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28–249 PDF 2006

S. Hrg. 109–673

NOMINATION OF R. DAVID PAULISON

HEARING

BEFORE THE

COMMITTEE ON 

HOMELAND SECURITY AND 

GOVERNMENTAL AFFAIRS 

UNITED STATES SENATE

ONE HUNDRED NINTH CONGRESS

SECOND SESSION

ON THE

NOMINATION OF R. DAVID PAULISON, TO BE UNDER SECRETARY FOR 

FEDERAL EMERGENCY MANAGEMENT, U.S. DEPARTMENT OF HOMELAND SECURITY

MAY 24, 2006

Printed for the use of the 

Committee on Homeland Security and Governmental Affairs

(

(II)

COMMITTEE ON HOMELAND SECURITY AND GOVERNMENTAL AFFAIRS 

SUSAN M. COLLINS, Maine, Chairman 

TED STEVENS, Alaska 

GEORGE V. VOINOVICH, Ohio 

NORM COLEMAN, Minnesota 

TOM COBURN, Oklahoma 

LINCOLN D. CHAFEE, Rhode Island 

ROBERT F. BENNETT, Utah 

PETE V. DOMENICI, New Mexico 

JOHN W. WARNER, Virginia 

JOSEPH I. LIEBERMAN, Connecticut 

CARL LEVIN, Michigan 

DANIEL K. AKAKA, Hawaii 

THOMAS R. CARPER, Delaware 

MARK DAYTON, Minnesota 

FRANK LAUTENBERG, New Jersey 

MARK PRYOR, Arkansas

MICHAEL D. BOPP, Staff Director and Chief Counsel 

JENNIFER A. HEMINGWAY, Professional Staff Member 

MICHAEL L. ALEXANDER, Minority Staff Director 

ADAM R. SEDGEWICK, Minority Professional Staff Member 

TRINA DRIESSNACK TYRER, Chief Clerk 

(III)

C O N T E N T S 

Opening statements: Page 

Senator Collins ................................................................................................. 1

Senator Lieberman ........................................................................................... 3

Senator Voinovich ............................................................................................. 6

Senator Akaka .................................................................................................. 7

Senator Dayton ................................................................................................. 8

Senator Carper ................................................................................................. 19

Prepared statement: 

Senator Levin .................................................................................................... 39

WITNESSES 

WEDNESDAY, MAY 24, 2006

Hon. E. Clay Shaw, Jr., a Representative in Congress from the State of 

Florida ................................................................................................................... 5

R. David Paulison, to be Under Secretary for Federal Emergency Management Agency, U.S. Department of Homeland Security: 

Testimony .......................................................................................................... 9

Prepared statement .......................................................................................... 40

Biographical and professional information ..................................................... 46

Responses to pre-hearing questions ................................................................ 50

Letter from U.S. Office of Government Ethics ............................................... 122

Responses to post-hearing questions .............................................................. 123

Responses to additional questions ................................................................... 145

(1)

NOMINATION OF R. DAVID PAULISON 

WEDNESDAY, MAY 24, 2006

U.S. SENATE, COMMITTEE ON HOMELAND SECURITY

AND GOVERNMENTAL AFFAIRS, Washington, DC. 

The Committee met, pursuant to notice, at 10:19 a.m., in room 

SD–342, Dirksen Senate Office Building, Hon. Susan M. Collins, 

Chairman of the Committee, presiding. 

Present: Senators Collins, Voinovich, Lieberman, Akaka, Carper, 

and Dayton. 

OPENING STATEMENT OF CHAIRMAN COLLINS 

Chairman COLLINS. The Committee will come to order. 

Today the Committee will consider the nomination of David 

Paulison to be the Under Secretary for Federal Emergency Management at the Department of Homeland Security. Put more simply, he has been nominated to be the Director of FEMA. 

It would be an understatement to say that Members of this Committee are familiar with FEMA. We have just completed an exhaustive 7-month investigation into what went wrong in the response to Hurricane Katrina. As a result, we are all too familiar 

with the profound problems that exist within the Nation’s emergency management structure and, in particular, within FEMA. 

As the title of our Katrina Report states, 4 years after the terrorist attacks, America was still a Nation unprepared when that 

powerful storm struck. With the official start of the 2006 hurricane 

season now less than a week away, we must ascertain whether we 

are any better prepared today as a result of the cruel lessons Hurricane Katrina taught us. 

The recent floods in the southern part of my State and in New 

Hampshire and Massachusetts remind us that disaster can strike 

any time and anywhere. The terrible human suffering and the 

physical devastation caused by Hurricane Katrina were truly horrifying. But, from natural disasters to terrorist attacks, we can easily 

construct scenarios that would be even worse. FEMA plays a central role in preparing for, responding to, and recovering from such 

catastrophes. 

The catalog of the 185 findings in our Committee’s report can be 

seen through the lenses of four over-arching failures: First, the lack 

of attention to long-term warnings and failures to prepare for a 

long predicted catastrophe. 

Second, insufficient actions and poor decisions prior to landfall 

and in the immediate aftermath. 

2

Third, the failure of systems that support response efforts, including abysmal situational awareness. 

And fourth, the failures of officials at all levels of government to 

provide effective leadership. 

As our investigation made painfully clear, FEMA, under its thenDirector Michael Brown, was at the center of each of these failures. 

Mr. Brown bears much of the responsibility for the haphazard and 

inadequate preparation, response, and relief effort. It matters 

greatly who leads FEMA. The Agency must have a strong, effective, 

and experienced leader, which is why we have convened today. 

But the record of our investigation also makes clear that the 

problems at FEMA go beyond matters of leadership, judgment, and 

equipment in one particular disaster. FEMA lacks the stature, the 

protection, the resources, the connections with State and local officials and first responders, and the direct communication with the 

President that are essential in responding effectively to a catastrophe. 

It is clear that the problems at FEMA were evident long before 

Katrina. Our investigation of FEMA’s disaster relief programs following the 2004 Florida hurricanes revealed alarming waste, fraud, 

and abuse. Yet, those alarms were not heeded before Katrina 

struck. 

FEMA’s problems are bone deep, and at the surface level, its 

credibility is shattered. That is why one of our report’s major recommendations calls for elevating and strengthening FEMA by giving it key preparedness and protection assets. We must transform 

this agency into a new, all-hazards authority within the Department of Homeland Security. 

This more capable and more regionally focused agency would be 

built upon the foundation of FEMA. More precisely, it will be built 

upon the foundation of FEMA’s skilled, dedicated, and professional 

workforce. 

Our nominee brings extensive credentials and leadership experience to the great challenges ahead. David Paulison was appointed 

Acting Director of FEMA just 2 weeks after Katrina hit, following 

the resignation of Michael Brown. He stepped forward to take command under extraordinarily difficult circumstances. 

Prior to his appointment as the Acting Director of FEMA, he was 

confirmed by the Senate as the U.S. Fire Administrator in December 2001. Before his confirmation, Mr. Paulison was Chief of the 

Miami-Dade Fire Rescue Department, where he directed 1,900 personnel and oversaw a $200 million operating budget. He also was 

responsible for the Dade County Emergency Management Office. 

Thus, Mr. Paulison has the kind of experience and background that 

our report strongly recommends for Federal emergency management leaders. 

A past president of the International Association of Fire Chiefs, 

Mr. Paulison has earned the respect of firefighters and emergency 

managers across the country. His nomination has the endorsement 

of that organization, as well as of the National Emergency Management Association, and several other groups. 

I look forward to hearing from him on what has been done to 

remedy the specific problems Katrina exposed and, even more important, to prepare for the 2006 hurricane season, such as improvVerDate 0ct 09 2002 12:18 Nov 17, 2006 Jkt 028249 PO 00000 Frm 00006 Fmt 6633 Sfmt 6633 C:\DOCS\28249.TXT SAFFAIRS PsN: PAT
3

ing evacuation plans, commodity tracking and replenishment, coordination with local, State, and other Federal agencies, communications interoperability, and temporary housing. 

We will also discuss other important issues, from the over reliance by the Agency on sole source contracts to preparations for 

other types of disasters, not only terrorist attacks but also those 

that our Nation has yet to experience, such as a pandemic disease. 

I thank Mr. Paulison for his continuing commitment to public 

service, and I welcome him back to the Committee today. 

Senator Lieberman. 

OPENING STATEMENT OF SENATOR LIEBERMAN 

Senator LIEBERMAN. Thank you very much, Madam Chairman, 

and welcome, Chief Paulison, to this hearing on your nomination 

to officially become the Under Secretary for Federal Emergency 

Management at the Department of Homeland Security—in effect 

FEMA—an agency that, as you know, Senator Collins and I would 

like to work to rebuild, to strengthen, and ultimately to rename. 

Chief, your background has clearly helped you prepare for the 

challenges that you are going to face in this position. As Senator 

Collins has said, and I want to restate it because it is so important, 

you have more than 30 years experience as a firefighter in the 

Miami-Dade County Fire Department. You rose through the ranks 

to become Chief with oversight of the County’s Office of Emergency 

Management. You led the U.S. Fire Administration, briefly served 

as Director of FEMA’s Preparedness Division, and have now served 

as FEMA’s Acting Director since September 2005. 

I do not think there are many people who would disagree with 

the contention that many of the problems that we, on this Committee, and the Nation, saw in FEMA’s response to Hurricane 

Katrina were the result of a management team there that did not 

have the same professional experience in emergency response and 

management that you have. That is one of the reasons our Katrina 

Report recommends that the leadership of this new authority that 

we would like to build up from FEMA have sufficient and relevant 

experience, as you do. 

I want to say here publicly that I also appreciate many of the actions that you have taken as Acting Director of FEMA—your hiring 

goals to bring the Agency to full strength; your plans to pre-position relief supplies better throughout areas that are presumed to 

be hit by hurricanes; and your programs to equip your personnel, 

and other personnel, better. 

Although these initiatives will help us prepare better, I know you 

will agree we have far more work to do, especially as we head into 

a hurricane season that experts have ominously warned favors 

more catastrophic storms in both the Gulf Coast and, I might say, 

along the East Coast getting closer to the neighborhoods of Senator 

Collins and myself. 

Bottom line: We need a strong FEMA with a strong manager 

leaning into the wind, not being blown apart by it. And I have confidence that you can be and will be that person. 

I know that there are those who believe FEMA should be a separate agency again and take it out of DHS. Our Committee’s investigation found, frankly, that FEMA was never prepared for a catasVerDate 0ct 09 2002 12:18 Nov 17, 2006 Jkt 028249 PO 00000 Frm 00007 Fmt 6633 Sfmt 6633 C:\DOCS\28249.TXT SAFFAIRS PsN: PAT
4

trophe of Katrina’s scope and intensity. And although it served the 

Nation well in previous years, particularly during the 1990s, it was 

not able to deal with every natural disaster of the 1990s as we had 

wanted. 

If you move FEMA out of DHS, you are not doing anything to 

strengthen FEMA. In fact, you are weakening it. You are isolating 

it from the resources it needs and from its collegial agencies within 

DHS that it must work with in a time of disaster. 

So I feel very strongly that what we need is more integration and 

coordination, not less, to strengthen America’s emergency response, 

prevention. and recovery capability. 

I know that you agree with the Chairman and me that emergency management must remain within DHS. However, we need 

much more, I want to say to you, than FEMA is now capable of 

delivering. And we have to work together with you to give you that 

capacity as we go forward. 

I would like to briefly add a word about the ongoing Katrina recovery. I want you to know, Chief, and you will not be surprised 

by this, that on this Committee we continue to receive reports of 

inadequate planning, poor coordination, inflexible guidelines, and 

still some ineffective communication on the part of a few FEMA 

personnel. 

I know that some of your recovery programs were not created for 

a catastrophe of Katrina’s proportions, which is why the Chairman 

and I introduced legislation immediately after the storm to address 

some of the most pressing needs. 

One of the most essential proposals was to give the President the authority to waive the $26,200 individual assistance cap. Unfortunately, that legislation was rejected. Nearly 14,000 people impacted 

by Katrina have now reached that cap and need additional assistance. This is an example of one of the additional resources and capacities that I think FEMA needs to manage successfully during 

long-term recovery efforts for communities and for individuals. I 

hope we can have your support as we develop some of those more 

effective approaches. 

Finally, some problems cannot wait. For example, as you know, 

FEMA recently gave 30-days eviction notice to some evacuees still 

living in apartments and trailers. These are Hurricane Katrina 

evacuees. Evacuees and local officials are expressing frustration 

and some anger on the argument that we cannot abandon these 

people now. I hope you will indicate to us during the hearing the 

ways in which you will move forward with the recovery in a fair 

and just manner. 

But bottom line, it seems to me that you are a good and able 

man to be put into this tough position. You will have the support 

of the Members of this Committee, certainly of both parties, as we 

go forward to prepare America to respond to all hazards and all 

disasters much better than our government did in response to 

Katrina. 

I want to apologize in advance. There is a joint session of Congress at 11 a.m. to hear Prime Minister Olmert. I have been honored to be asked to be on the escort committee to bring him into 

the hall. He probably would come into the hall whether I was there 

or not, but I would like to be there personally. 

5

So I am going to file some questions with the Committee and 

have confidence that Senator Collins and other Members will probably ask some of the questions that I would have asked. 

I wish you the best, Chief, and I look forward to working with 

you. Thank you. 

Chairman COLLINS. Thank you, Senator Lieberman. 

Before calling on the rest of my Senate colleagues for their opening statements, I am going to ask their indulgence while I call on 

Congressman Shaw for his introduction because he does have a 

tight schedule and needs to get back to the House. 

Congressman, we are very pleased to have you here this morning. Please proceed with your introduction. 

TESTIMONY OF HON. E. CLAY SHAW, JR., A REPRESENTATIVE 

IN CONGRESS FROM THE STATE OF FLORIDA 

Mr. SHAW. Thank you, Senator Collins, and I will be joining my 

friend, Senator Lieberman, as part of the escort committee in just 

a few moments so I will also be leaving this hearing. 

Chairman Collins and Ranking Member, Senator Lieberman, it 

is my distinct pleasure to appear before you and the rest of your 

Senators to introduce a man whose job it is to answer America’s 

alarms. 

As you know, David Paulison was appointed Acting Director of 

the Federal Emergency Management Agency by President Bush in 

September 2005. He ascended to that position as we began the difficult and demanding process of recovering from Hurricane 

Katrina, one of the worst storms in our Nation’s history. 

The term natural disaster does not even begin to describe the 

devastation that was wrought by not only just Katrina but also the 

major storms that followed, Hurricanes Wilma and Rita. Mr. 

Paulison rose to the occasion to lead our Nation’s relief and recovery efforts. 

David Paulison has long been a constituent of mine, and I personally supported him to be named permanent director of FEMA 

last fall because of his proven ability to meet major challenges 

head on through his effective leadership, remarkable management 

skills, and thorough approach. 

Before joining FEMA, Mr. Paulison, who has 30 years of fire and 

rescue experience, was Chief of the Miami-Dade Fire and Rescue 

Department. In that position, he oversaw 1,900 personnel with a 

$200 million operating budget and a $70 million capital budget. 

He also oversaw the Dade County Emergency Management Office, which I have visited several times. I can tell you firsthand 

that Mr. Paulison kept a well-organized and efficient Emergency 

Management Office in South Florida, which I also say is one of the 

most technically advanced in the entire country. 

He began his career as a rescue firefighter and rose through the 

ranks of rescue lieutenant commander, assistant chief, and then 

deputy for administration before becoming Miami-Dade Fire Chief. 

He is also a certified paramedic. 

As Fire Chief, he oversaw the Miami-Dade Urban Search and 

Rescue Task Force. His emergency management expertise includes 

major disasters such as Hurricane Andrew and the crash of 

ValuJet Flight 592 into the Florida Everglades. 

6

Knowing David Paulison and having worked with him in the 

past, I can tell you that he does not want this job because it is 

easy. There is nothing easy about the job of the FEMA Director, 

and he knows full well that every step he takes will be secondguessed by the Congress of the United States. He wants this job 

because of challenges and because of his passionate belief that 

America can not only survive times of tragedy but has the strength 

to rise above them and be strengthened by the tragedies that we 

experience. 

As you deliberate today and consider this important Senate confirmation, I hope you remember that for the last 30 years David 

Paulison has been the guy who runs into the fire. He should be 

honored and respected during his confirmation process for his distinguished service to his Nation in times of tragedy and crisis, 

which I am sure will be the case. 

Our neighborhoods, our communities, and our dependency is on 

his leadership. 

I might say, Senator Collins, your mention of wanting strength, 

effectiveness, and experience is exactly what David Paulison is all 

about. As Chairman of the Florida Delegation, it is my great honor 

to introduce to you the Acting Director of the Federal Emergency 

Management Agency, David Paulison. 

Chairman COLLINS. Thank you, Congressman Shaw, for taking 

the time this morning to introduce the nominee. Senator Voinovich. 

OPENING STATEMENT OF SENATOR VOINOVICH 

Senator VOINOVICH. Thank you, Madam Chairman, for holding 

this important hearing. 

The position of Under Secretary for Federal Emergency Management is an enormous responsibility, particularly during a time 

when our Nation faces seemingly constant hazards in the form of 

both natural disasters and terrorist threats. It is critical that the 

Under Secretary for Emergency Management be an individual with 

experience, skill, leadership, and integrity. Chief Paulison, I believe 

you possess these qualities, and I am pleased you are here today. 

During Chief Paulison’s recent visit to my office, we discussed 

the challenges facing FEMA. I was impressed with his background, 

and I believe he is the right man for the job. Leading FEMA 

through this time of transition will be an undertaking of monumental proportions. Chief Paulison, your willingness to take on this 

task speaks volumes about your character. I thank you for accepting this challenge, and I thank your family for the sacrifices that 

they have made and they are going to be making so that you can 

put in the long arduous hours that will be required. Unfortunately 

that job is a 24/7 operation. Again, that is a big responsibility and 

a great sacrifice to your family. 

I also want to take a moment to recognize all of the FEMA employees for their hard work and sacrifices, performing what they 

must feel like is a thankless job. Emergency management is important work, and our Nation owes much gratitude to the men and 

women of FEMA who have assisted capably in the response to disasters in my home State of Ohio, as well as home States of all of 

my colleagues. 

7

Chief Paulison, I look forward to learning of your intentions for 

revitalizing FEMA. As you know, the Members of this Committee 

will be actively engaged in oversight of FEMA’s progress. I encourage you to be as candid as possible with this Committee, to let us 

know what Congress might do to assist you in turning the Agency 

around. 

Thank you, Madam Chairman. 

Chairman COLLINS. Thank you, Senator. Senator Akaka. 

OPENING STATEMENT OF SENATOR AKAKA 

Senator AKAKA. Thank you very much, Madam Chairman. 

Mr. Paulison, welcome back to the Committee, and I also want 

to add my welcome from the Committee to your family that are 

present here this morning. I want to tell you that it is great to see 

you again. 

Mr. Paulison, one of my primary concerns is FEMA’s budget. 

During the Committee’s hearings on Hurricane Katrina, former 

FEMA Director Michael Brown testified that FEMA was underfunded during his tenure. Yet Mr. Brown never reported these 

budget issues to Congress, and we learned of his concern only after 

he resigned from FEMA. 

Mr. Paulison, as the Director of FEMA, you will be charged with 

ensuring that the Nation is prepared to respond to Federal disasters. If the President’s budget jeopardizes that mission, it is your 

responsiblity to inform Congress. I know you will take that responsibility seriously. 

I also believe that FEMA’s budget problems have been compounded by its placement under the DHS umbrella. Just last week 

the House Appropriations Committee passed a bill to decrease 

FEMA’s fiscal year 2007 budget by $325 million from current 

spending levels. If FEMA is not a funding priority now, during the 

first budget cycle after Hurricane Katrina ravaged the Gulf Coast, 

it never will be. 

Another issue is the preservation of the FEMA Pacific Area Office, which is located in Honolulu. When we met in my office last 

week, you made it clear that you understand the importance of 

having a FEMA office in the Pacific, and I appreciate your support 

and your comments there. 

Like many others, I was dismayed, and we spoke about this 

when Project Impact, a FEMA disaster mitigation program that encouraged community preparedness—and I want to say this slowly—through public-private partnership, was discontinued in 2001. 

Project Impact was replaced with the Pre-Disaster Mitigation 

Grant program, PDM, which fails to offer the same sustained partnership between FEMA and local communities. Nor does it provide 

the same level of private sector involvement as Project Impact. And 

I intend to look for ways to improve upon the PDM program to revive these partnerships. And I hope, if confirmed, you will work 

with me on this effort. 

I want to commend you for your background and experiences, 

which I feel are key in carrying out your duties as Director of 

FEMA. I also commend you for your commitment to public service 

and emergency management. I hope your tenure will do much to 

restore respect for men and women for FEMA. 

8

Thank you very much. 

Chairman COLLINS. Thank you, Senator. Senator Dayton. 

OPENING STATEMENT OF SENATOR DAYTON 

Senator DAYTON. Thank you, Madam Chairman. 

Mr. Paulison, I welcome you to the Committee and to your assignment. 

I started my career in various levels of State, Federal, and local 

governments. So I believe in government. I believe in the importance of its various missions. 

I must say, and particularly in my term here in the Senate, I 

vacillate every day from being a liberal to a libertarian, and sometimes three or four times a day depending on how well government 

is performing or not performing. 

And my experiences with FEMA have left me more often on the 

libertarian side of the coin because of my frustration and the frustration of many of my constituents in getting responses, getting answers, and getting decisions from that agency. 

They talk in business about the moments of truth and those 

being the critical times where a response or a non-response really 

secures or loses a client, a customer, or a supporter for life. 

By the nature of its work, FEMA is dealing with moments of 

truth, where people are in crises, they are in despair, and they are 

afraid. They have lost much or everything that they have worked 

all of their lives to accumulate. They need answers. They need responses. They need sometimes the impossible. But they, most of all, 

need the sense that government and the agencies of government 

are working as allies and bring a certain expertise and a desire, 

a dedication, and a willingness to assist in what they are faced 

with. 

That is the mission of FEMA. It seems clear that is the reason 

that the agency exists. 

My own experience, and it goes really beyond or is really unrelated—its related, but it is separate from New Orleans and the 

Gulf of Mississippi, which have understandably and deservedly 

gathered so much of the headlines and so much of this Committee’s 

and other committees’ attention in the last year. I think that has 

been both necessary and valuable for those of us who have been 

unable to bring that same kind of focus and a spotlight on what 

has happened to FEMA in other parts of the country, such as parts 

of Minnesota, because they do not reach that magnitude. 

But, in my view, while there can be some explanation for the 

magnitude of the disasters in the Gulf overwhelming the response 

mechanisms of FEMA and other agencies, there is not that same 

explanation or excuse for the lack of response, for example, when 

Northwestern Minnesota’s Roseau floods in June 2002, devastating 

that city and the city officials, part-time, many of them unpaid city 

officials, well-meaning, well-intended, and hard-working, spending 

4 years trying to get simple answers out of FEMA. 

So I have a lot of questions and my time has expired, but I appreciate your willingness to take on this task but to really make 

FEMA once again a responsive, responsible agency, it is going to 

require a huge commitment on your part and the support of this 

Congress. I hope it will be forthcoming. 

9

1The prepared statement of Mr. Paulison appears in the Appendix on page 40. 

Thank you, Madam Chairman. 

Chairman COLLINS. Thank you. 

Mr. Paulison has filed responses to a biographical and financial 

questionnaire, answered pre-hearing questions submitted by the 

Committee, and has had his financial statements reviewed by the 

Office of Government Ethics. Without objection, this information 

will be made part of the hearing record with the exception of the 

financial data, which are on file and available for public inspection 

in the Committee’s offices. 

Our Committee’s rules require that all witnesses at nomination 

hearings give their testimony under oath. Mr. Paulison, I would 

ask that you please stand and raise your right hand. 

Do you swear that the testimony you are about to give to the 

Committee will be the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the 

truth, so help you, God? 

Mr. PAULISON. I do. 

Chairman COLLINS. Please be seated. 

Mr. Paulison, I understand that you have some family members 

present today, and I would invite you to introduce them to the 

Committee. 

Mr. PAULISON. I would like to introduce probably my most ardent 

supporter, my wife, Kathy; my daughter Beth, who is my biggest 

cheerleader here; and also home watching is my daughter Amy, 

who is in Chicago; and both of my granddaughters, Isabelle and 

Lilly are both watching. 

Chairman COLLINS. We welcome them all, whether they are here 

in person or with you virtually. It is good to have that support 

here, I am sure. 

Mr. Paulison, I would now invite you to proceed with your statement. 

TESTIMONY OF R. DAVID PAULISON,1 TO BE UNDER SECRETARY FOR FEDERAL EMERGENCY MANAGEMENT, U.S. DEPARTMENT OF HOMELAND SECURITY 

Mr. PAULISON. Thank you, and thank you for allowing me to introduce my family. I appreciate that. 

Good morning, Chairman Collins, Senator Lieberman, though I 

know he had to leave, Senator Dayton, Senator Akaka, Senator 

Voinovich. I appreciate your being here, and I appreciate the support that I have had from each of you in this Committee as I have 

talked to you. 

It is my honor and privilege to come before you today as the 

President’s nominee to be the Under Secretary for Federal Emergency Management at the Department of Homeland Security and 

the Director of FEMA. I am grateful for the confidence and support 

placed in me by President Bush and Department of Homeland Security Secretary Michael Chertoff, and I thank them. And quite 

frankly, I thank you for giving me the opportunity to be here today 

to outline my vision for a strong and robust Federal Emergency 

Management Agency. 

Again, as I thank others, I want to thank my family for their 

support. I think that, as Senator Voinovich pointed out very clearVerDate 0ct 09 2002 12:18 Nov 17, 2006 Jkt 028249 PO 00000 Frm 00013 Fmt 6633 Sfmt 6633 C:\DOCS\28249.TXT SAFFAIRS PsN: PAT
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ly, it is a sacrifice for the family, and they have been my rock as 

I have gone through the last 35 years of serving in an emergency 

management capacity. 

I have served as the Acting Director of FEMA since last September, and I come before you today asking you for your support 

to continue leading FEMA. I make a solemn promise to you and 

the American people. It is my vision here now, and for the future, 

to strengthen FEMA, to strengthen its people, its processes, its capabilities, in order for it to be the preeminent national agency for 

emergency management, answering the call to serve the Nation 

and its citizens in times of need. 

During times of disasters, be they natural or man-made, this Nation’s emergency response capability has been faced with enormous 

challenges in recent years. From the flooding in Houston from 

Tropical Storm Allison, the terrorist attacks of September 11, 2001, 

back to back unprecedented hurricane seasons in 2004 and 2005, 

and a myriad of other disasters that have impacted this Nation, 

the people who dedicate their lives to emergency management have 

responded, at times faltering, but always with a vision of putting 

the lives and welfare of disaster victims first. 

It is with this same outlook of putting others first where I will 

continue my efforts, alongside the dedicated people of FEMA and 

Homeland Security, to accomplish our current priorities and build 

on the future. 

These priorities include preparing not only our Agency but preparing the Nation, be it for the upcoming hurricane season or any 

disaster. We will engage constructively with the emergency management officials, our Federal counterparts, the Department of Defense, and non-governmental organizational partners to maximize 

communication and coordination for all-hazard disaster preparedness, response, recovery, and mitigation activities. 

We will build, within FEMA, a 21st Century competency in operations, logistics, procurement, and communications. We will do all 

of this and, at the same time, restore the pride and spirit of FEMA 

employees and the Nation’s trust in our abilities. 

I believe that, along with the dedicated employees of FEMA, if 

you decide to confirm me, we will accomplish these goals by the adhering to the tenets of leadership, partnership, investment, and a 

solid business approach. 

FEMA will set clear and unambiguous goals, communicate and 

listen effectively, make informed decisions, and demonstrate personal and professional integrity in all that we undertake. 

With what is predicted to be another very active hurricane season just days away, much has already been accomplished toward 

strengthening and retooling FEMA. Since September of last year, 

I have led FEMA through a period of much-needed retooling to 

gear up for the next hurricane or major disaster. Our top three 

areas of improvement have been situational awareness and communications, logistics and commodity management, and victim 

management and assistance. 

In all that needs to be accomplished for strengthening FEMA 

and building it to become the preeminent national-level agency for 

emergency management, all of this cannot be accomplished without 

the Agency’s No. 1 asset, and that is the employees of FEMA. 

11

The employees at FEMA are public servants to the highest degree, and they bring years of expertise in emergency management. 

FEMA is a very proud agency with fine individuals who take great 

pride in their work in this Agency. 

If you decide to confirm me, I will stand before the employees of 

FEMA and ask them to allow me to work hand-in-hand with them 

to move past any negative perceptions that remain from when we 

faltered. Together, I know we will build back the full trust of the 

American people and in doing so make the pride of FEMA employees even stronger than it already is. 

I have laid out a personal mission and a list of priorities in my 

written testimony. As I conclude, I would like to remind the Committee that I started my career with a heart for public service and 

serving others. My commitment to serving others remains strong 

and I am deeply humbled and grateful for the opportunity to lead 

and represent this Agency. I will do my best for the call of America’s leadership to FEMA. 

Thank you very much, and I would be happy to answer any questions you might have. 

Chairman COLLINS. Thank you very much, Mr. Paulison. Your 

heartfelt commitment to public service impresses me and, I am 

sure, the other Members of this Committee, as well. 

We will begin with three standard questions that we ask of all 

nominees and then we will do a first round of questions limited to 

6 minutes each, followed by a second round of questions. 

First, is there anything that you are aware of in your background 

which might present a conflict of interest with the duties of the office to which you have been nominated? 

Mr. PAULISON. Senator, I am not aware of any at all. 

Chairman COLLINS. Second, do you know of anything personal or 

otherwise that would in any way prevent you from fully and honorably discharging the responsibilities of this office? 

Mr. PAULISON. I do not. 

Chairman COLLINS. And third, do you agree without reservation 

to respond to any reasonable summons to appear and testify before 

any duly constituted committee of Congress if you are confirmed? 

Mr. PAULISON. I do. 

Chairman COLLINS. Mr. Paulison, before I turn to policy issues, 

I do want to inform the Members of this Committee that last night 

Senator Lieberman and I became aware for the first time of an 

issue involving certain deductions that you have claimed on your 

Federal tax returns. 

I understand these deductions were claimed based upon the advice of your accountant. But since this is new information to come 

to our attention, I want to share that with our colleagues: Both the 

Minority and Majority staff will be sitting down with Mr. Paulison 

after this hearing and interviewing his accountant to get additional 

information, which we will share with the Members of this Committee, as well. 

Senator Lieberman and I are recommending that we proceed in 

that manner. 

Mr. PAULISON. I support that also, and quite frankly, I just became aware of it last night, also. So I am looking forward to it. 

Chairman COLLINS. Thank you. 

12

Mr. Paulison, yesterday Secretary Chertoff briefed Senator 

Lieberman and me about the steps that the Department has taken 

to improve the preparedness for this year’s hurricane season. You 

have mentioned three areas that have been of particular priority 

to you. Secretary Chertoff has convinced me that there has been a 

lot of work done to pre-stage commodities in greater quantities and 

also at more appropriate locations, and those are positive steps forward. 

There is, however, a great deal of skepticism and concern among 

the victims of Hurricane Katrina about whether or not FEMA really has taken the actions necessary to ensure a far better response 

this year if disaster strikes. 

They point, for example, to the fact that there are still those, in 

Louisiana in particular, that are awaiting temporary housing. The 

individuals in Arkansas point to the unused manufactured housing 

still sitting idle in Hope, Arkansas. I have seen that firsthand. 

Local officials tell us that debris removal still has not been completed. We know from the Army Corps of Engineers that the work 

on the levees is still not finished, increasing the vulnerability of the 

New Orleans area. 

In light of all of the problems that still exist in the recovery stage 

for a hurricane that occurred so many months ago, what assurances can you provide to this Committee that we are, in fact, better 

prepared to respond should any kind of disaster strike this year? 

Mr. PAULISON. I think, first of all, you are asking the right questions. There are a lot of issues out there that we have to deal with 

inside of FEMA. 

However, we have very clearly and very carefully and methodically taken those lessons learned from Katrina. 

First of all, let me back up a minute. Katrina was obviously an 

overwhelming event for everyone, far beyond what FEMA was designed to do. Just take the housing piece. We normally house 3,000 

to 5,000 people a year. In Katrina, we have either provided direct 

housing assistance or monetary housing assistance to over 900,000 

people. That is remarkable. 

You talked about the trailers that we put down. Yes, there are 

people who still do not have them. But we have put over 112,000 

families in travel trailers in just a few months. That is a remarkable housing program. If you just figure 2.5 people in a family, you 

are talking about 250,000 or maybe 300,000 people. That is a significant accomplishment. It was not pretty, and it was rough at 

times. But despite the small size of this Agency and the limited 

scope of what our capabilities were, I think we did an outstanding 

job. 

However, I am not making excuses for anything. We are looking 

very carefully at those things that we know went wrong in Katrina 

and did not go smoothly, quite frankly taking reports that came out 

of this Committee, the one that came out of the House Committee, 

the one that came out of the White House, the IG’s report, the 

GAO report. We are getting a lot of help in identifying some of 

those weaknesses, and we are taking those and putting them into 

several blocks. Particularly, what can we do for this hurricane season and what is it going to take longer term down the road. 

13

Let me touch on a couple of them. Logistics that you mentioned, 

we have tripled and sometimes quadrupled the amount of supplies 

that we had during Hurricane Katrina. We had, I think, 180 truckloads of meals ready to eat before Katrina, and right now we have 

over 770. 

With water, we had 600 truckloads of water before Katrina, and 

now we have 1,500 truckloads. Ice, we had 430 truckloads of ice, 

and now we have 2,000 truckloads of ice, ready in our stock. 

And also, we did an interagency agreement with the Defense Logistics Agency as a backup to all of that in case we even start depleting those supplies. So we are going to have a significantly larger amount of supplies this year than last year. 

Last year we were not able to track any of our tractor trailers 

that left our warehouses on the way to the recovery agency. We 

lost track of trucks for days sometimes. They would end up in the 

wrong place or there was no way to redirect them somewhere else. 

We have put a very sophisticated global positioning system in 

place so all of the tractor trailers coming out of our supply warehouses and all of those out of the Defense Logistics Agency we are 

going to be able to track. Ours particularly, we will be able to track 

real-time on a map. We will know exactly where every truck is. We 

can even call up and have the computer tell us where are all of the 

water trucks? Where are all the meal trucks? Where are all the ice 

trucks? And it will bring those up separately. We are doing things 

like that. 

Communications, a major problem, as your report pointed out, 

during Hurricane Katrina. A break-down in communications between the local community and the State, between the State and 

the Federal Government, and quite frankly inside the Federal Government itself. FEMA was not communicating like it should have 

communicated with the Department of Homeland Security, not 

sharing information on a timely basis. We have fixed that. There 

is a protocol issue in place, and there is also an equipment issue 

in place. We fixed the protocol piece. 

FEMA is part of the Department of Homeland Security, and we 

are going to act like we are part of Homeland Security. We are integrating ourselves into that Agency to make sure we are part of 

it just like the other operating components. I think that is an important thing to say. 

Equipment-wise, we have bought a tremendous amount of satellite equipment for voice and video. I know you have more questions, and I do not want to ramble on, but we are doing a lot of 

things to put in place what were not in place to make sure that 

what happened in Katrina does not happen again. 

Chairman COLLINS. Senator Akaka. 

Senator AKAKA. Thank you very much, Madam Chairman. 

Mr. Paulison, when you and I met last week we discussed the 

importance of the FEMA Pacific Area Office located in Honolulu. 

As you know, last year FEMA considered closing the PAO to cut 

costs. 

I first proposed creating that office in 1991, and since then I will 

tell you that office has really made a difference, not only in Hawaii 

but across the Pacific. I want you to know that I fought its closure 

14

in 2005 by securing a promise from former FEMA Director Michael 

Brown to keep the office open, which he did. 

In our chat we talked about that, and I would like to ask you 

about your feeling about that particular office in Hawaii and the 

Pacific. 

Mr. PAULISON. That is a very important office for FEMA. It gives 

us a connection out there we would not normally have, plus people 

on the ground to respond to disasters in your area. I am committed 

to support that office and keep it open. And we are projected funding it all the way through 2010. So there is no intention at all on 

my part to close that office. 

Senator AKAKA. Thank you very much for your commitment on 

that. 

Mr. Paulison, an issue that has troubled me, and I have mentioned it already, is Project Impact. I understand FEMA considers 

the PDM a replacement for Project Impact, but I am concerned certain benefits of the former program have been lost. For example, 

Project Impact encouraged private sector participation and created 

a structure that fostered ongoing interaction between FEMA and 

State and local communities. And we know this is needed. 

How will you enhance the PDM grants to better utilize the private sector and to provide permanent interaction between FEMA 

and the State and local communities? 

Mr. PAULISON. The PDM process that we are using now, we feel 

is a much fairer process. It is more competitive and takes a lot of 

the politics out of where the dollars go. And also, we have a private 

sector office inside Homeland Security that we are working with 

and will tie into the PDM process. 

However, what I would like to do is to work closely with your office and this Committee on any recommendations that you would 

have for that particular program. 

Senator AKAKA. Thank you. Thank you for that. 

Also, as I said in my statement, I am concerned that FEMA’s 

budget receives inadequate attention and scrutiny while under the 

DHS umbrella. 

We heard from former FEMA Director Brown during the Katrina 

hearings that he had numerous concerns regarding FEMA’s budget 

during his tenure, yet did not report these concerns to Congress. 

I understand the Chairman has already asked you to commit to 

providing information to this Committee if requested. And I would 

like to add to that request by asking for your commitment to notify 

this Committee if FEMA is not receiving the funding allocations 

from DHS and OMB you believe necessary to fulfill your mission. 

I would like to hear your comment on that. 

Mr. PAULISON. You have my commitment to speak to this Committee as honestly and frankly as I possibly can. And the budget 

issue is one of those things that obviously I will. 

One of the biggest budget issues we had was actually for staffing. 

And Congress has given us extra dollars in 2006 and also in the 

supplemental budget to do a lot of hiring, and we are in the process 

of doing this. So we are grateful for that. That is solving a lot of 

our issues, quite frankly, but I really appreciate your concern. 

Senator AKAKA. Mr. Paulison, an issue that has been on my 

radar screen for some time is qualifications for FEMA personnel, 

15

specifically political appointees. Would you share with us what 

background and qualifications you will require if FEMA political 

appointments are made? 

Mr. PAULISON. I think any person coming into FEMA, especially 

at the leadership level, needs to have the qualification to do the 

job. I can give you a couple of examples. I just appointed the Director of Region I, Art Cleaves, who actually was the State of Maine 

Emergency Manager, very well respected emergency manager 

around this country and has done an outstanding job in Maine. 

The Region II Director that I just appointed has been a previous 

regional director and also has a lot of emergency management and 

fire experience. 

I just appointed the Region VI Director, who was the Chief of 

Plano, Texas, Bill Peterson, who has 30 years of service in emergency management. 

So I can just tell you that based on—I can give you examples of 

people that I am bringing in to make sure that those who do come 

in are going to have experience. 

My new Deputy Director was an admiral in the U.S. Coast 

Guard, 25 years of service, ran the Pacific Fleet, tremendous 

amount of operational experience. He is now my new Deputy Director. 

We brought Deidre Lee over from TSA to deal with our acquisition part of it that we so struggled with in Hurricane Katrina. 

So I am bringing experts in that have the experience to do the 

job, and that is the right way to run this organization. 

Senator AKAKA. Thank you for that. And thank you for your responses. I asked that because I know you are here with a great 

background, and experience to boot, and I just want to tell you that 

we are happy to have you here. Thank you. 

Chairman COLLINS. Thank you. Senator Voinovich. 

Senator VOINOVICH. Thank you, Madam Chairman. 

Madam Chairman, I look at this Department, FEMA and Homeland Security, as a former mayor and governor. We have a big immigration problem today in part because the Federal Government 

did not previously provide the needed budgetary resources to secure the border. This week probably we are going to pass an immigration bill. It is going to cost a great deal of money, and it is going 

to put a lot of pressure on the budget of the Department of Homeland Security. 

I believe Congress needs to begin devoting greater attention to 

budgetary priorities and fiscal realities. We continue to reduce 

taxes. Our debt is skyrocketing. The non-defense discretionary 

budget, which is part of your budget, Mr. Paulison, is being 

squeezed. 

And I really think it is important that you and Secretary 

Chertoff come before this Committee and lay the cards on the table 

in terms of whether or not you have the resources to get the job 

done that we are asking you to do. 

In far too many cases, this Congress has asked departments to 

do work and then we do not give them the resources to get the job 

done. And from my way of thinking, if you do not give people the 

resources they need to get the job done, then you are basically tellVerDate 0ct 09 2002 12:18 Nov 17, 2006 Jkt 028249 PO 00000 Frm 00019 Fmt 6633 Sfmt 6633 C:\DOCS\28249.TXT SAFFAIRS PsN: PAT
16

ing them that you do not think very much of the job you have 

asked them to do. 

Madam Chairman, I also think we have to give some serious consideration to the fact that we are asking for the transformation of 

a massive department. Mr. Paulison is a political appointee. He is 

going to be gone with the next Administration. And I think some 

consideration should be given to a chief management officer or 

someone who can carry out the necessary transformation both at 

FEMA and the whole Department of Homeland Security. Because 

when this Administration is over, both you and Secretry Chertoff 

will depart. And goodness only knows what is going to happen in 

the interim period. And the Department cannot afford to be without skilled leadership, especially FEMA, which must be ready 24/

7. 

So I think those are big problems this Committee must examine. 

Chief Paulison, the key to any organization’s success is its workforce, having the right people with the right knowledge and skills 

at the right place and at the right time. As Chairman of the Subcommittee on Oversight of Government Management and the Federal Workforce, I am deeply concerned about the condition of 

FEMA’s workforce. I believe had FEMA devoted more attention to 

human capital management prior to Hurricane Katrina, the Agency’s response to the catastrophe in the Gulf Coast would have been 

more effective, although Katrina went way beyond anything that 

FEMA has faced in the past—I think we had better recognize that. 

FEMA currently has a high vacancy rate and has lost experienced senior career staff and managers. With half of your FTEs 

over 50 years of age, you stand to lose additional skill and talent 

in the coming years to retirement. 

In addition, with all the negative publicity your agency has received in the wake of Hurricane Katrina and now the discussion of 

yet another reorganization of FEMA, I would imagine morale is low 

and is affecting retention and recruitment. 

In short, if confirmed, you will face enormous workforce challenges. Please share your overall vision for improving human capital management at FEMA. How would you address the vacancy 

rates, retention, and succession planning? And how are you going 

to raise morale? 

Mr. PAULISON. I think first of all that is an outstanding observation on your part. One of the biggest issues we are facing right now 

is the staffing of FEMA. The first step is obviously what Senator 

Akaka talked about as far as bringing the right number of people 

on board and the qualification. Because the workers actually start 

respecting the leadership of FEMA, and we are doing that. 

But also, probably more important, is making sure that our organizational staffing is as full as it can absolutely be. I want to go 

into hurricane season with at least 95 percent of our allotted slots 

full. We are working hard toward that. 

I think right now we are probably somewhat less, maybe 85 percent, right in there. But I have 243 people in the pipeline to bring 

aboard so those hopefully will be coming on fairly soon. 

We are working hard. I have tasked our HR department to not 

only use their personnel, but I am getting assistance from HR peoVerDate 0ct 09 2002 12:18 Nov 17, 2006 Jkt 028249 PO 00000 Frm 00020 Fmt 6633 Sfmt 6633 C:\DOCS\28249.TXT SAFFAIRS PsN: PAT
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ple from other departments and even contract support to help recruit and bring people in. 

We just advertised this last week in three major newspapers in 

Washington, Boston, and Philadelphia for hiring to attract people 

to bring in, to bring good people in. 

What I do not want to do is just put bodies in there. They have 

to be good people. But at the same time I have to make sure that 

we move as expeditiously as possible to fill these slots. Our people 

are tired. A lot of them have literally been working 7 days a week. 

So we have to have enough staff going in where there is going to 

be relief for them. 

A major concern for me and it is one of my top priorities, quite 

frankly. 

Senator VOINOVICH. Thank you. 

The last comment I want to make involves the House cuts to Secretary Chertoff’s MAX HR program. If the MAX HR budget is reduced, the Department will not be able to fund this critical personnel program. So I know we are concerned about that. And we 

must ensure that Secretary Chertoff has the money for that human 

resource initiative. 

Chairman COLLINS. Thank you. Senator Dayton. 

Senator DAYTON. Thank you, Madam Chairman. 

It is virtually impossible to run an Executive Branch Agency 

from the legislative side, but that does not prevent any of us from 

trying. 

I was interested about what my friend and colleague, Senator 

Akaka, said about the benefits of the regional office in Hawaii. If 

you are looking for volunteers to eliminate a regional agency, I 

would like to volunteer Region V in Chicago, which I find I cannot 

assess whether that is indicative of the problems with FEMA or 

whether it is an exception, but it is in itself a problem. 

I do not have the time to give you the opportunity to review documents. In fact, I just received the letter myself yesterday from the 

correspondent for the Secretary of Homeland Security, to whom I 

gave a letter about this predicament in Roseau, Minnesota. I handed it to him at the Committee on March 1 of this year. And now, 

after considerable prodding, received a letter almost 3 months 

later. That tells me something right there, if I cannot get a letter 

of response to my inquiry for almost 3 months. 

The letter also indicates that whoever wrote this, I guess it is the 

central office, or at least on behalf of Region V, claims that they 

have not received an appeal of their decision that had to be submitted by the State of Minnesota on behalf of the City of Roseau. 

They had not received it as of the date of this letter, May 23. The 

State’s records are that it submitted the appeal to the FEMA Region V office on or about February 3 of this year. So that is, again, 

a period of 31⁄2 months during which the city thought that the Region V office or the Washington office was reviewing this appeal. 

And according to this document, the appeal has not even been received. 

We are talking about, well I was going to say ludicrous and also 

lunacy. I mean it literally drives—and I know these people in 

Roseau, Minnesota. It is a little town of 2,700 people. It got flooded 

in June 2002, as wiped out as New Orleans was, just being a 

18

smaller city. The whole downtown, everything except the Polaris 

plant, was totally submerged in water. And that survived only because as people lost their homes to the flooding or to the sewage 

backing up, they went and all joined together to sandbag around 

the Polaris plant because that employs 1,900 people. And they 

knew that if that went under, the whole town would basically collapse. 

So these are hard working people, good honest people. No one is 

perfect, but these are straight shooters. And they have tried to deal 

with this bureaucratic black hole for the last 4 years. 

And the nonsensical decisions that are made and foisted upon 

them, and the changing cast of characters. FEMA sends up one 

technical assistance contractor to advise them, and these I guess 

are private contractors hired by FEMA so there is a whole question 

of quality control and consistency of information, just knowledge of 

FEMA’s procedures there. That one person assures them to follow 

these procedures and do not do other things. Then they are told 

subsequently, by the Region V office, that they were supposed to 

have done these and not those. And then FEMA sends up another 

technical assistance consultant, contractor, who then countermands 

what the first one said. And then that one is pulled off the job. 

It is like a Saturday Night Live skit, except it is not funny. And 

meanwhile the clock is ticking. You talk about the next hurricane 

season, we are talking about the Red River which floods regularly. 

This is now the fourth year that they have faced the prospect of 

another devastating flood and they cannot get the flood projects—

they cannot get the formerly existent, now devastated, downtown 

reconstructed. 

It is just staggering, it really is. You are taking on this assignment. I just encourage you to look at it from the ground up. And 

if this is going to be a streamlined, efficient, and effective response 

mechanism of the Federal Government, I do not know whether the 

regional offices are an ally or an obstacle to that objective. There 

has to be some accountability. And there has to be a timeliness of 

response, that people can ask questions and get answers. They can 

ask the same questions of different people and get the same answers. 

They showed me the manual that they were given, basically said 

here is the manual, follow this. It was 4 years outdated. It was factually incorrect. Things have changed. FEMA cannot even publish 

a current manual to give to the local officials that have been devastated by a disaster. 

I just think that the whole thing is so dysfunctional now that I 

supported parts of what the Chairman, Ranking Member, and others have proposed about whether this is reorganized or not under 

one agency or freestanding, to me is secondary to having it reformed internally, streamlined, and consolidated. 

And frankly, if you have unfilled positions, you have an opportunity not to just fill those boxes on an organizational chart with 

new people but doing the same things. You have a chance to 

rethink, something that almost has never been done and almost 

would be a Herculean task in the Federal Government. 

But if we are ever going to get beyond these agencies that are 

so mired in their own bureaucracy and so overburdened with all of 

19

these laws and regulations and everything else that they cannot 

act either in a situation like FEMA, which is an emergency response and by definition has to act. You have an historic opportunity. 

And I just hope you will come back here after I have left but 

come back here and tell these colleagues of mine what is necessary 

to just go from the ground floor up and start to create an agency 

that can be responsive to people. Trust people, hold them accountable, but then allow them to act and give them the resources to do 

so. 

Thank you, Madam Chairman. My time has expired without a 

question. 

Mr. PAULISON. Can I just make one comment? 

What I do want to do, though, is particularly on that one issue, 

Ed Buikema is the Director of Region V, and I am going to task 

him personally to look into the issues you have talked about and, 

if it is all right with you, have him contact your office. 

Senator DAYTON. I will fly to Chicago to meet with him, happily. 

Or if he is out here, I would be happy, in fact, even prefer to meet 

with you and with him after you are confirmed. Thank you. 

Mr. PAULISON. Thank you, sir. 

Senator DAYTON. Thank you. 

Chairman COLLINS. Senator Carper. 

Senator CARPER. Thanks, Madam Chairman. Chief, how are you 

this morning? 

Mr. PAULISON. Fine, thank you. 

Senator CARPER. I am sorry I missed your statement. I certainly 

will read it with interest. Anybody here from your family? 

Mr. PAULISON. Yes, I have my wife, Kathy, behind me and my 

daughter, Beth. 

Senator CARPER. Which one is which? 

Mr. PAULISON. You just made a friend, I can tell. 

OPENING STATEMENT OF SENATOR CARPER 

Senator CARPER. I would say thanks to both of you. Thank you 

for sharing your husband and your father with our country. 

We had an event down in Southern Delaware the other day at 

the beach with a fellow named Jamie Turner, who you may remember. Jamie is head of DEMA, Delaware Emergency Management. 

And he and others in our state send their best wishes to you, and 

regards. 

We talked a bit about readiness for the upcoming hurricane season. We have been blessed in our State, we have not had a real 

head-to-head with a hurricane for about 50 years. I want to say it 

was Hurricane Hazel right around 1954. But it has been a long 

time. 

We have had plenty of tropical storms, a lot of Nor’easters and 

brushes with hurricanes, but nothing real serious. 

I am told that the seawater in the Atlantic Ocean off of our coast 

is a good deal warmer this year. Somebody told me by as much as 

six degrees, which sounds like an aberration. But whether it is six 

degrees or a couple of degrees, it is apparently warmer. 

I wonder what implications that might have for the likelihood of 

a hurricane actually coming to a place where it does not often 

20

come, and that is the DelMarVa Peninsula. We try to be ready, 

thought we were ready on the Gulf Coast for a pitch well 

telegraphed, and that was Hurricane Katrina. It turned out we 

were not ready at all. 

My hope is that we are ready on the DelMarVa Peninsula. But 

I would just ask you what do you think that FEMA might be doing, 

ought to be doing to help prepare for storms in communities like 

ours, where frankly we have been lucky in recent years? 

Mr. PAULISON. First of all, let me just say that you have an outstanding emergency manager in Jamie Turner. He is one of the 

best in the country. It has been a pleasure working with him. He 

is very professional and really knows his job. 

Senator CARPER. It is kind of a small world. Your daughter is 

here. And if you end up as head of FEMA, she will be like first 

daughter or something. But Jamie Turner, who is head of DEMA, 

his daughter is my scheduler. She tells me where to go every day, 

a job a lot of people would like to have. 

Mr. PAULISON. I was just in Miami at the Hurricane Center. We 

kicked off Hurricane Preparedness Week with Max Mayfield and 

had this very discussion you are talking about, about the Gulf 

being warmer. Also, some of the trade winds are not favorable for 

hurricanes moving into the Atlantic. 

So we have to caution ourselves that, although we have to focus 

on the Gulf because of the vulnerability of having 112,000 families 

in travel trailers and the weakness of the infrastructure, we simply 

cannot allow ourselves to neglect the Atlantic Coast where, quite 

frankly, the bulk of hurricanes actually hit. 

And you are right, your State and those around you have been 

very lucky in the last decade or so, couple of decades, about getting 

storms. 

One thing that concerns me is complacency. When you have not 

had a hurricane in a while, people do not necessarily take care to 

prepare themselves for hurricane season, with their 72 hours of 

food and water and medicines. 

Senator CARPER. Ironically, excuse me for interrupting, it is not 

just places where hurricanes have not hit in a while. It is even 

places where they do. 

Mr. PAULISON. That was going to be my next comment. Even in 

South Florida, where we came off of Hurricane Andrew and several 

other hurricanes in this year, what I saw was not a lot of personal 

preparedness. So that concerns me. 

I do have a lot of confidence in your emergency management system, though, your State, Senator Collins’ State, and others up and 

down the East Coast. I think that Hurricane Katrina was a wakeup call for emergency managers across this country, for all of us. 

It is going to be a defining moment this year in emergency management. I see a really renewed interest in people checking to say OK, 

we thought some of the Gulf Coast people were ready and obviously 

they were not. Am I ready? 

A lot of emergency managers are questioning themselves. So I 

think that is happening. 

My concern is the personal. Are they going to evacuate when 

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selves if they are not in an evacuation zone but in a high wind 

zone? 

Some of the messages we are trying to get out is make sure you 

are prepared. We are also doing an evaluation of all of those evacuation plans up and down the Atlantic Coast. Are there good plans 

in place? Are the shelters in place? What routes are they going to 

take? Where are people going to go? Where are they going to stay? 

Those are all important pieces that have to fit together for this system to work. 

Senator CARPER. One of the folks from your team in the Region 

III area was with us at this, really it was a session with DEMA, 

some of our Congressional delegation, the local towns and managers and mayors and so forth. 

The lady who was there from FEMA talked about the repositioning of materials and equipment that maybe had not been 

done before. She talked about 40-foot trailers, 20-foot trailers, and 

so forth that were being positioned now. 

What kind of materials and equipment are in those trailers and 

how can they be helpful? 

Mr. PAULISON. I briefed the staff earlier. We have doubled, tripled, and sometimes quadrupled the number of supplies that we 

had prior to Hurricane Katrina. So we are talking about food, basically MREs and other meals ready to eat, different brands, food, 

water, ice, blue tarps, medical supplies, all of the things that we 

normally have that we will use to respond to a disaster. 

We are really bulking up on those supplies, putting GPS tracking 

systems in the vehicles. And also we are going to have a very aggressive pre-positioning plan. 

At least with hurricanes, we know when they are coming. We 

know when they are coming and pretty much where they are going. 

The 5-day forecast that the Hurricane Center at NOAA is using 

now is as accurate as the 3-day forecast was 10 years ago. So we 

are getting much better at that. 

So we are going to be able to preposition a lot more. We are 

going to be very aggressive in repositioning people, equipment, and 

supplies. 

Senator CARPER. Has my time expired, Madam Chairman? 

Chairman COLLINS. It has. 

Senator CARPER. Is there going to be a second round? 

Chairman COLLINS. We are going to do a second round. 

Senator CARPER. Great. Thanks so much. Thank you. 

Thanks again, and welcome. 

Chairman COLLINS. Mr. Paulison, the attacks on our country on 

September 11 revealed a serious problem with a lack of compatibility of communications equipment used by first responders and 

by local, county, and State governments. Unfortunately, we learned 

again last year, with Hurricane Katrina, that much the same problems still exist. 

In fact, in one parish there were two separate and incompatible 

communications systems being used. 

In November 2001, when you had your nomination hearing to be 

the U.S. Fire Administrator, you were asked at that point about 

the problems associated with achieving interoperability. And you 

called this a ‘‘major issue.’’ And you said, ‘‘I think the long-term soVerDate 0ct 09 2002 12:18 Nov 17, 2006 Jkt 028249 PO 00000 Frm 00025 Fmt 6633 Sfmt 6633 C:\DOCS\28249.TXT SAFFAIRS PsN: PAT
22

lution is a countrywide communications system. We are talking 

about setting up satellites and towers across the country where we 

can have an emergency frequency across the country that everyone 

can tune in to when they have a disaster.’’

You went on to say that the Federal and State Governments 

need to help finance such a system for first responders. 

It is 41⁄2 years later, Mr. Paulison. Are we any closer to making 

real gains in having compatible communications equipment for our 

first responders? 

Mr. PAULISON. I think we are a lot further along. We are not 

where I predicted we needed to go, as far as a nationwide communications system. However, we do have a lot of ability to make our 

radios interoperable with some different types of technical equipment. Inside of FEMA, we have quite a few of that stuff that we 

purchased now where we can go into a local community and help 

them make their radio systems interoperable. 

What you mentioned is rampant across the country. We will have 

the police on 800 megahertz, we will have firemen on UHF, and 

the public workers on VHF, and just all over the place. And when 

it comes to the time of a disaster, there has to be an ability to communicate with each other in some form or another. 

There are different ways to do that. You can do it with swapping 

radios. You can do it with using units that put those together like 

a JPS 1000, and there is a lot of other places to do with protocols 

and things like that. 

I think we are further along. We are not where we need to be. 

This is something we still need to pursue as a country. We have 

a ton of firefighters sitting behind me that are here supporting me, 

and I did not thank them earlier. So thank you, guys, for being 

here. And they are very well aware of this interoperable issue. 

We are making progress. We have our 700 megahertz system out 

there now. But at the same time, we are not where we need to be. 

And I pledge, as far as FEMA is concerned, and I know that Secretary Chertoff is extremely interested in this project. We have to 

develop a nationwide communications plan of how we are going to 

communicate when we have these disasters. 

So I am committed to stick with it. It is something we have to 

do. And we are not quite where we need to be yet. 

Chairman COLLINS. In addition to equipment problems, whether 

it was equipment that did not survive the storm or equipment that 

was incompatible, there was a problem with communications that 

simply involved people not communicating. You touched on this in 

your response to a previous question and in your opening remarks. 

What specifically has FEMA done to ensure that decisionmakers 

across the country have better access to real-time accurate information? It was just appalling for this Committee to learn that officials 

in Washington, that officials at Northern Command, which were responsible for mobilizing military assets, did not know in a timely 

fashion that the levees had broken in New Orleans. That was only 

the greatest example, but that was repeated time and time again. 

I believe that we have made real progress in pre-staging commodities. But if we have not improved the ability for key decisionmakers to understand what is happening on the ground, we will 

not improve the response. 

23

Mr. PAULISON. Senator, you are right on target. What happened 

in Hurricane Katrina, as far as communications, was simply unacceptable. We have put several things in place. I did talk about a 

couple of them. 

One I do want to talk about is situational awareness. We have 

created teams inside of FEMA and also inside of DHS that will be 

prepositioned, pre-deployed. They have the capability of satellite 

communications and land mobile radio communications, including 

video streaming, beam it back to here in Washington and to our 

Joint Field Office. 

I think one of the most important things that I saw during Hurricane Katrina is a lack of—it was not a unified command post 

where everyone participated, including the Federal Government. 

We just had two hurricane exercises at the White House level, one 

at the assistant secretary level. We had one last week at the deputy secretary’s level. There is one today at the Secretary’s level, 

just dealing with the National Response Plan and the importance 

of our Joint Field Office. Now everyone has to be in that place 

doing our planning, our first block of 12-hour planning, then our 

second block of planning, and how we are going to communicate 

with each other. 

That is going extremely well, I have to tell you. So that part is 

going to be fixed. 

The other part is communication with the State. We did not have 

good communications with the State. We fixed a little bit of that 

in Hurricane Rita and then much more so in Hurricane Wilma. 

During Hurricane Wilma, we had up to 30 FEMA people inside the 

State Emergency Management Office. We had people at the Hurricane Center. We had people in some of the key counties around, 

where we knew what was going on, knew what the needs were of 

the State, and could react as quickly as possible. 

So those are the types of things that we are doing because, as 

you pointed out, communication is as important if not more important than anything else. If you do not know what is going on, you 

cannot help. 

Chairman COLLINS. Exactly. Thank you. Senator Voinovich. 

Senator VOINOVICH. Chief Paulison, one of the things that I 

think impacts upon your job is our Federal investment in infrastructure. And I think that Senator Collins and Senator Lieberman 

did an excellent job investigating Hurricane Katrina. 

But I think, as we learned at several EPW Committee hearings, 

that if the Congress had given the Army Corps of Engineers the 

budget that it needed to strengthen the levees, New Orleans might 

not have suffered such severe levee breaches. 

I was shocked to find that the Army Corps of Engineers did not 

have as one of their priorities the protection of life and property. 

Instead, the projects are primarily oriented toward economic considerations. 

I would suggest that there should be better communication and 

alignment between the Army Corps of Engineers and FEMA regarding pre-disaster mitigation and setting priorities. I would be 

interested to hear what you have to say about that. 

My second concern is interoperable communications. I will never 

forget when I was governor of Ohio, I got criticized roundly. We 

24

spent $240 million to put in a new interoperable communications 

system. 

The question I have is, what responsibility does the local and 

State Governments have in terms of putting that into place? And 

what is your opinion of the Federal Government’s role in ensuring 

the States achieve interoperability? Would you support a matching 

program? 

My third concern is the Emergency Management Performance 

Grants. I have been trying to get more money every year for 

EMPG. FEMA is only as strong as the State organizations you 

work with throughout the country. 

I know that our mutual friend, Dale Shipley, has assisted DHS 

in conducting a nationwide preparedness review. I would suggest, 

and maybe you have already thought of it, FEMA could send letters to the governors to let them know they are not where they are 

supposed to be in the nationwide preparedness goal. 

The reason I suggest that is when I became governor of Ohio, we 

did an analysis of the county organizations and found out a lot of 

them were not prepared. We could not get any action. So I sent letters to the county commissioners expressing my concern that they 

were not ready to respond to disasters. And I released the letters 

to the press. And it is amazing, something got done, and the counties began to work toward improving preparedness. 

So I would be interested in your comments on all three of these 

areas. 

Mr. PAULISON. I do have regular communications and meetings 

with the Army Corps of Engineers to make sure that they know 

our issues. I think you have pointed out something accurate. Our 

infrastructure system across this country, a lot of our levees were 

built 50 or 60 years ago. 

My own home State, right around Lake Okeechobee, now we 

found out that we have problems with those levees. 

Sacramento is another one that we were dealing with 3 weeks 

ago because of all the rains we were having. 

A tremendous amount of rain up in the Northeast in three States 

up there, and we are already dealing with assessing declarations 

for those three States. We are working with the Corps very closely. 

Our piece of it is we do not deal with the levees themselves. But 

what we are doing is we are identifying those critical areas, those 

weak areas, and going into those cities and States and helping 

them devise——

Senator VOINOVICH. One of the things that you ought to do is let 

us know what those critical areas are so that Congress can highlight them in terms of priority and also examine whether there is 

an adequate sum of money to address weaknesses. 

Mr. PAULISON. Understood. What we did in Sacramento, per se, 

and then also we are doing in Florida is helping them devise good 

evacuation plans because that is what FEMA does, and making 

sure there is a method to move people out if there is a levee 

breach, where are they going to go? How are they going to be 

housed? So we can step in where we can legally help them with 

some of those things. That is our part in that. Of course, that is 

an aftermath part. But at the same time it is the Corps responsibility for the levees, but we are working with them on that. 

25

Communications, it is a major issue like we talked about earlier, 

about how we are going to communicate with each other. A lot of 

it, quite rightly, does fall in the lap of the local communities. It is 

their radio system. But oftentimes, especially the way sometimes 

the economy is, local communities—especially some of the bigger 

cities that do not have the tax base anymore. You take Philadelphia and Pittsburgh and other places like that where they are losing people out of the inner cities, it is tough for them sometimes 

to come up with the money to develop sophisticated communication 

systems. 

Senator VOINOVICH. The point is, what is the responsibility of the 

Federal Government? And what is the local responsibility? In other 

words, I think we maybe ought to have a match program that says 

if States come up with some of the money for the communications, 

the Federal Government will assist. But the cost should not fall entirely on the back of the Federal Government. Some communities 

want us to pick up the entire tab, but I do not think that is a Federal responsibility. 

Mr. PAULISON. Understood. 

The EMPG, I think you are correct on that, also. Our State emergency managers are the key. It is very difficult for FEMA to come 

in and plug into a system when that system is broken. So it is important for the State emergency managers to be up to speed. 

I just had a conversation 3 days ago with Bruce Baughman, the 

current President of the National Emergency Managers Association, and we are going to be working with them to put together 

some type of an evaluation process where we can go to the States 

and do an assessment of what their capabilities are and find out 

where their weaknesses are and help put that together. 

So we will deal with some of the things you just did, like you 

said in your community, where you did an evaluation of all of the 

counties. 

So we are in a very preliminary conversation with that, but that 

is what they want to do, and we are looking at how we can help 

them do that to find out exactly where we are as far as preparedness across this country. 

Senator VOINOVICH. Thank you. 

Chairman COLLINS. Senator Carper. 

Senator CARPER. Thanks, Madam Chairman. 

Senator Coburn, who may have been here earlier, he and I serve 

as the Chairman and ranking Democrat on one of the Subcommittees of this Committee. 

Last month we were down in New Orleans, we had a field hearing. I think I mentioned this to you when you were good enough 

to come by and visit with me. 

Among the things that we heard about were what sounded like 

a no-bid contract that went out for debris removal. The prime contractor hired a subcontractor, who hired a subcontractor, who hired 

another subcontractor who actually did the work, it sounds like for 

if not pennies on the dollar, nickels on the dollar. And all the different levels of subcontractors got some money out of it. It was dismaying to hear about that sort of thing. 

26

We heard folks talk to us about the blue tarps. And flying around 

down there in the helicopter, we saw plenty of blue tarps. We understand how they can play a valuable, useful role. 

We also heard stories that some of the money spent on putting 

blue tarps on roofs cost almost as much as a new roof might have 

cost. 

We heard from folks who talked about the amount of money that 

was spent on these trailers to come in and provide temporary housing for folks, a lot of whom apparently were not actually used in 

the end. 

It certainly makes us angry, as Members of this Committee and 

Members of the Senate, but it sure makes taxpayers angry, as well. 

Just take a minute and tell me what you, as the Director, can 

do to ensure that kind of thing does not happen again? 

Mr. PAULISON. I think you are recognizing some of the same 

things we are recognizing, particularly with debris removal. We 

know it has been an issue. 

One thing we have done is we have taken away the discrepancy 

in our reimbursement between what we reimburse if you use the 

Corps and what we will reimburse if you use a private contractor. 

They are going to be the same now. Whatever the reimbursement 

is, whether it is 100 percent, 90/10, or 75/25. 

We are also putting together a registry of debris removal contractors, giving the flexibility to the local communities to choose who 

they want to choose. They can either use the Corps, which may 

have to happen at least in the first couple of weeks because generally the local contractors are not up and ready yet, or they can 

choose to use a contractor off the registry or anybody else who is 

qualified to do the job. 

That will give them a tremendous amount of flexibility in debris 

removal and also probably cut down on some of the same issues 

that you just talked about, about three or four contractors in a row 

and the last guy on the end is the one getting paid for it. 

Senator CARPER. Unfortunately, they all get paid something. The 

last guy at the end is actually doing the work. 

Mr. PAULISON. But the bottom guy is not getting paid probably 

as much as he should. 

The blue tarps, they can be expensive sometimes. But quite 

frankly, there is no other option. There simply are not contractors, 

nor are there building materials available, to put a new roof back 

on at that time. And the blue roof is the only option we have. 

I went to Miami over the weekend to visit with Max Mayfield. 

And when I flew in I was amazed at the number of blue tarps that 

are still there. And they talk to people, and they said I cannot get 

a contractor, I cannot get material. If I find a contractor, he cannot 

get shingles or roofing tile. 

I know it took us a while just to get tile for our roof down there. 

Luckily, we did not have any leaks, so it was not a big deal. 

The same thing with the trailers. The trailers can be expensive. 

It is not our first choice in putting people in housing. Unfortunately, it was all we had down there. There was no housing stock. 

There was no place to put people. The travel trailers work extremely well. We can back them up in somebody’s driveway, minimal hookup, hardly any permitting to do that at all, and those 

27

move very quickly. About 80 percent of our people that are in travel trailers are actually in their own driveways, so that works out 

well. 

To do a mobile home park, we have to go and put infrastructure 

in. We have to put water and sewer, electric, security, and lighting 

in. It gets very expensive to do that, and we do not really like to 

do that. 

Unfortunately, particularly in Louisiana and parts of Mississippi, 

we really did not have a choice. If people were going to be housed, 

that is all we had to house them in. 

Senator CARPER. I have a couple of questions I want to give you 

for the record with respect to the trailers, but I will just do that 

for the record. If you would respond, I would be grateful. 

Mr. PAULISON. We will be glad to, sir. 

Senator CARPER. The other thing, I think I heard Senator 

Voinovich talking about communications. When he and I were in 

our old jobs, one of the things we undertook in Delaware was to 

put in place a statewide 800 megahertz radio system to provide for 

interoperable radios for all of the first responders, fire, police, 

State, or DEMA people, National Guard, all kinds of folks. 

It has been difficult to get it to work as advertised, but eventually we have tweaked it and worked with the contractor long 

enough so I think it is a pretty good system today. It has been 

about 7, 8 years, 9 years that we have been working on it. 

We saw a lot of widespread total collapse of communications in 

New Orleans. You and I talked a little bit when you visited with 

me last week about how we can avoid that kind of communications 

failure in the future. 

For the record today, would you just talk about that some more, 

please? 

Mr. PAULISON. I think one of the issues, as we rebuild back some 

of these communication systems, that we harden them so that they 

will withstand some of those winds. Just in Hurricane Andrew we 

lost all of our towers where Hurricane Andrew went through, and 

there was no ability to communicate. We ended up taking a 100-

foot ladder truck and putting a portable repeater and a Honda generator on top of it. And that was our communications for the whole 

south end of the county. 

So as we rebuilt, the new towers that went up were hardened to 

withstand hurricane winds. That is one of the things we need to 

do. But also, we can move in with our MERS system and set up 

temporary communications. We also work with a lot of the private 

contractors to move in, people like Macom and Motorola who can 

move in quickly to help set up a system right away for the local 

community. 

In the short term we can help them do that. We can bring trucks 

in with towers. It is not perfect, but at least they can communicate 

in local areas. So that is some of the things we have to do. 

We can also bring in equipment to help them with their interoperability. We can put their radios together through some of our 

systems, where you can have police, fire, EMS, public works, everybody can talk to each other. 

Again, it is not a perfect system, but right now it is much better 

than what we were just a few years ago. 

28

Senator CARPER. What was the line from the old Paul Newman 

movie, what we have here is a failure to communicate? 

Chairman COLLINS. Cool Hand Luke. 

Senator CARPER. Cool Hand Luke. There you go. 

That is part and parcel of what happened, and Hurricane 

Katrina is part and parcel of what happens in other places, as well. 

We know it is going to be a challenge. We know it is going to happen. We just need to be ready for it. And the State and local governments have an obligation as well. It is not all on your back. 

Thank you for your willingness to serve in this capacity. We look 

forward to working with you. 

Mr. PAULISON. I look forward to working with the Committee, 

also. Thank you very much. 

Senator CARPER. Thanks so much. 

Chairman COLLINS. Mr. Paulison, I want to follow up on an issue 

that Senator Carper just talked to you about on the expensive and 

unnecessary reliance on sole source contracts in the wake of Hurricanes Katrina and Rita. 

FEMA awarded four large sole source contracts to provide temporary housing. Originally, these contracts had ceilings of $100 million. In the fall of 2005, in response to a greater demand for temporary housing, FEMA increased the ceilings on each of these contracts to $500 million. 

When you testified before our Committee, we expressed this concern to you. You said you were no fan of sole source contracts, and 

you indicated that you would get those contracts competed. 

But what happened is while some of the peripheral requirements 

contained in the contracts were stripped out and awarded competitively to small and local businesses, the main portion of the work 

continued to be done by these four large contractors. 

Then, in February 2006, the value of two of these contracts was 

raised again. The largest is now valued at $1.2 billion, and DHS 

has told our Committee that the ceiling is rapidly being approached. 

I think we could all agree that awarding nearly $3 billion in sole 

source contracts does not ensure the best value for the taxpayers. 

What are you going to do for the future to make sure that we do 

not have a situation where literally billions of dollars are going out 

of the door without competition, without any assurance that the 

taxpayers are getting the best price or the best quality? 

Mr. PAULISON. Senator, everything you said is right on target. 

Those four contracts were put in place where they were halfway 

through a bid process. That is not the way to do business. 

We have rebid the four bids. The ones we stripped out, actually 

we ended up taking all of what they were doing locally as far as 

the maintenance, security, breaking down the trailers, those types 

of things, and rebid those out to small and disadvantaged local 

companies. And we ended up giving them, I think 37 companies, 

almost $3.5 billion worth of work at the local community. 

We have since rebid the big contracts. They are out on the street, 

and they will be awarded probably about mid-June, I would guess, 

is where we will award the four big ones, if things go smoothly, as 

I hope they go. 

29

I do stand by my statement. I do not like no-bid. I do not like 

sole source contracts. That is why we got into the place we are 

now. The contracts were not crafted as they probably should have 

been because they were done in a hurry. 

So what FEMA needs to do, and what we are going to do, is to 

make sure we have contracts in place prior to hurricane season as 

much as possible. And not just for the four bids but everything, all 

of our commodities, our food, and our water, all of those types of 

things. Those contracts need to be bid out, awarded, and put on the 

shelf. We can take them off when they are needed. That gives us 

more control over what goes into the contract, more control over 

the contractors’ work and what their responsibilities are. So that 

is what we are doing to fix that problem, and it is so important 

that we do that. 

There may be an occasion where something comes up in the middle of a disaster where we did not have a clue we were going to 

need it and maybe have to do either a no-bid or sometimes there 

are true sole source, where that is the only company that can do 

that. 

But that should be the exception, not the rule, like we have had 

in the past. 

Chairman COLLINS. It should be the exception, but what we are 

talking about here are services and commodities that are easily anticipated. You know you are going to need ice. You know you are 

going to need temporary housing. You know you are going to need 

tarps. You know you are going to need debris removal. 

It is interesting because if you contrast competitive contracts 

issued by counties that planned ahead for debris removal, for example, they are getting far more debris removed at a far lower 

price. So I am pleased to hear that you agree we need to anticipate 

these needs and that you have taken actions to ensure that we do 

so. 

All of us understand the truly unanticipated need or the true 

sole source provider. But that is really not what we are talking 

about in this situation. 

Mr. PAULISON. You are right; we are not. And we do agree with 

you that we should have all those contracts for commodities in 

place ahead of time and not wait until the last minute to do those. 

Chairman COLLINS. To ensure its credibility and to restore the 

public’s confidence in FEMA, FEMA needs to do a good job not only 

with the huge disasters like Katrina but also in responding to 

smaller disasters that still qualify for public assistance and that 

still have an enormous impact on the people who are affected. Senator Dayton has expressed his frustration with one in Minnesota. 

As you know, we recently suffered enormous rain storms in the 

State of Maine. Some small towns were drenched with more than 

12 inches of rain in a very short period of time. That resulted in 

severe flooding, rivers overflowed, streets flooded, dams buckled, 

bridges were washed away. 

The timing of this for coastal Maine has really been a catastrophe. Many of these communities rely on tourism for their economy, and many small gift shops and restaurants had just stocked 

up for the beginning of the Memorial Day summer season, where 

they make most of their money. 

30

Last week, the State of Maine requested a major disaster declaration for Southern Maine. Could you bring us up-to-date on 

when we are likely to hear a decision on that request and what 

FEMA is doing to help the small business owners and also the 

homeowners? Two hundred homeowners were forced to evacuate 

their homes. Again, I realize this is not the scope of a Katrina, but 

it is absolutely devastating for the towns that were affected. 

Mr. PAULISON. No, you are right. If it is your house, it is a disaster, regardless of how many other houses it takes down. I am 

very sensitive to that. 

Actually, we have had staff working all last week and all over 

the weekend, processing not only the declaration from your State 

but the other two States also. They are in our office now, out of 

the regions here, and we are diligently working on them to get 

them out as quickly as possible. We are very sensitive to the economic impact it is going to have. So we will process them absolutely as quick as possible. 

And by the way, our regional directors up there have been working very closely with all three States and have had great cooperation to find what their needs are, and we are right there with it. 

The timing, the fact that I am coming in front of your Committee 

was also significant. So we are moving as diligently as possible, 

Senator. 

Chairman COLLINS. I am going to be talking to the governor in 

an hour from now. Do you have any idea when we might hear 

whether or not the declaration has been approved? 

Mr. PAULISON. I really cannot. I just need to go back and look 

at it. I was kind of getting prepared for this Committee. I did get 

briefed early this morning, and we do have all the stuff and have 

all of the packages. They all look like they are in good shape, so 

we are going to process them as quickly as possible. Just share 

that with the governor, and we will be glad to call him as soon as 

we are ready. 

Chairman COLLINS. Thank you. Senator Voinovich. 

Senator VOINOVICH. I have a couple of questions. 

In the wake of Hurricane Katrina, it seems the pendulum has 

swung away from terrorism and back toward natural disasters, 

with FEMA focusing significant attention on hurricane preparedness and response. Is FEMA maintaining an all-hazards approach? 

How will you work to ensure that the Agency achieves readiness 

for all threats, whether man-made or natural disasters? 

My other question concerns FEMA’s absorption into DHS. There 

are some people that have said that the merger with DHS has really hurt FEMA. Do you believe FEMA’s absorption into DHS hurt 

FEMA? If so, do you believe that the damage was a result of structural change or poor management? 

If you are confirmed as Under Secretary, what will you do to better integrate FEMA into the Department? 

Senator Collins and Senator Lieberman have some suggestions 

on reorganization. But I know from talking to Secretary Chertoff, 

he has indicated to me that you are just having a hard time doing 

what you are doing right now. 

I think the key is to continue integrating FEMA into the Department of Homeland Security and ensuring that you are utilizing all 

31

of the resources and that you are prepared for not only natural disasters but also for—hopefully we will not have to respond to one—

a terrorist attack. 

Mr. PAULISON. I am absolutely committed to the all-hazards approach. That is the right way to respond. It does not matter whether an earthquake takes a building down or a terrorist blows it up. 

The response is the same. The building comes down differently, but 

the response is exactly the same from the local level, from the 

State, and from the Federal Government. 

So it does not make sense to say this is for hurricanes, this is 

for something else. We are going to take the all-hazards approach 

and continue taking that because that is the right thing to do. 

On the other part, I will speak from my experience. I am not 

going to point fingers at anybody else as to what happened in the 

past. But I can tell you that being part of the Department of Homeland Security has been a tremendous asset for me personally in 

helping put FEMA back together. The resources inside Homeland 

Security that I can depend on that are right at my fingertips, Coast 

Guard, ICE, Border Patrol, Secret Service, all of those operational 

components, I meet with them every week, and we discuss these 

issues. 

Literally every week we have an hour-and-a-half meeting on how 

we are going to continue to coordinate, how we are going to share 

resources. And quite frankly, they are all personally, every one of 

the directors have personally offered their assistance in helping get 

FEMA back on its feet again. 

So for me it has been phenomenal. The support that I have gotten out of Secretary Chertoff and Deputy Secretary Michael Jackson has been remarkable. The amount of time they have put in 

working with me, helping us put the retooling system together. 

We meet with the Secretary every week for about 2 hours, going 

over the retooling, he is making sure that we are on track, what 

our needs are, where are our shortfalls, where are we doing well, 

where are we not doing well? So I could not ask for better support. 

With the deepest, and I mean this sincerely, the deepest respect 

to this Committee, reorganizing FEMA right now is not the right 

thing to do. We are still in the process of putting this organization 

back together. I think that I am on the right track. I think that 

you will see that the response that we have this year will be significantly different than we have had in the past. And I would just 

ask that you allow me to continue working with you on these 

issues. 

Your report is going to be a tremendous help for us. It is obvious 

that this Committee and your staff has a tremendous amount of 

knowledge that we can glean based on the investigation that you 

have done. So we want to continue working with the Committee 

through this next year. 

Senator VOINOVICH. I would just like to say that I would like to 

have what you are doing in writing. 

Mr. PAULISON. Are you talking about the retooling effort? 

Senator VOINOVICH. Retooling and integration and how you are 

proceeding. 

Mr. PAULISON. We can do that. Yes, sir. That is not a problem. 

Senator VOINOVICH. Thank you. 

32

Chairman COLLINS. Senator Carper. 

Senator CARPER. Madam Chairman, I apologize for being sort of 

in and out of the room. You are competing with the Prime Minister 

of Israel, Prime Minister Olmert, who is addressing at this moment 

a joint session of the Congress. In fact, he just has concluded his 

remarks. 

The fact that we were here bears testimony to how important we 

believe—I acknowledge that the situation in the Middle East is important. I know it is to my two colleagues here and to me. But this 

is enormously important as well. So we are delighted to be here to 

have this opportunity to have this exchange. 

My staff informs me, Chief, that next week the four national contractors who have been installing and maintaining FEMA trailers 

for those dislocated by Hurricanes Katrina and Rita will turn over 

the maintenance of those trailers to smaller local companies. I also 

understand the turnover will be handled in phases through the 

month of June. 

And while I strongly support moving away from the no-bid contracts that we talked about earlier, that were awarded earlier in 

the recovery, and supporting local businesses, we want to make 

sure that this turnover is a smooth one. I am sure you do, too. 

I do not know to what extent you are familiar with this, but if 

you are able to, can you just give us a minute or so and explain 

how FEMA will manage this kind of turnover? 

Mr. PAULISON. This is a concern of everyone. We cannot just 

have one company move out and another move in. The four big contractors are still there, doing the haul and install, for a short period of time anyway. But they are committed to make this transition as smooth as possible. 

We are transitioning out the maintenance, the day-to-day maintenance of the trailers and mobile homes. We are transitioning out 

the security. We are transitioning out all of those types of things 

to do with the breakdown of the trailers and things like that and 

bringing a lot of these small companies on board to do it. 

I think I told the Committee earlier we have, I think, 35 or 37 

companies that are going to receive bids for about $3.5 billion 

worth of work. It is going to be significant for the local community 

to get these type of dollars in there and put that money actually 

where it belongs. 

We are working very hard to make sure the transition is smooth. 

We will have our contracting officers down there, also, to make it 

as smooth as possible. 

You were out of the room, but we have also rebid those big nationwide contracts. 

Senator CARPER. Good. 

Mr. PAULISON. Those are out on the street. And we will have—

I cannot say we will have new contractors because these people 

have the right to compete also. But we will have new contracts in 

place that are much better written and will be much better managed than the ones we have had in the past. 

Senator CARPER. Good. 

I said a minute ago I support the idea of giving contracts to local 

businesses if they are able to do the work. However, we want to 

33

make sure that the services that we contract for are provided and 

we contract with qualified businesses. I know you share that view. 

I understand there may be some concern on the ground, at least 

in Louisiana, that some of the companies taking over the trailer 

maintenance contracts may not be the most qualified. You have 

sort of spoken to this, but I am going to ask you to address it 

again. 

Can you explain how companies that bid for FEMA contracts are 

vetted? And how, for example, a bookkeeping company might have 

been found qualified to manage a multimillion dollar trailer maintenance contract? 

Mr. PAULISON. I am not quite aware of that one, but I will check 

into it. I do not get into the nitty-gritty of those types of things. 

We have professional contracting staff that we are using, and not 

just out of FEMA. We have people from other agencies that are 

helping us, GSA and some others, to go through to vet through this 

list of people who bid because quite a few people bid on these contracts. 

I have to have confidence in the staff that they are picking qualified contractors. 

Again, if you have individual ones that I need to check on, I will 

be glad to do that. I simply do not have the time to get that deep 

into the woods sometimes. 

Senator CARPER. I understand. 

Mr. PAULISON. Thank you, sir. 

Senator CARPER. Those are my questions. 

Again, Chief Paulison, thanks for being with us. Thanks for your 

service to our country. And to your family, thank you for sharing 

your husband and father with us. 

Thank you. 

Chairman COLLINS. Thank you, Senator. 

Mr. Paulison, I just have a few more questions. I actually have 

many more questions, but I am only going to ask you a few of 

them. 

One difficult issue that FEMA faces is the appropriate role for 

FEMA vis-a-vis State government vis-a-vis local government. 

On the one hand we have always had a bottoms-up emergency 

management system with substantial responsibility placed at the 

local and State level. On the other hand, we have the reality that 

some States, such as the three of ours, do a better job than other 

States in carrying out their responsibilities. 

Obviously, you do not want to create a perverse incentive for 

States to abandon their responsibilities. You want to make sure 

they are making the investment, that they are not just relying on 

the Federal Government to completely take over emergency management. 

But on the other hand, you have the reality of a State like Louisiana, which has admitted that it is not prepared for this hurricane season. What do you do if the Federal Government steps in, 

as it really must because it cannot allow people to suffer? It takes 

pressure off Louisiana or other States to make the kinds of investments and do the planning that needs to be done. 

In a March 31 letter to you, the Director of the State of Louisiana’s Office of Homeland Security and Emergency Preparedness 

34

candidly lists several vulnerabilities in Louisiana’s emergency plan. 

It is really quite striking when you read how ill prepared Louisiana 

is. 

I think all of us are sympathetic that the State of Louisiana is 

still devastated by the hurricane. But let me just read you one example. The letter reads, ‘‘We expect that between 200,000 to 

300,000 people may need to be provided with shelter in the event 

of a regional evacuation from the Southeast portion of the State. 

The State of Louisiana currently has shelter capacity for approximately 80,000.’’ It does not come close to meeting what Louisiana 

predicts would be the projected need. 

There is also a discussion about the number of nursing homes 

and the lack of an adequate plan to evaluate nursing homes. To me 

the most tragic testimony that we received during our hearings 

was learning of the failure to evacuate nursing homes which 

caused the loss of dozens of lives needlessly in Louisiana and was 

such a contrast with Mississippi, which did evacuate its nursing 

homes. 

This letter outlines tremendous needs for pre-storm assistance 

and evacuation, in the aftermath of the storm in sheltering, in 

transporting people with special needs. What do you see as the appropriate role for FEMA for responsibilities that usually are done 

by State and local governments when you have a State admitting 

that it cannot possibly cope? 

Mr. PAULISON. That letter was actually precipitated by a visit by 

Under Secretary Foresman and myself down to Louisiana to meet 

with the State emergency manager, the emergency manager of 

New Orleans, the emergency managers of four or five of the parishes were there, to have a closed-door, no kidding, what can you 

do and what can you not do. And that is when we received that 

letter. 

I put two technical assistance teams down there to start working 

with them, developing their evacuation plans, identify some of 

these shortfalls and where we can step in and assist them as they 

build the system back up again, to identify some of the things you 

just talked about. 

It is a fine line you walk. The bottom-up system that you talked 

about, I mean all response is local. Nobody wants the Federal Government, nobody wants the State to come in. I came from the local 

community, and I do not want anybody taking over my community. 

But the system that we have used for the last 30 years, where 

you wait for the city to fail or the community to fail and then the 

State comes in, and you wait for the State to fail and then the Federal Government comes in and let them fail, simply is not good 

enough. 

What we are doing, we are going to be leaning very far forward, 

not taking over from any State, obviously. We are not going to do 

that, but be right there by their side as we go through this process, 

as we go through a disaster to make sure so we can identify where 

those issues are before there is a failure and bring in Federal resources to help the State and help the local communities. 

That is where we have to do this, particularly when you have a 

State like Louisiana that is extremely vulnerable, and Mississippi 

also now because of the numbers of people in travel trailers. It is 

35

extremely vulnerable, has a lot of issues they have to deal with 

that they would not normally have to deal with, like some of the 

massive evacuations. We have to simply be there by their side. And 

that is what we are going to do. 

We have committed to the State of Louisiana that we are going 

to do that. There is actually an exercise going on right now as we 

speak down there that we are participating in with them. Quite 

frankly, I just got some reports back just before the meeting. There 

are some problems. But that is good. We want to find all those 

problems now, during a drill, as opposed to waiting for an actual 

disaster. 

Chairman COLLINS. Mr. Paulison, I know you are familiar with 

our report and our 88 recommendations. I also understand that you 

are busy focusing on this year’s hurricane season and improving 

preparedness and response. 

Some of our recommendations require legislation, such as the reforms of FEMA. But there are 36 recommendations that FEMA 

could implement without legislation. Some of them are smaller recommendations, but still ones that would make a difference. 

For example, publishing the long overdue field operations manuals, and establishing the regional task forces, or strike teams. That 

is a major one. Reforming and revising the National Response Plan 

to make the lines of authority clearer. 

I would ask that you pledge to report back to this Committee as 

soon as possible with your plans on implementing these recommendations. Tell us which ones you agree with, which ones you 

disagree, and what are your plans to go forth with the ones that 

you do support. 

Will you pledge to do that? 

Mr. PAULISON. Actually, your staff gave me the list as I was sitting here so I have it right in front of me. Yes, I do pledge to do 

that. That is the right thing to do. 

The 88 recommendations are significant. Your report is extremely thorough. It showed a tremendous amount of work by this 

Committee and the staff. We are going to take it very seriously. 

Chairman COLLINS. Finally, I want to follow-up on an issue that 

Senator Voinovich raised, and that is the reform of FEMA. As you 

know, our report recommends a complete restructuring of FEMA 

with new authority, with the restoration of responsibility for preparedness and grant making. I understand your qualms about proceeding with a reorganization, although I would caution you that 

there are considerable risks in proceeding with a flawed organization as well. 

I want to focus on an issue that Senator Voinovich touched on 

to make sure that we get a clearer answer for the record. As you 

know, our Committee concluded that DHS is the proper home for 

FEMA and that otherwise you would end up taking what is now 

a weak agency out of a department that should be providing support. There should be synergies, such as you have mentioned with 

the Coast Guard, with the law enforcement agencies. I think you 

would also end up having a duplication of effort because you would 

have to reconstitute within DHS some sort of response agency to 

take care of mass casualties if there were a terrorist attack. 

36

I strongly support keeping FEMA or its successor agency within 

DHS. Given your 30 years of emergency management experience, 

I want to ask for your judgment, for the record, on whether or not 

FEMA should remain part of DHS? 

Mr. PAULISON. I would be happy to do that because I said it earlier, and I will repeat it again. FEMA belongs inside of DHS. There 

is a significant amount of resources that are at our fingertips, not 

only for retooling FEMA but also in response. 

Again with how you saw the Coast Guard operated, Border Patrol, ICE, all of those operational components inside of FEMA right 

there at our fingertips. We do not have to mission assign. We do 

not have to go through another secretary. We simply just pick up 

the phone and say I need this there, and it happens. That is a tremendous asset for us. 

I have developed a personal relationship with the other operational components inside FEMA. We meet once a week and discuss some of these issues. So I am firmly convinced that FEMA 

needs to be inside of DHS, and I will stand by that. The Secretary, 

quite frankly, supports me on that issue. 

Chairman COLLINS. Thank you. 

I think you are right on that point. You need, however, to reconsider the issue of reforming FEMA, but I think you are absolutely 

right. I think the best evidence is the performance of the Coast 

Guard. By all accounts, the Coast Guard was a star in responding 

to Katrina, and yet the Coast Guard is part of DHS. 

I think those who believe that it is the location of the agency 

that determines whether or not it functions well are really missing 

the point, so I appreciate your clear statement in response to my 

question. 

Mr. PAULISON. And they did such a good job, I stole Admiral 

Johnson from them. 

Chairman COLLINS. I saw that, as your Deputy. 

Again thank you. I do anticipate that there will be additional 

questions submitted for the record by Members of the Committee. 

Senator Voinovich, do you have any closing questions or comments you would like to make? 

Senator VOINOVICH. The comment I would like to make is that, 

after sitting through all of the things we discussed today, why anybody would want the job? 

Mr. PAULISON. My wife said what are you thinking? 

Senator VOINOVICH. But in all seriousness, I think you have a 

wonderful opportunity to start a new chapter for FEMA in its relationship with the Department of Homeland Security. 

If you really want to make a contribution to this country, and I 

sense that you do, I ask that you be as candid with Congress as 

you possibly can be. 

If you have concerns, whether budgetary or operational, I expect 

that you will come forward to the Committee either publicly or privately to let us know. 

I think the Chairman and Members of this Committee want to 

do everything we can to help you and your agency succeed. 

So we are expecting you to honestly communicate with this Committee about your agency’s needs. 

37

As I say, you have a wonderful opportunity to really make a contribution to our country and save lives and make people’s lives better. 

So thank you very much for your willingness to serve in this 

tough job. 

Mr. PAULISON. I want to thank both of you and the rest of the 

Committee. We do perceive this Committee as an ally, and we 

know you want to help. And we know how much work you have 

actually put in already. So you have my commitment, we will continue to work with this Committee with all vigor. 

Chairman COLLINS. Thank you. 

I want to echo Senator Voinovich’s admonition to you to come to 

us if you have problems, if you need more resources, if you need 

support. We want to hear from you. 

I want to thank Senator Voinovich for staying for the entire 

hearing. As you know, there were a lot of important competing demands today, and I think his full participation demonstrates how 

much he is concerned that we get this right and how important we 

view your nomination. 

I remember, Mr. Paulison, when we talked on the phone when 

you were tapped to be the Acting Secretary, you told me at that 

time that your wife thought you were crazy to undertake the responsibility of Acting FEMA Director. Now you are taking on even 

more responsibility. 

I want to thank you for your willingness to do so. I do think it 

is an extraordinarily important job. And it does matter, as we saw 

so vividly during the woefully inadequate response to Hurricane 

Katrina, who leads FEMA. I think that you are not only serving 

your country well, but that this is something your family can be 

very proud of, as well. I appreciate your public service. 

Without objection, the hearing record will be kept open until 

noon tomorrow for the submission of any additional written questions or statements for the record. 

Thank you for being here today, and this hearing is now adjourned. 

[Whereupon, at 12:20 p.m. the Committee was adjourned.] 

(39)

A P P E N D I X 

PREPARED STATEMENT OF SENATOR LEVIN 

I would like to welcome Chief Paulison. I am pleased that the President has nominated someone who has extensive emergency management experience. Someone who 

has on-the-ground experience fighting fires, conducting search and rescue operations, and coordinating the response and recovery efforts during large scale emergencies, such as Hurricane Andrew and the crash of ValueJet Flight 592. 

We all want—and this country needs—a Federal Emergency Management Agency 

that is led and staffed by experienced professionals. Unlike so many appointees of 

this Administration, you are being nominated based on your experience and abilities, instead of your political ties. I am pleased that you also intend to staff this 

agency with people who have the right skills and experience to handle the challenging and vitally important responsibilities of FEMA. My request to you is that 

you follow through on these good intentions—not only the tremendous staffing needs 

within FEMA, but the numerous other improvements that are required to get this 

agency back on track. 

The first responder community—including a number of fire chiefs in my own 

State of Michigan—have enthusiastically supported your nomination as head of 

FEMA. You have also received the support of James Lee Witt, the tremendously 

successful former director of FEMA under President Clinton. 

Although I am impressed with your qualifications, I do have some concerns. First, 

I am concerned that the commitments you made before this Committee during an 

October 6 hearing on Hurricane Katrina have not been fully realized. You committed to re-bid all of the Katrina contracts that were awarded through a no-bid, 

sole source process. That has not happened. You said you would make the matter 

of the thousands of reported missing children the number one priority of your agency’s efforts. But it took nearly 7 months—until March 7—until the last child reported to the National Center for Missing and Exploited Children was reunited with 

her family. 

I am also concerned with your support of the recent reorganization of DHS, which 

stripped FEMA of its preparedness functions and moved them into a separate Office 

of Preparedness within DHS. Emergency management experts and first responders 

across the country have been extremely critical of removing the important functions 

of preparedness from FEMA, and I hope that you will monitor how this reorganization is impacting the ability of FEMA to adequately respond to emergencies and disasters. 

While I have these concerns, I plan to support your nomination, and I look forward to working with you to create a Federal Emergency Management Agency that 

is stronger and more prepared to handle whatever disasters and emergencies this 

country might face in the future.

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