U.S. GOVERNMENT PRINTING OFFICE

44–138 CC WASHINGTON : 1997

H.R. 1635, H.R. 755, H.R. 1718, AND H.R. 708

HEARING

BEFORE THE

SUBCOMMITTEE ON NATIONAL PARKS AND PUBLIC

LANDS

OF THE

COMMITTEE ON RESOURCES

HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES

ONE HUNDRED FIFTH CONGRESS

FIRST SESSION

ON

H.R. 1635, to Establish Within the United States National Park

Service the National Underground Railroad Network to Freedom Program, and for Other Purposes. H.R. 755, to Amend

the Internal Revenue Code of 1986 to Allow Individuals to

Designate Any Portion of their Income Tax Overpayments,

and to make Other Contributions, for the Benefit of Units of

the National Park System. H.R. 1718, to Provide for the Conveyance of Certain Lands in Wyoming to the County of Park,

Wyoming. H.R. 708, to Require the Secretary of Interior to

Conduct a Study Concerning Grazing Use of Certain Land

within and adjacent to Grand Teton National Park, Wyoming,

and to Extend Temporarily Certain Grazing Privileges.

JULY 22, 1997—WASHINGTON, DC

Serial No. 105–37

Printed for the use of the Committee on Resources

(
(II)

COMMITTEE ON RESOURCES

DON YOUNG, Alaska, Chairman

W.J. (BILLY) TAUZIN, Louisiana

JAMES V. HANSEN, Utah

JIM SAXTON, New Jersey

ELTON GALLEGLY, California

JOHN J. DUNCAN, JR., Tennessee

JOEL HEFLEY, Colorado

JOHN T. DOOLITTLE, California

WAYNE T. GILCHREST, Maryland

KEN CALVERT, California

RICHARD W. POMBO, California

BARBARA CUBIN, Wyoming

HELEN CHENOWETH, Idaho

LINDA SMITH, Washington

GEORGE P. RADANOVICH, California

WALTER B. JONES, JR., North Carolina

WILLIAM M. (MAC) THORNBERRY, Texas

JOHN SHADEGG, Arizona

JOHN E. ENSIGN, Nevada

ROBERT F. SMITH, Oregon

CHRIS CANNON, Utah

KEVIN BRADY, Texas

JOHN PETERSON, Pennsylvania

RICK HILL, Montana

BOB SCHAFFER, Colorado

JIM GIBBONS, Nevada

MICHAEL D. CRAPO, Idaho

GEORGE MILLER, California

EDWARD J. MARKEY, Massachusetts

NICK J. RAHALL II, West Virginia

BRUCE F. VENTO, Minnesota

DALE E. KILDEE, Michigan

PETER A. DEFAZIO, Oregon

ENI F.H. FALEOMAVAEGA, American

Samoa

NEIL ABERCROMBIE, Hawaii

SOLOMON P. ORTIZ, Texas

OWEN B. PICKETT, Virginia

FRANK PALLONE, JR., New Jersey

CALVIN M. DOOLEY, California

CARLOS A. ROMERO-BARCELO ́ , Puerto

Rico

MAURICE D. HINCHEY, New York

ROBERT A. UNDERWOOD, Guam

SAM FARR, California

PATRICK J. KENNEDY, Rhode Island

ADAM SMITH, Washington

WILLIAM D. DELAHUNT, Massachusetts

CHRIS JOHN, Louisiana

DONNA CHRISTIAN-GREEN, Virgin Islands

RON KIND, Wisconsin

LLOYD DOGGETT, Texas

LLOYD A. JONES, Chief of Staff

ELIZABETH MEGGINSON, Chief Counsel

CHRISTINE KENNEDY, Chief Clerk/Administrator

JOHN LAWRENCE, Democratic Staff Director

SUBCOMMITTEE ON NATIONAL PARKS AND PUBLIC LANDS

JAMES V. HANSEN, Utah, Chairman

ELTON, GALLEGLY, California

JOHN J. DUNCAN, JR., Tennessee

JOEL HEFLEY, Colorado

WAYNE T. GILCHREST, Maryland

RICHARD W. POMBO, California

HELEN CHENOWETH, Idaho

LINDA SMITH, Washington

GEORGE P. RADANOVICH, California

WALTER B. JONES, JR., North Carolina

JOHN B. SHADEGG, Arizona

JOHN E. ENSIGN, Nevada

ROBERT F. SMITH, Oregon

RICK HILL, Montana

JIM GIBBONS, Nevada

ENI F.H. FALEOMAVAEGA, American

Samoa

EDWARD J. MARKEY, Massachusetts

NICK J. RAHALL II, West Virginia

BRUCE F. VENTO, Minnesota

DALE E. KILDEE, Michigan

FRANK PALLONE, JR., New Jersey

CARLOS A. ROMERO-BARCELO ́ , Puerto

Rico

MAURICE D. HINCHEY, New York

ROBERT A. UNDERWOOD, Guam

PATRICK J. KENNEDY, Rhode Island

WILLIAM D. DELAHUNT, Massachusetts

DONNA CHRISTIAN-GREEN, Virgin Islands

RON KIND, Wisconsin

LLOYD DOGGETT, Texas

ALLEN FREEMYER, Counsel

DAN SMITH, Professional Staff

LIZ BIRNBAUM, Democratic Counsel
(III)

C O N T E N T S

Page

Hearing held July 22, 1997 ..................................................................................... 1

Statements of Members:

Christian–Green, Hon. Donna, a Representative in Congress from the

Virgin Islands ................................................................................................ 7

Prepared statement of ............................................................................... 8

Cubin, Hon. Barbara, a Representative in Congress from the State of

Wyoming ........................................................................................................ 14

Prepared statement of ............................................................................... 16

Duncan, Hon. John J., Jr., a Representative in Congress from the State

of Tennessee .................................................................................................. 4

Prepared statement of ............................................................................... 5

Hansen, Hon. James, a Representative in Congress from the State of

Utah ............................................................................................................... 1

Prepared statement of ............................................................................... 3

Portman, Hon. Rob, a Representative in Congress from the State of

Ohio ................................................................................................................ 10

Prepared statement of ............................................................................... 12

Stokes, Hon. Louis, a Representative in Congress from the State of Ohio . 8

Prepared statement of ............................................................................... 10

Statements of witnesses:

Blockson, Charles L., Curator, Charles L. Blockson Afro–American Collection, Temple University ................................................................................ 24

Prepared statement of ............................................................................... 89

Eisenberg, Albert C., Deputy Director for Conservation Policy, National

Parks and Conservation Association ........................................................... 32

Prepared statement of ............................................................................... 110

Galvin, Denis P., Acting Deputy Director, National Park Service ............... 17

Prepared statement of ............................................................................... 61

Gantt–Wright, Iantha, Diversity Outreach Manager, National Parks and

Conservation Association ............................................................................. 22

Prepared statement of ............................................................................... 86

Howe, Allan T., Washington Representative, National Park Hospitality

Association ..................................................................................................... 34

Prepared statement of ............................................................................... 136

Martinez, Eluid, Commissioner, Bureau of Reclamation .............................. 18

Prepared statement of ............................................................................... 72

Nelson, Cathy, State Coordinator, Ohio Underground Railroad Association ................................................................................................................. 26

Prepared statement of ............................................................................... 93

Rigaud, Edwin J., Executive Director, National Underground Railroad

Freedom Center, Cincinnati, Ohio ............................................................... 28

Prepared statement of ............................................................................... 98

Additional material supplied:

List of Friends of Freedom Society ................................................................. 95

Maynard, Charles W., Executive Director, Friends of Great Smoky Mountains National Park Sevierville, Tennessee, prepared statement of ........ 143

Snowe, Hon. Olympia J., additional testimony submitted by for Maine

Underground Railroad Association .............................................................. 75

Text of H.R. 1635 .............................................................................................. 39

Text of H.R. 755 ................................................................................................ 46

Text of H.R. 1718 .............................................................................................. 51

Text of H.R. 708 ................................................................................................ 56
(1)

HEARING ON:

H.R. 1635, TO ESTABLISH WITHIN THE UNITED

STATES NATIONAL PARK SERVICE THE NATIONAL UNDERGROUND RAILROAD NETWORK TO FREEDOM PROGRAM, AND FOR

OTHER PURPOSES.

H.R. 755, TO AMEND THE INTERNAL REVENUE

CODE OF 1986 TO ALLOW INDIVIDUALS TO

DESIGNATE ANY PORTION OF THEIR INCOME TAX OVERPAYMENTS, AND TO MAKE

OTHER CONTRIBUTIONS, FOR THE BENEFIT

OF UNITS OF THE NATIONAL PARK SYSTEM.

H.R. 1718, TO PROVIDE FOR THE CONVEYANCE OF CERTAIN LANDS IN WYOMING TO

THE COUNTY OF PARK, WYOMING.

H.R. 708, TO REQUIRE THE SECRETARY OF INTERIOR TO CONDUCT A STUDY CONCERNING GRAZING USE OF CERTAIN LAND

WITHIN AND ADJACENT TO GRAND TETON

NATIONAL PARK, WYOMING, AND TO EXTEND TEMPORARILY CERTAIN GRAZING

PRIVILEGES.

TUESDAY, JULY 22, 1997

HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES, SUBCOMMITTEE ON NATIONAL PARKS AND PUBLIC LANDS, COMMITTEE ON RESOURCES, Washington, DC.

The Subcommittee met, pursuant to notice, at 10 a.m., Room

1324, Longworth House Office Building, Hon. James V. Hansen

(Chairman of the Subcommittee) presiding.

STATEMENT OF HON. JAMES HANSEN, A REPRESENTATIVE IN

CONGRESS FROM THE STATE OF UTAH

Mr. HANSEN. The Subcommittee on National Parks and Public

Lands convenes to receive testimony on several bills. I want to welcome the members who join us today as sponsors and co-sponsors

of the legislation before us. We will hear H.R. 1635 by Mr. Stokes
2

and Mr. Portman to establish the National Underground Railroad

Network to Freedom program, H.R. 755 by Mr. Duncan to allow a

tax checkoff for contribution to the National Park System, H.R.

1718 by Mrs. Cubin to transfer lands in Park County, Wyoming,

and H.R. 708, also by Mrs. Cubin, to study and extent grazing

rights on lands within and adjacent to Grand Teton National Park.

The first bill we will hear today is H.R. 1635, the National Underground Railroad Network to Freedom Act of 1997. The bill was

introduced by our colleagues Mr. Stokes and Mr. Portman, who are

here today to testify. The bill has over 70 co-sponsors representing

broad bipartisan support.

H.R. 1635 does not create any additional units to the National

Park System, but provides for the National Park System to establish a program to coordinate, produce and distribute interpretative

educational materials, enter into cooperative agreements to provide

technical assistance to State and local governments in the private

sector, and provides an official symbol for the 380 sites and structures associated with this historic social and humanitarian movement to resist slavery in the United States in the 1800’s.

H.R. 755 is the National Parks Checkoff Act, introduced by Mr.

Duncan, a member of this Subcommittee. This bill would amend

the Internal Revenue Code to allow individual taxpayers to voluntarily designate a portion of their overpayment of Federal income

tax or make a contribution in addition to their Federal tax payment of one dollar or more for the benefit of the National Park

Service.

This concept is unique in that there is no budgetary impact. This

is a voluntary decision by the taxpayer. None of the funds can be

used for land acquisition, but only for operation and maintenance

of the units of the National Park System.

The next bill is H.R. 1718. H.R. 1718 provides for the conveyance

of 190 acres of land in Wyoming to the County of Park, Wyoming.

The land conveyed can only be used for economic development by

the county or, if the property is transferred to a local non-profit organization, solely for the purposes of economic development. This

bill would convey all right, title and interest, except for any right

or interest in oil and gas reserves, which would remain held by the

U.S. Government. As originally proposed, if within 5 years of the

authorization of the conveyance the Secretary determines that the

property is not being used for economic development, then right,

title and interest shall revert back to the Federal Government. The

Federal Government also agrees to hold harmless future owners

from violations that may have occurred from past activity. We are

aware of a few concerns with this bill that have recently come to

light, and Mrs. Cubin will describe H.R. 1718 and some of the concerns when the time comes.

Lastly, H.R. 708, sponsored by Mrs. Cubin, is designated to address a problem that is beginning to affect many of our Federal

lands, and that is development up to the boundaries of our parks

and recreation areas. I am the last person in Congress to endorse

buffer zones, however in this instance Mrs. Cubin has crafted a solution that I believe will insure responsible grazing in and around

the park for years to come and will insure the benefits these ranchers provide the park and its resources are not taken over by con-
3

dominium developments. Many people forget that if we run the

true stewards of our Federal lands off these lands, the private

lands will likely be sold and developed for purposes that are completely in contradiction to conservation and responsible commodity

products.

We will hear from Mr. Duncan first. Mrs. Cubin is second, and

then members from the Committee in the order they arrive. I ask

unanimous consent that any of these members be allowed to join

us on the dias after their testimony. We will then call upon Administration witnesses, Mr. Galvin and Mr. Martinez, to testify on the

bills before us. Panel II will address H.R. 1635. Panel III will address H.R. 755. We appreciate the testimony attendants and look

forward to their testimony.

[Statement of Hon. James Hansen follows:]

STATEMENT OF HON. JAMES V. HANSEN, A REPRESENTATIVE IN CONGRESS FROM THE

STATE OF UTAH

The Subcommittee on National Parks and Public Lands convenes to receive testimony on several bills. I want to welcome the Members who join us today as sponsors and co-sponsors of the legislation before us. We will hear H.R. 1635 by Mr.

Stokes and Mr. Portman to establish the National Underground Railroad Network

to Freedom program, H.R. 755, by Mr. Duncan to allow a tax cheek-off for contributions to the National Park System, H.R. 1718, by Mrs. Cubin to transfer lands in

Park County, Wyoming and H.R. 708, also by Mrs. Cubin to study and extend grazing rights on lands within and adjacent to Grand Teton National Park.

The first bill we will hear today is H.R. 1635, ‘‘The National Underground Railroad Network to Freedom Act of 1997.’’ The bill was introduced by our colleagues

Mr. Stokes and Mr. Portman, who are here today to testify. The bill has over 70

co-sponsors representing broad bipartisan support.

H.R. 1635 does not create any additional units to the National Park System, but

provides for the National Park Service to establish a program to coordinate, produce

and distribute interpretative educational materials, enter into cooperative agreements to provide technical assistance to State and local governments and the private sector; and provide an official symbol for the 380 sites and structures associated with this historic social and humanitarian movement to resist slavery in the

United States in the 1800’s.

H.R. 755 is The National Parks Checkoff Act, introduced by Mr. Duncan, a Member of this Subcommittee. The bill would amend the Internal Revenue Code to allow

individual taxpayers to voluntarily designate a portion of their overpayment of Federal income tax, or make a contribution in addition to their Federal Tax payment,

of one dollar or more for the benefit of the National Park System.

This concept is unique in that there is no budgetary impact. This is a voluntary

decision by the taxpayer. None of the funds can be used for land acquisition, but

only for operation and maintenance of the units of the National Park System.

The next bill is H.R. 1718. H.R. 1718 provides for the conveyance of 190 acres

of land in Wyoming to the County of Park, Wyoming. The land conveyed can only

be used for economic development by the county or, if the property is transferred,

to a local non-profit organization, solely for the purposes of economic development.

This bill would convey all right, title, and interest, except for any right or interest

in oil and gas reserves, which would remain held by the U.S. Government. As originally proposed, if within 5 years of the authorization of the conveyance, the Secretary determines that the property is not being used for economic development,

then right, title, and interest shall revert back to the Federal Government. The Federal Government also agrees to hold harmless future owners from violations that

may have occurred from past activity. We are aware of a few concerns with this bill

that have recently come to light and Mrs. Cubin will describe H.R. 1718 and some

of the concerns.

Lastly, H.R. 708, sponsored by Mrs. Cubin is designed to address a problem that

is beginning to affect many of our Federal lands and that is development up to the

boundaries of our parks and recreation areas. I am the last person in Congress to

endorse buffer zones; however, in this instance, Mrs. Cubin has crafted a solution

that I believe will insure responsible grazing in and around the park for years to

come and will insure the benefits these ranches provide the park and its resources

are not taken over by condominium developments. Many people forget that if we run
4

the true stewards of our Federal lands off those lands, the private lands will likely

be sold and developed for purposes that are completely in contradiction to conservation and responsible commodity production.

We will hear from Mr. Duncan on H.R. 755 first, Mrs. Cubin, who sits on the Full

Committee, second and then Members from off the Committee in the order they arrived. I ask unanimous consent that any of these Members be allowed to join us

on the dais after their testimony. We will then call the Administration witnesses,

Mr. Galvin and Mr. Martinez to testify on all of the bills before us. Panel II will

address H.R. 1635 and then Panel III will address H.R. 755. We appreciate the witnesses attendance and look forward to the testimony.

Mr. HANSEN. Mr. Duncan, do you have any opening statement,

sir?

STATEMENT OF HON. JOHN J. DUNCAN, JR., A REPRESENTATIVE IN CONGRESS FROM THE STATE OF TENNESSEE

Mr. DUNCAN. Well, Mr. Chairman, first I would like to thank you

for holding this hearing. You have already explained H.R. 755, the

National Parks Checkoff Act. This is a simple bill that would place

a checkoff box on Federal income tax forms so that taxpayers could

make donations, voluntary donations, to our National Parks. Unlike the Presidential Checkoff, this would not divert funds from the

Treasury. Taxpayers would only be able to give above what they already owe or return part of their refund for this purpose. They

would not be allowed to divert part of their tax dollars toward this

fund. Therefore, it would not have any negative impacts upon the

Federal budget.

The other point that—another major point that should be noted

is that this legislation would not allow any of this money to be used

for land acquisition. This is because I and many others feel that

this money should be used to address the estimated $4 to $6 billion

maintenance backlog that the Park Service currently has. I do not

think we should be expanding the National Park System at a time

that we are having such extreme difficulties taking care of what we

already have.

This bill has strong bipartisan support. It has at this time a total

of 70 co-sponsors, 35 Democrats and 35 Republicans. Nine members of this Subcommittee are co-sponsors, including the Chairman

and the Ranking Member. And, Mr. Chairman, I want to say that

I certainly appreciate your support of this legislation.

In addition, this bill has received the support of the Full Committee Chairman, Representative Don Young, and the Chairman of

the Interior Appropriations Subcommittee, Representative Ralph

Regula. This bill has also been endorsed by organizations such as

the National Tour Association, the American Hiking Society, America Outdoors, Friends of the Smokies and several other leading organizations. I believe we will also hear today from witnesses from

the National Parks and Conservation Association and the National

Parks Hospitality Association on this bill.

Mr. Chairman, I believe that the Federal Government should

take a closer look at some of the State programs which have been

so successful which are similar to this. A report recently released

by the Federation of Tax Administrators found that ‘‘State income

tax checkoffs have proven to be popular ways of providing funding

for various causes during times of tight State budgets.’’

Currently 41 States have some type of checkoff on their State income tax forms. At least 37 of these raise money for conservation
5

funds. During the 1980’s these checkoffs brought in over $30 million a year according to a USA Today article recently published. In

addition, my staff was told by the Maryland Natural Resources Department that $1 million was raised last year alone through its

checkoff program to protect the Chesapeake Bay.

Mr. Chairman, if this legislation were passed, I really believe

that it could raise a substantial amount. In fact, I believe hundreds

of millions of dollars could be raised for our national parks. I believe this because Americans really love and support these parks

and they are willing to pitch in to help. One national poll showed

that 80 percent of the people would support a checkoff fund such

as this on their income tax returns if they were allowed to do so.

Let me just mention a couple other things. When the C&O Canal

was destroyed by flooding, numerous people volunteered their time

and money to help restore the canal. In fact, the Park Service at

the C&O Canal estimated that over $1 million was donated and

over 4,000 people donated time to help clean up.

In my own district a group of individuals formed the Friends of

the Smokies three years ago to help the Great Smoky Mountains

National Park. In just this short period of time, this organization

has raised over $1.3 million for the Park. This Friends group

placed a donation box at one of the more popular points in the

park. At the height of the visitation season, this box took in more

than $1,000 a day.

The legislation I have introduced simply places a donation box on

tax forms and does not require any specific amount. It just says

any even dollar amount. Many people would donate one dollar, five

dollars, but some people might even donate extremely large

amounts if they were allowed to do so or encouraged in this way.

In conclusion, Mr. Chairman, we all know about the problems

which exist in our national parks, and it was highlighted just last

week in the cover story by U.S. News and World Report called

Parks In Peril. I agree that many of our parks are in peril, however

I disagree with one point made in the magazine. The cover of its

July 21 edition stated that there is Congressional indifference toward our parks. I think that the fact that you are holding this

hearing and the many other things that this Subcommittee has

done under your direction, such as allowing parks to keep more of

the fees they collect, shows that everyone on this Subcommittee

and many, many people in this Congress are very concerned about

the condition of our national parks.

I believe that passage of H.R. 755, the National Parks Checkoff

Act, will go a long way toward protecting these national treasures

for future generations.

Again, Mr. Chairman, I would like to thank you very much for

holding this hearing and for supporting this legislation and for giving me the opportunity to discuss the merits of this legislation.

[Statement of Hon. John Duncan follows:]

STATEMENT OF HON. JOHN J. DUNCAN, JR., A REPRESENTATIVE IN CONGRESS FROM

THE STATE OF TENNESSEE

First, I would like to thank the Chairman for holding this hearing.

H.R. 755, the National Parks Checkoff Act, would simply place a checkoff box on

Federal income tax forms so that taxpayers could make donations to our National

Parks.
6

Unlike the Presidential Checkoff, this would not divert funds from the Treasury.

Taxpayers would only be able to give above what they already owe, or return part

of their refund for this cause.

They would not be allowed to divert part of their tax dollars toward this fund.

Therefore, it would not have any negative impacts upon the Federal budget.

The other point that should be noted is that this legislation would not allow any

of this money to be used for land acquisition. I feel that this money should be used to address the estimated $4 to $6 billion

maintenance backlog the Park Service currently has.

I do not think that we should expand the National Park System when we cannot

take care of what we already have.

This bill has strong bipartisan support. It has a total of 70 cosponsors—35 Democrats and 35 Republicans. Nine Members of this Subcommittee are cosponsors, including the Chairman and the Ranking Member. I want say that I appreciate their

support.

In addition, this legislation has received the support of the Full Committee Chairman, Rep. Don Young, and the Interior Appropriations Subcommittee Chairman,

Rep. Ralph Regula.

This bill has also been endorsed by organizations such as the National Tour Association, the American Hiking Society, America Outdoors, Friends of the Smokies,

and I believe we will hear from our witnesses today, the National Parks and Conservation Association and the National Parks Hospitality Association, as to where

they stand on this bill.

Mr. Chairman, I believe that the Federal Government should take a closer look

at some of the State programs which have been successful.

A report recently released by the Federation of Tax Administrators found that:

‘‘State income tax check-offs have proven to be popular ways of providing funding for various causes during times of tight State budgets.’’

Currently, 41 States have some type of checkoff on their State income tax forms.

At least 37 of these raise money for conservation funds. During the 1980’s these checkoffs brought in over $30 million a year according to a USA Today article recently published.

In addition, my staff was told by the Maryland Natural Resources Department that $1 million was raised last year through its checkoff program to protect the

Chesapeake Bay.

Mr. Chairman, if this legislation were passed, I really believe that it could raise

a substantial amount of money for our Parks.

I believe this because Americans really love their parks, and they are willing to

pitch in to help.

Let me give you just a couple of examples.

When the C&O Canal was destroyed by flooding, numerous people volunteered

their time and money to help restore the Canal. In fact, the Park Service at the

C&O Canal estimated that over $1 million was donated and over 4,000 people volunteered to help with the clean up.

In my own District, a group of individuals formed the Friends of the Smokies 3

years ago to help the Great Smoky Mountains National Park. In just this short period of time, this organization has raised over $1.3 million for the Park.

This Friends group placed a donation box at one of the more popular points in

the Park. At the height of the visitation season this box took in more than $1,000

a day.

The legislation I have introduced simply places a donation box on tax forms. I believe, it, too, can do great things for our parks.

In conclusion, Mr. Chairman, we all know about the problems which exist in our

parks, as it was highlighted in a recent cover story by U.S. News and World Report.

I agree that many of our parks are in peril, however, I disagree with one point

made in this magazine. The cover of its July 21st edition stated that there is congressional indifference toward our parks.

I think that the fact you are holding this hearing, and the many other things that

this Subcommittee has done under your direction, such as allowing parks to keep

more of the fees they collect, shows that everyone on this Subcommittee is very concerned about the condition of our National Parks.

I believe that the passage of H.R. 755, the National Parks Checkoff Act, will go

a long way toward protecting these national treasures for future generations.

Again, Mr. Chairman, I would like to thank you for holding this hearing and giving me the opportunity to discuss the merits of this legislation, and I yield back the

balance of my time.

Mr. HANSEN. Thank the gentleman.
7

Mr. DUNCAN. Thank you.

STATEMENT OF HON. DONNA CHRISTIAN–GREEN, A

REPRESENTATIVE IN CONGRESS FROM THE VIRGIN ISLANDS

Ms. CHRISTIAN–GREEN. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. And it is a

distinct honor and pleasure for me not only to be able to give these

brief opening remarks in support of H.R. 1635, the National Underground Railroad Network to Freedom Bill, but also to welcome our

esteemed colleagues who have sponsored this historic piece of legislation, and the other outstanding panelists this morning.

I am proud to be a co-sponsor of this historic bill, and I look forward to hearing the witnesses’ testimony.

I am especially pleased and proud to welcome Congressman Lou

Stokes, the dean of the Congressional Black Caucus, and someone

who has graciously taken me under his wing since I have arrived

at the House. And I want to take this opportunity to thank him

for his leadership on this issue, as well as on health care and on

other issues of importance to the integrity of this Nation.

In 1990 the Congress, in its wisdom, directed what I am sure

was a very willing National Park Service to study how best to interpret and commemorate the Underground Railroad. I trust that

this Committee and this Congress will be just as wise and pass this

significant piece of legislation.

As we embark on a national dialog on race and its impact on our

past, present and future, the memorializing of this testament to the

courage and sacrifice of many people of all persuasions and to the

spirit, strength and the determination of the Africans who had

been forced into brutal slavery will be an important legacy.

Already the investigators have greatly expanded our knowledge

of this important heritage trail. We now know that this was a far

more complex and expansive network than we thought. I am particularly happy that their investigation went beyond the borders of

the continent to the Caribbean, and I trust they have included the

escape routes to freedom which my ancestors used from the Virgin

Islands to nearby Puerto Rico.

From this study, and the bill before us today, we will come to

know the many heretofore nameless individuals and groups who

made the route come alive, and the traditions that created its culture. All were an integral part of the entire experience. An experience which, with the passage of this legislation, will bring us closer

to realizing this effort which will serve to enrich the lives of all

Americans.

I get very excited when I think about this project and its unlimited potential to be a part of the education of this country, the healing of our diverse community and a source of strength, direction

and hope for our children.

So I again thank the panelists and you, Mr. Chairman, for holding this hearing and for this opportunity to voice my enthusiasm

and support for this important project. And I urge all of my colleagues to give it their unqualified and wholehearted support, as

well.

Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

[Statement of Hon. Donna Christian–Green follows:]
8

STATEMENT OF HON. DONNA M. CHRISTIAN–GREEN BEFORE THE SUBCOMMITTEE ON

NATIONAL PARKS ON H.R. 1635, TO ESTABLISH THE NATIONAL UNDERGROUND

RAILROAD NETWORK TO FREEDOM PROGRAM—JULY 22, 1997

Thank you Mr. Chairman:

It is a distinct privilege and honor, not only to be able to give these brief opening

remarks in support of H.R. 1635, the National Underground Railroad Network to

Freedom Bill, but to also welcome our esteemed colleagues who have sponsored this

historic piece of legislation, and the other outstanding panelists.

I am proud to also be a cosponsor of this historic bill and I look forward to hearing

the witnesses’ testimony.

I am especially pleased and proud to welcome Congressman Lou Stokes, the dean

of the Congressional Black Caucus, and someone who has graciously taken me

under his wing since my coming to the House.

I want to take this opportunity to thank him for his leadership on this issue, as

well as, on health care and on other issues of importance to the integrity of our Nation.

In 1990, the Congress in its wisdom directed, what I am sure was a very willing

National Park Service, to study how best to interpret and commemorate the Underground Railroad.

I trust that this Committee and this Congress will be just as wise and pass this

significant piece of legislation.

As we embark on a national dialog on race, and its impact on our past, present

and future, the memorializing of this testament to the courage and sacrifice of many

people, of all persuasions, and to the spirit, strength, and the determination of the

Africans who had been forced into brutal slavery, will be an important legacy.

Already the investigators have greatly expanded our knowledge of this important

heritage trail. We now know that this was a far more complex and expansive network than we thought.

I am particularly happy that their investigation went beyond the borders of the

continent to the Caribbean, and I trust they have included the escape routes to freedom which my ancestors used from the Virgin Islands to nearby Puerto Rico.

From this study, and the bill before us today, we will come to know the many

heretofore nameless individuals and groups who made the route come alive, and the

traditions that created its culture.

All were an integral part of the entire experience. An experience which, with passage of this legislation, will bring us closer to realizing this effort which will serve

to enrich the lives of all Americans.

I get very excited when I think about this project and its unlimited potential to

be a part of the education of this country, the healing of our diverse community,

and a source of strength, direction and hope for our children.

Again, I thank the panelists and you Mr. Chairman for holding this hearing and

for this opportunity to voice my enthusiasm and support for this important project,

and I urge all of my colleagues to give it their wholehearted and unqualified support

as well.

Mr. HANSEN. Thank you. The gentlelady from Wyoming, Mrs.

Cubin.

Mrs. CUBIN. I don’t have an opening statement.

Mr. HANSEN. The gentleman from Nevada has no opening statement. We are honored to have our two distinguished colleagues

with us today from Ohio who will testify regarding H.R. 1635. the

National Underground Railroad Bill. We will first hear from the

Honorable Lou Stokes, who I had the privilege of serving as his

ranking member for a number of years, and a very distinguished

member of our group, and also our distinguished friend from Ohio,

the Honorable Rob Portman. We are grateful for both of you being

here.

Lou, we will start with you.

STATEMENT OF HON. LOUIS STOKES, A REPRESENTATIVE IN

CONGRESS FROM THE STATE OF OHIO

Mr. STOKES. Thank you very much, Mr. Chairman and members

of the Subcommittee. Mr. Chairman, before I begin my testimony,
9

I want to take just a moment to express my appreciation to you for

the expeditious manner in which you have responded to the request of Mr. Portman and myself to conduct hearings on our jointly

sponsored legislation. We appreciate very much your responsiveness in this matter.

I am pleased to appear before your panel this morning as you

consider H.R. 1635, the National Underground Railroad Network to

Freedom Act of 1997. My colleague, Congress Rob Portman, and I

introduced this legislation in May. Since its introduction, the bill

has enjoyed strong support on both sides of the aisle. As of this

morning, we very proudly say to you that we now have 92 co-sponsors here in the House. This Subcommittee hearing represents an

important step in our bipartisan effort to secure the enactment of

H.R. 1635.

The issue of slavery brings to mind a painful chapter in our Nation’s history. As a result of forced enslavement, America witnessed

the birth of a movement that would carry masses of people from

slave quarters in the South to freedom in northern cities of the

United States, Mexico, Canada and the Caribbean. This movement

became known as the Underground Railroad.

History teaches us that the Underground Railroad flourished

from the end of the 18th century to the end of the Civil War. It

was one of the most significant expressions of the American Civil

Rights Movement. During its evolution over more than three centuries, the Underground Railroad movement helped thousands of

African Americans gain the freedom and human dignity they were

endowed with at their birth.

Mr. Chairman, H.R. 1635, the National Underground Railroad

Network to Freedom Act, is a good bill. Through the National Park

Service, the measure will link Underground Railroad sites. The legislation directs the Secretary of the Interior to produce appropriate

educational materials associated with the Underground Railroad.

Further, the bill seeks to encourage public and private partnerships to tell the story of the Underground Railroad.

It is our hope that through this legislation, we can educate all

people concerning this important episode in American history. Second, we want to bring our country together by facing the lingering

vestiges of our dehumanizing past, so that we can find common

ground and move forward as a people. I am convinced that we cannot solve our racial problems unless we find a way to bring the

American people together in the same manner the Underground

Railroad bridged our divisions of race, religion, nationalities and

spanned State lines and, indeed, international borders.

I am pleased that a number of distinguished experts are joining

us this morning to offer their strong support for the Underground

Railroad bill. We are grateful for this high level of support.

Before I close, Mr. Chairman, I also want to thank Mr. Dan

Smith and the other members of your staff for the cooperation and

the work that they did with us in order to bring this bill before you

this morning. I also want to specifically thank Ms. Minnie Kenny

and Ms. Joyce Larkin, members of my own staff, who worked so

diligently on this legislation, along with members of Mr. Portman’s

staff. We have had an excellent working relationship, everyone

here, to produce the bill we bring before you this morning.
10

So, Mr. Chairman, I thank you for the opportunity to address the

Subcommittee, and I will be pleased to answer any questions if

there are any.

[Statement of Hon. Louis Stokes follows:]

STATEMENT OF HON. LOUIS STOKES, A REPRESENTATIVE IN CONGRESS FROM THE

STATE OF OHIO

Mr. Chairman, Members of the Subcommittee. Before I begin my testimony, I

want to express my appreciation to you for the expeditious manner in which you

have responded to the request of Mr. Portman and myself to conduct hearings on

our jointly-sponsored legislation.

I am pleased to appear before your panel this morning as you consider H.R. 1635,

The National Underground Railroad Network to Freedom Act of 1997. My colleague,

Congressman Rob Portman, and I introduced this legislation in May. Since its introduction, the bill has enjoyed strong support on both sides of the aisle. This Subcommittee hearing represents an important step in our bipartisan effort to secure

the enactment of H.R. 1635.

The issue of slavery brings to mind a painful chapter in our Nation’s history. As

a result of forced enslavement, America witnessed the birth of a movement that

would carry masses of people from slave quarters in the south to freedom in northern cities of the United States, Mexico, Canada and the Caribbean. This movement

became known as ‘‘The Underground Railroad.′′

History teaches us that the underground railroad flourished from the end of the

18th century to the end of the civil war. It was one of the most significant expressions of the American Civil Rights Movement during its evolution over more than

three centuries. The Underground Railroad Movement helped thousands of African

Americans to gain the freedom and human dignity they were endowed with at birth.

Mr. Chairman, H.R. 1635, ‘‘The National Underground Railroad Network to Freedom Act,’’ is a good bill. Through the National Park Service, the measure will link

underground railroad sites. The legislation directs the Secretary of the Interior to

produce appropriate educational materials associated with the underground railroad. Further, the bill seeks to encourage public and private partnerships to tell the

story of the underground railroad.

It is our hope that through this legislation, we can educate all people concerning

this important episode in American history. Second, we want to bring our country

together by facing the lingering vestiges of our dehumanizing past, so that we can

find common ground and move forward as a people. I am convinced that we cannot

solve our racial problems unless we find a way to bring the American people together in the same manner the underground railroad bridged the divisions of race,

religion, nationalities, and spanned State lines and international borders.

I am pleased that a number of distinguished experts are joining us this morning

to offer their strong support for the underground railroad bill. we are grateful for

this high level of support.

Thank you, Mr. Chairman, for the opportunity to address the Subcommittee. I

would be pleased to answer any questions at this time.

Mr. HANSEN. Thank you, Mr. Stokes. Appreciate your comments.

Mr. Portman, we will hear from you.

STATEMENT OF HON. ROB PORTMAN, A REPRESENTATIVE IN

CONGRESS FROM THE STATE OF OHIO

Mr. PORTMAN. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Mr. Duncan, Ms.

Christian–Green, Mrs. Cubin, we appreciate the opportunity to be

before you today.

Mr. Chairman, I would like to echo the comments of my colleague, Mr. Stokes, in thanking you for having this hearing and

helping us to expedite this process. This is a very important topic,

and I think it is important that the Subcommittee, Full Committee

and the Congress move forward on it.

I want to commend Lou Stokes—he is the original sponsor of this

legislation—for his leadership and also thank other Members of
11

Congress who have signed on, and the experts and supporters of

this project, many of whom are here with us today.

As Congressman Stokes mentioned, H.R. 1635 now has strong bipartisan support. I also understand it has the support of the National Park Service—I think you will be hearing from them directly

later—and the National Parks and Conservation Association.

Allow me to go into a little more detail as to the three things this

legislation does. First, it creates a National Underground Railroad

Freedom Network from all existing units and programs of the National Park Service that pertain to the Underground Railroad, and

also from historic buildings, interpretive centers, research facilities,

community projects and activities directly related to the Underground Railroad that are spread throughout this country and really

this hemisphere, all to commemorate and honor the history of the

Underground Railroad.

Much of what we know today, of course, has been handed down

by oral traditions over the years. And as a recent National Park

Service study indicated, much of the tangible evidence, we believe,

is in danger of being lost forever. So this network is very important

to establish.

Second, Mr. Chairman, it requires the Secretary of the Interior

to produce and disseminate appropriate educational materials such

as maps, handbooks, interpretive guides or electronic information,

and enter into cooperative agreements to provide technical assistance to facilities that have a verifiable connection to the Underground Railroad, and finally to create a uniform official symbol for

the national network and to issue regulations for its use.

Third, and I think, Mr. Duncan, this is along the lines of your

opening statement regarding another bill, I think it is very important that this legislation strongly encourages public/private partnerships that I believe we should be doing in the era of the balanced budget discussions we are currently having in Congress.

And finally, Mr. Chairman, the most important thing this legislation does—and it is not just the legislation but all the activities

that it will promote—is it helps to foster a spirit of racial harmony

and national reconciliation. Just as the Underground Railroad

itself bridged the divide of race, religion, sectional differences and

nationality and joined people in common purpose, so can this legislation. The powerful and largely untold stories of the brave men

and women of the Underground Railroad can inspire us, I believe,

even today about racial cooperation and reconciliation, about determination, about freedom and courage.

Like so many of us, I have a personal connection to the Underground Railroad. The family home of my namesake and grandfather, who passed away just last year, was a station on the Underground Railroad. His great grandparents were Quakers and abolitionists who lived in a farmhouse near West Milton, Ohio, that harbored slaves who sought freedom. And so many of the prominent

figures of the Underground Railroad happened to come from our

area. Levi Coffin, another Quaker, was active as a conductor and

often called the President of the Underground Railroad. Harriet

Beecher Stowe, another Cincinnatian, wrote Uncle Tom’s Cabin,

which of course helped to galvanize the anti-slavery forces back in

the 1850’s.
12

I would like to say a special thanks, Mr. Chairman, to my friend

and fellow Cincinnatian, Ed Rigaud, who is with us here today and

you will hear from in a moment, for his help. He has helped me

to understand and appreciate the Underground Railroad experience. He is also leading an exciting effort in Cincinnati to establish

a National Underground Railroad Freedom Center, funded primarily through private efforts. And he can talk a little about the

funds they have been able to raise and the interest that they have

locally in Cincinnati, and really around the country now, in this effort. The Cincinnati Center would be located on the banks of the

Ohio River, the line dividing the free and the slave States.

I would also like to recognize Iantha Gantt–Wright. She is here

with us today, I saw, from the National Parks and Conservation

Association, who also has been very helpful in providing input to

Mr. Stokes and myself as we have gone through this process.

And finally, I join Mr. Stokes in thanking the staff, particularly

Allen Freemyer and Dan Smith of the Majority staff and John

Lawrence of the Minority staff, for their great help in putting this

together and moving this process forward.

Again, Mr. Chairman, thank you very much for the opportunity

to testify, and we look forward to any questions you all may have.

[Statement of Hon. Rob Portman follows:]

STATEMENT OF HON. ROB PORTMAN, A REPRESENTATIVE IN CONGRESS FROM THE

STATE OF OHIO

Thank you, Mr. Chairman, Mr. Faleomavaega, and Members of the Subcommittee

for holding this important hearing today and giving me the opportunity to testify.

I want to thank my colleague, Mr. Stokes, the original sponsor of the legislation,

for his leadership on this project. I also want to thank the other Members, experts

and supporters of this legislation, some of whom have joined us today.

H.R. 1635 was introduced on May 15 and now has the bipartisan support of 81

cosponsors. I understand this legislation also has the support of the National Park

Service and the National Parks and Conservation Association.

Specifically, the bill would do three things: First, create a National Underground

Railroad Freedom Network from all existing units and programs of the National

Park Service that pertain to the Underground Railroad, historic buildings, interpretive centers, research facilities, community projects, and activities directly related

to the Underground Railroad, to commemorate and honor the history of the Underground Railroad. Much of what we know about today has been handed down

through oral traditions over the years. And, as a recent National Park Service study

indicated, some of the tangible evidence is in danger of being lost forever.

Second, it would require the Secretary of Interior to produce and disseminate appropriate educational materials, such as maps, handbooks, interpretive guides, or

electronic information; enter into cooperative agreements to provide technical assistance to facilities with a verifiable connection to the Underground Railroad; and create a uniform, official symbol for the national network and issue regulations for its

use. Third, it would strongly encourage public-private partnerships that we should be

promoting in a balanced budget environment. No funds are authorized except a

small amount to coordinate the network, offer technical assistance and place

plaques on network sites.

I think this legislation will also help to foster a spirit of racial harmony and national reconciliation. Just as the Underground Railroad bridged the divide of race,

religion, sectional differences, and nationality and joined people in common purpose,

so can this bill. The powerful, and largely untold, stories of the brave men and

women of the Underground Railroad can inspire us—even today—about racial cooperation and reconciliation, about determination and courage.

Like so many of us, I have a personal connection to the Underground Railroad.

The family home of my namesake and grandfather, who died last year, was a Station on the Underground Railroad. His great, great-grandparents were Quakers and

abolitionists who lived in a farmhouse near West Milton, Ohio that harbored slaves

who sought freedom. And many of the prominent figures the Underground Railroad
13

have connections to my district I represent in the Greater Cincinnati area. Levi Coffin, another Quaker, was active as a conductor and was often called the ‘‘President’’

of the Underground Railroad. Harriet Beecher Stowe, another Cincinnatian, wrote

Uncle Tom’s Cabin, which helped galvanize anti-slavery forces in the 1850’s.

I’d like to say a special thanks to my friend and fellow Cincinnatian, Ed Rigaud,

who will be speaking later this morning, and has helped me to understand and appreciate the significance of the Underground Railroad. Ed is leading an effort to establish a National Underground Railroad Freedom Center, funded largely through

private efforts, and located in Cincinnati on the banks of the Ohio River—the dividing line between free and slave States. I would also like to recognize Iantha Gantt–

Wright with the National Parks and Conservation Association, who will also be testifying. She provided us with a great deal of input throughout the process. Finally,

I wish to thank Allen Freemyer and Dan Smith of the majority staff, and John Lawrence of the minority staff, for their assistance.

Thank you, Mr. Chairman, for this opportunity to testify. I would be happy to answer any questions.

Mr. HANSEN. Thank you. I appreciate your testimony. Do any of

the members of the Committee have questions for our distinguished panel on what I consider a very laudatory and reasonable

piece of legislation?

Now you know where I am coming from. Let us go to the next

one. Mr. Duncan.

Mr. DUNCAN. I don’t have any questions, Mr. Chairman, but I

would simply like to say that I, too, support this legislation, and

Mr. Stokes has helped me on several occasions and is one of our

finest members. And I am pleased that my friend Rob Portman is

helping to lead the charge on this, because this is legislation that

should be bipartisan in nature. And I just want to thank both of

them for being here with us today. Thank you very much, gentlemen.

Mr. STOKES. Thank you.

Mr. HANSEN. Any other statements from members of the Committee?

Mrs. CUBIN. Mr. Chairman.

Mr. HANSEN. The gentlelady from Wyoming.

Mrs. CUBIN. Mr. Chairman, I certainly am impressed that you

are impressed, and I do support this bill. And if I am not a co-sponsor, this is how much I support it, I would like to go on the bill.

Mr. HANSEN. 93 here.

Mr. STOKES. 93, thank you.

Mr. HANSEN. Why don’t we just mark it up and forget the rest

of this nonsense.

If our colleagues would like to join us on the dias, we would be

happy to have you. We know you are both very, very busy with

other things, but we would love to have you join us if you would.

Mr. STOKES. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

Mr. HANSEN. We will turn to our first panel, Denis P. Galvin,

Acting Deputy Director of National Park Service. We are always

grateful to have Mr. Galvin with us. And Eluid—if I am pronouncing that wrong, I apologize—L. Martinez, Commissioner of

Bureau of Reclamation. We are grateful to have both of you gentlemen with us. And, Mr. Galvin, we will start with you, sir. Now we

are going to go to time. Is that okay?

Mr. GALVIN. That is fine, Mr. Chairman.

Mr. HANSEN. All right, we all know the rules. It is like a traffic

light, green you start, yellow you wrap up and red I gavel you

down. Is that fair?
14

Mr. GALVIN. That is fair.

Mr. HANSEN. All right, 5 minutes.

Mr. GALVIN. I have——

Mrs. CUBIN. Mr. Chairman.

Mr. HANSEN. Actually, hold on just a minute. The gentlelady

from Wyoming.

Mrs. CUBIN. Mr. Chairman, I have an opening statement.

Mr. HANSEN. If you will suspend, we will turn to the gentlelady

from Wyoming.

STATEMENT OF HON. BARBARA CUBIN, A REPRESENTATIVE

IN CONGRESS FROM THE STATE OF WYOMING

Mrs. CUBIN. Thank you. And thank you, Mr. Chairman, for holding this hearing.

H.R. 1718 is the result of 5 years of dedication and hard work

by the Cody Chamber of Commerce, by the Cody Economic Development Council to transfer 190 acres of Federal land to the ownership of Park County, Wyoming.

I also extend a special thanks to Paul Hoffman, the Executive Director of the Cody Chamber of Commerce, for his unwavering commitment for the past 5 years in getting this matter resolved.

The land to be transferred is currently in public ownership, more

specifically, that of the Bureau of Land Management—excuse me,

Bureau of Reclamation. The Bureau has completed its withdrawal

review of this land and has done extensive environmental testing,

archeological and cultural resource studies. For this I commend

them. The State Historic Preservation Office has reviewed and,

through the Bureau of Land Management, completed a cadastral

survey—it has something to do with cadaver—of the land to be

transferred.

All wetlands and lands with potential recreation, wildlife and

water management significance have been surveyed out of the area

recommended for disposal, and that land will be retained by the

Federal Government under the Bureau of Reclamation management.

Through the General Services Administration, the Bureau of Reclamation recommends that all 190 acres be transferred.

BLM, of course, would be the logical Federal agency to administer the current leases, but it has formally confirmed that it does

not want to have the property under its management.

Mr. Chairman, this property, when transferred to Park County,

will help ensure the economic stability of many businesses that

currently hold leases on the property. Most of the acreage has excellent development potential as an industrial area, but the details

of its use would be left to the discretion of the people of Park County, Wyoming.

The Bureau of Reclamation has refused to issue new leases for

the past 5 years and has not allowed expansion of existing leases.

This is definitely stifling the economic expansion of this area. The

area manager for the Bureau has had a letter on his desk to the

GSA asking for the property to be turned over, but as yet it has

not been sent. As a matter of fact, it has been stated that the Bureau of Reclamation has been withholding transfer to the GSA
15

pending this legislation. The interesting thing was that letter was

sent three months before the legislation was filed.

I am hopeful that my colleagues in the House will see the importance of conveying this Federal property, property that is no longer

needed or wanted by the Federal Government, but is significant to

the local entities that will directly benefit from it.

It is my understanding that the Bureau of Reclamation has some

concerns regarding this bill. Specifically, the Bureau is looking to

reap the rewards of selling the property to a private entity. However, to this point the Bureau of Reclamation has not demonstrated

it was interested in making any money for the Nation’s taxpayers.

As I mentioned before, it has not issued any new leases for the past

5 years and is not allowing any extension or expansion of existing

leases.

I believe another point must be brought forward. Although it is

very difficult to document, I am fairly sure of the fact that the taxable revenue brought about by economic growth, which will be realized after the transfer of the property to the county, will outweigh

the nominal $10,000 per year taxpayers are now making on leases

on the property.

An independent consulting team analyzed the North Cody area

and two other potential industrial area sites in Cody last fall. They

concluded it would cost about $13,600 per acre to bring the North

Cody area up to marketable standards, that is for appropriate

water, sewer and other infrastructure. Not all 190 acres of the

property are marketable. If the Federal Government insists on receiving fair market value for the property, many of the improvements will never be made.

Through the GSA, the Bureau of Reclamation—oh, wait, I said

that. Excuse me.

This property is not pristine. It has no scenic, recreational or environmental values. Park County is made up of over 4 million

acres. Eighty one point nine percent of those acres belong to the

Federal Government. I would like to repeat that. Over 80 percent

of this county belongs to the Federal Government, which means

that the schools, the cities, the towns and counties cannot benefit

from property taxes on 80 percent of the land in the county. That

is what makes it so much more important that the Federal Government move along in their process and dispose of this property as

quickly as possible.

The potential for growth in the county is severely limited by the

fact that the Federal Government has not moved on the action that

they themselves said was important, that is that the land should

be disposed of from Federal ownership.

The community supports this project in a variety of ways. In the

Park County Land Use Planning process and the Cody Master Plan

process, the community has said the focus should be on commercial

development near or within existing towns. North Cody has an industrial history and this proposal makes the most sense from a

viewshed perspective. It is the least visible area from the town’s

major entryways.

Cody, Wyoming, is the east entrance to Yellowstone National

Park. Understanding and knowing that allows us to realize that

one of the most important things on the minds of the people who
16

live in Park County and in Cody, Wyoming, is to maintain the pristine area. Tourism is their biggest industry. They certainly don’t

want any industrial development where it would harm the tourism

industry.

Over the past 4 years there have been a significant number of

front page stories about this project, and neither the Cody Chamber of Commerce or my office has ever received one negative comment regarding this project.

Mr. Chairman, I will work in cooperation with the GSA to resolve as many of these concerns as possible before the bill goes to

markup. I continue to believe that the taxpayers of this Nation will

be better served through the transfer of this property to Park

County and the local economic interests will be better served when

this property is out of Federal lands. I commend this legislation to

my colleagues and urge their support for its prompt enactment.

This concludes my comments.

[Statement of Hon. Barbara Cubin follows:]

STATEMENT OF HON. BARBARA CUBIN, A REPRESENTATIVE IN CONGRESS FROM THE

STATE OF WYOMING

Thank you Mr. Chairman for this opportunity to speak today, and the Subcommittee’s efforts to schedule this hearing.

Jackson Hole, Wyoming is one of the most beautiful and unique areas of our Nation. Over 3 million visitors per year come to hike, camp, ski, and sightsee amidst

the grandeur of the Teton range and the winding Snake River in Grand Teton National Park and the Greater Yellowstone area beyond.

Many wildlife species such as moose, bear, eagles, and trumpeter swan make the

valley their home, while the largest elk herd in the lower 48 states annually migrates through it to winter on the wildlife refuge at its southern end.

While much of the valley is protected in perpetuity by Federal ownership, some

of the most valuable wildlife habitat, migration routes, and scenic vistas remain in

private ownership as working ranch lands.

Conservation groups in Jackson Hole and around the country have worked for

years to help protect these ranches from development through the use of scenic

easements and other means and are to be commended for their good work.

The concept of preserving and protecting parts of the Teton Range and Jackson

Hole date from the time settlers moved into the valley in the late 1800s. In January

1929 the U.S. Senate reported on a bill to establish Grand Teton National Park and

stated:

The Teton range presents the most profoundly impressive view in America. It is

a gift to the nation and posterity in which the people of Wyoming may be proud,

and the wilderness surrounding them may be preserved in their natural state for

the benefit and enjoyment of the people of these United States and future generations to come.

In 1950, the Act establishing Grand Teton National Park allowed the continuation

of grazing privileges within the boundaries of the new park for the life of the designated heirs of the current holders of grazing permits.

Early management of the Park determined that managing cattle in a concentrated

area with irrigated grass was less destructive to the resource and less intrusive to

the visiting public than random grazing throughout the Park.

Mr. Chairman, the purpose of my legislation, H.R. 708, is not about granting special grazing rights; it is about doing the right thing to maintain the scenic wonderment that encompasses this magnificent area and keep the area open for wildlife,

especially migratory elk.

This pristine land obviously comes with a price tag. Real estate prices have skyrocketed; and intense development pressure has occurred because of this fact.

Through this legislation I pledge to work in cooperation with officials from Grand

Teton National Park to resolve this issue. I know that all parties involved in this

issue are striving to reach the same goal: maintain the scenic beauty that those of

us who have been fortunate enough to spend time in the Tetons will continue to

enjoy the Park for a long time to come.
17

Mr. Chairman, I am eager to work with my colleagues both here in the House

and the Senate, along with Grand Teton National Park Superintendent Jack

Neckels, to bring a resolution to this unique situation.

I believe the changes to the legislation proposed by the Park Service make sense,

and I will be happy to incorporate them in the legislation during the markup of the

bill.

Mr. Chairman that concludes my remarks.

Mr. HANSEN. I thank the gentlelady.

Mr. Galvin, you are recognized for 5 minutes.

STATEMENT OF DENIS P. GALVIN, ACTING DEPUTY DIRECTOR,

NATIONAL PARK SERVICE

Mr. GALVIN. Mr. Chairman, I have statements on three of the

bills before the Subcommittee this morning, and I will simply submit them for the record and summarize my remarks and the Administration’s position on each of those bills.

H.R. 1635 establishes the National Underground Railroad Network to Freedom. We strongly support this bill. We are pleased to

be part of this program to commemorate, preserve and interpret

this important and inspiring chapter in American history. Congressman Stokes adequately and eloquently outlined the history of

this chapter of American history. It is not, as some people believe,

simply a trail. It is a regional story that touched many States, that

touched many races, that indeed is international in character and

the bill references that.

The bill that we find here today, as Congressman Portman said,

is the result of grass-roots work extending in many of these communities and people who owned these sites that represent this important historic story to our country. And you will be hearing from

some of them later this morning.

The study was delivered to Congress in February 1996. Subsequently we have produced a brochure on the Underground Railroad

and a handbook is under production. The bill authorizes the Secretary to enter into memorandums of understanding. It is not a

high-cost bill. As you pointed out, it does not require new units of

the National Park System. It simply authorizes the Secretary to cooperate with these people in marking these sites and interpreting

them.

The second bill I would like to discuss is H.R. 755, a bill to

amend the Internal Revenue Code of 1968 to allow individuals to

designate any portion of their income tax overpayments and to

make other contributions for the benefit of the National Park System. As Mr. Duncan mentioned, the needs of the park system are

great, particularly in the area that the bill focuses on with respect

to infrastructure, rehabilitation of historic structures and reconstruction and rehabilitation of roads.

Regrettably, we must, because of the precedent-setting nature of

the bill and the potential for lengthening the Federal tax form, express opposition to H.R. 755. There are probably scores of federally

funded activities who could also benefit from such a treatment and

would want their own separate line on the 1040.

We understand that this Subcommittee does not have primary

jurisdiction in this matter. My prepared statement indicates, Mr.

Chairman, the many uses that could be used if this tax checkoff

became law. As I said, principally they are in the area of rehabili-
18

tating infrastructure, although there are important natural and

cultural resource preservation issues that could also be funded with

the revenue from this tax checkoff.

I noted in Mr. Duncan’s statement he estimated over $200 million of revenue would come from this. That in essence is larger

than the recent recreation fee demonstration project authorized by

the Congress where we estimate revenues of about $140 million

over 3 years.

Finally, Mr. Chairman, I have a statement on H.R. 708, a bill to

require the Secretary of the Interior to conduct a study concerning

grazing use of certain land within and adjacent to Grand Teton National Park. We recommend enactment of this legislation, if amended to address our concerns as outlined below.

And we have in our prepared statement three amendments that

are not major but simply focus and somewhat broaden the scope of

the study. We believe, as you mentioned in your opening statement, Mr. Chairman, in the West, and particularly in this valley,

we have intense pressure to develop, to in essence subdivide, some

of these important open spaces represented by these traditional

uses of the land.

We support this study because we believe it provides an opportunity to engage in an important discussion in this, indeed, worldclass scenic valley and to ponder the question of these traditional

land uses and their, indeed, importance to the history of this park.

The grazing that traditionally was done in this valley led to the

dude ranch industry that led to the creation of Grand Teton National Park. So all of these stories are importantly intertwined.

We strongly recommend enactment of this legislation which, as

I said, simply authorizes a study. And we have been working with

all the local interested parties to see that their views are represented as we do the study. We do recommend an amendment

that would extend these grazing privileges until such time as the

recommendations in the study are implemented as opposed to the

way the legislation is currently written that would only extend

them until the study is submitted.

That concludes the summary of remarks, Mr. Chairman. As I

said, I will submit our prepared statement. I would be happy to answer any questions of the subcommittee.

[Statement of Denis Galvin may be found at end of hearing.]

Mr. HANSEN. Thank you, Mr. Galvin.

Mr. Martinez, we are grateful to have you with us. We will turn

to the time to you for 5 minutes, sir.

STATEMENT OF ELUID MARTINEZ, COMMISSIONER, BUREAU

OF RECLAMATION

Mr. MARTINEZ. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Thank you for the opportunity to provide the subcommittee with the Administration’s

views on H.R. 1718, a bill that would provide for the conveyance

of 190.12 acres of Federal land in Park County, Wyoming. With

your permission, I would like to summarize my remarks and have

the full text of my prepared statement entered into the record.

The Administration believes that the disposal of the subject property should be handled by the General Services Administration

consistent with the Federal Property Administrative Services Act of
19

1949 and accordingly opposes H.R. 1718. The Bureau of Reclamation no longer needs the parcel of land. Reclamation and the Bureau of Land Management have determined that the property is

not suitable for return to the public domain. Reclamation supports

the intent of this legislation.

Mr. Chairman, my prepared statements contain some items of

concern with respect to the legislation. There is an issue of—we believe that if conveyance does occur it should be through a quitclaim deed, that there should be fair market value determined for

the property. I am advised that the GSA Property Disposition Act

requires a fair compensation, that if the property is transferred

there should be no oversight on the part of the Secretary of the Interior and that the environmental liability clause should be stricken. I am advised that the other Federal laws adequately address

and protect the Federal interest in these issues.

My prepared statement contains additional items of concern. The

Bureau of Reclamation would welcome the opportunity to work

with the Subcommittee on amendments to this legislation. And in

summary, the Administration opposes the legislation but recommends that the Committee allow the parties to work with GSA

to dispose of the property in a way that will facilitate economic development in Park County consistent with the GSA Property Act.

Mr. Chairman, this concludes my remarks. I will be happy to answer any questions you might have.

[Statement of Eluid Martinez may be found at end of hearing.]

Mr. HANSEN. Thank you, Commissioner. Questions for this

panel? Mr. Duncan.

Mr. DUNCAN. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. The only question I

might have is for Mr. Galvin. I notice that you said your opposition

to H.R. 755 was regrettable or reluctant. And I think I understand

where you are coming from, but just for the record, you do—the

Administration has taken the position that this might require that

the Federal tax form be lengthened and made over-complicated, but

you do realize that 41 States have similar checkoff funds and have

been able to limit them and keep their tax forms much simpler

even than the Federal tax code. And what we are talking about has

worked successfully throughout this country.

Mr. GALVIN. Indeed, I do. I live in a State that has, I believe, six

or eight tax checkoffs and is able to accomplish it.

Mr. DUNCAN. All right, thank you very much.

Mr. HANSEN. The gentlelady from the Virgin Islands. The

gentlelady from Wyoming.

Mrs. CUBIN. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Before I start questioning the panel, I have an opening statement on H.R. 708, which

is the study that Mr. Galvin referred to. So rather than read that,

I will just submit it for the record.

Mr. HANSEN. The lady is recognized for the opening statement

and to question the panel.

Mrs. CUBIN. Thank you. Mr. Martinez, I would like to start off

by saying that I, too, would like GSA to dispose of this property

going through all of the proper channels. The reason the legislation

is here is because the Bureau of Reclamation has not turned the

property over to the GSA so that they can do that. And this has

been going on for 5 years. So my reflex reaction to your statement
20

that you would like to work with the Subcommittee to amend the

bill is nice and it is laudatory and I appreciate that, however my

wish would be that you would work with your managers to get the

process completed to get the property owned by GSA so that they

can properly dispose of it through the proper channels.

In your statement you mention that the property should be

turned over to the GSA. And I am going to ask three questions

here, so if you can remember them, good. I couldn’t, if you want

to take notes. But why has it taken the Bureau of Reclamation so

long to turn the property over for disposal? This legislation was introduced in May of this year, but the issue of disposing of this

property has been around for a long time. I have a copy of a February 1997 memo to the area manager that informs him that this

qualifies as excess property. Could you please explain to the Subcommittee why the paperwork that will turn the property over to

GSA is still on the Bureau of Reclamation manager’s desk? And

when can GSA expect the SF–118?

Mr. MARTINEZ. Mr. Chairman, ma’am, if I may, I can’t—I will get

that answer for the record, but let me raise an issue which I think

is an issue that was raised to my attention and I think that might

be of some importance. It is my understanding, and subject to correction, that if a property is transferred to GSA, they will go

through the normal proceedings, which does not necessarily result

in the fact that the county will acquire the property, because their

procedures, as I understand, result in a procedure which is sale of

property to the highest bidder. So unless something is worked out,

it might not follow that the county will acquire the property.

Bureau of Reclamation is of the opinion that the intent of this

legislation that the county acquire the property has merit for the

reasons that you have raised and I, reading in between the lines,

believe that probably that has been one of the reasons why the

transfer has not occurred. But I am prepared to direct to my area

manager to move the paper forward.

Mrs. CUBIN. I do appreciate that, Mr. Martinez. When I first

began working on this legislation, it was understood that the Bureau would be willing to dispose of the property at no cost to the

local community. I think that certainly—that was a result of the

fact that a lot of money has to be put into the property before it

can be developed and Bureau of Reclamation didn’t want to do

that, isn’t in the position to do that.

And also I was under the understanding that when we were

working with the State office of the Bureau of Reclamation that it

would be turned over at no cost. Can you tell me why the Washington office and the Bureau disagrees with the State office on

this?

Mr. MARTINEZ. Mr. Chairman, Madam, I will be real frank. I do

not disagree with that position, however there is a Property Disposition Act that the GSA has that requires just compensation. And

there is a value to that property. And the issue is whether there

should be a fair price or compensation for the property. And I do

realize that some of that value is inherent in the fact that the

county and the individual who developed the property have developed it and caused the property value to go up.
21

Mrs. CUBIN. How many properties—this is industrial property.

How many other properties does the Bureau of Reclamation have

under its management that are industrial sites?

Mr. MARTINEZ. I couldn’t respond to that, but we administer millions of acres across the West, and I imagine we have quite a few

of them. And I would be glad to provide that information for the

record. In this particular area my understanding is we have six or

seven individuals leasing property.

Mrs. CUBIN. Would it be fair to say that managing industrial

property by the Bureau of Reclamation is an uncommon thing and

that managing industrial property is not in the scope, if you will,

of the Bureau of Reclamation?

Mr. MARTINEZ. Mr. Chairman, ma’am, I would like to get out of

that business. It is not—I don’t think we should be managing those

properties.

Mrs. CUBIN. In your testimony you made a couple of indirect references to the economic benefits this area has to the city of Cody,

and you also mention your concern about jeopardizing the existing

leases that are there. Could you tell me why the Bureau has refused to expand leases over the past 5 years or issue any new

leases in that area?

Mr. MARTINEZ. Mr. Chairman, ma’am, I was not aware of that

issue, and I will be glad to respond to the record.

Mrs. CUBIN. Is it fair for me to say that you think the best use

of the property is industrial use?

Mr. MARTINEZ. For that particular property in question, I believe

so. It has been industrial use, some of it, since the 1950’s.

Mrs. CUBIN. Thank you very much, Mr. Martinez.

Mr. HANSEN. The gentleman from Nevada, Mr. Gibbons.

Mr. GIBBONS. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Mr. Galvin, if I made

a presumption here that our National Park System over the last

few years has seen an increasing need of revenues for wear and

tear on it, that would be within the scope of what you would agree

to, would it not be?

Mr. GALVIN. Yes, it would.

Mr. GIBBONS. Do you believe that additional funding that could

be provided through this Internal Revenue Code change would be

helpful to the park system?

Mr. GALVIN. Yes, I do.

Mr. GIBBONS. Yet you are still opposed to it?

Mr. GALVIN. We are opposed to it. The Administration is opposed

to it because of the precedent. As I said in my prepared statement

it points out that there are probably a lot of other Federal programs that don’t come under my jurisdiction but could benefit from

a tax checkoff. And I think the basis of the Administration’s position is in that precedent, not denying the needs that exist in the

National Park System, but simply the precedent of a tax checkoff

is the basis of the opposition.

Mr. GIBBONS. Well, see, my understanding is this is not Federal

money. This is money coming back to an individual which is being

redonated back in an earmarked fashion for a specific program, not

at the will of the Administration but at the will of the taxpayer

whose money that is. So it is like a charitable contribution, a gift

to that individual or to that park system.
22

Mr. GALVIN. I share that understanding. I believe in reading the

bill that it is, in effect, money that people would get as part of a

tax refund that is being checked off here. So, as Mr. Duncan said,

it has no negative effect on the deficit. Nevertheless, the precedent,

I believe, causes anxiety in the Administration.

Mr. GIBBONS. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

Mr. HANSEN. Mr. Stokes.

Mr. STOKES. No questions.

Mr. HANSEN. Mr. Portman.

Mr. PORTMAN. No questions.

Mr. HANSEN. I will recognize the gentlelady from Wyoming, Mrs.

Cubin.

Mrs. CUBIN. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Just one last statement

for this panel. I wanted to thank Mr. Galvin for his kind remarks

regarding the bill for the open spaces in Grand Teton, the grazing

study. I appreciate your support and certainly want to work with

you on those amendments that you propose. I think they certainly

do improve the legislation.

I also wanted to recognize Kit Mullen, who is one of the supervisors of the Grand Teton National Park. Thank you all for being

here.

Mr. GALVIN. Thank you very much.

Mr. HANSEN. We thank the panel for being with us. We will excuse you and turn to our second panel.

Mr. GALVIN. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

Mr. HANSEN. Our second panel is Iantha Gantt–Wright, Diversity Outreach Manager, National Parks and Conservation Association; Charles L. Blockson, Curator, Charles L. Blockson Afro–American Collection, Temple University; Edwin Rigaud, Executive Director, Underground Railroad Freedom Center; and Cathy D. Nelson,

State Coordinator, Ohio Underground Railroad Association. If we

could ask you folks to come up and take your places, we would appreciate it.

I ask unanimous consent that the statement of Senator Olympia

Snowe be incorporated in the record. Is there objection? Hearing

none, so ordered.

[Additional material submitted by Senator Snowe may be found

at end of hearing.]

Mr. HANSEN. Have we got everybody in place? Let me ask you,

can you folks make it in 5 minutes in your testimony? Okay, I appreciate that. That is kind of you to agree with this. Iantha Gantt–

Wright, I hope I am pronouncing that right.

Ms. GANTT–WRIGHT. That is right.

Mr. HANSEN. We will give you the first 5 minutes. And just move

across the panel.

Ms. GANTT–WRIGHT. Okay, thank you.

Mr. HANSEN. Thank you.

STATEMENT OF IANTHA GANTT–WRIGHT, DIVERSITY OUTREACH MANAGER, NATIONAL PARKS AND CONSERVATION

ASSOCIATION

Ms. GANTT–WRIGHT. Thank you. Good morning, Mr. Chairman.

Once again, my name is Iantha Gantt–Wright, and I am the Cultural Outreach Manager for the National Parks and Conservation

Association. I would like to take the time to thank you and the
23

Committee for the opportunity to testify on behalf of H.R. 1635, the

National Underground Railroad Network to Freedom bill.

As a representative of the National Parks and Conservation Association, I would like to note for the record our full support for

H.R. 1635 and for sufficient funding to implement it. We believe

that this bill encourages the preservation, commemoration and interpretation of the hundreds of route sites, people, programs, activities and events that made up America’s historic Underground Railroad. We commend Representatives Stokes and Portman for their

leadership on this measure, and we greatly appreciate your positive

response to it.

Mr. Chairman, I have had the pleasure of working on this issue

now for about 2 years, and it is really close to my heart. And given

the level of support we have seen from around the country, it is

close to the hearts of many Americans. NPCA has received hundreds of phone calls and letters from Washington DC to Washington State and from every corner of America as people learn

about this bill. Blacks, whites, Hispanics, Native Americans, Christians, Quakers, Jews and many others have joined us in support

of this bill.

Evidence of this broad and diverse enthusiasm for the bill is here

in the room today. I would like to note for the record that here supporting this bill is the Ohio Underground Railroad Association

[they came in on a bus yesterday], the Friends of Freedom Society,

the National Underground Railroad Association based in St. Louis.

We also have here, Mr. Chairman, from Santa Barbara, California,

the great granddaughter of Levi Coffin, a well-known conductor of

the railroad. We have here today a representative of the tourism

industry from Kansas City, a member of the advisory committee

that worked on the study, and I am told that we have individuals

here from Michigan, Illinois, New York, Maryland and Pennsylvania.

Mr. Chairman, my reason for acknowledging these individuals

and organizations is twofold. First, I think it is really crucial that

the CCommittee see the ordinary people who have been working

for many years to preserve this powerful story. It is through the

persistence, fortitude, faith and courage of these wonderful and

committed individuals and many people just like them that this

story has remained alive for so long. The spirit of the railroad is

alive in them today. Look around this room, and what you see is

you see the faces are many colors, the backgrounds just as diverse,

but the motives are basically the same, the same as they were during the era of the railroad, to promote freedom, justice and the true

goodness of the American spirit.

Many of the people that you see here today are owners and operators of Underground Railroad sites. They open their hearts and

their homes to the public, not because they get paid to do it but

because they want to. The Network to Freedom bill would show

them that they are not alone in this effort and that our government

also realizes the significance of this chapter of American history.

Second, I believe that it is important for the Committee to see firsthand the vastness of the opportunities for interpreting this amazing story. The people here today and what they represent offer re-
24

sources that would be available to the Park Service for inclusion

in this network.

The Underground Railroad spanned 29 States, Canada, Mexico

and the Caribbean. Its railways were back roads, swamps, caves,

forests, rivers and streams, and the modes of transportation just as

diverse. The dilemma for those wishing to commemorate and establish this was to figure out how to best do it so that the American

public would experience and benefit from it. The advisory committee responsible for the study realized that the true story of the

railroad cannot be told by one site, trail or place but rather

through networks of sites, structures, programs, museums, artifacts, commemorative activities bound together through a variety of

partnerships among different levels of government, international

and all aspects of private sector.

As an African American, I grew up not knowing the intricacies

of the resistance to slavery. I spent most of my life believing that

my ancestors were not courageous enough to fight for freedom.

Today, because of my involvement in this experience, I know better. This network will provide for our youth a better understanding

of the institution of slavery, the progress we have made as a country, and more importantly the opportunity to visit a time in our

history when many of us put aside our differences and awakened

to the fact that if one of us was enslaved we were all enslaved.

H.R. 1635 would foster the projects, programs and materials to

bring the history, the message of the railroad to all Americans.

It is important to stress what the legislation won’t do. It won’t

create a new park. It would be too complex and diffuse and unmanageable. It is not a heritage area. It would not elevate any site or

project or activity above others, but would treat all equally and

would allow great flexibility in additions and changes to the network as the program proceeds.

Finally, Mr. Chairman, the National Park System brings to life

the history of the joys and pains of a nation striving to grow and

progress. The Underground Railroad is a piece of that history that

must be passed on to children and adults alike. This bill would create the means for doing that. It will make the connections across

borders, social and racial lines and time to create a visible and

identifiable commemoration that can engender the spirit of freedom

and national reconciliation in our homes, on our jobs and throughout the halls of Congress. What better time is there than now?

This concludes my testimony. I will be happy to answer any

questions.

[Statement of Iantha Gantt–Wright may be found at end of hearing.]

Mr. HANSEN. Thank you very much. Mr. Blockson, we will recognize you, sir.

STATEMENT OF CHARLES L. BLOCKSON, CURATOR, CHARLES

L. BLOCKSON AFRO–AMERICAN COLLECTION, TEMPLE UNIVERSITY

Mr. BLOCKSON. It is indeed an honor for me to return to Washington DC.

I became involved with the Underground Railroad—52 years ago.

When I was a boy of 10 years old my grandfather was singing a
25

song, ‘‘There’s a highway to heaven,’’and ‘‘Walking up the King’s

highway.’’ I said grandpop, what are you singing about. He said the

Underground Railroad—my father, your great grandfather James

and others escaped from the Underground Railroad from Seaford,

Delaware, through Pennsylvania into Canada. And so I became

more or less baptized in the Underground Railroad from the age of

10 and have been following it ever since.

I have traced my ancestry in Canada from Ontario to Nova Scotia. My great grandfather returned to Delaware from Canada after

the Civil War. For more than 35 years I have researched, collected

and traveled throughout the United States, and the greatest opportunity came in 1984 when I had the opportunity to write the cover

story for the National Geographic magazine, July issue, a story

that more or less popularized the Underground Railroad at that

time. I received scores of letters from all the country and various

parts of the world about the Underground Railroad. I spoke in Denmark, Sweden, Brazil and other countries. They knew about the

Underground Railroad.

Condensing 300 years of history in 5 minutes is very difficult,

nevertheless I also want to point out long before the National Park

Service Underground Railroad Committee was formed, there was

concern for preservation. To my astonishment as I traveled

throughout, to the deep South—we must not forget the people from

the South in the Underground Railroad—the Midwest and through

Pennsylvania and New York State, every county, hundreds of counties I collected information from the local history for years and

years. So I was able to visit these places.

I was called to Quindaro in Kansas back in June 1988 when

there was a problem pertaining to preservation of the nationally

known Underground Railroad site Old Quindaro. They were more

or less trying to fill it with some trash.

I also was astonished and saddened, deeply saddened, that most

of the known Underground Railroad sites in the Midwest where I

traveled, in Kentucky, Michigan, Ohio and many counties in upstate New York and Pennsylvania and other places, that many

sites in the African American community eliminated, demolished

through urban renewal. You will also find that many of the best

sites on this great study are the private homes. We must come up

with something to help identify private homes.

Let us begin with a short history of how all of this came about.

Let us not forget our good friend, my good friend, Peter H. Kostmayer, who was the brainchild behind the study from Pennsylvania. In 1990, Representative Peter Kostmayer asked me, after

reading the National Geographic article and one of my other books

that I did on the Underground Railroad, was it possible to establish

a committee to study the Underground Railroad. And finally I said

yes. Representative Kostmayer said select four or five people and

then I will contact their representatives of their States from Delaware, from Ohio, from Illinois, and other places. And as a result

it was finally established, a committee. We met at a historical African American church, Mother Bethel A.M.E. Church in Philadelphia, where we had a press conference January 16, 1990.

In order to deal with history, we must go back to the beginning,

and as I move on it is important to know that people from the age
26

of 99 to 9 seem—of all races seem to have an interest in the Underground Railroad. As late as last year, I took 35 school teachers

from Washington DC in conjunction with the National Geographic

from Buckstown, Maryland, Harriet Tubman’s home, up through

Delaware, Maryland, New Jersey, Pennsylvania to the Finger

Lakes of New York State, the great New York State, stood over the

grave of Frederick Douglas at Rochester and wept over the grave

of Harriet Tubman in Auburn, New York. And later we went on to

Niagara Falls and into Canada.

I also want to point out that there were many people of all races,

creeds and color. Let us not forget the spirit of Harriet Tubman,

Frederick Douglas, Levi Coffin, the great John Brown, the Quaker

Lucretia Mott, they chronicled the activities of the Underground

Railroad, along with William Still, Chief Pontiac and Detroit Michigan. Long before the Underground Railroad was formed, during the

time of George Washington, the Native American assisted not only

in the Midwest but the deep South. Let us not forget the Native

American, the children and adults.

And as I move on, let us give credit to all of you who came today,

from all over the country. Back in 1990, in the beginning, we had

to agitate, agitate, agitate for this Committee here. For seven

years, it did not come easy. As Frederick Douglas said, ‘‘agitate,

agitate, agitate.’’ I am greatly pleased just to be here today, after

all the trials and tribulations of having meetings around the country.

And let us not forget people such as Vincent De Forest and Barbara Taggert and others on the National Park Service, and our own

advisory committee, who worked to make this become a reality.

We must also remember that the Underground Railroad was not

a romantic episode. People died, people were arrested, people were

taken back. We must commemorate, not commercialize. Recently

groups have been springing up all over the country. The best people who know about the Underground Railroad are the local people

in the various communities. The National Park Service must reach

out to the historical societies and other areas around this country.

And in closing, I would like to say to you in the spirit of the old

black spiritual in connection with the Underground Railroad,

‘‘Please don’t let this harvest pass.’’ Pass this bill. Give us the funding we need so that we today can walk upon this American earth

in sisterhood and brotherhood. Thank you.

[Statement of Charles Blockson may be found at end of hearing.]

[Statement of Underground Railroad Advisory Committee may be

found at end of hearing.]

Mr. HANSEN. Thank you. Cathy Nelson, you are recognized for 5

minutes. Pull that mike as close to as you can get it, would you

please. Thank you.

STATEMENT OF CATHY NELSON, STATE COORDINATOR, OHIO

UNDERGROUND RAILROAD ASSOCIATION

Ms. NELSON. Good morning. My name is Cathy Nelson from Columbus, Ohio. I am the founder and president of the Friends of

Freedom Society and the State coordinator for the Ohio Underground Railroad Association commonly known as OURA. I am

joined by 22 members of our grass-roots organization from Ohio
27

and supporters from five States extending from Maine to California. We are all here today to show our support for H.R. 1635,

the National Underground Railroad Network to Freedom Act of

1997. We are also joined this morning by thousands of people

whose faces you cannot see but voices we hear, those of our ancestors. They are the voices of the past whose determination, courage

and sacrifices have spoken to us so we could bring their story to

you.

As State coordinator for OURA, I would like to take this opportunity to acquaint you with the efforts of our organization. OURA

is made up of 12 regions representing the 88 counties in Ohio.

Each region has a coordinator who works with county agents to research, collect and record their local Underground Railroad history

along with marking existing and nonexisting sites and structures.

This has been a statewide initiative involving individuals young

and old, black, white and Native American working together to

reach out across the State of Ohio and regionally to develop interpretive programs and to operate local Underground Railroad museums. To date over 150 sites throughout Ohio have been researched,

documented and photographed by county and regional coordinators.

There is a crying need for this history to be told from multiple

perspectives and not from one voice, which has traditionally been

the case. H.R. 1635 gives long overdue recognition to this important piece of history. It allows for a more expansive and diverse approach to the telling of this story by creating a network to link the

countless sites and structures that were a part of the Underground

Railroad both nationally and internationally.

Ohio, along with other participatory States, stand to benefit

greatly through the passage of this bill. With sufficient appropriations necessary in carrying out the responsibilities of the Underground Railroad Network to Freedom, we hope this bill will provide

for the creation of a national/international corridor program on

both land and water encompassing the natural and cultural features associated with the Underground Railroad. In addition, we

hope the Secretary will enter in cooperative agreements with nonprofit organizations in research and in the production of historical

information relating to the role of the Underground Railroad movement. In addition, we also hope that assistance to owners of documented Underground Railroad dwellings who at their own expense

maintain on a daily basis the historical integrity of their properties

while educating the general public of their significance in history.

America is incomprehensible without understanding the institution of slavery and the resistance to it. The U.S. Government enacted the legislation that legalized slavery in this country, which

lasted for over 250 years. Slavery was a war waged upon innocent

men, women and children. The Underground Railroad was one of

the effective resistances against that war. A movement cast in secrecy, the time has now come to reveal the historic deeds of those

who fought against the inhumanity of this peculiar institution

known as American slavery. Equally, it is now time for the Federal

Government to take responsibility by seizing the opportunity to acknowledge, honor and preserve the people, places and events that

launched this Nation’s greatest social and moral endeavor, the Underground Railroad.
28

With these and the recommendations from grass-roots organizations around the country and scholars alike, H.R. 1635 can begin

to develop a comprehensive understanding and inclusive approach

to educate the global society of the significant contributions made

by individuals who were diverse racially, politically, religiously, socially and economically.

In conclusion, the Underground Railroad movement is a story of

personal empowerment. It appeals to the better nature of humankind. In a sense, these ordinary people became the David who slew

Goliath. They were the foot soldiers of resistance and change.

These are the unsung heroes and heroines, both black, white and

red, whose acts of conscience and courage are largely untold but

were prepared to die for their beliefs. It is one of America’s most

powerful social movements.

On behalf of the Friends of Freedom Society and the Ohio Underground Railroad Association, I would like to thank you for allowing

me the opportunity to share our viewpoints with this committee.

[Statement of Cathy Nelson may be found at end of hearing.]

[List of attendees may be found at end of hearing.]

Mr. HANSEN. Thank you very much. Mr. Rigaud, we recognize

you for 5 minutes, sir.

STATEMENT OF EDWIN J. RIGAUD, EXECUTIVE DIRECTOR,

UNDERGROUND RAILROAD FREEDOM CENTER

Mr. RIGAUD. Thank you, Mr. Chairman and members of the Subcommittee. My name is Ed Rigaud and I am the Executive Director

of the National Underground Railroad Freedom Center in Cincinnati, Ohio.

Three years ago, the Greater Cincinnati Region of the National

Conference of Christians and Jews began an effort to create the

National Underground Railroad Freedom Center. This will be a

major interpretive center to open in 2002, and it will be located on

the historic Ohio River in downtown Cincinnati. The Freedom Center desires to become a significant link in the National Underground Railroad Network to Freedom being established by H.R.

1635.

Now let me briefly explain what we are setting out to do. Conceptually the Freedom Center is not a traditional museum. It is a museum of reflection which will attempt to touch the heart as well as

the mind. We want visitors to relive the great Underground Railroad stories of courage and cooperation between the races and to

understand the importance of the quest for freedom in America. We

also want them to be stimulated to think about how this history

can teach us to come together today across racial and ethnic barriers to preserve our liberties.

So we also view the Freedom Center as an educational and cultural institution which will employ state-of-the-art technologies and

the best minds to accomplish its mission of reconciliation. As one

educational psychologist put it: ‘‘I believe this project has more potential to create cross-racial reconciliation and collaboration than

any national endeavor currently in process.’’

This legislation is important to the future success of the Freedom

Center as well as all of the other Underground Railroad initiatives

from four perspectives. First, the expertise of the National Park
29

Service will be essential in helping our effort in Cincinnati and

elsewhere to authenticate historic sites and explore appropriate

ways to link those sites together in an official national network.

Secondly, the National Park Service can help facilitate public/private partnerships that will minimize Federal financial commitments and maximize the visibility and integration of each site in

the network. The Freedom Center, for example, is looking to raise

$80 million in order to have a 125,000 square foot facility, and the

majority of the funds will be coming from private sources. In the

future as we ask the private sector to take on increasingly meaningful roles in supporting our cultural institutions, it will be good

to hold up the Freedom Center as a strong example of how such

partnerships can be made to work. Obtaining the National Park

Service technical expertise without having to spend scarce Federal

dollars is the best of both worlds.

Thirdly, the National Park Service will help the Freedom Center

fulfill its distributive museum role. The Freedom Center is just one

important piece of a larger network that needs to be integrated and

given visibility so the story of the Underground Railroad is available to all Americans. Making information available about other

sites and units throughout the country will enable interaction and

communication between all sites. Through this cooperation, the

overall story of the Underground Railroad can finally be communicated throughout the entire Nation.

Finally, in our day when we see so many examples of divisiveness among our country’s diverse races and cultures, there is an increased need for institutions that can help foster understanding,

respect and cooperation between people of different races and backgrounds. When each element of the network, including the Freedom Center, becomes part of an overall National Underground

Railroad Network to Freedom, it will be in a much better position

to achieve its goals of commemoration, education and inspiration.

So I ask for your favorable consideration of H.R. 1635. It gives

the Underground Railroad sites visibility and unity. It promotes

public/private partnerships and it is fiscally responsible. The uplifting stories of the Underground Railroad, in sharp contrast with the

stark reality of slavery, can provide this entire country with a metaphor to shed light on the many issue confronting contemporary society. The powerful experiences from the Underground Railroad

Network to Freedom should encourage everyone, perhaps for the

first time, to have positive discussions about an otherwise painful

past. This is a great way to underscore the precious value of freedom to all and emphasize the importance of preserving that freedom for all future generations.

Thank you again, Mr. Chairman, for your kind consideration.

[Statement of Edwin J. Rigaud may be found at end of hearing.]

Mr. HANSEN. Thank you. We appreciate the testimony of all the

members of this panel. Now we will turn to the Members of Congress. You are recognized for 5 minutes for questioning of the

panel. Mr. Duncan from Tennessee is recognized.

Mr. DUNCAN. Well, let me—I have earlier said that I think this

is a very worthwhile cause, and I want to say that I appreciate

very much that in this time when we are all looking for funds for

so many good causes that you are working so hard to make sure
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that the majority of these funds come from private sources. But

thank you very much for being here with us today. Thank you.

Mr. HANSEN. The gentlelady from the Virgin Islands, you are recognized.

Ms. CHRISTIAN–GREEN. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I also want to

add my thanks to the panel and also to all of you who have come

out to support this bill, and to thank you also for your efforts,

which I am sure come at sacrifice to many of you to keep the story

of the railroad alive.

I would like to just ask one question just to probably allow you

to elaborate, but let me ask, Ms. Gantt–Wright, having just read

a book that my staff is tired of hearing me talk about, I am sure,

the Comino Folk, which gives the eyewitness accounts of slavery in

the Danish West Indies and Virgin Islands, and how much that

book enriched my life from reading those accounts, I understand

how important it is for us as African Americans to be able to relive

and to come to understand in a more meaningful way the history

and the story of the Underground Railroad. But to what do you attribute the widespread support that you say you have been receiving through phone calls to your offices?

Ms. GANTT–WRIGHT. I think you can attribute it to several

things, but I think probably one of the most important is the Underground Railroad engenders in people something really powerful,

especially in a time when we are really struggling with this issue

of race. And many of the phone calls that we are getting are from

people who have stories, who had families or ancestors who either

were conductors of the railroad or they were enslaved individuals

who passed stories down. And what you get most times from those

people is not just a story, but you get the passion. There is just this

wonderful passion about the ability to educate the rest of the country on what this story really was. And what that education means

is a country that begins to look at each other in an entirely different—from an entirely different perspective. And I think that is

exactly what it is. It is just the passion for the story.

Mr. HANSEN. The gentlelady from Wyoming.

Mrs. CUBIN. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I especially liked your

remark, Mr. Blockson, that we want to commemorate, not commercialize. And also several of you alluded to the fact that the people

at the local level know how to do this better than the people at the

national level or the people from another part of the country. And

I so very, very much support that concept, not just with this issue

but most all issues that come into play in my life. The grass-roots

effort that I see from all of you, all of you out there, is very moving

to me, and I am so thankful that you are doing this.

I represent the entire State of Wyoming, and we have fewer than

2 percent African American population in the entire State, and I

know that the education that I received—I am a chemist—in Wyoming was a wonderful education, but it wasn’t complete. And now

the opportunity my children will have to learn about all Americans

is very, very rewarding to me. And I thank you very much.

Mr. HANSEN. The gentleman from Nevada.

Mr. GIBBONS. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. And I also would like

to join my colleagues in thanking all of you for your appearance

here today. I think it is very important for America to hear and to
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learn about what this project is all about and what we are trying

to celebrate here. I think if this country is ever going to heal, it

has to heal from inside. And in order to heal from inside, we have

to educate. This program, this project will help America heal from

inside. I think it is a wonderful opportunity for us to create an institution of recognition of the struggle of Americans as the history

of this country developed. This is critically important to the future

of this country. I applaud you and I thank you very much for your

effort in trying to get this promoted. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

Mr. HANSEN. Thank you. Mr. Stokes.

Mr. STOKES. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Mr. Chairman, I don’t

have any questions, but I would like to take just a moment to express my appreciation to Ms. Iantha Gantt–Wright, to Curator

Charles L. Blockson, Ms. Cathy D. Nelson and Mr. Edward J.

Rigaud for their very eloquent and powerful testimony here this

morning with reference to this part of American history.

Mr. Chairman, this is one of those days when one serving in the

U.S. Congress feels how very important it is to have an opportunity

to serve in this great body. There are days when one questions

whether it is really—whether you are really providing a service to

be here. This happens to be one of those days where I in particular

feel very good about being able to serve in the U.S. Congress.

I am mindful on an occasion of this sort that I am a great grandson of a slave. I am also reminded of the fact that in the history

of the U.S. Congress, less than 100 African Americans have ever

served in the U.S. Congress. And so I sit here today, of course, with

a great deal of personal feeling regarding the history lesson that

we have heard in this room today. And I again want to especially

thank you for the privilege all of us have had to be able to participate in the history that has taken place in this room today. And

I thank you.

Mr. HANSEN. Mr. Portman.

Mr. PORTMAN. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I, too, want to thank

the panel. I have no questions for them, but to commend them.

Iantha, you were very helpful in coming up with this legislation.

I think this is the proper vehicle. I know that every one of the panelists and a lot of the visitors who are with us today, Mr. Chairman, have put an enormous amount of time and energy into this

effort. Dr. Blockson and I have spoken before about his research

dating back a couple of decades and other people who I see around

the room who have also worked together and in their own regions

on this effort.

I am very pleased to see that everyone is pulling together. I

would urge all of us to continue to do that. And I think that is one

of the lessons, of course, of the Underground Railroad, is the cooperation that we are commemorating here today. I also think that

it is important that we all try to stick together as we move this

process forward. I saw that today and I want to thank everyone,

because a number of people have spent an enormous amount of

time and energy working on this. It is difficult sometimes to pull

together with a single vehicle or method or approach to commemorating this incredible mosaic that was the Underground Railroad

that has so many aspects to it. It is very difficult, I think, to commemorate with one single approach.
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Again, I want to thank all the panelists, Iantha particularly, for

kind of pulling this together.

I am very pleased, Mr. Chairman, with your comments and the

support of others around this panel. I think this is something that

is very important for this Congress to do and for this country to

do for proper commemoration. I would just also thank you for the

forum today, because you heard a lot of very powerful statements

made by our panelists. It is a very emotional and powerful tale,

and you have provided the ability for this to be told.

I hope that we will now be able to move forward to final passage,

enactment, and we can do something together, as Mr. Stokes says,

which will be positive for not just this Congress but for our country. It is a pleasure to have been involved in it and to have been

enriched myself as I looked into my own roots. And I think all

Americans will find that experience enriching.

Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

Mr. HANSEN. Thank you very much. We thank the distinguished

panel for their excellent testimony. We will excuse you at this time

and turn to our last panel. The last panel is Albert C. Eisenberg,

Deputy Director for Conservation Policy, National Parks and Conservation Association, and our former colleague, Allan T. Howe,

Washington Representative, National Park Hospitality Association.

Mr. Eisenberg, you now have 5 minutes.

STATEMENT OF ALBERT C. EISENBERG, DEPUTY DIRECTOR

FOR CONSERVATION POLICY, NATIONAL PARKS AND CONSERVATION ASSOCIATION

Mr. EISENBERG. Thank you, Mr. Chairman and members of the

Subcommittee. I am Albert C. Eisenberg, Deputy Director of Conservation Policy for National Parks and Conservation Association.

We were founded in 1919, and today have about 500,000 members.

I will summarize my statement and ask that the written one be

included in the record.

I appreciate the opportunity to indicate our strong support for

H.R. 755. By coincidence, the basic elements of my testimony track

Mr. Duncan’s almost exactly, but that will not dissuade me from

proceeding.

I have three points here. Before I get to them I do want to commend Mr. Duncan for this leadership in this important issue, and

you, Mr. Chairman, for holding these hearings and being responsive to it. Three basic points: National Park Service has an enormous and growing backlog of maintenance operations and capital

projects that regular appropriations can’t match. Two, the Federal

Government has a fundamental responsibility to support the National Parks through general appropriations. We should also use

other means to supplement, not supplant these appropriations.

Three, the taxpayer checkoff concept is a sound one that Congress

should endorse by enacting this legislation with just a couple of

modest but important changes.

The backlog: Congressional appropriations would reach $1.6 billion for fiscal year 1998 under the Presidential Congressional

Budget Agreement, but looked at over the last 20 years that

amount represents a substantial loss in actual purchasing power.
33

In other words, as actual dollar levels have increased, the value of

these dollars is stretched thinner and thinner.

Park visitation has grown to almost 270 million people now, 55

million more than 20 years ago. It has a direct impact on the

amount and severity of park needs. The park system has grown,

too, since then by 79 new units. The Park Service backlogs $5.6 billion for construction and maintenance, $2 billion in resource protection, $1.2 billion land acquisition, which we understand is not part

of this particular legislation.

As the old saying goes, the harder I run the behinder I get, and

that is basically how the Park Service is operating today with these

backlogs. We have a survey of park superintendents that bears this

out, and I would like to have that submitted for the record, Mr.

Chairman.

Mr. HANSEN. Without objection.

Mr. EISENBERG. The combination of internal and external pressures compounded by inadequate Federal funding have imperiled

places that this Nation has officially recognized as the American

peoples’ most treasured lands. As the parks historic, cultural and

natural resources deteriorate, along with infrastructure and facilities designed to serve and to help in the safety of park visitors, the

very reasons that Americans value their parks will diminish too.

Behind repeated expressions of support for the national parks, the

Federal Government has also got to place the money to protect the

resources that make these places unique, enduring symbols of

America’s relationship to its land and its heritage.

Two, supplemental financing: It is a good idea to augment general appropriations with supplement sources of funds to benefit the

national parks. The new fee program is one way to do it. We support this at reasonable levels carefully monitored, its progress

measured according to suitable, reliable criteria on which to base

future decisions. Too, like you, Mr. Chairman, we are also eager for

reform of the national parks concession system, and we look forward to our continuing collaboration with you on this important

issue.

Also NPCA supports a workable program of revenue bond finance

for park capital projects, particularly for resource protection

projects.

Three, to the point of this hearing, Mr. Duncan’s taxpayer checkoff program offers a worthwhile addition to the list of supplemental

financing proposals. It should be adopted. It creates an entirely

win/win result for the national parks, the American taxpayer and

the Federal Government. It would utilize a mechanism already in

place. It would cost the Federal Government nothing since additional administrative costs, if any, would be financed by taxpayers’

donations. Monies would come into the program through entirely

voluntary contributions that in many cases would otherwise be lost

to the Federal Treasury through tax refunds.

Mr. Duncan’s proposal is based on a long-time experience with

the State. As he noted, 41 plus the District of Columbia already

have some 163 taxpayer checkoff programs. Many of the programs

relate directly to the purpose of Mr. Duncan’s legislation. The most

popular and widely employed program of this type are the nongame wildlife funds that exist in 36 States. We think that when
34

you figure the amount of taxpayers in this—tax returns in this

country on an individual basis, about 116 million, a 1-percent median participation rate for these programs and then calculate the

$8.28 per tax return amount here, multiply that product and put

it all together, you get about a little less than $10 million per year

from this program. It is a very worthwhile amount.

We would suggest three changes. One, specify that construction

include resource protection. We have got to protect and upgrade

these historic structures and cultural sites and other park resources or else the park’s values will decline and visitors will not

enjoy what they have come to enjoy. Specify that the funds derived

from the program shall not be used to offset Congressional appropriations. We know you can’t bind the Committee, the appropriations committees in that regard, but it does send a strong signal

about the intent of the legislation. Three, establish a study on the

effects of the program for the 2-year period following enactment so

that you can monitor how it works and then make adjustments as

necessary.

With your indulgence, Mr. Chairman, I will address one quick

issue of the National Park Service position. Just because others

may also have a good idea about other tax checkoffs doesn’t mean

that none should be accepted. Congress is fully capable of determining which if any taxpayer checkoff to specify. And besides, as

Mr. Gibbons pointed out earlier, these are not Federal funds. These

are taxpayers’ money, and this legislation presents an organized

means of encouraging voluntary contributions.

Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

[Statement of Albert C. Eisenberg may be found at end of hearing.]

Mr. HANSEN. Thank you. From Utah, Mr. Howe.

STATEMENT OF ALLAN T. HOWE, WASHINGTON REPRESENTATIVE, NATIONAL PARK HOSPITALITY ASSOCIATION

Mr. HOWE. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Nice to be back in the old

Committee room again where I spent a number of busy hours when

I was here. This is a wonderful Committee, and you are doing an

outstanding job as the Chairman of this Committee moving forward the protection and the use and enjoyment of our national

parks by millions of visitors who come every year.

Mr. Duncan, I am particularly pleased to be here today to support your legislation, H.R. 755. You have done a remarkable job,

I think, of outlining an idea and a method by which the Park Service can be supported and good projects within the Park Service can

be funded with no impact at all on the deficit. And it should give

no worry to anybody in the Congress to support that legislation.

I am also glad to be here with Al Eisenberg, who is the Chairman of the Arlington County Board, who I support and try to work

with over in Arlington where I live.

Today I would like to say a number of things, Mr. Chairman.

Some people may find it curious that the association that I represent, which of course is the National Park Hospitality Association, the men and women and their companies who provide visitor

services in the parks, would come forward and support this legislation. But as one considers the fact that our businesses only exist
35

in terms of supporting the visitors who come to the parks and enjoy

it, you can understand that if the infrastructure of the park is falling down around our visitor service businesses, no one would come.

No one wants to come and endanger their lives to participate even

in the glorious experience of going to a scenic area that would be

otherwise very enjoyable.

The needs have been outlined very well before your Committee,

and I won’t spend a lot of time on that except to say that the figure

of at least $8 billion in backlog does boggle my mind somewhat.

When I was here we were dealing with millions and now you are

into the billions. It seems to me that we need to take hold of this

problem before it grows any larger. I won’t elaborate more except

to say that one fact that comes through to me as I drive to the

parks, and you probably have this feeling, as well, is that throughout the entire park system each year the Park Service says about

another 1 percent of the roads fall from fair classification to the

area of poor or failed. So just to keep up with the road-building

program, which of course as you know is only one aspect of it, but

a very important one. The mobility of the visitors around the park

to be able to see it is, in fact, very important.

The concept of H.R. 755 does make sense. It allows the American

taxpayers to authorize by a checkoff on their Federal tax returns

a contribution over and above what they would owe in taxes, or to

return a portion of their refund. Unlike the Presidential checkoff,

as Mr. Duncan has observed, H.R. 755 would not allow taxpayers

to divert their taxes from the Treasury to the National Park Trust

Fund, as provided and set up under section 2 of the bill.

Now would the checkoff really help meet the NPS needs? Let me

tick off about four quick points, Mr. Chairman. The National Park

Service is the most popular Federal agency. I am always interested

in the polls that are run when the pollsters go out among the public and they say what do you like best about the Federal Government. Well, as we know—you especially who serve in the Congress

know the American people aren’t always very happy with what the

government is doing, and it is incredible that the Park Service

comes out No. 1 in all of these polls of relative popularity.

What does that mean in terms of the checkoff? Certainly it

means that their idea of supporting the Park Service and favorably

endorsing what they are doing would likely carry over to this

checkoff system. We would get, I think, a tremendous response.

No. 2, the precedent of the Presidential checkoff shows that it

could be done. Over the last 3 years, the Presidential checkoff has

raised over $200 million. I think that could be matched or even exceeded by this system that is set up for the parks. We are talking

here about the 368 units of the park system. The Park Service

would certainly have to determine where the greatest need was. As

we saw this year with Yosemite, that was crucial to get that problem solved, which I commend you and your colleagues in the Appropriations Committee for addressing this year to get those needs

taken care of. It would change from year to year.

No. 3, the cost to the Internal Revenue Service would be minimal. The reprinting of the forms goes on every year anyway. The

addition of another line to explain the Park Service checkoff would

not be any great burden on cost to the National Park Service.
36

No. 4, the similar conservation checkoff programs, as has been

observed, in various States has been successful. We have observed

that 41 States have a successful program.

In conclusion, Mr. Chairman, let me just say that the American

people do have a longstanding love affair with recreation activities

on their public lands, and especially do we see this in our national

parks. Millions upon millions of American families and many more

foreign visitors come to enjoy our camping, hiking, boating, fishing,

sightseeing and other sports each year. These visits are very valuable in the ways in which our Nation rekindles its love and dedication to our great historic, cultural, professional, natural and recreational heritage. I am confident that millions of Americans will

respond to the opportunity to make a small but significant contribution to support our national parks if Congress will enable

them to do so through the provisions of H.R. 755.

Thank you, Mr. Chairman, for this opportunity to testify.

[Statement of Allan T. Howe may be found at end of hearing.]

Mr. HANSEN. Thank you very much. We appreciate the testimony

of both of you gentlemen. Questions for the panel, Mr. Duncan?

Mr. DUNCAN. Well, thank you, Mr. Chairman. First, let me thank

Mr. Eisenberg and former Congressman Howe for some outstanding testimony and remarks and thank them for the support

that they and their organizations have provided to this legislation.

It really means a lot to me personally and I appreciate it very

much.

Like you, I am extremely optimistic about this legislation. As

Congressman Howe pointed out, the Presidential checkoff has resulted in over $200 million in funds going to the Presidential campaigns in just the last 3 years. And I think this checkoff will be

much more popular than that.

Mr. Eisenberg’s group conducted a poll not too long ago that

found that 80 percent of the American people would support or

would give at least a $1 contribution to the parks if given an opportunity to do so on their tax returns. And as I said in my opening

statement, we envision this, if we can accomplish this, to be done

in a way in which people can contribute $1, $5 or $10. And I think

that many, many people would contribute some very large

amounts. And I think that we would be amazed at what could be

raised in this way. I believe we could raise hundreds of millions of

dollars each year.

So I appreciate the efforts that both of you are making through

your groups and your willingness to come here and testify in support of this legislation today.

I did—interestingly enough, I noticed that Mr. Galvin said that

his opposition was regrettable, and I tried to point out that States,

41 States have these, and Mr. Eisenberg mentioned the District of

Columbia also. They have been able to limit these checkoffs and

keep their tax forms simple and do this without any real problem.

And Mr. Galvin was smiling and very friendly out in the hall and

he said—he told me, he said, Congressman, he said, we would love

your bill. And I think that the lukewarm opposition that he expressed was—came from a little higher up, maybe, than the Treasury or the OMB or something like that. But I think it is opposition

that we can overcome.
37

One matter of paperwork, I suppose. I do have a letter from the

Friends of the Great Smoky Mountains National Park. This is an

organization with over 6,000 members which has raised—I said in

my statement $1.3 million. Since they were formed 3 years ago,

they have raised $1.6 million. And they have written a letter, a

very strong letter, in support of this legislation. And they have

asked that I place this in the record. And, Mr. Chairman, I would

like to place this in the record at this time.

Mr. HANSEN. Without objection.

[Statement of Friend of Great Smoky Mountains may be found

at end of hearing.]

Mr. DUNCAN. Thank you very much.

Mr. HANSEN. Thank you, Mr. Duncan. The gentlelady from the

Virgin Islands.

Ms. CHRISTIAN–GREEN. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I don’t really

have a question. I want to thank Congressman Howe and Mr.

Eisenberg for their testimony. I just had a comment based on Mr.

Eisenberg’s testimony, because as we see an increasing resistance

to appropriating adequate funds for national parks and public

lands, I share what really is a concern that the funds supplement

and supplant Federal appropriations. And I agree that if passed at

the very least the intent of Congress that these funds not be used

to offset the Congressional appropriations be included in the bill.

Mr. HANSEN. Thank you. The gentleman from Michigan, Mr. Kildee, the Distinguished Mr. Kildee.

Mr. KILDEE. Thank you, Mr. Distinguished Chairman. It is good

to have Allan Howe. Allan is one who befriended me when I first

came to Congress 21 years ago, and I remember that very much,

Allan. You made a very good point. The Park Service certainly is

very well respected by the American people. If we ever had any

doubt on that, when the government was closed down a couple

years ago the thing that, I think, angered people more than anything else was the fact that the parks were closed now. It really—

I got more letters on that than any other parts of government closing down. So I think your point was really demonstrated during

that unfortunate closing down of government. And I think Mr.

Duncan has a bill here that certainly, I think, will help them show

their reverence and respect for the Park Service. I certainly would

like to support him.

Mr. HANSEN. Thank you very much. We appreciate the testimony

from the distinguished panel. Mr. Duncan.

Mr. DUNCAN. Mr. Chairman, can I say one more thing? And I appreciate Ms. Christian–Green as a co-sponsor, and I think many,

many of the co-sponsors that we have of this legislation are from

this Subcommittee and Full Committee. I appreciate Mr. Kildee’s

support and especially yours. But also, I did mean to mention it

when I was speaking a few moment ago that I think Mr. Eisenberg

has made several good suggestions in regard to this legislation. I

think they are suggestions that can make this bill even better. And

so we will work with you in regard to those suggestions.

Mr. EISENBERG. Thank you very much.

Mr. HANSEN. We look forward to marking up this legislation. I

would be curious—I don’t mean to take you time and I have got

a meeting in about 5 minutes, but I would curious to know your
38

reaction to the—what was it, U.S. News and World Report or

Newsweek or something that said Parks in Peril? Which one was

that? U.S. News and World Report. I hope you both read that. I

would be curious to know your reaction. If you ever get a chance,

drop me a note.

Thank you. The Committee will stand adjourned.

[Whereupon, at 11:52 a.m., the Subcommittee was adjourned.]
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