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S. HRG. 114–153 

HIGHLY PATHOGENIC 

AVIAN INFLUENZA: 

THE IMPACT ON THE 

U.S. POULTRY SECTOR AND 

PROTECTING U.S. POULTRY FLOCKS 

HEARING 

BEFORE THE

COMMITTEE ON AGRICULTURE, 

NUTRITION, AND FORESTRY 

UNITED STATES SENATE 

ONE HUNDRED FOURTEENTH CONGRESS 

FIRST SESSION 

JULY 7, 2015 

Printed for the use of the 

Committee on Agriculture, Nutrition, and Forestry 

( 

Available via the World Wide Web: http://www.fdsys.gov/ 

COMMITTEE ON AGRICULTURE, NUTRITION, AND FORESTRY 

PAT ROBERTS, Kansas, Chairman 

THAD COCHRAN, Mississippi 

MITCH MCCONNELL, Kentucky 

JOHN BOOZMAN, Arkansas 

JOHN HOEVEN, North Dakota 

DAVID PERDUE, Georgia 

JONI ERNST, Iowa 

THOM TILLIS, North Carolina 

BEN SASSE, Nebraska 

CHARLES GRASSLEY, Iowa 

JOHN THUNE, South Dakota 

DEBBIE STABENOW, Michigan 

PATRICK J. LEAHY, Vermont 

SHERROD BROWN, Ohio 

AMY KLOBUCHAR, Minnesota 

MICHAEL BENNET, Colorado 

KIRSTEN GILLIBRAND, New York 

JOE DONNELLY, Indiana 

HEIDI HEITKAMP, North Dakota 

ROBERT P. CASEY, JR., Pennsylvania 

JOEL T. LEFTWICH, MAJORITY STAFF DIRECTOR

ANNE C. HAZLETT, MAJORITY CHIEF COUNSEL

JESSICA L. WILLIAMS, CHIEF CLERK

JOSEPH A. SHULTZ, MINORITY STAFF DIRECTOR

JONATHAN J. CORDONE, MINORITY CHIEF COUNSEL

(II) 

(III) 

C O N T E N T S 

Page 

HEARING(S): 

Highly Pathogenic Avian Influenza: The Impact on the U.S. Poultry Sector 

and Protecting U.S. Poultry Flocks .................................................................... 1 

Tuesday, July 7, 2015 

STATEMENTS PRESENTED BY SENATORS 

Roberts, Hon. Pat, U.S. Senator from the State of Kansas, Chairman, Committee on Agriculture, Nutrition, and Forestry ................................................. 1 

Stabenow, Hon. Debbie, U.S. Senator from the State of Michigan ..................... 2 

Grassley, Hon. Charles, U.S. Senator from the State of Iowa ............................. 18 

Casey, Hon. Robert, Jr., U.S. Senator from the State of Pennsylvania .............. 19 

Thune, Hon. John, U.S. Senator from the State of South Dakota ...................... 37 

Panel I 

Clifford, John R., D.V.M., Deputy Administrator, Animal Plant Health Inspection Service, Veterinary Services, U.S. Department of Agriculture, Washington, DC ............................................................................................................. 4 

Swayne, David, D.V.M., Laboratory Director, Southeast Poultry Research 

Laboratory, Agricultural Research Service, U.S. Department of Agriculture, 

Athens, GA ........................................................................................................... 6 

Panel II 

Dean, James R., Chairman, United Egg Producers, Sioux Center, IA ............... 28 

Klippen, Ken, President, National Association of Egg Farmers, Collegeville, 

PA .......................................................................................................................... 30

Moline, Brad R., Manager, Owner, Moline Farms LLC, Manson, IA ................. 31 

Knecht, Rob, President, Vice President of Operations, Michigan Allied Poultry 

Industries and Konos, Inc., Martin, MI ............................................................. 33 

Elam, Thomas, Dr., President, FarmEcon LLC, Carmel, IN ............................... 34 

APPENDIX 

PREPARED STATEMENTS: 

Casey, Hon. Robert, Jr. .................................................................................... 46 

Grassley, Hon. Charles .................................................................................... 47 

Thune, Hon. John ............................................................................................. 48 

Clifford, John R. ............................................................................................... 52 

Dean, James R. ................................................................................................. 59 

Elam, Thomas ................................................................................................... 64 

Klippen, Ken ..................................................................................................... 67 

Knecht, Rob ....................................................................................................... 75 

Moline, Brad R. ................................................................................................. 79 

Swayne, David .................................................................................................. 87 

DOCUMENT(S) SUBMITTED FOR THE RECORD: 

Hon. Pat Roberts: 

American Bankers Association, prepared statement ..................................... 92 

National Pasta Association, prepared statement ........................................... 95 

Rembrandt Foods, prepared statement .......................................................... 97 

Page

IV 

Elam, Thomas: 

Economic Losses from the 2015 Highly Pathogenic Avian Flu Outbreak ... 100 

QUESTION AND ANSWER: 

Clifford, John R.: 

Written response to questions from Hon. Pat Roberts .................................. 108 

Written response to questions from Hon. David Perdue ............................... 109 

Written response to questions from Hon. Charles Grassley ......................... 110 

Written response to questions from Hon. John Thune .................................. 111 

Written response to questions from Hon. Joe Donnelly ................................ 113 

Dean, James R.: 

Written response to questions from Hon. John Thune .................................. 115 

Elam, Thomas: 

Written response to questions from Hon. John Thune .................................. 117 

Klippen, Ken: 

Written response to questions from Hon. John Thune .................................. 118 

Knecht, Rob: 

Written response to questions from Hon. John Thune .................................. 119 

Moline, Brad R.: 

Written response to questions from Hon. John Thune .................................. 120 

Swayne, David: 

Written response to questions from Hon. John Thune .................................. 114 

(1) 

HIGHLY PATHOGENIC 

AVIAN INFLUENZA: 

THE IMPACT ON THE 

U.S. POULTRY SECTOR AND 

PROTECTING U.S. POULTRY FLOCKS 

Tuesday, July 7, 2015 

UNITED STATES SENATE, COMMITTEE ON AGRICULTURE, NUTRITION, AND FORESTRY, Washington, DC 

The committee met, pursuant to notice, at 3:02 p.m., in room 

328A, Russell Senate Office Building, Hon. Pat Roberts, Chairman 

of the committee, presiding. 

Present or submitting a statement: Senators Roberts, Cochran, 

Boozman, Hoeven, Ernst, Perdue, Tillis, Grassley, Thune, Stabenow, Brown, Klobuchar, Bennet, Donnelly, and Casey. 

STATEMENT OF HON. PAT ROBERTS, U.S. SENATOR FROM THE 

STATE OF KANSAS, CHAIRMAN, U.S. COMMITTEE ON AGRICULTURE, NUTRITION, AND FORESTRY 

Chairman ROBERTS. Good afternoon. I call this meeting of the 

Senate Committee on Agriculture, Nutrition, and Forestry to order. 

We are here today to learn from the stakeholders on highly pathogenic avian influenza, the impact on the U.S. poultry sector. 

Thank you to our witnesses for sharing their experience with highly pathogenic avian influenza, or HPAI. I know several of you have 

had infected farms and others have been on the front lines of this 

response. 

I commend the U.S. Department of Agriculture, the State Departments of Agriculture, and the impacted sectors for their coordination and diligence in addressing HPAI. If it were not for the 

rapid response by all involved, including impacted producers, the 

virus could have caused much more damage. The rapid response 

demonstrated by government and industry alike is the kind of coordinated effort that will ensure the U.S. poultry sector weathers 

the storm. 

I am also pleased to share that many of the first farms hit with 

HPAI in the Upper Midwest have begun repopulating their farms. 

This is a critical step because it enables these farms to begin generating income again. 

As we will hear from experts today, it is important to emphasize 

the fact that this outbreak of HPAI poses no food safety risk—no 

food safety risk—nor does it pose any public health risks. While 

this outbreak has caused severe disruption to the U.S. poultry secVerDate Nov 24 2008 08:33 May 10, 2016 Jkt 000000 PO 00000 Frm 00005 Fmt 6633 Sfmt 6633 C:\USERS\MW42035\DESKTOP\DOCS\96181.TXT MICAH
2 

tor and to its retailers, it is important to reiterate the fact there 

has been no impact on human health or food safety. Nevertheless, 

this has been and continues to be an incredible taxing and trying 

situation for the individuals and industries that are represented 

and are here today. 

Agriculture is a high-risk business, and our poultry and egg producers are experiencing firsthand the damaging tolls some of these 

risks take on their operations. Many of the impacted farms employ 

dozens, or in some cases hundreds, of people. These businesses are 

often the backbones of rural communities that dot the American 

countryside, and the ripple effect that HPAI has had on these rural 

communities is dramatic and widespread. 

It is critical that we hear some of the lessons learned from the 

impacted industries and from the animal health experts at the Department of Agriculture. We need to identify improvements that 

must be made to both our national animal health infrastructure 

and biosecurity measures on farms to ensure the U.S. poultry and 

livestock sectors are protected from future disease threats. 

In 2013 and 2014, the U.S. pork sector was plagued with a similar devastating virus. Now, in 2015, we are experiencing HPAI, 

which has resulted in depopulation of ten percent of egg-laying 

hens and three percent of turkeys now produced in the United 

States. Both of these experiences have emphasized the importance 

of bolstering our animal health infrastructure and foreign animal 

disease preparedness here in the United States. 

U.S. businesses such as food producers and restaurant owners 

want to ensure that disease threats like HPAI do not continue to 

cause the extreme price volatility they have been working hard to 

manage. It is critical that we take the lessons learned from this 

outbreak and put them to good use. We need to take a good hard 

look at the animal health infrastructure here in the United States 

so we have the proper measures in place to continue to protect 

poultry, livestock, and, thus, the global food supply. 

U.S. agriculture has a long history of providing the safest, must 

abundant food supply in the world. That is due to the strength and 

dedication of our producers. I am confident that even in the face 

of today’s challenges, our farmers will continue to deliver safe, affordable, and abundant products. 

I now recognize the distinguished ranking member, Senator Stabenow. 

STATEMENT OF HON. DEBBIE STABENOW, U.S. SENATOR 

FROM THE STATE OF MICHIGAN 

Senator STABENOW. Well, thank you very much, Mr. Chairman, 

for holding this very important and very timely hearing, and thank 

you to all of our witnesses for testifying today. We look forward to 

hearing your perspectives this afternoon. 

We meet today because American poultry and egg producers are 

experiencing an unprecedented animal health crisis, as the Chairman has said. Since December 2014, avian flu has affected more 

than 48 million birds—it is stunning when you think about that, 

48 million birds—in 15 states, causing economic hardship for producers, driving up the cost of food for consumers, and threatening 

international trade. 

3 

As a sign of the difficulties producers are facing, this year is the 

first year in more than a decade that the United States will import 

eggs from European markets to help make up the shortage from 

the millions of birds lost to the outbreak. 

Members of the committee know these facts especially well. Senators Grassley and Ernst and Klobuchar’s home states of Iowa and 

Minnesota have experienced the worst of the crisis, and my 

thoughts are with the producers in your states. 

Addressing avian influenza and the variety of challenges it presents requires all stakeholders, both public and private, to work together. Since the start of the outbreak, the U.S. Department of Agriculture, alongside state governments, have moved swiftly to help 

producers, and I join with the Chairman in applauding those efforts. That work and continuing a close collaboration with industry 

is essential to moving forward in a way that maximizes the effectiveness of relief efforts while helping our producers on the path to 

recovery. That teamwork also sends a strong signal to customers 

at home and abroad that America’s poultry sector remains open 

and eager for business. 

I look forward to working with you, Mr. Chairman and members 

of the committee, as we move forward to do whatever we can to 

support this important industry. Thank you. 

Chairman ROBERTS. I thank the Senator. 

Before we welcome our first panel of witnesses, is Congressman 

King from Iowa in the audience? We would welcome him here. Perhaps he will appear later. 

Our first witness is Dr. John Clifford, Deputy Administrator Animal and Plant Health Inspection Service, Veterinary Services, the 

U.S. Department of Agriculture here in Washington. Dr. Clifford 

has played a key role in safeguarding U.S. animal health since he 

started his career at APHIS in 1985. Dr. Clifford has been Deputy 

Administrator of APHIS’s Veterinary Services since May of 2004, 

and prior to that, he served as the Associate Deputy Administrator. 

In those roles, Dr. Clifford has led the Veterinary Services efforts 

to protect, sustain, and improve the productivity, marketability, 

and health of the nation’s animals. 

Before beginning his work with APHIS, Dr. Clifford was a private veterinarian in a mixed animal practice. He received a Doctorate in Veterinary Medicine from the University of Missouri, 

home of the Tigers, formerly of the Big 12—— 

[Laughter.] 

Chairman ROBERTS. I am pleased to welcome you to the committee today, Dr. Clifford. 

Then our second witness is Dr. David Swayne, who will be introduced later by Senator Perdue. No, I beg your pardon. You are 

going to introduce him right now. 

[Laughter.] 

Senator PERDUE. Very good. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. 

Mr. Chairman, I am honored to introduce Dr. David Swayne. Dr. 

Swayne, I appreciate you appearing today before this Agriculture 

Committee. We are certainly honored to have what many would 

consider the foremost authority on avian influenza in the country 

here for this very important hearing. Thank you for being here. 

4 

Dr. Swayne received his Ph.D. from the University of Georgia in 

1987 and has been Director of the National Poultry Research Center in Athens, Georgia, since 1994. Although it took a few years to 

get him back to Georgia, we are proud he has been leading research in this area that is so crucial to my state’s economy for the 

past two decades. 

Dr. Swayne’s personal research has focused largely on the control 

of avian influenza in poultry. He has served on the World Organization for Animal Health, Committee on the Terrestrial Animal 

Health Code, and he currently serves as the Chair of the United 

Nations Food and Agricultural Organization. 

In addition to his Ph.D. from the University of Georgia, Dr. 

Swayne holds a Doctorate of Veterinary Medicine from the University of Missouri and is a board certified specialist in veterinary pathology. 

On a personal note, Dr. Swayne knows the devastating impact of 

HPAI and Georgians’ concerns about what could happen if poultry 

stock was exposed in our state to this devastating strain of bird flu. 

He has worked closely with people in the state to make sure information about biosecurity best practices is made available. 

Dr. Swayne, thank you for being here. Welcome. I certainly appreciate your insights on this important issue and we all look forward to your testimony. Thank you. 

Chairman ROBERTS. I thank the Senator. 

Dr. Clifford, would you please address the committee. 

STATEMENT OF JOHN R. CLIFFORD, D.V.M., DEPUTY ADMINISTRATOR, ANIMAL AND PLANT HEALTH INSPECTION SERVICE, AND CHIEF VETERINARY OFFICER, U.S. DEPARTMENT 

OF AGRICULTURE, WASHINGTON, DC 

Dr. CLIFFORD. Thank you, Mr. Chairman, and I am sorry I cannot do anything about what conference Missouri is in. I liked it better, personally, when it was the Big Eight. 

[Laughter.] 

Chairman ROBERTS. We share the same view. 

[Laughter.] 

Dr. CLIFFORD. Thank you again, Mr. Chairman and members of 

the committee, and thank you for the opportunity to testify before 

you today on behalf of the United States Department of Agriculture. 

In recent weeks, the number of new detections of highly pathogenic avian influenza found at U.S. poultry farms has slowed considerably. In fact, it has been over two weeks since we found a case 

in Iowa, and probably approaching three weeks and approaching 

four weeks, if not there, for—already over four weeks, I believe, 

since we found the last case in Minnesota. So, these are bright 

spots in the largest animal health emergency in our country’s history. 

While encouraging developments, the impact of this unprecedented disease outbreak is still being felt throughout our industries. Trading partners have restricted U.S. poultry exports. The 

risk of the disease reemerging in the fall or spring is significant. 

Our hearts go out to the affected producers, their employees, and 

the communities they live and support. I assure you that this disVerDate Nov 24 2008 08:33 May 10, 2016 Jkt 000000 PO 00000 Frm 00008 Fmt 6633 Sfmt 6633 C:\USERS\MW42035\DESKTOP\DOCS\96181.TXT MICAH
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ease has the USDA’s fullest attention and we are committing to 

standing with our producers and industry to get them back on their 

feet. 

The Secretary of Agriculture is leading efforts to respond to this 

virus, assist producers, and maintain trade markets. As we look to 

the fall, we will be ready for the challenge. 

More than 400 USDA staff and over 2,000 USDA contracted personnel have been working around the clock in every affected state 

on this response. We have delivered over $180 million in indemnification payments to producers to control the spread of the disease and to help them recover. All told, USDA has committed over 

$500 million, an amount more than half of APHIS’s yearly budget, 

in responding aggressively to this outbreak. We can and will request additional funds, should we need to. 

We have carefully studied and assessed the epidemiology of the 

virus as well as our response efforts in conjunction with our state 

and industry partners. We know that while birds brought this disease to the Western U.S. in late 2014, as the birds and virus moved 

into the Midwest, we saw point source introductions as well as 

farm-to-farm spread of the virus. 

Although we cannot point to a single specific practice that caused 

this, our epidemiological reports suggest that lapses in biosecurity 

were a contributing factor. We have talked at length with the state 

and industry partners about our findings and the need for all of us 

to think more comprehensively about on-farm biosecurity. 

We all agree we are in this fight together. We have a shared interest in eradicating this disease and getting the poultry industry 

back on its feet. Last week, we met with the industry and state officials to ensure that we have a high level of preparedness to deal 

with the reemergence and possible spread of the virus come fall. 

We have encouraged our partners to review the existing Avian Influenza Response Plan so that they understand what we will expect 

and what actions we will need them to take should the disease 

strike. 

We are also urging states and industry to develop site and country-level specific depopulation plans for landfilling or composting 

birds. Our experience in the Midwest showed us the biggest roadblock to efficient depopulation is the lack of ready sites to receive 

and process dead birds. 

For our part, we are taking proactive steps to be ready for the 

fall. We are identifying staffing needs and hiring more than 450 

additional temporary employees, including 210 animal health technicians and 90 veterinary medical officers. We are also developing 

a potential vaccine strategy. Should we decide to use vaccines to 

address the outbreak, we will have the systems in place to do so. 

As part of our planning, we are also working with our partners to 

increase surveillance of wild bird populations. We need to be able 

to identify the virus as present as quickly as possible to stamp it 

out. 

Later this month, we will be meeting directly with state veterinarians and industry to discuss the need for more biosecurity. The 

meeting in Des Moines will help ensure that our collective biosecurity is more stringent and that we are prepared as we again prepare for the fall. 

6 

I want to thank all of our partners in the industry and the states 

for their cooperation in this process. Their efforts and willingness 

to work with us are appreciated and will help us as we plan for 

the fall. 

Mr. Chairman, this concludes my testimony. 

[The prepared statement of Dr. Clifford can be found on page 52 

in the appendix.] 

Chairman ROBERTS. Well, Dr. Clifford, thank you so much. You 

are right on time. 

We turn now to Dr. Swayne. 

STATEMENT OF DAVID SWAYNE, D.V.M., LABORATORY DIRECTOR, SOUTHEAST POULTRY RESEARCH LABORATORY, AGRICULTURAL RESEARCH SERVICE, U.S. DEPARTMENT OF AGRICULTURE, ATHENS, GEORGIA 

Dr. SWAYNE. Chairman Roberts, Ranking Member Stabenow, and 

members of the committee, I am the Laboratory Director of the 

Southeast Poultry Research Laboratory, which is part of the Agricultural Research Service’s U.S. National Poultry Research Center 

in Athens, Georgia. ARS is committed to eradicating the HPAI 

virus at the center of the current North American outbreak 

through providing cutting-edge research and diagnostics, molecular 

epidemiology, pathology, and vaccinology. 

In response to the first detections of HPAI in the United States, 

ARS refocused its HPAI research program to the most imminent 

research needs. Within weeks, a rapid molecular test was developed to detect the Asian H5 HPAI virus, which quickly differentiated it from the North American low path AI viruses. This test 

was transferred to the National Vet Services Laboratory of APHIS 

and is the core test in the diagnostic effort to rapidly identify vaccinated flocks. 

We conducted studies to understand how the early HPAI viruses 

infected and caused disease in birds. In chickens and turkeys, highexposure doses were needed to produce infections, and bird-to-bird 

contact transmission was inefficient. But all infected chickens and 

turkeys became ill and died. By contrast, domestic ducks and mallards became infected with low doses of virus and had more efficient contact transmission, but they did not become ill or die. 

Subsequent experiments using later Midwest HPAI viruses required less virus to infect chickens and contact transmission occurred more easily, this indicating the later HPAI viruses had 

changed and were more easily transmitted to and among chickens 

and turkeys. 

In extending the laboratory data to the field situation, ARS researchers teamed up with APHIS virologists and epidemiologists as 

well as field and university poultry veterinarians by providing 

them with genetic analysis of HPAI viruses in order to focus the 

epidemiologic investigations. Genetic analysis supported a point 

source introduction from infected waterfowl to poultry in the Pacific flyway and the early cases in the Midwest area. However, the 

later Midwest viruses showed evidence of common source introduction for outbreaks supporting farm-to-farm spread. 

In the United States, there is no vaccine approved or currently 

in use in commercial poultry for high path AI. While some nations 

7 

have attempted to utilize vaccine to protect poultry against H5N1 

HPAI virus, a primary focus on vaccination for control has not led 

to immediate eradication. Ninety-nine percent of the HPAI vaccine 

has been used in China, Egypt, Vietnam, and Indonesia, where 

H5N1 HPAI is endemic. In these countries, prolonged vaccination 

use has been associated with vaccine failure and emergence of vaccine resistance, necessitating continued surveillance for vaccine-resistant strains and periodic change of the vaccine seed strain to 

more closely match the circulating HPAI field viruses. 

In support of APHIS, ARS conducts HPAI vaccine seed strain development and testing as a routine research activity, but it does 

not manufacture vaccines nor decide when or if vaccines should be 

used in the field. The licensing and use of vaccine is determined 

by APHIS. Currently, ARS has developed a new vaccine seed strain 

for inactivated vaccines and is conducting protection studies in 

chickens and turkeys. If viable, the vaccine seed strain will be 

transferred to a commercial vaccine manufacturer. In addition, 

ARS is evaluating registered AI vaccines for protection in chickens 

and turkeys against current outbreak viruses. 

Vaccination can play a helpful role in disease eradication if properly implemented, but globally, vaccination has negatively impacted poultry exports, which is a crucial part of the U.S. poultry 

industry. Efforts to mitigate the effect of vaccination on exports include identifying infected poultry within vaccinated populations 

through reliable and cost effective serological and virological testing. Such a strategy is often termed DIVA testing, development 

and validation of DIVA vaccination strategies is a research priority. 

In conclusion, the current HPAI outbreak presents unique and 

unprecedented challenges to the U.S. poultry industry and ARS 

and collaborators immediately shifted their research programs to 

high-priority areas: One, infectivity and transmission studies in 

poultry and wild birds; two, rapid diagnostic test development for 

detecting Asian H5 HPAI virus; three, molecular epidemiologic 

studies on virus spread; and four, development of efficacious vaccines and an effective vaccination strategy. 

Thank you again for the opportunity to testify and for Congressional support as we continue to fight this virus. 

[The prepared statement of Dr. Swayne can be found on page 87 

in the appendix.] 

Chairman ROBERTS. Well, thank you both, again, for taking the 

time to join us today. We appreciate you sharing your expertise 

and your firsthand experience managing this outbreak. 

For both of you, please describe as quickly as you can, but also 

be thorough, which I know you will, some of the protocols that are 

in place to ensure the safety of the food supply and public health. 

We will start with you, Dr. Clifford. 

Dr. CLIFFORD. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. With regards to highly 

pathogenic avian influenza, this virus, because it kills birds, and 

then the way we eradicate this virus, none of these birds go to 

slaughter, and if they did go to slaughter, they would be condemned at slaughter because of the virus itself and the destruction 

this virus causes in the bird itself. So, it would never—this virus 

would not be entering the food supply. 

8 

Having said that, the virus itself does not cause any particular 

concern at this time to the Centers for Disease Control and Health 

and Human Services. We monitor that very, very closely with 

them. We provide the virus sequences to CDC on an ongoing basis. 

We do that as active surveillance continually, not just in this occurrence, but in other occurrences. We follow these viruses. As Dr. 

Swayne indicated, we also monitor the wild bird surveillance. We 

also have swine surveillance in this country that we also monitor 

so that we can be proactively protecting public health as well as 

animal health. 

Chairman ROBERTS. Dr. Swayne, anything you would like to add, 

sir? 

Dr. SWAYNE. I think it was adequately covered. 

Chairman ROBERTS. Dr. Swayne, outside of the current research 

being done on the two circulating strains of HPAI H5N2 and 

H5N8, what additional research do you think is needed in order for 

the industry and government to combat this virus? 

Dr. SWAYNE. Research on vaccines is an important part of control 

programs globally, and our lab as well as other labs in the U.S. 

have done work to help other countries, such as Egypt, Indonesia, 

Vietnam, in combating their own problems with high path AI, and 

our neighbor to the south, Mexico. Additional work on H7N3, which 

is a big threat in Mexico, is needed, and it is always a concern for 

us here in the United States that that virus could move north 

across the border. 

Chairman ROBERTS. Dr. Clifford, avian influenza has left many 

wondering about the vulnerabilities that may exist within our national animal health protection infrastructure. Foreign animal disease threats, such as foot and mouth disease, could have widespread impacts. So, let us look forward. What additional steps 

could be taken to ensure we are ready to manage a disease like foot 

and mouth, should it appear in the U.S.? 

Dr. CLIFFORD. Well, there are actually several things on that 

front. Let me first by saying we need to have adequate personnel 

to be able to address these issues. Since the beginning of sequestration, APHIS has lost about $430 million and about 800 positions. 

Of that, within Veterinary Services alone, to date, we have lost 

$36 million and 225 positions. But, at the beginning of this, we had 

lost initially $54 million and 250 positions. With the high path AI 

situation that we are faced with, we have limited field support. I 

have a total of about 1,800 people in my organization to respond 

and to prepare. 

With regards to foot and mouth disease—with all of these diseases, it is a shared effort and it has to be a shared effort between 

the industry and the states and the federal government. With regards to things like foot and mouth disease—and I would like to 

even address this, if I could, and take a moment to expand it to 

high path AI and other diseases—we in the world, worldwide and 

internationally, have to stop eradicating diseases through the total 

destruction of animals and depopulation of animals. 

We need to find new ways to save animals and that protein for 

their families, for the owners, for the companies, for trade, for a lot 

of reasons, economics, and it is also a waste of protein. The only 

way we can do that is to put new tools in our toolbox and to effecVerDate Nov 24 2008 08:33 May 10, 2016 Jkt 000000 PO 00000 Frm 00012 Fmt 6633 Sfmt 6633 C:\USERS\MW42035\DESKTOP\DOCS\96181.TXT MICAH
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tively develop new strains of vaccine or other types of treatment to 

be able to address these issues. 

In the case of foot and mouth disease, we need an appropriate 

level of vaccine bank. Our previous vaccine bank was based upon 

an eradication, go in and kill, approach. It was not based upon a 

vaccine to live or a vaccine to kill approach. Besides the resource 

needs, we would need adequate levels of vaccine. The National Veterinary Stockpile, which, when it was started quite a few years 

ago, the idea was for it to have $20 million to help support these 

efforts. It is funded, I believe, to date, at $4 million for the National Veterinary Stockpile. 

The same way with high path AI. We have got to find out better 

ways and better tools to control this disease. We have got to have 

facilities—and I do not have a problem with integrated facilities or 

outdoor birds. This virus does not care which way it is. But, if we 

are building facilities, we have to build facilities that will protect 

one house from another house, so if you get the disease in one 

house, we can destroy 100,000 birds, not three million. 

Chairman ROBERTS. I thank you, Dr. Clifford. 

Dr. Swayne, would you like to add anything, with apologies to 

my colleagues for going overtime. 

Dr. SWAYNE. I think the issue for us is the same as APHIS, is 

that our funding level has required us to reduce staffing over the 

last 12 years from 35 staff members who worked full time on avian 

influenza down to 20, and so with immediate research response in 

an outbreak like that, we have a limited number of staff and also 

aging facilities. We appreciate the Senate obligating in fiscal year 2014 $45 million, which is to be used to upgrade some of our existing facilities, 

and there is a request in the budget for 2016 for the final piece of 

that budget, $113 million, the final upgrade of all facilities, and 

that is needed for us to be able to respond quickly and carry on 

the experiments we need to do to support the poultry industry. 

Our handicap in the size of our facilities and the aging facilities 

has restricted the type of studies we can do. So, for example, we 

cannot do studies in 12-week-old turkeys or older, which are a critical part of the outbreaks in both Minnesota and Iowa. 

Chairman ROBERTS. Thank you, gentlemen. 

Senator Stabenow. 

Senator STABENOW. Well, thank you very much, Mr. Chairman. 

Just along the size of what you just indicated, the ongoing concern that I have in a number of fronts is that we are penny-wise 

and pound-foolish as we look at various things, where we need to 

be getting ahead of it in terms of prevention, and we wait until we 

are in this crisis and do not have the tools, Dr. Clifford, as you 

were talking about, to make sure we are saving as many birds as 

possible or getting ahead of this. 

That is an ongoing concern that I have in general about the way 

we are budgeting and lack of really strategically thinking things 

through in terms of what is a smart way to provide funding. 

Specifically on the avian influenza, when we look at the fact that 

this popped up very quickly in the spring in the Mississippi flyway, 

and when we are talking about how quickly you had to move—and 

again, congratulations to everyone working as a team to respond to 

10 

this crisis—when you look going forward, what are the lessons you 

learned from the spring in terms of being effective, timely mitigation, and when you look going forward from here, what do you 

think in terms of a government response has positioned you for a 

potentially difficult fall? 

So, what have you learned to this point? What does it mean in 

terms of responding going on into the fall? 

Dr. CLIFFORD. So, I will hit a couple of those areas. I think, initially, our response, while we were onsite rapidly, it is key to put 

birds down quickly, and in some cases, there were delays in doing 

that for a multitude of reasons. We have got to not allow that to 

occur, because the longer birds live, the more virus production and, 

therefore, the more likelihood of more environmental contamination, more spread. So, that is one lesson learned. 

Now, we rapidly caught up to that after a while in Minnesota 

and were able to get the turkeys down pretty quickly after we 

caught up, got the kind of crews available, but there are other 

issues here that need to be through the planning process. I mentioned in my testimony about disposal. We had to go for quite some 

time—in fact, we had to initiate and call in Secretary Vilsack and 

the Governor of Iowa to address issues of landfill use in the State 

of Iowa while the state itself had already preplanned and had some 

of these things lined up. 

But when it comes to the actual outbreak, people get concerned. 

There are perceptions about these types of things, and they are 

concerned about their own livelihood and the way it is going to be 

viewed by others. It is the same way as a brand name. It was hard 

to break down some of those barriers initially. 

In addition, we have got to find a better way to get these birds 

euthanized properly, killed properly, humanely, but in these larger 

facilities, we have got to do it in a more timely way, and we are 

having some more of the discussions around that particular topic, 

as well. We are going to be meeting—a group of veterinarians will 

be meeting with the AVMA this coming weekend in Boston to discuss some of those strategies and to get the support of the American Veterinary Medical Association for some of that. 

Senator STABENOW. Thank you. 

Dr. Swayne, did you want to respond to that, as well? 

Dr. SWAYNE. Yes, just briefly. I think for us and our lab, we will 

be concentrating on a couple of things as research between now 

and the fall. One is assisting APHIS in some of the epidemiologic 

studies to try to identify risk factors that may be associated with 

movement of these viruses onto farms, and hopefully through that 

process, that will help the companies and the farmers to reestablish their biosecurity strategies to reduce any potential entry of 

that virus back into the farms. 

Also, we will be spending the next several months concentrating 

most of our laboratory research efforts on vaccines, but also vaccination protocols and how realistic they could be for use in the 

fall. 

Then we will be working closely with colleagues on the wildlife 

health side in identifying the viruses that might be in wild waterfowl and determining if they are more adapted to waterfowl or if 

11 

they are similar to the Midwest poultry adapted viruses, and that 

will determine the strategy for prevention in the fall. 

Senator STABENOW. Thank you. 

Finally, just very quickly, Dr. Clifford, because this is a team effort between the public and the private sector, just wondering, 

when you think about potential cases or suggestions or concerns, 

how does that go from farm to the offices at APHIS? 

Dr. CLIFFORD. Well, it is about communication and working together. So, I think in this particular outbreak situation, we had 

some issues initially, in the beginning of this, and we continued to 

improve communication until right now, it is really about working 

very closely with the industry and the states. We have held a meeting with the industry and states about a week ago to bring together—we brought together about 90 people. 

I had an international meeting held in Baltimore, or we did, to 

talk about the actions the U.S. were taking, talking about what 

other actions the other countries were taking and how to collaborate and address some of these issues, such as the use of vaccines. 

So, we began some of those discussions there with the industry, 

states, and other countries. So, we are hearing the concerns from 

the industry and we will be incorporating those into our action 

plans for the fall. 

Senator STABENOW. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. 

Chairman ROBERTS. Senator Perdue. 

Senator PERDUE. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. 

I really appreciate you guys being here. This is a critical thing 

for my state, as it is a lot of states right now. The Midwest has 

already seen major difficulties, obviously, and poultry producers 

nationwide are scrambling for answers and for help. 

Dr. Clifford, as you said in your testimony, people have lost their 

jobs and seen their livelihoods put in grave danger by this outbreak. You are exactly right. Georgians are fearful right now about 

what could happen to them in this next flyway season. I applaud 

the timely and coordinated efforts of USDA and Georgia agricultural officials as well as the University of Georgia scientists, but 

Georgians still eye the fall migration season warily, wondering 

what they can do to protect themselves. 

But, Dr. Swayne, as we look at this flyway season that is upcoming, I am searching to see what might be different. We had a question about best practices and what we learn, but I am also concerned about the strain of this influenza. You have successfully determined the strain, I think, that is causing the current outbreak. 

Do you see an evolution of this disease that is causing you concern 

right now about the upcoming season and next year, and is there 

a point at which the biosecurity best practices today will not be 

enough to contain future AI infections? 

Dr. SWAYNE. Those are excellent questions, and as scientists, we 

do not have all the answers. But, we do have a body of research 

data, some generated by the University of Georgia, on wild bird 

ecology with influenza viruses, and I know that that particular 

group, the Southeast Cooperative Wildlife Disease Study, is specifically working on trying to identify the viruses that might come 

back in the migration in the fall. That impacts not only Georgia, 

but all the Southeast and the Atlantic Coast flyways. 

12 

That would be the first step, is the identification of the potential 

virus in those flyways, and from that, the information should be 

disseminated out through the poultry industries to tell the farmers 

that we do have a higher risk situation and they should reevaluate 

their biosecurity practices. 

That being said, the biosecurity practices sometimes are difficult 

to do, but they take deliberateness in making sure that they are 

practiced to the highest level and that any weak points that could 

be identified before such an event and be corrected will help the 

industry keep the virus out if it does occur in wild birds in the Atlantic flyway. 

Senator PERDUE. Do we have any information from the Midwest 

in this latest outbreak about bird-to-bird infection versus human 

transfer and the communicable dimension of that? Do we have any 

information yet on that, either one of you? 

Dr. SWAYNE. I think we understand the basic principles of the 

epidemiology, and Dr. Clifford had in his written testimony listed 

that environmental contamination is probably the biggest issue 

that allows the virus to move around. That may have been initially 

in the Pacific flyway from wild birds contaminating the environment and that tracked in potentially around farms where birds 

may have been there eating residual feed that was spilled or having ponds too close to houses, that it made it easier to be tracked 

in. 

After the virus adapted in parts of the Midwest, then that contamination was in the barns and then more likely to have the 

tracking between barns by human activity—not that humans are 

affected, because they are not infected, but they can carry it on 

shoes, clothes, hands, and equipment that might be shared between 

farms. 

That is the challenge for all farmers, is to look at their comprehensive biosecurity plan, identify the weak points, and then 

take measures to prevent introduction, such as a better cleaning 

and disinfection program for maybe shared equipment, like manure 

spreaders or tractors, et cetera. 

Senator PERDUE. Thank you. 

Dr. Clifford, very quickly, I am concerned about trade, as well, 

and the possible vaccination. Aside from the difficulties of 

inoculating a flock from the practical standpoint, do we have any 

evidence right now that our trading partners will really put a quiet 

stop to any export? I mean, broilers—in the State of Georgia, I 

think we are the largest producer of broilers, but I am really concerned about the—we also—that is our largest export, and I am 

very concerned about our ability to actually trade in this protein. 

Dr. CLIFFORD. We, in May, when I was at the World Organization for Animal Health, discussed this with a number of our trading partners, and three or four of our trading partners indicated 

that they would definitely shut us off, the entire country, initially, 

until they had a chance to review the actions we were taking, why 

we were taking them, and what our plans—exit strategy for the 

use of vaccine was. So—— 

Senator PERDUE. Was that independent of inoculation? 

Dr. CLIFFORD. That was independent, yes. I mean, that was if 

you use it, period. Now, one of the reasons for that is because 

13 

worldwide, people look at the use of vaccine at times as the inability to control the spread of the disease. At the international meeting that we had, we pleaded with the countries to basically—we, 

as all countries internationally, need to allow all tools to be used 

in the toolbox, but that means use them appropriately for that 

task. 

So, our plans are—is to lay out the strategy for use, if we decide 

to use it. We will be meeting with our major trading partners, 

showing them that, and then seeing how they react to it before we 

make any final decisions. 

Senator PERDUE. Thank you. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. 

Chairman ROBERTS. Senator Klobuchar. 

Senator KLOBUCHAR. Thank you very much, Mr. Chairman, and 

thank you for holding this important hearing. As you probably 

know, Minnesota has the greatest number of turkeys produced in 

the country, and as a result, we were actually the hardest hit for 

turkeys, although I know Iowa was hard hit for laying hens and 

others. 

But, we are the hardest hit for turkeys and it is really—I have 

met with these producers, and as you know, Dr. Clifford, from visiting our state, it is not only an economic issue, it is an emotional 

issue for people that have really devoted their lives to this business 

and then suddenly to lose, really, their livelihood for a period of 

time, but also animals that they have been raising and it was really a difficult thing. 

So, some of the first farms affected by avian influenza in Minnesota have recently begun the process of restocking the barns 

with turkeys. It is great news. But cleaning and disinfecting, environmental sampling and a 21-day idling period before restocking 

can feel like an eternity to producers who have lost birds. I have 

heard from a few producers in Minnesota about the criteria for repopulating their flocks. 

Dr. Clifford, as more farms become ready for restocking, is USDA 

equipped to process the necessary paperwork in a timely fashion in 

order to get these farmers back in production, and can you provide 

an update on the USDA’s efforts to develop and communicate a 

consistent disinfection and repopulation timeline for producers. 

Dr. CLIFFORD. So, there are two things here that slow this process down. There is when we go in to depopulate a flock, which we 

have speeded up that process based on a presumptive positive, not 

based on a confirmed positive, and we immediately do an assessment of the number of birds present on that farm. 

Senator KLOBUCHAR. Right. 

Dr. CLIFFORD. Then they have to do a flock plan which they have 

to sign. As far as the flock plan, once that is signed, indemnity is 

paid. 

The cleaning and disinfection component—in the turkey situation, we are usually composting in-house, which is the litter and 

the turkeys and the birds are composted in-house. The house is 

then cleaned and disinfected after the compost period, which is 

about 14 to 21 days now, and we have adjusted that down. 

Senator KLOBUCHAR. Yes. 

Dr. CLIFFORD. So, once that is done and removed, the house is 

cleaned and disinfected, they start a 21-day countdown. TwentyVerDate Nov 24 2008 08:33 May 10, 2016 Jkt 000000 PO 00000 Frm 00017 Fmt 6633 Sfmt 6633 C:\USERS\MW42035\DESKTOP\DOCS\96181.TXT MICAH
14 

one days from that point of cleaning and disinfection, we go in and 

sample—— 

Senator KLOBUCHAR. Okay. So, you think you are ready to process, because in our state alone, we have had 108 farms that have 

had to destroy their birds, so—— 

Dr. CLIFFORD. Yes. 

Senator KLOBUCHAR. Okay. The virus has impacted many different types of farms with varying repopulation timelines. For example, egg-producing farms proceed on a much longer timeline 

than that of broiler or turkey farms. What steps has the USDA 

taken to ensure that the indemnity formula is providing all types 

of producers affected a fair market value for their losses? 

Dr. CLIFFORD. All right. So, we have redone the calculator at the 

request of the egg industry, because they wanted us to go from 80- 

week production to 90-week production. We have done that. We 

have also—trying to update all the data. We are currently in the 

final steps of doing that and we will be reimbursing producers the 

difference between the new calculator and the old calculation. 

There is, though, a request for egg producers by the industry to 

pay producers for their actual downtime because of the length of 

time it takes to repopulate these facilities in an egg-laying situation. They have to stage these birds. They cannot fill every 

house—— 

Senator KLOBUCHAR. Right. 

Dr. CLIFFORD. —immediately. So, it takes probably 18 months or 

longer to repopulate these facilities. That question still remains. 

The Secretary has the authority to do that and we are still evaluating that internally. 

Senator KLOBUCHAR. Okay. So, we will continue to work on that. 

I just hope we can come up with a pragmatic solution. 

Last, while this outbreak of avian influenza does not pose any 

threat to human health, which we make very clear to people all the 

time, it is hurting poultry producers and costing consumers more 

money in the grocery store. We all know that. In the 2014 farm 

bill, before this happened, I actually worked to include a provision 

requiring a feasibility study for ensuring turkey and chicken producers against catastrophic losses. I understand that that report is 

due to be released later this year. Do you have any updates on the 

time frame for when we can expect a final report? 

Dr. CLIFFORD. I do not think so, Senator. 

Senator KLOBUCHAR. Okay. 

Dr. CLIFFORD. We will have to get back to you on that, but we 

will. 

Senator KLOBUCHAR. Okay. You know, what I was trying to do 

when we did that provision before we even knew about this—— 

Dr. CLIFFORD. Yeah. 

Senator KLOBUCHAR. —was try to build in some program that 

would work. Again, I share Chairman Roberts’ view that you have 

been—the USDA and Secretary Vilsack have been incredibly responsive to our calls and requests about this, so this is in no way 

critical of the treatment and we really appreciate what you have 

done. But, I am just trying to look at if there is something we could 

do for the long term that would work better. 

15 

Dr. CLIFFORD. You know, I think insurance-type policies have 

been looked at in the past for other animal health issues. I realize 

it is difficult. Most of the time, they are very expensive. 

Senator KLOBUCHAR. Yes. 

Dr. CLIFFORD. So, if we could have something like that, it would 

be good for the industry itself to help protect them and their livelihood. 

Senator KLOBUCHAR. Thank you very much, Dr. Clifford. 

Dr. CLIFFORD. Thank you. 

Chairman ROBERTS. Senator Ernst. 

Senator ERNST. Thank you, Mr. Chair, thank you, Ranking Member, for holding this very important hearing today. 

This has had a horrible, horrible impact on Iowans, and Dr. 

Clifford, I know you have been extremely involved in Iowa. Thanks 

for sending Dr. Shere to us. We appreciate that very much. 

I can tell you, it has been trying for everybody—our producers, 

our growers, their families, their employees, everyone. We have 

fielded a number of calls in our offices, between the good senior 

Senator from Iowa and myself, and many of these impacted farmers have told me that just the process of gaining approval for the 

depopulation, the disposal, repopulating, and the indemnification 

has really been very complicated. It has been so frustrating for 

them, very slow. I know you have been working with that. Could 

you explain some of the processes that you have now put in place 

just to make that red tape a little less red for some of our producers in the State of Iowa? 

Dr. CLIFFORD. So, we are trying to provide personnel to assist in 

the actual agreements, what we call compliance agreements for 

cleaning and disinfection. Part of the issue is, it is really negotiating with each producer. They have a choice. We can do the cleaning and disinfection, which we pay contractors and others to do 

that. Or, they can do it themselves. The benefit of them doing it 

themselves, frankly, is to help their own employees, who are out 

of work now, to have work and some pay, and I understand that. 

But, it is also agreeing upon the cost of that. 

We are looking at different things for the future. I do not know 

that we can come up with it, but something like a per house cost 

basis that is fair, equitable for some of these facilities, because in 

the layer industry, it is extremely costly and a long period of time 

to be able to address this issue. So, we are trying to break down 

some of those things, and right now, what we are trying to do is 

provide the expertise to them individually to work through these 

things faster. 

Senator ERNST. We cannot go back and make it any faster in the 

past, but moving forward, is there a guide or an SOP, standard operating procedures, that APHIS can put out in a little pamphlet or 

just an easy way for our folks to know where to go, who to talk 

to? 

Dr. CLIFFORD. Senator, that is exactly what we want to do. In addition, the other things we want to do is assign a person to each 

flock that is affected, or each facility that is affected, that can basically be that go-to person for the entire length of time for that outbreak and its impact on that flock, so they have got one person to 

16 

communicate, and then that person would communicate back with 

us and it would make their lives a lot simpler and easier. 

Senator ERNST. I think that would be a great step going forward. 

Given the epidemiological study that showed wind was maybe a 

likely contributor towards the spread or the transmission of the 

disease, or the virus, is it possible that delays in the response time 

from APHIS contributed to the transmission of the disease across 

Iowa? 

Just to set the stage, I had a producer that I visited with over 

the phone and it took nine days from the time she had called 

USDA until the time that they actually responded. In that nine 

days, 90 percent of her flock was gone, and in the meantime, we 

could have wind transmitting, we could have human transmission. 

Do you think that delay might have contributed to some of the outbreaks that we saw in Iowa? 

Dr. CLIFFORD. Let me answer that this way, and I am not evading the question. Any delay in putting birds down puts more virus 

into the environment. So, the more virus in the environment, the 

more likelihood of spread for everyone. It does not matter whether 

it is a contractor or an APHIS employee, a state employee, or the 

producers themselves or their employees. It increases the level of 

risk. So, we all collectively need to go forward and work to quickly 

do these things. We totally agree it is too long. 

But, one of the things we have to address that we are going to 

need the support of a lot of people on is how we put these birds 

down in the future, because we cannot go in and remove—you can 

only take out about 100,000-plus birds a day out of one house and 

CO2 those. If that house—if you have got three million birds on 

that facility, you are talking huge numbers of personnel, huge 

numbers of work. 

The people themselves—and I am sorry I am going over, but the 

people themselves that come out of those houses, they can only 

work in there for about 30 minutes because of the heat. They have 

to come out. They have to rehydrate. The Tyvek clothing and 

things fill up huge amounts of biobags—huge amounts—because 

they are going in, they come out and rest for about ten minutes, 

they have to re-put the clothing back on, go in for another 30 minutes. 

It is—this is huge. You are talking about manure and birds and 

product that can be literally miles long and four or five feet wide 

and six or eight feet tall. It is—this is not an easy task. Some of 

these pits underneath some of the layer houses have not been—the 

manure has not been removed out of there for years and it is massive. 

Senator ERNST. Thank you. I appreciate it, Dr. Clifford. Thank 

you very much Mr. Chairman. 

Chairman ROBERTS. Senator Brown. 

Senator BROWN. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. 

Dr. Swayne, thank you for joining us. Thank you for your service 

at one of the largest universities in America at Ohio State a couple 

of decades ago. I hope Congress will provide your lab with the necessary funding to do the research and product development that is 

necessary to protect our nation’s agriculture. 

17 

My question is this. It is my understanding that this strain of 

avian flu is not currently transmissible to humans, as you have 

said. However, there is some risk, if it were to become prevalent 

in the swine population, it could mix and do a strain that is potentially dangerous to human health. As we know, the concerns with 

swine flu affecting vulnerable human populations. What is ARS’s 

plan to ensure that every measure is taken to avoid such a crossover? 

Dr. SWAYNE. I think there are two issues that are ongoing. One 

is that ARS is conducting experiments in swine, looking at are 

these viruses infectious for swine. The second, which Dr. Clifford 

has already mentioned, that there is surveillance going on in the 

native swine populations, our production farms, to try to look for 

this particular virus. 

Just like with the human side, where this virus has not been infectious for humans and has an extremely low risk, as CDC has 

said, also, if we look at the parent viruses that it came from, the 

H5N1 in Asia, there were just a few cases of swine infections in 

Asia initially. That is back in 2004, 2005. Since that time, it has 

been very difficult to find that virus in swine, so that the virus has 

not gone into swine. That is, hopefully, to our advantage that it has 

not done this before and we hope that it will also, based upon history, not do it in the future. 

But, the surveillance and the research are the two issues that 

will help us resolve that question. 

Senator BROWN. Thank you. 

Dr. Clifford, you mentioned in your testimony that migratory 

bird flyways are closely connected to the spread of this strain of 

avian flu. What are USDA’s plans to prepare other areas of the 

country, particularly Great Lakes states, for the fall migrations? 

Dr. CLIFFORD. So, our plans are comprehensive for all 50 states. 

In fact, what we are planning is a worst-case scenario that every 

major poultry producing state in this country for layers, broilers, 

and turkeys could be affected. So, that is 20 states, and we are estimating 500 cases. Now, that is a worst-case scenario, and do we 

think that will happen? We pray not, and I do not think that it will 

because I believe we are taking actions and the industry will take 

actions to try to beef up our biosecurity for this. 

We are also doing wild bird surveillance. We have been doing 

wild bird surveillance for a long time, since the beginning of the 

H5N1 in Asia that Dr. Swayne just mentioned. We had higher levels of that sampling in wild birds. We took it down to an appropriate level because of what we felt the level of risk. Now, we are 

increasing that, and we have increased it since December of 2014. 

We started increasing the sampling. So, we will be looking at all 

four flyways in the sampling of that. 

If I may just take a moment to explain something. This is unusual because this—for the first time have we had a high path 

avian influenza virus to cross from Europe and Asia into North 

America, the first time ever. The significance of that is this. The 

H5N1 that this came from originally in Asia is the parent to the 

H5N8 that has adapted itself to wild waterfowl. If you all would 

go back and look at the concerns at the time, it was concern that 

this would be the next human pandemic. We put some money toVerDate Nov 24 2008 08:33 May 10, 2016 Jkt 000000 PO 00000 Frm 00021 Fmt 6633 Sfmt 6633 C:\USERS\MW42035\DESKTOP\DOCS\96181.TXT MICAH
18 

ward trying to address H5N1 in Asia, but we did not put enough. 

If the world had put more money toward that effort and addressed 

these diseases in the animals at the time, we would not have this 

situation today, because that—what occurred in 1997 was the original finding of that virus in China—has caused this outbreak today. 

Senator BROWN. So, kind of playing along with that, what is 

USDA doing to ensure that states have adequate animal health infrastructure to be able to respond to major outbreaks? Are we doing 

enough investment in the states to do that? 

Dr. CLIFFORD. You would have to address that on a state-by-state 

basis, but I know that a lot of our state animal health officials feel 

like that they have lost key parts of their infrastructure and their 

ability to respond. I do not think that is the case of all states, but 

I know it is the case in—— 

Senator BROWN. How about from the federal level, from USDA? 

Dr. CLIFFORD. We try to help ourselves, but when we are cutting 

back ourselves, it is more difficult. As I indicated, we have lost 

quite a bit of resources ourselves, so that impacts the states, as 

well. 

Senator BROWN. So, similar to our investment in everything from 

NIH and CDC on human health, public health infrastructure, we 

are under-investing on the state and federal level as we are apparently in animal health infrastructure—— 

Dr. CLIFFORD. Yes—— 

Senator BROWN. —true statement? 

Dr. CLIFFORD. That is what I—I would say yes. 

Senator BROWN. Okay. Same old story. Thanks. 

Chairman ROBERTS. Senator Grassley. 

STATEMENT OF HON. CHARLES GRASSLEY, U.S. SENATOR 

FROM THE STATE OF IOWA 

Senator GRASSLEY. Mr. Chairman, first of all, I would like to put 

a statement in the record, opening statement. 

[The prepared statement of Senator Grassley can be found on 

page 47 in the appendix.] 

Senator GRASSLEY. I know that you folks are hit with a big problem that we only appreciate from the standpoint of what our constituents tell us, and I also appreciate a couple briefings we have 

had from people, including the Secretary of Agriculture, on this 

issue. So, pass our thanks on to all your staff who have been helping with that. 

I want to ask Dr. Clifford about the dissemination of information 

from USDA to contractors and farmers. I have heard concerns from 

farmers that they were getting different answers or conflicting answers from contractors and officials during the crisis. So, simply, 

could you walk us through the process that is used to get information out from APHIS to the farmers who were affected during this 

crisis of avian flu. 

Dr. CLIFFORD. So, Senator, I know early on, we have had issues 

of communication, and I think one of the things that we have been 

doing is to, as I indicated in our fall planning, about one person 

kind of being the liaison for that producer. But, we have shored up 

that currently, and while it is not one person, it is one person for 

the three-to four-week rotation of our personnel located there. 

19 

We have had some issues with contractors, and where those 

issues have occurred, we have addressed those specifically with the 

contractors, and even in some cases we have let those contractors 

go because we did not feel that their performance was as appropriate and as professional as what we were looking for. 

So, the other thing to address that component so that they are 

not getting misinformation or misguidance is we plan to embed a 

federal person in each of those contract crews so that we have a 

person there with oversight, and so that misinformation is not occurring. I know that there was some misinformation. 

What we are doing now is we have put in place a lot of documents that we have that we can provide to the states, provide to 

the industry, and the industry, I know, and the states are using 

those to get those out to their members. So, whether it is biosecurity to indemnity and all of these things. But, it is still an overwhelming task for everybody, and frankly, I think when you are 

faced with the devastation that some have been faced with, it is a 

very difficult situation and it requires a lot of education because 

they have got a million things going on in their mind, least of 

which is how to clean up a house. 

Senator GRASSLEY. Give me your latest estimate on approval of 

vaccine. You stated in your testimony, quote, ‘‘Only the most efficacious vaccine should be considered for field use as any infection in 

a vaccinated population would still require the entire barn to be depopulated.’’ How likely do you think it is that a vaccine could be 

approved for use before this fall that would satisfy USDA’s approval criteria? 

Dr. CLIFFORD. So, what we would do on vaccine and what our 

plans are is to stockpile vaccine. We intend to go out for a request 

for proposal to stockpile vaccine for the fall. That does not mean 

we are going to use vaccine, but we want it ready to use. 

With regards to the effectiveness of the vaccine, any kind of vaccine, you want it to be as effective as possible. But, it has also 

got—one vaccine—and Dr. Swayne can tell you this—one vaccine 

may be really effective against this particular virus and another 

vaccine against another strain. So, you also have to look about how 

those vaccines are going to be administered, whether they can be 

administered at the hatchery or whether they actually have to go 

and inject those birds directly. So, those things and considerations 

have to be taken. 

I want the tool in the toolbox to use if we need it. The limiting 

factor for the use of that is trade. 

Senator GRASSLEY. Okay. 

Dr. CLIFFORD. You have to weigh a loss of $3 or $4 billion in 

trade against the use of the vaccine itself, and it is a difficult situation. 

Senator GRASSLEY. Mr. Chairman, I am done. Thank you for 

holding this hearing. 

Chairman ROBERTS. Thank you, and we have next Senator 

Casey. 

STATEMENT OF HON. ROBERT P. CASEY, JR., U.S. SENATOR 

FROM THE STATE OF PENNSYLVANIA 

Senator CASEY. Mr. Chairman, thank you very much. 

20 

I want to thank our witnesses for your testimony, also for your 

public service, and especially when it comes to an issue this difficult. 

I wanted to, Mr. Chairman, first ask if I can have consent to submit a statement for the record. 

[The prepared statement of Senator Casey can be found on page 

46 in the appendix.] 

Chairman ROBERTS. Without objection. 

Senator CASEY. Thank you. Part of that statement will refer to 

a challenge we had in Pennsylvania when—certainly, it went beyond Pennsylvania—more than 30 years ago where we had a loss 

of about 17 million birds just in Pennsylvania. They either had 

died or had to be destroyed. The dollar loss at that time, again, 

over 30 years ago, about $65 million, and retail egg prices, as you 

can imagine, skyrocketed. So, we expect that, like so many other 

states, we will be dealing with this again in Pennsylvania, but we 

have our own history on the challenges. 

Therefore, Dr. Clifford, I wanted to start with you on the issue 

of resources, which is always an issue that arises, and I know you 

have been asked related questions. Several of us in the Senate sent 

letters to the appropriators in support of APHIS’s avian health program and the National Animal Laboratory Health Network in May 

of this year. I would ask you, what further resources do you believe 

you need in terms of resources needed to detect, monitor, respond, 

and prevent HPAI? 

Dr. CLIFFORD. Senator, the current level of need of resources, we 

have the ability to take care of that, I think, through the Secretary’s ability to request emergency funding and provide that. So, 

I think that we are equipped. Actually, we just got good news from 

OMB of another apportionment that would allow us to prepare for 

this fall and spring. Now, it is not going to address, if an outbreak 

happens with all the indemnity and C and D and those costs. So, 

we would have to go back to address that. 

But, let me address it in a long term. You know, I think APHIS 

as an organization and the Department has always been very well 

prepared for the level of resources that we get. So, from a—these 

types of events really task us. They strain us extremely. So, as far 

as the level, I guess the question is, is how much do you want to 

pay for, and you pay for what you get, so I cannot throw a number 

out at you, but my budget, my total budget, appropriated budget 

for veterinary services parts of APHIS is around—I think it is 

around $250 million, 1,800 people. 

Senator CASEY. You said, in terms of personnel, you were, in 

your opening statement—what were the numbers again in terms of 

the fall, in terms of hiring? You said you had some capacity to hire 

temporary—— 

Dr. CLIFFORD. We actually have approval to hire 460 temps. 

Senator CASEY. Temps, okay. 

Dr. CLIFFORD. Or term positions. But of those, there will be 300 

that will be nothing but responders. So, those are animal health 

technicians and veterinarians that will be part of the response capability. We plan to start hiring those soon. We have received the 

resources to do that and they will be staged throughout the U.S. 

21 

Senator CASEY. In the remaining time I have, and I just have 

about a minute, Dr. Swayne, thank you, as well, for your testimony 

and your work. I wanted to ask you about the vaccine, one of the 

vaccine questions. If you took into account the concerns that vaccines could affect poultry exports, if you consider that, do you think 

that we could fully eradicate the outbreak without a vaccine? 

Dr. SWAYNE. I think that the current data that APHIS has released, based on the diagnostics that has been going on in the Midwest, is that we have not had an outbreak flock in about three 

weeks. This would at this point suggest that we are at that point 

of eradication of the current outbreak of virus that began in December. 

I think the next question is, is will it come back with migratory 

birds in the fall, which would start probably late August in Minnesota would be a potential time, into September into Iowa and on 

down. So, that will be the big question. Will we will be prepared 

for a potential onslaught of another wave of outbreaks, and that is 

the question we have to face. 

Senator CASEY. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. 

Chairman ROBERTS. Senator Tillis. 

Senator TILLIS. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Gentlemen, thank 

you for being here. 

In your opening statements, Mr. Chairman, you mentioned something I think bears repeating and it has to do with the human 

health risk here and the CDC’s position. This is really about the 

health of the flock. I think we need to continue to restate that so 

that we focus on the root problem. We have to also talk about the 

economic impact. I think in Minnesota and Iowa, we are talking 1.6 

billion in economic impact over the past year. That is from at least 

one report that I read. The job impact, I think, for probably every 

job lost as a processor, we lose about two more other jobs in the 

supply chain. So, these communities are very hard hit by this and 

people are losing their businesses and their mortgages. 

I want to talk a little bit more about the way we respond going 

forward. I contacted my Commissioner of Agriculture, Steve Troxler 

a month or so ago. He had done some work, and I think we had 

some of our Department of Agriculture up in Minnesota trying to 

help out. The question I had for him, and I would like to ask you, 

Dr. Clifford, is, what work are we doing? 

You had said that there were some 20 states and, I think you 

said, the worst case scenario is 20 states with 500 houses affected. 

Has there been any work done—assuming we will never have 

enough money to do everything you would like to do—in trying to 

create some sort of emergency response network? In the worst case 

scenario, if all 20 states are affected, then that is a disaster. But, 

having some way to mobilize resources that may be in the states 

to the hot spots and have that be at least part of the strategy for 

dealing with the shortfall in resources that the USDA may have? 

Dr. CLIFFORD. Senator, we already do that, okay, so—and actually, in this outbreak occurrence, there have been a number of 

state—of personnel moved into the outbreak area that have assisted from other places across the country, and we know definitely 

North Carolina assisted. So, we do that. We also have the National 

Animal Emergency Response Corps, which uses private veterinarVerDate Nov 24 2008 08:33 May 10, 2016 Jkt 000000 PO 00000 Frm 00025 Fmt 6633 Sfmt 6633 C:\USERS\MW42035\DESKTOP\DOCS\96181.TXT MICAH
22 

ians. So, that process can be a little slow at times, getting those 

people back on board, and everybody has to be trained. You just 

cannot bring them on board and put them in work. They have to 

go through HAZMAT. They have to be fit tested for respirators. 

They have to go through a medical exam, because this is very difficult work in the field. 

Senator TILLIS. Well, really related to, I think, a question that 

Senator Klobuchar asked, in some of my investigation over the past 

couple of months of this is just the time between when you suspect 

you have an outbreak, to the point you have someone there to authorize the depopulation, there seems to be a lag. So, is there a—— 

Dr. CLIFFORD. There is not a lag now. That was initially. We 

have—as soon as the presumptive positive, we have somebody 

there just—— 

Senator TILLIS. Now, what about the states’ responsibilities? I 

think we have 26 or so depopulation machines in the state. I do 

not know if that is a high or a low number. It seems reasonably 

high to me. 

Dr. CLIFFORD. You mean defoaming—— 

Senator TILLIS. Yes. 

Dr. CLIFFORD. —or the foamers? 

Senator TILLIS. Yes, the foamers. Are there sorts of minimum 

standards we are setting up for the states to make sure that they 

are best prepared? 

Dr. CLIFFORD. We will be looking at that for the fall. I have alluded to the fact of trying to find new and better methods. We are 

considering and working with the industry and the veterinary community of considering closing up the houses and turning off the 

ventilators and heating up the house, because it is the fastest way. 

It is probably, while some people may have concerns, it is probably 

the most humane way to take care of this. So, this is what I was 

alluding to before as far as getting the support—— 

Senator TILLIS. I am glad to hear you say that, because I know 

that it is—there is the question on the humane treatment, but if 

these birds are left in that state for a week or so until you have 

the approval—— 

Dr. CLIFFORD. Well—— 

Senator TILLIS. —it seems to me it is the most expedient and 

probably facilitates the clean-up. 

I want to stay within my time, so I have one question for both 

Dr. Swayne and Dr. Clifford and it has to do with what more can 

we do, what constraints have we placed on you, or what things can 

we do, short of money—I heard that loud and clear—that may 

make your job easier? Have you given much thought to that, if we 

could do this or did not have to do that, as a result of decisions 

we made here in Congress, it could make your lives easier? 

[Laughter.] 

Dr. SWAYNE. Please do not have another sequestration, because 

it would shut us down, and we will be in the middle, as far as research, in the middle of all the research that we need to do to finish up the vaccination application and studies. If we have a sequestration, it requires us by law to shut everything down, which 

means if we have an experiment going, we have to euthanize all 

the birds. We have to kill all the cultures. We have got to lock 

23 

down all of our high path virus, which are select agents. We have 

to follow the select agent rules to contain those. Send everybody 

home. If we start back up again, it is the same situation. 

Dr. CLIFFORD. I would second that. We cannot send people home 

and then expect us to respond to an emergency if it occurs. 

Senator TILLIS. That goes back to the funding question, and I 

agree with that. I think sequestration is awful on every count for 

every agency. But are there other things beyond that that concern 

you or things that we should be looking at, or is it basically the 

certainty and the funding you need? 

Dr. CLIFFORD. I think those are the primary things. There may 

be other things, but let us give it some thought and if there is, that 

there be some way—— 

Senator TILLIS. I would encourage you to do that as you are 

going through the process—— 

Dr. CLIFFORD. —I would appreciate—— 

Senator TILLIS. —and working with the states to do everything 

we can to remove any sorts of hurdles that you do not think add 

value and that are adding costs and time. Thank you. 

Chairman ROBERTS. Senator Cochran. 

Senator COCHRAN. Mr. Chairman, I am informed that the Department of Agriculture’s Agriculture Research Service facility in 

Athens, Georgia, has isolated a seed strain of avian influenza virus 

that is infecting U.S. poultry flocks, but no vaccine has yet been 

approved for use in the United States. What is the reason for that? 

Why has the Department not been able to go forward? 

Dr. CLIFFORD. Well, I will let Dr. Swayne talk about that particular virus and its use in a vaccine. We do not typically use vaccine unless we need it. You need to have an exit strategy. Trade, 

it will impact trade. We can eradicate this disease without the use 

of vaccine. If vaccine is used, it does not mean that a particular 

bird or birds within a single house will not become affected with 

high path, and if they do, we still will take out the entire flock, 

even though they are vaccinated. 

You can—so, there are pros and cons on the use of vaccine. So, 

we have to weigh all of those things together. So, it is not a lack 

of approval of vaccines. It is whether we are going to use them and 

the impact it has if we do use them. 

Senator COCHRAN. Have any of our trading partners indicated 

that they will be seeking retaliatory trade measures if the U.S. 

starts vaccinating its commercial birds? 

Dr. CLIFFORD. They have not indicated from a retaliation standpoint. They have indicated, though, that they would initially stop 

all sales out of the U.S., exports to their countries, until they have 

had adequate time to evaluate our actions. 

Senator COCHRAN. Are you running out of money? 

Dr. CLIFFORD. No, sir. 

Senator COCHRAN. Would you let us know if you need any 

money? 

Dr. CLIFFORD. Yes, sir. 

[Laughter.] 

Senator COCHRAN. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. 

Dr. CLIFFORD. Thank you. 

Chairman ROBERTS. He is the man to talk to. 

24 

[Laughter.] 

Dr. CLIFFORD. Yes, sir. 

Chairman ROBERTS. Senator Boozman. 

Senator BOOZMAN. Thank you, Mr. Chairman, and thank you 

and the Ranking Member so much for having this really important 

hearing, and we do appreciate the hard work that you all are 

doing. 

I think the money, though, is an important question, and you mentioned the $250 million. Is that adequate? 

[Laughter.] 

Dr. CLIFFORD. Actually, no, it is not adequate. 

Senator BOOZMAN. Well, we need to—— 

Dr. CLIFFORD. But, I cannot—— 

Senator BOOZMAN. Again, this is—— 

Dr. CLIFFORD. —you know, it is—— 

Senator BOOZMAN. I understand the position you are in, but you 

cannot have it both ways, in the sense—— 

Dr. CLIFFORD. Also—yes, right. But, also, we have a process that 

we all follow—— 

Senator BOOZMAN. I understand that, but like I say, you cannot 

have it both ways. You cannot complain later on that we are not 

giving you the funding that you need when you do not—when you 

are not up front about it. I do understand the process, and again, 

I do not mean to—— 

Dr. CLIFFORD. I know—— 

Senator BOOZMAN. —I am trying to help you. 

Dr. CLIFFORD. I know. 

Senator BOOZMAN. The other thing is that you mentioned the— 

as we are doing it now, you talked about any delay, not having 

delay is so important. Then you outlined a process that it seems 

like, as you went through it, it is humanly impossible to do. You 

mentioned the large manure piles and the birds, trying to, people 

taking breaks and just physically dealing with this. What is the answer to that? 

Dr. CLIFFORD. So, I need to separate that into two portions for 

you. The key part is getting birds dead—— 

Senator BOOZMAN. Okay. 

Dr. CLIFFORD. —because then you do not have virus replication 

and production and more virus being spread into the environment. 

Senator BOOZMAN. Can they spread by the air? Can their feathers—— 

Dr. CLIFFORD. It can be spread by fomites, by people, by trucks, 

and there is some indication that wind has played a part, especially 

in parts of Minnesota, I believe, because of the proximity, the closeness of the lakes, the environmental contamination, and the wind 

that—— 

Senator BOOZMAN. Trucking them to kill them or whatever, that 

could possibly be a—just the birds being transported could be a 

possibility of spread, as far as the wind blowing their feathers 

and—— 

Dr. CLIFFORD. If they are infected, yes. 

Senator BOOZMAN. Okay. 

Dr. CLIFFORD. Hopefully, we are not moving infected birds. So, 

that is all—those are all possibilities. 

25 

What we have identified is the gaps that we see, and we need 

to fill and cover as many of those gaps on the biosecurity side as 

we can, now, realizing that in some cases, it may be cost prohibitive to the industry to fully address it. So, we need to identify those 

that are highest priority and work down that list and do everything 

we can to close those gaps. 

Senator BOOZMAN. Dr. Swayne, do you see anything in the biosecurity areas that we are doing—would you change anything that 

we are doing based on your research? Would you add or maybe say 

some of the things that we are doing were a waste of time, or—— 

Dr. SWAYNE. I think one of the challenges is that every individual farm has a different risk, and what needs to be done is that 

individual farms, whether they are broiler farms or layer farms or 

breeder farms or turkey breeder, turkey meat, turkey farms, needs 

to do an assessment of where all the entry and exit points are on 

that farm. 

I think that we, as humans—myself included—is that things that 

we do every day, repetitive, over and over and over again, we kind 

of forget that they could be risk activities. We tend to look outside 

ourselves to somebody else being the risk and not myself, and I 

think that is the challenge that all farmers and the companies 

have, is to go back and really assess honestly, and sometimes using 

an outside person who does risk assessment, to say, where are the 

critical control points? 

So, for example, some points that could be high risk is if you 

have families that have multiple farms and then they end up sharing equipment between the farms to save costs. It makes economic 

sense. It is a perfect—for example, you may share a tractor or a 

manure spreader. For example, manure spreaders are really high 

risk because that is where the virus is, in the manure, and if you 

move it from one farm to the other without proper cleaning and 

disinfection, that could be a risk factor that has to be identified and 

eliminated. 

Senator BOOZMAN. As far as the migratory birds, how do they 

spread it to enclosed flock? 

Dr. SWAYNE. That is a really good question, and I think Dr. 

Clifford made this comment, that all chickens, all turkeys, are all 

susceptible. It is just a matter of when they get exposure. So, if 

they are raised outdoors, they could be exposed. If they are raised 

indoors, they could be exposed. We do not always understand how 

the virus moves, but it is present in the fecal material and also in 

secretions from the respiratory tract. So, if you walk through feces 

from an infected duck and walk into your house, you can deposit 

it right there where you come in. 

In some studies that were identified in Pennsylvania in 1983– 

1984, they found that in some of those houses, the initial mortality 

and infections occurred right at the door where the owner walked 

in, in this case, tracking it in. In the case of Pennsylvania, that 

was most likely farm-to-farm spread. 

So, those are all the critical issues. 

Senator BOOZMAN. Good. Thank you very much, and I do appreciate your efforts, and I think I can speak for the whole committee 

in the sense that anything we can do to help, we certainly will. 

Chairman ROBERTS. Senator Donnelly. 

26 

Senator DONNELLY. I do not have any questions for the panel, 

Mr. Chairman. 

Chairman ROBERTS. Well, thank you very much. 

We are going to move to our second panel, but before that, I 

would acknowledge the presence of Congressman King, who is 

here. Congressman, if you would like to stand, to thundering applause, but at any rate—— 

[Laughter.] 

Chairman ROBERTS. You were introduced about two hours ago. 

Would you please go back to the other body and inform them that 

we are a little speedier than they think we are. 

[Laughter.] 

Mr. KING. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. 

Chairman ROBERTS. Thank you, Congressman. 

Welcome to our second panel of witnesses before this committee 

this afternoon. I am happy to welcome all of you to the committee. 

For our second panel, unfortunately, due to an upcoming vote, we 

are asking if you could limit your opening statement to four minutes, if possible. Just take a big pencil and cross out two or three 

paragraphs. You will be find. That is also for members, who I hope 

will remain, with regards to their questions. 

Senator Ernst is going to introduce Mr. Jim Dean, the egg producer from Sioux Center, Iowa, and Chairman of the Board of 

United Egg Producers, on behalf of the United Egg Producers. Senator Ernst. 

Senator ERNST. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. 

Chairman ROBERTS. While they are setting up, Joni. While they 

are setting up. 

Senator ERNST. Yes. Thank you so much, Mr. Chairman and 

Ranking Member, as well, again, for holding this committee meeting today. 

I want to start by thanking all the members of the panel as they 

are setting up. I appreciate their testimony and perspective on this 

topic, which has impacted each one of you very personally. 

The highly pathogenic avian influenza has had a devastating effect on Iowa, claiming the lives of over 31 million laying hens, 

broilers, pullets, and turkeys from across the state. Economists estimated that the net impact to Iowa will be almost $1 billion. Over 

70 family farms in Iowa have been wiped out by this terrible disease and there has been a resulting economic ripple effect in their 

rural communities. 

One of the farmers impacted is Mr. Jim Dean of Sioux Center, 

Iowa, who is here to testify today, so Jim, thank you for being here 

today. Mr. Dean is the Chairman of the Board of United Egg Producers, a trade cooperative with membership that represents over 

90 percent of the egg industry in the United States. He is a past 

board member of the Iowa Poultry Association, U.S. Egg Marketers, and Midwest United Egg Producers. 

Mr. Dean entered the egg business while in high school, working 

for a farm located in Pella, Iowa. 

After serving in Vietnam from June 1969 to June 1970, he returned to the employment at the egg farm and over the subsequent 

years was involved in all segments of the business. In 1979, he was 

invited to become a shareholder in the company, the first non-famVerDate Nov 24 2008 08:33 May 10, 2016 Jkt 000000 PO 00000 Frm 00030 Fmt 6633 Sfmt 6633 C:\USERS\MW42035\DESKTOP\DOCS\96181.TXT MICAH
27 

ily member to be so honored. After serving the needs of the company for 27 years and becoming Senior Vice President, he elected 

to sell his one-third stake to pursue other opportunities. 

In 2014, Mr. Dean was honored as United Egg Producers’ Egg 

Industry Producer of the Year, and in 2009 was inducted into the 

Iowa Poultry Association Hall of Fame. 

It is good to see you again, Jim, although I wish it were under 

different circumstances, it is always good to have a fellow Iowan 

in Washington, DC So, thank you very much for testifying today, 

and thanks to the rest of you on the panel as well. 

Thank you very much, Mr. Chairman. 

Chairman ROBERTS. Our second witness is Ken Klippen, President of the National Association of Egg Farmers, Collegeville, 

Pennsylvania. Senator Casey. 

Senator CASEY. Mr. Chairman, thanks very much. I will be brief. 

Ken, great to have you here. Ken Klippen, from Collegeville, 

Pennsylvania, is President of the National Association of Egg 

Farmers. He spent more than 30 years in the egg industry in capacities including production and processing. Most of that time has 

been representing egg farmers both nationally here in D.C. and as 

the Vice President and the Executive Director for Government Relations of the United Egg Producers, and internationally when he 

was the Director General of the International Egg Commission, 

headquartered in London, England. He received both a Master’s 

and Bachelor’s degree from Michigan State University. 

Ken, great to have you here. Thanks very much. 

Chairman ROBERTS. Our third witness, Brad Moline, is a turkey 

producer and owner of Moline Farms in Manson, Iowa, on behalf 

of the National Turkey Federation. 

Senator Grassley, would you please proceed with your introduction. 

Senator GRASSLEY. Yes. It is a privilege for me to introduce Brad 

Moline, a third-generation turkey farmer from Manson. He and his 

family operate Moline Farms, which producers approximately 

155,000 turkeys every year, along with corn and soybeans. His 

family has been farming in the Manson area since the late 1800s. 

Brad and his brother formed a farming partnership together after 

he graduated from Iowa State University in 2002. Today, the Moline Farms employ three owner-managers, four full-time employees, 

two part-time employees, and another employee who is currently 

serving in the National Guard. 

Brad, we welcome you and thank you for representing the turkey 

producers here at this very important meeting. 

Chairman ROBERTS. Our fourth witness is Rob Knecht. He is 

President of the Michigan Allied Poultry Industries, Vice President 

of Operations, Konos, Inc., Martin, Michigan. 

Senator Stabenow. 

Senator STABENOW. Thank you very much, Mr. Chairman. 

First, I have to say, before introducing Rob from Michigan, which 

is wonderful, but Mr. Klippen, it is nice to have a Michigan State 

University grad since we just heard from somebody on the other 

panel from Ohio State, so I feel a little better—— 

[Laughter.] 

28 

Senator STABENOW. —now that we know that we have got Michigan State represented. 

Rob Knecht is a third-generation egg farmer and serves as President of the Michigan Allied Poultry Industries and Vice President 

of Operations at Konos, Incorporated, in Martin, Michigan. Mr. 

Knecht is also a board member for the United Egg Producers. He 

holds a Bachelor’s degree from Hope College and an M.B.A. from 

Cornerstone University. 

It is great to have you, Mr. Knecht, with us as an important 

voice from Michigan. 

Chairman ROBERTS. Our fifth witness is Dr. Tom Elam, at 

Farm—and I have ‘‘Econ’’ down there. That means you are an economist, right? 

Mr. ELAM. Yes, sir. 

Chairman ROBERTS. He is from Carmel, Indiana. 

To introduce the witness to the committee, Senator Donnelly. 

Senator DONNELLY. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. 

Dr. Tom Elam, President of FarmEcon in Carmel, Indiana, is testifying today as a farm economics expert. Dr. Elam has earned his 

Doctoral degree in agricultural economics from the University of 

Tennessee-Knoxville and since worked in a variety of roles, serving 

the public through government, private, and nonprofit positions. 

After time at the USDA, Dr. Elam spent over 20 years at Elanco 

Animal Health. Dr. Elam founded FarmEcon in 2003, where he 

consults for all dimensions of the U.S. broiler and turkey sectors, 

and was named one of Poultry USA Magazine’s ‘‘Top 20 Consultants to the U.S. Poultry Sector’’ in 2006. 

I want to thank him for attending today to share his excellent 

working knowledge of the relevant areas of finance, agricultural 

production, and farming economics. 

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. 

Chairman ROBERTS. Let us start with you, Mr. Dean. 

STATEMENT OF JAMES R. DEAN, CHAIRMAN, UNITED EGG 

PRODUCERS, SIOUX CENTER, IOWA 

Mr. DEAN. Thank you, Mr. Chairman, Ranking Member Stabenow, members of the committee. Egg farmers appreciate the interest of this committee as we deal with the worst animal health crisis in the nation’s history. 

About 36 million hens have been removed from the nation’s laying flock as a result of the disease. An additional five to six million 

pullets have also been lost. We and our customers are dealing with 

the overall loss of 12 percent of the U.S. egg laying flock because 

most of the egg laying hens that were lost produce eggs for further 

processing. The loss to that sector is closer to 30 percent. 

I would like to publicly thank Chairman Roberts, Ranking Member Stabenow, and their staff, as well as USDA and APHIS for responding to this crisis swiftly and with hard work and dedication. 

Egg farmers have been implementing biosecurity measures for 

many years, starting after the avian influenza outbreak in Pennsylvania in the 1980s. Biosecurity is also required by the FDA’s Egg 

Safety Rule. The avian influenza outbreak did not catch producers 

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29 

precedented. Its uncontrolled spread stymied the best effort of both 

egg farmers and APHIS. 

Our farm in Sioux Center, Iowa, received a perfect score from a 

USDA biosecurity audit less than two months before the outbreak, 

but that did not prevent the virus from entering our operation. We 

can do more, and we are doing more. 

Avian influenza continues to threaten the rural economy’s farms 

and jobs. In Iowa, the egg industry accounts for 20,000 direct and 

indirect jobs and generates $6.6 billion in economic activity and 

more than $500 million in tax revenue. 

We are grateful that Congress saw fit to create a system of indemnity payments to cover the value of the birds that must be destroyed and lost egg production, as well as cleaning and disinfecting. For farmers, these indemnities can be the difference between failing and surviving. 

We are engaged in respectful dialogue with USDA about the formulas that are used to calculate indemnities for the egg industry. 

Current regulations require that indemnities reflect the value of 

egg production, but we are concerned that the specific formulas fail 

to completely reflect the value. We appreciate very much the Department’s openness to consider the data UEP has supplied. 

The biggest issue with the current formula is that it does not 

adequately capture the value of the future stream of egg production 

associated with the hen. We hope that USDA will agree to make 

changes in the current formula to better reflect egg production 

value, and we believe that the existing statutes provide ample authority for the Department to do so. 

Furthermore, we support and are engaged in current efforts to 

investigate the potential viability of a crop insurance-type program 

for avian influenza and other diseases. These investigations are at 

early stages and we look forward to exploring this and options that 

may assist farmers in the future. 

The indemnity issue is complex, and I can provide more detail 

during question and answers. The reason is that hens on egg farms 

are different ages. Their maturity is deliberately staggered so that, 

given them, they are collectively producing the right amount of 

eggs for the market. So, if all of them die at the same time and 

have to be euthanized at once, we cannot immediately repopulate 

our farms, but must do it in stages, during which time those barns 

that remain empty generate zero revenue to pay fixed costs and 

wages. Retaining our staff and keeping the local communities alive 

is of paramount importance to the egg producers. 

UEP supports continued, perhaps expanded, funding for the 

State Departments of Agriculture for the affected states to assist 

with depopulation and expanded education efforts in small backyard flocks on risk assessments and biosecurity. 

Mr. Chairman, our farm employees, communities, and customers 

have suffered an unprecedented blow this year. This cannot happen 

again. It is vital that all of us work closely with USDA to take 

every step that we can to prevent harm to our industry as well as 

to others. 

We need and appreciate the support of USDA as well as this 

committee to move forward. Thank you. 

30 

[The prepared statement of Mr. Dean can be found on page 59 

in the appendix.] 

Chairman ROBERTS. Thank you very much, Mr. Dean, for your 

efforts to keep this to four minutes. We do have a vote at 5:30, and 

I know everybody has important questions. 

Mr. Klippen, please proceed. 

STATEMENT OF KEN KLIPPEN, PRESIDENT, NATIONAL ASSOCIATION OF EGG FARMERS, COLLEGEVILLE, PENNSYLVANIA 

Mr. KLIPPEN. Thank you, Mr. Chairman, and good to see you 

again, Ranking Member Senator Stabenow. It is always good to see 

a fellow Spartan. 

The National Association of Egg Farmers formed in 2014, and we 

represent 278 farmers nationwide. We are composed of a lot of contract farmers. Our smallest manages a flock of about 8,000 birds. 

We are very small, up to some that have over five million birds. 

A group of farmers came together originally under the name of 

Egg Farmers of America when we opposed the national egg legislation in the 2011 and 2012 Congress, and we want to thank those 

members here that let the farmers decide how best to care for their 

chickens while providing the safe and wholesome egg. However, 

with waterfowl as a source of this disease transmission, we support 

a policy of producing poultry indoors and not in free-range environments, where the chickens may be exposed to the virus. 

Now, this AI is affecting small as well as large, and Mr. Chairman, there was a small flock of ten birds in your state that had 

to be depopulated because of AI, so it is considered one of the 

smaller ones, but the larger ones in the State of Iowa and Minnesota took a bad hit. 

Amon Baer from Lake Park, Minnesota, who testified before this 

Congress in the 2012 Congress in opposition to the national egg 

legislation, is a member of our association and he has also been hit 

by this avian influenza. He is working hard today to meet a deadline for cleaning and disinfecting his farm by Friday so he can repopulate his birds by August. When he discovered he had avian influenza on his farm, his heart sank, because he knew he would 

have to destroy all 300,000 of his birds. 

Now, because poultry is sold worldwide, this is a worldwide 

issue. With 20 percent of the broiler meat, 12 percent of the turkeys, and just under five percent of eggs and egg products produced 

that are being exported to other countries, this disease will impact 

trade. Eighteen countries have banned all poultry from the U.S., 

including China, South Korea, South Africa, and Russia. Recently, 

your fellow Senator Coons from Delaware expressed grave concern 

about banning eggs in South Africa, as he was instrumental in 

helping open those markets. 

There are 31 countries with restricted trade from infected regions 

or zones within the U.S., and those countries are—of the 31 represent Canada, Mexico, Japan, and the European Union. There are 

48 countries worldwide that are reporting highly pathogenic avian 

influenza. 

Now, in trying to shorten, I think I just cut a couple of sentences 

out here. Anyway, I will go right to the point here. 

31 

We corresponded with APHIS officials back on May 27, providing 

an indemnity plan for egg producers, and we were citing 9 C.F.R. 

Part 56(1)(a), which states that for laying hens, the appraised 

value should include the hens’ future egg production. We also provided a five-year average of statistics for APHIS as a means to 

bring about a fair and speedy appraisal for egg-laying hens. In our 

written comments, we have provided the details of that particular 

plan. 

Now, whether APHIS indemnifies using the plan we suggested or 

the one that United Egg Producers is acceptable to us, because 

both plans are comparable in pricing the value of the chicken and 

the future eggs produced. 

I was glad to hear Dr. Clifford today, because we want to make 

sure that we have uniformity in these plans, because some farmers 

are being indemnified when they are destroying their egg cartons, 

others are not. 

Again, we want to thank you, Mr. Chairman, for the opportunity 

to appear before you today, and I am pleased to answer any questions. 

[The prepared statement of Mr. Klippen can be found on page 67 

in the appendix.] 

Chairman ROBERTS. Mr. Klippen, thank you for your statement 

and thank you for your plan. 

Mr. Moline. 

STATEMENT OF BRAD R. MOLINE, MANAGER, OWNER, MOLINE 

FARMS LLC, MANSON, IOWA, ON BEHALF OF THE NATIONAL 

TURKEY FEDERATION 

Mr. MOLINE. Good afternoon, Chairman Roberts, Ranking Member Stabenow, and members of the committee. My name is Brad 

Moline and I am a third-generation turkey farmer from Manson, 

Iowa. I am testifying today on behalf of the National Turkey Federation, all of its farmers and processors that have been impacted 

by this year’s high path AI. 

I am currently living the avian influenza nightmare. We have already depopulated more than 56,000 turkeys, which totally cleaned 

out our 12 growing barns. If we are lucky, we will be able to salvage this year with one flock that we hope to repopulate soon. Regardless, two-thirds of our annual income has been wiped out. 

Without APHIS indemnification payments, many farmers may 

have been forced to hang it up. We appreciate Congress and the 

USDA for their continued support of indemnification. We will depend heavily on these payments until our next flock goes to market 

somewhere around Thanksgiving. 

Before I continue, we would like to extend a thank you to Secretary Vilsack, USDA, and APHIS for their leadership and thousands of hours of service fighting this outbreak. Additionally, I appreciate my home state Senators for raising our concerns during 

this difficult time, as well. 

Since the high path AI outbreak began in late January, there 

have been 153 cases confirmed in commercial turkey, turkey breeder flocks in eight states, resulting in the loss of nearly eight million 

turkeys nationwide, with an economic impact estimated at nearly 

32 

$500 million. Processors in these areas have laid off more than 400 

employees for the lack of turkeys. 

We are committed to working with APHIS in five key areas that 

are critical to eradicating this disease: A faster depopulation; disposal, repopulation strategy; a viable vaccine; and a coordinated, 

enhanced focus on biosecurity. However, there is no silver bullet, 

but increased efficiency will require clear communication among all 

shareholders. 

Initially, federal and state governments missed a critical opportunity to sit down with the industry to develop a defined gameplan. 

This would have avoided the mass confusion that we experienced 

in Iowa. Having a clear roadmap explained by government officials, 

not contractors, is a must. We understand contractors play an important role in eradication, but they should have been better 

trained. 

Finally, we recommend that the USDA staff assignments overlap 

in the field to reduce communication errors. 

In order to eradicate high path AI, swift and efficient depopulation is vital. We appreciate the government allowing us to speed up 

the process of safely depopulating all infected flocks. The goal 

should be to depopulate all infected birds within 24 hours of a positive confirmation. 

Regarding disposal, the industry has been challenged to adjust to 

the government’s ever-changing goalpost. Before fall, we look forward to streamlining the process with the USDA to minimize onthe-fly decision making. To that regard, the NTF is instructing its 

members to implement contingency plans immediately. Farmers 

and USDA need to finalize disposal options before fall. 

As farmers, biosecurity is something we take very seriously. 

Could we have all done more to prevent the spread of this virus? 

Most likely. But, however, I take offense to the notion by some inside and outside the government that the turkey industry was careless or knowingly negligent. We have everything to lose by being 

sloppy. 

Further, APHIS needs to examine its own biosecurity practices, 

especially those of their contractors. APHIS is doing an excellent 

job of documenting the transmission of this disease, but to the 

date, the agency has shared very little information that examines 

the role that delayed depopulation and biosecurity lapses played in 

spreading this disease. 

As for the NTF, we have initiated a review of our biosecurity best 

management practices to identify improvements. 

All of these efforts will mean little if we cannot restock birds by 

the end of the year. Farmers were unsure as when they could restock their previously infected farm. Communication with federal 

and state agencies was difficult and led to confusion. Although we 

still have concerns over some criteria, we now have a plan to move 

forward. To truly recover from this devastating chapter, many 

strategies will be employed. One of the most powerful tools will be 

a vaccine to fight the virus. 

To conclude, continued communication with APHIS must be enhanced to improve biosecurity, depopulation, disposal, repopulation, 

and vaccine development. 

33 

With that, Mr. Chairman, I conclude my testimony and would be 

happy to answer any questions. 

[The prepared statement of Mr. Moline can be found on page 79 

in the appendix.] 

Chairman ROBERTS. Thank you, Mr. Moline. 

Mr. Knecht. 

STATEMENT OF ROB KNECHT, VICE PRESIDENT OF OPERATIONS, KONOS, INC., MARTIN, MICHIGAN, AND PRESIDENT, 

MICHIGAN ALLIED POULTRY INDUSTRIES 

Mr. KNECHT. Mr. Chairman, Senator Stabenow, and all the 

members of the committee, thank you for inviting me to testify 

today on behalf of Michigan Allied Poultry. My name is Rob Knecht 

and I am an egg farmer, a third-generation egg farmer in Michigan. As I mentioned, I am the President of Michigan Allied Poultry 

Industries, which represents egg-laying hens, turkeys, and broilers 

in the State of Michigan. 

As the country’s seventh-largest producer of eggs and 15th largest producer in turkey production, Michigan’s poultry producers 

took action when highly pathogenic AI hit commercial poultry operations in the Midwest. The overall impact includes almost 51 commercial poultry throughout the U.S. My testimony today describes 

biosecurity changes that have been made to poultry operations in 

the wake of the AI outbreak, how the poultry industry in Michigan 

came together on a biosecurity initiative to protect the state’s poultry, and how the APHIS mitigation process for HPAI can work better for producers. 

As the number of AI cases grew this spring, companies in Michigan implemented changes to protect the commercial poultry of the 

state. Today, many poultry companies in Michigan hire crews specifically for completing all of the tasks dedicated to a flock, such 

as moving birds, vaccinations, and other tasks that require a large 

amount of labor in a short amount of time. These employees, along 

with permanent employees who work in the barns, have the closest 

interaction with the birds and, therefore, need to be the cleanest. 

Farmers can place a high level of control on these crews, which 

means a high level of control over on-farm practices that could lead 

to contamination. 

Michigan’s poultry farms also engage in different washing strategies. As a short-term measure, some companies have channeled 

house managers, bird crews, and anyone else in direct contact with 

birds to nearby hotel facilities where the egg producer covers the 

cost of a few rooms that serve as a locker room for sanitizing employees and changing clothes. Another short-term strategy includes 

utilizing mobile shower units which are pulled by trucks, have 

three stalls where employees can comfortably shower and change 

their clothes. In the long term, some poultry farms in Michigan are 

planning on constructing onsite shower and locker room facilities 

to stop the spread of the virus. 

In addition, having only clean vehicles on the premises is vital. 

There are many operations that have increased the frequency of 

spraying disinfectant on the wheels and wheel wells of every vehicle that enters a poultry facility. Many operations in Michigan and 

nationwide are also requiring full truck washes prior to entry onto 

34 

the farm, since trucks that are coming into Michigan could easily 

have been traveling up and down I–80, where AI could be found. 

All stakeholders within Michigan’s poultry sector have greatly increased communication with one another. Early on in AI outbreaks, 

MAPI was responsible for coordinating conference calls to discuss 

best practices and issues involving biosecurity. Through the entire 

crisis, we coordinated a Michigan-wide weekly call that includes 

many Michigan poultry stakeholders, including partner industries 

such as feed companies, Michigan State University’s Extension 

staff, Michigan’s Department of Agriculture, and Michigan State 

Veterinarian. 

Also on the topic of outreach, I would be remiss not to mention 

Michigan State, and they have always made themselves available 

to discuss biosecurity risk analysis, strategies, and implementation. 

MSU’s Extension program has presented at MAPI’s Annual Winter 

Seminar on biosecurity on multiple occasions, and Dr. Richard Fulton of MSU’s Extension program wrote the low-pathogen avian influenza program that is now administered by the state. In fact, 

when asked to provide this testimony, Dr. Fulton was one of the 

first people I asked for counsel. 

In conclusion, this committee should know that Michigan producers are optimistic, even while they maintain a position of constant vigilance. Our industry will keep a laser focus on biosecurity 

going into the fall and we intend to document, verify, and validate 

procedures to ensure a focus on biosecurity for the future. Many of 

these items discussed here will become and are becoming common 

practice. While the poultry industry has always cared deeply about 

biosecurity, the recent AI outbreak has opened our eyes to consider 

areas of production that were not previously thought to be significant risk. 

I am confident that Michigan and the U.S. poultry will build its 

resilience during this difficult period and be stronger for when the 

next challenge comes. 

Mr. Chairman, Senator Stabenow, and the rest of the committee, 

I appreciate the time and look forward to answering your questions. 

[The prepared statement of Mr. Knecht can be found on page 75 

in the appendix.] 

Chairman ROBERTS. Thank you, Mr. Knecht. 

Dr. Elam. 

STATEMENT OF THOMAS ELAM, PRESIDENT, FARMECON LLC, 

CARMEL, INDIANA 

Mr. ELAM. Thank you, Chairman Roberts and Ranking Member 

Stabenow, Senator Joe Donnelly from the great State of Indiana, 

and other members of this committee. I am Dr. Tom Elam, President of FarmEcon LLC, an agricultural economics consulting company in Carmel, Indiana. My specialty is poultry. 

I would like to summarize some findings that are in my written 

testimony and make two recommendations for your consideration. 

For the past several months, I have made a running analysis of 

the economic effects of HPAI and with dismay have closely followed 

these outbreaks as they spread from the Pacific flyway into the 

35 

Upper Midwest, and we have seen damage increase to record levels. 

As an economist, I deal with hard numbers routinely, but as an 

individual—and, by the way, economists are people, they do have 

feelings, regardless of what you may have heard. The hard realities 

faced by these producers and many others is very difficult to imagine and put yourself in their position. 

But, back to the hard numbers. Based on pre-outbreak wholesale 

prices, my preliminary estimate of producer direct loss arising from 

the destroyed turkey and egg production that we have heard about 

today is about $1.57 billion, $530 million for the turkey industry 

and a little over $1 billion for layers. 

By design, these estimated impacts exclude the substantial price 

increases that have occurred since the outbreak hit the Upper Midwest. That estimated loss also does not include the cleanup, bird 

restocking costs, higher costs to consumers from post-outbreak 

price increases, or any further production losses beyond what we 

know about today. Also not included is approximately $1.2 billion 

in lost export value, mostly broiler chicken meat, and broiler producers were not really significantly affected at all by this outbreak. 

The economy-wide loss for the just destroyed production to date 

is conservatively estimated at about $3.3 billion, and that is just 

for the production losses at pre-outbreak prices. The larger number 

is based on an earlier University of Minnesota piece of research. It 

includes estimated losses past the producer and wholesale level 

and into our retail food stores, restaurants, and other food service 

outlets. All of these production losses are concentrated among relatively few farms, representing only 223 turkey and layer production sites. 

As bad as it is for consumers facing higher prices and possible 

product shortages, especially in the egg industry, those affected 

producers have experienced catastrophic losses. What is even more 

important is that there is a very real possibility of another outbreak this fall and maybe even next spring. 

The first recommendation I have has already been sufficiently 

covered in these hearings, and that is APHIS funding. This committee and the House Committee on Agriculture need to make sure 

that APHIS has sufficient resources to address the remnants of 

this outbreak and any future outbreaks. If we get an infected broiler farm in the State of Georgia or North Carolina or Alabama and 

that starts to spread like wildfire like this one, the losses will be 

in order of magnitude larger than we are talking about here today. 

It is going to take a public and private partnership to make that 

happen, and I hope that the APHIS is ready to play its role. 

The second is more contentious. I think this Congress needs to 

look at the enabling legislation for indemnification payments in 

light of what we have talked about today, and ensure that USDA 

is interpreting those measures appropriately and making appropriate indemnification payments that offset the losses experienced 

by these producers, especially in the egg and turkey business. The 

loss of future production, I do not believe, based on my conversations, has been adequately compensated. 

Thank you, Mr. Chairman, and I will remain here for questions. 

36 

[The prepared statement of Mr. Elam can be found on page 64 

in the appendix.] 

Chairman ROBERTS. Dr. Elam, I am going to ask you the first 

question that I have. Have you done any forecasting to determine 

what the impact on consumer spending for turkey and egg products 

has been due to the recent outbreaks of HPAI, and have you been 

able to determine what the loss of certain export markets has 

meant for U.S. poultry producers? 

Mr. ELAM. Yes, sir, I have made some preliminary estimates 

based on current prices and price expectations for consumers. 

About 50 percent of roughly $3 billion in increased expenditures by 

consumers will be necessary as a result of higher egg and turkey 

prices, to a lesser extent chicken prices, as a result of this outbreak. 

On the exports, that is a little more complicated. I mentioned about $1.2 billion in lost chicken exports, but a substantial amount 

of that product will be sold on the domestic market, so it is not a 

loss of production, but it is a loss of export value and it does affect 

our balance of payments. 

Chairman ROBERTS. Thank you, sir. 

Mr. Dean and Mr. Klippen, indemnity payments for egg farmers. 

As you described, the indemnity calculation for egg-laying hens is 

different than indemnity calculation for birds raised for the meat 

they produce. Would you describe, to the best of your knowledge, 

some adjustments or improvements that could be made to the indemnity calculation for egg-laying hens that would be more adequate. 

Mr. Dean. 

Mr. DEAN. Yes. When the indemnification was put in place, I 

think, in 2002, I do not think it fully recognized the length of time 

that is needed to restock these layer farms. We are in a unique situation where it takes us actually 20 weeks to raise a day-old baby 

chick before she is a performing layer. So, we have that 20-week 

lag time of raising that bird before she is productive. 

Then we have to stagger in the amount of time, because in our 

facilities, we generally have four pullet—or one pullet house to four 

layer houses. So, it is not a one-to-one ratio of pullet houses to 

layer houses. So, by the time that you start restocking the layer 

buildings, you have to go through the cycle of the pullet building. 

So, it could take up to two years to fully populate the farm, and 

like I said in my testimony, we need a steady supply of eggs to supply our customers and we cannot just completely depopulate a farm 

and continue our supply. So, that is why the system is set up for 

a constant rotation. 

Chairman ROBERTS. Thank you, sir. 

Mr. Klippen. 

Mr. KLIPPEN. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. There is a difference between meat birds, the broilers and the turkeys, and egg layers, because the true value of an egg layer are the future eggs it would 

have produced. I have in front of me 9 C.F.R. 56.4(a)(1). It says, 

in part, for laying hens, the appraised value should include the 

hens’ projected future egg production. That is the true value, and 

that is what we are trying to help provide APHIS with these different formulas so that they recognize it is not just the bird value, 

37 

but all the eggs that bird would have produced. We have provided 

statistics from Iowa State University to help APHIS understand 

those values. 

Chairman ROBERTS. I appreciate that. 

Senator Stabenow. 

Senator STABENOW. Well, thank you very much, Mr. Chairman, 

and I am going to ask just one two-part question so we make sure 

colleagues have the opportunity to ask questions before the vote 

today. 

Mr. Knecht, thanks again for your testimony and all the witnesses that are with us. As you are watching confirmed cases 

emerge in our neighboring states, I am wondering what advice you 

are giving Michigan poultry farmers going into the fall. Then, secondly, as we see more cases pop up in Michigan, are there any specific changes that you would like to see from APHIS that would 

make the agency’s mitigation efforts more effective? 

Mr. KNECHT. So, two parts, the first part being the—oh, help me 

on the first one. 

Senator STABENOW. Advice to poultry farmers—— 

Mr. KNECHT. Ah, the advice. Yes. Well, this is what we have 

been talking about all along, is the increased emphasis on biosecurity. We want to continue to talk to, amongst, across industries, 

layers, turkeys, and broilers to make sure everybody is doing 

things the right way, because if it is coming through the air or 

being transmitted person-to-person, you want to protect each other, 

and with the west side of Michigan being where the vast majority 

of the population of all poultry is in the State of Michigan, we are 

all very close to each other, similar to the way it is in Iowa. We 

want to continue to preach biosecurity, the showering in, showering 

out, clean vehicles and all of those things, and even going so far 

as the smaller things—communicating with your employees, having 

meetings and keeping everybody updated on what is going on. 

Specifically, as far as if something were—hopefully, nothing happens in Michigan, but if something does happen, we are trying to 

get better from a biosecurity perspective. We want to be constantly 

vigilant. But Senator Ernst talked a little bit earlier about that lag 

time from when something is detected to when something is—when 

the birds are moved off, and my fear is—that is my fear for producers in Michigan, is that the time is what, if you have two turkey farms on the same road that are maybe a quarter-mile apart 

or a half-mile apart, that those people can be affected because of 

that lag time. I am not saying that we can get it down to zero, but 

let us reduce it. 

Senator STABENOW. Okay. Thank you. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. 

STATEMENT OF HON. JOHN THUNE, U.S. SENATOR FROM THE 

STATE OF SOUTH DAKOTA 

Senator THUNE. Mr. Chairman, I have got to a meeting, probably 

will not be able to be back before the votes. I have got a statement 

and questions I would like to submit for the record, if that would 

be okay. 

[The prepared statement of Senator Thune can be found on page 

48 in the appendix.] 

38 

Chairman ROBERTS. Without objection. 

Senator THUNE. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. 

Chairman ROBERTS. Are you going to remain for questions, 

or—— 

Senator THUNE. No, I am not. I am sorry. I said I will submit 

them for the record. I do not want to cut the line here. 

Chairman ROBERTS. All right. Senator Ernst. 

Senator ERNST. Thank you, Mr. Chair and Ranking Member. 

Mr. Dean and Mr. Moline, again, thank you very much for being 

here today. Just one thing, in the interest of time, maybe, that 

APHIS could do better going forward, and then, also, maybe what 

the producers could do, as well, if you were empowered to do so, 

if there was something that you could do to help the situation. 

Mr. MOLINE. Thank you, Senator Ernst. What APHIS can do and 

the government can do with producers and growers, number one, 

the two things that have to be done is clear communication start 

to finish. When we get that presumptive positive on the farm, we 

need to be contacted immediately by the USDA. 

On our farm, we broke on a Tuesday morning. Our first contact 

with the USDA was Thursday and we did not depopulate until Saturday. With the clear communication, one area that was improved 

is when the USDA and APHIS sent Dr. Shere out to Iowa. He 

straightened up a lot of the miscommunication that was coming 

from the contractors and straightened up a lot of the other things 

that were getting misconstrued and just blatantly false. 

The second area that APHIS needs to improve on is the paperwork that is for these farmers and producers that we have to do 

moving forward. We want to keep all of our employees employed. 

We do not want them going to the unemployment lines. So, I, myself, have over 40 hours of paperwork involved with our three sites 

that were infected. Those hours could have been better utilized 

cleaning buildings, removing litter, disinfecting. 

By streamlining the paperwork end of things, it is going to allow 

the producers to have a clear road map of exactly what they are 

going to get paid and it will allow them to make the decisions almost immediately, because they know that they will be getting paid 

for everything they do and it will encourage them to do it themselves and will save the government money because you will rely 

less on outside contractors. 

Senator ERNST. So, empowering the producers to do more of the 

work, which I think is—— 

Mr. MOLINE. Absolutely. Encourage the producers to do more 

work. 

Senator ERNST. —is an effective way to do it. 

Mr. MOLINE. We are doing our own. We have one site that has 

been environmentally tested and cleaned. We have two sites that 

will be done shortly. We look to repopulate as soon as possible, 

looking at the end of July or early August. 

Senator ERNST. Thank you. 

Mr. Dean. 

Mr. DEAN. Yes, I agree with Mr. Moline’s, all of his comments. 

The process can be streamlined. Dr. Shere came into a horrible situation when he was given the assignment in Iowa and he was comVerDate Nov 24 2008 08:33 May 10, 2016 Jkt 000000 PO 00000 Frm 00042 Fmt 6633 Sfmt 6633 C:\USERS\MW42035\DESKTOP\DOCS\96181.TXT MICAH
39 

pletely behind the eight ball, a lot of miscommunication. I think it 

can be streamlined. 

One of the requirements is that you must have a signed document before they can start, which has been a delay in the process, 

to get somebody out and actually have that signature and have it 

signed, because there has been a lot of confusion. I think that can 

be streamlined and I think Dr. Shere is streamlining that. 

I also agree that there should be a greater incentive for the producer to do the clean and disinfectant, because they can do it a lot 

quicker and a lot more economical than what APHIS can do. 

APHIS is limited by their federal contractors, what they can do. 

They have got to suit up in the HAZMAT suits. 

For example, when we were depopulating our farms, our people 

were pulling out four birds to one of APHIS’s birds—or not APHIS, 

but the contractor. APHIS was not doing the work, but the federal 

contractor was. We were pulling out four to one, and I have heard 

several cases of that from other producers that are in the same situation. So, I think that process can be streamlined. 

As far as stopping the spread of virus, like it was talked about, 

killing fans immediately. We have actually tried to save birds by 

killing fans before we even had a presumptive positive, because we 

could tell by the clinical signs that we had it. So, we wanted to protect other people, other farmers around us, and protect our own 

flocks from the spread in the large. 

So, I think we have learned a lot of lessons going forward in this 

process that I think will improve the system. 

Senator ERNST. Thank you very much. I do think this is an area 

that if we are encouraging our producers to take more of that on 

their own shoulders, they know their buildings, they know their operations best, and I think it does save dollars in the long run for 

use within APHIS to hopefully prevent the spread of this disease 

in the future. 

So, again, thank you both for being here. We appreciate it. 

Thank you to the panelists for joining us today. Thank you, Mr. 

Chair. 

Chairman ROBERTS. Senator Donnelly. 

Senator DONNELLY. Thank you, Mr. Chairman, and I also will 

just ask one question or so in the interest of time so everybody has 

a chance, and that would be for Dr. Elam. 

As an economist, every impact creates a ripple that causes effects 

throughout the economy. So, this virus has not impacted just those 

producers that have directly experienced a loss, but has impacted 

the entire industry and consumers. Could you elaborate a bit on 

the impacts the outbreak has had on producers, even those who 

have not experienced a loss, and how it will impact consumers in 

the long term. 

Mr. ELAM. Certainly. The producers who have not experienced 

any of the loss, and that would be the vast majority of them, are 

seeing higher prices as a result of their neighbors’ bad fortune. So, 

they are getting a bit of a windfall, a profit gain, from this outbreak. 

But, at the same time, some of them have lost export business, 

as well, particularly in the broiler business. We have lost approximately $1.2 billion worth of broiler exports that these companies 

40 

are now going to have to divert into the domestic market. This is 

causing them an enormous amount of pain, even though they had 

no production loss. 

For the consumer, the loss is going to be higher prices, and you 

have got to keep in mind here that some people might say, well, 

you have prices go up, therefore, the value of this production has 

gone up, but that is not true. Just because something has a higher 

price does not mean it has a higher value. 

Think about an automobile, for example, which the cost of producing automobiles have gone up because of the fact we have added 

all these safety and convenience features to them, all the cameras 

and the USB ports and all of this, and the safety features, the airbags and so forth. That all costs money and the consumer gets a 

benefit from that. He drives a safer, more convenient car. 

That has not happened in the egg and turkey business. These 

products have not changed. Their prices have gone up, but we have 

not really added any real value to these products. We have added 

cost to the consumer, for which they are paying more and actually 

getting less. The consumer is going to suffer from this to the tune 

of about $3 billion in increased food expenditures that could have 

gone for other things in their budget. 

Senator DONNELLY. Thank you, Mr. Elam. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. 

Chairman ROBERTS. Senator Grassley. 

Senator GRASSLEY. My first question was already asked by my 

colleague from Iowa, but if there are any of you that want to expand on any of those things that you think that the federal government needs to do when responding to these outbreaks, you can 

have a little bit of my time to do it. But, I think it has been pretty 

well covered. But, does anybody have anything to add? 

[No response.] 

Senator GRASSLEY. Okay. Then, I will ask—— 

Mr. MOLINE. I do, Senator Grassley. 

[Laughter.] 

Mr. MOLINE. Sorry to interrupt you. We have talked a lot about 

biosecurity today, and I think the point that all of us producers are 

trying to get out of APHIS and the USDA, our own research and 

just our own findings on the farm, is we talked about biosecurity. 

Biosecurity costs money. It takes time. We are more than happy to 

do it. My brooder houses are shower-in, shower-out facilities. My 

finisher barns, they are wide open curtain barns. 

We need some help identifying what areas of biosecurity we need 

to improve on. So, my recommendation is we need research dollars 

through the USDA, ARS, and let us find out everything we can 

about this virus so we can improve our biosecurity and spend our 

money where it needs to be spent, as well as the government’s 

money. We lost 56,000 birds and two-thirds of our income this year. 

We need—there are many producers like myself that will not 

have the money to spend a lot on upgrading barns and facilities. 

So, we need the government and the USDA to tell us, or help us 

identify areas that we can efficiently spend money on and improve 

not only our own facilities, but the whole industry in the turkeys 

and as well as our neighbors and friends in the chicken business. 

Thank you, Senator Grassley. 

41 

Senator GRASSLEY. My last question would deal with whether 

you would like to see a vaccine available, and in answering that 

question, take the trade implications into consideration. 

Mr. MOLINE. Speaking for the turkey industry and myself as a 

producer, one of the first things that we asked right away, when 

it—we were one of the last farms infected by the avian influenza— 

we were asking, how soon can we vaccinate? We had friends and 

neighbors in Minnesota, Northern Iowa, our friends in the chicken 

industry were breaking right and left. We asked as soon as we 

could, can we get our pullets vaccinated at the hatchery? We would 

gladly vaccinate every turkey coming out of the brooder house at 

five weeks. As a grower that owns his own turkeys, we would do 

anything possible. 

So, yes, we vaccinate for a lot of things already and we want a 

vaccine and we would be more than glad to do it, whether it is at 

the hatchery or on the farm or both. Thank you. 

Mr. DEAN. The layer side of it, if I may expand on that, the layer 

side of it gets—we have got mixed feelings on vaccines, not only 

from the trade issue, which is more a broiler issue, but in the layer 

side of it, since our bird is in production for a substantially longer 

period of time, it would require a vaccination at the hatchery and 

then would require two booster shots while that bird is in production. 

That would mean a lot of people going into the buildings to do 

vaccination. You have to handle that bird while she is actually in 

production. You would actually—it is estimated that you would 

knock production about ten percent. It then puts the producer that 

has to vaccinate at an unfair disadvantage as far as the productivity of the operation if they have to vaccinate. 

I, just speaking as an egg producer and not as United Egg Producers, as an egg producer, I would just as soon see an effective 

stamp-out program and eradicate the disease rather than a vaccination program. 

Senator GRASSLEY. I am done. Thank you. 

Chairman ROBERTS. Senator Hoeven. 

Senator HOEVEN. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. 

I just kind of want to follow up along the lines of Senator Grassley. A lot of the discussion has been about what USDA needs to do, 

has been doing, and also, of course, what APHIS is doing and 

should be doing. My question is more focused on what do you think 

the Congress should do specifically that would help both now and 

to prevent future influenza-type outbreak. Focus more from what 

you perceive the Congress needs to be doing in addition to any of 

the steps that USDA has taken or is taking, or that APHIS has or 

is taking, and I would ask that for each of the witnesses, kind of 

a wrap-up. 

Mr. DEAN. I will take it first, since I am first in line. I think Congress can help develop some sort of an insurance program similar 

to federal crop insurance, on those same lines. I have been involved 

in several meetings as far as that goes, and I think that is something that would be needed that I think we could ask Congress for 

help. It sounds like it was introduced in the 2014 farm bill to already look at that program and look at something. We think that 

42 

is something that would be extremely important for the industry 

in the future, to have that type of insurance program available. 

Senator HOEVEN. Let me ask you a question right there. Have 

you talked to RMA or Brandon Willis about something like that? 

Has there been any discussion of any kind of insurance product 

along those lines? 

Mr. DEAN. Yes. In fact, Congressman King organized a committee and asked producers to come together in Iowa, and some of 

those people were at that meeting from USDA and so forth to look 

at those type of products and pattern something similar to the crop 

insurance. It is going to be extremely difficult to try and get private 

insurance companies to want to insure those type of products since 

we are in the middle of a disaster and the worst animal health 

issue that we have ever experienced in this country. It is going to 

be hard to get it done from private insurance companies. 

Senator HOEVEN. Have you seen Congressman King around anywhere so that you could ask him, like, the status of that, or—— 

[Laughter.] 

Senator HOEVEN. So, anyway, there has been some preliminary 

work done, and there had been some—because something like that, 

I think, you would want to start with some serious discussions with 

RMA and with somebody like Brandon Willis—— 

Mr. DEAN. I think they are already in the process of doing the 

studies, and UEP has offered to help as far as what we needed to 

get producers’ input and involvement as far as being able to do the 

risk assessment and so forth. 

Senator HOEVEN. But, it is something that some people in the 

House, Congressman King and others, are starting to look at? 

Mr. DEAN. I do not know whether it is at the House level. It is 

Congressman King that started that because he saw a need of that 

type of program, and then I think it gets handed off to other agencies to do the work and develop that type of product. 

Senator HOEVEN. Okay. Mr. Klippen. 

Mr. KLIPPEN. I agree with Mr. Dean. We have had discussions 

about insurance. Back in January, we had a group of different 

groups of people that represented different industries within the 

poultry industry, whether it was game birds or whether it was 

ducks or geese or—and we did talk about trying to look into insurance. Of course, that was in January. Had we known, we would 

have been a lot further along. But, I think that is an important 

first step, perhaps a crop insurance program of sorts. So, definitely. 

Senator HOEVEN. Mr. Moline. 

Mr. MOLINE. I agree, also, with what Mr. Dean said earlier on 

the insurance end of things. Also, in future farm bills, I would ask 

Congress to possibly look at updating the indemnity for more coverage on the turkeys maybe along with that, with an insurance 

program of some sort, and also factor in loss of production due to 

cleaning and things like that, as well. You know, not only did we 

lose the birds, we lost at least one more flock and possibly two, and 

I know many other producers are in the same boat. Thank you. 

Senator HOEVEN. Mr. Knecht. 

Mr. KNECHT. I was on a conference call with RMA not that long 

ago, I think it was about a month ago or so, right in the heat of 

all of this, and I think one of the challenges with the crop insurVerDate Nov 24 2008 08:33 May 10, 2016 Jkt 000000 PO 00000 Frm 00046 Fmt 6633 Sfmt 6633 C:\USERS\MW42035\DESKTOP\DOCS\96181.TXT MICAH
43 

ance program is the timeline for which it would be implemented. 

It sounded like it was a ways off in terms of actually having a 

product for egg producers to be able to purchase. I would take this 

opportunity—I know you do not want to go back to APHIS, but I 

would take this opportunity to voice support for a major overhaul 

or addition to the indemnity program for the real value of ag production. 

Mr. ELAM. I think it was mentioned earlier by the gentleman 

from USDA that is there anything beyond the truly innovative beyond the current policies of vaccination and depopulation that 

could address these issues longer term, truly innovative animal 

health solutions beyond the current measures, whether they involve genetic engineering, which I understand could be somewhat 

controversial, or other things maybe we have not even thought of 

today that could help. I am talking about some very basic R&D 

here beyond what USDA has currently charged APHIS—or what 

the Congress has currently charged USDA with. 

Senator HOEVEN. Thank you. I think you bring up some interesting points. I mean, that kind of goes to the whole GMO aspect, 

but that science has prevented a lot of disease in a lot of crops and 

a lot of animals—— 

Mr. ELAM. Exactly. 

Senator HOEVEN. —so I think you bring up a very important 

point. Thank you very much. 

Chairman ROBERTS. I want to thank each of our witnesses for 

sharing your experiences related to highly pathogenic avian influenza and its impact on the U.S. poultry sector. Your firsthand experience with this devastating virus has been invaluable to the 

committee as we look to ways to ensure the health and safety of 

America’s poultry and livestock. 

With regard to asking Congress what you need, I would only respond, ask not from Congress what you can do, but what you can 

do for your Congress. 

[Laughter.] 

Chairman ROBERTS. To my fellow members, we ask that any additional questions you may have for the record be submitted to the 

Committee Clerk five business days from today, or 5:00 p.m. next 

Tuesday, July 14. 

That concludes our hearing. 

[Whereupon, at 5:19 p.m., the committee was adjourned.] 

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