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THE IRS: TARGETING AMERICANS FOR THEIR 

POLITICAL BELIEFS 

HEARING 

BEFORE THE

COMMITTEE ON OVERSIGHT 

AND GOVERNMENT REFORM 

HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES 

ONE HUNDRED THIRTEENTH CONGRESS 

SECOND SESSION 

MARCH 5, 2014 

Serial No. 113–99 

Printed for the use of the Committee on Oversight and Government Reform 

( 

Available via the World Wide Web: http://www.fdsys.gov 

http://www.house.gov/reform 

(II) 

COMMITTEE ON OVERSIGHT AND GOVERNMENT REFORM 

DARRELL E. ISSA, California, Chairman 

JOHN L. MICA, Florida 

MICHAEL R. TURNER, Ohio 

JOHN J. DUNCAN, JR., Tennessee 

PATRICK T. MCHENRY, North Carolina 

JIM JORDAN, Ohio 

JASON CHAFFETZ, Utah 

TIM WALBERG, Michigan 

JAMES LANKFORD, Oklahoma 

JUSTIN AMASH, Michigan 

PAUL A. GOSAR, Arizona 

PATRICK MEEHAN, Pennsylvania 

SCOTT DESJARLAIS, Tennessee 

TREY GOWDY, South Carolina 

BLAKE FARENTHOLD, Texas 

DOC HASTINGS, Washington 

CYNTHIA M. LUMMIS, Wyoming 

ROB WOODALL, Georgia 

THOMAS MASSIE, Kentucky 

DOUG COLLINS, Georgia 

MARK MEADOWS, North Carolina 

KERRY L. BENTIVOLIO, Michigan 

RON DESANTIS, Florida 

ELIJAH E. CUMMINGS, Maryland, Ranking 

Minority Member 

CAROLYN B. MALONEY, New York 

ELEANOR HOLMES NORTON, District of 

Columbia 

JOHN F. TIERNEY, Massachusetts 

WM. LACY CLAY, Missouri 

STEPHEN F. LYNCH, Massachusetts 

JIM COOPER, Tennessee 

GERALD E. CONNOLLY, Virginia 

JACKIE SPEIER, California 

MATTHEW A. CARTWRIGHT, Pennsylvania 

TAMMY DUCKWORTH, Illinois 

ROBIN L. KELLY, Illinois 

DANNY K. DAVIS, Illinois 

PETER WELCH, Vermont 

TONY CARDENAS, California 

STEVEN A. HORSFORD, Nevada 

MICHELLE LUJAN GRISHAM, New Mexico 

Vacancy 

LAWRENCE J. BRADY, Staff Director 

JOHN D. CUADERES, Deputy Staff Director 

STEPHEN CASTOR, General Counsel 

LINDA A. GOOD, Chief Clerk 

DAVID RAPALLO, Minority Staff Director 

(1) 

THE IRS: TARGETING AMERICANS FOR THEIR 

POLITICAL BELIEFS 

Wednesday, March 5, 2014 

HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES, 

COMMITTEE ON OVERSIGHT AND GOVERNMENT REFORM, 

WASHINGTON, D.C. 

The committee met, pursuant to call, at 9:33 a.m., in Room 2154, 

Rayburn House Office Building, Hon. Darrell E. Issa [chairman of 

the committee] presiding. 

Present: Representatives Issa, Mica, Turner, Duncan, McHenry, 

Jordan, Walberg, Amash, Meehan, DesJarlais, Gowdy, Farenthold, 

Hastings, Lummis, Massie, Meadows, Bentivolio, DeSantis, 

Cummings, Maloney, Norton, Tierney, Lynch, Connolly, Cartwright, Duckworth, Horsford, and Lujan Grisham. 

Staff Present: Molly Boyl, Deputy General Counsel and Parliamentarian; Lawrence J. Brady, Staff Director; David Brewer, Senior Counsel; Sharon Casey, Senior Assistant Clerk; Steve Castor, 

General Counsel; Drew Colliatie, Professional Staff Member; John 

Cuaderes, Deputy Staff Director; Adam P. Fromm, Director of 

Member Services and Committee Operations; Linda Good, Chief 

Clerk; Tyler Grimm, Senior Professional Staff Member; Frederick 

Hill, Deputy Staff Director for Communications and Strategy; 

Christopher Hixon, Chief Counsel for Oversight; Mark D. Marin, 

Deputy Staff Director for Oversight; Ashok M. Pinto, Chief Counsel, Investigations; Katy Rother, Counsel; Laura L. Rush, Deputy 

Chief Clerk; Jessica Seale, Digital Director; Jonathan J. Skladany, 

Deputy General Counsel; Rebecca Watkins, Communications Director; Meghan Berroya, Minority Counsel; Aryele Bradford, Minority 

Press Secretary; Susanne Sachsman Grooms, Minority Deputy 

Staff Director/Chief Counsel; Jennifer Hoffman, Minority Communications Director; Adam Koshkin, Minority Research Assistant; 

Elisa LaNier, Minority Director of Operations; Juan McCullum, Minority Clerk; Suzanne Owen, Minority Senior Policy Advisor; Brian 

Quinn, Minority Counsel; Dave Rapallo, Minority Staff Director; 

Donald Sherman, Minority Counsel; and Mark Stephenson, Minority Director of Legislation. 

Chairman ISSA. The committee will come to order. 

We are here today to continue a hearing that began on May 

22nd, 2013, called ‘‘The IRS Targeting Americans for Their Political Beliefs.’’ The purpose of the hearing is to gather facts about 

how and why the IRS improperly scrutinized certain organizations 

that applied for tax-exempt status. 

Today, we have recalled Ms. Lois Lerner, the former director of 

Exempt Organizations at the IRS. Ms. Lerner appeared for the 

2 

May 22nd, 2013, hearing under a subpoena, and that subpoena remains in effect. 

Before we resume our questioning, I am going to briefly state for 

the record a few developments that have occurred since the hearing 

began 9 months ago. These are important for the record and for 

Ms. Lerner to know and understand. 

On May 22nd, 2013, after being sworn in at the start of the hearing, Ms. Lerner made a voluntary statement under oath discussing 

her position at the IRS and professing her innocence. 

Ms. Lerner did not provide the committee with any advance notification of her intention to make such a statement. 

During her self-selected and entirely voluntary statement, Ms. 

Lerner spoke in detail about core issues under consideration at the 

hearing when she stated, ‘‘I have not done anything wrong. I have 

not broken any laws. I have not violated any IRS rules or regulations, and I have not provided false information to this or any other 

congressional committee.’’ 

Ms. Lerner then stated her intention to invoke the Fifth Amendment, and then, in response to a request by Ranking Member 

Cummings, she confirmed orally the authenticity of a document 

that was entered into the record. She subsequently re-invoked her 

Fifth Amendment rights in response to several questions. She then 

refused to provide any substantive response to those questions. 

At that hearing, a member of the committee, Mr. Gowdy, stated 

that Ms. Lerner had waived her right to invoke the Fifth Amendment because she had given a voluntary statement professing her 

innocence. 

I temporarily excused Ms. Lerner from the hearing and subsequently recessed the hearing to consider whether Ms. Lerner had 

in fact waived her Fifth Amendment rights. 

Meanwhile, the committee’s investigation proceeded without Ms. 

Lerner’s testimony. To date, we have conducted 33 bipartisan transcribed interviews of witnesses from the IRS. We have heard witnesses’ testimony during five committee and subcommittee hearings. 

Because the IRS has not fully cooperated with the committee’s 

investigation, I have issued three subpoenas for documents. The 

IRS continues to withhold some of Ms. Lerner’s emails from the 

committee. Documents and testimony show that Ms. Lerner is 

uniquely positioned to provide testimony that will help the committee better understand how and why the IRS targeted conservative groups. 

At a business meeting on June 28, 2013, the committee approved 

a resolution rejecting Ms. Lerner’s claim of Fifth Amendment privilege based on her waiver at the May 22nd, 2013. 

After that vote, having made the determination that Ms. Lerner 

waived her Fifth Amendment rights, the committee recalled her to 

appear today to answer questions pursuant to rules. The committee 

voted and found that Ms. Lerner waived her Fifth Amendment 

rights by making a statement on May 22nd, 2013, and additionally, 

by affirming documents after making a statement of Fifth Amendment rights. 

3 

If Ms. Lerner continues to refuse to answer questions from our 

members while she is under a subpoena, the committee may proceed to consider whether she should be held in contempt. 

Since it has been 9 and a half months since we started the hearing, I am going to ask Ms. Lerner to please rise and take a reaffirming oath pursuant to the committee rules. 

Raise your right hand, please. 

Do you solemnly swear that the testimony you are about to give 

will be the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth? 

Please be seated. Let the record indicate that the witness did answer in the affirmative. 

Ms. Lerner—put up slide 1, please. 

On October 10—on October—in October 2010, you told a Duke 

University group, and I quote, ‘‘The Supreme Court dealt a huge 

blow overturning a 100-year-old precedent that basically corporations couldn’t give directly to political campaigns. And everyone is 

up in arms because they don’t like it. The Federal Election Commission can’t do anything about it. They want the IRS to fix the 

problem.’’ 

Ms. Lerner, what exactly ‘‘wanted to fix the problem caused by 

Citizens United,’’ what exactly does that mean? 

Ms. LERNER. My counsel has advised me that I have not—— 

Chairman ISSA. Would you please turn the mic on? 

Ms. LERNER. Sorry. I don’t know how. 

My counsel has advised me that I have not waived my constitutional rights under the Fifth Amendment, and on his advice, I will 

decline to answer any question on the subject matter of this hearing. 

Chairman ISSA. So, you are not going to tell us who wanted to 

fix the problem caused by Citizens United? 

Ms. LERNER. On the advice of my counsel, I respectfully exercise 

my Fifth Amendment right and decline to answer that question. 

Chairman ISSA. Ms. Lerner, in February 2011, you emailed your 

colleagues in the IRS the following: ‘‘Tea Party matter, very dangerous. This could be the vehicle to go to court on the issue of 

whether Citizens United overturning the ban on corporate spending applies to tax-exempt rules. Counsel and Judy Kindell need to 

be on this one, please. Cincy should probably NOT,’’ all in caps, 

‘‘have these cases.’’ 

What did you mean by ‘‘Cincy should not have these cases’’? 

Ms. LERNER. On the advice of my counsel, I respectfully exercise 

my Fifth Amendment right and decline to answer the question. 

Chairman ISSA. Ms. Lerner, why would you say Tea Party cases 

were very dangerous? 

Ms. LERNER. On the advice of my counsel, I respectfully exercise 

my Fifth Amendment right and decline to answer that question. 

Chairman ISSA. Ms. Lerner, in September 2010, you emailed 

your subordinates about initiating a, parenthesis, (c)(4) project and 

wrote, ‘‘We need to be cautious so that it isn’t a per se political 

project.’’ 

Why were you worried about this being perceived as a political 

project? 

Ms. LERNER. On the advice of my counsel, I respectfully exercise 

my Fifth Amendment right and decline to answer that question. 

4 

Chairman ISSA. Ms. Lerner, Mike Seto, manager of EO Technical 

in Washington, testified that you ordered Tea Party cases to undergo a multi-tier review. He testified, and I quote, ‘‘She sent me 

email saying that when these cases need to go through’’—I say 

again—‘‘she sent me email saying that when these cases need to 

go through multi-tier review and they will eventually have to go to 

Ms. Kindell and the Chief Counsel’s Office.’’ 

Why did you order Tea Party cases to undergo a multi-tier review? 

Ms. LERNER. On the advice of my counsel, I respectfully exercise 

my Fifth Amendment right and decline to answer that question. 

Chairman ISSA. Ms. Lerner, in June 2011, you requested that 

Holly Paz obtain a copy of the tax-exempt application filed by 

Crossroads GPS so that your senior technical advisor, Judy 

Kindell, could review it and summarize the issues for you. 

Ms. Lerner, why did you want to personally order that they pull 

Crossroads GPS, Karl Rove’s organization’s application? 

Ms. LERNER. On the advice of my counsel, I respectfully exercise 

my Fifth Amendment right and decline to answer that question. 

Chairman ISSA. Ms. Lerner, in June 2012, you were part of an 

email exchange that appeared to be about writing new regulations 

on political speech for 501(c)(4) groups, and in parenthesis, your 

quote, ‘‘off plan’’ in 2013. 

Ms. Lerner, what does ‘‘off plan’’ mean? 

Ms. LERNER. On the advice of my counsel, I respectfully exercise 

my Fifth Amendment right and decline to answer that question. 

Chairman ISSA. Ms. Lerner, in February of 2014, President 

Obama stated that there was not a smidgeon of corruption in the 

IRS targeting. 

Ms. Lerner, do you believe that there is not a smidgeon of corruption in the IRS targeting of conservatives? 

Ms. LERNER. On the advice of my counsel, I respectfully exercise 

my Fifth Amendment right and decline to answer that question. 

Chairman ISSA. Ms. Lerner, on Saturday, our committee’s general counsel sent an email to your attorney saying, ‘‘I understand 

that Ms. Lerner is willing to testify and she is requesting a 1 week 

delay. In talking’’—‘‘in talking to the chairman’’—excuse me—‘‘in 

talking to the chairman, wanted to make sure that was right.’’ 

Your lawyer, in response to that question, gave a one word email 

response, ‘‘yes.’’ 

Are you still seeking a 1 week delay in order to testify? 

Ms. LERNER. On the advice of my counsel, I respectfully exercise 

my Fifth Amendment right and decline to answer that question. 

Chairman ISSA. Ladies and gentlemen, seeking the truth is the 

obligation of this committee. I can see no point in going further. I 

have no expectation that Ms. Lerner will cooperate with this committee, and therefore, we stand adjourned. 

[Whereupon, at 9:45 a.m., the committee was adjourned.] 

Æ