields and have years of institutional knowledge for this Administration to draw upon. 

As for the job to be done, it is immense. Our country faces a $20 trillion national debt. It will eventually 

wreck our country if not addressed. That burden will fall on my children and grandchildren iftoday's 

policy makers do not change the current trajectory of spending. It will mean a lower standard of living 

for them and less time for the truly important things in life as more and more oft heir salary is consumed 

by government. Theirfamilies and communities will be weaker, and they may be the first generation 

that gets a worse deal than their parents. That is not the American way. 
112 

1 have spent my entire career caring about taxpayers and their families. I have fought to save them 

money and ensure that their tax dollars were spent well. I come from a blue collar family. I'm the son of 

an electrician and a school teacher. I know what they went through to balance their budget and save for 

the future. My parents worked really long hours to put me through school. But they also worked long 

hours to pay for the government in their lives, and I often have wondered what they would have been 

free to build and give without such a high burden. My old boss called them the wagon-pullers in our 

country. Others have referred to them as the country's forgotten men and women. They have always 

been my test for federal spending. Did a particular program or spending increase help the nameless 

wagon pullers across our country, working hard at their job, trying to provide for their family and future, 

without the luxury of watching CSPAN to know that we might be increasing their burden at that very 

moment? How would they vote? Yay or nay? I believe that as a country we have too often failed that 

simple test, and it is the reason that we face a $20 trillion debt that needs to be dealt with. If the Senate 

confirms me, I am ready to take up that work again. 

Thank you for considering my nomination, and I look forward to answering your questions. 
113 

REDACTED 

HSGAC BIOGRAPHICAL QUESTIONS FOR 

EXECUTIVE NOMINEES 

1. Basic Biographical Information 

Please provide the following information. 

" 

1 
114 

1!176 Mount Vernon, NY 

Never Married Married Separated Annulled Divorced Widowed 

0 X 0 0 0 0 

estimate) 

E" Ell 

Mary Grace Maclean X 1111981 0 OJ/08 0 

Est Est 

0 a 

2 
115 

L---~-----T-----rl -~ I 

L---~-------"L-------~----------......1----~ 

2. Education 

List all pust-sccondary schouls attended. 

~--~-~ 

~~ ! Pate Ended I TypcofScl&ool Date B•gliil . School I Date (vocntionnlltechnicnlltrnde school, 

,,, .. , !..__" .... 1 ··- Awarded collegcluniversitylmilitnty college,. (month/year) box if <'Siimnlc) / School correspondencc!distnnCC:cxlenslonlonlme (ch"':k box if (check "presenl".box school) esltmnte) ifstill in school) 

The George Law Esl Est l'n:s1:n1 

09/00 0 05/04 0 0 Washington JD 5/23104 

University 

Law School 

Wheaton "college ES! )'reunt 

09/94 E•t 05198 c College " BA 8/31198 I 0 

I 

l 

. j J 

3 
116 

3. Employment 

(A) List all of your employment activities, including unemployment and self-employment. 

If the employment activity was military duty, list separate employment activity periods to 

show each change of military duty station. Do not list employment before your 18th 

birthday unless to provide a minimum of two years of employment history. 

I:£Rc !lf Etnl!IQl:tnC!!I 

(Active Military Dot)i Stntion, ~ 

Notional Ounrd!Reserve, E!!!l!lovritent 

US PHS Commissioned Corps, Date Ended 

Other Fedi:rnl employment, NnmeofYour M2stRecent ~ Etn!!IOJ:merit (month/year) State Government (Non- Employer/ Position (City and Began (check bnx 1f 

Fcderol Employment), Self- Assigned Dutv Title/Rnnk State only) (month/year) estimate) 

cmploy~.<:nt, Unemployment, Station (ch«:k box if (check Federal Contractor, Non- cstimntc) '

1

prescntt• box 

Goventment Employrilent if still 

(excluding sclf-employmcnl), employed) Other 

Other l'cderal Employment Office of 

Mnnagement Beachhead Wnshington, ESI 

Est ,, and Budget Team Member! DC 1117 n l'rul.'ntX 

Senior Advisor 

Non-Federal Employment Heritage Action Vice President, Wa~hington, £U t•t 

for America Grassroots DC 08!10 " 01117 

Outreach & 

Policy 

Initiatives 

Other l'cderal Employment House Policy Director Washington, 01/09 (It F.$\ 

Republican DC 07110 n 

Conference 

Other Federal Employment Republican Executive Washington, 05104 Es! Est 

Study Director DC X 12108 

Committee 

Other Federal Employment Rep,Jeb Policy Director Washington, 02103 Est 12/06 Est 

Hensarling DC " ,, 

Other Federal Employment Senator Chuck Legislative WashLngton, 09/02- I:. I 01103 Est 

Hagel Assistant DC X ~ 

Other Federal Employment Senator Phil Legislative Washington, Oli99 08/02 E>l 

Gramm Assistant DC ' 

Other Federal Employment Senator Dan Staff Assistant \Vashington, 07198 Est 12198 

Coats DC 

Non-Federal Employment B. Dalton N/A Washington, 09!98 12/98 E<t 

Bookseller DC X 

Other Federal Employment Rep. Chris Intern Washington, 05/98 07i98 EH 

Shays DC X 

4 
117 

Non·Fcderal Employment Deerfoot Lodge Section Chief Speculator, 06/94· 97 08194·97 

NY (Summers) 

Non-Federal Employment Safe and Sound NIA Wheaton, IL 09197 Est 05198 Est 

Security 

(B) List any advisory, consultative, honorary or other part-time service or positions with 

federal, state, or local governments, not listed elsewhere. 

None 

I Name of Government 

J Entity 

Name of Position Began (month'ycar)(chcck box 

(month'ycar) if estimate) (check 

(check box if •present" box if still 

estimate) serving) 

Date Service Date Service En de~· 

1 E~t ~ .. - ....... ~t'timcnt 

~-+-----==±_-~ - .: ·~~~ 

I 

4. Potential 

----~±~ Conflict of Interest 

(A) Describe any business relationship, dealing or financial transaction which you have had 

during the last 10 years, whether for yourself, on behalf of a client, or acting as an agent, 

that could in any way constitute or result in a possible conflict of interest in the position to 

which you have been nominated. 

None 

(B) Describe any activity during the past 10 years in which you have engaged for the 

purpose of directly or indirectly influencing the passage, defeat or modification of any 

legislation or affecting the administration or execution of Jaw or public policy, other than 

while in a federal government capacity. 

Although I was not a registered federal lobbyist, I spent 7 years engaged in grassroots lobbying 

at Heritage Action for America for the purpose of directly influencing the passage, defeat, and 

modification of a wide array of legislation, based on the research of The Heritage Foundation. 

5. Honors and Awards 

5 
118 

List all scholarships, fellowships, honorary degrees, civilian service citations, military 

medals, academic or professional honors, honorary society memberships and any other 

special recognition for outstanding service or achievement. 

The Heritage Foundation Leadership Development Program, 2016 

Lincoln Fellowship, The Claremont Institute, 2011 

Kingsmeo Alumni Award, 2007 

6. Memberships 

List all memberships that you have held in professional, social, business, fraternal, 

scholarly, civic, or t:haritable organizations in the last 10 years. 

Unless relevant to your nomination, you do NOT need to include memberships in 

charitable organizations available to the public as a result of a tax dedudible donation of 

$1,000 or less, Parent-Tca~:her Associations or other organizations connected to schools 

attended by your children, athletic clubs or teams, automobile support organizations (such 

as AAA), discounts clubs (such as Groupon or Sam's Club), or affinity 

membershipsfconsumer clubs (such as frequent flyer memberships). 

- - Name of Organization Dntes of Your Mcmberslllf! I Held (You muy npprrixlmnte.) 

Cherrydale Baptist Church 20!1-Present Elder, Deucon, Member 

Capitol Hill Baptist Church 2002-20!! Member 

' 

6 
119 

7. Political Activity 

(A) Have you ever been a candidate for or been elected or appointed to a political office? 

No. 

~ Ycnr(s} Election 

Nnme of Office Elccted/AJ!flOintedl Held or Term of Service 

Candldnte Onlv Al!!JOlntment (if appllcnble) 

Maile 

(B) List any offices held in or services rendered to 11 politico! porty or election 

committee during the last ten yeors that you hove not listed elsewhere. 

Nnme of ParQ:/Eiectlon Office/Services Rendered , ResRonsibllitles I Committee ~ 

Service .. 

I 

I 

l 

I 

7 
120 

(C) Itemize all individual political contributions of $200 or more that you have made in the 

past five years to any individual, campaign organization, political party, political action 

committee, or similar entity. Please list each individual contribution and not the total 

amount contributed to the person or entity during the year. 

Name of Recipient ill!!!!!!!.t. Year of Contri~ution 

~--·-------·· - j 

Cordasco for De1egote 

Cordasco for James City Supervisor $200 ·~-t"" ' 2015 

Scalley for Delegate i~4 

Mike lee (via Senate Conservative Fund) $100 2015 

I 

I 

I 

--

- ! -

r-----------------------~-----------~-------1--------------

8 
121 

8. Publications and Speeches 

(A) List the titles, publishers and dates of books, articles, reports or other published 

materials that you have written, including articles published on the Internet. Please provide 

the Committee with copies of all listed publications. In lieu of hard copies, electronic copies 

can be provided via e-mail or other digital format. 

- Title Publisher t Dnte(s} of Publiention 

House Republicans Need a Bold Redstate 812.'10 

Spending Proposal 

--- Time to Go After Democrats on i Redstate 813/10 1 

Repeal ofObamacare ; 

I - "Historic" and "Bipartisan" Redstate 8i91l0 

·~ Normally Means It's Bad 

Walt Minnick is Not Willing to Redstatc 819/10 

Repeal Obamacarc 

! I 

Senate Republicans Gelling Played Redstatc 18116110 

I 

on the Russian-Friendly Strategic 

~ Arms Treaty 

Congress Needs Reforms, but 1 Rcdstate 9i6110 

Committees Don't Need More i 

Power 

-----------l Only 31 House Democrats Willing Redstnte 9:16110 

to Offer Soft Support for Small 

Businesses 

Who Dares to be the Next Rcdstntc 9!16il0 

Democrat Defection on Obnmacare 

Repeal? 

Senator Bob Corker, Unacceptable Redstnle 9117110 

Idaho Congressman Misleads Redstate t 9i29110 

Constituents on Repeal. .. Again : 

! 

It's Time to Make GOP Leadership Redstate 8/26110 

Less Powerful 

Mike Pence is Ready for the Next Redstnte 1113/10 

Fight 

9 
122 

Senate Republicans Must Not Use Redstate 12/1/10 

National Security as a Bargaining 

Chit 

Bowles-Simpson is a Massive Tax Rcdstate 12/2110 

Hike 

Stop Start: Whip List Redstnte 12/3/10 

Senate Republicans and the Lost Redstnte 12/6/10 

Art of Negotiation 

House Rules Package is a Nice First Redstate 12/30110 

Step to Control Spending 

The Return of the Lunch Bunch Redstate 1/19111 

YouCut Can't Cut $100 Billion? Rcdstate !131111 

House Republicans Attempt to Rcdstate 217/11 

Extend "Stimulus" Trade Benefits 

How House leadership Can Fix Redstate 219111 

Their Mess 

Movement Towards $100 Billion, Redstole 21!01!1 

But Not There Yet 

Parsing the Pledge, House Rcdstate 2/10111 

leadership Still Not Compliant 

Speaker Boehner Throws Down the Redstate 2118/ll 

Gauntlet 

House Leadership Let Obamncnre Redstate 3/9/ll 

E.~pansion Pass 

Rep. Tim Huelskamp Stands Tall in Redstate 3/12111 

Budget Showdown 

The Problem with One Last Vote Redstate 3114/ll 

for Flawed Strategy 

This is What Leadership Looks Rcdstate 31i5/ll 

Like 

The Strategy of Short· Tenn CR Redstate 3116/11 

Opponents: A Response to Keith 

Hennessey 

10 
123 

Stop the Natural Gas Streaker Redstate 5111/11 

Corporate Welfare Gets New Life Redstate 7/5111 

in the House 

Message to RSC Members: Get1n Redstate 7127111 

or Get Out 

House Republicans Ram Highway Redstate 9/13/11 

Bill Through Without a Roll Call 

Vote 

Darrell lssn and the Ongoing Fight Redstnte 9/14/11 

Against Postal Bailouts 

The Crusade to Cave Redstnte 9115111 

Reid Goes Nuclear to Block the Redstate !016111 

President's Stimulus Plan 

Debunking the Election Myths of Redstate 12/6111 

the Republican Establishment 

Ramesh l'onnuru Moves the Goal Rcdstnte 1217111 

Posts 

House Conservatives Need to Block Redstate l/30112 

the Coming Highway Bailout 

Why Every House Conservative Redstate 2114/11 

Should Oppose the Highway Bill 

Incrementalism Doesn 'l Work for Redstate 7/12112 

the Right, Look at the Food Stamp 

Bill 

Our Daughter was Born with Cystic Daily Signal 7130114 

Fibrosis, We Can 'tlmagine Life 

Without Her 

Wheaton College and the Resurgent 1/17/16 

Preservation of Theological Clarity 

(B) List any formal speeches you have delivered during the last five years and provide the 

Committee with copies of those speeches relevant to the position for which you have been 

nominated." Include any testimony to Congress or any other legislative or administrative 

body. These Items can be provided electronically via e-mail or other digital format. 

I Tltlefl'opic l . Place/Audience 

11 

i 
124 

Building Dedicated Leaders with Sentinel Summit, Atlanta, GA 11113/14 

Relentless Optimism 

Untitled Opening Comments Sentinel Summit, Greenville, SC 9119/15 

(transcript lost) 

Statesmanship nt the Local Level; Sentinel Summit, San Antonio, TX 11118/16 

The Sentinel Program 

I 

I 

(C) List all speeches and testimony you have delivered in the past ten years, except for 

those the text of which you arc providing to the Committee. 

Title Pl•£e1Audl£1J£g Date(s} of SJ!eech 

Know, Grow, Go Values Voter Summit 12122/11 

Kingsmen Alumni A ward Trumbuii,CT 12/5/07 

Acceptance 

12 

I 
125 

i 

i 

: 

! 

i • 

l 

i 

9. Criminal History 

Since (and including) your 18u' birthday, has any of the following happened? 

Have you been issued a summons, citation, or ticket to appear in court in a criminal proceeding against you? 

(Exclude citations involving traffic infractions where the fine was less than $300 and did not include alcohol or 

drugs.) 

No 

Have you been arrested by any police officer, sheriff, marshal or any other type of law enforcement official? 

No 

Have you been charged, convicted, or sentenced of a crime in any court? 

No 

13 

J 
126 

Have you been or arc you currently on probation or parole? 

No 

Are you currently on trial or awaiting a trial <.lh criminal charges'! 

No 

To your knowledge, have you ever been the subject or target of n federal, state or local criminal investigation? 

No 

If the nnswer to any of the questions above is yes, please answer the questions below for 

each criminal event (citation, arrest, investigation, etc.). If the event was an investigation, 

where the question below asks for information about the offense, please offer information 

about the offense under investigation (if known). 

A) Date of offense: 

a. Is this nn e.>timate (Yes/No): 

B) Description of the specific nature of the offense: 

C) Did the offense involve any of the following·? 

I) Domestic violence or n crime of violence (such as battery or assault) against your child, dependent, 

cohabitant, spouse, former spouse, or someone with whom you sl1are a child in common: Yes I No 

2) Firearms or explosives: Yes I No 

3) Alcohol or drugs: Yes I No 

D) Location where the offense occurred (city, county, state, zip code, country): 

E) Were you arrested? summoned, cit~d or did· you receive n ticket to appear as a result of this offense by nny 

police officer, sheriff, marshal or any oU1er type of law enforcement official: Yes I No 

I) Name of the law enforcement agency that arrestedfci!ed!summoned you: 

2) Location of the law enforcement agency (city, county, state, zip code, country): 

F) As a result of this offense were you charged, convicted, currently awaiting trial, and/or ordered to appear in 

court in a criminal proceeding against you: Yes I No 

I) If yes, provide the name oflhe court and the location of the court (city, county, state, zip code, 

country): 

2) If yes, provide all the charges brought against you for this offense, and the outcome of each charged 

offense (such as found guilty, found not-guilty, charge dropped or "nolle pros," etc). If you were found 

guilty of or pleaded guilty to a lesser offense, list separately both the original charge and the lesser 

offense: 

14 
127 

3) If no, provide explanation: 

G) Were you sentenced as a result of this offense: Yes I No 

H) Provide a description of the sentence: 

I) Were you sentenced to imprisonment for a term exceeding one year: Yes I No 

J) Were you incarcerated as a result of that sentence for not less than one year: Yes I No 

K) If the conviction resulted in imprisonment, provide the dates that you actually were incarcerated: 

L) If conviction resulted in probation or parole, provide the dates of probation or parole: 

M) Are you currently on trial, awaiting a trial, or awaiting sentencing on criminal charges for this offense: Yes I 

No 

N) Provide explanation: 

15 
128 

10. Civil Litigation and Administrative or Legislative Proceedings 

(f\)Since (and including) your 18th birthday, have you been a party to any public record 

civil court action or administrative or legislative proceeding of any kind that resulted in (1) 

a finding of wrongdoing against you, .or (2) a settlement agreement for you, or some other 

person or entity, to make a payment to settle allegations against you, or for you to take, or 

refrain from taking, some action. Do NOT include small claims proceedings. 

Date Claim/Suit 

WnsFiledor Name(s}gf 

Legislntive £!!!!!:! Prlncll!nl Parties Nnture of Ae!ion!Proceeding Results of 

-

Proceedings ~ Involved In Action/Prooeeding Action!Pr!!ceedlng Began 

9199 Circuit fernando 0. Ruiz Lawsuit arising from a motor Settled on 2125!00 

Court of the vs. Russell Vought vehicle accident 

18°' Judicial 

Circuit, 

Dupage 

Countv.Il 

(B) In addition to those listed above, have you or any business of which you were an officer, 

director or owner ever been involved as a party of interest in any administrative agency 

proceeding or civil litigation? 

No. 

Please identify and provide details for any proceedings or civil litigation that involve 

actions taken or omitted by you, or alleged to have been taken or omitted by you, while 

serving in your official capacity. 

Name{$) of 

Court Pi'lnclnal Pariles . · Nature of Actlon!froeeedigg Date ClniniiSult Name Involved in · ·. · · Results or 

! 

WilsFUed j).ction/Proceedhig A~llg!!llroceeding 

i 

' I 

,...----

I ! 

' 

16 
129 

-

I 

t_ __ 

--------

(C) For responses to the previous question, please identify and provide details for any 

proceedings or civil litigation that involve actions taken or omitted by you, or alleged to 

have been taken or omitted by you, while serving in your official capacity. 

No 

11. Breach of Professional Ethics 

(A) Have you ever been disciplined or cited for a breach of ethics or unprofessional 

conduct by, or been the subject of a complaint to, any court, administrative agency, 

professional association, disciplinary committee, or other professional group? 

Exclude cases and proceedings already listed. 

Nnmc of ~------n.il-c·· ·--- Dcscrlb£ Citntion/DlsciQiin§O: Agcncy/Associntion/ Citation/Disciplinary Actioil/Coinplnlnt Results of Discil!linnry 

Commlttee/GrimQ Actlon/Complitlnt Astion/ConiQinint 

15sucd/Inltillted --- -----

--

{B) Have you ever been fired from a job, quit a job after being told you would be fired, left 

a job by mutual agreement following charges or allegations of misconduct, left a job by 

mutual agreement following notice of unsatisfactory performance, or received a written 

warning, been officially reprimanded, suspended, or disciplined for misconduct in the 

workplace, such as violation of a security policy? 

No 

12. Tax Compliance 

17 
130 

(This information will not be published in the record of the hearing on your nomination, 

but It will be retained in the Committee's files and will be available for public inspection.) 
131 

REDACTED 

13. Lobbying 

In the past ten years, have you registered as a lobbyist? If so, please Indicate the state, 

federal, or local bodies with which you have registered (e.g., House, Senate, California 

Secretary of State). 

No 

19 
132 

14. Outside Positions 

1 X See OGE Fonn 278. (If, for your nomination, you have completed an OGE Fonn 278 I 

Executive Branch Personnel Public Financial Disclosure Report, you may check the box here to I 

complete this section and then proceed to the next section.) · I 

For the preceding ten calendar years and the current calendar year, report any positions 

held, whether compensated or not. Positions include but arc not limited to those of an 

officer, director, trustee, general partner, proprietor, representative, employee, or 

consultant of any corporation, firm, partnership, or other business enterprise or any nonprofit organization or educational institution.~ positions with religious, social, 

fraternal, or political entities and those solely of an honorary nature. 

I 

I Ixn.!u!f I Oi-gnnlzntloil 

(corpOrotion,' finn, 

Name or ~ partnership, other Position Held Position 

OrgnniiuiJon Qrganlzatlon buSfncss enterprise. Position Held From Held To 

other non·pmfil (month/year) (month/year) 

organi.zntiOn, 

educntionnl I iq!!itution) --

I 

I ---· ! 

! 

; 

' T ! 

I 

t 

I -~---1 I 

l I 

I ----- I 

I ' \ i l I 

15. Agreements or Arrangements 

X See OGE Fonn 278. (If, for your nomination, you have completed an OGE Fonn 278 

Executive Branch Personnel Public Financial Disclosure Report, you may check the box here to 

complete this section and then proceed to the next section.) 

As of the date of filing your OGE Form 278, report your agreements or arrangements for: 

(1) continuing participation in an employee benefit plan (e.g. pension, 40lk, deferred 

20 
133 

compensation); (2) continuation of payment by a former employer (including severance 

payments); (3) leaves of absence; and (4) future employment. 

Provide information regarding any agreements or arrangements you have concerning (1) 

future employment; (2) a leave of absence during your period of Government service; (3) 

continuation of payments by a former employer other than the United States Government; 

and (4) continuing participation in an employee welfare or benefit plan maintained by a 

former employer other than United States Government retirement benefits. 

Status nnd Terms of Anv 

Agreement or Arrpngement 

1------------------ ~----·---------+----------.. ·---·-1 

!---"·---·-------·- ------~·-

r----------------- --------·-----4-·--·------·~---·-----l 

16. Additional Financial Data 

All information requested under this heading must be provided for yourself, your spouse, 

and your dependents. (This information will not be published in the record of the bearing 

on your nomination, but it will be retained in the Committee's files and will be available for 

public inspection.) 

REDACTED 
REDACTE[» 

SIGNATURE AND DATE 

I hereby state that I have read the foregoing Statement on Biographical and Financial Information and that the infor

provided therein is, to the best of my knowledge, current, accurate, and complete. 

= ' 

This 21 sl day of April, 2017 

28 
135 

UNITED STATES OFFICE OF 

GOVERNMENT ETHICS 

REDACTED 

~'< -------------~-----

The Honorable Ron Johnson 

Chainnan 

Committee on Homeland Security 

and Governmental Affairs 

Uniled States Senate 

Washington, DC 20510 

Dear Mr. Chairman: 

May 4. 2017 

ln accordance with the Ethics in Govemrhent Act of 1978, I enclose a copy of the 

financial disclosure report filed by Russell Vought, who has been nominated by President Trump 

for the position of Deputy Director, OfJice of Management and Budget. 

We have reviewed the report and have obtained advice fi'om the agency concerning any 

possible conflict in light of its functions and the nominee's proposed duties. Also enclosed .is an 

ethics agreement oullining the actions that the nomil)ee will undertake to avoid conllicts of 

interest. Unless a date for compliance is indicated iri the ethics agreemept, the nominee must 

fully comply within three months of confirmation with any action specitied in the ethics 

agreement. 

Based thereon, we believe that this nominee is in compliance with applicable laws and 

regulations goven1ing con!1icts of interest. 

Enclosures REDACTED 

Sincer-ely~ 

David J. Apol 

General Counsel 

1201 NEW YORK AVE NW ·SUITE 500· WAS KINGTON DC ·20005 * * * * 
136 

Yasam<tn Sutton 

Aitemat.e Designated Agency Ethics Official 

Office of Management and Budget 

725 17m Street, NW 

Washington, D.C. 20503 

Dear Ms. Sutton: 

May3,2017 

The purpose of this letter is to describe the steps that I will take to avoid any l!ctual or 

apparent conflict ofinterest in the event that I am confinrted for the position of Deputy Director 

of the Office of Management and Budget. 

As required by 18 U.S.C. § 208(a), I will not participate personally and substantially in 

any particular matter in which I know that r have a financial interest directly and predictably 

affected by the matter, or in which I krtow lhat a person whose interests are imputed to me has a 

financial interest directly and predictably affected by the matter, unless I first obtain a written 

waiver, pursuant to 18 U.S.C. § 208(b)(l), or qualify fora regulatory exemption, pursuant to 18 

U.S.C. § 208(b)(2). I understand that the interests of the following persons are imputed to me: 

any spouse or minor child of mine; any general partner of a partnership in which] am a limited 

or general partner; any organization in which I serve as officer, director, trustee, general partner 

or employee; and any person or organization with which I am negotiating or have an 

arrangement concerning prospective employment. 

My employment with Heritage Action for America ended in January 2017. For a period 

of one year after my resignation, I will not participate personally and substantially in any 

particular matter involving specific parties in which I know HeritageAction for America is a 

party or represents a party, unless I am first authorized to participate; pursuant to 5 C.F,R. § 

2635.502(d). 

My spouse, is currently a member with Vought Strategies LLC. For as 1ong as my spouse 

continues to work for Vought Strategies LLC, l will not participate personally and substantially 

in any particular matter that to my knowledge has a direct and predictable effect on the financial 

interests of Vought Strategies LLC, unless l first obtain a written waiver, pursuant to 18 U.S.C. 

§ 208(b)(l). 1 also will not participate personally and substantially in any particular matter 

involving specific parties in which I know a clie.nt of my spouse is a party or represents a party, 

unless I am first authorized to participate, pursuant to 5 C.F.R. § 2635.502{d). In addition, for 

the duration of my appointmentto the position of Deputy Director, my spouse has agreed not to 

communicate directly with the Office ofManageme[Jt and Budget on behalf of Vought Strategies 

LLC or any client. 
137 

If I have a managed account or otherwise use the services of an investment professional 

during my appointment, I will ensur~: that the account manag!!r or investment professional 

obtains my prior approval on a case-by-case basis for the purchase of any assets other than cash, 

cash equivalents; investment funds that qualify for the exemption at 5 C.F.R. § 2640.20!(a), 

obligations of the United States, or municipal bonds. 

I understand that as an appointee l am required to sign the Ethics Pledge (Exec, Qrd.er 

No. 13770) mid that I will be bound by the requirements and restrictions therein in addition to the 

commitments I have made in this and any other ethics agreement. 

I wili meetin person with you during the first week ofmyservioe ln the position of 

Deputy Director in order to complete the initial ethics briefing required under S C;F.R. § 

2638.305. Within 90 days ol'iny confiimation, I will also document my compliance With this 

ethics agreement by notifying :you in writing when I have completed the' steps described ih this 

ethics agreement. 

! have been advised that this ethics agreement will be posted publicly, consistent with 

5 U.S,C. ~ 552, on the website of the U.S. Office of Government EthiCs with ethics agreements 

of otl1er Presidential nominees who file public financial disclosure reports. 

~J~ Russell Vought 
138 

U.S. Senate Committee on Homeland Security and Governmental Affairs 

Pre-hearing Questionnaire 

For the Nomination of Russell Vought to be 

Deputy Director, Office of Management and Budget 

I. Nomination Process and Conflicts of Interest 

1. Did the President or the Director of the Office of Management and Budget (OMB) give you 

specific reasons why you were nominated to be the next Deputy Director of OMB, and if so, 

what were they? 

No. 

2. Were any conditions, expressed or implied, attached to your nomination? If so, please 

explain. 

No. 

3. Have you made any commitments with respect to the policies and principles you will attempt 

to implement as Deputy Director? If so, what are they, and to whom were the commitments 

made? 

No. 

4. Are you aware of any business relationship, dealing, or financial transaction that could result 

in a possible conflict of interest for you or the appearance of a conflict of interest? If so, 

please explain what procedures you will use to recuse yourself or otherwise address the 

conflict. And if you will recuse yourself, explain how you will ensure your responsibilities 

are not affected by your recusal. 

No. 

II. Background of the Nominee 

5. What specific background, experience, and attributes qualifY you to be Deputy Director? 

I spent 12 years working on public policy in Congress, including senior, cross-cutting roles 

such as the Executive Director of the Republican Study Committee and tbe Policy Director 

for the House Republican Conference. I have a background specifically in budget policy 

and process, having served as the RSC's Budget Director and compiling its budget 

resolutions. And I have managed all aspects of a large national organization with staff and 

volunteers spread out across the country. 

6. Please describe: 

a. Your leadership and management style. 
139 

My leadership style is to set a vision, encourage people to buy into that vision through 

coaching, and lead by example. I am a hands-on manager, getting into the details and 

asking questions, while at the same time giving employees the space to be creative. I highly 

value receiving feedback from people up and down an organization about what they think 

is or is not working. 

b. Your experience managing personnel. 

I managed the Grassroots Department at Heritage Action for America, a policy team at the 

House Republican Conference, and the entire Republican Study Committee. 

c. What is the largest number of people that have worked under you? 

I managed roughly 20 employees, including a number of field staff across the country, at 

Heritage Action. 

7. You have held the position "Beachhead Team Member/ Senior Advisor" at OMB since 

January 2017. What have your responsibilities been in this role? 

I have largely been responsible for advising the Director on the composition of the FY 2018 

budget proposal and preparing decisions for him to make. 

8. Please describe your experience working on matters relating to the federal budget or to other 

matters within the purview of the OMB Deputy Director. 

As stated, I have advised the Director on the composition of the FY 2018 budget and helped 

prepare decisions for him to make. 

III. Role of the Deputy Director ofOMB 

9. What do you consider to be the mission of OMB, and what would you consider to be your 

role and responsibilities if confirmed as the Deputy Director? Have you and OMB Director 

Mick Mulvaney discussed what your role would be? If so, please describe how you view 

your role in light of those discussions. 

The mission of OMB is to serve the President by providing the necessary information and 

analysis to properly assess policy options and then to execute those policy decisions 

government-wide. I have discussed my role with Director Mulvaney, and if confirmed, I 

would serve as a true deputy of OMB overseeing all aspects of the organization. However 

given the Deputy Director for Management (DDM) and the OIRA Administrator, my focus 

will be on the budget portfolio. 

l 0. In many agencies, the Deputy is charged with internal management of the agency. Do you 

expect to take on this role at OMB? If so, what do you see as the major internal management 

challenges there, and how would you plan to address them? 

2 
140 

Yes. The major internal management challenge is to meet the competing demands on OMB 

career staff in the midst of tight resources. 

II. What do you anticipate will be your greatest challenges as OMB Deputy Director, and what 

will be your top priorities? What do you hope to accomplish during your tenure? 

A top priority will be infusing in OMB a spirit of"one OMB" that ensures against a silo 

mentality within the organization that can inhibit bottom-up collaboration across the 

agency. 

12. How do you view the role of Deputy Director in the context of the Deputy Director of 

Management as well as OMB's three main offices the Office oflnformation and Regulatory 

Affairs, the Office of Federal Procurement Policy, and the Office of Federal Financial 

Management? 

The Deputy Director of Management (DDM) is the primary deputy for all of the 

management issues and oversees the other statutory offices, including the Office of Federal 

Procurement Policy and the Office of Federal Financial Management. The OIRA 

Administrator operates in similar fashion for regulatory matters, essentially as a de-facto 

Deputy of Regulation. 

13. If confirmed as Deputy Director, do you anticipate having a role in overseeing or assisting 

OMB with facilitating cooperation or coordination between agencies in areas such as 

information technology, financial management, procurement, performance, reducing waste, 

increasing governmental efficiency, and human resources? If so, what in your background 

has helped prepare you for this role? 

As stated, the DDM will be tbe primary deputy for these areas. 

IV. Policy Questions 

Budget 

14. Do you support biennial budgeting? Please explain. 

a. Do you foresee any obstacles for OMB in implementing biennial budgeting if it chose 

to do so in the future? How could those obstacles be overcome? 

I support making the budget process more efficient, and biennial budgeting is an idea that 

deserves consideration. I think it would lead to restrained and better spending where more 

oversight is done. It could lead to more supplementals and a longer list of"anomalies" 

beading into the second year as there is currently with any long-term CR. However, one 

way to overcome this concern would be to anticipate and budget for such expected 

spending in the second year. 

3 
141 

15. If confirmed, what preparatory steps will you take to minimize risks surrounding debt-ceiling 

negotiations and ensure the federal government does not threaten default? 

I have found that one of the challenges involved with debt-eeiling negotiations is that there 

is too little attention paid to the issue until the last minute, specifically what are the sorts of 

reforms or reductions that should be carried or considered as part of increasing the debt 

ceiling. I will help ensure there is a policy development process where principals have the 

information needed to make wise decisions early enough to minimize risks. 

16. What criteria will you employ when determining whether to propose an increase, decrease, or 

maintain funding to a federal program? 

I will consider a number of factors when proposing funding levels, including: a) does the 

program work? b) is there a pattern of waste, fraud, and abuse? c) what are the larger 

budget constraints?, and d) is there an appropriate federal role? All of these questions are 

necessary to allocate scarce resources in federal spending. 

17. What steps will you take to communicate to Congress and the public the realities of the longterm fiscal picture? Does this include issuing a 30-year projection? 

I will take every opportunity to encourage OMB to provide the Administration and the 

broader public the realities of our long-term fiscal picture, including 30-year projections 

where available and reliable. 

Regulatory Affairs 

t 8. Please describe how you view the mission of OMB with respect to coordinating and 

reviewing agency regulatory activity? Do you believe OMB has adequate resources and 

structure to meet that mission? Please explain. 

OMB has a crucial and central role in coordinating regulatory activity and ensuring that 

agencies take seriously their duty to consider the costs, as well as the benefits of proposed 

regulations. OMB is also the driver of the unified regulatory agenda to ensure that agencies 

are forecasting where they intend to take regulatory action. 

I do not believe that OIRA has adequate resources to properly advance the President's 

regulatory agenda. 

19. How do you intend to support the Administration's retrospective review efforts as outlined in 

Executive Order 13777? In your view, have previous retrospective reviews of existing 

policies been successful? Please explain why or why not. 

I would encourage OIRA to be in constant communication with the agency regulatory task 

forces being set up to ensure that that their reports are consistent with the President's deregulatory agenda and work with the DDM to ensure that the agencies' annual 

performance plans under the Government Performance and Results Act incorporate these 

4 
142 

regulatory goals. With regard to past retrospective reviews, my understanding is that they 

have been largely unsuccessful in that they have led to lists of prospective de-regulatory 

action, but are rarely acted on. While these lists now come in handy as OIRA implements 

the "1 in, 2 out" rule, they represent the shortcomings of past reviews. 

Management 

20. What are the most important steps that OMB can take to enable the federal government to 

perform its essential functions more efficiently and for less cost? Please explain any system 

or standard you intend to use to measure success or identify problems. 

OMB is in the midst of a comprehensive review of the federal government as directed by a 

Presidential executive order. This review will include an assessment of the essential 

functions of each federal agency. Guidelines have already been issued to agencies on how to 

approach this review in their submissions to OMB later this year, and OMB will then issue 

a report that previews the FY19 budget submission. 

21. What are the top management challenges facing the federal government, and if confirmed, 

what would you do to address them? 

In my opinion, the top management challenge continues to be the size and scope of the 

federal government. The government engages in so many activities, in so many different 

places, that it is difficult to manage it all well. This is why the President's executive order to 

reorganize the federal government, and hopefully do less of some things, is so important. 

22. The Bush Administration created and implemented the Performance Assessment Rating Tool 

(PART) for assessing performance at federal agencies. The system was replaced with an 

approach created by the Government Performance Review Modernization Act (GPRAMA). 

What is your opinion of the current status of government performance management and how 

do you believe it can be improved? Please explain. 

I found the Bush Administration's PART assessment to be a very helpful start in 

systematically evaluating federal programs and shining light on the fact that many 

programs either do not work or lack the necessary metrics or goals to make that 

determination. While the GPRA Modernization Act, as a replacement, may serve its 

purpose in emphasizing that agencies adopt and pursue wider strategic goals, I believe that 

it has led to an unfortunate de-emphasis on program-by-program assessments. My 

understanding is that PART consumed a great deal of OMB and agency time and resources 

so it may not be worth reviving, but if confirmed, I would want to thoroughly understand 

how to ensure the proper evaluation of federal programs. 

23. How can OMB work to ensure that the federal government is more effective and supportive 

of economic growth? 

OMB plays a central role in crafting the President's budget and coordinating the inclusion 

of proposals that would lead to economic growth, whether they be cutting taxes, 

5 
143 

encouraging energy development, or limiting federal spending. In addition, OIRA plays a 

central role in coordinating the President's regulatory agenda, which will lead to economic 

growth. 

24. How do you view OMB's role in addressing agency high-risk or duplicative programs 

highlighted in GAO's biennial "High Risk List" and annual "Duplication" report? 

I have not read GAO's latest report, but I have consistently used the High Risk List 

throughout my career to understand where government is not working well. If confirmed, I 

will study this year's report and encourage OMB examiners to incorporate GAO findings 

into their analysis of federal programs. 

a. Of the areas identified as "high risk," which do you find to be most concerning and 

why? 

See above. 

b. Are there any specific recommendations from GAO's High Risk report that you plan 

to pursue if confirmed? 

See above. 

25. Protecting whistleblower confidentiality is of the utmost importance to this Committee: 

a. How do you plan to implement policies within the agency to encourage employees to 

bring constructive suggestions forward without the fear of reprisal? 

First, I hope to model a leadership approach that welcomes information about what 

is not working and that creates a culture where all employees, at every level, are 

rewarded for trying to make the agency better. Second, I will be sure to assess what 

whistle blower protections we have in place and make any needed improvements. 

b. If confirmed, what avenues will be available to employees to report waste, fraud, or 

abuse within OMB? 

See above. 

c. Do you commit without reservation to work to ensure that any whistleblower within 

OMB does not face retaliation? 

Yes. 

d. Do you commit without reservation to take all appropriate action if notified about 

potential whistleblower retaliation? 

Yes. 

6 
144 

26. Federal inspectors general (lOs) face unique obstacles as they do their work, including 

budget challenges and disputes with agency heads over access to information. How do you 

view OMB's relationship to the statutory lOs, and if confirmed what efforts would you make 

to engage with this community and support their work? 

I highly value the work of the IG community and spent much of my career gleaning 

information from their reports on areas of waste, fraud, and abuse. If confirmed, I would 

encourage OMB's Resource Management Organizations to read IG reports routinely and 

infuse their own analysis of federal programs with what they learn from the IG reports. 

27. How can OMB efforts to improve government be integrated with the budget process and with 

the work of congressional authorizing and appropriating committees? 

OMB proposals are often the basis for many congressional initiatives. Even if Congress 

refuses to vote for an exact replica of the President's budget, often many of the proposals 

and spending levels are assumed in the congressional budget resolutions and annual 

appropriations bills. Authorizers can also use these efforts to inform their oversight 

activities and vice versa. 

28. The Digital Accountability and Transparency Act of2014 (DATA), Public Law 113-101 

(2014), was a priority for the Committee during the 113'h Congress. Key implementation 

deadlines are approaching. What steps will you take to ensure that the DATA Act 

implementation stays on track? 

OMB is working diligently with Treasury and other agencies to ensure that the newly 

required data and updated displays are ready for an updated USAspending.gov to be 

launched by the approaching deadline. 

29. The Committee has worked to pass the Taxpayers Right-to-Know Act for several years now. 

In the past, OMS has opposed this legislation. The bill requires a list of all federal programs, 

including their administrative costs, expenditures, and beneficiaries. What is your opinion of 

the Taxpayers Right-to-Know Act? 

I have always been frustrated with the difficulty in locating such information because there 

is currently not a government entity that keeps track sufficiently. Accordingly, I support 

the Taxpayers Right-to-Know Act and the information it requires OMB to collect. I also 

know that new responsibilities require tradeoffs, and that OMB is being asked to shoulder 

a number of new responsibilities. OMB has communicated these tradeoffs to Congress, and 

I would want to continue assessing what responsibilities would be displaced as we consider 

this legislation. 

30. What do you believe OMS's role should be in improving financial management in the 

federal government? 

7 
145 

OMB's Office of Federal Financial Management is the statutory leader in setting the 

standards for agencies' financial management. 

31. The Department of Defense has been unable to complete and pass a financial audit as 

required by the Government Management Reform Act of 1994. If confirmed, what steps, if 

any, will you take to address DOD's longstanding financial management challenges? 

Congress has set a number of statutory deadlines for the Department to be ready for an 

audit. The Department seems to be making progress to be audit ready by the end of the 

year, including working through some of the historic challenges that comes with attempting 

to audit classified information. 

Acquisition and Federal Property Management 

32. How do you view OMB's role in providing guidance to agencies on strategic sourcing? 

OMB has a central role in driving agencies to achieve savings by using shared services in 

common functions, such as payroll management and information systems, and leveraging 

the federal government's enormous buying power for common goods. OMB can both 

provide guidance and track the result of the savings. 

33. The Federal Property Management Reform Act was signed into law last year. If confirmed, 

how will you ensure that agencies are implementing the law and what additional steps do you 

think are necessary to improve the government's management of its property portfolio? 

If confirmed, I would work with the DDM, who chairs the Federal Real Property Council 

established under the FPMRA, to ensure there is a strategy for the federal government to 

better manage its properties and reduce its costs. 

34. What role do you believe OMB should play in determining the size of the federal 

government's property portfolio? 

OMB is vital to the Administration's efforts in downsizing the federal government's 

property footprint by cataloging and recommending the disposal of unneeded properties. 

For instance, OMB is set to recommend to the Public Buildings Reform Board under 

FAST A a list of properties for disposal. 

Cybersecurity and Information Technology 

35. Congress has recently passed several laws aimed at increasing cybersecurity at federal 

agencies, including the Federal Information Security Modernization Act of2014 and the 

Federal Cybersecurity Enhancement Act of2015. OMB, too, has demonstrated an increased 

level of attention to the networks, systems, and data at civilian agencies. 

a. What is your assessment of OMB's role in defending against cyber attacks, like the 

2015 cyber breach suffered at the Office of Personnel Management? 

8 
146 

OMB plays a critical role, in conjunction with DHS, in securing Federal systems and 

information. OMB's role includes developing and overseeing agency implementation 

of policies to appropriately protect their information systems. 

b. If confirmed, how will OMB work with the Department of Homeland Security to 

further enhance cybersecurity at federal agencies? 

OMB will continue to work with DHS in its role to ensure the implementation of 

Federal standards and guidelines. 

c. Do you support GAO's recommendations to OMB to: address agency cyber incident 

response practices in oversight of agency information security programs; and 

collaborate with stakeholders to enhance reporting guidance for the inspector general 

community? Please explain. 

I am not familiar with GAO's recommendations to address agency cyber incident 

response rates, but I will request a briefing from the FCIO, if I am confirmed. 

36. The Federal Information Technology Acquisition Reform Act (FITARA), empowered and 

made accountable agency Chieflnformation Officers (CIOs) for all major technology 

purchases and maintenance at agencies. While progress has been made, some C!Os remain 

walled off from the program side of the agency mission. What is your view of the role of the 

C!O in federal agencies? 

The CIO should have the authority necessary to meet its responsibilities under FIT ARA. 

37. The federal government collects and maintains significant volumes of Personal Identifiable 

Information (PII). What do you believe OMB's role should be regarding ensuring federal 

agencies are fully protecting the privacy of this information? 

OMB should include the proper protection of PII in its guidelines to federal agencies on the 

security of their information systems. 

38. What is your view of the role of the U.S. Digital Service and the General Services 

Administration's 18F in recruiting private sector technology talent to the federal workforce? 

I am most familiar with USDS' role, and it appears that it bas been very successful in 

recruiting private sector technology to the federal government. 

39. The President recently announced the creation of the Office of American Innovation. Have 

you had a role in the creation or work of this Office in your current role at OMB? What do 

you believe OMB's role should be with respect to the work of this office? 

9 
147 

I had no role in the creation of this Office, but it promises to be an important partner in 

OMB's efforts to both reorganize and modernize the federal government (pursuant to the 

President's EO). 

Improper Payments and Government Transparency 

40. In fiscal year (FY) 2014, GAO's government-wide estimate of improper payments was 

$124.7 billion, attributable to 124 programs across 22 agencies. In FY 2015, improper 

payments rose to $13 7 billion. If confirmed, how do you anticipate OMB ensuring agencies 

are in compliance with improper payments law and following OMB guidance in this area? 

Improper payments continue to be an enormous problem. Ifl am confirmed, I would want 

to incorporate the feedback from OFFM on the Management side into the FY19 budget 

process and ensure that the agencies that are effectively combatting improper payments 

according to our guidance, have additional resources that can provide the incentive to 

achieve reform. 

41. What role, if any, should OMB play in ensuring agency collaboration and greater sharing of 

data helpful for curbing waste and fraud? If confirmed how do you plan to carry out this 

role? 

If confirmed, I will work with the DDM to ensure that OMB is utilizing the tools at its 

disposal- including cross-cutting agency guidance and the President's budget- to promote 

greater agency collaboration on the best practices to fight waste, fraud, and abuse. 

42. Currently, information on recipients of federal grants, contracts, and loans is required to be 

posted online for public review, pursuant to the Transparency Act. Do you support making 

subcontracts and sub grants transparent in this same manner? 

Yes. 

43. Do you agree with the importance of publicly disclosing the federal government's 

performance goals and the results achieved? 

Yes. 

V. Relations with Congress 

44. Do you agree without reservation to comply with any request or summons to appear and 

testify before any duly constituted committee of Congress if you are confirmed? 

Yes, subject to the discretion of Director Mulvaney and the advice of legal counsel. 

45. Do you a!,'l"ee without reservation to make any subordinate official or employee available to 

appear and testify before, or provide information to, any duly constituted committee of 

Congress if you are confirmed? 

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Yes, subject to the discretion of Director Mulvaney and the advice of legal counsel. 

46. Do you agree without reservation to comply fully, completely, and promptly to any request 

for documents, communications, or any other agency material or information from any duly 

constituted committee of the Congress if you are confirmed? 

Yes, subject to the discretion of Director Mulvaney and the advice of legal counsel. 

VI. Assistance 

47. Are these answers your own? Have you consulted with OMB, or any other interested 

parties? If so, please indicate which entities. 

These answers are my own. I have at times consulted with the OMB staff to inform my 

thoughts and responses. 

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Minority 

Supplemental Pre-hearing Questionnaire 

For the Nomination of Russell Vought to be 

Deputy Director, Office of Management and Budget 

I. Nomination Process and Conflicts oflntercst 

1. Has the President, his staff or anyone in the transition team asked you to sign a 

confidentiality agreement during your term as a Beachhead team member or through other 

work you conducted during the transition or during the President's term in office? 

Yes. 

II. Background of the Nominee 

2. What was your role in drafting the "America First" budget blueprint submitted to Congress 

on March 13, 20 17? 

I participated in the development of the blueprint in my role as a Beachhead team member 

and Senior Advisor, preparing decisions for the Director to make. 

3. What has been your role in preparing the 2018 budget submission expected to be sent to 

Congress in May 2017? 

In similar fashion, I have participated in the development of the main budget expected to 

be sent to Congress later this month, preparing decisions for the Director to make. 

4. Do you seek out dissenting views and how do you encourage constructive critical dialogue 

with subordinates? 

Yes, actively.lt is a priority. 

5. Please give examples of times in your career when you disagreed with your superiors and 

aggressively advocated your position. Were you ever successful? 

I have spent my entire career advocating for the federal government to do less and save 

taxpayers money, and to push whomever 1 have worked for away from "business-as-usual" 

governing. Thankfully, I have worked for employers who have the same desire, but 

decisions around the "art of the possible" are rarely black and white and often require a 

strong commitment to principals. 

6. Please list and describe examples of when you made politically difficult choices that you 

thought were in the best interest of the country? 

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I made the decision to leave my work in Congress and devote seven years of my life to 

getting citizens more involved in the political process. Their increased attention and 

knowledge of how Congress works certainly led to challenges with many current and 

former relationships on the Hill. 

7. What would you consider your greatest successes as a leader? 

I helped envision, create, and lead the Heritage Action Sentinel Program, a network of 

17,000 high-information citizens committed to encouraging their Members of Congress to 

support sound public policy. 

III. Policy Questions 

Regulatory Affairs 

8. OMB Director Mulvaney was recently quoted as saying, "It is our position that the previous 

administration failed to follow the law in many, many circumstances .... And that they 

simply imposed regulation without proper regard to the cost side of that analysis." Do you 

agree with this statement? If so, which legal requirements do you believe were not followed 

by the previous administration and can you point to specific examples that support this 

allegation? 

Cost-benefit analysis has been required for rulemaking by executive orders for decades, 

and agencies understand that they have to comply. In fact, courts often overturn rules if 

significant errors are made in the process. Pushing out many significant regulatory actions 

through guidance rather than rulemaking is an attempt to end-run around that process. 

9. What role do you think OMB has when it comes to the substance of rules versus the 

budgetary impact? 

I think OMB has a significant role in assessing all aspects of the purported costs and 

benefits of a proposed rule, not just its budgetary impact. 

10. What are the main principles that you think should be taken into consideration in 

promulgating and issuing new regulations? 

I think new regulations need to be formulated based on hard data and analyses that are 

transparent to the public and with an eye toward limiting costs on society. 

11. What are the main principles that you think should be taken into consideration in removing a 

regulation from the U.S. code? 

The main consideration for removing a regulation is whether it has worked, after 

experience and analyses, as intended. Has the regulation led to the benefits it promised? 

Has the regulation avoided the costs it promised? If it bas not, it should be reconsidered. 

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Management 

12. One ofOMB's principal goals is to improve the effectiveness and efficiency of government 

programs. What OMB initiatives do you believe will make the greatest difference in 

government efficiency and effectiveness? How can those efforts be integrated with the 

budget process and with the work of the congressional authorizing and appropriating 

committees? 

As stated above, OMB is in the midst of a comprehensive review of the federal government 

as directed by a Presidential executive order. This review will include an assessment of the 

essential functions of each federal agency. Guidelines have already been issued to agencies 

on how to approach this review in their submissions to OMB later this year, and OMB will 

then issue a government-wide reform plan with the FY19 Budget. 

OMB proposals can, and often have, been the basis for many congressional initiatives. 

Even if Congress refuses to vote for an exact replica of the President's budget, often many 

of the proposals and spending levels are assumed in the congressional budget resolutions 

and annual appropriations bills. Authorizers can also use these efforts to inform their 

oversight activities and vice versa. 

13. The Government Accountability Office (GAO) has recommended repeatedly that that OMB 

develop and implement a framework for conducting performance reviews of tax 

expenditures, which represent forgone revenue estimated at $1 trillion. GAO has also 

recommended that OMB designate tax expenditures as a type of program and include 

relevant information about each expenditure in future iterations of the federal program 

inventory. Do you agree with GAO's recommendations? If not, why not? 

The Congressional Budget Act requires OMB to list tax expenditures in its budget 

submission. Developing a performance review of these expenditures is something that I 

support in theory, but I recognize the sizable resource requirements that it would entail 

and a potential concern that it might prove redundant with the efforts of Treasury's Office 

of Tax Analysis. 

Contracting and Procurement Policy 

14. If confirmed, what specific changes will you make to federal procurement policy that will 

limit the federal government's responsibility for cost overruns on existing and future 

contracts? 

If confirmed, I will ask for a briefing on the reasons for ongoing cost overruns and work 

with the DDM to propose improvements that save taxpayers' money. 

15. On April 18, 2017, the President issued the "Presidential Executive Order on Buy American 

and Hire American". Please describe the role that you believe OMB should have in 

implementing this Executive Order. Please describe the role that you would expect to play as 

the Deputy Director in OMB's implementation of this Executive Order. 

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OMB is charged with working with several agencies to issue guidelines jointly with the 

Department of Commerce, pursuant to the EO. OMB is uniquely situated to coordinate 

this process. 

16. Too often, agencies' contracting decisions~ e.g., over reliance on noncompetitive contracts, 

or inappropriate use of "cost plus" contracts - have unnecessarily inflated contract costs. 

What are the most important steps that OMB should take to ensure that agencies' contracting 

decisions do not waste taxpayer dollars? 

OFPP should continue to work with agencies to track and provide guidance on how to 

reduce the reliance on noncompetitive contracts and move towards fixed price contracts, as 

appropriate. In addition, it can work with both OIRA to identify regulatory burdens that 

might create the wrong incentives for competition and the private industry to gauge why 

companies choose not to submit bids on contracts that are competitively awarded. 

17. What factors should OMB and the Office of Federal Procurement Policy (OFPP) consider 

when reviewing federal agencies' business cases for the award of new government-wide 

acquisition contracts? 

Government-wide acquisition contracts are an import tool to leverage the Federal 

government's buying power and achieve efficiencies. These and other tools supported by 

OFPP should continue to be used whenever there are common requirements and 

administrative expenses and duplication can be limited. 

I 8. What do you see as the appropriate relationship between OFPP and the acquisition policy 

functions of GSA? 

I understand there to be a collaborative partnership between OFPP and GSA in the 

development and implementation of acquisition policy. For instance, while OFPP chairs the 

Federal Acquisition Regulatory Council, GSA is one of four members (along with NASA 

and DoD). This partnership is good for taxpayers. 

I 9. The Obama Administration has focused on the use of shared services and category 

management to make federal procurement more efficient and cost-effective. If confirmed, 

will you support category management? If so, what specific steps do you plan to take to 

continue its implementation? 

Yes, I would work with the DDM to consider expanding the number of categories and 

shared services where appropriate. 

Real Property Manageme11t 

20. What do you believe are the principal obstacles that the federal government faces in the 

management of, and where appropriate, disposition of federal real property? 

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My understanding is that some of the obstacles towards the disposition of federal real 

property is the overly burdensome regulatory process involved and the lack of incentives to 

build a culture at agencies that makes it a priority. Too often, agencies would rather save 

money in the short term rather than achieve long term savings. 

Cybersecurity a11d biformatiott Teclmology 

21. What do you view to be the most significant current and potential cyber security threats 

facing our federal networks and critical infrastructure owners and operators? If confirmed, 

what steps do you intend to take to improve the nation's cyber security, both with respect to 

the government and private networks? 

I believe the most significant vulnerability is the aging information systems that many 

agencies continue to operate. If confirmed, I would help advocate for H.R. 2227, the 

Modernizing Government Technology Act, proposed by Rep. Will Hurd that creates a 

revolving fund under GSA to fund (and receive reimbursements for) agency modernization 

projects in a manner that ensures effective oversight. 

Improper Payments and Government Tra11sparency 

22. Sec. 1222 ofGPRAMA instructs OMB to "issue guidance to ensure that such information is 

provided in a way that presents a coherent picture of all federal programs, and the 

performance of the federal government as well as individual agencies." The statute also 

states that the standards set for transparency and frequency of updates are the minimum. 

a. If confirmed as Deputy Director, what steps will you take to ensure that disclosures to 

the public are provided in a coherent and easily accessible manner? 

1 completely support the intent behind these sorts of initiatives. If confirmed, I 

would work with the DDM to comprehensively assess how OMB is complying with 

this and any related statutes. 

b. If confirmed, would you support OMB using its website to provide transparency and 

accountability to the public, including beyond the statutorily required minimums if 

necessary for coherence and comprehensiveness? 

I would be open to the idea if other sites proved insufficient and OMB had the 

resources to commit to such an endeavor without jeopardizing other key 

responsibilities. 

Fina11cial Mmtagement Systems 

23. What is your view of the government's current financial reporting requirements? Would you 

suggest any revisions to OMB Circular A-136, Financial Reporting Requirements? 

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The current financial reporting requirements are an important part of ensuring that all 

agencies maintain a "clean" audit and therefore maintain the public's confidence in their 

government. If confirmed, I would work with the DDM to look for opportunities to 

improve the requirements. 

24. The Obama Administration has emphasized the importance of having appropriate risk 

management processes and systems to identify challenges early, to bring them to the 

attention of Agency leadership, and to develop solutions. As part of this effort, OMB updated 

Circular A-123 in July 2016, to adopt a more integrated risk management structure. The 

updated Circular A-123 requires Agencies to implement an enterprise risk management 

capability coordinated with the strategic planning and strategic review process established by 

the GPRA Modernization Act, and the internal control processes required by the federal 

Managers' Financial Integrity Act (FMFIA) and GAO's Green Book. 

a. Do you support the integrated approach detailed in Circular A-123? 

Enterprise risk management is an important tool to identify risks and design 

processes that avoid and mitigate against them. It is important that the federal 

government incorporate these practices from the private sector. If confirmed, I 

would work with the DDM to continually assess A-123. 

b. If not, please explain your view on the appropriate approach to ensuring agencies 

maintain appropriate risk management practices? 

See above. 

Governme11t Waste 

25. What is your assessment of the oversight work performed by the IGs over the past decade? 

What do you view as the greatest challenges facing the IGs? What do you see OMB's role in 

addressing these challenges? 

As stated above, I highly value the work of the IG community. One of the challenges they 

face is getting policymakers to take seriously their findings, and OMB is well situated to 

incorporate their findings into the budget and oversight processes. 

26. The Paperwork Reduction Act, the electronic amendments to the Freedom of Information 

Act (FOIA), theE-Government Act, and current OMB circulars, together have led to a 

government-wide policy that supports the dissemination of government information and 

access to that information via the internet. What standard should be applied in determining 

the circumstances under which the federal government should be proactive in its 

dissemination of information to the public or when the dissemination of information should 

require a FOIA request? 

If confirmed, I will work with the DDM to review the appropriate amount of public 

information required under current law. 

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Whistleblower Rigl1ts 

27. Please describe any previous experience-in the public or private sector--with handling 

whistleblower complaints, and what steps you took to ensure those individuals did not face 

retaliation and that their claims were thoroughly investigated? 

I have no previous experience with handling whistleblower complaints, but I value 

whistleblowers and have always encouraged a leadership culture that seeks to alleviate the 

need for them because employees know they can communicate up the chain of command 

about what is being mismanaged. 

28. How will you ensure that OMB whistleblower complaints are properly investigated? 

If confirmed, I will be sure to assess what whistleblower protections we have in place and 

make any improvements. I will also personally ensure that complaints are made known to 

senior officials and investigated. 

29. If confirmed, will you ensure officials in your agency do not retaliate against federal 

employees, officials and contractor employees who communicate with representatives from 

this Committee, the GAO, lOs, the Office of Special Counsel, and any other statutorily 

protected channels for disclosure? 

Yes. 

Executive Orders 

30. Under Executive Order 11030, as amended, OMB substantively reviews and clears all draft 

Presidential Executive Orders and Memoranda to agency heads prior to their issuance. What, 

in your view, is the appropriate use of executive orders? What criteria should OMB use 

when evaluating proposed executive orders? 

Executive orders are an effective tool for the President to drive his policy agenda 

throughout his Administration. Some ofthe criteria for evaluating proposed executive 

orders inelude whether what is written accomplishes the President's intent, as well as 

identifying whether they comport with existing statutes. 

31. Are there any existing executive orders that you believe should be repealed or replaced? If 

so, describe which executive orders and your reasoning. 

I have not performed a review of existing executive orders. 

Personnel Management 

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32. What do you believe the biggest challenges are in addressing skill gaps in the federal 

government? What role should OMB play in efforts to improve human capital management 

across the federal government? 

I have not considered this issue, but if confirmed I will be briefed and assess any skill gaps 

in the federal government and work with the DDM to address these gaps through the 

Office of Performance and Personnel Management and the Office of Personnel 

Management. 

33. What do you believe the role of the Senior Executive Service (SES) should be in the federal 

workforce? If confirmed, what, if any, measures would you take to reform theSES system? 

I have not considered any specific reforms to theSES system, but it is an important system 

for ensuring that the federal government has versatile senior executives that can overcome 

many different management challenges and run agencies that are efficient. It may need to 

be modernized since it was instituted in the 1970s. 

34.ln response to some questions that Senator McCaskill submitted to the Army after a 2012 

hearing on the cost of contractors, the Deputy Assistant Secretary for Force Management, 

Manpower and Resources stated that, even when their analysis showed that using a federal 

employee was better from a cost and a mission perspective, the Army was under some 

circumstances forced to use a contractor instead because of a DOD-mandated freeze on 

civilian full-time equivalents, or FTEs for FY 2011 through FY 2013. This cap was later 

extended through FY 2018. 

a. Do you believe that hiring freezes lead to decreases in government spending? 

I believe that hiring freezes can lead to decreases in government spending over time. 

b. If so, does this come at a cost to efficiency and productivity? Do you believe the use 

of contractors is necessary and cost effective? 

As to whether contractors are necessary and cost effective, I think it depends on the 

agency involved and the particular job to be done. However, any assessment needs 

to consider the long-term costs of adding full-time civilian employees onto the rolls 

for purposes of federal benefits. 

Budget and Economic Policy 

35. At a March 13,2013, Homeland Security and Governmental Affairs Committee hearing 

titled "The Costs and Impacts of Crisis Budgeting," witnesses discussed the numerous 

management and other challenges government shutdowns and continuing resolutions create 

for federal agencies, state governments, and government employees. If confirmed, you will 

play an important role in ensuring that agencies across government are effectively managing 

the resources entrusted to them. What steps would you take to avoid the waste and 

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inefficiency that can result from the kind of budget uncertainty agency managers have been 

forced to deal with in recent years? 

If confirmed, I would encourage a return to regular order in the appropriations process 

and early planning to ensure that the Administration is working with Congress on its 

priorities in order to avoid crisis budgeting. 

36. The debt limit, or debt ceiling, reached the end of its suspension on March I 6, 2017. 

Existing obligations will require that the debt ceiling be raised in order to avoid breaching the 

debt limit. 

a. Do you believe it is necessary to raise the debt ceiling? Why or why not? 

Yes, I believe it is important to raise the debt ceiling in order to pay our bills. At the 

same time, I believe it is vital to consider reforms that force fiscal discipline and 

better enable the nation to deal with its debt problems. 

b. What do you believe would be the impact of not raising the debt ceiling? Would 

there be impacts on the credit rating of the United States, on the stock market, on the 

national and global economy? 

The debt ceiling bas always been raised, and I do not envision a scenario where it 

will not be, nor can I anticipate what the impact would be. 

37.OMB Director Mick Mulvaney bas argued that, were the debt ceiling breached, the 

government could choose which obligations to pay and which not to pay, and therefore that 

the debt ceiling can be breached without the government going into default on its debts. Do 

you agree with that argument? If so, and if the debt ceiling were not raised at some future 

point, which government obligations would you prioritize for payment? Which would you 

prioritize for default? 

Yes. As Director Mulvaney stated in his questionnaire, default is a technical term to 

describe the non-payment of interest or principle on debt. Since there is revenue sufficient 

to pay those particular bills, default would not immediately result. Prioritization would 

have to be informed by the available revenues for that particular month after debt 

payments have been made. 

38. In your view, what actions should Congress and the Administration take to address long term 

structural budgetary imbalances? By what amount do you believe our deficit should be 

reduced in order to stabilize our finances, and by how much in the short term and by how 

much in the long term? What level of publicly held debt as a percentage of GDP do you 

believe would be appropriate to achieve by 2025? 

I believe it is critical to address our nation's long-term structural budget imbalance. I think 

we should balance the federal budget and keep it balanced so that the debt can be 

eliminated over time. 

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IV. Relations with Congress and the Public 

39. If confirmed, how will you make certain that you will respond in a timely manner to Member 

requests for information? 

Yes, subject to the discretion of Director and the advice of legal counsel. 

40. If confirmed, do you agree without reservation to reply to any reasonable request for 

information from the Ranking Member of any duly constituted committee of the Congress? 

1. If confirmed, do you agree without reservation to reply to any reasonable request for 

information from members of Congress? 

Yes, subject to the discretion of Director and the advice of legal counsel. 

2. If confirmed, do you commit to take all reasonable steps to ensure that you and your 

agency complies with deadlines established for requested information? 

Yes. 

3. If confirmed, do you commit to protect subordinate officials or employees from reprisal or 

retaliation for any testimony, briefings or communications with members of Congress? 

Yes. 

41. Do you agree without reservation to identify to the Committee all Presidential appointments 

(regardless of Senate confirmation requirements) within OMB? Do you agree without 

reservation to allow Committee staft: as requested, an opportunity to interview such 

appointments? 

Yes, subject to the discretion of the Director, advice of legal counsel, and if agreed to by 

Majority and Minority staff. 

42. If confirmed, will you ensure that your staff will fully and promptly provide information and 

access to appropriate documents and officials in response to requests made by the 

Government Accountability Office (GAO) and the Congressional Research Service? 

Yes, subject to the advice of legal counsel. 

43. If confirmed, will you agree to work with representatives from this Committee and the GAO 

to promptly implement recommendations for improving OMB's operations and 

effectiveness? 

Yes. If confirmed, I will study their recommendations to improve OMB. 

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44. If confinned, will you direct your agency to fully and promptly respond to Freedom of 

lnfonnation Act requests submitted by the American people? 

Y cs, to the extent consistent with all applicable rules, regulations, exemptions and policies. 

45. If confinned, will you direct your staff to adopt a presumption of openness where practical, 

including identifying documents that can and should be proactively released to the public 

without requiring a Freedom oflnfonnation Act request? 

Yes. 

46. If con finned, will you keep this Committee apprised of new infonnation if it materially 

impacts the accuracy ofinfonnation your agency's officials have provided us? 

Yes. 

V. Assistance 

47. Are these answers completely your own? If not, who has provided you with assistance? 

These answers arc my own. I have at times consulted with the OMB staff to inform my 

thoughts and responses. 

48. Have you consulted with OMB or any other interested parties? If so, please indicate which 

entities. 

See question 47. 

l, Q. .. ss. \J.,.,svJ-- , hereby state that I have read the foregoing Pre-Hearing 

Questionnaire and Supplemental Questionnaires and that the infonnation provided therein is, to 

the best of my knowledge, current, accurate, and complete. 

(Signature) 

,2017 

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Sen. Heidi Heitkamp 

Post-Hearing Questions for the Record 

Submitted to Russell Vought 

Nomination for Russell Vought to be Deputy Director 

Office of Management and Budget 

1. The Office of Management and Budget (OMB) utilizes a Benefit-Cost Ratio 

(BCR) for determining which U.S. Army Corps of Engineers Flood Risk 

Management projects are funded in the president's budget. In some instances, the 

BCR overstates the true cost to the federal government because it assumes that all 

dollars spent on a project are federal dollars, despite the fact that a substantial 

portion of the money spent may come from non-federal sources, such as publicprivate partnerships (P3). Unfortunately, OMB's method does not adequately 

capture P3 projects, such as the Fargo-Moorhead diversion in my state, where there 

is substantial non-federal investments, often far exceeding the typical 65/35 

federal/non-federal funding split. In the case of the project in my state, the nonfederal funding commitment to the project is nearly 80 percent versus 20 percent 

from the federal government due to the use of a P3 partnership. This innovative 

financing arrangement saves the federal government hundreds of millions of dollars 

and yields a substantial return on investment. 

a. How can OMB best account for these types of projects in its budgeting 

deliberations when the standard BCR doesn't accurately reflect the true costs of the 

project to the federal government? 

b. Will you commit to working with the U.S. Army Corps of Engineers to properly 

take non-federal investments into account? 

I am committed to improving the way in which the Federal government works, in order 

to better serve the American people. In the Corps program, I would be interested in 

finding ways to work with non-Federal sponsors who arc prepared to contribute more 

than the required amount for their water resources projects. Their willingness to 

contribute more demonstrates the importance of the project to them. If confirmed, I look 

forward to working with the Corps on how it evaluates its projects, including how it takes 

non-federal investments into account. 
161 

Sen. Heidi Heitkamp 

Post-Hearing Questions for the Record 

Submitted to Russell Vought 

Nomination for Russell Vought to be Deputy Director 

Office of Management and Budget 

2. Last year, Congress passed the Program Management Improvement and 

Accountability Act (PL 114-264), which I was proud to cosponsor with Senator 

Ernst (R-IA). The law requires several actions by the Office of Management and 

Budget over the next year to improve the management of major programs and 

projects in the federal government. We owe it to the taxpayers of this country to 

make sure these programs and projects are completed on time and on budget. 

a. Will you commit to ensuring this law is implemented successfully and according 

to schedule? 

b. Will you commit to work with this committee on the implementation of the law? 

Improving the management of programs and projects to ensure the government operates 

more effectively and ell1ciently is a priority for OMB, and a management priority of this 

Administration. I support efforts to improve program and project management and will 

work to ensure the law and its provisions are implemented successfully. If confirmed, I 

will ensure this legislation is implemented in a manner that will ensure program and 

project managers arc held accountable for effective management using objective data and 

evidence, and that programs are regularly reviewed to ensure they are operating 

efficiently and addressing important outcomes. I welcome the opportunity to collaborate 

closely with the Committee as this legislation is implemented, and commit to providing 

regular updates both to Congress, key stakeholders, and the public. 
162 

Sen. Heidi Heitkamp 

Post-Hearing Questions for the Record 

Submitted to Russell Vought 

Nomination for Russell Vought to be Deputy Director 

Office of Management and Budget 

3. The Justice Department's Office of Legal Counsel (OLC) recently determined 

that executive branch agencies have no legal obligation to respond to congressional 

requests for information from individual members or ranking members of 

committees. Oversight of the executive branch is a core tenet of Congress, and I 

have serious concerns that this ruling weakens the ability of Congress to hold 

government accountable. During your Senate nomination hearing, I expressed to 

you my concerns about your lack of commitment to responding without reservation 

to reasonable requests for information from members of the minority party. 

a. Please elaborate on why you will not commit to responding without reservation 

to reasonable requests for information from members of Congress. 

I take very seriously Congress' vital role in performing oversight of the Executive 

Branch. While the OLC opinion to which you refer describes the Executive Branch's 

aftirmative obligations in responding to certain Congressional requests, it does not 

prohibit sharing information with individual members of Congress. I can assure you that, 

if confirmed, I am committed to working with Congress so that it has the information it 

needs to perform its oversight functions and accordingly will work with the Director to 

respond to reasonable requests for information that OMB receives from members of 

Congress. 
163 

Ranking Member Claire McCaskill 

Post-Hearing Questions for the Record 

Submitted to Russell Vought 

Nomination for Russell Vought to be Deputy Director 

Office of Management and Budget 

1. During your confirmation hearing you testified that you believe the May 1, 2017, 

opinion issued by the Department of Justice Office of Legal Counsel (OLC) to be 

the controlling guidance regarding how executive branch agencies should respond 

to requests from ranking members of congressional committees. 

The OLC opinion states that agencies have the "discretion" to respond to oversight 

requests from ranking members or individual members of Congress. The OLC 

opinion identifies that "the Executive Branch has historically exercised its 

discretion in determining whether and how to respond." If confirmed, would you 

commit to responding to any reasonable request for information from the Ranking 

Member of any duly constituted committee of the Congress? 

The OLC opinion also states, "Whether it is appropriate to respond to requests 

from individual members will depend on the circumstances." Please describe the 

factors you will weigh in evaluating the circumstances that will warrant a response 

to a request by the Ranking Member of any duly constituted committee of Congress. 

Yes, I respect the important role that Congress plays in performing oversight of the 

Executive Branch. If confirmed, I am committed to working with Congress so that it has 

the information it needs to perform its oversight functions and accordingly will work 

with the Director to respond to reasonable requests for information that OMB receives 

from members of Congress. In accommodating those requests, I will ensure OMB weighs 

all appropriate circumstances, including determining whether it can respond in a manner 

that is not overly burdensome and does not interfere with its ability to respond in a timely 

manner to duly authorized oversight requests. 
164 

Ranking Member Claire McCaskill 

Post-Hearing Questions for the Record 

Submitted to Russell Vought 

Nomination for Russell Vought to be Deputy Director 

Office of Management and Budget 

2. In the past, OMB has not conducted coordinated reviews of tax expenditures with 

related federal spending programs. Such reviews could identify opportunities to 

reduce overlap and inconsistences and direct scarce resources to the most effective 

or least costly methods to deliver federal support. As you begin reviewing programs 

areas and budgets, do you plan to include tax expenditures as part ofthose reviews? 

If so, how do you plan to approach these reviews? 

Reviewing tax expenditures can have important benefits, such as aiding efforts to close 

loopholes and simplify the tax code. Reviewing tax expenditures and eliminating 

unnecessary or inefficient tax expenditures can also improve government efficiency. If 

confirmed, I will look at how OMB can incorporate more extensive review of tax 

expenditures as part of the annual budget process. 
165 

Ranking Member Claire McCaskill 

Post-Hearing Questions for the Record 

Submitted to Russell Vought 

Nomination for Russell Vought to be Deputy Director 

Office of Management and Budget 

3. What are your views on how OMB should work with agencies to develop their 

reform plans, as well as crosscutting reform proposals, as Director Mulvaney laid 

out in his April 2017 memo? How would you engage the Congress and other key 

stakeholders in this reform effort"? 

Government reform is a critical endeavor to create a lean, more effective, efficient, and 

accountable government for the American people. OMB has been actively engaging 

agencies as they develop their reform plans in accordance with guidance M-17-22 

"Comprehensive Plan for Reforming the Federal Government and Reducing the Federal 

Civilian Workforce." At a government wide level, OMB has been communicating 

steadily through the President's Management Council and with Senior Accountable 

Officials to help agencies understand the guidance, learn from one another's approaches, 

and consider issues with cross-agency implications. In addition, many OMB offices have 

been meeting individually with agencies in order to discuss early ideas and priorities. 

After agency high-level draft plans are submitted to OMB on June 30th, OMB will meet 

individually with each of the major agencies to discuss their draft plans and their path to 

develop a full plan for submission in September. 

OMB has already begun to engage stakeholders in these efforts. Importantly, the public 

comment process alone has generated over I 00,000 pieces of input that are being shared 

with each of the relevant agencies for consideration. OMB has also reached out to 

stakeholders to seck their crosscutting ideas, including Federal agencies, Congressional 

staff, GAO, and good government organizations such as the Congressionally chartered 

National Academy of Public Administration. As interested organizations reach out to 

OMB, OMB is also meeting with stakeholders to hear their ideas and understand the 

needs that they see. In the coming months, OMB will continue working across Federal 

agencies and with key stakeholders to further t1esh out actionable crosscutting plans and 

proposals that complement the work of individual agencies. 

If confirmed, I look forward to working with Congress to consider these reform proposals 

on our shared goal of making the Federal government more effective, efficient, and 

accountable government for the American people. 
166 

Ranking Member Claire McCaskill 

Post-Hearing Questions for the Record 

Submitted to Russell Vought 

Nomination for Russell Vought to be Deputy Director 

Office of Management and Budget 

4. The President's fiscal year 2018 budget proposal includes an estimated savings of 

$139 billion from reductions in improper payments. Please describe the specific 

plans OMB has to eliminate improper payments and what your role will be, if 

confirmed, in advancing these efforts. 

l am committed to addressing this problem and preventing and reducing improper 

payments so that American taxpayers can rest assured that their hard earned money is 

being invested for the common good and not squandered needlessly. Ifi am confirmed, 

I will support OMB's efforts to: 

I) Collaborate with the largest agencies with improper payments resulting in monetary 

losses to the Government and direct them to: 

I) immediately identify and confirm the primary root causes for those payments; 

2) establish and implement corrective actions that will accurately gauge their 

progress on an annual basis; 

3) provide information as to any Federal policies or statutory constraints, which 

inhibit their ability to make those payments; and 

4) provide Congress with a list of the necessary statutory changes to help us 

eliminate improper payments. 

2) Work with Congress, GAO, and agencies to assess every federally funded, state 

administered program and determine what changes must be made to assess improper 

payments in those programs and correct the conditions that cause those payments. 

3) Instruct all agencies with improper payments resulting from processing errors to revisit 

their existing procedures and amend those procedures to comply with existing payment 

practices or stop making these improper payments. 
167 

Senator Gary Peters 

Post-Hearing Questions for the Record 

Submitted to Russell Vought 

Nomination for Russell Vought to be Deputy Director 

Office of Management and Budget 

1. The President's budget completely eliminates funding for the Great Lakes 

Restoration Initiative. This program helps communities throughout the Great 

Lakes by addressing several issues within the Great Lakes ecosystem, including 

clean drinking water, restoring habitat, and combatting invasive species that 

decimate our fisheries. The Great Lakes provide drinking water to 40 million people 

in North America and support multi-billion dollar tourism, commercial fishing, 

shipping and agricultural industries in Great Lakes states. A 2007 cost-benefit 

analysis of Great Lakes protection efforts by the University of Michigan and 

Brookings Institution concluded that every dollar invested in this restoration 

generated $2 in economic return. What role did you have in the decision to eliminate 

funding for GLRI and how do you justify that decision? In preparing the FY18 

budget, did you or anyone at OMB estimate the economic benefits of GLRI or the 

economic costs to eliminating it? What do you believe the long-term impact would 

be on our economy? As OMB Deputy Director, would you commit to looking into 

this long term impact, and impacts of similar programs? 

During the formulation of the 2018 Budget, OMB worked closely with the 

Environmental Protection Agency (EPA) to set priorities and adjust funding accordingly. 

The 2018 Budget focuses the EPA's efforts on core, national environmental protection 

programs while continuing to encourage State, Tribal, and local stakeholders to sustain 

progress on the locally and regionally targeted geographic programs, such as the Great 

Lakes Restoration Initiative (GLRI). The GLRI program activities are primarily localized 

ecosystem restoration efforts and the responsibility for coordinating and funding these 

efforts generally belongs with the States and local stakeholders. State and local groups 

are engaged and capable of taking on management of the environmental restoration of 

these water bodies. OMB will continue to work with EPA to evaluate the impacts to these 

programs for future budget considerations. 
168 

Senator Gary Peters 

Post-Hearing Questions for the Record 

Submitted to Russell Vought 

Nomination for Russell Vought to be Deputy Director 

Office of Management and Budget 

2. The President's FY18 budget appeared to contain significant math errors in 

calculating economic growth, assuming that very high rates of growth would 

generate over $2 trillion in additional revenue. It also had no sufficient discussion 

of how its program cuts would affect long-term economic prospects or affect states 

and communities in the long term. What processes would you honor or put in place 

to ensure that OMB studies and considers long-term budget impacts? How would 

you give agencies and stakeholders, which have data and perspectives on the 

effectiveness of these programs, a scat at the table? 

The Budget proposals represent a vision for balancing the Federal budget and avoiding 

the severe economic consequences for States, communities, and the nation as a whole of 

unsustainable increases in the debt. The Budget proposals were developed in consultation 

with agencies and other stakeholders to accomplish this fiscal objective while honoring 

the President's campaign commitments. The Budget shows the 1 0-year estimates of the 

Administration's proposals in detail. It also shows illustrative extensions ofthese policies 

over a 25-year horizon, as compared to the extension of the unsustainable current path, 

in the "Long-Term Budget Outlook" chapter in the Analytical Perspectives volume of 

the Budget. 
169 

Senator Gary Peters 

Post-Hearing Questions for the Record 

Submitted to Russell Vought 

Nomination for Russell Vought to be Deputy Director 

Office of Management and Budget 

3. The President's FY18 budget eliminates funding for many programs with proven 

economic growth effects. For example, it would eliminate the Manufacturing 

Extension Partnership, which provides consulting services to small manufacturers. 

For every dollar of federal investment, MEP generates $17.9 in new sales growth 

for manufacturers. For every $1,501 of federal investment, MEP creates or retains 

one manufacturing job. As another example, it would eliminate the Economic 

Development Administration, which effectively leverages private investment. Two 

current EDA grants in Detroit will help bring manufacturing back to the city and 

create 5,000 ,jobs over 5 years. When deciding to eliminate programs like the 

Manufacturing Extension Partnership and the Economic Development 

Administration, did you or anyone at OMB take into account their short- and longterm effects on economic growth? 

The eliminations of the Economic Development Administration (EDA) and 

Manufacturing Extension Partnership (MEP) are part of a broader effort to eliminate 

duplicative and unauthorized economic development programs across the Federal 

Government. While the Budget proposes to eliminate these programs, it also proposes 

tax reform and regulatory reforms that will provide short- and long-term economic 

growth across the country without using taxpayer dollars. 
170 

Senator Gary Peters 

Post-Hearing Questions for the Record 

Submitted to Russell Vought 

Nomination for Russell Vought to be Deputy Director 

Office of Management and Budget 

4. One of your responsibilities at OMB would be ensuring that agencies fully 

document and justify their actions related to the budget. One important factor in 

making budget projections is accurate economic data. I am concerned about this 

administration's budget request to reduce funding for federal statistical agencies 

including the Bureau of Economic Analysis and Economic Research Service. How 

would you work to maintain rigorous economic analysis at OMB and ensure that 

agencies have accurate and complete accounting for their decisions? 

I believe that rigorous economic analysis is critical, and the President's Budget expresses 

support for using evidence and analysis in decision making. The Budget reflects a series 

of hard choices, and most agencies did see reductions in funding. Nonetheless, I believe 

that Federal statistical agencies play an important role in collecting, analyzing, and 

disseminating high-quality data to accurately account for agency performance and to 

improve government effectiveness. 
171 

JEB HENSARLING 

fEXAS, 5H! DtST!'liCT 

FINANCIAL 

({ongress of tbe mntteb ~tate% 

~'ou~e of 1\cprc~mtatiuc~ 

~a%bington.JD( 20515 

June 7, 2017 

Testimony of U.S. Representative Jeb Hensarling (TX-05) 

On the Nomination of Russell T. Vought to be the 

Deputy Director, Office of Management and Budget 

I want to thank Chainnan Enzi, Ranking Member Sanders, and the Members of the Senate 

Budget Committee for allowing me to submit testimony on behalf of Russell Vought 

Our nation faces a fiscal crisis as we are drowning in a sea of debt This $20 trillion price tag 

will smother future generations with its weight and magnitude -dooming them to a standard of 

living that is less than the one enjoyed by their parents. 

President Trump has outlined a bold, forward-looking agenda to tackle the very serious problems 

that hardworking Americans and their families face- stagnant paychecks, shrinking savings and 

a skyrocketing debt burden racked up by their federal government 

I believe President Trump showed his strong commitment to addressing this dire debt situation 

when he nominated my former colleague, Mick Mulvaney, to be our nation's OMB Director. 

The President has further demonstrated leadership on our spending driven debt crisis by 

nominating Russ Vought as the Deputy Director of that office. 

I personally know of Russ' commitment to our nation and the cause of liberty because I had the 

distinct honor of working ·with him. 

Russ began his service to the American people and Congress immediately following his 

graduation from Wheaton College in !998. After a brief stint with then-retiring Senator Dan 

Coats, Russ joined the staff of my political mentor, Texas Senator Phil Gramm. During those 

four years with Senator Gramm, Russ became a keen student of legislative procedure and a 

master of federal budget policy. 

After I had the good fortune of being elected by the people of the 5th District of Texas, Russ 

joined my staff as Policy Director- where he served as my top adviser on budget issues and 

worked for several years providing invaluable counsel to me on tax, entitlement and spending 

policy. When 1 became Chainnan of the Republican Study Committee in the II O'h Congress, 

Russ served me and the I 00-plus members of the committee as Executive Director with integrity 

and an unwavering devotion to the conservative cause we shared. 

2228 RAVSURN HOUSE Ornct: BUILDING, WASH!NG'TON, DC 20515 * (202) 225·3484 
172 

cnlunilmuSiup, Russ \\·ent on to serve then-Conference Chairman Mike 

r'cpuowoan Conference. where he served as principle 

appropriations, Social Security.lcgislative procedure and entitlements. 

Throughout his career. Russ' devotion to constitutional, limited principles has 

always been second to none. 1 once said that 1 could take heart that Russ' service to the 

cause of liberty would continue in he chooses tor his As the Senate fulfills 

its constitutional duty of advice and consent} ask that truly recognize the impressive 

qualifications Russ Vought brings to this position and you confirm him without delay. 

Yours Respectfully. 
173 

United States Senate Homeland Security and Government Affairs Committee 

Hearing on the Nomination of Neomi Rao to be the Administrator of the Office of 

Information and Regulatory Affairs, Office of Management and Budget 

Statement ofNeomi Rao 

June 7, 2017 

Chairman Johnson, Ranking Member McCaskill, and Members of the Committee, 

it is an honor to appear before you as the President's nominee to be the Administrator of 

the Office oflnformation and Regulatory Affairs. I am grateful to the President and 

Director Mulvaney for their trust and confidence. 

At the outset, I would like to thank the Members of this Committee and their staff 

for taking the time to meet with me. I appreciate your graciousness and the chance to 

connect and discuss issues about the regulatory process. For those of you I did not have 

an opportunity to meet, I hope we might have a chance after the hearing. If confirmed, I 

look forward to working closely with Members of the Committee on issues relating to 

regulatory and information policy. 

If you will indulge me, I will take a moment to recognize my family. I am here 

today with my husband, Alan Lefkowitz, and my two children Isabella and Ezra. Alan's 

unwavering support has made it possible for me to even consider the demands of public 

service. My father, Dr. Jehangir Rao, is also here, and has believed in me at every stage 

of my life. I remember also my remarkable and loving mother, Dr. Zerin Rao, who died 

too young of cancer, and wish she could have been here to share this day. Leaving India 

in January 1972, my parents arrived in Detroit in the middle of a snowstorm without 

winter jackets, but with their medical degrees, $16, and the optimism of the recently 

married. They always imparted by example the importance of integrity, perseverance, 

kindness, and a commitment to service. 

Let me share some information about my background. For the past ten years, I 

have been a law professor at the Antonin Scalia Law School at George Mason University, 

teaching constitutional law and legislation and statutory interpretation. My scholarship 

has focused on the framework of constitutional accountability for administrative 

agencies. About two years ago, I founded the Center for the Study of the Administrative 

State. The Center commissions academic research and hosts public policy conferences, 

bringing together scholars, practitioners, and government officials to analyze and debate 

difficult questions of administrative Jaw. 

Prior to my academic career, I worked in the Office of the White House Counsel, 

where I oversaw the legal work of a number of agencies and helped to coordinate 

interagency discussions about law and policy. I have also served on the Senate Judiciary 

Committee as counsel for nominations and constitutional law. My other experience 

includes working for several years at a law firm in London and clerking for Justice 

1 
174 

Clarence Thomas of the U.S. Supreme Court and Judge J. Harvie Wilkinson III of the 

U.S. Court of Appeals for the Fourth Circuit. 

My academic background and practical experience in all three branches of the 

federal government have helped me to understand the regulatory process and the 

respective roles of Congress, the President, and the courts in administration. 

Since Congress established OIRA in the Paperwork Reduction Act of 1980, OIRA 

has operated with a consistent mission to improve the quality of decisionmaking in 

administrative agencies through regulatory review and the coordination of information 

policy. OIRA plays a vital role within the Executive Branch to ensure that administrative 

agencies follow the law, base their decisions on the best possible economic and technical 

analysis, and fulfill presidential priorities. Within the requirements set by Congress, 

OIRA works with an overarching goal of creating the greatest benefits for the American 

people while minimizing regulatory burdens. 

Reading through OIRA's statutory authorities as well as Executive Orders and 

OMB Guidance, I have been struck by the consistency of the principles guiding the work 

of the office across administrations. Perhaps this is one reason so many talented 

professionals work at OIRA and often stay for many years serving presidents of different 

parties. 

I am humbled to be nominated for this role. If confirmed as Administrator, I 

would work to ensure the continuity ofOIRA's principles, updating and refining when 

necessary, but maintaining the integrity of the process that has developed. I would also 

look forward to working with Members of this Committee and other Members of 

Congress on legislation relating to regulatory reform and other issues within OIRA's 

purview. 

Thank you for your consideration. I look forward to answering your questions. 

2 
175 

REDACTED 

HSGAC BIOGRAPHICAL QUESTIONS FOR 

EXECUTIVE NOMINEES 

l'lcnsc pi·Qyidc the following information. 

Administrator. Ofnce nflnformalion nnd R~gulatory 

Affairs. Office of Mmwgcmenl and Budget 

NIA 

Intent lo nominate: April 7, 20! 7 

From 

(Mm11h1Year) 

(Check box if 

estimate) 

Nnme Used To 

-(Monthly;a-;)-

(Check box if 

estimate) 

Est 
176 

Middle Name 

N/A 

2 

Numc Used To 

( M onu;;v;,;-~) 

(Check box ;r 

cstimnte) 

Est 

[sl 
177 

List nil post-secondary schools attended. 

Name 91 ~)QQI 

IY!l!'.Jlf..§£!!9Jll 

(vucatimml/lcdulicnlitrndt• $Chool. 

collegclunivl!rslt}'/militnrs C{l!lcgc1 

com.:;:;pondcncc/distancc/t.!Xlcnsiun/ontinc. 

school) 

Yale University--

University 

University of Law School 

Chicago 

Date Beg~!! 

School 

(ninnthlycar) 

(check box if 

estimate) 

9/1991 

t~t 

9/1996 

Date En<lc<l 

-SellOOI . 

(mnmi;iycar) (check hox if cstimalc} 

(chc..::k ''present .. box 

if still in school) 

5!1995 

l:sl l'rtJ>.cnt J.D. 

(>/1999 

!2'l!!l 

A>tun!s.<J 

51!995 

6!1999 

(A) List all of your employment activities, including unemployment and self-employment. 

If the employment activity was military duty,list sepa..ate employment activity periods to 

show each change of military duty station. Do not list employment before your 18th 

birthday unless to provide a minimum of two years of employment history. 

Tvpc of Employment 

(Active ;\,til\tmy lluty l>tation, 

NntiOnttl Guard/Rt:scrvc. 

USPHS Co111missioned Ct)fps. 

Oqtcr Fe<Jcml cinf)l9Yinf.?tll, 

State Govcrm11cnl (Non· 

f'cdcrul Emp.loymc!\1), Sclf-

¢tn!)!nymcnt1 Unemployment. 

Federal Contmct<11'~ Non· 

GoVernment Employment 

(cxclllding sclf-cmploynmnt), 

Other 

State Government 

State Government 

NnmeofYour 

Empl<!yerl 

Assigned Duty 

Sta!l2!! 

Antonin Scalia Law 

Schooft George 

Mnson University 

Amonin Scalia Law 

School, George 

Mason University 

~ccent 

Position 

Titlc/Ranfl 

Associate 

Professor 

Founder and 

Director of the 

Center for the 

Studyofthc 

3 

Location 

(City and 

Sture 

only) 

Arfingto 

n, VA 

Arlingto 

n, VA 

Date 

~m.lll!!Y!ucnt 

n£g_l\.!! (month/ycur) 

(check box if 

cstimall!} 

1-:st 8a£Jfl6 

'lilOI;t; 

Dale 

limplovmcnt 

Ended 

(m;;~th/ycnr) 

(check box ir 

i:Stimm~) 

(check 

"present" box 

lfOtill 

employed) 
178 

Administrative 

Stale 

Other Federal employment While House Associate Washingt f::~t 

4f~!IHS E•n 1/lltt!(, 

Counsel and on~ DC ,, 

Special 

Assistant to 

tho President 

Non·govcrnmcnt CliOonl Chance LLP Associate London. t~l 

11121102 z.:,t 312110~ ,, employment England r: 

Bar Ex<.ltn~ Washing! E~1 r:~1 

Unemployment Temple Bar Fellow, on, DC 7121)02 ttfi:WI\2 :·\ 

American 1nns of 

Court 

Supreme Court· Law Clerk Washing! K11 r::o.t 

Other Federal employment Justice Clarence on, DC 7{21101 0 M!IIU! 

Thomas 

U.S. Senate Counsel for Wnshingt 9/20!11) fl/!001 

Other Federal employment Committee on the Nominations on. DC 

Judiciary and 

Constitutionul 

Law 

Unemployment Washingt 7/2000 8!lUUO 

on, DC 

Other f'cdcral crnploymcnt U.S. Court of Law Clerk Charlotte '1n99'> 6/2!l!IU 

Appeals for the sville. 

Fourth Circuit-Judge VA J. Harvie Wilkinson 

Ill 

NonMgovernmcnt Gibson. Dunn & Summer Washing! 711998 11!1•)')}1 

employment Crutcher Associate on, DC 

Non-government Williams& Summer Washingt 6/1998 111998 

employment Connelley Associate on, DC 

Non-government Institute for Justice Law clerk Washing! (i/1'}97 11119')7 

employment on, DC 

Non~govcrnmcnt The Weekly Standard Reporter Wushingt 111??5 111'>% 

employment (mugazine) on, DC 

{B) List any advisory, consultative, honor·ary or other part-time service or· positions with 

fcllcral, state, or local govemmcnts, not listed clscwllcre, 

Na1ne of.Govcrnmcnt }'lame of !'osition 

.!'<!lillY 

4 

Dntg Sct·vicc 

.!!£il!!!! 

(month/ycnr) 

(check box if 

cstimmc) 

lli!!t.§!IJ"vicc Ended 

(month/yc.M} {check bo:x 

if cstim~ttc) (check 

"prcscnf' box if still 

ile'rviltl!} 

I 

I 
179 

Adminislrntive 

Conference of the 

United Stutes 

Public Member f:~l l'tfM'Ill 

(A) Des<:ribe nny business relationship, dealing or financial transaction which you have had 

during the last 10 years, whether· for yourself, on behalf of a client, or acting as an agent, 

that could in any way constitute or result in a possible conflict of interest in the position to 

which you have been nominated. 

I do not believe I have any relationships or financial dealings that would constitute or result in a 

con!licl of interest. 

(B) I>cscribc any activity during the past lO ycnrs in which you lmve engaged for the 

pur·posc of directly or indit-cctly influencing the passage, defeat or modification of any 

legislation or affecting the administration or execution oflaw or public policy, othe1· than 

while in a fedcml government capacity. 

None. 

List all scholarships, fellowships, honorary degrees, civilian service citations, military 

medals, academic or professional honors, honomry society memberships and :my other 

special recognition for outstanding service or achievement. 

Temple Bar Fellowship, American Inns of Court 

Order of the Coif~ University of Chicago Law School 

Cum Laude, High Distinction in Ethics, Politics, and Economics, and Philosophy, Yale 

University 

Humane Studies Scholarship. Institute for Humane Studies 

5 
180 

List all memberships that you have held in professional, social, business, fraternal, 

scholarly, civic, or cha.-itable o•·ganizntions in the last 1.0 years. 

Unless relevant to your nomination, you do NOT need to include mcmbc•·ships in 

chnritable orgnnizntions available to the public as a •·csult of a tax deductible donation of 

Sl,OOO or less, Parent-Teacher Associations or other m·gauizati()ns connected to schools 

attended by your children, nthletie clubs or teams, automobile support organizations (such 

as AAA), discounts clubs (such as Groupon o•· Sam's Club), or affinity 

mcmbc•·ships/consumer clubs (such as frequent flyer memberships). 

Nnme or OrgnnizatJOt\ Datssof.Y.l!l!rMcmbcrJ!l!iJ! Position[s) Held {\'oumny 11Jlproximnte.) 

Adas Jsmcl Synagogue 91 2005 to present None. 

Federalist Society '!11996 to present Executive Comm!Hce. Scpuration of 

Powers and Federalism Practice 

Group: 

Executive Committee~ International 

and NationHI Security Lrnv Practice 

G!"Oup: 

President, University of Chicago 

I.aw School Chapter 

American Bar Association 912006 to present Council Member, Administrative 

Law and Regulati.ny Practict.! Oroup 

(since 8!20 I 6); 

Co-Chair, Regulatory Policy 

Committee (since 112016) 

(A) Have you ever been n candidate for or been elected or appointed to a political office'! 

No. 

(H) List any offices held in o1· services rendered to a political party or election committee 

during the last ten years that you have not listed elsewhere. 

None, 

~ru:!:YL~ ·-l Officc/Se•·viccs Rendered l>otcs of Committee _Responsibilities Servtcc 

I 6 
181 

(C) Itemize all individual political contributions of $200 or more that you have made in the 

past live years to any individual, campaign organization, political party, political action 

committee, or similar entity. Please list each individual contl'ibution and not the total 

amount contributed to the person or entity during the year. 

- Nrunc of Reci]>ient ~!!!OIIllt Y car of CQI!!ribution -.-

Jcb Bush $1000 20!5 

Ted Cruz (Senate) $250 20!2 

Mitt Romney $500 2012 

Mitt Romney $250 2012 

John McCain $500 200& 

John Adams ror i\ltorncy Gcnerul (Virginia) S500 2016 

Joan Larsen for Justice (Michigan) $250 2016 

8. Publications and ~peeches 

(A) List the titles, publishers and dates of books, articles, rep01·ts or other published 

materials that you have written, including articles published on the Internet. Plcnse provide 

7 

I 

I 
182 

the Committee with copies of all listed publications. In lieu of luu·d copies, electronic copies 

can be provided vin e-mail o1· othct· digital format. 

Titl~ E!I!!!l~u;r _Q;tltl!;)_o .L!'-'!!!ll~!!!l!>J! 

Administmtivc Collusion: t)Q New York University Luw Review 1463 2015 

How Delegation Diminishes 

the Collective Congress 

Removal: Necessary and 65 Alabama Lnw Review I 205 2014 

Sufficient li.)t' Prcsidcntiol 

Control 

The Trouble with Uignity 99 Virginia Law Review Online 29 2013 

and Rights of Recognition 

The Choice to Pmtcct: 44 Columbia Human Rights Law Review 697 2013 

Rethinking Responsibility 

!'1..1r flWlHl!litarian 

Intervention 

Public Choice and 96 M inncsota Law Review 194 2011 

JmcmntionaJ Law 

Compliance: The Executive 

Hrnnch is a Thcv Not an IL 

American Dignity and 35 Harvard Journal of Law and Public Policy 171 2011 

Heullhcare Reform 

A Modest Proposal: 79 Fordham Law Review 2541 2011 

Abolishing Agency 

lndepcndcncc in Free 

Enterprise Fund v. P('AOB 

Three Ctmccpts of Dignity in 86 Notre Dame Low Review 183 2011 

Constitutional Law 

Gender, Race. and Individual 70 Ohio Suue Law Jounml 1053 2009 

Dignity: Evuluating Justice 

Ginsburg's Equality 

Jtlrisnmdcncc 

lhc President's Sphere of 45 Willamctte Law Review 527 2009 

Action 

On the Use and Abuse of 14 Columbia Journal of European Law 20 I 2008 

Dignity in ConstitutionGI 

Lnw 

Background Information on 5 Business Law Intemationa! 433 2004 

tho IBA Guidelines on 

Conflicts of Interest in 

lnternatjonnl Arbitration 

Arbim.Hion MccLS the Ch1ss 6 International ArbitnHion Law Review 216 2003 

Action 

A Backdoor to Policy 65 University of Chicago Law Review 1371 !998 

Making: The Usc of 

Philosophers by the Supreme 

Court 

8 
183 

John Roberts Oxford Encyclopedia of American Political and 2012 

Legal History, 0:\ford University Press 

Like Scalia, the law school at Tho Wnshington Post AprilS, 2016 

George Mnsnn U. has n 

maverick slrcnk 

Article I. Section I: The National Cohstitution Ceilter 2016 

Non·Delcgation Principle lnteracUve Constitution, availnbte at 

Persists https://constitutioncenler.orglintcraclivccunstitution/. 

'Tilcsupremc Court's rule by Tl1e Washinglon Examiner July 7, 2015 

talking pt)ints 

Real Dt'one Strike The Nc\',· York Times April25, 20 IS 

Accountabilily Requires 

Political Check~ 

A talc of two dignities The Dilily Caller January 24.2013 

The Constitution: Not Just Wall Street Journal January 10,2011 

for Courts 

Elena Kagan and the Wall Street Journtll Mnyll,2010 

'Hollow Charade' 

Tnklng a Constimtionaf Book review of Tile Citizen's Constitution by Seth January 20 l 0 

Lipsky. Commcntmy 

Questions tOr Sotomayor Wall Street lou mal May 27.2009 

One Writer's Battles The Weekly Standard November 10, 1996 

i 

i 

Stonewalling at Yale The Weekly Standard June 24, 1996 

The Hottest Duo in Academe The Weekly Standard April22, 1996 

(B) List any formal speeches you have delivered during the last five years and provide the 

Committee with copies of those speeches relevant to the position for which you have been 

nominated. Include any testimony to Congress m· any other legislative or administrative 

body. These items can be provided electronically via e-mail or other digital format. 

Iitlc!fopic Place/Audience DJ!fc(s) of Spc£_ch 

llearing on E;oc.:amining Agency Usc U.S. Senate Committee on March I 7, 2016 

of Dclcrence, Pm1 IT Homeland Security and Government 

Affairs. Subcommittee Qn 

9 

I 
184 

Regulatory Affairs nnd Federal 

Management I 

Heuring on The Administrative State U.S. Senate Committee on the July 23, 2015 

v. Tho Constiltltion: Dodd-Frunk at Judiciary. Subcommittee on the 

Five Yt!ars Constitution 

Hen ring on the Nominalion of Sonia U.S. St:natc Committee on the July 16, 2009 

Sotomayor to be an Associate Judiciary 

Jusliceofthe Supreme Court 

(C) List all speeches and testimony you have delivered in the past ten years, except for 

those the text of which you nrc providing to the Committee. 

When speaking, I use only informal notes and therefore do not have lhe text to provide 

for these appearances. Most of the speeches and panel discussions relate to my 

scholarship discussed in greater detail in publications listed in (A). I have provided copies 

or all of these publications to the Committee. 

Panel: 1 ustice Thomas and the 

Administmtive State. Conference on 

CelcbnHing Justice Thomas.: 25 

Years on the Suorcmc Court 

Panel: Arliclc I Project 

Panel: Regulatory Overreach 

Panel: The Lone Jurist. Conference 

on The Jurisprudence oi'Ciarcnec 

Thomas: 25 Y cnrs on the Courl 

Papc}; Parliaments, Prc:;idcnts, and 

Prime Ministers 

Roundtable: Congress, Delegation, 

and the Administrative State 

Panel: The Imperial Presidency? 

Executive Overreach and Civi1 

Justice 

Panel: Future of Judicial Deference 

Yale Law School 

Capitol Visitor's Center, 

Washington. DC 

State Farm Legislative Conference 

Chicago, IL 

Capitol Hill, Washington, DC 

Transatlantic Legal forum 

Hamburg, Germany 

American Political Science 

Association 

Philadelphia, I' A 

American Constilution Society 

National Convention 

Washington, DC 

Lawye-rs for Civil Justice National 

Conference 

Washington, DC 

Amcrh::an Bar Association. 

Administrative Law & Regulatory 

Praclicc Jnsritutc 

10 

February 10, 2017 

January t2, 2017 

November I I, 20 16 

October 24, 2016 

September 24, 20 I G 

September 2, 2016 

June 12.2016 

May 6, 2016 

March 15,2016 
185 

Washington, DC 

Panel: Rcgulutory Capture ii1 Administrntive Con terence of the Mnrch 3, 2016 

Rulcmaking U.S .. Regulatory Capture Forum 

Washington, DC 

Congress and the Administrative Congressional Fellows Program in Februmy 5. 20 I 6 

State Constitutional l .. aw 

Washington, DC 

Panel: The Living Congress-- Federalist Society National November 1.1. 2015 

Adaptation or Declintl! Convention 

Wnshington. DC 

Panel: The Constitutional Future ol' American Bar Assochlilon October 29,2015 

Administrative Law Judges Administrative Law ConlCrcncc 

Washington. DC 

P~mel: Administmtivc Law in Crisis'? Transatlnmic La\.v Forum October 23. 2015 

Arlington. VA 

Panel: S1.1prcme Court Preview Heritage Foundation and October9, 2015 

Conservative Women's Network 

Washington, DC 

Panel: Supreme Court Preview New York University Lnw School September 30, 2015 

Now York, NY 

Panel: Tim lnccnlives I3ehiJJd Federalist Society E!oi:ecutive Branch June 18,2015 

Congressional Delegation Review Conference 

Washington, DC 

Panel: Perez r. tHOr/gage Banker . ..,· A1nerican B&r Asso-ciation April 30, 3015 

rl.\·soc.-~-The Justices Answer One Administrative Law Institute 

Question but Ask Another W.ushingtQn, DC 

The Executive: Unitary. Not University of Minnesota redcralist November 21, 2014 

Unilateral Society 

Minneapolis, MN 

Interview with Damon Root on Washington, DC November 18, 2014 

book. "Overruled: The Long War tor 

the Control of the Supreme Cotlrf' 

Collective Congress University of Chicago Alumni November· 15. 20!4 

Breakfast, Federalist Society 

Washington, DC 

Abolish Agency Independence? University of Texas Law School, October !3, 20 14 

Federalist Society 

Austin, TX 

Panel: Shedding Light on the American Constittltion Society Junc21, 2014 

PRISM or Government National Convention 

Washington, DC 

Panel: Supreme Court Rc.view North American South Asian Dar June 20,2014 

Association National Convention 

Chicago. IL 

Panel: Executivl! Power and the Role Federalist Sociel)' Executive Branch May 7, 2014 

oCthc Coordinate Bnmchcs Review Confereltcc 

Washington, DC 

11 
186 

Removal: Necessary and Sunicient University of Chicago Federalist April25. 2014 

for Presidential Control Society 

Chicago, IL 

Women's Law Association George Mason Law S~hoo1 April9,2014 

Brcilklnst Arlington,. VA 

Securing Rights Fordham Law School, Conference September 20, 2013 

on Citizenship, Immigration~ and 

Nntional Security aflcr 91! I 

New York, NY 

Panel: The-Roberts Court al Age Virginia Bm· Association July 19,2013 

Seven: The 2013 U.S. Supreme Hot Springs, VA 

Courl Term in Review 

Panel: Human RigiHs in Times of Amcrica11 Association of Low January 6. 20 13 

Conflict Schools Annual Meeting 

Panel: Human Rights and National American Bar Association 21111 November 30,2012 

Security Lnw Issues Annual Review of the Field of I National Security Lnw I 

Washington, DC 

Panel: Supreme Court Review North American South Asian Bar June 30. 2012 

Assodation National Convention 

Philadelphia, PA 

Is Universal Hcnlthcare Compatible South Texas Law School Federalist April 12,2011 

with 1hc American Conception ()f Society 

Human Dignity? Houston, TX 

Constitutional Interpretation Denver-University Federalist Society March 14,2012 

Denver, CO 

Three Concepts (>f Dign it)/ University of Colorado at Boulder March 15.2012 

Law School, Federalist Society 

Boulder, CO 

ls Universal Hc-~tlthcm·e Compatibll;! University of Florida Law School Febnm•)' 2&, 20 12 

with the American Conception of Federalist Society 

lltnmm Dignity'! Gainesville. FL 

Panel: Habits of Compliance'/ American Branch of the October 21,2011 

International Law and the Executive International Law Association, 

Iulcrnational Law Weekend 

New York. NY 

Libyn Intervention: E:xcculivc Power Duke Law School Federalist Society September 22. 20 II 

and National Security Durlmm. NC 

Libya Intervention: Executive Power University ofNorlh Carolina Law September 21,2011 and Nati01ml Security School Federalist Society 

Chapel Hill. NC 

Panel: Supreme Cotlrt Roundup North American South Asian Bar July 25,2011 

Association National Convention 

Los Angeles, CA 

Panel: Executive Power and American Constitution Society June 18,2011 Nationnl Security National Convention 

Washington, DC 

12 
187 

l'anel: Welfare State and American Federalist Society National Student February 26, 2011 

Exceptional ism Symposium 

Charlottesville. VA 

Pa11el: Must U.S. Courts Enforce American University International February 9. 20 I I 

America's International Lnw Journal Symposium 

Agreements? A Discussion of Af- Washington. DC 

/Jilumi11, Obama 

A Modest Proposal: Abolishing Fnrdhnm L~tw Review Symposium November 12.2010 

Agency Independence in Fn~e on Presidential lnnucncc over 

Emeqwise l'imd , •. PCA OB Administmtive Action 

New York. NY 

Panel: Responsibility to Prntect-- American Bmncl1 of the October 22. 20 l 0 

The Relationship between l-lumnn International Law Association. 

Dignity and Stnte Sovereignty lntcrnatiollnl Ll•w Weekend 

New York. NY 

Use of Dignity ln Constitutional University ofChicugo Law School Mny 2010 

Lnw Fedc!'alist Society 

Chicago~ IL 

Shotdd American Courts Consider I University of Virginia Law School March 3, 20 I 0 

Foreign and lnternationul Law in Federalist Society 

Trying to Interpret the American Charlottesville, VA 

Constitution? 

Three Concepts of Dignity Federalist Society Faculty January 9. 2010 

Conference 

New Orleans, LA 

Panel: Evaluating Justice Ginsburg's Ohio State Law Journal Symposium April I 0, 2009 

E<]uality Jurisprudence on The Jurisprudence of Justice Ruth 

Bader Ginsburg I 

Columbus, OH 

Panel~ India's Constitution and George Washington University. March 13. 2()09 

Individual Rights Conference on Emerging India: 

Rights und Responsibilities 

!-Panel: The President and the Law 

Washington. DC 

Willamettc Center for Law and September 12, 2008 

Government. Symposium on 

Presidentin! Powers in the 21 H I 

Century 

Snlem,OR 

Panel: Executive Discretion and the Federalist Society Faculty January 3. 2008 

Rule oi'Luw Conference 

Now Y<>rk, NY 

Panel: A Critique of the American Branch of the October 27. 2007 

International Leguf Academy International Law Association. 

International Law Weekend 

New York. NY 

9. Criminal History 

Since (and including) you1· 18u' birthdny, has any of the following hnppcncd? 

13 
188 

Have you been issued a summons. citation, or ticket to appear in court in a criminal proceeding against you? 

{Exclude citations involving traft1c infractions where the tine was less than $300 and did not include alcohol or 

dmgs.) 

o No. 

Have you been arrested by <my police officer, shcri11; mm~hal o•· any other type of law enforcemcllt official? 

o No. 

Have you been chnrgcd. convicted. or semcn.ccd ofu crime in any court? 

o No. 

Have you been or nrc you currently on probation o1· parole? 

o No. 

Are you currently 011 trial or t~waiting a trial on criminal charges? 

o No. 

To your knowledge, have you ever been the subject or target of a federal, state or local criminal invesiigation? 

o No. 

[f tho answer to any of the questions above is yes, please answer the questions below fol" 

each criminal event (citation, arrest, investigation, etc.). If the event was an in\·cstigation, 

where tho question below asll.S for information nbout the offense, please offc1· information 

about the offense under investigation (if known). 

Not :tpplknblc. 

A) Date ofo!Tens~: 

a. Is this an estlmme (Ycs:/No): 

!3) Description of the specific nature ofthe ollense: 

C) Did the offense involve any of the lbllowing? 

I) Domestic violence or u crime of violence (such as battery or assault) against y<Hir child, depend em, 

cohabitant, spouse_ forrner spou~c, or someone 'vith whom you share a child in common; Y cs I No 

2) Fiream1s or explosives: Yes I No 

3) Alcohol or drugs: Yes I No 

D) Location wlwre the oftcnse occtll'l'ed (city, county, state, zip code. country): 

E) Were you arrested. summoned, cited or did you receive a ticket to appear as a result of this offense by nny 

police officer. sheriff, marshal or any other type oflaw enforcement official: Yes I No 

I) Name ol'tltc law cntbrcemcnt agency thai arrested/cited/summoned you: 

1) Location ofrhc law enforcement a)lency (city, county. state, zip code, country): 

14 
189 

F) As n result of this offense were you charge<!, convicted. currently awaiting trial. andtor ordered to appear in 

court i"n a criminal proceeding ag.ajnst you: Yes I No 

1) If yes. provide the name of the comt and the location of the court (city, county. state, zip code. 

country}: 

2) 1 f yes. provide all the charges brought against you l(ll' this offense. and the outcome of each charged 

oflcnsc (such as tbund guilty. lbund not-guilty. charge dropped or "nolle pros." etc). lfyou were found 

guilty of or pleaded guilty to a lesser offense. list separately both the original charge and the lesser 

ofi"ensc: 

3) If no. provide explanation: 

G) Were you sentenced as a t'csu\t of this offense; Yes I No 

H) Provide a description of the sentence; 

I) Were you sentenced to imprisonment lor a term exceeding one year: Yes I No 

)) Were you incarcerllled as a result af thai sentence Jbr not less than one year: Yes I No 

K) If the conviction resulted in i!llprisonment, provide the dates that you actually were incarcerated: 

L) If conviction resulted in probation or parole, provide the dates of probutimi or parole; 

M) Arc you currently on trial, awaililig a trial, or awaiting sentencing on criminal charges for this offense: Yes I 

No 

N) Provide explanaHon: 

(A)Since (and including) your 18th birthday, have you been a party to any public record 

civil court action or administrative or legislative proceeding of any kind that resulted in (J) 

a finding of wrongdoing against you, m· {2) a settlement Hgrccmcnt for you, or some other 

person or entity, to m:1kc a payment to settle allegations against you, or for you to take, or 

refrain from taking, some action. Do NOT include small claims proceedings. 

No. 

(B) In addition to those listed above, have you or any business of which you were an officer, 

director or owner ever been involved as a party ofintcrcst in any administrative ngcncy 

proceeding or civil litigation'? I' lease identity and provide details for any proceedings or 

15 
190 

civil litigation that involve actions taken or omitted by you, or alleged to have been taken Ol' 

omitted hy you, while serving in your official capacity. 

No. 

(C) For responses to the previous question, please identify and provide details for any 

pt·occcdings or civil litigation that involve actions takt•n or omitted by you, or alleged to 

ltave been taken or omitted by you, while set•ving in your official capacity. 

Not applicable. 

(A) Have you ever been disciplined or cited f()r a breach of ethics or unp1·ofessional conduct 

by, or been the subject of a complaint to, any court, administrative agency, professional 

association, disciplinat1' committee, or other professional group? Exclude cases and 

proceedings already listed. 

No. 

(B) Have you ever been fired from a job, quit a job after being told you would be fired, left 

a job by mutual agreement following charges or allegations of misconduct, left a job by 

mutual agreement following notice of unsatisfactory performance, or received a written 

warning, been officially reprimanded, suspended, or disciplined for misconduct in the 

worlq>lace, such as violation of a security policy? 

No. 

12. T_ax <:9J:!1Rili!.Il<;!l 

(This information will not be published in the record of the bearing on your nomination, 

but it will be retained in the Committee's files and will be available for public inspection.) 
191 

REDACTED 

17 
192 

In the past ten years, have you registered as a lobbyist? If so, please indicate the state, 

federal, or local bodies with which you haYc registered (e.g., House, Senate, California 

Secretary of State). 

No. 

ox Sec OGE Form 278. (lf, for your nomination, you have completed an OGE Form 278 

Executive Branch Personnel Public Financial Disclosure Report, you 111ay check the box here to 

complete this section and then proceed to the next section.) 

'For the preceding ten calendar years and the current cnlcndar )'Car, report any positions 

held, whether compensated or not. Positions include but arc not limited to those of :m 

officct·, director, tJ·ustcc, general partner, proprietor, representative, employee, or 

consultnnt of lmy cot'Porntion, firm, pnrtnership, or other business enterprise or any nonprofit organization or educational institution. ~_glud_f positions with religious, social, 

fraternal, or political entities and those solely of an honorary nature. 

Numcof 

01:g;;;r:u~tion 

Address of 

Q.rgani7.ation 

:Upcof 

Organization 

( corPorrition, nrm, 

partnership. other 

business enterprise, Pos!tiQp Held 

other nmiwproHl 

orgnnization, 

cducniionnl 

lnstilmion) 

18 

r_osition Held 

From 

(month/year) 

Position 

Held To 

(month/yc~r) 
193 

xo See OGE Form 278. (If. for your nomination. you have completed an OGE Form278 - -] Executive Branch Personnel Public Financial Disclosure Report. you may check the box here to 

complete this section and then proceed to the next section.) 

As ofthe date of filing your OGE Form 278, report your agreements or arrangements for: 

(1) continuing pariicipation in an employee benefit plan (e.g. pension, 401k, deferred 

compensation); (2) continuation of payment hy a former employer (including seircnmce 

payments); (3) leaves of absence; and (4) future employment. 

Provide information regarding any agreements or armngcments you have concerning (I) 

future cmploymeut; (2) a leave of absence dm·ing your period of Government ~crvicc; (3) 

continuation of payments by a former employer other than the United States Government; 

and (4) contiuuing participation in an employee welfare or benefit plan maintained by a 

former employer other than United States Government rcth'cment benefits. 

~:rtus ~!!d Tcr1!J1t of Any 

:1gr.£~1Jl!m!lu.:..t\..!!Jt!1&enten_! Dal£ 

(lllollth/yenr) 

r----------------------+----·----------------~-------------------1 

16. ,Ad<.!!ti_onal J:inanciru_l!J!tt. 

All information requested under this heading must be provided for yourself, yom· spouse, 

and your dependents. (This information will not be published in the record of the hearing 

on your nomiuation, but it will be retained in the Committee's files and will be avuilable for 

public inspection.) 

REDACTED 
REDACTED 

SIGNATURE AND DATE 

1 hereb)· state that I have read the foregoing Statement on Biographical and Financial Information and that the info

provided therein is, to the best of my knowledge, current, accurate, and complete. 

i \ """'-" \....../! ' 'V_ t l \,1.....0 t)- 'r-....Ciw 

This Z+- day of A:yr1 ~ 20 tf26 
195 

UNITED STATES OFFICE OF 

GOVERNMENT ETHICS 

REDACTED 

* -------------------------------------

The Honorable Ron Johnson 

Chairman 

Committee on Homeland Security 

and Governmental Affairs 

United States Senate 

Washine,'lon, DC 20510 

Dear Mr: Chairman: 

May24, 2017 

In accordance with the Ethics in Govennnent Act of 1978, I enclose a copy of the 

financial disclosure report filed by Neomi Rao, who has been nominated by President Tnunp tor 

the position of Administrator, Office of Infonnation and Regulatory Affairs, Office of 

Management and Budget, 

We have reviewed the rep01t and have obtained advice from the agency concerning any 

possible conflict in light of its functions and the nominee's proposed duties. Also enclosed is an 

ethics agreement outlining the actions that the nominee will undertake to avoid conllie\s of 

interest. Unless a date for compliance is indicated in the ethics agt~ement, the nominee must 

fully comply within three months of confim1ation with any action specified in the ethics 

agreement. 

Based thereon, we believe that this nominee is in compliance with applicable laws and 

regulations governing conflicts of interest 

Enclosures REDACTED 

Sincerely, 

DavidlApol 

General Counsel 

---------------* * -t~ 'Pt !20! NEW YORK AVE NW·SUJTESOO·WASHJNGTON DC·20005 
196 

May 19,2017 

Ms. Yasaman Sutton 

Alternate Designated Agency Ethics Official 

Office of Management and Budget 

725 171h Street, NW 

Washington, D.C. 20503 

Dear Ms. Sutton: 

The purpose ofthis letter is to describe the steps that 1 will take to avoid any actual or 

apparent conflict of interest in the event that 1 am confinrted for the position of AdministratOr of 

the Office ofinforrnation and Regulatory Affairs,.Office ofManagement and Budget. 

As required by LS U.S.C. § 208(a), I will not participate personally and substantially in 

any particular matter in which I kn.ow that I have a financial interest directly ancl predictably 

affected by the matter, or in whichJ know that a: person whose interests are imputed to me has a 

financial interest directly and predictably affected by the matter, Unless I first obtai!l a written 

waiver, pursuant to 18 U.S.C. § 208(b)(l), or qualifY for a regulatory exemption, pursuant to 

18 U.S.C. § 208(b){2). I understand that the interests of the following persons are imputed to 

me: any spouse or minor child of mine; any general partner of a partnership in which I am a 

limited or general partner; arty .organization in which I serve as officer, director, trustee, general 

partner or employee; and any person or organization with which I am negotiating or have an 

arrangement concerning prospective employment. 

Upon confirrnatiort, I will take an unpaid leave of absence from my tenured Associa:te 

Professor position at George Mason University and I will resign from my position with the 

Center fQr the Study ofthe Administrative State. I will not participate personally and 

substantially in any particular matter that to my knowledge has a direct and predictable effect on 

the fmancial interests of George Mason University, Unless I first obtain a written waiver, 

pursuant to 18 US.C. § 208(b)(l), or qualifY for either the exemption at 5 C.F.R. § 2640203(b) 

or another regulatory exemption, pursuant to 18 U.S.C. § 208(b)(2). 

Upon confirmation,. I will resign from my position. with the Administrative Conference of 

the United States. 

I will retain my position as trustee of my revocable living trust. I will not receive any fees 

for the services that I provide as a trustee during my appointmentto the position of 

Administrator. I will not participate personally and substantially .in any particular matter that to 

my knowledge has a direct and predictable effect on the financial interests ofthe trust, Unless I 

first obtain a written waiver, pursuant to. 18 U.S.C. § 208(b)(l), or qualifY for a regulatory 

exemption, pursuant to 18 U.S.C. § 208(b)(2). 
197 

I will divest my interest in Audax Senior Loan Fund III, LP, as soon as possible after 

confl.rmation and not later than 90 days after my confrrmation. Until r divest this fund, I will not 

participate personally and substantially in any particular matter that to my knowledge has.a direct 

and predictable effect qn the financialinterests ofthe fund or its underlying assets, unless.I first 

obtain a Written waiver, pursuant to 18 U.S.C. § 208(b )(1), or qualifY for a regulatory exemption, 

pursuantto 18 U,S.C. § 208(b)(2). 

Within 90 days of confinnation, I will divest my interests in the entities .listed in 

Attachment A .. With regard to each ofthe5e entities, I will not participate personally and 

substantially in any particular matter that to my knowledge has a direct and predictable effect on 

the financial interests of the entity, until I have divested it, unless I frrst obtain a Written waiver, 

pursuant to 18 U.S.C. § 208(b)(l ), or qualifY for a regulatory exemption, pursuantto 18 U.S.C. 

§ 208(b)(2). 

I understand that I may be eligible to request a Certificate of Divestiture for qualifYing 

assets and that a Certificate ofrn,vestitureis effective only ifobtained prior to divestiture. 

Regardless of whether !receive a Certificate of Divestiture, I will ensure that all divestitures 

discussed in this. agreement occur within the agreed up<ln timeframes and that all proceeds are 

invested in non-conflicting assets. 

My spouse is employed by WIRB•Copern!cus Group, a provider of regulatory and ethical 

review servjces for human research, and a subsidiary ofWCG Holdco IV, LLC, He receives a 

fixed annual salary and a bonus tied to his perfonnance, and holds an equity interest in the parent 

company, WCG Holdco IV, LLC. I will not participate personally and substantially in any 

particular matter that to my knowledge has a direct and predictable effect on the financial 

interests of WCG Holdco IV, LLC, or its subsidiaries, unless I first obtain a Written waiver, 

pursuant to18 U.S,C. § 208(b)(l). 

My spouse is employed by Certara, a biosimulation and regulatory Writing consultancy 

company. I:ie receives a fixed annual salary and a bonus tied to his perfonnance, and also holds 

vested profjts interestUI.lits. l will not participate personally and substantially in any particular 

matter that to my knowledge has a direct and predictable effect on the financial interests of 

Certara, unless I fust obtain a written waiver, pursuant tol8 U.S.C. § 208(b)(I). 

My spouse is an independent contractor with TtactManager, Inc., a healthcare technology 

company, He receives an annual salary and a bonus tied to his perfonnance,,and also holds 

vested profits interest units. I will not participate personally and substantially in any particular 

matter that to my knowledge has a direct and predictable effect on the financial interests of 

TractManager, Inc., unless !Trrst obtain a. written waiver, pursuant tol8 U.S.C. § 208{b)(l). 

My spouse is an independentconsultant with BioReclamationiVT, a provider of 

biological products to life sciences and pharmaceutical companies. He works on an on-call 

basis, and also holds unvested profits interest units. l will not participate personally and 

substantially in any particular matter that to my knowledge has a direct and predictable effect on 

the fmancial interests of BioRedamationl VT, tiilless I first obtain a Written waiver, pursuant to 

18 u.s.c. § 208(b)(l). 

2 
198 

I have been advised that the duties of the position of Administrator of the Office of 

Infotmation and Regillatory Affairs may involve particular matters affecting the. financial 

interests of Legends. ofL~ng. Tht;: agency has determined that it. is not necessary at this time 

for me to divest my interest in this entity because the likelihood that my duties will involve any 

such matter is remote. Accordingly, with regard to. this entity, I will not participate personally 

and substantially in any.partict!lar matter that to my knowledge has a direct and predictable 

effect on the financial interests of the entity for as long as my spouse l1as an ownership interestin 

it, unlessJ first obtain a written waiver, pursuant to 18 u,s.c. § 208(b)(l ). 

If I have a managed account or otherwise use the services of an investment professiol'!lll 

during my appointment, I will enslire that the account manager or investment professional 

obtains my prior approval on a case-by-case basis for the purchase of any asse!S other. than c<~Sh, 

cash equivalents, investment funds that qualifY for the exemption at 5 C.F .R § 2640.201 (a), or 

obligations ofthe United States. 

I understand that as an appointee I will be. required to sign the Ethics Pledge (Exec. Order 

No, 13770) and that I will be bound by the requirementS and restrictions therein hiadditipn to the 

commitments I have made in this ethics agreement. 

I will meet in person with you dllring the. first week of my service in the position of 

Administrator of the Office ofinformation and Re~ulatory Affairs in order to complete the initial 

ethics briefing required under 5 C.f.R. § 2638.305; Within 90 d!.tys of my confirmation,.{ will 

document my compliance with this ethics agreement by .notifying you in writing when I have 

completed the steps described in this ethics agreement. 

I have been advised thatthis ethics agreement will be postedpublicly, ~;:onslstent with 

5 U.S.C. § .552, on the website of the U.S. Office ofGovernment Ethics with ethics agreements 

of other Presidential nominees who file public fil'lancial disclosure reports; 

Since. rely, ,n '---1/\J.~--KQ.--C:r 

NeomiRao 

3 
199 

ATTACHMENT A 

I. Apple - AAPL 

· ;!. Amg¢n Inc. -AMGN 

3. Amazon:com Inc.- AMZN 

4. American Express Co. - AXP 

5. BoeingCo.-BA 

6. Bank of America Corp.-BAC 

7. Biglari Holdings Inc-BH 

8. Biogen Inc. - BIIB 

9. Bristol-Myers Squibb- BMY 

10. Berkshire Hathaway-BRK.A 

11. Citigroup Inc. - C 

12. Caterpillar Inc.- CAT 

n Comcast Corp-CMCSA 

14. Conoco Phillips- COP 

15. Cisco Systems Inc- CSCO 

1.6. CVS Health Corp - CVS 

17. Chevron Corp- CVX 

18. DFA Commodity Strategy Port- DCMSX 

19. E.I. duPont de Nemours and Com- DD 

20. Walt Disney Co.-DS 

21. eBay Inc- EBAY 

22. Twenty-First Ceritury Fox, Inc- FOXA 

23. General Electric Co.- GE 

24. Gilead Sciences Inc -GILD 

25. Alphabet Inc~ GOOG 

26. Goldm!lll Sachs GrotJp Inc- GS 

27. HomeDepcitlnc-HD 

28. Honeyvielllntlli:K:- HON 

29. Inti Business Machines Corp~ illM 

30. Intel Corp~ rNTC 

31. Johnson & Johnson- JNJ 

32. Jp Morgan Chase.& Co-JPM 

33. Coca-Coia Co- KO 

34. Lincoln National Corp- LNC 

35. Macerich Co -MAC 

36. McDonalds Corp- MCD 

37. Merck & Co Inc- Miu<. 

38. Microsoft Corp- MSFT 

39. Oracle Corp- ORCL 

40. Occidental. Petrol urn- OXY 

41. The Price line Group Inc- PCLN 

42. PepsiCo Inc- P 

43. Pfizer Inc- PFE 

44. Proctor & Gamble- PG 

45. Philip Morris International- PM 

46. QUALCOMM Inc- QCOM 

47. Scblumberger Ltd- SLB 

48. AT&Tlnc~T 

4 
200 

49. Time Warner Inc- TWX 

50. United Heaith Group~ UNH 

51. Union Pacific Corp- UNP 

52. US Bimcorp- UNP 

53.. United Technology Corp- UTX 

54. Visa Inc- V 

55. Verizon Communications Inc VZ 

.56. Wells Fargo & Co- WFC 

57. Wal-Mart Stores- WMT 

58. Exxon Mobil Corp- XOM 

5 
201 

U.S. Senate Committee on Homeland Security and Governmental Affairs 

Pre-hearing Questionnaire 

For the Nomination of Neomi Rao to be 

Administrator, Office of Information and Regulatory Affairs 

I. Nomination Process and Conflicts of Interest 

I. Did the President or the Director of the Office of Management and Budget (OMB) give you 

specific reasons why you were nominated to be the next Administrator of the Office of 

Information and Regulatory Affairs (OIRA) at OMB, and if so, what were they? 

No. 

2. Were any conditions, expressed or implied, attached to your nomination? If so, please 

explain. 

No. 

3. Have you made any commitments with respect to the policies and principles you will attempt 

to implement as Administrator? If so, what are they, and to whom were the commitments 

made? 

No. 

4. Are you aware of any business relationship, dealing, or financial transaction that could result 

in a possible conflict of interest for you or the appearance of a conflict of interest? If so, 

please explain what procedures you will use to recuse yourself or otherwise address the 

cont1ict. And if you will recuse yourself, explain how you will ensure your responsibilities 

are not affected by your recusal. 

No.1 will not participate personally and substantially in any particular matter that to my 

knowledge has a predictable effect on my financial interests or on the financial interests of 

the entities identified in my Ethics Agreement. I will work with OMB General Counsel and 

White House Counsel to ensure full compliance with ethics requirements. Should recusal be 

necessary, I would ensure that the Associate Administrator fulfill my responsibilities. 

II. Background of the Nominee 

5. What specific background, experience, and attributes qualify you to be Administrator? 

As the founder and director of the Center for the Study of the Administrative State, I have 

brought together scholars, government officials, and practitioners to study and discuss 

important questions relating to administrative law and regulatory practice. For instance, 

recent conferences have examined "The Time for Regulatory Refonn in Congress" and 

"Rethinking Due Process." 1 am a Public Member of the Administrative Conference of the 

United States, which is an independent federal agency committed to using research and nonSenate Homeland Security and Governmental Affairs Committee Page 1 
202 

partisan expertise to improve federal agency procedures. As a Council Member of the 

American Bar Association Section on Administrative Law and Regulatory Practice, I have 

worked on a range of regulatory process issues. I have testified before Congress on 

regulatory refonn relating to judicial deference and to regulatory structures created by the 

Dodd-Frank Act. 

As Associate White House Counsel, my portfolio included a number of executive branch 

agencies, and I frequently coordinated interagency cooperation on matters oflaw and policy. 

My scholarship has focused on the constitutional structure of administration and measutes to 

improve political accountability of agencies. 

6. Please describe: 

a. Your leadership and management style. 

If confirmed, I would strive to lead with a clear mission for the office and manage in a 

manner that is open and collaborative. 

b. Your experience managing personnel. 

I work with other law professors, policy makers, and practitioners as a law professor and 

the Director of the Center for the Study of the Administrative State. In the White House 

Counsel's Office and as counsel to the Senate Judiciary Committee, I worked with 

colleagues and subordinates on legal and policy issues. 

c. What is the largest number of people that have worked under you? 

As a scholar and government official I have primarily worked in collaborative 

environments. 

7. Please describe your experience working on matters relating to regulatory review, 

interagency cooperation, government collection ofinfonnation, or other matters within the 

purview of the OIRA Administrator. 

Please see answer to question 5. 

III. Role of the Administrator of OIRA 

8. What do you consider to be the mission of OIRA, and what would you consider to be your 

role and responsibilities if confirmed as the Administrator? Have you and OMB Director 

Mick Mulvaney discussed what your role would be? If so, please describe how you view 

your role in light of those discussions. 

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The mission of OIRA is to coordinate and to improve the quality of decisionmaking in 

administrative agencies both with respect to regulation and information policy. OIRA works 

to ensure that regulation is necessary, consistent with the law, and reflects presidential 

priorities. OIRA plays an important role in ensuring agencies undertake rigorous cost-benefit 

analysis and base their decisions on sound evidence. Director Mulvaney has expressed to me 

his strong support for the longstanding role of OIRA in these areas. 

9. What do you anticipate will be your greatest challenges as Administrator, and what will be 

your top priorities? What do you hope to accomplish during your tenure? 

OIRA faces the challenge of implementing and institutionalizing Executive Orders 13771 

and 13777, which require administrative agencies to reduce regulatory burdens and costs. My 

priorities will include: (I) ensuring that administrative agencies comply with the law; (2) 

working with agencies to develop regulations based on quality analysis and to further 

institutionalize retrospective review of the actual results of regulation; and (3) promoting 

presidential priorities for the benefit of the American people. 

IV. Policy Questions 

10. Do you believe OIRA has adequate resources to meet its mission? Are there organizational 

changes to OIRA and/or its place in OMB that you believe would help further its mission? 

In my current capacity, I do not have a view about the specifics of OIRA's resources. I 

recognize, however, that Executive Orders 13771 and 13777 create coordination 

responsibilities for OIRA's regulatory review process. In its budget, the Administration has 

requested an increase of approximately $1 million for OIRA for fiscal year 2018. If 

confirmed, I would work with OMB to assess whether the existing organizational structure 

and resources are adequate to meet OIRA's responsibilities. 

I I. What actions will you take to ensure that regulatory impact analyses have integrity, are 

accurate, and that potential impacts of proposed regulations are properly estimated? 

I will follow longstanding regulatory review process principles reflected in executive orders 

and OMB guidance issued across administrations. I will collaborate with agencies to ensure 

they use the best available evidence and cost benefit analysis in their regulatory proposals. 

12. Do you support undertaking a retrospective review process? If so, what role do you believe 

OMB should play in this process and how can you ensure agencies properly prioritize their 

own review efforts? 

Y cs, I support the retrospective review process, which is encouraged by Executive Orders 

12866 and !3563. OIRA and OMB can play an important role in coordinating and providing 

guidance for agencies to engage in retrospective review. In addition, complying with 

Executive Orders !3771 and 13777 will create strong incentives for more thorough 

retrospective review to identify regulations that can be modified or repealed and to identify 

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regulations that are outdated, unnecessary, ineffective, or otherwise impose costs that exceed 

benefits. 

a. In your view, have previous retrospective reviews of existing policies been 

successful? Please explain why or why not. 

I understand that retrospective review has had some success, but lacks consistency. 

b. Would you support, as a substitute or complement to retrospective review, 

establishing a task force outside the agencies to conduct a review and make 

recommendations for the repeal or improvement of old regulations? Please explain 

why or why not. 

Retrospective review can serve an important role in understanding the actual costs and 

benefits of regulation and in providing information about whether and how a regulation 

should be modified. If confirmed, I would be open to considering a variety of institutional 

forms for ensuring more thorough and consistent retrospective review and to working 

with agencies and Members of Congress on such proposals. 

13. What steps will you take to ensure the Unified Agenda is both completed on time and 

contains the most accurate information with respect to agencies' prospective regulatory 

plans? 

Executive Order 12866 requires all agencies, including those considered to be independent 

regulatory agencies, to prepare an agenda of all regulations under development or review. 

The agenda must also include all significant regulatory actions that the agency expects to 

issue in the coming year. Executive Order 13 771 gives further weight to this requirement by 

stating that an agency cannot issue a regulation unless it was included in the most recent 

published Unified Regulatory Agenda, with exceptions for regulations otherwise required by 

law. This requirement creates an incentive for agencies to complete their agendas on time 

and to provide accurate information about their forthcoming regulatory activities. 

14. Are there any major reform proposals of the regulatory process for proposing, adopting, and 

reviewing federal regulations that you would like to see enacted by Congress or fulfilled 

through executive action or OMB guidance? Please explain. 

The Senate and the House of Representatives are considering a number of legislative refonn 

bills designed to improve the regulatory process and to increase accountability and 

transparency. If confinned, I look forward to working with Members of Congress on these 

proposals. 

15. If confirmed, what do you see as your specific responsibilities with respect to implementing 

Executive Order 13 771? 

If confirmed, my responsibilities would include ensuring that agencies complied with the 

presidential directives in Executive Order 13771 in so far as they are consistent with legal 

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requirements. It would also include providing centralized assistance and guidance for 

implementing the Order. 

a. Do you believe the Memo to agencies issued on April 5, 2017, provides sufficient 

direction to agencies to comply with the executive order? If not, what additional 

information is needed? 

The OMB Guidance of April 5, 2017, provides definitions and further details about how 

to implement the Order. If confirmed, I would work with agencies and OIRA staff to 

evaluate whether further guidance is necessary as agencies have more experience 

implementing the Executive Order. 

b. What do you see as your role in developing regulatory cost caps for FY2018? 

The OMB Memorandum to agencies of April 5, 2017, indicates that guidance on this 

topic is forthcoming. If confinned, I would work with OMB to fonnulate that guidance 

and to consider OIRA's role in developing regulatory cost allowances. 

c. What criteria will you use in determining whether to grant an exemption to agencies, 

either under the FY20 17 zero net cost cap or those that will be set for FY20 18? 

I do not have a view of this subject, but if confirmed, I will work with OMB to consider 

what criteria should be used for such decisions. 

16. The process for developing regulations is meant to be transparent and to ensure that those 

who will be affected by a proposed rule will have their needs and opinions heard and 

considered. As Administrator, what would you do to ensure the rulemaking process is 

transparent and accessible? 

Transparency is an important value in the regulatory process in order to ensure participation 

of relevant stakeholders. Under Executive Order 12866, OIRA meets with individuals and 

groups who wish to discuss rules under review and those meetings are made public on 

OIRA's website. Additional websitcs allow individuals and stakeholders to comment and to 

track the progress of regulations. I support maintaining these important transparency 

measures. 

17. Protecting whistleblower confidentiality is of the utmost importance to this Committee. 

a. How do you plan to implement policies within the office to encourage employees to 

bring constructive suggestions forward without the fear of reprisal? 

If confirmed, I would analyze existing policies and any concerns about those policies 

to ensure that employees can bring constructive suggestions forward without fear of 

reprisal. In general, I would also encourage an open door policy for employees to 

share their concerns with me directly. 

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b. If confirmed, what avenues will be available to employees to report waste, fraud, or 

abuse within OIRA? 

If confirmed, I would ensure there were effective mechanisms for employees to report 

waste, fraud, and abuse. 

c. Do you commit without reservation to work to ensure that any whistleblower within 

OIRA does not face retaliation? 

Yes. 

d. Do you commit without reservation to take all appropriate action if notified about 

potential whistle blower retaliation? 

Yes. 

V. Relations with Congress 

18. Do you agree without reservation to comply with any request or summons to appear and 

testifY before any duly constituted committee of Congress if you are confirmed? 

Yes. 

19. Do you agree without reservation to make any subordinate official or employee available to 

appear and testifY before, or provide information to, any duly constituted committee of 

Congress if you are confirmed? 

If confirmed, I will work to ensure that OIRA provides Congress with the information it 

needs in order to carry out its essential oversight functions. 

20. Do you agree without reservation to comply fully, completely, and promptly to any request 

for documents, communications, or any other agency material or information from any duly 

constituted committee ofthe Congress if you are confirmed? 

lf confinned, I will work to ensure that OIRA provides Congress with the information it 

needs in order to carry out its essential oversight functions. 

VI. Assistance 

21. Are these answers your own? Have you consulted with OMB, or any other interested 

parties? If so, please indicate which entities. 

These answers are my own and were written in consultation with OMB. 

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U.S. Senate Committee on Homeland Security and Governmental AtTairs 

Minority 

Pre-hearing Questionnaire 

.For the Nomination of Neomi Rao to be 

Administrator of the Office of Information and Regulatory Affairs 

I. Background of Nominee 

I. Do you seek out dissenting views and how do you encourage constructive critical dialogue 

with subordinates? 

I believe it is essential to have an open mind and to seek out a range of viewpoints. I would 

encourage subordinates to share with me their analysis and honest recommendations; and in 

turn would provide feedback and explanations about my decisions. As Director of the Center 

for the Study of the Administrative State, I invited scholars and practitioners with very 

different views and encouraged discussion and debate on matters of administrative law. 

Throughout my education and career, I have sought to have an open dialogue with friends 

and colleagues who have different perspectives. 

2. Please give examples of times in your career when you disagreed with your superiors and 

aggressively advocated your position. 

As Associate White House Counsel, my legal analysis would sometimes conflict with a 

proposed policy position. In those instances, I strongly advocated for a policy alternative that 

would be consistent with the law. 

3. Were you ever successful? Please list and describe examples of when you made politically 

difficult choices that you thought were in the best interest of the country? 

Yes, I believe that I was successful. I cannot discuss specific examples due to deliberative 

privilege. 

4. What would you consider your greatest successes as a leader? 

The Center for the Study of the Administrative State, which I founded and direct, has brought 

together over I 00 accomplished speakers~-scholars, government officials, and 

practitioners-in just over one year to analyze and to debate important questions of 

administrative law. 

5. You are the founder and director of the Center for the Study of the Administrative State at 

George Mason University, Antonin Scalia School of Law. 

a. What are your responsibilities as Director of the center? 

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As Director, I develop and organize the programs of the Center, which includes 

commissioning scholarship and inviting speakers and discussants to the Center's research 

roundtables and public policy conferences. 

b. What is the mission and goal of the center? 

The Center's mission includes examining the constitutional foundations and political and 

economic impacts of administration. The Center studies administration from a variety of 

perspectives and coordinates, promotes, and funds top-quality research, and then links 

that research to public policy debates. 

c. What type of research and scholarship does the center support? 

The Center supports research and scholarship on a range of issues relating to 

administrative law. We have held conferences on issues such as financial regulation, 

judicial deference, and regulatory reform in Congress. A full list of the Center's events 

and participants can be found on its website, https://administrativestate.gmu.edu. 

d. How is the center funded? (i.e. Grants, Charitable donations and/or 

contributions, University Funding). 

The Center is funded through private grants and charitable donations. 

II. Role of the Administrator of OIRA 

6. What do you see as the most important challenges facing the federal government and if 

confirmed as Administrator, what would you do to address those challenges within your 

purview? 

The federal regulatory system faces a challenge to ensure that policies arc necessary, 

effective, and not unduly burdensome. OIRA plays an essential role in ensuring the quality of 

government decisionmaking with respect to regulation and information management. 

Through interagency coordination and thorough regulatory review, OIRA can improve the 

welfare of the American people. 

7. OIRA is a small office within OMB, but its responsibilities impact the entire federal 

government. What are your views on the organization and allocation of resources for the 

various activities undertaken by the office? If confirmed, how would you want to reorganize 

or reallocate resources within the office? 

In my current capacity, l do not have a view about the specifics ofOIRA's resources. l 

recognize, however, that Executive Orders 13771 and 13777 create coordination 

responsibilities for OIRA's regulatory review process. In its budget, the Administration has 

requested an increase of approximately $1 million for OIRA for fiscal year 2018. If 

confirmed, I would work with OMB to assess whether the existing organizational stmcture 

and resources are adequate to meet OIRA's responsibilities. 

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8. Please describe your approach to the rulemaking process and analysis. 

In the rulemaking process, agencies should adhere closely to the law, including their 

particular statutory directives and the Administrative Procedure Act, and to the extent 

permissible, account for presidential priorities. Regulatory analysis and review should follow 

longstanding practices and principles expressed in Executive Orders and OMB Guidance. 

Regulatory decisions should be based on sound objective analysis and the best available 

scientific, technical, and economic information. 

III. Policy Questions 

Budget 

9. What are your views on the best way to approach the analysis of a rule's budgetary impact? 

If confirmed, I would seek to learn more about this issue. In general, I understand that rules 

often implement federal spending programs or can cause an increase in the resources used by 

federal agencies. Regulatory analysis often considers such costs. 

I 0. Over the past decade, Members of Congress have introduced a number of bills that would 

place more analytical requirements onto both OIRA and regulating agencies. However, one 

of the greatest challenges for agencies and OIRA alike is that they are increasingly asked to 

do more with limited personnel and resources. Do you agree that OIRA and regulating 

agencies should have more analytical requirements? If so, how do we solve the challenge of 

asking agencies and OlRA to do more analysis without providing sufficient resources to 

conduct such analysis? 

OIRA's responsibilities have increased over time with new statutory authorities and 

executive orders. If confirmed, l would work with Members of Congress and OIRA staff to 

analyze existing resources in light of new proposals and with regard to budget constraints. 

Rulemaking 

11. What is your opinion of the formal rulemaking process? What are some changes to the 

process, if any, you would like to see? 

Agencies rarely use the formal rulemaking process and instead regulate largely through 

informal notice and comment rulemaking. In my current capacity, I do not have a view of 

whether this process should change. 

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12.OMB is tasked with review of agency work-product, but does not have the subject matter 

expertise possessed by agencies. When should OMB officials rely on their own expertise 

and when should they defer to the expertise at agencies? 

Congress confers rulemaking authority on agencies in part because of their expertise. OIRA 

staff has also developed expertise through the process of regulatory review and interagency 

coordination. In a collaborative process, OIRA works with agencies and depends on 

interagency expertise to ensure regulations implement presidential priorities and advance the 

public interest within the requirements of the law. 

13. If confinned, how would you approach the interagency review process? 

Interagency coordination is an important and longstanding part ofOIRA's mandate, in part 

because agencies often have overlapping regulatory authority, interests, and expertise. 

Interagency coordination can improve the quality of analysis, account for interactions with 

other regulatory efforts, and prevent duplicative or incompatible regulation. If confirmed, I 

would approach interagency coordination in a manner that ensures all agency stakeholders 

were part of the process and able to provide meaningful input. 

14. What are the main principles that you think should be taken into consideration in 

promulgating and issuing new regulations? 

The principles for promulgating and issuing new regulations have remained relatively 

consistent since OIRA's inception and across administrations. Executive Order 12866, which 

remains in place, sets out broad regulatory principles including that the regulatory system 

should protect and improve the well-being of the American people without imposing 

unacceptable or unreasonable costs on society. EO 12866 further recognizes that the "private 

sector and private markets are the best engine for economic growth." More recently, 

Executive Orders 13771 and 13777 build on these principles, stating a policy of alleviating 

unnecessary regulatory burdens. 

15. Do you believe OIRA should serve as a "gatekeeper" or as a "consultant" to administrative 

agencies during the rulemaking process? Please explain. 

Agencies derive their regulatory authority from Congress. OIRA consults with agencies to 

ensure, among other things, that proposed regulations comply with the law, use the best 

available evidence and analysis, and implement alternatives that yield the greatest net 

benefits to the American people. Moreover, OIRA serves to ensure agencies implement 

presidential priorities consistent with the law. 

16. In March 2017, as Director of the Center for the Study of the Administrative State, you 

sponsored a public policy conference on "The Time for Regulatory Reform in Congress," 

where panelists discussed the Congressional Review Act and the Regulations from the 

Executive in Need of Scrutiny Act of2015 (REINS). Which principles within the legislative 

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items discussed at this conference do you support and would like to see implemented under 

the Trump Administration? 

The Senate and the House of Representatives are considering a number oflegislative reform 

bills designed to improve the regulatory process and to increase accountability and 

transparency. If confirmed, !look forward to working with Members of Congress on these 

proposals. 

a. A common objection to the REINS Act is that it would represent a legislative 

veto over executive branch action. Do you agree? Why or why not? 

The REINS Act applies to economically significant rules with an impact of 

over $1 00 million, and requires before such a regulation goes into effect that 

Congress enact a joint resolution approving the regulation, which must also be 

signed by the President. This does not represent a legislative veto, because the 

regulation cannot take effect without bicameral approval and the President's 

signature. 

b. If you do agree, do you support such a legislative veto? Why or why not? 

I do not consider the REINS Act to operate as an unconstitutional legislative 

veto. 

17. In November 2016, the American Bar Association's section on Administrative Law and 

Regulatory Practice, on which you serve as a council member, submitted a report to 

President-Elect Trump titled "Improving the Administrative Process." This report outlines 

strategies for improving and reassessing the process that "federal agencies use to make law 

and affect the lives of millions of Americans." 

a. Which recommendations within this report do you support? 

I joined the Council after this report was substantially completed. I support a 

number of its common-sense recommendations, including continuing with the 

longstanding regulatory review process, using sound scientific risk assessment, 

and building on efforts of previous administrations with respect to 

retrospective review. 

b. If confirmed as Administrator of OIRA, which of these recommendations 

would you seek to implement during your tenure? Please explain why. 

I have not formed a view of which of these recommendations should be 

implemented. If confinned, I would work with OMB and members of Congress 

to address the recommendations raised by the report and consider possible 

mechanisms for implementation. 

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18. What are the main principles that you think should be taken into consideration when 

considering repealing or modifying an existing regulation? 

OMB's AprilS, 2017, guidance states that Executive Order 12866 "remains the primary 

governing EO regarding regulatory planning and review" and that its requirements apply to 

agency regulatory and deregulatory actions. 

Cost- Benefit Analysis 

19. What actions will you take to ensure that cost benefit analyses have integrity, are accurate, 

and that costs and benefits of proposed regulations are properly estimated? 

If confirmed, I would work with OIRA staff to ensure that agency analysis complies with the 

requirements of Circular A-4, which is OMB's well established guidance to federal agencies 

on the best practices for regulatory analysis. 

20. Do you support the use of non-administration or non-federal sources to ascertain costs and 

benefits of proposed regulations? 

Longstanding executive branch policy requires agencies to use the best available sources of 

information about the costs and benefits of proposed regulation. Public comments and nongovernmental sources might sometimes provide credible infonnation that can help to identify 

the costs and benefits of proposed actions. The regulatory review process encourages the 

participation of affected parties and groups under Executive Order 12866 and Circular A-4 

states that agencies should consult with individuals and organizations who "have special 

knowledge or insight into the regulatory issues." 

21. How should cost benefit analyses account for non-monetizable costs and benefits of a 

proposed rule? 

OMB's guidance to federal agencies in Circular A-4 states that agency analysis should 

identify non-monetized costs and benefits. The Circular further provides that if such nonquantified benefits and costs are likely to be important, then the agency should designate 

those factors as important and explain their significance in its analysis. 

22. What is the appropriate scope for considering indirect costs and benefits of a proposed rule? 

Agencies should consider both indirect costs and benefits, as explained in OMB Circular A4, to the extent that these costs and benefits can be reasonably estimated and attributed to an 

impact of the proposed regulation. 

23. How should the regulatory analysis process-- including cost benefit analysis, examination of 

regulatory alternatives, and outreach to stakeholders- be different when an agency is 

working to repeal or modify an existing regulation rather than issuing a new one? Should the 

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cost benefit analysis consider indirect and non-monetizable costs and benefits in the same 

way they are considered in issuing a new rule? 

OMB's Guidance of AprilS, 2017, provides further clarification for how the costs and 

benefits of deregulatory actions should be measured and explains that cost savings estimates 

for deregulatory actions should follow the same conventions used for calculating costs of 

regulatory actions. The Guidance also follows OMB Circular A-4 for the treatment of 

unquantified costs and benefits. 

24. What role should qualitative analysis play in the rulemaking process? Do you consider a 

qualitative analysis equal to that of a quantitative analysis in the rulemaking analysis? Why 

or why not? 

Agencies should consider qualitative values and objectives when required by statute. 

Moreover, longstanding OMB practice emphasizes the importance of quantifying effects 

where possible, but also allows for the inclusion of qualitative effects in regulatory analysis. 

25. Please provide an example of when you believe a regulation was necessary even though its 

cost benefit analysis showed that the costs would outweigh the benefits. 

1 do not have a specific example because I am not familiar with the cost benefit analysis of 

particular regulations. In general, however, a regulation might be necessary if required by 

law, even if analysis demonstrated that the costs would outweigh the benefits. 

26. Is there ever a time when it is inappropriate to conduct a cost benefit analysis? 

Some statutes may preclude the consideration of cost benefit analysis in regulatory 

decisiomnaking and agencies must follow legal requirements with respect to the proper 

regulatory analysis. In rare circumstances, an immediate risk to safety or national security 

may make such an analysis infeasible. 

27. Regulatory analysis represents a fundamental and important tool in the regulatory process to 

help agencies determine the best path forward, and OIRA plays a critical role in reviewing 

and helping agencies develop good regulatory analysis. What are the critical factors that you 

feel must be part of quality regulatory analysis? 

The factors for quality regulatory analysis have developed over time with a wide measure of 

bipartisan consensus in executive orders and OMB guidance. Regulatory analysis begins with 

an assessment of the need for government action, the legal authority for regulation, an 

examination of alternatives, and an evaluation of the costs and benefits of proposed action. 

28. What are your thoughts on including economic, pricing, or other models used during OIRA's 

evaluation of a proposed rule as part of the public rulemaking record? 

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I do not have a view on this subject, although I understand that pending legislative proposals 

would impose this requirement. If confirmed, I look forward to working with Members of 

Congress on considering such transparency measures. 

29. Much of your scholarships focus on less delegation from Congress and less deference to 

agencies. Do you believe that these theories should apply to OIRA? If confirmed, how would 

you put these theories into practice during the rulemaking process as Administrator of 

OIRA? 

The rulemaking process follows the law as it exists. My scholarship has focused on 

constitutional limitations on administrative action that do not necessarily reflect the existing 

state of the law. Based on my experience as an academic and also as a government official, I 

appreciate the distinction, and sometimes significant gap, between academic theory and 

practical government policy. 

30. Should federal agencies, when developing a new rule, always have to pick the least-costly 

regulatory option? Why or why not? 

When developing a new rule, agencies must follow their statutory directives. In so far as it is 

consistent with statutory authority, agencies should consider the costs and benefits of 

regulatory alternatives, aiming to maximize net benefits to the public. Moreover, Executive 

Orders 12866 and 13563 both require agencies to impose the least burden on society, 

consistent with regulatory objectives and taking into account the cumulative burden of 

regulations. 

31. OMB Director Mulvaney was recently quoted as saying, "It is our position that the previous 

administration failed to follow the law in many, many circumstances .... And that they 

simply imposed regulation without proper regard to the cost side of that analysis." Do you 

agree with this statement? If so, which legal requirements do you believe were not followed 

by the previous administration and can you point to specific examples that support this 

allegation? 

I am not aware ofthe context of the Director's comments. I agree that OIRA should ensure 

that agencies follow the law and take into account costs and benefits of regulation. 

Transparency 

32. In the past, OIRA has often had significant contact with the agencies regarding proposed 

regulations early in the rulemaking process, before the formal OIRA review. 

a. Do you think OIRA should consult with agencies prior to the fonnal review 

process? 

Such consultation has been a longstanding practice across administrations as 

part of the deliberative process. Early interaction with agencies ensures that 

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agencies understand OIRA's expectations regarding the quality of information 

and analysis necessary to support a rulemaking. 

b. If so, what would you do, if confirmed, to ensure transparency in that early 

consultative process prior to formal review? 

As a general matter, transparency is important for public understanding and 

accountability and OIRA provides significant transparency about the content of 

proposed and final rules once its review is complete. During the early stages of 

consultation, the values of transparency must be balanced with confidentiality 

for internal deliberation, which can encourage debate and full consideration of 

all alternatives. 

33. Federal agencies are producing, collecting and storing more information than ever before. 

This flood of infonnation allows agencies to better meet their missions, but it also comes 

with significant costs and challenges. 

a. What do you see as the biggest challenges that agencies face in managing 

information? 

In consultation with OIRA staff, I understand that one of the challenges in 

managing information includes determining how to evaluate the quality of 

available data and its infonnative value. OIRA has also made efforts to 

improve efficiency by promoting agency sharing of data. Managing 

information also requires protecting personally identifiable data and other 

sensitive information, consistent with legal requirements. 

b. If confinned, what would be your priorities in helping agencies manage their 

information? 

If confirmed, I would work with the expert OIRA stafi and agencies to develop 

policies for evaluating the quality of data for use in decisionmaking and 

guidance for balancing privacy interests with data transparency. 

34. As Administrator of OIRA, you would play a role in the protection of personal privacy by the 

federal government and oversee numerous regulations that protect the privacy rights of 

millions of Americans. If confirmed, how would you approach the challenge of privacy and 

how would you balance the need to protect personal information with the need to ensure 

government transparency? 

OIRA plays an important role in the coordination of privacy policy under various statutory 

authorities, including the Privacy Act of 1974, the Paperwork Reduction Act of 1995, theEGovemment Act of2002, and the Federal Information Security Modernization Act of2014. 

Pursuant to these authorities, OMB has developed privacy policy over the years through 

guidance and memoranda issued to agencies. If confirmed, I would work with the recently 

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created Privacy Branch in OIRA to ensure that OIRA fulfills these mandates to protect 

privacy and to ensure information integrity and confidentiality. 

35. OIRA also plays a role in coordinating and overseeing policies and practices across agencies 

that allow greater public access to information. What will be your priorities in fulfilling 

these functions of the office? Generally, what role do you believe OIRA should play in 

promoting greater transparency government-wide and what approach would you take to 

improving government transparency? 

OIRA should continue to lead efforts to promote the release of appropriate government 

information and data and to release that information in more user-friendly formats. 

36. Are there any major reform proposals of the regulatory process for proposing, adopting, and 

reviewing federal regulations that you would like to see enacted by Congress or fulfilled 

through executive action or OMB guidance? 

If confirmed, I am open to working with Congress on reform proposals and to considering 

what reforms might be necessary and could be accomplished through OMB guidance. 

Executive Orders 

37. Of the practices listed in Executive Order 12866, both Republicans and Democrats agree that 

more emphasis should be placed on reviewing existing regulations to ensure they are 

achieving their regulatory objective. 

a. Do you support the Trump Administration undertaking a retrospective review 

process? If so, what role do you believe OIRA should play in this process? 

I support the retrospective review process, which is encouraged by President 

Clinton's Executive Order 12866 and more recently, President Obama's Executive 

Order 13563. OIRA and OMB can play an important role in coordinating and 

providing guidance for agencies to engage in retrospective review. In addition, 

Executive Orders 13771 and 13777 create strong incentives for more thorough 

retrospective review as agencies work to identify regulations that should be 

modified or repealed because they are outdated, unnecessary, ineffective, or 

otherwise impose costs that exceed benefits. 

b. As OIRA Administrator, how would you ensure that retrospective reviews 

become an integral part of agencies' culture, and embedded as a regular part of 

the rulemaking process? 

Executive Order 13777 requires agencies to designate a Regulatory Refonn 

Otlicer and a Regulatory Refonn Task Force. If confirmed, I would work with 

these officials and OIRA stafito assess the challenges of institutionalizing 

retrospective review and to consider how OIRA can collaborate with agencies to 

address these challenges. 

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c. In your view, have previous retrospective reviews of existing policies been 

successful? Please explain why or why not. 

I understand that retrospective review has had some success, but lacks consistency. 

38. Executive Order 12866 requires regulations be adopted "only upon a reasoned determination 

that the benefits of the intended regulation justify its costs," but recognizes that some costs 

and benefits are very difficult to quantify. How would you implement this requirement, 

especially in situations where costs and/or benefits cannot be easily reduced to monetary 

equivalents or cannot be quantified at all? 

As discussed above, OMB Circular A-4 explains how to account for regulatory costs and 

benefits that might be difficult to quantify, and if confirmed I would follow that general 

approach. 

39. Executive Order 13771, "Reducing Regulation and Controlling Regulatory Costs," 

established a two-step regulatory process by agencies must adhere to before issuing a new 

"significant" regulation. First, it requires agencies to eliminate two old regulations for each 

new "significant" regulation. Second, the executive order requires that the cost of any 

"significant" regulation be fully offset by the cost savings of the eliminated regulations. 

a. What is your view or understanding of a "significant" regulation? 

OMB Guidance Implementing Executive Order 13771 follows the definition of 

"significant" used by Executive Order 12866. 

b. If confirmed, are there any conditions under which you would apply the 

requirements of the Executive Order to regulations that do not meet this 

standard? If so, please explain. 

The Executive Order applies to "significant" regulations and I would follow this 

definition. 

40. In response to this executive order, the current OIRA Administrator issued interim guidance 

to agencies detailing how to implement the order. If conflnned, will you take additional 

action to assist agencies in implementing this order? 

If confirmed, I would seek to understand and analyze agency concerns, and as necessary, 

provide gnidance and support to assist agencies with the implementation of Executive Order 

13771. 

41. Executive Order !3777, "Enforcing the Regulatory Reform Agenda," directs each federal 

agency to establish a regulatory reform task force, which would recommend which 

regulations the agency should simplify or eliminate. If confirmed, what role would you have 

OIRA play in working with these task forces? 

Senate Homeland Security and Governmental Affairs Committee Page 17 
218 

While it is difficult to predict the precise relationship at this time when the task forces are in 

the process of being established, OIRA could follow its traditional role of supporting 

presidential priorities and collaborating with agencies to ensure compliance with executive 

orders and the regulatory review process. 

42. Complying with both Executive Order 13771 and 13777 could be extremely time consuming 

and labor intensive for agencies as they will be required to go through a more intensive rule 

making process for both the regulations proposed to be weakened and eliminated, and for the 

proposed new rule. Please explain how you will work with agencies to streamline this 

process to reduce burdens on the agencies. 

Executive Order 13777 establishes a task force within each agency charged with evaluating 

existing regulations and making recommendations for the modification and repeal of 

regulations, consistent with applicable law. If confirmed, I would work with the agencies and 

these task forces to understand any challenges they face and to work with OIRA staff to help 

agencies meet the requirements of the Executive Orders. 

43. Of the existing Executive Orders concerning OJRA's responsibilities and operations, arc 

there any you believe should be repealed or replaced? 

I have not formed a view of this question. 

a. If so, describe which Executive Orders and your reasoning. 

b. If not (or if you do not yet have a view), describe what approach you will take to 

evaluating the current executive orders that apply to OIRA role in the rulemaking 

process. 

I would work with OMB and the agencies to understand any concerns or problems 

with the implementation of existing Executive Orders and, as necessary, make 

recommendations for improving the rulemaking process through guidance or further 

Executive Orders. 

c. Do you see any conflict between the rulemaking requirements established by the new 

Executive Orders issued by President Trump and previously existing obligations on 

agencies? If so, how would you propose to resolve those conflicts? 

President Trump's Executive Orders specify that they must be "implemented 

consistent with applicable law"; therefore, they do not create conflicts with existing 

legal obligations. 

44. If confirmed, what is your plan to ensure implementation of the OIRA 's new responsibilities 

under both Executive Order 13771 and 13777 are consistent with existing law and OMB 

guidance? 

Senate Homeland Security and Governmental Affairs Committee Page 18 
219 

OIRA review includes ensuring that regulations are consistent with statutory requirements as 

well as Executive Orders and OMB guidance. If confirmed, I would ensure that regulatory 

and deregulatory actions complied with the law. 

Protecting Existing Safeguards 

45. If an agency proposes to weaken or eliminate a regulation designed to protect public health 

and safety, in your role as Administrator ofOIRA, how would you work with the agency to 

ensure these existing public safeguards and/or standards remain protected? 

If confirmed, I would work with agencies to ensure regulations are consistent with the law, 

maximize net benefits, and minimize burdens to the public. Moreover, as OMB Guidance has 

stated, deregulatory actions must follow the same legal and analytical standards as regulatory 

actions. 

IV. Relations with Congress and the Public 

46. If confinned, how will you make certain that you will respond in a timely manner to Member 

requests for information? 

If confirmed, I would work with OIRA staff to ensure timely responses to requests for 

information. 

47. If confirmed, do you agree without reservation to reply to any reasonable request for 

information from the Ranking Member of any duly constituted committee of the Congress? 

Yes, consistent with advice from OMB General Counsel. 

48. If confinned, do you agree without reservation to reply to any reasonable request for 

information from members of Congress? 

Yes. 

49. If confirmed, do you commit to take all reasonable steps to ensure that you and your agency 

comply with deadlines established for requested information? 

Yes. 

50. If confirmed, do you commit to protect subordinate officials or employees from reprisal or 

retaliation for any testimony, briefings or communications with members of Congress? 

Yes. 

Senate Homeland Security and Governmental Affairs Committee Page 19 
220 

51. If confirmed, will you ensure that your staff will fully and promptly provide information and 

access to appropriate documents and officials in response to requests made by the 

Government Accountability Office (GAO) and the Congressional Research Service? 

Yes, consistent with advice from OMB General Counsel. 

52. If confinned, will you agree to work with representatives from this Committee and the GAO 

to promptly implement recommendations for improving OMB's operations and 

effectiveness? 

Yes, I agree to work with the Committee and GAO on their recommendations for 

improving OIRA's operations and effectiveness. 

53. If confirmed, will you direct your staff to fully and promptly respond to Freedom of 

Information Act requests submitted by the American people? 

Yes, consistent with advice from OMB General Counsel. 

I, ___ Neomi Rao ____ , hereby state that I have read the foregoing Pre-Hearing 

Questionnaire and Supplemental Questionnaires and that the information provided therein is, to 

the best of my knowledge, current, accurate, and complete. 

_/S/_Neomi Rao __ _ 

(Signature) 

This_26th_day of _May_, 2017 

Senate Homeland Security and Governmental Affairs Committee Page 20 
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Ranking Member Claire McCaskill 

Post-Hearing Questions for the Record 

Submitted to Neomi Rao 

Nomination of Neomi Rao to be Administrator of the Office of Information and Regulatory 

Affairs, Office of Management and Budget 

Wednesday, June 7, 2017 

l. OIRA review often takes far longer than the 90 days established under EO 12866 for its 

consideration of regulations. How can this process be improved so that review is completed 

in a more timely fashion? Should there be consequences for not meeting the 90 day 

deadline? 

I understand that delays in the OIRA review process could be caused by interagency 

consultation and the need for a full consideration of the issues and interests implicated by 

complex regulation. If confirmed, [ would seek to learn more about the reasons for delay and 

to analyze what measures could be taken by OIRA and the agencies to ensure consistently 

prompt review of regulations. 

2. Do you believe that the public should have access to the initial proposed rule that was 

submitted by an agency to OIRA once the final rule has been published in the Federal 

Register so that they can better understand the changes made during the review process? Will 

you commit to making that change? 

OIRA currently shares copies of initial draft rules upon request by a member of the public. If 

confirmed, I would work with the OIRA staff to consider whether such materials could be 

made more easily accessible. 

3. What will you do to increase transparency at OIRA? For example, will you consider ensuring 

that the public can see feedback that O!RA provides agencies as they consider regulations? 

Transparency is an important value in the regulatory process and OIRA currently operates 

with significant transparency. Under Executive Order 12866, O!RA meets with individuals 

and groups who wish to discuss rules under review and those meetings arc made public on 

OIRA's website. Additional websites provide opportunities for individuals and groups to 

track and to comment on the progress of regulations. I support these transparency measures. 

If con finned, I would consider other mechanisms for improving transparency while also 

protecting the ability for OIRA and agencies to have candid deliberations with regard to 

proposed regulations. 
222 

Senator Gary Peters 

Post-Hearing Questions for the Record 

Submitted to Neomi Rao 

Nomination of Neomi Rao to be Administrator of the Office of Information and 

Regulatory Affairs, Office of Management and Budget 

Wednesday, June 7, 2017 

l. You have expressed that you would respect many longstanding principles of OIRA as 

Administrator, including agencies' regulatory cost-benefit analyses. Each agency has 

standards and processes for its cost-benefit analyses, many of which give substantial 

weight to non-monetizablc benefits. Can you discuss in more detail your thoughts on 

the role of cost-benefit analyses, and any of your work that has led you to think that 

OIRA should make changes in the way it views or uses cost-benefit analyses? You 

have said that how OIRA views each cost-benefit analysis, in making its 

recommendations on regulations, depends on the specific case. However, given your 

deep study of this issue and the fact that you will be responsible for this office's 

overall policy frameworks, can you give us an idea of how you would take these 

analyses into account? Would you commit to upholding OIRA precedents and 

processes for weighing cost-benefit analyses- including fully accounting for 

qualitative benefits? Or would you seek to change these practices as OIRA 

Administrator? 

If confirmed, I would work within the longstanding practices and polices in Executive 

Order 12866 and Circular A-4 that have guided OIRA with respect to regulatory review. 

These documents set forth guidelines for cost benefit analysis and specify factors that 

agencies should consider in the process of drafting regulations, including the qualitative 

effects of regulation. 

2. In her confirmation hearing for Associate Attorney General, Rachel Brand made a 

striking admission that she was unsure whether federal agencies could comply both with 

the Executive Order 13771 (one in, two out) and the Administrative Procedures Act when 

issuing new regulations. While saying she had to "study it further" she did indicate that 

agencies must comply with the APA first and foremost. Can you ensure this committee 

that if agencies comply with the EO, their rules will not be held "arbitrary and 

capricious" because they did not comply with the AP A or the agency's authorizing 

statute? Which statutes authorize agencies to withhold issuing new regulations until 

they can repeal existing regulations to offset the costs? If agencies do not have 

adequate rules to repeal to provide offsets for new rules, they are likely to pick the 

"least costly" rule to industry stakeholders in order to meet budget caps under the 

EO. Doesn't that violate EO 12866's directive, followed by Republican and 

Democratic presidents, that agencies pick rules that "maximize net benefits" to the 

public? If the point of the EO is to compare the costs of old rules to the cost of new 

rules, doesn't that throw the benefits of regulation out the window and turn "costbenefit" analysis into "cost-cost" analysis? 

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Executive Order 13771 requires that deregulatory actions must be "in accordance with 

the Administrative Procedure Act and other applicable law." OIRA works with agencies 

to ensure that their actions arc consistent with legal requirements, which include the APA 

and other statutory authorities. 

Executive Order 12866 directs agencies to "maximize net benefits" and also to "tailor 

[their] regulations to impose the least burden on society." Within any particular budget 

allowance, agencies should be able to identify regulatory and deregulatory actions that 

together maximize net benefits. OMB Guidance on April 5, 2017, states that deregulatory 

actions must follow the same cost benefit calculations as regulatory actions. Therefore, 

the benefits of existing rules must be taken into account when proposing their 

modification or repeal. 

3. I am concerned that the Trump Administration's Executive Order on regulations will 

make it harder, not easier, for the FDA to use its regulatory authority to help stop the 

opioid epidemic. Specifically, it is concerning that potential new FDA attempts to 

regulate opioids may be contingent on the removal of other important FDA regulations 

that may be entirely unassociated with the drug crisis. Can you ensure this committee 

that any f'DA attempts to regulate opioids to stop this crisis will not be slowed 

down, blocked, or weakened by the President's Executive Order? 

OIRA can work with agencies such as the FDA to meet the requirements of the 

President's Executive Order. Moreover, an agency such as the FDA, which is within the 

Department of Health and Human Services, can also offset its regulations against other 

deregulatory actions within HHS. If confinned, I would work with agencies on the 

expeditious approval of important regulations. 

4. In the Congressional debate to improve and refonn the federal regulatory system, there 

have been a number of proposals that call for all federal agencies to adhere to the "best 

available science standard." First referenced in the Endangered Species Conservation Act 

of 1969, the "best available science standard" has since been codified in some other 

federal wildlife and pollution control laws. Should the standard be statutorily applied to 

all agencies, there is a concern that agencies may rely on the most cautious scientific 

approaches and ignore new techniques or information for fear of litigation. Considering 

the agencies' incentives to be cautious, and the disincentive for researchers to share new 

techniques and infonnation with regulators, there is a real issue with how regulators can 

adapt when the science is constantly changing. Though the courts currently provide a 

great deal of deference to their review of agency actions under the "best available science 

standard," it is uncertain how that will apply when the "best science" may not be shared 

with regulators and what is "available" is quickly outdated. How would you implement 

a "best available science standard" so agencies are not incentivized to disregard 

novel techniques or information when making their regulatory decisions? What is 

your view on the most effective way to regulate emerging and fast-advancing 

industries? 

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This is a complex question and, if confirmed, I would seek to learn more about the 

interpretation of "best available science" and how agencies have been implementing this 

standard. In the context of regulatory choices, some general considerations in emerging 

industries might include using perfonnancc standards rather than prescriptive 

requirements, which would allow industries to innovate to meet regulatory standards. 

With respect to standards for developing and identifying the best available science, in 

2004 OMB issued a "Final Information Quality Bulletin for Peer Review," which 

provides detailed guidance on processes for enhancing the quality and credibility of the 

government's scientific information. 

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Senator Heidi Heitkamp 

Post-Hearing Questions for the Record 

Submitted to Ncomi Rao 

Nomination of Neomi Rao to be Administrator of the Office of Information and Regulatory 

Affairs, Office of Management and Budget 

Wednesday, June 7, 2017 

1. Although cost-benefit analysis plays an important role in much of agency rulcmaking, it 

is often inconsistent with the authorizing statutes that agencies operate under. For 

example, when Congress enacted the Clean Air Act, we specifically prohibited the EPA 

from using cost-benefit analysis to set its National Ambient Air Quality Standards. One 

can agree or disagree with the wisdom of that policy choice, but Congress and the courts 

have clearly detennined that is the law. 

a. If confirmed, how would you make sure that OIRA docs not force agencies to 

make changes to the rules they promulgate that would otherwise be prohibited by 

their authorizing statutes? 

If confirmed, I would ensure that agencies follow the law when promulgating 

regulations and comply with any specific statutory requirements or limitations on 

agency decisionmaking and authority. 

b. For example, how would you ensure that OIRA does not improperly rely on costbenefit analysis considerations to force an agency to revise a rule that is being 

issued under a statute that prohibits the use of such considerations when designing 

the rule? 

An agency must follow statutory requirements and standards, including any limits 

on cost benefit analysis, when designing a regulation. If confirmed, I would work 

with OlRA staff and agencies to make certain that regulations followed the 

policies and processes required by law. 

2. In addition to OIRA's regulatory review responsibilities, OIRA also has a number of 

specific functions related to the regulatory process which include paperwork review, 

infonnation resources and technology management, statistical policy oversight, under the 

Paperwork Reduction act; collecting agency statements and reporting them to Congress 

under the Unfunded Mandates Refonn Act; organizing "advocacy review panels" under 

the Small Business Regulatory Enforcements Fairness Act; and preparing and submitting 

an accounting statement and report containing an estimate of the cost and benefits of 

federal rules and paperwork in the OMB budgct,just to name a few. How do you plan to 

balance and prioritize these and other statutory requirements with implementing the 

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President's "2 for 1" Executive order, which seems to be a labor and resource intensive 

endeavor? 

Three ofOIRA's six branches focus on these statutory requirements, including branches 

dedicated to Privacy, Information Policy, and Statistical and Science Policy. If 

con finned, I would work with these branches to meet statutory requirements and address 

new challenges with respect to information management. 

3. In your capacity as OIRA Administrator, how would you advise agencies to implement 

the "2-for-1" EO as it relates to issuing and repealing rules that are statutorily mandated 

by Congress? 

OMB has already issued detailed guidance on the implementation of Executive Order 

13771, which includes important principles such as that deregulatory actions must be 

consistent with an agency's underlying statutory authority and must meet the same 

requirements as regulatory actions, and that Executive Order 12866 remains the "primary 

government EO regarding regulatory planning and review." As agencies work to 

implement the new Executive Order, I would seck, if confirmed, to collaborate with 

agencies on potential deregulatory actions and also to consider whether further guidance 

may be necessary 

4. In your pre-hearing policy questionnaire, you stated that Executive Orders 13771 and 

13777 build upon the principles established under EO 12866. When you say that that 

they "build upon" the principles with 12866, are you suggesting that those executive 

orders are consistent with the same principles established in 12866~ 

I understand Executive Orders 13 771 and 13 777 to highlight and expand upon specific 

requirements in Executive Order 12866. 

a. Would you agree that EO's 13771 and 13777 are primarily focused on 

deregulating, while 12866 is focused on implemented best practices to improve 

mlemaking? 

Executive Order 12866 sets forth the general process for regulatory plam1ing and 

review. While the recent Executive Orders 13771 and 13777 focus specifically on 

requirements for reducing overall regulatory burdens, these are consistent with 

principles in Executive Order 12866 to regulate "without imposing unacceptable 

or unreasonable costs on society" and to ensure that regulations impose "the least 

burden on society" by taking into account "the costs of cumulative regulations." 

Moreover, Executive Order 12866 also requires agencies to "examine whether 

existing regulations (or other law) have created, or contributed to, the problem 

that a new regulation is intended to correct and whether those regulations (or 

other law) should be modified to achieve the intended goal of regulation more 

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effectively." In these respects, the new Executive Orders reinforce longstanding 

principles. 

b. Additionally, EO 13771 uses the word "cost" 17 times, while only mentioning the 

word benefit once (and in the context of the EO not creating any benefit against 

the United States). How are EOs 13771 and 13777, which are keenly focus on 

cost reduction, consistent with EO 12866, an executive order that is focused on 

developing regulations to "maximizing net benefits"? 

As OMB Guidance has clarified, Executive Order 12866 remains the primary 

government executive order regarding regulatory planning and review. Executive 

Orders 13771 and 13777 operate within that framework to require agencies to 

focus on eliminating regulations that are duplicative, inconsistent, obsolete, and 

unnecessarily burdensome. Administrations of both parties have emphasized the 

importance of retrospective review of existing regulations to make sure they 

continue to maximize benefits for the American people. 

5. In her continuation hearing for Associate Attorney General, Rachel Brand made a 

striking admission that she was unsure whether federal agencies could comply both with 

the Executive Order 13771 (one in, two out) and the Administrative Procedures Act when 

issuing new regulations. While saying she had to "study it further" she did indicate that 

agencies must comply with the AP A first and foremost. Can you ensure this committee 

that if agencies comply with the EO, their rules will not be held "arbitrary and 

capricious" because they did not comply with the APA or the agency's authorizing 

statute? 

Executive Order 13 771 requires that deregulatory actions must be "in accordance with 

the Administrative Procedure Act and other applicable law." OlRA works with agencies 

to ensure that their actions arc consistent with legal requirements, which includes the 

APA and other statutory authorities. 

6. If agencies do not have adequate regulatory savings from repealed or modified rules to 

provide offsets for new rules, they are likely to pick the "least costly" regulatory option in 

order to meet budget caps under the EO. 

a. Doesn't that violate EO !2866's directive, followed by Republican and 

Democratic presidents, that agencies pick mles that "maximize net benefits" to 

the public? 

Executive Order 12866 directs agencies to "maximize net benefits" and also to 

"tailor [their] regulations to impose the least burden on society." Within any 

particular budget allowance, agencies should be able to identify regulatory and 

deregulatory actions that together maximize net benefits for the American people. 

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b. If the point of the EO is to compare the costs of old rules to the cost of new rules, 

doesn't that throw the benefits of regulation out the window and turn "costbenefit" analysis into "cost-cost" analysis? 

OMB Guidance states that deregulatory actions must follow the same cost benefit 

calculations as regulatory actions. Therefore, the benefits of existing rules must be 

taken into account when proposing rules for deregulation. 

Executive Order- Regulatory Budget 

7. A key feature of the EO 13771 is that it makes the costs of regulations the overriding 

focus in agency regulatory decision-making, while making any considerations of 

regulatory benefits irrelevant, or at best a distant aftet1hought. After all, an agency can 

only issue a new rule if it has room in its budget of regulatory costs to do so, and this is 

true no matter how much the benefits of that rule may outweigh its costs. At the same 

time, agencies must clear space in their budget of regulatory costs by removing existing 

rules. Here, too, the costs of the existing rules take precedence since they must be large 

enough to offset the costs the new rule. By definition, under this equation, consideration 

of regulatory benefits plays no role. Do you support this regulatory budgeting approach 

enshrined in the administration's "2-for-1" executive order which fundamentally puts the 

regulatory focus on costs? 

In complying with Executive Order 13 771, agencies must continue to account for both 

the benefits and costs of regulatory and deregulatory actions, consistent with 

longstanding regulatory principles. Executive Order 13771 recognizes the problems of 

cumulative regulatory burdens and requires agencies to focus on eliminating unnecessary, 

obsolete, and ineffective regulations. This emphasis on the cumulative cost of regulation 

is also consistent with the principles articulated in Executive Order 12866. 

8. As OIRA Administrator, one of your primary responsibilities will be to implement the 2-

for-1 executive order, and work with the OMB Director to set the regulatory budget of 

new incremental regulatory costs for future fiscal years. Under the executive order, this 

year's regulatory budget calls of$0 in incremental cost, and each subsequent year, you 

will work with the OMB Director to establish a new level of total incremental cost. How 

will you work with OMB to determine the "appropriate" level of incremental cost 

necessary to adequately preserve the public health and safety of the American citizens, 

especially when there is no mention or consideration of benefits in the President's 

executive order? 

This is an important and complex issue that requires agencies to act within their statutory 

obligations while also promoting presidential priorities to reduce the overall regulatory 

burden. If confirmed, l would work with Director Mulvaney, the expert OMB and OIRA 

staff, and administrative agencies to develop an appropriate level of total incremental 

regulatory costs within the context of specific regulatory requirements. 

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229 

9. Much of your academic writings focus on the "non-delegation doctrine" and how 

Congress has delegated much of its legislative authority to the Executive branch. In these 

writings, you have been very critical of the amount of centralized power that has been 

ceded to the Executive branch. Under EO 13771, OMB is given the authority to 

determine the appropriate level of total regulatory cost, and forces agencies to make 

policy decisions based on what regulations they perceive are more important than others. 

This type of deliberation seems better suited for Congress. In fact, it should be presumed 

that Congress weighed the necessary societal factors when they decide to pass the 

authorizing statute - as well as the executive branch when the President signs an 

authorizing bilL Is this not a prime example ceding too much legislative power to the 

Executive branch, which you refer to in your writings? 

Executive Order 13 771 focuses on priorities of execution and considers the impact of 

particular administrative decisions. As these decisions must be undertaken within the 

laws enacted by Congress, they pertain not to legislative power, but to traditional 

discretion regarding the execution of the laws. 

10. Guidance is a fundamental, and often welcomed, part of an efficient and effective 

regulatory system. !fused appropriately, it helps provide clarity and certainty to 

regulated entities on a wide variety of compliance issues. However, agencies can misuse 

guidance as a way to issue rules without going through notice-and-comment 

requirements. As OIRA Administrator, how would you ensure that agency do not misuse 

guidance as a way to forego notice-and-comment rulemaking? 

If confirmed, I would first ensure that agencies complied with the requirements of 

OMB's "Final Bulletin for Agency Good Guidance Practices," which sets forth 

requirements for "significant" guidance documents, including notice and comment 

requirements, specific clements for such guidance, and public access to guidance. In 

addition, if I am confirmed, I would like to evaluate whether and how OIRA and OMB 

can further work with agencies to develop best practices for non-significant guidance. 

II. You reiterated in your pre-hearing questionnaire that you will run OIRA and guide 

agencies consistently with the law. You also stated that President Trump's Executive 

Orders related to regulatory refonn do not create conflicts with existing legal obligations. 

a. Do the principles and processes outlined by EO 12866 and Circular A-4 constitute 

legal obligations? 

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The principles and processes in Executive Order 12866 and Circular A-4 by their 

tenns are designed to "improve the internal management of the Federal 

Government." They are directives from the President and OMB respectively and 

therefore must be followed by agencies in so far as they are consistent with 

statutory requirements. 

i. If yes, do these principles and processes apply to both regulatory and 

deregulatory action? 

These principles and processes apply to both regulatory and deregulatory action, 

as explained in further detail in the April 5, 2017, Guidance Implementing 

Executive Order 13 771. 

ii. If no, what weight do you assign to these documents in the regulatory and 

deregulatory review process? 

12. Your answers to the pre-hearing indicate that you agree that agencies must abide by the 

principles set forth in EO 12866 and Circular A-4 for both regulatory and deregulatory 

actions. What specific steps will you take, as OIRA Administrator, to review agency 

deregulatory actions to ensure the same principles outlined for rulemaking under EO 

12866 and Circular A-4 are adhered to in the rule modification or repeal process? 

As OMB Guidance has stated, the modification or repeal of regulations must go through 

the same process as regulatory actions. If confirmed, I would work with agencies and the 

OIRA staff to apply the standards of Executive Order 12866 and Circular A-4 to the 

modification and repeal of regulations. 

13. Administrative agencies create rules based on Congressional directives in Federal law. 

These authorizing statutes often give broad discretion to agencies to create, modify, 

repeal, and implement rules in line with those directives. Other authorizing statutes, 

however, provide more narrow guidelines for agencies to follow when crafting and 

implementing a mle. 

a. Do you believe that agencies have authority to create, modify, or repeal rules 

made based on their own discretion or agenda? 

As part of the Executive Branch, administrative agencies have no independent 

regulatory authority. What authority agencies possess is granted by Congress 

through statutory directives. At times Congress confers regulatory authority in 

capacious terms, which leaves agencies with discretion about how to achieve 

statutory objectives, including through the creation, modification, and repeal of 

rules. 

i. In what circumstances do agencies have the ability to initiate regulatory or 

deregulatory action without Congressional authority? 

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231 

Agencies cannot initiate regulatory or deregulatory action without statutory 

authority. Within their statutory authmity, however, agencies often have 

discretion to make specific regulatory choices, including assessing when existing 

regulations no longer serve statutory goals and should be modified or repealed. 

b. What steps will you take to guide agency rulemaking according to Congressional 

directives':' 

If confinned, I would work with agencies and the OIRA staff in the regulatory 

review process to ensure that proposed regulatory action is undertaken within 

statutory directives. 

c. How do you plan to work with Congress, specifically members of HSGAC, to 

address the modification or repeal of regulations where no statutory authority 

exists to do so? 

When an agency lacks statutory authority to take a regulatory action, it must work 

with Congress to obtain the appropriate authority through legislation. If 

confirmed, I look forward to working with Members of HSGAC and other 

Members of Congress on regulatory reform proposals. 

Role as_O_LI!A_Administrator 

14. Under your leadership, how will OIRA review regulations in a way that respects 

agencies' expertise and alignment with statutory standards? 

Congress confers regulatory authority on administrative agencies, in part because of their 

subject matter expertise. If con finned, I would follow longstanding practice at OIRA to 

respect agency authority and expertise while ensuring that agencies follow the Jaw and 

use the best available technical and economic analysis. 

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Questions for the Record 

Senator Rand Paul 

On the Nomination of Ms. Neomi Rao to be 

Administrator, Office of Information and Regulatory Affairs, 

Office of Management and Budget 

June 8, 2017 

l. In response to question 16 (a.) of the Pre-hearing questionnaire you completed for the 

Committee ("A common objection to the REINS Act is that it would represent a 

legislative veto over executive branch action. Do you agree? Why or why not?), you 

indicated that you do not believe that the REINS Act established a legislative veto. As 

a follow-up question to your response: Do you support the overall premise of the 

REINS Act? That is, do you believe that it is proper for the Congress-as the 

people's representatives-to weigh in on the most costly and consequential 

regulations being promulgated by Executive Branch agencies? 

Article I, Section 1, of the Constitution vests all legislative power of the federal 

government in Congress. Congress at times enacts statutes that give rulemaking 

authority to executive branch agencies to implement legislative programs. Such 

authority is often expansive and leaves important policy decisions in the discretion of 

executive agencies. The REINS Act proposes one mechanism for ensuring that before 

a significant regulation goes into effect that Congress approves the regulation and 

also takes responsibility for its enactment. As I have written elsewhere, there are 

important reasons the Constitution vests lawmaking with Congress and the people's 

representatives, and I support Congress exercising the legislative power more 

directly. If confirmed, I would look forward to working with Members of Congress 

on proposals, such as the REINS Act, that could improve the accountability of 

administrative agencies to Congress and to the Executive. 

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Former Administrators of the 

Office of Information and Regulatory Affairs 

June 6, 2017 

The Honorable Ron Johnson, Chairman 

Senate Committee on Homeland Security and Governmental Affairs 

340 Senate Dirksen Oflice Building 

Washington, DC 20510 

The Honorable Claire McCaskill, Ranking Member 

Senate Committee on Homeland Security and Governmental Affairs 

340 Senate Dirksen Oftice Building 

Washington, DC 20510 

Dear Mr. Chairman and Mme. Ranking Member: 

The Office of Information and Regulatory Affairs (OIRA) has helped presidents, both 

Democratic and Republican, ensure that federal regulations are designed to provide the greatest 

value to the American people. Objective evaluation of regulatory benefits and costs and open, 

transparent, and responsive regulatory procedures are essential to the development of effective 

public policy free from the undue inf1uence of narrow interests. The undersigned are former 

OIRA Administrators who have worked to achieve these essential goals under administrations of 

both parties. We respectfully request that the Senate move as quickly as possible to ensure that 

OIRA has strong leadership in place as the new administration and Congress confront a range of 

difficult and complex regulatory challenges. 

We commend the nomination of Neomi Rao to fill the position of OIRA Administrator. 

Professor Rao has experience in all three branches of government. She is currently an associate 

professor at the Antonin Scalia Law School where she founded and directs the Center for the 

Study of the Administrative State. She is also a member of the Administrative Conference of the 

United States and serves on the Governing Council of the American Bar Association's Section 

on Administrative Law and Regulatory Practice. We are pleased that the Senate Committee on 

Homeland Security and Government Affairs will this week hold Professor Rao's hearings. 

Given the important role that OIRA has to play in policy initiatives already under way, we urge 

the Committee to proceed expeditiously with its report and recommendation so that the full 

Senate can vote on Professor Rao's nomination. 
234 

Sincerely, 

James C. Miller Ill 

(January 1981 September 1981) 

Christopher C. DeMuth 

(October 1981-May 1984) 

Wendy Lee Gramm 

(October 1985- February 1988) 

0Q~~tl'0) J 

Sally Katzen 

(June 1993- February 1997) 

John T. Spotila 

(July 1999- December 2000) 

c~/Jj~i/) (lu~ · 7~ 

John D. Graham 

(July 2001 -March 2006) 

Susan E. Dudley 

(April 2007- January 2009) 

Howard Shelanski 

(June 2013- January 2017) 

!'lease note: Former Administrators Douglas H. Ginsburg (June 1984- September 1985) and S. Jay Plager 

(February 1988 November 1989) are now United States Circuit Judg;es. Canon 7 vfthe Code of Conduct for 

United States Judges provides that a "judge may not endorse ... a candidate for public office . . , 
235 

Sen. Ron Johnson 

Chairman 

U.S. Senate Committee on 

Homeland Security & 

Governmental Affairs 

340 Dirksen Senate Office Bldg. 

Washington, DC 20510 

Dear Senators Johnson and McCaskill, 

Sen. Claire McCaskill 

Ranhing Member 

U.S. Senate Committee on 

Homeland Security & 

Governmental Affairs 

June 2, 2017 

340 Dirksen Senate Office Bldg. 

Washington, DC 20510 

We, the undersigned scholars of administrative law, constitutional law, and 

regulation, write in support of Professor Neomi Rao's nomination to be 

Administrator of the Office of Information and Regulatory Affairs (OIRA). 

As scholars, we hold diverse views on administrative law, constitutional law, 

and regulatory policy. But we agree that Professor Rao is well qualified to 

administer OIRA, under the statutes and executive orders that govern the office. 

Professor Rao's scholarship is well regarded within the academy, even by 

those who may disagree with aspects of it. She is an intelligent, thoughtful, and 

careful scholar who knows a great deal about how federal agencies function and the 

relevant laws within which they operate. 

Professor Rao has also contributed to public understanding of these issues as 

an appointed member of two important bodies: the Administrative Conference of the 

United States, and the governing council of the American Bar Association's Section 

of Administrative Law and Regulatory Practice. And she will no doubt bring 

important experience to the office from having worked in all three branches of the 

federal government as well as in private law practice. 

Finally, the Center for the Study of the Administrative State, which 

Professor Rao founded and directs, has fostered dialogue among scholars and 

policymakers, by supporting the development of legal scholarship by scholars from 

widely diverse viewpoints, by hosting workshops where scholars can debate and 

collaborate on these papers, and by holding policy conferences open to the public to 

further explore this scholarship and current issues in administrative law and 

regulatory practice. Many of us have participated directly in the Center's work, as 

authors or discussants, and even more of us have benefited from the dialogue 

created by her Center's efforts. 
236 

Scholars Letter re Rao Nomination 

June 2, 2017 

Page 2 of9 

Our nation would be well served by Professor Rao's open-mindedness, her 

intellectual seriousness, and her dedication to collaboration and dialogue. 

Sincerely,* 

Jonathan H. Adler 

Johan Verheij Memorial Professor of Law 

Director, Center for Business Law and Regulation 

Case Western Reserve University 

Aditya Bamzai 

Associate Professor of Law 

University of Virginia School of Law 

Evan Bernick 

Visiting Lecturer and Fellow 

Georgetown University Law Center 

Marshall Breger 

Professor of Law 

Columbus School of Law 

The Catholic University of America 

Emily S. Bremer 

Assistant Professor of Law 

University of Wyoming College of Law 

Henry N. Butler 

Dean and Professor 

Antonin Scalia Law School 

George Mason University 

Ronald A. Cass 

Dean Emeritus 

Boston University School of Law 

* Institutional affiliations are provided for identification purposes only. 
237 

Scholars Letter re Rao Nomination 

June 2, 2017 

Page 3 of9 

James W. Coleman 

Assistant Professor of Law 

SMU Dedman School of Law 

Peter Conti-Brown 

Assistant Professor 

The Wharton School 

University of Pennsylvania 

Lincoln L. Davies 

Associilte Dean for Academic Affairs 

Hugh B. Brown Professor of Law and 

Presidential Scholar 

S.J. Quinney College of Law 

University of Utah 

Christopher DeMuth 

Distinguished Fellow 

Hudson Institute 

OIRA Administrator, 1981-1984 

Susan E. Dudley 

Director and Distinguished Professor of Practice 

Regulatory Studies Center 

George Washington University 

OIRA Administrator, 2007-2009 

,John F. Duffy 

Samuel H. :VIcCoy II Professor of Law 

Elizabeth D. and Richard A. :Vlerrill Professor of Law 

University of Virginia School of Law 

Richard A. Epstein 

Laurence A. Tisch Professor of Law 

l'\ ew York University School of Law 

Elizabeth Price Foley 

Professor of Law 

Florida International University 
238 

Scholars Letter re Rao :--Jomination 

June 2. 2017 

Page 4 of 9 

Michael Greve 

Professor of Law 

Antonin Scalia Law School 

George Mason University 

Yuliya Guseva 

Associate Professor of Law 

Rutgers Law School 

F. Andrew Hessick 

Professor of Law 

University of North Carolina School of Law 

Kristin E. Hickman 

Distinguished McKnight University Professor 

Harlan Albert Rogers Professor of Law 

University of Minnesota Law School 

Claire Hill 

Professor and James L. Krusemark Chair in Law 

university of Minnesota Law School 

Julie Andersen Hill 

Professor of Law 

Cniversity of Alabama 

James Huffman 

Dean Emeritus 

Lewis & Clark Law School 

Justin (Gus) Hurwitz 

Assistant Professor of Law 

Co-director, Space, Cyber, &Telecom Law Program 

University of Nebraska College of Law 

William S. Jordan, III 

Emeritus Professor of Law 

University of Akron School of Law 

Kathryn Judge 

Professor of Law 

Columbia Law School 
239 

Scholars Letter re Rao Nomination 

June 2, 2017 

Page5of9 

William K. Kelley 

Associate Professor of Law 

Notre Dame Law School 

Donald J. Kochan 

Professor of Law 

Associate Dean for Research & Faculty Development 

Chapman University Dale E. Fowler School of Law 

Nelson Lund 

University Professor 

Antonin Scalia Law School 

George Mason University 

Daniel Lyons 

Associate Professor of Law 

Boston College Law School 

Brian Mannix 

Research Professor 

Regulatory Studies Center 

George Washington University 

Jennifer :Yiascott 

Olin/Searle Fellow in Law 

Georgetown University Law Center & 

The George Washington University Law School 

Jonathan S. Masur 

John P. Wilson Professor of Law 

David and Celia Hilliard Research Scholar 

Director of the Wachtell, Lipton, Rosen & Katz 

Program in Behavioral Law, Finance and Economics 

University of Chicago Law School 

Brett McDonnell 

Dorsey & Whitney Chair and Professor of Law 

University of Minnesota Law School 
240 

Scholars Letter rc Rao ~omination 

June 2, 2017 

Page 6 of 9 

Gillian Met7,ger 

Stanley H. Fuld Professor of Law 

Columbia Law School 

Geoffrey Parsons Miller 

Stuyvesant P. Comfort Professor of Law 

Director, Center for Financial Institutions 

New York University School of Law 

Andrew P. Morriss 

Dean & Anthony G. Buzbee Dean's 

Endowed Chair in Law 

Texas A&),1 University School of Law 

John Nagle 

John X Matthews Professor of Law 

Notre Dame Law School 

Donna M. Nagy 

Executive Associate Dean 

C. Ben Dutton Professor of Law 

Indiana University Maurer School of Law 

Jonathan R. Nash 

Robert Howell Hall Professor of Law 

Emory University School of Law 

Aaron L. Nielson 

Associate Professor of Law 

Brigham Young University 

J cnnifer Nou 

1\"eubauer Family Assistant Professor 

University of Chicago Law School 

Anne Joseph O'Connell 

George Johnson Professor of Law 

University of California, Berkeley 
241 

Scholars Letter re Rao Nomination 

June 2, 2017 

Page 7 of9 

John Ohnesorge 

George Young Bascom Professor in Business Law 

Director, East Asian Legal Studies Center 

University of Wisconsin Law School 

Jeffrey A. Pojanowski 

Professor of Law 

Notre Dame Law School 

Philip A. Pucillo 

Professor of Law in Residence 

Michigan State University College of Law 

Jeremy A. Rabkin 

Professor of Law 

Antonin Scalia Law School 

George Mason University 

Michael Rappaport 

Hugh & Hazel Darling Foundation 

Professor of Law 

University of San Diego 

Edward P. Richards 

Director, Program in Law, Science, and Public Health 

Clarence W. Edwards Professor of Law 

LSU Law School 

David Rubenstein 

Professor of Law 

Washburn University School of Law 

Bijal Shah 

Associate Professor of Law 

Sandra Day O'Connor College of Law 

Arizona State University 

Jonathan R. Siegel 

Professor of Lenv 

Davis Research Professor 

George Washington University Law School 
242 

Scholars Letter re Rao Nomination 

June 2, 2017 

Page8of9 

Bradley A. Smith 

Josiah H. Blackmore II/Shirley .M. Nault 

Professor of Law 

Capital University Law School 

Kevin M. Stack 

Professor of Law 

Vanderbilt University Law School 

Lee J. Strang 

John W. Stoepler Professor of Law & Values 

University of Toledo College of Law 

Jim Tozzi 

Director 

Center for Regulatory Effectiveness 

J.W. Verret 

Associate Professor of Law 

Antonin Scalia Law School 

George Mason University 

Christopher J. Walker 

Associate Professor of Law 

Michael E. Moritz College of Law 

The Ohio State University 

Philip A Wallach 

Senior Fellow, Governance Studies 

The Brookings Institution 

Adam White 

Research Fellow 

Hoover Institution, Stanford University 

Amy J. Wildermuth 

Profe;:;sor of Law 

S.J. Quinney College of Law 

University of Utah 
243 

Scholars Letter re Rao Nomination 

June 2, 2017 

Page 9 of 9 

Ann W oolhandler 

William Minor Lile Professor of Law 

University of Virginia Law School 
244 

June 1, 2017 

The Honorable Ron Johnson 

Chairman 

Committee on Homeland Security & Governmental Affairs 

United States Senate 

Washington, DC 20510 

The Honorable Claire McCaskill 

Ranking Member 

Committee on Homeland Security & Governmental Affairs 

United States Senate 

Washington, DC 20510 

Re: Nomination ofNeomi Rao for Administrator of the Office oflnformation and Regulatory 

Affairs (OIRA) 

Dear Chairman Johnson and Ranking Member McCaskill: 

We worked as law clerks for various Justices of the Supreme Court of the United States 

during the year Neomi Rao served as a clerk for Justice Clarence Thomas, and we all support her 

nomination to serve as Administrator of the Office oflnformation and Regulatory Affairs. We 

have diverse political and ideological viewpoints, and we have had a wide array of professional 

experiences. Many of us have worked in government, at both the federal and state levels, some 

for Democrats and some for Republicans. Many of us also have worked in the private sector. 

Several of us are law professors. While our professional and personal paths have thus diverged, 

one of the things we always have shared is admiration for Neomi. We are confident she will 

serve our country well at OIRA. 

During our year on the Court, Neomi exemplified the legal skills and collegiality the 

Justices need from their clerks. Neomi expressed Justice Thomas's views in ways that were 

cogent, forceful, and persuasive, yet also respectful to everyone involved. She did her work with 

appropriate discretion and confidentiality. and she demonstrated all the qualities the Government 

would want in a person holding an important Executive Branch position. 

Both during that year and in the time since, Neomi gained experience that makes her 

uniquely qualified to be OIRA Administrator. Many of the cases the Court decided during our 

year implicated important questions of administrative law, and it has been no surprise to any of 

us that Neomi has become a leading scholar in this field. After she joined the faculty at what is 

now the Antonin Scalia Law SchooL Neomi founded and directed its Center for the Study of the 

Administrative State, which has brought together scholars, judges, and practicing attorneys to 

examine important administrative-law issues. Neomi has been a prolific scholar in this area, 

publishing more than a dozen articles since she joined the faculty. 

Despite all the success she has enjoyed, Neomi has remained the same level-headed, 

down-to-earth person we all liked and respected during our year on the Court. We feel confident 
245 

that she will remain that way at OIRA, and our country will be better for her service. We 

wholeheartedly recommend her for this position.' 

Respectfully submitted. 

Matthew Berry 

Law Clerk to Justice Clarence Thomas 

Heather Elliott 

Law Clerk to Justice Ruth Bader Ginsburg 

BrianT. Fitzpatrick 

Law Clerk to Justice Antonio Scalia 

Jeremy Gaston 

Law Clerk to Justice Sandra Day O'Connor 

Benjamin Gruenstein 

Law Clerk to Justice David H. Souter 

Mirah A. Horowitz 

Law Clerk to Justice Stephen G. Breyer 

Michael Leiter 

Law Clerk to Justice Stephen G. Breyer 

Brett McGurk 

Law Clerk to Chief Justice William H. Rehnquist 

Edward Morrison 

Law Clerk to Justice Antonio Scalia 

David O'Neil 

Law Clerk to Justice Ruth Bader Ginsburg 

Nicholas Quinn Rosenkranz 

Law Clerk to Justice Anthony M. Kennedy 

Aaron Saigcr 

Law Clerk to Justice Ruth Bader Ginsburg 

Alexander J. Willscher 

Law Clerk to Justice Anthony M. Kennedy 

Shay Dvoretzky 

Law Clerk to Justice Antonio Scalia 

Susan E. Engel 

Law Clerk to Justice Antonin Scalia 

Carolyn J. Frantz 

Law Clerk to Justice Sandra Day O'Connor 

Risa Goluboff 

Law Clerk to Justice Stephen G. Breyer 

Kathleen Hartnett 

Law Clerk to Justice John Paul Stevens 

Thomas Lee 

Law Clerk to Justice David II. Souter 

Anup Malani 

Law Clerk to Justice Sandra Day O'Connor 

Troy McKenzie 

Law Clerk to Justice John Paul Stevens 

John Neiman 

Law Clerk to Justice Anthony M. Kennedy 

Joseph Palmore 

Law Clerk to Justice Ruth Bader Ginsburg 

Monica Washington Rothbaum 

Law Clerk to Justice David Souter 

Heidi Docrhoff Vollett 

Law Clerk to Chief Justice William H. 

Rchnquist 

' Please note that professional ethics rules prevented certain members of our clerkship class from signing this letter. 
Æ 

We've done 81% of Simpson-Bowles 

(dollars in billions) 

Simpson- %

Bowles Actual Sim-

Revenue $996 $700 7

Discret savings $1,661 $2,100 12

H care savings $342 

Mandat savings $215 

Social Security 

Revenue $138 

Benefits $100 

Total Social Sec $238 

$3,452 $2,800 8

Interest savings $673 $545 8

$4,125 $3,345 8

National Commission on Fiscal Responsibility, "The Moment of Truth," Dec. 2010, Figure 17