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S. Hrg. 111–152 

ARE WE READY? A STATUS REPORT ON 

EMERGENCY PREPAREDNESS FOR THE 

2009 HURRICANE SEASON 

HEARING 

BEFORE THE

AD HOC SUBCOMMITTEE ON DISASTER RECOVERY 

OF THE

COMMITTEE ON 

HOMELAND SECURITY AND 

GOVERNMENTAL AFFAIRS 

UNITED STATES SENATE 

ONE HUNDRED ELEVENTH CONGRESS 

FIRST SESSION 

JUNE 4, 2009 

Available via http://www.gpoaccess.gov/congress/index.html 

Printed for the use of the Committee on Homeland Security 

and Governmental Affairs 

( 

(II) 

COMMITTEE ON HOMELAND SECURITY AND GOVERNMENTAL AFFAIRS 

JOSEPH I. LIEBERMAN, Connecticut, Chairman 

CARL LEVIN, Michigan 

DANIEL K. AKAKA, Hawaii 

THOMAS R. CARPER, Delaware 

MARK L. PRYOR, Arkansas 

MARY L. LANDRIEU, Louisiana 

CLAIRE MCCASKILL, Missouri 

JON TESTER, Montana 

ROLAND W. BURRIS, Illinois 

MICHAEL F. BENNET, Colorado 

SUSAN M. COLLINS, Maine 

TOM COBURN, Oklahoma 

JOHN MCCAIN, Arizona 

GEORGE V. VOINOVICH, Ohio 

JOHN ENSIGN, Nevada 

LINDSEY GRAHAM, South Carolina 

MICHAEL L. ALEXANDER, Staff Director 

BRANDON L. MILHORN, Minority Staff Director and Chief Counsel 

TRINA DRIESSNACK TYRER, Chief Clerk 

AD HOC SUBCOMMITTEE ON DISASTER RECOVERY 

MARY L. LANDRIEU, Louisiana, Chairman 

CLAIRE MCCASKILL, Missouri 

ROLAND W. BURRIS, Illinois 

LINDSEY GRAHAM, South Carolina 

BEN BILLINGS, Staff Director 

ANDY OLSON, Minority Staff Director 

KELSEY STROUD, Chief Clerk 

(III) 

C O N T E N T S 

Opening statements: Page 

Senator Landrieu .............................................................................................. 1 

Senator Burris .................................................................................................. 8 

Senator Graham ............................................................................................... 15 

WITNESSES 

THURSDAY, JUNE 4, 2009 

Hon. W. Craig Fugate, Administrator, Federal Emergency Management Agency, U.S. Department of Homeland Security ....................................................... 5 

Major General Frank Grass, Director of Operations, U.S. Northern Command 7 

George Foresman, Advisory Board Co-Chairman of the ReadyCommunities 

Partnership, Corporate Crisis Response Officers Association, Former Undersecretary, Preparedness and Emergency Response, U.S. Department of 

Homeland Security ............................................................................................... 22 

Armond Mascelli, Vice President, Disaster Operations, American Red Cross ... 24 

Janet Durden, President, United Way of Northeast Louisiana ........................... 26 

ALPHABETICAL LIST OF WITNESSES

Durden, Janet: 

Testimony .......................................................................................................... 26 

Prepared statement with attachments ........................................................... 58 

Foresman, George: 

Testimony .......................................................................................................... 22 

Prepared statement .......................................................................................... 50 

Fugate, Hon. W. Craig: 

Testimony .......................................................................................................... 5 

Prepared statement .......................................................................................... 35 

Grass, Major General Frank: 

Testimony .......................................................................................................... 7 

Prepared statement .......................................................................................... 48 

Mascelli, Armond: 

Testimony .......................................................................................................... 24 

Prepared statement .......................................................................................... 52 

APPENDIX 

Ronald C. Osborne, Director, State of South Carolina, Office of the Adjutant 

General, Emergency Management Division, prepared statement submitted 

by Senator Graham .............................................................................................. 93 

Charts submitted for the Record by Senator Landrieu ........................................ 97 

Questions and responses submitted for the Record from: 

Mr. Fugate ........................................................................................................ 101 

Major General Grass ........................................................................................ 107 

Mr. Mascelli with attachments ........................................................................ 110 

Mr. Mascelli answer to question asked at hearing ........................................ 114 

Additional statements submitted for the record by: 

Mr. Kenny Harrell ............................................................................................ 115 

Ms. Lucinda Nord ............................................................................................. 116 

Ms. Francis G. Furrie ....................................................................................... 117 

Ms. Tracy Hays ................................................................................................. 118 

Ms. Lori Linstead ............................................................................................. 119 

Mr. Stephen G. Almon ..................................................................................... 120 

(1) 

ARE WE READY? A STATUS REPORT ON 

EMERGENCY PREPAREDNESS FOR THE 2009 

HURRICANE SEASON 

THURSDAY, JUNE 4, 2009 

U.S. SENATE,

AD HOC SUBCOMMITTEE ON DISASTER RECOVERY,

OF THE COMMITTEE ON HOMELAND SECURITY

AND GOVERNMENTAL AFFAIRS, 

Washington, DC. 

The Subcommittee met, pursuant to notice, at 2:03 p.m., in room 

SD–342, Dirksen Senate Office Building, Hon. Mary L. Landrieu, 

Chairman of the Subcommittee, presiding. 

Present: Senators Landrieu, Burris, and Graham. 

OPENING STATEMENT OF SENATOR LANDRIEU 

Senator LANDRIEU. Good afternoon. Our Subcommittee on Disaster Recovery will come to order. And let me welcome everyone 

that has joined us today for what I think is a very important hearing and what is one of a series of hearings that will continue to 

happen as we strive to get our Nation’s response capabilities in the 

very best possible shape that we can for hurricanes and all disasters. 

That is the subject of this hearing today, to see where we are, 

and we have the opportunity to have on our first panel the new 

FEMA administrator who will be testifying today for the first time 

since his confirmation. 

Welcome, Mr. Fugate. And Major General Grass from Missouri, 

who will be testifying today as well. 

Let me say that this hearing is focused on hurricane response because we started hurricane season this week. But we will be examining issues that affect not just the hurricane region, but all regions of the country in this hearing today, and we will be focusing 

on plans and processes that actually have applicability across the 

board for many different types of threats, be it hurricanes, earthquakes, etc. 

The Ranking Member and I both represent States that have seen 

large portions of our States, major cities, and very important rural 

areas devastated by recent hurricanes. 2004, 2005, and 2008 were 

particularly hard years for cities and communities throughout the 

Gulf Coast, from Florida to Texas, but the last century has been 

difficult for many States. 

2 

1The chart referred to appears in the Appendix on page 97. 

2The chart referred to appears in the Appendix on page 98. 

And I would like to put the first chart up.1

These are the tracker of all the hurricanes that have hit this particular region of the country, which is the Hurricane Belt, from 

1955 to 2005. The blue line is Hurricane Katrina, which was the 

greatest among all the storms depicted there by a significant 

amount, in terms of size, of damage. And then, Hurricane Rita, 

which ranks second amongst the storms in terms of damage. And 

I would like to show you the next graph, which is even more startling, these are the storms since 1851 to the present.2

So when we, in the Gulf Coast, talk about the threat, it is real, 

it is frightening, and it is important for this Subcommittee, and all 

committees of this Congress, to continue to focus, as best we can, 

on the sure threat of hurricanes, that are getting more and more 

predictable, we know, and can be better focused on where they are 

going to hit and when they are hitting, unlike earthquakes, although our science is getting much better on earthquakes and fires 

as well. But we have gotten pretty good at predicting where these 

storms will hit. There is very little we can do, I think, immediately 

to stop them, but we most certainly can prepare our people better 

for the threat that they are facing. 

It is important for us to understand our capacity to deal with 

these real and ongoing, and in some people’s minds, ever-strengthening threats, and that is what this Subcommittee will focus on 

and has focused on since the wake-up call of Hurricane Katrina, 

which will be 4 years ago on August 29. 

We want to make sure that we continue the work necessary to 

make more scientifically-based predictions and warnings for people, 

so they can move out of the way of these powerful storms. We want 

to make sure that their evacuation routes are clear and secure and 

that the rules and regulations involving evacuation are clear to the 

millions of people that have to follow them, as well as to those who 

are organizing the evacuations. 

What will people be reimbursed for, what they will not be reimbursed for is of particular interest to me. Immediately stabilizing 

availablity of water, food, and medicine to all the people that flee 

from storms like this is important, and we have not quite gotten 

that right yet. Where do people that flee these storms, where do 

they live in the event that they cannot go back to the house, or the 

shelter, or the apartment, or the place, nursing home, hospitals 

that they evacuated from? Where do we shelter them and who pays 

for that and for how long? 

Then, what do we do to help these communities recover when 

they are big cities, large metropolitan areas with millions of people? How do we help the small rural communities that do not get 

any attention from anybody once the wind and the waves are gone? 

How do we help them to recover? I would suggest that we have a 

lot of work to do. 

I would like to say a few words about the devastating hurricanes 

that struck Texas and Louisiana last year because the response to 

those demonstrated progress that has been made, as well as the requirement for significant improvement. 

3 

The evacuations for Hurricanes Gustav and Ike were the largest 

in U.S. history. Louisiana moved 2 million people out of harm’s 

way, including the elderly, the disabled, and those without transport. 

Texas kept Houston residents at home so roads could be cleared 

for people on the Coast to flee from Hurricane Ike without getting 

stuck in traffic as they did when Hurricane Rita was approaching. 

Communication and coordination between different levels of government was better. FEMA declared pre-landfall disasters in both 

States, surged resources into the areas before impact, and the Federal levees held. 

However, insufficient quantities of generators forced hospitals in 

Baton Rouge to evacuate patients. Insufficient supply of generators 

caused gas stations to shut down, which almost caused a panic in 

a major metropolitan area, as for weeks people could not access any 

gasoline. When people cannot access gasoline, they cannot get to 

work. It shuts the economy down. People start getting laid off of 

work. Even within a week or two of a storm that could happen. 

We cannot afford to lose more jobs right now, I might remind the 

people testifying today. Local governments waited days for commodities like ice and water and blue tarps. The State of Louisiana 

bus contractor failed. Evacuees were forced to take school buses 

without air conditioning or bathrooms, which does not seem like 

much, except if it is 100 degrees out and your bus ride is 10 hours 

or longer, it becomes a real issue for people who are sick or elderly, 

or for small children to sit still on a bus is very hard, particularly 

if they have to do so without bathrooms. 

Evacuees from Texas and Louisiana arrived in Shreveport and 

Bastrop, just two, to give examples of. And I have walked through 

these shelters myself that were wholly inadequate. There were no 

cots, there were no blankets, there were inadequate showers, and 

people were forced to sleep on floors because the cots and towels 

did not arrive until 17 days after people arrived. So it was a very 

interesting couple of weeks for the mayors of those towns, which 

did their very level best to make a bad situation better. 

Local levees in South Louisiana failed again. They failed in Hurricane Katrina, they failed in Hurricane Rita, they failed in Hurricane Gustav and Hurricane Ike. And as Administrator Fugate 

knows, because he is from Florida, the people of South Florida are 

very concerned about their water management issues and whether 

their dikes, levees, and water will hold, and that is the subject of 

another hearing. 

Recovery has continued to be a frustrating and cumbersome process for individuals and local governments despite many improvements, which I will mention in a moment. I believe we are still relying, Mr. Fugate, too much on trailers in order to jump start recoveries, and we are going to be pressing hard on new housing and 

shelter options from this Subcommittee. 

I will continue to say that providing these communities with $5 

million in community disaster loan assistance is probably not what 

Charleston, Savannah, Miami, New Orleans, Atlanta, Baton Rouge, 

or any number of communities—they cannot do much with $5 million, and that is all the law allows them to borrow. 

4 

So Administrator Fugate from FEMA will discuss the 2008 response and the agency’s work on alert and warning systems, evacuation plans, and, from his perspective—if we are better situated as 

the 2009 season opens. 

Major General Grass from U.S. Northern Command will outline 

the Department of Defense’s support mission for hurricane response, including aerial storm surveillance, air MedEvac, search 

and rescue, communications support, logistics support, recent hurricane response exercises, and NORTHCOM’s coordination with the 

State National Guard. It is a lot, but we are going to try to get that 

in. And I will mention that we are very proud to have the general 

with us. And he is from the Missouri National Guard, which is of 

particular interest to Senator McCaskill. 

Then on our next panel, we will have George Foresman, a former 

DHS official who is here today to talk about the private sector’s 

role because this Subcommittee Chairman, and Ranking Member, 

and Members recognized, it is not just the Federal Government. It 

is State and local government. It is individuals. It is the private 

sector and the nonprofit sector. We want to give them a voice. 

We also are happy to hear from Armond Mascelli, the Director 

of Operations for the American Red Cross. They have gone through 

a major transformation since Hurricane Katrina. We are very interested in hearing about the fact that they have increased their 

volunteer base from 23,000 to 90,000. And we think it is not only 

a bigger but a better Red Cross, and we are excited about hearing, 

because I think Americans look to the Red Cross to give them 

strength and comfort at times of disaster, and that, of course, has 

been a key role of the Red Cross for many years. 

Finally, Janet Durden joins us on behalf of a community in 

Northeast Louisiana, of which I am very proud, my husband’s 

hometown. And in Hurricane Katrina, they did a phenomenal job 

through their 2–1–1 system there. As the offices lost current and 

became overwhelmed in south Louisiana, north Louisiana picked 

up, and I am sure the same thing happened in Texas, Alabama, 

Mississippi, and Florida. As these storms come in, the northern 

part of the State provides a great amount of help. And we want to 

hear about the increased activity of the 2–1–1 operation, which is 

sort of the go-to-operation when people need information during an 

emergency. They do not call 9–1–1, they call 2–1–1, and we want 

to help Americans understand that. 

So with that opening statement, I would like to ask Mr. Fugate 

to begin. 

Let me ask Senator Burris—I know you are just coming in, and 

welcome. 

Do you want to make any brief opening statement or should we 

go right to the panel? 

Senator BURRIS. Go right to the panel, and I will catch up. 

Senator LANDRIEU. Thank you, Senator. 

We are happy to have Craig Fugate with us, who is the new Administrator of FEMA, a man whom I supported wholeheartedly, as 

did many other members of the Senate. You are extremely experienced. We thank you for the work that you have already done, but 

we are looking forward to hearing from you, Administrator Fugate, 

because, you know as I know, that while we have made some 

5 

1The prepared statement of Mr. Fugate appears in the Appendix on page 35. 

progress, there is a tremendous amount of work that has to be 

done, and we are looking to you for leadership and guidance. 

And may I say before you start, how thankful I am to Nancy 

Ward, who came in before the election of President Obama and the 

appointment of the Secretary of Homeland Security, Janet Napolitano, and stepped in the interim and was immediately able to 

make a tremendous difference and improvement. And I know that 

you are happy with what she was able to do. And I wanted to acknowledge that and then thank you for now being the formal and 

official director, and I look forward to your remarks. 

STATEMENT OF THE HON. W. CRAIG FUGATE,1 ADMINISTRATOR, FEDERAL EMERGENCY MANAGEMENT AGENCY, 

U.S. DEPARTMENT OF HOMELAND SECURITY 

Mr. FUGATE. Thank you, Madam Chairman and Senator Burris. 

There is always your first time to testify a lot of formalities. I have 

submitted written testimony to address some of the questions. I 

have some opening statements. I will try to keep these short because I would rather have the questions and be able to have the 

dialogue. 

I am pleased to be here to represent Homeland Security and the 

Federal Emergency Management Agency to talk about preparations 

for 2009. And I really appreciate the opportunity to come before 

you, particularly your leadership in these issues, this Subcommittee’s work in identifying as a Nation where we need to go. That 

kind of talks about changing how we want to approach things. 

We, in FEMA, believe our role is to ensure that we are working 

together as a Nation to build, sustain, and improve our capabilities 

to prepare for, protect against, respond to, recover from, and mitigate against all hazards. And the key thing here is recognizing that 

FEMA by itself cannot be successful. 

Many of the groups that you have represented today in your 

hearing are part of that team. More importantly, it is our local and 

State officials and the volunteer organizations, but ultimately it is 

our citizens that are part of that team. And if nothing else, I am 

trying to get people to recognize that the public is not the liability; 

they are the resource that can help us be more successful, but we 

also have to be there for their needs when disaster strikes. 

As you know, the Post-Katrina Emergency Management Reform 

Act of 2006 established the position of administrator, provided for 

the authorities and additional functions that we now have at 

FEMA, more tools that, as you pointed out, last year began showing the improvement, but, again, we still have a ways to go. And 

it allows us to further strengthen that relationship with our State 

partners, with our tribal and local governments as part of that 

community. It is contributed to our increased operational capacity 

to manage all types of emergencies. 

As you remember, one of the challenges in Hurricane Katrina 

was not being able to move and release items until there was a 

declaration. And the challenges of pre-positioning and providing 

that assistance, that clarity, has been brought because of the work 

your Subcommittee did and the findings that said we needed to enVerDate Nov 24 2008 14:58 Nov 12, 2009 Jkt 051783 PO 00000 Frm 00009 Fmt 6633 Sfmt 6633 P:\DOCS\51783.TXT SAFFAIRS PsN: PAT
6 

able the administrator and the team to support governors more 

proactively. 

We continue that work in empowering FEMA to do that. In fact, 

as you point out, we face a variety of hazards. We have also instituted, starting this morning, no-notice exercises. To begin testing 

the team, we simulated a major earthquake in California this 

morning at 6 a.m, no notice to the team, to see and make sure that 

we are reinforcing these procedures so that, as you point out, we 

are not 72 hours after disaster strikes getting critical resources 

there in support of the governors. 

This process of building this team and enhancing what you have 

given us, the tools, is really what we are focused on in this 2009 

season. There is tremendous capability that has been built and the 

legal construct that often times your work, the Subcommittee’s 

work, and the legislation’s past has addressed. Now it is our responsibility to make sure we can implement that fully. 

So as we go through this and build these integral partnerships— 

Secretary Napolitano, as you pointed out, and Nancy Ward, who I 

just cannot say enough great things about, having worked with her 

as a State Director, having her serve in that role and helping transition as I came on board, and now, again, a very strong regional 

administrator as part of the FEMA family. As you pointed out, she 

brought a lot of common-sense approach and got a good team to address the challenges we face in the recovery, and that is a continual commitment that we have. 

As I serve in this capacity, coming from a State director and 

working with Secretary Napolitano, as she was a former governor, 

we very much bring the experience that we were once, too, customers of our Federal family and the challenges we face in trying 

to help our citizens. And we continue to work towards that, and we 

are working on our State partners to give them more ownership of 

this process. 

We know that, as you point out, temporary housing—how do we 

house people after a disaster—is not a solution that we are going 

to be able to bring from Washington and fit all States. We really 

want to work with our States as we have developed some ideas and 

concepts to really work with our States and say, what other ideas 

have you come up with. How do we make sure that we are able 

to capture what resources are there, what is the best way to address that. We know that there is no one solution that fits every 

scenario, and we want to make sure that we are working with the 

States to build those housing task forces, so that as, unfortunately, 

these may occur in the future, we have more options as we go forward. 

It is again, multidiscipline, multi-team approach. We need to 

have that ownership and buy in at all levels and integrate. And 

when I said working together, I think sometimes when we look at 

our planning process, we are so government-centric, we forget that 

the community’s a lot more than government. 

As you have here, some of the volunteer agencies that are represented, of course, our partners, the American Red Cross, the people that promote the United Way with 2–1–1, and brokering those 

resources is critical, that we bring about that team approach and 

7 

1The prepared statement of General Grass appears in the Appendix on page 48. 

that we work as not just representing government but what the 

private sector does. 

I mean, to me, it is always the challenge—does it make sense to 

be distributing supplies when we have an open grocery store, but 

we have other areas in the community that are not served? And 

we cannot do that if our focus is we are just going to build a government-centric team and we do not recognize. We have to build 

a team that involves all the partners that can serve and support 

our citizens. But most importantly, making sure our citizens understand they have a role to be as prepared as they can so that when 

disaster strikes, we can focus on the most vulnerable citizens because we have done our part to get a plan to be ready. 

Finally, the last thing, Madam Chairman, as my time runs out, 

if we can just ask folks—all this work that your Subcommittee is 

doing, we can do a lot more if people do one more thing when disaster strikes. If you and your family are OK, check on a neighbor. 

We can do a lot more working together than we can just trying to 

do it from a government-centric approach. 

Senator LANDRIEU. Spoken like a true local FEMA administrator. 

I thank you. And we will give you as much time as you need. 

Thank you for sticking to the 5 minutes, but I want to be very liberal with you in your time because I do think that you have a great 

message to bring to the Nation. 

General Grass. 

STATEMENT OF MAJOR GENERAL FRANK GRASS,1 DIRECTOR 

OF OPERATIONS, U.S. NORTHERN COMMAND 

General GRASS. Chairman Landrieu, Senator Burris, thank you 

for the opportunity today to represent and present comments of the 

defense support to civil authorities that we do at NORTHCOM 

everyday. I would like to take just a moment to introduce my executive officer, Commander Dan Baxter, who grew up in Jefferson 

Parish, Louisiana, a great naval aviator, and has many relatives 

living there today. He definitely understands the hurricane season, 

ma’am. 

Senator LANDRIEU. Very nice to meet you. 

Commander Baxter. Thank you. 

General GRASS. We at U.S. Northern Command are privileged to 

be a member of the whole U.S. Government approach to disaster 

response, including active Guard and Reserve, alongside our Federal, State, tribal and local partners. 

We started our planning this year well in advance of the past 

year. We stand ready to assist the primary Federal agencies in responding quickly to man-made and natural disasters when directed 

by the President or the Secretary of Defense. When requested and 

approved by appropriate Federal officials, in accordance with the 

national response framework, we support civil authorities by providing specialized skills and assets to save lives, reduce suffering, 

and restore infrastructure in the wake of catastrophic events in the 

homeland. 

Last year, during one of the most destructive hurricane seasons 

on record, we supported the Department of Homeland Security and 

8 

the Federal Emergency Management Agency in responding to three 

major hurricanes, Hurricanes Gustav, Hanna and Ike, within a 13- 

day period. 

We continued to take significant steps in improving our response 

capabilities. First of all, we have incorporated the Joint Staff 

standing execution order to streamline defense support to civil 

authorities within operational planning for the 2009 hurricane season. This Joint Staff Execution Order provides U.S. Northern Command commander the authority to establish operational staging 

areas, Federal mobilization centers, national logistic support areas, 

and Department of Defense base support installations to support 

FEMA. In addition, our 10 full-time defense coordinating officers 

and their staffs coordinate and plan continually with their respective FEMA regions. 

In collaboration with the Department of Defense and the Department of Homeland Security, we have also developed pre-scripted 

mission assignments for FEMA. We have 24 of those approved currently. It provides a menu of response capabilities with a cost to 

FEMA so they can quickly respond and request those mission assignments, based on anticipated requirements of medical evacuation, damage assessment and commodity distribution, to mention 

just a few. 

Finally, in 2009 February, we co-hosted the first National Guard 

and Northern Command Hurricane Planning Conference, in South 

Carolina. It brought together adjutant generals from the Eastern 

and Gulf Coast States, along with the chief of the National Guard 

Bureau and General Renuart, my boss, to the opportunity to look 

at gaps and also work with FEMA and other interagencies, and 

provide a list of shortfalls that we anticipate, based on current deployments, for the 2009 hurricane season. 

Additional planning for the 2009 hurricane season included discussions with U.S. Transportation Command on aeromedical evacuation, general population evacuation, discussions with the Department of Homeland Security and also FEMA, Health and Human 

Services, and our service component commands. All of these are 

planning conferences and table-top exercises we have conducted in 

preparation for the season. 

If and when called, Northern Command continues to stand ready 

to provide robust support to civil authorities during the 2009 hurricane season. Thank you for the opportunity to present today, and 

I stand ready to answer your questions. 

Senator LANDRIEU. Thank you, General. We very much appreciate it. Senator Burris. 

OPENING STATEMENT OF SENATOR BURRIS 

Senator BURRIS. Thank you very much, Madam Chairman. And 

to our distinguished panel, it is certainly a good opportunity to listen and learn what we are preparing for. 

Mr. Fugate, we know that we had a bad—it was not quite a tornado. We hear a lot about hurricanes, but inland a hurricane is a 

tornado, and that is what we get in Illinois. And my home, as a 

matter of fact, is in Tornado Alley down in Southern Illinois. And 

we just had a big storm come through a few weeks ago, and it was 

not quite at the tornado level. They called it a ‘‘dorado.’’ But they 

9 

come up with this new name for it, but it is high winds that 

reaches about 75 miles an hour. 

Is that correct, Mr. Fugate? Is that what they call it now, a dorado? 

Mr. FUGATE. That is one term they use. You also may hear it 

called a microburst. My experience has been if you lose your roof, 

it is kind of academic. It was a strong—— 

Senator BURRIS. It is a hell of a storm. Right. 

Mr. FUGATE. Yes, sir. 

Senator BURRIS. And we had quite a bit of damage. And, of 

course, our governor has asked for some assistance, and I am just 

hoping that assistance would be forthcoming because, unfortunately, in Southern Illinois, there is a lot of poverty and it is just 

not that much resources. So I just hope that we can get some assistance on that. 

Are you familiar with that request? Has it been put in for Southern Illinois yet? 

Mr. FUGATE. No, sir, I am not. We will research that. It could 

still be at the region. I have not seen it. 

Senator BURRIS. It was about 6 weeks ago. 

Mr. FUGATE. Yes, sir. It may have already come through. I have 

been on the job for about 2 weeks and 3 days, so if I have not seen 

it, I will find out where it is at, sir. 

Senator BURRIS. Check it out for us. 

General, I was down in my National Guard facility, down at 

Camp Lincoln the other day, and we were talking about a coordination of the disasters of what our National Guard does. We also 

have another issue called flooding over that Mississippi River that 

ends up in New Orleans. But it comes down through Illinois, roaring like a Mack truck doing 90 down I–55. And it leaves in its 

wake a lot of flooding. 

And I was just wondering, how does NORTHCOM coordinate 

with the National Guard in terms of the disaster coordination? 

Does it go through the National Guard first or who is really in 

charge there? 

General GRASS. To answer your question, our coordination is 

with the National Guard Bureau, but the first response will always 

be with the National Guard supporting the State and local officials. 

We, though, immediately upon indications that there is a disaster pending, we will begin to coordinate with the National Guard 

in case there are gaps in their capability to respond. And I talk 

with the National Guard chief of operations daily, looking across 

the country, looking at where they have forces deployed so we are 

prepared to respond if they have gaps. 

We recently responded to the flood in the Red River of the North 

in North Dakota, working with the National Guard in North Dakota and Minnesota. And we provided some active duty forces to 

back them up, at the request of the Federal Emergency Management Agency. And we prepositioned six aircraft. 

Senator BURRIS. Pardon me. So you say your request also could 

be from FEMA to you. 

Now, does that have to originate at the state level? It generally 

originates at the State level. 

10 

Mr. FUGATE. Senator, the process by which we would activate 

NORTHCOM would be at the request of the State, and we would 

not have assets within either your National Guard or other Federal 

assets, and it was appropriate. We would mission Task D folks at 

NORCOM to provide that assistance. 

But one of the things we have done—and this goes back to some 

of the issues that Madam Chairman had raised previously. A lot 

of times, these would be requests that we had not planned ahead 

of time. 

What we have done is after Hurricane Katrina, and then after 

the hurricanes last year, we have developed what we call a prescripted mission, which is, essentially, we are putting together the 

types of things that we would be likely asking for from 

NORTHCOM. We write these missions out very clearly what we 

are trying to accomplish. NORTHCOM then identifies the resources, trains those resources, and have them ready to go so that 

rather than trying to describe or call up pieces to do something, we 

can activate a mission package that NORTHCOM can then execute 

in support of our mission, which is working through those States. 

So if it exceeds the capability of that National Guard, we often 

times have built these packages for the threats we know about, so 

that whether it was to do a flood fight, whether it was to support 

mass care, whether it was to support commodity distribution or 

bring in specific equipment, these are the types of things that we 

have written out. I believe there are over 260 of those missions we 

have already written out. And that is in addition to the capability 

NORTHCOM could do in addition to the support we would have 

from the Federal family for things we had not written one on. 

One of the things we try to do in our after-action reports is capture anything that was different that we either needed to adjust 

that mission or we needed to create a mission support for. So that 

is a constantly evolving process each time we go through a disaster. 

Senator BURRIS. Well, gentlemen, I have naturally been a civilian for so long, coming back into the government. I think the general public has no idea of the preparation and planning that goes 

into these disaster. And what I am certainly saying as a public official, it is good that I know these things so, hopefully we can get 

a message out to the people that we are really prepared to assist 

in these situations, which leads me, Mr. Fugate, to another question. 

Are you familiar with what the University of Illinois has with 

this super computer that they are simulating the tornadoes and the 

hurricanes, and simulating disasters on these computer models? 

I was down at the University of Illinois, which has the fastest 

computer, Madam Chairman, in the whole country. And what they 

showed me a demonstration of is a simulated tornado. And they 

can then study this, and then actually prepare, based on the atmospheric conditions that are taking place and the development of 

the various winds and velocities, and all the other elements that 

go to make up a tornado, as well as simulating floods and a disaster, even at the city of Chicago. They have this computer design 

that, say, if there is a disaster in Chicago, where are evacuation 

routes. 

11 

Do you know of any other facility where this is being studied 

computer-wise or these simulations are taking place? 

Mr. FUGATE. Senator Burris, I know there are a lot of different 

programs out there. I do not know directly about this, but I will 

ask my staff to get with your staff so I can be briefed on it, sir. 

Senator BURRIS. Yes. We would certainly like to let you know 

what the University of Illinois is really coming up with in terms 

of the simulations and the preparations for it. 

Senator LANDRIEU. Thank you, Senator. 

I am actually aware of a center like that in Louisiana. I do not 

know if our computers are as fast as yours, but we will see. I think 

it is; the battle of the computers here between Illinois and Louisiana. But I am very impressed with what several of our universities have done on the heels of Hurricanes Katrina and Rita, and 

using technology that was there, and building some strategic partnerships. 

So let’s explore the opportunity because there may be some real 

expertise out there, Mr. Fugate; I know there is at the University 

of Lafayette because I have seen it. Perhaps, Senator Burris has 

a suggestion as well. 

I would like to get to my line of questioning if I could, Senator, 

and we will come back. 

I wanted to ask, first, Mr. Fugate, what are your top three priorities? I know you have many, but if you could, for this Subcommittee—because we would like to work with you. We are going 

to push. We are going to work with you, but push to get the very 

best systems we can. 

So what are your top three priorities as you are stepping in to 

an agency that has really been on the front line in many ways 

these last few years? And I am certain that you have discussed this 

with the Secretary and with the highest levels of this Administration. So would you outline that for us now? 

Mr. FUGATE. Yes, ma’am. They are rather broad, they are easy 

to communicate, and they require a lot of moving pieces, and they 

are very simple. 

My first and my greatest priority is to increase the responsibility 

of participation of our citizens to prepare for disaster. I truly believe that far too many of us who do not get ready, do not prepare, 

often times put our most vulnerable citizens in jeopardy as we compete for those needed resources. And in looking at these large-scale 

type disasters, I know that the more that those of us that can be 

ready, can be prepared, the more successful the team will be. That 

is one. 

Two. I really have come into this job with the understanding that 

in our response to the immediate needs to a State and a governor, 

we need to be focused on the outcome we are trying to achieve and 

not necessarily look at process. I am challenging the team, as we 

have been participating in hurricane exercises, to not merely define 

our response by our capabilities, but define the response by what 

is needed to support an impacted State and local government, recognizing there are many parts of that partnership. 

But as an example, it does not seem to me to be very effective 

in search and rescue operations that if we are not reaching the injured quickly, that we are mobilizing, staging and assessing, and 

12 

it is still 2, 3 days into the event, and we have not reached people, 

we have not changed that outcome. So I would rather take the approach of let’s define what that outcome should be. Let’s then work 

in partnership and say, rather than waiting for a disaster and trying to bring it from the outside, how do we build that capability 

within those communities, within those States? And then where 

the Federal Government responds, how do we do that. 

But speed and stabilization have to be based upon not what we 

can build capability to and say that is what the response will be, 

but look at what could happen and go, if that does, have we got 

all the parts of the team working together, including our support 

from the National Guard, from our active duty and reserve components, to achieve that? And not merely go, we are going to incrementally improve something. 

I think that starts getting back to the crux of some of your issues 

that you raised, some of the challenges we had in 2008, such as 

hospitals that we had not gotten generators pre-planned for. We 

need to do that ahead of time, because it is not a generator, it is 

getting that hospital back on line. And that may mean a generator, 

an electrician, or a mechanic. And if you just look at one piece of 

it, you did not get the outcome, which was getting that hospital 

back on line so you do not have to evacuate it. And that is one of 

the things that I learned and continue to bring forth. So that response, based on changing outcomes. 

The third piece—and this is a piece I have seen in much of what 

you have been trying to get in testimony; it is much of what you 

have been writing about—is what is recovery? We keep talking 

about long-term recovery; we keep trying to build it. And I keep 

walking away from it. I am not sure that all the pieces understand 

what we are trying to do. And I certainly recognize the Stafford Act 

all by itself will not achieve what we need to achieve. But if we do 

not have some focal point that says this is where we are going, 

then I think we get lost in our housing programs. We get lost in 

these solutions because they are not really tied to that outcome. 

It is a very simplistic approach, but it helps me guide an outcome 

that I can articulate and begin looking at the variety of resources 

we have at the Federal level to support State, and that is reestablishing a tax base in a community within a time frame that I would 

say no greater than 5 years, that equals or exceeds that tax base 

prior to the event. And this is recognizing you do not want to just 

take 5 years, but in an event like Hurricane Katrina, where we 

have so much rebuilding to take place, that it is—— 

Sometimes people say it may be a simplistic measure, but having 

been in government most of my life, tax bases are a good indicator 

of the health of the economy. It tells us how many homes we have. 

It tells me that businesses are buying permits and people are buying cars. It tells me that I can provide for the services, such as 

schools and other components. And it gives me a chance to start 

looking at programs that can come in, such as HUD dollars from 

Community Block Development Grants, training dollars that come 

in from the Department of Labor, working with Commerce and 

other groups and SBA to make sure that—sometimes disasters 

happen as a community is pivoting economically, and it does not 

make sense if you do not recognize that just putting it back will 

13 

not change the economic outcome, and we still end up with a failure; so looking at something that may not be the best answer in 

all cases, but from the standpoint of being able to give us a focal 

point to start driving recovery. Not just merely administering the 

Stafford Act, but really getting to the point where a community has 

their tax base in tact, which is a good indicator that they can continue those services that have been successful. 

The housing mission, getting schools open, providing public safety, setting the stage for business to thrive, helps me articulate a 

view that says as much as we work as a team to respond to the 

governor in a disaster—it is not FEMA. We merely are articulating, 

on behalf of the President, the team approach of all of our Federal 

agencies. That approach in recovery was just, to me, one of the 

things; that you cannot have a great response and not recover is 

still a failure. 

It gives us a better opportunity to start looking at holistically 

what Federal programs do we already have, what authorities we 

already have. And even though FEMA may not have those programs, helping provide that focus of the Stafford Act, parts of the 

program doing what it can, but also bringing in the rest of the Federal family to help a local government and a State re-establish that 

government, that tax base, which in turn is a reflection that we 

have been able to achieve these things, such as housing, jobs, and 

maintaining the community infrastructure. 

Senator LANDRIEU. Well, let me say, Mr. Fugate, what you have 

just outlined is music to my ears. And the people that I represent 

will be very grateful to hear such a clear and passionate vision of 

what is needed and, truly, what has been lacking for many years 

here, and your focus on citizens and empowering them to make decisions that help us make all of this much better, even though 

these are very difficult challenges, whether it is hurricanes, earthquakes, tornadoes, or great floods. 

Your focus on results as opposed to process, I cannot tell you how 

happy that makes this Senator. And what you just said about trying to define what recovery is because I myself have searched for 

that, and your focus on defining it as restoring the tax base, either 

100 percent or 120 percent, or being satisfied with 80 percent. 

Whatever we decide it is, at least it gives us a goal that we all 

know we are working toward. And I think that is a very excellent 

vision that you have outlined, and I most certainly can appreciate 

the significance of it. 

Let me ask you this question, which I have to bring up to you 

because it is a very tough issue at home, is the V-zone issue. 

Can you take a minute to explain to the country what a V-zone 

is, how many parts of the country are going to be affected by the 

Federal Government’s current policy on V-zones, and why we are 

struggling right now with what we rebuild and what we do not rebuild? 

I am happy that FEMA released, I think, 60 percent of $33 million or so that we have tied up in this issue which affects the building of fire stations, police stations along the coast of Louisiana, 

Mississippi. All the coastal communities from Texas to Mississippi 

to Florida are going to be affected as well as many communities 

14 

alongside rivers. And I am going to get a map of the United States 

with all the V-zones on it so people can understand. 

You may find yourself in one of these V-zones. And if a tornado 

comes, Senator Burris, and destroys areas in the V-zones, the reimbursement that your community thinks they may be getting from 

the Federal Government is not necessarily going to happen. 

So I would like Mr. Fugate to take a minute, and I am going to 

press you on how we can try to resolve this for our State. But go 

ahead. 

Mr. FUGATE. Madam Chairman, a V-zone is a velocity zone. It refers to the Flood Insurance Program in determining risk, that these 

are areas that have the highest risk. And we have had, as a policy 

within the Nation, to direct new growth away from the most vulnerable, most hazardous areas. That is a good policy; it makes 

sense. 

The challenge, though, however, is as we go back and re-map and 

identify these areas, we are often times finding that we have many 

communities that were built in the V-zone and historically are 

there—and as we had developed our policy of passively directing 

construction out of there and again, not wanting to put new growth 

there. But when you had a disaster, if something was damaged 

there, we would relocate. 

Well, there are probably opportunities in a small event, where we 

had only a few homes, that relocation would make sense. But when 

you are dealing with the challenges we find across the Gulf Coast 

and other places that, when you look at the new data that would 

suggest it is a high velocity or a high-risk area, merely using the 

passive approach of removal and not rebuilding the totally destroyed but allowing repairs to damaged buildings, but mitigating, 

really did not recognize that we still have to ask the question that 

as good stewards, we do not want to promote growth in a hazardous area, but if it is already there, can we not look at engineering? And I understand, Madam Chairman, you have just come back 

from the Netherlands where they do a lot more active engineering 

to protect property that we would look at as being in a vulnerable 

zone. 

So I think we are reaching a point, where as we come back and 

we discuss the reauthorization of the National Flood Insurance 

Program and we look at V-zones, we have the immediate issues you 

are facing right now in your district that we are working under our 

current rules and regulations. But also looking at, as we go forward, is it time to recognize that there are many places along 

coastal communities that are going to face this same challenge in 

a disaster; that we have to recognize it? 

If we are going to allow a repair to occur if we mitigate, why 

would a destroyed building not also be considered the same factor? 

And should we not be looking at if we can engineer a solution that 

keeps the public safe, reduces the future damages, does not commit 

to new growth in these areas but allows those historical communities to rebuild as they were, but better so they are not damaged. 

I think that is something we have to ask ourselves as a country. 

And this will be, again, through your leadership and through the 

process of Congress, looking at reauthorization that we want guidance on. 

15 

But I think we have to recognize that for far too many areas, 

that a passive approach of relocation only does not provide options 

that communities need to be able to continue. As you pointed out 

numerous times, doing an alternative project for a fire station fire 

away from the community it is supposed to protect does not make 

any sense. 

Senator LANDRIEU. And I want the public to understand the significance of this issue. Right now, we have communities that have 

been in place for hundreds of years, that are vibrant communities, 

vital communities, that are shipping communities, that have been 

designated as V-zones. The current law says FEMA will—you can 

repair your home, but we will not build a fire station, we will not 

build a post office. We will not build a library. 

So the question then becomes how viable a community can you 

remain without a fire station, without a police station, without a 

library? And that is a big question. And when this map is put up, 

which I do not have today, it is going to show all the V-zones in 

the country and how many millions of people, millions and millions 

and millions of people, live in V-zones, which are in this Senator’s 

State. I can promise you this is going to be a major debate on this 

reauthorization of flood insurance. 

As you know, I have a hold on that bill. That hold is going to 

remain until this issue gets resolved in a way that I believe, or my 

Subcommittee—I am only one Senator, but this Subcommittee is 

going to work very close with you to find a rational approach, 

which is part of what motivated me to go to the Netherlands because I think that they have an extremely rational approach to this 

issue, which is a whole different system we will not get into at this 

hearing, but we will have some more hearings on that subject. 

I have been joined by my Ranking Member, and I would like to 

recognize him now because, as I was pointing out, he and I have 

quite a challenge. And why I love having him on my Subcommittee, 

when I pointed this map out to him, he said, ‘‘And, yes, Strom 

Thurman was there through most of these.’’ 

Senator GRAHAM. He did not miss many of them. 

Senator LANDRIEU. So he is ready to work side by side with me. 

And let me correct myself. When I pointed out earlier, Senator— 

the blue is actually the route of Hurricane Rita, which was one of 

the second largest, I think, storms of all of these, and Hurricane 

Katrina was the yellow. I said the reverse. And I, of course, should 

know these patterns better than anyone. So Hurricane Rita was 

the blue and Hurricane Katrina was the yellow, and this was done 

before Hurricane Ike. And I am going to put Hurricane Ike up 

there because it really ran right smack into Galveston. And I am 

sure you have had some major storms in your time. 

But, Senator Graham, let me recognize you at this time. 

OPENING STATEMENT OF SENATOR GRAHAM 

Senator GRAHAM. Well, thank you, Madam Chairman. That 

would be interesting modern art, and it is just scary that it represents hurricanes. Hurricane Hugo came through South Carolina 

and was very devastating. 

One, I appreciate the work of the Chairman of this Subcommittee. I have never met anybody in the entire Congress more 

16 

1The prepared statement from Ron Osborne submitted by Senator Graham for the record appears in the Appendix on page 93. 

dedicated to a cause than you are to this Subcommittee. I am just 

trying to stay up with you. But South Carolina is certainly in 

harm’s way. 

I want to thank all the folks at the State, local and Federal level 

who help our fellow citizens with disaster. In Myrtle Beach, we had 

a huge fire. The fire did a lot of damage to Myrtle Beach. And it 

is not just hurricanes. The Red Cross was there. So hurricanes are 

what we are talking about today, but coastal communities can be 

hit in many different ways. 

Ron Osborne, the Director of the Emergency Management Division, the Office of Adjutant General, Madam Chairman, could not 

be here today, but he prepared a report about hurricane preparedness, and I would like to submit it to the record. They are doing 

an exercise in South Carolina, a major exercise today. But Mr. 

Osborne is a very smart guy, and I would like to put this into the 

record and share it with the Subcommittee.1

Senator LANDRIEU. Without objection. 

Senator GRAHAM. And one final thought. As you talk about— 

when you go down to the coast of South Carolina, land is obviously 

very valuable, but there are a lot of minority communities and 

where do they go? I mean, there are people that have been there, 

literally, generation after generation after generation, and where 

do they go and what do they do? For someone that may live in Nebraska or on the upper part of South Carolina where hurricanes 

are not such a factor, I think we want to make sure that our coastal residents can get help. 

I mean, people are not being irresponsible. They are not living 

in areas for mudslides. I mean, so many people in our country live 

along the coast, and it is a rich tradition culturally, the Gullah culture in South Carolina, and I want to hang on to it. I want to make 

sure that we have that rational approach. 

So, Madam Chairman, I will help you in any way I can to make 

sure that when a community is hurt, the community is rebuilt, and 

that community includes fire stations, libraries and other aspects 

of a community. Because if you are not willing to invest in those 

things, you have lost a community, and these communities are 

worth hanging on to. 

Senator LANDRIEU. Thank you very much. Let me ask the General a question if I might. 

You said that the exercises that you have recently conducted 

identified some gaps, General, in the organization between 

NORTHCOM and the National Guard. 

Could you identify for us one or two or three of those gaps that 

you identified and what you are doing to close them? 

General GRASS. Madam Chairman, as we met in South Carolina 

in February, the first thing we did was we brought together the 

staff from the National Guard from each of the 11 coastal States. 

And we sat with the National Guard, FEMA, and then we brought 

in a representative from Beaufort County, county-level first responder, and then we brought in the State coordinating officer. 

17 

What we did is we walked through those gaps from how the 

locals would be responding, how the State would respond. Then the 

National Guard gave us a lay down by State of where their shortfalls were. Then FEMA came in and explained what capabilities 

they may be requesting, and then General Renuart summarized 

the table-top exercise. 

I would tell you that the biggest shortfall in this current hurricane season probably is in the brigade structure within the National Guard because of the number of brigades deploying. Even 

though it is a shortfall in certain regions—and it is not a shortfall 

across the Nation. So it is a matter of reallocating forces. And the 

National Guard is working very closely right now with the State’s 

adjutant general to identify those forces that can fill those shortfalls. 

So the brigade structure was one area. Another area was the 

number of rotary wing aircraft that could be deploying. Again, we 

looked across the States, and there are plenty of assets available. 

It is, again, identifying those well in advance, who would back up 

who within the States. And on top of that, we have looked closely 

at the active component, both Army, Navy, Air Force, Marines, and 

Coast Guard assets, working with the Coast Guard through DHS 

to see where their assets would be available as rotary wing would 

be called into the emergency. 

The last area that I would mention that is of concern to us, and 

we worked closely last week with U.S. Transportation Command, 

DHS, FEMA, Health and Human Services, and the Veterans’ Administration, is aeromedical evacuation. And I think we have improved greatly since last hurricane season on the ability to identify 

patients that may be moved, how to receive them on the outbound 

end. And the problem I think that we will face, and we have 

brought it up and discussed at great length, is the release time of 

those patients at local and state levels, because if you wait until 

the last moment, we can only move so many patients. 

So we are trying to have our defense coordinating officers working closely with Administrator Fugate’s Federal coordinating officers to talk to the locals and give them that time line, and say, if 

you make the decision 48 hours, here is the number of patients 

that we can still move and get aircraft in. 

Senator LANDRIEU. Now, I am going to ask my staff for the next 

hearing to design a chart along the Coast from Texas to New York, 

and indicate how many nursing home patients live within 30 miles 

of the coast, and I am going to provide those numbers for you. Because, as you know, in Hurricane Katrina, we had the very unfortunate incidents of dozens of patients drowned in those nursing 

homes. And, of course, it was quite traumatic for the families as 

well as for the victims, obviously. 

I do not think people realize, like Senator Graham just said, how 

many people live near this coast. And not everyone that lives near 

the coast has an automobile. Not everyone is well. Not everyone is 

strong enough or young enough to move out—they have got to have 

help moving out—or be wealthy enough to afford the several thousand dollars that it costs to leave your home for several days. Even 

if you manage to just find shelter in a tent, there is some expense 

associated with that. And I just do not think people have an idea 

18 

of this that have not recently gone through what some of our 

States have gone through. 

So that is going to be an interesting focus. And I think that you 

have identified this MedEvac situation as something with which 

the National Guard and NORTHCOM can be very helpful. Because, 

as you know, States do not have helicopters to move their citizens 

out of harm’s way. So it would be helpful to have these Federal assets available to conduct this evacuation. 

Senator GRAHAM. General Grass, it is not a question of lack of 

capacity in terms of overall numbers for the Guard; it is just the 

resources may not be in the right spot. Is that correct? 

General GRASS. Senator, yes, sir. 

Senator GRAHAM. And I hear recruiting and retention is pretty 

good now in the Guard? 

General GRASS. Yes, sir. They are over-strength right now. 

Senator GRAHAM. How important is the Guard to hurricane assistance in terms of the different agencies involved? How important 

does the Guard—what role do they play? 

General GRASS. I cannot talk for the National Guard being a 

Title 10 Federal officer right now serving at Northern Command. 

But I grew up in the Missouri National Guard, so I will talk about 

my experiences from the past. But they are the first responders in 

support of the fire departments, the emergency responders, and the 

governor. And so, they are going to be there first. And it behooves 

us at NORTHCOM to understand their capability, look at their response times, because if they are successful at the local level, that 

is less Federal assets that we have to put forward. 

Senator GRAHAM. You do not see any need from this Subcommittee or the Armed Services Committee to plus up anything? 

It is just to redistribute, reorganize what we have got? 

General GRASS. Yes, Senator. The Congress has been very gracious with the Department of Defense in our ability to look at what 

we call the 10 essentials that we use in the homeland, those capabilities that we respond to disasters. And we are coming along very 

well and improving that capability, especially in equipping of those 

10 essentials. 

Senator LANDRIEU. Thank you. 

Mr. Fugate, would you comment, from your perspective, on the 

role of the National Guard, whether you consider it to be essential, 

and how you want to position your organization with it? 

Then also comment on the idea about a civilian-ready reserve 

force that could supplement both FEMA and the National Guard 

in terms of trained personnel that could be called out in the event 

of a catastrophic disaster, which, obviously, we cannot maintain on 

call every day, but it would be nice to maybe have something like 

that. 

Maybe that is partly what the Red Cross is going to do, or maybe 

that is a role the National Guard can play. But if there is a gap— 

please comment on the National Guard and then this ready reserve 

idea. 

Mr. FUGATE. Thank you, Madam Chairman. The National Guard 

is a key component of any State governor’s ability to respond to a 

variety of disasters. They are a force multiplier for the local and 

State responders. 

19 

Again, with your leadership, upon my confirmation, one of my 

first visits was with General McKinley, commanding general of the 

National Guard Bureau, having worked very closely with my TAG, 

knowing that relationship. And, again, we have a very strong 

Statewide mutual aid system under EMAC. We leveraged that with 

the National Guard so that as units rotate in and out, we have capability, we identify other States. In addition to that, there is a lot 

of work done within the TAGs to make sure that things, such as 

your joint operation center training, that they are ready to go and 

support each other in a disaster. 

So I think it is a good team. It is a key component of our national 

defense strategy. But most importantly, they are the first of those 

assets available to governors on that governors’ authority, and 

those governors can request from other State governors additional 

Guard units as part of their authority in managing a disaster. 

As far as the reserve component, there is actually some requirements that have been provided in the Post-Katrina Emergency 

Management Reform Act for FEMA to build and take our existing 

structures and build a more professional response force and provide 

more training and capabilities within our reserve force. And so, we 

are looking at that. 

As far as a standing reserve, that would be something I would 

like to further research. But I think there are some elements of 

that that we are already seeing in some of our programs, where we 

are not creating so much formal reserve processes, but building like 

community emergency response teams through the CERT training; 

and in many cases, building capabilities that are more adequately 

leveraged at the local level by enhancing, through community 

emergency response teams, through citizen corp capabilities, that 

people stand ready to help in their neighborhoods and their communities when a disaster strikes. 

Senator LANDRIEU. Thank you. General Grass, When you did 

your assessment of the Joint Task Force, one of the issues that 

came up was the significance of particularly this coast. I mean, all 

of our coasts have port assets. That, of course, must be maintained, 

not just for the benefit of those communities, but the Nation’s economy depends—and in some measure you could say the world’s 

economy depends on the continued operations of these major ports. 

If you start from Houston and work your way up to Maine, there 

are many major ports that can be affected. And we saw when Hurricane Katrina hit, one of the largest, by volume, ports in the Nation was shut down for a long period of time, and the oil and gas 

operations off the Gulf Coast came precariously close to shutting 

down as well. 

Had Hurricane Rita hit Houston, which it did not—it hit close 

to Houston. It was very interesting, as someone might want to 

write what could have happened to the price of oil and gas had 

both the Port of New Orleans and the Port of Houston—and almost 

all offshore operations at that point would have been shut down for 

quite some time. That did not happen, but it would be an interesting research project. 

But what is your responsibility to the ports to keeping them 

open, and did you discuss that at your exercise, and could you testify to that point, please? 

20 

General GRASS. Madam Chairman, again, working with FEMA— 

and I will give you an example of what we did during Hurricane 

Ike last year. We work closely with the Coast Guard through DHS 

and FEMA. And FEMA requested an amphibious ship be deployed 

into the Gulf. And the Port of Galveston was devastated by Hurricane Ike, and there was over a hundred obstacles in the channel. 

And so, the USS Nassau was deployed there. 

We have, any given day, two ships on the East Coast and two 

ships on the West Coast, primarily amphibious ships that can take 

on rotary wing helos. Also, it is the type that you unload vessels 

out the back that can respond. And we had Navy Seabees on board 

that went ashore, and they worked with the locals to try to open 

the port facilities, again, working at the request of FEMA. 

Senator LANDRIEU. Now, you said you have two ships on the East 

Coast and the West Coast. Do you have any on the Gulf Coast? 

General GRASS. No, ma’am, not at this point. But the two on the 

East Coast would respond. 

Senator LANDRIEU. And they are able to get there in time or be 

pre-positioned in the event you had enough notice? 

General GRASS. Yes, ma’am. If we receive a request from FEMA, 

we are prepared to move those. And as we move those, again, we 

are looking at the storm path to try to get them as close into a port 

as we can outside of the storm path. 

Senator LANDRIEU. Last question, Mr. Fugate, and I am going to 

submit several, about pets, about community disaster loans, and 

other things—trailers, alternative housing. But because my time is 

short, and because the season is now, and because a storm will hit, 

this debris removal for local communities is a nightmare, and it 

causes unmitigated pain and suffering on the part of local officials, 

that one of the first things they have to do is remove debris. And 

we had just one headache after another about FEMA’s rules and 

regulations that went something like this. 

If the tree limb was more than 5 inches round, you got reimbursed at a hundred percent, if it was 4 inches, you got 80 percent, 

and if it was 2 inches, you got 30 percent. I am exaggerating a little bit. But for the purposes of this hearing, what has been changed 

about debris removal in a catastrophic or major storm? What hope 

could you give to these local officials, that is one of their immediate 

headaches, trying to just clear their streets, clear their roads so 

that people can get back? Obviously, with debris there, no one can 

move. That has to be done. And it seems to me that we keep making mistake after mistake after mistake. 

So what can you do as the FEMA director to put a system in 

place that is clear, easy to use and cost effective? We are not asking the Federal Government to always pick up 100 percent, but we 

are asking the Federal Government to have clear rules and regulations so the local officials can actually begin the recovery, because 

without debris removal, there is no recovery. 

Mr. FUGATE. Madam Chairman, debris and emergency protective 

measures are two of those things that I think that we have to 

make sure we know what the outcome is so we can get there quickly. And that is, to get debris, where, one, we can get access in the 

community, and, two, we get the debris up so we prevent the problems it creates and we begin the recovery. 

21 

There were some successful programs started. There were pilots—I would like to revisit those—that provided a better incentive 

financially to the local governments and States, who went ahead 

and developed debris management plans. So they had many of 

these questions answered, knew what they were going to do. 

But I think it is also incumbent upon us at FEMA to make sure 

that our guidance is providing clear direction without being a process that is so difficult, that as a local official, the only way I can 

understand it is to hire a former FEMA official as a contractor to 

explain to me the rules; that I am now having to seek reimbursement from the Federal Government in my time of need. 

Senator LANDRIEU. Thank you very much. 

Thank you. The panel has been wonderful. I wish we could spend 

more time, but we will follow up. Thank you all. 

If the second panel would take your seats, please. Thank you 

very much for joining us. I would like to introduce all of you, and 

then in the order that I do so, you are asked to proceed with your 

opening remarks. 

Our first witness today on the second panel will be George 

Foresman. Mr. Foresman co-chairs the Advisory Board for the Corporate Crisis Response Officers Association. He is also the former 

Undersecretary for Preparedness and Emergency Response at the 

Department of Homeland Security. The Corporate Crisis Response 

Officers Association is a new organization chartered to identify, 

train, and engage crisis response officers, as local contact points for 

the public sector. 

So I am, as Chairman of this Subcommittee—and you heard Mr. 

Fugate say that we look to the private sector for partners. We want 

to not only look to the private sector for partners, but I want to 

look to the private sector for better technologies, operations and efficiencies that we can, of course, incorporate into the government 

response. And we thank you very much for your testimony today. 

We are anxious to hear your views and perspective. 

Next, we will hear from Armond Mascelli. Mr. Mascelli is Vice 

President of Disaster Operations at the American Red Cross. Mr. 

Mascelli is responsible for initiating and coordinating the Red 

Cross’ response to major domestic disasters, and managing the organization’s disaster logistics, technology and human resource systems. 

I understand the Red Cross since Hurricane Katrina has gone 

through a major reorganization, and we are looking forward to 

hearing some of the outcomes today. 

Finally, last but most certainly not least, Janet Durden, President of the Northeast Louisiana Chapter of the United Way. She 

served on the coordinating council for Louisiana 2–1–1, but this is 

actually a nationwide emergency response system that I think can 

be very helpful in all of the issues that we have talked about this 

morning. 

So, Mr. Foresman, if you will begin. Thank you. 

22 

1The prepared statement of Mr. Foresman appears in the Appendix on page 50. 

STATEMENT OF GEORGE FORESMAN,1 ADVISORY BOARD COCHAIRMAN OF THE READYCOMMUNITIES PARTNERSHIP, 

CORPORATE CRISIS RESPONSE OFFICERS ASSOCIATION, 

FORMER UNDERSECRETARY, PREPAREDNESS AND EMERGENCY RESPONSE, U.S. DEPARTMENT OF HOMELAND SECURITY 

Mr. FORESMAN. Senator, thank you very much. I am pleased to 

be here. 

Senator Landrieu, thank you for the opportunity to be with you 

this afternoon and to talk about the important work of the 

ReadyCommunities Partnership. We have provided written testimony and respectfully request that it be included in the record. 

The ReadyCommunities Partnership is an initiative for the Corporate Crisis Response Officers Association. It seeks to identify and 

implement best practices that help support improvements in public 

and private sector disaster response and recovery efforts. This initiative has grassroots, developed by a coalition of public and private sector leaders who recognize that better preparedness for 

emergencies and disasters could not solely depend on the actions 

of the Federal Government or, in fact, government alone. 

This initiative is centered on a community-based approach that 

seeks to further galvanize the resources of the public and private 

sectors to address a large-scale crisis in a community. These two 

sectors depend on each other on a day-to-day life of a community 

as they collaborate on how to improve their economic competitiveness, schools, and infrastructure. 

The partnership operates under a tenet that the dependency 

should be just as strong, if not stronger, during a crisis. Yet today, 

even following Hurricane Katrina and countless other disasters, a 

widespread cultural belief remains that envisions crisis response 

and recovery during the first critical 72 hours as being government-centered with private sector engagement limited to those forprofit companies and not-for-profit organizations that deliver essential services, like electricity, phone, debris removal, or disaster aid. 

As a result, the broader private sector is viewed as part of the 

victim population rather than as a potential community of resources to be leveraged to alleviate suffering and speed up recovery, and the communities return to normal. 

The ReadyCommunities Partnership seeks to give local, political 

and business leaders, as well as emergency managers, an additional low-cost tool to improve private sector integration for preand post-event crisis management efforts, while simultaneously acknowledging that it must be accomplished in a manner that complements existing government-centered community preparedness 

initiatives. 

Specific to the challenges that we face for the upcoming hurricane season, America’s newest FEMA administrator, Craig Fugate, 

has just provided you with a very compelling update on FEMA’s 

readiness for the upcoming season. I cannot think of a better or 

more qualified professional to lead FEMA. I will also offer that as 

someone who has been associated with the field for more than a 

quarter of a century, Craig and his senior management team are 

23 

collectively the most diverse, qualified, and hands-on experienced 

group to ever occupy the senior seats of that agency. This is bolstered by the talented group and its parent organization, the Department of Homeland Security. 

It gives me optimism, and it should give optimism to Americans, 

that the Federal Government is continuing to reform and improve 

in its ability to support communities and States in dealing with 

emergencies and disasters of all kinds. But to be fair, however, 

even with this great leadership team, the Federal Government is 

but one part of America’s preparedness equation. Federal readiness 

should not imply national readiness. Other parts, local and State 

government, non-profits, the private sector, and America’s citizens, 

have equally compelling and important roles in all aspects of communities, not just government actions. We need to make sure that 

the entire community is ready for the hurricane season. 

Our recent work with the private sector relative to the flu outbreak provides anecdotal evidence to suggest that private sector 

preparedness efforts remain inconsistent and not necessarily coordinated with the government officials in communities where 

these businesses operate. Even with the heightened attention to 

nationwide pandemic planning, for instance, over the past 4 years, 

there has been surprise at the number of businesses, large and 

small, who have done nothing at the assumption that their local, 

State and Federal Governments will and can do everything when 

a crisis like a hurricane or a pandemic appears at the front door. 

But yet, at the same time, we have seen innovative hurricane 

preparedness efforts along the Gulf Coast and the Atlantic Coast, 

between local and State governments, and the private sector, and 

in States such as Florida. But, unfortunately, these are not replicated across all States vulnerable to a hurricane strike. In light 

of both, we are left to conclude that, on the whole, community preparedness with the right mix of public and private collaboration 

and mutual dependence is lacking. This will create unrealistic expectations and requirements for government, and especially for the 

Federal Government. This Subcommittee knows that with preparedness efforts, leaders make the difference, business and government making the political and economic business case that crisis preparedness is essential to the physical and economic survival. 

In light of today’s severely cash-strapped communities, States 

and businesses, there is very little margin for error in terms of the 

efficiencies applied to how we respond to and recover from disasters. The ReadyCommunities Partnership has seen the value of 

businesses, large and small, designating a corporate crisis response 

officer to work hand in hand with government in the preparation 

for and response and recovery to a crisis. These predesignated contact points, along with pre-event collaboration, enhance the resiliency of a community in a crisis because when something bad happens, the right public and private officials are talking at the right 

time about the right issues. 

Thank you for the opportunity to appear today, and I look forward to your questions. 

Senator LANDRIEU. Thank you very much. 

Mr. Mascelli, am I pronouncing that correctly? 

Mr. MASCELLI. Yes, ma’am, you are. 

24 

1The prepared statement of Mr. Mascelli appears in the Appendix on page 52. 

Senator LANDRIEU. Thank you. 

STATEMENT OF ARMOND MASCELLI,1 VICE PRESIDENT, 

DISASTER OPERATIONS, AMERICAN RED CROSS 

Mr. MASCELLI. Senator, thank you very much. It is an honor to 

testify before you on behalf of the American Red Cross. We appreciate this opportunity to share with you some of the details on our 

ability to respond to the challenges that may face the American 

people during the coming months. Before I begin my testimony, I 

would like to take this opportunity to thank our new FEMA Administrator Fugate for his work in Florida and to express the appreciation of the Red Cross for his support to our disaster preparedness and response efforts in that State. 

For more than 125 years, the Red Cross has provided relief to 

the victims of disasters, helped families and individuals prevent, 

prepare for, and respond to emergencies. From single-family house 

fires to large-scale disasters like hurricanes, the Red Cross works 

to provide essential life-saving and sustaining services to those in 

need. We shelter, we feed, we provide critical supplies and emotional support to those impacted by disasters in communities across 

our country. Our work relies heavily on generous contributions 

from the public, including donations of time, money, and blood. 

Today I will report on our preparations for the upcoming hurricane season. 

Our organization on a local and national level operates in a constant cycle of responding to disasters and preparing for the future. 

Red Cross regularly participates in activities to build capacity, to 

partner, to plan, prepare, exercise, and evaluate our capabilities. 

Spring is a critical time of year for us because, typically, we are 

responding to tornados and floods in one part of the country, while 

at the same time preparing for potential demands of the upcoming 

hurricane season. To meet expected needs, material resources have 

been pre-positioned in 23 warehouses that we have across the 

country for easy access and mobilization. We have completed a detailed assessment of our communications equipment inventory and 

have verified the readiness of our nationwide disaster fleet. 

The National Shelter System is ready. It now contains shelter locations and capacity information for over 55,000 buildings that 

could potentially be used as shelters across this country. The National Shelter System is used for both planning and operational decisions. It records all shelter openings and closings and overnight 

populations on a daily basis. We have made the National Shelter 

System available to FEMA and to all the States free of charge. And 

it is also currently being used by 12 other national non-government 

partners. 

Staffing for disaster operations is also a critical function that requires advance planning. While we focus on the use of local volunteers when possible, we also have a cadre of people trained and 

available to leave their communities to go to disasters. The number 

is now 50,000 available to travel, which is a substantial increase 

from the 23,000 we had available for Hurricane Katrina. These disaster workers are trained for specific jobs, and we are now in the 

25 

process of evaluating availability for disaster assignment over the 

next several months. 

Since Hurricane Katrina, in part, as a result of several after-action reports, including one from the Senate Committee on Homeland Security and Governmental Affairs, the Red Cross has focused 

more resources on coordination with the Federal, State and local 

government. With support from FEMA, we currently have brought 

full-time Red Cross representatives into each of the 10 FEMA regional offices, and we also have two additional staff who are working at the FEMA National Headquarters. We have also tasked a 

staff member to work with the National Disaster Housing Task 

Force. 

During the last year, we have been working with State governments in improving planning; for example, the Red Cross and the 

state of Louisiana working toward a single unified sheltering plan. 

Discussions are continuing with the State’s Department of Social 

Services and the Governor’s Office of Homeland Security Emergency Preparedness about mutual logistics and sheltering for people with critical transportation needs. 

We recently participated, in the State of Florida, in a major disaster exercise with FEMA on a table-top exercise, to model a Category 4 hurricane affecting Savannah, Georgia. We also participated in a recent cabinet-level exercise that dealt with a catastrophic hurricane scenario. 

Identifying new and strengthening existing partnerships continues to be a strong priority of my organization. On the local level, 

chapters partner with local community, faith-based and civic organizations. We have also stepped up efforts to ensure that community 2–1–1 organizations have current disaster information. I 

would like to acknowledge to Ms. Durden the good work that the 

United Way has been doing in this area. 

In addition, we have cultivated and strengthened partnerships 

with such diverse groups as HOPE worldwide, the National Association for the Advancement of Colored People, the Legal Services 

Corporation, and the Tzu Chi Buddhist Foundation. In addition, we 

have worked closely with the National Association of Judiciary Interpreters and Translators, the Virtual Translation Center, the National Council of La Raza, National Disability Rights Network, and 

Save the Children. We have also worked with pet rights groups, 

such as the U.S. Humane Society. 

Seeing that my time is short, I will just move on to say that the 

Red Cross is also involved and continuing to improve our disaster 

response in a cost-effective way. In an economic turndown, the 

needs of the most vulnerable are magnified by disasters. At the 

same time, the donations to charitable organizations are decreasing. Like many non-profit organizations that depend on the generosity of donors, we are faced with financial challenges. 

The major disasters of 2008, such as the wildfires in California, 

flooding in the Midwest, and Hurricanes Gustav and Ike, created 

expenses that far outpaced donations. We were fortunate that our 

organization received support from Congress—— 

Senator LANDRIEU. You could try to wrap up, if you could. I am 

sorry. 

26 

1The prepared statement of Ms. Durden with attachments appears in the Appendix on page 

58. 

Mr. MASCELLI. With that, I will conclude my presentation, and 

if you have questions, I would be happy to answer them. 

Senator LANDRIEU. Thank you very much. Ms. Durden. 

STATEMENT OF JANET DURDEN,1 PRESIDENT, UNITED WAY 

OF NORTHEAST LOUISIANA 

Ms. DURDEN. Thank you, Chairman Landrieu. It is an honor and 

a privilege to have this opportunity to be able to speak today on 

behalf of the United Way and their 2–1–1 system across America. 

As you are aware, 2–1–1 is an information referral line that connects people to existing community resources, like rent and mortgage assistance, as well as food and utility assistance; however, 2– 

1–1 plays a vital role in disaster response and recovery. Trained 

specialists assist callers in times of natural disaster and crisis, providing real time information on shelter locations, food and water 

distribution sites, and all important evacuation routes. 2–1–1 disseminates accurate information about the crisis and it relieves the 

very overworked 9–1–1 dispatchers, who are also taking those nonemergency calls. 

As you are aware, 2–1–1 was truly a bright spot in a very difficult time in our State in responding to 2005 Hurricanes Katrina 

and Rita. Prior to the landfall of Hurricane Katrina, the 2–1–1 in 

New Orleans had to close. Our United Way, the United Way of 

Northeast Louisiana and Monroe, began taking all the 2–1–1 calls 

that were directed from New Orleans. Overnight, we expanded 

from a four-person call center there in Monroe to a 65-person 2– 

1–1. We had additional support that was outstanding. From 2–1– 

1 call specialists around America, 25 States sent people to our community, and there were hundreds of local volunteers that responded. 

As a result of that, in Monroe, 2–1–1 responded to more than 

111,000 calls in 2 months. The call volume peaked at 7,358 the day 

that Hurricane Rita hit. After 2005, we were even better prepared 

for 2008. Going into the hurricane season in 2000, we had a partially integrated telephony, a statewide disaster plan, a centralized 

disaster database, and 24-hour a day, 7-day a week coverage. 

2–1–1 Louisiana answered more than 117,000 calls between Hurricane Gustav hitting on August 31 and September 16, 2008. In the 

peak of that, we were assisted by the 2–1–1 system in California, 

which was invaluable in expanding our capacity. In an 8-day window, when Hurricane Ike hit Texas in September, the Texas 2–1– 

1 answered 157,000 calls, an absolutely incredible response. Inland, 

the aftermath of Hurricane Ike caused unprecedented flooding, as 

you are well aware, and wind damage throughout the Midwest. 

The 2–1–1’s in Missouri, Iowa, Indiana, and Ohio played significant 

roles in their recovery efforts. 

The 2009 preparation is well underway, and I am pleased to report to you that we have complete integrated telephony throughout 

the State of Louisiana. Most importantly, we have an extended and 

enhanced relationship with the Louisiana State government. I am 

pleased to tell you that we have had both Red Cross, 2–1–1 and 

27 

1The charts referred to appear in the Appendix on pages 99 and 100. 

the National Guard embedded in DSS for months of planning that 

have been underway. And third, I would tell you that statewide, we 

have recruited and begun training response volunteers if called 

upon. However, there remain enormous vulnerabilities, and I 

would like to address those. 

The current economic crisis has surged the call volume beyond 

the current capacity of our system in many locations around America. Most 2–1–1’s are still in need of critical elements for disaster 

response. For example, generators, remote-controlled calling ability, 

telephone service priority arrangements with telephone companies, 

and of significant concern to all of us are the gaps in services along 

the U.S. Atlantic coast. 

To properly respond to disaster, 2–1–1’s across America need to 

unify technology and standard operating procedure to ensure best 

responsiveness. Every resident must have 2–1–1 access on any 

kind of telecommunications device, particularly cell phones. 2–1–1’s 

need a system of national inoperability with each other and other 

three-digit numbers. 

Senator Landrieu, we are in desperate need of the Congress’ help 

to ensure both a reliable response to disaster and to everyday 

needs. Fortunately, Congress can cure this vulnerability during 

this session by passing the Calling For 2–1–1 Act before the next 

event occurs. 

Senator Landrieu, we are extremely grateful to you for your 

steadfast support of this legislation, for your co-sponsorship of the 

bill, and your ability to deliver on dedicated Federal funding for 

Louisiana 2–1–1 this year. Thank you again for this opportunity, 

and I welcome the opportunity to answer questions. 

Senator LANDRIEU. Thank you very much. I really appreciate the 

content of all of your testimony and the thoughtfulness that went 

into it. 

I would like to start, Mr. Mascelli, with questions here to you 

about these charts,1 which represents the National Shelter System. 

I know that this was probably in your testimony in some detail, but 

could you take a minute to explain. 

These are all the, and the only, official Red Cross shelters. And 

would you describe most of them as school buildings or most of 

them as churches or places where people worship? How would you 

describe the shelters if someone looked at that map and said describe the actual buildings that those dots represent? 

Mr. MASCELLI. Yes, Senator. You are right in the sense that most 

of them are public buildings. Part of the criteria when we look at 

buildings, along with safety construction, etc., is that they have facilities there that could support a population: Kitchens, bathrooms, 

etc. Schools and churches fill that bill quite readily, so most of 

them are either churches or schools throughout the United States. 

We had the shelters before Hurricane Katrina, but after Hurricane Katrina, we actually put those into a database. So the first 

time, in a computer base, we could see where they were at short 

notice, what might be available. And also, when we actually have 

a disaster, our local chapters will report back to us how many shelters are opening, numbers of people in the shelters, etc. 

28 

Senator LANDRIEU. And the school issue is interesting to me because, obviously, in a catastrophic disaster like the one that we 

had, and others have had, when people move in to schools for a 

long period of time, it is hard to actually operate the school. And 

one of the essential ingredients of recovery for parents with children is to get their children back in school as soon as possible because, then, at least when the children are in school, the parents 

can go about all the work that they need to do to rebuild their 

home, their business, etc. 

How does the Red Cross approach the use of school buildings in 

areas that could potentially suffer catastrophic flooding and destruction? And do you have a backup plan in the event that using 

schools in some areas might not be the best approach in that circumstance? 

Mr. MASCELLI. There is right now work being done, but there is 

a long way from a solution regarding—and you are absolutely 

right, a place of catastrophic disaster. What happens when you 

have large numbers of people that are dislocated on a sudden basis 

for long periods of time? Now, there is the Housing Task Force that 

FEMA has, that really should be the natural connection from getting people from shelters into some other type of housing. I know 

that looking at evacuations of people to other areas, that is a possibility, but that has its own trials and tribulations in terms of dislocating large numbers of people to other communities. 

So as it stands right now, the options are kind of limited and this 

does press communities. We feel it quite a bit, particularly when 

people evacuate from one community to go to another community, 

and that community would like to get back to normal again. So it 

is something that, until a solution comes up, a ready solution 

comes up, for interim housing for large numbers of people, we will 

still be struggling with that. 

Senator LANDRIEU. In the Red Cross’ model right now for the 

sheltering program, do you have a timeframe of 1 week or 2 weeks 

or 3 days or 30 days? Your sheltering plan is, I know, geared toward immediate, not long term assistance. 

Mr. MASCELLI. Right. 

Senator LANDRIEU. So what is your explanation today of that? 

Mr. MASCELLI. We look at emergency shelters for about a 30-day 

period. We think after that, for a whole variety of other reasons, 

that may not be a good environment for a lot of folks. So unless 

absolutely no other option is available, we would like the sheltering 

to be within a 30-day period. 

Senator LANDRIEU. Mr. Foresman, this is still what I would identify as one of dozens of gaps that I see across the board. 

Do you have any comments about any private sector solution 

that some of your members might be willing to put forward on this 

particular issue? 

Mr. FORESMAN. Well, Senator, I do. I have three points that I 

would make. 

First, I think that part of what you heard in Administrator 

Fugate’s testimony is this whole idea about getting to defining the 

objective rather than defining the process. And I think that is really critical, and you said it in your opening statement, that part of 

29 

it is about how do we link, because disaster housing is very much 

of a community issue. It is a State issue, it is a local issue. 

The Federal Government is a supporter in a lot of different ways, 

but it is about being able to partner those private sector entities 

with those local governments, not only in the context of crisis preparedness for the first 72 hours, but what are the innovative solutions, particularly doing large-scale housing operations. And I 

think FEMA is to be commended for having gotten the task force 

report out on housing, but we have got to address the broader issue 

of what are we going to do if, God forbid, we have 200,000 Americans that are homeless again? Because the solutions that we currently have on the table will not solve that for us. And as my colleague from the Red Cross has correctly pointed out, you cannot 

leave them in schools indefinitely. 

The second point, we have seen through a lot of our corporate 

sponsors, who have engaged in a very active way—Sprint is a very 

big player in the ReadyCommunities’ initiative Previstar. Previstar 

has provided some technology about being able to identify resources 

on a more ready scale, for instance, in a local community, not being 

dependent on the traditional government resource identification, 

but private sector tools that allow the private sector to put in their 

resources and make those available to local officials, to the nonprofit community, to a variety of others to be able to deal with it. 

The final comment is this, Senator. We have been wrestling with 

a model of disaster preparedness and recovery in this country for 

the past 25 years that, apparently, is not good for catastrophic 

events. What you heard in the last hour with Administrator 

Fugate’s testimony and his vision, what you are hearing from the 

colleagues of 2–1–1 and from the Red Cross and the United Way 

is 21st Century thinking for disaster response and recovery. That 

is what the ReadyCommunities initiative is about. Let’s not put it 

all on the back of government to try to be everything to everybody 

in the midst of a crisis. Let’s truly take a community approach to 

a community problem to deal with a crisis event. 

Senator LANDRIEU. Thank you very much. And I want you to 

know that I agree 100 percent with what you said, but I also would 

stress that it is important for the Federal Government to be able 

to function, and to function efficiently and well. Because when it 

does not, the other parties, whether they are private sector or nonprofit or States or locals, have that much more of a difficult time. 

So you are correct. The focus of this hearing is, is the Nation 

ready, not just is FEMA ready or Homeland Security ready or the 

Federal Government ready. Is the Nation ready? But it is important for, at least, the Federal framework to be clear. And I think 

the vision that Administrator Fugate—and I happen to agree with 

you about the quality of people now in these positions. If any team 

could get it done, this is the team that can, with our support and, 

of course, a lot of other people’s input. 

Mr. Mascelli, let me ask you this about the Red Cross. I know 

Congress just appropriated a significant amount of money for the 

Red Cross, which maybe is not unprecedented but it is not usual. 

Can you comment on the financial stability right now of your organization and what resources you have to address this pending 

hurricane season? 

30 

Mr. MASCELLI. Yes. We did receive an appropriation from the 

Federal Government. We are in the process of drawing funds 

through the Federal Emergency Management Agency, which is the 

executor of the grant. 

Senator LANDRIEU. And how much was that? 

Mr. MASCELLI. One hundred million dollars total. And we are in 

the process of drawing from that reimbursement for expenses for 

the last hurricane season, and it continues until the end of this fiscal year, Federal fiscal year. 

In addition to that, we have taken a number of activities to basically come within budget, and looking at our finances. And part of 

that is we have restructured our organization fairly substantially, 

our national headquarters, and then with our chapter structure to 

reduce cost. And we are still in the middle of that at this point. 

In addition to that, an aggressive fundraising campaign to get out 

even in this time of economic instability, to be able to raise funds 

when we have these big disasters on an ongoing basis. 

So we believe that the combination of cutting back and restructuring the organization, reducing expenses, aggressive fundraising, 

and then the use of the appropriation, that we should balance our 

organization. We do project for our next fiscal year, which begins 

July 1, 2009, that we will have a balanced budget and we will proceed on that basis. 

Senator LANDRIEU. Thank you. What is your operating budget? 

Mr. MASCELLI. I would have to get back to you. Counting the bio- medical services, the blood services, it is a little over $3 billion. 

Senator LANDRIEU. Ms. Durden, can you comment about the bill 

that we are moving through Congress? And, again, just hit what 

the two or three most important parts of that legislation are for 

supporting a national network, basically, of volunteers in large 

measure—it is led by staff but leveraged by volunteers—that would 

provide not only the operations, but the training necessary to provide that backup communications, so essential in disaster, really, 

of any size, for small disasters. And as Mr. Fugate said, if it is your 

roof that is gone, it is not a small problem for you. 

Tell us again about the specifics of what you see as the benefits 

of that legislation. 

Ms. DURDEN. The Calling for 2–1–1 Act, Senator, is critical. And 

I think the first point is that only 80 percent of our country has 

access to 2–1–1. There are 23 States in America that will have a 

hundred percent coverage as we are in Louisiana, but that is 25 

States, counting—including Puerto Rico. I think there is a map 

that shows that. 

Senator LANDRIEU. If the map could be put up there. So the full 

coverage is in—— 

Ms. DURDEN. The full coverage is in green. 

Senator LANDRIEU [continuing]. Green. And then the blue States 

are—— 

Ms. DURDEN. Eighty percent is the dark blue. 

Senator LANDRIEU. OK. And then the red States are—— 

Ms. DURDEN. The red States are where 2–1–1 is in development. 

And I think it is particularly concerning that there are gaps along 

our Gulf Coast, all the way up to Delaware, Long Island, New 

York; rural Georgia; North Carolina; and the Panhandle of Florida 

31 

are some of those areas where there are gaps, and that is of significance. 

Another factor that this authorization bill would allow us is the 

telephony capacity to be connected. We are very blessed in Louisiana that there were donors that gave after Hurricane Katrina 

that enabled us to have Voice Over IP. And that gives us the opportunity, with the flipping of a switch, to move it around. And 

that is an absolutely incredible opportunity, but that is very rare 

in our country. And so, the capacity through technology is just critical. 

Senator LANDRIEU. If you could take that down, if you would just 

a moment, and leave the state issue—— 

Ms. DURDEN. The map. 

Senator LANDRIEU [continuing]. The map. 

Am I seeing that New York has some serious gaps in that very 

highly urbanized area there? You are shaking your head; New 

York, New Jersey. 

Is that Pennsylvania? 

Ms. DURDEN. That is correct. 

Senator LANDRIEU. Pennsylvania. And then is that Kentucky? 

Ms. DURDEN. South Dakota, Arizona, and Wyoming. 

Senator LANDRIEU. OK, the western States. But on the eastern 

seaboard—and the reason that I raised this issue at this hearing 

in the beginning of this season is that the predictions that I have 

seen, or the feeling about this season, because the storms have 

been so intense in the Gulf, there is some sense that this is the 

East Coast’s time. And I just need to reinforce that I know that 

people in the northeast have not had a storm in a long time, but 

there are some significant studies that show what will happen if 

they do, and it is not a pretty picture. 

In 1938, there was a major storm that hit Long Island, and you 

can just understand and think about what the population was 

then, but what it is today, 70 years plus later. 

Are you testifying that actually in that part of that highly urbanized area, that there virtually is no method outside of your 9–1– 

1 system which you would use to report an emergency? In terms 

of where you could go get a shelter, where you could get a voucher 

for an apartment, where you could get a meal for your child, that 

is basically the service that you provide? 

Ms. DURDEN. That is correct. 

Senator LANDRIEU. And you are absolutely right. I think it 

speaks to the urgency of this Calling for 2–1–1 Act that you are 

supporting. And I have to tell you that we know that was never 

more vividly described or illustrated than after September 11, 

2001. The State of New York did not have it; the State of Connecticut did. And the documented difference in the response in that 

very urbanized region of our country was vivid, and 2–1–1 was 

very successful in their response in the state of Connecticut. And 

it is well documented, the concerns that occurred in New York following September 11, 2001. 

I just want to mention for the record, that in 1938, a Category 

4 hurricane struck Long Island. It destroyed 75,000 buildings and 

displaced thousands of residents. 

32 

For these highly, densely populated areas, if you do not have a 

number to dial to get information, if your electricity is severely 

compromised, if you do not have the right sheltering plans, and if 

the only FEMA housing plan is still what it is today, FEMA trailers, we are in for a very serious situation here. And that is why 

this Subcommittee continues to work. And we will continue to 

work, but it is just a matter of time. And I do not know how much 

more I can do personally to impress upon people how real some of 

these gaps are and what catastrophe lies ahead should a Category 

5 or 4, or a very powerful 3, slam into one of these very densely 

populated urban and low-lying areas along this coast. 

So having said that, we have just a short amount of time. If 

there is anything that you want to add—I have probably one or two 

more questions. 

Is there anything, Mr. Mascelli, you would like to add about how 

you are going to shelter several million people? 

Mr. MASCELLI. Yes, ma’am. I would just like to just reinforce 

what you said about the major metropolitan areas and the level of 

capacity and preparedness in the area. It really—these catastrophic 

disasters are an animal unto themselves, something that, fortunately, we have not experienced until recently. 

There is a great deal of work that needs to be done, particularly 

in those areas. We seem to do OK on the recurring disasters at a 

certain level, and those happen on a regular basis. But when we 

get to these catastrophic events, large populations affected, large 

dislocation, it affects the whole country, the economy of the country, the people, the psyche of the country, etc. So it is something 

that keeps us concerned on a consistent basis. 

Senator LANDRIEU. And just for comparison, not to really beat a 

dead horse here, but it has been something that as a Senator from 

Louisiana and the lead spokesperson for the Gulf Coast on this 

issue—I have to say that with the terrorist attack in New York, 

which was just a horrible and a totally different kind of event— 

that there were a confined number of buildings that were destroyed 

in a very confined space. And while it was a disaster that rocked 

the world, most of the people in New York and Washington, DC on 

that night went to sleep in their own homes. And there was a small 

percentage of people led by Rudy Giuliani and all the rest of a very 

small group that were focused on this particular thing. I mean, 

hands on, the whole world watched. But that night in New York 

and New Jersey and Connecticut, I mean, almost everyone was in 

their own bed. 

That is the difference between what happened there and what 

happened in Hurricane Katrina, where that night of the storm, 2 

million people were somewhere other than their own bedroom. And 

I do not think the country understands what is going to happen if 

this happens in New York or New Jersey or Connecticut or Pennsylvania, or Virginia; I mean, anyplace. And I think that people 

think that they are not going to be impacted by a Category 5 hurricane. I think they think that they have built buildings strong 

enough to withstand them, but I beg to differ. 

So I will continue to make my voice heard to the President and 

to the leadership, and hope that we get through this storm season 

without facing a Category 3, 4, or 5 in a major metropolitan area, 

33 

not that New Orleans is not a major metropolitan area or Galveston or Houston. But a northeast metropolitan area has a lot 

more density than we do along the Gulf Coast. Because the numbers are just staggering. 

And I do not know, Janet, if you want to—— 

Ms. DURDEN. I do want to, first of all, thank you for your sense 

of urgency. And I want to give you an update regarding this critical 

issue of the urban parts of the northeast. New York City has excellent coverage of 2–1–1, but because of the economic condition of 

many of our States, specifically New York State has had to cut 

their funding of 2–1–1. So you are absolutely on point as you talk 

about that urgency in those metropolitan areas. 

The other comment I would make—and you know this so vividly. 

But while you did an outstanding chart that shows the 73 percent 

growth in call volume in a 2-year period, I think the public needs 

to understand those 14 million are people. And during Hurricane 

Katrina, those were people whose lives were being saved by the 

volunteers and the staff on the phone of 2–1–1. We did rooftop rescues. We did connecting people to the appropriate governmental entities. And the most vivid example happened with someone you 

know quite well. Joe Thomas’ wife, Robin, was serving as a volunteer, and took a call from a man who went back into his home and 

found his mother’s body. There was no one for him to call but 2– 

1–1. 

I think that your urgency to continue this funding and this legislation speaks to the need of American people, and I want to thank 

you for that. 

Senator LANDRIEU. Thank you very much. Any closing comments? 

Mr. FORESMAN. Senator, I just want to make—also add the 

thanks to it. Having spent a few years doing this, I have gotten 

pretty good at realizing that there has not been a lot of advocacy 

on the Hill, consistent advocacy, on the issues of disaster response 

and recovery. And to your point—and one of the things that we 

have seen with the ReadyCommunities initiative is—— 

I know you are focused on hurricanes. That is your constituency, 

that is your geography, that is one of the biggest threats that you 

have faced. But we have, over the course of the last 60 days, had 

a little bit of a shake in the Los Angeles region. We have had a 

scare from pandemic. And I think the one recognition and the one 

thing that I very strongly encourage you to do is let’s make this 

about the need for better capabilities to deal with catastrophic 

events, particularly housing, irrespective of what the cause is. Because as the Senator from Illinois pointed out, he is more concerned about tornados or dorados, or whatever we are calling them, 

or microbursts, these days. And we have got to make sure that we 

are resonating the argument with the people who are hearing 

them. 

Senator LANDRIEU. Well, thank you. And I will tell you what I 

am going to do because I do want to support the point that you just 

made. I am going to call a hearing for earthquakes particularly. 

And I want to show a film in this Subcommittee of what is going 

to happen when an earthquake, a major earthquake, hits not just 

California but also Memphis, which is vulnerable. And I am going 

34 

to use the risk assessment that has been done by our risk managers to show the likely disasters, based on their scientific information. 

This is not just what Senator Landrieu thinks might happen. 

This is what our government and scientists believe is probable to 

happen. And what this Subcommittee is going to do is to try continuously to show those probabilities and the gaps in response capacity to what we are predicting is going to happen. And as we 

work, I realize there are other priorities of the government. This 

is not the only priority of the government. But having represented 

people who live and survive through a catastrophic disaster, it is 

hard to tell them that there is another priority. 

That is what is going to happen. I mean, for the 2 or 3 or 4 million, or 5 million, or 20 million people that are caught up in it at 

the time it happens, it is very hard to tell them that there is a 

higher priority than giving them a meal, a shelter, a potential job, 

a place to return. And it becomes a very significant issue for any 

country, whether it is China or India or other countries that we 

have seen go through some horrific catastrophic disasters. And it 

is just a matter of time until some of these predictions happen. And 

I would like to say we are ready, but I am telling you we are not, 

in any number of areas that we have heard about today. 

So thank you all. I think we will bring the hearing to a close. 

The record will remain open for 15 days, and we urge anyone, either here or listening, to submit any information that will be helpful to our Subcommittee, and we thank you very much. Hearing is 

adjourned. 

[Whereupon, at 3:55 p.m., the Subcommittee was adjourned.] 

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