LEARNING DISABILITIES AND EARLY 

INTERVENTION STRATEGIES:

HOW TO REFORM THE SPECIAL EDUCATION 

REFERRAL AND IDENTIFICATION PROCESS 

HEARING

BEFORE THE 

SUBCOMMITTEE ON EDUCATION REFORM 

OF THE 

COMMITTEE ON EDUCATION AND 

THE WORKFORCE 

HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES

ONE HUNDRED SEVENTH CONGRESS

SECOND SESSION

HEARING HELD IN WASHINGTON, DC, JUNE 6, 2002 

Serial No. 107-65 

Printed for the use of the Committee on Education 

and the Workforce

 82-137 pdf 

For sale by the Superintendent of Documents, U.S. Government Printing Office 

Internet: bookstore.gpo.gov Phone: toll free (866) 512-1800; DC area (202) 512-1800 

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ii

COMMITTEE ON EDUCATION AND THE WORKFORCE 

JOHN A. BOEHNER, Ohio, Chairman 

THOMAS E. PETRI, Wisconsin GEORGE MILLER, California 

MARGE ROUKEMA, New Jersey DALE E. KILDEE, Michigan 

CASS BALLENGER, North Carolina MAJOR R. OWENS, New York 

PETER HOEKSTRA, Michigan DONALD M. PAYNE, New Jersey 

HOWARD P. “BUCK” McKEON, California PATSY MINK, Hawaii 

MICHAEL N. CASTLE, Delaware ROBERT E. ANDREWS, New Jersey 

SAM JOHNSON, Texas TIM ROEMER, Indiana 

JAMES C. GREENWOOD, Pennsylvania ROBERT C. “BOBBY” SCOTT, Virginia 

LINDSEY O. GRAHAM, South Carolina LYNN C. WOOLSEY, California 

MARK E. SOUDER, Indiana LYNN N. RIVERS, Michigan 

CHARLIE W. NORWOOD, JR., Georgia RUBEN HINOJOSA, Texas 

BOB SCHAFFER, Colorado CAROLYN McCARTHY, New York 

FRED UPTON, Michigan JOHN F. TIERNEY, Massachusetts 

VAN HILLEARY, Tennessee RON KIND, Wisconsin 

VERNON J. EHLERS, Michigan LORETTA SANCHEZ, California 

THOMAS G. TANCREDO, Colorado HAROLD E. FORD, JR., Tennessee 

JIM DeMINT, South Carolina DENNIS KUCINICH, Ohio 

JOHNNY ISAKSON, Georgia DAVID WU, Oregon 

BOB GOODLATTE, Virginia RUSH D. HOLT, New Jersey 

JUDY BIGGERT, Illinois HILDA L. SOLIS, California 

TODD RUSSELL PLATTS, Pennsylvania SUSAN DAVIS, California 

PATRICK J. TIBERI, Ohio BETTY McCOLLUM, Minnesota 

 RIC KELLER, Florida 

 TOM OSBORNE, Nebraska 

 JOHN ABNEY CULBERSON, Texas 

 JOE WILSON, South Carolina 

Paula Nowakowski, Chief of Staff 

 John Lawrence, Minority Staff Director

 SUBCOMMITTEE ON EDUCATION REFORM 

 MICHAEL N. CASTLE, Delaware, Chairman

BOB SCHAFFER, Colorado, Vice Chairman DALE E. KILDEE, Michigan 

THOMAS E. PETRI, Wisconsin ROBERT C. “BOBBY” SCOTT, Virginia 

MARGE ROUKEMA, New Jersey LYNN C. WOOLSEY, California 

JAMES C. GREENWOOD, Pennsylvania RUBEN HINOJOSA, Texas 

MARK E. SOUDER, Indiana CAROLYN McCARTHY, New York 

FRED UPTON, Michigan LORETTA SANCHEZ, California 

VAN HILLEARY, Tennessee HAROLD E. FORD, Jr., Tennessee 

VERNON J. EHLERS, Michigan HILDA L. SOLIS, California 

THOMAS G. TANCREDO, Colorado SUSAN DAVIS, California 

JIM DeMINT, South Carolina MAJOR R. OWENS, New York 

JUDY BIGGERT, Illinois DONALD M. PAYNE, New Jersey 

TODD RUSSELL PLATTS, Pennsylvania TIM ROEMER, Indiana 

RIC KELLER, Florida RON KIND, Wisconsin 

TOM OSBORNE, Nebraska DENNIS J. KUCINICH, Ohio 

JOHN ABNEY CULBERSON, Texas 

JOE WILSON, South Carolina 
iii

TABLE OF CONTENTS 

OPENING STATEMENT OF CHAIRMAN MICHAEL CASTLE, SUBCOMMITTEE ON 

EDUCATION REFORM, COMMITTEE ON EDUCATION AND THE WORKFORCE, U.S. 

HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES, WASHINGTON, D.C.......................................................... 2 

OPENING STATEMENT OF RANKING MINORITY MEMBER DALE E. KILDEE, 

SUBCOMMITTEE ON EDUCATION REFORM, COMMITTEE ON EDUCATION AND THE 

WORKFORCE, U.S. HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES, WASHINGTON, D.C. ..................... 3 

STATEMENT OF HON. WILLIAM F. GOODLING, FORMER CHAIRMAN, COMMITTEE 

ON EDUCATION AND THE WORKFORCE, WASHINGTON, D.C. ....................................... 6 

STATEMENT OF ROBERT PASTERNACK, ASSISTANT SECRETARY FOR SPECIAL 

EDUCATION AND REHABILITATION SERVICES, U.S. DEPARTMENT OF 

EDUCATION, WASHINGTON, D.C. .......................................................................................... 9 

STATEMENT OF G. REID LYON, RESEARCH PSYCHOLOGIST AND CHIEF, CHILD 

DEVELOPMENT AND BEHAVIOR BRANCH, NATIONAL INSTITUTE OF CHILD 

HEALTH AND HUMAN DEVELOPMENT, ROCKVILLE, MARYLAND ............................ 24 

STATEMENT OF JOSEPH F. KOVALESKI, DIRECTOR OF PUPIL SERVICES, 

CORNWALL-LEBANON SCHOOL DISTRICT, LITITZ, PENNSYLVANIA........................ 27 

STATEMENT OF DAVID W. GORDON, SUPERINTENDENT, ELK GROVE UNIFIED 

SCHOOL DISTRICT, ELK GROVE, CALIFORNIA................................................................. 29 

APPENDIX A - WRITTEN OPENING STATEMENT OF CHAIRMAN MICHAEL CASTLE, 

SUBCOMMITTEE ON EDUCATION REFORM, COMMITTEE ON EDUCATION AND THE 

WORKFORCE, U.S. HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES, WASHINGTON, D.C. ................... 49 

APPENDIX B - WRITTEN OPENING STATEMENT OF RANKING MINORITY MEMBER 

DALE E. KILDEE, SUBCOMMITTEE ON EDUCATION REFORM, COMMITTEE ON 

EDUCATION AND THE WORKFORCE, U.S. HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES, 

WASHINGTON, D.C................................................................................................................... 53 

APPENDIX C - WRITTEN STATEMENT OF HON. WILLIAM F. GOODLING, FORMER 

CHAIRMAN, COMMITTEE ON EDUCATION AND THE WORKFORCE, WASHINGTON, 

D.C................................................................................................................................................ 57 

APPENDIX D - WRITTEN STATEMENT OF ROBERT PASTERNACK, ASSISTANT 

SECRETARY FOR SPECIAL EDUCATION AND REHABILITATION SERVICES, U.S. 

DEPARTMENT OF EDUCATION, WASHINGTON, D.C. ...................................................... 65 
iv

APPENDIX E - WRITTEN STATEMENT OF G. REID LYON, RESEARCH 

PSYCHOLOGIST AND CHIEF, CHILD DEVELOPMENT AND BEHAVIOR BRANCH, 

NATIONAL INSTITUTE OF CHILD HEALTH AND HUMAN DEVELOPMENT, 

ROCKVILLE, MARYLAND....................................................................................................... 73 

APPENDIX F - WRITTEN STATEMENT OF JOSEPH F. KOVALESKI, DIRECTOR OF 

PUPIL SERVICES, CORNWALL-LEBANON SCHOOL DISTRICT, LITITZ, 

PENNSYLVANIA........................................................................................................................ 99 

APPENDIX G - WRITTEN STATEMENT OF DAVID W. GORDON, SUPERINTENDENT, 

ELK GROVE UNIFIED SCHOOL DISTRICT, ELK GROVE, CALIFORNIA ...................... 107

Table of Indexes.......................................................................................................................... 123 
1

HEARING ON LEARNING DISABILITIES AND EARLY 

INTERVENTION STRATEGIES: HOW TO REFORM THE 

SPECIAL EDUCATION REFERRAL AND IDENTIFICATION 

PROCESS

________________________________________________________________

THURSDAY, JUNE 6, 2002 

U.S. HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES, 

SUBCOMMITTEE ON EDUCATION REFORM, 

COMMITTEE ON EDUCATION AND THE WORKFORCE, 

WASHINGTON, D.C.

 The subcommittee met, pursuant to notice, at 10:00 a.m., in Room 2175, Rayburn House 

Office Building, Hon. Michael Castle [chairman of the subcommittee] presiding. 

 Present: Representatives Castle, Ehlers, Platts, Osborne, Culberson, Wilson, Kildee, Scott, 

Woolsey, Solis, Davis, Owens, Payne, Roemer, and Kind. 

 Staff present: Kate Gorton, Professional Staff Member; Blake Hegeman, Legislative 

Assistant; Charles Hokanson, Professional Staff; Sally Lovejoy, Director of Education and Human 

Resources Policy; Patrick Lyden, Professional Staff Member; Deborah L. Samantar, Committee 

Clerk/Intern Coordinator; Bob Sweet, Professional Staff Member; Holli Traud, Legislative 

Assistant; Heather Valentine, Press Secretary; Liz Wheel, Legislative Assistant; Denise Forte, 

Minority Legislative Assistant/Education; Maggie McDow, Minority Legislative 

Assistant/Education; Alex Nock, Minority Legislative Assistant/Education; and Joe Novotny, 

Minority Staff Assistant/Education 
2

Chairman Castle. The Subcommittee on Education Reform will come to order. We are meeting 

today to hear testimony on how to reform the special education referral and identification process.

Under committee rule (b), opening statements are limited to the chairman and ranking minority 

member of the subcommittee. Therefore, if other members have statements, they may be included 

in the hearing record. 

 With that, I ask unanimous consent for the hearing record to remain open 14 days to allow 

member statements and other extraneous material referenced during the hearing to be submitted in 

the official hearing record. Without objection, so ordered. 

OPENING STATEMENT OF CHAIRMAN MICHAEL CASTLE, 

SUBCOMMITTEE ON EDUCATION REFORM, COMMITTEE ON 

EDUCATION AND THE WORKFORCE, U.S. HOUSE OF 

REPRESENTATIVES, WASHINGTON, D.C. 

 Let me start by welcoming everybody here today. These hearings are continuing and are a 

matter of extraordinary importance. We appreciate the attendance of the Members of the House as 

well as, of course, our distinguished witnesses, who we will hear more about and more from 

shortly.

 The Individuals with Disabilities Education Act, which is the federal education act that 

welcomes all learners and excludes none, regardless of their disabilities, is of extraordinary 

importance to this country. Today, children with disabilities sit with their non-disabled peers in 

regular classrooms and many learn from a general education curriculum. Yet, despite these 

significant accomplishments, children with disabilities are not completing school or performing at 

levels near their non-disabled peers. 

 As I have stated previously, it is not enough to open the schoolhouse door for children with 

special needs. We must ensure that we meet the letter as well as the spirit of the law and provide 

our children with the high-quality instruction and services they need to succeed. Just as we must 

move states and schools from simple compliance to real achievement, we must also ensure that our 

special education and general education programs evolve to meet the needs of a new generation of 

children with disabilities. 

 Today, more than half of our children in special education programs have specific learning 

disabilities. Yet, unlike some severe physical and mental disabilities, many children with learning 

disabilities are identified too late. Others are over-identified because they fail to learn fundamental 

skills like reading. In each case, frustration and an accumulated learning gap can spell disaster, 

with many children dropping out of high school and shunning higher education. 

 For these reasons, the purpose of this morning's hearing is to learn more about the way 

students with various learning disabilities are referred for special education-related services under 

IDEA. Specifically, I want to know if IDEA can be strengthened to prevent mild learning 

disabilities from turning into lifelong learning disabilities. I also want to know more about the 
3

models and strategies that have been effective in helping children learn in new ways. Finally, I 

believe it is important to hear more about effective, evidence-based early intervention programs 

and how they have been used to improve education outcomes. It is my hope that our distinguished 

witnesses will provide our members with a better understanding of each of these issues. 

 To that end, I am pleased to welcome a mentor and a friend, the former chairman of the 

Education and the Workforce Committee, Bill Goodling. Although I was sorry to see him retire to 

his farm in Seven Valleys, Pennsylvania, his counsel will carry me through IDEA reauthorization, 

just as it did with the reauthorization of ESEA. 

 I will proceed with the introduction of the rest of our distinguished panel in just a moment 

and Mr. Platts will do the introduction of Mr. Goodling. 

 First, I want to thank those of you in the audience as well as those listening to our IDEA 

hearing via live webcast. I know that many of you are interested in communicating directly with 

the Education and the Workforce Committee on issues related to learning disabilities as well as 

other topics in this series. To that end, my colleagues and I have unveiled a new interactive Great 

Ideas website on the Education and the Workforce Committee page. This will allow us to hear 

directly from the teachers and principals, parents and coaches, advocates and relatives who educate 

and care for our children with disabilities on the upcoming reform. 

 I know I speak for all our committee members when I encourage you to share your thoughts 

and reauthorization ideas. I look forward to hearing from you all. 

 Now, let's proceed with the hearing. First, of course, I yield to the distinguished ranking 

member, Mr. Kildee, for whatever opening statement he may wish to give. Dale? 

WRITTEN OPENING STATEMENT OF CHAIRMAN MICHAEL CASTLE, SUBCOMMITTEE 

ON EDUCATION REFORM, COMMITTEE ON EDUCATION AND THE WORKFORCE, U.S. 

HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES, WASHINGTON, D.C. – SEE APPENDIX A 

OPENING STATEMENT OF RANKING MINORITY MEMBER DALE E. 

KILDEE, SUBCOMMITTEE ON EDUCATION REFORM, COMMITTEE ON 

EDUCATION AND THE WORKFORCE, U.S. HOUSE OF 

REPRESENTATIVES, WASHINGTON, D.C. 

Mr. Kildee. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I am pleased to join Governor Castle at our latest hearing 

on reauthorization of IDEA. I want to join Governor Castle in welcoming our witnesses to today's 

hearing. I had a chance to meet with Secretary Pasternack yesterday, and I am certain the praise he 

has received by those in the field is indeed deserved. I also want to especially welcome my friend 

and former chairman of this committee, Bill Goodling. He has been my friend for many, many 

years, and will always be my friend. 

 During his career here in Congress and also as an educator, Bill Goodling worked hard to 

provide full funding for IDEA but also to improve the lives and education of children with 
4

disabilities. His appearance here today shows he maintains his commitment to our nation's 

children. Your leadership in the Congress on these issues is very much missed. I can recall back 

when you and I served on the Budget Committee many, many years ago. You and I offered an 

amendment on the budget for full funding for IDEA. And I got almost all my Democrats but you 

were the only Republican voting for that, and it took some courage to do that. And I always will 

remember that. You were a pioneer in this field, not a Johnny-come-lately. 

 Today's focus on learning disabilities, their identification, and the need for pre-referral 

behavior and academic intervention services is a crucial element of our review of IDEA.

According to the Department's 23rd Annual Report to Congress, slightly less than half of all 

children with disabilities are identified as having learning disabilities. We must examine what 

services these children are being provided within IDEA and what interventions and supports can be 

provided prior to identification. 

 These interventions and support can make special education unnecessary for a number of 

children. However, some with identified learning disabilities will always need the protections and 

services provided under IDEA. 

 In any discussion of intervention services designed to reduce mis-identification, we must 

ensure that those services do not create barriers to those who need special education. Equally 

important in our discussion of intervention services is a need to have them address both academic 

and behavioral difficulties. A great deal of attention has been focused on children who struggle in 

reading. Intervention strategies must also address functional and behavioral problems that children 

experience.

 Lastly, our efforts to examine the identification process and its impact on children must be 

done carefully. We need to continue to focus our efforts on full implementation of IDEA rather 

than seeking changes in the statute merely for the sake of change. This translates into a better 

technical assistance from the Department to states and from states to school districts. And this 

technical assistance is extremely important. In addition, it also demands a stronger enforcement 

role by the Department and possibly other agencies to target serious issues of non-compliance with 

the statute. 

 In closing, Mr. Chairman, I want to thank you for holding this hearing. I look forward to 

working with you on reauthorization in the coming months and next year. 

 Thank you, Mr. Chairman. 

WRITTEN OPENING STATEMENT OF RANKING MINORITY MEMBER DALE E. KILDEE, 

SUBCOMMITTEE ON EDUCATION REFORM, COMMITTEE ON EDUCATION AND THE 

WORKFORCE, U.S. HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES, WASHINGTON, D.C. - SEE 

APPENDIX B 

Chairman Castle. Thank you, Mr. Kildee. You probably heard the bells. We have a procedural 

vote on the floor. Because it is a procedural vote, sometimes there are other procedural votes; we 

aren't sure what is going to happen once we get there. I think the best way to proceed, because of 
5

the importance of the testimony of the first panel and the second panel, is to recess. Before we do 

that, I want to give an opportunity for the introductions of the witnesses. We will withhold their 

statements until after the vote is taken. The reason for that is there is a multitude of individuals 

who want to introduce Mr. Goodling. I don't know if they want to introduce him or just want to talk 

about him. And I want to let both Chairman Boehner and Mr. Platts, who succeeded Mr. Goodling, 

have that opportunity. 

 So let's proceed with that and see where we are time-wise after that. Chairman Boehner. 

Mr. Boehner. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I just want to welcome our good friend and my former 

mentor. He is someone who I pestered mightily when I was a junior member of this committee. 

Bill, we are glad that you are here. We know that you spent many decades in the classroom and 

many decades here in the Congress dealing with IDEA. We know that your testimony can be very 

helpful to us as we reauthorize the bill this year. 

 But for all of you in the audience, Mr. Goodling used to sit in that chair over there. Well, 

he used to sit in that chair where Mr. Kildee is sitting today. I used to sit way off in one of those 

corners and pester him. If Mr. Armey and I couldn't get Mr. Ford angry with us, we would get Mr. 

Goodling angry with us. If you are in a minority and you are a freshman, you didn't have much 

else to do. 

 But over the years, Bill and I have become very good friends. During my years in 

leadership and Bill's early years as chairman, we worked very closely together on a multitude of 

issues. I am just glad to see that you are here. Welcome. 

Chairman Castle. Thank you, Chairman Boehner. As I indicated, Mr. Platts would like to also 

introduce his predecessor. 

Mr. Platts. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I am glad to add my words of welcome to Congressman 

Goodling. To echo the chairman's remarks, we certainly are sorry as a body and nation to have lost 

your expertise here in the committee and in the House. As one who succeeded you, I also have to 

say I am glad to have the opportunity to do so. 

 But I do want to herald that when Congressman Goodling stepped down, he was such a 

wonderful role model for all of us back home as a public servant. Twenty-six years here and for 

me a wonderful role model growing up as a constituent. But also 24 years as an educator. I think I 

have the years right that when he retired from the House, it was 50 years of public service in 

education, as an educator and in education as a Member of Congress. It is certainly an honor to be 

here and be serving, but a true and very distinct honor to be given the privilege of succeeding 

Congressman Goodling. 

As I said to our current chairman, Chairman Boehner when I joined this committee, I share 

the desire, the commitment, and the interest in education. But I know it will take many, many, 

many years until I have even the chance to begin to fill in a small way the shoes of my predecessor, 

Congressman Goodling. It is wonderful to have you here, Bill. Thanks for your testimony today. 
6

Chairman Castle. Thank you, Mr. Platts. We appreciate that introduction as well. I will resist the 

temptation to be the third one to introduce Chairman Goodling, except only to second the great 

comments we have had before. 

 What I am going to do is just go through Dr. Pasternack's background and then we will 

break for the members. We would encourage everybody to come back, because this is very 

significant testimony. Hopefully, it will be after one vote. We will go to the floor and try to figure 

out if that is what the situation is going to be. 

Dr. Pasternack is the Assistant Secretary for Special Education and Rehabilitative Services 

at the U.S. Department of Education, where he serves as principal advisor to the Secretary on all 

issues regarding special education and the IDEA. He is also an ex officio member of the 

President's Commission on Excellence in Special Education. Previously, he served as state director 

of special education for the New Mexico State Department of Education. Dr. Pasternack holds a 

Ph.D. in special education from the University of New Mexico. 

 I have had an opportunity to meet with him. I overheard Mr. Kildee and Dr. Pasternack 

speaking and they have also had an opportunity to meet him. And, indeed, he is a gentleman who 

is as well versed in his field as anybody who has served in that position. We really appreciate him 

doing that, as well as his being here today. 

 So we appreciate both of you being here today. We will stand in brief recess to the call of 

the chair, which hopefully, will be as soon as we can get over and vote and get back if it is only one 

vote. We apologize for the inconvenience, but Chairman Goodling knows what it is all about. 

 We stand in recess. 

 [Recess.] 

Chairman Castle. I think we are going to resume if we can. 

 Just so everybody knows, we may be in a series of odd votes and may have to break again 

at some point or continue the hearing with people going back and forth. Mr. Kildee should be back 

in a minute. But this is important. We want to move forward and get the testimony in. And with 

that, we will turn to a true star witness, the former chairman, Mr. William Goodling. 

STATEMENT OF HON. WILLIAM F. GOODLING, FORMER CHAIRMAN, 

COMMITTEE ON EDUCATION AND THE WORKFORCE, WASHINGTON, 

D.C.

Mr. Goodling. Mr. Chairman, it is great to be back. What I miss most of all is my wonderful staff. 

To show you how bad it is, I went to one funeral a day late. I went to another memorial service a 

week early, because I don't have those pink cards in my pocket telling me where I am supposed to 

be every two seconds of the day. 
7

 I would hope that all of you would have time to read the statement. We put a lot of work 

into that, and I traveled throughout the country and talked to an awful lot of advocates, parents, 

teachers, and administrators. So I hope you will have time to read it. I am going to very quickly 

summarize what I think you should know. 

 I will start out simply by saying I would encourage you not to do massive surgery. I know 

you are going to get those who want you to do massive surgery and you are going to get those who 

want you to retreat on what we did in 1997. I suggest that you do neither. And I say that primarily 

because if you remember, the regulations did not come out for the first two years after the 

reauthorization. So the people back in the trenches are now just completing their second year of 

trying to implement what the regulations said they were to implement. So I encourage you not to 

give them a lot of new regulations on top of what they are presently trying to implement. 

 Secondly, I encourage you to move forward and complete the work that you have to do as 

quickly as you possibly can. 

 If you remember in 1996, we passed a program that we thought was filled with quality from 

one end to the other. We were trying to move the whole effort to have quality education for all of 

the children. The Senate did not act and in 1997 one of the most unbelievable things happened.

We ended up with a bipartisan, bicameral, including a White House, proposal. It was 

overwhelmingly passed. It is the only time that ever happened in my 26 years. So I suggest that 

you let them implement that, because it would appear in my conversations around the country that 

some of the things that we were trying to do to improve the program are beginning to work. 

 I would like to very quickly summarize everything I have to say around the 40 percent 

phenomenon, because it has become the number one political issue. I can remember for the first 12 

years, the only person I could get to help me talk about ``we have got to do something about this 40 

percent'' was Congressman Kildee. Everybody else was talking about all the new programs have 

now. Forget about funding the last program. We have got to do the new things that are out there.

Then Stennie Hoyer eventually came on board. In the last six years, it has become very politically 

popular to please those school board members back there, the school districts, and so on. 

 What I want to point out, however, is that 40 percent does not ensure a quality education for 

children with disabilities. It can, but it does not automatically. I don't know whether moving from 

the 6 percent during my six years as chairman to 13 or 14 percent has improved the quality 

dramatically or not. 

 Let me talk about how it can. If it is used properly, you could attract and keep quality 

teachers. The biggest problem we have at the present time in IDEA is attracting and keeping 

quality teachers. So that money could help you do that. It could help you do that several ways. 

First of all, paperwork is their greatest gripe and greatest complaint. If you are a teacher and you 

have to do an assessment and an IEP or a quality lesson plan for tomorrow's lesson, what are you 

going to do? Well, you are going to do the assessment and IEP. So you could use that money to 

help reduce that paperwork load. Now you can do that other ways. You could use it for increased 

technology to help reduce that paper load. 
8

 You could do it to train non-professional people. That is not the word I want to use. They 

are all professional. But if you could use it to have lay people trained, they could do a lot of that 

and you could keep some of those quality teachers and attract young people into the field. 

 You need to use that money also to make very sure that the regular classroom teacher gets 

the kind of training that they need in order to do their job. Many of the problems that are out there, 

including discipline problems, are due to the fact that the regular classroom teacher has had very 

little training and preparation. On average, there are four special needs youngsters in their class.

You could use it effectively to do that. 

 You could use it to constantly upgrade the special education skills in general classroom 

teachers, because everything is changing. Right now, the physically and emotionally disabled, 

autistic, and all those programs are those, which there is not a great deal known about how you deal 

with the issue. So money could be used for that purpose. 

 If you use the money for early identification and diagnosis, you have to have trained people 

in order to diagnose those disabilities early. This would allow you to prevent an awful lot of overidentification and help an awful lot of young people. But people must be trained in order to notice 

that there is a problem. That has to be done early on. I guess I am saying Part C and Part D need 

all the help you can possibly give them in the program. 

 If we would use some of this money for quality early childhood family literacy programs, it 

would be a great help. If you had quality early childhood and family literacy programs, you could 

prevent an awful lot of young people from having the diagnosis. Now is not the time to reduce 

Even Start funding. Now is the time to increase Even Start funding. I just recently heard that a 

three-year-old child in an affluent home is equal to an adult's vocabulary in a home of poverty. So 

you see how important it is to deal with both the parent and the child. 

 We must also use some of this money to see whether we can find a way to keep some of it 

from going to litigation rather than helping children. I think you really need to take another look at 

that. The tragedy is that oftentimes teacher recommendations are ignored because the school 

district decides that it is too expensive to go on with this suit. So they just settle. That is a real 

challenge.

 In summary, let me say that you have to look at the formula. I don't envy you, because I 

know how that is done. As soon as every member gets the printout, they look to see what they get. 

If they don't do well, then it is a bad formula. Forget about whether it was good for education or 

good for children. But you probably will have to look at it, because 40 percent could be 80 percent 

in some districts, in some states. It could be 20 percent in other states. So you will probably have 

to look at that. 

 Let me summarize simply by saying that this 40 percent phenomenon must translate into a 

quality program for all children. Funding and accountability must go hand in hand. Otherwise, you 

are not going to increase the opportunities for young children with disabilities to get a better 

education. Of course, that means your oversight responsibility is tremendous. Whether that will 
9

happen or not will depend primarily on your oversight ability. 

 Let me just close by reminding you of that picture up on the wall. The lips move all the 

time. And what do those lips say? They say, ``Quality, not quantity.'' They say, ``Results, not 

process.'' So you will hear that constantly as you are marking up the legislation. 

 Thank you for the opportunity to testify. 

WRITTEN STATEMENT OF HON. WILLIAM F. GOODLING, FORMER CHAIRMAN, 

COMMITTEE ON EDUCATION AND THE WORKFORCE, WASHINGTON, D.C. – SEE 

APPENDIX C 

Chairman Castle. Thank you, Chairman Goodling. Thank you for the warning about what we 

might hear from the lips up here as well. We really appreciate your being here. It is tremendous to 

have you. 

Secretary Pasternack, we are also very interested in your testimony. You are next, sir. 

STATEMENT OF ROBERT PASTERNACK, ASSISTANT SECRETARY 

FOR SPECIAL EDUCATION AND REHABILITATION SERVICES, U.S. 

DEPARTMENT OF EDUCATION, WASHINGTON, D.C. 

Mr. Pasternack. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. It is a privilege to be here this morning. Thank you 

for the opportunity. 

 I would like to start by sharing with you that when Isaac Newton was asked how he had 

managed to see the world the way he did, he said it was because he stood on the shoulders of 

giants. That was how he was able to see the world as he did. So it is a privilege for me to be here 

this morning next to a giant, someone with a legacy of supporting kids with disabilities and their 

families. Thank you for allowing me the opportunity to be on the same panel with him. 

 It is also a great privilege for me to be testifying before you the same morning that you have 

invited my best friend and former college roommate, a guy that I actually taught in the same 

elementary school with. That is Reid Lyon. When we taught in the same elementary school, he 

taught third grade and I taught first grade. We both decided that neither one of us were trained very 

well on how to teach kids to read. Unfortunately, Mr. Chairman and members of the committee, I 

am sad to tell you that things haven't changed very much. 

 Part of the reason why I am here this morning is to talk about the fact that out of the 6.5 

million kids with disabilities currently receiving special education, 2.8 million of those children are 

in one of our 13 categories of eligibility. That is the category of specific learning disability. Now, 

we know that there are seven types of learning disabilities. However, 80 to 90 percent of the kids 

in that category are there because they don't do one thing very well. That is they don't read. What 

we see is some problem differentiating those students who could learn to read if they were taught 
10

by highly qualified, well-trained personnel using scientifically based instructional practices. 

 Now, if those conditions existed in our public schools and if in fact teachers were being 

trained in how to do that, we think that we would see a significant difference in the kids who 

eventually displayed these kinds of intractable reading problems. We know that learning 

disabilities exist. There has been an incredible amount of very well done science to guide us in this 

area including converging science, neuro-imaging data, genetic data, and functional MRI data.

That science is attributable to Dr. Lyon and his colleagues at NICHD. What we have learned from 

those longitudinal, multi-site studies of cohorts of kids is that there is a sub-group of kids who will 

not learn to read even when they are taught by highly qualified personnel using scientifically based 

instructional strategies. Those are kids who really do have disabilities. Those are kids that should 

be in special education. 

 However, from the studies that we have done at OSEP, we see that the kids currently in that 

category constitute a very heterogeneous group of kids. Part of that heterogeneity is due to the fact 

that the current regulations that are in place talk about a model of identifying kids with learning 

disabilities that has been in place since the mid-'70s. That model focuses on identifying a 

discrepancy between ability and achievement. 

 We think that we predict or identify ability by giving an IQ test. Right now, Mr. Chairman 

and members of the committee, there are about a million IQ tests a year given in this country. 

What we know from the work that has been done on IQ testing is that IQ tests don't predict much of 

anything. What they do is measure accumulated knowledge and don't help us identify a kid's 

ability.

 What we would like to talk with you about and what we have been talking about in the 

testimony, we have heard across the country during the work that we have been doing the last six 

months on the President's Commission on Excellence in Special Education. I am proud to serve a 

President who thought enough about special education to create a presidential commission on 

Excellence in Special Education. We have heard no scientist that has come before us that supports 

the continuation of the IQ achievement model for identifying kids with learning disabilities. That 

is in fact a regulatory issue. One of the things that we hope to be talking with you and members of 

the committee about is the opportunity to change the statute to give us the ability to change the 

regulations, which focus on a practice that is fundamentally flawed and does not allow us to get the 

kids early. 

 Mr. Chairman, during the last 10 years we have seen about a 40 percent increase in the 

number of kids with learning disabilities that have been identified and placed in special education.

The overwhelming majority of those kids are identified between the ages of 12 and 17 years of age. 

What we know from science is that that is too late. We have a model where we are waiting for kids 

to fail before we identify them as having a disability and placing them in special education. The 

best science available tells us that the earlier we identify these problems and the earlier we get to 

these kids, the higher the probability of successfully intervening and changing their life trajectory 

and helping them learn to read. If we continue a model where we are waiting for these kids to fail, 

then we are not doing what needs to be done. 
11

 So what I would submit to you is that the model that we have evolved, where we focus on a 

diagnosis for classification rather than diagnosis for instructional purposes, needs to be changed.

As someone on the Commission said, ``It is time for us to drive a stake through the heart of the 

model that we have used to identify kids with learning disabilities in this country.'' 

 In closing, I would like to say that we know that learning disabilities exist. We know that 

they are real. We know that they are life-long. We know that their effect is pervasive. And we 

know that we have to go ahead and provide specially designed instruction to those kids who really 

do have learning disabilities. But the problem is we have kids in that category that really should 

not be in that category. The way to get them out of that category is to do what Dave Gordon has 

done at the Elk Grove schools. That is to teach kids how to read by having highly qualified 

teachers who get sustained, comprehensive, job-embedded professional development and use a 

scientifically based, proven, effective instructional model. Teach kids for two-and-a-half hours a 

day, K through 6, on how to read. What you will hear from him is that by doing that in Elk Grove, 

he went from 16 percent of his kids in special education to 9 percent of his kids in special 

education.

 It is not about kicking kids out of special education. It is not about shutting down special 

education. It is about bringing the right kids into special education, kids who really have 

disabilities.

 I look forward to the opportunity to respond to your questions and to continue to discuss 

this very important issue. Thank you for the opportunity to be here this morning. 

WRITTEN STATEMENT OF ROBERT PASTERNACK, ASSISTANT SECRETARY FOR 

SPECIAL EDUCATION AND REHABILITATION SERVICES, U.S. DEPARTMENT OF 

EDUCATION, WASHINGTON, D.C. – SEE APPENDIX D 

Chairman Castle. Thank you, Secretary Pasternack. Before I begin the five-minute questioning 

process by yielding to myself, I would just like to make a comment. In reading all of the testimony 

that I had available to me before the hearing today, I was struck by the intensity, knowledge, and 

desire of all of our witnesses today who want to make this system better. But also by the fact that 

they believe if we do not make adjustments to the system, it will not necessarily improve and that 

there are decisions that have to be made. 

 You obviously hit the one that stood out in everyone's testimony. That is reading, which is 

a very significant matter. I say that because in the past this has become strictly a funding issue. I 

think the funding issue is a significant and difficult issue, as Chairman Goodling pointed out. But 

the bottom line is that there is a lot more to be looked at besides funding that would advantage 

these young people and give them opportunities. I hope that everyone who is focused on IDEA this 

year will realize that we need to look at opportunities for improvements as well as the funding 

mechanism so that we can do exactly what Chairman Goodling mentioned that we did back in 1997 

when we had a bipartisan, bicameral White House, congressional piece of legislation. Let's take 

the next steps beyond that. That was a heck of an improvement, but let's take the next step. 
12

 Let me yield to myself for five minutes of questioning. And let me start with Chairman 

Goodling, if I can. You discussed the funding formula for IDEA. Correct me if I don't say this 

quite accurately. My understanding of IDEA funding is that the federal role is to provide up to 40 

percent of the funding. As you know, we did not do that. You have been, without a doubt in my 

mind, the strongest advocate for increasing the federal funding formula for many years. Only in 

recent years have we started to do this and have more than doubled it in terms of the percentage 

that we have increased it. 

 But I have always understood that essentially you are dealing with a whole pot of 100 

percent. What we are doing is we are increasing the federal percentage of it, which reduces the 

need for the local and state government to make up the rest. However, it doesn't necessarily add 

more dollars to the overall funding for IDEA. In terms of improving it, is it your assumption that if 

money is freed up, some of that money would come back into IDEA as well as be freed up for 

other educational expenditures? 

Mr. Goodling. Of course, any additional money that they receive in the local district means that 

they now have extra money to do whatever it is they want to do within the district. My concern is 

that one of those things is to help improve the quality of special education programs. I think that 

may not happen unless they hear that over and over and over again. 

 Now when you talk about C and D, which of course here you are talking about teacher 

training, you are talking about research. This is so important and I would hope those funds could 

be increased. I don't know how many years it has been since we have increased D money. If I 

understand the formula, and of course the formula experts are sitting up there, I tried to stay as far 

as I could from those. However, as I understand the formula, I believe that 40 percent - and, again, 

let me make sure we understand 40 percent of the average cost to educate a non-disabled child. At 

the present time if we do math easily, we will say that average is $7,000. So 40 percent is $2,800, 

and you should be spending $2,800 per child. Is that right, Sally? Okay, I checked with the experts 

here.

 But I believe that that could send some states beyond that and some states below that. So it 

is something that I think you will have to look at. If you don't, I know what is going to happen. As 

the Members look at what they get, it becomes a real problem. 

Chairman Castle. Actually, you have raised an interesting question, because it is important that 

we understand the formula. It is a little more complex than just 40 percent. 

Mr. Goodling. It is very complex. 

Chairman Castle. Let me turn to Secretary Pasternack for a moment. I was very interested in your 

statement as well and you are going to hear more about reading later today. I could not be in 

greater agreement with you. If we start to identify people as having learning disabilities when they 

are 12, you can almost forget it. Quite frankly, I think that if you start to identify them when they 

are five, you may have problems. I would be interested in your views on very early preparation. I 

don't want to call it necessarily education, but do you believe Head Start, daycare, the Federal 

Government, as well as the early reading money that has gone into the No Child Left Behind 
13

legislation from last year will make a difference? Are you looking at that? Are you in your role of 

worrying about special education, overseeing how this is being implemented as well as the 

connection between this and special education or removing children from special education? 

Mr. Pasternack. Thanks for the question. I think one of the challenges to us is to use science and 

evidence to guide policy and infuse science into politics, which is your profession and not mine. 

Thank God. The opportunity that we have to do the right thing is difficult when you have so many 

people who are passionately clinging to their beliefs and their experiences and choose to ignore 

some of the evidence that is available. The evidence that we have is that the earlier we can get the 

kids, the higher the probability of successfully intervening in the lives of those kids. 

 You mentioned Head Start as an example. I think one of the things that we know from 

science is that the larger the number of letters that a child can identify before that child enters 

school is highly predictive of that child's future success in learning to read. Yet, students leave 

Head Start on average only identifying one letter of the alphabet according to the large-scale 

evaluative studies that have been done. What that suggests is that Head Start is a wonderful 

program and has done a great deal of good for lots of kids, but it is not rigorous enough in our view 

in terms of preparing students with the pre-academic skills that they need in order to benefit from 

instruction once they enter kindergarten. 

 You mentioned Early Childhood. One of the responsibilities that I have is to chair the 

Federal Interagency Coordinating Council. This council is supposed to advise nine cabinet 

agencies on early childhood issues, particularly early childhood issues affecting kids with 

disabilities. Our hope is that by integrating services and collaborating across agencies, we can 

prevent kids from developing the conditions. This makes it difficult for them to benefit from 

education once they enter public school. There is an incredible opportunity there for us if we work 

with daycare programs and if we build family literacy skills. We know, for example, that lap time, 

a child - when I was talking with Congressman Kildee about his grandkids the other day, he was 

telling me about reading to them. 

 Well, I read to my grandkids as well. I think many of us as parents read to our kids. If you 

can't read, then you can't read to your children. We know this from well-done research that just an 

opportunity to sit on the lap of a parent and hear the parent read is incredibly helpful to kids 

learning language. And that language learning is helping them prepare to learn to read. 

 So to the question that you asked about Reading First and Early Reading First, I applaud the 

bipartisan, bicameral approach to the most fundamental education reform that we have seen in the 

last 35 years. We hope that those programs will significantly improve reading acquisition for all 

kids.

Mr. Chairman, 40 percent of kids are going to learn to read despite what we do to them 

when they go to school. Our challenge is to focus on the other kids who are at risk of having 

difficulty learning to read. Now we know that direct, systematic instruction will help most of those 

kids to read. But the 2 to 6 percent of the total school population that have intractable reading 

problems are the kids that we are really struggling to identify the right kinds of strategies. I am sad 

to say that 27 years into the implementation of this law, we still haven't identified the most 
14

effective instructional practices to be able to use with that small group of kids that really do have 

disabilities and really do have these intractable, persistent reading problems. 

 But what I can tell you is that giving them IQ tests and trying to identify this discrepancy 

between ability and achievement will not improve our ability to instruct these kids. It is about 

providing high-quality, scientifically based instruction, which will give them the kind of reading 

skills that we need them to have to be able to benefit from future instruction down the road. 

Chairman Castle. I appreciate that. As you sat there and told us the story of reading to the child, I 

worry about the children whose parents cannot read at all. That is a comment, not a question, 

because I am going to turn to Mr. Scott for the next round of questioning. There are a lot of 

societal concerns that we are going to have to undertake in order to prevent the problems that exist. 

Mr. Scott? 

Mr. Scott. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. And I want to thank our witnesses. Comment has been 

made about how this passed last time on a bipartisan basis. That would not have been possible 

without the leadership from this committee. IDEA can often be very controversial. And, it took 

strong leadership to get everybody together. And, Mr. Goodling, I want to thank you for providing 

that leadership. 

Secretary Pasternack, if you don't use the IQ tests, what should you use? 

Mr. Pasternack. Thank you, Mr. Scott. We believe we should actually be using a problem-solving 

approach where you would have three tiers of the identification process. The first tier would be 

you use the--since we are talking about reading, and since 80 and 90 percent of the kids in the LD 

category have problems in reading, I will just confine my response to the reading problem. There 

is a basal approach to teaching reading. However, some kids don't benefit from that approach. 

Those kids would then go to the second tier, which includes programs like Title I and Title VII. 

These are the supplemental programs that are available through the fine work that Congress has 

done in creating those programs. 

 Then you have some kids who don't even benefit from that level of intervention. Those are 

the kids who would get the kind of assessment that we would be talking about, which is really just 

an assessment of their reading deficits. Then based on assessing their reading deficits, one could 

begin to decide that a kid needs special education. The assessments would then help the teachers to 

develop an instructional model, which would allow them to help teach the kid how to read. 

 So it is a problem-solving model. It is currently in use in the state of Idaho where as a state 

they basically said we don't need to use an IQ achievement discrepancy model to identify kids with 

learning disabilities. Interestingly enough, the percentage of kids with learning disabilities has 

remained pretty much the same in that state. But they are convinced that the kinds of kids they are 

identifying are really kids who do have learning disabilities and they are able to spend their money 

differently. Rather than wasting it on unnecessary assessments, they are able to use assessments 

that can help teachers identify the instructional needs of kids rather than talking about whether a 
15

kid have an IQ of 80 or 90 or 100. 

Mr. Scott. Well, after you have gone through that evaluation process, how do you differentiate 

between someone who has a deficit because of a learning disability and someone who has a deficit 

because they were just subjected to a bad educational process? 

Mr. Pasternack. The most important decision that needs to be made is documenting failure to 

respond to scientifically base instructional practices delivered by highly qualified personnel. When 

you have that kind of documentation, you can be convinced that the kid you are looking at really 

does have an intractable reading problem, a specific learning disability in the area of reading. Then 

people can make the second tier of that decision, which determines whether that student needs 

specially designed instruction provided through special education. 

Mr. Scott. Now does all this evaluation process take so long as to violate your principle of 

providing the services as early as possible? 

Mr. Pasternack. That is a great question. I would hope not. I think right now we are seeing 

school psychologists who aren't able to help. They are spending too much of their time attending 

meetings and providing what has been described as a legal inoculation. This is where districts are 

so worried about failing to comply with the process parts of the regulations that the school 

psychologists don't have the opportunity to actually administer the kinds of tests that they have 

been trained to administer in helping implement these problem-solving models and doing things 

like functional behavioral assessments and developing positive behavior intervention plans instead 

of spending. 

 For example, I was in Palm Beach and they have got 70 school psychologists. When I 

asked them what they spent the majority of their time doing, they said they spend most of it going 

to meetings. As a school psychologist, I don't believe that is what I was trained to do. I was 

trained to help kids. I think many school psychologists and many special-ed teachers that 

Chairman Goodling alluded to are frustrated by the fact that they are spending too much of their 

time filling out paperwork and going to meetings and therefore they don't have time to actually 

provide high quality instruction. 

Mr. Scott. I think we are hearing results of a process - 

Mr. Pasternack. You are sure hearing it from me. 

Mr. Scott. - in what you just said. If we use more of Part C, could we reduce the need for Part B 

services? 

Mr. Pasternack. Absolutely. 

Mr. Scott. Good. What can we do to increase the service - we do all this evaluation, what can we 

do to increase the quality of services that are provided. You mentioned training. You also 

mentioned Iowa. In terms of suspensions, there is one study in Iowa that was done where they 

showed they came in with services to the teachers, showing them best practices where they reduced 
16

the number of suspensions from something in the hundreds to a handful. What should we be doing 

to increase the quality of services after you have evaluated someone? 

Mr. Pasternack. No matter what we do in statute, no matter what we do in regulation, and no 

matter what we do in funding, if we don't have highly-qualified personnel teaching our kids, we are 

never going to get to the improved results that the President is demanding and that the Congress 

has the right to expect and that parents want to see. 

 As an example, I am frustrated by the fact that when you go out and talk to teachers around 

the country, they don't know about something as fundamentally important as progress monitoring. 

This is where you sit with a kid and you ask that kid in one minute to read to you and you count 

how many words that kid correctly reads in a one-minute probe. This doesn't require technology, it 

requires the equipment that you have in your hand, which is a pencil and a piece of paper. It is not 

an expensive approach and yet we don't have teachers who are trained on how to do that. 

 I believe that we have to work with our colleagues in higher ed to find out why they are not 

training teachers differently based on the science that is available now that wasn't available 10 

years ago. When I was trained, I wasn't trained on how to teach kids how to read. I believe I was 

guilty of malpractice back then and I believe many of our teachers want to do the right thing. They 

are not malicious in trying to deny kids free and appropriate public education; they just don't have 

the skills. 

 So I believe it is about pre-service preparation. And it is about high-quality, comprehensive, 

sustained job-embedded professional development. 

Mr. Scott. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. 

Chairman Castle. Thank you, Mr. Scott. 

Mr. Wilson? 

Mr. Wilson. I was very interested in your concern about paperwork. You indicated interest in 

providing more modern technology to assist the teachers in preparing the IEPs. Are there any 

efforts being made to reduce the size of the IEPs or to simplify them in addition to use of 

technology?

Mr. Goodling. What I see happening out there, as I ask people, ``Where did that regulation come 

from?'' is the state, trying to make very sure that they are complying with whatever the Federal 

Government wants. They pour it on. Then the local district adds additional regulations in order to 

make sure that they are following the line that they are supposed to follow. 

 Yes, if we could assure the state and the local district that you are meeting those regulations 

and they are simple enough to understand, then I think you could reduce that paperwork. 

 But, again, I think you could solve an awful lot of these problems if you could have paraprofessionals properly trained to help and if you could have teachers, both in the regular classroom, 
17

properly trained to deal with the issue. 

 That is why I said C and D money is extremely important, because you are talking about 

research. You are talking about teacher training. You are talking about re-training. 

 So in answer to your question, yes, I think it could be reduced dramatically. I think it has to 

be reduced dramatically, because these people are leaving the profession because they want to 

teach. Young people are not coming into the profession because they have heard of all of these 

horror stories about how teachers have to spend all their time on assessments, IEPS, and so on. As 

a result, they don't have time to prepare a decent lesson. 

Mr. Pasternack. Mr. Wilson, as we move forward, I hope that we can talk about the fact that right 

now we have a system that cares more about who is in an IEP rather than what is on an IEP. 

There aren't enough trees in America to keep slaughtering them at the rate that we are slaughtering 

them in the name of providing specially designed instruction to kids with disabilities. 

 We have to make this process simpler, and we have to focus on a model where we ask four 

fundamental questions: Where is the kid now? Where is he going to get to? How are you going to 

get him there? And how are you going to know when the kid gets there? That is what an IEP 

should be about. But instead you have people whose fear of a lawsuit is driving the kinds of 

discussions and the kinds of decisions that they are making rather than focusing on providing a 

high-quality program to kids that is designed to provide measurable results. And then we just need 

to go about measuring the results. 

 Chairman Goodling is exactly right. We are losing competent, qualified, and dedicated 

people in alarming numbers because they are spending too much of their time going to meetings 

and filling out paperwork. We did a national study that documents that sad fact. 

Mr. Wilson. I do understand it from two angles. My wife is a teacher. I have also had the 

opportunity to meet with educators for my children for IEPs and it has worked out beautifully. It is 

just that I thought I was educated. Then I was overwhelmed with the minutia of what I thought was 

in the IEP. In fact, I was really intrigued by your pointing out the four points. It seems to me that 

would have been sufficient. I didn't need to know how to make a watch. Indeed, I, again, thought I 

was fairly educated until I was overwhelmed with more information than I ever wanted to know, 

understand, or comprehend. 

 And so I really look forward to efforts at simplification for educators and for parents. 

 I have no further questions. 

Chairman Castle. Thank you, Mr. Wilson. 

Mr. Owens. 

Mr. Owens. Mr. Chairman, I am pleased to welcome our former chairman back and I am glad to 

hear that he is looking over our shoulders. We certainly want to make certain that we follow 
18

through on some of the commitments that were made. And the 40 percent to IDEA is one of those 

commitments that is long overdue. 

 I just want to start by asking you to clarify a little confusion there before about how the 

formula works. Is it appropriate to assume that the 40 percent of whatever is being expended 

would be met and the money freed up from a local education agency can be used somewhere else 

for local education so that everybody gains regardless of whether everybody gets the same, is that 

correct?

Mr. Goodling. Yes, I think you have to look at the formula simply because, as I understand the 

formulas, one state could be getting 60 or 70 percent. Another state might be getting 30 percent as 

you move toward ``full funding.'' 

 But it is very important that that money is freeing up an awful lot of demands that the local 

school district has for all of their students. But when they get that money, they shouldn't forget that 

improving the quality of a special education program is very, very important. 

 And then, as I also said, increase C and D so that you can really do some of the things that 

have to be done in order to improve the education for all children. 

Mr. Owens. Is it correct to assume that that 40 percent is kind of open-ended; it is like an 

entitlement, right? 

Mr. Goodling. Pardon? 

Mr. Owens. The 40 percent promised by the Federal Government is kind of open-ended, it doesn't 

have a cap on it, right? 

Mr. Goodling. Well, when the program started, it wasn't a mandate. No one was mandated to 

participate in the federal special education program. You would have been a fool not to take the 

federal dollars, because the courts were going to make sure you were doing what you should be 

doing for children with disabilities. But it was not a mandate. The 40 percent was all confused, 

because what was in Senate language was that Congress would strive to get to 40 percent of the 

average cost to educate a non-special ed student. As I said earlier, the average cost today is 

something like $7,000. So 40 percent of that is $2,800. 

 So you would be as the Federal Government sending $2,800 back for each student that was 

in special education. That is why I always said not to focus on over-identification, because of the 

money. The $2,800 is not going to get them very far, because the cost may be 10 times as great for 

an individual student. 

 But I think you have to look at the formula. I can just see everybody up here. They will 

look at the print outs and ask how their district or state did. I think you could get a discrepancy in 

relationship to the 40 percent due to the way the different formulas are set up at the present time. 
19

Mr. Owens. But even the $2,800 hypothetical figure would be on a per pupil basis. So the number 

of pupils would determine ultimately the amount of money that the local education agency would 

receive?

Mr. Goodling. Today, you should be sending $2,800 per pupil back to the state, per pupil who is in 

IDEA.

Mr. Owens. Now, you mentioned over-identification and the major problem in a large urban area 

like New York City where I have parents in revolt against special education because they feel too 

great a number of their youngsters are being routed to special education as an easy answer to a 

discipline problem, a behavior problem, maybe a slight emotional problem, and the figures keep 

growing. And I understand from some study that was done, it is not just New York City, that it is a 

problem all over. 

 In your perspective now, having backed away from things a bit, do you have any ideas 

about how we could work with that problem a little more? I once proposed an amendment 

whereby we have a transition period to allow funding for a transition program to come out of the 

special education funds for discipline problems in youngsters who might have been misidentified 

so that we would transition out of this problem of over-identification and hopefully one day 

establish programs that are designed to deal with behavior problems and deal with them separately 

as behavior problems. Either one of you that might have - Mr. Pasternack, you might have an 

answer to that problem, too. 

Mr. Goodling. In outlining what I thought could happen if you got to 40 percent - early 

identification is just so important for these young people - and programs, if you remember, I 

constantly told the Members that Head Start early on was not giving these children a head start at 

all. Every study that was done told us that. Title I was not giving children an opportunity to 

improve their academic achievement at all, and every study showed us that. I kept harping on the 

fact that we have got to talk in terms of quality, quality, quality in those programs. That is why, of 

course, I am harping today on C and D, because the research, the preparation of teachers, the 

preparation of those who identify, helping teachers and administrators deal better with parents are 

very important if we are going to improve the quality of education for those with disabilities. 

 What I cautioned was don't get carried away with the 40 percent as a political argument. 

Make sure that we are talking about quality, quality, quality for the children that we are trying to 

help.

Mr. Pasternack. Congressman Owens, I was just in Brooklyn on Saturday talking to a group of 

parents of kids with disabilities, and I have great empathy for Chancellor Levy in trying to serve a 

district with 1.2 million students in it. I know that he faces great challenges. 

 The issue that you raise about kids with behavior problems is very complicated. Head Start 

around the country has reported that the number one increase in requests for technical assistance is 

about young kids between the ages of 3 and 5 years of age with behavior problems. I think one of 

the things that we are seeing, particularly in school age kids with behavior problems, is that the 

reason that they have behavior problems is because they fail to learn how to read. That frustration 
20

leads them to both act out and act inwardly. One of the things that I am concerned about is the fact 

that we have done a much better job acting out kids that we call externalizers. These are the kids 

who act out and who are easily identified, and we haven't done as good a job identifying the kids 

who withdraw and are depressed and become kids who refuse to go to school and are at higher risk 

for suicide and things like that. 

 We see many kids who enter the juvenile justice system because of their failure to succeed 

in school. An interesting statistic, very quickly, is that there is more juvenile crime committed 

during the school year than during the summer. One would speculate that there would be more 

juvenile crime committed during the summer, because of idle hands being linked to doing the 

devil's work. But the hypothesis that underlies that is that the kids are frustrated by their lack of 

success in school during the school year. That is one of the reasons why they commit some of the 

acts that they do. 

 I think that we should free up some of the school psychologists and the people who provide 

related services in schools to provide some help to the very difficult issue that you raise. They 

should be identifying why these kids are having behavior problems and developing programs to 

help intervene with the behavior problems that these kids are having, rather than focusing on the 

administration of tests. 

Mr. Goodling. May I just add that I have been telling the administration over and over again to 

avoid focusing on every child reading at the third grade level at the end of third grade. Instead, 

focus on every child reading at the first grade level at the end of first grade. If they are not reading 

at the first grade level at the end of first grade, I can assure you that millions will not be reading at 

the third grade level at the end of third grade. They will not read at the first grade level at the end 

of first grade unless they have a quality family literacy program prior to that for millions of 

children. As the Secretary has said over and over again, we can reduce identification for IDEA 

dramatically if we can deal with that reading problem. 

Chairman Castle. Thank you, Mr. Owens. 

Mr. Goodling. Reading readiness problem. 

Chairman Castle. I will now yield to Ms. Woolsey for five minutes. I would like to point out that 

we are reacquainting her with her favorite chairman. I don't remember the two of them ever 

disagreeing about anything in the whole time they were together. 

 [Laughter.] 

Ms. Woolsey. We didn't disagree, did we, Mr. Chairman? 

Mr. Goodling. Thank you for the letter. 

Ms. Woolsey. You are welcome. Thank you for dropping by my office. You are wearing your 

retirement well, and it is nice to have you back here. 
21

 Now, I wasn't here, I am sorry, for your testimony, but I am going to assume you talked 

about funding for IDEA and you talked about quality educators. So I want to ask you a question 

about funding. We have finally put some more money through appropriations into the states for 

IDEA, not 40 percent. But what I am finding in my state of California that our governor has taken 

that increase and put it some place else. Well, I mean he has put it in IDEA and then taken that 

amount they were putting into it and moved it to some place else in education or to some place else 

in the state budget. So instead of supplementing with the increase, they are supplanting. And we 

are going to be reauthorizing, and I would suggest you could help us maybe with some language 

that would make that not possible for states. What good is it for us to reach 40 percent and then 

have them not use it? 

Mr. Goodling. As I indicated both in my testimony and in answer to some questions, if you do not 

do an outstanding oversight job, my greatest fear is that the 40 percent will be a political 

accomplishment and make an awful lot of people feel good back in districts. It will do nothing to 

improve the education of children with disabilities. 

 So you are going to have to be very, very vigilant. If they get that additional money, that 

frees them up from using all sorts of money that they would have for other purposes. They should 

concentrate on how could they improve the quality of education for the disabled. That is the 

purpose of the money. 

Ms. Woolsey. And that is the purpose of the money. 

Mr. Goodling. This is why I said you are going to have to be very careful for your formula. 

Ms. Woolsey. Well, both of you, I am sure you - in your testimony, you have given us lots of good 

ideas and I certainly know you have a lot of good ideas, Mr. Chairman. Are there bad ideas that 

are being kicked around that we should be aware of before we reauthorize? 

Mr. Goodling. What I had said in my initial statement was that I would be very careful that - 

Ms. Woolsey. You keep reminding me that I was not here for that. You are always nagging at me. 

Mr. Goodling. I had said in my initial statement that you have to be very careful in my estimation 

that you don't do massive surgery. We did that in 1996 and 1997. The regulations were delayed a 

couple of years before they were ever published. Therefore, you have states and school districts 

just in their second year of implementation. 

 As I travel the country, it appears that some of the things that we were trying to do to 

improve the quality of the program are working. But they are just in the business of getting those 

regulations down the way they should be. So I cautioned against giving them a lot of new 

regulations or you will have them going through this same process all over again and it won't result 

necessarily in quality education for disabled children. 

Ms. Woolsey. Mr. Pasternack? 
22

Mr. Goodling. So fine tune, I am saying. 

Ms. Woolsey. Fine-tune but not operate. 

Mr. Goodling. There needs to be some fine-tuning. 

Mr. Pasternack. I think that one of the bad ideas is to do nothing to the IDEA and leave it in its 

current form. In my view and from what I hear from practitioners, parents, and kids, we have got to 

go ahead and make the law simpler. It has gotten way too complicated. 

 A bad idea is to continue focusing on process and not to change our focus to accountability 

for results. A bad idea is not to put any more money into it. I am proud to serve a President that 

asked for the largest single presidentially requested increase in IDEA funding in history.

I think there are bad ideas about not using the science and the evidence that we have to 

guide policy and inform us on how we make this change in order to focus more on results and 

accountability for those results rather than policy, procedure, and more regulation. 

 It is an interesting question. No one has ever asked a question like that. That is a very 

interesting way to pose a question. And that would be an initial response. I would like to think 

about that some more. 

Mr. Goodling. It would be a bad idea not to increase funding dramatically in C and D. 

Ms. Woolsey. Okay, thank you very much. 

Mr. Pasternack. Amen. 

Ms. Woolsey. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. 

Chairman Castle. Thank you, Ms. Woolsey. On the issue of C and D, just for everyone's 

edification, it is my understanding that the C program is for the younger program. I think the D 

program is for research. This is basically funding which is outside of the formula, is that correct? 

Just to underline what it is that we are saying about the formula and the C and D references we 

have here today. 

Mr. Pasternack. C is for our program that serves infants and toddlers, birth through 2 years of age.

Part D funds things like research, as you mentioned, personnel preparation, our parent training and 

information centers, which is a critically important service that we provide, and some other related 

programs. 

Chairman Castle. They are not part of the B formula, which goes back to the schools for the 

children with disabilities, is that correct? 
23

Mr. Pasternack. That is correct, Mr. Chairman. Those are our discretionary dollars as opposed to 

the formula dollars. 

 Mr. Goodling could not be more right in saying that we have got to invest more in those 

things in order to improve results under Part B. 

Chairman Castle. Well, I am going to resist the temptation to have a second round of questioning 

here, because we have another panel. However, it is a temptation. This has been very 

enlightening. We very much appreciate your testimony here today. We also know you are both 

individuals with busy schedules, and we appreciate your taking the time to join us. Obviously, we 

welcome Chairman Goodling back at any time for his reunion with everybody here. 

 So we thank you. 

Mr. Goodling. And you can demand that the Secretary come back. 

Chairman Castle. Oh, that is correct. Or we can subpoena if worst comes to worst. No, thank 

you. We really appreciate it. 

Mr. Pasternack. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. 

Chairman Castle. Why don't we formulate the second panel. We may try to keep this rolling, 

because we are going to start to lose time. So if the next group could gather at the table, we will 

start the hearing. Somebody may take over for me when I go to vote, and we will keep it going that 

way.

 Let me introduce the three witnesses. The first is Dr. G. Reid Lyon. Dr. Reid Lyon is a 

research psychologist and the chief of the Child Development and Behavior Branch of the National 

Institute of Child Health and Human Development. He serves as an ex officio member of the 

President's Commission on Excellence in Special Education. Prior to joining the NIH, he served as 

a faculty member at Northwestern University and the University of Vermont. He holds a Ph.D. 

from the University of New Mexico with a dual concentration in psychology and development 

disabilities.

 I might say he is well named. We have begun to ``lionize'' quite a few things around here.

We discussed what he has done in his department when we did OERI. I was at a discussion 

recently in which your name came up again in terms of duplicating how you have done things. So 

we appreciate all you have done and look forward to hearing from you today. 

 Our second witness in this particular group will be Dr. Joe Kovaleski, who is the Director of 

Pupil Services at Cornwall-Lebanon School District in Lebanon, Pennsylvania. He previously 

served as a director of research and evaluation for the instructional support system of Pennsylvania. 

Dr. Kovaleski currently serves as a member of the editorial board of School Psychology Review 

and is a member of the National Association of School Psychologists Cadre on IDEA. He holds a 

Doctor of Education degree from Penn State. 
24

Mr. David W. Gordon is the superintendent of the Elk Grove Unified School District in Elk 

Grove, California and serves as a member of the President's Commission on Excellence in Special 

Education. Prior to assuming his current position, he served as assistant superintendent of 

elementary education for Elk Grove Unified. He holds a Master of Education degree in educational 

administration from Harvard University. 

 We appreciate all of you being here. What we are going to do is start this, Dr. Lyon. If 

somebody comes back to replace me, we will continue it. If not, we will have to break to go from 

there. We expect somebody to return shortly. 

 So, Dr. Reid Lyon. 

STATEMENT OF G. REID LYON, RESEARCH PSYCHOLOGIST AND 

CHIEF, CHILD DEVELOPMENT AND BEHAVIOR BRANCH, NATIONAL 

INSTITUTE OF CHILD HEALTH AND HUMAN DEVELOPMENT, 

ROCKVILLE, MARYLAND

Mr. Lyon. Thank you, Chairman Castle. And thank you for the kind remarks. It is an honor to be 

here and an honor to follow the two previous witnesses. As you know, Chairman Goodling was a 

champion of infusing science into educational practice and policy. It was delightful to see him. 

Representative Ehlers is not here, but he also was a strong advocate for making sure that what we 

do with children is supported and informed by the best science we have available. And to you, sir, 

for that equal emphasis on making sure that what we use with children has been shown to work. 

 It is easy for me to make this testimony this morning, because I can summarize only what 

has been already said. I don't need to take us down other paths other than to say that we can do 

much better with children who have learning disabilities by putting in place that which has been 

discussed already. 

 We know that many of the youngsters who are now identified as learning disabled are in 

fact mis-identified, primarily because they haven't been taught effectively in classroom situations. 

That means that the amount of instruction that has to be provided to all of the children in LD is 

diffused, diluted, and not being given to those children who most effectively need it. 

 That occurs for a variety of reasons that have already been mentioned. Learning disabilities 

and kids with learning disabilities are typically identified at older ages. The largest influx of 

youngsters coming into the system are 11 to 17 years of age. The reason for that is that we now 

have in place a set of criteria, which requires that kids manifest an IQ achievement discrepancy, a 

gap between two psychometric measures. That gap typically does not show itself until the kid is 

about 9 to 10 years of age. By that time, the youngster has already failed for two, three, four, or 

five years. Motivation to learn is very minimal. 

 Secondly, we have youngsters going into both special education and classroom settings 

where the teachers have not been prepared, as Secretary Pasternack indicated, to address the 
25

tremendous variability in how these youngsters come to the classroom. Many of the kids do have 

bonafide genuine learning disabilities, but many have come from environments which have not 

provided the background language and literacy information. This puts them behind the curve once 

they come into kindergarten, first, second, and third grades. When they get there, we don't have the 

instructional capability to meet their individual needs. 

 So there are two issues here. First, we are mis-identifying youngsters at a very late stage, 

 because of incorrect psychometric measures and procedures. Secondly, we are identifying 

children much too late. Thirdly, even if we were to identify them earlier, much of our teaching 

force has not been provided with the critical information they need to address individual 

differences in kids. 

 And, fourthly, we are not holding schools and the system accountable for making sure what 

we do works. I cannot say it any better than Dr. Pasternack said, our job is to make sure we 

identify the right children, that we bring to bear the best evidence-based instruction as early as 

possible, and that we make sure that it has actually had an effect. 

 If I could, I will depart from the way that I usually speak with you all and take you through 

some data, but very child-centered data. On page 14 of the testimony, you are going to find a series 

of bar graphs. Let me take you through what that means. What you can see, if you have that in 

front of you, is a graph labeled first grade. And the years noted are 1995 through 1999. If you will 

note above each bar, there is a figure. That denotes the percentage of kids within that population 

who are identified as at risk or already failing in reading. 

 This is a school system. These data are derived from a school system in one of NICHD 

studies where we knew there was a high rate of reading failure. We could predict that on the basis 

of many things but mostly these kids are poor. Sixty percent of them are on free and reduced lunch 

and 60 percent of them come from minority families. Many of those families have parents who 

cannot read themselves. 

 Before we start the project, what you are looking at is this astounding number of kids who 

cannot read; 31.8 percent of first graders at the end of that first grade year still cannot read.

Between those two years, we brought to bear a research program that put in place early 

identification in kindergarten. That brought to bear comprehensive instruction for teachers in terms 

of what it takes for kids to learn how to read, how you assess reading development, and how you 

address what you get from the assessment with good instructional strategies. 

 It is an evolving process. This shows how long it takes to bring evidence-based practices, 

early identification, and early intervention into schools. It has a demonstrable effect. 

 In 1995, again, 31.8 percent of the children could not read at the end of the first grade year.

In 1996, we had reduced that to 20.4 percent of the children. As we became more adept at 

providing early intervention and early identification services and scientifically based instruction in 

1997, the percentage of kids at the end of the first grade year drops to 10.9. As you can see, in 

1999, only 3.7 percent of those kids at the end of the first grade year have difficulties reading. 
26

 It is that 3.9 percent of the children who we believe are bona fide, genuine learning disabled 

students that we now have to bring to bear more research and intensive study to determine how we 

can in fact deal with these refractory or recalcitrant reading problems. 

 But that is a very strong indication of when we can put in place what we know how to do; 

we can actually save the educational lives of all of these children. And then focus our resources on 

those that need the more intensive instruction. 

 While the Members' figure that looks like this doesn't show up in color, although the 

chairman has one in color, let me show you that when we teach well, we also do pretty good brain 

surgery. If you look, Mr. Chairman and Mr. Kind, you can see this is also in front of you. On the 

right-hand side of that figure, you will notice a left hemisphere of the human brain. We can 

determine within brains at these early ages whether or not the neural systems that work hard to read 

are working well. 

 If you look at the top right-hand picture, you will see a very small display of red color. 

That color just indicates to us the degree of physiologic activation in those systems that are 

handling reading. You will note in the top right-hand side that is a fairly minuscule amount of 

activation. At the end of this first grade intervention period, if you will look down below, we not 

only had demonstrable increases in reading behavior to the average level in both word reading 

skills and comprehension, but also notice how the brain has indeed changed and has normalized. 

 When teachers get the kids early, when they identify early what it is that are putting kids at 

risk and they bring to bear strong evidence-based instruction, we cannot only move those kids, the 

majority of kids to average or above average levels of reading, but in fact we can make sure that 

physiologically they are becoming more healthy as well. 

 I would like to stop there and would be delighted to answer any questions as we move 

along.

WRITTEN STATEMENT OF G. REID LYON, RESEARCH PSYCHOLOGIST AND CHIEF, 

CHILD DEVELOPMENT AND BEHAVIOR BRANCH, NATIONAL INSTITUTE OF CHILD 

HEALTH AND HUMAN DEVELOPMENT, ROCKVILLE, MARYLAND – SEE APPENDIX E 

Mr. Platts. [presiding] Thank you, Dr. Lyon. We are going to reserve questions until the end of 

when all the panelists are done speaking, but thanks for your testimony. I do have some follow-up 

for you on the graphs you just referenced. 

Dr. Kovaleski, thanks for being with us and especially as a fellow central Pennsylvanian. 
27

STATEMENT OF JOSEPH F. KOVALESKI, DIRECTOR OF PUPIL 

SERVICES, CORNWALL-LEBANON SCHOOL DISTRICT, LITITZ, 

PENNSYLVANIA

Mr. Kovaleski. Thank you. And thank you to all of the members of the committee for this 

invitation. I am delighted to be here. I reflected as I was waiting this morning that I started my 

graduate program in 1975, which was the year that IDEA was drafted first as PL-94-142, and 

started practicing as a school psychologist in 1977, which was the year of the regulations. So I 

have seen this law grow up as I have grown up professionally. 

 And the interesting thing about that is the issues that we are addressing today about the 

special education identification process have been around since that time. I can say that early on in 

my career, we were over-identifying too many kids in this area. I have also seen at the same time 

an overwhelming of the special education system by having too many students in the system. 

 What happens in regular education is also interesting because when students have been 

identified in large numbers as learning disabled, regular education has come to believe it has a very 

limited capability of providing service for students and a limited ability to do that for students. 

What happens then is the teachers come for any kind of problem that they see in kids and start 

looking for disabilities rather than thinking about good instruction. 

 Luckily for me, in your introduction for me, you did not say what was probably the most 

important job I had in my career. Between 1990 and 1997, I was director of the instructional 

support team process in Pennsylvania, which was a statewide program that was targeted toward 

addressing these issues in terms of improving regular education and also stopping the growth in 

special education by not having these students need special education. 

 The process that we used was called an instructional support team and we implemented the 

process in over 1,700 schools during that period in all 500 school districts in Pennsylvania. The 

program provides a building-based approach to helping teachers by providing curriculum-based 

assessment and other procedures where we can identify exactly what students need and provide 

services just in time when they need it. In-class support was an important part of this program. 

And what we tried to do during that process was to identify the student’s rate of learning and a lot 

of talk today about the discrepancy. I think one thing we have to look at is not only how discrepant 

kids are, but also their rate of learning in the face of appropriate instruction. 

 When we implemented this program in those 1,700 schools, we found that 85 percent of the 

kids that were identified for the process did not need a further individual evaluation for special 

education. This was 1990 to 1997 and before we had Dr. Lyon's research. So just having that 

process in place we were able to cut off referrals for special education and the need for special 

education dramatically. 

 From that experience as well as talking to colleagues from across the country that have used 

similar models of pre-referral intervention teams, I want to offer the following recommendations or 

conclusions.
28

 First of all, referrals for special education eligibility screening can be greatly reduced by 

using an effective pre-referral intervention program. We know that there are a large number of 

students who can learn if support interventions are delivered before the problems develop and 

before learned helplessness sets in. 

 Secondly, the testing process itself, as it is typically implemented, leads to misidentification. Typically, what happens in most schools that don't have this kind of early 

intervention pre-referral process use what is called the Refer Test Place Program. Basically, you 

refer students to the school psychologist. Then you identify whether or not they qualify based on 

various formulas and you go from there. That process itself leads to over-identification. Or what I 

might rather say is mis-identification because what you get oftentimes from teachers at the school 

level is not only that we have too many kids in special education, we have the wrong kids in special 

education and we have the wrong kids identified for learning disabilities. I would be happy to go 

into that more in detail during the question and answer period if you would like. 

 Based on our experience with these teams, we found that the best way to identify the right 

kids for special education is to use what Dr. Pasternack referred to as the response to intervention 

process. We can identify a student's rate of learning when provided with effective instruction. And 

what we have found is the best way to identify which kids are the right kids is to see which kids 

who fail to make progress in spite of our best and most scientifically-based efforts. 

 There also needs to be a fully funded early literacy program that provides intensive 

intervention for students who are at risk for not learning to read by the third grade. We know 

which kids need intervention by kindergarten or first grade. We have appropriate assessment 

procedures that can identify which kids need intervention. What we don't know is which of those 

kids are eligible for special education. So that leads me to my next point. There needs to be a 

coordination of the various federal programs: special education, remedial education, Title I, and 

general education so that we can address effective intervention programs. We don't need to 

identify kids as learning disabled at kindergarten or first grade. In fact, that is a really bad idea. 

What we need to do is provide intensive intervention and help schools understand how they can use 

all of the services that they have in a more coordinated way. 

 Teachers of administrative service and related service personnel address students' needs 

best when they are organized in teams. We found that the instructional support team process in 

Pennsylvania not only helped to support teachers individually by allowing them to address the 

needs of individual kids, but it really helped the whole school to watch and monitor everybody so 

that we knew who was falling through the cracks and who was falling behind so that we could 

deliver just-in-time services to the kids who needed it most. 

 As we heard earlier this morning, we also think that the screening and early identification 

process needs to identify students' emotional and behavioral needs as early as possible. As a school 

psychologist, we know that during our experience with ISTs and also on a day-to-day basis many 

of the problems that we get are about social and emotional issues. We need to keep that front and 

center as we address the issues that we are talking about today. 
29

 In summary, we have talked about these issues now for decades, since I entered the field. I 

think we are at the point where the research that has been talked about earlier has caught up to the 

rhetoric and I think we need to look at the recommendations that I have included today. I think 

what they would help us with is they would help to improve general education. We can't think 

about this process as a special education issue. Special ed does not sit out there somewhere 

separately. It is inherently connected to the general education program. We need to improve 

general education in order to prevent students from needing special education. 

 I also think that the recommendations I have been talking about today would help prevent 

those problems and reserve special education for those students who truly need it. 

 I thank you for the opportunity to address this group and would be happy to answer your 

questions.

WRITTEN STATEMENT OF JOSEPH F. KOVALESKI, DIRECTOR OF PUPIL SERVICES, 

CORNWALL-LEBANON SCHOOL DISTRICT, LITITZ, PENNSYLVANIA – SEE APPENDIX 

F

Mr. Platts. Thank you, Dr. Kovaleski. We will come back to questions after Mr. Gordon. 

Mr. Gordon? 

STATEMENT OF DAVID W. GORDON, SUPERINTENDENT, ELK GROVE 

UNIFIED SCHOOL DISTRICT, ELK GROVE, CALIFORNIA

Mr. Gordon. Thank you, Chairman and Members, for the invitation. 

 I certainly concur with what has been said before, number one, that we have got to throw 

out the IQ testing as a means of identifying students. Secondly, we are over-identifying children in 

my state and in this nation, and I would like to tell you my district's story of what happened. 

 My district is a 50,000-student district in the southern part of Sacramento County, 

California. We project to grow to 80,000 children in the next eight years. We serve a wonderfully 

diverse population. Thirty percent of our students are white. Sixty-three percent are children of 

color. Our students also speak more than 80 languages and dialects. 

 When I came to Elk Grove almost 11 years ago, I was in charge of elementary education 

and was shocked to find out that 16 percent of the students in the district were in special education, 

16 percent. And what was going on is we were waiting until the discrepancy got large enough to 

refer the children to special ed and they were going in and never getting out. 

 So what we decided to do is go before our state board of education and ask for a waiver to 

be able to use our special ed money in kindergarten, first, and second grade, because the teachers at 

those levels could tell you with great precision which kids you would identify three years later. So 

we began serving those kids with a very focused instructional strategy based on the kind of 
30

teamwork that Mr. Kovaleski described. 

 All of our instructional people work together. There are no empires and fiefdoms. The Title 

I people team with the general education and special education people try to catch the reading 

problems as early as possible. 

 Now, what has been the result? Well, the result is that in the last 11 years, our special ed 

population has dropped from 16 percent to just under 9 percent. So we are now confident that we 

are serving the right children. In addition to that, we have a good relationship with our parents.

Our IEP processes go smoothly. We have not had a due process hearing in the 11 years that I have 

been in the school district. 

 So I think my recommendation to you is much like Dr. Kovaleski's. We have got to get our 

programs working together. We are also wasting a lot of money because we allow these services to 

operate in isolation, and we have got to somehow find some ways to make IDEA work better with 

the ESEA and with the general education program. I also think we have to add some more 

accountability for results in special education. We should not be bashful about saying we want to 

assess every special education student in a competent, quality way, and let's give some feedback to 

parents based on the results. 

 Thank you. 

WRITTEN STATEMENT OF DAVID W. GORDON, SUPERINTENDENT, ELK GROVE 

UNIFIED SCHOOL DISTRICT, ELK GROVE, CALIFORNIA – SEE APPENDIX G 

Chairman Castle. Thank you very much, Mr. Gordon. I apologize for missing all of your 

testimony. As a matter of fact, we are trying to see if somebody else wants to start the questioning 

first for that reason. 

Mr. Platts, are you prepared to go ahead so I can get caught up? Mr. Platts, I yield to you for five 

minutes. 

Mr. Platts. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Again, I thank all of you for your testimony. 

Dr. Lyon, when you were sharing your numbers, there was certainly a dramatic reduction in first 

graders not being able to read. I want to make sure that I am reading your graphs right; the top and 

bottom graphs represent first graders who were 31.8, when they were second graders, 14.5. Was 

that the same group? 

Mr. Lyon. No, sir. No, it is not. 

Mr. Platts. Okay. 

Mr. Lyon. The top graph is just the first grades, each first grade that year. 
31

Mr. Platts. Okay. 

Mr. Lyon. Lets say you are in the first grade in 1995 and you are part of that bigger group. I am 

in the first grade in 1996. That is my graph. Then another first grade comes behind us the next 

year. These are not the same kids over time. This is the effect of putting teacher preparation and 

the early identification and intervention in place as well as integrating special and regular education 

in a cohesive manner to address the needs. The bottom graph shows in 1996 that as we get better 

with doing it with first graders, obviously, second graders now begin to benefit from our increased 

knowledge and so forth. 

 So the second great cohort that came in 1996, 14.5 of them were still disabled readers, but 

we had learned over the next several years enough to make sure that cohort coming in 1999 was 2.4 

percent. 

Mr. Platts. But it is the same school, right? 

Mr. Lyon. The same school. 

Mr. Platts. So 1995's first graders are 1996's second graders? 

Mr. Lyon. No - yes, that is correct. 

Mr. Platts. So we had almost a 20 percent drop? 

Mr. Lyon. That is correct. 

Mr. Platts. That improved from first to second grade, so we can correlate it out? 

Mr. Lyon. Right. It is important to not just look at the data but to look at the conditions that have 

to be in place to ensure these changes can actually happen. Both my fellow witnesses from the 

public school systems have realized this for years. You cannot implement even the best researchbased programs without preparing the system to do so. Even the best preparation will take time. 

We have to make sure that our teachers have the support and the preparation to understand both the 

assessment and teaching side of things. Number two, we have to make sure that it is not just a 

special education issue, but rather it is a general education/special education collaborative. In fact, 

at the Hartsfield School, all instruction takes place within the classroom, with the special educator 

and the classroom teacher working together, but grouping students to focus that instruction. 

 At the same time, the most powerful instructional time for kids is in the morning. All of the 

instructional time has been moved to that time of the day and extended so kids get more time to 

learn and practice. 

Because the IQ achievement discrepancy model had been replaced by early intervention 

models, we have to make sure that the parents of these children understand at every step of the way 

what we are trying to do. You have got to, and I think everybody does recognize, that the existing 

IDEA and its regulations, with its process, heavy process requirements and its heavy regulatory 
32

requirements, is frankly there because parents are very fearful that the system will not take care of 

their children. That is, IDEA is focused not on education as much as protection. 

Now, when we want to be able to bring to bear the best science we have, that informs 

instruction better than it ever has, and we have converging evidence from multiple sites that says 

we can do it, we still must make sure that all unintended consequences of these changes are taken 

into account. We must also study how to actually implement this type of information to make it 

effective and don't randomly throw these programs in when our teachers are not trained, when our 

systems are not ready, and when are principals are not ready to go. 

Mr. Platts. I appreciate that important point. It has got to be that comprehensive team approach 

and everyone on the same page to make it work. 

 In my few remaining seconds, I am going to say quickly to Dr. Kovaleski, I appreciate your 

testimony. Would you be able to quickly touch on two things? First, you said not only are too 

many students over-identified, but the wrong students are in special ed. Could you expand on that 

and then on the instructional support team? While I was in the statehouse for eight years in 

Pennsylvania, we unfortunately cut back the state support and made it more of a local option. If 

you want to comment on that, that would be great. 

Mr. Kovaleski. Sure. Just to give you a kind of graphic example, and I don't have graphs so I will 

have to use my hands. If you imagine two kids that both have what we call standard scores of 70 

and that is they are way behind in just looking at the discrepancy model. Let's imagine one of those 

students has average intelligence and the other student has intelligence that is more commensurate 

with their achievement. The way people think about the learning disability identification process 

now is that the student who has - now both of these kids both have a hard time learning, we do our 

best to teach them and they have a difficulty learning. The student with the high IQ under the 

current system qualifies as eligible for special education. The other student whose IQ is more 

commensurate with what they are achieving does not qualify. There are a lot of people that believe 

that those students do not need special education. 

 What I have said many times about this is that what people are in effect saying is that the 

second student is not smart enough to be in special education. That is an absurdity and it happens 

all the time in this country. What we really need to be about is not looking at who is discrepant 

from what. Instead, we need to look at who is having the most difficulty learning when provided 

with very effective, scientifically based instruction. 

 We have procedures that we have used for years based on curriculum-based measures, for 

example, and we have literary graphed data to see students' progress over time. I think we are able 

to identify the best kids. 

 In terms of what happened in Pennsylvania with IST, it was set in as a state mandate in 

1990 and de-regulated in about 1998. I am happy to report that most districts that I talk to have 

institutionalized this as a procedure. However, as with anyone, you need to maintain a high degree 

of special development support for processes like that. Otherwise, the new people that come on do 

not implement it as well as anything. Anything we are talking about today really needs to be 
33

implemented with a high degree of fidelity in order to work. 

Mr. Platts. Thank you again for your testimony. 

 Thank you, Mr. Chairman. 

Chairman Castle. Thank you, Mr. Platts. 

Mr. Kildee? 

Mr. Kildee. Thank you very much, Mr. Chairman. I apologize for being absent for a while but I 

had to be on the floor for a foreign policy debate. 

 Let me first ask Dr. Lyon, I certainly agree with the need to provide early intervention for 

children. However, your testimony also mentions the fact that many older children have been 

identified as being learning disabled. What can we do to give them meaningful help when they are 

identified later, possibly by the general education teacher? And how important is good contact 

between the general education teacher and the special education teacher? 

Mr. Lyon. Thank you for the question, Mr. Kildee. Since you were in the well when I was 

introduced, I want to thank you again, since you didn't hear it, for yours, Mr. Castle's and Mr. 

Ehlers' emphasis on making sure that sciences drives instruction as much as possible. I believe it 

has been that leadership along with ex-Chairman Goodling that has allowed us to come some steps 

in answering this question. 

 Older kids have a tough time. Whether they are learning disabled or not, kids who are not 

achieving after the third grade have already suffered multiple years of failure. We have learned as 

we follow thousands of these kids that even if we bring good strong instruction to some of them, 

they resist it. They resist it, because they no longer have the motivation to look stupid, which they 

think they will do. 

 So in answering your question, we have had to be extraordinarily creative in trying to 

understand how we can bring to bear instruction in reading, writing and mathematics with older 

kids when they are failing that does not make them look dumb, but goes back and builds all the 

foundational knowledge that has not been in place and provides them with a level of success so 

they keep going. 

 There are two solutions to that. The first is again the black hole we are trying to fill in 

teacher preparation. This means making sure that teachers know how reading develops, what goes 

wrong, and what you do about it at every age. Consider that most kids after third grade are now 

confronted with learning content, social science, history, literature, and so forth. If you can't read, 

that is pretty rough. So we have to make sure that we have content-area teachers that have an 

understanding, not so much the specialty but an understanding of how the kids are dealing with that 

content that is above their level. Then they must learn how they should collaborate and 

communicate with specialized instructional personnel and special educators to present the 
34

information in a readable way. 

 Still when we do that, we find tremendous resistance in older kids. Both the NIH and 

OCEF are working to provide youngsters with these difficulties with digitized kinds of textual 

information in the content area. OCEF has done a great job of this by bringing history, science, 

and mathematics texts to the kids by allowing the kids to push on words that they don't know and 

the book talks to them. As they are helping the kids read through, and this can be done more 

privately, the book asks them questions about what they are reading in the content area. So it will 

ask them specific questions about the science concept they just have read about or the social studies 

concept. This is a type of technology that is interactive. It helps to build motivation. It can be 

done, again, within the integrity of the kids' lives so they are not being embarrassed and so forth. 

 We have to make sure of another thing with older kids. As they are struggling in reading 

and we are bringing to bear better instruction and technology to help them, we have to be able to 

continue to get them the information in alternative ways. We have to provide accommodations, 

whether that means books on tape or whether that is whatever it takes to get around the disability. 

Mr. Kildee. In kindergarten through third grade, basically, a child learns to read and after that they 

read to learn. So if they have not learned to read by the third grade, maybe because of some special 

learning disability, there is a socialization problem that has to be addressed then, too, does it not? 

Mr. Lyon. Absolutely. Again, as Secretary Pasternack testified, the biggest predictor of poor selfconcept, behavioral difficulties later on, difficulties adjusting to life, and getting a good job or not a 

good job, is this ability to learn through print. If you don't do it, we have a lot of downstream 

consequences.

 But, again, I think by putting in place what we are recommending today, the number of kids 

that actually have these difficulties, which now ranges from 5 to 20 percent in some states, will 

reduce down to 6 percent or less. The data that I have shown this morning and the data that Dr. 

Gordon is talking about indicates that when we can bring those numbers down of those children 

who did not respond to the powerful instruction, we can now focus much more intensively on what 

to do. But to be sure, we have a lot to learn about how in fact we will help that 2 to 6 percent come 

around in reading. Every example I gave you in response to your question is in a sense a 

prophylaxis. That is, we are not actually changing reading behavior yet. We still have 2 to 6 

percent of our kids, who with the best instruction, are slow, inaccurate readers and hate to do it. 

We have got to figure that out. 

Mr. Kildee. Thank you very much for your response and for your testimony, and thank you for 

everything you are doing. 

Chairman Castle. Thank you, Mr. Kildee. Mr. Ehlers? 

Mr. Ehlers. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I apologize that I missed some of the discussion, because 

we had to go vote. I hope I am not going over old ground. First of all, just to comment, Dr. Lyon, 

in response to your comments. As I am sure you are aware, instruction in math and science also 

helps children learn how to read. But it also struck me once. Years ago when I was still teaching, I 
35

took a group of students into a school and they each taught four students on science. I remember a 

group of four youngsters coming in and the teacher pulled me aside and said this one person is very 

slow, treat him gently. It turned out he was the best of the four, because he had never before 

experienced someone trying to teach him science properly. Obviously, he had skills that had not 

been recognized in the school. 

 I just wanted to ask, based on your background, Dr. Lyon, how accurately and scientifically 

can we characterize learning disabilities and what types of categories can we set up? Secondly, 

have we yet learned what instruction works best with what category? 

 And let me give you a specific example. I have a grandson who is very dyslexic and so I 

have learned a lot about dyslexia. The standard methods of teaching never helped him. My 

daughter put him into private school for dyslexics and he is finally in high school and is learning 

how to read. It really struck me that nowhere along the line did someone really identify him well 

and teach him properly for his disability. Are there other cases like this? How many categories are 

there and is it possible for a school system to have the resources to address the needs of each 

category? 

Mr. Lyon. A good question, a tough question, a complex question. Let me see if I can address it 

with clarity. In IDEA there are currently seven major types of learning disabilities. You can have 

a learning disability in listening, speaking, basic reading skills, which mean the word level skills, 

reading comprehension, mathematics calculation, mathematics reasoning, and written expression. 

Now, obviously, kids can come with one, all of those, or subsets of those. As has been testified to 

this morning, the largest majority of kids within that larger umbrella are youngsters who have 

problems in basic reading skills. Eighty to 90 percent of all of the youngsters have difficulties 

there.

 As you pointed out, difficulties in reading portend difficulties in science and mathematics 

and any other content area where you have to bring the information in through print. So quite a few 

kids are going to be in classrooms that have multiple difficulties. As you know, we know the most 

about reading. We have placed a great deal of emphasis understanding reading, because it is the 

most prevalent. It is the foundational ability for everything that comes after. For some reason, it is 

more highly related to the kid's self-esteem, self-concept, and occupational success later on, even 

more than science. I hate to say that, but even more than science. 

Mr. Ehlers. I agree. 

Mr. Lyon. The fact is when we bring to bear our converging evidence; we have a very good idea of 

why difficulties in learning to read occur and the different sub-types that exist. Through your 

efforts in helping us bring science to this process, we have been able to identify what it takes to 

learn to read. We know kids have to have the underlying sound structure well developed. They 

have to have phonics, no matter how controversial that is. They have to be able to apply the sound 

structure in phonics to print rapidly and accurately. They have to have good vocabularies to 

understand what they read. And they have to bring to bear active strategies to comprehend. 
36

 We have good measures of all of those components of reading. And we have good 

measures that can give us an idea of who is going to have a tough time at 5 and 6 six years of age.

We are moving down to 3 and 4 now under the new Early Reading First initiatives and so forth. 

 Through the efforts of this committee in promoting this kind of work and clinical trials, we 

also now understand which teaching approaches are most beneficial for which children or different 

types of difficulties in reading. It is through these efforts that we can get to all but about 6 percent 

of the kids. Within that 6 percent, those children that we would consider dyslexic or learningdisabled in reading, we are making tremendous strides and bringing that down to 5 and 3 and 2 

percent in some of our studies. 

 What goes into the instruction is extremely well known. It is the intensity, consistency, and 

the preparation of the teacher delivering that intense and consistent instruction. We know the 

components of the instruction, and we also know that general educators can apply these kinds of 

procedures as well to kids who may or may not be disabled and actually bring about tremendous 

change.

 So we are getting very good at it. The difficulty, as we have always talked before, is 

infusing what we know into practice. That is a much more complex issue that requires bolstering 

teacher preparation, having leadership as to my left that can bring the information into schools, and 

making sure teachers understand and can apply it. 

Mr. Ehlers. Just one last quick question. When you classify the students, is there some good 

scientific basis for it or does it end up being largely the judgment of a practitioner? 

Mr. Lyon. At the present time, it is highly subjective, highly variable, and, frankly, the 

identification process is based upon invalid concepts. I hate to continue to drive the stake into this 

discrepancy point, but using an IQ achievement discrepancy to identify someone with learning 

disabilities does not make any sense because it does not differentiate the disability. 

 For purposes of example, let me do it this way. I am going to get into trouble, but let's say 

on this side of Chairman Castle are people with high IQ's. 

Chairman Castle. You are already in trouble now. 

Mr. Lyon. Yes, sir. 

Chairman Castle. I can tell you right now. 

Mr. Lyon. In the context of that high IQ, there is underachievement in reading or math. There is a 

discrepancy. I am on this side. Just for today, we have lower IQ scores, just for today. The only 

reason I put us on this side is I know you and so you will bear with me. They have a discrepancy 

and we don't have a discrepancy. If the discrepancy had any value to it, they would respond to 

instruction differently than we would. They would have different physiology from us. Their 

development course would look differently from us. None of those differences can be obtained.

The discrepancy does nothing to differentiate what it takes to learn to read, how one responds to 
37

instruction, and what the developmental outcomes look like. 

 So why do you keep it? We keep it, because it has been put in place for a long time. 

People can actually derive discrepancies through testing very well. I mean they know how to do 

this extremely well. One of the things I have noticed over the years that we have been working at 

is that people will continue to do what they know how to do extremely well irrespective of whether 

or not it affects children positively. 

Mr. Ehlers. So, in other words, it is bad but we don't know of anything better? 

Mr. Lyon. We do know of a lot better. We actually can look at kids in terms of their achievement, 

their reading, their math, their writing, and their language. We can then look at the achievement 

and determine whether or not they respond to instruction. Using those two variables, we then begin 

to identify the learning disability from that context. 

Chairman Castle. Thank you, Mr. Ehlers. 

Mr. Scott? 

Mr. Scott. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I wanted to somewhat follow up on that same line of 

questions. On your chart, Dr. Lyon, what portion of the fewer people being identified was due to 

better testing and how much of it was due to the fact that - this is the end of the first grade, right, 

after you have actually provided some instruction, how much of it was better instruction and how 

much of it was better evaluation? 

Mr. Lyon. The two are hand in hand, Mr. Scott. Obviously, we are identifying at the end of the 

first grade reading achievement levels. Frequently, that is not done. What we are looking at in 

1995 in the top bar is the traditional instruction and evaluation procedures being employed and 

resulting in this very high rate of reading failure. That is, it is identified after the fact. Between 

1995 and 1996, both kindergarten and first grade early screenings were put in place and the 

instructional procedures necessary to attempt to alleviate the difficulties were also put in place. We 

are dropping to 20.4 in the second cohort of first graders, primarily as a function of now improved 

early assessment and improved teaching. 

 Keep in mind it is a process. The school, the system, and the teachers are learning how to 

do it better. In 1997, a new group of first graders come in. There has been improvement not really 

on the assessment side, but now on the instructional side in integrating classroom and special 

education in the classroom. 

 So what you are seeing is the growth curve within a school that takes place when the early 

assessment is put in place and the instructional procedures that we know that work are also put in 

place. The fact that it takes five years, at least in this school, to get to a 3.7 failure rate from a 31.8 

failure rate in first grade cohorts is the amount of time it has taken to implement these processes 

well.
38

Mr. Scott. It is interesting that people are doing this much better because the instruction is better. 

That is one of the concerns some of us have about this every year testing. The old adage, you don't 

fatten the pig by weighing the pig. If you are not actually improving the instruction, all you are 

doing is punishing the children. Here you got - it wasn't the children's fault that they weren't 

learning, it was the system that they were subjected to. 

Mr. Lyon. Yes, and I think that is a very articulate way to put it. These are system casualties. 

These are instructional casualties in the main. I think as both of the experts on my left have 

mentioned, when you are trying to bring to bear special instruction, special education with this 

large group, many of whom are instructional casualties, you can't focus effectively on those who 

need the more specialized help. You are diffusing and diluting the process. 

Mr. Scott. Did any of this improvement come about because of better use of Part C? 

Mr. Lyon. Absolutely, absolutely. 

Mr. Scott. I notice in one chart I saw a couple of hundred thousand are getting Part C benefits and 

millions are getting Part B benefits. As we reauthorize, maybe we ought to focus a little bit more 

attention on Part C funding. 

Mr. Lyon. Yes, sir. 

Mr. Scott. Mr. Kovaleski, in your testimony, you indicated a need to test emotional needs as well 

as academic needs. Could you elaborate on that? 

Mr. Kovaleski. I think I wouldn't characterize it as ``test.'' I think to be sensitive to and identify -

frankly, emotional and behavioral needs in school are pretty easy to identify. Teachers will tell you 

very quickly who needs help in that area. 

 I agree with Dr. Pasternack's earlier testimony that a large part of that is frustration over not 

being able to read. The other part of it that we do have to realize is that there are kids coming from 

all kind of environments that frankly didn't exist when you and I went to school or if they did, they 

existed in much smaller numbers. Those are not just impoverished environments or environments 

that fail to produce vocabulary, but they are also harmful to kids. 

Mr. Scott. How does all that translate into something we can do something about? 

Mr. Kovaleski. You didn't ask me that. The question is do we need to be sensitive to that? I think 

we have to be ready to provide effective interventions early in all areas, not only academic but also 

emotional support and behavioral support. It is not a testing issue. It is very much an issue where 

we can provide strong programs for kids. 

Mr. Scott. Did you want to comment on that, Mr. Gordon? 

Mr. Gordon. I was just going to say one thing we are starting to do in our Title I schools, we have 

re-configured the funding and we are putting in a person we are calling a behavior intervention 
39

specialist. This is not a counselor, but someone who will work with the principal and the teachers 

to work through issues with kids. Again, trying to start that as early as possible. But we are just 

starting it now and we are hoping to find enough money to do it in all our schools. 

Chairman Castle. Thank you, Mr. Scott. 

Mr. Wilson? 

Mr. Wilson. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Dr. Kovaleski, I was very interested in your observation 

about over-identification. Then I was equally interested in the ISTs and how you described in-class 

support for the instructional support teams. Can you go a little bit further in layman's terms and 

describe how this system works? 

Mr. Kovaleski. By looking at group data in schools, we identify who is falling between the cracks. 

At that point, we have a team of people that work with the classroom teacher to what we call 

systematically search for what works. Part of that is to use good assessment systems to identify 

where the discrepancies are academically and/or behaviorally, and then to help teachers. 

 One of the things we have talked about a lot of today that I agree with is the issue of teacher 

preparation. It is not going to be very soon that we have teachers that are absolutely prepared for 

every type of student with a difficulty in school. What we found through instructional support is by 

having support teachers, school psychologists, guidance counselors, remedial teachers actually go 

into classrooms with teachers and try to figure out how to help students by assessing them 

effectively and then providing good strategies, it is the best staff development program that we 

have ever seen. What happens is that teachers just don't go to a workshop and get trained. They 

actually see what is going to work with a student right in front of them. They have just learned a 

skill that way that they didn't have before. 

 So it is very much a process where the team is important in supporting teachers, but the 

other part of the process is this in-class searching for what works in a very trial and error way.

Again, from where we were 10 years ago, we have got much better ideas about what to use. 

Frankly, at this point, a combination of a strong foundational early literacy program with a process 

that helps teachers with kids that are falling even out of that good program would be a very strong 

complementary program. 

Mr. Wilson. And during the IST period, the 50-day period of determination, are parents notified or 

are they involved? 

Mr. Kovaleski. They are actively involved. It is interesting that we didn't even start with that as a 

training component in 1990. The schools did that themselves. They got parents to the table early 

and talked over what was going on. We had extremely harmonious and effective relationships with 

parents. We did parent training in that process. Interestingly, parents were more than happy to 

come to school if you get them early in the process rather than waiting for their reaction later. 

Mr. Wilson. And that is through parents being involved? 
40

Mr. Kovaleski. Absolutely. 

Mr. Wilson. And so much being put on the teachers, that concern me. 

 And for Mr. Gordon, I want to congratulate you. You had indicated no litigation. That is 

extraordinary. 

Mr. Gordon. Thank you, sir. 

Mr. Wilson. You must be working with parents, and so that is a great sign. 

Mr. Gordon. Yes, the thing that we do that I think is effective, which could be applied to the 

whole IDEA. The first time the parent encounters the system, so to speak, is at the IEP meeting. 

We work hard to train people to facilitate the IEP meetings. We used in our collective bargaining 

process, a process called interest-based bargaining. So they are trained to facilitate the meetings so 

the parents first encounter with the system is positive. And we work to seek solutions in terms of 

the program that is planned for the student. 

Mr. Wilson. Well, I certainly hope other people can learn from your example and that can spread. 

 Additionally, I was interested in your point about over-enrollment. I heard you indicate that 

there was a waiver that had to be sought. Was that due to federal regulation, state regulation, or 

what was the regulation that needed to be waived? 

Mr. Gordon. Both. At the time, you couldn't use special education money unless the child had an 

IEP. So actually it was a two-sided waiver. We got the waiver to use the special ed personnel with 

children who are not yet identified. But the other thing that was important to us that we got was a 

hold harmless so that we didn't lose money if this whole thing worked. This allowed us to reinvest 

the money back into the early intervention system. Since the state law has been changed basically 

to make it a capitated program, you get funded for a certain proportion of your kids and then you 

keep the difference if you don't identify that many. So there is no more need for waivers. 

Mr. Wilson. So much now goes back to the local school district to make that determination, is that 

correct?

Mr. Gordon. Right, right. But the fact of the matter is in the long run we haven't saved money 

because we are serving many, many more low incident students with very costly services. 

Mr. Wilson. Intensive. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. 

Chairman Castle. Thank you, Mr. Wilson. 

Ms. Davis?

Mrs. Davis. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. And I also wanted to thank the expert panelists and 

particularly an old and dear friend, Mr. Gordon, who I want to just share with you that the Elk 
41

Grove School District is really among the best in the state of California and certainly the nation.

And Mr. Gordon has brought that to the district, and I want to applaud him for that. 

Mr. Gordon. Thank you. 

Mrs. Davis. I think you really have just touched on the issue that I was particularly concerned 

about, and that is teacher preparation and training and in collaboration with parents. Is there 

anything in the reauthorization now that we are looking at that needs to be enhanced to really 

support that issue? In San Diego, I must admit, they actually tried to have teachers in regular 

classrooms with some special education expertise, and frankly, it didn't work. And the district 

came under great fire as a result of it from parents as well as from the state of California. And so 

they certainly have to go back and take a look at the way that was occurring in the school district. 

 I am just looking now as we actually are working with language, it sounds like you have 

what you need there to do what is possible. But I want to be sure that school districts perhaps that 

are not aware of the need, it is the collaboration. It is the feedback for teachers. It is not just the 

hour on a Saturday, it is having somebody in the classroom who is really letting them know that 

this is working or not working or they are able to evaluate it certainly on their own. And in a lot of 

school districts, we don't necessarily have that peer support. We don't provide it. We don't fund it. 

We don't do a whole lot of things to encourage it. And sometimes there is a lot of resistance as 

well.

 Is there anything that we particularly should be looking at that would aid you in that and 

obviously would help kids, which is what we are all about here? 

Mr. Kovaleski. I am going to have a really hard time giving you advice about how to change the 

law or if the law needs to be changed about that. However, I can clearly articulate what the 

problem is, and maybe that will help us get part of the way. We are going through a real sea 

change in education. I think for the first time in my 25 years, we have actually seen people start to 

say, ``Let's look at what works for kids from a scientific research point of view.'' Throughout all my 

years, the thing that has frustrated me the most about being in education is that it is who has got the 

new idea before it has even been tested. If we had anything in public education that I would love to 

have it is an FDA for instructional strategies. Let's make sure that we are using what has been 

proven to work, not what somebody came up with last week and is already selling their product to 

schools.

 I think we need to look at getting everybody focused on outcomes, holding people's feet to 

the fire as to whether those are not working, and using research-based approaches. If things are not 

working, let's look at what we need to do to change from systems that are using ineffective 

instructional strategies to those that are. How you change college education systems to have people 

teach new teachers strategies that work and not the 49 ideas about what might work is very 

daunting to me but that is what needs to happen. 

Mrs. Davis. Thank you. Anybody else want to respond? 
42

Mr. Lyon. Well, actually, David should go before me, because he has done an extremely creative 

thing in Elk Grove with teacher preparation, which maybe he will share. But I would just like to 

reinforce Dr. Kovaleski's point in terms of changing the emphasis to what works and how it affects 

kids.

 For the last 30 years, everything seems to have been done for the adult's sake. We still have 

to deal with funding research that adults do because the adults want to do the research irrespective 

of whether it helps kids. Likewise, we continue to put programs in schools that people like, but 

don't work. The reason they continue to stay there is based upon belief and philosophy. I think Joe 

is absolutely correct. Once we start to operate from the very clear window of what works, we need 

to examine the evidence. 

 I think in the situation or the example that I gave in Florida and in David's example in 

California, people rally around what works. In the 39,000 kids we have studied and the over 1,200 

schools we have studied, it is very difficult to change teachers' minds by quacking away at them. 

What changes their minds is watching kids actually change. Kids don't get better and don't develop 

better skills, unless somebody is using what has been shown to work. 

 The chairman earlier asked about Reading First and Early Reading First and how all of this 

integrates with that. Secretary Pasternack is working extremely hard on commensurate language to 

say that we should not be spending federal money on programs, projects, strategies or approaches 

that haven't been shown to be effective with the kids that you have in your district. We have got to 

support schools better that way. I think that as culture shifts from process to what works and from 

philosophy and belief to science, then people start to get on the same page with a common 

language. I think it is going to take that. In the law, we have a very clear statement that we should 

not be spending taxpayer money for that which is shown to be ineffective. In our experience, that 

is what will drive the common language, the collaboration, and the communication. 

Mr. Gordon. Just one other comment. I think in your law you can push the higher education 

people much harder to collaborate with school districts. We got frustrated about eight or nine years 

ago so we run our own teacher credential program, because we were getting people coming out 

who were mis-trained. We had to retrain them and we changed the whole program. So now we 

have doubled the amount of time they spend hands-on in the classroom. And we added two extra 

courses in reading so they are trained then to our specifications. We are about to start up a 

comparable program for special education. 

Chairman Castle. Thank you, Ms. Davis. 

Mrs. Davis. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. 

Chairman Castle. I haven't asked questions yet, but I am going to go to Mr. Payne first. Then 

unless anybody else comes, I will go last and we will finish it up there. 

Mr. Payne?
43

Mr. Payne. Thank you very much. It is kind of unusual for a chairman to be so benevolent, but I 

certainly appreciate that. 

 I just have a question. As a former educator, many years ago, I certainly have had some 

concerns throughout the years, even when I was teaching, about the over-representation of 

minorities. Data suggest that racial and ethnic distribution of students in special ed essentially 

remains unchanged from 1998 to 1999 school year. Black students, however, continue to be overrepresented in special education across all disability categories. We go on to find out that all blacks 

with disabilities is 20.3 percent, which exceeds their representation in the resident population, 

which is about 14.5 percent. 

 The most striking disparities were in mental retardation. Over one-third of AfricanAmerican students were considered mentally retarded, and developmentally delayed was 30.5 

percent, and probably leaving only about a third of the population to be in neither category unless 

there is overlapping. As you mentioned, there are seven categories, and perhaps some of the 30.5 

percent might be counted in the other 34.2 percent. 

 But the other very glowing statistic is that most of these, of course, are boys, are men, 

young men. So I just have a question. I am not trying to find solutions and I am not being critical, 

I am just trying to determine whether there is a problem in teacher training, whether cultural - 

sometimes Hispanics, for example, are supposed to be more Latin and very expressive. Perhaps 

Haitian Americans because of their culture also tend to be more colorful. We find this problem in 

law enforcement with someone who might be considered belligerent by say a Caucasian police 

officer, an African-American who grew up in the same neighborhood, well, that is relatively 

typical. As a matter of fact, under these circumstances and under the stress that most AfricanAmerican males have to go through, anyway, they tell me if you don't have high blood pressure and 

you are a black guy, you haven't done anything. 

 So you have got these cultural problems that are very difficult. Even in medicine, you find 

that there is the same kind of disparity even with people who have the same income and same 

insurance coverage, sometimes not even about access, but it is about the ability to communicate. 

And we find that there are more health disparities in people who have the same kind of coverage. 

 So it is kind of what I would like to see if we could determine how we can crack this 

continuing problem that has been around for a long time and it is not even going to go away even if 

we start to come up with solutions. So if any of you would take that? 

Mr. Lyon. Let me try to unpack the two, the educational from the medical, and go with you on the 

educational issues. I say very clearly to you, Representative Payne, it does not and should not be 

that way. The over-representation is a function of the system not providing what is needed with 

what works. This relates to something that Chairman Castle brought up. Let me first say that the 

issue that you are talking about on the educational side is neither racial nor ethnic, it is economic. 

Socioeconomic factors cut through all these kinds of things. No doubt there are cultural issues that 

you know much more about than I do. 
44

 Here is the fact of the matter. In the school that I showed you, the Hartsfield School, the 

majority of youngsters in this school come from poverty. Sixty percent are on free and reduced 

lunch. What does that mean? It means frequently that their parents do not read. Because their 

parents do not read, they are not read to as much as middle class kids and beyond. They are not 

interacting in discussions and conversations, building vocabulary that other kids with advantage 

have. They come into preschool and kindergarten way, way behind. 

 Now, Chairman Goodling remembered the fact that an affluent three-year-old has a stronger 

working vocabulary than the welfare parent of a three-year-old. That is true. By 18 months of age, 

kids in middle to affluent families are learning nine new words a day, every day until they move 

into school. Kids from poverty are learning three to four words, putting a 50 percent differential on 

language.

 Here they come into school. Yes, African-Americans are being over-represented, not 

because of their race but because poverty is disproportionately represented in those ethnic groups, 

those and Hispanic kids. As you know, if you just unpack reading, 38 percent of our nation's fourth 

graders cannot read a lick. If you disaggregate those data, 65 percent of African-American kids 

can't read very well. And 60 percent of Hispanic kids cannot read. 

 That is not the effect of a learning disability. That is the effect of accumulating distance 

from what they should know. They don't have the foundational skills. They come into preschool, 

kindergarten, first grade, and no one is building the foundation for them. That is why Early 

Reading First tries to go directly to getting these kids, as Chairman Castle said, not at 5, not at 6, 

but at 3 and 4 and 5. 

 We are working very hard on Head Start now to make sure we are infusing in Head Start 

not only interactions to develop emotional and social capabilities, but language and early literacy 

capabilities. The system has to step up to the plate. Otherwise, we are going to continue 

recursively to see this cycle continue. If we don't help kids learn to read, think, write, and to do 

math, then they are going to have kids that are equally behind the bar. 

 But that is the real issue. Poverty is cutting no slack in how these kids are learning. By the 

way, the IQ tests that are given that put these kids disproportionately into mental retardation 

categories are based not so much on the kid's intelligence but what the kids have learned. An IQ 

test is nothing more than accumulated knowledge. If you are not being interacted with or your 

folks are working too hard and have three jobs or if your parents can't read and can't engage you in 

these interactions, at 2 and 3 and 4 and 5, you are going to be lagging so far behind by the time 

somebody gives you an IQ test. It is not measuring your intelligence, but is measuring the lack of 

interaction.

 Guess what is going to be the solution? Early identification, early intervention from birth 

onward and strong, and strong teaching and instruction that is based upon the scientific evidence. 

When we do that, those kids you are talking about now are no longer put behind by what the 

President calls that ``soft bigotry of low expectation.'' We now have 3.7 kids in first grades having 

difficulties learning to read in a highly disadvantaged school, whereas when we started 31.8 percent 
45

were learning. That is because the system responded to those needs. 

Mr. Kovaleski. If I can add to that just briefly. Since the '70s we were asking for culture-fair 

testing, we still don't have it. There are no tests that are going to be fair to all the cultures that we 

have in schools. We talked earlier about response to instructions being the way to identify whether 

students need special education. I think this is the way to be fair to everybody, especially minority 

students, because we can see their rate of learning when we carefully teach them. The problem 

with that is going to be that when kids come to school so far behind, as Dr. Lyon is talking about, it 

is nice to see the Hartsfield data but in many cases they are not going to catch up overnight. 

 I cannot tell you how many times in my career I have heard people say, ``I know this kid 

doesn't have a learning disability, but the only way to get him help is to put him in special 

education.'' That is not fair to anybody. We have got to look at ways that we can improve general 

education so that during the primary years, especially, we can provide the intensity of programs 

that are as intense as special education without having to label kids and identify them as special ed. 

Mr. Payne. Thank you very much. I see my time has expired. 

Chairman Castle. Thank you. 

Mr. Payne. I would like to go on, but I won't. And maybe, Mr. Chairman, we could work on that 

jointly some time in the future to take a look at how we can - 

Chairman Castle. In fact, I am delighted you raised the question, because I have been bothered by 

some of those statistics, too. I thought the answers were extremely interesting and extremely 

thorough. I would be happy to work on it. We have been working on it and the bottom line is that 

we have just got to do more. I agree that the socioeconomic issue is what it really comes down to 

that we have to deal with. 

 Let me just yield to myself for a couple of minutes here in terms of finishing up. Let me 

start with you, Dr. Lyon. Perhaps I am not as knowledgeable about these programs as I should be. 

I have always focused more on the B aspect of all this, and the C and D are starting to interest me a 

little bit. I don't know enough about them to really argue whether the way they were done in the 

reformation of the law five years ago is the correct way to go or not or if there is inadequate 

funding in terms of the research and the preparation in the under-three program. But should we be 

looking more at those programs than perhaps we are focused on? I think most of the time we hear 

about the B program and not those as much. 

Mr. Lyon. Absolutely, Mr. Chairman. I think it is nice to have a question where we have 

proactively moved forward to bolster both in OSERS and at NIH our efforts from birth to three and 

birth to five. Beginning in 2003, for the first time we will be working strongly with other agencies, 

not just in conversation but also in actual planning and in actual investment. Working with Dr. 

Pasternack's office, OSERS and with HHS to bring together and put in place the largest, most 

comprehensive research program. This will address how we can get all kids from birth to school 

entry squared away and learning well in terms of their cognitive language pre-literacy skills 

integrated with good social competencies and good strong emotional health. For years, people have 
46

attacked these issues, if they have attacked them at all, from birth to five in very parochial ways.

They have talked about social and emotional development or they have talked about cognitive 

development. Frankly, they have never been integrated. 

 Now across agencies we are going to bring to bear our best talent and quite a bit of 

resources financially to figure out what it is kids need to know, how we can identify if they have it 

at the earliest ages, if they don't have it, how at the earliest stages we can bolster their development 

and how to make sure that we are tracking them or following them or walking with them through 

their life. This allows us to see the effects of our efforts at every epic in their development. 

 So I will assure you that in 2003 you will see a very well integrated research program 

across OSERS, across NICHD, and across HHS, ACF and ACYF, that goes directly to what you 

are talking about. 

Chairman Castle. That is comforting, although sometimes I worry about the acronyms and the_ 

Mr. Lyon. I am sorry. 

Chairman Castle. - inability of most of us to be able to relate all those things as to what we are 

doing.

Mr. Lyon. Right. 

Chairman Castle. We are basically trying to help very young kids get a good start is really what it 

all adds up to. 

Mr. Lyon. You got it, yes, sir. 

Chairman Castle. I think we need to be clear in our messages as well, but we thank you for your 

extraordinary work in that area. It is really exceptional. 

 Let me turn to Dr. Kovaleski and to Mr. Gordon with basically the same question. It is sort 

of broad and I don't expect you to have a complete knowledge of everything that is in the IDEA 

law. We write them and we don't have complete knowledge of it. So I know it is a little difficult. 

But both of you in your testimony, which I read but did not hear you deliver, unfortunately, 

indicated that by various practices, which you have adopted in Pennsylvania or in your school 

district, you have been able to reduce some of the over-identification and deal with some of the 

statistical problems of IDEA and hopefully this will get kids out of the system earlier and into the 

regular education system and help educate them more. I assume for the most part that you have 

done that within the context of the law as it is written today, but I could be wrong about that.

Perhaps you have waivers or something, which I don't know about, that have aided you in doing 

this.

I think, Mr. Gordon, you actually recommended in your testimony some possible changes 

as far as the federal law is concerned. I am interested to know if a number of the practices that you 
47

have employed could be done within the context of the law today. Are there clear 

recommendations that you have in terms of things we should be looking at to give that flexibility to 

make sure that we have leaders who can actually make a difference in making IDEA work better 

and obviously helping kids more? 

Mr. Kovaleski. Everything we did in Pennsylvania was within the constructs of IDEA and we had 

no waivers for any of those programs. They were all understood under the screening aspect of 

IDEA. In 1997, when you folks gave us the new revised law, one of the most heartening things 

that we had in there was the response to instruction or the lack of instruction provision. To be 

identified as eligible for special education, you could not be having your problem because of lack 

of instruction. That really fits very closely with what we are talking about. 

 What we need, though, is for people to understand precisely what procedures you go 

through to assess whether or not there was a lack of instruction involved. That is a key piece of the 

legislation that currently exists that can be expanded upon in order to deliver the kind of programs 

that I think we are thinking about. 

 The other part of it is in the preamble to IDEA. There is wonderful language about prereferral intervention and teams and so forth, but it doesn't make its way into the statute itself. I 

think the place where all this belongs is in screening. I think if we can beef up the screening part so 

that it is clear when we talk about assessing lack of instruction, that we have got to do 

demonstrated interventions before we even get to testing, regardless of what you want to talk about 

that conversation. Before we get to testing, let's make sure we have documented interventions 

based on scientifically researched principles. I think that would really give a clear message to the 

field.

Chairman Castle. Thank you. Mr. Gordon? 

Mr. Gordon. I think the best thing that you can do is change your compliance monitoring 

oversight system so it provides incentives to do the right thing, screening-wise and instructionally. 

Right now, no one ever comes and asks you how the program is going instructionally. It is all 

procedural minutia and piles of paper. 

 So that is where the accountability comes in. We have got to start asking the right questions 

about how are we doing instructionally, how are we doing in identification, and have the technical 

assistance to back that up to get people to where they are talking about changing the culture that 

Dr. Lyon talked about. 

Chairman Castle. Well, let me thank you, Mr. Gordon, for that statement, and Dr. Kovaleski. 

That brings to an end our questioning. We have a vote, which you may have heard the buzzers 

starting again. So we will end the entire hearing at this point. 

 In closing, I would just like - I will turn to Mr. Kildee in a moment- to thank you. I worry 

sometimes when we are dealing with IDEA, that those who are the advocates for these programs, 

generally families or those families with children who are in the program or have been in the 

program or people who are working in the program, become concerned that any change could 
48

potentially diminish the law as it is and perhaps be harmful to the ultimate beneficiaries, the 

children. When in reality I believe that we can make changes and improve the law and provide 

greater opportunity for these children. I think the testimony from both of our panels today 

underlines this. I think it is very important that we have that dialogue. There are significant 

numbers of families in this country who are affected by this. 

 I am delighted we have the web site now. People can go to it and make further suggestions 

to us, because we want to have that communication. I don't want to get into a tug of war. I want to 

get into a meaningful discourse and dialogue to improve this law. We ended up doing that in 1997. 

I just hope we can do it in 2002. I think this kind of hearing helps with that a lot. So we appreciate 

the testimony of all of you today. 

Mr. Kildee? 

Mr. Kildee. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. This has been an excellent hearing. We have heard from a 

researcher and two great providers who gave us some very, very good insights. Some hearings 

only rate, C+, some B, but this was a good A+ hearing. Thank you very much. 

Chairman Castle. I didn't get a lot of A+'s in school, so I appreciate that. 

 Thank you all very much. We stand adjourned. 

 [Whereupon, at 12:50 p.m., the subcommittee was adjourned.] 
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Table of Indexes 

Chairman Castle, 2, 4, 5, 6, 9, 11, 12, 14, 16, 17, 20, 22, 23, 30, 33, 34, 36, 37, 39, 40, 42, 45, 46, 

47, 48 

Mr. Boehner, 5 

Mr. Ehlers, 34, 35, 36, 37 

Mr. Goodling, 6, 12, 16, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23 

Mr. Gordon, 29, 38, 40, 41, 42, 47 

Mr. Kildee, 3, 33, 34, 48 

Mr. Kovaleski, 27, 32, 38, 39, 40, 41, 45, 47 

Mr. Lyon, 24, 30, 31, 33, 34, 35, 36, 37, 38, 42, 43, 45, 46 

Mr. Owens, 17, 18, 19 

Mr. Pasternack, 9, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 19, 22, 23 

Mr. Payne, 42, 43, 45 

Mr. Platts, 5, 26, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33 

Mr. Scott, 14, 15, 16, 37, 38 

Mr. Wilson, 16, 17, 39, 40 

Mrs. Davis, 40, 41, 42 

Ms. Davis, 40 

Ms. Woolsey, 20, 21, 22