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74–835—PDF 2011

S. HRG. 112–462 

NOMINATIONS OF DAVID S. COHEN 

AND JENNI RANE LeCOMPTE 

HEARING 

BEFORE THE

COMMITTEE ON FINANCE 

UNITED STATES SENATE 

ONE HUNDRED TWELFTH CONGRESS 

FIRST SESSION 

ON THE

NOMINATIONS OF 

DAVID S. COHEN, TO BE UNDER SECRETARY FOR TERRORISM AND FINANCIAL CRIMES, DEPARTMENT OF THE TREASURY; AND JENNI 

RANE LeCOMPTE, TO BE ASSISTANT SECRETARY FOR PUBLIC AFFAIRS, DEPARTMENT OF THE TREASURY 

APRIL 7, 2011 

( 

Printed for the use of the Committee on Finance 

COMMITTEE ON FINANCE 

MAX BAUCUS, Montana, Chairman 

JOHN D. ROCKEFELLER IV, West Virginia 

KENT CONRAD, North Dakota 

JEFF BINGAMAN, New Mexico 

JOHN F. KERRY, Massachusetts 

RON WYDEN, Oregon 

CHARLES E. SCHUMER, New York 

DEBBIE STABENOW, Michigan 

MARIA CANTWELL, Washington 

BILL NELSON, Florida 

ROBERT MENENDEZ, New Jersey 

THOMAS R. CARPER, Delaware 

BENJAMIN L. CARDIN, Maryland 

ORRIN G. HATCH, Utah 

CHUCK GRASSLEY, Iowa 

OLYMPIA J. SNOWE, Maine 

JON KYL, Arizona 

MIKE CRAPO, Idaho 

PAT ROBERTS, Kansas 

JOHN ENSIGN, Nevada 

MICHAEL B. ENZI, Wyoming 

JOHN CORNYN, Texas 

TOM COBURN, Oklahoma 

JOHN THUNE, South Dakota 

RUSSELL SULLIVAN, Staff Director 

CHRIS CAMPBELL, Republican Staff Director 

(II) 

C O N T E N T S 

OPENING STATEMENTS 

Page 

Baucus, Hon. Max, a U.S. Senator from Montana, chairman, Committee 

on Finance ............................................................................................................ 1 

Hatch, Hon. Orrin G., a U.S. Senator from Utah ................................................. 3 

Cardin, Hon. Benjamin L., a U.S. Senator from Maryland ................................. 4 

Schumer, Hon. Charles E., a U.S. Senator from New York ................................. 8 

ADMINISTRATION NOMINEES 

Cohen, David S., nominated to be Under Secretary for Terrorism and Financial Crimes, Department of the Treasury, Washington, DC ............................ 6 

LeCompte, Jenni Rane, nominated to be Assistant Secretary for Public Affairs, Department of the Treasury, Washington, DC ........................................ 7 

ALPHABETICAL LISTING AND APPENDIX MATERIAL 

Baucus, Hon. Max: 

Opening statement ........................................................................................... 1 

Prepared statement .......................................................................................... 23 

Cardin, Hon. Benjamin L.: 

Opening statement ........................................................................................... 4 

Cohen, David S.: 

Testimony .......................................................................................................... 6 

Prepared statement .......................................................................................... 25 

Biographical information ................................................................................. 27 

Responses to questions from committee members ......................................... 38 

Hatch, Hon. Orrin G.: 

Opening statement ........................................................................................... 3 

Prepared statement .......................................................................................... 76 

LeCompte, Jenni Rane: 

Testimony .......................................................................................................... 7 

Prepared statement .......................................................................................... 78 

Biographical information ................................................................................. 80 

Responses to questions from committee members ......................................... 88 

Rockefeller, Hon. John D., IV: 

Prepared statement .......................................................................................... 91 

Schumer, Hon. Charles E.: 

Opening statement ........................................................................................... 8 

(III) 

(1) 

NOMINATIONS OF DAVID S. COHEN, 

TO BE UNDER SECRETARY FOR 

TERRORISM AND FINANCIAL CRIMES, 

DEPARTMENT OF THE TREASURY; 

AND JENNI RANE LeCOMPTE, TO BE 

ASSISTANT SECRETARY FOR PUBLIC 

AFFAIRS, DEPARTMENT OF THE TREASURY 

THURSDAY, APRIL 7, 2011 

U.S. SENATE, 

COMMITTEE ON FINANCE, 

Washington, DC. 

The hearing was convened, pursuant to notice, at 10:08 a.m., in 

room SD–215, Dirksen Senate Office Building, Hon. Max Baucus 

(chairman of the committee) presiding. 

Present: Senators Wyden, Schumer, Cardin, and Hatch. 

Also present: Democratic Staff: Russ Sullivan, Staff Director; 

John Angell, Senior Advisor; Ayesha Khanna, International Trade 

Counsel; Rory Murphy, Staff Assistant; and Chelsea Thomas, Professional Staff. Republican Staff: Chris Campbell, Staff Director; 

and Nick Wyatt, Tax and Nomination Professional Staff Member. 

OPENING STATEMENT OF HON. MAX BAUCUS, A U.S. SENATOR 

FROM MONTANA, CHAIRMAN, COMMITTEE ON FINANCE 

The CHAIRMAN. The hearing will come to order. 

President Dwight D. Eisenhower once said, ‘‘We seek peace, 

knowing that peace is the climate of freedom.’’ 

Our country is founded on the principles of freedom and liberty. 

In fact, our Constitution makes clear that we strive to secure the 

blessings of liberty to ourselves and our posterity. And throughout 

American history, we have dedicated ourselves to upholding these 

principles. We strive to ensure liberty at home and support freedom abroad. 

As our world changes, we face new challenges in meeting this 

goal. Today, it is not enough to fight the dangers that we see; we 

need to address those that we cannot see as well. 

Mr. Cohen, as Under Secretary of Treasury for Terrorism and Financial Crimes, much of this task falls on your shoulders. 

You must fight terrorism where it often starts, at the beginning 

of the money trail. You must find and eliminate the funding that 

terrorists rely on. You must fight financial crimes and impose economic sanctions. And the Office of Terrorism and Financial IntelVerDate Nov 24 2008 16:03 Jul 13, 2012 Jkt 000000 PO 00000 Frm 00005 Fmt 6633 Sfmt 6633 R:\DOCS\74835.000 TIMD
2 

ligence, or TFI, has a track record of success in carrying out this 

task. 

Your predecessor, Stuart Levey, guided TFI from its creation 7 

years ago to its status today as a powerful tool to fight against terrorism. This office has been active on many fronts, combatting financial support networks to al Qaeda, Iran, North Korea, and the 

Taliban in Afghanistan. 

In fact, I was able to visit the Afghan Threat Finance Cell Team 

in Afghanistan last year and was impressed by their efforts. They 

are working very hard. They showed me all they are doing with 

cells, and it was very, very impressive, their effort, and also their 

effectiveness. They showed me their efforts in cutting off funding 

for the Taliban and al Qaeda in that region. 

And TFI has proven agile in facing new threats as they emerge. 

The office has taken aggressive steps in recent weeks to freeze assets totaling over $30 billion associated with the regime of Muammar al-Qaddafi, further isolating the regime. 

But issues remain with our U.S. antiterrorism funding efforts. To 

ensure the effectiveness of our efforts, we need to maximize our resources without duplicating them. 

We need to coordinate the 19 Federal offices that work on terrorism financing. We need to work seamlessly with the Justice Department, FBI, and other law enforcement agencies that oversee 

this issue. And we need to make sure we have the training and resources to anticipate—not just react to—the next generation of 

issues. 

It is a huge challenge. I remind you of the words of British terrorism expert, Paul Wilkinson, who once said, ‘‘Fighting terrorism 

is like being a goalkeeper. You can make 100 brilliant saves, but 

the only shot that people remember is the one that gets past you.’’ 

Ms. LeCompte, you have been nominated to be the Assistant Secretary of Treasury for Public Affairs. In this capacity, you must ensure that the American people are aware of the enormous tasks 

that the Treasury Department undertakes. 

From printing our money to collecting our taxes to overseeing our 

banking system to stamping out terrorism financing, the Treasury 

Department is responsible for much of what makes this country 

function. 

And I might add, one big challenge we have is educating the 

American people on what the effect would be on failure to increase 

the debt limit. I do not think they know that, and I think that is 

a big challenge that we all face. 

Your role will be to inform the American people of all that you 

do, and do so in an objective and transparent manner. I urge you 

to fulfill this role with clarity of purpose and precision. 

You both bring experience, you bring vigor to your jobs. Should 

you be confirmed, you will be required to maximize both of those 

properties in your new roles. I urge you to do your very best. I 

know you will do that. And I will urge my colleagues to confirm 

you without delay. 

Finally, I would just say thank you very much for accepting 

these challenges. They are not easy. They are huge sacrifices, both 

on your part and your family, and I just thank you very much for 

your service. 

3 

[The prepared statement of Chairman Baucus appears in the appendix.] 

The CHAIRMAN. Senator Hatch? 

OPENING STATEMENT OF HON. ORRIN G. HATCH, 

A U.S. SENATOR FROM UTAH 

Senator HATCH. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I am looking forward 

to hearing from both of our witnesses here today. 

David Cohen appears before us as President Obama’s nominee 

for the position of Under Secretary for Terrorism and Financial 

Crimes. He currently occupies this position in an acting capacity, 

where he has significant responsibility for enforcing our country’s 

national security policies. 

Now, this position is a critical one for maintaining the integrity 

of our Nation’s fiscal system, and the issues that come before him 

are ones that this committee takes with the utmost seriousness. 

Mr. Cohen’s educational background is an impressive one. After 

graduating from Cornell University, he went on to receive his J.D. 

from Yale Law School. He has experience at the Treasury Department working in different roles, and previously developed the Department’s anti-money laundering policies. Given the importance of 

the position for which he has been nominated, I look forward to 

hearing his testimony today and evaluating his responses to inquiries from the committee. 

We will also hear from Jenni LeCompte, nominated to be Assistant Secretary for Public Affairs at the Treasury Department. Ms. 

LeCompte comes to us with legislative branch experience, some of 

which was for a member of this committee. She also has campaign 

experience, also partially for a member of this committee, and previous experience working within the executive branch. 

In her testimony, Ms. LeCompte notes that, if confirmed, she 

would not develop or set policy, but that at Treasury, ‘‘the public 

affairs team is responsible for developing and implementing communications strategy for the Department.’’ 

This is a very important job and will play a significant part in 

how policies are perceived and understood by our citizens, taxpayers, businesses, and foreign nations. 

The Assistant Secretary for Public Affairs has an important decision to make. Is it her role to inform and educate the American 

people, or to promote a political agenda and score political points? 

I think all of us agree that the best way for Americans to understand policy alternatives and make informed choices is for accurate 

and reliable information to be presented to them. 

Now, this is the first nomination hearing held by the Senate Finance Committee in the 112th Congress, and the first nomination 

hearing where I have served as ranking member on this committee. 

This committee has a tradition of thoroughly vetting nominees, and 

I intend to continue that practice. 

I believe that the President, no matter who that person is and 

no matter the political party, has the right to nominate whomever 

he or she wants. He or she is free to nominate individuals who 

share his or her mindset. 

I take very seriously, however, the Senate’s independent constitutional role in this process. The constitutional power of advice 

4 

and consent is a responsibility that I take with the utmost seriousness. It is not effectively exercised with either a rubber stamp or 

with an axe to grind, although I have a tendency to rubber stamp 

both of these nominees this morning. 

What I promise is to make sure that the individuals selected by 

the President to serve our Nation have a level of competence and 

integrity necessary to carry out their duties and great responsibilities. 

As Senators, the only power that we have is derived from the 

Constitution and our constituents, and I promise to exercise this 

authority with a commitment to both. 

I also expect that the President will treat the Senate’s role in 

this process with the respect that it deserves. As a coordinate 

branch of government, the Senate’s constitutional role in the confirmation process is not to be taken lightly, and, of course, I will 

not tolerate its circumvention for political expediency. 

The citizens of Utah, my fellow Utahans, like citizens everywhere, expect that those in government will abide by the same 

rules and laws that they do. The vetting done by this committee 

helps to deliver on this expectation. 

As the Senate committee of jurisdiction over the Internal Revenue Code, we examine the last three individual income tax returns as filed for each nominee; and, though this does not constitute an audit, it does verify a basic level of compliance with rules 

that every single family and individual that pays income taxes 

must comply with. 

Our constituents need assurance that their country is governed 

by fellow citizens who work for the people and that it is not ruled 

by elites who live by their own set of rules. 

I am looking forward to working with the chairman and continuing to exercise our role of advice and consent in a fair and consistent manner, and I welcome both of these nominees today. I look 

forward to their testimony and to the opportunity of asking questions. 

And I have to say that I believe both of you will be confirmed 

and, hopefully, expeditiously. 

Mr. Chairman, I will be cooperative in helping to push these 

nominees through as fast as we can, because I think these are 

very, very important positions. 

The CHAIRMAN. Thank you, Senator. I agree. 

[The prepared statement of Senator Hatch appears in the appendix.] 

The CHAIRMAN. I would now like to introduce our witnesses—our 

first witness is Mr. David Cohen—and Senator Cardin will do so. 

OPENING STATEMENT OF HON. BENJAMIN L. CARDIN, 

A U.S. SENATOR FROM MARYLAND 

Senator CARDIN. Mr. Chairman, thank you for the courtesy of introducing a fellow Marylander, whose family I have known for a 

long period of time. 

I want to welcome both of our witnesses. Ms. LeCompte, I want 

to thank you for your public service and thank your family for the 

sacrifices that they make, and we look forward to your service in 

this very important position. 

5 

Mr. Cohen, let me welcome you to the committee and welcome 

your family, whom I have known for a long period of time. Your 

dad, Jordan, has been a close advisor of mine for many years. He 

was intimately involved in the policy process here for many years 

in a very constructive, bipartisan way, and added greatly, I think, 

to the debate of preserving the best in our health care system. 

So it is nice to have your dad with us, and I welcome Suzy and 

your family. And we are glad that you are willing to continue to 

serve in public life, and we thank you. And we know this is a family sacrifice and the time that you spend. 

It is an incredibly important position that you are seeking Senate 

confirmation for, because we are talking about disrupting and 

hopefully dismantling the networks that finance terrorists, that finance weapons of mass destruction, and that deal with the drug 

trafficking. All those issues that we are trying to disrupt fall under 

the portfolio of the position that you are seeking. 

Mr. Chairman, I would tell you, Mr. Cohen comes well-qualified. 

He has long experience within the Treasury Department. He started there shortly after law school—graduated from Yale Law School; 

undergraduate work at Cornell. He used that experience in government and Treasury and then used it in the private sector in the 

private law firm where he was known for his dealing with these 

types of issues. 

He also dealt with white collar criminal defense. He dealt with 

advising people on anti-money laundering type issues. 

So he brings to this position the experience that I think is vitally 

important. But I can tell you: you look at his resume, you know 

that he has the talent, you know that he has the background. But 

I can tell you, knowing the family, that we are going to be wellserved with Mr. Cohen in this very important position. 

And I thank you for being willing to step forward. I urge the 

committee to promptly consider his confirmation. 

The CHAIRMAN. Thank you, Senator, very much. 

I would now like also to introduce our second witness, Ms. Jenni 

LeCompte. Senator Schumer would like to be here to introduce you, 

and I have a statement here that he would like inserted in the 

record if he does not make it. He praised you very highly. 

I also now have several mandatory questions I would like to ask 

each of you. 

Before I do that, though, this is a big day. Mr. Cohen, do you 

have family or friends here you would like to introduce? 

Mr. COHEN. I do, Mr. Chairman. Thank you very much for the 

opportunity to introduce my family. 

I have with me my father, Dr. Jordan Cohen—— 

The CHAIRMAN. Dr. Cohen. 

Mr. COHEN [continuing]. My wonderful wife, Suzy; and my sons, 

Sam and Zeke. 

The CHAIRMAN. Would you all stand up, please, so we can give 

you a round of applause and recognize you? [Applause.] 

Ms. LeCompte, do you have family or friends here? 

Ms. LECOMPTE. I do, yes. I am joined by my husband, Theodore 

LeCompte. He is here today. 

The CHAIRMAN. Theodore, why don’t you stand so we can recognize you? [Applause.] 

6 

I would now like to ask each of you three standard questions 

which I ask all nominees. 

Is there anything you are aware of in your background that 

might present a conflict of interest with the duties of the office to 

which you have been nominated? 

Mr. Cohen? 

Mr. COHEN. No, Mr. Chairman. 

The CHAIRMAN. Ms. LeCompte? 

Ms. LECOMPTE. No. 

The CHAIRMAN. Do you know of any reason, personal or otherwise, that would in any way prevent you from fully and honorably 

discharging the responsibilities of the office to which you have been 

nominated? 

Mr. Cohen? 

Mr. COHEN. No. 

Ms. LECOMPTE. No, Mr. Chairman. 

The CHAIRMAN. And, finally, do you agree, without reservation, 

to respond to any reasonable summons to appear and testify before 

any duly constituted committee of the Congress, if you are confirmed? 

Mr. COHEN. I do, Mr. Chairman. 

Ms. LECOMPTE. Yes, I do. 

The CHAIRMAN. Thank you. All right. Now, I would like you to 

explain to us why you think you should have these jobs. 

Your full statements will be in the record, and I would just urge 

you to summarize your statements for about 5 minutes. 

STATEMENT OF DAVID S. COHEN, NOMINATED TO BE UNDER 

SECRETARY FOR TERRORISM AND FINANCIAL CRIMES, DEPARTMENT OF THE TREASURY, WASHINGTON, DC 

Mr. COHEN. Thank you, Chairman Baucus, Ranking Member 

Hatch, Senator Cardin. Thank you very much for the opportunity 

to appear before you today. 

It is an honor to be the nominee to serve as Under Secretary for 

Terrorism and Financial Crimes. 

I want to thank President Obama for the confidence he has 

shown in me by nominating me, and Secretary Geithner for recommending me to serve in this position. 

Having served for the past 2 years as the Assistant Secretary for 

Terrorist Financing, I am keenly aware of the very significant responsibilities assigned to the Under Secretary for Terrorism and 

Financial Crimes, as well as the consequential contributions that 

the Under Secretary can make in advancing our Nation’s security. 

Illicit finance, in its many forms, is a threat to the integrity of 

our financial system, both domestically and internationally. Combatting illicit finance not only protects our financial system from 

abuse by money launderers, terrorist financiers, weapons proliferators, and others engaged in financial crime, but it helps to advance our most critical foreign policy and national security objectives. 

The many tools that the Treasury Department can deploy, ranging from anti-money laundering regulatory oversight, to outreach 

to counterparts overseas, to deploying targeted financial measures 

7 

focused on particular individuals and entities, play an integral role 

in responding to the many challenges we face. 

Treasury’s unique capacity to understand financial flows and the 

operation of the financial system, to analyze financial intelligence, 

to map financial and material support networks, and to take targeted, powerful actions is key to meeting these challenges. 

As Assistant Secretary, I had the opportunity to work very closely with the previous Under Secretary, participating in almost all 

aspects of the work of the Office of Terrorism and Financial Intelligence. 

If confirmed, I intend to continue to work intently on the issues 

that I focused on as Assistant Secretary, as I also take on the 

broader range of responsibilities assigned to the Under Secretary. 

In closing, I want to thank the committee for the attention it has 

given to my nomination. If confirmed, I intend to work closely with 

you, Mr. Chairman, and other members of this committee and your 

staff to pursue our shared objective of protecting national security 

and the integrity of the financial system. 

I am deeply committed to maintaining the very productive and 

close relationship that exists between this committee and the office 

that I have been nominated to lead. 

Mr. Chairman, I would be pleased to respond to any questions 

that you or members of the committee may have. 

[The prepared statement of Mr. Cohen appears in the appendix.] 

The CHAIRMAN. I think that is a record, the shortest statement 

I have yet experienced. [Laughter.] 

Mr. COHEN. I am very good at following directions, Mr. Chairman. 

The CHAIRMAN. Ms. LeCompte? 

STATEMENT OF JENNI RANE LeCOMPTE, NOMINATED TO BE 

ASSISTANT SECRETARY FOR PUBLIC AFFAIRS, DEPARTMENT OF THE TREASURY, WASHINGTON, DC 

Ms. LECOMPTE. Thank you. Chairman Baucus, Ranking Member 

Hatch, and members of the Senate Finance Committee. It is a 

privilege to have my nomination come before you today. 

As a former Senate staffer, I have tremendous respect for this institution and for the relationship between the legislative and executive branches. 

I am honored to be President Obama’s nominee for this position 

and deeply grateful to Secretary Geithner for his trust in presenting me, if confirmed, with this opportunity to grow my role 

within the Department. 

I grew up in Wisconsin, the daughter of public school teachers. 

My mother, Kathleen, served nearly 20 years teaching art education before she retired. My father, Arnie, taught mathematics for 

29 years. He passed away in 1998, but I know he would be extremely proud to see me sitting here today. 

I was a college journalism major who came to Washington, DC 

for a summer internship at the White House and found that I 

shared a passion for public service with my parents. After starting 

on overnight clips duty and then serving as a press assistant in the 

White House, I came here to the Senate, landing a position in Senator Schumer’s press office. 

8 

As members of this committee might guess, he certainly kept me 

on my toes, and that has served me well ever since. 

I also had the good fortune of working for Senator Durbin in his 

communications office here in DC. 

Since leaving the Hill, I have held communications positions on 

campaigns for public office at two nominating conventions, most recently serving as deputy CEO for public affairs at the 2008 Democratic national convention in Denver. 

I now find myself back in the executive branch of the Federal 

Government. Without question, the last 2 years at Treasury have 

been the most challenging of my career. I was welcomed on day one 

of this administration by a career staff that never skipped a beat, 

and I am awed on a daily basis by my colleagues at Treasury who 

have carried tremendous responsibility in pulling our country back 

from the worst global economic crisis since the Great Depression. 

The institutional knowledge of the Department and the issues 

that I have come to know during this time, as well as my strong 

skills in strategic planning, operational management, and project 

execution make me well-suited to serve as Assistant Secretary for 

Public Affairs. 

At Treasury, the Public Affairs team is responsible for developing 

and implementing communications strategy for the Department 

and advises officials within the Department and its bureaus on 

how best to communicate with the American people on issues and 

priorities of public interest. 

While Public Affairs does not develop or set policy, it carries a 

frontline responsibility for communication with the media, the business community, and the public at large. 

It is a privilege to be considered for this position and even more 

so at this particular time. Economic news continues to dominate 

home pages and front pages with great frequency. It permeates 

conversation during broadcast roundtables and at kitchen tables 

across the country. 

The Treasury Department and the Treasury Secretary are central to that dialogue, and today there are unprecedented expectations and obligations on the ways in which we communicate and 

the clarity with which we do it. 

I look forward to continuing and expanding my contribution to 

this effort, should the Senate choose to confirm me. 

Thank you, Chairman Baucus and Ranking Member Hatch, for 

this opportunity, and I look forward to taking your questions. 

[The prepared statement of Ms. LeCompte appears in the appendix.] 

The CHAIRMAN. Thank you very much. 

Before we go with questions, Senator, why don’t you more properly introduce Ms. LeCompte? 

OPENING STATEMENT OF HON. CHARLES E. SCHUMER, 

A U.S. SENATOR FROM NEW YORK 

Senator SCHUMER. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. And good morning 

and thank you, Ranking Member Hatch. And I want to thank both 

of you for holding this hearing, for allowing me to take a few moments to introduce a good friend of mine, a former employee, and 

someone of extreme competence—that was a joke. 

9 

The CHAIRMAN. I hope not. [Laughter.] 

Senator SCHUMER. The extreme part, you know. Jenni LeCompte. 

But you are right, Mr. Chairman, she is very, very capable and 

competent. 

Jenni LeCompte, formerly—and I liked her maiden name better—Engebretsen. It took me a little while to say it right. So Jenni 

Engebretsen LeCompte, on the occasion of her nomination to be Assistant Secretary for Public Affairs at Treasury. 

I first met Jenni when her name, as I mentioned, was Jenni 

Engebretsen—all Es, by the way, E-n-g-e-b-r-e-t-s-e-n. And she was 

my first deputy communications director. Since then, she has had 

a remarkable career in public life, spanning more than a decade. 

She was born in Madison, WI to two public school teachers. She 

learned the value of public service early. 

After graduating from Northwestern’s Medill School of Journalism, she moved to DC, where her career took her to two Senate 

offices, both my own and that of my good friend, Senator Durbin. 

Her talent for writing and communicating were a great asset to 

my office. She was on my staff in September of 2001 and served 

the people of New York so well in those horrible days and weeks 

and months after 9/11. 

Jenni also had the honor of serving her President in two different administrations. All of these experiences have led her to 

where she is today, serving as Deputy Assistant Secretary for Public Affairs at Treasury and nominated by President Obama to serve 

as Assistant Secretary of the Department of Treasury. 

Jenni’s experience at Treasury for the past few years no doubt 

more than qualifies her for the position to which she has been nominated. Her expertise in both public affairs and the work of the Department of Treasury are without rival, and I have no doubt she 

will thrive in her new position. 

I am confident that Jenni’s remarkable intelligence, diligence, 

and extraordinary public knowledge make her the ideal candidate 

for Assistant Secretary for Public Affairs. 

I am honored to have worked so closely with her and proud of 

how her career has thrived in the 10 years I have known her. 

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. 

The CHAIRMAN. Very nice. Thank you, Senator, very much. 

I will begin asking you a couple of questions, Mr. Cohen. Can you 

bring us up-to-date on the actions your office has taken with respect to Libya—Libyan financing—financing of Qaddafi’s assets 

and so forth? Just bring us up-to-date. 

Mr. COHEN. Yes, Mr. Chairman. As you know, on February 25, 

the President signed an executive order that froze the assets of 

Colonel Qaddafi, several of his children, as well as all government 

of Libya entities and instrumentalities. 

That has resulted in the freezing of something slightly beyond 

$34 billion under U.S. jurisdiction. We have followed up the initial 

signing of the executive order with a series of additional designations of senior government officials and other family members of 

Colonel Qaddafi, and we have today, I think, nine people who are 

subject to sanctions. 

10 

And we have also identified close to 30 entities that are affiliated 

with the government of Libya, all of whose assets are frozen under 

the executive order. 

As President Obama made clear when he signed the executive 

order and then again a week ago Monday in his speech to the Nation, the assets are frozen for the benefit of the Libyan people. We 

are holding them for the day when Qaddafi is no longer in power 

in Libya, and the assets of the Libyan people can be returned to 

their use. 

The CHAIRMAN. So the assets now are frozen in accounts, bank 

accounts, essentially. Where are these accounts? 

Mr. COHEN. The way that the executive order operates is that 

any U.S. person, which means any bank here in the United States 

or that is organized in the United States operating overseas, if they 

have accounts that are either government of Libya accounts or accounts for any of the individuals who have been designated under 

the executive order, they are required to freeze those accounts. 

And so the $34-plus billion that have been frozen are all under 

U.S. jurisdiction in various accounts of U.S. financial institutions 

here and abroad. 

The CHAIRMAN. What about other assets? What other assets does 

he have within the purview of that executive order? 

Mr. COHEN. It is my understanding, Mr. Chairman, that there 

are a substantial number of assets that have also been frozen in 

Europe. As you know, the U.N. Security Council has adopted two 

resolutions in the last several weeks, which also include asset 

freeze provisions. 

The EU has followed on with its own regulations to freeze assets 

in all of the EU. We have been in contact with many of our allies 

in Europe to try to get a sense of what is frozen under European 

jurisdiction. 

There is a substantial additional amount of money in Europe 

that is frozen as—— 

The CHAIRMAN. Do you know the amount, roughly? 

Mr. COHEN. It is actually quite hard to get a precise figure because of sort of potential double-counting and some lack of clarity 

in the European system. 

I think it is probably not quite as great a number as we have 

frozen in the U.S., but I think it is approaching that. 

The CHAIRMAN. I would guess that he has assets elsewhere, not 

in the U.S. system, not in the European system. Is that a fair assumption? 

Mr. COHEN. I think it is a fair assumption. 

The CHAIRMAN. And do you have any guess how much that is? 

Mr. COHEN. I do not know, Mr. Chairman, but I will point out, 

again, that the Security Council resolution that was adopted about 

2 weeks ago now, Security Council Resolution 1973, requires every 

member state to implement the asset freeze. 

So wherever Colonel Qaddafi has money, and wherever the Central Bank of Libya has money, wherever the Libyan Investment 

Authority has money, the U.N. Security Council directs that that 

money be frozen. 

The CHAIRMAN. He is a pretty crafty guy. I would guess that 

there are other assets elsewhere that are very difficult to find. 

11 

Now, $34 billion, how is that going to be disposed of? 

Mr. COHEN. Well, currently, Mr. Chairman, those assets are frozen. They are immobilized and are being held essentially in trust 

for the Libyan people. 

There have been some discussions, I know, within the administration and with members of Congress about the possibility of 

using some of those assets to defray some of the humanitarian 

needs and costs for the Libyan people. I think those conversations 

are still in progress, but as we sit here today, that money is frozen. 

Colonel Qaddafi and his government cannot get access to it, and 

we are holding it, as I said, for the Libyan people. 

The CHAIRMAN. So who is going to decide how the assets are disposed of? Who in the U.S. will decide what happens to the $34 billion? 

Mr. COHEN. Well, Mr. Chairman, I think it is a question of working with Congress and in the administration to make a sort of initial determination of whether, as we proceed along with these frozen assets, whether we treat them essentially the way we have 

treated all other blocked assets, with very rare exception, which is 

the assets remain blocked, remain frozen until such time as the 

sanctions are lifted; and, at that point, the assets are returned to 

their rightful owner. In this case, they would be returned to the 

Libyan people, presumably after Colonel Qaddafi has left the scene. 

The CHAIRMAN. So the answer to my question is, you anticipate 

that to be a joint determination by both the President and the Congress; that is, the question of who decides. 

Mr. COHEN. I am quite certain, Mr. Chairman, that there will 

be—and I think there already has been—but there will be consultation between the administration and Congress on how best to dispose of these assets. 

The CHAIRMAN. I do not mean to pursue this too far, but who are 

the Libyan people? 

Mr. COHEN. Well, I can tell you who they are not. I think one 

thing that is clear is that we are not going to return these assets 

to Colonel Qaddafi and the people who are currently in power in 

Tripoli. I think it, obviously, remains to be seen exactly how events 

will unfold in Libya, but what the sanctions are designed to do in 

the first instance is to ensure that Colonel Qaddafi and his government do not get access to this money. 

The CHAIRMAN. I am asking a different question. Who are they, 

not who are they not? Clearly, it is not Colonel Qaddafi, because 

they are his assets. But this is going to be quite complicated, it 

seems to me. There may be terrorist elements among the Libyan 

people. 

If it devolves into a civil war—and in the case of settlement— 

who are the Libyan people? Is it both sides, assuming there is a 

truce, or is there just one side? There are a lot of sides, I am guessing. 

Mr. COHEN. Mr. Chairman, I think your question is a very good 

one, and I think that counsels real caution as we proceed here with 

this $34 billion that has been frozen to ensure that, if we make the 

determination jointly with Congress of unfreezing any of these assets and making them available, as I say, to defray humanitarian 

12 

costs or for other related expenses, that we know with a great deal 

of precision exactly what we are doing and who we are doing it for. 

And the situation on the ground in Libya today is, obviously, one 

with a great deal of uncertainty, and I think we all need to proceed 

with due caution. 

The CHAIRMAN. Thank you. 

Senator Hatch? 

Senator HATCH. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. 

In June of 2006, the New York Times published a story which exposed a classified program, the terrorist finance tracking program. 

Now, your predecessor, Stuart Levey, provided the following quote 

relating to the paper’s decision. ‘‘This disclosure compromised one 

of our most valuable programs and will only make our efforts to 

track terrorist financing—and to prevent terrorist attacks—harder. 

Tracking terrorist money trails is difficult enough without having 

our sources and methods reported on the front page of newspapers.’’ 

Do you agree with the New York Times’ decision to publish this 

specific story? 

Mr. COHEN. Senator Hatch, I think the New York Times’ decision 

to publish that story was quite regrettable. I, of course, was not at 

the Treasury Department at the time, but I have spoken with 

Under Secretary Levey about the efforts that were undertaken at 

that time to try to persuade the New York Times not to publish 

that story, both because the program was entirely lawful and because, as Stuart Levey said in that statement, it does make our job 

more difficult having that program revealed. 

The Times went ahead and published the story. I think 6 or 9 

months later, the public editor, I think, published a column in the 

newspaper in which he expressed regret at having the story published, and I think that is the—I associate myself with that—— 

Senator HATCH. What policies and procedures would you pursue, 

if confirmed, which would minimize the instances of illegal disclosure of classified information by government employees? 

Mr. COHEN. Well, Senator, we have a very strong office in the Office of Intelligence, in-house within TFI, that is dedicated to information security. We take it very, very seriously, have procedures, 

as you might imagine, to ensure that classified information is handled appropriately. 

And I will continue to support those efforts, because I think they 

are quite important as part of our efforts to do our job. 

Senator HATCH. Given the strong expectation of integrity in our 

Nation’s security documents, can you explain what efforts you have 

made at Treasury to monitor the international security document 

printing industry, and what outreach has been made to industry 

elements, and what efforts you have made in the prevention of foreign countries’ attempts to create counterfeit Treasury obligations 

and securities? 

Mr. COHEN. We work closely with the Secret Service on those efforts. I personally have been involved with the Secret Service in efforts to address the North Korean counterfeit of the $100 bill, the 

so-called super note, and have also been working with the Bureau 

of Engraving and Printing on some related issues that I think are 

probably not for discussion in this setting. 

13 

But we are very much focused on preventing the counterfeit of 

U.S. currency. 

Senator HATCH. That is good. 

Now, Ms. LeCompte, as I discussed in my opening statement, in 

the course of carrying out your duties, if you are confirmed, you 

will need to balance whether your priority is to provide useful information to the American people or to advance a political agenda. 

Now, what part would politics play in developing a communication strategy in your Office of Public Affairs, and do you think it 

is your job to inform people or to shape what people think? 

Ms. LECOMPTE. Thank you. Certainly an important question, and 

as you might expect, I certainly believe that communication plays 

a critical role in the successful operations of any organization. 

At the Treasury Department, Public Affairs is responsible for developing and implementing a communications strategy that best 

serves the interests of the Department and, also, advising the senior officials on the best means with which to communicate on 

issues and priorities of public interest. 

As you both alluded to in opening statements, there is a tremendous desire and need on the part of the American people to understand the work that we do at the Treasury Department, particularly during these very important times for our country’s economy, 

and much of what we do in the Public Affairs Department is moving facts out on a host of programs and initiatives that we are 

working on. 

In the modern media environment, with so many mediums and 

even more voices out there, we are frequently spending a good bit 

of time, as well, correcting the record on misinformation, misperceptions around our programs, and that too is something that is 

very important. 

As for the Treasury Department, I think the Department has a 

longstanding reputation of work that is very thoughtful and very 

serious analysis grounded in policy, and the Treasury Secretary, 

Secretary Geithner, who is setting the agenda for the Department 

and the work that we do, himself began as a career public servant, 

working himself up through the ranks, and that reputation, that 

tradition is something very much wired in everything that he does 

and the agenda he asks of us for the Department. 

So that is certainly something that I would work to uphold, if 

confirmed, in the work that we would do for public affairs. 

Senator HATCH. Thank you. 

Mr. Chairman, I have to go to Judiciary. Could I ask one other 

question? And then I will leave. 

The CHAIRMAN. Absolutely, sure. 

Senator HATCH. Mr. Cohen, I sent a letter yesterday, on the following issue, to Secretary Geithner. The administration’s proposed 

2012 fiscal year budget appears to call for the cancellation of 142 

current State and local law enforcement access agreements to Bank 

Secrecy Act, or BSA, data. 

Given the wide variety of criminal investigations which utilize direct access to FinCEN, I am concerned that the proposed action 

will adversely affect investigations and hinder the investigators 

whose goal is to follow the money that finances terrorist organizations and crime syndicates. 

14 

Now, let me just ask you three basic questions. Is it your opinion 

that this decision will result in an experience for the law enforcement user that is identical to the current system and that there 

will be no adverse impact on local law enforcement? 

Mr. COHEN. Senator Hatch, I have actually seen the letter that 

you sent yesterday and have been working on this issue for a number of weeks now, and I do share your concern about the impact 

that this may have on local law enforcement’s ability to conduct its 

investigations. 

I think the answer to the question of whether it would be the 

identical user experience for all local law enforcement is that, if 

they do not have direct access to the BSA database, it will not be 

the identical experience; that going through a State coordinator 

would add another step in the process, and I understand the concern with that. 

Senator HATCH. Do you believe that a Federal statute exists 

which requires FinCEN to retain auditors in order for local law enforcement to directly access BSA data? 

Mr. COHEN. I think FinCEN’s obligation to ensure that its data 

is properly used is, if not explicit in the statute, it is certainly implicit in all that FinCEN does and is an important part of what it 

does protecting that. 

Senator HATCH. Is it your opinion that the only way to reduce 

the budget of FinCEN is by incorporating this administration proposal? And just an add-on question: is this really the only way that 

FinCEN can lighten its investigatory—its budgetary belt, I guess 

would be a better way to say it? 

Mr. COHEN. I do not know that it is, and what I have asked the 

director of FinCEN to do is to look at his operation overall, keeping 

the baseline steady, but to look at his overall operation and see 

what can be done to mitigate the effect of some reduction in this 

particular function, because I, like you, Senator Hatch, share the 

view that supporting local law enforcement’s ability to effectively 

conduct investigations is critically important. 

And I know that that is a view shared not just by me, but by 

Secretary Geithner and Director Freis as well. 

Senator HATCH. Mr. Chairman, I have a lot of advance knowledge about Mr. Cohen, and I have to say I just want to congratulate you and thank you for being willing to give time to our country 

in this very, very important position. 

Your predecessor, Stuart Levey, thinks the world of you, and I 

know him very well, and he is a totally honest, really good man. 

And I think the two of you have done really wonderful service for 

our country there. 

And, Ms. LeCompte, I commend you. This is a great opportunity 

for you to not only represent this administration, but also to learn 

an awful lot about what really means so much to this country in 

the order of Treasury affairs and to be able to articulate that in 

the best interest of the public and the people. 

So, Mr. Chairman, I would reiterate my statement. I would like 

these two to go through as quickly as possible. If we can expedite 

the process, I would be happy to cooperate and try to make sure 

that our side is cooperative. 

15 

I think these positions have to be filled, and these are two excellent people, and that is the way I feel. 

The CHAIRMAN. Thank you, Senator. I agree, and, clearly, we will 

do our best. 

Senator HATCH. All right. If you will excuse me, I am going to 

have to get over to the other markup. 

Thank you. 

The CHAIRMAN. Thank you, Senator. 

Mr. Cohen, how are other countries cooperating? The Arab 

League, for example, China, Russia, how well are they cooperating 

in sanctions efforts? 

Mr. COHEN. Well, Senator, I think the level of cooperation differs 

somewhat depending on which sanctions program is being considered. We have had, I think, very good success in bringing along 

Russia, China, the Arab League, the Arab world more generally, in 

our efforts to combat terrorist financing. 

Beginning with U.N. Security Council Resolution 1267 and the 

efforts that we have domestically to designate terrorist financiers, 

we have had quite good success in internationalizing that effort. 

With respect to our program on combatting proliferation of nuclear weapons and weapons of mass destruction more generally, 

with Iran, we have had really remarkable, I think, success in the 

last 6 to 9 months in bringing together a broad coalition of countries to increase the pressure on Iran, and, similarly, pressure on 

North Korea with respect to their illicit activity in their nuclear 

program. 

So I think there are, obviously, variations between countries and 

between programs, but one of the things that we work very hard 

at—and we have had some success, although by no means complete 

success—is to internationalize these efforts. 

It is very important that we do that because the strength of 

these programs is largely dependent on the extent to which we 

have broader buy-in and cooperation. 

The CHAIRMAN. How is the coordination? There are about 20 different offices involved in terrorism financing, about 20. It sounds 

like a lot. And I bet to the American people, that sounds like too 

many. And, as we try to whittle down our national debt, there is 

great pressure, proper pressure, to reduce unnecessary duplication, 

et cetera. 

So part of the question is, how well do they all work together? 

Second, is there overlap and duplication that perhaps we should 

address? 

Mr. COHEN. I think we work well, really quite well with our colleagues in other agencies that are focused on illicit finance and 

threat finance. 

The sort of overall effort in terms of taking action is coordinated 

through the National Security Council. But I think we at the 

Treasury Department are viewed in the interagency effort as sort 

of the first among equals, I would say, in terms of combatting illicit 

finance. 

And I think that was recognized recently by Director Clapper, 

the DNI, who identified the Assistant Secretary for Intelligence at 

Treasury, Leslie Ireland, as the national mission manager for 

threat finance. 

16 

So her job is to coordinate the intelligence community’s efforts to 

combat illicit finance. And so I think the concern that you express 

of having a number of different agencies involved in this effort, this 

new position of national mission manager for threat finance, I 

think, is in part designed to ensure that everybody is working well 

together, that there is not unnecessary duplication, and that the 

mission is achieved in the most efficient fashion. 

The CHAIRMAN. I would just encourage you—I know you want 

to—just do your very, very best and just follow the money and just 

really perform your job as well as you possibly can. 

I am thinking of the special IG that just retired, Neil Barofsky, 

who may not be terribly popular over at Treasury because he did 

such a good job, in my judgment. We created that position in this 

committee. It was my idea. And, second, we pushed him to take the 

job. I think he has been very, very good. 

And I would just urge you—your job is a little different, you are 

not an IG, but nevertheless, your job is to pursue your responsibilities with total integrity and professionalism and get politics out of 

the way. I just urge you to kind of think of Neil Barofsky a couple 

times a week as you are pursuing your job. 

How well is lifting sanctions working to get some people to defect 

from Qaddafi? I notice that you unfroze the assets, I think, of 

Moussa Koussa. 

Mr. COHEN. Right. 

The CHAIRMAN. And has that worked, and are there other examples of unfreezing assets? I guess the deeper question is, to what 

degree is all this working? To what degree—not only the unfreezing, but also the sanctions—to what degree is it degrading 

Qaddafi, and is it working, and how do you know if it is working? 

What is your measure? 

Mr. COHEN. Those are all great questions. On the delisting, the 

unblocking of Moussa Koussa, he was identified for sanctions because he was a senior official in the Libyan government. He was 

the foreign minister. And so he was added to the sanctions several 

weeks ago. 

He has defected, has gone to Britain and renounced his position. 

As a result, he was no longer subject to the sanctions. So we lifted 

the blocking of Moussa Koussa’s assets. 

Whether he defected because of the coercive effect of the sanctions or not I think is an open question. Certainly, in the Libya 

program, as well as in our other sanctions programs, the idea, particularly in these conduct-based programs, is to encourage a change 

in behavior, whether it is the terrorist financing program or the 

weapons proliferation program or the Libya program. 

We are encouraging people to choose a different course, and one 

of the tools is the ability to apply sanctions and to relieve sanctions 

as a reward for the behavior that we are looking to encourage. 

More broadly, on whether the Libyan sanctions are working, they 

are certainly working to the extent that Colonel Qaddafi does not 

have access to the resources that we have frozen. 

One of the theories behind blocking all of those assets, and his 

assets as well, is to try to squeeze him financially. He is in a cashintensive business. He needs to pay his military, he needs to pay 

mercenaries, he needs to pay for loyalty for people around him, 

17 

and, to make those payments, he needs hard currency. Libyan dinars are not that useful when you are trying to buy the loyalties 

of mercenaries or trying to buy weapons on the black market. 

And so the theory behind the sanctions is to try to put the financial squeeze on Qaddafi. 

The CHAIRMAN. He has been around quite a while. What else do 

you think he has stashed away? What is your best guess as to what 

is unfrozen, an amount? 

Mr. COHEN. What he has inside Libya? 

The CHAIRMAN. Or wherever. 

Mr. COHEN. Well, I think we need to think differently about what 

he has outside the country and what he has inside the country. I 

think his resources outside the country are much more difficult for 

him to get access to. 

In terms of what resources he has in the country in terms of 

hard currency, I think the short answer is we do not know exactly, 

but we think there is clearly a limited supply. And at some point, 

that supply of hard currency, if it is not replenished—and the sanctions are designed to ensure that he does not replenish that supply 

of hard currency—it will get depleted as he needs to spend that 

money to, say, pay his mercenaries, buy loyalty for others in the 

regime, and that is part of what the overall strategy with Colonel 

Qaddafi is about. 

The CHAIRMAN. I regret I have a telephone call I have to take. 

Senator Wyden, you are in charge. 

Senator WYDEN [presiding]. Mr. Chairman, thank you very 

much, because I know you have a tight schedule, and I appreciate 

this. 

Mr. Cohen, I spend a considerable amount of time on these 

issues, because I also serve on the Intelligence Committee. And I 

am particularly concerned, and what I would like to start with is 

an area that Mr. Levey and I talked a lot about, and that is Iran. 

I continue to believe that the Iranians are finding ways to get 

around the sanctions, continue to think that this is a problem, that 

we ought to look for ways to up the ante, to put more pressure on 

them through effective use of sanctions to close these loopholes. 

What is the latest update you can give us on the approaches the 

Iranians are using to get around sanctions, and what, if anything, 

would you recommend that the Senate do next to deal with that? 

Mr. COHEN. Well, Senator Wyden, I know that you have been focused on these issues for quite some time, and I appreciate your 

attention to them. 

The current state of affairs with Iran, and in particular the financial sanctions, is that, as we sit here today, the Iranians are 

largely frozen out of Europe, unable to use the euro in large measure with, I think, one very important exception that I want to come 

back to. They are certainly frozen out of the dollar. 

Major financial institutions around the world are largely not 

doing business with Iran, certainly the financial institutions in the 

United States and Europe. And elsewhere around the world, I 

think we are seeing—and we have seen increasing shunning of Iranian financial institutions, which really has had, I think, a quite 

palpable effect on the Iranians’ ability to conduct their proliferation-related activity and conduct transactions more generally. 

18 

It is clear to us, though, as it is to you, that the Iranians are 

looking for new outlets, for new ways to engage in transactions. We 

are very much focused on identifying these new outlets that the 

Iranians are trying to establish and to shut them down. 

Senator WYDEN. Can you say this morning—and if we have to 

have this conversation in the intelligence room at some point, we 

can do it. Can you tell us what the outlets are that they are most 

aggressively trying to tap as the new approach around sanctions? 

Mr. COHEN. Well, the outlet that is currently in existence that 

I think is probably the most important outlet into Europe is the 

bank in Hamburg, Germany, EIH. That remains the principal financial lifeline for the Iranian regime into Europe. 

And, as you know, we designated EIH in early September of last 

year and are working quite aggressively to try to shut down the 

Iranians’ ability to use that financial institution. 

In terms of other new outlets that the Iranians are trying to establish, I do think that that is probably a topic that is better suited 

for a different setting. But what I can tell you here, though, is that 

we have been using CISADA, the Comprehensive Iran Sanctions, 

Accountability, and Divestiture Act, the new Iran sanctions law 

that was enacted on July 1, to go to financial institutions around 

the world where we have some reason to suspect that they are engaged in significant transactions with designated Iranian banks, 

and have made very clear to them the choice that they face, which 

is the choice that is laid out in CISADA, which is, either you can 

have access to the United States’ financial system or you can do 

significant transactions with these designated Iranian banks, but 

you cannot do both. 

We have had interactions in, I think, close to 20 countries and 

more than 40 different financial institutions and have made this as 

clear to them as possible. And I think, generally speaking, we have 

had quite good success in encouraging these financial institutions 

to sever their relationships with the designated Iranian banks. 

Senator WYDEN. Another question with respect to Iran. I know 

my time is almost up on this round. 

U.S. pension funds, and particularly the question of divestment, 

because there has been a great interest in this whole issue and 

pretty spirited debates, as well. Is divestment by U.S. entities having a significant impact? 

Mr. COHEN. Senator, I do not know the answer to that question. 

I would be happy to look into it and get back to you. 

Senator WYDEN. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. 

The CHAIRMAN. Thank you, Senator. 

Mr. Cohen, what about Cuba? We have to lift the travel ban and 

the trade ban with Cuba. For a long time, OFAC, in my judgment, 

has dedicated way too many resources to Cuba—I do not think 

Cuba is a national security threat to the United States—and rather 

has not spent enough time with other countries that are. 

What changes are you making? For example, the cash in advance 

regulations are a huge impediment to U.S. exports to Cuba. They 

have fallen off dramatically with the policy of cash in advance. 

As I recall, maybe you can correct me, this administration has 

not rescinded that or changed that cash in advance requirement. 

19 

I have gone to Cuba a couple of times. It makes no sense for us 

to have these bans, these limitations. Other countries do not. 

Mr. COHEN. Right. 

The CHAIRMAN. It makes no sense. And I understand a little bit 

of the politics in southern Florida. But come on, you have to do 

what is right here and loosen up a little so we can help the American people who need jobs. 

Mr. COHEN. In terms of contact with the Cuban people, as you 

know, we have implemented direction from the President to relax 

both the purposeful travel restrictions, as well as remittance between family members, and that is all designed to increase contact 

between the U.S. citizens and citizens in Cuba to try to fulfill the 

democratic aspirations of the Cuban people. 

With respect to the cash in advance, what OFAC has done is to 

try to implement, as best they can, what they understand to be the 

intent of Congress. And, as you know, the interpretation of the 

term ‘‘cash in advance’’ meaning ‘‘payment must be received before 

the goods leave the U.S. port’’ is the industry standard understanding of that term. 

I know in recent appropriations bills, it has been directed that 

the payment can be made after the goods leave the port and just 

before they are transferred at the Cuban port, and I think we have 

been, as directed by Congress, applying that understanding of the 

term during the time that the appropriations bills were in effect. 

I think, from where we sit, all we are trying to do is implement 

the directive of Congress in the best fashion that we can. 

The CHAIRMAN. Well, I appreciate that. I just urge you to define 

‘‘best fashion’’ in a way that is most helpful to U.S. businessmen 

and women exporting products to Cuba. Of course, you have to live 

within the law, but you also can interpret the law. I am just asking 

you to interpret it in a way that helps us as Americans exporting 

to Cuba. 

Ms. LeCompte, you have been very patient, the patience of Job, 

I might say. You also confirmed one of my theories. One of my 

theories is, you show me an achiever, and I will show you that person had a teacher as a mother or a father or somewhere in the 

family, and I suspect that they have had a huge effect on you and 

they are the reason why you are so actively involved in public service, and I just thank them for that, for being teachers. 

Tell us a little more, again, what you might do to help explain 

to the American people all these issues, in a way that encourages 

people to start to think, ‘‘Gee, we have to figure out how to solve 

them in a nonpolitical way, in a substantive, pragmatic way.’’ 

The debt limit, for example, our large debt, it is, unfortunately 

about 70 percent of GDP, and it is an extremely serious problem 

our country is facing. 

If you could just give us some of your thoughts on how your department might help the American people understand the gravity 

of the situation and the need for Americans to work better together 

to solve it. 

Ms. LECOMPTE. Sure, absolutely. I think, first and foremost, 

making sure that we do have full, robust, accurate, free-flowing information about all of the programs that the Treasury is engaged 

in, and it does span, as you noted, quite a broad spectrum. 

20 

In these particular times, as I mentioned in my opening statement, we see economic headlines dominating newspapers, broadcast coverage, such a wide variety of online mediums, so many 

channels that we can really utilizes to get information, facts and 

good information to the American people about the work that we 

are engaged in. 

Secretary Geithner is certainly a strong messenger for us to deliver that, to convey that message, and really utilizing the full force 

of senior officials that we have across the Department to make sure 

that, both from Washington and out across the country, we are taking the time to explain what it is that we are doing and why those 

policy choices were the right ones to make and will benefit the 

American people in so many ways. 

The CHAIRMAN. You mentioned you had spent some of your time 

correcting mistakes, with the advance of blogs and, I guess, Facebook and Twitter and all the new communications technologies. 

Is that a growing trend? Do you find that you have to spend 

more time correcting mistakes than perhaps was the case a couple 

of years ago? 

Ms. LECOMPTE. Well, I think in the modern world, with so many 

mediums, so many voices out there, and the 24-hour news cycle, it 

does really require someone dedicated full-time to thinking through 

how we are getting information across all of those channels, and 

I think there is just a much more populated landscape in terms of 

entities that are covering government. 

The CHAIRMAN. Do you have to spend more time making corrections? 

Ms. LECOMPTE. I think there are more outlets, and that does require both more proactive work to get the message out and to make 

sure that we are working to make sure that the facts out there are 

correct. 

So certainly, with more channels, the burden and responsibility 

on our team are greater. 

The CHAIRMAN. I understand there are developing sites, websites 

you can go to, probably have to pay them something, to correct information on other sites, whether it is Google or Wikipedia or 

whatever it might be, some sort of preventive action. 

I am not surprised that these have developed because of all the 

information out there on the internet, much of it misinformation. 

It is a challenge, but I urge you to do your very best—clearly, 

you will anyway—to make sure that misinformation is corrected. I 

think that is very important. But good luck. 

Senator Wyden? 

Senator WYDEN. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Just one other area 

I was interested in asking about. 

Mr. Cohen, as you are looking at ways to cut off the Taliban, al 

Qaeda, and the militants, you are, obviously, going to be looking a 

lot at the wealthy donors in the Persian Gulf. And, as you know, 

we spent a lot of time with Stu Levey on the Saudi side of this, 

but there are other wealthy countries in the region, and some of 

them have been a clear source of terrorism funding as well. 

So I wanted to ask you in particular about Kuwait. How would 

you characterize the cooperation of the Kuwaiti government with 

regard to cutting off terrorism funding? 

21 

Mr. COHEN. I think we have a real challenge with the Kuwaiti 

government. Kuwait is the only country in the Gulf Cooperation 

Council that does not criminalize terrorist financing. 

We have been urging the Kuwaitis for a number of years now to 

pass legislation that would criminalize terrorist financing, and that 

has not yet occurred, and I do not think there is any prospect in 

the near future that that is going to occur. 

I think that creates or, in fact, reflects a problem in Kuwait, 

where the government there is not as focused on preventing terrorist financing from occurring in that country and, frankly, not as 

focused on restricting terrorist activity generally that is focused 

outside of Kuwait as they are on terrorist activity that may occur 

within Kuwait. 

It is a problem. It is something that we have been closely engaged with the Kuwaitis on. And, as we have had greater success 

in other countries in the Gulf—Saudi Arabia, for one; we have good 

cooperation in the UAE—I think we have seen more of this activity 

sort of move toward more permissive environments, and that is a 

problem in Kuwait. 

Senator WYDEN. When your office identifies the particularly suspicious financiers in Kuwait, the people whom we think are these 

wealthy private donors who are back-dooring money to the terrorists, when you bring that to the attention of the Kuwaiti government, does the Kuwaiti government take action against them? 

Mr. COHEN. I think the record is quite mixed. To some extent, 

they do. To some extent, they do not. And that, as I say, is a real 

challenge for us and something that—— 

Senator WYDEN. Is it getting better? Because my understanding—and we can talk about this some more in the Intelligence 

Committee behind closed doors—is that this is still a particularly 

frustrating, unacceptable situation in Kuwait, that they are simply 

not stepping up, even when we are bringing them these cases 

where there is a strong pattern of evidence suggesting they are a 

route to terrorism finance. 

And I gather you would say, at least for purposes of an open session, that this remains a significant problem. 

Mr. COHEN. I think you characterized it accurately. 

Senator WYDEN. Mr. Chairman, I would like to follow up with 

you on this, as well. I think part of this is what you talk about in 

open session and part of it is just the fact that you are using these 

kinds of sessions to spotlight some of these practices. So I would 

really like to work with you on it. 

The CHAIRMAN. Yes. Thanks, Senator. You mentioned Kuwait is 

the only country that does not criminalize terrorism financing. 

Having said that, are there other countries that are problems 

like Kuwait, along the lines that you and Senator Wyden have just 

described? 

Mr. COHEN. Kuwait is the only country in the Gulf Cooperation 

Council, so in the Gulf, that has not criminalized terrorist financing. I think there are others around the world that have not done 

so. 

As I had mentioned earlier, I think there is a range of effort, a 

range of political will, and a range of capacity across the world in 

terms of countries addressing terrorist financing. 

22 

In the Gulf region, in particular, as Senator Wyden noted, I 

think we have had some good success in recent years in working 

with the Saudis. I think we have had less success and a less productive relationship with Kuwait and with Qatar, which is also a 

country of some concern with respect to terrorist financing. 

There are other countries where I think we have very good cooperation. And, if you look across Europe, I think we have a very 

good relationship with the British, for instance. If you look elsewhere within South Asia, the relationship with the Pakistanis is 

one where we are working with them very, very closely on a range 

of counterterrorism issues, including terrorist financing. 

And there is a lot of work to be done. This is not an endeavor 

where I think any of us expect to be able to declare victory and go 

home. This is a long process, but I think we are making progress, 

and we will continue to work on this extremely hard. 

The CHAIRMAN. To what degree is the tension between the Pakistani government, ISI, the Afghan government, the Saudis, and 

other countries operating in the region, a hindrance to your efforts? 

Mr. COHEN. We get both cooperation and frustrations, as Senator 

Wyden said, in a number of countries, and Pakistan, Saudi Arabia, 

all of those countries, Afghanistan, I think their record is mixed in 

all of them. 

And we have in Pakistan, for instance, we have a Treasury 

attache ́ who works with the Pakistani government to try to, on a 

day-to-day basis, move the needle as much as we can every day. 

In Afghanistan, I could not help but smile when you mentioned 

the Afghan Threat Finance Cell, because I have been there also, 

and have seen the work that they are doing, which is—— 

The CHAIRMAN. They are still there, Kirk Meyer and his colleague? 

Mr. COHEN. Kirk is still there and Frank Calestino, who is a 

Treasury employee, and the deputy lead of that operation is still 

there. 

These are incredibly dedicated public servants. Frank had done 

that same job in Iraq and signed up to do it in Afghanistan, and 

they do tremendous work in mapping the financial support networks of the Taliban and help us enormously in being able to take 

action to try to disrupt the financing for the Taliban. 

The CHAIRMAN. I do not have any more questions. All I am saying is, go for it, and, if you need help, let us know, because this 

is a team effort. Whether it is resources or legislation, whatever it 

is, telephone calls, whatever, we want to help. 

Mr. COHEN. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. 

The CHAIRMAN. Thank you for your efforts, both of you, very 

much. 

Thank you. The hearing is adjourned. 

[Whereupon, at 11:22 a.m., the hearing was concluded.] 

(23) 

A P P E N D I X 

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