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U.S. ENVIRONMENTAL PROTECTION AGENCY

PUBLIC HEARING:

Carbon Pollution Standard for New Power Plants

8:36 a.m. through 8 p.m.

Thursday, May 24, 2012

Environmental Protection Agency

Ariel Rios East Building

1201 Constitution Avenue

Washington, D.C. 20460
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EPA PANEL:

Kevin Culligan, Associate Director, Office of

 Air Quality Planning and Standards

Howard Hoffman, Office of Air and Radiation

Jeb Stenhouse, Office of Air and Radiation

Lora Strine, Office of Congressional and

 Intergovernmental Relations

David Evans, Benefits Assessment and Methods

 Development Division

Jim Ketcham-Colwill, Office of Air and Radiation
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C O N T E N T S

 Page

Public Comments:

Samantha Ahdoot, American Academy of

 Pediatrics .................................12

Joelle Novey, Interfaith Power & Light .......17

Paul Billings, American Lung Association .....21

Kimberly Williams, American Lung Association..26

Taldi Walter, National Audubon Society........31

Glen Besa, Sierra Club........................35

Darin Schroeder, Clean Air Task Force.........39

Mandy Warner, Environmental Defense Fund......41

Elizabeth Perera, Union of Concerned

 Scientists..................................51

Dr. Vinayak Jha, George Washington Medical

 Facility Associates.........................57

Laura Kate Anderson, Environment Virginia.....61

Trieste Lockwood, Interfaith Power & Light....68

Jonathan Kolm, Sierra Club....................71

Rev. Mitch Hescox, Evangelical Environmental

 Network.....................................76

Rev. Mari Castellanos, National Council

 of Churches.................................82

Dr. Damian Pitt, Virginia Interfaith

 Power & Light...............................85

Mary Ann Hitt, Sierra Club....................89

Dede Smith, Environment Virginia..............94

Allison Chin, Sierra Club.....................98

Becky Dawson, Environment Virginia...........102

Carol Stone, Concerned Citizen...............107

Christina Morgan, Environment Virginia.......112

Barbara Gottlieb, Physicians for Social Responsibility.............................116

Rev. Douglas Hunt, United Church of Christ...122

Kenneth Haapala, Science & Environmental Policy Project.............................126

Linda Burchfield, Northern Virginia Climate

 Action Network.............................128

Herbert Fitzell, Sierra Club.................133

Tyla Matteson, Concerned Citizen.............139

Larry Roussell, Sierra Club..................140
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C O N T E N T S (continued)

Public Comments: (continued)

 Page

Rachel Cleetus, Union of Concerned

 Scientists.................................142

David Doniger, NRDC..........................149

Richard Kennedy, Sierra Club.................155

Dr. Catherine Thomasson, Physicians for

 Social Responsibility......................160

Charles Ellis, Concerned Citizen.............164

Kim Knowlton, NRDC...........................166

Daryl Downing, Concerned Citizen.............171

Dr. Laura Anderko, NRDC......................172

Vasiliy Kisunko, Concerned Citizen...........176

Monica Cevallos, Voces Verdes................177

Roger Rivera, National Hispanic 

 Environmental Council......................180

Walter Ebmeyer, Sierra Club..................186

Barbara Weinstein, NRDC......................189

Andon Zabel, Concerned Citizen...............195

Nathan Willcox, Environment America..........202

Lara Levison, On behalf of Peter Bahouth.....207

Priscilla Lin, Concerned Citizen.............213

Montre Moore, Concerned Father...............218

Mary Love, NAACP.............................223

Sulvia C. Wood, Concerned Citizen............227

Matt Sinclair, Communication Workers

 of America.................................231

Michael Williams, BlueGreen Alliance.........234

Joe Mendelson, National Wildlife Fed.........241

Mark Jester, Berkshire County League

 of Sportsmen...............................247

Dr. Lih Young, Concerned Citizen.............254

Joy Bergey, Center for Celebration

 of Creation................................259

Eric Orff, National Wildlife Fed.............264

Jim Hoover, Student..........................268

Rocky Sundquist, Concerned Citizen...........270

Richard Mode, North Carolina Wildlife Fed....274

Gary Botzek, Minnesota Conservation Fed......279
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C O N T E N T S (continued)

 Page

Public Comments: (continued)

Sylvia Ridgeway, NAACP.......................286

David Dittloff, National Wildlife Fed........291

Dylan Voorhees, National Resources Council

 of Maine...................................300

Ben Yamagata, Coal Utilization &

 Research Council...........................306

Jenny Kordick, On behalf of Joel Gay, New

 Mexico Wildlife Fed........................312

Joan Picone, National Wildlife Fed...........316

Carol Oldham, National Wildlife Fed..........320

David Ellenberger, National Wildlife Fed.....322

Frank Szollosi, National Wildlife Fed........326

Sarah Mullkoff, Michigan Citizen.............332

Rev. Richard Cizik, National Association

 of Evangelicals............................338

Paul McAllister, Virginia Interfaith Power

 & Light....................................343

Molly Rauch, Moms Clean Air Force............349

Dr. Lisa Van Susteren, National Wildlife Fed.355

Lisa Jacobson, Business Council for

 Sustainable Energy.........................357

Christina Elles, Union of Concerned

 Scientists.................................363

Jim Dougherty, Sierra Club...................367

Quentin James, Sierra Student Coalition......371

Gerri Michalska, Concerned Citizen...........380

Boyd Walker, Concerned Citizen...............385

James Casey, Union of Concerned Scientists...390

Henry Hamburger, George Mason University.....394

Sara Chieffo, League of Conservation Voters..400

Kathleen Mogelgaard, Concerned Citizen.......404

Doug Ouse, Concerned Citizen.................408

Brenna Muller, Concerned Citizen.............411

Seth Heald, Concerned Citizen................413

Alycia Ashburn, Concerned Citizen............416

Jessica Christy, Concerned Citizen...........422

Allison Donnelly, Concerned Citizen..........428
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C O N T E N T S (continued)

 Page

Public Comments: (continued)

Rhett Buttle, Small Business Majority........432

Lilia Abron, Small Business Owner............437

Ross Eisenberg, National Association of

 Manufacturers..............................441

Beth Kemler, Chesapeake Climate Action

 Network....................................446

Larry Greenfield, Concerned Citizen..........450

Jennifer Abel, Concerned Citizen.............452

Tom Stevens, Concerned Citizen...............454

Alex Bond, National Mining Association.......457

Anastasia Shemkes, Concerned Citizen.........465

Seth Long, Concerned Citizen.................468

Christine Guhl, Concerned Citizen............471
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1 P R O C E E D I N G S

2 MR. CULLIGAN: Good morning and thank 

3 you for joining us for this morning's public 

4 hearing or today's public hearing. My name is 

5 Kevin Culligan and I am an Associate Division 

6 Director with our Sector Strategies and Program 

7 Division in our Office of Air Quality Planning 

8 and Standards, which is part of EPA's Office of 

9 Air Radiation.

10 I will be chairing this morning's or 

11 actually today's hearing, and I am joined on the 

12 panel by Jeb Stenhouse, who is also in our Office 

13 of Air Radiation, and Howard Hoffman, who is in 

14 our Office of General Counsel.

15 We are here today to listen to your 

16 comments on EPA's proposed, "Carbon Pollution 

17 Standard for New Power Plants." The standards 

18 were published in the Federal Register on April 

19 13, 2012. This common-sense step under the Clean 

20 Air Act would, for the first time, set national 

21 limits on the amount of carbon pollution the 

22 power plants built in the future can emit.
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1 For future power plants EPA is proposing 

2 an output-based standard of 1,000 pounds of CO2

3 per megawatt hour. The agency's proposal does 

4 not apply to existing units or to planned units 

5 that already have permits and that break ground 

6 within 12 months of the date of the proposal.

7 EPA's proposed standard reflects the 

8 ongoing trend in the power sector to build 

9 cleaner plants that take advantage of 

10 American-made technologies. The proposal is 

11 flexible and would help to minimize carbon 

12 pollution throughout the deployment of modern 

13 technologies that power companies are already 

14 using to built the next generation of power 

15 plants. EPA's proposal would ensure that 

16 progress towards a cleaner and more modern power 

17 sector continues.

18 Today, we will be accepting oral 

19 comments on all aspects of our proposal, and we 

20 will prepare manuscripts of the hearing. The 

21 transcript will be available as part of the 

22 official record of the rule. We are also 
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1 accepting written comments up through June 25, 

2 2012.

3 At the registration area, which is out 

4 front, there is a handout detailing how you can 

5 submit written comments either through the mail, 

6 fax, or electronically. We will consider your 

7 comments whether you make them orally today or in 

8 written format as we move forward to complete the 

9 rule.

10 Now, I would like to describe the 

11 procedures for today's hearing.

12 I will call the scheduled speakers up in 

13 groups of two. When it is your turn to speak, 

14 please state your name and, for the benefit of 

15 our court reporter, please spell it, and also 

16 provide your affiliation before you begin your 

17 testimony.

18 In order to be fair to everyone, we are 

19 limiting public testimony to five minutes, and we 

20 ask that those speakers remain at the panel until 

21 they both have finished speaking.

22 After you have finished your testimony, 
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1 I or other panelists up here may ask questions. 

2 If, in addition to your oral testimony, you would 

3 like to submit written comments, you can either 

4 do so through the mail or you can just leave them 

5 with EPA staff at the registration desk.

6 In order to make sure that we keep to 

7 the five minutes and give everyone a chance to 

8 speak, we do have a timekeeping system right over 

9 here. It is a system of lights. When you start 

10 speaking, the light should turn green, and after 

11 four minutes, so when you have one minute left, 

12 the light should turn yellow. At five minutes, 

13 the light will turn red and I will gently nudge 

14 you to end your testimony.

15 Today's hearing is scheduled to run from 

16 8:30 a.m. until 8:00 p.m. this evening, and later 

17 if necessary, if we do have additional speakers. 

18 We are trying to accommodate everyone we can.

19 The hearing will go on recess from 12:00 

20 to 1:00 and also from 4:30 to 5:30 p.m. We will 

21 begin promptly after those recesses, so at 1:00 

22 p.m. in the afternoon, and 5:30 p.m. in the 
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1 evening to get to everybody.

2 If you would like to testify and have 

3 not yet registered, there is still an 

4 opportunity, and you may go out to the 

5 registration desk up front.

6 We have done our best to accommodate 

7 specific requests for time, and we ask your 

8 patience as we run through the list of speakers. 

9 We may need to make adjustments as the day 

10 progresses depending upon if people come at the 

11 last minute or if people don't show up. Like I 

12 said, what we are trying to do is give everybody 

13 an opportunity to speak.

14 If any questions arise throughout the 

15 day, there are a number of EPA staff around, and 

16 the easiest place to find them is at the 

17 registration table for assistance.

18 Thank you, and with that, let's get 

19 started. I am going to call up our first two 

20 speakers. I apologize in advance, because I 

21 guarantee you that before the end of the day, I 

22 will butcher probably more than one name, and I 
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1 do apologize in advance for that.

2 Our first two speakers are Samantha 

3 Ahdoot and Joelle Novey, so if two people come 

4 up, and we will plan on starting with Samantha.

5 DR. AHDOOT: I am Samantha Ahdoot. That 

6 is Samantha, and the last name A-H-D-O-O-T, and I 

7 am here today on behalf of the American Academy 

8 of Pediatrics.

9 Thank you for giving me the opportunity 

10 to speak today. I am a practicing pediatrician 

11 in Alexandria, Virginia, and I am happy to be 

12 testifying today on behalf of the American 

13 Academy of Pediatrics of which I am a member.

14 The AAP is a nonprofit professional 

15 organization of greater than 62,000 primary care 

16 and subspecialist pediatricians dedicated to the 

17 health, safety, and well-being of children.

18 I am testifying today to express AAP's 

19 strong support for the EPA's proposed carbon 

20 pollution standard for new power plants. There 

21 is broad scientific consensus that the planet is

22 warming rapidly and at an accelerating rate. 
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1 Human activities, primarily the burning of fossil 

2 fuels, have been deemed responsible for this 

3 warming with greater than 90 percent probability.

4 As the first ever national limits on 

5 carbon pollution's new power plants, the EPA's 

6 proposed standard represents a major step in the 

7 global effort to reduce greenhouse gas emissions.

8 As such, it is a significant opportunity 

9 to protect children from the adverse health 

10 effects of climate change. These effects are 

11 wide ranging and are increasingly being witnessed 

12 by pediatricians, such as myself, across the 

13 world every day.

14 According to the World Health 

15 Organization, greater than 88 percent of the 

16 existing burden of disease due to climate change 

17 occurs in children less than five years old. 

18 Increasing global temperatures put children at 

19 direct risk of thermal injury. Children spend 

20 more time outside than adults, often during the 

21 hottest hours of the day, playing sports and 

22 being physically active.
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1 They have less ability to control their 

2 local climate or to seek cooling. As a result, 

3 they have greater vulnerability to heat stroke, 

4 exhaustion, sunburn, and skin cancers.

5 The summer of 2011 broke innumerable 

6 records for heat across this country, and heat 

7 waves are predicted to increase in frequency and 

8 magnitude. This poses a significant threat to 

9 children's safety during the summer months.

10 The Intergovernmental Panel on Climate 

11 Change predicts that it is likely or extremely 

12 likely that climate change will cause an increase 

13 in extreme weather events. 2011 had a record 14 

14 weather and climate disasters in the U.S. 

15 including drought, heat waves, floods, tornadoes, 

16 hurricanes, and wildfires.

17 Weather disasters represent a major 

18 threat to the health and well-being of children. 

19 Faced with such events, children are at 

20 immediate danger of injury, death, locked up or 

21 separation of some caregivers, and emotional 

22 trauma. Infectious diseases often follow 
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1 disasters as illustrated by the cholera outbreak 

2 that followed the 2010 earthquake in Haiti, which 

3 resulted in greater than 400,000 cases and 6,000 

4 deaths in just 11 months.

5 Rising temperatures and changes in 

6 precipitation are expected to lead to increases 

7 in water-borne gastroenteritis. A study of 

8 children in Peru during an El Nino year showed 

9 that the rate of hospitalizations of children for 

10 diarrhea increased 80 percent per degree 

11 Centigrade temperature increase.

12 Globally, infectious diarrhea is the 

13 second leading cause of death in young children 

14 with an estimated 1.62 million deaths in children 

15 less than five years every year.

16 Vector-borne illnesses are also expected 

17 to increase in range and frequency. Malaria 

18 currently causes more than 1 million deaths 

19 annually, 75 percent of which occur in children 

20 less than five years old. Climate change is 

21 expanding the range of host mosquitos and speeds 

22 the development of the parasites within the host 
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1 mosquito.

2 Lyme disease is similarly expanding its 

3 range with exponential increases in the abundance 

4 of ticks documented in Quebec, and dramatic 

5 increases in all tick-borne diseases reported in 

6 my home State of Virginia including the very 

7 dangerous and rapidly progressive Rocky Mountain 

8 spotted fever.

9 Children age five to nine years old have 

10 the highest incidence of Lyme disease and are 

11 likely to suffer greatest from these increases. 

12 Respiratory disease due to air pollution is a 

13 significant problem in this country as more 

14 hospitalizations and decreased lung function have 

15 all been linked to air pollution resulting from 

16 fossil fuel consumption.

17 One-half of the U.S. population 

18 currently live in counties where air pollution 

19 exceeds the national health standard. The CDC 

20 recently reported that 7 million children had 

21 asthma in 2010, and that the proportion of 

22 Americans with this condition has increased 15 
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1 percent since 2001.

2 In summary, climate change places the 

3 health and well-being of children in this country 

4 and the world in jeopardy. There are currently 

5 no national limits on how much carbon can be 

6 released by coal-fired power plants, the nation's 

7 largest source of carbon pollution.

8 The EPA's proposed standard is a 

9 significant step towards reducing carbon 

10 emissions and mitigating the effects of climate 

11 change. The American Academy of Pediatrics 

12 applauds the EPA for seeking to protect the 

13 health and well-being of children in this country 

14 and the world.

15 Thank you.

16 MR. CULLIGAN: Thank you.

17 We will move on to Joelle.

18 MS. NOVEY: Yes. Joelle Novey, 

19 J-O-E-L-L-E; Novey, N-O-V-E-Y. I am with 

20 Interfaith Power & Light.

21 Through our local Interfaith Power & 

22 Light program, hundreds of congregations of all 
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1 religious traditions work together on energy and 

2 climate issues. This morning, I am only the first 

3 of a diverse group of religious leaders from 

4 Virginia, Pennsylvania, Maryland, and D.C., who 

5 will speak in support of the EPA's proposed 

6 carbon pollution standards for new power plants.

7 Our words will be joined also by those 

8 of religious leaders testifying in State hearings 

9 in Chicago, and over the coming months, many of 

10 the 14,000 congregations in the Interfaith Power 

11 & Light movement nationally will be sending our 

12 messages to the EPA in written testimony.

13 The teaching from my own tradition that 

14 informs my thoughts on this comes from Rabbi 

15 Isaac ben Sheshet, a 14th century scholar of 

16 Jewish law. He wrote, "One is forbidden from 

17 gaining a livelihood at the expense of another's 

18 health." One is forbidden from gaining a 

19 livelihood at the expense of another's health. 

20 Simple, ethical wisdom, not bad for medieval 

21 speak.

22 For too long, here, now, those who 
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1 operate our power plants have been permitted to 

2 gain their livelihood at the expense of people's 

3 health. Right now coal pollution in the United 

4 States results in more than $100 billion annually 

5 in health costs, 12,000 emergency room visits per 

6 year are due to coal-related illnesses.

7 Here in D.C., we have one of the 

8 nation's highest asthma rates particularly among 

9 children. 10,000 children in our nation's 

10 capital city sometimes struggle to breathe 

11 because of our dirty air. Someone is making 

12 their living at the expense of these kids' 

13 health, and it should be forbidden in this 

14 country for folks in the energy business or for 

15 anyone else to make their livelihood at the 

16 expense of people's health.

17 In the religious communities with which 

18 I work, people are heartsick about the role of 

19 coal power in producing the heat gases that are 

20 causing global climate change. They are working 

21 to reduce their electricity use in their 

22 sanctuaries and at home. They are using their 
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1 energy dollars to support wind energy generation. 

2 They are working to bring offshore wind power to 

3 our coasts, and they are figuring out how to 

4 finance solar panels for their roofs.

5 So often we are told that the change we 

6 are trying to make is unrealistic because clean 

7 renewable energy is so expensive, while coal 

8 power is cheap. In fact, coal power is 

9 intolerably expensive, but until now its true 

10 costs have been borne by others.

11 Who bears the cost of the permanent 

12 destruction through mountaintop removal mining? 

13 Who bears the cost of buried streams, air 

14 pollution from coal prep plants and toxic coal 

15 ash dump sites? Who bears the cost of bad air 

16 quality, the cost of kids with asthma, seniors 

17 having heart attacks, pregnant mothers with 

18 mercury in their bodies?

19 Who bears the cost of stronger storms, 

20 extreme drought, devastating floods, and other 

21 scary weather caused by global climate change?

22 On this historic morning, for the first 
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1 time, the EPA stands poised to set national 

2 limits on our nation's largest sources of carbon 

3 pollution. Protecting people's health and the 

4 climate is the only way to take a truer measure 

5 of the real cost of coal power.

6 Please approve carbon pollution 

7 standards for new power plants. New power plants 

8 shouldn't be permitted to damage our climate or 

9 make people sick.

10 Thank you.

11 MR. CULLIGAN: Thank both of you and I 

12 appreciate the fact that you guys are setting a 

13 good example and staying within the five minutes. 

14 So, thanks.

15 Our next two speakers will be Paul 

16 Billings and Kimberly Williams.

17 Good morning and we will start with 

18 Paul.

19 MR. BILLINGS: Thank you. Good morning. 

20 I am Paul Billings, P-A-U-L B-I-L-L-I-N-G-S, 

21 vice president of National Policy and Advocacy 

22 for the American Lung Association.
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1 The American Lung Association is pleased 

2 to support EPA's proposed standard for carbon 

3 pollution from power plants. This rule is 

4 setting the stage for the next generation of 

5 America's power plants to be the least toxic and 

6 most modern in the world.

7 The American Lung association believes 

8 that power plants should not be allowed to emit 

9 unlimited amounts of carbon pollution into the 

10 air. Scientists warn that the buildup of carbon 

11 pollution will create warmer temperatures which 

12 will increase unhealthful levels of smog.

13 Any increase in smog means more 

14 childhood asthma attacks and complications for 

15 those with lung disease. Addressing carbon 

16 pollution will help protect public health. 

17 Higher temperatures can enhance conditions for 

18 ozone formation. Even with steps that are in 

19 place to reduce ozone, evidence warns that the 

20 changes in climate are likely to increase the 

21 risk of unhealthy levels of ozone in the future 

22 in large parts of the United States.
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1 To protect human health, the nation 

2 needs strong measures to reduce climate change 

3 and ozone. The proposed standards are an 

4 important first step to address large stationary 

5 source contribution to climate change.

6 Let me speak briefly about ozone. Ozone 

7 is a highly reactive gas and is a form of oxygen. 

8 Commonly known as smog, ozone is the most 

9 pervasive air pollutant that forms in the 

10 atmosphere when hydrocarbon vapors react to 

11 oxides and nitrogen in the presence of sunlight 

12 and heat.

13 The American Lung Association State of 

14 the Air report shows that more than 115 million 

15 Americans live in areas where the air is 

16 unhealthy because of ozone air pollution.

17 The report is based on the 75 ppb ozone 

18 standard, a standard that the science shows is 

19 clearly too high to protect public health. If 

20 President Obama and EPA had followed the law and 

21 the science, the ozone standard would be much 

22 lower and more protective of more people.
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1 When a person inhales ozone, a chemical 

2 reaction for bodies' internal tissues causing an 

3 inflammation like a sunburn of the lung. Ozone 

4 acts as a powerful respiratory irritant at levels 

5 found routinely across the nation.

6 Breathing ozone may cause serious harm 

7 to health including premature death, shortness of 

8 breath and chest pain, wheezing and coughing, 

9 inflammation of the lining of the lungs, 

10 increased susceptibility to respiratory 

11 infections, increased risk of asthma attacks, an 

12 increased need for medical treatment and 

13 hospitalization of people with lung diseases, 

14 such as asthma and chronic obstructive pulmonary 

15 disease.

16 Children who regularly breathe high 

17 levels of ozone may face reduced lung function in 

18 adulthood. Reduced lung function increases the 

19 risk of lung disease in later life. Most at risk 

20 are people with lung diseases like asthma and 

21 emphysema, children, because their airways are 

22 smaller, their respiratory defenses are not fully 
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1 formed, and they have higher rates of breathing.

2 People who work or exercise outdoors, 

3 older adults over the age of 65, and then there 

4 is a subgroup of people who are just very 

5 responsive and react to those, and we call 

6 responders.

7 In sum, ozone is a serious health threat 

8 that impacts millions of Americans. 

9 Specifically, to the rule, we urge EPA to 

10 strengthen the carbon proposal standard in 

11 several key ways. To ensure the next generation 

12 of power plants is the most modern and the least 

13 toxic, we urge EPA to adopt a tighter than the 

14 1,000 pound per megawatt hour CO2 standard, 

15 reflecting the achievements of the best 

16 performing power plants in operation today.

17 We urge EPA to set a standard for 

18 simple-cycle turbines. We urge EPA to establish 

19 a firm sunset date for the alternate compliance 

20 mechanism option, excluding all plants built 

21 after a specific data.

22 We urge strong enforcement of those 
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1 provisions to ensure that operators will not fail 

2 to meet that compliance option. We will discuss 

3 these issues further in detailed technical 

4 comments that we will file next month.

5 Finally, EPA needs to get to work on 

6 establishing a standard for existing sources. 

7 Anything less shortchanges our kids and 

8 shortchanges our health.

9 Thank you.

10 MR. CULLIGAN: Thank you.

11 We will move on to Kimberly now.

12 MS. WILLIAMS: Good morning. I am 

13 Kimberly Williams, and I am manager of Advocacy 

14 and Communications for the American Lung 

15 Association serving North Carolina, Virginia, 

16 Washington, D.C., and Maryland.

17 I am pleased to be here today along with 

18 my colleague from the American Lung Association 

19 National Office to support the U.S. EPA's 

20 Proposed Standards for Carbon Pollution of Power 

21 Plants. This rule is an important and historic 

22 opportunity for protecting public health.
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1 We are pleased that EPA has proposed the 

2 first national standards to address power plant 

3 carbon pollution. There is no reason why this 

4 pollution should not be regulated in the same 

5 manner as other pollutants that are linked to 

6 smog and soot.

7 This rule will also help to address 

8 public health impacts resulting from smog, which 

9 is especially important for the territory served, 

10 North Carolina, Virginia, D.C., and Maryland.

11 In North Carolina, there are 206,700 

12 children with asthma, 73,700 of them are living 

13 in areas where ozone levels received a failing 

14 grade in the American Lung Association's State of 

15 the Air report.

16 In Virginia, there are 153,000 children 

17 with asthma, and 51,000 or one-third of them are 

18 living in areas with unhealthy levels of ozone.

19 The District of Columbia also received a 

20 failing grade for ozone pollution, and there are 

21 18,000 children with asthma. Additionally, of 

22 importance to note, is that the Washington 
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1 Metropolitan Area ranks 13th most polluted in the 

2 nation for their high ozone days.

3 Lastly, in Maryland, there are 160,200 

4 children with asthma, 117,600 or nearly 

5 three-quarters of them are living in areas with 

6 unhealthy levels of ozone.

7 Science would say the buildup of carbon 

8 pollution will likely lead to increases in 

9 temperatures which, in turn, could lead to more 

10 ozone or smog in the air. This is why it is 

11 important that EPA begin to address carbon 

12 pollution.

13 You have heard it before, but it bears 

14 repeating. More smog means more childhood asthma 

15 attacks and complications for those with lung 

16 disease. The truth is even healthy, active 

17 adults can be negatively affected by air 

18 pollution.

19 Take, for instance, my own personal 

20 story. I was born in Fayetteville, Arkansas, 

21 which is located in Washington County, and 

22 receives a letter grade of B in the State of the 
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1 Air report. I have been active almost my entire 

2 life running, biking, rock climbing, all with 

3 little to absolutely no trouble.

4 About four years ago, I moved to the 

5 District of Columbia, which, in turn, received a 

6 failing grade for ozone pollution, and there is a 

7 noticeable change in the ease at which I can 

8 perform these activities especially during the 

9 warmer months.

10 I began to notice that my throat felt 

11 constricted and I was having difficulty taking 

12 deep breaths that were needed to sustain my 

13 typical level of activity. Over time, the 

14 symptoms worsened, and my shortness of breath 

15 became more frequent. On high ozone days, even 

16 my daily Metro commute to and from work would 

17 exacerbate the difficulty I was having in 

18 breathing.

19 Eventually, I was diagnosed with asthma 

20 and to control my various symptoms, was put on 

21 three separate medications by my physician.

22 As a young woman who is focused on 
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1 leading a healthy lifestyle, and being active, 

2 this is both frustrating and troublesome that I 

3 have now been diagnosed with asthma and now have 

4 to use a daily medication just to maintain an 

5 active lifestyle.

6 Unfortunately, my story is all too 

7 common for those in the Washington metropolitan 

8 area as we are living with unhealthy levels of 

9 ozone.

10 In closing, the proposed rule is an 

11 important step to ensure that the plans of the 

12 future are as clean as they possibly can be. If 

13 we don't enact these standards, we run the risk 

14 of shortchanging the health and well-being of 

15 future generations.

16 The National Office of the American Lung 

17 Association will be submitting more detailed 

18 written comments, but I would like to take the 

19 opportunity to urge EPA to lower the emissions to 

20 meet the cleanest plant in operation which they 

21 emit, eliminate exceptions, and do not have 

22 exceptions for coal plants that go beyond 2020.
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1 Also, I ask that EPA begin the process 

2 of developing standards to cover existing 

3 sources, as well.

4 Thank you for the opportunity to testify 

5 here today and I urge you to please finalize this 

6 rule before the end of the year.

7 Thank you.

8 MR. CULLIGAN: Thank both of you.

9 Our next two speakers will be Todd 

10 Walter and Glen Besa.

11 MR. BESA: I am Glen Besa.

12 MR. CULLIGAN: Do we have Todd?

13 Oh, I apologize, yes. Sorry about that.

14 So, we will start with Taldi.

15 MS. WALTER: My name is Taldi Walter, 

16 Assistant Director of Legislative Affairs.

17 On behalf of National Audubon Society 

18 and our members, thank you for the opportunity to 

19 comment on the proposed carbon rule today. 

20 Audubon is the oldest conservation group in the 

21 country and is supported by half a million 

22 members, 460 chapters, and 23 State offices.
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1 Audubon is committed to conserving and 

2 restoring natural ecosystems, focusing on birds 

3 and other wildlife and their habitats for the 

4 benefit of humanity and the earth's biological 

5 diversity.

6 I want to express our strong support for 

7 the U.S. Environmental Protection Agency's 

8 historic efforts to put limits on carbon dioxide 

9 and other greenhouse gas pollutants from new 

10 power plants.

11 According to the Energy Information 

12 Administration, power plants are the largest 

13 source of carbon pollution, accounting for 

14 approximately 40 percent of carbon emissions. 

15 Without action, power plant emissions will 

16 continue to contribute to the unsustainable rate 

17 at which the planet is warming.

18 Common disruption is harming natural 

19 systems across the globe, posing the greatest 

20 threats to birds and other wildlife in modern 

21 history. More than 80 percent of plants and 

22 animal species have shown changes associated with 
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1 climate change. Unabated, climate change could 

2 lead to the loss of one-fourth to one-third of 

3 all species on the earth.

4 With such an unprecedented rate of 

5 change, many species will not be able to adapt. 

6 Audubon is greatly concerned about the impacts of 

7 climate change on avian species. Birds have long 

8 served as indicators of biological health. Birds 

9 also help control insects, rodents, and pests 

10 that can destroy crop foods.

11 Additionally, one-third of all human 

12 food comes from plants that are pollinated by 

13 birds, butterflies, and other insects. Lastly, 

14 bird watching, hunting, and outdoor activities 

15 are enjoyed by more than 80 million Americans, 

16 support over 2.6 million jobs.

17 While some birds may adapt to a warming 

18 planet, other species are highly adapted to 

19 particular habitats throughout the hemisphere, 

20 making adaptation and numerous latitudes 

21 throughout the globe impossible.

22 Here are some examples of how global 
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1 warming is already affecting birds. Audubon's 

2 2009 Birds and Climate, Ecological Disruption and 

3 Motion report authored by Audubon scientists 

4 using decades of Christmas bird count data found 

5 that birds are shifting their wintering ranges 

6 northward on an average of 35 miles.

7 More than 60 of the 305 observed species 

8 have moved their ranges in excess of 100 miles 

9 north. This is a clear indication that climate 

10 change is already impacting birds on a global 

11 scale.

12 As rising sea levels inundate coastal 

13 wetland habitats, species like the American 

14 oyster catcher will be impacted as flooding 

15 mates, submerged aquatic vegetation used for 

16 nesting and foraging aren't available.

17 Many bird species have very exact 

18 migration, reproduction, breeding, nesting, and 

19 hatching time lines. This evolutionary synergy is 

20 matched to specific locations and conditions to 

21 maximize resources such as hatching insects in 

22 the spring that are a vital food source after a 
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1 long migration from wintering habitats to spring 

2 nesting grounds.

3 If food sources and hatch dates do not 

4 match, the hatchlings may not survive. As 

5 temperatures warm, the synchronicity between 

6 migration and food supplies may be compromised.

7 Birds that live in very limited 

8 specialized habitats, such as the red crossbill, 

9 which is dependent on high altitude habitats, or 

10 the Eastern meadowlark, a declining grassland 

11 bird, have very few options for immigration when 

12 favored habitats vanish.

13 We are already seeing the impacts of 

14 frequent droughts at the breeding grounds for new 

15 rice water species dry up in the prairie pot hole 

16 regions of the West.

17 Audubon commends the EPA for its 

18 leadership on this critical issue, and we fully 

19 support the proposed rule.

20 Thank you so much for the opportunity to 

21 speak today and for considering these comments.

22 MR. BESA: Good morning. My name is 
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1 Glen Besa, G-L-E-N B-E-S-A. I am the director 

2 of the Sierra Club in the neighboring State of 

3 Virginia.

4 I want to thank the EPA, Administrator 

5 Jackson, and President Obama for moving forward 

6 with these important rules to reduce industrial 

7 carbon pollution from new power plants. I also 

8 want to thank you for relying on the 

9 well-established climate science to move forward 

10 with the statutory obligation you have under the 

11 Clean Air Act as interpreted by the Supreme Court 

12 in Massachusetts versus EPA.

13 It is especially important in a 

14 political climate dominated by 21st century flat 

15 earthers who deny the science of climate change. 

16 In a coastal State like Virginia, rise is 

17 already costing us millions of dollars in 

18 infrastructure adaptation costs. It is 

19 embarrassing that our governor and our attorney 

20 general are among the climate science deniers 

21 either through ignorance, political expedience or 

22 both.
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1 I have had the good fortune to represent 

2 the Sierra Club at several of the United Nations' 

3 climate summits over the past several years, most 

4 recently December in Durban. From my 

5 interactions with citizens and with government 

6 officials from across the world, it is very clear 

7 that the United States stands alone in its 

8 widespread questioning of the science of climate 

9 change.

10 This does not mean that the other 

11 nations are actually providing both leadership 

12 and addressing climate change, too few are. That 

13 is why it is so important that the U.S. EPA and 

14 the Obama administration move forward with these 

15 reasonable standards, and with others, to reduce 

16 industrial carbon pollution for power plants.

17 Finally, I would like to close on a 

18 personal note. I suffer from asthma and I take 

19 medication daily to control it. This is what I 

20 take. Before working for the Sierra Club, some 

21 years ago I worked for the American Lung 

22 Association of Maryland, where among my other 
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1 duties, major duties, was asthma education.

2 In that position, working with 

3 physicians and with young people and with adults 

4 with asthma, far worse than mine by the way, I 

5 saw that air pollution, smog exacerbated by 

6 longer, hotter summers, can cause increased

7 doctor visits and even hospitalizations and 

8 worse.

9 I was reminded of this past experience 

10 with the Lung Association when, in March, I hired 

11 a young woman to work for the Sierra Club, and 

12 two weeks later she died of an asthma attack.

13 These regulations are an important step 

14 in the right direction, protecting our health and 

15 well-being for all Americans.

16 I want to again thank you for moving 

17 forward with these rules and for this opportunity 

18 to testify.

19 Thank you so much.

20 MR. CULLIGAN: Thank both of you.

21 Our next two speakers are Darin 

22 Schroeder and Mandy Warner. We can start with 
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1 you, Darin.

2 MR. SCHROEDER: Okay.

3 First off, my name is Darin Schroeder. 

4 That is D-A-R-I-N S-C-H-R-O-E-D-E-R, and I am 

5 with Clean Air Task Force.

6 On behalf of the Clean Air Task Force, I 

7 want to congratulate EPA and everyone else 

8 involved on the proposed rule. Fossil fuel, 

9 electric generating units are the leading 

10 stationary source of carbon dioxide, a well-known 

11 greenhouse gas. Carbon dioxide contributes to 

12 climate change, internally impacting nearly all 

13 aspects of our everyday life.

14 This includes adverse effects on 

15 agriculture systems, increases weather-related 

16 events like wildfires and flooding, increase 

17 stressors on water systems, and adverse effects 

18 on wildlife and ecosystems.

19 The pressing need to immediately reduce 

20 carbon dioxide, as well as other greenhouse gas 

21 emissions, is highlighted by the pollutant 

22 physical properties as compared to other 
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1 pollutants regulated under the Clean Air Act, 

2 carbon dioxide remains in the atmosphere for 

3 upwards of 100 years or more.

4 Until reductions in its emissions are 

5 achieved, resulting accumulations and associated 

6 damage will continue and even grow at a dangerous 

7 rate. The need to achieve greenhouse reductions 

8 therefore is immediate, and we applaud you all 

9 for taking this historic and important first 

10 step.

11 Initially, I would just like to note 

12 that because of the impact, all fossil-fueled 

13 electric generating units have, and will continue 

14 to have on CO2 emissions, we feel it was wise for 

15 EPA to combine them into a single subpart TTTT 

16 for the purposes of this rule.

17 However, there are a couple of issues 

18 with this rule I would like to briefly touch on 

19 today. The first is EPA's determination that a 

20 natural gas combined cycle plan is the only best 

21 system of initial reduction, supporting the 

22 emission standard EPA proposes.
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1 Congress, through the Clean Air Act, 

2 requires EPA to establish new source performance 

3 standards that reflect -- and I quote from the 

4 statute here -- "The degree of emission 

5 limitation achievable through the application of 

6 the best system of initial reduction, which 

7 taking into account the cost of achieving such 

8 reduction in any non-air quality, health, and 

9 environmental impact and energy requirements the 

10 Administrator determines has been adequate 

11 demonstrated."

12 For electric generating units, this 

13 system of emission reductions is not only an 

14 efficient gas plant, but also a carbon capture 

15 and sequestration, which I will refer to as CCS 

16 for the remainder of these comments.

17 CCS is the best system of emission 

18 reduction both as a matter of law and fact. The 

19 NSPS program is meant to pave the way toward 

20 improved air quality including the increased 

21 climate pollutant emissions, and is to be based 

22 on the best system of emission reduction.
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1 As such, the courts have said that the 

2 NSPS program should look, quote, "toward what can 

3 fairly be projected for the regulate future 

4 rather than the state of art of the present," in 

5 order to stimulate, augment the innovative 

6 character of industry.

7 Courts have further told us that an 

8 adequately demonstrated technology, which can be 

9 the basis for the standard, is one which is shown 

10 to be reasonably reliable, reasonably efficient, 

11 and which can reasonably be expected to serve the 

12 interests of conclusion control without becoming 

13 exorbitantly costly in an economic or an 

14 environmental way.

15 This includes systems in use in other 

16 countries, as well as across other industries. 

17 The courts have explained that an achievable 

18 limitation based on such technology is one that 

19 is not fairly theoretical or experimental, but it 

20 also need not necessarily be routinely achieved 

21 within the industry prior to its adoption.

22 CCS has adequately demonstrated that 
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1 emission limits based on this technology are 

2 achievable especially when looking at over the 30 

3 years that EGU would have to comply under this 

4 proposal.

5 For example, two new coal plants in the 

6 U.S. would utilize CCS technology immediately 

7 upon commencement of operations in 2014 and 2015. 

8 Moreover, CCS has long been demonstrated to 

9 work. CO2 from the Norwegian commercial gas 

10 filament project has been captured and 

11 sequestered since 1996. Accordingly, EPA must 

12 also rely on CCS as the best system of emission 

13 reduction for the emission limit and finalizes 

14 subpart TTTT.

15 Secondly, I would also like to briefly 

16 comment on the transitional source category 

17 described in the proposal. Under the NSPS 

18 program, any source commencing construction after 

19 the date of the proposed rule's publication is 

20 subject to that rule.

21 The proposed rule as is would carve out 

22 an exemption to this requirement for certain 
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1 facilities it identifies as potential 

2 transitional sources, but such an exemption from 

3 the statutory requirement just is not justified 

4 by the sum costs of projects that have yet to 

5 commence construction alone.

6 Moreover, we do not see a policy 

7 rationale for providing any special treatment for 

8 potential transitional sources that have no plans 

9 to ever utilize CCS to reduce CO2 emissions. As 

10 such, EPA has not provided a policy of legal

11 rationale for these exemptions.

12 Finally, we would also like to note that 

13 the bulk of future CO2 emissions will come from 

14 sources that exist today. We look to EPA to take 

15 much needed action to reduce CO2 emissions from 

16 these existing sources as the next step.

17 Thank you for the opportunity to comment 

18 on this critically important and historic rule.

19 MS. WARNER: Good morning. My name is 

20 Mandy Warner and I am with the Environmental 

21 Defense Fund, a nonpartisan environmental 

22 organization with more than 750,000 members 
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1 nationwide. EDF is dedicated to working towards 

2 innovative, cost-effect solutions to 

3 environmental problems, building on a foundation 

4 of rigorous science, economics, and law. Thank 

5 you for the opportunity to testify today.

6 The proposed standards are an important 

7 step towards addressing the massive quantities of 

8 climate stabilizing pollution emitted from U.S. 

9 power plants, one of the largest sources of 

10 greenhouse gases in the world.

11 By having the lifetime carbon emissions 

12 from coal-fired power plants relative to 

13 traditional coal plants, these historic clean air 

14 standards will provide long overdue and urgently 

15 needed protections for our health and climate 

16 while strengthening our made in the USA clear 

17 energy economy.

18 Climate change presents a clear and 

19 present danger now to the U.S. and to the world. 

20 The National Oceanic and Atmospheric 

21 Administration recently announced that the U.S. 

22 completed the single warmest 12-month period on 
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1 record. Left unchecked, climate change will have 

2 severe impacts on American's health, our 

3 environment, and our economy.

4 The U.S. Global Change Research Program 

5 has determined that if carbon pollution is not 

6 reduced, it is likely that American communities 

7 will experience increasingly severe impacts, for 

8 example, rising levels of dangerous smog in 

9 cities, which will lead to an increased risk of 

10 respiratory infections, more asthma attacks, and 

11 more premature deaths, increased risk of illness 

12 and death due to extreme heat, more intense 

13 hurricanes, and storm surges, increased frequency 

14 and severity of flooding, reduced precipitation 

15 and runoff in the West, reduce crop fields and 

16 livestock productivity, and more wildfires and 

17 increasing frequent and severe droughts in some 

18 regions.

19 U.S. power plants fueled by coal and gas 

20 are the single largest source of carbon pollution 

21 in our nation and one of the largest emitters of 

22 climate stabilizing pollution in the world.
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1 The U.S. power sector is responsible for 

2 roughly 40 percent of all carbon pollution of the 

3 U.S., and of its more GHGs than Russia, India, 

4 Japan, or Germany. Building just one inefficient 

5 emission-intensive plant today, and millions of 

6 tons of future climate pollution or the expensive 

7 after-the-fact shuttering of built infrastructure 

8 that releases harmful pollution.

9 We cannot effectively address 

10 climate-stabilizing emissions without addressing 

11 the pollution emitted by the power sector.

12 Fortunately, our nation has the 

13 innovative solutions and the knowhow to meet this 

14 pressing challenge while strengthening our 

15 economy. Numerous States across the U.S. are 

16 already limiting carbon pollution from new power 

17 plants, like Minnesota, Montana, and Washington.

18 Ten leaders of State environmental 

19 agencies also recently wrote to EPA expressing 

20 their support for the standard including 

21 Connecticut, Delaware, Maryland, Massachusetts, 

22 Rhode Island, Vermont, and the District of 
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1 Columbia.

2 Furthermore, over two dozen States have 

3 policies in place to harness the economic and 

4 environmental benefits of cleaner energy. 

5 Twenty-four States have standards in place that 

6 will drive investments and energy efficiencies, 

7 saving American homes and businesses money while 

8 reducing emissions.

9 These standards are also aligned with 

10 market forces that are already driving utilities 

11 to develop cleaner technologies. An April 2012 

12 WRI report explains that lower natural gas 

13 prices, declining growth in electricity demands, 

14 rising coal prices, and increased cost 

15 competitiveness of renewables are shaping 

16 business decisions in the utility sector.

17 Leaders from the utility industry 

18 recognize the importance and achievability of 

19 EPA's proposed standards. For instance, Ralph 

20 Izzo, a CEO of a public service enterprise group, 

21 issues the following statement after EPA released 

22 the proposal:
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1 "The agency's action establishes a 

2 logical and modest standard for new electric 

3 power plants and provides the industry with much 

4 needed regulatory certainty. The EPA provides a 

5 framework for the industry to confront this 

6 problem in a cost effective manner."

7 Under EPA standards, the nation's energy 

8 needs can be met through a diverse, efficient mix 

9 of power sources including renewable energy, 

10 efficient natural gas power plants, combined heat 

11 and power, and improvements in the efficiency of 

12 our energy use.

13 The standards also provide a pathway for 

14 the development of carbon capture and 

15 sequestration for coal plants. The standards 

16 will provide power companies with regulatory 

17 certainty for prudent long-term investments and 

18 cleaner home-grown energy that puts Americans to 

19 work.

20 The technology we need is available 

21 today, and the time has come when we can no 

22 longer afford to build new uncontrolled coal 
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1 plants that discharge vast volumes of GHG 

2 pollution for 50 years or more, recklessly 

3 imperiling our health, our environments, and our 

4 prosperity.

5 EPA's proposed limits on GHG pollution 

6 for fossil-fueled power plants are central to 

7 address climate change, to drive innovation and 

8 clean energy solutions, to ensure a steady flow 

9 of cost effective and cleaner electricity to 

10 power our economy and to protect the health and 

11 well-being of Americans now and in the future.

12 EDF will also be submitting more 

13 detailed further technical comments on the 

14 proposed rule.

15 Thank you again for the opportunity to 

16 testify.

17 MR. CULLIGAN: Thank you.

18 Darin, I have one clarifying question 

19 for you.

20 You had mentioned CCS as best system of 

21 emission reductions.

22 MR. SCHROEDER: Yes.
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1 MR. CULLIGAN: Do you think or will your 

2 written comments elaborate on what you think that 

3 does to what the appropriate rate would be for 

4 the limit?

5 MR. SCHROEDER: I can't say what it 

6 would be right now, but we will be submitting 

7 detailed technical comments on what that rate 

8 would be.

9 MR. CULLIGAN: Thank you.

10 Before we get on to our next two 

11 speakers, I did want to let people know that 

12 someone apparently left an IPad at Security, so 

13 if you are missing an IPad, that might be where 

14 it is.

15 Our next two speakers are Elizabeth 

16 Martin Perera and Vinayak Jha. I apologize in 

17 advance because I probably got those both wrong.

18 Why don't we start with you, Elizabeth.

19 MS. PERERA: Certainly. Good morning, 

20 everyone, and good morning, Howard, Kevin, and 

21 Jeff.

22 Thank you for the opportunity to testify 
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1 today in support of EPA's power plant carbon 

2 standard. My name is Elizabeth Martin Perera. I 

3 live in Bethesda, Maryland, and I am a senior 

4 Washington representative and public health 

5 analyst at Union of Concerned Scientists.

6 Sadly, due to recent layoffs, today will 

7 be my last day at UCS, but I am proud to be 

8 testifying here as a kind of swan song, leaving

9 Union of Concerned Scientists.

10 I present this testimony today on behalf 

11 of my two children, Lee and Evan, and also on 

12 behalf of UCS's more than 350,000 supporters and 

13 a network of more than 17,000 scientists.

14 We strongly support the EPA's effort to 

15 regulate carbon emissions from coal- and 

16 oil-fired power plants under the Clean Air Act. 

17 America's public health is gravely threatened by 

18 climate change and EPA's actions to move forward 

19 regulating global warming emissions are grounded 

20 in very strong science.

21 This first draft rule regulates global 

22 warming emissions from new power plants, and we 
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1 urge the EPA to move swiftly in completing this 

2 rule, and then releasing a draft rule to regulate 

3 emissions from existing power plants as the 

4 majority of global warming emissions come from 

5 existing power plants.

6 I would like to submit three things for 

7 the record today as a part of my testimony. 

8 First, is a letter that I have signed along with 

9 369 physicians, nurses, and public health 

10 experts, urging our policymakers to support EPA's 

11 ability under the Clean Air Act to take action 

12 that will protect public health and address 

13 climate change.

14 The letter reads: "Climate change poses 

15 significant threats to the health and well-being 

16 of all Americans with disproportionate impacts on 

17 children, the elderly, and the poor. Our own 

18 medical journals and professional organizations, 

19 such as American Medical Association, American 

20 Academy of Pediatrics, American Public Health 

21 Association, American Nurses Association have all 

22 sounded the alarm.
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1 Health effects will include heat-related 

2 illness, exacerbated cardiovascular, and 

3 respiratory diseases, more frequent outbreaks of 

4 water-borne diseases, such as cryptosporidium, 

5 and vector-borne diseases, and then to health 

6 impacts resulting from the stress of coping with 

7 extreme weather including flooding and 

8 hurricanes.

9 On April 2, 2007, the Supreme Court 

10 ruled that global warming emissions are a 

11 pollutant covered by the Clean Air Act. 

12 Subsequently, the EPA performed an exhaustive 

13 review of the relative scientific research and 

14 determined that global warming emission is a 

15 danger to public health and welfare, and 

16 therefore must be regulated.

17 Because the EPA's finding is based on 

18 well-established science, any effort to prevent 

19 or delay them from taking action to reduce global 

20 warming emissions is a rejection of that science.

21 The EPA is charged with protecting our 

22 public health and our environment, and the Clean 
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1 Air Act is an extraordinarily successful and cost 

2 effective way of doing this.

3 In 2010 alone, this science-based law 

4 prevents an estimated 160,000 premature deaths 

5 and millions of cases of respiratory and 

6 cardiovascular disease, annual benefits that it 

7 projects to grow during the next decade.

8 The Clean Air Act is also good for the 

9 economy with benefits exceeding its cost by 26 to 

10 1. Now, the EPA must be allowed to act under its 

11 authority and law, and begin regulating global 

12 warming emissions. This Act is important to move 

13 forward with.

14 Finally, I would like to submit two 

15 short reports, which I coauthored with our 

16 climate scientist Todd Sanford that provide more 

17 details on expected impacts from climate change.

18 These two reports are part of UCS's 

19 climate change and their health series. The 

20 first is entitled, "Rising Temperatures Worsening 

21 Ozone Pollution." Ozone pollution is directly 

22 linked to temperature, thus, climate change could 
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1 likely lead to increased ozone levels.

2 Our analysis found that in the next 10 

3 years, climate change induced ozone increases in 

4 the United States could result in 2.8 million 

5 additional respiratory illnesses, 5,100 more 

6 infants and seniors hospitalized with serious 

7 breathing problems, and 944,000 extra missed 

8 school days. All told, these health-related 

9 impacts could cost approximately 5.4 billion in 

10 2020 alone.

11 If global warming continues unabated, 

12 these impacts and costs will continue to rise.

13 The second report is entitled, "After 

14 the Storm," which details the hidden health risks 

15 of flooding in a warming world. Heavy rainfall 

16 events that can lead to flooding have been 

17 increasing at the same time the temperature has 

18 been rising in the United States.

19 The problem will likely grow worse in 

20 coming years as earth's atmosphere continues to 

21 warm, leaving more and more Americans vulnerable 

22 to the immediate and lingering health impacts of 
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1 a major flood event.

2 This report combines a review of 

3 flooding health risks with a look at how climate 

4 change in current development patterns will 

5 likely increase the threat in years ahead. We 

6 urge you to act swiftly in finalizing this rule 

7 and propose a draft rule for existing power 

8 plants.

9 I hope and I pray that these standards 

10 will be finalized quickly. Our children and our 

11 future depends on it.

12 Thank you for your time.

13 MR. CULLIGAN: Thank you.

14 DR. JHA: Good morning. My name is Dr. 

15 Vinayak Jha, V-I-N-A-Y-A-K, last name Jha, J-H-A.

16 I practice pulmonary and critical care 

17 medicine at the George Washington University 

18 Medical Center. I am also privileged to direct 

19 the pulmonary fellowship program there at GW and 

20 thereby help to train two new lung doctors in 

21 critical care positions each year.

22 Almost every day I treat people whose 
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1 life is affected by asthma, emphysema, or chronic 

2 bronchitis. I am here, therefore, to support EPA 

3 limits on power plant carbon pollution. The EPA 

4 and I have similar goals. We both want to help 

5 people breathe easier.

6 Allow me to share with you what it is 

7 like for one of my patients with lung disease. 

8 Imagine someone referred because for several 

9 months they have been short of breath. Things 

10 that were previously easy for them to do, going 

11 for a jog or walking up a flight of stairs, are 

12 now difficult.

13 After evaluating them and running tests, 

14 I determined that they have COPD, chronic 

15 obstructive pulmonary disease. Although there is 

16 treatment, the damage is permanent and there is 

17 no cure. This news can be sobering and even more 

18 so when one realizes that COPD is a leading cause 

19 of death in the U.S., and there are approximately 

20 12 million Americans who have the condition.

21 Fortunately, in addition to medications, 

22 there are some ways to manage their COPD, and I 
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1 counsel them to quit smoking if they have not 

2 already, flu shots and the pneumonia vaccine are 

3 also important to avoid infections that may 

4 trigger breathing trouble.

5 I also advise them to avoid dust, fumes, 

6 and pollution. Now, if they are someone who 

7 works outdoors, that may be really difficult to 

8 do. He or she may simply not be able to report 

9 to work some days if there is heavy pollution on 

10 that day, and whether you are an outdoor worker 

11 or not, COPD is a major cause of disability in 

12 the United States. In fact, half of all COPD 

13 patients say their condition limits their ability 

14 to work.

15 Even for the vast majority of people who 

16 don't work outside, they are still affected 

17 clearly by air pollution, especially if they live 

18 in an area with a large number of smog or ozone 

19 alert days. As we all know, ozone smog forms 

20 when pollution reacts with heat.

21 Carbon pollution contributes to warmer 

22 temperatures, further creating conditions for 
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1 smog formation.

2 As we have heard already in this 

3 morning's speakers, even in healthy people, ozone 

4 smog can make breathing uncomfortable. For 

5 people with asthma, it can cause irritation and 

6 worsen asthma attacks. For people with COPD and 

7 other respiratory illnesses, these ozone alert 

8 days may get harder for them to breathe.

9 Even when there are not red alert ozone 

10 days, it makes it harder for them to breathe, 

11 sometimes prompting physician visits or hospital 

12 visits.

13 So, in your review of this proposed 

14 regulation, you are incredibly important to my 

15 patients. You can actually take this step to 

16 reduce outdoor air pollution. You can set 

17 standards to limit power plant emissions.

18 As someone devoted to improving people's 

19 respiratory health, I am here to commend your 

20 efforts to reduce carbon pollution. I am also 

21 here to ask for more. The rule that the EPA has 

22 proposed does not address the carbon pollution 
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1 from existing power plants, only new ones.

2 There are almost 6,000 power plants in 

3 existence today, and there is not an indication 

4 that they will comply with this new standard for 

5 new power plants. For these standards to have 

6 the greatest effect, the Environmental Protection 

7 Agency must develop a standard for all power 

8 plants, not only ones built in the future.

9 So, there are millions of patients 

10 depending on you, millions of people depending on 

11 you. As a physician, I urge you to finalize this 

12 rule and develop standards for existing power 

13 plants as well.

14 Thank you for the opportunity to 

15 testify.

16 MR. CULLIGAN: Thank you.

17 Our next two speakers are Laura Kate 

18 Anderson and Trieste Lockwood.

19 Why don't we start with Laura Kate.

20 MS. ANDERSON: Hi. My name is Laura 

21 Kate Anderson. I live in Falls Church, Virginia, 

22 and I am a field organizer with Environment 
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1 Virginia, a statewide citizen-based environmental 

2 advocacy organization.

3 I come before you today in strong 

4 support of EPA's proposed standard to limit 

5 carbon pollution from new power plants. Power 

6 plants are the biggest single source of carbon 

7 pollution which causes global warming, so 

8 cleaning up carbon is crucial to protecting our 

9 health.

10 In my capacity as field organizer, I 

11 have been lucky enough to travel to States, help 

12 get the word out to the media and the public 

13 about the biggest problems facing Virginia's 

14 environment and the solutions that we have to fix 

15 them.

16 Everywhere I go I meet people who are 

17 passionate about keeping carbon pollution out of 

18 our air. There is no place in Virginia that will 

19 be immune from the effects of global warming. 

20 Global warming is not only raising sea levels 

21 around the world, but also makes it more likely 

22 that we will see stronger storms and more 
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1 frequent rain.

2 Thanks in large part to industrial 

3 carbon pollution, Hampton Roads residents are 

4 literally struggling to stay above water. I have 

5 spoken with some who have watched the danger grow 

6 every year, facing more and more storms that 

7 could flood their home.

8 One volunteer I met in Norfolk took me 

9 on a tour of the city's large neighborhood and 

10 pointed out the places that had flooded in the 

11 past few hurricanes and whole streets that will 

12 find themselves permanently under water in a 

13 matter of years if things continue the way they 

14 have been.

15 Coastal communities aren't the only ones 

16 facing problems. Richmond has the dubious 

17 distinction of being named the asthma capital of 

18 the country by the Asthma and Allergy Foundation 

19 of America in 2010 and 2011. Smog exacerbates 

20 asthma and more global warning pollution means 

21 more smog.

22 I have had asthma almost my entire life, 
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1 and on particularly smoggy days I can't do 

2 anything more strenuous outside than walk. I 

3 also vividly remember a child's asthma attacks 

4 and trips to the emergency room, and the 

5 terrifying feeling of not being able to breathe.

6 I can only imagine that my asthma was 

7 even scarier for my parents. When I was five, my 

8 severe asthma attacks landed me in the hospital 

9 for a week. My parents were overseas visiting 

10 relatives, and when they found out from an 

11 international phone call from my grandmother that 

12 I was in the hospital, they took the first flight 

13 home.

14 Maybe when I am a parent myself, I will 

15 be able to understand how they must have felt 

16 sitting during a 12-hour plane ride with no way 

17 of knowing how I was doing.

18 In the meantime, though, I do know that 

19 industrial carbon pollution means more parents 

20 will have to go through what mine went through.

21 A warming world will have more smog 

22 days, means more kids with asthma are rushed to 
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1 the hospital, days when playing outside is 

2 dangerous just because of the air our children 

3 breathe.

4 In 2010, the Richmond area had 12 of 

5 those days, the D.C. area had 36. Everywhere I 

6 go, I meet people who are concerned about the 

7 impacts that smog has on their health. In 

8 Northern Virginia, people in places like Reston 

9 and Loudon are forming their own start-up 

10 environmental organizations to combat air 

11 pollution and other problems on the most local 

12 level.

13 People in Fairfax recently gathered at 

14 an Environment Virginia event to learn more about 

15 what dirty air means for our health and exchange 

16 ideas on how to fix it. In Charlottesville, one 

17 doctor I spoke with said that asthma is reaching 

18 epidemic proportions among the children there and 

19 that that epidemic is being fueled by the dirty 

20 air they breathe.

21 Another child's doctor said that he 

22 treats children nearly every day for asthma 
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1 flareups and that pollution is part of the reason 

2 they are getting sick.

3 I have also worked with college students 

4 from George Mason University in Fairfax to the 

5 University of Virginia in Charlottesville, the 

6 college of William and Mary in Williamsburg. 

7 Many of the students I have met see global 

8 warming as the most profound environmental threat 

9 of their generation.

10 They are doing whatever they can to stop 

11 it, from getting their friends to use less 

12 electricity in the dorms, starting bike share 

13 programs and campus gardens to lobbying their 

14 school administration to adopt sustainable 

15 practices, but they also know that these actions 

16 are only part of the puzzle and that Federal 

17 Government actions to cut carbon pollution is an 

18 essential piece.

19 All over Virginia, people are speaking 

20 up about the need to fight global warming. We 

21 are getting news articles written about it and 

22 across the street and the State, we are getting 
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1 our opinions printed as Letters to the Editor. 

2 We are knocking on doors and talking to citizens 

3 and hearing time and time again we need to do 

4 something about this now.

5 EPA's proposed standard to limit carbon 

6 pollution from new power plants is a necessary 

7 step in the fight to protect our health and our 

8 communities from the effects of global warming, 

9 but it is not a sufficient one.

10 EPA needs to finalize the standard for 

11 new power plants and then move forward to propose 

12 and finalize the standard for existing power 

13 plants, as well.

14 Virginia power plants support 32 million 

15 tons of carbon pollution into the air in 2010. 

16 We simply can't stop global warming without 

17 setting limits on those plants.

18 Clean air is a need that transcends 

19 every possible division among people, race, 

20 location, background, political party. We can't 

21 wait any longer to attack global warming. I urge 

22 EPA to protect our health by finalizing the 
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1 proposed standards to cut carbon pollution from 

2 power plants as soon as possible because our 

3 health can't wait.

4 Thank you.

5 MR. CULLIGAN: Thank you.

6 MS. LOCKWOOD: Good morning. My name is 

7 Trieste Lockwood, T-R-I-E-S-T-E L-O-C-K-W-O-O-D, 

8 and I speak from my position as director of 

9 Virginia Interfaith Power & Light.

10 Thank you for your work and for holding 

11 today's hearing. We highly value the open 

12 process around this rulemaking and appreciate the 

13 opportunity to bring in constituents from across 

14 Virginia to speak to you today.

15 It is encouraging to know that the EPA 

16 is addressing carbon pollution and engaging the 

17 public on this carbon pollution standard that 

18 could positively affect so many people.

19 I would like to start by telling you a 

20 little bit more about the work we do and the 

21 widespread support in the communities for 

22 eliminating industrial carbon pollution.
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1 Virginia Interfaith Power & Light is one 

2 of 39 State affiliates of the National Interfaith 

3 Power & Light group. Together, we are composed 

4 of thousands of congregations and individuals 

5 whose voices of faith are heard locally and 

6 nationally on responsible energy use and climate 

7 change.

8 Virginia Interfaith Power & Light is

9 also part of the Interfaith Center for Public 

10 Policy, the oldest State-based advocacy group in 

11 the State. We work with 10 adjudicatories and 

12 reach thousands of people on environmental issues 

13 throughout Virginia including those of Hindu, 

14 Jewish, Muslim, and Christian traditions.

15 I have personally worked with Jerry 

16 Lawson, who is EPA's national manager for energy, 

17 small business and congregations network on our 

18 energy stewardship workshop, and these were 

19 created to reduce carbon pollution from these 

20 facilities and educate the faith community on 

21 energy efficiency.

22 Through this experience I have seen a 
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1 sincere passion and initiative of our network 

2 members to reduce their energy consumption and 

3 carbon footprints. Fossil- fueled power plants 

4 currently emit more than 2 billion tons of carbon 

5 pollution and other toxic pollutants into the air 

6 each year. Modernizing new power plants with 

7 better technologies will reduce the emissions 

8 that contribute to climate change and health 

9 problems.

10 Climate change and the respiratory 

11 problems that you are hearing about today, caused 

12 by smog, disproportionately affect the most 

13 vulnerable communities. For many, this is a moral 

14 issue, and I am here today to echo the widespread 

15 support from hundreds of these community members 

16 who desire standards to improve our air quality.

17 Protecting air quality for all 

18 populations is a critical part of EPA's work. 

19 Putting a national cap on carbon pollution from 

20 power plants multiplies the effects of local 

21 action people take to reduce their energy use.

22 We strongly support enacting these 
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1 historic carbon pollution standards and thank you 

2 for your time today.

3 MR. CULLIGAN: Thank both of you.

4 Our next two speakers are Jonathan Kolm 

5 and Mitch Hescox.

6 We will start with Jonathan and give 

7 Mitch a chance to sit down.

8 MR. KOLM: Good morning. My name is 

9 Jonathan Kolm. I am a volunteer with the Sierra 

10 Club. I am a resident of Alexandria, Virginia.

11 Today is an historic day. The carbon 

12 pollution standards that the EPA is proposing 

13 have the potential to usher in a multiple of 

14 positive changes that will be of great benefit to 

15 all Americans.

16 For such important issues like climate 

17 change and the impact of the use of coal and 

18 other fossil fuels, I believe it is vitally 

19 important to consider relevant precedence in 

20 other industries. There is one in particular 

21 that I believe is worth considering to put into 

22 context policy decisions concerning the 
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1 regulation of coal and other fossil fuels.

2 Until the middle of the 20th century, we 

3 did not know with scientific and medical 

4 certainty that smoking was harmful to our health. 

5 It took longer than it should have, but in 1964, 

6 the Surgeon General issued a direct, clear 

7 warning that smoking was directly attributed to 

8 cancer, heart disease, and emphysema.

9 In that year, almost half U.S. and all 

10 populations smoked. Over the next couple of 

11 decades, it took great courage on the part of 

12 whistleblowers, scientists, doctors, grass-roots 

13 campaigners and policymakers to confront the 

14 tobacco industry.

15 Over time they were successful in 

16 raising the issue and they increased taxes and 

17 public awareness of the dangers of smoking was 

18 increased. The tobacco industry fought hard 

19 against any changes they knew that cut into the 

20 process, but through the hard work and 

21 determination of those that had the courage to 

22 stand up to the tobacco industry, real change has 
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1 been accomplished.

2 Today, less than 20 percent of the 

3 American adult population smokes, and no one 

4 debates anymore that smoking is harmful to our 

5 health. We are a better nation today for 

6 standing up to the tobacco industry.

7 So, too, has the fossil fuel industry 

8 unfolded. When fossil fuel use began, we didn't 

9 know all of the negative health effects that they 

10 have, but we do now.

11 The mouth and top removal of coal in 

12 States like West Virginia has devastated the 

13 water and environment of many communities. The 

14 mercury and other toxic emissions of coal plants 

15 is directly linked to death and disease.

16 As we have to drill for oil in more 

17 extreme places, the likelihood of disasters like

18 the BP Gulf of Mexico spill increase, tapping 

19 into shale gas reserves with fracking has already 

20 shown that the injection of toxic substances can 

21 contaminate local water supplies.

22 These are among many other documented 
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1 health risks in the extraction and burning of 

2 fossil fuels, but there are two additional 

3 pressing reasons that we must work swiftly to 

4 curb the use of coal and other fossil fuels.

5 The first reason is climate change. 

6 Today, there is overwhelming scientific consensus 

7 that the increase in carbon dioxide in the 

8 atmosphere through fossil fuel use is directly 

9 linked to climate change.

10 Our changing climate has already 

11 produced a number of extreme weather events from 

12 droughts in Texas to floods in the Midwest, and 

13 more frequent and intense tornadoes and storms.

14 Another product of climate change is 

15 rising sea levels, but the current level of 

16 increase, the historic part of the city where I 

17 live, Old Town Alexandria, will be under water by 

18 the end of this century.

19 The second reason is that fossil fuels 

20 are finite and there is only so much coal, oil, 

21 and gas in the ground. As we remain utterly 

22 dependent on fossil fuels, we are captive to 
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1 resource depletion, wild price swings that play 

2 havoc with our economy, and we must make 

3 difficult geopolitical choices in order to secure 

4 oil supplies.

5 The fossil fuel industry is aware of all 

6 of this, but like the tobacco industry before 

7 them, they will fight any change that might mean 

8 a cut in their profits. They are simply doing 

9 what they are legally bound to do, to create a 

10 maximum return for their shareholders.

11 We need the EPA and other public 

12 servants whose job it is to protect the common 

13 good and the health of the environment, and the 

14 citizens of our great nation to take the lead in 

15 the struggle.

16 The people here today and millions more 

17 all over the country are in support of the carbon 

18 pollution standards. I remain optimistic that 

19 America can rise to meet the energy and 

20 environmental challenges before us. We have 

21 brilliant scientists, the savvy entrepreneurial 

22 class, and many innovators of new technologies.
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1 We have the right policies in place, we 

2 can invent and create a clean energy future that 

3 is sustainable, poses less risk to our health, 

4 and increases our national security.

5 The proposed carbon pollution standards 

6 are a vital early step in this effort that we are 

7 all in together.

8 Thank you for your time.

9 MR. CULLIGAN: Thank you.

10 REV. HESCOX: Good morning. My name is 

11 Mitch Hescox. I am the Reverend Mitch Hescox. I 

12 am president of the Evangelical Environmental 

13 Network, and I reside in New Freedom, 

14 Pennsylvania.

15 On March 27th of this year, the EPA 

16 proposed the first national carbon pollution 

17 standard for power plants. This truly is an 

18 historic step in the right direction to overcome 

19 global warming and protecting human health.

20 The simple fact that if man is not able 

21 to solve his ecological problems, then, man's 

22 resources are going to die. Those words were 
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1 stated by Francis Schaefer, a noted evangelical 

2 in 1970, and they remain true today.

3 The earth has a fever, and the fever's 

4 impacts have reached epidemic proportions 

5 threatening all of us. Simply put, climate change 

6 is the greatest moral challenge of our time. 

7 Climate change resulting from carbon pollution 

8 makes bad things worse. It intensifies natural 

9 processes, making natural events unnatural or 

10 extreme, and it hits the most vulnerable the 

11 hardest.

12 The climate change vulnerability index 

13 graphically indicates the difficulty for those 

14 scraping out a life on the world's poorest 

15 people. The Democratic Republic of Congo, Kady, 

16 Malawi, Sierra Leone, and Bangladesh are always 

17 some of the most difficult places to survive in 

18 the entire world, and with climate change, they 

19 are most at risk.

20 These threats are not some future event, 

21 they are happening now, and God's children across 

22 this planet cry for our help. The Katem 
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1 commitment issued by the Lausanne movement 

2 founded by Billy Graham and John Stott recognizes 

3 the need for climate change action, as does the 

4 global evangelical network, the mico challenge.

5 The changing climate kills hundreds of 

6 thousands of people each year, multiplies 

7 diseases, and forces millions to flee their 

8 homeland as food and water scarcities simply do 

9 not exist. Without basic needs being met, 

10 conflict ensues.

11 In October 2009, Burke, et al., 

12 published "Warming Increases the Risk of Civil 

13 War in Africa." The author's model, the impacts 

14 just described and their influence by temperature 

15 rise. They conclude that for each 1 degree 

16 Celsius warming will result in 49 percent 

17 increase in African civil wars, a 54 percent 

18 increase in conflict, an additional almost 

19 400,000 battle deaths within the next 20 years.

20 They are not alone in predicting 

21 increased instability. Our own U.S. Department 

22 of Defense said in its quadrennial review at 2010 
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1 that climate change will continue to contribute 

2 to food and water scarcity, will increase the 

3 threat of disease, and may spur or exacerbate 

4 mass migration.

5 While climate change alone does not 

6 cause conflict, it may act as an accelerant of 

7 instability or conflict, placing a burden to 

8 respond on civil institutions and militaries 

9 around the world.

10 These facts represent people. Victor 

11 Mughogho, the director of the Eagle's Relief and 

12 Development Agency in Malawi, just visited the 

13 United States. During his time with us, Victor 

14 shared exactly what climate scientists have 

15 predicted for years.

16 Victor told us how their parents, the 

17 rainy season was so predictable they could plant 

18 repeatedly on every year on October 15th. They 

19 planted, the rains fell, predictable, stable, 

20 reliable.

21 They grew so much food that they had an 

22 overabundance. In their parents' lives, they 
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1 experienced only one major drought, but since 

2 1970, droughts, floods, and unpredictable rains 

3 have become the new normal, exactly what 

4 scientists said climate change would do, wrecking 

5 havoc for poor farmers.

6 2011 was the fourth consecutive year of 

7 drought that was played in Malawi. Moreover, 

8 when the rains came, they were unpredictable. 

9 Victor told us that last year, that farmers 

10 planted and crops failed, planted and failed 

11 again, planted a third time and still failed.

12 Hunger, malnutrition, the stenning of 

13 children are all the results, and Victor reminded 

14 us that all this is happening will damage the 

15 future of Malawi. I have much more to report and 

16 you will find that in my written testimony, but 

17 the new source standard for carbon pollution 

18 remains but a first step, and only a first step.

19 We need a clean energy revolution whose 

20 rate of change must be incredibly fast. A 

21 transition will not provide an adequate means to 

22 protect public health and the well documented 
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1 fossil fuel consequences.

2 Many people here today will talk about 

3 the increase in jobs, the public health benefits, 

4 unveiling the true cost of coal, which right now 

5 experts with Harvard say adds anywhere from 9 

6 cents to 27 cents per kilowatt in the real cost 

7 of public health and other things.

8 Today's action is a first step. We need 

9 that kind of clean energy revolution. As I 

10 mentioned here today, and I will conclude with 

11 the following, you may consider that I look like 

12 Johnnie Cash today, and I did that for a purpose. 

13 I came here today to speak for those without a 

14 voice.

15 Many will talk about other things, but I 

16 come here to believe that climate change, carbon 

17 pollution, and the health risks, population risks 

18 are truly a great moral challenge, and we, people 

19 of faith, and we, people of the United States 

20 have a moral responsibility to protect our own 

21 children and the children of the world.

22 Thank you very much.
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1 MR. CULLIGAN: Thank you.

2 Our next two speakers are Mari 

3 Castellanos and Damian Pitt.

4 We will start with Mari.

5 REV. CASTELLANOS: Good morning. My 

6 name is Reverend Mari Castellanos, and I am here 

7 representing both the United Church of Christ, 

8 which has more than 5,600 congregations and more 

9 than 1.2 million members, as well as the National 

10 Council of Churches, which is made of 37 

11 Christian denominations including the UCC and 

12 more than 100,000 congregations in the United 

13 States.

14 The United Church of Christ and the 

15 broader faith community applaud the Environmental 

16 Protection Agency for its proposed carbon 

17 pollution standard for new plants. We believe 

18 your proposed rule will improve air quality in 

19 this country and uses the Clean Air Act the way 

20 it was intended, to protect creation and ensure 

21 healthy communities for all of God's children.

22 As noted in the EPA's 2009 Endangerment 
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1 Finding, carbon dioxide, as one of the greenhouse 

2 gases, is a threat to human health and welfare. 

3 Carbon dioxide is one of the leading contributors 

4 to global climate change, an issue that the faith 

5 community believes is one of our greatest moral 

6 challenges of our time.

7 Climate change is having enormous impact 

8 on creation, the very creation that God declared 

9 good, as we read in the Book of Genesis, the very 

10 creation that we depend on to live life right 

11 here on earth, the very creation that is a gift 

12 from God, not only for us humans, but for all 

13 creatures of the earth.

14 Changes in local climate including, as 

15 we have just heard, more frequent natural 

16 disasters, of floods and droughts, as well as 

17 changes in seasonal cycles, are not only 

18 affecting our communities, our human communities, 

19 but are disturbing the systems that the entire 

20 creation relies on.

21 We must do all that we can to prevent 

22 future impacts, as well as prepare for the 
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1 changes we can no longer prevent.

2 While the standard proposed by the EPA 

3 will not eliminate carbon emissions from the 

4 power sector, they would put forth a standard for 

5 carbon emissions that utilities and businesses 

6 can use for planning purposes that will not 

7 increase utility rates for consumers, and that 

8 lays the groundwork for improvements to the 

9 utility sector, which is responsible for more 

10 than 30 percent of U.S. carbon dioxide emissions.

11 As religious people, we pray and long 

12 for the day when power plants will have no carbon 

13 dioxide emissions and when people will treat 

14 energy as the gift that it is, using only that 

15 which is needed in their daily lives.

16 Presently, we encourage you to maintain 

17 the rule as is, along transitional plans to be 

18 built over the 12 months and limiting future 

19 plans to 1,000 pounds of carbon per megawatt are 

20 generated.

21 Thank you for the opportunity to share 

22 the perspective of the Christian Church as other 
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1 speakers have done and will do.

2 Thank you.

3 MR. CULLIGAN: Thank you.

4 DR. PITT: My name is Dr. Damian Pitt. 

5 That is D-A-M-I-A-N P-I-T-T. I am an assistant 

6 professor of urban and regional planning at the 

7 L. Douglas Wilder School of Government and Public 

8 Affairs at Virginia Commonwealth University. I 

9 am here at the request of my colleagues from 

10 Virginia Interfaith Power & Light.

11 I would like to begin by thanking the 

12 EPA and the members of this panel for the 

13 opportunity to give this testimony.

14 I am strongly in favor of the EPA's 

15 proposed carbon pollution standard for new power 

16 plants. My research is primarily on climate 

17 action planning in which local governments devise 

18 strategies to reduce carbon emissions in their 

19 communities through energy efficiency renewable 

20 energy use and other means.

21 Over 1,000 cities and towns across the 

22 country are engaged in these efforts. In 
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1 addition, many States are devising plans and 

2 adopting policies to address climate change, 

3 however, the State and local efforts are 

4 insufficient as long as our electricity is 

5 provided in large part by antiquated fossil fuel 

6 power plants emitting massive amount of carbon 

7 pollution.

8 It is time for the Federal Government to 

9 do its part by adopting these proposed carbon 

10 pollution standards for new power plants.

11 I would like to share with you a story

12 about one small town's efforts to address climate 

13 change by reducing its own carbon emissions, and 

14 use that context to demonstrate the dramatic 

15 benefits that these proposed standards would 

16 have.

17 From 2007 to 2011, I assisted the town 

18 of Blacksburg, Virginia, in developing a draft 

19 climate action plan which includes an inventory 

20 of current and proposed future carbon emissions 

21 from the community, a goal for reducing those 

22 future emissions, and a series of recommendations 
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1 for policies and programs to achieve those 

2 emissions reductions.

3 As part of this process, I worked with 

4 students at Virginia Tech to evaluate a variety 

5 of potential carbon reduction strategies. We put 

6 a major emphasis on residential energy 

7 efficiency, which is our view of I believe the 

8 most effective way that local governments can 

9 reduce energy use in carbon emissions.

10 In a paper recently published in the 

11 Journal of Energy Environment Research, we found 

12 that an aggressive program to retrofit every 

13 single family home in Blacksburg using the best 

14 efficiency technologies on the market today would 

yield about 27,000 metric tons of annual CO2 15

16 equivalent to greenhouse gas reductions.

17 So, let's contrast those with the 

18 potential carbon reductions with the ones that 

19 could be achieved from these proposed standards.

20 According to EPA's eGRID data, there are 

21 25 large power plants in Virginia that produce at 

22 least 100,000 megawatt hours of electricity per 
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1 year at CO2 rates exceeding the proposed 

2 standard. The median output of these plants is 

3 about 463,000 megawatt hours and the median CO2

4 rate is about 2,000 pounds per megawatt hour, 

5 about twice the proposed limit.

6 If just one of these typical power 

7 plants in Virginia were to meet the proposed 

8 standard, that would save over 210,000 metric 

9 tons of CO2 annually. In other words, just one 

10 plant that meets the standard would save about 

11 eight times more carbon per year than Blacksburg 

12 community of about 50,000 residents could hope to 

13 achieve from dramatically improving the energy 

14 efficiency of every single family home in town.

15 These numbers demonstrate that while 

16 significant carbon reductions can be achieved 

17 through energy efficiency and other programs at 

18 the local level, they fail in comparison to the 

19 vast amounts of carbon that could be saved over 

20 the long term through implementation of the 

21 proposed standards.

22 In order to achieve notable carbon 
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1 reductions across the country and do our part to 

2 mitigate the impacts of future climate change, we 

3 must take action at all levels of government, and 

4 that is why it is extremely important that these 

5 proposed carbon standards for future power plants 

6 be implemented.

7 Thank you.

8 MR. CULLIGAN: Thank you. Will your 

9 written comments include the Blacksburg study?

10 DR. PITT: I have a summary of some of 

11 those results in the handout I gave you, and I 

12 can add more in depth.

13 MR. CULLIGAN: Thanks.

14 Our next two speakers are Mary Ann Hitt 

15 and Dede Smith.

16 MS. HITT: Good morning. My name is 

17 Mary Ann Hitt. I am a mother, a concerned 

18 citizen, and the director of the Sierra Club's 

19 Beyond Coal Campaign.

20 I live in West Virginia with my family 

21 and because my husband is traveling on business 

22 this week, I am joined today by my two-year-old 
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1 daughter Hazel. So, hopefully, her patience will 

2 last through the length of my testimony. We will 

3 see.

4 I am here today to voice my full support 

5 for the EPA's proposed carbon pollution standard. 

6 A decade ago, there were over 200 proposed 

7 coal-fired power plants on the drawing board 

8 nationwide.

9 Fast forward to today, 10 years later, 

10 and only a handful of those plants have been 

11 built. Why? Some of them were rejected by moms, 

12 dads, small business owners, and other local 

13 community leaders who feared that a major new 

14 industrial polluter in their backyard would not 

15 only harm their children's health, but would 

16 destroy their property values and trap them in a 

17 town or a neighborhood condemned to a downward 

18 spiral of pollution and poverty.

19 Some of those coal plants were rejected 

20 by governors who wanted their States to be clean 

21 energy leaders in the 21st century and thought 

22 major new investments in coal would take their 
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1 State in exactly the wrong direction.

2 Some of those coal plants were rejected 

3 by State regulators who feared that rate payers 

4 would pay dearly on their electric bills if their 

5 State became locked into high carbon energy for 

6 the next 50-plus years, and some were rejected by 

7 financial backers, who realized that these 

8 projects were an increasingly bad bet, because 

9 they simply could not compete with the rapidly 

10 dropping prices of cleaner sources of energy.

11 As a result, only one new coal-fired 

12 power plant has broken ground in the U.S. since 

13 2008, and the permit for that project was 

14 recently struck down in an unanimous decision by 

15 the Mississippi Supreme Court.

16 During the same decade in 2009, the EPA 

17 issued its finding that carbon pollution 

18 endangers public health and welfare. As I just 

19 noted, Americans of all walks of life were 

20 simultaneously reaching the same conclusion, from 

21 financiers to governors, and from State 

22 regulators to local moms and dads.
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1 In issuing this proposed carbon 

2 pollution standard, the EPA has taken an 

3 important step to safeguard our health and our 

4 families. As I am sure you will hear many times 

5 today, carbon pollution has been linked by 

6 scientists to increasing temperatures, decreasing 

7 levels of smog, which triggers asthma attacks and 

8 other life-threatening health problems.

9 But carbon pollution doesn't just 

10 threaten our children's health today, as the main 

11 cause of climate disruption, carbon pollution 

12 casts a dark shadow over every aspect of their 

13 future, a future menaced by the threat of 

14 increasing droughts, wildfires, tornadoes, 

15 hurricanes, rising sea levels, not to mention the 

16 resulting political instability around the world.

17 My daughter Hazel is the light of my 

18 life. She is learning to sing. She never, ever 

19 wants to go inside including being in here at 

20 this moment, and one of her favorite things is 

21 wandering around the alleys of our small town 

22 looking for cats.
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1 She is also an 11th generation West 

2 Virginian through her father. With our deep 

3 Appalachian roots, we understand in our family 

4 all too well the challenges that the clean energy 

5 future poses to some parts of the country, but I 

6 believe we have the ingenuity and the knowhow to 

7 tackle those challenges.

8 Here is how the largest newspaper in 

9 West Virginia, the Charleston Gazette, put it in 

10 their editorial this past Sunday. "The topic of 

11 climate change has special resonance in West 

12 Virginia, a fossil fuel treasure trove, and what 

13 happens here has a special impact on the future 

14 of the planet. Pollution controls seeking to 

15 reduce global warming are sure to impose tighter 

16 restrictions on coal and natural gas.

17 West Virginia's energy should not be 

18 squandered on short-sighted attempts to protect 

19 the status quo, or to discredit science in the 

20 public eye, or to vilify the Obama 

21 administration's very reasonable proposal that 

22 new coal-fired power plants be required to limit 
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1 their greenhouse gas emissions.

2 Hazel, I am almost done.

3 The EPA's proposed carbon pollution 

4 standard is a common sense step towards 

5 addressing a very real threat to this nation and 

6 to the future that my daughter and all our 

7 children will inherit.

8 If anything, the EPA is arriving late in 

9 the game, following in the footsteps of community 

10 leaders, governors, State regulators, and 

11 financiers, who all realized in the past decade 

12 that new power plants in this country must deal 

13 with their carbon pollution.

14 I support the proposed standard and I 

15 encourage you to finalize it with all due haste.

16 Thank you very much.

17 MR. CULLIGAN: Thank you.

18 MS. SMITH: Ooh, I am not sure I can 

19 compete with Hazel. Good morning. Thank you for 

20 this opportunity.

21 My name is Dede Smith and I am here from 

22 Charlottesville, Virginia, where I am an elected 
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1 member of City Council. On April 2, 2012, the 

2 Charlottesville City Council voted unanimously to 

3 endorse the EPA's proposal to limit carbon 

4 pollution from new coal-fired power plants. I 

5 have attached a copy of that resolution to my 

6 statement.

7 Why would Charlottesville, nestled in 

8 the foothills of the Blue Ridge Mountains, be 

9 concerned about coal-burning power plants being 

10 built even hundreds of miles away? Well, simply 

11 because with a new coal-burning plant proposed in 

12 our vicinity there is an imminent threat of 

13 further degradation in air quality to those of us 

14 down wind of new sites.

15 We are concerned because our modest 

16 city, with its reputation as one of the best 

17 places to live in America, has in recent years 

18 had to issue warnings over unhealthy air quality. 

19 This is a threat to our children, to pregnant 

20 women, to the elderly, to the patients who come 

21 to our outstanding medical facilities, and to the 

22 economic health of our region.
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1 Smog is not just an eyesore. It 

2 irritates our lungs, triggers asthma attacks, 

3 increases emergency room visits, and can lead to 

4 irreversible lung damage.

5 Tourism, education, and our renowned 

6 medical centers are the core of our area's 

7 industry. A city with as rich a historic fabric 

8 as ours relies on the 2 million tourists each 

9 year who come to Charlottesville to see Thomas 

10 Jefferson's Monticello, James Monroe's Ash Lawn, 

11 and James Madison's Montpelier, or to attend one 

12 of Charlottesville's renowned literary, cultural, 

13 or artistic festivals, tour its 30 wineries and 

14 breweries, or just take in the spectacular beauty 

15 of the area, and at the heart of our local 

16 economy is the University of Virginia, 

17 consistently listed as one of the top five public 

18 universities in the country for its strong 

19 academic standing and renowned hospital.

20 Another part of our tourism attraction 

21 is Shenandoah National Park celebrating its 75th 

22 birthday today, a short jaunt from 
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1 Charlottesville and a refuge from the beltway's 

2 clamor. Sadly, where once a visitor could see 

3 more than 100 miles from its overlooks, today, 

4 its iconic views are often limited to only a mile 

5 or two due to the smog and other pollutants 

6 carried on the winds from faraway coal-burning 

7 plants and posing health risk to the 1.5 million 

8 people who visit the park every year.

9 I am here today to ask you to help us 

10 preserve the historic and natural heritage of 

11 Central Virginia and therewith its economy by 

12 reducing the amount of smog and haze allowed in 

13 our air by controlling carbon pollution from new 

14 coal-fired power plants, and I urge you further 

15 to consider higher standards for existing power 

16 plants, as well.

17 Thank you for your time and attention, 

18 and I hope you will come visit Charlottesville as 

19 we celebrate our 250th birthday.

20 Thank you.

21 MR. CULLIGAN: Thank you.

22 Our next two speakers are Allison Chin 
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1 and Becky Dawson.

2 MS. CHIN: Good morning. My name is 

3 Allison Chin and I am the president of the Sierra 

4 Club's national board of directors. On behalf of 

5 our 1.4 million members and supporters, I thank 

6 you for the opportunity to speak to you today 

7 about why the Sierra Club strongly supports the 

8 EPA's recently proposed carbon pollution 

9 standards for new power plants.

10 These standards are an important and 

11 historic step toward addressing what I believe to 

12 be one of the greatest and most daunting 

13 challenges of our generation, global climate 

14 disruption.

15 Climate disruption, which scientists 

16 tell us is happening because of ever increasing 

17 amounts of greenhouse gases, such as carbon 

18 pollution, being emitted into our air represents 

19 a threat, not just to polar bears and to Arctic 

20 dwellers, but to communities and ecosystems 

21 nationwide.

22 Scientists and doctors warn us that as 
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1 the earth warms, unhealthy levels of ozone 

2 pollution or smog will increase and become more 

3 widespread. Higher smog levels will mean more 

4 cases of respiratory illnesses, such as childhood 

5 asthma and lung disease.

6 Already, according to the American Lung 

7 Association, 154 million Americans, roughly half 

8 our country, suffer from air pollution levels 

9 that are unsafe. Holding dirty plants accountable 

10 for the carbon pollution they emit into our 

11 communities means fewer sick children and 

12 suffering loved ones, while also preserving for 

13 future generations the wild places and 

14 biodiversity that makes our country great.

15 By taking this step to address 

16 industrial pollution from power plants, the 

17 administration is setting the stage for a shift 

18 in how we power our society. If we are to grow 

19 our economy and shift into a 21st century 

20 renewable model for energy production, we must 

21 modernize our infrastructure and diversify our 

22 sources.
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1 Many States are already leading the 

2 charge to the transition to clean energy, for 

3 example, according to the American Wind and 

4 Energy Association, Iowa and North Dakota now 

5 receive 20 percent of their energy from wind 

6 power, and 38 States have utility scale wind 

7 installations.

8 As we think about what kind of world we 

9 want to live in, and leave for future 

10 generations, and what policies and laws we will 

11 enact regarding the future of energy production 

12 it seemed like a no-brainer that we would want to 

13 consistently strive for more energy and less 

14 waste, for a transition to cleaner fuels that do 

15 not pollute our air and sully our water, and to 

16 incentivize industry modernization and innovation 

17 to provide good, clean jobs for the next 

18 generation of workers.

19 Yet, unfortunately, what we have seen is 

20 a handful of corporate polluters and their 

21 well-funded lobbyists on the Hill attempt to 

22 speak for the entire energy community in opposing 
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1 these common sense steps forward on grounds no 

2 firmer than they simply do not wish to clean up 

3 their pollution, to be held accountable for their 

4 emissions and damages inflicted on the 

5 communities they serve.

6 Americans see right through these 

7 attempts to paint the EPA as the bogeyman, and 

8 poll after poll demonstrates they support 

9 implementation of the Clear Air Act and letting 

10 the EPA do its job to protect public health and 

11 ensure a cleaner future for us all.

12 We should not let a vocal minority of 

13 backward thinking, profit-driven corporate 

14 polluters derail standards that will have 

15 tremendous benefits for our children, families, 

16 and all Americans who value clean air and wild 

17 places.

18 Again, the Sierra Club strongly supports 

19 EPA's efforts to clean up dangerous carbon 

20 pollution, and we strongly support this rule.

21 Thank you.

22 MR. CULLIGAN: Thank you.
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1 DR. DAWSON: Good morning. My name is 

2 Becky Smallin Dawson, and I am an assistant 

3 professor in the Department of Global and 

4 Community Health at George Mason University.

5 My research and teaching interest and 

6 truly my professional passion lie at the 

7 intersection of public health and environmental 

8 science, and I am here today to voice my support 

9 for EPA's proposed standard for carbon pollution 

10 from new power plants, and I would also like to 

11 urge the agency to develop standards for the 

12 existing power plants.

13 I came to Washington, D.C. as a newly 

14 minted Master of Public Health with a focus on 

15 environmental health issues 10 years ago today. 

16 My first task and my first full-time job was on a 

17 project aimed at identifying strategies to reduce 

18 environmental factors that contribute to asthma 

19 in children.

20 Ten years ago, both the public health 

21 and the environmental health communities were 

22 keenly aware of the association between air 
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1 pollution and asthma, so it is disheartening for 

2 me to read the latest vital statistics from CDC 

3 that say that the number of people diagnosed with 

4 asthma grew by 4.3 million people between 2001 

5 and 2009.

6 From 2001 through 2009, the asthma rates 

7 rose the most among black children, almost a 50 

8 percent increase. Asthma was linked to 3,447 

9 deaths in 2007 alone. Asthma costs in the United 

10 States grew from about $53 billion in 2002 to $56 

11 billion in 2007, and this is about a 6 percent 

12 increase.

13 During the past decade, as the number of 

14 asthmatics and asthma-related illnesses and death 

15 have grown, the scientific literature linking 

16 asthma particularly in children to air pollution 

17 has also grown.

18 The peer-reviewed literature shows that 

19 evidence to particulate matter, ozone, and other 

20 air pollutants is associated with several 

21 measures of increased asthma including increased 

22 symptoms, such as wheezing, increased bronchitis 
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1 in children with asthma, increased medication 

2 use, and reduced lung function.

3 The adverse effects associated with air 

4 pollution are not limited to asthma and other 

5 respiratory illnesses. A systematic review and 

6 meta-analysis published in the Journal of the 

7 American Medical Association in February of this 

8 year found that carbon monoxide, nitrogen oxide, 

9 sulphur dioxide, pm10 and pm2.5 were 

10 significantly associated with increased risks of 

11 myocardial infarction.

12 The evidence linking air pollution to 

13 several adverse health outcomes, namely, asthma 

14 and MI, is strong, and it should be noted that 

15 the burden of these diseases disproportionately 

16 impacts two of the most vulnerable populations, 

17 our children and the elderly.

18 Each year I teach a survey course on 

19 environmental health to both undergrad and 

20 graduate students at George Mason. During my 

21 introductory lecture, we identified the 

22 environmental health challenges facing us in the 
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1 21st century. Without fail, global climate 

2 change is identified as the most important 

3 environmental health issue for the future.

4 The evidence that the temperature of the 

5 earth is increasing is undeniable. Combine that 

6 with the fact that evidence linking air pollution 

7 to asthma, other respiratory illnesses, and MI, 

8 and we are creating the perfect storm, the 

9 perfect environmental health storm.

10 We need to make changes as individuals, 

11 communities, and as a nation to prevent this 

12 storm from rising. We must take steps to address 

13 global climate change, and we must take steps to 

14 improve our ambient air quality, our health 

15 depends on it.

16 EPA needs to address carbon pollution. 

17 New and existing power plants, the largest single 

18 source of carbon pollution, need to be held 

19 accountable for the pollution they create.

20 Before I step down, I want to take off 

21 my hat as a professor and put on my hat as a 

22 mother of two young and healthy children. I want 
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1 my kids to grow up in this city. We live about 

2 two miles north, where they can be outside every 

3 day during the summer without breathing unhealthy 

4 air.

5 As a mother and an environmental health 

6 researcher and educator, I believe that we need 

7 to shift our thinking and our actions to reflect 

8 the message contained in the Native American 

9 proverb. The proverb reads that we need to treat 

10 the earth well. It is not given to you by your 

11 parents, it is loaned to you by your children. 

12 We do not inherit the earth from our ancestors, 

13 we borrow it from our children.

14 We have borrowed too much from our 

15 children already. The time to act is now. The 

16 time to treat the earth well is now. Let us 

17 begin by working together and limiting carbon 

18 pollution produced by power plants.

19 Thank you.

20 MR. CULLIGAN: Our next two speakers are 

21 Carol Stone and Christina and no last name. 

22 Let's start with Carol.
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1 MS. STONE: My name is Carol Stone, 

2 C-A-R-O-L S-T-O-N-E. I am a resident of 

3 Virginia for the past 23 years. I am here as a 

4 citizen. I frequently sail on the Chesapeake Bay 

5 and camp, hike, and cycle in the Potomac and 

6 Shenandoah River watersheds.

7 I relish opportunities to swim, kayak, 

8 and fish in natural waters that are clean enough 

9 and which to safely do so, which are increasingly 

10 rare. Although I work as a violin and viola 

11 teacher, because of my appreciation for clean 

12 water, I have earned a Master's degree in 

13 environmental engineering, and my personal 

14 environmental advocacy now tends to center on 

15 aquatic environments.

16 Therefore, I would like to address a 

17 specific concern about CO2 emissions that is not 

18 often mentioned in the mainstream media. This 

19 concern is the acidification of the world's 

20 oceans. Acidification and related carbonate 

21 depletion occurs when CO2 from the air mixes with 

22 saltwater and forms carbonic acid. Hydrogen ions 
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1 thus released also quickly react with carbonate 

2 ions making them unavailable to organisms in the 

3 ocean that need carbonate for shell building.

4 CO2 released into the air by power 

5 plants and other sources is quite readily 

6 absorbed into the ocean and the deleterious 

7 effects long predicted in the scientific 

8 community are beginning to be seen in reality.

9 According to NOAA, acidity in the oceans 

10 has risen 30 percent in the past 200 years since 

11 the onset of the industrial revolution, and this 

12 is thought to be primarily due to the absorption 

13 of CO2 from the air. As the rate of CO2

14 emissions increases, so does the rate of 

15 acidification of the world's oceans.

16 Ocean acidification predicted to be 

17 harmful to any aquatic organisms that form shells 

18 has already begun to be demonstrably taking its 

19 toll on the health of oyster populations in the 

20 Pacific Northwest.

21 Over the past decade, highly acidified 

22 seawater has begun rising up along portions of 
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1 the West Coast of the United States and the 

2 corrosive waters are preventing the larvae of 

3 wild oyster populations from successfully forming 

4 shells in areas such as the Puget Sound of 

5 Washington State.

6 Oyster hatcheries in Washington and 

7 Oregon have also begun to experience extremely 

8 high larval mortality rates that have been 

9 attributed to the same corrosively acidic 

10 seawater. Affected oyster hatcheries on the West 

11 Coast must now monitor their seawater intake to 

12 avoid the most acidic water and buffer overly 

13 acidic water using sodium bicarbonate in order to 

14 raise the pH levels to allow oyster larvae to 

15 survive. This is an expensive and short-term 

16 solution and is currently supported with Federal 

17 funds.

18 The problem in the American Northwest is 

19 an example of what we can expect to see more of 

20 worldwide as CO2 emissions from power plants and 

21 other sources continues. According to Richard 

22 Feely, a senior scientist at NOAA's Pacific 
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1 Marine Environmental Laboratory, and an expert in 

2 ocean's carbon chemistry, problems with ocean 

3 acidification are also starting to be seen in the 

4 United States Atlantic Coast and in Australia.

5 Agricultural runoff and sewerage have 

6 been taking a toll on the once thriving oyster 

7 business in the Chesapeake Bay and now a rising 

8 ocean acidity is further exacerbating the 

9 problems of CO2 laden waters right here.

10 All organisms that build a shell or 

11 contribute a branch of the coral reef are 

12 threatened, not just mussels and oysters that 

13 some may love to eat. A multitude of familiar 

14 organisms and also those we may not be so 

15 familiar with, such as foraminifera, form an 

16 integral part of the food chain and also provide 

17 essential oceanic habitat for fish and other sea 

18 creatures.

19 Thus, CO2 emissions are not just harming 

20 our respiratory health and tracking heat in our 

21 atmosphere. They are threatening the viability of 

22 our oceans as well, thereby undermining the 
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1 world's environmental health at a very 

2 fundamental level.

3 CO2 emissions must be curbed and 

4 limiting emissions from both new and existing 

5 power plants is essential in light of threats to 

6 the ocean systems that we are beginning to see 

7 unfold.

8 I support the EPA's proposed standards 

9 for limiting carbon pollution from new power 

10 plants, and I urge the EPA to act quickly and 

11 responsibly to finalize these standards and move 

12 forward to develop standards for existing power 

13 plants as well.

14 My son, who recently graduated from 

15 college last weekend, said to me, "This is a 

16 great time to be alive, we have all this great 

17 technology and we haven't destroyed the planet 

18 yet."

19 I wonder what his children will be 

20 saying to him when they graduate from college.

21 Thank you.

22 MR. CULLIGAN: Thank you.
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1 Go ahead.

2 MS. MORGAN: Hey, everyone. My name is 

3 Christina and I am from Hampton Roads, Virginia. 

4 I am currently with the Funds for the Public 

5 Interest, working on grass-roots campaigns for 

6 nonprofits, like Environment America and 

7 Environment Virginia. I have spent my life 

8 feeling passionately about the environment, and I 

9 have studied and explored the natural world with 

10 joy from my childhood.

11 My undergraduate studies and research 

12 within biology and chemistry have given me an 

13 in-depth view of many aspects of the carbon cycle 

14 on planet earth and ways that human activities 

15 affects that cycle.

16 We are all here today essentially 

17 discussing those aspects of the carbon cycle the 

18 way that humans through their power plants in the 

19 USA, for example, are shaping the destiny and 

20 overall experiences, billions of people in 

21 countless numbers of other organisms on the 

22 planet.
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1 For me, this issue boils down to one 

2 major concept, and that is responsibility. The 

3 planet is now more polluted by human beings -- I 

4 am sorry -- more populated by human beings than 

5 ever before in recorded history. In tandem, our 

6 biosphere is more challenged by human impacts 

7 than ever before in earth's history.

8 Time ticks by and we learn daily about 

9 the ways that greenhouse gases and global warming 

10 affect our climate. News stories tell us the 

11 tales of lives destroyed by storms and illnesses 

12 that are expected to intensify as carbon release 

13 into the atmosphere through human activities 

14 continues and tentatively increases with coming 

15 years.

16 At this point in the research and 

17 experience of the human species, we are at a 

18 crossroads. We know the facts or at least many 

19 of them, and have found critical connections of 

20 major greenhouse gases like carbon dioxide, two 

21 phenomenon like global warming or climate change, 

22 and we are watching the effects of climate change 
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1 unfold around us through weather, temperature 

2 changes, ocean acidification, increased ground 

3 level ozone pollution and all of their dramatic 

4 effects on our biosphere.

5 When faced by the information and 

6 circumstances, I feel like the one choice we have 

7 as a species is to stand up for the lives of the 

8 many even if it is sometimes a bit inconvenient 

9 for the few.

10 With knowledge comes great 

11 responsibility, and for the United States to 

12 finally adopt and enforce the standards for power 

13 plant carbon emissions with power plants leading 

14 the way in our nation for anthropogenic sources 

15 of carbon release, we would truly be acting 

16 appropriately in response to the knowledge that 

17 we possess on this subject.

18 Personally, it would make me more proud 

19 to be an American. My family and I have had to 

20 evacuate numerous times from powerful nor'easters 

21 and hurricanes, and felt the impacts of their 

22 winds and flood waters at our homes and our 
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1 communities.

2 The older I get, the more I meet youth 

3 with respiratory problems and asthma tied to air 

4 pollution, and I have watched some of my favorite 

5 views in Virginia, such as the ocean front and 

6 the Shenandoah National park be obscured by smog 

7 and gray-green haze.

8 As a marine scientist, I have been 

9 horrified to learn about the ways that ocean 

10 acidification threatens our marine life 

11 worldwide, in particular, plankton, the producers 

12 of most of the world's oxygen and foundational 

13 components of the world's green ecosystems are 

14 threatened increasingly by acidic oceans as 

15 created by more carbon dioxide diffusing into 

16 earth's waters.

17 I am not prepared to witness humans 

18 failing to acknowledge their role and conserving 

19 species and habitats for human and non-humans 

20 worldwide. Rather, I am ready to see America 

21 take responsibility for its anthropogenic sources 

22 of carbon release into the atmosphere.
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1 So I support EPA's proposed standards 

2 for carbon pollution from new power plants, and I 

3 urge the agency to move forward with finalizing 

4 these standards this year.

5 I also urge the EPA to move quickly to 

6 develop standards for existing power plants, 

7 bringing our nation notably more up to date and 

8 meeting our biological requirements for reducing 

9 carbon emissions from such industry.

10 Thank you all for your time and here is 

11 to a long-lived healthy planet earth for 

12 countless generations to come.

13 MR. CULLIGAN: Thank both of you for 

14 that.

15 Our next two speakers are Barbara 

16 Gottlieb and Douglas Hunt.

17 Thank you and welcome. We will start 

18 with Barbara.

19 MS. GOTTLIEB: Good morning. My name is 

20 Barbara Gottlieb, G-O-T-T-L-I-E-B. I am the 

21 director of Environment and Health at Physicians 

22 for Social Responsibility, a national 
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1 organization of health professionals that works 

2 to protect human life from the greatest threats 

3 to health and survival.

4 I speak on behalf of our 40,000 members 

5 and activists in voicing our support for the 

6 EPA's proposed rule for reducing greenhouse gas 

7 emissions from coal-fired power plants.

8 As we all know, climate change is 

9 acknowledged by scientists around the world to be 

10 real and to be caused primarily by human activity 

11 especially the burning of fossil fuels.

12 As the earth warms, the delicate balance 

13 of climate, weather, water, and life is 

14 disrupted. The consequences threaten human 

15 health and ultimately survival. This makes the 

16 EPA's proposed carbon pollution rule for electric 

17 utility generating units one of the most 

18 important actions you can take to protect human 

19 health and well-being.

20 The world is warming. 2011 was one of 

21 the warmest years on record according to the 

22 World Meteorological Organization, and longer 
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1 term, the chance of limiting the rise in global 

2 temperatures to the desired ceiling of 2 degrees 

3 Celsius in this century is getting slimmer and 

4 slimmer according to the International Energy 

5 Agency. Significantly, the IEA's chief economist 

6 recently attributed that pessimistic assessment 

7 to the continuing construction of power plants.

8 Warming has grave and immediate 

9 consequences for human health, and these will be 

10 the focus of my remarks today. Global warming is 

11 predicted to increase the frequency of extreme 

12 heat events or heat waves which can cause serious 

13 heat-related illnesses and can lead to death.

14 The most common is heat exhaustion, 

15 which, in turn, can progress to heat stroke. The 

16 clinical definition of heat stroke includes a 

17 core body temperature of 105 degrees Fahrenheit 

18 or more, and central nervous system 

19 abnormalities, such as delirium, convulsions, and 

20 coma.

21 With effects like these, heat waves can 

22 and do cause mortality, often related to 
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1 cardiovascular, cerebrovascular, and respiratory 

2 causes especially with pre-existing illnesses.

3 Extreme heat events are already a 

4 significant public health problem in the United 

5 States, responsible for more deaths annually than 

6 hurricanes, lightning, tornadoes, floods, and 

7 earthquakes combined.

8 The health impact of extreme heat events 

9 will likely be exacerbated in the future by the 

10 synergistic effects of a warming climate, 

11 urbanization, and an aging population.

12 Advanced age represents one of the most 

13 significant risk factors for heat-based 

14 illnesses. Although the people have diminished 

15 ability to regulate body temperature, they 

16 generally experience poorer health and they are 

17 more likely to live alone and have reduced social 

18 contacts, further increasing their vulnerability.

19 This vulnerable group is growing as the 

20 elderly become an increasingly large proportion 

21 of the U.S. population. The urban poor are 

22 another highly vulnerable population to extreme 
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1 heat exposure. City environments hold more heat, 

2 creating the so-called urban heat island 

3 phenomenon.

4 After absorbing heat during the daytime, 

5 the urban heat island radiates it out at night, 

6 raising nighttime minimum temperatures, a 

7 phenomenon which has been linked 

8 epidemiologically to excess mortality.

9 People with certain pre-existing medical 

10 conditions including cardiovascular disease, 

11 respiratory illnesses, obesity, neurologic, or 

12 psychiatric disease are highly vulnerable. Taken 

13 together, that encompasses a wide swath of the 

14 American population.

15 Rising temperatures also worsen air 

16 quality and the risk of respiratory disease. As 

17 you have heard from other speakers today, ozone 

18 formation increases with increasing temperature 

19 and ozone contributes to asthma and other chronic 

20 lung diseases.

21 In addition, a 2000 mine study indicates 

22 that ozone exposure is associated with a 
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1 heightened risk of death from respiratory causes, 

2 and that long term, even low-level exposures to 

3 ozone can be lethal.

4 This is very worrisome given that other 

5 research suggests that ozone concentrations in 

6 the U.S. may increase between 5 and 10 percent 

7 over the next 50 years purely as a result of 

8 climate change.

9 Because time is short, I have presented 

10 only a part of PSR's concerns about the health 

11 and climate change. I entered into the docket a 

12 full footnoted version of this testimony and also 

13 information about climate change effects on human 

14 health related to extreme weather, floods, and 

15 droughts, water-borne and insect-borne diseases, 

16 wildfires, impact on crop fields and the food 

17 supply, and the less known but very real dangers 

18 of mental health effects due to climate change.

19 I have also entered into the docket the 

20 names and addresses of cities, at least cities 

21 and States, of 2,180 PSR members who have added 

22 their support for this very important proposed 
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1 EPA rule. These signatures are a small 

2 indication of the importance PSR places on this 

3 first Federal action for nationwide reduction of 

4 greenhouse gases.

5 We look forward to a strong rule, strong 

6 implementation, and, in the future, more 

7 comprehensive steps to protect our health and our 

8 world from carbon pollution from existing, as 

9 well as power plants.

10 Thank you.

11 MR. CULLIGAN: Thank you.

12 REV. HUNT: Good morning. My name is 

13 Douglas Hunt. I am an ordained clergy in the 

14 United Church of Christ -- I guess you can't hear 

15 well -- United Church of Christ. I am also a 

16 board member of the Pennsylvania affiliate of 

17 Interfaith Power & Light, a national 

18 organization, as you have heard before this 

19 morning, connecting over 30,000 congregations of 

20 all faiths across the United States. I have also 

21 been the executive director of Tennessee 

22 Interfaith Power & Light.
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1 I come this morning -- and we will talk 

2 with some language that I don't think you have 

3 heard very much -- I was struck by the fact that 

4 in 2007, a public broadcasting system special 

5 called "Heat," began with the remark that we are 

6 standing on the precipice of hell.

7 Now, those of us in religious circles 

8 are used to using those kinds of language, but 

9 clearly, the hell that we are being talked about 

10 is the hell on earth, not a hell after earth, and 

11 I want to thank you for issuing the first ever 

12 national industrial carbon pollution standards 

13 for power plants, and offering the public this 

14 second chance to be heard.

15 We have taken with this proposal a step 

16 back, a small step, but perhaps a step back from 

17 that precipice. The standards are essential to 

18 reduce the effects of climate change that worsen 

19 smog, trigger asthma attacks, and other serious 

20 health consequences.

21 These health impacts are felt most by 

22 those that we care about, children, the elderly, 
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1 and people with other respiratory problems 

2 especially those who do not have the resources, 

3 as many in this country and around the world do, 

4 to mitigate these impacts.

5 As you may know, Knoxville, Tennessee, 

6 where I was located for five years when I was 

7 executive director there, is also one of the 

8 world's asthma capitals thanks to the Tennessee 

9 Valley authorities, coal-fired power plants, many 

10 of which are very old.

11 I have also been struck recently by a 

12 diverse spectrum of individuals, such as NASA 

13 senior climate scientist James Hensen, Archbishop 

14 Desmond Tutu, Prime Minister Angela Merkle, and 

15 many, many others who have recognized the issues 

16 and have identified addressing climate change and 

17 the release of greenhouse gases as a moral 

18 imperative, not just a scientific, but a moral 

19 imperative.

20 In the views of these notables, in 

21 science and religion and politics, if they are 

22 not persuasive, the deaths and the life of 
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1 illness of our children, human dislocations, crop 

2 failures, decertification, and conclusively laid 

3 by scientific fact at the door of our globally 

4 warming planet proclaim that addressing climate 

5 change is indeed a moral and ethical imperative 

6 and needs to be the concern of everyone.

7 The United States remains the leading 

8 worldwide per capita emitter of greenhouse gas 

9 pollution. It is clear that the U.S. has the 

10 responsibility to lead in moving us back from 

11 that precipice.

12 My faith tradition calls me to see with 

13 loving eyes what is before me to judge what I see 

14 against moral and ethical standards and then to 

15 act, to act in faith, to bring the message to 

16 those who will listen.

17 The needs of our children and our 

18 grandchildren command us to take action. That is 

19 why I am here today. That is why this first step 

20 to directly regulate carbon pollution in the 

21 power industry is so very important.

22 I strongly support the proposed 
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1 regulation and urge rapid approval and very, very 

2 rapid implementation.

3 Thank you again for the opportunity.

4 MR. CULLIGAN: Thank you.

5 Our next two speakers are Kenneth 

6 Haapala and Linda Burchfield.

7 You can start whenever you are ready.

8 MR. HAAPALA: Good morning. I am Ken 

9 Haapala, the vice president of the Science and 

10 Environmental Policy Project, SEPP.

11 The idea that carbon is a pollutant that 

12 needs to be regulated is based upon the EPA 

13 endangerment finding. The finding is being 

14 litigated in Federal court, USCA Case No. 10109. 

15 The finding is based upon predictions of 

16 unprecedented and dangerous global warming based 

17 upon speculative computer models.

18 The models have never been validated or 

19 verified, thus, the products are not scientific 

20 knowledge, but speculation. The models are 

21 clearly wrong. There has been no warming trend 

22 for about 15 years even though the atmospheric 
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1 carbon dioxide levels have been increasing.

2 There is a high to very high level of 

3 uncertainty in 11 of the 16 major forcing 

4 factors, inputs in the models considered by the 

5 models. Thus, the outputs have a level of 

6 scientific uncertainty.

7 The certainty expressed by the EPA is 

8 scientifically false. It is no better than 

9 taking a poll of a J.P. Morgan model builders on 

10 their certainty that their models are correct, 

11 that is, taken three months ago.

12 The models on which the EPA is based are 

13 clearly wrong. The EPA failed to produce an 

14 independent analysis of the science as required 

15 by the Data Quality Act, a finding by the EPA 

16 Inspector General.

17 The EPA failed to consult its Scientific 

18 Advisory Board, a finding by the EPA Inspector 

19 General.

20 The EPA failed to consider the enormous 

21 health and welfare benefits from enhanced carbon 

22 dioxide in the atmosphere including benefits to 
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1 agriculture and the environment, making the 

2 environment far more robust.

3 I have here a document with 

4 approximately 1,000 studies, scientific studies, 

5 verifying that statement, and another document 

6 with more scientific studies verifying my 

7 statements.

8 In short, using faulty science, the EPA 

9 is proposing to close down the coal-fired utility 

10 industry that has greatly benefited Americans for 

11 130 years by providing affordable electricity.

12 Climate has been changing for billions 

13 of years. To propose that controlling EPA will 

14 somehow stop climate change is totally absurd.

15 Thank you.

16 MR. CULLIGAN: Thank you, and like I 

17 said, you are free to add your comments, read 

18 comments at the front table.

19 Linda.

20 MS. BURCHFIELD: Good morning. My name 

21 is Linda Burchfield and I am speaking on behalf 

22 of the Northern Virginia Climate Action Network, 
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1 a coalition of 10 nonprofit groups here in 

2 Northern Virginia that all have different 

3 missions, different focuses, but we are united 

4 and are concerned about climate change and a 

5 sense of urgency to reduce greenhouse gas levels.

6 We are delighted that the EPA has 

7 proposed their new source performance standards, 

8 which will begin to reduce or which will begin 

9 the process of reducing greenhouse gases while, 

10 at the same time, protecting the power industry 

11 from undue hardship.

12 By beginning the process of reducing 

13 emissions from electric utility generating units, 

14 EPA is reducing the impacts and risks articulated 

15 in the endangerment finding. I will mention two 

16 impacts that focus directly on public health, 

17 higher average temperatures and more heat waves,

18 which are associated with increased death and 

19 illness.

20 Heat is already the leading cause of 

21 weather-related deaths in the U.S. Increased 

22 temperatures react with nitrous oxide and 
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1 volatile organic compounds to raise ozone levels 

2 which have been linked to ozone, which have been 

3 linked to asthma and premature death. Asthma 

4 levels are too high now, and will increase as 

5 temperatures increase.

6 A pediatrician friend of mine reports a 

7 telling statistic. At Inova Hospital in Fairfax, 

8 where she works, 285 children were admitted for 

9 severe asthma attacks in 2010, and 2,007 children 

10 in 2011.

11 The standard is not expected to result 

12 in any disruption to our power supply. It merely 

13 reflects the ongoing trends started by themselves 

14 when they choose to fuel with natural gas for 

15 economic reasons, and for fossil fuel EGUs that 

16 are being proposed, technologies are available 

17 which have been adequately demonstrated.

18 In proposing the standard, EPA has 

19 considered both the energy and economic impacts 

20 that may result from meeting the new standard. 

21 This process ensures the new standard will not be 

22 an undue hardship on our economy. Instead, this 
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1 standard will lead to innovation.

2 Look, for example, at the EPA standards 

3 on nitrous oxide for auto emissions. In that 

4 case, regulation was the mother of innovation, 

5 and the catalytic converter was born. A whole 

6 new industry of air pollution control equipment 

7 was created.

8 A 2010 study by the Department of 

9 Commerce found that here, in the U.S., air 

10 pollution control equipment alone generated 

11 revenues of 18 billion per year including exports 

12 of more than 3 billion.

13 Approximately 119,000 companies are 

14 engaged in the environmental technology business, 

15 which generates approximately 300 billion in 

16 revenue, 44 billion in exports, and supported 

17 close to 1.7 million jobs.

18 This standard will encourage research 

19 into more American pollution control technology, 

20 such as CCS. So, yes, we applaud the EPA for 

21 taking this first limited step to protect the 

22 public health and encourage the current trend 
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1 towards cleaner generation.

2 It is high time for the standard to be 

3 adopted, and we look forward to seeing reductions 

4 of carbon dioxide from existing EGUs and other 

5 high emitters.

6 Thank you.

7 Where do we take our written?

8 MR. CULLIGAN: You can drop them off at 

9 the registration desk if you signed in at the 

10 beginning.

11 Thank you, both.

12 Our next two speakers are Tyler Madison 

13 and Herbert Fitzell. As they are coming up, I 

14 would just like to thank everyone who has spoken 

15 so far for helping me with the only part of my 

16 job today that I wasn't looking forward to, which 

17 was having to tell anyone that they had exceeded 

18 their five minutes.

19 Everyone has done a very commendable job 

20 of writing, well written, but yet concise 

21 testimony. I personally very much appreciate 

22 that, so thank you.
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1 With that, do we have Tyler Madison?

2 MR. FITZELL: I will go first.

3 MR. CULLIGAN: Okay.

4 MR. FITZELL: I am with the Sierra Club.

5 I would like to thank everybody for the 

6 opportunity to speak today. Thank you all for 

7 the opportunity to speak about the EPA proposal 

8 to limit industrial carbon pollution.

9 As a concerned citizen, I am pleased 

10 that the EPA is taking action to address limits 

11 which, given the nature of the problem, could not 

12 be more urgently needed.

13 Firstly, as a matter of health, 

14 according to the EPA's web site, I currently live 

15 in the U.S. zip code with unhealthy air quality. 

16 Although the air is far cleaner in Chester, 

17 Virginia than in my previous residence of Mexico 

18 City, the quality of the air in Chester has been 

19 a factor in life and death situations for my 

20 family on more than one occasion.

21 I lived for years in Mexico City and I 

22 had severe respiratory infections every few 
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1 months due to the severe pollution. We certainly 

2 need protections from the type of unrestrained 

3 pollution found in that city.

4 My Mexican doctor advised me that over 

5 95 percent of the population there has either a 

6 respiratory problem or an eye problem due to 

7 pollution.

8 One would hope that we would be safe 

9 from such extremes in the USA, nevertheless, 

10 after returning to the U.S., I was the primary 

11 caregiver to more than one person who was dying 

12 of a respiratory disease, and the air quality in 

13 Chester exacerbated what was already a terminal 

14 situation.

15 My mother had asthma for years and 

16 developed terminal lung cancer in 2001. She 

17 passed away in 2003. During the intervening year 

18 and a half, she had several asthma attacks which 

19 required a rush to the hospital and threatened to 

20 take her away immediately.

21 Research has shown that vulnerable 

22 populations are most susceptible to 
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1 asthma-inducing smog. Unfortunately, I believe 

2 the air quality in Chester contributed to her 

3 asthma attacks.

4 It is during these life and death 

5 moments when a loved one is struggling for life 

6 and asks for help that one realizes the air 

7 quality is truly a matter of life and death.

8 My mother did smoke, and this did 

9 contribute to her death, but each day, countless 

10 young children across this country are victims of 

11 asthma attacks. They bear no responsibility for 

12 their situation, and their parents were placed in 

13 a similar life and death struggle while listening 

14 to their children try to say "Help me, I can't 

15 breathe."

16 In 2007, the American Public Health 

17 Association issued a policy statement entitled, 

18 "Addressing the Urgent Threat of Global Climate 

19 Change to Public Health and the Environment."

20 It said, "The long-term threat of global 

21 climate change to global health is extremely 

22 serious, and the fourth IPCC report and other 
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1 scientific literature demonstrate convincingly 

2 the anthropogenic THG emissions were primarily 

3 responsible for this threat. U.S. policymakers 

4 should immediately take the necessary steps to 

5 reduce U.S. emissions of THGs including carbon 

6 dioxide to avert dangerous climate change."

7 Despite such warnings, my local energy 

8 provider and State monopoly, Virginia Power, has 

9 no plans for clean energy in its recently 

10 released 15-year integrated resource plan. Dirty 

11 coal remains its chief energy source, and they 

12 continue to muscle out small, clean energy 

13 start-ups.

14 I recently spoke to my congressional 

15 representative from Virginia's 4th District, 

16 Randy Forbes. I provided him with a list of 

17 official statements from virtually every 

18 scientific society in the world. These comment 

19 statements were all similar to the statement of 

20 the American Public Health Association, and 

21 stating that the earth is warming and that 

22 anthropogenic THG emissions are primarily 
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1 responsible for climate change.

2 We spoke to Senator James Inhofe's 

3 recent book, "The Greatest Hoax," in which the 

4 science of climate change is said to be a great 

5 hoax.

6 Representative Forbes did not state that 

7 he disagreed with Senator Inhofe, but he 

8 certainly disagrees with Al Gore on the science.

9 I later received a letter from 

10 Representative Forbes, which stated, "New debate 

11 on global climate change has been fueled by the 

12 extensive discussion arguing new evidence and 

13 research findings on both sides of the climate 

14 change debate."

15 While there may be debate and deadlock 

16 on both sides of the supposed issue in Congress, 

17 there is a consensus in the scientific community 

18 about the cause of climate change.

19 Contrary to some media and Internet 

20 reports, the consensus among professional 

21 scientists is that human activities are the 

22 primary cause of global climate change. We need 
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1 to reduce the level of atmospheric carbon dioxide 

2 from 392 parts per million to under 350 parts per 

3 million.

4 In my view, nothing could be more 

5 important than a science-based approach to global 

6 climate change. Many individual life and death 

7 struggles are impacted by carbon emissions, and 

8 the biosystems of the planet are under the 

9 greatest threat in 65 million years.

10 I urge the EPA, in accordance with the 

11 2007 Supreme Court ruling that requires the EPA 

12 to take action to address carbon pollution, to 

13 take whatever action is necessary to reduce 

14 carbon levels to under 350 parts per million.

15 Respect for the sanctity, not only of 

16 human life, but all life and creation itself 

17 requires our strongest efforts.

18 Thank you, all.

19 MR. CULLIGAN: Thank you.

20 MR. FITZELL: I would like to bring a 

21 picture of my mother, Nancy Fitzell.

22 MR. CULLIGAN: Just a reminder for all 
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1 of our future speakers, for the benefit of the 

2 court reporter, it is very helpful for you to 

3 both state your name and spell it, and list any 

4 affiliations before you start talking.

5 MS. MATTESON: My name is Tyla Matteson, 

6 T-Y-L-A M-A-T-T-E-S-O-N, 4896 Burnham Road in 

7 Richmond, Virginia 23234. My comments are quite 

8 short.

9 It is of most importance to have carbon 

10 standards that the EPA standards stand for our 

11 health, for our safety, and for our climate.

12 My mother's home has been flooded three 

13 times in the last 10 years due to the more 

14 frequent and severe storms and the resulting 

15 storm surges, also, which is because of the sea 

16 level rise, which is happening in the Hampton 

17 Roads area. She lives near a coastal area in 

18 Hampton, Virginia, on a canal that did not 

19 usually cause such damage.

20 The number one concern for all of us is 

21 addressing climate change, and these regulations 

22 will address that. I have traveled six times on 
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1 my own expense to the United Nations climate 

2 change conferences, and I have heard firsthand 

3 the stories of people from around the world who 

4 are affected by climate change, permafrost 

5 melting, islands disappearing, glacier melting, 

6 and many other things.

7 Thank you kindly.

8 MR. CULLIGAN: Thank you.

9 Our next two speakers are Larry Roussell 

10 and Rachel Cleetus.

11 MR. ROUSSELL: Good morning. Thank you 

12 for this opportunity. My comments will be brief. 

13 I didn't prepare anything for today, but I am 

14 sure you are reminded of all the things that Tyla 

15 just mentioned. It is very obvious that our 

16 climate is changing for whatever reason, and many 

17 scientists now believe that it is because of 

18 mankind's input.

19 But I would remind you that we have 

20 failed to regulate our banking system, and we are 

21 paying the consequences now. I think we need 

22 regulations even though I generally, as a 
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1 businessman, I am opposed to regulations.

2 Some regulations are needed. The profit 

3 motive is a wonderful thing, but if it is not 

4 watched, it can cause problems.

5 I am sorry, L-A-R-R-Y R-O-U-S-S-E-L-L 

6 from Richmond. I am affiliated with C-CAN, 

7 Sierra Club, and other groups that are working on 

8 this issue.

9 I was present when VEPCO presented their 

10 60-page batch of regulations that they had 

11 written to the Virginia General Assembly. Some 

12 of the members there weren't even aware, they 

13 hadn't had a chance to even read this proposal, 

14 and for some reason it was voted on unanimously. 

15 I think there is a money factor going on here 

16 that we are not necessarily party to or aware of 

17 sometimes.

18 So, I just encourage you to look at this 

19 as a bigger issue than just protecting citizens 

20 of Virginia, but it is a worldwide issue, and as 

21 a leader of the world, we need to stop dragging 

22 our feet and do something about some of the 
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1 issues that we are talking about.

2 Thank you.

3 MR. CULLIGAN: Thank you.

4 MS. CLEETUS: Thank you for the 

5 opportunity to testify today. My name is

6 R-A-C-H-E-L, C-L-E-E-T-U-S, and I am a senior 

7 climate economist at the Union of Concerned 

8 Scientists.

9 UCS is the nation's leading 

10 science-based nonprofit working for a health 

11 environment and a safer world, and we do a lot of 

12 work to raise awareness of climate science, as 

13 well as solutions we have available to lower 

14 emissions.

15 On behalf today of UCS's more than 

16 400,000 supporters and our network of more than 

17 18,000 scientists, I want to say that we strongly 

18 support the EPA's efforts to regulate carbon 

19 emissions from fossil fuel-fired power plants.

20 Our supporters have written over 55,000 

21 comments in support of the standard, and this is 

22 part of over 1 million supportive comments that 
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1 EPA will have delivered to it.

2 We believe that EPA's actions are firmly 

3 grounded in the science, the threat posed by 

4 unchecked climate change, which is driven by 

5 human activities, has been clearly articulated by 

6 numerous national and international scientific 

7 organizations including the U.S. National Academy 

8 of Sciences.

9 If we fail to make deep reductions in 

10 our carbon emissions, we will greatly increase 

11 the risk of serious economic, public health, and 

12 environmental consequences including sea level 

13 rise, extreme weather events, increased risk of 

14 asthma and heat stress, a strain on water 

15 resources, and the loss or degradation of vital 

16 ecosystems.

17 EPA's obligation and authority to

18 regulate global warming emissions under the Clean 

19 Air Act is clearly supported by the 2007 Supreme 

20 Court ruling on a subsequent endangerment finding 

21 that the agency issued in 2009.

22 In 2010, CO2 emissions from power plants 
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1 were the single largest source of U.S. CO2

2 emissions, responsible for approximately 40 

3 percent of these emissions, and therefore, taking 

4 action to reduce emissions from the electricity 

5 sector is crucial to our overall efforts to 

6 mitigate climate change.

7 EPA's draft proposal for carbon 

8 standards for new power plants are a good start. 

9 We believe that setting an ambitious, but 

10 achievable, output based on it, that is applied 

11 uniformly to all new fossil-fired power plants 

12 will help ensure a transition to cleaner 

13 generation over time.

14 We do believe that the standard would be 

15 improved by lowering it from 1,000 pound CO2 per 

16 megawatt hour for electricity generated to 800, 

17 which is a level that is currently achievable by 

18 modern natural gas combined cycle units.

19 As EPA has noted in its proposal, EIA's 

20 2011 reference case forecast shows that there 

21 were virtually no new conventional coal-fired 

22 power plants being built, projected to be built 
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1 anywhere, and EIA's 2012 projections underscore 

2 the same message.

3 Basically, even under business as usual, 

4 low natural gas prices, the mounting production 

5 and pollution costs of coal-fired power, and 

6 increased competition for low-cost alternatives 

7 like energy efficiency and renewable energy are 

8 basically making coal-fired power uneconomical 

9 under current market conditions.

10 So, this proposed standard just 

11 underscores a reality that is already underway. 

12 We do have some serious reservations about the 

13 30-year averaging will turn a compliance 

14 mechanism that is proposed in the rule, both 

15 because of the difficulties in actually enforcing 

16 these provisions and because of concerns about 

17 the cost and performance assumptions around 

18 carbon capture and storage.

19 If this provision does remain in the 

20 final rule, we believe it should be significantly 

21 tightened to ensure that it doesn't merely serve 

22 as a loophole for high-emitting power plants to 
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1 be built with the risk that those emissions may 

2 never be reduced eventually.

3 Furthermore, we don't see a reason for 

4 special treatment for CCS. We believe EPA should 

5 explore alternative compliance mechanisms that 

6 utilize energy efficiency and renewable energy. 

7 These are proven technologies, they are already 

8 affordable and available, and, therefore, far 

9 less risky than banking on CCS.

10 Of course, reducing emissions from the 

11 power sector does require reducing emissions from 

12 the existing fleet, as well, which are the main 

13 source of emissions. Since much of our existing 

14 fleet is old and efficient and dirty, there are 

15 significant opportunities here for reducing 

16 emissions.

17 EPA itself has noted in the draft rule 

18 that we note that now that it is moving on used 

19 power plants, it is legally obligated to issue 

20 standards under 111(d) for the existing power 

21 plants.

22 So, we look forward to seeing a draft 
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1 proposal for existing power plants issued in a 

2 timely fashion, and this would also provide more 

3 certainty to utilities as they make decisions 

4 about how best to comply with the entire suite of 

5 Clean Air Act obligations.

6 We encourage EPA's efforts to engage 

7 with and consult with States and appropriate 

8 stakeholders to ensure that those standards for 

9 the existing fleet are well coordinated with 

10 existing State actions.

11 Several States and regions, as you know, 

12 have taken a leadership role in this area. We 

13 need to ensure that they have the appropriate 

14 incentives to continue to implement and 

15 strengthen their programs.

16 In all cases, the Clean Air Act 

17 standards to the existing fleet should provide an 

18 ambitious framework to encourage greater emission 

19 reductions than would occur without it.

20 We especially encourage EPA to conduct 

21 this dialogue in an open fashion perhaps by 

22 holding public hearing listening sessions as you 
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1 have done in the past. The work that EPA has 

2 begun to reduce global warming emissions is of 

3 crucial importance to the health and well-being 

4 of Americans and, indeed, for citizens around the 

5 world.

6 We request that you move quickly to 

7 finalize these common standards for new power 

8 plants, and we also urge you to issue strong 

9 common standards for existing power plants 

10 without delay.

11 Ultimately, other forms of strong action 

12 will be required to get deep emission reductions, 

13 but these standards are very necessary and 

14 important first steps. We will also be 

15 submitting detailed written comments, but on 

16 behalf of UCS and all our members and supporters, 

17 we thank you deeply for the good work you are 

18 doing.

19 MR. CULLIGAN: Thanks. You had 

20 mentioned an 800 standard for natural gas. Will 

21 your comments talk about how that would work?

22 MS. CLEETUS: Yes.
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1 MR. CULLIGAN: And then, second, you had 

2 also mentioned I think for a preference for not 

3 having a 30-year averaging, but you also 

4 mentioned that if we did have it, we should make 

5 it more stringent?

6 MS. CLEETUS: Yes.

7 MR. CULLIGAN: Would you also provide 

8 details on what you think on that?

9 MS. CLEETUS: Yes. Thank you.

10 MR. CULLIGAN: Thank you.

11 The next two commenters are David 

12 Doniger and Richard Kennedy.

13 We will start with David.

14 MR. DONIGER: Thank you very much. I am 

15 David Doniger, D-A-V-I-D D-O-N-I-G-E-R. I am 

16 policy director and senior attorney with the 

17 Natural Resources Defense Council. It is a real 

18 pleasure to be here, thank you for what you are 

19 doing and for holding this hearing.

20 NRDC supports EPA's first national 

21 limits on carbon dioxide emissions from new 

22 fossil fuel-fired electric plants. Already more 
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1 than a million citizens across the country, a 

2 record number in EPA's history, have raised their 

3 voices in support of these standards.

4 I have been doing this for years. I 

5 have working, supported action to curb carbon 

6 pollution under the Clean Air Act. It is my day 

7 job to be here, but I am truly grateful that 

8 hundreds of citizens are taking time out of their 

9 normal days to be here and express their support.

10 My colleague, Kim Knowlton, will testify 

11 later today on what scientists have shown, the

12 staggering costs, health costs, of carbon 

13 pollution, more asthma attacks and 

14 life-threatening illnesses from worsened air 

15 pollution, and the contribution to climate change 

16 includes the contribution to extreme weather with 

17 devastating storms, floods, and other events that 

18 severely threaten life, limb, and property.

19 The Supreme Court has found in not one, 

20 but two landmark cases that it is EPA's job under 

21 the Clean Air Act to curb dangerous carbon 

22 pollution. The new source performance standard 
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1 that EPA has proposed for new power plants under 

2 Section 111(b) is a critical step forward.

3 Power plants have long topped the list 

4 of categories of industrial stationary sources 

5 that contribute significantly to air pollution 

6 that endangers public health and welfare.

7 The EPA made the endangerment finding 

8 for carbon pollution in 2009, because of a 

9 mountain of scientific evidence demonstrating 

10 that it is already harming, and will continue to 

11 harm, the health and well-being of our families, 

12 children, and communities.

13 Fossil fueled power plants are 

14 responsible for more than 2.3 billion metric tons 

15 of carbon dioxide each year, approximately, 40 

16 percent of the U.S. total, and they are the 

17 largest source. By any standard, they contribute 

18 significantly to dangerous greenhouse gas air 

19 pollution.

20 NRDC supports EPA's determination to 

21 establish a single category including both 

22 natural gas and coal-fired new units. These 
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1 units perform the same function of base load and 

2 intermediate load power generation, and 

3 prospective builders have the flexibility to 

4 choose among these technologies when building new 

5 plants to serve this function.

6 EPA has asked for comment on the 

7 treatment of simple-cycle gas turbines, which we 

8 will take up in written comments.

9 NRDC supports setting a single emission 

10 rate standard applicable to all new plants in the 

11 category. EPA has asked for comment about the 

12 1,000 pound proposed level and levels above and 

13 below that.

14 NRDC supports setting the new source 

15 standard below 1,000 pounds per megawatt hour, 

16 because modern new natural gas combined cycle 

17 plants can meet a tighter standard at no 

18 additional cost, and new coal-fired power plants 

19 equipped with carbon capture and storage can also 

20 meet a tighter level especially with the 30-year 

21 averaging provisions that EPA has proposed.

22 You will hear many claims that EPA's 
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1 proposed standard is a de facto ban on 

2 constructing new conventional coal plants and 

3 that the standard will cause lost jobs and higher 

4 utility bills. These are phony arguments. The 

5 proposed new source standard actually will impose 

6 no additional costs on the industry or on rate 

7 payers, and have no adverse impact on jobs.

8 The reason is that market realities have 

9 already driven decisions on new power plants away 

10 from coal. As Brookings senior economist Peter 

11 Wilcox explained in April, "To put it simply, the 

12 life cycle costs of coal-fired power are 

13 considerably higher than gas-fired power," and he 

14 continued, "because it only rules out an 

15 expensive option that wouldn't have been used 

16 anyway, the EPA rule will have no significant 

17 effect on electricity prices."

18 Government utility and financial world 

19 analysts all agree in forecasting that the nation 

20 will meet its electricity needs over the next two 

21 decades without constructing new coal-fired 

22 plants.
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1 Power companies simply aren't planning 

2 to build them due to the availability of low cost 

3 natural gas, strong growth and wind and solar 

4 power, and big opportunities to improve energy 

5 efficiency.

6 EPA's sensitivity analysis in the 

7 regulatory impact analysis show that power 

8 companies will not choose to construct new 

9 conventional coat plants before 2030 even if 

10 natural gas becomes four to five times more 

11 costly and power demand increases.

12 MR. CULLIGAN: If I could ask you to try 

13 to wrap up.

14 MR. DONIGER: Okay. So, I am going to 

15 be your first one to violate the five-minute 

16 rule. I will wrap up very quickly.

17 So, going forward, EPA also has the 

18 obligation under Section 111(d) to start cutting 

19 the 2.3 billion tons of dangerous carbon 

20 pollution from the existing fleet.

21 You will hear false claims that doing 

22 what you are proposed to do now will wipe out the 
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1 existing coal plants by requiring them to meet 

2 the same standard as the new plants, but that is 

3 not what the Act requires, the criteria are 

4 different, and nonetheless, there are significant 

5 cost effective steps to curb this pollution from 

6 existing power plants, and EPA must begin that 

7 process without delay.

8 Thank you.

9 MR. CULLIGAN: Thank you.

10 MR. KENNEDY: My name is Richard 

11 Kennedy, a Sierra Club member. I am a chemical 

12 engineer who switched to economics, got a Ph.D., 

13 spent 31 years as a CIA European analyst, was 

14 awarded the agency's career intelligence medal, 

15 and just as evidence, I have a photo of my family 

16 at CIA Headquarters on the day of the ceremony.

17 My work sometimes involved energy or 

18 environmental issues. I had a small role in 

19 CIA's analysis of the 1973 oil price hike from 

20 $3.00 to $12.00 a barrel.

21 In 1992, I wrote a paper on how 

22 environmental policy is made in the EU, and that 
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1 paper led me to read "The Economics of Global 

2 Warming" by William Cline, who is a very 

3 respected economist.

4 He approached the subject like a good 

5 CIA analyst, gathered as much information as 

6 possible, and his conclusion was that the case 

7 for CO2 induced global warming was not absolutely 

8 proven, but it was very strong and the 

9 consequences were very severe, and in that 

10 situation, the rational response is to begin 

11 action to start mitigating the problem.

12 As a side note, just last year he 

13 published a book called, "Carbon Abatement Costs 

14 and Climate Change Finance," which I suspect is 

15 equally good, and I know he concludes that the 

16 economic costs are not prohibitive.

17 That first book was 20 years ago. The 

18 data since then strongly confirmed his 

19 conclusions. I recently did a chart showing

20 polar sea ice coverage in northern latitudes 

21 temperature from 1880 to 2011. It shows the 

22 temperature rising and the ice shrinking since 
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1 about 1970. That is this chart, and to me it is 

2 very striking evidence.

3 I also looked at the plant hardiness 

4 zones that the Department of Agriculture 

5 calculates, and those show that since 1990, 

6 approximately half of the country has shifted 

7 into a warmer zone, and that is this chart, but 

8 there is other evidence, of course, which is 

9 shrinking glaciers and the fact that insects are 

10 now causing problems in regions that used to be 

11 too cold for them, which my entomologist daughter 

12 tells me about.

13 CO2 causes other problems. I heard a 

14 Smithsonian biologist speak on how the world's 

15 coral reefs are threatened with extinction 

16 because CO2 is making the oceans more acidic.

17 So, given the problem of what is the 

18 economist's solution, first, we ask why is the 

19 free market not working here when it works so 

20 marvelously in most situations. The answer is 

21 that in most transactions, only the buyer and 

22 seller are affected and people usually are good 
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1 at protecting their own interests.

2 Some transactions, however, have what 

3 economists call externalities, which simply means 

4 that other people are affected. In the case of 

5 fossil fuels, the buyer pays all the costs of 

6 producing them, but not the cost, the resulting 

7 CO2 emissions impose on society.

8 So, the basic answer to any economist is 

9 the carbon tax, imposed gradually over many 

10 years, according to a pre-announced schedule, so 

11 that businesses and consumers have time to 

12 adjust, unlike that 1973 oil price increase, 

13 which was the 300 percent increase imposed in a 

14 couple of months, and other taxes can be lowered, 

15 so there is no net tax increase.

16 EPA, of course, can't impose taxes, so 

17 the regulation you are proposing is what 

18 economists would call a second best solution, but 

19 second best is far better than nothing.

20 The U.S., of course, can't get too far 

21 out of step with our trading partners, because it 

22 would hurt competitiveness, but the U.S. has been 
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1 the largest contributor to the increase in 

2 atmospheric CO2, and so it is common sense for us 

3 to play a leading role in addressing the problem.

4 I should also mention that former CIA 

5 Director Jim Woolsey is a strong advocate of 

6 action to address global warming, particularly 

7 the development of biofuels and plug-in hybrid 

8 cars.

9 Also, CIA serves the rest of the 

10 government, so perhaps EPA could request an 

11 assessment, not of U.S. policy, which would not 

12 be permitted according to the agency's charter, 

13 but whether there is a global problem and what 

14 other nations are doing to address it.

15 One other observation. I am struck by 

16 the overwhelming consensus among scientists on 

17 global warming, not only the climate scientists 

18 themselves, but also those in other disciplines, 

19 such as the biologist E.O. Wilson or the 

20 physicist Stephen Hocking.

21 Finally, let me conclude by saying that 

22 in 31 years as a CIA analyst, I seldom 
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1 encountered an issue as clear-cut as climate 

2 change. I hope you can begin the process of 

3 addressing it before it's too late.

4 Time may be short because of the 

5 negative feedback effects that could increase 

6 emissions of methane, which is an even worse 

7 greenhouse gas, and that could cause warming to 

8 spiral out of control with possibly catastrophic 

9 consequences or what we would call a worst case 

10 in most CIA analyses.

11 Thank you for the opportunity to speak.

12 MR. CULLIGAN: Thank you.

13 Our next two speakers are Catherine 

14 Thomasson and Charles Ellis.

15 Catherine, you can start when you are 

16 ready.

17 DR. THOMASSON: Thank you. My name is 

18 Catherine Thomasson, T-H-O-M-A-S-S-O-N, 

19 Catherine, C-A-T-H-E-R-I-N-E.

20 I am a physician, I am also a mother, 

21 and I am the executive director of Physicians for 

22 Social Responsibility.
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1 I would like to submit this oral and 

2 written testimony by first applauding the 

3 Environmental Protection Agency and the 

4 Administration for proposing this first Federal 

5 rule to address the largest public health threat 

6 of this century, global warming.

7 It is extremely hard to tell your 

8 patient or to tell your child who has asthma or 

9 lung disease that they shouldn't go out and play, 

10 that it is harmful to their health when the ozone 

11 level is high.

12 Children in Los Angeles who played three 

13 or more sports in one year in areas of high 

14 ozone, compared to children who lived in low 

15 ozone areas, have actual decrease in lung volume 

16 or lung capacity.

17 This will only worsen with climate 

18 change as ozone or smog, ground level smog will 

19 increase with increasing temperatures.

20 Currently, up to half of the Americans 

21 live at some time during the year in areas of 

22 high ozone. I also want to mention that extreme 
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1 weather events are already markedly affecting 

2 Americans. From Hurricane Katrina to the recent 

3 Mississippi floods, we now have had over a 

4 million weather refugees.

5 Economic disruption is a strong social 

6 determinant of health, loss of jobs, loss of 

7 health insurance, loss of home, and loss of 

8 public health infrastructure has incredible 

9 impacts on health.

10 I also want to mention infectious 

11 diseases as I am sure you are familiar. My son 

12 went to Central America on an away rotation for 

13 college and called me on the phone telling me 

14 that he had dengue fever. Dengue fever is a 

15 virus that is contracted from mosquitoes, and is 

16 also called bone break fever, because it causes 

17 such pain in the bones.

18 Currently, in the Tropics, about 3 

19 billion people can be affected by dengue fever. 

20 If you get another strain of dengue fever, you 

21 can die from the hemorrhagic autoimmune 

22 consequences.
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1 It is estimated that with climate change 

2 and the increasing range of the mosquito vector, 

3 that up to 6 billion people will be affected. We 

4 now know it is endemic in Southern Texas and in 

5 the Keys, where it was not previously present.

6 Increases in exposure statistics are 

7 available for malaria, West Nile virus, Lyme 

8 disease, and the most common worldwide parasite, 

9 schistosomiasis. These are but a few of the 

10 examples that I am sure you are very familiar 

11 with, having promulgated the rule to control 

12 greenhouse gas, which is the cause of climate 

13 change.

14 We, as Physicians for Social 

15 Responsibility, also want to advocate for a 

16 higher standard than 1,000 pounds per megawatt 

17 hour, as the technology can bear that standard, 

18 and we need to control greenhouse gases as much 

19 as we can with this first initial rule.

20 So, again, PSR wholeheartedly endorses 

21 this first Federal step in regulation of carbon, 

22 appropriately targeting new electricity 
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1 generation, generating units for your first rule 

2 with no minimal impact on the economy.

3 Thank you very much.

4 MR. CULLIGAN: Thank you.

5 MR. ELLIS: Good morning, gentlemen. My 

6 name is Charles Ellis, Charles the way you would 

7 expect, and Ellis, E-L-L-I-S.

8 I am a happy and proud resident of the 

9 District of Columbia, but I am also proud to tell 

10 you that I am a friend of Larry Roussell, who

11 spoke a few minutes ago, and I have been a fan of 

12 EPA for 40 years, and of this country for all of 

13 my 66, and I have family in this city, and I have 

14 a little car in this city that does very nicely 

15 on the gas mileage, but every time I go out with 

16 the glass cleaner and the paper towel, if it has 

17 been a couple of weeks, I get black stuff on the 

18 paper towel from cleaning up the windows on the 

19 outside of the car.

20 I don't have very much to say to you 

21 this morning except that I encourage you to go 

22 ahead with this standard for new power plants, 
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1 this carbon pollution standard for new power 

2 plants. It will encourage the development of 

3 alternative energy, and it will bring to an end 

4 the dependence on fossil fuel a little bit longer 

5 than it would otherwise.

6 I would discourage everybody from 

7 getting all happy about natural gas and how cheap 

8 it is and how clean it is, because the places 

9 where it is getting explored, in Pennsylvania and 

10 New York, and other places around the country, 

11 they are already finding very serious problems 

12 with water quality, air quality, and public 

13 health.

14 All of these fossil fuels where they are 

15 obtained produce awful results, that the people 

16 within a mile or two know all too well, and 

17 everybody else, we don't think we have to worry 

18 about it, because it is someplace else.

19 So, ultimately, we have to move fossil 

20 fuels out of the picture, but I think that the 

21 proposed carbon pollution standard is an 

22 eminently reasonable step, which other people 
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1 have told you would be easily afforded and could 

2 bring us forward, and we need to do that instead 

3 of going backward or sitting still.

4 Thanks very much.

5 MR. CULLIGAN: Thank both of you very 

6 much.

7 Our next two speakers are Kim Knowlton 

8 and Daryl Downing.

9 MS. KNOWLTON: Hello. Good morning. 

10 Thank you for this opportunity to testify on the 

11 health threats of climate change and the 

12 milestone the proposed standard offers to limit 

13 the worst of those effects. I am Kim Knowlton. 

14 That is K-I-M, K-N-O-W-L-T-O-N.

15 I am a senior scientist in the Health 

16 and Environment Program at the Natural Resources 

17 Defense Council, or NRDC. I am also Assistant 

18 Clinical Professor at Columbia University's 

19 Mailman School of Public Health. I am Chair of 

20 the Topic Committee on Climate Change and Health 

21 of the American Public Health Association and a 

22 co-convening lead author of the Human Health 
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1 Chapter of the 2013 National Climate Assessment.

2 As so many people have told you today, 

3 as you will hear and as you know, climate change 

4 is an absolutely urgent public health concern. 

5 Americans had a very personal experience of one 

6 aspect of climate change last year, and that is 

7 extreme weather.

8 2011 gave us 3,251 monthly broken 

9 weather records, so many extreme events that NRDC 

10 put together an on-line mapping tool to track 

11 them and the destruction that they caused across 

12 the U.S.

13 2012, this year, is off to another 

14 record smashing start. March was the hottest 

15 March since recordkeeping began back in 1895. 

16 April marked the end of the warmest 12 months' 

17 stretch ever in the U.S., and summer isn't even 

18 here yet.

19 Now, what is sobering about this is that 

20 many of these extreme weather events are 

21 influenced by climate change, which is loading 

22 the weather dice and contributing to some of the 
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1 most health-harming of those conditions we face, 

2 and those conditions in extreme weather that have 

3 big health consequences.

4 For example, rising temperatures worsen 

5 ozone smog pollution, which is terrible news for 

6 people with asthma. There are nearly 26 million 

7 Americans with asthma and prevalence is 

8 increasing especially among children, women, and 

9 economically disadvantaged families.

10 If you know someone with asthma, and who 

11 doesn't, you know someone whose health is being 

12 challenged by climate change and thus carbon 

13 pollution.

14 Lung doctors expect asthma cases to rise 

15 further as the air pollution worsens from the 

16 effects of carbon pollution, and ozone related 

17 emergency room visits for asthma among children 

18 in New York City where I live could increase over 

19 7 percent by 2020, so it is right around the 

20 corner from the effects of climate change, or 

21 take extreme heat. That sends tens of thousands 

22 of people to emergency rooms across the United 
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1 States for heart, lung, kidney, and other 

2 ailments.

3 My family has migraines and kidney 

4 stones. Both of those conditions are worsened by 

5 extreme heat, and heat can, unfortunately, also 

6 be lethal. It has been estimated that, when 

7 totaled, over 150,000 Americans could perish by 

8 the end of this century due to the additional 

9 heat and premature heat-related mortality 

10 associated with climate change, or take flooding 

11 and extreme rain.

12 The towns and farms of Upstate New York 

13 where I grew up were devastated last year by 

14 record rainfall and flooding, homes, businesses, 

15 crops, main streets were washed away. Besides 

16 human pain and suffering, flooding costs 

17 billions.

18 Extreme weather in 2011 took over 1,000 

19 lives in the U.S., with economic damages 

20 estimated at well over $52 billion, and that 

21 doesn't include health-related costs.

22 NRDC, the University of California 
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1 economists, recently found out that just six 

2 climate change related events in the last decade 

3 could add tens of billions of dollars in 

4 health-related costs. This is all just a partial 

5 snapshot of the serious toll that climate change 

6 can take on our health and our economy. There is 

7 a really strong consensus among health scientists 

8 that action is needed.

9 Over 141 public health groups and 

10 professionals have urged President Obama and 

11 members of Congress to address the roots of these 

12 health problems and reduce carbon pollution.

13 Public health is built on a foundation 

14 of prevention with the goal of avoiding disease 

15 before it happens, so the parallel here is clear. 

16 Supporting EPA's new source performance standard 

17 places national limits on industrial carbon 

18 pollution to prevent more potentially disastrous 

19 health effects of climate change before they 

20 happen.

21 The time for us all to protect our 

22 children's and grandchildren's health and future 
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1 is now. The standard that EPA is proposing will 

2 protect their health in the climate that has 

3 allowed us to build a way of life that we enjoy 

4 today and pave the way for our children and our 

5 grandchildren to enjoy healthier and more secure 

6 communities.

7 I thank you for the opportunity to talk 

8 and offer testimony on this matter of vital 

9 importance to the public health of the nation.

10 MR. CULLIGAN: Thank you.

11 MR. DOWNING: My name Daryl Downing, 

12 D-A-R-Y-L, D-O-W-N-I-N-G. I am the father of two 

13 children, one of whom has asthma. Other than 

14 ensuring he has an inhaler in the health clinic 

15 at school, and more at home, and an inhaler pack 

16 when he goes on outings with the Boy Scouts, I 

17 can't help my son with his asthma.

18 I need the Federal Government to reduce 

19 toxic pollutants emanating from coal-fired power 

20 plants. I need the EPA to regulate the amount of 

21 particulate matter, mercury, and other harmful 

22 substances that enter the air.
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1 I can't protect my family from the 

2 noxious substances that come out of coal-fired 

3 power plant smoke stacks, but the EPA can and 

4 must.

5 I served in the Air Force for 24 years. 

6 I was willing to give my life in the defense of 

7 the Constitution. I did not serve so 

8 irresponsible companies could poison the air we 

9 breathe, the water we drink, and the land we need 

10 to grow our food.

11 Regrettably, the U.S. has a deplorable 

12 record. It allows electricity companies to put 

13 very harmful substances into the environment. We 

14 can and must do better. The carbon pollution 

15 standard is a step in the right direction for my 

16 family and every other family in the country.

17 Thank you.

18 MR. CULLIGAN: Thank you.

19 Our next two speakers are Laura Anderko 

20 and Vasiliy Kisunko.

21 DR. ANDERKO: Good morning. My name is 

22 Laura Anderko. That is L-A-U-R-A, A-N-D-E-R-K-O. 
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1 I hold the Robert and Kathleen Scanlon Endowed 

2 Chair in Values Based Health Care at Georgetown 

3 University. I am here on behalf of the Natural 

4 Resource Defense Council and Health Care Without 

5 Harm. I am a member of the American Public 

6 Health Association and the Alliance of Nurses for 

7 a Health Environment.

8 I was one of almost 400 health 

9 professionals who signed a letter sent by the 

10 Union of Concerned Scientists in support of the 

11 EPA's carbon pollution standard. I have been a 

12 nurse and a public health professional for over 

13 30 years, served as a member of the EPA's 

14 Children's Health Protection Advisory Committee, 

15 and have conducted research, published, and 

16 taught in the field of climate change and health.

17 The proposed regulations and the Clean 

18 Air Act represent a common sense approach to 

19 reducing pollution, improving our nation's 

20 health, and reducing related health costs. In 

21 addition to improving air quality, the proposed 

22 regulations will reduce greenhouse gases that are 
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1 associated with climate change.

2 These greenhouse gases can have an 

3 immediate and detrimental impact on human health. 

4 The United States is in the middle of an 

5 epidemic of chronic disease that incurs $1.3 

6 billion in health care costs each year.

7 Many chronic illnesses, including 

8 asthma, heart and lung disease, cancer, and 

9 vector-borne disease, such as Lyme disease, 

10 dengue fever, malaria have environmental 

11 associations and are increasing each year.

12 These illnesses take a toll on the 

13 productivity of workers, on the education of 

14 children when they miss school due to illness, 

15 and on our health care system. There is no doubt 

16 that greenhouse gases contribute heavily to these 

17 diseases, and the related costs are 

18 unsustainable.

19 The effects of uncontrolled greenhouse 

20 gases are borne not just by individuals, but by 

21 our society. As the effects of climate change 

22 progress, communities will rely more heavily on 
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1 both the public health and health care systems to 

2 deal with increased illness, heat stroke and 

3 heart attack patients during heat waves, asthma 

4 attack rates that increase during high air 

5 quality index days, increased insect-borne 

6 disease as their geographical ranges expand, and 

7 trauma associated with hurricanes, tornadoes, and 

8 other extreme weather events that are already 

9 happening in record numbers and increased 

10 intensity.

11 It will cost millions to prepare our 

12 nation's public health and health care systems to 

13 meet these challenges, including the emotional 

14 and mental health costs of climate change.

15 However, few communities are prepared to 

16 adapt these climate events and associated health 

17 needs. I currently am working with experts at 

18 Georgetown Climate Center to create tools for 

19 cities and States to adapt to these changes and 

20 address health effects from climate events, such 

21 as heat waves. We can do much better than that.

22 Allowing industries to pollute our 
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1 atmosphere unchecked is placing an economic 

2 burden on the taxpayer, patients, and the health 

3 care sector. The question is not whether 

4 industries can afford to implement greenhouse gas 

5 limitations. The question is whether the nation 

6 can afford for then not to do so.

7 We owe it to our future generations to 

8 enact these regulations, clean our air, and 

9 improve our nation's health. I strongly support 

10 and really applaud EPA's efforts in proposing the 

11 carbon pollution standards.

12 Thank you.

13 MR. CULLIGAN: Thank you.

14 MR. KISUNKO: Hi. My name is Vasiliy 

15 Kisunko, V-A-S-I-L-I-Y, last name K-I-S-U-N-K-O.

16 Thank you for the opportunity to 

17 testify. I just want to encourage EPA to limit 

18 the worst effects of fossil-fueled power plants. 

19 We cannot continue to pollute our air and our 

20 water by burning fossil fuels like coal.

21 We have an opportunity now to find new, 

22 innovative ways to power our lives with renewal 
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1 energy.

2 It is our responsibility to provide a 

3 healthy environment, not only for ourselves, but 

4 for our children. This carbon pollution standard 

5 for new power plants would not only protect our 

6 health, but also take the right steps towards 

7 curbing global warming and the pollution that 

8 causes it.

9 We need the EPA to do the right thing 

10 and protect our health and our environment.

11 Thank you very much.

12 MR. CULLIGAN: Thank you.

13 Our next two speakers, I have written 

14 here Richard Kennedy, who I think already 

15 testified, unless there are two Richard Kennedys.

16 Andon Zabel. A-N-D-O-N Z-A-B-E-L.

17 [No response.]

18 MR. CULLIGAN: We will move on to the 

19 next two.

20 We have got Roger Rivera and Monica 

21 Cevallos.

22 MS. CEVALLOS: Hi. My name is Monica 
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1 Cevallos. Last name C-E-V-A-L-L-O-S. I am here 

2 on behalf of Voces Verdes and several Latino 

3 organizations committed to efforts that support 

4 our community's health, economic advancement, 

5 safety, and well-being, and the concerned 

6 communities whom we represent.

7 We are here to express our strong 

8 support for the Environmental Protection Agency's 

9 proposed carbon pollution standards that will 

10 limit industrial carbon pollution from new power 

11 plants.

12 We also urge the EPA to move forward 

13 with carbon pollution standards for existing 

14 plants. For Latino families, limiting industrial 

15 carbon pollution from new power plants, as this 

16 rule proposes, is a historic step towards 

17 protecting our children and communities from the 

18 impacts of climate change and the associated 

19 health risks.

20 Power plants are the biggest carbon 

21 polluters. There are currently no national limits 

22 on power plants carbon pollution that fuels 
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1 climate change, which threaten their health, and 

2 drives our increasingly extreme weather causing 

3 more severe heat waves and contributing to more 

4 devastating floods, rising sea levels, poor air 

5 quality, and many other health threats.

6 Carbon-induced climate change also 

7 causes more heat-related illness, cardiovascular, 

8 and respiratory disease, results in more frequent 

9 outbreaks of water-borne diseases and 

10 vector-borne diseases, all of which affect 

11 Latinos in the U.S. and abroad in great numbers.

12 Increased temperatures as a result of 

13 climate change also makes smog worse and 

14 threatens the health of those that can least 

15 afford it, because nearly half or 48.8 percent of 

16 all Hispanics in the United States live in smog 

17 and non-attainment areas, and since many Latinos 

18 work outside in construction and agricultural 

19 trades, millions in our communities are often at 

20 even greater risk at damaging health impacts of 

21 smog.

22 Groups representing millions of Latinos 
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1 have already called for limits to pollutants that 

2 cause climate change and pollute our air, 

3 recognizing the heightened impacts to many in the 

4 Latino community from these environmental harms.

5 We are here again joining here to 

6 demonstrate the strong support that exists among 

7 Latinos for strong environmental protection and 

8 the proposed limits to carbon pollution from new 

9 power plants, as well as the need to move forward 

10 on carbon pollution limits and existing power 

11 plants.

12 It is time for the EPA to set pollution 

13 limits that are truly protective of the public 

14 health of our communities and the future.

15 Thank you.

16 MR. CULLIGAN: Thank you.

17 MR. RIVERA: Good morning. I am Roger 

18 Rivera, president and founder of the National 

19 Hispanic Environmental Council, the only National 

20 Latino environmental and natural resource 

21 organization in the country.

22 Thank you for the opportunity today to 
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1 present NHEC's views on this critical 

2 environmental health and safety issue that 

3 impacts all Americans, but in particular the over 

4 50 million Americans who are Latino.

5 I am here today to express our strong 

6 support for the Environmental Protection Agency's 

7 proposed standard to reduce industrial carbon 

8 pollution from new power plants. In addition, we 

9 also urge EPA to move forward with carbon 

10 pollution standards for existing plants, actions 

11 we know are under consideration.

12 The power sector is the largest source 

13 of carbon pollution in the United States, as we 

14 all know, and one of the largest sources in the 

15 world. This sector generates nearly 40 percent 

16 of all greenhouse gases in the United States.

17 Today, insufficiently regulated 

18 industrial carbon pollution from power plants is 

19 having a significant impact on our nation's 

20 health, as you have heard from many speakers this 

21 morning and today.

22 154 million Americans already suffer air 
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1 pollution levels that are too dangerous. Many 

2 studies have amply demonstrated who is most at 

3 risk, people with lung diseases, such as asthma, 

4 chronic bronchitis, and emphysema, children, the 

5 elderly, and people who work outdoors.

6 Regarding those working outdoors, 

7 millions of Latinos, as has been said, are 

8 employed in agriculture, construction, building 

9 trades, and many other occupations, and they work 

10 outside daily.

11 Since several of these at risk groups 

12 are disproportionately Latino, and as such are 

13 vulnerable to the effects of air pollution and 

14 greenhouse gas emissions, I would like to focus 

15 on the particular impacts to my community.

16 First, as is well known, the 2010 census 

17 revealed that there are over 50 million Latinos 

18 in the United States. Our community is now 16 

19 percent of the U.S. population, and we accounted 

20 for more than half the growth of the country's 

21 total population over the last 10 years.

22 There are a number of key socioeconomic 
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1 factors for our community that we urge 

2 policymakers to keep at the forefront as you 

3 deliberate on these proposed carbon standards.

4 First, in 2009, the median age for 

5 Latinos was 27.4 years compared to almost 37 

6 years for the total population. Further, more 

7 than one-third of Latinos were younger than 18 

8 compared to approximately one-fourth of the total 

9 population. Indeed, today, Hispanics are now the 

10 youngest population in the U.S.

11 Second, according to the 2010 census, 

12 25.3 percent of Hispanic Americans live in 

13 poverty, a total of 12.4 million people. Only 

14 African Americans exceeded that percentage with 

15 25.8 percent.

16 Third, as you have heard, Latinos have a 

17 significantly increased risk of developing acute 

18 and chronic illnesses like asthma and other 

19 pulmonary and respiratory diseases from exposure 

20 to air pollution.

21 The reason, as you have heard, is that a 

22 disproportionate number of Latinos live in areas 
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1 that fail to meet one or more Federal standards 

2 for clean air.

3 In 2010, the American Lung Association 

4 examined the 25 most polluted U.S. cities as 

5 measured by unhealthy levels or particulates, 

6 ozone, and other air pollution.

7 In analyzing that data, the Center for 

8 American Progress found that fully 66 percent of 

9 U.S. Latinos, nearly 26 million people live in 

10 areas that do not meet the Federal Government's 

11 safe air quality standards.

12 Moreover, it found that 7 out of the 25 

13 worst polluted U.S. cities have Latino 

14 populations of over 40 percent. In fact, the 

15 average Latino population in the 10 worst 

16 polluted U.S. cities is 33 percent.

17 Fourth, it is a documented reality that 

18 low income and poor Latinos have far less access 

19 to quality health care, health insurance, and 

20 inadequate housing. These conditions make our 

21 community especially vulnerable to climate change 

22 related illnesses, a reality that would only 
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1 worsen should air pollution and greenhouse gases 

2 increase as is projected.

3 One particular scourge for the Latino 

4 community is asthma. Today, Latinos have some of 

5 the highest rates of asthma in the country. 

6 According to a 2005 study by the CDC, 13 percent 

7 of all Latino children suffered from asthma.

8 In 2009, the Federal Office of Minority 

9 Health reported that 1.7 million Latinos have 

10 asthma. Indeed, Hispanic children are 60 percent 

11 more likely to have asthma compared to 

12 non-Hispanic whites.

13 For Puerto Rican children living on the 

14 Island, the asthma rate was an astounding 30 

15 percent. There, the death rate from asthma is 

16 2.5 times the rate of the mainland according to 

17 the CDC.

18 Finally, Latinos are among the most 

19 uninsured and under-insured population in the 

20 U.S. when it comes to health insurance. 

21 Estimates were in 2010 that 39 percent of all 

22 Latinos lack health insurance with 25 percent of 
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1 Latino children being uninsured.

2 Further, the uninsured are three times 

3 more likely than those with insurance to report 

4 problems getting needed medical care and are less 

5 likely to receive preventative care.

6 For all these reasons, the proposed EPA 

7 carbon pollution standard is absolutely vital to 

8 the public health, wellness, and safety of the 

9 Latino community.

10 NHEC urges EPA to move at the fastest 

11 possible speed to implement this much needed 

12 standard.

13 On behalf of the National Hispanic 

14 Environmental Council, thank you.

15 MR. CULLIGAN: Thank both of you.

16 Our next two speakers are Walter Ebmeyer 

17 and Barbara Weinstein.

18 MR. EBMEYER: My name is Walter Ebmeyer. 

19 My last name is E-B-M-E-Y-E-R. I am a member of 

20 the Sierra Club, and I am the Pennsylvania 

21 coordinator of Progressive Democrats of America.

22 This is an article from yesterday's New 
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1 York Times about Richard Leakey, famed 

2 anthropologist and son of famed anthropologist. 

3 He was asked to speak at a fundraiser on Chelsea 

4 Piers, a dining room over the Hudson River in 

5 Manhattan, and he said, "I was wondering how many 

6 dinners you will be able to have at Pier 60 

7 before it went under water."

8 Dr. Leakey and virtually all the tenured 

9 science professors in the world know about global 

10 warming and know what causes it - greenhouse 

11 gases, among which the greatest are water vapor 

12 and carbon dioxide.

13 Yet, during the news yesterday morning, 

14 we were subjected to a visually elaborate ad for 

15 Americaspower.org, a clan of fossil fuel 

16 producers and burners who are devoted to 

17 convincing the American people there is such a 

18 thing as clean coal, and their continuing to burn 

19 coal, oil, and gas will somehow be good for us.

20 Virtually, every night during the 

21 network news we see another ad featuring an 

22 attractive young woman sharing her joy that 
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1 energy need not be a problem, that we only have 

2 to dig up more fossil fuels and burn them, and 

3 all our problems will be solved. She even uses 

4 the phrase, "No question."

5 I am 77 years old and I have six 

6 grandchildren, 7 years, 7 years, 4 years, 4 

7 years, 17 months, and 3 months old. I would bet 

8 that they could correctly answer this question: 

9 Should we believe the people who excavate and 

10 burn fossil fuels for vast profits, or should we 

11 believe a tenured science professor at Stonybrook 

12 University? I am quite sure a majority of them 

13 would get it right.

14 When we talk about carbon dioxide, I 

15 worry about my grandchildren's future, about 

16 breathing problems, glacier melt, sea level rise, 

17 and ocean acidification. I also worry about men 

18 and women in our world who spend gobs of money 

19 spreading lies about clean coal and the no 

20 question benefits of oil and natural gas. Who 

21 are these people? Do they look in the mirror in 

22 the morning? What do they see?
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1 Thank you very much.

2 MR. CULLIGAN: Thank you. You can leave 

3 a copy of that article at the desk to be included 

4 in the record. Thank you.

5 MS. WEINSTEIN: Good morning. My name 

6 is Barbara Weinstein. I am the legislative 

7 director at the Religious Action Center of Reform 

8 Judaism, the Washington Office of the Union for 

9 Reform Judaism, which advocates on behalf of more 

10 than 900 congregations and a million and a half 

11 Reform Jews across North America.

12 I am also here on behalf of the 

13 Coalition on the Environment and Jewish Life, 

14 composed of 27 national Jewish organizations 

15 spanning the full spectrum of Jewish religious 

16 and communal life.

17 Thanks for the opportunity to speak 

18 about support for the EPA's proposed carbon 

19 pollution standard for new power plants. The 

20 standard marks an historic step toward developing 

21 comprehensive U.S. climate and energy policy, and 

22 we call on the EPA to maintain the strength of 
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1 this proposed safeguard as it moves toward a 

2 final rule.

3 The looming crisis of climate change is 

4 an immense environmental, political, and economic 

5 challenge, but in the Jewish community, as in the 

6 faith community broadly, climate change is also a 

7 moral and spiritual challenge.

8 Judaism teaches that we are partners 

9 with God in the world of creation and that we 

10 must till and tend the earth, and that it is not 

11 ours to abuse for our own profit.

12 Our ancient sages well before there were 

13 power plants or man-made carbon pollution told us 

14 that God implored take care lest you spoil and 

15 destroy my world, because if you do, there is no 

16 one after you to make it right again.

17 If we fail to preserve and protect this 

18 world, our only world, by failing to address 

19 rising levels of climate pollution, we betray our 

20 responsibility to one another and to future 

21 generations.

22 Our faith also instructs and guides us 
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1 that in the most difficult times, even in times 

2 of economic hardship or political conflict, all 

3 of creation is to be honored and protected. In 

4 Deuteronomy, we read that it is forbidden to cut 

5 down fruit-bearing trees outside a besieged city. 

6 It's a reminder to honor our national resources 

7 even when it may seem most imperative or 

8 expeditious to exploit them is a lesson that 

9 inspires us in the secular sphere as well.

10 The standards proposed by the EPA 

11 address the heart of our nation's carbon problems 

12 by targeting power plants, the country's largest 

13 source of carbon pollution.

14 Existing power plants emit more than 2 

15 billion tons of carbon and other toxic pollutants 

16 each year, nearly 13,000 pounds for every man, 

17 woman, and child in the country.

18 There are serious health and 

19 environmental and economic consequences of those 

20 emissions. Scientists and experts agree carbon 

21 pollution threatens public health and welfare by 

22 contributing to rising rates of respiratory 
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1 ailments and heart attacks.

2 These health issues disproportionately 

3 affect some more than others, particularly 

4 communities of color, low income communities, 

5 children, and older adults. Moreover, carbon 

6 pollution it is agreed to be the main cause of 

7 climate change and is linked to the rising number 

8 of extreme weather events in recent years.

9 Each year from 2001 to 2011 has been one 

10 of the 12 warmest years on record, and the trend 

11 is projected to continue with April making 

12 history as the third warmest month ever recorded.

13 The science is clear and our faith 

14 tradition inspires our understanding of the steps 

15 that must be taken to reduce carbon emissions and 

16 address the impacts of these harmful pollutants.

17 That is why a recent survey conducted by 

18 the Public Religion and Research Institute found 

19 that an overwhelming 69 percent of American Jews 

20 are supportive of tougher laws and regulations to 

21 protect the environment even if it raises prices.

22 Today, it is our responsibility to 
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1 protect our children from the impact of climate 

2 change. That includes the 55 percent of American 

3 children who, in 2005, by this agency's own 

4 estimate, lived in counties in which the 8-hour 

5 ozone standard was exceeded on at least one day 

6 per year.

7 Today, it is our responsibility to help 

8 prevent our congregants and others in Missouri, 

9 Texas, and Kansas from ever again knowing the 

10 devastation caused by the extreme weather events 

11 that swept their States this year and last, the 

12 same kinds of extreme weather events like heat 

13 waves that this agency notes on its web site, are 

14 probable to become more likely and progressively 

15 more intense over the course of decades under 

16 current climate change scenarios.

17 Today, it is our responsibility to cut 

18 our carbon emissions and arrest the ever 

19 worsening phenomenon of climate change, and we 

20 can do that by adopting the carbon pollution 

21 standard for new power plants that this agency 

22 has proposed.
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1 The need for carbon limits has never 

2 been clearer. We commend the EPA for taking 

3 steps to limit these harmful emissions, and we 

4 call on the EPA to maintain the strength of this 

5 safeguard as it moves toward issuing a final 

6 rule.

7 Thank you.

8 MR. CULLIGAN: Thank you.

9 We have Andon Zabel. Also, Cathy Green.

10 We will start with you, Andon.

11 MR. ZABEL: Where is that yellow light 

12 you guys were talking about? Oh.

13 Thank you for holding this public 

14 hearing. My name is Andon Zabel, and I live at 

15 1342 A, South Mount Vernon Avenue, Williamsburg, 

16 Virginia 23185. I will spell that for you in a 

17 minute.

18 I can sit here and tell you about all 

19 the people that I know who are going to be 

20 personally offended by climate change, but 

21 honestly, I would be here all day.

22 The truth is every family I know is 
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1 going to be adversely affected by climate change, 

2 whether it is my grandfather's desert wheat 

3 fields that can no longer produce wheat, or my 

4 friends in Norfolk who are getting flooded out of 

5 their homes. Every family in this great land of 

6 ours is going to be affected.

7 Now, what I want to talk about today is 

8 the young people I know who are devoting their 

9 lives to slowing down climate change. We do not, 

10 as the coal industry loves to suggest, do this 

11 for the money. We do it because we know that it 

12 is our future that is on the line here.

13 The effects we are experiencing right 

14 now, flooding in Norfolk, wildfires out West, 

15 months of drought in D.C. followed by weeks of 

16 pouring rain, fewer and fewer snow days in 

17 Virginia, this is just the beginning. By the 

18 time I think about retiring, Norfolk will be 

19 mostly under water, hurricanes will be expected 

20 each August, and every coastal city in the 

21 country will feel the way Norfolk does now, so we 

22 are fighting.
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1 We fought hard to get Obama elected just 

2 so that this hearing could take place in the 

3 first place. We fought for clean energy and 

4 green job legislation, and we are fighting coal 

5 plants one by one as they are proposed.

6 We are doing this because we know three 

7 basic facts to be true.

8 One. Coal is the largest source of 

9 carbon emissions. Two. Carbon emissions are the 

10 largest cause of climate change. Three. Climate 

11 change is going to adversely affect our future by 

12 making weather hotter, more variable, and more 

13 intense.

14 I applaud the EPA for taking this 

15 historic first step in limiting carbon pollution 

16 from new power plants, and I urge you not to back 

17 down in the face of the inevitable backlash from 

18 the coal industry.

19 The EPA must implement and enforce this 

20 rule first, and next, they must implement 

21 controls or a timeline for controls on carbon 

22 pollution for existing power plants.
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1 Thank you for your time.

2 MR. CULLIGAN: Thank you.

3 Do we have Cathy Green? Is Cathy Green 

4 in the audience?

5 [No response.]

6 MR. CULLIGAN: I guess with that, that 

7 concludes the slate of speakers we had for the 

8 morning. I would like to actually, before I 

9 adjourn the hearing for lunch, repeat something 

10 that one of the earlier speakers said.

11 We recognize a lot of you took time off 

12 to come here and also traveled a fair distance to 

13 get here, so we all appreciate the effort that 

14 you have taken to come and share your views with 

15 us this morning.

16 We will be adjourning for lunch, and the 

17 panel will be returning at 1 o'clock to hear 

18 speakers this afternoon.

19 Thank you very much.

20 [Luncheon recess from 11:52 a.m. to 1:08 

21 p.m.]

22 MR. CULLIGAN: Good afternoon. I think 
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1 we will get started for the afternoon session.

2 First, I would like to thank you all for 

3 attending our hearing. My name is Kevin 

4 Culligan. I am an Associate Division Director 

5 with our Sector Strategies and Policy Division, 

6 which is part of our Office of Air Quality 

7 Planning Standards, which is part of our Office 

8 of Air and Radiation at EPA.

9 I am joined on the panel by Laura 

10 Strine, who is also with the Office of Air and 

11 Radiation, and by David Evans, who is in our 

12 Office of Policy.

13 We are here today to listen to your 

14 comments on our proposed, "Carbon Pollution 

15 Standards for New Power Plants." We published 

16 the proposed standards in the Federal Register on 

17 April 13, 2012. This is a common-sense step 

18 under the Clean Air Act that would, for the first 

19 time, put national limits on the amount of carbon 

20 pollution that could be emitted from power plants 

21 built in the future.

22 For future power plants EPA is proposing 
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1 and set an output-based standard of 1,000 pounds 

2 of CO2 per megawatt hour. The agency's proposal 

3 does not apply to existing units and it also does 

4 not apply to planned units that have already 

5 received permits if they commence construction 

6 within 12 months of April 13, 2012.

7 EPA's proposed standard reflects the 

8 ongoing trend in the power sector to build 

9 cleaner plants to take advantage of American-made 

10 technologies. The proposal is flexible and would 

11 help to minimize carbon pollution throughout the 

12 deployment of the same types of modern 

13 technology. EPA's proposal would ensure that 

14 this progress towards a cleaner, safer, more 

15 modern power sector continues.

16 Today, we will be accepting oral 

17 comments on all aspects of our rule, and we will 

18 prepare a written transcript of all of the oral 

19 comments that we receive today. The transcript 

20 will be available as part of the official record 

21 of the rule. We are also accepting written 

22 comments through June 25, 2012.
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1 At the registration area outside, there 

2 is directions on how those comments can be 

3 submitted either through the mail, via fax, or 

4 through e-mail.

5 We will consider the comments whether 

6 they are received here to whether they are 

7 received in written format as we move forward to 

8 complete the final rule.

9 I would like to walk through the 

10 procedures that we will use this afternoon, as we 

11 have you all testify.

12 I will call up the scheduled speakers up 

13 in pairs, so two of you will come up at a time. 

14 When it is your turn to speak, please state your 

15 name, your affiliation, and if you would, spell 

16 out your name. It is very helpful to our court 

17 reporter.

18 In order to be fair to everyone, we are 

19 limiting testimony to five minutes, and we ask 

20 that as two of you come up in pairs, that the 

21 first person remain at the table until the second 

22 person finishes speaking.
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1 The three of us may ask clarifying 

2 questions. If an addition to the transcript of 

3 your testimony that will be made, you would like 

4 to put the full text of your testimony into the 

5 docket, you are welcome to drop off a copy of 

6 your testimony at the registration desk out 

7 front.

8 We will be using a timekeeping system to 

9 help make sure we keep everyone at five minutes, 

10 so basically, as soon as you start speaking, the 

11 green light will turn on, and then after four 

12 minutes, the yellow light will turn on to warn 

13 you that you have one minute left, and then the 

14 red light will turn on after five minutes.

15 Today's hearing is scheduled from 8:30 

16 this morning until 8:00 p.m. tonight. We will be 

17 taking a second break this evening from 4:30 to 

18 5:30, and we will commence with the final part of 

19 the hearing from 5:30 to 8:00 promptly at 5:30.

20 If you would like to testify and you 

21 have not yet registered, there is still an 

22 opportunity to do so. Just go out to the 
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1 registration table outside, and the folks there 

2 will be able to help you.

3 We ask for your patience as we proceed 

4 through the list of speakers, and we may make 

5 some adjustments as time progresses if you 

6 weren't here, or to accommodate people's 

7 schedules.

8 If you do have any questions throughout 

9 the day, the staff outside at the registration 

10 table will be happy to help you.

11 With that, why don't we get started, and 

12 I am going to call up our first two speakers for 

13 the afternoon, and they are Lara Levison and 

14 Nathan Willcox.

15 MR. WILLCOX: Nathan Willcox, the last 

16 name is W-I-L-L-C-O-X, and I am the Federal 

17 Global Warning Director for Environment America. 

18 Good afternoon and thanks for the opportunity to 

19 testify on this critically important issue of 

20 carbon pollution from power plants.

21 Environment America is a federation of 

22 29 State-based environmental organizations 
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1 working to protect America's air, water, and open 

2 spaces, and on behalf of Environment America's 

3 citizen members nationwide, I commend EPA for its 

4 proposed carbon pollution standards for new power 

5 plants and urge the agency to move forward with 

6 finalizing these much needed standards this year.

7 Doing so will help to ensure that we 

8 protect our health, our environment, and our 

9 planet for future generations. The science is 

10 clear that global warming is happening and that 

11 it is being fueled by carbon pollution from human 

12 activities. Already March 2012 was the hottest 

13 March on record for the United States, 2010 tied 

14 for the hottest year, and the decade of 2001 to 

15 2010 was the hottest 10-year period on record.

16 Globally, April 2012 marked the 326th 

17 consecutive month that the global average 

18 temperature was above its 20th century normal. 

19 The science is also clear that left unchecked, 

20 global warming will negatively impact our health, 

21 our safety, and our environment in a number of 

22 ways.
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1 Numerous studies by the Environment 

2 America Research and Policy Center and others 

3 have documented the increase in extreme weather 

4 that many areas of the country have already seen 

5 in recent decades and documented the science 

6 showing how global warming will likely bring even 

7 more extreme weather in the future.

8 Other studies have shown how global 

9 warning will lead to the loss of native plant and 

10 animal species, as well as drought and a 

11 dangerous rise in sea level, but the potential 

12 damage to our health from global warming is key 

13 specifically, with relation to ozone smog 

14 pollution. This is the pollution that hangs over 

15 our cities on many of the hottest summer days, 

16 triggering asthma attacks and a number of other 

17 respiratory problems for even healthy 

18 individuals.

19 Since heat is a key ingredient in the 

20 formation of smog, scientists predict that we 

21 will see even more smog in a warming world. In 

22 fact, a recent study by the Union of Concerned 
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1 Scientists predicts that higher levels of ground 

2 level ozone due to rising temperatures could lead 

3 to 2.8 million more asthma attacks and other 

4 respiratory problems leading to 900,000 

5 additional missed days of school.

6 That is bad news for all of us, but 

7 especially to the millions of children, adults, 

8 and seniors who suffer from asthma and other 

9 respiratory problems, and this is to say nothing 

10 of global warming's impact on our health because 

11 of more frequent and more intense heat waves, and 

12 the spread of tropical diseases.

13 We have known for years that power 

14 plants are the largest single source of the 

15 carbon pollution fueling the problem, and for 

16 decades these power plants have been allowed to 

17 spew unlimited amounts of carbon pollution into 

18 our air with the exception of power plants in the 

19 areas of the country that have enacted State and 

20 regional caps on carbon pollution.

21 In order to achieve the reductions in 

22 carbon pollution that scientists say are 
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1 necessary to avoid the worst consequences of 

2 global warming, we need to reverse this trend and 

3 start holding power plants accountable for their 

4 carbon pollution.

5 That is why EPA's proposed carbon 

6 pollution standards for new power plants are so 

7 important. Until we rein in the largest emitters 

8 of carbon pollution, most notably power plants, 

9 we cannot possibly hope to achieve the reductions 

10 in carbon pollution called for by scientists.

11 Environment America, therefore, 

12 wholeheartedly supports EPA's proposed carbon 

13 pollution standards for new power plants, and we 

14 also urge the EPA to move ahead with carbon 

15 pollution standards for existing power plants.

16 Curbing pollution from potential new 

17 power plants is critical, but even more critical 

18 is carbon pollution from plants that are 

19 polluting today. The public support for the 

20 standards is strong and it is growing.

21 Already, Environment America and our 

22 State affiliates throughout the country have 
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1 collected more than 180,000 public comments in 

2 support of EPA moving ahead with carbon pollution 

3 standards for new and existing power plants

4 The broader nationwide network of 

5 environmental and public health groups working on 

6 this issue has gathered over 1 million supportive 

7 public comments.

8 Thanks again for the opportunity to 

9 testify today and for the agency's work in 

10 developing these critical standards to protect 

11 our health and our environment.

12 MR. CULLIGAN: Thank you.

13 MS. LEVISON: Good afternoon. My name

14 is Lara Levison. It's L-A-R-A, L-E-V-I-S-O-N. 

15 However, I am giving this testimony in behalf of 

16 my boss, and his name is Peter Bahouth, 

17 P-E-T-E-R, B-A-H-O-U-T-H.

18 This testimony is from Peter Behouth, 

19 executive director of the U.S. Climate Action 

20 Network. I am the program director and domestic 

21 policy director for U.S. CAN.

22 I am here to express support of U.S. CAN 
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1 and its member groups for the proposed carbon 

2 pollution standard for new power plants. This 

3 proposed rule takes an important step forward at 

4 the Federal level to reduce U.S. greenhouse gas 

5 emissions that are contributing significantly to 

6 global climate change.

7 The U.S. Climate Action Network is the 

8 largest U.S. network of organizations focused on 

9 climate change with over 85 member groups. Our 

10 purpose is to support and help coordinate these 

11 or organizations' efforts towards effective, 

12 equitable, and sustainable strategies to reduce 

13 carbon pollution and promote a clean energy 

14 future at all levels of the debate - local, 

15 State, Federal, and international.

16 U.S. CAN is also an affiliate of the 

17 Climate Action Network CAN International, a 

18 worldwide network of more than 700 

19 nongovernmental organizations and NGOs in more 

20 than 90 countries working to promote government, 

21 private sector, and individual actions to limit 

22 human-induced climate change to ecologically 
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1 sustainable levels.

2 U.S. CAN's members include a wide range 

3 of nonprofit organizations whose individual 

4 members represent a broad spectrum of Americans. 

5 Many of our member groups focus on climate 

6 change specifically or environmental issues more 

7 broadly, and these include State, regional, 

8 national, and global organizations.

9 Because climate change will affect, and 

10 is already affecting, so many aspects of society, 

11 organizations representing many interests and 

12 constituencies belong to U.S. CAN's Network, as 

13 well, including groups focused on the following 

14 topics: health, civil rights, faith, business, 

15 animal welfare, international developments, 

16 energy efficiency, portable energy, renewable 

17 energy, environmental justice, think tank 

18 research, green jobs, sportsmen and anglers, 

19 wildlife, sustainables, transportation, and 

20 science. A list of U.S. CAN's members is 

21 included at the end of this testimony. I will 

22 not read that list you are happy to know.
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1 The proposed carbon pollution standard 

2 is relevant to American's day-to-day concerns 

3 about the health of our families and the state of 

4 the economy. Limiting industrial carbon pollution 

5 from new power plants is critical to protecting 

6 the health of our children and families.

7 I am going to skip forward to cover the 

8 main points. Regarding the economy, cleaning up 

9 carbon pollution will spark innovation and clean 

10 technologies and create American jobs to 

11 manufacture, install, and operate these 

12 technologies.

13 Again, the proposed carbon pollution 

14 rule is important in relation to topics that 

15 Americans think about every day and recognize as 

16 relevant to our daily lives, namely, the health 

17 of our families and the strength of the U.S. 

18 economy.

19 The rule is also critically important 

20 from a longer term perspective. U.S. CAN's 

21 members recognize that climate change is already 

22 reshaping our lives and our planet in myriad ways 
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1 and that we must seize the opportunities we have 

2 now to reduce carbon pollution and slow down 

3 global warming.

4 At the International Climate Change 

5 Conference in Copenhagen in December 2009, the 

6 Copenhagen Accord recognized that greenhouse 

7 gases in the atmosphere should be stabilized at a 

8 level that would keep the increase in global 

9 temperature below 2 degree Celsius to prevent 

10 dangerous changes to the climate.

11 Just last week, the chief economist for 

12 the International Energy Agency, Fartih Berol, 

13 warned that it is becoming increasingly unlikely 

14 that we will be able to keep the increase in 

15 global temperatures below 2 degrees Celsius in 

16 this century, "What I see now with existing 

17 investments for plants under construction, we are 

18 seeing the door for a 2-degree Celsius target 

19 about to be closed, and closed forever," said Dr. 

20 Berol, " Well, this door is getting slimmer and 

21 slimmer in terms of physical and economic 

22 possibility."
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1 According to the IEA, this is because 

2 such a large amount of energy-related greenhouse 

3 gas emissions is already locked in by existing 

4 power plants, factories, buildings, and other 

5 infrastructure.

6 The evidence of climate change is 

7 becoming harder to ignore as we witness unusual 

8 bouts of extreme weather and record warm 

9 temperatures. Nathan covered that pretty well, 

10 so I will skip this part, too.

11 Americans are noticing, they are making 

12 the connection between extreme weather and 

13 climate change. According to a March 2012 poll, 

14 82 percent of Americans report that they were 

15 affected themselves by one or more extreme 

16 weather event or disaster in the last year.

17 In response to the statement global 

18 warming is affecting the weather in the U.S., 70 

19 percent agreed strongly or somewhat.

20 We must move forward at the local, 

21 State, national, and international levels to slow 

22 down climate change. The carbon pollution rule 
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1 for new power plants is a step in the right 

2 direction at the national level for the United 

3 States.

4 Some of you U.S. CAN's member groups see 

5 it as a significant step, others see it as very 

6 insufficient step, but all agree that it is a 

7 step forward and that EPA should move swiftly to 

8 cover existing power plants as well.

9 Thus far, more than 1 million comments 

10 have been submitted to EPA --

11 MR. CULLIGAN: I am sorry.

12 MS. LEVISON: -- in support of the 

13 proposed carbon -- oops, done, okay. Thank you.

14 MR. CULLIGAN: The next speaker is 

15 Priscilla Lin. I am ready whenever you are.

16 MS. LIN: Hi. My name is Priscilla Lin. 

17 It is P-R-I-S-C-I-L-L-A, L-I-N. I grew up in 

18 Fairfax, Virginia, and I am currently studying at 

19 the College of William and Mary in Williamsburg, 

20 Virginia.

21 My major is global studies and 

22 environmental policy. I am in full support of 
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1 EPA's proposed carbon standards for new power 

2 plants, because I want clean air and healthy 

3 families for Virginia.

4 Today, I would like to share an example 

5 of how these proposed standards would improve and 

6 benefit the City of Williamsburg and the 

7 surrounding communities. In Surry County, 

8 Virginia, there has been an aggressive pursuit of 

9 a plan to build a $6 billion coal-fired power 

10 plant.

11 The site of the proposed coal plant lies 

12 across the James River, 20 miles away from the 

13 College of William and Mary. It would be the 

14 largest coal-fired plant in Virginia, generating 

15 more than 1,700 pounds of carbon per megawatt 

16 every year.

17 Carbon pollution fuels global warming, 

18 which only exacerbates air quality and smog 

19 problems. My generation already faces a host of 

20 health problems and from air pollution, my 

21 community would face increased risk of asthma and 

22 other lung illnesses seriously affecting our 
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1 quality of life.

2 Carbon pollution would also threaten the 

3 tourist industry that is crucial to the 

4 Williamsburg community. For almost four years, 

5 residents of Surry County and surrounding areas, 

6 including Williamsburg and Norfolk, have fought 

7 against this proposal.

8 William and Mary students have also 

9 joined in the dialogue with the Student 

10 Environmental Action Coalition for a campaign for 

11 Surry justice.

12 There is opposition to this project 

13 locally, but there has been blatant disregard in 

14 what the people want. Big polluters need to be 

15 held accountable. There are currently no Federal 

16 limits on how much carbon pollution power plants 

17 can emit into our air, and these polluters are 

18 bad corporate neighbors who take advantage of 

19 communities without regard for the health of 

20 people and their environment.

21 So, we need the EPA to finalize these 

22 carbon pollution standards this year. This is 
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1 one of the many examples of how big polluters 

2 hurt and exploit communities. I urge the EPA to 

3 move forward in finalizing these standards this 

4 year, and I urge EPA to also move quickly in 

5 developing standards for existing power plants.

6 The people of Surry County deserve 

7 better. The students and faculty at William and 

8 Mary, and citizens of Williamsburg, and the rest 

9 of the downwind areas affected deserve better. 

10 We all deserve better.

11 Thank you.

12 MR. CULLIGAN: Thank you very much.

13 I think at this point we are waiting on 

14 several speakers we are expecting, so we will 

15 take a pause while we wait.

16 [Pause.]

17 MR. CULLIGAN: Our next two speakers are 

18 Montre Moore and Mary Love.

19 I am going to walk through the 

20 directions one more time. Both of you can sit at 

21 the table. We are basically having two folks 

22 jump up to speak at a time. We have got the 
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1 light system over here, so basically, when you 

2 start speaking, they will turn it on.

3 It will be green for the first four 

4 minutes, it will turn yellow after four minutes, 

5 so that will let you know you have one minute 

6 left, so you can start to wrap up, and then it 

7 will turn red, and when it turns red, I will give 

8 you a gentle nudge to wrap up.

9 With that, whichever one of you wants to 

10 go first.

11 The other thing I would ask for the 

12 benefit of our court reporter, all of this goes 

13 in a transcript, if you could -- your names are 

14 actually fairly simple, but if you could repeat 

15 and spell your names, so the court reporter knows 

16 who you are, and your affiliation, that would be 

17 great.

18 MR. MOORE: Do you want me to do that 

19 first?

20 MR. CULLIGAN: When you start speaking, 

21 yes.

22 MR. MOORE: Do you want me to spell my 
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1 name also?

2 MR. CULLIGAN: Yes, great. Thank you.

3 MR. MOORE: Good afternoon. My name is 

4 Montre, M-O-N-T-R-E, last name Moore, M-O-O-R-E.

5 Good afternoon. My name is Montre 

6 Moore, and I am a resident of Milwaukee, 

7 Wisconsin. I come before you today, not as an 

8 environmental expert, nor as a doctor, nor as a 

9 lawyer, but I stand before you today as what I 

10 feel is the greatest position that God has given 

11 me, and that is of a father.

12 This is my daughter Malea. Two years 

13 ago my outlook on the world changed dramatically. 

14 As many first-time parents, I had no clue as to 

15 how to take care of a newborn child, let alone 

16 step into the role of parenting.

17 But I wanted nothing more than the love 

18 of my life, to have all that she could possibly 

19 aspire for. I wanted nothing but the best for 

20 her, the best bottles, the best car seats, even 

21 the best educational toys. No expense would be 

22 spared to bring these things to pass no matter 
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1 how hard I had to work.

2 As time went on, I seemed to settle into 

3 my new role fairly well, however, I did notice 

4 that I had a greater sensitivity to things that I 

5 had never paid attention to before. I found 

6 myself holding onto empty water bottles, looking 

7 for recycling bins. I even made an effort to 

8 purchase those ridiculous looking grocery bags 

9 what you can reuse.

10 I said to myself I have to do my part to 

11 save this planet for my little girl. So today I 

12 stand before you, not just asking for myself, but 

13 also for the millions of parents around this 

14 country that more than likely don't even know 

15 this hearing is currently taking place.

16 I ask you today to do your part to save 

17 this planet for our children.

18 Environmental regulation and awareness 

19 is not something that is commonly spoken about in 

20 my community, yet approximately 71 percent of 

21 African-Americans live in areas in violation of 

22 air pollution standards. Pollution from power 
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1 plants is an issue of racial disparity as people 

2 with color are most likely to experience the 

3 toxins coming from these plants, and the impact 

4 is obvious on the health outcomes.

5 Approximately 68 percent of 

6 African-Americans live within 30 miles of 

7 coal-fired power plants, which is a zone that is 

8 the highest risk of impact of exposure to these 

9 toxic pollutions.

10 The report on power plants found that 

11 emissions from all power plants in the U.S., both 

12 coal-fueled and also others, are responsible for 

13 30,000 premature deaths, 7,000 asthmatic effects 

14 attacks on African-Americans have been shown.

15 African-Americans are at 36 percent 

16 higher rate than that of white America as it 

17 relates to these type of illnesses. 

18 African-Americans are hospitalized twice as much 

19 as relates to asthma and other diseases as it 

20 relates to carbon dioxide.

21 In addition to the pollution, in 

22 addition to polluting the air we breathe, and the 
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1 water in which we catch our fish, carbon dioxide 

2 is the number one driver of climate control.

3 Coal-fired power plants are the number 

4 one contributor of carbon dioxide in our 

5 atmosphere.

6 So, today, I stand before you and I 

7 speak on behalf of my sister Sonya, who spent a 

8 warm afternoon in Chicago shopping with a dear 

9 friend of hers. She thought to herself this 

10 would be a great opportunity to take in a film 

11 and end our day.

12 Unfortunately, her BFF, as she called 

13 her, suffered a severe asthma attack during the 

14 film and was pronounced dead just a few hours 

15 later.

16 Today, I speak on behalf of my niece 

17 Lenora, who suffers from severe asthma. She has 

18 missed 39 days of school this year alone. 

19 Unfortunately, there will be no summer break for 

20 her this year. She simply has too much work to 

21 make up.

22 Passing the carbon pollution standards 
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1 will enrich the communities worldwide, that they 

2 don't face continued efforts, continued problems 

3 and threats from pollution that degrade our 

4 health today, also while reeking havoc on the 

5 environment that we all depend on, thereby 

6 resulting in widespread devastation and sea level 

7 rising, and also extreme weather events, as well.

8 It is time that we put people before 

9 profit and no longer profit before people.

10 We have to begin to put in, we have to 

11 begin to implement a succession plan for our 

12 planet. We now have the resources to do better, 

13 we can do better, and there is no reason that we 

14 should not do better.

15 We have the opportunity to set the 

16 standard for the world, all while strengthening 

17 our economy and creating millions of clean energy 

18 jobs. Our children are depending on us to get 

19 this right. Our children are depending on us to 

20 get this right.

21 I thank you and may God bless you.

22 MR. CULLIGAN: Thank you.
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1 Mary.

2 MS. LOVE: Okay. My name is Mary Love, 

3 M-A-R-Y, L-O-V-E. My name is Mary Love, and I am 

4 a resident of Henrico County in the State of 

5 Virginia.

6 Good afternoon to everyone. I stand 

7 before you today praying silently that you will 

8 listen with an open mind about a young mom who 

9 will give birth in two weeks, hoping her baby 

10 will be born healthy.

11 I stand for the grandmother who lives 

12 three miles from a power plant that gives off 

13 industrial pollution, who has breathed polluted 

14 air most of her life.

15 I stand to be a voice for their little 

16 boy or their girl who has been in the emergency 

17 room four times within six months for asthma, 

18 missing school two to three days each time.

19 I can't forget about that dad who has 

20 not missed a day from work in 10 years, trying to 

21 be the head of the household, but can't, because 

22 bad news has come his way, he has cancer.
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1 Carbon pollution increases smog and 

2 other nasty wastes continue to be dumped into our 

3 rivers, lakes, creeks, bays, and oceans. Oh, 

4 that we could turn back the hand of time to a 

5 period where these ugly pollutants first began 

6 infesting our environment.

7 Sadly, we can't travel back in time, 

8 however we can stand up right now and change 

9 these harmful practices in their tracks.

10 I stand for that young mom who will bear 

11 her baby that live only two days due to breathing 

12 and polluted air, and whose father who can't 

13 provide no more. My friend's grandmother who 

14 likes to check on her neighbors in her community 

15 can't walk two blocks because of lung disease.

16 I stand for my coworker's twin boys, 

17 Jason and Justin, who live in a community that is 

18 filled with smog, who would like to have the 

19 chance to go to college after high school.

20 Doctors, scientists, and experts says 

21 that carbon pollution is dangerous for children 

22 and seniors because climate changes raises 
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1 temperatures, is likely to make small pollution 

2 worse, which would trigger asthma attacks and 

3 permanently damage and reduce the function of her 

4 children's lungs.

5 I ask you to pick up a pen to write a 

6 contract of demand to these industrial power 

7 plants to begin to bring an end to polluted 

8 environment. Let's clear up America around all 

9 neighborhoods to be a cleaner, better place to 

10 live.

11 Power plants give off carbon pollution, 

12 threaten our health each day, therefore, we are 

13 dying in record notice due to air, waste, and 

14 carbon pollution. We stand here today to ask you 

15 to put yourself in the place of people living 

16 dangerously close to these power plants.

17 What would you do if your mother, who 

18 hadn't smoked a day in her life, and had nearly 

19 perfect health, suddenly developed lung cancer 

20 and died?

21 What would you do if your two children 

22 began having sudden asthma attacks due to 
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1 polluted levels in the air?

2 What would you do if your job your 

3 husband had, had since high school, was at the 

4 coal power plant, and as a result, his health has 

5 consistently declined?

6 Think about it and make the right 

7 decision.

8 I plead and I urge the Environmental 

9 Protection Agency to clean up carbon pollution 

10 from new or existing power plants, because it 

11 will protect America's health, young and old.

12 Clean up industrial carbon pollution, 

13 which global warming will stop innovation and 

14 clean technology, and create American jobs to 

15 manufacture, install, and operate these 

16 technologies, modernizing the nation with new 

17 power plants to make them more efficient and 

18 cleaner.

19 It would create new generation and green 

20 jobs. We cleaned up air pollution in the past, we 

21 can do it again. I stand for America everywhere.

22 Thank you.
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1 MR. CULLIGAN: Thank you both very much, 

2 and I thank you also for the amount of time you 

3 guys took to get here. We really appreciate 

4 that.

5 Our next two speakers are Briana Lou and 

6 Sylvia Wood.

7 MS. WOOD: My name is Sylvia Wood.

8 Do we have Briana anywhere, Briana Lou?

9 [No response.]

10 MR. CULLIGAN: We will let you get 

11 started and after you are done, we will give 

12 Briana another shot.

13 MS. WOOD: Thank you. Good afternoon. 

14 My name is Sylvia Carpenter Wood. I am a 

15 resident of the City of Richmond, Virginia. I 

16 come today to address the issue of carbon 

17 pollution that contributes to many changes in our 

18 climate, as well as a threat that it has on the 

19 health and safety of Americans.

20 As an African-American, I stand to speak 

21 for those in my neighborhood and my community, 

22 the voices who are voiceless, and they that are 
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1 affected by the pollutants that circulate 

2 throughout the air.

3 I come today, not to totally focus on 

4 giving dates or records on the pre-industrial 

5 era, or even the greenhouse gases that tend to 

6 warm the atmosphere, but I stand today to 

7 acknowledge my concern as an individual who deals 

8 with effects of many pollutants 365 days a year.

9 When I wake up in the morning, one of 

10 the things I have to do is turn on the weather 

11 channel of my favorite TV Station WTVI, CBS 6 to 

12 get the local weather and the news. This helps 

13 me to prepare for my day and what I will expect 

14 when I venture outdoors.

15 My sensitivity to certain pollutants 

16 circulating in the air plays a vital role in my 

17 activities that fill the day.

18 I have to decide whether I want to take 

19 a morning walk or a stroll, what medications I 

20 have to take or inhale, or just decide whether I 

21 simply want to venture out to go to work and 

22 venture back out to return to home. That sounds 
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1 like an exciting and a fun-filled day.

2 It can also play a part in limiting my 

3 community and civil rights activism when I travel 

4 throughout the United States speaking on various 

5 issues.

6 Today, I stand on behalf of my great 

7 nephew Breyon Wood, a 6-year-old, who attends 

8 Westover Hills Elementary in Richmond, Virginia. 

9 He has to limit his outdoors playing because one 

10 day at school, he became sick and doctors 

11 diagnosed him to having asthma.

12 Now, playing outdoors for a long period 

13 of time and the outdoor conditions can cause 

14 major medical problems. The whites of his eyes 

15 for a long period of time, they can become 

16 yellow.

17 A coughing spell can lead to him 

18 vomiting and a trip to the hospital emergency 

19 room, and all the doctors' office, and yet that 

20 not only affects him, but his mom has to lose 

21 time from her job. This leads to her receiving a 

22 low paycheck, because her job has limits on the 
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1 amount of sick or personal leave time that she 

2 can use during the calendar year.

3 How can you tell a young child that has 

4 been busy playing baseball, football, basketball, 

5 that he loves to play, he now comes along with 

6 medical guidelines.

7 Breyon now has to carry around, and 

8 utilize, an inhaler, not an easy task for a 

9 playful young child.

10 I stand on behalf of my mother-in-law, 

11 who lives near a factory in Richmond, Virginia. 

12 The pollutant from that factory caused her a lot 

13 of pain and suffering with her breathing. She 

14 finally decided to pack up the family and move to 

15 another area in the City of Richmond, which 

16 didn't affect her as much.

17 I come before the EPA to ask that you 

18 strongly look into changing the carbon pollution 

19 standards, and reading there is news articles 

20 that existing power plants looked upon as having 

21 great responsibilities for adding to the tons of 

22 carbon and other toxic pollutants in the air.
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1 This could lead to thousands of pounds 

2 of toxins for each man, woman, or child in the 

3 country. Now is the time to change, if not now, 

4 when? Time is of essence. Please look into your 

5 hearts by focusing on the safety of many 

6 generations of Americans that are here and the 

7 generations to come.

8 Thank you and God bless you.

9 MR. CULLIGAN: Thank you very much.

10 Briana Lou, has Briana Lou joined us? 

11 No, okay.

12 We will move on to Michael Williams and 

13 Matt Sinclair.

14 MR. SINCLAIR: Hello. My name is Matt 

15 Sinclair and I am a proud member of the 

16 Communications Workers of America, Local 2201, in 

17 Richmond Virginia.

18 I work for a large telecommunications 

19 company and I am here to testify in support of 

20 the proposed standards limiting carbon emissions 

21 for new power plants.

22 Union workers like myself are often on 
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1 the front lines when it comes to pollution and 

2 hazardous chemicals, and every day we see how 

3 safeguards and regulations make our workplaces 

4 safer and cleaner.

5 While some try to say that there has to 

6 be a choice between having a clean environment or 

7 jobs, this is simply not the case. We have 

8 repeatedly seen how Americans can turn 

9 environmental challenges into new economic 

10 opportunities, and the proposed carbon emission 

11 standards for new power plants once again gives 

12 us this chance.

13 The standard will require new power 

14 plants to emit fewer greenhouse gases or carbon 

15 pollution into the air when they operate. This 

16 means new plants will be built cleaner and more 

17 energy efficient than current plants.

18 Building new power plants that are 

19 cleaner and more energy efficient will drive 

20 innovation and clean technologies, spur 

21 development and production of clean technologies 

22 in the United States, creating jobs and economic 
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1 growth, and reduce greenhouse gas emissions, 

2 which will address the worse impacts of climate 

3 change.

4 These regulations will also protect the 

5 health of our families and make sure that we have 

6 a healthier environment, all while creating jobs 

7 and making America more competitive in the global 

8 economy.

9 In fact, it is likely that we will see 

10 an improvement in job performance and 

11 productivity of American workers and long-term

12 environmental growth with these standards.

13 The need for these standards is becoming 

14 even greater as international competitors and 

15 other governments take action to increase the use 

16 of clean energy sources and reduce greenhouse gas 

17 emissions.

18 In today's economy, America isn't an 

19 island, and we must continue to move forward and 

20 remain competitive internationally. America has 

21 made strides over the past few years to get back 

22 to where we should be economically following the 
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1 recession.

2 EPA actions like this, coupled with 

3 specific job policies, will make the U.S. economy 

4 more competitive, put millions back to work, 

5 strengthen existing industries, and building the 

6 industries of the future.

7 I am proud to be a union member and an 

8 essential part of what that means is that I know 

9 I have a moral responsibility to defend the 

10 long-term interests of the working people.

11 We want to know we cannot have only good 

12 jobs, but a planet that will be safe and healthy 

13 for future generations of workers. My fellow 

14 union members and I do not accept the false idea 

15 that we must choose between jobs and a healthy 

16 environment.

17 I know that in truth, we will have both 

18 or we will have neither.

19 Thank you for your time.

20 MR. CULLIGAN: Thank you.

21 MR. WILLIAMS: Good afternoon. My name 

22 is Mike Williams. I work for the BlueGreen 
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1 Alliance as a senior policy and legislative 

2 advocate, and I have the privilege today to help 

3 manage their climate and energy work.

4 I am here today to convey the BlueGreen 

5 Alliance's support for the proposed carbon 

6 pollution standard and to express our strong 

7 desire for a comprehensive solution to addressing 

8 climate change.

9 BlueGreen Alliance is a national 

10 partnership of labor unions and environmental 

11 organizations, founded in 2006 by the United 

12 Steelworkers and the Sierra Club, and has since 

13 expanded to now include four of the largest 

14 environmental organizations and eight diverse and 

15 prominent labor unions.

16 All told, the membership of BGA's 

17 partners represents the interests of over 14 

18 million people across North America. One of the 

19 main principles BGA was founded on was the dire 

20 need to address climate change, that through 

21 addressing climate change, America can build a 

22 lasting, sustainable economy that provides high 
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1 quality employment and helps rebuild the middle 

2 class.

3 As the dean of the House, Congressman 

4 John Dingell recently said, "We can't afford to 

5 have an economy in which some jobs work for the 

6 future; we need an economy in which they all do."

7 It is this basic principle that workers 

8 throughout every industry play a vital role in 

9 the 21st century climate conscious economy. We 

10 will achieve this only by reimagining, 

11 refocusing, and rebuilding our current economy.

12 Labor and environmental partners of our 

13 alliance strongly advocated for a comprehensive 

14 approach to America's energy and climate policy, 

15 matching mandated reductions in greenhouse 

16 emissions with investment portfolio meant to spur 

17 innovation across the many sectors of the 21st 

18 century clean economy, and enhanced 

19 competitiveness within the traditional sectors.

20 Regretfully, we failed to implement this 

21 approach, not just Congress, we all failed, but 

22 we must not use this as an excuse to turn our 
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1 backs from what we currently can and must be 

2 done, nor can we use this as an excuse to turn 

3 our backs on fiercely advocating for a 

4 comprehensive solution.

5 The carbon pollution standard fits well 

6 within the realm of what must be done. This 

7 proposed rule comes out of a long process that 

8 includes a mandate from the Supreme Court and an 

9 endangerment finding from the scientists at the 

10 EPA.

11 The standard will apply only to future 

12 power plants, limiting emissions of greenhouse 

13 gases to a standard on natural gas combined cycle 

14 generation or a coal-fired plant equipped with 

15 carbon capture and storage. Technology is 

16 absolutely vital for the future of American 

17 industry, across industries.

18 It will apply only to large power plants 

19 and allows for projects that will begin 

20 construction within one year to forego 

21 compliance.

22 This is a reasonable first step towards 
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1 addressing climate change. The standard does not 

2 affect existing power generation, but it will 

3 ensure that long-term investments in energy 

4 infrastructure reflect the reality of climate 

5 change, driving investment in clean energy, which 

6 we believe will make America more competitive, 

7 more energy dependent, and create many good jobs.

8 Again, this is a reasonable and 

9 necessary first step, but there is much, much 

10 more that needs to be done. BlueGreen Alliance 

11 believes that in the absence of comprehensive 

12 climate and clean energy policy, Congress should 

13 enact the following policies to complement the 

14 carbon pollution standard and ensure that our 

15 country fully realizes the job retention and job 

16 creating benefits of the clean energy economy.

17 First, create clear market signals for 

18 clean energy deployment; second, address global 

19 competitiveness; third, invest in cleaner, more 

20 advanced power generation; fourth, provide a 

21 proper transition for workers and communities; 

22 fifth, guarantee access to capital markets for 
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1 energy-intensive industries; and, sixth, rebuild 

2 American manufacturing and infrastructure.

3 Pollution is, quite simply, a form of 

4 waste and a sign of inefficiency. Over and over 

5 again, the environmental safeguards of the last 

6 40 years have resulted in waste reduction, energy 

7 efficiency, and greater economic competitiveness, 

8 creating thousands of new jobs and making 

9 existing jobs more secure.

10 In a global economy where international 

11 competitors are leading in the development of 

12 clean energy technologies and deployment, 

13 retreating from this basic understanding is 

14 tantamount to surrendering our economic future.

15 Air pollution of all sorts also puts a 

16 tremendous drag on our economic recovery from 

17 increased health care expenses to the cost of 

18 adapting to changed weather patterns.

19 Thus, although BlueGreen Alliance 

20 believes that Congress ultimately should pass 

21 comprehensive climate and clean energy 

22 legislation, the dangers presented by climate 
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1 change and the potential for jobs lost as a 

2 result of inaction, leaving us further behind in

3 the global clean energy market, are too great to 

4 delay any further the process of cutting U.S. 

5 carbon pollution under existing law.

6 Finally, all too often people are 

7 offered a false choice between having good jobs 

8 or a clean environment. The truth is we don't 

9 have to choose between good jobs and the clean 

10 environment. We can and we must have both.

11 Thank you.

12 MR. CULLIGAN: Thank you.

13 So, Judith Charles and Joseph Mendelson.

14 MS. CHARLES: My name is Judith Charles. 

15 I am here as a citizen and also as a volunteer 

16 with the Sierra Club and the Beyond Coal 

17 Campaign.

18 I wanted to commend the EPA in proposing 

19 a carbon pollution standard for new power plants 

20 and enforcing the Clean Air Act.

21 We have heard a great from industries 

22 about costs to clean up the environment, the 
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1 costs are too high, the essential benefits to 

2 society do not justify the investment, or the 

3 standards will cost jobs.

4 I don't think that this is true. The 

5 costs of leaving carbon emissions unchecked will 

6 be more costly to society in terms of public 

7 health and environmental damage.

8 Not only are there severe threats to 

9 human health, but there will be significant costs 

10 to agriculture, natural resources management, and 

11 conservation practices.

12 I am encouraged that the EPA has 

13 proposed the carbon emission standard. As the 

14 country with the second highest level of carbon 

15 emissions in the world, it is time that we act 

16 responsibly and take steps to regulate carbon 

17 emissions.

18 We need to join the positive actions 

19 taken by some of our States, Australia and the 

20 European Union, in tackling these emissions.

21 Thank you.

22 MR. MENDELSON: Hi. My name is Joe 
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1 Mendelson. I am director of Policy for National 

2 Wildlife Federation's Climate and Energy program. 

3 NWF is the nation's largest conservation, 

4 education, and advocacy organization with more 

5 than 4 million members across the country.

6 We have affiliate organizations in 48 

7 States and territories, and our mission is to 

8 inspire Americans to protect wildlife for our 

9 children's future.

10 As you will hear from the inspired NWF 

11 speakers representing 12 States that follow my 

12 testimony, support for EPA's proposed carbon 

13 pollution standards for new electric power plants 

14 as a means to protect our public health and 

15 wildlife for future generations is widespread and 

16 found throughout the country.

17 There has never been a more urgent time 

18 to stop carbon pollution as it is fueling climate 

19 change and ocean acidification. Each year, our 

20 nation's power plants pump nearly 2.3 billion 

21 tons of carbon pollution into the atmosphere. 

22 Global carbon pollution is increasing in record 
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1 amounts, jumping by 6 percent over the last year.

2 If this pollution path is not altered, 

3 global temperatures will increase by at least 7 

4 degrees Fahrenheit, potentially 11 degrees 

5 Fahrenheit by 2100.

6 This current path also leaves wildlife 

7 in local communities on the front lines, 

8 experiencing the increasingly virulent impacts of 

9 climate change on a daily basis.

10 At 4 degrees C, that is the 7-plus 

11 Fahrenheit temperature increase, scientists 

12 predict massive extinctions across the globe. In 

13 the last year, the U.S. has seen wildfires harm 

14 the monarch butterfly migration and push the 

15 Houston toad to the brink of extinction.

16 Record drought has threatened endangered 

17 whooping cranes, and extreme floods have blown 

18 out fish populations in numerous rivers and 

19 streams.

20 Our 2011 report game changers, air 

21 pollution, a warming climate, and the troubled 

22 future for America's hunting and fishing 
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1 heritage, details how toxic air pollution and 

2 carbon pollution from power plants represents a 

3 double whammy, exacerbating the disappearance of 

4 our nation's beloved fish and game species.

5 In our recent report on thin ice forming 

6 winters puts America's hunting and fishing 

7 heritage at risk, provides real world 

8 experiences, some of which you will soon hear, 

9 with how the decades long trend in shorter, 

10 warmer and less snowy winters is having major 

11 impacts on all forms of outdoor recreation.

12 At the same time, communities across the 

13 country face a record number of climate change 

14 extreme weather events that are taking toll on 

15 our families and our personal property.

16 In 2011, the U.S. experienced over $35 

17 billion worth of extreme weather losses. That is 

18 insured weather losses, not the uninsured losses, 

19 which we know probably hurt even more.

20 This property damage has left families 

21 homeless, destroyed critical infrastructure, and 

22 placed an immediate human cost upon accelerating 
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1 climate change. Without a national policy that 

2 begins to tackle carbon pollution, these problems 

3 will accelerate the speed and force, and may 

4 become unstoppable.

5 It is for these very reasons that NWS 

6 affiliates passed a resolution in 2009 resolving 

7 that all new coal-fired power plants being built 

8 should be required to control their carbon 

9 pollution.

10 Happily, EPA's proposed rule just does 

11 that. It sets a standard regardless of fuel type 

12 that says we can no longer indiscriminantly pump 

13 carbon pollution into our skies, and ensures that 

14 as we modernize our power sector, we do not 

15 saddle the future generations with more high

16 carbon polluting infrastructure that lasts for a 

17 decade to come.

18 Importantly, EPA cannot stop there. 

19 Since 1999, I have engaged in personal efforts to 

20 utilize the Clean Air Act to limit carbon 

21 pollution. One legal petition, numerous court 

22 rulings including two Supreme Court rulings now, 
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1 and three presidents later, we are only now 

2 tackling the first piece of the nation's largest 

3 sector of carbon pollution.

4 It has been 12 years since my own 

5 efforts began. I have literally watched my two 

6 daughters grow up, and close to 40 billion tons 

7 of uncontrolled power plant carbon pollution be 

8 emitted during this time.

9 We cannot delay additional efforts any 

10 longer, and standards to control the carbon 

11 pollution from existing power plants must follow 

12 in short order. There is not only a legal 

13 obligation to do so, but there is a moral duty to 

14 act. We cannot leave future generations 

15 wondering why we waited to take the next step.

16 Thank you.

17 MR. CULLIGAN: What are the 12 States 

18 that we will be hearing from?

19 MR. MENDELSON: Do I have it? Let me 

20 check if I have it. They will introduce their 

21 States when I think they testify.

22 MR. CULLIGAN: Our next two speakers are 
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1 Mark Jester and Lhi Young.

2 MR. JESTER: Good afternoon.

3 MR. CULLIGAN: I just want to remind 

4 folks that, if you could, spell your names for 

5 the court reporter. It is very helpful.

6 MR. JESTER: Certainly. My name is Mark 

7 Jester. It is Mark with a "k," last name is 

8 Jester, just like the court, J-E-S-T-E-R.

9 I am president of the Berkshire County 

10 League of Sportsmen located in Pittsfield, 

11 Massachusetts. The Berkshire County League of 

12 Sportsmen is an umbrella organization 

13 representing 20 regional clubs and just over 

14 3,200 sportsmen and conservationists, all of whom 

15 have a vested interest in preserving our proud 

16 outdoor heritage and protecting Massachusetts' 

17 rich natural resources.

18 The delegates of the League represent 

19 some of the most dedicated sportsmen and 

20 sportswomen in the country. People are willing 

21 to give their time, effort, resources to ensure 

22 that the fellow sportsmen and future generations 
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1 will be able to enjoy the pursuits that we have 

2 all had the opportunity to enjoy.

3 The Berkshire County League is 

4 considered one of the strongest and most 

5 effective and united organizations of the State 

6 of Massachusetts.

7 I am here today to talk to you as their 

8 representative about EPA's proposed Clean Air Act 

9 and the effects of carbon pollution on the 

10 Massachusetts habitat and wildlife.

11 I have been hunting and fishing in 

12 Massachusetts for over 45 years. Both my father 

13 and my grandfather introduced me and my brothers 

14 and sisters to the outdoors as kids. My 

15 grandparents lived next-door to Lanesboro Town 

16 Brook when I was growing up, one of Berkshire 

17 County's best kept fishing spots up until this 

18 moment.

19 Each spring, on opening day of fishing 

20 season, every kid that lived in Lanesboro would 

21 be lined up elbow to elbow trying to catch the 

22 biggest brook trout and rainbow trout that they 
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1 could see from the narrow banks leading along to 

2 opening day, each kid dreaming about catching the 

3 biggest fish in the stream, so they could proudly 

4 show it to their mom and dad afterwards.

5 Today, there is a mercury poisoning 

6 warning on that body of water and any fish that 

7 is caught should be released back into that 

8 polluted water.

9 In Massachusetts, there are 125 bodies 

10 of water that have mercury warnings on them. The 

11 fish that are caught in these lakes and ponds 

12 cannot be eaten, and effectively, all have become 

13 unofficial catch and release areas.

14 In these financially troubled times, 

15 many sportsmen are forced to provide their 

16 families dinner from these polluted waters. As a 

17 leader in the State's community of sporting, I am 

18 often called upon by young parents asking about 

19 the waters in western Massachusetts, are the fish 

20 that the kids catch, are they safe to eat. More 

21 times than not I have to say no.

22 My first hunting experience was going 
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1 after rabbits with my grandfather and his 

2 tri-colored beagle named Topper. It was one of 

3 the most favorite memories of all time, hearing 

4 Old Top, as my grandfather called him, bay as he 

5 chased the rabbits around and around the hedge 

6 rows of my uncle's farm.

7 These experiences I have now passed on 

8 over the years to my children, fishing in the 

9 town brook, rabbit hunting with my own beagles, 

10 and now hopefully, I will be able to do the same 

11 with my four grandchildren, who are still too 

12 young to take out into the woods and the waters.

13 But I have to say that I am doubtful 

14 that I will be able to do so if things don't 

15 change, and don't change soon. Sportsmen are on 

16 the front lines of conservation every day, and 

17 have been for well over 200 years.

18 We are in the woods and the waters every 

19 single day of the year. We are the watchdogs and 

20 whistleblowers when it comes to protecting the 

21 environment. I am here today to tell you there 

22 are some problems, big problems for our 
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1 ecosystem, and the effects on the wildlife are 

2 severe.

3 I have a few examples. There are two 

4 species of cottontails in Massachusetts, the 

5 Eastern Cottontail and the New England 

6 Cottontail. In June of 2004, U.S. Fish & 

7 Wildlife found that there was substantial need 

8 for protection of the New England Cottontail 

9 under the U.S. Endangered Species Act, they had 

10 initiated a review.

11 In 2006, U.S. Fish & Wildlife determined 

12 that the Federal listing was warranted, but 

13 passed them over due to other priorities for 

14 other species. However, the New England 

15 Cottontail was given the highest priority in the 

16 Northeast, and is in decline due to loss of 

17 favorable habitat, habitat is being destroyed by 

18 a warming climate.

19 We all know about the comeback of the 

20 striped bass, and that is in jeopardy. The 

21 striped bass is considered by sportsmen 

22 throughout as a highly -- won a trophy in its 
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1 regulated seasons and strict limits. Striped 

2 bass fishing is one of the largest growing 

3 specters in the sportsmen's ranks. As a 

4 fisherman, one of my favorite pastimes is fishing 

5 for stripers out in the Cape.

6 They are one of the few big game fish 

7 that require a vastly different habitat. A 

8 warming climate leads to rising sea levels that 

9 destroy marshes, that serve as nurseries for 

10 these juvenile bass.

11 Warmer waters have a cascade of ill 

12 effects on the fish. Stripers absorb toxic 

13 chemicals more quickly when water is at a higher 

14 temperature. Science has shown that the striped 

15 bass with higher loads of dioxins have a lower 

16 reproduction rate.

17 The final example is waterfowl hunting, 

18 and is as much of a tradition as it gets for 

19 sportsmen. You have a dog, a shotgun, and a fast 

20 moving quarry. The black duck is a Holy Grail 

21 for the duck hunters, they are big, they are 

22 fast, and they are brawny.
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1 It has been identified as a susceptible 

2 species due to loss of breeding habitat, 

3 associated with ever increasing climate. Highest 

4 breeding densities are found in the Northeast. 

5 Black ducks utilize a variety of habitat 

6 breeding, such as alkaline marshes, acid bogs, 

7 lakes, and streams, along with fresh brackish and 

8 saltwater marshes. Rising sea levels from 

9 warming climates pose disaster for this fragile 

10 species.

11 In 2006, 500,000 anglers and 70,000 

12 hunters came to Massachusetts to hunt and fish in 

13 the lands and waters. Fishing and hunting are not 

14 just recreational pasttimes, they are also a 

15 major contributor to the Massachusetts economy.

16 Over half a million sportsmen and women 

17 generated more than $800 million in revenue in 

18 that year alone, however, this rich community of 

19 fish and game and the ecosystem that it depends 

20 on is at risk with the warming world.

21 For Massachusetts sportsmen, healthy 

22 populations of wildlife are necessary to support 
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1 our economy and our outdoor heritage. EPA must 

2 be allowed --

3 MR. CULLIGAN: I ask you to wrap up.

4 MR. JESTER: One second. Thank you.

5 EPA just be allowed to carry out its 

6 legal obligation to control carbon pollution that 

7 causes climate change for our country's biggest 

8 polluters.

9 I will leave you with this quote from 

10 the former Republican Massachusetts Congressman 

11 Sylvio Conte, that was delivered to a delegate 

12 back in 1984. "The problem with preservation 

13 boils down to this - ducks can't vote, trees 

14 can't vote, neither can salmon, flowers, 

15 mountains and rivers. It is incumbent upon us as 

16 sportsmen to take on this weighty responsibility. 

17 To serve this is our greatest constituency."

18 Thank you.

19 MR. CULLIGAN: Thank you.

20 DR. YOUNG: Hi. My name is Lih Young. 

21 I am a Ph.D. in economics by training. I have 

22 run for public office since '94 from local to 
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1 Federal, and I am here to testify for the 

2 following purpose.

3 First, to join the Sierra Club, EDF, 

4 including Air Force, and other environmental 

5 groups to support EPA plans to clean air, reduce 

6 the pollution emissions, and in global warming, 

7 industry improve the government function, protect 

8 the people, families, and the communities from 

9 harmful damages, and to reduce the health care 

10 cost.

11 American people count on EPA to protect 

12 them, don't depend on polluters to police 

13 themselves, and don't buy the polluters' claim 

14 that EPA safeguard would hurt jobs.

15 Second, to urge the elimination of any 

16 unfairness and irresponsibility, the impact on 

17 unfair elections, unfair market mechanism, and 

18 unjust inference of corporations, entities, or 

19 network which cause serious social, political 

20 media budget problems and then cost our society 

21 tremendously, briefly speaking.

22 One, to oppose corruption, unjust, 
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1 unlawful practices and the policies.

2 Two, to end all unfair, unjust, 

3 unlawful, or misleading legislation, 

4 appropriation subsidies, or use of land and 

5 resources.

6 Three, to stop abuse, waste, 

7 destruction, victimization from local to global.

8 Fourth, to prosecute, eliminate murder, 

9 fraud, crime, unjust networks, which cause 

10 serious social and political problems.

11 Five, to promote fairness, health, 

12 productivity, social life, and the well-being of 

13 general public.

14 Six, to protect people, families, and 

15 communities.

16 Seven, to improve government function, 

17 considering social cost-benefits.

18 Eight, to resolve social issues, 

19 including various social, political media 

20 legislation, budget election system. You put the 

21 hyphen among those words especially those I have 

22 identified, and my family have experience.
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1 I would like you to see my candidate 

2 statement on social issues, local to Federal to 

3 global, and complaints at administrative and 

4 judicial levels.

5 As I mentioned, I have run for public 

6 office on local to Federal since '94, to 

7 prosecute, eliminate murder, for all crime, 

8 unjust network, which is a robbery machine, 

9 robber-ism, instead of capital-ism, which are 

10 rampant in private, public sectors, branches of 

11 various agencies, administrative and judicial 

12 levels, including legal, judicial, core 

13 personnel, law enforcement, child services 

14 occupation, contractors, facilities, et cetera, 

15 which are continuing, ongoing, relaying, 

16 infiltrating every segment of our lives including 

17 nonprofit organizations, a standing local problem 

18 with threat, coercion, falsification, misleading, 

19 destruction, tempering the strain, concealing 

20 evidence, document, witness end of abuse of 

21 power, law, authorities, unlawful, immoral acts, 

22 abuse and misconduct, waste unjust scheme, scam, 
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1 manipulation, monitoring inferences, deprivation 

2 of people's lives, rights, resources, property, 

3 homes, cars, reputation, destruction of social 

4 activities including personal, political 

5 affiliation destroy individual families, 

6 communities, society, justice, peace.

7 Of course, the home is human rights 

8 network, social political election media, 

9 destroy essence of democracy, fair market 

10 mechanisms, and so-called capitalism, and that 

11 costs our society tremendously.

12 I will have attached several of my 

13 documents, and which a lot of evidence how 

14 serious the problems, not working right. So, 

15 this is an opportunity. I really hope the EPA 

16 can show you leadership and to improve our 

17 society, and government function.

18 As I mentioned, my evidence is including 

19 all those of foreclosure, and abuse of power of 

20 attorney and guardianship, eviction and 

21 detention, abuse of mental institutions, 

22 anti-conspiracy, they were sent to mental 
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1 institutions rather than improve the government 

2 function, and then prosecute official misconduct.

3 So, we have to make sure this EPA with 

4 Department of Justice, and then prosecute those 

5 with misconduct, criminal network, very serious, 

6 where to put the people, their life, their 

7 rights, and the property, their homes, and, of 

8 course, health and productivity is about all.

9 Thank you very much.

10 MR. CULLIGAN: Thank you.

11 Our next two speakers are Joy Bergey and 

12 Eric Orff.

13 MS. BERGEY: Good afternoon. My name is 

14 Joy Bergey. That is J-O-Y, B-E-R-G-E-Y. I speak 

15 in my role as executive director of the Center 

16 for the Celebration of Creation. The Center is

17 an inter-religious program affiliated with 

18 Chestnut Hill United Church in Philadelphia, 

19 Pennsylvania.

20 The Center works with congregants, 

21 congregations, and individuals to address 

22 problems of environmental injustice.
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1 The Center for the Celebration of 

2 Creation applauds President Obama and 

3 Administrator Jackson for proposing this strong, 

4 new rule. We urge that it be implemented quickly 

5 and not weakened in any way.

6 Every major faith tradition calls on its 

7 followers to protect those at the margins of 

8 society, those who cannot defend themselves, the 

9 young, the old, the sick, the poor, and it is 

10 exactly those persons who will be hurt first and 

11 worst by climate change, the climate change 

12 caused by industrial carbon pollution.

13 The major faith traditions also call on 

14 us to protect, even celebrate the natural world 

15 that God has given us. God's love is infinite, 

16 the earth's natural resources are not.

17 The ways that we generate power in this 

18 country are causing damage to God's world that 

19 may take decades or centuries to heal, 

20 threatening to deprive our children and their 

21 children of safe and healthy communities in which 

22 to live and grow.
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1 Pennsylvania is the third worst State in 

2 terms of global warming pollution with our 12 

3 million residents creating 1 percent of the 

4 world's heat trapping emissions. Our State 

5 creates more global warming pollution than 101 

6 countries combined.

7 With a long history of burning fossil 

8 fuels to generate our power, Pennsylvania already 

9 has abundant scars on our landscape, piles of 

10 coal waste, miles upon miles of dirty, dead 

11 waterways, and dirty air, and their unacceptable 

12 air quality is largely a result of power plant 

13 pollution.

14 The Clean Air Task Force found that more 

15 than 1,300 Pennsylvanians died prematurely just 

16 in 2010 because of this power plant pollution. 

17 Almost 2,300 Pennsylvanians had heart attacks 

18 brought on by the pollution. This State that I 

19 love so much offers its people the second worst 

20 mortality risk in the country attributable to 

21 power plant pollution.

22 Of course, all this industrial carbon 
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1 pollution is damaging our earth, heating the air, 

2 the land, the water, and destabilizing the 

3 climate.

4 Our children deserve clean air, so they 

5 can play outside without risking asthma attacks. 

6 Our elders deserve clean air, so they can live 

7 out their years in good health.

8 Our Snowshoe Hares in Pennsylvania, also 

9 part of God's creation, deserve a secure future. 

10 The National Wildlife Federation calls the 

11 Snowshoe Hares the "polar bears of Pennsylvania," 

12 because their already declining numbers are 

13 signaling the arrival of climate change.

14 Pennsylvania's beloved forests are 

15 threatened by global warming as warmer winters 

16 fail to kill off pest species and changing 

17 precipitation patterns stress our trees, the 

18 wildflowers, and the birds and other wildlife 

19 that depend on them.

20 At one time, we simply didn't understand 

21 the long-term consequences of our actions as we 

22 burned fossil fuels with abandon. We couldn't 
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1 have been faulted in the 1960s or '70s for 

2 building countless coal plants that belched 

3 enormous quantities of industrial carbon 

4 pollution.

5 But now we know better. We know this 

6 pollution is leading to global warming and we are 

7 understanding just how devastating it may be in 

8 the decades ahead. Morality compels us, 

9 therefore, to require a change moving forward.

10 This is why the faith community cares so 

11 deeply about this country's energy policies, such 

12 as the rule we are proposing today.

13 The Center for the Celebration of 

14 Creation, on whose behalf I speak today, is an 

15 interfaith organization.

16 I am personally a Christian, and I will 

17 quote Saint Paul, who tells us repeatedly in the 

18 New Testament that all things, all people belong 

19 to God. Our little babies in their mama's arms 

20 belong to God. Our Snowshoe Hares belong to God. 

21 The chronically disabled elders with respiratory 

22 disease due to air pollution belong to God.
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1 Our brook trout threatened by 

2 Pennsylvania's warming waters belong to God. 

3 This rule on which we comment today moves us to 

4 better protect the sacred and irreplaceable gift 

5 of creation, which comes from and belongs to God. 

6 We need this rule. Amen.

7 MR. CULLIGAN: Thank you.

8 MR. ORFF: Good afternoon. My name is 

9 Eric Orff E-R-I-C, O-R-F-F. I am from Epsom, New 

10 Hampshire. I am a certified wildlife biologist 

11 and currently work as a consultant to the 

12 National Wildlife Federation. I am also on the 

13 Fish and Game Commission. I serve on a voluntary 

14 board of 11 commissioners appointed by the 

15 Governor to oversee the Fish and Game Department 

16 in New Hampshire.

17 I have had a four decade long career as 

18 a wildlife biologist serving over 31 years as a 

19 wildlife biologist in the New Hampshire Fish and 

20 Game Department until my retirement in June of 

21 2007.

22 I was the State's first black bear 
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1 biologist beginning in 1978, never having seen a 

2 bear in the wild, and soon after came the fur 

3 bear biologist. In my lifetime of living 50 of 

4 my 62 years in New Hampshire, I have seen winter 

5 disappear.

6 When my family moved from Maine to New 

7 Hampshire in 1962, I soon discovered a local 

8 marsh called Little Cohas Marsh, created by the 

9 Fish and Game Department in the 1950s to bolster 

10 the duck population. I also discovered wood duck 

11 nesting boxes placed there by the Department to 

12 bolster the nesting ducks. By 1965, I joined the 

13 local Fish and Game Club and convinced them to 

14 fund a project to allow me to build another dozen 

15 boxes to add to the marsh.

16 I began to check them each winter. In 

17 fact, my parents had bought me snowshoes for 

18 Christmas in 1964, so I could travel to the marsh 

19 that I dearly loved in the deep snow. I 

20 regularly checked the boxes in the winter for the 

21 sign of ducks for years to come.

22 By the middle of the 1980s, I also 
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1 became the Regional Wildlife Biologist, and one 

2 of my assigned duties was to check the duck boxes 

3 at Little Cohas Marsh. I was actually paid to do 

4 what I wanted to do most as a teen, imagine that.

5 Here again the snow was deep, and 

6 through the 1980s I used a snow machine or 

7 snowshoes to hike the mile long marsh. By the 

8 mid-1990s, the snow was gone most winters, so we 

9 used a wheel ATV to get around the marshes.

10 By the 2000s, the ice was not safe for 

11 me to use a machine on the ice. In fact, the 

12 last winter that I worked, the winter of 2007, I 

13 was supposed to check the duck boxes, but there 

14 was no ice in January, there was no ice in 

15 February or March, there was no ice that winter 

16 to check the duck nesting boxes.

17 In three of the last five years, in 

18 fact, there has been little ice on Little Cohas 

19 Marsh. Winter has disappeared in Southern New 

20 Hampshire during my lifetime. The unusually warm 

21 winters have raised havoc also with our moose. 

22 These same two warm winters are killing off our 
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1 moose with spikes and moose winter ticks. The 

2 moose population has declined some 40 percent in 

3 the last six years from about 7,500 moose to now 

4 about 4,500 moose.

5 In the meantime, the Fish and Game 

6 Department and the Commission, which I am a 

7 member of, has had to cut the moose hunting 

8 permits by some 60 percent.

9 In my decade long observation of 

10 waterfowl populations, saw them migrating later 

11 as well. Consequently, duck hunters have 

12 demanded an adjustment of duck season and now our 

13 season runs until mid-January where it used to be 

14 only in December.

15 We have bears active all winter long, 

16 something not seen in the first two decades of my 

17 career. Imagine insomniac bears?

18 The lack of snow and ice this past 

19 winter devastated New Hampshire's outdoor 

20 businesses. Ice fishing equipment sales were off 

21 some 60 percent based on the shop owners I have 

22 known for decades.
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1 The local snow machine dealer in my 

2 town, they were off over 50 percent. Carbon 

3 pollution is impacting much of New Hampshire's 

4 fish and wildlife, and the businesses that depend 

5 on them.

6 I urge you to support and pass this 

7 regulation.

8 Thank you very much.

9 MR. CULLIGAN: Thank you and, as I said 

10 earlier, I really appreciate the distance that a 

11 lot of people have come to testify today.

12 MR. ORFF: Thank you.

13 MR. CULLIGAN: The next two speakers are 

14 Jim Hoover and Rocky Sundquist.

15 MR. HOOVER: I am Jimmy Hoover. I am a 

16 student at American University and also an intern 

17 at the Sierra Club, Maryland Chapter, based in 

18 College Park.

19 I hadn't originally planned to speak 

20 today, but I knew I would regret not taking the 

21 opportunity to express my support for the new 

22 proposed standard for the EPA on carbon with new 
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1 power plants.

2 I come to the hearing today I think as 

3 an ambassador of the younger generation in that 

4 while we have largely been sidestepped from this 

5 discussion of our nation's energy, I think that 

6 it is something that we need to participate in, 

7 because it concerns us so largely.

8 To elaborate on that, it is our 

9 generation and the ones that will come after us 

10 that will face the effects and the adverse risks 

11 that carbon pollution poses.

12 It is our generation and the ones that 

13 come after us that will miss out, because of the 

14 negative effects that climate change will pose 

15 to, for instance, you know, the beloved species 

16 of my Rock Creek Park and its temperate 

17 environment.

18 I think that, you know, with 40 percent 

19 of carbon pollution being attributed to the power 

20 plant industries in this country, then, there is 

21 no better time to act with this legislation, and 

22 because simply for the fact that there are 
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1 alternative solutions already out there, and I 

2 think they need to be harnessed and we need to 

3 move past this old and outdated and moreover 

4 harmful technologies and embrace the new.

5 In closing I would like to thank the 

6 Environmental Protection Agency for having our 

7 best interests in heart with this new proposed 

8 carbon standard, and propelling us into a clean 

9 and healthier future.

10 MR. CULLIGAN: Thank you.

11 MR. SUNDQUIST: My name is Rocky 

12 Sundquist. That's S-U-N-D-Q-U-I-S-T. I recently 

13 came down from New York to campaign against 

14 climate change as that it's an actually really 

15 urgent problem.

16 I mean the thing about climate change is 

17 it is often viewed as a really gradual process 

18 like there will be plenty of time to work on 

19 this, you know that we will have until 2100 

20 before things get out of hand. Even then, you 

21 know, what is a few degrees anyways.

22 I want to tell you a story that I read 
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1 recently in National Geographic. You know, this 

2 is legitimate, it is not something, it's not just 

3 hearsay, it is not just speculation. There are a 

4 number of myths surrounding global warming and 

5 climate change in general.

6 One of them is that it is a natural 

7 cycle, that this is a natural cycle. Well, you 

8 know, I have a few things to say about natural 

9 cycles.

10 The stories about the PETM, which is an 

11 acronym for the paleocene, eocene, thermal 

12 maximum, which happened 65 million years ago, and 

13 it was after a long warming trend, such as the 

14 one that we have been experiencing, and what 

15 happened was there was a sudden spike of 

16 temperature over a very brief period of time, 

17 there was like a 9 Fahrenheit jump, and it 

18 resulted in like half of the species going 

19 extinct, all the ice caps melted, just complete 

20 destruction, acidification of the seas, complete 

21 annihilation, and, you know, I mean it took 

22 hundreds of thousands of years for the carbon 
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1 levels to come back down to reasonable standard, 

2 the atmosphere is completely different, and, you 

3 know, we are on the brink of such a change, 

4 because it is not as if this is just, you know, 

5 going to, like we have all this time to do this.

6 You know, there are several -- the 

7 environment isn't really a delicate balance, and 

8 there are a number of things that keep carbon in 

9 check, the sequestering of carbon is done in 

10 soil, and in the oceans, and by plants, but those 

11 are complicated processes.

12 Another one of the myths is that the 

13 earth can withstand anything we throw at it, but 

14 the fact is that plants don't always 

15 photosynthesize.

16 Sometimes plants actually breathe like 

17 we do, they switch over to photorespiration 

18 during a drought, and they will produce carbon 

19 dioxide, and, you know, the ability of the sea, 

20 which is what absorbs most of the carbon dioxide 

21 out of the atmosphere, to sequester carbon, is 

22 dependent on the acidity of the sea, and as it 
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1 gets more acidic, it loses that ability, and, you 

2 know, agricultural methods are decreasing the 

3 amount of carbon absorbed by the soil, you know, 

4 because they are just not done very responsibly.

5 In closing, I would like to draw 

6 attention to the Beaufort and Chukchi Seas where 

7 Shell is threatening to drill this week, and I 

8 would just like to point out that, you know, the 

9 leading theory as to what exactly happened during 

10 the PETM is that there was a sudden massive spike 

11 of methane caused by the melting of permafrost, 

12 which inundated the atmosphere.

13 Currently, right now, in the Chukchi and 

14 East Siberian Seas, and also off the coast of --

15 what is that island in Norway -- well, there are 

16 a number of places where the methane deposits 

17 that have been frozen, the permafrost under the 

18 sea are melting, and it is happening right now, 

19 it is happening right now, and it is not like we 

20 have like a century to work on this.

21 It's we are in the next PETM at the 

22 moment.
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1 Thank you. Thank you for taking the 

2 stance, it is long overdue.

3 MR. CULLIGAN: Thank both of you for 

4 taking the time to testify today.

5 I just would like to follow up. For 

6 those of you who have joined us since we started 

7 at 1:00, if you have not signed up to speak, and 

8 want to, there are obviously still an opportunity 

9 to do so. so just see the people outside.

10 Our next two speakers are George Mode 

11 and Gary Botzek.

12 MR. MODE: Members of the panel, I hope 

13 you are having as much fun working on this 

14 terrific issue as I am.

15 My name is Richard Mode. I am from 

16 Morganton, North Carolina. I have spent 40 years 

17 as a wildlife conservationist working with 

18 sportsmen. I have had the opportunity to serve 

19 in three major nonprofits that advocate for 

20 wildlife conservation.

21 I had the opportunity to serve as 

22 volunteer leader and did from local chapter 
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1 president through national president and chairman 

2 of the board. I now serve as the senior member 

3 of the North Carolina Wildlife Federation Board. 

4 I serve as affiliate representative to National 

5 Wildlife Federation.

6 I have been blessed and pleased to 

7 receive all three organizations' most prestigious 

8 award. In 2007, I was presented with the 

9 Budweiser U.S. Fish & Wildlife Foundation, 

10 Budweiser Conservationist of the Year Award.

11 The only reason I review that is because 

12 I have had an opportunity to work with hundreds 

13 of thousands of sportsmen across America.

14 They, like me, are not couch potatoes, 

15 they get outside. The ones that are as old as I 

16 am and my friend here have had an opportunity to 

17 see many, many years of change. It is the very 

18 nature of sportsmen and sportswomen and wildlife 

19 conservation is to observe changes in the natural 

20 world.

21 When you spend your time for a period of 

22 years, it is easy to see the impacts climate 
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1 change on that natural world. It is the 

2 consensus of the sportsmen and wildlife 

3 communities that wildlife habitats are changing 

4 and changing quickly.

5 As a dedicated trout angler, I have 

6 observed trout streams warming, streams that are 

7 marginally cold enough to sustain trout, are 

8 warming to a point that they will not sustain 

9 trout in the future.

10 Cold water scientists predict that a 

11 very small temperature rise will reduce the range 

12 of Appalachian brook trout, which is North 

13 Carolina's only native salmonid, dramatically.

14 For almost 40 years, my family's joy has 

15 been to go down east to Lake Phelps, which is a 

16 percosin lake. I have pictures of my 40-year-old 

17 son, who is 230 pounds, when he was a little boy 

18 down there with fly rod in his hand. Basically, 

19 we go down there and wade fish for bass. We go 

20 the end of June because the water is warm enough 

21 to wade and warm enough for the kids to swim.

22 We have been moving that trip up or back 
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1 earlier in the year for the last few years. Last 

2 year we went a month early. The water was too 

3 hot to wade comfortably. The bass had to leave 

4 their nesting areas and their areas of cover and 

5 go out to deep water in order to survive. We had 

6 to come to the house.

7 As an avid duck hunter I have tracked 

8 duck migrations for 40 years. Basically, we hunt 

9 local ducks during the early part of the year 

10 during the early part of the season. They are 

11 wood ducks, and the wood ducks leaving for a 

12 while we had no ducks.

13 Then, a glorious thing typically 

14 happens. The big migratory birds come in from up 

15 north. Last year they didn't come. It was the 

16 season that wasn't.

17 The conservative estimates of sea level 

18 rise on the coast of Eastern North Carolina show 

19 that we are going to lose 1,500 square miles of 

20 prime esterine habitat. This is incredible 

21 wildlife habitat, and it also supports robust 

22 seafood nursery habitat and migratory bird 
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1 habitat.

2 We currently have mercury advisories 

3 from the Great Smoky Mountains to the Outer 

4 Banks. That is a drive that would take you 8 

5 hours. It's an atrocity that North Carolinians 

6 cannot eat the fish that they catch.

7 Our loss of these special places and the 

8 special pursuits that we hold dear are somewhat 

9 self-centered we admit, however, two and a 

10 quarter million North Carolinians hunt and fish 

11 and watch wildlife. We spend $2.6 billion a 

12 year. We create 46,000 jobs. We are an economic 

13 driver in the State, so what is good for 

14 sportsmen is good for North Carolina.

15 Additionally, outdoor recreationally 

16 related tourism is a major economic driver in the 

17 State. This business relies on a robust natural 

18 resources base to attract visitors.

19 I have two granddaughters and another 

20 one on the way. I want them to be able to 

21 experience North Carolina like I am. I don't 

22 want to be the butt of their children's jokes. I 
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1 don't want them to draw cartoons of us, of you 

2 and me and us, with our heads in the sand with 

3 captions saying something like "You had a chance 

4 to act and you didn't."

5 The sportsmen wildlife community applaud 

6 the development of these carbon rules, welcome 

7 the mercury rules, and hope you will proceed with 

8 speed to implement these rules as the next step 

9 to protect wildlife habitats in our natural world 

10 from the worst impacts of climate change.

11 Furthermore, we encourage you, when this 

12 work is done, to address emissions from existing 

13 coal-fired plants.

14 Thank you.

15 MR. CULLIGAN: Thank you.

16 MR. BOTZEK: Thank you and good 

17 afternoon. It is an honor and a privilege to be 

18 here, number one, but even more so to sit next to 

19 my North Carolina friend. He is a good friend of 

20 mine, as you can see it's from the heart, and I 

21 am here to give you some more of that experience 

22 but from the Minnesota perspective.
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1 My name is Gary Botzek, and as I said, I 

2 appreciate the opportunity to come before this 

3 panel this afternoon. I am the executive 

4 director of the Minnesota Conservation 

5 Federation. That is located in St. Paul, 

6 Minnesota. Our membership is traditionally made 

7 up of local sportsmen's clubs. Like Richard 

8 explained, we have the same types of club 

9 memberships. We also allow individuals in 

10 statewide regional organizations to participate.

11 Our members work every day. They hunt 

12 and fish by night and on weekends. They are blue 

13 collar, they are lawyers, they are professional 

14 people, but they love to get outside. That 

15 speaks for Minnesota.

16 Minnesota is known for its lakes and our 

17 streams and rivers. We have over 12,000 lakes, 

18 92,000 miles of shore land. Minnesotans love the 

19 out of doors, and we live it year around.

20 We love to hunt and fish just like the 

21 North Carolinians do. We bike and we hike. We 

22 eat, and we drink the waters of the great 
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1 outdoors. We enjoy our natural resources every 

2 day, however, our waters and our air are not as 

3 clean as they used to be, should be, or need to 

4 be.

5 The Minnesota Department of Health 

6 actually puts out fish advisories through their 

7 web site, indicating mercury levels in fish in 

8 our lakes and streams. They state that eating 

9 fish is an excellent source of low fat protein.

10 We all agree with that, but they go on 

11 to warn that some fish that contain contaminants, 

12 such as mercury, that can harm human health 

13 especially for children and fetuses.

14 We have fish advisories for mercury in 

15 most of our lakes and streams in Minnesota. That 

16 is not a good story. The mercury we have in our 

17 waters in Minnesota comes from power plants. It 

18 is not just power plants in Minnesota, but it is 

19 power plants in our surrounding states, it is 

20 power plants in Canada.

21 This is a regional, this is a national, 

22 this is an international problem.
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1 Our utilities in Minnesota are actually 

2 good guys in most cases. They have done an above 

3 average job of converting coal-burning electrical 

4 generation plants to natural gas, and they are 

5 upgrading their scrubber technology in the 

6 exhaust pipes.

7 Minnesota is rich with wildlife and 

8 fish, as I mentioned. Many of our animal species 

9 like trout and moose are sensitive, you heard 

10 already, to temperature change. Milder winters 

11 in Minnesota, as well, are affecting the 

12 migration patterns of our wildlife both north and 

13 south, along the Mississippi byway, are affecting 

14 both ducks and loons, our State bird.

15 The story of the moose population in 

16 Minnesota is not a pretty picture. Aerial photos 

17 that our Department of Natural Resources do show 

18 a decline of the moose in Minnesota in one area 

19 from over 8,000 to just over 4,000, a 50 percent 

20 reduction since 2006.

21 In six years, we have lost half of our 

22 moose population. This is due to mild winters, 
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1 as you have heard earlier, balmy springs, fall 

2 seasons require a moose to use more strength to 

3 cool themselves.

4 The milder winters also allow parasites 

5 and ticks to survive the winters and do more 

6 damage on the native moose. We need normal 

7 colder winters. I never thought I would say 

8 that, but we need normal colder winters, not 

9 warmer ones assisted by climate change caused by 

10 fossil-fueled power plants, factories, and 

11 automobiles.

12 The Minnesota Conservation Federation 

13 supports the passage and implementation of the 

14 legislation and the rules that you have in front 

15 of you today as it relates to reductions in 

16 greenhouse gas emissions.

17 We are joined by many other conservation 

18 and environmental organizations in Minnesota, 

19 some of which are testifying in Chicago today, as 

20 well.

21 I personally live next to the largest 

22 coal burning electrical generation plant in the 
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1 State, called Sherco, Sherco 1, 2, and 3. Due to 

2 the wind movement in that part of the State, the 

3 pollution from that facility gravitates northeast 

4 to the Boundary Waters Canoe area. Most people 

5 know the Boundary Waters Canoe area and Voyageurs 

6 National Park. It is two our jewels in the 

7 Minnesota and National systems.

8 This haze is a major concern to park 

9 users and to the general public. As I mentioned, 

10 Sherco has got three smokestacks on this 

11 location, all full based, two of which are 

12 operational currently.

13 The Minnesota Pollution Control Agency 

14 and others are watching and keeping the pressure 

15 on the utility to do more in terms of 

16 retrofitting the plants with cleaner technology.

17 This plant that I reference is an 

18 excellent example why it is so critical for the 

19 EPA to move to tackle emissions from existing 

20 coal-fired plants. Strong new standards for new 

21 coal plants are the first step, but we are very 

22 proud to live and work in Minnesota.
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1 Once we have our sporting teams back in 

2 shape, we will be at the perfect place once again 

3 to live and raise our kids and grand kids. 

4 However, we must continue to ask our businesses 

5 including our utilities to do a better job, do 

6 the best job that they can to improve the quality 

7 of our air and our waters.

8 As rate payers, we are paying them to do 

9 the right thing. At the Minnesota conservation 

10 meetings that we hold, we open our meetings with 

11 a pledge that goes like this. I give my pledge 

12 as an American to save and faithfully defend from 

13 waste, the natural resources of my country, its 

14 air, soil, and minerals, its forests, waters, and 

15 wildlife.

16 We, in Minnesota, try hard every day to 

17 practice what we preach or what we pledge. This 

18 proposed rule will go a long way in the correct 

19 direction of our pledge.

20 Thank you and have a good afternoon.

21 MR. CULLIGAN: Thank you. Thank both of 

22 you.
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1 Our next two speakers are Sylvia 

2 Ridgeway and David Dittloff.

3 While we are waiting to have both of 

4 them come up, I do want to take a minute to do a 

5 little bit of a commercial for a couple of our 

6 other rules.

7 There has been some references to some 

8 of the conventional pollutants that come from 

9 power plants, mercury has come up a number of 

10 times. I want to note that we did recently pass 

11 the mercury and air toxics rule, that we are very 

12 hopeful will be significantly reducing mercury in 

13 the next several years from power plants. We 

14 will additionally probably get a lot of the other 

15 pollutants, the conventional, not CO2, but a lot 

16 of the other conventionals.

17 Go ahead.

18 MS. RIDGEWAY: Good afternoon, members 

19 of the Environmental Protection Agency. I am 

20 Sylvia C. Ridgeway. That is S-Y-L-V-I-A, 

21 R-I-D-G-E-W-A-Y.

22 I am a resident of Huntington, West 
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1 Virginia. My comments will focus today on the 

2 environment as it is in my State of West 

3 Virginia.

4 West Virginia is known as the Mountain 

5 State with its beautiful healthy mountains, 

6 streams, and valleys. Yet, many are being 

7 destroyed by mountaintop mining. West Virginia 

8 mining is important because coal production 

9 serves a great percentage of heating in this 

10 nation.

11 Big mining companies resist EPA 

12 regulation that call for a cleaner coal 

13 processing, that which is safe for miners, and to 

14 the health of all who live near the mining 

15 operations. It appears that the important focus 

16 is profit rather than the health of West 

17 Virginians.

18 A study done on communities affected by 

19 mountaintop mining on Cold River in Raleigh and 

20 Boone Counties, on a total of 409 people, and In 

21 Pocahontas County on a total of 360, a non-mining 

22 community.
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1 This revealed that cancer rates were 

2 higher in the mining community than in the 

3 non-mining community. The cancer rate was higher 

4 in ways not explainable by age, gender, smoking, 

5 occupational exposure, or family history of 

6 cancer.

7 On a personal level, my young son, who 

8 is now 47 years old -- I know I look young -- was 

9 diagnosed with chronic asthma before age 1. I 

10 was diagnosed with asthma only four years ago.

11 To my knowledge, no one in our family 

12 was asthmatic, so the answer is possibly poor air 

13 quality due to chemical pollution.

14 My son moved to California where smog is 

15 heavy, but to our family's surprise, he gets 

16 along just fine. It isn't until his plane 

17 touches down when he comes home for a visit that 

18 he begins to have asthma attacks and must use an 

19 inhaler, as I also do.

20 Chronic diseases do not happen by 

21 accident. The fact is that America is hooked on 

22 coal and according to the executive summary of a 
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1 report titled "Coal-blooded," that is, c-o-a-l, 

2 putting profits before people.

3 The coal-blooded charts of that report 

4 revealed that of 10 coal plants that were studied 

5 in West Virginia, the John Amos plant, which is 

6 located in Winfield, received a failing plant 

7 grade of D-plus because of the percentage of 

8 chemical emissions it causes.

9 Needless to say, poor whites and people 

10 of color live near these power plants. 

11 Approximately 71 percent of African-Americans 

12 live in areas in violation of air pollution 

13 standards. Race over income is the number one 

14 predictor of whether a person lives near a 

15 polluting facility.

16 An African-American making $50,000 a 

17 year is more likely to live in an area cited for 

18 air pollution than a white American making only 

19 $15,000 a year.

20 Certain studies reveal that plant 

21 pollution emissions in the U.S. are responsible 

22 for 30,000 premature deaths, 7,000 asthma-related 
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1 emergency room visits, and 18,000 cases of 

2 chronic bronchitis each year.

3 Asthma affects African-Americans at a 46 

4 percent higher rate of incidence than white

5 Americans. In West Virginia, asthma is 

6 relatively high. The Marcellus Shale process, 

7 known as fracking, must not be overlooked. 

8 Fracking is responsible for gas leaks and water 

9 pollution that are causing people and animals to 

10 become sick, and is making it possible for some 

11 people to light their tap water on fire.

12 Included as an addendum to my comments 

13 today are pictures which depict the dangers of 

14 contamination to people's well water supply. One 

15 picture shows an October 2009 cleanup of a coal 

16 sludge spill. Another reveals dark red water in 

17 a bathtub. It is this poisoned water by slurry 

18 that can cause skin rash, birth defects, cancers, 

19 hair loss, kidney problems, and more.

20 To conclude, there is no doubt that the 

21 environmental issue must be resolved between the 

22 EPA and State legislature. Drilling permits need 
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1 to be awarded with caution based on the areas and 

2 degrees of drilling, cost to families, and enough 

3 EPA monitors to ensure that the process of mine 

4 and gas drilling are done properly and safely, so 

5 that our air, water, and land in West Virginia 

6 and across this beautiful nation are protected 

7 against lung disease, cancer, and chronic 

8 conditions that cause insurance rates to 

9 skyrocket, hospitals to become overcrowded, and 

10 to ultimately reject the idea that profit is more 

11 important than the health of our citizens.

12 Thank you for allowing me to speak.

13 MR. CULLIGAN: Thank you.

14 MR. DITTLOFF: Good afternoon. My name 

15 is David Dittloff, D-I-T-T-L-O-F-F. I am the 

16 regional representative for the National Wildlife 

17 Federation based out of our northern Rockies and 

18 Prairie's office in Montana. I don't know if 

19 that gives the longest distance to there or not, 

20 but we have our annual meeting in town last week, 

21 so I had to stay over to do this.

22 I stand in support of these proposed 
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1 rules, and I want to start off a little bit. At 

2 the end of every year, I think back on the year, 

3 and one of my favorite days, and inevitably, they 

4 are me getting outside with my two girls.

5 I want to talk a little bit, tell a 

6 story about one of those days. In Glacier Park, 

7 right next to the border of Canada, me and my two 

8 girls started, at Swift Current Ranger Station, 

9 and the one thing to remember about this day is 

10 it was hot, 100 degrees, right next to Canada, 

11 along the Continental Divide.

12 We proceeded to hike into Bullhead Lake, 

13 you know, Wilbur Mountain, Grinnell Mountain 

14 rising 3- 4,000 feet above us on each side, kind 

15 of one of the very many needed breaks. My girls 

16 were maybe 8 and 10 at that time.

17 We spotted some mountain goats on the 

18 mountainside and proceeded to get in to the lake 

19 four or five miles in, I forget exactly, and 

20 breaking out our fishing gear. The girls wanted 

21 to catch some trout, and I am all for that if 

22 they want to catch some trout.
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1 It was so hot we literally waded in to 

2 our chests. Luckily, there was kind of a gradual 

3 slant there right before the drop off, so it was 

4 ideal, you know, the trout are right after that 

5 drop off.

6 Sure enough, during that day we caught 

7 some trout, and they were still at the age where 

8 dad takes the fish off the hooks, and I make sure 

9 that I showed them this trout, and coloration, 

10 and the beauty, and the fragility of this trout 

11 before I take it off, and we let those go that 

12 day.

13 Maybe an hour or two into our fishing 

14 expedition, you know, the biggest moose I have 

15 ever seen in my life strolls down obviously to 

16 get out of the heat, and this wasn't a big lake, 

17 so a little bit scary for a parent, but was far 

18 enough away and not showing any inclination, but 

19 we actually got to watch that moose for two, 

20 three hours it stayed in that water.

21 Later on, two deer literally came right 

22 down to the lakeside within 10 yards of us, and 
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1 at the time it was obvious because of the heat, 

2 but it made for an unbelievable day.

3 You know, it is the kind of day as a 

4 parent, you know, you want to connect your kids 

5 to something beautiful. My girls and my wife is, 

6 by heritage, Glacial Park is part of those 

7 ancestral grounds, so they got to connect to 

8 that, as well.

9 It was a beautiful day, you know, God's 

10 grace was on us. It wasn't until we were 

11 actually driving back out to the camp site that 

12 we actually saw a plume of smoke rising from the 

13 forest, which turned into a major forest fire, 

14 and it got me thinking a little bit. This is 

15 before I worked for National Wildlife Federation.

16 This was such a great day, I will 

17 remember it the rest of my life, my kids will 

18 remember it the rest of their lives, but are we 

19 screwing this up. It was 100 degrees, right next 

20 to the Canadian border, along the Continental 

21 Divide, literally the switch backs going up to 

22 the Continental Divide, we are within 20 yards of 
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1 where we were fishing.

2 I just say that here, because I want to 

3 be able to protect for my kids' future and if 

4 they have kids moving forward, that they are able 

5 to experience those same things, and as a planet, 

6 we are screwing things up, and not allowing that 

7 kind of thing, and that is a travesty from a 

8 moral, ethical standpoint. America's natural 

9 heritage is something to be proud of, and we need 

10 to protect it.

11 I looked a little bit more into the 

12 science after that, and sure enough, Montana is 

13 heated up 2.3 degrees on average every year in 

14 the last 60 years.

15 This was an August day. August 

16 precipitation has declined by 20 percent. What 

17 does that do with the critters that we saw and 

18 hooked that day?

19 Trout are really a poster child in the 

20 Northern Rockies for climate change, and trout 

21 need cold water, clean water, and a lot of it, 

22 and climate change impacts all those things. 
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1 Obviously, the ambient air temperature being high 

2 impacts trout.

3 The earlier runoff from the snow pack in 

4 the streams at least we were fishing on a lake 

5 that day, reduces the amount of water in the 

6 streams late in the season, so the amount of 

7 water is impacted there.

8 Then, you look at the forest fires and 

9 all the siltation that causes, that impacts clean 

10 air. So, that is how trout is impacted by 

11 climate change.

12 You look at the moose. A couple of 

13 people have talked about moose already, I won't 

14 get into that, but the heat stressors there and 

15 the ticks associated with the mild winters are 

16 really ravaging moose populations in Minnesota 

17 and the Northeast. It is likely just a matter of 

18 time before they are headed to the Rocky 

19 Mountains with the same problems with moose.

20 Mountain goats, another poster child. 

21 As temperatures increase, the mountain forests 

22 are creeping up slow, pinching off the Alpine 
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1 areas where mountain goats spend their time, and 

2 likely then bighorn sheep pikers are all going to 

3 be impacted.

4 Then, obviously, Glacier Park is named 

5 after glaciers. They predict, now here the 

6 latest signs say within 10, probably at most 20 

7 years, Glacier Park will not have a glacier. 

8 That is a travesty, that is a heritage site for 

9 not just America, but the world.

10 That being said here, there is a number 

11 of organizations that are recognizing these 

12 concerns and these impacts to wildlife in our 

13 natural world that have jumped into this. The 

14 National Wildlife Federation for which I work is 

15 a key component of what we do.

16 Other sportsmen groups created a Seasons 

17 End campaign basically, along the same thing, to 

18 educate sportsmen about the impacts of climate 

19 change, Trout Unlimited, Ducks Unlimited, 

20 Pheasants Forever all belong to that 

21 organization.

22 The Wildlife Society, an organization of 
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1 wildlife professionals has put out papers on it. 

2 You know, this is an important topic if we are 

3 going to protect our natural world for our 

4 children.

5 It is not just kind of a recreational 

6 issue, it is not just a spiritual issue. It is 

7 more than that, the economics of a lot of areas

8 are tied to the outdoor recreation. In Montana, 

9 that is one of the leading other than 

10 agriculture, it is the second leading economic 

11 driver in the State right now here.

12 In the United States, just hunting, 

13 fishing, wildlife, viewing generates $122 billion 

14 worth of expenditures each year. That is a 

15 significant component to our country's economy, 

16 and something that really meshes with our outdoor 

17 way of life that we have in many parts of it.

18 That being said, I applaud the EPA for 

19 this proposal. It is a significant step in the 

20 right direction. I think if we are really to 

21 tackle the problem, we might need to go after 

22 existing power plants and propose some kind of 
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1 standards there as well here, but this is a 

2 really good solid step, and I sure appreciate it.

3 MR. CULLIGAN: Thank you.

4 I am hoping you all indulge us on the 

5 panel if we take a quick five-minute break for 

6 the sake of the three of us on the panel and our 

7 hard-working court reporter over there. After 

8 that we will restart with Dylan Voorhees and Ben

9 Yamagata.

10 [Recess from 3:01 to 3:09 p.m.]

11 MR. CULLIGAN: We are going to get 

12 started again. I know there is a lot of people 

13 who want to talk, and I know people have joined 

14 us since we walked through the directions, so we 

15 really are trying to limit people to five 

16 minutes. Like I said, there is a lot of people 

17 who want to talk, and we want to limit people to 

18 five minutes, so that everybody does get a 

19 chance.

20 In that spirit, Dave is manning our 

21 lights, so what happens over here is they are 

22 green for your first four minutes, and David 
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1 doesn't start them until you start talking, and 

2 then in the last minute they turn yellow. At 

3 five minutes they will turn red and you will 

4 probably see me lean forward to the mike and try 

5 to find an opportune time to nudge you to quickly 

6 wrap up.

7 So, with that reminder, we will resume 

8 our panel, and I think Laura will be back with us 

9 shortly, but let's just get started so we can 

10 hear as many people as possible.

11 MR. EVANS: And then briefly remember to 

12 spell your name for the reporter.

13 MR. CULLIGAN: Thank you. That's a good 

14 reminder.

15 MR. VOORHEES: Good afternoon. My name 

16 is Dylan Voorhees, V-O-O-R-H-E-E-S, and I am the 

17 clean energy director for the Natural Resources 

18 Council of Maine, which is a nonprofit membership 

19 organization founded in 1959 and dedicated to 

20 protecting, restoring, and conserving Maine's 

21 environment for now and for future generations, 

22 and we have over 12,000 members and activists 
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1 across the State.

2 Improving air quality, promoting clean 

3 energy, and taking actions to address climate 

4 change are high priorities for NRCM, because they 

5 are high priorities for Maine.

6 The EPA has proposed carbon standards 

7 for power plants are essential to protecting 

8 Maine's people, and environment. Maine's 

9 environment is tied to our culture and our 

10 economy in unique ways, making it especially 

11 critical that we address climate change and power 

12 plant air pollution as quickly and as effectively 

13 as possible.

14 So far, over 8,000 Maine people have 

15 commented to the EPA in support of these proposed 

16 standards, but that abstract figure kind of 

17 belies the fact that climate change is already 

18 negatively impacting real people in Maine, their 

19 lives and their livelihoods.

20 Last week the EPA administrator for 

21 Region One came up to Maine and to participate in 

22 and listen to a panel of Maine leaders talk about 
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1 climate change, and I would like to share a few 

2 of their words, so you can have a sense of how 

3 much people in Maine have at stake.

4 Harry Dwyer is a master logger and a 

5 forester from Fayette, Maine, and works in the 

6 woods for his own small forestry business. Harry 

7 doesn't earn a salary. His pay comes from the 

8 time he spends in the woods, log in the woods, 

9 and these are some of his words.

10 I don't think climate change is a future 

11 problem, I think we are in the midst of it right 

12 now, and I have been absorbing the economic costs 

13 of lost work time when heavy rain shuts us down 

14 or when we are waiting for the ground to freeze 

15 to start a logging job.

16 Ten or 15 years ago no one had to worry 

17 about deer ticks in Central Maine. Now, I am 

18 picking ticks off hours after I get home. They 

19 just weren't here, because we used to have those 

20 cold winters that kept them at bay.

21 I am a parent, and the world we hand off 

22 to our children matters more to me than the lost 
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1 work time and the economic costs of these things. 

2 Our asthma rates, especially childhood asthma, 

3 are far higher than is morally or ethically 

4 defensible.

5 If you have ever laid awake at night 

6 listening to your child struggle to breathe, had 

7 to go everywhere with an inhaler, wondering at 

8 what point you are going to head to the hospital, 

9 because inhaler and the nebulizer aren't helping, 

10 then, you will agree these rules are long 

11 overdue.

12 Harry is one of the people caught in the 

13 crossfire of warming and pollution, a vulnerable 

14 spot that will only get worse. The impacts of 

15 the loss of traditional winter, declining habitat 

16 for industrial soft wood species and increased 

17 invasive pests pose an enormous threat to the 

18 forest products industry in Maine. On top of 

19 that, his son is one of over 23,000 kids in Maine 

20 suffering from asthma.

21 Indeed, these rules are important 

22 because they help us reduce the effect of climate 
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1 warming on smog formation, which fuels childhood 

2 asthma attacks and respiratory illness.

3 Another panelist last week was Dr. Peggy 

4 Pennoyer, an asthma specialist, says that as a 

5 specialist in asthma, I see the health effects of 

6 air pollution daily on children and adults.

7 But what Dr. Pennoyer and many other 

8 physicians in Maine are really worried about is 

9 the situation getting worse, and she cited a 

10 recent study that predicted 15,000 additional 

11 cases of serious respiratory illness in Maine by 

12 2020 if warming continues.

13 So, by advancing these standards along 

14 with the other air safeguard standards from

15 mercury and soot and others, EPA is holding 

16 polluters accountable and protecting Maine 

17 families and others.

18 Our marine environment is also essential 

19 to our large commercial fishing sector, a $375 

20 million lobster and shell fishing industry, and 

21 the acidification of the oceans is an existential 

22 threat to these sectors of our economy.
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1 We congratulate and applaud the EPA for 

2 these standards for new power plants, but it is 

3 also even essential that standards for existing 

4 power plants come next. That is the people of 

5 Maine need in order to preserve our way of life 

6 in a natural resource-based economy.

7 In fact, Maine and other northeastern 

8 states have already taken action to limit carbon 

9 pollution from existing power plants through the 

10 innovative and highly successful regional 

11 greenhouse gas initiative.

12 Because of the way that program is 

13 designed, independent assessments have shown that 

14 Maine's economy will see a net benefit of $92 

15 million as a direct result, but Maine cannot 

16 solve this problem alone. We are down wind of 

17 many power plants that need to be addressed.

18 The power plants we build today are, of 

19 course, the existing power plants of the future, 

20 that our children will inherit for 30 to 40 years 

21 to come.

22 My 6-year-old daughter asked me this 
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1 week why I was traveling to Washington, D.C., and 

2 she has only a vague sense of what I do, so she 

3 said, "Are you going there to clean the air, 

4 daddy?"

5 "Yes, I am trying," I answered, "But to 

6 do that, I have to persuade our leaders to make 

7 sure that we have less pollution," and so that is 

8 why I am here, on her behalf, on behalf of the 

9 members of NRCM and the people of Maine support 

10 these rules and insist that we have strong carbon 

11 pollution standards from here on out.

12 Thank you very much.

13 MR. CULLIGAN: Thank you.

14 MR. YAMAGATA: On behalf of the 

15 membership of the Coal Utilization and Research 

16 Council, CURC, I want to thank you for the 

17 opportunity to present these comments.

18 My name is Ben Yamagata, 

19 Y-A-M-A-G-A-T-A. CURC is a coalition of research 

20 universities, electric utility associations, coal 

21 producers, major U.S. utilities that use coal, 

22 and major equipment suppliers of combustion and 
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1 gasification platform systems, as well as 

2 pollution control equipment. A list of our 

3 membership can be found on our web site.

4 It is in the context of technology 

5 development that I am here to provide these 

6 comments. I do not profess any expertise in 

7 environmental law generally, nor the statutory 

8 regulatory requirements of the Clean Air Act 

9 specifically.

10 As an organization focused on technology 

11 and what is required to develop and deploy clean 

12 coal-based technologies, I must tell you that the 

13 proposed regulations will not drive the adoption 

14 of carbon capture and storage, and unfortunately, 

15 at least in my view, would simply turn the nation 

16 away from a richly abundant low cost domestic 

17 energy resource.

18 I have four points i would like to make. 

19 First, the proposed single performance standard 

20 for all power plants based on emission rates 

21 achievable only by the fuel with the lowest 

22 emissions is troubling.
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1 In the absence of proven carbon capture 

2 and storage or carbon capture and utilization 

3 storage, the rule is functionally equivalent, I 

4 think, to a requirement that natural gas is the 

5 sole available control technology.

6 Adoption of the regulations as proposed 

7 simply means the nation cannot continue to enjoy 

8 the energy and economic benefits which are 

9 distinctively a part of the coal-based power 

10 system.

11 You seem to ignore, I think, these 

12 energy and cost benefits shown to be achievable 

13 with coal by citing to the EIA, including the 

14 natural gas is the abundant domestic resource 

15 cost less than coal and thus, there will be no 

16 new coal bills for the next several decades 

17 anyway.

18 Somehow by this rationale, this results 

19 in no harm, no fowl. If EPA generally believes 

20 that the rule contains no environmental benefit, 

21 and no change in electric power decisionmaking, 

22 why are you proposing the standard in the first 
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1 place.

2 Second, the proposed alternative 

3 compliance plan is predicated on a completely 

4 unrealistic view that businesses will invest 

5 hundreds of millions, or more likely, several 

6 billions of dollars in a power plant betting that 

7 after 10 years of operation, or sooner, 

8 commercial CCS technology will be available and 

9 cost effective for retrofit installation.

10 Research and development programs and a 

11 number of first generation demonstration 

12 projects, which I might add have significant 

13 public support, are trying to develop and 

14 demonstrate CCS and CCS U.S. technology, let the 

15 process underway run its course.

Compounding the lack of proven CO2 16

17 capture technology or unresolved technical, 

18 legal, and regulatory issues concerning carbon 

19 dioxide storage options.

20 Third, the agency's contention that this 

21 proposed rule is actually a technology driver for 

22 the adoption of CCS is wrong. The agency seems 
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1 to argue that if coal is chosen to fuel a power 

2 plant, and there exists a CCS requirement, then, 

3 the regulation will actually drive development 

4 for adoption of the technology.

5 That might occur if the technology were 

6 commercially mature and other less costly fuel 

7 options were not available. Neither of these 

8 circumstances exist.

9 Fourth, assuming you have a desire, as 

10 we do, to effectively develop and deploy CCS 

11 technology, there are better ways to make steady 

12 progress to reduce carbon dioxide emissions from 

13 coal. We have three immediate positive steps 

14 forward.

15 First, adopt a stringent but 

16 technologically achievable efficiency standard 

17 for new coal fields, just as you have proposed 

18 for natural gas fuel power plants.

19 Second, if we are seeking -- and I state 

20 again I believe that we all should be seeking --

21 a realistic balance to achieve CO2 emission 

22 reductions, because you yourself admit that no 
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1 environmental benefits are forthcoming from this 

2 rule, then, revisit these standards in 8 years 

3 when you are obligated to review NSPS and examine 

4 then the technology progress being made.

5 Third, let the Clean Air Act operate to 

6 drive CCS technologies by recognizing that there 

7 are coal-based CCS demonstrations underway, and 

8 we believe many will become operational.

9 Once demonstrated and commercially 

10 proven, the existing case-by-case procedure to 

11 determine best available control technology 

12 should effectively distinguish whether a 

13 particular coal field power plant can reliably 

and reasonable and cost effectively capture CO2 14

15 and store or use it.

16 Thanks very much for your attention.

17 MR. CULLIGAN: Thank you, thank both of 

18 you, and I assume that your comments will go into 

19 some detail about what you think alternative 

20 appropriate level would be --

21 MR. YAMAGATA: We have an intention to 

22 submitting formal statements by the 25th.
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1 MR. CULLIGAN: Great. Thank you.

2 MR. EVANS: Also, on the EIA 

3 characterization of relative fuel prices, that is 

4 something that you have --

5 MR. YAMAGATA: As well, we would be 

6 happy to do that.

7 MR. CULLIGAN: Our next two speakers are 

8 Jenny Kordick and Joan Picone.

9 MS. KORDICK: Hi. My name is Jenny 

10 Kordick, but I am actually going to be reading 

11 the testimony of a colleague Joel Gay of the New 

12 Mexico Wildlife Federation who couldn't be here 

13 today. His name is Joel Gay, G-A-Y.

14 My name is Joel Gay and I am the 

15 communications director for the New Mexico 

16 Wildlife Federation, which represents thousands 

17 of conservation minded New Mexico hunters, 

18 anglers, and others who care about wildlife and 

19 habitat.

20 I am also an avid hunter and fisherman 

21 myself. I am here today to ask the Environmental 

22 Protection Agency to protect our nation's 
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1 wildlife habitat by standing up for clean air and 

2 clean water that our wild game requires to 

3 thrive.

4 Hunters and anglers in this country have 

5 always promoted the protection of our wildlife 

6 resources. A century ago, it was sportsmen like 

7 Aldo Leopold, founder of the New Mexico Wildlife 

8 Federation, who calls for a conservative harvest 

9 limit on fish and game. No more commercial 

10 harvest of game birds and animals, and strong law 

11 enforcement to protect game species like 

12 antelope, elk, and turkey that have been 

13 exacerbated in New Mexico and other States.

14 Thanks to those farsighted sportsmen, 

15 our game populations have recovered and in some 

16 cases are booming.

17 Today, the threat to wildlife is not 

18 from overharvesting, but from overheating. The 

19 science is irrefutable that as the climate 

20 changes due to increasing levels of greenhouse 

21 gases, average temperatures will rise, and 

22 precipitation will be increasingly erratic.
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1 Those two factors work together to 

2 affect wildlife and, by extension, sportsmen.

3 Last week I went fishing on Columbine 

4 Creek in Northern New Mexico, hoping to find 

5 native Rio Grande cutthroat trout. In many 

6 States, the trout streams are big enough that 

7 trout can find deep pools of cold water to help 

8 them survive if temperatures rise, but in New 

9 Mexico, we often fish in streams like the 

10 Columbine that are less than a foot deep.

11 If temperatures continue to rise, trout 

12 and trout fishing on many streams in New Mexico 

13 will simply disappear.

14 Earlier this spring I hunted for turkeys 

15 in the Sacramento mountains in Southeast New 

16 Mexico. They had a record snowfall early in the 

17 winter, followed by a drought, and then early 

18 runoff. There are almost no water in canyons and 

19 almost no birds.

20 Wildlife in our region can withstand 

21 flood and drought, but climate change is creating 

22 even bigger swings in precipitation that makes 
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1 the future of hunting for birds like turkey and 

2 quail questionable.

3 Likewise, bigger animals that thrive in 

4 so-called Sky Island of the Southwest, that can't 

5 migrate north, will have nowhere to go as 

6 temperatures rise.

7 Many hunters already see the effect of a 

8 warming planet, as waterfowl migration and the 

9 rut season for elk, deer, and others occur later 

10 than they have historically.

11 I am asking the EPA to take quick 

12 actions of these pollution standards for new 

13 power plants and to begin to rein the pollution 

14 from existing power plants.

15 We need the EPA to protect our air and 

16 water, which ultimately will protect our 

17 wildlife, protect our outdoor heritage from the 

18 worst effects of a warming world.

19 Sincerely, Joel Gay who lives in 

20 Albuquerque, New Mexico.

21 Thank you.

22 MR. CULLIGAN: Thank you.
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1 MS. PICONE: Good afternoon. My name is 

2 Joan Picone. It's J-O-A-N, P-I-C-O-N-E. I am a 

3 life-long resident of Canton, Ohio, and work in 

4 the community of Stark and Summit Counties on 

5 behalf of the National Wildlife Federation's 

6 Clean Air Defense Campaign.

7 Professionally, I have worked in 

8 business and public health. Today, I want to 

9 address the importance of the proposed carbon 

10 pollution standards for new power plants.

11 According to the American Lung 

12 Association's 2012 State of the Air report, Stark 

13 and Summit Counties, my home base, have a 

14 combined population of roughly 917,367 residents. 

15 Moreover, they estimate that half of this 

16 population, 456,364, are at greater health risk 

17 from air pollution due to an existing diagnosis 

18 of asthma, chronic bronchitis, emphysema, 

19 emphysema, cardiovascular disease, or diabetes.

20 The Lung Association's report released 

21 just this past april gave Stark and Summit 

22 Counties failing grades of F for ozone levels, 
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1 while Stark received a poor grade of D and Summit 

2 a failing grade of F for 24-hour particle 

3 pollution levels. Recognizing that Ohio is 

4 considered one of the dirtiest polluting States, 

5 I would like to highlight what impact that has on 

6 the lives of two Ohioans.

7 Recently, I learned that a dear 

8 childhood friend Pattie has been suffering from 

9 emphysema and COPD for some time. She is 

10 frequently on oxygen, but going outdoors, 

11 particularly during ozone alert days can be fatal 

12 to her.

13 She is a grandmother, so enjoying play 

14 time with her grand kids outdoors is no longer an 

15 option.

16 In another incident, I have been in 

17 communication with a mother, Nicole, whose son 

18 was diagnosed with pediatric asthma, and receives 

19 ongoing weekly treatments in the Akron area. 

20 Sadly, his doctor now recommends that her child 

21 wear a mouth mask when venturing outdoors for any 

22 length of time.
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1 In both cases, simply stepping outdoors 

2 creates breathing risks for these individuals 

3 given the existence of unhealthy polluted air.

4 The National Wildlife Federation's 2007 

5 Gardeners Guide points out that global warming 

6 has increased northern Ohio temperatures 4 

7 degrees Fahrenheit over the last decade. For 

8 residents living in this region, winter of this 

9 year 2011-2012 was the warmest in 140 years 

10 according to the National Weather Service weather 

11 record.

12 We know that with warming temperatures, 

13 the threat of health issues including 

14 heat-related death, illnesses, and the spread of 

15 infectious diseases become real possibilities.

16 With the rise of diabetes, in all age 

17 categories including youth, heat is a troublesome 

18 factor and can be life threatening for this 

19 at-risk group. My mother lived 36 years with 

20 diabetes, so I know firsthand how her body 

21 reacted to the rise of smog-related temperatures.

22 Venturing outdoors during very warm days 
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1 was limiting for her particularly as she aged, 

2 however, the rise in outdoor temperatures and 

3 living without air conditioning created a medical 

4 challenge.

5 Heat lessens one's desire to eat, and 

6 this was true for my mother, who was insulin 

7 dependent. Often this combination would send her 

8 body into a severe insulin reaction state, 

9 weakening her quality of life.

10 Now, imagine our youth of today dealing 

11 with diabetes and going through similar health 

12 circumstances simply because the climate is 

13 warming at the hands of polluters.

14 Ohioans, along with the nation, continue 

15 to be exposed to air pollution levels that are 

16 dangerous to our health. The proposed EPA carbon 

17 pollution standards for new power plants are 

18 another and first step in the right direction, 

19 and one the National Wildlife Federation and I 

20 fully support.

21 Thank you for your time.

22 MR. CULLIGAN: Thank you.
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1 Our next two speakers are Carol Oldham 

2 and David Ellenberger.

3 MS. OLDHAM: Good afternoon. My name is 

4 Carol Oldham, and I live in Brookline, 

5 Massachusetts. I am the National Wildlife 

6 Federation's Northeast Regional Coordinator. I 

7 am here on behalf of more than 500,000 members 

8 and supporters of the National Wildlife 

9 Federation in the Northeast.

10 I am also an elected representative in 

11 Brookline.

12 The town of Brookline and the State of 

13 Massachusetts have made strong commitments to 

14 decrease their carbon emissions because they 

15 represent a clear danger to human health in the 

16 natural world.

17 I personally have made every effort in 

18 my individual life to decrease my impacts, and I 

19 have dedicated my career to helping others do so, 

20 as well.

21 I love to get outdoors to do almost 

22 anything, but this last winter I had no chance to 
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1 go skiing or snowshoeing. The Northeast had 

2 practically no winter at all. This year was the 

3 earliest recorded ice out on the lake in New 

4 Hampshire where my grandmother's cabin is, and it 

5 was almost a month earlier than last year.

6 I found a tick on me when I was hiking 

7 in March, and who knows what the heat is going to 

8 be like this summer. I love wildlife and I worry 

9 about our moose as Eric Orff and several of my 

10 other colleagues have mentioned, they are 

11 suffering from increased tick populations.

12 Some of my favorite animals like lynx 

13 thrive in areas with cold winters, and are having 

14 a hard time as our weather is already warming. 

15 This why carbon pollution needs to be controlled. 

16 It is bad for our health, and it is bad for our 

17 wildlife.

18 I applaud the Environmental Protection 

19 Agency's work to control carbon pollution, and I 

20 strongly encourage you to move forward with this 

21 important rule. I also encourage you to look at 

22 controlling carbon pollution from existing power 
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1 plants.

2 Thank you for your time and the 

3 opportunity to speak to you today.

4 MR. CULLIGAN: Thank you.

5 MR. ELLENBERGER: Good afternoon. Thank 

6 you for the opportunity to testify in strong 

7 support of EPA's rules to cut carbon dioxide 

8 pollution on future coal-fired power plants.

9 My name is David Ellenberger. I am a 

10 regional outreach coordinator with the National 

11 Wildlife Federation based in Boulder, Colorado.

12 Being born and raised in the 

13 Intermountain West has instilled in me an abiding 

14 love of nature, wildlife, and unique recreational 

15 opportunities supported in the great outdoors of 

16 my beloved Rocky Mountains.

17 Needless to say, when I moved to 

18 Colorado from Montana nearly a year ago, I was 

19 excited to experience some of the legendary 

20 downhill skiing that the State has to offer and 

21 that they often brag about.

22 Before I had even moved to my new home, 
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1 I went on line to purchase what is called an epic 

2 ski pass, offering unlimited ski access to the 

3 famed mountains of Bail, Beaver Creek, Keystone, 

4 Breckinridge, and Arapahoe Basin.

5 Unfortunately, my first ski season in 

6 Colorado turned out to be something less 

7 pedantic. The season limped to a start with a 

8 later opening in most places and on very limited 

9 terrains than many are accustomed to out west.

10 My friends just kept telling me wait 

11 until March, that's our biggest snow month. I 

12 waited patiently, but March on the front range 

13 was ultimately defined by unseasonably warm 

14 temperatures and nearly zero precipitation, only 

15 0.01 inches of precipitation was recorded on the 

16 front range during the month of March, making it 

17 the driest March since recordkeeping began, and 

18 towards the end of the month, a wildfire blew out 

19 of control southwest of Denver, killing three 

20 people and torching thousands of acres of wild 

21 lands.

22 Ski season ended in a whimper and by 
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1 mid-April many of the resorts were showing more 

2 bare ground than snow and hardly managing to stay 

3 open until their usual closing dates. Apparently 

4 this, as Carol mentioned, was not limited to the 

5 Colorado Rockies as the Denver Post reported that 

6 the 2011-12 ski season will forever rank as one 

7 of the ugliest ever.

8 The record levels indicate coast to 

9 coast, across the country, average snowfall in 

10 ski areas was down 41 percent, marking yet 

11 another record low in the last 20 years. Half 

12 the country's resorts opened late with man-made 

13 snow and closed early in sweltering March, ski 

14 area temperatures reaching into the '80s.

15 The ski industry in Colorado is the 

16 major economic driver for the State, and while 

17 likely some will say that 2012 was an anomaly 

18 after a few good years of winter snow packs in 

19 the Rockies, the reports from climate scientists 

20 seem to concur that the future of the 

21 Intermountain West will be hotter and much drier, 

22 more similar to 2012 than not.
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1 Indeed, the recent Washington Post 

2 article in early May confirmed that in 2012, that 

3 the U.S. just completed the warmest 12-months 

4 period in 117 years, further stating that 

5 although the contortions of the jet stream 

6 established the unusually warm weather patterns, 

7 the intensity and persistence of the warmth 

8 compared to the past is very likely related to 

9 the elevated greenhouse gas concentrations in 

10 atmosphere from human activities.

11 The unfortunate demise of my first ski 

12 season in Colorado pales in light of a predicted 

13 habit of an increasingly warming climate in the 

14 West, increased wildfires, prolonged drought, and 

15 water scarcity, regional dieoffs of numerous 

16 susceptible plant and animal species and numerous 

17 other maladies that can unravel the very fabric 

18 of western landscapes.

19 I thought EPA's new proposal to cut 

20 carbon dioxide emissions from future power plants 

21 that will reduce heat trapping emissions by an 

22 estimated 123 billion pounds of carbon pollution 
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1 annually compared with the business as usual 

2 model.

3 In my opinion, these rules are very long 

4 overdue and need to be finished this year, as 

5 well as immediately followed by similar rules to 

6 cut our limit in carbon pollution from existing 

7 coal-fired power plants in this country.

8 Thank you very much for the opportunity 

9 to testify today and long live winter.

10 MS. STRINE: Thanks, Dave, I feel your 

11 pain.

12 MR. CULLIGAN: Our next two speakers are 

13 Frank Szollosi and Sarah Mullkoff.

14 MR. SZOLLOSI: Good afternoon. My name 

15 is Frank Szollosi, S-Z-O-L-L-O-S-I. I am a 

16 regional outreach coordinator working at National 

17 Wildlife Federation's Great Lake office in Ann 

18 Arbor, Michigan.

19 I live in Toledo, Ohio. Our regional 

20 office works very closely with Deputy 

21 Administrator Cameron Davis on Great Lakes 

22 compact issues, and obviously, the Great Lakes 
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1 restoration project, which we want to thank the 

2 EPA for their leadership on, representing 

3 hundreds of thousands of members in Great Lakes 

4 states as part of the National Wildlife 

5 Federation.

6 The threat that climate change poses to 

7 the Great Lakes is real, is already occurring, 

8 and is destructive to wildlife fisheries, 

9 habitat, and is disruptive and costly to human 

10 systems, such as agriculture, tourism, real 

11 estate, transportation, infrastructure just to 

12 name a few.

13 Lake Superior is among the fastest 

14 warming lakes in the world. Evaporation 

15 increases snow and precipitation costing cities 

16 more money in snow removal and impacts from 

17 localized flooding.

18 Without ice cover in the winter, lake 

19 levels decrease, hurting property values along 

20 the shore and requiring vast expensive new 

21 capital expenditures.

22 Warmer water also expands the species, 
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1 such as the warm water loving agent carp, and 

2 without the ice, winter wave activity destroys 

3 eggs of false spotting native fish species 

4 critical to the Great Lakes economy and our 

5 heritage.

6 It is important to know that Superior 

7 feeds the other Great Lakes and water levels in 

8 Lake Michigan and Lake Huron may drop as much as 

9 4 1/2 feet in our lifetime, impacting ground 

10 water for communities, as aquifer levels and 

11 recharge rates drop.

12 Tourism, shipping, and agriculture, as I 

13 mentioned, are also uniquely vulnerable to 

14 climate disruptions. Michigan cherry harvest is 

15 down this year 80 percent as a result of the 

16 abnormally warm winter and hard freeze. Michigan 

17 produces three-quarters of all U.S. tart cherries 

18 and for the first time in their history, the 

19 Michigan cherry businesses are importing cherries 

20 from Poland and South America.

21 Apples and peaches have also been 

22 adversely impacted. Jobs are lost, $190 million 
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1 in business profit have been lost just this 

2 season, and for small family-run businesses in 

3 small towns in Northern Michigan that have been 

4 in the same hands for generations it is 

5 devastating.

6 Last week, the Michigan legislature 

7 passed a resolution asking President Obama and 

8 the Secretary of Agriculture for Federal disaster 

9 aid. These types of climate disruptions are 

10 going to cost more in the future without sensible 

11 regulations, such as the carbon pollution 

12 standard.

13 Water shortages in other regions of the 

14 country will increase the threat of Great Lakes 

15 water diversion. Western governors are already 

16 publicly talking about building pipelines from 

17 the Great Lakes into the Great Plains in the 

18 Southwest and fortunately, the Ohio Senate just 

19 passed a bill weakening resolutions or weakening 

20 protections against increased water diversions 

21 from the Great Lakes. It's a crime.

22 With that said, it is clear that Great 
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1 Lakes takes themselves, bear considerable 

2 responsibility for these impacts. Midwest 

3 Utilities are responsible for the greatest share 

4 of carbon pollution in the United States.

5 Michigan is ranked 12th as far as carbon 

6 emissions from the electric power sector. 

7 Illinois is 6th, Pennsylvania 4th, and my state 

8 Ohio is behind only Texas in CO2 emissions from 

9 the electric power sector. 88.9 percent of our 

10 electric generation is coal fired in Ohio. When 

11 we don't mine coal in Ohio, we have to report 

12 that, and it costs us money. We send our income 

13 to places like West Virginia and Montana and 

14 other States.

15 In fact, there are more jobs associated 

16 with renewable energy in Ohio then there is with 

17 coal. In our State, like many States, have done 

18 a good job of creating incentives on the supply 

19 side for renewable energy.

20 Unfortunately, our States are not doing 

21 enough on the demand side, and that is what 

22 regulations, such as carbon pollution standard 
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1 does in that it acknowledges the externalities 

2 associated with fossil fuels.

3 A gentleman who spoke a moment ago 

4 perpetuates this myth of low cost coal. That 

5 argument demonstrates an ignorance of the 

6 well-established externalities that fossil fuels 

7 -- using fossil fuels in our energy system.

8 It is an argument that we have heard 

9 before. In the mid-1990s, big tobacco spent 

10 millions to undermine well-established science 

11 and to block regulations that the Clinton 

12 Administration was pursuing to regulate tobacco.

13 Big oil and big coal are adopting the 

14 same methods to try to undermine science and 

15 block regulations that will save lives and where 

16 the benefits will far outweigh the costs.

17 In conclusion, I will sum up. These 

18 clean air standards create jobs by driving growth 

19 in cleaner forms of energy. We need the carbon 

20 pollution standard not only for new power plants, 

21 but also for existing fossil fuel power plants. 

22 It is time for public policy to catch up with 
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1 established science and economic analysis, and it 

2 is time to stand up for this in future 

3 generations.

4 Thank you.

5 MR. CULLIGAN: Thank you.

6 MS. MULLKOFF: Good afternoon and thank 

7 you for the opportunity to speak today. My name 

8 is Sarah Mullkoff, that is M-U-L-L-K-O-F-F. I 

9 hail from the State of Michigan where I have 

10 lived my entire life, and I work out of the Great

11 Lakes Office also for the National Wildlife 

12 Federation and with a network called RE-AMP, 

13 collectively working on energy and climate 

14 campaign.

15 I carry a strong identity with where I 

16 come from. The place trademarks by its precious 

17 natural resources like the cleanest and freshest 

18 Great Lakes speeches, pristine forest and ripe 

19 agricultural layout.

20 It is also the home to fresh and locally 

21 grown cherry pies and peach cobblers, a family 

22 pastime that summer has never forgotten.
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1 It is part of my outdoor heritage in 

2 enjoying the States and marked by a third under 

3 my fingernails, I continue to invest considerable 

4 time into the lands intending to -- my homestead 

5 style garden plot at my house and two community 

6 garden plots in the neighborhood, always helping 

7 out my boyfriend's 4-acre farm in the City of 

8 Detroit.

9 In addition, I volunteer at our 

10 community food bank, the Greater Lansing food 

11 bank, which currently covers the three counties 

12 in the center of the State, Ingham, Eaton and 

13 Clinton Counties on food distribution programs, 

14 food gathering programs for various gardening 

15 programs.

16 One of those entitled the garden project 

17 has a program which rescues excess edible produce 

18 and crops from Michigan State University in the 

19 area farmers access excess crops, and distributes 

20 to a vast network of recipients throughout the 

21 greater Lansing area.

22 Many of those include traditional 
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1 Michigan crops such as apples, peaches, cherries, 

2 and other berry fruit trees. This year, as 

3 others have mentioned, extreme weather has hit 

4 more severely than ever before, and Michigan's 

5 crops are severely adversely affected.

6 Well, the gleaners program I just 

7 mentioned usually collects 250- to 350,000 pounds 

8 of produce from the tricounty area, and this 

9 season it will be diminished to 150,000 pounds. 

10 That is half as much as they are able to collect 

11 in excess produce meaning thousands of people 

12 less served.

13 The string of weather events including 

14 the unseasonably warm weather in March, switching 

15 drastically until late April freeze, a 

16 significant source in Michigan fruit crop, and 

17 once fruit trees started to come out of their 

18 dormancy with the warmer winter, jumpstarted in 

19 March, and they prematurely bloomed, and with 

20 overnight freezes late into April, the 

21 vulnerability at such a young age stunted the 

22 rest of their development and ability to bear 
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1 fruit later in the summer.

2 The lack of crop inevitably will have 

3 tremendous impacts on farmers, business markets, 

4 and work throughout the remainder of the season. 

5 According to the U.S. Department of Agriculture, 

6 damages extreme weather events are accounting for 

7 $223.5 million lost with highest declines 

8 pointing to 90 percent apple, 90 percent sweet 

9 cherry, and 95 percent peach loss.

10 The loss of our trees and bizarre 

11 weather impacts are not just an anomaly this 

12 year. The warmer and wetter weather this year 

13 emphasizes that there are increased levels of 

14 carbon dioxide in the atmosphere, and it will 

15 continue to exacerbate if not adequately 

16 addressed.

17 Cumulative impacts of climate change 

18 causing air pollution, specifically those 

19 released from coal-burning smokestacks, are going 

20 to continue to result in higher average 

21 temperatures in cases of extreme weather, thus 

22 continuing to adversely affect our agriculture.
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1 In the proposed new standard, the new 

2 source solution standard takes an important step 

3 to alleviate these concerns for the future. I 

4 strongly support this as a measure to ensure the 

5 power plants must reduce their carbon pollution 

6 by using sound and advanced technology. This 

7 proven process will provide assurance to the 

8 carbon limits, so it will not have an adverse 

9 effect on our economy.

10 It is critical that the EPA commit to 

11 finalize and publish the carbon rule this year, 

12 and it is equally important that the EPA take 

13 additional steps to tackle emissions from its 

14 15-pole fire power plant to continue to decrease 

15 the nation's greenhouse gas emissions.

16 These steps will ensure that important 

17 decisions on clean air are set in place, 

18 preventing future harmful impacts. Earlier this 

19 month, we planted 100 fruit trees at the farm in 

20 Detroit including apples, pears, cherry, paw-paw, 

21 and chestnuts. Fortunately, we missed the blight 

22 that affected the aforementioned trees an earlier 
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1 spring.

2 I see this orchard and their early 

3 blossoms, apple blossoms are starting to come 

4 out, and symbolic toward the future.

5 As long as the EPA makes the right 

6 decisions today to set strong standards on air 

7 pollution, and finalizes the rule this year, the 

8 trees will have a healthy atmosphere, to grow 

9 strong into the future and we will be able to 

10 harvest ample packs of produce for decades to 

11 come.

12 Thank you for hearing my comments.

13 MR. CULLIGAN: Thank both or you.

14 Frank, you had mentioned in your 

15 comments the statistic about Ohio having more 

16 jobs in renewables than in coal. I assume 

17 National Wildlife will probably submit more 

18 detailed comments. That would be a very useful 

19 thing to elaborate on if you have got more 

20 detail.

21 MR. SZOLLOSI: I will give it to you.

22 MR. CULLIGAN: Thank you.
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1 Our next two speakers are Richard Cizik 

2 and Paul McAllister.

3 REV. CIZIK: Good afternoon. Richard 

4 Cizik is spelled C-I-Z-I-K, and I am president of 

5 The New Evangelical Partnership for the Common 

6 Good and served for 28 years with the National 

7 Association of Evangelicals, the last 10 as the 

8 vice president for Governmental Affairs.

9 I speak today not just with the new 

10 evangelicals, but as an evangelical Presbyterian 

11 minister and an activist in Virginia who has also 

12 been on the Virginia Climate Commission that was 

13 selected by former Governor Tim Kaine, and an 

14 advisory member to the Virginia Interfaith Power 

15 & Light and the Interfaith action group, so there 

16 you have it, my Virginia credentials, great State 

17 of Virginia.

18 I speak most importantly, though, as a 

19 father and the parent of a son, two teenage sons, 

20 in fact, one of whom turned 19 yesterday, but 7 

21 years ago, he was, well, waking up in the morning 

22 struggling to breathe, and so much so that I 
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1 frankly panicked and wondered what in the world 

2 had happened. He has been suffering bronchial 

3 problems, but I had no idea.

4 Well, we took him to the doctor 

5 immediately. He was diagnosed with a serious case 

6 of asthma, and he still has it today. He is a 

7 strapping 6 foot 4 young man with a bright 

8 future, but he has asthma, and will carry, as I 

9 heard testified here by others, an inhaler with 

10 him the rest of his life.

11 Our family has thus come to know 

12 firsthand the impacts that come from pollutants 

13 and toxins in the environment. It wasn't always 

14 so. I was among those evangelicals who said, 

15 well, the environment and these concerns are for 

16 someone else, not for us.

17 I was somewhat aware intellectually of 

18 these industrial pollutants in the air, but had 

19 no idea how they would be and were at the very 

20 time impacting me, that is, until I was asked by 

21 the Environmental Working Group to participated 

22 in what was called the Human Toxome Project.
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1 In so doing, according to the project's 

2 final report, I became, quote, "One of only a 

3 small number of people in the world that know a 

4 portion of my personal body burden of industrial 

5 chemicals called the human toxome," one of 25 in 

6 the United States so tested.

7 The result is that I can speak to you 

8 today as someone, testify to you as someone who 

9 has industrial chemicals, plasticizers, flame 

10 retardants, teflon chemicals, and heavy metals 

11 that are present in my body. In fact, I have 

12 bearing levels of 39 of 84 industrial compounds, 

13 pollutants, and other chemicals tested including 

14 chemicals linked to reproductive health problems. 

15 No wonder my wife and I experienced infertility 

16 for 10 years.

17 I was tested for mercury and 

18 methylmercury, so I applaud you today for the 

19 actions you have taken to restrict the emission 

20 of mercury from our nation's coal-burning utility 

21 plants, and I urge you to act further, not just 

22 with this rule, on new plants, that is, new
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1 electric utility plants, coal-burning electric 

2 utility plants, but also on those in the future.

3 Why? Because, well, I have high levels 

4 of mercury in my body. In fact, I am in the 87 

5 percentile, only 13 percent higher mercury 

6 levels, and what the National Academy of Science 

7 says is that, well, there are mercury-driven 

8 risks for immune disorders and cardiovascular 

9 diseases.

10 We know that science is only now 

11 beginning to study the health impacts of chronic 

12 exposure to chemical mixtures. In genetics, 

13 timing and dose all play a role, but let's face 

14 it, what we have in this country are hundreds of 

15 thousands, daresay millions of people who have 

16 exposure to the same kinds of toxins that I have 

17 in my body, that they don't even know about, no 

18 idea.

19 So, I applaud you today for this first 

20 ever national industrial carbon pollution 

21 standard that will help reduce the effects of 

22 climate change that worsens smog and trigger 
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1 asthma attacks, such as my son had, and other 

2 health consequences such as the cardiovascular 

3 and respiratory problems that men and women my 

4 age have.

5 We all know our nation's air quality can 

6 be cleaned up, but no industry that pollutes it 

7 with toxic chemicals or carbon emissions in my 

8 opinion should be permitted to profit at the 

9 expense of public health. It's that simple.

10 More and more children, like my son, the 

11 elderly and baby boomers like myself will 

12 experience increasing life-threatening illnesses 

13 if those in Congress who care, by the way, those 

14 who among others say climate change is the 

15 greatest hoax ever perpetrated, this is a joke, 

16 my friends, and it is a lie -- if, that is, if 

17 these folks continue to protect themselves and 

18 their own campaign coffers and stymie your 

19 efforts, so I say, as a Presbyterian preacher and 

20 as someone who has been called by God to speak on 

21 these issues without any financial support or 

22 remuneration from environmental groups, I do it 
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1 because of my conviction, biblical convictions as 

2 an evangelical that we have to be stewards of 

3 God's creation.

4 I will finally close by saying that when 

5 we die -- I say it to all the groups I speak to 

6 -- God will not ask us how old the earth is, 

7 whether it was created in six days, or six 

8 billion years, he will instead say, as he should, 

9 "What did you do to be a steward of that which I 

10 gave you?"

11 Thank you very much. It is my pleasure 

12 to be here.

13 REV. McALLISTER: My name is Paul 

14 McAllister. I am a member of the Virginia 

15 Interfaith Power & Light group of Richmond, 

16 Virginia, that Richard has just spoken about. I 

17 am also a member of the Prince William County 

18 Ministerial Association. I am currently in my 

19 first term as a member of the Business Leadership 

20 and Resource Committee of the Church of God 

21 headquartered in Anderson, Indiana.

22 Furthermore, I was encouraged to share 
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1 with the Committee that I am not only a minister, 

2 was ordained, with pastoral experience for nearly 

3 20 years, but I am also an engineer of 22 years 

4 having done consulting with Fortune 100 and also 

5 the Federal Government for at least 22 years.

6 I am also speaking from a scientific 

7 perspective. I want to mention and will present 

8 to the Committee at a future date, a review 

9 article that was published by the Journal of 

10 Toxicology just this year.

11 It is entitled, "The Adverse Effects of 

12 Air Pollution on the Nervous System," and it is a 

13 thorough peer reviewed article that is worthy of 

14 this Committee's interest and consideration as it 

15 lists over 200 references regarding this issue, 

16 which fundamentally justifies and substantiates 

17 everything that has been said here today.

18 I want to voice my support for you and 

19 the Obama Administration as it seeks to maintain 

20 a fair and balanced clear air standards approach 

21 to improve public health and protect future 

22 generations from air pollution.
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1 I am alarmed by the callous 

2 insensitivity that many individuals seem to have 

3 towards power plant regulation. I am alarmed for 

4 the following reasons.

5 First, we should not wish to live in a 

6 fledgling nation where there is a deficit of 

7 clean breathing air for some, particularly those 

8 who are either very young or senior citizens or 

9 those who are most vulnerable based on other 

10 medical conditions.

11 Second, we should not continue to build 

12 a culture that devalues the abundant gift of 

13 healthy living at any cost simply to financially 

14 benefit any public or private enterprise. As our 

15 brothers and sisters keepers, we owe much more to 

16 one another.

17 In his recent book, George Soros, the 

18 billionaire and economist in financial turmoil, 

19 he argues that proponents for the efficient 

20 market hypothesis sincerely believed that if the

21 government would leave industry to its own 

22 devices, industry would always assure the optimum 
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1 allocation of resources and well-being of 

2 humanity.

3 However, this type of thinking, free 

4 from regulatory oversight such as what you are 

5 proposing today, eventually led to a global 

6 financial crisis from which our nation, even our 

7 world is yet to recover.

8 The parallels of this fiscal crisis to 

9 the issue at hand are quite obvious. While 

10 financial restitution to those adversely impacted 

11 by unavoidable catastrophes, natural disasters, 

12 and such, is indisputably our sense of moral duty 

13 to one another as citizens, there is no price of 

14 restitution that can atone for the robbery of 

15 another person's health and physical well-being 

16 if coal-fueled power plants are inadequately

17 regulated.

18 Robust regulatory measures that lead to 

19 cleaner and safer air quality and removal of 

20 unsafe pollutants from the atmosphere, may be 

21 controversial to some, but I can think of no 

22 better way to strengthen our economic prospects 
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1 as a nation than to insist upon social equity via 

2 clean air throughout all of our towns and cities 

3 and communities.

4 In closing, persons who attend church 

5 services are very familiar with Psalm 24, Verses 

6 1 and 2, where David says, "The earth is the 

7 Lord's and the fullness thereof, the world and 

8 they that dwell therein, for he hath founded it 

9 upon the seas and established it upon the 

10 floods."

11 When viewed through the lens of Genesis 

12 Chapter 1, Verse 28: which says that we should 

13 be fruitful and multiply and have dominion over

14 the earth, it truly begs the question who is 

15 mankind to de-establish and demolish the earth 

16 rather than protect it in the interest of all as 

17 an enjoyable habitation.

18 Our stewardship of the earth extends 

19 outward from our desire for independence and 

20 freedom toward everyone we know and also to those 

21 whom we do not know, and so with the hope and 

22 belief that we are bonded together in common 
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1 cause toward life, health, and prosperity, I 

2 encourage, applaud, congratulate the EPA's 

3 efforts to strengthen power plant standards and 

4 to reduce carbon dioxide emissions on behalf of 

5 billions of Americans or millions of Americans in 

6 this country and hopefully, the impact of this 

7 standard will be global in its impact as well.

8 Thank you.

9 MR. CULLIGAN: Excuse me. Richard, you 

10 had mentioned the tested mercury levels, the 

11 toxin testing that you had done, on the mercury 

12 levels, did they do any -- did they try to figure 

13 out what the source was? Like did you grow up a 

14 big fish eater, or did the study look at that?

15 MR. CIZIK: No. To the question, in the 

16 project, the Human Toxome project ascertained the 

17 origins of the mercury, not to my knowledge, but 

18 they gave me levels of both methyl mercury and 

19 mercury.

20 Interestingly enough, my levels were 

21 lower than that which have been established for 

22 impacting parts per billion, the infant in the 
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1 womb, lower than that, but nonetheless, 

2 significantly high enough to experience 

3 respiratory and other consequences.

4 So, in closing, to answer your question, 

5 no, but we do know that the evangelicals in 

6 particular, myself and others, have been speaking 

7 out on the impacts of mercury upon the unborn, 

8 and it is simply an outrage that anybody in 

9 Congress could call them themself a pro-lifer and 

10 tolerate this. But thank you for your question.

11 MR. CULLIGAN: Thank you.

12 Our next two speakers are Molly Rauch 

13 and Lisa Van Susteren.

14 MS. RAUCH: Good afternoon. I am Molly 

15 Rauch. M-O-L-L-Y, R-A-U-C-H. I live in 

16 Washington, D.C. I am speaking today as a 

17 representative of Mom's Clean Air Force, as a 

18 public health professional, and as a mom.

19 My daughter turned 9 just yesterday, and 

20 I have two boys, ages 6 and 4. I am grateful for 

21 the opportunity to speak with you today in 

22 support of EPA's proposed carbon rules.
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1 Mom's Clean Air Force is a community of 

2 moms united by concern over the effects of air 

3 pollution on our children. We read the health 

4 research on air pollution, and we have learned a 

5 lot about the health effects of breathing dirty 

6 air.

7 We know that in its many forms, air 

8 pollution has been linked to the major health 

9 problems of our time. We see that asthma attacks, 

10 heart attacks, heart disease, stroke, lung 

11 cancer, premature death, emergency room visits, 

12 hospital admissions, all of these health problems 

13 have been linked to air pollution.

14 Many of these problems harm our children 

15 in particular. We, at Mom's Clean Air Force, 

16 think that is unacceptable. I have with me in my 

17 red wagon and wish to submit the comments of more 

18 than 8,000 members of Mom's Clean Air Force in 

19 support of the proposed carbon pollution 

20 standard.

21 These moms, dads, and grandparents know 

22 that protecting our children means preventing 
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1 pollution. Carbon pollution is disrupting our 

2 planet's climate, causing temperatures to rise. 

3 These rising temperatures increase formation of 

4 ground level ozone or smog, which triggers 

5 asthma.

6 This is just one of the many health 

7 impacts that people will endure in a warming 

8 world. After reviewing a massive volume of 

9 research by leading climate scientists on smog 

10 formation and other climate impacts, EPA found 

11 that carbon pollution is a health threat for 

12 Americans.

13 I am here to assert that carbon 

14 pollution is a health threat especially for our 

15 children. Just last year I was personally 

16 affected by air pollution. I developed wheezing 

17 and respiratory symptoms and started using an 

18 inhaler and other medications.

19 I noticed that my symptoms are worse on 

20 days when the air quality around Washington, D.C. 

21 is poor. Doctors and scientists know that the 

22 high smog and particle pollution levels we have 
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1 here in D.C. and around the country can harm our 

2 lungs and trigger asthma attacks.

3 Because of my wheezing, I exercise less, 

4 I spend less time outside with my children, and, 

5 of course, I am very concerned about what 

6 pollution is doing to my children's lungs and 

7 whether they will develop asthma symptoms, too.

8 But I have it easy, very, very easy. I 

9 want to tell you about Rachel Lameyer Murphy. 

10 She has two children with asthma, she lives in 

11 Massachusetts, where wind currents carry 

12 pollutants from power plants, many of which are 

13 in other states, into her community, forming 

14 smog.

15 Her daughter Mia has such severe asthma 

16 that last year the blood vessels in her eyes 

17 burst from how hard she was coughing. Mia 

18 regularly has to take five-day courses of 

19 steroids for her asthma, which cause nightmares, 

20 outbursts, and uncontrollable tears.

21 Rachel says, and I quote, "Cleaning up 

22 air pollution from coal-fired power plants would 
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1 have a tremendous impact on my children's 

2 health."

3 Or the story of Chandra Baldwin Woods, 

4 whose son Jovante had a severe asthma attack 

5 almost two years ago at home in Ohio, and died at 

6 age 16. He was one of the more than 3,000 people 

7 who die of asthma every year.

8 Jovante was an athlete who had suffered 

9 from asthma since he was a baby. His sudden 

10 attack, which led to his death, is a horror to 

11 contemplate. Chandra says, and I quote, "Air 

12 pollution causes asthma attacks and cuts short 

13 the lives of those we love most."

14 Our blog is full of these stories, 

15 stories from Chandra, Rachel, and so many others. 

16 We need to do everything we can to prevent 

17 children like Jovante from dying, to prevent 

18 Mia's next severe asthma attack, to prevent the 

19 damage smog causes inside my children's lungs.

20 Reducing carbon pollution is a critical 

21 step toward protecting their health.

22 Our electric utilities claim, as you 
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1 have heard today, that they have given us cheap 

2 electricity, but for Jovante's mom, it could not 

3 have been more expensive.

4 Moms have a lot of experience cleaning 

5 up messes. We know that most children won't 

6 clean up their messes on their own, and neither 

7 will our power plants.

8 Our children deserve a well-regulated 

9 electric power industry that produces electricity 

10 from clean sources without destabilizing the 

11 climate, increasing smog levels, and the 

12 associated respiratory health problems, and 

13 causing other grave health effects of global 

14 warming.

15 It is EPA's job to set the rules that 

16 will give us the clean and safe power industry 

17 that all Americans and especially our children 

18 deserve.

19 Please finalize the carbon pollution 

20 rule for the sakes of our children.

21 Thank you for your time.

22 MR. CULLIGAN: Thank you, and you can, 
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1 if you don't mind, you can drop off the comments 

2 at the registration desk.

3 DR. VAN SUSTEREN: Lisa Van Susteren.

4 That's V-A-N S-U-S-T-E-R-E-N. I am with 

5 the Center for Health and the Global Environment 

6 at Harvard Medical School.

7 You have spent the last hours hearing 

8 about sea level rise, wildfires, storms, heat 

9 waves, droughts that turn lands to dust, and 

10 perhaps about climate refugees desperate, leaving 

11 their homes barefoot and hungry to go to new 

12 places that can't help them and don't want them.

13 I am a doctor, a psychiatrist. Should 

14 the EPA write an enforced policy to reduce our 

15 dead carbon emissions? Civilization is standing 

16 on the track, the train is coming. Should we get 

17 off the track? We have enshrouded ourselves in a 

18 world of pretense, really, going about our 

19 business, celebrating holidays, traveling to and 

20 from. We are not safe, and we are in denial 

21 about this.

22 As a physician, I assure you of the 
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1 physical toll, famine, the spread of infectious 

2 diseases, new deadly diseases, cancers, 

3 respiratory illnesses, cardiovascular problems, 

4 the statistics are there.

5 As a psychiatrist, the psychological 

6 toll, the cumulative effect on our psyches of

7 storm after storm, our world burning drought, 

8 now, and with mounting frequency, we will be 

9 riddled with anxieties, insecurities, our 

10 children frightened, those of us in the trenches 

11 in despair.

12 When posttraumatic stress disorder is no 

13 longer something the military alone confronts, 

14 but that the populace, as a whole, knows only too 

15 well, who will take care of us?

16 The CIA, the Pentagon have said climate 

17 change is a bigger threat to our national 

18 security than terrorism. We will be guilt 

19 ridden, furious at our leaders for their 

20 inaction, profoundly depressed, watching species 

21 disappear and our world lying in anguish.

22 What will this do to us? How will we 
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1 look in the eyes of the world? We will be 

2 pariahs. Where will we be safe? As a former 

3 psychological profiler for the Central 

4 Intelligence Agency, I fear gravely for our 

5 democratic way of life.

6 In times of peril, conflict and 

7 scarcity, people turn to what they perceive as 

8 strong leaders to protect them. People are 

9 willing to give up their freedoms in exchange for 

10 perceived security. Heaven help us from the 

11 tyrants who may be unleashed upon us.

12 Fight with all your hearts to save us 

13 from ourselves. Hear the anguished urgent cry, 

14 this is the 11th hour.

15 Thank you.

16 MR. CULLIGAN: Thank you.

17 Our last speaker on the list that I have 

18 at this point is Lisa Jacobson. 

19 MS. JACOBSON: Good afternoon. Lisa 

20 Jacobson. J-A-C-O-B-S-O-N. Thank you for the 

21 opportunity to participate in this public hearing 

22 today. My name is Lisa Jacobson, and I am the 
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1 president of the Business Council for Sustainable 

2 Energy.

3 The Council is a coalition of companies 

4 and trade associations from the energy 

5 efficiency, natural gas and renewable energy 

6 sectors.

7 Our coalition also includes independent 

8 electric power producers, investor-owned 

9 utilities, public power, commercial end users, 

10 and project developers and service providers for 

11 environmental markets.

12 The Council was founded in 1992 and 

13 advocates for policies that increase the use of 

14 commercially available clean energy technologies, 

15 products, and services.

16 Our diverse business membership is 

17 united around the revitalization of our economy 

18 and the creation of a secure and stable energy 

19 future for America. I would like to share five 

20 points with you this afternoon.

21 First, the Business Council for 

22 Sustainable Energy believes that energy 
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1 efficiency, renewable energy, and natural gas 

2 will be able to help our nation reduce emissions, 

3 grow the economy, create jobs, and strengthen our 

4 energy system in addition to being cost 

5 effective, compliance options.

6 Second, we support the science 

7 underpinning the greenhouse gas endangerment 

8 finding and EPA's continued use of Section 111 to 

9 the Clean Air Act to regulate greenhouse gas 

10 emissions.

11 That said, we believe the optimal policy 

12 for regulating greenhouse emissions is for 

13 Congress to enact a comprehensive market-based 

14 program that allows for flexibility and cost 

15 effective emission reductions including the use 

16 of carbon offsets.

17 Third, in evaluating EPA's proposal, we 

18 applaud the agency for adopting an output based 

19 approach. As we communicated to EPA in past 

20 comments, the Council has long supported the 

21 development and use of output-based emissions 

22 regulations as effective ways to enhance air 
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1 quality and encourage cost effective and 

2 efficient emission reductions.

3 The best way to limit emissions and to 

4 drive technological innovation is to ask 

5 facilities to produce more useful output per unit 

6 of pollution.

7 Fourth, building on the positive step 

8 for energy efficiency, EPA has the opportunity in 

9 the carbon pollution standard to encourage clean 

10 and efficient combined heat and power and waste 

11 heat recovery.

12 The proposal asks for comments 

13 specifically on CHP. We are working with our 

14 members to suggest ways that EPA could better 

15 account for, and encourage, useful heat output 

16 from CHP units to help comply with the proposed 

17 1,000 pounds per CO2 per megawatt hour standard.

18 There are also possibilities to credit 

19 on-site use of CHP generated electricity with 

20 avoided line losses which can be quite high at 

21 times of peak demand.

22 Today, in the EPA public hearing in 
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1 Chicago on the proposed standard, BCSE board 

2 member recycled energy development is speaking on 

3 these exact issues, and we urge you to take its 

4 recommendations into consideration.

5 Finally, over the past two years, there 

6 have been discussions on how EPA might guide the 

7 States in regulating existing sources through 

8 this NSPS. The Business Council for Sustainable 

9 Energy urges you to keep this in mind in 

10 finalizing the carbon pollution standard for new 

11 sources and devising the Federal guidelines that 

12 States must follow in their plans to cover 

13 existing power plants under Section 111(d).

14 The Business Council for Sustainable 

15 Energy supports an approach that allows States 

16 and tribes to show achievement of equivalence 

17 with prospective Federal Clean Air Act Section 

18 111(d) requirements through their own and 

19 cooperative regional climate, clean energy, and 

20 energy efficiency programs and policies.

21 To that end, EPA should establish the 

22 minimum stringency States must meet, but allow 
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1 States the flexibility to achieve greater 

2 reductions. For example, flexible market-based 

3 programs that allow for carbon offsets and 

4 emissions trading can drive down emissions at 

5 lower cost and encourage overperformance with 

6 reduction targets.

7 These are complicated issues, but it is 

8 central that facilities not face double 

9 regulation and that existing programs that work 

10 are allowed to continue achieving emissions' 

11 reductions at low cost while spurring clean 

12 energy development.

13 Again, thank you for the opportunity to 

14 speak with you today. The Council is working 

15 with its members in the coming months to submit 

16 full written comments on the proposed standards, 

17 and we look forward to working with EPA as this 

18 process moves forward.

19 MR. CULLIGAN: It sounds like you are 

20 likely to submit some pretty detailed comments on 

21 how we might be able to encourage more CHP. 

22 Certainly, the more detail you can get into on 
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1 how you think it works, the more detail you can 

2 get into on helping us understand how it would 

3 work and why it would work would be certainly 

4 helpful.

5 MS. JACOBSON: We are going to be 

6 striving for that, and also there are a set of 

7 other organizations that are focused specifically 

8 on CHP and waste heat recovery, and I know they 

9 will be submitting comments as well.

10 MR. CULLIGAN: Great.

11 MR. EVANS: The other thing I have is 

12 that point about the output basis. To the extent 

13 that you can speak to this particular regulation 

14 when you provide your comments regarding that 

15 perspective of your organization.

16 MS. JACOBSON: We would be happy to.

17 MR. CULLIGAN: Thank you.

18 Our next two speakers are Jim Dougherty 

19 and Christina Elles.

20 MS. ELLES: Christina,

21 C-H-R-I-S-T-I-N-A, Elles, E-L-L-E-S. I want to 

22 thank you for allowing me to testify today. I 
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1 know you have been sitting in this room for a 

2 couple of hours, and it's a long day, lots of 

3 folks talking about the importance of the 

4 standards, but I want to reiterate the fact that 

5 I hope that you are finding this day, as long as 

6 it might be inside, as inspirational and moving 

7 as I have found it.

8 This is one of two hearings and I know 

9 that there are millions of Americans who support 

10 carbon standards who cannot be here today. I 

11 want to talk a little bit. I am an outreach 

12 associate for the Union of Concerned Scientists, 

13 and we had some of our experts testify earlier 

14 today, but I want to reiterate that despite 

15 whether your a scientist, you are an economist, 

16 or health expert, millions of Americans support 

17 these standards and want to see climate action.

18 UCS had collected over 55,000 comments 

19 in support of the carbon standards, and we have 

20 seen an overwhelming response to this action 

21 alert. I just found out today that our carbon 

22 petition web site is the number one web site on 
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1 our entire web site, which is big.

2 Out of all the web pages on our entire 

3 site, people, the number one click that they are 

4 going to is to submit a comment to EPA, and that 

5 was very touching to hear and find out today.

6 A couple of weeks ago UCS had a 

7 conference call for our entire network, and over 

8 1,200 people RSVP'd to learn more about the 

9 carbon pollution standards, and EPA's very own 

10 Gina McCarthy was on that call, and hundreds of 

11 UCS activists and experts joined to learn more 

12 about the carbon standards.

13 I think what was most touching to me was 

14 after the fact, we got a few e-mails from folks 

15 who were so happy to hear from EPA officials and 

16 also from Heather Zichal from the White House, to 

17 learn that our Federal Government is actually 

18 taking action and steps to protect our health and 

19 our environment from climate change.

20 I just wanted to pass that along that 

21 people are very excited to see this happen.

22 Last week, UCS had an event for young 
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1 scientists, and as I was standing around with 

2 these folks who are newly minted Ph.D.'s, newly 

3 minted Masters of Science, and all sorts of 

4 backgrounds, some of them were baffled when I 

5 told that we are not taking steps to actually 

6 limit carbon pollution.

7 Many of us inside the beltway know that 

8 the climate bill failed, that we haven't taken 

9 yet steps, but the fact that we do not yet have 

10 limits on industrial power plants that are 

11 emitting carbon pollution, their jaws dropped to 

12 the floor.

13 Immediately, as I said that, I passed 

14 out comment postcards, and they all signed them, 

15 they all took stacks home with them to pass them 

16 out to their friends and to their coworkers, and 

17 there is just this overwhelming sense that we 

18 need to get this done.

19 The polls have showed that Americans 

20 want the EPA to protect our health and to protect 

21 the health of their children from carbon 

22 pollution, and we know that it is not just the 
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1 polls, but now with the overwhelming support from 

2 the comments, that this is to be true, I hope 

3 that the EPA will take steps to not only reduce 

4 carbon pollution from new sources, but also from 

5 existing sources, and again I thank you for your 

6 time today.

7 MR. CULLIGAN: Thank you.

8 MR. DOUGHERTY: Good afternoon. My name 

9 is Jim Dougherty. I am a member of the Board of 

10 Directors of the Sierra Club. On behalf of the 

11 club and its 1.3 million members and supporters, 

12 I am here to express strong support for the 

13 proposed regulations.

14 In an effort to minimize my carbon 

15 footprint, I bicycled over here. The summer has 

16 already begun apparently.

17 Let me read from my prepared statement, 

18 if I may. The science before us is conclusive. 

19 Climate change is real, it is happening, and it 

20 presents enormous threats to our way of life as a 

21 sign of well-being.

22 A warmer world will mean more extreme 
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1 weather, damage via wildfires to our private 

2 property and public lands, water shortages and 

3 the associated reduced crop yields, and increase 

4 in pest populations and a higher prevalence of 

5 insect-spread diseases, and intensified 

6 precipitation events, such as hurricanes, storm 

7 surges, and flooding.

8 Additionally, doctors and nurses tell us 

9 that as temperatures rise, so will the instances 

10 of smog-induced asthma and a respiratory illness. 

11 In areas like my home here in D.C., where a 

12 disproportionately high number of children suffer 

13 from asthma, a warmer planet means reduced public 

14 health, more lives lost, and an increased burden 

15 on our already strapped health care service 

16 program.

17 It will also hurt our economy by costing 

18 us billions of dollars in damages. As the 

19 Supreme Court recognized in the case of 

20 Massachusetts V. EPA, greenhouse gases are 

21 pollutants that threaten public health and the 

22 environment.
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1 But it is one thing to recognize a 

2 problem and it is another to address it. It has 

3 now been five years since the decision in Mass V. 

4 EPA, and it is high time that EPA move forward as 

5 it is now doing to reduce carbon pollution and to 

6 hold industrial polluters accountable for the 

7 carbon pollution they spew into our air.

8 Let this be the end of the era in which 

9 big polluters are given a free pass to poison our 

10 communities, and let it represent a new beginning 

11 for American innovation and clean energy 

12 production.

13 As EPA is well aware, the United States 

14 emits more carbon pollution per capita than any 

15 developed country. This must change. The 

16 automotive and truck fuel economy standards 

17 proposed by EPA represent an important first step 

18 toward a clean energy future.

19 A vital second step is the regulation 

20 that we consider today. These regulations must 

21 be promulgated promptly.

22 Let me close on a personal note. I 
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1 worked for the agency in the '70s and the '80s 

2 and the '90s, so I had first hand involvement in 

3 EPA's efforts to roll out the major environmental 

4 initiatives in our country's history including 

5 the Clean Air Act, Clean Water Act, Hazardous 

6 Waste Control, and the rest.

7 Not once in 40 years has EPA ever 

8 proposed a regulatory program that subsequently 

9 was judged by the American people to have been 

10 too expensive or onerous or to have gone too far.

11 The industry lobbied in every case. 

12 They said, oh, catalytic converters will make 

13 automobiles unaffordable, stack gas scrubbers 

14 will double the cost of electricity, hazardous 

15 waste management will create backlogs, and all of 

16 it was bull.

17 In fact, the lesson that we took away 

18 from all of these examples was that we didn't go 

19 far enough. In every case we have had to go back 

20 or Congress had to go back, close loopholes, 

21 strengthen the standards, and in every case, we 

22 have near unanimous agreement on the part of the 
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1 American public that we moved in the right 

2 direction.

3 So, please, I urge you not to pull your 

4 punches on what may be the most important 

5 regulatory initiative in the agency's history.

6 Thank you.

7 MR. CULLIGAN: Thank you both, and I do 

8 want to say in response to how you started your 

9 talk, Christina, that I think I speak for 

10 everyone on this panel and I think probably in 

11 the other room, as well as Chicago, that we all 

12 appreciate the opportunity to be sitting on these 

13 panels, and we appreciate, frankly, the effort 

14 that people put into writing their comments and 

15 making it here.

16 We have one more speaker at this point, 

17 Quentin James.

18 MR. JAMES: Hello. My name is Quentin 

19 James spelled Q-U-E-N-T-I-N, James, J-A-M-E-S.

20 I am going to read from some prepared 

21 remarks, but thank you all for having these 

22 hearings and allowing the voices of the American
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1 people to be heard, we really appreciate that.

2 Again, my name is Quentin James, and I 

3 am the national director for the Sierra Student 

4 Coalition, the youth arm of the Sierra Club.

5 I am also proud to serve as a national 

6 board member for the NAACP.

7 At the Sierra Club, working with more 

8 than 13,000 high school and college students, our 

9 mission is pretty simple, is to train, empower, 

10 and organize the next generation of leaders in 

11 the environmental movement.

12 A great many of the youth said that we 

13 work with, I work with, are members of the Sierra 

14 Student Coalition, because they enjoy the 

15 country's great outdoors and wild places.

16 They are hikers, campers, anglers, 

17 hunters, swimmers, beach goers, skiers, and 

18 snowboarders. They share a common purpose in the 

19 Sierra Club's mission to explore, enjoy, and 

20 protect the planet.

21 Unfortunately, air pollution often 

22 hinders our ability to be outside, and it is 
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1 particularly pertinent for young people suffering 

2 from asthma and other respiratory diseases. We 

3 know that approximately 20 million Americans 

4 suffer from asthma, and we know that children are 

5 more likely than adults to have asthma.

6 Ozone or smog is the leading cause of 

7 asthma attacks. It contributes to missed school 

8 days, increased uses of medicine, and trips to 

9 the hospital and emergency rooms.

10 Further, scientists tell us that carbon 

11 pollution, which contributes to hotter days in 

12 summers, leads to increased ozone pollution and 

13 thereby more days when it is unsafe for many 

14 young people to even be outside.

15 So, simply put, young people are 

16 uniquely affected by carbon pollution, and they 

17 are also uniquely aware that environmental and 

18 ecological challenges are facing our country.

19 Most of them have literally seen climate 

20 disruption in their lifetimes and they are keenly 

21 aware of the fact that if not addressed, today's 

22 environmental problems could become tomorrow's 
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1 environmental catastrophes, that they and their 

2 children will be forced to live with.

3 When I talk to students across the 

4 country, the feedback is clear. They know 

5 climate disruption is happening. In fact, 

6 polling tells us that in greater numbers than any 

7 other age group, young people age 18 to 29 

8 consider a warming planet a serious problem.

9 They know climate disruption means 

10 increased respiratory health issues, such as 

11 childhood asthma, because of more asthma-inducing 

12 smog. They know climate disruption means an 

13 increasingly less secure world, both domestically 

14 because of extreme weather, and globally because 

15 of dwindling resources.

16 They know that if we thrive economically 

17 in a changing and constantly advancing world, we 

18 must decrease our dependence on dangerous dirty 

19 fuels and increasingly turn to home-grown 

20 renewables, and they know that the time to act is 

21 now, that we must support steps, such as the new 

22 carbon pollution standards, to get America back 
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1 on track, putting the next generation to work and 

2 staving off the worst effects of the climate 

3 crisis.

4 In closing, I want to again reiterate 

5 that the Sierra Student Coalition stands with the 

6 EPA on the carbon pollution standard for existing 

7 power plants, and we strongly encourage the 

8 Administration to continue to act to protect our 

9 health, economic future, and environmental 

10 quality by addressing the very real threat of 

11 carbon pollution.

12 Thank you very much.

13 MR. CULLIGAN: Thank you. With that, we 

14 are going to, I believe we do not have anybody 

15 else, so we are going to adjourn for a break, and 

16 we will back at 5:30 to hear any remaining folks. 

17 We do have I know a number of people already on 

18 the schedule.

19 With that, like I said, we are going to 

20 adjourn until 5:30.

21 [Recess from 4:36 to 5:38 p.m.]

22 MR. CULLIGAN: Good evening. Thank you 
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1 for attending this public hearing. My name is 

2 Kevin Culligan and I am an Associate Division 

3 Director with our Sector's Policy and Program 

4 Division of EPA's Office of Air Quality Planning 

5 and Standards, which is part of our Office of Air 

6 Radiation.

7 I am joined at the table by two of my 

8 colleagues from the Office of Air Radiation, Jim 

9 Ketcham-Colwill, and Laura Strine.

10 We are here today to hear your thoughts 

11 on the "Carbon Pollution Standard for New Power 

12 Plants," that the agency proposed. The proposal 

13 came out in the Federal Register on April 13th of 

14 this year.

15 The proposal is a common-sense approach 

16 to controlling CO2 emissions, greenhouse gas 

17 emissions from new power plants.

18 For future plants EPA is proposing that 

19 they need to meet a standard of 1,000 pounds of 

20 CO2 per megawatt hour. It does not apply to 

21 existing sources, it also does not apply to 

22 planned units that have permits that commence 
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1 construction with a year of April 13th, 2012.

2 The standard will continue a trend 

3 towards building cleaner generation, and is 

4 consistent with the types of generation that 

5 power companies are typically building today.

6 We will be accepting oral comments on 

7 all aspects of our proposal. We do have a court 

8 reporter who will be preparing a transcript that 

9 will go into the official docket for the 

10 rulemaking.

11 In addition, we are accepting written 

12 comments. Written comments can be provided to the 

13 agency through June 25th, 2012. I believe there 

14 are still copies of directions for how written 

15 comments can be submitted. They can either be 

16 submitted by mail, fax, or e-mail, and out at the 

17 desk where you registered or passed on your way 

18 in, there is an explanation of what you do to 

19 submit those. We will consider all the comments 

20 as we move to finalize the rule.

21 I would like to talk through the 

22 procedures that we are going to use as people 
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1 testify.

2 I will be calling the scheduled speakers 

3 up in groups of two. When I call you up, if you 

4 can sit at that table and take turns obviously 

5 speaking.

6 We would ask that the first person stay 

7 seated while the second person speaks. After 

8 both of you speak, the three of us may ask a 

9 follow-up question.

10 In order to be fair to everyone, we are 

11 trying to limit people to five minutes. We have 

12 had a pretty packed day so far, and we used 

13 pretty much all of the allotted time in both the 

14 morning and the afternoon sessions. We do 

15 encourage and people were very good about it, we 

16 encourage you all to help us with that, that we 

17 limit the testimony to five minutes.

18 In order to make that happen, what we 

19 will be doing is Jim is running our time system, 

20 and as soon as you start speaking, Jim will start 

21 the timer. You will see a green light go on, and 

22 that green light will stay on for the first four 
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1 minutes of your testimony.

2 Then, a yellow light will come on 

3 alerting you that you have one minute left. The 

4 yellow light will stay on for a minute and then 

5 at five minutes, your red light will go on, and 

6 shortly thereafter if you have not finished, you 

7 will see me leaning to the mike in an attempt to 

8 gently prod you to let the rest of the folks here 

9 who would like to also talk about the rule have a 

10 chance.

11 One more thing. We are scheduled to end 

12 at 8:00 p.m. tonight. If we do have other 

13 people, we will try to accommodate everyone we 

14 can this evening. If you haven't registered to 

15 speak yet, and you would like to, you can go out 

16 to the table outside and get your name on the 

17 list.

18 With that, let's get started for the 

19 evening.

20 Our first two speakers are Ms. Michalska 

21 and Boyd Walker. The other thing I did forget to 

22 mention, for the benefit of our court reporter, 
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1 when you start speaking, if you could say your 

2 name, spell it, and then if you do have any 

3 affiliation that you would like us to know about, 

4 announce that, too, so that it gets into the 

5 public record. We would appreciate it.

6 You are welcome to start.

7 MS. MICHALSKA: Good evening. Gerri 

8 Michalska here, a citizen concerned about the 

9 environment, public health, why be retrograde 

10 when we can be in the forefront.

11 Dirty and unhealthy fossil fuel, time to 

12 go, inertia and status quo, time to go. Climate 

13 change is the biggest global health threat of the 

14 21st century. A major report on managing the 

15 health effects of climate change, launched 

16 jointly by the Lancet and the University of the 

17 City of London today say that climate change is 

18 the biggest global health threat of the 21 

19 century.

20 The UCL team focused on key areas, 

21 patterns of disease and mortality, food security, 

22 water, and sanitation, shelter and human 
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1 settlements, extreme events and population 

2 migration, all of the above is what is happening 

3 now.

4 Professor Costello from UCL says that 

5 the big message of this report is that climate 

6 change is a health issue affecting billions of 

7 people now, not just an environmental issue about 

8 polar bears and deforestation.

9 The impact will be felt, not just in the 

10 UK, but all around the world; not just in some 

11 distant future, but in our lifetimes and those of 

12 our children.

13 Carbon pollution causes climate change, 

14 whose rising temperatures worsen health-harming 

15 air pollution. Fossil fuel fired power plants are 

16 responsible for 40 percent of manmade carbon 

17 dioxide emissions.

18 Fossil fuels also account for more than 

19 80 percent of U.S. global warming pollution. 

20 Global warming, if unchecked, threatens to 

21 fundamentally change the planet that has 

22 sustained our civilization. In the U.S., we are 
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1 already seeing some of the effects - wildfires 

2 tearing through western states, devastating 

3 floods in the Midwest, and historic droughts in 

4 the Southeast.

5 Carbon and air pollutants like toxic 

6 mercury and dirty soot from coal plants are 

7 linked to asthma attacks, lung disease, and 

8 urological disorders. Do we want this? Do we 

9 need this? No, enough.

10 The toll from coal, coal pollution in 

11 the United States results in more than 100 

12 billion annually in house costs. Do we want 

13 this? Do we need this? No, time to go.

14 Then, we have what a Stanford University 

15 study directly links carbon dioxide emissions to 

16 increase human mortality. The study concludes 

17 that each increase of 1 degree Celsius or 1.8 

18 degree Fahrenheit caused by carbon dioxide would 

19 result in air pollution that would lead annually 

20 to about 1,000 more deaths.

21 Do we want this? Do we need this? No, 

22 time to go.
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1 Then, we have here asthma. Asthma was 

2 responsible for 3,384 deaths in the United States 

3 in 2005, and it is increasing rather than 

4 decreasing.

5 So, I believe that it is apparent to all 

6 of us here that intervention ASAP is called for 

7 to stop this road to oblivion.

8 The solutions: What is not to like by 

9 Greenpeace. With current technology, renewable 

10 energy sources like wind, solar, and geothermal 

11 can provide 96 percent of our electricity, and 98 

12 percent of our total heating demand, accounting 

13 for almost all of our primary energy demand.

14 Investing in renewables could jump start 

15 our flagging economy, creating millions of jobs 

16 that can't be shipped overseas. It could put the 

17 U.S. back at the forefront of the 21st century 

18 economy in front of China, which in 2009 became 

19 the largest global investor in renewables.

20 Additionally, we also have to improve 

21 our energy efficiency as Europe, for example, far 

22 outpaces us and therefore, we can fill in the gap 
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1 of our energy needs with a better standard of 

2 energy efficiency.

3 So are we going to lead the world 

4 community or follow in the wake of countries like 

5 Germany and even China?

6 It is time to get ahead of the curve and 

7 break the change of inertia and status quo. Yes, 

8 fossil fuel industries will go kicking and 

9 screaming off the main stage, but alas and alack, 

10 they have already long overstayed their welcome.

11 The tide is turning as the heartland 

12 institutes most recent conclave of climate change 

13 deniers last week is slated to be the last. The 

14 public outcry overcame their concerted farce at 

15 keeping retrograde policies in effect.

16 MR. CULLIGAN: Try to wrap up.

17 MS. MICHALSKA: Five minutes is up?

18 MR. CULLIGAN: Yes.

19 MS. MICHALSKA: Oh, no. Can't I say one 

20 last thing?

21 MR. CULLIGAN: Yes.

22 MS. MICHALSKA: Justin Hoffman in 1967 
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1 said plastics; in 2012 I say renewables. For my 

2 friends in the fossil fuel industry, renewables. 

3 There is millions more jobs than in the fossil 

4 fuel industry, and your children will be proud of 

5 you if you do that. Do the right thing.

6 MS. STRINE: Before you go, could you 

7 just please spell your name? Thank you.

8 MS. MICHALSKA: G-E-R-R-I 

9 M-I-C-H-A-L-S-K-A.

10 MR. CULLIGAN: Thank you. If you want 

11 to give us a written copy, so it all gets in, you 

12 can certainly do that.

13 MS. MICHALSKA: To you or to him?

14 MR. CULLIGAN: It actually goes to the 

15 folks upfront, but if you want to just leave it 

16 here, it will get there.

17 MR. WALKER: Thank you. I am Boyd 

18 Walker. My name is B-o-Y-D, W-A-L-K-E-R.

19 For over the last 100 years, we have 

20 lived in a carbon-based economy. For the next 

21 100 years, we will be in a carbon-constrained 

22 economy. Then, we might have to live without 
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1 carbon fuels at all without constraints on much 

2 carbon we put into the atmosphere, we will not 

3 only run out of this resource, but be unable to 

4 breathe our air and drink our water.

5 I know as I live within a mile of 

6 coal-fired power plant. It has been the center 

7 of controversy since two citizens produced a 

8 report showing that the plant was producing 

9 particulate matter that was harmful to citizens.

10 Why did they suspect that there was a 

11 harmful substance being emitted from the Potomac 

12 generating plant in Alexandria, once owned by 

13 Mirant, but now owned by the GenOn Corporation? 

14 Because every morning they woke up to dust on 

15 their window sills or on their cars, and wondered 

16 where it came from.

17 The source was obvious and probably from 

18 some vantage points in D.C., you can see the 

19 stacks that from 1949 have generated power, but 

20 have also been a powerful generator of 

21 pollutants.

22 The plant said that they do not have 
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1 large particles and they do not have small 

2 particles without measuring the particles in 

3 between.

4 But the obviousness that the plant 

5 emitted something was on the stacks themselves, a 

6 kind of skirt to catch the particles before they 

7 fell back into the plant.

8 It was not until 1989 that they were 

9 even granted a special use permit. Before, they 

10 had been a nonconforming use, and they were not 

11 even regulated.

12 After Elizabeth Chimento and Poul 

13 Hertel's report came out, two citizens who lived 

14 nearby the plant, there have been steady efforts 

15 to close the plant. Their permits have been 

16 attempted to be revoked, and their ability to 

17 operate limited.

18 In 2007, I spoke in front of the 

19 Virginia State Department of Environmental 

20 Quality, which was having hearings on how the 

21 plant should be regulated, and a solution was 

22 found - build smokestacks that were higher, so 
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1 the plumes would blow farther, just far enough to 

2 be outside Alexandria. Then, the citizens might 

3 stop complaining. Thankfully, those taller 

4 stacks were never built, but this one plant has 

5 become the poster child for why there is no such 

6 thing as clean coal.

7 You can put a chemical like tar on the 

8 tron end, but it also might have bad effects, 

9 that have not been studied enough. You can use 

10 steam to catch the particles, but this was never 

11 implemented, and there are two other parts of 

12 running a coal plant that you cannot see from 

13 Washington, D.C., that have an effect in other 

14 parts of the country.

15 First, the coal has to come from 

16 somewhere and probably comes from Mountaintop in 

17 West Virginia, which are ruining streams and 

18 valleys.

19 Secondly, coal does not burn clean 

20 through, but leaves ash, and this ash is put in 

21 an ash pit somewhere far outside Alexandria. I 

22 am sure the disastrous ash pits in Tennessee a 
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1 couple of Christmases ago has already been 

2 mentioned. So, if we are not polluting our 

3 waterways and our air when we remove the coal, 

4 but when we burn it, we risk damage when we put 

5 the waste in an ash pit.

6 Coal is not the energy source of the 

7 future. In just a few short months, thanks to 

8 the Sierra Club, Major Michael Bloomberg from New 

9 York, and all the people in Alexandria who worked 

10 on this, our coal-fired power plant will close, 

11 but all the work and the clean air that we will 

12 regain will be negated if new coal-fired power 

13 plants open in other parts of Virginia like Wise 

14 County or in Surry County on the beautiful Isle 

15 of Wight.

16 I would rather see wind turbines on the 

17 mountains if they are still there, and across our 

18 seas if they are still clean than one more 

19 coal-fired power plant built.

20 Thank you.

21 MR. CULLIGAN: Thank you.

22 Our next two speakers are Jim Casey and 
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1 Henry Hamburger.

2 Just a reminder to remember to spell 

3 your name for the court reporter.

4 MR. CASEY: Good afternoon. My name is 

5 James F. Casey, J-A-M-E-S, F, C-A-S-E-Y. I am 

6 Professor of Economics at Washington and Lee 

7 University in Lexington, Virginia. My primary 

8 area of teaching and research is environmental 

9 economics and policy.

10 Today, on behalf of the Union of 

11 Concerned Scientists, I would like to express my 

12 support for the standards to limit carbon 

13 emissions from new power plants. I hope the EPA 

14 will move quickly to finalize and implement 

15 limits on carbon emissions from new power plants, 

16 and then take the next critical step and issue 

17 standards to reduce carbon emissions and all 

18 greenhouse gas emissions from all existing power 

19 plants.

20 In the brief time I have this afternoon 

21 I will explain why I advocate this set of 

22 actions. Let me start with a quick question. 
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1 What did Paul Krugman, the Nobel Prizewinning 

2 economics professor at Princeton University and 

3 Gregory Mankiw, Professor of Economics at 

4 Harvard, who currently serves as advisor to Mitt 

5 Romney, and is the author of a bestselling 

6 economics textbook, have in common?

7 Aside from having Ph.D.'s in economics, 

8 not much. One might even argue that they 

9 currently represent the polemics of liberal and 

10 conservative economic thought, yet they both want 

11 to regulate and reduce greenhouse gas emissions, 

12 and they are not alone. I certainly stand with 

13 both of them on this policy objective.

14 In fact, in April of 1997, more than 

15 2,000 economists signed the Economist Statement 

16 on Climate Change. Again, in March of 2010, more 

17 than 2,000 scientists and economists including 

18 myself and several of my colleagues at Washington 

19 and Lee University endorsed the Union of 

20 Concerned Scientists' call for swift and deep 

21 cuts in greenhouse gas emissions.

22 Why? Because adherence to standard 
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1 economic theory recognized the negative side 

2 effects generated by greenhouse gases, which 

3 predisposes them to favor strong environmental 

4 protection.

5 It is true that economists generally 

6 believe free markets are the most efficient way 

7 to direct consumption and investment decisions as 

8 long as prices are right.

9 Unfortunately, energy markets get the 

10 prices wrong. Producers and consumers do not pay 

11 for the damage of burning the fuels traded in 

12 these markets. Due to the sometimes massive 

13 external costs, prices are set inefficiently low 

14 and pollution levels, particularly greenhouse gas 

15 emissions, are inefficiently high, much too high.

16 Internalizing the externalities 

17 associated with carbon emissions is an important 

18 step toward creating a more efficient economic 

19 system. Additionally, according to a 2009 report 

20 from the World Coal Association, climate change 

21 is a global challenge and requires a concerted 

22 global response.
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1 The world can be set on course to a 

2 sustainable energy future provided we make the 

3 necessary investments in policy decisions. By 

4 choosing to set limits on the amount of carbon 

5 emitted from power plants, the Environmental 

6 Protection Agency is beginning to set such a 

7 course. Not only will the limits reduce future 

8 emissions, but they provide the incentive for the 

9 private sector to make the necessary investments 

10 to reduce the negative environmental footprint 

11 that characterizes our current economic behavior.

12 Climate change has already altered our 

13 environment, and with it, patterns of disease. 

14 Let me be very clear. This is a scientific fact, 

15 it is not in dispute. Those that claim climate 

16 change has had little, if any, substantive impact 

17 are ignoring the scientific evidence on this 

18 topic.

19 Unfortunately, no one is more vulnerable 

20 to the adverse health consequences that accompany 

21 climate change generated by greenhouse bases than 

22 young children. In recent years, they have had 
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1 to battle an increasing number of respiratory 

2 illnesses, allergies, infections, 

3 immunosuppressive disorders, just to name a few, 

4 this according to the Center for Health and 

5 Global Environment at Harvard University.

6 We cannot continue to allow for the 

7 unregulated release of greenhouse gases into our 

8 atmosphere. The United States must take the lead 

9 in the battle to reduce the costs and impacts 

10 associated with climate change especially the 

11 cost being placed on our children.

12 The new EPA carbon standards are a 

13 critical step toward reducing the effects of 

14 climate change and protecting public health. 

15 Thus, the time has come to support EPA in its 

16 important work to protect and ensure the health 

17 and safety of our nation.

18 Thank you very much.

19 MR. CULLIGAN: Thank you.

20 MR. HAMBURGER: My name is Henry 

21 Hamburger. Henry is spelled H-E-N-R-Y. Hamburger 

22 is spelled as in hamburger.
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1 I am a member of the Union of Concerned 

2 Scientists, Emeritus Professor of Computer 

3 Science at George Mason, and formerly, and more 

4 to the point, a tenured mathematical social 

5 scientist at the University of California at 

6 Irvine, where I once worked in a field of crucial 

7 relevance to the issue now before EPA, the study 

8 of the multi-person Prisoner's Dilemma game 

9 originated by three people independently in 1973, 

10 according to Elsevier's Dictionary of 

11 Psychological Theories.

12 One got a Nobel Prize in Economics, 

13 another was the James Awardee in Psychology one 

14 year, and the third one is me. I will state the 

15 lessons learned from this field and relate them 

16 to the need for regulation specifically with 

17 regard to carbon pollution.

18 Before I do that, I just want to say I 

19 absolutely agree with everything everybody said 

20 here, and this is just a little background about 

21 externalities, I guess you could say, negative 

22 externalities.
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1 Game theories about interacting 

2 decisions, Prisoner's Dilemma was originally a 

3 game with two people, for example -- and I am 

4 going to take this example, throw out the 

5 Prisoner's and just do the Dilemma.

6 For example, two strangers sit in 

7 separate rooms -- this is actually the way 

8 empirical studies are done, in separate rooms 

9 without the ability to communicate.

10 Each gets an initial stake of $10 -- I 

11 mean depending on how wealthy the scientist is 

12 who is doing this -- to keep or maybe not. Each 

13 is offered an additional $10. If one of them 

14 takes it, that costs the other one $15. That is 

15 the negative externality, and vice versa.

16 So, each has two options, take it or 

17 leave it. No matter what you think the other 

18 person will choose, you do best by taking the 

19 offered extra amount, but if both of you say yes, 

20 you are both worse off, 20, 10 + 10, minus the 15 

21 the other one costs you. Then, if each took the 

22 initial stake.
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1 So, individual rational choice defeats 

2 the common good.

3 Here are 10 lessons learned from the 

4 game called "multi-person, Prisoner's Dilemma."

5 One, many real-life situations have this 

6 decision structure, most notably --

7 Two, situations involving pollution. 

8 Results may involve money, health, and other 

9 things people like to have --

10 Four, the numbers matter, the amount of 

11 money, the degree of lost health, communication 

12 matters --

13 Six, voluntary uncritical cooperation is 

14 for suckers --

15 Seven, with increasing numbers of 

16 players, cooperation gets harder and harder to 

17 achieve.

18 We actually did studies with three 

19 players and with seven players back in the day. 

20 It really does happen, you can't achieve 

21 cooperation without something.

22 Governments can restructure a situation 
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1 to induce better outcomes.

2 Nine, a nation sets up the game that 

3 businesses play

4 Ten, nations are also players in a 

5 global game where the rules are three.

6 Here are three real known solutions to 

7 real problems structured like this is the 

8 multi-person's Dilemma.

9 One, congestion charge in urban centers.

10 Two, enforce nonproliferation of nuclear 

11 weapons.

12 Three, government regulation of carbon.

13 So, the way I see it, you are not only

14 legal, you are right. EPA is right to have a 

15 carbon pollution standard, but I think you can do 

16 more.

17 Five things worry me. If any of them is 

18 something that you are already dealing with, 

19 great. I mean if these are not valid criticisms, 

20 that's terrific.

21 One, fracking is carbon pollution that 

22 is huge, upstream, and as far as I can tell, 
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1 ignored here.

2 Sequestration is a long-term risk, it is 

3 huge, it is downstream, and apparently ignored 

4 here.

5 Old utilities, where is the pressure to 

6 replace them?

7 Four, non-utilities and small utilities 

8 exempt. Exemption promotes subdividing and 

9 decentralizing.

10 Five, the averaging rule, there is no 

11 accountability as far as I can tell until after 

12 the 11th year. I don't know, if I am wrong, so 

13 be it.

14 Thank you.

15 MR. CULLIGAN: Thank you.

16 MR. HAMBURGER: Did you guys have 

17 questions?

18 MR. CULLIGAN: I could find out on your 

19 five, you know, certainly those are all 

20 worthwhile things to comment, and there are 

21 things that it is helpful for us to think about.

22 On the fifth one, the way we have set 
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1 up, and we actually take comments on different 

2 ways to deal with the issue, but there is -- the 

3 30-year average is actually done through a series 

4 of one year averages, so the one-year averages 

5 would be enforceable.

6 MR. HAMBURGER: Yeah, but the first 10 

7 years it is very high. They allow increase in 

8 the first 10 years, for it is only in the 11th 

9 year that you begin to get a handle on something 

10 that really matters. That is my point.

11 MR. CULLIGAN: Right. Point taken.

12 The next two speakers are Sara Chieffo 

13 and Kathleen Mogelgaard. I am sure I butchered 

14 both of those, and I apologize in advance.

15 MS. CHIEFFO: Good evening. My name is 

16 Sara Chieffo, spelled S-A-R-A, C-H-I-E-F-F-O.

17 I am here tonight to encourage the 

18 Environmental Protection Agency to finalize this 

19 year its proposal to place the first national 

20 limits on industrial carbon pollution from power 

21 plants.

22 I am here today as a concerned citizen, 
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1 as an asthma sufferer, and as the legislative 

2 director for the League of Conservation Voters.

3 LCV's mission is to turn environmental 

4 values into national priorities. LCV's members 

5 are spread throughout the country, and we work in 

6 close partnership with a network of over 30 

7 State-based Leagues of Conservation Voters.

8 LCB was founded in 1970, the same year 

9 that the Republican President Richard Nixon 

10 created the EPA, and also signed the landmark 

11 Clear Air Act into law.

12 As an asthma sufferer, whose attacks are 

13 worst on smog-filled, hot summer days, this 

14 proposal means a great deal to me personally. I 

15 live here in the Nation's Capitol, and we have 

16 some of the worst air quality in the country.

17 As I am sure you have heard today from 

18 doctors, nurses, scientists, and other experts 

19 who warn us that carbon pollution threatens 

20 public health and is especially damaging to 

21 vulnerable populations like children and the 

22 elderly.
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1 This is because climate change's rising 

2 temperatures are likely to make smog pollution 

3 worse, triggering asthma attacks and even 

4 permanently damaging children's developing lungs.

5 Consistent with the United States 

6 Supreme Court's decision, this agency, the EPA, 

7 in 2009, formally recognized these and other 

8 health threats posed by climate change in its 

9 determination that global warning pollution 

10 threatens human health and the environment.

11 Power plants are the largest source of 

12 carbon pollution in the United States and right 

13 now these polluters are free to dump an unlimited 

14 amount of carbon pollution into our air.

15 EPA's proposal would, for the first 

16 time, impose national limits on the amount of 

17 carbon pollution that these power plants built in 

18 the future can emit. These limits translate into 

19 a roughly 60 percent reduction in carbon 

20 pollution when compared with today's coal-fired 

21 power plants.

22 The EPA's proposal is a common sense 
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1 measure that will protect public health, spur 

2 innovation and clean technologies, and start us 

3 down the needed path to stop unabated global 

4 warming.

5 It will help ensure the current market 

6 trends toward a cleaner, safer, and more modern 

7 power sector continue. Cleaning up and 

8 modernizing the power sector will also create 

9 much needed jobs.

10 This proposal is not without precedent. 

11 Many States have taken similar steps, and the 

12 standard also builds on the successful actions of 

13 the EPA in partnership with the Department of 

14 Transportation, have taken the reduced carbon 

15 pollution from the nation's fleet of cars.

16 I am honored to be part of the over 1.4 

17 million positive comments that have been already 

18 submitted to the EPA in support of this public 

19 safeguard. With over a month yet to go in the 

20 public comment period, this total already 

21 represents the highest number of comments the EPA 

22 has ever received.
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1 In closing, I would just like to 

2 reiterate my support for this proposal and to 

3 encourage the EPA to finalize a strong carbon 

4 pollution rule this year.

5 Thank you for this opportunity to 

6 testify.

7 MR. CULLIGAN: Thank you.

8 MS. MOGELGAARD: Good afternoon and 

9 thank you for providing this opportunity for 

10 public input.

11 My name is Kathleen Mogelgaard, 

12 K-A-T-H-L-E-E-N, M-O-G-E-L-G-A-A-R-D. I am a 

13 resident of Washington, D.C., and I have a 

14 long-standing interest in environmental policy. 

15 I received Master's degrees in public policy and 

16 natural resources from the University of 

17 Michigan, and I currently work as an independent 

18 consultant on science and policy issues.

19 For the past two years, I have taught a 

20 course on climate change and energy policy to 

21 undergraduates at the University of Maryland. In 

22 that process, my students read technical reports 
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1 on climate change science and climate change 

2 impacts. They learned about prospects for energy 

3 efficiency and renewable energy development, and 

4 they spoke with guest lecturers from the Federal 

5 Government about the challenges and opportunities 

6 in the Federal system for advancing clean energy 

7 future and mitigating climate change.

8 My students learned the basic science 

9 that carbon pollution is contributing to global 

10 average temperature increase. They learned that 

11 the United States has contributed the most of any 

12 country to the carbon pollution that is causing 

13 this temperature increase, and they learned that 

14 in the United States, the electricity generation 

15 is the biggest source of carbon pollution.

16 My students also read the U.S. Global 

17 Change Research Program's recent report about the

18 impacts that climate change is having on the 

19 United States - severe weather, sea level rise 

20 and storm surge, more agricultural pests, and the 

21 health risks associated with extreme heat and 

22 declining air quality.
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1 Students wrote about how these changes 

2 are already affecting their lives and the lives 

3 of their families. In class, when we discussed 

4 the projected growth in greenhouse gases and 

5 carbon pollution, many voiced their fears about 

6 what the future might look like if these trends 

7 don't change.

8 We talked about how to respond to these 

9 challenges, analyzing possibilities for reducing 

10 carbon pollution at individual, State, national, 

11 and international levels.

12 Student quickly realized how critical 

13 Federal Government action is. They recognize 

14 that individual and State action can only get us 

15 so far, and how international progress on climate 

16 change has been stymied by a lack of Federal 

17 action.

18 Not surprisingly, many of my students 

19 are frustrated at the slow pace of Federal 

20 action. After studying climate science and 

21 impacts, and especially after viewing a film in 

22 which they watched an old man on the Pacific 
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1 Island of Keravis, a country with almost no 

2 carbon pollution, dragging boulders by hand to 

3 create a sea wall to protect his family's home 

4 from sea level rise and storm surge.

5 After seeing that image, and others like 

6 it, many students are somewhat bewildered that 

7 the U.S. Government has yet to impose any limits 

8 on carbon pollution from power plants.

9 It is for their sake and my own that I 

10 want to voice my support for the currently 

11 proposed rule that would limit carbon pollution 

12 from future power plants. Such limits represent 

13 an important step in the direction our country 

14 needs to head, toward a future in which we 

15 continue to innovate and prosper with cleaner 

16 energy sources that don't threaten our house, 

17 that don't wreck our agricultural systems and 

18 strain our water supplies, and that don't 

19 inundate our coast lines and the coast lines of 

20 others around the world who have not contributed 

21 to this problem.

22 The proposed carbon pollution standards 
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1 for future power plants do signal that we are 

2 serious about addressing our climate change and 

3 energy challenges and that we are ready to lead, 

4 and that we do indeed care about the future we 

5 are leaving to our young people.

6 Thank you for this opportunity to share 

7 my views.

8 MR. CULLIGAN: Thank you very much.

9 Our next two speakers are Doug Ouse and 

10 Brenna Muller.

11 MR. OUSE: My name is Doug Ouse, and I 

12 am from Towson, Maryland. I am here to speak out 

13 in favor of carbon pollution limits on industry 

14 today. When we look at our nation and the world 

15 today, it is easy to see why we need a carbon 

16 pollution standard, because this standard will 

17 not only clean up the carbon pollution, it will 

18 also clean up the industries that emit other 

19 toxic substances into the air.

20 These include dirty soot, mercury, and 

21 smog from coal-fired power plants that induce a 

22 wide range of ailments especially asthma. As 
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1 someone who has a history of asthma, I am very 

2 interested in seeing how our standards for clean 

3 air, including carbon pollution limits.

4 An estimated 680,000 people in the 

5 Baltimore, Washington, and Northern Virginia 

6 areas suffer from asthma. With the population of 

7 this area at about 7.46 million, that puts the 

8 asthma rate at 9 percent, and I just read an 

9 article published last week on Medical Daily's 

10 web site that said asthma rates rose by 15 

11 percent from 2001 to 2010 alone.

12 In 2007, just that year, asthma cost the 

13 American economy $56 billion. People had to take 

14 over 14 million days off of work and 10 1/2 

15 million days missed from school due to asthma in 

16 2008 according to data from the U.S. Centers for 

17 Disease Control and Prevention.

18 In 2009, there were 3,400 deaths due to 

19 asthma, and U.S. hospitals had to handle almost 

20 480,000 cases of asthma that year, and pollutants 

21 that accompanied the carbon emitted into the air, 

22 also causes cardiovascular disease in the elderly 
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1 and neurological ailments.

2 We must also limit this carbon pollution 

3 to curb global warming. Last summer, Texas 

4 experienced a historic drought and heat wave that 

5 spawned an unprecedented wildfire system. Ten 

6 people lost their lives to this heat and these 

7 fires, and about 2,900 homes were destroyed.

8 Closer to home, we have had more 

9 100-degree temperatures the last two years than 

10 we have had during the previous 20 years combined 

11 according to my memory.

12 We just had probably the first ever 

13 winter here where there were no daytime highs 

14 below the freezing point of 32 degrees 

15 Fahrenheit. This all is evidence of global 

16 warming.

17 Public polls consistently show that 

18 Americans do not trust industrial polluters to 

19 police themselves or industrial claims that 

20 tougher environmental regulations will cost jobs.

21 I personally think that these safeguards 

22 benefit the economy as companies make new 
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1 investments in equipment which will spur the 

2 growth of hundreds, if not thousands, of small 

3 businesses. All this makes it necessary for the 

4 EPA to step in with this standard to limit all 

5 new power plants to 1,000 pounds of carbon 

6 pollution or less per megawatt hour.

7 MR. CULLIGAN: Thank you.

8 MS. MULLER: Good evening. My name is 

9 Brenna Muller, B-R-E-N-N-A, M-U-L-L-E-R. Thank 

10 you for the opportunity to testify in strong 

11 support of the national carbon pollution 

12 standard.

13 I am testifying today because I am 

14 concerned about the extreme health impacts and 

15 the dangers of climate disruption caused by 

16 carbon pollution from coal-fired power plants.

17 I grew up outside of New Haven, 

18 Connecticut, where there is a disproportionately 

19 high asthma rate, and the ozone grade is F. I 

20 have many friends who suffer from asthma, most of 

21 whom are the first people in their families to 

22 have had asthma.
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1 I am also especially concerned about the 

2 extreme climate disruption of which carbon 

3 pollution is the primary contributor, such as 

4 severe weather, sea level rise, and agricultural 

5 disruption.

6 In my opinion, these rules are long 

7 overdue. American citizens are counting on the 

8 EPA to protect them from dangerous carbon 

9 pollution. EPA's industrial carbon pollution 

10 standards for power plants are a historic step 

11 towards modernizing the way we power our country.

12 So, I would just like to reiterate my 

13 support for the proposal and thank you for the 

14 opportunity to testify this evening.

15 MR. CULLIGAN: Thank you very much.

16 Our next two speakers are Seth Heald and 

17 Alycia Ashburn.

18 I would just actually like to take a 

19 minute to thank everybody who has taken the time 

20 both to prepare testimony and to come here and 

21 give it. I know that it takes a lot of effort on 

22 all of your parts, and we really do appreciate 
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1 you all taking the time to come here and tell us 

2 what you think of the rules.

3 MR. HEALD: Good evening. My name is 

4 Seth Heald, S-E-T-H, last name H-E-A-L-D. I am 

5 here today to voice my strong support for the 

6 EPA's proposed new greenhouse gas standards for 

7 electric generating units.

8 In recent years, as I have learned more 

9 about climate change and the carbon dioxide 

10 emissions that cause it, I have grown 

11 increasingly concerned at our nation's lack of 

12 meaningful effort to reduce carbon emissions.

13 We have known for decades that we need 

14 to move away from carbon-intensive fuels, but 

15 business and government have not done nearly 

16 enough to deal with this.

17 The EPA is charged with protecting 

18 Americans from pollution that adversely affects 

19 our health. The vast majority of Americans 

20 support this mission. Carbon pollution is a 

21 serious threat to our health and welfare and the 

22 proposed greenhouse gas standards are a small, 
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1 but important step towards the goal of protecting 

2 us from climate disruption.

3 The proposed standards are actually 

4 quite modest and quite overdue. They will not 

5 affect coal-burning power plants that are already 

6 in service or under construction.

7 The standards simply acknowledge the 

8 scientific reality that our nation cannot afford 

9 to build any new coal-fired power plants unless 

10 and until the electric power industry comes up 

11 with a workable method of capturing and 

12 sequestering carbon emissions and there is no 

13 such method in sight.

14 I am a member-owner of the Rappahannock 

15 Electric Cooperative in Virginia, which, in turn, 

16 is a member-owner of the Old Dominion Electric 

17 Cooperative in Virginia, also known as ODEC. 

18 That makes me a utility owner, so I am a utility 

19 owner here speaking out in favor of these 

20 regulations.

21 As an active Cooperative member, I have 

22 taken seriously my role both as an electricity 
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1 consumer and as a utility owner. I have sharply 

2 reduced my electricity consumption through a 

3 combination of conservation and efficiency 

4 measures while also installing solar panels to 

5 provide almost all of the power that I do need.

6 ODEC's management, unfortunately, 

7 persists with an ill-advised plan to build a huge 

8 new coal plant in Virginia notwithstanding strong 

9 opposition to that throughout the State and 

10 strong scientific evidence that coal burning is 

11 the leading cause of climate change.

12 Yet, ODEC engages in only the most 

13 modest and superficial efforts to invest in 

14 efficiency or carbon-free renewable energy 

15 sources. We can and must do better for the sake 

16 of ourselves, our children, and generations to 

17 follow.

18 The coal industry and some short-sighted 

19 utilities spending large sums to challenge the 

20 proposed greenhouse gas standards. They claim 

21 that coal is clean while ignoring the fact that 

22 coal plays a major role in changing the earth's 
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1 climate.

2 Those changes will last for thousands of 

3 years. Americans cannot afford to ignore coal's 

4 role in climate disruption. The EPA's proposed 

5 standards are sound, science-based measures to 

6 protect Americans.

7 I commend the EPA for proposing these 

8 standards and urge that they be implemented as 

9 soon as possible, and in closing, I thank the 

10 three of you for listening, and I thank you and 

11 your colleagues for the important work you do to 

12 help protect Americans from pollution.

13 MR. CULLIGAN: Thank you.

14 MS. ASHBURN: Good evening. My name is 

15 Alycia Ashburn. A-L-Y-C-I-A, A-S-H-B-U-R-N.

16 My presence and my testimony here today 

17 in support of the EPA's new source standards for 

18 carbon pollution is just as much a religious and 

19 personal act as it is a professional one.

20 While I am here wearing my work hat as 

21 director of the Creation Care Campaign at 

22 Sojourners, one of the nation's largest network 
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1 of Christians Committed to Social Justice, I wear 

2 my many other hats at the same time - U.S. 

3 citizen, Christian, congregation member and 

4 trainer for Lutherans Restoring Creation, 

5 biologist, wife, daughter, runner, national park 

6 lover, and last, but certainly not least, 

7 especially in this context, asthma sufferer.

8 I wasn't born with asthma, in fact, one 

9 could argue that it was at least in part an 

10 occupational hazard that led to it. When my love 

11 of God's creation led me to graduate school, I 

12 spent many hours, days, and months in plots of 

13 trees fumigated with ozone and carbon dioxide, 

14 studying insects living in those trees and the 

15 impact of air pollution on their communities.

16 Even though I wore a breathing mask as 

17 much as possible, I still developed asthma. I 

18 know it's ironic, right? My study of air 

19 pollution led to my own personal health battle 

20 with it.

21 Ironic for me maybe because I chose my 

22 field of study, but not ironic for so many others 
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1 in the U.S. Upon publicizing this EPA rule and 

2 urging Sojourners' members to submit comments via 

3 our web site, over 3,300 people of faith have 

4 responded and more continue every day.

5 Some of them have shared their very 

6 personal ongoing battles with air pollution and 

7 here are just a few examples. From Thomas in 

8 Tulsa, Oklahoma, "As a chronic asthmatic, clean 

9 air is not just a nice thing to have, it' a 

10 matter of life and death."

11 From William in Ames, Iowa, "I lost a 

12 dear brother a few months ago to asthma due to a 

13 lifetime in a polluted, smoggy city. We must get 

14 our priorities straight and support such rules 

15 that will enhance the possibility of the 

16 generations yet to come for having sustainable 

17 clean air. Please stay the course."

18 From Linda in Sault Ste. Marie, 

19 Michigan, "I totally encourage you to adopt these 

20 emission standards. I lived south of a coal-fired 

21 power plant for 10 years and know firsthand the 

22 impact it had on the local environment. Every 
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1 north wind brought a new layer of gray dust on 

2 and into my house. My family had repeated upper 

3 respiratory infections. When the company planted 

4 foliage on the coal piles and covered the 

5 unloading blooms from the freighters, air quality 

6 improved. Additional regulations can only help 

7 more."

8 From Calvin in Norman, Oklahoma, "When I 

9 lived in Conneaut, Ohio, and Ponca City, Ohio, 

10 power plants would release their pollutants into 

11 the air after midnight. It made my wife and 

12 older son so sick we had to move from both places 

13 on doctor's orders. That should not be allowed. 

14 Please make our health and the earth's health a 

15 top priority."

16 From Michael In North Hartford, 

17 Connecticut, "I am a working family physician and 

18 see the effects of pollution on a daily basis. I 

19 wish my job were easier. Please help make it 

20 so."

21 From Wyatt in Indiana, "In Indianapolis, 

22 the heart of a major coal power generation State, 
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1 air quality still detrimentally affects children 

2 who attend schools near energy-generating 

3 stations."

4 From Young Tyler in Lancaster, 

5 Pennsylvania, "It would be great to have clean 

6 air to breathe. I breathe every day, and it 

7 would be great if we can improve air quality so 

8 my mom, brother, and friends don't suffer from 

9 asthma."

10 From Sandra in Mount Joy, Pennsylvania, 

11 "I am supporting this new role from the EPA 

12 because breathing clean air shouldn't be a choice 

13 or a talking point. It is essential to our 

14 health. What kind of country would hurt its own 

15 citizens just so polluters can have their way? 

16 It unconscionable and also immoral. Clean air 

17 and clean water shouldn't be a privilege, it's a 

18 right of every American and every human being."

19 These are folks who have Internet access 

20 and enough time to write in and share their 

21 stories. Whose stories are not hearing? How 

22 about those who don't have access to health care? 
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1 I have great health insurance and access to 

2 affordable medication, but so many do not.

3 I will leave you with two quotes, 

4 because I could bring my hats here today, but so 

5 many couldn't.

6 Thank you for listening to all of them. 

7 You can read more on the SOJO web site. 

8 SOJO.NET. We are adding more to the blog every 

9 day.

10 Dr. Marlene from Worthington, Ohio. "We 

11 can't sacrifice public health to cheap energy. 

12 And what is cheap? For all the people in our 

13 country, children, adults, old persons who have 

14 trouble breathing, my religion teaches our duty 

15 to respect and love our environment as God's 

16 creation for sustaining our lives. It is ungodly 

17 to contaminate, and it is also bad environmental

18 policy to sacrifice the breath of life to the 

19 greed of certain economic-driven interests. Stop 

20 the pollution, please."

21 From Dr. Charlotte in Auburn, Alabama. 

22 "I am a Christian who is a scientist by 
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1 profession. As a physical chemist by training, I 

2 spent a teaching career of more than 30 years 

3 trying to teach students not only the laws by 

4 which the natural world operates, but the 

5 necessity of our being good stewards of the only 

6 planet ever likely to be available for human 

7 habitation. I support the efforts of the EPA to 

8 maintain the environment of the home God has 

9 given us by maintaining the quality of land, 

10 water, and air necessary for our survival and 

11 that of our fellow species on earth."

12 Thank you.

13 MR. CULLIGAN: Thank you.

14 Our next two speakers are Jessica 

15 Christy and Allison Donnelly.

16 MS. CHRISTY: My name is Jessica 

17 Christy. It is J-E-S-S-I-C-A, C-H-R-I-S-T-Y. I 

18 would like to start today by thanking you for 

19 allowing public comment on this rule. I am an 

20 asthma sufferer, and it has affected me in many 

21 different ways, and I appreciate you listening.

22 There is a certain thing in my house 
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1 that if you get the cadence and the rhythm just 

2 right, it elicits a smile from me, my husband, 

3 and my oldest son. Let me tell you how it goes.

4 "No, mama, no mama, no mama, no." You 

5 can even like do a little dance when you say it, 

6 and I am sure you are wondering what this has to 

7 do with carbon emissions, so let me tell you.

8 I live in Washington, D.C. with my 

9 husband and my three children, age 10, 3, 18 

10 months. My oldest son has struggled with asthma 

11 for the past 7 years, and this stuff is really 

12 the reason why I am here to testify on behalf of 

13 limiting carbon emissions.

14 Currently, my son's asthma is well 

15 controlled. We visit the doctor every three 

16 months like clockwork in order to ensure his 

17 asthma maintenance medication is working like it 

18 should. We get refills for his emergency 

19 medications, his inhaler, and we discuss 

20 different ways to minimize asthma triggers.

21 However, there was a time when his 

22 asthma was not so well controlled, and we have 
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1 been in the hospital overnight on more than one 

2 occasion. One of those times is worst asthmatic 

3 attack and is an especially vivid memory for me.

4 My second child James was just two weeks 

5 old at the time, and my oldest son began having 

6 some trouble breathing. He had a dry, 

7 unproductive cough and I could see that his skin 

8 sinking down between his ribs with every breath 

9 that he took.

10 Retractions is what I would later learn 

11 they are called. His doctor's office sent him to 

12 the emergency room after several nebulizer 

13 treatments failed to raise his oxygen level.

14 The ER admitted him into the hospital 

15 overnight when several more treatments failed to 

16 raise his oxygen levels back to normal. My 

17 husband stayed overnight with our son. The next 

18 afternoon I brought our two-week-old, who was 

19 nursing at the time, to the hospital, so that my 

20 husband could go home and shower and brush his 

21 teeth.

22 By the time my husband returned to the 
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1 hospital, the decision was made that he needed to 

2 stay another night, and he had also gotten a 

3 roommate another boy around 5 years old. Around 

4 10:00 that evening, the other boy's mother showed 

5 up to the room. It incited a round of demands on 

6 the part of the boy and his mother meeting those 

7 demands with soothing words, and finally, the boy 

8 shouting, "No, mama, no mama, no mama, no" for 

9 the next 10 minutes until the nurse finally 

10 entered the room and suggested turning off the 

11 light.

12 I can smile when I think about it now, 

13 thinking about being in that hospital room with 

14 my family and trying to sleep, and having this 

15 young child scream because he is so tired and he 

16 is so in distress from his troubled breathing, 

17 but in the moment I was terrified.

18 After watching my son sleep after he had 

19 been on albuterol treatments for several hours, 

20 it became clear just how much of a struggle it 

21 was for him to take just a small breath in and 

22 out.
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1 I still have the peak flow meter that 

2 they gave us at the hospital, and if you are not 

3 familiar with it, you make a seal around it with

4 your mouth, and you blow as hard and as long as 

5 you can, and red means you are in trouble, yellow 

6 means you need to watch out, green means that you 

7 are in the clear.

8 Without putting a seal on this, I can 

9 blow to the top. My son, when he is at his 

10 worst, has trouble making it out of the red. You 

11 can see just how much their small lungs are 

12 affected by triggers such as carbon emissions.

13 You can see how clearly my son's asthma 

14 affected me. It's a constant part of my life, 

15 every time I leave the house I have to make sure 

16 I am prepared. But let me tell you about another 

17 vivid memory of mine.

18 During the Thanksgiving in 2007, before 

19 this trip to the hospital, my husband and I took 

20 a 3-day trip t the Florida Keys. It was an 

21 amazing trip. We drove on the overseas highway 

22 from Miami down to mile marker zero on Route 1.
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1 The next day we took a boat trip to a 

2 small chain of islands about 70 miles west of Key 

3 West called Dry Tortugas. It was a wonderful 

4 opportunity to learn about and appreciate both 

5 Civil War era history as well as the fascinating 

6 ecosystem that is the coral reef.

7 We toured the fort there and snorkeled 

8 in the coral reefs. Other visitors got a permit 

9 and were able to camp on the beach overnight. 

10 The trip wasn't all good. I didn't appreciate 

11 the roosters crowing at 3:00 in the morning after 

12 the bars close, and if I had a choice, I would 

13 have passed on watching several people on the 

14 boat get seasick due to rough waters, but I 

15 wouldn't trade those memories for anything.

16 It is memories like our trip to Dry 

17 Tortugas that I would like to continue to make 

18 with my family, and that is why I am asking you 

19 to limit carbon emissions, so that I don't have 

20 to start panicking as soon as I hear that dry, 

21 unproductive cough.

22 Please help me protect my children's 
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1 growing lungs. James and Mary, my two little 

2 ones have never experienced the difficulty that 

3 comes from an asthma attack and breathing, and I 

4 would like to try to keep it that way.

5 I know I cannot protect my children from 

6 all harm, but I am depending on the EPA to help 

7 me protect my children's lungs from harmful 

8 carbon emissions. Please put the health of my 

9 children and children across the United States 

10 first when setting limits on carbon emissions.

11 MR. CULLIGAN: Thank you.

12 MS. DONNELLY: Good evening. My name is 

13 Allison Donnelly, A-L-L-I-S-O-N, D-O-N-N-E-L-L-Y.

14 I am a rising junior at Duke University, 

15 and I am originally from Appleton, Wisconsin. 

16 The current pollution standard is important for 

17 all of us, which is why you have heard today from 

18 public health professionals, businesses, 

19 environmental organizations, economists, faith 

20 groups, mothers, and concerned citizens in 

21 support of the rule.

22 I am here representing a voice and an 
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1 age group that isn't often included in these 

2 hearings, college students. Like every other 

3 American, we have a stake in this, a 

4 responsibility to be informed and the right to 

5 speak up. We understand the health consequences 

6 of both pollution and climate change. We 

7 understand from basic economics concepts like 

8 externalities, how damages from pollution can end 

9 up costing us far more than what we actually pay.

10 We also understand the messaging coming 

11 from the other side. Complying with the rule 

12 will cost the electric power sector more money to 

13 build and operate, and therefore, lose jobs and 

14 hurt the economy.

15 But this is far outweighed by the 

16 positive economic impacts, a factor which has 

17 been greatly understated and also affects us. 

18 The job rhetoric applies just as much to college 

19 students as to the rest of the country and 

20 potentially even more.

21 When my friends in the class of 2012 

22 graduate, or when I graduate in 2014, we enter 
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1 the work force in full for the first time, and 

2 every single one of us is worried about finding 

3 work.

4 The unemployment rate for workers under 

5 age 25 is 16.4 percent, twice as high as the 

6 national average. Also, notably, the 

7 underemployment rate for recent college graduates 

8 is 19.1 percent over the last year according to a 

9 recent report by the Nonpartisan Economic Policy 

10 Institute.

11 We students have ideas and the knowhow 

12 to put them to good use, and we as members of an 

13 overeducated and underemployed work force will 

14 therefore tend to gravitate towards areas where 

15 we see progress and growth, areas where 

16 investments have sparked innovation.

17 The carbon pollution standard will do 

18 just this, spark innovation. It will create 

19 high-paying jobs for an educated work force to 

20 develop and implement new technologies to provide 

21 clean, reliable power.

22 A March 2012 report by the Economic 
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1 Policy Institute stated that investments towards 

2 cleaning up and modernizing power plants would 

3 create 90 more jobs than it would displace.

4 For example, the report analyzed the 

5 EPA's finalized mercury and air toxic standards 

6 and estimated that the rule would create 117,000 

7 new jobs. Investments in clean technologies for 

8 power plants would further spur one of the 

9 fastest growing industries worldwide, the clean 

10 energy sector.

11 In the last seven years, investments in 

12 U.S. clean energy have increased 600 percent, and 

13 the industry already employs 2.7 million 

14 Americans according to the reports by the Pugh 

15 charitable trusts and the Brookings Institute 

16 respectively.

17 This generation of current students is 

18 not bound to the view that traditional coal is 

19 how we have always done things, and that is how 

20 we are going to continue.

21 In our lifetimes, we have seen massive 

22 strides with cleaner technologies, and we see no 
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1 need to hold onto outdated technology simply 

2 because alternatives represent a change to the 

3 status quo.

4 We will be the ones in a few years 

5 taking those massive strides in innovation 

6 ourselves. Therefore, we call on the EPA to 

7 enact the first ever carbon pollution standard 

8 for new power plants to reduce pollutants that 

9 should not be in our air in the first place, and 

10 spark innovation and new, cleaner technologies 

11 that will create jobs.

12 We, the future American work force are 

13 counting on it.

14 Thank you.

15 MR. CULLIGAN: Our next two speakers are 

16 Rhett Buttle and Dr. Lilia Abron.

17 MR. BUTTLE: My name is Rhett Buttle, 

18 R-H-E-T-T, last name Buttle, B-U-T-T-L-E, sort of 

19 like Gone with the Wind, but not exactly.

20 Good evening. As I said, my name is 

21 Rhett Buttle. I am the national government 

22 affairs director for Small Business Majority. 
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1 Thank you for having me tonight.

2 Small Business Majority is a national 

3 nonpartisan, small business advocacy 

4 organization. We are founded and run by small 

5 business owners. We represent the 28 million 

6 Americans who are self-employed or own small 

7 businesses.

8 We conduct extensive opinion and 

9 economic research and work with our rapidly 

10 growing network of small business owners from 

11 across the country to ensure that their voices 

12 are an integral part of the public policy debate.

13 Small businesses across the country are 

14 working to pull us out of the economic doldrums, 

15 and in that process, they continue outperforming 

16 large businesses in the face to put America back 

17 to work.

18 But if we are to harness 100 percent of 

19 small business' support as job creators, the 

20 government must do its job to support them. 

21 Small businesses have the potential to try the 

22 economy around, but they need smart policies to 
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1 help them do so, and implementing stronger carbon 

2 pollution standards under the Clean Air Act can 

3 help.

4 By concentrating their efforts on 

5 raising the requirement new power plants must 

6 meet, legislators can help entrepreneurs 

7 innovate, better their bottom lines and give the 

8 boost they need to rebuild America.

9 We know this from our research. In two 

10 scientific opinion polls, Small Business Majority 

11 has commissioned over the past year, we found 

12 that America's entrepreneurs want pragmatic 

13 innovative policies that help guide them into 

14 competitive clean energy economy.

15 Just last month we were at least opinion 

16 polling in six States that found that the vast 

17 majority of small business owners, 71 percent 

18 believe government investments in clean energy 

19 play an important role in creating new jobs in 

20 boosting our economy.

21 That support remains strong despite the 

22 fate of Solyndra, a company that received a $535 
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1 million loan guarantee from the Federal 

2 Government prior to filing bankruptcy last year.

3 In our poll, a majority, 6 in 10 owners 

4 agreed that Solyndra's failure doesn't mean the 

5 government should stop investing in renewable 

6 energy. Turning to the specific standard 

7 proposed by the EPA to limit carbon emissions 

8 from new power plants, we have consistently found 

9 powerful and enduring support for this rule among 

10 small business owners.

11 Our recent 6-State poll, which surveyed 

12 small business owners in Colorado and Michigan, 

13 Nevada, Ohio, Pennsylvania, and Virginia, 

14 revealed that more than three-quarters of them, 

15 or 76 percent, are in favor of the EPA 

16 determining Federal limits on power plant 

17 emissions and greenhouse gases like carbon 

18 dioxide, methane, and nitrous oxide.

19 So, unwavering is the support that a 

20 majority of these entrepreneurs would still back 

21 the standards even if it meant a possible 

22 increase in the utility rates. Fifty-six percent 
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1 said that utility price increase wouldn't deter 

2 their support for these standards.

3 In addition, 57 percent believed the 

4 EPA's regulation of carbon pollution and other 

5 emissions will impact their own businesses, which 

6 goes to show just how big of a game changer these 

7 standards can be for many small businesses.

8 Those strong poll findings are 

9 consistent with the results of our national poll 

10 that we conducted last summer. We asked more 

11 than 1,000 small business owners across the 

12 country how they view EPA standards under the 

13 Clean Air Act and if they would curb carbon 

14 emissions from power plants and other major 

15 emitters.

16 The results directly mirrored our six 

17 people, 76 percent of respondents said they favor 

18 this kind of standard, and what is more, 43 

19 percent strongly favor it.

20 In that poll, 6 in 10 of the individual 

21 small business owners said that the regulation of 

22 carbon emissions would impact their business 
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1 directly. They said it would impact it in a good 

2 way, which again reinforces the magnitude and the 

3 significance of economic benefits small 

4 businesses will see if the EPA can fully 

5 implement the carbon pollution standard for new 

6 power plants.

7 Not only will it strengthen standards, 

8 put the United States on a path to a more 

9 innovative, competitive economy, but also small 

10 business owners and consumers will save money 

11 over the long term that can be reinvested in jobs 

12 and growing the economy.

13 We support the EPA's proposed carbon 

14 pollution standard because it will be good for 

15 small businesses and our economy.

16 Thank you.

17 MS. ABRON: Good evening. My name is 

18 Lilia Abron, L-I-L-I-A, A-B-R-O-N.

19 I am the owner of a small business here 

20 in Washington, D.C. Thank you for having me here 

21 today.

22 My business was founded in 1978 and we 
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1 are headquartered right here. We are an 

2 environmental engineering consulting firm meaning 

3 that our primary intent is to improve the 

4 environment and to do so in a way that helps 

5 sustain a strong economy.

6 We have done a tremendous amount of work 

7 for EPA in helping to provide sustainable and 

8 efficient solutions to various environmental 

9 issues.

10 One of our major ongoing projects in the 

11 District presently addresses the reduction and 

12 mitigation of greenhouse gas emissions in the 

13 built environment.

14 As a small business owner who has dealt 

15 directly with the issue at hand, and who has been 

16 in the consulting business for nearly 35 years, 

17 perhaps since the industry began, I can assure 

18 you that supporting the Environmental Protection 

19 Agency standard to limit carbon emissions from 

20 power plants would do a great deal to give small 

21 businesses more opportunities in the green 

22 economy and our national economy a much needed 
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1 financial boost.

2 Small businesses like mine, and perhaps 

3 all small businesses, for that matter, regardless 

4 of what industry they are in, have the potential 

5 to help turn the economy around, but what we need 

6 are smart policies to facilitate that process, 

7 implementing stronger carbon pollution standards 

8 under the Clean Air Act can help.

9 We are proud to say that we are a member 

10 of the 71 percent of the small businesses that 

11 support this, and about 10 percent of our 

12 business now focuses on the reduction of 

13 greenhouse gases in urban areas and the 

14 implementation of sustainable low carbon 

15 footprint human settlements in developing 

16 countries.

17 The support from entrepreneurs for the 

18 Clean Air Act has been so steadfast that 56 

19 percent said they would still back the rule even 

20 if it meant a possible increase in their utility 

21 bills.

22 In addition, small businesses like mine 
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1 say that we believe that the EPA's regulation of 

2 carbon pollution and other emissions would impact 

3 their businesses positively, that truly 

4 highlights how significant these standards could 

5 be for the small business sector.

6 The carbon pollution standard for new 

7 power plants will help the United States become 

8 more competitive in the global economy, but more 

9 importantly it will have positive impacts at a 

10 local level here at home, because small 

11 businesses like me will have new project 

12 opportunities, and that new income over a long 

13 term will be used to reinvest in our businesses 

14 and create and maintain jobs, and contribute to 

15 the economic growth of our city and our country.

16 One of my business goals is to help make 

17 Washington, D.C. one of the greenest cities in 

18 the world, and I support EPA's proposed carbon 

19 pollution standard because it will help me 

20 achieve that goal.

21 Thank you. Thank you for this 

22 opportunity.
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1 MR. CULLIGAN: Thank both of you. 

2 Rhett, are you going to submit more detailed 

3 written comments?

4 MR. BUTTLE: Yes.

5 MR. CULLIGAN: I assume you will be 

6 attaching all those, the more detailed poll 

7 results, and stuff? Thank you very much.

8 MS. ABRON: Thank you.

9 MR. CULLIGAN: Our next two speakers are 

10 Ross Eisenberg and Beth Kemler.

11 MR. EISENBERG: Good evening. My name 

12 is Ross Eisenberg, R-O-S-S, E-I-S-E-N-B-E-R-G. I 

13 am vice president of Energy and Resource Policy 

14 for the National Association of Manufacturers.

15 The NAM is the largest industrial trade 

16 association in the U.S., representing over 13,000 

17 small, medium, and large manufacturers in all 50 

18 states.

19 The NAM is the leading voice for the 

20 manufacturing economy in Washington, D.C., which 

21 provides millions of high wage jobs in the U.S. 

22 and generates more than $1.7 trillion in PDP.
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1 In addition, two-thirds of any NAM 

2 members are small businesses, which serve as the 

3 engine for job growth. Our mission is to enhance 

4 the competitiveness of manufacturers and improve 

5 American living standards by shaping a 

6 legislative and regulatory environment conducive 

7 to U.S. economic growth.

8 We appreciate the opportunity to provide 

9 comments today at this hearing.

10 Through these proposed new source 

11 performance standards for electric generating 

12 units, EPA is proposing a dramatic and 

13 fundamental change to the scope and application 

14 of the Section 111 and its PS program under the 

15 Clean Air Act, and that will have long-term 

16 implications for implementing an environmental 

17 policy in the United States.

18 The NAM and our member companies are 

19 committed to protecting the environment through 

20 greater environmental sustainability, increase 

21 energy efficiency, and conservation and reducing 

22 greenhouse gas emissions.
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1 However, we know the U.S. cannot solve 

2 the climate change issue alone. The 

3 establishment of Federal policies to reduce 

4 greenhouse gas emissions must therefore be done 

5 in a thoughtful, deliberative, and transparent 

6 process that ensures competitive level playing

7 field for U.S. companies in the global 

8 marketplace.

9 The EPA has proposed NSPS that a 

10 domestic only policy that sets a very dangerous 

11 precedent that regulations as opposed to the 

12 market decide which fuels should be utilized in 

13 facilities.

14 Our President said it could very easily 

15 cascade to other manufacturing sectors, and 

16 despite EPA's assurances that the rule will not 

17 affect existing plants, EPA, in a voluntary 

18 settlement agreement, has committed to regulate 

19 greenhouse gas emissions from existing facilities 

20 under the same provision, and groups testifying 

21 today have urged the EPA to do so immediately.

22 To issue this rule, EPA must first make 
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1 a finding that the source category contributes --

2 and this is a quote -- "contributes significantly 

3 to air pollution which may reasonably be 

4 anticipated to endanger public health and 

5 welfare."

6 This Clear Air requirement, a 

7 significant contribution, is a fundamentally 

8 different finding than what the EPA made in its 

9 prior finding for motor vehicles under Section 

10 202, which really cannot be relied upon as a 

11 backdrop for this regulation of utilities under 

12 Section 111, yet EPA's proposal failed to make 

13 the necessary finding of significant contribution 

14 of greenhouse gas emissions for the particular 

15 source category, which is required to do here and 

16 for possible future regulations.

17 The EPA's proposed standard of 1,000 

18 pounds of CO2 per megawatt hour does not reflect 

19 the best demonstrated technology for greenhouse 

20 gas reductions from new conventional coal-fired 

21 power plants although it can be accomplished by 

22 different types of power plants, namely, natural 
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1 gas and IGCC with carbon capture and storage.

2 When applied to conventional coal-fired 

3 power plants, though, EPA's standard has been 

4 consistent with its own best available control 

5 technology guidance for greenhouse gases, as well 

6 as just plant specific determinations that the 

7 EPA and the States have made over the past 18 

8 months.

9 Of particular concern to manufacturers, 

10 is its own groups will argue that this 1,000 

11 pounds per megawatt hour standard should be 

12 applied as a backstander for other types of 

13 manufacturing facilities, both new and existing, 

14 which are required to give permits, but not 

15 actually explicitly covered by this rule.

16 The NAM therefore believes that the EPA 

17 should proceed with imposed NSPS rule at this 

18 juncture. EPA has not met the prerequisites to 

19 do so, and it does have discretion to defer 

20 regulation.

21 The agency has an affirmative duty to 

22 promote predictability and reduce uncertainty 
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1 under President Obama's Executive Order 13563, 

2 and the settlement agreement that gave rise to 

3 this regulation does not provide any legally 

4 binding requirement for issuing the regulations, 

5 not a judiciously approved consent decree, and it 

6 specifically disclaims having the force and 

7 effect of a legal requirement.

8 If EPA does, nonetheless, intend to 

9 proceed, the NAM believes the agency should 

10 consider withdrawing the proposal and restarting 

11 with an advanced notice or proposed rulemaking 

12 ANPR.

13 This action will provide greater 

14 certainty for manufacturers, they will be subject 

15 to the NSPS promulgated in the future.

16 Thank you for your attention today, and 

17 the NAM looks forward to submitting a full set of 

18 comments to the agency before the deadline. 

19 Thank you.

20 MR. CULLIGAN: Thank you.

21 MS. KEMLER: Good evening. My name is 

22 Beth Kemler, B-E-T-H, K-E-M-L-E-R. I am the 
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1 Virginia State Director for Chesapeake Climate 

2 Action Network. We are a local, sort of regional 

3 organization here in D.C., Maryland, and 

4 Virginia, working to stop the climate crisis.

5 We support strict limits on carbon 

6 pollution because climate change is already 

7 affecting people in our region. I want to tell 

8 you about a recent day of action that our members 

9 participated in called Climate Impacts Day. It 

10 was an international day of action aimed at 

11 connecting the dots between the sources of carbon 

12 pollution and their actual effects on people.

13 Throughout Virginia and Maryland our 

14 supporters actually held up literal dots and took 

15 photos. We had about 25 dots over across the 

16 region, and I want to just briefly tell you about 

17 three of those dots in Virginia.

18 One of them was a group of residents in 

19 the Larchmont neighborhood of Norfolk led by 

20 resident Chris Scanlon, and if you don't know, 

21 Hampton Roads region in Virginia is the second 

22 most vulnerable area of the country to sea level 
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1 rise, because the land is actually subsiding at a 

2 higher rate than most land does.

3 So, they are actually on the front lines 

4 of sea level rise down in Hampton Roads, and in 

5 Larchmont, basically, about every year the folks 

6 who live there, they live right on the water, 

7 pretty much every year their houses are getting 

8 flooded, so when a big storm comes through, their 

9 entire houses will get flooded and they will have 

10 to replace all their appliances.

11 When you walk around in the 

12 neighborhood, you see For Sale signs all over the 

13 place, and folks are having to decide between 

14 losing tons of money on their house and having a 

15 productive life where they don't have to deal 

16 with flooding constantly.

17 Another dot was held up by Joe Bouchard. 

18 He is a retired U.S. Navy Captain. He was 

19 Commander of the Naval Station at Norfolk, the 

20 largest Navy Base that we have, and he held up a 

21 dot that said "Climate crisis equal national 

22 security crisis."
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1 So, the naval station down there is 

2 obviously being affected as well, and they have 

3 14 piers that they are currently spending tens of 

4 millions of dollars to raise, because the sea 

5 level rise is affecting them that much.

6 Another dot that we had down in Virginia 

7 was held up in Heathsville, Virginia, at Athena 

8 Vineyards and Winery. The president of the 

9 Vineyard, one of the co-owners, Carol Spengler, 

10 held up the dot, and it said, "Get it before we 

11 can't make it anymore."

12 Down in Virginia, the growing seasons 

13 are shifting so much that Carol's vineyard has 

14 only been around since 2003 and over the past 10 

15 years, the blooming time has actually shifted to 

16 three weeks earlier, not three days, not a week, 

17 three weeks earlier over the course of 10 years, 

18 and grapes are so sensitive to temperatures that 

19 just a couple of degrees, a slight shift can make 

20 a difference between a $100 bottle of wine and 

21 cooking sherry.

22 So folks all over Virginia, various 
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1 people are being affected already, and therefore, 

2 we support very strict limits. We would love to 

3 see even stricter limits in the future, but we 

4 think this is a really great first step towards 

5 climate stability.

6 Thank you.

7 MR. CULLIGAN: Thank both of you. Ross, 

8 just two questions, and I am not looking for a 

9 detailed answer, but I assume your comments will 

10 go into more depth on why you don't think we made 

11 the appropriate finding?

12 MR. EISENBERG: Our written comments 

13 will.

14 MR. CULLIGAN: And you talked about an 

15 ANPR being a strategy, will your comments go into 

16 what you think would be the appropriate standard 

17 to talk about?

18 MR. EISENBERG: They absolutely will.

19 MR. CULLIGAN: Thank you.

20 Our next two speakers are Larry 

21 Greenfield and Jennifer Abel.

22 MR. GREENFIELD: As a person who has 
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1 suffered from asthma since birth, I came today to 

2 testify in favor of the EPA standards to regulate 

3 carbon emissions.

4 People with asthma have serious 

5 limitations in their quality of life. For 

6 example, combined with global warming, if you 

7 have asthma, you are advised not to go outside 

8 during excessively hot summer days in the 

9 Washington area in particular, probably in many 

10 other areas.

11 The hot weather combined with the 

12 pollution is dangerous to oneself especially if 

13 you have asthma. Asthma is related to other 

14 serious lung problems and I myself have been 

15 hospitalized numerous times with asthma, most 

16 recently five years ago I was given up for dead 

17 in the hospital.

18 Asthma causes increases in medical 

19 costs, doctors and emergency room visits, 

20 hospitalizations, extensive use of prescribed 

21 medicines, and for people who are suffering from 

22 unemployment today, especially recently with the 
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1 high unemployment, they often lose their health 

2 insurance, and this puts an increasing burden on 

3 people to have to cover these costs.

4 I applaud EPA for regulating, attempting 

5 to regulate carbon emissions and pollution in 

6 general.

7 MR. CULLIGAN: Thank you.

8 MS. STRINE: Larry, where are you from?

9 MR. GREENFIELD: I am from Kensington, 

10 Maryland.

11 MS. STRINE: Thank you very much.

12 MS. ABEL: My name is Jennifer Abel

13 J-E-N-N-I-F-E-R, A-B-E-L. I appreciate the 

14 opportunity to speak in support of the proposed 

15 carbon pollution standard that would limit 

16 industrial carbon pollution from new power 

17 plants.

18 The scientific community is in agreement 

19 that global warming and climate disruption are 

20 real phenomenon and that the causes are man-made.

21 It is therefore crucial that our 

22 government take action to move us away from 
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1 greenhouse gas producing power generation methods 

2 and increase the availability of renewable energy 

3 sources.

4 Passing the proposed pollution standard 

5 is a step in the right direction and is also 

6 vitally important for the health of our children 

7 and other vulnerable populations.

8 I am a long-time volunteer with the 

9 Sierra Club and fought to close the GenOn 

10 coal-fired power plant in Alexandria that was 

11 shown to be spewing pollutants into the air in 

12 Alexandria and in Arlington where I live.

13 I am grateful that this plant will be 

14 closing, and I think we owe it to the future of 

15 our children to ensure that coal-fired power 

16 plants that continue to operate exceed clean air 

17 standards.

18 I also believe that the pollution 

19 standard is an important tool to reduce the 

20 effects of climate disruption particularly 

21 related to the rise in extreme weather events 

22 from increased severe storms and hurricanes and 
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1 freak warming trends in winters in this area to 

2 long-term droughts and wildfires in other parts 

3 of the country.

4 We are clearly seeing an unnaturally 

5 high level of extreme weather occurrences.

6 We obviously take seriously the 

7 scientific community's warnings about the impact 

8 of climate change and the impact on our economy, 

9 public health, and environment if the warnings go 

10 unheeded.

11 I applaud the EPA's proposed pollution 

12 standards and hope that they will be passed and 

13 put into effect without delay.

14 Thank you for your time and attention.

15 MR. CULLIGAN: Thank you both.

16 Our next two speakers are Tim Stevens 

17 and Alex Bond.

18 MR. STEVENS: Good evening. My name is 

19 Tim Stevens. That is T-I-M, S-T-E-V-E-N-S.

20 I am a retired resident of Falls Church 

21 in Northern Virginia. I support the EPA's 

22 proposed regulations to begin limiting carbon 
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1 pollution from fossil fuel-fired power plants.

2 According to the Union of Concerned 

3 scientists, roughly 45 percent of our electricity 

4 comes from coal-fired power plants, and they are 

5 responsible for one-third of this country's 

6 greenhouse gas emissions.

7 On an individual basis, each of us is 

8 responsible for approximately 20 tons of 

9 greenhouse gas emissions annually, and that 

10 translate to about 115 pounds of carbon dioxide 

11 daily per person.

12 Using the one-third fraction that I just 

13 mentioned, the greenhouse gas emissions from 

14 burning coal, which is mainly carbon dioxide, 

15 translates to about 40 pounds a day per person. 

16 Putting 40 pounds of anything into the air on a 

17 daily basis seems extreme, let alone considering 

18 that this is a pollution source that is 

19 disrupting our climate and leading to a number of 

20 significant health concerns requiring billions of 

21 dollars to treat.

22 These viewpoints sum up why the proposal 
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1 to limit to 1,000 pounds of carbon dioxide per 

2 megawatt of power produced is reasonable by any 

3 standard that has the public interest at its 

4 local point.

5 Given what is at stake, the EPA could 

6 easily be criticized for being too timid in this 

7 initial effort to regulate carbon dioxide 

8 emissions from stationary sources, but knowing 

9 that the EPA has already received substantial 

10 criticism from those who want carbon pollution to 

11 continue unabated, I will instead emphasize the 

12 positive and praise the EPA for taking this first 

13 step to establish a uniform national limit on the 

14 amount of carbon pollution that future power 

15 plants can emit.

16 This rule should have a positive 

17 multiplier effect in several respects. It will 

18 be a signal to other countries that the U.S. is 

19 finally willing to take some steps to reduce out 

20 greenhouse gas emissions, which in turn should 

21 help others follow the same path.

22 It will help give additional emphasis to 
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1 the need to develop renewable sources of energy, 

2 ones that do not emit carbon pollution. Of 

3 course, there is a positive economic benefit to 

4 that.

5 It will also help us address our status 

6 here in the Washington area as a nonattainment 

7 area, as carbon dioxide contributes to harmful 

8 ozone. Given that the EPA issued its 

9 endangerment filing in 2009, this proposed rule 

10 is long overdue, and I support seeing it 

11 implemented.

12 Thank you.

13 MR. CULLIGAN: Thank you.

14 MR. BOND: Good evening. I'm Alex Bond, 

15 A-L-E-X, B-O-N-D. I am the director of Air 

16 Quality for the National Mining Association. NMA 

17 represents the producers of most of America's 

18 coal, metal, and metals industrial and 

19 agricultural minerals.

20 Like the recent rules directed at the 

21 electricity sector, this proposal by the U.S. EPA 

22 to establish new source performance standards, to 
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1 reduce greenhouse gas emissions from new electric 

2 utility generating sources is not designed to 

3 improve environment performance, but rather to 

4 force retirement of existing power plants and bar 

5 the construction of new, more efficient coal 

6 plants that would provide our nation robust, 

7 diverse, reliable and affordable source of 

8 electricity.

9 My comment today will highlight the 

10 unlawful, unprecedented, and unwise nature of 

11 EPA's proposed rule in a shortened version of 

12 official comments that I have submitted to the 

13 docket.

14 Initially, the proposed rule from EPA is 

15 unlawful. EPA in it NSPS proposal is further 

16 evidence that the Clean Air Act is ill suited for 

17 addressing climate change. Moreover, it 

18 demonstrates how EPA's regulatory approach yields 

19 only stunning costs while producing little, if 

20 any, measurable benefits.

21 Section 111(b) requires that NSPS 

22 reflect the best system of emissions reduction, 
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1 BSEER. EPA's proposal one illegally combines 

2 distinct source categories, natural gas and 

3 coal-fired units into super category of electric 

4 generator units and then chooses a natural gas 

5 combined cycle plant at BSEER.

6 NGCC is a technology, not a system for 

7 emissions reduction, and unlawfully requires a 

8 coal plant to be something entirely different 

9 than what it actually is, a natural gas combined 

10 cycle plant.

11 The proposed NSPS is aimed at denying 

12 America affordable and reliable coal electricity 

13 by forcing fuel switching. The proposal acts as 

14 a de facto mandate to force utilities to fuel 

15 switch from coal to natural gas.

16 If EPA truly wanted to address 

17 greenhouse emissions, they would have issued 

18 achievable performance, and it is for both 

19 natural gas and coal-fired units, and wouldn't 

20 have exempted less efficient, simple cycle 

21 natural gas units from the rule in its entirety.

22 EPA's proposal is also unprecedented. 
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1 The agency's decision to combine two distinct 

2 technologies, which have been previously treated 

3 as entirely separate categories, into one 

4 regulated source category is unprecedented. 

5 EPA's decision to treat dissimilar technologies 

6 as equals for GHG emissions bucks decades of 

7 established clear air policy.

8 The only control option that EPA focuses 

9 upon, carbon capture and storage for coal-fired 

10 units is commercially unavailable. If CCS 

11 becomes commercially viable in the future, there 

12 is no reason to believe that it would not also be 

13 available for natural gas combined cycle units. 

14 EPA would be able to conduct a rulemaking to set 

15 appropriate NSPS across both source categories.

16 Until such a time it is reckless for EPA 

17 to pursue this rulemaking.

18 Finally, the proposed NSPS is unwise. 

19 EPA admits that there are no benefits from this 

20 proposed rulemaking based on the assumption that 

21 no new coal plants would be built in future years 

22 even in the absence of this rule.
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1 This argument is self-serving in its own 

2 right to justify a rule that imposes a standard 

3 that all but guarantees that no new coal plant 

4 will be constructed even if energy supplies and 

5 costs change in the future.

6 It is stunning shortsighted and unwise 

7 to base the future of our energy policy on such 

8 an assumption.

9 The proposal will only impair the 

10 reliability and affordability of domestic energy 

11 supplies as well by severely diminishing the 

12 diversity of electric generation sole sources 

13 that we rely upon in the United States.

14 The de facto ban on new high efficiency 

15 coal plants, leaves U.S. households and 

16 businesses exposed to a less reliable, more 

17 expensive and more volatile electric mix of 

18 generation sources.

19 EPA relies upon faulty assumptions about 

20 natural gas supplies. EPA incorrectly assumes 

21 that there will be an adequate, reliable and 

22 affordable supply of natural gas that can sustain 
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1 electricity supply, which is not supplied to find 

2 any support in energy forecasts.

3 Incremental net domestic supply, go 

4 through Shell Gas, may be less than half of what

5 it needed. This has far-reaching implications 

6 for thwarting this so-called U.S. manufacturing 

7 renaissance that our colleagues in NAM recently 

8 spoke about. There will also be a supply deficit 

9 for fueling any potential industrial growth.

10 Finally, I would like to offer a better 

11 way forward for the agency. The better way, and 

12 the only way, for it to reduce greenhouse gas 

13 emission from EGUs is to set a practical and 

14 achievable standard for coal and natural 

15 gas-fired units that is in step with all of the 

16 above energy strategy.

17 Instead of placing de facto bans on new 

18 coal construction, EPA rules should enable new 

19 advance coal generation that pays both economic 

20 and environmental dividends by replacing old coal 

21 units and more efficient, low emission, super 

22 critical coal plants. We should acknowledge the 
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1 economic benefits of a stable and diverse 

2 electric generation mix and realize that policies 

3 such as this fly in the face of that goal.

4 I close by urging the agency to withdraw 

5 its proposed rule for all of the above stated 

6 reasons. NMA will submit more detailed written 

7 comments by the June 25th, 2012 comment deadline 

8 that will focus upon the legal and policy 

9 implications of EPA's proposed rule.

10 Thank you for your time today.

11 MR. CULLIGAN: Thank both of you.

12 Alex, in those more detailed comments, I 

13 assume you will go into the concerns you have 

14 about gas price assumptions?

15 MR. BOND: Yes.

16 MR. CULLIGAN: You also suggested what 

17 you thought the cost of the rule would be. I 

18 assume we will get more detail on that.

19 MR. BOND: Cost of the rule and --

20 MR. CULLIGAN: I think at one point you 

21 said that it would have very large costs to the 

22 rule. I assume you will give us some detail on 
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1 how you come up with those numbers.

2 MR. BOND: We are building an analysis 

3 right now. I don't have those for you now 

4 unfortunately.

5 MR. CULLIGAN: I just wanted to make 

6 sure, I suspect it would probably a fairly 

7 detailed set of comments.

8 The last thing is you suggested that we 

9 should have a separate standard for gas and coal.

10 MR. BOND: Yes.

11 MR. CULLIGAN: I imagine you will talk 

12 in detail about what you think an appropriate 

13 level would be for a coal plant.

14 MR. BOND: I believe that is what our 

15 plan is at the moment. Our focus is also to 

16 highlight the fact that this is the first time 

17 that you have combined two unlike sources into 

18 one category, and haven't set separate standards.

19 MR. CULLIGAN: Thank you very much.

20 We have got Anastasia Shemkes, I am sure 

21 I got that wrong and I apologize. And I see Seth 

22 Long.
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1 MS. SHEMKES: My name is Anastasia 

2 Shemkes. I work at the Sierra Club. I work for 

3 the Sierra Student Coalition, but I am here 

4 mostly representing myself.

5 I grew up in Seattle, Washington, and 

6 Seattle, Washington is more famous for Mount 

7 Rainier. I grew up with Mount Rainier outside. 

8 I can see it from my house, I saw it every day in 

9 the city.

10 You grow up with a sense of on clear 

11 days you can't always see Mount Rainier very 

12 clearly. There is a haze like over the top of 

13 it, and so you are looking at this beautiful 

14 mountain, but you can only see pieces of it.

15 People always say, "Oh, it is such a big 

16 mountain, it has its own micro-climate," and it 

17 wasn't until I got older that I learned that the 

18 reason that I couldn't see Mount Rainier 

19 sometimes on clear days was because of dangerous 

20 pollutants that were being dumped into our air 

21 from sources like coal-fired power plants.

22 These toxic emissions, carbon pollution, 
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1 particulate matter, sulphur, you know, I can talk 

2 about it kind of funny, in a sense of, you know, 

3 oh, like I just thought Mount Rainier had its own 

4 micro-climate, but it actually represents a much 

5 bigger issue.

6 So, I work for the Sierra Student 

7 Coalition, and I work with students across the 

8 nation who are working to retire coal-fired power 

9 plants on their campuses, and they are driven to 

10 protect their future, my future.

11 I have students in Kentucky who were 

12 taking shelter from the record tornado outbreaks 

13 that were happening throughout the Midwest. I 

14 work with another student who has suffered from 

15 asthma since she was a young child and had 

16 actually been hospitalized for her asthma before.

17 These are very serious and like real 

18 cases representing these issues, that the 

19 pollution they are coming from coal-fired power 

20 plants, it is climate disruption. This is a very 

21 real thing where I have started to see the 

22 impacts of this pollution in my lifetime, and I 
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1 am going to be dealing with a much different 

2 future than the current one than what we have 

3 now.

4 It is our job right now to protect my 

5 future, to protect my children's future with new 

6 standards like these new carbon pollution 

7 standards. In the case of my friend, you know, 

8 the student that I work with who suffers from 

9 asthma, she is one of millions.

10 There are so many children and young 

11 people and older folks and people in 

12 underprivileged communities that suffer from 

13 asthma and other lung diseases because of the 

14 pollutants coming from these coal-fired power 

15 plants.

16 I don't want my children to have asthma, 

17 I don't want my children or my nephews or nieces 

18 or my cousins, you know, or I don't want to 

19 develop asthma, and these are very, very real 

20 issues.

21 I applaud these standards and urge you 

22 to approve them. I think that they are a huge 
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1 step in protecting our future and cleaning up our 

2 air and protecting the health of future 

3 generations.

4 MR. LONG: Thank you for giving me time 

5 to speak. It's a little late. I appreciate 

6 having this opportunity. I think the EPA's new 

7 standards for carbon pollution, for coal plants, 

8 it's an excellent step forward in the right 

9 direction. I am impressed that EPA is moving 

10 forward with these.

11 I think it has only been about 20 years 

12 or so, maybe 30, where science has really 

13 understood the impacts of carbon pollution on 

14 climate change and the quality of air.

15 So, it is understandable. I think that 

16 there is a little bit of resistance from coal 

17 energy companies, and there is a little bit of a 

18 lag since it is relatively new, but I think all 

19 of us would agree especially living around here 

20 in the summers that the air quality is definitely 

21 suffering.

22 Just anecdotally, myself and my friends 
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1 this past spring, with the early spring and the 

2 pollen counts dramatically increasing and just 

3 really taking a beating on our lungs. I feel 

4 like every other person I know has suffered from 

5 respiratory ailments this summer, and I don't 

6 know about you, but last summer in D.C. it was 

7 atrocious.

8 I was living in a third floor house 

9 without air conditioning under a metal roof, 

10 which was horrible I wouldn't recommend it to 

11 anybody, but it was cheap, so it was not pleasant 

12 though, basically, sleep on the floor with two 

13 fans blowing over me, it was just miserable, it 

14 did not make my life -- my life was pretty 

15 unpleasant at the time.

16 It is just a vicious circle, if we only 

17 continued to crank up our air conditioners to 

18 fight back, and global warming, it is only going 

19 to get worse, but I know we can do better. The 

20 United States has always been a leader in 

21 technological innovation. We already had the 

22 resources and the knowhow to invest in clean 
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1 energy solutions, to address these problems, and 

2 while the coal companies are fighting back, they 

3 talk about the loss of jobs. There are clearly 

4 more jobs created by winds and solar energy than 

5 coal production.

6 You know, they are one of the wealthiest 

7 industries in the country or in the world that 

8 have even ever existed, so I think really those 

9 concerns are minimal. If people are suffering 

10 with asthma, things like asthma and worse 

11 allergies and heat strokes because the air is 

12 increasing like how many job they have had, it 

13 will not be that important if they are in the 

14 hospital.

15 I would just like to say thank you for 

16 implementing these new standards. I think the 

17 science is there. It is clear, it is not really 

18 a mystery to anybody. We use science to build 

19 our roads, build computers that everybody relies 

20 on. We shouldn't give in to false arguments 

21 about jobs or science on something that is so 

22 important as our health.
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1 Thank you.

2 MR. CULLIGAN: Thank both of you.

3 We have one more speaker at this point.

4 Christine Guhl.

5 MS. GUHL: My name is Christine Guhl. 

6 C-H-R-I-S-T-I-N-E, G-U-H-L. First, I just want 

7 to say thank you for this opportunity and also 

8 thanks to you folks for being here. It has been 

9 a very long day for you I know, so I appreciate 

10 it, and we all appreciate you taking the time to 

11 listen to us and listen to so many comments in 

12 support of this rule.

13 I am glad to be here to close. But the 

14 other comment is it is no mystery that the Sierra 

15 Club is supporting this rule. I am a New Jersey 

16 Sierra Club organizer, but I would really like to 

17 talk about how this rule will affect the people 

18 of New Jersey because that is where I am from, 

19 that is where I live.

20 Climate change is already affecting New 

21 Jersey, and a standard on carbon pollution will 

22 help to curb the effects that it is having. From 
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1 the small to the really large issues, climate 

2 change is already here and it is already 

3 happening, and I just want to give you a few 

4 anecdotes that maybe will be humorous, but are 

5 also very real.

6 In March, I found out that my dog has 

7 Lyme disease, and I love my dog as I am sure 

8 everyone does, and I was really surprised that my 

9 dog had Lyme disease because it was March and I 

10 didn't think that ticks would be active.

11 When I went to my vet, I was told that 

12 this last year he saw 3,000 cases of Lyme 

13 disease. It had grown every year since he had 

14 been practicing, and I was really interested in 

15 that fact.

16 So, I went home and, of course, I went 

17 to the Internet like everyone does, and I found 

18 out that one of the reasons that Lyme disease has 

19 become so prevalent in States like New Jersey and 

20 actually north all the way into Canada is because 

21 the winters are just getting warmer, and so every 

22 year that we have a warmer winter and less days 
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1 below freezing, the ticks will be active and 

2 therefore there will be more Lyme disease.

3 Actually, it is not just my dog that had 

4 Lyme disease in the last few years. I had Lyme 

5 disease, my mom had Lyme disease. My sister had 

6 Lyme disease, and my sister's two dogs had Lyme 

7 disease.

8 So, yes, that is anecdotal, but there is 

9 a lot of research to support that infectious 

10 diseases are going to get worse, not just in 

11 places like Sub-Saharan Africa, but in places 

12 like New Jersey which is in the United States, 

13 which is clearly out of the central purview of 

14 the EPA.

15 So, that is just one small anecdote 

16 about infectious diseases, but there are many, 

17 many more.

18 Another one is allergies. My colleague 

19 was just up here talking about allergies and how 

20 they are getting worse, and that is another issue 

21 that I suffer from, that I, of course, went to 

22 the Internet and looked up why my allergies were 
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1 getting so much worse in the last few years, and 

2 particularly this year.

3 Actually, pollen counts have gotten much 

4 higher and have shown up much, much earlier, 

5 every week for the least few years, and that is 

6 because we have just been having a warmer winter, 

7 and there are many, many allergists and asthma 

8 specialist who will attest to that, and there are 

9 a lot of studies that have been done that have 

10 proven that allergies are getting worse as a 

11 result of higher pollen counts, which are cause 

12 by warmer weather, warmer weather every year.

13 So, these are kind of the more I guess 

14 minimal effects that climate change is having 

15 right now, but they are effects that are already 

16 happening. They are only going to get worse as 

17 the years go on, and they are not just health 

18 effects, although we have heard a lot about them 

19 today. There are effects to New Jersey and to 

20 the planet that will be happening in 20 years, 

21 but that are already starting.

22 Rising sea level is an issue 
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1 particularly of concern for coastal States. I 

2 don't live on the beach, but I do like to go 

3 there, and I don't want to see it go away.

4 Places like Long Beach Island in New 

5 Jersey are already suffering with flooding. I 

6 live on the Delaware River. There is a lot of 

7 flooding going on there, so there are already 

8 things happening in the State of New Jersey that 

9 are effects of climate disruption, and there are 

10 things that we need to do now to make sure that 

11 those effects don't get worse.

12 One of the things that we need to do is 

13 ensure that we have limits on carbon pollution. 

14 It is dangerous, it is dangerous for our health, 

15 it is dangerous for our planet, and I want to 

16 thank you for proposing this rule.

17 I know that you have heard from probably 

18 over 100 people here today. You have gotten 

19 millions of comments in support of this rule. I 

20 would just like you to take those comments into 

21 consideration when making decisions about 

22 implementing it and go forward.
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1 Don't take any steps back. You have 

2 done a great thing. Thank you for your time and 

3 thank you for proposing the rule.

4 MR. CULLIGAN: We will take a brief 

5 recess, and if somebody else shows up, we will 

6 listen to them. If anybody here hasn't spoken 

7 and they would like to, there is an opportunity.

8 [Recess from 7:27 to 8 p.m.]

9 MR. CULLIGAN: It's 8 p.m. We have no 

10 other speakers, so we are going to close the 

11 hearing. Thank you.

12 [Hearing adjourned at 8 p.m.]

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