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### U.S. ENVIRONMENTAL PROTECTION AGENCY

PUBLIC HEARING:

**Standards of Performance f**  **or Greenhouse Gas**  **Emissions**

8 : 30 a.m. through 8 : 01 p.m. T h u r sday, May 24 , 20 12

Ralph H. Metcalf Federal Building Lake Michigan Ro om, 12th Floor 77 West Jackson Boulevard Chicago, Illinois 60604OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### EPA PANEL:

**Jenny Noonan ,**  Hearing Chair Director of Policy Analysis and Communications, Office of Air Quality, Planning, and Standards **Christian Fellner ,**  **Donald Bruce ,**  **Douglas A burano**  **, Michael Compher** 

- - -OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### C O N T E N T S Page Public Comments:

**Dr. Claire Butterfield ,**  Faith in Place & Illinois Interfaith Power and Light Campaign

..... ... ............................ 12
**B eth Wa**  **llace ,**  National Wildlife Federation.

.... 1 7 **Mikka McCracken,** E LCA, E vangelical Lutheran Church in America and National Council of Churches USA

. ............................... 2 1 **Rev. Myriam Renaud,** Concerned Citizen .........2 5 **Peter Iwanowicz,** Americ an Lung Association ....2 9 **Jean Sideris,** UCS, Union of Concerned Scientists .... ..............................34 **Randy Juras,** Conc erned Citizen ................39 **Daniel M. Dolan**

**- Loughlin,**  Concerned Citizen ...43 **Wanda Martin**

**- Terry,**  Concerned Citizen .. .......48 **J. Drake Hamilton,** Fresh Energy ...............51 **Pamela Hardwicke,** CATF, Clean Air Task Force...56 **Susan Buchanan , M.D.**  **,** Physicians for Social Responsibility and Union of Concerned Scientists .... ..............................61 **Christopher Codispoti, M.D.,**  Allergist ........66 **Janet Smith,** Sier ra Club Cool City Coalition ..68 **Daniel Lee,** Physicians for Social Responsibility ..............................73 **Joseph Leija, M.D.,** Allergist .................77 **Robert Collier,** Environmental Defe nse Fund ....82 **Bryan Grochowski,** Blue Green Alliance .........88 **Theodore Steck,** C oncerned Citizen .............93 **David Schaefer,** C oncerned Citizen .............97 **Jan Gehrig,** Cool Joliet ......................105 **Maureen McCue, M.D.,** Iowa Chapter of Physicians for Social Responsibility .......108 **John Rachow, M.D.,** National Organization of Physicians for Social Responsibility .......113 **Ellen Rendulich,** CARE, Citizens Against Hurting the Environment ....................116 **Peter Gorr,** Sierra Club and the Illinois Solar Energy As sociation ...................119 **John Heinz,** Conce rned Citizen ................124OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### C O N T E N T S Page Public Comments:

**Tom Wolf,** Energy Council of the Illinois Chamber o f Commerce

.. ........ ..............1 2 5 **Judith Jonker**

**- Bredeweg,**  West Michigan Sierra Club and West Michigan Environmental Action Council ....... .............................131 **Peggy Salazar,** Southeast Environmental Task
Force ........................ ..............134 **Mary Burnitz,** CARE, Citizens Against Ruining the Environment ............................136 **Steven Francis,** C oncerned Citizen ............139 **Tracey McFadden,** Concerned Citizen ...........144 **Reuben Keller,** Ecologist .................. ...149 **Kelly Pierce,** Concerned Citizen

... ........... 155 **Dr. John Bodine,** Concerned Citizen ...........159 **Robert Hudson,** Co ncerned Citizen .............162 **Bill Moore,** Conce rned Citizen ................169 **Dick Munson,** Recy cled Energy Development .....172 **Max Muller,** Envir onment Illinois .............178 **Sandra Kaptain,** Elgin Climate Change Organization .. .............................183 **Rev. Dr. Jerome Stone,** Concerned Citizen .....191 **Amy Allen,** Students for Environmental
Concerns ...................

.......... ...... 193 **Peter I. Slaby,** C oncerned Citizen ............195 **Derrell Slaughter,** Lansing NAACP Branch ......199 **Rev. Theresa Dear,** NAACP Dupage County .......207 **Dorthea Thomas,** NAACP Michigan State Conference .... .............................210 **Jacqueline Patterson,** Concerned Citizen ......215 **Katherine Egland,** NAACP Environmental and Climate Justice Committee ..................221 **Theodore Carrington,** NAACP, Environmental and Climate Justice Program for New Jersey .....225 **Gloria Gilmer,** NA ACP .........................230 **Terry Wiggins,** Interfaith Earth Network of Southeastern Wi sconsin .....................233 **Yangyang Cheng,** C oncerned Citizen ............237OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### C O N T E N T S Page Public Comme nts:

**Mitchell Avant,** Concerned Citizen ...........241 **Virginia Wisdom,** Concerned Citizen ..........244 **Dr. Robert Rosenstein,** Concerned Citizen ....248 **Terry Grace,** Con cerned Citizen ..............253 **Ann Schultz,** Con cerned Citizen ..............259
**Veren a Owen,**  Sie rra Club ....................262 **Andrew Clarke,** C oncerned Citizen ............267 **Pamela Ortner,** H ealth Care Without Harm .....272 **Charlotte Des Jardins,** Concerned Citizen

**.....** 278 **Kevin Kuhn,** Conc erned Citizen ...............279 **Tony Fuller,** Sie r ra Club ....................285 **Angela Li,** UChicago Climate Action Network ..289 **Bob Bingaman,** Si erra Club ...................290 **Stacey Salman,** C oncerned Citizen ............295 **Sylvia Glauster,** UChicago Climate Action Network and Chicago Youth Climate Commission

.......... ..... .................299 **Caroline Wooten,** Concerned Song

- Writing Citizen ...... .............................304 **Julian Borjas,** C hicago Clean Power Coalition.309 **Jerry Mead**

**- Lucero,**  PERRO, Pilsen Environmental Rights and Reform Organization . .............................312 **Cheryl Hogan,** Concerned Citizen .............319 **Michael Zurakob,** Concerned Citizen ..........321 **Willard Fry, M.D.,** American Thoracic Society.324 **Dr. Robert Jacob,** Concerned Citizen .........327
**Karen Root haan,**  Concerned Citizen ...........332 **Ryan Baker,** Concerned Citizen ...............336 **Caitlin Grey,** UChicago Climate Action Network ...................................338 **Alexandra Siporia,** Concerned Citizen ........340 **Anthony Martinez,** Beyond Coal C ampaign ......341 **Suzanne Dixon,** Kalamazoo River Sturgeon for Tomorrow and Saugatuck Dunes Coastal Alliance

... ...................... .........342OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### C O N T E N T S Page Public Comments:

**Ross Carstens,** UChi cago Climate Action Network and Chicago Youth Climate Commission ... .............................346 **David Ellis,** Sierra Club Hoosier Chapter, Dunelands Grou p ...........................348 **Carole Herhold,** Concerned Citizen ...........352 **Ann Josep h,**  Conc erned Citizen ...............354 **Joseph Weston,** O peration Free Campaign ......356 **Lora Chamberlain, M.D.,** Concerned Citizen .

. .360 **Olivia Woollam** , Concerned Citizen ... ........364 **Jenny Woronecki,** Concerned Citizen ... .......370 **Paul Kim,** Sierra Clu b ... ....................375 **Lucinda Hohmann,** Union of Concerned Scientists ... .............................377 **Amy Ochalski,** American Lung Association ... ..381 **Nadia Oehlsen,** Sierra Club ... ...............383 **Mary Fox,** Concerned Citizen ................

. 386 **Grace Pai,** Chica go Youth Climate Coalition ..387 **Edward Warden,** Chicago Youth Climate Coalition .... .............................389 **Craig Chrispell,** Hoosier Energy ... ..........391 **Becky Schillo,** Concerned Citizen ... .........396 **Elizabeth Stark,** National Wildlife Federation, Michigan Students Sustainability Coalition ... ...............399 **Angie Viands,** Concerned Citizen ... ..........403 **Rose Gomez,** Sierra Club .....................404 **Elizabeth Uchiyama,** Sierra Club ... ..........406 **John Phil lips,**  Sierra Club ..................412 **Jimmie Mitchell,** Little River Band of Ottawa Indians ...................................415 **Marie Socha,** Concerned Citizen ..............419 **Xhoana Ah m**  **eti,** Sierra Club, Chicago Youth Climate Coalition ........... ..............421 **Caty Bautista,** Sierra Club ... ...............422 **Rich Summins,** Sierra Club ...................425 **Kelly Mitchell,** Concerned Citizen ...........429OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### C O N T E N T S Page Public Comments:

**Brando n Bodar,**  Operation Free ...............433 **Kathryn Norregaard,** Evangelical Environmental Network ...................................439 **Mike Johnson,** Greenpeace ....................445 **Margaret Goldstein,** Concerned Citizen .......451 **Jessica Bell,** Concer ned Citizen .............452 **Allison Fisher,** Concerned Citizen ...........454 **Jack Gilroy,** Sierra Club ....................457

- - -OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### P R O C E E D I N G S 1



### M S. NOONAN : My name is Jenny Noonan, and 2



### I'm the Director of Policy Analysis and 3



### Communicatio ns in EPA's Office of Air Quality, 4



### Planning, and Standards. I will be chairing 5



### today's hearing. 6



### Joining me on the panel are Christian 7



### Fellner, also with EPA's Office of Air Quality, 8



### Planning, and Standards in the Sector of Policies 9



### and Programs Division. And Donald Bruce is with 10



### EPA's Region 5 office. 11



### We are here today to listen to your 12



### comments on EPA's Proposed Carbon Pollution 13



### Standards for New Power Plants. EPA published 14



### the proposed standards in the Federal Register on 15



### April 13th, 2012. This comm on sense step under 16



### the Clean Air Act would, for the first time, set 17



### national limits on the amount of carbon pollution 18



### that power plants built in the future can emit. 19



### For future power plants EPA is proposing 20



### to set an output

- based standard of 1,000 pound s 21



### of carbon dioxide per megawatt hour. The 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### Agency's proposal does not apply to existing 1



### units or planned units that already have received 2



### permits and break ground within the next 12 3



### months. 4



### EPA's proposed standard reflects the 5



### ongoing trend in the power sector to build 6



### cleaner plants that take advantage of American

7



### made technologies. The proposal is flexible and 8



### would help minimize carbon pollution through the 9



### deployment of the same types of modern 10



### technologies that power companies are already 11



### using to b uild the next generation of power 12



### plants. EPA's proposal would ensure that this 13



### progress toward a cleaner, safer, and more modern 14



### power sector continues. 15



### Today we will be accepting oral comments 16



### on all aspects of our proposal, and we will 17



### prepare a writt en transcript of the hearing. The 18



### transcript will be available as part the official 19



### record for this rule. We are also accepting 20



### written comments on the proposed rule until June 21



### 25th, 2012. 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### At the registration area, which is 1



### located in the hallway outsid e of this room, 2



### there are handouts with detailed information for 3



### submitting written comments by mail, fax, or 4



### electronically. EPA will consider your comments 5



### as we move forward to complete a final rule. 6



### Now let me describe the procedures for 7



### today's hear ing. I will call the speakers to the 8



### table in pairs. When it is your turn to speak, 9



### please state your name and your affiliation 10



### before you begin your testimony. And it would 11



### help our court reporter if you would also spell 12



### your name. 13



### In order to be fair to everyone, we will 14



### limit your testimony to five minutes each; and we 15



### ask that you remain at the table until both 16



### speakers in the pair have finished. After you 17



### finish your testimony, members of the panel may 18



### ask you a clarifying question or two. 19



### If, in addition to the transcript of your 20



### testimony, you would also like us to put a full 21



### text of your comments into the docket , please be 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### sure to give a copy of any written comments to 1



### our staff

-- again, at the registration table. 2



### We have a time

- keeping syste m consisting 3



### of red, yellow, and green lights to help keep 4



### track of your five minutes to speak. Before you 5



### begin speaking the green light will come on. The 6



### yellow light will signal that you have one minute 7



### left to speak. When the red light comes on, fiv e 8



### minutes have past and I will ask you to please 9



### complete your testimony. 10



### Today's hearing is scheduled from 8:30 11



### a.m. and will continue until 8:00 p.m. or later, 12



### if necessary, depending on the number of 13



### speakers. The hearing will recess during the 14



### schedu led lunch break from 12:00 to 1:00 and a 15



### dinner break from 4:30 to 5:30 p.m. We will 16



### reconvene promptly at 1:00 p.m. and 5:30 p.m., 17



### respectively. 18



### If you would like to testify but have not 19



### yet registered to do so, please sign up at the 20



### registration table in the hallway outside of this 21



### room. For those who have already registered to 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### speak, we have tried to accommodate your requests 1



### for specific time slots. We ask your patience as 2



### we proceed through the list of speakers. We may 3



### need to make some adjustment s as the day 4



### progresses. 5



### If you have any questions that arise 6



### through the day, please see a staff member at the 7



### registration table for assistance. 8



### Again, thank you all for participating 9



### today. Let's get started. 10



### The first two speakers for the morning 11



### a re Claire Butterfield and Beth Wallace. Please 12



### come to the table. 13



### And, Ms. Butterfield, would you like to 14



### start? 15



### MS. BUTTERFIELD: Thank you. 16



### Good morning. I'm Reverend Claire 17



### Butterfield, the Executive Director of Faith in 18



### Place and the Illinois Inte rfaith Power and Light 19



### Campaign. 20



### First of all, I want to thank you for 21



### holding this public hearing on the proposed CO 2 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### pollution standards for new power plants. I 1



### believe the standards you've announced are more 2



### than a reasonable response to the Supreme Co urt's 3



### instruction that you take steps to regulate a 4



### pollutant that we now know beyond any question is 5



### harmful to humans and other living things. 6



### I know you will hear testimony from 7



### experts today in the fields of public health and 8



### environmental science on how important this is. 9



### I'm here today as a minister and as the Director 10



### of Illinois Interfaith Power and Light Campaign 11



### and Faith in Place. Faith in Place and our 12



### campaign work with over 900 congregations in 13



### Illinois to help people of all faiths become 14



### b etter stewards of creation because all our faith 15



### teach us that we must take care of this beautiful 16



### planet. Every faith teaches this in different 17



### ways, but they all speak to the need for us to be 18



### careful stewards of this extraordinary gift of 19



### being here at all. 20



### And we are part of the Interfaith Power 21



### and Light Coalition nationally, which involves 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### 14,000 congregations in this called

- for 1



### stewardship in 38 states. Many of our partner 2



### congregations are taking steps themselves to 3



### address climate change by redu cing their energy 4



### consumption. The Mosque Foundation in Bridgeview 5



### has installed a solar thermal system to heat the 6



### water they use to wash for Friday prayers , making 7



### them the first solar mosque in the nation. 8



### Our friends at the Jewish 9



### Reconstructionist C ongregation in Evanston built 10



### the first platinum LEED graded worship space in 11



### the count r y. 12



### The Euclid Avenue United Methodist Church 13



### in Oak Park retrofitted their heating system to 14



### go geothermal. And while they had their parking 15



### lot dug up anyway for the well field, they 16



### retrofitted it with a permeable surface. For the 17



### climate change we don't manage to prevent, that 18



### will help when the heavy rains come. 19



### St. Matthew Lutheran Church in Urbana 20



### converted a five

- acre field to a community

21



### supported agriculture farm. The Sola Gratia CSA 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### making them the only church I know of with a 1



### farmer on their payroll. 2



### And these examples are inspiring. They 3



### inspire us at Faith of Place, but we all know 4



### that steps like these are too small to impact an 5



### issue as big as climat e change. We need more 6



### than individual action. We need policies that go 7



### across the economy as a whole. 8



### I'm also here today to support you and to 9



### speak to you as a human, a mother, and someone 10



### who grew up in a part of Illinois which has coal 11



### beneath it. I recently took part in a tour of 12



### the mining areas of central Illinois with a group 13



### of clergy. We stood at the base of the slurry 14



### impoundments, and we thought about what would 15



### happen to the rivers of our state and our farm 16



### fields if those impoundment wal ls break and the 17



### billions of gallons behind them spill out. 18



### We also watched the prairie winds blow 19



### across piles of coal ash, the final remnant of 20



### coal burn for electricity which is being disposed 21



### of back at the mine sites by the acre . This 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### mining goes on in proximity to our water and our 1



### food because of the demand for coal. When we 2



### burn that coal, which is after all nature's own 3



### carbon sink, we are also releasing tons of carbon 4



### into the atmosphere. 5



### We've heard a lot over the last 13 years 6



### that I've be en in this work about how to describe 7



### the impacts of carbon pollution from industrial 8



### sources on the climate of the earth. The biggest 9



### single source of this pollution is our fleet of 10



### old coal

- fired plants. As a person if faith, I 11



### think we should just tel l the truth about them, 12



### that they will disrupt natural systems and may 13



### soon push the earth beyond its resilient 14



### capacity. 15



### We're already seeing impacts on 16



### agriculture. Our harvest two years ago was the 17



### latest ever recorded. Last year there was hardly 18



### any winter, so pests that should be killed by 19



### freezing are probably here in greater number this 20



### year. The rain patterns have become erratic with 21



### ferocious storms followed by dry weather. 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### I grew up among farmers, so this matters 1



### to me; but we all know the jo y of that first ripe 2



### peach in summer, the way it bursts and the juice 3



### runs down our chins. And that won't happen this 4



### year in the Midwest. 5



### Too many disruptions year after year in 6



### the last decade have happened for us not to be 7



### looking at greenhouse gas co ncentrations as a 8



### cause. This is the beginning of the altered 9



### world, a world of less joy and less beauty, and a 10



### world of more suffering, not just for our 11



### farmers. The floods and famines that climate 12



### change will trigger among the millions in the 13



### world who live in poverty are an injustice that 14



### could be prevented. 15



### Your regulations are a first step in 16



### addressing this and a hopeful one. People of 17



### faith are united with me today to thank you for 18



### making it. 19



### MS. NOONAN: Ms. Wallace? 20



### MS. WALLACE: Good morning . Thank you. 21



### Beth, B

- E

- T

- H, W

- A

- L

- L

- A

- C

- E. 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### I thank you for the opportunity to speak 1



### today. I am with the National Wildlife 2



### Federation, and I'm the Community Outreach 3



### Regional Coordinator, and I work on conservation 4



### issues within our Great Lakes basin. 5



### I am also proud to say I am a new mom of 6



### a five month little boy. His name is Regan, and 7



### being a mom is one of the best thrills in the 8



### world. However, as a new mom, I am face with so 9



### many new fears. I worry about pesticides in the 10



### fruit that we eat, if the water is safe to drink. 11



### And one of my biggest fears

-- and it's something 12



### I think about daily is if air that we breathing 13



### safe. 14



### I also worry about the future of our 15



### resources and wildlife and how Regan will 16



### experience the great outdoors as he grows up . I 17



### fear that if we keep on this path, he might not 18



### be able to spend summers along the Great Lakes 19



### due to beach closings, or he won't be able to 20



### take a weekend fishing trip with his dad and 21



### actually eat the fish that he catches. 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### Uncontrolled carbon pollu tion that causes climate 1



### change

-- it also causes toxic mercury emissions 2



### and numerous other air toxins still pose a 3



### serious threat to people and the wildlife. 4



### Power plants are the nation's single 5



### largest source of climate change causing air 6



### pollution, pu mping roughly 2.4 billion tons of 7



### carbon dioxide into the air each year. 8



### Currently there are no limits on the 9



### amount of carbon pollution that can be released 10



### from power plants' smokestacks, and this air 11



### pollution results in higher average temperatures, 12



### ex treme weather, serious impacts on, of course, 13



### public health and impacts to wildlife. 14



### Scientists predict that if the 15



### temperatures increase as much as forecasted, we 16



### could lose as many as 40 percent of the species 17



### on the planet. But the fact is fish and wi ldlife 18



### are already being impacted by the small increases 19



### in temperature we've already had. 20



### Safeguarding our natural resources is 21



### important to those of us who want our children to 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### grow up being able to fish and spend time 1



### outdoors; but it is also a wise in vestment in our 2



### economy and future. Reducing industrial carbon 3



### pollution will help impact our longstanding 4



### investment in our outdoor heritage. 5



### Michigan wildlife and natural resources 6



### is the backbone of our $5 billion recreation 7



### tourism economy. The Grea t Lakes are a national 8



### treasure. 9



### It is misleading to say that enforcement 10



### of national

-- a nation that's barren o f laws is 11



### bad for the economy and employment . It is not. 12



### We should never have to choose between a job and 13



### a healthy environment. We are ent itled to both. 14



### Americans are no less entitled to a safe, clean 15



### environment during difficult economic times than 16



### they are a more prosperous economy. 17



### Taking action to reduce carbon pollution 18



### and confront our climate crisis is essential for 19



### safeguarding our wildlife and our outdoor 20



### heritage. By utilizing our environmental laws we 21



### can help rid the air and water of harmful 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### pollutants and restore health to our ecosystem. 1



### I strongly urge the EPA and Congress to 2



### move forward with finalizing carbon air pollution 3



### standards and ensuring a healthy outdoor legacy 4



### for my son and future generations. Now and in 5



### the future the EPA and other federal and state 6



### environmental laws can help ensure that the 7



### legacy we leave our children is a clean and 8



### healthy planet. 9



### Thank you

. 10



### MS. NOONAN: Thank you both. 11



### Our next two speakers will be Mikka 12



### McCracken and Myriam Renaud. 13



### MS. McCRACKEN: Good morning. 14



### MS. NOONAN: Good morning. 15



### MS. McCRACKEN: My name is Mikka 16



### McCracken. It's a little tricky. M

- I

- K

- K

- A

. 17



### Last name is McCra cken, M

- C

- C

- R

- A

- C

- K

- E

- N. It's 18



### kind of catchy. So, my name is Mikka McCracken, 19



### and I represent the Evangelical Lutheran Church 20



### in America, based here in Chicago, and the 21



### National Council of Churches USA. 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### The Evangelical Lutheran Church in 1



### America, also k nown as the ELCA, is the largest 2



### Lutheran denomination in the United States, with 3



### more than 10,000 congregations and 4.2 million 4



### members. As a church we're part of the National 5



### Council of Churches , which is a group of 37 6



### Christian denominations with over 100,000 7



### congregations and over 45 million people. 8



### Specifically, I serve as a program 9



### director with ELCA World Hunger and Disaster 10



### Response. Every year these related ministries 11



### mobilize about $30 million and countless 12



### congregational leaders to make a diff erence in 13



### the lives of families and communities in more 14



### than 50 countries, including the United States. 15



### As people of faith, we're called to serve 16



### as stewards of God's good creation and to seek 17



### justice for those who are hungry, poor, and 18



### marginalized. Wit h that call in mind, we speak 19



### in support, and we're particularly thankful for 20



### two parts of the proposal before us today. 21



### First, we appreciate that the analysis 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### shows no increase in the price of electricity as 1



### a result of the proposal. It's an important 2



### p iece that will protect families and communities 3



### as they work to recover from the economic 4



### downturn. 5



### Second, the proposed rule will diminish 6



### carbon output for future power plants. And 7



### studies, of course, have linked carbon dioxide 8



### emissions to increased r espiratory illness among 9



### children

-- we heard the concern of the mother 10



### just now

-- the elderly, people of color, and 11



### people living in poverty. The proposed standard 12



### will really mean hope for better health among the 13



### vulnerable. 14



### Carbon dioxide also contri butes to global 15



### climate change, and we, at ELAC World Hunger, 16



### know that climate change has already begun to 17



### affect agriculture in the United States and 18



### around the world. That it endangers food 19



### security for people in our nation and all members 20



### of the globa l family. 21



### As climate change continues, our work to 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### end hunger and extreme poverty will become more 1



### necessary and more challenging. If you remember 2



### anything from my time today, I hope that you 3



### remember that Lutherans care and Lutherans make a 4



### difference. Lutherans offered the first cups of 5



### water to drought

- fleeing refugees at the Dadaab 6



### refugee camp in Kenya. That camp is the largest 7



### refugee camp, and it's managed by Lutherans. And 8



### through our social service agencies we reach 1 in 9



### every 50 Americans eac h year, which includes 10



### hospital and medical systems. 11



### We can't do this alone. With the EPA, 12



### with your systemic level help to enact these 13



### rules that would reduce carbon emissions we can 14



### do more together, and we really appreciate that. 15



### In the words of Psal m 100, verse 5, for 16



### the Lord is good, the Lord's steadfast love 17



### endures forever, and the Lord's faithfulness to 18



### all generations. By ensuring that future power 19



### plants will have reduced carbon footprints you 20



### will help protect the most vulnerable and care 21



### fo r God's creation for generations to come. We 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### encourage you to enact the strongest rule 1



### possible. 2



### Thank you for your service and for the 3



### opportunity to speak with you on behalf of the 4



### ELCA and the National Council of Churches. 5



### MS. RENAUD: My name is Myr iam Renaud, M

6



### Y

- R

- I

- A

- M, R

- E

- N

- A

- U

- D. I'm a minister 7



### representing myself. 8



### Ralph Waldo Emerson, who was like me, a 9



### Unitarian minister, once said that nature never 10



### wears a mean appearance. In his essay Nature 11



### Emerson described the earth as a green ball wh ich 12



### floats us human beings through the heavens, 13



### offering steady and prodigal provision for our 14



### support and delight. What angels, he asked, 15



### invented this ocean of air above, this ocean of 16



### water beneath, this firmament of earth between

. 17



### The earth, the wate r, and air, he wrote, are 18



### splendid ornaments, rich conveniences. The air, 19



### he wrote, is a cordial of incredible virtue. 20



### What the Clean Air Act recognized was 21



### that while this ocean of air above invented by 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### angels seems never to wear a mean appearance, 1



### it's appearance can be deceiving. The air may 2



### seem like a cordial of incredible virtue, but 3



### when the air next to coal and oil

- fired plants is 4



### tested, it is shown to carry mercury and toxic 5



### particulate matter. 6



### Here, in Chicago, we've learned the hard 7



### way abou t the cost of having two of the nation's 8



### oldest and dirtiest coal power plants in our city 9



### limits. We've learned that the mercury and toxic 10



### particulate matter that these plants spew into 11



### the air make asthma worse, increase rates of 12



### heart attacks, and caus e other illnesses. We've 13



### learned that these plants are especially noxious 14



### to the elderly and to our children. 15



### Here in Chicago the air is not a splendid 16



### ornament or rich convenience. It is poisoned. 17



### Chicagoans, especially those who live near the 18



### two coa l power plants have become afraid to 19



### breathe. Afraid to breathe. Afraid to breathe 20



### from the ocean of air above, created a steady and 21



### prodigal provision for our support and delight. 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### What to do? 1



### I also am a mother. I have a 13

- year

- old 2



### daughter. She en joys many of the benefits that 3



### come with living in a big city, as I do, as does 4



### my husband. Chicago is our home, so a conundrum. 5



### Do we leave Chicago for an area with cleaner air, 6



### or do we stay in Chicago knowing that this 7



### decision may impact our health in a negative way? 8



### For more than 10 years residents of this 9



### city have asked for improved air quality, and 10



### help has finally come. It came in December of 11



### last year. It came in the form of stricter 12



### federal regulations about what power plants may 13



### pump into th e air that we all share. It came in 14



### the form of the mass regulation. Thanks to this 15



### regulation plants are now about to close those 16



### coal power plants within our city limits. This 17



### regulation has already gone a long way to 18



### restoring our trust that the air we breathe will 19



### not hide a mean appearance. 20



### While the people of Chicago will soon 21



### have healthier to breath we celebrate the fact 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### that beyond our city limits other communities, 1



### other Americans, will also benefit from strict 2



### controls on air quality. 3



### And I also will quote a Psalm, Psalm 79, 4



### which basically says this: Dear God, we have 5



### made a mess, but we are your hands in the world. 6



### We give thanks for life. We will repair all we 7



### have made waste. 8



### Indeed, thanks to the Clean Air Act, and 9



### to the EPA, and t o MACT we will begin to repair 10



### the air to which we have laid waste. Our hope is 11



### restored for a day when with every breath we take 12



### we will enjoy a cordial of incredible virtue

. 13



### MS. NOONAN: Thank you. Our next 14



### speakers Peter M. Iwanowicz

-- sorry if I'm 15



### mangling names. 16



### MR. IWANOWICZ: No, that's right. 17



### MS. NOONAN: Great. And Jean Sideris ? 18



### MS. SIDERIS : Yes. 19



### MS. NOONAN: Okay. Please come to the 20



### table. 21



### MR. IWANOWICZ: Me first? 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### MS. NOONAN: Sure. Go ahead. 1



### MR. IWANOWICZ: Good morning. My name is 2



### Peter Iwanowicz. Last name is spelled I

- W

- A

- N

- O

3



### W

- I

- C

- Z. I am Assistant Vice

- President with the 4



### American Lung Association, and I am pleased to 5



### provide testimony in support of the Environmental 6



### Protection Agency's proposed power plant carbon 7



### pollution standard. 8



### The standard is historic in that it sets 9



### the first national standard for power plant and 10



### carbon pollution. The standard is equally 11



### important because it represents the next step in 12



### what is needed to address pollution of power 13



### plants. 14



### Power plan t pollution kills and it can 15



### make people sick. Enforcing the clean air 16



### protection such as the EPA's Cross

- State Air 17



### Pollution Rule which we call the secondhand smog 18



### rule and the power plant Mercury and Air Toxic 19



### standards will dramatically improve public 20



### health. 21



### By proposing standards for carbon 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### pollution from new facilities the EPA is setting 1



### the stage for the next generation of America's 2



### power plants to be the least toxic and most 3



### modern in the world. Doing anything less 4



### shortchanges our children's hea lth and future 5



### generations. 6



### Today you will hear the tremendous 7



### support that this rule has with the public. More 8



### than one million comments in support of the rule 9



### have come in since early April. I am told that 10



### this is the most comments that EPA has ever 11



### r eceived on a rule, and there is still a month 12



### left before the comment period closes. 13



### This affirms the support that, we at the 14



### American Lung Association, have found in recent 15



### poll of voters. According to our bipartisan 16



### survey, voters strongly support EPA' s efforts to 17



### update clean air protections. An astounding 72 18



### percent of voters in this country surveyed 19



### specifically want EPA to set limits on power 20



### plant carbon pollution. How often do you get 21



### three

- quarters of the population in this country 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### supporting s omething? Seventy

- two percent of 1



### voters want limits on carbon pollution of power 2



### plants. 3



### Also, we found that the public doesn’t 4



### buy into the industry's false choice that we must 5



### choose between public health and a strong 6



### economy. According to the same po ll that we 7



### conducted, nearly three

- quarters of voters say 8



### that we do not have to choose between an air 9



### quality and strong economy. We can achieve both. 10



### And a 2 to 1 majority, 60 to 31 percent, believes 11



### that strengthening safeguards against pollution 12



### will create, not destroy, jobs by encouraging 13



### innovation. 14



### But numbers and polling information 15



### cannot speak for the people who we have met 16



### during the past year who are getting a lot more 17



### involved in our fight for air. I want to tell 18



### you a little bit about some of the folks I've met 19



### in the last year. 20



### First, myself. I'm a dad. I live in 21



### upstate New York with my wife and two children. 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### And I work out of the National ALA office in 1



### Washington, D.C. They know that when I leave 2



### home each week that I'm fighting to make the air 3



### healthy and to make future generations brighter. 4



### And they know that when I return home each week I 5



### will have met another person that is in need of 6



### clean air and has joined the fight as well. 7



### This week I met Judy

-- just yesterday 8



### here in Ch icago. She had a double lung 9



### transplant three years ago. She understands the 10



### value of every breath she takes and wants each 11



### one to be with air that is cleaner than it is 12



### now. Let's stand up for Judy today. 13



### Jake is a friend I met last June in mid 14



### Main e. His dad calls him the canary in the coal 15



### mine because Jake's asthma gets worse even before 16



### a bad

- air day is declared by the state. He knows 17



### what cleaner air will mean to his son and all the 18



### other kids with asthma. Remember, there are no 19



### coal

- fired po wer plants in Maine. They breathe 20



### in a lot of what we call second

- hand smog. So 21



### let's stand up for kids like Jake. 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### Pam, a mom from Philadelphia, lost her 1



### son to an asthma attack and knows that polluted 2



### air made it tougher for him to manage his 3



### disease. She does not want others to have to go 4



### through the pain of losing a child to asthma. 5



### It's not the total solution, but clean air will 6



### make it a heck of a lot easier for children with 7



### asthma and their parents to manage the disease. 8



### So let's stand up for P am. 9



### Last fall I met former football great, 10



### Ickey Woods of the Cincinnati Bengals and C handra 11



### Woods. They lost their son, J a v o nte Woods, i n 12



### August of 2010. His fatal asthma attack occurred 13



### during a time when air in Cincinnati was 14



### particularly bad. They wish they knew then what 15



### they know now about dirty air and asthma. So 16



### they're joining us in fighting for clean air. So 17



### let's stand up for the Woods family. 18



### And, finally, there are 6.4 million 19



### children with asthma in this country. 2.5 20



### million of them li ve in a county that fails the 21



### American Lung Association's State of the Air 2012 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### Report for Ozone. This is unacceptable. We all 1



### need clean air to breathe. 2



### We are pleased that EPA is moving forward 3



### on carbon pollution from power plants. We urge 4



### you to fi nalize the rule before the end of the 5



### year and to propose one for existing sources as 6



### well. 7



### Thank you for your attention. 8



### MS. SIDERIS: Hi there. Thank you for 9



### the opportunity to testify today in support of 10



### the EPA's power plant carbon standard. My nam e 11



### is Jean Sideris, and I work with the Union of 12



### Concerned Scientists. 13



### UCS is the nation's leading science

- based 14



### non

- profit working for a health environment and 15



### safer world. I here on behalf of UCS' more than 16



### 350,000 supporters and a network of more tha n 17



### 18,000 scientists to show strong support for the 18



### EPA's efforts to reduce carbon emissions from 19



### coal and oil

- fired power plants under the Clean 20



### Air Act. 21



### The EPA's actions are grounded in 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### science. The threat posed by unchecked climate 1



### change has been cle arly articulated by numerous 2



### national and international scientific 3



### organizations, including the U.S. National 4



### Academy of Sciences. 5



### If we fail to make deep reductions in 6



### carbon emissions, we will greatly increase the 7



### risk of serious economic public healt h and 8



### environmental consequences, including sea level 9



### rise, extreme weather events, increased risks of 10



### asthma and heat stress, a strain on water 11



### resources, and the loss or degradation of vital 12



### ecosystems. 13



### Today I would like to talk about the 14



### public health risk. I have with me today a 15



### letter signed by 356 physicians, registered or 16



### advanced practice nurses, and public health 17



### experts with an M.S., Ph.D., or MPH. The letter, 18



### an open letter from health professionals in 19



### support of the Clean Air Act and the 20



### Env ironmental Protection Agency, urges U.S. 21



### policymakers to support EPA's ability under the 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### Clean Air Act to take action that will protect 1



### public health and address climate change. 2



### The letter includes endorsers from 48 3



### states and the District of Columbia. I t calls 4



### attention to the professional organizations that 5



### have already pointed out the health impacts of 6



### climate change : The American Medical 7



### Association, the American Academy of Pediatrics, 8



### American Nursing Association, and the American 9



### Public Health Asso ciation to name a few. 10



### The most likely health impacts in the 11



### U.S. include heat

- related illness, waterborne 12



### disease, and mental health impacts from coping 13



### with the extreme weather. The most vulnerable 14



### populations are children, the elderly, and the 15



### poor. 16



### The Clean Air Act has a long history of 17



### protecting public health. In 2010 alone, the 18



### science

- based Clean Air act prevented an 19



### estimated 160,000 premature deaths and millions 20



### of cases of respiratory and cardiovascular 21



### disease. These annual benefits are p rojected to 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### grow in the next decade. 1



### We believe that the EPA's draft proposal 2



### to limit carbon emissions from new power plants 3



### is an important first step to putting our nation 4



### on a path to reducing (unintelligible) emissions 5



### and avoiding the most catastrop hic impacts of 6



### climate change. 7



### Setting an ambitious but achievable 8



### standard that is applied uniformly to all fossil

9



### fuel power plants will help ensure a transition 10



### to cleaner generation of sources over time. 11



### Of course, these standards for new power 12



### plant s are not enough to address the threat of 13



### climate change. Reducing emissions from the 14



### power sector requires that we also set standards 15



### for the existing fleet of power plants. Now that 16



### the EPA has moved to regulate emissions from new 17



### power plants, it must move quickly to regulate 18



### emissions from existing. 19



### Ultimately, other forms of strong action 20



### will be required to achieve the full scale of 21



### deep reductions needed to reduce or avoid some of 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### the worst impacts of climate change. But today 1



### these are the very necessary and important first 2



### steps. 3



### We thank the EPA for taking this first 4



### step and look forward to continued action to 5



### address the climate challenge. 6



### MS. NOONAN: And the letter that you 7



### reference, you are going to enter into the 8



### record? 9



### MS. SIDERIS: I have that. Yes. 10



### MS. NOONAN: Okay. Thank you. 11



### MR. FELLNER: I just have one clarifying 12



### question. When you say move quickly, do you have 13



### an idea on the time frame? Because that could 14



### mean different things to different people. 15



### MS. SIDERIS: Yes. W e would like to see 16



### this rule finalized this year and

-- 17



### MR. FELLNER: Okay. 18



### MS. SIDERIS:

-- existing started this 19



### year. 20



### MR. FELLNER: Okay. Thank you. 21



### MS. NOONAN: Okay, our next two 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### panelists, Randy Jur a s and Dr. Josephine L ejia

-- 1



### Dr. Joseph Lejia , L

- E

- J

- I

- A? I'm sure I'm 2



### totally mangling that, and I apologize. 3



### [No response.] 4



### MS. NOONAN: Okay. Then Dan Dulan

5



### Laughlin? 6



### MR. DOLAN

- LAUGHLIN: That was close. 7



### MS. NOONAN: Okay. Please correct me. 8



### MR. DOLAN

- LAUGHLIN: It's Dolan

- Laughlin. 9



### MS. N OONAN: Dolan

- Laughlin. Okay. 10



### Thank you. 11



### Okay. Please begin. 12



### MR. : Hello, my name is Randy Juras, R

13



### A

- N

- D

- Y, last name J

- U

- R

- A

- S. I live at 14351 14



### South Oak Trail in Homer Glen, Illinois. 15



### I appreciate the opportunity to speak 16



### today about the EPA's s tandards regarding new 17



### fossil

- fuel

- fired electric power plants. As 18



### someone who cares about the environment and 19



### actually lives close to pollution sources, I know 20



### it is not safe. I also know that this is one of 21



### the few opportunities that average American c an 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### get to voice their concerns and feelings. 1



### In my case my elected representative, 2



### Judy Biggert has not shared any of the same views 3



### that I have for my environment. For her the 4



### economic interests of the businesses in our 5



### district have always come first. She has put 6



### profits ahead of the environment every time. So 7



### this is the best chance I have at making my 8



### thoughts known in Washington. 9



### In Homer Glen the prevailing wind is from 10



### the west. Straight west from where I live, only 11



### about a mile or two, Midwest Generation, Will 12



### County Station is located. If you look south 13



### from 135th Street, just over the river, you can 14



### clearly see the coal pile and the power plant. 15



### The plant itself is old and, therefore, it has 16



### none of those scrubbers or other air pollution 17



### re duction devices. 18



### While Midwest Generation has done a few 19



### things in the last few years, they have simply 20



### taken poke and fixes driven by lawsuits against 21



### them. A spokesman for the plant said that they 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### were targeted unfairly. I have trouble with that 1



### sta tement. How can you be targeted unfairly for 2



### polluting? The toxic fumes such as soot, heavy 3



### metals, sulfur dioxide, and nitrogen dioxide are 4



### coming from your plant and drifting over polluted 5



### areas. Why would you not expect the residents to 6



### be upset? Do you honestly think that these 7



### people are actually not concerned about this 8



### condition? 9



### That is not all. Directly north of this 10



### coal

- burning plant are a series of refineries. 11



### Driving along New Avenue you can literally smell 12



### the pollution. So along with the toxic fumes 13



### coming from Midwest Generation coal plant, we 14



### have the refinery pollution as well. 15



### Yet the story does not end. At 143rd and 16



### Bell construction of the Heritage Crossing 17



### Industrial Park is underway. When completed 18



### there will be 220 acres of light industry and 19



### distribution in operation. Tens of thousands of 20



### diesel engine trucks will be driving in and out 21



### of that industrial park each and every year. The 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### toxic fumes from that pouring from those engines 1



### will mix with the already present poll ution 2



### coming from Midwest Generation coal

- fired power 3



### plant and those refineries. 4



### Two coal

- fired plants in Chicago are 5



### closing down. These two plants should have been 6



### shuttered years ago, but that did not happen. 7



### For many years these plants operated ver y 8



### cheaply. Token fixes were added but only after 9



### they were forced to do so, which brings us to 10



### this hearing. 11



### Finally, the EPA has the opportunity to 12



### do something about the largest source of 13



### pollution coming from generating electric power. 14



### The EPA can do what the electrical power 15



### generating industry is not willing to do. 16



### Without setting up national standards 17



### defining how much pollution is allowed, the 18



### industry will simply not punish themselves. As 19



### history clearly shows, corporations are driven by 20



### profits . If these proposed new fossil

- fueled 21



### power plants are now required by law to reduce 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### these toxic pollutants they emit, they simply 1



### will not do it. 2



### If anything, the EPA should have the 3



### ability to go back into those older plants and 4



### require them to clean u p their operations. As I 5



### have pointed out, these fossil

- fuel

- burning 6



### plants are not the only source of pollution. In 7



### way too many cases they are part of a complex 8



### situation which creates high concentrations of 9



### pollution in urban areas. We need to start 10



### taking the environment seriously. 11



### Thank you for allowing me to speak. 12



### MR. DOLAN

- LAUGHLIN: I'm going to take 13



### this off because this is like having a 14



### conversation through a bath towel. 15



### Good morning. My name is Daniel M. 16



### Dolan

- Laughlin. I am appearing here today to 17



### testify how pollution controls like the carbon 18



### pollution limits that EPA is proposing today 19



### impact millions of people who suffer from 20



### respiratory illnesses. Although I am not a 21



### scientist nor a doctor, I am someone who has 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### suffered nearly fat ally from COPD. I am someone 1



### who received a double

- lung transplant of over six 2



### months ago, and someone for whom pollution 3



### control still and will mean the difference 4



### between life and death for the rest of my life. 5



### I suffered from Chronic Obstructive 6



### Pulmo nary Disease or COPD for decades. As the 7



### disease progressed, I could no longer work. My 8



### quality of life declined, slowly at first, then 9



### more rapidly as I approached end stage. I 10



### required round the clock oxygen therapy to 11



### perform even basic functions. 12



### E ventually I wound up in the hospital 13



### with end stage COPD. My doctor told me the words 14



### that no one is ever really prepared to hear or 15



### wants to hear, that I only had several days to 16



### live without having mechanical support, a 17



### ventilator or the like, which I e nded up with. 18



### And yet a miracle occurred at that point. 19



### Through organ donation, a miracle organ donation, 20



### I was given the gift of life and hope and a 21



### healthy new pair of lungs. Even with this life

- 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### changing gift, I must still be very vigilant 1



### about pollut ion levels. Poor air quality during 2



### high ozone days forces me to stay indoors. 3



### Pollution literally makes me sick. I depend on 4



### healthy air to breathe and to live. And there 5



### are many, many, many others who depend on it, 6



### too, like I do. 7



### And I'm not here today simply to talk 8



### about my own battle for healthy air. I'm here as 9



### an advocate for everyone with lung diseases. 10



### Asthma sufferers, COPD patients, and others rely 11



### on pollution controls to simply get through 12



### another day. Lung disease impacts young peopl e, 13



### old people, rich, poor. And all over the country 14



### every one of them deserves a right to breathe 15



### healthy air. 16



### On behalf of these people I support EPA's 17



### limits on carbon pollution from new power plants. 18



### By you having the courage to implement this rule, 19



### y ou will reduce carbon pollution and smog that 20



### threatens millions of people like me every day. 21



### Carbon pollution builds up in the 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### atmosphere, and scientists believe that this

-- 1



### as this rapidly grows, it will increase 2



### temperatures leading to formation of gr ound level 3



### ozone or smog. Breathing in ozone causes 4



### problems of all kinds for all kinds of people, 5



### not just the ones with COPD. It can cause 6



### wheezing. It can cause and aggravate asthma 7



### attacks and COPD exacerbations which are flare

8



### ups of the lungs whic h require costly 9



### hospitalizations. 10



### Children who inhale ozone have a higher 11



### chance of developing lung diseases or reduced 12



### lung functions as they become adults. And since 13



### power plants are one of the largest single 14



### sources of carbon pollution, it is only r ight 15



### that the EPA impose this standard. 16



### Although I strongly support the EPA's 17



### power plant carbon pollution limits, I'd like 18



### these limits to be enforced also on existing 19



### power plants, not just the new ones. There are 20



### more than 5,000 existing power plants spewing 21



### carbon and other pollutants into our atmosphere 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### on a daily basis. Most of these existing power 1



### plants are fueled by coal. A single coal

- fired 2



### power plant released an average 3.7 million tons 3



### of carbon pollution. Imagine the impact on our 4



### 580 exi sting coal

- fired plants. It's going to 5



### have a terrible affect on the next generation. 6



### We cannot ignore the impact of carbon pollution 7



### from these existing power plants. 8



### The current rule not only exempts 9



### existing power plants but it ignores the fact 10



### that they can and will likely continue to pollute 11



### the air for future generations. Unlike COPD, 12



### there is no identified end stage for our power 13



### plant. 14



### In Illinois the Wood River power plant 15



### has been operating since 1948, and that is by no 16



### means a record. There 's a power plant in Indiana 17



### that's been running since 1903. Existing power 18



### plants aren't disappearing, and they certainly 19



### should be included in the carbon pollution 20



### limits. 21



### Every day I wake up with a miraculous 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### gift, a set of health new lungs and life. I 1



### cannot take my gift of new lungs for granted, and 2



### I urge that the EPA not take it for granted 3



### either. I urge you to implement this rule and to 4



### get to work on carbon pollution standards for 5



### existing power plants also. 6



### Thank you very much for your time, and 7



### thank you for your attention. 8



### MS. NOONAN: Thank you. 9



### MR. BRUCE: Good luck. 10



### MS. NOONAN: I'm going to try this name 11



### again, and I apologize if I continue to mangle 12



### it. Dr. Joseph L

- E

- J

- I

- A? 13



### [No response.] 14



### MS. NOONAN: Okay. We'll move on. Ms. 15



### Wanda Martin

- Terry and J

. Drake Hamilton, please? 16



### And if you could, repeat your name and 17



### spell it for the record, please. 18



### MS. MARTIN

- TERRY: Hi, I'm

-- 19



### MS. NOONAN: Your name and spell it. 20



### MS. MARTIN

- TERRY: Okay. Wanda Martin

21



### Terry, W

- A

- N

- D

- A, M

- A

- R

- T

- I

- N, hyphen, T

- E

- R

- R

- Y. 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### Thank you. Good morning. My name is 1



### Wanda Martin

- Terry, and I am a Chicago resident 2



### and very concerned about air pollution and its 3



### affect on lung health. Last year I became a 4



### member of the local leadership board of the 5



### Americ an Lung Association in Greater Chicago due 6



### to my passion for educating the community on an 7



### illness that once consumed my father. Over 30 8



### years ago my father passed away from lung cancer. 9



### To provide for our family he worked as a janitor 10



### at a company in Chi cago that produced chemicals 11



### for oven cleaners and floor wax. Every day he 12



### would breathe in these chemicals, and in 1972 he 13



### was diagnosed with lung disease. 14



### I watched my father's illness debilitate 15



### him so much that he was unable to give me away at 16



### my wed ding. My father's passing has forever 17



### changed my life, and it gives me a voice to 18



### spread the word and ensure that there is 19



### awareness about lung disease and how it can be 20



### prevented. 21



### Today I'm here to testify in strong 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### support of the EPA's proposed ruling limiting 1



### carbon pollution from power plants. The public 2



### should not have to breathe in pollution. 3



### In 2009 your agency determined that 4



### greenhouse gas pollution threatens Americans' 5



### health and welfare by leading to long

- lasting 6



### changes in our climate that c an have a range of 7



### negative effects on human health and the 8



### environment. 9



### We need to protect our children and our 10



### grandchildren. And by setting standards for 11



### future power plants, it will save lives and 12



### reduce disease. I heard some members of Congress 13



### are proposing changes to the Clean Air Act that 14



### could dismantle the progress made in the last 40 15



### years. Our nation must keep that law strong to 16



### continue to protect public health. 17



### Today we employ EPA to move ahead and to 18



### finalize this rule on or before the court order 19



### deadline of June 25th. Each day of delay harms 20



### health and it shortens lives. 21



### Thank you. 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### MS. HAMILTON: Good morning. I'm J. 1



### Drake Hamilton. J, period, Drake, D

- R

- A

- K

- E, 2



### Hamilton, H

- A

- M

- I

- L

- T

- O

- N. 3



### Thank you for this opportunity to testi fy 4



### in support of the first ever carbon standards 5



### from new power plants. I serve as the Science 6



### Policy Director for Fresh Energy, which is a 7



### private, non

- profit organization based in St. 8



### Paul, Minnesota, so a different part of this EPA 9



### region. 10



### Fresh Ene rgy is 20 years old and has a 11



### strong track record of working on clean energy 12



### policy that builds our Midwestern economy and 13



### jobs around clean energy that also reduces carbon 14



### pollution and improves community health through 15



### better air and water quality. Our work helps 16



### build the market economy around the many dozens 17



### of solutions to climate change that also drive a 18



### thriving economy. Fresh Energy works across the 19



### State of Minnesota and in the upper Midwest 20



### region that is our marketplace. 21



### The vitality of Minn esota's economy and 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### our quality of life depends in many ways on the 1



### health of agriculture, our forests, lakes and 2



### waters, and the quality and supply of those 3



### waters. Iconic Minnesota species such as the 4



### loon, moose, boreal forest species, and wall eye 5



### depe nd on climate; and all are threatened as the 6



### climate is changing. Minnesota is in a region 7



### that has witnessed many examples of the extreme 8



### water conditions driven by rapidly increasing 9



### concentrations of greenhouse gases in our 10



### atmosphere. 11



### Just one exam ple but a very important 12



### one, heavy downpours, the very heavy rainfall 13



### events that are very expensive for communities 14



### and human life between 1958 and 2007 have 15



### increased by 31 percent in our region, the 16



### highest in the country. 17



### Minnesota's state climatol ogist has 18



### documented in one small area in southern 19



### Minnesota not one, not two, but three 1,000

- year 20



### rainfall events in the last 10 years, some of 21



### them 17 inches of rain costing human lives. 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### Our quality of life also depends on air 1



### quality. In Minnesota, a s in other places, we 2



### feel the health impacts of our outdated 3



### dependence on dirty coal plants, but we don't pay 4



### those health costs on our energy bills. But we 5



### do see the costs of increasingly expensive coal 6



### on our energy bills. The price Minnesota paid 7



### f or coal from other states

-- we don't have any 8



### of our own

-- increased by more than 100 percent 9



### since 2004, so more than doubled. 10



### Minnesota is more tied to coal than the 11



### country as a whole, with 58 percent of our 12



### electricity generated from burning coal. In some 13



### parts of Minnesota utilities generate as much as 14



### 95 percent of our electricity from burning coal. 15



### We know we need to make a transition to clean 16



### energy. And Minnesota has established state 17



### policies that help put us on a clean

- energy path. 18



### Our renew able energy standard requiring 25 19



### percent of our electricity to come from renewable 20



### energy by the year 2025, for example, is working 21



### well. Today Minnesota is the number 4 state in 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### per capita wind generation. We get 13 percent of 1



### our power from the wind a lone. And every utility 2



### in Minnesota is meeting the state's renewable 3



### energy standard. So we know that way forward 4



### works. 5



### Minnesota's legislature in 2007 passed 6



### strong bipartisan legislation that included 7



### economy

- wide science

- based goals to reduce 8



### green house emissions from 2005 levels by at least 9



### 30 percent by 2025 and at least 80 percent by the 10



### year 2050. So Minnesota is beginning to see the 11



### economic clean air, water, and health benefits of 12



### those market

- based policies. 13



### To give you a sense of our partn ers and 14



### the folks in Minnesota who are already submitting 15



### comments to the Environmental Protection Agency 16



### in support of this rule, let me list some of the 17



### places and numbers of people who are discussing 18



### this standard. The Iron Range Earth Fest on 19



### Mountain Iron, Minnesota, on Minnesota's Iron 20



### Range, 1,200 people came during a snow storm to 21



### talk about carbon and environmental protection. 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### At the state's largest environmental expo 1



### 15,000 people in St. Paul, Minnesota, at the 2



### State Fairgrounds

-- talk about ic ons

-- came to 3



### the Living Green Expo and signed postcards in 4



### support of the carbon standard. 5



### In communities in Minnesota from 6



### Cambridge to Bloomington, Edina to Fridley, Eden 7



### Prairie to Duluth, and across a swath of our 8



### lakes and forest country from Alexa ndria to 9



### Bemidjii, people are weighing in, and you will 10



### see those comments coming into the Environmental 11



### Protection Agency. 12



### Fresh Energy's partners include the 13



### Minnesota Conservation Foundation, the Will 14



### Steger Foundation, Minnesota Interfaith Power and 15



### L ight, and Minnesota 350. 16



### Take a look around this room and around 17



### your own communities when you go home this 18



### evening. We are the healthiest, wealthiest, best 19



### educated generation in human history. We need to 20



### great things, and this is one of them. Fresh 21



### E nergy urges the Environmental Protection Agency 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### to move forward and finalize this significant 1



### first step this year in reducing greenhouse gas 2



### emissions from new power plants and to move 3



### forward to set standards for emissions from 4



### existing power plants. 5



### Th ank you. 6



### MS. NOONAN: I have one clarifying 7



### question. You had mentioned in your testimony 8



### the June 25th date, and that was the date for 9



### public comments to be submitted. Right? 10



### MS. HAMILTON: Correct. 11



### MS. NOONAN: Okay. Great. Thank you. 12



### MS. HAMILTON : Thank you. 13



### MS. NOONAN; Pamela Hardwicke, please, 14



### and Dr. Susan Buchanan, please. 15



### MS. HARDWICKE: On behalf of the Clean 16



### Air Task Force I would like to offer comments on 17



### U.S. EPA's proposed 111(b) rule that will 18



### establish CO 2 

### emission limits on new fo ssil power 19



### plants. 20



### MS. NOONAN: I'm sorry to interrupt. Can 21



### you say your name and spell it into the 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### microphone? 1



### MS. HARDWICKE: Oh, yes. Pamela 2



### Hardwicke, P

- A

- M

- E

- L

- A, H

- A

- R

- D

- W

- I

- C

- K

- E. 3



### MS. NOONAN: Thank you. 4



### MS. HARDWICKE: You're welcome. 5



### On beh alf of the Clean Air Task Force I 6



### would like to offer comments on U.S. EPA's 7



### proposed 111(b) rule that will establish CO 2 8



### emission limits on new fossil power plants. The 9



### Clean Air Task Force is an international, non

10



### profit environmental organization headq uartered 11



### in Boston, Massachusetts, that operates 12



### throughout the United States and China. 13



### CATF focuses on the key atmospheric air 14



### pollution issues of the 21st century. Greenhouse 15



### gas emissions that drive climate change and 16



### particulate matter link to prema ture death and 17



### disease. Our staff works extensively with 18



### companies in both the U.S. and China that develop 19



### advanced low

- carbon technologies, including 20



### carbon capture and storage. 21



### Carbon capture and storage is an 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### available technology that U.S. EPA can and should 1



### rely upon in establishing CO 2 

### emission limits for 2



### new fossil fuel electrical generating units. In 3



### Kemper County, Mississippi, Plant Radcliffe is a 4



### new 582

- megawatt coal power plant that is under 5



### construction. When it opens in 2014, the plant 6



### will capture 65 percent of its CO 2 

### and sequester 7



### it deep underground. The CO 2 

### emissions from this 8



### plant are estimated at 550 pounds per megawatt 9



### hour gross. 10



### In Odessa, Texas, the Texas Clean Energy 11



### Project is expected to break ground later this 12



### year. The 400

- megawatt project will turn coal 13



### into base load power, fertilizer, and produce CO 2 14



### that will be sequestered deep underground. 15



### TCEP will capture over 90 percent of the 16



### CO 2 

### it would otherwise emit. The emission for 17



### this plant when it goes into operation in 2015 18



### will be 228 pound per megawatt hour gross. 19



### Other projects th at CCS are advancing as 20



### well . EPA is not limited to looking at EGU 21



### applications. Earlier this month the Indiana 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### Department of Environmental Management filed an 1



### air permit with U.S. EPA Region 5 for the Indiana 2



### Gasification, LLC, project in Rockport. While 3



### this project is not intended to produce 4



### significant electricity generation, it will turn 5



### coal into natural gas, and the permit requires 6



### CCS. The plant will capture at least 80 percen t 7



### of the CO 2 

### that would otherwise be emitted. The 8



### liquefied CO 2 

### from the plant will be sequestered 9



### deep underground and thereby permanently isolated 10



### from the atmosphere. 11



### While these projects are new, it's 12



### important to emphasize that the components of CCS 13



### have been demonstrated and used successfully both 14



### in this country and abroad for many, many years. 15



### In Texas alone over one billion tons of carbon 16



### dioxide already has been sequestered underground. 17



### EOR is an important technology because 18



### revenue from sale o f CO 2 

### helps pay for CCS costs. 19



### The capacity of EOR to handle CO 2 

### emissions is 20



### large in the United States. A new DOE study 21



### notes that 67 billion barrels of oil are 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### economically recoverable at an oil price of $85 1



### per barrel. This would require the purchase of 2



### 20 billion metric tons of CO 2 

### at a projected price 3



### of $40 per ton. This is equivalent to 30 years 4



### of CO 2 

### emissions from 93 gigawatts of coal plants. 5



### In evaluating BSER EPA is not limited 6



### only to the domestic applications. In Norway the 7



### Slightner [ph onetic] CO 2 

### Injection Operation in 8



### the North Sea has isolated 8 to 9 million tons of 9



### CO 2 

### in a saline formation since 1996 without 10



### evidence of leakage. 11



### Moreover, the U.S. already has over 4,000 12



### miles of CO 2 

### pipelines in operation. CO 2 13



### pipelines carry CO 2 

### from natural reservoirs as 14



### well as industrial sources to EOR sites. The 15



### expansion of this network to meet future CO 2 16



### transportation needs presents no new technical or 17



### regulatory uncertainties. 18



### In addition to the plants described 19



### above, carbon capture tec hnology is operating in 20



### a variety of settings and fuels in the United 21



### States and across the world. For example, in the 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### U.S. Plant Marion in Mobile, Alabama, is 1



### capturing CO 2 

### and using post

- combustion capture 2



### technology. And the Dakota Gasification Plant in 3



### North Dakota it has been using pre

- combustion 4



### capture technology to capture CO 2 

### and send it via 5



### pipelines to oil fields in Canada where it is 6



### sequestered via enhanced oil recovery option. 7



### In China the Shidonkou post

- combustion 8



### CCS facility hen removing over 120,000 tons of CO 2 9



### from a coal

- fired power plant outside Shanghai 10



### since 2010. 11



### I appreciate this opportunity to comment 12



### at this hearing. CATF intends to file more 13



### detailed materials into the record as part of our 14



### written comments by June 24th, 2012

. 15



### MS. NOONAN: Thank you so much. 16



### Start when you can. 17



### MS. BUCHANAN: My name is Susan Buchanan, 18



### B

- U

- C

- H

- A

- N

- A

- N. Thank you for the opportunity 19



### to express my personal views about the EPA's 20



### carbon pollution standard for new power plants. 21



### I am here today representing Physicians 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### for Social Responsibility and the Union of 1



### Concerned Scientists, groups whose missions 2



### include protecting the public from environmental 3



### health threats. 4



### I am a family physician with specialty 5



### training in Occupational and Environm ental 6



### Medicine. In my role as a primary care provider 7



### I have diagnosed hundreds of patients with 8



### diseases that can be linked directly to air 9



### pollution and poor air quality in our city here 10



### in Chicago. 11



### As an environmental medicine specialist, 12



### I follow the scientific literature on the health 13



### effects of climate change, and I recognize that 14



### research in the past decade has clearly shown 15



### that air quality affects human health to a much 16



### greater degree than we previously thought. 17



### Power plants are the largest sour ce of 18



### carbon pollution in the U.S., which includes 19



### carbon dioxide, a greenhouse gas. Scientists now 20



### overwhelmingly agree that the accumulation of 21



### greenhouse gases is causing climate change. 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### Health effects that can be linked to 1



### climate change include ast hma, coronary heart 2



### disease, heat stroke, and deaths from heat waves, 3



### insect

- borne infectious diseases, injuries and 4



### deaths from floods, and food shortages caused by 5



### drought. The health effects of climate change 6



### will likely be the biggest public health 7



### ch allenge of the 21st century. 8



### I would like to review three potential 9



### health effects from climate change. First, 10



### asthma: Air pollution triggers wheezing, 11



### shortness of breath, and coughing, and is known 12



### to cause asthma attacks. 13



### In Cook County we are alrea dy suffering 14



### from an epidemic of asthma. Over 300,000 adults 15



### and 100,000 children have been diagnosed with 16



### asthma giving a prevalence of 13 percent. Some 17



### neighborhoods have 44 percent. That means that 18



### in some areas of Chicago 44 out of every 100 19



### residen ts are suffering from this chronic, 20



### potentially deadly disease which has been 21



### directly linked to air pollution. 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### Asthma exacerbations or flare

- ups are one 1



### of the most common reasons for visiting primary 2



### care physicians and emergency rooms. Asthma 3



### fataliti es are not uncommon and are likely to 4



### increase as our air quality worsens with climate 5



### change. 6



### Onto deaths due to heat waves: The U.S. 7



### Centers for Disease Control reports that the heat 8



### wave in Europe in 2003 caused in excess of 35,000 9



### deaths. Climate ch ange models predict that heat 10



### waves already on the rise will become more 11



### frequent. 12



### Cancer: It is estimated that 13



### environmental factors account for approximately 14



### 30 percent of cancers. According to the Centers 15



### for Disease Control, quote, one possible dire ct 16



### impact of climate change on cancer may be through 17



### increase in exposure to toxic chemicals that are 18



### known or suspected to cause cancer following 19



### heavy rainfall and by increased volatilization of 20



### chemicals under conditions of increased 21



### temperature. 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### In the case of heavy rainfall or flooding 1



### there may be an increase in leaching of toxic 2



### chemicals and heavy metals from storage sites and 3



### increased contamination of water with runoff 4



### containing persistent chemicals that are already 5



### in the environment, end quo te. 6



### In summary, carbon emissions contribute 7



### to climate change. Climate change causes adverse 8



### health effects on humans that will likely 9



### increase in the future; therefore, I strongly 10



### support the proposed carbon pollution standard 11



### for new power plants. In addition, I urge the 12



### EPA to move swiftly to enact standards that cover 13



### existing power plants. Is it essential to the 14



### health of our citizens that the U.S. EPA take 15



### measures immediately to prevent air pollution 16



### and, therefore, reduce the effects of climate 17



### change. 18



### Thank you. 19



### MS. NOONAN: I'd like to call Dr. 20



### Christopher Codispoti and Janet Smith to the 21



### table, please. 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### [Pause.] 1



### MS. NOONAN: And could you

-- I'm sure I 2



### pronounced your name incorrectly. Could you

-- 3



### MR. CODISPOTI: Not a problem . Dr. 4



### Codi spoti. That's C

- O

- D

- I

- S

- P

- O

- T

- I. 5



### MS. NOONAN: Thank you. 6



### MR. CODISPOTI: You're welcome. Thank 7



### you for having me here. 8



### Good morning, my name is Dr. Christopher 9



### Codispoti, and I'm an allergist at Rush 10



### University Medical Center, and I'm here to 11



### support the EPA's proposed limiting carbon 12



### pollution from power plants. 13



### The EPA and I have related goals. We 14



### both want to help people breathe easier. Every 15



### day I treat patients whose lungs are compromised 16



### by asthma. I could tell you about their 17



### treatment, the risks they face, and how the air 18



### quality impacts their daily life. Or you’re your 19



### indulgence I could show you what's it like to be 20



### one of my patients. 21



### So, imagine that come into my office, and 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### for the past few months you've been short of 1



### breath. Things that were easy for you to do

-- 2



### go for a job, walk up a flight of stairs

-- are 3



### now difficult. After a series of tests I tell 4



### you

-- I have to tell you you have asthma and for 5



### a variety of reasons your airways are inflamed. 6



### For better or worse, you're no t alone. 7



### In 2009 it was estimated that 24.6 million 8



### Americans currently had asthma. Fortunately, 9



### though, there are some lifestyle choices that we 10



### can do to mitigate their asthma symptoms. For 11



### instance, tobacco smoke should be avoided. We 12



### also

-- where you work, dust, fumes, and 13



### pollution should also be avoided. If you work 14



### outside, air pollution could become your worst 15



### enemy. 16



### You're not one of my patients, but you're 17



### incredibly important to them. Unlike my 18



### patients, you can do more than avoid air 19



### pol lutants. You can take steps to reduce their 20



### directions. You can set standards and limits to 21



### omit power plant carbon pollution. As someone 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### devoted to improving respiratory health, I'm here 1



### to commend your efforts to reduce carbon 2



### pollution. 3



### The rule tha t the EPA has proposed does 4



### nothing to address carbon pollution from existing 5



### power plants, only new ones. There are almost 6



### 6,000 power plants in existence today with no 7



### sign that they will comply with the standard for 8



### new power plants. For these standar ds to have 9



### the greatest effect the EPA must develop a 10



### standard for all power plants, not only the ones 11



### built in the future. 12



### So, there are 3 million

-- there are 13



### millions of patients depending on you, and so am 14



### I. And I urge you to finalize this rule and 15



### develop standards for existing power plant carbon 16



### pollution. 17



### Thank you. 18



### MS. SMITH: My name is Janet Smith, J

- A

19



### N

- E

- T, S

- M

- I

- T

- H. 20



### Thank you so much for having this hearing 21



### and giving us opportunity to speak. 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### I am a volunteer Sierra Club leader of 1



### the Cool City Coalition in Carol Stream, 2



### Illinois, where we are working on local solutions 3



### to global warming one city at a time. Since 2009 4



### our coalition has been working together with our 5



### village board, park district, public libraries, 6



### schools, businesses, a nd residents to reduce the 7



### carbon footprint of our community. It is 8



### important that everyone do all that we know how 9



### to do to protect the planet, and above all, to 10



### stabilize climate change or changing climate. 11



### We know from such reputable scientists as 12



### J ames Hansen from NASA that the climate 13



### disruption is already being felt in the 14



### increasing severity and frequency of the storms 15



### which even Carol Stream has been suffering. The 16



### amount of carbon dioxide in the atmosphere and 17



### oceans has increased from around 280 parts per 18



### million in the late 1800's to around 390 parts 19



### per million, and the oceans are becoming so much 20



### more acidic from the increased carbon dioxide 21



### that it has been absorbed into the sea water so 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### as to threaten sea corals and shell

- bearing sea 1



### life

. 2



### This March when we had eight days in a 3



### row above 80 degrees, people were enjoying 4



### themselves, but to me, it had an eerie feeling. 5



### We broke, as I read, over 4,000 temperature 6



### records across the United States in that one 7



### month. 8



### Civilization depends on a stabilized 9



### climate. Even some of our highest military 10



### leaders have named the changing climate as a 11



### national security threat. Crops have failed from 12



### the extreme and long droughts in Texas and across 13



### the southern half of the United States. The 14



### United Sta tes Department of Agriculture has 15



### changed the climate zones to farther north

-- to 16



### be revised farther north. 17



### It's strange to me that the USDA cannot 18



### say that this is climate change because, as they 19



### say, before they can say it is really climate 20



### change, it has to be like that for about 50 21



### years; but we can't wait 50 years because the 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### climate change is rolling on faster and faster, 1



### and we are seeing major changes in the reduction 2



### of the glaciers and of the ice caps. And the 3



### glaciers supply water to many majo r rivers. 4



### The work we have been attempting to do in 5



### our local Cool City

-- Cool Cities across the 6



### nation is important, but it is not enough. We 7



### need a national effort acknowledging that the 8



### climate is changing unnaturally from increased 9



### human

- caused carb on dioxide pollution and other 10



### heat

- trapping emissions as well in our atmosphere 11



### and seas. 12



### It is important now to work together at 13



### every level to solve global warming one city at a 14



### time, and one nation at a time, and globally. We 15



### must be leaders, not fol lowers in this effort. 16



### Please, I urge you and the U.S. EPA to regulate 17



### carbon dioxide emissions from all new fossil fuel 18



### fed power plants. 19



### There are over 40 people that I have 20



### spoken with in the last five days who couldn't 21



### come today, themselves, but t hey have sent these 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### postcards that I have with me to present to you. 1



### They support the Environmental Protection Agency 2



### and its proposed new source performance 3



### standards. There would be many more if I had 4



### started earlier to collect these postcards. 5



### But sig nificantly, some of the first to 6



### sign were my mayor, Frank Saverino, Sr., and five 7



### of the six trustees of the Carol Stream Village 8



### Board. 9



### Thank you, Mrs. Jackson, and EPA for what 10



### you are trying to do, and here is our 11



### wholehearted support. And I have

- - 12



### MS. NOONAN: Thank you. 13



### MS. SMITH:

-- the postcards and a copy 14



### of what I tried to read. 15



### MS. NOONAN: Okay. Great. Thank you 16



### both very much. 17



### Michael Olinger and Daniel Lee, please? 18



### MR. LEE: Daniel Lee. 19



### MS. NOONAN: You're Daniel Lee. Okay. 20



### Dr. Joseph Leija, please? I apologize 21



### for butchering your name twice. 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### MR. LEE: First, good morning to all. My 1



### name is Daniel Lee, and I am an at

- large board 2



### member of Physicians for Social Responsibility 3



### and work in the field of public health. 4



### MS. NOONAN : And you spell Lee, L

- E

- E? 5



### MR. LEE: L, double E, yes. 6



### I'd like to preface my remarks by 7



### reviewing just some basic givens. The earth is 8



### undeniably in a warming phase with a worldwide 9



### average temperature currently 1.4 degrees 10



### Fahrenheit higher than it was a century ago. The 11



### rate of warming is accelerating, and as a result, 12



### most of this increase has occurred within the 13



### past few decades with 11 of the past 12 years 14



### among the dozen warmest on record since 1850. 15



### The primary cause of this global warming 16



### tr end is the increasing level of carbon dioxide 17



### in the atmosphere, which in turn is the result of 18



### human activities creating it at a much faster 19



### rate than plants and oceans can absorb it. In 20



### other words, we have knocked the key global 21



### equilibrium out of bala nce and have done so to 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### the extent that if carbon emissions were reduced 1



### to pre

- industrial levels today, the warming would 2



### not immediately stop let alone begin to reverse 3



### itself. 4



### Among the most devastating consequences 5



### of global warming is climate change. The term 6



### which includes the increasing incidence of ever 7



### more powerful hurricanes, heat waves, wild fires, 8



### and other natural disasters. In addition to 9



### these relatively transient short

- lived types of 10



### past (unintelligible) severe and long

- lasting 11



### droughts are transforming an increasingly large 12



### portion of the earth's surface from air 13



### ( unintelligible ) land to deserts resulting in 14



### food insecurity in many parts of the world and 15



### higher food prices everywhere. 16



### There is even evidence suggesting that 17



### global warni ng may paradoxically trigger a mini 18



### ice age in western Europe due to permanent 19



### alterations in the oceans' circulation patterns. 20



### A report on the future health costs 21



### associated with these climate change related 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### occurrences that was published in the Journal of 1



### Health Affairs late last year focused on several 2



### public health concerns. Among those most 3



### pertinent in this part of the country are more 4



### ozone pollution episodes leading to an increase 5



### in emergency departments' visits, 6



### hospitalizations, or premature de aths as a result 7



### of reduced lung function and airway inflammation. 8



### Longer and more intense and more frequent heat 9



### waves which increase stress on the heart, lungs, 10



### kidneys, and other organ systems, leading to, 11



### once again, emergency department visits, 12



### hospit alizations, and premature deaths. 13



### The emergence of infectious diseases 14



### previously not found in the area. For example, 15



### it is thought by some that the appearance of West 16



### Nile Virus in the United States is linked to 17



### changing climatic conditions. 18



### Fortunatel y, thanks to the work of 19



### dedicated scientists, public health, and 20



### healthcare practitioners, environmentalists, 21



### activists, elected and appointed officials , and 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### the membership of entities such as the United 1



### Nations Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change 2



### t he information that I've just relayed is widely 3



### known and, to a large extent anyway, accepted as 4



### accurate. 5



### What I think is a very positive 6



### consequence of the dissemination, understanding, 7



### and general acceptance of this information, 8



### gloomy as it is, is tha t we are seeing large 9



### numbers of people taking at least some measure of 10



### personal responsibility for global warming and 11



### changing behavior accordingly. 12



### I'm talking about reducing one's carbon 13



### footprint by doing everything from converting to 14



### more efficient l ighting, appliances, and cars to 15



### designing and constructing green buildings, to 16



### using bicycles and public transport to commute. 17



### Although I don't want to downplay these things 18



### and applaud the genuine sacrifices made by some 19



### in the name of saving the planet, this type of 20



### fragmented piecemeal and inconsistently 21



### implemented approach is not enough, not by a long 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### shot. 1



### What is needed and what has been missing 2



### in our country up until now, I think, is 3



### meaningful, collective action toward achieving 4



### some measure of control over the source of global 5



### warming

-- carbon pollution. 6



### This rule represents the first real 7



### opportunity for us to do that as a society, and I 8



### wholeheartedly support it. Let us not fiddle and 9



### dither, and delay, and remain indecisive any 10



### longer. Pl ease implement and then rigorously 11



### enforce the carbon pollution standard for new 12



### power plants. 13



### Thank you. 14



### MS. NOONAN: Thank you. 15



### DR. LEIJA: My name is Dr. Joseph Leija, 16



### L

- E

- I

- J

- A. I'm an allergist Loyola University 17



### Health System. In my case I'm her e to support 18



### the EPA through their proposed rules limiting 19



### carbon pollution from the power plants. 20



### For years I've been involved in allergy, 21



### and my main focus has been people with asthma. 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### And we are seeing people nowadays creating a big 1



### problem with runny noses, sneezing, coughing, 2



### congestion, and mainly wheezing, difficulty 3



### breathing asthma. 4



### As s omething that in my case as a hobby 5



### I've been do ing pollen count for many years, and 6



### I'm certified by the American Academy of Allergy 7



### and Immunology to do the po llen count for the 8



### past 20 years. Every year I'm seeing completely 9



### changes in the pollution of the area, pollen 10



### increasing tremendously, mold increasing more and 11



### more and creating more problems with asthma, 12



### allergy rhinitis. 13



### This year is an example of what never 14



### have before felt in my life. Seeing that the 15



### weather was nice and warm in March, and we 16



### started putting the machine to do the pollen 17



### count, and we found that it was extremely large 18



### amounts of pollen in the air. It's something 19



### that we never did before because we usually is 20



### done pollen counts in April 15th, April 1st 21



### sometimes. And this time we started earlier. 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### And we find ourselves we got to start with large 1



### amount of pollen. And in the beginning I thought 2



### it was a mistake, but it wasn't a mi stake. It 3



### was something that every day we find more pollen 4



### in the air and create more problem with people 5



### with allergies and asthma. 6



### It's something that nowadays the season 7



### have been prolonging quite a bit with the trees 8



### pollen. We are seeing pollen lik e never before 9



### from ragweed that usually is August, September 10



### the time. And the previous we were seeing 11



### ragweed a little bit earlier (unintelligible) 12



### attention, but nowadays we're seeing quite a bit 13



### of pollen in the air that is going to precipitate 14



### more p eople with allergies and asthma. 15



### I'm having increasing tremendously. We 16



### have been having problems because medications and 17



### the insurance liability is not there. And people 18



### are suffering more from asthma and going to the 19



### emergency room, being seen by the emergency room 20



### doctors, giving medication for relief. And 21



### really, that is not to be the treatment. The 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### treatment is you be seen by the proper physician, 1



### an allergist. I'm not saying they refer to me or 2



### anything like that, but it's something the 3



### patient needs care. And the most important thing 4



### for us is the air. We are having an increase in 5



### the amount of pollen, an increase in the amount 6



### of asthma coming to the patient into the 7



### emergency room. 8



### Nowadays, too, we have a big problem 9



### because the money is n ot there. The insurance is 10



### not there. And for me to keep on fighting those 11



### things that the pollution is a problem, while at 12



### the same time the patient is not coming to be 13



### seen properly. It is something that we have 14



### millions and

-- everybody put numbers a nd 15



### numbers. I don't care about the numbers. All I 16



### care about is patients right now. And the 17



### patient has been seen in the emergency room, or 18



### many times they postpone the treatment. If I 19



### take the treatment, the medication are expensive 20



### for one thing. Th e medication, the inhaler that 21



### they use is 200 bucks a month. They do not 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### afford that. And in the meantime I have to help 1



### them by giving samples. Nowadays we have 2



### nothing. People come

-- the salesmen come to the 3



### office with a (unintelligible) because o f the 4



### economy situation, and we don't have no samples 5



### to give to the patients to help them to control 6



### the asthma. 7



### It's something that we have to look into 8



### this business to

-- and for years I've been 9



### talking about business of the pollution and 10



### improve the environment, but we do nothing about 11



### it. And in my case here I am trying to help as 12



### much as I could, you know, to help the pollution 13



### in the air that we're having by controlling the 14



### plants that produces quite a bit of problem with 15



### also increasing

-- indica te a problem with more 16



### pollutants in the air. 17



### It's something that's very essential for 18



### us to do

-- participating. We talk about it, but 19



### we don't do nothing much. I think it's something 20



### that we have to control the environment, the air 21



### that we breathe by helping ourselves. 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### Like I say, I do the pollen count, and we 1



### do it every year. And this year much earlier. 2



### And the year before it was a little early. We 3



### don't pay attention about it, but this year in 4



### March we already have very high count, you know, 5



### of pollen, trees, and then we're having weeds 6



### that never

-- having season of weed pollen until 7



### May, June, July, but now we're having quite a bit 8



### of pollen, quite high. And it was on television. 9



### It goes to different areas, and newspaper, and 10



### everything else, but it's something that we have 11



### to help the people. And we have to change the 12



### environment that we have. 13



### MS. NOONAN: Thank you both very much. 14



### MR. PELLNER: Actually I just had a 15



### couple more questions. You were with Physicians 16



### for? 17



### MR. LEE: Social Res ponsibility. 18



### MS. NOONAN: Thank you. 19



### Okay. I'd like to call Bryan Grochowski 20



### and Robert Collier, please. 21



### MR. COLLIER: My name is Robert Collier, 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### R

- O

- B

- E

- R

- T, C

- O

- L

- L

- I

- E

- R. 1



### Thank you for the opportunity to testify 2



### today. I'm here on behalf of Enviro nmental 3



### Defense Fund, a nonpartisan environmental 4



### organization with more than 750,000 members 5



### nationwide and 37,000 members in Illinois. 6



### The proposed standards are an important 7



### step towards addressing the massive quantities of 8



### climate destabilizing pollut ion emitted from U.S. 9



### power plants, one of the largest sources of 10



### greenhouse gases in the world. By having the 11



### lifetime carbon emissions from new coal

- fired 12



### power plants relative to a traditional plant, 13



### these historic clean air standards will provide 14



### long overdue and urgently needed protections for 15



### our health and climate while strengthening our 16



### made in the USA clean energy economy. 17



### Climate change presents a clear threat to 18



### the U.S. and to the world. The United States 19



### Global Change Research Program starte d in 1989 as 20



### a presidential initiative under George H. W. Bush 21



### has determined that if carbon pollution is not 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### reduced, it is likely that American communities 1



### will experience increasingly severe climate 2



### impacts. 3



### Since the 1980's Midwesterners have been 4



### exp eriencing intense heat waves more frequently 5



### than any other time except the Dust Bowl era. 6



### Data from the insurance industry reveals that in 7



### 2011 Americans saw 12 climate disasters causing 8



### at least a billion dollars of damage each, a 9



### record number of such events. 10



### Although any particular individual 11



### extreme weather event cannot be directly 12



### connected to climate change, changes in frequency 13



### and intensity can be connected. And these are 14



### precisely the type of impacts projected to affect 15



### American communities. 16



### U nless our country takes aggressive 17



### action to reduce greenhouse gas emissions, 18



### climate impacts are projected to worsen. Severe 19



### heat waves such as the unprecedented 1995 event 20



### in Chicago could happen as often as every other 21



### year. Furthermore, warmer temper atures will also 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### lead to rising levels of smog pollution, which is 1



### known to cause heightened risk of respiratory 2



### infections, more asthma attacks, and more 3



### premature deaths. 4



### In the interest of the health and 5



### prosperity of our citizens, ecosystems, and 6



### econ omies we simply cannot afford additional 7



### delay. Each year power plants discharge over 2.3 8



### billion tons of carbon dioxide pollution, an 9



### amount that exceeds total carbon emissions of 10



### industrialized nations such as Russia, Japan, and 11



### Germany. 12



### During the pas t several years states 13



### across the nation have adopted greenhouse gas 14



### emission standards for new fossil

- fuel

- fired 15



### power plants that have laid the groundwork for a 16



### strong national standard. 17



### In 2007 Minnesota enacted the Next 18



### Generation Energy Act which req uires increases in 19



### power sector greenhouse emissions from any new 20



### large coal

- fired power plant built in Minnesota 21



### or the import of electricity from such a facility 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### located out of state to be offset by equipment 1



### emissions reductions. 2



### Here, the City of Chic ago is taking 3



### immediate action to both mitigate additional 4



### impacts and adapt to changes already under way. 5



### With the Climate Action Plan launched in 2008 the 6



### city set on a path to reexamine the existing 7



### fleet of coal

- fired power plants throughout the 8



### state , promote energy efficiency and renewable 9



### sources of energy and adapt to climate changes 10



### already set in motion by reducing ozone

- forming 11



### air pollution, managing the heat island effect, 12



### and preparing the city for more intense heat 13



### waves. 14



### These standards ar e in line with market 15



### forces that are already driving utilities to 16



### develop cleaner technologies. Leaders within the 17



### utility industry recognize the importance and 18



### achievability of EPA's proposed standards. Ralph 19



### Izzo, CEO of Public Service Enterprise Grou p, 20



### issued the following statement immediately after 21



### EPA released its proposal: The Agency's action 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### establishes a logical and modest standard for new 1



### electricity power plants and it provides the 2



### industry with much needed regulatory certainty. 3



### The EPA prov ides a framework the industry to 4



### confront this problem in a cost effective manner. 5



### In addition to the scores of citizens 6



### testifying today, over 1.2 million Americans have 7



### spoken out by submitting written comments in 8



### support of EPA's historic proposed heal th 9



### protections. Groups that represent millions of 10



### Americans from all walks of life have also 11



### released strong, supportive statements. These 12



### groups include Catholics United, Blue Green 13



### Alliance , Presente, the nation's largest online 14



### Latino advocacy group, and the American Public 15



### Health Association as well as many more that are 16



### here today. 17



### And under EPA's standards the nation's 18



### energy needs can be met through a variety and 19



### diverse mix of power sources, including renewable 20



### energy, efficient natural gas power plants, 21



### combined heat and power, and improvements in the 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### efficiency of our energy use. The standards also 1



### provide a pathway for the development of carbon 2



### capture and sequestration for coal plants. 3



### And in conclusion, working together, 4



### America can build t he energy generation 5



### infrastructure that we need to protect our health 6



### and strengthen our economy. 7



### Thank you. 8



### MR. GROCHOWSKI: May I move the

-- 9



### MS. NOONAN: Yes, please. 10



### MR. GROCHOWSKI:

-- mike? Okay. 11



### Good morning. My name is Bryan 12



### Grochowski. Th at's B

- R

- Y

- A

- N. Grochowski, G

- R

13



### O

- W

- S

- K

- I. 14



### And I'm an executive board member of the 15



### Scientists and Engineers SEIU, Local 517M, in 16



### Lansing, Michigan. I work as a hazardous waste 17



### inspector for the Michigan Department of 18



### Environmental Quality, and I've spen t my career 19



### working to reduce pollution and advocate for good 20



### policies, and making our communities health, 21



### safer, and more profitable. 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### In my spare time, among other things, I 1



### started a green team at my church which helps 2



### fellow people of faith be good s tewards of the 3



### earth. 4



### Today I'm here representing myself and 5



### the Blue Green Alliance, a partnership of 12 of 6



### the country's largest unions and environmental 7



### organizations focused on creating good jobs in a 8



### clean environment. We at the Blue Green Allianc e 9



### support the EPA's authority to regulate 10



### greenhouse gases as it's vital for our public 11



### health and ability of Americans to transition to 12



### a clean energy economy. We also believe that 13



### it's imperative for Congress and the 14



### administration to implement the foll owing 15



### complementary policies to ensure we maximize the 16



### job

- creating potential of greenhouse gas 17



### regulations and a thriving U.S. energy economy. 18



### Union workers like myself are often on 19



### the front lines when it comes to pollution and 20



### hazardous chemicals. We are the ones working to 21



### ensure that the surrounding workplaces and 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### communities are kept safe from potential 1



### disasters. But right now there is one potential 2



### disaster that America is coming together around 3



### to confront, and that is climate change. This 4



### prop osed regulation would help us confront this 5



### challenge. The standards will require new plants 6



### to emit fewer greenhouse gases or carbon 7



### pollution into the air when they operate. This 8



### means new plants will be built cleaner and more 9



### energy efficient than cur rent plants. Everyone 10



### can agree that preventing waste is a good policy. 11



### Building new power plants that are 12



### cleaner and more energy efficient will drive 13



### innovation and clean technologies, spur 14



### development and production of clean technologies 15



### in the United States, creating jobs and economic 16



### growth, and reduce greenhouse gas emissions which 17



### will address the worst impact of climate change 18



### and protect the public health of our families and 19



### communities. This will protect the health of our 20



### families and make sure that we have a healthier 21



### environment all while creating jobs and making 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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- 3376 91



### America more competitive in the global economy. 1



### Protections like these are not only 2



### critical to protecting public health and the 3



### environment, but they will drive economic growth 4



### much like clean air protections have driven 5



### economic growth over the past 40 years. 6



### Protecting public health and the 7



### environment requires strong standards to reduce 8



### pollution also while ensuring a cleaner, more 9



### efficient economy. Common sense environmental 10



### p rotections will drive economic growth

-- I'm 11



### sorry. I think I just said that. 12



### In Michigan we're already seeing the 13



### benefits of smart and strong protections for our 14



### air. The remarkable recovery of the U.S. auto 15



### industry is a result of the work between un ions, 16



### business, and government to build more efficient 17



### and desirable cars. And that has worked. 18



### For America to compete and create and 19



### keep jobs in the 21st century, we need the 20



### proposed standard. Countries around the world 21



### are moving to make their econo mies more efficient 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### and capitalize on the benefits of both 1



### economically and environmentally for clean 2



### energy. To compete and win against them we need 3



### this and other measures to spur innovation and 4



### clean energy and efficiency. That's what this 5



### proposed st andard will do. 6



### If we believe in the future with good 7



### jobs, a clean environment, and a safer world, 8



### then we must act. An essential part of our moral 9



### responsibility as a union member is to defend the 10



### long

- term interests of working people. EPA 11



### action like this, coupled with specific jobs 12



### policies, must move forward to make the U.S. 13



### economy more competitive. We believe that that 14



### is a formula that will put millions back to work, 15



### strengthening existing industries, and build the 16



### industries of the future. 17



### In closing, all too often people are 18



### offered a false choice between having jobs and 19



### having a clean environment. And the truth is 20



### that we can choose both. Today is an opportunity 21



### to succeed like we succeeded so many times in the 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### past. We can have jobs and a clean environment, 1



### and we must have both. 2



### Just one of the calculations that I did 3



### on my own when I learned how many greenhouse 4



### gases are emitted by one of our states, Texas, 5



### indicated that over one ton of carbon dioxide is 6



### released from that state for ev ery man, woman, 7



### and child on the planet. That's just one state 8



### in the United States. So this is critical to the 9



### world. 10



### And thank you for the opportunity to 11



### speak. And God bless. 12



### MS. NOONAN: Thank you both. 13



### Okay. I would like to call Theodore 14



### Steck and David Schaefer to the podium

-- or to 15



### the table, please. 16



### MR. STECK: Good morning. 17



### MS. NOONAN: Good morning. 18



### MR. STECK: My name is Theodore Steck, T

19



### H

- E

- O

- D

- O

- R

- E, S

- T

- E

- C

- K. I am an emeritus 20



### professor at the University of Chicago where I 21



### founded the environmental studies program and 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### chaired the program for about 15 years. I am 1



### also an M.D. and a biological scientist in my 2



### career. 3



### My longstanding interest in environmental 4



### policy prompts me to express my strong support 5



### for the proposed new standa rds limiting carbon 6



### dioxide emissions from new power plants, and I 7



### speak as an individual. 8



### To me, the principal issues are the 9



### following: There is overwhelming scientific 10



### evidence that the earth's atmosphere is warming 11



### at an increasing and an alarming ra te. Experts 12



### envision that this global warming will impose 13



### severely negative impacts on human well being. 14



### Human activities and in particular the burning of 15



### fossil fuels with the release of carbon dioxide 16



### are the principal causes for this climate change. 17



### Because carbon dioxide is cleared from 18



### the atmosphere very slowly, global warming and 19



### its impacts will increase for centuries even 20



### after its emission ceases. The nations of the 21



### world have been slow to respond to this 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### increasing hazard. It is, therefore, very 1



### important for this nation to act immediately to 2



### drastically curtail the emission

-- sorry

-- of 3



### greenhouse gases and carbon dioxide in 4



### particular. 5



### Burning coal for electric power 6



### generation is a major source of the rise in 7



### carbon dioxide. In additio n, the emissions from 8



### burning coal can have a highly negative impact on 9



### human health and well being through acid rain, 10



### release of toxic mercury, and other toxic 11



### chemicals into the environment, and the 12



### generation of small particles called PM 2.5s 13



### which are responsible for significant 14



### cardiovascular death and disability. 15



### Fortunately, a variety of alternative 16



### energy sources are available and are becoming 17



### increasingly cost competitive with coal. 18



### Furthermore, it has been shown that carbon 19



### dioxide emissions fro m burning coal can be 20



### captured prior to its release so as not to 21



### pollute the air. The captured carbon dioxide can 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### then be put to commercial use, in particular for 1



### expelling petroleum from the ground. 2



### The new standards proposed by the EPA 3



### will, therefore, have several beneficial effects. 4



### They will prevent high

- polluting coal

- burning 5



### power plants from being built. They will 6



### stimulate the development of new and cost 7



### effective ways to burn coal with low carbon 8



### dioxide emissions, in particular through carbon 9



### capture and sequestration technology. They will 10



### stimulate the development of cost competitive 11



### clean alternative energy sources thereby reducing 12



### the use of coal altogether. They will 13



### demonstrate this country's commitment to global 14



### warming mitigation and t hereby contribute 15



### favorably to our climate negotiations with other 16



### nations. These new standards will help to slow 17



### the rise of greenhouse gas emissions and the rate 18



### of global warming. 19



### Finally, government studies have 20



### repeatedly shown that wise federal reg ulations 21



### such as this save money by protecting the 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### environment and human health rather than hurting 1



### the economy. 2



### Thank you. 3



### MS. NOONAN: Thank you. 4



### MR. SCHAEFER: David Schaefer. My name 5



### is David Schaefer, D

- A

- V

- I

- D, S

- C

- H

- A

- E

- F

- E

- R. 6



### I have come to ur ge the EPA to adopt the 7



### proposed carbon pollution standard limiting 8



### industrial carbon pollution from new power 9



### plants. 10



### Two reasons stand out in mind. I retired 11



### from Chicago Transit Authority after 38 years of 12



### service. For 31 years I was a transportation 13



### manager at Night Bus at a bus garage and a 14



### disciplinarian. When someone would come to sign 15



### out of the sick book to return to work, I saw 16



### steady and then accelerating increase in absences 17



### due to asthma. The problem with absence

-- 18



### increasing absences is that it costs CTA more 19



### because we have to provide extra bus drivers to 20



### be ready to go when somebody doesn't

-- somebody 21



### else doesn't come to work. The costs for our 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### industry gradually increased due to carbon, 1



### mercury, soot, smog, other toxic pollutants th at 2



### cause public health problems. 3



### When I was on vacation last summer, I 4



### drove through southern Minnesota, and we passed 5



### rank upon rank of huge wind generators. They 6



### were magnificent to see, and I was glad to see 7



### that some power generators are reducing the ir 8



### carbon output. That was

-- on previous testimony 9



### said 13 percent. I think that's great. 10



### We saw double

- length flatbed railroad 11



### cars, very long trucks followed by a car with 12



### flashing lights on the top carrying immensely 13



### long wind turbine blades, one pe r truck. And the 14



### blades show that good jobs are available to 15



### benefit American workers as power generating 16



### companies turn to clean technology. 17



### Finally we're seeing, this spring and 18



### this winter, cumulative effects of too much CO 2 

### . 19



### Chicago had the mildest winter that anybody can 20



### remember. I went camping two nights, March the 21



### 13th and 14th, this spring when we had a 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### predicted high of 80 degrees which is unheard of 1



### in March, a low of 58. The 14th we saw

-- went 2



### out to the beach and saw flights and flights o f 3



### northbound migrating S andhill C ranes , three or 4



### four weeks earlier than they ordinarily are 5



### traveling. 6



### A previous testimony said that the 7



### weather was eerie. I think it's been scary. 8



### Flowers are blooming an hour

-- not an 9



### hour, a month earlier. There i s

-- because we 10



### didn't have our customary strong winter, we've 11



### had a great increase in deer ticks in the woods 12



### that mean that we also have the possibility of a 13



### greater spread of Lyme disease. I saw a small 14



### white dog come out of the bushes after three 15



### minu tes, and we counted 12 ticks on the animal 16



### where maybe you would have seen none last year or 17



### one or two. An anecdotal evidence but still 18



### something very serious is going on, and it's 19



### detrimental. 20



### Please implement and then enforce the 21



### proposed carbon pollu tion standard to limit 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### industrial carbon pollution from new power 1



### plants. 2



### Thank you very much. 3



### MS. NOONAN: Thank you both. 4



### We're going to take a five

- minute break, 5



### and then we will return. So I appreciate 6



### everyone's comments so far, and we look forwar d 7



### to more this afternoon

-- the rest of the 8



### morning. Thank you. 9



### [Break from 10 : 07 a .m. to 10 : 16 a .m.] 10



### MS. NOONAN: Again everyone, thank you 11



### for attending this public hearing. My name is 12



### Jenny Noonan, and I'm the Director of the Policy 13



### Analysis and Com munications Staff at EPA's Office 14



### of Air Quality, Planning, and Standards, and I am 15



### chairing today's hearing. 16



### And joining me on the panel this morning 17



### are Christian Fellner, also with EPA's Office of 18



### Air Quality, Planning, and Standards in the 19



### Sectors Pol icy and Programs Division; and Donald 20



### Bruce who is here in EPA's Region 5 Office. 21



### We are here today to listen to your 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### comments on EPA's Proposed Carbon Pollution 1



### Standard for New Power Plants. EPA published the 2



### proposed standards in the Federal Register on 3



### April 13th, 2012. This common sense step under 4



### the Clean Air Act would, for the first time, set 5



### national limits on the amount of carbon pollution 6



### that power plants built in the future can emit. 7



### For future power plants EPA is proposing 8



### to set an output

- based standard of 1,000 pounds 9



### of carbon dioxide , or CO 2, 

### per megawatt hour. The 10



### Agency's proposal does not apply to existing 11



### units or to planned units that already have 12



### received permits and break ground within the next 13



### 12 months. 14



### EPA's proposed stand ard reflects the 15



### ongoing trend in the power sector to build 16



### cleaner plants that take advantage of American

17



### made technologies. The proposal is flexible and 18



### would help minimize carbon pollution through the 19



### deployment of the same types of modern 20



### technologies that power plants are already using 21



### to build the next generation of power plants. 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### EPA's proposal would ensure that this progress 1



### toward a cleaner, safer, and mo re modern power 2



### sector continued

. 3



### Today we will be accepting oral comments 4



### on all aspects of our proposal, and we will 5



### prepare a written transcript of the hearing. The 6



### transcript will be available as part the official 7



### record of this rule. We are also accepting 8



### written comments on the proposed rule until June 9



### 25th, 2012. 10



### At the registration area , which is 11



### located in the hallway outside of this room, 12



### there are handouts with detailed information for 13



### submitting written comments by mail, fax, or 14



### electronically. EPA will consider your comments 15



### as we move forward to complete a final rule. 16



### Now let me describe the procedures for 17



### today's hearing. I will call speakers to the 18



### table in pairs. And I apologize in advance for 19



### mangling last names. When it is your turn to 20



### speak, please state your name

, your affiliation 21



### before you begin your testimony. And i t would 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### also help the court rep orter if you would spell 1



### your name. 2



### In order to be fair to everyone, we will 3



### limit your testimony to five minutes each; and we 4



### ask that you remain at the table until both 5



### speakers in the pair have finished. After you 6



### finish your testimony, members of the panel may 7



### ask you clarifying question s

. 8



### In addition , is you would like to have us 9



### put the full text of your written comments in the 10



### docket, please be sure to give a copy of any 11



### written comments to our staff at the registrat ion 12



### table, or we can take them here. 13



### We have a time

- keeping system consisting 14



### of green, yellow, and r e d lights to help keep 15



### track of your five minutes to speak. When you 16



### begin speaking the green light will come on. The 17



### yellow light will signal that you have one minute 18



### left to speak. When the red light comes on, five 19



### minutes have past and I will ask you to please 20



### complete your testimony. 21



### Today's hearing is scheduled to

-- we 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### started at 8:30 and we will continue until 8:00 1



### tonight , if necessary, dependin g on the number of 2



### speakers. The hearing will recess during the 3



### scheduled lunch break from 12:00 to 1:00 and a 4



### dinner break from 4:30 to 5:30 p.m. We will 5



### reconvene promptly at 1:00 p.m. and 5:30, 6



### respectively. 7



### If you would like to testify but have not 8



### yet registered to do so, please sign up at the 9



### registration desk. For those who have already 10



### registered to speak, we have tried to accommodate 11



### your requests for specific time slots. We ask 12



### your patience as we proceed through the list of 13



### speakers. We may need to make some adjustments 14



### throughout the day as t im e progresses. 15



### If you have any questions through out the 16



### day, please see the staff at the registration 17



### table for assistance. 18



### A nd, a gain, thank you all for 19



### participating today. Let's get started again

. 20



### The next two speakers are Jan Gehrig and 21



### Maureen McCue. Please come to the table. Thank 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### you. 1



### MS. GEHRIG: My name is Jan Gehrig, G

- E

2



### H

- R

- I

- G, and I represent Cool Joliet. My name is 3



### Jan Gehrig. My address is 733 Holland Lane, 4



### Romeoville, Illinois. Do you want me to go 5



### ahead? 6



### MS. NOONAN: Please go ahead. 7



### MS. GEHRIG: I'm President of Cool 8



### Joliet, which is an organization in the Joliet 9



### area concerned about clean air, water, and soil. 10



### As you may know, the Joliet area houses some of 11



### the dirtiest pow er plants in the nation. And 12



### people in our suffer from a high incidence of 13



### asthma, early deaths due to a variety of 14



### respiratory problems. And we have tried to get a 15



### plan together without success, and so we are here 16



### in appreciation for the fact that now t here is a 17



### national standard in view that will be something 18



### that will enhance the lives of current and future 19



### Will County residents. 20



### The EPA is historic for its successful 21



### efforts to safeguard the air that we breathe; and 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### we appreciate that. The battle fo r clean air has 1



### been waged over the years with significant 2



### successes as well as some failures. Emissions of 3



### automobiles, diesel trucks, buses, and big 4



### equipment have improved as a result of EPA 5



### action. Sustainable forms of energy have 6



### emerged, and we als o have a variety of 7



### sustainable forms of energy as a result of EPA 8



### action. 9



### The quality of our air is central to the 10



### quality of our health. You know, we can live 11



### several weeks without food. We can live several 12



### hours without water, but just a few minutes 13



### without air. So air is central to the quality of 14



### our health. 15



### As we look to the future, we realize that 16



### we're standing on a historic point in our 17



### nation's history. And we must claim the EPA's

-- 18



### this as the greatest success because our future 19



### health depe nds on this standard. 20



### I brought a picture of my grandson, 21



### Ryland. He looks healthy. If you were to listen 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### to his breathing, you would hold that in 1



### question. He wheezes. He has labored breathing. 2



### And this was as an infant. And when he sleeps, 3



### you would swear there was an adult in the room he 4



### snores so loudly. 5



### Now that breathing has shown some 6



### improvement, but what does his future health look 7



### like? I have two grandsons that carry nebulizers 8



### in their hip pocket. How much activity they can 9



### endure, where they can be is dependent on that 10



### nebulizer. 11



### And if you have ever looked in the face 12



### of a child who has forgotten his or her 13



### nebulizer, you realize the tragedy of not being 14



### able to get air. There are those who would 15



### characterize these herrings and our other actions 16



### and psychopathic heresy. They want to let the 17



### polluters off the hook, repeal the air quality 18



### standards, suggest that gas will be cheaper and 19



### that there's an economic benefit. The result, of 20



### course, we know is simply more smog, more asthma, 21



### more respiratory illnesses, and more deaths. 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### Children such as my grandchild Ryland deserve a 1



### toxic

- free environment. 2



### This is our moment in history to provide 3



### that kind of future for coming generations. 4



### Carbon pollution standards will provide a future 5



### th at is cleaner and simultaneously provide 6



### innovative solutions to our energy needs. We 7



### must claim the moment and declare the victory. 8



### Thank you for this opportunity. 9



### [Applause.] 10



### MS. NOONAN: While I appreciate the 11



### support that are given to the speakers, just for 12



### the sake of time, we ask that everyone hold your 13



### enthusiasm. 14



### MS. McCUE: Okay. Hi, my name is Maureen 15



### McCue, M

- C, capital C

- U

- E. I am a physician and 16



### a professor of global health at the University of 17



### Iowa. I am also the coordinator for Iowa C hapter 18



### of Physicians for Social Responsibility. 19



### I'm unlikely to say anything which you 20



### haven't already heard or of which you are 21



### unaware . Rather, I see my role here today as 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### speaking in support of your efforts to protect 1



### our health my limiting carbon emi ssions from new 2



### utilities burning any of a variety of carbon

3



### based fossil fuels, primarily coal, but including 4



### natural gas and others. 5



### For any coal or fossil

- fuel burning 6



### utility, new or old, emissions of carbon dioxide, 7



### nitrous oxide, sulfur oxides, part iculate matter, 8



### mercury, other heavy metals, and greenhouse gases 9



### are all released. Each is well known to be 10



### harmful to health either directly or indirectly 11



### through its impacts on the climate and the 12



### environment. 13



### And while the U.S. is no longer the 14



### large st national emitter of carbon

- based 15



### pollution, it does remain number one around the 16



### world as having the largest cumulative 17



### contribution of CO 2 

### to our atmosphere. U.S. 18



### citizens continue to produce the most carbon 19



### pollution on a per capita basis. 20



### Our carbo n footprint is well beyond all 21



### other developed nations and most especially many 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### times more than most of those in the poorer 1



### countries of the world, those that are being hurt 2



### even today by our changing climate. 3



### Carbon pollution drives climate change. 4



### Clim ate change is one of the gravest health 5



### threats facing our nation and the population of 6



### the entire world. Action is urgently needed to 7



### reduce carbon pollution and limit its most severe 8



### health effects. Climate change is here now. 9



### Regardless of the diffic ulties in drawing lines 10



### between particular weather events and climate 11



### change, there is a strong relationship between 12



### the emerging patterns of disasters and global 13



### warming. 14



### And just to acknowledge Mr. Romney, who 15



### questions why we should be constrained in 16



### r esponding to a global phenomenon as if it were 17



### not America warming, I'd like to quickly review 18



### the U.S. experience. 19



### 211 [sic] was a year of extremes. 20



### Thousands of weather reports were broken all 21



### across the U.S. The decade 2000 to 2010 was the 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### warmest on the record. 2000, 2005 were the 1



### hottest years since recordkeeping began in the 2



### 1880's. 3



### We have experienced 35 consecutive years 4



### with global temperatures well over the 20th 5



### century average. With the climate changing, the 6



### costs of health are climbing . Health costs of 7



### just six U.S. climate

- change

- related events 8



### between 2002 and 2009 cost us $14 billion in lost 9



### lives. And this figure doesn't include related 10



### and less intense morbidity costs of several 11



### climate

- related events like vector water borne 12



### dise ases, allergies, mental health, or food 13



### security costs. 14



### We know the following are all expected to 15



### increase in extent, frequency, and intensity. 16



### Things like heat waves which are involved in 17



### increasing ozone air pollution across the nation. 18



### Our existing coal plants are contributing to 19



### that. 20



### Increasing periods of severe drought with 21



### more frequent wild fires. We've just been 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### listening to the wild fire out west. Hurricanes 1



### and other extreme storm events, more torrential 2



### downpours, flooding. We're well

- ac quainted with 3



### that in Iowa. We have water borne and food borne 4



### diseases coming along with that flooding. 5



### Infectious diseases like the West Nile Virus 6



### outbreaks. Increasing levels of pollens and 7



### allergy responses, ecosystem disruptions leading 8



### to food an d water supply insecurity, reduced 9



### mental health and community well being. 10



### These costs go on and on. We have costs 11



### for insurance, for home owners, for businesses, 12



### the cost of preparedness, and so on. So, we have 13



### to look at carbon pollution. We don't ha ve to 14



### continue our excessive carbon pollution. We 15



### don't have to continue to affect our children and 16



### those of the world. We have to draw back. We 17



### have to begin to limit. 18



### When you find yourself in a hole, stop 19



### digging. When a powerful monster comes near

, 20



### don't feed it or provoke it. The time to stop 21



### feeding the climate change monster is now. 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### Limiting and reducing CO 2 

### emissions from new 1



### carbon

- burning utilities is but a small start on 2



### a very long road. We have a lot of work to do. 3



### MS. NOONAN: Thank y ou. 4



### I would like to call John Rachow and 5



### Ellen Re n dulich. And on deck for the next

-- 6



### after these speakers just so we can keep things 7



### moving, John Heinz and Peter Gorr. Could you be 8



### ready for the next panel? 9



### MR. RACHOW: Good morning. I'm Dr. John 10



### Rac how, J

- O

- H

- N, R

- A

- C

- H

- O

- W. I'm a physician 11



### from Iowa, and I'm the 2011 President of the 12



### National Organization of Physicians for Social 13



### Responsibility. We drove over from Iowa today to 14



### speak at this opportunity. And we appreciate the 15



### opportunity. 16



### Our or ganization, Physicians for Social 17



### Responsibility, recognizes greenhouse gas driven 18



### global warming as one of the greatest, if not the 19



### greatest, most immediate threat to human health 20



### on the planet. So we were pretty excited when 21



### the EPA was given authority to regulate carbon 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### emissions, were excited when the rule came out. 1



### Reading the rule, we can see it is a rule, but 2



### there are some disappointing aspects. It is 3



### extraordinarily narrow. It addresses only plants 4



### that may burn fossil fuels that don't exist, t hat 5



### may exist in the future. They may be in 6



### planning. They may be built or may not be built. 7



### In the first quarterly issue of the 8



### Quarterly Coal Report in 1994

-- that's more than 9



### 20 years ago

-- an article stated that the modern 10



### pulverized coal electric generating plant emits 11



### 1,050 tons of carbon dioxide per mega kilowatt of 12



### electricity generated. I was stunned to see the 13



### limit for any future plants to be 1,000 tons of 14



### carbon dioxide per mega kilowatt hour of megawatt 15



### hour of electricity generating for the future. 16



### Hopefully, our technology would have advanced in 17



### the last 20 years, and certainly over the next 30 18



### years it should advance tremendously over that. 19



### So that particular limit is surprisingly weak. 20



### But as I read through the Regulatory 21



### Impact Ass essment that the EPA has published, an 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### executive summary at least, it is fairly clear 1



### and stated over and over that this rule will have 2



### no impact on a variety of things. It will have 3



### no impact on the cost of electricity. It will 4



### have no impact on the eco nomy. It will have no 5



### impact on the way industry designs and builds 6



### plants. It will have no impact on jobs. And, in 7



### fact, it says it's not expected to impact carbon 8



### dioxide emissions at least until after 2020. 9



### In addition there

-- and it doesn't limit 10



### the number of plants that can be built. So, if 11



### theoretically industry can start building 12



### unlimited numbers of coal plants over the next 10 13



### years that meet the standards, but our total 14



### carbon emission would go way up. That's 15



### theoretical. That could happe n. So that is of a 16



### concern. 17



### And also of concern is the 30

- year 18



### averaging rule that's built in that says that 19



### that 1,000 tons standard can be met if it's 20



### averaged over 30 years, as I understand the 21



### interpretation of the rules and my understanding 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### of the i nterpretation which say that

-- the 1



### example that was given, so for 10 years a new 2



### power plant could exceed considerably that 1,000

- 3



### ton limit as long as in the next 20 years it was 4



### enough to get it less, put in new technology 5



### perhaps that would limit the e missions from 6



### thereon. 7



### So, I really appreciate that the rule is 8



### made and EPA has a rope but is not planning to 9



### even make the first coil that would form the 10



### noose to tighten restrictions. The rule will not 11



### be revisited for eight years. The 30

- year rule 12



### pushes things out to 2040, and by then we will be 13



### over the carbon tipping point in the global 14



### warming

-- global warming tipping point. So this 15



### is a formula for business as usual, although it 16



### is a first rule, and I applaud that. 17



### Thank you. 18



### MS. RENDULICH : My name is Ellen 19



### Rendulich, R

- E

- A

- D

- U

- L

- I

- C

- H. I am one of the 20



### founders and directors of a grassroots 21



### organization, Citizens Against Ruining the 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### Environment , CARE. We are located in Will 1



### County, Illinois. We have been attending public 2



### hearings since 1996 pertaining to antiquated 3



### coal

- fired plants in Illinois in hopes of 4



### achieving binding and enforceable permits and the 5



### highest and most modern technology available. 6



### In 1995 while watching the soot and 7



### pollution coming from two polluting coal

- fired 8



### plan ts in Will County, we decided to find out 9



### exactly how that pollution might be affecting our 10



### health. These facilities are currently owned by 11



### Midwest Generation, and they're located in 12



### Romeo ville and Joliet, Illinois. 13



### We found that both facilities were 14



### gra ndfathered from the Clean Air Act. In 1996 we 15



### heard that the antiquated coal

- fired power plant 16



### with minimal to no pollution controls was going 17



### to do an experimental coal tar burn. We 18



### requested a public hearing and we lost. The 19



### experimental coal tar burn failed. 20



### When we asked the EPA, the Illinois EPA, 21



### what to do after we watched the black clouds and 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### inhaled the fumes from the Romeo facility, we 1



### were told by the Illinois EPA to close our 2



### windows and stay inside, period. 3



### Many of our friends are using i nhalers, 4



### including myself. My husband uses two types 5



### daily. My sister

- in

- law who died of lung disease 6



### leaving two small children and one of our members 7



### used an oxygen tank before they passed. 8



### Many of our (unintelligible) driveways in 9



### our neighborhoods a re covered with soot and 10



### respiratory illness. And respiratory illness is 11



### prevalent. Air is life, and we know that our 12



### lives can be shortened due to the toxic 13



### conditions in the air that we are breathing. 14



### For 17 years members of Citizens Against 15



### Ruining the Environment , CARE, has relayed 16



### stories of negative health effects and how our 17



### lives are adversely affected by the soot and 18



### pollution from coal power plants. And we need 19



### your help. 20



### Carbon emissions pollution is not a 21



### statewide issue. It's a nationwi de issue. We 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### are requesting that the U.S. EPA do the right 1



### thing by implementing the most stringent possible 2



### pollution controls. 3



### Thank you. 4



### MS. NOONAN: John Heinz and Peter Gorr, 5



### please. 6



### MR. HEINZ: Did you say John Heinz? 7



### MS. NOONAN: I did. 8



### MR. GO RR: Good morning. My name is 9



### Peter Gorr, G

- O

- R

- R. I live in Palatine, 10



### Illinois. I'm a retired business executive, but 11



### I’m an active member of Sierra Club and the 12



### Illinois Solar Energy Association. 13



### I am testifying today in support of 14



### carbon pollution s tandards for new power plants. 15



### You will hear from many people and even your own 16



### documents highlight the importance of these 17



### standards as relates to environmental and health 18



### effects. These are critically important, but I 19



### wish to focus on this matter from a nother 20



### perspective. 21



### We like to think of our economy as 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### essentially a free and fair market economy. I 1



### say free and fair because a totally unregulated 2



### free market is anything but fair. What makes the 3



### market more fair are rational and reasonable 4



### regulation s. Generally, and unfortunately, 5



### regulations are required to protect the health, 6



### safety, and wealth of the public. In a perfect 7



### world they shouldn't be needed, but it is not a 8



### perfect world with powerful corporations run by 9



### many individuals driven more b y greed and power 10



### than the public interest. 11



### We continue to struggle through economic 12



### events brought on by nothing more than these same 13



### shortcomings in an under regulated financial 14



### industry. The energy industry is also not free 15



### and fair. Fortunately, the industry has evolved 16



### to offer many alternatives for generating energy. 17



### Unfortunately, there's not a level playing field 18



### between these alternatives and fossil fuels. And 19



### this is in direct conflict with free market 20



### principles. 21



### We now have alternatives tha t effectively 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### and efficiently generate energy with no carbon 1



### emissions. I know because I own such a system. 2



### I converted my home to solar generated 3



### electricity and produce over 8 megawatt hours of 4



### electricity per year with not what is being 5



### allowed under these standards, namely over 8,000 6



### pounds of carbon emissions, but rather I produce 7



### zero carbon emissions. Also, I generate energy 8



### at a very competitive rate to what is offered 9



### from the utility. 10



### The point I wish to make is that it is no 11



### longer required t o hand fossil fuel supplied 12



### plants special treatments which improve their 13



### profits and give them an unfair competitive 14



### advantage at the expense of the public's health 15



### and safety. In the case of carbon emissions we 16



### are talking about the health, safety, and wealth 17



### of the public for generations to come. 18



### I am also a grandfather, and I am gravely 19



### concerned about the future of my children and the 20



### grandchildren face. The idea of allowing an 21



### industry to ignore some of their costs of 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### production flies in the face of market 1



### principles. These principles consider waste a 2



### sign of inefficiency, and pollution is certainly 3



### waste. Free markets penalize inefficiency, yet 4



### the energy industry has been rewarded. 5



### Again, the key point is there are clean 6



### and efficient alternat ives that are struggling to 7



### gain a meaningful share because of the advantages 8



### given to their competition fossil fuels. These 9



### alternatives, like wind and solar, do not produce 10



### these negative externalities like pollution. All 11



### their costs are internalized, and as such, must 12



### find their way into the pricing. Fossil fuels 13



### have been allowed to pollute with much of the 14



### costs not reflected in their price but rather in 15



### the public's taxes as we clean up after them, in 16



### our doctor's bills as we try to recover from th e 17



### health effects, and in our insurance premiums as 18



### devastating climate events inflict huge losses. 19



### The Stern Review on the Economics of 20



### Climate Change estimates that already one percent 21



### of global GDP is required each year to deal with 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### the impacts of clima te change. This same report 1



### states, with business as usual we will face an 2



### annual investment exceeding 5 percent of global 3



### GDP. This is unimaginable. 4



### With electricity generation one of the 5



### leading contributors of CO 2 

### , the positive economic 6



### impact of lim iting emissions is huge. As a 7



### professional whose job it was to advance products 8



### and strategies that delivered profits, how much 9



### easier my job would have been if I could have 10



### ignored some of my production costs while my 11



### competitors could not. 12



### The time ha s come to not allow any 13



### business to dump their garbage on the public. We 14



### are not avoiding costs. We are simply delaying 15



### the payment and, worse yet, shifting the burden 16



### to our children and our grandchildren. 17



### If fossil fuels cannot be competitive 18



### without special cost avoidance, I offer that they 19



### do not have a marketable product. 20



### In conclusion, while the environmental 21



### and health benefits of limiting carbon pollution 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### are well known and by themselves reason enough to 1



### establish these standards, the economic b enefits 2



### are equally profound and create a win

- win

- win 3



### scenario for the public. 4



### Thank you. 5



### MS. NOONAN: Thank you. Mr. Heinz? 6



### MR. HEINZ: Yes, my name is John Heinz. 7



### I'm from Joliet, Illinois. And we have a large 8



### facility there that produces electrici ty using 9



### coal. And I have seen the limestone pits that 10



### were former quarries where the coal ash is 11



### stored. I am very concerned that this is a very 12



### concentrated form of pollution that is seeping 13



### into our groundwater and, you know, it will take 14



### decades to r eally come to fruition as to how much 15



### pollution is going to be, you know, there in the 16



### future. But I'm very concerned that the coal as 17



### well as oil is perhaps one of the most polluting 18



### possible forms of energy that is available, and 19



### that there are many oth er technologies available 20



### that could be developed. 21



### I understand that these technologies are 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### not easily monetized by large corporations 1



### because they have to be spread out over large 2



### areas and would tend to be used by more 3



### individuals and small corporations and I think 4



### perhaps this is a resistance to the development 5



### of the alternative ways of making energy. But I 6



### feel that they really need to be developed in 7



### order to prevent further pollution of the 8



### environment, and, you know, harm to the citizens 9



### in gener al. 10



### I feel that the development of 11



### alternative methods of producing electricity 12



### would be of far more benefit to the citizenry in 13



### general. 14



### Thank you. 15



### MS. NOONAN: Thank you. 16



### Next up can we please have Tom Wolf and 17



### Judith Jonker

- Bredeweg? 18



### MR. WOLF: Goo d morning. My name is Tom 19



### Wolf, W

- O

- L

- F like the animal, which people who 20



### know me know that's incorrect, but I'm the 21



### Executive Director of the Energy Council of the 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### Illinois Chamber of Commerce. Just so you guys 1



### know, the Council is made up of companies that 2



### generate, transmit, and transport energy or 3



### supply the energy marketplace. We have voices 4



### from the world of crude oil, coal, wind, solar, 5



### nuclear, waste to energy, natural gas, utility 6



### transmission, and engineering interests on the 7



### Council. It's a lot of fun. 8



### The Council's goal is to make Illinois a 9



### better place for energy of all kinds because it 10



### creates economic opportunities of all kinds. 11



### When it comes to regulatory oversight, businesses 12



### are looking for a few general goals: 13



### predictability, a sw eet spot where interests are 14



### protected and commerce can flourish, benchmarks 15



### that are based by step

- by

- step improvement and 16



### not leaps of faith, and diversity, not relying on 17



### too much of any one form of energy. 18



### We believe the proposed regulations by 19



### the U. S. EPA fall short on some of these goals, 20



### and here is why: The regulation that will allow 21



### t he greenhouse gas emissions from future 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### generation sets a limit which I believe most 1



### natural gas generators can accommodate with 2



### today's technology but that coal ge neration 3



### cannot. It seems a bit strange that this magic 4



### limit saves the planet and just so happens to 5



### allow natural gas generation but not coal 6



### generation. We're for natural gas generation. 7



### Everybody, including the Chamber, is excited 8



### about the new natu ral gas finds across the 9



### country, but it was a few short years ago that we 10



### were talking about importing natural gas. Things 11



### change in ways we cannot predict

-- sometimes for 12



### good and sometimes for bad. 13



### So from our perspective the regulations 14



### are advocati ng for natural gas generation and 15



### creating a regulatory wet blanket on future coal 16



### production, in that sense picking winners and 17



### losers. 18



### We understand there's a provision in the 19



### EPA regulations for coal companies to average the 20



### greenhouse gas emissions ov er 30 years, 21



### theoretically allowing them to build a new plant 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### and retrofit it with sequestration technology 1



### when and if it becomes available and economical. 2



### So there's a claim there's a path forward 3



### for coal in this rule, but we believe the path 4



### runs thro ugh the installation of carbon capture 5



### and storage and technology that is still under 6



### development and too expensive for use today. 7



### Though it is promising, it's too expensive today. 8



### Given that, what company will be able to 9



### get financing for a new plant th at is built on 10



### the hope that that new technology will be 11



### available and affordable at some point in the 12



### future. We don't believe investors will take 13



### that risk. 14



### I want to take a moment to comment on how 15



### much cleaner coal production has gotten in the 16



### past t hree or four decades due to the work of 17



### producers and government together. The Prairie 18



### State Generation Plant that's just about to 19



### become fully operational in southwestern Illinois 20



### produces 50 percent less regulated emissions and 21



### 15 percent less greenhous e gas emissions using 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### best available control technology, a great step 1



### forward. 2



### However, we believe that these proposed 3



### regulations come at a place, the leap coal 4



### producers are asked to make in these regulations 5



### will be a roadblock to new innovation, not an 6



### incentive. The leap being asked for could result 7



### in companies abandoning coal research and will 8



### lead to other forms of energy leaving us more 9



### vulnerable with fewer supply choices. 10



### We agree with the administration 11



### (unintelligible) the importance of inv enting new 12



### alternative energy technologies here in America, 13



### but we believe that these regulations

-- if the 14



### regulations are enacted, the cleaner coal 15



### technologies will be invented somewhere else or 16



### they won't be invented at all because other 17



### countries that rely on coal are making no

-- few, 18



### if any, efforts to limit greenhouse gas 19



### emissions. 20



### We are a leader in cleaner coal 21



### technologies today and could be going forward, 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### but asking for this leap of faith could squash 1



### our ability to lead the world. 2



### Finally, t he Chamber is concerned

-- and 3



### it's harder to address but imperative under the 4



### concept of predictability. Whatever regulations 5



### come out of this proceeding, they should not 6



### serve as a precursor to regulating greenhouse gas 7



### emissions for the existing plants or provide a 8



### legal trap door for controls to comply with other 9



### regulations. 10



### The U.S. EPA has clearly said that they 11



### will not treat modified sources as new and that 12



### they have no plans or timetable for proposing 13



### regulations for existing sources. We ask th at 14



### you stay true to that commitment as there will be 15



### voices pushing you back

-- pus hing you to 16



### back track on that promise. 17



### Since no one can predict the future, we 'd 18



### hope the government would create an environment 19



### where all sources of power have a chance to 20



### become more efficient and cleaner. We believe 21



### coal should be an important part of that future

, 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### and if regulations allow the industry to 1



### continually improve its production methods, it 2



### can provide opportunities for continued 3



### advancements and economic oppor tunity at home and 4



### abroad. 5



### Thank you for the opportunity to say our 6



### peace, and have a good day. 7



### MS. JONKER

- BREDEWEG: I am Judith Jonker

8



### Bredeweg, J

- O

- N

- K

- E

- R, B

- R

- E

- D

- E

- W

- E

- G. I'm from 9



### Grand Rapids, Michigan, and I'm representing West 10



### Michigan Sierra C lub and West Michigan 11



### Environmental Action Council. 12



### In my profession I taught public health 13



### nursing and also environmental sociology through 14



### UM and other places. Environmental sociology is 15



### a relatively new field where the social and 16



### physical side of this have decided to collaborate 17



### over environmental issues and say if you damage 18



### to the environment, it will have its 19



### consequences. 20



### As a teacher of nursing, obviously I'm 21



### very concerned about all the health issues which 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### other people have described in better d etail than 1



### I will be going into. And those have been around 2



### for a long time, and so has coal burning been 3



### around for a long time. And I'm glad we're 4



### seeing a direct connection. 5



### I'm also concerned about the burning of 6



### coal for the generation of electrici ty and the 7



### effect that that has had on global warming and 8



### climate change, which again, others are going 9



### into much better detail than I am able to go into 10



### right now. 11



### I'm also concerned about the devastation 12



### caused by coal mining. What they're doing, 13



### blow ing off the tops of mountains and sending 14



### polluted sediments into the water and destroying 15



### communities. And, in fact, haven't we done this 16



### long enough? 17



### I really appreciate how our alternative 18



### options have become better and better, and that 19



### we really need to go in that direction. And we 20



### need some cities for those things. 21



### I appreciate to hear what the industry is 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### doing to try to improve what it is doing. But I 1



### guess I think most importantly we, as 2



### individuals, need to use less electricity. And 3



### it's so o bvious and so easy, and, you know, just 4



### make a change in our lifestyle. 5



### I wasn't planning to speak, but I 6



### appreciate the opportunity. 7



### Oh, and I have my two T

- shirts. Here's 8



### the one everybody else is wearing because we care 9



### about clean air. This is one from a previous 10



### conference and that's focusing on clean 11



### alternative energy. And they don't fit anymore. 12



### MS. NOONAN: Thank you both very much. 13



### I just have two reminders. There are 14



### seats throughout if people in the back would like 15



### to move forward and gr ab a chair, we'd be happy 16



### to have you join us with a seat. 17



### And also, if you have a cell phone or 18



### other electronic device, please turn it off. 19



### Thank you. 20



### Okay. Next, Peggy Salazar and Mary 21



### Burnitz. 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### MS. SALAZAR: My name is Peggy Salazar. 1



### I am a lifelo ng resident of the southeast side of 2



### Chicago and am also here to represent the 3



### Southeast Environmental Task Force, a small 4



### grassroots environmental organization on the 5



### southeast side. 6



### MS. NOONAN: Can you spell your last name 7



### for the record? 8



### MS. SALAZAR: Oh, I am sorry. Peggy 9



### Salazar, S

- A

- L

- A

- Z

- A

- R. Okay. 10



### I'm here to let you know, let the EPA 11



### know, that the Task Force supports these new 12



### regulations because we, on the southeast side of 13



### Chicago

-- as anyone is familiar with the area 14



### knows that we have a n historical

-- we have a 15



### history of dirty polluting industry. We had 16



### steel mills. Interestingly enough we had a 17



### number of old coal gasification plants that have 18



### polluted the property and contaminated the 19



### property. We had all industries that supported 20



### t he steel industry like lime kilns and chemical 21



### plants, and I mean, it's just

-- we had all types 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### of toxic industry down there. 1



### We currently continue to be zoned for 2



### heavy industry which has resulted in a 3



### concentration of industries that are still 4



### pollutin g that have a cumulative impact when it 5



### comes to emissions that many times are 6



### overlooked. 7



### So we're hoping that these standards, 8



### these new standards, would take our country in 9



### the direction and begin the small steps of 10



### weaning ourselves off of dirty energ y like coal. 11



### Coal, in our opinion, can never be clean because 12



### as long as it has or generates emissions when 13



### it's processed that are polluting or there are 14



### toxic waste products, we don't see how we can 15



### claim that coal is clean. 16



### In addition, when you transp ort coal, 17



### when you handle coal, when you store coal, there 18



### is fugitive coal dust that is airborne, and it 19



### blankets communities like ours where they store 20



### mountains of coal. No one even considers that in 21



### the equations. 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### And I have a photo here that I'd b e happy 1



### to just kind of briefly show you of siding that's 2



### covered in coal dust. And here is a street 3



### adjacent to KC B S Coal Storage Yard that's just 4



### covered with black mud. So you can see how this 5



### coal dust is just everywhere. So it's no wonder 6



### that comm unities like ours have high rates of 7



### asthma, and no one even considers the coal dust 8



### in the equation. 9



### So we definitely hope that the EPA will 10



### consider these new regulations. We are hopeful 11



### that that means that the air in our community 12



### will be a little cleaner and also that they won't 13



### bring any additional industries that will 14



### continue to pollute on the level that is going on 15



### now. 16



### Thank you. 17



### MS. BURNITZ: Good morning. My name is 18



### Mary Burnitz. I am a founder and director of a 19



### local grassroots group ca lled CARE, Citizens 20



### Against Ruining the Environment. 21



### I live in the shadow of a dirty, 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### polluting coal plant. And as this gal has just 1



### said, the

-- that's never taken in the equation, 2



### the ash that covers our home, that we breathe , to 3



### -- I have five childre n. To hold my youngest 4



### daughter while she struggles to breathe is 5



### heartbreaking. 6



### Clean air is a fundamental right. And I 7



### feel that big polluters, big industry is stealing 8



### that from us

-- not just myself, my neighbors, 9



### everyone who lives in the United St ates, everyone 10



### who lives in the world

-- we're all affected. 11



### Coal

- fired power plants produce 12



### electricity for the nation's power grid, but they 13



### also produce more hazardous air emissions than 14



### any other industrial polluting source. Over 15



### 386,000 tons of 84 s eparate hazardous air 16



### pollutions spew from over 400 plants in 46 17



### states. Air pollution has no boundaries. 18



### The Clean Air Act requires the EPA to set 19



### ambient air quality standards for widespread air 20



### pollutants listed by the EPA often called 21



### criteria pollut ants. 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### I urge you to do the right thing for the 1



### people of Illinois and implement correct carbon 2



### standards on any new facilities. The decisions 3



### that you make have life and death consequences 4



### for the people here and throughout the United 5



### States. Why is it that profit for big money 6



### companies have more of an impact than the lives 7



### of all of us? We're all affected. 8



### Carbon standards hopefully will be 9



### implemented. Unlike the SO 2 

### 's that were set in 10



### 1971, the last review of 1996

-- it's now 2012. 11



### When are the p eople of this country going to be 12



### protected? 13



### Thank you. 14



### MS. NOONAN: Now as I mentioned, if there 15



### is anyone in the back who would like to have a 16



### seat, there are seats that we you folks could 17



### fill in. 18



### And our next two speakers, could we 19



### please have Steve Francis and Tracey McFadden. 20



### And then on deck would be Reuben Keller and Kelly 21



### Pierce. 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### MR. FRANCIS: Thank you for holding this 1



### hearing and I came down on the electric train 2



### from South Bend, saving greenhouse gases along 3



### the way; but I also recognize th at it runs

-- at 4



### least in Indiana

-- on 95 percent coal. So, you 5



### know, it really doesn't save as much as one might 6



### think. And I applaud the EPA for posing this 7



### rule. 8



### I'm a consultant in a company that I run 9



### and President of, a sustainable energy and 10



### eco nomic development in South Bend, Indiana, and 11



### consult on numerous sustainable economic 12



### development projects, am a member of the

-- or 13



### chair of the Green Energy Committee for a Mayoral 14



### Green Ribbon Commission in South Bend, Indiana, 15



### although I'm not speakin g for that group or for 16



### the city; but one thing we ran into and often run 17



### into in projects is that when we try to factor in 18



### greenhouse gases and emissions into projects

-- 19



### economic development projects, city projects

-- 20



### was that we can only go so far on en ergy 21



### efficiency, and we run into a brick wall because 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### we recognize that in Indiana, you know, a large 1



### percentage, a majority of electricity is produced 2



### through coal plants. And I think we recognize 3



### that while we need to do some renewables from the 4



### city's standpoint and from project standpoints, 5



### but then we run into problems in terms of 6



### avoiding costs that the utilities offer us in 7



### terms of renewables, and, therefore, they are not 8



### economic in the State of Indiana under the 9



### regulatory system and the federal regulatory 10



### system. 11



### I support the effort wholeheartedly. I 12



### think we've got to wrestle with this issue in 13



### this nation and around the world. I think that 14



### the planet can't wait, and I applaud the EPA for 15



### doing so. 16



### However, I do think that there are 17



### several problems and concerns that I have with 18



### this rule, and I'll go into more detail in 19



### written comments. I can't go into them here 20



### today, but as an economist I always taught my 21



### students that

-- tried to drill into them there's 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### no such thing as a free lunch. And that's the 1



### basis of most economic theory and policy. 2



### And in this case what you're saying is 3



### that there's no real cost to these regulation in 4



### your proposed rule, which

-- and that

-- it would 5



### happen almost anyway outside of the rule because 6



### of the low price of natural gas. Unfortunately, 7



### I think it

-- to some extent then that kind of 8



### negates the rationale for having a rule because 9



### there is a cost to not reducing greenhouse gases 10



### even beyond what this proposed rule would 11



### achieve. And I'm recognizing it would slow the 12



### rate of growth, but it will not achieve the 13



### necessary reductions in the future that would 14



### mitigate the cost of climate change that we're 15



### going to experience now and are experiencing and 16



### will experience in the future. 17



### So, I think one specif ic item in here in 18



### terms of CCS, I think that Edwardsport Plant in 19



### Indiana is a cautionary tale. We were promised 20



### when that plant was proposed and approved by the 21



### IURC in Indiana, the regulatory commission, that 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### it received public subsidies, that it would have 1



### CCS and carbon capture and storage. It is 2



### nowhere to be seen at this point as the plant 3



### goes on line. The costs are too high according 4



### to the plant manufacturer, the utility. And all 5



### of those public subsidies went for naught or went 6



### into a study t hat determined that it was not 7



### feasible at this point in time. So that plant is 8



### a CCS

- ready plant, but it's going to vent 4 9



### million tons of greenhouse gases to the 10



### atmosphere in Indiana for the foreseeable future 11



### and will not be regulated, of course, unde r this 12



### rule. 13



### So, CCS is a problem because you've got a 14



### rule that says in the future you can offset

-- 15



### you can pollute more now but offset it on down 16



### the line. However, there's no guaranty that that 17



### will be available, that technology will be 18



### available, th at they'll be able to put those 19



### through in terms of regulatory structures within 20



### the states, that they will be approved in terms 21



### of least cost alternatives. 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### And I would suggest that you look 1



### seriously, if it's possible within this 2



### rulemaking, to add ren ewables as a possible 3



### solution to that problem. That is, there is no 4



### advantage to a utility producing or constructing 5



### renewable power plants under this rule that I can 6



### see. And I haven't read it all, but I promise 7



### to. 8



### But there is a penalty if they go o ver 9



### the 1,000 pound per megawatt hour. And, 10



### therefore, it tilts the scale towards coal with 11



### CCS and, of course, natural gas. And it doesn't 12



### give any advantage to non

- carbon polluting 13



### sources or power plants such as renewables that I 14



### can see. Now maybe t hat will come on down the 15



### line at some future point. 16



### I see I'm at the end of my time. I would 17



### say that the political climate in this country is 18



### perhaps not accepting of anything stronger. I 19



### would encourage the EPA to link the benefits of 20



### stronger regula tion with this rule. The 21



### planetary climate cannot wait. 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### Thank you. 1



### MS. NOONAN: And just as a follow

- up, if 2



### you have any legal or engineering analysis that 3



### you want to include in your comments about how to 4



### link renewables within the new source proposal, 5



### that would be excellent. 6



### MR. FRANCIS: I will do so. And mainly 7



### my expertise is economic, but

-- 8



### MS. NOONAN: [Inaudible.] 9



### MR. McFADDEN: Good morning. My name is 10



### Tracey McFadden. I'm a captain for American 11



### Airlines based here in Chicago. 12



### Before I begin, I want to thank you for 13



### the opportunity to speak on this very important 14



### issue, creating limits for carbon pollution in 15



### coal

- fired plants. 16



### I feel this new standard will have a 17



### monumental impact on the health and well being of 18



### every American. And I also want to mention that 19



### I very much appreciate the work that the EPA is 20



### doing on a day

- to

- day basis for the health of all 21



### Americans. I know that's sometimes a tireless 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### and thankless job. Appreciate that. 1



### But by taking this historic step of 2



### creating th e first

- ever limits on carbon 3



### pollution, I think the EPA would be protecting 4



### myself, my family, my grandchildren, and my 5



### grandchildren's children so

-- from harm. 6



### And I think the harm comes in the form 7



### not only in air pollution but, of course, global 8



### warm ing has been mentioned. Our planet, I 9



### believe, is reaching a crisis stage of which 10



### there is no return. And only by taking an 11



### aggressive approach to climate change can we 12



### protect ourselves. And I see limiting carbon 13



### pollution from new power plants is jus t such a 14



### step. This is our putting the man on the moon 15



### moment as I see it. 16



### We can solve pollution as well as climate 17



### problems, but we need the will to do so. And I 18



### think with this

-- that the EPA is showing that 19



### they do have the will. And this is a hug e 20



### challenge for all Americans to take these steps 21



### to ensure this healthy future for our children 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### and I can see that the leadership provided the 1



### EPA will spill over in to other areas. I think 2



### this is just a beginning. 3



### Setting the standard

-- I would also say 4



### setting the example and this action will not only 5



### solve the problem, it's going to motivate others 6



### to action. And these actions include, of course, 7



### reducing consumption and encouraging the use of 8



### reusables such as solar and wind. 9



### And it also shows, I think very 10



### importantly that the EPA is on the side of all 11



### Americans without taking any political position. 12



### It's critical, I think, that the EPA be the 13



### enforcers of the pollution standards, as American 14



### citizens depend on our government

-- on you

-- to 15



### prot ect us from these types of harm. 16



### As an Air Force pilot and in the first 17



### Gulf War, I felt it was my duty to serve the 18



### country, and I took upon that responsibility. 19



### And right now I feel just as today the EPA is 20



### called upon to serve our country in its time of 21



### need. 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### And there are areas in our society I feel 1



### that cannot be self

- policed, and this is one 2



### area. I think the underlying motive for a power 3



### plant is always going to be profit, so it's 4



### understandable that they cannot put the public 5



### health first, tha t it's going to end up being a 6



### distant second. 7



### So, by creating these limits on carbon 8



### pollution, I don't feel this is hampering power 9



### plants. I don't think it's hampering their 10



### ability to carry out their business because this 11



### is just like a business cons traint. In any 12



### business you have the cost of doing business, 13



### whether it be building materials, labor, 14



### recurring costs. And American ingenuity and 15



### know

- how will allow power plants to function just 16



### the way they

-- you know, to work and produce 17



### power. But they're all going to have to play by 18



### a standard set of rules. And that kind of levels 19



### the playing field. 20



### And as a nation I feel we've got to move 21



### away from our dependence on coal. The negative 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### effects on our environment which have been 1



### outlined here man y times and the health of our 2



### citizens due to coal pollution cannot be 3



### overstated. And the proposal creates these 4



### limits on carbon pollution, I believe, is a

-- 5



### quote

-- giant leap for mankind. And I cannot 6



### thank you enough for these new protections being 7



### considered, and I fully support all of your 8



### efforts. Thank you. 9



### MR. NOONAN: Thank you both. 10



### Next up, please, Reuben Keller and Kelly 11



### Pierce. 12



### MR. KELLER: Thank you very much for 13



### coming to Chicago to hear us, and thank you for 14



### having me to speak. 15



### My name is Reuben

-- 16



### MS. NOONAN: Spell your name, too. 17



### MR. KELLER: Oh, Reuben Keller, R

- E

- U

- B

18



### E

- N, Keller, K

- E

- L

- L

- E

- R. 19



### I'm an ecologist and I'm a professor at 20



### Loyola University, Chicago. And most of the work 21



### that I do concerns invasive species, and I d o a 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### lot of work trying to predict which species will 1



### become invasive in the future because we know 2



### from

-- 3



### UNIDENTIFIED SPEAKER: Can't hear. 4



### MR. KELLER: Okay. You got my mike 5



### right. 6



### My name is Reuben

-- 7



### UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: He's not talking 8



### into

-- 9



### MS. NOONAN: Let's take a five

- minute 10



### recess and we'll sort this out. 11



### [Break from 11 : 12 a .m. to 11:2 0 a .m.] 12



### MS. NOONAN: Once again, Mr. Keller. 13



### MR. KELLER: Reuben Keller, R

- E

- U

- B

- E

- N, 14



### Keller, K

- E

- L

- L

- E

- R. 15



### I'm an ecologist and a professor at 16



### Loy ola University here in Chicago. Most of my 17



### research is looking at invasive species, and 18



### especially

-- my specialty is looking at invasive 19



### species in aquatic ecosystems. So I'm interested 20



### in species that exist beyond their native range, 21



### and I'm interested in the types of problems that 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### they have. And it's well known from the wide 1



### body of research that these are invasive species 2



### and now one of the major drivers of biodiversity 3



### loss across the globe; and they also cause 4



### massive impacts to economies and to hu man health. 5



### So anything that further spreads invasive species 6



### is something that we should all be concerned 7



### about. 8



### And over the history of the discipline

-- 9



### and this is reflected in the history of my work, 10



### we've not only thought about invasive species as 11



### t hings that are spread by human action. So in 12



### the Great Lakes, for example, we're still very 13



### concerned about the impact of ships coming in and 14



### bringing in new species in ballast water. 15



### What we're increasingly seeing and what 16



### we're increasingly having to deal with in 17



### invasion biology is the spread of species not by 18



### direct human action but by the indirect human 19



### action of climate change. 20



### As climates are changing, species are 21



### able to expand their range into areas where 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### they've never been before. And when they do 1



### that, they become non

- native and they have the 2



### potential to have very large impacts. 3



### So we're seeing both the spread of 4



### species that we consider to be invasive, so 5



### species that came from outside the United States, 6



### have been here for a long time, b ut have set up 7



### sort of quite well

- defined ranges. We're seeing 8



### them begin to spread as climate is generally 9



### warming, especially across this part of the 10



### world. And we're also seeing native species 11



### which have been kept in their range by climatic 12



### factors be ing able to spread. And both of those 13



### groups of species we're coming to see can have 14



### very large impacts. 15



### So one example that I can give which I'm 16



### quite familiar with is Hydrilla. This is a water 17



### weed. It grows in extremely high densities. 18



### It's a serio us invader. And for a long time we 19



### thought that it was a serious invader in very 20



### warm climates. It's been in the southern U.S. 21



### for a long time. Florida spends millions of 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### dollars a year on control. We thought that we'd 1



### never s ee it in the Great Lakes r egion, but then 2



### a couple of years ago it turned up in Indiana. 3



### And the Indiana Department of Natural Resources 4



### and their associated programs and spent well over 5



### a million dollars over the last several years 6



### trying to eradicate one population of Hydrilla i n 7



### one lake. And we're actually seeing it turn up 8



### in other lakes around Indiana as well. So this 9



### is an example of a species that we thought we 10



### knew everything about its biology, and we thought 11



### we know about how far north it could go; but with 12



### these changi ng climates we're discovering that it 13



### can go further north. 14



### Another example which is building and 15



### which I think we'll hear a lot more about in 16



### future is the degradation of lake trout in Lake 17



### Superior by sea lamprey. So the lake trout 18



### population in Lake S uperior is one of the last 19



### great native fisheries in the Great Lakes, and 20



### one of the reasons it's been able to persist in 21



### Lake Superior is because the water is very cold. 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### And that both favors lake trout life cycles and 1



### it also disfavors

-- it's a negative for the sea 2



### lamprey. The sea lamprey is an invasive parasite 3



### of large fish. 4



### So what we're beginning to see now in 5



### Lake Superior and what will accelerate over time 6



### as Lake Superior continues to warm is that lake 7



### trout are doing worse. They are more stre ssed, 8



### and this makes them more susceptible to sea 9



### lamprey degradation. Not only are they more 10



### susceptible to degradation and parasitism by sea 11



### lamprey, but sea lamprey are getting more 12



### numerous and they're getting bigger because the 13



### warmer

-- the warmer w ater favors them. So we're 14



### seeing this real double whammy that is

-- that is 15



### taking a toll on one of these last great native 16



### fisheries in the Great Lakes. 17



### So these are two examples, Hydrilla and 18



### the lake trout and the sea lamprey. They're two 19



### examples f rom the aquatic realm because that's 20



### where I work, but I could give and others could 21



### give many examples of where we're going to see 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### and where we're already seeing increasing 1



### impacts, ecological, economic, human health 2



### impacts of invasive species that are b eing 3



### brought about by these changing climates. 4



### And of course changing climates are 5



### caused in

-- they are caused primarily we know 6



### by anthropogenic releases of greenhouse gases. 7



### So I support the efforts of the EPA to try to 8



### control these releases of gree nhouse gases, and I 9



### support the actions that are being taken. 10



### On a personal note, forgetting that I'm 11



### an ecologist, I have two young children. I love 12



### taking them to places in the wilderness and 13



### taking them hiking in places where I've been 14



### before, showing them these environments that are 15



### very important to me. I would love to be able to 16



### continue to do that 40 and 50 years from now and 17



### that depends very much on countries like the 18



### United States reducing their emissions of new 19



### greenhouse gases so that those e nvironments that 20



### are valuable to me are not changed by changing 21



### climates and by these new species moving through. 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### Thank you very much for your time. 1



### MS. NOONAN: Okay. Mr. Pierce. 2



### MR. PIERCE: Thank you. My name is Kelly 3



### Pierce, and I'm a Chicago resi dent. I live in 4



### the Lakeview neighborhood on the north side of 5



### Chicago. 6



### I come here today because I am fully in 7



### support of the carbon rule as proposed by the 8



### Environmental Protection Agency. I have read 9



### through this rule and believe personally that it 10



### w ill help me very much as well as my community. 11



### In the last few years I have had several 12



### health conditions that have developed, one of 13



### which has been

-- actually, several glandular 14



### issues that cause weak glandular functioning of 15



### my adrenal system and my th yroid. Upon further 16



### examination what has happened most likely upon a 17



### hair tissue mineral analysis that was taken 18



### earlier this year when I eventually saw another 19



### health care practitioner up in Evanston was that 20



### I had excessive levels of mercury in my syste m. 21



### Mercury interferes with the functioning 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### of the thyroid and the endocrine system in 1



### general. The largest sources of mercury in the 2



### Chicago area

-- the largest single sources of 3



### mercury emissions in the Chicago area and of 4



### carbon are the coal

- fired powe r plants such as 5



### the two here in Chicago, fortunately that will be 6



### closing later this year. The State Line Plant in 7



### northwest Indiana and the other coal plants in 8



### the suburbs such as those in Waukegan in Will 9



### County and in Joliet. 10



### These big carbon emitte rs interfere with 11



### the health and as well create gases, some of 12



### which lies carbon dioxide that actually put a lid 13



### or put a cap on the

-- from the gases escaping 14



### into the rest of the atmosphere and creating a 15



### warming effect here in Chicago. 16



### I live in a home built in 1886, 15 years 17



### after the Chicago Fire. And for obvious reasons 18



### it doesn't have air conditioning. It has high 19



### ceilings. And it's the only

-- one of the only 20



### single

- family homes left in the Lakeview 21



### community that's still intact, that hasn't bee n 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### chopped up. 1



### And at this point the summers have 2



### changed since I've lived there in

-- started 3



### living there in 1987. The summers have become 4



### so, so much warmer, near hundred degree 5



### temperatures these days are very regular in the 6



### last five years. The temp eratures are so warm 7



### and so hot it's impossible to use the second 8



### story of our bungalow home

-- it's so hot. It's 9



### so hot that it's not even possible

-- that's 10



### where my computer is, and a computer for me as a 11



### blind person is everything. It allows me to 12



### ac cess the world and to read the newspaper, to 13



### read books. But for good stretches of the summer 14



### I'm not even able to go up there it's so hot 15



### because our summers have changed. They've become 16



### so substantially warmer and at this point it's to 17



### the point of thi nking about moving, selling the 18



### home, letting a developer take it over, tear it 19



### up, build whatever they're going to build, and 20



### then live [sic] into a building with air 21



### conditioning to actually tolerate Chicago 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### summers. That's what's happened. That's what 's 1



### changed. That's why this regulation is needed. 2



### When 90

- degree humid summers are a regularity

, 3



### but are we going to

-- now what will be the next 4



### decade or two? Hundred

- degree humid summers, 5



### hundred and ten degree humid summers. 6



### At some point this re gulation is 7



### absolutely needed to stop this madness, to end 8



### this out of control spiraling warming effect 9



### that's happening, to begin to do something about 10



### the health effects and effects to our community 11



### that's making Chicago where I live, frankly, an 12



### unlivab le place during large stretches of the 13



### year. 14



### That's why I'm here, and that's why I'm 15



### really urging the EPA to adopt the carbon rule as 16



### it was proposed in April and maintain

-- and 17



### adopt that and put it in final form. 18



### Thank you for your time today. 19



### MS. NOONAN: Thank you very much. Thank 20



### you both. 21



### Next up we have Dr. John Bodine and 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### Robert Hudson, please. 1



### MR. BODINE: My name is John Bodine, B

- O

2



### D

- I

- N

- E. I'm a resident of Naperville, Illinois, 3



### and I'm here to support the EPA regulations for 4



### carbon em issions. 5



### I have a background in nuclear 6



### engineering from the U.S. Navy, a Ph.D. in 7



### geophysics, and worked with B P Amoco Corporation 8



### for 18 years as an oil and gas explorationist. I 9



### then made a career shift to join a Chicago

- area 10



### manufacturing company ma naging business systems 11



### as a chief information officer. 12



### This blend of engineering, science , and 13



### business experience has provided me a strong 14



### basis for understanding the tradeoffs and 15



### challenges we face with environmental issues 16



### today. 17



### When I retired fr om my CIO position in 18



### 2008, I committed to educating myself on the 19



### facts concerning climate change so I could be a 20



### resource in my community on the issues. I'm 21



### motivated by wanting to ensure that our world is 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### a decent place to live for our grandchildren an d 1



### future generations. 2



### I'm also associated with the Northern 3



### Illinois Conference of the United Methodist 4



### Church which represents 25,000 members who 5



### believe that being good stewards of the earth is 6



### part of their moral obligation. We want to 7



### prosper but in a healthy world. 8



### Climate and weather are complex 9



### processes, difficult to perceive and understand 10



### on a global scale; but I've come to understand 11



### that the strong impact of human activities on 12



### climate has been clear for at least 20 years. 13



### Scientific evidenc e continues to build to reveal 14



### that unrestrained pollution of air and water are 15



### putting us at a level of climate change risk 16



### never previously experienced by humans. 17



### Evidence of past geologic events of 18



### comparable magnitude and scale have been clearly 19



### assoc iated with mass extinctions of diverse life 20



### forms. We've been on a very bad path, but I now 21



### think we're beginning to turn in the right 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### direction. We're struggling as individuals, as 1



### communities, and as a nation to change our 2



### culture, our habits, our econ omic dependencie s to 3



### avoid the worst effects of heating our planet. 4



### With this sense of the challenge to 5



### transform our approach to how we live in the 6



### world, I applaud the EPA for their work in 7



### bringing forward the proposed carbon pollution 8



### standard for new power plants. I'm not sure if 9



### the degree of constraint is enough. I would 10



### encourage us to go as far as we can with that in 11



### order to turn around these negative e ffects from 12



### carbon pollution. 13



### It's common sense to inhibit further 14



### exposure to air pollutant s from power plants when 15



### the adverse effects of carbon emissions and other 16



### contaminants are so well understood. It is the 17



### role of government to help maintain the balance 18



### between health and prosperity through policy and 19



### incentives. 20



### The proposed standard s are well designed 21



### to avoid negative economic impact while at the 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### same time providing great latitude in the 1



### cogeneration energy companies can take in 2



### producing power. 3



### I also support applying similar standards 4



### to existing power plants, knowing that we mus t do 5



### everything we can to eliminate excessive carbon 6



### pollution. 7



### America has a capacity for great 8



### innovation and transformational change. Our 9



### national culture is one of aggressive ambition 10



### and individualism. And finding common purpose 11



### can often be a chal lenge. When we do find common 12



### purpose, however, we've shown we can change the 13



### world. 14



### Leadership has never been more in need 15



### than now as we face some of the greatest global 16



### challenges for ensuring prosperity and health for 17



### future generations. 18



### Thank you. 19



### MR. HUDSON: My name is Robert Hudson. 20



### I’m an associate professor in the Department of 21



### Natural Resources and Environmental Sciences at 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### the University of Illinois at Champaign

- Urbana. 1



### MS. NOONAN: And spell your name. Spell 2



### your name. 3



### MR. HUDSON: Oh, R

- O

- B

- E

- R

- T, H

- U

- D

- S

- O

4



### N. 5



### As a father, a resident of Illinois, a 6



### U.S. citizen, and an associate professor, I am 7



### grateful for this opportunity to express my 8



### strong support for EPA proposed rule limiting 9



### carbon dioxide emissions from new power plants. 10



### I s pent my career working on pollution 11



### issues related to the generation of power, 12



### especially from coal. Much of this work has been 13



### funded by the electric power industry, and I 14



### applaud them for the good basic science that EPRI 15



### and other organizations have don e on a range of 16



### issues from acid rain to mercury pollution to 17



### climate change. 18



### But sometimes the doctor needs to tell 19



### the patient to take more steps, and this is such 20



### a time. I have a great understanding of the 21



### contribution of human activities that are ra pidly 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### increasing levels of carbon dioxide in the 1



### atmosphere in personal and professional 2



### priorities since the early 1990's. 3



### When I began my study, I felt reassured 4



### by the overwhelming evidence showing that humans 5



### are the sole cause of the current trend in 6



### atmospheric CO 2 

### levels. Why was that reassuring? 7



### I was confident that since our responsibility was 8



### so clear, surely humankind led by the United 9



### States would collect the data and develop the 10



### sophisticated models needed to guide the world to 11



### a soft landing before climate change got out of 12



### hand and our children's future was endangered. 13



### But unfortunately, I no longer feel that 14



### way at all. In fact, I'm worried sick. Yes, 15



### scientists have conducted the essential research 16



### and developed the needed models. And many of the 17



### world's main emitters of CO 2 

### are acting to reduce 18



### their emissions, but here, in the U.S., we find 19



### it difficult to take even modest steps such as 20



### implementing this new rule when the science tells 21



### us that we need to move in leaps and bounds 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### towar d a low carbon economy. 1



### Why do we resist? I'm not a social 2



### scientist, but from what opponents of regulating 3



### CO 2 

### emissions like Senator Inhofe say, it appears 4



### that some people find it difficult to accept 5



### higher costs now in order to avoid seemingly 6



### uncert ain future damages. 7



### Perhaps they are over confident having 8



### learned that we can clean up polluted lakes and 9



### rivers at least to some extent after we see 10



### clearly the consequences of polluting natural 11



### systems. After all, why waste money on 12



### preventative measu res when natural processes 13



### sometimes clean up much of our mess anyway. But 14



### climate change will not be as easy to reverse as 15



### polluted lakes and rivers or any other 16



### environmental problem we're familiar with. 17



### Carbon dioxide pollution has and will 18



### recycle th rough the atmosphere and surface ocean 19



### for a long time. And, in fact, if we don't 20



### dramatically change the course of our current 21



### business as usual emissions trajectory we may at 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### least on the time scale of human generations 1



### permanently change the global cli mate. 2



### Perhaps the other reason that we hesitate 3



### to act is that we're used to thinking of our 4



### nation as exceptional

, on the right side of 5



### history

, and divinely blessed. How could we

-- 6



### how could we be doing any harm when we're acting 7



### within our rights and have God on our side? Most 8



### of us can't even conceive of asking a question 9



### such as what responsibility we, the nation that 10



### has emitted the most CO 2 

### of any nation over the 11



### last two centuries, might have for the plight of 12



### people in parts of the world most a ffected by 13



### climate change. We need to ask ourselves what 14



### will become of our moral authority as the only 15



### global superpower if the most noble exceptional 16



### aspect of our country becomes our refusal to help 17



### stabilize a common global power system. Will we 18



### open the borders to our spacious open lands when 19



### rising sea levels drives millions from their 20



### homes in Bangladesh and elsewhere? 21



### And closer to home, recent science 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### indicates that we can no longer afford to be 1



### sanguine of our own prospects of the changing 2



### cli mate. Do we really want to make the drought 3



### in Texas last year the new normal? Farmers there 4



### suffered billions of dollars in crop losses. 5



### Forecasts of persistent drought across the 6



### American southwest adds many other downsides to a 7



### changing climate also suggest a higher potential 8



### toll. 9



### Ultimately I do believe that American 10



### people will respond, but will we do so in time? 11



### We owe a tremendous thank you to Administrator 12



### Jackson and the EPA for starting us in the right 13



### direction now. 14



### Some that oppose this r ule, like 15



### Congressman Sensenbrenner, argue that CO 2 

### is 16



### natural, therefore, not a pollutant that EPA 17



### should regulate. After all, each of us emits CO 2 18



### with every breath, don't we? Admittedly 19



### politicians cannot all be expected to understand 20



### the difference b etween CO 2 

### emissions from 21



### breathing which closes the rapid atmospheric

-- 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### the atmosphere food and atmosphere loop in the 1



### carbon cycle and for burning fossil fuels which 2



### returns ancient geologically sequestered carbon 3



### into circulation

. 4



### But I hope the debat e in Congress over 5



### this new rule will at least get the politicians 6



### and the citizens of this land to listen to 7



### scientists such as those at EPA long enough to 8



### get their facts straight. People need to 9



### understand that it is possible to have too much 10



### of a good thing, and when that occurs, it is 11



### perfectly appropriate to call it pollution. 12



### While the preceding comments express my 13



### personal perspective, I should add that to the 14



### best of my knowledge, this new rule is consistent 15



### with actions needed to reduce the grow th in 16



### atmospheric CO 2 

### levels advocated by scientists 17



### from virtually every academic discipline involved 18



### in the study of the environment and climate. 19



### It is a modest step, one that requires 20



### new power plants to be as efficient as those 21



### burning natural gas. I t makes Illinois coal less 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### economically viable, but the value of preserving 1



### our climate is well worth the price of reducing 2



### the development of this resource. At the very 3



### least new coal plants should wait until CCS can 4



### be shown viable. 5



### MS. NOONAN: We cou ld take the rest of 6



### your comments

-- 7



### MR. HUDSON: Okay. 8



### MS. NOONAN: Thank you very much. 9



### MR. HUDSON: Thank you. 10



### MS. NOONAN: Next up, could we please 11



### have Bill Moore and Dick Munson? 12



### MR. MOORE: Hi, I'm Bill Moore. I am 13



### from New Berlin, Wisconsin, and the last name is 14



### M

- O

- O

- R

- E. 15



### First, thank you for taking the bull by 16



### the horns and creating the first step to truly 17



### regulate coal plants. While it's too bad that 18



### these steps were not begun 40 years ago after the 19



### Clean Air Act was adopted, still better late than 20



### never. 21



### Second, since the reason we are here is 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### that carbon pollution contributes to global 1



### warming, I strongly suggest that you remember 2



### that 97 percent of climate scientists believe 3



### that global warming is happening, that it is 4



### mostly caused by human

- created pollution and that 5



### it is harmful both to us and to the planet. The 6



### other 3 percent are mostly either employed or 7



### influenced by the pollutant industries. Climate 8



### deniers are just plain wrong. 9



### I am fortunate to live in a clean 10



### conservative suburb without a power plant nearby. 11



### Our Mayor even signed the Seattle sponsored U.S. 12



### Mayors Climate Protection Agreement. 13



### People in my city want the power 14



### generated by those plants, but they don't want to 15



### live near them. A few years ago a peak power 16



### pla nt fueled by natural gas was proposed for my 17



### city of New Berlin. The outcry was more than 18



### loud, raucous enough for the plant to be denied 19



### the required permits. Even though natural gas is 20



### cleaner than coal, suburbanites complained not in 21



### my back yard; put it in someone else's back yard. 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### So, whose back yard? Near those who don't have 1



### political clout? Near homes populated by 2



### minorities? Even if you think the answer is yes 3



### and can live well away from pollution sources, 4



### you really can't escape the pollution

. 5



### I'm a retired airline pilot. When I 6



### started flying in 1967, I noticed the average 7



### town with a haze layer was about 3,000 feet above 8



### the ground. Over the years I recognized that 9



### that haze was mostly particulate pollution that 10



### also contained other harmf ul substances like 11



### carbon dioxide. 12



### But because the Clean Air Act has not 13



### really been well enforced until now, that haze 14



### and pollution layer now tops out at an average of 15



### 10,000 feet. That, to me, is unacceptable and 16



### preventable. 17



### I'm bemused by the T

- s hirts I see that 18



### say America Counts on Coal. That truly is a 19



### fact. It sadly is a fact. We count on it to 20



### make open pit mining to destroy our land, to 21



### remove our mountaintops in West Virginia and 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### Pennsylvania, pollute our waterways as tailings 1



### are dumped in the valleys , eliminate the animal 2



### habitat, pollute our air with extraction and 3



### transportation, pollute our air as it creates 4



### energy for us, and then we count on coal to 5



### pollute afterwards as we try to protect our 6



### citizens from coal ash as we see around the Oak 7



### Creek Power Plant in Wisconsin where We Energies 8



### supplies nearby residents with bottled water 9



### because coal ash pollutes their wells. 10



### But we can count on clean energy. Jobs 11



### can move from coal to clean energy. Counting on 12



### dirty energy is just not in anybody's best 13



### interest. 14



### So, thank you, EPA, Lisa Jackson, and 15



### President Obama for finally doing what is right 16



### and should have been done by many prior 17



### administrations. Enact the thousand pound rule. 18



### Encourage may require clean energy. 19



### MR. MUNSON: G ood morning. My name is 20



### Dick Munson, M

- U

- N

- S

- O

- N. I'm Senior Vice

21



### President of Recycled Energy Development. We're 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### a co

- generation waste energy developer based here 1



### in Chicago. 2



### And my basic message is to commend EPA 3



### for recognizing the economic and envi ronmental 4



### benefits of efficiency. There have been numerous 5



### studies, including your own MACT Sensitivity 6



### Study that looks at the reality that efficiency 7



### reduces waste, reduces pollution, and also saves 8



### money. 9



### And a focus with new rules in the utility 10



### sect or, the power plant sector on efficiency are 11



### desperately needed because this is an industry 12



### that wastes two

- thirds of the fuel input to 13



### produce electricity, and that 33 percent 14



### efficiency has not improved by a single 15



### percentage point since Herbert Hoover w as in the 16



### White House. 17



### I also commend the EPA for changing its 18



### metric for measuring pollution on an output

- based 19



### standard. That approach, as I think you 20



### appreciate, encourages efficiency by rewarding 21



### those generators that produce more megawatt hours 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### and discourages those generators that produce 1



### more pollution. 2



### So, great commendations. I'm going to 3



### also suggest two changes to your rule if I might 4



### and then respond to two of your questions. The 5



### changes would deal with issue of thermal energy 6



### and your, I t hink, too narrow definition of 7



### combined heat and power. 8



### On the issue of thermal energy, my 9



### commendations to you to recognize that indeed 10



### power plants emit two products. One is 11



### electricity and one is heat. And unfortunately, 12



### the utility industry or powe r industry in this 13



### country usually throws the heat away. And that 14



### waste costs money. So, EPA, I think, recognizes 15



### that the generation of heat and power together 16



### accounts for 69 percent of the CO 2 

### emissions in 17



### this country. That's five times more than al l 18



### pollution coming from all the cars on the road. 19



### So this

-- if you want to tackle carbon, you go 20



### after where the carbon is, and two

- thirds of it

- 21



### - more than two

- thirds of it is coming from the 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### generation of electricity and heat. And there 1



### are enormous potentials to reduce waste and 2



### increase efficiency. 3



### I would encourage the EPA, which 4



### implicitly defined gross output to include 5



### thermal energy, to be more explicit about that 6



### and include something to reference it in your 7



### preamble. Moreover, I would encou rage you to not 8



### arbitrarily limit credits for thermal energy to 9



### only 75 percent. If, indeed, you want to 10



### encourage the efficient generation of both heat 11



### and power, why limit things? 12



### My second comment is on the draft rule's 13



### narrow definition of combined h eat and power or 14



### cogeneration. First, I want to commend you for 15



### recognizing its efficient attributes, but I would 16



### encourage you to delete the word steam as a 17



### descriptive term of CHP generating units because 18



### some cogeneration units use things like hot oil 19



### or other media to do cogeneration. And to be 20



### limiting I think just

-- you miss a few 21



### opportunities. 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### Second, I'd encourage EPA to follow the 1



### example of a lot of states and do different 2



### definitions for what is topping cycle or fuel

3



### fired combined heat and power and bottoming cycle 4



### cogeneration or waste heat recovery. They have 5



### different attributes and different benefits, and 6



### I think deserve different definitions in your 7



### rule. 8



### And then, finally, I would encourage you 9



### to be strict on your standard for cogen eration. 10



### Don't let, you know, a lousy cogeneration unit or 11



### inefficient ones get away . So encourage

-- you 12



### know, perhaps use the tax code which says that 13



### cogeneration units need to be at least 60 percent 14



### efficient and at least 20 percent of their units ' 15



### o utput needs to be in the form of their 16



### (unintelligible) applications. 17



### In response to several of your questions, 18



### let me just touch on two. You asked about the 19



### wisdom of adopting net output

- based standards. 20



### Great idea. Using facilities as a result of tha t 21



### approach would have an incentive to minimize 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### their parasitic energy demands coming from 1



### pollution control equipment and, therefore, 2



### increase their overall efficiency, and it seems 3



### like a wise route to go. 4



### Secondly, you asked about the wisdom of 5



### having a 5 percent credit for cogeneration units 6



### that avoid transmission and distribution losses. 7



### I commend you for recognizing what is a vastly 8



### overlooked problem, and that is line losses in 9



### this country. We waste 236 million megawatt 10



### hours of electricity a year through line losses. 11



### That's more than the entire consumption of 12



### California, and it costs this nation $23 billion 13



### annually. 14



### I would argue, however, that EPA's 5 15



### percent credit is far too low. Average line 16



### losses in this country are 7 percent. They reach 17



### 20 percent during peak periods, and there's new 18



### research out of MIT and Carnegie Mellon that 19



### suggest the benefits of well

- placed distributed 20



### generation can be as high as 20 to 40 percent. I 21



### don't know what the right number is, but it ain't 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### five. 1



### So, in conclusion, commendations to you 2



### for recognizing the benefits of efficiency and 3



### cogeneration output

- based standards. And thanks 4



### for your consideration of my comments. 5



### MS. NOONAN: Thank you both. 6



### Next up we have Max Muller and is there 7



### anyone else in th e audience who would like to 8



### testify before lunch? We would be happy to take 9



### -- fit you in now. 10



### [Pause.] 11



### MS. NOONAN: Yes? Please come to the 12



### table. 13



### Mr. Muller? 14



### MR. MULLER: Good afternoon. I want to 15



### thank you for the opportunity to testify today, 16



### and I want to thank EPA for its hard work in 17



### developing the proposed rule. 18



### My name is Max Muller. I'm the program 19



### director at Environment Illinois. We're a 20



### statewide environmental activist organization. 21



### And we have about 12,000 members in the State of 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### I llinois. And on their behalf I want to say that 1



### we strongly support the proposed new pollution 2



### standard for new coal

- fired power plants. It's 3



### going to help protect public health and the 4



### environment in Illinois. 5



### There are numerous studies that show the 6



### i mpact that global warming, which is fueled by 7



### carbon pollution, can have on people's lives, the 8



### economy, public safety, health, and welfare. I 9



### want to focus on three studies that show the 10



### impacts that global warming could have 11



### specifically on the State of Illinois and the 12



### people living here. 13



### We released a report about a month ago on 14



### the standing next to Lake Michigan

-- I'm sorry, 15



### standing on Lake S hore Drive with Senator Dick 16



### Durb in. The report documented that increased 17



### frequency of weather

- related fede rally

- declared 18



### disasters in the United States. It looked at 19



### federally

- declared disasters on a county

- by

20



### county basis and tallied the number of weather

21



### related disasters in Illinois. We found that 24 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### out of 25 people in the State of Illinois live in 1



### a cou nty that's had a weather

- related disaster 2



### since 2006. And it's almost everybody. 3



### In 2011 alone we had a weather

- related 4



### disaster. That means

-- or we had two weather

5



### related disasters that made the cover of 6



### newspapers nationwide. The first was a blizza rd, 7



### the Groundhog 's Day Blizzard

, that shut down Lake 8



### Shore Drive , left people

-- hundreds of motorists 9



### stranded in their cars. It cost billions of 10



### dollars, and it killed 32 people in the region. 11



### That same year, also in 2011, we had 12



### flooding on the Missi ssippi River that was so 13



### severe that it shut down an entire

-- I’m sorry, 14



### it forced the evacuation of an entire Illinois 15



### city called Cairo. Regionally, the flooding cost 16



### $9 billion in economic damage, and seven people 17



### lost their lives from it. So that's just one 18



### year and two very high profile extreme weather 19



### events that have affected Illinois. 20



### The second effect that global warming 21



### could have on Illinois or that we are certain 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### global warming will have on Illinois is the on 1



### our corn industry. Illinois is the second 2



### biggest corn producing state in the country. And 3



### corn likes it cool. There really is no 4



### substitute for farmers for Illinois' stable 5



### climate and our good soil. And global warming is 6



### projected to effect both. 7



### Our study found that due to incre ased 8



### carbon dioxide and increased heat, the Illinois 9



### corn industry

-- those two effects will cost 10



### Illinois farmers in the corn industry $256 11



### million a year by the year 2025. That's just one 12



### crop and two effect from global warming we 13



### considered. There are many more impacts on 14



### farmers from global warming that we expect. 15



### And then the last effect from global 16



### warming that I wanted to talk about is our 17



### health. Specifically, I wanted to talk about 18



### ozone pollution. Scientists know that heat is 19



### one of the main triggers or one of the key 20



### ingredients in the production of ground

- level 21



### ozone. It's a lung

- irritating pollutant, and it 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### is caused by coal

- fired power plants. 1



### A recent study by the Union of Concerned 2



### Scientists predicted that ground

- level ozone will 3



### rise due to the projected increased temperatures 4



### associated with global warming. They found that 5



### we can expect to have 144,000 more asthma attacks 6



### and other occurrences of acute respiratory 7



### problems in Illinois each year due to the 8



### anticipated increase in hea t due to global 9



### warming. 10



### That's really bad news for people 11



### concerned about public health in Illinois, but 12



### for people who have asthma

-- that's 250,000 13



### children in Illinois and 750,000 adults

-- it's 14



### particularly bad news because they can expect to 15



### be impa cted more frequently. 16



### We have known forever

-- well, not 17



### forever, but for a very long time that power 18



### plants are the largest single source of global 19



### warming pollution. And it appalls me that for 20



### year, and years, and years, and decades coal

21



### fired power pl ants have been able to emit a 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### dangerous pollutant without limit and without 1



### penalty. 2



### We believe that the limits for carbon 3



### pollution for new coal

- fired power plants 4



### contained in the rule are very important. We 5



### applaud the rule, and we recognize that we n eed 6



### to go much further than this rule will in the 7



### future to further reduce global warming pollution 8



### if we're going to achieve the levels of global 9



### warming reduction

-- the levels of pollution 10



### reductions that scientists say are necessary to 11



### prevent the wors t impacts of global warming. 12



### And that is all. Thank you very much. 13



### MS. KAP T A IN : Hi. My name is Sandra 14



### Kap t a i n, and I’m very glad to be able to speak 15



### today to you. I am treasurer

-- 16



### MS. NOONAN: I'm sorry. Can you spell 17



### your name? 18



### MS. KAPTAIN: K

- A

- P

- T

- A

- I

- N, Kaptain with 19



### a K. I am treasurer of the Elgin Climate Change 20



### Organization, a member of the Sierra Club, and as 21



### a

-- I was previously for 14 years a chemist and 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### pre

- treatment coordinator at the Sanitary 1



### District of Elgin, which is now called th e Fox 2



### River Water Reclamation District or FRWRD. While 3



### at the SDE or Sanitary District of Elgin, we 4



### cleaned Elgin's wastewater. This includes 5



### solids, organic wastes, and priority polluta nts, 6



### which includes heavy metals, mercury, cadmium, 7



### copper, zinc, an d over a hundred other toxic 8



### and/or carcinogenic pollutants before discharged 9



### to the Fox River. As many of you probably know, 10



### we currently drink Fox River water after further 11



### treatment by the City of Elgin Water Treatment 12



### Plant. 13



### At the Sanitary District alone I was very 14



### pleased we removed

-- and this is true across the 15



### country

-- 95 to 99 percent of these materials 16



### before they are discharged into the river. In 17



### short, with regulation and enforcement, we 18



### cleaned the wastewater because of the U.S. EPA 19



### and I EPA regulations and enforcement. And not 20



### only did we

-- we enforced with the industries 21



### and the IEPA enforced it to us. It works. It 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### works. It is cost effective. 1



### We must do the same thing for carbon 2



### pollution. Air is treatable at the source also. 3



### You can't clean wastewater after the fact, and 4



### the same goes for the air. And it is cost 5



### effective, and it is doable. And I applaud the 6



### EPA for their actions taking

-- starting to take 7



### actions now on coal

- fired power plants. 8



### As with wastewater, industries want 9



### clear, fair regulations across the board. When 10



### dealing with the industries in Elgin, they want 11



### to know what the rules are and they want it 12



### applied fair and across the board. 13



### Good will, good intentions are everyone 14



### will do the right thing is nonsense for industry. 15



### They have to compete. And if they're in 16



### competition, they have to know what the rules are 17



### so they can compete with each other fairly. 18



### I support carbon amelioration. We can do 19



### this now. We have done this before with water. 20



### We can do it wi th the air. It has to be done now 21



### as everybody before me has mentioned. And we can 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### lead

-- we can have the clean

-- we have the 1



### cleanest water in the world I am told. We can 2



### also lead the way with clean air. And I very 3



### much support the EPA and their ef forts. 4



### Thank you. 5



### MS. NOONAN: Thank you. 6



### And, Mr. Muller, could you just spell 7



### your name into the mike? I didn't get that 8



### earlier. 9



### MR. MULLER: It's Max Muller, M

- A

- X, M

- U

10



### L

- L

- E

- R. 11



### MS. NOONAN: Thank you both very much. 12



### Is there anyone else who wou ld like to 13



### speak before the lunch break? 14



### [No response.] 15



### MS. NOONAN: Okay. Great. We are in 16



### recess. We will return at 1:00 o'clock. 17



### [Break from 12 : 00 p.m. to 1 :0 0 p.m.] 18



### MS. NOONAN: Just before we start I just 19



### want to remind everyone if you have cel l phones 20



### or other electronic devices to please turn them 21



### off. That's out of respect for the other folks 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### in the room. 1



### And I think we'll just get started. 2



### Good afternoon. My name is Jenny Noonan, 3



### and I am the Director of the Policy Analysis and 4



### Communica tions staff in EPA's Office of Air 5



### Quality, Planning, and Standards, and I will be 6



### chairing today's hearing. 7



### Joining me on the panel are Christian 8



### Fellner, who is also with EPA's Office of Air 9



### Quality, Planning, and Standards in the Sector of 10



### Policies and Programs Division. And we're also 11



### joined by Douglas Aburano, who's from the Region 12



### 5 office here in Chicago. 13



### And we are here today to listen to your 14



### comments on EPA's Proposed Carbon Pollution 15



### Standards for New Power Plants. EPA published 16



### the proposed standard in the Federal Register on 17



### April 13th, 2012. This common sense step under 18



### the Clean Air Act would, for the first time, set 19



### national limits on the amount of carbon pollution 20



### that power plants built in the future can emit. 21



### For future power plants EPA is proposing 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### to set an output

- based standard of 1,000 pounds 1



### of carbon dioxide , CO 2 

### , per megawatt hour. The 2



### Agency's proposal does not apply to existing 3



### units or to planned units that already have 4



### received permits and break gr ound within the next 5



### 12 m onths. 6



### EPA's proposed standard reflects the 7



### ongoing trend in the power sector to build 8



### cleaner plants that take advantage of American

9



### made technologies. The proposal is flexible and 10



### would help minimize carbon pollution through the 11



### deployment of the same types of modern 12



### technologies that power companies are already 13



### using to build the next generation of power 14



### plants. EPA's proposal would ensure that this 15



### progress toward a cleaner, safer, and more modern 16



### power sector continues. 17



### Today we will be accepting o ral comments 18



### on all aspects of our proposal, and we will 19



### prepare a written transcript of th is hearing. 20



### The transcript will be come a part of the official 21



### record for this rule. We are also accepting 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### written comments on the proposed rule until June 1



### 25th, 20 12. 2



### At the registration area outside , there 3



### are handouts with detailed information for 4



### submitting written comments by mail, fax, or 5



### electronically. EPA will consider your comments 6



### as we move forward to complete a final rule. 7



### Now let me describe the proc edure for 8



### today's hearing. I will call the speakers to the 9



### table in pairs. When it is your turn to speak, 10



### please state your name and your affiliation 11



### before you begin your testimony. And it w il l 12



### help our court reporter if you spell your name. 13



### In order to be fair to everyone, we will 14



### limit your testimony to five minutes each; and we 15



### ask you remain at the table until both speakers 16



### in the pair have finished. After finish ing your 17



### testimony, members of the panel may ask 18



### c larifying question s

. 19



### If, in additio n to the transcript of your 20



### testimony, you would also like us to put the full 21



### text of your written comments into the docket, 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### please be sure to give a copy of any written 1



### comments to our staff at the registration table

, 2



### or we can take them here

. 3



### We have a time

- keeping system consisting 4



### of green, yellow, and re d lights to help you 5



### track of your five minutes to speak. When you 6



### begin speaking the green light will come on. The 7



### yellow light will signal that you have one minute 8



### left. When the red light comes o n, five minutes 9



### have past and I will ask you to please complete 10



### your testimony. 11



### Today's hearing is scheduled from 8:30 12



### a.m. and continue until 8:00 p.m. or later, if 13



### necessary, depending on the number of speakers. 14



### The hearing will recess

-- or we just

-- are 15



### finishing our recess for lunch , and we'll recess 16



### again for the dinner break from 4:30 to 5:30. 17



### And w e will reconvene promptly at 5:30. 18



### If you would like to testify but have not 19



### yet registered to do so, please sign up at the 20



### registration table in the hallway outside of this 21



### room. And f or those who have already registered 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### to speak, we have tried to accommodate your 1



### requests for a specific time slot. We ask for 2



### your patience as we proceed through the list of 3



### speakers. We may need to make some adjustm ents 4



### as the day progresses. 5



### If you have any questions that arise 6



### through out the day, please see a staff member at 7



### the registration table for assistance. 8



### Again, thank you all for participating 9



### today. Let's get started. 10



### The first two speakers of the afte rnoon 11



### are Reverend Dr. Jerome Stone, and Amy Allen. 12



### Please come to the table. 13



### Would you like to start? 14



### REV. DR STONE: Is everyone picking me 15



### up okay? All right. 16



### I am Jerome Stone, a former United Church 17



### of Christ minister, Professor Emeritus of 18



### Phil osophy, and former Chair of the Department of 19



### Philosophy at William R ainey Harper College in 20



### Palatine where I taught environmental ethics. In 21



### fact, I wrote the course description for 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### environmental ethics for use in the community 1



### colleges in Illinois. 2



### I h ave three points to make. First, 3



### cost

- benefit analysis is not a final analysis. I 4



### hold in my hand a calculator and a picture of my 5



### grandchildren. They could be your children or 6



### grandchildren. A calculator is useful in cost

7



### benefit analysis, but the wor th of children and 8



### their health cannot be determined by a 9



### calculator. We cannot ignore a cost

- benefit 10



### analysis, but if life is sacred, we need more 11



### than a calculator. 12



### The second point is that the argument 13



### about job destruction which you may hear is 14



### false . I used to be a minister in Danville in 15



### east central Illinois. The economy of that area 16



### is very close to my heart. But even more 17



### important we need healthy workers, healthy 18



### children to grow into healthy workers, and 19



### healthy lives for our retired workers

. 20



### If there is some displacement of workers 21



### from these regulations, there will also be new 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### jobs from the pollution

- curbing technologies. 1



### There will be time to adjust jobs and job 2



### training. We did it as the tobacco industry 3



### slowed down. We can do it in c oal. The bottom 4



### line is if we don't have our health, jobs won't 5



### matter. 6



### My third point is this: I have studied 7



### and taught religions of the world, and I can tell 8



### you that if there is anything that all the 9



### religions agree on is that we must care for the 10



### e arth and work for the alleviation of suffering 11



### now and for future generations. If life is 12



### sacred, we need more than a calculator. 13



### The EPA is to be applauded for its work. 14



### Thank you. 15



### MS. NOONAN: Ms. Allen? And spell

-- can 16



### you spell your name, too? 17



### MS. ALLEN: Hi, my name is Amy Allen. A

18



### M

- Y, A

- L

- L

- E

- N. I'm a student at the University 19



### of Illinois and a member of Students for 20



### Environmental Concerns , and I represent a large 21



### group of students there that were inspired and 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### compelled by the EPA's effort in creating these 1



### regulations. 2



### As many other have said, addressing the 3



### climate change is a critically important 4



### challenge for the safety and health of future 5



### generations. And the EPA is to be commended for 6



### this effort at regulating carbon emissions. 7



### How ever, there are several ways in which 8



### these restrictions could go farther and have a 9



### more immediate impact on climate change such as 10



### addressing the emissions of existing plants or 11



### setting stricter controls on the amount of CO 2 12



### emissions that would be permi tted. 13



### Nevertheless, the coal, natural gas, and 14



### other fossil fuel industries have been allowed 15



### for too long to dump their externalities and the 16



### pollution and health impacts of their industries 17



### onto the rest of society without regulation or 18



### having to pay fo r them. Unless we do ask them to 19



### do that, they're not going to change; so it's 20



### important that we force them to pay for things 21



### like that an enact these regulations. 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### And I applaud the EPA for doing so, but I 1



### also encourage you to enact the strongest 2



### regu lations that you can that will have the most 3



### immediate impact. 4



### Thank you. 5



### MS. NOONAN: Thank you both. 6



### Next, Terry Wiggins and Peter Slaby. 7



### [Pause.] 8



### MS. NOONAN: Is Terry Wiggins here? 9



### [No response.] 10



### MS. NOONAN: Okay. Well, we'll have

-- 11



### okay. De rrell Edward Slaughter. 12



### MR. SLABY: My name is Peter I. Slaby, I 13



### for Ivan, middle name. Slaby, S

- L

- A

- B like in 14



### Boston, Y. I live in

-- I'm from Wisconsin, 15



### Milwaukee, a lift

- time Wisconsin resident. I 16



### have logged in 75 years so far and heard we have 17



### 30 years to go before I'm out of here. So time 18



### is of the essence

-- 19



### [Laughter.] 20



### MR. SLABY:

-- to get this rule squared 21



### away. And I'm here to help back up the EPA guys 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### and gals. When you need somebody to watch your 1



### back, Slaby will be there as much as I can do. 2



### We'll get to that. 3



### I support the proposed rule here for new 4



### plants, although details I would not be that much 5



### aware of, but there's so much material that I 6



### downloaded online from EPA, and from, you know, 7



### various environmental groups. I got a to n of 8



### stuff now I'm researching. It stays with me 9



### forever that I think it's important, though, that 10



### I will trust others who have more details 11



### regarding that. And it's about observations. 12



### During World War II I'm just a little kid 13



### becoming aware of the wor ld. So in 19

-- World 14



### War II and all through the 1940's in the 15



### Milwaukee area, just north of the Menomonee 16



### Valley, a lot

-- we put the laundry out in the 17



### back yard to dry. It was always tattletale gray. 18



### We never had clean white sheets because of the 19



### part iculates coming in from the steam engines and 20



### the manufacturing and the

-- all the coal 21



### furnaces in Milwaukee at that time. 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### Up to the 19070's I started hiking with 1



### the Wisconsin Go Hiking Club . All through the 2



### 1970's we could guaranty a year or two years and 3



### even five years ahead of time on a specific date 4



### we could plan that far ahead to hike the Cedar 5



### Bog about 35 miles north of Milwaukee because we 6



### were guaranteed a hard surface. 7



### Around 1980 or so the formerly hard 8



### surface of ice and snow started to get a little 9



### squicky. In the

-- all through the latter 1980's 10



### and, well, to date there is no such thing as 11



### planning ahead for a guaranteed hard ice to 12



### penetrate a bog. That's only a memory. I wonder 13



### what happened. 14



### The 1990's and 2000's in the rental 15



### bu siness and working with children or tenants, 16



### children of tenants, and also the Milwaukee 17



### Public Schools, a number of people were using my 18



### building to help children with exceptional needs, 19



### rather suffering from

-- not just something from 20



### the coal but it wou ld be mercury, asbestos, lead, 21



### that kind of business, and maybe other issues. 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### But I found it

-- in my world I don't 1



### remember as a kid having the kind of problems 2



### that our children are now

-- seem to be suffering 3



### over this entire world of ours in the Unite d 4



### States, in Milwaukee, especially Central City or 5



### rural areas that was my turf. And I worry about 6



### the children. I have no children of my own, but, 7



### however, I do make my observations. What is 8



### happening with this

-- like a pandemic went on of 9



### ailments of children? Is there something going 10



### on that we need to take notice of? 11



### Okay. I think one thing

-- just to wrap 12



### up here, I think the

-- when I look at the

-- 13



### scan some of the materials that EPA that I 14



### downloaded, I think we're talking

-- we're too 15



### human centric. And when I see references to that 16



### -- our children, and the elderly, and their 17



### children's chi ldren, and children's children of 18



### the humans, how about the children and 19



### grandchildren, and great, great grandchildren of 20



### all of the life forms that we hu man beings have 21



### to depend on? That's called the biological chain 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### of life. And there are references throughout 1



### from time to time, but I think when we talk about 2



### the human factors, we better talk about all other 3



### life forms as well, flora and fauna. 4



### Oh, Go d, I

-- I also

-- therefore, I 5



### offer some tools to add to EPA's toolbox when the 6



### -- and when those deniers come on or those who 7



### oppose these massive changes that these

-- quote 8



### -- radical changes for the record as I'm putting 9



### that in quotes. I think in or der for the EPA 10



### staffers and anybody else that has to combat 11



### those who do not like these changes consider 12



### something called willful blindness. 13



### Willful blindness is a concept that 14



### indicates that you

-- it's a humanality 15



### throughout history. Humans will deny reality or 16



### consciously or unconsciously will

-- if it's 17



### inconvenient, or not nice, or maybe

-- for 18



### whatever reason we'll deny the facts, and it's 19



### called

-- 20



### MS. NOONAN: Mr. Slaby. 21



### MR. SLABY:

-- willful blindness. Now, 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### I'm just reading the book now but you can go on 1



### any search engine and just type in willful 2



### blindness, and bam, there's a ton of everything. 3



### It's a legal concept. Some people have been 4



### convicted legally of violating, consciously 5



### practicing this willful blindness and try to get 6



### away with e vading facts. Willful blindness. 7



### MS. NOONAN: Thank you

. 8



### MR. SLABY: Nothing new about it. 9



### MS. NOONAN: Thank you very much. And we 10



### would accept any

-- if you have longer comments 11



### that you would like to submit for the record, we 12



### would certainly

-- 13



### MR . SLABY: And lastly, I'm suggesting 14



### that

-- 15



### MS. NOONAN: Really, your time is up. 16



### MR. SLABY: Oh, I'm sorry. It's a red 17



### light. I will put this in. I want to put this 18



### on paper. 19



### MS. NOONAN: Please do. 20



### MR. SLABY: I'll give it in the next two 21



### weeks, and it will be a little more

-- you know, 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### lay it out a little more easier to read. 1



### MS. NOONAN: Okay. Thank you so much. 2



### MR. SLABY: But Slaby will be watching 3



### you and helping your back and watching out for 4



### you. 5



### MS. NOONAN: I appreciate that. Thank 6



### y ou. 7



### [Applause.] 8



### M R

. SLAUGHTER : Good afternoon, lady and 9



### gentlemen. My name is Derrell Slaughter. That's 10



### D

- E

- R

- R

- E

- L

- L, Slaughter, S

- L

- A

- U

- G

- H

- T

- E

- R. And 11



### I proudly serve as the Second Vice

- President for 12



### the Lansing, Michigan NAACP Branch. I'm the 13



### Sec ond Vice

- President of the Lansing NAACP 14



### Branch. 15



### And I stand before you today as a person 16



### gravely concerned about the quality of life for 17



### the American citizens of today and tomorrow. I 18



### fear that future generations, many of which have 19



### not been born yet, w ill grow up in a world where 20



### basic resources like clean water and air will be 21



### polluted and scarce. Instead, these natural 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### resources will reserved for those individuals 1



### that have the means to obtain them, thus granting 2



### them a higher quality of life than th e average 3



### person. 4



### And equity issues that will be caused by 5



### the lack of available clean resources will be 6



### owned by our unborn children and grandchildren. 7



### Because of this I feel that people of this era 8



### must be obliged

-- must oblige themselves to 9



### begin to address the elements in our society 10



### today that limit the available natural resources 11



### of tomorrow. 12



### Coal

- fired power plants happen to the top 13



### culprit and frame this bleak future. Coal

- fired 14



### power plants emit massive amounts of human

15



### harming harming chemic als in the air every day. 16



### According to the American Lung Association's 17



### report on coal

- fired plants, toxic air, coal

18



### fired plants release 386,000 tons of 84 separate 19



### adverse air pollutants, all which spew from 400 20



### plants across the country. 21



### Some of the ch emicals that are a part of 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### those emissions include arsenic, mercury, radium, 1



### and hydrochloride. These chemicals can cause 2



### everything from skin irritation to lung and bone 3



### cancer in humans. The most unfortunate aspect of 4



### coal

- fired plants is who gets affl icted by the 5



### chemicals that are being spewed out. These 6



### effects are more

-- even more severe in children 7



### who are the future of our country. 8



### According to the National Black Child 9



### Development Institute's Fall 2011 Newsletter, 10



### Child Health Talk, 68 percent of all African

11



### Americans live within 30 miles of a coal

- fired 12



### plant. When you get down to a 3

- mile radius, 13



### according to the NAACP's 2011 Report, Coal 14



### Blooded, you'll find that there are 8.1 million 15



### people that happen to live near a coal

- fired 16



### plant. Of t hose individuals 36.4 percent or 2.94 17



### million happen to be people of color. 18



### Coupled with the close proximity to coal

19



### fired plants comes with startling statistics. 20



### Particulate soot from coal

- powered power plants 21



### cost a family of four an average of $500 pe r year 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### in expenses and damage associated with increased 1



### hospital admissions, premature deaths, and 2



### treatments for asthma, respiratory ailments, and 3



### cardiovascular problems among others. 4



### A recent study commissioned by the 5



### Michigan Environmental Council als o estimated 6



### national impacts of Michigan's old coal power 7



### plants find they are responsible for $5.4 billion 8



### in health care costs, mostly in the Great Lakes 9



### region where much of their pollution follow 10



### patents. 11



### Where people of color have

-- while 12



### people of color have less to worry about the 13



### harmful chemicals coming from these coal

- fired 14



### plants, they have much more to worry about with 15



### the role of coal

- fired plants claim accelerating 16



### climate change through carbon emissions. People 17



### of color are very much susce ptible to the 18



### negative effects of climate change. 19



### One of the most obvious effects from 20



### climate change is increased temperature. The 21



### commission to engage African

- Americans on climate 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### change has stated that African

- Americans are 1



### twice as likely to live in cities deemed as heat 2



### islands compared to whites. As a result, 3



### African

- Americans suffer from heat

- related deaths 4



### at a rate of 150 to 200 percent more than their 5



### white counterparts according to the Environmental 6



### Justice and Climate Change Initiative 2008 7



### r eport, The Climate of Change. 8



### We also happen to be more susceptible to 9



### extreme weather events that climate change 10



### caused. According to the National Wildlife 11



### Association's 2009 report, More Extreme Weather, 12



### African

- Americans comprise 20 percent of the 13



### pop ulation in the eig ht states deemed as 14



### hurricane zones. They also note that 56 percent 15



### of all African

- Americans live in the south or in 16



### urban areas. 17



### In order to stop some of the effects that 18



### climate change is having on our planet and on 19



### peop le of color we need to begin to hold coal

20



### fired power plants to more prudent carbon 21



### emission standards. I believe that EPA's carbon 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### standard rule for new power plants is a step in 1



### the right direction. It helps protect future and 2



### current generations from the harmful ef fects of 3



### carbon emissions and climate change. The rule is 4



### prudent, fair, and follows right in line with 5



### where the country is headed in terms of energy 6



### use estimates and trends. 7



### As clean energy technology become the 8



### standard force of our country's energy capacity, 9



### we must oblige those who want to continue to use 10



### carbon

- laden energy source with the task of 11



### significantly reducing their emissions. 12



### I truly hope the EPA passes more rules to 13



### ensure a high quality life of all people 14



### regardless of resource availa bility. 15



### Thank you. 16



### MS. NOONAN: Thank you both very much. 17



### [Applause.] 18



### MS. NOONAN: And while I appreciate your 19



### enthusiasm, as do, I’m sure, the speakers, just 20



### for the sake of time we're going to ask folks to 21



### restrain your enthusiasm and maybe share i t with 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### the speakers later. Thank you. 1



### Dorthea Enrique Thomas, please, and 2



### T h eresa Dear. And we'll do for the

-- on deck, 3



### as they say in baseball, Jacquel ine Patterson 4



### will be next along with Katherine Egland. 5



### Go ahead. 6



### MS. DEAR: I want to thank you f or the 7



### opportunity to speak to you today. I appreciate 8



### this agenda

-- 9



### MS. NOONAN: I'm sorry. Can you say your 10



### name and spell it? 11



### MS. DEAR: Reverend Theresa Dear, D

- E

- A

12



### R. 13



### I appreciate this gathering, this agenda 14



### as one of a testimony, but the way th at I see our 15



### time together here is that it's really a post

16



### mortem to assess the environmental ills and 17



### contaminants that ultimately contribute to the 18



### death of many in this country. We are here to 19



### really examine what we've done wrong to kill so 20



### many in thi s country. You may not see it that 21



### way, but I do. 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### In the CDC's fourth report of national 1



### exposure it reveals data of the United States 2



### populations' exposure to 212 chemicals. Seventy

3



### five of these 212 chemicals were identified in 4



### the first report. And the first report was 5



### delivered in 2001. The fourth report, friends, 6



### reveals our exposure to 212 chemicals. The first 7



### report, again, revealed our exposure in 2001 to 8



### only 27 chemicals. Again, in 2001 there were 27 9



### chemicals. Here in 2012 the CDC reports that 10



### there are 212 chemicals that we are exposed to 11



### now. 12



### If you look at the African

- American 13



### community in particular , w here our food staple

-- 14



### in the African

- American urban community

, in 15



### particular

, where there are food deserts and the 16



### primary food stapl e is processed and manufactured 17



### food, that number of 212 is almost doubled, if 18



### not tripled. And so I applaud the landmark and 19



### progressive steps that this administration and 20



### this leadership has taken to address pollutants 21



### from plants. I applaud the action that has been 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### taken in terms of developing the interagency 1



### environmental justice initiatives, but, friends, 2



### significantly more must be done because, as I 3



### said earlier, we have moved from 27 chemicals to 4



### 212. 5



### The Hospice Association talks about two 6



### stag es of death. There's the pre

- stage of death, 7



### and then there is the active stage of death. And 8



### what I would submit to you is that we are in an 9



### active stage of dying right now because these 10



### pollutant and these contaminants that we inhale, 11



### ingest, and eat a re gradually, yet rapidly, 12



### killing us. 13



### And so I dare not leave this table 14



### without what I am most passionate about, and that 15



### is accountability because I have read all the 16



### documents from Secretary Katherine [sic] 17



### Sebelius, the Executive Order from President 18



### Clinton, et cetera. I have seen nothing 19



### published, at least on websites, where there are 20



### metrics of accountability. And I would ask you 21



### to consider these four items of accountability. 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### First, that we broaden and publicize 1



### compliance standards; secondly, that we would 2



### hold companies accountable for non

- compliance, 3



### that we would mandate compliance dates, not 4



### target dates but actual and specific publicized 5



### dates. 6



### And finally, we would assign fines and 7



### penalties to companies for non

- compliance 8



### because, lead ers of the EPA, if we do not do this 9



### in this post

- mortem session, we are going to find 10



### ourselves, in a few years, where this number from 11



### 212 is now increased to over a thousand. I would 12



### submit to you that if we don't take actions of 13



### accountability, we are going to be the authors of 14



### more death certificates than birth certificates. 15



### We are going to be designing more and delivering 16



### more eulogies than commencement speeches. And we 17



### are going to be giving more time to autopsies 18



### rather than births. 19



### Thank you. 20



### M S. THOMAS: Good afternoon. My name is 21



### Dorthea Thomas. That's D

- O

- R

- T

- H

- E

- A, T

- H

- O

- M

- A

- 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### S. 1



### And today I am here on behalf of the 2



### NAACP Michigan State Conference as an 3



### Environmental Justice Co

- Lead and an advocate of 4



### conservation and sustainability mana gement. 5



### I'm from the heart of the city that is 6



### known for its bad air quality, Detroit, Michigan; 7



### but my grandparents are from here, Chicago, 8



### Illinois. I am the granddaughter of Dorothy 9



### Irvin, an evangelist and a Woman of Ministry, 10



### that was loved and cher ished in her community yet 11



### passed away from lung cancer because of the 12



### toxins that existed in the air of her community. 13



### If the efforts of the EPA are enforced, 14



### this could significantly reduce mercury, soot, 15



### smog, and pollution announcing historic, new 16



### emi ssions standards that combined save 46,000 17



### lives a year. 18



### I watched her suffer until death, wishing 19



### there was a way to escape the environment 20



### exposure to prolong her life a little while 21



### longer. The only advice her doctor gave her was 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### to move to another cl eaner and safer environment. 1



### Yet, because of our current situation, she was 2



### financially incapable of leaving everything she 3



### had ever worked for in her life. 4



### My grandfather had always loved to fish 5



### and enjoy the weather on bright sunny days, but 6



### now he's e ven too afraid to go out for too long 7



### because of the quality of our air. After years 8



### of fishing in the Belle Isle River and 9



### surrounding Great Lakes, after coming across the 10



### fish infested with tumors and disease, not only 11



### was the love of his life was taken away from him 12



### but his hobby and quality of life has now 13



### shattered, too. 14



### Coal

- fired plants spew hundreds of 15



### thousands of pounds of toxic mercury into our air 16



### every year which falls to the earth in the form 17



### of rain and contaminates rivers, lakes, and 18



### strea ms. And it doesn't take much mercury to 19



### have a big impact on our health. 20



### Scientists found that a single gram of 21



### mercury can contaminate an entire 20

- acre lake. 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### My grandparents did all they could to raise me in 1



### the most loving, safe, upright way. One da y I 2



### wish to start my own family, but I want to feel 3



### comfortable knowing that my children and family 4



### is born into an all

- around healthy society. 5



### Passage of the carbon pollution standards 6



### will ensure that communities worldwide would not 7



### face new threats fro m plants that will degrade 8



### their health today and the future to come. 9



### At least 1 in 12 and then as many as 1 in 10



### 6 of American women of child

- bearing age have 11



### enough mercury in their bodies to put a baby at 12



### risk for mercury poisoning. Mercury and other 13



### da ngerous air pollutants are connected to extreme 14



### health problems such as brain damage, learning 15



### disabilities, birth defects, heart disease, 16



### cancer, and even premature death. 17



### Mercury impairs 3,781 bodies of water 18



### across the country. More than 6 million acr es of 19



### lakes, reservoirs, and ponds in the United states 20



### are contaminated by mercury pollution. 21



### With the help of the EPA and political 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### backing we can save 46,000 lives a year. As we 1



### in our efforts to continue to constantly work 2



### closely with our allies in the public health 3



### community, lobbying, key senators, and thousands 4



### of activists, we can stand up our future, 5



### present, and generations to come. 6



### This new carbon rule prevents 123 billion 7



### pounds of carbon pollution annually. EPA's 8



### proposed rule would help mitigate climate change 9



### and achieve an immediate carbon pollution 10



### reductions from power plants. 11



### My health has declined over the years as 12



### well. I've been diagnosed with a rare eye 13



### disease called scleritis that my doctor has 14



### directly correlated with enviro nmental exposure. 15



### Without health insurance, the government even 16



### turned me down from assistance for

-- qualifying 17



### for assistance because they said I was not blind 18



### yet. 19



### We must protect our families and create a 20



### sustainable society. Not only do I support th e 21



### EPA proposal on enforcing new power plants to 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### abide by these rules, but I hope that existing 1



### plants shall also be in the near future as well. 2



### Our people are suffering and dying slowly 3



### in the African

- American community without any 4



### help or assistance. So mething must be done. 5



### Finalizing a new standard to reduce 6



### carbon pollution is one of those things. This 7



### will save lives, communities, and the quality of 8



### life for all people to come. We must stand by 9



### investing the notion that in creating healthy 10



### people, it will ultimately create a healthy 11



### economy in general. 12



### Thank you. 13



### MS. NOONAN: Thank you both very much. 14



### Jacqueline Patterson and Katherine 15



### Egland. 16



### MS. PATTERSON: Yes, hi. My name is 17



### Jackie Patterson. I was born and raised in 18



### Chicago, Illinois. I now live in Silver Spring, 19



### Maryland. 20



### Last year in February my father began to 21



### complain of a cough which increased in severity 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### over the course of the year, progressing into him 1



### being confined to the home and dependent on an 2



### oxygen machine. He was still so severely winded 3



### from just walking from the living to the kitchen 4



### to get a glass of water even while on the oxygen 5



### machine. My dad's doctors diagnosed him with 6



### pulmonary fibrosis and said that it was likely 7



### due to environmental exposure given that my 8



### fath er has never smoked a day in his life. We 9



### laid my father to rest on September 4th of last 10



### year. 11



### How many more people must be buried 12



### before we're granted equal protection under the 13



### law? As stated before 68 percent of African

14



### Americans live within 30 mile s of a coal

- fired 15



### power plant. An African

- American family making 16



### $50,000 per year is more likely to live near a 17



### toxic facility than a white American family 18



### making $15,000 per year. 19



### We've seen the results of this in the 20



### rates of respiratory illnesses in A frican

21



### Americans. Even though we have lower rates of 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### smoking, African

- Americans are more likely to die 1



### of lung disease. 2



### A recent study found that in the Bronx an 3



### African

- American child is five times more likely 4



### to die of asthma than a white American chil d. 5



### Nationwide African

- American children are twice as 6



### likely to die of asthma and three times more 7



### likely to be admitted to the hospital for asthma 8



### attacks. 9



### From what I understand carbon pollution 10



### doesn't directly cause these health conditions, 11



### but rath er, it creates what some scientists call 12



### domes that trap, concentrate, and intensify they 13



### myriad of other toxins we breath every day, some 14



### of us more than others. 15



### With the mercury, arsenic, lead, dioxins, 16



### and other pollutants that come from power plants 17



### i n communities nationwide, these domes are 18



### effectively creating lethal gas chambers for 19



### communities. At the same time, we understand 20



### that carbon dioxide is the number one driver of 21



### climate change, and these power plants are the 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### leading emitters of carbon d ioxide. 1



### Again, climate change affects us all, but 2



### its affects are felt hardest by communities and 3



### people who are politically, economically, 4



### physically, and socially vulnerable. 5



### When I did hurricane relief after 6



### Hurricanes Katrina and Rita, the throngs of folks 7



### who walked through the doors of the disaster 8



### recovery center every day were largely African

9



### Americans. I also met scores of people with 10



### hearing impairments where my pathetic one year of 11



### sign language was their saving grace. But my 12



### presence and mea ger skills were pure 13



### happenstance. So what would have happened if I 14



### hadn't been there? 15



### I also met people with HIV and AIDS who 16



### went weeks without access to their life

17



### preserving antiretroviral drugs . Overall I met 18



### hundreds of people who had to start the ir entire 19



### lives over with barely two pennies to rub 20



### together to do so. And scientists say that 21



### Katrina was only the tip of the iceberg. 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### Regarding other effects of climate 1



### change, growing up here in the south side of 2



### Chicago, I lived in a community that w ould be 3



### considered to be a food desert like so many other 4



### communities of color. This means we would have 5



### more immediate access to a Dorito or a Funyun 6



### than a leafy vegetable or a strawberry. We 7



### already see how this plays out for communities 8



### who are dispr oportionally suffering from 9



### heightened rates of obesity as well as hunger and 10



### all of the health conditions that result from 11



### poor diet, including diabetes, heart disease, 12



### high blood pressure, et cetera. 13



### Access to affordable nutritious foods 14



### will only lesse n as climate change impacts 15



### agricultural yields here and abroad. Last year 16



### we saw farmers in Illinois, Iowa, Mississippi, 17



### and beyond lose crops from flood

-- due to flood 18



### and drought. Again, scientists say we've only 19



### begun to see these impacts. 20



### Finally, I visited coastal communities 21



### from Florida to Louisiana to Alaska, some of whom 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### are already experiencing coastal erosion and 1



### several of whom are facing displacement in the 2



### next 20 years due to some sea level rising 3



### resulting from climate change. 4



### The cost of inaction on carbon pollution 5



### is the health, livelihood, culture, economic and 6



### social well being of communities nationwide and 7



### worldwide with vulnerable communities being hit 8



### first and worst. 9



### We need strong carbon pollution standards 10



### to ensure that new ly proposed plants have 11



### controls in place that protect the well being of 12



### us all. We must also make sure that our next 13



### step is also to regulate carbon dioxide from the 14



### hundreds of existing plants that are now 15



### polluting thousands of communities. The histor y 16



### of decades of pollution from those plants is one 17



### of the leading reasons we are now on the brink of 18



### catastrophic climate change. We must get the 19



### situation under control for all of our sakes. 20



### Thank you. 21



### MS. NOONAN: And can you spell your name 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### into the

-- 1



### MS. PATTERSON: Sure. My name is 2



### Jacqueline Patterson, J

- A

- C

- Q

- U

- E

- L

- I

- N

- E, 3



### Patterson, P

- A

- T

- T

- E

- R

- S

- O

- N. 4



### MS. NOONAN: Okay. Thank you so much. 5



### MS. EGLAND: Good afternoon. My name is 6



### Katherine Egland. That's Katherine with a K

- A

- T

7



### H

- E

- R

- I

- N

- E, l ast name Egland, E

- G

- L

- A

- N

- D. And 8



### I am a member of the NAACP National Board of 9



### Directors and chair the Environmental and Climate 10



### Justice Committee of the Board. 11



### First, let me preface my remarks by 12



### commending this administration for proposing this 13



### much ne eded new source performance standard 14



### regulation. This is a tremendous leap towards 15



### providing safeguards to assure cleaner air for 16



### promoting a more robust and responsible economy. 17



### And one of the most perplexing concerns 18



### that I have heard from those who ob ject to the 19



### regulation is that it is a job killer. Now let 20



### me be clear. You simply cannot justify killing 21



### people to create jobs. We cannot compromise the 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### health of a nation for the wealth of the 1



### privileged. Making a living wage is of no 2



### consequence to an unhealthy or a dying worker. 3



### The end does not justify the means. 4



### Former President Bill Clinton once said

- 5



### - and I quote: I have never believed that we had 6



### to choose between either a clean and safe 7



### environment or a growing economy. Protecting the 8



### hea lth and safety of all Americans doesn't have 9



### to come at the expense of our economy's bottom 10



### line. And creating pride in companies and new 11



### jobs doesn't have to come at the expense of the 12



### air we breathe, the water we drink, the food we 13



### eat, or the natural l andscape in which we live. 14



### We can and indeed must have both

-- unquote. 15



### We should never turn a blind eye or a 16



### deaf ear to those who have a deep and abiding 17



### commitment to protecting our environment and 18



### dismiss them as opponents of progress or even 19



### worse h ired assassins to kill the job market. 20



### I am certainly grateful for this 21



### opportunity and all those who work so diligently 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### within this administration to protect my right to 1



### breathe clean air. 2



### I am here today in a volunteer capacity 3



### as a grandmother of a ch ild who requires periodic 4



### breathing treatments and as a Gulfport, 5



### Mississippi, homeowner who for the past 33 years 6



### has resided within five miles of a failing coal 7



### plant, Plant Jack Watson. Three of my 8



### grandchildren live only two blocks from me which 9



### place s them within that same five

- mile radius. 10



### It isn't enough that Plant Watson's 11



### owner, Mississippi Power Company, has this one 12



### failing plant. They're pending final approval by 13



### the Public Service Commission to develop yet 14



### another coal plant in the state. This new Kemper 15



### County site will utilize lignite and eliminate 16



### 20,000 acres of prime forestland and small farms. 17



### Any runoff from the project will impact the 18



### Pascagoula River. And to add insult to injury, 19



### it appears that we, the ratepayers, will finance 20



### t he building of this plant with a 30 percent rate 21



### hike. But the company claims it's doing us a 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### favor as the increased power rates will take 1



### effect gradually over a 10

- year period. 2



### Apparently they have no appreciation for 3



### the fact that Social Security, ret irement, and 4



### other incomes will not increase at a rate of 30 5



### percent over a 10

- year period. And that this 6



### increase will impose a considerable hardship on 7



### many of its consumers. This is really an 8



### absolute travesty that the construction of the 9



### new coal pla nt will be financed on the backs of 10



### struggling customers with absolutely no risk to 11



### the shareholders of this publicly traded company. 12



### This kind of blatant disregard is why we need 13



### federal government intervention. 14



### Also located within five miles of Plant 15



### Ja ck Watson is the Gulf of Mexico. Gulf 16



### residents have had not only to contend with the 17



### results of extreme climate changes, respond to 18



### unprecedented devastation of Hurricane Katrina, 19



### but we also have had to cope with the horrendous 20



### BP Oil drilling disaster. And we also have 21



### continued concerns regarding the environmental 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### impact of all the pollutants of the Mississippi 1



### River which flows through 10 states before 2



### dumping into the Gulf of Mexico. 3



### We need federal government regulations to 4



### protect us, not just fo r future coal plants but 5



### for all the existing pitfalls which have led us 6



### down this unyielding path of destruction. I 7



### encourage consideration of NFPS as well 8



### protective guidelines for existing coal plants. 9



### Thank you. 10



### MS. NOONAN: Thank you both very much

. 11



### Up next we have Ted Carrington and Gloria 12



### Gilmer. And then after that we'll have Terry 13



### Wiggins and Yangyang Cheng. 14



### [Pause.] 15



### MS. NOONAN: Ted Carrington and Gloria 16



### Gilmer? 17



### MR. CARRINGTON: Good afternoon. My name 18



### is Theodore Carrington, T

- H

- E

- O

- D

- O

- R

- E, C

- A

- R

- R

19



### I

- N

- G

- T

- O

- N. I'm a resident of Franklin Park, 20



### New Jersey, located near the middle of the state. 21



### I am Chairperson of the Environmental and Climate 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### Justice Program for the New Jersey State 1



### Conference of the NAACP, the nation's oldest and 2



### larges t civil rights organization. 3



### Let me start by saying that every one of 4



### us has the right to breathe clean, healthy air, 5



### air that is not saturated with carbon dioxide, 6



### clean air that will not make you sick each day 7



### when you take a breath, clean air that does not 8



### impact your health because of accumulated affects 9



### of breathing in carbon dioxide over a lifetime, 10



### in a year, every single day. We have the right 11



### to breathe clean air free of carbon dioxide and 12



### other pollutants. 13



### The proposed rule will reduce the harm ful 14



### impacts of carbon dioxide, a major contributor to 15



### global warming that makes our cities hotter, 16



### causes increases in asthma attacks and 17



### respiratory complications. Carbon dioxide has a 18



### great impact on a state like New Jersey which is 19



### ranked the fourth sm allest state in the union yet 20



### 11th in population. New Jersey is ranked 5th in 21



### the nation for new cancer cases each year. New 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### Jersey has five power plants that emit tons of 1



### carbon dioxide into the air each year, plus we 2



### are impacted by the power plants lo cated in 3



### Pennsylvania, West Virginia, and Ohio. Data from 4



### 2005 indicates Pennsylvania has 78 coal

- fired 5



### generating units emitting carbon dioxide into the 6



### air, and the easterly wind currents blow carbon 7



### dioxide and other pollutants into New Jersey 8



### every da y. 9



### Because of the dense population in New 10



### Jersey over 7 million people are exposed to power 11



### plant pollution each year that includes more than 12



### one and half million children of which 244,225 13



### are in poverty conditions and 99,488 suffer from 14



### asthma. This is a devastating combination for 15



### our communities when our children must compete on 16



### a world market and they start off life poor and 17



### sick. 18



### Two of New Jersey's power plants are 19



### located in densely populated areas of the state 20



### where large numbers of blacks and La tinos live. 21



### The Hudson Generation Station and the Mercer 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### Facility have recently reduced the amount of 1



### harmful emissions they emit into the air each 2



### year. The two facilities did not reduce the 3



### emissions because they were concerned the 4



### emissions were causi ng harm to the community. 5



### They were not concerned that our children are 6



### growing up with illnesses that would prevent them 7



### from participating in simple playtime activities 8



### or cause them to have difficulty in school. 9



### These two facilities were forced to 10



### red uce toxic emissions because of lawsuits and 11



### the threat of lawsuits. And the federal 12



### government had to step in and make the companies 13



### do what they were supposed to do in the first 14



### place. The corporations were supposed to reduce 15



### the emissions because it wa s the right thing to 16



### do. This is another example of the power plant 17



### industry putting profits over the health of the 18



### most vulnerable. 19



### Although the emissions from the power 20



### plants have been reduced, the polluting continues 21



### to assault communities that will be affected for 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### many years to come. This is why we need new 1



### source performance standard as initiated by the 2



### EPA. We will be somewhat satisfied to know that 3



### the power plants will not add significant amounts 4



### of carbon dioxide into the air. There would be a 5



### greater sense of satisfaction if we were able to 6



### do a community related health impact analysis and 7



### determine what communities have high levels of 8



### nitrous oxide and sulfur dioxide. These are 9



### precursors to particulate matter, a microscopic 10



### unit that is ca using coronary havoc in black and 11



### Latino communities. 12



### Finally, last Saturday I attended a 13



### three

- mile community walk in central New Jersey 14



### and had the opportunity to communicate with one 15



### of the walkers. I noticed she was distracted 16



### from our conversation. She explained she wasn't 17



### being rude, but she was concentrating on her 18



### child. It seemed the young girl wanted to do 19



### more than walk. She wanted to run and play with 20



### her friends, but her parents knew that any over 21



### exertion could cause her to experience a l ife

- 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### threatening asthma attack. It was all the mother 1



### could do to keep her child contained when she 2



### could contained

-- when she should be in the 3



### active prime of her young life. Despite the 4



### parent's efforts to contain her child, the young 5



### girl still had to leave the walk suffering a mild 6



### asthma attack. We should not have to suffer just 7



### because we breathe. 8



### EPA's proposed carbon pollution standard 9



### for new power plants is a step in the right 10



### direction. 11



### MS. GILMER: My name is Gloria Gilmer, 12



### and I'm the aut hority that most of these people 13



### are. I'm here to learn as much as I can about 14



### the problems that we are discussing, but it is 15



### because I am a mathematician and I really spent a 16



### lot of time looking at problems and how to solve 17



### them, but this particular issu e of climate 18



### control became of extreme interest to me. 19



### Recently, a friend of mine spent some 20



### time in Costa Rica. And she

-- 21



### MS. NOONAN: I'm sorry to interrupt. 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### People want to be able to hear you. 1



### MS. GILMER: Okay. Recently, about a 2



### year ago a frien d of mine spent some time in 3



### Costa Rica, and she brought the problem

-- the 4



### problem that came to me from her was the fact 5



### that she lived with people who generated their 6



### own energy needs. All of the needs that they had 7



### for energy, they created, and they ha d enough 8



### energy for their neighbors. Well, I never heard 9



### of anything like this, and I was wondering how do 10



### people do this. 11



### And so when she came back and she shared 12



### some things with us about the production

-- 13



### people being able to produce energy for 14



### thems elves, I began to look at what was happening 15



### in my city. And my city is Milwaukee. And I 16



### began to see how people were beginning to look at 17



### other forms of energy. 18



### Now, I did not know initially the 19



### problems that we confronted. I did know about 20



### lead , lead in the schools. I knew that. I 21



### didn’t know the problems that we confronted with 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### generating energy and the coal problem. 1



### But now that I see it, I'm seeing it 2



### differently. I see

-- and also, I wanted to say 3



### that I am a member of the NAACP, and I'm not a n 4



### officer but I just wanted to solve problems. 5



### I see this as a problem for the nation, 6



### but all of us are responsible. We helped to 7



### create it, and we also, in many ways, can help 8



### solve it. So when I looked at what they were 9



### doing in Costa Rica and they l ooked at their own 10



### waste that they used with composting so that they 11



### -- even though, you know, you eat food and I knew 12



### what they did with the animals. I knew that we 13



### use the manure from the animals in order to 14



### fertilize the fields so that we'd have

-- I n ever 15



### thought of it this way. I'm really

-- let me 16



### tell you that I'm learning a great deal because I 17



### had never thought about energy in this year. And 18



### I bet a lot of people had never thought about it 19



### in this way. But we have a great opportunity. 20



### I'm very happy about the standards. 21



### I didn't know about the standards that 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### you are generating at the EPA for our 1



### contamination. You've got to have standards 2



### because how we know whether we are in compliance 3



### or we're over the top in what we have been doing. 4



### So, I like the fact that we are going to be 5



### looking at standards, and I certainly will be one 6



### of the proponents of explaining to people that 7



### you are in a community that's creating a lot of 8



### problems for you and that we do have some 9



### standards. 10



### I don't know how yo u plan to make sure 11



### that all the communities know what the standards 12



### are, but I think the NAACP will be right there 13



### helping to share with people. And people begin 14



### to see what they

-- we all do in order to reduce 15



### this problem of that contamination. 16



### MS. NO ONAN: Thank you both very much. 17



### Terry Wiggins and Yangyang Cheng, please. 18



### [Pause.] 19



### MS. NOONAN: Please go ahead. And start 20



### with spelling your name. 21



### MS. WIGGINS: Good afternoon. My name is 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### Terry Wiggins, T

- E

- R

- R

- Y, W

- I

- G

- G

- I

- N

- S, and I'm 1



### representi ng the Interfaith Earth Network of 2



### Southeastern Wisconsin. 3



### Our various faiths call us all to do the 4



### same thing, though we often express it in 5



### different language. I am a Unitarian 6



### Universalist, and one of my principles is to 7



### respect the interdependent web of all life of 8



### which we are a part, and another is to affirm the 9



### inherent worth and dignity of every person. 10



### The Christians among us say that care for 11



### God's creation is what's important to them. Here 12



### are some samples from a few of many Christian 13



### denomin ations: The two most recent Roman 14



### Catholic Popes have spoken out on this path. 15



### Pope Benedict XVI said if you want to cultivate 16



### peace, protect creation. 17



### The evangelical climate initiative signed 18



### in 2006 claims human

- induced climate change is 19



### real. The c onsequences of climate change will be 20



### significant and will hit the pool the har d est. 21



### Christian moral convictions demand our response 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### to the climate change problem and the need to act 1



### now is urgent. Governments, businesses, 2



### churches, and individuals all h ave a role to play 3



### in addressing climate change starting now. 4



### United Methodists social principles state 5



### all creation is the Lord's, and we are 6



### responsible for the ways in which we use and 7



### abuse it. Further, The General Board of Church 8



### and Society publish ed a resolution in 2008 on 9



### environmental stewardship which lays out their 10



### theology for stewardship and the environment and 11



### principles for Christian stewardship of the 12



### environment which include responsible use of 13



### natural resources, right to live in a commun ity 14



### free of toxic and hazardous substances, the right 15



### to clean air, responsible land use, and 16



### preservation of the diversity of life. 17



### Lutherans have been strong in their 18



### teachings on the environment. Lutheran 19



### theologians have been influential leaders of t he 20



### religious environmental movement. In a statement 21



### they encourage their congregations to advocate 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### with their local and state governments 1



### individually and corporately through local and 2



### state councils of churches. 3



### Muslims also care about the environment. 4



### A few of the concluding statements in the 2003 5



### Islamic Faith Statement on the Environment tell 6



### us that there are several Quran principles that 7



### taken in their totality state in clear terms that 8



### Allah is the creator of the universe and indeed 9



### its owner. All ah has invited to partake of the 10



### fruits of the earth for their rightful 11



### nourishment and enjoyment. He has also directed 12



### them not to waste that which Allah has provided. 13



### Furthermore, Allah has also ordered humans to 14



### administer his responsibilities with jus tice. 15



### Above all, people should conserve the balance of 16



### Allah's creation on earth. 17



### I could easily go on with many more 18



### statements from Hindu and Buddhist and other 19



### faith perspectives, but my time is about up. I 20



### will conclude by saying that our faiths cal l us 21



### to make any progress we can toward a cleaner 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### environment. One step along the way would be to 1



### have a cleaner and safer power sector. The 2



### carbon pollution standard as proposed by EPA is 3



### an important part of that progress, but it is 4



### only part of the so lution because it would only 5



### apply to new power plants, and power plants are 6



### not the only source of carbon pollution. 7



### While there may be some strong and 8



### influential voices for weakening the standard, I 9



### say from a religious perspective that it needs to 10



### be strengthened, finalized, and adopted. 11



### Thank you. 12



### MS. CHENG: Thank you. Good afternoon, 13



### ladies and gentlemen. I am Yangyang Cheng, Y

- A

14



### N

- G

- Y

- A

- N

- G, C

- H

- E

- N

- G, Ph.D

. candidate in 15



### physics at University of Chicago. 16



### First of all I would like to express m y 17



### sincere gratitude to the EPA for holding this 18



### public hearing and to Unions of Concerned 19



### Scientists whose help enabled me to be here today 20



### to voice my support for the EPA standards to 21



### limit carbon pollution from new power plants. 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### I am a physicist. If th ere is anything 1



### that my scientific background and training has 2



### taught me is that the facts remain true whether 3



### you're believing them or not. 4 

### [Laughter.} 5



### MS. CHENG: And these are the facts. 6



### First, climate change is happening. Second, 7



### climate change pos es health risks for the general 8



### public. Third, certain human activities, 9



### including carbon emissions from power plants, 10



### contribute to climate change. Climate change is 11



### not an ideology. It is a factual truth. 12



### Environmental protection is not a Democratic 13



### mission or a Republican mission. It is a 14



### universal mission. Clean air is not an 15



### entitlement. It is a human right. 16



### Regulations set in place to preserve the 17



### air we breathe, the land we walk on, and the 18



### world we live in are not impediments for to our 19



### pers onal freedom. They are protections for our 20



### freedom from pollutants, our freedom to be safe 21



### and healthy. 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### The immediate costs of some of these 1



### regulations are not a burden to our economy. 2



### They're investments in our future that bring in 3



### tremendous net bene fits in terms of savings in 4



### medical costs, clean

- up efforts, and human 5



### capital. 6



### More importantly, the regulations serve 7



### as incentives for development of existing forms 8



### of new energy and exploration of new energy 9



### sources where the potential for financial growth 10



### and job creation is infinite. 11



### Since its founding the EPA has performed 12



### its duty of protecting human health and 13



### environment. Every single one of us today is a 14



### beneficiary to that relentless effort. Thank you 15



### so very much. 16



### Just a few weeks ago on March 27th of 17



### this year the EPA released standards to reduce 18



### carbon emissions from new power plants. In spite 19



### of the ongoing attacks from certain politicians 20



### (unintelligible) this is a major step forward. I 21



### applaud the EPA and its partners for their 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### cou rage and conviction, and I sincerely urge that 1



### the Agency will be able to take this effort one 2



### step further to issue emission standards for 3



### existing power plants as well. 4



### While certain industry groups may be 5



### blinded by short

- term financial benefits, the 6



### g overnment is not a for

- profit organization, and 7



### our society is not merely a balance sheet. It is 8



### ultimately about we the people, our sky, our 9



### land, our health. The world we live in and the 10



### world we leave behind. 11



### The environmental footprints we place on 12



### this planet will last beyond any immediate 13



### election cycle. Excessive carbon

- emission

14



### induced climate change is happening under our 15



### watch. It is impacting our lives right now. And 16



### it's part of our civic duty and moral conscience 17



### when we ask ourselves th e question. A heated up 18



### world suffocating under a thick blanket of carbon 19



### -- is that the legacy we want to leave behind to 20



### generations to come? 21



### I am speaking to you here today as a 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### young physicist in training, as a concerned 1



### individual , and as a Chinese girl who came across 2



### the greatest ocean on earth because she believes 3



### in this country and thinks it exceptional. The 4



### very fact the members of the public, including 5



### myself, have the opportunity to voice our support 6



### for the EPA's efforts, this very fact sta nds as a 7



### testament to the strength and character of our 8



### democracy. And let's put this strength and 9



### character to work for a cleaner and safer world. 10



### Thank you very much. 11



### [Applause.] 12



### MS. NOONAN: Thank you. 13



### Up next we have Mitchell Avant and 14



### Virginia Wisdom, please. 15



### And the next pairing just so you're ready 16



### would be Dr. Robert A. Rosenstein and Terry Grace 17



### will be next. 18



### MR. AVANT: Good afternoon . My name is 19



### Mitchell Avant. Last name is A

- V

- A

- N

- T. I live 20



### in Milwaukee, Wisconsin, born and bred ther e. 21



### And one of my

-- why I'm here is about 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### more of a personal nature. Lived in Milwaukee 1



### for 44 years. My family has lived there

-- my 2



### entire family has lived there for the last 40. 3



### And unbeknownst to us

-- and this is what I find 4



### interesting as I start ed delving into this

-- is 5



### that there's a power plant that's like basically 6



### 15 miles away from my mother's home. And I have 7



### a twin sister, and she had a lot of asthma 8



### problems when we were kids. And as people know, 9



### asthma can be a very life

- threatening e xperience. 10



### So just watching that off and on when we were 11



### kids just kind of really

-- 12



### It is interesting because Milwaukee is an 13



### industrial city. I mean, there's a lot of 14



### plants, a lot of emissions being delivered into 15



### the ozone. And the environment's no t conducive, 16



### I think, for

-- at least I don't believe for our 17



### people to breathe. And I believe that, you know, 18



### watching my sister go in and out of the hospital, 19



### taking medication

-- I have a niece and nephew 20



### who are also asthmatic as well. And in fact, m y 21



### sister wound up moving closer to the plant that 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### I'm going to discuss with you. 1



### The plant is called the Valley Plant. 2



### It's in the center of Milwaukee, Wisconsin. It's 3



### a predominantly African

- American and Hispanic 4



### community. This particular plant has b een under 5



### some conversation or rather attention regarding 6



### its quality of emissions that it's putting out. 7



### And, quite frankly, it's not meeting the levels 8



### that basically you guys are saying standard. I 9



### believe the new standards that you guys have is 10



### 1,000 pounds per CO 2 

### megawatt an hour, which is up 11



### as part of our proposal. 12



### And the reason I'm talking about this 13



### plant is that I believe this type of plant should 14



### not be in the city like that. It shouldn't. I 15



### think that should have better standards. I thin k 16



### it should go to gas versus coal. 17



### I know it's an older facility, and I know 18



### we're discussing newer facilities, but this is 19



### staring everybody right in the face. So my 20



### concern is that we address the new facilities but 21



### we also look at the old ones that are basically 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### not meeting the standards that are needed. 1



### So, that being said, my personal issue is 2



### that we talk about jobs; we talk about

-- you 3



### know, we talk about jobs; we talk about this; we 4



### talk about that; and at the end of the day it's a 5



### business, but to me it's more of a moral issue 6



### that people

-- this is something that people 7



### should say, okay, you have the right to live 8



### longer, and for the fact that we're here talking 9



### about it, and these companies aren't doing the 10



### right thing to meet the standards is just mind 11



### boggling. 12



### So, that's all I have to say. Thank you. 13



### MS. NOONAN: Thank you. Ms. Wisdom? 14



### MS. WISDOM: My name is Virginia Wisdom. 15



### That's V

- I

- R

- G

- I

- N

- I

- A, last name is Wisdom, W

- I

16



### S

- D

- O

- M. I live in Naperville, Illinois, and I 17



### grew up in Gary, Indiana, where the coal plants 18



### there not only power residential use but also 19



### power the steel mills. 20



### I thank you for this opportunity to tell 21



### you how we live and how we die. I was born on a 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### farm and moved to Gary, Indiana, as a small child 1



### with my paren ts. My parents believed that city 2



### life would give me great advantages. Gary had 3



### wonderful schools. Gary had a world

- class 4



### Carnegie library. My neighborhood in Gary had a 5



### sense of community where neighbors cared for each 6



### other and tried to help each oth er out as much as 7



### they possibly could, but there was one thing that 8



### we could not avoid, one thing that we could not 9



### help each other out with

-- cancer. Cancer was 10



### the Grim Reaper that pervaded every aspect of our 11



### world in the form of the coal dust polluti on that 12



### fell constantly in every corner. 13



### As young children we liked to play 14



### outside; however, when the sky got yellow, the 15



### rotten egg smell was so bad that our mothers 16



### called us inside in futile hopes of avoiding the 17



### worst of it. 18



### On warm days we had outd oor picnics; 19



### however, we had to keep the food covered, and we 20



### had to wash down the picnic tables about every 15 21



### minutes because that was about how long it took 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### for everything to get covered up with the filthy 1



### black soot. 2



### In winter it snowed nearly every d ay. We 3



### had a lot of late effect snow storms in Gary that 4



### did not fall anywhere else. There was another 5



### thing notable about our snow. Within about 15 6



### minutes it turned black. When it fell on our 7



### cars, when we wiped it off, it would actually 8



### scratch the cars' paint. If the soot would do 9



### that to paint, can you imagine what it did to our 10



### lungs? 11



### I moved to Illinois for college and 12



### eventually opened a chain of health clubs where I 13



### took detailed health histories on thousands of 14



### people. I also stayed in touc h with my Gary, 15



### Indiana, community. In my experience as both 16



### owner of a chain of health clubs in the western 17



### suburbs of Chicago and as a collector of vital 18



### statistics from my Gary, Indiana, high school 19



### class, it is obvious that the cancer rates for my 20



### for mer classmates is drastically higher than 21



### those for my health club clientele of the same 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### age. 1



### The average American lives to age 87. 2



### Nearly 25 percent of my classmates developed 3



### cancer in middle age , mostly those who were born 4



### in Gary and lived there all their lives. If I 5



### had not moved away from Gary, I, too, would 6



### probably have cancer. 7



### Many of those Garyites who got cancer at 8



### an early age represent the very brightest and the 9



### best. Let me introduce to you to some of them. 10



### My class valedictorian was Ros alie Berger. 11



### Rosalie became a lawyer and did extensive civil 12



### rights litigation. She developed cancer at age 13



### 52. She nearly died, but fortunately she is 14



### still here 10 years later. 15



### Doris Vanhorn was not as fortunate. She 16



### was a world

- class athlete. As a child she stood 17



### up to bullies, and as an adult she stood up for 18



### human rights. Even on her deathbed she was 19



### writing letters to her Congressman asking for an 20



### end to the war in Iraq. She died of cancer at 21



### age 56. 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### Marty Szymanski was about the handsomest 1



### b oy I ever saw. He sang with me in the church 2



### choir. He sang like an angel, and now he 3



### probably is an angel. He died of cancer at age 4



### 57. 5



### Christine Davis was the President of the 6



### Student Council and also Chairman of my church 7



### youth group at the same tim e. She had 8



### outstanding leadership skills. She died of 9



### cancer in a nursing home at age 55. Her family 10



### said she had been in such terrible shape and so 11



### much pain for so long that her death was actually 12



### a blessing. 13



### MS. NOONAN: Ms. Wisdom. 14



### MS. WISDOM: Th ank you. 15



### MS. NOONAN: Thank you. 16



### Ma'am, we would be happy to take your 17



### written comments if you want to submit them. 18



### MS. WISDOM: Thank you. 19



### Dr. Rosenstein? 20



### DR. ROSENSTEIN: Yes, my name is Dr. Bob 21



### Rosenstein. I'm here as representing myself, but 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### I' m here as a concerned citizen, an 1



### environmentalist, and as a scientist from the 2



### disciplines of physics and chemistry. I'm a 3



### member of different organizations like the Union 4



### of Concerned Scientists, the Sierra Club, Chicago 5



### Consult on Science and Technolog y, American 6



### Chemical Society, American Physical Society, but 7



### I just want to present my perspective on carbon, 8



### how I feel it impacts climate change and what we 9



### have to do to help resolve this issue to mitigate 10



### this global climate crisis. 11



### Now, carbon to me is an integral part of 12



### the tapestry of our universe. It's certainly 13



### been part of the structure of earth since the 14



### earth was formed billions years ago. We had 15



### carbon in the crust and in the atmosphere where 16



### it's

-- in pre

- industrial times we had a 17



### concen tration of carbon dioxide of 350 parts per 18



### million. We know that if the carbon dioxide 19



### concentration in the atmosphere goes appreciably 20



### below that value you will have a deep freeze, and 21



### you won't be able to survive. If it goes above 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### it, we're going to ba ke and we won't be able to 1



### survive either. So natural processes over 2



### periods of years have brought the carbon dioxide 3



### to about 350 ppm, but because of our addiction to 4



### f ossil fuels we're now up to 389 parts per 5



### million and a rising global mean temperature

. 6



### And that has terrible consequences for the planet 7



### earth and our citizens everywhere. 8



### You know, for example, we have these 9



### decaying water supply. We have these terrible 10



### natural disasters like flooding which impacted 11



### Pakistan. We had the forest fires i n Israel and 12



### in Russia. We had the heat wave in Europe which 13



### led to the loss of thousands of lives, and we 14



### really have to mitigate this growth of CO 2 

### and try 15



### and keep it as close to the natural levels as 16



### possible. 17



### I know on Monday evening President Obama 18



### went to Joplin, Missouri, to speak at the high 19



### school ceremony for 190 people who died as a 20



### result of the terrible tornado which our experts 21



### will tell us the tornado strength is intensified 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### by the climate change. And we certainly know 1



### that Katrina was au gmented by the increasing 2



### temperature of the Gulf waters, and these are 3



### things which are going to terribly exacerbate our 4



### culture. 5



### Now, the Director of the (unintelligible) 6



### happened in California's agency (unintelligible) 7



### new carbon neutral r e newables say s we're head ed 8



### towards the CO 2 

### concentration of 440 parts per 9



### million which means that we may not be able to 10



### sustain any viable civilization if we reach that 11



### high . How do we avert that? 12



### I think the EPA regulations to keep the 13



### CO 2 

### levels at the lowest p ossible on a nationwide 14



### scale is going to help. And I think by setting 15



### the house in order this way it would help to 16



### improve community health, and we're going to be 17



### able to outreach also to other countries which 18



### are put ting on line these coal

- fired power p lants 19



### to

-- which threatened to destroy the climate 20



### resiliency. 21



### One example I can give you is China 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### because we had

-- at the Chicago Council on 1



### Science and Technology last March

-- a discussion 2



### o f the energy issues with China. The Chinese 3



### Council people told us that 60 percent of their 4



### electricity is generated by coal and they're 5



### desperate for new forms of renewable energy. So 6



### if we show the way and cut down our emissions, we 7



### can work along with the Chinese and these other 8



### countries to mitigate the level of CO 2 

### and bring 9



### (unintelligible) 440 parts per million. 10



### We don't want to see our coastal regions 11



### flooded. We don't want to see these massive 12



### migrations. We don’t want to see our water 13



### supplies polluted. And so let us implement 14



### these regulations and move expeditiously to bring 15



### on line wind, solar, geothermal, hydrogen in our 16



### electricity generation and also in our 17



### transportation center. And that way I think we 18



### can really be a light for the nation and help the 19



### other countries of the world move this way, too. 20



### So, that's my perspective. And carbon is 21



### not evil if you keep it within the natural levels 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### by natural processes, and we all need it. It's 1



### part of our bodies , but we cannot let the levels 2



### build up because we (unintelligible). 3



### So, thank you for you r time and the 4



### regulations (unintelligible) impact , and I 5



### certainly respect President Obama for introducing 6



### th ese to help our country move forward and bring 7



### the rest of the world along with us. Thank you. 8



### MS. NOONAN: Thank you. Mr. Grace? 9



### MR. GRACE: Hello. My name is Terry 10



### Grace. I'm a citizen of Oak Park. I am 11



### testifying primarily as a private citizen but I 12



### am in the Sierra Club

. 13



### I want ed to thank the EPA for granting us 14



### the opportunity to

-- for public comments on the 15



### carbon pollution standards for our country. The 16



### EPA is a vanguard of protection against polluters 17



### and for the public welfare upon whom we all 18



### depend. 19



### Thank you for your service to our country 20



### in spite of significant political, litigious, and 21



### the economic pressures ( unintelligible) against 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### your agency. 1



### There are massive amounts of information 2



### indicating the negative effects of carbon 3



### pollution upon our environment, our health, and 4



### the weather. That said, it remains difficult for 5



### the average person to relate to the to the

-- 6



### this i ssue on a personal, tangible level. 7



### I have a personal experience of the 8



### impact of carbon emissions that I have seen over 9



### time that I'd like to share. We bought a 10



### vacation home in the Upper Peninsula of Michigan 11



### in 1986. At the time we bought our cottage , the 12



### summer highs were generally in the low 80's and 13



### the locals would complain about how uncomfortable 14



### it was in those days. Air conditioning was 15



### almost nonexistent up there at the time because 16



### there was no need for it. 17



### Snow routinely covered the ground for 18



### (unintelligible) throughout most of the winter. 19



### The lakes and the water table were routinely 20



### replenished by the cycle of heavy snows in the 21



### winter and rain throughout the rest of the year. 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### Temperatures in the north woods began to slowly 1



### rise about 15 years ago. 2



### The first time some of our friends used 3



### our cottage and talked about how hot it was 4



### during their visit, we were amazed. They 5



### reported temperatures in the 90's. No one had 6



### experienced temperatures that high up there. 7



### Then we experienced a fe w scattered days of 8



### similar temperatures. This had been unheard of 9



### in the UP. 10



### Air conditioning is now common in 11



### businesses and in some homes. The area 12



### experiences routine summer temperatures in the 13



### 80's now and occasional days in the 90's every 14



### year. 15



### We went to our cottage this past weekend 16



### to open it up for the season. On Saturday the 17



### high for the area reached 90 degrees, surely a 18



### record for May 19th in the North Woods. 19



### Seven years ago a phenomena began to 20



### occur in the North Woods. In the Land of L akes 21



### we began to have droughts. This began with 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### warmer winters and diminished snowfall followed 1



### by minimal rainfall. This pattern continued for 2



### five consecutive years. 3



### The World Snowmobile Dirty Race held 4



### annually in Eagle River, Wisconsin, 20 miles 5



### sou th of us, was actually canceled due to a lack 6



### of snow at least once, maybe twice. I’m not sure 7



### about that. 8



### The diminished snowfall took away a 9



### primary source of precipitation from the North 10



### Woods, and the lake level started dropping, 11



### eventually dramati cally. The end of our dock 12



### stood in one or two inches of water. Boats were 13



### beached. And the biggest lake in our area, Lac 14



### Vieux Desert , the water level dropped so low that 15



### boats could not get out to the water. Some 16



### resorts built piers extending 100 fee t out 17



### further into the lake to accommodate boats. 18



### The trees in the North Woods have been 19



### weakened from the increased heat and drought 20



### conditions. Our cottage is on a lake called 21



### Birch Lake. The contrast around the lake of 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### green conifers, other deciduous trees, and live 1



### birches was beautiful. The demise live birches 2



### was mostly attributed to the birch borer. That 3



### nemesis had been around for a while, but 4



### seemingly they became more volatile. 5



### The prolific birch trees around our lake 6



### now are almost gone. P eople have asked me, why 7



### did they name it Birch Lake. There are no birch 8



### trees around here. 9



### There has been an increase in storms with 10



### high winds as well. Combined with the trees' 11



### weakened conditions, blow downs have become 12



### somewhat common up there. W e have experienced a 13



### sharp increase of downed trees on our own 14



### property. We have also begun to see the loss of 15



### the beautiful hemlocks of the North Woods. The 16



### hemlocks are dying of diseases or are being blown 17



### down at a pace never seen before. It's a sad 18



### process to watch. All of these issues appear to 19



### be related to climate change as stimulated by 20



### excessive CO 2 

### levels. 21



### In summary I'd like to say that in my 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### opinion the effects of massive CO 2 

### emissions on 1



### our environments are substantial, costly, and 2



### potent ially irrevocable. The ultimate impacts on 3



### these emissions are not totally clear to us, but 4



### few appear to be beneficial to our country, our 5



### economy, our environment, and to our people. 6



### I appeal to you, the representatives of 7



### the EPA, to take the next act ion available to you 8



### to reverse this dangerous path we are on at this 9



### time. My personal experiences in the Upper 10



### Peninsula of Michigan tell me that time is of the 11



### essence. Please approve the stronger carbon 12



### pollution standards for new power plants as 13



### qui ckly as possible. 14



### Thank you for your time and the 15



### opportunity to present my concerns. 16



### MS. NOONAN: Thank you both very much. 17



### Ann Schultz and Verena Owen, please? 18



### MS. SCHULTZ: Hello. I think I will be 19



### quite brief. I want to speak about the refinery 20



### w hich

-- 21



### MS. NOONAN: Can you first start with 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### your name and how you spell it? 1



### MS. SCHULTZ: Oh, I'm sorry. Ann 2



### Schultz. I'm a private citizen, also a member of 3



### the National Wildlife Federation, and the first 4



### that I heard about this refinery (unintellig ible) 5



### which already had the fourth largest refinery in 6



### the United States there. What they're going to 7



### do is to increase it to become the sixth

-- to 8



### contain the sixth largest refinery in the United 9



### States. So in other words absolutely 10



### (unintelligible) no t skip a beat in their work. 11



### They assured Chicago that there would be no toxic 12



### sludge coming into Lake Michigan. 13



### Of course they lied. Everybody knew they 14



### lied, including the State of Indiana which 15



### colluded and said that the toxic waste would be 16



### so sma ll as to be not even measureable. 17



### So, the first I really heard of it was 18



### when Mayor Daly had thousands of us out signing 19



### petitions. And he had never done anything like 20



### that before. High school students, senior 21



### citizens, everybody was out there on the beaches 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### signing these petitions for Mayor Daly, that they 1



### should not be allowed to expand this refinery. 2



### I thought, okay, it's going to be all 3



### right, but of course, Mayor Daly generally gets 4



### what he wants. Well, in this case he failed to 5



### get what he want ed. 6



### As was predictable, of course, BP has

-- 7



### well, the amount of money it has is unbelievable. 8



### So they built their refinery. And sure enough

, 9



### toxic sludge did come. All our beaches were 10



### closed a great deal that summer and the 11



### subsequent summer, and it w as not surprising. It 12



### could have been stopped. And, oh, please, I hope 13



### you're stopping all of this. It's so awful. 14



### It's killing the wildlife. It's killing the 15



### fish. It's damaging us. I heard the very moving 16



### testimony of the person who knew all these people 17



### who died of cancer. We've got to put a stop to 18



### what's going on. 19



### The other thing I wanted to talk briefly 20



### about

-- and I hope I'm not too incoherent, but 21



### the polar bears

-- I love polar bears , always 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### have. And what I think everybody here has 1



### prob ably seen that Wrangel Island and that 2



### there's no longer enough ice to support the 3



### weight of the adult polar bear. So they're 4



### trapped on that tiny little piece of ice until 5



### they can move on. And there's going to be less 6



### and less and less and less until i t's not going 7



### to be too long before we have no polar bears 8



### anymore. 9



### But the cruelty of it, the cruelty of it 10



### is so horrible that they don't care at all about 11



### these animals. They don't care at all about us, 12



### about what's happening with the global warming, 13



### what's happening to the ice caps. 14



### And for me, the metaphor for the whole 15



### thing really is

-- in these polar bears in this 16



### ever shrinking little piece of ice that they have 17



### to stand on. And so I just wanted to come and 18



### tell you do something about the polar bears, 19



### please. 20



### [Laughter.] 21



### MS. SCHULTZ: So that's all I have to 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### say. 1



### MS. NOONAN: Thank you. Please stay. 2



### Please stay. 3



### Go ahead. No, stay, stay. 4



### MS. SCHULTZ: Oh, stay. Oh, okay. 5



### MS. OWEN: Good afternoon. I didn't get 6



### the right shirt, but I' m wearing the right color, 7



### so

-- thanks

-- 8



### MS. NOONAN: And your name your

-- 9



### MS. OWEN: Yes, I will get to that. 10



### Thanks for being here today. 11



### My name is Verena Owen, and I am a 12



### concerned citizen, a wife, a mother. And in my 13



### spare time I am the volunt eer coordinator of the 14



### Sierra Club's Beyond Coal Campaign. 15



### Sierra Club was founded in 18 92 and now 16



### has over 1.4 million members and supporters and 17



### is the oldest and largest environmental 18



### organization in the nation. 19



### I came today to add my voice to the bro ad 20



### coalition of 1.3 million people who already e

21



### mailed you, wrote to you, or spoken to you in 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### support of the proposed carbon pollution standard 1



### for new coal

- fired power plants. 2



### Just this past weekend my son graduated 3



### from college with a degree in chemist ry and 4



### physics, with a minor in physics, and in his 5



### college application he stated that he wanted to 6



### go to college to get some skill so he can move 7



### this country into a better future and that all 8



### young people

-- and I'm so glad to see so many 9



### young faces her e in the audience

-- that all you 10



### people hoped to change the world, and like all 11



### mothers, I believe he will. 12



### Ten years ago when my son was still in 13



### grade school, I was the person

-- for a while the 14



### only volunteer on the (unintelligible) Beyond 15



### Coal Campai gn. 16



### In the last decade over 200 new proposed 17



### -- over 200 new coal

- fired power plants were 18



### proposed, but only a handful of them were built. 19



### The Beyond Coal Campaign envisions that no new 20



### coal plants will be built, that we will see the 21



### retirement of old coa l, and their replacement by 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### clean energy. And we are also working to keep 1



### coal in the ground and out of the markets. 2



### The 200 coal plants did not get built 3



### really, in retrospect, does not come as a big 4



### surprise to me. They were rejected by ordinary 5



### citiz ens, by grandparents, by moms and dads, and 6



### students who didn't want to live with more 7



### pollution in their lives and instead want a 8



### cleaner, and better, and healthier future for 9



### their families. 10



### Small business owners realize that 11



### reliance on big coal does n ot offer them a good 12



### deal. New coal plants have been rejected by 13



### legislators, regulators, and utility boards 14



### realizing that exposing their ratepayers with 15



### ever increasing costs after 31 years of coal

16



### fired generation was not a good deal, but cleaner 17



### and m ore cost

- effective alternatives are already 18



### available. 19



### For instance, in Illinois just recently 20



### voters in many communities have opted to support 21



### community aggregation that would be 100 percent 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### from renewable energy sources. Political leaders 1



### have stepped up who saw the opportunity for their 2



### states to become the 21st century leader in the 3



### clean energy field. And finally, even financial 4



### backers backed away and did not want to be 5



### exposed to the fact that coal is no longer 6



### competitive in price to greener alte rnatives. 7



### As a matter of fact, since 2008 and all 8



### the years my son was in college, not a single new 9



### coal plant broke ground legally. 10



### The proposed new carbon pollution 11



### standard mars but it does not cause the end of 12



### business as usual for electric generati on from 13



### coal. The Supreme Court concluded that carbon 14



### pollution is a threat to human health. EPA found 15



### that carbon pollution endangers the public health 16



### and welfare. And people from all kind of 17



### backgrounds and all kinds of interests agree. 18



### By following the law and issuing the 19



### proposed rule EPA has taken an important first 20



### step to safeguard our families and communities, 21



### and, indeed, our planet from pollution that, as 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### you will hear many times today from regular 1



### citizens, from scientists, from nurses and 2



### d octors is linked to a rise in temperature and 3



### all the dire consequences. I was very moved by 4



### the gentleman from Michigan. I happened to walk 5



### in the room and he talked about how his world has 6



### changed, and Ann's passion for the polar bears 7



### was really telli ng, too. 8



### And that also leads to an ever

- increasing 9



### level of unhealthy smog. I tell my kids that if 10



### you're in a hole, stop digging. So the next step 11



### is to address carbon pollution from existing 12



### sources. My son and his three brothers and one 13



### is working f or public safety, one is a political 14



### organizer, and one is in Afghanistan. One will 15



### either be a diplomat or a DJ, depending. 16



### [Laughter.] 17



### MS. OWEN: They and I

-- both understand 18



### the challenge s and opportunities that new clean 19



### energy future will bring to this country. 20



### Can I have 30 seconds to wrap up ? 21



### MS. NOONAN: If you'd like . O ne 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### sentence, and then we'll take the rest for the 1



### record. 2



### MS. OWEN: I totally support the rule. 3



### [Laughter.] 4



### MS. NOONAN: Great. Thank you very much. 5



### Andrew Clarke and Pam ela Ortner? And 6



### then on deck we'll have Charlotte Des Jardins and 7



### Kevin Kuhn, please. 8



### Mr. Clarke, would you like to start? 9



### MR. CLARKE: Hi, my name is Andrew 10



### Clarke, and I’m a concerned citizen and I also 11



### volunteer with the Sierra Club. 12



### Well, I am now a small business 13



### consultant in Chicago. I have a Ph.D. in 14



### materials science from the University of 15



### Wisconsin. I also did post

- doctoral studies at 16



### Cornell University, British Columbia, and 17



### University of Washington. I was not a 18



### climatologist, but I do hav e formal training in 19



### physics and chemistry. 20



### I first heard about the idea of climate 21



### change in the late 1980's when I still worked in 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### science. At the time I remember I thought the 1



### idea was interesting, but I was not worried since 2



### it seemed so far off. Bu t over the past 25 years 3



### I followed the debate, and I have become 4



### increasingly concerned. 5



### The scientific evidence is now 6



### overwhelming that we are affecting the earth's 7



### climate through burning fossil fuels, 8



### deforestation, and other practices. 9



### For approxim ately 800,000 years the 10



### global average carbon dioxide level in the 11



### atmosphere was below 300 parts per million. 12



### Beginning approximately 250 years ago, roughly 13



### coinciding with the start of the industrial 14



### revolution, carbon dioxide began increasing. The 15



### lev el now stands at about 393 parts per million. 16



### In an early paper Dr. James Hansen 17



### estimated a safe of carbon dioxide in the 18



### atmosphere was about 450 parts per million. Then 19



### a few years ago, based on a detailed look at 20



### historical data from ice core samples and other 21



### sources, he revised his estimate downward from 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### 450 to 350. This threshold of 350 parts per 1



### million is now accepted by most scientists as the 2



### maximum level at which our earth's climate is 3



### stable. 4



### We are now 43 par ts per million above 5



### this leve l and climbing every year. Furthermore, 6



### the rate of increase is itself increasing. In 7



### the 1960's the average rate of increase was 1 8



### part per million per year. Today the average 9



### yearly increase is over 2 parts per million. 10



### At some point carbon emissions will reach 11



### a tipping point where the rate of increase goes 12



### out of control. The point where this happens is 13



### not certain, but if it does happen, civilization 14



### as we know it will be in danger from rising sea 15



### levels, violent storms, flooding, droughts, and 16



### sp ecies extinctions due to loss of natural 17



### habitats. The tipping point may be as little as 18



### 50 years from now if we continue on our present 19



### course. 20



### Well, there's strong evidence that 21



### climate change is being caused by man, and it is 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### getting worse. Our count ry is not addressing the 1



### core problem in any meaningful way. The carbon 2



### pollution standard would be an important step in 3



### the right direction. It will either force new 4



### coal power plants to invest in new technologies 5



### to reduce carbon emissions or change to lower 6



### carbon intensive power sources. The ruling will 7



### effectively increase demand for wind, solar, and 8



### energy efficiency. 9



### I live in a high

- rise condo along Lake 10



### Shore Drive in downtown Chicago. Over the past 11



### few years the weather has become more extrem e

-- 12



### higher wind speeds, more violent thunderstorms, 13



### warmer days and nights, especially during the 14



### spring and fall. This past winter was one of the 15



### warmest winters in history, and in March we broke 16



### several records for high temperatures. 17



### I grew up on the east coast, and I have 18



### friends all across the United States. No matter 19



### where I go, people tell me stories about how the 20



### weather is getting crazy. 21



### The fossil fuel industry will fight every 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### new regulation proposed by the EPA. They will 1



### say this regulatio n will destroy jobs, but what 2



### they will not say is that it should lead to new 3



### jobs and even new industries. Studies show that 4



### new coal power plants create fewer jobs than 5



### solar power plants or wind turbines. The carbon 6



### pollution standard should lead to a net increase 7



### in jobs in our country. 8



### By helping to level the playing field for 9



### non fossil fuels, it will begin to reduce our 10



### country's carbon emissions, which will, in turn, 11



### help slow down climate change. The effect of 12



### increase in carbon dioxide in the atmosphere is 13



### not just a local or a regional problem. It's a 14



### global problem. The United States is still the 15



### economic leader. We may have lost ground 16



### recently during the recession, but we can 17



### recover. The carbon pollution standard will help 18



### us get our e conomy back on track by shifting 19



### investments toward low carbon energy sources 20



### leading to new technologies and new jobs. This 21



### is not just good for the environment, but it's 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### good for the economy. 1



### Thank you. 2



### MS. NOONAN: And can you spell your last 3



### name, t oo? 4



### MR. CLARKE: Clarke, C

- L

- A

- R

- K

- E. 5



### MS. NOONAN: Thank you. Ms. Ortner? 6



### MS. ORTNER: Good afternoon. I didn't 7



### wear the right colored shirt, but I have the same 8



### color heart. 9



### [Laughter.] 10



### MS. ORTNER: Good afternoon. My name is 11



### Pamela Ortner, and I' m the Michigan Environmental 12



### Health Nurse Advocate for Health Care Without 13



### Harm. I am a public health nurse advocate and 14



### educator. Health Care Without Harm is an 15



### international coalition of more than 430 16



### organizations in 52 countries working to 17



### transform the health care sector worldwide 18



### without compromising patient safety or care so 19



### that it is ecologically sustainable and no longer 20



### a source of harm to public health and the 21



### environment. 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### If you remember the campaign a few years 1



### ago, the medical waste incine rators were closed 2



### as a result of Health Care Without Harm's work as 3



### well as reducing the incidence of mercury 4



### thermometers and sphygmomanometers in hospitals 5



### and in health care. 6



### I appreciate this opportunity to comment 7



### on the proposed carbon pollution st andard that 8



### will limit carbon pollution for new power plants. 9



### Health Care Without Harm supports the 10



### Environmental Protection Agency's efforts to 11



### protect the public's health through the 12



### implementation of this rule. I am in strong and 13



### support of this EPA an d this administration who, 14



### without both, we would not be here at this 15



### hearing. We would not have the promulgation of 16



### this rule. Thank you very much. 17



### This first

- ever national industrial 18



### carbon pollution standard for new power plants is 19



### essential to prote ct public health. By advancing 20



### several cleaner safeguards that address carbon, 21



### mercury, soot, smog, and other toxic pollutants, 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### the EPA is holding big polluters accountable and 1



### protecting our kids and families from deadly, 2



### dangerous air pollution. 3



### As of today more than one million 4



### comments

-- that's historical, by the way

-- have 5



### been generated in support of this carbon rule 6



### Health providers and advocates, families, 7



### community members, environmental advocates, and 8



### industry leaders have added their voice o f 9



### support to this rule, as have nurses. 10



### I brought over 350 cards supporting this 11



### rule from nurses and community members in my 12



### community that I have collected. 13



### Carbon pollution is most dangerous for 14



### children and the most vulnerable of our 15



### population. R ising temperatures are likely to 16



### increase smog pollution, which will be a trigger 17



### for asthma attacks and can cause permanent damage 18



### to and reduce the function of a child's lungs. 19



### Asthma is a chronic, often debilitating condition 20



### that has no cure. During an asthma episode the 21



### airways become constricted and swollen. The 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### chest goes very tight, and it becomes very 1



### difficult to breathe. I'm sure you all remember 2



### the fish out of the fish bowl commercial. 3



### Data from the Centers for Disease Control 4



### have prevent ion and from the American Lung 5



### Association detailed prevalence and costs of 6



### asthma in the United States. In 2008 almost 7



### 700,000 children had to go to the emergency room 8



### because of asthma. The total estimated 9



### incremental direct cost of asthma in the Unite d 10



### States is more than $53 billion a year. 11



### But we can't forget the personal cost 12



### either. As a nurse for over

-- I'll say it

-- 35 13



### years, I'll never forget the face of a child with 14



### asthma gasping for air. Ask any nurse. They'll 15



### tell you of the impacts of ozone alert days and 16



### really hot days and the affect it has on people 17



### in our communities and our children. 18



### Parents, most often mothers, must have 19



### ways to stay home with their child who is ill. 20



### And I experienced that when I had a young child 21



### many moons ag o who had asthma. And it can be a 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### financial hardship, but if the home doesn't have 1



### air conditioning, the child still will be exposed 2



### to unhealthy air. 3



### According to the CDC

, asthma episodes 4



### keep children out of school about 10.5 million 5



### lost school days i n 2008 and takes adults out of 6



### the workplace, accounting for more than 14 7



### million lost work days in 2008. An estimated 7 8



### million children and over 17 million Americans in 9



### the U.S. have asthma. As you know, we're 10



### suffering. And our cost

-- the direct cos t of 11



### asthma in Michigan is almost $2 billion. 12



### Children, however, are not the only ones 13



### negatively impacted. Exposure to carbon dioxide 14



### increases the likelihood that seniors with health 15



### problems would be hospitalized. The elderly, 16



### those most likely to ha ve heart and lung 17



### ailments, those who already have diminished lung 18



### capacity, and those who are poor and live in more 19



### highly polluted areas will be disproportionately 20



### affected. 21



### We know there is very little scientific 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### debate about the harmful effects of cli mate 1



### change. The proposed rule will save lives, 2



### protect the health of millions, and bring about 3



### an action that is long overdue. We can and must 4



### act to ensure we protect the most vulnerable 5



### among us. 6



### Thank you very much. 7



### MS. NOONAN: Thank you both. An d we can 8



### -- 9



### MS. ORTNER: And I brou ght the cards in a 10



### Sa nders bag which is an ice cream company that's 11



### indigenous to Michigan. 12



### [Laughter.] 13



### Do you want the cards? 14



### MS. NOONAN: Yes, please. 15



### MS. ORTNER: If you would have said no, 16



### I'd put them back. 17



### MS. NOONAN: Charlotte Des Jardins. 18



### MS. DES JARDINS: Jardins. 19



### MS. NOONAN: Say again? 20



### MS. DES JARDINS: De Jardins. 21



### MS. NOONAN: And Kevin Kuhn. 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### MS. DES JARDINS: Hi. Well, I see 1



### there's a lot of people here today. And, you 2



### know, as you can tell, I'm probably the oldest

-- 3



### well, one of the oldest people here. 4



### [Laughter.] 5



### MS. DES JARDINS: And so, that means that 6



### I've been through hundreds of hearings just like 7



### this, sometimes with thousands of people, at the 8



### local level, at the state level, and at th e 9



### national level on all kinds of issues that 10



### everybody

-- not just those that are here today

- 11



### - but the thousands of people that are going to 12



### be impacted by the proposals that are being made. 13



### Over the years I've done this all through 14



### my adult life. On ed ucation, on mental health, 15



### on health care, and the environment, and all 16



### kinds of things. 17



### And most of the time that I've been at 18



### these hearings, I've been there complaining. I 19



### mean, you know, isn't that how it usually goes? 20



### We're there to complain becaus e the government or 21



### somebody in some public agency is about to do 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### something that's really going to harm people and 1



### hurt people. 2



### So, here, for the first time I find that 3



### really there's cause for congratulations, and 4



### cause for celebrations, and cause to say thank 5



### you for doing something right, doing the right 6



### thing, doing something that's really going to 7



### help all of us, all of our family members, and 8



### everybody, not just in Illinois but really all 9



### over the country. So, thank you. And I wish you 10



### to continue to do the right thing. 11



### That's it. 12



### [Applause.] 13



### MS. NOONAN: Thank you. 14



### MR. KUHN: Hi, my name is Kevin Kuhn, 15



### last name is spelled K

- U

- H

- N. I'm a member of 16



### the Sierra Club and the Environmental Justice 17



### Alliance of the Southside of Chicago, and truly 18



### g rateful that I have an Environmental Protection 19



### Agency that is looking out for my health. Thank 20



### you for organizing this hearing today in Chicago. 21



### Thank you for the important work that you do. 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### I am personally involved in environmental 1



### activist work in my neighborhood on the Southside 2



### of Chicago, and I'd like to think of you, my EPA, 3



### as my role models, my heroes of hope. I am 4



### encouraged by your environmental activism. High 5



### fives to you. 6



### You are now making this historic step by 7



### creating the first ever lim its on carbon 8



### pollution from new power plants. Wow. These 9



### welcome new standards will help us to make the 10



### transition to use more renewable energy sources 11



### such as solar and wind power. It is hopeful to 12



### drive through rural Illinois and Indiana and see 13



### the tall white windmills that are using renewable 14



### energy. It is hopeful to drive along 109th 15



### Street in the West Pullman area and near my 16



### Southside neighborhood and see the largest solar 17



### farm in the country in use. 18



### These new EPA carbon pollution standards 19



### wil l help clean up and modernize the way we power 20



### our country. This will spark more innovation in 21



### clean energy technologies that create good 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### American jobs. 1



### I do not buy some polluters claims that 2



### our EPA safeguards hurt jobs. I do not trust 3



### polluters to po lice themselves. I count on my 4



### EPA to protect me from dangerous carbon pollution 5



### and the dangerous lies that some would like to 6



### spin about the safety of clean coal. We are 7



### working on that goal together today. This is 8



### very inspiring. 9



### For many years I wo rked as a public nurse 10



### for a local health department here in Illinois. 11



### I worked with people that had immigrated from 12



### countries that do not have a strong public health 13



### system or an enlightened EPA like I do here with 14



### you. 15



### My clients had respiratory illn esses from 16



### serious air pollution in their native country or 17



### pulmonary tuberculosis from lack of an adequate 18



### public health system. 19



### We have this opportunity today to prevent 20



### human suffering here in our USA with these new 21



### carbon standards. We must show the world that we 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### are serious about cleaning up our own back yard. 1



### We must stop being a world leader in carbon 2



### pollution. Thank you for leading us out of this 3



### mess. 4



### I also worked for many years as a public 5



### school teacher. I taught social studies, and 6



### clima te change was discussed in my classroom. It 7



### can be difficult for young people to know what a 8



### person can do about such a complicated problem. 9



### We must give them examples of what they can do. 10



### This is what we are doing here today. 11



### I acknowledge the young p eople that are 12



### speaking today. They see the strong connection 13



### between our U.S. carbon pollution and global 14



### climate change. 15



### I also coached cross country and track 16



### for many years. I have seen some scary asthma 17



### attacks. Any person suffering from asthma do es 18



### not need the life

- threatening air pollutants like 19



### dirty soot, toxic mercury, and the smog that 20



### comes from carbon pollution and, in particular, 21



### coal plants. 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### And speaking of coal plants, I am 1



### involved in my neighborhood in efforts to prevent 2



### a new coal g asification plant from moving in, 3



### commonly known as Leucadia. My Southside 4



### neighbors and I intend to stop this Leucadia 5



### plant from more coal pollution in our own 6



### community. 7



### Now I realize that these new EPA 8



### standards are intended for new power plants only

. 9



### Leucadia is not a power plant. Leucadia would 10



### like to use coal to create synthetic natural gas; 11



### however, I am connecting the dots here. 12



### We need to move B eyond C oal in our 13



### country in whatever way coal may be used. We 14



### must stop our use of this cheap f orm of fossil 15



### fuel. I am hopeful that these new EPA 16



### protections from carbon pollution will have a 17



### ripple effect on our country's use of coal in any 18



### form. I support you in setting the standard and 19



### moving us beyond our heavy dependence on coal. 20



### And just to be clear, I am wearing an I 21



### heart clean air dark blue T

- shirt along with many 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### others here in this room. We are not the ones 1



### who showed up today because of an ad on 2



### Craigslist with the promise of $50 and a free 3



### lunch. We're here for clean air and our kids. 4



### [Laughter.] 5



### MR. KUHN: Today is a good example of 6



### working together with my EPA to move beyond our 7



### dependence on coal and beyond just good 8



### intentions. Together we are taking action. 9



### Thank you for these new protections from carbon 10



### pollution. I sup port you, and I am grateful for 11



### you. 12



### MS. NOONAN: Thank you. And I think this 13



### would be a good time to take a

-- I think we'll 14



### take a five

- minute break right now. 15



### [Break from 2 : 51 p.m. to 3 :0 2 p.m.] 16



### MS. NOONAN: And, Mr. Fuller, would you 17



### like to start? Actually both of you sit at the 18



### table. And if you could start by spelling your 19



### name before you speak? 20



### Good. We'll take that, too. 21



### Your name and affiliation. 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### MR. FULLER: My name is Tony Fuller. I’m 1



### with the Sierra Club. 2



### MS. NOONAN: F

- U

- L

- L

- E

- R? 3



### MR. FULLER: Oh. Yes. Thank you. 4



### Good afternoon. My name is Tony Fuller. 5



### I'm with the Sierra Club and I volunteer and 6



### chair the local Air and Energy Committee with the 7



### Chicago group. 8



### And I come today to support the EPA 9



### carbon rule. There are many scientific reasons 10



### to support the rule, but I'm no scientist, so I'm 11



### focusing on my own personal reasons. I'm here 12



### because I believe in science. And science 13



### clearly states, from what I read, that carbon 14



### dioxide causes climate change. And I also think 15



### th at science shows that climate change is here, 16



### and further disruption is coming if we do not 17



### start cutting carbon emissions now. We must 18



### start taking action now or not only will we 19



### threaten our own way of life, but threaten the 20



### lives of future generations and the existence of 21



### life in general on the planet. 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### The carbon rule limits on new power 1



### plants is the first step forward towards taking 2



### responsibility for the carbon problem. And we 3



### also need to take more steps to regulate existing 4



### sources of greenhouse gases. And eventually we 5



### need comprehensive legislation to address climate 6



### problems. But in the absence of a comprehensive 7



### solution this is a good first step. 8



### We have to take action now. About a year 9



### before Hurricane Katrina I watched a program on 10



### tele vision that discussed what would happen if a 11



### large storm h ur t New

-- sorry, hit New Orleans

-- 12



### also hurt New Orleans, too. And in this program 13



### they showed an emergency preparedness drill and 14



### government officials were there kind of going 15



### through what would happen if the storm came 16



### together, and it was clearly that the main plan 17



### was to evacuate. 18



### But at the end of the program they asked, 19



### well, what's going to happen to the people who 20



### can't evacuate. And pretty much t here was just 21



### kind of crickets . There w as really no plan what 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### to do if that happened. 1



### And sure enough, not too much later there 2



### was a hurricane and there was evacuation, but the 3



### people who remained didn't have a means to get 4



### out. And we all know what that meant for those 5



### people and the

-- how much they suffered. 6



### And also, personally, I also have friends 7



### and family that live in Louisiana

-- not in New 8



### Orleans but around there. And we 've lost touch 9



### with a lot of my extended family because they had 10



### to move, and it was really disruptive and a sa d 11



### event in my life. 12



### And the reason why I think of this is 13



### because carbon emissions have the potential to 14



### cause not only more storms like Katrina but also 15



### global climate disruption. And if we do not take 16



### action now, future generations will ask why 17



### didn't you do something. Why didn't you protect 18



### us from harm? 19



### And I sit here now and speak to you today 20



### because I don't want to be like those people who 21



### did not take action to protect people when they 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### knew of the consequences of that action. 1



### Our planet is in p eril and we must 2



### protect the world not only for us but for future 3



### generations. And I'm going to take a step 4



### further here and state that not only must we 5



### limit carbon dioxide emissions for own benefit 6



### but for the benefit of all life on this planet. 7



### I stro ngly believe that life on earth here is 8



### precious, that this planet is a home to an 9



### amazing variety of life and ecosystems. And 10



### climate change induced by carbon dioxide 11



### threatens all of these forms of life that depend 12



### the ecosystems that we have here. 13



### And , you know, once again, I think, you 14



### know, mass extensions are a threat. So

-- and 15



### climate change presents a big

-- it could 16



### threaten

-- I'm sorry

-- threaten life. So, 17



### while climate

-- or global warming or climate 18



### change is a challenging problem, we do know the 19



### cause. We know how to address it, and that's by 20



### cutting emissions. We just need the will to take 21



### action. 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### Today I'm asking you to take this action 1



### because not only will it protect our families, 2



### but we have a moral obligation to protect this 3



### plan et. By taking action now we'll start on a 4



### path towards a healthy clean energy future that 5



### we can be proud of for future generations. And 6



### we will have fulfilled our duty to protect earth. 7



### Thank you. 8



### MS. NOONAN: If you could start by 9



### spelling your name? 10



### MS. LI: Yes, sure. 11



### MS. NOONAN: Actually, if you could stay. 12



### MR. FULLER: Okay. 13



### MS. LI: My name's Angela Li, L

- I. I'm a 14



### second

- year student at the University of Chicago, 15



### and I'm a member of our school's Climate Action 16



### Network. I joined the Climate Action Network 17



### because I have a stake in the future of the 18



### environment. It's the climate that my peers and 19



### I will be living in as adults and the climate in 20



### which we'll be raising our children. 21



### I'm also strongly opposed to polluters 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### because my mom loves spending time outdoors, and 1



### I don't think her health should be harmed by air 2



### pollution. So it's for these same reasons that 3



### I'm a strong supporter of the EPA's new carbon 4



### regulations. I don't think that polluters should 5



### be able to create carbon output fr eely. And I 6



### think the decisions we make today to cap carbon 7



### are going to have a huge impact on future 8



### decades. 9



### MS. NOONAN: Thank you very much. 10



### Bob Bingaman and Stacey Salman, please. 11



### MR. BINGAMAN: Good afternoon. My name 12



### is Bob Bingaman. That's B

- I

- N

- G

- A

- M

- A

- N. I live 13



### in Takoma Park, Maryland; and I'm here today 14



### representing the Sierra Club. I'm the National 15



### Organizing Director and work out of the 16



### Washington, D.C. office of the Sierra Club. 17



### And I want to speak today on why the 18



### Sierra Club and ou r 1.2 million members and 19



### supporters support the Environmental Protection 20



### Agency's first ever carbon pollution standard for 21



### new power plants and how this is going to benefit 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### the American people. 1



### I want to start, however, by saying the 2



### reason that I work f or the Sierra Club and the 3



### reason I am in this room today is because of a 4



### nine

- year

- old boy named Timothy. Timothy happens 5



### to be my son. And 18 years ago when I was 6



### offered this job, myself and my partner did what 7



### many couples do when confronted with a c areer 8



### choice. I was in a job I loved, and I had a 9



### tough choice to make when I got offered this job. 10



### So we put together a list of pluses and 11



### deltas for taking this job. And we spent about 12



### 24 hours having numerous conversations. And at 13



### one point we were taking the family in the car 14



### somewhere around Washington, D.C., and my partner 15



### and I were having this back and forth, and out of 16



### the back seat comes a little voice, nine

- year

- old 17



### Timothy, said, "Okay, Dad. Stop." He said, 18



### "What's the Sierra Club?" So I had to explain to 19



### him the best I knew as a member of the Sierra 20



### Club what the Sierra Club does. And he said, 21



### "What do they want you to do?" So, again, what I 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### knew about the job I explained to him. 1



### And I was driving the car, and I looked 2



### in the rearview mirror, and I could see little 3



### nine

- year

- old gears turning in Timothy's head. 4



### It was dead silent in the back. And I said, 5



### "Timothy, what are you thinking? 6



### And he said, "Dad, you have no choice. 7



### You have to take this job. I want to raise my 8



### kids on a h ealthy planet." 9



### [Laughter.] 10



### That conversation

-- the decision was 11



### made at that very moment. There was no more 12



### discussion, and even on the roughest days I pull 13



### inspiration from my then

- nine

- year

- old son. And 14



### I'm so moved by the stories we've heard today 15



### about how this issue, it's not academic. Well, 16



### it is academic. It is science, but it's very 17



### real in the lives of people like Timothy and the 18



### other young people in this room who want an 19



### opportunity to grow up on a healthy planet. So I 20



### am here to give vo ice to Timothy, the young 21



### people, and our members and supporters. 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### The science and the data on climate 1



### change is conclusive. Scientists tell us that 2



### climate change is real. It's happening, and it 3



### presents some very real threats to our health and 4



### societal well being. 5



### Fueled by carbon pollution, doctors and 6



### nurses tell us that as temperatures rise so will 7



### the instances of smog

- induced asthma and 8



### respiratory illness. As part of my job in the 9



### Sierra Club, I travel all across this country 10



### meeting with commun ity organizations and 11



### community organizers. 12



### I see firsthand the detrimental health 13



### affects that carbon pollution and other dangerous 14



### pollutants from coal

- fired power plants, in 15



### particular, pose to communities. And I really 16



### want to note that these impact s are particularly 17



### profound on communities of people of color and 18



### low income communities. If you're Mitt Romney, 19



### you're probably okay. 20



### [Laughter.] 21



### MR. BINGAMAN: Tens of thousands of 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### people from Maine to Nevada, to right here in 1



### Illinois, suffer in a ve ry real way, and 2



### sometimes fatal way, the consequences of power 3



### plants, not bearing responsibility for the 4



### pollution they spew out. And this rule will 5



### begin to hold those polluters accountable. 6



### This not only devastates family, but it 7



### also increases the b urden on an already strapped 8



### health service program. Additionally, a warmer 9



### world will mean more extreme weather causing 10



### damage via wild fires to our homes and national 11



### lands, reduced crop yields, and water shortages. 12



### An increase in insect pests and preva lence of 13



### insect

- spread diseases, intensified precipitation 14



### events such as hurricanes, storm surging, and 15



### flooding. This will cost us our lives and our 16



### livelihoods if we do not take action. 17



### Thankfully, the EPA is taking action, and we are 18



### profoundly appre ciative. 19



### In closing, again, on behalf of the 1.2 20



### members [sic] of the Sierra Club, on behalf of 21



### Timothy, I want to thank the EPA for their 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### efforts. And once again, restate our strong 1



### support for this rule that we hope the EPA will 2



### move forward and finali ze by the end of the year. 3



### Let's do it for the communities we've heard 4



### about today. Let's do it for the people we've 5



### heard about today. Let's do it for Timothy. 6



### Thank you very much. 7



### MS. NOONAN: Ms. Salman? 8



### MS. SALMAN: Yes. Excuse me. My name is 9



### S tacey Salman . And thank you for the opportunity 10



### to submit a statement regarding the proposed 11



### carbon standard ruling. 12



### MS. NOONAN: And spell your name. 13



### MS. SALMAN: S

- T

- A

- C

- E

- Y, and then S

- A

- L

14



### M

- A

- N. 15



### I applaud your efforts to take the steps 16



### needed to co ntrol carbon emissions and to apply 17



### the intentions of the Clean Air Act. I'm here 18



### today to speak as a parent, as a mom of three 19



### young children. 20



### I actually testified several years ago in 21



### regards to the EPA's big polluter rule. And at 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### that time I was moti vated to testify because my 1



### oldest daughter was in third grade, and she was 2



### learning about climate change in school And as 3



### you would expect, she was asking me a lot of 4



### questions, hard questions, questions about things 5



### that were frightening her. And as a parent I 6



### answered her questions with optimism about all 7



### the smart, intelligent people working hard to 8



### find answers. 9



### My children are, for the most part, 10



### satisfied by this answer; but the reality is we 11



### have failed to yet develop strategic, 12



### comprehensive fed eral policy to reduce carbon 13



### emissions and to move away from our dependence on 14



### fossil fuels. So I am still answering my 15



### children's questions, and they are still 16



### rightfully concerned about the planet they will 17



### inherit, but they remain optimistic. 18



### My child ren remain optimistic because 19



### they believe in a future that is not dependent on 20



### dirty, polluting sources of fuel. They believe 21



### they will live in a community that is powered by 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### efficient, clean renewable energy. They not only 1



### believe in this clean energy future, but they are 2



### counting on it. They are counting on using smart 3



### energy, smart meters, smart meters, smart 4



### appliances, smart cars, smart grids all being 5



### powered by clean renewable, preferably local 6



### energy sources. They believe in this future 7



### because we tell them it's possible. 8



### So, to me, that is what this ruling is 9



### about. It's about our necessary transition to 10



### clean energy future. And the standard that you 11



### are proposing is a bold step in the direction 12



### toward that clean energy future. 13



### So we know t here's a pushback from the 14



### fossil fuel industry, and they will present 15



### compelling evidence claiming that we need to 16



### continue our heavy dependence on coal far into 17



### the future, but what I see and what I think they 18



### are saying is they reject our vision for a c lean 19



### energy future. They reject developing a clean 20



### energy economy, but the research has shown that 21



### there is strong public support for advancing 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### clean energy; and we do not need to wait any 1



### longer. 2



### This ruling is not a death to the coal 3



### industry as they w ant to claim. It's flexible, 4



### and it's lined with industry standards and 5



### trends. Changing an industry is a monumental 6



### challenge, but we have so many emerging, 7



### ambitious, exciting innovative technologies and 8



### strategies. And the strategies can produce can 9



### produce our energy cleaner, manage it more 10



### effectively, and use it more efficiently. 11



### We know that policies that support energy 12



### efficiency and renewable energy

-- these are 13



### policies that also create jobs; they stimulate 14



### the economy; and they reduce our ove rall energy 15



### demands. 16



### So we should enforce the Clean Air Act 17



### with carbon standards, but we should partner this 18



### with a national energy efficiency standard and 19



### include a federal renewable energy standard. So 20



### if we developed demand

- side strategies that are 21



### c apable of producing real energy savings, we have 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### seen that these savings displace the need to 1



### generate additional power from supply

- side 2



### resources. So let's focus on advanced strategies 3



### and tools and not just building more and more 4



### coal plants to meet the demands of a poorly 5



### managed electrical load. 6



### So I hope I am not as naïve as my 7



### children, but I do believe in our ability to rise 8



### to this challenge. And the challenge is 9



### transitioning to a clean energy future. And we 10



### now need to make hard decisions that are required 11



### to realize the future that our children are 12



### expecting. 13



### So, thank you, and I appreciate your 14



### leadership in taking the necessary steps to 15



### achieve that future. 16



### MS. NOONAN: Thank you both. 17



### Next we have Caroline Wooton and Sylvia 18



### Glauster. And just on deck we'll have Julian 19



### Borjas and Jerry Mead

- Lucero. 20



### MS. GLAUSTER: Hi, good afternoon. My 21



### name is Sylvia Glauster, S

- Y

- L

- V

- I

- A, G

- L

- A

- U

- S

- 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### T

- E

- R. And I teach middle school here in 1



### Chicago. 2



### As a teacher it's always hard for me to 3



### make these sorts of hearings which are usually 4



### during the school day, so I rarely come to them; 5



### but issues of energy, pollution, and climate are 6



### central issues of our generation, and as such are 7



### never far from the classroom. 8



### When I teach data analysis, scientific 9



### t hought, or social responsibility we take the 10



### time to delve deeply into the issues students 11



### raise. Let me tell you it's pretty terrifying to 12



### look at those naïve faces and encourage them to 13



### really examine our systems of energy production 14



### and their consequen ces for the first time, so I 15



### couldn't leave it in the classroom today. 16



### Who cares about air pollution I asked 17



### them. Well, who here has asthma? Several 18



### children in every class I've ever taught raise 19



### their hands and others not. They see how this is 20



### seriou s business. 21



### Did you know that toxic chemicals 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### released by power plants can cause cancer? At 1



### this point they're quite upset. And what's more, 2



### the carbon dioxide released by burning fossil 3



### fuels is causing our entire climate and weather 4



### patterns to change in ways we are still 5



### struggling to understand. 6



### Motivated to continue researching on 7



### their own, various students have come back to the 8



### class to inform us of their findings that the 9



### emissions from power plants disproportionately 10



### affect low income and minor ity communities, that 11



### studies link asthma to energy

- related emissions, 12



### and that right here in Chicago 41 people die each 13



### year as a result of the dirty power plants we 14



### have fought so hard to close. 15



### Debating in a mock summit, students argue 16



### passionately abo ut the need for reduced carbon 17



### emissions to stabilize our climate and protect 18



### reliable food and water supplies. 19



### Of course, outraged as they are, these 20



### kids want to fix the problems right away. We 21



### have solar panels. We have windmills. We have 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### teams of e ngineers ready to take on green jobs 1



### like installing new energy systems and designing 2



### better ones. 3



### People are dying here. It's not just the 4



### people with lung diseases and asthma attacks, 5



### people unfortunate enough to live under a plant's 6



### smokestacks. Peo ple are dying in escalating 7



### storms, starving in the face of crop failures 8



### brought about by drought, and fighting in 9



### conflicts over increasingly scarce resources. To 10



### these students it's clear that the whole world is 11



### at stake. "So why hasn't anyone done an ything," 12



### they demand. 13



### Too young to be either cynical or 14



### practical, no excuse is acceptable to them. And 15



### they're right. Our current regulations are not 16



### acceptable. Why haven't we taken action at the 17



### national level? We have known that carbon 18



### dioxide fro m fossil fuels causes dangerous 19



### changes in our atmosphere since before I was born 20



### 30 years ago. We have known that the toxic 21



### chemicals in our fuel become the toxic chemicals 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### in the air we breathe, in the rain that falls, 1



### and the food we eat. And yet we a re not pushing 2



### the electrical industry to do better? We have no 3



### national limits on the carbon pollution that is 4



### high

- jacking our future security? 5



### People talk about our children's 6



### children, but while those people have been 7



### talking, their children grew up. And those 8



### hypothetical future generations are not real 9



### people with tough questions. 10



### And so I step forward and I stand among 11



### my students, and I say to them, "I don't know. I 12



### don't know why we haven't done anything yet. I'm 13



### frustrated, too. I've been w aiting my whole 14



### life, but now I'm an adult. And you know what? 15



### Now is on us. It's time for us to lead." 16



### This regulation is an opportunity for us 17



### to do something. It's an opportunity to lead in 18



### the direction of clean energy and away from 19



### deadly complac ency. Though this regulation is 20



### not as strict as I would like

-- and I believe we 21



### should act much more aggressively

-- the move to 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### regulate carbon pollution is a critical first 1



### step. That's why I'm here today and not in my 2



### classroom. It's an opportunity for me to return 3



### to my students and say, "Guess what. We are 4



### doing something about this problem. Our 5



### government really is working to save lives and 6



### keep businesses under control." 7



### Remember those dirty plants that closed 8



### down? Well, the new electricity is going to have 9



### to be cleaner. Am I going to be able to say 10



### that? Are these regulations going to get through 11



### with their current standards or even stricter 12



### regulations that include existing power plants? 13



### Are other teachers, and parents, and 14



### elected off icials going to be able to go home and 15



### say, "We're taking important steps. We're 16



### changing the way we do things. We're reducing 17



### pollution, and we're moving forward." I hope so. 18



### It's on us. 19



### MS. NOONAN: Ms. Wooten? 20



### MS. WOOTEN: Hi, my name is Caroline 21



### W ooten. I am a fourth

- year student at the 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### University of Chicago . I'm a member of the 1



### UChicago Climate Action Network and a larger 2



### citywide student network called the Chicago Youth 3



### Climate Coalition. 4



### I am here to express my strong support 5



### for the EPA in p roposing these standards, and I 6



### feel so strongly about it I wrote a song and I 7



### brought my guitar up here. The song I wrote is 8



### based on this JFK Petition where he says, "We 9



### have the power to be the greatest generation in 10



### the history of mankind or to be the last." And I 11



### feel like that quotation is scarily true today. 12



### And, you know, usually I write songs 13



### about pretty personal things. I write about 14



### breakups. I write about how much I love my 15



### mother. 16



### [Laughter.] 17



### MS. WOOTEN : And so climate change might 18



### see m kind outside that realm, but it's not. Right 19



### now short

- term corporate profits are being put 20



### before my future and the future of my friends. 21



### And I am really mad about that, and that's 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### personal. And that's so personal that I'm going 1



### to write a song, and I 'm mad enough that I am 2



### going to sing it here at the EPA hearing. 3



### [Laughter.] 4



### MS. WOOTEN : And just to warn you guys, 5



### I'm an amateur in the worst sense of the term, so 6



### I just ask that you humor me, and you're welcome 7



### to sing along. 8



### MS. NOONAN: And plea se pull the mike 9



### close so we can hear you. 10



### MS. WOOTEN : Okay. It might be a little 11



### painful. 12



### [Guitar playing.] 13



### MS. WOOTEN : I'm sorry. I'm going to 14



### tune. 15



### [Guitar playing.] 16



### MS. WOOTEN : Good enough for government 17



### work. 18



### [Laughter.] 19



### [Guitar playing.] 20



### MS. WOOTEN : [Singing.} We have the 21



### power to make this the greatest generation, or we 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### have the power to make this generation the last. 1



### So if we wanna survive, gonna have to struggle 2



### and strive, and we're gonna have to fight the 3



### powers of the past. 4



### I'm t alkin' 'bout carbon. I'm talkin' 5



### 'bout fossil fuels. I'm talkin' 'bout CEOs who 6



### manipulate the rules. I'm talkin' 'bout money 7



### could be for the good of us all. These are the 8



### powers that will lead us to our (unintelligible). 9



### 'Cause we have the power to make this the 10



### greatest generation, or we have the power to make 11



### this generation the last. So if we wanna 12



### survive, gonna have to struggle and strive, and 13



### we're gonna have to fight the powers of the past. 14



### 'Cause the waters are rising, and the 15



### forests are b urning down, and the twisters are 16



### taking the whole damn town. So we know how to 17



### stop this, but the question is if we will. We 18



### gotta get a move on. We got n o time to kill. 19



### We have the power to make this the 20



### greatest generation, or we have the power to make 21



### this generation the last. So if we wanna 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### survive, gonna have to struggle and strive, and 1



### we're gonna have to fight the powers of the past. 2



### There's a future awaiting. There's a 3



### future that we can make. We have the power of 4



### people with a vision to be the nation of the 5



### world who builds on wisdom, hope, and love

, 6



### another world builds on the justice from above. 7



### 'Cause we have the power to make this the 8



### greatest generation, or we have the power to make 9



### this generation the last. So if we wanna 10



### survive, gonna have to struggle and strive, and 11



### we're gonna have to fight the powers of the past. 12



### [Applause.] 13



### MS. NOONAN: Ms. Wooten, would you like 14



### to put that on a record? 15



### MS. WOOTEN: That's fine. 16



### MS. NOONAN: Okay. Coming up next Julian 17



### -- how to your sa y your last name? 18



### MR. BORJAS: Borjas. 19



### MS. NOONAN: Borjas. And Jerry

-- 20



### MR. MEAD

- LUCERO: Mead

- Lucero. 21



### MS. NOONAN: One more time. 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### MR. MEAD

- LUCERO: Mead

- Lucero. Mead like 1



### the paper. No relation. 2



### MR. BORJAS: It's J

- U

- L

- I

- A

- N, B

- O

- R

- J

- A

3



### S. And I 'm here representing the Chicago Clean 4



### Power Coalition and asking the EPA to support the 5



### national carbon emissions standard; but I'm not 6



### doing this for the 3.1 million jobs according to 7



### the U.S. Department of Labor Jobs and Innovative 8



### Forms of Power Genera tion Will Bring even though 9



### we desperately need them here in Chicago as well 10



### as in the nation. 11



### And instead of urging the EPA to achieve 12



### its mandate, to achieve the EPA's original duty 13



### with no obligation to promote either culture or 14



### our commerce, only the critical obligation to 15



### protect and enhance the environment. 16



### So I urge you to pass CO 2 

### regulations and 17



### thereby promote life in all of its shapes and 18



### forms, bringing the U.S., our home, our country, 19



### the world's largest per capita polluter into the 20



### global ef fort to mitigate the most catastrophic 21



### and deadly affects of global air pollution and 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### climate change. 1



### I urge the EPA to promote liberty with 2



### this agency started by a Republican 3



### administration to overlook partisan politics and 4



### the sole pursuit of profits, and instead, focus 5



### solely on the EPA's duty to research health and 6



### the environment. And I urge the EPA to foster 7



### the pursuit of happiness from the joy that comes 8



### from a challenge as we face a very real and great 9



### threat of extinction, to foster the joy and the 10



### exhilaration of not turning down the same old 11



### road, and not the tired beaten path, but forging 12



### a new path, imagining new ways forward, and 13



### embracing scientific know

- how , and riding the 14



### coming tidal wave of green clean power. 15



### I ask the EPA to let our lungs breathe 16



### clean air and our eyes enjoy bright blue skies, 17



### to challenge our minds, to face the very real and 18



### existential threat not only to ourselves but to 19



### those the world over, to humans, and to animals, 20



### and to countless future generations. 21



### These reg ulations will stop dirty, old, 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### destructive, and outdated ways of the past and 1



### encourage new thinking, innovation, and that 2



### distinctly human trait of entrepreneurship. 3



### I urge the EPA to pass this legislation 4



### as an idealist having worked with community 5



### grou ps, the Chicago Clean Power Coalition, 6



### Chicago's Mayor Rahm Emanuel, and closing down 7



### the Fisk and Crawford Power Plants. These two 8



### coal

- fired power plants were actually within the 9



### very city limits. Having closed them means 10



### Chicago halted 40 premature de aths per year, 11



### 2,800 asthma attacks per year, 500 unnecessary 12



### emotional, unwanted, unneeded emergency room 13



### visits per year. 14



### So please help to solidify our victory, a 15



### victory of the power of the people, not coal 16



### power but community power. Please help us 17



### b reathe a sigh of relief here in the Windy City 18



### and help us to fight to protect

-- to keep 19



### fighting to protect the planet, our city, our 20



### environment, and with your help, the country free 21



### of air pollution. 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### I urge you to pass these standards and 1



### limit the em ission of CO 2 

### and help save our 2



### planet. Thank you very much. 3



### MR. MEAD

- LUCERO: My name is Jerry Mead

4



### Lucero with PERRO, a environ mental j ustice 5



### o rganization in Pilsen

, and now I'm know I’m 6



### being punished for missing my original appointed 7



### time in the morn ing by having to follow Caroline. 8



### I don't think I'm going to get quite as many 9



### applause as Caroline got. Unfortunately, it is a 10



### little hard act to follow, but anyway

-- so, as I 11



### said, I'm with PERRO, Pilsen Environmental Rights 12



### and Reform Organization, an environmental justice 13



### group in the Pilsen neighborhood, which is a low

14



### income working class

-- a Mexican immigrant 15



### neighborhood here in Chicago on the southwest 16



### side. 17



### And as you heard earlier from Julian, 18



### we've had a victory recently in both Pilsen and 19



### L ittle Village, both Mexican immigrant 20



### neighborhoods here in Chicago, working class 21



### neighborhoods that finally were able to get rid 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### of a long neighborhood nightmare of a coal

- fired 1



### power plant in our neighborhood. So that was a 2



### great victory for us, a long , hard

- fought 3



### victory. We were working on that campaign for 10 4



### years, most

-- many of us. And so we're really 5



### glad to have that finally gone. 6



### But looking at this from more of a 7



### national perspective, we realize there's a lot of 8



### other communities that are still suffering the 9



### same fate that we suffered for so long here in 10



### Chicago. And so we don't want to see that 11



### continue. 12



### I don't know if these are the most recent 13



### statistics. They're probably a few years old 14



### now, but last time I checked at least 39 perce nt 15



### of Latinos nationally live within 30 miles of a 16



### coal

- fired power plant, and 71 percent lived 17



### within air counties that the U.S. EPA determined 18



### were

-- there was

-- one of the air pollutants 19



### was over the limit that it should be. So this is 20



### something affe cting communities like ours across 21



### the country, environmental justice communities 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### across the country. And we definitely want to 1



### see this corrected. 2



### Now I realize that this rule is targeting 3



### new plants. It's not targeting existing plants. 4



### That's, I guess , the one thing I, you know, would 5



### love to see it actually go after the existing 6



### plants as well, you know, like Fisk and Crawford. 7



### In fact, one of my concerns is that by 8



### going after just the new plants, that it will 9



### actually encourage companies to keep pl ants like 10



### Fisk and Crawford running longer than they 11



### should. That would be the one down side to this 12



### regulation; but I definitely am in support of the 13



### regulation even if it is just applying to new 14



### plants for a lot of reasons (unintelligible) 15



### state which i s

-- even though what we were

-- you 16



### know, when we heard about the 41 deaths every 17



### year, and the hundreds of emergency room visits, 18



### and thousands of asthma attacks, that was coming 19



### from particulate pollution, which, of course, is 20



### not directly targeted in t his case, but certainly 21



### ozone, which is one of the outcomes of the carbon 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### pollution as well, is also a problem for people 1



### that have respiratory illnesses. 2



### Again, within the Latino communities in 3



### the United States, there's already a high rate of 4



### asthma and already a high rate of complications 5



### due to asthma. That's a mixture of factors. You 6



### know, when we talk about EG [phonetic]

, we're 7



### always talking about these various kinds of 8



### socio

- economic factors coming together. And so 9



### you have people that don't hav e good access to 10



### health care to begin with, and they have asthma, 11



### and then they live in communities where their 12



### asthmas is aggravated by these pollution sources, 13



### and then they end up in a severe complication 14



### because of their asthma. 15



### So, from a health pers pective, that 16



### immediate health perspective of the ozone impact 17



### that we see in our communities, that is one of 18



### the reasons why I'm very much in favor and 19



### support of this. 20



### But also, when you talk of the issue of 21



### climate change is more a global issue, t hat a lso 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### is a direct impact in our communities as well. 1



### We 've see n here in Chicago already one of the 2



### things that we're going to see more and more 3



### often now with the effects of climate change is 4



### these increased heat waves that we've been having 5



### in the summer. 6



### You know, they've already changed the 7



### zone designation for Chicago just recently 8



### because it's warmed up so much that we're 9



### actually in a slightly different climatic zone 10



### than we were previously. And they're definitely 11



### expecting that these heat waves this summer will 12



### become more and more common. And the last bunch 13



### of these we've had, we've seen high numbers of 14



### deaths during those heat waves, again, primarily 15



### in low income communities where people don't have 16



### access to cooling the way that people in more 17



### af fluent communities do. 18



### Again, even in Pilsen I can tell you the 19



### vast majority of my neighbors, you know, don't 20



### have air conditioning, and so they

-- you know, 21



### one of the problems we always see is they open 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### their windows for cooling in the summer. And 1



### t hat just lets in the

-- of course, the pollution 2



### in the air in there, too, which is unfortunate

. 3



### But, of course, with these heat waves, that's 4



### going to become more and more of a problem as 5



### well. 6



### I also am kind of speaking here on behalf 7



### of my wife. My w ife was going to come and 8



### testify today as well, but unfortunately because 9



### of work she wasn't able to. And she's the 10



### President of the Durango Unido , which is a n 11



### association of people from Durango state in 12



### Mexico, and also the President of Confo

- Mex 13



### [phone tic], which is the federation of all the 14



### different federations and hometown associations 15



### from different states of Mexico here in Chicago. 16



### And one of the things that we've been 17



### talking about

-- well, both her and I have been 18



### going out to groups and talking about it the 19



### affect climate change has on migration as well 20



### and has, not only here in the United States but 21



### in Latin America. Those are a few examples, and 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### I wish she was here to give more of the 1



### statistics, but Durango, Mexico, where she comes 2



### from hers elf, has been in a severe drought much 3



### like the drought that we know about in Texas for 4



### the last several years. 5



### Now, the officials in Mexico are already 6



### saying this is an outcome of climate change. Of 7



### course, you get into these, you know

-- the 8



### science g ets difficult when you're trying to take 9



### one particular event and draw it to climate 10



### change; but the reality is that droughts like the 11



### one that's going on right now will become more 12



### common. 13



### And the drought that's going on right now 14



### already has wiped out d rinking water supplies by, 15



### I think, something like 2.5 million people . It's 16



### devastated agriculture in that region. Eighty 17



### percent of the agriculture in Durango State 18



### itself has been completely wiped out in the last 19



### couple years of drought. It's just

-- there are 20



### literally people now living just on food rations 21



### provided by the government in states of northern 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### Mexico because of this drought. 1



### We're going to see

-- are we getting 2



### short on time? We're going to see the same 3



### thing. A lot of friends of mine h ave came to the 4



### U.S. originally because of fleeing Hurricane 5



### Mitch in Central America. We're going to see an 6



### increase in those type of events as well. 7



### And there's already like 25 million that 8



### the U.N. has declared as climate refugees 9



### currently in the wor ld. That could get up to 200 10



### million by 2050 if under the current pro jections. 11



### So

-- I know I'm out of time, but just a little 12



### piece of why we wanted to see this passed. 13



### MS. NOONAN: And we would be happy to 14



### have written comments for the record. 15



### MR. MEA D

- LUCERO: We'll do that. My 16



### apologies. Thank you. 17



### MS. NOONAN: Thank you. 18



### Okay. Up next we have Cheryl Hogan and 19



### Michael Zurato

-- Zurako. Sorry. 20



### Do you want to start? 21



### MS. HOGAN: Hello, my name is Cheryl 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### Hogan, H

- O

- G

- A

- N. And I am only

-- I don' t have 1



### much to say other than to say that I'm so glad 2



### I'm here today. This has been just such a 3



### wonderful education for me. I' ve always been 4



### concerned about the environment

. 5



### For years I flew over to China, and 6



### Beijing, particularly, and experienced the 7



### environment there in the air when I'd look out of 8



### my hotel room. I was always so thankful to get 9



### back to the United States, which we have, 10



### thankfully, our air. We don't have to wear 11



### masks, but, you know, we're approaching the part 12



### where our environment is becoming also not good 13



### anymore as we all know. And I think that we have 14



### to become more and more aware of what we can do 15



### to protect our environment. 16



### I'm just kind of amazed that we don't 17



### have national standards. Every

-- there's been 18



### people here from Michigan, Wisconsin, and New 19



### Jersey

-- you know, you name it. And we all want 20



### the same thing, and we don't have a national 21



### standard. So we can have Indiana that just this 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### morning in the Tribune, you know, they're finally 1



### going to clean up BP, but they ca n do what they 2



### want in Indiana, and we suffer the consequences 3



### of it. 4



### So, unless we have states that are all 5



### working together here in our United States, we're 6



### all going to be working at crosshairs with each 7



### other. We're not going to be on the same

-- you 8



### know, somebody's going to

-- somebody else and 9



### (unintelligible) being able to pollute over there 10



### because they don't care. They'll get a get a tax 11



### benefit or something like that. 12



### Anyway, I just want to say thank you very 13



### much for being here. I certainly hope that these 14



### -- the national standards go through. I think we 15



### need this desperately here in our country. And 16



### thank you very much. 17



### MR. ZURAKOB: Hello, I'm Michael Zurakob, 18



### Z

- U

- R

- A

- K

- O

- B. I'll be very brief today. I 19



### didn't bring a prepared text. 20



### I want to commend the EPA for putting 21



### forth the standards for limiting

-- an initial 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### limitation at least

-- but with reservation. I 1



### think from my brief study of the proposed 2



### standard that it seems there are quite a few 3



### exceptions, even going forward with n ew power 4



### plants. And, of course, there's the enormous 5



### issue of the existing power plants that are 6



### putting out greenhouse gases today in huge 7



### quantities. 8



### I commend the EPA for taking this first 9



### step. I certainly hope that the CO 2 

### standards go 10



### through at least as strong as they've been 11



### proposed, and I would very much like to think 12



### this is a first step and we will soon see some 13



### standards related to existing power plants. 14



### We're long past the time where we have 15



### the luxury of pretending we don't know that 16



### put ting greenhouse gases into the atmosphere in 17



### enormous quantities has no effect. 18



### I work up north in an area that was once 19



### literally a sea of forest, up in northern 20



### Wisconsin near Duluth, working on a project 21



### trying to save the remains of a forest full of 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### trees that was built into a grain elevator in 1



### 1887. And I'm reminded every day that when the 2



### first Europeans came there and looked around, 3



### they couldn't be faulted for thinking that this 4



### forest wasn't endless because from a human scale 5



### it was endless. 6



### Y ears later we learned that cutting down 7



### those forests, in fact, has an impact, and we've 8



### impacted our planet by cutting down one forest 9



### after another. Now it's our turn to acknowledge 10



### that dumping greenhouse gases into the atmosphere 11



### has an effect. For 3 00 years we've burned fossil 12



### fuel believing that we couldn't possibly alter 13



### the climate. Now we know better. We don't have 14



### that luxury. 15



### But there are people among us who want so 16



### desperately to believe that the status quo is 17



### okay, that they're ignoring t he signs. I'm glad 18



### to see the EPA is not in that group of ignoring 19



### the signs, but it's a fight because there are 20



### very powerful forces who are very, very happy 21



### with the status quo. And we all need to be aware 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### of that. 1



### So, again, I commend the EPA for the 2



### first step. I strongly support limiting 3



### greenhouse gases from stationary sources. I very 4



### much hope that we'll see forthcoming standards 5



### fo r existing power plants as well so that I won't 6



### have to worry about what future generations are 7



### going to say about us and all the things we 8



### didn't do. Thank you very much. 9



### MS. NOONAN: Thank you both. 10



### Dr. Willard Fry and Robert Jacob, please. 11



### DR. FRY: I'm Dr. Willard Fry. I'm a 12



### professor of clinical surgery emeritus at 13



### Northwestern University Feinberg School of 14



### M edicine and a thoracic surgeon or a chest cutter 15



### for those of you who are M.A.S.H. fans. 16



### [Laughter.] 17



### DR. FRY: Today I am speaking on behalf 18



### of the American Thoracic Society of which I am a 19



### member. The ATS is a medical professional 20



### organization of over 15,000 physicians, 21



### scientists, nurses, and allied health 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### professionals dedicated to the detection, 1



### prevention, treatment, and cure of respiratory 2



### critical care and sleep

- related illness. 3



### The American Thoracic Society wishes to 4



### express our strong support f or the EPA's proposed 5



### carbon emission standards for power plants. 6



### The research documenting the reality of 7



### climate change is comprehensive and compelling. 8



### Evidence supporting human activity as a 9



### contributing factor to climate change is equally 10



### clear. A s a clinician, I have seen some of the 11



### health effects of global climate change right 12



### here in Chicago. The earlier arrival of spring 13



### is impacting the health and well

- being of allergy 14



### sufferers. The higher summer temperatures and 15



### the accompanying Code Oran ge and Code Red air 16



### pollution days is adversely affecting patients 17



### with asthma, COPD, and other respiratory 18



### conditions. While my observations are anecdotal, 19



### they fit the pattern of predicted adverse health 20



### impacts associated with climate change. 21



### Now let' s not forget the heat wave of 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### 1995 that led to approximately 750 heat

- related 1



### deaths over a five

- day period. The frequency and 2



### intensity of Chicago heat waves is expected to 3



### get worse in the near future. 4



### According to Dr. Peng and colleagues at 5



### Johns Hopk ins University, Chicago will experience 6



### 166 to 2,127 excess deaths per year as a result 7



### of heat waves. 8



### The ATS recently published in the 9



### proceedings of the American Thoracic Society a 10



### workshop report respiratory health effects of 11



### global climate change. I will leave a copy of 12



### that report with the panel. The workshop report 13



### explores the respiratory health effects of global 14



### climate change which include changing pollen 15



### releases impacting asthma and allergic rhinitis, 16



### heat waves causing critical care related 17



### illnesses, climate driven air pollution increases 18



### exacerbating asthma and COPD, desertification 19



### increasing particulate matter exposures, and 20



### Chicago is already known for having a significant 21



### excess of particulate matter in the air. And 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### climate change rela ted changes in food, water, 1



### and security impacting infectious respiratory 2



### diseases through malnutrition. 3



### Because of the strength of the existing 4



### data from multiple scientific disciplines, trends 5



### and weather patterns, sea temperatures and ice 6



### measurements around the globe, and the breadth 7



### and severity of likely climate force human health 8



### issues, the ATS strongly urges the EPA to move 9



### forward with the proposed carbon emissions 10



### standard for power plants. 11



### Furthermore, the ATS encourages the EPA 12



### to move forwar d with issuing greenhouse gas 13



### emission standards for other major point sources 14



### of greenhouse gases. 15



### I thank you. 16



### D R. JACOB: Hello, and thank you for 17



### giving all of us the opportunity to present 18



### testimony on this important new standard. 19



### My name is Dr. Ro bert Jacob. I've lived 20



### in the Logan Square neighborhood of Chicago for 21



### over 12 years. I'm a scientist at Argon ne 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### N ational Laboratory on the southwest side of 1



### Chicago, but my remarks here are my own and do 2



### not necessarily represent the opinion of my 3



### emplo yer. 4



### I'm actually a climate scientist, and my 5



### specialty is those complex computer programs 6



### known as climate models. I'm very familiar with 7



### the details of those models and would like to say 8



### a little bit about them since the conclusions 9



### drawn from those mo dels are partly why we're here 10



### today. 11



### We use these programs and the 12



### supercomputers they run on to make theoretical 13



### calculations of how the climatist who responds to 14



### changes such as an increase in the concentration 15



### of carbon dioxide. And you should know t hat the 16



### science behind these models is extremely well 17



### founded. Some of the equations they solve such 18



### as those for wind and currents have their origins 19



### in the 19th century. They have been verified and 20



### re verified countless times and underlie in most 21



### of th e science and technology of our modern 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### world. 1



### Now using the observed changes in carbon 2



### dioxide and other gases over the 20th century as 3



### input, these models calculated a rise in global 4



### average temperature. And the calculated rise 5



### closely matches the obser ved rise in global 6



### average temperature we saw in the 20th century. 7



### That is a remarkable scientific achievement given 8



### the complexity of the full climate system. 9



### And a straightforward application of 10



### these models to then calculate what would happen 11



### as carbo n dioxide levels continues to rise, the 12



### result from these simulations is well known. The 13



### global average temperature will continue to rise 14



### over the long term leading to significant 15



### disruptions in the climate we have known. These 16



### disruptions will be unprec edented in earth's 17



### history because the planet has never before 18



### experienced this large a rise in carbon dioxide 19



### over such a relatively short period of time. 20



### One of the largest sources of that carbon 21



### dioxide pollution is electricity generation from 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### burning fossil fuels, and coal is one of the 1



### worst fossil fuels. There are currently no 2



### national limits on how much carbon dioxide coal

3



### fired power plants can dump into the atmosphere. 4



### It costs the power plants nothing to do so. 5



### The only way to fix this marked f ailure 6



### is t hrough national carbon pollution limits. 7



### Carbon dioxide mixes into the global atmosphere 8



### relatively rapidly. So the pollution from power 9



### plants here in the Midwest have and will continue 10



### to affect the climate of the rest of the United 11



### States a nd the world. And those affects will be 12



### long lasting. 13



### Calculations performed by Professor David 14



### Archer at the University of Chicago have shown 15



### that this excess carbon dioxide could stay in the 16



### atmosphere for a thousand years, and even after 17



### 10,000 years as much as 20 percent of the 18



### pollution emitted today will still be in the 19



### atmosphere. This is why there is a need to act 20



### urgently. 21



### We have heard others testify about the 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### health effects of other forms of carbon pollution 1



### from power plants. These propose d standards will 2



### thus protect the health and well being of 3



### children and families now and help ensure their 4



### future will not be blighted by even more climate 5



### disruption we are already seeing. 6



### Taking responsibility for carbon dioxide 7



### pollution on a national level hopefully will 8



### encourage other countries to act. Over time we 9



### must reduce carbon dioxide emissions from 10



### electricity generation to zero. So it will be 11



### important to revisit these rules and gradually 12



### lower the maximum emission rate to further 13



### encourag e the transition to clean energy. 14



### The exception currently allowed for new 15



### plants that only plan to use carbon capture and 16



### storage should be eliminated. Our climate can't 17



### afford a bunch of new plants emitting above the 18



### proposed limit for even one year, mu ch less 10 19



### years. And we can't trust polluters to fulfill a 20



### promise to use carbon capture and storage 21



### especially since it is an expensive technology. 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### Finally, these rules should be followed 1



### by a similar set of rules for existing power 2



### plants. No matter how much pollutant has already 3



### been emitted, it is always worthwhile to reduce 4



### and eliminate further future pollution. These 5



### standards on carbon pollution should be put in 6



### immediately and followed by further restrictions. 7



### Thank you. 8



### MS. NOONAN: Thank y ou both. 9



### Would Ryan Baker and Karen Roothaan 10



### please come to the table? 11



### MS. ROOTHAAN: Hi, my name is Karen 12



### Roothaan, and on Saturday I will be 59 years old. 13



### I had my first vegetable garden when I was 16, so 14



### I've been a gardener for over 40 years. 15



### MS. NO ONAN: Can you spell your name? 16



### MS. ROOTHAN: R

- O

- O

- T

- H

- A

- A

- N. 17



### And what I brought here today is a plant 18



### I grew myself. It's a tomato plant for those of 19



### you who are gardeners will know that. And I do 20



### this every year, and I start indoors, and then I 21



### go o ut to a very primitive cold frame in my yard 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### that's built out of old storm windows. 1



### And normally around today, which is May 2



### 24th, my plant is about this tall and, as many of 3



### you know, you religiously wait until Memorial Day 4



### to set out your tomato plants . Right? But this 5



### year the people in my neighborhood started 6



### putting them out at the beginning of May because 7



### our last frost was April 4th. Right? 8



### And if you look closely, you'll see 9



### something you never see on a tomato plant that's 10



### not from a heated gr eenhouse. You'll see 11



### flowers, small buds. And this guy then is about 12



### a month ahead of schedule. 13



### Last year we planted our tomato plants 14



### two weeks ahead of schedule

-- not so early, but 15



### our corn farmers could not get in to plant on 16



### time because of wet soi l. 17



### Every fall for the last two years I 18



### watched flowers appear on trees that normally 19



### bloom in spring, trees such as Magnolia and 20



### crabapple. These seemingly small changes are 21



### only the ones that I have seen in my own 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### lifetime, but I know that other more dr astic 1



### changes are happening right now as we speak. 2



### Those affected drastically are not here today. 3



### The polar bears that swim for miles looking for 4



### ice, and the farmers in sub Saharan Africa 5



### waiting for rain are not here today, but we have 6



### a moral responsi bility to remember them as we 7



### consider the changes we need to make. And these 8



### proposed carbon standards are just a very small 9



### slice of what we need to do. 10



### Some of these changes need to be made on 11



### a personal level through better choices in food, 12



### transport ation, and shelter. I grow most of my 13



### own vegetables in the summer and have helped to 14



### start two community vegetable gardens. I commute 15



### mostly by bus and bicycle, and I weatherized my 16



### home two years ago. I take one or two vacations 17



### a year by train . I'm sure I could go on for a 18



### long time about my mostly good but definitely not 19



### perfect environmental choices. But I am one of 20



### over 300 million Americans, so my individual 21



### choices mean little unless I encourage others to 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### take similar steps. 1



### What I do for a li ving is I teach 2



### mathematics at the community college level. Over 3



### the years I have introduced environmental 4



### considerations into my classes when appropriate. 5



### And what I have learned from my students is that 6



### people are starting to understand that the 7



### choices they make have a global impact. But this 8



### change is very recent as the following will 9



### illustrate. 10



### And so I'm thinking back to a very hot 11



### day in 2007 when I arrived late to class, hot, 12



### very out of breath from my bicycle ride, and I 13



### asked my students how m uch gas they had burned to 14



### get to class, and none of them knew. Now, this 15



### was a teachable moment, and I created what I 16



### thought was a very basic assignment, to look up 17



### their gas mileage on the EPA website and then 18



### calculate their annual CO 2 

### emissions based on that 19



### number. 20



### However, none of those college students 21



### knew that EPA stands for Environmental Protection 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### Agency. I'm asking you today to live up to your 1



### name and mission and protect our environment. I'm 2



### asking for the polar bears and the people of th e 3



### world who live in floodplains and depend on 4



### subsistence agriculture for their daily bread; 5



### but I am also asking for those of us less at 6



### risk. We need to know what the EPA stands for, 7



### and we need you take a stand. 8



### Thank you. 9



### MR. BAKER: Hi, my name is Ryan Baker, 10



### and I come here to tell you about why it's 11



### important to me that the proposed rules be 12



### carried forward. 13



### Over the last three years I've spent 14



### hundreds of hours working on an important 15



### campaign to improve the health of Chicago. That 16



### campaign was the effort to stop the pollution 17



### from the Fisk and Crawford coal

- fired power 18



### plants. Recently those efforts paid off, and by 19



### the end of this year Chicago will be free of 20



### coal

- fired power plants. 21



### Winning that campaign was not easy, but I 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### can tell you wit hout a shadow of doubt that 1



### Chicagoans do not want coal. Throughout that 2



### campaign I talked to thousands of people in 3



### Chicago at bus stops, at various places, and the 4



### biggest obstacle in that campaign was raising 5



### awareness. Once Chicagoans knew the plants were 6



### here, they almost unilaterally agreed that they 7



### should not be. 8



### Yet despite this, Chicago is under the 9



### threat of having new coal

- fired power plants 10



### being built here. Through back

- room deals greedy 11



### energy companies are trying to get huge amounts 12



### of m oney from Illinois' taxpayers to build new 13



### coal power plants. 14



### It should be a foregone conclusion that 15



### we're not interested in destroying our climate in 16



### exchange for writing a big check to a few greedy 17



### energy companies. Yet they hope to find us 18



### asleep at the wheel. And it's only through rules 19



### like this that we'll finally send a message that 20



### no, we're not interested in what they're selling. 21



### These rules reflect the values that I 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### know are common and are (unintelligible) 1



### reflection of the needs of the needs of today. 2



### They may not reflect the interest of a handful of 3



### companies who own some of the most harmful parts 4



### of our infrastructure, but that's irrelevant. 5



### There are many more companies who, if given an 6



### opportunity, will supply us with clean energy. 7



### All that is necessary is to level the playing 8



### field so that our future is not stolen from us. 9



### Thank you. 10



### MS. NOONAN: Thank you both. 11



### Next up Alexandra Siporia and Caitlin 12



### Grey. 13



### MS. GREY: Sorry. Excuse my frantic 14



### nature. I was just informed I was going to 15



### testify, so since it's slightly unprepared

-- my 16



### name is Caitlin Grey, C

- A

- I

- T

- L

- I

- N, last name 17



### Grey, G

- R

- E

- Y. 18



### I'm a second year at the University of 19



### Chicago, and I'm part of the UChicago Climate 20



### Activists Network and more largely part of the 21



### Chicago Y outh Climate Coalition. 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### I know that you've heard a lot of young 1



### people today talk about why this is important 2



### because this is our future, and we have to raise 3



### our children in this environment. 4



### And my personal story of that is that I'm 5



### actually from Cali fornia. I'm from Alameda, 6



### which if you've been to the Bay Area, you'll know 7



### it's an island in the San Francisco Bay. 8



### Basically, it's built out of landfill. And so 9



### Alameda is predicted to be under water by 2050. 10



### This is where I've grown up since I was f ive 11



### years old. This is where all my family and 12



### friends are. A lot of people think I just care 13



### about the environment because I'm from California 14



### and kind of stereotype that, but actually, this 15



### is a very real situation for me, and I might want 16



### to raise my children there, and I might not be 17



### able to do that. 18



### I really love this quote, and it goes

-- 19



### I'm probably going to butcher it, but it goes 20



### something like that: We borrow the planet from 21



### the next generation. And basically I just feel 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### that we can't do som ething that will abuse what 1



### we have coming. So it's very ironically 2



### unsustainable. 3



### So, that's all I have to say. Thank you. 4



### MS. SIPORIA: Hello, I'm Alexandra 5



### Siporia, and I'm here for two reasons. I'm very 6



### concerned about the global warming and the i mpact 7



### the heat will have on the elderly. I have 8



### elderly parents, and my best friend is also 9



### elderly. And every summer when there's a heat 10



### wave, they die. 11



### And the increased heat is also wreaking 12



### havoc on the climate of my home state of Texas. 13



### They had su ch a severe drought last summer that 14



### they had multiple fires, like wild fires, and I 15



### actually know people who lost property. 16



### And I'm also here because I don't want 17



### more coal plants being rebuilt because I've been 18



### getting mercury poisoning repeatedly, and I think 19



### that the coal

- fired power plants are partially 20



### responsible and added a huge impact on my life. 21



### I had to go on a leave of absence, and I 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### got a failing grade when I'm usually an A 1



### student. 2



### So, if you would just keep those facts in 3



### mind when you go to limit the pollution, I would 4



### appreciate it. 5



### MS. NOONAN: Thank you both very much. 6



### We have short gap here. And if anyone 7



### who has not registered to speak or has decided 8



### they would like to speak extemporaneously, we 9



### would welcome that opportunity. If you want to 10



### come to the table just

-- as with everyone else, 11



### just say your name and affiliation, and spell 12



### your name would be helpful. 13



### MR. MARTINEZ: Anthony Martinez. 14



### MS. NOONAN: Wait. Once you get started. 15



### MR. MARTINEZ: Anthony Martinez, with the 16



### Beyond Coal Campaign. 17



### MS. NOONAN: Okay. And can you spell 18



### Martinez, please? 19



### MR. MARTINEZ: M

- A

- R

- T

- I

- N

- E

- Z. 20



### MS. NOONAN: Thank you. 21



### MR. MARTINEZ: And I'm from the southeast 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### side of Chicago. The highest

-- it has the 1



### highest rate of asthma. Many pe ople I know in 2



### the area also have cancer. I also have five 3



### members that have cancer. Three of them already 4



### passed away. 5



### And there are so many coal plants in that 6



### area. The coal dust lands on houses, cars, 7



### streets, flying in the air. And the people tha t 8



### breathe. And you'll see people walking around in 9



### masks in the area. 10



### Just a few weeks ago a 19

- year

- old family 11



### friend wrote on his Facebook that him and a few 12



### friends were dirt biking on the coal hills in the 13



### rain unknowingly the dangers of what happens to 14



### them by doing that. I wrote him right away, make 15



### sure you wash up really good and gargle. I pray 16



### that the under ac knowledge d people could live in 17



### good one day in the area. 18



### Thank you very much. 19



### MS. NOONAN: Thank you. Just stay. 20



### MS. DIXON: Yes, I 'm Suzanne Dixon, and 21



### that's D

- I

- X

- O

- N. I was registered to vote, but 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### somehow I must have gotten lost. 1



### I'm representing a group called the 2



### Kalamazoo River Sturgeon for Tomorrow and also 3



### the Saug atuck Dunes Coastal Alliance, and I am a 4



### member of the Leagu e of Women Voters, but I don't 5



### have their permission to speak in their name, but 6



### I would like to inform you that the defense of 7



### the Clean Air Act has been a priority within our 8



### organization, and we've been working on that. 9



### I want to thank you for giving u s this 10



### opportunity. 11



### I'm from the eastern shores of Lake 12



### Michigan, so that's

-- I'm in the Saugatuck Dunes 13



### Coastal Region, and that's in western Michigan. 14



### We have a tourist and a fruit

- growing 15



### economy. The air quality in my county is 16



### compromised because of the lack

-- we have a lack 17



### of industry, and we have a low population. Yet 18



### today we have a clearer action alert today. 19



### This isn't July. We don't have

-- it's 20



### not a hot day. We, you know, enjoy those cool 21



### breezes, and it's not Chicago, so I just want to 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### let you know that. 1



### I come before you to tell you about the 2



### loss of our family dog, about dredging in our 3



### community, and about sturgeon. 4



### I'm a member of a sturgeon rehabilitation 5



### organization working hard to increase the 6



### Kalamazoo River's small threate ned population. 7



### We were extremely fortunate to receive a rearing 8



### facility last year and celebrated the releases of 9



### about 130 juvenile sturgeon. 10



### This year the story is very different. 11



### We had a severe storm event which caused a local 12



### dam operator to relea se a rush of water which 13



### washed out the equipment placed to capture the 14



### eggs for the rearing facility. These storms are 15



### unfortunately becoming more frequent. 16



### The lack of snow pack caused bank 17



### collapse which is damaging our spawning sites. 18



### The sediment f ills our recreational harbor. The 19



### local marina operator has had to adjust his 20



### dredging schedule around a changing spawning 21



### season due to early warming water. This 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### necessary dredging catches our juvenile sturgeon 1



### to be dumped into spoil piles. 2



### Another dr edging contributor is the lower 3



### water levels that we're experiencing. With 4



### little ice cover, more evaporation is occurring. 5



### Carbon pollution left unchecked is contributing 6



### to these more frequent and severe storms, 7



### increasing these water temperatures and t he 8



### never

- ending need to dredge. 9



### We also have a severe insect problem. 10



### They're over wintering and presenting themselves 11



### earlier and in greater numbers. We've been 12



### picking ticks off of ourselves and our pets since 13



### February. My dog and my next

- door neighb or's dog 14



### both died from Lyme's Disease within the last few 15



### months. And her other dog is currently being 16



### treated for the disease. 17



### I support these reasonable standards to 18



### control carbon emissions from new electricity

-- 19



### on new electric utility generating u nits. 20



### When I need replacing

-- when I have to 21



### replace things in my home, I

-- you know, for 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### instance when I needed a new furnace, I got a 1



### high

- efficiency furnace. I get, you know, more 2



### efficient operating refrigerators, and, you know, 3



### I really do expect the same thing from utility 4



### companies. As they build new utility plants, I 5



### think that they should be using the current 6



### technology that we have as being built by our 7



### American companies and prevent this pollution as, 8



### you know, the technology is available to them. 9



### I'd finally like to say that my local 10



### representative and the Michigan State Attorney 11



### have been

-- both intend to continue to obstruct 12



### your rules. And I see this as a political issue. 13



### I'd like to offer my support to these 14



### proposed rules for cleane r air, and I intend to 15



### make sure my opinions are heard in my community. 16



### Thank you. 17



### MS. NOONAN: Thank you both. 18



### Other folks who would like to

-- okay. 19



### MR. CARSTENS: Ross Carstens, C

- A

- R

- S

- T

20



### E

- N

- S. I am a fourth

- year student at the 21



### University of Chica go and work with University of 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### Chicago Climate Action Network and the Chicago 1



### Y outh Climate Coalition

. 2



### And I wanted to express my support for 3



### these rules, and also, I do feel that somewhat 4



### more aggressive action, if that were taken with 5



### fewer loopholes an d response to existing plants 6



### would be absolutely fantastic. 7



### I guess my personal story about why I 8



### feel this way

-- I'm originally from New York. 9



### Almost all of my family has lived on Long Island 10



### for the last

-- I don't know

-- hundred years, I 11



### guess. A nd almost all of my family has houses 12



### along the coast of Long Island that would in 13



### coming years because of climate change will 14



### become nonexistent. They would become submerged 15



### in the ocean. I would have no place to live 16



### really. 17



### And expecting these rule s are

-- and 18



### rules like them are a big part of an effort to 19



### save territories like that island just talked 20



### about

-- islands in San Francisco, many places 21



### like this where, you know, people's homes, 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### livelihoods get destroyed. 1



### For me, personally, also I had a sthma as 2



### a kid. I remember a number of times on the 3



### playground in kindergarten, and first grade, 4



### second grade, third grade where I was just 5



### playing football with my friends or something 6



### that any kid should be able to do and enjoy, and 7



### then all of a sudden I just couldn't breathe, and 8



### I would collapse not be able to move. And it was 9



### just this horrible feeling of helplessness and, 10



### you know, you think you're about to die. And 11



### then when that's something growing up as a kid 12



### that keeps happening over and over again because 13



### of things like pollutants in the atmosphere, 14



### because of too much carbon, it really can be very 15



### debilitating. And I'd really like to express my 16



### firm support for these rules to make people's 17



### lives better. 18



### MS. NOONAN: Okay. 19



### MR. ELLIS: Hi, m y name is David Ellis. 20



### That's D

- A

- V

- I

- D, E

- L

- L

- I

- S. I actually live in 21



### northwest Indiana, and I’m a member of the 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### Executive Committee for the Hoosier Chapter of 1



### the Sierra Club, which is the Indiana Chapter of 2



### Sierra Club; and also, I represent our local 3



### group which is the Dunelands Group. So, we're in 4



### northwest Indiana. I've lived pretty much my 5



### whole live in northwest Indiana in the industrial 6



### sacrificial zone which is Lake County. So I 7



### pretty much lived within just a few miles of 8



### heavy industry, som e of the heaviest industry 9



### around. 10



### I swam in Lake Michigan as a kid. And I 11



### remember sometimes when the wind was coming off 12



### the lake when I was a kid, we would smell some 13



### funny things in the air, but we never really 14



### thought much about it. I also experien ced 15



### childhood asthma. Fortunately, I guess I outgrew 16



### it. I don't know any other

-- better way about 17



### it. 18



### Currently I'm training for a m arathon if 19



### you can believe that

-- as a runner, a distance 20



### runner. I'm kind of slow but steady. And when I 21



### think of c arbon dioxide pollution in these 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### regulations, I feel like we're taking our first 1



### baby steps, and it's a 100 yard dash. Now I'm 2



### preparing for a marathon which is 26.2 miles. If 3



### I approached a hundred yard dash with the pace of 4



### a marathon runner, we'd lose . I would lose by a 5



### significant margin I believe. 6



### And I know that this rulemaking is a 7



### first step. The EPA is about as old as I am. 8



### We're part of the same generation so to speak. 9



### And I know it's always a tough battle to get 10



### industry to change. And I think that's really 11



### critical that we need to change a lot faster than 12



### what we're used to. And I think the proposed 13



### rule can have some teeth. That's for sure. 14



### But I would like to see

-- aside from 15



### output of carbon dioxide emissions from the new 16



### power pla nts to include a full, more 17



### comprehensive life

- cycle analysis of the carbon 18



### dioxide emissions that those plants will produce, 19



### including extracting the coal, transporting the 20



### coal, burning the coal, and finally, disposing of 21



### the waste products from coal com bustion. I think 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### that would be a more comprehensive approach and a 1



### more systemic long

- term view of the real impacts 2



### of these proposed power plants. 3



### We do have different ways to do it, but 4



### we do need to act quickly as a society to move 5



### beyond these kind s of pollution. 6



### There was a time when people didn't 7



### really believe that there were invisible things 8



### that could make us sick. And we found out using 9



### microscopes that there were bacteria. And 10



### eventually we've discovered viruses. 11



### And I hear people today saying that, 12



### well, carbon dioxide is something that we exhale. 13



### It can't be that bad for us, or maybe, it's not 14



### our fault as society and humanity that things are 15



### changing. But I think that shouldn't excuse us 16



### from taking steps to change things as we can, 17



### honestly. 18



### And I know that the

-- I do trust that 19



### the mission of the EPA is to ultimately protect 20



### our environment, but I think that we need to act 21



### quickly. And the tighter the rules can be and 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### the more comprehensive and far

- reaching that they 1



### would be wou ld be a great benefit to humanity and 2



### all the rest of the species on this great blue 3



### and green earth that we inhabit, and it's the 4



### only home I know. 5



### Thank you. 6



### MS. NOONAN: Thank you both. 7



### UNIDENTIFIED SPEAKER: Need two more? 8



### MS. NOONAN: Sure. Pleas e. 9



### Anyone else in the audience who would 10



### like to testify at this time? 11



### MS. HERHOLD: My name is Carole Herhold. 12



### That's C

- A

- R

- O

- L

- E, last name H

- E

- R

- H

- O

- L

- D. And 13



### it's pronounced Herhold like Harold Washington I 14



### always say, and the second H is Spanish, so you 15



### don't sound the second H. So while I don't look 16



### like I'm all of these things, I am. I'm 17



### everyone. That's what I signed on the list. 18



### I am just reading again the statement of 19



### Jenny Noonan, and she says we are here today to 20



### listen to your comments on EPA's proposed carbon 21



### pollution standard for new power plants. And 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### that's why I'm here. I've never done this 1



### before. That one lady was saying she had, you 2



### know, done it all of her life at local, state, 3



### national. 4



### And I was with the group in the area by 5



### the big flamingo bird and, you know, I had my 6



### blue shirt on and all of the proper

-- I had 7



### never chanted before. I mean, you know, this is 8



### like I'm going into my childhood finally. 9



### And that was what brought me to remember 10



### the big noise in our drivew ay in the wintertime. 11



### And it would be the coal truck coming and 12



### pushing the coal down the chute into our special 13



### bin in the basement where the coal would be kept, 14



### and then my dad would come and shovel it out of 15



### there and into the furnace. And, you know, the n 16



### it would come the registers upstairs, and we'd 17



### have all these black marks around the registers 18



### because of all the coal dust. So we have come a 19



### long way. And I just wanted to give you that 20



### little bit of history and say thank you very much 21



### for what yo u have done which is so foreign to all 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### I remember as a child. 1



### MS. NOONAN: Thank you. 2



### MS. HERHOLD: Your turn. 3



### MS. JOSEPH: My name is Ann Joseph, and a 4



### week ago I had said that I would testify. And 5



### then as I looked over a lot of the issues for the 6



### env ironment I'm saying, yes, we need to worry 7



### about carbon emissions. And I certainly support 8



### this limitation, but at the same time I have 9



### environmental concerns which go beyond this. 10



### Our demand for energy in this world is 11



### overwhelming. And my fear is that as we focus on 12



### the carbon emissions, that seeing that natural 13



### gas has less carbon, that we will turn to natural 14



### gas. And natural gas is not that available. 15



### And I'm reading in these terrible stories 16



### about what is happening with fracking. So, yes, 17



### I'm ve ry concerned about the air pollution, but I 18



### am also concerned about the water pollution that 19



### comes from this alternative fossil fuel. I 20



### continue to be very concerned about all fossil 21



### fuels on both levels. 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### This is not to say that I do not support 1



### this lim itation. I definitely do. And I support 2



### practically everything that I have heard since I 3



### came in here today, but I don't necessarily feel 4



### the need to repeat that because I don't have 5



### anything new to say on that. I just hope that 6



### the EPA will take a broa d look at protecting the 7



### environment which is your responsibility. 8



### Thank you. 9



### MS. NOONAN: Ms. Joseph, would spell your 10



### name into the microphone? 11



### MS. JOSEPH: First name, A

- N

- N. Last 12



### name, J

- O

- S

- E

- P

- H. 13



### MS. NOONAN: Thank you both. 14



### Okay. Joseph West on and Dr. Lora 15



### Chamberlain

. 16



### [Pause.] 17



### MS. NOONAN: Is Dr. Chamberlain here? 18



### DR. CHAMBERLAIN : Yes, I'm ready. 19



### MS. NOONAN: Oh, okay. You can actually 20



### sit right at the table. 21



### DR. CHAMBERLAIN : Oh. 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### MR. WESTON: Good evening, ladies and 1



### gentlemen of th e committee. Thank you for 2



### letting me speak here today. 3



### My name is Joe Weston. I am a graduate 4



### of West Point and a two

- time veteran of Operation 5



### Iraqi Freedom, with the First Brigade Combat 6



### Team, 82nd Airborne Division. Currently I serve 7



### in the Army Re serves, and I'm a graduate student 8



### at the University of Chicago's Harris School of 9



### Public Policy. And today I represent the 10



### Operation Free Campaign. 11



### It was just over a year ago in North 12



### Carolina that I was huddled in a parking garage 13



### watching a tornado p ass through downtown Raleigh. 14



### As the tornado darkened the sky and passed me by, 15



### my friend, an Army helicopter pilot, was minutes 16



### from being trapped in a Lowe's Home Improvement 17



### Warehouse in Sanford, North Carolina. Nearby 18



### Fort Bragg sustained damage to ve hicles, 19



### equipment, and facilities. Soldiers training 20



### were called in from the field, and immense work 21



### began to get accountability of damage across the 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### installation and at our homes. 1



### Training and resources, jumps, were all 2



### postponed and millions of dollars were sacrificed 3



### over these canceled events alone. 1,706 tornados 4



### hit the United States last year, most of which 5



### were outside of Tornado Alley, and some as far 6



### north as Massachusetts. 7



### The severe weather claimed 553 lives and 8



### caused an estimated $20 billi on in damage. This 9



### wasn't the first especially deadly weather in 10



### recent memory that affected our military. 11



### Hurricane Katrina devastated the coast of 12



### Louisiana, and the 3rd Brigade, 82nd Airborne was 13



### sent to fix New Orleans. My fellow 82nd 14



### paratroopers deployed domestically while there 15



### were two wars abroad, reducing our global 16



### response capability. 17



### While these particular weather patterns 18



### cannot be directly linked to climate change, 19



### scientists have estimated that effects of climate 20



### change will be similar

-- rising water levels, 21



### heat waves, freak storms, and changing weather 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### patterns exacerbated by global climate change 1



### will require increased humanitary aid and 2



### military response. 3



### The Department of Defense recognizes that 4



### climate change is a threat multipl ier, an 5



### accelerant of instability or conflict. With 30 6



### threatened bases at sea level and troops reacting 7



### to instability around the world, the Department 8



### of Defense has serious stake in this issue. 9



### Increasing the regulation of carbon fuels 10



### will mitigate t hese risks and drive the free 11



### market to invest in technology that will reduce 12



### the strain on our military. 13



### To those who argue that disaster and 14



### instability will happen regardless of climate 15



### change, I propose the following metaphor: 16



### Imagine you are visit ing the pediatrician's 17



### office with your child. After the doctor has 18



### finished the examination, he tells you he 19



### believes with a strong certainty that your child 20



### has a fatal condition that, if left untreated, 21



### will eventually kill your child. There are a few 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### other doctors who believe that your child may not 1



### actually have this condition, but if they are 2



### wrong, your child will suffer needlessly and die. 3



### Luckily, the treatment is simple. Live healthy, 4



### exercise, maintain a wholesome diet. This 5



### lifestyle change would impose a cost on your 6



### family, but it would be minor compared to the 7



### potential downside. Would you undergo this 8



### treatment plan for your child? Do you invest in 9



### a healthier lifestyle for the sake of your 10



### child's life, or do you gamble, play the odds, 11



### for the sake of convenience? 12



### Today I implore decision makers who are 13



### the proverbial parents to this nation to make the 14



### smart choice and use the proposed regulation to 15



### further limit greenhouse gases. I ask you to 16



### implement this for our troops, like me, w ho have 17



### had to respond to global instability in 18 hours' 18



### notice and risk their lives wherever and whenever 19



### they are called. 20



### The risk of not implementing this carbon 21



### reduction policy is too great to ignore. The 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### military understands this risk and the impo rtance 1



### of risk mitigation. Implementing a carbon 2



### limitation policy will not only reduce greenhouse 3



### gas emissions but decrease the chances of future 4



### disasters that distract our military from actual 5



### security threats. 6



### Thank you very much. 7



### MS. NOONAN: Than k you. And just spell 8



### your name into the microphone. 9



### MR. WESTON: Joseph Weston, J

- O

- S

- E

- P

- H, 10



### W

- E

- S

- T

- O

- N. 11



### MS. NOONAN: Thank you. 12



### DR. CHAMBERLAIN : Hi, I'm Dr. Lora 13



### Chamberlain . And I am here in support of the 14



### proposed regulation to limit CO 2 

### release

. 15



### And I want to talk about the hidden side 16



### of the world's carbon crisis and climate crisis. 17



### And that's the acidification of the oceans. This 18



### is a severe problem, and hardly anybody talks 19



### about it and relate it to the climate change. 20



### And although all of the other aspects of climate 21



### change are extremely important, so is the 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### acidification of our oceans. 1



### About half of all CO 2 

### emissions are 2



### absorbed by the oceans and chain of this 3



### acidification of the oceans. All of life has a 4



### pH balance based on carbon

-- carbon dioxide

-- 5



### that is extremely regulated to a very fine degree 6



### -- all of us, every single one of us, and thus, 7



### the oceans as well. And so half of all of the CO 2 8



### emissions are absorbed by the oceans, and it 9



### changes the pH in the chemistry of the seas. 10



### This diminishing

-- this acidification of the 11



### ocean decreases the species available. 12



### Definitely extinctions have occurred because of 13



### this, and it disrupts the food supply, affecting 14



### the lives of billions of people and the 15



### livelihoods of many trades from fishermen to 16



### tourism. 17



### So over the last 250 years the oceans 18



### have absorbed 530 billion tons of carbon dioxide, 19



### increasing the acidity of the oceans by 30 20



### percent. The ocean pH had remained stable for 20 21



### million years before we started to burn carbon. 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### An d now we are fastly approaching the extinction 1



### of our coral reefs. 2



### At the present level of CO 2 

### release the 3



### ocean acidity will double by 2100. The southern 4



### oceans are being impacted the greatest as the 5



### polar regions

-- I'm sure people have talked 6



### about th is. The southern oceans will actually 7



### become corrosive, so acidic that they're actually 8



### corrosive by 2050. This immediately impacts 9



### coral reefs and the shell life. 10



### So shells are made by the species 11



### utilizing calcium carbonate, and when the 12



### acidificat ion of the oceans occur, this calcium 13



### carbonate be comes very brittle and unstable so 14



### that shells cannot form. And it's very similar 15



### to osteoporosis in human beings

-- and slowing 16



### the growth of all shell life and including the 17



### very small micro ocean life. 18



### And this affecting the bottom of the food 19



### chain of the oceans will affect the higher levels 20



### of life as well. So acidification also slows 21



### reef building, and all of this combined is 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### affecting the overall numbers of fish that we 1



### have in our ocean and the va riety and the 2



### diversity of life in our ocean. 3



### And the tipping point for the coral reefs 4



### would happen as soon as 2050. So I'm really 5



### begging you to consider the livelihoods of 6



### billions of people and the life supply, the food 7



### supply of billions of people a s you consider this 8



### proposed regulation. 9



### Such a disappearance as the complete 10



### extinction of the coral reefs is going to impact 11



### -- really, I can't even

-- I don't even think 12



### there's estimates of how many people get their 13



### livelihood from the oceans. 14



### I have seen it myself. I'm a SCUBA 15



### diver. And I have seen the disruption of the 16



### coral ribs throughout the Caribbean and 17



### throughout the world. And it's really 18



### devastating. Even Jacques Cousteau said it in 19



### his last years that we must do something to save 20



### the c oral reefs. So please consider the oceans 21



### when you consider your proposed regulations. 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### Thank you very much. 1



### MS. NOONAN: Thank you very much. 2



### We are at

-- we're going to take a five

3



### minute break and then we will come right back. 4



### [Break from 4 : 28 p.m. to 4 : 34 p.m.] 5



### MS. NOONAN: Okay. We're going to start. 6



### Olivia Woollam ? 7



### MS. WOOLLAM: Yes, my name is Olivia 8



### Woollam, W

- O

- O

- L

- L

- A

- M. I am a student at the 9



### University of Chicago and I wanted to testify at 10



### this EPA hearing because I

-- I'm originally from 11



### New Orleans, and I live in a

-- what is 12



### constituted kind of like an environmentally 13



### vulnerable area. And I think that especially 14



### here in Chicago we often think about coal 15



### generation as something that fuels our economy, 16



### fuels our lifestyles, and we don't n ecessarily 17



### think about the direct impact that it has on 18



### lives, especially in

-- even in our own country 19



### but also in other places that are environmentally 20



### vulnerable. 21



### So I wanted to come and speak today 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### because I think it's really important that our 1



### gener ation especially

-- I'm 22. And I think 2



### that our generation is going to be held 3



### responsible for the continuation of the immense 4



### destruction that the last hundred years have 5



### waged on our planet. And I think that it's 6



### incredibly important that the EPA cont inues to 7



### have the capacity and the desire to do what its 8



### original intent was, which is to protect our 9



### natural resources and protect our ability to use 10



### our natural space as well and as for as long as 11



### we can. 12



### And so as far as the creation of yet 13



### more, you k now, production

-- capacity for 14



### generation which is even more than agriculture, 15



### like the highest emitter of greenhouse gases that 16



### we have in our daily lives, I think it's 17



### incredibly important that we try to be rational 18



### about the ways and kind of the priori ties that we 19



### have in developing those facilities. 20



### Thank you. 21



### MS. NOONAN: Thank you very much. 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### Okay. With that, that concludes our 1



### speakers for this afternoon. We will come back 2



### at, I believe, 5:30. So there will be more 3



### speakers at that time. You'r e welcome to rejoin 4



### us or if anyone has been moved to speak at that 5



### point, you're welcome to sign up on the 6



### registration table out there. Thank you. 7



### [Break from 4 : 37 p.m. to 5 : 35 p.m.] 8



### MS. NOONAN: Thank you for attending this 9



### public hearing. My name i s Jenny Noonan, and I 10



### am the Director of the Policy Analysis and 11



### Communications staff at EPA's Office of Air 12



### Quality, Planning, and Standards, and I will be 13



### chairing tonight's hearing. 14



### Joining me on the panel are Christian 15



### Fellner, who is also with EPA's Office of Air 16



### Quality, Planning, and Standards in the Sector 17



### Policies and Programs Division. And also I am 18



### joined by Michael Compher with EPA's Region 5 19



### Office. 20



### We are here today to listen to your 21



### comments on EPA's Proposed Carbon Pollution 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### Standard for New Power Plants. EPA published the 1



### proposed standard in the Federal Register on 2



### April 13th, 2012. This common sense step under 3



### the Clean Air Act would, for the first time, set 4



### national limits on the amount of carbon pollution 5



### that power plants built in the future can emit. 6



### For future power plants EPA is proposing 7



### to set an output

- based standard of 1,000 pounds 8



### of carbon dioxide per megawatt hour. The 9



### Agency's proposal does not apply to existing 10



### units or to planned units that have already 11



### received perm its and break ground within the next 12



### 12 months. 13



### EPA's proposed standard reflects the 14



### ongoing trend in the power sector to build 15



### cleaner plants that take advantage of American

16



### made technologies. The proposal is flexible and 17



### would help minimize carbon pol lution through the 18



### deployment of the same types of modern 19



### technologies that power companies are already 20



### using to build the next generation of power 21



### plants. EPA's proposal would ensure that this 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### progress toward a cleaner, safer, and more modern 1



### power secto r continues. 2



### Today we will be accepting oral comments 3



### on all aspects of our proposal, and we will 4



### prepare a written transcript of the hearing. The 5



### transcript will be available as part the official 6



### record for this rule. We are also accepting 7



### written comm ents on the proposed rule until June 8



### 25th, 2012. 9



### At the registration area, which is 10



### located in the hallway outside of this room, 11



### there are handouts with detailed information for 12



### submitting written comments by mail, fax, or 13



### electronically. EPA will consid er your comments 14



### as we move forward to complete a final rule. 15



### Now let me describe the procedures for 16



### today's hearing. I will call the speakers to the 17



### table in pairs. When it is your turn to speak, 18



### please state your name and your affiliation 19



### before you b egin your testimony. I t would help 20



### our court reporter if you also spell your name. 21



### In order to be fair to everyone, we will 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### limit your testimony to five minutes each; and we 1



### ask that you remain at the table until both 2



### speakers in the pair have finished. After you 3



### finish your testimony, the members of the panel 4



### may ask clarifying question s

. 5



### If, in addition to the transcript of your 6



### testimony, you would also like us to put the full 7



### text of your comments into the docket, please be 8



### sure to give a copy of an y written comments 9



### either to our staff at the registration table or 10



### we will take them here. 11



### We have a time

- keeping system consisting 12



### of green, yellow, and red lights to help you 13



### track your five minutes to speak. When you begin 14



### speaking the green light wi ll come on. The 15



### yellow light will signal that you have one minute 16



### left. When the red light comes on, five minutes 17



### have past and I will ask you to please complete 18



### your testimony. 19



### Today's hearing began at 8: 3 0 this 20



### morning and will continue until 8:00 o'c lock 21



### tonight or later, if necessary, depending on the 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### number of speakers. We've reconvene d twice, and 1



### here we are. 2



### If you would like to testify but have not 3



### yet registered to do so, please sign up at the 4



### registration table. For those who have already 5



### re gistered to speak, we have tried to accommodate 6



### your requests for specific time slots. We ask 7



### for your patience as we proceed through the list 8



### of speakers. We may need to make some 9



### adjustments as the evening progresses. 10



### If any questions arise through out the 11



### evening , please see a staff member at the 12



### registration table for assistance. 13



### Again, thank you all for participating 14



### today. Let's get started. 15



### Our first two speakers for the evening 16



### are Jen Woronecki and Paul Kim. Please come to 17



### the table. 18



### MS. WOR ONECKI: Hi, I'm Jen Woronecki. 19



### It's J

- E

- N

- N

- Y. Woronecki is W

- O

- R

- O

- N

- E

- C

- K

- I. 20



### I had not planned on testifying, so I will try 21



### not to ramble. 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### My affiliations are with Sierra Club, 1



### specifically the Northwest Indiana Group. It's 2



### the Dunelands Group where I am the Secretary. 3



### Also, Moraine Ridge Wildlife Rehab, which is also 4



### in northwest Indiana where I'm the Vice

5



### President. 6



### So I've spent most of my life in 7



### northwest Indiana, also the Chicagoland area, 8



### also a filmmaker and author, was educated here 9



### just a few blocks away at Columbia. So I've 10



### really had my entire life take place in the 11



### Chicagoland area. So I've been exposed to these 12



### toxins the whole length of it. And so have my 13



### family members. My parents were both born in 14



### northwest Indiana and have rem ained here. 15



### We heard about a lot of asthma cases and 16



### statistics . My father was one of those asthma 17



### children, as was I. He kind of, I guess, put 18



### that

-- well, fear of asthma into my head at a 19



### young age. I hadn't been suffering from asthma 20



### yet, but I hea rd the stories of him as a child 21



### growing up in the mid '50's having to be picked 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### up by the ambulance once a week because of his 1



### asthma attacks until his widowed mother finally 2



### had to take him and his brother to Arizona just 3



### so he could breathe. 4



### Once the a sthma cleared up, actually 5



### after a few years there, they came back to the 6



### area where the asthma started up again; but they 7



### didn't have enough money to go back to Arizona, 8



### so they remained. 9



### And then I started having the attacks, 10



### too, once I got into my ear ly teen years. And to 11



### hear about the statistics is

-- well, pretty 12



### disturbing, but I think it was even more 13



### disturbing for my parents to see that. You know, 14



### my dad was used to growing up with it. And it's 15



### a pretty intense thing to experience firsthand, 16



### but I think to see your child go through that

-- 17



### I mean, I know I was pretty stressed out when I 18



### was laying in bed in the middle of the night 19



### suddenly not being able to breathe, but the look 20



### of horror on my parents' face

-- you know, it's 21



### just beyond helpl essness. Just the terror in my 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### mom's eyes thinking that I might die. 1



### And, you know, that's not a statistic. 2



### That's something that is real life that people go 3



### through, and it's

-- I mean, it's terrifying. 4



### I guess what popped into my head and made 5



### me wan t to testify as I was sitting here 6



### listening to everyone's stories was that, you 7



### know, when there are products like cribs that 8



### come out and, you know, the babies are getting 9



### their heads stuck in them, they're recalled. Or 10



### when there are venetian blinds an d toddlers are 11



### getting the cords wrapped around their necks and 12



### being strangled, they're recalled. You know, 13



### infant formula turns out to have some poison in 14



### it. It's recalled. 15



### But these plants have been poisoning kids 16



### for, I mean, how long now? You kno w, my dad was 17



### suffering from this in the '50's. And, you know, 18



### what happens with these plants that are already 19



### in existence? And this is not going to apply to 20



### them. You know, this is a really great start. 21



### Don't get me wrong, this is fantastic, but you 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### know, this has gone on too long. 1



### And this is something that has been 2



### really detrimental to the health of Americans. 3



### You know, when other countries

-- oh, I don't 4



### know, poison Americans in vast numbers, you know, 5



### it might be considered chemical warfare or 6



### terrorism. I don't know why these companies 7



### aren't looked at in such serious terms. 8



### And I think that's something that people 9



### need to start considering, that this isn't just 10



### business. It's not just making money. It's not 11



### just environmentalists versus c orporations. This 12



### is some pretty serious stuff here that is really 13



### threatening the lives of a lot of people. And I 14



### mean, it's not even just the United States. You 15



### know, pollutio n doesn't just stay in one area, 16



### and it doesn't just affect a few things. Y ou 17



### know, this is global. 18



### You know, like everybody said, oceans

-- 19



### you know vast things, large places. You know, 20



### it's a pretty big deal, and it's not just about 21



### global warming. It's about things around us 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### dying and not being able to be brought back. 1



### Tha nk you. 2



### MS. NOONAN: Mr. Kim? 3



### MR. KIM: Thank you. So, I saw something 4



### -- oh, first of all, my name is Paul Kim, P

- A

- U

5



### L, K

- I

- M. I'm a student at the University of 6



### Chicago, and I guess I'm with Sierra Club, too, 7



### in Chicago. 8



### So, I'm a student at the Un iversity of 9



### Chicago, and I'm doing climate research for the 10



### summer. At least I hope to make that into a 11



### career. And I saw something on Facebook the 12



### other day that I thought was very good. 13



### If we had aliens come to earth and emit 14



### something into our atmosp here that they were 15



### pretty sure was going to do huge amounts of 16



### damage to our civilization, we would do something 17



### about it. If that were aliens, we would do 18



### something about it, but if humans are putting 19



### something into the air that we're pretty sure is 20



### goi ng to do a lot of damage to our civilization, 21



### we ought to do something about it just the same. 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### And so I’m glad that the EPA is 1



### considering regulating generation in this way, 2



### especially since it's, I think, the sector of our 3



### economy that makes the most car bon dioxide. I 4



### think that's right. 5



### And we're on our way to way above what 6



### any scientist thinks is reasonable. So, I guess 7



### I'm also here because I think like some other 8



### people have said, the people who are alive today, 9



### but especially my generation, are g oing to be 10



### judged by future generations for what we did on 11



### this subject. And I think it's

-- I think it's 12



### morally incumbent on us for the sake of ourselves 13



### and our children and grandchildren and the people 14



### of the next several centuries that we do the 15



### righ t things to do this. So I’m glad that we're 16



### starting to just directly look at carbon. 17



### That's it. 18



### MS. NOONAN: Okay. Thank you both very 19



### much. 20



### Next up we have Lucinda Hohma n n and Amy 21



### Ochalski. 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### MS. HOHMA N N: I guess I start. The 1



### microphone is facing me. 2



### Thank you, first of all, for the 3



### opportunity to testify in support of EPA's power 4



### plant carbon standard. My name is Lucinda 5



### Hohmann, L

- U

- C

- I

- N

- D

- A, Hohmann, H

- O

- H

- M

- A

- N

- N. 6



### And I'm with the Midwest Office of the Union of 7



### Concerned Scientists. 8



### UCS is the nation's leading science

- based 9



### non

- profit working for a healthy environment and 10



### safer world. So I'm here on behalf of UCS

-- has 11



### more than 350,000 supporters and a network of 12



### about 18,000 scientists who show strong support 13



### for the EPA's efforts to re duce carbon emissions 14



### from coal and oil

- fired power plants under the 15



### Clean Air Act. 16



### UCS works at advancing awareness of both 17



### the science of climate change and the solutions 18



### to help lower emissions and mitigate the worst 19



### impacts of climate change. 20



### There a re many reasons for reduced carbon 21



### emissions, and many of those reasons you've heard 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### about here today. I want to use the time that I 1



### have today to pull all those reasons together and 2



### emphasize the diversity and volume of support for 3



### the rule. So it might work. 4



### I, personally, traveled the Midwest 5



### region extensively over the last seven years and 6



### have had conversations with literally thousands 7



### of individuals who are deeply concerned about 8



### climate change. I've worked with scientists, 9



### economists, business le aders, engineers, 10



### concerned parents, and farmers just to name a 11



### few. And these individuals all have very 12



### different perspectives, but all agree that we 13



### need to reduce carbon emissions and transition to 14



### a clean energy economy. 15



### So let me explain. I grew up on a farm 16



### in rural Wisconsin, and I can you firsthand that 17



### no one cares more about the changing climate than 18



### Wisconsin dairy farmers. So one example of how 19



### climate change is impacting farmers is extreme 20



### heat. Extreme heat puts an enormous amount of 21



### phys ical stress on dairy cattle. And any dairy 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### farmer will tell you that milking cows 1



### experiencing high levels of physical stress will 2



### decline milk production. 3



### During one of my recent trips to Ohio I 4



### spent an afternoon with the president of Dovetail 5



### Solar an d Wind. Dovetail Solar and Wind is a 6



### small firm that specializes in renewable energy 7



### system design and installation. The President 8



### spent the afternoon filling me in on how he 9



### started his company 17 years ago with five 10



### employees and today employs more tha n 40 full

11



### time, well

- paid staff. 12



### Any savvy business owner would tell you 13



### that to stay ahead in the business world you have 14



### to be on the cutting edge of innovation. 15



### And then just a couple of weeks ago I was 16



### at a clean energy event in Michigan, and I aske d 17



### the woman sitting next to me why she decided to 18



### come and attend such an event. And she didn't 19



### say a word but instead pointed to the young boy 20



### sitting beside her. Any parent will tell you 21



### that one of the most important goals in life is 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### to create a bette r world for their child. 1



### So with me today I have 320 comments that 2



### are signed by concerned citizens from Ohio, 3



### Indiana, and Kentucky. And today I would like to 4



### enter into the record these 320 comments in 5



### support of EPA's standards to limit carbon 6



### emissio ns from new power plants. 7



### But I do want to emphasize that these 8



### comments are just a small sample of the hundreds 9



### of thousands of people across the country who 10



### support action to reduce greenhouse gas 11



### emissions, protect our health, and transition to 12



### a clean er energy economy. The diversity and 13



### volume of support for this rule is unmistakable. 14



### We applaud the EPA for moving forward 15



### with these carbon standards for new power plants. 16



### We request that you move quickly to finalize 17



### them, and we urge you to issue str ong carbon 18



### standards for existing power plants without 19



### delay. 20



### Ultimately other forms of strong action 21



### will be required to achieve the full

- scale of 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### deep reductions that are needed to reduce or 1



### avoid some of the worst impacts of climate 2



### change. But these rules are very necessary and 3



### important first steps. 4



### Thank you very much for the opportunity 5



### to speak today. 6



### MS. OCHALSKI: Good evening . My name is 7



### Amy Ochalski. It's spelled Amy, A

- M

- Y, O

- C

- H

- A

8



### L

- S

- K

- I. And I am the Healthy Air Campaign 9



### Manager for t he American Lung Association in 10



### Illinois. 11



### I help raise awareness about the 12



### importance of clean air for healthy communities 13



### and also about how policies created in 14



### Washington, D.C. have a direct impact on the 15



### quality of our air. 16



### And to date 15 Illinois pub lic health 17



### organizations have signed onto our campaign in 18



### support of stronger air pollution standards. Our 19



### partners range in size and scope from small 20



### county health departments to chapters of national 21



### health advocacy organizations. And however, they 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### do s hare a common goal of improving public health 1



### and realize that clean air is fundamental to 2



### achieving this goal. 3



### On behalf of the American Lung 4



### Association and Illinois' Healthy Air Campaign I 5



### want to express support for the proposed carbon 6



### pollution stand ards for new power plants. I 7



### spend a lot of my time talking at health fairs 8



### and community meetings about how public policy 9



### affects the quality of our air we breathe in 10



### Illinois. I explain the intricacies of how EPA 11



### makes the rules, and how these rules so metimes 12



### get weakened or delayed or even eliminated 13



### together. 14



### There are definitely a few things I've 15



### learned as a result. The first is that people 16



### get pretty bored when you talk a lot about public 17



### policy, and the second thing is that people 18



### really do cou nt on you and your colleagues to 19



### look out for their best interests. So they count 20



### on you to make sure the air is clean as it can 21



### possibly be. 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### In 2010 alone the Clean Air Act prevented 1



### 160,000 premature deaths, 1.7 million instances 2



### of asthma exacerbation , 41,000 respiratory 3



### hospital admissions, and 45,000 cardiovascular 4



### hospital admissions. New and improved 5



### regulations are expected to save even more. 6



### So cleaner air will improve the lives of 7



### many of the people in Illinois and throughout the 8



### country. Ple ase make new power plants as clean 9



### as they can possibly be by creating the strongest 10



### possible rules for carbon pollution. 11



### Thank you. 12



### MS. NOONAN: Thank you both. 13



### Next up we have Nadia Oehls e n and Mary L. 14



### Fox. And just so we know who's on deck, next 15



### we' ll have Edward Warren and Grace Pai. 16



### MS. OEHLS E N: Hi, my name is Nadia 17



### Oehlsen. It's spelled just like Nadia, N

- A

- D

- I

18



### A. Last name is O

- E

- H

- L

- S

- E

- N. I’m a volunteer 19



### with the Chicago Group of the Sierra Club. And I 20



### also help out with the Illinois Sier ra Club from 21



### time to time. I've lived in Chicago for most of 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### my life and Illinois for all of my life. 1



### I really appreciate you all extending the 2



### time of the hearing so those of us who work day 3



### jobs can make it out to have our thoughts heard. 4



### I appreciate the many ways in which the 5



### EPA has long

- protected us from our legislators, 6



### from the lack of will or bad decisions of state 7



### and local governments. 8



### Illinois is a prime example of why we 9



### need strong federal environmental regulations to 10



### protect the common in terest when local lawmakers 11



### can't or won't. Right now our state legislators 12



### recently passed

-- and our senators are now 13



### considering

-- a bill I find ridiculous that 14



### would enable a contorted and unfair funding 15



### structure for an unnecessary new power plant i n 16



### Taylorville, Illinois. This is just one example. 17



### If built, Tenaska would eventually convert dirty 18



### Illinois coal into synthetic natural gas only to 19



### create excess electricity we don't currently 20



### need. This electricity could cost residential 21



### and commercial customers more based on unproven 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### carbon sequestration technology, but the company 1



### has not proven that they will actually be able or 2



### willing to use. 3



### Unfortunately, too many of our state 4



### legislators have allowed the prospects of 5



### temporary union jobs, tempo rary vote

- trading 6



### arrangements, promises of college scholarships 7



### and other bribes to cloud their judgment. In 8



### exchange for these short

- term gains, they're 9



### willing to enable the building of a plant that 10



### will ultimately threaten our farmland and water 11



### suppl ies with additional coal mining, our climate 12



### with additional carbon emissions, and our economy 13



### with higher electricity bills. 14



### I am willing to pay more for electricity 15



### that's cleaner, more sustainable, and fair to 16



### everyone. I'm not willing to pay more for what 17



### appears to be another dirty Illinois horse

18



### trading deal that will funnel ill

- gotten funds to 19



### a few at the expense of many. And I'm hoping 20



### additional regulations will stop the building of 21



### this plant and others that may have unacceptable 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### carbon emissi ons in the future. 1



### Climate change is already costing us all 2



### in hotter summers, more extreme weather events, 3



### and mass extinctions. As a consumer who's 4



### concerned about climate change, I am grateful for 5



### the prospect of common sense federal regulations 6



### that can limit carbon emissions from new power 7



### plants, protecting our battered climate even when 8



### too many of our lawmakers lack the foresight or 9



### courage to make the right decisions. 10



### I hope that just when state legislators 11



### are poised to once again fail us, the EPA might 12



### step in to save the day with additional 13



### regulations to limit carbon emissions from power 14



### plants. Thank you. 15



### MS. FOX: Good evening. My name is Mary 16



### Fox, F

- O

- X. 17



### I am here to voice my support for the new 18



### proposed rule to regulate carbon emiss ions for 19



### new coal plants. I have seen the results of the 20



### environmental regulations in cleaner air and 21



### waterways. And this work must continue to 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### preserve our planet and keep it save for our 1



### children and for future generations. 2



### Thank you for your time. 3



### M S. NOONAN: Thank you very much. 4



### Edward Warden and Grace Pai? 5



### MS. PAI: Good evening. My name is Grace 6



### Pai, spelled P

- A

- I. I'm a student at the 7



### University of Chicago. I'm in my second year, 8



### and I’m a member of Chicago Youth Climate 9



### Coalition. 10



### So to start off, I agree wholeheartedly 11



### with everything that I've been here to hear, 12



### which is in, like, the past five or so maybe

, in 13



### support of your proposed regulations. 14



### The perspective that I'd like to provide 15



### is one of both a student and a young person, an d 16



### also someone who just really values or has been 17



### thinking a lot about it recently at least this 18



### (unintelligible) home . So, on Sunday when NATO 19



### was in town, I attended one of the large protests 20



### as part of the environmental block. And so my 21



### prop was a mon arch butterfly. And the reason I 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### had that butterfly was because it symbolized 1



### climate refugees . And so I was thinking kind of 2



### a lot about that that day. 3



### And as a student living in Chicago

-- and 4



### I've only been here two years. I've been 5



### thinking kind of about whether Chicago is my home 6



### or whether my home is actually in Los Angeles 7



### where I am from, and kind of how much I value 8



### this ability to go back to my home that has a lot 9



### of support for me. 10



### And so when I had this butterfly, I 11



### thought about all the pe ople who are affected by 12



### things that they can't control, by rising sea 13



### levels, by climate change, by these kind of

-- 14



### by, like, polluted air. And so I thought that in 15



### terms of just kind of thinking about human 16



### dignity and that ability go back to a home an d 17



### kind of preserve your home and not be forced to 18



### mo v e somewhere by things that you really have no 19



### control over

-- if there is anything that

-- in 20



### the world that I could do to stop that, that I 21



### should and that I would. And so that's why I'm 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### here today is to kind of express my huge support 1



### for these steps that the United States EPA is 2



### taking to combat the affects of climate change 3



### because I think the reach of this regulation is 4



### far beyond anything that I can possibly 5



### comprehend as a student, as a young pers on, as a 6



### citizen of Chicago. And so I just wanted to 7



### thank you for your time and for coming here to 8



### hear our voices. 9



### MR. WARDEN: So my name is Edward Warden. 10



### I am second

- year at the University of Chicago, an 11



### active member of the Chicago Youth Climate 12



### Co alition and a lifelong Chicago resident. 13



### MS. NOONAN: Can you spell your last 14



### name? 15



### MR. WARDEN: Warden, W

- A

- R

- D

- E

- N. 16



### The U.S. is one of the largest 17



### contributors to carbon pollution in the 18



### atmosphere, and it's overwhelmingly clear at this 19



### point human ca rbon emissions are causing global 20



### climate change. This is important to me because 21



### I don't want to live in a world where extreme 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### weather is the norm that devastates our 1



### communities and our homes. And I don't want to 2



### live in a world where the local flora a nd fauna 3



### that I grew up w ith all my life goes extinct or

- 4



### - because it can't adapt quick enough. I don't 5



### want to live in a world where islands and coastal 6



### areas are flooded and we have refugees that we 7



### don't know what to do with and often don't want 8



### to de al with. And I don't want to have to deal 9



### with the expanding ranges of diseases and their 10



### carriers that will find new homes because of the 11



### changing climate. 12



### These things are all things that will 13



### occur and are already occurring because of global 14



### climate c hange. And I feel that it is the burden 15



### of the United States and everyone here to see 16



### that we, as a country, reduce our carbon 17



### emissions. 18



### The new carbon pollution standard for new 19



### power plants is as crucial and important step in 20



### that direction, and I gue ss to keep my testimony 21



### nice and short, as you guys travel the country 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### and garner support and comments, understand that 1



### for me the EPA has unrequited support, and I'm 2



### sure that there are many, many, many people in 3



### Chicago and across this country who will s tand up 4



### and do whatever it takes to make sure that the 5



### things you are doing, like this new standard, go 6



### forward and are established. 7



### Thank you. 8



### MS. NOONAN: Thank you both very much. 9



### Up next, please, Craig Chrispell and 10



### Becky Schillo. And then on deck Elizabeth Stark 11



### and Angie Viandis

-- Viands. 12



### MR. CHRISPELL: Good afternoon, and thank 13



### you for the opportunity to speak today. 14



### My name is Craig Chrispell, C

- R

- A

- I

- G, 15



### C h rispell, C

- H

- R

- I

- S

- P

- E

- L

- L. I work in the 16



### Environmental Affairs Department for Hoosie r 17



### Energy, a rural electric cooperative based in 18



### Bloomington, Indiana. 19



### Hoosier Energy is a not

- for

- profit 20



### generation and transmission cooperative serving 21



### 18 rural cooperatives in central and southern 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### Indiana as well as a portion of southeastern 1



### Illinois. I'm speaking on behalf of our members. 2



### Our comments are also

-- will reflect the 3



### concerns of the National Rural Electric 4



### Cooperative Association. 5



### Hoosier Energy produces electricity with 6



### an increasingly diverse range of energy sources. 7



### These sources inclu de renewable energy such as 8



### landfill gas, hydro, wind, as well as traditional 9



### fuels

-- natural gas, combined cycle, coal, and 10



### gas turbines. 11



### Our members expect and strive for 12



### affordable electricity produced in an 13



### environmental acceptable manner. This rule 14



### effectively, though, deletes an affordable and 15



### abundant domestic fuel source from either use and 16



### innovation. 17



### Problems and aspects

-- or the aspects of 18



### this rule: One, the rule effectively redefines 19



### the source by taking the limits to an alternative 20



### fue l. The standard is based on the performance 21



### of a natural gas combined cycle which EPA has 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### determined constitutes the best system of 1



### emission reduction for th is source category. 2



### And the thing is that EPA is taking the 3



### unprecedented step of defining new so urce 4



### performance standards for both coal

- fired power 5



### plants and natural gas power plants together by 6



### setting the standard for coal

- based power on the 7



### performance of natural gas power plants. 8



### This is a doctrine known as fuel 9



### switching or redefining the sou rce. EPA has said 10



### in the past, and the courts have agreed, that EPA 11



### doesn't have the authority to redefine a source. 12



### Number two, basically a coal

- fired power 13



### plant will have three options. The preferred 14



### option seems to not to use coal and switch to 15



### natu ral gas. Another option would be to use 16



### supercritical older technology, a coal 17



### technology, for 10 years, but over 30 years EPA 18



### is going to hold you to a more stringent standard 19



### and expect you to phase that out. The third 20



### option is to use carbon capture a nd sequestration 21



### which EPA says is technically feasible. There is 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### not any coal

- fired power plant or any power plant 1



### in the world has been able even with substantial 2



### government subsidies to use this technology on a 3



### commercial scale. At this time coal capt ure and 4



### storage is just not economically viable nor 5



### commercially available. 6



### In the preamble to the rule, the NSPS 7



### wouldn't, as proposed

-- not apply to existing 8



### E G Us [phonetic], including existing EGUs that 9



### undertake modifications or are reconstructed. 10



### A lthough emission standards promulgated 11



### by EPA under Section 111(b) of the Clean Air Act 12



### traditionally have applied to modified and 13



### reconstructed facilities. EPA states that it has 14



### insufficient data on which to base greenhouse gas 15



### emission standards for mo dified or reconstructed 16



### sources. 17



### The proposed NSPS limit limits for new 18



### sources must not apply to existing sources in 19



### connection with PSB or NSR applicability. Or EPA 20



### must provide the rule as proposed to make it 21



### absolute ly clear that the rule does not ap ply to 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### simple cycle combustion power plants . EPA has 1



### made statements to this fact that the rule as 2



### drafted would require combustion turbines to 3



### limit operations to only 900 hours or less, which 4



### would have a major affect on system reliability. 5



### Lastly, bec ause of the rule any future 6



### innovation to potentially help energy strategy 7



### and costs in the United States would not be 8



### tolerated whatsoever to coal, the United States' 9



### most abundant domestic energy source. 10



### Also, effectively removing that source of 11



### energy from our country's energy mix raises 12



### additional concerns due to the volatility that 13



### exists in other energy markets. Losing the 14



### option to generate power from coal, which has 15



### been historically stable cost compared to oil and 16



### gas is a risk we shouldn't be wi lling to take at 17



### this point. The fact that the NSPS prevents gas 18



### emissions for power plants will increase 19



### electricity costs for residential consumers and 20



### businesses in the U.S. is beyond dispute. These 21



### higher prices, in turn, will undermine the U.S. 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### econ omy and future progress to curb greenhouse 1



### gas emissions. 2



### Our charter as a rural electric 3



### cooperative is to provide reliable, affordable 4



### electricity for our members. 5



### MS. SCHILLO: Hi, my name is Becky 6



### Schillo, and I'm here today representing myself, 7



### alth ough I did get this really great T

- shirt when 8



### I walked in, so thank you to Sierra Club. 9



### And I'm here today to express my strong 10



### support for the EPA's proposed carbon pollution 11



### standard. This proposed standard represents a 12



### tremendous bold step towards add ressing one of 13



### the most pressing challenges of our time, climate 14



### change. 15



### According to the EPA's own data, existing 16



### power plants are responsible for adding more than 17



### 2.3 billion tons of carbon and other toxic 18



### pollutants into the air. These pollutants not 19



### only harm the communities where the power plants 20



### are located but threaten to further destabilize 21



### our climate, leading to more extreme weather 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### events and stressing the very natural systems 1



### that we all depend on for things like clean air, 2



### clean water, and he althy food. 3



### This September I'll be getting married, 4



### which I'm really excited about. And my future 5



### husband and I really look forward to starting a 6



### family together. But, truthfully, sometimes I 7



### really worry about what type of world we're 8



### creating for our children to grow up in and 9



### whether or not having children is a good decision 10



### at this time. Because I just worry that each day 11



### we're emitting more and more carbon into the 12



### atmosphere, and each day that we don't do 13



### something about climate change, the proble m is 14



### going to get more and more difficult to tackle. 15



### So, I just think , will this be a hot, 16



### crowded polluted world, and is it really, you 17



### know, something that we'd want to have children 18



### in. Or can we kind of come together and think 19



### about ways to stop this threat to stabilize our 20



### climate and to support health ecosystems? 21



### We know that climate change is occurring, 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### and we know there's things we can do about it. 1



### So I really praise the EPA's bold leadership in 2



### enacting these standards to address this critica l 3



### issue. 4



### Thank you. 5



### MR. FELLNER: I just have one clarifying 6



### question on the simple cycle. 7



### MR. CHRISPELL: Yes. 8



### MR. FELLNER: Were you advocating

-- 9



### excuse me

-- just like the complete exemption or 10



### a higher run time limit? Because I note the rule 11



### has those two options, yes. 12



### MR. CHRISPELL: Well, just to

-- just to 13



### clarify

-- I'm sorry. I think just leave that 14



### off the table at this point. 15



### MR. FELLNER: Okay. 16



### MR. CHRISPELL: I mean, if we're going to 17



### talk about coal

- fired power plants and that kind 18



### o f think, I think if

-- those are usually peak 19



### plants anyhow, but if they're needed to run and 20



### there's a limit and they can't run, then here we 21



### go with brown and blackouts and

-- 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### MR. FELLNER: Okay. I just 1



### (unintelligible). 2



### MS. NOONAN: Thank you both. 3



### Elizabeth Stark and Angie Viands. 4



### MS. STARK: Hi, my name is Elizabeth 5



### Stark, and I'm from the State of Michigan. I 6



### have lived in Michigan for the majority of my 7



### life, and I have recently joined the work force 8



### after graduating from Michigan State Univers ity a 9



### couple weeks ago, which Michigan State 10



### coincidentally has

-- is home to the nation's 11



### largest on

- campus coal plant. 12



### I was recently hired by the National 13



### Wildlife Federation to continue my work 14



### organizing the Michigan Students Sustainability 15



### Coalition , which is a growing stateside network 16



### of young leaders in our environmental movement. 17



### We have member from universities, community 18



### colleges, and high schools across the state. 19



### So as a Coordinator of the MSSC , I 20



### represent a wide variety of students all un ited 21



### in making our state and nation a more sustainable 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### and healthy place to live. Almost all of these 1



### students that I've met are fighting dirty energy 2



### on their campuses and communities every day. 3



### At my alma mater at MSU, for example, 4



### several students hav e been working tirelessly to 5



### transition away from our large, on

- campus coal 6



### plant. Students are extremely concerned about 7



### health issues related to living by a coal plant, 8



### something that jeopardizes their life span every 9



### day as well as how our school is ha ving an impact 10



### on the world around us. Many Spartans are sick 11



### of contributing to mountaintop removal in West 12



### Virginia and a changing global climate. 13



### The students at Western Michigan are also 14



### fighting dirty energy in their back yards as we 15



### still deal wit h the aftermath of the tar sands 16



### pipeline spill in the Kalamazoo River. These 17



### students have been adamant about telling their 18



### representatives and peers that this sort of 19



### corporate unaccountability is not acceptable. 20



### At virtually every campus in our state 21



### you can find students taking steps to improve the 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### futures of their communities by encouraging 1



### themselves and others to think and act more 2



### sustainably. 3



### Although our voices are loud and our 4



### efforts are tireless, we find that many 5



### administrators, corporation s, and institutions 6



### around us are not committed to making these to 7



### protect our livelihoods and futures. 8



### As Michiganders we all take pride in the 9



### natural beauty of our state. It seems that no 10



### matter where you come from in Michigan, everybody 11



### has some pris tine shorelines, secluded forests, 12



### or a patch of wildlife to brag about. Although 13



### these things are all highly valued, they continue 14



### to slip away from us more and more each day. 15



### This year we experienced many weather 16



### anomalies, including a bizarrely warm w inter, 17



### which was real upsetting to me

-- I love the 18



### winter

-- followed by late spring freezes. 19



### Clearly there's something very strange and wrong 20



### happening with the climate in our state, and 21



### unless we make drastic changes soon, our identity 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### as Michiganders will soon behind to fade away. 1



### I am confident that the students in 2



### Michigan will continue to fight for what is right 3



### no matter the political context, but support from 4



### the EPA with stronger carbon plant rules and 5



### regulations will be critical to their succe ss on 6



### their campuses and communities. We need these 7



### stronger federal regulations to emphasize the 8



### importance of our message to our communities and 9



### convince them to take more serious action. 10



### It is extremely important to myself and 11



### to the students in Michi gan that the EPA commits 12



### to finalize and publish this carbon rule this 13



### year. We also need the PA to tackle emissions 14



### from existing coal

- fired plants to continue to 15



### decrease our nation's greenhouse gas emissions. 16



### These steps will ensure that future decisi ons 17



### about clean air are set on the right path. 18



### The students of Michigan are counting on 19



### the EPA to help us win our battles and protect 20



### the health, future and identify of ourselves and 21



### our states. Thank you very much. 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### MS. VIANDS: My name is Angie Viands , and 1



### the last name is spelled V

- I

- A

- N

- D

- S. 2



### MS. NOONAN: And I'm sorry I butchered 3



### that. 4



### MS. VIANDS: Fine. And I'm a concerned 5



### citizen and an educator, and I'm here to support 6



### the carbon standard for new power plants. 7



### Our lack of action on the issue of 8



### climate change is, for me, a justice issue. It's 9



### not fair to future generations. I work with 10



### seventh and eighth graders to help them with 11



### different environmental project, including 12



### projects concerning climate change. And a lot of 13



### the youth that I wo rk with, they are, frankly, 14



### very scared about climate change and the fact 15



### that we know it's a problem and we're not doing 16



### anything to address it. They're, frankly, very 17



### scared, and they don't really know what kind of a 18



### world they're going encounter when t hey get 19



### older. 20



### I also

-- a lot of friends that I have

-- 21



### I'm in my 30's, and I have a lot of friends that 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### are couples. And a lot of my friends are 1



### choosing not to have children because they don't 2



### know what our world is going to be like, and they 3



### don't kn ow if they want to bring children into a 4



### world in which we have pumped carbon dioxide into 5



### our atmosphere and, you know, our droughts, 6



### floods, lack of food, people migrating here and 7



### there, increased climate conflict, increased 8



### wars. And, frankly, the fut ure looks very bleak 9



### right now just because we know that this is a 10



### problem and people are not doing anything to 11



### solve the problem. 12



### So, I urge you to support a carbon 13



### standard for new power plants. It's especially 14



### not fair to people that are poor and thos e that 15



### live directly on the land. Those are the people 16



### that are least responsible for the problem, and 17



### they are going to suffer the most. Therefore, 18



### it's a justice issue, and it's frankly not fair. 19



### MS. NOONAN: Thank you both. 20



### Rose Gomez and Liz Uchiya ma. 21



### MS. GOMEZ: Hi, my name is Rose Gomez. I 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### am a Sierra Club volunteer, and I have been for a 1



### while. I have been a volunteer for

-- when my 2



### son started kindergarten. He's now already 19 3



### years old, and he's been my motivating factor as 4



### to why I get invo lved and continue to get 5



### involved in these environmental issues that 6



### affect today and the future generations. 7



### I think that it's our responsibility to 8



### act accordingly to do what we have to do today 9



### and not have those regrets in the future in which 10



### our chil dren will ask us where were you, or what 11



### did you do when

-- before it got to be this bad? 12



### So, I'm urging the U.S. EPA to move forward 13



### because there are alternative energies available 14



### in order not to depend like we have for too long 15



### a period of time with gr ave consequences on 16



### fossil fuels. 17



### If there weren't alternatives, I mean, 18



### there would be lots of question marks as to when 19



### could we or if we could, so on and so forth; but 20



### there are so, so, so many alternatives in order 21



### to be able to move forward and use a lternative 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### energy . And that's not for our sake. That's for 1



### my sake, your sake, your children's sake, and for 2



### this (unintelligible) backlash and have our 3



### children ask us, "Where were you? What did you 4



### do when

-- " and like I said, that

-- my son is 5



### alread y grown already. 6



### [Fire alarm notice.] 7



### MS. NOONAN: No worries. 8



### And following that direction, if there 9



### are speakers and strobes that interrupt 10



### testimony, we will certainly pause and wait for 11



### those events to pass. And I apologize for the 12



### interruption. P lease continue. 13



### MS. GOMEZ: Okay. The battles continue 14



### and I really hope that we're able to move forward 15



### and pass this new rule so that we can be proud of 16



### our decisions that we make today for a better 17



### future and for our kids. 18



### MS. UCHIYAMA: Hello. My n ame is 19



### Elizabeth Uchiyama. It's U

- C

- H

- I

- Y

- A

- M

- A. 20



### I am a Sierra Club member , and I support 21



### the EPA, and I thank you for your hard work on 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### our behalf. 1



### I am also a business owner and I'm a 2



### corporate member of the Blues Foundation, so I 3



### speak for thousand s of musicians and blues

4



### related music professionals when I say it is very 5



### important to us to have clean air and water. 6



### I travel the globe as an ambassador for 7



### the United States, bringing the blues to 8



### countries as diverse as South Africa, Latvia, and 9



### all over Europe. I've been all over Mexico and 10



### Canada. And I say we need to look at ourselves 11



### as a global entity, not just as a United States. 12



### We are all interdependent and interconnected. 13



### And we can learn from other countries. We're a 14



### very young country. 15



### I support this bill, but I think it could 16



### be stronger. I wish it were stronger. I really 17



### would like to see a limit on carbon emissions on 18



### existing as well as new constructions. I'd like 19



### to see limits on carbon emissions for 20



### construction within the next 12 months, not just 21



### things that are going to happen in 2014 and 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### beyond. We don't have any time to waste. We are 1



### now in a crisis. 2



### As a musician traveling the United States 3



### by van, I don’t get to get into an airplane and 4



### fly off to events and pass over wh at's going on 5



### on the ground. I see it through the window of 6



### the van on a highway. I talk to the farmers. I 7



### talk to the people living in small towns. 8



### And I'm seeing firsthand people poisoned 9



### by toxic industrial waste in Mississippi, in 10



### Missouri, in Lo uisiana. I flew over the wetlands 11



### that were affected by the BP oil spill. And 12



### that's not the only oil spill. That's just one 13



### of many going on. There are hundreds of oil 14



### derricks in the Gulf of Mexico. There are tons 15



### and tons of pounds of industrial wa ste going into 16



### the Mississippi River. And all of our rivers are 17



### so sick it's poisoning people that are not here 18



### to testify. 19



### I had a gig in Marshall, Michigan. I 20



### went and played a theater there. I can't go back 21



### there because their river is so polluted t hat 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### people there are getting leukemia and cancer in 1



### rates that are just too toxic for me. I sing for 2



### a living. I cannot risk my lungs. I cannot risk 3



### my endocrine system. 4



### But there are children in these areas 5



### that are forced to play in toxic areas. The y 6



### can't go to the beach by their river in Marshall, 7



### Michigan, anymore because they get sick from it. 8



### It really disturbs me. And I apologize for being 9



### emotional, but it makes me emotional. 10



### Her little boy

-- I decided not to have 11



### children because I couldn' t see bringing more 12



### children into a world that we can't take care of. 13



### My husband had four children with his 14



### first wife. Those kids are not going to have 15



### children because they are so concerned with how 16



### toxic we've made this world. 17



### Of course, because I sp end a lot of time 18



### in hotels, I watch lots of local television news 19



### and lots of local public television. And I've 20



### seen a program about industrial waste in Africa 21



### that was proposed that was caused by over fishing 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### of the sardine population. What people didn 't 1



### realize is that sardines are part of the great 2



### web, a biosphere, that affects the entire world's 3



### ocean. Without the sardine population there to 4



### eat the plankton, the plankton over breeds and it 5



### causes a gas in the ocean that overheats the 6



### ocean and cau ses massive deaths of fish 7



### populations. 8



### What does that mean to the rest of the 9



### world? It means that the people who would be 10



### eating that fish that is murdered by the 11



### overfishing of sardines now have to go in and eat 12



### the animals that should be all over the savannahs 13



### in Africa. And they can't find those animals. 14



### The population of lions is down to about 3,200 15



### creatures. 16



### I was in South Africa

-- they took me on 17



### a safari as part of my tour. It was beautiful. 18



### I was so thrilled to be in actual Africa, look ing 19



### at actual African animals , not in a zoo, not in 20



### Florida's go Africa, but real Africa. And they 21



### were apologizing to me, "We're very sorry, but 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### poachers have taken all of our big game." We 1



### found one elephant. 2



### If that doesn't bother you, then there's 3



### something wrong. This is a global problem. This 4



### is not just America. This is not just here in 5



### Illinois. This is not just Michigan. 6



### Short

- term solutions

-- I'm sorry. I'm 7



### running over; aren't I? 8



### MS. NOONAN: You have

-- 9



### MS. UCHIYAMA: Short

- term sol utions offer 10



### long

- term problems. I'd like to see the EPA act 11



### to limit fracking, to limit construction on 12



### canals and wetlands, and to stop the 13



### prolifigation [sic] of nuclear power plants 14



### faults. 15



### MS. NOONAN: Thank you, ma'am. If you 16



### have written comments , we'll be happy to take 17



### them if there's additional things you wanted to 18



### say. 19



### MS. UCHIYAMA: That kind of covered it. 20



### Thank you very much for listening. And thank you 21



### for being here today. 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### MS. NOONAN: And thank you. 1



### Jimmie Mitchell and John Phillips, 2



### please. 3



### MR. PHILLIPS: Good afternoon. I'm John 4



### Phillips. I'm a Sierra Club member. I also work 5



### at the University of Chicago. 6



### MS. NOONAN: And you spell your name? 7



### MR. PHILLIPS: Oh, P

- H

- I

- double L

- I

- P

- S. 8



### MS. NOONAN: And John with an H or 9



### without ? 10



### MR. PHILLIPS: J

- O

- H

- N. 11



### MS. NOONAN: And I

-- I was going to 12



### come down and listen, but I feel compelled to 13



### speak. And I'm not real organized perhaps, but 14



### I'm a chemical engineer by trade and profession. 15



### I've worked in chemical plants. I know the 16



### chem ical industry a big, but now I work in a 17



### different spot. And people there at the 18



### University are saying to me they can't understand 19



### why people or what people don't understand about 20



### global warming, and people in denial of global 21



### warming are obviously on the lunatic fringe, as 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### they would term it. There's just so much 1



### evidence that I just

-- I, personally, don't see 2



### how somebody could deny that it does exist and it 3



### is going on. 4



### I think with respect to the fossil fuels, 5



### we now know what's going on when you di g up oil, 6



### when you dig up coal, and the pollution that goes 7



### on from that. 8



### I, personally, try to fight global 9



### warming and the associated things by biking to 10



### work and taking public transportation to work. I 11



### do have a four

- cylinder car but choose not to 12



### dri ve it to work and trying to limit my driving, 13



### and do other things like that. 14



### When I do that, I feel like I have to 15



### hold my head up, and I have to be able to look at 16



### myself and say, hey, did you do the best you 17



### could to limit global warming? Did you do th e 18



### best you could to be a good steward of the 19



### environment of our world. 20



### And I think we're at the point where we, 21



### as a world, have to look at what we're doing and 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### where we're going. We're engaged in a big 1



### experiment with our earth, without knowing what 2



### t he end point is. I mean, this isn't something 3



### we're going to do in a test tube over here and 4



### when the test tube is all done, you know, you 5



### just throw it down the drain, or you put it in a 6



### little bottle and it goes away to an incinerator. 7



### It's our world. It's our life, and it's the only 8



### planet we've got, and we are stuck here. And 9



### we're working on an irreversible process of 10



### pumping CO 2 

### in the atmosphere, and it isn't going 11



### to go away. And we are not slowing down ever 12



### since the Kyoto Protocol thing came o ver in 13



### Japan. We haven't slowed down one bit in our 14



### emissions. We haven't made one bit of progress 15



### as a world in slowing down what we're doing. 16



### And I thank you for all that you've done 17



### so far as the EPA because I believe you have 18



### helped immeasurably in the American cleaning up 19



### of our world, our country, but I think we have to 20



### go further. I think we, as a country, have to 21



### show the world that we're serious and that we are 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### going to contribute and cut back and help our 1



### world be a better place. Thank you. 2



### MR. MITCHELL: [Speaking foreign 3



### language.] My name is Jimmie Mitchell, M

- I

- T

- C

4



### H

- E

- L

- L. I'm the Director of Natural Resources 5



### for the Little River Band of Ottawa Indians in 6



### Lansing, Michigan . I am also a manager over a 7



### 40

- P program s in my tribe. And t hank you for 8



### allowing me to be here today to testify. 9



### I’m not testifying on behalf of my tribe 10



### or my position within my tribe but actually on

-- 11



### because of a friend who couldn't be here today. 12



### And she searched long and hard to find somebody 13



### that would co me and speak up for her, and I hope 14



### that I don't fail her in any way. 15



### The world that we knew 177 years ago was 16



### much different than it is today. The world that 17



### we had here was beautiful and pristine. The 18



### things that we had were in abundance that 19



### provided so much for us. And now today we're 20



### worried about the fish that we feed our children 21



### a s Indian people , about t he species that are of 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### cultural significance to us, the wolf, the moose, 1



### our wild rice, some of the things that are 2



### required for us to maintain our culture identi t y. 3



### And why it's so important t o us as Indian 4



### people is because we lost (unintelligible)

. 5



### After we signed the treaty of 1836, it was within 6



### one generation of our people's existence after 7



### that treaty was signed that we lost everything. 8



### We lost all the trees. We lost the ability to 9



### drink the water, and we really became wards of 10



### the state, and we struggled, and we suffered for 11



### a very long time until such time that people 12



### forgot about us. 13



### When they forgot about us, we maintained 14



### our ident ity as well as we could. And so the 15



### earth began to try and heal itself, and it has in 16



### some ways, but there is a second wave coming now. 17



### And it's in the form of a poison. It's poison 18



### that comes into the ground and comes into the 19



### water. And it comes in th e form of the way that 20



### it affects the atmosphere and the ozone layer. 21



### And the things that we rely on again to maintain 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### our

-- this identity, our kinship with mother 1



### earth i s being degraded before our eyes. And so 2



### now we're becoming fearful t o feed our ch ildren 3



### that fish, or to take that wild rice, or to even 4



### harvest certain animals because we know that the 5



### existence that they have now is so fragile that 6



### they're on the brink of extinction. 7



### And so I applaud the measures today that 8



### the EPA is taking and tha t

-- your request for 9



### this standard. And in speaking

-- having the 10



### pleasure in the past of speaking with EPA 11



### Administrator Johnson and having the ability to 12



### ask questions of him at a time during his tenure, 13



### I asked him, "Why would the EPA consider taking a 14



### known pollutant like mercury and trying to 15



### classify it as a non

- hazardous air pollutant?" 16



### And anybody that knows Stephen would know that he 17



### would smile because he was a scientist. And he

- 18



### - in a way that he tried to make things happen 19



### during his admini stration he said, "We don't have 20



### any standards now. And we didn't have any 21



### standards before. And it was our ability to 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### begin somewhere." It was our choice to start 1



### with something because we need to start 2



### somewhere. 3



### So maybe this is the beginning of tha t. 4



### Maybe this is the beginning o f looking at 5



### creating the standard f or this particular future 6



### proposal of these affects on our planet, but 7



### again, I think a lot of people have said here 8



### maybe we need to take a step back and reevaluate 9



### what's currently happ ening, what's been 10



### continuing to happen, and those things aren't 11



### going to change. 12



### The effects of what's happened up to this 13



### date

-- if we stop polluting today, it will take 14



### a thousand yea r s

-- a thousand years before those 15



### facts will finally diminish to t he point where 16



### the earth can heal itself again. And so we all 17



### need to start somewhere. 18



### And the responsibility, again, goes back 19



### to all of us as people because I think if we all 20



### think back what's going on in our own respective 21



### homes, how many of the wall works that we have 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### plugged in the wall that are knowingly passing 1



### energy through them. And for what? Maybe 2



### nothing. Maybe it's just sitting there with 3



### nothing even attached to it. 4



### So those are the types of things that we 5



### all need to take responsibilit y for, not just put 6



### it at the feet of the EPA, or the government, or 7



### the coal

- fired power plant owners, but ourselves 8



### because it's going to take us all to create the 9



### solutions for this. 10



### Thank you. 11



### MS. NOONAN: Thank you both. 12



### Okay. Marie Socha and Xhoa na Ah m eti. 13



### MS. SOCHA: Hi, my name is Marie Socha, a 14



### recent college graduate, and recently

-- and I've 15



### been involved in anti coal efforts for a while

. 16



### I'm learning more than ever about coal and how it 17



### pollutes the more that I'm surprised about how 18



### we've regulated it

, and now that we've defeated 19



### Fisk and Crawford, we can breathe easier. 20



### But

-- and because they had been

-- they 21



### were grandfathered in, we didn't have a chance to 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### really get them on setting a standard, but now we 1



### have the chance to set the sta ndard and have a 2



### historic moment of regulating carbon for the 3



### first time in history. And this historic moment 4



### is such a big thing for the EPA and for

-- and I 5



### -- I want to support it and to encourage it to 6



### being pushed forward. 7



### For the first time, I left the country 8



### this January, and I went to Peru, to Lima, Peru, 9



### to work on a

-- our bio culture project . And I 10



### experienced some surprises there. The more I 11



### learned about it, trying to grow food there

-- 12



### there was very limited water because their

-- 13



### their w aters are gotten from this glacier. And 14



### because of climate change, the river is really 15



### nothing now, and they're not going to have any 16



### water from this glacier by 2050 they estimate. 17



### And this is because of climate change, 18



### and so, this is a really urgent th ing that we 19



### really consider the emissions of carbon. This is 20



### a historic moment, and I hope that the EPA will 21



### really step up and really push this over. 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### Thank you. 1



### MS. NOONAN: Thanks. 2



### MS. AHMETI: Hi, my name is Xhoana 3



### Ahmeti. It's spelled X

- H

- O

- A

- N

- A, space, A

- H

- M

4



### E

- T

- I. I am a second year a t DePaul University. 5



### I am an environmental public policy major, and 6



### I've been working with Chicago Youth Climate 7



### Coalition as well as in connection with the 8



### Sierra Club. And I think for the past six 9



### months, and I' d just like to say that it's 10



### changed my life, and I feel like we have a lot to 11



### learn from building community a nd not only 12



### building community with other privileged citizens 13



### like ourselves but also I think the global 14



### community and how our actions affect its faith 15



### and the faith of people we'll probably never 16



### meet, are related to, whose pain we'll never 17



### feel. And that includes names will never be 18



### known. 19



### And I'd like to encourage the passing of 20



### this law on the basis of community and on the 21



### basis of justice bec ause I feel like I have 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### learned a lot about those two things in the past 1



### six months that I spent fighting our enormous and 2



### perceivable threat. 3



### And I hope that you will consider the 4



### fate of not only ourselves and our interests but 5



### those of people we don't even know. 6



### Thank you. 7



### MS. NOONAN: Thank you both. 8



### We're going to take a five

- minute break, 9



### and we'll come back after that. 10



### [Break from 6:40 p.m. to 6:50 p.m.] 11



### MS. NOONAN: Could Caty Bautista and Rich 12



### Summins

-- and in case you've just arrived, 13



### you'l l get five minutes to speak. Please both 14



### come and sit at the table and just stay there 15



### until both of you are completed speaking. We may 16



### ask you a question or two. We may not. Welcome. 17



### And thank you for coming. 18



### And spell your name into the

-- say your 19



### name, your affiliation and spell your full name, 20



### if possible. 21



### MS. BAUTISTA: Okay. My name is Caty, C

- 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### A

- T

- Y, Bautista, B

- A

- U

- T

- I

- S

- T

- A. And I’m a 1



### volunteer with the Sierra Club and just an 2



### environmentally conscious person, too. 3



### So, living in south Chic ago, I've always 4



### been surrounded by one polluting industry after 5



### another. The list is long. I'll just name a 6



### few: landfills, a power company which while 7



### based in Indiana is just a stone's throw away 8



### from my neighborhood, an old petroleum coal 9



### plant, hug e stockpiles of coal which are 10



### literally in my backyard, the remnants of three 11



### retired steel mills which wreaked environmental 12



### havoc during their heyday. 13



### It wasn't until I was older that I 14



### realized the serious health effects of living in 15



### such close prox imity to so many high polluting 16



### companies. It's common to walk down the street 17



### and overhear that someone has recently been 18



### diagnosed with cancer, that someone's child was 19



### taken to the hospital due to their asthma. There 20



### are alarming high rates of both th ese health 21



### issues prevalent in south Chicago. 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### One would imagine that strides would be 1



### made to improve the environmental health of the 2



### community, but businesses and local government 3



### move away from introducing plans that would 4



### continue to negatively affect the health and well 5



### being of my neighborhood. 6



### The sad fact is that south Chicago 7



### continues to battle with companies that generate 8



### tons of pollution, companies like a cement plant 9



### that would add tons and tons of added pollution, 10



### companies like a coal gasif ication plant that 11



### would also add tons and tons of pollution. 12



### I'm sharing with you this brief and sad 13



### overview of the environmental state of south 14



### Chicago because I think it highlights the 15



### importance of having regulations and limits in 16



### place to keep pollu tion levels from reaching such 17



### deadly levels. It's often communities like south 18



### Chicago because it's a low income community, 19



### because it has a working class status that it is 20



### targeted and allowed to be exploited, that it is 21



### acceptable for the people in my community to get 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### sick, that the companies can make a profit. 1



### Adding caps to limit the amount of carbon 2



### power plants can produce is a great stride in the 3



### right direction. I hope this is just the 4



### beginning of the EPA's effort to protect not only 5



### marginaliz ed communities like south Chicago but 6



### our environment as a whole. 7



### Thank you. 8



### MR. SUMMINS: My name is Rich Summins. 9



### That's S

- U

- M

- M

- I

- N

- S. And I’m a member of the 10



### Sierra Club as well. 11



### I apologize if my remarks seem redundant. 12



### I haven't been here for mo st of the other 13



### speakers. I think what's clearly at stake here 14



### is the limits on carbon pollution, carbon being a 15



### global

- warming gas. 16



### I a m not a climatologist, and so I ask 17



### myself: In this issue, who do you trust? Who 18



### are you going to believe? There's a great deal 19



### of smoke, literally and figuratively. 20



### So I went looking for the scientists who 21



### have supported the theory of global warming and 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### those who have speared it . And here's just a 1



### little bit of what I found. 2



### Right now the American Lung Association

, 3



### which has been combating lung disease for over a 4



### hundred years, they've urged their members to 5



### come to this hearing today and to fight for the 6



### protection against power plant pollution. The 7



### World Health Organization, which has been in 8



### business for more th an 60 years, led the fight 9



### against smallpox and currently is the United 10



### Nations main health organization

-- I say it's 11



### the health organization

-- said in a recent 12



### article on their website: Climate changes over 13



### recent decades have probably already affected 14



### some health outcomes. There is now recognition 15



### that global climate change poses risks to human 16



### population growth. 17



### And I'm sure you're familiar with the 18



### Interim Governmental Panel on Climate Change. I 19



### won't bore you with all the details. I will say 20



### the re have been some very rational criticisms of 21



### the Intergovernmental Panel's on Climate Changes 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### conclusions, but on March 13th, 2010, an open 1



### letter signed by over 250 scientists in the 2



### United States was sent to U.S. Federal Agencies 3



### that

-- quote

-- none o f the handful of 4



### misstatements out of hundreds and hundreds of 5



### unchallenged statements remotely undermines the 6



### conclusion that warming of the climate system is 7



### unequivocal and that most of the observed 8



### increase in global average temperatures since the 9



### mid 20th century is very likely to have observed 10



### increase in ant h ropogenic greenhouse gas 11



### concentrations. 12



### So even those people who agree with the 13



### criticisms still agree

-- or agree with the

-- or 14



### have

-- I'm sorry

-- disagreements with the 15



### conclusions still overall support the 16



### conclusions. 17



### The IPCC has been endorsed by, among 18



### other scientific bodies, a joint science academy 19



### statement in 2001, Canadian Foundation for 20



### Climate and Atmospheric Scientists, the Canadian 21



### Meteorological and Oceanographic Society, t he 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### European Jewish Scientists Union, the 1



### International Council for Science, and the 2



### National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration, 3



### the United States National Research Council, and 4



### the Network of African Science Academies. 5



### I think that's pretty sound bac king of 6



### the global warming conclusion by the scientific 7



### community. 8



### Now, let's take a look at some of the 9



### global

- warming disputers. There is the George C. 10



### Marshall Institute which has received $715,000 11



### from Exxon Mobil since 1998. There is the 12



### Competitiv e Enterprise Institute. Let's see 13



### where their funding's coming from. It's coming 14



### from Texaco, Texaco Foundation. The American 15



### Petroleum Institute of the Arch Coal and Exxon 16



### Mobil Groups. There is the Center for the Study 17



### of Carbon Dioxide and Global Ch ange . They also 18



### received contributions from Exxon Mobil. Who 19



### else have given money to them? Oh, and also the 20



### Green Earth Society, which is a group formed by 21



### the Western Fuels Association. And, finally, 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### everybody's favorite: The Heartland Institute. 1



### T he Heartland Institute recently added the 2



### Illinois Coal Association as a sponsor of their 3



### conclusions, and, of course, Exxon Mobil. 4



### So you can take the conclusions of the 5



### respected scientific community or you can accept 6



### the conclusions of people who are b eing paid for 7



### these conclusions by energy means. 8



### Thank you. 9



### MS. NOONAN: Thank you both. 10



### Brandon Bodor and Kelly Mitchell. 11



### MS. MITCHELL: Hi, thank you. My name's 12



### Kelly Mitchell. I'm a Coal Campaigner for 13



### Greenpeace, based here in Chicago. 14



### First of f, I just want to thank you for 15



### sitting through what's probably 11 hours now of 16



### testimony under fluorescent lighting. That gives 17



### me a headache quite often in the office. So I 18



### applaud you for being here. And I do hope that a 19



### lot of the kind of praise and hope that's been 20



### conveyed in today's comments have made that 21



### process a little bit easier because, you know, 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### today's an important day, and this rule is an 1



### important rule. Congress has failed the American 2



### public for years, and EPA is now taking long 3



### overdu e action to limit CO 2 

### , a greenhouse gas 4



### that's responsible already for extreme weather, 5



### flooding, drought, and dangerous and even deadly 6



### heat waves across the country. 7



### However, this rule has some shortcomings. 8



### I'd only address it as current

-- or, sorry, new 9



### sources of CO 2 

### emissions, and it has some serious 10



### loopholes. Included in those are an exemption 11



### for biomass plants which can spew out just as 12



### much CO 2 

### as coal plants, and the sort of 10

- year 13



### free pass for corporate polluters that promise to 14



### invest in mythical carbon capture and 15



### sequestration technology. The limits of this 16



### rule or too low to address natural gas plants. 17



### And as we all know, cheap natural gas is fueling 18



### record investments in new power plants, 19



### pipelines, and wells that contribute to clima te 20



### change across

-- throughout their entire life 21



### cycle. 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### You know, a strong rule that eliminates 1



### these loopholes is going to set an incredible 2



### precedent for a r u le to tackle existing sources 3



### of climate pollution, something that's absolutely 4



### necessary if we want to avoid the worst 5



### consequences of global warming. 6



### I also won't pretend that the getting to 7



### that is going to be an easy task. The anti

8



### science wing of our federal government has pretty 9



### much done everything in their power to paint EPA 10



### as a boogey ma n. They're painting the life

11



### saving health and environmental regulations that 12



### you are working on as government overreach. 13



### But I hope you also know that you are not 14



### alone in standing up to forces that would put 15



### industry profit over the health and well b eing of 16



### American families. 17



### Across the country right now communities 18



### are standing up to the corporate polluters in 19



### their back yard. I'm sure you've heard a couple 20



### instances today, people talk about the Fisk and 21



### Crawford coal plants here in Chicago. Those 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### plants are closing this year because of the 1



### resolve, because of the sweat, and because of the 2



### tears of communities who are tired of living in 3



### the shadow of smokestacks, you know, and the face 4



### of industry propaganda, of intimidation, of junk 5



### science, of bo ught politicians. Communities 6



### across this country are demanding clean air and 7



### clean water. 8



### So on behalf of the 300,000 Greenpeace 9



### members here in the U.S., I'm calling on you to 10



### find the same resolve as regular people in this 11



### country, as community activi sts, and to stand up 12



### to corporate polluters because a crisis as urgent 13



### as climate change requires nothing less than bold 14



### and principled action. And I promise you if 15



### you're closing these loopholes and getting to 16



### work on existing sources of pollution, histo ry is 17



### going to look back on this moment and smile. 18



### So thank you for being here, and thank 19



### you for listening to these comments. And I look 20



### forward to seeing what comes in the following 21



### months. Thank you. 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### MR. BODOR: Good evening. I hope to be 1



### just as p assionate, perhaps not as eloquent, and 2



### I have also prepared a speech that perhaps is not 3



### as intelligent either, but good evening. Thanks 4



### for the opportunity to speak to you this evening. 5



### My name is Brandon Bodor. I probably 6



### spent the past seven years o n active duty in the 7



### United States Army . My military service included 8



### two combat deployments, one each in Iraq and 9



### Afghanistan. In 2007 to 2008 I spent a long 15 10



### months fighting in support of Operation Iraqi 11



### Freedom during the heart of what is now common ly 12



### referred to as the surge of troops to quell the 13



### fierce sectarian violence that plagued the 14



### country at that time. 15



### And I recently returned from a year in 16



### Kandahar where I contributed to the strategic 17



### troop increase designed to turn the tide of the 18



### Taliba n insurgency across southern Afghanistan. 19



### I continue to serve just up the street at 20



### Fort Sheridan in Illinois as a U.S. Army 21



### Reservist. So, I’m here today to speak on behalf 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### of Operation Free. I think there are a few other 1



### Operation Free folks who spoke with you today. 2



### It's a dedicated coalition of veterans who 3



### recognize that our nation's fossil fuel addiction 4



### and contribution to climate change threaten our 5



### national security. And it's with that basic 6



### premise, that basic premise of mitigating 7



### national s ecurity threats that I’m here to 8



### testify today. 9



### I'm going to share with you just one 10



### anecdote. I have several, but I'll share with 11



### you just one anecdote because I understand I'm 12



### limited by time. 13



### From my military experiences that have 14



### shaped my understan ding are the implications of 15



### our reliance on fossil fuels. So, after a year 16



### of touring my platoon across the German 17



### countryside where I was stationed back in 2006, 18



### we deployed in 2007 for a 15

- month combat tour in 19



### Iraq. So to refresh your memory, at that time 20



### the level of violence in Iraq was at an all

- time 21



### high. Sunni and Shiite extremists groups were 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### not only killing each other at alarming rates, 1



### but they were also killing Americans at alarming 2



### rates, particularly in Bagdad. 3



### My platoon was based, as i t turns out, in 4



### an extremely volatile neighborhood known as Dora 5



### in southern Bagdad, which unfortunately still 6



### remains a rather volatile neighborhood. And back 7



### then it was one of the most volatile in the city. 8



### So my men and I patrolled the streets 9



### every day. And one thing was undeniably and 10



### unfortunately clear, and that's that the U.S. 11



### military has an intense reliance on fuel, 12



### particularly on diesel generators. 13



### So at the time this was General Petraeus' 14



### counter insurgency model to set up a series of 15



### sm all outposts which was an extremely effective 16



### operation, and it's kind of what we had been 17



### doing during the surge in Kandahar as well. 18



### But in order to do that, it does require 19



### -- I mean we have to power all those small 20



### outposts, and so that takes

-- you k now, what the 21



### Army has now is diesel generators, so, you know, 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### that relies on

-- in Iraq alone

-- ground convoys 1



### and in some cases in Afghanistan, some air 2



### convoys that can do the same thing, but the 3



### common theme there is that we have an intense 4



### reliance o n supporting those bases with diesel 5



### fuel. 6



### So what's the result of that? Well, I 7



### was on multiple convoys along with a lot of my 8



### friends. Some of my friends were injured gravely 9



### on some of those convoys. And really, we just 10



### must be cognizant that the en emy is not dumb by 11



### any means. We fight a smart and adaptable enemy 12



### in Iraq. You know, it doesn't really matter what 13



### the insurgent group's name is, they will follow 14



### all of the patterns that we're doing. And, of 15



### course, if we have the large fuel trucks th at 16



### have to go from one point to another, we really 17



### can't

-- I mean, we can be as sneaky and, you 18



### know, we can change those patterns as much as we 19



### want, but we still have to drive on the roads to 20



### get there, so it's

-- and we set patterns, and 21



### the enemy adap ts to those patterns. But just as 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### the enemy adapts, we need to be just as adaptable 1



### with new, unique ways to power our force. 2



### So the military recognizes this grave 3



### threat to our security posed by America's 4



### outdated energy policies. Just for some numbers

, 5



### we send over one billion dollars a day overseas 6



### for our oil, funding regimes that more often than 7



### not don't share our values. 8



### So the military is the biggest purchaser 9



### of energy in the country. And the volatility of 10



### oil prices can certainly compromise m ission 11



### readiness. 12



### There are several estimates out there. 13



### And I know folks mentioned Heritage and some 14



### other groups. And groups on either side have 15



### different numbers for this, but conservative

-- 16



### you know, the estimates indicate that for every 17



### one dollar increase in the price of a barrel of 18



### oil, the Defense Department incurs an additional 19



### $130 million in fuel cost. 20



### If we had an extra $130 million to spend 21



### on equipment and in training

-- I mean if

-- just 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### put that in perspective, an additional $130 1



### millio n to prepare for our national security. 2



### MS. NOONAN: Your time. 3



### MR. BODOR: Okay. So I want to emphasize 4



### that oil is not the only problem. All fossil 5



### fuels, including coal, pose a threat to our 6



### security by disrupting our climate. 7



### We must remember th at environmental 8



### issues such as drought, famine, migration, rising 9



### sea levels, and natural disasters caused by 10



### climate change pose a threat to military 11



### installations and raise demand for military 12



### assistance. 13



### We can all be part of this fight here at 14



### home. The Defense Department's already using 15



### wind and solar to power many of our military 16



### bases. And there's a bold DOD

- wide goal to 17



### deploy three gigawatts of renewable energy, 18



### including solar, wind, biomass, and geothermal on 19



### a variety of bases by 2025, enoug h to power 20



### 750,000 homes. 21



### MS. NOONAN: And we're going to

-- if we 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### could have the rest of your testimony as written 1



### comments, that would great. 2



### MR. BODOR: I just have two paragraphs 3



### left, so. 4



### MS. NOONAN: I apologize. We've been 5



### consistent with everyb ody. So

-- 6



### MR. BODOR: Okay. That's great. Thanks 7



### for your time. 8



### MS. NOONAN: Okay. Kathryn Norregaard? 9



### MS. NORREGAARD: Hi, my name is Kathryn 10



### Norregaard. I am a resident of Wheaton, 11



### Illinois , a nursing graduate of Moody Bible 12



### Institute here in Ch icago . I'm here with the 13



### Evangelical Environmental Network as well as the 14



### Young Evangelicals for Climate Action. And I'm 15



### offering this testimony on behalf of our 16



### President Reverend Mitchell C. Hescox. 17



### The simple fact is that if man is not 18



### able to solve his ecological problems, then man's 19



### resources are going to die. Noted evangelical 20



### Francis Schaeffer correctly stated those words in 21



### 1970, and they remain true today. The earth has 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### a fever, and the fever's impacts have reached 1



### epidemic proportions, threat ening all of us. 2



### Simply put, climate change is the greatest moral 3



### challenge of our time. 4



### Climate change resulting from carbon 5



### pollution makes bad things worse. It intensifies 6



### natural processes, making natural events 7



### unnatural or extreme, and hits the mo st 8



### vulnerable the hardest. 9



### These threats are not some future event. 10



### They are happening now, and God's children across 11



### this planet are crying for our help. 12



### The Cape Town Commitment issued by the 13



### Lausanne Movement founded by Billy Graham and 14



### John Stott, b oth internationally respected 15



### evangelical leaders, recognizes the need for 16



### climate change action as does the Evangelical 17



### Network Micah Challenge. 18



### Victor Mughogho, the Executive Director 19



### of Eagle's Relief and Development in Malawi, 20



### recently visited the Uni ted States for my 21



### organization's global day of prayer for creation 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### care and the poor. 1



### During his presentation Victor shared 2



### exactly what climate scientists have predicted 3



### for years. Victor told us how for their parents 4



### the rainy season was so predictable that they 5



### knew how to plant on October 15th every year. 6



### They planted and the rains fell

-- predictable, 7



### stable, and reliable. And they grew so much food 8



### they had an overabundance. 9



### In their parents' lives they expected 10



### only major drought. But since 1 970 droughts, 11



### floods, and unpredictable rains have become the 12



### new normal , exactly what the scientists said 13



### climate change would do, wreaking havoc for poor 14



### farmers. 15



### 2011 was the fourth consecutive drought 16



### that's plagued Malawi. Moreover, when the rains 17



### c ome, they are unpredictable. Victor told us 18



### that last year the farmers planted and the crops 19



### failed. Planted again, failed again. Planted a 20



### third time, and they failed a third time. 21



### Hunger, malnutrition, the stunting of 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### children are the results. Victo r reminded us 1



### that such stunting harms a person's brain 2



### development, further jeopardizing their future, 3



### and that of Malawi. 4



### The United States does not escape either. 5



### 2011 was the wildest year on record for extreme 6



### weather in the U.S. with 99 major events. 7



### Insurance losses in 2011 were the second 8



### costliest on record. Only 2005 with Hurricane 9



### Katrina were higher. 10



### The trend continues in 2012 being the 11



### year without winter. Extreme winter weather 12



### appeared to be drawing attention to the changing 13



### climate. 14



### Sc ience now affirms that North America's 15



### summer heat waves and changing precipitation are 16



### very, very likely resulting from anthropogenic 17



### climate change. In other words, the extreme 18



### weather events of the past several years are 19



### typical of climate change and v ery likely will 20



### continue. 21



### Others presenting today will testify or 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### maybe have testified to coal

- produced 1



### electricity, the largest source of carbon 2



### pollution. And those are all true, however, my 3



### testimony is the moral cause for the poor. 4



### Someone must stan d and speak for those without a 5



### voice and those who are most impacted by carbon 6



### pollution yet the least responsible for its toxic 7



### emissions. 8



### There are many Christians in the U.S. who 9



### are concerned about what happens to poor people 10



### in poor countries. The new source standard for 11



### carbon pollution remains a first step and only a 12



### first step. We need a clean energy revolution 13



### whose rate of change must be incredibly fast. A 14



### gradual transition will not provide adequate 15



### means to protect public health from well

16



### d ocumented fossil fuel consequences. 17



### Our nation must empower a second greatest 18



### generation, similar to the mobilization required 19



### for overcoming Fascism. Provide the leadership 20



### for a clean energy revolution. 21



### Clean energy and reducing carbon 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### pollution, acco rding to the respected business 1



### consulting firm McKinsey and Co., will require a 2



### tenfold increase in carbon productivity. This 3



### will require a united effort of government, 4



### business, and all society working together, 5



### including comprehensive energy climate c hange 6



### legislation. 7



### This is just a springboard, this new 8



### source performance standard for carbon pollution, 9



### but we urge the administration, Congress, 10



### industry, and the American people to work toward 11



### a market

- based solution to reduce current carbon 12



### pollution and ensure a safer and healthier world 13



### for all of God's children. 14



### Thank you. 15



### MS. NOONAN: Thank you. This concludes 16



### the registered speakers. And we would be happy 17



### to take testimony from anyone else here who has 18



### not already testified. 19



### Okay. We plan t o stay until 8:00, and 20



### we'll just be here in the front or hanging around 21



### if people who have changed their mind or if 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### others arrive. So the hearing will be in recess 1



### until such time as someone else would like to 2



### speak. 3



### [Break from 7:14 p.m. to 7:19 p.m.] 4



### MS. NOONAN: Mike Johnson. And would 5



### anyone care to join Mr. Johnson at the table? 6



### [No response.] 7



### MS. NOONAN: So you get five minutes. 8



### The yellow light will come on when you have one 9



### minute left. 10



### If you could say your name, your 11



### affiliation, and spe ll your name, that would be 12



### great. 13



### MR. JOHNSON: Sure. I'm Mike Johnson, M

14



### I

- K

- E, J

- O

- H

- N

- S

- O

- N. And I'm with Greenpeace. 15



### Okay. Well, thanks for this opportunity 16



### to testify. I testify here before you on behalf 17



### of 300,000 Greenpeace supporters nationw ide to 18



### say no to corporate welfare for polluters and no 19



### to selling public health to the highest bidder. 20



### We're here this evening to talk about how 21



### much pollution we, as Americans, are willing to 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### allow new power plants to emit into the air we 1



### breathe. The stakes could not be higher as 2



### public health, livable climate, and generations

3



### old livelihoods hang in the balance. 4



### Recent victories in securing retirement 5



### commitments for aging coal

- fired plants is 6



### bringing sweet relief for millions of Americans, 7



### but yet here in Chicago even as federal and state 8



### lawsuits could not force the Fisk and Crawford 9



### plants into compliance after endless legal 10



### maneuvers by Midwest Generation and its parent 11



### company, International. While Fisk and Crawford 12



### are existing facilities, th ey illustrate that an 13



### ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure for 14



### residents and regulators alike, when it comes to 15



### promulgating effective NSPS guidelines. 16



### Simply put, the plants' illegal 17



### operations would never have taken place had their 18



### Title 5 permi t not allowed the coal plant

-- or 19



### not allowed the plant to burn coal. A strong 20



### NSPS that prohibits coal

- fired generation and 21



### does not grant exemptions for carbon capture and 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### sequestration can make these stories and related 1



### unnecessary suffering a thing o f the past. 2



### Thankfully, after more than 10 years of 3



### lawsuits, protests, and civil disobedience Fisk 4



### and Crawford here in Chicago will finally close 5



### this September; but in the meantime more than 400 6



### Chicagoans have died waiting for justice. All 7



### the while Edison is leading the charge to 8



### invalidate the cross

- state air pollution that 9



### after 35 years finally holds all generators 10



### accountable for their SO 2 

### and NO x 

### emissions. 11



### Though long overdue and perhaps not as 12



### ambitious as it could have been, EPA is to be 13



### con gratulated on promulgating this landmark 14



### public health protection. At the same time legal 15



### challenges by corporate polluters jeopardize this 16



### gain. 17



### In that spirit we call upon the EPA to 18



### proceed in adopting stringent new standards for 19



### new power plants to h onor those who lost their 20



### lives and to protect the health of the living by 21



### taking common sense action to prevent toxic 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### disasters from the start. 1



### Now is the time to say no more ash ponds, 2



### no more supporting an industry driven by 3



### wholesale destruction and e xport of the Rockies 4



### and Appalachians. Now is the time to start a 5



### transition to carbon

- free, conflict

- free, home

6



### grown, 100 percent renewable energy, and a strong 7



### NSPS can help get us there. 8



### True success requires recognizing that 9



### CCS is a false solution and a losing prospect for 10



### ratepayers and the environment. The cancellation 11



### of FutureGen and Ameren's now

- retired Meredosia 12



### Plant, E dwardsport and IGCC's billion dollar cost 13



### overrun, and others show that these projects make 14



### no economic sense and have yet to be proven at 15



### the scale. 16



### Industry rep ea tedly argues that it can 17



### self

- regulate while blackmailing the American 18



### public, regulators, and elected officials with 19



### its threats of job loss, power disruption, and 20



### eroding tax bases. Enough is enough. Far from 21



### d eserving sympathy, corporate polluters have 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### stated the case for regulation about as well as 1



### any advocacy group could through an atrociously 2



### negative example. 3



### The recent energy sector examples of BP, 4



### Chesapeake , and Ameren hardly c an i nspire 5



### confidence; an d in fact, strongly suggest that 6



### the industry cannot be trusted to protect public 7



### health above polluter profits. 8



### In fact, trusting industry in these 9



### instances led respectively to the largest 10



### environmental disaster in American history, 11



### rampant pollution of groundwater in one of the 12



### largest corporate implosions and energy crises in 13



### American history. 14



### Until coal pollution is against the law 15



### for new generation, companies like Leucadia will 16



### continue to abuse public funds to subsidize dirty 17



### coal development and forcibly deliver above

18



### market price natural gas to utility customers. 19



### Companies like Duke Energy will continue 20



### to use billions of dollars of ratepayer money to 21



### build unnecessary plants incapable of delivering 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### the promised carbon capture they used to win 1



### r egulatory support. 2



### In the end promised benefits

-- promised 3



### environmental benefits are not being delivered to 4



### those who are truly financing this development, 5



### ratepayers and taxpayers, both of whom bear the 6



### brunt of the related health impacts. 7



### At a time w hen cleaner power is cheaper 8



### than coal

- fired generation carbon limits through 9



### NSPS basically only codify what the market has 10



### said loud and clear, that new coal does no t make 11



### sense to build. While many banks will not 12



### finance new coal

- fired generation, some new coal 13



### plants are still being built, including the 14



### Prairie State Energy Campus right here in 15



### Illinois. 16



### Municipal customers across the state will 17



### soon be paying above

- market rates for the power 18



### generated from the plant while those living near 19



### the plant bear the burden of pollution. And NSPS 20



### that specific prohibits coal

- fired generation, 21



### including plants hawking the snake oil of carbon 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### capture could not send a clearer signal to the 1



### market. 2



### In solidarity with many of the other 3



### groups who have testified h ere this evening we 4



### demand better from the nation's power generators, 5



### especially as communities across the Midwest and 6



### the nation choose clean power and

-- not or

-- 7



### cost

-- 8



### MS. NOONAN: Mr. Johnson

-- 9



### MR. JOHNSON:

-- savings. 10



### MS. NOONAN:

-- your time has expired. 11



### MR. JOHNSON: Okay. 12



### MS. NOONAN: We'd be happy to take the 13



### rest of your comments. 14



### MR. JOHNSON: Okay. Thank you. 15



### MS. NOONAN: Thank you. Margaret 16



### Goldstein. 17



### MS. GOLDSTEIN: I support the 18



### Environmental Protection Agency's proposal for 19



### f irst ever national emission limits for carbon 20



### pollution from new power plants. 21



### In 2007 a Supreme Court ruling requires 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### the EPA to deal with carbon pollution. And 1



### several states and countries are already 2



### eliminating carbon emissions from power plants. 3



### T he consequence of not controlling carbon 4



### emissions is global warming with all its adverse 5



### effects. 6



### Do you want this? 7



### MS. NOONAN: That would be great. Thank 8



### you. 9



### Are there other speakers who have not yet 10



### testified who would like to come forward and giv e 11



### testimony? 12



### MS. BELL: Yes. 13



### MS. NOONAN: Great. And state your name, 14



### affiliation, and spell your name. 15



### MS. BELL: Sure. My name is Jessica 16



### Bel l , B

- E

- L

- L. I currently work at the 17



### University of Chicago's Social (Unintelligible) 18



### Club, and in the fall I 'm going to be doing my 19



### Ph.D. in Environmental Studies at Michigan State. 20



### I support this rule mainly because I feel 21



### that there has been a false economy set up in the 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### media and among certain political groups that the 1



### economy and the environment are mutuall y 2



### exclusive. And that is not the case based on any 3



### research that I, personally, have seen or that I 4



### am working on in my Ph.D. I'm thinking of a 5



### current study that showed, for example, in 6



### western states that the more land protected in 7



### that state actually leads to more jobs due to 8



### tourism and wilderness exploration. 9



### I am also willing to say that this is a 10



### long rigid rule that I really support that you're 11



### finally taking the first step in addressing 12



### climate change, which I see as inextricably 13



### linked to issue s of national security, food 14



### security, and other vital issues. 15



### And, again, as scientist, I feel that the 16



### science on climate change is very clear and that 17



### taking the first step is absolutely essential. 18



### Thank you. 19



### MS. NOONAN: Thank you. 20



### MS. FISHER: Hi, my name is Allison 21



### Fisher, and I live here in Chicago. 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### MS. NOONAN: Can you spell your last 1



### name? 2



### MS. FISHER: F

- I

- S

- H

- E

- R. 3



### And I want to thank you guys so much for 4



### spending all this time today to listening and 5



### hearing these stories. It means so much to all 6



### of us to know that our stories and our 7



### experiences are being heard and want to thank you 8



### so much for posing and also give my support for 9



### this rule. 10



### I'm originally from Long Island, New 11



### York, which

-- and I spent so many wonderful, 12



### wonderful summers growing up on the beach

-- go 13



### there with my family, play in the ocean, walk on 14



### the rocks, just

-- it was beautiful. And, you 15



### know, there was a community that was there so we 16



### would have barbecues, and we would sit down and 17



### have big family meals, and learn how to swim. 18



### And where I grew up is actually just 10 19



### miles away from that beach. And I think I was in 20



### middle school and I learned that global warming 21



### means that that barrier beach that I grew up on, 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### had all these beautiful, wonderful memories 1



### wouldn't exist with global warming. And that 2



### that

-- all those beautiful summers, all those 3



### beautiful places, memories, and that community 4



### wouldn't be there anymore. 5



### And this past summer when the hurricane 6



### was going over Long Island was the first time 7



### that I act ually realized that it was possible in 8



### my lifetime that that beach wouldn't be there 9



### anymore. And what was even worse is that the 10



### damage from that hurricane, and the damage from 11



### future hurricanes, and damage from future 12



### flooding, the cost that it would be to my 13



### community, to all those folks that actually don't 14



### have flood insurance. 15



### And my parents actually have gone through 16



### multiple home insurance brokers who keep on not 17



### insuring them just because they're so close to 18



### the floodplain. 19



### And knowing that, my p arents would be 20



### fine. They're both folks who've worked for the 21



### government for years, have good government 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### pensions, so if our community isn't there 1



### anymore, they could always move. Yes, we will 2



### have memories. We won't have the house that they 3



### lived in f or 30 years, but they can move. And 4



### it's knowing that others in my community aren't 5



### going to be able to afford that when the next big 6



### hurricane comes, and when the next big floods 7



### come that make this community no longer livable. 8



### And I'm so, so excited th at the EPA is 9



### taking this first step to regulating carbon, to 10



### regulating these climate disrupting gases. That 11



### means that we can actually address and solve this 12



### problem so my community can still

-- could exist, 13



### so that the beaches where I grew up in, the 14



### b eaches that were beautiful, you know, we have 15



### the potential for those to be there for future 16



### generations. 17



### So I thank you so much for what you're 18



### doing, and I thank you on behalf of the people 19



### who live in so many vulnerable places across the 20



### united state s and across the world. 21



### MS. NOONAN: Thank you. 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### Others who would like to testify? 1



### MR. GILROY: Good evening. My name is 2



### Jack Gilroy, G

- I

- L

- R

- O

- Y. And I've been a 3



### volunteer with the Sierra Club here for seven or 4



### eight years in the Chicago Chapter. 5



### I don't know too much about the exact 6



### proposal, though, so I didn't have any prepared 7



### response tonight to bring to you. And I applaud 8



### you for your endurance here in putting up with 9



### this long session here today. 10



### I just wanted to make a few points after 11



### lis tening to the talk from others here this 12



### evening. One is that I work with a health 13



### insurance company, and a lot of the time I've 14



### experienced or noticed that a lot of the 15



### utilization of health care in the Illinois area 16



### is affected very heavily by coal. An d I think 17



### that it's important to understand the extent to 18



### which coal companies are externalizing their 19



### costs on to other people, namely onto insurance 20



### companies who pay the claims, onto the state 21



### agencies that pay medical claims for people on 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### medical progr ams by the state and certainly upon 1



### the citizens who get sick and sometimes die as a 2



### result of the coal caused or diseases. 3



### That in itself, I think, is really 4



### important that there be some sort of regulation 5



### to block that kind of externalization of what is 6



### really the cost of the coal manufacturer or the 7



### energy manufacturers themselves. 8



### But what's the broader story, of course, 9



### is just that the problem of global warming is one 10



### that could literally make the planet 11



### uninhabitable according to climate scientis ts 12



### within the next 100 or 200 years. And the figure 13



### I've seen

-- is it something like 97 percent of 14



### Ph.D. climate scientists who are discussing this 15



### are in agreement that that is the case, that the 16



### climate is in danger of becoming uninhabitable 17



### here on ou r planet. 18



### And it strikes me that the nature of the 19



### situation is such that the damages from coal are 20



### so great in terms both of our loved ones dying 21



### and asthma attacks on their way to the emergency 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### room or in terms of the planet possibly being 1



### uninhabitable when our great grandchildren would 2



### want to be inhabiting it because nobody can then 3



### survive, no living thing might be able to be on 4



### Planet Earth, but perhaps underwater volcanic 5



### bacteria or something. 6



### When you think of the damage being that 7



### great, it st rikes me that it's the sort of thing 8



### that a normal context would be considered an act 9



### of war. And I don't know if anyone here has 10



### mentioned that to you, but the coal companies 11



### are, in effect, damaging us as much as some 12



### foreign group would be if they caus ed our loved 13



### ones to be kidnapped and forced to ingest all 14



### sorts of dangerous toxins or forced to live in a 15



### climate that can no longer support life. 16



### Those kinds of things, again, are 17



### traditionally thought of as acts of war and 18



### causes of war. Well, of cou rse we're not asking 19



### for military action against these companies. 20



### We're simply asking for the most basic kind of 21



### regulation of them that would halt them from 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### bringing that kind of damage onto the citizenry. 1



### And given the nature of the political 2



### situation now, I don't know if there's going to 3



### be another kind of legal solution for us to do 4



### that. So I applaud very much the EPA's 5



### consideration of this proposal to halt the coal 6



### damage to our citizenry. And I would really hope 7



### very much that it can be accepte d. And I thank 8



### you for, again, your efforts on that behalf. 9



### MS. NOONAN: Okay. Thank you. 10



### Others who would like to come and 11



### testify? 12



### [No response.] 13



### MS. NOONAN: Well, we're going to go into 14



### recess for a few minutes. And if anyone feels 15



### that they wan t to

-- minute to collect their 16



### thoughts, we'll come back as soon as you decide 17



### you would like to testify. Otherwise, we'll 18



### probably close down at 8:00 o'clock. 19



### [Break from 7:35 p.m. to 8:00 p.m.] 20



### MS. NOONAN: It's now 8:00 p.m., and we 21



### are closing

-- w e are adjourning the hearing. 22OLENDER REPORTING, INC. 1100 Connecticut Avenue, N.W., #810, Washington D.C. 20036

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### Thank you to all who have participated. 1



### The end of the comment period is June 25th, 2012. 2



### Thank you. 3



### [Whereupon, at 8 :0 1 p.m., the Public 4



### Hearing was concluded.] 5



### - - - 6

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