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# OAR Box 1147 Prepped by Ollie Stewart



## Document

Number: 

# 17DIV-E-4 4 Docket Number: 

# A-87-1 1

Printed 4/22/2008 2:42:56

PM Sheet 171 of 242

# X** ^ P. 2 

## A-87-mmZ?- i fi ' i UNITE D STATE S ENVIRONMENTA LPROTECTIO N AGENC YVL''la' <S</ 

# use r MA YI 6 1988 AN N ARBOR . MICHIGA N 4810 5

OFFIC E O F AI R AN D RADIATIO N MEMORANDU

M 

### SUBJECT : SA

E Fue l Suppl ySystem s Subcommitte e Meeting FROM : Glenn W . Passavant , Senio r Projec t Manage r 2)«»v«\a)ntAkixs*/^ T Standard s Developmen t an d Suppor t Branc h TO : THRU : Publi c Docke t A-87-1 1

Cheste r J . France , Chie f S^ " L*Hu^ ^ ^ Standard s Developmen t an d Suppor t Branc h On Februar

y29 , 198 8 Glen

n Passavan t an

d Joh n Muelle r o f the EP AOffic e o f Mobil e Source s attende d a meeting of th e Societ yo f Automotiv e Engineer s (SAE ) Fue l Suppl ySystem s Subcommitte e at tbe Veteran s Memoria l Hal l in Detroit , Michigan . Aful l agenda i s attached . Among the items discusse d wer e EPA' s propose d onboard vapo r recover ytes t procedur e an

d th e need for fue l nozzl e geometrystandard s a s par t o f a

n onboard rul e (se e previou s memo t o thi s docke t date d January29 , 1988 , (IV-E- 2 2. ) Acop yo f the minute s o f the meeting including a n attendee s lis t i s als o attached . Attachment sP. 3

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1 The Engineering

Society For Advancing

Mobility Land Sea Air and Space AJoint Effort by Industry, Government

and SAE
300 1 WES

TBI G BEAVER
. SUrTE 602 , TROY , MICH
. 48084

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## UNCONFIRME D MINUTE S SAC . COOPERATIV E ENGINEERIN G PROGRA M '_DETROI TBRANC H OFFIC E TEL; (313 ) 649-042 0 March31 , 198 8 FUE L SUPPL YSYSTE MSUBCOMMITTE

E Unconfirme dMinute s o f th eFebruar y29 , 198 8 Meetin g Veteran s Memoria lBuilding , Roo m820 , Detroit , Michiga n Members Absent : 

### M . G . J . A . W . T . A . L . R . K . K . M . J . P . A . C . K . E . R . J . Harriga n - E . Moor e A . Aube l R . Bake r E . Crut e Detwile r C . Fink E . Freema n W . Furro w Chairperso n

Vic e

L . Kirkpatric k A . Kerb y A . Mahe r W . Muelle r R . 0'Connel l R . Podger s Taylo r A . Steile n G . Strage r H . Thompso n Chairperso n T . J . Car r E . Ellswort h H . M . Faulcone r L . W . Gibb s S . Hask o D . K . Lawrenc e R . L . Murray H . J . Silve r D . R . Sterzinge r G . E . Swic k Als o present : R . Thoma s Northrup : SAE Staf f Enginee r P . B . Anderso n P . Cingl e W . D . Confo y R . D . Hal l G . Heckma n G . Pasavan t

************************************************************* * 1 . APPROVAL O F TH E MINUTE S O F TH E DECEMBE R 1 , 198 7 MEETING Mr . W . D . Confoystate d tha t h e wa s presen t a t the meetin g bu t hi s nam e wa s no t s o note d i n the minutes . Wit hthi s correction , the minute s wer e approve d a s written . 2 . STATU S O F FIVE YEA R REVIE WO F DOCUMENT S Th e statu s o f thi s subcommittee' s document s i s summarize d i n Attachmen t I . Onl y J111 4 remain s wit hope n issues . Thi s documen t i s writte n t o gover n "Pressure-Vacuuir , Type " ga s caps . However , identica l design s ar e availabl e whic har e non-vente d o r vacuu monly . Therefore , i t i s possibl e t o purchas e aftermarke t ga s cap s wit ha valv e systemwhic hi s incompatibl e wit hsome vehicl e fue l systemdesign s bu t they wil l fi t the fille r pip e o f thes e vehicles . Thi s coul d pos e potentia l safet yan d emission s risks . Th e member s o f the subcommitte e believ e tha t a mean s mus t b e adde i t o the documen t whic hwil l preclud e the interchangeabilit yo f a vente d o r non-vente < cap . Differen t thread design s ar e unde r discussio n bu t n o desig n t o dat e ha s prove i goo f proof . Th e us e o f lef t hand v s righ t hand thread s i s a possibility . Mr . Bil l Crute , the officia l recorde r fo r thi s document , wil l cal l a tas k forc e meeting o f ca p manufacturer s and EOMengineer s t o develop a resolutio n t o thi s issue . Mr . Crut e hope s t o hav e a proposa l fo r the nex t subcommitte e meeting . SOCIETYO F AUT0MO I iv t emj.. . 370121E -P. 5

3 . ON-BOARD REFUELIN GVAPO R RECOVERY (ORVR ) Nozzle/Fille r Interfac e Mr . Glen n Moor e ha s forme d a tas k forc e unde r SAE J28 5 t o develop mor e complet e standardizatio n o f nozzles . Thi s effor t i s no t directl yassociate d wit hORV R bu t i t i s viewe d b ythe member s wh o wor k fo r the automotiv e manufacturer s a s an importan t par t i n achieving feasibilit yfo r ORV R designs . Mr . Moor e circulate d a sign-u

p shee t fo r hi s tas k forc e and hel d a brie f meetin g afte r thi s on e adjourned . Attachmen t I I i s a communicatio n fro mGlenn regarding the plan s o f the SAE J28 5 tas k force . Mr . Ale xPodger s provide d update d nozzl e spou t geometrydat a whic hi s include d her e a s Attachmen t III . Refueling Tes t Procedur e Mr . Keit hKerb

yha s forme d a tas k forc e t o evolv e SAE J39 8 int o a procedur e fo r evaluating the qualit yo f refueling . Thi s coul d involv e a procedur e wit ha standar d fille r pip e and tank t o asse s nozzl e performanc e an d a procedur e wit ha standar d nozzl e t o asse s vehicl e fille r systemperformance . Onc e thi s i s develope d the procedure s migh t b e enlarge d t o includ e a n ORV R tes t procedure . Mr . Kerb

ycirculate d a sig n u p lis t a t thi s meetin g fo r thos e intereste d t o joi n the tas k force . Mr . Kerb yi s planning t o hav e a tas k forc e meetin g i n conjunctio n wit hthe meeting o f Glenn Moore' s Nozzl e Spou t Tas k Force . SA E - EPACooperativ e Effort s Mr . Gle n Pasavan t fro mEPAwa s presen t and state d tha t EPAsupport s voluntary consensu s standard s whic haugmen t the goal s o f EPA . H e sai d tha t i f SAE develop s an

d adopt s a standar d nozzl e spou t configuratio n tha t EPAwil l designat e tha t spou t a s the officia l tes t spou t fo r ORV R certificatio n testing . However , a t thi s tim e EPAwil l no t agre e t o making the SAE standar d spou t a lega l requiremen t fo r al l ga s station s becaus e i t i s no t clea r tha t the anticipate d SAE standar d woul d represen t a broa d enoughconsensus . Mr . Pasavan t pointe d ou t that , althoughthe membershi p i n thi s subcommitte e i s ope n t o anyone , i n fac t ther e ar e veryfewo f the numerou s nozzl e spou t manufacturer s represented . H e suggeste d tha t w e shoul d tak e positiv e step s t o infor man d recrui t membershi p fromal l nozzl e spou t manufacturer s and othe r affecte d partie s suc ha s the Petroleu mEquipmen t Institut e and Underwriter s Laboratories . Th e Chairma n agree d completel ywit hthi s observatio n and wil l send a lette r o f invitatio n t o al l affecte d companie s an d add thei r name s t o ou r mailin g list . Alivel ydiscussio n develope d regarding the relativ e safet yand feasibilit yo f variou s ORV

R fil l systemdesigns . Th e chairma n curtaile d the debat e an d pointe d ou t tha t the suc hdiscussion s woul d b e entirel yappropriat e a t the upcoming SA E Governmen t - IndustryMeeting thi s Mayi n Washingto n D.C . 4 . OL D BUSINES S IS O Nozzl e Spou t Standard : M r Glenn Moor e reporte d tha t n o actio n ha s bee n take n b y ISO . 5 . NEXT MEETIN

G I t wa s agree d tha t the nex t meeting o f the ful l Subcommitte e shoul d b e hel d i n conjunctio n wit hthe SA E Passenge r Ca r Meeting an d Expositio n t o b e hel d Octobe r 3 1 throughNovembe r 3 , 198 8 a t the Hyat t Regenc yHote l i n Dearborn , Michigan . Detail s o f the exac t time , meeting roo mlocatio n an

d a n agend a wil l b e communicate d t o the member s a t a late r date .

M . J . Harriga n 1988SAE-F 1 Chairma n mjh/88032 6 SAE Fue l Suppl ySystemSubcommitte e

- 2 -P. 6

/ / s i r % J 5 .-&*

The Engineering Society —^%^*wrr r ' r °' ' Advancing Mobility ^Bfln^a g Lan

dSe a 4f r an dSpace . DETROI T BRANC H OF F 300 1 WES T BIGBEAVER . SUIT E 602 . TROY . Ml 48084-317 4 U.S.A . FA XNO . (313 ) 649-042 5 TEL : (313 ) 649- (

January18 , 198 8

Dea r Members : Th e nex t meetin g o f the SAE Fue l Suppl ySystem s Subcommitte e wil l be hel d i n conjunctio n wit hthe SAE Internationa l Congres s an d Expositio n during the wee k o f February2 9 throughMarc h4 , 198 8 a t Cobo Hall , i n Detroit , Michigan . TIME : Monday , Februar y29 , 1988 , 1:3 0 p.m . t o 5:0 0 p.m . PLACE : Veteran s Building , Room820 , Detroit , Michiga n Apeel-of f labe l compute r printou t o f al l anticipate d attendee s wil l be generated . Thi s lis t wil l be i n alphabetica l order . I n the registratio n are a o f Hal l "A" , ther e wil l be a registratio n wit ha marque e reading "Technica l Committee " registration . Al l SA E member s vil l receive a membe r badg e allowing the mr o atten d technica l session s an d th e exposition , a t no cost . Technica l Committe e member s wh o ar e no t SAE menber s mayattend the technica l meeting s a t n o charge . Fo r a cos t o f $35.00 , non-member s ca n receiv e a badg e tha t wil l permi t themt o atten d the exposition , an d an yo f the session s t o b e conducte d throughou t the week . Thi s fe e ca n b e credite d toward the combinatio n o f membershi p initiatio n fe e and firs t year' s dues , whe n elected , i f applicatio n i s mad e withi n si xmonths . Member s wh o ar e planning t o atten d the Congres s ar e encourage d t o mak e an y necessarysleeping roo mreservation s a s soon a s possible . Ahote l reservatio n for

mi s attache d fo r you r convenience . Tn e agend a fo r thi s meeting i s attache d fo r you r convenience . I f yo u ar e unabl e t o attend , pleas e contac t Chairman Harriga n o n the retur n meeting for

mwhic hi s attached . Your s truly ,
Darlen e Crocke r Senio r Technica l Secretary DC/b m Enclosure s

SOCIET YO F AUTOMOTIV E ENGINEERS
. INC
.P. 7 / | ME E T I NG \ \ ANNOUNCEMENT/AGEND A| / SUBJECT : SA E Fue l Suppl ySyste mSubcommitte e MEETIN GDATE : Februar y29 . 198 8 Hel d A t SA E Worl d Congres s 

## I TIME : .

DURATION : 3 Hour s LOCATION : .Gobtx-Jtel l Roo m# ifTf. l ^fy.x^i-MVa . CONFIR MB Y CALLING : M . J . Harriga n (313 ) 594-106 2 o r Darlen e Crocke r (313 ) 649-042 2 ; CHAIRMAN : Michae l J . Harriga n \ Detroit , Michiga n / DESIRE D OUTCOMES : 1 ) Complet e th e 5 yea r revie wo f document s 2 ) Revie wprogres s i n establishin g Tas k Force s fo r th e Nozzle-Fille r Interfac e an d fo r Refuelin g Tes t Procedure s 3 ) Revie wplan s fo r On-Boar d Refuelin g Vapo r Recover y 4 ) Agre e o n meetin g schedule , an d next meetin g dat e

/ 1 1 _ i - • |3 .

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### 1 ^ . |6 . |7 . 

### IS . \ ORDE R O F AGEND AITEM S Introduction s Approva l o f Dec . 1 , 1?5 7 Meetin g Minute s Statu s o f 5 yea r Revie wo f Document s

- J28 5 Nozzl e Spout s

- J39 8 Fue l Fillin g

- J829 c Cam-o n Ca p

- J111 4 Threade d Ca p

- J114 0 Stag e I I Emissio n

Fille r an d Spou t On-Boar d Refuelin g Vapo r Recover y Nozzle/Fille r interfac e P^ e fue l in g Tes t Procedur e Actio n plan s -SAE/EP AJoin t Meetin g -SA E Gov't./Industr y Meeting , May>*198 8 -Action s fo r affecte d document s Ol d Busines s IS O Nozzl e Spou t Std . Ne wBusines s Nex t Meetin g Adjor n ; . PERSON S RESPONSIBL E Chairma n ' Chairma n Al l Glen n Moor e Kiet hKerby Bil l Crut e Bil l Crut e Glen n Moor e

Glen n Moor e Kiet hKerb y Kathlee n Steile n Mik e Harriga n Officia l Recorder s

Glen n Moor e Al l Al l PROCES S

Consensu s

Infor m& Discus s u H Infor m& Discus s t t t t Consensu s

Consensu s TIM E ALLOCATE D 5 min . m'O

1 0 1 0 1 0 1 0 1 0

2 0 2 0 1 0 1 5 2 0

1 0 1 0 1 0 min .

min . min . min . min . min .

min . min . min . min . min .

min . min . min . 3 hour s tota l
1588SAE-Fl a mih/88010 6 \TABL E 1 SUMMAR Y STATU S O F DOCUMENT S SA E FUE L SUPPL Y SYSTE MSUBCOMMITTE E Documen t Numbe r D ocumen t Titl e Documen t Typ e Officia l Recorde r Statu s - March , 198 8
J28 5 Gas o I in e Dispence r Nozzl e Spout s Recommende d Practic e G . E . Moor e 0 P UDivisio n Dove r Corperatio n Bo x40500 3 Cincinnati , Ohi o 513-870-320 2
45240-500 3 Publishe d Feb . 1988 ;

subjec t t o futur e review .

J39 8 Fue l Tan k Fille r Conditio n - Passenge r Car , Recommende d

Mult i Purpos e Passenge r Vehicl e an d Ligh t Practic e Dut yTrucks . Kiet hA . Kerb y Chrysle r Corp . 1280 0 Chrysle r CIM S 418-36-0 6 H i gh I an d Park , 313-956-173 4

Dr . Mich . 4820 3 Approve d byth e Aut o Emission s Committee . Sen t t o Moto r Vehicl e Counci l fo r fina l approva l prio r t o publication . Afte r reaffirmatio n wor k wil l star t t o includ e fillin g qualit yrequirements . J829 c Fue l Tan k Fille r Ca p an d Ca p Retaine r Standar d Willia mG . Crut e 317-825-312 1 Approve d byth e Aut o S t an t Mfg . C o 162 0 Columbi a Connersvilie , Emission s Committee .

Ave . Ballote d t o th e Moto r Indian a 4733 1 Vehicl e counci l fo r fina l approv e I prio r t o ' publication . J111 4 Fue l Tan k Fille r Ca p an d Ca p Retaine r

Threade d Pre s sur e - Vacuu mTyp e Recommende d Practic e Willia mG . Crut e (Sam e a s above ) 5 yea r revie wballot s returne d wit hcomments . Revise d text , whic h include d recognitio n o f uniqu e Japanes e ca p retaine r designs , wa s reviewe d bymembers . Method s t o preven t interchangin g Vente d v s Non-Vente d ca p design s i s a n ope n issue . J114 0 Fille r Pipe s

Fue l Tank s an d Opening s o f Moto r Vehicl e Recommende d Practic e GI en n (Sam e E . a s Moor e above ) Reaffirmed . Publishe d subjec t to'futur e review . SAEstatu s mjh/8 8 0 32 6 n 

# I Z

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### Marc h30 , 198 8

To : MEMBER S O F SA

E J-28 5 TAS K FORC E Dea r Members : Our Tas k Forc e wil l be meetin g on Apri l 1 4 a t th e Sherato n Metropolita n Detroi t Airpor t Hotel . Th e hote l ha s airpor t limousin e service . W e expec t t o star t the meeting a t 9:0 0 an d wil l be discussin g thos e items outline d in m ynot e o f Marc h4 , 1988 . We expec t the meeting t o be adjourne d b y12:0 0 Noo n an

d n o late r than 1:0 0 p.m . I f yo u have an

yquestion s regarding the meeting pleas e fee l fre e t o contac t me a t 513-870-3155 . 

## Ver y truly , 

# AS L Glenn E . Moor e Chairma n GEM/ml s CC : R . T . Northru

p3 .1 0 

### FUELIN G COMPONENT S GROU P 939 3 PRINCETON-GLENDAL E ROA D P.O
. BO X40500 3 CINCINNATI
. OHI O 45240-500 3 TELEPHON E (513 ) 870-310 0



### Marc h4 , 198 8

To : Member s o f th e SA E J28 5 Tas k Forc e

First , I woul d lik e t o than k al l o f yo u fo r volunteerin g t o wor k o n th e nozzl e spou t tas k force . Secondly , I woul d lik e t o revie wbriefl ysom e o f th e point s w e discusse d a t ou r shor t meetin g o n Februar y2 9 followin g th e Fue l System s Subcommitte e Meeting . Thi s i s no t intende d t o b e a forma l se t o f minutes , sinc e I d o no t thin k th e meetin g wa s a forma l meeting . However , sinc e w e wil l b e meetin g i n eithe r mid

Apri l o r earl yMay , I thin k i t woul d b e a goo d ide a t o not e som e o f th e item s w e discussed . 1 . W e nee d t o determin e jus t wha t ou r charte r o r objec t i s tha t w e ar e strivin g fo r i f w e ar e going.t o mak e change s i n J285 . I a msur e w e hav e th e optio n o f a ne w recommende d practice , leavin g J28 5 a s i t i s o r makin g change s i n J285 . 2 . W e discusse d briefl yth e dimension s and th e fac t w e nee d t o establis ha toleranc e o n th e outsid e diamete r o f th e spout , whic hi s no wa nomina l 13/16 " wit ha maximu mdiamete r o f .840 . Severa l o f th e member s o f th e tas k forc e state d th e nomina l dimensio n ha s no t bee n tie d dow n an d i s stil l ope n an d need s t o b e resolved . Th e straigh t lengt ho f th e spou t als o need s t o b e reviewed . 3 . Othe r dimension s an d requirement s o f th e ne wspou t woul d includ e th e following : A . Angl e o f ben d o n th e spout . I t wa s note d byon e membe r tha t th e olde r I Atyp e nozzle s hav e a steepe r angle .

CORPORATIO N/ OP WDIVISIO NP.1 1



### Member s o f th

e SA E J28 5 Tas k Forc e Marc h4 , 198 8 Pag e 2

B . Ale xPodger s o f Emc o Wheato n passe d ou t ne w

drawing s t o al l o f the member s o f the tas k forc e o f a propose d spou t including a sligh t modifi

catio n t o the ben

d angle . C . I t wa s suggeste d tha t the latching means , regarding the spring or othe r method , be locate d in th e ne wrecommende d practice . D . I t wa s suggeste d b yRober t Thompso n tha t the vacuu msigna l rang e shoul d be par t o f th e ne w recommende d practice . A s soo n a s a meeting dat e an d locatio n i s determine d b yth e SA

E office , yo u wil l b

e notifie d b

ythe SAE . Verytruly , Glenn E . Moore , P.E . Vic e Presiden t - Technica l Liaiso n GEM/dkd

### Joh n A . Aube l

Sr . Projec t Enginee r Contro l System s Bors-Warne r Automotiv e 70 7 Southsid e Driv e Decatur , I L 6252 5 Willia mD . Confo y Vic e Presiden t Sha wAer o Developmen t Inc . 422 7 Progres s Avenu e Naples , F L 3394 2 Arthu r Charle s Fink , Jr . Chie f Enginee r Husk yCorporatio n 1 + Daile yIndustria l Par k Pacific , M O 6306 9 Michae l J . Harrigan , Sr . Fue l Syste mTech . Specialis t Bod y& Chassi s Engineer s Div . For d Moto r Compan y 2000 0 Rotund a Drive , Buildin g 5 , Roo m

3077 , Bo x205 3 Dearborn , M I 4812 1 Keit hA . Kerb y Projec t Enginee r Chrysle r Corporatio n CIM S 41 8 3 6 0 6 Highlan d Park , M I 4820 3 Richar d Le e Kirkpatric k Staf f Projec t Enginee r Prod . Engineerin g Dept . BO C Divisio n GM C 94 2 Townsen d Stree t Lansing , M I 4892 1 Joh n Muelle r USEP A SESB1 2 256 5 Plymout hRoa d An n Arbor , M I 4810 5 Ale xPodger s Engineerin g Manage r Emc o Wheato n Inc . Chamberlai n & Paris hBlvd . Conneaut , O H 4403 0 Rober t H . Thompso n Projec t Enginee r Stan t 162 5 Columbi a Connersville , I N4733 1

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