INTERIOR, ENVIRONMENT, AND RELATED 

AGENCIES APPROPRIATIONS FOR 2011 

HEARINGS 

BEFORE A 

SUBCOMMITTEE OF THE 

COMMITTEE ON APPROPRIATIONS 

HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES 

ONE HUNDRED ELEVENTH CONGRESS 

SECOND SESSION 

SUBCOMMITTEE ON INTERIOR, ENVIRONMENT, AND 

RELATED AGENCIES 

JAMES P. MORAN, Virginia, Chairman 

NORMAN D. DICKS, Washington 

ALAN B. MOLLOHAN, West Virginia 

BEN CHANDLER, Kentucky 

MAURICE D. HINCHEY, New York 

BETTY MCCOLLUM, Minnesota 

JOHN W. OLVER, Massachusetts 

ED PASTOR, Arizona 

MICHAEL K. SIMPSON, Idaho 

KEN CALVERT, California 

STEVEN C. LATOURETTE, Ohio 

TOM COLE, Oklahoma 

NOTE: Under Committee Rules, Mr. Obey, as Chairman of the Full Committee, and Mr. Lewis, as Ranking 

Minority Member of the Full Committee, are authorized to sit as Members of all Subcommittees. 

DELIA SCOTT, CHRISTOPHER TOPIK, JULIE FALKNER, 

JASON GRAY, and BRENDAN LILLY

Staff Assistants 

PART 7 

Page 

Voices From Our Native American Communities ........... 1 

Issues From the Field: Public Witnesses and Members.. 235 

Voices From Our Native American Communities ........... 365 

Witnesses—Prepared Statements for the Record ............ 483 

( 

Printed for the use of the Committee on Appropriations 


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Part 7 

Witnesses 


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INTERIOR, ENVIRONMENT, AND RELATED AGENCIES APPROPRIATIONS FOR 2011 


hsrobinson on DSK69SOYB1PROD with HEARING

hsrobinson on DSK69SOYB1PROD with HEARING
INTERIOR, ENVIRONMENT, AND RELATED 

AGENCIES APPROPRIATIONS FOR 2011 

HEARINGS 

BEFORE A 

SUBCOMMITTEE OF THE 

COMMITTEE ON APPROPRIATIONS 

HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES 

ONE HUNDRED ELEVENTH CONGRESS 

SECOND SESSION 

SUBCOMMITTEE ON INTERIOR, ENVIRONMENT, AND 

RELATED AGENCIES 

JAMES P. MORAN, Virginia, Chairman 

NORMAN D. DICKS, Washington 

ALAN B. MOLLOHAN, West Virginia 

BEN CHANDLER, Kentucky 

MAURICE D. HINCHEY, New York 

BETTY MCCOLLUM, Minnesota 

JOHN W. OLVER, Massachusetts 

ED PASTOR, Arizona 

MICHAEL K. SIMPSON, Idaho 

KEN CALVERT, California 

STEVEN C. LATOURETTE, Ohio 

TOM COLE, Oklahoma 

NOTE: Under Committee Rules, Mr. Obey, as Chairman of the Full Committee, and Mr. Lewis, as Ranking 

Minority Member of the Full Committee, are authorized to sit as Members of all Subcommittees. 

DELIA SCOTT, CHRISTOPHER TOPIK, JULIE FALKNER, 

JASON GRAY, and BRENDAN LILLY

Staff Assistants 

PART 7 

Page 

Voices From Our Native American Communities ........... 1 

Issues From the Field: Public Witnesses and Members.. 235 

Voices From Our Native American Communities ........... 365 

Witnesses—Prepared Statements for the Record ............ 483 

( 

Printed for the use of the Committee on Appropriations 

U.S. GOVERNMENT PRINTING OFFICE 

56–200 WASHINGTON : 2010 


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COMMITTEE ON APPROPRIATIONS 

DAVID R. OBEY, Wisconsin, Chairman 

NORMAN D. DICKS, Washington 

ALAN B. MOLLOHAN, West Virginia 

MARCY KAPTUR, Ohio 

PETER J. VISCLOSKY, Indiana 

NITA M. LOWEY, New York 

JOSE ́ E. SERRANO, New York 

ROSA L. DELAURO, Connecticut 

JAMES P. MORAN, Virginia 

JOHN W. OLVER, Massachusetts 

ED PASTOR, Arizona 

DAVID E. PRICE, North Carolina 

CHET EDWARDS, Texas 

PATRICK J. KENNEDY, Rhode Island 

MAURICE D. HINCHEY, New York 

LUCILLE ROYBAL-ALLARD, California 

SAM FARR, California 

JESSE L. JACKSON, JR., Illinois 

CAROLYN C. KILPATRICK, Michigan 

ALLEN BOYD, Florida 

CHAKA FATTAH, Pennsylvania 

STEVEN R. ROTHMAN, New Jersey 

SANFORD D. BISHOP, JR., Georgia 

MARION BERRY, Arkansas 

BARBARA LEE, California 

ADAM SCHIFF, California 

MICHAEL HONDA, California 

BETTY MCCOLLUM, Minnesota 

STEVE ISRAEL, New York 

TIM RYAN, Ohio 

C.A. ‘‘DUTCH’’ RUPPERSBERGER, Maryland 

BEN CHANDLER, Kentucky 

DEBBIE WASSERMAN SCHULTZ, Florida 

CIRO RODRIGUEZ, Texas 

LINCOLN DAVIS, Tennessee 

JOHN T. SALAZAR, Colorado 

PATRICK J. MURPHY, Pennsylvania 

JERRY LEWIS, California 

C. W. BILL YOUNG, Florida 

HAROLD ROGERS, Kentucky 

FRANK R. WOLF, Virginia 

JACK KINGSTON, Georgia 

RODNEY P. FRELINGHUYSEN, New 

Jersey 

TODD TIAHRT, Kansas 

ZACH WAMP, Tennessee 

TOM LATHAM, Iowa 

ROBERT B. ADERHOLT, Alabama 

JO ANN EMERSON, Missouri 

KAY GRANGER, Texas 

MICHAEL K. SIMPSON, Idaho 

JOHN ABNEY CULBERSON, Texas 

MARK STEVEN KIRK, Illinois 

ANDER CRENSHAW, Florida 

DENNIS R. REHBERG, Montana 

JOHN R. CARTER, Texas 

RODNEY ALEXANDER, Louisiana 

KEN CALVERT, California 

JO BONNER, Alabama 

STEVEN C. LATOURETTE, Ohio 

TOM COLE, Oklahoma 

BEVERLY PHETO, Clerk and Staff Director 

(II)


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DEPARTMENT OF THE INTERIOR, AND RELATED AGENCIES APPROPRIATIONS FOR 

2011 

TESTIMONY OF INTERESTED INDIVIDUALS AND 

ORGANIZATIONS 

TUESDAY, MARCH 23, 2010. 

VOICES FROM OUR NATIVE AMERICAN COMMUNITIES 

PUBLIC WITNESSES—REPRESENTATIVES FROM TRIBES AND NATIVE 

AMERICAN ADVOCACY GROUPS 

Mr. MORAN. Good morning to everyone. Thank you for being 

here. We are starting precisely at 9:30 and we want to welcome you 

to the first public witness hearing of the year. This morning and 

again this afternoon, we are going to hear from many of our partners and friends in the Native American community, and we want 

to especially welcome those of you who traveled from long distances 

this morning, all the way from the West Coast and many from 

Washington State. We do look forward to your testimony. 

I think that this quote from the constitution of the Iroquois Nation sums up why many of you have traveled here today and why 

the subcommittee believes your testimony is so valuable, and I 

quote, ‘‘Look and listen for the welfare of the whole people and 

have always in view not only the present but also the coming generations, even those whose faces are yet beneath the surface of the 

earth.’’ That is much of what we want to talk about, what we are 

doing to look forward to future generations. 

As my colleagues on this Subcommittee know, there are significant challenges facing the Native American community today including the availability of health services, access to quality education and combating crime in Indian Country. We continue to take 

steps to address these challenges, and we are proud that last year 

this Subcommittee under Chairman Norm Dicks’ leadership with 

support from Mr. Cole as well, so it was bipartisan, provided $2.6 

billion to the Bureau of Indian Affairs. This was a historic 10 percent increase in funding over the previous year’s levels. 

We were pleased to see a significant increase in the Indian Health Service’s budget request this year. The request is $4.4 billion. It is $350 million more than last year’s levels. 

Now for some important housekeeping items. We are going to 

have to remind all witnesses that you only have 5 minutes total to 

deliver your statement and to answer questions. We are going to 


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have to watch the timer closely to ensure that we hear from everyone on the schedule. When the orange light comes on, you have 

only 1 minute left and should then begin to wrap up. When the red 

light comes on, your time has expired. We do not like to do this, 

but it was either do it this way or only hear from half the witnesses, and so we figured we are better off giving everyone an opportunity to be heard even though it is going to be in a very tight 

time frame. Now, of course, your entire prepared statement will be 

included in the hearing record. 

Mr. MORAN. Before we get started, Mr. Cole or Mr. Simpson, did 

you have any comments? 

Mr. COLE. Thank you very much, Mr. Chairman. 

For those of you that are regulars at this Committee, you know 

I do not normally sit in this seat. This is Mr. Simpson’s seat. I feel 

a little bit like getting in the car with my dad right next to me, 

watching every move I make. 

Mr. MORAN. We will make sure he does not crash it. 

Mr. SIMPSON. I am going to be in and out at other hearings, so 

Mr. Cole is obviously the expert in this area. 

Mr. COLE. That is not true. My good friend, Mr. Simpson, knows 

at least as much about this as I do, and certainly Mr. Moran and 

former Chairman Dicks are wonderful partners in this work. 

Greetings, Mr. Chairman, and thanks to all of you who have 

come. This is an area of great interest and importance, I think, certainly to the country but to me personally. So as a Native American, as a tribal member, a lot of the problems that I see in other 

parts of the country, the same kinds of problems that exist in my 

area and certainly with the tribes that I am privileged to represent, 

11 different tribes actually in my district. So I look forward to the 

testimony. This is actually one of the highlights of the year for me, 

Mr. Chairman, to have the opportunity to hear so many voices from 

Indian Country and a lot of their concerns, their points of view, 

and frankly enjoy their wisdom on this. 

So it is a great privilege to be here. I look forward to a productive 

hearing. 

Mr. MORAN. Thank you, Mr. Cole. 

Mr. Simpson, did you have anything you—— 

Mr. SIMPSON. No, that is okay. 

Mr. MORAN. Very good. Mr. Dicks. 

Mr. DICKS. Well, I just want to welcome all of my friends from 

Washington State over here this morning, and today is a historic 

day. We are going to sign the health care legislation later this 

morning and so I will not be able to stay for all of the testimony, 

but I am going to be here for most of it, and I just want to say 

how glad I am that Mr. Moran has now assumed the chairmanship. 

He and I have been friends for 40 years. I hired him to work for 

Senator Magnuson. It just shows you what good judgment I have. 

And also we have the best committee terms of bipartisanship, and 

Mike Simpson and Tom Cole are just great supporters and have 

worked with us on these issues, and this is a committee that supports what the tribes are trying to do. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. 

Mr. MORAN. Thank you, Mr. Dicks. You have left me with big 

moccasins to fill. You have done wonderful work on behalf of Native Americans and we really thank you, and we appreciate your 


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continued intense involvement in these issues. Our first witness 

will be Henry Cagey, the chairman of the Lummi Indian Nation. 

Chairman Cagey, welcome. 

TUESDAY, MARCH 23, 2010. 

LUMMI INDIAN NATION 

WITNESS 

HENRY CAGEY 

Mr. CAGEY. Good morning, Mr. Chairman. My name is Henry 

Cagey, chairman of the Lummi Nation up in Washington State, 

and again, I appreciate the time that you have given the tribe to 

talk about our issues and some of our challenges. 

You know, again, I heard you loud and clear that we will summarize our testimony. For the record, Mr. Chairman, we are the 

third largest tribe in Washington State and we have over 5,200 

members in the tribe. We are a fishing tribe, and one of the challenges that we have is that our salmon are gone. Mr. Dicks has 

been working very hard in restoring our salmon and bringing them 

back, but again, the challenge that we face as a tribe is that we 

are still dependent on fishing. One of the things that we have been 

asking the Committee to look at is the hatchery line item, and 

again, the hatcheries are one of the few ways that we can sustain 

our economy. Hatcheries are one of the few ways that we can sustain our families and our fishing lifestyle that we have become accustomed to, and again, that is really challenging Mr. Dicks’s theory on wild stock versus hatchery stock. I understand that. 

But again, the Lummi are still a fishing economy, and again, our 

lifestyle has really changed in the last 10 to 20 years and it is really starting to show the effects of the drug abuse, the high dropout 

rates with our kids. The parents that we have are fishermen, and 

seeing that, we are working very hard to change the dependency 

on the fishing, but again, that is a hard corner to turn. We have 

a ways to go to address the next generation of these kids that are 

coming behind the current fishermen. So we are working with the 

Department of Labor, we are working with Commerce and looking 

at ways to sustain our fishing, but again, one of the things that we 

need the Committee to look at is the hatchery line item, and again, 

we support hatcheries. That is really one of the few areas where 

we can do that. 

The other areas that we want to hit on, Mr. Chairman, is the Indian Health Service. Contract health services is a huge need in the 

Northwest. Since we do not have hospitals, we are dependent on 

contract health service. 

The other thing that we are becoming aware of is HIV, HIV 

meaning that we are seeing increases in AIDS in our community, 

and starting to show some of the effects of that disease coming at 

us. 

The other part we would ask the Committee to look at is getting 

the Bureau of Indian Affairs to recognize this commerce declaration 

disaster. So again, this disaster that we are talking about, Mr. 

Dicks’s office is very familiar with the disaster, but we want the 


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Bureau of Indian Affairs to recognize this declaration that was 

issued in 2008, and for the last 2 or 3 years now we have been 

punted back and forth between the Administration and Congress 

and we need some better guidance on what we need to do with this 

declaration that was issued in 2008. 

The other area that we want to touch on, Mr. Chairman, is the 

Lummi Nation Slater Road Project, and it was a big project that 

we are in partnership with Whatcom County, and Whatcom County 

is a road that we have come to agreement with to basically take 

a look at the flooding area, and we have FEMA money that has 

been provided to the project but we need $6 million more to finish 

the project, and that is something that we want to get your support 

as well. 

The other part we want to wrap up is the Indian Energy and 

Economic Development Workforce Division within the Bureau that 

we are working with Mr. Middleton and his folks, and they are 

doing a very good job in at least taking some leadership in economic development. So energy and economic development, Mr. 

Middleton’s office, has been very supportive of our welding school 

and other things that we are creating through his shop. 

So again, on behalf of the Lummi Nation, we want to thank the 

Committee. We want to thank you for all your hard work you did 

last Sunday with the health care bill. We really appreciate everything that you guys do in supporting Indian issues. 

[The statement of Henry Cagey follows:] 


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Mr. MORAN. Thank you, Chairman Cagey, and right on the dot. 

You did it within 5 minutes. 

Does anyone want to make a comment or question? 

Mr. DICKS. I would just say we are pleased that on the BIA hatcheries we have been able to increase the funding by $5 million 

over the last 2 years. It still starts from a very small number but 

we have tried to help increase the funding and we will continue to 

look at that. 

Mr. MORAN. Very good. Thank you, Chairman Cagey. 

Next we will hear from Douglas R. Nash, who is the director of 

the Institute for Indian Estate Planning and Probate at the Seattle 

University School of Law. Mr. Nash. 

TUESDAY, MARCH 23, 2010. 

INSTITUTE FOR INDIAN ESTATE PLANNING AND 

PROBATE AT SEATTLE UNIVERSITY SCHOOL OF LAW 

WITNESS 

DOUGLAS R. NASH 

Mr. NASH. Thank you, Mr. Chairman, Mr. Vice Chairman, members of the Committee. As noted, I am the director of the Institute 

for Indian Estate Planning and Probate at Seattle University 

School of Law. Our organization establishes projects that provide 

estate-planning services to Indian people nationwide. We provide 

direct services through those projects to tribal member clients at no 

cost, and the statistics and the results of our work are contained 

in my written statement. Our work has proven that effective estate 

planning reduces the issue of fractionation on Indian-owned trust 

lands and reduces probates and consequently the cost of those probates. They are done through the Office of Hearings and Appeals 

within the Department of the Interior. 

Last year I appeared before the Subcommittee to urge funding 

for Indian estate planning projects. Last year the conference committee’s report urged the Bureau of Indian Affairs to provide funding for Indian estate planning projects through existing budget line 

items. We tried for months to find out how that language would be 

implemented and met with no success in that regard. This year we 

note that the Department has submitted a request for five new positions to implement the American Indian Probate Reform Act and 

they propose to do this through researching cost-effective actions 

regarding Indian estate planning and providing public information 

through the use of brochures and the use of news media. While we 

appreciate the Department’s interest and their actions, those proposed actions will not get wills done, they will not reduce fractionation and they will not avoid Indian probates. Consequently, they 

will not reduce the cost to the Federal Government for the Bureau’s administration of those fractionated interest and the cost of 

the probates that eventually come to pass regarding those 

fractionated interests. 

Through our projects and our experience, we have used almost 

every conceivable model to deliver estate-planning services to Indian people. We funded attorney projects, projects staffed by attorVerDate Mar 15 2010 02:18 May 18, 2010 Jkt 056200 PO 00000 Frm 00009 Fmt 6633 Sfmt 6602 E:\HR\OC\A200P2.XXX A200P2

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neys. We have utilized paralegals. We have the first Indian estateplanning clinic at Seattle University School of Law. We have 

stretched dollars so far as to establish pro bono projects in which 

retired attorneys provide estate-planning services at no cost. So we 

know the cost-effective models and we know how to stretch available dollars to provide the services. 

We also agree that public information is essential. We have utilized all of our projects to hold community outreach meetings to 

provide information to Indian landowners, to tribal leaders and to 

government officials as well. We have a website that provides information on a regular basis based upon interest. It is divided 

amongst attorneys, Indian landowners and tribal leaders. Over the 

past 5 years we have reached over 14,000 Indian people with our 

community outreach efforts. 

We have established that effective estate planning services will 

reduce fractionation, will reduce probates and consequently reduces 

the costs that are associated with those activities. We would ask 

again that this Subcommittee look at the prospect of funding those 

activities, which are built into the American Indian Probate Reform 

Act as is the authorization for appropriations and the direction of 

funds through contract to nonprofits as well as tribes. 

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I would be happy to answer any questions that you might have for me. 

[The statement of Douglas R. Nash follows:] 


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Mr. MORAN. Thank you very much, Mr. Nash. 

Any questions? 

Mr. DICKS. So you are saying this is authorized so it does not 

need an earmark, it could just be funded by the Committee? 

Mr. NASH. That is correct, sir. 

Mr. DICKS. What about a website? Do you have a website? 

Mr. NASH. We do, sir, Indianwills.org. 

Mr. DICKS. Thank you. 

Mr. MORAN. Mr. Cole. 

Mr. COLE. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. 

Mr. Nash, I am just curious, do you have any assessment on if 

Congress passed the Cobell settlement as negotiated, how would 

that impact what you are doing, particularly in the fractionated 

area? Would that be a big help dealing with some of these problems? 

Mr. NASH. The provision of funds for the land consolidation effort 

would have a big impact. The land consolidation program, as you 

know, was part of the American Indian Probate Reform Act, and 

the Act was designed actually to have both fronts active, estate 

planning and land consolidation activities, and it has been our assessment for years that those activities, if funded and active, would 

eventually reduce fractionation to the point that it would not be a 

problem. 

Mr. COLE. So I would assume on that ground alone you would 

see that the passage of the enactment of the settlement by Congress is a very good thing? 

Mr. NASH. We would, sir. 

Mr. COLE. Thank you very much. 

Mr. MORAN. Very good. I am glad you asked that question. 

Thank you, Mr. Cole. 

Mr. Simpson. Okay. Thank you very much, Mr. Nash. 

Mr. NASH. Thank you. 

Mr. MORAN. Next we will hear from Frances Charles, who is the 

chairwoman of the Lower Elwha Klallam Tribe. 

TUESDAY, MARCH 23, 2010. 

LOWER ELWHA KLALLAM TRIBE 

WITNESS 

FRANCES CHARLES 

Ms. CHARLES. Good morning. I thank you for the opportunity to 

testify on behalf of the Lower Elwha Klallam Tribe, and I would 

like to have it on record that we support the Affiliated Tribes 

Northwest of Washington State, the Northwest Portland Indian 

Health Board and also the Northwest Indian Fish Commission testimonies that are going to be heard before you today. Also, we support the budget request for the National Congress of American Indians and the Native American Health Board recommendations as 

well. 

One of the reasons that I am here before you today, in 1992 Congress enacted the Elwha River Ecosystem and the Fishery Restoration Act, Public Law 102–495. The law mandated the removal of 


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the Elwha and Glines Canyon dams from the Elwha River. The 

government committee itself addressed the public health and safety 

environment and economic development issues that we pertain. 

Dam removal will occur in 2011 and we thank you for the continued support for the dam removal project itself. The law states in 

section 7, ‘‘Tribal land acquisition and development. After the Secretary makes a determination to remove the dams and actually acquires the projects and funds are appropriated for such conveyance 

and removal, the Secretary is authorized to acquire by purchase 

and hold in trust in reservation status for their benefit of the 

Lower Klallam Tribe lands in Klallam County, Washington, for 

housing, economy development and moorage for the tribal commercial and fishing fleets. (B) There is authorized to be appropriated 

amount not to exceed $4 million to carry on land acquisition purposes for this section.’’ Congress authorized $4 million for land purchases for the tribe 

to make amends for the damages of tribal fisheries. The National 

Park Services acts as a lead agency for the federal dam removal 

projects and the mandate did not include addressing any appropriation for the tribe. It has been 18 years since the Act was 

passed, and we are requesting for an additional amount from the 

$4 million to $15 million due to the prices of the economics and not 

only that, for the cost of the land bases of the properties around 

the Klallam County area. 

And again, before the dams are removed, we are requesting some 

of the resources for the removal of the 200-year-old dams that have 

taken away and rendered the impossibilities of our tribal community who live on the fishing industry in the Port Angeles area. Of 

the $15 million requested, the tribe would immediately use $2 million to purchase and improve 12 acres centrally located on Highway 101 on the east shore of Lake Aldwell, therefore gaining a 

timely opportunity to develop the land that is contiguous to the 

project land that the tribe also seeks to acquire. 

Improvements would facilitate conversion of the parcel from private to public use including road access development, wastewater 

treatment, parking, utilities, trail development and facility upgrade. Acquisition and development on this site provide the unique 

setting for a world-class interpretative center to foster research in 

educational outreach and showcase ecosystem restoration, which 

will follow with the dams itself. So we ask for your continued support in that area. 

Also, the Lower Elwha Klallam Tribe is requesting funds for the 

tribal historic preservation in Port Angeles area that we are enriched with the cultural resources of significant sites. We have 

been involved in protecting and restoring the two ancient village 

sites which we had remains of over 300 of our Klallam ancestors, 

one of the largest single sites that have been unearthed west of the 

Mississippi River. Other sites of that area also include Ennis 

Creek, which is undergoing a cleanup. We also have other areas of 

the Pish as well as the dam, removal of sacred sites where we have 

ceremonial sacred grounds that we have been entwined with our 

community members and our elders have indicated a lot of the stories that are in some of their books for the youth and for our community itself. 


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We are also asking for the need to continue with the support for 

the National Historic Preservation and the Native American Grave 

Protection Act itself in those areas, and we really emphasize the 

importance, and we thank you for the opportunity to testify and 

that you have passed the health bill. We also encourage you to put 

some more money and resources to the tribal programs. Thank you. 

[The statement of Frances Charles follows:] 


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Mr. MORAN. Very good. Well done, Ms. Charles. Thank you. 

Mr. Dicks, did you have anything? 

Mr. DICKS. Well, I just want to say, this is going to be a very 

exciting year with the contracts going out finally for the dam removal, and it is a very large project but one that I think is going 

to be very beneficial to the tribe. 

Ms. CHARLES. Thank you. 

Mr. MORAN. Mr. Cole. Mr. Simpson. Okay. Very good. Thank you 

very much, Ms. Charles. 

Ms. CHARLES. One other comment is, please support our veterans 

that are out there. Thank you. 

Mr. MORAN. That is very good. 

Mr. DICKS. We do. 

Mr. MORAN. Now we will hear from Mr. David Bean, who is a 

council member of the Puyallup Tribe of Indians. Mr. Bean, please 

proceed. 

TUESDAY, MARCH 23, 2010. 

PUYALLUP TRIBE OF INDIANS 

WITNESS 

DAVID BEAN 

Mr. BEAN. Chairman Moran, Vice Chairman Dicks, members of 

the committee, thank you for allowing us to be here today to share 

our priorities for the fiscal year 2011 budget. 

I am here on behalf of our chairman, Herman Dillon, Sr. The 

Puyallup Tribe’s top priority is addressing the public safety needs 

of our community. For the last decade, the Puyallup Reservation 

has been in the crossfire of over 30 identified gangs. In the last 5 

years, we have lost several members as a result of gang violence. 

Our experience is that they are targeting younger and younger people every year but also if we do not stem this wave, we will lose 

a generation of Puyallup. The violence and criminal activity has 

touched virtually every family on our reservation, so our public 

safety needs are acute in all areas from patrol officers, tribal court 

funding, investigators and prosecutors. 

We presently fund 95 percent of our public safety. The BIA only 

funds 5 percent. What is more alarming is that the BIA’s amount 

of funding we have received in the last decade, we have not received any increases in the last decade. We understand that the increases in the BIA law enforcement accounts have been largely 

kept within the BIA itself. We urge the Committee to ensure that 

law enforcement funding is shared proportionately between the 

BIA and tribal law enforcement agencies. 

In responding to growing public safety need, the Puyallup Tribe 

fulfilled a vision in planning and development of a new justice center, a place where we will not only be able to properly house and 

rehabilitate offenders but also provide justice in a holistic and comprehensive way. We are honored to have received a DOJ ARRA 

grant for construction of the detention center portion and will be 

breaking ground within the next 90 days. However, we are fearful 

that the BIA will not be able to honor its commitment to fund the 


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operations of these new detention facilities once they come online. 

We urge the Committee to fund the operation of these new facilities and closely monitor the BIA’s process in this regard. 

The tribe’s second priority is the education of our children. We 

are deeply disappointed in the BIA’s budget for education. There 

are no proposed programmatic increases for BIA or tribally operated schools. Thus, our schools must now do the same job of educating our children with less funds, consequently, less staff. It is 

no wonder numerous tribal schools are failing the No Child Left 

Behind standards. 

Finally, within the BIA’s account, the Puyallup Tribe takes very 

seriously the responsibility to protect and manage our treaty-protected rights and resources. Thus, we fully support the President’s 

$28 million funding for BIA rights and protection. What we would 

ask is that Congress fund this account to the full $30 million that 

was provided by Congress in fiscal year 2010. 

I end this testimony with again a statement of thanks for the 

President’s proposed 8 percent increase in the Indian Health Service funding. However, the lines at our clinic and the health status 

of my elders tell me that this is not enough. Medical appointments 

are scheduled 3 months out, and in our dental clinic, patients wait 

up to 18 months for a root canal. Oftentimes they need a tooth extracted before it can be fixed. The contract care allocation has been 

significantly inadequate to meet the needs since 2004. At Puyallup 

alone, we face a $6 million shortfall. With no IHS hospitals in the 

Portland area, all specialty and hospital services are paid for out 

of contract health care. This means that children go without access 

to optometry and our elders are denied access to surgeries and specialty care. There is no access to after-hours urgent care, mammography, colonoscopy or inpatient drug and alcohol treatment. The 

tribe can fill some of this gap but we cannot fill it all. We need 

your help. 

And so in closing, I raise my hands to each and every one of you 

and say to you, thank you all for being here today and allowing us 

to share our priorities with you. 

[The statement of David Bean follows:] 


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Mr. MORAN. Thank you very much, David. 

Mr. Dicks. 

Mr. DICKS. Well, I want you to know that we are working with 

the local law enforcement people and we want to work with the 

tribe as well on this gang-related issue. This is a very serious matter. We take it seriously and we want to work with you on that and 

all the other issues that you presented. 

Mr. MORAN. Mr. Cole. 

Mr. COLE. I have several questions. First, thank you for your testimony. It is quite compelling. I am sorry I am not familiar with 

a lot about your particular tribe, but can you tell me what sources 

of income independent, if any, of the Federal Government you 

have? Do you have any tribal businesses? 

Mr. BEAN. We do have tribal businesses. We have a tribal casino. 

We are in the process of developing a port facility that was developing several acres of land that was returned to the Puyallup Tribe 

in 1988, the historic land claim settlement agreement that Vice 

Chairman Dicks was so instrumental in helping bring to life, so I 

want to say thank you for that, and we have a tax base where tax 

on cigarette sales, fuel sales, and exploring opportunities to diversify our economy. 

Mr. COLE. I am particularly struck, again you mentioned three 

areas and you started out with law enforcement, and obviously that 

is a matter of concern to everyone and we do obviously have a trust 

responsibility there, which I would suspect we have not met. In 

terms of law enforcement, I saw a little bit in your testimony, what 

is the size of your total budget and what are the sorts of things you 

need from the BIA, number one, and two, jurisdictionally, do you 

have some problems, do you feel limitations in terms of the amount 

of authority you get to exercise over your own land or people that 

commit crimes in your own territory? 

Mr. BEAN. Yes, there are several limitations. We are working 

with local law enforcement jurisdictions to cross-deputize our officers but have met some obstacles in that regard. Our public safety 

budget is about $5.7 million annually, and again, we find 95 percent of that, and so I would look for funding to increase our patrol 

officers. I would look for funding to help expand our court system 

as well as investigators, prosecutors. 

Mr. COLE. Last question, just on your health care needs. Again, 

what sort of percentage, if any, of that do you fund and is it contract services? Do you operate your own clinics? How does your 

health care structure work? 

Mr. BEAN. We do operate our own clinic. We contribute about $6 

million annually to our clinic. Its annual budget is about $21 million. So we fill that gap as best we can but again we fall short and 

appreciate any help you can give us towards that end. 

Mr. COLE. I will conclude with this. I just wanted to make the 

point, Mr. Chairman, a lot of these tribes, whatever their economic 

base, they turn around and invest very heavily back in their own 

people, actually making up for the shortfall that we legally are responsible for, and I suspect we are going to get case after case after 

case like this where you have tribes doing as much as they possibly 

can and really relieving the burden of the Federal Government, 

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man Dicks deserves credit for that more than any other single individual, but these are problems that are going to take sustained investment over many years to really catch up with the backlog. 

Thank you for your testimony. 

Mr. BEAN. Yes, sir. 

Mr. MORAN. Thanks, Mr. Cole. 

Mr. Simpson. 

Mr. SIMPSON. Did you say you were building, were planning to 

build a justice center? 

Mr. BEAN. Yes, sir. We have been planning a justice center for 

quite some time and again appreciate having been awarded ARRA 

funding for our detention center. 

Mr. SIMPSON. So it is in the planning stage? 

Mr. BEAN. Yes, sir, and we plan to break ground here in the next 

90 days. 

Mr. SIMPSON. One of the things we put in the language of the 

report last year is that the BIA should look at regional facilities, 

and the reason I ask this is, Shoshone-Bannock Tribe, Fort Hall 

Reservation, just opened a justice center. I went to their opening 

in February. They actually built it and their concern is the same 

as yours, operating these afterwards, but the language we put in 

the report is that the BIA should look at the possibility of regional 

facilities. Would this be a regional facility? Would you be able to 

use it for that? 

Mr. BEAN. We could. We would have to expand it. Presently, it 

is only 26 beds. There are 25,000 Native Americans within our 

service area, and so we definitely—our needs are larger than what 

we have presently for this facility. 

Mr. SIMPSON. Do the other tribes in the same region have the 

same issues with the justice—when I went out and looked at the 

facilities, the buildings, they were, frankly, deplorable. Do the 

other tribes have those same problems? 

Mr. BEAN. Yes. I recently visited. I was east of the mountains in 

Spokane and saw a BIA facility, and it was just in terrible condition, not very safe, as well as our own. I have been to the Nisqually 

Tribe. They are developing a beautiful facility, which is about 20 

miles south of Puyallup. 

Mr. SIMPSON. Thank you. 

Mr. MORAN. Thanks, Mr. Simpson. 

Thank you, Mr. Bean. Thank you very much. 

We will now hear from Mr. Billy Frank, who is the chair of the 

Northwest Indian Fisheries Commission. Mr. Frank. 

Mr. DICKS. Welcome, Billy. 

Mr. MORAN. You can introduce the folks that you are accompanied with. 

TUESDAY, MARCH 23, 2010. 

NORTHWEST INDIAN FISHERIES COMMISSION 

WITNESSES 

BILLY FRANK, JR. 

BOB KELLY 

MICHAEL GRIM 


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Mr. FRANK. We are handing out our annual report. There is a 

map in front there. That tells who we are, Mr. Chairman. 

Thank you for having us here, and congratulations, Mr. Dicks. 

Mr. MORAN. Mr. Dicks is now responsible for the country’s defense in addition to being responsible for its interior. 

Mr. DICKS. Formerly. 

Mr. FRANK. That is good. I am Billy Frank, chairman of the 

Northwest Indian Fish Commission. It is indeed a privilege for me 

to be among the distinguished cadre of Northwest tribal leaders, 

who are also here, and this is most all of our tribes right here and 

the national tribes, you know, we are all here. 

Mr. MORAN. Would you introduce the gentlemen with you? 

Mr. FRANK. Yes. This is the new chairman of the Nootsack Tribe, 

Bob Kelly, and this is my executive director of Northwest Indian 

Fish Commission, Mike Grim, and they are going to respond here 

in a minute. Their strong support and encouragement gives our organization focus and direction and helps make us successful in protecting and enhancing the treaty rights. 

Now, out of the United States versus Washington, we became comanagers with the State of Washington in fishery management 

and natural resources, and we sit on a 200-mile international treaty Pacific Salmon Management Council from Mexico to Alaska. We 

sit on the international treaty now and for the last 35, 40 years 

and we are fishery managers. The tribes are on every one of these 

watersheds along the Pacific Coast and inside Puget Sound, and 

the State of Washington, they are on course. They are putting the 

watersheds back together. We work with the Puget Sound Partnership. We work with the Federal Government and co-management 

with the State of Washington, and we are managers. Michael. 

Mr. GRIM. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. As you will see from our 

testimony, the Northwest Indian Fisheries Commission, the 20 

tribes that make up the Commission make up Puget Sound as well 

as the coast. If you look to your far left on the page, you will see 

our coastal tribes as well as our Puget Sound tribes. We have a 

number of Acts that all of our 20 tribes are in the process of implementing. In many of those cases, we went through the long process 

of planning for recovery on a number of species and we are not into 

implementation. The main and most important Act that we face is 

the Endangered Species Act, and we have a number of listings. We 

have Puget Sound Chinook, Lake Ozette sockeye and steelhead is 

not far away. 

What we are starting to see as we move forward into implementation with our 20 tribes is that we are running into the harsh reality that there are two different standards that we are addressing 

here as we look at achieving our goals and objectives in the implementation of these plans that we have. We have plans in every 

basis for our Chinook species. There is a different stock relative to 

every river if you look at the map. When we talk about the standards, the tribal standard that we equate with the trust responsibility that the agencies and the Federal Government have in terms 

of protecting and restoring these treaty rights is somewhere up 

here. You have got harvestable numbers versus a different standard with the Act, which is something more attune to museum 

pieces, and we have this large gap that we have identified. 


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Now, with every piece of funding that we can get our hands on, 

our member tribes, we are collaborating as much as possible. There 

are a couple of different ways we could go. We could fight like hell 

through the courts or we could choose the collaborative route and 

try to work with our local governments. We have local governments 

in each one of these basins. We work very closely with the state 

government and the agencies as well as we try to implement these 

Acts but the main message as you read through our testimony is 

that we have two different standards that we are trying to achieve 

here and we need your help in terms of helping us achieve the 

standard that means the most for us, which is harvestable numbers and not museum pieces. 

Mr. MORAN. Thank you. Very good. 

Mr. Kelly. 

Mr. KELLY. I see we are pretty short on time so just allow me 

just a couple of seconds to wrap up. First of all, I just wanted to 

recognize how important the actions of this Committee were last 

year to address the needs that we identified in the BIA rights protection. That was huge. One of our priorities this year is to try to 

maintain those gains that you were able to provide. The President’s 

budget came up short. There was a 10 percent reduction, or 10 percent of those gains were not included in the President’s budget request for the western Washington fish management and the Washington State timber, fish and wildlife program and so we want to 

see those restored. In addition, we also want to note that we continue to have more needs than this Committee was able to address 

last year but I do not want to diminish the significance of what you 

did do. 

We also, as Mr. Dicks pointed out, we also have an interest in 

continuing increase in fish hatchery maintenance. You have done 

a tremendous job getting that up but again we have additional 

maintenance needs. 

Then lastly, EPA, I wanted to make note that we very much support what we see in the President’s budget there for the Indian 

GAP program. This new multimedia tribal implementation grant 

program is huge to us. That is going to go a long way to addressing 

our partnership with EPA with tribal environmental programs. 

And we support increasing the Puget Sound back to the $50 million 

mark that this Committee was able to get in last year. 

Mr. MORAN. Very good. Mr. Dicks. 

Mr. DICKS. You were very good on that, and you also want to see 

the Legacy Roads and Trails restored to its level too, which will 

also help us on the habitat. 

Mr. MORAN. Mr. Frank. 

Mr. FRANK. Mr. Chairman, we have Ed Johnstone from the 

Quinault tribe. He is our treasurer, so he just has to look good. 

[The statement of Billy Frank, Jr., follows:] 


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Mr. MORAN. We will do what we can, particularly for the salmon 

harvest. Thank you all very much. 

Mr. DICKS. Thank you, Billy. Good job. 

Mr. MORAN. Mr. Cole, we are out of time so—— 

Mr. COLE. Just one quick question. I am always amazed at the 

diversity of Indian Country, and I have learned more about fisheries from Mr. Dicks. We do not have a lot of those in Oklahoma 

for our tribes. That has never been a major source of income or 

livelihood. I am just curious, could you tell me how many Native 

Americans are involved in this industry amongst the 20 tribes that 

are in the Commission? How big an economic impact is this activity? 

Mr. JOHNSTONE. The three tribes are the Lummi, the Makah and 

the Quinault. Just using those as an example, we have probably 

between 300 and 400 at Quinault and I would say the other tribes 

also. I would say the Quinault and the Lummi—Henry is here. He 

has probably got 400 to 500. We have 300 to 400 at Quinault, and 

I would say at Makah you would easily have 400 to 500. 

Mr. COLE. So these are really substantial parts of the local economy? 

Mr. JOHNSTONE. Definitely. 

Mr. GRIM. It supports not only their economy but also their culture, and the local economy. 

Mr. DICKS. And there is a lot of recreational fishing associated 

with this too. I mean, there is both the commercial side of this and 

the recreational, and a lot of the work that we do helps both. 

Mr. COLE. And I assume that under treaties that you have got 

rights obviously that nobody else has in terms of the amounts you 

are able to harvest, the season, what have you. 

Mr. FRANK. It is very unique, Mr. Cole. We are the only treaty 

tribes along the Pacific Coast and throughout all of the Nation, and 

I mean real comprehensive fishery management programs, shellfish, hunting, all of that, gathering, harvesters and gatherers. 

Mr. COLE. I will not take the Committee’s time, but I would like 

to learn more about it sometime. It is very different than the tribes 

I represent. 

Mr. MORAN. Thank you, and Chairman Cagey of the Lummi Nation indicated it had been 700 fishers supporting 3,000 people, now 

it is down to 500 in just a decade, so there are problems that are 

consistently felt across the board. 

Our next speaker will be Ralph Forquera. He is the executive director of the Seattle Indian Health Board. Mr. Forquera. 

TUESDAY, MARCH 23, 2010. 

SEATTLE INDIAN HEALTH BOARD 

WITNESS 

RALPH FORQUERA 

Mr. FORQUERA. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. 

Good morning. My name is Ralph Forquera. I am the executive 

director of the Seattle Indian Health Board. The Seattle Indian 

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We are celebrating our 40th anniversary this year, so I think we 

are the oldest and probably one of the larger Indian urban health 

programs in the country. 

I would first like to thank the Committee for the generous contribution that they made last year to the urban Indian health program. An additional $5 million was added to our budget, which 

meant that we received almost $7 million in increase for the urban 

program, which is the largest single increase in the history of the 

program, and I just wanted to acknowledge the great work that you 

guys are able to do, and I know that Mr. Dicks was very involved 

in that process and we really appreciate it. 

I have three items that I would like to speak to regarding the 

urban Indian health programs. One is sexual violence against 

women. In a meeting that the President held with the tribes in November of last year, one of the items that was brought up repeatedly is the fact that there seems to be an epidemic of sexual violence against Indian women on reservations. We recently looked at 

a study called the National Study of Family Growth, which is a 

CDC-sanctioned study. It is the first time that Indians have ever 

been looked at in this particular database, and we found remarkable evidence of sexual violence among Indian women living in cities also. So one of the recommendations I would like to ask is that 

the Committee consider additional funding to look more specifically 

at this particular issue among the Indian population and hopefully 

begin to build partnerships in order to be able to address that particular issue. 

The second item that I would like to mention is electronic health 

records for the urban Indian health programs. Last year the Congress appropriated $85 million to the Indian Health Service for 

technology and electronic health records through the ARRA fund. 

The urban Indian health programs were not considered eligible for 

any of those dollars so we received no financing for electronic 

health records from that particular fund. This year, even with the 

increase that was provided for the urban Indian health programs, 

the Indian Health Service only set aside $95,000 to support technology, and that was primarily to train people in their RPMS system, their electronic health records system, that many of us do not 

operate, primarily because of the kinds of operations that we have. 

We have a need for a much broader array of technologies than the 

Indian Health Service’s system has available to it, so I would like 

to request that the Committee consider about a $2 million appropriation for advances in the non-RPMS technology for the urban 

Indian programs. 

And finally, Mr. Moran, you mentioned earlier the importance of 

looking at especially Indian youth. This is one of the areas that we 

have been working on. I also direct the Urban Indian Health Institute, which is a small research center that we created back in 2000 

to basically begin to look at urban Indian health issues. The Indian 

Health Service has never really spent a lot of time looking at urban 

Indians and so my organization decided that we would try to address that particular issue. One of the areas that we have been 

most concerned about is the area of youth issues. We know that 

there are a number of youth that are at high risk. We also know 

that there are a number of urban Indian youth that have for a vaVerDate Mar 15 2010 02:18 May 18, 2010 Jkt 056200 PO 00000 Frm 00037 Fmt 6633 Sfmt 6602 E:\HR\OC\A200P2.XXX A200P2

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riety of reasons succeeded very well, but we do not know what are 

the causative factors of those youth. So we started working with 

Dr. Robert Blum at the Johns Hopkins University, who has done 

the last study on Indian youth back in 1988, so it is quite old, and 

there were no urban Indians that were looked at at the time. But 

working with Dr. Blum, we started talking about trying to develop 

a study specifically to look at the urban Indian communities, working through the network of urban Indian programs around the 

country. We estimate that this will be about a 3-year project. It will 

take somewhere around $1 million to $1.5 million to do based on 

what our estimates are for that particular project. And we had 

been looking for resources within the bureaucracy itself, within 

DHHS and the Indian Health Service and have not really been able 

to pull anything together, so I thought that this year I would try 

and make a request of the Committee itself to see if there might 

be some interest in doing that particular work. 

We want to congratulate you on the passage of the health reform 

bill and we think that that will have a profound effect on the urban 

Indian programs over time, but we think it is going to take time 

to get there, and what we are looking for is some bridge opportunities in order to be able to build that capacity. Thank you very 

much. 

[The statement of Ralph Forquera follows:] 


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Mr. MORAN. Thank you very much, Mr. Forquera. 

Mr. DICKS. We appreciate your being here and your leadership 

on these issues, and we are glad we were able to keep this program 

alive a few years ago, and now it is back in the President’s budget, 

which is very positive. Thank you. 

Mr. FORQUERA. It was very reassuring for us to get that kind of 

an increase. I mean, it was just finally somebody kind of patted us 

on the back for the work that we have been trying to do for a long 

time. 

Mr. MORAN. Mr. Cole. 

Mr. COLE. Yes, I have a couple questions. First, I wanted to follow up on this violence to women off the reservation. We normally 

attribute it on the reservation, a big part of it obviously the absence of law enforcement. One would suspect that would be less the 

case in urban centers that are outside of reservations. Do you have 

any particular reason? 

Mr. FORQUERA. We do not, and that is one of the reasons why 

we want to look at this. We think some of it may be—you talked 

about earlier the gang issue and especially young women being affected by early gang involvement and gang activity in cities. But 

we really do not know, and that is one of the things that we need 

to look at. We were quite surprised at the extent of the violence. 

It was a very small cohort so it was not a large group, so you would 

not have expected the intensity of the responses that we got on 

that particular issue, so it must be a major issue and we would like 

to look more at what are some of those causative factors and see 

if there are interventions that we can effect. 

Mr. COLE. A couple other quick questions. Just educate me, how 

many—number one, are you comparable to—we have Indian health 

facilities off reservations or outside areas of historic jurisdiction, 

Oklahoma City and Tulsa, enormously important to us. Is that basically the scope of your operations? Well, how many patients do 

you see? 

Mr. FORQUERA. It depends. We see about 7,000 or 8,000 Indian 

people a year in our program. It is quite a comprehensive program 

because we have a fairly sizable clinic, very similar to, actually 

probably closer to Tulsa than Oklahoma City because Oklahoma 

City has a much larger program. Our program is fairly similar to 

the Tulsa program. We have a couple of unique characteristics. We 

have a family practice residency program, for example, where we 

actually train Indian docs on site, and then we have this research 

institution. We also manage Thunderbird Treatment Center, which 

is a residential drug and alcohol treatment program, and that is in 

the process of a transition right now too because it was primarily 

state funded in Washington State and the state has really had 

some serious financial problems in the last couple of years, so we 

are seeing some erosion in that area but it has not quite impacted 

us as much as it has some of the other communities. 

Mr. COLE. I assume again, like Oklahoma City and Tulsa, that 

any tribal members eligible to use the facility or restricting certain 

tribes, or what have you? 

Mr. FORQUERA. Yes, we actually serve members from about 250 

Indian tribes from around the United States, plus we serve nonfederally recognized Indians also so state-recognized Indians and 


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Indians that are no longer affiliated with a tribe. So we have a 

number of state-recognized tribal people representing our service 

population as well as a lot of descendants of people that were displaced as a result of the relocation programs, a number of people 

that cannot link back to their home reservations or their home 

tribes anymore but yet we can follow their heritage by going back 

through linear kinds of things. We work with the Mormon Church, 

we work with the census and a whole variety of different places to 

try to get information for people. 

Mr. COLE. Well, thanks for what you do. This is a huge problem, 

Mr. Chairman, that we have got a lot of natives a long way away 

from their tribes, a long way away from their historic areas. They 

still have frankly the same trust rights and same negotiated privileges as those back on a reservation or in an area of historic jurisdiction, so making these kinds of services available in urban areas 

is absolutely critical. 

Mr. FORQUERA. Thank you very much. 

Mr. COLE. Thanks for the work you do. 

Mr. MORAN. Thank you. Would it not be fair to say that nearly 

all of your clientele would have incomes below $44,000 for a single 

person, $88,000 for a family of four? 

Mr. FORQUERA. About 86 percent of our clients are below 100 

percent of poverty, so whatever the standard is for 100 percent of 

poverty. So it is a very, very large—— 

Mr. MORAN. So they would qualify for 100 percent subsidy? 

Mr. FORQUERA. The majority of them would, yes. 

Mr. MORAN. And would not be paying anything for the health 

care that will now be made available to them from the health care 

bill that was signed Sunday. 

Mr. FORQUERA. That is correct. 

Mr. MORAN. They can go to an insurance company, they can get 

their insurance policy. The Federal Government will pay 100 percent for 86 percent of them. I suspect it will provide a subsidy for 

100 percent because the subsidy extends up to 400 percent of poverty. 

Mr. FORQUERA. That should cover a significant number of our 

population. 

Mr. MORAN. Virtually all the clientele that you serve, so it will 

have a dramatic impact on the quality and accessibility of health 

care. 

Mr. FORQUERA. Absolutely, and I think over the course of the 

next 4 or 5 years as all this gets rolled out, we will be able to really 

see the impact of that as well as better define the structures and 

the systems that we need to have in place that we are going to be 

able to care for them. 

Mr. MORAN. Well, there will be financial incentive for insurance 

companies to do that since the government will be paying them directly. Thank you very much, Mr. Forquera. 

Mr. FORQUERA. Thank you. 

Mr. MORAN. Joseph Pavel, the vice chair of the Skokomish Indian Tribe. Thank you for coming. 


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TUESDAY, MARCH 23, 2010. 

SKOKOMISH INDIAN TRIBE 

WITNESS 

JOSEPH PAVEL 

Mr. PAVEL. Joseph Pavel, Skokomish Tribe. Thank you for this 

opportunity. Chairman Moran, Congressman Dicks, good to see you 

again, members of the committee. I am Joseph Pavel and I am here 

on behalf of the Skokomish people, on behalf of our community and 

the great needs that we have. Our community is certainly at high 

risk, at great risk. Public safety is a big issue for us. We are a 

small rural community, Hood Canal in western Washington, not 

immune from any of the other problems that you have heard spoken of this morning. 

Just this last holiday season, we had two young men die of drug 

abuse situations. This is something that our community is not willing to tolerate anymore. They have directed us to counsel the staff 

to take action, to take steps to remedy this situation. This is something that the community has been very sincere about for many, 

many years. When I was first on the tribal council in the early 

1980s, we had no capacity to address these issues. We started out 

with basically hiring a tough guy half time, gave him a shirt, walking up and down the reservation half time. I think we were able 

to fund him out of a domestic violence community outreach grant. 

And we have been struggling to build our law enforcement, our judicial system by cobbling together whatever we could. We do not 

receive any BIA enforcement dollars. You know, we are a small 

tribe, formally a 280, which is a jurisdictional situation. We have 

since been endorsed by the state and county or rescind jurisdiction 

back to the tribe. The Department of Interior has not recognized 

that as yet because we do not have the capacity to maintain law 

enforcement and they refuse to provide that capacity to the tribe. 

So the Bureau of Indian Affairs within that culture, that society 

is pervasive. I believe this was one of the original roles, policing 

tribal people, tribal reservations. It is an area of jurisdiction that 

they continue to hold tight-fisted to their own selves. They need to 

be directed to allow for tribal programs to develop, to be enhanced, 

to provide the capacity for tribes to enforce their own laws and 

codes in our own communities. We have been very successful at 

putting together with whatever resources we could find our public 

safety program. We have a very, I believe, appropriate set of codes 

and ordinances. Certainly they need to be enhanced, continued to 

work on. We are a member of an intertribal court system that 

struggles to be funded. The Bureau of Indian Affairs does not support them. They get nominal funding. They have received no increases from any of the recent upgrades in the Bureau law enforcement judicial appropriations. The Bureau needs to be directed to be 

forthcoming with those dollars. 

Our people are in a crisis. We are in the process of developing 

a multi-pronged approach to deal with these issues. Certainly prevention is huge on the list. I think a community that feels safe and 

secure that they can be comfortable in their own homes, not the 

victim of crime, not have to be fearful. Every one of our folks is a 


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victim, not only those that are a direct victim of a crime or in this 

situation of drug use and abuse or dealing it but every single one 

of our members, every one of our families is immediately affected 

just tremendously right to the core of our families, our community 

and our culture, and this is something that we have been directed 

to address and we are very sincere and we will work diligently towards that effort. We ask for the Committee’s support in that. We 

ask that the Bureau be forthcoming with providing that support capacity for tribes, Skokomish Tribe as well, particularly who I am 

here to speak for but I am sure we are not unique in that situation 

across the country, that we need to get over this area of distrust, 

of turf. Tribal courts, tribal law enforcement are often not very well 

trusted. I think in our area, we have been able to address those 

issues. We have support for the law enforcement community in our 

area and we have a high standard. 

[The statement of Joseph Pavel follows:] 


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Mr. MORAN. Thank you very much, Vice Chair Pavel. I do see 

that crime rate is five times the national average and half of the 

members of the tribe have been victims of crime, many of them violent crime. It is a very difficult situation and I am glad you brought 

it to our attention. 

Mr. Dicks. 

Mr. DICKS. Has the BIA been out on the reservation? 

Mr. PAVEL. No. 

Mr. DICKS. Have you invited them to come out there? 

Mr. PAVEL. No, we have not. 

Mr. DICKS. Do you think that might be a useful idea to have 

them come out? 

Mr. PAVEL. Certainly. 

Mr. DICKS. We could ask somebody to come out. I would be glad 

to be there myself to have a discussion. I think we need to take 

some extraordinary steps here, so I would appreciate it if you 

would get in contact with me so that we can figure out what to do 

about this. 

Mr. MORAN. It sounds like they need to assign more BIA officers. 

Mr. Cole. 

Mr. COLE. No questions. 

Mr. MORAN. Mr. Simpson. 

Mr. SIMPSON. No questions. 

Mr. MORAN. Thank you very much, Mr. Pavel. 

Our next speaker will be Ray Peters. He is the tribal administrator of the Squaxin Island Tribe. Mr. Peters. 

TUESDAY, MARCH 23, 2010. 

SQUAXIN ISLAND TRIBE 

WITNESSES 

PETE KRUGER 

RAY PETERS 

Mr. KRUGER. Good morning, distinguished members of the Committee. I am Pete Kruger, secretary of the Squaxin Island Tribe. 

Congratulations, Chairman Moran, on your recent appointment. 

On behalf of Squaxin, I offer the support of our people to assist you 

and your staff in anything that we can. 

Mr. MORAN. Thank you. What is the story with Mr. Peters? 

Mr. DICKS. He is right here. 

Mr. MORAN. Oh, there we go. Okay. Good. So you are accompanied by Mr. Peters? 

Mr. KRUGER. Yes. 

Mr. MORAN. Very good. 

Mr. KRUGER. Thank you for inviting the Squaxin Island Tribe to 

provide testimony on our 2011 funding request. I would like to introduce Mr. Ray Peters, executive director, also a tribal member, 

who will present our request to you today. Thank you very much. 

Mr. MORAN. Very good. Thank you, Mr. Kruger. 

Mr. PETERS. It is my honor on behalf of the Squaxin tribal leadership and the tribal members to give this testimony to you. I want 

to go on record by saying that the regional requested recommendaVerDate Mar 15 2010 02:18 May 18, 2010 Jkt 056200 PO 00000 Frm 00050 Fmt 6633 Sfmt 6602 E:\HR\OC\A200P2.XXX A200P2

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tions of the Northwest Portland Area Indian Health Board, Affiliated Tribes of Northwest Indians and Northwest Indian Fish Commission that the Squaxin Island people fully support their request. 

The first request that I would like to talk about is a request to 

the Northwest Indian Treatment center. It is a regional facility. It 

is very effective. It is an accredited facility through CARF. It is recognized. It is certified by the State of Washington Department of 

Health. We have been a treatment facility since 1993, and have 

served an average of 180 Native Americans per year. With the diminishing resources at the state level and increasing access problems we will face, this will decrease our funding for beds. This increase in the base funding will be the first increase since the original 1993 Congressional set-aside. The co-occurring treatment addresses the historic trauma, specifically post-traumatic stress disorder, by increasing a grief process that takes into account a historical context. Patients see their addictions and problems in their 

community in a historical context, which in itself can be healing 

and inspires the recovery to be active participants in the healing 

back home. I have seen as a tribal administrator firsthand a tribal 

member who has been affected by these addictions, see people come 

out of the Northwest Indian Treatment Residential Program and be 

active participants in our community healing and go on to get educations, be an inspiration to their children, be inspirations and become leaders of the tribe. It is paramount that our base funding 

is increased. Due to the funding that we seek and have leverage 

from the State of Washington, it is important that we get some increase in that area. 

As well as you have heard from other tribes, public safety is a 

big concern for the Squaxin people. Our reservation is also on the 

mainland and our island in the waterways, our tree rights, shellfish, we are the people of the water, and then our hunting lands 

are nearly 3 hours away. That poses some challenges. The lack of 

enforcement in officers, we have become a target of those peddlers 

of poison and methamphetamine that also affect our community. 

We are one of the first tribes to start a tribal historic preservation office and we appreciate the funding that we received from the 

Federal Government, but as other tribes have gotten their offices 

up and going, that funding has decreased and so while it is good 

that other tribes are starting their office, we will receive nearly 150 

requests per year for land projects within our lands that require 

our oversight and research, and the funding does not even cover a 

part-time archaeologist or an assistant to be able to handle the administrative paperwork for that. We do appreciate the increase 

that has been shown, but due to the number of offices that are 

being started up, it actually has become a decrease in our overall 

annual funding. 

As well, we request that the final payment to the Puget Sound 

regional shellfish settlement be fulfilled, and we are responsible for 

co-managing that resource and want to enhance those areas. 

[The statement of Pete Kruger follows:] 


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Mr. MORAN. Thank you, Mr. Peters, and thank you, Council 

Member Kruger. 

Mr. Dicks. 

Mr. DICKS. Good to see you guys. We will certainly work with 

you on these issues. 

Mr. COLE. I have just a quick question if I may, again just educational for me. I noticed just looking at your testimony you are the 

largest employer in your local area. Can you tell me what your economic base is, what your activity is, how you generate your own 

income? 

Mr. PETERS. Yes. We have Sala Seafoods Company, where we 

grow oysters, sell shellfish, which we buy from our tribal harvesters, as well as salmon, and then we sell that, so we have Sala 

Seafoods, and we have Little Creek Casino and Resort. We also run 

two trading posts, convenience stores, and then also run Skookum 

Creek Tobacco Company. 

Mr. COLE. And roughly how many employees and what is the 

breakdown between tribal and non-tribal? 

Mr. PETERS. In the government, we have about 150 full-time employees. In the enterprise, Island Enterprise Inc., we have just 

about 90, and then at the casino resort, which we have 200 rooms, 

as well we have just under 1,000. 

Mr. COLE. And again, how many native, how many non-native? 

Mr. PETERS. We have about 30 percent of our tribal population 

is employed and so the other 70 percent is residents of Mason 

County. 

Mr. COLE. So a pretty significant contributor obviously to non-natives? 

Mr. PETERS. Yes. 

Mr. COLE. So they are lucky to have you there. 

Mr. PETERS. Yes. Mason County is a very depressed county. 

Mr. COLE. Thank you. 

Mr. MORAN. Thanks, Mr. Cole. Mr. Simpson. Okay. Thanks very 

much, both of you. 

We will next hear from Michael Finley, the chair of the Confederate Tribes of the Colville Reservation. Mr. Finley. Thank you all 

very much for coming. Thanks for making the long trip. We appreciate your testimony. 

TUESDAY, MARCH 23, 2010. 

CONFEDERATED TRIBES OF COLVILLE RESERVATION 

WITNESS 

MICHAEL FINLEY 

Mr. FINLEY. Chairman Moran, Ranking Member Simpson, it is 

an honor to be here today. My name is Michael Finley. I am the 

chairman of the Confederate Tribes of the Colville Reservation in 

northeast Washington State. You have my written testimony, and 

I wanted to highlight a few of those areas here today. 

The challenges that Indian tribes face today in constructing IHS 

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great importance to us and my tribe, and IHS facility dollars have 

not been traditionally made available to tribes. Our tribe is a large 

tribe in a rural area, as I stated, in northeast Washington State. 

We are 1.4 million acres. We have a large high-service population 

of around 5,000. We have been operating out of dilapidated buildings for quite a few years until about 5 years ago we had new facilities constructed at three different locations on our reservation. 

We had tried using the existing programs to fund the construction 

of the Nespelem facility and we were on the priority list for several 

years but for whatever reason we were never pushed to the top of 

that list, and so we were forced to deal with the situation by paying 

for a majority of the construction with our own tribal dollars. And 

so presently we have the largest community within the boundaries 

of our reservation being Omak, Washington, where we are trying 

to look at ways, funding options, funding sources to build a facility 

in Omak. The problem with building our own facility is it does not 

always come with adequate funds or staff to equip the facility, so 

now we are faced with new buildings but we do not have adequate 

staff or equipment to put in the buildings. 

So the Omak area that I mentioned just a minute ago, we are 

looking at the joint venture program to try to get a new building 

constructed but unfortunately with the downturn in the timber 

market, we have taken huge cuts on our tribal revenues. Historically we have been a timber resources tribe and we were forced to 

close two mills in the Omak district that employed just under 500 

people, and that is not counting the contractors who brought the 

product to the mill, and so the actual impacts are far more reaching than just the jobs at the mill themselves. So our recommendation is to include $40 million to the Small 

Ambulatory Program for fiscal year 2011. We would also like IHS 

to provide 50 percent of the staffing costs for facilities in awarding 

grants as well as IHS to award up to $5 million for the construction portion of grants in instances where a facility will serve an unusually high user population, that being Omak since it is the largest community of our tribal members within our boundaries and 

where unique circumstances exist as well. 

I appreciate the opportunity to be here today before you and I 

stand for any questions you may have. 

[The statement of Michael Finley follows:] 


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Mr. MORAN. Thanks very much, Mr. Finley. 

Mr. Cole. 

Mr. COLE. Thank you. Just again educational for me, how many 

tribal members, how many tribes, actually, collected together and 

how many members? 

Mr. FINLEY. We have just under 9,400 members. We have 12 aboriginal distinct tribes that make up our confederacy, and as I stated, we have a land base of 1.4 million acres. 

Mr. COLE. You mentioned the importance of timber obviously and 

how much that has hurt given what has happened in that industry. 

What are the other sources of income that the tribes have? What 

are their enterprises they operate? 

Mr. FINLEY. Well, we have several enterprises. We do have casinos, and since we are one of the largest tribes in the Pacific Northwest, we do have a rather generous compact with the State of 

Washington, but at the same time we are off the beaten path. We 

are in probably the most rural areas in Washington. 

Mr. COLE. It is a business where location is everything. 

Mr. FINLEY. It is. We are not along a major corridor. We are not 

along an interstate. We are along a state highway, but again, you 

know, it is not a highway that is well traveled in comparison to 

some of the other ones such as the I–5 corridor, the I–90 in Washington State. 

Mr. COLE. Do you have any sort of statistics on what the unemployment rate would be? 

Mr. FINLEY. It is over 50 percent. 

Mr. COLE. Thank you very much, Mr. Chairman. 

Mr. MORAN. Thank you. Mr. Simpson. 

I think for next year it might be helpful to have a map to see 

where exactly the tribes are located. 

Mr. FINLEY. It is up there, dead center of Washington State. You 

see the largest tribe there in the middle? That is us. 

Mr. MORAN. Thank you. That prior map that we had with the inlets and the bay, that was helpful, and I appreciate it. Thank you, 

Mr. Finley. 

Next we will hear from Roger Trudell, who is the chair of the 

Santee Sioux Tribe. 

TUESDAY, MARCH 23, 2010. 

SANTEE SIOUX TRIBE 

WITNESSES 

ROGER TRUDELL 

PATRICIA MARKS 

Mr. TRUDELL. Good morning, Chairman Moran and Committee 

members. I would like to thank you for the opportunity to be here 

and present, and this is Patty Marks, our attorney at large and our 

right-hand person out here in this area. I am chairman of the Santee Sioux Nation, which is located in northeastern Nebraska. We 

are in northeast Nebraska as we were removed from the State of 

Minnesota in the 1860s. Our tribe was the recipient of the largest 

mass execution in this country’s history. Thirty-eight members of 


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our tribe were hung in public at Mankato, Minnesota, December 

26, 1862. Later after that, two more were kidnapped from Canada 

and hung publicly again, so 40 in all. We are currently located in 

Nebraska and we have made a few stops before there. Our people 

were interred at Fort Snelling, which is close to Minneapolis-St. 

Paul area, removed to Crow Creek in South Dakota, then later relocated to Nebraska, where our home is now. 

We have approximately 4,000-some members on our roll dispersed throughout the 50 states. How many total Santee Sioux are 

there? Nobody knows. A lot of them were absorbed by other tribes 

and currently in Canada. 

Today I am specifically here to address the water needs on our 

reservation. Our population far exceeds the ability to put wells in 

anymore and the water that is available for drinking is not really 

potable, as I call it. They have other levels in here that Indian 

Health Service states the levels of our water do not meet human 

consumption. The approximate cost of a reservation-wide water 

system which would include all persons, tribal and non-tribal residing within boundaries of our reservation, approximately $21 million. 

The majority of our people are below the poverty level. We do 

employ through contracting of federal programs. We employ somewhere in the neighborhood of 100 people. We also have some private industry or private commercial activities that employ probably 

another 50 people or more, probably greater. We have a class II casino operation that employs 30-some people. They have a C store 

which is located on the reservation. It is open 24 hours a day. That 

employs anywhere from two to three people a shift. And we have 

a C store located in South Yankton, which is across the bridge from 

Yankton, South Dakota, and that is also a 24-hour operation that 

employs two to three people per shift also. The majority of those 

people at Yankton are non-tribal members. We do employ other 

tribal members that reside in the town of Yankton and some nonIndian people at that facility. We also have a business called Santee Financial Services, which is a lending institution, and that is 

serviced from the reservation. 

Again, the water that we have, the studies have been going on 

actually since the 1960s. I see 1997 and 2004 in here. They have 

gone on longer than that. Indoor water was brought to our reservation in the early 1960s. Many of the people did not even have wells 

in the 1960s. Now the wells that we do have are all going bad. A 

lot of this is created by the Pick-Sloan Act. We are between the 

Fort Randall Dam and Gavins Point Dam, and we do have some 

visual aids there to show the siltation that is going on in the Missouri River caused by the Lewis and Clark Dam on the Missouri 

River, and we are on the tail waters of that. The siltation has 

caused a rising water table level and through that process, although you would think it would enhance our water sources, it is 

actually a detriment to it because it creates a lot of nitrates and 

other chemicals that are used in agriculture to filtrate into the 

wells and into the water system. That would cost approximately 

$21 million. We also have a request to assist people with drinking 

water until that can be accomplished. 

So I thank you for your time this morning. 


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[The statement of Roger Trudell follows:] 


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Mr. MORAN. Thanks very much, Mr. Trudell. Who is your Member of Congress? Who represents you in the Congress? 

Mr. TRUDELL. Adrian Smith is my representative from our 3rd 

district in Nebraska. 

Mr. MORAN. Adrian Smith. 

Mr. TRUDELL. I do not know him either. I do not think anybody 

in our part of Nebraska knows him. 

Mr. MORAN. Do you know him? Is there a—oh, you do? 

Mr. COLE. As a matter of fact, it is a big district. That is a 

75,000-square-mile Congressional district. 

Mr. MORAN. I did not know he was a colleague. Now I am embarrassed. I did not realize. Okay. I have not heard of him before. 

Mr. Cole, do you have questions? 

Mr. COLE. Yes, just a couple quick questions. You mentioned you 

had a class I facility. Is that all Nebraska allows? They do not have 

class III gaming? 

Mr. TRUDELL. Nebraska does not have class III gaming. 

Mr. COLE. This is a pretty dramatic picture. The siltation here 

is just amazing. Are there any state efforts for help? 

Mr. TRUDELL. There are no state efforts. The state did come in 

and assist us when the wells that were our primary source for our 

main village of Santee were flooded. The state did come in and assist us with rebuilding those wells and providing drinking water for 

a period of time. 

Mr. COLE. You mentioned you had 4,000 or so members. How 

many actually reside on the reservation and what is the size of the 

reservation? 

Mr. TRUDELL. Well, our reservation is 12 by 17 miles. We own 

approximately 27,000 of those acres in there. We provide service. 

We have 2,300 active files in our health facility. 

Mr. COLE. Are any of the neighboring communities, non-tribal 

communities, affected with a water situation similar to yours? 

Mr. TRUDELL. Nibrara and Center and of course the communities 

east of us are already on rural water systems. 

Mr. COLE. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. 

Mr. MORAN. Thank you, Mr. Cole. 

Ms. MARKS. May I make one—— 

Mr. MORAN. Please. 

Ms. MARKS. We had a meeting with the Indian Health Service 

2 weeks ago. One of the concerns is that this water clearly does not 

meet level II of the Clean Drinking Water Act. Indian Health Service says because they cannot monitor the tribal system every day, 

they believe that on various occasions, more numerous than we 

would like to talk about, it does not meet level I. We have mothers 

mixing baby formula with water that does not meet level I. We 

have people who literally cannot afford to buy it so they are adding 

sugary mixes, Kool-Aid, whatever we can, to kill the taste. This 

water smells. I cannot get it from my mouth to my nose. 

This has been a ping pong ball. The Bureau of Reclamation sends 

us back to the Indian Health Service who sends us over to Interior 

who sends us back over here. We have got to solve this problem. 

We cannot have newborn infants drinking contaminated water. 

That is why we put the request in for the $200,000 just to buy 


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water for those young mothers until we can get this problem fixed. 

It is a serious mess. 

Mr. COLE. May I ask an additional question, Mr. Chairman. 

Mr. MORAN. Please, go ahead. 

Mr. COLE. You know, when you talk to BIA, what do they tell 

you in terms of what is available—— 

Ms. MARKS. Go to Reclamation or Indian Health. 

Mr. COLE. And what do they tell you? 

Ms. MARKS. Indian Health says we will try to get you on the priority list. Reclamation says all of our monies come through earmarked for specific projects. 

Mr. COLE. Does anybody acknowledge that the Federal Government has an obligation to provide you water on a reservation? 

Ms. MARKS. That is why quite frankly I recommended to the 

chairman that he come here and get you in the mix of people being 

talked to about this issue because no one seems to want to have 

this squarely within their box. Reclamation says well, we build big 

huge water systems. Indian Health Service says we build wells. 

Bureau of Indian Affairs says we do not deal with water at all. It 

is one of those things where there is no question the authorization 

exists but for someone to step up and say this is our agency’s responsibility and we will help you is what we are missing. 

Mr. MORAN. Well, frankly, it is difficult to do much without the 

person who represents you advocating for you because there are 

members who advocate for tribes within their district. Mr. Cole 

does that extremely well. 

Ms. MARKS. And Mr. Smith is publicly in support of this project. 

Mr. MORAN. Does Senator Nelson get involved at all? 

Ms. MARKS. Senator Nelson is weighing in now. Senator Johanns 

has been very upfront for a while. Part of the issue was, we kept 

hoping, BOR started a study of this water back in 2004. They 

never finished it. The administration changed. Mr. Osborne, who 

was a former member of this fine body, retired, and since then no 

one is picking up the ball. We certainly are going to encourage as 

much as we can with our delegation but I would state for the 

record, it is my belief that this is a trust responsibility area. It is 

squarely on Indian Health Service’s shoulders, and this Committee 

has oversight over Indian Health Service. 

Mr. COLE. You make a very good point. It is very clearly a trust 

responsibility to provide water on a reservation. 

Ms. MARKS. You cannot drink it. You cannot bathe. You cannot 

wash dishes. You cannot cook. 

Mr. COLE. So that is a failure of the—— 

Ms. MARKS. When you boil the water and it still comes up unsafe, there is a problem here we have to figure an answer to. 

Mr. MORAN. Well, good for you for bringing it to our attention. 

I am not sure what we are going to be able to do. I wish Mr. 

Osborne was still here representing you. 

Mr. COLE. Mr. Chairman, speaking for somebody that is an ardent OU Sooner fan, we are glad he is back in Nebraska but we 

do not wish him quite the success that he used to have. 

Mr. MORAN. It is troubling. The Sioux Nation was one of the 

greatest, most heroic, tribes and that is basically why you have suffered and been abused in such an extreme manner. I would hope 


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that we could do something about this situation. This is not your 

land. You were put here and your land was taken from you. For 

what it is worth, I wish that stories like this could be told at the 

American Indian Museum just half a block away. Unfortunately, as 

far as I am concerned, it is a glorified craft store, but this is the 

history that should be shown. I was not aware of the situation in 

Minnesota. I am glad you brought it to our attention, but most importantly, I am glad you described your current situation because 

it continues to be one of deliberate abuse as far as the testimony 

you have provided today. It needs to be rectified. I hope maybe Mr. 

Cole and I can figure out something to do about it. Thank you very 

much. 

Ms. MARKS. Chairman, congratulations, sir. We are very pleased 

to have you as chairman. 

Mr. MORAN. Thank you. Thank you for saying that. 

All right. The next testimony will come from Ron Suppah. You 

are the chair of the Confederated Tribes of the Warm Springs Reservation of Oregon? 

Mr. SUPPAH. Yes, sir. 

TUESDAY, MARCH 23, 2010. 

THE CONFEDERATED TRIBES OF THE WARM SPRINGS 

RESERVATION OF OREGON 

WITNESS 

RON SUPPAH 

Mr. SUPPAH. Good morning, Mr. Chairman and members of the 

Subcommittee. I am Ron Suppah, chairman of the Confederated 

Tribes of Warm Springs Reservation of Oregon. 

Warm Springs is a forestry tribe. Timber is a principal source of 

our revenue and jobs, and the health and good management of our 

forest is very important for us. Unfortunately, BIA has been starving its forestry programs for years. It gets only about one-third of 

the per-acre funding of the Forest Service, and since 2003 inflation 

has gone up 17 percent while BIA forestry has only gone up 5.3 

percent. At Warm Springs, this unfair treatment of BIA forestry 

funding has seriously eroded our forestry staff. Eleven of our 27 

full-time positions are permanently unfunded. Our ability to plan 

and manage our forest has been crippled. 

Warm Springs believes the following steps are needed to begin 

repairing this damage. First, reject the absorption of BIA fixed 

costs. We are already way understaffed and this cut will only eat 

further into forestry and other programs’ limited funds. Second, 

BIA forestry funding must be substantially increased. The Intertribal Timber Council suggests increasing forestry to $31.2 million 

just to keep up with increases given other agencies in recent years. 

We believe it would be a start and we support that. Third, in the 

BIA forestry project budget, restore $1 million to the Timber Harvest Initiative Program and add $5 million to forest development 

to reduce the national thinning and replanting backlog of 900,000 

acres. On Warm Springs, our own backlog is approximately 60,000 

acres. 


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Also related to our forestry is BIA Endangered Species Act fund- ing. Nationally, the ESA program needs at least $5 million and 

$2.3 million needs to be directed for the northern spotted owl on 

the Northwest reservations. 

Mr. Chairman, for BIA law enforcement, Warm Springs asks that the $19 million for FBI agents be kept at BIA to increase the 

pay of tribal law enforcement personnel. Being able to retain our 

tribal police will do more to improve day-to-day law enforcement on 

the ground than hiring more FBI agents. 

For BIA Johnson-O’Malley, Warm Springs urges it be funded at $25 million. That is the only BIA elementary and secondary support for the great majority of our tribes whose children are in public schools and its decline must be reversed. 

In the Indian Health Service, add $100 million to contract health 

care. There are no IHS hospitals in the Northwest so even with recent increases, when contract care money now runs out around the 

middle of the year, our care is pushed back to next year. 

Finally, please instruct the IHS that 638 contract support funding for new contracts must be spent on new contracts. Currently, 

they use that money to help existing contracts and will not fund 

new contracts such as ours. 

Mr. Chairman, that concludes my remarks. Thank you. 

[The statement of Ron Suppah follows:] 


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Mr. MORAN. Thank you. That is a sophisticated analysis of the 

budget. Good for you, Mr. Suppah. 

Mr. Cole. 

Mr. COLE. A couple questions just quickly. I am interested in the 

idea of $19 million for FBI because you put your finger on a difficult problem. We know we do not have enough tribal law enforcement personnel but we also know they do not have the same authority that an FBI agent does on Indian land, and one of our big 

problems is tribal courts are so limited in the kinds of penalties 

they can impose on non-Indians on Indian land. They ought to 

have, in my mind, the same jurisdiction as any local jurisdiction 

does. They ought to be able to impose the same kind of penalties 

as would be imposed on me if I committed a crime in Alexandria, 

Virginia, even though I am not from Alexandria. But if you do not 

have this federal component, do you have any concerns that you 

are not going to have people with adequate jurisdiction because we 

know a lot of crimes do not go punished appropriately because it 

is just a long time before you get a federal investigator to deal with 

them. 

Mr. SUPPAH. It is funny that you should bring that up as an example because Warm Springs has recently had a tribal police officer follow a non-tribal member off the reservation on a state highway across the reservation line and cited the individual and they 

were subsequently taken to court in Jefferson County in Madras, 

which is an off-reservation community, and the court there found 

them guilty, and basically the non-member appealed that to the 

Oregon Supreme Court and the Oregon Supreme Court overturned 

that decision by the Jefferson County judge, and basically we run 

into that dilemma of islands of no jurisdiction. That is what reservations are now in Oregon and we are working with the state attorney general’s office to ask them to help us, and they said that 

they will appeal to the Oregon Supreme Court to review that case. 

Mr. COLE. It is a huge problem. Our colleagues, Stephanie 

Herseth-Sandlin and Senator Dorgan, actually have a pretty good 

piece of legislation to try to enhance the authority of tribal courts, 

but you are still going to have this disparity between what literally 

a non-tribal judicial system right next door can do, and it invites 

crime in. I mean, criminals are not stupid. They go to places where 

there is not as much law enforcement and the penalties that can 

be imposed are not nearly as great. It makes sense then to prey 

on those communities as opposed to somebody right next to them. 

Let me ask you another question because you really hit on something that is near and dear to my heart, which is JohnsonO’Malley. 

Mr. SUPPAH. Can I finish? 

Mr. COLE. Please do. 

Mr. SUPPAH. I think that a lot of the goal as tribal members, we 

made a run for the line as kind of like a safety to get back onto 

the reservation where we felt we were safe. That was the tribal 

member doing that. Now it has been reversed to where now the 

non-members are running for that line because there is a jurisdictional void there. 

Mr. COLE. I can assure you, you are exactly right. 


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You made a pretty strong pitch for Johnson-O’Malley money, 

which I could not agree with you more since about 90 percent of 

native kids are actually not in reservation schools, they are someplace else, and that is something honestly we have not really substantively increased since 1995. We actually froze the population 

count as if there were no new native kids in non-native school districts, and it is a very good but very, very dramatically underfunded program. Do you have kids off your reservation in non-tribal schools? Is that where your interest comes from? 

Mr. SUPPAH. Yes. Approximately 50 percent of the 509–J school 

district where our children go to public schools is comprised of tribal membership. 

Mr. COLE. Is there any particular programs for them in these 

non-tribal schools that help them deal with the challenges they 

have or teach them about their own culture and history? 

Mr. SUPPAH. Well, I think that try as we may, the dropout rate 

is severely high for our tribal membership and our graduate rate 

is hurt also, so that is why it becomes more critical for JohnsonO’Malley to come into play because you can get tutor programs and 

other kinds of assistance for the tribal members that go to school 

there. 

Mr. COLE. Well, I do not know what the dropout rate is in your 

tribe, but I know nationwide, you are talking only 49 percent of native kids finish high school compared to 75 percent national average, and about 10, 11, percent go to college compared to almost a 

quarter of the non-native population, so you really put your finger 

on a pretty critical problem. 

Anyway, I am sorry, Mr. Chairman, but it is very excellent testimony. Thank you. 

Mr. MORAN. Yes, very interesting. Thanks very much, Mr. Cole. 

Thank you very much, Mr. Suppah. 

Mr. SUPPAH. Thank you guys for the time. 

Mr. MORAN. Appreciate it. Thank you. Good for you. 

Delores Pigsley is the next person, chair of the Tribal Council of 

the Siletz Tribe in Oregon. 

TUESDAY, MARCH 23, 2010. 

SILETZ TRIBE 

WITNESS 

DELORES PIGSLEY 

Ms. PIGSLEY. My name is Delores Pigsley and I am the chairman 

of the Confederated Tribes of Siletz Indians of Oregon and we are 

a small tribe on the Oregon coast. We have 4,700 tribal members 

who have a most tragic history. We negotiated treaties. Seven of 

those treaties were ratified and one was not. We were removed 

form our aboriginal homelands. We were terminated in the 1950s 

and restored in the 1970s during the Carter administration, and 

because of termination, we have been subjected to many injustices. 

We have a long list of needs. Many of them are basic needs because we had no services for those years of termination. Health 

care is our top priority, and I thank those of you who supported 


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the Indian Health Care Improvement Act because we hope that it 

will benefit us. We are requesting $2.9 million to address staffing 

and equipment needs for our clinic. From restoration in 1977 until 

today, we have not had the opportunity to have an IHS clinic funded on our reservation. We would still find ourselves on the waiting 

list. We were fortunate to get a grant, a loan and Congressional 

dollars for startup equipment to build a small clinic in Siletz. The 

clinic was funded as a demonstration project and it still bears that 

title. Since the clinic was built in Siletz, it has been expanded 

twice. The need for further expansion occurred about 3 years ago, 

and today we have built a new clinic that is going to open in May 

and it is three times the size of our current clinic to be able to support the services to our expanding population and non-tribal members. 

Our clinic services our membership as well as the community at 

large and we are one of the few tribes in Oregon that accept Medicare and Medicaid patients. People drive a long ways to visit our 

clinic. The new clinic will be able to accommodate many more patients and services and funds for additional staffing and equipment 

will help to address the greater need of the providing services. 

Our tribe is totally dependent on contract health care as are 

most of the tribes in the Northwest. All the services that we get 

in hospitals, we pay out of contract health care, and contract health 

care dollars until the last 2 years has not had a sizable increase. 

An example of critical needs—we have a long list of deferred surgeries, surgeries that include carpal tunnel, knee surgeries, stomach hernias, rotator cuff repair, gastric bypass, MRIs for various 

things, dental surgery, hysterectomy. None of those services get 

funded. 

The second-highest priority is providing education benefit scholarships for every tribal member that wants to go nts to go to college. Back in the days when the tribe was restored, we had zero 

dollars, and I was the secretary-treasurer in the 1970s, and $75 

was the most money we ever had in our coffee can. Today we provide services and scholarships to every student or adult that wants 

to go to college. The higher education funds have been stagnant 

since 1995. In 1995, we had 35 students in college. Today we have 

161 students. The tribe has had to make up the shortfall in funding to the tune of $3.5 million. For 2004 to 2009, we were funded 

$707,000. Our costs were $4.2 million. We make these difficult 

funding decisions because we view education and health as one of 

the best investments that our tribe can make for its members, and 

we fully support the Northwest Portland Area Indian Health 

Board’s budget request along with the National Congress of American Indians. We fully support funding Indian boarding schools. 

The Chemawa Indian School is a mile away from my home and 

they never receive adequate funding for the students that they get 

at the school and care for. Thank you. 

[The statement of Delores Pigsley follows:] 


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Mr. MORAN. Thank you very much, Ms. Pigsley. 

Mr. Cole. 

Ms. PIGSLEY. Any questions? 

Mr. COLE. Just one quick one. I was curious, what are your 

sources of income since you are obviously picking up a lot of costs. 

What tribal enterprises or—— 

Ms. PIGSLEY. Well, in the beginning we had—we have timber and 

we cut just a small, I think it is 2.5 million board feet a year, very 

small timber base that would not support government. Our largest 

source of funding comes from a casino that we built on the coast. 

It is right on the beach in Lincoln City, and since we built the casino, we purchased the hotel next door and the golf course down 

the road and so it has been our—and we the largest employer in 

the county. So it supported all of the shortfalls that we have had 

across the board, and we are a self-governance tribe. 

Mr. COLE. Are you class III or class II? 

Ms. PIGSLEY. Class III. 

Mr. COLE. Well, that is good. Congratulations on not waiting 

around for us to solve your problems. 

Ms. PIGSLEY. We still need your help. 

Mr. COLE. No, no, I am not trying to escape the obligation. I just 

think it is really important to do what your tribe has done, and you 

have to be well situated and a lot of things have to work just right, 

but it shows an awful lot of initiative. 

And Mr. Chairman, as I know you know, when tribes do this, 

they almost always turn right around and invest all the money 

right back where you are investing your money, in education, in 

health care and what have you. 

Ms. PIGSLEY. And all the casino money goes back to the tribe, 

unlike other non-tribal casinos, and so it has been tremendously 

successful for us. 

Mr. COLE. Well, again, congratulations on the initiative, again, 

not to let us off the hook, but I am glad you did not wait for us 

either. 

Ms. PIGSLEY. Thank you. 

Mr. MORAN. Thank you, Mr. Cole. It is an example of why I do 

support Indian gaming. 

But please do watch the development of the health care bill very 

carefully. It does sound as though that can be of assistance to you. 

Ms. PIGSLEY. I was watching TV most of the day Saturday and 

yesterday, heard all the commentaries and I am looking forward to 

see how it can support tribes. Thank you 

Mr. MORAN. Thank you. 

The next witness will be A.T. Stafne, the chair of the Assiniboine 

and Sioux Tribes of the Fort Peck Reservation. 

TUESDAY, MARCH 23, 2010. 

ASSINIBOINE AND SIOUX TRIBES OF THE FORT PECK 

RESERVATION 

WITNESS 

A.T. STAFNE 


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Mr. STAFNE. Good morning, Chairman Moran, Congressman 

Cole. Thank you for providing this opportunity for Native Americans to come before you and having the patience to listen to all our 

problems. I am thankful for this opportunity that you have provided. 

I am A.T. Stafne. I am the chairman of the Assiniboine and 

Sioux people, who number about 12,000 members who live on the 

Fort Peck Reservation, which is in northeastern Montana. The size 

of our reservation is about 100 miles long by 50 miles wide. It comprises over 2 million acres of land that we have there. Of the 

12,000 members, we have about 6,500 that live on the reservation. 

The total population of the reservation is about 11,000. The other 

4,500 or so people on the reservation comprise non-Indians and Indians from other tribes. So with that, we are quite a large reservation. 

But first, let me say congratulations for the enactment of the 

health care bill. We watched that with much interest. We listened 

to hear Native American people in that bill but I never heard native people mentioned in that bill. 

Mr. MORAN. Let’s clarify that. Native Americans are fully qualified. 

Mr. COLE. Actually, my chairman and I would have probably 

have a difference on this because I think this legislation should 

have been enacted separately, but basically the Indian Health Care 

Reauthorization Act was folded in to the total bill. So what has 

been a goal of ours for a very long time, it is part of this large bill 

that I actually favor, was reauthorization. We went since 1992 

under both Republican and Democratic Congresses, quite frankly, 

without getting it reauthorized. So you will find full Indian health 

care reauthorizations in there, so there are subsections that deal 

specifically with the native population, and there is a good increase 

in funding and authority there. It sort of got lost in the larger discussion because, again, this is a trust obligation that we have but 

it is there, and I think you will find it very helpful going forward. 

Lots still to do but that is a good step in the right direction. 

Mr. MORAN. First, I think it is just as well that it was not discussed because the folks who were most adamantly opposed probably would have found just one more reason to be opposed, so it 

is just as well it snuck in, but it is a great opportunity for all Native Americans to take advantage of it. I hope you will. Excuse me 

for the interruption. Go ahead. 

Mr. STAFNE. And I hope since this is acted on, I hope we will certainly discuss the Indian Health Service. Basically more money is 

what is needed. I would like say 2 years ago when I met then-Senator Obama when he came to Montana, I told him our number one 

problem on Fort Peck Reservation was health. In fact, Fort Peck 

Reservation Tribal Council has declared health a crisis on Fort 

Peck Reservation. Number one was health. Number two was law 

enforcement. That is still our situation now. We are thankful for 

the increase in this year’s IHS funding. That is a step again in the 

right direction. We are happy it is now the other way, a decrease. 

At Fort Peck, when we have health problems, we go to our IHS, 

which operates a clinic on the reservation. Now, most of the time 

we do not even have doctors working at the clinic because we have 


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trouble attracting doctors to IHS. We see nurses, but all they do 

is prescribe pills, pills for inflammation and pills for pain, and that 

is causing many of our people to become addicted to painkillers. We 

recently had a drug bust, a raid made by our law enforcement department and they arrested, I think it was approximately 37 people 

for drug violations, selling pills illegally. So the reason for that is, 

we do not have a hospital on Fort Peck IHS. We do have hospitals 

for the city. The city has hospitals but we are not referred up there 

by IHS. If we have a problem, we have to come to a level 12 before 

they can send you out for contract health care. Level 12 means you 

have to be in danger of losing a limb or your life. When that happens, they call for an airplane, which from Billings, Montana, is 

300 miles from where we live. The airplane comes and airlifts us 

out. Now, if you are in danger of losing your life, sometimes that 

happens on the airplane trip. And of course, that costs more 

money. If they could diagnose these and have more preventive-type 

medications, we would save a lot of money for that. 

I am sorry. My time is up. Thank you. 

[The statement of A.T. Stafne follows:] 


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Mr. MORAN. Well, good for you. Thank you. This is a large reservation, and I am glad that President Obama is aware of it and 

of your needs. I hope some of them will be met directly from the 

new health care authorization, but clearly there are others in the 

area of public safety and economic development. 

Mr. Cole. 

Mr. COLE. Yes, just for the record, so you know, the Indian 

health care reauthorization was actually passed by the Senate in 

the last session of Congress. We held it up here in the House, and 

it had bipartisan support. It moved actually through the Resources 

Committee very quickly, got hung up two sessions ago actually, got 

hung up in E&C at the subcommittee level, finally got through the 

Senate last time. Then frankly what happened here is, we made a 

decision that we did not want to have a debate over abortion before 

an election, and so we had to start all over again. That is why this 

got put in this particular vehicle. So again, just for the record, Mr. 

Chairman, neither party has a whole lot to be proud of in the way 

we have handled the Indian Health Service. I am certainly willing 

to take my party’s share of the blame. But the important thing, 

and you made this point, is that it is done. It moved through. It 

is a movement in the right direction. But the basic problem has 

been, again, both parties historically underfunding these services, 

which they are obligated to provide by treaty. So we look forward 

to working with you because I know the challenges in reservations 

this size and population bases this small, and getting doctors to 

come is a challenge. It is the same problem that you have in the 

inner city, really. It is exactly the same thing. You have got a relatively poor population. You do not have a lot of opportunities for 

professionals in the financial sense. They have to be awfully dedicated to go there. We probably do not pay them enough, either, you 

know, from our end of this deal, but the needs are very great. So 

anyway, thanks for what you are doing. 

Just by way of a question, I made a long statement here—again, 

you are in a very sparsely populated area. What sorts of economic 

activities do you have? Do you have the potential from your standpoint to engage beyond timber? I think it is always good to get in 

the record what the unemployment rate is in a particular area because it really gives us a quick short on how many challenges you 

face across the board. 

Mr. STAFNE. Well, the unemployment rate depends on what report you read. I have seen it from 53, 57 percent to 70 percent. 

Mr. COLE. Well, if 53 is the good number, I do not think anybody 

on this panel will regard that as a good result. 

Mr. STAFNE. And our resources, this is mainly a cattle and farming area and we have a farm and ranch and we also have limited 

oil activity, so that is our income. 

Mr. COLE. Thank you very much. 

Mr. STAFNE. Thank you, sir. 

Mr. MORAN. Thank you, Mr. Stafne. Thank you very much. 

Next we will hear from Patricia Whitefoot, the president of the 

National Indian Education Association. 


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TUESDAY, MARCH 23, 2010. 

NATIONAL INDIAN EDUCATION ASSOCIATION 

WITNESS 

PATRICIA L. WHITEFOOT 

Ms. WHITEFOOT. Good morning, Mr. Chairman, members of the 

Committee. I am Patricia Whitefoot, a member of the Yakama Nation from south central Washington, and I want to say I appreciate 

the opportunity to submit testimony on behalf of the National Indian Education Association. 

The Association was founded in 1970, and NIEA is the largest 

native education organization in the Nation with a membership of 

over 3,000 individuals who are American Indian, Alaska Native 

and Native Hawaiian educators, tribal leaders, school administrators, teachers, elders, parents and students. 

Since the release of the 1969 Senate Kennedy report documenting the problems in Indian education, Indian communities 

have realized greater participation and control of programs in 

schools. However, in Indian education we still face enormous challenges including severe underfunding. For too many of our students 

in schools, we continue to experience abject failure. A study released last month by the Civil Rights Project at the University of 

California at Los Angeles Graduate School of Education and Information Studies found that less than 50 percent of American Indian 

and Alaska Native students in 12 states graduate from high school. 

Mr. MORAN. Can you repeat that more slowly? 

Ms. WHITEFOOT. Okay. I am sorry. 

Mr. MORAN. No, it is just I wanted everyone to hear that. 

Ms. WHITEFOOT. Just this last month in February, UCLA’s Graduate School of Education and Information Studies found that less 

than 50 percent of American Indian and Alaska Native students in 

12 states graduate from high school, a statistic that sadly also applies on a national level and has held steady over the past decade. 

In addition, schools serving native students within the Bureau of 

Indian Education System continue to struggle to meet AYP with 

only 24.4 percent of BIE schools meeting AYP as compared to almost 70 percent of schools nationally. These statistics only serve to 

reaffirm the need for systemic reform of education programs in 

schools serving native students. 

NIEA is requesting $660.96 million for fiscal year 2011, which includes new program funding and a modest 5 percent increase for 

BIE’s programs. This includes funding for the elementary and secondary education programs, education management, an increase of 

$25 million allocation for student transportation, and a $5 million 

allocation to provide technical assistance to schools to develop their 

own standards and assessments. Schools currently have to use 

classroom dollars to transport their students to make up for the 

transportation funding shortfall. During the school year, BIE-funded school buses will travel nearly 15 million miles, often over gravel or dirt roads. The Little Wound School, located on the Pine Ridge 

Reservation in South Dakota, runs 13 bus routes each day during 

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ing 268,000 miles annually for regular bus runs, not including activity runs. For Indian school construction and repair, NIEA requests $263.4 

million. In May of 2007, the Office of Inspector General, Department of Interior, issued a flash report that describes the conditions 

at BIE schools that require immediate action to protect the health 

and safety of students and faculty. In his conclusion, the Inspector 

General states that the failure to mitigate these conditions will 

likely cause injury or death to children and school employees. 

NIEA is also requesting report language requiring the Department 

of the Interior report on the status of the schools listed on the 

BIE’s construction list, the use of funding for Indian school construction and a timeline for completion of projects currently on the 

list. 

NIEA is also requesting $24 million for the Johnson-O’Malley 

program funded at Bureau of Indian Affairs. JOM grants are the 

cornerstone for many Indian communities in meeting the unique 

and specialized needs of native students, as you heard previously. 

Our tribal educational departments provide tribes with the opportunity to become actively involved in the education of their children. Despite an authorization under NCLB and several other prior 

statutes, federal funds have never been appropriated for tribal education departments. Therefore, NIEA is requesting that the Department of the Interior fund tribal education departments at $5 million. 

In closing, Mr. Chairman, members of the Committee, I would 

like to just echo the expressions made by the tribal leadership. I 

fully support all of the congratulations that people provided for the 

Committee on the health care legislation. However, we want to 

make certain that those needs are also impacting students in our 

schools where we work from preschool to higher education, attention is needed, and on behalf of NIEA, I would like to thank the 

Committee for its support on behalf of native communities. With 

your support, we are hopeful we can begin to provide the funding 

for education that native communities deserve. Thank you. 

[The statement of Patricia L. Whitefoot follows:] 


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Mr. MORAN. Thank you very much. I appreciate that, Ms. 

Whitefoot. 

Mr. Cole. 

Mr. COLE. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Just a couple quick questions. One, that, usually, when I deal with the impact aid, it is in 

connection with a large military installation, but I, you know, obviously, there is impact aid for—— 

Ms. WHITEFOOT. Exactly. 

Mr. COLE. Tribal, too. Can you give me an idea of whether or not 

we are anywhere close to adequate, in terms of impact aid flowing 

to schools where there are significant native populations? 

Ms. WHITEFOOT. Right. I worked in a public school as a teacher, 

educator, administrator. And in the school district where I work, 

we have an Indian education program and, of course, with our Indian education parent committees, we participate in the policy recommendations for the school district, to provide the necessary services in the community. When we take a look at the funding, and 

I participate in the impact aid conferences over the years, impact 

aid just continues to be underfunded, as well. And I would say, for 

the military community, too. I also have grandchildren that are in 

the military community, and are directly impacted by the impact 

aid funding, as well. That is not just those impact aid funds that 

are available on reservations or, where federal installations are. 

Mr. COLE. And let me ask you this, too. I have never seen the 

statistic on this, and I thought, given your background, you might 

know. Is there any sort of estimate on what tribes themselves, out 

of their own economic activities, invest back? We have had a number of people testify about the number of their children that they 

are giving scholarships to, you know, how significant is this for 

tribes, in terms of when they have got money, putting it right back 

in there? 

Ms. WHITEFOOT. Well, I appreciate, Chairman Pigsley and the 

work that she has done. And of course, being from the Northwest, 

we all communicate with one another and learn from one another 

about what tribes are doing, in terms of education, and just comprehensive needs for children. 

In our case, I am from the Yakima Nation in Washington, and 

recently, our tribe has taken the casino funds, and put it back into 

public education with our children. We serve 26 school districts in 

South Central Washington, including along the Oregon border, and 

currently, I am in conversations with our tribe about making certain that those tribes reach the children from preschool to higher 

education, and we are still in deliberation right now on that, but 

that is to go directly back to the students that are currently in education, from preschool to higher education. 

Mr. COLE. Last question. I am very curious about your thoughts 

as an educator: We really have two subsets of kids here, ones that 

are being educated at the BIE schools, and a much larger group, 

obviously, that are in the normal, regular public school system. 

What is the best way to use funds that are available, whether 

it is impact aid, Johnson-O’Malley, tribally directed funds, to help 

kids, which is a great majority of Native American children, that 

are going to non-native schools, do better? I mean, what are the 


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types of things, the ways in which that money ought to be deployed? 

Ms. WHITEFOOT. Well, the works that we do at NIEA, of course, 

includes occupational and professional development programs, administration programs to have native people working in those 

school systems, and I think through programs like Head Start, 

which I have managed over the years, when you work with professionals that are coming from your community, you work with those 

individuals so that they, one day, will become a teacher, and then, 

come back into the public education system. 

But I also think it is important that, at the local level, that parents be involved in those decision-making processes, as well as the 

tribal government, and that tribal control is important, just like 

local control of public education. 

And I think we need to take a look at the education system, systemically from preschool, from birth to lifelong learning. And the 

more that we could get the community involved and, as I said, parents and volunteers in our community, and that we take them 

through a career development program, I have witnessed and experienced the benefits, that have been able to address some of the 

issues and problems that were expressed here today. 

Mr. COLE. Well, I know Secretary Salazar and Secretary Echo 

Hawk are putting—— 

Ms. WHITEFOOT. Thank you. Thank you. 

Mr. COLE. And I think appropriately so, a great deal of emphasis 

on tribal empowerment. 

Ms. WHITEFOOT. Both of them, right. 

Mr. COLE. And it is so critical that tribes have a direct say-so. 

Ms. WHITEFOOT. Exactly. 

Mr. COLE. In the education of their kids. I mean, it brings the 

responsibility down to the local level. It pulls the parents in. 

Ms. WHITEFOOT. Exactly. 

Mr. COLE. And it makes an enormous difference in the lives of 

individual children. 

Ms. WHITEFOOT. And I agree, and having met with Secretary 

Salazar, and both he and Duncan and their staff people, I agree 

with that. Thank you. 

Mr. COLE. Thank you. And thank you very much, Mr. Chairman. 

Mr. MORAN. Thank you, Mr. Cole. Thank you very much, Ms. 

Whitefoot. Appreciate the testimony. Next, we will hear from Joe 

Durglo, the President of the Intertribal Timber Council of Oregon. 

Mr. Durglo. 

TUESDAY, MARCH 23, 2010. 

INTERTRIBAL TIMBER COUNCIL (OREGON) 

WITNESS 

JOE DURGLO 

Mr. DURGLO. Good morning, Mr. Chairman, and members of the 

subcommittee. My name is Joe Durglo. I am the Vice Chairman of 

the Confederated Salish & Kootenai Tribes, and President of the 


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Intertribal Timber Council, an organization of 70 tribes that collectively possess most of the 18 million acres that BIA holds in trust. 

I appreciate the opportunity to testify today, because the BIA 

Forestry is in trouble, and needs this subcommittee’s attention. 

Over the past two years, ITC testified that 1993 and 2003 independent reports noted that BIA Forestry receives only about one 

third the per-acre funding provided the U.S. Forest Service, and 

that BIA Forestry needs $120 million increase to achieve parity. 

A review of the federal forestry budgets from Fiscal Year 2004 

to Fiscal Year 2009 showed that Forest Service forest products and 

BLM public domain forest management budgets increase 26 percent, while at the same time, BIA tribal priority allocation forestry 

budgets, which provides similar services, increased only 3.8 percent. Inflation over the same period went up 14.1 percent. 

Such a disparate treatment of Indian forestry funding is neither 

fair, nor does it comply with the federal trust responsibility. It is 

hurting the health of our forests, the economies of our communities, and our governments’ abilities to meet the basic needs of our 

people. To correct this, and put BIA forestry on a path toward 

equality, with funding of other federal forestry programs, the Intertribal Timber Council requests the following. 

First, as a general matter, reject the BIA’s proposed absorption of fixed cost increases. Then, increase BIA PPA forestry to $31.2 

million, which will be equal to those increases for the U.S. Forest 

Services and the BLM from 2004 to 2009. 

Second, BIA forestry projects funding has fallen from $18.5 mil- lion in Fiscal Year 2005 to $17.7 million proposed for fiscal year 

2011. Projects cover essential functions, like management planning, 

woodlands, integrated resource management plans, and forest development. An $8 million increase is needed, with $5 million dedicated to reducing the forest development, thinning, and planting 

backlog. 

Third, on a considerably bolder note, with Indian reservation un- employment at about 50 percent nationwide, we urge $151 million 

for a two year tribal forest restoration project, for 3,125 Native 

American green jobs, doing thinning and planting on trust 

forestland to reduce the backlog by half. These jobs can hire a 

great range of people, including entry-level. They are quick to 

train. They will help the forests’ health, capture carbon, and help 

climate change adaptation, and help the trust responsibility. We 

urge you to give this serious consideration. 

Fourth, for BIA endangered species, increase funding to $4.7 million, so the BIA gets the same per-acre funding as BLM. Fifth, we 

ask the committee to direct the BIA and the Forest Service to draw 

up a plan, with tribes and the Intertribal Timber Council, to preserve tribal forestry and mill infrastructure. Sawmills are disappearing across America, and tribal mills, because they are so important to tribal communities, are among the last to close. Without 

them, timber and other forest materials cannot be processed. Their 

retention is essential. We ask that a federal tribal plan be developed and be reported back to this committee in six months. 

Finally, for interior wildland fire management, we ask that preparedness be funded equal to the Forest Service. The Department 

of the Interior and the U.S. Forest Service fire cost accounting be 


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standardized, and that $44 million be restored for field removal, 

and that for Indian trust land, it be prioritized, and not prioritized 

to the Wildland Urban Interfacte, and that fire 638 indirect costs 

come from the BIA in the right cost pool. 

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. 

[The statement of Joe Durglo follows:] 


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Mr. MORAN. Good for you. Thank you, Mr. Durglo. Mr. Cole. 

Mr. COLE. Thank you. I have to say, I am from Oklahoma. I do 

not know much about trees, so this has been very educational for 

me, Mr. Chairman. And nothing about the timber industry. And I 

frankly did not realize it was important, as important as it clearly 

is to the number of tribes that there are. 

And I got to tell you, I am pretty stunned at the differential between how we fund the U.S. Forestry Service and how you are 

funded. Is this historically, has this gap always been this wide, 

or—— 

Mr. DURGLO. Yes, sir. We have been historically underfunded in 

Indian forestry. 

Mr. COLE. What is the justification for us doing one thing on 

non-Indian lands, in terms of forests, and you know. 

Mr. DURGLO. That is a very good question. I cannot answer that. 

Mr. MORAN. I have some suspicions. 

Mr. COLE. Me too, Mr. Chairman. That is all I had. I just 

thought those facts deserved being underlined. 

Mr. MORAN. Yes. Thank you very much, Mr. Cole. And thank 

you, Mr. Durglo. Very good. I had no idea that your Council manages the 90 percent of the millions of acres that we have under 

management. Thank you. Next, we will hear from Robert 

Benavides, the Governor of the Pueblo of Isleta. 

TUESDAY, MARCH 23, 2010. 

PUEBLO OF ISLETA (NM) 

WITNESS 

ROBERT BENAVIDES 

Mr. BENAVIDES. Good morning, Mr. Chairman. Good morning, 

Mr. Cole. Members and staff. As you know, my name is Robert 

Benavides. I am the Governor of the Isleta Pueblo. I live 13 miles 

south of Albuquerque on the Rio Grande Valley. 

We have got a population of about 4,000 tribal members that live 

on the reservation, and about another 3,000 that are not members 

that also live on the reservation. We have a land base of 200,000 

acres. The age median is around 31 years of age, with an income 

of less than $30,000 a year. Some of them are unemployed, even 

though we do have enterprises such as a casino, hotel, and some 

other facilities. We do employ close to 2,000 people on our reservation. 

But just like the national economy, we too have felt the crunch, 

and we are still feeling it. And I guess that is why I am here. The 

reason why I am here is we have a bad water, we need to replace 

our water main in the village. That water main was installed in 

the late ’40s, and probably the early ’50s, and they are asbestos 

concrete water mains, and as a result, we have had poor health in 

our village. 

We have had over 200 water leaks. We have a high rate of cancer 

in our village. We have used our own money, and we have had 

some assistance from the State of New Mexico. We are replacing 

around 15,500 linear feet of water mains and lines. The construcVerDate Mar 15 2010 02:18 May 18, 2010 Jkt 056200 PO 00000 Frm 00104 Fmt 6633 Sfmt 6602 E:\HR\OC\A200P2.XXX A200P2

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tion of the main water line has started on March the 31st. We are 

identifying all the gas lines and whatever is needed for the project 

to begin. That will take around a year and a half to complete. I did 

take Congressman Teague to my home. I have a home in the village. To show him the coloration of the water, and the rusty color 

and smells. The people from the pueblo will hardly drink that 

water, because it is really in bad shape. The project is in excess of $1.25 million. We are seeking from fed- eral funding about $500,000. You do have a copy of my testimony 

with you. And we are seeking help, also, from the State. We have 

been fortunate, but we need a lot more to complete that project. 

We are also working on an educational complex and long-term elderly care. Some of our buildings are condemned, but we are still 

using those buildings. There is mold and asbestos, and the EPA 

has come in and condemned those buildings, but we have no other 

buildings to work out of, so some of these employees are still working there. And we are also asking for help in that area. 

The Early Elderly Care Center, we are also asking for around $10—well, we spent $2.2 million of our own for that project. We received funding of $75,000 from HUD in 2006, $50,000 from the 

State of New Mexico, through capital outlay, but we still need 

around $10 million in federal appropriations to complete phase two 

of this project. 

As you know, even though we are in the Albuquerque area, there 

is no facilities that are really available, and some of the elderly 

cannot afford some of these facilities to stay in. So, that has been 

a hardship on most of the families that do have someone to take 

care of. 

[The statement of Robert Benavides follows:] 


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Mr. MORAN. Thank you, Mr. Benavides. The time has expired, 

and we are going to have to get back into session. Mr. Cole. 

Mr. COLE. Just a quick question or two. Out of curiosity, how 

close is the casino complex to the village, and—— 

Mr. BENAVIDES. It is about 5 miles. 

Mr. COLE. About 5 miles. What is their water source? 

Mr. BENAVIDES. Well, we have a new water source there, but 

even though we do have a casino, we had a decline in our profits 

by about 23 percent. 

Mr. COLE. Oh. No, believe me, I am quite aware. 

Mr. BENAVIDES. Yeah. 

Mr. COLE. That most of Indian country—— 

Mr. BENAVIDES. We have wells for the casino. 

Mr. COLE. Well, and of course, a significant portion of that income goes back to the investors, and goes, I suspect to the State 

of New Mexico who has a compact with you. 

Mr. BENAVIDES. Right. Right. 

Mr. COLE. So, it is not like all that revenue flows to you. 

Mr. BENAVIDES. No. And I just hope you consider our request. I 

did want to say one thing on law enforcement, as a law enforcement officer. The funding is not $19,000. It was $33,000. However, 

DoJ did take $20,000. Law enforcement in Indian country received 

$10,000. $10 million, I am sorry. We need all that money. We do 

not need 100,000 agents out in the field. They are never there, so 

that is where we need the money. 

Mr. COLE. Thank you. 

Mr. MORAN. Thanks very much, Mr. Benavides. We appreciate it. 

Elbridge Coochise. Chief Justice, Retired, of the Independent 

Tribal Courts Review Team in Arizona. Judge. 

TUESDAY, MARCH 23, 2010. 

INDEPENDENT TRIBAL COURTS REVIEW TEAM 

WITNESS 

ELBRIDGE COOCHISE 

Mr. COOCHISE. Thank you. Good morning, Chairman and committee staff. Thank you for allowing me to come in. 

I represent the Independent Tribal Courts Review Team. We 

have been reviewing tribal and CFR courts for the past four years, 

and we are here to make a request for at least $50 million for the 

156 tribes that are provided funds through the Bureau of Indian 

Affairs. 

Up until Fiscal Year 2009, the Bureau only provided $11.9 million for the 156 tribes. And I do want to thank the committee for 

the $5 million for Fiscal Year 2010, and then, the Senate adding 

$5 million for a $10 million to Fiscal Year 2010. 

And this is the first time that I have seen in all my years that 

additional funding that will go into the base of tribal courts. And 

again, the committee passed two years, ’09 and ’08, provided $2.4 

million for one time funding, and that was distributed to about 24 

and 22 tribes in those years, just for one time. 


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But with the $11.9 and the current $10, that only brings us up 

to about $21 for the whole, all 156 tribes. And we have been 

charged with a responsibility to do a systemic operations assessment of the tribal courts. 

And to the Governor and chairwoman from Siletz, we just recently did theirs, and they are in dire need. In fact, we found the 

lowest, one court only gets $10,000 for their court system. But the 

funding, we are finding, is needed drastically at tribal courts. Understand, the tribes that are here have other problems that are 

health-related, but we are requesting an increase in the tribal 

court funding by 50 percent. And to fund, authorize $58.4 million 

under the Indian Tribal Justice Act that was passed in 1993, and 

it was reauthorized twice, and we still have not seen any funding 

under that bill. 

The reason for the increased funding need is the hiring and 

training of court personnel, an increase in salaries for judges, and 

a need for new technology. Most of the 60 courts that we have reviewed are still on a manual data collection system, and the few 

that have got grants from DoJ cost $60,000 to $80,000 a year. The 

problem is, for relicensing of court clerks and others who use it, 

that is $5,000 a year that they have to pay, that they do not have 

the funds for. 

The security system really is nil within the tribal court system. 

Chairman Stafne, we reviewed his court last year, and while we 

were there, everybody, prisoners, people, court staff and judges, are 

crossing in—there is no security in most of these court systems, 

just because they do not have the funds. 

Then, there is code development. Many of the tribes, we are finding, are outdated in their codes, or they have been adopted from 

state codes that do not fit within the reservation. And so, we are 

requesting that additional funding be given to the Bureau of Indian 

Affairs to fund the 156 tribes. 

We have done 9 reviews this year, in Fiscal Year 2010. So, we 

had a total, then, of 69. And one of the items that was added in 

’09 was the speedy trial issue. Thus far, every court that we have 

reviewed, there were no violations of speedy trial issues, even 

though not all of them had a statute. Because most trials, from arraignment to trials, were done within 4 weeks. 

The only one that went beyond that was a federal CFR court, but 

they only have court once a month, and they were 6 months between arraignment and trials. So, the court systems are doing fairly well in providing due process to the community members, but 

they really need assistance. 

In fact, the Governor’s court systems is a condemned building 

that has asbestos and other things. We were just there a couple 

weeks ago, and two of my people got sick just being in there for 

about an hour and a half. They need to be moved to a better facility. 

This is what we are finding, and in my report, or testimony, the 

one in Montana, the house and a dormitory, it leaks all over, and 

the walls are all marked up. 

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forcement, you bottleneck the system if you do not put any more 

money into the court systems. 

We are handling, in the tribal court systems, even now, from 

gaming, that have state compacts. A lot of those cases, the slip and 

fall, the contract, tort issues, are coming to tribal court, because 

the compacts are not following through with the outside jams, 

judges are supposed to handle those. 

[The statement of Elbridge Coochise follows:] 


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Mr. MORAN. Thank you, Judge. The time has expired. 

Mr. COOCHISE. That is fine. 

Mr. MORAN. And we have got to get this in by noon time. Mr. 

Cole. 

Mr. COLE. Just a quick comment, maybe, and question. I know 

we have been trying to work on this, Mr. Chairman, but we keep 

seeing these law enforcement issues, obviously, and justice issues. 

They come up in almost every discussion we have. 

Mr. MORAN. I know. 

Mr. COLE. No matter what the point. It shows how central it is. 

And I know we have talked in the past about having a joint hearing with our colleagues in the Commerce, Justice, and Science 

Committee, where frankly, a lot of this funding is also at, because 

of the justice component. 

I hope we can do that some time, so it would be highlighted. 

Mr. COOCHISE. Yeah. Like I said, we really want to thank the 

committee for what you have done up to this point. I have been retired 13 years, and spent 32 years on the bench, and we are still 

not far down the road, as far as resources to run the courts. 

Mr. MORAN. You make compelling testimony. We thank the Chief 

Justice. 

Mr. COOCHISE. Thank you very much, Chairman. 

Mr. MORAN. Next, we will hear from Patty Brown-Schwalenberg, 

who is Executive Director of the Chugach Regional Resources Commission. This is in Alaska. 

TUESDAY, MARCH 23, 2010. 

CHUGACH REGIONAL RESOURCES COMMISSION 

WITNESS 

PATTY BROWN-SCHWALENBERG 

Ms. BROWN-SCHWALENBERG. I have with me the chairman of our 

board, Patrick Norman, who is also the First Chief of the Native 

Village of Port Graham. I asked him to accompany me, and after 

a lot of years, he has finally been able to pull away from his work 

in the village. 

Thank you for allowing us to testify before you. I know we are 

on a short timeline here, so I will try to make it quick. 

The Chugach Regional Resources Commission is requesting that 

our funding of $350,000 be put into the base budget through the 

Indian appropriations process. We were in the base budget for, 

since 1992, under a 638 contract, and in about 2003, the Bureau 

of Indian Affairs took us out of the budget. So, every year, we have 

been coming back to the Appropriations Committee, asking to be 

put back in. And we have, up until 2006, our budget was severely 

reduced by the Bureau of Indian Affairs. In 2007, we did not get 

any money. In 2008, we were not sure we were going to get any 

money. 

So, we started talking to the Assistant Secretary of Indian Affairs, trying to resolve the matter. We knew the money was in the 

budget, but it was not, there were no earmarks in 2007. And we 

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rior to get our funding, which we did, with contract support, and 

according to the lawsuit, we are supposed to be getting full funding 

every year, and then, every three year contract has to be renewed 

by the Bureau of Indian Affairs. 

Despite this lawsuit, the Bureau of Indian Affairs has not put us 

in the budget and so, every year, we are faced with presenting our 

proposal, and then, they come back with a letter saying gee, we do 

not have any money for you. So—— 

Mr. MORAN. What is their rationale, beyond the fact that they do 

not have the money? 

Ms. BROWN-SCHWALENBERG. I am not exactly sure. There were 

other organizations, including Circle of Light, that were taken out 

of the budget at the same time we were. They have been put back 

in. We have not, so we have been meeting with the Bureau of Indian Affairs on a regular basis, and I have no idea why we have 

not been included, but when we do go back, like we had to come 

back here last November, and pound on some doors and tables. We 

did get our funding for Financial Year 2010. So, the money is somewhere. I am just not exactly sure where. 

So, rather than us taking money from other tribal programs, and 

we have heard a lot of issues here today, just as we were sitting 

there. You know, economic depression and the community’s health, 

law enforcement, clean water, education, elder care. It is all important stuff, and I would hate to have, you know, those programs suffer because the Bureau of Indian Affairs has not put this money 

in the budget, as required under the 638 contract law. 

But our organization works with the Seven Villages in Prince 

William Sound and Laura Cook on natural resource and environmental issues. So, it is, to me, the basis or the foundation to address all those problems in a culturally appropriate manner. Law 

enforcement, clean water, education, all that depends upon the resources, and make sure that they are all there. 

So that is what we work on. The second part of our request is $150,000 in additional funding for our Alutiiq Pride Shellfish 

Hatchery. It is the only shellfish hatchery in the state. And it not 

only serves the villages, in providing them with shellfish seed for 

replenishing the seed, but it is near the villages. It is also an economic project that sells various kinds of shellfish seeds to industry. 

We are doing a lot of research right now. We are doing research 

on blue king crab and red king crab, with Western Alaska, as well 

as Kodiak Island, and working with the state and the university 

and NOAA to, actually, maybe enhance the crab population, since 

there has not been a commercial crab industry in, I am sorry, 

around Kodiak in about 20 years. 

So, we are doing a lot of things with very little money, but this 

issue with our recurrent funding has been a problem. So, we would 

respectfully request assistance with that. 

[The statement of Patty Brown-Schwalenberg follows:] 


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Mr. MORAN. Thank you. What are shellfish seeds? 

Ms. BROWN-SCHWALENBERG. In layman’s terms, they are like 

baby clams. 

Mr. MORAN. That is what I figured. 

Ms. BROWN-SCHWALENBERG. They are about that big, you know, 

clams, geoducks. 

Mr. MORAN. Sure. 

Ms. BROWN-SCHWALENBERG. Scallops. 

Mr. MORAN. They are bought in large quantity, and then, 

you—— 

Ms. BROWN-SCHWALENBERG. We, well, we buy, we have the 

adults, and then, we spawn them out, raise up the seed, and then, 

they are planted in the sea beds. 

Mr. MORAN. Yeah. 

Ms. BROWN-SCHWALENBERG. In the substrate. Near the villages, 

and—— 

Mr. MORAN. Well, we should find out why BIA is not including 

you in its budget. I have been to the Chugach, on the way to 

Denali, and thank you for your hospitality several years ago. Although it was July 4, and you had a festival, and my son won the 

pie eating contest, and we went up to the national wildlife refuge 

there, where of course, they do not have any sanitation facilities, 

and he had the runs for a week and a half. But I will not forget 

the Chugach Village. We had a great time. Mr. Cole. 

Mr. COLE. I am not going to try and top that, Mr. Chairman. 

Just I want to echo your point you made. It does amaze me when 

the BIA loses a legal case. That ought to kind of tell them, you 

know, why do we want to come back down this road again? So, 

thank you for bringing it to our attention. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. 

Mr. MORAN. Yeah, thank you, Mr. Cole. And thank you, Ms. 

Brown-Schwalenberg. And we appreciate the fact that you were 

able, for your colleague here, that I know it is a long ways to travel, but we appreciate you making your presence known before the 

subcommittee. 

Ms. BROWN-SCHWALENBERG. Well, we feel it is important, and we 

appreciate the opportunity. Thank you. 

Mr. MORAN. Very good. Good for you. Thank you very much. 

What we will do is to recess until two o’clock this afternoon. 

Mr. MORAN. Welcome. Mr. Young, would you like to take your 

seat up here at the—— 

Mr. YOUNG. Thank you. And then I have to leave. We are going 

to have votes as soon as we get done with it. 

Mr. MORAN. Yeah. 

Mr. YOUNG. Oh, you gave me the nice chair, too. 

Mr. MORAN. Let me mention to the witnesses first of all, we have 

only 5 minutes total for your statement and to answer questions. 

We do that because we have so many people who have asked to testify that we want to hear from all. We will watch the timer closely 

so that you are aware when the yellow light comes on and then 

when the red light comes on, then we are going to have to shut it 

off. 


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Your entire prepared statement, though, will be inserted in the 

final hearing record. 

And at this point, I would like to call on the former Chairman 

of the Natural Resources Committee and a very prominent member 

of the Congress and leader for many years and a terrific representative for his constituents in Alaska, Congressman Don Young. 

Mr. YOUNG. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Again, I want to congratulate you on becoming Chairman of this committee. This committee is very important to the State of Alaska, as you know, and 

you play a major role in Alaska and invite you up to not only enjoy 

the scenery but the great people of Alaska. 

It is my honor today to introduce two people, Andy Teuber and 

Katherine Gottlieb. Both of these individuals have been very important. Andy has been a KANA board member, becoming President and CEO and Corporate Vice President in Kodiak, a for-profit 

Native corporation in the Kodiak region. He has served on the 

Boards of Alaska Federation of Natives, the Alutiiq Heritage Foundation, and the State Chamber of Commerce. He served as the Gulf 

of Alaska Coastal Communities Coalition, and he has done many, 

many things. He has worked on the Anchorage Chamber of Commerce, and actually, the Alaskan Journal of Commerce recently 

named him as Alaska’s top 40 under 40. He is a commercial fixedwing and helicopter pilot, and he was born and raised in Kodiak 

and has three children with his spouse, Natasha. Katherine—— 

Mr. MORAN. Well, let’s get them up here so we can—Yeah, where 

are they? 

Mr. MORAN [continuing]. See who you are talking about. 

Mr. YOUNG. As I was introducing him I thought—this is the 

young man. I am sorry. I apologize. 

Mr. MORAN. Very good. 

Mr. Welcome, Mr. Teuber. 

Mr. YOUNG. And Katherine is an MBA, serves as President and 

CEO of the Southcentral Foundation. It is a customer-owned 

healthcare system that works together with Alaska native people 

to achieve wellness in the entire community. Under her direction 

and guidance, the SCF has become a leader in healthcare, receiving 

national and international recognition. SCF’s unique and creative 

programs draw upon the Alaska native culture to address 

healthcare challenges, substance abuse, women’s health issues, and 

family wellness. She was a recipient of the 2004 MacArthur Genius 

Award. She holds a Bachelor of Arts degree, a Master’s in Business 

Administration and Honorary Doctorate from Alaska Pacific University. She serves on numerous boards. She remains active on the 

national level of Native American policy issues and serves as a primary representative of the Indian Health Services National Tribal 

Advisory Committee on Behavioral Health. She is a daughter of an 

Aleut mother and a Philippine father. She is the mother of six children and grandmother of 23 grandchildren. And may I say, Mr. 

Chairman, she runs a tremendous healthcare facility. I have had 

the privilege of not only visiting but having my wife participate in 

the unit, and it is really an example. I actually submitted the 

model of that hospital to the writers of the new health bill and 

asked them to look at this model to see whether it would work correctly. They did adopt some things but not everything as they 


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should have. These are good Alaskan young people that understand 

the healthcare needs of the State of Alaska. 

It is my honor to have them both at the table. And I do apologize. Usually I am down there when I do this. I got all confused. 

But thank you, Mr. Chairman. 

Mr. MORAN. Thank you very much. Those were tremendous introductions. Unfortunately, they exhausted all of your time. 

Mr. YOUNG. I was watching the time. 

Mr. MORAN. I am kidding. No, come on back. I am kidding. We 

also have Mr. Cole, a very valuable member of the committee who 

has taken a particular interest in Native American affairs. He is 

of Native American heritage himself, and it is wonderful to have 

someone that cares as much as he does, as does Mr. Young. 

At this point, perhaps we can hear from you, Mr. Teuber. And 

they called a vote, so we have got at least 10 minutes. So we will 

get both witnesses in before we go to the vote. 

TUESDAY, MARCH 23, 2010. 

KODIAK AREA NATIVE ASSOCIATION, ALASKA 

WITNESS 

ANDY TEUBER 

Mr. TEUBER. Thank you so much, and thank you for that wonderful introduction, Congressman Young. 

Good afternoon Chairman Moran and Ranking Member Cole, 

members of the committee. My name is Andy Teuber, and I serve 

as the Chairman and President of the Alaska Native Tribal Health 

Consortium and also as the President and CEO of the Kodiak Area 

Native Association. On behalf of those we serve, which includes 

each of Alaska’s 229 tribes and over 135,000 American Indian and 

Alaska natives, I thank you and extend an invitation to the members to visit Alaska and see first-hand some of the unique challenges that nature creates, but more so many of the successes we 

have had been able to achieve in providing quality health services 

with what are oftentimes very limited resources. 

While the Nation debates the provisions in the recently passed 

health reform bill, I believe we can nearly all agree that the inclusion of the Indian Healthcare Improvement Act reauthorization is 

a long-overdue step in the right direction to modernize and improve 

the Indian health system. 

On behalf of Alaska’s native community, thank you for your commitment to improving the health status of our native people. 

In recent years, the IHS budget has been funded at about 60 percent of identified need, but we are now beginning to see meaningful 

increases thanks to your efforts. My written testimony addresses 

four key areas of resource deficiency in the 2011 IHS budget, and 

accordingly, we are requesting increases of $15 million for dental 

health, $81 million in contract support costs, $83 million for facility 

operational needs, and $10 million for a child abuse and neglect 

prevention initiative. 

By design, IHS budget line items work together to achieve the 

best possible results in the delivery of healthcare. Clearly increases 


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in the clinical and preventive services funded by the IHS budget 

are necessary, but their full value cannot be realized if other portions of the budget that provide essential support for those services 

are not adequately funded. 

Frequently we find it necessary to compromise one essential program to support another. While I cannot emphasize enough the 

value the fully funded contract support costs would have, I am 

committing the balance of my time to bring attention to the need 

for resources in child abuse and neglect prevention initiatives and 

in dental health. 

An issue that often lurks in the darkness and in secrecy is the 

issue of child abuse and neglect. I do not believe there is another 

issue that affects the long-term health and well-being of native people as significantly as child abuse. Ironically, it is also an area that 

is glaringly devoid of resources to address the problem. A recent 

CDC study found a strong relationship between childhood trauma 

and risk factors for many of the leading causes of death in adults, 

including tobacco use, alcohol and substance abuse, obesity, diabetes, heart disease, and cancer. People who experience childhood 

trauma were found to be 12 times more likely to have increased 

health risks for alcoholism, drug abuse, depression and attempted 

suicides, 2 to 4 times more likely to smoke, 2 to 4 times more likely 

to contract a sexually transmitted disease and 1.4 to 1.6 times 

more likely to be physically inactive or severely obese. Alaska unfortunately has the highest reported substantiated incidence per 

capita of child abuse and neglect in the United States. 

The domestic violence prevention initiative in 2009 funded at $7.5 million and $10 million in 2010 is a great step toward addressing our domestic violence prevention needs. We could use a 

similar program to address the equally important need for the prevention of child abuse and neglect and request that $10 million be 

provided for such an initiative. 

Next, American Indians and Alaska natives, especially children, 

continue to experience oral health disparities such as children ages 

2 to 4 suffering tooth decay at five times the national average and 

that 79 percent of native children ages 2 to 5 have tooth decay, 60 

percent of which is considered severe. This year in Alaska we have 

children who are graduating from high school with a full set of dentures. 

Each year over 1,200 children need oral surgery in Alaska due 

to the extent of their tooth decay, and the cost of one operating 

room dental case for a child with early childhood dental care can 

be as much as $7,000 because of the unique geography. 

Mr. MORAN. Mr. Teuber, I hate to interrupt you, but I am serious 

on this one at this time. You are still on the first part of your testimony. We are almost up to 5 minutes, and we are going to have 

to leave. And I do want to get Katherine in if possible. So if you 

could somewhat summarize and we could go to questions. 

Mr. TEUBER. I appreciate that. On behalf of ANTHC and KANA, 

I thank you for providing the opportunity to testify today and allowing me to highlight what I believe to be among the most urgent 

of needs for our native population. I appreciate your consideration 

of our recommendations and particularly for giving consideration to 

addressing the tragedy of child abuse and dental health disparities 


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as both clearly are root causes for some of the challenges our native 

people confront. We need your help to deliver our children into 

adulthood without the burden and trauma of abuse and neglect and 

with improved dental health. Thank you. 

[The statement of Andy Teuber follows:] 


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Mr. MORAN. Thank you. A very important statement, and thank 

you for making the committee aware that almost four out of five 

Indian children between the ages of 2 to 4, Alaska native children, 

have tooth decay and 1/3 miss school because of that. It is understandable when dental care costs up to $7,000 because of the travel. I did not know that Alaska had the highest rate of child abuse. 

It is very disturbing, but we do appreciate you bringing it to our 

attention. Mr. Young? 

Mr. YOUNG. That is fine. Let’s hear from Katherine. 

Mr. MORAN. Mr. Cole, do you want to—okay, very good. We now 

will hear from Katherine Gottlieb who is the President and CEO 

of the Southcentral Foundation in Alaska. 

TUESDAY, MARCH 23, 2010. 

SOUTHCENTRAL FOUNDATION, ALASKA 

WITNESS 

KATHERINE GOTTLIEB 

Ms. GOTTLIEB. Thank you, Chairman Moran, Ranking Member, 

Mr. Cole and Congressman Young, and committee members for 

hearing my testimony today. 

My name is Kathy Gottlieb and I am the President and CEO of 

Southcentral Foundation for the last 17 years, and we have carried 

out various programs under compact from the Secretary of Health 

and Human Services for the last 25 years and under tribal leadership, Southcentral Foundation’s Nuka Model of Care, of healthcare, 

redesigned the way Indian Health Service provides services, and 

people from across the world have come to see what we have done 

in the redesign of our health system. 

SCF’s Nuka model includes primary care services to 50,000 Alaskan Native American Indians in Alaska, and it covers Anchorage, 

Matsu Valley and 55 villages throughout Alaska, and it is an area 

covering about 100,000 square miles. 

SCF employs more than 1,400 employees, and we also jointly 

own and manage the Alaskan Native Medical Center with the Alaska Native Tribal Health Consortium, Andy Teuber is the chair. 

For many years, I have been an advocate for an increase in contract support costs, funding for tribes, and I want to pause just for 

a moment, even if it takes 2 minutes or so of my time, and the reason I want to pause is to thank this committee and this Congress 

for the increase that we have had, this historic increase in contract 

support costs for 2010. And for this, I am truly grateful as a President, CEO and tribal leader of Alaska. 

We have the hope and we have the belief of this committee and 

this Congress that we may finally have full funding for contract 

support costs in fiscal year 2011, and that is my prioritized request. In our world, we are addressing the highest disparities, cancer, obesity, child sex abuse, domestic violence, child neglect. And 

these are our top health issues. Without these funds, we are unable 

to do this. 

I am going to summarize my testimony because of your time, and 

I strongly urge this committee and Congress to fully fund tribal 


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contract support costs. The majority of SCF’s contract support costs 

are comprised of fixed overhead costs that are determined by indirect rates, and the remainder of the contract support cost is set directly by the IHS through negotiations. Together there are fixed 

costs that Southcentral Foundation occurs every single year. 

And I strongly emphasize that the contract costs cover critical infrastructure. They cover federally mandated costs such as annual 

independent audits, liabilities, property insurance, worker compensation payroll systems, purchase supplies, costs that track property and equipment. And if contract support costs appropriations 

are not provided, we will have to do what we have been doing for 

several years and that is we have no choice but to make up the difference through staffing and service reductions. And what that 

means is a shortfall, and it is a direct impact on our healthcare and 

it is also a direct impact on jobs. And our request specifically is 

this. We are asking that Congress increase the President’s fiscal 

year 2011 budget request for contract support costs from $45 million to $150 million. If this is not possible, then a total increase to 

$80 million next year and a like increase of $35 million every year 

for the following 2 years would eliminate that contract support cost 

shortfall in 3 years. And what this means is it is critically needed. 

It is a side benefit. One hundred percent of these funds would go 

to the creation of good jobs at a time of severe stress in the Nation’s economy, thereby increasing employment in some of the depressed parts of the United States. 

The bottom line is this. Contract support costs means jobs. 

Southcentral Foundation is anxious to fill as many vacancies as 

possible, those that we have been unable to fill because of the 

shortfall. If as we project, SCF alone would create 100 jobs from 

that funding and the associated increase in third-party revenues 

that SCF would collect from these positions. 

The IHS needs your help like you have already done in this last 

year. We ask that they would be able to honor the agency’s obligation to all the tribes across the Nation. We have taken on this responsibility. We have shouldered this shortfall way too long. It 

really costs us. 

And thank you again for granting me the opportunity to testify 

on this critical issue on behalf of SCF and the tribes across the Nation. 

[The statement of Katherine Gottlieb follows:] 


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Mr. MORAN. Thanks very much, Ms. Gottlieb, and Mr. Teuber. 

Mr. Young, did you have any questions? 

Mr. YOUNG. One question, Katherine. On the contracting, you negotiate with the Indian Healthcare Service? 

Ms. GOTTLIEB. Yes, we do. 

Mr. YOUNG. Separately? 

Ms. GOTTLIEB. Yes, we do. 

Mr. YOUNG. If this committee appropriates the money, what assurance do we have that they negotiate in good faith? 

Mr. YOUNG. They will negotiate in good faith. They have in the 

past. We have a methodology. Once the money is allocated to Indian Health Service, we will receive those contracts—— 

Mr. YOUNG. Okay, because you will not be caught in a shortfall 

then by them not paying because you have to do it up front? 

Ms. GOTTLIEB. Right. Well, we have been caught short in the 

shortfall only because the money has not been allocated, and IHS 

will allocate those monies to the Indian tribes. 

Mr. MORAN. Mr. Cole. 

Mr. COLE. Just number one, thank you very much, and thank 

you for the tremendous work you do. I sort of have a sense you are 

both on the wrong side of this table, but we need to keep Mr. 

Young as long as we can. 

Mr. YOUNG. Thank you. 

Mr. COLE. Let me ask you this, Doctor. It is really maybe not directly about your clinic, but I am very interested in the contracting 

process whereby you manage your own healthcare outcomes because my experience has been, certainly in my tribe, that once we 

were able to take over those services ourselves and contract for 

ourselves, and frankly eight other tribes in our area, healthcare got 

a whole lot better just because you really had a direct tribal involvement in the management of the delivery, and even with the 

resources and challenges that we all have in this area, that fundamental change and moving tribes forward as quickly as they can 

being able to manage their own healthcare was a good thing. I 

would love to hear your perspective and experience to see if it 

is—— 

Mr. MORAN. Mr. Cole, I am terribly sorry to do this, but we had 

several minutes remaining 1 minute ago. 

Mr. COLE. Mr. Chairman, I understand. 

Mr. MORAN. We still have some members who have not voted, 

but they are all going down to vote now and if you have a quick 

response, maybe we could get that in and then I think we are going 

to have to go. 

Ms. GOTTLIEB. I have a very quick response for Mr. Cole. I would 

say that if all tribes would assume the management from the Indian Health Service and take responsibility for their own 

healthcare, they will drive health disparities down. 

Mr. MORAN. Perfect. 

Mr. COLE. Thank you. 

Mr. MORAN. That is a perfect way to end. And Mr. Teuber, thank 

you. That was excellent testimony, and thanks for the emphasis on 

dental and particularly child abuse. It was very good. We really appreciate you being here. 

[Recess.] 


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Mr. MORAN. Again, some housekeeping here. As compelling as all 

this testimony is going to be, we are going to have to get stricter 

because of the delay attributable to the votes. We have got to end 

this at 4:00, so we are going to have to go through in almost lightning fashion. So the more concise the statement, the more appreciated probably the more persuasive, perhaps. 

We will next hear from John Mousseau who is the Councilman 

of the Oglala Sioux Tribe in South Dakota. Nice to have you with 

us. 

TUESDAY, MARCH 23, 2010. 

OGLALA SIOUX TRIBE, SOUTH DAKOTA 

WITNESS 

HERMES ‘‘JOHN’’ MOUSSEAU 

Mr. MOUSSEAU. Thank you, sir. Good morning, Mr. Chairman, 

committee members. My name is Hermes John Mousseau. I am a 

member of the Oglala Sioux Tribe Judiciary Committee. I am also 

a former police officer. I am here representing the Oglala Sioux 

Tribe. President Two Bulls regrets that she cannot be here to 

present this herself. 

Our Pine Ridge reservation is roughly the size of Rhode Island, 

making us the second-largest reservation in the United States. Our 

population is upwards between 50,000 and 20,000 coming on and 

off yearly. Our per-capita for a family of four is roughly $7,500 a 

year, and we also have an 80 percent unemployment rate. 

Now, our law enforcement, our 911 system, receives 77,000 calls 

for police service a year. All of those calls are answered by 50 police officers. That means we average around 15 police officers per 

shift, provided none are injured, sick or on regular scheduled days 

off. 

And while the BIA’s own studies say we need 110 police officers, 

we only have 50 police officers so we are currently way under-funded as far as our needs of the population base. This is true even 

though our salaries are far lower than what the BIA police officers 

receive. Our police officers are only making an average of $31,000 

a year with no medical, retirement or healthcare benefits. And the 

BIA under the 638 contract, our police officers are supposed to be 

guaranteed a wage or a salary that is comparable to a BIA law enforcement officer which we are far below. And yet, our officers still 

choose to work on our reservation and provide services. 

Not only is our response time ridiculously slow in Pine Ridge, our 

shortage of officers means that each one of them has to work alone 

with backup at least 30 minutes away. On a reservation with as 

much violence, alcoholism, drugs and gangs as ours, this is an extremely dangerous situation, and a number of officers are injured 

on the job every year. I myself was shot in the line of duty, and 

the officers who responded to my calls for assistance took 30 minutes to arrive. Now, can you imagine being in a situation where 

you are wounded in the line of duty and waiting for 30 minutes for 

assistance? 


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Mr. Chairman, while we appreciate the increases that this subcommittee has provided to law enforcement programs over the past 

few years, I respectfully say that they are simply not enough. And 

like I emphasized before, studies show where we need 110 officers 

just based on our old 2000 population which—go up. So we do need 

more time, more officers. And back home we were shocked and 

quite a bit angered when we had learned that the BIA was ready 

to give $19 million of the BIA budget to the FBI. 

While we are first to agree that we need more arrests and prosecutions of violent crime in Indian country, we also know that because the FBI is at least 11⁄2 hours away from our reservation, our 

police officers are going to be the ones who respond, transport the 

victims, secure the crime scene. To reward the FBI for failing to 

perform what is already their authorized responsibility and to pay 

the reward with our precious tribal funds is just plain wrong. 

While the DoJ programs that the tribes compete for do provide a 

great source of income, purchasing certain unique equipment and 

for funding certain specialized training, I must state emphatically 

that they must not be seen as a replacement for, or a supplement 

to, BIA-based law enforcement because as you know, DoJ does now 

have indirect funding, they are competitive and they are unreliable 

from year to year. 

For these reasons, I respectfully request that you do everything 

in your power to increase the BIA-based law enforcement funding 

by at least 50 percent each year for the next 3 years, and without 

this increase crime on the reservation will not decrease. 

Now to tribal court funding. Given the fact that your tribal court 

is severely understaffed and underfunded and our backlog is over 

a year, we were shocked to see that the Administration is proposing a cut in tribal court funding, and you know, law enforcement alone is not going to combat these crimes. We also need a 

sound, well-trained, well-equipped, and well-funded judicial system 

to put those arrested in jail. How can you stop crime when you cannot afford to hire judges and prosecutors? 

So we are requesting an increase of the court’s funding for 30 

percent, and we also would appreciate this assistance for the Pine 

Ridge Justice Facility. Let me bring your attention to the Medicine 

Root Facility. When the BIA came in for the Pine Ridge Justice Facility to ask us which one of our two jails we wanted to replace, 

we chose Pine Ridge because of the larger population. But our Kyle 

Facility was granted $3 million by this subcommittee for repairs, 

and our own estimate of $11.9 million for repairs just to fix it, to 

bring it up to code. But we still need the $93 million to keep the 

building open, but we are asking, simply asking, instead of putting 

a Band-Aid approach on this, we want a new building that would 

be up to code. 

[The statement of Hermes John Mousseau follows:] 


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Mr. MORAN. Thank you, Councilman Mousseau. This was important testimony. It is unbelievable that you have half the officers 

that you had a decade ago, and you have got five times the crime. 

It needs to be addressed, and it is amazing that your officers are 

getting paid so much less than BIA officers and do not even get 

health insurance. It needs to be addressed. I appreciate it. We 

could talk about just Pine Ridge Reservation alone all afternoon. 

Unfortunately we do not have that time, but I much appreciate 

your coming to testify. Thank you very much. And I am sorry, we 

just have to do this in such an expedient manner, but I appreciate 

it. 

Mr. MOUSSEAU. Thank you for the opportunity, and we would be 

pleased if you gentlemen would come to the Pine Ridge Indian Reservation and show you first hand what we are talking about. 

Mr. MORAN. I do want to go to Pine Ridge, and I am sure Mr. 

Cole does as well. But more importantly, we would like to get you 

some resources. More than getting us out to the reservation, we 

need to get some money to you. But thank you very much. We appreciate it very much, Councilman Mousseau. 

Mr. MOUSSEAU. Okay. Thank you. 

Mr. MORAN. Thank you. Very good. Tom I am going to move on 

because we have to catch up on time due to the votes. 

Next we have Mr. Zorn, Jim Zorn, the Executive Director of the 

Great Lakes Indian Fish and Wildlife Commission. 

TUESDAY, MARCH 23, 2010. 

GREAT LAKES INDIAN FISH AND WILDLIFE 

COMMISSION 

WITNESS 

JAMES ZORN 

Mr. ZORN. Mr. Chairman, Mr. Cole. Congratulations, Mr. Chairman. A picture is worth 1,000 words as they say, so as a lawyer, 

here is a picture to help remind the committee of who we are. My 

name is James Zorn. I am the Executive Administrator of the 

Great Lakes Indian Fish and Wildlife Commission. On behalf of 

our 11-member tribal nations and their 38,000 members in the 

60,000-square-miles service area that we cover, we thank you for 

what you did last year to help us solidify the Rights Protection Implementation programs. And we are here again today to remind 

you. Many times I follow Billy Frank, and so I get to say, ditto. So 

I am sure you remember what he testified to this morning, so I will 

not repeat in the interest of time. But just so you know, we face 

a similar situation out in the Great Lakes. We have increasing demand for services. We have many unmet needs at a time when 

states and others are doing less, and when our communities are at 

important crossroads, especially in these economic times and with 

youth trying to figure out what they should do and getting them 

connected back to a key, back to mother earth, and understanding 

their roots and the life ways that the ancestors reserved for them 

in these treaties is a very important job. 


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And so the money that was restored last year was greatly appreciated, and we seek to get at least that much restored again this 

year because as I am sure you have heard, that goes a long way 

but there are certainly other unmet needs. 

And so we just point out that restoration last year, we are down almost $.5 to $1 million from that simply because of proposed cuts 

in the base program, the contract support shortfalls, as well as the 

absorption of the fixed costs. 

And so for Right Protection Implementation, the important point 

to remember is that if we are out to restore, let’s not get back to 

where we were in a relatively short period of time. 

Now, on the EPA, the Great Lakes Restoration Initiative, we 

have a challenge for the committee to help us think through. As 

you know, the Administration this year is proposing $300 million 

for that program. Last year $475 million was appropriated, $375 

million, you know, pick a figure somewhere in between there will 

probably work. Our focus is on how to get tribes at the table there. 

What we would like to see is to figure out a way to get some of 

that money devoted to tribes and get to them directly under selfdetermination. That has proven to be accountable, efficient and the 

best way—I believe, Mr. Cole, you talked about healthcare services 

in the hands of tribes. Get this money in the hands of tribes and 

you will get the type of results that we all want in restoring and 

preserving. Why should you have to destroy something before you 

get the funds necessary to keep it there in the first place? 

And so we would like to figure out a way to work together. We 

are happy to talk to EPA. We have been talking to OMB and the 

Administration about that, how to get some of these dollars for 

these regional initiatives through whether it is BIA or some other 

way, I mean, clearly, for that intended purpose, but then more direct into the hands of the tribes where we can get them out to the 

field much more quickly without all the administrative overhead 

that you have. 

So those are our two main focuses today. We know that both of 

the committee members here today understand these programs. We 

know you understand the needs, and anything we can do to give 

you the ammunition you need to help out, just let us know. 

[The statement of James Zorn follows:] 


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Mr. MORAN. Thank you very much, Mr. Zorn. In terms of the 

amount available for actual outlay, there will not be a reduction, 

will there, even if we do not maintain at the $475 million, it is still 

a substantial money in the pipeline. 

Mr. ZORN. There is a lot of money out on the table that has not 

been contracted, and that is why I think from our perspective, we 

are more focused on the tribal share than the overall. We tend to 

see federal agency’s budget grow, and then the tribes do not necessarily get their share. 

Mr. MORAN. So let’s be cognizant of that. 

Mr. ZORN. That would be great. Thank you so much. 

Mr. MORAN. If it is something that could be done without adding 

to the bill, that would be fair. Good. Thank you very much, Mr. 

Zorn. Thank you. Nice job. 

Mr. ZORN. Thank you. 

Mr. MORAN. Thank you very much. Next we are going to hear 

from Buford Rolin, Vice-Chair, National Indian Health Board and 

Chairman of the Poarch Band of Creek Indians. 

TUESDAY, MARCH 23, 2010. 

NATIONAL INDIAN HEALTH BOARD 

WITNESS 

BUFORD ROLIN 

Mr. ROLIN. Mr. Chairman, members of the committee, thank you 

very much for having me here today to provide testimony on the 

National Indian Health Board’s views on the fiscal year 2011 IHS 

budget. But first I would like to thank the House for its work on 

passing healthcare reform which included the permanent reauthorization of the Indian Healthcare Improvement Act. Indian country 

has labored over the reauthorization of the Indian Healthcare Improvement Act for over 10 years now, and after Sunday’s vote, this 

important law is finally reauthorized. And I want to thank you. It 

was so good to hear from the President this morning of his support. 

And I attended the healthcare meeting, and he was certainly supportive of that issue. 

Our work is not done, though. Indian country needs to be a partner in designing and implementing the new authorities offered in 

the Indian Healthcare Improvement Act. In addition, we need your 

assistance in making sure that the new programs receive resources 

and that the IHS receives the funding increases as proposed in the 

fiscal year 2011 budget. 

NIHB was very pleased to learn that for the fiscal year 2011 IHS 

budget, the Obama Administration is proposing a $354 million increase over the fiscal year 2010 appropriations. This is an 8.7 percent increase, and this is certainly noteworthy. 

Despite the Federal Government’s trust responsibility to provide 

healthcare to American Indians and Alaskan natives, IHS funding 

remains a discretionary line and is susceptible to cuts. IHS’ budget 

also remains far from adequate funding. We need the help of the 

Appropriations Committee to make adequate funding a reality. The 

trust obligation to provide healthcare is paramount, and it is upon 


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this foundation that the IHS Tribal Budget Formulation Work 

Group formed its recommendation for the fiscal year 2011 IHS 

budget. The work group’s proposal centers on a 10-year phase-in to 

eventually achieve full funding for IHS. As a first step, the work 

group recommended an increase in the IHS budget totaling $2.1 

billion over the fiscal year 2010 funding levels. These recommendations focus on two types of needed increases. First, the work group 

recommended an increase of $947 million in current services. Current services increases are those budget increments needed to enable the Indian Health System to continue operating at its current 

level of service. This category contains such items as pay cost increases, inflation, contract support costs, funding for population 

growth, and for facilities construction and staffing. Without these 

increases to base funding, the Indian health system would experience a decrease in its ability to care for current populations. Second, the work group recommended $1.14 billion be added to 

identify programs and facilities accounts. Programs services increases refer to the recommended increases in HHS budget accounts to enable our program to improve and expand the services 

they provide to Indian patients. As you know, the IHS has long 

been plagued by woefully inadequate funding in the program areas. 

On behalf of all tribes, please move toward funding all of the IHS 

budget. On behalf of the National Indian Health Board, thank you 

for the opportunity to address the Subcommittee on these important matters, and I will be happy to answer your questions. 

[The statement of Buford Rolin follows:] 


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Mr. MORAN. Very well done. Thank you, Mr. Rolin. 

Mr. ROLIN. Thank you. 

Mr. MORAN. Thank you very much. Good testimony. We will now 

hear from Mickey Peercy who is the Tribal Executive Director of 

the Choctaw Nation of Oklahoma. 

TUESDAY, MARCH 23, 2010. 

CHOCTAW NATION OF OKLAHOMA 

WITNESS 

MICKEY PEERCY 

Mr. PEERCY. I want to thank the committee and Subcommittee 

for having Choctaw Nation of Oklahoma here. We have been here 

over the last 4 years to—and this is not in my written testimony— 

but we have been here in the last 4 years to think about Jones 

Academy, and I think that is working. That program is working. 

It is working through the BIA, and so the only thing I wanted to 

say is that I appreciate the interest in the movement from the Subcommittee to move the issue with Jones Academy forward. 

Chief Pyle sends his regards and wishes he could be here, but 

he is in Shreveport for a community meeting tonight. 

Mr. COLE. If I could just interrupt real quickly. 

Mr. PEERCY. Yes, Congressman. 

Mr. COLE. Our friend, Congressman Boren and I share representation of the Choctaw Nation, and Dan did a great job working 

with Chairman Dicks in making sure that Jones Academy thing 

got done. 

Mr. PEERCY. Thank you. 

Mr. COLE. So I just wanted to make sure that that was in the 

record. 

Mr. PEERCY. Thank you, and we certainly appreciate that. 

I am here today to talk—there are about five issues that I have 

got in my written testimony that revolve around Indian Health 

Service contract support costs, contract health service, sanitation 

facilities construction, mandatories, and additional money back into 

the self-governance line item. 

The two, the mandatories and the self-governance line item, 

again, they are in the written testimony. We ask that you pay close 

attention to that. 

In terms of contract support costs, in the written testimony you 

have with you describes the stance of the Tribal Self Governance 

Advisory Committee and how they stand on contract support costs. 

We certainly support that stance, and we will support—I know 

Lloyd Miller will speak later about contract support costs, and we 

are part of his coalition. 

Just for an instance, I know we did a joint venture in Idabel, 

Congressman, about 6 or 7 years ago. It took until this year to get 

contract support costs on that addition to our program, so there is 

a real program. Our goal eventually is to make sure the shortfall 

is done away with, and I think Mr. Miller will describe how that 

can be done. 


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Secondly, with contract health service, I do not know how familiar you folks are with contract health service, probably the most 

complex service provided in health service. It is those payments to 

outside doctors, vendors, hospitals, those things that we cannot 

provide in-house. I spoke about 6 or 8 weeks ago to a Senate Committee on Indian Affairs about that issue, and the problem with the 

800-pound gorilla is we do not know how much it is going to cost 

to fully fund that. Dr. Roubideaux within the health service has 

taken some steps forward to put a committee together to start taking a look at that. But again, we do not know how much it is going 

to cost. I know Senator Dorgan asked, ‘‘what is it going to cost to 

fully fund it?’’ We do not know. It is not the money we spend. It 

is not the deferreds and denials, it is those three, plus we know in 

our systems, Chickasaw, Choctaw systems, doctors do not make 

those referrals because they know it is not going to get paid. So 

there is an 800-pound gorilla out there waiting on us. 

The one thing I wanted to really talk about is you do not hear 

much about sanitation facilities construction. Choctaw Nation’s 

southeast corner of Oklahoma is the size of Vermont. In Oklahoma, 

we have mountains, you know. We have hard to access communities and hard to access homes. Sanitation facilities construction 

is about putting those water systems in, those sewer systems in, 

that reaches those homes and those communities. It is a lot like on 

the BIA side, it is a lot like the roads program because we deal 

with communities, we deal with municipalities, we deal with rural 

water districts going into joint partnerships to try to use our money 

and their money, because in Oklahoma, we are not a reservation 

state. So our tribal folks live among everyone else. In Oklahoma there is an unmet need of $77 million. So we would 

ask that as we look into the Indian Health Service budget, that 

sanitation facilities really get looked at. It does not get looked at 

when you are talking about the difference in cancer, heart disease, 

diabetes, those things that we look at, but it is a preventative service that is necessary to keep the health of our people. Nine seconds. 

[The statement of Mickey Peercy follows:] 


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Mr. MORAN. Thank you very much, Mr. Peercy. Mr. Cole, since 

it is Oklahoma. 

Mr. COLE. Thank you because there are actually a couple of 

points I want to make, and Mr. Peercy made one of them right off 

the bat. This is not a reservation tribe at all. What is the size of 

the Choctaw Nation? 

Mr. PEERCY. It is the size of Vermont. 

Mr. COLE. Yeah, but what is the number of people, I should say. 

Mr. PEERCY. Choctaw Nation totals 200,000 people. There are 

probably 65,000, 70,000 of those living in the ten counties. 

Mr. COLE. And what is the size of your tribal budget, roughly? 

Mr. PEERCY. Total? 

Mr. COLE. Yes. 

Mr. PEERCY. Health system or total? 

Mr. COLE. Total. 

Mr. PEERCY. A billion. 

Mr. COLE. And there is no per-capita income distribution, correct? 

Mr. PEERCY. No, sir. None at all. Services are provided. 

Mr. COLE. Right. So what you do is end up—everything you 

make, gaming, every other enterprise you have and there are multiple enterprises, Mr. Chairman—turn back and get invested in 

healthcare—— 

Mr. PEERCY. Yes, sir. 

Mr. COLE [continuing]. Education services—— 

Mr. PEERCY. Yes, sir. 

Mr. COLE [continuing]. Cooperative arrangements with local governments? 

Mr. PEERCY. Yes, sir. Pretty unbelievable exercise and very different from what most people understand tribes to be, and that is 

the common situation in Oklahoma. This is one of the largest tribes 

in the country. They do an unbelievably good job. 

Mr. COLE. Thank you. 

Mr. MORAN. Thank you for pointing that out. Thank you, Mr. 

Cole. 

Mr. MORAN. Mr. Olver from Western Massachusetts has joined 

us, also the Chair of the Housing and Roads Appropriations Committee. 

Mr. OLVER. May I make a comment? 

Mr. MORAN. Yes. 

Mr. OLVER. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Since you had introduced 

me, I would just like to say for people who are here to testify today 

that Mr. Moran and I did not particularly plan this this way, it 

turns out that tomorrow I am holding in my Subcommittee, which 

covers transportation and housing and urban development, which 

does the road building on reservations, and HUD of course deals 

with Indian housing on the reservations and the construction and 

such. We are going to be doing that in Room 2358 at 10:00. I think 

it is 10:00 tomorrow. And for anybody who is still around, that 

makes it almost a two-fer for those who would have an interest or 

who are involved in the reservations and would want to know 

something about this oversight hearing on the building—— 

Mr. COLE. Would the gentleman yield? 

Mr. OLVER [continuing]. And housing programs. 


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Mr. COLE. Would the gentleman yield for just a question on 

point? Some of that money I think went to your community. I am 

not even sure, but there is tribal road building money. It does not 

just go to reservations. These folks are in partnership with county 

governments and everything from bridges to things that county 

governments cannot afford, particularly where they have got either 

concentrations of their tribal members which then helps everybody, 

or where they have got the tribal enterprises. They become partners with some of that money that you make available to other 

people around them. 

So a lot of that, quote, reservation road money is not always 

spent on reservations. But it is spent through tribes. 

Mr. MORAN. Good. A very important point. If any of you are 

going to be around, that would be a worthwhile hearing to observe 

tomorrow under Mr. Olver’s committee. 

Thank you very much. 

Mr. PEERCY. Thank you for your time. 

Mr. MORAN. Thank you. All right. Next we will hear from Donald 

Rodgers, the Chief of the Catawba Indian Nation, South Carolina. 

TUESDAY, MARCH 23, 2010. 

CATAWBA INDIAN NATION, SOUTH CAROLINA 

WITNESS 

DONALD RODGERS 

Mr. RODGERS. Good afternoon. Thank you very much on behalf 

of the Catawba Indian Nation for allowing us this opportunity to 

testify before the House Interior Appropriations Subcommittee. 

First and foremost, I think that a lot of times Congress folks do 

not hear enough appreciation, and I want to personally thank you 

on behalf of the Catawba Tribe who received support from the committee this past year. As we had some budget and audit issues that 

I had to address when I took office about 21⁄2 years ago, but with 

the support of Chairman Moran, Ranking Member Simpson, Congressman Cole, and the committee as a whole, the Bureau of Indian Affairs did take action and allowed the Catawba Indian Nation to receive several million dollars in funds that were allocated 

to it, and we would not have been able to do so without you all’s 

support, and I deeply appreciate that, sir, from the Catawba Indian 

Nation. Thank you so much. 

Mr. MORAN. I think Mr. Spratt was also instrumental in that. 

Mr. RODGERS. Yes, sir. 

Mr. MORAN. Not think, I know that, and he is a good friend and 

a good friend of the Catawba—— 

Mr. RODGERS. Yes, sir. 

Mr. MORAN [continuing]. To his credit as well. 

Mr. RODGERS. Well, thank you very much. I am here today to 

urge the Subcommittee to invest federal dollars in programs that 

support economic development for smaller tribes that have limited 

resources but like the Catawba are committed to achieving economic self-sufficiency. The Catawba Indian Nation is one of a handful of federally recognized tribes that do not enjoy the range of full 


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sovereign powers possessed by most federally recognized Indian nations. 

Under the terms of our settlement agreement, we possess what 

I would term second-class tribal sovereignty. For example, in the 

area of gaming, we are not authorized to establish gaming operations pursuant to the Indian Gaming Regulatory Act. Instead, we 

are limited to small bingo halls, and let me explain a couple of 

things here. 

During the Revolutionary War, the Catawba Indian Nation stood 

with the American Colonists in their struggle for independence 

from the doctoral mandates of King George III. Catawba scouts accompanied then General George Washington on many of his campaigns through the South. Ever since, the Catawbas have always 

answered the call of country, living up to their half of the tribe’s 

government relationship with the United States, and we will continue to do that. 

It is our hope that when we come back to Congress and ask for 

amendments to our settlement act to restore some of our lost sovereignty and free up our economic potential that Congress will respond to our call just as enthusiastically as we have responded to 

the call of America as a whole. 

In the 2000 census, the Catawba Indian Nation had a per-capita income of just $11,000. The estimated current unemployment rate 

among the Catawba is more than double that of the State, which 

is very high itself now. I think it is at 26 percent overall, and so 

about half of our folks are unemployed now. The tribe currently 

has no economic development venture, so what we have come to 

ask for is that we want the same rights as other tribes but we 

want to also have the opportunity to have funding that comes to 

our tribe on behalf of small economic ventures. We are working on 

a Catawba market to create jobs that improve services to our tribal 

members but also gives them an opportunity to work. Also, a major 

road extension that would provide decent, safe access to our reservation but also allows emergency services to come to the reservation. 

A ride share program to get our members to jobs located 

throughout the area, and the summer youth program that will 

allow our children and young people to become engaged in education and prevention activities for them. 

I thank you for this opportunity to talk about the needs of the 

Catawba Indian Nation. Your support for our people and indeed for 

all the native people in America is greatly appreciated and truly 

in the best traditions of the government, the government relationship. Again, I thank you for the time that we have been able to 

spend here. 

[The statement of Donald Rodgers follows:] 


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Mr. MORAN. I thank you very much, Mr. Rodgers. Is there any 

more money that needs to be settled with regard to the claim on 

the Catawba Nation? 

Mr. RODGERS. Well, what happened with that is the Department 

of Interior worked with the Department of Treasury to suspend collection on the debt, but we are working on that. I do not know if 

Congressman Sprat has asked you to seek an appropriation to settle that debt and if that could take place, that would be a blessing 

for us dearly. 

Mr. MORAN. Okay. Thank you. 

Mr. COLE. Quickly, and I will try and be quick, Chairman. I just 

wanted to really reemphasize a point you made, Chief Rodgers, 

which all states may be equal but all tribes are not, and we have 

dispensed recognition in many cases and stripped tribes of the ability to pursue their own economic interests. We have done it as recently as the last Congress. It is totally the wrong thing to do. It 

actually turns the tribe into a permanent ward of the state and 

does not allow them to pursue the opportunities they ought to be 

able to pursue. And you are a perfect example of a tribe that has 

been handicapped in this way for a long time. 

The second, just a quick question to you. I know you were working with Secretary Echohawk, and he probably ought to get a plug 

here, too, because I understand he has been working really hard. 

Mr. RODGERS. Yes, he has. He has worked extremely hard for us 

and on our behalf, and we do offer him plugs quite a bit and thank 

him for that. I do appreciate his hard work for us on our behalf 

because he did step to the plate and it was an emotional day for 

us that day because it freed up about $3 million of funds that came 

to us immediately. 

Mr. COLE. He would not tell me what he was going to tell you, 

but he told you you were going to be a lot happier when you left 

than when you saw him. 

Mr. RODGERS. We were extremely happy. 

Mr. COLE. I thought it was going to happen. 

Mr. RODGERS. Thank you all for your help. 

Mr. COLE. Thank you. Thank you, Chairman. 

Mr. MORAN. Once in a while good things happen to deserving 

people. Okay. Thank you very much. Good job, Mr. Rodgers. Now 

we will hear from Geoffrey Roth, the Executive Director of the 

International Council of Urban Indian Health. 

TUESDAY, MARCH 23, 2010. 

NATIONAL COUNCIL OF URBAN INDIAN HEALTH 

WITNESS 

GEOFFREY ROTH 

Mr. ROTH. I will be as brief as possible, and I thank you guys 

very much. 

My name is Geoff Roth. I am the Director of the National Council 

of Urban Indian Health and a descendant of the Standing Rock 

Sioux Nation. I sit here and represent 36 of our member organizaVerDate Mar 15 2010 02:18 May 18, 2010 Jkt 056200 PO 00000 Frm 00169 Fmt 6633 Sfmt 6602 E:\HR\OC\A200P2.XXX A200P2

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tions and 150,000 American Indians and Alaska natives that our 

programs serve every year. 

I would like to thank Chairman Moran for this opportunity to 

talk about the fiscal year 2011 budget. 

Like everyone else has done, I would really like to come and say 

thank you first, thank you for healthcare reform. Thank you for the 

Indian Healthcare Improvement Act, and thank you for the increased budget in fiscal year 2010. However, our work is not done. 

In order to fulfill the promises of the Indian Healthcare Improvement Act, we must work toward ensuring that the new programs 

and projects under IHCIA receive the necessary funding for implementation. We ask the Subcommittee to sit down and be our partner implementing these new authorities. 

I have got three main budget recommendations. First, we fully 

support the National Indian Health Board’s tribal budget formulation process and $2.1 billion above the fiscal year 2010 funding 

level. We are grateful that the President’s budget freeze did not include the Indian Health Services Budget. That is great. Second, NCU strongly advocates for a $4 million increase to the 

Urban Indian Health line item. We believe this is a modest increase request in light of the incredible need within the urban Indian communities and in order to meet rising needs, we definitely 

need that. 

Last, NCU would like to encourage the Subcommittee to discuss 

the additional funding needed created by the passage of the Indian 

Healthcare Improvement Act, and we would be happy to sit down 

and talk with you about that. 

While we recognize that this year’s budget is very difficult to 

deal with, and we understand that there is an economic downturn 

in the country, we really feel that investment in Indian programs 

is extremely important. 

I want to thank you again. I would like to sit down with your 

staff and talk some more about the individual line items and again, 

$4 million to the Urban Indian line item. 

[The statement of Geoffrey Roth follows:] 


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Mr. MORAN. Very good. Nice going. Thank you, Mr. Roth. Mr. 

Cole? 

Mr. COLE. Yes. Quick point again. Given the constituency which 

you serve, which is located primarily as your name implies, in 

urban areas, if you are not funded, where do your patients go? 

Mr. ROTH. Back to the tribes. 

Mr. COLE. Either back to the tribes, which can be a long way 

away—— 

Mr. ROTH. Or the emergency room. 

Mr. COLE [continuing]. Or they become indigent care in the next 

hospital over that gets uncompensated for. So it is sort of pennywise and pound-foolish. You are not funded. I promise you, they are 

going someplace else because they do not have the wherewithal to 

do it. And again, you do not have the concentration of skill sets 

that you get a lot of these claims that are used to dealing with Indian people. They know the special healthcare challenges that population has. So you guys do great work. 

Mr. ROTH. Thank you. Thank you very much. 

Mr. OLVER. May I just ask, as information, you are not eligible 

to get care at a community health center? Many of the urgent centers do have community health care center systems. 

Mr. ROTH. Eight of our programs are dual-funded Urban Indian 

Health programs and community health center programs. A lot of 

our population will not go to the community health center programs that are not native-specific. Our patients have a hard time 

going there without the doctors and people that know how to care 

specifically for the Indian population. 

Mr. OLVER. I have heard that other years, yes, and I really do 

not entirely understand that other than—— 

Mr. ROTH. Well, there are different issues like amount of time 

that they are able to spend with patients to deal with the specific 

issues. There are long issues that our population has, medical disparities that our population has that require longer times sitting 

down and talking and, you know, being culturally sensitive. The 

community health centers do not necessarily do that. 

Mr. MORAN. But they are allowed to? 

Mr. ROTH. They are allowed to, yes. 

Mr. MORAN. And we would encourage Native Americans to take 

advantage of that if that is what is most accessible because we are 

putting more money into those community health centers. 

Mr. COLE. I could not agree more. Those are great investments. 

But it is also a population that is different, literally, genetically 

than the rest of the population to some degree, and it has certain 

susceptibilities to certain diseases. And you just will not get the expertise unless you are dealing with a large enough concentration 

of that population to get it there. 

Mr. ROTH. Yeah. 

Mr. MORAN. On the other hand, if more Native Americans did 

use the community health centers, they might beef up and become 

more sensitive. Any way, good point. 

Mr. OLVER. On the other hand, if there are eight of them that 

you do actually have arrangements with and are being sensitive to 

the kinds of issues that you raised, there is no reason why there 

cannot be 18. 


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Mr. ROTH. Yes, and I got to say, Dr. Wakefield, the administration—is really working to increase those and we want to work with 

them on it. 

Mr. MORAN. That is what we want to see. Excellent. Thank you 

very much, Mr. Roth. 

Mr. ROTH. Thank you. 

Mr. MORAN. Next we will hear from Larry Wawronowicz who is 

the National Resources Director, Lac du Flambeau Band of Lake 

Superior Chippewa Indian Tribe from Wisconsin. 

Mr. WAWRONOWICZ. Yes, how are you doing? 

Mr. MORAN. Fine. 

Mr. WAWRONOWICZ. Congratulations on your appointment. 

Mr. MORAN. Thank you, Mr. Wawronowicz. 

Mr. WAWRONOWICZ. When Jim Zorn indicated that pictures are 

worth 1,000 words, there is about a million words in there. If you 

want to share that, it gives you a little bit of an—— 

Mr. MORAN. Oh, pictures, yeah. 

Mr. WAWRONOWICZ [continuing]. Opportunity to talk about Lac 

du Flambeau. It is located in the northern part of Wisconsin. I do 

have two Lac du Flambeau tribal members that are located in the 

audience, and one is named Eric Chapman. He is our—— 

Mr. MORAN. In fact, if they would like to sit beside you, that is 

fine while you give testimony, if they would like to. 

Mr. WAWRONOWICZ. He is newly elected and tribal council member in October, and I have Patty Brown-Schwalenberg in the back 

that gave a presentation earlier. 

Mr. MORAN. Yes. We heard from her. She did a good job. 

Mr. WAWRONOWICZ. Yeah. 

TUESDAY, MARCH 23, 2010. 

LAC DU FLAMBEAU BAND OF LAKE SUPERIOR 

CHIPPEWA INDIAN TRIBE, WISCONSIN 

WITNESS 

LARRY WAWRONOWICZ 

Mr. WAWRONOWICZ. Mr. Chairman and members of the committee, I am Larry Wawronowicz, and I am the Natural Resources 

Director for the Lac du Flambeau Band of Lake Superior Chippewa 

Indians. I am going to be brief today because we have a written 

document that gives you a lot of detail on what we support within 

the President’s budget, as well as what our concerns are. And I respectfully submit this testimony on behalf of the tribal membership 

of the Lac du Flambeau Band of Lake Superior Chippewa Indians. 

This is what we are doing it for. We are doing it for the members. 

The Lac du Flambeau Band supports the inclusion of the Circle 

of Flight program as the BIA’s base program at the amount of 

$600,000. This is a very important program for us in terms of protecting our wetland resources within the Great Lakes Region as 

well as enhancing waterfowl, and you know how important waterfowl is in terms of providing the opportunity for tribal members to 

hunt for subsistence as well as it supports a good hunting program 

within the Great Lakes Region. 


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The Band also supports the $8.5 million for GAP, and the $30 

million for multi-media grant programs. But we are a little bit concerned about the $93 million reduction in the Clean Water and 

Drinking Water State Revolving Fund. But the set-aside for tribal 

programs has increased, and we appreciate that support for you to 

keep that in there. The Great Lakes Restoration initiative of $475 million at the fiscal year 2010 level, I wish we can maintain that in the fiscal year 

2011 budget. 

The tribe appreciates the increase in indirect costs for the BIA programs, but we do not understand why there was a $9.4 million 

absorption of fixed costs such as salary and fringe within the President’s budget. We would like to request this committee to restore 

that funding. 

Eric Chapman is our chief conservation law enforcement officer 

as well as a very important component of our Tribal Natural Resource Department. We have a very comprehensive program and 

conservation laws. This is one of the programs. This program is totally funded by tribal funds. There is no BIA funding whatsoever 

that is going into our program, and that is around a $248,000 

budget. Because of the economic downturn, we reduced our conservation law enforcement officers from four individual officers to 

two. And it is costing us about $100,000 per officer to put them in 

patrol vehicles and taking care of business within the boundaries 

of the reservation. 

So we are asking Congress to maybe direct some funding through 

the Bureau of Indian Affairs to support our conservation law enforcement programs. We have two officers that are basically patrolling a 144-square-mile reservation, and it is not very safe just having two people on board. 

While we support the Administration and the Congress’ support 

on trying to increase public safety in Indian country, we feel that 

some of the funds in the proposed budget are misdirected. An earlier presenter indicated that the $19 million the BIA is going to 

give the FBI or the Department of Justice for 45 I believe FBI 

agents, we feel that is misdirected and maybe not the best use of 

the dollars, and we would like to see that money go to conservation 

law enforcement officers so we can protect our resources within the 

Lac du Flambeau Indian Reservation. Conservation law enforcements are always our first line of defense to illegal activities occurring on the reservation. 

The Lac du Flambeau Band supports the $3.6 million and $2.8 

million for tribal fish hatchery operations. We would like to see 

BIA forestry monies increase. I think there is a decrease of 

$156,000 which is in this year’s budget which is not a lot but has 

totally been underfunded since 1991. And any decrease is going to 

have a negative impact on our ability to do business. It has economic development potential, helps us fight things like climate 

change because, you know, sequestering carbon and things like 

that. 

Historic preservation, we also need funding there. $120,000 I 

guess is being requested to support tribal historic preservation offices. That is about $12 million because they anticipate THPOs 

across the country. 


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And lastly, higher education is becoming so important for us at 

Lac du Flambeau because we are getting more and more people 

that are graduating from high school and going onto college and 

graduate work. So we support the budget of $2.1 million, but we are concerned 

that this particular budget is remaining flat over the few years, 

and maybe it is something that we can take care of in this budget 

but just make it something that we could red-flag for the future. 

So again, thank you very much for your time. I really appreciate 

it, and again, congratulations on your appointment, sir. 

[The statement of Larry Wawronowicz follows:] 


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Mr. MORAN. Thank you, sir. Thank you very much. Thanks for 

the testimony. I appreciate it and all the explanatory material as 

well. 

Mr. WAWRONOWICZ. Yeah, there is a good video on there, so if 

you do not have anything else to do—— 

Mr. COLE. Mr. Chairman, if I could ask one question? 

Mr. MORAN. Yes, Mr. Cole. 

Mr. COLE. This might be more appropriate to staff because I do 

not know if you would know, Mr. Roth. But this $19 million to the 

45 FBI agents has come up several times in testimony, a lot of concern. Nobody is hollering, yeah, this is a great idea. Do you know 

if those agents would be stationed specifically on reservation land? 

Mr. WAWRONOWICZ. No, the way I understand it there are 565 

federally recognized tribes in the United States. I think it is going 

to have an impact on 200 tribes. So there would be about 365 tribes 

that may or may not be affected. It does not really put a lot of 

boots on the ground as far as I am concerned within Indian country. You know, if the $19 million goes to blue force, I call it, or 

brown force, conservation law enforcement, I think it would be a 

better, efficient use of the money. 

Mr. COLE. I may be wrong. Maybe again we can direct these 

questions to the Secretary, but you know, I think the argument behind it is, look, they have got jurisdictional authority that obviously, unfortunately, tribal law enforcement does not have and this 

sort of beefs it up and speeds it up. So there is an argument either 

way, but I would just like to know a little bit more about it. 

Mr. WAWRONOWICZ. Well, if we could help in some way, you 

know, please give us a call. 

Mr. COLE. You already have. 

Mr. WAWRONOWICZ. Contact information—— 

Mr. COLE. Because just waving the red flag helps a lot. 

Mr. MORAN. Yeah, it is something we should look at. It may very 

well not be the optimal use of funds. 

Mr. WAWRONOWICZ. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. 

Mr. COLE. Thank you very much. Thank you. 

Mr. OLVER. May I make—— 

Mr. MORAN. Yeah, Mr. Olver. 

Mr. OLVER [continuing]. A very strict comment? 

Mr. MORAN. Yeah. 

Mr. OLVER. I am reminded that the hearing that I was talking 

about is at 2:00 in the afternoon rather than at 10:00 in the morning. So if anybody was inclined to visit with that subcommittee as 

we talk about housing and road building on the reservations, then 

it is 2:00 at 2358 Rayburn Building. 

Mr. MORAN. So that means you can stay up late, celebrate tonight, sleep late in the morning and come back at 2358 Rayburn 

for Mr. Olver’s hearing on housing and transportation. 

Mr. WAWRONOWICZ. Thanks again. 

Mr. MORAN. Thank you. Next we will hear from Tracy Ching 

King, the President of the Fort Belknap Indian Community in 

Montana. 


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TUESDAY, MARCH 23, 2010. 

FORT BELKNAP INDIAN COMMUNITY, MONTANA 

WITNESS 

TRACY CHING KING 

Mr. KING. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I really do not have any 

pictures, just requesting a picture perfect budget. 

Again, my name is Tracy Ching King. I serve as the President 

of the Fort Belknap Indian Community Council, home of the Assiniboine and Gros Ventre Nations. North Central Montana where 

winter is still there, and we are requesting some help with issues. 

Just like everyone else, we have our issues regarding 638 contracts. 

It seems like we are treated like prisoners and we are on probation 

sometimes, and to me that is not the way to treat us. I feel that 

the BIA should be working with us, not against us. 

A good example is: once we 638 contracted our law enforcement 

and our detention, the FTEs were 55,000 and that was cut to 

27,000 now. So we have half the funding that we should have, but 

once the BIA will take over, usually it goes to 100 percent funding. 

A lot of issues were talked about regarding different budgets. We 

are working on programs to try to deal with a lot of different 

abuses. Myself, I do not believe in locking up people. I believe in 

helping them. I have worked with kids that were ready to be locked 

up, and one of the things that happened with a grant through the 

Department of Justice about 10 years ago, many of them were 

ready to be locked up. Today a lot of them come back from Iraq, 

serve their country. I come from a family of veterans, historically, 

and my daughter served in Iraq in the satellite imagery capturing 

insurgents, and the DA and sometimes IHS, they treat our veterans as if they were the tennis ball of the Williams sisters competing against one another. 

[The statement of Tracy Ching King follows:] 


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Mr. MORAN. That is inexcusable, and I appreciate you bringing 

it to our attention. 

I have to bring to the attention of everyone here, though, we 

have just been informed we are going to have votes about 3:45. 

They are going to take us to about 4:30. At 4:30, I have a hearing 

that I have got to attend with the Chair of the Chief of Staff of the 

Army, actually, on army funding. So we are going to run out of 

time, unless Mr. Olver is able to come back, I do not know whether 

you are going to be able to about 4:30, John. 

Mr. OLVER. Oh, at 4:30? 

Mr. MORAN. Yeah. Well, if that being the case, we have got nine 

more. You are the 10th, Mr. King. I do not see how else we are 

going to have this hearing. I do not think it is fair to bring people 

back another day, so let us try to move through as many people 

as we can out of consideration for everyone. I hate to do this. 

Mr. KING. I am finished, Mr. Chairman. 

Mr. MORAN. The staff warned me that this could happen, and I 

thought that we could move forward anyway. 

Mr. KING. Okay. 

Mr. MORAN. But we have all of your testimony for the record. 

Mr. KING. Thank you. 

Mr. MORAN. Mr. Pomeroy is here. Mr. Pomeroy, did you want to 

say anything quickly with regard to Fort Belknap? 

Mr. POMEROY. Thank you. Let me just say a couple words for the 

record. You will hear either in oral or written form from David 

Gipp, the President of the United Tribes Technical College in Bismarck, North Dakota. This is one of two multi-tribal colleges that 

was founded 41 years ago, offers 17 vocational and technical programs, 11 1-year certificates and a 4-year degree to elementary 

education, 81 percent retention rate, and an extraordinary placement rate of 94 percent, Mr. Chairman. 

Mr. MORAN. Mr. Gipp, did you want to come up? We are going 

to have to move through this very quickly, unfortunately, but—— 

Mr. POMEROY. Let me just say, this outfit is the best. What they 

do is remarkable. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. 

Mr. MORAN. Thank you, Mr. Pomeroy. Very quickly. Mr. King 

was in the middle of some very good testimony, and I am sorry, Mr. 

King, it is very embarrassing that this kind of thing happens. 

Please, very quickly, Mr. Gipp, but we do want to hear from you. 

TUESDAY, MARCH 23, 2010. 

UNITED TRIBES TECHNICAL COLLEGE, NORTH DAKOTA 

WITNESS 

DAVID GIPP 

Mr. GIPP. Thank you, Mr. Chairman, and members of the Subcommittee. I will make it very quickly here within the next 1 or 

2 minutes. 

We do have five major points within our testimony that we would 

like the committee to consider. One is our general operating funds 

for United Tribes which is at about 6.4 percent in the request. We 

are also working very heavily with the Bureau of Indian Affairs 


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and with the new Administration relative to law enforcement and 

police training. We are requesting $4.3 million to fund a Northern 

Plains Indian Police Academy of which we have pretty unanimous 

support from all of our tribes in our region, and we are also working on a science and technology building that is for $3 million. Another $3 million for an expansion on our south campuses. You 

know we have been operating for over 41 years now, and we are 

also supporting the $23 million request for the Bureau of Indian 

Education for elementary and secondary schools. 

And that would summarize basically our testimony. We have 

about 1,100 adults and about 400 children on our campus with a 

K through 8 elementary school. Thank you so much. 

[The statement of David Gipp follows:] 


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Mr. MORAN. Thank you very much, President Gipp. And again, 

President King, thank you very much. So sorry to have had to interrupt your testimony. I feel very badly about that. You did not 

deserve that. 

Next, Mr. Begay who is the General Manager of the Dine Power 

Authority in the Navajo Nation of Arizona. Mr. Begay. 

TUESDAY, MARCH 23, 2010. 

DINE POWER AUTHORITY, NAVAJO NATION, ARIZONA 

WITNESS 

STEVE BEGAY 

Mr. BEGAY. Thank you, Chairman Moran, Ranking Member 

Simpson, and members of the House Interior Appropriations—— 

Mr. MORAN. Thank you, President King, President Gipp. Thank 

you both. 

Mr. BEGAY [continuing]. Subcommittee. This is Tim Goodlet, the 

Chairman of our board and also a member of the Navajo Nation 

Council. I am the general counsel for Dine Power Authority, the energy development enterprise of Navajo Nation, and we have a 

project, the largest Indian project that we know of in Indian country. It is a 1500 megawatt desert rock energy project. It has modern emissions systems. It will generate jobs over a 5-year construction period, 200 permanent jobs in the plant, 200 permanent jobs 

in the mining for a 40- to 60-year period. Navajo has 50 percent 

unemployment, but this project will bring in over $50 million over 

the term of the project. 

The agencies and the Federal Government have been slow in the 

DREP permitting process. We received the air permit from the 

EPA, and it has been withdrawn and now we are a little bit frustrated that things are moving forward slowly. It has been twice extended for public review and comment process, and still we do not 

have a permit today. It is notable that coal projects in Illinois and 

Colorado, which were at the same stage of permitting in 2004, are 

now under construction. 

Why is the project located on Indian lands put at such an incredible regulatory disadvantage to other projects? Navajo nation is 

similarly frustrated by the continued delays in the federal environmental impact statement process. 

We have been actively engaged in both the EPA and the Department of Interior in an effort to bring these regulatory processes to 

closure in a reasonable timeframe. DPA urges this committee to include in the fiscal year 2011 Interior Appropriations bill sufficient 

funds to ensure that the EPA and the Interior are adequately 

resourced to complete the DREP regulatory processes and report 

language tasking them to move these processes forward in a quick 

way. 

[The statement of Steve Begay follows:] 


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Mr. MORAN. I think we should put report language in. Maybe if 

the staff feels that a letter asking that they accelerate the process 

of it, it is at a pace comparable to non-Indian lands, that might be 

a constructive thing to do. We appreciate you bringing it to our attention. Thank you very much. 

Mr. BEGAY. Thank you very much. 

Mr. MORAN. Thank you. We greatly appreciate that. Faye 

BlueEyes. Thank you very much, Mr. Begay. 

TUESDAY, MARCH 23, 2010. 

DZILTH-NA-O-DITH-HLE COMMUNITY GRANT SCHOOL 

BOARD, NEW MEXICO 

WITNESS 

FAYE BLUEEYES 

Ms. BLUEEYES. Good afternoon. I am Faye BlueEyes. I am the 

program director at Dzilth-Na-O-Dith-Hle Community School. Our 

school is part of the Bureau of Indian Education School System and 

is operated by an all-Navajo school board with a grant from BIE. 

The main thing I would like to point out is that—schools get the 

same tribal grant support cost as BIA non-school contractor. We 

are only going to get 66 percent while the non-school contractors 

will get 94 percent. But yet we both do the same thing, so we feel 

that is very unfair and it is not good policy and the disparity is just 

not right. 

And then I urge you to please read my written testimony. 

[The statement of Faye BlueEyes follows:] 


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Mr. MORAN. Thank you, and thanks for being so brief. Maybe 

working with Mr. Cole and other members of the Committee we 

can rectify some of the—it does not seem that it should be so disparate. That disparate treatment is something we should be able 

to do without having to devote a lot of resources, but maybe we can 

focus a little attention to it. 

Mr. Crouch, James Crouch, Executive Director of the California 

Rural Indian Health Board. 

TUESDAY, MARCH 23, 2010. 

CALIFORNIA RURAL INDIAN HEALTH BOARD 

WITNESS 

JAMES CROUCH 

Mr. CROUCH. Thank you for having me here. I will be extremely 

brief. 

CRIHB, in association with Tribally Operated Health Programs 

in California supports the President’s request for the appropriations for fiscal year 2011. We would like to inform you about the 

fact that there are only two areas in the IHS that have no IHS hospitals so that all of our inpatient and specialty care is provided 

through the contract healthcare system. The President’s request 

does include a significant, although never sufficient, amount of 

funds, new funds, program improvement funds, for contract 

healthcare. 

You may hear, and I would draw your attention to the last page 

of my testimony, that the current formula or the new change formula overly advantages those of us that have no access to IHS 

funded inpatient and specialty care. The graph shows actually over 

10 years distributing the same $46 million every year going forward, after about a billion dollars, basically, the programs that 

have no hospitals, have not overlapped or exceeded in fact the relative distribution among the 12 areas stays the same. The curve 

has been bent up, and we appreciate the support. 

[The statement of James Crouch follows:] 


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Mr. MORAN. Okay. Thank you very much. I see what you are telling us in this chart. Thank you very much, Mr. Crouch. Well done. 

Next we will hear from Harold Dustybull who is Vice President 

of the National Johnson-O’Malley Association headquartered in 

Oklahoma. 

TUESDAY, MARCH 23, 2010. 

NATIONAL JOHNSON-O’MALLEY ASSOCIATION, 

OKLAHOMA 

WITNESS 

HAROLD DUSTYBULL 

Mr. DUSTYBULL. Congressman Moran, Congressman Cole, Congressman Olver, I just have a couple of things, and I will make it 

real brief. We want our funds restored to $24 million which was 

a fiscal year 2006 enacted level. That is the main thing that we 

have been pushing for for years. 

We also want a position in the Department of Interior to oversee 

the JOM program. Those are two things that we have had and 

were taken away from us, and we want them back. And we ask for 

your folks’ help in putting this back in place for us. 

And the rest of it is in my testimony, and I thank you very much. 

[The statement of Harold Dustybull follows:] 


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Mr. MORAN. The testimony is very good testimony, and I am just 

reading it through here. I know Mr. Cole has a particular interest 

in Johnson-O’Malley Act, and I think as he explains it as you do, 

he gets some support there as well. Did you have anything you 

wanted to say, Tom? 

Mr. COLE. Thank you for those comments, Mr. Chairman. I look 

forward to working with you on it, and as you know, it is a great 

program. We need to restore it. 

Mr. DUSTYBULL. Thank you. 

Mr. MORAN. Thank you. Very well done. Thank you very much, 

Mr. Dustybull. 

Joseph Brings Plenty, Chairman of the Cheyenne River Sioux 

Tribe in South Dakota. 

TUESDAY, MARCH 23, 2010. 

CHEYENNE RIVER SIOUX TRIBE, SOUTH DAKOTA 

WITNESS 

JOSEPH BRINGS PLENTY 

Mr. BRINGS PLENTY. My name is Joseph Brings Plenty. I am tribal Chairman, Cheyenne River Sioux Tribe. 

I am not going to be able to do any justice as far as what I have 

written down here. I have come a long ways, and I know you are 

pressed for time. So what we have here are our priorities, and I 

have traveled in representation from my nation to come here to express our concerns. I know that each and every other tribe out 

there has great concerns, and each one of them are unique in their 

ways, but everything is down in the testimony here. I hope you 

read it and take our priorities into consideration. Thank you. 

[The statement of Joseph Brings Plenty follows:] 


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Mr. MORAN. Do not leave yet. Tell us for a couple more minutes 

about your priorities. The Cheyenne River Sioux Tribe is the fourth 

largest tribe in the United States. We should be able to afford you 

more than a minute-and-a-half. Go ahead. 

Mr. BRINGS PLENTY. Okay. Let me go ahead and read through 

my testimony. 

Mr. MORAN. No, you do not have to read through it. Just tell us 

from your heart what you want us to be doing. What would you be 

doing if you were on this side of the table? 

Mr. BRINGS PLENTY. One thing for sure is that our greatest priority is our water and infrastructure, and we had an appropriation 

through WRDA in 2007. It had survived basically a veto by the 

President then. But it was one of the unfunded mandates that so 

many people have heard of. 

This past January we had dealt with a winter ice storm which 

knocked out over 3,000 poles throughout our reservation. We had 

10,000 tribal members without electricity, without heat, without 

water. 

Mr. MORAN. How long did they go without power? 

Mr. BRINGS PLENTY. I would say half of the tribe went without 

power for about a week, and the rest of the tribe for about 2 weeks. 

And there were some rural areas that went without electricity for 

19 days. 

I guess one thing that you have to understand, too, as soon as 

the electricity went off the following day, there was 40-below wind 

chill factors with 40-miles-per-hour winds that had hit the reservation area on the Great Plains. 

Mr. COLE. Did you get a FEMA disaster declaration for that? 

Mr. BRINGS PLENTY. Yeah, we did. It was recently approved, and 

we are going through the application process this week back home. 

Mr. COLE. I would like to know how you come out on that because actually we had a similar situation in my area, in a rural 

area, and FEMA was actually quite good about helping. Those 

poles are $2,000 a piece to put up. So just do the math. At least 

that is what they are in our area. They may be more in yours. But 

that is a huge drain on tribal resources if you do not get it back 

up, and you should be eligible for FEMA help on something like 

that. 

Mr. BRINGS PLENTY. Yeah, the FEMA was approved. We are 

going through the process. The utility company actually is not 

owned by the tribe. Our part of it, of course, with the water infrastructure, when that went down, that posed—we had to send our 

dialysis patients off the reservation, actually to our sister tribe. 

The Oglala Sioux Tribe had assisted us greatly during that time. 

We had about 40 or 39 people get sent off the reservation. But our 

water infrastructure is most important. We cannot build. We have 

three or four families living in one home. Unless we get the water 

infrastructure of course with—and HUD you cannot build a new 

home unless you know, you have to have the infrastructure there 

for it before those dollars are spent. Probably about 5, 6 days into 

it, when the electricity came on, we had numerous assaults. A lot 

of people were pretty tired of each other, so law enforcement, which 

we have about 10 officers for 2.8 million acres there, trying to police the area were just overwhelmed. We had extra BIA personnel 


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come on to assist, thank God nobody had perished during the 

storm. 

Mr. COLE. Just to underline the need, do you happen to know 

roughly what the unemployment figure on this reservation would 

be and what the per-capita income is? 

Mr. BRINGS PLENTY. Eighty-six percent unemployment rate, and 

I would say maybe, for some families, I know that they are living 

off about $500, $300—— 

Mr. COLE. So clearly not a lot of resources available to meet 

these kind of needs when you are talking infrastructure law enforcement all across the board. They are not there to be locally generated at this point. 

Mr. BRINGS PLENTY. Yes, exactly. 

Mr. MORAN. Some of us saw this on television and wished we 

could have done something about it. 

Mr. Olver, do you have any ideas, Chairing the House—— 

Mr. OLVER. Oh, do I have ideas. I am not sure that it is possible 

to cover them as quickly since—have the votes been called? I am 

not sure. 

Mr. MORAN. They have not been called quite yet. 

Mr. OLVER. I would like to ask a couple questions if I may. 

Mr. MORAN. Okay. 

Mr. OLVER. I note, Joseph, that you are also the Vice Chairman 

of the United Sioux Tribes Development Corporation. What sort of 

a budget does your development corporation have per year? 

Mr. BRINGS PLENTY. Well, right now it has not—before it was in 

the President’s budget. Since then before Bush’s terms, it had been 

surviving on earmarks basically, and the corporation, of course, it 

involves all the tribes that are involved with the treaty of 1868. 

Right now I could not give you an exact estimate, but they are not 

functioning off very much money. 

Mr. OLVER. And what kind of things come under the development? Do you build housing? Are you trying to create jobs? 

Mr. BRINGS PLENTY. Yes—— 

Mr. OLVER. Are you developing social services in the development corporation? 

Mr. BRINGS PLENTY. It takes care of some of the social needs on 

a public level as far as some individuals, and it had been done in 

the past as far as relocating from the reservation off, but what the 

primary function of the corporation is to create opportunity. And he 

had stated possible development in a business. That is—— 

Mr. OLVER. Job opportunities? 

Mr. BRINGS PLENTY. Yes, exactly. And one thing, if you read in 

there toward the end of it, as per my request is funding for a database which is I think for just about every tribe out there would be 

very useful. We do not have a database system to where we could 

collect all our information. That would be one function of the 

United Sioux Tribes Corporation, to be able to be a hub for all of 

the tribes. 

Mr. OLVER. And you are United Sioux Tribes, the corporation, 

the development corporation, that covers all the Sioux bands from 

North Dakota, South Dakota and Nebraska? 

Mr. BRINGS PLENTY. Nebraska, yeah. The ones that are on—— 


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Mr. OLVER. How many bands would there be? How many bands 

would you—— 

Mr. BRINGS PLENTY. Nine. 

Mr. OLVER. Nine? 

Mr. MORAN. So we will move on at this point, but Mr. Olver, let 

me just say, he is a very good guy, and he does chair the Housing 

and Transportation Appropriations Committee. It might be useful 

to contact his staff. I do not know whether he can help you out at 

all, but he is having a hearing on Indian housing tomorrow afternoon, and you know, he allocates his money according to need. 

Mr. OLVER. But we do not have enough for all the needs—— 

Mr. MORAN. No, that is for sure. 

Mr. OLVER [continuing]. On the reservations to say nothing of 

the needs elsewhere. 

Mr. BRINGS PLENTY. And real quick, too, without the upgraded 

water infrastructure, we cannot—if we build a house here and add 

on a line, then somebody loses water pressure here. So we cannot 

build houses or we cannot build business. We cannot build anything. Right now, we have a moratorium on our reservation stating 

that we cannot build because of the water pressure. 

Mr. MORAN. And what can you do about the water pressure? 

Mr. BRINGS PLENTY. We have done just about everything that we 

could. We put up water towers, we put up reserves, everything that 

we could, and we have been very efficient but, you know, at this 

point, we—— 

Mr. MORAN. The water is not there. 

Mr. BRINGS PLENTY. This has been an issue since 1993. 

Mr. COLE. What would be the largest job-creators—if you can 

just tell me a couple of them that are done by your development 

corporation? 

Mr. BRINGS PLENTY. It has been helpful in the past with some 

of the tribes to create business within their reservations. But like 

I said it has not been very effective for some years now because of 

the funding. It was in the President’s budget before. It is not now. 

So what we will do is come together and bring our ideas and push 

forward with a resolution from the Great Sioux Nation. What I 

could do, Mr. Olver, is send you a list of what United Sioux Tribes 

has done in the past to give you an idea of how it could be useful 

and what a good tool it could be. 

Mr. OLVER. From my point of view, one needs to understand exactly all that—land or much of it North and South Dakota and a 

couple of places in Nebraska would be your bands. Some of them 

have their own tribal housing authorities—— 

Mr. BRINGS PLENTY. Yes. 

Mr. OLVER [continuing]. Which would do housing. 

Mr. BRINGS PLENTY. Yes. 

Mr. OLVER. One by one. And whether each of the separate bands 

has mechanisms to do economic development, which is what you 

are talking about. HUD begins to talk about doing economic development which is what urban development is the other part of the 

title, not just housing and urban development, and not that you are 

urban particularly but in your communities. Certainly you need 

community development. 


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Mr. MORAN. So the more you can collaborate or you can show 

that it is generating jobs, the more consistent it is with the Federal 

Government’s priorities, and Mr. Olver is a good contact to have 

and we appreciate your testimony. Thank you very much. 

Mr. BRINGS PLENTY. Thank you, sir. I appreciate it. 

Mr. MORAN. Thank you. Brian Patterson, President of the United 

South and Eastern Tribes of Tennessee. 

TUESDAY, MARCH 23, 2010. 

UNITED SOUTH AND EASTERN TRIBES, INC., 

TENNESSEE 

WITNESS 

BRIAN PATTERSON 

Mr. PATTERSON. Good morning or good afternoon as it may be. 

Chairman Brings Plenty, while America turned to Haiti with its 

heart in its wallet, the eyes of Indian country looked at your reservation with our thoughts and prayers and put our minds together 

and came up with ways that we could assist your people. So thank 

you for your leadership. 

And just as a point of interest as we sit here and we center our 

issues around self-determination and self-governance and self-sufficiency to become a self-determining people, I would just like to 

point out in point of the hardships on chairman’s reservation facing 

his people, I spoke with Gail Kingman, the Executive Director of 

Great Plains Association, and we are going to spear a movement 

that would rally Indian country to put an emergency 

respondedness plan of action and develop some strategies that we 

could reach out and support Indian country in times of need such 

as this. Just as Katrina devastated some of my tribes in the South, 

in many of our USET member tribes, our family responded. We 

want to put into place the same type of strategy to respond within 

Indian country and help them out. 

Mr. MORAN. Nice going, Mr. President. Thank you. Excellent. 

Mr. PATTERSON. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I expressed my 

heart-felt gratitude to you chairing this committee in taking on and 

shouldering that responsibility. So from my heart, I express my 

heart-felt gratitude. 

Mr. Cole, I would just like to acknowledge your years as a tireless warrior and advocate for Indian country. Many thank yous. 

Mr. Olver, same with you. Thank you for, with heartfelt gratitude for serving in your capacity. 

I have served my people for nearly 20 years as Bear Clan representative of the Oneida Indian Nation of New York. I am in my 

second term as USET President of the United South and East 

Tribes. We are very diverse, not only in geography but in where we 

are in development. I represent tribes from Texas to Florida up to 

Maine, 25 federally recognized tribes, and we are grateful for this 

opportunity to present. 

Most of the USET in the BIA and BIE budget priorities are in 

line with identified national tribal priorities. However, there are 

several areas of concern that are specific to the tribes of the eastVerDate Mar 15 2010 02:18 May 18, 2010 Jkt 056200 PO 00000 Frm 00221 Fmt 6633 Sfmt 6602 E:\HR\OC\A200P2.XXX A200P2

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ern region. While USET believes that all Indian programs are vital 

to creating strong tribal governments and that Congress should 

protect and improve current base funding levels for all programs, 

the USET priority programs are tribal priority allocations, contract 

support, tribal courts and scholarships. Education is the key to our 

survival as a people as well as the other priorities listed in advancing the best, bright future for our children. 

Thank you for your time, sir. 

[The statement of Brian Patterson follows:] 


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Mr. MORAN. Thank you very much. Good, concise, to-the-point 

testimony, and I appreciate it very much, Mr. Patterson. As you 

probably know, members, but far more importantly, the staff is 

going to review all of these statements and hopefully we will be 

able to reflect them in our markup. So thank you very much. 

Mr. PATTERSON. If we can be of any further service, please do not 

hesitate to call on us. Thank you. 

Mr. MORAN. And thank you for responding for the Cheyenne 

River Sioux situation. That was horrible what they encountered 

through a natural disaster, and it is great to hear your response. 

Thank you, Mr. Patterson. Excellent. 

Lloyd Miller, who is a partner in Sonosky Chambers Sachse Miller & Munson, and Counsel to the National Tribal Contract Support Cost Coalition. 

TUESDAY, MARCH 23, 2010. 

NATIONAL TRIBAL CONTRACT SUPPORT COST 

COALITION 

WITNESS 

LLOYD MILLER 

Mr. MILLER. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. The coalition is com- prised of 16 tribes in 10 states administering over $400 million in 

Indian health service grants and contracts and self-governance 

agreements. 

I can say two things today without fear of contradiction. One is 

that the most important piece of Indian legislation to pass in the 

last 35 years is the Indian Self-Determination Act. It has produced 

enormous improvement for Indian communities by the communities 

themselves through contracts, compacts, self-governance agreements. Mr. Cole’s district in particular is stellar across the country 

as well as in Alaska. 

I can also say without fear of contradiction and as the Senate has 

said and the House has said that the single greatest impediment 

to the success of self-determination has been the underpayment of 

contract support costs. 

The committee has heard a lot this morning and this afternoon 

about contract support costs, and they sound like a very obscure 

issue. Contract support costs are the fixed costs that are set by the 

Federal Government through indirect cost rates that must be incurred which are audited every year and re-audited after they are 

incurred. They are fixed costs. They are costs of insurance, for instance, workers’ compensation insurance. They are fixed. When 

they are not paid by the agency, they come out of the program. As 

a result, tribes are penalized such as the Cherokee nation, over $10 

million. The Choctaw Nation, also a member of the coalition’s like 

sum, several $10 million shortfalls across the country. Every $10 

million is 243 positions lost in healthcare both as a result of the 

money that comes out of the program and then the Medicare and 

Medicaid third-party revenues that cannot be generated. 

So it is an enormous drain on jobs in very depressed areas that 

provide healthcare, law enforcement, grazing, land programs, all of 


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the programs that you have heard about today. Our concern is that 

when the budget is balanced on the contract support costs line 

item, instead of some other line item such as law enforcement, it 

is terrible to balance it on anything. But it balances it on the line 

item where only tribes participate, then it is balancing a budget 

disproportionately on the tribes. If it is balanced, for instance, on 

the hospital and clinic’s budget, half of which, 60 percent of which 

is run by the tribes and 40 percent by IHS, there is a certain parity. But if it is balanced only on the contract support cost line, 100 

percent of the cut is borne by the tribes. 

So we would ask this committee to give some consideration. Wonderful of the committee the work that you did last year to increase 

an already wonderful budget request from the President to $116 

million and to find funding for the BIA contract support cost increase. Spectacular, unprecedented in 20 years, that increase, but 

unfortunately, we are still only at 80 percent funding on both sides 

in 2011 at the President’s figures. I must correct the budget justification from the BIA. The BIA took the amount of the budget request and divided by the 2007 need, and that calculated out to 94 

percent of need which a colleague earlier just mentioned. In fact, 

if they divided it by the 2011, it would be about 80 percent. 

So there is a long way to go. The testimony explains how we might close the gap in a three-year period, $30 million increases 

from IHS, $21 million increases per year for the BIA. These are 

enormous numbers, and the pressure is on the committee. You are 

formidable. I thank the committee for working on this issue so 

much over the years and offer any assistance I can to help in the 

future. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. 

[The statement of Lloyd Miller follows:] 


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Mr. MORAN. Thank you. Thank you very much, sir. I appreciate, 

Mr. Miller, what you are doing on behalf of Native Americans. 

If we cut it tight on this vote, we could have almost 5 minutes 

left, and what we could do, we have got two or three members that 

we cut short. If there are comments that you feel should have been 

made that have not gotten into the—thank you, Mr. Miller. You 

can offer comments, too, but if you feel there are comments that 

should have been made, we are open to them. We want to maximize our time in this hearing because we do not get enough time 

to listen to the Native American communities, and we want to get 

as much on the record as possible. 

Are there any comments that you wanted to make that, you 

know, having taken your seat subsequently that you thought, gee, 

I wish I had said so-and-so. Go ahead. 

Mr. ROTH. I just wanted to—— 

Mr. MORAN. You need to repeat your name again for the record. 

Mr. ROTH. My name is Geoffrey Roth, and I am the Executive 

Director of the National Council of Urban Indian Health. 

I did mention or was in my testimony that urban Indian health 

programs did not receive any money from the ARRA funding at all. 

Indian tribes community health centers and other programs that 

serve Indian populations received ARRA funding. Our programs 

did not receive any of that. 

So in consideration of additional funding or to increase services 

to the Indian population, I just wanted to make sure that that was 

understood. 

Mr. MORAN. But there was money for Native American programs 

in ARRA. 

Mr. ROTH. Oh, yes, there was quite a bit of money for Indian programs, but nothing for urban Indian health programs. 

Mr. MORAN. I see. All right. 

Mr. ROTH. And there was quite a bit of money for IHS-funded 

programs, and when the Finance Committee realized that they left 

us out, the staffers had already released the numbers at that point 

of how much was going to be in, and they said that they would 

carve money out of the tribal appropriations for urban Indian 

health programs, and I said no, do not do that. I am not going to 

take from the tribal programs. 

Mr. MORAN. Yes, we do not want you to do that. But what we 

would like for you to do is to do an analysis of how this health reform plan, assuming it gets through the Senate this week, affects 

urban Indian health. 

Mr. ROTH. Yes. 

Mr. MORAN. And if there was a way through outreach or whatever to make it more effective, how you could do that. I think that 

would be very helpful for us to fully understand the maximum impact that this bill that we passed on Sunday might have, because 

I do think it could be a tremendous opportunity for many families 

to get some, really, to get 100 percent subsidy of insurance. 

Mr. ROTH. We will definitely do that, and Dr. Roubideaux has 

just committed to do a national needs assessment on urban Indians 

as well. 

Mr. MORAN. Thank you, Mr. Roth. 

Mr. ROTH. Thank you. 


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Mr. OLVER. May I comment on that? 

Mr. MORAN. Please. 

Mr. OLVER. In my subcommittee we did—well, it was not out of 

the subcommittee because ARRA is coming out of the general programs of the Appropriations Committee. But there was $.5 billion 

for Indian housing, and that has been largely committed, largely 

allocated, and obligated I think by this time. But what happens 

with that is for the 2011 budget, the recommendation out of OMB 

has been to reduce what had been the yearly allotment for that 

program because it takes a while, a period of time to use up what 

we did. Of course, what we intended to happen was that we would 

be providing a mechanism to do some of the replacement of the 

really serious housing deficiencies. These of course are only on the 

tribal areas, on the reservation areas. 

Mr. MORAN. If I could, Mr. Olver, Chairman Brings Plenty, did you get any of that $.5 billion for the Cheyenne River Reservation, 

for housing that was made available in the economic Recovery Act? 

Mr. OLVER. They should have gotten it tribe by tribe, whichever 

ones have housing authorities. Some of that—— 

Mr. MORAN. This is a large tribe. This is—— 

Mr. OLVER [continuing]. Was—do not apply for it. 

Mr. MORAN. Sir, do you want to add anything before leaving? 

Mr. BRINGS PLENTY. Sure. Of course there were requirements 

that came out or conditions that came out with the ARRA funding, 

and unfortunately if you were not a participant the year before, 

then you were not going to be eligible for that specific ARRA funding. So we were not—— 

Mr. OLVER. Well, why? There are 500 recognized tribes. Some do 

not have reservations of any significance, and some do not have 

housing authorities per se. 

Mr. MORAN. True, but this is the fourth-largest tribe on a reservation. 

Mr. OLVER. Well, when he says his tribal group, the combined 

bands are the fourth-largest tribe of the tribes. Several of those 

bands have housing authorities, and some of them must have gotten—I am going to have to ask questions tomorrow about that. 

Mr. MORAN. And it would be useful if you could get back to us. 

Mr. BRINGS PLENTY. Most definitely. Real quick, too, our relative 

here who had mentioned the emergency response. I am also the 

President of the large land-based tribes. Now, the thing is, what we 

are going to introduce in our next meeting is that we come up with 

basically the idea of what our relative has said on getting our own 

emergency response to be able to come out because this was completely, a really frustrating process for us, and we understand it is 

in place through the Stanford Act as far as how to request it and 

the mechanisms are set up, and I am worn down and emotionally 

exhausted from having to deal with all of that. But that is one 

thing that large land-based tribes are going to pursue. 

Mr. MORAN. When there is money available, it has got to go to 

the people most in need, and you are certainly one of them. I hope 

you will continue in communication with us. 

Mr. BRINGS PLENTY. I will. 

Mr. MORAN. And Mr. Olver is a real resource because he is on 

both committees. 


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Mr. Cole, did you have a final comment? Was there anything further that you wanted to add? 

Mr. ZORN. Very quickly. Jim Zorn, Great Lakes Indian Fish and 

Wildlife Commission. 

It is great to hear all the talk about health programs, and for 

natural resource-based tribes, it is important to remember the importance of the natives’ foods diets. And so when you help the 

healthy communities in the front end, you help save costs in the 

back end. And one small comment about Self-Determination Act 

funding, if you can get that to the tribes, they can use that as 

matching funds to leverage other funds like Fish and Wildlife Service and other agencies that are very good programs. And like with 

Circle of Flight, we have proven that for every dollar that you get 

to a tribal program like that, you can leverage up to three others. 

So there is efficiencies that way as well. So thank you. 

Mr. MORAN. Very important. Thank you for that. Sir. 

Mr. BEGAY. Just real quick, we are building a large transmission 

project for renewable energy as well, and also we are in the Energy 

Act to receive grants and other assistance. Thank you. 

Mr. MORAN. Good. Thank you. Yes. 

Mr. NOKA. Excuse me, I do not want to breech protocol. Randy 

Noka, Tribal Council from the Narragansett Tribe, and also Vice 

President for UCET that the President spoke about. 

There is always a desire to get additional monies, and my tribe 

is certainly in that vein and this is the protocol I speak of. If there 

is any opportunity, I know it was before the House Resource Committee, but at the—we certainly need that in Indian country. So 

any consideration by the committee members would be appreciated. 

Mr. COLE. We have a bill to that effect. Senator Dorgan has a 

bill to that effect, and Congressman Kildee has a bill, and it really 

needs to get done because there are billions of dollars worth of investments in Indian lands that are at risk, and this is a tribe that 

is a very old tribe. I mean, it is ridiculous that you are not considered recognized. So I am certainly doing everything on my end to 

help. 

Mr. MORAN. I totally agree with Mr. Cole and you. I am glad you 

made that point, and it will be the last word in this hearing. Thank 

you all very much. 


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THURSDAY, MARCH 25, 2010. 

ISSUES FROM THE FIELD: PUBLIC WITNESSES AND 

MEMBERS 

ORGANIZATIONS AND MEMBERS OF CONGRESS 

Mr. MORAN. Good morning to all of our witnesses and guests for 

our second public witness hearing of this week. This morning we 

are going to hear from Members of Congress and a number of witnesses representing a variety of environmental, recreational, memorial and arts organizations. I want to especially welcome those 

of you who have traveled long distances to be here today, so that 

does not include the Members as much as it is nice to hear from 

them. You did not have to make the effort that some folks had to 

make. But we look forward to everyone’s testimony. 

At Mr. Simpson’s urging, I try to cite someone that I know we 

find inspiration from mutually, and the great John Muir advocated 

passionately for the environment. He helped to inspire President 

Theodore Roosevelt’s conservation initiatives and encouraged Congress to found the extensive national park system. He reminds us 

that we should never underestimate the importance of public citizens advocating before their government when they see opportunities for improvement, and we think that perhaps this quote from 

John Muir sums up why many of you traveled here today, why this 

subcommittee believes your testimony is so valuable no matter 

what the subject. Here is the quote: ‘‘Everybody needs beauty as 

well as bread, places to play in and pray in, where nature may heal 

and give strength to body and soul.’’ 

Now for some important housekeeping items. We have to remind 

all witnesses that there is only 5 minutes total to deliver your 

statement and to answer questions. Invariably we get votes and all 

and there are other hearings going on so we found that we just 

have to be disciplined about that, so we are going to watch the 

timer closely. When the orange light comes on, you have 1 minute 

left, and should you not wrap up within that 1 minute, the red 

light comes on and that is when the time is expired. But everyone’s 

entire prepared statement will be put into the final hearing record. 

Mr. MORAN. Before we get started, Mr. Simpson, would you like 

to make any comments? 

Mr. SIMPSON. I am just meditating, and let’s go on. Thank you 

all for coming. 

Mr. MORAN. Our first witness is Representative Dean Heller 

from the great State of Nevada, and Mr. Heller, welcome. 


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THURSDAY, MARCH 25, 2010. 

NV–02 

WITNESS 

HON. DEAN HELLER 

Mr. HELLER. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. 

Well, I appreciate you allowing me a few minutes of your time 

to discuss some of these issues. These are critical issues for the 

State of Nevada, and if you are out West—and Mike and I were 

looking at that map up there at the amount of land that is owned 

by the Forest Service and the Federal Government through BLM, 

and I think the issues that we are going to discuss today are just 

absolutely critical for some of these western states, especially the 

State of Nevada. So Mr. Chairman, thank you for allowing me to 

come in front of you, and Ranking Member, I appreciate your time 

also. 

I mentioned taking a look at that map. Eighty-five percent of Nevada is controlled by the Federal Government, 85 percent. I do not 

see any yellow in Virginia there, Mr. Chairman. So it causes some 

very distinct differences and issues, and I want to bring a couple 

of those issues up. 

The health of our rangelands under federal jurisdiction greatly 

impacts the health of the local communities in Nevada. Nevada’s 

rangelands are in serious need of restoration and rehabilitation. 

As I am sure both of you are aware, the U.S. Fish and Wildlife 

Service recently announced that the sage grouse is a candidate for 

listing under the Endangered Species Act, and in some areas in 

Nevada we expect listing to occur within just the next few years. 

Sage grouse habitat consists of large portions of Nevada as well as 

portions across many of the western states. To say that an official 

listing of the sage grouse as an endangered species will have impact on the Western states is very much an understatement. 

Wildfires, invasive weeds and the overpopulation of non-native 

wild horses have led to severe damage of our range and wildlife 

populations. Some of the native wildlife such as sage grouse relies 

heavily on healthy sagebrush ecosystem to maintain healthy populations. So in light of these problems, I would like to voice my support for making rangeland restoration a greater priority. The two 

top causes for the decline of the sage grouse population in Nevada 

are wildfires and invasive weeds. While I continue to strongly support wildfire suppression as a priority, I also believe greater efforts 

should be made to curb the infestation of invasive weeds and elevate rangeland restoration to a higher priority. 

The second issue I would like to bring to the committee’s attention would be the removal of the geothermal royalties to local governments. As you know, the fiscal year 2010 Interior appropriations legislation contained a provision that stripped counties of the 

geothermal energy revenue sharing that was enacted as part of the 

energy policy back in 2005. This provision robs counties of their 25 

percent share, which they count on to provide services and infrastructure in part made necessary by geothermal development and 

production in their communities. We have one particular county, 

Churchill County, that their 25 percent was literally millions of 


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dollars to them. When that 25 percent was eliminated, it clearly 

had an impact on their ability to provide services. Some of our 

western communities have as little as 2 percent taxable land base. 

The geothermal revenue sharing provides a funding stream that allows the counties to fund services such as law enforcement, schools, 

health care and other critical infrastructure. 

I have introduced bipartisan legislation with Representative 

Thompson out of California to restore the counties’ share of these 

revenues. While I believe these revenues should be returned to the 

local governments this year, I am here to advocate for the removal 

of this provision for the next fiscal year. At a time when Nevada 

counties are struggling to address falling revenues, action by Congress suddenly cut a significant portion of their local county budgets. Nevada has been hit with high foreclosure rates. Counties in 

my district are grappling with increased unemployment. In fact, 

there was an article that came out today in one of the local papers 

saying that four out of 10 people in Las Vegas desire to move out. 

So Las Vegas is going to lose 40 percent, and if it comes to fruition 

that that is the case, you can understand the impact that that is 

going to have throughout the whole State of Nevada. Local governments in Nevada are struggling to provide essential services, and 

these revenues are critical, these geothermal revenues. 

Nevada is a geothermal state. I think we have more geothermal 

activity in the state of Nevada than any other state in the country, 

and clearly the revenues that come from this, which offset the fact 

that we have very small taxable lands in the State of Nevada, getting hit twice, not being able to have a larger tax base through the 

lands and also eliminating the geothermal tax revenue has really 

been rough on the local governments throughout the State of Nevada. So we are looking to eliminate that particular provision when 

it comes to geothermal revenues and looking for some real solid 

help from this committee on rangeland management. 

I guess my point is, if you take the sage grouse and you put them 

under the Endangered Species Act, it is going to have huge impacts 

on our farmers and ranchers throughout the State of Nevada, so 

rangeland restoration is a critical issue in making sure that we 

have good sage grouse habitat so that we can alleviate some of 

those problems that would come with listing that. 

[The statement of Dean Heller follows:] 


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Mr. MORAN. Thank you, Mr. Heller. With regard to sage grouse, 

we have had some discussion in this subcommittee and with the Interior Department. The population has been reduced from millions 

down to a few thousand, so they felt that they are going to have 

to do something but their decision was to put it on a low priority 

so basically it is on a list but it is at the bottom of a long list and 

there is no intended action in the near term and probably for years. 

It will be years before they get to it. What they are going to try 

to do is to figure out other ways to build the sage grouse population 

back up so there are no punitive measures applied that would have 

economic problems for the areas where the sage grouse is indigenously located. 

I know that you had a problem last year on the construction of 

a fire facility in Carson, Nevada. That was all taken care of. That 

was moved away, moved out of Carson City? 

Mr. HELLER. On that fire station? You know, I do not know what 

the current status of that is. I believe it went forward. I think it 

went forward and they are going to—— 

Mr. MORAN. In Carson City? 

Mr. HELLER. In Carson City. 

Mr. MORAN. I thought—because we were informed that BLM and 

Forest Service decided the facility would be built someplace else 

out of town. 

Mr. HELLER. I knew that there was a variety of locations that 

they were considering for this particular fire station but I have not 

been told yet what that location is going to be. 

Mr. MORAN. Well, what was indicated to us was that they were 

trying to reach a decision that you would find acceptable. 

Mr. HELLER. Good, and I look forward to working with them. 

Mr. MORAN. Our staff will inform you as to what we—— 

Mr. HELLER. That is good. 

Mr. MORAN. I think it will show a responsiveness on the BLM/ 

Forest Service part. 

And lastly, Senator Reid did add that provision on the revenue 

sharing from geothermal revenue onto the Senate-passed tax extended package. 

Mr. HELLER. That is my understanding also. 

Mr. MORAN. But the state did not lose revenue, right? Is the 

issue not that the state gets half the revenue instead of splitting 

it with the counties? So the state could choose to share it with the 

counties and there would not be any problem. 

Mr. HELLER. Well, right now the issue that we have in the State 

of Nevada, it is in dire condition as most states are right now, very, 

very difficult for them. They just got out of a special session. I 

think they had to cut another billion dollars out of their budget and 

they are—— 

Mr. MORAN. They are telling you they want to just keep all the 

money. Okay. So it is not quite so much the Federal Government 

as the fact that the state wants to keep all of it, but I understand 

what happened in terms of the accounting for the energy—— 

Mr. HELLER. I do support Senator Reid’s amendment to the extenders bill and putting that provision back in. 

Mr. MORAN. Mr. Simpson. 


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Mr. SIMPSON. Thanks for your testimony. I could not have said 

it better. What affects Idaho is the same thing that affects Nevada. 

Have you guys done any of the cooperative conservation agreements with BLM on sage grouse habitat there? Has your state been 

doing that, or regions of your state? 

Mr. HELLER. We have, and we will continue to work with them. 

You know, the point of my testimony, as you are well aware, is that 

we continue to burn. When I was on the Resource Committee, we 

burn about the State of Rhode Island every year, and that is a lot 

of sage grouse habitat, and what grows back is not sagebrush, it 

is the cheek grass. And so yes, there are a lot of agreements and 

working with cooperative agreements with the Federal Government 

trying to figure out how to keep this cheek grass—maybe working 

with the cattle ranchers and the sheep ranchers in the area so that 

we can eliminate this cheek grass so we can get the sage to grow 

back, but it is these wildfires that are causing the concerns and the 

problems. 

Mr. SIMPSON. And it is important to point out when we did talk 

to BLM and the Fish and Wildlife Service that contrary to some 

people’s popular belief, it is not grazing that causes the decrease 

in the sage grouse habitat, it is, as you mentioned, invasive species 

and the wildfires that are causing the decrease in the habitat. 

Mr. HELLER. Correct. 

Mr. MORAN. Thank you, Mr. Heller. 

Mr. HELLER. Thank you very much. 

[The following is written testimony submitted by Congressman 

Silvestre Reyes:] 


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Mr. MORAN. Our next witness will be Gordon Felt, who is the 

president of Families of Flight 93. Mr. Felt. 

THURSDAY, MARCH 25, 2010. 

FAMILIES OF FLIGHT 93 

WITNESS 

GORDON FELT 

Mr. FELT. Chairman Moran, Ranking Member Simpson, my 

name is Gordon Felt and I am the president of the Families of 

Flight 93. The Families is a nonprofit organization dedicated to 

honoring our loved ones’ actions including those of my brother, Edward Porter Felt, that prevented an attack on our Nation’s capital 

at the cost of their lives. 

Attending this hearing with me today are two family members, 

our vice president, Patrick White, and our treasurer, Deborah 

Borza. Deborah’s daughter, Deora Bodley, and Patrick’s cousin, 

Louis J. Nacke II, were two other heroes onboard Flight 93. 

I appreciate the honor to appear before you today to provide the 

subcommittee with a progress report on the Flight 93 National Memorial as well as to request the subcommittee’s continued support 

in providing funding for the Memorial. However, before I begin, I 

want to voice my sincere appreciation to former Chairman Dicks 

for all he has done on behalf of the families of Flight 93 and our 

memorial. 

To keep the promise that this Nation and Congress made to appropriately honor the heroes’ memories, it is critical that the first 

phase of the Flight 93 National Memorial be dedicated by the 10th 

anniversary of September 11th. Almost immediately following the 

crash of Flight 93, local officials and volunteers created a temporary memorial on a hilltop overlooking the crash site. Since September 11, 2001, more than 1 million visitors have come to this 

temporary memorial driven by a desire to ensure the valiant efforts 

of the passengers and crew of Flight 93 were never forgotten. 

Senator Arlen Specter and the late Congressman John Murtha 

introduced legislation establishing the Flight 93 National Memorial. In 2002, Congress passed and the President signed the Flight 

93 National Memorial Act which established the creation of the 

Flight 93 National Memorial. The memorial will serve to honor the 

courage and enduring sacrifice of the 40 heroes of Flight 93. It will 

be a place for individuals to learn about the events of September 

11th and to find meaning and inspiration from their experience. 

The Flight 93 National Memorial’s general management plan 

proposes to construct a memorial, visitors center, roads, parking facilities and associated infrastructure to accommodate approximately 250,000 annual visitors. The effort is expected to create 

nearly 1,200 new jobs in Somerset County, Pennsylvania, and the 

surrounding region including 670 positions in construction and related fields over a 4-year period. The balance would be permanent 

employment resulting from increased tourism and related businesses. The boundaries of the Memorial are approximately 2,200 


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acres including 1,000 acres that will be privately held but protected 

though easements or partnership agreements. 

The design for the Memorial was announced on September 9, 

2005, amid overwhelming support from the families of Flight 93 

and our partner organizations including the Flight 93 Memorial 

Task Force, the Flight 93 Federal Advisory Commission, the National Park Service and the National Park Foundation. A solemn 

groundbreaking ceremony was held on November 7, 2009, and a 

construction contract for phase 1 was awarded, and on February 1, 

2010, a construction motion-to-proceed order was issued by the National Park Service. 

The budget estimate for the design and construction of the Me- morial’s first phase is $58.4 million. A cost estimate was prepared 

to reflect 2010 construction dollars anticipated to be the midpoint 

of construction. The budget, phasing plan and strategy to deal with 

increased costs of construction were presented to the National Park 

Service development advisory board in March 2008 and were approved. 

Securing the funds for the design and construction of the Memorial is a public-private partnership between the Federal Government, the Commonwealth of Pennsylvania and the American people. Under the partnership agreement, the Federal Government is 

responsible for providing $18.4 million, and the Commonwealth of 

Pennsylvania would provide $10 million and private donors would 

be responsible for raising $30 million. More than 57,000 donors 

have raised over $17 million for the Memorial, and we are on target to reach our $30 million goal. The Commonwealth of Pennsylvania has exceeded its original commitment of $10 million, providing approximately $18.5 million to the project. Since fiscal year 

2005, Congress has appropriated $10.371 million toward the design 

and construction of the Memorial from the Department of the Interior and Department of Transportation funding bills. The bipartisan support by the House and Senate to ensure the necessary 

funds are available to complete the Memorial’s first phase by the 

10th anniversary of September 11th is truly appreciated. 

For 2011, the Families of Flight 93 have requested $3 million in 

funding from Interior, Environment, and Related Agencies bill for 

the Memorial’s phase 1–B water and sewage infrastructure as provided by the project’s general management plan. I ask you and 

your committee for their individual attention and collective support 

for this funding request. 

Before I conclude my remarks, I would like to bring to the subcommittee’s attention the Families of Flight 93’s concern regarding 

the recently enacted Republican Conference rule change on earmarks and its impact on our ability to request federal funding for 

the Memorial’s completion. The Memorial is a congressionally authorized project whose federal funding in the past has been provided through congressionally directed spending, primarily sponsored by Congressman Bill Shuster. With Congressman Shuster 

now unable to request funding for the Memorial, valid questions 

have been raised about whether the Federal Government’s financial commitment to the Memorial will be realized. Mr. Chairman, 

the Families of Flight 93 have submitted the appropriations application to your office. We respectfully request that you personally 


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support our efforts this year to ensure the needed funds are secured. Thank you. 

[The statement of Gordon Felt follows:] 


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Mr. MORAN. Well, thank you very much. It was very good testimony, but the last paragraph was the more important. I was trying 

to figure out what it was that you particularly wanted. I can see 

that. It is an earmark. I happen to agree with you in terms of earmarks. I think they are a proper reflection of Congressional intent 

individually and collectively, and they served our country for better 

than 200 years they have been in effect. But perhaps we would like 

to hear from Mr. Simpson at this point. 

Mr. SIMPSON. I agree with you. 

Mr. MORAN. Okay. 

Mr. FELT. Mr. Chair, if I may, we look at the Memorial as a legislated memorial. I mean, it was enacted. So we like to look at the 

funding not necessarily as an earmark. 

Mr. SIMPSON. You are right. It ought to be a program. 

Mr. FELT. Exactly. 

Mr. SIMPSON. And I think the committee will be very supportive 

of it, is my guess. 

Mr. FELT. Well, we certainly appreciate your support. 

Mr. MORAN. The only problem—and I agree with Mr. Simpson, 

but the issue is that normally it needs an authorization, and we 

are going to have to figure out how to do this. I also would like to 

build it into the budget but there is a reason why Mr. Shuster had 

to specifically designate it each time. So we are going to have to 

work with the staff and do the best we can. I do not think there 

is much disagreement over the objective but the process of getting 

there we will just have to try to figure out. 

Mr. SIMPSON. Also, Mr. Chairman, the Administration has said 

that if—this is their attack on earmarks. Of course, no Administration likes earmarks. They do not like Congress telling them how to 

spend money. But they have said that if something starts as an 

earmark, then they will not request it in their budget next year, 

you are going to have to continue it on by earmarks, so they do not 

request those kind of things that were started with earmarks, 

which is a problem. But that does not mean that this committee 

cannot direct what things are funded and are not funded whether 

you want to call them earmarks or anything else. I agree with your 

testimony. We need to get this done. 

Mr. MORAN. It is the right thing to do. It is also 1,200 jobs in 

an area that is desperately in need of jobs, and there are some sustainable jobs. I know people will be working at the Memorial. So 

we get what you are telling us, both Mr. Simpson and I, and we 

are just going to have to work with the staff to see what we can 

do. 

Mr. FELT. Well, we greatly appreciate your leadership and your 

continued support. Thank you. 

Mr. SIMPSON. Thank you. 

Mr. MORAN. The next witness will be Gary Werner, who is the 

executive director of the Partnership for the National Trails System. 


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THURSDAY, MARCH 25, 2010. 

PARTNERSHIP FOR NATIONAL TRAILS SYSTEM 

WITNESS 

GARY WERNER 

Mr. WERNER. Good morning, Mr. Chairman and Mr. Simpson. I 

thank you for the opportunity to testify this morning. I am Gary 

Werner, here from Wisconsin representing the 30 nonprofit organizations with over 75,000 members throughout the country who are 

your partners in helping to sustain the 19 national historic trails 

and 11 national scenic trails that Congress has authorized to thank 

you for the support that you have given over the last decade or so 

of consistent funding for the trails. As you know, these 30 national 

scenic and historic trails span more than 50,000 miles through 49 

of the 50 states. I am happy to say and remind you that our commitment as true partners remains firm. 

In 2009, we inspired and organized over 907,000 hours of volun- teer labor contributed by citizens valued at about $18.6 million and 

contributed another $11.9 million of direct financial assistance, 

about $30.5 million to these trails. Congress, you appropriated in 

2010 about $29 million to the National Park Service, the Forest 

Service and the Bureau of Land Management to sustain the trails. 

We continue to be your good partners. 

What I do want to say, however, is that there is a lot of work 

yet to do. There are miles to build on these trails. There are 

invasive species to remove. There are sites to interpret, so we are 

asking you to increase funding to the three agencies in 2011, specifically about $16.5 million to the National Park Service for the 23 

trails that it administers, about $8 million to the Bureau of Land 

Management for the three trails it administers and the 10 trails 

that it manages significant portions of, and about $11.3 million to 

the Forest Service for six trails that it administers and the 16 

trails that it manages in part throughout the country. 

We are also asking you to appropriate $1.5 million of funding for 

a special youth stewardship or internship development program 

which would fund 50 student interns to work with national scenic, 

historic and recreation trail organizations throughout the country 

to help get more young people engaged and involved with the 

trails. 

There are also significant gaps in most of the scenic trails and 

there are many important sites on the historic trails yet to be protected, so we enthusiastically support the Administration’s goal of 

ultimately getting to the full $900 million annual funding authorized for the Land and Water Conservation Fund and to that end 

we ask you to appropriate $425 million in 2011 for federal program 

projects, $175 million to the states for the various projects that 

they can do and $150 million to the companion Forest Legacy program, and then specifically from the federal portion of land and 

water, to appropriate to the National Park Service $13.9 million for 

projects along the Ice Age, North Country and Appalachian national scenic trails, $5.3 million to the Bureau of Land Management for projects along the Oregon Trail in Idaho and in Oregon, 

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tinental Divide and Pacific Northwest national scenic trails and to 

the Forest Service $41.7 million for projects along the Florida, Pacific Crest national scenic trails, Old Spanish National Historic 

Trail, Appalachian Trail and the North Country Trail, and also 

$3.375 million from the Forest Legacy Program for Continental Divide in New Mexico, and parenthetically, as you know, I guess 

those are all considered earmarks, but again, like the previous, 

these are federal programs and this is the way you direct the 

money to be spent. 

Mr. SIMPSON. No earmarks, just congressionally directed spending. 

Mr. WERNER. Great. That is what we want. 

Secondly, last year at our request you directed the Bureau of 

Land Management to provide a sub-activity account for trails in 

the National Landscape Conservation System. We understand that 

the Office of Management and Budget told the Bureau not to follow 

your direction. This leaves the Bureau at a significant disadvantage in working with the Park Service and the Forest Service on 

these trails that cross various jurisdictional boundaries. So we ask 

you to once again direct the Bureau to provide a sub-activity account for the national scenic and historic trails and the wild and 

scenic rivers in their National Landscape Conservation System to 

be commensurate with the wilderness areas and the monuments. 

Lastly, the Challenge Cost Share programs were eliminated for 

the Park Service, the Bureau of Land Management and Fish and 

Wildlife Service. These are the programs that specifically are 

meant to foster the kind of volunteerism that I reported on and we 

ask you to please reinstate those programs. I think they are a total 

of $19 million across the three agencies and specifically we would 

ask for $4.5 million for the Park Service, and as you have in the 

past 15 years, direct the Park Service to provide one-third of that 

for the national trail system. 

I thank you for the opportunity to testify. 

[The statement of Gary Werner follows:] 


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Mr. MORAN. You have got a lot to ask there. 

Mr. WERNER. Yes, I know. 

Mr. MORAN. But we are very sympathetic. Let me just ask one 

thing. When you clear these trails, one of the problems is that the 

first thing to grow back is poison ivy. I mean, if an area is not disturbed you do not get the poison ivy, but as soon as you disturb 

it you get the poison ivy and some trails just get overwhelmed with 

those poison ivy. Have you figured out how to—I mean, it sounds 

like a strange thing but it does discourage people if they think that 

the trail is just full of poison ivy. Have you thought about how you 

are going to address that? 

Mr. WERNER. Actually, yes, and it is not just poison ivy. I mean, 

in some areas of the country, it is poison ivy, it is poison oak. In 

the Midwest where I am from, we have wild parsnip, which have 

an equally bad effect. And we are actively working to control those 

invasive and noxious species like that, but again, one of the reasons we are asking for more money is, we need more assistance to 

do that. We need to recruit more volunteers, and there is no substitute for actually going out and doing something on the ground. 

Mr. MORAN. We are very sympathetic. We like trails. 

Mr. WERNER. Thank you. 

Mr. MORAN. They are an opportunity. They do not do any damage to the environment and they are an opportunity for people to 

enjoy that environment. The more trails, the better, as far as I am 

concerned, so we will do what we can. 

Mr. WERNER. And they are a tremendous opportunity to get 

young people out and involved. 

Mr. MORAN. In physical exercise. 

Mr. WERNER. This is a report that we put together of a lot of the 

kinds of projects that we have underway along the trails. 

Mr. MORAN. Now, where did you say you were going to put the 

Mike Simpson Memorial Trail in Idaho? 

Mr. SIMPSON. Blackwood. 

Mr. WERNER. There are several that go through Idaho. 

Mr. MORAN. Mr. Hinchey. 

Mr. HINCHEY. Well, thanks very much, and sorry I did not get 

here for the beginning of your statement but I very much appreciate what you are doing. I understand how important it is, and I 

also understand how a lot of these issues have not been paid appropriate attention to for a long time and so there are a lot of things 

that are pending there. One of the things that we are having in 

New York, just curiously, is a lot of closing of state parks and there 

are a lot of state parks in New York. The issues there are that the 

Federal Government has provided a substantial amount of money 

for those parks and we are trying to keep them open on a number 

of bases including the contribution of the Federal Government to 

those state parks. So I just appreciate what you are doing and I 

understand how important it is, and I am sure that this committee 

will do everything it can to strengthen things up. 

Mr. WERNER. Thank you. 

Mr. SIMPSON. Just one quick question. 

Mr. MORAN. Sure. 

Mr. SIMPSON. The recommendation that they put a separate line 

item for trails, was that in report language? 


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Mr. WERNER. Yes. If you can put it into bill language, I understand it makes it much stronger. 

Mr. SIMPSON. Sometimes that is a better way to get your point 

across. 

Mr. WERNER. And I just need to emphasize what you all have 

mentioned. It has been the efforts of your committee in adding 

money to what the agencies have requested over the years that has 

enabled us to increase the work that we are doing for the trails so 

we cannot thank you enough for that and encourage you to keep 

doing it. Thank you. 

Mr. MORAN. Thank you very much, Mr. Werner. 

Mr. Arthur Cerullo, who is the speaker for the American Lung 

Association Nationwide Assembly. 

THURSDAY, MARCH 25, 2010. 

AMERICAN LUNG ASSOCIATION NATIONWIDE 

ASSEMBLY 

WITNESS 

ARTHUR CERULLO 

Mr. CERULLO. Chairman Moran, Ranking Member Simpson, Mr. 

Hinchey, I am Arthur Cerullo, the speaker of the American Lung 

Association Nationwide Assembly. I am honored to testify in support of the Environmental Protection Agency’s program to improve 

the Nation’s air. I have been a volunteer for the American Lung 

Association for more than 20 years. I am an attorney in private 

practice in Portland, Maine, and prior to that I was a chemical engineer for a number of years. 

The American Lung Association was founded in 1904 to fight tuberculosis and today our mission is to save lives by improving lung 

health and preventing lung disease. We welcome the increases in 

the President’s budget for EPA for Healthier Outdoor Air to $811.3 

million and for Healthier Indoor Air to $47.1 million. Cleaner, 

healthier air will protect the public and especially those with lung 

disease from air pollution. As a former engineer, I know that aggressive implementation and enforcement of the Clean Air Act will 

drive innovation and improve our Nation’s environmental performance while at the same time grow the economy. We urge this committee to ensure that the Clean Air Act’s promise of clean, healthy 

air for all Americans is kept. 

I am from Maine, and if you have ever visited our beautiful 

state, you know why we treasure the outdoors: majestic mountains, 

crystal lakes, bracing coastal waters. Our summers are short, however, and we hate to miss a single chance to be outdoors but too 

often we miss our clear blue sky because of smog. Acadia National 

Park, one of the most beautiful parks in the country, is plagued by 

poor air quality much of the summer. Too often, smog from both 

local and distant sources obscures the view of the first light of day 

in the United States at the top of Cadillac Mountain. Unhealthy, 

polluted air robs of us the ability to enjoy the outdoors for fear of 

wheezing, an asthma attack or even death. 


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In my written statement, I detail the magnitude of lung disease 

in the United States, the enormity of the Nation’s air pollution 

problem and delineate specific support for sections of EPA’s budget. 

In brief, more than 35 million Americans suffer from chronic lung 

disease and air pollution exacerbates nearly all lung diseases. The 

Clean Air Act has proven to be a powerful tool to improve the quality of our Nation’s air. Since 1990, when Congress strengthened the 

Clean Air Act, air pollution has been cut significantly. However, 

much remains to be done. Millions of Americans live in counties 

that have dangerously unhealthy air. 

I will briefly highlight some of the key programs that we support. 

First, the health-based National Ambient Air Quality Standards 

are the cornerstone of the Clean Air Act. They set the health goals 

and drive the pollution cleanup. We applaud EPA’s renewed commitment and urge the committee to support EPA’s work to complete the reviews of these standards in a timely manner based in 

the science and in compliance with the law. 

Second, we strongly support EPA’s clean air research programs 

that help provide the sound science to inform these decisions. 

Third, EPA must also complete major rulemaking to reduce pollution. EPA must complete the rules to clean up power plants, 

known as the Clean Air Interstate Rule and Utility Maximum 

Achievable Control Technology Rule to reduce hazardous air pollution. 

Fourth, we support EPA’s efforts to further reduce tailpipe emissions from cars and trucks known as tier 3. These rules are needed 

to mitigate any adverse air quality impacts that may result from 

increased use of renewable fuels and could include tighter particulate and nitrogen oxide standards as well as lower sulfur gasoline 

to enable advanced control pollution technology. 

Fifth, we strongly support increased funding for those on the 

front lines in the efforts to improve air quality, our state and local 

air agencies. We would like to highlight the President’s request for a $15 million increase for air pollution monitoring, which will help improve 

the understanding of the levels and sources of pollution in our communities. Funding monitors must be a high priority for the committee. 

Finally, cleaning up the existing fleet of diesel vehicles is vital. 

Diesel pollution kills. Research shows increased health risks associated with living or working in close proximity to busy roadways. 

Children are especially vulnerable. We urge the committee to increase the diesel retrofit funding to at least $100 million. 

Further, we thank the committee for its support of the Healthier 

Indoor Air program at EPA. EPA has provided great leadership in 

addressing radon, the second leading cause of lung cancer. We also 

are pleased to support increased funding for the Healthy Schools 

Initiative. The Indoor Air program raises awareness about asthma 

and reduce children’s exposure to indoor asthma triggers. The 

American Lung Association is proud to partner with EPA in this 

important work. 

Mr. Chairman, thank you for the opportunity to present the recommendations of the American Lung Association. Every day we are 

fighting for air, clean, healthy air for all Americans to breathe. Our 


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robust Environmental Protection Agency air pollution program is 

vital to that success and our success. 

[The statement of Arthur Cerullo follows:] 


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Mr. MORAN. Good for you. Good, solid testimony. You got it in, 

in the 5 minutes. Unless there are some critical questions that are 

asked, we probably have to move along, but I do not want to preclude you. 

Mr. HINCHEY. Just briefly. 

Mr. MORAN. Go ahead. 

Mr. HINCHEY. I just want to express, as the chairman did, my 

appreciation of what you said and how important it is. I mean, 

there is a whole lung situation that really needs to be dealt with 

more and more effectively, and as time goes on, it is getting worse 

and worse because of all the other activities going on. 

I wonder if there has been any focus of attention on this frac 

drilling circumstance and the potential for contaminating air quality in that regard? 

Mr. CERULLO. I cannot say offhand I have any information about 

that but certainly we will get back to you in the next day or two. 

I will ask some of our experts back at the office. I mean, our neck 

of the woods, radon is the real problem for us and because we are 

at the end of the tailpipe where we are from, these changes are 

what we need to implement as soon as possible. But I will get back 

to you on that issue. Anything else? 

Mr. MORAN. No. Thank you very much for your testimony. 

Mike Garner and Bradley ‘‘Butch’’ Lambert. Mr. Garner, you are 

the chief of the Abandoned Mine Land Section of the Maryland Bureau of Mines, and Deputy Director, Virginia Department of Mines 

and Minerals and Energy is Mr. Lambert. And you are here on behalf of Interstate Mining Compact Commission, so please proceed. 

THURSDAY, MARCH 25, 2010. 

INTERSTATE MINING COMPACT COMMISSION 

WITNESSES 

MIKE GARNER 

BRADLEY LAMBERT 

Mr. LAMBERT. Good morning, Mr. Chairman and members. 

Thank you for this opportunity to appear before you this morning. 

Again, my name is Butch Lambert. I am the deputy director for the 

Virginia Department of Mines, Minerals and Energy. I am appearing today on behalf of the Interstate Mining Compact Commission 

to present the views of the Compact member states concerning the 

fiscal year 2011 budget request of the Office of Surface Mining. 

In its proposed budget, OSM is requesting $60.3 million to fund 

Title V grants to states and Indian tribes for the implementation 

of the regulatory programs which will be a reduction of $11 million, 

or 15 percent for the fiscal year 2011 enacted level. Last year, Congress appropriated an additional $5.8 million to increase for state 

Title V grants over the fiscal year 2009 enacted level for a total of 

$71.3 million. For the first time in many years, the amount appropriated for these regulatory grants aligned with the demonstrated 

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versed course and essentially unraveled and undermined the 

progress made by Congress in supporting state programs. This 

comes at precisely the wrong time. The states are in the process 

of putting the recent improvements in funding to work in the programs for the filling of vacant positions and the purchase of muchneeded equipment. We trust the recent increases approved by Congress will remain the new base on which we build our programs 

into the future. This is particularly important as the state agencies 

work hard to convince our state legislators and our budget officers 

to support the regulatory programs through matching state funds, 

particularly given the difficult fiscal climate the states are facing. 

In this regard, it should be kept in mind that a 15 percent cut 

in the federal funding translates to a 30 percent cut for the overall 

program funding for many states since these states can only match 

what they receive in federal money. For instance, in Virginia, 

should OSM’s reductions prevail, we would be looking at a $1.2 

million cut to our state program. OSM’s solution to drastic cuts to 

state regulatory programs comes in the way of an unrealistic assumption that the states can simply increase user fees in an effort 

to reduce the level of federal funding required to regulate and to 

an extent subsidize the coal industry. OSM’s proposal is completely 

out of touch the realities associated with establishing or enhancing 

user fees. IMCC’s recent polling of its member states confirmed it 

would be difficult, it not impossible, for most states to accomplish 

this feat, let alone in less than 1 year. We strongly urge the subcommittee to reject this approach and approve not less than $71 

million for the state in Title V regulatory grants. 

At this time I will ask that my colleague, Mike Garner, talk 

about the Title IV funding. 

Mr. MORAN. Mr. Garner. 

Mr. GARNER. Thank you, Mr. Chairman, for allowing me to testify. I am here representing the 30 state and tribal members of the 

National Association of Abandoned Mine Land Programs that operate abandoned mine land programs authorized under Title IV 

SMCRA. Based on SMCRA fee collections, the fiscal year 2011 

mandatory appropriation for state and tribal AML grants should be 

$413.2 million. Instead, the Office of Surface Mining is only budgeted $259.5 million. This would eliminate funding to states and 

tribes that have been successful and able to certify completion of 

their highest-priority coal reclamation sites. 

From the beginning of SMCRA in 1977 to the latest amendments 

in 2006, Congress has promised that at least half of the money generated from fees collected within state or tribal boundaries, referred to as state share, would be returned for the uses described 

in the Act. For certified states, the state share funds can be used 

for environmental stewardship, cleaning up abandoned coal and 

hardrock mines, sustainable development, infrastructure improvements and alternative energy projects all stimulating the economy, 

protecting public health and safety, creating green jobs and improving the environment, many of the goals described in the American 

Recovery and Reinvestment Act. Breaking the promise of state 

share funding will upset 10 years of negotiation that resulted in 

the balance and compromise achieved in the 2006 amendments. We 


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therefore respectfully ask the committee to continue funding for 

certified states. 

The proposed budget would also eliminate $20 million for federal 

AML emergency program. Section 410 of the emergency powers 

was unchanged in the 2006 amendments and requires OSM to fund 

the emergency AML program, and likewise, the Act does not allow 

states and tribes to fund the emergency program. Instead, it requires strict compliance with the non-emergency funding priorities. 

OSM has not developed legislation, regulations, procedures, directives nor has OSM received a solicitor’s opinion regarding the legality of this transfer. For these reasons and many others, we urge 

the committee to restore the $20 million for the AML emergency 

program. Thank you, sir. 

[The information follows:] 


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Mr. MORAN. Thank you. Do you have anything to say, Mr. Simpson? 

Mr. SIMPSON. No. We probably need to go on because you are 

running us behind. 

Mr. HINCHEY. I think it is very clear. I appreciate it. Thank you. 

Mr. MORAN. The mines that generated the revenue are not the 

ones necessarily that pay the fee, are they? I mean, excuse me, the 

mines that generated the abandoned mine situation are not the 

ones that pay the fee. There is a disconnect there. 

Mr. LAMBERT. Correct. 

Mr. MORAN. Thank you. 

Maria Hinojosa and Gretchen Long, who are the commissioners 

of the National Parks Century Commission, nice to have you with 

us. 

Mr. MORAN. Thank you. 

THURSDAY, MARCH 25, 2010. 

NATIONAL PARKS SECOND CENTURY COMMISSION 

WITNESSES 

MARIA HINOJOSA 

GRETCHEN LONG 

Ms. HINOJOSA. Chairman, Ranking Member and Representative, 

it is good to be here. My name is Maria Hinojosa. Thank you for 

allowing Gretchen Long and myself to represent the National 

Parks Second Century Commission, an independent commission 

that last fall released our 21st century vision for our treasured national parks. Now, when I was first asked to be on this commission, 

I thought, why me? You know, I went to my first park, Yosemite, 

when I was about 26 years old. But then I thought wait a second, 

I am an American, I am an immigrant, I am a journalist, I am a 

mom. I know what these parks mean when people see this as a 

beacon, and serving on the Commission, we all understood that the 

parks should not only survive, they need to thrive. 

You all know that going to a national park can change you. It 

strengthens education. It reduces the impact of climate change. It 

provides meaningful opportunities for our young people. When you 

leave a park, when you leave a site, whether it is Yosemite or the 

Statue of Liberty or the African burial ground, you as an American 

are changed. 

But despite the tremendous power of the parks, our commission 

found that current funding is fundamentally inadequate. Our financial commitment to the parks matches neither their importance 

to society nor the enormous franchise they have with the American 

people. Our Commission came to greatly admire the bipartisan 

commitment that Congress and two Presidents have shown over 

the last 3 years to attack the operations funding shortfall of the national park system and we believe that adequate operations funding to be fundamental to the parks’ success for the future. So we 

are hoping that the subcommittee will do as much as it can to continue the effort to increase funding for the National Park Service 


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by at least $100 million over fixed cost inflation each year until the 

shortfall is eliminated. I see this as a park stimulus myself. 

We know that in order to keep the parks thriving, we have to 

engage non-traditional park visitors and we have to provide strong 

educational programming. It is not enough to just make people feel 

equally at home in the parks, we really have to put our efforts out 

there to bring the parks up to our modern society. We know that 

if people do not visit these parks, if they do not feel committed to 

the parks, connected to the parks, they will not thrive. So we would 

like to see you spend a tremendous amount of money, or effort, 

rather, to keep those $100 million coming to the parks, and let me 

just say that is a wonderful thing to have a park there but we do 

not want the tourists to say well, that was a really nice park but 

gee, it needed to be spruced up and why was that museum exhibit 

so retro. We can do better than that. 

[The statement of Maria Hinojosa follows:] 


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Mr. MORAN. Well, that is pretty impressive testimony there, Ms. 

Hinojosa. It is nice to have your professional communicative ability. 

Ms. LONG. Maria has basically said all that I would say but perhaps I will add a few more points. I am Gretchen Long. I am also 

a member of the Second Century Commission, which was a wonderful experience under the leadership of Senator Howard Baker 

and Senator Bennett Johnston; 25 people from various parts of the 

geography and expertise and knowledge came together and all left 

with a profound sense that our national parks are indeed the best 

idea America has ever had. They are our treasured landscapes. 

They are our identity as Americans, as Flight 93 Memorial just 

was discussed and indicated, and they are our economic engines for 

the surrounding communities. 

The Second Century looked at what it hopes will be the role of 

the parks in the next century but it was a visionary yet practical 

outlook, particularly making recommendations that will position 

the parks by its 100th anniversary in 2016. The major recommendations of that Commission in my judgment were to increase the educational aspects of the National Park Service, to 

reach out far more effectively to all Americans and engage them, 

and thirdly, to realize that national parks alone cannot protect natural resources. They are part of larger areas and must be part of 

a larger landscape level conservation effort and in fact play, as national parks can uniquely do, the leadership and convening role in 

a larger agenda of landscape preservation. 

These are all good recommendations but over and above the existing needs of the Park Service, they like every other worthy request that has been made here today, we think ours of course is 

most worthy. They need to receive more funds. Your subcommittee 

has been particularly effective since 2008 in decreasing the shortfall in operating funds from $800 million to $580 million, and that 

is great but it is still a shortfall, and it is a shortfall within the 

context that there is still $9 billion in maintenance backlog and $2 

million in unacquired inholdings requirements worthy all to be purchased. 

So the Park Service is actually woefully underfunded for the high 

regard it holds with the American people. Particularly troubling is 

this year’s operating budget, and we would ask, as Maria did, that 

you continue to work to try to realize full increase of $100 million 

plus fixed costs. It is a very difficult year. We understand that. If 

you can come up with something better than it is now, even if not 

$100 million, it would make a tremendous difference for the Park 

Service not to really be behind the curve in terms of its fixed costs. 

Secondly, we support fully the Land and Water Conservation 

Fund, and thirdly, and perhaps interestingly for your future consideration, and lastly, the Commission recommended that as the 

parks were set up in perpetuity, so should they have permanent 

and sustainable funding and there is a recommendation, which I 

believe will be followed through in the next couple of years, to develop an endowment with a national campaign looking for philanthropic and government support dollars. That is a new recommendation and I think you will see it coming before you in the 

next period of time. 

Thank you very much for listening to us. 


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Mr. MORAN. Thank you, Ms. Long. Ms. Hinojosa, thank you very 

much. You neglected to mention all the benefit that the restoration 

of Indian Creek has meant to Caldwell, Idaho. 

Ms. LONG. I did, but you have that in your written testimony. 

When I looked at that testimony, I did wonder if that would be the 

pivotal point. 

Mr. MORAN. Nice going. I was thinking for Mr. Simpson, not as 

much for me. 

Mr. SIMPSON. I have been there. 

Mr. MORAN. I am sure you have. 

Thank you. Very good testimony. We appreciate it. Thank you. 

We are going to now hear from Mr. Calvelli, Ms. Moffatt, and 

then we are going to put in Congressman Brad Sherman, who has 

just arrived to join us. Mr. Calvelli. Mr. Calvelli is the executive 

vice president of the Wildlife Conservation Society. 

THURSDAY, MARCH 25, 2010. 

WILDLIFE CONSERVATION SOCIETY 

WITNESS 

JOHN CALVELLI 

Mr. CALVELLI. Good morning, and I am also a recovering Hill 

staffer. I was on Capitol Hill for 12 years as Congressman Elliot 

Engel’s chief of staff, so it is a pleasure to be back here in the Rayburn Building. 

In its 114-year history, the Wildlife Conservation Society has 

maintained a constant commitment to save wildlife and wild places 

around the world. Our conservation operations have expanded to 

65 countries today and our curatorial science in five living institutions in New York City help make WCS one of the world’s most 

comprehensive conservation organizations. We currently manage 

more than 200 million acres of land with a commitment to protect 

25 percent of the earth’s biodiversity. We also have an annual economic impact of $414 million, employing more than 4,000 staff 

globally including 200 PhDs and welcoming nearly 4 million visitors to our urban wildlife parks each year. 

I request that my previously submitted written testimony, which 

unfortunately did not have that great headline that the previous 

people spoke of, detailing WCS’s conservation investments in fiscal 

year 2011 Interior appropriations recommendations be entered into 

the official record. 

This morning I will describe the invaluable contribution of the 

U.S. government to both domestic and international conservation, 

explain the need for greater investment and make recommendations to further strengthen U.S. government leadership and environmental stewardship and conservation. 

Having been born in the south Bronx, I have been all too familiar 

with busy streets and concrete. Amidst this, the 265-acre Bronx 

Zoo headquarters of the Wildlife Conservation Society has for over 

100 years provided a source of inspiration, stewardship and a real 

connection to global conservation to working-class families and 

neighborhoods across the region and beyond. The first-ever Urban 


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Assembly School for Wildlife Conservation located in one of the 

poorest Congressional districts in the United States represented by 

Congressman Jose ́ Serrano is an investment in changing the way 

we communicate our interactions with nature to our next generation. Students take regular classes at the Bronx Zoo, where our living exhibits provide extended classrooms for students to learn 

about and participate in local, national and global efforts to conserve the natural world. To this end, I applaud Secretary Salazar’s 

commitment to engaging youth, particularly those from underserved areas, as a pillar of the Great Outdoors Initiative and recommend that the Department of the Interior develop great partnerships with zoos and aquariums to build a conservation ethic among 

the next generation of youth. 

One such challenge facing not just our youth but our nation and 

indeed the world is that of climate change, which poses an unparalleled threat to wildlife and the environments on which they depend. WCS conservationists work across the globe to combat climate change impacts including shifts in wildlife habitat and 

ranges. In the United States, WCS is encouraged by Interior’s stated goal for its Climate Change Adaptation Initiative of identifying 

areas and species most vulnerable to climate change and implementing adaptation strategies in these areas. We support this laudable goal and recognize that the overall funding request of $171.3 

million for this initiative is a good start to building resilient ecosystems. 

As part of this investment, landscape conservation cooperatives 

will continue to be developed and the scope of U.S. Geological Survey’s National Climate Change and Wildlife Center will expand 

through the establishment of eight Climate Science Centers. 

Through these investments, WCS would like to see increased coordination with other agencies and external partners to develop a 

further understanding of climate impacts across entire landscapes 

coupled with demonstration projects that could provide resource 

managers the tools necessary to address the specific needs in that 

landscape. These interagency landscape level approaches are key to 

addressing not only climate change impacts but other issues such 

as sprawl and energy development as well. 

Recently, the U.S. Forest Service, National Park Service and the 

National Wildlife Refuge System pledged to work together to support the protection of the migration corridor of pronghorn antelope 

known as the Path of the Pronghorn across the broad greater Yellowstone ecosystem. While further protections are needed, WCS applauds this cooperative action demonstrating that by working together, we can find solutions to preserve our Nation’s wildlife history and heritage. 

From world-renowned WCS conservationist George Schaller’s 

first studies of mountain gorillas in 1959 to our 2008 discovery of 

more than 125,000 western lowland gorillas in Congo, WCS has 

been committed to saving all four subspecies of gorilla. In recent 

years, our conservation successes would not be possible without the 

support of the U.S. Fish and Wildlife Service among other U.S. government agencies. Since 1991, the multinational species funds administered by the Fish and Wildlife Service has provided the 

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phants, rhinos, tigers, great apes and sea turtles, and WCS recommends that Congress fund this program at $5 million for RhinoTiger Fund and $2.5 million for each of the remaining species 

funds. 

I see that we are running quickly out of time. 

Mr. MORAN. We are out of time. 

Mr. CALVELLI. And I want to just end with one thought, this idea 

that Ken Burns and the greatest idea that we had with parks. You 

will see in my testimony that we have many examples of that, and 

I apologize, I did not recognize the ranking member and Mr. Hinchey. Thank you for being here and giving us an opportunity. 

[The statement of John Calvelli follows:] 


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Mr. MORAN. Thank you very much for that testimony, Mr. 

Calvelli. It is interesting, the newest exhibit at the National Museum of Natural History shows the closeness of the great apes and 

the chimpanzees and many of the species that you are trying to 

protect to mankind itself, so—— 

Mr. CALVELLI. One of the things, Mr. Chairman, that we have 

not done well as a conservation community is explain the impact 

of saving these tropical forests just in terms of even medicinals 

that are found there, and we need to be doing that and the Forest 

Service has done a good job in that. 

Mr. MORAN. Thank you very much, Mr. Calvelli. 

Mr. HINCHEY. John, I just want to say I appreciate what you are 

doing, always have, and I look forward to continuing working with 

you. Thank you very much. 

Mr. CALVELLI. Thank you, sir. 

Mr. MORAN. Now we will hear from Laurie Norton Moffatt, who 

is the director of the Norman Rockwell—oh, we can do Mr. Sherman. I am sorry, Ms. Moffatt. We are going to do Mr. Sherman, 

then we will bring you up. I was going by the schedule here. Congressman Brad Sherman. 

THURSDAY, MARCH 25, 2010. 

CA–27 

WITNESS 

HON. BRAD SHERMAN 

Mr. SHERMAN. Mr. Chairman, thank you for taking me out of 

order. I come here as I have so many years on behalf of the Santa 

Monica Mountains National Recreation Area. Over 33 million visitors a year visit the beaches and parks and mountains of this unit 

of the national park system, which stretches across the Santa 

Monica Mountains and transverses Zuma and Trancas Canyons. It 

is the most visited unit of the National Park Service. To date, the 

National Park Service has acquired 22,000 acres of park land using 

Land and Water Conservation funds totaling $163 million. 

The Santa Monica Mountains National Recreation Area has one 

of the largest backlogs of acquisition needs. Approximately 20,000 

acres remain to be acquired to complete the land protection plan 

and eventually to complete that plan it will cost an estimated $57 

million. I am not here to ask for $57 million. I am instead here to 

focus on the highest priority of the National Park Service in the 

Santa Monica Mountains, the Zuma/Trancas Canyons. The Department of Interior fiscal year 2011 budget provides $3.75 million to 

acquire 16 tracts in those canyons. I strongly support what is already in the Administration budget and ask that you plus that 

amount up to $6 million so that all of the parcels in those two canyons can be acquired. 

The National Park Service ranks Zuma/Trancas Canyon watersheds and coastal estuaries as their top priority for land acquisition. The Park Service has identified 484 acres in the watershed 

for acquisition. This includes some 28 parcels. The estimated value 

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ness to sell. There are no takings involved in the request that I am 

making. 

[The statement of Brad Sherman follows:] 


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Mr. MORAN. So the problem is that they are building high-end 

housing on the private inholdings, which I suppose the value is enhanced because it is protected federal land around it, so you are 

suggesting that at this time the real estate value is depressed and 

so it is a good time to pick it up and preserve the overall quality 

of the entire area? 

Mr. SHERMAN. It is a buyer’s market. We need to take advantage 

of this buyer’s market, and at some point if these owners instead 

use their legal entitlements to put up mansions, we will never be 

able to restore the view shed. We will never really be able to preserve this land. 

Now we will hear from Ms. Moffatt, Laurie Norton Moffatt, who 

is the director of the Norman Rockwell Museum on behalf of the 

Association of Art Museum Directors and American Association of 

Museums. 

THURSDAY, MARCH 25, 2010. 

ASSOCIATION OF ART MUSEUM DIRECTORS AND THE 

AMERICAN ASSOCIATION OF MUSEUMS 

WITNESS 

LAURIE NORTON MOFFATT 

Ms. MOFFATT. Thank you, Mr. Chairman and Congressmen 

Simpson and Hinchey. Thank you for this opportunity to testify. 

Following on the heels of the millions of acres of preservation of the 

national parks, I have two very small stories to tell but I am speaking on behalf of millions of visitors and billions of museum artifacts 

our Nation preserves. I am here today to testify about the 2011 appropriations for the National Endowment for the Arts and the National Endowment for the Humanities, and I am speaking on behalf of Norman Rockwell Museum in Stockbridge, Massachusetts, 

where I am executive director, as well as for the American Association of Museums and the Association of Art Museum Directors. 

We are respectfully requesting Congress to approve funding increases for both agencies this year. At a time when individual, corporate and foundation giving is under unprecedented pressure and 

demand for the services of our museums in the Nation is at an alltime high as a result of the recession. These agencies are offering 

lifelines, helping us to preserve programming, collections and educational services for the public, not to mention millions of jobs of 

our staff and the vendors to our businesses. 

To provide a context for this request, I would like to speak about 

specific grants that the Norman Rockwell Museum and the Association of Art Museum Directors have received from the NEA and 

the NEH. Norman Rockwell Museum stewards the world’s largest, 

most significant collection of the art and archives of American artist Norman Rockwell. Our exhibits attract 150,000 visitors to 

Stockbridge, Massachusetts, in the rural western part of our state 

annually but we also serve 300,000 additional visitors through our 

exhibitions that travel around the country. Last year alone, we had 

nine exhibits traveling and being seen in 10 different states. ThereVerDate Mar 15 2010 02:18 May 18, 2010 Jkt 056200 PO 00000 Frm 00295 Fmt 6601 Sfmt 6602 E:\HR\OC\A200P2.XXX A200P2

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fore, we are serving about half a million people a year from our 

small museum. 

Caring for this world-class collection is a formidable task for our 

small-size museum with a very tiny endowment. Let me just show 

you the impact of two NEA and NEH grants on one collection 

project that we have been doing. In 2003, we launched a comprehensive 10–year preservation digitization and public access initiative for the Norman Rockwell Archive, which has gained broad 

public support. For our efforts, our professional efforts, in 2008 the 

museum received the National Humanities Medal, the first and 

only museum in the Nation to have received this recognition for the 

studying and honoring of the life work and ideals of an icon in 

American art and for being the careful curator of the archives illustrations and benevolent spirit of Norman Rockwell that he bequeathed to the Nation. I can tell you that none of this would have 

been possible without funding we received from the NEA and the 

NEH and we leveraged this funding with more than $1 million in 

private foundation grants on top of the public grants. 

Mr. MORAN. Well, it probably would have been NEH, would it 

not have been, more than NEA? 

Ms. MOFFATT. It was both, actually, because of the ideals, the 

humanity ideals represented in Norman Rockwell’s art, and NEH 

supports many, many exhibits that are seen around the country, so 

we do benefit from both agencies. A $25,000 NEA grant and a $300,000 Save America’s Treasures 

grant preserve 18,000 fragile acetate negatives that were being lost 

and this collection of pictures, American Life in the 20th Century. 

And American Masterpiece’s program has supported a national 

traveling exhibition of our collection to 12 venues around the country and is being seen in the states of Arkansas, California, Florida, 

Kansas, Michigan, North Carolina, Ohio, Virginia and Washington 

State. It will be seen by an estimated 5 million visitors by the time 

it concludes in 2012. And an additional NEH grant has supported 

the arrangement and description of the Rockwell Archive and this 

vast collection of 200,000 items that we care for and has created 

exhibitions, online digital access, book projects and educational programming for schools. 

To put this in context, our budget is less than $4 million annually and our endowment is equally small, also below $4 million. 

The NEA and NEH support has made it possible for us to steward 

this national collection, which would not have been possible to do 

just from our visitors. The field at large has made recent grants to 

the Association of Art Museum Directors to help do a mapping 

project which has shown the regions of the Nation that our art museums are serving and demonstrating that many underserved and 

poor school districts are being served by the school programs in our 

country. 

So we respectfully request as a last request that the Congress reject a budget request by the Executive Office to eliminate Save 

America’s Treasures. This program was established by First Lady 

Hillary Clinton and strongly supported by First Lady Laura Bush 

and it has helped rescue sites and collections of national and even 

world significance. So together with the National Park Service and 

the art museums and all museums in the Nation, we request that 


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you support the NEA and NEH funding and restore America’s 

treasures. 

[The statement of Laurie Norton Moffatt follows:] 


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Mr. MORAN. Your testimony is meeting sympathetic ears. 

Mr. HINCHEY. The Norman Rockwell Museum is very impressive, 

and I think a lot of people are very grateful to you for what you 

continue to do there. 

Mr. MORAN. Have you seen that, Mr. Hinchey? 

Mr. HINCHEY. I have, yes. It is a great place. 

Ms. MOFFATT. Thank you very much. 

Mr. MORAN. Very good. Good testimony, and we happen to agree, 

and Save America’s Treasures will be saved. Trust us. Thank you. 

Next we are going to hear from Peter Evans, the director of the 

Interstate Council on Water Policy. Mr. Evans. 

THURSDAY, MARCH 25, 2010. 

INTERSTATE COUNCIL ON WATER POLICY 

WITNESS 

PETER EVANS 

Mr. EVANS. Good morning, Mr. Chairman, thank you, Ranking 

Member Simpson, Congressmen Hinchey. We have met previously 

with you. You will recall from last year’s briefings that you are well 

aware of the America stream gauge programs at the U.S. Geological Survey. I know that time is short so we are going to get 

straight to the point. 

We brought you a letter in December showing the broad support, 

the wide level of concern about the continuing loss of stream 

gauges. For the record, sorry, I am Peter Evans. I am the executive 

director of the Interstate Council on Water Policy, and we appreciate this opportunity to testify this year, especially because the 

President’s budget request includes a decrease in funding for two 

vital water science programs at USGS and we believe that this 

subcommittee needs to take action to correct that mistake. 

The last time we brought a letter to you, we brought 56 organization endorsements along with the endorsement from 26 state officials indicating their reliance on these programs and the detriment 

that they suffer as USGS continues to lose stream gauges. 

The stream gauges and groundwater monitoring wells operated 

by USGS serve as the stethoscope on America’s rivers and water 

supplies. The members of the Interstate Council depend heavily on 

USGS stream gauging for the interpretative science essential in 

the development and implementation of sound water plans and in 

the operation of water projects. The Council was established in 

1959 as a way for state officials to get together on a regular basis 

to learn from each other, to build their capabilities, also to speak 

as a group on important issues of federal policy and the assistance 

that we need. What our members have in common is the responsibility for developing and managing programs and implementing 

projects that reduce flood risk and drought risk and balance the 

needs of human communities with the protection of water quality, 

wetlands and riparian areas as well as the species that depend on 

them. 

As you know better than many of the other subcommittees in the 

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lenges, and the President’s budget includes new funding to address 

much of the infrastructure improvement and environmental restoration across the country. Without detracting from the worthiness of those initiatives, we find it unreasonable to invest so much 

in new support in those programs and projects without first investing in the water data and science needed for their design and implementation. Full implementation for these programs has never 

been requested. Both of these programs, the National Streamflow 

Information Program and the Cooperative Water Program, are national programs that have been authorized by Congress, funded for 

many years, but the Department has never requested full implementation. 

USGS estimated last year, at your request, that completing the 

installation of the Cooperative Water Program would cost an additional $121 million if they could do that over the next 5 years and 

that annual operation and maintenance will cost $114 million. If 

the National Streamflow Information Program were fully implemented, it would take a considerable burden off the co-op program, 

which is a cost-share program in which as the USGS lacks capacity 

states and local governments, tribal agencies have had to pick up 

the slack. They are now carrying on average across the country 70 

percent of the share instead of the traditional 50/50 cost share. 

USGS also estimated last year, again at your request, that they would need an additional $100 million for the Cooperative Water 

Program in order to stop losing stream gauges and restore the ability to match local governments and state agencies on a 50/50 basis. 

In response to your question, Congressman Simpson, I recall that 

the acting director for the U.S. Geological Survey told you last year 

that they had a plan to fully implement these programs over the 

next 5 years, and the information that they provided after their 

hearing last year showed the budget that they need. So it was a 

surprise to us to see that the President’s request for this year includes a cut for both programs, and we realize that the budget is 

tight but we have made repeated efforts over the last 5 years to 

persuade the Department that this is a national problem that they 

need to attend to with the concurrence of lots of other organizations. We have written many letters over the past 5 years to Secretary Salazar and his predecessors. They say that they are sympathetic and yet we see budget cuts. The data from these programs 

are essential in planning and managing the metropolitan water 

supply for Washington, D.C., the Everglades, the Chesapeake, the 

Long Island Sound, the Grand Canyon, the Sacramento-San Joaquin Bay Delta, all of these crucial water programs, all of which 

are vital to different parts of the country and depend on the data. 

The data is needed for the Water Smart Program, the water census 

that the Department is proposing and so we ask that you support 

us. 

[The statement of Peter Evans follows:] 


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Mr. MORAN. Thank you, Mr. Evans. You raise a very important 

issue to our attention and we certainly agree on the need. Thank 

you, Mr. Evans. 

Dr. Craig Schiffries, who is the director for Geoscience Policy at 

the Geological Society of America. Dr. Schiffries. 

THURSDAY, MARCH 25, 2010. 

GEOLOGICAL SOCIETY OF AMERICA, GEOSCIENCE 

POLICY 

WITNESS 

CRAIG SCHIFFRIES 

Dr. SCHIFFRIES. Thank you very much, Mr. Chairman and members of the subcommittee. Thank you for the opportunity to testify 

today on behalf of the Geological Society of America, and I also 

serve as co-chair of the USGS Coalition. The Geological Society of 

America was founded in 1888 as a scientific society with over 

22,000 members from academia, government and industry in all 50 

states and more than 90 countries. 

The Geological Society joins with the USGS Coalition and other organizations in recommending an appropriation of at least $1.3 

billion for the USGS in fiscal year 2011. This budget would enable 

the USGS to address a growing backlog of science needs, accelerate 

the timetable for deploying critical monitoring systems and launch 

science initiatives that address new challenges. Despite the growing need for USGS science and information, funding for the USGS 

has stagnated in real dollars for more than a decade. 

The USGS is one of the Nation’s premier science agencies that 

addresses many of society’s most pressing challenges including energy resources, water resources, climate change and natural hazards. The devastating earthquake in Haiti on January 12th that 

killed more than 200,000 people and the enormous earthquake in 

Chile on February 27th emphatically demonstrate the value of robust natural-hazards monitoring and warning systems and the 

need for increased investments in the USGS. The USGS has a 

unique combination of biological, geographical, geological and 

hydrological programs that enable it to address interdisciplinary 

research challenges that are beyond the capabilities of most other 

organizations. Quite simply, the USGS benefits every American 

every day. 

As shown in figure 1, the USGS budget fell in real dollars for 7 

consecutive years from 2001 to 2008. Despite budget increases in 

2009 and 2010, the USGS budget request for 2011 remains below 

the USGS budget for 2001 in real dollars. The decline in funding 

for the USGS during this time period would have been much greater if Congress had not repeatedly restored proposed budget cuts. 

Federal funding for non-defense R&D increased significantly while 

funding for the USGS has stagnated for more than a decade. From 

1996 to 2009, federal funding for the USGS fell by 1 percent constant dollars. During that same period, federal funding for non-defense R&D increased by 45 percent and funding for defense R&D 

increased by 66 percent in constant dollars. 


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Let me mention two examples of USGS science. In the 30 years 

since the cataclysmic eruption of Mount St. Helens in 1980, scientific and technological advances have enabled the U.S. Geological 

Survey to make reliable forecasts of expected volcanic activity a reality. Until now, these technologies and methods have been applied 

mainly on an ad hoc basis to volcanoes showing signs of activity. 

At present, almost half of the most threatening U.S. volcanoes are 

monitored only at a basic level with real-time sensors and only a 

few are well monitored with a suite of modern instruments and 

methods. However, monitoring capabilities at many hazardous volcanoes are known to be sparse and antiquated and some hazardous 

volcanoes have no ground-based monitoring whatsoever. The National Volcano Early Warning System is a proposed national-scale 

effort by the USGS and its partners to ensure that volcanoes are 

monitored at a level commensurate with the threats they pose. 

I want to turn to earthquakes for a moment. In the minutes after 

an earthquake strikes, as recent events in Haiti have demonstrated, knowing where the shaking was most intense can save 

lives by providing emergency responders with situational awareness they need to concentrate their efforts where they matter most. 

In the United States, earthquakes are a national challenge with 75 

million people in 39 states living in moderate to high earthquake 

hazard areas. The USGS has developed models for the location and 

expected severity of earthquakes shaking nationwide within specified time periods. These models are used to generate maps that are 

incorporated into seismic safety standards for model building codes 

and other purposes. Even if seismologists are unable to issue precise earthquake predictions, they can still issue warnings after an 

earthquake occurs. They can do this by sending warning signals 

that outrun seismic waves just as lightning outruns thunder. 

Earthquake waves travel roughly at the speed of sound and rock, 

and once an earthquake is detected, seismologists can send warning signals that travel at the speed of light. These warnings can 

be used to stop trains on the tracks before they derail, to shut 

down nuclear power plants before they are damaged, and to stop 

surgical procedures before a patient is injured. The United States 

has the technology but not the funding to fully implement this type 

of warning system. 

Let me make some other comparisons with federal funding for research and development. As I mentioned earlier, federal funding 

for the USGS fell 1 percent while non-defense R&D increased by 

45 percent from 1996 to 2009. The USGS would continue to lose 

ground to other science agencies under President Obama’s budget 

request for 2011 because non-defense R&D would increase overall 

by 5.9 percent while USGS R&D would increase by only 2.9 percent. Under President Obama’s budget request to Congress, the increase in NASA’s R&D budget is greater than the entire budget for 

the United States Geological Survey. According to the White House 

Office of Science and Technology Policy, the President’s budget 

would increase R&D at NASA by $1.7 billion, or 18.3 percent, in 

fiscal year 2011. The $1.7 billion increase for NASA’s R&D is far 

greater than the entire budget of the U.S. Geological Survey, which 

is $1.1 billion. 

[The statement of Craig Schiffries follows:] 


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Mr. MORAN. Dr. Schiffries, I am going to interrupt you. That is 

all interesting. We are not opposed to the R&D in those areas, and 

do feel that there ought to be more devoted to USGS. You need to 

be making this case to the science guys in the White House to build 

it into the budget because we are very limited in how much we can 

do, the add-ons and subtractions and so on. We do not like to subtract but it would have been a lot easier if they had built in more, 

particularly for a warning system, which would seem to have even 

national security implications, but you have to talk to the people 

in the White House as well. That is very good testimony. Thank 

you, Dr. Schiffries. 

Dr. SCHIFFRIES. Thank you very much. 

Dr. Robert Gropp, the co-chair of the U.S. Geological Survey Coalition. Dr. Gropp. 

THURSDAY, MARCH 25, 2010. 

U.S. GEOLOGICAL SURVEY COALITION 

WITNESS 

ROBERT GROPP 

Dr. GROPP. Thank you, Mr. Chairman, members of the committee. I appreciate the opportunity to testify today, again sort of 

continuing to talk about the USGS. I am director of policy for the 

American Institute of Biological Sciences in addition to serving as 

co-chair of the Coalition. 

First of all, we would like to thank all the members of the committee and past members of the committee for your long support 

of the USGS. We truly appreciate what you all have done in a bipartisan fashion over the years to restore cuts, and so we sincerely 

thank you all for your efforts on that front. As Craig just mentioned, one of the Coalition’s longstanding now, couple year request 

is that we think that the USGS would benefit from a $1.3 billion 

budget. We recognize your constraints but that remains our recommendation for the Survey for this coming year. 

The USGS Coalition is actually an alliance of over 70 scientific 

societies, data consumers and associated stakeholders of the USGS. 

The group was founded to highlight and promote the continued vitality of the crosscut of unique biological, geological, hydrological 

and mapping programs that are found within the USGS and the 

unique opportunities scientifically that arise from that. 

With respect to the USGS, as you all well know, it is the Department of Interior’s science agency but importantly, it is also an 

internationally recognized natural-resource agency that has benefits to every citizen domestically and internationally on a daily 

basis. Also importantly, as Craig was mentioning, it is a science 

agency and we are working to try to highlight that among the Administration and other federal agencies and appreciate any support 

you all can offer us with doing that. As you know, science is important in terms of reigniting the economy, solving problems, and in 

the case of USGS, it is also a beneficial investment in terms of reducing costs through making wise management decisions, cost-effective conservation decisions and so forth. 


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Mr. MORAN. It was a $20 million increase provided over last 

year’s budget. What is the total? Do you recall the total for USGS 

versus the $1.3 billion? 

Dr. GROPP. It is about $1.1 billion. 

Mr. MORAN. So you are looking for a $200 million increase? 

Dr. GROPP. Right. 

Mr. MORAN. About 10 times what we did last year. 

Dr. GROPP. No, we recognize your constraints. As I am sure you are well aware, within that $20 million increase that is included, and I think this is a problem across Interior, is that $13.5 million is not accounted for in terms of fixed cost 

increases, and that is becoming a growing concern for us when we 

look at USGS as they continue to have to absorb these costs year 

over year. So if you take that off the $21 million proposed increase, 

you are down to $8 million, which largely goes to important new 

programs—climate change, environment, ecosystems—but as was 

mentioned, there is about $11 million in cuts to water programs, 

bio programs and enterprise infrastructure. So it is a tight environment. 

[The statement of Robert Gropp follows:] 


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Mr. MORAN. As you know, the Department of Interior elected to 

make every program absorb those fixed costs, but it is a fair point 

and an important one to bear in mind. Thank you, Dr. Gropp. Your 

testimony and the prior testimony were important, and we do understand USGS is very strong. In fact, I have made a point of trying to increase money for USGS and we will try to continue to, and 

while there are a lot of priorities, these are very good scientists 

that do good, important work. 

Mr. Hinchey. 

Mr. HINCHEY. Well, I just agree. What you are talking about is 

very important, and I am sure we will do the best we can. 

Mr. GROPP. Again, thank you very much. 

Mr. MORAN. Thank you, Dr. Gropp, very much. 

The next speaker will be Sara Fain, who is the co-chair of the 

Everglades Coalition. Good morning, Ms. Fain. 

THURSDAY, MARCH 25, 2010. 

EVERGLADES COALITION 

WITNESS 

SARA FAIN 

Ms. FAIN. Mr. Chairman, members of the subcommittee, thank 

you for the opportunity to be here today. My name is Sara Fain 

and I am here as the national co-chair of the Everglades Coalition. 

The Everglades Coalition represents 53 environmental and conservation organizations and collectively we represent over 6 million 

members nationwide, and we have been working for over 25 years 

to work for the full restoration of the Everglades ecosystem. 

So first I want to take this opportunity to thank you for your visionary leadership over the last 17 years in guiding Everglades restoration. We are undertaking something really, really special down 

in south Florida. This is the most ambitious ecological restoration 

plan that has ever been undertaken in the history of the world, and 

we are setting the standard for restoration initiatives nationwide 

from Puget Sound to Chesapeake Bay, and it is largely because of 

your example that we are setting the high standard that we have, 

and I am excited to be able to come here today and talk about a 

wonderful year that we have had. It has been a momentous year 

where a lot has been accomplished. The year 2009 brought the 

highest levels of federal funding ever for the Everglades. We have 

finally broken ground on the modified water deliveries project, 

which is building a mile-long bridge along the northern border of 

Everglades National Park across Tamiami Trail and this will allow 

water to once again flow back into this park, helping restore critical habitat upon which our unique and biodiverse wildlife depends, 

and it was this committee that because of your actions has helped 

to move that forward, so on behalf of the Coalition, I thank you. 

We have also celebrated two other groundbreakings. We have 

broken ground on the C–111 spreader canal western project and 

the Picayune strand project, and with support in the fiscal year 

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poundments. And all these projects, let’s remember, are not just 

critical pieces of the restoration plan but they are also creating onthe-ground construction jobs in this new restoration economy. 

Another great thing that has happened this year is the National 

Park Service at your direction has been developing a plan for additional bridging along Tamiami Trail, which this will be the ultimate goal in actually fully restoring water flow into one of our Nation’s most iconic parks, so it really has been a momentous year 

and it is largely because of your commitment and leadership that 

I can come here today and be so optimistic about the future. I hope 

that we can continue on this momentum. People down in south 

Florida and nationwide are really, really excited about what is happening in the Everglades and so I would like to ask that you support the Administration’s budget for Everglades restoration while 

also increasing funding for the modified water deliveries project to 

$15 million. That would be half of what remains in order to finish 

building the mile-long bridge along Tamiami Trail and would go a 

long way to actually start getting some flow back into the park. 

I also ask that you provide for the National Park Service’s planning efforts in additional bridging along Tamiami Trail and let’s 

just keep setting the bar high for America’s Everglades. We continue to set the example for restoration initiatives everywhere. 

In closing, it was the foremost protector of the Everglades, Marjorie Stoman Douglas, who said, ‘‘There are no other Everglades in 

the world.’’ And so I hope that we can continue on this path to not 

only make sure that Everglades is a sanctuary for our wildlife but 

is also an economic driver, is a source of fresh water for people and 

that we leave a legacy for our children to be proud of. 

[The statement of Sara Fain follows:] 


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Mr. MORAN. Thanks very much, Ms. Fain. I was disturbed at the 

deal that had been worked out with the State of Florida, Governor 

Crist and the sugar producer appears to be compromised. For one 

thing, Florida has run out of money and they signed the deal when 

real estate values were at their highest level ever, and of course, 

the sugar producers will not budge an inch. And so what was heralded as major progress has seen something of a setback, and I am 

not sure what we can do about that but it is troubling. 

Ms. FAIN. Well, the good news is that the deal is not completed 

yet. The deal is still on the table and I think that there are opportunities for negotiations in the price. I think that the important 

thing is that we have known that the 2000 plan that Congress 

adopted, the comprehensive Everglades restoration plan, was fundamentally flawed in that it did not provide enough land for storing and cleaning water. We have a willing seller for the first time 

in a generation who will provide us that opportunity. So I hope 

that we can find a way within the economic constraints to make 

this happen. 

Mr. MORAN. Well, if they are not willing to show some flexibility, 

we need to see if we cannot come up with some creative approaches 

to dealing with them. 

Mr. Simpson. 

Mr. SIMPSON. Creative approaches. 

Mr. MORAN. Well, I am thinking about it. I am not sure what we 

can do. 

Mr. SIMPSON. It scares me when you say ‘‘creative approaches.’’ 

Mr. MORAN. That is right. Well, I mean that. I did not say it was 

illegal. I just think that it is a terribly important issue and there 

ought to be some help given to people when an enormous amount 

of money has been made off that area down there. 

Ms. FAIN. And I can bring back your comments to the State of 

Florida. I think that they recognize that there are potentially opportunities to make sure that this is a deal that is good for the people in South Florida. 

Mr. MORAN. I do not think Governor Crist is the problem. It is 

not the government in Florida that is the problem. 

Mr. Hinchey. 

Mr. HINCHEY. Well, I just want to thank you for what you are 

doing, and what you said is so true. I mean, this committee has 

been very, very devoted to this for a number of years and we have 

done a lot of things to help it get better advanced, and the optimism that you express is very encouraging to us, and I agree with 

what our chairman has just said. There are a lot of things we have 

to pay very close attention to, and this project is very, very important, and thank you for everything you are doing. 

Ms. FAIN. Well, thank you, too. 

Mr. MORAN. Thank you for everything you are doing. Thank you 

very much. 

Tom Partin, president of the American Forest Resource Council 

on behalf of the Federal Forest Resource Coalition. Mr. Partin. 


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THURSDAY, MARCH 25, 2010. 

FEDERAL FOREST RESOURCE COALITION 

WITNESS 

TOM PARTIN 

Mr. PARTIN. Thank you. Good morning, Mr. Chairman, Ranking 

Member Simpson, members of the subcommittee. My name is Tom 

Partin. I am president of the American Forest Resource Council located in Portland, Oregon. I am testifying here today on behalf of 

the Federal Forest Resource Coalition. The Federal Forest Resource Coalition is kind of an informal group representing many 

forest industry trade associations including Intermountain Forestry 

Association, which Mr. Simpson, I am sure you are very aware of. 

Collectively, our members represent every segment of the forestry and wood products industry, and we employ more than 1 million people directly and rank among the top 10 manufacturing employers in 48 states, so we are pretty proud of our record. Our companies depend on the federal forest to provide a consistent and sustainable flow of raw materials to remain in operation. Our members are often located in smaller rural communities and the jobs 

they provide are the lifeblood for these rural economies. With this 

in mind, it is easy to recognize that as the Forest Service budget 

and timber outputs go, so go the health of our forests, our forest 

products industry and many of America’s rural communities. 

I am here today to discuss the President’s fiscal year 2011 Forest 

Service budget request. First, let me say that we are very pleased 

that the President recognizes the importance of the Forest Service 

and gave the Forest Service an increase. We are very much appreciative of that. However, we have some concerns with the budget. 

First, we have significant issues with merging the forest products, 

vegetation and watershed management and wildlife and fisheries 

habitat line items into a single integrated resources restoration account. The only target for this new account are acres treated, and 

we fear that the agency will lose the accountability for the timber 

targets that our industry so desperately needs. Our plants do not 

operate on acres treated. We need predictability and certainty in 

the form of timber output targets to be able to plan operations and 

investments. We strongly urge you to keep timber targets at both 

the regional and national forest level to ensure the flow of materials we need to survive. 

Our second concern is the timber management output target for 

the 2011 budget is actually down from 2.5 billion board feet in fiscal year 2010 to 2.4 billion in fiscal year 2011. This reduction is 

contrary to the strong Congressional support in many letters that 

came to the Administration for increasing timber sales, particularly 

as they relate to forest health and industry needs. We have recommended an increase from our group of $57 million to the forest 

products line item which would bring the 2011 target up to 3 billion board feet. This level of funding would provide a much-needed 

boost to rural America and speed the restoration of our federal forests which, as you know, are burning millions of acres each year. 

A very conservative estimate of jobs created per million board 

feet of timber harvested is 11.4 new direct and indirect jobs with 


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an average wage of $42,300. Therefore, increasing the forest products line item by $57 million would increase the timber harvest to 

3 billion board feet and create 6,600 new jobs nationwide. Quite 

frankly, we find it very difficult to understand at a time when we 

need to provide jobs to rural America, you propose reducing timber 

harvests, thus reducing jobs in our industry. Obviously we are 

missing 100 million board feet nationwide with this President’s 

budget that came out and we are very concerned about that. 

A closer look at the integrated resource restoration line item shows an actual $26 million increase. However, $30 million of that 

would be set aside to implement the Forest Landscape Restoration 

Act and $50 million for priority watershed improvement projects. 

This means a $54 million actual reduction to the combined budgetary pool, and we fear this could greatly impact forest health 

projects and the timber outputs again that we do desperately need. 

Switching to the hazardous fuels line item, this area would re- ceive a $9.2 million increase under the budget. In light of the heavy 

fuels buildup, we feel this is appropriate. However, we think we 

should take a new direction with this line item, and our group recommends that Congress should integrate hazardous fuels dollars 

with national forest system dollars for fuels work in some of the 

higher condition class areas. This integration could also fund the 

$80 million for the landscape restoration and watershed programs. 

We are also concerned about the language that directs a higher 

percentage of the work to be focused on wildland-urban interface 

area. Now, I will not disagree that the WUI areas are really important. However, a higher percentage of the class 2 and class 3 forests where the big fires really start are located in the general forested areas away from the wildland-urban interface. We need to 

put more focus and more of our dollars and efforts towards these 

extreme forest class condition areas. 

Finally, we disagree with the $118 million proposed cut to the 

capital improvement and maintenance budget. The elimination of 

all new road construction and reconstruction will undercut the 

agency’s ability to sell many timber sales that are already through 

the NEPA process and ready to go and it will prevent maintaining 

a roads infrastructure already located out there in the forest that 

many of our public besides just the manufacturers really depend 

on. 

In short, again, the health of our forests, our forest products industry and our rural communities are based on the Forest Service 

budget. We really would request that you increase the forest products line item by $57 million to get our harvest up to 3 billion 

board feet and put 6,600 people back to work. Thank you for taking 

my testimony. 

[The statement of Tom Partin follows:] 


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Mr. MORAN. Thank you, Mr. Partin. Thank you very much. 

Brian Moore is the legislative director of the Audubon Society. 

THURSDAY, MARCH 25, 2010. 

AUDUBON SOCIETY 

WITNESS 

BRIAN MOORE 

Mr. MOORE. Good morning, Mr. Chairman, Mr. Simpson, Mr. 

Hinchey, and Mr. Chairman, congratulations on your new assignment as chairman of the subcommittee. We are very supportive of 

it, and the Audubon Society has a long relationship with you and 

the subcommittee, and we are glad to be here to be able to present 

our views on a few parts of the Department of Interior budget as 

well as the Environmental Protection Agency. 

Our main focus for the National Audubon Society is protecting 

and establishing habitat for birds and wildlife and so there is certain programs within both agencies that we particularly like to 

focus on. 

Mr. MORAN. You begin by making recommendations for fiscal 

year 2012. Did you want to focus on 2012? 

Mr. MOORE. No, sir, I did not. I have a revised testimony. That 

was a typographical error. I apologize for that and I have a new 

copy for you. 

Mr. MORAN. I was giving you credit for a visionary approach. 

Mr. MOORE. I apologize for that. 

Mr. MORAN. You decided there is not much you can do about this 

year but let’s try in 2012 to do a better job. 

Mr. MOORE. I think we can do a lot this year, and even more in 

2012. 

Mr. MORAN. Sorry for the interruption. 

Mr. MOORE. No, no. It is your committee. You interrupt as you 

please. 

The first thing that I would like to talk about is the restoration 

of the Everglades, and I know you have already heard about the 

Everglades. It is also a key priority for the National Audubon Society. We think last year was a monumental year for the Everglades, 

especially with the groundbreaking on the Tamiami Trail and other 

groundbreakings as well, and one funding recommendation we 

would give this year and also for 2012 would be $15 million in 2011 

and then $15 million in 2012 for the modified water delivery program. We think that would complete that program, which would 

then free up the Park Service and this committee to begin to work 

on new projects within Everglades and create an ever greater restoration amongst that ecosystem. There are also other recommendations in that but I think you have heard them from the 

Everglades groups. 

Our second priority of course is the Land and Water Conservation Fund. We agree with many other groups that that fund should 

be increased to about $425 million with $175 million of it going to 

the stateside program. We have many priorities with the LWCF. 

They are not limited to, but they include many refuges that have 


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received funding in the past. They are the Silvio Conte National 

Wildlife Refuge, the Stewart McKinney National Wildlife Refuge, 

the Cash River National Wildlife Refuge in Arkansas, and of course 

the James River National Wildlife Refuge in your State of Virginia. 

We focus heavily on the national wildlife refuge system because 

we believe it is one of the federal units of land that provide the 

greatest habitat for birds, wildlife, migratory species and recreation 

for all Americans and so we call on this committee to continue your 

good work to increase the funding for the national wildlife refuge 

system to about $578 million. We think that is a fair number to 

increase the operations and maintenance of that agency as well as 

to maybe add some increased capacity to it. 

We are also very encouraged by the Administration’s proposal 

that within that request they would move around $5 million to the 

wildlife refuges within the Louisiana-Mississippi coastline to help 

restore some of the damage created by Hurricane Rita, Hurricane 

Katrina and Hurricane Ike. Those are still ongoing issues and 

those communities are still recovering and so are those refuges. So 

we are pleased with that and we encourage both full funding for 

the refuge system as well as some dedicated funding or funding towards America’s coastline. 

Of course, we are the Audubon Society and birds are very important to us. One program this committee has always shown great 

support for is the Neotropical Migratory Bird Conservation Act. We 

support a funding level this year of $6.5 million for that program. 

It requires a three to one match to the Federal Government on that 

program, but in reality, it receives about a four to one match. We 

think this is an important year for that program because it is up 

for reauthorization, so proving to not only this committee but to the 

Administration that these funds are spent well and that the Congress and the authorizing committees can look at it as a success. 

It is important for the reauthorization of that program to show continued success for it and their ability to successfully spend the dollars that they received. The program is also very important to the 

Audubon Society. 

And finally, we of course have many other priorities but one 

more is the restoration of Long Island Sound, and we greatly commend this subcommittee. You nearly doubled the funding, or I 

think you more than doubled the funding for that program from 

the previous fiscal year to the one we are in now, and we would 

like increased funding for that program. We think that that office 

has shown the ability to effectively spend that money, and the 

same way with the Neotropical Migratory Bird Conservation Act, 

that program is up for reauthorization this year. I believe many of 

the efforts to reauthorize it coincide with the way this committee 

has spent money for it, meaning there were two authorized programs. This committee has wisely chosen to fund it as one line 

item and that is the way the reauthorization legislation is moving 

this year. So to have those things coincide we believe helps the reauthorization of that important program because it is an ecosystem 

that is often overlooked and it is important to us and it is important to the fifth of the population, I believe, that lives within that 

watershed. 


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So those are our recommendations, and they are short, and there 

are many more in the written testimony, and I do appreciate your 

time. 

[The statement of Brian Moore follows:] 


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Mr. MORAN. Thank you. It is comprehensive testimony. Thank 

you very much, Mr. Moore. 

Mr. SIMPSON. Let me ask one question. 

Mr. MORAN. Please, Mr. Simpson. 

Mr. SIMPSON.1 Does the Audubon Society support the Fish and 

Wildlife Service’s land conservation cooperatives? 

Mr. MOORE. I am not sure we have created an opinion on that, 

Mr. Simpson. I will have to get back to you on that. 

Mr. SIMPSON. I appreciate it. Thank you. 

Mr. MORAN. Mr. Moore, thank you very much. 

Dr. Bruce Stein, associate director of the Wildlife Conservation 

and Global Warming, National Wildlife Federation. Dr. Stein. 

THURSDAY, MARCH 25, 2010. 

NATIONAL WILDLIFE FEDERATION 

WITNESS 

BRUCE STEIN 

Dr. STEIN. Thank you very much, Chairman Moran, Mr. Simpson, Mr. Hinchey. On behalf of the National Wildlife Federation, 

which is the Nation’s largest conservation advocacy and education 

organization, we have got more than 4 million members and supporters, we thank you for the opportunity to provide testimony on 

the fiscal year 2011 budget. 

Our written testimony covers a wide range of agencies and issues 

commensurate with the wide range of our organizational interests, 

but today I want to focus on just four issues: climate change adaptation, state wildlife grants, renewable energy siting and the U.S. 

Forest Service’s proposed budget reorganization. 

Regarding climate change adaptation, the National Wildlife Fed- eration is strongly supportive of the $35 million increase in Department of Interior activities relating to preparing for and coping with 

the effects of climate change on our natural resources, and this 

does include the implementation expansion of the network of landscape conservation cooperatives, so Mr. Simpson, we are very supportive of that effort. We do recognize, however, as we mention in 

our written testimony, that there are and will be growing pains in 

any such program of that sort and there is a need for increased cooperation and communication among the federal agencies and with 

the states but we see the focus on landscape-scale conservation and 

bringing good science to bear on identifying what is going to be 

needed in the face of climate change to be absolutely essential. We 

are also supportive, by the way, of the U.S. Geological Survey’s 

Wildlife and Climate Change Science Center which this committee 

has been so supportive of, again bringing to bear very important 

scientific expertise on how we address this central challenge of our 

time. 

Turning to state and tribal wildlife grants, this is a program that 

is really one of the Nation’s core efforts to ensure that wildlife populations remain healthy across the country and do not become endangered. The National Wildlife Federation has been working with 

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smart, to incorporate the necessary science and on-the-ground conservation activities that will be needed to ensure that this wildlife 

survives in an era of rapid climate change, and we would specifically recommend $100 million in funding in fiscal year 2011 for 

this program, which is a $10 million increase over what the President has requested. 

Transitioning to a clean energy economy is really one of the 

greatest challenges facing the Nation and we are very supportive 

of the President’s New Energy Frontier Initiative in the Department of Interior, which would invest $73 million in new renewable 

energy programs, and although the program does recognize that 

not all lands with renewable potential are appropriate for development, we are concerned that the Department does not yet have the 

necessary policy guidance to avoid significant impacts on wildlife in 

their habitats through renewable and transmission siting, so this 

is something that we think really needs to be attended to. We are, 

however, very supportive of the Department’s commonsense budget 

proposals for reducing extravagant subsidies to the oil and gas industries including a new fee on non-producing wells. 

And finally, just wanted to discuss the Forest Service’s proposed 

integrated resource restoration budget line item. This proposal 

combines forest products, wildlife and fisheries and vegetation 

management into a single $694 million budget item, and although 

we are generally supportive of the intent of this, which is to get 

the Forest Service doing more large landscape and watershed restoration, integrated restoration, we are concerned that by doing 

this, the wildlife component of the budget is at risk of declining due 

to lack of budget transparency. We have seen similar things happen in the past when endangered species, for instance, no longer 

are a separate budget line item and the investment and their management and Forest Service activities has appeared to decline, although it is difficult to tell for sure. And so if this budget realignment is put in place, we would encourage the development of robust program monitoring and oversight to ensure the continued 

commitment to the delivery on wildlife and fisheries objectives. 

So Mr. Chairman, I appreciate the opportunity to appear. 

[The statement of Bruce Stein follows:] 


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Mr. MORAN. Good. Thanks very much. We appreciate that, Dr. 

Stein. Thank you for the testimony. 

We will move on at this point to Mary Sullivan Douglas, who is 

the senior staff associate of the National Association of Clean Air 

Agencies. 

THURSDAY, MARCH 25, 2010. 

NATIONAL ASSOCIATION OF CLEAN AIR AGENCIES 

WITNESS 

MARY SULLIVAN DOUGLAS 

Ms. DOUGLAS. Good morning. As you said, I am Mary Sullivan 

Douglas with the National Association of Clean Air Agencies. The 

members of NACAA are the state and local air pollution control officials in 53 states and territories and over 165 metropolitan areas 

across the country. We thank you for this opportunity to testify on 

EPA’s fiscal year 2011 budget for state and local air pollution control grants. NACAA supports the President’s request for $309.1 million in 

federal grants for state and local air pollution control agencies. 

This amount represents an increase of $82.5 million above last 

year. Air pollution is one of the most pressing public health problems facing our Nation and probably causes more deaths than any 

other issue under this subcommittee’s jurisdiction. In the United 

States, exposure to polluted air results in the premature deaths of 

tens of thousands of people every year and causes many serious 

health problems. According to EPA data, about 127 million people 

lived in counties that exceeded at least one of the health-based air 

quality standards in 2008. In addition, EPA estimates that nearly 

everyone in the United States has an increased cancer risk from 

air pollution of greater than 10 in 1 million where 1 in 1 million 

is generally considered acceptable. 

State and local air quality agencies have struggled with insufficient resources for many years. The Clean Air Act authorizes the 

Federal Government to provide grants for up to 60 percent of the 

cost of state and local air programs while states and localities must 

provide a 40 percent match. In reality, however, state and local air 

agencies provide 77 percent of their budgets while federal grants 

constitute only 23 percent. Clearly, state and local agencies are 

providing far more than their fair share, which is especially difficult now when their budgets are severely strained by the economy. To make matters worse, federal grants have remained stagnant and their purchasing power has actually decreased from inflation by nearly 10 percent over the last 10 years. Last year we surveyed state and local air pollution control agencies and learned 

that there is an annual shortfall of $550 million in federal grants 

for air programs. During all this, state and local responsibilities 

have increased dramatically. These agencies cannot carry out their 

programs effectively with such enormous deficits. 

While the President’s proposed increase does not fully address all 

of our funding needs, we are grateful for it and we support it because it will be very helpful as we continue our efforts to obtain 


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and maintain healthful air quality for our Nation. The proposed 

budget calls for increases in three primary areas. The first is for 

core activities. While new and innovative efforts are necessary, the 

day-to-day activities that are the foundation of our programs are 

essential. The additional funds will support continuing responsibilities and the increasing workload that results as EPA updates its 

health-based air quality standards. These include planning, emission inventories, sophisticated modeling, expanded monitoring networks, and adoption and enforcement of regulations. 

The second area identified for additional grants is increasing capacity for greenhouse gas permitting. State and local agencies need 

to expand their capacity with respect to greenhouse gases so that 

they are able to transition to whatever greenhouse gas program 

EPA develops and are prepared to issue permits to affected 

sources. The increase would be used for planning and analysis, 

source identification, staff development and training, outreach to 

industry, and responding to the public. 

The third area identified for increases is air pollution monitoring. 

State and local agencies must significantly increase their monitoring activities to address the new and revised health-based standards related to ozone, lead, nitrogen dioxide and sulfur dioxide, 

which will require the purchase of additional ambient air monitoring equipment. 

All three of these areas are of critical importance to state and 

local efforts to improve air quality and protect public health and 

are worthy of additional federal resources. 

In conclusion, NACAA recommends that Congress appropriate $309.1 million in federal grants to state and local air quality agencies under sections 103 and 105 of the Clean Air Act as the President requested. 

We thank you for this opportunity to testify, and we thank you 

for your support of clean air programs in the past. 

[The statement of Mary Sullivan Douglas follows:] 


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Mr. MORAN. Thank you, Ms. Douglas. Thank you very much. 

Mr. HINCHEY. Thank you very much. 

Mr. MORAN. The next witness will be Tom Cassidy, director of 

Federal Land programs for the Nature Conservancy. Mr. Cassidy, 

nice to see you again. 

Mr. CASSIDY. Good to see you, sir. 

Mr. MORAN. Thank you. 

THURSDAY, MARCH 25, 2010. 

THE NATURE CONSERVANCY 

WITNESS 

TOM CASSIDY 

Mr. CASSIDY. Mr. Chairman, Mr. Simpson, Mr. Hinchey, I appreciate this opportunity to present the Nature Conservancy’s recommendations for fiscal year 2011 appropriations. My name is Tom 

Cassidy and I am director of federal land programs. I suspect at 

this point in the hearing, as Moe Udall said, everything has been 

said but not everybody has said it. My oral testimony will highlight 

six of the key program areas described in my written testimony. 

First, thank you, Mr. Chairman and also for Chairman Dicks’ 

leadership in restoring critically important funding for the Land 

and Water Conservation Fund. We are gratified by the President’s 

commitment to fully fund LWCF and look forward to working with 

Secretary Salazar and the Congress to secure the funding necessary to protect America’s great outdoors. 

As a member of the Land and Water Conservation Coalition, we 

recommend a funding level of $425 million for the federal side of 

LWCF. This year the Conservancy is specifically recommending 33 

biologically rich land acquisition projects including the Eastern 

Shore of Virginia National Wildlife Refuge, Washington’s Turnbull 

National Wildlife Refuge, and continuing large-scale projects in 

New England’s Silvio Conte National Fish Wildlife Refuge, and the 

Montana Legacy Project. We also support a large multi-partner request in Wisconsin’s Chequamegon-Nicolet National Forest. 

Second, we support a forest legacy funding level of $150 million 

and are specifically proposing six projects totaling $20 million. We 

hope this year to complete the phased acquisition of the Northern 

Cumberlands project, the largest conservation project in Tennessee 

since the creation of Great Smoky Mountains National Park. Other 

priorities include the second phase of projects in New York’s 

Follensby Pond and also in Texas. 

Third, the Conservancy welcomes the President’s commitment to 

address the global climate challenge and supports the Administration’s fiscal year 2011 proposed increases for climate-specific programs and activities. We appreciate this committee’s leadership in 

highlighting climate change adaptation and science funding including the National Climate Change and Wildlife Science Center. 

Fourth, in wildfire management, we appreciate the committee’s 

continued attention to high-cost wildfire and proactive management to reduce fuels and protect communities from damaging fire. 

We have several recommendations including an increase for hazVerDate Mar 15 2010 02:18 May 18, 2010 Jkt 056200 PO 00000 Frm 00351 Fmt 6601 Sfmt 6602 E:\HR\OC\A200P2.XXX A200P2

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ardous fuels reduction by 10 percent over enacted as a necessary 

investment to reduce threats to communities and abate the cost of 

future wildfire and full funding of fire suppression needs through 

a combination of the fire suppression budget, the FLAME Fund 

and the Contingent Reserve Fund. 

Fifth, the Conservancy strongly supports the President’s proposal 

for the Forest Service’s integrated resource restoration budget. We 

recommend full funding for the Collaborative Forest Landscape 

Restoration Program and the Priority Watershed and Job Stabilization Initiative. We also support creation of the integrated resource 

restoration budget by combining formerly separate programs. We 

trust this new budget structure will better enable the Forest Service to provide important ecosystem and public services such as 

clean and abundant water, renewable energy from biomass, restored wildlife and fish habitat, carbon sequestration and healthy 

forests and grasslands. 

Finally, we support an increase for the Cooperative Endangered Species Conservation Fund to $100 million. We and our partners 

including multiple state, county governments and private landowners have used the habitat conservation plan and recovery land 

acquisition programs to secure key habitats for numerous threatened, endangered and at-risk species including through conservation easements on high-priority private lands such as Northern 

Idaho’s Kootenai Valley. 

Thank you for the opportunity to present our testimony. 

[The statement of Tom Cassidy follows:] 


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Mr. MORAN. Good. Thanks. Fully comprehensive. 

Mr. HINCHEY. Thank you for a very good statement. 

Mr. MORAN. Thank you, Mr. Cassidy. Nice to see you. 

Patrick Natale is the final speaker, the executive director of the 

American Society of Civil Engineers. 

THURSDAY, MARCH 25, 2010. 

AMERICAN SOCIETY OF CIVIL ENGINEERS 

WITNESS 

PATRICK J. NATALE 

Mr. NATALE. Thank you, Mr. Chairman, Mr. Simpson and members of the subcommittee. Good morning. I am Patrick Natale, executive director of the American Society of Civil Engineers, and I 

am very pleased to be here to speak to the subcommittee on behalf 

of the American Society of Civil Engineers but also the proposed 

budgets for the Environmental Protection Agency and the U.S. Geological Survey for 2011. First, ASCE recommends that appropriations of $3 billion for the 

Clean Water Act State Revolving Loan Fund for 2011. The President has requested $2 billion for clean water state revolving loans, 

and we support that. Although this reflects the President’s desire 

to deal forcefully with the needs of America’s aging infrastructure 

that serves our water needs, ASCE believes that the 20-year wastewater investment has a gap of approximately $400 billion, which 

requires a greater annual commitment. Our report card that we 

produce every several years talks about the importance of the 

grades on infrastructure. This has a barely passing grade of a D 

minus. Aging wastewater plants discharge billions of gallons of untreated wastewater into U.S. surface waters each year. In 2008, 

EPA reported a total investment need of America’s publicly owned 

treatment works as of January 1, 2004, were at $202.5 billion. This 

reflects an increase of $16.1 billion, or 8.6 percent over the EPA’s 

plan or review from 4 years earlier. 

Many of our systems have reached the end of their useful life. 

Older systems are plagued with chronic overflows during major 

rainstorms, heavy snow melts. Either intentionally or not, this 

brings the discharge of raw sewage into our water systems. EPA 

estimates that in August of 2004, the volume of combined sewage 

overflows discharge nationwide is 850 billion gallons per year. Sanitary-sewer overflows caused by blocked or broken pipes result in 

the release of as much as 10 billion gallons of raw sewage yearly 

into our systems, according to EPA. 

Future investments must be focused on updating, replacing existing systems as well as building new ones to meet the increasing 

demand. Improved operation processes include ongoing oversight, 

evaluation, asset management on a system-wide basis, and the watershed approach is to look more broadly at water resources and coordination with a systematic approach. 

Second, ASCE recommends the appropriation of $2 billion for the 

Safe Drinking Water Act State Revolving Fund for 2011. Like 

wastewater systems, America’s drinking-water systems also had a 


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near-failing grade of a D minus in our report card of 2009. America’s drinking-water systems face annual shortfalls as much as $11 

billion to replace aging facilities and they are near the end of their 

useful lives. This does not account for the growth and demand for 

drinking water over the next 20 years. Leaking pipes are estimated 

to lose 7 billion gallons of clean drinking water every day. Federal 

assistance has not kept pace with the demand. Between 1997 and 

2010, Congress provided $11 billion for the drinking-water state revolving fund through an annual appropriation. This total approximates the annual requirement to meet the needs according to an 

EPA study of 2002. Although drinking-water-treatment operators 

are often able to provide work-arounds during disruptions, the Nation’s drinking-water systems are not highly resistant or resilient 

and present capabilities and failures. They make it up but it is not 

the way to do business. Third and finally, ASCE recommends the appropriation of $1.3 

billion for the USGS in the 2011 fiscal year budget. There is a bit 

of good news here, Mr. Chairman. In a time of fiscal constraint, the 

USGS budget proposal for 2011 represents a 4 percent increase 

over the current fiscal year. The 2011 USGS budget request totals 

of $1.1 billion or $21.6 million above the enacted level of 2010. But 

we believe the agency’s request falls short in several areas of being 

able to meet the needs for basic science in America. 

The President has asked for increases in the programs for renewable energy, climate change, water availability and use, natural 

hazards and Landsat. This is all good. But water resources investigations activity is funded at $228.8 million in 2011, which is $3.5 

million below 2010 enacted levels. The tight budget led the Department to request budget reductions for the Cooperative Water Program, a reduction of $1.9 million from the 2010 levels, and the National Streamflow Information Program was reduced by almost 

$600,000 during this time frame. 

On a positive note, program increases were requested for the Na- tional Water Availability and Use Assessment including $1.1 million for groundwater resource programs and $6.4 million for the 

hydrological networks and analysis but the Cooperative Water Program is funded at $63.6 million, $2 million below the 2010 levels. 

The program builds on the efforts of leveraging state, local and 

tribal funds to support the majority of national hydrologic data networks, stream gauges, wells and monitoring sites. The Water Research Act Program is funded at $6.5 million to promote state, regional and national coordination of the Water Resources Institute 

to facilitate research coordination, information and technology 

transfer. In the agency’s own words, USGS is a multidisciplinary 

science organization focused on biology, geographic geology, 

geospatial information and water. We believe that this type of 

science effort deserves the strongest fiscal support from Congress. 

Mr. Chairman, this concludes my remarks. 

[The statement of Patrick J. Natale follows:] 


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Mr. MORAN. Thanks very much, sir. I appreciate your being willing to testify, Dr. Natale. I guess you are not a doctor but you are 

executive director of American Society of Civil Engineers. 

Mr. NATALE. That is correct. 

Mr. MORAN. It is troubling that we are providing 5 percent of the 

need for clean drinking water and our sanitary-sewer overflows is 

one of the most pressing municipal infrastructure problems facing 

this country. 

Mr. NATALE. I appreciate you understanding that, especially 

since you are my representative. 

Mr. MORAN. Thank you for being here today. Thank you for your 

testimony. 

That will conclude the testimony. I want to thank all the witnesses. 


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THURSDAY, APRIL 15, 2010. 

VOICES FROM OUR NATIVE AMERICAN COMMUNITIES 

Mr. MORAN. We want to say good afternoon to everyone to welcome all of our guests for today’s public witness hearing. We are 

going to hear from our partners and our friends in the Native 

American community this afternoon, and we want to especially 

welcome those who traveled very long distances to be here. We do 

appreciate and respect that. I think I speak for Mr. Cole as well, 

though, we are kind of embarrassed that we cannot spend more 

time with you but because we have so many witnesses, we are 

going to have to restrict the time we are able to hear from you. 

Before we begin I would like to acknowledge the passing of a 

great American leader, the leader of the Cherokee Nation, Chief 

Wilma Mankiller. She passed away on April 6 of this year at her 

home in rural Adair County, Oklahoma. She often spoke of the 

need for Native Americans to speak out, and I think it would be 

appropriate today to honor her with the following quote. 

She said, ‘‘I think the most important issue we have as a people 

is to begin to trust our own thinking again, to articulate our own 

vision of the future, and work to make that vision a reality.’’ 

She once said, ‘‘I want to be remembered as the person who 

helped all of us to restore faith in ourselves,’’ and so shall she be 

remembered. 

In March we held our first Native American witness day. The 

challenges these witnesses brought before us were absolutely 

daunting. Among other issues we heard about the need for better 

access to quality healthcare, the need for clean drinking water on 

any number of reservations, and in several situations the residents 

could not even use the water after it had been boiled and screened, 

and still it was not safe to drink, even to boil food with. We also 

heard about the challenges posed by a shortage of law enforcement 

officers on tribal lands. 

This subcommittee was affected, and we are proud of that. In 

this current year the response to Native American issues that were 

brought before the subcommittee caused us to provide what was an 

historic increase, it was a 10 percent increase in the Bureau of the 

Indian Affairs budget. We funded the Bureau at $2.6 billion. 

This year the Administration has recognized the need for increased funding, particularly for health services. It is an issue that 

is continually raised and appropriately so. So this year’s Indian 

Health Services Budget Request from the Obama Administration 

includes a substantial increase. The request is for $4.4 billion. It 

is a $350 million increase over this current year’s levels, and that 

is in a freeze budget. So almost every other program either got 

what they got last year or less, but the Indian Health Service 

stands out as a very substantial increase. 


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Now, we would, and I mean, we cannot make you stay, obviously, 

but we would strongly urge you, certainly invite all of you, to stay 

for the Indian Health Service hearing that is going to follow right 

on the heels of this. Immediately after this series of hearings we 

are going to hear from Dr. Yvette Roubideaux, who is the Director 

of the Indian Health Service, and I think it is going to be a very 

important hearing. 

A couple of housekeeping things. Everyone is going to be restricted to 5 minutes. It is the only fair way we can do it so we 

treat everybody equally. If you finish before 5 minutes, there is a 

better chance of us being able to get in a question or two. We are 

going to have to watch the timer closely. When the orange light 

comes on, you have only 1 minute left and should begin to wrap 

up, and then when the red light comes on, the time is expired. The 

entire statement will be put into the record; and before we get 

started, Mr. Cole, would you have any comments you would like to 

share with us? 

Mr. COLE. Thank you very much, Mr. Chairman. I love these 

hearings because this room glitters with turquoise when we have 

these, and it makes me feel at home. 

But I want to first begin by following your lead and acknowledge 

the passing of our good friend, Chief Mankiller. I had the privilege 

of knowing her personally, working with her for many years. I was 

very proud that the House of Representatives passed a resolution 

honoring her remarkable life and achievements yesterday, and I do 

not have the exact quote, Mr. Chairman, but she was very famous 

in Indian Country for speaking truth to power, and I cannot recall 

the number of occasions when I heard her introduce herself as 

Wilma Mankiller, Principal Chief of the Cherokee Nation. If the 

United States Government had its way, I would not be chief, and 

there would not be a Cherokee Nation. That is a pretty good thing 

to think about, because that has been historically the policy of the 

country. It has oscillated between, ‘‘assimilation and accommodation and compromise and recognition of tribal sovereignty.’’ Nobody 

was a more articulate and more ferocious defender of tribal sovereignty than Chief Mankiller was, and I know wherever she is at, 

she is watching, and frankly, would be pleased at this assembly. 

I also want to follow your lead in acknowledging the work of our 

former Chairman and last year’s historic increases in our budget. 

It came in large part because of his hard work and his bipartisanship in this area. It was a pleasure for me to get to work with him 

and our current Chairman, Mr. Moran. The Administration has 

kept its commitments to Indian Country and has taken them very, 

very seriously. The Administration continues to do so in this budget, which, again, I concur with the Chairman, I am exceptionally 

pleased with the increases we have seen in Native American and 

Indian healthcare services. 

It is tried but true but the first Americans are the last Americans in a variety of ways. This is particularly obvious in statistics 

like lifespan, health and illness rates. This is a commitment that 

is long overdue in terms of being fulfilled, and we are going to work 

very hard with you, Mr. Chairman, and obviously with our friends 

on both sides of the aisle and with the Administration to make sure 

we continue to build on the progress that was made last year. 


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Frankly, we cannot solve these problems in a single year. We all 

know that. They are decades really, even longer in duration, but 

the fact that we started and made significant steps in this direction 

is something I think this committee can be proud of on a bipartisan 

basis. 

But, again, I particularly want to single out my friend and our 

senior member on this committee, Congressman Dicks, Chairman 

Dicks. He has gone on to other responsibilities. The fact that he is 

here still tells you how focused he continues to be on this community. So thank you for your efforts, and again, thank all of you for 

traveling this distance. I know sometimes you wonder if it matters. 

Believe me, it does. You have been speaking for a long time. I think 

the points you have made are finally being listened to and attended 

to in a systematic fashion. 

So I appreciate that, and Mr. Chairman, appreciate your leadership and look forward to the hearing. 

Mr. MORAN. Thanks very much, Mr. Cole. As Tom has said, Mr. 

Dicks has arrived. Mr. Dicks is now the Chair of the Defense Appropriations Committee, but he left a legacy of substantial increase, particularly for Indian programs and the Native Americans 

throughout the country have benefited from his priority. And so everyone should know the impact that he has had, and we will be 

lucky if we can continue simply in that tradition that he has established. He really set a standard of responsiveness. 

Norm, did you have anything you wanted to say? 

Mr. DICKS. Mr. Chairman, I would like to thank you for yielding, 

and I want to congratulate you for continuing to have this hearing, 

which is very important, and I think our committee has worked on 

a very bipartisan basis on Indian health, on contract support costs, 

and on urban health clinics. Yourself and Mr. Cole and all the 

other members have been very supportive of this. I look forward to 

hearing from the witnesses, I appreciate your leadership, and I 

wish you well as the new Chairman of the subcommittee. 

Mr. MORAN. Thank you very much, Mr. Dicks, and of course, Mr. 

Cole, thank you very much for your comments and very appropriately giving Mr. Dicks the recognition that he clearly deserves. 

Our first witness will be Clarence Skye, the Executive Director 

of the United Sioux Tribes Development Corporation. Mr. Skye, 

welcome. 

THURSDAY, APRIL 15, 2010. 

UNITED SIOUX TRIBES DEVELOPMENT CORPORATION 

WITNESS 

CLARENCE SKYE 

Mr. SKYE. Good afternoon, Chairman James Moran and Representative Cole and Representative Norm Dicks we first met back 

in 1984. So I am a little old. 

Appreciate testifying before the House of Representatives Committee on Appropriations and Subcommittee on Interior, Environmental, and Related Agencies. The United Sioux tribes is made up 

of Sioux tribes in North Dakota, South Dakota, Nebraska, and they 


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were once the Great Sioux Nation, and with the Great Sioux Nation they had treaties, and they were very sovereign people and 

proud people back in the early days. 

And like the gentleman said, what Wilma Mankiller said, we are 

not the Great Sioux Nation yet today, but we will be as long as we 

get the things we need and the appropriation. We have a dialect, 

which is the Lakota, Nakota and Dakota Sioux tribes, and they are 

in North Dakota, South Dakota, Nebraska, Minnesota, and Montana. 

What we are asking for in the agency programs, and the funding request, is to appropriate $1.2 million for the Indian Jobs Placement Program through the United Sioux Tribes Development Corporation under CFDA number 15.061, otherwise listed as United 

Sioux Tribes Fund Assistance Program. That is a very important 

program because what we do is we create jobs. We go out and work 

with the employers, we work with different companies, and we ask 

them to find employment for our Indian people. The Indian person—or tribal members I should say—come into our office, and 

they either come from the Oglala Reservation, the Rosebud Reservation, the Cheyenne River Reservation, the Standing Rock Reservation, which I am from, the Lower Brule or the Crow Creek and 

the Santee Reservation and the Yankton Reservation. 

They come in from their reservation, and there is no work. The 

other day we had a lady, a single parent with six kids, all the way 

down to 3 years old. They had runny noses, and the clothes were 

not in good shape, and they were real poor, and I dealt with them. 

We went and found them a place to live, and we found them food 

stamps, and we went to the state and got after them because under 

state’s rights the states are cannibalizing federal programs. They 

are getting a lot of federal programs, and we are not privy to them, 

and we hope that with what I just said that it will make a difference when state officials testify before you on whether the people are participating in those programs. They send the money back 

to the Federal Government and say, no participation, no activity. 

And so, you know, we do not get to be a part of that. 

I will get over my emotionalism here. The other program that we 

are working on is to authorize $1.2 million for a National Tribal 

Cultural Resource Database, and we are working with U.S. Geological Survey, and we have a memorandum of understanding with 

them, and right now we are redoing that because what they do is 

satellite photographing of the land, and we are starting with the 

demonstration project with two reservations. We would like two 

under the appropriation. 

And what it does is like, when you go to a hospital, you get an 

MRI. Well, with the satellite photographing, they do an MRI of the 

land. With all the pipelines and gas lines and oil lines moving into 

the country, we want to be sure that we have those areas mapped; 

the sacred sites, the funeral remains, and artifacts, so that they do 

not get destroyed. 

Right now we have the state level signing off and approving the 

progress of the Keystone Pipeline. We want to have this program, 

and we want to work with the Harvard University to help us do 

some of the research. We are trying to get more of our Indian students into the science and math area with the tribal colleges, and 


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so that is one of the purposes of working with the U.S. Geological 

Survey. Rosebud Sioux Tribe, the college, Sinte Gleska University, 

already has an agreement with USGS, and they are making their 

attempts, but we want to do this overall. 

Mr. Chairman, I would like to end my testimony by saying that 

I appreciate and congratulate Congressman Norm Dicks. He has 

been very helpful over the years, and it is hard to see somebody 

go, but changes got to be made. Thank you. 

[The statement of Mr. Skye follows:] 


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Mr. MORAN. Thank you, Mr. Skye. We are going to do everything 

we can to see that Native American people are not disadvantaged 

by the fact that Norm is no longer Chair, and he is the Vice-Chair 

of the committee, and we have a very strong advocate particularly 

in Mr. Cole. 

The folks, the communities that you pull together that were in 

such desperate poverty, how long ago was that? 

Mr. SKYE. Mr. Chairman, we did that way back there in 1969. 

Mr. MORAN. Yes. 

Mr. SKYE. And we had done a lot of work to be sanctioned, the 

organization was sanctioned by all the Tribal Councils. It was 

voted on by resolution, and our main purpose was to do economic 

development, but then as the Indian people became more aware of 

the organization, they demanded more things of me, so I had to—— 

Mr. MORAN. Right. Yes. 

Mr. SKYE [continuing]. Do education and everything else. 

Mr. MORAN. I just wanted to fully understand that fact. Well, I 

am sure you have made a very positive difference, and we appreciate you caring as much as you do. 

Mr. SKYE. Thank you very much. 

Mr. MORAN. Thank you, Mr. Skye. Were there any questions? 

Mr. COLE. Quick comment, Mr. Chairman. 

Mr. MORAN. Yes. Mr. Cole. 

Mr. COLE. I just wanted to thank you for two things. First in 

your testimony, I really appreciate the fact you mentioned the roles 

of President Nixon, Ford, and Reagan played in reestablishing selfdetermination and frankly how much better that has made things, 

because we deal with folks much better if we are dealing with Tribal Governments than trying to deal with isolated individuals. 

Second, I really want to echo the point that you made about the 

mapping program and the archeological work. Mr. Chairman, I had 

occasion last week when we were on break to visit the Oklahoma 

Archeological Site at the University of Oklahoma, and of course, 

my fellow Chickasaw, Lieutenant Governor Keel is here, we are 

newcomers to Oklahoma. We have only been there since 1830, but 

they have identified 25,000 archeological sites in Oklahoma that 

they have catalogued and some of them going back 11,000 years to 

buffalo-kill sites in the western part of the state. 

So getting that identified is important. We all mentioned something about Chief Mankiller. She used to have a wonderful saying, 

‘‘You do not know who you are until you know who you were.’’ That 

is a very farsighted emphasis on your part, I think, to help us uncover and preserve what is a long, deep, rich history in this continent. 

Mr. SKYE. Thanks very much. 

Mr. MORAN. Thanks very much, Mr. Cole. 

We have also been joined by Mr. Simpson. Thanks for joining us. 

Very good. Thank you, Mr. Skye. 

Mr. SKYE. Thank you. 

Mr. MORAN. Thank you. Next we will hear from Andy Joseph, 

who is the Chairperson of the Northwest Portland Area Indian 

Health Board, Oregon. Mr. Joseph. 


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THURSDAY, APRIL 15, 2010. 

NORTHWEST PORTLAND AREA INDIAN HEALTH BOARD 

WITNESS 

ANDY JOSEPH 

Mr. JOSEPH. Good morning, Chairman Moran, Ranking Member 

Simpson, and Mr. Cole and Honorable Mr. Norm Dicks. I am Andy 

Joseph, Jr. I chair the Portland Area Indian Health Board in the 

Health and Human Services Committee for the confederated tribes 

of the Colville Indian Reservation. For 21 years our organization 

has conducted a detailed analysis of the IHS budget. It is used by 

Congress and the Administration, the Indian Health Advocate nationally. I am here today to provide our recommendations for IHS 

fiscal year 2011 budget. 

I want to begin by underscoring the significant health disparities 

that Indian people face and the progress we have made to address 

them over the last 30 years since IHS was established in 1954, has 

reduced maternal mortality by 64 percent, reduced cervical cancer 

by 76 percent, reduced tuberculosis mortality by 80 percent. The 

average death rate has lowered by 29 percent. 

Despite these improvements, Indian people continue to have the 

highest disparities in the United States; 400 percent more likely to 

die of tuberculosis, 91 percent more likely to die of suicide, 300 percent more likely to die of diabetes complication, 67 percent more 

likely to die of pneumonia or influenza. Because of these health disparities, the funding recommendations this committee makes to the 

Appropriations Committee are critical to improving the health status of our people. 

The fundamental budget principle of the Northwest Tribes is 

that you must maintain the basic health program. To do this Congress must provide adequate funding to cover pay increases, inflation, population growth, and contract support costs. If these costs 

are not funded, tribes have no alternative but to cut health services 

to absorb these mandatory costs. 

We recommend for fiscal year 2011 that at least $469 million increase be provided to the Indian Health Service as follows. We urge 

the committee to take into consideration actual medical inflation. 

The IHS Congressional justification uses a 3.3 percent inflation 

rate to calculate need in fiscal year 2011. Comparatively, the CPI 

inflation rates for hospital services is over 7 percent and for hospital outpatient services is over 8 percent. 

We recommend the committee provide $268 million to fund medical inflation for IHS Programs and at least $80 million of this to 

provide for CHS Program. The Senate Committee on Indian Affairs 

reports unmet need in the CHS Program to be at least $1 billion, 

and an $80 million increase is reasonable. 

We recommend that at least $60 million be provided to fund population growth in the Portland area. Our user population last year 

grew by 2.4 percent, and unless funding is provided for population 

growth, services will have to be cut. 

We recommend a $146 million increase to contract support costs 

for funding ongoing CSC needs. Funds to support past years shortVerDate Mar 15 2010 02:18 May 18, 2010 Jkt 056200 PO 00000 Frm 00375 Fmt 6601 Sfmt 6602 E:\HR\OC\A200P2.XXX A200P2

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falls owed to tribes who have assumed programs on behalf of the 

IHS. 

Health reform holds great potential for Indian people, and we encourage the subcommittee to begin thinking about how it can assist 

tribes to implement and benefit from health reform. The IHS system does not have the same capacity to provide comparable 

healthcare services across its system. Because of this, not all Indian people will benefit on an equal basis in health reform. This 

is a result in the varying levels of IHS funding. 

Facilities, infrastructure, staffing packages, and third party collections used to provide healthcare. To address these we recommend two things. First, funding provided for the Indian 

Healthcare Improvement Fund and through CHS Program must be 

carefully evaluated to consider the unique needs and circumstances 

of CHS-dependent areas. We further recommend that the subcommittee monitor the IHS to make sure that the resources are allocated carefully and fairly in the Indian Healthcare Improvement 

Fund and in the CHS Program. Otherwise it will continue to perpetuate the inequities in the level of care provided across the system. 

Second, we recommend that the committee encourage the IHS to 

explore alternative, innovative ideas for facilities’ construction that 

will allow tribes to develop additional infrastructure, staffing capacities to provide health services that will be expanded under 

health reform. Examples of this includes adding staffing packages 

to the Small Ambulatory Constriction Program and develop regional referral specialty care centers to maximize CHS funding. 

I thank you, and I am happy to take any questions you might 

have. 

[The statement of Mr. Joseph follows:] 


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Mr. JOSEPH. You know, one time I had breakfast with Norm 

Dicks, and—— 

Mr. MORAN. And you still remember it? That must have been 

quite a breakfast. 

Mr. JOSEPH. He asked me where I was from, and I told him from 

the Colville Indian Reservation, and he said, do you know Lucy 

Covington? I said, yeah, that is my grand aunt. He says, well, she 

never used to ask us for anything. She would tell us what we were 

going to do for you. So as a tribal leader, government to government, I ask you to or I tell you to—this is what I want you to do 

for us. 

But thank you, Norm Dicks, for all your time that you have 

helped us. 

Mr. DICKS. Thank you. 

Mr. MORAN. Good for you. Thank you very much, Mr. Joseph. 

Very good. Well done. You could have actually just made that 

statement, and it would have sufficed on the written testimony. 

Next we will hear from Fawn Sharp, who is the President of the 

Quinault Indian Nation in Washington State. Ms. Sharp. 

Mr. DICKS. Welcome, Fawn. 

THURSDAY, APRIL 15, 2010. 

QUINAULT INDIAN NATION 

WITNESS 

FAWN SHARP 

Ms. SHARP. Thank you, Chairman. First of all, I would like to 

congratulate you on this new post, and I would also like to congratulate the committee as a whole for the amazing accomplishments and success of the work of this committee over the last year 

and especially to our representative, Congressman Norm Dicks. 

Norm, thank you for your dedication and effort to Indian Country. 

I have three basic initiatives, priorities I would like to mention 

for and on behalf of the Quinault people, but before I do that I 

would like to first of all draw your attention to the first page of 

our testimony. We have laid out our recommendations in support 

of the affiliated tribes to the Northwest Indians, the Northwest 

Portland Area Indian Health Board, and the Northwest Indian 

Fisheries Commission. We have also identified a number of national and self-governance requests and recommendations that we 

would like to lend the support of the Quinault Indian Nation to. 

The first item that we would like to provide testimony on relates 

to the Quinault River Blueback Restoration Project. For those of 

you that are not familiar with that project, two years ago the 

Quinault Indian Nation looked at the Upper Quinault, and we saw 

widespread decimation of the flood plain. We saw houses being 

pulled into the river, we saw infrastructure being destroyed. For 

the last century the Upper Quinault has been wildly shifting from 

the north to the south. 

Now, we do have our own vision for what we would like to see 

in the Upper Quinault. It is about an 80-year vision. This is what 

we call a legacy plan that the Quinault Nation is putting together. 


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We would like to see a mature, stable forest in place, large carbon 

sinks. It is an opportunity that we not only stabilize and secure 

local communities and infrastructure but to provide restoration to 

our sacred Blueback salmon. 

Along the way this project is going to create 20 to 30 jobs for construction. It is going to provide a sustainable economy for well over 

100 commercial fishermen and 25 sport fishing guides. So it is a 

project that we have enlisted the local community, the state, the 

Army Corps of Engineers, and it is going to take 80 years to see 

this vision come to fruition, but in the last two years we have 

taken our very first step. We have constructed 12 engineered log 

jams and are proving to be effective. The river has shifted to the 

north, and that entire bank has been secure. So in a short period 

of time we have seen immediate success, and we plan to do that 

through fiscal year 2019. Maybe when I am 86 years I will see mature forests in the flood plain. I will be 40 next month, Norm. 

Mr. DICKS. Too long to wait. 

Ms. SHARP. The next item that I would like to speak to you about 

is a request that we have for resource protection and enforcement. 

The Quinault Nation is comprised of over 200,000 acres of forest 

and lands. There are 22 points of entry into the interior of our reservation from Lake Quinault to the Queets community. We have 

seen widespread natural resource looting, a destruction of our sacred materials that we use for basketry. We also would like to step 

up enforcement and provide six additional enforcement officers for 

our fishery, wildlife, and securing our treaty-based resources. 

So we want to provide a comprehensive approach to ensuring 

those that are recklessly disregarding our laws that we have in 

place to ensure that our resources are sustained into the future are 

brought to justice. 

The last item that I would like to speak to you about is our Comprehensive Substance Abuse Strategy. The Quinault Nation is 

seeking $500,000 to step up our Substance Abuse Comprehensive 

Strategy to seek, not only treatment, but prevention, after we have 

seen widespread and prolific increase to prescription pain medication, as well as the continued threat of methamphetamine within 

our communities. 

Our Comprehensive Strategy is seeking to leverage participation 

throughout the community. We have encouraged collaborative relationships with governmental departments, health authorities, medical professionals, community members, churches, and families. We 

see and recognize that to address drugs in our community it is 

going to take a comprehensive, widespread approach throughout 

the entire Nation and our local community. 

So with that I would like to thank this committee. It has been 

a pleasure, and I do thank you for your time. 

[The statement of Ms. Sharp follows:] 


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Mr. MORAN. Thank you, Ms. Sharp. Thank you very much. 

Mr. Dicks. 

Mr. DICKS. I just want to say to Fawn that we are glad you are 

here, and we know this Blueback salmon issue is serious, and we 

appreciated your supplies that were sent to the event last week, 

and we thank you very much. 

Ms. SHARP. Excellent. 

Mr. DICKS. Thank you. 

Mr. MORAN. Thank you, Ms. Sharp. 

All right. Next we will hear from Jefferson Keel, the President 

of the National Congress of American Indians. Nice to see you, Mr. 

Keel. 

THURSDAY, APRIL 15, 2010. 

NATIONAL CONGRESS OF AMERICAN INDIANS 

WITNESS 

JEFFERSON KEEL 

Mr. KEEL. Thank you. Good afternoon, Mr. Chairman. 

Mr. MORAN. Good afternoon. 

Mr. KEEL. Congressman Cole, Congressman Dicks, Mr. Simpson. 

Thank you for allowing us this opportunity to bring to you some 

items of interest in Indian Country. 

The first area I will address is public safety and justice. In Interior, the Administration has proposed an Empowering Tribal Nations, Protecting Indian Country Initiative that provides an additional $20 million in program funding over the fiscal year 2010, enacted level. The Department of the Interior is to collaborate with 

Justice for additional FBI agents dedicated to protecting Indian 

lands. 

NCAI has concerns about the proposed transfer of law enforcement funds from Interior to the FBI. In the 1980s the Reagan Administration transferred the entire BIA budget for investigations to 

the FBI. Even though these funds are now built into the FBI budget, the FBI has sometimes lost sight of its mission to provide these 

services to Indian Country. 

In addition, tribal leaders have consistently stated that the highest need is to provide more funding and more consistent funding 

for regular policing budgets. From 2005, to 2010, funding for BIA 

law enforcement has risen by 68.4 percent, from $180 million to 

$303 million. The major purpose of this increase was to put more 

cops on the street to combat violent crime, which is what tribal 

leaders have called for. 

Upon review of the Law Enforcement Spending Plan for fiscal 

years 2005 to 2009, the greatest percentage of increases went to 

the BIA Central Office, BIA District Commands, and the BIA Direct Service Operations. The smallest increases went to 638 and 

self-governance tribes. We would urge the subcommittee to ensure 

that substantial law enforcement funding increases make it down 

to the tribal level and provide the needed boots on the ground. 

Next is Energy and Natural Resource Programs. The President’s 

fiscal year 2011, budget request for EPA would establish a new focused, multi-media Tribal Implementation Grants Program to support on-the-ground implementation of environmental protection on 


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tribal lands. These grants for which $30 million is requested are 

tailored to address an individual tribe’s most serious environmental 

needs. We support this initiative, and we also support the $8.5 million increase for the General Assistance Program and the proposed 

percentage increase from 1.5 percent to 2 percent for the tribal setasides under both the Clean Water and Drinking Water State Revolving Funds. The 2011 budget request includes $2.5 million for energy projects 

given the potential for development of both conventional and renewable energy resources on tribal lands and the drastic impacts 

that climate change have in Indian and Alaskan native communities. NCAI supports these requested increases with hope that 

such funding could be sustained and increased in future years. 

We also support the requested increases in the Water Management Planning and Pre-Development, especially given level funding 

over a number of years for the BIA Natural Resources Programs. The 2011 budget proposes an increase of $28 million in Tribal 

Priority Allocations, TPA, which is 3.4 percent above the fiscal year 

2010 enacted level. TPA funds the core governmental services that 

tribes provide to their citizens. We would like to request a general 

increase to TPA and BIA in general that takes into account inflation, pay costs, and population growth. As with other federal agencies, calculating mandatory cost increases is essential to maintaining the current level of services. These mandatories are unavoidable costs and include inflation, pay costs, and population growth 

as stated. 

If these mandatory requirements are not funded, tribes have no 

choice but to cut services, which further reduces the quantity and 

quality of core governmental services available to our Native people. 

To put this in context, over the last eight years of the largest six 

Interior agencies, BIA received the smallest percentage increase of 

11.3 percent, while the Fish and Wildlife Service budget expanded 

by 26 percent, and the National Park Service grew by 21 percent. 

NCAI and tribes understand your subcommittee must weigh many 

needs and priorities, but we hope that we can work with you to ensure trust responsibility to tribes is honored in the budget process. 

Again, thank you for the opportunity to testify this afternoon. 

[The statement of Mr. Keel follows:] 


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Mr. MORAN. Mr. Cole. 

Mr. COLE. Thank you very much. First of all, I have got to point 

out just for the committee, Mr. Keel wears two hats. He is also the 

Lieutenant Governor of my tribe, Chickasaw Nation, and we are 

very proud of that and frankly, very proud of the fact that before 

he was involved in tribal government, he was busy defending the 

United States of America for most of his career as a professional 

solider. So thank you for that. 

I do have one question. It really does not relate to your testimony 

because I know you are here from NCAI, but one of the things I 

would like the committee to be aware of and I am sure we will talk 

about in the next session, is the Joint Venture Opportunity in 

Healthcare that the Chickasaws have undertaken with the BIA, because I think this is a way forward, particularly for tribes that are 

able to generate economic activity. 

In my district, Mr. Chairman, currently the Chickasaws are building a $170 million hospital, there was no federal money involved in the construction activity, but obviously there will be federal support in an ongoing basis in terms of the operation. So talking about that as an alternative or an additional model I think is 

very important for this committee to understand what the range of 

possibilities there might be for all tribes. 

Mr. MORAN. Very good. 

Mr. KEEL. Absolutely. The opportunity there, and as Congressman Cole just mentioned, there are some tribes that have the ability to enter into these joint venture arrangements with the Federal 

Government, and that is that the tribe can construct a hospital, in 

our case we are constructing a hospital, and we simply asked the 

Indian Health Service to staff it, and we already have a hospital, 

but we are asking for a little bit of an increase in the staffing to 

raise the level and quality of services that are provided to Indian 

people. 

In Southern Oklahoma we currently have a hospital that was 

built in 1980, to serve about 50,000 outpatient visits per year. For 

the last 7 years we have been over 350,000 visits per year. So, you 

know, we outgrew the need for that. We outgrew it 15 years ago, 

and so it is time for us to be able to meet the needs of the Indian 

people, and this hospital will go a long way in ensuring that. 

We think it is a great model and something that Indian Country 

could model in the future. 

Mr. MORAN. Sounds like it is. 

Mr. COLE. It is. It is amazing. 

Mr. MORAN. I wish we could duplicate that all over the country 

on reservations but good. Thank you. 

Mr. SIMPSON. Mr. Chairman. You mentioned something that I 

think bothers this committee a little bit, and that is the concern 

that you expressed that we express also, transferring the law enforcement funds from Interior to BIA. 

As I understand it, one of the problems that the FBI has when 

they prosecute crimes on a reservation is that they go there, and 

oftentimes at the crime scene, the first officer that is going to be 

there is your local tribal officer and oftentimes they do not have the 

training and so forth to secure a crime scene, and so when the evidence gets disturbed, they have difficulty prosecuting a crime. 


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Would not we be better off in pushing those funds down to train 

the tribal officers in securing crime scenes and those types of 

things rather than giving it to the FBI? 

Mr. KEEL. Absolutely. That is exactly our point, that we believe 

that if we had adequate funding, we could train our local police 

forces in exactly that, in treating crime scenes, making the appropriate arrests when time is of the essence, and prosecuting crimes 

on Indian Country. 

Mr. SIMPSON. Well, Mr. Chairman, as we have talked about in 

prior hearings, I still think it would be a good idea when we have 

our hearing schedule over the whole joint hearing with Commerce, 

justill, Science, about this issue and talk to them about it and 

maybe a little joint hearing. 

Mr. MORAN. Absolutely. Thank you, Mr. Simpson. 

Mr. KEEL. Thank you very much. 

Mr. MORAN. Thank you very much. Good testimony, Mr. Keel. 

Now we will hear from Nate Tyler, who is the Vice-Chair of the 

Makah Tribal Council in Washington State. 

THURSDAY, APRIL 15, 2010. 

MAKAH TRIBAL COUNCIL 

WITNESS 

NATE TYLER 

Mr. TYLER. Good afternoon. First and foremost I would like to 

congratulate you on your Chairmanship. Also, I would like to thank 

Mr. Norm Dicks for everything you have done for all tribes, your 

commitment, your dedication. We appreciate that. 

Mr. DICKS. Thank you. 

Mr. TYLER. Especially the Makah Tribe. 

Mr. DICKS. Thank you. 

Mr. TYLER. My name is Chelup. My family name means warrior. 

I was given the name Chelup after the Gulf War and Somalia. I 

am joined by T. J. Greene, Makah Tribal Council Treasurer. We 

have four priority issues: assistance for our decrepit jail, increased 

contract support costs for our Indian Health Service, which we 

compacted in ’06, assistance from CERCLA or the Defense Department for helping us close the Warmhouse Beach Dump on the 

Makah Reservation, and we are asking for the National Park Service to consult with the tribes on their expansion plans in the Lake 

Ozette area. 

The current public safety correctional facility is totally inadequate in size, capacity, and design for our community’s needs. BIA 

did an audit in 2001, and found it in non-compliance with almost 

all of the BIA’s detention facility standards, and it has gotten 

worse since then. Our tribe wants to repair the current facility by 

the most cost-effective means possible to meet minimum standards. 

We believe the best way to do that is purchase a modular unit that 

can be attached to the existing facility. It will be able to house inmates, as well as making improvements to the existing building for 

administrative uses and to the adjoining grounds. 


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We seek Congress’s support for our modest Byrne Discretionary 

Grant request of $105,200 to cover 80 percent of the cost of improvements to the existing building and grounds, remodeling the 

kitchen and laundry, providing new water and sewer connections, 

repairing or replacing the HVAC system, new vents and new security camera and better lighting. This request will help us provide 

a correctional facility that meets the public safety and public 

health needs of our community. 

Contract support costs. In 2006, we compacted with the Indian 

Health Service. For 3 years we did not see an increase. We were 

stuck at 14 percent contract support costs, and you know, we spent 

a lot of effort coming back and forth between the Pacific Northwest 

and Washington, DC, and Maryland and Portland. A lot of effort 

was put into that, and once again, we do thank, Mr. Dicks and this 

subcommittee, on what they have done as far as contract support 

costs go. 

Mr. MORAN. I think the average is about 12 percent. 

Mr. DICKS. No. It is much higher. They went to 12 percent—— 

Mr. MORAN. Average is probably about—— 

Mr. TYLER. We are currently sitting at about 88 percent. 

Mr. DICKS. What would it be across the board for most tribes? 

Mr. MORAN. Of the total project the cost for support costs, that 

ratio is about 12 percent across the board, I believe. In other 

words, the overhead. It is about 12 percent for contract support 

costs. 

Mr. TYLER. We urge this subcommittee to continue in the efforts 

of trying to close that gap and fund it at 100 percent. 

The Warmhouse Beach Dump. The Makah Tribe has taken aggressive steps, we have been for the last 3 years to address this serious environmental issue and the health risks posed by the Open 

Beach Dump. It is a decade-old landfill started by the DOD and 

used by the DOD and other federal agencies. It is leaking harmful 

chemicals into nearby streams which flows into the pristine waters 

of the Straits of Juan de Fuca, a traditional shell fishing location 

for the Makah people. 

We have initiated processes that could lead to the listing of the 

dump on EPA’s list of Superfund sites. We will begin construction 

soon of a transfer station that would handle all the on-reservation 

garbage needs. 

As a result of the legacy of waste disposed by federal agencies 

on tribal land, Federal Government bears substantial responsibility 

for cleaning up the dump. The tribe has served a demand letter on 

the Defense Department seeking federal monetary contribution to 

the tribe’s clean-up effort, which is projected to cost between $6 

and $10 million. 

We have waited many years and tried many different avenues to 

close this dump. We believe that our latest actions are a necessary 

last resort to protect the health of our citizens and would appreciate the subcommittee’s support of our efforts. 

Olympic National Park. The Olympic National Park is talking 

about expanding up to 12,000 acres in our traditional UNA. They 

are looking at currently an expansion of 240 acres. Friday was the 

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with the Park Service. The Superintendent did come out to the 

Makah Reservation. 

We filed comments on the proposal, which focused on the needs 

from the National Park Service to engage in government-to-government consultation with the Makah Tribe regarding this proposed 

boundary expansion in order to ensure that it does not impair the 

treaty hunting and gathering rights of the Makah Tribe in this 

area. Our tribe reserved the right to hunt and gather on ‘‘open and 

unclaimed lands’’ in the 1855 Treaty of Neah Bay. This land falls 

within the ceded territory that would give them up. 

So we request Congressional legislation to implement this boundary expansion to include a treaty savings clause, to ensure that our 

tribe’s existing treaty rights on these lands are preserved. In the 

meantime we have started that discussion with the Park Service, 

and that happened this last Friday. 

We appreciate your time, and we do thank you guys for everything you have done this past year. 

[The statement of Mr. Tyler follows:] 


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Mr. MORAN. Thank you very much, sir. We appreciate your testimony, Mr. Tyler. 

Mr. SIMPSON. Just one question. 

Mr. MORAN. Mr. Simpson. 

Mr. SIMPSON. You mentioned the jail facility you have. I never 

realized before until we started having all the testimony, that there 

are many tribes in the Pacific Northwest in the Puget Sound area, 

and I suspect a lot of them have the same issue with jail facilities 

and so forth. 

Have you ever looked at regional facilities? Several tribes getting 

together and building a regional facility to address those needs? 

Mr. TYLER. You know, we are at the beginning of the world. You 

know, we are probably a good hour and 40 minutes to the closest 

city, the closest reservation to us that would—— 

Mr. DICKS. They are right at the northwest corner. You have the 

Pacific Ocean, and the Straits of Juan de Fuca. 

Mr. TYLER. Yeah. 

Mr. DICKS. Makah is right there at the northwest corner of the 

lower 48. So they are pretty isolated. 

Mr. SIMPSON. Okay. 

Mr. DICKS. The Quinaults are a couple of hours south and—— 

Mr. TYLER. Three hours south. 

Mr. DICKS [continuing]. The Elwas are in Port Angeles, which is 

at least an hour and a half or two. 

Mr. TYLER. Yes. 

Mr. DICKS. So that is a ways away. 

Mr. SIMPSON. But conceptually it is a good idea. 

Mr. DICKS. It is a good idea. 

Mr. SIMPSON. Yeah. 

Mr. GREENE. Congressman, if I can real quick just respond to 

that a little bit, I am T. J. Greene. I am the Treasurer for the 

Makah Tribe. I am the former chief of police for the Makah Tribe 

also. 

We did look at regionalization, talked with other tribes on it, and 

one of the issues with it, with doing a regionalization plan is because of our remote locations, the costs of staffing, transportation, 

and all those types of overhead costs go up dramatically when you 

do that, so it creates an extra burden for the tribes in our region 

when we do those sort of things. And those are not quite addressed 

through that regionalization planning when we do that. 

And if I can real quick also speak in support of something President Keel touched on, on the funding coming down to the officer 

level. You know, that makes a great difference. When I was the 

chief of police, I focused hard on training, and we had a serious incident that occurred on our reservation involving a non-member, an 

assault rifle, and while the FBI and local sheriff were trying to sort 

out jurisdictional issues, our officers were the ones processing the 

crime scene, did it from beginning to end, and turned the case over 

to the FBI. The FBI had no problems at all with that case. They 

were impressed with the level of training, the level of the skill that 

was provided by our officers, so that makes a real difference when 

that sort of thing can happen. 

Mr. MORAN. Thanks very much. Appreciate it, Mr. Greene. 

Thank you. 


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Mr. DICKS. I need to ask one question. Is your dad Dan Greene? 

Mr. GREENE. That is my brother. 

Mr. DICKS. Your brother. Wonderful. 

Mr. GREENE. Thank you. 

Mr. DICKS. We fished a lot together up there. 

Mr. MORAN. All right. The next witness will be Sam Penney. He 

is actually the Chairman of the Nez Perce Tribal Executive Committee from Idaho. So this is going to be Mr. Simpson’s fan club, 

and we just apparently heard from Mr. Dicks’ fan club. Well deserved. 

Mr. DICKS. Thank you. 

Mr. MORAN. Mr. Penney. 

THURSDAY, APRIL 15, 2010. 

NEZ PERCE TRIBAL EXECUTIVE COMMITTEE 

WITNESS 

SAM PENNEY 

Mr. PENNEY. Good afternoon, Mr. Chairman, members of the 

committee, and I would like to congratulate as well Congressman 

Dicks from the Northwest and Mike Simpson from Idaho’s second 

district. 

I have submitted my testimony for the record, and I would just 

like to say a few things briefly. 

As with any government the Nez Perce Tribe provides a wide variety of services, not only to our tribe members, but also to the 

community at large. The Nez Perce Tribe operates a health clinic 

with a satellite office and a tribal police force of 16 officers. We 

have a social service department, a comprehensive natural resource 

program that does work in forestry, wildlife management, land 

services, and land management, habitat restoration, air quality, 

smoke management, water quality and sewer service. We also have 

one of the largest fisheries department of any tribe in the country. 

We have a fishery’s office in Lapwai, Idaho, Orofino, Idaho, McCall, 

Idaho, and one office in Joseph, Oregon, and we do a lot of work 

on the restoration of listed species under the ESA. 

I will speak briefly on several related agencies as well, Mr. 

Chairman. The tribe supports the President’s 8.7 increase in spending for the Indian Health Service. As I mentioned, the Nez Perce 

Tribe operates two clinics. For example, under Nimiipuu Health, 

we served approximately 3,800 patients in 2009, with a contract 

health service expenditure of $4.5 million in 2009, but had an appropriation of only $3.3 million, which is a huge shortfall. Many 

times you hear about the deferred services for tribe members, and 

often we hear here in Washington the term, health rationing, and 

that is actually what it is. It ends up to health rationing of our 

tribal members’ health. 

Let us speak briefly about BIA. The Nez Perce Tribe supports 

President Obama’s budget request regarding increased spending for 

the BIA with an increased emphasis on law enforcement and trust 

land management. I think we are all familiar with the Cobell case 


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and all the related issues regarding records, land titles, surveys, 

just a number of things that go along with Cobell. 

The Nez Perce Tribe also supports increased funding for law enforcement. The Nez Perce Tribe currently, because of the shortfall 

in our contract, contributed about $600,000 a year to law enforcement. That currently comes out of our fuels taxes to make up that 

shortfall. 

The tribe also supports increased funding for the law enforcement and public safety in the Protecting Indian Country Initiative. 

The Nez Perce Reservation covers about 1,200 square miles and 

covers five counties and has a mixture of tribal and non-tribal residents. Since I testified here last March there have been two incidents where a tribal member was shot fatally. Both of these incidents have created a sense of unease on the reservation. Proper 

funding for the federal authorities, in conjunction with passage of 

the Tribal Law and Order Act, is needed. 

What was apparent to me, Mr. Chairman, during the two shootings I referred to was the coordination that is needed between the 

U.S. Attorney General’s Office, the FBI, and the Office of Law Enforcement Services under the BIA. 

I will speak a little bit about the Snake River Basin Adjudication. In 2004, the Snake River Basin Water Act was enacted. A 

component of that agreement was a transfer of 11,000 acres of 

BLM land within the reservation to the Nez Perce Tribe. The lands 

were supposed to be surveyed as part of the transfer, but funding 

for those surveys has not been made to this date. The current 

budget calls for $695,000 for this year to begin that process. Although this will not cover the full cost of the surveys, it will be a 

great start to getting that project done. 

Also, Mr. Chairman, I will speak briefly about EPA. The tribe was pleased that Administrator Lisa Jackson proposed a $1.3 billion for state and tribal partnerships when she testified before this 

committee. In addition to the Air Quality Program, the tribe is currently in facilitation discussions with the State of Idaho that are 

being funded through grants from EPA. The facilitated discretion 

involves the tribe adopting water quality standards to improve 

water quality on the Nez Perce Reservation, and we look forward 

to continued funding to continue that process. 

Under the U.S. Forest Service the tribe also supports increased 

funding for the U.S. Forest Service in the protection of treaty reserved rights. Under our treaty of 1855, the treaty-reserved hunting, fishing, gathering rights are very important to the Nez Perce 

people. Our areas are rich in natural resources. We have had a 

good working relationship with the Forest Service. We have a forest agreement where the forest supervisors come to meet with us 

to discuss issues of importance to the Nez Perce Tribe. 

Also, we have issues with bighorn sheep, and I am just using this 

as an example of the partnerships we have with the Forest Service 

and other federal entities over the years. We are currently working 

on a bighorn sheep restoration in the State of Idaho where scientists believe diseases are transmitted by domestic sheep to wild 

bighorn sheep. So we are working hard to try to address that concern and also help to reduce the impacts to the domestic sheep industry. 


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We are also working on a bison issue over in the Yellowstone 

area. The tribe is looking for a funding solution to help the bison 

hunt in the Gallatin National Forest near Yellowstone Park. More 

funding for the work to assist the Forest Service, the Fish and 

Wildlife Service, and the National Park Service to help meet the 

hunting rights of the Nez Perce Tribe is needed. 

And I will conclude, Mr. Chairman, in my brief statement just 

to summarize what I stated about the importance of partnerships, 

you know, with the various federal agencies. I think we found with 

especially a lot of the ESA work that we have done on fisheries 

that without the partnerships between the Forest Service, the Nez 

Perce Tribe, some local entities, Bonneville Power Administration, 

that it seems at times that, you know, not one entity has enough 

funds to do, you know, one project, but when we can work in partnership, there are a lot of things that we have been able to do, especially regarding endangered species, listed fish. 

So, Mr. Chairman, I thank you for this time. 

[The statement of Mr. Penney follows:] 


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Mr. MORAN. Thank you, Mr. Penney. Mr. Simpson. 

Mr. SIMPSON. Mr. Chairman, let me just say thanks to Sam for 

hosting me and my Deputy Chief of Staff last August when we 

came up and spent a day. He took us all around the reservation, 

showed us what was going on, and if Norm would have been with 

us, he would still be at the fish hatchery trying to figure out how 

to get those salmon. I know that. But, thank you. I enjoyed it very 

much and learned a lot. 

Mr. PENNEY. Thank you. 

Mr. COLE. Mr. Chairman, I just have one—— 

Mr. MORAN. Yes. Mr. Cole. 

Mr. COLE. This comes up over and over, but Chairman, you have 

got extensive experience in all ranges of tribal operations, and you 

have touched on law enforcement and the challenges that you face 

there. Thank you very much for the plug for Representative 

Herseth Sandlin’s very good effort to streamline, overhaul, and beef 

up enforcement. That is an important piece of legislation that 

needs to move. 

I would like to get your opinion. One of the problems I have seen 

across Indian Country is, again, the relative weakness, honestly, of 

tribal jurisdiction, the inability to enforce your own laws on nonNative populations and to have anywhere near the range of criminal options. You know, if I went to a small town in Virginia or 

Washington and committed a crime, I would be subject to the full 

force of the law in the local jurisdiction. That is not true if you are 

a non-Indian coming onto Indian Country. 

What difference do you think it would make to law enforcement 

if you had comparable abilities to a local government in terms of 

both arrests and penalties? 

Mr. PENNEY. Well, I think first of all our tribal officers, their 

first concern is public safety, no matter who the officer is, to try 

to secure whatever the situation is until the appropriate law enforcement arrives, and just recently the Corlain Tribe in which I 

testified at the Idaho State Legislature, had some cross deputation 

agreements with the local counties, and one of the local sheriffs refused to enter into an agreement, the Corlain Tribe proposed HB– 

500, which would provide a mechanism for them to enter into such 

an agreement. 

But what takes place normally, in the Corlain case in particular, 

was say if there was a crime committed that they could be detained, but they would have to call for a local sheriff or Idaho State 

Police or someone else to arrive at the scene, and during that testimony many times they said that they never responded so that the 

person was just let go. So it does create a void in the safety of, not 

only tribe members, but all people within the reservation boundary. 

Mr. COLE. Yeah. Mr. Chairman, I would just like to echo the 

point that Mr. Simpson said. I mean, this really is an appropriate 

topic for a joint hearing between our subcommittee and CSI, not 

just on the funding and the FBI issue, but the whole problem of, 

frankly, the relative, you know, what do we do to make sure that 

the law enforcement that is the first-line responder and the justice 

system that is there, has the appropriate range of authority to 

make sure that its citizens and other citizens that come into this 


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territory are protected. I just think this is an enduring, ongoing 

problem in Indian Country. 

Mr. PENNEY. If I may, Mr. Chairman, just one final statement 

about law enforcement. I think for many tribes, including our tribe, 

we believe our officers are well trained. They go to the Federal 

Academy, many of them go to the State Post Academy, and some 

in our case go to Advanced Idaho State Police Academy. So, you 

know, we believe hopefully we can provide the necessary training, 

but a lot of it is left up to the local sheriff, whether they want to 

enter into an agreement or not. If they do not, then there is no 

mechanism to do that. 

Mr. MORAN. Well, you have some language for the report you 

may want to suggest to Mr. Cole in that area. There seems to be 

some agreement on that issue, and thank you very much, Mr. 

Penney. 

Mr. PENNEY. Thank you. 

Mr. MORAN. Dr. Roger Bordeaux is the Executive Director of the 

Association of Community Tribal Schools in California. 

THURSDAY, APRIL 15, 2010. 

ASSOCIATION OF COMMUNITY TRIBAL SCHOOLS 

WITNESS 

DR. ROGER BORDEAUX 

Mr. BORDEAUX. Mr. Chairman, members of the committee, thank 

you for allowing me a few minutes to talk to you about the appropriations of Interior, and I specifically want to talk about the inequities that exist in the Bureau of Indian Education in regards to 

the distribution of their appropriations. 

Over the last five or six years their education management budg- et has increased by 288 percent from $8 million to $25 million, and 

that did not even include an additional $10 million that they get 

from the Department of Education and then over that same time 

period they have been increasing their Program Adjustment Funds 

and what they call Program Enhancement Funds, which are small 

pockets of money here and there that they use to dictate to schools 

what kind of programs they are to have and how much they are 

to have. So collectively, they have increased their total amount by 

well over 250 percent, from close to $10 or $15 million, five or six 

years ago to over $55 million right now. 

The inequity exists when you go and look at the five programs 

that are funded by the schools that actually get down to the school 

level, in the school, in the classrooms. The Indian School Equalization Program, the Facilities Management money, the Facilities 

Operations money, the Transportation money, and the Tribal Grant 

Cost Support funds. All of those have either had zero increases 

over the last five or six years or small increases, and I put charts 

in all of the testimony to identify all of that, and it is real glaring 

to us that it is almost like the Bureau of Indian Education is making a conscious effort to manage from 1,000 or 2,000 miles away 

all of the schools that they fund, even though they are tribally operated. 


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So what we are asking is that you take a look at that and possibly use some of that funding to decrease those amounts for management and get that money down to the schools where it is necessary. The Bureau has a process for all five of those programs that 

I talked about, either through a formula that is required by legislation or required by regulations to develop a formula that says this 

is the need in each one of those cases. There is a formula for the 

Indian School Equalization Program need, the Facilities Maintenance and Facilities Operation monies are both driven by a formula, and those programs are both constrained right now anywhere from 56 percent up to 98 percent or something like that. The 

transportation costs also can be done through a formula system, 

and the contract support costs also can identify the need. 

So they know what the need is. I mean, the total need right now, if they fully funded, is about an additional $171 million for all of 

the programs. But we realize it is kind of unrealistic to ask for 

$171 million in this time period, but I think we could come up with 

$20 to $40 million that was already within the budgets to transfer 

from Education Program Management, and a lot of these other 

things, and into the school systems. 

We have some recommendations on the last page of our appropriations of what we think should happen. The last thing I think 

that we would also like to talk about is in the appropriation language since 1995, there is some language that restricts existing 

schools from having program changes or expanding their school 

system. So if they have a K to 8 program and they want to go to 

high school, they cannot do it at existing schools, and then there 

is also more or less a moratorium on new school starts. So if another tribal government wanted to try to get a contract school 

started or grant school started, they could not do that because of 

the restriction that has existed in the appropriation language since 

1985. 

We have been talking to a number of people that have an interest in possibly running their own school system at the tribal level 

but because of that language they cannot do it. So we ask you to 

consider lifting it and possibly putting a process in to help new 

schools start and program expansions, but still not attacking the 

current dollar pie that we have for the 185 schools that are funded 

right now. 

So in a nutshell, that is what is in the testimony, and we would 

also be more than willing to provide additional information if you 

need it to show you what our concerns are. Thank you for your 

time. 

[The statement of Mr. Bordeaux follows:] 


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Mr. MORAN. Very good, Dr. Bordeaux. Thank you. 

Mr. Cole. 

Mr. COLE. I think you make a really important point, because 

this committee has actually done, I think, a very good job, certainly 

in the last couple of years, to put additional money where it is 

needed. I do not know that we track it as well as we would like 

to but sort of push it through the bureaucracy down to local levels. 

It is exactly the same problem Mr. Simpson was pointing out with 

law enforcement. There are significant increases, but are they really going to where the rubber meets the road, and this is a perfect 

example. 

I particularly appreciate your emphasis on local management of 

the schools. You know, it is pretty tough if somebody making the 

decisions is 2,000 miles away. It is a lot different if people making 

the decisions are right where parents are at and where students 

are at. They not only know more, frankly, they are subject to more 

scrutiny and at least. As one parent put it to me, I would just like 

to be able to get my hands around the neck of the person that is 

making this decision. They are too far away right now, and I think 

that is a good thing. Local management meets local responsibility, 

so I hope, Mr. Chairman, we really look seriously at this as a way 

of pushing some of this money down to very hard-pressed schools 

and students. I think it would be very well used. 

Mr. BORDEAUX. We will do whatever we can to help you guys 

with the information you need. Thank you. 

Mr. MORAN. Thanks, Dr. Bordeaux. Thank you very much. 

Marvin Yellowhair is the president of the Black Mesa Community School Board on the Navajo Reservation in Arizona. 

THURSDAY, APRIL 15, 2010. 

BLACK MESA COMMUNITY SCHOOL BOARD (NAVAJO 

RESERVATION) 

WITNESS 

MARVIN YELLOWHAIR 

Mr. YELLOWHAIR. Good afternoon, Mr. Chairman and members of 

the subcommittee. My name is Marvin Yellowhair. I am a School 

Board President of Black Mesa Community School, a K through 8 

school located on 6,700 feet elevation. One of the most remote parts 

of the Navajo Reservation in Arizona. I also teach Navajo history 

and Navajo language at Rough Rock High School. I just want to 

tell you about the challenges of operating a very small school in an 

isolated area. 

As a small school we are not able to generate much funding from 

the Bureau of Indian Affairs, from the Base Education Program, 

and we ask for your help in increasing funding for several BIA 

schools. 

I will start with school transportation. Isolation with high transportation costs. That is certainly true of Black Mesa Community 

School. Neither of the two roads leading into Black Mesa are 

paved. To get on or off the mesa, we must travel 16 miles of direct 

road to Rough Rock and also to Pinon; it is a 26-mile trip. From 


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either location it is yet another hour’s drive to our closest town in 

Chinle. During periods of snow or heavy rain, both dirt roads in 

our community are impassible. Many of our school children routinely travel four hours per day when the roads are in good condition and up to eight hours in bad conditions. 

Here are pictures if you are interested, pictures of the road condition there in the last two winters. Many of our school children 

routinely travel four hours a day to school. I wish you could see our 

roads in February when the snow is melting. 

A few consequences of impassible roads are at one time this past 

winter we had to cancel school for 20 days and after our freezer 

broke down we lost a whole month’s food for the school cafeteria. 

Another consequence is the high cost for delivery of foods and services due to length of time for our vendors, service providers, and 

others who reach our school. Due to the frequent breakdowns of the 

General Service Administration buses, GSA refuses to give us new 

buses, so they usually give us used buses that might break down 

easily. 

So, therefore, we had to purchase our own service truck and a 

back hoe. Every time we had to pull out a bus due to muddy conditions we use this equipment. We also purchased our own buses, 

some decent buses, which were approximately $80,000 a piece. So we recommend $70 million for a transportation account in 

order to meet more closely national school transportation standards 

for all BIE schools. 

TGSC, Tribal Grant Support Costs, laws require that tribally-op- erated schools receive at least $200,000 each year for its administrative and direct costs. Black Mesa should qualify for the small 

school minimum, but we routinely receive less than that because 

Congress never supplies a full account required by the law. Last 

year we received only $172,800 in Travel Grant Support Cost funding. Overall, BIE paid TGSC at only 61 percent of the amount the 

law requires. 

Even though ours is a small school, we must perform all of the 

fundamental administrative tasks required of a school board. Because we cannot afford to employ business and human resource 

managers, all these functions must be performed by an office technician and the school principal who is also responsible for directing 

the education program and supervision of the teaching staff. In 

other words, we have one person essentially performing three jobs, 

and a large portion of our TGSC funds must be reserved for audit, 

which costs $40,000, and that is close to a fourth of what we receive. 

The Administration proposal of $46 million would fund only 60 

percent of needs. We ask Congress to appropriate at least $70 million for the Tribal Grant Support Cost Account. 

Our facilities operation also falls short of the amount we need to 

maintain our buildings and communications systems. Even though 

the BIE has a formula for calculating facility operation funding 

needs, we and other BIE schools routinely receive less than onehalf of the amount the formula produces. When our equipment 

malfunctions, it often means several days or several weeks for a 

technician or a repair person to come to our school to provide the 

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We recommend $109 million for facilities operation to fully fund 

the formula for all BIE schools. 

As far as education program, ISEF, budget, for the current school year we received $338,300 under the ISEF formula for our education program. These funds must support teaching personnel to 

staff seven classrooms and a special education program, and the 

low salaries we offer makes recruitment and retention of certified 

personnel very difficult, and we have a high turnover of our teachers due to the isolation. 

We recommend $431 million for the ISEF account for all BIE 

schools. All of us connected with Black Mesa School work very hard 

each day to keep our school operating, and if we fail in this mission 

the children of our community being in an isolated area would not 

have access to education. The United States made a commitment 

to the Indian children enrolled in 183 BIE schools, including the 

Indian children at Black Mesa. We need to fulfill this commitment 

by providing us with the resources we need to make their path toward equality education easier to navigate. 

And by the way, being in an isolated school, our school made 

AYP this year, and would not use external excuses to not make 

AYP, but we made AYP. And thank you for believing in us and believing in our Navajo children. 

If you have any questions. 

[The statement of Mr. Yellowhair follows:] 


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Mr. MORAN. Well, I mean, it is astounding you are spending $8,000 per year per student just on transportation. There must be 

a better way, whether it is, you know, computers at home or 

linkups. With that kind of money you could afford a screen in the 

home with a computer linkup so you could have videoconferencing 

for the school. But I do not know enough about it to really be able 

to ask appropriate questions, but it seems an enormous undertaking to be transporting children for four hours a day at the cost 

of $8,000 per student just for transportation. 

Okay. Any questions? Okay. 

Mr. SIMPSON. That would be rural America, but Mr. Cole and I 

will come and visit your school at 6,700 feet if you will provide the 

oxygen. That is a little high. 

Mr. YELLOWHAIR. I have seen people coming from Oklahoma and 

gasping for air up there in that elevation. 

Mr. SIMPSON. I bet. 

Mr. MORAN. All right. Thanks very much, Mr. Yellowhair. 

Mr. YELLOWHAIR. Okay. Thank you very much. 

Mr. MORAN. Thank you. Next up will be Nathan Small, who is 

the Vice-Chair of the Shoshone-Bannock Tribes of the Fort Hall 

Reservation in Idaho. 

THURSDAY, APRIL 15, 2010. 

SHOSHONE-BANNOCK TRIBES OF THE FORT HALL 

RESERVATION 

WITNESS 

NATHAN SMALL 

Mr. SMALL. Good afternoon, everybody, and thank you for the 

honor of being here today. Our Chairman is unavailable to make 

it for today’s hearing or for today’s testimony, so I am here today, 

and our testimony is going to focus on three priorities: public safety, road maintenance, and Indian Health Service needs. 

First, I would like to thank our Ranking Member Simpson for his 

tremendous support for our new Justice Center. We have endured 

the long struggles to provide adequate law enforcement, and we 

greatly appreciate his efforts to help us open up the new facility. 

Mr. Simpson has had the opportunity to come to our reservation. 

He just lives next door. He finally came in, and he had a chance 

to look at our facility that we have that we are currently in right 

now, and his words were that it was deplorable conditions, and 

these need to be changed. So with his help we have made those 

changes. 

But in order to make a lot of those changes, the Shoshone-Bannock Tribes had to do something that the Bureau of Indian Affairs 

and, I guess, you the Congressional people, did not do for our tribe 

for about 20 to 30 years and that was to build us something that 

was adequate. We were not asking for something that was extravagant but adequate. 

Currently our courthouse that we have that is housing our court 

personnel is from a building that was built in 1895. Our police and 

jails were condemned 20 years ago and we are still using it up to 


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this year. We were unable to house juveniles because we lacked a 

juvenile detention facility. 

Due to the lack of resources to provide deterrents and lack of 

public safety, many of our people over the past few generations 

have turned to gangs, drugs, crime, alcohol, all of the social ills 

that can affect the community in the worst way. 

Further, many of our tribal members have dropped out of school 

and have no vocational skills for jobs. They typically turn to a life 

of crime, without programs in place to help them. 

With our new justice center we are hoping to turn things around. 

Our tribe finally was able to secure a loan, even in these tough economic times, to build our own justice center. We are about ready 

to move into that new justice center, and, again, Mr. Simpson was 

there for our opening. It was not a grand opening, but it was more 

of an open house for our people to come and look at it, and it was 

the most beautiful thing that I have ever seen as far as court systems go, as far as a detention facility goes. They are state of the 

art. 

However, I have heard of other places that have opened up new 

jail systems, new detention centers, only to see them unused because of lack of funding. I hope that this would not include our 

tribe. Through grants and our own funds we were able to kind of 

complete this justice center this year. It will house our police department and our prosecutors, our courts, our adult and juvenile 

detention centers. Our staff are moving into the center as we speak 

today. 

We hope that the new facility can serve as a regional detention 

center for adults and juveniles. We built the center with sufficient 

bed space for this purpose, and we have already received support 

from nearby tribes to house their detainees. We ask for your continued support for use of our facility as a regional detention center 

as I heard a little earlier that that could be an idea in helping. We 

are at that phase real soon here. 

We have entered into contracts with the BIA to carry out programs in the new facilities. While we have received increased funding, it is still only a portion of the cost, forcing us to pay for many 

of those costs ourselves. Corrections, especially for juveniles, require a comprehensive approach. We do not want to simply lock up 

our juveniles but to educate them, provide treatment, rehabilitation, and help them become productive citizens. Our new facility 

has classrooms, treatment rooms, however, the BIA seems to lack 

funding for these programs. 

We urge the Appropriations Subcommittee to work together to 

force agencies to pool resources to address the health, educational 

treatment, and justice needs of tribal detention facilities in a comprehensive way. Right now the agencies are doing their own thing 

and do not affect the way we assist tribes when they can all pull 

their resources together to help. 

[The statement of Mr. Small follows:] 


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Mr. MORAN. Thank you, sir. Thank you, Mr. Small. 

Mr. SMALL. Yeah. 

Mr. MORAN. Any questions? 

Mr. SIMPSON. Not any questions. I just want to thank you, Nathan, for being here today to give your testimony and give me part 

of the credit for the justice center, but it was the tribe who did this. 

I was just fortunate enough to be there when they opened, and I 

will tell you that if anybody wants to see a modern facility that 

really incorporates the police department, the court system, and 

the detention facilities together, this is really a model, and we said 

in our report language last year, that we hope this can serve as a 

model for other regional sort of detention facilities. 

One of the things and Nathan mentioned it, is these guys went 

out on their own and got a loan to do this, to build this. The concern that they have and continue to have is, you know, now that 

it is built, there is operating costs that are involved, and we have 

got a memorandum of understanding with the Department to help 

that for at least the first year I guess. 

Mr. SMALL. Correct. 

Mr. MORAN. Well, that is the way it should be done. Thank you 

very much, Mr. Small. 

Mr. SMALL. All right. Thank you. I am sorry I am not a fast 

speaker, but I did have some stuff on road maintenance and 

healthcare but—— 

Mr. MORAN. Your entire statement will be put into the record. 

Mr. SMALL. All right. Thank you. 

Mr. MORAN. Very good. Thank you, sir. 

Next we will hear from Nancy Martine-Alonzo, Trustee President 

of the Ramah Navajo School Board in New Mexico. 

THURSDAY, APRIL 15, 2010. 

RAMAH NAVAJO SCHOOL BOARD, INC. 

WITNESS 

NANCY MARTINE-ALONZO 

Ms. MARTINE-ALONZO. Good afternoon, Chair and members of the 

committee. Thank you for the opportunity to make this presentation before you. Up front with me is also my fellow colleague, 

Martha Garcia. 

I want to first start out by saying that we are extremely grateful 

to the Congressional funding we received 40 years ago to start our 

own Ramah Navajo Pine Hill School, and we are celebrating that 

40th year this year, and over the years we have graduated over 700 

students of our own children in our community, and many of them 

have gone on to be very successful, and we have graduated from 

colleges, medical doctors and lawyers and engineers, and we are 

just proud of that effort, and it all began through the Congressional 

funding that we received. So you and us stand to be congratulated 

today. We thank you very much for that. 

Testifying before you on five issues, four of them have to do with 

the operation of the Pine Hill Schools and to echo some of the same 

testimony that various members have come before you regarding 


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the administration and operation of the BIE-funded schools, and 

the first area we want to focus on is the administrative costs, and 

while the Indian Health Services and some other contractual programs have received some modest increases in the last couple of 

years to bring them up to parity, you are talking about 80 to 90 

percent of their indirect costs, the education side, the BIE education side is still at about 60, 65 percent. And so we are requesting more effort to bring that level up to the 100 percent that the 

law requires, and so that is something that we, too, want to go on 

record to request. 

And then in addition to that, our Indian Student Equalization 

Formula, you also heard testimony on that previously, about the 

need to increase that funding because we are struggling with trying to meet the adequate yearly progress. Our school is a K–12 

school, and so in order to meet adequate yearly progress, all the 

scope of K through 12 must make that percent and meet that percent, and we are making progress every year, but we are struggling. 

And then in the area of transportation, when we do not receive 

adequate funding, we have to take funds from instruction and 

learning and use that to bring the children to school in order to 

provide the instruction, and so that is really a critical need that we 

would like to see increases in those areas. 

And the fourth item is scholarships for our Indian children. The 

new ESEA blueprint when you are going to revise a No Child Left 

Behind under the U.S. Department of Education, one of the criteria 

they are looking at is asking that by 2020, schools will be able to 

graduate students that can go into college or into the workforce 

without remediation, that they will really be able to raise their 

level of skill to that level. And so we need to increase the scholarship fund. We do send a lot of our students on but there are a lot 

that have to look to other areas for funding their college level education. So we urge you to consider that as well. 

And then the fifth and last item that I would like to talk about 

is the funding for about $1 million to address the telemedicine component. We operate a very small clinic on the Ramah Navajo Band 

and Tribe Reservation, and we are very remote, and the nearest 

hospital is 45 miles away, and we share that hospital with Zuni 

Tribe. We need to bring all of our capabilities up to par so that we 

can be able to get specialized services. If you take an X-ray in our 

clinic and you send it through the slow snail mail, it is going to 

take a week for that to go out and for a radiologist to read that 

X-ray and to give you a diagnosis and send it back to you, and by 

that time maybe 2 or 3 weeks have passed. And if the diagnosis 

is cancer, you have deprived a patient of about a month’s worth of 

treatment, and sometimes these are critical times that you have to 

respond. 

And so if we had the telemedicine capability and the data capability to be able to work with our partnerships in other areas that 

have this specialization, we can do this in 30 minutes to an hour 

in sending our X-rays and get them read and receive that prognosis. So that is kind of the difference of what we are talking about 

here. 


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And so we know that that is also a goal of the Indian Health 

Services, and so that is our last request, and we just thank you 

very much for this opportunity. 

[The statement of Ms. Martine-Alonzo follows:] 


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Mr. MORAN. Thank you very much, ma’am. We appreciate that. 

Thank you. I have got to share some bad news with the committee 

here, so we appreciate your testimony, but we are going to have to 

accelerate the witnesses’ testimony here. 

Coming up momentarily we are going to have the Flight Privilege Resolution. It is a 15-minute vote, which means it will probably be a good 20 minutes. Then the Shea-Porter amendment on 

sea level change. That is another 15 minutes, which is probably 20. 

Then 10 minutes of debate on a recommittal motion, 15 minute recommittal vote, final passage of the Clean Estuaries Act, and then 

another resolution. 

So we have got almost 2 hours of votes. I am not sure how we 

are going to handle this. They are going to start very quickly. I 

think we are going to have to do kind of a tag team here. Mr. 

Olver, if you could help, we could go back and forth. The problem 

is that more than likely you are only going to get one member of 

the committee, so we are going to have to accelerate this. We will 

try to get as many in as possible right now while the members are 

still here. We can probably take another 10 minutes before we have 

to run over to vote. 

But thank you very much for your testimony. 

Ms. MARTINE-ALONZO. Thank you. 

Mr. MORAN. Thank you, Ms. Martine-Alonzo. 

Jerome Jainga, who is representing the Tribal Education Departments National Assembly. The acronym is TEDNA in Colorado. 

And if you could accelerate it, sir, we would very much appreciate it. 

THURSDAY, APRIL 15, 2010. 

TRIBAL EDUCATION DEPARTMENTS NATIONAL 

ASSEMBLY 

WITNESS 

JEROME JAINGA 

Mr. JAINGA. You bet. It is Jerome Jainga for the record, and good 

afternoon, Chairman Moran, Ranking Member Simpson, members 

of the subcommittee. Thanks for this opportunity for TEDNA to 

come and speak before you about Tribal Education Departments. 

I have worked as the Tribal Ed Director in the State of Washington for the Suquamish Tribe, who is one of the founding members of TEDNA, and we are very thankful to member Norm Dicks 

as well. 

TEDNA is a national member-based advocacy organization that 

is representing Tribal Education Departments and Tribal Education Agencies, TEDs or TEAs. Over 200 tribes have TEDs that 

serve almost 700,000 tribal students in public, Bureau of Indian 

Education, and charter schools located on or off tribal geographic 

territories. 

Today we are here to ask the subcommittee for the support of $2 

million for TED. This money would become available to all the 

TEDs through a grant process in the Department of the Interior. 


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In the Elementary and Secondary Act funding for TEDs through 

the Department of Interior has been authorized since 1988. In the 

authorization Congress envisioned TEDs facilitating tribal control 

over education at the local level by coordinating education programs, developing and enforcing tribal education codes, policies and 

standards, and providing support services and technical assistance 

to schools and programs. In NCLB it was retained that TED appropriations of $2 million, 

even though this needed, yet inadequate, Federal Appropriation 

Authorization would support the important work of TEDs to this 

date it has never been funded. Lack of federal support for TEDs 

harms tribal students and the statistics prove it, and again, it has 

yet to be funded. 

In some states high school dropout rates is well over 50 percent. 

In 2008, approximately 23,000 tribal students between the ages of 

16 and 19 dropped out of high school. That is roughly 5,750 tribal 

students a year throughout all classes, and it shows and represents 

about $221.6 million in lost wages for these families per year. 

Further, tribal students have a high rate of absenteeism, suspension, expulsion. Eighth graders are shown in the tribal student 

population to be 18 percent more likely to read or perform in mathematics at a below-basic level than their peers. TEDs are uniquely 

equipped to improve these statistics, because they are aware of the 

cultural, social, and the economic conditions that affect these tribal 

students. And this point is supported by the universal support in 

Indian Country and how they have shown their support for the 

TED and TEA appropriations. 

This year TEDNA has secured resolutions in support of these appropriations in the fiscal year 2011, budget from the National Congress of American Indian, National Indian Education Association, 

the United Southern Eastern Tribes, the Great Plains Tribal Chairman Association, and the Affiliated Tribes of the Northwest Indian. 

Further, several tribes have submitted appropriation request 

forms for TED and TEA program funding authorized in the NCLB 

to their Congressional offices, including tribes in Montana, Oklahoma, Washington, California, and Wisconsin. 

In addition, the National Congress of American Indians and the 

National Indian Education Association has made this funding a top 

priority. Indian Country is united in its support for TED and TEA 

appropriations, and we have worked to secure support from many 

Congressional offices, and we are grateful to that, and they are 

submitting support letters to the subcommittee. 

Without this federal financial support, TEDs for the most part do 

not have the ability to do what Congress had envisioned and to 

help students. It is a great investment in tribal students to put this 

funding forward so that tribal education codes, policies, and standards that have not been developed or implemented as they should 

can do that. 

The requested $2 million for TED and TEA appropriations is a 

good investment. It will improve academic success by providing 

funding for tribal education agencies to operate programs mentioned above and in areas such as math, science, reading, afterschool programs, and tutoring. The Rosebud Sioux tribe, using 

their tribal dollars, operated similar programs, and that helped to 


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lower the dropout rate by 30 percent. This is a statistic that came 

through the 1990s, but in short and in closing, TEDs and TEAs can 

help the non-tribal, and the federal, state governments to serve 

tribal children. TEDNA strongly encourages Congress to do this. 

[The statement of Mr. Jainga follows:] 


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Mr. MORAN. Thank you. 

Mr. JAINGA. Thank you. 

Mr. MORAN. Thank you, Mr. Jainga. Thank you. 

Mr. JAINGAN Questions? 

Mr. MORAN. No, because we have got to move on, and what is 

going to happen is that it is the luck of the draw, and unfortunately, the people that have not yet spoken their luck is going to 

run out in terms of having the attention of the full subcommittee 

unfortunately. 

Roman Bitsuie, the Executive Director of Navajo Hopi Land 

Commission in Arizona. 

THURSDAY, APRIL 15, 2010. 

NAVAJO HOPI LAND COMMISSION 

WITNESS 

ROMAN BITSUIE 

Mr. BITSUIE. Mr. Chairman and members of the subcommittee, 

my name is Roman Bitsuie. I am the Executive Director of the 

Navajo Hopi Land Commission Office, an entity of the Navajo Nation. Thank you for this opportunity to provide testimony on what 

has been one of the most difficult matters in modern federal Indian 

policy and a true tragedy for the Navajo Nation. 

I have spent my entire adult life working to resolve Navajo Hopi 

land dispute and to address the Bennett freeze. I was born in the 

disputed area, and I have seen the hardship that the relocation law 

and the various long-term construction freezes that has created. 

The impact of these federal actions will be with the Nation for generations to come. 

Let me speak first about the former Bennett freeze area. Because 

of a dispute between the Hopi Tribe and the Navajo Nation, then 

BIA Commissioner Robert Bennett imposed a construction freeze in 

1966, on this 1.5 million acre area located in the western portion 

of the Navajo Reservation. The freeze was in place until 2006. It 

was finally lifted after the Navajo Nation secured a court decision 

that held that nearly all the area was Navajo and then the two 

tribes were finally able to reach a settlement agreement. 

Because of the freeze, the Bennett-freeze Navajos are the poorest 

of the poor. As President Obama noted in his proposed fiscal year 

2011, budget, ‘‘During the freeze era the Navajo people were prohibited from building new homes, schools, and health facilities; 

building infrastructure; and engaging in community and economic 

development projects, including development for grazing, energy, 

and other land uses. The freeze influenced the Navajo people socially, economically, emotionally, physically, mentally, and spiritually.’’ The Senate Interior Appropriations Committee reached a 

similar conclusion at a field hearing in 1993, which I have a copy. 

I might add that since the hearing, the only federal appropriation was that of $1.5 million to construct 85 homes when the freeze 

was lifted temporarily in 1992, only to be re-imposed by the court 

in 1995. 


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President Obama has proposed setting aside $1.5 million, ‘‘to 

begin development of the former Bennett freeze area.’’ While the 

President’s budget request is welcome, it is intended to be spent 

largely on land user and agricultural purposes. While these purposes are important, the number one need in this area based on 

an extensive independent study completed last year is improving 

housing. For this reason I will propose an additional $5 million in BIA 

housing funds be set aside for critical housing repairs and construction. 

I would also recommend that this committee support the establishment of a trust fund for reconstruction of the former Bennett 

freeze area with an initial allocation of $10 million for fiscal year 

2011, but with further funding over the next 15 years. Such funding will provide the long-term support needed if this area is to be 

rehabilitated. 

Finally, I would ask for $1.5 million for phase II of a solar project 

that the Navajo Nation is developing on Paragon ranch, lands in 

New Mexico. Funds generated through the development of these 

lands can only be used for the benefit of Navajo families and communities that have been affected by the Federal Relocation Law. If 

these lands can be developed, then a vital new source of funds will 

be available to address the Relocation Law. 

Although the Navajo Hopi land dispute and the Bennett freeze 

are painful issues, I thank the committee for this opportunity and 

to provide testimony about the many Navajo families who have suffered under federal actions can hope for a better life. 

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. 

[The statement of Mr. Bitsuie follows:] 


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Mr. MORAN. Thank you, Mr. Bitsuie. Thank you very much. 

Dr. Mark Walker is next. I am going to ask that it only be oral 

testimony. Please do not read anything. We do not have time for 

that. Just summarize what you want to tell us, and we will put the 

statement into the record. We have only got less than 5 minutes 

to vote, and once we go we are gone for 2 hours of voting. So that 

is the situation that confronts us unfortunately. It is out of our control. Dr. Walker. 

THURSDAY, APRIL 15, 2010. 

COUNCIL ON GOVERNMENT AFFAIRS, AMERICAN 

DENTAL ASSOCIATION 

WITNESS 

DR. MARK WALKER 

Dr. WALKER. Thank you very much. Well, we appreciate the opportunity to comment on the oral health issues that affect the 

American Indians and Alaska Natives, as well as the dentists that 

serve in Indian Country. I would like to thank the committee for 

their continued support of the Indian Health Service Program. Increases the committee included in this budget year will expand recruitment efforts, increase advanced training needed for specialists, 

and provide an electronic dental record service, all important 

things. 

We are pleased the Administration has recommended an increase 

in the budget for the dental division this next year; however, the 

proposed funding level of just over $161 million really only protects 

the status quo and does not improve the program to reduce the disproportional level of oral disease in this population. 

The most pressing oral issue in Indian Country is tooth decay or 

caries, and, especially among young children, has reached epidemic 

proportions. The decay rate is about 400 percent that of the average population. Worse still is the severity of the decay. Native 

American preschool children have five decayed teeth compared to 

one decayed tooth in the rest of the population. 

To address this the Indian Health Service instituted an Early 

Childhood Caries Initiative, a program designed to promote prevention and early intervention in tooth decay in young children. Having long recognized the severity of this epidemic, last year the ADA 

hosted a symposium on early childhood caries in American Indians 

and Alaska Native children. Among their conclusions is that more 

research needs to be done for this disease because in the Native 

American children the disease starts earlier and it is often more 

aggressive and destructive. 

The Sisseton-Whapeton Tribe set a five year goal to have all children enter into school caries free. We would ask the committee to 

support this goal and expand it to all Native American children 

under the age of five. We anticipate this would cost another $50 

million. 

[The statement of Dr. Walker follows:] 


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Mr. MORAN. Okay. Thanks very much, Dr. Walker. We are 

down—— 

Dr. WALKER. Thank you. 

Mr. MORAN [continuing]. To about 2 minutes. We will bring that 

up with the head of the Indian Health Service if we can get her 

here. 

Dr. WALKER. Thank you so much. 

Mr. MORAN. Thank you very much. 

McCoy Oatman. You are going to have to do this in a minute or 

two if you want to have the attention of all of us, sir. I am sorry 

for this, but you are the Chair of the Columbia River Inter-Tribal 

Fish Commission, and we appreciate your coming to testify from 

Oregon. 

THURSDAY, APRIL 15, 2010. 

COLUMBIA RIVER INTER-TRIBAL FISH COMMISSION 

WITNESS 

MCCOY OATMAN 

Mr. OATMAN. All right. Thank you, Chairman Moran, committee 

members. My name is McCoy Oatman, and like you say, I am the 

Chairman of the Columbia River Inter-Tribal Fish Commission. I 

also sit on the Tribal Executive Committee, Nez Perce Tribal Executive Committee with Sam Penney who testified earlier. 

Most of our money for our program comes out of BIA, Rights Protection Implementation. The biggest request we have today is to restore the entire Rights Protection Implementation Account to its 

fiscal year 2010 level of $30,451,000. The two primary justifications 

for that is the increase in the management responsibilities. We recently concluded three significant 10-year agreements: the U.S./ 

Canada Pacific Salmon Treaty, U.S. v. Oregon Fisheries Management Plan, and Columbia Basin Fish Accords, which three of our 

tribes are signatories. The Nez Perce Tribe is not, but we agree 

with, the status of each tribe that they can go on with their own 

pathway. 

And just address our challenges. Climate change, reduction in 

state natural resource budgets, increase in safety and enforcement 

needs, and other species needs like lamprey, sturgeon, and some 

management need for the predatory sea lions that take a part of 

our salmon. 

And finally, we continue to sustain losses from inflation and rising costs, and I would just like to thank the subcommittee for their 

time today. 

[The statement of Mr. Oatman follows:] 


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Mr. MORAN. Nice job, Mr. Oatman. Well done. That is the model. 

Nice going. Thank you very much. He does deserve a hand there. 

John Antonio, the Governor of Pueblo of Laguna in New Mexico. 

We may be able to fit this one in, but we are now out of time to 

go vote. 

THURSDAY, APRIL 15, 2010. 

PUEBLO OF LAGUNA 

WITNESS 

JOHN E. ANTONIO 

Mr. ANTONIO. Good afternoon, Mr. Chair and members of the 

committee. I thank you for the opportunity. My name is John Antonio, Sr. I am the Governor of the Pueblo of Laguna, New Mexico, 

a little bit west of Albuquerque, and on behalf of our 8,300 member 

strong I bring our greetings. 

I know there is a lot of needs, and we have a lot of needs, and 

of course, you have heard them from the different tribes. So it is 

going to be part of the written records I understand, but, again, 

health, education, roads. I mean, those are all needs, and one of 

the basic things I just want to leave you with is right now we have 

a trust litigation that is still pending. You know, we hate to spend 

taxpayer money and our own money to fight each other. 

So I would just encourage you to encourage the Department of 

Justice, the Department of the Interior to please settle these trust 

litigations. You know, we have the world’s largest open-pit uranium mine, and we have been dealing with this for 57 years. We 

did our part to provide uranium resources, and the royalties that 

came to us were mismanaged by the Federal Government. They 

lost a lot of value. So right now we have calculated what they are 

worth today, and we would just like the government to be honorable and fair and give us our just compensation. 

[The statement of Mr. Antonio follows:] 


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Mr. MORAN. I think we would like to see that be the case as well. 

We are not going to be able to resolve that in the Appropriations 

Subcommittee, but it is important to bring that to our attention. 

Thank you very much, Governor. 

Mr. ANTONIO. Thank you. 

Mr. MORAN. And now we have to—— 

Mr. ANTONIO. I appreciate it. Thank you. 

Mr. MORAN [continuing]. Run off to vote now. We will try to get 

both votes in, and then I will try to be back hopefully either Mr. 

Simpson or Mr. Cole or either one. We are going to work with Mr. 

Olver and see if we cannot figure out a way to play tag team here 

and get as many witnesses as possible. 

And we also got the Director of the Indian Health Service, but 

I think at this point we are probably going to have to run over. The 

time expired a couple minutes ago. 

[Whereupon, the subcommittee recessed, to reconvene the same 

day.] 

Mr. MORAN. Thank you. We are going to try to get the rest of 

the testimony in before the next vote. 

The next person to speak would be Rodger Martinez, the President of the Ramah Navajo Chapter of the Ramah Band of Navajos 

in New Mexico. 

Sir. 

THURSDAY, APRIL 15, 2010. 

RAMAH NAVAJO CHAPTER OF THE RAMAH BAND OF 

NAVAJOS 

WITNESS 

RODGER MARTINEZ 

Mr. MARTINEZ. Mr. Chairman, thank you very much and the 

committee if they are here. I have a three, four things. 

The first request we are looking at is the detention facilities. 

Through the ARRA funding we received $3.8 million. It is going to 

be constructed by the year 2011. We are looking at an operating 

fund of $941,000 that we want to see if we can have that included 

in the Bureau funding and also reoccurring funds from there on. 

And also we are looking at the Natural Resource Facilities that 

we have that needs to be completed with $400,000 and then 

$200,000 of reoccurring funds for operations. 

And the other unmet need is infrastructure for a real estate program that we have. Currently our building is situated in an emergency flood zone, and it has been flooded several times, and it does 

not really look good. We have been infested by other things as far 

as we had a bull snake that came in and we lost it in the building 

somewhere. Those are some of the things that we have been dealing with. 

And the last one, that was the third, and the fourth one is Congress passed a jobs bill here recently, and it does not do much the 

way the bill was passed. You know, it does help a lot of business 

people in situations where they, mainly the roads and the small 

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where it puts a workforce together. And we can go as far back as 

Depression era. So that, and you know, having some money go 

across for the Marshall Plan and the WPA at the time. We need 

to do something like that and put people back to work on the reservation. 

On the reservation our unemployment is very high; 60 percent, 

and now we had two suicides since January, and some of it is attributed to that, and it is a depressing situation, no jobs, and people have kids, and they cannot afford to make a living in situations 

like that, and nowadays it is high tech, and everybody cannot land 

a job that is high tech, and that is one of the big issues that we 

are facing on the reservation. Not only in Ramah but all the reservations. And this is some of the things that we face. 

I hope the committee will understand our needs and be able to 

afford us in this request that we have for you today. 

[The statement of Mr. Martinez follows:] 


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Mr. MORAN. Thank you. Which money are you talking about that 

was so disappointing to you? Which agency? 

Mr. MARTINEZ. The Southwest Region. We are with the Navajo 

Nation, but our fundings are going through the Southwest Region 

because that is where we usually receive our monies with the 

Southwest Region in Albuquerque. 

Mr. MORAN. All right. Well, thank you very much, Mr. Martinez. 

Thank you for your testimony. Thanks for being here with us. We 

appreciate it. Thank you. 

Dr. Dale Walker is the Director of the One Sky National Resource Center for American Indian/Alaska Native Substance Abuse 

Services on behalf of the Friends of Indian Health in Oregon. Sir. 

THURSDAY, APRIL 15, 2010. 

ONE SKY NATIONAL RESOURCE CENTER FOR AMERICAN INDIAN/ALASKA NATIVE SUBSTANCE ABUSE 

SERVICES ON BEHALF OF FRIENDS OF INDIAN 

HEALTH 

WITNESS 

DR. DALE WALKER 

Dr. WALKER. Hello, there, and thank you very much for a chaotic 

day, and I appreciate the fact that you came back to help us work 

through the process. My name is Dale Walker. I am a member of 

the Cherokee Tribe from Oklahoma. I am also a psychiatrist. I 

work with the University of Oregon and have a center there called 

the One Sky Center. As a part of that center we provide consultation and technical assistance across Indian Country. We average 

about 50 tribes a year that we work with, and so part of my experience has to do with working behavioral health, especially addictions, methamphetamine, alcohol, depression, domestic violence, 

suicide. Not what you call the easy things to deal with in Indian 

Country. They are all elevated, they are all remarkable issues and 

problems. 

What we want to talk about today is the fact that I am here representing the Friends of American Indian Health. That is a unique 

organization, because it has voluntarily come together to advocate 

and help support Indian issues, and I am certainly honored to be 

here on their behalf. 

They come here with two issues of major concern. One has to do 

with contract health services as a piece of the solution for Indian 

healthcare. Now, Indian healthcare is a remarkable phenomenon. 

Your committee advocated and supported special facets, especially 

for meth and suicide, last year, and we thank you for that process. 

This year there is an increase of just under 9 percent of the 

budget now to about $4.8 billion. The contract healthcare part of 

that budget covers the chronic illness care that the primary 

healthcare clinics of the Indian Health Service do not administer 

or have the staff to support. They contract that out to local community, private practitioners, and such. 

Their needs are estimated to be $400 million short. That would 

help solve the problems of the contract care. Let me just mention 


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to you, if you are an American Indian, and you happen to have an 

illness that requires longer-term care, could be diabetes, could be 

cancer, could be heart disease, if the funds could run out in the 

first six months of a fiscal year, the last six months there are no 

funds, and so care is denied. 35,000 times in 2008. 

When that happens, the care is just delayed and spilled into the 

next year, so prevention intervention for chronic illness does not 

happen. So the idea is to provide the contract care services, build 

your prevention programs, and help these systems work. I can tell 

you that is a very, very critical element. 

The next issue is how do you deal with the lack of recruitment, 

the vacant positions within the Indian Health Service. There are 

over 900 vacant positions within the Indian Health Service, and 

one way of dealing with that is funding. In funding the workforce 

and providing to do retention support for people who have bills for 

their healthcare payments has worked in the past. It is estimated 

that another $14 million would be very, very useful. I do not think 

that is a lot of money to try to recruit and bring more people into 

the Indian Health Service. 

When people are involved in recruitment and retention by payback of their healthcare, that has been shown to increase their retention considerably, and so we think that that is a good way to 

go. 

The other thing that is happening is the friends themselves are 

helping to develop an advocacy package for recruitment of more 

people into Indian healthcare. I just want to take the moment and 

tell you that I am excited about what is happening in the Indian 

Health Service. I think that the movement towards increases in 

funding, the attention to care is absolutely critical and will empower Indian people to be much more involved in their care. If we 

can figure a way for interagency coordination between Indian 

Health Service and Bureau of Indian Affairs to help pursue that, 

I think it will be a major breakthrough. Frankly, the way I saw 

your committee work is a model for what needs to happen. 

[The statement of Dr. Walker follows:] 


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Mr. MORAN. Thank you very much, Dr. Walker. We appreciate it. 

We are going to hear from Dr. Roubideaux in a moment, and 

they have increased money, and I know they will spend it well, 

even though the demands are enormous. 

Thank you very much. 

Dr. WALKER. Thank you. 

Mr. MORAN. Next, Jerry Pardilla, who is the Executive Director 

of the National Tribal Environmental Council, New Mexico. Mr. 

Pardilla. 

THURSDAY, APRIL 15, 2010. 

NATIONAL TRIBAL ENVIRONMENTAL COUNCIL 

WITNESS 

JERRY PARDILLA 

Mr. PARDILLA. Good afternoon. 

Mr. MORAN. Good afternoon. 

Mr. PARDILLA. Thank you for the opportunity to be here, Mr. 

Chairman. In the interest of time I would really like to just highlight, focus on five programs, and they are within the Bureau of Indian Affairs, the Fish and Wildlife Service, and the Environmental 

Protection Agency. 

The underlying perspective that we offer these comments are 

that tribes have some of the more pristine habitat in the country, 

and for those lands tribes have been historically under-funded for 

wildlife and natural resources, management programs, and also for 

environmental protection programs. 

I would like first to draw your attention to the Climate Change 

Adaptation Initiative. This is a new program. It began in fiscal 

year 2010, out of the Bureau of Indian Affairs. Now, that first year 

there was appropriated 136 million, and there were no allocations 

to tribes. Tribes got zero in the first year. 

Mr. MORAN. Go over this again. 

Mr. PARDILLA. The Climate Change Adaptation Initiative began 

fiscal year 2010, in September. 

Mr. MORAN. And there were requests but no funding. 

Mr. PARDILLA. Zero funding for tribes. And it is not consistent 

with the disproportionate impacts tribes are experiencing due to 

climate change and lifestyle and even their very homes if you look 

to the very well-known villages along the Alaska coast. So zero 

funding in 2010. In 2011, tribes are only being allocated $200,000, 

and we think that this is tragically low, and it is a mere .001 percent of the overall funding for this program, which the Administration is requesting $171.3 million. So of that in 2011, only $200,000 

for tribes. 

We think that a more proportionate amount of funding given 

that of the 95 million acres that Indian tribes and Alaska Native 

corporations manage, some 4 percent of the United States total 

land area, that a more equitable funding would be $8.5 million out 

of that Climate Change Adaptation Initiative funding. 

Mr. MORAN. We may address that. We may want to address that 

in the report. Thank you for bringing that to our attention. 


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Mr. PARDILLA. Thank you, and the next area is the Trust National Resources Program, and we urge you to maintain the 2010 

enacted amount of $175.62 million. This would involve a reinstatement of $17.2 million, and again, I would like to point out that this 

fund represents the largest amount of base federal funding for tribal natural resources management. 

In 1999, Department of Interior, Bureau of Indian Affairs issued a report that documented more than $356 million of unmet annual 

needs, so we are dramatically under-funded, and a reduction would 

be a further harm. 

Moving onto the Fish and Wildlife Service, I draw your attention 

to the Tribal Wildlife Grants Program. We urge you to consider increasing the funding to $8.4 million, which would be a 20 percent 

increase over last year’s funding. In 2010, the State and Tribal 

Wildlife Grant Program received $90 million, and it is an increase 

of $15 million from the year before and approximately 20 percent. 

We think that tribes should be considered for a 20 percent increase 

proportional to the increased request. 

Moving onto the Environmental Protection Agency, we urge you to preserve the Administration’s request for $32.9 million. This 

comes in two parts. One is a new $30 million for Multi-Media Tribal Implementation Program funds. This is a new program. We are 

not quite sure how this is going to operate at the EPA, but it is 

new funding, and we encourage you to preserve that. Along with that is $2.9 million for capacity building and implementation of that program. 

The last part and final point is with the Indian Environmental 

General Assistance Program, and we encourage you to preserve the 

Administration’s 2011 request of $71.4 million in the GAP Program. 

So with that, sir, that concludes my comments. 

[The statement of Mr. Pardilla follows:] 


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Mr. MORAN. Thank you very much, Mr. Pardilla. We appreciate 

your testimony. We appreciate the testimony of everyone, and those 

who were cut short, please feel free to share your further views 

with the committee, and we have all of your formal testimony. I am 

sorry that I had to cut some people short, but I wanted as many 

members as possible to hear the major points that you wanted to 

make. 


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smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1077 here 56200B.313
648 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1078 here 56200B.314
649 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1079 here 56200B.315
650 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1080 here 56200B.316
651 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1081 here 56200B.317
652 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1082 here 56200B.318
653 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1083 here 56200B.319
654 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1084 here 56200B.320
655 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1085 here 56200B.321
656 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1086 here 56200B.322
657 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1087 here 56200B.323
658 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1088 here 56200B.324
659 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1089 here 56200B.325
660 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1090 here 56200B.326
661 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1091 here 56200B.327
662 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1092 here 56200B.328
663 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1093 here 56200B.329
664 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1094 here 56200B.330
665 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1095 here 56200B.331
666 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1096 here 56200B.332
667 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1097 here 56200B.333
668 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1098 here 56200B.334
669 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1099 here 56200B.335
670 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1100 here 56200B.336
671 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1101 here 56200B.337
672 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1102 here 56200B.338
673 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1103 here 56200B.339
674 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1104 here 56200B.340
675 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1105 here 56200B.341
676 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1106 here 56200B.342
677 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1107 here 56200B.343
678 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1108 here 56200B.344
679 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1109 here 56200B.345
680 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1110 here 56200B.346
681 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1111 here 56200B.347
682 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1112 here 56200B.348
683 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1113 here 56200B.349
684 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1114 here 56200B.350
685 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1115 here 56200B.351
686 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1116 here 56200B.352
687 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1117 here 56200B.353
688 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1118 here 56200B.354
689 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1119 here 56200B.355
690 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1120 here 56200B.356
691 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1121 here 56200B.357
692 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1122 here 56200B.358
693 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1123 here 56200B.359
694 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1124 here 56200B.360
695 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1125 here 56200B.361
696 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1126 here 56200B.362
697 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1127 here 56200B.363
698 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1128 here 56200B.364
699 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1129 here 56200B.365
700 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1130 here 56200B.366
701 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1131 here 56200B.367
702 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1132 here 56200B.368
703 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1133 here 56200B.369
704 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1134 here 56200B.370
705 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1135 here 56200B.371
706 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1136 here 56200B.372
707 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1137 here 56200B.373
708 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1138 here 56200B.374
709 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1139 here 56200B.375
710 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1140 here 56200B.376
711 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1141 here 56200B.377
712 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1142 here 56200B.378
713 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1143 here 56200B.379
714 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1144 here 56200B.380
715 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1145 here 56200B.381
716 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1146 here 56200B.382
717 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1147 here 56200B.383
718 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1148 here 56200B.384
719 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1149 here 56200B.385
720 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1150 here 56200B.386
721 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1151 here 56200B.387
722 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1152 here 56200B.388
723 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1153 here 56200B.389
724 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1154 here 56200B.390
725 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1155 here 56200B.391
726 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1156 here 56200B.392
727 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1157 here 56200B.393
728 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1158 here 56200B.394
729 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1159 here 56200B.395
730 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1160 here 56200B.396
731 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1161 here 56200B.397
732 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1162 here 56200B.398
733 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1163 here 56200B.399
734 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1164 here 56200B.400
735 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1165 here 56200B.401
736 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1166 here 56200B.402
737 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1167 here 56200B.403
738 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1168 here 56200B.404
739 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1169 here 56200B.405
740 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1170 here 56200B.406
741 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1171 here 56200B.407
742 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1172 here 56200B.408
743 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1173 here 56200B.409
744 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1174 here 56200B.410
745 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1175 here 56200B.411
746 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1176 here 56200B.412
747 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1177 here 56200B.413
748 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1178 here 56200B.414
749 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1179 here 56200B.415
750 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1180 here 56200B.416
751 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1181 here 56200B.417
752 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1182 here 56200B.418
753 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1183 here 56200B.419
754 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1184 here 56200B.420
755 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1185 here 56200B.421
756 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1186 here 56200B.422
757 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1187 here 56200B.423
758 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1188 here 56200B.424
759 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1189 here 56200B.425
760 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1190 here 56200B.426
761 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1191 here 56200B.427
762 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1192 here 56200B.428
763 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1193 here 56200B.429
764 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1194 here 56200B.430
765 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1195 here 56200B.431
766 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1196 here 56200B.432
767 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1197 here 56200B.433
768 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1198 here 56200B.434
769 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1199 here 56200B.435
770 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1200 here 56200B.436
771 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1201 here 56200B.437
772 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1202 here 56200B.438
773 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1203 here 56200B.439
774 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1204 here 56200B.440
775 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1205 here 56200B.441
776 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1206 here 56200B.442
777 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1207 here 56200B.443
778 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1208 here 56200B.444
779 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1209 here 56200B.445
780 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1210 here 56200B.446
781 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1211 here 56200B.447
782 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1212 here 56200B.448
783 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1213 here 56200B.449
784 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1214 here 56200B.450
785 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1215 here 56200B.451
786 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1216 here 56200B.452
787 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1217 here 56200B.453
788 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1218 here 56200B.454
789 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1219 here 56200B.455
790 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1220 here 56200B.456
791 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1221 here 56200B.457
792 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1222 here 56200B.458
793 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1223 here 56200B.459
794 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1224 here 56200B.460
795 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1225 here 56200B.461
796 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1226 here 56200B.462
797 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1227 here 56200B.463
798 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1228 here 56200B.464
799 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1229 here 56200B.465
800 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1230 here 56200B.466
801 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1231 here 56200B.467
802 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1232 here 56200B.468
803 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1233 here 56200B.469
804 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1234 here 56200B.470
805 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1235 here 56200B.471
806 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1236 here 56200B.472
807 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1237 here 56200B.473
808 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1238 here 56200B.474
809 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1239 here 56200B.475
810 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1240 here 56200B.476
811 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1241 here 56200B.477
812 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1242 here 56200B.478
813 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1243 here 56200B.479
814 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1244 here 56200B.480
815 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1245 here 56200B.481
816 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1246 here 56200B.482
817 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1247 here 56200B.483
818 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1248 here 56200B.484
819 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1249 here 56200B.485
820 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1250 here 56200B.486
821 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1251 here 56200B.487
822 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1252 here 56200B.488
823 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1253 here 56200B.489
824 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1254 here 56200B.490
825 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1255 here 56200B.491
826 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1256 here 56200B.492
827 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1257 here 56200B.493
828 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1258 here 56200B.494
829 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1259 here 56200B.495
830 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1260 here 56200B.496
831 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1261 here 56200B.497
832 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1262 here 56200B.498
833 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1263 here 56200B.499
834 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1264 here 56200B.500
835 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1265 here 56200B.501
836 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1266 here 56200B.502
837 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1267 here 56200B.503
838 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1268 here 56200B.504
839 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1269 here 56200B.505
840 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1270 here 56200B.506
841 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1271 here 56200B.507
842 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1272 here 56200B.508
843 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1273 here 56200B.509
844 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1274 here 56200B.510
845 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1275 here 56200B.511
846 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1276 here 56200B.512
847 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1277 here 56200B.513
848 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1278 here 56200B.514
849 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1279 here 56200B.515
850 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1280 here 56200B.516
851 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1281 here 56200B.517
852 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1282 here 56200B.518
853 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1283 here 56200B.519
854 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1284 here 56200B.520
855 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1285 here 56200B.521
856 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1286 here 56200B.522
857 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1287 here 56200B.523
858 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1288 here 56200B.524
859 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1289 here 56200B.525
860 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1290 here 56200B.526
861 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1291 here 56200B.527
862 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1292 here 56200B.528
863 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1293 here 56200B.529
864 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1294 here 56200B.530
865 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1295 here 56200B.531
866 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1296 here 56200B.532
867 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1297 here 56200B.533
868 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1298 here 56200B.534
869 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1299 here 56200B.535
870 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1300 here 56200B.536
871 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1301 here 56200B.537
872 


smartinez on DSKB9S0YB1PROD with HEARINGInsert offset folio 1302 here 56200B.538
873 


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(i) 

I N D E X 

Voices From Our Native American Communities 

March 23, 2010 

INDEX—ORGANIZATIONS 

Page 

Assiniboine and Sioux Tribes of Fort Peck Reservation ....................................... 82 

California Rural Indian Health Board ................................................................... 204 

Catawba Indian Nation ........................................................................................... 163 

Cheyenne River Sioux Tribe ................................................................................... 212 

Choctaw Nation of Oklahoma ................................................................................. 156 

Chugach Regional Resources Commission ............................................................. 117 

Colville Reservation, Confederated Tribes of ........................................................ 56 

Dine Power Authority .............................................................................................. 195 

Dzilth-Na-O-Dith-Hle Community Grant School Board ....................................... 199 

Fort Belknap Indian Community ........................................................................... 184 

Great Lakes Indian Fish and Wildlife Commission .............................................. 144 

Independent Tribal Courts Review Team .............................................................. 110 

Institute for Indian Estate Planning ..................................................................... 9 

Intertribal Timber Council ...................................................................................... 97 

Isleta Pueblo ............................................................................................................. 104 

Johnson-O’Malley Association ................................................................................ 209 

Kodiak Area Native Association ............................................................................. 125 

Lac Du Flambeau Band of Lake Superior Chippewa Indian Tribe ..................... 176 

Lower Elwha Klallam Tribe .................................................................................... 15 

Lummi Indian Nation ............................................................................................. 3 

National Council of Urban Indian Health ............................................................. 169 

National Indian Education Association ................................................................. 90 

National Indian Health Board ................................................................................ 150 

Northwest Indian Fisheries Commission ............................................................... 29 

Oglala Sioux Tribe ................................................................................................... 138 

Puyallup Tribe of Indians ....................................................................................... 22 

Santee Sioux Tribe .................................................................................................. 61 

Seattle Indian Health Board ................................................................................... 36 

Siltez Tribe ............................................................................................................... 76 

Skokomish Indian Tribe .......................................................................................... 44 

[Sonosky, Chambers, Sachse, Miller & Munson] .................................................. 226 

Squaxin Island Tribe ............................................................................................... 50 

Southcentral Foundation ......................................................................................... 132 

United South and Eastern Tribes, Inc ................................................................... 221 

United Tribes Technical College ............................................................................. 189 

Warm Springs Reservation of Oregon, Confederated Tribes of ........................... 69 


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INDEX—WITNESSES 

Bean, David .............................................................................................................. 22 

Begay, Steve ............................................................................................................. 195 

Benavides, Robert .................................................................................................... 104 

BlueEyes, Faye ........................................................................................................ 199 

Brings Plenty, Joseph .............................................................................................. 212 

Brown-Schwalenberg, Patty .................................................................................... 117 

Cagey, Henry ............................................................................................................ 3 

Charles, Frances ...................................................................................................... 15 

Coochise, Elbridge ................................................................................................... 110 

Crouch, James .......................................................................................................... 204 

Durglo, Joe ............................................................................................................... 97 

Dustybull, Harold .................................................................................................... 209 

Finley, Michael ........................................................................................................ 56 

Forquera, Ralph ....................................................................................................... 36 

Frank, Billy Jr. ........................................................................................................ 29 

Gipp, David .............................................................................................................. 189 

Gottlieb, Katherine .................................................................................................. 132 

Grim, Michael .......................................................................................................... 29 

Kelly, Bob ................................................................................................................. 29 

King, Tracy Ching ................................................................................................... 184 

Kruger, Pete ............................................................................................................. 50 

Marks, Patricia ........................................................................................................ 61 

Miller, Lloyd ............................................................................................................. 226 

Mousseau, Hermes John ......................................................................................... 138 

Nash, Douglas .......................................................................................................... 9 

Patterson, Brian ....................................................................................................... 221 

Pavel, Joseph ............................................................................................................ 44 

Peercy, Mickey ......................................................................................................... 156 

Peters, Ray ............................................................................................................... 50 

Pigsley, Deloris ........................................................................................................ 76 

Rodgers, Donald ....................................................................................................... 163 

Rolin, Buford ............................................................................................................ 150 

Roth, Geoffrey .......................................................................................................... 169 

Stafne, A.T. .............................................................................................................. 82 

Suppah, Ron ............................................................................................................. 69 

Teuber, Andy ............................................................................................................ 125 

Trudell, Roger .......................................................................................................... 61 

Wawronowicz, Larry ................................................................................................ 176 

Whitefoot, Patricia ................................................................................................... 90 

Zorn, James .............................................................................................................. 144 

Issues from the Field: Public Witnesses and Members of Congress 

March 25, 2010 

INDEX—ORGANIZATIONS 

American Association of Museums ......................................................................... 295 

American Lung Association .................................................................................... 260 

American Society of Civil Engineers ...................................................................... 357 

Association of Art Museum Directors .................................................................... 295 

Audubon Society ...................................................................................................... 332 

Everglades Coalition ................................................................................................ 320 


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Families of Flight 93 ............................................................................................... 245 

Federal Forest Resource Coalition ......................................................................... 326 

Geological Society of America ................................................................................. 308 

Interstate Council on Water Policy ........................................................................ 302 

Interstate Mining Compact Commission ............................................................... 267 

Member of Congress .................................................................................... 236, 242, 292 

National Association of Clean Air Agencies .......................................................... 345 

National Parks Second Century Commission ........................................................ 278 

National Wildlife Federation .................................................................................. 339 

Nature Conservancy ................................................................................................ 351 

Partnership for National Trails System ................................................................ 253 

USGS Coalition ........................................................................................................ 314 

Wildlife Conservation Society ................................................................................. 285 

INDEX—MEMBERS OF CONGRESS 

Heller, Representative Dean ................................................................................... 236 

Reyes, Representative Silvestre ............................................................................. 242 

Sherman, Representative Brad .............................................................................. 292 

INDEX—WITNESSES 

Calvelli, John ........................................................................................................... 285 

Cassidy, Tom ............................................................................................................ 351 

Cerullo, Arthur ........................................................................................................ 260 

Douglas, Mary Sullivan ........................................................................................... 345 

Evans, Peter ............................................................................................................. 302 

Fain, Sara ................................................................................................................. 320

Felt, Gordon ............................................................................................................. 245 

Garner, Mike ............................................................................................................ 267 

Gropp, Dr. Robert .................................................................................................... 314 

Hinojosa, Maria ........................................................................................................ 278 

Lambert, Bradley ..................................................................................................... 267 

Long, Gretchen ......................................................................................................... 278 

Moffatt, Laurie Norton ............................................................................................ 295 

Moore, Brian ............................................................................................................ 332 

Natale, Patrick ......................................................................................................... 357 

Partin, Tom .............................................................................................................. 326 

Schiffries, Dr. Craig ................................................................................................. 308 

Stein, Dr. Bruce ....................................................................................................... 339 

Werner, Gary ........................................................................................................... 253 

Voices from Our Native American Communities 

April 15, 2010 

INDEX—ORGANIZATIONS 

American Dental Association .................................................................................. 446 

Association of Community Tribal Schools ............................................................. 410 

Black Mesa Community School Board ................................................................... 416 

Columbia River Inter-Tribal Fish Commission ..................................................... 452 

Friends of Indian Health ......................................................................................... 468 

Makah Tribal Council ............................................................................................. 394 

National Congress of American Indians ................................................................ 387 

National Tribal Environmental Council ................................................................ 475 


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Navajo Hopi Land Commission .............................................................................. 441 

Nez Perce Tribal Executive Committee ................................................................. 402 

Northwest Portland Area Indian Health Board .................................................... 375 

Pueblo of Laguna ..................................................................................................... 457 

Quinault Indian Nation ........................................................................................... 381 

Ramah Navajo Chapter of the Ramah Band of Navajos ...................................... 462 

Ramah Navajo School Board, Inc ........................................................................... 428 

Shoshone-Bannock Tribes of the Fort Hall Reservation ...................................... 422 

Tribal Education Departments National Assembly .............................................. 435 

United Sioux Tribes Development Corporation .................................................... 367 

INDEX—WITNESSES 

Antonio, John E. ...................................................................................................... 457 

Bitsuie, Roman ......................................................................................................... 441 

Bordeaux, Dr. Roger ................................................................................................ 410 

Jainga, Jerome ......................................................................................................... 435 

Joseph, Andy ............................................................................................................ 375 

Keel, Jefferson .......................................................................................................... 387 

Martine-Alonzo, Nancy ............................................................................................ 428 

Martinez, Rodger ..................................................................................................... 462 

Oatman, McCoy ....................................................................................................... 452 

Pardilla, Jerry .......................................................................................................... 475 

Penney, Sam ............................................................................................................. 402 

Sharp, Fawn ............................................................................................................. 381 

Skye, Clarence ......................................................................................................... 367 

Small, Nathan .......................................................................................................... 422 

Tyler, Nate ............................................................................................................... 394 

Walker, Dr. Dale ...................................................................................................... 468 

Walker, Dr. Mark .................................................................................................... 446 

Yellowhair, Marvin .................................................................................................. 416 

Written Public Testimony 

INDEX—ORGANIZATIONS 

1854 Treaty Authority ............................................................................................. 484 

Alaska Wilderness League ...................................................................................... 487 

Alliance of National Heritage Areas ...................................................................... 493 

American Assoication of Petroleum Geoligists ...................................................... 497 

American Bird Conservancy ................................................................................... 500 

American Forest & Paper Association ................................................................... 504 

American Forest Foundation............................................................................... 510, 914 

American Forests ..................................................................................................... 508 

American Indian Higher Education Consortium .................................................. 514 

American Institute of Biological Sciences .............................................................. 518 

American Public Power Association ....................................................................... 522 

American Rivers ...................................................................................................... 524 

American Society for Microbiology ......................................................................... 528 

American Society of Agronomy ............................................................................... 532 

American Society of Mechanical Engineers ........................................................... 536 

American Sportfishing Association ........................................................................ 540 

Amigos de la Sevilleta ............................................................................................. 544 

Animal Welfare Institute ........................................................................................ 546 

Appalachian Mountain Club ................................................................................... 550 


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Appalachian Trail Conservancy .............................................................................. 554 

Association of American Universities .................................................................... 489 

Association of Public and Land-Grant Universities .............................................. 562 

Association of Research Libraries .......................................................................... 566 

Association of State Drinking Water Administrators ........................................... 558 

Bat Conservation International .............................................................................. 569 

Biomass Energy Research Association ................................................................... 573 

Bird Conservation Alliance ..................................................................................... 577 

Bird Conservation Funding Coalition .................................................................... 580 

Buffalo Field Campaign .......................................................................................... 584 

California Forest Pest Council ................................................................................ 914 

Cascade Land Conservancy .................................................................................... 588 

Center for Coalfield Justice .................................................................................... 592 

Center for Plant Conservation ................................................................................ 594 

Central Arkansas Water ......................................................................................... 598 

Childrens Environmental Health Network ........................................................... 600 

Chippewa Flowage Project in Wisconsin ............................................................... 604 

Citizens Coal Council .............................................................................................. 607 

City of Chicago Department of Streets & Sanitation, Bureau of Forestry ......... 914 

Civil War Preservation Trust ................................................................................. 609 

Closeup Foundation ................................................................................................. 613 

Coalition for Environmentally Safe Schools .......................................................... 619 

Coalition for Healthier Schools ........................................................................... 620, 622 

Colorado River Basin Salinity Control Forum ...................................................... 616 

Colorado River Board of California ........................................................................ 624 

Colorado River Commission of Nevada .................................................................. 628 

Confederated Tribes of the Grande Ronde Community of Oregon ...................... 629 

Connecticut Council of Trout Unlimted ................................................................. 632 

Conservation Fund .................................................................................................. 636 

Cooperative Alliance for Refuge Enhancement (CARE) ....................................... 640 

Council for Tribal Employment Rights .................................................................. 643 

Council of Western State Foresters ........................................................................ 647 

Cuyahoga Valley National Park Association ......................................................... 649 

Dance/USA ............................................................................................................... 652 

Davey Institute ........................................................................................................ 914 

Defenders of Wildlife ............................................................................................... 656 

Deschutes Chapter of Trout Unlimited .................................................................. 660 

Doris Day Animal League ....................................................................................... 744 

Emissions Control Technology Association ............................................................ 667 

Endangered Species Coalition ................................................................................ 671 

Environmental Council of the States (ECOS) ....................................................... 663 

Federation of State Humanities Councils .............................................................. 675 

Fond du Lac Band of Lake Superior Chippewa .................................................... 679 

Friends of Back Bay ................................................................................................ 683 

Friends of Balcones Canyonlands National Wildlife Refuge ................................ 686 

Friends of Blackwater National Wildlife Refuge .................................................. 689 

Friends of Congaree Swamp ................................................................................... 692 

Friends of Maine Seabird Islands .......................................................................... 695 

Friends of Rachel Carson National Wildlife Refuge ............................................. 697 

Friends of Shiawassee National Wildlife Refuge .................................................. 699 

Friends of the Bosque del Apache National Wildlife Refuge ............................... 701 

Friends of the Chassahowitzka National Wildlife Refuge .................................... 703 

Friends of the Tampa Bay National Wildlife Refuges, Inc .................................. 706 

Friends of Virgin Islands National Park ............................................................... 708 

Friends of Wallkill River National Wildlife Refuge .............................................. 711 


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Friends of Wertheim National Wildlife Refuge ..................................................... 713 

Georgie Department of Natural Resources ............................................................ 715 

Grand Valley Water Users Association .................................................................. 718 

Great Lakes Commission des Grands Lacs ........................................................... 722 

Greater Yellowstone Coalition ................................................................................ 719 

Green Mountain Club .............................................................................................. 726 

Ground Water Protection Council .......................................................................... 729 

Healing Our Waters - Great Lakes Coalition ........................................................ 732 

Hoopa Valley Tribal Council ................................................................................... 736 

Hoopa Valley Tribe, K’ima:w Medical Center ....................................................... 740 

Humane Society Legislative Fund ......................................................................... 744 

Humane Society of the United States .................................................................... 744 

Ice Age Floods Institute .......................................................................................... 752 

Idaho Conservation League .................................................................................... 756 

International Association of Fire Chiefs ................................................................ 757 

International Code Council ..................................................................................... 759 

International Maple Syrup Institute ...................................................................... 914 

InterTribal Bison Cooperative ................................................................................ 762 

Izaak Walton League of America ........................................................................... 766 

Kern County Valley Floor Habitat Conservation Plan Industry & Government 

Coalition ................................................................................................................ 770 

Land and Water Conservation Fund Coalition ..................................................... 774 

League of American Orchestras ............................................................................. 778 

Ludlow’s Island Resort ............................................................................................ 782 

Marine Conservation Biology Institute .................................................................. 786 

Metropolitan Water District of Southern California ............................................. 790 

Mother Lode Chapter, Sierra Club ......................................................................... 793 

Mulch & Soil Council ............................................................................................... 914 

National Assembly of State Arts Agencies ............................................................ 796 

National Association of Forest Service Retirees ................................................... 800 

National Association of State Energy Officials ..................................................... 804 

National Association of State Foresters ............................................................. 807, 914 

National Association of Tribal Historic Preservation Officers ............................. 845 

National Conference of State Historic Preservation Officers ............................... 811 

National Cooperators’ Coalition .............................................................................. 849 

National Fish and Wildlife Foundation ................................................................. 815 

National Humanities Alliance ................................................................................ 852 

National Institutes for Water Resources ............................................................... 819 

National Mining Association ................................................................................... 823 

National Parks and Hospitality Association ......................................................... 827 

National Parks Conservation Association ............................................................. 831 

National Plant Board .............................................................................................. 914 

National Recreation and Park Association ............................................................ 835 

National Trust for Historic Preservation ............................................................... 839 

National Wildlife Refuge Association ..................................................................... 856 

Native American Healing Through Horses Alliance ............................................. 843 

Nature Conservancy ................................................................................................ 914 

New Jersey Audubon Society .................................................................................. 860 

New Mexico Wildlife Federation ............................................................................ 863 

New York Department of Environmental Conservation ...................................... 914 

North American Maple Syrup Council, Inc ........................................................... 914 

Northern Plains Resource Council ......................................................................... 867 

Ohio Environmental Council .................................................................................. 868 

Opera America ......................................................................................................... 871 

Ophir (Town of), CO ................................................................................................ 875 


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Oregon Water Resources Congress ......................................................................... 877 

Orleans Audubon Society, Inc ................................................................................. 881 

Outdoor Alliance ...................................................................................................... 884 

Pelican Island Preservation Society ....................................................................... 888 

Pennsylvania Department of Agriculture .............................................................. 914 

Performing Arts Alliance ........................................................................................ 890 

Pocono Heritage Land Trust ................................................................................... 894 

Preservation Action ................................................................................................. 897 

Public Lands Foundation ........................................................................................ 901 

Public Trust Environmental Legal Institute of Florida, Inc ................................ 905 

Purdue University, Department of Entomology .................................................... 914 

Rainforest Biodiversity Group ................................................................................ 908 

Red Lake Band of Chippewa Indians ..................................................................... 910 

Rocky Mountain Climate Organization ................................................................. 917 

San Diego County Water Authority ....................................................................... 921 

Sierra Foothills Audubon Society ........................................................................... 923 

Society for American Archaeology .......................................................................... 926 

Society of American Florists ................................................................................... 914 

Standing Rock Sioux Tribe ..................................................................................... 930 

Team El Toro ........................................................................................................... 934 

Theatre Communications Group ............................................................................ 937 

Trust for Public Land .............................................................................................. 940 

Union of Concerned Scientists ................................................................................ 914 

Upper Peninsula Public Access Coalition .............................................................. 944 

Vermont Council of Trout Unlimited ..................................................................... 948 

Wellington, FL ......................................................................................................... 951 

West Virginia University National Drinking Water Clearinghouse ................... 956 

Western Interstate Energy Board (WINB) ............................................................ 954 

Wheeler Wildlife Refuge Association ..................................................................... 960 

Wilderness Society ................................................................................................... 970 

Wildlands CPR ......................................................................................................... 962 

Wildlife Society ........................................................................................................ 966 

Wisconsin Board of Commissioners of Public Land .............................................. 974 

Wyoming State Engineer’s Office ........................................................................... 977 

INDEX—WITNESSES 

Adler, Prudence S. ................................................................................................... 566 

Arnold, Susan ........................................................................................................... 550 

Bajura, Richard A. ................................................................................................... 956 

Barnes, Randy .......................................................................................................... 875 

Barnett, Claire ......................................................................................................... 622 

Bartel, Dan ............................................................................................................... 770 

Baskin, Laurie ......................................................................................................... 937 

Basralian, Joe .......................................................................................................... 860 

Bearer, Cynthia ....................................................................................................... 600 

Beetham, Mary Beth ............................................................................................... 656 

Berdahl, Robert M. .................................................................................................. 489 

Bisson, Henri R. ....................................................................................................... 901 

Blazer, Arthur Butch ............................................................................................... 647 

Blue-McLean, Anngeolace ....................................................................................... 703 

Bowen, Darell ........................................................................................................... 951 

Bowers, Carla ........................................................................................................... 583 

Brister, Daniel ......................................................................................................... 584 

Brown, Molly P. ....................................................................................................... 683 


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Brown, R. Steven ..................................................................................................... 663 

Brownrigg, Ted ........................................................................................................ 660 

Budd, Dan s. ............................................................................................................. 977 

Burns, Kathleen ....................................................................................................... 935 

Caan, George M. ...................................................................................................... 628 

Carlson, Ervin .......................................................................................................... 762 

Carr, Julie Palakovich ............................................................................................. 518 

Chandler, William ................................................................................................... 786 

Clark, Chris .............................................................................................................. 715 

Clark, Les ................................................................................................................. 770

Colburn, David ......................................................................................................... 675 

Coulson, Jennifer ..................................................................................................... 881 

Crandall, Derrick A. ................................................................................................ 827 

D’Antonio, John R. ................................................................................................... 616 

Daulton, Michael ...................................................................................................... 580 

Davis, James ............................................................................................................ 934 

Davis, Mary .............................................................................................................. 934 

Davis, Timothy S. .................................................................................................... 613 

DeCoster, Kathy ....................................................................................................... 940 

Dickson, David ......................................................................................................... 486 

Diver, Karen R. ........................................................................................................ 679 

Durkin, Bill .............................................................................................................. 697 

Duvernoy, Gene ....................................................................................................... 588 

Easley, Tom .............................................................................................................. 917 

Eder, Tim .................................................................................................................. 722

Edwards, Conrad ..................................................................................................... 643 

Erickson, Aimee ....................................................................................................... 607 

Fascione, Nina ......................................................................................................... 569 

Finkelman, Lois G. .................................................................................................. 835 

Focht, Will ................................................................................................................ 819

Giudice, Philip .......................................................................................................... 804 

Glasener, Karl .......................................................................................................... 532 

Glowienka, James P. ............................................................................................... 632 

Goad, Claire ............................................................................................................. 713 

Gray, Gerald J. ........................................................................................................ 508 

Grego, Dr. John ........................................................................................................ 692 

Gunn, Dr. Sue .......................................................................................................... 962 

Guyer, Ed ................................................................................................................. 736 

Hamilton, Alan ......................................................................................................... 866 

Harbut, Dr. Michael ................................................................................................ 936 

Hargis, Shelia .......................................................................................................... 686 

Hein, Erik ................................................................................................................. 897

Hirsche, Evan ........................................................................................................... 640 

Holmer, Steve ........................................................................................................... 500 

Hoover, Charles ....................................................................................................... 699 

Hopper, Dr. George .................................................................................................. 562 

Hopwood, Jane T. .................................................................................................... 695 

Howard, Barbara ..................................................................................................... 706 

Huta, Leda ............................................................................................................... 671 

Hutchins, Michael .................................................................................................... 580 

Hymel, Stephanie .................................................................................................... 598 

Ibata, Dr. Brent ....................................................................................................... 748 

Iwan, Gerald R. ........................................................................................................ 956 

James, Ted ............................................................................................................... 770 

Johnson, Jeffrey D. .................................................................................................. 758 


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Jourdain Jr., Floyd .................................................................................................. 910 

Kane, Robert ............................................................................................................ 736 

Kennedy, Cheryle A. ................................................................................................ 629 

Kennedy, Kathryn L. ............................................................................................... 594 

Kessler, Elizabeth S. ............................................................................................... 835 

Kessler, Joe .............................................................................................................. 708 

Kiernan, Thomas C. ................................................................................................. 831 

Kightlinger, Jeffrey .................................................................................................. 790 

King, Tim .................................................................................................................. 934

Kleinknecht, Gary .................................................................................................... 752 

Koehn, Steve ............................................................................................................ 807 

Kovarovics, Scott ...................................................................................................... 766 

Kraus, D. Bambi ...................................................................................................... 845 

Kurtzweil, Douglas J. .............................................................................................. 609 

Larson, Douglas C. .................................................................................................. 954 

Lawton, Joe .............................................................................................................. 875 

Lee, Joe ..................................................................................................................... 729 

Leonard, George M. ................................................................................................. 800 

Leopold, Bruce ......................................................................................................... 966 

Lighthizer, O. James ............................................................................................... 609 

Liss, Cathy ............................................................................................................... 546 

Lord, Chad ................................................................................................................ 732 

Lorenz, John C. ........................................................................................................ 497 

Ludlow, Mark ........................................................................................................... 782 

Martin, Tom ............................................................................................................. 510 

Mason, Maria ........................................................................................................... 619 

Massey, Steve ........................................................................................................... 888 

Masten, Leonard .................................................................................................. 736, 740 

McCollum, Michelle ................................................................................................. 493 

Meyer, Kristy ........................................................................................................... 868 

Miller, Andrew ......................................................................................................... 905 

Miller, Dr. Gregory .................................................................................................. 884 

Mimiaga, Bill ............................................................................................................ 934 

Mimiaga, Christine .................................................................................................. 934 

Moe, Richard ............................................................................................................ 839 

Moore, Chris ............................................................................................................. 948 

Morganthau, Thomas A. .......................................................................................... 894 

Murphy, Charles W. ................................................................................................ 930 

Murray, William R. .................................................................................................. 504 

Myers, Jacob ............................................................................................................. 484 

Nelson, Tia ............................................................................................................... 974 

O’Connor, Martin ..................................................................................................... 689 

O’Dowd, Grace .......................................................................................................... 934 

O’Dowd, Robert ........................................................................................................ 934 

O’Grady, Dr. Richard ............................................................................................... 518 

Olson, Jody ............................................................................................................... 815 

Pellegrino, Joan L. ................................................................................................... 573 

Pfister, Ellen ............................................................................................................ 867 

Pierpont, Ruth .......................................................................................................... 811 

Pizarchik, Joseph ..................................................................................................... 607 

Poole, Bob ................................................................................................................. 770

Pope, Maddy ............................................................................................................. 774 

Proctor, Richard L. .................................................................................................. 718 

Raabe, Peter ............................................................................................................. 524 

Ratliff, Mary Lee ...................................................................................................... 960 


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Regan, Ron ............................................................................................................... 580 

Regan, Timothy ........................................................................................................ 667 

Riley, Steve ............................................................................................................... 849

Rippel, Raina ............................................................................................................ 592 

Rivenes, Barbara L. ................................................................................................. 793 

Rivenes, Donald L. ................................................................................................... 923 

Robertson, Gordon ................................................................................................... 540 

Robison, John ........................................................................................................... 756 

Rosen, Jesse ............................................................................................................. 778 

Rowsome, Alan ......................................................................................................... 970 

Sakura, Daniel G. .................................................................................................... 636 

Schneider, Daniel R. ................................................................................................ 908 

Schroeder, Darin C............................................................................................... 577, 580 

Schulfer, Roche ........................................................................................................ 890 

Scorca, Marc ............................................................................................................. 871 

Shea, Susan .............................................................................................................. 726 

Snyder, Andrea ........................................................................................................ 652 

Soare, Mihail ............................................................................................................ 740 

Springer, Marie ........................................................................................................ 711 

Staab, Darek ............................................................................................................ 660 

Stapleton, Maureen A. ............................................................................................ 921 

Startzell, David N. ................................................................................................... 554 

Stowe, Nyleen Troxel ............................................................................................... 544 

Sybert, Brian ............................................................................................................ 719 

Taft, James D. .......................................................................................................... 558 

Tyrrell, Patrick T. .................................................................................................... 977 

Uldrich, John ........................................................................................................... 934 

Vradenburg, Leigh Ann ........................................................................................... 701 

Warren, Nancy ......................................................................................................... 944 

Winkler, Anita ......................................................................................................... 877 

Yandala, Deb ............................................................................................................ 649 

Yerkes, Sara C. ........................................................................................................ 761 

Zimmerman, Gerald R. ............................................................................................ 624 

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