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S. HRG. 111–873 

IN CRITICAL CONDITION: THE URGENT NEED 

TO REFORM THE INDIAN HEALTH SERVICE’S 

ABERDEEN AREA 

HEARING 

BEFORE THE

COMMITTEE ON INDIAN AFFAIRS 

UNITED STATES SENATE 

ONE HUNDRED ELEVENTH CONGRESS 

SECOND SESSION 

SEPTEMBER 28, 2010 

Printed for the use of the Committee on Indian Affairs 

( 

(II) 

COMMITTEE ON INDIAN AFFAIRS 

BYRON L. DORGAN, North Dakota, Chairman 

JOHN BARRASSO, Wyoming, Vice Chairman 

DANIEL K. INOUYE, Hawaii 

KENT CONRAD, North Dakota 

DANIEL K. AKAKA, Hawaii 

TIM JOHNSON, South Dakota 

MARIA CANTWELL, Washington 

JON TESTER, Montana 

TOM UDALL, New Mexico 

AL FRANKEN, Minnesota 

JOHN MCCAIN, Arizona 

LISA MURKOWSKI, Alaska 

TOM COBURN, M.D., Oklahoma 

MIKE CRAPO, Idaho 

MIKE JOHANNS, Nebraska 

ALLISON C. BINNEY, Majority Staff Director and Chief Counsel 

DAVID A. MULLON JR., Minority Staff Director and Chief Counsel 

(III) 

C O N T E N T S 

Page 

Hearing held on September 28, 2010 ..................................................................... 1 

Statement of Senator Dorgan ................................................................................. 1 

Statement of Senator Franken ............................................................................... 6 

Statement of Senator Johnson ................................................................................ 7 

WITNESSES

His Horse Is Thunder, Ron, Executive Director, Great Plains Tribal Chairmen’s Health Board ............................................................................................. 32 

Prepared statement .......................................................................................... 35 

Red Thunder, Charlene, M.S., Area Director, Aberdeen Area Indian Health 

Service ................................................................................................................... 17 

Prepared statement .......................................................................................... 18 

Roubideaux, Yvette, M.D., M.P.H., Director, Indian Health Services ................. 9 

Prepared statement .......................................................................................... 11 

Roy, Gerald, Deputy Inspector General for Investigations, Office of Inspector 

General, U.S. Department of Health and Human Services .............................. 20 

Prepared statement .......................................................................................... 22 

APPENDIX

Dorgan, Hon. Byron L., report dated December 28, 2010 .................................... 50 

Garcia, Gerard P., Psy.D., Licensed Psychologist, prepared statement .............. 46 

Miller, Dr. Steven, Business Manager, Indian Health Service National Council Laborers’ International Union of North America, prepared statement ...... 46 

Response to written questions submitted to Gerald Roy by: 

Hon. John Barrasso .......................................................................................... 119 

Hon. Byron L. Dorgan ...................................................................................... 117 

Warne, Donald, MD, MPH, Senior Policy Advisor, Great Plains Tribal Chairmen’s Health Board, prepared statement .......................................................... 43 

Written questions submitted to: 

Charlene Red Thunder ..................................................................................... 120 

Yvette Roubideaux, M.D., M.P.H. ................................................................... 122 

(1) 

IN CRITICAL CONDITION: THE URGENT NEED 

TO REFORM THE INDIAN HEALTH 

SERVICE’S ABERDEEN AREA 

TUESDAY, SEPTEMBER 28, 2010 

U.S. SENATE, 

COMMITTEE ON INDIAN AFFAIRS, 

Washington, DC. 

The Committee met, pursuant to notice, at 10 o’clock a.m. in 

room 628, Dirksen Senate Office Building, Hon. Byron L. Dorgan, 

Chairman of the Committee, presiding. 

OPENING STATEMENT OF HON. BYRON L. DORGAN, 

U.S. SENATOR FROM NORTH DAKOTA 

The CHAIRMAN. I am going to call the hearing to order. This is 

a hearing of the Indian Affairs Committee. 

Today we are going to hold an oversight hearing entitled In Critical Condition: The Urgent Need to Reform the Indian Health Service’s Aberdeen Area. We have focused, as many in this room know, 

on an investigation of the Aberdeen Area of the Indian Health 

Service. Two months ago, this Committee began this formal investigation. I initiated this investigation with the consent of the Committee after years of hearing about poor performance and mismanagement within the Area. 

The investigation has focused on facilities operated by the IHS 

over the past five years especially, and today’s hearing is going to 

discuss some of the initial finds and will give us the opportunity 

to hear from the Director of the IHS and others and understand 

what the Agency is doing at this point to address the problems. 

Many of the allegations heard throughout these years were substantiated in the investigation. The Committee found increasingly 

high numbers of EEOC complaints and other workforce grievances 

being filed in this region, transfers and administrative leave commonly being used as a remedy for problem employees, doctors and 

nurses treating patients with expired licenses and certifications, 

several facilities on the brink of losing their accreditation or certification, frequent diversion of healthcare services and substantial 

amounts of missing or stolen narcotics, questionable management 

of contract health service funds, and mismanagement of billing 

Medicare, Medicaid or other private insurers. 

I recognize these problems are not new and, in fact, have festered in some cases for decades. I know Director Roubideaux and 

Aberdeen Director Red Thunder inherited many of these problems 

2 

and only had a short time to address them. I believe, however, that 

it will take more than two Directors to make significant change to 

the system and it is my hope that Secretary Sebelius will make improving the Indian Health Service a priority during her tenure. We 

have met and talked about that and she has given me that commitment. 

Let me say there are clearly many dedicated and hardworking 

employees in the Aberdeen Area working for Indian Health Service. 

I recognize that. I have said it publicly. I want it to be said again 

today. There are people I am sure working in the units who got up 

this morning and all they care about is treating patients. God bless 

them for their good work. This is not to cast aspersions on dedicated, loyal, good people who are working today in the Indian 

Health System. Lives are being saved because of their work. 

But, it is the case and I know it to be the case and I have 

watched the Indian Health Service juggle all of these things 

around, that there are poor performing employees who, in my judgment, ill serve the very patients they are supposed to help. And I 

am convinced that problem employees are able to wreak havoc and 

demoralize those who fight so hard to provide quality healthcare. 

And I just think it is time to stop. 

We found instances of employees working under impaired conditions, in some cases perhaps under the influence of alcohol. In one 

horrendous incident, a nurse was found to be assisting in a C-section in such an impaired state that she could not even hold the patient’s skin for staples. And the nurse kept her job following this 

incident. 

In 2002, this goes back some while, the former Service Unit Director of the Quentin Burdock Memorial Hospital was found by the 

Inspector General, the Office of the Inspector General, to have a 

pattern of mismanagement, discrimination and retaliation against 

employees, resulting in grievances and unwarranted civil suits. 

This is the report by the Inspector General. 

Though several suits against this Director cost the Agency over 

$106,000, despite this the Service Unit Director did not receive a 

demotion or a suspension and in fact was reassigned to the Aberdeen Area office only to retire seven years later in 2009. 

Sadly, this Committee found many, many more stories just like 

this one. Some employees repeatedly engaging in bad behavior or 

even illegal activity facing little or no disciplinary action. Instead, 

administrative leave or transferring employees is a solution. 

The Committee found that 176 employees in the Aberdeen Area 

were placed on paid administrative leave in the past five years for 

a period of times that totals eight years. This chart will show the 

paid administrative leave at three facilities in the Aberdeen Region, Aberdeen, Sisseton and I cannot see the third, I guess it is 

Winnebago. 

[The information referred to follows:] 

3 

Employees Placed on Administrative Leave: Aberdeen Area, 2005–2010 

Service Unit 

Number of 

Employees on 

Administrative Leave 

Average Length of Administrative Leave 

Belcourt 22 Nearly 1.5 Months 

Sisseton 11 Nearly 1 Month 

Winnebago 13 Nearly 3 Weeks 

Source: Indian Health Service 

The CHAIRMAN. The Committee found that in some cases a single 

individual was placed on administration leave for over eight 

months due to a pending investigation. I do not understand why 

the Federal Government would pay someone for eight months to 

stay home while something is being investigated. 

The number of EEOC, Equal Employment Opportunity complaints in the Aberdeen Area has increased dramatically in the 

past five years. I hope my colleagues will look at this chart. 

[The information referred to follows:] 

The CHAIRMAN. This chart shows the number of EEOC complaints being filed year by year in the Aberdeen Area. It has increased dramatically. Even worse, the number of complaints filed 

in the Aberdeen Area filed by July of this year has surpassed the 

number filed for the entire Agency in 2009. This problem is not getting any better. It is getting worse. 

Additionally, five Agency facilities in the Aberdeen Area are at 

risk of losing their accreditation, that according to information that 

we have received. That is Chart Number 3. 


928a1.eps
4 

[The information referred to follows:] 

The CHAIRMAN. If accreditation is lost, these facilities would be 

unable to bill Medicaid, Medicare or other insurers. 

Finally, these problems have also resulted in diverted healthcare 

services where a facility that would normally be able to take patients is no longer able to provide a service and must send a patient outside to obtain care. This fourth chart, I am running 

through these quickly, I am sorry, this fourth chart shows facilities 

in the Aberdeen Area that have recurring diverted or reduced services. 

[The information referred to follows:] 

Reduced or Diverted Health Care Services: Aberdeen Area, 2007–2010 

Facility Name Reduced or Diverted Services 

Belcourt—Quentin Burdick Memorial Hospital 

(ND) 

388 Days 

Rapid City Hospital (SD) 385 Days 

Eagle Butte Hospital (SD) 242 Days 

Source: Indian Health Service 

The CHAIRMAN. From 2007 to 2010, the Quentin Burdock Hospital in North Dakota diverted or reduced services 388 days, 45 

percent of the time patients could not receive certain inpatient 

services at that hospital. The Rapid City IHS Hospital Eagle Butte 

Service also had hundreds of days of reduced or diverted services 

in the last three years. 

The result of this is summed up well in a statement by an internal Agency document referring to its hospital in Rapid City, South 

Dakota. And here is what that statement said. Again, this is an internal document. If a patient needs to be seen today, they must 

start calling daily at 8:00 a.m. to try to secure an appointment 


928a2.eps
5 

time. If the line is busy, they must keep trying, like a radio station 

giving away a prize. If the patient is lucky, they will secure an appointment. 

[The information referred to follows:] 

Scheduling medical appointments should not be like trying to 

win a lottery on a radio station. 

Let me just make a final comment. Ms. Red Thunder, you and 

I met at a hospital, the Quentin Burdock Hospital in Belcourt, I 

think it was a year and a half or two years ago now. I went there 

and sat around a table and spent a fair amount of time listening 

to everybody because it was dysfunctional, unbelievably dysfunctional. 

It has now had six, six Directors for that hospital, in two years. 

Some of those were just Active Directors, but six of them, and the 

seventh will start this next month as I understand it. Everyone understands how unbelievably bankrupt that is for an institution to 

have seven Directors in two years. 

You and I, I met you at that hospital because I said and believed 

at the time that Indians were being dis-served. These are people 

who expect good healthcare service and were not getting it, children, elders, and it was dysfunctional. In my judgment, nothing 

has changed in two years. 

I do not call you all here to decide to say that the whole system 

is bankrupt, but I am determined, one at a time, to find out what 

is going on first with this Service District because I think it has 

not worked at all. You have seen the numbers. Anybody can justify 

to me what we are seeing in these, all these complaints and the 

stories I have just described? It is unbelievable and it has to stop. 

Now, we have sent demand letters. I know there have been concerns that we have asked for too much information. Anything we 


928a3.eps
6 

did not get, or will not get or do not get, we will subpoena. We intend to get all of the information and make judgments about it. 

Ms. Roubideaux, you were confirmed by this Committee, supported by me and the Committee. We did that because we believe 

you have the capability to fix this. But I told you the day that you 

were before this Committee that this is a mess, and a big problem, 

and a big bureaucracy that does not want to change. It wants to 

not deal with problems. It wants to ship them to the next Reservation, the next Service Unit. That has got to stop and it is going to 

stop now. 

Let me call on my colleagues for brief comments and then I will 

proceed to the witnesses. 

Senator Franken? 

STATEMENT OF HON. AL FRANKEN, 

U.S. SENATOR FROM MINNESOTA 

Senator FRANKEN. Mr. Chairman, thank you for holding this 

hearing on a topic of vital importance to our American Indian communities in Minnesota and across the Country. I want to thank you 

for initiating this investigation. It is an important step in what will 

be a difficult, but I hope successful, effort to reform IHS so it can 

be a model of delivering healthcare. 

The VA came through this in the early 1990s and is now considered one of the very best healthcare systems in this Country. And 

I hope that we can say the same of the Indian Healthcare System. 

However, over and over again I have heard from Minnesota 

tribes that health services are inaccessible and insufficient. We 

have serious shortages of all services, especially in substance 

abuse, mental health and dental services. Tribal members drive 

hours to get care and too many are on waiting lists for contract 

health services. They often wait hours, if not years, for urgent care 

like heart surgery and joint replacements. 

That is why I am deeply concerned about the findings from the 

Committee’s investigation. These findings indicate that there is serious dysfunction and mismanagement in the Indian Health Service. Instead of being good stewards of scarce and desperately needed Federal resources, there is blatant misconduct and a serious 

lack of accountability. 

I truly hope that the findings of this investigation are not indicative of IHS nationwide, but I think we all know that if these problems are happening in Aberdeen, they are probably happening in 

Alaska, in Albuquerque, Billings, Phoenix, Oklahoma, Navaho 

Country, Nashville, California, Portland, Tucson and in Bemidji, 

Minnesota. 

That is why I respectfully request that Secretary Sebelius and 

Acting Director of the Office of Management and Budget, Jeffrey 

Zients, take a serious look at the information presented here today. 

I would like them to conduct comparable investigations into all IHS 

areas. We need to do everything we can to provide tribal members 

with high quality healthcare which they are promised. And we 

need to know what is happening within our Federal agencies. 

I will be submitting these requests in writing later today and 

welcome any other members of the Committee to join me on these 

letters. 

7 

Thank you again, Mr. Chairman, for your outstanding leadership 

and work on this matter. And thank you to the witnesses for joining us here today. I look forward to hearing your testimony. 

The CHAIRMAN. Senator Franken, thank you very much. 

Senator Johnson? 

STATEMENT OF HON. TIM JOHNSON, 

U.S. SENATOR FROM SOUTH DAKOTA 

Senator JOHNSON. Mr. Chairman, thank you for holding this 

hearing. As you know, the Aberdeen Area serves tribal members in 

both North and South Dakota and I believe this is a very important 

hearing. 

For many years there have been questions surrounding the agencies that serve Indian Country. I consistently hear a variety of concerns from many of my individual Indian constituents. It is my 

hope that this hearing can provide the necessary insight into these 

problems and focus on solutions. 

I would like to commend many of those who work in Indian 

Health Service. I am certain it is their goal to provide a high quality of care to our tribal members. While this hearing is to look at 

deficiencies at the IHS and the Aberdeen Area, it is critical to focus 

on moving forward and seeking positive solutions to solve these 

problems. We must do all that we can to uphold our treaty and 

trust responsibility to the American Indians. 

I would like to thank the witnesses for being here today to provide important testimony and I look forward to working together 

to improve the healthcare delivered to American Indians. 

Thank you. 

The CHAIRMAN. Senator Johnson, thank you very much. 

I want to make one additional comment, and then I am going to 

call on the witnesses and Dr. Roubideaux. 

The Congress passed, for the first time in 17 years, the Indian 

Healthcare Improvement Act this year. I used a photograph of a 

little girl every day I was on the Senator Floor, a little girl named 

Ta’Shon Rain Little Light. I did that with the consent of her grandparents and her parents. Ta’Shon Rain Little Light, just to remind 

all of us what this subject is about, it is not about some academic 

dispute or some concern we have with this, with an Agency, it is 

about life and death. 

[The photograph referred to follows:] 

8 

This little girl is not with us anymore. You can see the sparkle 

in her eyes. She loved to dance, her mother and her grandmother 

told me. She went to a Service Unit, not in this District by the way, 

was told three separate times that she was depressed, given medicine for depression. In fact, she had terminal cancer and she died. 

The night before she died in her mother’s arms, she told her mother, mommy, I am sorry that I have been sick. And then she passed 

away. 

This little girl probably should be alive today if she had better 

medical treatment. It happens. I understand that. It happens. 

Sometimes, diagnoses are missed. But, with the consent of the parents, I wanted to make sure that every day on the Floor of the Senate when we debated this subject of improving Indian Health Care 

that people understood what the stakes were. This is life and death 

for children, for elders and others. 

Having passed the Indian Healthcare Improvement Act in the 

name of Ta’Shon Rain Little Light and so many others, I do not 

want Indian healthcare now to be delivered in a second class way. 

I want this to be the outstanding delivery of good healthcare to 

those who deserve it, expect it and need it. 

With that, let me call on Dr. Yvette Roubideaux, the Director of 

the Indian Health Service. Dr. Roubideaux, you may proceed. 

We have three witnesses today I should say, Dr. Roubideaux, 

Charlene Red Thunder and Gerald Roy. Charlene Red Thunder is 

the Aberdeen Area Director of the Indian Health Service. Gerald 

Roy is the Deputy Inspector General for Investigations of the Office 

of Inspector General. Following that, we will have testimony by 

Ron His Horse Is Thunder, the Executive Director of the Aberdeen 

Area Tribal Chairman’s Health Board. 

Dr. Roubideaux, you may proceed. 


928a4.eps
9 

STATEMENT OF YVETTE ROUBIDEAUX, M.D., M.P.H., 

DIRECTOR, INDIAN HEALTH SERVICES 

Dr. ROUBIDEAUX. Great. Well, thank you, Mr. Chairman, and 

members of the Committee. 

My name is Dr. Yvette Roubideaux and I am the Director of the 

Indian Health Service. I am pleased to have the opportunity to testify on the review of the Aberdeen Area Indian Health Service. 

I would first like to thank you, Chairman Dorgan, for your advocacy for Indian people over the years. You have worked tirelessly 

to improve the healthcare of Indian people. And I agree with you. 

We have a serious problem in the Aberdeen Area and we are here 

to talk about how we are going to fix it. And so I would like to 

summarize my testimony. 

I am a member of the Rosebud Sioux Tribe of South Dakota and 

I was raised in Rapid City. I have a long history with the Aberdeen 

Area Indian Health Service and I am acutely aware of the longstanding challenges facing the Area. 

There has been insufficient accountability with respect to performance and financial management. There have been difficulties 

providing care in rural and remote and impoverished communities 

and limited resources to address the problem. I have witnessed 

these problems firsthand and seen the consequences for Indian people and seen the consequences for my own family. 

While many would like to believe that Agency funding levels are 

the sole reason for the Area’s management problems, that simply 

is not true. Without question, funding plays a significant role. But 

we can and we must make meaningful progress toward addressing 

these issues utilizing the resources we currently have. We cannot 

pay for services with money we do not have, but we can manage 

our human and financial resources more capably. And that is what 

I am committed to doing. 

Chairman Dorgan, I know you are committed to the same goal. 

I deeply appreciate your efforts over the years to provide the Agency with the resources it needs to address its longstanding problems 

and your support for my own efforts to bring reform to the Indian 

Health Services, meaningful and lasting change. With your continued support, I know we can make substantial progress. 

One of the main reasons I became a physician was my desire to 

help and improve the quality of healthcare for my people. Thirty 

years later, I accepted President Obama’s nomination to be the Director of the Indian Health Service and to begin this very important but very difficult work. In the time since I was sworn in as 

the Director, we have already taken a number of important steps 

to address the challenges facing the Aberdeen Area of the IHS and 

to reform the IHS as a whole. 

Chairman Dorgan, you and I share a mutual belief. We both believe that the Aberdeen Area Indian Health Service must do a better job of serving its communities. We also share a mutual conviction. Our management policies and principles must continue the 

change. I have four management priorities that will bring about 

the changes that we both want. 

My first priority is to renew and strengthen our partnership with 

the Tribes. I really believe the only way we are going to improve 

the health of our communities and address these types of problems 

10 

is to work in partnership with the Tribes. I personally conducted 

more than 270 tribal delegation meetings and visited 11 of 12 

areas. Just last month I visited the Aberdeen Area and met with 

tribal leaders and heard their specific input about needed improvements. 

The second priority is to reform the management practices and 

the organizational culture of IHS in order to create lasting changes. 

This starts with a strong tone at the top of the organization. I have 

communicated clearly to all IHS employees the importance of improving our customer service, professionalism and ethics, and the 

importance of holding employees accountable for poor performance. 

We are also improving financial management by holding leadership and management accountable for specific improvements and 

more consistency in managing our budgets. We have implemented 

a stronger performance management process, including setting expectations, holding people accountable for poor performance and establishing more specific and measurable performance goals. I will 

see the outcomes of that in the next couple of months as we evaluate our employees for this past year. 

And now we have a property management system that holds 

leadership and all employees financially and personally accountable for property lent to them. 

My third priority of reform focuses on improving the quality of 

and access to care for patients we serve. We are improving our customer service and expanding our medical home initiative. We are 

also supporting our facilities to ensure that 100 percent of all IHS 

facilities continue to meet accreditation standards. 

In addition, I am assembling a group of senior leadership this 

month to develop recommendations on how to improve the quality 

of healthcare in our facilities and in our system as a whole. 

The fourth priority is to make all of our work transparent, accountable, fair and inclusive and I firmly believe that creating a 

culture of openness at IHS is an important part of meeting these 

objectives. 

Chairman Dorgan, while I believe that these four priorities for 

reform will help bring meaningful, lasting change throughout the 

IHS, as I mentioned earlier in my testimony, I recognize that the 

Aberdeen Area faces severe challenges. I would like to discuss our 

progress to date in clearly defining and addressing these challenges. 

In 2009, I launched a series of comprehensive management reviews for the 12 IHS areas. Given the severity of the problems it 

faces, the Aberdeen Area was the second on the list and the review 

was completed in April 2010 by an independent internal team and 

contained 54 specific recommendations for improvement. As of 

today, significant progress has been made on each of these recommendations. And there is still more work to do. 

That progress is due in large part to the efforts of our Aberdeen 

Area Director, Charlene Red Thunder. Ms. Red Thunder is committed to bringing reform at the Area level and is holding managers and employees accountable for their performance. She is 

making progress under very difficult and challenging circumstances 

and I am so grateful that she has been willing to step up to this 

very difficult challenge. 

11 

In her two years as Director, Ms. Red Thunder’s specific accomplishments include taking disciplinary action against five Service 

Unit Directors and achieving complete area wide fiscal solvency 

with no budget deficits at the Service Unit level. This is a performance accountability result that has not been accomplished in over 

20 years; resolution of past Service Unit debt going back 20 years; 

increased third party collections by $30 million in the last year; 

and regained the trust of area tribal leadership by being more 

transparent about Agency business. 

Well, despite the progress to date, we obviously have a long way 

to go. While the situation at IHS is improving every day, the kind 

of change that we want to see will not happen overnight. In order 

to achieve our shared goals for IHS and the Aberdeen Area, I believe an effective collaboration between IHS and Congress is essential. And IHS is committed to cooperating fully with your investigation. 

Secretary Sebelius asked me to tell you that she and the rest of 

the Department fully support IHS in remedying these important 

issues that you have helped to raise. Her program Integrity Initiative is assisting us in addressing these concerns about the Aberdeen Area. 

Mr. Chairman, this concludes my statement. Thank you again for 

your longstanding commitment to the Indian Health Service, improving it overall and the Aberdeen Area, and the opportunity to 

testify today. 

Thank you. 

[The prepared statement of Ms. Roubideaux follows:] 

PREPARED STATEMENT OF YVETTE ROUBIDEAUX, M.D., M.P.H., DIRECTOR, INDIAN

HEALTH SERVICES

Good Morning. I am Dr. Yvette Roubideaux, Director of the Indian Health Service 

(IHS). Today I am accompanied by Charlene Red Thunder, Area Director of the Aberdeen Area Indian Health Service. I am pleased to have the opportunity to testify 

on the Senate Committee on Indian Affairs’ ongoing review of the Aberdeen Area 

Indian Health Service programs and operations. 

As I noted in my confirmation before this Committee in the spring of 2009, I am 

a member of the Rosebud Sioux Tribe of South Dakota, and was raised in Rapid 

City. I have a long history with the Aberdeen Area Indian Health Service, and am 

acutely aware of the longstanding challenges facing the Area, including insufficient 

accountability with respect to performance and financial management; the difficulties of providing care in rural, remote, and impoverished communities; and limited 

resources to address the problem. I’ve witnessed these problems firsthand and seen 

the consequences for Indian people. 

While some believe agency funding levels are the sole reason for the Area’s management problems, that simply isn’t true. Without question, funding plays a significant role, but we can and must make meaningful progress toward addressing these 

issues utilizing the resources we currently have. We cannot pay for services with 

money we don’t have, but we can manage our human and financial resources more 

capably, and that is what I am committed to doing. 

Chairman Dorgan, I know you are committed to this same goal. I deeply appreciate your efforts over the years to provide the agency with the resources it needs 

to address its longstanding problems, and your support for my own efforts to bring 

meaningful and lasting change to IHS. With your continued support, I know we can 

make substantial progress. 

The main reason I became a physician was my desire to help improve the quality 

of health care for my people. Thirty years later, I accepted the President’s nomination to be IHS Director and begin this important but difficult work. In the time 

since I was sworn in as Director, we have already taken a number of important 

steps to address the challenges facing the Aberdeen Area of the IHS—and to reform 

the IHS as a whole. 

12 

My testimony begins with a general overview of where IHS stands today and a 

status report on my priority goals for the agency. It then discusses the specific challenges facing the Aberdeen Area and our efforts to work with the Committee to address them. 

The Indian Health Service Today 

The Indian Health Service has demonstrated that it can provide quality 

healthcare with limited resources and staff. It has many dedicated health professionals providing important services. 

This Indian health system serves nearly 1.9 million American Indians and Alaska 

Natives through hospitals, health centers, and clinics located in 35 States, often representing the only source of health care for many American Indian and Alaska Native individuals, especially for those who live in the most remote and 

povertystricken areas of the United States. 

This is, as we all recognize, a difficult mission—and one that has grown more 

challenging as a result of population growth, rising healthcare costs, and greater incidence of chronic conditions and their underlying risk factors, such as diabetes and 

childhood obesity, among Indian people. The circumstances of too many of our communities—poverty, unemployment, and crime—often exacerbate the challenges we 

face. We have made great strides in facilitating Tribes taking over management of 

health programs through the Indian Self-Determination and Educational Assistance 

Act (Public Law 93–638); Tribes now manage over half of the Indian Health Service 

budget, and are demonstrating how new ideas and increased flexibility in managing 

these healthcare services can result in innovative and more effective healthcare programs. At the same time, this transition has resulted in significant reorganization, 

which has changed the approach we use to manage the direct service component of 

IHS. 

Priorities for IHS Reform 

Since I was confirmed in May 2009, I have responded to a call from Tribal leaders, staff and patients to change and improve the Indian Health Service. While 

bringing fundamental reform to IHS may seem like a daunting task, I believe this 

is a unique time in history, and that, with a supportive President and bipartisan 

support in Congress for reform, we have an opportunity to bring lasting change to 

an agency that desperately needs it. Accordingly, upon being confirmed as Director, 

I set four priorities to guide the work of the agency in the coming years, and I am 

pleased to say that we are beginning to make real progress. 

Renew and Strengthen the IHS Partnership with Tribes 

The first priority is to renew and strengthen our partnership with Tribes. I believe the only way we are going to improve the health of our communities is to work 

in partnership with them. The first step in strengthening that partnership is 

through face-to-face meetings. I have personally conducted more than 270 Tribal 

Delegation Meetings since being sworn in over a year ago, and have visited 11 of 

12 IHS Areas to visit with Tribes. Just last month, I visited the Aberdeen Area to 

meet with tribal leaders and heard their input and comments about needed improvements. Because not all Tribes can afford to travel to Washington, DC, these 

Area visits are critical to make sure all Tribal voices are heard. Building on these 

meetings, I instructed my Director’s Workgroup on Tribal Consultation to develop 

detailed recommendations for improvement. We have already begun implementing 

those recommendations. For example, I have prohibited the practice of shifting Area 

resources and funds without consulting tribes directly. Under my watch, no tribe is 

going to lose or gain from shifts in funds without being part of process. 

Reform Indian Health Service Management 

The second priority is about reforming the management of the IHS, which I have 

already begun to do. It is clear we must improve the way we do business and lead 

and manage our staff, by putting in place fundamental reforms in management 

practices and organizational culture to create lasting change. 

This starts with a strong tone at the top of the organization. I have communicated 

clearly to all IHS employees the importance of improving our customer service, professionalism, and ethics, and I have insisted that we do a better job of holding employees accountable for poor performance or improper conduct in the context of a 

fair process. I have received hundreds of emails from employees thanking me for 

setting a strong tone at the top on areas where we need to improve. It is the first 

step toward organizational change, and I believe it has made an important difference. 

We are making a number of other specific improvements in the way we conduct 

the business of the agency. Leadership and managers are being held accountable to 

13 

balance budgets, justify expenses, and do better fiscal planning. We have trained 

senior leaders and program managers to better use our financial accounting system 

and are implementing a consistent budget template agency-wide in our federal administered sites. We are also requiring greater transparency in agreements between 

programs with regard to funding transfers. These steps will help strengthen financial management and ensure the consistency and effectiveness of business practices 

throughout IHS. 

In terms of personnel, we are streamlining the hiring process. I convened a group 

of IHS employees in July to make recommendations for shortening the hiring process to enable the agency to compete for qualified candidates and bring them onboard more quickly, and we are currently implementing those recommendations. Recruiting qualified health care providers for many of our sites, including remote and 

rural health facilities, is already a challenge; we must not let the process contribute 

to the problem. We are also working on improvements in pay systems and strategies 

to improve recruitment and retention. 

I have also worked to address concerns about staff performance by implementing 

a stronger performance management process. All employees have been notified that 

staff performance and accountability are top priorities for reform, and expectations 

about how we manage performance have been issued to all staff. In the past, we 

did not hold employees sufficiently accountable for poor performance. You cannot 

improve performance or remove problem employees if you do not set standards and 

then hold them to those standards. After becoming Director, I established new, 

higher performance standards for our employees, including measurable goals to ensure that we can more effectively manage performance. 

I am committed to holding our employees to these new standards. At the same 

time, we will continue to follow policies and regulations to allow employees due 

process, and to ensure that employee performance issues are dealt with fairly. When 

allegations are made, our managers will act swiftly to investigate them, and, if the 

allegations are found to be true, they will take appropriate action. 

Property management within IHS has been a particular concern of the Committee. We share that concern, and in response to recommendations from the recent 

GAO investigation, we have made many improvements, including implementing an 

electronic property management system, holding senior leadership responsible for 

completion of annual inventories and boards of survey, and updating policies and 

procedures with the assistance of an outside consulting group. We also now hold all 

individual employees accountable for the property they use by implementation of a 

hand-receipt system. All property, including our Blackberrys, are marked with a 

sticker that documents who is responsible for it, and employees sign a form stating 

they will be held financially responsible if the property is lost. In 2009 and 2010, 

100 percent of inventories were completed, boards of surveys (a panel of IHS employees determining liability for lost, damaged or destruction of IHS property) are 

being conducted. These system-wide improvements have created an unprecedented 

level of accountability for property in the IHS. 

Improve the Quality Of and Access to Care 

My third priority for reform focuses on improving the quality of and access to care 

for the patients we serve. I started by identifying the importance of customer service, emphasizing that we must treat our patients—and each other—with dignity and 

respect. As with other management responsibilities, I have made specific and measurable improvements in customer service a key feature of our performance evaluations. This kind of cultural change is critical to improving the way the agency does 

business—both internally and externally—and I have already begun to see improvements throughout the IHS system. 

We are also improving the quality of care by expanding efforts to create a medical 

home for our patients so that our teams of providers can make care more centered 

on an individual patient’s needs. We are expanding our Improving Patient Care Initiative to 100 more sites over the next three years. 

Quality of care is also demonstrated by meeting standards, and 100 percent of all 

IHS facilities continue to meet accreditation standards of the Joint Commission on 

Accreditation of Healthcare Organizations (JCAHO) and other appropriate accrediting bodies. Our facilities must also meet standards to receive reimbursement from 

Medicare and Medicaid, something that can be more challenging for IHS than some 

providers due to limited resources, staff, or provider turnover. If facilities have problems in these areas, we help them make improvements. In addition, I am assembling a group of senior clinical leaders this month to develop recommendations for 

how to improve the quality of health care in our facilities and our system as a 

whole, and have required that each IHS Area report to me by next month concrete 

examples of improvements of quality of care. 

14 

Make Our Work More Transparent, Accountable, Fair and Inclusive 

The fourth priority is to make all our work more transparent, accountable, fair 

and inclusive. I firmly believe that creating a culture of openness at IHS is an important part of meeting all of these objectives. For example, telling the story of how 

we are working to bring change to the agency will reassure our patient population 

that health reform is also happening for the Indian Health Service. Examples include working more closely with the media, sending more email messages on key 

management and personnel issues, and Dear Tribal Leader letters. We have also enhanced our website with the IHS Reform page, Director’s Corner, and Director’s 

Blog, which contain important updates and information about reform activities. We 

are looking at ways to improve IHS-wide communication among Areas, Service 

Units, and Headquarters. I personally send emails to all IHS staff to provide important updates that help promote better communication, which will in turn help us 

improve as an organization. 

Overview of the Aberdeen Area Indian Health Service 

As you know, the Aberdeen Area Indian Health Service was established to serve 

the Indian tribes in North Dakota, South Dakota, Nebraska, and Iowa. Within the 

Aberdeen Area, IHS brings health care to approximately 122,000 Indians living in 

both rural and urban areas. The Area Office in Aberdeen, SD, is the administrative 

headquarters for nineteen service units consisting of nine hospitals, fifteen health 

centers, two school health stations, and several smaller health stations and satellite 

clinics. 

Each facility incorporates a comprehensive health care delivery system. The hospitals, health centers, and satellite clinics provide inpatient and outpatient care and 

conduct preventive and curative clinics. Direct care and contract care expenditures 

are used to augment care not available in the local Indian Health Service facilities. 

The Aberdeen Area also operates an active research effort through its Area Epidemiology Program. Research projects deal with diabetes, cardiovascular disease, cancer, and the application of health risk appraisals in all communities. 

Indian and tribal involvement is a major objective of the program, and several 

tribes do assume partial or full responsibility for their own health care through contractual arrangements with the Aberdeen Area IHS. Tribally managed facilities include the Carl T. Curtis Health Center in Macy, NE, an ambulatory care and nursing home facility, and health centers in Trenton, ND, and Tama, IA. 

As I mentioned earlier in my testimony, and as the members of this Committee 

know well, the Aberdeen Area faces severe challenges, including insufficient accountability with respect to performance and financial management; difficulties associated with providing care in rural, remote, and impoverished communities; and 

limited resources to address the problem. We can and must make meaningful 

progress toward addressing these issues utilizing the resources we currently have, 

and that is what I am committed to doing. 

I would like to discuss our progress to date in clearly defining and effectively addressing the challenges facing the Aberdeen Area. 

Aberdeen Area Management Review 

In 2009, with the goal of developing Area-specific plans for improvement, I 

launched a series of comprehensive management reviews for each of the 12 Areas 

of the IHS. Recognizing the seriousness of the problems it faces, I made the Aberdeen Area review the second of the 12 Area reviews. The review was conducted by 

an independent, internal team, and was completed in April 2010. 

Several areas were covered in the Aberdeen Area Management Review, including 

Area leadership, Tribal relations/consultation, administration, finance, acquisitions, 

property, human resources, Equal Employment Opportunity (EEO), Ethics, Business 

Office, Information Technology, and the Contract Health Service program. The review team issued its final report in June and made a follow-up site visit in September to assess the Area’s progress in addressing the 54 recommendations of the 

review. 

The Aberdeen Area recently submitted a 90-day progress report on implementation of the recommendations. IHS senior staff receives weekly and monthly reports 

by the Aberdeen Area on specific actions taken to address the recommendations for 

three broad categories of Leadership; Tribal Relationships/Consultation; and Administration. Significant progress has been made in the last 90 days. Of the 54 recommendations, 38 have been completed and by the end of the year, 14 more will 

have been completed, with the remaining two slated for completion next year. 

15 

Aberdeen Area Improvements in Program Management and Accountability 

The review team found that the Aberdeen Area Director had made improvements 

in strengthening Tribal relations and could now focus on overall structure, system, 

and process improvements supporting the health care programs. We have created 

an operational plan to institutionalize the recommended improvements into the 

structure and operations of the Aberdeen Area Office and the Service Units Improvements have touched every element of the Aberdeen Area organization, and include: 

• Leading the IHS in obligations and disbursements of ARRA funding. Of the 

$107,543,000, the Aberdeen Area has fully obligated all ARRA funds. This 

achievement outpaces that of other Areas within the IHS. 

• The Cheyenne River Health Care Facility is on track to open in late 2011. 

• Information Technology reduced high-risk vulnerabilities by 74 percent, medium-risk by 9 percent, and low-risk by 10 percent. 

• Established a process for leave balance reconciliation that reduced the number 

of discrepancies and errors by 33 percent. 

• The Northern Plains Regional Human Resources Division has fully implemented HHS’s requirement of 100 percent utilization of Quick Hire for all vacancy Announcements and leads the IHS in HR Quick Hire recruiting actions 

that will reduce critical clinical vacancies. 

I also believe that we have an Aberdeen Area Director who is committed to bringing the same kinds of changes at the Area level by working in specific ways to hold 

individuals accountable for their performance. It is not surprising that there have 

been complaints, or that there is resistance to change. However, the efforts to identify and address the management problems in the Aberdeen Area over the past year 

demonstrate a commitment by the Area Director to make meaningful progress 

under difficult circumstances, and I am grateful that she has been willing to step 

up to this challenge. I have assessed the Area Director’s performance in part based 

on her ability to accomplish the specific recommendations made by the review team. 

Both the review team and I have observed demonstrable progress. At the same time, 

the Area Director must also respond to unexpected demands, including emergencies 

due to severe weather and crises due to surprise staffing shortages. 

Specific steps taken by the Area Director in her first two years of leadership include: 

• Taking disciplinary action against five service unit directors related to management or fiscal incompetence, conduct and misuse of authority, and lack of Tribal 

consultation and poor communication. All five service unit directors either resigned or were terminated. 

• Transferring the supervision of the EEO program from the Area to Headquarters. 

• Achieving complete Area-wide fiscal solvency in FY 2010 with no budget deficits 

at the service unit level—a performance accountability result that had not been 

accomplished in over 20 years. This has been achieved by requiring more fiscal 

accountability of CEOs and Area Program managers. Past service unit debt 

going back 20 years has been resolved. 

• Recording fiscal year 2010 collections totaling $95.5 million as of September 20, 

2010—an increase of $30 million compared to FY 2009 collections of $66 million. 

This reflects a 45.4 percent increase in collections from FY 2009 to FY 2010. 

This increase in third party revenue can be attributed to use of the Area-wide 

third party contract to supplement IHS staff in collection efforts. A targeted 

campaign was developed to collect past due accounts receivable and to increase 

staff competencies through focused training and skills development. The Aberdeen Area Director increased management oversight of business office operations utilizing the Internal Controls Reporting tool, the Accounts Receivable 

Dashboard metrics, and continuous feedback to Service Unit CEOs. 

• Initiating and implementing key organizational protocols related to human capital management improvements, communication, and customer service measurement and improvement. Area-wide high turnover rates of clinicians continue to 

occur; but the Area continues to address, plan for, and take actions to fill vacancies at health care delivery sites. 

• Regaining the trust of Area Tribal leadership by being more transparent about 

agency business. 

16 

Finally, I have already discussed some of the specific changes I am working to 

implement across IHS in an effort to improve the way we do business, and I believe 

these changes will contribute to our efforts to address the specific problems in the 

Aberdeen Area. 

Aberdeen Area Investigation by Senator Dorgan 

Despite the progress we have made to date, we have a long way to go. I believe 

effective collaboration between IHS and Congress is essential to helping us achieve 

our shared goals, and I am grateful for the commitment this Committee has made 

to highlighting the challenges facing the Aberdeen Area and working with IHS to 

develop solutions. 

IHS is committed to cooperating fully with the Chairman’s investigation. My staff 

and I have worked to be as responsive as possible within the timeframes provide 

to the Committee’s requests for documents, and to answer follow-up questions and 

requests for clarification expeditiously. Providing complete and timely agency responses to all the Committee’s information requests is and will continue to be a top 

priority of mine through the completion of the Committee’s review of the Aberdeen 

Area operations. 

Conclusion 

In the past year, I have brought a new leadership focus on providing better customer service, promoting ethical behavior, ensuring fairness and accountability in 

performance management, strengthening financial management, improving Tribal 

consultation, and improving the quality of services delivered to IHS’s patients. 

While the situation at IHS is improving every day, the transformative cultural and 

organizational change I am working to bring to the agency won’t happen overnight, 

and it may face resistance from some corners. Nevertheless, I have made it clear 

to senior leadership within the agency—including Area Directors—that we must implement specific improvements in a number of areas, and I am committed to making 

visible, measurable progress in the coming weeks, months, and years. 

Secretary Sebelius has asked me to tell you that she and the rest of the Department fully support IHS in remedying the important issues that you have helped to 

raise, Mr. Chairman. In May of this year, the Secretary undertook a major, Departmentwide initiative to ensure that all of HHS’s agencies live up to the public’s trust 

that they will operate with maximum integrity, effectiveness, and efficiency as responsible stewards of taxpayer funds. Specifically, Secretary Sebelius established a 

Program Integrity Initiative that includes all HHS agencies and staff divisions, including IHS. This Initiative has been working to further integrate program integrity 

in all HHS programs and business processes to reduce fraud, waste, and abuse and 

ensure that our budgeted resources provide maximum impact for those we serve. 

The Secretary’s Council on Program Integrity (SCPI) oversees the Initiative. One of 

the first major undertakings of SCPI has been to launch a Program Integrity Task 

Force for the Aberdeen Area of IHS, comprised of senior officials from across the 

department, specifically to address the important issues we are discussing today. 

This task force will ensure that IHS benefits from the expertise and support of professionals in other parts of the Department who can assist in addressing concerns 

you have identified and support IHS’s efforts to implement corrective actions as 

needed. 

Mr. Chairman, this concludes my statement. Thank you again for your long-standing commitment to improve Indian health, both in the Aberdeen Area and throughout IHS, and for the opportunity to testify today on the Aberdeen Area Indian 

Health Service programs. 

I will be happy to answer any questions you may have. 

The CHAIRMAN. Dr. Roubideaux, thank you very much. We appreciate your testimony. 

Next, we will hear from the Aberdeen Area Director of the Indian 

Health Service, Charlene Red Thunder. 

Ms. Red Thunder? 

17 

STATEMENT OF CHARLENE RED THUNDER, M.S., AREA 

DIRECTOR, ABERDEEN AREA INDIAN HEALTH SERVICE 

Ms. RED THUNDER. [Greeting in native tongue.] Mr. Chairman 

and members of the Committee, good morning. I am Charlene Red 

Thunder, Area Director of the Aberdeen Area Indian Health Service. 

I am an enrolled member of the Cheyenne River Sioux Tribe of 

South Dakota. I was born and raised at the Cheyenne Agency. I 

have a Master’s Degree in Education from Northern State University in Aberdeen, South Dakota. 

In the 30 years I have served in the Indian Health Service, I 

have held positions of various degrees and various responsibilities. 

In addition, I strongly support Dr. Roubideaux’s priorities for the 

Agency, including improving consultation with the Tribes, reforming management and employee performance in IHS, improving 

quality of and access to care, and making our work more accountable, transparent, fair and inclusive. 

I am already working to improve fiscal management. In my first 

year as Director of the Aberdeen Area, I successfully increased 

third party collections by $30 million. 

I am pleased to have this opportunity to testify on the Senate 

Committee on Indian Affairs’ review of the Aberdeen Area Indian 

Health Service programs and operations. Let me start by saying 

that I recognize the serious challenges facing the Aberdeen Area 

IHS. And I am working closely with Dr. Roubideaux, the Tribes, 

managers, employees and patients on a daily basis to address 

them. 

I believe that it is my role as Area Director to make some hard 

decisions necessary to hold employees accountable, strengthen our 

financial management and ensure the quality and availability of 

healthcare to our customers. In addition, I am responsible for advancing Dr. Roubideaux’s priorities for the Agency by implementing specific strategies at the Area level. I am grateful for Dr. 

Roubideaux’s support and believe the priorities she has set provide 

the best framework for achieving significant and lasting change in 

the Aberdeen Area. 

My own top priority as Aberdeen Area Director has been to create meaningful relationships between the Office of the Area Director and the Tribal governments and nations. The efforts to achieve 

a meaningful dialogue between the programs of the Area Office and 

Tribal governments include active engagement of our Service Unit 

Executive Teams. 

There are good and hardworking women and men in the hospitals and clinics and management programs in the Aberdeen Area 

in both Tribal and Federal programs. I would like to take this opportunity to acknowledge and thank them before I proceed. 

Staff in these hospitals and clinics and Area office programs is 

also predominantly members of the nations and the people that we 

serve. The range of cultural diversity among our bands and tribes, 

along with their commitment to building and maintaining health 

communities is a hallmark and strength of Indian Country. I understand this and believe Dr. Roubideaux has defined important 

priorities to improve clinical care while supporting and promoting 

self determination of the Great Plains Tribes. 

18 

Since I became Director of the Aberdeen Area, I have made it a 

priority to consult with every Tribe in the Area. Coordinating the 

priorities of Tribal governments and administrative and clinical 

programs of the Indian Health Service happens every day and, 

mostly, seamlessly. 

However, there are times when the reality of traumatic injury, 

severe weather, and the hardship of the poorest of the poor in this 

Country play out in our emergency and treatment rooms of IHS 

and our Tribal healthcare facilities. 

I am personally committed to ensuring the Aberdeen Area Office 

serves its Tribes in a manner consistent with the mission of the 

IHS. And I am pleased to report that, in my two years as Director, 

we have had some important successes at the Area level. These include leading the IHS in obligations and disbursement of the Recovery Act funding, reducing IT vulnerabilities, strengthening financial management, addressing clinical vacancies through accelerated hiring practices, increasing collections from third parties, and 

achieving complete Area-wide fiscal solvency in FY 2010 with no 

budget deficits at the Service Unit level. 

In addition, I have not been afraid to take strong disciplinary actions against poor-performing employees, including managers. Specifically, I have taken action against top executive individuals related to management or fiscal incompetence, misconduct, misuse of 

authority, and lack of Tribal consultation and poor communication. 

Despite our progress, as the members of this Committee know, 

the Aberdeen Area still has a long way to go to address its most 

serious problems. I was born in an Indian Health facility and have 

received the majority of my care from the Indian Health Service. 

I understand the challenges that American Indians and Alaska Natives experience in accessing quality healthcare. And I have made 

it my life’s work to improve the system. 

I will maintain my focus by empowering and supporting Tribal 

governments to design and manage their healthcare systems. And 

I am equally committed to bringing change to management and operations of the Aberdeen Area Indian Health Service. 

Thank you. I am happy to answer any questions that you may 

have. 

[The prepared statement of Ms. Red Thunder follows:] 

PREPARED STATEMENT OF CHARLENE RED THUNDER, M.S., AREA DIRECTOR, 

ABERDEEN AREA INDIAN HEALTH SERVICE

Good Morning. I am Charlene Red Thunder, Area Director of the Aberdeen Area 

Indian Health Service. I am an enrolled tribal member of the Cheyenne River Sioux 

Tribe of South Dakota. I was born and raised at the Cheyenne Agency. I have a 

Masters Degree in Education from Northern State University in Aberdeen, South 

Dakota, and have augmented my knowledge by participating in executive leadership 

development in numerous courses during my career. 

In the thirty years I have served in the Indian Health Service, I have held positions as a budget analyst, administrative officer, Chief Executive Officer, and Area 

executive officer. In addition, I strongly support Dr. Roubideaux’s priorities for the 

agency, including: (1) improving consultation with Tribes; (2) reforming management and employee performance in IHS; (3) improving quality of and access to care; 

and, (4) making our work more accountable, transparent, fair and inclusive. I’m already working to improve fiscal management, and in my first year as Director of 

the Aberdeen Area, I successfully increased third party collections by $30 million. 

I am pleased to have the opportunity to testify on the Senate Committee on Indian Affairs review of the Aberdeen Area Indian Health Service programs and operVerDate Nov 24 2008 12:56 Feb 28, 2011 Jkt 063826 PO 00000 Frm 00022 Fmt 6633 Sfmt 6621 S:\DOCS\63826.TXT JACK PsN: JACKF
19 

ations. Let me start by saying that I recognize the serious challenges facing the Aberdeen Area IHS, and am working closely with Dr. Roubideaux, the Tribes, managers, employees, and patients on a daily basis to address them. I believe it is my 

role as Area Director to make the hard decisions necessary to hold employees accountable, strengthen our financial management, and ensure the quality and availability of health care to our customers. In addition, I am responsible for advancing 

Dr. Roubideaux’s priorities for the agency by implementing specific strategies at the 

Area level. I am grateful for Dr. Roubideaux’s support, and believe the priorities she 

has set provide the best framework for achieving significant and lasting change in 

the Aberdeen Area. 

My own top priority as Aberdeen Area Director has been to create meaningful relationships between the Office of the Area Director and the Tribal governments and 

nations. The efforts to achieve meaningful dialogue between the programs of the 

Area Office and Tribal Governments include the active engagement of Service Unit 

Executive Teams. There are good and hard working women and men in the hospitals and clinics and management programs of the Aberdeen Area in both tribal 

and federal programs. I would like to take this opportunity to acknowledge and 

thank them before I proceed. 

Staff in these hospitals and clinics and area office programs are also predominantly members of the nations and the people that we serve. The range of cultural 

diversity among bands and tribes along with their commitment to building and 

maintaining health communities is a hallmark and strength of Indian Country. I 

understand this and believe Dr. Roubideaux has defined important priorities to improve clinical care while supporting and promoting self determination of the Great 

Plains Tribes. 

Since I became Director of the Aberdeen Area, I’ve made it a priority to consult 

with every Tribe in the Area. Coordinating the priorities of tribal governments and 

the administrative and clinical programs of the Indian Health Service happens 

every day and, mostly, seamlessly. However, there are times when the reality of 

traumatic injury, severe weather, and the hardships of the poorest of the poor in 

this country play out in the emergency and treatment rooms of IHS and tribal 

health care facilities. 

I am personally committed to ensuring the Aberdeen Area Office serves its Tribes 

in a manner consistent with the mission of the IHS. And I’m pleased to report that, 

in my two years as Director, we’ve had some important successes at the Area level. 

These include leading the IHS in obligations and disbursements of Recovery Act 

funding, reducing IT vulnerabilities, strengthening financial management, addressing clinical vacancies through accelerated hiring practices, increasing collections 

from third parties, and achieving complete Area-wide fiscal solvency in FY 2010 

with no budget deficits at the service unit level. 

In addition, I have not been afraid to take strong disciplinary actions against 

poorperforming employees, including managers. Specifically, I have taken action 

against five service unit directors related to management or fiscal incompetence, 

conduct and misuse of authority, and lack of Tribal consultation and poor communication. All five service unit directors either resigned or were terminated. 

Despite our progress, as the members of this Committee know, the Aberdeen Area 

still has a long way to go to address its most serious problems. I was born in an 

Indian Health facility and have received the majority of my health care, from the 

Indian Health Service. I understand the challenges that American Indians and Alaska Native experience in accessing quality health care, and I have made it my life’s 

work to improve the system. I will maintain my focus by empowering and supporting tribal governments to design and manage their health care systems, and I 

am equally committed to bringing change to management and operations of the Aberdeen Area IHS. 

Thank you. I am happy to answer any questions that you may have. 

The CHAIRMAN. Ms. Red Thunder, thank you very much. We appreciate your testimony. 

Next we will hear from Mr. Gerald Roy who is the Deputy Inspector General for Investigations at the Office of Inspector General, HHS. 

Mr. Roy? 

20 

STATEMENT OF GERALD ROY, DEPUTY INSPECTOR GENERAL 

FOR INVESTIGATIONS, OFFICE OF INSPECTOR GENERAL, 

U.S. DEPARTMENT OF HEALTH AND HUMAN SERVICES 

Mr. ROY. Good morning, Chairman Dorgan and other distinguished members of the Committee. 

I am Gerald Roy, Deputy Inspector General for Investigations as 

the U.S. Department of Health and Human Services Office of Inspector General. I appreciate the opportunity to testify about OIG 

work relating to the Indian Health Service. 

I have the privilege of having with me today OIG Special Agent 

Curt Muller, who has served in the Aberdeen Area since 2000 and 

is familiar with many of the issues I expect will be raised at today’s 

hearing. 

OIG is an independent, nonpartisan agency committed to protecting the integrity of more than 300 programs administered by 

HHS. We are the Nation’s premiere healthcare fraud enforcement 

agency, providing oversight to all agencies and programs of our 

vast Department. 

OIG consists of five components, our offices of Audit Services, 

Evaluation and Inspections, Counsel to the Inspector General, 

Management and Policy, and Investigations, which I oversee. OIG 

has a significant body of work on IHS issues which I am happy to 

submit for the record. But my testimony today is focused solely 

today on the work of the Office of Investigations. 

The Office of Investigations employs nearly 400 highly-skilled 

special agents trained to conduct investigations of fraud and abuse 

related to HHS programs and operations. Our special agents utilize 

state of the art technologies and effectuate a wide range of law enforcement actions including service of subpoenas and execution of 

search and arrest warrants. 

Our constituents are the American people and we work hard to 

ensure their money is not stolen or misspent. Thanks to the work 

of our dedicated professionals, over the past fiscal year OIG has 

opened nearly 1,700 investigations and obtained over 570 criminal 

convictions. OIG investigations have also resulted in over $3 billion 

in expected criminal and civil recoveries. 

Over the last 10 years, my office opened nearly 300 investigations related to or affecting IHS. Many of these cases also involved 

allegations of Medicare and Medicaid fraud. In the course of these 

investigations, OIG has identified three general areas of vulnerability that threaten IHS. These areas are mismanagement, employee misconduct and drug diversion. I will now provide examples 

of investigative findings in each of these three areas. 

With respect to mismanagement, our investigations have uncovered insufficient internal controls, lack of documentation relating to 

employee misconduct, and prohibited personnel practices, including 

the hiring of excluded individuals to provide items or services to 

beneficiaries. 

OIG protects beneficiaries and the integrity of Federal healthcare 

programs, including IHS, by excluding individuals for fraud and 

abuse violations such as drug diversion and patient abuse. IHS 

must be vigilant in ensuring that it does not hire excluded individuals. Otherwise, vulnerable patient populations may be put at risk, 

21 

and Federal healthcare programs could inappropriately pay for the 

salaries and services of excluded individuals. 

In 2008, the Aberdeen Area Personnel Office identified two employees who were excluded by OIG from participation in Federal 

healthcare programs. One employee was excluded based on a criminal conviction for embezzlement in 2001 that was the result of an 

investigation conducted by our special agents. While still excluded, 

this employee was subsequently rehired by the same department 

within the Aberdeen Area Office where she committed her illegal 

acts. The other employee was a nurse convicted of drug diversion 

charges. 

During the course of this investigation, we discovered that IHS 

had no policy in place to verify employees and contractors against 

the list of excluded individuals and entities. As a result, we recommended that IHS immediately review the names of all current 

employees and contractors against the excluded individuals and entities lists and issue exclusion guidance to employees. IHS agreed 

to implement OIG’s recommendations. 

Concerning employee misconduct, OIG investigations have resulted in numeral criminal convictions. These investigations have 

focused on a variety of criminal violations, including conspiracy, 

healthcare fraud and embezzlement. In 2005, we investigated allegations that an IHS employee unlawfully altered government 

records of IHS beneficiaries for personal gain. The employee and 

co-conspirators replaced beneficiaries’ names with their own on 

medical records and filed claims for payment to a private insurance 

company. 

Five of the individuals were indicted, including two IHS employees who were charged with conspiracy and healthcare fraud. One 

employee was sentenced to 12 months in prison. The other, an IHS 

supervisor, was sentenced to 18 months in prison. They are jointly 

responsible for paying the insurance company over $99,000 in restitution. 

In drug diversion, we have determined that IHS pharmacies are 

vulnerable to controlled substance abuses, including diversion and 

trafficking by employees, contract providers and patients. 

In 2008, we investigated an allegation that a Sioux San pharmacy technician in Rapid City, South Dakota stole large quantities 

of Vicodin and Tramadol. When questioned by our special agents, 

the employees admitted to stealing large quantities of narcotics 

from the IHS pharmacy which she then sold on the street for cash. 

During a search of her home, our special agents found additional 

evidence of stolen narcotics. The employee pled guilty to a felony 

count of theft. 

During the course of our investigation, we discovered that the 

IHS pharmacy lacked effective security controls to prevent and detect drug diversion, including security cameras and two person inventory counts. 

The work I have testified about today reflects OIG’s serious commitment to ensuring the integrity of IHS programs. Our Sioux 

Falls Office has considerable expertise with these issues and dedicates a significant amount of time to investigating fraud and abuse 

in IHS. 

22 

Additionally, the Inspector General serves on the Secretary’s 

Interdepartmental Council on Native American Affairs and has 

personally toured Indian Country. Through the dedicated efforts of 

our OIG professionals, we will continue working to deter fraud, 

waste and abuse within IHS and Tribal programs. 

Thank you for your support of this mission. I welcome any questions you may have. 

[The prepared statement of Mr. Roy follows:] 

PREPARED STATEMENT OF GERALD ROY, DEPUTY INSPECTOR GENERAL FOR

INVESTIGATIONS, OFFICE OF INSPECTOR GENERAL, U.S. DEPARTMENT OF HEALTH

AND HUMAN SERVICES

Good morning Chairman Dorgan, Vice Chairman Barrasso, and other distinguished Members of the Committee. I am Gerald Roy, Deputy Inspector General for 

Investigations at the U.S. Department of Health & Human Services’ (HHS) Office 

of Inspector General (OIG). I appreciate the opportunity to testify about OIG work 

relating to the Indian Health Service (IHS). I have the privilege of having with me 

today OIG Special Agent Curt Muller who has served in the Aberdeen area since 

2000 and is familiar with many of the issues I expect will be raised at this hearing. 

OIG is an independent, nonpartisan agency committed to protecting the integrity 

of more than 300 programs administered by HHS. We are the Nation’s premiere 

health care fraud law enforcement agency, providing oversight to all agencies and 

programs of our vast Department. 

OIG consists of five components: our offices of Audit Services, Evaluation and Inspections, Counsel to the Inspector General, Management and Policy, and Investigations, which I oversee. OIG has a significant body of work on IHS issues, which I 

am happy to submit for the record, but my testimony today is focused solely on the 

work of the Office of Investigations. 

The Office of Investigations employs nearly 400 highly skilled special agents 

trained to conduct investigations of fraud and abuse related to HHS programs and 

operations. Our special agents utilize state of the art technologies and effectuate a 

wide range of law enforcement actions including service of subpoenas and the execution of search and arrest warrants. 

Our constituents are the American people and we work hard to ensure their 

money is not stolen or misspent. Thanks to the work of our dedicated professionals, 

over the past fiscal year OIG has opened over 1,700 investigations and obtained 

over 570 criminal convictions. OIG investigations also have resulted in over $3 billion in expected criminal and civil recoveries. 

Over the last 10 years, my office opened nearly 300 investigations related to, or 

affecting IHS. Many of these cases also involved allegations of Medicare or Medicaid 

fraud. In the course of these investigations, OIG has identified three general areas 

of vulnerability that threaten IHS. These areas are: (1) mismanagement, (2) employee misconduct, and (3) drug diversion. 

I will now provide examples of investigative findings in each of these three areas. 

Mismanagement 

Our investigations have uncovered insufficient internal controls, lack of documentation relating to employee misconduct, and prohibited personnel practices, including hiring excluded individuals to provide items or services to Federal program 

beneficiaries. OIG protects beneficiaries and the integrity of Federal health care programs, including IHS, by excluding individuals for fraud and abuse violations, such 

as drug diversion and patient abuse. IHS must be vigilant in ensuring that it does 

not hire excluded individuals. Otherwise, vulnerable patient populations may be put 

at risk, and Federal health care program funds could inappropriately pay for the 

salaries and services of excluded individuals. 

In 2008, the Aberdeen Area personnel office identified two employees who were 

excluded by OIG from participation in federally funded health care programs. One 

of the employees was excluded based on a criminal conviction for embezzlement in 

2001 that was the result of an investigation conducted by our special agents. While 

still excluded, this employee was subsequently rehired by the same department 

within the Aberdeen Area Office where she committed her illegal acts. The other 

employee was a nurse convicted of drug diversion charges. 

During the course of this investigation, we discovered that IHS had no policy in 

place to verify employees and contractors against the List of Excluded Individuals 

and Entities. As a result, we recommended that IHS immediately review the names 

23 

of all current employees and contractors against the excluded individuals and entities lists and issue exclusions guidance to employees. IHS agreed to implement 

OIG’s recommendations. 

Employee Misconduct 

OIG investigations have resulted in numerous criminal convictions relating to employee misconduct. These investigations have focused on a variety of criminal violations, including conspiracy, health care fraud, and embezzlement. In 2005, we investigated allegations that an IHS employee unlawfully altered government medical 

records of IHS beneficiaries for personal gain. The employee and co-conspirators replaced beneficiaries’ names with their own on medical records and filed claims for 

payment to a private insurance company. Five individuals were indicted, including 

two IHS employees, who were charged with conspiracy and health care fraud. One 

employee was sentenced to 12 months in prison. The other, an IHS supervisor, was 

sentenced to 18 months in prison. They are jointly responsible for paying the insurance company over $99,000 in restitution. 

Drug Diversion 

We have determined that IHS pharmacies are vulnerable to controlled substance 

abuses, including diversion and trafficking by employees, contract providers, and patients. In 2008, we investigated an allegation that a Sioux San pharmacy technician 

in Rapid City, South Dakota, stole large quantities of Vicodin and Tramadol. When 

questioned by our special agents, the employee admitted to stealing large quantities 

of narcotics from the IHS pharmacy, which she then sold on the street for cash. During a search of her home, our special agents found additional evidence of stolen narcotics. The employee pled guilty to a felony count of theft. During the course of our 

investigation, we discovered that the IHS pharmacy lacked effective security controls to prevent and detect drug diversion, such as security cameras and two-person 

inventory counts. 

Conclusion 

The work I have testified about today reflects OIG’s serious commitment to ensuring the integrity of IHS programs. Our Sioux Falls office has significant expertise 

with these issues and dedicates over 30 percent of its workload to investigating 

fraud and abuse in IHS. Additionally, the Inspector General serves on the Secretary’s Intradepartmental Council on Native American Affairs and has personally 

toured Indian country. Through the dedicated efforts of OIG professionals, we will 

continue working to deter fraud, waste, and abuse within IHS and the tribal programs. Thank you for your support of this mission. I welcome any questions you 

may have. 

The CHAIRMAN. Mr. Roy, thank you very much for your testimony as well. 

We have one additional witness but I think we will have to do 

that after this first panel. 

Let me begin to ask some questions and try to understand what 

is happening in this Area Office. If I might, let me put up the 

EEOC complaints for the Aberdeen Region, if I can use that chart. 

Ms. Red Thunder, let me ask you to talk us through, what do you 

think is happening in this Agency when you see that trend with 

respect to EEO complaints by year? These are people at the workplace, in the IHS in the Aberdeen Region, saying, I am alleging the 

following, and all kinds of allegations. So, it seems to me this appears to be a completely dysfunctional Agency just based on those 

lines. Your reaction? 

Ms. RED THUNDER. Every Indian Health Service employee has a 

right to file an EEO complaint and I believe, I also am committed 

to having a fair workplace, and I support Dr. Roubideaux’s high expectation of our employees. And some of this, I believe, is a push 

back from employees in the standards that we have set as of this 

past year. 

In addition, we have provided more training. Rather than on an 

annual basis to our supervisors, we are providing quarterly trainVerDate Nov 24 2008 12:56 Feb 28, 2011 Jkt 063826 PO 00000 Frm 00027 Fmt 6633 Sfmt 6601 S:\DOCS\63826.TXT JACK PsN: JACKF
24 

ing to our supervisors so they can take action at the local level and 

resolve those complaints at the local Service Unit level. 

The CHAIRMAN. Let me ask you about, now this is an example 

of troublesome things that I see throughout this time period, 2008. 

November 2008, the Aberdeen Office conducted a review of the 

Quentin Burdock Memorial Hospital after there had been significant diversions of patients so that patients could not get access to 

that hospital. They had to drive 100 and some miles one way or 

the other to find another hospital. 

The reviewing, this is an internal review by the Aberdeen Area, 

concluded that two individuals had made the decision to divert 

services without a proactive effort to identify the root causes of the 

problem or find alternative means. The reviewer also found that 

one of those individuals had created an intimidating work environment where the subordinates were in fear of retaliation. The report 

says, eliminating the bad behaviors of these two employees is critical to changing the facility to being patient focused. 

Then, that particular employee that your internal report has as 

an intimidating work environment, subordinates in fear of retaliation, that person was never disciplined. In fact, was given a $4,000 

bonus. 

Tell me, how does that happen? How does that work? I mean, 

you do your own internal evaluation and they say, you know what? 

We have got a couple of employees here that are trouble. And not 

only does the employee not get confronted or there is no discipline, 

but the employee gets a bonus. 

Ms. RED THUNDER. I understand your concern, Senator Dorgan. 

When we do a local review, there is a corrective action plan that 

is required for the CEO to complete. And we have established some 

controls where those corrective action plans are now submitted to 

the Area and we track those on a regular basis. And, if they are 

not held accountable, then disciplinary action is taken against the 

Service Unit Director. So, stronger oversight has been in place 

since I have been Area Director. 

The CHAIRMAN. Well, except you were the Area Director when I 

showed up at the hospital because there were massive problems 

there. We knew it. You were there. You sat around a table with 

me. And nothing has changed. 

Ms. RED THUNDER. We actually disciplined this Service Unit Director. 

The CHAIRMAN. Well, yes, you do that. Actually, that person was 

on paid leave for some long while and then, that is part of the having now seven new Directors in two years. But the other people 

that have been cited in internal reports and so on as creating intimidating circumstances for employees, which I suppose probably 

provokes this spike in EEO complaints, nothing has been done in 

those areas. 

I just, I find all of this very difficult. When I just asked you the 

question, I did not describe the title of the people just for their 

own, I probably should have. But you said, well, it goes to this and 

that process. Does it ever go to a circumstance where when you 

have an internal report that says this employee is not functioning 

in the way an employee is expected to function, that somebody 

25 

says, wait a second, this person is put on notice right now and may 

well be terminated as a result moving forward? 

And I ask that question because we had a case in North Dakota, 

which you are familiar with, someone was sent to run the Spirit 

Lake Nation health facility, and the Tribe actually took the unusual action of banishing that person from their Reservation they 

were so furious at the way she behaved. 

As I began to look at that to find out what is going on here, I 

found out that this is the third place that that person had been and 

the first two places she had been a failure and the person had, I 

believe, four EEO complaints filed against her, adjudicated, taxpayers paid the bill, and then she is sent to Spirit Lake Nation and 

does such a poor job that, and by the way, that was taken care of 

because the Tribe not only wanted to banish her but finally you all 

decided to transfer her. She still works for you. 

My point is, I do not think it works unless you decide that employees who are not functioning the way you expect them to function are going to be gone. Describe to me why someone is working 

in a circumstance where you see multiple EEO complaints adjudicated against someone and they are still on your payroll. 

Ms. RED THUNDER. I have to take a minute, Senator Dorgan, to 

process. My first language is Lakota, so I have to process that. 

The CHAIRMAN. While you are thinking about it, I will give you 

a chance to think about that, we were told that the Deputy Director, your Deputy Director of the Aberdeen Area, Shelly Harris, has 

been on paid administrative leave for some while. Is that the case? 

Ms. RED THUNDER. Yes, sir. 

The CHAIRMAN. And you did not report, that was not in the reports we received about paid administrative leave. We had asked 

for reports on who is on paid administrative leave and where because there has been substantial amounts of it. That was not in the 

report that was sent to us. So, why is the Deputy Director of the 

Aberdeen Area on paid administrative leave? Or, is she still on 

paid administrative leave? 

Ms. RED THUNDER. She is on paid administrative leave. But I am 

uncomfortable talking about that particular case because it is a 

personnel issue. 

The CHAIRMAN. But, but, look, I have been told that for 10 years. 

Everybody’s uncomfortable talking about something. If your Deputy 

Director is on paid administrative leave, how long has she been on 

paid administrative leave? 

Ms. RED THUNDER. I believe for the last 12 months. 

The CHAIRMAN. So for 12 months your Deputy Director has been 

paid by the American taxpayers and not working because you put 

her on paid administrative leave? 

Ms. RED THUNDER. She has actually been assigned work, so she 

is actually working from home currently until this investigation 

has been resolved. 

The CHAIRMAN. What kind of an investigation takes 12 months 

to resolve? 

Ms. RED THUNDER. With the HR system, I guess I am not really—— 

The CHAIRMAN. Well, then maybe we need to change the system. 

I watched this happen at Quentin Burdock. I am just asking the 

26 

question. I did not know the answer that you were going to give 

me today but, because I had somebody call me and say the Deputy 

Director in Aberdeen has been on paid administrative leave and I 

said, no, I do not think so because the material they sent to us does 

not include that. 

So, first of all, somebody made a mistake in sending us information. I want the right information, I want accurate information and 

complete information. That was not the case. So how did that happen? Were you aware that the information you sent us did not include that? 

Ms. RED THUNDER. Not all of the information. There were dozens 

of documents that were sent and I did not have a chance to review 

all the documents that were submitted. 

The CHAIRMAN. I understand. You and I, two years ago, were at 

Quentin Burdock and you and the Director of the Health Service 

at that point indicated they were going to give me a report on 

Quentin Burdock. I never received it. 

And let me just say to you, I do not know you and I am not suggesting you are either fit or unfit for the job you are performing. 

All I am saying is, can you understand how some of us look at this 

system and then think for a moment about what if we were on the 

other end of this trying to get healthcare from a system that does 

not work? 

I went through three affiliated Tribes’ clinic one day in North 

Dakota and the doctor, a wonderful man, said to me, this is where 

our new x-ray machine is going to be and it is going to change everything. I am so excited. This is the space, he said, as soon as we 

get it. I said, how long have your been waiting? He said about a 

year and a half. I said, well, what are you waiting for? He said, 

it has all been approved. It is just waiting for the signatures of the 

Aberdeen Office. We just cannot get it through the Aberdeen Office. 

It is going to get done. It is just delayed because of bureaucracy. 

So, for a year and a half, patients do not get this because the Aberdeen Office apparently is like a big morass of glue. Papers come 

in and never come out. And so, do you understand, when you look 

at this through the lens of somebody who is wanting healthcare 

from the system, let us say somebody at Spirit Lake that shows up 

with a woman that has been transferred two additional times because she was not capable of doing the job and has complaints 

against her, and then she is still working for you all these years 

later? 

I mean, that is, you know, I am not trying to browbeat you. I am 

just telling you this system is not working. It just is not working. 

And you have been there two years. And I think, I suggested to Dr. 

Roubideaux when she was here, you are going to have to tip this 

upside down and shake it and make sure the ones that should fall 

out fall out and you got the good people left and you run a first 

class system that people can be proud of. 

It is not the case now. And I think Senator Franken asked the 

question, with what we are learning about Aberdeen, what would 

we learn about other agencies, other regions if we did the same investigation? I fear that I know the answer. But I believed that we 

had to do this because things just stuck out like big thumbs to say 

you have got to get a hold of this. 

27 

Ms. RED THUNDER. Yes. 

The CHAIRMAN. So, how does the Committee begin to have some 

confidence? I have not gone through hardly any of the questions I 

have, unfortunately, and I have got to turn to my colleagues here 

because I have overstayed my welcome on questions. But there are 

so many questions, stolen narcotics, you know, we have all of this 

evidence of what has gone on and it all comes back to effective 

management, someone on top saying, here is our expectation, meet 

it or leave. Be a part of a team that wins and works and does good 

jobs and does the job we expect or you are gone. 

But what I see is people being rewarded despite the fact that 

complaints are lodged against them, adjudicated against them, and 

they get a bonus. So now, yes Dr. Roubideaux? 

Dr. ROUBIDEAUX. Senator Dorgan, we absolutely agree with you 

that what has happened over the years in the Aberdeen Area is absolutely unacceptable. And we thank you for this investigation to 

help bring some of these issues to light. 

You are right. Strong management is needed at the top to say 

this is unacceptable and employees will be held accountable. So, as 

we are reviewing the information from the investigation, I do believe that what we are doing now is creating the foundation for 

longstanding and real change in the Indian Health Service. 

The issue about the EEO complaints, EEO complaints are allegations that an individual has been discriminated against and it is 

usually related to a conflict between a manager and an employee. 

I actually am not surprised that EEO complaints are going up because we are starting to hold people more accountable and people 

will complain when they are getting disciplinary action. But I know 

that the problem with the process related to EEO complaints we 

can improve. We can do more training. We are actually trying to 

do that. 

I have confidence in Ms. Red Thunder because she realized that 

the EEO Program in the Aberdeen Area needs more support and 

within the last month she requested that the headquarters take 

over the management of the EEO Program in the Aberdeen Area 

and we have come to an agreement on that. That is the first step 

in improving the process to try to make sure we are handling these 

issues fairly, but also holding people accountable. 

In terms of this issue of administrative leave, there are some 

cases where we do have to put people on leave while investigations 

are pending, but it should be the very minimal time. I agree with 

you. We cannot continue to have people on administrative leave for 

long bits of time. 

All of these issues at some of these more troubled Service Units, 

I really think that the relationships that we are trying to develop 

with the Tribes will help. And, I do think that the efforts of holding 

people accountable will send a message throughout the organization. The Aberdeen Area Director has already disciplined five 

CEOs. I am aware there are others that are not following her directives and that may be at risk for disciplinary action and I encourage her to take action against them. 

The situation in Aberdeen is unacceptable and it is a part of my 

priorities throughout the entire IHS to hold more employees accountable. 

28 

The CHAIRMAN. Let me, with the indulgence of my colleagues, 

say one more thing. 

Ms. Red Thunder, the number two person in the Aberdeen District is your Deputy. Your Deputy is not at work, apparently has 

been on leave paid by the taxpayer for a year. You did not tell us 

that when you were asked. And now you come here and you say 

you are uncomfortable telling us what has taken a year. And I am 

saying, I am uncomfortable having this Area service with the number two person not at work for 12 months and being paid and you 

cannot tell us because you are uncomfortable. 

We will subpoena the records and you will answer the subpoena, 

of course. But, you must, surely, all of you sitting there, understand the angst we have about this. 

Does anybody, do you believe that if my two colleagues had 

somebody on their staff that there was problem with that 12 

months later they would be at home being paid by the taxpayer? 

Not on your life. And that would be the case in any organization 

I am aware of. 

You make decisions. What are the facts, what is the requirement 

as a result of those facts and then make decisions. But, you know, 

I have so many questions. I am going to submit a rather lengthy 

list of questions and I know that you all have chafed at the fact 

we have asked so much of you. 

We are not asking nearly as much of you as a sick person is who 

comes to the IHS asking for help. They are the ones that are asking a lot of you, and too often they have not been satisfied. 

Senator Franken? 

Senator FRANKEN. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Dr. Roubideaux, I 

respect your efforts to address deficiencies within the Agency. But 

I am concerned that internal reviews have not been sufficient. For 

example, many of the issues described in the Committee investigation are not included in your April 2010 review, including missing 

narcotics, administrative leaves, reassignments and licensure 

issues. Can you please comment on the discrepancies between the 

two reviews? 

Dr. ROUBIDEAUX. Right. Well, the Aberdeen Area review that we 

completed in April was as a part of a greater look at how we do 

business in the Indian Health Service and was primarily focused 

on business practices. We also are very concerned about the quality 

of care and other issues related to that. 

But what I heard in the input from my employees when I asked 

for input during the past year, when I said what are the things you 

want us to focus now on, to improve in the Indian Health System, 

the vast majority of comments were about improving our business 

practices. And very little, actually, was about clinical care. Because 

I can understand it. The doctors are frustrated, the nurses are 

frustrated, everybody is frustrated by some of these problems we 

have with administrative issues. 

And so, I asked one of my deputies to develop a team that would 

develop a tool to do administrative reviews. The investigation has 

been actually very helpful for me to know that these are items of 

interest to the Committee and we can certainly do more of a review 

on these issues around the entire system because I know it is a 

very important issue. 

29 

I was just responding to the issues that were brought up to me 

from the input that we got from our staff. But those other issues 

are incredibly important, they are unacceptable, and we will be 

working on improving those areas. 

Senator FRANKEN. Well, let me express frustration that I think 

you heard from the Chairman. When I first got here, I remember 

talking to a member of this Committee on the other side and I wish 

he were here today. And he really, he knew I was going to be on 

this Committee and he seemed very dedicated to the work of this 

Committee. 

Then I went to visit him and we were talking about funding. And 

I know that you have, you know, not adequate funding in many 

cases. But he said, why should I vote for more funding when the 

bureaucracy is dysfunctional? 

So, we have kind of a Catch 22. We have members who do not 

want to increase funding because the bureaucracy is dysfunctional 

and you have got a situation where you feel under funded but you 

are not going to get it unless, you know, I see this tremendous discrepancy between your own internal reviews and then the review 

that this Committee initiated. And it just, it just feels like unless 

we can trust you to crack down and make this, the Health Service, 

work, we are in a conundrum here, we are in a Catch 22. Do you 

understand that? 

Dr. ROUBIDEAUX. Absolutely. Senator Franken, I completely 

agree with you. And I have publicly stated that in order to get the 

support we need, we must demonstrate a willingness and real 

progress and improvement. We are accountable for our public resources and we need to show improvement. 

The OIG, the things that were mentioned in the OIG report, 

things that have been mentioned by the Committee, the things that 

were discovered in our review, I have been aware of those for many 

years. And now that I am the Director, I have the opportunity to 

make a difference and to start to make real progress on these 

issues. And we are starting. But I am not going to say that we can 

fix this overnight. It is a huge problem. 

But I am committed to making as much progress as possible. 

And can I be that strong one to be able to do this job? Absolutely. 

I have disciplined employees, I have stopped transferring problem 

employees. I have made it clear to our employees that we are going 

to hold people accountable, and I have implemented a number of 

reforms in the performance management system. 

So, I do think that I, I have to work as hard as I can. These are 

my people as well and I am just as concerned as you are as well. 

Senator FRANKEN. If you have been aware of all of these problems, why did you not focus on them in your review? 

Dr. ROUBIDEAUX. The review that we did of the areas was for a 

different focus, more on some of the technical management issues. 

Senator FRANKEN. I understand that. You said that. I am asking, 

if you are aware of these issues and these issues, I mean, there are 

narcotics that are completely out of control that go, you know, and 

we know that we have abuse problems of narcotics in Indian Country. 

I mean, these are all kinds of, you now, listen, I also have so 

many questions here that, and I am already past my time. But it 

30 

seems to me that if you are aware of these problems, that you 

would not have done a review that was so narrow that it did not 

go into these problems. 

Dr. ROUBIDEAUX. Well, we are actually addressing those issues 

other ways. I do believe that the performance management process 

and the lack of accountability is a bigger overriding issue that surrounds all of these issues. And if we can work on the root cause 

of holding people accountable for bad behavior and poor performance as well as improving the quality, I think that we can address 

the root causes of some of these issues. 

Accountability is a huge issue for me and we are implementing 

a number of activities to improve that accountability. And that 

really is fundamentally what is wrong with the system, is that 

there is a lack of accountability. 

And if we can implement a stronger performance management 

process, encourage our managers to take care of problems rather 

than transferring them around, and to really address what is important, which is improving the quality of care. I have actually met 

with the OIG and I have presented our issues to the IHS and have, 

am really looking forward to them assisting us as we move forward 

to improve these issues. 

Senator FRANKEN. Well, I am out of time and I am going to submit a lot of questions in writing. I suggest that this be done in a 

way that convinces us that it is going to be done because I despair. 

You know, you are from, I just went to, I did not go to Rosebud 

but I went to Pine Ridge. And 85 percent unemployment there, you 

know. I did not have meetings about healthcare there, I had them 

about housing. But unbelievable deprivation, unbelievable problems. And many, many of them in this kind of cycle of mismanagement. 

Therefore, why throw more money at it? And we, you know, we 

need to turn this stuff around. And I am going to end my questions, but I will submit a number of questions, both for you and for 

all of you, Ms. Red Thunder and for Mr. Roy. 

Thank you very much. 

The CHAIRMAN. Senator Franken, thank you very much. 

Before I call on Senator Johnson, I wanted to just mention that 

I have to take a conference call in the back with Vice President 

Biden and my colleague, Senator Conrad, which was scheduled 

after I scheduled this hearing. So, Senator Franken has agreed to 

chair while I am on the conference call with Vice President Biden. 

Senator Johnson? 

Senator JOHNSON. Thank you. Dr. Roubideaux, the review conducted by the IHS indicated the need to take immediate action to 

ensure preservation of CMS accreditation. What are these specific 

action items? 

Dr. ROUBIDEAUX. Well, the one thing we are proud of in Indian 

Country is that 100 percent of our facilities are accredited and we 

want to do everything we can to make sure that that continues. 

What we do is that we have an internal process of technical assistance and ongoing survey preparedness to help our sites and 

then when there are either surprise surveys or regular surveys 

that have findings, we have a team go and help the facility to corVerDate Nov 24 2008 12:56 Feb 28, 2011 Jkt 063826 PO 00000 Frm 00034 Fmt 6633 Sfmt 6601 S:\DOCS\63826.TXT JACK PsN: JACKF
31 

rect some of those so that they can have a corrective action plan 

to avoid losing their accreditation. 

So far, we have not lost accreditation and we are very serious 

and very aggressively looking into these recommendations that 

happen as a result of some of the surveys and unplanned visits. We 

are very committed to providing good quality of care and the 100 

percent accreditation that we have been able to maintain is very 

important to use. 

Senator JOHNSON. Ms. Red Thunder, it is my understanding that 

only the hospital in Rosebud has a policy on diversion in healthcare 

services. Are you familiar with the policy and can you explain some 

more about it? 

Ms. RED THUNDER. Yes. Most recently it came to my attention 

that Rosebud was the only hospital that had a policy on diversion. 

That is being shared with the other facilities in Aberdeen Area, so 

we do have a policy. 

Senator JOHNSON. What are the greatest challenges that contribute to diversion of healthcare services? 

Ms. RED THUNDER. Staffing is our major issue. I believe we want 

to provide safe patient care and if there is not nursing staff or providers, then we do not admit. We never close our ERs. Inpatient, 

we do not take any admissions but we refer to a higher level of 

care. 

Senator JOHNSON. Mr. Roy, based upon your review of IHS, what 

recommendations could you make about how to prevent and detect 

drug diversion? 

Mr. ROY. Well, we have made several recommendations to IHS, 

specifically, security measures. We are talking about changing 

locks on doors when there is a staff change and when there is staff 

turnover. We have also recommended the two person inventory 

counts. 

With respect to drug diversion, IHS has done a pretty good job 

of controlling Schedule 2 Narcotics, the Oxycontin and executions. 

What we still see an issue with is in respect to Schedule 3 drugs 

and non-schedule drugs because they are used on the street. They 

have a street value as well and they are an addictive drug as well. 

I would recommend, again, tighter security measures. For instance, in one of our management implication reports, we recommended cameras in a certain facility. We also recommended, 

again, this two person count. And although we have seen the two 

person count take place, we have yet to see cameras installed in 

that particular facility. We would hope to see those recommendations acted upon to better secure and help deter drug diversion. 

Senator JOHNSON. Is there any way of knowing the follow up on 

your recommendations? 

Mr. ROY. Well, when we submit a management implication report to an operating division of our department, we have an expectation that we receive a response in writing. And I would like to 

see better control of that. 

With respect to my special agents in the field, they are often at 

these facilities and there is eyes on where they certainly will notice 

if certain parameters, certain recommendations, have taken place. 

I think overall my special agents have a good rapport. They work 

well in Indian Country on these Reservations and have a rapport 

32 

with managers and that facilitates this communication process and 

also the ability to check and see if our recommendations have been 

implemented. 

Senator JOHNSON. Dr. Roubideaux, what factors account for the 

Aberdeen Area’s success at obligating the Stimulus Funding? 

Dr. ROUBIDEAUX. Well, I am really proud of the Aberdeen Area 

for leading the other areas in obligating the ARRA funding. I think 

that this is an incredible accomplishment. It has been very important for us to make sure that we get this funding out so that it can 

benefit the programs that will be benefitting from equipment or 

sanitation or maintenance and improvements. And I know that 

they have worked very hard and have worked very hard with the 

business functions that are necessary to get that money obligated. 

This has been a big priority of mine. All of the Area Directors 

have this in their performance plans, that they had to obligate 100 

percent of those funds by the end of the fiscal year in order to receive a good evaluation. And this has been a priority of ours. 

Senator JOHNSON. Ms. Red Thunder, how have you been able to 

increase third party collection during your service as Director? 

Ms. RED THUNDER. At some of our locations, there is inadequate 

staffing. And so we have actually procured an area-wide contractor 

to assist. Through that contractor, they do coding and billing, back 

billing, and we also have been successful with the State of South 

Dakota and the State of North Dakota to negotiate multiple encounter rates. And so that has helped in the increase in our collections. 

Senator JOHNSON. My time has expired. 

Senator FRANKEN. [Presiding.] Thank you, Senator. 

Right now, I would like the witnesses to stay seated if you will. 

Thank you for your testimony and I would like to keep you there 

so that we can continue asking questions. 

I would like now to call Mr. Ron His Horse Is Thunder to provide 

his testimony. Thank you, sir. 

STATEMENT OF RON HIS HORSE IS THUNDER, EXECUTIVE 

DIRECTOR, GREAT PLAINS TRIBAL CHAIRMEN’S HEALTH 

BOARD 

Mr. HIS HORSE IS THUNDER. Mr. Chairman, members of the 

Committee, thank you for giving me this opportunity to testify before you today. Thank you, especially, for having this hearing and 

this investigation to bring out the disparities in healthcare in the 

Aberdeen Area. 

As a Tribal member and a former Tribal Chairman, I have had 

to deal over and over with my constituents coming to me and complaining, expressing their concerns about the inadequate 

healthcare that they have received. 

I am absolutely amazed at some of the information that this 

Committee has been able to glean from its investigation, especially 

the Inspector General’s report in terms of some of his findings. And 

I also am appalled, as you are, by the idea of having someone who 

has been on administrative leave for over a year, that some decision should have been made by now in terms of the investigation 

of this person so that either they are on board or they are not on 

board any longer. 

33 

So, thank you again for the information that you have gleaned 

during your investigation and allowing me this opportunity to testify. 

One of the things we have consistently heard, and it is true, is 

that Indian Health Service is under funded. When you have more 

appropriations going to the Federal prisons for healthcare for prisoners than you do for Indian Health Service, then yes, there is a 

problem in disparity in funding. 

However, Mr. Chairman, as you have pointed out, your colleagues in the Senate and on the House side are a little bit more 

than reluctant to give additional appropriations to an agency that 

obviously has problems in managing the services given the appropriations it currently has and some of the misspending, etcetera, 

that you have found that yes, it is hard to convince the rest of your 

colleagues that they need to give the additional funds to IHS. 

And so throwing more money at the problem, yes, will guaranty 

some additional services, more quantity, but truly what I think we 

need to take a look at is the quality of services that are currently 

being given, given the appropriations that we have. There are obviously some changes that need to be made so that current appropriation levels can give better quality care. 

And once that is established, if you can give better quality care, 

then I think it is going to be easier for the Senate and the House 

to give additional appropriations. I know that this past year there 

has been an increase of 13 percent in the appropriations to IHS, 

particularly to contract health services. And as my predecessor, 

Carol Ann Hart, used to say, and Senator Dorgan is fond of quoting 

her, do not get sick after June because the appropriation could run 

out. 

Well, the 13 percent increase has ensured that contract health 

services, at leastwise for this year, will hopefully make it to the 

end of the year. But, given that, there are other problems with Indian Health Service that need to be taken care of so that more appropriations can be had by Congress. 

One of the areas we think can be shored up and provide additional funding to the Area without an increase from Congress is in 

third party billing. That was mentioned here. I think Charlene 

mentioned that there was a $30 million increase this year in recovering from third party payers. 

But I also am aware of this, that in this year, part of that $30 

million actually is a total of $80 million that has been collected 

from October of last year to June of this year, $80 million has been 

collected. I am also aware though that at least another $10 million 

per month could have been collected. Why was it not collected? Because, as has been mentioned, there is under-staffing and undertraining. And so, they are reliant on consultants to help them process this third party billing. 

It is through talking with them, the consultants, that I am aware 

that there is additional dollars left on the table. If we are talking 

$10 million additional dollars on the table per month, we are talking about $120 million still available within our Service Area that 

could be collected if we had a better system and better training. So, 

that is one of the problems that we see. 

34 

One of the other problems that we have with the local IHS is 

this, although with Charlene and Dr. Roubideaux there has been 

additional consultation with the Tribe. There has been more of a 

partnership, if you will. However, there still are some unanswered 

questions that some Tribes have. 

In my testimony, we provided at least one example, an anecdote 

of one Tribe which believes they have not had the transparency 

that they need and that was the Wagner Service Unit on the 

Yankton Sioux Tribe where a good portion of their funding was 

given to another Tribe and they were not told why. It has not been 

transparent to them, at leastwise to the Yankton Sioux Tribe, as 

to the reason why 30 percent of their funding went to another 

Tribe. 

The Yankton Sioux Tribe believes that the budget formulation is 

based on outdated data. And so, data collection needs to be shored 

up so that you have good data to make budget formulation questions. The Yankton Sioux Tribe specifically says that they have 

18,000 open cases of clients coming through their doors. The data 

that IHS is using is saying only 3,500, you only have a 3,500 user 

population. Therefore, their budget is based on 3,500 as opposed to 

the 18,000. That is a problem. 

One of the other issues that has been discussed is personnel. 

There seems to be either a revolving door there or they are on administrative leave for so long. Part of that does go back to the idea 

of lack of adequate funding to attract and retain good service providers at the local areas. Local Service Units cannot attract them 

and cannot retain them and therefore they are reliant on contracting for those services, which takes actually, in my opinion and 

in many of the Tribal Chairmen’s opinions, much more money as 

well as having the clients and patients having to travel such a long 

way to get services. 

One of the other problems that Tribal Chairmen wish to express 

is the idea of transportation for contract health services. In the 

past, prior to the 13 percent increase, if you had a patient who had 

cancer and had to leave from Standing Rock Reservation, any Reservation in South Dakota, and go to Rochester, Minnesota, sometimes a 500 mile drive, there was no transportation provided for 

many of those clients. 

I had a 13-year-old girl come into my office as Tribal Chairman, 

she did not have any money to go to Rochester to have a CAT scan 

done for a brain tumor. Our Tribe did not have the money to give 

to her either. And so what happened to the young girl? I do not 

know. I know that I reached into my pocket as Tribal Chairman 

and gave her some of funds out of my pocket, but I know it was 

not enough to get to Rochester. 

So, that is a problem, transportation of clients to get to these 

contract health services off the Reservation. I know that they are 

providing services, transportation, now if you are Medicaid eligible 

because Medicaid will pay for a one-way trip. But once they get 

there, there is no money to get these people back home. 

One instance that I am aware of, and I forget the young man’s 

name, is a 15 year old diagnosed with cancer, going to be sent off, 

off the Reservation. He will be transported, yes, but he will not be 

transported home. 

35 

So, the Tribe, at its last celebration, had what we call Blanket 

Downs, and that is to go around and ask all the Tribal members 

who are currently at that celebration to reach into their pocket and 

give a dollar or two so that that young man could have his mother 

transported with him and have transportation back home. This is 

in fact the young man and he is 16 years old. 

And that is the celebration where people are coming out and giving their last dollar. This on one of the poorest reservations in the 

United States. These are the poorest of the poor people in this 

Country reaching into their own pocket to help with transportation 

for this young man so he can get to his services. So, transportation 

is a problem. 

There are a host of other problems as well. But even with all the 

problems, Mr. Chairman, we believe that Charlene Red Thunder is 

probably the best Regional Director that IHS has provided us since 

its inception. She needs more time, and some additional resources, 

but we think she can do an adequate job. 

There are problems with the system that she has to deal with 

that Dr. Roubideaux will hopefully find some solutions for. Part of 

it is, how do you, selection of employees takes six months, at a minimum six months. So, you have a vacancy and you do not have a 

healthcare provider who is filling that position for at least six 

months. That is six months at a minimum. Many times it takes 

longer than that. 

At Standing Rock Sioux Reservation, for example, the mental 

health position was unfilled for more than two years. Standing 

Rock Reservation has suffered one of the highest suicide rates in 

this Country and needs a mental health provider. But that position 

on our Reservation had gone unfilled for almost two years. Why? 

Part of it is just the process and selection, recruitment, not only 

the money but the selection process itself is at fault. It should not 

take six months to hire somebody, a qualified person who is willing 

to come. 

I see that I am out of time. Thank you very much for having me. 

[The prepared statement of Mr. His Horse Is Thunder follows:] 

PREPARED STATEMENT OF RON HIS HORSE IS THUNDER, EXECUTIVE DIRECTOR, 

GREAT PLAINS TRIBAL CHAIRMEN’S HEALTH BOARD

Introduction 

Mr. Chairman and other Members of the Committee: 

I am pleased to be here and want to thank you for your hard work to ensure that 

the appropriate authority and funding for healthcare services is available to meet 

the needs of the 17 Tribal Nations of the Great Plains. I am Ron His Horse Is Thunder, Executive Director of the Great Plains Tribal Chairman’s Health Board an association of 17 Sovereign Indian Tribes in the four-state region of SD, ND, NE and 

IA. I am an enrolled member of the Standing Rock Sioux Tribe, The Great Plains 

Region, aka Aberdeen Area Indian Health Care has 18 IHS and Tribally managed 

service units. 

We are the largest Land based area served of all the Regions with land holdings 

of Reservation Trust Land of over 11 million acres. There are 17 Federally Recognized Tribes with an estimated enrolled membership of 150,000. To serve the 

healthcare needs of the Great Plains there are 7 IHS Hospitals, 9 Health Centers 

operated by IHS and 5 Tribally operated Health Centers. There are 7 Health Stations under IHS and 7 Tribal Health Stations. There is one Residential Treatment 

Center and 2 Urban Health Clinics. The Tribes of the Great Plains are greatly underserved by the IHS and other federal agencies with the IHS Budget decreasing 

in FY 2008 over the FY 2007 amount. This is in spite of increased populations and 

36 

need. The GPTCA/AATCHB is committed to a strengthening comprehensive public 

healthcare and direct healthcare systems for our enrolled members. 

Health Data and Overview 

As documented in many Reports, the Tribes in the Great Plains region suffer from 

among the worst health disparities in the Nation, including several-fold greater 

rates of death from numerous causes, including diabetes, alcoholism, suicide and infant mortality. For example, the National Infant Mortality Rate is about 6.9 per 

1,000 live births, and it is over 13.1 per 1,000 live births in the Aberdeen Area of 

the Indian Health Service—more than double the National rate. The life expectancy 

for our Area is 66.8 years—more than 10 years less than the National life expectancy, and the lowest in the Indian Health Service (IHS) population. Leading causes 

of death in our Area include heart disease, unintentional injuries, diabetes, liver disease and cancer incidents as a whole has increased. In most cases in the Northern 

Plains cancer is diagnosed in the late stages, which makes it harder to diagnose and 

treat as well as poor access to early screening. While these numbers are heartbreaking to us, as Tribal leaders, these causes of death are preventable in most 

cases. They, therefore, represent an opportunity to intervene and to improve the 

health of our people. Additional challenges we face, and which add to our health 

disparities, include high rates of poverty, lwer levels of educational attainment, and 

high rates of unemployment. 

All of these social factors are embedded within a healthcare system that is severely underfunded. As you have heard before, per capita expenditures for 

healthcare under the Indian Health Service is significantly lower than other federally funded systems. In FY 2005, IHS was funded at $2,130 per person per year. 

This is compared to per capita expenditures for Medicare beneficiaries at over 

$7,600, Veterans Administration at over $5,200, Medicaid at over $5,000 and the 

Bureau of Prisons at nearly $4,000. Obviously, our system is severely underfunded. 

It is important to note that as Tribal members, we are the only population in the 

United States that is born with a legal right to healthcare. Tribes view the Indian 

Health Service as being the largest pre-paid health plan in history. 

Great Plains Indian Health Hearing Objectives 

Mr. Chairman, Members of the Committee, this hearing provides a significant opportunity to (1) identify Indian Health Service (IHS) administrative areas of concern, (2) submit Tribal comments on detrimental effects of IHS administrative weaknesses, (3) suggest possible constructive action, and (4) express urgency for congressional support for strengthening agency operations in light of recently enacted Indian health reforms. 

You, and others of this Committee, have been very instrumental in promoting 

needed Indian health legislative provisions in the recently enacted Affordable Care 

Act (ACA). Our Tribal leaders are grateful for your efforts to secure passage of the 

Indian Health Care Improvement Act reauthorization as part of the ACA, as well 

as Tribal specific language in the national ACA provisions. 

However, as you may realize, if these new authorities are overlaid on agency operations and staff protocols that are weak or impaired, these new provisions’ benefits 

are immediately lessened. 

Secondly, our Great Plains Tribes are Direct Service Tribes, whose partnerships 

with the IHS should be strengthened, without our Tribes resorting to Indian Self 

Determination Act (aka ‘‘638’’) compacting. If there were greater transparency, in 

the IHS Area’s administrative decision-making process, and greater joint IHS-Tribal 

program decision-making, this improved partnering could act to ensure accountability and deter certain mismanagement conduct. Such Joint Venturing will be 

vital in this new era of Health Reform implementation. 

Most importantly, when there is agency mismanagement of programs or resources, it is our tribal patients and communities who suffer. When there is inequity 

in resource allocations, preferential treatment or delayed decision-making, it is our 

tribal members’ whose health is immediately harmed. 

I will, today, provide some broad areas of agency program operation concern and, 

then a few examples of the consequences of poor performance, whether through neglect or mismanagement. 

Indian Health Service (IHS) Aberdeen Area 

Staffing. Our Area has been plagued by inadequate staffing, due to poor recruitment, rural and climate conditions, difficult facility and equipment conditions. Staffing that is obtained is often poorly trained and not prepared for the difficult conditions in their facility postings. Our Area suffers from insufficient funds for both recruitment and retention bonuses. We are in need of quality health professionals for 

37 

chronic, behavioral or preventive health care services, which services can act to forestall more critical or acute care and costs. 

Business Office. This function is critical to ensuring that we maximize all funding 

and reimbursements for patient care. This office will also be especially important 

in the new health reform endeavors. However, our direct service staff are often poorly trained, resulting in the untimely processing of billing and collection and missed 

appeal deadlines for disputed Medicaid reimbursement denials. It is our understanding that if our Area were to appeal initial Medicaid denials for coverage, we 

could likely recover up to 50 percent or more of disputed claims. These are Service 

Unit claims for reimbursement that run afoul of technical deficiencies that could be 

corrected with a more thorough documentation or clarification. 

What will happen if this trend continues, under the new Affordable Care Act 

(ACA) or the new VA-IHS coverage authorities and reimbursement protocols? Answer: lost income due to deficient staff training and lack of performance accountability; AND continuing tribal health disparities that were supposed to be alleviated 

by these new authorities. 

Human Resources (HR). HR office problems contribute to poor health services on 

many levels. HR staff, who are asked to prioritize assistance to one Service Unit 

over another, adjust quickly to inequitable staffing allocations and assistance. HR 

staff, who are not held to fast timelines for filling vacancies, contribute to (1) rising 

Contract Health Services’ (CHS) costs, (2) delayed patient treatments, and (3) higher morbidity and mortality levels. HR staff, who do not help Management use appropriate Employee Performance Management criteria and evaluation, contribute to 

discouraged and dispirited staff. Such demoralized or unfairly targeted staff can 

delay or improperly fulfill their responsibilities. 

Budget Formulation. Area Office budget formula inadequacies, such as insufficient 

or outdated patient workload data, can cause Service Unit to Service Unit, or Area 

to Area funding inequities. Area staff who do not ensure that data is current or uniform make it very difficult to secure needed funding increases. Area Staff who do 

not understand these various budget formulas or the national formula distribution 

factors place our Area at a disadvantage in any national program resource allocation. 

Area leadership is important in fighting for Area increases. Area Leadership cannot arbitrarily withhold monies from one Service Unit, though, to assist another 

Service Unit. Decisions to withhold Service Unit allocations cannot be made behind 

closed doors, nor to favor one community at expense of another [E.g. One SU with 

serious shortfall was only aided by taking monies away from only one other SU, 

when such shortfall could have been overcome by taking a little from each SU. Decision not satisfactorily explained to affected Tribe.] 

Pharmaceutical. Our Area has insufficient supplies and relies on older medication 

type. There seems to be an unwillingness to secure new medications (for heart, diabetes, skin graft treatment for diabetes related sores). This outdated pharmacy 

schedule (inventory) becomes a costly problem, both financially and patient healthwise. If older type medicines are inadequate, then patient is sent to a private provider who recommends more up to date drugs. Yet, these medicines are often not 

covered under Contract Health Service (CHS) referrals. Patients are often unable 

to pay for these meds and, so, do without. Again, this interrupts ongoing care and 

results in patient moving into an acute care stage when his/her health deteriorates. 

A modern pharmaceutical is not only important to our Tribal patients, but it will 

be critical for a more seamless melding between the IHS and any Affordable Care 

Act (ACA) coverage and reimbursement activities. It seems that a modern pharmaceutical, such as enjoyed by rest of the U.S., can only come to Indian country if it 

chooses to ‘‘638’’ compact. This is not the right mind set for improving our federal 

health care delivery system. Area Management should be advocating for proper drug 

supplies and treatment, and not be satisfied with status quo. 

Patient Transportation. There is simply not enough Emergency Medical Transport 

(EMT) or Community Health Representative (CHR) funding for this purpose. We 

have patients who are discouraged from seeking care because they have no way to 

travel to this care, aware of the long waits on arrival at a clinic or hospital; then 

need to walk many miles home after seeking such care. Our EMT vehicles must 

cope with rugged conditions and weather, and Medicaid or other funding is not adequate to rising gas, vehicle maintenance or replacement. Budget planning and funding on this front is critical. 

IHS staff are losing their compassion when they allow elderly patients to walk, 

wait and walk long distance again, after securing minimal care. At Sioux Sanitarium, one Health Board staff did decide to take action when she learned of such 

an instance. She drove out to find an elderly patient who had left the clinic to walk 

home on a long, dark road. Yet, how many others did not have this help? In another 

38 

instance, staff at the Sioux Sanitation facility told a disabled patient to take the city 

bus in for his appointment. This statement was made knowing that the patient’s 

neurological disorder (myasenthia gravis) was so disabling that he could not drive 

or stand to wait for a bus. There appears to be no budget being developed for patient transportation purposes, resulting in patients not receiving care until their 

condition has gone critical. Such poor planning and callous patient treatment increases preventable deaths or leads to other health crisis. 

Contract Health Services (CHS). Our Tribal Leaders have previously addressed 

the current CHS formula , and which we believe unfairly favors certain regions. The 

current formula directs an immediate and significant percent of new CHS funds (up 

to 20 percent) to Areas that do not contain inpatient facilities. These Areas then 

participate in the national allocation on the remaining funds, giving them two shots 

at the same budget. 

We all recognize that Indian health funding has been, until this Administration, 

squeezed painfully shut. This includes the CHS program. While a Tribal community 

may have an inpatient facility, this does not mean that this Tribe is not equally 

reliant on CHS for inpatient care services. First, such inpatient care facilities are, 

as we have noted, poorly staffed and equipped. Secondly, such staffing and equipment as exist are very basic. Thirdly, our large populations which helped justify the 

need for an inpatient care facility, also means that we have an equally large need 

for specialty or other care not available in our under-funded sites (heart, physical 

therapy, OB/GYN, etc.). 

This CHS formula is a prime example of the many inter-connecting problems afflicting the Area’s effective program management, and of this vital program in particular. If CHS program staff do not do a thorough job on documenting patient workloads, new budget and increases are difficult to obtain. If CHS staff do not do a thorough job on documenting denials or timely processing appeals, a false picture of the 

true CHS need is presented. Likewise, if CHS staff does not share with the Budget 

Formulation and Clinical Care team, the types of patient care being sought from 

private providers, funding for in-house staffing and equipment are difficult to come 

by too. 

Poorly trained staff, demoralized staff, or overburdened staff, in CHS or other programs, contributes directly to the amount of patient care is available to our communities. 

Conclusion 

Mr. Chairman, and other Members of this Committee, as you have seen, any mismanagement costs lives. Any mismanagement, whether staffing inequities, employee 

performance problems, budget and data deficiencies, billing and reimbursement 

weakness, or patient access difficulties, all lead down the same path of poor Indian 

patient health care. 

We ask that the Committee work with us to devise Direct Service Tribal and IHS 

partnerships, appropriate to our circumstances. We support improved transparency 

and joint Tribal-IHS decision-making to improve accountability and better Tribal 

awareness. There is an urgent need for these activities to be accompanied by needed 

resources, so that we are able to carry our weight in the new ACA structure and 

with the new Indian Health Care Improvement Act reauthorization authorities. 

Thank you for this opportunity and we look forward to working with you and others on the Committee on strengthening our health care services. 

Senator FRANKEN. Thank you, Mr. His Horse Is Thunder. 

You mentioned, sort of, disbursement of funds. Dr. Roubideaux, 

as I mentioned in my statement, we have a serious shortage of 

Contract Health Services funds in Minnesota. So, when I hear that 

Aberdeen has surpluses and has been transferring CHS funds to 

other programs as recently as this year, it kind of makes me a little peeved. This, especially, since many of my colleagues and I have 

been advocating for increased CHS funding. 

Do you believe IHS currently has the authority to transfer CHS 

funds for other uses? And what do we need to make these transfers 

stop? 

Dr. ROUBIDEAUX. Well, Senator Franken, I can understand why 

you would be concerned about that issue. I think it is important 

to note that I have testified that we are under funded overall in 

39 

the Contract Health Service Program by over $300 million. That is 

nationwide. And I want to reassure you that in the Aberdeen Area 

overall, there are huge needs and very limited resources. 

I think what you may have heard about is an unusual case 

where a facility changed from a hospital to an outpatient clinic. 

Our current Contract Health Service formula right now favors giving more funding to clinics because they do not have hospitals so 

they have to refer out more. 

I know there are lots of questions about how we distribute the 

Contract Health Services funds. I called for a consultation on this 

during the past year and have a work group of Tribal elected representatives and Federal representatives from each area that has 

met several times to talk about how we improve the business of the 

Contract Health Services Program so that we can bill for more dollars, so that we can negotiate better rates, so that we can be more 

efficient in the process. 

But they are also looking at the formula, and what they are looking at is the distribution of Contract Health Service funds, the 

small amount that we get, is that equitable? Is that fair? Are the 

right programs getting more of the resources? 

The current formula right now gives more if you have more 

users. It gives more based on if you have higher costs in the area. 

But it also has an access factor which favors giving more funding 

to clinics that do not have inpatient services. And so, I think that 

that was an inadvertent problem related to that. 

In terms of funding transfers between facilities, that is something that I have heard a lot of Tribal complaints about in the entire system. I have heard them complaining that they hear that 

some of their funds went somewhere else and they did not know 

what happened. Well, to me that is unacceptable. So, I have made 

it clear to all my area Directors that they should not be transferring funds unless they have a justified reason, they have agreement of both Service Units, and agreement of all the Tribes involved. 

And the Aberdeen Area Director has just started implementing 

that policy. I know, and confirmed last night, that our other Area 

Directors know that that is our new policy in the Indian Health 

Service. There are to be no transfers unless everybody is in agreement and they pay them back. So, that is one of the improvements 

that we have made in this area. 

Senator FRANKEN. Okay. Thank you. 

Mr. Roy, Mr. His Horse Is Thunder spoke to a lot of the frustrations that are reflected in the report and the dysfunction that is reflected in the report. And the widespread problems you uncovered 

in your investigation are overwhelmingly. 

Can you please comment on where you think is the best place to 

start reforming IHS and any specific recommendations you have for 

this Committee as we try to improve the Agency. 

Mr. ROY. Sir, please understand that from an investigative 

standpoint, we operate under the guise of criminal investigations 

and a fact finding mission. But with respect to the three areas that 

I discussed in my testimony, mismanagement is something that the 

IHS should certainly look at. 

40 

With respect to how the operation runs, I would suggest, again, 

the Committee here has done a great job at focusing a light on 

these issues and I would certainly hope that this focus continues. 

And I believe that, with the proper leadership and management in 

place, you will see improvement in the Indian Health Service, specifically with the Aberdeen Area. 

Senator FRANKEN. Again, just any specific recommendations from 

having done this report? 

Mr. ROY. I have spoken about the drug diversion issue with respect to the security angle of that. Misconduct, there is a myriad 

of misconduct issues that organizations see. I guess why I described it as a point that we need to be aware of is certainly because of the amount of allegations that come into OIG pertaining 

to misconduct. 

But in terms of specific changes, you know, I would like to submit additional testimony and utilize our management implication 

reports to give you a better sense of what the OIG would feel would 

be in the best interests of IHS. 

Senator FRANKEN. Thank you. I want to ask Senator Johnson, I 

know I am over my time but I have not been Chairman very often. 

[Laughter.] 

Senator FRANKEN. So I have the prerogative to ask an extra 

question or two. Would you indulge me? 

Senator JOHNSON. Yes, I will. 

Senator FRANKEN. Thank you. I am sorry. 

I was curious, because Mr. His Horse Is Thunder spoke very eloquently about the problems that we have all been talking about 

today, and yet at the end said that Ms. Red Thunder is the best 

administrator that you have had. How long have you been there? 

How long have you been in charge? 

Ms. RED THUNDER. Two years. 

Senator FRANKEN. Three years. 

Ms. RED THUNDER. Two years, 2008. 

Senator FRANKEN. Two years. Okay. I guess my question is, we 

have a pretty devastating report here and yet, and I would feel on 

the defensive if I were you and I would not blame you for feeling 

that, and I would not blame us for putting you on the defensive for 

this bad report, and yet Mr. His Horse Is Thunder spoke very highly of you and in your defense. 

And I would like to ask him, if this is the case, what do you, 

what do we do? If we get such a bad report out of an area that has 

been administered by a person you think is the best administrator 

you have ever had, where do we begin here? 

Mr. HIS HORSE IS THUNDER. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Let me 

start by saying this. The slide that was put up earlier in terms of 

EEOC complaints, and I know that Dr. Roubideaux addressed that, 

and the spike that we are seeing, actually the climb and climb and 

climb in the EEOC complaints, truly, as the policies changes, and 

I have been an administrator for 20 years of my life for Tribe and 

college, et cetera, one of the things I know for sure about personalities and management of people is this, that when you change a 

system and they are so used to the old system that they do not like 

to change. 

41 

Change is inevitable and there needs to be change in the system, 

absolutely. But changes that they are marking, the current administration is making, people are balking at them, people are complaining about. They are so used to doing things the old way which, 

in many ways, is the sloppy way and inefficient manner of doing 

things, and as they are being called on to be more efficient, to be 

more accountable, they are fighting back, if you will, and they are 

complaining. That is human nature. 

Senator FRANKEN. So, in other words, that chart that was given 

as evidence of dysfunction is actually evidence that that dysfunction is being addressed? 

Mr. HIS HORSE IS THUNDER. I believe so. 

Senator FRANKEN. Okay. As Dr. Roubideaux said and as Director 

Red Thunder probably would have said had we come to her. 

Well, listen, I want to thank you all, really. And I really hope 

that what you are suggesting is right, that we are beginning to address this. Because we need to, desperately. 

And we desperately need to reform all the areas in Indian Affairs 

so that my colleagues who truly want to fund Indian Health Services, Indian education, housing, that they feel that the money is 

being spent wisely. 

So, I want to thank you all for your testimony and this hearing 

is adjourned. 

[Whereupon, at 11:35 a.m., the Committee was adjourned.] 

(43) 

A P P E N D I X 

PREPARED STATEMENT OF DONALD WARNE, MD, MPH, SENIOR POLICY ADVISOR, GREAT PLAINS TRIBAL CHAIRMEN’S HEALTH BOARD

I would like to start with the story of William Sutton, a 16-year-old Oglala Lakota 

young man. William attended the Sherman Indian High School—a boarding school 

located in Riverside, CA, where as a freshman he was thriving scholastically and 

athletically. He is a straight-A student and on the honor roll. He has gone from a 

desire to be an NBA star, to being a pediatric oncologist. While playing basketball, 

his knee began hurting. He was diagnosed with osteosarcoma in February in Riverside, CA. He had to leave school and was sent home. 

After returning to Pine Ridge, he was a patient at the Pine Ridge Hospital. His 

doctor said that he needed to go to either Denver or Minneapolis for cancer treatment. His first treatment in Minnesota was in March. The treatment for William 

has been 3 weeks in Minneapolis and then 2 weeks at home. William will return 

to Pine Ridge on September 30th and returns to Minneapolis again on October 17th, 

with the chemotherapy beginning on October 18th—again, for 3 weeks. 

The Oglala Sioux Tribe is one of the most impoverished communities in the nation, and they have minimal resources to provide to the family for transportation. 

His grandmother has been transporting him every month to Minneapolis from Pine 

Ridge at a significant cost to the family. William’s mother, Jolynn Two Eagle, was 

working as a cook at the Cohen Home (the local assisted living facility), but had 

to quit her job to be with William. 

Beginning in August, the Tribal Ambulance Service have been driving them to 

Minneapolis, but will not transport them back home; they are on their own. The 

reason they could take them was that they had a referral from IHS and a receiving 

letter from his doctor in Minneapolis. With this documentation they can be reimbursed by Medicaid. Since there is no reimbursement for the trip back they are on 

their own to get William home in between cancer treatments. 

As a result, the community held a Blanket Dance to raise funds for William and 

his family at the Pine Ridge Pow-Wow in August. The blanket dance is an old tradition that is done for people that are sick or maybe lost everything in a fire or a 

storm. It is a great tradition in which even small children will give their last dime. 

It shows the generosity of our people, which is one of our strong virtues. However, 

Pine Ridge is among the most impoverished communities in the nation, and despite 

the generosity, community members generally have very little money to give. 

The treatment protocol for William at this point changes, and he will be given the 

chemotherapy for 3 weeks and he will be off of it for only week before resuming 

again for another 3 weeks. With only a week off the therapy, the family will remain 

in Minneapolis, and be ready to begin on November 5th, hopefully returning back 

to Pine Ridge on December 5th or 6th. At that time, the oncologist will determine 

if William is finished with the chemotherapy, or not. William receives an SSI check for $646, but out of that, the University of MN 

Hospital automatically deducts money for his room at the Ronald McDonald House 

and food, which leaves him only $30.00 to live on. This family is guilty of nothing 

but the misfortune of illness and poverty. This is an instance where the Indian 

Health Service and the Federal Government need to step up and assist this family 

to ensure that William has the opportunity for a full recovery. William and his family should not have to worry about getting to and from the hospital for treatment, 

and they should not be worrying about how they will pay for their next meal while 

this young man should be focusing on healing. 

Unfortunately, this story is not unique. It is a story repeated many times in Indian Country, and much of the problem is directly related to underfunding of the 

IHS. 

I recognize that there is a Senate investigation of the management of the Aberdeen Area IHS. I know there have been concerns about mismanagement of funds 

and delays in hiring processes and personnel issues. However, these issues have 

been long-standing and largely ignored for many years. And, like in the case of WilVerDate Nov 24 2008 12:56 Feb 28, 2011 Jkt 063826 PO 00000 Frm 00047 Fmt 6601 Sfmt 6621 S:\DOCS\63826.TXT JACK PsN: JACKF
44 

liam Sutton, many of the problems are rooted in chronic and sustained underfunding of the IHS. With limited resources, the IHS is forced to choose between investing those resources into improved administrative processes or to expand clinical 

services. We do not have the resources to do both. 

Most of the tribal leaders in our region have expressed confidence in the IHS leadership and frustration with the system. IHS is not a broken agency, it is a starved 

agency, and the management issues identified in many ways are a symptom of a 

larger problem of underfunding. 

Another issue we face is the challenge of recruiting health professionals and managers into the IHS. In many cases, we cannot offer salaries that can compete with 

the private sector. Also, our remote locations pose a challenge to recruitment. As 

a proactive step to improve the Aberdeen Area’s ability to recruit health professionals, the Great Plains Tribal Chairmen’s Health Board voted to encourage the 

IHS to move the Area Office from Aberdeen, SD to Rapid City, SD. It will be much 

easier to recruit highly qualified professionals to Rapid City than to Aberdeen. 

Despite our challenges, we have seen improvements in the management of the Aberdeen Area IHS in a number of arenas, for example: 

• Third party revenue is significantly increased in 2010 as compared to any previous year. These resources will lead directly to additional services. 

• The tribal consultation process is better than it has ever been, and the Area 

Director attends these meetings quarterly and is open and transparent with the 

tribal leaders. 

• The budgeting processes and circumstances are more transparent now than 

they have ever been. 

• All of the senior leadership at the Area Office are members of local tribes for 

the first time in history. 

Although improvements still need to be made, the Area is going in the right direction. Thank you. 

Attachment 

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PREPARED STATEMENT OF GERARD P. GARCIA, PSY.D., LICENSED PSYCHOLOGIST

Greetings, 

Hopefully, some of the comments will be helpful in understanding operations in 

the Albuquerque area. 

• Clandestinely, the program director at NSRTC in Acoma, NM was quickly removed after news of the Aberdeen investigation. 

• At the facilities, bullying continues to go on. 

• The clinical director is not allowed final decisions on clinical matters. 

• When the state licensing board visited site, administration was not forthcoming 

with information, nor did they follow the state’s mandates. 

• Opened group home without a state license at New Sunrise Regional Treatment 

Center, unsupervised by clinician. 

• Numerous medical errors concealed from state. 

• Whistle blowers threatened and warned not to contact anyone outside facility. 

• Clinical director threatened with loss of position in aim of controlling decisions. 

• Facility accepts psychiatric patients with psychiatrist only attending patient 

care 6 hours per month. 

• New Sunrise Regional Treatment Center should not be licensed as a psychiatric 

treatment center when staff is untrained (Only two experienced staff members 

have worked in a psychiatric hospital). 

• Administrative flow chart is not observed, non-clinical staff making clinical decisions and charged with keeping clinicians in check. 

PREPARED STATEMENT OF DR. STEVEN MILLER, BUSINESS MANAGER, INDIAN HEALTH

SERVICE NATIONAL COUNCIL LABORERS’ INTERNATIONAL UNION OF NORTH AMERICA

On behalf of the Indian Health Service National Council of the Laborers’ International Union of North America (LIUNA), the union thanks the Committee for 

holding this hearing on the critically important issue of mismanagement in the Aberdeen Area of the Indian Health Service (IHS). 

LIUNA proudly represents approximately 500,000 workers in the United States 

and Canada. While primarily in the construction industry, the union also represents 

65,000 workers in federal, healthcare, and public employment. LIUNA has represented federal employees at the Indian Health Service since 1977. We represent 

9,600 employees at IHS nationwide, including over 1,300 employees in the Aberdeen 

Area. We represent employees of all job classifications at IHS, including physicians, 

nurses, social workers, patient care advocates, billing technicians, laborers, maintenance workers, cooks, and public health educators. The vast majority of workers 

LIUNA represents at IHS are Native American. The employees LIUNA represents 

are very dedicated to IHS’s mission as part of their jobs and because of the important role the agency plays in providing health care to them and their families as 

enrolled tribal members. 

Despite their dedication to the IHS mission, employees at the agency are challenged on a daily basis by chronic mismanagement. There is a huge contrast between the excellent work done by the rank and file employees LIUNA represents, 

and IHS management. In the 2010 ‘‘Best Places to Work in the Federal Government’’ survey, in which 223 agencies were reviewed, IHS employees were rated in 

the top 7 percent for the match of employee skills to the agency’s Mission. However, 

IHS is rated in the bottom 6 percent for effective supervision and leadership. In 

other words, employees feel that their skills and abilities are valuable and gain satisfaction from contributing to the organizational mission, but also that they work 

in an environment where ineffective supervision frustrates them. This is a combination that causes multiple problems including difficulty in recruitment and retention, 

adequate staffing, consistency and continuity in care, and impact on patient outcomes. 

LIUNA wishes to highlight three issues of concern to the Union in the Aberdeen 

Area: 

1) diversion of services; 

2) violations of employee rights and misconduct/mismanagement by supervisors, 

including discrimination and EEO cases; and 

3) management interference with employee communications with the Senate. 

47 

Diversion of Services 

Diversion of services at IHS impacts patient care and also employees’ jobs. Typically, diversions at IHS facilities are decided with little notice to, and no input by, 

the facility’s health care providers. The law requires IHS management to notify the 

union when changes in working conditions, such as a diversion, occur. However, IHS 

has consistently failed to follow its legal obligation on this matter. Diversions mean 

that IHS employees can lose their jobs, or be reassigned. Notice is therefore critical 

to these workers to make the necessary arrangements if their job is being eliminated or significantly changed due to a diversion of services. Diversions also can 

compromise patient care. Most IHS facilities are in rural areas. When an IHS facility closes in whole or part, Native American patients cannot simply go to the next 

closest health care facility for care. Federal laws providing for health care for Native 

Americans only allow them to attend IHS facilities for covered care. Even if a private hospital is nearby, Native patients usually cannot access those facilities because they typically lack private insurance. Thus, diversions at IHS facilities can 

require Native patients to be diverted 60 or more miles away; this delay can have 

a devastating impact on patients, especially in emergency situations. 

From January 2008 to November 2009, the Quentin Burdick Hospital in Belcourt, 

North Dakota, intermittently closed the inpatient ward. Existing patients were 

transferred by ambulance, and any patient needing admission from the emergency 

room or clinic was also admitted elsewhere. The facility only had one full-time physician, despite the fact that it serves more than 30,000 Native Americans in a remote, economically depressed/agricultural area that have no other options for care. 

Women in labor were diverted even though the next closest health care facility is 

more than 60 miles away. The clinic ran out of IV catheters and alcohol wipes, and 

had to borrow X-ray film. During this period, employee morale was terrible, and 

over 40 percent of the nursing staff resigned because they feared the hospital would 

close permanently. 

On January 15, 2009, Union was notified by an employee at Rosebud, South Dakota, that the CEO informed staff that the facility only had enough funding to stay 

open for five more days, and that the facility would potentially have to close its 

doors at that time. The Union contacted the Aberdeen Area Director, Charlene Red 

Thunder to determine what was happening. Ms. Red Thunder never contacted the 

union about this closure until after the union had to resort to going to the press. 

Finally, on Saturday, January 17, Ms. Red Thunder informed the Union that the 

facility would not close due to funds provided by the Area Office. This ‘‘near miss’’ 

is an example of the ineptitude of IHS If the facility would have closed, 188 Bargaining Unit employees would have been affected. The next closest facility is 96 

miles away. IHS failed to follow a number of laws requiring notification to the 

Union about how this potential closure would have affected the employees we represent and the patients that we serve. 

In both these instances, IHS employees’ jobs were compromised, as well as patient 

care. These examples highlight the chronic mismanagement both at the service unit 

and at the Aberdeen Area office with regard to failure to budget, account for revenue, and to notify the Union about changes in working conditions. 

Violations of Employees’ Rights and Misconduct/Mismanagement by 

Supervisors 

Supervisors at every level at the Aberdeen Area of IHS—from a first-line supervisor to a CEO—are typically either poorly trained and/or uninformed about laws 

governing employee rights. This results in the Union having to file a huge number 

of grievances, unfair labor practices (ULPs), equal employment opportunity (EEO) 

complaints, and disciplinary appeals at the Merit Systems Protection Board (MSPB). 

In just the first nine months of 2010, the LIUNA IHSNC has filed over 60 grievances, 20 ULPs, 24 EEO cases, and 3 MSPB appeals in the Aberdeen Area—a huge 

number compared to other federal agencies at which the Union represents federal 

employees. 

At Rapid City, South Dakota, contract workers from the VA Compensated Work 

Therapy program, (CWT) were stalking, making physical threats, and sexually 

harassing IHS employees. The union received reports that a CWT employee was distributing marijuana and methamphetamine at work. The Aberdeen Area Human 

Resources Office told the Union they were too busy with the Senate investigation 

to deal with these issues. 

Examples of workplace grievances that the Union has filed in the Aberdeen Area 

include a nursing director blaming nursing staff for the department losing accreditation, threatening the staff with losing their licenses for cooperating with CMS inspectors (Pine Ridge, South Dakota), and a manager who hired his spouse as a contractor, violating federal nepotism regulations (Kyle, South Dakota). Employees conVerDate Nov 24 2008 12:56 Feb 28, 2011 Jkt 063826 PO 00000 Frm 00051 Fmt 6601 Sfmt 6621 S:\DOCS\63826.TXT JACK PsN: JACKF
48 

stantly face issues such as improper leave denials/FMLA violations and denials for 

employees to attend the funeral of a close family member. One of the most egregious 

examples of blatant disregard for employee rights in the Aberdeen Area was a case 

in Eagle Butte, South Dakota, where a female IHS employee who was very ill with 

diabetes collapsed in her home during an ice storm when her power and water went 

out. She had to leave her home to be cared for by her children. Despite properly 

requesting leave, she was fired for being absent without leave. 

Aberdeen Area Managers are slow to address basic problems causing employees 

to work under primitive, unsafe working conditions. Nurses are forced to report to 

work and see patients in facilities that have faulty electrical systems (Eagle Butte, 

South Dakota) or intermittent running water and functioning sewer system 

(Wanblee, South Dakota). Nurses are forced to work in understaffed units. Nine of 

fourteen nurses quit after management refused to comply with CMS directives to 

improve patient care in the emergency room (Pine Ridge, South Dakota). Just last 

month, the Winnebago Indian Hospital (Winnebago, NE), forced employees to work 

all day with no running water. This meant no functioning toilets for patients or employees (other than porta-johns that were finally provided hours later). Patients 

were forced to use red hazard bags to urinate; nursing staff then had to dump those 

bags for urine samples—which compromises infection control. The Union reported 

this incident to OHSA and is pursuing further legal action against the facility for 

jeopardizing the health and safety of both the employees and the patients. All of 

these issues compromise patient care and happen far too often at IHS. 

The Union has stewards at Aberdeen Area facilities to carry out functions relating 

to our collective bargaining obligations. The stewards are federal employees who volunteer their time. However, they are often retaliated against for Union activities by 

supervisors and CEOs. Just this month, one of our union stewards resigned her position as a steward due to pervasive harassment by management at Rapid City, 

South Dakota. During the past year, this 21-year veteran of IHS was denied leave 

for her mother’s funeral; denied leave for her own surgery; harassed for reporting 

substance abuse of IHS employees; denied compensatory and overtime; and received 

a low rating for the first time in 21 years on her performance evaluation—likely in 

retaliation for these other issues. This employee is not alone in receiving this kind 

of treatment at Rapid City. In 2010, over half the union grievances and unfair labor 

practices filed in the entire Aberdeen Area were at Rapid City. 

Workers should not have to fear coming to work or retaliation for helping their 

co-workers deal with problems at work. Union representatives on the job solve problems, give workers a say in working conditions, resolve conflicts, increase morale 

and improve patient care. Management’s resistance to employees having a say at 

work,failing to respond to grievances and problems andintentionally ignoring issues 

causes conflict, increases fear, hurts morale and negatively affects patient care. 

Despite all of this evidence of blatant mismanagement by Aberdeen Area supervisors, the union is very concerned and disappointed that Director Roubideaux accused IHS employees at the hearing of filing EEO cases because they do not want 

to be ‘‘held accountable’’ for new agency policies. It is unconscionable that Dr. 

Roubideaux resorted to a strategy of ‘‘blaming the victim’’ instead of committing to 

investigate the real reason for the spike in discrimination allegations at her agency 

or taking responsibility for these civil rights violations under her watch. Until IHS 

makes a true effort to address the serious issue of discrimination at the agency, one 

of Dr. Roubideaux’s own key priorities will not be able to be addressed—that of recruitment and retention of quality employees. What health care provider would 

want to come work for an agency with such an alarming increase in discrimination 

cases? 

Finally, LIUNA would like to address another issue raised by Dr. Roubideaux at 

the hearing—the IHS performance management processes for agency employees. Dr. 

Roubideaux testified that she has ‘‘implemented a stronger performance management process.’’ There are two problems with this statement. First, the union was 

not provided notice of these changes. Under the federal labor-management statute, 

IHS must provide notice to the union about changes affecting working conditions; 

the performance management system falls into this category. Further, the agency 

and the union just completed a five-year negotiation for a collective bargaining 

agreement (CBA) covering conditions of employment for the 9,600 employees the 

union represents; that CBA established procedures for the performance management system that cannot be changed without negotiating with the union. Neither 

of these things occurred. Instead, the union was forwarded a memo from one of our 

members that Dr. Roubideaux to all IHS employees on September 13, 2010 about 

performance management. That memo stated: ‘‘Our performance management plans 

this year contain more specific measures that require leadership and staff to demonstrate how they are helping advance the priorities of the agency.’’ The addition 

49 

of ‘‘more specific measures’’ is clearly a change to the current system and a violation 

of both federal law and our CBA. However, when the union contacted IHS to determine what these new measures are, the union was told that no changes in fact are 

being made to the current system. The second problem, then, with Dr. Roubideaux’s 

testimony is that she told the Committee that IHS is making changes to the performance management system while simultaneously telling the union the agency is 

not making changes. This performance management memo, along with the customer 

service memo that Dr. Roubideaux referred to, are also examples of a ‘‘blame the 

rank and file employee’’ mentality by IHS management. Both memos have a condescending tone and fail to note the role of IHS management in improving the agency. 

Dr. Roubideaux testified that she wants to set a positive ‘‘tone from the top.’’ To 

do that, the union believes she should solicit input from all interested and affected 

parties, including LIUNA. However, despite repeated requests for a meeting to discuss working together to reform and improve IHS, Dr. Roubideaux has ignored the 

union’s request to meet. LIUNA hopes that the Senate Committee can encourage 

Dr. Roubideaux to reconsider and understand the value of meeting with the organization representing the vast majority of her employees. Leadership at IHS must 

start at the top. The union looks forward to hopefully establishing a productive and 

cooperative relationship with the Director to move the agency in a positive direction 

and help her address her key priorities, including recruitment and retention of the 

exceptional workers the union represents at the agency. 

Management Interference with Employee Communications with the Senate 

Despite the fact that federal workers have a legal right to communicate workplace 

concerns with their Members of Congress, management in the Aberdeen Area interfered with those rights during the course of the Senate investigation this year. The 

Union was told that Fred Koebrick, the CEO of Rapid City, notified the staff at a 

general staff meeting that they were not to talk to the Senate about the Aberdeen 

Area investigation. He later recanted that story. At the Woodrow Wilson Keeble Memorial Health Care Center in Sisseton, South Dakota, a nurse mentioned the Senate investigation to her supervisor (the Acting Director of Nursing). The supervisor 

told the nurse that she was not allowed to talk to the Senate investigators. It is 

unclear whether the CEO at Sisseton has taken action against this supervisor. 

To try to mitigate the problem of interference by management officials, the Union 

sent a notice to all bargaining unit employees in the Aberdeen Area reminding them 

of their legal right to communicate with the Senate investigators. The Union hopes 

this action contributed to less interference during the rest of the investigation. 

Conclusion and Recommendations 

LIUNA and our IHS National Council very much appreciate the Senate Committee on Indian Affairs shedding light on management problems in the Aberdeen 

Area. The Union and those that it represents should be seen as a resource willing 

to work with Congress and IHS to remedy these problems. Ultimately, the patients 

that we serve will benefit. To this end, we recommend the following: 

1. Involve the union and the workforce in plans to reform IHS This would not 

only allow for the agency to hear from the rank and file workers on the ground, 

but also would give IHS employees confidence in Dr. Roubideaux’s leadership 

and ability to improve morale. Set a tone from the top that the union is a partner in reform at the agency. One significant step would be to aggressively implement President’s Obama’s Executive Order (13522) which encourages LaborManagement cooperation through pre-decisional involvement and Labor-Management Forums. 

2. Determine best practices for management at IHS and work with the union 

and agency employees to implement those practices throughout the Aberdeen 

Area and nationwide. 

3. Hold poor managers accountable. 

4. Include budgeting, financial planning, and accounting as part of the reform 

process to avoid diversion of services. 

5. Conduct an inventory of the numbers and types of grievances, unfair labor 

practices, EEO complaints, and MSPB disciplinary cases and work with the 

union to determine the cause of these problems and how to eliminate them. 

Review why IHS employees are consistently ranked in the top 10 percent of federal employees while IHS management is ranked in the bottom 10 percent of 

agencies. 

7. Commit to recruitment and retention of federal workers at the agency (rather 

than reliance on contract workers) to save costs, improve morale, and ensure 

50 

consistency of care. Ensure that all managers receive training on labor-management issues, including performance management systems and the collective bargaining agreement with the union. 


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RESPONSE TO WRITTEN QUESTIONS SUBMITTED BY HON. BYRON L. DORGAN TO

GERALD ROY

Question 1. Office of Inspector General (OIG) investigations of the Indian Health 

Service (IHS) have resulted in numerous criminal convictions relating to employee 

misconduct. For instance, the OIG investigated the former CEO of Fort Totten 

Health Center in 2008 and the former Service Unit Director of Quentin Burdick Memorial Hospital. 

Did the OIG determine that the IHS responded appropriately and addressed the 

findings of these investigations? 

Answer. Although the OIG cannot address the appropriateness of IHS’s response 

to the OIG’s employee misconduct investigations regarding the former Service Unit 

Director of Quentin N. Burdick Memorial Hospital in 2001 and the former CEO of 

Fort Totten Health Center in 2008, we can speak to how IHS addressed the findings 

of these investigations. 

• IHS transferred the former Service Unit Director of Quentin N. Burdick Memorial Hospital out of his position at the facility. 


928c31.eps
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• IHS issued the former CEO of Fort Totten Health Center a 14-day suspension 

and she was subsequently transferred out of the facility. 

• The OIG is not aware of additional sanctions or employee discipline implemented by IHS to the former Service Unit Director of Quentin N. Burdick Memorial Hospital and the former CEO of Fort Totten Health Center regarding 

these investigations. 

The results of the OIG investigations involving the former CEO of Fort Totten 

Health Center and the former Service Unit Director of Quentin N. Burdick Memorial Hospital were turned over to the United States Attorney’s Office in the District 

of North Dakota for review. Both investigations involving these individuals were declined for criminal prosecution. 

Question 1a. Do you have recommendations for how the IHS could better address 

these employee conduct and accountability issues? 

Answer. OIG has not examined IHS’s personnel policies and procedures to an extent that would permit it to provide general recommendations. OIG last examined 

this issue in 2000, when the Office of Evaluation and Inspections issued a report 

on IHS’s Equal Employment Opportunity (EEO) Complaint Process. The report is 

available at http://oig.hhs.gov/oei/reports/oei-05-99-00290.pdf. The study found 

that many IHS employees were confused about Indian preference laws, commissioned corps EEO rules, and employee EEO rights under tribal contracting. OIG 

found that inconsistencies in IHS’s EEO system resulted in unequal treatment of 

complaints and the EEO program lacked direction, which potentially weakened its 

effectiveness. Additionally, OIG found that employee distrust of EEO was widespread throughout IHS and undermined effectiveness of the EEO process. 

From 2005 through 2010, OIG’s Office of Investigations conducted fraud awareness presentations to IHS officials, including 13 in the Aberdeen area, for the purpose of describing and discussing internal investigative procedures. These presentations consisted of an OIG overview, and discussion of specific OI functions, including drug diversion, employee misconduct issues, reporting requirements, and reporting processes. OIG is happy to brief the Committee if you are interested in additional information about these presentations. 

Question 2. The Committee is aware of the fact that the OIG has investigated several instances of employees stealing narcotics at Belcourt Service Unit and Rapid 

City IHS Hospital. In addition, there has been a troubling history of diverted narcotics and controlled substances at Quentin N. Burdick Memorial Hospital since 

2003. The Inspector General conducted an investigation of the facility’s pharmacy 

in 2003 and issued a Management Implication Report. 

Please provide a brief description of your findings at the Belcourt and Rapid City 

service units. Do you have recommendations for how the IHS could prevent the theft 

of narcotics in the future? 

Answer. During the course of our investigations, we discovered that the IHS pharmacies at both the Belcourt Service Unit and Rapid City IHS Hospital lacked effective security controls to prevent and detect drug diversion by employees, contractors, 

and others. The lack of security controls and poor internal oversight of the pharmacies and their staff allowed drug diversion to go undetected for long periods of 

time. The OIG recommended the following measures be implemented at these facilities in order to minimize drug diversion: 

• A perpetual inventory of all Class II-V (CII) medications stocked in each pharmacy should be completed and maintained. The logging in and out of inventory 

should also be completed and documented with two pharmacy staff members. 

• Security cameras should be installed in each pharmacy to record the CII storage 

area(s) and any other locations that store controlled substances. The areas of 

video observation should include automated medication dispensing robots, the 

pharmacy filling area, and the primary areas of dispensing medications to the 

patients. All entrance and exits to the pharmacies should also be monitored by 

security cameras. 

• Access into each pharmacy should be restricted to pharmacy staff and IHS employees with a need to enter the pharmacy area. 

Question 2a. Can you describe what the Inspector General found in its investigation of Quentin N. Burdick Memorial Hospital? 

Answer. During the course of our investigation at the Quentin N. Burdick Memorial Hospital, we discovered that the facility’s pharmacy lacked effective security 

controls to prevent and detect drug diversion by employees, contractors, and others. 

The lack of security controls and poor internal oversight of the pharmacy allowed 

drug diversion to go undetected for long periods of time. The facility’s pharmacy 

119 

lacked effective video surveillance, proper inventory controls, two-party witnessing 

of controlled substance stocking, and comprehensive security controls to prevent and 

detect drug diversion. 

Question 2b. Has this facility been referred to Inspector General any additional 

times since 2003? 

Answer. Yes, the Office of Investigations received complaints regarding the Quentin N. Burdick Memorial Hospital in 2004, 2007, and 2010. Each complaint and subsequent investigation related to lost or stolen medications at the facility’s pharmacy. 

The 2010 criminal investigation remains open and we would be happy to brief the 

Committee on our findings once this matter is resolved and our investigation at this 

facility is closed. 

Question 3. The Committee also identified a history of missing or stolen narcotics 

at Sisseton Hospital. On March 17, 2009, the Inspector General received two reports 

of missing or stolen narcotics from the hospital and the Inspector General conducted 

a site visit in response. 

Please provide the Committee with the findings of this investigation? 

Question 3a. Do you have any indication that your findings from 2009 have been 

addressed? 

Answer. The OIG was notified of missing or stolen narcotics from the Sisseton 

Hospital in March 2009. Agents with OIG’s Office of Investigations immediately initiated a criminal investigation at the Sisseton Hospital Pharmacy and that investigation remains open. We would be happy to brief the Committee on our findings 

once this matter is resolved and our investigation at this facility is closed. 

RESPONSE TO WRITTEN QUESTIONS SUBMITTED BY HON. JOHN BARRASSO TO

GERALD ROY

Question 1. Your written testimony notes several investigations that have occurred over the course of 10 years, including a 2008 investigation regarding drug 

diversion. One of your investigation found that the IHS pharmacy in Rapid City 

lacked basic security controls, such as security cameras, to prevent drug diversion. 

Has the Inspector General conducted any follow up reviews to determine whether 

IHS has adopted drug diversion prevention measures? 

Answer. The Office of Investigations completed a follow up review in 2010 of the 

Rapid City Sioux San Indian Hospital Pharmacy regarding security measures that 

were added, modified, or are in the planning stages since the 2008 investigation. 

The following security enhancements are now in place or have been scheduled for 

installation at this facility: 

• Pharmacy door access has been changed to have security enhanced keys and a 

cipher lock with the combination of the lock changed every 90 days. 

• Pharmacists are the only staff members that have physical keys for the pharmacy. 

• Pharmaceutical orders and product intake are now separate duties and forms 

are completed to ensure that the ordering staff does not check-in the order 

when received. 

• Bars have been installed on the exterior windows of the pharmacy to prevent 

unlawful entry. 

• Pyxis machine for the CII inventory was updated with user passwords now 

being changed every 90 days. 

• More staff was added to handle incoming orders and patients to prevent medications from being stored unsecured or forgotten. 

• Security cameras are budgeted through the Aberdeen Area Office for installation in FY 2011. 

Question 1a. What support do you need to achieve the goals for improving the Aberdeen Area? 

Answer. The OIG utilizes and prioritizes its investigative resources in the Aberdeen area based on the nature of the referrals that are received. Our investigators 

pursue those criminal cases that warrant investigation after a review of the particular issue or complaint. We will continue to closely analyze any complaints that 

we receive and accept or reject such complaints based on standardized criteria. 

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* Response to written questions was not available at the time this hearing went to press. 

‘without a proactive effort to identify the root causes of the problem or find alternatQuestion 1. In November 2008, after lengthy periods of diversions in health care 

services, the Aberdeen Area Office conducted a review of Quentin N. Memorial Hospital. The reviewer concluded that two individuals—including the Director of Nursing and Clinical Director–had made the decision to divert services ‘‘without a 

proactive effort to identify the root causes of the problem or find alternative means 

to ensure admission of patients.’’ 

The reviewer also noted that the Clinical Director stated that the facility had frequently diverted inpatient admissions in the past and it was ‘‘no big deal then so, 

why is everyone getting excited about it now? ’’ 

Question 1a.Considering that Quentin N. Burdick Memorial Hospital diverted 

services for over 388 days, what is your reaction to the quote above? 

Question 1b. Did this Clinical Director face any disciplinary action for allowing 

these lengthy diversions without a long-term plan to address the understaffing? 

Question 1c. Please describe how the decision to go on a diversion is made at an 

IHS facility. 

Question 1d. Does the Aberdeen Area Office notify the respective Indian tribe 

prior to initiating a diversion? 

Question 1e. What do you see as the long-term solution to prevent diversions in 

health care services at facilities in the Aberdeen Area? 

Question 2. The Committee found that the Director of Nursing at Quentin N. Burdick Memorial Hospital has been the subject of three Equal Employment Opportunity (EEO) complaints—two of which were fully adjudicated. One found substantial evidence of discrimination costing the Agency over $148,000. A second was resolved just this year and found the Director of Nursing had failed to take action 

to prevent subordinates from harassing another employee. 

Can you explain how the IHS addressed this issue and whether any disciplinary 

action has been taken against the Director of Nursing? 

Question 3. As Chairman of the Committee, I wrote to the Agency with serious 

concerns about the vacancies in the mental health department on the Standing Rock 

Sioux Reservation. During a spike in youth suicides (100 suicide attempts and 16 

completions in 2009 and 2010), the Mental Health Director position at the Standing 

Rock IHS facility was not posted for 10 months after it became vacant and continues 

to be unfilled today. 

What obstacles is the agency facing in filling the vacancies in the IHS Aberdeen 

Area? 

Question 3a. Why does it take so long to post a vacancy? Do you have recommendations for how to shorten the timeframe? 

Question 3b. What happens to funding for these positions when they are left vacant? Were the funds for the Mental Health Director position spent on some other 

program or at a different facility? 

Question 4. The Committee found that the use of locum tenens cost the Aberdeen 

Area over $17.2 million over the last 3 fiscal years. 

What actions have you taken to address staffing issues in the Aberdeen Area, including excessive use of contract nurses and doctors, and ‘‘Acting’’ managers? 

Question 5. The Aberdeen Area has had an increasing number of EEO complaints 

over the past 10 years. We have heard that IHS policy states that there should be 

two EEO Counselors per facility, but there are currently only 13 for the entire Aberdeen Area. We are aware that the Aberdeen Area is in the process of training and 

hiring more EEO counselors. 

What are the biggest barriers to ensuring that there are two EEO Counselors at 

each IHS facility? 

Question 6. In one EEO case, an administrative judge described an IHS facility 

as a workplace where employees threaten the use of EEO complaints against one 

another. In addition the judge stated that supervisors often either side with one employee or simply ignore divisive situations altogether. 

How big of a problem are retaliatory complaints and what is done to deter or punish employees who wrongly accuse others? 

Question 6a. Do you think the prospect of retaliatory complaints deters people 

from becoming EEO counselors for their facilities? 

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Question 7. The Aberdeen Area Administrative Review, completed in April 2010, 

states that five service units were identified as being in jeopardy of losing their 

CMS accreditation. 

What are the five service units at risk? 

Question 7a. When a facility is in danger of losing its accreditation, how quickly 

are you notified? 

Question 7b. What is your role, as Director of the Area, in ensuring that the facility takes the necessary actions to avoid losing its accreditation? 

Question 7c. What steps have you taken to address the deficiencies at these service units? 

Question 8. Both the Fort Yates and Quentin Burdick Hospitals have had a history of accreditation issues. 

What steps are you taking to ensure that these hospitals submit an acceptable 

Corrective Action Plan and retain their CMS accreditation? 

Question 9. The Committee found that Rosebud Hospital has had three EMTALA 

violations between 2005 and 2010. One particularly troubling violation involved a 

pregnant woman who presented to the hospital in October 2008 nearing delivery 

and was then discharged shortly thereafter. According to the IHS report: 

A ‘‘[p]atient presented with contractions every 5 minutes and bloody show. [The] 

patient was discharged from [the] ER at 7:15 still with contractions and [was] 

not stable. [The patient] delivered in the... bathroom at approximately 7:50.’’ 

In an Administrative Review of the hospital in July 2009, CMS addressed an allegation of negligent care by nursing staff and ultimately placed the facility on ‘‘Immediate Jeopardy’’ status. The hospital submitted a Corrective Action Plan, which 

was returned in November 2009 as ‘‘unacceptable.’’ 

Please explain the current status of the facility. Is it CMS-accredited? 

Question 9a. What has been done to address these serious concerns involving patient care? 

Question 10. In October 2007, just after the beginning of the 2008 fiscal year, Fort 

Yates transferred $100,000 of CHS funds to an ambulance program. Later in that 

same fiscal year, Fort Yates then borrowed CHS funds from Sisseton to pay CHS 

bills. 

Why did this transfer occur so early in the fiscal year? 

Question 10a. What kind of oversight does the Area Office have for these types 

of transfers? 

Question 11. There is a troubling history of repeated narcotics losses and/or diversions at Rapid City Sioux San Hospital. A statement submitted for the record by 

the Laborers International Union of North America (LIUNA) said this: 

‘‘At Rapid City, South Dakota... [we] received reports that a CWT employee 

was distributing marijuana and methamphetamine at work. The Aberdeen Area 

Human Resources Office told the Union they were too busy with the Senate investigation to deal with these issues.’’ 

What measures have you taken to address this serious concern? 

Question 12. There also appears to be a pattern of narcotics losses and/or diversions at Quentin Burdick and Sisseton Hospitals in recent years. These problems 

may exist at other facilities as well—the Committee did not even receive documentation on the pharmacy at Fort Yates Hospital, for example. 

Please describe what the Area Office is doing to address the lost and missing narcotics. In addition, explain how the Area will enforce the IHS policy to conduct 

monthly audits of pharmaceuticals. 

Question 13. The Committee received documentation of lapsed provider licenses 

and certifications at Belcourt, Fort Yates, Rapid City and Winnebago Service Units. 

At Belcourt, for example, the most recent Mock Joint Commission Survey found that 

10 of 20—half—of all employee files reviewed did not have the proper license or registration. At Rapid City Hospital, one physician was practicing with an expired medical license for over seven months, and a Physician Assistant was practicing without 

a valid license for over two years. 

What is the process at each local facility for monitoring provider licenses and ensuring that these licenses are current? 

Question 13a. Who is responsible for this monitoring? 

Question 13b. How often are the licenses verified? 

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* Response to written questions was not available at the time this hearing went to press. 

Question 13c. Do local facilities communicate with the licensing state boards to 

ensure that provider licenses are current? 

Question 13d. How is it possible that a provider could have practiced for over two 

years without a valid license? 

Question 13e. Were providers who practiced without a valid license put on notice 

or disciplined in any way for failing to maintain current credentials? 

Question 13f. What corrective actions have you taken to address this pattern of 

poor oversight of provider licenses? 

Question 14. The Committee found that Rapid City Hospital refunded $63,000 to 

Medicare for services provided by the Physician Assistant who for over two years 

did not have a valid license. 

Are there other instances where an IHS facility, in the Aberdeen Area, refunded 

a third party insurer because the services were rendered by a provider without an 

active license? 

Question 15. The Aberdeen Area Internal Review found significant backlogs in 

billing Medicare, Medicaid and private insurers. The internal review states that 

these backlogs result in reduced cash flow to fund service unit operations. The Committee is aware that contractors have been hired to help the facilities catch up with 

their billing, and that many of the service units are already up-to-date. 

What steps have been taken to prevent these backlogs from occurring again? 

WRITTEN QUESTION SUBMITTED BY HON. TIM JOHNSON TO CHARLENE RED

THUNDER * 

Question. What support do you need to achieve the goals for improving the Aberdeen Area? 

WRITTEN QUESTIONS SUBMITTED BY HON. BYRON L. DORGAN TO YVETTE

ROUBIDEAUX, M.D., M.P.H. * 

Question 1. A nurse at Quentin Burdick Hospital was found to have stolen drugs 

from the pharmacy for her own personal use and also worked in an impaired state 

on several occasions from 1989 to 2003. The North Dakota Board of Nursing found 

that the employee was in such an impaired condition that during a C-section procedure in 2000 the nurse ‘‘could not properly place and hold retractors, and hold the 

patient’s skin in place for staples.’’ 

Can you please explain why this employee was not terminated? The Committee 

was told that the nurse was ultimately placed on a ‘‘desk job’’ so that she could 

reach her 20 years of service and reap the benefits of a full retirement. 

Question 2. During the hearing, the former Chief Executive Officer (CEO) of Fort 

Totten Health Center was discussed as an egregious example of employee misconduct. In this instance, the Spirit Lake Tribe passed several resolutions—first 

asking for an investigation and finally—expelling the CEO. IHS performed an investigation six months after the Tribe passed the first resolution. IHS found 7 key 

areas of misconduct, including creation of a hostile work environment, misuse of 

property and sexual harassment. According to documents the Committee found— 

IHS reviewers recommended the CEO’s termination. 

Please explain why the former CEO was given a 14 day suspension rather than 

terminated? 

Question 2a. According to Inspector General’s investigative report, it found that 

the CEO had been the subject of 5 EEO complaints—4 of which were filed during 

the employee’s previous place of work. These cases were settled and cost the Agency 

over $50,000. What efforts are in place to ensure the Agency oversees and addresses 

employees that are repeatedly the subject of EEOs? 

Question 3. An Aberdeen Area administrative review in November 2009 found 

that the CEO of Winnebago Hospital (1) was absent without approval for 130 work 

hours in 2008 and 2009; (2) misused government funding by using these dollars to 

purchase food for hospital employees on various occasions; and (3) used a government vehicle for personal purposes. 

Administrative reviewers ultimately found that that the CEO did not ‘‘demonstrate the leadership and ethical skills necessary’’ and that appropriate disciplinary action should be taken against the CEO. The Committee understands that the 

123 

IHS’ removal action was mitigated after the CEO agreed not to apply for another 

position in the Aberdeen Area for one year. 

Please explain how the CEO was held accountable for misconduct and potentially 

criminal behavior. 

Question 3a. Why did the Agency digress from its initial termination action, despite the reviewer’s recommendations? 

Question 4. The Quentin Burdick Memorial Hospital diverted inpatient services 

for more than 45 percent of the time between 2008 and 2010. When an IHS facility 

diverts patients there are numerous negative consequences, such as requiring the 

use of already underfunded Contract Health Service dollars and the burden of travel 

time and cost on Native American patients. In this case, patients had to travel at 

least 100 miles to the next hospital—Trinity Hospital in Minot. 

Trinity Hospital reportedly has $10 million in unpaid bills from serving Belcourt 

IHS patients during the almost 400 days of diversions. Can you confirm this? 

Question 4a. Is it common for local hospitals to be burdened by unpaid bills after 

diversions? 

Question 4b. Can you provide inform the Committee of which non-IHS facilities 

are owed money in the Aberdeen Area due to the non-IHS facilities providing patient care to IHS-eligible patients? 

Question 4c. Does the IHS have an Area-wide policy on when it is appropriate for 

a facility to divert patients? 

Question 5. The Committee found instances of lapsed provider licenses, certifications and privileges at the Belcourt Service Unit, Fort Yates Service Unit, Rapid 

City IHS Hospital, and Winnebago Service Unit. For instance, in a 2009 Winnebago 

Hospital’s Joint Commission Mock Survey, 4 providers had expired licenses—some 

for over 9 months. Provider licensure is critical to the safety of patients and the 

credibility of a facility. 

Were you aware that providers had been practicing for as long as two years without valid licenses? 

If yes, how did you allow providers to continue practicing months after their license had expired? 

Question 6. IHS is required to maintain records of provider licenses, including adverse actions for at least 10 years after the individual’s termination of employment 

or association with the Agency. The IHS only submitted only 5 instances of Aberdeen Area providers with a disciplinary action by a State Board. However, the Committee contacted SD, ND, IA and NE nursing boards and found 14 Aberdeen Area 

nurses with license suspensions or revocations due to misconduct committed during 

their employment with the Agency. 

Does the Agency have any system in place to ensure providers are not treating 

patients with a revoked or suspended license? 

Question 6a. How is a report of a provider’s license suspension communicated 

from the Area Office to Headquarters? 

Question 7. The Aberdeen Area Administrative Review, completed in April 2010, 

states that five service units were identified as being in jeopardy of losing their 

CMS accreditation. 

Five of 12 service units—nearly half of all major facilities in the Aberdeen Area— 

are at risk for losing their CMS accreditation. Is this unique to the Aberdeen Area? 

Question 7a. How many other service units in the IHS system are at risk for losing their accreditation? 

Question 7b. How important is it for facilities to retain their CMS accreditation? 

How would that affect the hospital’s operation and patient care? 

Question 7c. How does Headquarters work with the Area Directors to ensure that 

local facilities get the support they need in order to avoid losing their accreditation? 

Question 8. The Aberdeen Area facilities have been below average in all aspects 

of its third party billing operations, facing backlogs in submitting bills to Medicare, 

Medicaid and private insurers. For example, the Committee found that a high percentage of bills remain uncollected beyond 120 day and accounts were also not 

turned over to the Department’s Program Support Center (PSC) for debt collection 

after 180 days, in accordance with IHS policy. 

What role does IHS headquarters play in the third party collection process? 

Question 8a. Is there any oversight of the various Areas or service units? 

Question 8b. Have there been changes to the IHS policies since the Aberdeen Area 

internal review revealed problems with all aspects of the third party billing process? 

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* Response to written questions was not available at the time this hearing went to press. 

Question 9. As you know, CHS is often labeled as chronically underfunded and 

the budget requests often focus on large increases for the CHS program. However, 

the Committee has become aware of transfers of Aberdeen Area Contract Health 

Service (CHS) funding between CHS programs at different IHS facilities as well as 

to non-CHS programs. For example, in 2008 the IHS facility in Sisseton transferred 

$250,000 to an oral health care program. There have been several instances over 

the past five years of transfers to tribal ambulatory programs and also an instance 

of CHS funds being transferred to an oral health program. 

If these facilities are running out of CHS money every year, why are CHS funds 

being transferred to other programs? 

Question 9a. In your opinion, is it within the authorization of CHS to utilize these 

funds for purposes other than paying directly for health services rendered outside 

the Indian health system? 

Question 9b. Is the practice of transferring CHS funds specific to the Aberdeen 

Area or is this done throughout the Indian health system? 

Question 13. There is a troubling history of missing or stolen narcotics at Quentin 

Burdick, Rapid City and Sisseton Hospitals, among others. 

What steps have you taken to address these issues? 

Question 14. During the investigation, the Committee encountered instances 

where it appeared union stewards had been retaliated against. For instance, one 

union steward experienced alleged harassment by management at Rapid City IHS 

hospital, resulting in her denial of leave for her own surgery, denial of leave for her 

mother’s funeral and harassment for reporting that her supervisor had come to 

work drunk on several occasions. 

How has the Agency engaged the union to ensure a better working relationship 

and to prevent retaliation against union stewards? 

WRITTEN QUESTIONS SUBMITTED BY HON. TIM JOHNSON TO YVETTE ROUBIDEAUX, M.D., M.P.H. * 

Question 1. How and when will IHS implement the OIG’s recommendations for 

controlled medications? 

Question 2. Does IHS have a plan for providing greater support services to staff 

to better job performance and prevent misconduct and poor performance? 

Question 3. While the program is severely underfunded, it is critical to properly 

manage Contract Health Service (CHS) funds. How will IHS ensure that these monies are managed better in the future? 

Question 4. What discretion is given to Area offices to move funds around between 

accounts? What funds were moved in FY 2010 and why? 

Question 5. Do you consult the National Combined Council of Chief Executive Officers? It is my understanding that they were contacted about the issues and problems encountered at the Service Units. Would you consider consulting that group 

for solutions for reform? 

WRITTEN QUESTIONS SUBMITTED BY HON. JOHN BARRASSO TO YVETTE ROUBIDEAUX, 

M.D., M.P.H. * 

Question 1. Your written testimony indicates you are working to streamline the 

hiring process to bring more qualified health professionals on board more quickly. 

Bringing quality care to tribal members is an important priority. However, the IHS 

must also ensure that these providers are duly licensed and have no suspensions 

or other disciplinary action against them. 

In 2008, the Office of Inspector General found that IHS did not have certain safeguards in place to determine whether employees or contractors were on the OIG 

List of Excluded Individuals and Entities. What safeguards, policies, and procedures 

are in place to ensure that the professionals, employees, and contractors are all appropriately qualified to work in IHS facilities? 

Question 2. Employee accountability and oversight appeared to be two major 

weaknesses that the Office of Inspector General has identified in past investigations 

of IHS. The Office of Inspector General’s testimony mentions one case where an IHS 

employee altered government medical records of patients for personal gain. What 

specific oversight, verification, and accountability measures are in place to prevent 

this type of incidence from occurring again? 

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* Response to written questions was not available at the time this hearing went to press. 

Question 3. I understand that the Department has begun a program, directed by 

an ‘‘integrity council,’’ to assess the IHS financial integrity and quality of care. Can 

you describe the process that will be employed for this initiative and when it will 

be conducted? 

WRITTEN QUESTIONS SUBMITTED BY HON. JOHN MCCAIN TO YVETTE ROUBIDEAUX, 

M.D., M.P.H. * 

Question 1. On July 22, 2010, I wrote a letter to IHS Director Roubideaux with 

questions concerning the Service’s responsibilities under the IHS Healthcare Facilities Construction Priority System. I’ve heard from my constituents of the Gila River 

Indian Community that IHS is not meeting its contractual obligations for the South 

East Ambulatory Care Center. Please let me know when I can expect a response 

from IHS concerning my two-month old letter. 

Question 2. The Gila River Indian Community has complained to me about several administrative delays at IHS that are jeopardizing the SEACC project. For example, the approval of the Program of Record didn’t occur until 7 months after the 

deadline set forth in the contract. Furthermore, transfer of Design Funds didn’t 

occur until 8 months after contract deadline. What is the cause of these lapses? 

Question 3. Local newspapers in Arizona recently reported that the Service’s Fort 

Yuma Service Unit, which provides medical care for the Cocopah Indian Tribe and 

the Quechan Indian Tribe, may have exposed approximately 111 tribal members to 

HIV, hepatitis B and C and other infections because of a failure to property sterilize 

medical equipment. 

Has the IHS identified specific at-risk tribal members and have those members 

been notified? What recourse do tribal members have with IHS if they’re diagnosed 

with one of these potential infectious diseases? 

Question 3a. Please explain why there was a failure to properly sterilize the unit’s 

medical equipment. When were IHS officials made aware of this incident? When 

were the two tribes officially notified? When will IHS complete its investigation of 

this incident? 

Question 3b. What steps is IHS taking to ensure this doesn’t happen again at 

Yuma? 

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