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96–381PDF 2005

UNIFORMED SERVICES EMPLOYMENT AND

REEMPLOYMENT RIGHTS ACT

HEARING

BEFORE THE

SUBCOMMITTEE ON BENEFITS

OF THE

COMMITTEE ON VETERANS’ AFFAIRS 

HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES

ONE HUNDRED EIGHTH CONGRESS

FIRST SESSION

JULY 24, 2003

Printed for the use of the Committee on Veterans’ Affairs

Serial No. 108–22

(
COMMITTEE ON VETERANS’ AFFAIRS 

CHRISTOPHER H. SMITH, New Jersey, Chairman 

MICHAEL BILIRAKIS, Florida 

TERRY EVERETT, Alabama 

STEVE BUYER, Indiana 

JACK QUINN, New York 

CLIFF STEARNS, Florida 

JERRY MORAN, Kansas 

RICHARD H. BAKER, Louisiana 

ROB SIMMONS, Connecticut 

HENRY E. BROWN, JR., South Carolina 

JEFF MILLER, Florida 

JOHN BOOZMAN, Arkansas 

JEB BRADLEY, New Hampshire 

BOB BEAUPREZ, Colorado 

GINNY BROWN-WAITE, Florida 

RICK RENZI, Arizona 

TIM MURPHY, Pennsylvania 

LANE EVANS, Illinois 

BOB FILNER, California 

LUIS V. GUTIERREZ, Illinois 

CORRINE BROWN, Florida 

VIC SNYDER, Arkansas 

CIRO D. RODRIGUEZ, Texas 

MICHAEL H. MICHAUD, Maine 

DARLENE HOOLEY, Oregon 

SILVESTRE REYES, Texas 

TED STRICKLAND, Ohio 

SHELLEY BERKLEY, Nevada 

TOM UDALL, New Mexico 

SUSAN A. DAVIS, California 

TIM RYAN, Ohio

PATRICK E. RYAN, Chief Counsel and Staff Director 

SUBCOMMITTEE ON BENEFITS 

HENRY E. BROWN, JR., South Carolina, Chairman 

JACK QUINN, New York 

JEFF MILLER, Florida 

JEB BRADLEY, New Hampshire 

GINNY BROWN-WAITE, Florida 

MICHAEL H. MICHAUD, Maine 

SUSAN A. DAVIS, California 

SILVESTRE REYES, Texas 

CORRINE BROWN, Florida

(II) 
(III)

C O N T E N T S 

July 24, 2003

Page

Uniformed Services Employment and Reemployment Rights Act ....................... 1

OPENING STATEMENTS 

Chairman Brown ..................................................................................................... 1

Hon. Michael H. Michaud ....................................................................................... 2

Prepared statement of Congressman Michaud .............................................. 37

Hon. John Boozman, a Representative in Congress from the State of Arkansas .......................................................................................................................... 24

Prepared statement of Congressman Quinn .................................................. 41

WITNESSES 

Adams, 2nd Lt. Taylor E., 315th Airlift Wing, Maintenance Squadron, U.S. 

Air Force Reserve ................................................................................................. 7

Prepared statement of Lt. Adams ................................................................... 43

Comeau-Dumond, Michelle, Persian Gulf War Veteran and Military Spouse ... 3

Prepared statement of Mrs. Comeau-Dumond ............................................... 61

Juarbe, Jr., Frederico, Assistant Secretary for Veteran’s Employment and 

Training Service, Department of Labor; accompanied by Col. Alan R. Smith, 

Director, Military Member Support, National Committee for the Employer 

Support of the Guard and Reserve ..................................................................... 29

Prepared statement of Mr. Juarbe .................................................................. 94

LaChance, Susan, Manager of Selection, Evaluation, and Recognition, U.S. 

Postal Service ....................................................................................................... 20

Prepared statement of Ms. LaChance ............................................................. 77

Lezy, Lt. Gen. Normand, (U.S. Air Force, ret.), Vice President, National 

Government Relations, Wal-Mart Stores, Inc. ................................................... 26

Prepared statement of General Lezy .............................................................. 93

Norton, Col. Robert F., (U.S. Army, ret.), Co-chairman, Veteran’s Committee, 

The Military Coalition ......................................................................................... 8

Prepared statement of Col. Norton ................................................................. 50

Perez, Peter, Senior Vice President, Human Resources, W.W. Grainger, Inc. ... 24

Prepared statement of Mr. Perez .................................................................... 86

Rouse, Jim, Vice President, Washington Office, ExxonMobil Corporation ......... 16

Prepared statement of Mr. Rouse ................................................................... 65

Ryan, John, Senior Vice President for Human Resources, Schering-Plough 

Corporation ........................................................................................................... 14

Prepared statement of Mr. Ryan ..................................................................... 58

Timmerman, William, Chairman and Chief Executive Officer, SCANA Corporation ................................................................................................................. 18

Prepared statement of Mr. Timmerman ......................................................... 68

MATERIAL SUBMITTED FOR THE RECORD 

Statements: 

Mr. Jerry Carter, Senior Vice President, Human Resources, International 

Paper .............................................................................................................. 83

The American Legion ....................................................................................... 102

National Association of Uniformed Services .................................................. 106

Paralyzed Veterans of America ....................................................................... 111

Military Officers Association of America ........................................................ 119
Page

IV

Statements—Continued

John D. Halamka, MD, MS, CIO, Beth Israel Deaconess Medical Center 

and Harvard Medical School ........................................................................ 120

Thomas G. Hardy, MeadWestvaco Corp. ........................................................ 132

Written committee questions and their responses: 

Chairman Brown to Hon. Donald H. Rumsfeld, Secretary of Defense ........ 135

Chairman Brown to Hon. Frederico Juarbe, Jr., Assistant Secretary for 

Veterans Employment and Training ........................................................... 140

Chairman Brown to Hon. John E. Potter, Postmaster General ................... 143

Chairman Brown to John Ryan, Senior Vice President, Human Resources, 

Schering-Plough Corporation ....................................................................... 145

Chairman Brown to J.J. (Jim) Rouse, Vice President, ExxonMobil Corporation .......................................................................................................... 147

Chairman Brown to William B. Timmerman, Chairman and CEO, 

SCANA Corporation ...................................................................................... 149

Chairman Brown to Peter Perez, Senior Vice President for Human Resources, W.W. Grainger, Inc. ....................................................................... 151

Chairman Brown to Lt. Gen. Normand Lezy, Vice President, National 

Government Relations, Wal-Mart Stores, Inc. ............................................ 153
(1)

UNIFORMED SERVICES EMPLOYMENT AND 

REEMPLOYMENT RIGHTS ACT 

THURSDAY, JULY 24, 2003

HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES, SUBCOMMITTEE ON BENEFITS, COMMITTEE ON VETERANS’ AFFAIRS, Washington, DC 

The subcommittee met, pursuant to notice, at 9:30 a.m., in room 

334, Cannon House Office Building, Hon. Henry Brown (chairman 

of the subcommittee) presiding. 

Present: Representatives Brown, Quinn, Miller, Brown-Waite, 

Michaud, and Davis. 

Also present: Representative Boozman. 

OPENING STATEMENT OF CHAIRMAN BROWN 

Mr. BROWN. Good morning. We will now come to order. 

I am pleased today to join with Ranking Member Michaud and 

subcommittee members to examine the Department of Labor’s Uniformed Services Employment and Reemployment Rights Act, otherwise known as USERRA. We will examine the direct effect that 

this law has on those who it applies to, mainly Guard and Reserve 

members and their employers. 

This truly is a public hearing, as the audio portion is being 

broadcast live around the world through the committee’s awardwinning website. 

USERRA is the law that provides protections for both Reservists 

and National Guard members who are mobilized or are on active 

duty for training and applies to all employers—federal, state and 

private. 

Today, over 200,000 Reserve and Guard members are mobilized 

around the world. These servicemembers left their jobs to defend 

our Nation. Our goal this morning is twofold: first, to determine if 

USERRA is working; and second, to determine if it needs improvements in the eyes of servicemembers, commanders, or employers. 

I extend a warm welcome to all of today’s witnesses, many of 

whom represent world-class organizations. With our first panel, we 

will hear from a recently returned Reservist and the wife of a mobilized National Guard member, herself a disabled Gulf War veteran. These folks have faced the challenges of mobilization. 

USERRA not only protects Reserve and Guard members and 

their families, but it also gives corporate America a chance to be 

a part of an ongoing effort to protect our Nation. In a recent ceremony, Secretary Rumsfeld thanked 20 top business leaders for 

their support of their employees who are members of the Guard 
2

and Reserve, some of whom are with us today. Noted Secretary 

Rumsfeld, ‘‘Employers have become inextricably linked to our national economy.’’ Forbes Magazine has recognized several of the corporations testifying in our second and third panels because they dramatically exceed the law in helping their Reservist-employees. We want to both 

commend and learn from these outstanding companies. In our concluding panel, we will hear testimony from the Departments of 

Labor and Defense, public stewards of the USERRA program. 

I am delighted to be working with Ranking Member Michaud on 

this issue, and now I recognize him for his opening remarks. 

OPENING STATEMENT OF HON. MICHAEL H. MICHAUD 

Mr. MICHAUD. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. As this is the last 

hearing scheduled for this legislative session, I would like to commend you for your leadership and the professional manner that you 

exhibited as chairman of this committee in a bipartisan manner. I 

really appreciate that. I would also like to thank your subcommittee staff for their cooperation and their great work, as well 

as my subcommittee staff and Mike Brownlie, who handles my Veterans’ Affairs committee, who has done an outstanding job as well. 

Mr. Chairman, I believe this is an extremely timely hearing as 

we come together, as our brave military personnel are selflessly 

risking their lives overseas. It is well-established that our Guard 

and Reserve, who now comprise nearly 50 percent of our total force, 

are an integral part of our national defense policy. Many of these 

individuals are leaving behind families who depend on them. These 

family members must endure not only the emotional strain of 

knowing loved ones are in harm’s way but in many cases they must 

fight through increasing difficulties with these hard economic times 

we are now faced. In my district alone double-digit unemployment 

is very common, particularly in mill towns, leaving people to struggle to make ends meet. And this is the climate in which we are 

asking many Guard and Reserve members to leave their families. 

It is my hope USERRA will be enforced by the Department of 

Labor to provide soldiers and their families with the support and 

employment protection that they have earned and will definitely 

need upon their return. 

I am very pleased that today we will not only receive testimony 

from government agencies running USERRA programs but we will 

also hear from individuals and organizations who are affected by 

this law. And I would like to thank each and every one of you now 

for your testimony that you will be presenting to this committee. 

I especially look forward to hearing Michelle Dumond, who has 

made a long trip from northern Maine, which is along the Canadian border, for taking her time to come to Washington to tell her 

story to this committee. 

And I look forward to hearing from the U.S. Department of Labor’s efforts in administrating USERRA, as well as progress in developing and publishing clarifying USERRA regulations. Committee staff has informed me that you plan to have draft regulations published by the end of the year. And I strongly urge you to 

try to get those regulations published by that time if not sooner. 

And, lastly, I would like to note my disappointment that Secretary 
3

of Labor Chao was unable to appear before this subcommittee. And, 

as I stated earlier, I find no other subject as important as the wellbeing and employment protection for our men and women in uniform. 

I might have to apologize, I might have to leave. We have a 

markup in another committee, which I might be called away. So I 

apologize if I do have to leave to attend that markup. And, Mr. 

Chairman, I would like to revise and extend my remarks for the 

record. 

Mr. BROWN. Without objection. 

Mr. MICHAUD. Thank you. 

[The prepared statement of Congressman Michaud appears on p. 

37.] 

Mr. BROWN. Thank you, Mr. Michaud. It is certainly a pleasure 

working with you on the many issues facing our veterans community. I was telling somebody earlier today that when we walk 

through this door, this is a non-partisan committee and we don’t 

have room for partisanship in veterans’ issues. Veterans are either 

Democrats or Republicans but they are all Americans. And so I appreciate the spirit in which we serve together. 

I would like to extend an especially warm welcome to our first 

panel this morning. Starting us off is Ms. Michelle Dumond, wife 

of Warrant Office Dean Dumond, a member of the Maine Army National Guard. Warrant Officer Dumond flies Black Hawk MediVac 

helicopters. Michelle is herself a disabled veteran and served in the 

Persian Gulf War during Desert Storm as a medic. Mrs. Dumond, 

we are honored to have at the table with Mrs. Dumond 2nd Lt. 

Taylor Adams of the U.S. Air Force Reserve, 315th Airlift Wing at 

Charleston, SC. Lt. Adams, an employee of McNaughton-McKay 

Electrical Company, was mobilized for almost a year. I look forward to hearing from a fellow Charlestonian. 

Ms. Dumond, is your husband with you today? Is your husband 

with you? Okay. I see, thanks. Okay. 

The final member of this distinguished panel is Col. Robert Norton, Co-Chair of the Veterans’ Committee for The Military Coalition. Col. Norton retired from the U.S. Army in 1995 after a very 

distinguished career, including a tour in Vietnam and overseeing 

the Reserve call-up during the Persian Gulf War. Thank you, Col. 

Norton, for joining us this morning. 

The prepared statement of each witness will appear in the record 

in full. Please limit your oral statements to no more than 5 minutes. The red light will let you know when the 5 minutes is up. 

Ms. Dumond, we will hear from you first. 

STATEMENTS OF MICHELLE COMEAU-DUMOND, PERSIAN 

GULF WAR VETERAN AND MILITARY SPOUSE; 2ND LT. TAYLOR E. ADAMS, 315TH AIRLIFT WING, MAINTENANCE SQUADRON, U.S. AIR FORCE RESERVE; AND COL. ROBERT F. NORTON (U.S. ARMY, RETIRED), CO-CHAIRMAN, VETERAN’S COMMITTEE, THE MILITARY COALITION 

STATEMENT OF MICHELLE COMEAU-DUMOND 

Mrs. COMEAU-DUMOND. Good morning, ladies and gentlemen. My 

name is Michelle Comeau-Dumond. I am a disabled veteran from 
4

Operation Desert Storm, a wife of a Maine Army National Guard 

member currently serving in Operation Iraqi Freedom, and a mother of two beautiful little girls. I am here before you today as a person who has been on both sides of the uniform. I have seen the effects of combat and the effects of military families torn apart by deployment. I have watched hundreds of hours of TV concerning various stories about the war on terrorism, but what I want to see 

today is the effects it is having in our own backyards of the United 

States of America. 

My story and family are not unique. My girls and I are but one 

of some 200,000 Guard and Reserve families affected by this current situation in the world. And not just in Iraq but Kuwait, Afghanistan, Bosnia, Kosovo, and several other countries and locations where Guardsmen and Reservists are deployed, stateside and 

abroad. Much like what happened to us happens to most family 

servicemembers. They get a call any hour, night and day, and are 

expected to respond. The families rush around to wash clothes, 

pack bags, wives hold back their own tears and wipe away those 

of their children. We do our best to do our jobs, give them a big 

hug, and put our best face forward as we watch them roll down the 

road. We proudly send them off to war while dealing with emotions 

of anxiety, confusion, uncertainty, and overall stress and concern 

about how our family will survive. 

Our family lifestyle is now drastically changed without our loved 

one and breadwinner, as I found out firsthand the day I returned 

home after the send-off. It was February in northern Maine. We 

had been hit with one of the worst blizzards in many decades. 

Aroostook County had been declared a disaster area. I arrived 

home to find six feet of snow in my driveway and 10 feet on my 

garage roof. I could not open the garage door to get the shovels out 

because the beams were buckling. The snow blower would not 

start, and I could not find anyone to immediately repair it. 

My girls and I dug out the door with our hands to get into the 

house, and I started to make phone calls for help. We had not had 

any family support briefing yet so I did not have the phone numbers to reach them, and I could not find any other help. I managed 

to haul our suitcase through the snowbank and drive the car into 

the bank in the front of the driveway, hoping no one would hit it. 

The next day I got a path dug to the house. The temperature had 

dropped to 40 degrees below zero. The day after that I was taken 

by ambulance to the hospital with pneumonia. I forced the doctors 

to release me from the hospital after promising I would not shovel, 

as I had no one to take care of the girls now. 

Mr. BROWN. That is just giving notice that the House is going in 

session. 

Mrs. COMEAU-DUMOND. Thank you. It took me a week and a half 

to clear the snow, and I had to pay people to do the work my 

spouse would normally have done. The snow blower was easily 

fixed, but it cost me $50 when my spouse always fixes those items. 

Now that the snow is removed, it is revealed that the deck on top 

of my garage needs to be repaired and the siding on the house 

needs to be replaced. These are things my spouse would have done 

for cost, but now I have to pay somebody to do them. These things 

cannot wait for my husband to return because winter is coming 
5

again and things will only get worse. Yet I have no help and not 

enough money to have the work done. 

In March, my spouse temporarily returned to his home unit in 

Bangor to train with the aircraft and fly them to their port of departure. He made arrangements to stay at a local hotel in Bangor, 

a 4-hour distance from our home. My husband was told his military 

credit card could be used for the room and to save all receipts for 

travel and food for reimbursement. When he checked out of the 

room, the card would not work. We were forced to use our personal 

money to pay for the room, food, and travel, a cost of almost $1,700 

to the family, which put a huge financial burden on us. 

As a result, I fell behind monthly payments on every bill and ran 

out of heating oil during the coldest winter in northern Maine history. We had purchased a heating oil plan, but this was the first 

year we did not make it through the winter. I was forced to beg 

for oil when 2 months earlier I had a perfect credit history and had 

never missed a payment. I knew the family support program was 

there to help, but I knew there were families even worse off than 

us, knew that they were very limited on the funds and staff available. After all, we did still have food, a roof, and now heat, at least 

for now. But it was not long before I was forced to go to the church 

and ask for food. On two occasions they assisted me with food for 

my children. 

It seemed like every day something was breaking down—the 

driver’s window in the truck, an oil leak in the car, the screen door 

was falling off, the faucet in the sink had been replaced with a pair 

of pliers. Just when I thought I could not take any more, my grandfather passed away. I had no way to get there. I had no money and 

no clothes because I had lost 40 pounds from stress and was working on my third bout of pneumonia. 

I had reached my breaking point. I picked up the phone and 

asked our state family support coordinator, who was located in Augusta, 6 hours away, for help. I told her I needed enough money 

to get there and back, a 500 mile trip, plus meals on the road one 

way. Once there I could stay with family and borrow clothes. The 

state family support coordinator asked if I had money to get to Augusta. I had one gas card that had not yet maxed out. And 6 hours 

later, me and my girls were in her office and she gave me $200 for 

travel and a new outfit to wear to the funeral. I never thought I 

could be so happy to go to a funeral, but now I would be able to 

say goodbye to my grandfather and my children’s great grandfather. 

We returned home thinking things were looking up, to find out 

my husband was losing his job because of this little-known clause 

in the USERRA law. This clause says you can leave your employer 

to defend your country, leave your family to fend for themselves, 

and there is no job protection if the employer has a company-wide 

layoff. Yes, you heard me correctly. When my husband returns 

from Kuwait, he will be unemployed. How will he be able to seek 

employment in northern Maine while he is honorably defending his 

country and the freedom of others in Iraq? The paper mill he works 

for is laying off 100-plus employees, two of which are currently deployed. Do you not think the other 98-plus will have a head start 

in filling the available jobs in the area where we live? If they wait 
6

until they return home, what kind of luck will we have in selling 

a house in a community where high unemployment exists? There 

must be a way to protect our country’s protectors. 

I have a few ideas. Schooling for new trades, job placement at 

deployment stations and real estate opportunities for the ones who 

are forced to relocate. 

My stories seem comical now and perhaps they are small compared to others, but in Maine alone we have felt the pains of the 

war on terrorism. Many spouses and families have suffered. Many 

spouses left behind have been fired or quit their jobs because their 

employer would not accommodate them with shorter hours to care 

for their family’s special needs or simply to manage the day-to-day 

matters. Why are the families of Guard and Reserves fighting just 

as hard at home to support their spouses and yet have no legal representation themselves? There are spouses who can’t drive due to 

visual handicaps and live in rural areas away from central commands and no way to help them. They are left to the wolves. Why 

do we not have special provisions set aside for these special needs 

people when their spouse is called away to serve our country? If 

provisions were set aside, they could arrange for extra help for 

their and rides to get groceries. I am not asking for Disney World. 

I am simply asking for basic life provisions. 

You are probably thinking we pay your spouse for military service. Yes, you do. But here is a fact I do not know if you realize. 

In my family alone we have lost $12,000 for one year while my 

spouse is serving. In a family that makes under $50,000 a year, 

that is a large reduction in our income. 

Families need protection as well as soldiers. My children were 

chastised at school. Teachers singled them out simply because their 

father went to war. My 8-year-old desperately needs counseling, 

and the support group did try to find us some in the area, but to 

no avail. There are no qualified civilians to deal with children and 

real war problems. 

Guard and Reserve families need family support during deployment. They are the only ones that know what each other is going 

through. Words cannot say what family support coordinators and 

family support programs do for those left behind. But Maine has 

the only one coordinator that does the work of 10 people, 24 hours 

a day, 7 days a week, with very little money and assistance. Oftentimes, they rely on local donations. Outreach to all the families is 

difficult, too. The state of Maine alone has 417 miles of interstate, 

and another 120 miles north of that from north to south, with several Guard and Reserve units activated overseas and abroad, some 

1,000 citizen-soldiers from Maine alone. We are a very rural state 

and our coordinator does her best with what she is given. 

What must be done is to protect and provide both our soldiers 

and their families support and protection by federal law. Without 

that, many of our families will suffer and struggle through many 

of the same problems that can be avoided. 

Family Assistance Centers have been set up during this mobilization. It consists of a person on the other end of the phone to refer 

us to outside sources. They do a fine job with what they have but 

are not established until war and are only equipped to refer. We 

need inside resources, trained professionals. They do not have the 
7

training to deal with what we have been exposed to. We need professional staff on hand like an active duty base would have. The 

family program should be staffed like an Army Community Center, 

with counselors for both child and adult, financial counseling services, job placement help, legal counseling, and more. 

The family program schedules dinners and informational meetings throughout the state at different times and locations. They try 

very hard to reach us all. They also schedule events for children 

and adults so we may socialize and just be together. 

Being able to talk to people who are in the same situation, having the same feelings make a huge difference for me emotionally 

and physically. The family program would be able to reach more 

of us with more funding and assistance. I live an hour and a half 

away from the closest meeting and cannot always make it due to 

financial reasons. That one trip could mean 2 weeks of gas in my 

car. I am the only one in this part of the county, so it would not 

make sense for them to change the meeting. However, if they could 

assist me with gas, I would be fine. And I know other families are 

in the same position. 

I stand before you as a proud spouse and American. I will continue to stand behind my husband and my country. I appreciate 

the opportunity to address you today and ask you to stand also for 

the issues that are affecting our military families. 

Thank you. 

Mr. BROWN. Thank you very much for your testimony. Now, Lt. 

Adams, we certainly welcome you from the low country of South 

Carolina. 

STATEMENT OF 2ND LT. TAYLOR E. ADAMS 

Lt. ADAMS. Mr. Chairman, distinguished members of the subcommittee, thank you for the invitation to testify before you today. 

I am an Air Force Reservist proudly assigned to the 315th Maintenance Squadron, part of the 315th Airlift Wing at Charleston. I 

also work for McNaughton-McKay Electrical Company in Charleston, SC, also home of the distinguished chairman. McNaughtonMcKay is an electrical distributor that sells all electrical commodities and especially automation products to industrial manufacturers. I have worked for McNaughton-McKay since I graduated from 

Appalachian State University in 1994. 

Before 9/11 and the activation, I was one of four account managers in a branch of 15 employees. When I was activated, I left behind 25 percent of the company’s accounts. Out of necessity, they 

hired a new account manager to ensure seamless customer service. 

Since deactivation, my new title is automation consultant, not only 

covering Charleston, SC but Savannah, GA as well. 

I enlisted in the Air Force Reserve in 1989. I had always thought 

seriously about becoming an officer if the opportunity arose. And, 

ironically, it finally did in 2001 while on active duty for Operation 

Enduring Freedom. 

In the uncertainty after the attacks of 9/11, it looked more and 

more as if we were going to go to Afghanistan. My employer frequently asked me if he thought I would be activated or not. All I 

could offer was that if I got the call, I would probably have a few 

days before I had to report to duty. That would be enough time for 
8

account planning and transitioning the accounts to new account 

managers. 

Sunday night, October 6th, about 10 o’clock at night, I got the 

call to activation, and I immediately called my boss to let him 

know. I told him we had to meet in the morning because instead 

of a few days to report, I only had a few hours. He was very accommodating and cleared his schedule to handle the planning. 

Just a week earlier, David Beattie, president of McNaughtonMcKay, had come up with a new policy to pay anyone called to active duty their normal pay minus their military pay for a period 

of 6 months. This was enormous, since I was going to be taking 

about a 30 percent pay cut going from an account manager at 

McNaughton-McKay to E–5 for the Reserve. Along with the pay 

differential, all benefits remained intact, as well as my seniority 

with the company. 

I was deactivated on August 15, 2002 and immediately returned 

to work. The first day back I met with the sales manager, as well 

as the general manager, to discuss my future. They first explained 

how glad they were to have me back and asked if I would be leaving again any time soon. I said yes, I needed time off again in October and November to attend the Academy of Military Science in 

order to get my commission. Once again, they were very accommodating and said it was not a problem. I was also given my new position of automation consultant since they needed to hire somebody 

in my absence to handle my accounts. 

Since then I have asked for time off to be here for this incredible 

opportunity as well as for a month next year to attend aircraft 

maintenance officers’ school. As well as with all other requests, 

McNaughton-McKay has accommodated without question and without reserve. Mr. Beattie has now expanded his company policy on 

activated Reservists to provide pay differential and benefits for as 

long as needed by the Reservists. I am pleased to be an integral 

part of two great teams who value me, my family. And I would 

hope that any employers who are able to do so would consider providing the same benefits to their Reservists. 

Again, I would like to thank you for the opportunity to be here. 

Thank you for your continued support of our military men and 

women around the world, and for recognizing the contributions of 

my boss, David Beattie, as a true patriot. 

Thank you, sir. 

[The prepared statement of Lt. Adams appears on p. 43.] 

Mr. BROWN. Thank you, Lieutenant. It would be appropriate at 

this time if you wanted to introduce your boss and the other members of the team who accompany you. 

Lt. ADAMS. This is Dave Beattie, president of McNaughtonMcKay. (Applause.) 

Mr. BROWN. Thank you. Thank you, Mr. Beattie. Glad to have 

you here today, too. Colonel. 

STATEMENT OF COL. ROBERT F. NORTON 

Col. NORTON. Thank you, Mr. Chairman and distinguished members of the subcommittee. On behalf of The Military Coalition, I am 

very grateful for this opportunity to express our collective views on 
9

improving the Uniformed Services Employment and Reemployment 

Rights Act. 

Before I begin my remarks, though, Mr. Chairman, I would like 

to say that it is a great honor for me to sit with these fine young 

patriots, servicemembers, and their families. I think their testimony points out two things. First, the essential role of the National 

Guard and the Reserve Forces in our national security. And, secondly, the fact that today, unlike any other mobilization in our history, and certainly unlike the mobilization of World War II, mobilization today of the National Guard and the Reserve involves the 

call up of families as well as the call up of individual 

servicemembers. The families bear a tremendous burden, a financial burden and other responsibilities that the mostly single men 

of World War II did not face. And so the USERRA is extremely important to the work that you and this committee and the Congress 

does in terms of protecting the reemployment rights of families. 

Mr. Chairman, The Military Coalition is a consortium of nationally-prominent uniformed services and veterans organizations, 

which represent approximately 5.5 million current and former 

members of the uniformed services, plus their families and survivors. 

There are three areas I would like to discuss concerning improving the USERRA. First, there is a need to tighten enforcement 

mechanisms for federal and state employees who are members of 

the National Guard and Reserve Forces. Second, there is a need to 

bolster outreach and support activities to ensure that USERRA is 

understood in the workplace by Reservists and employers alike. 

And, third, is to bring to the subcommittee’s attention the importance of providing some measure of guarantees to the many student Reservists who have no protections under the law when they 

return to their work as students in academic institutions or training programs. 

I would like to emphasize, Mr. Chairman, the importance of the 

USERRA to the men and women of our Armed Forces. Since 9/11 

there have been nearly 300,000 men and women called to federal 

active duty. And based upon the remarks of the Commander-InChief yesterday (July 23, 2003), many thousands more are likely to 

be mobilized in the coming weeks, months, and years ahead. Because this mobilization is the largest protracted call-up since World 

War II, it is extremely important for Congress, employers, and Reservists themselves to understand and support the reemployment 

protections provided under the USERRA. 

That leads to the Coalition’s first point. As indicated in our prepared statement, the enforcement mechanisms in USERRA for 

Guard and Reserve servicemembers who work in the Federal Government and state governments are broken and exist essentially 

only on paper. For example, Congress passed an amendment to the 

USERRA in 1998 which was intended to provide reemployment 

protections for Reservists employed by state governments. But 

going back nearly 5 years, there have been no reported cases where 

the Department of Justice or the U.S. Attorneys have sued a state 

on behalf of a USERRA state employee complainant. If a state refuses to waive its sovereign immunity under the Eleventh Amendment of the Constitution—and we understand that states routinely 
10

do this in a variety of situations—if that doesn’t happen, the state 

employee Reservist has absolutely no place to turn to seek relief in 

a reemployment rights case against a state. 

We recently learned, for example, of an activated Air Force Reserve professor at Alabama State University who has been denied 

reemployment. Unless and until the U.S. Attorney officially receives the case from the Department of Labor through the Department of Justice, or that the State of Alabama waive its sovereign 

immunity, the Reservist will have absolutely no chance to argue a 

violation of the USERRA. 

With hundreds, if not thousands, of state employees being mobilized, the Coalition strongly recommends that the USERRA be 

amended to require—that is require, rather than permit, the Department of Justice to accept USERRA cases that the Department 

of Labor deems to have merit. We further recommend that the subcommittee impose a reporting requirement on the Departments of 

Labor and Justice regarding the number of such referrals and the 

outcome of the litigation. 

Similarly, the section in the statute concerning federal executive 

agency reemployment rights cases is also in need of repair. Since 

Congress enacted an amendment to the USERRA in 1994 no Reservist employees have been represented by the Office of Special 

Counsel as intended in the statute. It is our understanding that 

the Office of Special Counsel has neither the resources nor the intention of taking on such cases. Therefore, The Military Coalition 

recommends that Congress strengthen Section 4324 so that the Office of Special Counsel will have a legitimate, even mandatory role, 

to accept such cases. And, Mr. Chairman, additional resources may 

be needed to put teeth into the Office of Special Counsel’s role. 

Our second area of interest is support and outreach for the 

USERRA. Given the scope and the unknown conclusion of this mobilization, it goes without saying that all stakeholders need better 

tools to understand the USERRA. The Department of Labor Veteran’s Employment and Training Service needs to publish a 

USERRA handbook, not only for its own staff but as a reference 

manual for the Department of Justice, the Office of Special Counsel, employers, Reservists, and even the media. The Department of 

Labor also should be required, rather than permitted, to publish 

implementing regulations in the Code of Federal Regulations for 

the USERRA, to write and present to help educate and inform employers, the media, and the general public about the USERRA. 

Right now, Mr. Chairman, in the statute, the departments ‘‘may’’

publish implementing regulations. We strongly recommend that 

they be required to publish regulations to help get the word out on 

USERRA. 

The Coalition believes that the Veterans Employment and Training Service is grossly under-funded for the likely demand that is 

surely going to occur as tens of thousands more Guard and Reserve 

servicemembers cycle back and forth on active duty. 

Finally, Mr. Chairman, the Coalition would like to urge the subcommittee’s attention to the plight of some student Reservists who 

are treated like dropouts when they incur financial obligations and 

have other problems with their academic reinstatement. A number 

of bills have been introduced this session that address aspects of 
11

this situation, reflecting the fact that Reservists are greatly concerned with the second-class treatment they occasionally get from 

colleges and universities. Some would say that the solution is to 

give the Secretary of Education greater policy authority in this 

arena. But we believe that based upon the experience of Gulf War 

I, that hasn’t worked. And we recommend that statutory guarantees, rather than policy authority be provided to federal Reservists 

who are students, to help them with their student loan, Federal 

student loan repayment problems and related issues that must be 

dealt with either by making changes to the USERRA itself or perhaps to the Soldiers and Sailors Civil Relief Act. 

Thank you, Mr. Chairman, for this opportunity to testify today 

on behalf of The Military Coalition. And I look forward to your 

questions. 

[The prepared statement of Col. Norton appears on p. 50.] 

Mr. BROWN. Thank you, Colonel. Let me thank all the members 

of the panel for coming today to give their testimony. I think if you 

stay around for the rest of the proceedings, we are trying to link 

the employee and the employer and also the Department of Labor 

all in one setting. So if you all would be kind enough to stay. 

Mrs. Dumond, I certainly want to thank you for your selfless 

service and that of your husband. Both of you make us proud. And 

the assistant secretary is with us this morning, Mr. Fred Juarbe. 

He has spent his whole career, I understand, working on veterans’

issues, and we are grateful for his service. On behalf of Mr. 

Michaud and myself, we have asked him to look at your husband’s 

case. And I think you have had a chance to chat with him. So 

maybe something will come from that. 

We had the privilege, Mr. Michaud and myself, about 3 weeks 

ago, to go to the Pentagon and meet with the Secretary of Labor, 

Ms. Chao, and the Secretary of Defense, Mr. Rumsfeld, and witness 

them signing a memorandum of understanding to help find jobs for 

those members of the service who are coming out of the service 

without employment. And so we are real proud to be part of that 

and to make an impact on that particular regulation. 

Lt. Adams, it is certainly good to have you with us this morning 

and to testify in a good way, what a great company you work for 

and what a great area you live in. 

And, Mr. Beattie, we certainly appreciate your coming and being 

a part of this and for your contribution. I was just mentioning earlier that sometimes corporate America is looked at as a cold box 

that is out there just collecting cash. But I think as you find in the 

testimony this morning and also in further testimony of some of 

our great corporate citizens, that you find that they really do have 

compassion for their workers. And I am grateful to have the opportunity to give them the privilege to be able to gain some recognition. Sometimes good things sort of go under water. But at least 

this morning we will have a chance to bring some recognition to 

those people who are doing good things. 

Col. Norton, it is always good to have you here. And after today’s 

hearing, I will consult with Mr. Michaud, and all of you witnesses, 

ask you to view the Coalition’s recommendations and report back 

to the subcommittee in 30 days. We really want to take some action on those concerns that you brought forward. 
12

Mr. Michaud, do you have any questions? 

Mr. MICHAUD. Yes, I, too, would like to thank the panel. I really 

appreciate your telling your story, Ms. Dumond and Lt. Adams. 

They are really heart-warming, and I appreciate everything both 

you and your family have done for the citizens of the United States 

of America. And Col. Norton, I also appreciate your comments as 

well. And it will be interesting in knowing, as far as the recommendations, the Coalition’s recommendations, what you envision 

are the top priorities in those recommendations. But also whether 

or not you feel that the Office of Veterans Employment and Training Service has sufficient resources to administer the many programs that they have to administer. If you could address that. 

And the other issue is you heard Ms. Dumond talk about her situation, where she lives in the northern part of the state. Maine is 

a very rural state. You have to travel many hours to get to actually 

the central part of the state. And it really is a burden for those who 

live in the rural area with only one person to assist. And I want 

to know if there are any suggestions you might have, whether or 

not there is a toll-free number for situations that were faced in 

Maine and other rural areas that we might be able to have to assist the families of our military? 

Col. NORTON. Thank you, Mr. Ranking Member. Yes, I think we 

feel very strongly that because the National Guard and the Reserve 

are widely scattered across tens of thousands of American communities, that much more needs to be done in terms of family and financial support services. These individual servicemembers and 

their families, in most cases, are not associated with particular active-duty bases or posts or camps or stations. And so we need to 

bring these support services closer to the point of need. I think, as 

Mrs. Dumond properly and correctly pointed out, you are out there, 

you need the support. A 1–800 number would be very helpful. 

I could draw an analogy, if I could, sir. A couple of years ago, 

funeral honors for deceased veterans’ family members to provide 

adequate funeral honors was a big problem in the Department of 

Defense. And one of the solutions was that the local funeral directors became involved, and they are in a network. There is a 1–800 

number that any family member can call to get that kind of service. 

In The Military Coalition we believe that a whole range of family 

support services for National Guard and Reserve servicemembers 

needs to be established. So it is not just USERRA but it is also financial counseling. It is help with adjusting to the absentee 

servicemember. The stresses on these families are tremendous. One 

of our 35 members, the National Military Families Association, 

specializes in this kind of work. And I am sure if you had any follow-up questions in particular, they would be happy to provide insight, through the Coalition, on some of these issues. 

Mr. MICHAUD. Great. Thank you very much, Colonel. Appreciate 

it. 

Mr. BROWN. Okay, thank you, Mr. Michaud. We have been joined 

by Congressman Quinn from New York, upstate New York. Congressman Quinn, do you have a question? 

Mr. QUINN. Thank you, Mr. Chairman and Mr. Michaud. And 

thank the panelists. It cannot be coincidence that we have got a 
13

South Carolinian and a Mainian. I am just hoping maybe Col. Norton might be from New York. (Laughter.) 

Col. NORTON. I can help you on that, sir. Yes, I have some relationship, as you know, with Keuka College in Buffalo, NY. 

Mr. QUINN. Exactly. Exactly my point. And if you flew over New 

York to get here today, that would qualify. Thank you very much. 

Mr. Chairman, I have a statement and ask unanimous request 

that it be included in the record. 

Mr. BROWN. Without objection. 

[The prepared statement of Congressman Quinn appears on p. 

41.] 

Mr. QUINN. But I did want to come over to thank the panelists. 

And to mention that I have been a member of the subcommittee 

and the committee for 11 years now and find myself doing some 

railroad and transportation work. 

But the issue and the reason I came over this morning, the issue 

that you are talking about today is critically, critically important. 

Michelle and Taylor, your stories this morning, I have heard many 

times, Mr. Chairman, when I sat in your chair about the families 

that are effected. All of us already know that about 65 percent of 

the soldiers are married at the time that they separate from the 

service. So that your point, Colonel, that we are talking about families, not individual people now, really needs us to pay attention to 

that. 

One of the issues that I have worked on since I have been here 

and on the subcommittee has been the transition for our servicemen and women from active duty into the civilian world. And how 

we can’t better license and certify and make certain that not only 

as Reservists return to their job, and you happen to have a wonderful employer and we are going to hear some more testimony later, 

but that that transition be as seamless as possible. And we have 

had resistance from the Department of Defense over the years because they want to always talk about retaining their membership. 

But I believe that from the minute that a man or a woman enters the service, we should be preparing them to exit into a job. Because as soon as that break happens where there is not work and, 

Michelle, as soon as you start going in debt, we end up with situations of unemployment and homelessness and bills and things that 

cause marital problems and all kinds of other social problems that 

we have to deal with and aren’t equipped. And rather than have 

to deal with that problem, it is my thought that we ought to be 

working on it from the day men and women enter the service of 

our country for them to leave. 

And so while it is not exactly the topic this morning, Mr. Chairman, I applaud you and the Ranking Member for holding this hearing and for making certain that we have got panelists this morning 

and individuals like we have at the table right now who are going 

to testify to the need for that. And then it is our job as members 

of the Veterans’ Committee to lobby our colleagues on both sides 

of the aisle and to lobby this administration to make certain that 

we not only make the headlines about this war but that we make 

certain we make the families whole as well. 

And for whatever work that I and my colleagues have done, Mr. 

Chairman, we stand ready to help you, both of you, in that job. And 
14

that is why I took some time to come over and say that myself. 

Thank you. 

Mr. BROWN. I appreciate that, Jack. And certainly it is a pleasure of mine to work alongside you on this committee and also on 

the Transportation and Infrastructure Committee and try to meet 

the needs of this great Nation. Thank you for your dedication. 

I thank you, panel, and we look forward to hearing from the second panel. 

Good morning and welcome. This is the first of two panels of essentially corporate citizens. First, we have Mr. John Ryan, former 

Army Reservist and senior vice president for human resources at 

Schering-Plough. Mr. Ryan is responsible for overseeing ScheringPlough’s human resources programs worldwide. 

Mr. Jim Rouse is vice president of ExxonMobil and is a former 

Army officer who has served in a leadership position with Exxon 

since 1962. 

And William Timmerman is my friend from South Carolina—no, 

wrong panel. Where is Mr. Timmerman? Did he come up? Okay. 

Third on the panel is my good friend from South Carolina, Mr. William Timmerman, the chairman and CEO of SCANA Corporation 

since 1997. Bill served in the U.S. Navy from 1968 to 1972 and is 

a Vietnam veteran. And I would be amiss if I didn’t go to the next 

step and introduce his wife, Debbie. Debbie, would you stand? And 

with Debbie is Polly Cosco from Columbia. Did Polly show up or 

did she leave? Hey, Polly. Thank you all for being here. 

Our final witness on the second panel is Susan LaChance, the 

manager of selection, evaluation and recognition for the U.S. Postal 

Service. She is a career civil servant and a member of the Postal 

Service Executive Management Team. 

You folks represent the very best of the business world, and we 

are honored to have you with us. 

Mr. Ryan, you may begin. 

STATEMENTS OF JOHN RYAN, SENIOR VICE PRESIDENT FOR 

HUMAN RESOURCES, SCHERING-PLOUGH CORPORATION; 

JIM ROUSE, VICE PRESIDENT, WASHINGTON OFFICE, 

EXXONMOBIL CORPORATION; WILLIAM TIMMERMAN, CHAIRMAN AND CHIEF EXECUTIVE OFFICER, SCANA CORPORATION; AND SUSAN LACHANCE, MANAGER OF SELECTION, 

EVALUATION, AND RECOGNITION, U.S. POSTAL SERVICE 

STATEMENT OF JOHN RYAN 

Mr. RYAN. Good morning, Mr. Chairman and members of the 

subcommittee. I am John Ryan, senior vice president for human resources at Schering-Plough, a research-based pharmaceutical company headquartered in New Jersey. 

As a human resources professional for 42 years, I applaud the 

subcommittee for drawing attention to how employers’ policies toward Reservists can make it possible for talented men and women 

to serve in the Reserves, to be assured of support during military 

service, and return with a stronger commitment to their employer 

and their job. 

Over the decade since enactment of USERRA, we have seen increasing demand for skilled workers at the same time as our Na-
15

tion’s Armed Forces have become more reliant on the National 

Guard and Reservists. 

It has been my responsibility to position Schering-Plough to recruit and retain talented, skilled, and motivated employees in this 

more competitive hiring environment. The assurance we make to 

men and women who have chosen to serve in the Guard and Reserves is one important element of our program to attract and retain qualified employees. We also view it as a part of our civic responsibility to support our Nation and the men and the women 

who serve it. 

As a company, we are aware of our obligations under USERRA 

and we consider them a floor for what we provide our employees. 

The USERRA requirements effectively freeze time for the employee 

who is called to active duty. The 224,000 Reservists called to service in Iraq know that this time is anything but frozen. Today, the 

majority of professional soldiers and Reservists have families at 

home. Sixty percent are married and 30 percent have children. For 

many, active duty means giving up a regular paycheck, or even 

part of a paycheck, and trying to secure other forms of health and 

life insurance to protect their families while they are protecting the 

rest of us. 

While a lot of these employees have a right to return to their job, 

or a similar one, with the same pay and health benefits as when 

they left, the right simply to return to work does not meet the family’s needs while the employee is away on active duty. We think 

companies should do more. And, in fact, many do. 

Since 1991, Schering-Plough has had a policy to provide full support to Guard members and Reservists called to active duty. As you 

can see in the copy of our policy attached to my prepared testimony, we provide the Guard and Reservist employee the following: 

full pay for the duration of service without offset of their ScheringPlough by their military pay; all company-provided and optional 

employee benefits, including health and life insurance for the soldiers and their dependents for the duration of their service; job protection and the opportunity for the same or a comparable position 

upon returning to work; continued accumulation of all senioritybased benefits, such as vacation, profit-sharing, and sick pay allowance, throughout their tour of duty as if still employed. 

And, finally, for the families of employees called to active duty, 

there is an employee assistance program which is available to provide counseling and support to help the family members deal with 

the disruptions and the issues arising from the extended absence 

of a spouse, a son or a daughter or other family member. 

We believe these policies are not just the right thing to do. They 

also make good business sense. Our Guard and Reserve members 

are good employees. They are generally mature, dedicated and committed people who come with a deep sense of loyalty to their country and to their employer. And have learned how to manage their 

dual obligation as an employee and as a citizen soldier. They also 

may have benefitted from educational and training benefits that 

the Guard and Reserve units provide to them at no cost. With the 

$14 billion the Department of Defense spends each year on training 

and education, regular military and Reservists who join or re-join 
16

the civilian labor force tend to be highly skilled and extensively 

trained. 

While the level of support we provide to Reservists is easier to 

sustain in a large organization like ours, some level of support can 

also work in medium and small enterprises. At the very least, companies should be encouraged to publicly affirm their support for 

their Reservist and Guard employees by signing the statement of 

support provided by the Defense Department’s Employment Support of the Guard and Reserves, otherwise known as ESGR. I know 

from our own experiences the talented people at ESGR are more 

than willing to help companies clearly understand their obligation 

and to communicate their support. 

We at Schering-Plough are proud of our Reservists and our policies to support them. The Reserve Officers of America recognized 

our pursuit of these policies just this year when Schering-Plough 

was ranked first among the employers for Reservists. Most of all, 

we are proud that working together with our Reservist employees, 

we have been able to offer a benefit that, as substantial as it may 

be, still pales in comparison to the honor our Reservist and National Guard employees reflect on our company. 

Thank you, Mr. Chairman and members of the subcommittee, for 

the opportunity to appear before you today. I am very happy to answer any questions you may have. Thank you. 

[The prepared statement of Mr. Ryan appears on p. 58.] 

Mr. BROWN. Thank you. Mr. Rouse. 

STATEMENT OF JIM ROUSE 

Mr. ROUSE. Good morning, Mr. Chairman and members of the 

committee. My name is Jim Rouse. I am a vice president of 

ExxonMobil and the Corporation’s senior official here in Washington, DC. I feel qualified to talk to you today about my company’s 

military leave policy for two reasons. First, before coming to Washington some 7 years ago, I managed the human resources function 

for Exxon Company USA for more than a decade. And, secondly, 

going all the way back to 1962, about a year after I joined the company, I was called to active duty as a lieutenant in the U.S. Army 

and was the direct beneficiary of the program I am about to describe for 2 years on active duty and then another 6 years in the 

U.S. Army Reserve. 

As you know, ExxonMobil is the world’s largest publicly traded 

petroleum and petrol-chemical company, with operations in nearly 

200 countries and territories across the world. More than 36,000 of 

our employees are residents of the U.S. And our military leave policy dates back more than 60 years, being initiated in the 1940’s 

and includes the following basic provisions. 

First, if an employee is inducted into or recalled to full-time active service with the Armed Forces of the United States or the Reserves, they qualify for both a lump sum payment, 2 months’ pay, 

and the difference between their military and their company pay, 

up to 50 percent of their company pay for the duration of their 

tour. Now, a special provision was adopted in October of 2001 in 

response to Operation Enduring Freedom and then expanded to include Operation Liberty Shield and Operation Iraqi Freedom, 

which increased the employee pay match from a maximum of 50 
17

percent of their company pay to 100 percent of their company pay, 

which it is today. 

Further, if an employee is called up in an emergency situation 

or full-time temporary duty for military training purposes that will 

not exceed 2 months, the normal things that we run into often 

times in Reserve training, they receive 100 percent of their company pay less any military pay that they might receive. 

Participation in ExxonMobil benefits continues for the employee 

on military leave. Examples of the continued benefits would be the 

service credit for our retirement program, which is fully paid for by 

the company; a makeup of the company contributions to the savings plan if the employee chooses to remain in a savings plan when 

they return from active duty; life insurance plans, medical and dental coverage for the employee and their families; even pay in lieu 

of vacation; and our employee company discount program when 

they buy gasoline. 

Of course, upon return, employees are placed in a position in the 

company where they would have normally achieved if they had remained active with the company while they were gone. In other 

words, if an individual is a sales representative and would have 

been promoted to senior sales representative when they went off on 

active duty, then they are promoted to that position when they return from active military service. There are no company service requirements to participate in these programs while employees are 

on military leave. 

More than 50 U.S.-based ExxonMobil employees were on active 

duty in connection with Homeland Security activities, with the war 

in Afghanistan, and the war in Iraq. Interestingly, ExxonMobil employees in the UK who participated in the Afghanistan operation 

and operations in Iraq were also similarly treated under a policy 

like this. 

Turning to USERRA, the requirements of the Act seem very reasonable to us. Guidelines that have been written for it create, we 

think, pretty much an administrative ease in terms of implementation of the policy. Our employees or the company have experienced 

no difficulties in implementing the program as it is designed. 

Complying with USERRA has not come without its challenges. 

For example, as the employees are called to active duty, uncertainty exists about the expected duration of their call up. Sometimes we have individuals called up multiple times over a period 

of time. And, of course, the duration of the call up itself is often 

a mystery, which poses some opportunities for us in the planning 

and staffing of our organization. 

We believe the current requirements of USERRA are reasonable, 

and the Department of Labor’s administration of the Act has been 

practical and efficient. 

Again, I want to thank the subcommittee for this opportunity to 

share a brief overview of our company military leave policies. And 

I can assure you as a beneficiary of those many years ago, it was 

very important to me. 

[The prepared statement of Mr. Rouse appears on p. 65.] 

Mr. BROWN. Thank you, Mr. Rouse. Mr. Timmerman. 
18

STATEMENT OF WILLIAM B. TIMMERMAN 

Mr. TIMMERMAN. Chairman Brown and members of the committee, I am honored to be here today representing 5,500 employees of SCANA Corporation to share in the recognition of our company as an exemplary employer of our valued Reservists. 

A few quick facts about our company will provide some context 

for the rest of my testimony. SCANA Corporation is a successor to 

a company founded 157 years ago in Charleston, SC. Today we are 

a Fortune 500 company, serving electricity and natural gas to significant portions of South Carolina, North Carolina, and Georgia. 

Thirteen percent of our outstanding common stock is owned by our 

employees. Our average employee owns 2,000 shares of our stock, 

which is freely tradeable by them, has a market value of $66,000 

and pays them an annual dividend of $2,800. Our average employee has been with us 14 years and expects to work with us until 

retirement. 

Our business success as a service company is built on six corporate values relating to service to communities, achievement, open 

communications, respect and caring for all people, excellence in our 

operations and safety, and, finally, always doing the right thing. I 

am especially proud that the veterans’ organizations have recognized our company for doing the right thing. I sincerely believe we 

walk the talk with respect to our values, especially doing the right 

thing. 

There is also an unwritten business principle which we diligently 

follow: Employees treat customers as well or as poorly as they perceive they are being treated by the company. It is human nature. 

It is a very powerful and a very real predictor of our employee behavior in the workplace. Our business success depends on serving 

nearly 1.2 million natural gas customers and 600,000 electric customers everyday. In today’s world, it takes a massive amount of 

teamwork, personal communications, and attention to detail to 

make our efforts all come together so that our customers can take 

reliability, safety, integrity, and caring energy service for granted. 

So what do we do for Reservists who are called away to active 

duty? First, we continue all pay at current levels until their return, 

reduced only by the amount of their military pay. Their total pay, 

including military pay, qualifies for matching in our 401(k) savings 

plan and counts toward their retirement plan, which the company 

pays for. We keep them eligible for all bonuses. And, in fact, recently paid incentive bonuses to Reservists on active duty, which 

were earned by company employees for the performance of the company in 2002. Obviously, their job is protected upon their return. 

Beyond this, though, we work very hard to keep them a part of 

our corporate family. We organize support groups for the families 

left behind. Managers and other leaders in our company monitored 

those families’ needs while the Reservists were gone. From time to 

time, we sent care packages, including a lot of company publications and other news to those overseas. Finally, each Reservist got 

a letter from me, which provided them with my direct e-mail address and encouraged them to let me know of any problems their 

families were incurring which I could fix. Throughout their deployments, I have received many notes and letters. And, thankfully, I 

have not had to intervene. But it always feels good to know that 
19

the lines of communication are wide open with our Reservists. 

Other leaders in our company did the very same thing, I should 

point out that these policies as well were substantially in place for 

our last major deployment, which occurred in the 1990 to 1991 

time frame. 

So why do we do this? The first reason is my personal commitment to members of the Armed Forces. From 1968 to 1972, I was 

an enlisted man in the U.S. Navy. And served in 1972 aboard the 

USS America then deployed to Vietnam. I do not have many happy 

memories of the treatment of military personnel during that era or 

upon their transition and re-entry into the civilian world. That is 

history. None of us can change it. Some of us will never forget, 

even though we may have gotten over it. However, I do use my 

sphere of influence to ensure all my fellow employees never feel a 

lack of support or caring, especially those called to active duty. 

Going beyond my personal convictions, our treatment of Reservists parallels our treatment of other good employees who might be 

having a significant temporary personal issue. For example, we 

work closely with employees who might be going through an extended series of chemotherapy or other treatments or other physical rehabilitation. They might have had a house fire. They might 

have experienced a sudden loss of an immediate family member or 

other catastrophic situation that impacts their ability to work a 

normal schedule for a while. 

We take a long-term view with respect to employment of our 

company members. We are able to do this because our operating 

assets and our relationships with our customers are very longlived. So our policies and practices in this area fit our general business model. 

I could not in good conscience, however, proscribe these policies 

for all organizations. There are many businesses which are not of 

our size and scope. There are many businesses perhaps who are in 

the development stage or are much smaller. But all businesses can 

communicate with their employees in a very direct and clear manner as to what the expectations are and what employee family’s expectations should be. And all businesses can communicate and 

work very hard to support the families that are left behind. It 

doesn’t matter whether you have five people in your company or 

5,500 people in your company. 

In summary, I do think employers must provide a clearly-written 

delineation of how Reservists on active duty would be treated. A 

clear and explicit set of expectations and policies for the employer, 

the Reservist and their family would go a long way towards helping 

Reservists find employers who support the Reservist’s commitments. 

My personal thanks to this committee for allowing me to testify 

today regarding SCANA’s experiences with the treatment of our 

employees who also serve in the Armed Forces Reserve. And I, too, 

would be pleased to answer any questions. 

[The prepared statement of Mr. Timmerman appears on p. 68.] 

Mr. BROWN. Thank you, Bill. Ms. LaChance. 
20

STATEMENT OF SUSAN LACHANCE 

Ms. LACHANCE. Good morning, Mr. Chairman and members of 

the subcommittee. My name is Susan LaChance, and I am the 

manager of selection, evaluation, and recognition for the U.S. Postal Service. 

The Postal Service has a long tradition of employing America’s 

veterans in large numbers. As our Nation’s military deployment 

needs have evolved, including the greater reliance on its Reserve 

components, our efforts in support of those needs have evolved as 

well. We continue to innovate as times change and as we identify 

areas where we can provide additional support. I am particularly 

pleased to have this chance to hear firsthand how other employers 

are innovating to meet employee needs with regard to the Uniformed Services Employment and Reemployment Rights Act. 

For the Postal Service, the most important part of our efforts is 

ensuring that our employees, who serve the Nation in both a civilian and a military capacity, receive the employment benefits and 

protection that they are entitled to under USERRA. So I take my 

responsibility for developing the Postal Service’s implementation 

policies for USERRA very seriously. 

We understand that USERRA is an essential tool that our Armed 

Forces need to be able to continue to recruit and retain qualified 

men and women. We strongly and publicly support USERRA. In 

fact, during last year’s Postal Service’s Veterans Day ceremonies, 

our Postmaster General, Jack Potter, re-pledged our commitment 

by signing a statement of support for the Guard and Reserves. 

The Postal Service employs more than 212,000 veterans, including more than 70,000 who are disabled. And of that number, nearly 

18,000 have a disability rating of 30 percent or more. We have 

some 13,000 men and women who are proudly serving our country 

twice, both as Postal employees and as members of the Reserve 

components of the Armed Forces. Additionally, approximately 

30,000 other Postal Service employees completed their service in a 

Reserve component while working for the Postal Service and are 

members of the Retired Reserve. Since September 11, 8,000 of our 

employees have been called to duty to assist in the defense of the 

Nation in various capacities, both here and abroad. In fact, for the 

most recent two week pay period, more than 3,400 employees of the 

Postal Service were on military duty. That means approximately 

one-quarter of our entire Reserve component was on military duty 

during the first 2 weeks of July. 

These employees serving the Armed Forces receive military pay 

benefits like those provided by other federal agencies. And as in 

the administration of any Postal policy, the Postal Service has developed a number of pro-active steps to ensure both Reservists and 

our managers understand USERRA. For example, we have inhouse labor and human resource publications which highlight and 

explain our policies on a regular basis to those field personnel with 

the responsibility to see to it that they are properly implemented. 

This year we began offering very specific USERRA training to our 

human resource and labor relations specialists in the field. So far 

we have provided training to 125 of these specialists, and we intend to provide additional outreach education in 2004. 
21

Postal Service managers also keep in contact with the Department of Labor to review information and to obtain advice on applying USERRA in specific situations. We actively support the Employer Committee for support of the Guard and Reserve and maintain a liaison with its national office. We are also in the process 

of identifying and assigning a liaison to work with each of the 

ESGRs state committees. 

The Postal Service is the Nation’s second largest employer of 

men and women who also serve in the National Guard and Reserve. Clear communications with our employees is critical at every 

stage of the process if they are called up for service. We are constantly looking for ways to provide information quickly and conveniently to our employees. 

One tool is our Internet site, which lists a number of publications 

and has links to military affairs offices to assist our employees with 

any questions they may have about this very complex topic. Of 

course, our local personnel officers are also available to answer employee questions directly. 

In addition, our Employment and Placement Handbook defines 

very specifically how we administer USERRA. The handbook spells 

out our position very clearly. It states, and I quote, ‘‘The Postal 

Service supports employee service in Reserve or National Guard. 

And no action is permitted to discourage, either voluntarily or involuntary participation.’’ We have a standard operating procedure for all employees that 

we issue as they enter USERRA-covered military service. This includes providing them with a letter with very specific information 

providing detail about their leave, benefits, and status while on 

military duty. We work hard to accommodate their needs of our 

employees that are called to duty by our Nation’s military. We also 

provide support to their families, particularly those spouses which 

are struggling with the separate stresses. 

Our Employee Assistance Program offers a number of counseling 

options for employees and their family. And the Employee Assistance Program website has helpful information o a variety of topics 

related to military deployment and its effects on the family. 

We continually look for ways on how to improve the services we 

provide to our employees. And as we see ways to improve communications and programs for USERRA-covered employees, we continue to implement them nationwide. 

We will continue these efforts to assist employees who serve in 

the Guard and Reserve, both as co-workers and through our 

USERRA responsibilities. We don’t do this because it is mandated 

but because these are dedicated employees who deserve our full 

support and our commitment because of their dual duties on behalf 

of the American people. 

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. And I would be happy to address any 

questions you may have. 

[The prepared statement of Ms. LaChance appears on p. 77.] 

Mr. BROWN. Thank you, Ms. LaChance. And it proves that the 

Postal Service is a good corporate citizen, too. Thank you very 

much for your testimony. 

I also have some post-hearing questions that I will submit to 

each of you in writing regarding possible legislative changes to 
22

USERRA. I, too, came from the corporate world and I served some 

9 years in the National Guard. So I guess I have got kind of both 

sides, just like you, Mr. Rouse. We are grateful that you all would 

come and exemplify what true America is all about. 

Mr. Ryan, you are modest, sir. Forbes Magazine and ABC News 

recently named Schering-Plough as the number one company in 

America as far as doing right by it Reservists. Thank you for your 

leadership in getting that accomplished. 

Mr. RYAN. You are welcome. 

Mr. BROWN. Mr. Rouse, what is so impressive about Exxon and 

your 41 years of service, that speaks very highly of your longevity 

and your ‘‘stickability.’’ And your relationship—not your relationship, but Exxon’s relationship—with the Reservists goes back to 

World War II, and we are grateful for that longstanding and particularly effective relationship. That is pretty outstanding. Thank 

you for coming and testifying this morning. 

Bill, thank you very much for coming. I personally know what a 

great outstanding corporate citizen that SCANA is to our state. I 

commend your leadership, and particularly your service in Vietnam 

and knowing the handicaps that service personnel have, particularly returning back into the workforce. Thank you for your continued commitment to the service personnel who work for your company. And thanks for coming to Washington this morning. And particularly thank you for bringing Debbie with you. 

Mr. TIMMERMAN. Thank you very much, sir. I am honored to be 

here. 

Mr. BROWN. Ms. LaChance, you are part of an executive management team of the Postal Service that indeed is a nationwide, municipal corporation. The Postal Service’s website for spouses and 

Reservists is something I consider very helpful. In fact, I have 

asked my committee to link our website to your website. I appreciate your coming today and being a part of this process. It was 

amazing to learn that so many of your personnel, your retirees I 

guess or service personnel, 30 percent of them, have some disability. And so we are grateful for giving those people a second 

chance. 

Mr. Michaud, do you have any questions? 

Mr. MICHAUD. Thank you very much, Mr. Chairman. I, too, 

would like to thank the panel. You definitely are outstanding corporate citizens and we appreciate all that you do for our Reservists. 

You are all to be commended for what you do and you definitely 

do walk the talk. And I really appreciate that very much. 

I, too, Mr. Chairman, have some questions I will be submitting 

in writing as well. But I do want to say that, Mr. Timmerman, as 

you heard me say earlier in my comments about Chairman Brown, 

I have been in the Maine legislature for over 22 years, and what 

I said about the chairman earlier, I mean it. He definitely treats 

members of the minority on this committee exceptionally well. And 

he works very hard in a bipartisan manner to fight for veterans’ issues. And I wish other Members of Congress on both sides of the 

aisle would look at Mr. Brown as a true leader and emulate some 

of his actions in this committee. And you should be very proud of 

him in South Carolina for all that he does for South Carolina and 

for the veterans. 
23

So thank you, Mr. Chairman. 

Mr. BROWN. Thank you, Mr. Michaud. I certainly appreciate 

those remarks. And I can second that for you, too. It is absolutely 

a great pleasure to work with you. I have never known anybody 

from Maine before, but you certainly represent your state very, 

very well. And thank you for your cooperative spirit in working in 

this committee. 

Do we have any other questions? We have been joined by Congressman Miller from Florida. And Congressman Boozman from 

Arkansas. Do you all have any questions of the panel? And Ms. 

Susan Davis from the State of California. Glad to have you, Susan. 

Do you have any questions? 

Mrs. DAVIS. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I think I will just wait 

until the next panel, because unfortunately I missed it. Like all of 

us, I am doing twofold duty today. But I want to thank you again 

for being here. What we need to do is protect our brave Reservists 

and be sure that we take a look at the law and see what we can 

do differently. I didn’t have an opportunity to hear your testimony, 

but I appreciate your being here. 

Mr. BROWN. Thank you, Susan. It is absolutely a crazy process 

trying to logistically go to all the spots you are supposed to go to. 

I know I serve on three different committees, and I guess five different subcommittees. So it makes it almost impractical sometimes. 

I know that you notice around, you see some signs and empty 

chairs. It is not any disrespect to this panel or this committee. It 

is the fact that there is so much activity going on, it is difficult just 

to be at all those places you are supposed to. 

In fact, as we speak, if you hear a funny bell go off on the clock 

or anything, it means that we have to run over to the Capitol and 

vote. The House is actually in session, unlike in the state legislature, where we would actually go to the floor and sit and listen to 

the debate. Here, through the line of communication, we are able 

to monitor what is happening on the floor. Somebody on our staff, 

back in our offices, is actually tracking what is happening on the 

floor. So if we get called for a vote, know that we will need to leave. 

But anyway, thank you all for coming and being a part of this 

process. What a great testimony on what true corporate America 

is about. Thank you all. 

Mr. MILLER (presiding). Our first witness on the third panel this 

morning is Mr. Peter Perez. Mr. Perez is the senior vice president 

for human resources at W.W. Grainger, Inc., the largest supplier 

of facilities maintenance products in North America. Mr. Perez is 

in charge of all the human resource programs and functions at 

W.W. Grainger. 

Our next witness on this panel is Lt. Gen. Norman Lezy, an Air 

Force retiree and vice president for National Governmental Relations for Wal-Mart stores. In a minute I will turn to my good friend 

from Arkansas and member of this committee, John Boozman, who 

will introduce the General. In fact, I think I will do that now. John, 

would you introduce the General? 
24

OPENING STATEMENT OF HON. JOHN BOOZMAN, A REPRESENTATIVE IN CONGRESS FROM THE STATE OF ARKANSAS 

Mr. BOOZMAN. Well, thank you, Mr. Chairman, and the Ranking 

Member. I am very pleased to be part of the full committee. I don’t 

have the honor of being part of the Benefits Subcommittee. So 

thank you for allowing me to do that. 

And it really is an honor to have somebody that I not only enjoy 

working with but is also a very good friend. Lt. Gen. Norm Lezy 

is currently vice president of National Government Relations for 

Wal-Mart stores. Most importantly though, the General is a United 

States veteran. And Gen. Lezy honorable served this country for 34 

years in the U.S. Air Force. In his final assignment, he served as 

the deputy assistant secretary of Defense for military personnel 

policy at the Pentagon. He retired 5 years ago and has continued 

his commitment to serve people through hard work while representing well over a million Wal-Mart associates. 

Gen. Lezy joined Wal-Mart in May of 1999 as director of federal 

and international relations in Washington, DC. He was appointed 

to his current position in April 2000. He represents Wal-Mart with 

the executive branch, Congress, and foreign governments on legislative, regulatory, and legal issues in support of the company’s 

global business interests. 

Mr. Chairman, it has been an honor to be able to work with Gen. 

Lezy. He represents a company that is dedicated to serving the 

American public while successfully pursuing the American dream. 

Wal-Mart is an extremely generous corporation and a role model 

for other American businesses. I am sure the General’s testimony 

will be useful and insightful to the subcommittee. 

Thank you very much. 

Mr. MILLER. Thank you, John. And, unfortunately, another member of our panel, Mr. Jerome Carter, who is the senior vice president for Human Resources at International Paper, will not be testifying in person this morning. His flight out of Nashville was canceled. He will be submitting his testimony for the record. 

[The statement of Jerry Carter appears on p. 83.] 

Mr. MILLER. Mr. Perez, if you would, you may begin whenever 

you are ready. 

STATEMENTS OF PETER PEREZ, SENIOR VICE PRESIDENT, 

HUMAN RESOURCES, W.W. GRAINGER, INC. AND LT. GEN. 

NORMAND LEZY, (U.S. AIR FORCE, RETIRED), VICE PRESIDENT, NATIONAL GOVERNMENT RELATIONS, WAL-MART 

STORES, INC. 

STATEMENT OF PETER PEREZ 

Mr. PEREZ. Thank you. Distinguished members of the subcommittee, I am pleased to appear before you today on behalf of my 

employer, W.W. Grainger, Inc., to provide testimony on USERRA. 

I represent 15,000 employees throughout North America; some of 

them are currently on active duty on the Iraqi Freedom mission. 

We are proud of their service to our country, and we support their 

commitment to a safer, more peaceful future. 
25

Grainger is the largest supplier of facilities maintenance products in North America. Our products are not glamorous, but they 

are essential. They are the hammers, cleaning supplies, safety 

gear, and equipment that are crucial to keep facilities up and running. We are headquartered in Lake Forest, Illinois and have nearly 400 branches across the United States, with branches in every 

state in the Union. 

Supporting our Reservist personnel during not only this critical 

time but at all times is important to us as a company. Our commitment to them goes beyond what we consider to be our duty. 

Grainger is committed to helping them and their families because 

we have a deep respect and admiration for their selfless service to 

our country. 

Since September 11, nearly 40 Grainger employee Reservists 

have been called to duty. In total, there are 130 Reservists in our 

company and we are proud of every one of them. 

USERRA is an important measure to guarantee Reservist confidence. Grainger’s policy fully agrees with the spirit of this Act because it is designed to ensure financial security and well-being of 

not only the employee Reservist but, just as importantly, their families. We have extended benefits to these Reservists that is beyond 

that which is required by law. Our practice is to provide full benefits for up to 1 year. We provide full pay in addition to their military pay for up to a year for Reservists who are called to active 

duty. We also continue to provide group term life insurance and 

continue to make contributions into the retirement profit-sharing 

fund. And upon their return from active duty, employee Reservists 

are guaranteed the same or an equivalent job. 

As we all know, while Reservist members are often deployed to 

locales far from home, their hearts remain with their families. Of 

all the Reservists stationed abroad, 60 percent are married and 30 

percent have children. That means this is not just an issue with 

employees. It affects spouses, children, parents, and those Reservists hold dear, who are never far from their thoughts. 

To ease the financial hardships on our Reservist families, we believe it is important to provide health and dental coverage for eligible dependents of Reservists for up to one year. In addition, as time 

goes on, emotional strain can take its toll on the family and on the 

Reservists. We also offer family members access to our Employee 

Assistance Program, which offers a variety of services such as 

counseling, to be able to help. 

Over the last year, we have come to understand just how unique 

our program is. A survey conducted by the Reserve Officers’ Association of the United States cites Grainger one of three companies 

providing the most generous support to employees called into military duty. And Forbes recently recognized us among the top three 

employers for Reservists. Recently, Illinois Congressman Mark 

Kirk wrote to us to recognize our policy, stating that it ‘‘does much 

to boost troop morale and focus.’’

We know that it is Grainger that benefits the most from these 

policies, as we are able to attract and retain exceptional employees. 

We have a clear example in Orlando McGee. He is a dedicated Reservist who was called to action during the Gulf War. However, at 

the time he worked for a company that did not offer comparable 
26

benefits. And one of the reasons Orlando came to us is because of 

our Reservist policy. Today he is a safety analyst at our distribution center in Niles, IL. Our policy attracts quality employees like 

Orlando whose military experience only enhances their value to the 

company. 

Fellow Grainger employees also appreciate and respect military 

experience. We have a very positive response from our workforce 

to this policy and how we supported Reservists. When employee 

Reservists are called into service, Grainger employees ban together 

in support. It may include sharing duties and cross-training to 

cover responsibilities of the Reservist who left. 

Our pride extends to all Grainger employees, many of whom 

have been working hard over the last year to provide essential 

items to our troops. In fact, one of our San Diego account managers, Paul Bill, is currently stationed in Kuwait. He recently 

wrote to us to thank us for our benefits and support. Paul wrote, 

‘‘There is not a person in my unit of 125 that does not know I work 

for Grainger. We get our Gatorade, generators, boots, safety stuff, 

all from Grainger.’’ That makes a statement about the business impact of our policy. 

We will continue to support Paul and other activated Grainger 

Reservists. And we remain committed to examining our Reservist 

benefit program to determine whether or not we need to refine, revise, or extend our benefits to provide additional support to them. 

Grainger is committed to sending a clear message to our employees in the Armed Forces: While they are serving their country, they 

don’t have to worry about the financial support of their families or 

whether there will be a job for them when they return. 

We wish them well and pray for their continued health and safe 

return to their families and to us. 

Mr. Chairman, this concludes my statement. Thanks for your 

time and consideration. If you have any questions, I will be glad 

to answer them. 

[The prepared statement of Mr. Perez appears on p. 86.] 

Mr. MILLER. Thank you, Mr. Perez. I think what we will do is 

we will move to the General’s testimony and then give the members an opportunity to ask some questions after that. 

General, good to see you again, sir. 

STATEMENT OF LT. GEN. NORMAND LEZY 

Gen. LEZY. Good morning, Mr. Chairman, Congressman 

Michaud, and Congresswoman Davis. Thank you very much for giving Wal-Mart the opportunity to spend some time with you this 

morning to tell you a little bit about what we do for our Guard and 

Reservists, our treasured Wal-Mart associates. And it is really an 

honor to share this table with my new-found friend here from 

Grainger, as well as the other corporate members, who told you a 

little bit about what they do to take care of our troops in this great 

country of ours. 

Before I talk about Wal-Mart, just let me take a couple of seconds to thank you, each and every one of you on this subcommittee 

and also the members of the committee at large, the Veterans’ Affairs Committee. As my friend, Congressman Boozman told you, I 

had the pleasure and the honor of spending over 34 years in the 
27

United States—in your U.S. Air Force. My last job in NOSD was 

the military personnel policy guy. I really got a deep appreciation 

of what the committee has done to provide for the health, morale, 

and welfare of not only our troops but of equal importance to their 

families, our families. And I want to thank you for that. And want 

to convey to you from the Wal-Mart leadership that we really appreciate what you do in this very difficult job that you carry out 

each and every day as you serve this country of ours. 

At Wal-Mart we do share the same commitment that you have. 

And I have been working with the company, I am now in my fifth 

year. And I can tell you from our chairman, Mr. Rob Walton, to our 

CEO, Mr. Lee Scott, to the Wal-Mart leadership permeating down 

to we have got about 3,500 stores and Sam’s Clubs and about 100 

distribution centers around the continental United States, and I 

can tell you that everybody involved at Wal-Mart in a leadership 

position is a strong supporter of what the Guard and Reserves and 

our military is all about. We are deeply committed to trying to do 

what is right. 

Recognizing that—in fact, somebody asked me, ‘‘Well, how many 

Guard and Reservists do you have?’’ I can’t tell you. We don’t track 

them. But I can tell you though that in this year alone, we have 

1,200 of our associates who are on leave of absence serving either 

the Guard or the Reservists somewhere around the globe. 

You have heard some of the stories this morning from Michelle 

Dumond is a good example and from the lieutenant of what happens. And so at Wal-Mart we gave some thought to making sure 

that we do what is right, as I said. We basically follow the precepts 

of the law in all cases. But there is a couple of things we do that 

go beyond the law, much like my friends from the other companies 

enumerated. But I would just like to tell you about two of them. 

One is we certainly do the pay differential. We match the difference between the military pay and what the Wal-Mart pay is. 

And also recognizing that perhaps the second most important thing 

after pay is health, medical, and dental benefits. We make sure 

that those are continued uninterrupted and Wal-Mart picks up the 

majority of the tab for the premium. And we do this, by the way, 

not only for those that are deployed in an active duty role, also 

those who go to extended training camps, we do the same thing, 

provide the pay differential for them also. 

In addition to being concerned and really lay awake at night, 

thinking about what we can do to support our Guard and Reservists, we do spend a lot of time trying to figure out what it is we 

can do to help our Armed Services members, the active duty folks 

at large. Since 9/11, the Wal-Mart Foundation, and I am really 

proud of our Wal-Mart Foundation, it is run by a lovely woman 

named Betsy Reesemire, whose dad was a career Naval person. In 

fact, I need to mention Congressman Boozman, our third district’s 

Congressman’s dad was a career Air Force also. But we have given 

more than $3 million since 9/11 to the Navy, Marines, Army, Air 

Force, and Coast Guard relief and aid societies. We found that 

there was tremendous networking capability to reach out to help 

people like Michelle, who told you this gut-wrenching story here, 

to try to help families, particularly in really a time of need. 
28

So we find that it is a great vehicle and a way where we can 

channel money that we raise from our associates and from our customers and from the company to try to do what we can to help. We 

also provide funds to the USO. The USO does a great job of taking 

care of troops and their families. And we make sure that we want 

to take care of them. 

In concert with our friends of the VFW, I have been really impressed with what the VFW is doing for deployed troops and their 

families, as well as AT&T. We have bought well over $1 million 

worth of phone cards that we have distributed at least two times, 

maybe three. And we try to get a phone card to every single person 

that is deployed overseas so they can call home. We find that the 

troops and the families really appreciate that. 

At the local level, we have a network of some 3,500 stores and 

100 distribution centers, our associates in concert with our customers do lots of things to try to help out. We have outreach programs where we adopt families of those who are deployed to make 

sure that they are taken care of and get help when they need it. 

We provide lots of support to youth clubs, like Boys and Girls 

Clubs of America, who play a vital role in taking care of our kids 

when we are away from home and can help wives and husbands 

with those sorts of things. 

We do photos, Walls of Heroes, every one of our thousands, there 

are thousands of stories I could tell you about what we do to try 

to reach out and make our Armed Forces members and their families feel good about what is going on. 

The most recent thing we have gotten into, we have earmarked a $5 million grant. We will be doing this every year throughout our 

Foundation that will be aimed at civic groups, such as the Rotary 

Club, and also veterans’ organizations, such as the American Legion, VFW, and et cetera, where we will award grants around the 

country through our stores to try to help particularly the veterans’ organizations. They will be getting the lion’s share of the monies 

going out to our stores and our clubs to help veteran organizations 

to take care of them. 

I could go on and on. And, again, it is pleasure to sit here and 

listen to big and small companies who really are doing what is 

right in this great country of ours to take care of those who serve. 

And we are proud to be a small part of that. And, again, we thank 

you for giving us the opportunity to be here today. And I am ready 

to answer any questions that you might have. 

[The prepared statement of General Lezy appears on p. 93.] 

Mr. BROWN. Thank you, General. I will have questions for you 

folks as well and I will submit them to each of you in writing regarding possible legislative changes to USERRA. 

Mr. Perez, apart from Grainger’s very responsive personnel policies, you also help Reservists’ family members through your Employee Assistance Program. And that is pretty impressive. Thank 

you very much for coming and sharing that this morning. 

Gen. Lezy, what can I say about Wal-Mart? I think it touches the 

lives of every American, and we are grateful for your support of our 

Reservists and military, and particularly for the $5 million that 

you mentioned that goes to the Servicemen’s Aid Society. That 

speaks volumes about your company and your corporate commit-
29

ment. Thank you very much for coming and giving your testimony 

this morning. We will send you a list of those questions. We want 

to be sure that USERRA is working and is something that you all 

can fit in. A lot of corporations don’t suggest impovements but if 

there are some parts of current flaw that do need improvement, we 

certainly want to do that. 

Mr. Michaud, do you have any questions? 

Mr. MICHAUD. Thank you, Mr. Chair. I, too, want to thank both 

you gentlemen for your outstanding efforts when it comes to veterans’ issues. I really appreciate how you do treat the Reservists. 

Also, General, I would like to thank Wal-Mart for your assistance 

in the State of Maine. I know the biggest employer in my district 

when it filed bankruptcy and shut its doors, we have over 38 percent unemployment and Wal-Mart was very helpful in assisting the 

displaced workers there. So I want to thank you for your assistance. 

And I, too, Mr. Chairman, have some post-hearing questions I 

will submit in writing. Thank you. 

Mr. BROWN. Did Mrs. Davis leave? Okay, gentlemen, thank you 

very much for coming. 

Mr. Perez, aren’t there some members of the Grainger team with 

you today? 

Mr. PEREZ. Yes, Mark Plesby and Renee Young. 

Mr. BROWN. Thank you all for coming. 

I am delighted to welcome Assistant Secretary Juarbe, who has 

dedicated his career to serving veterans. He is accompanied by Col. 

Alan Smith, a distinguished career Marine Corps officer who directs the National Committee for the Employer Support for the 

Guard and Reserve. 

Secretary Juarbe, please begin. 

STATEMENT OF FREDERICO JUARBE, JR., ASSISTANT SECRETARY FOR VETERANS’ EMPLOYMENT AND TRAINING 

SERVICE, DEPARTMENT OF LABOR; ACCOMPANIED BY COL. 

ALAN R. SMITH, DIRECTOR, MILITARY MEMBER SUPPORT, 

NATIONAL COMMITTEE FOR THE EMPLOYER SUPPORT OF 

THE GUARD AND RESERVE 

Mr. JUARBE. Good morning, Mr. Chairman. If I may, before I 

begin my prepared comments, I would like to just make a couple 

of observations. 

First of all, I think it is very meaningful that you have had this 

hearing today and have given an opportunity for these witnesses 

to speak. And I value my opportunity to have heard directly from 

them. We have heard from employer witnesses who speak about 

their value of the Guard and Reservists and veterans who are their 

employees. We have heard from the advocacy witnesses, Col. Bob 

North, in who I personally rely on tremendously, for their input 

and their guidance in directing how we—in gauging—how we are 

providing services. I think most importantly, we have heard from 

the employee witnesses and also family witnesses. And I can’t help 

but feel that, from everything that I have heard here today, Congress, in its wisdom, constructed a law that is comprehensive and 

far-reaching. And what we have heard here today is good news, 
30

tempered of course, by the eloquent expression of the poignant experience that Mrs. Dumond is experiencing. 

But USERRA works. And USERRA works because—not only because it is comprehensive but because America’s Guards and Reservists and its veterans represent the best of qualities that employers are seeking and employers value them. And USERRA also 

works because America’s businesses and America’s employers are 

responsive and they value those employees. So I want to express 

my appreciation for the previous witnesses and my commendations 

to the excellent support that Guards and Reservists are receiving. 

Mr. Chairman and Ranking Member Michaud and other distinguished members of the House Veterans’ Affairs Subcommittee on 

Benefits, the Department of Labor is pleased to have this opportunity to provide comments on USERRA, the Uniformed Services 

Employment and Reemployment Rights Act. We face an enormous 

challenge enforcing USERRA, a law that had been very much in 

the news for nearly 2 years. Since September 11, 2001, almost 

300,000 members of the Guard and Reserve have been called to 

serve in operations globally. Approximately 200,000 of these citizen-soldiers remain on active duty today. USERRA provides reemployment rights and prohibits employers discrimination against 

veterans and Reservists on account of their military service or obligations. 

USERRA’s roots go back to the 1940 Veterans’ Reemployment 

Rights law. USERRA enforcement follows two legal principles, the 

law should be interpreted to benefit those it protects, the returning 

servicemembers to be reemployed in the position he or she would 

have occupied had employment continued during the period of service, the Escalator Principle. When USERRA was enacted on October 13, 1994, the overarching goal of Congress was, as stated in the 

House report, ‘‘to clarify, simplify, and where necessary strengthen 

the existing veterans employment and reemployment rights provision.’’ With USERRA experiencing its greatest test ever during the current national security challenge, I can tell you that your goal was 

accomplished. As compared the VRR, USERRA is clear. It is simple. And it is strong. 

Let me review the USERRA experiences and activities, particularly since September 11, 2001. Since enactment in October 1994, 

we have reported to this committee on the administration and enforcement of USERRA. For Fiscal Years 1995 through 2001, 

USERRA cases steadily declined. I have submitted a written statement for the record that includes detailed statistics and supporting 

information. 

As expected, following the large-scale mobilizations resulting 

from the tragic events of September 11, we saw an increase of just 

under 35 percent of new cases over Fiscal Year 2001. It should be 

noted, however, that this increase was not proportional to the number of men and women of the Guard and Reserves called to duty. 

By June 30, 2003, we had opened 953 cases. And we expect more 

when those now serving are released in large numbers. 

Secretary Chao has made compliance assistance a priority for the 

entire Department, and USERRA is a major part of that effort. The 

Department’s Office of the Solicitor has provided comprehensive 
31

support in addressing technical questions. The Wage and Hour Division of Employment Services Administration has been instrumental in formulating a policy that for activated Reservists, active 

duty time is counted towards eligibility to take time off from work 

under the Family and Medical Leave Act. This position was articulated in a joint memorandum signed by the Solicitor, the wage and 

hour administrator, and myself. The Employment Benefits Security 

Administration has also been extremely helpful in providing information concerning pension benefits. And there have been a number 

of other offices within the Department that have also been very 

supportive. 

Outside the Department, efforts by the National Committee for 

Employer Support of the Guard and Reserves are extraordinary. 

With their small national staff and over 4,000 volunteers nationwide, they promote understanding between employers and their 

Reservist employees and help informally resolve disputes. I am 

pleased to have their representative, Col. Al Smith, with me as a 

witness today. 

Overall, the Nation’s employer community is overwhelmingly 

supportive of their employees in the ongoing mobilization. Since 9/

11 we have responded to over 15,000 requests for information and 

have provided USERRA presentations to more than 91,000 people 

nationwide, including mobilized Guard and Reserve units, employers and employer groups, including the U.S. Chamber of Commerce 

and the Society for Human Resource Management. 

Secretary Chao, as well as my staff and I, have participated in 

webcasts, radio broadcasts, newspaper interviews, and television 

appearances to help get the USERRA message out. 

Finally, I want to mention that Secretary Chao has made the decision for the Department to begin drafting proposed regulations 

that will be promulgated for USERRA. I expect these will provide 

clear and consistent guidance for all employers and 

servicemembers and will greatly help our compliance efforts. 

In summary, the Department of Labor will continue to inform 

employers about USERRA. And we will continue protecting the reemployment rights of our servicemembers. 

Mr. Chairman, Mr. Michaud, that concludes my statement. I will 

be happy to answer any questions you may have. 

[The prepared statement of Mr. Juarbe appears on p. 94.] 

Mr. BROWN. Thank you, Mr. Juarbe. We notice you had to make 

a lot of changes in your schedule to be with us today, and we appreciate your testimony and certainly give our regards to Secretary 

Chao. We appreciate her efforts and cooperation the other day as 

we met with her and Secretary Rumsfeld to sign that memorandum of understanding. 

Mr. JUARBE. Well, if I may, Mr. Chairman, that event and that 

effort, the Joint Memorandum between the Department of Defense 

and the Department of Labor underscores the focus that this administration has on not just supporting our military, not just supporting veterans but improving the quality of life for the military 

and veterans with the very issue that is being addressed here 

today. 

Mr. BROWN. Well, I know it is a major concern of our leader, 

President Bush. In fact, we had the privilege yesterday to visit 
32

with him on the Truman Porch and he certainly is talking about 

the many issues around the world where all the fighters are and 

the concerns of his to try to bring peace to those countries, particularly where so many citizens are under hardships everyday. We are 

grateful to have him as our leader. Thank you for coming and 

being a part of this today. 

Col. Smith, did you have any comments? 

Col. SMITH. I have no prepared remarks, Mr. Chairman. But on 

my desk yesterday arrived a request. And the request was written 

so well that I thought I would take this opportunity to follow 

through on that. The request came from four folks. One from Maj. 

Joe Grubacki, U.S. Air Force Reserve. And he wanted you to know 

that he has put you in for an ESGR as My Boss is a Patriot Award. 

Maj. John Gallagher, U.S. Air Force Reserve, for Representative 

Miller, who has left, but he has put in for My Boss is a Patriot 

Award, for Representative Davis, Cdr. Michael Valasquez, U.S. 

Navy Reserve, and for Representative Sylvestre Reyes, Petty Officer Golyamo Valenzeula, U.S. Navy Reserve. 

And I think those awards are pretty important. They are just 

saying from the individual soldier, sailor, Airman, Marine, or Coast 

Guardsman is that it is important that the employment situation 

and the defense goes both ways. And I think that is a pat on the 

back to all of you. 

Mr. BROWN. Thank you. And certainly Joe Glebocki, I guess colonel now, maybe, or is it major, is a great asset to our office. He 

came as a fellow and worked a year. And now he is—this week he 

is somewhere in Europe as part of his Reserve training. But he is 

an outstanding individual, and we certainly are glad to have him 

part of our team. I thank you for those remarks, and I certainly 

will thank him for that recommendation. 

Mr. Juarbe, I will send you some recommendations for legislative 

revisions to USERRA proposed by the Military Coalition. Would 

you please submit DOL’s views on these recommendations within 

30 days? 

Mr. JUARBE. Yes, Mr. Chairman, we will. 

Mr. BROWN. And Col. Smith, does USERRA need tweeking or an 

overhaul? How have employers and servicemembers reacted to mobilization and/or training duty in terms of USERRA? 

Col. SMITH. Mr. Chairman, at ESGR during Fiscal Year 2001, we 

had about 11,000 requests for assistance. The following year we hit 

17,000. This year we are fully expecting between 20,000 and 22,000 

calls for assistance with USERRA. 

What I think is important is that this is really, and I think Secretary Juarbe used these words, this is its real test. This is the 

first time since it has—since 1994 with revisions of 1996 and 1998, 

that it is actually being put to the test other than just drill weekends and annual training. Right now, we are dealing with situations that are long-term mobilizations. There are mobilizations that 

don’t happen once. There are mobilization, de-mobilization and 

then a second event. Mobilization unlike Desert Storm, where it 

was a quick six month hit. They were mobilized very quickly, went 

off to war, returned, and then were back to the workforce. 

That is not the case now. Now we have one year, two year mobilizations. We have a different ball of wax. And what I can tell you 
33

is from the calls that I get and from my ombudsmen in the field, 

we have 500 ombudsmen out in the states, is that their sense is 

that the USERRA is broad enough to handle the multiple types of 

inquiries that we get, yet narrow enough to handle each individual 

servicemember and employer. And of all those calls that I explained to you, about 34 percent of those are from employers. 

Mr. BROWN. Thank you. Col. Smith, since we have Congressman 

Miller back, do you want to repeat what you—— Col. SMITH. Certainly, Mr. Chairman. Representative Miller, 

Maj. John Gallagher, U.S. Air Force Reserve, has put you in for, 

and you will be so awarded at a later date, the My Boss is a Patriot 

Award. And that is clearly a statement of how he feels about you 

and your cooperation with his Reserve service. 

Mr. MILLER. Mr. Chairman? I obviously was not expecting any 

type of recognition. Maj. Gallagher is an integral part of the team 

in our office. He happens to be a hurricane hunter and has been 

on active duty. He was called up and is now, hopefully, on his way 

home to Keysler and will be returning to the office very soon. And 

I certainly am honored with this. And we are doing our best to do 

our job and support our men and women in what they are doing. 

And we appreciate, sir, also what you do and Mr. Juarbe, also. 

Mr. BROWN. Thank you. Mr. Juarbe, I know that you had a 

chance to speak to Ms. Dumond, and I hope that you will be able 

to help in her situation. 

Mr. JUARBE. Yes, Mr. Chairman. In fact, I am pleaed to report 

that my state director for veterans’ employment and training, John 

Guay, is already working with Ms. Dumond, and we will be following it very, very closely from my office. 

Mr. BROWN. Thank you so very much. Mr. Michaud. 

Mr. MICHAUD. Thank you very much, Mr. Chair. I have some 

post-hearing questions I will submit in writing but I would like to 

actually ask two brief ones right now to the Assistant Secretary. 

One, you had mentioned about the beginning drafting regulation. 

My first question is when do you think that will be done? My second question is you talked about the compliance assistance as a 

priority of the Department. Does your Department have the resources, ability or inclination to aggressively enforce USERRA? 

Mr. JUARBE. On the first question, Mr. Michaud, as you can well 

understand, USERRA is a comprehensive law and the drafting of 

regulations is quite a project. The Solicitor of Labor’s office has 

been working diligently for some time now in drafting those regulations. They hope to have them completed for us to issue a Notice 

of Proposed Rulemaking towards the end of this year. And since it 

affects all employers in America, they will be provided ample opportunity for comment and response. And we hope then to issue the 

final rules towards the end of the following year 2004. 

On the second question, compliance assistance has been an emphasis that Secretary Chao has placed on all of the Department. 

And we have taken on that effort with a major commitment. The 

outreach efforts that we have carried out this year are representative of that. We have requested the resources necessary to execute 

the claims. We have estimated the number of claims. We have projected the rate of growth of those claims and have requested the 

resourcs to do that. 
34

In addition, Mr. Michaud, we are constantly reviewing how we 

do our job and how we can do it better, what training is required 

by our staff, how can we have the most skilled people doing the 

most critical parts of that effort. All of our state staff will be prepared to do the initial investigative work and we are preparing a 

team that will do the more sophisticated and more detailed levels 

of work so that we can offer the highest levels of expertise in addressing USERRA claims. 

Mr. MICHAUD. Great. Thank you very much. 

Mr. BROWN. Col. Smith, I am going to put you back on again. 

Mrs. Davis just came back in. Did you want to make some notation 

of that? 

Col. SMITH. Sure. 

Mr. BROWN. Okay. 

Col. SMITH. Representative Davis, Cdr. Michael Valasquez, U.S. 

Navy Reserve, has put you in for, and you will be awarded, a My 

Boss is a Patriot Award. It is again a demonstration of your support of his military support and his appreciation for that. 

Mrs. DAVIS. Thank you very much. I appreciate that. I have really been honored to have Mr. Valasquez working with me. And it 

has been very special to have his past experience and the kind of 

relationships that he has built up over the years. I think we all 

know how much that makes a difference in our ability to do our 

job here. And so I think him and I thank you. I appreciate it. 

Thank you. 

Mr. BROWN. Do you have any questions, Mrs. Davis? Do you 

have any questions? 

Mrs. DAVIS. Well, perhaps you have already addressed this. But 

I am wondering about the impact that a turn down in the economy 

has in your ability to make sure and maintain that people can go 

back to their jobs or at least be put in comparable positions. Perhaps you have addressed that. But greater challenges do you see 

and is it a problem? 

Mr. JUARBE. These are very real challenges, Mrs. Davis. Of 

course, USERRA provides protection through the seniority provision within the Act; it would protect Guards and Reservists who 

would be eligible to retain their jobs had they been on the job during the layoffs or during the down-scaling of any workforce, had 

they been given an opportunity to take a lower position or transfer 

to another location, they still have to be considered the same as if 

they had been there. And they would be protected by that. 

But having said that, we do recognize that there are some that 

will come back and their former employers will no longer be there 

and their position may have been abolished. And that is why we 

are prepared with the full resources of the Department of Labor 

and the Veterans Employment and Training Service through our 

LVERs and DVOPs to provide employment and training assistance 

services. 

As you know, under the Jobs for Veterans Act, which this committee sponsored and brought to fruition, you provide priority of 

services for veterans in all Department of Labor employment and 

training programs. 

Secretary Chao and the entire Department has taken on that effort with major commitment. This very week and last week we 
35

have been running a series of conferences in Denver, Colorado with 

all state workforce agency representatives and my state staff in 

preparation for the full implementation of that law. And I can tell 

you, Mrs. Davis, that there is a high-level of excitement, not just 

among my staff but among the state workforce agencies because of 

the greater flexibility that you have allowed them. And that we are 

truly working as effective partners to maximize the effectiveness of 

the resources we have to serve America’s veterans. And Guards 

and Reservists that are eligible as veterans now also will be provided services through transition assistance workshops. 

Albeit it is much more difficult to capture them for these workshops because some of them are discharged within very short periods of times or they are not all at one location like we have at 

bases. But we are working in trying to provide them with the workshops that are available through transition assistance. 

Mrs. DAVIS. Thank you. I appreciate that. Is it possible to characterize that 10 percent, 20 percent are just very difficult to be successful with? 

Mr. JUARBE. Are you saying about what percentage of those that 

are losing their jobs? 

Mrs. DAVIS. Yes. 

Mr. JUARBE. I don’t have that information right now but if it is 

available, I will certainly make it available to the committee. 

Mrs. DAVIS. Thank you. I certainly appreciate the work that you 

all do. Thank you very much, and thank you for being here. 

Mr. JUARBE. Thank you. 

Mr. BROWN. Mr. Juarbe, as we look at the regulations, I believe 

that USERRA protects the jobs up to 2 years, is that correct? 

Col. SMITH. Sir, could you rephrase the question again, please? 

Mr. BROWN. The amount of time that the job is protected if a Reservist goes on active duty, I see somebody raising a five, I assume 

that is 5 years. 

Col. SMITH. Yes, sir. USERRA protects up to 5 years of military 

service. 

Mr. BROWN. Okay. 

Col. SMITH. Service during a presidential call-up or any kind of 

call up does not count toward those 5 years. 

Mr. BROWN. Okay, all right. Thank you. I believe Congressman 

Miller has a question. 

Mr. MILLER. No questions, sir. But at the appropriate time I 

have two introductions I would like to make. 

Mr. BROWN. Okay, if there are no further questions, go ahead 

and do that. 

Mr. MILLER. Thank you. You often hear me talk about serving 

one of the finest congressional districts in the country. And with 

me today, I just want to introduce two of the constituents that I 

have the great pleasure and honor of representing. In fact, we just 

happen to be sitting in my office talking about some issues when 

the call came to come back to the committee room. So with the panel’s indulgence and the folks in the audience, if you would, I would 

like to introduce retired Lt. Col. Robert Renley. And I am going to 

ask them both to stand in just a second. But I will introduce them 

both and then ask them to stand up. 
36

Col. Renley served in the Army and Air Force between 1942 and 

1967. He is a 25-year veteran. He flew 30 missions as a B–17 navigator over Europe during World War II, including three missions 

over Normandy on D–Day. He is a veteran of not only World War II but Korea and Vietnam. He has spent about $15,000 of his own 

money for medical care during the years after which coverage was 

withdrawn. And he and countless other veterans of World War II 

and Korea are currently fighting another battle, not against the 

Axis powers but ironically against our own government. And he is 

a lead plaintiff in the class action lawsuit whereby World War II 

vets are trying to get a promise restored for lifetime free health 

care benefits. 

The other individual that is with him is probably no stranger or 

the name is certainly no strange name to this committee. But Col. 

George E. ‘‘Bud’’ Day, retired. Col. Day is a veteran of more than 

30 years of service in the Armed Services of the United States. He 

was shot down over North Vietnam on August 26, 1967 and spent 

67 months as a prisoner of war. Col. Day was the only POW to escape from prison in the South. He is also credited with living 

through the first no-shoot bailout from a burning jet fighter in England in 1955. 

Col. Day holds every significant combat award and is the Nation’s most highly decorated officer, as well as the most decorated 

since Gen. Douglas MacArthur. He holds nearly 70 military decorations and awards, of which more than 50 are for combat. He is a 

member of the Medal of Honor Society, Legion of Valor, and was 

the first president of Nam POWs, president of the Misty Superfac 

Association and a member of numerous military and fraternal organizations. Col. Day was a member of the Code of Conduct Review 

Board established by DOD in 1976 to review POW conduct. 

I would like to introduce you both, Col. Renley and Col. Day. (Applause.) 

Mr. BROWN. Thank you very much, gentlemen, for your service 

to this great country. In fact, we were honored last week to have 

the Band of Brothers come by. That is the 101st Airborne troops 

who landed in Normandy. And we are grateful, we are grateful. We 

say all the time, if you enjoy your freedom, thank a veteran. And 

so thank you all very, very much. 

Gentlemen, thank you for being here today with us. And I would 

also like to note that we will be receiving testimony for the record 

from the veterans’ service organizations, Mrs. Lynn Guimond, the 

spouse of a mobilized Reservists and various businesses. 

All of the witnesses this morning have provided a wealth of information. And I want to thank you all very much, all the witnesses, 

for coming. 

If there is no other business, we stand adjourned. 

[Whereupon, at 11:35 a.m., the subcommittee was adjourned.] 
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A P P E N D I X 
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WRITTEN COMMITTEE QUESTIONS AND THEIR RESPONSES
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