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43–451 PDF 2008

S. HRG. 110–444 

EXAMINING THE FEDERAL ROLE TO WORK WITH 

COMMUNITIES TO PREVENT AND RESPOND TO 

GANG VIOLENCE: THE GANG ABATEMENT AND 

PREVENTION ACT OF 2007 

HEARING 

BEFORE THE

COMMITTEE ON THE JUDICIARY 

UNITED STATES SENATE 

ONE HUNDRED TENTH CONGRESS 

FIRST SESSION 

JUNE 5, 2007 

Serial No. J–110–40 

Printed for the use of the Committee on the Judiciary 

( 

(II) 

COMMITTEE ON THE JUDICIARY 

PATRICK J. LEAHY, Vermont, Chairman 

EDWARD M. KENNEDY, Massachusetts 

JOSEPH R. BIDEN, JR., Delaware 

HERB KOHL, Wisconsin 

DIANNE FEINSTEIN, California 

RUSSELL D. FEINGOLD, Wisconsin 

CHARLES E. SCHUMER, New York 

RICHARD J. DURBIN, Illinois 

BENJAMIN L. CARDIN, Maryland 

SHELDON WHITEHOUSE, Rhode Island 

ARLEN SPECTER, Pennsylvania 

ORRIN G. HATCH, Utah 

CHARLES E. GRASSLEY, Iowa 

JON KYL, Arizona 

JEFF SESSIONS, Alabama 

LINDSEY O. GRAHAM, South Carolina 

JOHN CORNYN, Texas 

SAM BROWNBACK, Kansas 

TOM COBURN, Oklahoma 

BRUCE A. COHEN, Chief Counsel and Staff Director 

MICHAEL O’NEILL, Republican Chief Counsel and Staff Director 

(III) 

C O N T E N T S 

STATEMENTS OF COMMITTEE MEMBERS 

Page 

Feinstein, Hon. Dianne, a U.S. Senator from the State of California ................. 1 

Leahy, Hon. Patrick J., a U.S. Senator from the State of Vermont, prepared 

statement .............................................................................................................. 131 

Specter, Hon. Arlen, a U.S. Senator from the State of Pennsylvania ................. 3 

WITNESSES 

Boxer, Hon. Barbara, a U.S. Senator from the State of California ..................... 4 

Bratton, William J., Chief of Police, Los Angeles Police Department, Los 

Angeles, California ............................................................................................... 8 

Croteau, Gregg, Executive Director, United Teen Equality Center, Lowell, 

Massachusetts ...................................................................................................... 23 

Driskill, Boni Gayle, Wings of Protection, Modesto, California ........................... 16 

Fox, James P., District Attorney, San Mateo County, California, and President-Elect, National District Attorneys Association, Redwood City, California ..................................................................................................................... 18 

Robinson, Claude A., Jr., Vice President of Youth Development Programs, 

Uhlich Children’s Advantage Network, Chicago, Illinois ................................. 20 

Villaraigosa, Hon. Antonio R., Mayor, City of Los Angeles, Los Angeles, 

California .............................................................................................................. 6 

Word, Patrick, Detective, Gaithersburg Police Department, Gaithersburg, 

Maryland, and Chairman, Mid-Atlantic Regional Gang Investigations Network, Gaithersburg, Maryland ............................................................................ 25 

QUESTIONS AND ANSWERS 

Responses of Gregg Croteau to questions submitted by Senators Durbin and 

Kennedy ................................................................................................................ 34 

Responses of James P. Fox to questions submitted by Senator Kennedy ........... 41 

Responses of Patrick Word to questions submitted by Senator Kennedy ........... 43 

Questions submitted by Senator Durbin to James P. Fox (Note: Responses 

to the questions were not available at the time of printing.) ........................... 45 

SUBMISSIONS FOR THE RECORD 

Action Network, Manolo Guillen, Founder & Chairman, San Diego, California, 

letter ...................................................................................................................... 46

Advancement Project Inc., Constance L. Rice, Los Angeles, California, letter .. 47 

Association for Los Angeles Deputy Sheriffs, Inc., Steve Remige, President, 

Monterey Park, California, letter ....................................................................... 48 

Bakersfield City Council, Safe Neighborhoods and Community Relations Committee, Walter Williams, Stephanie Campbell, Steve Perryman, DeVon 

Johnson, and Ann Batchelder for Bob Malouf, Bakersfield, California, letter .......................................................................................................................... 49 

Biane, Paul, Chairman, Board of Supervisors, County of San Bernardino, 

San Bernardino, California, letter ...................................................................... 50 

Big Brothers Big Sisters, Judy Vredenburgh, President & CEO, Philadelphia, 

Pennsylvania, letter ............................................................................................. 51 

Bond, Hon. James, Mayor, City of Encinitas, Encinitas, California, letter ........ 52 

Boxer, Hon. Barbara, a U.S. Senator from the State of California, prepared 

statement .............................................................................................................. 53 

Boys & Girls Clubs of America, Lorraine Howerton, Senior Vice President, 

Office of Government Relations, Washington, D.C., letter ............................... 56 

Page

IV 

Bradford, Hon. Steven C., Council Member, City of Gardena, Gardena, California, letter .......................................................................................................... 57 

Bratton, William J., Chief of Police, Los Angeles Police Department, Los 

Angeles, California, statement ............................................................................ 58 

Brown, Hon. Edmund G., Jr., Attorney General, Oakland, California, letter .... 73 

California District Attorneys Association, David LaBahn, Executive Director, 

Sacramento, California, letter ............................................................................. 75 

California Gang Investigators Association, Wesley D. McBride, Executive Director, Huntington Beach, California, letter ...................................................... 76 

California Peace Officers’ Association, Paul Cappitelli, President, Sacramento, 

California, letter ................................................................................................... 77 

California State Sheriffs’ Association, Laurie Smith, President, Sheriff, Santa 

Clara County and Robert T. Doyle, Legislative Committee Chair, Sheriff, 

Marin County, West Sacramento, California, letter ......................................... 78 

Childhelp, John R. Reid, Executive Director, Scottsdale, Arizona, letter ........... 79 

Citizens Against Homicide, Jan Miller, Co-Founder, Jane Alexander, CoFounder, San Anselmo, California, letter .......................................................... 80 

Couso-Vasquez, Garry, Chief of Police, Montebello, Califorina, letter ................ 81 

Croteau, Gregg, Executive Director, United Teen Equality Center, Lowell, 

Massachusetts, statement ................................................................................... 82 

Driskill, Boni Gayle, Wings of Protection, Modesto, California, statement ........ 92 

Delgadillo, Rockard J., City Attorney, Los Angeles, California, letter ................ 100 

Do It Now Foundation, James D. Parker, Executive Director, Tempe, Arizona, 

letter ...................................................................................................................... 102 

Dorn, Hon. Roosevelt F., Mayor, City of Inglewood, Inglewood, California, 

letter ...................................................................................................................... 103 

Doty, Wendy L., Superintendent, Downey Unified School District, Downey, 

California, letter ................................................................................................... 104 

Doyle, Bob, Sheriff-Coroner, Riverside County, Riverside, California, letter ..... 105 

Dumanis, Bonnie M., District Attorney of San Diego County, San Diego, 

California, letter ................................................................................................... 106 

Federal Law Enforcement Officers Association, Art Gordon, National President, Lewisberry, Pennsylvania, letter .............................................................. 107 

Foster, Hon. Bob, Mayor, City of Long Beach, Long Beach, California, letter ... 108 

Fox, James P., District Attorney, San Mateo County, California, and President-Elect, National District Attorneys Association, Redwood City, California, statement .................................................................................................. 110 

Grand Lodge, Fraternal Order of Police, Chuck Canterbury, National President, Washington, D.C., letter ............................................................................ 120 

Grim, Arthur E., President Judge, Reading, Pennsylvania, letter ...................... 121 

Hahn, Janice, Councilwoman, City of Los Angeles, California, letter ................ 122 

Hamai, Sachi, Executive Officer, County of Los Angeles, Board of Supervisors, 

Los Angeles, California, letter and attachment ................................................. 123 

Hispanic American Police Command Officers Association, Ray Leyva, National President, San Antonio, Texas, letter ...................................................... 125 

International Association of Chiefs of Police, Joseph C. Carter, President, 

Alexandria, Virginia, letter ................................................................................. 126 

International Association of Women Police, Amy Ramav, President, Ontario 

Provincial Police, Operational Policy & Strategic Planning Bureau, Orillia, 

Ontario, Canada, letter ........................................................................................ 127 

International Union of Police Associations, AFL–CIO, Dennis Slocumbe, 

International Vice President, Alexandria, Virginia, letter ............................... 128 

Kolender, William B., Sheriff, San Diego County Sheriff’s Department, San 

Diego, California, letter ....................................................................................... 129 

League of California Cities, Maria Alegria, President, and Christopher 

McKenzie, Executive Director, Sacramento, California, letter ......................... 130 

Local Initiatives Support Corporation, Benson F. Roberts, Senior Vice President for Policy and Program Development, Washington, D.C., letter ............. 133 

Los Angeles County Sheriff’s Department, Leroy D. Baca, Sheriff, Monterey 

Park, California, letter ........................................................................................ 135 

Loveridge, Hon. Ronald O., Mayor, Riverside, California, letter ......................... 137 

Major Cities Chiefs Association, Darrel Stephens, President, letter ................... 138 

McKenna, Hon. Rob, Attorney General of Washington, Olympia, Washington, 

letter ...................................................................................................................... 139 

Mentor, Karen Nussle, Senior Vice President, Alexandria, Virginia, letter ....... 141 

Mollner, Joe, Senior Director, Delinquency Prevention, Boys & Girls Clubs 

of America, statement .......................................................................................... 142 

Page

V 

National Association of Police Organizations, Inc., William J. Johnson, Executive Director, Washington, D.C., letter ............................................................... 148 

National Association of Women Law Enforcement Executives, Laura Forbes, 

President, Carver, Massachusetts, letter ........................................................... 149 

National Black Police Association, Inc., Ronald E. Hampton, Executive Director, Washington, D.C., letter ............................................................................... 150 

National Board of Concerns of Police Survivors, Suzie Sawyer, Executive 

Director, Camdenton, Missouri ........................................................................... 151 

National Crime Prevention Council, Alfonso E. Lenhardi, President and CEO, 

Washington, D.C., letter ...................................................................................... 152 

National Center for Victims of Crime, Mary Lou Leary, Executive Director, 

Washington, D.C., letter ...................................................................................... 153 

National District Attorneys Association, Mathias H. Heck, Jr., President, 

Alexandria, Virginia, letter ................................................................................. 154 

National Juvenile Justice & Delinquency Prevention Coalition, joint letter ...... 156 

National Latino Peace Officers Association, Roy Garivey, President, Las 

Vegas, Nevada, letter ........................................................................................... 161 

National League of Cities, Hon. Bart Peterson, President and Mayor, Indianapolis, Indiana, letter ........................................................................................... 162 

National Major Gang Task Force, Edward L. Cohn, Executive Director, Indianapolis, Indiana, letter ...................................................................................... 163 

National Narcotic Officers’ Associations Coalition, Ronald E. Brooks, President, West Covina, California, letter .................................................................. 164 

National Organization for Victim Assistance, Joseph Myers, President, Alexandria, Virginia, letter ......................................................................................... 165 

National Organization of Black Law Enforcement Executives, Jimmie Dotson, 

President, Alexandria, Virginia, letter ............................................................... 166 

National Organization of Parents of Murdered Children, Inc., Dan Levey, 

President, Cincinnati, Ohio, letter ...................................................................... 167 

National Sheriffs’ Association, Ted Kamatchus, President, Alexandria, Virginia, letter ........................................................................................................... 168 

National Troopers Coalition, Dennis Hallion, Chairman, Washington, D.C., 

letter ...................................................................................................................... 169 

Oklahoma Gang Investigators Association, Tim Hock, Vice President, Lawton, 

Oklahoma, letter .................................................................................................. 170 

Parks, Hon. Bernard C., Councilmember, Los Angeles City Council, Los Angeles, California, letter ............................................................................................ 171 

Passalacqua, Stephan R., Sonoma County District Attorney, Santa Rosa, California, letter .......................................................................................................... 173 

Peace Officers Reserch Association of California, Ron Cottingham, President, 

Sacramento, California, letter ............................................................................. 174 

Penrod, Gary S., Sheriff, San Bernardino County, San Bernadino, California, 

letter ...................................................................................................................... 175 

Points of Light Foundation, Howard H. Williams, III, Interim CEO and President, Washington, D.C., letter ............................................................................ 176 

Pulido, Hon. Miguel A., Mayor, Santa Ana, California, letter ............................. 177 

Rackauckas, Tony, Orange County District Attorney, Santa Ana, California, 

letter ...................................................................................................................... 178 

Ramos, Michael A., San Bernardino District Attorney, San Bernardino, California, letter .......................................................................................................... 179 

Reed, Hon. Chuck, Mayor, San Jose, California, letter ........................................ 180 

Robinson, Claude A. Jr., Vice President of Youth Development Programs, 

Uhlich Children’s Advantage Newtwork, Chicago, Illinois ............................... 181 

Robles, Darline P., Superintendent, Los Angeles County Office of Education, 

Downey, California, letter ................................................................................... 184 

Salinas City Council, Ann Camel, City Clerk, Salinas, California, letter and 

resolution .............................................................................................................. 185 

Sanders, Hon. Jerry, Mayor, San Diego, California, letter .................................. 187 

Schwarzenegger, Hon. Arnold, Governor, Sacramento, California, letter ........... 188 

Sheedy, Hon. Sandy, Chair, Law and Legislation Committee, Sacramento, 

California, letter and attachment ....................................................................... 189 

Totten, Gregory D., County of Ventura District Attorney, Ventura, California, 

letter ...................................................................................................................... 191 

Tulare County Board of Supervisors, Allen Ishida, Chairman, Visalia, California, letter .......................................................................................................... 193 

United States Conference of Mayors, Hon. Douglas Palmer, Mayor of Trenton, 

President, Washington, D.C., letter .................................................................... 194 

Page

VI 

Villaraigosa, Hon. Antonio R., Mayor, City of Los Angeles, Los Angeles, 

California .............................................................................................................. 195 

Walters, Paul M., Chief of Police, Santa Ana, California, letter ......................... 205 

Walters, Thomas P., Washington Representative, San Diego County Board 

of Supervisors, Washington, D.C., letter ............................................................ 206 

Williams, Hubert, Police Foundation, Washington, D.C., letter .......................... 207 

Wood, Hon. Jim, Mayor, Oceanside, California, letter ......................................... 208 

Word, Patrick, Detective, Gaithersburg Police Department, Gaithersburg, 

Maryland, and Chairman, Mid-Atlantic Regional Gang Investigations Network, Gaithersburg, Maryland ............................................................................ 209 

(1) 

EXAMINING THE FEDERAL ROLE TO WORK 

WITH COMMUNITIES TO PREVENT AND RESPOND TO GANG VIOLENCE: THE GANG 

ABATEMENT AND PREVENTION ACT OF 2007 

TUESDAY, JUNE 5, 2007 

U.S. SENATE, 

COMMITTEE ON THE JUDICIARY, 

Washington, D.C. 

The Committee met, Pursuant to notice, at 10:02 a.m., in room 

SD–226, Dirksen Senate Office Building, Hon. Dianne Feinstein, 

presiding. 

Present: Senators Feinstein, Feingold, Durbin, Whitehouse, and 

Specter. 

OPENING STATEMENT OF HON. DIANNE FEINSTEIN, A U.S. 

SENATOR FROM THE STATE OF CALIFORNIA 

Senator FEINSTEIN. The meeting of the Judiciary Committee will 

come to order, and I am delighted to have Senator Specter here. 

And we have an all California panel, Senator: my colleague Senator 

Boxer; the very distinguished mayor from Los Angeles, Antonio 

Villaraigosa; and, I happen to think, an extraordinarily fine Chief 

of Police, Chief Bratton from L.A. What I would like to do is begin 

with a brief statement, ask if you would like to make one, then 

turn to Senator Boxer. 

I want to begin by thanking Chairman Leahy for scheduling this 

hearing on S. 456, the Gang Abatement and Prevention Act of 

2007. This problem—gang violence—is one that Senator Hatch and 

I have been trying to address with Federal legislation for over 10 

years now. I did not realize it had been so long. We first submitted 

legislation in the 104th Congress, the 105th, the 106th, 107th, 

108th, and 109th. So it looks like we are finally going to be able 

to address this problem in this bill, and I am very pleased. 

Gang violence today is no longer just a big-city problem. Like a 

cancer, criminal street gangs have now spread throughout the 

United States, destroying neighborhoods, crippling families, and 

killing innocent people as they expand. Before 1990, the number of 

cities and counties affected by gangs had grown by less than 200 

jurisdictions in both the 1970s and the 1980s. But gangs expanded 

by 675 cities and 458 counties from 1990 to 1995, just about when 

Senator Boxer and I came to the Senate. And today the FBI says 

gangs affect 2,500 jurisdictions in this country. 

In 1991, the National Youth Information Center said there were 

4,881 gangs in America. Today there are at least 30,000 different 

2 

street gangs. In 1991, the National Young Information Center said 

there were 250,000 gang members nationally. Today the FBI estimates there are at least 800,000 active gang members. 

Let me put this 800,000 number in its proper perspective. Los 

Angeles City Attorney Rocky Delgadillo recently noted in his letter 

endorsing our bill that, ‘‘The Department of Justice tells us there 

are only 708,000 State and local police officers. We are outmanned, 

outgunned, and in the midst of a national crisis.’’ In short, cities 

and States need our help. Our gang problem is large and growing— 

a national problem that requires a national solution. 

Gang members do not simply commit violent crimes, but they 

also commit them more frequently. In two cities—Los Angeles and 

Chicago, arguably the most gang-populated cities in the United 

States—over half of the combined nearly 1,000 homicides a year 

were attributed to gangs in 2004. Of the remaining 171 cities, approximately one-fourth of all homicides are considered gang related. And across the United States, the number of gang homicides 

reported by cities with populations of 100,000 or more increased 34 

percent from 1999 to 2003. And that was before the recent surge 

in violent crime that we have seen nationwide in the past 2 years. 

A few weeks ago, at a hearing on violent crime before Chairman 

Biden’s Subcommittee on Crime and Drugs, every witness present 

talked about gangs as a contributing factor in this violent crime 

upsurge. Several of the witnesses expressly endorsed our bill, and 

today, as we hold a specific hearing on the bill itself, I am pleased 

that several other witnesses will also call for its passage. 

S. 456, the Gang Abatement and Prevention Act, is tough on violent gang crimes, but it is also tough on the root causes of that 

gang crime. Through a comprehensive approach that will combine 

suppression, prevention, and intervention efforts, the bill would 

adopt new Federal criminal laws and tougher penalties against 

those who commit gang-related and other violent crimes. It would 

authorize hundreds of millions of dollars for new gang-related prosecutions and to bolster witness protection in cases involving violence. And it would identify successful community programs and 

invest hundreds of millions of dollars in schools and civic and religious organizations to encourage young people to walk away from 

gangs and to provide positive alternative so they never join. 

I am very pleased to see that the bill has received support from 

dozens of organizations: United States Conference of Mayors, Fraternal Order of Police, International Association of Chiefs of Police, 

National Sheriffs Association, and on and on. I have pages listed 

here, which I will not go into, but over the 10 years that we have 

been fighting for this bill, I think it has become much better 

known, and we have also negotiated with several members of this 

Committee and others. And so I think today we have a much better 

bill, Senator Specter, before the body of the Senate. So I look forward to rapid passage, hopefully, by this Subcommittee and Committee and on the floor of the Senate. 

If I might turn it over to you, and thank you for your interest 

in this very, very much. 

3 

STATEMENT OF HON. ARLEN SPECTER, A U.S. SENATOR FROM 

THE STATE OF PENNSYLVANIA 

Senator SPECTER. Well, thank you, Madam Chairman, for your 

leadership on this important issue. I have seen the problem of juvenile gangs since my days at district attorney of Philadelphia many 

years ago, and the problem has increased in intensity because 

there has been insufficient attention paid to it. I thank you for 

coming to Philadelphia last year for the hearing which we had 

there on the issue, and I sent for a copy of the Philadelphia Inquirer to demonstrate the problem which is in Pennsylvania’s biggest city: ‘‘Philadelphia leads big cities in murder rate.’’ I am sorry 

that we have that distinction, but that is the brutal fact of life. 

It is very appropriate for the Federal Government to play a more 

active role in this issue, and the legislation which we are discussing here today is a big step along the way. I note that last 

week the Department of Justice initiated some action in New Orleans, a special problem because of the impact of Katrina. But it is 

an issue around the country. And what some of us have been 

searching for on an immediate answer, we talk about the underlying causes of crime; we talk about education and housing and job 

training. And it is a seemingly intractable problem, but we have to 

continue to battle it. 

One thought is for a short-term answer would be to try to recruit 

mentors. We find so many of these gang members and other juvenile offenders come from broken homes—no father, a working 

mother, no parental guidance, no role models. And the thought has 

been that if we could identify the at-risk youth and pair them with 

an adult mentor to provide some immediate guidance, that might 

provide some answer. 

And following the hearing with Senator Feinstein, Senator 

Biden, and Governor Rendell and I attended in Philadelphia last 

year, we have held similar hearings across the State, in Pittsburgh 

and Allentown and Lancaster and Harrisburg, trying to bring in 

the United States Attorneys, the Drug Enforcement Agency, Alcohol, Tobacco, and Firearms, FBI, in addition to the State police. 

But the Federal Government needs to play a role in this important 

subject, and I think that this legislation, Senator Feinstein, is a big 

step forward. So I am pleased to join you. 

I am sorry to see that there are not more members of our Committee here today, but that is not atypical because there is so much 

activity in the Senate—really on any day, but today is an especially 

tough day. Senator Feinstein and I just came from a lengthy meeting on immigration, and we are trying to take some important 

steps on that subject today. That bears on this issue as well. 

So I will stay as long as I can, Madam Chairwoman. 

Senator FEINSTEIN. Thank you very much, Senator. I appreciate 

it and I appreciate your support and your concern. And I remember 

well and very much enjoyed my time in Philadelphia. It was a very 

good hearing. 

Senator SPECTER. You will have to come back. 

Senator FEINSTEIN. I would like to. Thank you. 

Senator SPECTER. I was in Los Angeles last week. 

Senator FEINSTEIN. Thank you very much. Reciprocity. 

4 

Now I would like to call on my friend and colleague and welcome 

her here, Senator Barbara Boxer. 

STATEMENT OF HON. BARBARA BOXER, A U.S. SENATOR FROM 

THE STATE OF CALIFORNIA 

Senator BOXER. Thank you, Madam Chair, for the privilege of 

participating in this important hearing, and I commend you for 

your hard work and leadership on this issue for so many years. 

And I am proud to join you as a cosponsor of your bill, and I am 

proud because I believe this bill is balanced. It combines toughness, 

prevention, punishment, help to beleaguered communities—all 

those elements that I think are so crucial. And I also want to join 

you in welcoming my friend Mayor Antonio Villaraigosa and my 

friend Chief William Bratton. 

Both of these gentlemen, as you and I well know, worked tirelessly on the issue before us today—gang violence. They confront 

it every single day, and I want them to know how much we appreciate their efforts and how much we hope to be able to help you. 

Those of us from California, Madam Chair, the mayor, the chief, 

and I, know all too well, unfortunately, the damage that gang violence has done to our communities and our families, particularly 

our children. And while I will put the balance of my statement into 

the record, I want to share with you a story that really catapulted 

me into this issue after my friend Senator Feinstein had shown 

such leadership, and this occurred in 2005. 

On November 13, 2005, 11-year-old Mynisha Crenshaw sat down 

to have dinner with her 14-year-old sister and their family in their 

San Bernardino, California, apartment building. And I just want us 

to all think about that, sitting down with our families to have dinner. That was very unremarkable. A gang-related dispute broke out 

in the neighborhood, and gunfire sprayed the apartment building, 

killing young Mynisha, 11-year-old Mynisha, innocent, seriously 

wounding her 14-year-old sister who, thank goodness, has recovered. But imagine the fear and anguish the family and the community felt because of this tragedy. A young girl full of hope and 

promise sitting down for dinner as part of a family, dead because 

of this senseless violence. 

When I went into the community, San Bernardino, after that 

fact, I saw something I had rarely seen before. The community was 

just up in arms together and saying, ‘‘This is it. This cannot happen again.’’ Well, 4 months later, it did happen again. Two innocent men were killed in gang-related crossfire in downtown San 

Bernardino. 

Well, believe me, Senator Feinstein, you and I know exactly what 

happened in San Bernardino. It is a very high-intensity gang area 

right now, and I wrote a bill with you called ‘‘Mynisha’s Law.’’ And 

it is a very simple concept, and I am so happy it has been incorporated into your larger bill because I think it does add something. 

It is complementary, and I am so happy your staff worked so hard 

to get this done. 

What we simply say is that there should be an interagency task 

force from the various areas of Government that provide help to 

these communities but do not ever talk to each other about it—the 

Department of Justice, Education, Labor, HHS, and HUD. And 

5 

they will coordinate and work with your coordinating committee 

that you have on the ground already in the bill to make sure that 

what is delivered to these communities, you know, is really the 

right medicine. 

I will give you just one example, and then I will wind up. 

For example, the Department of Education runs the 21st Century Community Learning Centers, and Mayor Villaraigosa and I 

and, I know, Senator Feinstein, you have been strong supporters 

of after-school programs. They really do work. They keep these kids 

out of trouble. These high-intensity gang areas need more funds, so 

that would be part of the mix. Health and Human Services, they 

have the Healthy Start program, which gets in really early. These 

are just examples. Community development block grants come out 

of HUD, and Job Corps comes out of Labor. 

So what we are going to do is not reinvent the wheel but have 

people who know what they are doing, and what I liked about your 

staff’s and your recommendation to us is—originally we had the 

task force in Washington. You insisted, and I think rightly so, that 

they ought to be people on the ground from the community so we 

really have an onsite team working with the rest of the bill, as you 

have set it up. 

So at the end of the day, I would ask unanimous consent to put 

the rest of my statement into the record. I just want to again say 

thank you. This is a good bill. I am going to work with Senator 

Reid to get this bill to the floor. We need this bill. It is a long time 

coming. It is going to make a difference. And I am so happy that 

Senator Specter is here. I know the numbers of things he has to 

do. I am so happy that Senator Whitehouse is here and that Senator Hatch is so supportive. 

So, Madam Chair, you just call on me. Sometimes back home we 

say Senator Feinstein and I make a good team. She talks to the 

tall Senators, I talk to the short Senators. Whatever you need from 

me, I will be there for you on this very important legislation. 

Thank you very much. 

Senator FEINSTEIN. Thank you very much. I appreciate your comments. I appreciate your cosponsorship. I appreciate your friendship. Thank you so much. 

[The prepared statement of Senator Boxer appears as a submission for the record.] 

Senator FEINSTEIN. We will now move on, if we might. Senator 

Whitehouse has joined us, and I would like to introduce now, I 

think, one of the finest mayors in America. He runs a very big 

city—Los Angeles—Mayor Antonio Villaraigosa. He is the 41st 

mayor of the city. He was elected in 2005 after serving 2 years on 

the Los Angeles City Council. Before that, he served in the California State Assembly, where he was elected by his colleagues as 

the first Assembly Speaker from Los Angeles in 25 years. The reason is because, I think, San Francisco had a bit of a monopoly on 

the speakership, but you certainly— 

Mr. VILLARAIGOSA. A century. 

Senator FEINSTEIN. Yes, exactly. 

He was raised in East Los Angeles, was the oldest of four children, raised by a single mother. He is the first Latino mayor of Los 

Angeles since 1872 and was named as one of America’s 25 Most InVerDate Aug 31 2005 13:25 Aug 04, 2008 Jkt 043451 PO 00000 Frm 00011 Fmt 6633 Sfmt 6633 S:\GPO\HEARINGS\43451.TXT SJUD1 PsN: CMORC
6 

fluential Latinos by Time Magazine. He also has been named one 

of America’s best leaders by United States News & World Report. 

Mr. Mayor, both Barbara and I know what it is like to go back 

and forth, the time loss. We thank you and Chief Bratton so much 

for coming back for this hearing. I know it is a bit of a hassle, but 

just know your visit is very much appreciated. Thank you for coming. 

STATEMENT OF HON. ANTONIO R. VILLARAIGOSA, MAYOR, 

CITY OF LOS ANGELES, LOS ANGELES, CALIFORNIA 

Mayor VILLARAIGOSA. Well, thank you, Senator Feinstein, for 

your leadership on this issue over the last decade that you have 

been working on this bill and for bringing this issue to the forefront. And, Ranking Member Specter, it is good to see you in good 

health and to see you again. We had an opportunity to talk last 

year about this issue, and we had talked about the idea of me coming to speak here, and I want to thank you for being here. And, 

Senator Whitehouse, although we have not been able to meet previously, it is good to have you here as well. 

Thank you for holding this hearing on the issue of preventing 

and confronting gang violence. I too, along with Senator Boxer, who 

I was on the plane with last evening, have some chilling stories to 

share with you. One of them was on December 20th of last year. 

I received a call from my security detail informing me that there 

had been a shooting in Central Los Angeles. At about 8:30 that 

night, two gang members—one barely 20 years old—were seen 

driving down a quiet residential street, like many in the city of Los 

Angeles. Neighbors heard the sound of gunfire. Shots rang from the 

car toward a nearby house. The car sped off. But one stray bullet 

pierced the front window of a neighboring apartment. That bullet 

crossed the living room and penetrated a wall into the kitchen, 

where stood a lovely 9-year-old girl. Her name was Charupha 

Wongwisetsiri. The next day I met and grieved with Charupha’s 

mother. She told me she had brought her daughter to Los Angeles, 

to America from Thailand, on the promise of a better education and 

a brighter future. Little Charupha died a few days later in the hospital. 

This was just a week after 14-year-old Cheryl Green, a young girl 

with her whole future in front of her, was standing on a corner in 

her own neighborhood in the middle of the day with a group of 

youngsters around the same age, when gang members walked up 

to her, shot her in cold blood, for the simple fact that she was African American. 

Honorable members, innocent people lose their lives to gang violence every day in every corner of this country. Gang violence affects neighborhoods from Phoenix to Boston, from Milwaukee to 

New York, from Columbia to Chicago, from Houston to San Diego 

and Philadelphia. 

Since 2001, more than 4,000 people have lost their lives to gang 

violence in California alone. More than 4,000 people. Hear that for 

a moment. That is more American lives than we have lost in the 

war in Iraq. That is more American lives than we lost on September 11th. Gang violence is a problem of national scope, and it 

must be confronted on a national scale. 

7 

You are all too aware that crime is on the rise across the country. Homicides and robberies are up double digits since 2004. And 

street gangs are becoming increasingly responsible for violent 

crime in our urban centers. 

In Los Angeles, violent gangs were responsible for a majority of 

the homicides, about 56 percent of all homicides; 70 percent of the 

gun violence in 2006 was perpetrated by gangs. In order to reduce 

the crime in our urban centers, we must confront this issue. 

I am very fortunate, as both Senator Feinstein and Senator 

Boxer have mentioned, to have Chief Bratton. I believe Chief 

Bratton is one of the most experienced leaders on this issue of gang 

and gun violence. He knows full well that cities like ours have limited resources to achieve the maximum reduction in crime. We 

need to collaborate and work with the Federal Government to address this issue, and so your leadership on this issue is very important. 

The chief also knows and is the first to tell you that we simply 

cannot arrest our way out of the problem of gang violence. Ranking 

Member Specter spoke of the issue of mentors. I can tell you, as 

a young boy growing up on the east side of Los Angeles, the fact 

that I had a mentor—and I was an at-risk individual. I grew up 

in a home with domestic violence and alcoholism. Many of the kids 

who are involved in gangs and gun violence come from broken 

homes, come from homes filled with drugs, and oftentimes do not 

have the support that we need. And so in order to reduce gang violence for the long term, we must, as Senator Boxer said, address 

this issue in a comprehensive way. That means a significant and 

sustained investment in prevention, intervention, and re-entry, in 

addition to enhanced suppression. 

That is why I am here to voice my strong support for Senator 

Feinstein’s legislation. The Gang Abatement and Prevention Act 

creates a collaborative and shared environment for law enforcement to work together on gang crime. It recognizes the wide consensus of gang experts and academics and local officials that the 

only sustainable and effective anti-gang strategy must include elements of gang prevention, intervention, suppression, and community-based re-entry. 

To implement this approach, we need the necessary resources for 

a comprehensive strategy. I can tell you that we are growing our 

police department. We are the most under-policed big city in the 

United States of America, on a per capita basis the safest big city 

in the United States. The numbers of homicides are down in Los 

Angeles to levels that we have not seen since I was a 3-year-old 

boy in 1956. And yet last year gang crime was up, while in the last 

few months, because of a strategy that the chief and I have implemented, it has gone down. We still, in addition to police officers, 

need the funding that I just mentioned. 

I have submitted for the record our gang reduction strategy. It 

is a strategy of working with the Federal Government, with a Justice Department grant, that in an area of the city where crime has 

gone up 30 percent, in this area, we are focusing on suppression, 

prevention, intervention, re-entry, family preservation, jobs, tattoo 

removal, a whole amalgam of programs, gang crime is down 40 percent. So we think this strategy works. We are here in support of 

8 

this legislation. We think it is important to be tough on crime, but 

equally tough on the root causes of crime as well. We think this 

legislation does that. 

Thank you very much. 

[The prepared statement of Mayor Villaraigosa appears as a submission for the record.] 

Senator FEINSTEIN. Thank you very much, Mr. Mayor, and I 

want to thank you because you have taken a very active interest 

in this area. I think you have put forward your own programs. I 

know they are working, and I really think you are to be commended. So thank you for being here. 

Senator BOXER. Senator Feinstein, may I be excused? I have another hearing. 

Senator FEINSTEIN. Yes. Thank you again very much. Thank you, 

Barbara. 

Since October 2002, William J. Bratton has served as the 54th 

Chief of the Los Angeles Police Department. That is the third largest police department in the United States. He manages 9,000 

sworn officers. He is the only person ever to serve as chief executive of both LAPD and the New York Police Department. He has 

developed an international reputation for re-engineering police departments and bringing down crime. 

As chief of the New York City Transit Police, Boston Police Commissioner, and then New York City Police Commissioner, he cut 

crime in all three posts, including the largest crime declines in 

New York City’s history. 

Chief, it is a great pleasure to welcome you here, and we look 

forward to hearing from you. 

STATEMENT OF WILLIAM J. BRATTON, CHIEF OF POLICE, LOS 

ANGELES POLICE DEPARTMENT, LOS ANGELES, CALIFORNIA 

Chief BRATTON. Thank you, Senator. It is a pleasure to be here 

with Mayor Villaraigosa to speak on this very important issue. I 

have previously submitted written testimony, and I will paraphrase 

some of that. 

I am here in support of the Gang Abatement and Prevention Act 

of 2007. I thank you and your colleagues, Senator Whitehouse and 

Senator Specter, for the opportunity to appear here this morning 

with my mayor. 

In the 1990s, we got it right in this country. The Congress of the 

United States supported the omnibus crime bill, and in the 1990s, 

we began to reduce crime dramatically after the peak year of 1990 

when it reached its highest level ever. Overall, crime in the United 

States in those years went down by between 30 and 40 percent, including homicides. 

But after the events of 9/11, the Federal Government, like a oneeyed Cyclops, basically focuses its attention now on terrorism, and 

in many ways abandoned the partnership with local communities 

and States in fighting local crime. Your bill—and I would expand 

on Senator Boxer’s comment. This is not just a good bill. It is a 

great bill—a great bill not only in its content and its focus on suppression, intervention, and prevention—and you need all three, as 

Mayor Villaraigosa has indicated, that American police chiefs and 

mayors have known for a long time. You cannot arrest your way 

9 

out of this problem. Suppression is, in fact, the first and foremost 

ingredient, but you need to add to the mix prevention and intervention, and your bill certainly allocates resources to begin that process. 

But after the events of 9/11, the Federal partnership was frayed. 

The additional officers that were hired in the 1990s by and large 

went away. The 8- to 10-percent reduction in the size of American 

police forces over the last 5 years has mirrored closely the increase 

in the 1990s. We have seen also that the new insidious element of 

crime that was evident in Los Angeles, Chicago, and some other 

cities in the 1990s gang crime has now spread throughout the 

United States and, in fact, Chicago and L.A., we are the source of 

much of that spread of gang crime, unfortunately, to the rest of the 

country. 

But in our city, as the mayor has indicated, we believe that we 

know what to do about it, and what it takes is resources and it 

takes partnership—resources in terms of not only additional police 

officers appropriately focused, but partnership with our Federal 

agencies, and we believe the partnerships we have in Los Angeles 

serve as a national model—FBI, DEA, ATF, and that partnership 

has been expanded on to the war on terrorism as well as trying to 

deal with the gang crime problem in L.A. 

As of this morning in Los Angeles, our overall homicides are 

down by 50 versus the same period of time last year. That is a 25- 

percent reduction. So we are having some success. But where we 

are still need to do more is in the area of prevention and intervention, because even as we make the city streets safer, to keep them 

that way we have to find alternatives for our young people. And 

the mayor’s testimony, supported by mine, speaks to a number of 

the initiatives that we have underway in Los Angeles that are 

helping us out, and helping us out significantly. 

As the mayor indicated, you cannot arrest your way out of this 

problem, but, in fact, that is where you need to begin in the sense 

of the suppression. To that end, the organization that I am proud 

to be President of, the Police Executive Research Forum—and I am 

also a very active member in the Major City Chiefs of Police-–2 

years ago we issued a report, ‘‘The Gathering Storm,’’ that talked 

about our belief, based on what we were dealing with, that crime 

was coming back to the United States; the residual benefits of the 

investment in the 1990s was, in fact, wearing off; the fact that 

agencies like the FBI, which had focused most of their 13,000 

agents on crime in the United States, were now focusing the vast 

majority of the resources on international terrorism; that that was 

going to have some impact on our abilities to fight crime. And it 

has. 

The FBI yesterday reported that for the second straight year in 

a row crime is up in the United States. In eight of the ten largest 

cities of the United States, homicides are up. As indicated by Senator Specter, Philadelphia has the dubious distinction of now having the highest murder rate in the country. 

We know what to do about this. We got it right in the 1990s. We 

can get it right again in the 21st century. But it is essential that 

the Federal Government re-engage in the partnership that brought 

about the successes in the 1990s. Your bill begins that process. It 

10 

is a necessary, essential, and critical first step. I applaud you and 

your colleagues for moving it forward, and I certainly wish you 

every success as you bring it to the full Congress. 

Thank you. 

[The prepared statement of Chief Bratton appears as a submission for the record.] 

Senator FEINSTEIN. Thank you very much. 

Senator SPECTER. Madam Chair? 

Senator FEINSTEIN. Yes, Senator, would you— 

Senator SPECTER. I would just like to submit a couple of questions for the record. I am going to have to excuse myself at this 

point. But I thank the witnesses who have come in, the mayor and 

the chief and the witnesses from San Mateo. 

Senator FEINSTEIN. Thank you. 

Senator SPECTER. Very important testimony, and we congratulate you on your success, and Philadelphia is going to follow you. 

Thank you. 

Senator FEINSTEIN. Thank you, and thank you for your cosponsorship. I appreciate it very much. 

Senator SPECTER. Glad to do it. 

Senator FEINSTEIN. Just a quick question before we move on. 

Most people do not know that the Federal Government does not 

run prevention programs. We fund grants which go to communities 

or organizations for these programs. In your view, since your initiative, Mr. Mayor, and, Chief, during your tenure—you heard Senator Specter speak about mentoring, which is, I think, a great idea. 

It is very hard because if you have 700,000, 800,000 gang members, 

it is hard to find that number of mentors. But which programs in 

Los Angeles have you found work the best? 

I went to Lennox School, and I watched a gang program in that 

middle school. I was very impressed with it. And I thought it might 

be interesting if you could go into what you believe today in Los 

Angeles are the most successful models. 

Mayor VILLARAIGOSA. We are in the process currently of reviewing our anti-gang programs. We hope to complete that assessment 

of their performance sometime later in the year. I can tell you that 

one program, a prevention program that you have been very, very 

supportive of and sponsored budget augmentations in support of 

this, is the L.A.’s Best after-school program, a great prevention program, an after-school enrichment program for kids that about 

26,000 kids in Los Angeles are benefiting from, in a school district, 

however, with 780,000 kids. So a long way— 

Senator FEINSTEIN. Explain how it works. 

Mayor VILLARAIGOSA. It is essentially an after-school program of 

enrichment. It has academics, music, dance, you know, a cultural 

component as well as tutoring. Kids participate—not all the kids in 

the school because the program is not big enough, but a group of 

kids who qualify participate in this program. It has been very, very 

successful. There has actually been a longitudinal study by UCLA 

that has demonstrated the positive impacts of this program for 

graduation later on. And there are other programs, Homeboy Industries, Father Boyle, who I think you know, has done incredible 

work with kids. He says that nothing stops a bullet like a job, 

11 

working with kids on family preservation issues, on counseling, 

providing skills for jobs. 

We are in the process of increasing—when I was elected mayor, 

we were doing only about 2,500 summer youth jobs. In my first 

year, we had a goal of 5,000. We passed that, got 7,500. This year 

the goal is 10,000 summer youth jobs. We are on our way to 

13,000, we hope, by the end of the summer. Very important to keep 

kids off the streets. We have a program called ‘‘Learn and Earn’’ 

that focuses on the dropout rate and on the failure of young people 

to pass the high school exit exam. We train them with the Princeton Review in the morning to pass the exit exam, and in the afternoon we give them a job. 

So those are some programs. There are others. Again, this GRIP 

program—I think it is called Gang Reduction Improvement Program—is a collaboration with the Justice Department, and those 

are some of the elements. 

Senator FEINSTEIN. Thank you. 

Chief, in your view, what community program works the best? 

Chief BRATTON. I am certainly very supportive of Homeboy Industries, which is to my mind one of the most successful intervention programs; taking active gang members and trying to turn their 

lives around. Father Boyle has done a phenomenal job. But there 

are three programs within the Los Angeles Police Department that 

I would like to briefly reference. 

First is our Jeopardy program, which is an intervention effort to 

take kids who are beginning to get recruited into gangs, and I applaud in your bill that there is a significant component that basically makes it a crime to recruit young people into gangs, because 

that is where we need to stop it as they are going in. But Jeopardy 

tends to deal with those young people who are into a gang but not 

so far in that we cannot help to pull them out. It requires parental 

involvement. The parents have to basically come to classes with 

their kids. Something that is so often missing and allows for the 

recruitment of young people into gangs is parental involvement. 

The second program is the Explorer program. These are young 

cadets. We have about 750 of them in this program. We are going 

to double that, hopefully, over the next year. These are young people who for 12 Saturdays in a row come in and they are mentored 

and taught by our police officers. They wear uniforms. After graduation they can stay with the program until they turn 20 years of 

age. They give over 100,000 hours of voluntary service every year 

back to the community, and these are young people who have 

found an alternative to the gangs. 

The third program is our Magnet Schools, in partnership with 

the Los Angeles Unified School District. We have five high schools 

in which we have approximately 1,500 young people who are in our 

program. The graduation rate of young people entering our high 

schools is about 50 percent. But in our Magnet School program, the 

graduation rate is 95 percent of people who enter, and the vast majority of them go on to college when they graduate. Last year, they 

received in excess of a million dollars in scholarships. We have police officers assigned to those schools full-time. They work with 

these kids every day. One day a week they wear their uniforms to 

school and mingle with their classmates. The bravery that takes in 

12 

the Los Angeles School System to wear a Magnet School police uniform among their classmates is laudable. 

Those are just three of the efforts that are underway currently 

that would be expanded upon with the resources that your bill 

would provide. 

Senator FEINSTEIN. Thank you very much. 

Senator Whitehouse, any questions? 

Senator WHITEHOUSE. Thank you. 

First of all, welcome to you both. It is wonderful to have the 

mayor with us, and, Chief Bratton, in Providence, Rhode Island, we 

have Dean Esserman as our police chief. 

Chief BRATTON. You have the best. 

Senator WHITEHOUSE. He was an acolyte of yours and has 

brought a lot of the thinking that you brought to law enforcement 

to the city of Providence with great effect. So I will pass on your 

good regards to him. He is a close friend. 

Like many other cities, we have a fair amount of gang activity 

in Providence. We see it starting very early, and I wanted to ask 

at what school level do you see the risk of gang participation and 

influence really becoming very acute. 

Chief BRATTON. The mayor mentioned the L.A.’s Best program 

that he is so intimately involved with. He and I have actually had 

a fundraising event this past Sunday and raised almost $1 million 

for that program. It is all privately funded. Those are elementary 

school kids. 

We are finding, as we get more involved with this and the evolution of the gangs over the last 15 years, is that it is increasingly 

affecting younger people. You literally have to start trying to get 

them at the elementary school age, keep them engaged, off the 

streets, in an environment where there is mentoring, and then 

move right up the cycle. In Los Angeles, we have got truly a career 

ladder, if you will, for lack of a better term. Get them into L.A.’s 

Best, see if you can then move them into our Explorer programs, 

see if you can move them into the Magnet School programs. 

The mayor, in very tight budget years the 2 years he has been 

mayor, has been very actively supportive of our student worker 

program so that when the kids graduate high school, these Magnet 

Schools, they can find employment in the police department or they 

can be funded to go on to college and then hopefully become police 

officers. Over 20 of our police officers have gone through that series 

of steps, if you will, where you provide a safe passage through 

those very troubling years from elementary school on up. 

So elementary school, it is like so many other things, you cannot 

start early enough. 

Senator WHITEHOUSE. Mr. Mayor? 

Mayor VILLARAIGOSA. Let me just mention, Senator, that we hear 

from teachers that as young as 8 years old they start seeing some 

of the at-risk behavior in a lot of these kids. So the chief is right 

that the elementary school level is where you begin to see some of 

the manifestations of kids who are at risk and maybe moving into 

gangs. 

Just to set the record straight, I said ‘‘GRIP.’’ It is ‘‘grip,’’ but it 

is G-R-P, Gang Reduction Program. 

13 

Senator WHITEHOUSE. Chief, the HIGAA program, High-Intensity 

Gang Activity Areas, that Senator Feinstein has proposed seemed 

to be modeled on the HIDTA, the High-Intensity Drug Trafficking 

Area programs that I helped administer as U.S. Attorney in Rhode 

Island. What was your experience from the police side with the 

HIDTA programs? 

Chief BRATTON. HIDTA is a great initiative. It is a regional initiative, something we are certainly very familiar with, both from 

my experience in Boston, New York, and now in Los Angeles. The 

recommendation that the mayor has included in his testimony is 

that the new initiative that is proposed in the Senator’s gang bill 

should be focused more specifically. HIDTA is a larger region. Our 

experience would be that you would want to keep it concentrated 

within a geographic jurisdiction, such as the city of Los Angeles. 

So in the Mayor’s testimony, written testimony, there is a proposal to more specifically, while taking many elements of HIDTA, 

the High-Intensity Drug Trafficking Area program that has been so 

successful throughout the country, as we deal with gangs you 

would want a more significant and focused concentration of how 

you would apply those resources. 

Senator WHITEHOUSE. I cannot help but think about, if we speak 

about safety in our communities, the decision of the Bush administration to reduce funding for community policing and taking police 

officers off the streets and to fight against assault weapons restrictions and put more assault weapons on the streets. Do you see 

fewer police officers and more assault weapons as a sensible policy 

with respect to gang activity and violence in our cities? 

Chief BRATTON. I was quite proud during my time as police commissioner of New York City to actively work with the then-President and the then-Congress to work on the omnibus crime bill. I 

was pleased to be in the Rose Garden when President Clinton announced the initiative and to also be there for its signing, and we 

saw the benefits of that coalition—the omnibus crime bill, some 

meaningful gun laws for the first time in the history of the country, 

and it worked, including the close to 100,000 additional police that 

were hired. 

All of the elements of that program have pretty much been dissipated since the events of 9/11 other than the philosophy of community policing, which we embrace—partnership, problem solving, 

prevention. Unfortunately, the partnership with the Federal Government, the Federal Government contribution to that partnership 

has waned significantly. Director Mueller of the FBI would love to 

have his agents once again back working in close partnership with 

us on issues besides terrorism. What few agents he does have he 

allocates to traditional crime reduction efforts, and Los Angeles 

certainly gets its fair share of what is left. 

But the point you make that in the 1990s we got it right. We 

must once again understand that we cannot just fight a war on terrorism. We need also to fight a war that is closer to home, that is 

taking 16,000 lives every year, and that death toll is now growing 

once again. We have the capabilty to fight both terrorism and traditional crime together. 

Mayor VILLARAIGOSA. And, Senator Whitehouse, I am glad that 

you make the reference and the connection between gangs and gun 

14 

violence. I know that Senator Feinstein authored the assault weapons ban, and as she knows, I was, along with Senator Perata, the 

author of California’s assault weapons ban when I was Speaker of 

the California State Assembly, and also the author of most of the 

most far-reaching, sensible gun legislation in California. 

These gang members are not using bats and brass knuckles. 

They are using guns. They are using fire power that should be restricted to the battlefield and not the streets and neighborhoods 

and kitchens, as you heard from our testimony, of neighborhoods 

in Los Angeles and in cities across the Nation. We mayors—Mayor 

Bloomberg, myself, Mayor Daley—have led an effort to address this 

issue of micro-stamping and having the ability to trace weapons 

and ammunition so that we can get a handle on this issue. 

Whenever I refer to gang violence, I always say ‘‘gang and gun 

violence,’’ because as I said, they are not using knives and bats 

and, you know, brass knuckles. They are using fire power that is 

very, very formidable. 

Senator WHITEHOUSE. Thank you. 

Senator FEINSTEIN. Thank you. 

Let me just thank you for that effort because, having been a 

former mayor myself and active in the Conference of Mayors, I always thought that where the leadership would have to come with 

respect to guns is either from the mayors or from the women of 

America. There has to be an understanding of what the laxity with 

respect to being able to buy a gun on a street corner, from the back 

of a car, at a gun show, really does to the safety of the cities of 

America. And that has always been a very difficult point because 

the NRA comes right after you, and I see where they are going 

after Mayor Bloomberg. But I just want you to know I have the 

greatest respect. Thank you for what you are doing. Stand up tall. 

I am ready to go with legislation at any time. It is written. We 

have it. The problem is we do not have the votes for it. I just want 

to, you know, really say thank you. 

I also want to make a point. A few years back, I went on a visit 

to various schools in L.A. You were not mayor then. I was speaking 

to a fourth-grade class, and I noticed a youngster came up and 

stood next to me. I thought, ‘‘This is strange.’’ And afterwards, I 

asked somebody, I said, ‘‘Who was that youngster that came up?’’ 

He was the gang leader. So he was coming up to assert his territory in the classroom while I was actually speaking to the class. 

It sort of concentrated my attention, and I began to watch body 

language in other classes. And what I saw—and I do not know 

whether this is valid or not, but I saw it—was the difference between the third graders and the fourth, fifth, and sixth graders in 

the dullness of the eye that appeared, the apparent boredom, their 

body language in the chairs, and this sort of bright, eager third 

grader. By the time that third grader became a sixth grader, you 

saw the cynicism and the kind of pulling back that took place. 

So I have always drawn the conclusion that you really have to 

be concerned from grades 4 on up. Do you think that is wrong? 

Mayor VILLARAIGOSA. No, I do not. I think you are absolutely 

right. You know, the murder of Cheryl Green that I mentioned, the 

young boy or the young man who shot and killed her in cold blood 

was—they did a story on him on the front page of the L.A. Times, 

15 

and, you know, as a young boy he was a ball player, a church-going 

youngster, a good mom, a good family. And around the fourth or 

fifth grade, he began to exhibit, you know, aberrant behavior that 

then resulted in him joining gangs in middle school grades and 

then finally a life of destruction. 

Senator FEINSTEIN. You mentioned Father Boyle and his programs, and the chief did as well, in terms of being able to turn 

around these youngsters. 

One of the things that I have thought about is having some of 

these programs right in the school, almost part of the curriculum, 

in places where you really have troubled schools—and we know 

they do exist—and try to get at the heart of the gang movement 

right inside the schools. Do you think that makes any sense? 

Mayor VILLARAIGOSA. It makes a lot of sense, Senator. In fact, 

as you know, I made a valiant effort— 

Senator FEINSTEIN. Yes, you did. 

Mayor VILLARAIGOSA.—to take over in a partnership L.A. city 

schools. That effort notwithstanding was judged unconstitutional, 

and then I supported a majority, helped to elect a majority of reform members. I am hoping and expect that I am going to get a 

cluster of schools, some 50,000 kids, and one of the things we want 

to work on is on this issue of gangs and at-risk kids and have a 

concentrated focus in the schools. 

A woman who I supported for school board who is a neighborhood prosecutor, who works in the city attorney’s office and works 

with gang members, says she has never met a gang member who 

was not first a truant or a dropout. 

Senator FEINSTEIN. That is correct. 

Mayor VILLARAIGOSA. And so focusing on this issue in the schools 

is one aspect of the partnership that I think cities and schools need 

to have to address the violence in schools and in neighborhoods. 

Senator FEINSTEIN. Well, thank you very much. I do not want to 

take any more of your time. You might have to remind the commission occasionally of your support of them during the election. That 

is what I always found happened after a while. But I wish you the 

best of luck, and thank you for your help with this bill, and thank 

you both so much for being here. I appreciate it very, very much. 

Mayor VILLARAIGOSA. Thank you, Senator Feinstein, Senator 

Whitehouse, for having us here. 

Senator WHITEHOUSE. Good to be with you, Mayor, Chief. 

Senator FEINSTEIN. We will move on to the next panel. We have 

a victim, Ms. Boni Gayle Driskill, from Modesto, California. And 

Mr. James Fox, District Attorney of San Mateo County. Mr. Fox is 

also the President-Elect of the National District Attorneys Association. We have Mr. Claude Robinson, Vice President of Youth Development Programs, Uhlich Children’s Advantage Network, Chicago; 

Mr. Gregg Croteau, Executive Director, United Teen Equality Center; and Mr. Patrick Word, a detective from the Gaithersburg Police Department of Gaithersburg, Maryland, and he is also Chairman of the Mid-Atlantic Regional Gang Investigators Network. 

It is wonderful to have you here. Boni, I believe we will begin 

with you. She is a resident of Modesto. She is the mother of Lacy 

Marie Ferguson, who has been an innocent victim of gang violence. 

Before Lacy was shot and killed at the age of 25, Ms. Driskill had 

16 

been a medical assistant. She then quit her job to help raise her 

granddaughter, Haleigh, who is now 6 years old. Ms. Driskill is a 

member of Wings of Protection, a group that provides counseling 

to the family members of victims of homicide and missing persons. 

Welcome. We will ask you to confine your remarks to 5 minutes 

so we can hear from everybody. Thank you very much. 

STATEMENT OF BONI GAYLE DRISKILL, WINGS OF 

PROTECTION, MODESTO, CALIFORNIA 

Ms. DRISKILL. Thank you. First of all, I want to introduce you 

to my daughter and my granddaughter. I find it is much easier if 

you can see who I am speaking about. This is my daughter Lacy. 

She is 25. This is my granddaughter, Haleigh, who is now 6. Her 

mother was killed on her third birthday. 

First off, I know by looking at me you would not think that I 

would be aware of what gang violence means or be an expert in it. 

I do not— 

Senator FEINSTEIN. May I make a suggestion? Talk into the 

microphone, please, because it is all recorded. 

Ms. DRISKILL. OK. First off, I know you would not think that I 

would be aware of what gangs are or anything else. I mean, my 

kids grew up—I am a Mom. My kids grew up. Of course, I saw 

gangs in our neighborhood, but I kept them away from them. We 

had lived in Los Angeles, and in 1982 I decided to move my small 

children to Modesto, California, which was a small town at the 

time and did not have a gang problem like Los Angeles. I thought 

that that would be the solution at the time. 

Well, on August 24, 2003, my daughter, Lacy, who was not a 

gang member, who was not wearing the wrong colors, who—the 

closest thing to a gang was Girl Scouts and Sea Cadets—went to 

a corner market with her boyfriend. She was on a date with him, 

and she went in to get a pack of cigarettes, came out. One car 

pulled in front of her. It had gang members in it. Another car came 

in, looked at them, left, I guess to—I assume to load up their weapons, came back and opened fire on the first car. 

My daughter’s boyfriend was shot in the arm. The intended target, which was the other gang member from the other car, was shot 

twice in the buttocks. My daughter, on the other hand, was shot 

pointblank in the back of her head. 

She was resuscitated at the scene. She was taken to the trauma 

unit. She was resuscitated again. And the wound itself was such 

that there was nothing they could do. It was a large-caliber hollow 

point, which did complete damage. It entered the back of her head, 

exited her forehead with part of her forehead and most of her 

brains. She was put on machines to keep her alive. We had to 

make the decision to let her go because there was nothing that 

could be done. We let her go that next day. 

We took Haleigh into the ICU unit. We covered Lacy up and we 

took Haleigh in there. She was 3. She wanted her Mom to hold her. 

She couldn’t. She asked why Mama had a big boo-boo on her head. 

We took her out of the room. That was her good-bye. 

I want you to know now Haleigh gets as physically close to her 

mother as when we visit that graveyard. We do this. I personally 

go about four times a month. She gets to go probably about once 

17 

a month and on holidays. She hugs the stone. She kisses the picture good-bye. She asks questions now. ‘‘Why? Why are these people free?’’ Because it is unsolved still due to the fear that people 

have of gangs. There were 20 to 30 witnesses to the shooting. Nobody has stepped forward, which is hard for us. We have fought 

very hard for justice. 

I appreciate and I thank you, Mrs. Feinstein, for this gang abatement bill. It means a lot to me and to numerous families that I 

deal with on an everyday basis who have the same sad life that we 

do. Their story may be a little different, but they do not have a 

loved one anymore. They visit graveyards. They get to talk about 

their feelings, and the gangs still exist. They are not only existing, 

but they are proliferating. They are spreading. 

Los Angeles, as you heard, has a drop in crime. A lot of their 

gang members are moving to our area. The Central Valley is 

known for gangs. You cannot go to a J.C. Penney’s, you cannot go 

to a diner, you cannot go to take your child to Chuck E. Cheese 

without seeing these people. They used to stay basically within 

their own realm. Now there are so many that they are everywhere 

that you go. 

I appreciate Washington, D.C. It is so clean here. I have not seen 

anybody that even remotely looks like a gang member here, and for 

that I applaud you guys. We would like to see the same. 

Senator FEINSTEIN. Well, do not rush to judgment. 

[Laughter.] 

Ms. DRISKILL. Well, so far. But, I mean, compared to what we 

are used to living with. 

A couple days before Christmas Eve in 2005, I wrote a letter to 

the editor. It was addressed to the killers. Not so much what I 

wanted to see done with them. I am pro death penalty. I will be 

honest with you. But not so much what I wanted to see done with 

them, but for the fact that I wanted them to know what we have 

to live like since they did what they did. They did what they did 

and they scurried into the night. That is it. Nobody is uncovering 

who they are. They have that much intimidation. 

When I wrote a letter to the killer and put it as a letter to the 

editor, they made a feature story out of it. A couple days later, I 

received my answer from the gangs. They found out where we 

lived. They drove into my driveway and shot off seven rounds with 

a 9-millimeter gun. This is at a house that consists of me and my 

husband—grandparents—and a 6-year-old child who no longer has 

her mother. We face the intimidation of these people every single 

day where we live, and as for police officers, there are not enough. 

The crime is just over-running them. 

As for the gang units and stuff or prevention, we do not have it. 

We have a wake-up program that I came in contact with, and we 

have the after-school program. That is it. 

Senator FEINSTEIN. Could you wrap up because of the time? 

Ms. DRISKILL. OK. Thank you. Sorry. I tend to get on a roll with 

this. 

Senator FEINSTEIN. Thank you very much. We appreciate it. 

Ms. DRISKILL. But basically what I am asking you is two things. 

We really like this bill. Please, speaking as a victim’s family—and 

18 

I speak for many—do not water this down. Pass this thing the way 

it is so people can live peacefully. 

Thank you. 

[The prepared statement of Ms. Driskill appears as a submission 

for the record.] 

Senator FEINSTEIN. Thank you. One of the big problems is witness protection and the intimidation that gangs practice, andyou 

are obviously a victim of that, too, and I am so sorry. We will do 

everything we can. 

James Fox is the President-Elect of the National District Attorneys Association, and he is a former President of the California 

District Attorneys Association. He is a graduate of the University 

of San Francisco, and he has served at the elected D.A. of San 

Mateo County for the past 25 years, where he has seen firsthand 

the rise of gang violence. 

Welcome, Mr. Fox. 

STATEMENT OF JAMES P. FOX, DISTRICT ATTORNEY, SAN 

MATEO COUNTY, CALIFORNIA, AND PRESIDENT-ELECT, NATIONAL DISTRICT ATTORNEYS ASSOCIATION, REDWOOD 

CITY, CALIFORNIA 

Mr. FOX. Thank you very much, Madam Chair. It is a pleasure 

to be here, and I would like to thank you for the leadership role 

that you have taken in regard to this very important issue. 

I have been involved in the criminal justice system in one role 

or another for the past 41 years. I started out with the juvenile 

probation department. I served as a deputy district attorney prosecuting crimes. I spent 9 years as a criminal defense attorney. And 

as you said, I have been the elected district attorney now for almost 25 years. So I do think I have a rather broad perspective of 

the issue of crime, and in particular gang violence. 

Our county is somewhat unique, as you are certainly aware, 

Madam Chair. Many people do not realize that they have been in 

San Mateo County, but San Francisco International Airport is located in San Mateo County. So if you have been to San Francisco 

by flying, you have been in San Mateo County. 

The views that I am expressing are the views of both the National District Attorneys Association as well as the California District Attorneys Association, which has endorsed your legislation. 

You are well aware of the nature of the national gang problem. 

I will talk a little bit about the San Mateo County gang problem. 

But I want to also touch upon why I believe that it is important 

that there be Federal legislation to deal with this issue. 

Complexity characterizes the gang issue in all of our communities, and the safety of our citizens is seriously jeopardized as a 

result. But the fact of the matter is this is not just a local community issue. It is a national epidemic requiring Federal assistance. 

With the relative ease with which gang members can today cross 

State lines and international borders and utilize ever emerging 

technologies to communicate and perpetrate their crimes, we believe that it is important that there be a cooperation and a partnership formed by the local prosecutors as well as the Federal authorities. 

19 

In 2005, the San Mateo County Board of Supervisors, recognizing 

the proliferation of the gang problem in our county, funded additional positions in the sheriff’s office and in the probation department. We created a Gang Task Force, as well as a Gang Intelligence Unit, which is collaboratively cooperating with the Federal 

Government. The FBI is actively participating along with ATF. We 

believe that that could serve as a model for the partnership between the Federal Government and the local prosecutors. 

San Mateo County’s gang problem really does not reach the level 

where there are gang enterprises, criminal gang enterprises. The 

majority of our gangs, it is all about colors, turf, and respect. They 

are not engaged in for-profit operations, but they will engage in 

violent retaliation if somebody wearing the wrong color goes into 

their turf. So the current Federal laws are not capable of dealing 

with that on the Federal level because it does not rise to the level 

of a RICO. It is not an enterprise as such. 

We believe that there are inadequate resources that have been 

devoted certainly to prevention—as I said, I have spent 41 years 

in the criminal justice system. We do not nor have we ever spent 

enough money at the front end to try to change people, modify 

their behavior. We certainly do not spend enough money in trying 

to educate and do the intervention for at-risk behavior. You know, 

I am familiar with Father Boyle. I think he has got a fabulous program. But the high school level is too late. The intervention has got 

to start at the elementary school—they cannot even start in the 

middle school—because that is where it is getting started, as you 

commented yourself Senator, having been in a fourth grade class 

and firsthand witnessing the behavior of people who are at risk. 

We believe that the additional funding that might be available 

through this would authorize training. Training is absolutely critical for prosecutors to succeed in a courtroom. It is also critical for 

providing safety for our witnesses and our victims, and the National District Attorneys Association has a National Advocacy Center in Columbia, South Carolina, which we believe is a model of 

training for prosecutors and should be utilized in providing additional training to address the gang problem. 

In closing, I appreciate your efforts, Senator, and the Committee’s interest in this. I appreciate Chairman Leahy scheduling this 

hearing on a very, very important issue, and I believe that it is imperative that we finally be able to take action that you have been 

advocating now for the past 10 years. 

Thank you very much for your efforts. 

[The prepared statement of Mr. Fox appears as a submission for 

the record.] 

Senator FEINSTEIN. Thank you, Mr. Fox. 

We are now joined by Senator Durbin, and since the next witness 

is a distinguished Chicagoan, I believe that Senator Durbin should 

introduce him. 

Senator DURBIN. Thank you, Madam Chair, and thank you for 

your leadership on this issue. 

This hearing is the culmination of many years of effort by Senator Feinstein on this issue. I know of her determination and hard 

work to bring us to this point, and I thank her. We have worked 

to resolve some differences that we had, and I believe that we now 

20 

are very close to having a good piece of legislation to bring through 

the Committee and to the floor to deal with this national problem. 

Madam Chair, my guest today is Claude Robinson. Claude is 

with an organization known as the Uhlich Children’s Advantage 

Network. Uhlich goes back to the Civil War. It was started at a 

time when orphans of Civil War soldiers needed a place to go and 

be safe. It has survived all these years because it has been dedicated to young people and to the real problems that they face on 

a regular basis. 

Madam Chair, there is a lot of criticism of Members of Congress 

for earmarks. I want to put it on the record that I am proud of the 

earmark that I put in legislation to help fund this program at 

Uhlich Children’s Advantage Network because they have taken 

this money and reached out, just as Mr. Fox has noted, to children 

in the lower grades for gang prevention. If we are going to avoid 

the terribly tragedies that Ms. Driskill spoke of earlier, many of 

these children need to be reached at an early age. UCAN, Uhlich 

Children’s Advantage Network, has done that. 

And a word about Claude Robinson. Over 20 years of dedication 

to this effort, he was truly deserving when WGN–TV recently 

called him one of Chicago’s ‘‘unsung heroes,’’ so I am happy to welcome him to this Committee. 

Mr. ROBINSON. Thanks. Thanks for having me, Senator. 

Senator FEINSTEIN. Welcome, Mr. Robinson. 

STATEMENT OF CLAUDE A. ROBINSON, JR., VICE PRESIDENT 

OF YOUTH DEVELOPMENT PROGRAMS, UHLICH CHILDREN’S 

ADVANTAGE NETWORK, CHICAGO, ILLINOIS 

Mr. ROBINSON. Thank you, Senator Feinstein. I wanted to tell 

you that we really do appreciate the opportunity to speak with the 

Committee today and to provide what we hope are some viable solutions to the problems that young people experience and that we 

experience then as adults in this country. 

Perhaps Chicago’s most indelible mark currently for the 2006– 

2007 school year are the 28 young people who have lost their lives 

to guns and violence, in a timeframe spanning from September of 

2006 through March 31, 2007. In my estimation, one life is too 

many, but 28 is unconscionable-–28 young lives where their futures 

are unfulfilled, where their families are impacted, our communities 

are impacted, and then our Nation is impacted. 

I had the opportunity to watch—and hopefully some of you did 

also—Anderson Cooper come to Chicago last week, and he spoke to 

the superintendent of the Chicago public schools, Mr. Arne Duncan, 

and asked him, ‘‘Why is this happening in Chicago? Is this specific 

to Chicago?’’ And what Arne said, which resonates with young people as they try and speak out to adults in this country, Arne said 

that young people have not enough love, their lives are not filled 

with enough meaning, and their lives are not filled with enough 

hope. And he said, ‘‘When you have hopelessness, lovelessness, and 

meaninglessness, what value can you have of yourself? How can 

you value your life? And then if you do not value your life, you will 

not value the lives of other people.’’ 

So I wanted to present to you over the past 3 years what we 

have done in Chicago to try and eradicate some of the violence, 

21 

Chicago being one of the most highly gang-infested and gun-infested cities in this country. 

We have been able to go into the Chicago Public Schools through 

a partnership with Project Safe Neighborhoods, a public-private 

venture where law enforcement partners and partner providers 

were able to go into some of the toughest neighborhoods in the city 

of Chicago—Chicago Police Districts 7th, 9th, 10th, 11th, and 15th. 

And we were able to provide 720 hours of classroom-based violence 

interruption workshops to sixth through eighth graders at 40 different Chicago public schools. We were also able to train about 25 

young—40 young people, actually, through our Young Leaders Development Institute. These are young people who we get involved 

in actual leadership activities, being involved working with our legislators, being involved working with our local, State, and national 

policymakers, being involved in their communities to challenge 

their peers to look at the behavior, look at the destructiveness that 

is going on, and then to actually try and affect policy and effect 

change. 

During the past 5 years, we have noticed that young people have 

spoken about violence prevention programming and then, like a lot 

of the colleagues that came up before me, they recognized that not 

enough financial resources in prevention programs are going, to 

help them to lead more productive and less destructive lifestyles. 

So they see the hypocrisy that adults are saying that you are supposed to lead a certain lifestyle; however, you are not giving them 

the resources or helping them to build the capacity to deal with the 

issues they deal with on a daily basis in their neighborhoods. 

UCAN’s violence prevention programming has been able to steer 

2,000 young people away from gangs, away from guns, and away 

from crime. These are not young people who romanticize violence. 

They are dedicated to learning how to reduce the violence and how 

to engage with policymakers to make sure that things are moving 

in a direction that would benefit them. 

We have a national poll that we do each year where we have 

1,000 young people from around the country give their ideas on 

what they think about guns and what they think about violence. 

Every year we learn pretty much the same thing. I was privileged 

to stand with Senator Durbin at the Cook County Medical Examiner’s Office as we launched 1 year the Teen Gun Survey, and 84 

percent of the young people that were surveyed said that we should 

have a Federal assault weapons ban, that we should renew it. And 

somehow the sunrise set on it. Young people are active and young 

people are seeing that they can make a difference, and they are 

looking for adults at all levels who are concerned and who are committed to trying to make their lives better. 

UCAN firmly believes in the need for more resources, more diversion programs, and more opportunities like the youth-led programs 

that Senator Durbin has endorsed in Chicago. 

There is a tremendous value in having all of the parties work together. As a member of Project Safe Neighborhoods, I have been 

able to sit in rooms with the U.S. Attorney’s Office, ATF agents, 

DEA agents, the Cook County State’s Attorney, and the Chicago 

Police Department to share information that will help to get young 

22 

people educated so that then they can make more informed choices 

in their lives. 

These partnerships made it possible for students who were struggling through war zones to make better decisions for their lives. 

UCAN’s model is based on the Boston model that started in 1993 

that was recognized by OJJDP as a promising model. We continually try and work with national organizations and foundations to 

try and create partnerships that will keep funding going so we can 

keep doing the programs that we do. 

We are excited about the $125 million that would be made available under S. 456 for prevention and intervention services. This 

level of funding underscores the importance of prevention services 

and the commitment of our elected leaders to support proven, successful programs. 

Additional funding will allow us to reach another 800 students 

in Chicago in only 2 years, and it will allow us to train 50 more 

young leaders under our Young Leadership Development Institute. 

In closing, I want to just share what one of our young people who 

is a freshman in college right now said. We launch the results of 

our national poll each year in August or September before school 

is about to start, and we let it go until October 1 year. And he said, 

you know, ‘‘Adults think that Halloween is scary. And Halloween 

is not scary.’’ He said, ‘‘What is scary is that 49 percent of my peers 

around the country want more violence prevention programs, but 

people keep cutting them.’’ And he said, ‘‘It is also funny that they 

will not listen. Violence prevention should be part of the defense 

budget. Homeland security begins at home.’’ 

Ladies and gentlemen, in my 20 years of working with and learning from young people, I know it is essential to have a youth-adult 

partnership where people are committed to a common cause, and 

this cause would be gang prevention, gang intervention, and then 

at the highest level where there are young people who just do not 

care, then prosecution would fit the bill. 

I thank you for the time to speak, and I look forward to many 

great things. 

[The prepared statement of Mr. Robinson appears as a submission for the record.] 

Senator FEINSTEIN. Thank you very much, Mr. Robinson. 

Our next witness is Gregg Croteau. I hope I am saying that reasonably well. 

Mr. CROTEAU. Yes. 

Senator FEINSTEIN. Mr. Croteau is the Executive Director of 

United Teen Equality Center in Lowell, Massachusetts. That is a 

youth-led agency that focuses on gang intervention and peacemaking. In June of 2006, he received the prestigious Robert Wood 

Johnson Community Health Leader Award for his leadership in 

gang peacemaking work. He has more than 13 years of youth work 

experience, and he has brought with him in our audience today 

Ricky Le, one of the youth members working with his organization. 

We welcome you as well. 

Please go ahead. 

23 

STATEMENT OF GREGG CROTEAU, EXECUTIVE DIRECTOR, 

UNITED TEEN EQUALITY CENTER, LOWELL, MASSACHUSETTS 

Mr. CROTEAU. Thank you, Senator Feinstein. It is great to be 

here, great to be here with the panel. I would like to thank all of 

the distinguished members of the panel for allowing me the opportunity to share some of our thoughts on this critically important 

issue. And I say ‘‘our’’ because, as you mentioned, I am here actually with three of our colleagues: Ricky Le, who is one of our team 

members; Sako Long, who is our streetworker supervisor; and Juan 

Carlos Rivera, who has been with UTEC from the very beginning 

as our streetworker director. And I want to thank them because 

they are out there every day making the difference on the streets 

of Lowell as well. So it is great to be with them. 

I would like to begin by acknowledging that the Federal Government is absolutely on point in recognizing youth violence as a critical issue in our communities. We have had to attend far too many 

funerals in our days as youth workers. Funerals have become far 

too much like regular events in the lives of young people. In fact, 

when we were at one of our last funerals, walking toward the 

gravesite of this 19-year-old man who was shot, I accidentally 

stepped on another gravestone. And as I looked down, the gravestone was actually that of another young man who was shot only 

weeks before that we know. And looking up, I thought, ‘‘This is absolutely absurd. This is not normal, and we cannot continue to 

keep walking past these gravesites.’’ 

So, yes, we truly appreciate the Committee’s initiative in 

prioritizing this critical issue in our communities and agree that a 

major statement—a major statement—must be made to best address the violence too often found in our streets. 

For the past 7 years, I have had the honor of working as the first 

Executive Director for the United Teen Equality Center, better 

known as UTEC, which is a youth organization located in Lowell, 

Massachusetts. As a youth-led agency, we offer a range of services 

for young people ages 13 to 23, and our core values focus on peace, 

positivity, and empowerment. 

Soon after our establishment, we created the Streetworker Program, and in short, basically the streetworkers are out there mediating disputes, mediating conflicts with young people on the 

streets. In particular, our staff implement a peacemaking process 

with rival youth gang leaders that ultimately leads to the facilitation of various peace summits between opposing gang sets. We 

have had success stories over the past years. One in particular was 

a summit where we were able to build relationships up with young 

people from different rival gang sets. The leaders of these gang 

sets, being to get a commitment from them to get in the same van 

together and then be able to go in the middle of an island in Maine, 

actually kayak out together to the island in the same kayaks, and 

by the fire that night they—not us or the staff—they were able to 

bridge a peace summit between these two groups that were previously shooting and stabbing each other. 

These stories are not unique for us. A major statement must be 

made to truly reduce the violence in our streets. However, we respectfully express our concern that this major statement, this 

unique opportunity to significantly effect change—change that lasts 

24 

beyond the current moment—must include a balanced approach of 

enforcement along with intervention and prevention. 

As many researchers have commented, we cannot just lock away 

the problem. At the recent House hearing for H.R. 1582, the Chief 

of Police from Kansas City echoed this in his testimony, saying 

that, ‘‘We cannot arrest and imprison our way out of this problem.’’ 

As indicated in a letter from the National Juvenile Justice and 

Delinquency Prevention Coalition, this bill ‘‘contains 23 substantive 

sections; of those, 21 focus solely on creating new crimes, expanding culpability for the accused, and enhancing penalties for the convicted. Similarly, of the $240.5 million in appropriations the bill requests, less than 20 percent is allowed for prevention and intervention.’’ Moreover, the proposed legislation actually only authorizes 

approximately $25 million a year for gang violence prevention services for communities across the country such as Lowell that will 

probably not be designated as a High-intensity Interstate Gang Activity Area. I sometimes think that the term ‘‘gang problem’’ is too 

easily thrown around. Perhaps it is subconscious, but I think it becomes more palatable and easier to pinpoint the problem by doing 

so. No community simply has a gang problem. This is not some 

type of medical model where we can identify the specific disease— 

i.e., the gang—that is eating the life out of our communities. 

All of the complex forces and rooted causes of gang-related violence will never be adequately portrayed when defining it with a 

singular name. The issues of poverty, racism, education, and other 

complex forces all impact the violence in our streets. There is no 

one fix, there is no one face, and there can be no one name that 

encompasses all of our concerns. 

That being said, we do have concerns that this new legislation 

takes a very broad approach to solving problems that are often locally distinct and community centered. As Senator Kennedy mentioned in his statement on June 22, 2006, there is a ‘‘one-size-fitsall approach’’ to this legislation that is of considerable concern. 

From our experiences, it is incredibly clear that the gangs in Los 

Angeles are very different from the gangs in Lowell. 

In Lowell, we have Bloods and Crips living right next door to 

each other, and teens are not fighting over drug trade and territory, but more often fighting over a perceived disrespect or differing colors. As such the approach to best address this problem 

must also allow for the opportunity to be radically different. 

We know that intervention and prevention strategies can provide 

the hope that some young people have lost sight of. Without a balanced effort in these areas, the hopelessness that already surrounds too many young people will continue to grow that much 

stronger. There is no greater foe, no greater frustration, than the 

sense of young person who feels like nothing can change, who feels 

like their life is cornered into hopelessness. 

There is a critical problem in our communities, and, yes, we need 

to make a major statement in our policies to best address it. However, we need to be very careful about getting too drawn into the 

sensationalism that too often surrounds gangs and believing that 

change is not possible by young people. 

Senator FEINSTEIN. Could you summarize please? 

25 

Mr. CROTEAU. Yes, ma’am. We know too many young peacemakers that have successfully brokered peace between their rivals. 

Two of them are here today in Sako and Ricky. And if I could be 

very brief, Sako, who spent some years in prison, came out of prison and made a pact with his mother because he did not want to 

see his mother cry anymore, and now he talks with other young 

peace people with the theme of, ‘‘How would it feel to have one less 

enemy on the street?’’ And he does amazing work. And Ricky, who 

was moving in and out of foster care for years, found our center 

belonging in a gang. After years of finding now instant enemies, he 

made a decision—a decision that almost cost him his life—to leave 

a gang. He decided to get jumped out of the gang. And 3 years ago, 

in the process of being jumped out, he was beaten into a coma for 

10 days. He has traumatic brain injury, but in his recovery, which 

has been beautiful over the past 3 years, he is now using his story, 

his opportunity to create change and send a message of peace to 

other young people. 

Senator FEINSTEIN. If you could conclude, please. You are 2 minutes over. 

Mr. CROTEAU. So we seriously caution against any new policies 

that inadvertently risk deleting the success stories of Ricky and 

Sako. We need more policies to help us strengthen hope. 

We thank you for considering our testimony. We thank you for 

considering the concerns around the one-size-fits-all, our concerns 

around increasing more funding for prevention and intervention, 

and we truly look forward to working with you. 

Thank you again. 

[The prepared statement of Mr. Croteau appears as a submission 

for the record.] 

Senator FEINSTEIN. Well, we do as well. 

I want to correct one figure. You said $25 million for prevention 

and intervention. It is $250 million for prevention and intervention 

in this bill. 

I will move right along now to Patrick Word, a 17-year police veteran and a detective in the Gaithersburg City Police Department. 

He currently serves as National Secretary and Executive Board 

member of the National Alliance of Gang Investigators and is 

President of the Mid-Atlantic Regional Gang Investigators Network. Since 1994, Detective Word has been assigned as Gaithersburg Police Department’s Gang Investigator, working with other 

State and Federal agencies on investigation and intelligence gathering on criminal street gangs. 

Welcome, Detective. 

STATEMENT OF PATRICK WORD, DETECTIVE, GAITHERSBURG 

POLICE DEPARTMENT, GAITHERSBURG, MARYLAND, AND 

CHAIRMAN, MID-ATLANTIC REGIONAL GANG INVESTIGATIONS NETWORK, GAITHERSBURG, MARYLAND 

Mr. WORD. Thank you, Madam Chair and members of the Committee. The pervasiveness of gangs throughout society is undeniable. They incite fear and violence within our communities. Gangs 

threaten our schools, our children, and our homes. Gangs today are 

more sophisticated and flagrant in their use of violence and intimidation tactics. As they migrate across the country, they bring with 

26 

them drugs, weapons, violence, and other criminal activity. The acknowledgment of the issue and joint community and law enforcement response is our best defense. 

The National Alliance of Gang Investigators Associations is an 

alliance of 18 gang investigator associations across the United 

States and Canada. The combined alliance represents over 20,000 

gang investigators, intelligence officers, gang prosecutors, corrections officers, and parole and probation agents at the Federal, 

State, local, and tribal levels. 

The NAGIA is a unique alliance of criminal justice professionals 

dedicated to the promotion and coordination of national anti-gang 

strategies. The NAGIA also advocates the standardization of antigang training, the establishment of uniform gang definitions, the 

assistance for communities with emerging gang problems, and 

input to policymakers and program administrators. We are not 

meant to replace or duplicate services provided by any other entity. 

Rather, we facilitate and support regional gang investigators associations, the RISS projects, as well as Federal, State, and local 

anti-gang initiatives. 

Since 1994, I have been a police detective working gangs in the 

suburban Washington, D.C., area. In that time, in my membership 

with the Mid-Atlantic Regional Gang Investigators Network and 

the NAGIA, we have partnered with the National Gang Intelligence Center in the FBI; we have partnered with the Global Intelligence Working Group and the National Youth Gang Center to coordinate the sharing of gang intelligence in order to foster information sharing among law enforcement investigators across the country. 

To date, in 2002 and in 2005, the NAGIA and the Bureau of Justice Assistance conducted the most comprehensive and scientific 

study to date of gangs across the country. That threat assessment 

is available online and will be submitted as part of the testimony. 

Senator FEINSTEIN. Thank you. 

Mr. WORD. Local law enforcement is the front line in the war on 

gangs and gang violence. Eighty percent of all gangs, according to 

our association members, are local and homegrown groups engaged 

in daily criminal activity in large and small communities, urban 

and rural, and every type of neighborhood in between. These gangs 

range in size from the minimum accepted definitions of three subjects to as large as several hundred. They cross all cultural boundaries in the make-up of their membership, and the age ranges anywhere from age 9 to age 40 here in the Washington, D.C., area. Too 

often, the public has been confused linking the immigration issue 

as the major cause of the gang issue in this country. It is simply 

a cause, but not the cause of a gang problem. 

Intelligence gaps still exist between law enforcement agencies, 

and this hampers our ability to investigate and apprehend violators 

as well as present cases for prosecution, both locally and in the 

Federal system. These gaps can be closed with the implementation 

of the national reporting and the national gang data base which 

this bill calls for, which already exists in the Violent Gang and Terrorist Organization File, VGTOF, there the NCIC. 

Criminal gangs have stepped up their recruiting efforts over the 

years, and few States have addressed the issue through legislative 

27 

means. The NAGIA endorses those sections of the bill that allow 

for the prosecution of gang recruitment. Earlier Chief Bratton mentioned that we have currently 700,000 police officers and 800,000 

gang members. Those numbers are increasing every day. 

Here in the Washington, D.C., area, U.S. Attorney Rod Rosenstein for the District of Maryland is currently prosecuting a large 

RICO case involving the MS13 gang, the violent Salvadoran gang 

found here in the United States, and also we are currently investigating a large Crip set in Maryland-–53 members arrested at the 

State level and Federal prosecution is coming. And there is a press 

conference today, I believe, on further indictments on the MS13 

case. 

Witness intimidation is a major problem in that case. Witness intimidation is a problem for local law enforcement. Many violent 

gang cases are dropped or lost in local courts because witnesses do 

not or cannot come forward. Most local jurisdictions do not have 

the resources necessary to fund witness protection programs. The 

NAGIA supports and endorses the portions of the bill which assist 

law enforcement in this capacity. 

Obviously prevention alone does not solve the gang problem, inventory alone. We have heard that from other members of the panels. But this is a remarkably progressive bill. It is a crime bill, but 

it funds prevention and intervention and other social type programs, which is unprecedented, at least in recent memory, in law 

enforcement where a crime bill or a large portion of this crime bill 

funds intervention programs. So we support and endorse the funding of those programs as well. 

Law enforcement plays only one of three roles needed for communities to deal with the issue of gang violence. We are the suppression arm of the comprehensive approach, and the NAGIA has 

partnered with the National Youth Gang Center and their support 

with Federal funding of the GREAT program and endorses those 

prevention and intervention efforts across the country. We support 

and endorse local nonprofits and faith-based groups and other police departments who have worked with these groups. 

This bill is part of the suppression arm, and we welcome and endorse its passage. My thanks to the Committee and its members 

for inviting me to speak on this very important matter, and I am 

available to answer any questions that you may have. 

[The prepared statement of Mr. Word appears as a submission 

for the record.] 

Senator FEINSTEIN. Thank you very much, and let me thank all 

of the witnesses. I really appreciate your being here and appreciate 

your testimony. 

What we have tried to do is put together a bill that is bipartisan 

in nature, and that has not been always very easy. If you have Republican support, you sometimes do not get Democratic support, 

and vice versa. 

I think we have achieved it. The bill has been last session preconferenced with the House. My staff has been wonderful about 

working with any member that has a concern or an amendment or 

something they want in a bill to try to see if we can keep our bipartisan group together, but at the same time where there are good 

ideas add them to the bill. 

28 

Detective, I am very pleased by what you said. We have over the 

10 years greatly increased the prevention and intervention part 

from where it started, to be very candid with you. One of my concerns is to try as we move along to really be able to get a more 

adequate compendium on intervention and prevention programs 

that exist in the United States and that are working so that the 

money that is in this bill is not wasted but it goes to the groups 

and organizations and cities and counties that can produce a 

change in young people. 

As I mentioned to Mayor Villaraigosa, I am particularly interested in seeing if we cannot do more actually in schools and maybe, 

like with L.A. Best, bridge that gap between the school time and 

the after-school time to really begin to get at the heart of it. 

I must tell you, I am very concerned with the brutality of these 

gangs, and we have a living witness here as to what happened. Not 

only was her daughter shot and killed, but when she went out and 

asked for additional police help, her house got seven bullets. And 

that is the kind of thing that has to be stopped and for which there 

should be no sympathy whatsoever. 

The use of hollow-point bullets, again, is another indication of 

just you do not have a chance, and I think and hope we have 

struck a balance in this bill because that is what we have tried to 

do. 

I really have no additional questions. If anyone would like to 

make a closing comment or two, the floor is yours. 

[No response.] 

Senator FEINSTEIN. No? OK, then. Well, thank you all very much 

for being here. This bill is on the calendar for Thursday’s markup. 

We anticipate that it will be held over a week. 

[Pause.] 

Senator FEINSTEIN. My understanding is that Senator Feingold 

is on his way. He should be here in 2 minutes. So in the meantime, 

I have a statement by Senator Kennedy to add to the record and 

one by Senator Leahy to add to the record, and I will do that. 

I would like to ask the two law enforcement people here a question. The High-Intensity Gang Areas, which are really modeled 

after the HIDTA areas, are trying to put together these task forces 

that extend out, where necessary, into a region to bring together 

people in law enforcement to really go after some of these gangs, 

those that kill, those that practice witness intimidation, those that 

kill witnesses. I mean, that is—do you see that working well? We 

will start with the DA, if I might. 

Mr. FOX. Madam Chair, I know that in the San Francisco Bay 

Area, at least, the HIDTA has been incredibly successful, and Captain Brooks, whom I know you are familiar with, has been very, 

very effective. 

One potential concern is the potential of overlapping because 

there may be some gangs that are engaged in drug activities. And 

so I would hope there would not be a duplication of effort or creation of a new bureaucracy if, in fact, there exists a current structure which could address the problem. 

The HIDTA has been effective and can focus in on a particular 

area. It is not just a broad— 

29 

Senator FEINSTEIN. Well, let me ask you, do you think what we 

should do is merge the two? 

Mr. FOX. I think that that is something that should certainly be 

given consideration, because my concern is if you are going to create a new bureaucracy with the High-Intensity Gang Area and you 

already have an existing structure, which basically has the capability of providing the same coordination and resource distribution, 

I would think that that is something that should be considered, 

yes, Madam Chair. 

Senator FEINSTEIN. Thank you, Mr. Fox. 

Detective, would you like to comment? 

Mr. WORD. Senator, I think that it has to be looked at on a caseby-case basis. I think HIDTAs in certain areas of the country are 

more effective than they are in other parts of the country. I think 

the HIDTA concept is extremely effective. 

Senator FEINSTEIN. Do you have one back here? 

Mr. WORD. We do have one. The Baltimore-Washington HIDTA 

extends from Northern Virginia up through the Baltimore-Washington corridor, up the 95 corridor. Tom Carr is the director of the 

HIDTA in this area, and they have been very effective in their drug 

work. They have actually gotten involved in some of the computer 

work involving gang data bases here, at least in the State of Maryland, and that is a data base that will be extended to the HIDTA. 

But a case in point would be the small town in rural North Carolina, in Fayetteville, North Carolina, just outside of Fayetteville. A 

town of 900 had a gang infiltrate the town in recent months where 

they have 25 gang members in a town of 900. There are four police 

officers in that town. If that does not tax resources, if that is not 

an area in need of a HIGAA or a HIDTA extension and a role for 

a task force, I do not know where there would be one. 

Certainly we want to concentrate those in the larger areas where 

we have more gang problems, but the gangs have moved out into 

the rural and the suburban communities. Western Maryland, West 

Virginia—these areas would be more attuned to having task force 

concepts as opposed to the larger agencies and the municipalities 

in the metropolitan areas. They already work in a number of task 

force areas in the Project Safe Neighborhoods, through each of the 

U.S. Attorney’s districts. If we could concentrate on working the 

HIDTAs or the HIGAAs in cooperation with the Project Safe Neighborhoods program and the Operation Safe Streets, I think that 

these would be a more effective use of both manpower and of the 

funding. 

Senator FEINSTEIN. We will look into that. Thank you very much. 

I notice we are joined by Senator Feingold. Welcome, Senator. 

You are the closing hitter, so please go ahead. 

Senator FEINGOLD. All right. I thank the Chair for keeping the 

hearing going, and I thank you, Senator Feinstein, for chairing this 

important hearing. 

I would like to also thank all the witnesses for attending today 

and extend my sincere condolences to Ms. Driskill. It is always 

heartbreaking to lose a loved one, but particularly when that loss 

is so violent and senseless. 

Wisconsin has had to suffer its share of heartbreaking losses as 

well. While we all hear about the rising crime rates in cities across 

30 

America, one of those cities hardest hit has been Milwaukee. In a 

case that is far too similar to that of Ms. Driskill’s, on Monday, 

May 14th, 4-year-old Jasmine Owens was shot and killed by a 

driveby shooter. She had been skipping rope in her front yard. We 

simply must find a way to curb the violence that is wreaking such 

havoc on our communities. 

When I talk to law enforcement officials in Wisconsin about combating gangs, they tell me something very interesting. They tell me 

that the problem in California is extraordinarily serious. They also 

say that the scope of the problem varies across the Nation and that 

a solution tailored to California’s experience may not be the best 

way to deal with the problem in other areas of the country. 

Accordingly, they suggest that what is needed is a targeted and 

substantial influx of funds from the Federal Government to areas 

with serious gang problems to ensure sufficient numbers of officers 

to patrol neighborhoods and to ensure sufficient resources in the 

penal system to incarcerate gang offenders once they are sentenced. 

Basically, they are telling me that this is a problem of resources 

more than a problem of law. And they are also very insistent that 

prevention and intervention must play a very significant role in 

strategies to combat gang crimes. 

I want to be certain that we respond to the growing gang problem in the smartest and most responsible way possible, and I look 

forward to working with Senator Feinstein and others to ensure 

that any legislation we consider to address the rising gang problem 

is as effective as possible for both her State and mine, and the 

other States as well. 

Mr. Fox, do you think it would be a good practice for Federal 

prosecutors who are considering a Federal gang prosecution to consult with their local counterparts before making a final decision? 

Mr. FOX. Absolutely, Senator, and I think that one of the models 

that could be used is the current Safe Streets Task Force concept 

where there is a collaboration, and, frankly, the local prosecutor, in 

conjunction with the U.S. Attorney, should determine where that 

case could best be handled. There are certainly some areas where 

the Federal laws may be far more effective in providing public safety than the local laws, in which event those should be handled by 

the U.S. Attorney. 

So I strongly encourage collaboration and coming to an agreement as to where the matter could best be handled. 

Senator FEINGOLD. Thank you, Mr. Fox. 

Mr. Croteau, do you have any concerns about Federal prosecutors 

deciding to bring gang charges without consulting with local officials? 

Mr. CROTEAU. I think from my experience I would say we come 

from the intervention and prevention side, so we are not enforcement experts. But we have a really good partnership with our Middlesex District Authority’s office, and we actually meet monthly 

with them and with the chief of police. We have now a whole advisory task force. And I think that having that local connection there, 

which really has a feel for what is going on on the ground, really 

makes the most sense for us. So I think having the Federal prosecution come in that would have concerns, again, we do not know 

31 

that much about it yet. But I know what works right now is working with local enforcement and the district attorney. 

Senator FEINGOLD. Then do either of you think that requiring 

Federal prosecutors to consult with local prosecutors before bringing Federal charges would be a good addition to the gang bill that 

the Committee will be considering in the coming weeks? 

Mr. FOX. I certainly feel that it would be appropriate to require 

at least to consult. It is not necessarily limiting or inhibiting the 

ability of the U.S. Attorney to move forward in appropriate cases. 

But there certainly should be a level of openness and communication. 

Senator FEINGOLD. Mr. Croteau? 

Mr. CROTEAU. And I would say maybe the one thing that I—and 

I just have been doing some research. It seems clear that at least 

in—I think it was D.A. Paul Logli’s testimony before the House, he 

indeed said that, you know, it is not that they need more laws. 

They do not need more sanctions. They need more programs. And 

I think his testimony kind of echoed some things, and that there 

necessarily -maybe there is not necessarily a need to have additional Federal prosecutors. But as you said, it is not necessarily an 

issue of laws but maybe an issue of resources. 

Senator FEINGOLD. You do not think it would be a negative thing 

to have this requirement of consultation? 

Mr. CROTEAU. To have a consultation? I do not— 

Senator FEINGOLD. A requirement that they have the consultation. 

Mr. CROTEAU. To have the Federal prosecutors required—if the 

Federal prosecutor will be involved, then, yes, I would definitely 

think they should be required at the local. 

Senator FEINGOLD. What about you, Detective Word? Would you 

have a problem with this kind of requirement? 

Mr. WORD. Senator, I do not. I have a U.S. Attorney in Maryland 

who is very engaging and works closely with each of the 24—at 

least in the State of Maryland, each of the 24 Maryland State’s attorneys. I do not have a problem with a requirement. I do think 

that recommendations should be made through the bill that this— 

that it be strongly worded that it be highly recommended that the 

U.S. Attorneys do, if not required. I do not have a problem. We do 

have, like I said, a very engaging U.S. Attorney in Mr. Rosenstein, 

and we have not had those problems nor seen those problems. A 

very close working relationship with our U.S. Attorney’s Office. 

Senator FEINGOLD. Very good. Thanks. 

Mr. Robinson and Mr. Croteau, your organizations both work directly with young people, so you may be able to provide the best 

perspective on this question. I would like to talk to you about the 

implications of sentencing a minor to life in prison in the Federal 

system where there is no opportunity for parole. The Supreme 

Court has acknowledged that an adolescent’s culpability or blameworthiness may be ‘‘diminished to a substantial degree by reason 

of youth or immaturity.’’ That statement was made in the context 

of whether it was cruel and unusual punishment to execute individuals who have committed a capital crime while adolescents, but 

it seems to me that the same principle could apply more broadly. 

32 

Do you think it is advisable to sentence individuals under the 

age of 18 to life without the possibility of parole? Mr. Robinson. 

Mr. ROBINSON. Senator Feingold, with my expertise in working 

with young people, the age of 18 would be too high to sentence 

somebody for life. I would have it go a lot lower. If we are going 

to-–18 and over, maybe 20, because I think that certain young people who have committed certain crimes potentially should go, but 

then there is also, I think, a case-by-case piece that we should go 

by around that. And if I am considered an expert in youth development, my primary expertise is in prevention and having young people not get anywhere near that type of situation that you brought 

to my attention. So I would probably not be the—I am not a prosecutor, so I would not be the best person to ask that question. 

Senator FEINGOLD. Mr. Croteau? 

Mr. CROTEAU. In my experiences working with young people, absolutely I would be opposed to it. I think there is too much potential in young people. Obviously, there is an absolute role for enforcement and prosecution to the fullest. But I think when that 

happens blanketly, if it is a blanket, across-the-board prosecution, 

then we lose the possibility of having young people who have had 

experiences, whether it be gang involvement—and, again, it depends on the crime because I think my concerns were also around 

the broad array of crimes that now fell into this new crime bill. 

And potentially you can go away for certain crimes that you would 

go away for life that you would not have thought of before. And if 

that is the case, you risk losing people, whether it be, like—people 

that we know on the street that are doing amazing work now, having come out of prison after being there for 7 years and who can 

now be really the ones who are relating to young people on the 

streets, and they are brokering peace and they are creating change. 

And you lose that no matter what. Blanketly, you lose that opportunity. 

Senator FEINGOLD. Thank you. Thank you all for your answers. 

I thank the Chairwoman. 

Senator FEINSTEIN. Thank you very much. 

I just wanted to address one question as Senator Feingold is 

leaving. The problem with consultation is the Department of Justice, who has never agreed to a statutory consultation amendment. 

I have no problem with it. I think there should be. Whether we lose 

some of our Republican colleagues, I mean, we have worked so 

hard and so long to get a bill that can cross the aisle on both sides 

that it is difficult. But this, I understand, is the problem with a 

statutory requirement for consultation, that it is precedent setting. 

Senator FEINGOLD. Well, I understand the desire, obviously, 

Madam Chair, to pass a bill, but it strikes me as odd that that 

would be a concern of the other party to not have consultation with 

local officials about something like this. You know, those are strong 

answers from these folks. You obviously recognize— 

Senator FEINSTEIN. Well, they are the locals, and the Feds like 

to keep their biceps flexed. But I am happy to look further into it. 

I wanted to just suggest one thing by way of ending this. On 

page 27 of the bill begins the High-Intensity Gang Areas, and it 

goes on for about 10 pages. It is a relatively easy read. By that I 

mean it does not refer to other statutes. What I would like to ask 

33 

everybody to do, if you would, is take a look at it and see how the 

two might be better integrated. I agree with you, Detective, we do 

not want to reinvent the wheel. Let us use the wheel that is there 

as effectively as we possibly can. So I would be interested from you, 

from Mr. Fox, from anybody, in some additional suggestions. 

With that, let me thank you all, particularly those of you who 

have come from a distance. It is really appreciated. And to our victim, let me just once again extend our heartfelt sympathy, and I 

hope you will get some satisfaction when we can pass this bill. So 

thank you very much. 

We will keep the hearing record open for the purpose of written 

questions for 1 week. 

The hearing is adjourned. 

[Whereupon, at 11:50 a.m., the Committee was adjourned.] 

[Questions and answers and submissions for the record follow.] 

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