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- --\ ) BEFORE THE WEST VIRGINIA DEPARTMENT OF ENVIRONMENTAL PROTECTION

DIVISION OF AIR QUALITY

In re: Revisions to Rule 45CSR14

- Permits for Construction andMajor Modification of Major stationary Sources of Air Pollution for the Prevention of Significant Deterioration.

Transcript of proceedings had at a public hearing in the above-styled matter taken at the West Virginia Department of Environmental Protection, Division of Air Quality, Conference Room, 601 57th Street, S.E. Charleston, West Virginia, commencing at 6:19 p.m., on the 11thday of July, 2011, pursuant to notice.

MISSY L. YOUNG, C.C.R.

POST OFFICE BOX 6296 CHARLESTON, WEST VIRGINIA 25362 304-205-4929 or 304-539-6192 1

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## ~ 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 Proceedings 2

PRO C E E DINGS MR. MASON: This public hearing will now come to order on this 11thdayof July, 2011, at theWest Virginia Department of Environmental Protection Headquarters. Comments and testimonywill be accepteduntil the close of this hearing and will be made part of the rulemaking record. Any question regarding revisions to the rules will be includedwith your comments, and any such question will be answered as part of the response to comments in the rulemaking record. The purpose of this public hearing is to satisfy state rUlemaking requirements by accepting comments onproposed revisions to rule 45CSR14

- Permits for Construction andMajorModification of Major Stationary Sources of Air Pollution for the Prevention of Significant Deterioration. This rule establishes a state construction permit program consistent with the federal CleanAirAct and implementing regulations titled "Preventionof Significant Deterioration of Air Quality." Revisions to the rule incorporate changes to the federal counterpart, Prevention of Significant Deterioration for Particulate MatterLess Than 2.5
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- Increments, Significant Impact Levels and 2 Significant Monitoring Concentration. upon authorization 3 and promulgation of 45CSR14, the Division will submit the 4 rule to the EPA as a revision to the State Implementation 5 Planpursuant to the federal Clean Air Act. 6 The floor is now open for comments. Please 7 state your name and any affiliation. 8 MR. KOTSON: My name is James Kotson, I'm 9 the chair of the Energy Committee for the West Virginia 10 Chapter of the Sierra Club. Specificallywhat's being done 11 to 45CSR14, there are a number of minor changes to many 12 terms. In particularly there is definitions for content 13 such as the baseline area and the baseline dates. It does 14 not appear that either of those terms have any application 15 to constructionpermits, except for the concept of the 16 Platt Line applicability, Platt Line Applicability 17 Limitation, it's referred to as the PAL. 18 The PAL concept is something that we have 19 been opposed to for quite sometime. It is our 20 recommendation that in this rule, we simply eliminate that 21 concept all together. We believe that it would make a lot 22 more sense to simply applypollution emission limits to 23 each emission point rather than have emission limits apply
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\! 1 to a plant-wide facility. It wouldmake monitoringmuch 2

# ~ 3 simpler, it would make it much easier to identify the best available control technologies. From that standpoint, we 4 recommend that the rule be further revised to strike any 5 and all references to the Platt Line Applicability 6 Limitations. That concludes my comments. 7 MR. MASON: Thankyou, Mr. Kotson. 8 MS. MAUL: I'd also like to speak on this 9 rule. My name is MaryAnn Maul, I'm an attorneyhere in 10 Charleston, west Virginia. I have represented Bill Hughes 11 in a Air Quality current appeal 10-03, for the Air Quality 12 Board, whichhas been heard, but we have .not received a 13 written decision on as of yet. In this case the main issue 14 was whether two proposedpermits for natural gas compressor 15 stations wouldbe considered together, which is also called 16 aggregated or aggregation. Also, whether the connected 17 well paths to each of those compressor stations would be 18 considered together when total emissions were calculated 19 for each of these compressor stations, both separately and 20 together. 21 Inboth of those issues the Board ruled 22 against us. The Agency took the positionthat each of 23 these emissionpoints, each compressor station that is, and
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### e.e.R. (3011)205-1f-91f-2rn(3011)539-6192Proceedings 5

1 eachwell cap that is, despite the fact that theywere all i 2 physicallyconnectedbypipelines intended to carrynatural

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## I gas shouldbe consider separate emissionpoints and 4 permitted as separate emission units. 5 We believe that is contraryto the federal 6 law and therefore makes the data limitations plan, out of 7 compliance with the CleanAirAct. We briefed this issue 8 extensively in filing in this matter and I refer the 9 rulemaking officials to that record for further 10 information. Thank you. 11 MS. HERNANDEZ: I would like to comment. My 12 name is Renee Hernandez, H-e-r-n-a-n-d-e-z. I'm withWest 13 Virginia for Moms, and I'm also quite concerned about 14 Marcellus shale compressor stations, and the separate 15 ruling and believe that aggregate shouldbe considered in 16 DEP'S consideration for air quality. This is a grave 17 concern of ours that we standupon also. I request that the 18 DEP refer to the federal CleanAirAct also. 19 MR. MASON: There being nothing further, 20 this public hearing for proposed 21 MR. GASPER: Wait, I have a comment, I 22 guess. It's a little something different inthat I'm Don 23 Gasper, from Buckhannon, West Virginia, I'm with the E
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### IJ.a.(304)205-4942""(304)539-6/92Proceedings 6

1 Counsel, I guess. Don G-a-s-p-e-r. 2 I'd like to say that we should be concerned 3 about health, our own health impacts and our experts on 4 that. It's a rather serious matter. I think we have a 5 high asthma problem in this state. My own lungs are not to 6 good, and I apologize for the way I'm speaking. 7 I'm a retired fishery biologist and I was 8 in charge of management on the National Forests in the 9 state. They have a obligation to preserve the integrity in 10 every sense up there. The resources is our resource, just 11 as DEP must feel a responsibility for west Virginia's 12 resources. 13 They received an awful lot of the regional 14 sulphur emissions. Eightypercent of their deposition is 15 sulphuric acid. It falls when the hard mountain tops, with 16 very little insulation ability. About one fifth of West 17 Virginia trout stream regions have how been acidified over 18 maybe 60 years of continual acid rain. In 1996, I think we 19 all know that the CleanAir Act was environmental groups 20 went to court and forced the Bush administration to 21 implement the CleanAir Act. In one year sUlphur emissions 22 were reduced by half. 23 Earlier, I've been collecting rain and snow
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### 1 for over 10 years and doing chemistryon it and getting the 2 volumes. I do everyevent, I had 70, two for one an 3 average, whereas all the stations measure simply, Tuesday 4 morning at 9 o'clock, weekly samples. Theyhave 52, I have 5 72, andmy events tell me where they originate, weather 6 patterns, how it's delivered. In onlytenyears I had two 7 clean rains that came in off the ocean. Theywere like the 8 original rains. Our snow is still white, it has a 9 conductivity that averages 35 micro centimeter. 10 It's a long way frombeingpure like our 11 ionized water, our de-ionizedwater shouldbe. That's a 12 distillationprocess that we have that is now effectedby 13 acid rain, by sulphate in the air. Nitrogen makes up 20 14 percent of the nitric acid and this is the fertilizer. A 15 lot of the watersheds now are saturatedwithnitrogen and 16 it runs through and it's no longer takingup the soil 17 mantle bythe trees and everythingbecause it's excess 18 nitrogen. It then carries away nutrients like sulphuric 19 acid does. 20 

### That's what I want to tell you. 

### Simply 21 that for over 60 years, when it was so verybad, acid 22 deposition of one pound per acre peryear of Hplus, that's 23 the most acidrain deposition anywhere in the United
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### 1 states. We inwestern Pennsylvania, westernMaryland, get

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## l it. For over 50 years it has leached a lot of nutrients from the spruce. I think reallythe spruce eco system, 4 

### growing as it does, higher elevation, where theyget maybe 5 twice as much acid deposition, as at the lower stations 6 where it's measured, that systemmy crash. We may not 7 expect recovery of the spruce. It's just that the plant 8 available nutrients left after all of these years of 9 leaching, are so few for them to complete their growth in 10 fall, to recycle you know, a hundredyearprocess is 11 ratherunlikely. I think they'll stunt, become unthrifty, 12 effectedby disease and decline. 13 

### Of course I'm a trout biologist and I want 14 

### to saydraining these infertile watersheds now, 15 impoverished further from their geological strata that are 16 alreadynutrient poor, there's one fifth of West Virginia 17 trout streamreaches have been lost over the last 50 years 18 because of acidrain. From undisturbedwatersheds for 19 regions and our regional effect. Penn state records that 20 southernVirginia, belowthe State of West Virginia also 21 records it. 22 I want to saythat these are concerns, 23 these are losses and they shouldbe brought forward to any
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\, 1 kind of comprehensive evaluation of additional power 2 source, you know. That impoverishment rate, we have some 

# 1 3 figures, I won't go into, it's startling. We don't realize 4 that this has been going on for such a long time. It's 5 very significant, economic loss. Not only the loss of the 6 trout streamreaches, but the accelerated leaching of acid 7 rain for over 50 years amounts to at least 250 pounds per 8 acre of calcium, and that's a major nutrient. This is what 9 you would have in an acre of forest, in the eastern forest, 10 in the trucks, 250 pounds per acre. 11 So, if they are contemplating a sand 12 harvest or a forest after another hundredyears, we've had 13 a chemical leaching that amounts to a truck only clear cut 14 of the entire eastern forest over the last 70 years. 15 That's a terrible economic loss folks would say. We're 16 looking at instead of the second cut, whichmost folks 17 thing of today, it's really the third. We've had one cut 18 for gone leached away by acid rain over 50 years. 19 So, these are things I thinkwe have to 20 consider if we are going to preserve what fisheries, what 21 forests we have, and of course our own health is involved 22 too. I raised some issues you probablyhaven't heard of 23 before, but shouldbe considered. My name is down here, I
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1 can sendyou some substantiation, if you call or ask, and 2 answer your questions. Thank you. This is a very easy 10

3 opportunity for me to communicate, and I appreciate it very 4 much. 5 MR. MASON: Thank you for your comments, Mr. 6 Gasper. 7 MR. MANYPENNY: My apologies, I thought you 8 were going to ask if there was any other comments before 9 you started to adjourn. I did want to sayone thing. Mike 10 Manypenny, Delegate for the 42nd District. M-a-n-y-p-e-n-n11 y. 12 First of all I would just like to reiterate 13 what all of these good citizens who have come down to 14 comment on regarding the ambient quality and the different 15 pollutants that are effectingWest Virginia. I just wanted 16 to support all of the comments and suggestions that have 17 beenmade here and offer my support to them, andbe here 18 for them support their causes. 19 MR. MASON: Thank you verymuch for your 20 comments and support. 21 MR. MANYPENNY: Thank you all verymuch too. 22 MR. MASON: Any other comments on 45CSR14? 23 MR. KESLING: Yes, I would like to make a ;/13$$1ij.f!.Iij()U!V(f,eeR.(304)205-4942(JJJ,(304)539-6192Proceedings 11

1 comment. I'm Randy Kesling, I'm with the Mountaineer

1 2 Chapter of Trout Unlimited, out of Clarksburg. I just want 

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# I 5 to say that we see this all the time on the streams, acid deposition. We do liming to help mitigate that acidrain impact on our trout streams. We just appreciate anything 6 that helps, as Mr. Gasper has said, the problems createdby 7 the acid deposition and the additional acid deposition that 8 will occur, you know, the more compressors and the 9 Marcellus and all of the truck traffic, and everything from 10 the Marcellus, has to be considered. It's a concern to us 11 andwe would like to see something that would mitigate that 12 impact. 13 MR. MASON: Thank you, sir. There being 14 nothing further, this public hearing for proposed rule 15 45CSR16 is concluded. 16 (WHEREUPON, the hearing was 17 concluded at 6:36 p.m.) 18 19 20 21 22 23
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### e.e.R.(3011).205-11911.2en(3011)539-6/9.2Proceedings 12

STATE OF WEST VIRGINIA, COUNTY OF KANAWHA, to-wit:

I, the undersigned, MissyL. Young, a certified Court Reporter andNotary Public within and for the State of West Virginia, dulycommissioned and qualified, do hereby certifythat the foregoing, was taken to the best of my skill and ability, a true and accurate transcript of all the proceedings had in the aforementioned matter. Given undermy hand and official seal this 13th dayof July2011.

My commission expires April 15, 2018.**t'-c",~"'--".'** OFFICIALSEAL 

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