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Both th0 tellli-annual reporting and t he anuual 

compliance certificati on only bee~ requir&d 

after the iaau&nce of the permit. 

llso, I wanted to share tQ.th you what tho 

USEPA :say a about Title v· pen:d:ts: t'bb purpoae of 

th• 't'itle V ~raits i$ t.o redUce violation• of air 

pollu·tion la" s and U~Pro"Ve enforcel'll!lnt of those 

laws. Tltle v pcPlits d.o thi-s by: 

L Record1n9 in one document &11 of the air 

pollution control r~rements that apply to the 

Gourc:e. 1'hi.a 9ives members of the public:, 

re9ulators, and the source, a claar picturo, of 

what the focility is required to do to k.Gcp ita 

ai.r {>ollution undQr tbe lega1 ~ ts. 

2. Requiring the source to .aka rec;rular 

re.porta on bOW it i.s tracking iu eaissiona of 

pOllution and the contro~ i t .ls u.&~ to liait 

it• e.Iaaions. Tbese reports are public 

i.n,_form&tion, and you can gat tbeJG fro~n the 

por~ittln9 authority. 

3. Adclin9 IIK>Oitoring, testi09, or record 

keeping requ1%~ ts , where needed, to assure that 

the eouECe cowplies with its e~ssion li~ta or 

other Pollution control requiE·ementa. 

4. ReqU1X'in9 the source to c:artify each yea:r 

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whether or. not it h•s mat the aiT pollution 

requirements i f'l i ts 'l'itlo V pemi t. •rbeso 

cex:titieations are public information. 

5. Makin<J t he terms of. the Title V pe.t:lllit 

tede.rally enforceable. This eea..o.s that the EPA 

and the public can enforce the teras of the 

-p4I'-.it, al.ot\9 wlth the State. 

1 "'ill nov 90 into w-hat this penait doe-s and 

cloes not do: The pendt. does not. do: 

This permit does not a.llov any lnc:Xl!U& 

emission~ abOvo those previously allowed. 

This permit dOes not allow the construction of 

•nY new •quiptQ~~nt or ehe JDOdi.ficati on ol a.ny 

e~atin~ equtpoent. 

tifbat thift perait c;Soes <1o~ 

'fbi a peDDi.t e.e·tablisbes new conditions tht.t 

.w.st now be a4he.r*Cl to AB a result ot the ieauance 

of thia parait. 

Mhezeas all previous pe_~ts Were only 

enforceable by tbe l&PA and OSEPA, this permit ia 

now ent.orceable by the p"blic. 

T.hia pe:rtn.it astablished new reporting 

equire»ents and self-monitoring ~ireaen~a that 

at.• an inte<Jr.,J. part of the title v px09r-U!-· 

This permit is ~ired to be issued under the 

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National 1990 Clw~ ir ~ct ~~nt - - Title v. 

Thia: pormit is considered the primary 

cOAPliance tool for monitorinq an~ verifying 

compliance o~ the aource . 

Now 10M cocsent.s on coni.gbt's bea.rin9· we 

•~ here to provide you info~~ion and perhaps 

raost iq:lortant.lY. to Usten to your C()IIIIM.nt• and 

concerna . 'tour ~nts can, and often do, •ft:ect 

the content of ti)e permit or even tha t:inal a.et.i on 

that is to be taUn on tb• application. so 

please, mak• yOU% concerns known to us. 

lt is also import&nt that you ~~ Known your 

concotns in o~der to retain your r ight& should you 

vi4b to obj•ct to the CAAPP pe.xtdt . In 

~lanation, the issues tnat you may cite in a 

petition to object to the CAAPP peadt IIIAY bo 

lt.ited ~o t ho•• issues that you ba~e pxevioualy 

raised. Therefore, i:9a.in• it is tmporU.nt that 

you identify in v r itin9 any concerns t:M.t you ~y 

have here toni9ht. If n~t here, let ~s know prior 

to the closing of the bearin9 record, which will 

be around 30 days from tonight. You ~Y •ubmit 

auc.h coments' concerning the dra.ft CAJ\PP pormi.t 

~ia a lettex oi e-~il to tbe Ill inOis £PA, B~teau 

of Air, Pe.DIIit section. 

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And finally, I vant to qive you s~ 

infox-ation on what comes next after tonight'e 

haartnQ. The hearing record will close in rou;hly 

30 di,ya ft'OIIl tonight. We wi-1.1 th•n qenerllte a 

proposed CAAP'P penait ~nd seocl t.hiS to the USB.PA 

tor their 4S-d.&y review period. 'fbi& proposed 

CAAPP peodt will also sbov up on our vebsit.e when 

we send it to the OS EPA. 

The public ~ 45 days froa the close of the 

OS£PA 4S day review perLod ln which to petition 

t he USEPA to object to the CAAPP permit. 

Atter the USEPA review period expires, we will 

take final .action on tbe CAAPI? pemit. l\ou9hlY 

aroW'Id the UA!A't we take final action. on the CMPP 

peDait we will .ail out the Sqaring Respoaslvoness 

sunaary. This doc'UfPe.tlt will a.lso a.~ax on our 

weboite. 

!bat concludes •Y opening ceoarks and I'd like 

to turn 1~ over to Ahatoly ~l..oqorslty. , 

1\JfATOLY BELOGOR.SKY, Pendt Roviewor 

(BY HI\. 8EWGOI\SK'l) : Good evening, Ladioa 

and Ge.ntlemen. My name is Anatoly selogoraky and 

t .. an enviro~n~ pro~ction engineer vith the 

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lllt.nola Envir.onmental erotection ~gancy at 

Sp.ritlgtiold. I h•vtt })Sen workinq in the Permit 

Section of the Div-ision of Air Pollution COntJ:ol 

for more than nino years. 

I would ~a to thAnk everybodY for coaing 

hue t.o exprea• your intexe.&t i.n the environtHnU.l 

tss\.183 concernin<J onyx Bnvirou.ental Se rvices 

'[itlo v p roposed poraie . I will bri e tly discuss 

siqn.i ficant emission unit.s ot the· proposed pamlt 

along with uniqueness of this source frOR th& 

te<j'lllatory st.o.ndp01nt. 

Onyx Environmental services in Sauget .is a 

treat~nt, ato~a;e, and disposal ~llty, which 

accepts of!slte qenerated waste fo~ furth•~ 

dispOSal throu;K incin~a~oaTbo Illioo 1e EPA b.ad recei v ed the appliCAtion 

for a Clee.n Air Act P&alit. f or Onyx &nvirolliOel\t.al 

suvicea on Sopl;e!Ober 7, 1995. 'fbe dr.Ut puait 

has been prepa:recl b&sed on the source r~irll'l9 a. 

~lean Air ~t ~t as a major source of 

bazardoue and pollu~ t emissions. 

The draft petlftit for Ony¥ contains nine 

.!Sections. These sections e stablish tot·al em1eoione 

allow•d at t.hi.s site ftom. stationary emission 

units, <Sescribo appLicable and oon-apPlie&bl• 

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regulations, unit-specific oonditioos, emission 

l~tations for individual emission uni tS at thia 

source, taating, record keeping, ~nitorinq, and 

other require~nts needed for demOnstration 

COliPuance. with applicat>le state and federal 

cul••· 

Si9ni!icant ~ssion Units, as establl#hed i a 

section 4, include the following: ll tbroe 

Ha&&rdOUI waste combustors; 2) Materl~ ProooaaiD9 

Areas; 3) 0~ cruaherJ 4l Storaqe Tanks for 

Liquid Wsateat 5) Bulk solid waste Sto're.ge 

Facilityl 6) ru;itive ~i~sioos; and 1) so110r. 

total permitted ~aeions of requlated air 

pollutant•. • • doaeribed in section 5, are 

eatabliahod at ~ followi ng rounded 1eve1a in 

tons per year1 ~ - - 41 tons; su~fur dioxido --

66 tonal p&rticulate J>&tter -- 41 tonS; nitroqen 

oxidea -- 9'1 ton•; and baz,a.rdous air poUut.a.ntl, 

not included 's.n VCM or PM -- 52 tons. Thie source 

is c::onsider.ad o.s a Njor source for ~za.rdouo ai:c 

pei.lutanta emitted frOI\ the st;ationary WaGion 

units operated at this site. 

Section 1 determines appl icability ~nd 

non- applieebilitY of state and fede~~l ~equlations 

for significant ~ssioo units described 'in 

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Section 4. Pe~it 'condit ions of this section also 

establish appropriate compliance procedures, 

includinq inspection practi ces, estin~, 

mon i toring, record keeping, and reporting 

requireawntll. ,.he Permit. tee ftl.St carry Out the•• 

proc:edu~•• on &n on-,qoing bAsis to demonstrate 

that t..bie •ource operates vi thi.n tbe U.aitationa 

set by the peDILlt . 

H.a~aLdous lla.st.e tncine.rat.i o.n operation is tho 

cent8~1ece of thi3 source. By June 30, 2004, 

theeo i ncinerat ors shal l demonstrate full 

co~ltance with 40 CFR Part 60, Subpart BE£, 

Hazardous Waste Combustions, Milestones of ouch 

<:OIIPliance arc osubiiehed in the Compliance 

,Schedul• of Section 7 . 

Tho CC<~~Plexity of drafting this pe.rait Ues 

in t.be unique nature of this f&ci.lity wb.UO 

diff erent Feder~ S~and&rds bis or~ca11y beiR9 

a..pPli oc:1 prior to the coq>liance ~ta of the ne.vly 

promu1;atod HACT standArd for Hazardous M4ato 

co~ustion. These i nterim rules were prOMul ; ated 

undar tho joint aut hori t y of the Clean AJr Act and 

the Resource conservation and Recovery Act (RCRAl . 

MACt' atanda.rd will be implementi ng a tr&naition 

fr~ the SU:RA pe.ad.t mech&nicsa to t he Clean l!.ir 

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Act Title V po rrait .nechanisl'l as a.rticulatad. in the 

Subpart E&& and any ~elevane a.en~ent5. 

rt is iooportant to r_..t>er that tblS permi': 

transition ia only for the ai r ~ssioos USEPA ie 

regulat.inq \lncler !4AC't rula. AU other oo!llpOnet\t$ 

of tho Rc:AA pendt appli cable to the .,.,.bu.Stion 

unit and to other Mzaxdous waste un.aqemeot unit.• 

..-in in tho Rc:AA peooit. 'fbe oSEPI>. cl.arifi•• 

that they cboae to avoi d t.posin9 duplicativo 

require11\6nt• under: both 'RCRA and the Clean Air Act 

where poaa ible, by: 

1. Placing the st andards Onl y in the c~a3n Air 

Act i mplU\eO.til'\9 regulations a t 40 CFI\, Part 63, 

Sub.paJ:t !.EEi 

2. specifying that the analngou• standard• in 

the Rc:AA re<JUl.at.ions do not apply once a faeility 

d.e-QO&tratea COIIPliacce vitb t.be Baz,a.rd.oUS tfaat.e 

CC>IIbustion 1-u.CT standards to S\lbpart ar;; and 

3. Requ1z:inq the· Ha-z,a.rdous Waste Co«<buJJtion 

MACT .atancll.rda to be ineorpor.ated i nto operati.nq 

pe~it5 issued under title V of t he Clean Air Act 

rather t hen i nto RCAA. perrU.t:s . 

I hope t hat the pt,tblic, local cowmmity, a nd. 

the ~ttee would be satisfie~ on ho" tho 

IUiooil &Pil is handlU>9 tbi.s thallenginq p roject. 

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That concludeS •Y brief presentation and I 

thank you for your attention. 

(81 IIEARiliG OFfiC£R IIATO&SINil: thank you 

spe.a.tecs.. Detore ve t•ke c:oa:ae:ntG trot:~ the puJ)lic 

I 1u•t vent to en~~ a fev e%btbits into tho 

ce eord. !'be t'it'Bt exhibi~ vill be a COPY of the 

notieo of public haarinq which ~s placed in the 

PSWl!lp.IPer. 1'he ~od v ill be a sheet Sh0'111J.n9 

date• it ~•• in the paper and newspapers tha t it 

was in. Third, vill be a copy of testimony of Mr. 

Dragov ich. Fourth, vill be a cop1 of U\c 

testimony of Ha. Rieqle. Fifth, wi l l bO a copy of 

the eeatJ..ony of M:r. Blough. ·Si xth1 will be a 

copy of tM Kr. Belog-orsky ' s testiJL'IOny, and thlln 

sevencb i~l be • copy of the p~oposed CAAPP 

peooie. ouy. 

- ve vill u.~ ,_,.ts t.:ooo we publ1c. 

sevor-al peoplo have no't.Qd that they wish to ID&k.e 

pUblic c~nu. we'll take theJP fi~:st, then 

afterwards va'l l take questions in qeoa~al fr~ 

t h& public or anyone else who wishes to .eke a 

c~nt. A~~in, pleasa approach the microphone, 

ata.te and ~pell your last for the reeocd and 

p1e.ase tr:y to speak clea.rly. 

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the fl.rst person 1 have Ust e<l as Jill 

Mil!er. te 3hG be re? 

(BY MS . HlLL&Rlt I prefer to vait after a ll 

of tho q~eat1on& s~art. 

(BY HEAAING Ofi'ICBR HATOf:Sll'Nl : OkAY. I'll 

~ bllc.k then. I have KathY Mdri a. 

(8)! KS. .Mfi)RlAl : 1 prefer t.o wait. 

(BY uEAAING OFFlCBR KATliESlANl : >ibO are 

You? \!Jhat ia your your nU~B? 

(BY HS. l\NORlAl : · Kathy Andri a . 

(BY Hli:AIUNG OFFICER Y.A'JoESiliN) : Hov oi><>Ut 

Jaok. Nonnan. 

(BY HR. JACK NORMAN): Hr . !learin'J officer, 

my ~ ls Jack, J-A~C-K, and N-0-R ~A-N , I live 

in Col~la, Illinois. l "m a v9lunte er with the 

Sierra Club in the b.Staskia qcoup w~re I am t..M 

conse~ tion chair. 

Onyx Snvi ro,...,ent ,al servi.ce.s has asked for a 

.CAAPP opereting pet'llli~ tor t.ne saugot, tlU .. noi a 

fa.c1lity for reat:ll~t, ato:rage, ..nd disposal of 

hazardous waste. .'fhe key con.side:r:atioo regardi ng 

thia facility ia whether or POt public bealth ~nd 

tho envitonmant are adequately protected. If ~ 

facili ty c4n do so, but doe~ not, it abod1d 

not be -- it .sbOQld be shUt c:sovn. If i t cannot do 

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so i t should atso be shut do~n. Further, it i t 

aoes not operate without undue risk to faci litY 

peraonnol, it should be shut doWn · 

Until nov, thiS facil Lty bas not operated eo 

that wotkexs• safety, pUblic health. and t he 

regional environment il.re pxotected. ourinq 

.couti-oe. opeutlona this plant e&its sub.ate.ne6S to 

the envlroNMnt vbieh are hazardous to bUUJ'l 

he~tb and • destructive to the cOnditions necessary 

conounity. 

some o f· this emi.ssions alloWed under the 

previous pe.rJil t and regul~tions intended. to 

~1ement re10van~ haDn, but the 'facility b3D over 

tbe yearG taken out quantities of those a-\lbstances 

in ·e.xcets of pera.it l iJDits, as t.blt reeo~ ebov•. 

tbia ~eeoEd otleJ• no baS~ tor acceptable 

aatisfact.ory pertortDil.Dce in the tut-u". 

incidenta, 1nclud1ng p1osions, indic&tinq both 

tho i nstability of some materials recei vod for 

treatment and .anage~nt deficiencies. 

These i neidents in the recorded ~latory of 

the Onyx facilit Y are adequately e.utioned. On 

the r·ecord, t.hl.s facility should not continue to 

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operate as before. Thank you. 

(81 HE~NG OFFIC&R MATOESilN)' Thank you, 

~. Norman. N•xt, we have Ch£istin& Favilla. 

(BY HS. FAVI.t.L.P.): Good evening, ttear·io9 

Officer, again, •Y name is Chxistine Favilla and I 

live in tS&cli&on County and 1 WO.l"k on S~ff for the 

Sierra Club, Il-li.oois ChApter, i,n charqe of thO 

three Sliv•r• Pro1e-ct, vb.i.cb is ba-sed o\lt: of 

~Adi&on, ' calhoun, and J ersey counties, wbicb L• 

obviously not in St. Clair, and I vill qet to why 

1 b3va conoernS-

~b• lncinerato~G consistently releeae larqe 

-.mount& of aX'cenic, dioxin, and other hi9hlY toxie 

air pollutanea. lt is a..lso contributi~ to tho 

&mag level~ t.hat ..:Ce plaguinq the entire St. t.ouio 

•nd Metro 41)(1 ttetro Ea.st a..rea. 

La at ~r parts of St. LO\li& recorded COde 

Or&090 and Coda Red s·l'lOC} wa.rninqs on a t leut 35 

days, and ~~ pollutions caus$$ bre&thin9 

probl•taa, iocludin9 taO.re frequent. and U\Or8 aevere 

aethm& attacks auch as che county is aeoin9 i ,n 

t.r:equontly hic;Jb nU'IQbGrs. 

So I have concerns with the ~diete 

coaounity wbich tbe facility is basad in and also . 

Ka..cS.Leon and .Jus6y County as they aro Cl)rreotly 

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not in cOMPliAnce vith th& c l ean Air Act and t 

would l i ke to ~ko awa%e of the i mpact the 

facility hal on those ~wo counties and I would 

like to see that those are reduced in the f uture. 

Ou.t cOIIIDWD.ities dee&nd respect aM that 

inclu4el tbe right to live i n a healthY 

atmosphere, and r egulax inspections of Onyx 

aaz.udOUI waat.e i.oc.lnerat.ors b&ve not previously 

oc:.cur:recl, and vit.b t:be Illinois EPA requlatory 

bUdget defic1C. it ia difficult to see how tbe 

onyK toxic waote ci a~ ors wil l be inspected 

thoroughly even with its own se lf inspection• and 

and how i t will come into ~omplianoe . And for 

those reaaona t ur9e you to deny the pa~t. 

Thank you v-ery liUCh. 

(BY siWIING oFFICER Hl>'roSSIANl : 'l'MJ\k you. 

(BY KS. J..(lCAII SMI'rlll : xatbleen Loqan Saith, 

"itb a K. t•lll on the BoU'd of Health a.nd 

tnvironaental Justi~e of St. LOuis. we "pro sent 

a populat!.on o f people tbat are !."'P•<ted by the 

polluti ng facilit ies, and we ' re here to 3peak 

against this particular faci lity. 

It polluteS our neighbors on the east a ide ot 

tho :river but to the a.rea& south ot the river it 

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pollutes es woll- We're conce£ried about tha air 

impact of this facility, particula~ly because ~ 

have a serious asthmA pioblem in st. ~o~is, we 

have asthma rates as hiqh· as, you kn?w, seven to 

cen t~• the nati~l averaqe in s~ areas. 

Tbis wou.ld add by •i't' c:.a.lculat.ions 3'11 aore ton_s 

to 0\l.C air poltueion. problea, and that's as.:s\D.i.ft9 

they operate well and aeeo~ to the peralt 

limits, and their ~eoord indicates that that is 

unlikely. 

Obviously co~li&nce is not the ~ stron9 

pOint a.nd so it's not a lot ~ reassutance to the 

qen•rill public thet you have a pe·rldt that ia 

within accoptabla l evals because we have no 

oa.-uraneas that they' U ccwuply. 

&eyond t.bat, though.., we al$0 know tMt even 

"itb tl>O•• pe%1&its tbey are allowed t.o .,.ut 

diod.na, fura.nst' IIQI8t.al&, ba:ardoUs and orc}anic 

pollutants, and a whole host of chemical• that 

iJOPa.Ot our enviroJ'lJQent. 

there was a study that came out a few weeki 

e9o roc~mmendinq that t he qover ruaent issuo 

st.o.nda.rdS and reCOCUHndations to young women and 

v.-an of childhearinq age to ~t their 

eonsu.peion oC fats because of the dioxin in the 

.· 

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food chain. So t hey ' re trying to tell all omon 

tbot we ehould avoid ~·~ and eat a l ow fat diet 

bec&uae ot t he .dioxin io the food , becaus e 

ehey come out of facilities like t his one, thoy 

settl e 1n the fleld• and rk their way up in the 

food chaln. Tbey get into our cattle and our JIO&\; 

prodUcts, che••e products, dairy product&, and our 

breo.et Dille. vben we fa-e<l our babies, and tb&t ia 

&ometb1ng that you have an opPortunity to deal 

with riq'ht nov . 

I don't thlnlc we should be issuing v a..rni.ngs 

t o women that say your bxeast milk is contributing 

to your baby's dioxin buJ:den excessively. 1\n~ tbe 

onlY v&y ve can st op t hi$ as 3 societ y isauinq 

va_rni_f191 like that i s i f we s top &).l owing cUoKin 

in the environ-ant. 

And 1 undere,tand it • s your 1ob to i .aau• 

peudta, that's whe.t your j ob 9-escriptiOl'l is, but 

h~n we hava one l ike this ~ that can't aeet o compl y an~ will thr eat en the health of 

generations to come, emi ssi ons th&t come from i~ 

facility, t urge you to take your j ob description 

one atep furthe~ and deny the pe~t. 

(BY H"EJI!liNG OFFIC£R w.roESillll) : TMnk you, 

~~~& ar:a. Ne xt l bave Claral.yn BoUinqar. 

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(BY HS. SOLLINGER.): Good evening, rtty nanle is 

Cl&ralyn BollinQer, that's C-L-A-R A-L-Y-N, 

.s:...o-L-L-1-N-G-E-R, and 1'111\ here tonight j uac 

pri~ily as a concer~ed St . Louis citi zen, and 

I'd l.ike to exprus my concern about the 

incineration tacillty ope ated by on~ 

&nvironMnt.&l Services in Sauget, lUlnot.a. 

I would like to cl,arify some thii'MJ& that you 

s&t6 and ~aybe you can't really answer -. dixectly 

now, but perhaps in the question part you can. 

Firat ~- Victorlne, l tho~qht I beArd you say 

that tull risk assessment~ are not needed to~ 

toxic Y&ate inciner~tion tacil~ties, at ~4aoc 

that ' s how it ca-e acroos, and lt sao~ 11k• you 

said that the projected di oxin/furan Q»iamions at 

tbe Onyx f•eillty are projected to be below the, 

quot•, t he level of conce.rn, and. pe.rbapa • • might 

t>e.Mfit troa, turtber clari fication· a.s to ttba.t 

really meats tbe Ill i nois and USEPA level of 

concern, because 1 think priaarily uost average 

people 'think ~nythlng ie a level of concern. 

Further, Onyx like many other regulated 

industries, would s~ingly be respOnsible t or 

condUctinQ heir own emission mo~ttorin9 and 

reportinq to the Ill i no.is &PA- and to the USEPA.,. 

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~d 1 think it would be interes ting to f i nd o~t. 

you know, sr• they goi ng to have kind of spot 

~nitoxinq by you all ox is it qoinq to be kind of 

l i ke the !ox qua~n9 the ben bouse and they can 

ba<~• a tr:.-endoua toxic nU.s.sion and be like, 

oaps, aorry, oh ell, you know, we'll pay tbe floe 

and vo' ll be a'bl• to keep having our pexait ia 

place. 

That brin~• ~ ~o vhat, if aoythinq, i n the 

pe~t require• the• to bave a plan of otlon if a 

~ssivo •xcoftdenoe happens. ~· th~Y qoing to bO 

requited to aomebo~ ~acuate all of the citizens 

in saug•t? Wha~ about us on the other side ot t he 

river? A£• our oepart~ent of ~ational Resouroos 

qo~nq to a~hov l i ke be on the pbone fiqu%in9 

out, you tmov, it • s c;:oa.i.tt.9, i.t' s a biq black c l ®ci 

or qreen or aoeetblng, os: t"Un type of tblnq. 1 

clOn' t thin)C that' & too praetica..l really. 

ttr. Belogorsky, you had said that the Onyx 

feci lity ia a major source for ~~ardOus i~ 

correct you are nodding pollutants 1P thti area 

yo~r head -- okay, and as other people have said 

an~ wlll probablY s~y again, obviously tho 

Kisai.ssippi fliver is oot this divid1nq l ine and ao 

we '%0 aftected· on the west side )u&t as nai9hbors 

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over hexe on t he east side are· affected. 

And I think, too, qi ven the time of crisis 

~6mingly we are !acing as a country i t would kind 

of be of question in •Y sind, and probably other 

peoplo, ia if thiR facil ity is burning toxic waste 

is it a~how going to be some sort ot target for 

t erroriaD or it the facility sa.ebow ha&ardOUa i f 

s~thi g bappene4 txa. outside bandits or vandole 

that - - you knov , Ve hope that. doe.s~ t bappenr but 

you know, things l ite that could ba.ppe.n. So, l 

would llke to hear yo'?-r a.t~s wers about tho8e 

tbing3. T~ank you . 

(BY R£~RJ G OPFICER HATOESIAN)' Thank you, 

(8~ HR. Vt CTO'UN'E): 'thanks. Let's see, your 

fir·a.t qu~•tion had to do with rl3'k as.se&$ltlel\t& not 

bll!linCJ ~e.asuy. tMt was par t of the pre a..Cle of 

the requlations that the .EPA i n washington o.c., 

wrote. Pa.rt of tk re&son tilat they updat.cl the 

regul4tioos vas they were not sure that tbo older 

requl~tion• cove~ absolutelY evorytbing, until 

~uch ti~c tho new regulatio~ CODe out t hat called 

tor 5ite •pQcitie risk asseasaents if t he£e vas 

reason to believe that any of tbe emJ,ssi.oos, even 

tbou<;Jh. they ttet the old standards, lllight c;re'ate a 

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the purpose of developing the new regulations 

was to hopefully get away from that whe:te ev,u:yon,e 

ould be mec~in9 standard$ that are protected. 

The pri.UrY tool to be protected are the 

regulation• themSelves. Tbe r isk assessments h&VI 

a);)ove t.be cequlat.ions c.Mt ve use as a back 

• nio~~n level of concern, you had the 

question, nationally for dioxins, tho nuPber3, tho 

that have been u~ed, althougb they're not 

promulgated o.t th-is poin~, are cancer ri:sk 

increasft due to any one facil ity. dua to the 

dioxins of one and one hundred .thOusand· 'fbo only 

tb.ey had vaste OQIIIbustion rules tb&t deal. with 

tenths to c!nua fifth, (1 and 100, 0001 ia 

contained in t hat rule. Although it waa never 

officially brought into the other rules the valuea 

hav-e been used nationaUy so that a.l.l toei.litlel 

a.xe held to thAt s~ standArd, but the ptJ.rpoee of 

tbe federal ~::ec,JUl.at.lons is to trY to hold everyone 

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to consist e nt standards. 

Who does the II\Oni toring? Perhaps the State1!:1iqbt want to get involved in this one. Each 

permit is a l i tUe different. Regul ations are 

the .regul ations· under the new Air Act rules, I 

bel ieve, say that testing has to ~ done once 

every five ye&rs as far as actual Stack testing~ 

but i.n addition t o tba.t , dioKi:n test ing has to be 

done once every two 4nd a half years, and thac 

the r e ha.s to be continuous JllOnitorinq of vArious 

process parameters which control the emissions. 

The equipment doesn't quite exist yet to put on a 

st ack, to hanq on a stack to continuousl y monitor 

the Mi~sions. I think we all look forward to the 

t~ ~n that equi pment does ~st, but until 

then a lot of regu1ations 

done by regulating tbe oper ating parameters, the 

temperatures, the flow rate$, the velocity to such 

within the equi~nt . 

~e eltl(lrgeocy plan, that.' s probably part that 

the s tate pe~t -- there's a contingency plan. 

The other one that I -- questi on that ·you 

br?ugbt u p I would liko to tcy is the one ve call 

Hoaeland Security. My understanding i.s that the 

EPA headquarters in Washington D.C. , is 

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considering whether regulations should be 

developed for like all llCRA hazaxdous waste 

f&cili ties addressing your kind. of concexns. .It 

s eems that there i s a bit of bact and fOrth about 

whether it's th~ EPA regulations or Whe ther i t 

would be the Depa..rtf;lent of Homeland security which 

has now been given all ot these kind of 

authorities. So that: kind of thinq has been 

worked out, but the issue is being· considered in 

the &PA headquarters. 

lBY MR~ BELOGOitSl<Y): I bave the question 

aboue the source, the major source of hazardous 

air pollutant s. Yes, that's absolutely truQ1 i t's 

a major so~oe of ha1ardous air pollutan~s ac~oss 

Illinois, so basically the nature ot hazardous air 

pollutants from this so\u:ce is not \Uli que or. 

somethinq let's say terribly bad in ~ariSon 

~ith many other facilities in Illinois. Because 

of -- I can give you an exa.ntp ~, ~e.~i~ri~s oi 

che.IO.i.cal p lants, they a:naintain much 1110re hiqh · 

levels of hazardous air pollutants .than Onyx. 

So notbinq in the Clean Air Act requires the 

type of permit just because t he faci~ity is a 

u jor source . The major source tor the country, 

for the entire country, is 10 ton:~ of individual 

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CAAPP or 25 tons of total CAAPP emitted f~ the 

facility. 

So this is a tbiesbold to be reasonable for 

the Title v proq~am and this is the only pol~utant 

that makes thiS facility major source and eligible 

for the Title V program. 

(BY HR. 01\AGOVICII): I' 11 try to address the 

question on e•ergency r esponse and secUrity 

issues. 

The facility is r~ized to have contingency 

plan or emer9ency response plan to address 

different scenarios that could happen, fires, 

explosions, releases, and a copy of th;t plan has 

to go to everYbodY that will be involva4 in 

respondinq to that emerqency, such ·as local tire 

departments, police departa~nts, a hospital that 

they plan on taking people to, and an emergency 

contractor that may be Called upon to respOnd to 

the plant. 

AQd t~en our hope is that cbey will comment 

on that plan i f the plu is not· adeq\uate. We 

compare the plan to the ecJula~ory r equirements •. 

but beyond that tbe local fire department would 

look At that plan, it's their responaibility to 

deal tdth evacuations off site. And they have· 

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coordination 19~nts among them5elve6 as to hov 

~hey'll fi9ht fires and do evacuations and then 

thQ tocl.lit y 1t~e1f is requi.re<l to annually sond 

an update of t h4t contingency plan to those people 

and qivo thY the opportunity to cOlli!Mtnt on and 

co.e and ioepeet the plant &S necessary. 

As fa% ae the se~ity issuas qo, thor• are 

requlatory requi~ements tbat tbe faci~ity bo 

secUred. No~lly they use several diff•renc 

tbinga, fences, qua~ds, security cam.c•s, and they 

have to ma,ko thoaa requirements betora a pc~lt 

wi ll be iasuod. 

(BY HI\, B&UlGOIISKY) : I woul d like t o ona.ke a 

brief ooftMant ~ut dioxin emissions ~om the 

sow:co. currently unde.r: tbe RCRA re.91Jlations -..e 

don •t have any dio n e.i~sion levels 

concentration tor this, and under tbe new 

promulgated KACT standard_ USZPA established 

ellission lilldt.tions,. incl ucling d.iorlo.s -- a.nd by 

the way, USEPA ·just proposed sone tiNe ago 

different eMiesion -- federal e~ssion standards 

for hazardou8 waate, combustions as we aeo today 

~ chemical waste ineineratio~devices tor 

comM:reial aolid ~Hste i nci nerators for different 

qroup of i ncineration devices, which certain 

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emission lev•le including dioxins, so basically we 

moved non-roqulatod &rea& for different 

pollutants, 1neludin9 dioxins, to regu~ated 

are&s. So ~aically ~e just follow~d what the 

OS£PA la d.oinCJ and just follollinq thair st&n<14rd 

and iiii!Pluaentinq the standards in I ll.i.noi.&, and in 

tbe St. LOuis •~~a. I bel~eve St. Louis, baving a 

n\llllbe.r ot heal.th care facilities and bospltala, 

and I '• not auz:e in "issouri, bot probably .ocUeal 

wast• inc.1neratora a~;e in operation in thl.a area 

omittinQ ce~tain ~unts of di oxins. 

(BY HEARING OFFICER MA~ESIAN : Thank you. 

Next :t ha.va M.r. Robert Freeman l.isted. 

CBY HR. ROB£R~ FREf;MAII) : Thank you, Hr. 

Beacin9 Officer, {or providin9 tbiG for~, 

toniq.ht. 

Hy o&M i.a Robett ~' F-R- S-S-M-A-N, and 

I live 1.D Madison county and r vou.ld Uk• to 

cQCNr~Cnt a littl.e bit ~n the pre-sentatioa of tho 

Meti.n9· &arly on ve coul.d not near a.n.ythi.n9 at 

all. I ~ 1urprla~ tbat you didn't have ony 

graphics or visuaLs to present to help the peoplO 

under#tand a little bit more what the issue ia 

about. A lot of U8 AX8 laypersons th•t don't 

upderat•nd all of the techa~cal babbl1oq t hat's 

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going on. ~a don't understand the acronyms 

totally, so we would appr eci&t e i f you had more 

inforMation that vas availabl e in advance. 

&aeh of t he presenters xead directly from 

some prepr•pared te~t that you had and ~ would 

reapectfuly r~est that at l~t ~self receive a 

copy of your prlnte4 text prior to oaldn9 final 

comM-DU in 30 cU.ys. And I vou.ld also x:equ.est 

that you offef t hat same privilege to any other 

citiz•n here that feels like they would like to 

read ~xe directly, because it's ba~ to 

comprehend if you are walking in here cold, and 

you folka work with this ~very da~ of the year and 

you know che to~ and e~ rythinq and· you knOW 

what's qoing on -

~.so, I'D going oo 10 yeus: old and. 1 c&'n't 

·read all of the aaeerla.l• that yoU present throu;b 

the t.ntexnet. 'fbO yoUf19&r folks cal\ do tba.tt well, 

u s ol.der f'olk.a c&JU'IOt. do that. I think that there 

should bl 100re p l "ce3 avo.Hable for pooplo to 

acquire the prin~ed info~tion thAt ls available 

on the draft, aod I'm not sure of whether o r not 

tho Library ot ~ecord at Soutbarn Illiooia 

Oniveraity of Edwa.rds'V-ille has a copy of thi a 

whore one can CJO ia and read t.hi.s. 

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I ould request that -- because of sOP& of 

these iasues that t•ve mentioned, that you e xtend 

the c~nt pe~iod an addit ional 30 days and mako 

it a 60 day period and that wil l give your people 

tLmc to print out and mail to tbos~ that rcquoat 

the lnformatLon that are qiven additional time to 

do a.o-e conaiderinq on it. 

One tbi.n9 that pu2.z.led De was the tact 

that - a.nd r forget who it was tbat said tbat a.ll 

of tho pe~te, four permits, are consolidated 

into one permdt, and to ~ that seemG a littlo, b i t 

not ,ln l inO with tfhat Citizens w-ou ld l ike. If 

'~th~9 chanqea 1n any one of the lou~ dift:orenc 

pe:m.lt requ.i.remente , how vould we do ' that? Would 

you have t.o bold another entire tneeti.n.q like 

tonigbt to do that? 

So, I would r eQUe$t that -- it's probably a 

little thln9, but t would stLll likt to requeat 

that tbeao vario~s areas of ~cern bere, the 

various pe:t'lrlit.s would be segregated and each time 

that on,yx or e.ny o~r eoq:>any decided to chanQe 

theix equipment or their input o~ fuol or tho 

toxic waste of 'different proces~cs, you knOW, they 

Would be handled a.s an individual permit. 

Alao, I did not understand the does not and 

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does all that ~body t alked about, and I would 

~ike~ ~a et on that. perhaps. 

i~ing up in Madison County we'r• in a 

nonattainment area, St. Clair county here 11 nonattainMen~ air qua4ity area, Jersey CoUnty 1a e 

county vitb a ~11- ~tioo and virtu&.llY no 

tnctust.J:y, no aiqnifieant i.ndu&t.ry, i.a a nonattainaant area ~ on ~ed alert daya for o~ono, 

JerSey County get.' hit haxd, ·and vbat it 1s, it'• 

as you deccr1be4 i n a previous .eeti~g recently, 

you are gotting t .:a.noport&d f>:Ol.lution frOII othor 

araas - - &a tho people from st. LOuis spoko of 

we're CjJB: tti'ng tranaport.e(l pollution "fi tnin the 

Mtr:o east a.re.• i nto Ma.dison County and i nto 

Jereey County and into CalhoUn County, which ia 

not .,.n daa i Qn&t.ed., a.nd in Macoupi.n county, ao 

-we • re gett.inq those are.a.s of uansp0rted pollution 

into those countiesAnd l would lika i~fo~t oo on t•~ that 

o~ quya uaod on thi& t ranspOrted thing, and I 

bol1ave it's • wi nd ~ection and X believe you 

ref0rred co i t as a wind rose, R-0- S-E, t hat 

c;10ean' t make: a.ny' aanse to me, but that's the 

direction of tb• di~ferent winds ~at go into 

different a,reas. 

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I live withi n a mi le of Jersey County and 

Madison county and I brinq my wife al ong with me 

of 49 years, she"s been on oxygen tor about 10 

years now, 2 4 hours a day, and I·' af p:ce t t:y sure 

i t's transported pollution f r om Missouri. 

Portage des Si oux power pl ant is right ac ross the 

r iver. We • re i n a nonattainotent area anywhere in 

St. Cl a-ir or are we t alkinq about inc reasi nq the 

po lu ~on, or what is it t hat we •ve done ? 1 think 

t her e tr~as ·a denia_l t hat i t would i ncrea se any 

poll ution, but l ' m nOt quite a .s confide_nt as you 

a.re that that is 9?i n9 to happen . 

oo~n the r oad I believe back into Madison 

County is a facil ity dovri there , Chemeteo, you're 

pr·obablY al l fui liar wi th that ~g y vor d, 

Chemetco In ustrie~ went down bard, t hey made a 

l ot of miatak~s · they did a lot of polluti ng over 

t he years, and r·~ reall y not confident i n the job 

~hat the Il l i noi s .BPA did on ·the Chemot co tbi~, 

and I believe nsgp_A eventuall y had t o step down on 

the situation and they're closed down rigbt no . 

I:n the ease ot: onyx I •m concerned about 

industries walking away and leavi ng, just leaving 

t he pollUtion, and they close down and tbey qo 

bankrupt ana I don' t know what ~otections we have 

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that onyx wil l continue to be a good citizen in 

the community. 

In the local area, for instance, the Lead 

Worka shut down, we have tvo· Guinness world 

records in Alton, the y have the tallest livin9 man 

would be Robert Wadl ow, 8 foot 11 inches, we have 

the talles.t :si\OKe stack.a in the world, the Lead 

Works, and they walked away from it. The Tanner y 

walked awa y C.tOfll that in Hartford, the Box Board 

walked away from their facility in Alton, ~ 

steal mill walked away from th9ir cil y and 

just closed the door and shut it down, the glass 

company d id the same thing 4 

Mba~ protection do ve have f~~ th~ type of . 

co~ ate insensitivi ~ to the· viro~nt? So, 

that•s about all.I have. But I . hope to hear so.e 

connents later on in the qUe stion and Answers. 

Thank y ou. 

(BY H&ARING OFFICER HATOESIAN) : Thank you, 

Mr. Freeman. we •11 respond to those qUestions in 

the question and answer section. 

The next paper t hat I have is - I believe 

it • s Aa.ron Maxey. 

(BX MR . ~) :. .Good ev ng- . That' s 

Aaron with an A, M-A-X-E-Y. I re~resent a 

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~unity of &ast· st. Louis in the to~~ of Metro 

HOPE ·formally known as Projeot HOPE, and I have a 

cOuple ~eation~ for you thiS eYening. 

Firat ot a.J.l, from my unctexta.nditu~ thero' a 

approltimat ely 16 sites in the United Statts tor 

incine.Ca~r• and 1 vo.s vonde.rinq vbat is the 

actual dlatance to the closes~ ~ty around 

thO.se other l6 altes o r other 15 sit.e&. I Jtnow 

thero'a a lo·t here, but in proxiJIIity or distance 

wise, vhat l e the eloa.at c~nity to these oth•r 

sitea that ~$Y not be in this area? Tbat' s a 

question that can be answered latOr. 

And the eecond question i.s, what does 

previous hlatory as re1ates to t hese companies, 

these lndusttie.a , played a part in actuallY 

receiving a perait? 

(BY REAAIIIG OFFICER MMO£Sllllll : Thank yo~>, 

Kr. KAKOY. ~&in, ve will cove.c tbose i.n the 

que_stion and answer section. The nut opeaker 

then il Mr. Bruce Nilles 1 I believe. 

{BY~- NILLES): Hy naae is Bruce Nilloa, 

N-1- l•· L- E- S, I'• an at.torney with the Siecra Club 

bAsed in Chicago, I'm responsible to wotk tn clean 

air iasuu thro\!9hout the s·tat.e of I llinoia. 

Siexca Club is abQut 26 thousand ~rs here in 

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this at.ate a nd 100 thousand nationwide, and '"' 

woEked tor tho last thtOO decade$ t o help p&,a t ho 

Clean Air '-Ct and continue its enforceMnt, aO we 

very aueh would like ~ thank you all for t3kinq 

the tiM to he.&-J: th& public aoc1 ~o receive 

coaraente on tbeae two baz.a rdous waste and cl ean 

air pa<JOita . 

Ybat said~ there vas a few thingS s~ abOU~ 

this p rocess t hat have not been a good 6xample of 

bow to do outte.cb. tixst of all, thi& per.it 1a 

five years l•te. The state b8s refused to i nvest 

the :te.aourco:s to issue permJts tllat. s_hould have 

been iaaued in 1998. The feder~l EPA atood by and 

et-uck their he.&d in tbe sand and did o.othil\9 a))Out 

it. For tive yeat's this tacl.lity baS oper•ted 

witbout a pe~it . 

secondly, tbe pecmita issued, people who, bave 

tried to read thMl. there• s a l ot ot. j a..cqon in 

~ore, there• a .any .,.ys tQ s~i"t.e to put stuff 

i nto plai n Enqli sb, that vould make & woxld of 

diffarenee . I "?uld ask any of the xeporter! he,re 

to tak8 a look at these pe~its ~o see if they 

UQdexata~d,, because the who~e purpose of he~e 

pera~ita ia tor eoGIIlU!1ities to UD.derstand that. 

saok.e stackS in the,ir fa.cili ty and i n their 

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co~unity, what is coming out of it, what are the 

l~its, and what can I do if soaethiog goe3 wro09, 

and that's not noocaaari ly understood at all in 

the t wo pendta ~h~t ue out there. 

Anoth•.r thing on pz:ocess. The RCRA pexmit, 

the aecond perait, why wasn't it pu:t up on the 

web? I appr.c'lat.e aoae people don • t have ac:cea• 

to the Web, but I vas told the place I had to 90 

qet -it va• tbe OSEPA headquarters io Chicago. 

First ot all, I had aet a.o appointment, the.n 

they c:ha.r9ed mo 15 eent-e a page for each copy, 

that•a 240 paqea jast for t he permit. There's a 

bo~ of ~teriala, just t he perait alone cost 35 

dollars to qet • copy of i~. That's not public 

access. Why wasn' t · the RCRA permit put up? That'• 

not enqaqing in hOnest pu?lic outreach. 

There's lliasing records, enforcement records. 

II biq 1 .. 11<1 tonigbt io c:.in thio c:oaop&ny be truated . 

to prol:lect our coa.uoi ty. !bose we r e not 

organi-%ed and. Nny of. the~~~ were aiasiog. fcom tbo 

public fileJ. We know tbat in 2000 tbe S~PA 

8tepped in and said we're going to do a multi media 

and ~nopcct your facility, and b.ave the air, 

water, and vaate folks coma out and t ake a look at 

tbio, and tbey apent two days investigatJ.ng tbat 

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facilitY in 7.000 . Mhere ~ that repOrt? 

Apparent l y the draft report wa s not allowed to ,see 

the draft report. Why is there no acees~ to those 

ooc~nta? It's not io the r ecords, we reqpoaiod 

it a_nd i t vas Ckltde<i. say·ing it was e.nforc~nt 

sen siti ..,... fb.at vas three years aqo. tfby ba\r• vo 

not been 9.1ven access to tho~e records? 

And tl'\eo • coupl e of points abo\lt e.xlati n<J 

rul e s. Tbe US£PA said ~at ~-e were rul.U 

deai9nod to protect the p~lic, those MACT rules 

are interim r.ulea . ~bey are inter~ rule~ bOc•uae 

the 1990 rules ware set aside by the court of 

Appeals in D.C •• end we sued and d t hcy' wer•n't 

protective of h~n health and env1ron.entt the 

C®~t a9r·eed and issued standard.$ a.nd ue now i n 

the process of issoinq final , so to say it' s 

protec tive ia aisle&dinq. · 

so bare ~ ilr& wl t..h thB. Sie.rra Cl ub in a 

somewha t uniqu~ pOsition asking fo~ you to deny 

· those p erJ\its. We are a5ki.nq you to 5hut this 

tacili~Y down. This .iS a big ~t•P for us, we 

oon• t usually say the only ~s er is to shut the.., 

dovn, it's usually put up sa.e new poll~tion 

eont:rol iteru, P:&Y. a finft, and qat into 

c:ouc>ll.,ncc. But here i s wby. we • re a..sidnq t o dAny 

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the pe~nlta . we h-,ve been digging th%ough the 

records, as disor9anized as they are, we found 135 

~iolations, and we're ati~l countinq. In 20 ye&ra 

they b.avo llad 135 vlo.lations. 

wo•ve bad vorkexs h~1 ve• ve had dozens of 

explosioM, we've had pa.llets of pesticid.e .-aate 

ca"t.ch fire, the l ist goe.s on. Me have thea 

falsifyl"9 doCuiO&Ats. If you N>d I falo!.fled taX 

rQ:tums what ha.ppens to us? We go to jail. What 

b~pened to Onyx? They get a slap .on t be ~1at. 

In 1990 the ,State Attorney Gener~l at the 

ti~e impoaed a court order for violationo ~t1nq 

back before 1990. A year l ater the Attorney 

General 'ffaa back ln court bQ:cause they refused to 

abide by the 1990 court order, charged. wi til tllrM 

point four aillloo in fines. I.f you loo:k at vhon 

~y ot those violations occurr~ right alter 

1991, 1992, 1993, 1994, dozens more ~iolat1ona. 

clna.rly they didn't qet tbe. MeSSage. 

tn the ~id 1990's, 1995, the EPA slapped them 

with o 35 hunijred do1lar fine. which ia 

ridiculous, p€obably didn't cover their lewyer•-

This is a 10 millioo dollar operation. If you want 

to iMpOse penalties and .e&n somethinq~ it haa to 

bu.tt. And bow &anY tilDeS do we qet a c..o-pa.ny 

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violate the la~ which ~hr atens t he community and 

i t cont i nue to do what tbky• £e doing? We said 

enough is enough. 

Two weeks ago to the cr edit of the Attorney 

General, · 4Lsa Madi gan did impose a half milllon 

dollar fino tor vio1&tions between 1996 and 1998. 

That st ill leaves all of the violations since 

1998. 

And so her e we- as:e today, ve • re vo:(Jc.ing· out 

OSEPA baa a website that says the y haven't 

been in si qnificant noncompliance basically since 

1991. I n 2002 the I&PA lists 22 ongoing 

violati ons. so what . are vo waiting for? Tbey're 

ttot getting the mes·sage with these penalties. 

You have two case s, we · urqe y9u to shut them 

down. If Uer e .is fal sification of doCunmts if's 

ti.Jno to put someone in j&i l. If you Ar\d I do that 

we go to j a.il. Why not Onyx? 

The notion that we can rely on existing 

en.force.nent· peopl e to p t:otect us is really 

misleading. There are 11 major sources of air 

pol ti~n· and watet: pollution in sau~et 17. I n 

the last t vo years less than half of th~ have 

been in~pected . That ~~~eans you a..re insPect~n<J the 

facility l ess than every two years. lnd what do 

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\lie ·have hera out ot washington D.C. , the ~sh · 

Administration wants to cut resources, so you bavG 

even 1~18 dollar~ to protect our communities. 

'tho bottOIQ line is this oocupany deJDOnstratea 

it c~ t c~ly with the law. Ne 're dealing with 

very to•ic ~terials, the most dan9erous aatexia~s 

to b~, dio~. fucans, ~cury, it doesn't 9et 

any wox•t· It baDftl!:d wor~ers a.nd released doz.ena 

of c:louda of smoke over the nei.qhborhood. 00 .,e 

need dead bodies? How .any more violations ~o we 

oeed? Is 135 not enough? Wbat is enou9h? I'd 

appreciate an answer •s to when do va say they•vc 

sac~Liicod, they r$l inquished, they fo~feited 

theia::: right to Ol)er•t& -- or their priv-Ueqe. 

It's not a riqht, it's a pri vil&;e. Pa&t of doing 

busilleaa ia you aqree ~ COJIIPly . Tbey failed to 

eoapl.y, ao 1 ULCJ• you to, in tbe interest of the 

c~ity &t la.rcJe• that these cbeaical5 don't 

just stay in Sau;et, they don't juat stay in St. 

Louia, mercury travels around the 9lobe. I ur9e 

you to do what you have the authority to do and 

shut the facility dOwn and pxotect all of us trom 

onyx.. 'thank you. 

(BY HEARING O!'i'ICER HATOESIJ\N) : Thank you, 

M.r. MUles. The nut speaker i s JilP 8ensun. 

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(BY HI\. BENSMAII): My """" is Jim BeOSOWln, 

I'• conaervation chair fo~ the Piasa Palisades 

oup of the SieJ:r& Club and we would like tor: you 

·- to roqu&st that you deny these pe~ta ~ 1 

would alao point out that I, t.oo, could not 

underGtand .est of the presentations, th~y vere 

incoquehen•1ble with all t.he noise -.nd th• poor 

sound eyatea i n here, vh.ich 1 thi.nk chat tbat v.u 

not accept.abl.e. 

).n(1 I'sn just lfOndering hov many ot: you would 

live ith your family next to this place? In the 

question a.nd anBware 3ection I would li~e for each 

of you to a&y hetb~r or not you wou14 live. next 

to it. Th&nk you. 

(DY H£AAI IIG OFFICER MATO&SIANI : Thank you, 

HJ:. &cn.anan. we have Or- Blount. 

(BY DR. BLOORTl: Good e-!'in9· 1 '• Or. Lee 

810\IDt, 1 1• • retir6d su.rg40n and now for the lo.at 

12 y~a I've been··in alt.e.rnative ...ed.icitle, 

specifically propbil3ctic and prcventat1va. I'm a 

member of a gr~ss ~oot com-unity baaed 

orqani t.ation in 'st. Lou i s ancl Vo don't ro:rt~ict 

ottrselvee just to St. Louis, but tha Metro area. 

Racontly beceuse of the ongoing effort over a 

couple ot years the peop1e in here in the audience 

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have been workin9 for the last thxee or fou~ year= 

to gat - - apecifically ove r tbe last two y•ars, a 

medical wa1te incinerator in St . Louia ·- some of 

you all uy know about tMt -- they "'ere burnln9 

•dical waste tr011 the ho.spitals over in North St. 

toul.s in a.o area ebat houses the very lov i acotne, 

ainorities, a.n.cl people vi thout a. voice. TvO ~r~&jor 

~e&l pe4iatric bosplt&ts vere from the other 

city areat. So beeauae of the publ.ic -· and I •ee 

that one ot your t:eCJUl&t.ions, I think tbe CAAPP, 

says tnat tho permits a.re enforceable by tllU 

public. 

Tho people hear, and th&t~s what happe~cd. 

We 90t to the politicians, we embarrassed somo,•we 

had 3Gme that CODe on, and we put pressure. I 

Ma_n, vo had people fr~ all over, ve hild wa•h U 

la.w s-tudent•, -d stud.elat.s, ve bad pelltic.ia.ha, ve 

had welfare .otMrs, we had everybOdy, and we 90t 

the. to close down the oedieal waste i ncioer•tor. 

What they were doinq is they were buxning Medical 

waste, but what they do now is autocl.ave, which ia 

Auch, Much better, we don't get this toxic wasta 

f~OM the stacks . 

So that ' • one of the point.s I wanted to uka 

to the publ ic, because real.ly we're the ones that 

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are affected. Tbe point that vas mentioned abou~ 

where, you Live. For sure many of these planto are 

t.i low incOG\e, poverty, l'linority ~a.s . ther• ar• 

none in the suburbs or Creve Coeur, rront&nac, it 

you know thea• areas. 

we all knov, even i~ you are a layper son, you 

don't have no aedic.l «lationship at all in teras 

of back9-round1 but ve bear the vord lead., ae.ccury, 

and dioxin, we kno"' that: they don't sound 9ood., 

they don • t sound like vegetables and food and l.ov 

fat that•s goocl for y our health. 

Wo kno~ th~t d i oxin, and this ant waa qoing 

h~t was qolnq ori in this plant here, ~he 

canCer aide affects, the astbN, the b1_rth · 

defect•, t he neu.toloqiea.l defects, the :~te.t ility 

clefec:.ta. Lead ia just · a real - - we now are 

tacUin9 th• l ead aituaUon in St. LOuis. That's 

•'hex• 11eo are nov . ADd the m.inorlrle.s io St. LOu.la 

and the national averaqe is 12 to 14 perce-nt 

involve~nt of youngs~eFS in indUstrial cities, 

and certain areaa of St. Louis is 25 percent of 

tho kido ore lead poisOned. ·so I'm sure thee~ 

fita with thi~ area, t oo. 

~d •• v u said by soae others, thi.s it a 

regional area , the pollutants don't just atay in 

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St. Louis, they don't j ust stay i n S&uqet, they 

are all ve , thay travel world wide, not to 

~ention the situation t hat Kathy LOgan talked 

about. 

so this l& a significant s~tuation that'G 

going on a_nd. becoainq epidem.ic in certain areas. 

Chilctroft, aot.har• have lead, but they have e»~ 

bitth c•to a.n<l prsatuce birt.bs. 'fbese kid.s havtt 

neurolOCJiC 6et ecu. 11:\Qse are t:be gross de.fcct.a, 

but one of the moat i nci dious def ects i$ the 

lC!iarninq d 11J3b1lit.iea . Jl.nd these are many tiiMIO 

not notod. they've tracked a lot of the4G 

youogst x~ and they•ve found out that this otaya 

on into adulthood, this child co~ldn't learn or 

his 10 "'•·• '75 , but they have done GODe etudies and 

rese&r'Cb ahowa that a lot of these a re lead kid.f, 

and ao we' re qettin<J tbe~e pol~utants , be&lcku the 

l ead pt.i.nt , but we're gett.i.ng it fro. die .stacks. 

So in eloslnq 1 would ~ike to say that I 

think eOMti»e.s ve t..ho public ve don' t kaow how 

pOWOEf~l we are. Me don 't 'know -- weil, I anea.n 

pOlitici ans liaten to the public. 1 appreciate you 

al l bei n9 here, it' s your job, but it' s l i ke . you 

know, everYbOdY in ·here, especially.tha public , 

the people i n the comMUnity, they' r e LnPoxtaat. 

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And \otbco you put thO pressure and, enforce your own 

re9ulationa and say that the permit is enforceable 

by tho publiC, it state• it there. So I just 

e..ncollr&9Q you to get involved, beeau.&e i t' 4 not 

9oitLq t o happ&l'\· t'hi a pla_nt i s not qoi ng to 

close.. teo vue :re&df to just lie down in t.M 

straot over in St. Louis, I vas. 1 went to j a1 l 

tor project..s like this. so so.etimes you Mvo t o 

do that. beCause overybody bas a £igh t t o li"o a 

full Hf<i, but if you h&ve people dyin9 at 30 and 

40 of c•ncar, and 1 know that when I was doing 

tradit1onal ~Ddieine, I saw a lot of t hese people , 

and now r•••arch is ebowinq that a lot ot t his 13· 

r e14t.ed t.o toxic dyafunct ion.s. Tbanlc: you. 

(BY I!EAAlNG OFFlCEil MAroBSIJINl ' Tha.nl< -you, 

Or- Blount- Nov Jl.ll Kil ler v:ould i~ to speak. 

(BY KS. MILLBitl: !<y na&e i s ..:Jill K11ler, 

J-t-L-1., M-1-L-lr-&-~. one of the easie;r naaDa to 

apell. I' 111. a eonie-.x:vatiOJ) o~er for ~ 

·Sierr,a "club· in St. t..oui-5, Missouri , and t •a 

representing tl'le &astern MisSouri group, more t han 

5000 .ambara thare. 

I Q~ew up in St . LOuis and I have t~ily i n 

the araa and tha.nb for letting M make •otM 

Coanenta on t.hls very iJaportant i ssue. 

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Those of us who live in St. LOuis, we've 

beard on the evening ne~s over tim~ abouc 

expl osions and re-leases of poisonous ga.ses in this 

ar ea, and t.te' ve been really concerned ,aboUt.. this 

inciOora~or facility for some t~. We 've heard 

about workers being hospita i~&d and, you know, we 

heard the ~nity has been atfect&d. 

No one should bave to live in ever present 

fear of explosions and releases of toxic 

substances i nto the air they breathe, and no one 

should go to bed at night worrying about when the 

~t one is goi ng to ap . 

And Onyx Corporation does no~ have a good 

track r ecord- repeated Violations. and that seems 

t o just b~ ao ongoinq problel\. And you lulov, we 

a r e also concerned about the health risks t ram air 

pol lution, and they aren't l imited to this 

immediate vicinity, because the St. LOuis area i s 

affected on the other side of ~ c~ty . 

Thia incinerator contri butes to smog that we 

suffer with every, summei , and accordipg to the 

~can Lung Association of Eastern H1s&ouri 

ozooe travels with the wind, and because o! this 

ozone cannot be vi ~ed a s • strictlY local 

problem. 

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So BmoQ ia of -uch concern to tbo$e of us on 

the Hi8souri aide of the r i ver, and smoq cauaea a 

.host of breathing problems, including more 

freqUent and more severe astluU. attacks. one 

study allows t.hat there is a direct lioJc. between 

days vben there's • b~gb ozone leve~ and _.oxgeocy 

rOOID ta for respiratory probleM· 

Lalit su-nnar one of those eaerqetl<:Y ~ 

Y" i Sita on a day t ha-t was coded a.n Oranqe Alert day 

was my niece, who waa 14 monthS old at the ti.e. 

And abo doesn't live in St. LoUis, bar family 

U.veo at 4D Ai~ E'o:rce b&.se vb.e.re h ar father ia iJ\ 

tho service. ~hey were in St. LOuis visiting, and 

withi.n 24 hours of ~ell. ar:rivinq she had. to be 

rusbod to ca din•~ Glennon cbildxen's aoap~t l by 

-lance. Slle lUid luld respuatory probl- st.nce 

she wu born, but thie was &n unu.sua.l.lY severe 

attack, and her condition did. iJaProvc, but she had 

. no choice bUt tO play indoO:tS for the t'eoSt of ber 

visit. 

So there are thous~ds of children &nd 

' elderly people and People ~ith ~espitatory illness 

i n the St. t.ouia area \fbo l i ve here year roW'Id and 

are 1ufferi.nq: from smog problems 1n st. LOuis. 

And thia incineratoE does contribUte to the 

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proble.a, and ao qranting 1110re poll.ution perml.t,a 

will only continue to 11ak.e the proble;n worse. 

So · wa are aakirt9 you to deny t heae pexllit.a 

and we're asking tor t be plant to be shut down due 

to i ta repo•ted ~iolations. Thank you. 

(BY lWIIUNG OFFJCEll HATOESIAlll : 'fho.nk you, 

Miss Hill ex. Do you vl.sb to ..,e.ak nov? 

(BY MS. I(JU'IIl' ANDIUA) : My na.e is Katby 

An~ia, Kathy with a . Andri a wi th •n 1. I'• with 

the ·AMrican Bottom conae.rv~cy. 0\lr 

orqanizi a tion i a a conservation organiz.a.tion baaed 

i n East St. Louis and we vor k to protect the 

coJJJDunity ot the resources of ths AJnOrican Bottoll 

Flood Pl4n, 

About eight ye&r5 aqo I was wor king on an 

incinCxator, working to stop an incinerator from 

bei.CCJ built, and at t.Mt time I va.s told that tb• 

EPA was worJc.inCJ on a dloxiri doCUIQe.Dt. We ..,.r;e 

waiting, it vas CJOing t.~ be next montb, next 

mopth, no~t nontb. It's eight year~ lator, w• 

don • t have the dioltin d0C'\,111\e4t. And I hear d -- 1 

don't remember who said it - - but s~ebOdy sai d 

that t hey were tryin9 to have fairness to tbe 

coq)a.nies 10 that •11 ot 'the componi.,s would be 

t re.a.ted equally. I.o se-qen,. eight years, o~ 

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ever ~y a~a that e have been waiting fox 

the docUJftOnt , what about the pe.op1e? I JOeanr wo 

4.re b re.a t binq this, our children aro absotbinq it 

f~ t heir .other's , the ~thers are 

a.bsorbinq it. tM children, tbe fathers, evcxybody 

is gettinq this into our systee. It' s ch&Dging 

vha.t • • b.appeni.nq to childz:en ~s they ue bo.m. 

Tbere'• a nev study that MS. Logan rc~erced 

to, there a re studies all the tiM that a re aayin<J 

dioxi ns are very bad. Dioxins cocoe from 

incino~a io . You know that, I know that. ~Y are 

wo bainq fair to the indus·t rie:s? That isn' t l air 

to anyone . 

I have a combination ot question• and 

atat~nta, eo "I'» goioq to kind of dovetail back 

and forth. 

You said t .bat thia i s the Clea.n AU Act 'fltle 

V. I've taken Title v training, I •ve taken t wo 

• odtsbopa, one waa: - I don t t evc.n r emeliber hov .. 

ND~ days, the ~er one was a couple da ~. I 

have documents like this, I have ret ~•noe booka , 

it's very ~itfieult for citiZens to go through 

piles of papers, and I don't have an engineerin9 

deqree, 1' • a cit izen. I ' m volunteerinq for the 

mst part in everything that ~ do vith tho 

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environment. tt•a really an unfair buxden to put 

on citizens to bavc to enforce a pt~rmit to l,ook 

throUQh and tell ·you what's ~rong, · what you ahould 

be tellincJ us, what you shoul~ be tellinq the 

COCIIIPiiD)". There are lilllits to thes• thingsOne of the thingG tbat bas happened., a good 

thiDCJ that baa llappued, finally the I.lli.noi s EPA 

bAs aA onviroNM'lnt justi ce policy. t•m va.:y bappy 

that ve bave an ebvi.t'omte.nt jurtice pOlicy, but 

ca.n that. be u1ed to •~I?P a plant U ke thi•7 1 

don't think ao. Aa ron Maxey and 1 were i n a 

.aeting wlth env1ror\J\ent justice groupo !rom 

around t he state and we as~ Renne .Zi priano 

(pbooet1cl, bow can w~ use this, can this atop a 

f\e,f pl&nt frOIR bei.n; built i'f i t • s being put. i.nt:O 

a.o uea. that i.s o.l.ready ovexburde nod? w..u, ub, 

yo\1 tnov. Vb.at i• it for then? 

&a•t St. LOUis, Sauget, cenueville, 

Washioqton Park, all. of these coaaunitie• on thil 

side. of tho river, all of the peopl e l iving ins~. 

Lou~s are truly overburdened by al l of t b41e 

chelaicals. 

You ve~e addressing on~ plant, and Mr 4 Ni lles 

aaid there' l 17 aou~ces, that's. just here, they 

a.l"e across the river, they're down wind fcom N.ny; 

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many plants. There's a new cement kiln that i s 

qoinq in that is qoinq to be sendin9 things our 

way. Have you ·addressed and are you add%essinq 

~ulative effects when you dO a heal th 

assessment? Do you j ust do it f or that ope plant 

~r do you do it for say Big· River·s, Inc. , a.nd Onyx 

and SOl utions, and on and on. There are too many 

in this ci,ty and in Sa..uqet, in Granite Cit y , in 

Wood River, in Hartford: There are so many. people 

suffering· becaus, of lack of ;egulation, because 

of. quote, fairness t o coiPorations, and too ~ny 

children who are r eall y hurting. 

Dy the way, Mr. Freeman's · request f or an 

additional 30 , t cOuld use six more months 

f r ankly., When . I came in I me.t up with the 

.gentlemen who were with Onyx and they reminded 1M . 

that I s one of three people .at a hearing that 

they bad about five years ago . My. father was 

dying at that tJJoe but tie was a troop$r, be went 

with. M to all of these public hearin.gs tllat I 

would qo to, and they re«''eeltbered that. But the · 

thing that zeally putz e~ me is· one ~ t~ things 

we· were asked to do, since the old operators who 

wete just fined half a mil~ion do~ars, the old 

ovners e~e asked to drav a line and· separate them 

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frQ40, thQ now onea. But they're the same 

opet&to~a. I .ean, th~~e was s~ kind of 49 

percent, 51 percent, some kind of ownership, I 

don't. sea how the ehanqe in ownership-- it' s the 

sue plant., it's the s~ .actu.nery. and it'a tho 

same operators. and .uch of i t 1 thi nk is the aame 

ud•siona. 

~t only do you tw.ve the. CUSEUlative eUoct•, 

but you h&ve ayno:rq.i,ttic effects. What happens · 

whe.n tb.ia cbelllic:al me.eta Up wit h ·thla eheadcal l.n 

the air? Kow doee that affect the body? Have wo 

studied that? No, we. r eally tiaven't. When,· by 

the way, are we e~ting the dioxin ~:epor-t:? Do 

we lcnoll? 

(BY MR. VIctOIUNB) ' Up in Cbic"90 tbe 

rcqiona1 office ia not invo1ved in tbat, that io 

t..roa waabinCJtDD D.C. We're concerned iitbout that, 

too, about how 101'19 it's been tak.i.D9· My 

undareta.nd.ing is there's a draft out there t hat's 

•'\t&ilable, it's oa the tn~et and evo.iything 

eloe, that I thl.nk io still in public coaacnt. I 

wou1d like to see i t, too. 1 agrea with you. 

(B~ MS. Nf()IUAl' I do' hOpe th~t tba oiUII6 

peopla who took out tbe qlob~l wandt\9 prol>ldl 

f roe th• nev policy are not the saae people that 

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are rovievinq the dio~in r~ort. 

Mhan wae the health risk performed, health 

aases~nt, .nd where is it? I think someone 

indicated that there vas one, a ~isk analyaia? 

(8'! M!l. VICTORINE}: 'tes, there was a 

saeeninq analysle 4Qne. t ri.ll cheCk with ay 

...,.ge.oont aboUt it if you would liks a c<>PY. 

(BY t<S . l\liOf(IAI : I really do tbi.nlt that the 

whole thinq 11 supposed to be publiclY 

eofo~ce&ble, but it we don't nave a ll of tho 

doc~nt8 it'S ~ery hard for us to know how to 

comment, what to co~ent on, unless w9 have all of 

the mterials. 

lU\d Kr. i'r·eeN-n ia abso~ute,ly ri9bi, any kind 

of facility here the air emissi ons go all. ovor. 

tie don 't have a wall. i n the sky that tr.eepS the&\ 

x1.qht here in c.bOUa, so tbat people fra. sc. 

LOUis and people f..,. Alton o.od peoplo froe 

Graolte city ha9e to oooe hexe to view those 

dQCU8CPt~, ~nd abSOlutely the reco~d dQCu .. nt5 

belon9 on the yebsite. 

It used to have four units, and whnt happened 

to the fourth icu:.inet"ator ? I notice that you just 

have thr••· 

(BY t«. anoc;oRSKYI: Riqbt nov only th<M 

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units in oporation and number one was elLainated, 

t beliovo, or whet 

CBl MR. MRRIS): t '.-t Doug Ha_rris, I'll 

gener8l u.nager of the facility. We be.93-Q 

operation i n 1918 or 1919 with one incine.cator, 

known •s Incinerator Nuober 1. In 199l, late 

199~, that incinerator •as closed down, 

specif ically because it did not: ~t tbe current 

staJ>dar<U. 

!BY HS. l\lfl)RlAl : ls t:he>:e an oparati"9 

permit for four? 

(BY MR. IIJ\1\I\IS): Yes. 

(BY HS. ANDRIJ\) : I don't ic,.,.. how ...,ny 

months aqo a.n~re, but I had sent in a Freedo• 'ot 

Info~tion Request to IEPA and went up to 

Springfield wit-b a.o.eone who caM d.ovn froll thO 

Chicago •~•• to belp M w:ho b.ad been t;hrOuqb a. 

"l'itl• V before, 6-l'lfi we yent in lookin9 at the 

files, and I've been thxougb file rev-lew , tEPA 

before, and J 've always bee.n pret ty au.cb able to 

find tho th1n9• tbat 1 needed. I was r•ally 

d ismayed at th1a, There were whole. chunks of 

~~.aterial that wer~ missinq. .Kissing "'"a the 

a.n nurt.~ enissione report, the inspection. rep0r't 

ftoa 1997, the operating pez:Ja.it for U'nit 4, the 

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~ltimed13 inopection cepo~t, stac~ tests t hat are 

refereed ~o, and we 've been trying t o get ~r ll 

2001 and May 2002. we·ve· b&OA tryinq to got thoao 

for IIIIOClthl, and 1 t .ia l ked. to Kr. rrost t he other 

daY and be said that app~ntly tnere va5 none. 

so 1 dOD ' t u.nderatand bow s(llllt'let.hinq is r·e.terred co 

in a fila that l t hapPened, bUt yet it didn't 

ha.pPen. so, we have sCM: real conce.rns ei:JOU'C tbe 

cOII'Ipl.ctaneaa of t be file. 

There ver~ quarterly reports that a te 

adGs1nQ, 11anife'sts, treatie s, that we.re not tho.re, 

t hore waa another inspect i on report t hat • •• 

miss.lrl(J, a;~ all of the Qocuments. r ola.tinCJ to t ho 

Nov~r 2002 meetinq wit h onyx reqardin9 

olat1ons and CQC9lLanoe i ssues were missing. 

So what hapPens with the public vbefl they aee 

thAt, it aUght be very i nnocent a..od tboae recot:ds 

• re sa-ewhere lq sosebedY'S desk, tb&t they're 

vor ldnq on it, bat ou.t il'lpressi on is, especially 

when vo keep c.~y n9 a.od we ask to pleasGI p rovide 

tbo~• to ua and they don't show up, then we ·don•e 

t~ot you. I hate to say tba t 1 but that' s what 

happone . 

Nov, if t t!-ere is nothit\9 aJlisa here and tboa• 

records are be·re, please provide thea to ue so " e 

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can look at the.n and we can make our cocmte:nt.s 

baGed on tbe eomp1ete record . 

And ray M mory is - - I que.ss as I qet older it 

$O~t~ee fadea -- but when we first started thia, 

when the Title V draft came t, there vas no 

tec:oxd po~it. ,Soalebody in a CepartJnent •ILid, oh, 

110 don • t need one. tr'by wa.s tbert not one? We 

c::OI'I!Pl&.ioed &1\d. t.ban'k. you very web that we now 

have one, but what vas thClt? I s that sone ki nd of 

aomothioq? I don• t unde.rst.and.. And is it tb&t 

yo~ have too many of them that you are trying to 

do by tho end of t he ye a% or -- if th4t' a what's 

happeninq , there's too ~uch vork, beeaua& I ~qree 

with you there • s way too a ueh vorlc for you., t:or 

tho aqencies, for you to. try to do all of thl8, 

and frankly, you ...., trying to do it all """ too 

fut. 

ln thil area we've qot thi-s T-itle v. we;•ve 

qot tho B&ldwin p lant, we have the Oynegy, •o've 

qot all of these coming up. You have how many ' 

permit rovie e~a who are workinq on this? tou 

have all these people, we j ust have a few. of us 

who have the time , who have the de sire, vho have 

the cotQPulaion, vho a.r e cra:y, vbate¥er, to sit 

dOwn &Dd go through thi& uf ~ So, you tnow, you 

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haw to U$0 aolll9 kLnd of j~nt and respect tor 

~ public for a publicly enforceable pe<Odt to 

let us have a little tiwe to be able to qo through 

thi• aod let us ha..,e .soree a.ore help. 

I knooo • • will be happy to lobbY to get ~ 

111101:• .ooey. 1 t.hink you Jcnov t:b.is adallni&t.rat.ion 

is tatiOQ avay our e.nv ~rorullllUltal. protections every 

clay io viav of tbe regulations, i n viev of the 

cuttinAJ of the budgets. T:bey ' r e cuttiO<J a.ll of 

these thlnil and what '• happening is our &ir ia 

going to 9et dirty, its getting dirtiar, our vater 

is defi ni tely dirt ier. 

SOMone o~tid abo.':lt the 52 tons of. hazardous 

·air pollutants, what tbey are talXinq about il· 

~_ry. We've. got t wo la.Ku, state Park la'kea 

heft that -- D&ny of the ~ty cannot afford 

to go out and boy steakO ·and ·ali kinds of protein 

for t.bol.r fiJILili es, they go and they tiah l n thoae 

lakes, t bey' re state .pa.rk..s, they're cont:.a.a.i.nated 

with M.rcury. 'they ,qet the bottotD feeders, 

tbey• re teedlnq their f amily, they•re gett ng 

tbo&Q fieh. The IDPM has an advisory on their 

WGJ>site. Tbey ~>ave ~ the Illi nois oepar~nt of 

National ~aources when you go in to .got a fiahinq 

license hae a little varnih9 on. the back of the--

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so:mewbe.re in t~ little booklet when you qot yoUr 

fishing license -- that says thiG fish ·advisory - -

only e3t one a .onth from this l ake unlO•• you are 

a woman of' cb.lld be~aring age~ a..nd then kind of 

skip it or however. 

But you qo to the lakes and you. see all of 

tbeso people around fishing# ther9's oo sign tbat 

t.e~l• ,t.bom tha t where th~y • re ~tshing -- there' • · 

nothing that tells them that Frank Holten .stat e 

Pa~k bas PCB'a, it's con~ated with Pes. Where 

do the y come froa? M!hy are the y there? Nothin9 

tollo them t hat, ell ~ • aybe you can eat these 

tiab if you taJce. the fat off and tbe s kin off . . 

Sow lflany 'people i.n this comrunity i.n thie whole 

area eat the fi$h with the skin and everythi ng 

taken off and not fried? T:bey · fcy it a.nd that 

seale in the polson. 

ADd l.t you k""P al.loring every s inqle COIOP""Y 

t bet COI\eS tor anOther permit for a. ne al and 

Oon't hit them with fines and don' t cloee eb~ 

down when they need to' be cl osed down, yo~ a re 

contr1but1nQ - · each of you is indi idual y 

culpable of contributinq to the poor health and 

tha f~turo of t bie community, of these 

coamunities. of the chi1dren bet:o. 

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One teaspoon of morcury i s enough to 

Contbm!nate a whole lake ve're told. How .any 

pounds of roorcu.ry . come out of the s t ack? . flow I'M.DY 

qet out ot the aide vant that doesn't' go up the 

$tack? How many upsets are ther e ? Do we know? 

Do tlwty tell you. •very t.ime there's u ~set? The 

aalf r;eporti09 is very, ve.cy troublaaoae, and lt'l 

not jus·t with thi.e coepany that I ' m. troubled. I 

knov ·it,l p~rtly because you don't ~ave enough 

personnel to go out and inspect, but somethin9 ' 1 

qot to be done. 1 IQO.IIn, you have to make nolaes 

about doinq it. Get your peopl~ out t here and 

start inspeetinq an~ do it w;itbout announclnq i t. 

I know thos e thinqs get cleaned vben you announce 

when you're ooainq . 

one of the things I found kind of 

interestin9~ and I'• xeally pleasecL very pleued, 

that the cbuical W4ste gr~.. the aedical vo_ste 

inei.Der&t.Or 9'%'0up CUII8: oftr : ebe p6ople VhO worked 

very, very bat<l and they deserve so n::ruch CJ:ectit 

for t ho work t hay did i n qotting the medica l wa.to 

incinorator cloaed-

'This 1n ine~at r bare· got at t ent ion wbon 

there vaa a small a few years back and oycry~y 

vaa on the newa at nine and tbe t en 'c ~k news, 

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~hat 13 that smell, vb~t is that sMell? I w.a 

getting call,e, is that Granite City? Sauget? All 

of th• people in St. Louis "'anted to knOW. Hell 

it turn~d out th•t it vas be~e~ 

But. locMl of •Y concern is that it wa& 

socoethl.n<J o:Mt they could saell. What i! thc>y 

cannot .-117 What all is qoiog out there that we 

don't know about thAt we can'~ s ee? ~en black 

s~n.ok.e come• out you see t hou · t b ings. You don 

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see s~ of t hese toxins. And I, too, request a 

copy of tho report that was asked for, t he 2000 

repOrt, And l would teally l i ke to know soacthing 

abOUt how you vere treatinq the viol&tione that 

wont on and ia t here a line tbat the new ones are 

treated a ditferent way, are they qiven a 

ditfero.nt wei.qht, ,ore they qet.tin9' erec:U:c. fot' 

being new owners? 1 .ea.n, do new ovne:a bav• to 

~ r.ally new? can we ju&t kind of aova over to 

bigqer aeata? 

And finally. J woul d really like. for you to 

tell tho people here, who reall y want to know that 

are· told thia is enforceabl e by the publ i c , what 

exactlY does thit mean? Rov do we enforce it and 

bow do •• change what t s bappen,icg here and h ow 

does it beCOCb& wrs? And I vou.ld re.a.l.~ y like eoM. 

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ans were to that. T~nk you. 

(BY HEI\RlNG OITICI;R MATOESIJ\ll) : Do wo want 

to take a five mioute break or do you w~nt to keep 

(BY liS. RETTLE) : I didn ' t say I want to 

ca-e-o.t., but I would like tO -.at.e one. 

(BY IIURiliG OFl'lCBR HMOBSl l\ll) : State and 

spell your n~, a~se. 

(BY HS. RETfLB): My na-e iS Jeanette Rattle, 

Sierra Club. J '• not here in any capacity for the 

Siexca Club. I'~ a resident of Bell eville and I 

think it' a i~o~ta t ~at you kno~ people i n otber 

oomaunities close by • ·eoncei ned tor ~opl• in 

these areas, tn areas that are not able to fight 

back vbeo tb.in9S like this are put upon ~, and 

ve ~ to band toqethe:t .to p rotect everyone1 a.nd 

this i s tbe meuo-eas·t area and so thi ngs that 

affect St. Louis &ftect us, and things that affect 

us will affect them. 

And I did have ~ question I really w&nte~ to 

'k:oow about. I would just ask what doeU tho pubiic 

do to enforce this? Do I go down t tle.r• asid 

breathe e~ry day and see if I qet canc:er or vhat 

do you do? SO I 1\0pe you vUl answer that 

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qu-estion. 

And I bad a question for Hr . Victorine, 

beea\lSe you are the only one I could ta.e.ar and 

understand~ and I appreciate that. You said that 

there are t ests, I thi nk, on -- and correct me if 

I 'm vTonq, on dioxin every two aod a half years 

and on somethinq else every five ye•r8 by the 

USEPA; is that correct? 

(BY MR. VIC1'0RINE) : Yes. 

(BY MS. at:n'L£) : Are those announced or 

unannounced visits? 

(BY MR. VIC1'CiRI NE): That•s the wordin9 i o 

the regul ations for th&Se new l)a.z.ar~ous waste 

corobustable HACT rul8s ac~ually under the Clean 

Air Act. Those w0'uld be tests' that a facili~y 

wou~d hire a con3Ultant to do those teSt$, and 

generallY ~e regulatory aqen~y will observe those 

tests· and provide audit mat~rials, in some ease s, 

to sort ot test: tbe testers, if you v ill. 

(BY HS. RE'l'rLE): Okay. 

(BY HR. VICWRDIE) : No<t I thinl: that ri9ht 

now becaUse of the lawsuit fr~ the Sierra Club 

which so(t o£ puts soma of those regulations on 

hold, I think that that pNvision bas been· stayed 

by th& judqo as tar as the testing: every two and a 

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hal f years on dioxins. 

(BY MS. RETTLE): SO t ha t ' s not oven ~ing 

done? 

(BY MR. VlCTORI NEI : Riqht now you know tho 

judge roapondcd to the ierr~ Club law$Uit by 

vac&t.i.n9 all the reg-s. And th• £PA vorke.d to 9ec 

aOICB i ntori• t49S in pl&ce but that particular 

provi.sion was n.oc put back i.n. 1. think it v i ll be 

put bock in 1n 2005 v hen the nev rules a.re put 

in. 

(BY HS. REr'l"l£} : So tba.t when it doo•. happen 

::rnd it • e scheduled, i t is the corapao.y i tsalf, ,the 

facility hir.os a cone~ltant to do i t and ~one 

just watch••~ do J understand that correctly? 

CBY MR. VICTORINE) : It's oboerved, it'a 

vitneas•c! by the apPropr:iat e t eam. at the 

requl.&tory • ge.ncy chat knOY hov ~ do. that kind o f' 

thi.n9· 

(BY HS. RE'!'I"L£l : 'thank you. I have a.nothec 

question r&ga.rding the Ill-inois EPA. With tho 

terrible budCJet defic-its that I llinoi& .bas, what 

does tbe Illinois EPA, how do you regulato thoae 

facilities and how often are they regulAted by t he 

Illinois EPA? If they . 

(BY MR. BEIUI<>7EITI : llben tho penoit is -- or 

.. 

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whetbCr the pe~it is i csued.it will ha~e • ·tarm 

of five yee ra. that me•ns every fivo yea~a tho 

pc~t will bo ~•noved, at h~cb time they'll put 

the draft per~t out to public noti ce like we have 

before tho i nitial issuance of the permit. 'l'he 

pul:U.ic can at that titDe sut:ait COSIIIX!nts, reque1t • 

buri nq1 like you have done &t this :time. In 

addition, all Title V sou.cces in the State of 

Illino~e, which thare' s ,e.pproxillately 125, thoy 

c;et i nspected once per year, that' s a requirement 

from our man~9cment, at least once a year. 

If there arc probl ems at the facility or if 

there ' s citizen co.plaints for the facility ~he 

inspector will nve~tiqate. Our compliance 

enforceme.nt people, ae a qeneral practice, 

toxmally rcqueet tbe facility stack teat onc:e 

e11ery fi ve yearS to assure that the ~r pollution 

cootrol equi.-ant Ls functioning proper ly and 

JDMts tMt at.anclords •. 

(BY MS. RET't'.L£): Are those a.onounet!id or 

Unannounced viait1? 

(BY HR. BE~EIT) o Tbey can either be 

annoWtced or unannounced. .. (BT MS. RETTU:lo Ol:ay. 

(BY MR. OAAGOVICII); As f&+ as the facility 

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is nspeot~d t wice a year a~ a minimUM, they can 

be announced or unanpounced, and they can be 

ins~ct d more often it there•s a preble~. 

{BY MS. REn'U): TO further confuse the 

issue* but thank you for your att~ntJ..on. I que a a 

I wu juat a U d otteoded chat the rea.rk v.u 

N de, t hat there are otbe.r fa.cilitie.a that are •• 

bad or worat tb&n thU one, and. this ainiai~ea 

vhat'a goinq on hera . I don 't think that's a 

corr•ct appro~ch. I t hink we should be 

approochi ng t hst1 as it.has been said before, enat 

we all d&RQrvo .t o live in a safe place with a nate 

food chGin with s afe wator with sate air . I do 

not th~nk we should have to rely on the· 

pba ceut eal. Cotllp&nies to CODe up vit.h ~tcinot 

tor: ast:tma, curos for c.a.neer. Nbat ve should cSo 

i.s stop it a t th9 be-g'i.ruting wbere the carciOQ9RB 

and to.xina start, and you have the opportunity to 

do tbat, •nd we- do hope that You do .tbat; ve bope 

that you close thea down. Thank you. 

IllY H&AAING OFFIC&R MATOESIANI : Thank you. 

Is there a.nyone else vho wisbe.s to make a c:<>mment? 

(BY MS . GRtEN): ~ name is J~dice Gteen; 

J-0-D-I-C-E, -~-e-t-N, I'm with the Health and 

Environment Juatioe C?roup of St. Louis. Our qrou:p 

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is reaponsible wi th Or . Blounc ror shut.ting dc;)wn 

Stericycle. It had been pollutinq North St . Louis 

and a numbor of -- quite a few areas of St. LOuis, 

and I'~ here because 1· am personally concer~d for 

thiS ~unity and St. LOuis. 

And I beard Mr. Victorine speak about lead. 

He did.rl't rul ly go into details &.bout. it but I 

Mvwt a caajor coDOCrn about. the elri.$sion of le.-d. 

Pretty ~ch overy otbex hou~ that I 90 to the 

children are lead poisoneC, aod. ve shut down 

Stericycle because a lot of the children in the 

co11111u~ity had asth1Aa1 and I - r·eally concerned 

because of the taqt that ve had to t ake I consider 

drastic at•P• to shut down Stericycle, and thie 

community will p~etty much have to do· the •ame 

thing. 

And I have a list of questions, and tbe Cirat 

one is, vby &re tba. st•ck tests only happening 

every five ye.ara? Maybe someone can a.nswe.r t hat .. 

Another one ia, does tEPA a.lvays 9ive pennita 

to polluters wi th track recorda a.s bad .a Onyx? 

And tho third ono is, how ~~an y surpriaa 

inspection~ are condu~ted each yea~? 

And I havo another one . Isn 1 t t:his mpre a 

particular utter too hi9h-, why or why not? Is 

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~e standard t6o high? And like I "say, 1 do have 

a pe~sonal concern and I feel like I don•t have to 

come ~- l feel like it"s up t~ you all to deny 

~is pe~t, bec~use I don't wan t to ha ve t o come 

aci oss the water to do what we did in St. Louis to 

close down Steri cycle. X do urge you to deny t his 

P"C1!it. Thank you . 

(BY HEARING OFFICER MAtOESLANl : Thank you, 

Hs. Green. Is there anyone e1se that wishes to 

make a comment right now? Does anyone have any 

question,? c~ up. 

(BY MS. FAVI LLA): A lot of tba r egulations 

an? a ·lot of t he testinq, I wondered il there was 

actually a chart out there t hat shows the six 

months t o one year, and two and a half years, the 

five year t ests which were done by the E~A, 

Illinois or u.s., vbieh are done by a hired 

consultant, vh.ich ones" ver6 watched ove r, whi ch· 

Ones -- is there somet~ing out the re that we can 

look a t , because t thi nk this would elimina te a · 

l ot of confusi on. And if it•s all in the Heb, 

that would be great, and if there ' s not, i t 

there • s a parti cular o ft i ce we can look fox: that 

at. 

(BY HR. B.ELOGORSJ<Y): All testing con~tions, 

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you C4n copy and paste from the fede~al 

cegulat1on. You can go to the proposed pentit and. 

looK into toatinq requirements. 

(BY MS. FAVILLA); I neEd to go through the 

Title v regulations .a.nd copy a.nd ~ste. So t .here'a 

not • c:hart out7 

(BY MR. BELOGORSKY); We copy and paate frca 

the federal requl&tion&, so the federal 

requirerHnts ot title v pexmit are den~ica.l 

r~ir~nta or th• USEPA and the federal 

regulations. 

tf you aLe interested in stack testing 

condition requireMents, I can point out during the 

brea.k. or a.fter tho meeting the c:e'rtaln a~ction yoU 

can loo); for. If you look at it it will be e~sior 

for you t·O J?e~tu understaod. 

(BY KS. FAVI"_LLA) : And I did. have <me other 

question. It was said a coupl-e different tiM• 

beca.uee. this ple.nt puU out a smaller 8*>uot of 

toxicities compared to others in the reqion i t's 

not lOoked at as SOl'lething that shoUld be deni ed. 

And X vor.der where will we ever start if thero'IJ a 

cu.ulative effecta study on all of the different 

pl•nta 40 so if we aUov facilities to emit t.be 

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•aximum to the qlass ceilin9, co the very ·top, and 

everyonQ is allow&4 to do that just because it 

.!qht be a little le$S than soee of the othera. 

If you don't $t.ct..r t l ooking a.t dehyinQ: pe~ta on a 

coin..iJaull level, then you aren•t eve.r look.lnq at the 

cwa.ulative effect of tbe be.al tb of the c:~nity, 

and I • on&t:r 1 f tbere is any effort to look at the 

comaunlty effects? 

(BY MR. B£RN0TEIT}: Noraally when a new 

ujor source it con1tructed .they go ths;ouqh what 

ia called PSO r.evlew, PSD standards, or Prevention 

of S.iqn1f.1c;snt Detariorat.ion. Onyx d-oes leso than 

h&lf of the threshold to trigqer thosa 

regulations. They axe . not a JM.jOt source. 

Therefore, tht ~l&t~ve eftect~ on the amblont 

ai.c quality as a result of Onyx vas not studied, 

or ~n OnyX ••• originally constructed likewise 

vit.h the pl&ntB ne.ig-hboring onyx. For ex&J~Ple, 

you &re • little bit f~liar with the Solutia. 

Solutia vas conscructed a long time before the rso 

recommendation~ ever came in, and I'm not aware of 

any pro1oct t h&t Soluti a bad th~t triqgered the 

PSO, but if t hey bad trigqared PSO, review 

~el1D9 i e done, all the backqrouAd 

concent.r•ti.ons e.re &tudied, includinq 

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conc·eptrations coming frotn oayx .. from. Biq River, 

~oain9 from Joint ~erioan Bottle, t think Ds 

~t door, a'll of t h ese ax:e · studit!d durin.q • PSO 

reviov of project at solutia. I'm not f&Miliar 

vith ~Y projecta recently, so that hasn't boon 

dQne. 

(BY MS. FA VILLI\) ' So vheo you say that tbe 

toxici ty levels are about 50 percent ot w~t 

othe.rs an no'lf' ·~lyifl9 for permits with -

(BY MR. ·DERNO'l'BIT) ' For tbe VOl<, nitroqen 

oxida and carbon PQnoxide. 

(B~ MS. VAVILLA): Do yoU take into Account 

the other permit~? I know that thete are anotb&J: 

four' or five that Ca.e acros$ ~Y desk wi~in the 

last week and a b&lf. Have you taken into account 

tbose evan if they're only in 50 to 75 per~ent, 

bOV the:y a.l.ght i .nter&ct even thouqb th•y don't 

quite Met that? 

(BY MR. B&RNOT&Ul ' " • have no l eqol 

a~tho~ity to do, that. 

(BY HS. FA VILLI\) ' Thank you very IIUCh. 

(8Y MS. NfDRIA) : K<tthy Andria, r wonder i n 

how Nny qu.a_.rter$ does the facility have to be. in 

~iqnlficant non-~liance before there's some 

action? 

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(BY Ml\ . B£RNOT£IT) ; None of us are in 

o~ i&oce enforcement oup~ so we're unab~c to 

answer yout question. 

c61 HS. ANDlUA) : there's ':fl attorney fro\n 

the ~ttorney Genez:&l ' ! Office, wou.ld he knOW that 

answer? 

(81 Mfl. BEPNOTEl'!l: 1 '• not aware that tbUI 

vas an attorney. 

!BY MR. HOJ>GNll : Ji:n Morqa.t> froa the 

Attorney Gene.r a l 's Office, and 1 don' t kn~v tbo 

e .. ns-wor oi t he r:. 

(BY MS. ANDRIA): Can you f ind that ans wer, 

})ecao.se m)' underotAi'l<1in9 from the re<7ord, l t looks 

like there hao been si9nificant.non-compliance 

tba.t kind of )<aepS on goin9 and going and goJ.nq . 

(BY HUIUHG OITIC£1\ ~IAN) : 'Ole ioaues 

of conplianCO and en or~t are bettez: sui t.cS 

tor written re.sponn, beea'U.Se the public he.Ui n<J 

ooean • t cover cOIIIPlUuice enfor cement issue:•. so I 

ttiink a lot of t be questions woul d be better 

b4ndled in a vrittQn response. 

(BY HR. s~&tT) : It was asked • couple 

diffe~ent times during tha comments how doee a 

.-.~>er of tb• pu!>UC:: enforce the pe.,.U.t. And ttr. 

N~•• toucbed on vhat .I vas abOUt to • xplain. 

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Basically you have to ~nvest SQm& tiGe and effort 

to fOI files and requllSt copies of reports and 

eud~slon reports, exce~dence reports, inspection 

xepo~ts! and it takes a lot ot ~ork, We hAve & 

full-time staff that are dedicated to ·doing that 

and .,e can•t catch. all of the violations 

ourselves. 

Let me qualify that comment. A member ot the 

~ublic cannot enforce tbe permit i t we don't issue 

the permit . so, that would be a reason why .it's 

necessary for us to is'sue a Title v pe_nni.t. 

(BY HEARING OFFICER MATOESlAN): I think· they 

n~ed a l ittle clarification of the bene fits of 

i.s.suance of the peradt. 

(BY HR. BERNOTEIT) : The public enfo.rcemeni:. 

component is a be~efit of having to issue a Title 

V pe~it for this facility. If one is not issued 

to the f4cility, the public doesn ' t really have 

power .to en{orce violation of air pollutioo 

requlation_s. 

(BY MR. CORTNI!R) : Marvin Co~tner, Suburban 

Journals Newspapers. In reterence to th~ miasing 

2000 USEPA inspection, l~ . Harris is hare 

representing Onyx, pe:rhap.s be might be ·forthcoming 

and shed so111e light on that. 

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Secondly, 1 would like Mr. Barris t o take the 

opportuni ty to explai n what Onyx, what 

imp~oveme.nt.s as far as compllan.ce, have been made 

under the onyx new mana<;ement. 

(BY MR. HARJUS): My name is Doug Barris, I'm 

general manager for th'e Onyx facil ity. 

!BY MR. ~TN&R) : The miasing 2000 USEPA 

report that the Sierr& Club attorney saya cannot 

be obtained becau se it·' s enforcement sena:i~ive, ' 

perhaps ' you as a representative of O~y.x might be 

f0rthc0Gdng to inform the community.abo.ut what was 

de terwined or was vh.a t was found in that 

inspection. 

(BY HR. BARRIS): Hbat he's speaking of ia 

the US&PA mul t i media a.udit , that au'dit that was 

perfomed in Jul y of 2000. .That audit, we have 

reques-ted a copy of that at least on ·a half a 

dozen occasions. We understand the draft exists 

to that. We'd be very ~nteres.ted to 9et that . 

ourselves. The ·Only light I can shed on that is 

that at the close of the meeting vhen we spoke 

with the ins-pectors. they told us that they had no 

signi:ficant issues and no violations found d.u.ring 

mul ti.tledia audit . Bot we have not s een the report 

and woulct- vory mach like to. 

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(BY HR. CORTNER) : What iq>rovementa as far · 

as compli ance have boen made under the new Onyx 

management whe n they took. over operatiOn of the 

eoaopany? 

(8'i ~· BARIUS): Well, I 'll speak to the 

pollution control &ystem of our Unit N~r 4 

inCln.rator,. it bas had a ca,r,bo.n injection syatom 

added to it for diox_in control.. 

One thing that • s C:OJ'M up a couple ot times 

w&s the testing of pnce every five r,ears or once 

every two and a half yeArs oO th&se inc~neratora. 

Actually we bave tested these incinerators 

even eiqht. or· ten t.~es in the last t wo ye4rs, a.itd" 

inoe we have three incinerators that would be al1 

of the incinerators, so tbat•s three plus times 

per incinerator over the last tvo years. and 

basically t hose tests haye been done to 

· de.onstrate compliance with the MACT standar~, 

which at the pr:escnt time they are in compliance 

with the MACT standaros. 

(RY HS. ANDIUA) : ·coul.d you provide tb«<l to 

us? 

(BY. HR. lll\RIUS): Certainly. 111\at I'll do is 

I' 11 leave a few o·t my cards up here on the chair 

aod anybodY that would like to visit the facili ty, 

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please givo ~c ~ call, we'd lo9e to have you cOMe 

viait the facility . If there ' s any partieula~ 

doCUJD6Dtl or reports that you eouldn' t find or you 

would like, I'm e~in it we have the~ wa will be 

haPPY to copy thea for you a nd it doesn't coat 15 

ce.o.ta per copy. 

(BY MS. G!UZHI: JUdice GrM<>· Are you able 

(BY MR. !SARRIS): No, we do not have an 

autoclave proc• as. 

B~ OR. BLOUNT): I .was just reviewing so~o 

scotistica, start~ng in 1995, 1996, and up throu~h 

2001 you h4d' 19 incidents·of ~ploaions with toxic 

waste be1n9 distributed to the enviro~nt. 

Nineteen diftezent on•s· Md. then wo tal_lt about 

c~liancc? t ee&n, the regulatory ac;~encies 'have 

not seon flt to release :.t.a.t~nta s a yi.ng that you 

arc not in oonpli.a.nce, that. you a..s;.e in 

comp~ anee. I mean, could you talk abOUt tbDaG 

19? that seams "an inordinate n~r of 

explo~ions •. Can you talk about thos e? 

(81 MR. ~lSI : I think BKPlosion migbt not 

reptese.nt 1:.he&e loc:.ide.nts ~ Wbat happens is in an 

incinerator --

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August 10, ~uqust 20, 1999, JUly 2, 2000, 

s~thing exploded, released -- a cloud of 9aaoa 

vas rolaaaod, rele~sed thiS cloud~ most of the~ 

toxic que a lnto the environment. Maybe they trere 

not exploaiona, maYbe I' ~ just misinfol"'Ntion. 

(8Y MR. KARRJS): t•n not sure who did tho 

paper that yo\J &ctu&lly have. An i.ociner•tor ia 

operated ln negat ive pressure, $0 it is t ypie&lly 

one t"o t W'o inches ot water co \.~Gl negative 

pressure, eo there'S· suction i nto the 

inci ner•Cor. An ooc•sion in these instances would 

be if so~eth ng ver~ to be pLaced in the 

incineratOr and lot's say it's in somo type of 

bottle or can, let's say an aerosol e&n would be 

an example. I n many ca.se.s I '10 sure that some of 

these are aerosol conditions, th~y voul4 qo in and 

they preeaurita, they aay instantaneously c•use 

the incinerator to qo positive, maybe for oae, 

wo, three soconda, or vbatevex, and if ve have a. 

eam.E& on our cioerator and if ve detect a 

po5it1ve preeeure, wb&t we do is ve review the 

ca.mora t.nd it t here's any s i gn of physic:.al 

e.U..u :.S.on, and so.ae of t be.se are visible · 

emiasiona. It you just reviev the camera on 

noraa.l speed you ca.n • t see thea, you have to puah 

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i t ta•t forva_rd to actually detect i t. sotne of 

them ate tar less than maybe a standazd tractor 

triile'r or standard tractor starting up or 

wb&tever. You can detect those and gi ve a report 

of each and every one of these· eo tbe a9ency. 

so t hOse ate .ost like ly pos tive pr•ssure in 

the lncine.rator. t don't Uaink explosion would be 

the correct vord for thetl. 'Those posi tive 

p.ressures z:eaulted in SOI!le- type of eai-s.aion from 

the combu.st ion of the incinerator . Whether it be 

on• second or five second ~ission, tho$e ar• all 

a:epcu:tod. 

(BY HR. ·FIUU'!MAN ): I 'WOnder, l've heard. 

go:salp that some of the aateria.ls thAt you are to 

be u.alnq is caainq from the .caxi.bbean, as far a"ay 

as that. And ae~dly, I 've. heard a story t~t 

you are golng' to do some processinq of nerve qases 

frca t.be ailit.ary, and. I wonder if there's any 

truth to c.bat? 

(BY HP. . RAJUU.S): The first -- the carrJ.b<tan, 

or Puerto Rico I!IOXe likely -- we do have a b'ra.'och 

in Puerto Rico. Me get a very, vexy small amount 

of IUtetlal f'rorn someone that f a.r •way: I would 

have to t hink it vQul d be less than a hal! of a 

percent of materLal, 'but there ~ &~ 

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circuao:tances tfhe.t'e material hAs in fact co•e from 

that far away to our {$cili~Y· Very r are. ver y 

ra ro. 

secon4 question on the p~s$in9 of nerve 

gas. I 9~11 tint, tber• is no such thing a.s 

n~• g•a, which it's nerve aqent, which is a 

A.pp.r::oxi.Utely six to nin• mndl.s ago we were 

contacted by the r>epartJnent of Defense ancl uked 

if we -..ould consider t1lsposi n9 of neutrelizad VX 

nerve oqcnt. Now once it' s neutral ~ed, it's an 

irreversible che.tcal reaction that rendora ita 

~terlal a~st identical to what you vould 

COftiiOOlY boy as drain c leaner . It vou.ld. p~ly 

be b&at Cbuacteriz.ed a s drain cl.eane.r that you 

could buy at t.ove.a or Hoce Depo 3.nd. za.J.a.tbion 

~5ticiclu that you can <Jet i t JOiJ<1Id ~ether that . 

would be the ~cal. it is no lott<Jel' nern 

oqeo.t. lt ia A(J&in.st federal law to tr-&naport 

nerve a.qant. 

• e re ~ed by the Department of Oe en~e it 

we would coneider dispo$ing of tb&e since we 

entered 1nto a treaty with otber nationa to 

dispose ot that in tbe year 2006 or 20~7, I 

believe. our answer to the AgenCy vaa i f vo ' re 

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called upon and you determine tha.t our facility is 

the best facility in t his country to dispose of 

that we would i n tact ente~tain that. At tbat 

time we will announce it to tbe public and we 

would hold a public outreach program and discus& 

it vith the public. 

At the present t ime the ~t of Oefenae 

it atte.pti.Dg to co.e up with a new process witb a 

c::c:.pany Ln Ohio to d.isposs of this uterial. 'fhua 

f.a_r thcy'vo been unsuccessful rith that procosa so 

there are no plana. at the present time t o do that, 

but there i a "' Ch31.nc:e in the next three or six 

·months ths.t we My agai n be contacted by the 

DepaEtMent of Defense. 

our anawo.r to the DepartMttt of 'Oefen.so, 

we' re not particul.-rly inter ested in doing it; 

boweve..r, 1! we wore called upon by the qove.aaent 

and we were ~ by our qov~nt to be tba 

best faeilLty to clo that, ve vi.ll uspond.. 

(BY Ma. UJZS) : Broce N:lll.es witb the 

Sie cra Club on the poi nt ot explosion. A cOnsent 

Dec~ee was ente~d i nto a week aqo by t he Attorney 

Gene~ l t hat refers to two instances, oper ator 

tailed to take precautions that led t o reactions~ 

the reaction• prodUced uncontrolled toxic waste 

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fumes ot qaseo in 1996. Then i n 1998 a mixturo of 

lithium foill was released ing a volume of 

qaa four times this expl osion, cau1ed a &U%9e~nt 

(phonetic], to open and emission to escape 

a.llO'otinCJ t\a_zarctoue: g-ases t.o escape i.l\to the 

atJDOipbez:• · 

so, thia l.a the aqreement tha.t the opexator 

aiqnod two weeks .a9o to settle claiAs dated back 

before 1996. Tbe use of the wOrd explosl oo ia not 

fron the Sierra Club, it's a reflection of what 

actually happened. 

(BY HR. HARRIS)! Did you have~ question? 

(8Y HR. Hl LLBS}: Just a clari fication. 

(BY HJl. JtARlUS) ~ Mit.h the previous owner as 

t.o tha.t, beCAUSe those- were both - a,re both' 

c.JC&JIIPlea of positive pressures o~ tho kiln in t.bat 

s~th.l.nq wu positive i.e leued.. And ..ayba 

thil is an opportu~ity f or me to respOnd earlier 

to·tbe, I queee, 135 or so violations' sioeo 1991, 

includi ng faleification· of re~rds, and this mlqht 

be a tJJna tl\at 1 cC>Uld respond to t hat J.saue . 

I quoss what I would likG to say~ I thi nk I 'm 

going to put in a classification of all of the 

otbe.x ones, is the issu~ of f&l.sitleation ot 

reco.r;d.S. Maybe: iet ae eJCPlaiD that one end vhat 

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- - t he only one that I cari ·imagine you would be 

refer ring to. This was p robably six t o e ight _

years aqo and i t vas not fals fica~ion of records 

tram the· co:~pany to the agency or any goverrunen:t 

bod.Y·· 

What happened as 'a resul t of that i s we. had 

an empl~yee that had been receiving dL~, Naybe 

ve'd 9et 10 or 20 a ~ek drwns that was crushed 

glass trom chemical bot tles, and t bey would send 

us t be crushed gl ass and we bad a procedure tbat 

ve!d open up every one of 'thos-e dt'UII18 and look 

into the• and verify what was ~ it to ma.ko sure 

tha t what they had sent us is, ·in f act , what they 

sent us . We had an employee, vho alter receiving 

these week after week, i nstead ot Opening up every 

drum, act uall y QP4ned a couple of tbem and then · 

shook the rest of them to hear crushed "glass, 

which is qa1.~t our procedure . Okay. ·said he 

opened them, but he -shook them .. 

The action of the company was t o i~ately 

f.ire t.be empl oye-e and to i i'!Giediately ·report this 

act to tha Illinois Environmental Protection 

Agency. 

So the falsification of records, I don't 

believe - - if it's not that incident I cannot 

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imag1no what it would be. It was not a 

falsification of record$. That speaks to that 

incident. 1'he other 13"4 incident a r e very 3iln.ilar. 

Maybe there waa an exceedence of • poaitlve 

pr8-ssu.re that ve h.ad. We report each and eYOry 

ooe of those tinoe 1991. Our ac~lity has cQpoTted 

eac:h and every one of those to the £PA. Oby. 

The up-to-dat• sca.nda.rds .. vbat it says in 

there 11 that if you have 10 of thaae vith1o a 

60- day period you will tben report them. So the 

2004 atand&rd• that were required to meet state 

that 10 of them withi n 60 days, you w£i te a lettMr 

to tho Agency,. Si.nco 1992 we. have 'been r equj.J:"ed 

bY the Illinois EPA to write a letter on ~ach and 

every one of them. 

wa vill continue to re~rt each and every one 

of t..heD., ao I th.lnk t~then you underst~ a lot of 

theae, you tDow, 135 sounds l.ike a. lot, but you 

b4ve to really under~tand the regulat(ons. 

And agiJ.,n, ahould any or you decide t hat you 

want aosne lOON i~follMtion about theae 5pt1Cific 

i ncidents, I encouraqe you·to take a card and we 

can provido some data and information for tbat. 

iBY KR. B&LOGORSKYI : I wou~d like to aake 

some qualific.atlons, because a ownber of people' 

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.ra_ised tho. question ~out so111e tind of 

co~unication between the .DePartment and public 

and the Agency . The Illinois EPA, we have ptetty 

good field people, field inspe~tors i n the office 

in COllinsville, we have .ain offices in 

Sprinqfiold, and everybody that vould like to 

co=awnica.t.e with tbe. Agancy on a a'Q:II.be% o f issuaa, 

they can do it easily at any tiDe. We're opao for 

tbe.ae ~Jeetings wit:h the 1.qency seaff &l!Y t.iJae, and 

the poopl~ are esger to give any assistance to yo~ 

a ny ti~Mt. ~d 'i n this pa r ticular case, tor' 

ex.tu:a;pla, T1tl.o v permit was put. on for ·the publ~c 

i n Novetnbe:r. 2002, and si nce t b.ls tUlle, pc.rso.nally 

Me, I can talk aboUt ayaelf, as a pe~ t director 

of tbia dxaft 1 recei ved no ~nts or no 

c()GIDW)i.cation at .,11 troa the public. SO a t ;.ny 

ti,M, one, ac;e.in, we • re open for any discusaione 

and for any ldnd of COinll8nts . and cl.ari ficatioo•. 

And one .ore point about pl.ain Enqllsh 

l.ilflquaqo, how the perait is Yritten ~nd. t.h4 

regulatiOn ia written. 'Yes, re~l&tiooa the.y · uee 

for this title ~ facility are very, ver y 

c~licatod, and you . hava to tem$mbe~ that thia ie 

a 1o9a1 document, and e&ch a.nd every condition. 

that • s d:ratte.Cl should be drafted vtl:.t'Y, •ery 

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carefully, because again, this is a legal 

docum'Qnt, a_nd unfort unately plai.o lang-uoge is not 

an option in t his particulax case and in any title 

v permit i n general. 

(BY HS. ANDRI A); I just have one quick 

question. Could you es ~te about how aaAy hours 

you have put i nto this penzdt and bott u..ny boura 

otber a. b.ave put into this permit? Could you al~ 

tell • vbat was tbe fea charged the company for 

this PGmit? 

(BY 1'.11. B!lLOGORSK'O; I t's not an easy 

question. I w&a drafting thi$ permi t ove...r time 

pro.bbbl y atou.~d three tnonth.s. Let•s Dee , And 

atteE t ho dr~tt was ready and sent to the public 

notice we have numerous, namerOU$ a&etinqe and 

con!arence calla with a~l of these peop1e zittln9 

at t.hl . .s table, ~ it•s bar d to $ay bow mny 

hou.ts. 

I have aJceady contribut-ed. to this pendt and 

bow many hours wU l be n~ mre in re6"ponae to 

the questions people raise on thia heAring, so 

probAbly it will be, I believe, at least a couplo 

moL·e weeJca, because I expect to have a nwnber of 

meetinqs in re&ponse to your questions trom thia 

heu~ng. 

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About teea. Mter July 1 we have -- Illinois 

EPA General A•sembly has raised the fees tor ~ny, 

many· aoure• a, and fo~ all sources i n ,Illinois, .so 

we axe charqing t he f.acility right now Title V· 

sources, so total -- wh&t does the total - - I 

believe, probably .something about 2000 . 

(BY HR. IWUUS): It vu 4, 000 dollan. 

(BY HR. B&I.OGOR.sKYl : Four- thoUsand doJ.lu:e 

we 're charqinq the facility . 

!BY MR. B&RNO'l'Elf) : Onyx .bas paid a 'Utlc v 

perait fee every ~r since 1995, so thGy 'vo been 

paying tor: the permit tor eight ye.ars even though 

they h.IJvcm't hod the penn1t.· 

(BY MS. SANDRA HOOD) : Related question &bout 

the ttmo. I understand the law, fr~ your 

diaeuasion, lt wa.a passed in 199(), the c0111pany 

presented their request for a ~t in 1995, and 

the perait woo put o"t in June of 2003, and yet it 

took just three 100nths to wri te it, but those 

wcren ' t. the date a t r~r ~ing. So tho 

proce.ee we bave tor pecai.tting, . inapecti nq, 

· re.ports, don't protec·t us at all. Why does it 

t.a.ko ao J.onQ? 

(BY MR. DERNOT'EJT): To answer your que:stion 

about why it takes so long. Nationvi<H ~itle v 

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pe.naits have been slow to be issued. To date only 

two permitting authori ties in the entlre Onited 

States have successfully issued Title V pe~ta. 

OSEPA Inspector General issued a report last year 

detailing all of the problems with the Title v 

permit pr oqraJR. ntis permit so tar has taken a 

significant a.ount of time to draft, ·and to have 

roeeti.nqs with ' the company OSEP~ with your Bureau 

of Land people. Today t his is pxobobl y the most 

.siqnificant permit that Anatoly has beeil 

reviewing. 

Why i f t he program was i nstituted i n 1990 d i d 

it taKe untll 2003 to get where we are? The 

.Illinois &~A io 1992 -- let me· b>ek up~- in 1993, 

we submitted our pr09ra11. to OS£l?A for approval . 

We dtd not get approval for Title V CAAPP program 

until March 1, 1995. And then we were collectioq 

permit appl ications for that next year. 

Title V vas a totally nev and dilferene way 

for us to "rit.e and issue permits. we addressed 

procedures and I had to hire and train per'sonnel, 

we've had a lot of personnel turnover in the last 

eight years, so then ve have to retrain personnel 

on the Title V pe.X.i't.s. lt's just ~n: a very 

time-consumin9 ero~ss. 

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Illinois is not alone in the country in 

having problttll\S i.asui ng Title V per•ita. tn 

Region 5 we were t he number -- a few 11ont hs back, 

we were the number one state in Region 5 as tar aa 

Title V pormit i ssuance and ntl111be..r of perarl.ta. To 

qivo you a c~rison. Region ? onsi ~s ol th• 

states of Illinois, Indiana, Obio~ Michig-an, 

Wi e eonain, and MJ.nne&ota. And· me Inspector 

GenerAl's J:eport th.at I referred to ia available 

(BY HR. NILLES.: Again, it•s Bruce Nilles 

with tbe Sierra Club. Jus t on the Title v pe.r.U.t 

fee, tile honeat ;).OSvor to the questi on the WOI'Iit.n 

jUAt aGkod, i e t he Agency bas never had the 

~••ourcea to do t he job. Back in 1993 it said it 

needed about 16 to 18 tUllion dOll ars to do the 

job to get pemita issued. Within thr~e yeue. 

be.._en 1995 and 1998, they reAlized they couldn't 

Cbange the law pa1aed in 1990 by Congre&s, 

rea~lzod thia stote, t.hey couldn't chaQ4e tho la_w# 

so they did the next best t hi nq; which make aure 

the Agency could never charqe enougb permit fees , 

to hire enough etaff to get t he program done. 

They fouqht tooth ~nd nail at the state 

le;isl&tur-e , we cUd succeed, we did c;et a Perut 

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fee increese. The honest answer is making sure 

you never have the resources to qet ~he jOb done. 

Tbe tPA 8tood bY a.nd let the p roq-ra.m lan;ui,•h for 

year after yoar a£tar year. 

And I quess I would continue with a questi on 

that 1 asked ear11er, vbich is what would it take 

t<1 deny a perait? Have you ever deDied .a pe..Ut 

bas.d on tomoooe's cccplia.nce record? And if i t'a 

not tbis oo.plianco ~•cord where workers have been 

injured, doea incidents of explosions, firea? 

What mora dooa: it take before you say you're dono, 

you are over, wo axe not qoincJ to 9ive you • 

pe~it? What would it ta~e i f it's not this 

e&ae? 

CB'r MR. s&RifoT&It) : I wil·l try to anaver 

your question. We've denied state opera.ti.nq 

peralta ~:outinel y it ~ies were not in 

coq>liance. On Title V permit ve ca.n iaeue a 

pernLit to a aou.rce vbo is out of cocqpliance, 

·however, ve can put into the. pemit ~ c~liance 

plan and scbed\lle for COI'lpli.anee that is 

entor~eable not only by our stat e a9ancy but US£PA 

and by ~embers of the public. 

(BY MR. NILLESt: Tbat•s not an · answer to the 

(1\W.Stion. Because we havE:: a compa.ny that 

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c~nsiotontly violated state and tederal law. When 

do you oay no? 

(BY MR. BELOGORSKYI :· You are to.lkin9 •bout 

violationa? ViolAtion• of the .land rules or 

violations ot the aLr rule$? He are ~alkinq about 

the 'l'itle v pemit. 

(.BY HR. NILL£$): For the a.ir d.iviaion, and 

asked for the land &nd the same for OSEPA. 

(BY KR. BELOGOI\S!cr): Tbi$ is two saparate 

venue•, coapli&nce issues and enforcement 1aaues 

and Title V ie1uea. Non-compliance iaSu*s wh~~e 

is in tho Title v permit in qene.ral, if thia ia 

the caae, it whan this pa:tticuJ.ar facility docon•.t 

comply with the atate or federal ru~es, the 

compliance schedule given the company, a 

reasonable period of tiae to brinq 0!)4tta:tion into 

compliance. In this particular case this 

effective re9Ulations, these uew matter rag$ will 

be effective for this facility on June 30, 2004. 

IU.9ht DO¥ until Juno 30 they rill be eubj~ct 

to R~· rulea. Aftec June 30 they will be subject 

to new federal MAtT rules. 

(8t HR', NILLES); You're still not answerinfil 

my question. You are rete~ing to the case in tho 

Attorney General'• office for outstanding 

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siqnificant non-compliance; eight? There is a 

ca.ao iight now · wit h the AG' s office dealittg with 

oo.yx. 

{BY MR. &ELOGORSKY): I honestly don ' t know 

vhat tho ~ttorney General's Off~ce is doi n9 

beca..u.se --

(BY HR. NILLES): Exactly my point. llhy do 

you not conaldar the point .ln d:ecidi.ng vhetb•~ or 

not to opecate in this community? 

(BY HR. BELOGORSJ!il: 'l'bis facility I'm not 

talkinq &bout, l am not talking about thio 

facility, because l "m.not faai1ia~ with t ho 

n~oroe~nt case at the Attorney Genecal'5 right 

now. If any facility violates the rulo, thia 1a 

the certain venue that our enforce.ent people use 

to proceed and punish this coq>any. thi a is how 

w practice. It's not in the Title V per.it U 

this faci l ity doesn't violate state or fedezal 

requlati on•. If they have a ,fire ·or &ome aoeldont, 

it • a not related to the a i r rtanda.rds enforc&DOnt 

by t!a atate·. 

(BY !<R. DMGOIIICHJ: I will try to an&V0r 

that question a little bit, bu·t as the h.earin9 

officer aaid ee.rlier, the problm· will be bette.r 

add$essod ip writing bec~use we don't havo 

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enforoement people here. It"s an issue of denying 

the pomi t a,ppliC:ation on its technical meri ts and 

enforc~ent ~ on a sep~rate tract, and th4~e·a 

specific enforcemant procedures that arc 

follovcd. 

fbe po~ita itsal~ vould be used as a tool. 

1 -.ean, you could i~e violation of the pe.ra.it -.nd 

do anforeesent aq&inat that, but. you couldn • t deny 

the permit, and you probiWly know this better tban 

I do beeau.e you aro an attorney and you wo~ld 

know this ca•e by law, 'but there were instances 

wheri£!1 I beU eve we were accused Qf trying to 

eircu~nt enforcement ayste~ by denyinq a ~4trtn 1t 

ba.eed upon the viol~ti.ons. Enforcement ~as to 90 

through the .~fo~cement process. The permit has 

to be an iaa\le of denying based on teChnical 

.erits of the opplication. 

(BY liS. RI EGLE I: I would like to clul.ty the 

issue of bow long it ta~ to get a pe~t- 1 

· think it wea answered three aoaths to issue a 

pentl t, how ru.ny hours we put into this permit. He 

didn't Man he. picked i t up and three month• l&tor 

he h~d it dona. It took quite a bit of tU.O. 

(BY Hl~. NI U£81: Can the OS&Pl\, do they 

beli&~e they have the •utbority to deny? 

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(BY HR. VICTORINE): First all, with this 

penll.t our guostion i.s very s-mall , but not 

wttnatanding that, I th i~k soxt of giving t he aomo 

answer tha t Tod gave, I think it's a good question 

and .I wou~d like to see it r aised to our 

enforceM-nt. 9tOU:P and see i f they -- you tnow, i f 

t hey bave an a ttoroey. I'• really not the rig.ht 

per•on to answer it, b\lt ve have the Coaaeot on 

the record and there wi11 be responses to thoae 

eonaonta. I think that's p~bably eha beat way t o 

handle it. thanko. 

(BY HeMI NG. OFFICER MATOBSIAll) : Do we 1\avo· 

any other CJUflltione or conoent·s then at this 

·time? All right then . Well thank you all tor 

coming, and ve hope to have complete re$p0nses to . 

you a;'1d ill answer any fo:r'the.r question&. Ag•in, 

the coanant period is until --

(BY HS . MDIW\) : llheo v lll you r<tply to tl\e 

question of the extension o.f the comne.nt period? 

(BY Hll. BRAD iliOS'r) : I tl\i nk tl\o bast thin; 

tor us to do is toke i~ back to our su.pe.xiors at 

tho EPA and they can review that, a.nd we ecrt&inly 

if the decision is made ~ beariog Order will 

be ·put i n to· the record t ha t will be placed on the 

Intetnet, and it'a certainly reasonable for us to 

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.ail out a letter saying that to the people 

atte nding this hear!n~ that the time period baa 

beeo extendttd. 

(BY HS. ANO~IAl: Also fox the do~ents thet 

we r equested that are not avaUable that have not 

been available to us - -

(BY HR. 8IW) f!U)ST) :" liell, I think a lot of 

those doc\llrlent s so far that you·- I 've be<!:n t.h• 

persoq-• just tor the info~tion of the people 

here - - that h&a bOon trying to t rack do~n cathy 

with the rot request to our office. She had 

received oome i nformacion and the~e was some 

nlo~tlon. Onder ber r eview she fou nd t hings to 

be m.isa.lnq frccl\ the r ecord.S. The 'FOI x:eviev wa.a 

separated between the Buxeau of Air and. a~ and 

Wate.r, ao ahe c.-to De and she said can you oe-e 

i f you can find this. 1 did go to our Bureau of 

w.nd and I believe you received s0kll8 further 

~tl, but theo the.re vas sti~L sOfl)l) 

outstanding doc~nts. I think those docunenta 

are US&PA d.ocu1r1ents. !'hose trial burns of 2002 to 

2000,. • ere not request•d by our Agency, of tho 

c~ny, t hey vere done voluntar(ly by the· · 

c~ny . It'a ~y understanding ·they we~• not 

a~tted officiAlly to our agency. Now that's 

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somethinq •aybe the USEPA can expand on further. 

I'm not auro. It's •Y understandin9 those 

documents we£e not thinga our agency rOquested of 

the Coq>;U\Y• 

($Y HS. ANDRIA) : Does the Agency have theca? 

If you bav• tbaza tbe:Y' re public record and. their 

subject to r-~eedoa of lnfor:N.tion. YOU ca.n' t aay 

that they ver• unoff icial beeau:se: you d.idn • t 

reque.et the•· I f you have thea.. they're ou.£8-

(BY ,MS· Rl&G~E): ~hey were sent di~ectly to 

os£PA. 

(8Y Ms. ANORlA) l The r e i s' no copy at t he 

I lliPOi•· EP~ of h~e multi -- this i nspectton 

report, multi po~t 2000. 

(8'! t_45. RIEGLE}: I doo't lc.nO"' that, but the 

aini burn• that they are talking about we.re not 

subaltbOd to the 1llinOiS &PA . 

(Bt HS : A!flliUAl: Since OSEPA is a patty to 

the vbole peP!dt: process of thi.s can they Ee.e\kl:IID.it 

the pemit. and tte 9et our 30 days after: we get it 

and oubeit • FOI reqoest to tbe OSBPA? 

(BY Ha. VICTORINE): I ' m not quite sure 

(Bt HS . . AN~I~l: Wa want the document. If 

ve have to ·qo to OSEPA we'll su~it a FOI to you. 

tBt HP.. VICTORnml : This i s vbich clocUMnt? 

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(BY MS. ANORIAI : This is the 2000 multimedia 

inspection r eport . plus tbe test burns, and I 

asked about the test burns and wa£e told t hat they 

~ere 't done . Is that correct? 

(BY MR. BRAD FROST): All I know i s we d9n 't 

have them. 

(BY MS. ANDRIA)! So 1'1> asldnq if ><e don't 

have them, do you ~ve them.? 

(BY 10.. VICTORINE) : We can look to our file. 

As far as the inspection report, 1 don •t. know, and 

I don't know about the inspection that was donG by 

the state. 

(BY 145 . lUIDRIAl : US&PA. 

Q (BY Ma. VIC!'OEUNE) : .Again., tbat' a somethinq 1 

can raise to the enforcement people tbat keep that 

kind of thin~. 

(BY MS . ANDIUA) : It • s referenced in tb<l 

Illi.ni.os EPA documents. OOcau~ when I went 

through t~e information material it was referenced 

ther e but it wasn't - - but it was missing. 

(BY HS . RIEGLE): It soun~s l ike we ' re 

talkif\9 About more than one thinq. M inspection 

report and mul~ia are t wo separate tbin9s. 

(BY MR. NILLES): It' s 2000 ~timedia 

report, EPA did a w.ul ti.taedia inspection. 

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·. (BY MS. RIEG.l.£): 'Xou are l eavinq out the 

multimedia, a.nd wben I hea r in tion repor t I •m. 

~hinlcing I&PA inspection report. 

· (BY MR. NILLES): 1lnd t he other i s· these 

trial burns, were those not part of the record? 

(BY MR. DRAGOVICH): X t~i.nk Mary vas t-t:yin9 

to address that. 

(BY MS. RIEGLE) : i: ~hinlc they call tb<>m 

mini-burns, that is something the facility did on 

their own. I t wasn't r equi red ox asked for, that 

was a company decision to do those burns, so those 

would not be i n our records. 

(SY MR . IIARRIS): ila ~ci thOse tests 

ours~lves an~ we hired the ·testinq compAnies to 

~~ on our site ~ test. I don't M&nt to make 

this too $implist ic, but if you wan-t to cocne I" 11 

qive you a copy, just call ate or something, I 'll 

copy it and 3end it t o you. Tbose are not 

requize~ •. but we did thosa 'tests to assure 

ouxae lves t hat when i t comes ~ to comply with 

the xLmum, our machines will. 

(BY MR. NI LLSS): Did you suboll.t them to the 

USEPA? 

(BY HR. HARRIS): I f she said tboy were not 

equi~e4 I ' m quite sure we didn't off al~y 

... 

VES 004591 
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s~bmit them, becaus& theY vareo't required. 

Whe ho~ we q,vc somebody a copy, we may havo or 

may not have. You are certainly wel.CoM t o thea 

if you vould like them, call ·and ~ will give t he• 

to ~· Aa tar aa: the nw,lti.tedical in.specUona, 

W4t h.ave not ceceived a copy. If you qat a copy --

(IIY MS. ): li<o will. 

(8Y II&AAING OFFICER I<Aro£SlAN): We'd like to 

thank you again for eOWLinq. ttds wasn't the .oat 

convenient place for this, but it•a the belt we 

can do. We ' ll a end the i:esponsi~nesS study out 

to you. Good night. 

(Adjourned) 

VES 004592 
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ST~TE OY ·ILLINOIS) 

COUNTY OF KADISON) 

I, CYN'ft.JIA A. HYERS, a Not.ary PUbUc in an4 toz:: 

the County ot Madison, State of Illinois, do 

be..reby certify that a heuing vas hal.d a t the 

Cahokia Vlllaqe, Q.a.ll , cabotia, IUinoi&. by the 

Ill nol~ EP~ reqarding Draft CAAPP and RCRA 

Pex:ldta for Qnyx Envi on.raent~~ Servioos, Sauget , · 

Illinois, and was taken in ~tenotype and 

~ransCri.boct accordift91Y· 

l K WlTN&SS WKE.REO!', I have hereunt o set •'i band 

and affixed ray nota~ia.l seal this 4th day of 

AIJ9U&t, A. 0. , 2003 -

VES 004593 
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VES 004594 
. . 

. . L.ah Pack Decision~ 

R~vu# __ ~--------­

Received Date:--------

Decision:·. . Appioyed D Disapj)ioved D Process Code Auth 01 02 

Approyal ~ Si~·_;--...,..----- _;- Dale:,_..: _ ___ _ 

Total Pieces Appzoved Reactive ClaSs.,---- Btu · 01 __ ·. As ' · ppmBe ppmCd_..PPm.Cr _ _ _.ppmPb_ppm Ash~ 

Bun>.i!ls/HalldliJ)giMjsc..'lofurm•tion:. ___ .....,. ______ ~----------------..-

. -: . 

Drum# SUe!I')'pe 0/P Pnim# Si:zel m>e 0/P Druinil ' Sizr.. 1 ype 0/P 

I 11 21 

'2 12 22 ' 

3 1:3 ' 23 

4 ' 14 24 

5 : 15 25 

6 16. 26 . 

7 17 27 . ' 

8 18 28 

9. 19 29 

10 . 20 30 

Technician's Signature ____________ Date _· _ ___ Location __ _; 

Air Reactive 

Water Reactive 

Gross Weight 

Pallet/Container Wt 

Net Weight 

Piecelfype Mfst. 

GaiiCU. Yd. Mfst 

COMMENTS; 

YesD' NoD 

YesD NoD 

QuantHy 

Total 

Type Size Comments 

........ 

.. · . 

·. 

VES 004595 
•, 

000'1 0002 ' 0003 Ul04 0005 ()()(lA 00117 u• ;()II 1)1)('1.j 0010 ' 0011 0012 0013 0014 0015 . 0016 0018 0019 0020' 0021 0022 0023 0024 D<i2s D02f{ 0027 0028 0029 0030 . 0031 

0032 · 0033 0034 ' 0035 0036 0038 0039 0040,. 0043 . ~ -· 

FOOl F002 F003 F004 F005 F006 F007 F008 F009 ' F011 F012 F019 F03S ., 

¥Ll02. K003 K004 K005 •J\IJOt; K007 KOOII K009 K010 KD\5 . K016 1<017 1<018 1<029 ·K030 ' 

.-

1<031 KD32 KD33 1<034 KD3S K038 1<037 K038 1<039 K040 K041 1<042 K044 KD45 ~ 

KD4T. K0411 K049 KOSO Kll61 K052 K062 l<il6.4 K4l65 KOO& .w69 K071 K073 KD83 1<0&4· 

'KLiaa IWSil K090 K091 K093 K094 K095 K096 .·1<&7 KD98 KIOO K101 K102· K103 K105 

1<111 K112 K113 K1l4 K115 K116 K117 K123 K124 K125 K126 K136 . K156 '1(157 K158 

K159 K161 

P001 P002 P003 1'004 P005 P006 'PilOt P008 ' POOll f'IJIO POll PO!? P013 Pm4 P01S 

1'016 P017 P018 1'020 P021 P022 P023 ;f>024 P026 POZ1 P028 P029 P030 1'031 1'033 

P034 · P038 P037· P038 P039 P040 POo41-:, .- P042 P043 P044 p04s P046 POo47 P048 P0411 

P050 P051 PQ54' P056 P057 P058 Pbs9 P060 ' POB2 1'00~ P064 POO~ P066 P067 POB8 

. . 1?069 'PCI10 ·P071 ' P,072 P073 ·P074 P075 POn P080 P081 POO.l P004 P085 P087 POB8 

P089' 1'092 P093 P094 P005 PO!J6 P097 · .P098 P.099 ·P101 P102 P103· P104 P105 P106 

P108 . P109 PliO P111 P112 P113 P114 P115 P116 . P118 P119 . P120 P121 ' 'ii122 P123 

P127 P128 P185 P188 P189 . P180 P191 P192 P194 · 'P196 P197 P198 P199 P201 P202 

. P203 P204 P205 

0001 U002 rll003 U004 uoos . U008 U007 U008 

. U009 uo1o U011 U012 U014 U015 U016 

U017 U018 U019 U020. UOL:t U022 ·U023 U024 U025 U026 U027 Ul28' -U029- u03o U031 

U0;\2 U033 Ull34 U03S U036 • UD37 U038 t tl039 U041 · U042 U043 U044 uci45 U()o4G:' U047 

U048' U049 U050' 1)051 U062 U053 U055 U056 U057 U058 U059 006o U06! U062 'U063 

IJ064 U066 U067 U068 U069 u070 . UOil ' U072 . • l.)073 U074 U075 . uois uon U078 U079 

U080 U081 . U082 U083' u084 u0a5 U066" U067; U086 U089 U090 U091 U092 'U003 . lJ094 • 

U095 U096 uti97 U098 t.i099 U101 U102 Ul03 t U105 U106' U107 U108 U109 · U110 U111 ' 

U112 U113 U114 . U11S d11il' U117• U1·18 U11s • U12o U121 U122 • U123 U124 u1zs · \:1126 

U131. •'U1'33 11134 ' U127 U128 tJ!:JJ. ' li142 !..1129 U130 U135· ·-U137 U138 ' U140 · U141 U143 

Ul"-4 IJ1CS U1.Jil 0 147. . . ,U148 ' U149 u1so, U152 U153l U154 U155 U156 U157 U158 U159 

Ul60 U161 U162. Ul63 U164. U185 · U166' U1li~ U168 U169 Ul70 U171 U172 U173 UH4 

Ui76 · UH7 U118 1)179 u~80 , U181 ' '•U1S2. \U183 · '· Uf64 ,u;as 1;1186• U187·' U188 Q189. · U1110 

U191 ' U192 U193· ,o194 · ,U196: ·U197 uzoo, ' U2011 .U202 . uzoa· U204 U205 U206 , U207 U208 

U209 ' U210 -U211 U213 U2H' ' U2f5 · U216' • U2t7. ''U2l8' U219 U220 U221 U222 ' tt223 'l/225 

U226 V227 l/228 · U234 - U235 . U236 U237 U233' U239 U240 U243 · U244 U24&· U247 U248 

U249 U271 11278 U279 U280 U326 U353 U359. IJ364 U367 U372 U373 U387· 'l/360 U394 

U39s U404 U409 \:1410 . U411 

•' 

METALS CODES OSHA CARCINOGEN CODES 

Hq - Aa Be Cd c.. Pb 

0004 POlS 0006 0007 0008 0009 IJ093 U1671 U168 1 

P038 K002 P110 P092 

U136 K005 U144 

K006 U145 

KD08 U146 ' 

U032 

Rev: 

VES 004596 
VES 004597.pdf 
Case: l:Q5.cv-{)4425 Document#: 1 Filed: 08102/05 Page 1 of 32 PageiD #:1 

FILED 

AUG- 2 ZOCSCY JNTHEUNJTEDSTATESDISTRICTCOURT 

~ FOR THE NORTHERN DISTRICT OF ILLINOIS 

MICHAEL W. DOlliNS EASTERN DIVISION 

CUJIIC, U.S, DIITRK:T COUIIT 

SlliRRA CLUB, und ) 

) 

AMERICANBOTIOM ) 

CONSERVANCY, ) 

) 

Plaintiffs, ) 

) 

) 

~ ) 

) 

l 

STEPHEN L. JOHNSON, in his official ) 

Clllllloily Qs Administrator, United States ) 

Envlrownental Protccti1>n Agency, ) 

) 

) 

[)Qfoodant. ) 

l 

COMP~FORDECLARATORY 

AND INJUNCTIVE REUEP 

PURSUANTT042 U.S.C. § 7604. 

(Environmental) 

l'lainliffs, Sierra Club and Alnerican Bottom Constli'Vancy, oomplain of Defcndan(, 

Stcpben 1.. Johnson, a:s follows: 

lNTRQDUCIION 

I. Tllis is a civil action for decluralory and injunctive relief; with costs und let~~, 

under the Clean Air Act ("the Act" or"CAA"), 42 U.S.C. §§ 7401, et seq., and the 

Administrative Procodnrc Act, 5 U.S.C. §§ 551, Cl SC{J. 

2. Si=.l Club ami Autmcan Bottom Conservancy (together "Plaintiffs") seek on 

onler requiring the Defemlant, the Administrator of the Environmental Protection A[!p•cy 

VES 004597 
Case: 1:05-cv-04425 Document#: 1 Filed: 08102/05 Page 2 of 32 PageiD #:2 

("Adminis\r4tor''), to perfonn his non-discretionary duty to grant or deny a petition submitt<XI by 

tlw Plaintins to the Administrator pursuant to CAA § 50S(b)(2), 42 U.S.C. §§ 7661d(h)(2). 

3. On February 18, 2004, Siem1 Club ltlld American Bottom Conservancy petitioned 

the Administrator, pursuant to CAA § 505(b){2), 40 CJI.R.§ 70.8(d) and Executiv10 Order 12898, 

to object to a proposed CAA Title V operating penn it for the Onyx F.fwironmenl'al Services' 

waste incinerator in Sauget, nlinois ("the Permit''). 

4. Pursuant to CAA § SOS{b)(2), 42 U.S. C. § 766ld(b)(2), the Administrator was 

required to grant oqleny Sit:ml Club und American Boltom Conservancy's petition within 60 

days. 

5. More titan 60 days have passed since Plaintiffs petiti<med the Administrator. 

6. To date, the Administrator has taken no action on the Plaind ffs' petition. 

PARTIES 

7. Siem Club is an incorporated, not-fur-profit orgllllizatlon located at 200 N. 

Mich t~8lt Avenue, Suite 505, Chicago, Illinois, 60601. Its purpose is to preserve, protect, and 

enhance the nntural cttviroruncnt. The mission of the Sierra Club is to inOucnce public, private, 

and corporate policies through prO!!I'liRlS ut the local, state, national, and international levels. 

Sierra Club has r 700,000 members nati<mwide and 26,000 mernbm in minois. 

8. American Bottom Conservancy is a not-for-profit conservation organization 

working to protect the people and resources of.thc American Bottom floodplain in Southwestern 

Illinois. American Bottom Conservancy is located at614 North 7"' Street, East St. Louis, 

Ulinois, 62201. 

2 

VES 004598 
case: 1:05·cv-04425 Document#: 1 Filed: 08102105 Page 3 of 32 PageiD #:3 

9. l'laintitfs' members live, work, and rccrcaic around the Onyx Envif()nmental 

Services wa.•te incinerator in Sauget, ntinois. Plaintitfs' members breathe, usc and enjoy the 

mbient air around the area of Sauget, Ulinois. Their health and use of the air is in\1)8lrcd by the 

pdl ution in the air cai.LSW hy the Onyx wasto incinerator in Sauget. Onyx's waste ineinctator 

emits criteria and hazardous air pollutants which negatively impact l'laintitfs' mtmlb.:rs. 

Plaintiffs' membern are directly banned by dte AdmlnistriUOr's delay in rc11p00diug to Plaintiffs' 

!)<tition. 

10. Additionally, Plaintiffs and !heir memhenl would funherpar1icipat" in the public 

piOCeSSCS provided for by C'.ongres.' in the Clean Air Act if the Administrator would timely 

respond to l'lainlill$' petitions, including t!te petition At is.<ruc in this case. TilC Admini~ rator's 

fail ure to respond to PlaintiiTh' p~tition negatively affocts PlaintlfiS' procedural rights under the 

CAA. 

ll. ·niC !Xfmdant is the Admlnil!ln.wr ofthe Un~ States Environmeutall'roteetiou 

Ag<ncy ("U.S. EPA j . The Admini~im!or ill ~ponsiblc for directing the activities of lhc U.S. 

EJ> A and implementing the requircmatts of the CAA. Specifically, the Admirristrutor is 

statut<>rily required to respond to pcnlions under CAA § SOS(h )(2), 42 U .S.C. § 7661 d(bX2). 

lQlUSDlCIJON AND YENUE 

12. Thi~ Cuurt has subject maner jurisdicnon over the claims set f(lrth in thi~ 

C>1f11lllaint putSU&ntto 42 U.S.C. § 7604{aX2), 2R U.S.C. § 1331, aod 28 U.S. C.§ 2201. The 

rdiefrcquested by tho Plaintiffs is authc>riY.ed by stutute in 28 U.S.C. §§ 2201 Blld 2202, and 42 

u.s.c. § 7604. 

3 

VES 004599