U.S. GOVERNMENT PUBLISHING OFFICE

33–867 WASHINGTON : 2019

JOBS AND OPPORTUNITY: EMPLOYER 

PERSPECTIVES ON THE JOBS GAP 

HEARING 

BEFORE THE

SUBCOMMITTEE ON HUMAN RESOURCES 

OF THE

COMMITTEE ON WAYS AND MEANS 

U.S. HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES 

ONE HUNDRED FIFTEENTH CONGRESS 

FIRST SESSION 

APRIL 25, 2018 

Serial No. 115–HR06 

Printed for the use of the Committee on Ways and Means 

( 


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COMMITTEE ON WAYS AND MEANS 

KEVIN BRADY, Texas, Chairman 

SAM JOHNSON, Texas 

DEVIN NUNES, California 

DAVID G. REICHERT, Washington 

PETER J. ROSKAM, Illinois 

VERN BUCHANAN, Florida 

ADRIAN SMITH, Nebraska 

LYNN JENKINS, Kansas 

ERIK PAULSEN, Minnesota 

KENNY MARCHANT, Texas 

DIANE BLACK, Tennessee 

TOM REED, New York 

MIKE KELLY, Pennsylvania 

JIM RENACCI, Ohio 

PAT MEEHAN, Pennsylvania 

KRISTI NOEM, South Dakota 

GEORGE HOLDING, North Carolina 

JASON SMITH, Missouri 

TOM RICE, South Carolina 

DAVID SCHWEIKERT, Arizona 

JACKIE WALORSKI, Indiana 

CARLOS CURBELO, Florida 

MIKE BISHOP, Michigan 

DARIN LAHOOD, Illinois 

RICHARD E. NEAL, Massachusetts 

SANDER M. LEVIN, Michigan 

JOHN LEWIS, Georgia 

LLOYD DOGGETT, Texas 

MIKE THOMPSON, California 

JOHN B. LARSON, Connecticut 

EARL BLUMENAUER, Oregon 

RON KIND, Wisconsin 

BILL PASCRELL, JR., New Jersey 

JOSEPH CROWLEY, New York 

DANNY DAVIS, Illinois 

LINDA SA ́ NCHEZ, California 

BRIAN HIGGINS, New York 

TERRI SEWELL, Alabama 

SUZAN DELBENE, Washington 

JUDY CHU, California 

DAVID STEWART, Staff Director 

BRANDON CASEY, Minority Chief Counsel 

SUBCOMMITTEE ON HUMAN RESOURCES 

ADRIAN SMITH, Nebraska, Chairman 

JACKIE WALORSKI, Indiana 

CARLOS CURBELO, Florida 

MIKE BISHOP, Michigan 

DAVID SCHWEIKERT, Arizona 

DARIN LAHOOD, Illinois 

DAVID G. REICHERT, Washington 

DANNY DAVIS, Illinois 

LLOYD DOGGETT, Texas 

TERRI SEWELL, Alabama 

JUDY CHU, California 


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C O N T E N T S 

Page 

Advisory of April 25, 2018 ....................................................................................... 2 

WITNESSES 

David Ard, Senior Vice President and Global Head of People and Communications, Gap, Inc. ..................................................................................................... 6 

Julie Shapiro, Executive Director, The Door ......................................................... 12 

Steve Staub, President and Owner, Staub Manufacturing Solutions ................. 18 

Dr. Dan Lustig, Psy.D. CAADC MISA II, President and CEO, Haymarket 

Center .................................................................................................................... 27 

Glenn Johnson, Manufacturing Workforce Development Leader, BASF Corporation ................................................................................................................. 33 

Barb Pilarski, Head of Human Resources, FCA U.S. LLC .................................. 40 


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JOBS AND OPPORTUNITY: EMPLOYER 

PERSPECTIVES ON THE JOBS GAP 

WEDNESDAY, APRIL 25, 2018 

U.S. HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES, 

COMMITTEE ON WAYS AND MEANS, 

SUBCOMMITTEE ON HUMAN RESOURCES, 

Washington, DC. 

The Subcommittee met, pursuant to call, at 11:30 a.m., in Room 

1100, Longworth House Office Building, the Honorable Adrian 

Smith [Chairman of the Subcommittee] presiding. 

[The advisory announcing the hearing follows:] 


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Chairman SMITH. The Subcommittee will come to order. Good 

morning and welcome to the third hearing in our series focusing on 

jobs and opportunity. The purpose of these hearings is to demonstrate how, as our economy continues to strengthen, following 

the enactment of the Tax Cuts and Jobs Act, employers’ demand 

for workers is growing and our human services programs can plan 

an important role in supporting the next wave of workers needed 

to continue this economic growth. 

Millions of Americans are on the sidelines of our economy, and 

it is vital we understand how taxpayer resources, particularly those 

under this Committee’s jurisdiction, are being leveraged, or not, to 

address the needs of those struggling to get ahead. With the Temporary Assistance to Needy Families program set to expire in September, this Committee must not stand down from its responsibility to reauthorize this program and provide certainty to families, 

States, and taxpayers. 

Last week, we were honored to welcome Department of Labor’s 

Secretary Alexander Acosta to share the Federal Government’s perspective. Secretary Acosta told the Committee in his opening remarks how the Department of Labor has been working to keep our 

economy moving forward because, as it fires on all cylinders, with 

the help of the Tax Cuts and Jobs Act. 

He said, quote: ‘‘At the Department of Labor, we are creating opportunity for all Americans by expanding apprenticeships across all 


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industries by streamlining traditional workforce education and providing State leaders the flexibilities they need to meet the needs 

of job creators and their local workforces,’’ end quote. 

Secretary Acosta also emphasized the demand from Governors 

for more flexibility to focus funds on where they can best serve the 

needs of the communities. He rightly pointed out that Nebraska is 

different from California, which is very different from Florida and 

went on to add, it is not just cooperation between the agencies but 

also flexibility to allow the Governors to focus workforce education 

funds where they best serve the needs of their States. 

Two weeks ago, before this Subcommittee, we heard about local 

perspectives from Members’ districts about the challenges they are 

facing in an economic environment with low unemployment and 

more than 6 million job openings. Three witnesses, including a program participant, testified about a program, the Arizona Homebuilders Association, started to help companies be able to continue 

to grow as they face a labor shortage. The association partnered 

with Arizona correctional facilities to provide training in construction trades to inmates nearing their release date. These are winwin programs. 

Companies gain access to a strong labor pool of hardworking individuals, and incarcerated men and women are given the purpose 

and stability of good jobs, reducing recidivism. Public policy should 

have the same goals. But the programs heard about 2 weeks ago 

were created and operated entirely without the use of Federal, 

State, or local funds or programs. 

At the same time, there are more than 40 federal job training 

programs. States are spending a combined $30 billion a year 

through TANF, and less than half of those dollars are being spent 

on core work activities and supportive services that could help close 

the jobs gap. 

Today, we continue our exploration of the jobs gap, the difference 

between the employers’ demands for workers, shown as job openings, and the declining number of individuals in the workforce, as 

shown on the screen as the labor force participation rate. Our 

panel features several larger national employers across industries, 

including automotive, manufacturing, chemical, and retail. 

They will each highlight challenges they face in growing their 

businesses due to a lack of workers. What they are doing to address the jobs gap and what they believe is the best way to promote 

Americans to get back into the workforce. Today’s employers may 

have similar stories as those from our first hearing, but we will be 

focusing on their business case for investing in workers on the sidelines to get them job-ready. 

We will also learn more about why this moment is different from 

those in the past and the urgency which is needed to address the 

jobs gap. Today I am excited to learn from the witnesses about 

their experiences and what has led to their success so we can 

translate these lessons into better public policy for across-the-board 

victories for American workers, American families, American businesses, and the American economy. 

Without objection, I will now recognize Mr. Davis, our Ranking 

Member, for his opening statement. 


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Mr. DAVIS. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. And I thank you for holding this hearing. I have appreciated your willingness to hear from 

a range of voices, including returning citizens who are often left behind by the economy and left out of our policy changes. I also hope 

we will have the opportunity to hear testimony in response to specific potential changes. 

We need ample feedback from the people who are successfully 

lifting up families in our communities to ensure that any policy 

changes we consider will help more Americans get good jobs and 

not bring added hardship on struggling families. Thurgood Marshall correctly observed that none of us got where we are solely by 

pulling ourselves up by our bootstraps. We got here because somebody—a parent, a teacher, a family, or a political connection, a 

nun, or other faith-inspired person or program—helped us pick up 

our boots. 

More than three-fourths of unemployed Illinois residents live in 

the Chicago area. In my congressional district, the unemployment 

rate is over 9 percent, and more than a fourth of families with children live in poverty. In Illinois the Black unemployment rate is 

twice the overall State unemployment rate, and at least 43 percent 

of Black men, aged 20 to 24 in Chicago, are neither employed nor 

in school. 

I share your desire to connect people with jobs so they can lift 

themselves and their families out of poverty. But I remain concerned by the rhetoric we are hearing in Washington, suggesting 

that helping people with barriers to employment who live in communities with few resources, who lack connections in some form of 

offensive welfare, that merits cutting or attaching humiliating conditions. We should not be cutting off food, housing, and healthcare 

for people who aren’t working. We should be knocking down the 

barriers that are keeping them from getting good jobs and supporting them, just as people supported us in achieving their goals. 

I am looking forward to hearing from our witnesses today. I want 

to think not just the good they are doing, but also what we can 

learn from them about what works and how we can apply these 

lessons to programs we oversee, like the Temporary Assistance to 

Needy Families program, or TANF; the Fatherhood grants; and 

child support enforcement. 

We know that low-income fathers are among those who encounter multiple barriers to good jobs, and we know that State TANF 

programs are generally not assisting them, and child support enforcement programs are sending them a bill but not helping them 

to get a job to pay it. We know that the mothers served by TANF 

are encountering barriers to education and training that were created by Congress and keep them from getting good jobs. 

And we know that many families are struggling just to get the 

basics—food on the table, a roof over their heads, treatment for serious health conditions—and there is no point in trying to find 

them jobs until they have those basic necessities. There are many 

good things happening in communities across the country, but they 

are not available to everyone who needs them. 

TANF is supposed to help parents work, but what is clear from 

witness testimonies from this and past hearings is that TANF is 

not conducting quality workforce development with the array of 


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services needed to support workers with multiple barriers. We 

should take these lessons about what works and apply them to create widely available opportunities for parents to succeed. 

Helping our citizens address these barriers and obtain quality, 

good-paying benefits our communities, our Nation, and our economy is in need. I, too, welcome our witnesses, and thank you again 

for holding this hearing. 

Chairman SMITH. Thank you, Mr. Davis. 

Without objection, others Members’ opening statements will be 

made a part of the record. I would like to welcome our witnesses 

here today. 

First, we have Mr. David Ard, a senior vice president and global 

head of people and communications at Gap Inc. Next, we have Ms. 

Julie Shapiro, executive director of The Door, an organization in 

New York City. Next, we have Mr. Steve Staub, president and 

owner of Staub Manufacturing Solutions in Dayton, Ohio. And next 

we have Dr. Dan Lustig, president and CEO of the Haymarket 

Center in Chicago, Illinois. And then we have Mr. Glenn Johnson, 

the manufacturing workforce development leader at BASF Corporation in Houston, Texas. 

I now recognize Mr. Bishop for the purpose of introducing his 

constituent from Michigan. 

Mr. BISHOP. Well, thank you, Mr. Chair. It is my great honor 

to be able to introduce Barb Pilarski. Ms. Pilarski is the head of 

human resources for Fiat Chrysler North American Operations 

based just outside my district in Auburn Hills, Michigan. Similar 

to the others employers we have heard from in the previous hearings, Fiat Chrysler is also experiencing major workforce challenges, 

especially in finding workers for their manufacturing plants in 

order to keep up with the increasing demand for their vehicles. 

They have recently interviewed several thousand nonskilled employees to fill openings as part of their new industrialization plan, 

and several thousand more are forthcoming. They have also restructured their hiring approach and the interview process and are 

considering changing the requirement of a college degree to be a 

supervisor. To their great credit, Fiat Chrysler has been working 

proactively with United Way and other partner organizations to 

connect employees and potential employees—excuse me, employers 

and potential employees to support services they need to enter the 

successful—and be successful in the workforce. 

Ms. Pilarski, we appreciate you being here today to provide your 

perspective on the jobs gap, and we look forward to your testimony. 

Chairman SMITH. Thank you. 

Witnesses are reminded to limit their oral statements to 5 minutes. All of your written statements, certainly in their entirety, will 

be included in the official record. We will begin with Mr. Ard. 

Begin when you are ready. 

STATEMENT OF DAVID ARD, SENIOR VICE PRESIDENT AND 

GLOBAL HEAD OF PEOPLE AND COMMUNICATIONS, GAP 

INC., NEW YORK, NEW YORK 

Mr. ARD. Chairman Smith, Ranking Member Davis, and Members of the Subcommittee, it is an honor to be with you today at 

this very important hearing on the challenge of finding qualified 


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workers to support our businesses and provide Americans more opportunities for jobs. 

I am here to talk about This Way Ahead, which is a Gap Inc. 

program that gives young people, especially those facing barriers to 

employment, an opportunity for their first job with an Old Navy, 

Gap, or Banana Republic store. Before I share more about This 

Way Ahead, I ask you to pause for just a moment and think about 

your first job and what it taught you. 

My first job was working at a video store. And through that job, 

I learned that my time was worth something, got a lot of great free 

movies, and working allowed me to pay my own way, which was 

really important. I grew up in a small town. My parents didn’t 

have a lot of money, a small town in south Florida. 

A first job is an important milestone in every person’s life. For 

many young people, especially those with limited opportunities, it 

can be life-changing and it can shape an individual’s prospects for 

the future. In the United States, there are 4.6 million opportunity 

youth that are disconnected from school and from work. 

Research shows that not getting a first job as a teenager has a 

profound effect on your long-term earning potential. For example, 

being unemployed young can reduce earnings by as much as 20 

percent for up to two decades. To address the challenge for opportunity youth, we recognized that we have two key job assets: jobs 

in our stores and the experience of hiring teenagers. 

In our company’s nearly 50-year history, we estimate that we 

have given over 1 million youth their first jobs. It is a really important responsibility that we believe we have in the community. Our 

store managers are great at coaching, and they are great at development, and we know what it takes to help young employees get 

on the path to future success. 

So, in 2007, we designed This Way Ahead, and that was to give 

youth facing barriers a way to the workforce and a way up. Over 

the last 10 years, we have also come to recognize that This Way 

Ahead is very important for the long-term sustainability of our 

business. The program helps to expand our talent pool, to support 

business growth and foster a future customer base. 

Here is how the program works. In each of the locations where 

This Way Ahead operates, we team up with local nonprofits that 

run job training programs, like The Door that my friend, Julie Shapiro, runs in New York City. These nonprofit partners recruit motivated youth, ages 16 to 24, facing barriers to employment. 

Our local Old Navy, Gap, and Banana Republic store employees, 

they volunteer with the nonprofits to help support training, making 

connections with the youth. Our employees run workshops on topics like customer service, conflict resolution, as well as presentation 

skills. 

When the training ends, youth apply and store managers interview them. Thanks to the volunteer interactions prior to the interviews, the youth and our hiring managers, they aren’t meeting for 

the first time. So, it is not a high-stakes interview. One of the key 

differentiators lies in the interview itself. We guide the hiring managers to hire for potential, not credential: a prevalent openness to 

feedback, and work ethic. Since those are two factors that contribute to success, the youth who demonstrate these attributes are 


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hired to work in an Old Navy, Gap, and a Banana Republic store. 

And even more important than getting a job is keeping that job. 

In addition to store managers who offer guidance and feedback, 

we also build another support system to help keep youth employed. 

Each This Way Ahead participant has what we call a Big Sib, who 

helps them and supports them on questions that they have and 

questions that they may not want to ask their managers. I think 

we all need a Big Sib sometimes in our life. It goes into things like 

how their locker works or where they eat lunch. 

There is also a job coach from the nonprofit who meet regularly 

with the youth to provide additional support and advice on issues 

that may come up at work and home. All these supports, in addition to the exposure of Gap Inc.’s culture and values, help to make 

the youth feel at home and welcomed into the family. They know 

we believe in them, and they want to succeed. 

I want to give a brief example and a story of Dashawn Hightower—he is a This Way Ahead alumnus—that underlines the importance of these supports. Dashawn currently works at one of Gap 

Inc.’s largest stores, our Old Navy at 34th Street in Manhattan. He 

is a business and operations training specialist, and he is the oldest 

of three children. He lives with his mom and his sisters in the 

Bronx. 

Dashawn started his career with us at This Way Ahead, participated in our Old Navy store in Harlem, New York. In his words: 

This Way Ahead was a struggle. There were times when I was late 

or got written up, but my managers pushed me. They didn’t give 

up on me. Finally, my manager, Yeera, pulled me to the side and 

asked, what is it you want to do with this opportunity? I thought 

I had joined the program to become a sales associate and get a 

check. She made me realize that this was only the beginning. If I 

worked hard enough, there was a real opportunity to grow within 

the company. That is what it took to turn me around. 

Dashawn has continued to grow his career with our company. He 

has held multiple specialist roles and has been promoted several 

times. He is now supervising This Way Ahead participants, helping 

others to see the opportunities to advance professionally. 

I will give a couple of statistics, for the purpose of time, and I 

would be very happy to answer questions as we go forward. But a 

few things in terms of our results and things that give us confidence that there is greater opportunity for us to move forward: 71 

percent of This Way Ahead participants improve their soft skills, 

so things like decision-making and time management; 72 percent 

of our alumni from 2007 to 2016 are employed in at least one paid 

job, versus 55 percent of 16 to 24 year olds in general U.S. population; 81 percent of This Way Ahead store managers said that 

This Way Ahead increases their pride in working for our company; 

and 66 percent said it gives them a lot more—said it makes them 

a lot more willing to go above and beyond what is normally expected to help their brand succeed. 

We give advice to other employers all the time. Do not underestimate the valuable talent you may be overlooking by relying on traditional recruitment and training practices. Programs like This 

Way Ahead demonstrate that we do not need to choose between 

what is good for the community and what is good for business. We 


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can have both. We can have them at the same time, and we can 

create sustainable programs that benefit all of us. Thank you. 

Chairman SMITH. Thank you, Mr. Ard. 

[The prepared statement of Mr. Ard follows:] 


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Chairman SMITH. Ms. Shapiro, you may begin. 

STATEMENT OF JULIE SHAPIRO, EXECUTIVE DIRECTOR, THE 

DOOR, NEW YORK, NEW YORK 

Ms. SHAPIRO. Chairman Smith, Ranking Member Davis, and 

Members of the Subcommittee, I am honored to be with you today 

at this important hearing on jobs and opportunities. My name is 

Julie Shapiro, and I am the executive director of The Door in New 

York City. 

For over 45 years, The Door has served as a vital resource for 

New York City’s young people, including those facing homelessness, 

unemployment, poverty, and deportation. The Door’s mission has 

always been to empower young people to reach their potential by 

providing comprehensive youth programs in a diverse and caring 

environment. 

Each year, The Door works with nearly 10,000 young New Yorkers, ages 12 to 24. We offer comprehensive integrated programs 

free of charge, confidentially, and all under one roof. They include 

primary and behavioral healthcare; education; career training, and 

internships; creative arts programs; healthy meals and nutrition 

counseling; legal and immigration services; and supportive of housing. 

The Door provides career and education services to 3,400 young 

people annually, 1,200 of whom are disconnected youth. We know 

that for many low-income young adults, three intertwined challenges impact their ability to gain a foothold in the labor market. 

They are: one, minimal educational attainment and basic skills; 

two, limited job opportunities; and, three, limited access to living 

wage career paths. 

The retail industry, our Nation’s largest employer, provides genuine opportunities to address these challenges, due to a willingness 

to hire young adults, low entry-level skill requirements, anticipated 

growth, and advancement opportunities. Part-time retail jobs provide flexibility to meet competing needs for immediate work and 

continued education, and these jobs build skills valued throughout 

the labor market. 

For more than 15 years, The Door has been committed to tapping 

into the retail sector. Our longstanding, employer/nonprofit partnership with Gap Inc. has been the cornerstone of our pioneering 

retail sector training programs. We have been working together 

and building a team that finds solutions that work for Gap and for 

young people from the development of first pilot site at This Way 

Ahead in 2007 with 11 interns. This year, 11 years later, we are 

preparing to place 414 youth in internships across more than 60 

stores in New York City and Westchester County. In 2019, we anticipate growing the program to 500 interns. As far as we know, 

this is the largest employer-led internship initiative in the entire 

company. 

This Way Ahead internships are designed to provide youth with 

invaluable hands-on experience in the workforce, often for the first 

time. Participants gain essential and transferable job skills, as well 

as in-depth knowledge of the retail industry. Interns receive ongoing mentoring and supervision from store managers who have participated in related training. Participants are also encouraged to 


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take advantage of The Door’s entire suite of support services to address any barriers they may face, so that they remain engaged in 

their internship. Our unique model ensures that anything a young 

person needs is available at The Door, from academic tutoring, to 

help applying to college, to healthcare. 

The results have been remarkable to date. Over 11 years, of the 

more than 1,500 young people who have completed our training, 62 

percent were offered internships, 89 percent of those completed 

their internships, and 72 percent of those received job offers. This 

Way Ahead graduates stay with the company twice as long as their 

peers and have higher engagement scores than their coworkers. 

Third party evaluations have demonstrated that This Way Ahead 

participants also improve their confidence and on-the-job skills. 

Here is what I think is the best evidence of our success, and 

David mentioned this, but I think it bears repeating: 72 percent of 

program alumni from the first 10 years are currently employed in 

at least one paid job versus 55 percent of 16 to 24 year olds in the 

general U.S. population. Significantly, our partnership has paved 

the way for Gap Inc. to expand This Way Ahead to 32 additional 

U.S. cities. 

This Way Ahead is a model of how companies and nonprofit organizations can collaborate to make an impact on the lives of thousands of disconnected youth. Many companies want to do the right 

thing and hire young people in the community. Our partnership 

with Gap Inc. shows this can be brought to scale, but only if there 

is a strong partnership with an experienced youth development organization. 

I am grateful to Gap Inc. for their outstanding leadership and 

partnership, and I encourage the Subcommittee to look at ways to 

develop and fund programs like This Way Ahead. Thank you for 

your time. 

Chairman SMITH. Thank you. 

[The prepared statement of Ms. Shapiro follows:] 


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Chairman SMITH. Mr. Staub, you are recognized for 5 minutes. 

STATEMENT OF STEVE STAUB, PRESIDENT AND OWNER, 

STAUB MANUFACTURING SOLUTIONS, DAYTON, OHIO 

Mr. STAUB. Good morning, Chairman Smith and Ranking Member Davis—— 

Chairman SMITH. You might want to turn your microphone on 

there. 

Mr. STAUB. Good morning, Chairman Smith, Ranking Member 

Davis, and Members of the Subcommittee on Human Resources, 

thank you for allowing me to be here today. I am Steve Staub, 

president of Staub Manufacturing Solutions in Dayton, Ohio, a 

business my sister and I started with the help of our father that 

specializes in manufacturing fabricated metal components and assemblies from everything from locomotives to agricultural equipment, and retail displays. 

I care a lot about manufacturing in our country. That is why I 

am here today, and that is why I am proud to serve on boards of 

organizations like the Ohio Manufacturer’s Association, or the 

OMA, and the National Association of Manufacturers, the NAM. 

Nationwide, manufacturers employ more than 12 million people, 

as the NAM recently found in its manufacturing outlook survey. 

Since the tax reform was passed, the manufacturer’s optimism is 

at an all-time high. At Staub, like many small- and medium-size 

manufacturers, we have been struggling in the past just to keep 

our doors open. 

Now, since the debate and passage of tax reform, we have been 

able to invest in new equipment, expand our facility, hire new employees, and provide our people with bonuses and pay raises. There 

are many other examples like ours across the country. In fact, the 

NAM recently launched a new campaign, called Keeping Our Promise, that highlights these stories. But while manufacturers are 

growing and creating jobs, we are also having difficulty finding 

enough workers to fill those jobs. 

Approximately 426,000 U.S. manufacturing jobs are going unfilled today, because there are simply not an enough qualified applicants to fill them. Over a 10-year period, that number is going 

to rise to 2 million if we don’t do something now. So what can we 

do? Well, quite a few things, actually. Here are some basic points. 

First, there is what groups like the NAM and OMA are doing. 

They are working hard to support the next generation of manufacturing workers through various incentives, and progress has been 

made, in particular, in encouraging veterans, women, and other 

underrepresented populations as well as showcasing the promise of 

manufacturing to America’s youth. 

Second, there is what manufacturing companies can do as an individual. At Staub, we have developed some recruiting strategies 

that may be considered somewhat unconventional. We have been 

working with a local anti-poverty agency, for example. And we 

have often welcomed team members to our finishing department 

with little or no skill, teaching them a trade and giving them plenty of opportunity for advancement. We believe in hiring for attitude 

and training for skill. 


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Not only is this the right thing to do for our communities, but 

we believe there is also a strong business case to take on harder 

to serve individuals as well. And the result of our efforts has led 

to improved employee retention and loyalty. 

Third, there is work being done with local education institutions. 

I am very engaged in our local schools to get students involved in 

manufacturing. A few years ago, a group of us got together and 

started a nonprofit called Xtreme STEM to get kids excited about 

the manufacturing industry. We host robotic and 3–D printing competitions with names like Xtreme BOTS and Xtreme 3D. 

Other opportunities include apprenticeships, various workplace 

learning opportunities, and certificate programs that combine classroom time with work experience. Our company, like many others, 

also offers 100 percent tuition reimbursement. 

Fourth, there is what policymakers can do. Manufacturers appreciate the House passing the bipartisan Strengthening Career and 

Technology Education for the 21st Century Act. We hope it will 

pass the Senate soon, too. In addition, there is more that elected 

officials can do to help support communities like ours that have 

been impacted by the horrific and absolutely devastating opioid crisis. 

When someone survives addiction, they need more help, they 

need tools and strategies to keep off drugs and get back into the 

workforce and stay employed. Finally, we need a continued commitment to the kind of programs—policies like tax reform that helped 

create today’s manufacturing renaissance in the first place. 

Manufacturing offers many promising career options, often without the financial burdens of college debt. And the average manufacturing worker earns about 27 percent more in wages and benefits 

than their peers. These well-paying jobs are in modern, high-tech, 

and a growing industry, and they are ready to be filled today. In 

fact, let me say this. Right now, we have $500,000 in paid benefits 

and training to give away to five people, but we are having trouble 

finding those people. 

Here is what I would say to your constituents: It is not difficult 

to get this money, just show up every day, be willing to learn, be 

drug-free, and we will teach you the skills that you need to know. 

I imagine countless other manufacturers around the country feel 

the same way and have the same opportunities. In the meantime, 

we are going to keep working hard to tackle the skills gap. We appreciate what you are doing. Thank you. 

Chairman SMITH. Thank you, Mr. Staub. 

[The prepared statement of Mr. Staub follows:] 


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Chairman SMITH. Dr. Lustig. 

STATEMENT OF DAN LUSTIG, PSY.D. CAADC MISA II, PRESIDENT AND CEO, HAYMARKET CENTER, CHICAGO, ILLINOIS 

Mr. LUSTIG. Good morning, Chairman Smith, Ranking Member 

Davis, and Members of the Subcommittee. Thank you for allowing 

me to testify this morning. My name is Dr. Dan Lustig. I am the 

president and CEO of Haymarket Center in Chicago. It is the largest and most comprehensive provider of treatment for substance 

use and mental health disorders in Chicago, founded in 1975 by 

Father Ignatius McDermott. 

Haymarket Center has grown to serve over 12,000 individuals 

annually in over 30 specialized treatment programs and work development programs. Haymarket Center serves individuals suffering from addiction, especially those presenting with histories of 

unemployment, homelessness, criminal justice involvement, trauma, and mental illness. Haymarket Center’s recovery support infrastructure helps clients sustain recovery, minimize relapse, and 

improve overall quality of life, through its onsite provision of services that go far beyond the scope of most treatment programs. For 

example, with family medicine and psychiatry, child care, and job 

training. 

Problems with employment are common among individuals with 

substance use disorders, yet comprehensive vocational services are 

not generally available to them, and vocational interventions are 

often not matched to their specific needs. Substance use and other 

barriers have been identified as an important problem to address 

among the hard-to-employ TANF recipients and other entitlement 

programs. 

A diverse set of factors have been identified as potential barriers 

to employability. These include situational factors, such as transportation; human resource factors like low literacy or low job skills; 

and personal problems, such as domestic violence or substance use 

disorders. 

Studies indicate that the presence of these barriers, and especially the co-occurrence of multiple barriers, is associated with 

lower likelihood of employment. Over the past two decades, there 

have been numerous programs attempting to add additional requirements on a vulnerable population without understanding that 

all barriers to employment must be addressed and in place for individuals to be successful. 

In general, low-income individuals and users of public benefits do 

not have substance use disorders at a higher rate than the general 

public. It is just that when they do, it is very clear that they have 

fewer resources to address them. 

In 2011, Haymarket Center received a Pathways to Responsible 

Fatherhood grant from the Administration for Children and Families to serve low-income fathers in Chicago who are both entering 

treatment for substance use disorders and estranged from their 

children because of their drug use. The project enrolled over 1,300 

fathers. Most of these fathers resided in low-income communities 

on the south and west sides of Chicago. These neighborhoods have 

the highest murder rates and drug arrest rates in the Nation. All 


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of these fathers served through the program had complex problems 

in addition to their substance use disorders. 

Other barriers included involvement in the criminal justice system, unemployment, lack of housing, little to no work history, low 

educational levels, multiple children from different mothers, and 

co-occurring mental illness and other chronic diseases. Of the participants that we enrolled, 61 percent were African American, 8 

percent Hispanic, 27 percent White; 46 percent of the sample had 

GED or a high school diploma; 64 percent were never married; 74 

percent had a family history of substance use; 48 percent lived 

below the federal poverty level; 55 percent were currently involved 

in the criminal justice system; 64 percent report being victimized 

as children and young adults; 39 percent were reported severe victimization, including weapons; 76 percent reported extensive history of running away and period of homelessness; 48 percent reported use of alcohol and drug use under the age of 15; 29 percent 

reported history of depression and suicidal ideation; 73 reported a 

history of profound trauma. 

This representative sample demonstrates that many of the individuals have multigenerational barriers, that if we do not continue 

to wrap around services around this population, they will not be 

able to achieve a stable employment history. Over the course of the 

past two decades, there have been two specific times when the government attempted to place work requirements on this vulnerable 

population, both times failing in that they did not address the barriers to sustain employment. 

Our program at Haymarket Center, once their addiction was stabilized, fathers were able to focus and meet the demands of sustained work. Fathers began job readiness training program by 

meeting with a vocational counselor who administered a vocational 

assessment, health questionnaire, and criminal background check. 

The vocational counsel then worked with clients to develop an individual employment plan, informed by the assessments. This IEP 

actually helped individuals get connected to employment, that connected to a lot of different resources that were not previously available to them because their addiction and other illnesses and other 

conditions were not stabilized. 

In general, it is absolutely critical that we wrap services around 

individuals if we look at increasing work requirements. Right now, 

the work requirements will take enormous resources that many 

States don’t have. And it is important that the Federal Government 

continue to support government supported programs and resources 

as we move forward. Thank you. 

Chairman SMITH. Thank you, Dr. Lustig. 

[The prepared statement of Mr. Lustig follows:] 


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Chairman SMITH. Mr. Johnson, you may begin. 

STATEMENT OF GLENN JOHNSON, MANUFACTURING WORKFORCE DEVELOPMENT LEADER, BASF CORPORATION, 

HOUSTON, TEXAS 

Mr. JOHNSON. Thank you, Chairman Smith and Ranking Member Davis for allowing me to testify today and to the rest of the 

Committee. BASF is the second largest producer of chemical products in North America. At BASF, we create chemistry for a sustainable future. Sustainability includes the environment and the economy but also people, and that is what I am here to talk about 

today. 

Some say that jobs in manufacturing are dead-end jobs. But I am 

here today to testify that these jobs do not have a ceiling; they 

have options. Some of us prefer the exciting, hands-on aspects of 

technology roles, and some seek administrative work. Manufacturing provides opportunities for both, today. 

Ms. Jana Truett was a cashier in a pharmacy when she decided 

to get her associate’s degree in process technology. She began work 

with BASF as an operator and now trains others in technology. Ms. 

Jalisa King was a cook when she decided to get her associates degree. She is now an operator and part of our ambassador team, 

telling her story to other young women. Ms. Tara McMahon worked 

in a rec center. After completing her associates degree, she now 

works as a laboratory technician. 

I, personally, 22 years ago, was a proud young man living in a 

trailer park in western Kentucky with only a high school diploma 

whenever I began my first manufacturing job. I ran assembly lines, 

and stacked cases of product. And as I worked through the ranks, 

I took advantage of a tuition reimbursement program. I progressed 

into leadership roles while continuing to train and educate, with 

the support of my manufacturing employer. That proud man from 

the trailer park sits before Congress today to tell you that the manufacturing industry changed my life, and it changes people’s lives 

in the same way every day. 

Recently, there has been national discussion about the jobs gap. 

However, if we are to solve this issue, we must treat the root cause, 

not the symptom. The lack of skilled workers, for example, is the 

symptom. The root cause, however, is much more basic. In this 

country, we have allowed a narrative to develop that the best jobs 

are no longer in manufacturing. From parents and teachers to fictional characters portrayed on television, the way we talk about 

certain careers has led to a lack of interest in them, and we compound the problem by leaving information out during counseling. 

We tell kids: Dream big; you can do anything you want. 

And although I believe this general direction to be correct, it is 

profoundly incomplete. If a thousand children dream to have a job 

that has two openings, 998 of them will be unemployed, even if 

they are all straight A students. Countless stories about graduates 

that cannot find jobs have become a norm, seemingly accepted by 

society. 

Coexisting with this norm is the fact that industries like manufacturing simply cannot find enough workers for jobs that most 

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fessional of a career than the jobs that these unemployed and misinformed Americans sought. We must assure that job availability 

is a part of the counseling we provide to students, transitioning 

veterans, and other retooling adults whenever they are making 

education and training decisions. 

Collaboration with our industry partners is pivotal in regional 

and national workforce development strategy. Instead of BASF creating a pipeline for our own needs, we work with our industry partners to determine the needs of the region to create a workforce 

pipeline that supplies us all. Within the East Harris County Manufacturers Association in Houston, Texas, BASF joins with 12 colleges and 130 manufacturing and contractor companies to identify 

the critical crafts for that region and agree on the competencies 

needed. 

Within the National Association of Manufacturer’s ‘‘Dream It Do 

It’’ platform, BASF joins with multiple industry partners, where in 

2017 alone, in one area of the country, we delivered what we referred to as the manufacturing value proposition to over 11,000 

students and over 1,600 teachers, parents, and other community 

representatives. 

Within the North American process technology alliance, BASF 

joins 49 colleges, 22 industrial organizations, and 19 vendors across 

America. Here we focus on curriculum and instructor skills for the 

process technology associate’s degree. 

We can no longer hit the snooze button on the jobs gap. We must 

change our messaging to entice workers to seek jobs that are readily available. We must create education success metrics that indicate if we are filling the jobs most needed for America’s sustainability, not just how many people have 4-year degrees. 

The Department of Labor must provide job projections directly to 

the Department of Education within an aligned and specific strategy to guide education funding pursuit, as well as spending decisions for program development incentives. 

Chairman SMITH. Thank you, Mr. Johnson. 

[The prepared statement of Mr. Johnson follows:] 


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Chairman SMITH. Ms. Pilarski. 

STATEMENT OF BARB PILARSKI, HEAD OF HUMAN 

RESOURCES, FCA U.S. LLC, AUBURN HILLS, MICHIGAN 

Ms. PILARSKI. Chairman Smith, Ranking Member Davis, and 

Members of the Subcommittee, thank you for the opportunity to 

contribute to the discussion on how to address industry-wide job 

gaps. As Head of Human Resources at Fiat Chrysler Automobiles, 

I am responsible for more than 60,000 employees in the U.S., many 

of whom live in Congressman Bishop’s district. 

Since June 2009, the company has created more than 28,000 new jobs and invested more than $10 billion in the United States. We 

are justifiably proud of our growth in the U.S. over the last decade, 

but it also creates a challenge: finding the talented workers who 

will build our cars and trucks in the future. 

Our assembly line workers operate under a production methodology that we call World Class Manufacturing, or WCM, which relies heavily on employee engagement and leadership on the shop 

floor. The results of WCM have exceeded our expectations in health 

and safety, quality, productivity, morale, and other key measures. 

To continue to realize these kinds of benefits, we need our future 

assembly line workers to be idea generators, critical thinkers, problem solvers, and good communicators. We at FCA face two interrelated challenges in achieving this. First, our high school education system does not adequately expose students, especially those 

who may not be interested in a four year college degree to the manufacturing sector and the attractions of careers in this area. 

Second, this same education system has been inconsistent in 

terms of providing all graduating students with the skills to keep 

pace with the evolution of the automotive industry. We need to 

build a stronger pipeline of workers at FCA, and we have already 

begun to do this. For example, in 2013, we initiated a partnership 

with Ivy Tech Community College in Kokomo, Indiana, to launch 

the Integrated Technology Education Program, also known as 

ITEP. 

ITEP’s goal is to reach high school students, including students 

from Congresswoman Walorski’s district who are interested in 

manufacturing. The program exposes these students to manufacturing theory and concepts beginning sophomore year, followed by 

opportunities to shadow workers in a manufacturing facility during 

senior year. High school students who complete the ITEP program 

are eligible to receive free tuition for a two year technical associate 

degree from Ivy Tech. 

This fall, we plan to launch a pilot co-op program at a Michigan 

Community College. The two year program combines classroom 

learning for four days a week with one day a week of work experience in one of our manufacturing facilities. Graduates of the program will be interviewed for supervisory jobs in our own plants. 

Employers today have to think creatively about how to better 

prepare and support the good people we hire. For example, we recently redesigned our hiring and onboarding process for more than 

2,800 new employees who will build Ram pickup trucks in Michigan to acclimate them to what it is like to work in an assembly 

plant before they even set foot on the shop floor. 


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We have also begun looking at ways to leverage our longstanding 

relationship with the United Way of Southeastern Michigan to provide other support and assistance to our workers to enable them 

to address challenges, such as the lack of reliable transportation 

and childcare, as well as to create employment opportunities in our 

plants to support the meaningful efforts that United Way is undertaking to get people back to work. 

I would like to leave you with two suggestions on ways you can 

support employers like FCA. First, please continue to support and 

fund programs like the Department of Labor’s Youth Career Connect Program, which supports educational partnerships like the 

ITEP program in Indiana. And, second, consider enhancing support 

for vocational education at high schools and community colleges. 

Manufacturers like FCA are reaching out to local schools to generate interest, but these efforts are piecemeal and specific to each 

company. 

We need your help to take a comprehensive approach. This is so 

important, not just for us at FCA but for the suppliers and small 

businesses that we depend on for the components we utilize to 

build our cars and trucks. Thank you. 

[The prepared statement of Mr. Ard follows:] 


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Chairman SMITH. Thank you. I appreciate all of the testimony 

here. We will move into questions from myself and Members on 

both sides. I do want to point out that Nebraska is a great place 

to do business, but we need more workers. And having too few people for quite a while now to fill many positions, I just don’t want 

this to turn into lost opportunity. And so, I am glad that we can 

have this discussion that is particularly timely. 

Mr. Ard, I understand you have a new partnership with the Boys 

& Girls Clubs nationally, which will allow you to expand your program, right? 

Mr. ARD. Correct. 

Chairman SMITH. I also understand that you will now be having 

a presence with this program in Nebraska, although not in my district. There are only three House Members. We get along well and 

are proud of each other’s advances in our respective districts in Nebraska. 

But can you perhaps talk about why you believe it is important 

to expand beyond the major markets of say New York City, Chicago, and L.A. to places like Omaha? 

Mr. ARD. Yeah. Thank you very much. As you mentioned, we 

will be going into the Nebraska market through an extended partnership with the Boys & Girls Clubs of America. We are going to 

go into 22 new cities that we are not currently operating in, and 

we are very excited about that, by the way. Let me give you a couple of details that we believe—— 

Chairman SMITH. Because it’s Nebraska, right? 

Mr. ARD. Nebraska. It is. So, let me give you a couple of details 

that we think are key ingredients to these partnerships. So, we 

look for a local youth-serving nonprofit, and particularly one that 

runs training programs. As I mentioned about the Big Sibs and 

some of the back-office support, if you will, for our trainees, it is 

super important. 

We look for employee volunteers from our Old Navy, from our 

Gap, as well as from our Banana Republic stores, who are going 

to work with the local nonprofits again to support the training, as 

well as to make the connections with the youth, and who also have 

an interest in their community. We look for store managers who 

hire for potential and not credential. So, they are probing on openness. They are probing on feedback, work ethic. And, you know, we 

see that the interview approach is a key differentiator, and so it 

is a core ingredient to our ability to be successful as we go into a 

new market. 

Support for youth post-hire is critically important. It is one thing 

to get the job; it is another thing to keep the job. In addition to 

store managers who offer the guidance and the feedback through 

the This Way Ahead program, we have established the Big Sib. 

And, again, this is someone who is there for you, who is answering 

all your questions, things you might not be interested in asking 

your manager directly, and it just gives that supplemental support 

that they may not be getting anywhere else in their life. 

All of these supports, and in addition to exposure to Gap Inc.’s 

culture as well as our values, help to make you feel welcome and 

at home, and we know that they feel that they are believed in. 

Chairman SMITH. Very good. Thank you. 


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Mr. Staub, you have been sounding the alarm about the jobs gap 

for quite some time, well before it was on a lot of the other folks’ 

radar. Can you tell me what motivates you to keep beating this 

drum about the workforce and taking what others perceive as risks 

in who you hire and devoting your personal time to engaging with 

junior high and high school students? 

Mr. STAUB. Thank you. Simply, it is the right thing to do. I am 

third generation in the manufacturing industry and fifth generation in Dayton, Ohio, and I have seen over the years how, with the 

opioid epidemic and other things, how we have had a lot of people 

that have somewhat been lost, I could say. And the industry has 

continually grown, and it has worked out well—it is just something 

I am passionate about to try and get people into the industry. 

Interacting with high school and middle-aged kids, I see that the 

schools aren’t—like was said previously—aren’t really conveying 

the message that you can be successful without a 4-year degree. I 

went to college for a year and a half and took a year off and never 

quite made it back. And there is a lot of us out there that weren’t 

college material but have been very successful by following a path 

in the manufacturing and trades industry. 

Chairman SMITH. Very good. Thank you. I think these items 

that you have raised and others on the panel have raised that 

there is more than one path to success than a 4-year degree. And 

I think we have turned the corner a bit on this, and certainly I am 

a big fan of our community college system that can work with the 

private sector very effectively and efficiently as we do address this 

problem. And, hopefully, we can see it as an opportunity to get 

folks back on to the economic playing field and off the sidelines 

where it currently is just posing some challenges and lost opportunities. 

So, with that, I will recognize Mr. Davis for 5 minutes for his 

questions. 

Mr. DAVIS. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. 

I thank all the witnesses for your testimony. Dr. Lustig, evidence 

shows that substance abuse disorders don’t discriminate, that 

wealthy people are just as likely to use drugs as poor people. But 

poor people who are poor, especially those in poor communities, do 

have a harder time getting support and treatment than those with 

more resources, especially in States that did not expand Medicaid 

under the Affordable Care Act; they may not have access to treatment. And even if they can access treatment, they may struggle to 

pay for childcare or rent while they are in treatment, and they may 

be less likely to have jobs waiting for them when they get out. 

What are some of the additional supports you provide to your clients to make sure that they can get treatment and be in a position 

to get a job? 

Mr. LUSTIG. So, first and foremost, Haymarket Center is a 400- 

bed residential complex on the west side of Chicago, and our goal 

is to offer a very comprehensive program with immediate access to 

care. So, once we stabilize individuals in treatment, one of the key 

components in keeping individuals sustained in recovery is job 

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that we see, which is about 12,000 a year, actually have so many 

additional barriers. 

And so, one of the three things that we do at Haymarket Center 

that moves people into recovery quicker is that we not only address 

the addiction, the mental illness, and any kind of medical disorders 

that a patient presents with, but we have a job readiness program, 

and that really starts to, as a person finishes treatment, that is a 

time when we are able to work with individuals, begin the soft 

skills training, and really begin to rebuild a person. That still is 

not quite enough when you deal with individuals with long-term 

addiction. 

What is key is that we have what are called job coaches and recovery coaches. That is a program that follows individuals for 1- 

year post-treatment, and that is what we have learned to be really 

key components for individuals who are leaving treatment, is that 

we follow them for a year. And employers actually begin to build 

a level of credibility when they know that somebody else is involved with that individual. And so, our program—our job training 

program focuses on job coaching and mentoring and addressing 

those skills as a person moves through what is called ‘‘early recovery.’’ 

Mr. DAVIS. Does your agency get any support from TANF? 

Mr. LUSTIG. Yes, we do. We are an agency that has extensive 

support from TANF. We couldn’t do what we do if it wasn’t the 

support from TANF, both as it comes to addressing our entire 

issue. About 6 years ago, we took on a family-based model, and 

that model was designed not just to treat the individual patient but 

the entire family because addiction impacts the entire family. And 

so, we have had mothers and fathers who are not just impaired 

when it comes to addictions, but a lot of the kids are also failing 

in schools and need support. And so, a lot of our programs go out 

into the community and work with the entire family in addressing 

issues that the family needs to address to heal them. 

Mr. DAVIS. Mr. Johnson, does your program get any TANF support? 

Mr. JOHNSON. It is not something I have information for today, 

but I can absolutely get back to you on that. 

Mr. DAVIS. Ms. Pilarski, does your organization get TANF support? 

Ms. PILARSKI. Can you please repeat the question? 

Mr. DAVIS. Yes. Do you have any support from TANF for the 

work that you do? 

Ms. PILARSKI. I would also have to get back to you on that. We 

certainly have programs for our employees who are suffering from 

substance abuse, individualized programs to help identify those 

employees and then respond to those issues. 

Mr. DAVIS. Mr. Staub, do you get any? 

Mr. STAUB. I do not believe so. 

Mr. DAVIS. Ms. Shapiro? 

Ms. SHAPIRO. We do not. 

Mr. DAVIS. Mr. Ard? 

Mr. ARD. We do not. No specific plans at this time. 

Mr. DAVIS. Well, I thank each one of you very much. And my 

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rently not providing to some of the agencies that are doing the 

work. 

I yield back. 

Chairman SMITH. Thank you. I now recognize Ms. Walorski for 

5 minutes. 

Mrs. WALORSKI. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. 

Thanks to all of you for being here to talk about the jobs gap. 

Mr. Ard, just a quick question. I am curious, when your folks are 

interviewing these applicants and you talk about what they are 

looking for—they are kind of perusing with questions on openness 

to feedback and work ethic, what are some of those questions? How 

do you actually get in there and assess that? Just give me an example of like two questions. 

Mr. ARD. Absolutely. I mean, challenges that someone has overcome, that is certainly a very important way by which you can understand what someone has overcome, as well as what their determination is. Grit is really important as we think about that path 

to determination. And what they have learned from their job training, that curiosity and that willingness and that openness to have 

your mind changed. Those are two areas and two fundamental sort 

of ways we go about asking questions to get at that. 

Mrs. WALORSKI. Interesting. I appreciate it. 

And, Ms. Pilarski, thanks for all your work you are doing in my 

district to drum up interest in manufacturing. It is a challenge that 

is pretty well documented across my district in northern Indiana. 

Lots of manufacturing, and lots of manufacturing jobs, and no bodies to put in them. I am interested to learn more about this ITEP 

program that you started with Ivy Tech. 

You mentioned 45 others companies have joined ITEP. How do 

you work with those other companies, and are the other companies 

competitors or in different industries? And then are the students, 

when they are shadowing somebody, are they just shadowing you, 

you know, some of these other competitors? How does that whole 

process work? 

Ms. PILARSKI. Thanks for the question. We are really proud of 

the program. Ivy Tech—we sort of divide up the responsibility for 

this important initiative among the folks that have the competencies. So, there is not a lot of interaction that we have with 

the other 45 companies, we interact directly with Ivy Tech. Ivy 

Tech is the organization that determines the curriculum that the 

students are taught in sophomore year, which eventually leads to 

a certified production certificate for them. 

What we do is we expose these students to manufacturing. So, 

beginning in their senior year, we invite them into our plants, and 

we have a very structured 12-week program. So, they come to us 

a few days each week, they have two rotations through two of our 

plants, and they have three assignments in total. And they are 

given coaches because the most important thing we are going to 

teach these kids in 12 weeks isn’t necessarily technical skills; we 

are going to teach them soft skills. 

So, we want to make sure they know they need to show up at 

work every day, that they need to be there on time, that they need 

to be part of an important team. They need to ask questions. All 


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of those kinds of things that may be very natural to a lot of kids 

aren’t always natural to all kids. So that is our role. 

So, we expose these kids to manufacturing. They make it through 

their associate’s degree. Right now, we have some that have come 

back to us now doing summer internships, who we think have 

great promise, and our hope is that we start offering them full-time 

jobs when they complete their associate’s degree. 

Mrs. WALORSKI. So, given the fact that these are young people 

coming right out of high school and they really don’t have these 

skills that you are trying to teach them, soft skills, show up, it is 

important. How do you do that with a young person that comes in 

the door? Is this competitive where they are competing with each 

other? Are you incentivizing them when they do something correct 

that they have got what you are trying to tell them? What do you 

do? 

Ms. PILARSKI. We assign mentors. We assign one-on-one mentors. Every one of these kids has a mentor that follows them 

through these assignments. And those mentors are meeting with 

the kids. They are giving them guidance. They are talking to the 

supervisors that have exposure to the kids. So, we are giving them 

sort of real-time feedback and help molding them as they make it 

through this 12-week process. And that is really the way you do it. 

You team up—you really find support and assistance in that way. 

We find that to be the most effective. 

Mrs. WALORSKI. I appreciate it. 

I yield back, Mr. Chairman. Thank you. 

Chairman SMITH. Thank you. 

Next, recognizing for 5 minutes, Ms. Chu. 

Ms. CHU. Ms. Pilarski and Mr. Johnson, I would like to direct 

my first questions to both of you. Many of the programs you highlighted today are offered to youth in high school or individuals in 

the early stages of their career. However, there are other populations that are willing to work and able to work but would have 

difficulty following those pathways. 

According to the Migration Policy Institute, 25 million individuals in the U.S. are considered limited English proficient, or LEP. 

In my region of the Los Angeles metro area, 26 percent of the total 

working age population is LEP. In addition, 47 percent of adults 

who speak Asian or Pacific Island languages are LEP, which is the 

highest percentage of any linguistic group, including Spanishspeaking individuals. 

These statistics are very relevant to today’s discussion because 

LEP individuals are more likely to live in poverty than English 

proficient individuals. In 2015, about 23 percent of LEP individuals 

lived in households with an annual income below the official federal poverty line, which is nearly twice as high as the share of 

English proficient persons. 

Ms. CHU. Now, there are companies that are helping LEPs gain 

English skills to help fill jobs. The Boston Globe reported in January of 2017 that companies who are facing worker shortages have 

started offering English classes free of charge at work sites for its 

employees. Employees are paid the normal wage while they are in 

class. Companies are finding that investing in English skills and 

other kinds of training helps them retain employees, helps them 


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promote from within the company, and has helped employers identify workers whose potential was previously hidden behind a language barrier. 

In addition, errors are reduced, and employees can provide better 

customer service. Employers are offering this benefit in a range of 

industries from hospitals to manufacturing to food service companies. So, this is one way that employees can close the job gap. 

I would like to know; do you have people who work for you in 

your companies for whom English is not the first language? And 

do you offer services such as this? 

Mr. JOHNSON. Thank you for the question. 

Specifically, within the organization, what I would better refer 

that to is the people that are on the boards that we work with. So, 

the first thing that we must do is to be sure that we have a strong 

industry partnership along with education to identify what are the 

critical crafts for the area. If we have done that, we have half of 

the battle. But a part of that, and what is missing in most of those 

boards, is connecting with the neighborhood centers around the 

area that have the direct connection to people that are underrepresented and to people that are in impoverished areas that need 

these additional services. Including those organizations onto the 

board allows us to find out what are these additional barriers that 

we need to address within the education portion because just enticing them to come to this path is not the end of the equation. The 

other part of that is the quality part of it, and what are the skills 

that they need? And if there are some underlying foundational 

skills that are necessary like what you are talking about, it helps 

us to know in advance what those are, to put into the curriculum. 

Ms. CHU. So, Mr. Johnson, I am talking about the English language skills. So, are those being addressed? 

Mr. JOHNSON. Yes. If that is identified as a critical skill, as a 

skill that is absent in the community that we are trying to employ 

people, then it is put into the curriculum as well. 

Ms. CHU. Ms. Pilarski. 

Ms. PILARSKI. In southeastern Michigan, we also struggle with 

a population of folks that have non-English speaking skills. And 

one of the ways that we address it is through our partnership with 

United Way of Southeastern Michigan. So, we have been together 

partnering with United Way for 65 years. We have a very longstanding relationship. And they have some unique and specific programs where they focus on folks who have trouble with English. 

Our employees this year contributed over $5 million to support programs like these with United Way of Southeastern Michigan. 

So, I can certainly relate to the challenges that you have. We 

find it ourselves in our region, and we think the right approach is 

to partner with professionals like United Way to help us move 

through that issue because those folks, you are exactly right, would 

be very good folks for us to consider for positions in our plants. 

Ms. CHU. I applaud you for that partnership. It certainly can 

make sure that we utilize these people to the greatest degree possible by addressing their English language skills and certainly can 

provide a more robust workforce. Thank you. 

Chairman SMITH. Thank you. Next up, we have Mr. Bishop who 

is recognized for 5 minutes. 


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Mr. BISHOP. Thank you, Mr. Chair. 

Thank you to all the panelists for being here today. Thank you 

for taking the time out of your busy days to participate in this and 

helping to craft public policy and really lead discussion on this 

issue that is so vitally important to the future of this country. 

Each and every one of us has constituents that we represent. 

Personally, I have been all over my district talking to companies 

big and small about issues that are of concern to them. 

This is the primary issue that I hear from every single business, 

and so we really have got to get creative about this, and we really 

have got to work together to figure out how to change the direction 

of what we are doing now and really, reinventing the wheel. 

In Michigan, as Ms. Pilarski knows, we are the motor city, and 

we had some problems about 10 years ago. We had a really, really 

bad recession. Manufacturing jobs left our State, and they did in 

great numbers. We are just now rebuilding. Ten years later, I think 

you can say that, as many people do, that Michigan is the comeback State and Detroit is a comeback city. One of our biggest problems, and some people say it is probably a good problem to have, 

is our economy is doing so well that we need workers, and we have 

to find a way to fill them. 

So, Ms. Pilarski, I know that Fiat Chrysler has done such a great 

job in bringing this intuitive new process, it is brand-new on how 

you look for employees and fill spots. You are the H.R. director of 

a rather large—if anybody has an issue or is struggling right now 

or has challenges, it has got to be someone like you who sees it 

from every angle. 

There are so many things to talk about, but can you tell me a 

little bit about the United Way? I know you just started a discussion with Ms. Chu, but I would like to hear more. 

Ms. PILARSKI. Yes. We actually feel like part of the resolution 

to this problem is partnering with community organizations like 

the United Way. As I said, we have been together with them for 

65 years, and we understand very well the programs that they 

have, what they have done, where they have been successful. And 

so, for example, they have a program they call College and Career 

Pathways. And what they do, these are for high school students, 

and they prepare kids for life after high school whether it is a two 

or four year degree or it is something else. 

So, for us, that is very natural for us to connect to a program 

like that because we have the jobs for those folks, those high 

schoolers who aren’t going to go right and start their four year college degree. So, for us, understanding their programs and then 

being able to figure out where we connect is really, really important. 

The other thing, one of the things in our plants that can be a 

problem for us is absenteeism. And if you really drill down on that 

issue, you find that our employees struggle with some things like 

transportation, reliable transportation, childcare, other things, and 

United Way has wraparound services to help employees do that. 

I said that we have been partnering with United Way for 65 

years. For 64 years it was a one-way thing where we were raising 

money and providing it to United Way, and this is the first year 


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in 65 years that we are asking for support back because of the situation that we are dealing with regarding the jobs gap. 

Mr. BISHOP. It is admirable. On behalf of my constituent base 

in southeast Michigan and the State of Michigan, I am so grateful 

to Fiat Chrysler for your leadership in this area. 

You also mentioned in your testimony, and also, I indicated in 

the introduction, that you are thinking about taking away the requirement for college education for your supervisors. We have 

many students in this country, many young people who have significant debt in that 18- to 24-year-old gap that are most likely not 

to have a job, and so we are facing a fundamental crisis here. 

Tell us a little bit about your decision to take away that degree 

requirement for supervisors. 

Ms. PILARSKI. Yes, and we are talking specifically about production supervisors, so these are folks in our plants that generally 

have responsibility for a team of about 40 people that would lead 

maybe five or six different work activities. In the past, we have required a four year degree for those folks, and we have too many 

positions that are open. 

What we are finding is that when we bring a new hire on to the 

assembly line who doesn’t need a college degree, we bring them in 

as a team member, and for those who have the interest, they can 

aspire to be team leaders which they are then managing about six 

folks. We are finding that these folks are a really good pipeline into 

these production supervisor positions, but they don’t have the college degree. So, we just connected the dots on that and said, we 

need to rethink what our minimum requirements are because we 

really have the capability in these employees, and we need to leverage that and that is what really drove the decision. 

Mr. BISHOP. Thank you very much. I yield back. 

Chairman SMITH. In the interest of time, we want to move 

things along given the vote schedule. 

Next, I will recognize Ms. Sewell for 5 minutes. 

Ms. SEWELL. Thank you, Chairman Smith and Ranking Member Davis. I want to thank our witnesses for being here today. My 

constituents in Alabama know that my top legislative priority is 

jobs and workforce development. Every year, during the August 

district work period, I host a job fair, an annual job fair, that 

moves around between my urban parts and my rural parts of my 

district given the fact that there are different needs in different 

parts of the district. But there are very real barriers that obstruct 

individuals from entering or staying in the workforce. 

After every job fair, I hear from my employers that there are 

many enthusiastic applicants but that the job openings go unfilled 

because many of the candidates don’t have the proper skills or 

training to qualify to fill those jobs. 

That is why I think it is really important that the work that you 

all are doing in terms of workforce development and apprenticeship 

programs and internship programs are critically important to our 

ability to make sure that we not only close the jobs gap but the opportunity gap that exists in this country. 

Policymakers, Republicans and Democrats, support apprenticeship programs and internships because employers can fill labor 

gaps, and workers can earn while they learn. But apprenticeships 


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are scarce in today’s economy. Last year, fewer than 50,000 Americans graduated from a registered apprenticeship program. Moreover, I have learned that often they don’t reach women, minorities, 

and rural youth as effectively as they do other kinds of applicants. 

After speaking to my constituents and employers, I found that 

there are two reasons for this. First, low-income families need stability to be effective participants in workforce development programs. If a family can’t afford childcare or they don’t have access 

to transportation, housing, or healthcare, it becomes almost impossible for an individual to focus on succeeding in a workforce development program. 

In my district, where the average median household income for 

a family of four is less than $35,000, working families don’t earn 

enough to make ends meet without assistance. So, if Congress and 

this Administration is serious about addressing the skills gap, we 

must strengthen funding for wraparound services so that those 

who have fallen on hard times have the ability and the opportunity 

to pull themselves out of poverty. 

Secondly, I believe the reason why we see fewer youth—rural 

youth, minorities, and women in some of these programs is because 

workforce development programs do not serve some of our most 

disparate populations programs like I think programs like TANF, 

the Temporary Assistance for Needy Families, is not properly designed to provide workforce training and education to its recipients. 

Since its inception, TANF has been sold as a program that helps 

transition impoverished Americans, but, unfortunately, very few 

TANF dollars go to education and training, making it very difficult 

for TANF recipients to find good, long-term employment. 

This Committee must focus on making sure that workforce development becomes the central part of TANF’s mission. And that is 

what we are doing here today is learning more about what works 

as far as workforce development programs and what we can learn 

from them. 

So, I guess my question: I will start with you, Ms. Pilarski, I in 

Alabama, we consider ourselves the Detroit of the South because 

we have a lot of automobile manufacturers in our district. Likewise, in my district, I have Mercedes-Benz and Hyundai, so I am 

quite interested in the program that you have outlined. 

Can you talk to us about best practices and what workforce development and apprenticeship best practices that you have learned 

that we can maybe glean to government assistance programs like 

TANF? 

Ms. PILARSKI. You know, I will agree with you that these apprenticeship programs and co-ops and all that kind of stuff, these 

are very small numbers. They are very, very, very small numbers. 

Ms. SEWELL. And often they are more than—your training program is a 2-year program. TANF only is 12 months. We have to 

really start thinking about how we are designing these programs 

in order to make sure that we are addressing the real skills gap 

that exists. 

Ms. PILARSKI. Right. I agree. Like I mentioned before, I think 

when we talk about apprenticeship or development of folks coming 

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ships. We really leverage these cohort groups of folks with similar 

experiences and similar skills coming in. 

Ms. SEWELL. They can learn from each other. 

Ms. PILARSKI. Yes. It is really important, and especially for 

young kids, coming from schools, they are used to those—— 

Ms. SEWELL. I am running out of time. I wanted to ask Dr. 

Lustig, wraparound services like having access to childcare and access to transportation, how critical is that in these programs? 

Mr. LUSTIG. Those are the most significant barriers. One of the 

biggest barriers for women accessing treatment is the need for 

childcare. Most agencies and services won’t allow a woman to become stabilized without childcare, and that is a tremendous barrier. 

So, one of the things we do at Haymarket Center is as mom is 

going through our job training program, we are offering an onsite 

daycare center. 

Chairman SMITH. I am sorry to interrupt, but we are kind of 

pressed for time. 

Next recognized for 5 minutes is Mr. Reichert. 

Mr. REICHERT. Ms. Shapiro, how long have you been working 

in this field in your community? 

Ms. SHAPIRO. Twenty years. 

Mr. REICHERT. Twenty years. Dr. Lustig, how long have you 

been doing your outreach work? 

Mr. LUSTIG. Twenty-five years. 

Mr. REICHERT. So, in your 45 years of experience, what has 

changed since you started your work and we find ourselves in the 

situation that we find ourselves in today? 

Ms. Shapiro, first. 

Ms. SHAPIRO. Broad question. I think, in some ways, the work 

has gotten harder. In New York City, even just 7 or 8 years ago, 

the number of out-of-school and out-of-work adults was about 

187,000. That is just in New York City. 

Mr. REICHERT. What was it 20 years ago, do you remember? 

Roughly. 

Ms. SHAPIRO. Maybe a little bit less than that but still high. 

And so—— 

Mr. REICHERT. So, no progress. 

Ms. SHAPIRO. Not a lot. And now it actually has dropped a bit. 

So now it is down to 136,000. It is still a huge number, but it has 

dropped a bit. But the young people who are sort of left behind, 

who are sort of left disconnected are the ones who need the most 

support. And so young people who are aging out of foster care, 

young people who have involved with the justice system, young 

people who are struggling with mental illness, those are a lot of the 

barriers that we are trying to address now. 

Mr. REICHERT. I get that. Doctor, what do you see, after your 

25 years of hard work? 

Mr. LUSTIG. We don’t see a lot that has changed. But what we 

have seen is that the programs that the Federal Government has 

put out, we have learned a lot, and we have found that some of 

these work development programs, these job training programs, 

really do work, but they are never brought to scale. 


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Mr. REICHERT. One of the comments you made was this is 

generational. That is what I am trying to get at. I know—I agree: 

the programs, the treatment, the medical, the psychological, the 

physical medical treatments, and help that we can give people, job 

training, soft skills. I have got a question mark around that, learning disabilities. I am dyslexic. I barely graduated from high school. 

I have 2 years of college and look where I ended up: God has punished me. No. I am proud to serve. 

But the point is that what is happening—for me, it is what is 

happening in the family. I was a cop for 33 years. I ran away from 

home when I was a senior in high school. I lived in an old car. I 

went to school every day. I am trying to figure out why. I think 

it was football and girls was the reason I was there. 

We used to have home economics class, wood shop, metal shop, 

and machine shop, and we don’t have those in our schools today. 

We need to go back to the basics, I think, and what can we do, especially in the foster care world too. I was a foster grandparent and 

an adoptive grandparent, et cetera. There are so many things that 

are happening within the family that create or not happening within the family that create the situation that we are in now that is 

happening in the school or not happening in our schools that are 

creating the sadness that we see that you have seen for 45 years 

total. 

What can we do to prevent? Because I am about prevention. Instead of—we are playing catchup. And your numbers are essentially the same. What can we do for prevention? 

Mr. LUSTIG. First and foremost, when you look at your prevention programs, most prevention programs in many States have either been cut or eliminated. So that is the first piece to understand. 

Mr. REICHERT. At the local, city, county, State level? 

Mr. LUSTIG. Yes. But what is the key with prevention is that 

we have to get far enough upstream to really have prevention 

work. That is what we are not seeing today. So, when you take a 

look at, take addiction that is impacting so many families as it relates to jobs—— 

Mr. REICHERT. I have seen that. 

Mr. LUSTIG. There are so many key pieces to this. The key piece 

to understanding addiction is, even though we have dumped billions of dollars into the opioid epidemic, the issue as it relates to 

stigma of people seeking treatment is still alive and well today. So, 

you have to get your prevention programs. 

Mr. REICHERT. What about the soft skills though? That is stuff 

that my parents taught me at home, the teachers taught me at 

home: to show up for work or to show up on time, 8 hours work 

for 8 hours pay. 

Ms. Shapiro, real quick. 

Ms. SHAPIRO. I think the focus really has to be, and for us, it 

is sort of on positive youth development, and that is prevention for 

us. It is getting to young people early, providing them opportunities, connecting them to positive relationships with caring adults, 

providing that wraparound support, believing in them, and helping 

them chart a course for their future, which as we have talked 

about in this hearing may or may not involve college but can cerVerDate Sep 11 2014 07:48 Mar 27, 2019 Jkt 033867 PO 00000 Frm 00061 Fmt 6633 Sfmt 6602 I:\WAYS\IN\33867\33867.XXX 33867

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tainly involve positive paths either through education or through 

careers. 

Mr. REICHERT. Thank you. 

I yield back. 

Chairman SMITH. Next is Mr. LaHood for 5 minutes or less. 

Mr. LAHOOD. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. 

I appreciate your doing this series before our Subcommittee on 

the jobs gap and employers’ need for qualified workers. It is so important to our economy and where we are at today. 

I want to thank all the witnesses for being here today for spending some time with us and sharing your perspective. 

Mr. Johnson, I had a couple of questions for you. 

In your testimony, you talk about a strategy for workforce development and collaborative synergy. I have heard mixed reviews 

about the workforce system and one-stop centers. In my State, they 

call them Illinois Worknet Centers. Given that you operate facilities I believe in 29 States, what has your experience been in working with the workforce system? That is number one. 

Secondly, my understanding is that the workforce system, or 

WIOA, is supposed to be oriented toward connecting people with indemand jobs and working with employers in some of the same 

ways we have heard in your testimony. 

Is that currently happening? 

Mr. JOHNSON. Yes, that is currently happening. But the key, 

I believe, is to connect those workforce centers with the workforce 

boards that industries are leading together as a group. Getting us 

all together to this workforce development equation that I mentioned is the only way for everyone to understand it, to be able to 

follow it. For example, let’s say that one of my BASF sites or the 

site leader says that they decide they need three electrical technicians over the next 5 and 10 years. Well, to get three, we have to 

credential three. But to credential three, you have to enroll six, because not everyone makes it through the program. To enroll six, we 

have to talk to 25 because we don’t convince everyone to take the 

path. 

That system is what is happening today with individuals worried 

about that end-part of the pipeline. 

If we do that, the problem is we are never going to supply what 

we are trying to get because a lot of those people who are graduating with those credentials may get hired by someone else. 

The better bet is for us to work with our regional partners, our 

industry partners in the area, and decide how many electrical technicians do we need as a group for this region so we know how 

many to enroll, so we know how many to speak to. If we get that 

math correct, we create a pipeline that fulfills us all instead of us 

only worrying about our individual needs. 

Mr. LAHOOD. When you describe that deficiency, is there a public policy answer to that? Is there something government should or 

shouldn’t be doing? Or is that something that is solved in the private sector? 

Mr. JOHNSON. Well, it is a bigger answer than I have time for 

today, but the answer is absolutely yes. 

One of the primary things that I believe that public policy can 

address is educational funding messaging. I talk about the message 


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a lot during my testimony, parents, teachers, everyone, but that 

would include our policy does not communicate to kids, what jobs 

are available. If I as a young student go to apply and get a Pell 

grant, whenever I get that Pell grant, it doesn’t tell me that I can 

use it for just these particular jobs, but that is what it should do. 

Right now, if you get qualified for a Pell grant, you can use it for 

a master’s degree in basket weaving if you want to. But you are 

probably not going to get a job in that. 

If we change policy to where educational funding is based upon 

job availability projections, we are sending a message each time to 

each student whenever they fill out their federal application for 

student financial aid, that, yes, I received this money, but I might 

not want to go in this particular direction because they don’t say 

there is going to be any jobs available. 

Mr. LAHOOD. Lastly, as the world’s largest chemical producer 

in the world, can you talk a little about BASF, how you balance 

the need for labor when unemployment is so low with safety concerns in your facilities? 

Mr. JOHNSON. I would hate to say the word ‘‘balance against 

safety’’ at any time. Safety is number one at all times. But we do 

address the need for labor by the urgency at which we take action 

and join with our industry partners. 

The urgency of what is happening now and what we project to 

see happening because 11,000 baby boomers turn 70 every single 

24 hours beginning last year is something that we have to take action on now and, again, as I mentioned earlier, not put the snooze 

button on this jobs gap issue. So, we are taking the urgency extremely seriously at this moment to prepare for something we don’t 

think is quite affecting us yet. We believe that a lot of baby 

boomers have decided to stay in the workforce for a number of 

years longer than they would have because of the last 5 to 10 years 

of market downturns when they thought they were going to retire, 

didn’t because their 401(k)s just weren’t where they thought it 

would be. By the time it came back, they realized: I don’t have to 

retire. But we are learning that, by the time they turn 70, they are 

rethinking that decision. 

Mr. LAHOOD. Thank you. 

Chairman SMITH. Thank you. 

Mr. Schweikert. 

Mr. SCHWEIKERT. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. 

This is an area I have a huge fascination so forgive me if we 

bounce all over the place data-wise. I actually have the CBO report 

in front of me that is talking about our economic growth and those 

things. It turns out they consider the single biggest barrier, the 

capping that we are—the ceiling we are hitting up against is our 

labor force participation numbers. And within that, it was shocking. You just talked about seniors. When you actually look at some 

of the labor force participation numbers, how many of our younger 

people aren’t actually entering the labor force. 

I struggle with some of this because just what I think 10 days 

ago sitting right where you are sitting, I had a gentleman from Arizona, a three-time convicted felon, took on some electrical training 

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ment, because they were so desperate for workers, and they are 

having this amazing retention rate. 

Remember this is a young man who was an addict. But bless 

him. As he said, one of the quotes, and it is burned in my head, 

is: I am working so many hours and I am so busy, I haven’t had 

a chance to relapse. In several months he is up to $22 an hour. 

And having a mother who was a substance abuse counselor 

where we never knew who was coming to Thanksgiving dinner, it 

turns out being busy sometimes is an amazing antidote to that and 

showing up at your meetings. 

If I came to you right now and said: This is the opportunity we 

were dreaming of a few years ago, there are jobs. A few years ago, 

our complaint was there weren’t jobs. People are moving to very 

bad behavior because they have no place to go. We can’t use that 

excuse today. We have lots of places for them to go. 

What are we working? Is it Ms. Shapiro? Did you say you were 

seeing actually in some of your population that you are down to 

what, 130,000? 

Ms. SHAPIRO. In New York City. 

Mr. SCHWEIKERT. My curiosity is it was a measurable number. 

Ms. SHAPIRO. In New York City, there are 136,000 out-of-school 

out-of-work young people. 

Mr. SCHWEIKERT. What was it at its peak a few years ago? 

Ms. SHAPIRO. It was 187,000. 

Mr. SCHWEIKERT. So what positive happened in that population? How do we keep doing more of that? 

Ms. SHAPIRO. I think there has been progress with both additional public resources. And in New York City, there are also a lot 

of private resources that are dedicated to workforce development. 

So, the programs that have been set up, and there is a good infrastructure of job training programs in the city have worked—— 

Mr. SCHWEIKERT. Could you share with me—I am sorry; I 

know I am interrupting it is but it is the life of living on a clock— 

are you seeing the number of businesses just like our example last 

week with the young man who is changing his life around, it was 

a business that needed a certain electrical talent. They trained him 

to that talent and guaranteed him a job upon his release date 

whereas—and I would like to actually submit it to the record. I 

have the Labor Department inspector general’s report on the Job 

Corps, and it is heartbreaking how badly the auditor general said 

it is failing the very populations it is supposed to be serving. 

Chairman SMITH. Without objection. 


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Mr. SCHWEIKERT. I think it is important to see that. Both 

right and left want solutions to this. Sometimes we may come at 

it from different directions. 

What do you see working most effectively right now? 

Ms. SHAPIRO. Our partnership with Gap is a great example, but 

we have a lot of other industry partnerships as well. So, we have 

a culinary industry partnership, an IT industry partnership. We 

are training young people for EMT jobs. We are working with the 

masonry and historical preservation industry. And so, these industry partnerships and employer partnerships are working. It is just 

there are a lot of young people who are left behind who need more 

support and more prep—— 

Mr. SCHWEIKERT [continuing]. Are you sometimes taking 

someone who may have a bit of a dodgy past, and are you accepting 

them, training them, hoping they are showing up at their meetings? What are you doing? 

Mr. STAUB. Yes. We have hired some folks who have had a not 

so great past and entering them in to our finishing department 

where we train them and see how they do there, and we can give 

them the skills to move forward and do computer operating machinery or other skills, welder, or whatever is needed and what 

path they are interested in. 

Mr. SCHWEIKERT. Mr. Johnson. 

Mr. JOHNSON. I just have a comment. The bottom line comes 

down to this, either we have truly a second chance society or we 

don’t. And part of the barrier for people with need for a second 

chance has to do with how we ask them if they are available or if 

they are okay to work. We ask them questions like, ‘‘have you 

ever,’’ instead of, ‘‘have you in the last 7 years.’’ 

Mr. SCHWEIKERT. Mr. Chairman, I know I am way over time, 

but you are actually seeing some really interesting stuff in the 

data. Felons, people with some really difficult pasts are getting 

jobs. 

How do we, as policymakers, make it so if someone needs to go 

to their 12-step meeting over lunch, that that is embraced? It is almost a rethinking, and I am hoping this labor force shortage is 

making a difference in our society. 

Chairman SMITH. There is considerable interest in these winwin scenarios of bringing folks off the sidelines and focusing on the 

future. 

Next up is Mr. Curbelo for 5 minutes. 

Mr. CURBELO. Thank you very much, Mr. Chairman. 

I am grateful to you and to the Ranking Member and to really 

the entire Committee for dedicating so much time to this issue, to 

figuring out how we can work together as an institution with the 

private sector, with local and State partners, to improve the lives 

of disconnected youth, a lot of these young people who want to 

make their contribution to the world, to their communities, but just 

can’t figure out how. And all of you who are here today in some 

way are dedicating a lot of your own personal time to figuring out 

a way forward for these young people so they can integrate into our 

society and be productive. I think you should all be commended for 

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I am especially grateful because, in south Florida, we have a 

wonderful organization called Youth Co-Op that partners with 

Gap’s This Way Ahead program to promote the well-being of at-risk 

youth in the community through education, employment, and empowerment. 

But a question I have for Mr. Ard, for Mr. Staub, and for anyone 

else who wants to answer it, and I think it was touched upon earlier, but we should explore it more deeply. 

The Federal Government, does it have a visible role? Is it a reliable partner? 

You work on this every day. 

What difference is the Federal Government making in terms of 

helping these young people find their pathway to success? 

Mr. Ard, if you want to take it first, please. 

Mr. ARD. It is definitely a big question and one that I think we 

are grappling with on a pretty regular basis in my company. I 

think there is opportunity for all of us to do more. What we are 

doing currently is certainly on a more localized level with organizations for example with Youth Co-ops and things, something along 

those lines, The Door, our Boys and Girls Club. So, this is certainly 

an opportunity for the Federal Government to do more. Otherwise, 

it is a patchwork of experiences that you are being strung together 

and look different State-by-State. 

Mr. CURBELO. Mr. Staub. 

Mr. STAUB. There certainly is, like the Perkins bill that is currently in front of the Senate, things like that, to help the community and technical colleges get the funding and resources they need 

to have the equipment that they can train their students on. And 

there is opportunity too for the Federal Government to reach out 

to the education system to let them help spread the message that 

you don’t have to get a 4-year degree. 

Today, the average attorney makes about the same as the average machinist when you figure out the college debt and the timeframe when they can earn their highest wages. 

It is very surprising that most people don’t understand that, and 

we have an opportunity to share that message that many educators 

don’t know, and we can help educate them too. 

Mr. CURBELO. Mr. Chairman, I think this is an interesting 

point because American taxpayers contribute billions of dollars 

every year to support those who are in need. And I think most 

Americans really do it proudly because we all want to help people 

who are struggling who need a hand up. But I think it is pretty 

clear from the testimony today and from all the different questions 

and answers that we have heard, that we can do a lot better as 

a Federal Government. 

Obviously, a great emphasis on education. I fully agree. I think 

we need to stop lying to young people by telling them there that 

there is only one pathway to success, which is a traditional 4-year 

degree. It works for a lot of people. It worked for me, but it does 

not work for everyone. We have created a stigma that is very dangerous. 

I hope from this Committee we can continue supporting those efforts to present the full menu of education options and pathways 

to success. 


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And then I also think, in a lot of our social welfare programs, we 

need to do better and target them and make sure we are 

partnering with organizations and initiatives like the ones represented here today so that we can actually help empower people 

so they can grow independent of the government and kind of blaze 

their own pathway and find their role in the world. 

So, Mr. Chairman, I am going to be generous and efficient here 

the way I expect our federal programs will be some day and give 

you back about 45 seconds. 

Thank you. I yield back. 

Chairman SMITH. Thank you, Mr. Curbelo. 

Thank you to everyone for participating and, to our panel, for 

sharing your insights and your expertise. It is vital that we have 

these conversations. I think it is just a great reminder of what is 

at stake and how we want to focus on opportunity for the future, 

and like I said earlier, it is helping folks leave the sidelines and 

get in the action, because I think that it is just a win-win down 

the line positive scenario when we can help folks connect with opportunity for themselves personally, for their communities, for 

their families, you name it. 

So, thank you again. 

I will say that all Members will have 2 weeks to submit written 

questions to be answered later in writing. Those questions and 

your answers will be made part of the formal hearing record. 

With that, the Subcommittee stands adjourned. 

[Whereupon, at 1:23 p.m., the Subcommittee was adjourned.] 

Æ 


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