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95–582—PDF 2015

S. HRG. 113–678 

NOMINATION OF CAROLYN WATTS COLVIN 

HEARING 

BEFORE THE

COMMITTEE ON FINANCE 

UNITED STATES SENATE 

ONE HUNDRED THIRTEENTH CONGRESS 

SECOND SESSION 

ON THE

NOMINATION OF 

CAROLYN WATTS COLVIN, TO BE COMMISSIONER, 

SOCIAL SECURITY ADMINISTRATION 

JULY 31, 2014 

( 

Printed for the use of the Committee on Finance 

COMMITTEE ON FINANCE 

RON WYDEN, Oregon, Chairman 

JOHN D. ROCKEFELLER IV, West Virginia 

CHARLES E. SCHUMER, New York 

DEBBIE STABENOW, Michigan 

MARIA CANTWELL, Washington 

BILL NELSON, Florida 

ROBERT MENENDEZ, New Jersey 

THOMAS R. CARPER, Delaware 

BENJAMIN L. CARDIN, Maryland 

SHERROD BROWN, Ohio 

MICHAEL F. BENNET, Colorado 

ROBERT P. CASEY, Jr., Pennsylvania 

MARK R. WARNER, Virginia 

ORRIN G. HATCH, Utah 

CHUCK GRASSLEY, Iowa 

MIKE CRAPO, Idaho 

PAT ROBERTS, Kansas 

MICHAEL B. ENZI, Wyoming 

JOHN CORNYN, Texas 

JOHN THUNE, South Dakota 

RICHARD BURR, North Carolina 

JOHNNY ISAKSON, Georgia 

ROB PORTMAN, Ohio 

PATRICK J. TOOMEY, Pennsylvania 

JOSHUA SHEINKMAN, Staff Director 

CHRIS CAMPBELL, Republican Staff Director 

(II) 

C O N T E N T S 

OPENING STATEMENTS 

Page 

Wyden, Hon. Ron, a U.S. Senator from Oregon, chairman, Committee on 

Finance .................................................................................................................. 1 

Hatch, Hon. Orrin G., a U.S. Senator from Utah ................................................. 2 

Cardin, Hon. Benjamin L., a U.S. Senator from Maryland ................................. 7 

CONGRESSIONAL WITNESS 

Mikulski, Hon. Barbara A., a U.S. Senator from Maryland ................................ 5 

ADMINISTRATION NOMINEE 

Colvin, Hon. Carolyn Watts, nominated to be Commissioner, Social Security 

Administration, Baltimore, MD .......................................................................... 8 

ALPHABETICAL LISTING AND APPENDIX MATERIAL 

Cardin, Hon. Benjamin L.: 

Opening statement ........................................................................................... 7 

Colvin, Hon. Carolyn Watts: 

Testimony .......................................................................................................... 8 

Prepared statement .......................................................................................... 19 

Biographical information ................................................................................. 25 

Responses to questions from committee members ......................................... 39 

Hatch, Hon. Orrin G.: 

Opening statement ........................................................................................... 2 

Prepared statement .......................................................................................... 106 

Mikulski, Hon. Barbara A.: 

Testimony .......................................................................................................... 5 

Letter from the National Committee to Preserve Social Security and 

Medicare to Senator Mikulski, dated July 28, 2014 .................................. 109 

Letter from AARP in support of the nomination of Carolyn Watts Colvin 

to be Commissioner of the Social Security Administration, dated June 

10, 2014 .......................................................................................................... 110 

Wyden, Hon. Ron: 

Opening statement ........................................................................................... 1 

Prepared statement .......................................................................................... 111 

Fiscal Year 2013 Title II Payment Accuracy Report, Office of Budget, 

Finance, Quality, and Management, May 2014 ......................................... 112 

(III) 

(1) 

NOMINATION OF CAROLYN WATTS COLVIN, 

TO BE COMMISSIONER, 

SOCIAL SECURITY ADMINISTRATION 

THURSDAY, JULY 31, 2014 

U.S. SENATE, 

COMMITTEE ON FINANCE, 

Washington, DC. 

The hearing was convened, pursuant to notice, at 10:07 a.m., in 

room SD–215, Dirksen Senate Office Building, Hon. Ron Wyden 

(chairman of the committee) presiding. 

Present: Senators Carper, Cardin, Brown, Hatch, and Thune. 

Also present: Democratic Staff: Michael Evans, General Counsel; 

Anderson Heiman, International Competitiveness and Innovation 

Advisor; Tom Klouda, Senior Advisor for Domestic Policy; Jocelyn 

Moore, Deputy Staff Director; Joshua Sheinkman, Staff Director; 

and Kelly Tribble Spencer, Detailee. Republican Staff: Chris Campbell, Staff Director; Nicholas Wyatt, Tax and Nominations Professional Staff Member; and Jeff Wrase, Chief Economist. 

OPENING STATEMENT OF HON. RON WYDEN, A U.S. SENATOR 

FROM OREGON, CHAIRMAN, COMMITTEE ON FINANCE 

The CHAIRMAN. The Finance Committee will come to order. 

The Finance Committee is here today to consider the nomination 

of Carolyn Watts Colvin to fill a role of extraordinary importance 

to millions of Americas; that is, the position of Commissioner of the 

Social Security Administration. If confirmed, Ms. Colvin will be 

managing the nuts and bolts of the Social Security program, a vital 

task given that more than 62 million Americans depend on Social 

Security as an economic lifeline. 

I thought, Ms. Colvin and Chairman Mikulski, I would just hold 

up a Social Security statement, the reason being that I believe 

that, when Americans get this document that demonstrates what 

amount they have paid for their Social Security insurance and 

what benefits they have earned, they will hang onto this document, 

because it is a testament to just how important this program is. If 

you are confirmed, Americans are going to depend on you to ensure 

that Social Security is operating efficiently and providing the right 

amount to the right person at the right time. 

We all know that this is not a new role for you, because you have 

been the Acting Commissioner since February of 2013. Before that, 

you served as the Deputy Commissioner for more than 2 years, 

coming out of a well-deserved retirement to engage in this critical 

public service. Colleagues, as we begin consideration of the nomiVerDate Mar 15 2010 21:14 Jul 27, 2015 Jkt 000000 PO 00000 Frm 00005 Fmt 6633 Sfmt 6633 R:\DOCS\95582.000 TIMD
2 

nee, I would just like to note for the record that the Finance Committee approved Ms. Colvin’s nomination for that position by a vote 

of 23–0. Sometimes—I will tell you, Ms. Colvin—I am not sure I 

could get a 23–0 vote. So you have very strong support. 

Senator HATCH. I am not so sure either. [Laughter.] 

The CHAIRMAN. I was leading with my chin on that one. 

Senator HATCH. I think so. [Laughter.] 

The CHAIRMAN. Because of Ms. Colvin’s years of experience, Ms. 

Colvin is well-versed with the challenges involved with running the 

Social Security Administration. One of those challenges is working 

within a tight budget and fiscal constraints. Social Security felt the 

same fiscal squeeze that every Federal agency has in recent years, 

and Social Security has worked hard to maintain critical services. 

That has required making some tough decisions, including reducing 

field office hours and consolidating some offices to address budget 

and staffing challenges. 

Ms. Colvin has been actively working on ways for Social Security 

to effectively manage its program integrity workload. As Acting 

Commissioner of Social Security, Ms. Colvin has also made several 

service improvements. She has made a strong push to make Social 

Security information more user-friendly and accessible to a broader 

swath of Americans. She has made Social Security work more efficiently with other Federal partners, and she has devoted significant time and significant resources to addressing the needs of the 

many disabled Americans the agency serves. 

And I am very pleased that that is the case, Ms. Colvin, because 

just a few weeks ago we had a hearing looking at chronic disease 

and those who are disabled. Right next to where Chairman Mikulski is sitting was Ms. Dempsey from Georgia, a woman who had 

done everything right in America. Ms Dempsey had been pounded 

with one illness after another, the daily medications for which 

nearly overflowed her table. For those, she depends on the Disability program that you have focused on. So I have no doubt that 

you are going to continue that important work, that advocacy work, 

for disabled Americans, once confirmed. 

Today’s hearing, of course, is an opportunity for the Finance 

Committee, Ms. Colvin, to discuss how to guarantee the Social Security promise for today’s seniors and future generations. I hope to 

see this nomination for head of Social Security move through the 

committee and the full Senate quickly so that Social Security will 

have a confirmed leader in place. 

[The prepared statement of Chairman Wyden appears in the appendix.] 

The CHAIRMAN. Senator Hatch will make his opening statement, 

and I am very pleased to be working with my colleague on this, 

again, in a bipartisan way. Then we will have an introduction from 

Chairman Mikulski and also from Senator Cardin. 

Senator Hatch? 

OPENING STATEMENT OF HON. ORRIN G. HATCH, 

A U.S. SENATOR FROM UTAH 

Senator HATCH. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. 

Welcome, Ms. Colvin. I think it is a little unfair of you to bring 

Barbara Mikulski here to talk for you. We are all scared to death 

3 

of her. We do whatever she tells us to do, is all I can say. We 

learned that a long time ago. [Laughter.] 

I have enjoyed meeting with you in the past. Today, and with 

questions to follow, we have an opportunity to learn more about 

your past management performance and how you would, if confirmed, face the challenges of the future. 

Over the past 10 years, the Social Security Administration’s administrative budget has increased by 34 percent. That is well above 

the 24-percent growth in the number of disabled and retired beneficiaries, to a level of almost $11.7 billion. The budget has grown 

at an average annual pace of more than 3.5 percent above the average growth of even nominal GDP. 

Social Security’s administrative funding continues to take up 

greater shares of the Labor-HHS appropriations bill, inevitably 

crowding out other programs relating to health and education. Yet, 

all we seem to hear from SSA is the need for more and that any 

problems in administering programs can be solved if only SSA receives more funds. That is true of almost every agency today. 

In a hearing on this committee last week that was supposed to 

be a fresh look at the Disability program, the representative of SSA 

devoted significant time to repeating what are, in my view, becoming stale talking points, demanding more funds for the agency. SSA 

officials have been marching to the Hill repeatedly to decry staffing 

reductions that SSA itself decided to make, just as the agency decided to pay $244 million in bonuses between fiscal years 2008 and 

2013. 

What I would like to learn more about today, Ms. Colvin, is what 

you have done in managing administrative funding provided to 

SSA, which has accumulated to more than $104 billion over the 

past 10 years, and what you would do moving forward. I think 

those are fair questions, and hopefully we can enjoy working together on these things. And I hope that your answers will not simply be that SSA needs more funds. 

I hope to learn more today and in follow-up questions about what 

you have done and what you would do, if confirmed, to increase efficiency in the SSA, to reduce billions of dollars of administrative 

waste and overpayments associated with Social Security programs, 

and, of course, to fight fraud. 

And while there are many concerns to discuss, let me briefly 

identify just a few items. The first is fraud and overpayments. To 

give you an example, uncollected overpayments in the Disability 

program have recently grown to more than $10 billion. Think about 

that. Overpayments in the Disability program alone are almost 

equal to the Social Security Administration’s entire annual administrative budget. 

There also is an unacceptably high overpayment rate in the SSI 

program, and there have been discoveries of fraud, as in the Puerto 

Rico cases, the New York City cases, and the West Virginia cases. 

As for fraud, a bipartisan investigation by a Senate subcommittee led by Senators McCain, Coburn, Carper, and Levin has presented compelling evidence of fraud in the DI program in West Virginia. And even so, it is my understanding that an alleged rogue 

disability insurance attorney involved in the West Virginia cases is 

still representing claimants in Social Security’s DI program. And, 

4 

as I understand it, allegedly corrupt administrative law judges 

have retired with full retirement benefits from SSA. 

Now, it is hard to see how that is an adequate response and how, 

if this is indeed the case, we can effectively provide deterrence 

against future fraud. Ms. Colvin, I hope that today we will hear 

from you about your plans to address fraud and overpayments in 

the Social Security programs. 

The second item of concern is waste. There have been recent revelations that Social Security spent nearly $300 million over 6 years 

on a computer processing system for disability cases that has been 

identified by an outside evaluator as having, quote, ‘‘delivered limited functionality.’’ The chairman of the House Ways and Means 

Subcommittee on Social Security has called for you to stop further 

spending on the system and has called for an investigation into the 

failed implementation of the system. 

That is just one example of waste at SSA that has been uncovered. There are a number of other examples I could mention. Indeed, it is not hard to find enormous amounts of questionable and 

likely wasteful spending and payments when you read thoroughly 

the numerous reports by Social Security’s Office of Inspector General. Now, Ms. Colvin, during today’s hearing, I hope to get a better 

sense from you what your plans are to eliminate the obvious instances of wasteful spending we have been seeing at SSA. 

As you can see, Mr. Chairman, we have a lot to discuss today, 

and I am pleased, Ms. Colvin, that you are here today. And I honor 

you and expect a great deal from you as we go into the future. But 

naturally, today we want to learn more about your stewardship of 

a staggeringly large administrative budget and what your plans 

would be to improve SSA’s management and to fight the disturbing 

amount of fraud and waste at Social Security, should you be confirmed. 

We welcome you to the committee, and these are matters that 

concern me greatly. 

Thanks, Mr. Chairman. 

The CHAIRMAN. Thank you, Senator Hatch. 

[The prepared statement of Senator Hatch appears in the appendix.] 

The CHAIRMAN. Carolyn Watts Colvin has been nominated to be 

the Commissioner of the Social Security Administration. 

It is our practice, Ms. Colvin, to give you the opportunity to introduce your family. 

Ms. COLVIN. Thank you, Chairman Wyden. 

I would like to introduce my sister, Genevieve Unger, a resident 

of Maryland, who is here. And, if I may, I would like to introduce 

my colleagues Shirley Marcus-Allen, a long-term State employee, 

and Ernest Eley and his wife, Stacy Eley. 

Thank you. 

The CHAIRMAN. We are glad that you all are here. I would only 

say, as I reflect on Chairman Mikulski’s being with us, that we 

have served together both in the Senate and in the other body. I 

would just say, Ms. Colvin, you are running with the right crowd 

when you are with Chairman Mikulski. 

5 

Chairman Mikulski, we are pleased to have you do the opening 

introduction. You will be followed by Senator Cardin. Please proceed. 

STATEMENT OF HON. BARBARA A. MIKULSKI, 

A U.S. SENATOR FROM MARYLAND 

Senator MIKULSKI. Thank you very much, Senator Wyden. I want 

to thank you for expediting this hearing on our last day in session 

before the August break, when there is much pressure on you, particularly in matters related to moving the highway trust fund. So 

we thank you for this courtesy. 

To both you and Senator Hatch, it is an honor to be here in the 

Finance Committee. Your committee, the Finance Committee, and 

my committee, the Appropriations Committee, are the only two 

committees in the Constitution. They are the only two committees 

that the founders of the United States of America felt important 

enough to put into the Constitution, because it is the revenue committee and the spending committee working hand-in-hand to provide the checks and the balances to ensure the functioning of the 

democracy, not an elected monarchy. 

I think when we look at this, your job is to be looking at, really, 

the significant issues of the solvency of the Social Security trust 

fund, what do we do to ensure the future viability of Medicare and 

Medicaid. But there is also the administration of these agencies, 

often overlooked in today’s media-driven Congress where the headlines are not in the nuts and bolts of management. But under the 

leadership of you two, working with Senator Shelby and I, let us 

take a look at how Social Security is run. Does it have the right 

staff, the right technology, and the right way to do that, both at 

the Social Security Administration and, also, at CMS? 

So, hands across the aisle, hands across the committee, shoulderto-shoulder, but no matter what we do, every agency needs a good 

leader. This is why I am so pleased to join with Senator Cardin 

today in bringing Carolyn Colvin to you to be nominated for the 

permanent Social Security Commissioner. 

I first met Carolyn Colvin when she came into government under 

the legendary William Donald Schaefer, and I worked hands-on 

with Carolyn under William Donald Schaefer as both the Mayor, 

she in the health department, I in the city council, and as Governor—I had moved to the Senate. 

William Donald Schaefer was known for many things, one of 

which was his passion for making sure that government worked. 

He was a legendary figure with his spoken, ‘‘Do it now and do it 

right.’’ So he recruited people who were intellectually brilliant, had 

enormous competency in terms of management skills, and possessed the sense of urgency about solving problems of ‘‘do it now 

and do it right.’’ But he also did something else. He reached out 

to people of color to make sure that they were actually coming into 

government, and, for all of their previous service, were actually 

promoted in government. 

Carolyn Colvin was over there at the health department. Bishop 

Robinson was our police commissioner. It was a new day, a new 

profile, a new demographic, and a new buzz in Baltimore. Carolyn 

was part of that reform movement. That buzz, that ‘‘do it now and 

6 

do it right,’’ she has carried with her in the many positions that 

she has had in government. 

After William Donald Schaefer moved on, she was the Director 

of Human Services in the District of Columbia, was the Director of 

the Montgomery County Health and Human Services Department, 

was a special assistant in the Maryland Department of Transportation, and then became the Deputy Commissioner of Social Security, and, in February, also then was appointed the Acting Commissioner. 

So you know her resume, and, in each position, it was the nuts 

and bolts of government: fix problems, do it now, do it right. 

She has inherited many significant issues at Social Security: 

backlogs, techno boondoggles, some of the issues that Senator 

Hatch has enumerated. But I think she is up for the job, and I 

think I am not the only one. The National Committee to Preserve 

Social Security and Medicare has supported her nomination. The 

AARP has submitted a letter. 

I ask unanimous consent that those letters be submitted into the 

record. 

The CHAIRMAN. Without objection, so ordered. 

[The letters appear in the appendix on p. 109.] 

Senator MIKULSKI. So I bring this to your attention and, also, 

that she has been recognized by many of the women’s groups and 

leadership groups in Maryland. She is part of a group called Leadership Maryland to actually train people in working together in bipartisan relationships. Also, she is part of the Maryland 100. She 

and I joined. We are now part of the Maryland 1,000 people who 

have achieved prominence. 

But what I so admire about Carolyn is that she is ready to do 

the job, and I am just going to close with one example. 

When I became the chair of the Appropriations Committee, one 

of the perplexing issues was the disability backlog at the Veterans 

Administration. And as we talked then with General Shinseki, it 

resulted because Social Security and IRS were dragging out their 

response to the information VA needed from both of those agencies. 

Working with Senators Tim Johnson and Mark Kirk, I convened 

an all-hands-on-deck hearing with these agencies. Social Security 

immediately responded under Carolyn’s leadership to make sure 

that the VA gets on a biweekly basis—biweekly, am I correct?—the 

information it needs so that the Veterans Administration can deal 

with its backlog. 

But she has her own backlog of disability cases, this techno boondoggle plagued by, once again—before she took over—no one in 

charge, everybody in charge, everybody dithering and moving their 

microchips around. You know that deal. And we saw it in the 

health exchange. We see it over here. But I think she is the person 

to fix it. 

So, Mr. Chairman and Senator Hatch, you can see my enthusiasm for her. And, if you want William Donald Schaefer smiling 

on you today about ‘‘do it now and do it right,’’ confirm Carolyn 

Colvin. 

The CHAIRMAN. Ms. Colvin, that is some kind of send-off. 

Thank you very much, Chairman Mikulski. Your passion and 

your commitment to these programs is renowned, and I especially 

7 

appreciate your bringing up Mr. Schaefer, because I remember 

meeing him and realizing you could have a head and a heart, that 

you could focus on making sure you stretch resources while also 

caring for people. So you said it very well. 

Now, Senator Cardin has the challenging job of trying to match 

that. 

Senator Cardin? 

OPENING STATEMENT OF HON. BENJAMIN L. CARDIN, 

A U.S. SENATOR FROM MARYLAND 

Senator CARDIN. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I agree with Senator 

Mikulski. [Laughter.] You are not going to get away quite that easily, Senator Hatch. 

But let me first concur completely in Senator Mikulski’s comments about Carolyn Colvin. She is an extraordinary person. 

We have only had 15 permanent Commissioners of the Social Security Administration. It is interesting: Franklin Delano Roosevelt 

announced that he wanted to send to Congress the law creating the 

Social Security Administration. He announced that in June of 

1934, 80 years ago. He then, by executive order, set up a commission to report back to him. By the end of the year, he introduced 

legislation. Congress took it up, and by August 1935 it was signed 

into law. 

That is a model for us in taking up issues and resolving issues, 

and, of course, Social Security is a critically important program to 

millions of Americans; it is the only inflation-proof, guaranteed lifetime income source for millions of Americans. 

The permanent Commissioner is an extraordinarily important 

position, as Chairman Wyden has said. Not only are millions of 

Americans dependent upon the agency’s services, but it has more 

than 68,000 employees. 

We are very proud, Senator Mikulski and I, that the headquarters of the Social Security Administration is in Woodlawn in 

Baltimore County, MD, and we are very proud of the dedicated 

workforce that is committed to the mission and to public service. 

One-fifth of Americans depend upon the agency’s services directly. 

I have known Carolyn Colvin for 30 years, Mr. Chairman, and 

I concur completely in Senator Mikulski’s evaluations. When I 

think of Carolyn Colvin, I think of a person who is dedicated and 

who has commitment and integrity. Carolyn is dedicated to public 

service and improving the lives of others. Throughout her career, 

she has carried with her an unmatched level of commitment. 

To her current position of Acting Commissioner, she has brought 

the integrity needed to ensure that beneficiaries, applicants, and 

the SSA workforce are treated fairly and that the benefits are administered according to the law. 

Mr. Chairman, Senator Mikulski brought out many parts of 

Carolyn Colvin’s career, but it is interesting that she began at SSA 

in August of 1963 when she was hired as a clerk stenographer, and 

now she is Acting Commissioner. This really is the American story 

of a person who has worked hard, is dedicated to public service for 

the right reasons, and has accomplished so very much. 

She has experience working for municipalities, for counties, for 

the State, and for the Federal Government. She has also worked 

8 

in the private sector. So she brings all of that, and this commitment, to this position. 

I might also say that she was the director of field operations for 

my predecessor, Senator Paul Sarbanes. So she brings a great deal 

of experience. She knows us, and she also knows how to deal with 

challenges, whether it is the budget challenges facing Social Security, modernizing the disability claims system, or restoring a constructive, positive relationship between labor and management at 

SSA. 

There is one thing I know: Carolyn Colvin has never shied away 

from a challenge, and I know that she will give her best. I know 

she has the talent. I know she is there for the right reasons, and 

I strongly support her nomination and hope that we will confirm 

her shortly. 

The CHAIRMAN. Thank you, Senator Cardin. 

Ms. Colvin, with the ringing endorsement of 100 percent of 

Maryland Senators, you are now going to have the opportunity to 

make a statement. Your prepared statement is automatically going 

to be made part of the record. If you could perhaps take 5 minutes 

or so to summarize, we would like you to proceed. 

Chairman Mikulski, you are welcome to stay, and, of course, I 

know you have a very hectic day, so we appreciate your coming. 

STATEMENT OF HON. CAROLYN WATTS COLVIN, NOMINATED 

TO BE COMMISSIONER, SOCIAL SECURITY ADMINISTRATION, BALTIMORE, MD 

Ms. COLVIN. Chairman Wyden, Ranking Member Hatch, and 

members of the committee, my name is Carolyn Colvin, and I am 

the Acting Commissioner of the Social Security Administration. I 

am honored and grateful to appear before you today as President 

Obama’s nominee for Commissioner of Social Security. 

I want to thank Senator Mikulski and Senator Cardin for their 

very, very kind introductions. I would also like to thank the Senators and their staff for taking time out of their busy schedules to 

meet with me during this confirmation process. 

It is a privilege to have the opportunity to lead the Social Security Administration as the Commissioner. The scope of what we do 

is truly enormous, and it is both a humbling and rewarding experience to go to work every day knowing that what my colleagues and 

I do for families helps our fellow citizens. 

We serve with the same spirit of compassionate public service 

that President Roosevelt envisioned. I am very fortunate to have 

spent so much of my life in public service, most of it leading Federal, State, and local health and human service organizations that 

provide critical safety net services to those most in need. Quite 

often I have led these organizations through periods of change and 

uncertainty. My career has included several executive positions in 

policy and operations at SSA. Most recently, I was confirmed as the 

Deputy Commissioner on December 22, 2010, and, since February 

14, 2013, I have served as the Acting Commissioner. 

One of my top priorities since becoming the Acting Commissioner 

has been to position SSA to provide excellent service for future generations. At SSA, we have not always engaged in truly long-range 

strategic planning. This is why I created the position of Chief StraVerDate Mar 15 2010 21:14 Jul 27, 2015 Jkt 000000 PO 00000 Frm 00012 Fmt 6633 Sfmt 6633 R:\DOCS\95582.000 TIMD
9 

tegic Officer, who reports directly to me and is responsible for developing strategy and promoting innovation across SSA. We are 

well on our way toward developing a long-range plan. 

I am committed to protecting SSA’s programs from waste, fraud, 

and abuse, and I am proud to serve as the agency’s Accountable Official for Improper Payments. I have promoted new and innovative 

ways to prevent, detect, and recover improper payments. 

I am pleased with the progress we have made in expanding our 

electronic services. We have created secure and convenient electronic services for individuals who want to do business with us online. As of June 2014, over 12.5 million users had registered for my 

Social Security online accounts. With the success of our online services, we are able to conserve field office resources for those who 

prefer to visit the offices. We are fully committed, now and in the 

future, to sustaining a field office structure that provides face-toface service and is responsive to members of the public who need 

or prefer to come into the local office. 

I have appreciated the opportunity to collaborate with my colleagues across the government and contribute toward improving 

the overall efficiency and effectiveness of our service to the public. 

I am particularly proud of our collaboration with the Departments 

of Veterans Affairs and Defense, which has led to several initiatives that improve services to America’s veterans. 

SSA has many challenges ahead of it. If confirmed, I look forward to addressing them. First, we must complete a long-range 

plan that will help us adapt to a rapidly changing world and continue to provide excellent service for generations to come. 

Second, we must make wise investments in technology. If confirmed, I will continue aggressively to increase the agency’s use of 

modern technology that maximizes the return on the taxpayers’ investment. 

Third, I am committed to ensuring that we balance timely, highquality service with our program integrity responsibilities. 

Fourth, we must do more to help individuals with significant disabilities succeed in the workforce. Accordingly, the President’s fiscal year 2015 budget contains a proposal requesting resources and 

demonstration authority for us to collaborate with other agencies 

to test early intervention strategies to help people with disabilities 

remain in the workforce. 

Finally, if confirmed, I will continue to work to provide the best 

service possible for the American people. In the few years before 

fiscal year 2014, limited funding and sequestration constrained our 

ability to meet our mission. We lost employees, and we had to cut 

back on services. 

Our employees are our best asset. Despite tight budgets and 

growing workloads, I have witnessed our employees make often heroic efforts to serve our customers quickly and compassionately. 

However, without adequate resources, they can do only so much to 

serve the public. The fiscal year 2014 funding level positioned us 

to begin to restore services to the public and increase our program 

integrity efforts. I ask you to support the President’s fiscal year 

2015 budget request, which will keep us on this path. 

10 

In conclusion, I believe that my policymaking experience, management expertise, problem-solving skills, and passion for the work 

make me well-suited to be Commissioner of this wonderful agency. 

Thank you for the opportunity to appear before you today. I 

would be happy to answer any questions you have. 

The CHAIRMAN. Ms. Colvin, thank you. 

[The prepared statement of Ms. Colvin appears in the appendix.] 

The CHAIRMAN. Now, I think you have been advised by the staff 

that we have a number of standard nominee questions that we simply have to go through with all of our nominees. 

The first is, is there anything you are aware of in your background that might present a conflict of interest with the duties of 

the office to which you have been nominated? 

Ms. COLVIN. No. 

The CHAIRMAN. Do you know of any reasons, personal or otherwise, that would in any way prevent you from fully and honorably 

discharging the responsibilities of the office to which you have been 

nominated? 

Ms. COLVIN. No. 

The CHAIRMAN. Do you agree, without reservation, to respond to 

any reasonable summons to appear and testify before any duly constituted committee of the Congress, if you are confirmed? 

Ms. COLVIN. Yes. 

The CHAIRMAN. And do you commit to provide a prompt response 

in writing to any questions addressed to you by any Senator of the 

committee? 

Ms. COLVIN. Yes. 

The CHAIRMAN. Very good. Let me start by reflecting on your 

plans after confirmation. I am particularly struck by how the agency has changed over the years. You were there between 1994 and 

2001. You joined the agency as Deputy Commissioner in 2010. So, 

obviously, you have seen a lot, and you have learned a lot. 

Particularly, in terms of your plans for the next 2 years, I have 

been struck by the comments that you have made about new technologies and how you would apply new technologies. And I note 

that the recent report from the National Academy of Public Administration addresses that as well. 

So let us start with that. What are your thoughts about how, 

given the report, you can use new technologies, again, to better 

serve people and make better use of scarce resources? 

Ms. COLVIN. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. 

Social Security is a wonderful organization, and we have known 

for some time that our rolls would increase. Right now, we have 

about 10,000 individuals per week who are turning 65. So, it is not 

surprising that our rolls are increasing as a result of the demographics. 

In order to be able to keep up with those increasing workloads 

and to get the efficiencies we need, technology is the solution. We 

have already begun to make great strides in online services. We 

have the my Social Security service where individuals can sign up 

for an account, go online, and transact much of their business. We 

have had great success with my Social Security. Well over 12 million individuals have already signed up in the short time that we 

have had this service. 

11 

We also have other applications, such as disability and retirement applications, and about 50 percent of all people who apply for 

those benefits now apply online. But we realize we have to continue 

to expand in that area, and the reason is because our population 

is not homogenous. There will be people who must, in fact, have 

the availability of coming into the office to be personally served. 

Their situation may be complex, or they may just simply not be 

comfortable with the Internet, or they may prefer face-to-face services. So we will always have a field presence. 

On the other hand, my goal is to develop systems that will be 

easy to use and convenient, so that those who prefer to, can handle 

their business in the privacy of their home. What that does, Mr. 

Chairman, is allow us to free up employees in the offices to serve 

people who need face-to-face service. 

We have been very successful in developing applications. For instance, we know that the Supplemental Security Income error rate 

is partially due to people’s inability or unwillingness to report their 

wages. We now have both a telephone process where they can call 

in their wages and a mobile application where they can report their 

wages. This mobile application has already seen well over 80,000 

people use it in the very short time since its inception. My goal 

would be to get most of those people who are in need of reporting 

their wages using those systems. 

We want to also have a process where individuals would be able 

to go online and get the service that they need online in real time, 

including a chat service; where they would be able to complete 

their business and then not have to come back another time. 

So for us, technology is extremely important, and it is what we 

need in order to continue. 

The CHAIRMAN. That is helpful, Ms. Colvin, and I appreciate it. 

Let me ask you about one other aspect of this whole IT issue. It 

is no surprise that we are focusing on that, and this has been a 

special priority of mine since coming to the Senate. 

My State was always about wood products and forestry—it always will be—but we have also put a major focus on information 

technology, and that is what I wanted to ask you about in regard 

to Social Security. 

Now, I have been informed that the agency has nearly 3,000 data 

exchange agreements with Federal, State, and private entities and 

processes an average daily volume of 150 million individual transactions. 

Ms. COLVIN. Yes. 

The CHAIRMAN. We compared that to Amazon, and Amazon has 

only 27 million transactions. That was the case back on Cyber 

Monday in 2012. 

Now, we understand that much of this IT is, at its core, COBOLbased. It is the computer language developed in 1959, essentially 

before color television. And, while many of the IT managers acknowledged that a COBOL-based system works, they also have indicated that it is less efficient and agile than more modern computer languages. So what can the agency do to update the technology that it must possess to manage this eye-popping amount of 

data that you are dealing with every day? 

12 

Ms. COLVIN. I think one of the underlying challenges you just 

mentioned is the tremendous volume of data that we process. We 

recognize that we have to move away from COBOL to some extent, 

but not fully, because in some instances, it is the best language. 

So, there is a transition to modernize our systems. One of the 

challenges will be how quickly we can do that, because there are 

still other types of Information Technology projects that we must 

also develop at the same time to make our system useful and efficient, both for our employees and for the public. We have an IT 

plan that will, in fact, gradually remove some of that COBOL language and replace it with other types of language, but not fully replace it. 

The CHAIRMAN. My time has expired. 

Senator Hatch? 

Senator HATCH. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. 

Ms. Colvin, Social Security has long been criticized for not formulating long-term plans. Last year, the nonpartisan Government Accountability Office identified that SSA faces four key areas of management challenge over the next decade. These are SSA’s lack of 

an updated succession plan, even though the agency faces a retirement wave; Disability program issues, including a need to incorporate what GAO says is, quote, ‘‘a more modern concept of disability;’’ information technology, including internal weaknesses in 

information security; and physical infrastructure. 

I have a note that the lack of funding was not identified as a key 

area of management challenge. GAO wrote that, quote, ‘‘SSA has 

ongoing planning efforts, but they do not address the long-term nature of these management challenges.’’ 

Now, Ms. Colvin, how will you, if confirmed, confront those challenges in human capital, Disability modernization, information 

technology, and physical infrastructure? 

Ms. COLVIN. Senator Hatch, we have recognized that the agency 

does need to have a long-term vision. We are in the process of 

doing that right now. We have the National Association of Public 

Administrators that was commissioned by Congress to help in this 

process. They have submitted their report. 

We will use some of that report to inform decisions as we finish 

our own planning process. We expect to have a long-term vision 

plan around the first of the year. We need to make sure that we 

have extensive engagement with our stakeholders, Congress, our 

advocates, and customers, et cetera. 

So, we are looking at making sure that all of that has been done, 

but we do expect to have a long-term vision document completed 

by the beginning of the new fiscal year. The last vision document 

was, in fact, done in 2000 when I was at SSA, and it was for the 

years up to 2010. So, we recognize the need there. 

We are also in the process of developing a human capital plan 

which looks at succession planning and at the gaps that we need 

to fill. Probably about half of our employees are now eligible for retirement. The fact that our program is very complex means that 

this will be a major problem for us. So we are, in fact, doing skill 

gap training. 

Senator HATCH. Well, look at those four critical ones. 

13 

Ms. COLVIN. And we are, in fact, modernizing our system. So 

those three areas that were identified, we are currently addressing. 

Senator HATCH. All right. Well, thank you. In our hearing last 

week about the Disability program, views were expressed that the 

DI trust fund exhaustion has been foreseen for 20 years, and that 

increases in the Disability rolls have been expected for some time. 

Now, this means that SSA has ample time to update its DI program to adapt to changes. However, as I understand it, decisionmakers in the DI program utilize tens of thousands of pages of instructions to decide who should get benefits, including 37-year-old 

medical criteria, 35-year-old vocational criteria, and 23-year-old 

guidelines to determine what jobs exist for individuals with disabilities. 

Now, according to the nonpartisan GAO’s high-risk list in 2013, 

disability programs managed by SSA, quote, ‘‘rely on out-of-date 

criteria to a great extent in making disability decisions.’’ 

So I have two questions about this. The first is whether 2013 was 

the first time that GAO identified high risk in SSA’s Disability program, and the second is why it is taking so long for SSA to update 

its criteria and guidelines, especially since you have had so much 

time and foresight about troubles with Disability finances. 

If you could address those, I would appreciate it. 

Ms. COLVIN. Senator Hatch, it is my understanding that there 

have been other earlier recommendations related to the need to update some of the medical tools that we use in determining disability. 

The Disability program, as you know, is a very complex program. 

Any change is going to generate significant discussion both here in 

Congress and the community. So any change that is made has to 

be evidence-based. It has to be based on research and medical advancements. 

We are in the process right now of working with the Department 

of Labor to update the occupational list that we use, and that has 

been happening for some time. The occupational standards that we 

currently use are, in fact, not going to be updated. We are working 

with the Department of Labor to develop a tool that will be helpful 

in making our disability decisions. We do not have a timeline, but 

we have been working aggressively on development of that tool. 

Our medical listings are updated on an ongoing basis. These are 

the criteria that are used in making the disability determination. 

Most have been updated and are presently on a cycle to be reviewed every 3 years. We follow the advances in medicine. So if, 

in fact, there are new developments in science that make disability 

decisions different, then we use that information. 

This update is something that is ongoing and therefore is always 

going to be in need of review. There is tremendous progress going 

on within the agency, so I do not want to leave the impression that 

we are not making advances. The changes that we are making, 

though, will not have a significant impact on the trust funds. It is 

our hope that Congress will find a bipartisan way to address the 

need to have additional funding there. 

You are aware that Congress many times in the past has reallocated between the two trust funds. The President has indicated 

that he hopes that they do this again so that we have adequate 

14 

time to make long-term decisions, and that whatever is decided will 

be a bipartisan decision. We know that that will take a lot of discussion. 

Senator HATCH. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. 

The CHAIRMAN. Thank you, Senator Hatch. 

Senator Brown? 

Senator BROWN. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. 

It is good to see you, Ms. Colvin. Thank you for joining us. 

First, I just wanted to exhort you to work hard in terms of improving and expanding SSA’s communication with the general public. 

Like I do, as many of us do, I have done literally hundreds of 

roundtables and calls with senior groups and various kinds of teletown halls, and I hear so many of the same myths about Social Security, about Disability, that they are not going to always be there 

and all the things that people say, and I just want to exhort you 

to do what you can to help dispel those myths. 

I know we talked about that; you agree with that. But let me 

talk about a couple more serious things, a couple other more administrative things, if I could. 

My office got a copy of a memo to the hearing office of the chief 

administrative law judge in the Office of Disability Adjudication 

Review in New York. I also received a memo from the chief administrative law judge that mandates a 600-case-a-year quota. 

The first memo I mentioned contains a number of fairly mundane details, but it also makes two important assertions. An ALJ, 

administrative law judge, should be issuing 500 to 700 legally sufficient and timely decisions each year. If you continue to fail to consistently and efficiently manage your workload, the agency may 

initiate disciplinary action against you. 

Could you, Commissioner Colvin, please elaborate on SSA policy 

regarding quotas for administrative law judges? 

Ms. COLVIN. Senator Brown, we do not have quotas. The agency 

has set targets or goals toward which they want to see the ALJs 

work. Those targets were developed by chief judges who, in fact, 

have held cases. The agency has about 7 years’ experience now 

with the targets. 

The majority of our ALJs do, in fact, reach that target of between 

500 and 700 decisions per year. The reason I say it is not a quota 

is that no one gets disciplined because of their failure to reach that 

number. It is just a goal that we work toward. 

We are a production agency. Our first priority is quality—to 

make sure that the decision is policy-compliant and legally defensible. But we know it is a high-volume business. When we train 

ALJs, we mention that to them. And we have, as in any other organization, some who meet that target, and some who go above it, 

and some who do not meet it. But it is not a quota. 

Senator BROWN. Thank you for that. It seems, talking to them, 

to many of them it feels like a quota, and I do not need a comment 

on that, but I just hope that you will sit down and find a way to 

open up communications with them and, again, reinforce what you 

just said to this committee right now that it is not a quota, that 

it is a recommendation and that there is no discipline. I think they 

just need to hear that directly from you. 

15 

Let me shift briefly to the labor and management relations. Even 

with the presidential executive order calling for labor-management 

partnerships throughout the Federal Government, it seems from 

our reports that it has only gotten worse, to the point where some 

labor organizations tell us it is as bad as it gets in the entire Federal Government. 

What explains this? Why is this? And can I have a commitment 

from you to provide my office and this committee with a detailed 

update on progress you are making toward fully implementing your 

office plans to improve labor relations as specified in executive 

order 13522? 

Ms. COLVIN. Senator Brown, I hear your concern about the labormanagement relationships in the agency. In every organization I 

have worked in, we have had very strong and effective relationships with the union. I think it is very important when union and 

management work together, because it benefits the agency and the 

employees that we both represent. And I believe that the unions 

have the same goal that we have, which is to do the best we can 

for our employees and for the American public. 

Historically, there has always been a very acrimonious relationship in the agency. I worked with the union when I was here from 

1994 to 2001 under President Clinton, and we had what we call a 

partnership. In fact, I was the one who signed that contract at that 

time, and I felt that relationships had improved. When I returned, 

I was amazed to see the deterioration. But what I have done is, I 

meet with them on a regular basis. I have lunch with them without 

management staff so that we can begin to just get to know one another. 

I have had relationship training given by the Federal Labor Relations Board to have managers and the union come together to 

look at how we can build trust, how we can communicate better, 

et cetera. You have my commitment that I will continue to do that. 

I will say that, when you have a huge organization like SSA with 

62,000 employees, it takes a long time to change the culture and 

the relationships. But you have my commitment to continue to try 

to move that gap a little bit closer so that we can work better together. 

Senator BROWN. And also, a commitment to report to my office 

and to this committee of progress, labor progress. 

Ms. COLVIN. Absolutely. 

Senator BROWN. Thank you very much. Good luck in your confirmation. Thanks. 

The CHAIRMAN. Thank you, Senator Brown. 

Senator Carper? 

Senator CARPER. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. 

First of all, let me just say how pleased I was to meet with you 

earlier this morning. 

Ms. COLVIN. Thank you, sir. 

Senator CARPER. And thank you for your service and for your 

leadership at the Social Security Administration for these many 

months as our acting leader. My hope is that you will be confirmed. 

Ms. COLVIN. Thank you, sir. 

Senator CARPER. I went to Ohio State as an undergrad. I get invited back there from time to time. I was back last year and had 

16 

an opportunity to speak to about 400 or 500 young men between 

the ages of 18 and 22, some from Ohio State, others from other 

States in the Midwest, and I talked to them about leadership, I 

talked to them about values, and I talked to them about some of 

the challenges that we face. 

Among the questions that they asked me were questions relating 

to our future as a country, the economy, their ability to get jobs, 

and so forth. I asked them a question too. I asked them a couple 

of questions. I said, ‘‘How many of you think that someday you will 

receive a Social Security check? Raise your hand.’’ Not one person 

out of 500 guys raised his hand, not one. And I said, ‘‘How many 

of you think you will ever benefit from Medicare?’’ Not one. Not 

one. 

I said, ‘‘Our job here is to make sure if you ever need a Social 

Security check when you are 65 or 70 or 75, it will be there, and 

our job is to make sure that if you ever need Medicare or you need 

health care, and you probably will, that it will be there for you as 

well.’’ 

I think we have a moral imperative to the least of these in our 

society to look out for their needs. I also think we have a fiscal imperative to make sure that we are meeting that moral imperative 

in a fiscally responsible, fiscally sustainable way. 

I chair the Committee on Homeland Security and Governmental 

Affairs. We have a subcommittee led by Carl Levin and, until a 

year ago or so, by Tom Coburn. They did an in-depth analysis, as 

you know, of Disability Insurance fraud in one place, in Huntington, WV. And what they found was—and I mentioned this to 

you in our meeting—they had one judge who was, in all his cases 

from one attorney, from one law firm, approving about 99 percent 

of them, and, almost magically, a cash payment was deposited into 

the bank account of the judge every month for year after year after 

year. 

We have to be smart enough to detect that, find it, and do something about it. In the private sector, they have the ability to use 

a technique called predictive analytics. Predictive analytics. And 

this is just an area that is ripe for this. 

I think the average approval rate for Disability Insurance applications is about 40 percent. When somebody, a judge, is at 50 percent, it is not unusual, 60 percent or 70 percent, but 99 percent, 

95 percent, 90 percent is unusual, especially when the bulk of a 

judge’s cases are coming from one lawyer. We should be able to 

pick this stuff up. We should be able to pick this stuff up, and they 

do it in the private sector all the time. 

I just want you to talk to us about how we plan to use the same 

kind of tools and techniques in order to defend a fund that I think 

is going to run out of money in 2016 or so: the Disability Insurance 

fund. 

I think the Social Security trust fund will start having to chop 

down the benefits in the early to mid-30s, 20s. But just talk to us 

about how we are going to use it, how we are using predictive analytics to get at this problem. 

Ms. COLVIN. Thank you, Senator Carper. We are enhancing our 

anti-fraud activities. We are, in fact, using data analytics. We are 

17 

working internally. We also want to be using external groups so 

that we can maximize this. 

Our fraudsters have become much more sophisticated. So we are 

seeing third-party fraud, and that is why data analytics is going to 

be so important, because it will show us the trends that are happening, and we will be able to identify things that we would not 

be able to identify without that. 

So we are, in fact, working on that. But let me just mention that 

we have a zero tolerance for fraud in the agency, and, even though 

the Inspector General has indicated in reports that we have less 

than 1 percent fraud, even one case is too many. 

Every time we have a case, we look at lessons learned so that 

we can benefit from that. Most of the fraud is identified by our 

front-line employees who tend to be our best defense against fraud. 

We also have—I do not know if you are familiar with our Continuing Disability Investigation Units. These are the units that are 

partners with the Office of Inspector General, the local Disability 

Determination Services, and with local law enforcement. I initiated 

the first unit in 1998 when I was here. We now have 25. As a result of the increased funding that we got this year for program integrity, I am opening up another seven. 

What these units do is identify fraud before we pay out the first 

check. This is important, because it is so much easier to not pay 

the money than it is to recoup it once we have made the benefit 

payment. So, we are aggressive in that area. 

For example, our front-line employees made about 22,500 

disability-related fraud referrals to the Office of the Inspector General in fiscal year 2013. We have been working with the Department of Justice to try to get them to be more aggressive in prosecuting the cases, and, in some instances, we have to defer any administrative action that we take until such time as the criminal action has been taken. That is a benefit to us because, if criminal action is taken, we can get restitution, whereas if we take an administrative action, we do not know how much of the money we can 

get back. 

Senator CARPER. Great. Well, that is encouraging. We want to be 

your partner. 

I want to say, Mr. Chairman, a special thanks before I yield. 

Thanks to you, and I want to thank Senator Hatch and your staffs 

for working with Dr. Coburn and me on something called improper 

payments, $106 billion in improper payments last year. And some 

of those are hard to correct, but a lot of them can be fixed. 

We have a situation where the Social Security Administration 

has a Death Master File that pretty much keeps track of who is 

alive and who is dead so that we do not pay benefits to people who 

are dead, and we need to be able to make that available to other 

Federal agencies so that they have the right and the most accurate 

information. 

But I want to say, Senator Wyden, Mr. Chairman, and to Senator Hatch, thank you very much for working in concert with Dr. 

Coburn and me to make sure that we can address this issue, $106 

billion in improper payments—not all from Social Security by any 

means. We are doing better, but we could do better still, and this 

bill will help us to. So thank you. 

18 

The CHAIRMAN. Thank you, Senator Carper. 

I want you to know, as I have indicated to Senator Hatch—because we had a hearing on Disability Insurance—that where there 

is fraud, we are going to find it and we are going to fight it, and 

the reason we are is because this program is so important for the 

kind of person like Ms. Stephanie Dempsey. I talked about her before you came. 

She was really the face of the Disability Insurance program when 

she came for our discussion of chronic conditions, and she did everything right. She just got clobbered by one disease after another, 

and she was sitting there at the end of the table where Chairman 

Mikulski was with medications piled up one box after another that 

she takes every day. So we owe it to her; we owe it to taxpayers. 

I also have this report with respect to Social Security about the 

question of improper payments, and I am going to put that into the 

record, which would indicate that, in the overwhelming number of 

instances, the agency gets it right. But your point is, when they do 

not and when there is particularly fraud, we have to find it, we 

have to fight it, we have to root it out, and we are going to do that 

in a bipartisan way. 

[The report appears in the appendix on p. 112.] 

The CHAIRMAN. So let me recognize Senator Hatch. Would you 

like to say anything else, Senator Hatch? 

Senator HATCH. Just welcome and we are happy to have you testify here today. I enjoyed our meeting in our office together and 

look forward to working with you. 

The CHAIRMAN. The only thing I would say in closing, Ms. 

Colvin—and you could see this from the remarks of the Senators— 

is that sometimes government is kind of an abstraction: there is 

‘‘some agency’’ in ‘‘the office of acoustics and ventilation,’’ and the 

citizen tries to figure out, well, what does that exactly have to do 

with me, etc. That is not the case with Social Security. 

This is what I was getting at earlier when I held up an earnings 

statement and talked about what receiving one means to someone. 

There have been changes in the policy—yes—but people hold onto 

this because it tells them what they have earned, what they have 

paid in, what they have coming to them. 

So I support your nomination, and I think you have addressed 

the concerns of the Senators here, and I am doing it because I 

think you have the experience. Indeed, you have had several stints 

at the agency, so you have seen the changes over time. And I think 

you will work with us, particularly in an area I am personally very 

interested in, to make sure that we are using modern technology. 

Ms. COLVIN. Absolutely. 

The CHAIRMAN. We have 21st-century challenges, yet what we 

have to meet them has been in place since before color TV, sort of 

20th-century technologies. That is why we have to play some catchup, and we have to work together, and we have to move quickly, 

and we have to do it given the challenge of constrained resources. 

I feel you are going to work closely with us, and I intend to support your nomination. 

With that, the Finance Committee is adjourned. 

[Whereupon, at 11:06 a.m., the hearing was concluded.] 

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