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71–016—PDF 2010

S. HRG. 111–1108 

NOMINATION OF CAROLYN W. COLVIN 

HEARING 

BEFORE THE

COMMITTEE ON FINANCE 

UNITED STATES SENATE 

ONE HUNDRED ELEVENTH CONGRESS 

SECOND SESSION 

ON THE

NOMINATION OF 

CAROLYN W. COLVIN, TO BE DEPUTY COMMISSIONER OF SOCIAL 

SECURITY, SOCIAL SECURITY ADMINISTRATION 

DECEMBER 9, 2010 

( 

Printed for the use of the Committee on Finance 

COMMITTEE ON FINANCE 

MAX BAUCUS, Montana, Chairman 

JOHN D. ROCKEFELLER IV, West Virginia 

KENT CONRAD, North Dakota 

JEFF BINGAMAN, New Mexico 

JOHN F. KERRY, Massachusetts 

BLANCHE L. LINCOLN, Arkansas 

RON WYDEN, Oregon 

CHARLES E. SCHUMER, New York 

DEBBIE STABENOW, Michigan 

MARIA CANTWELL, Washington 

BILL NELSON, Florida 

ROBERT MENENDEZ, New Jersey 

THOMAS R. CARPER, Delaware 

CHUCK GRASSLEY, Iowa 

ORRIN G. HATCH, Utah 

OLYMPIA J. SNOWE, Maine 

JON KYL, Arizona 

JIM BUNNING, Kentucky 

MIKE CRAPO, Idaho 

PAT ROBERTS, Kansas 

JOHN ENSIGN, Nevada 

MICHAEL B. ENZI, Wyoming 

JOHN CORNYN, Texas 

RUSSELL SULLIVAN, Staff Director 

KOLAN DAVIS, Republican Staff Director and Chief Counsel 

(II) 

C O N T E N T S 

OPENING STATEMENTS 

Page 

Baucus, Hon. Max, a U.S. Senator from Montana, chairman, Committee 

on Finance ............................................................................................................ 1, 6 

Hatch, Hon. Orrin G., a U.S. Senator from Utah ................................................. 3 

Grassley, Hon. Chuck, a U.S. Senator from Iowa ................................................. 4, 7 

CONGRESSIONAL WITNESS 

Cardin, Hon. Benjamin L., a U.S. Senator from Maryland ................................. 8 

ADMINISTRATION NOMINEE 

Colvin, Carolyn W., nominated to be Deputy Commissioner of Social Security, 

Social Security Administration, Baltimore, MD ................................................ 9 

ALPHABETICAL LISTING AND APPENDIX MATERIAL 

Baucus, Hon. Max: 

Opening statements ......................................................................................... 1, 6 

Prepared statement .......................................................................................... 17 

Cardin, Hon. Benjamin L.: 

Testimony .......................................................................................................... 8 

Colvin, Carolyn W.: 

Testimony .......................................................................................................... 9 

Prepared statement .......................................................................................... 19 

Biographical information ................................................................................. 21 

Responses to questions from committee members ......................................... 35 

Grassley, Hon. Chuck: 

Opening statements ......................................................................................... 4, 7 

Prepared statement .......................................................................................... 42 

Hatch, Hon. Orrin G.: 

Opening statement ........................................................................................... 3 

Mikulski, Hon. Barbara A.: 

Prepared statement .......................................................................................... 43 

(III) 

(1) 

NOMINATION OF CAROLYN W. COLVIN, 

TO BE DEPUTY COMMISSIONER 

OF SOCIAL SECURITY, 

SOCIAL SECURITY ADMINISTRATION 

THURSDAY, DECEMBER 9, 2010 

U.S. SENATE, 

COMMITTEE ON FINANCE, 

Washington, DC. 

The hearing was convened, pursuant to notice, at 10:28 a.m., in 

room SD–215, Dirksen Senate Office Building, Hon. Max Baucus 

(chairman of the committee) presiding. 

Present: Senators Bingaman, Stabenow, Carper, Grassley, Hatch, 

Snowe, Ensign, and Enzi. 

Also present: Democratic Staff: Bill Dauster, Deputy Staff Director and General Counsel; Alan Cohen, Senior Budget Analyst; Tom 

Klouda, Senior Staff Member, Social Security; Claire Green, 

Detailee; and Mary Baker, Detailee. Republican Staff: Nick Wyatt, 

Tax and Nominations Professional Staff Member; and Robert Donovan, Detailee. 

OPENING STATEMENT OF HON. MAX BAUCUS, A U.S. SENATOR 

FROM MONTANA, CHAIRMAN, COMMITTEE ON FINANCE 

The CHAIRMAN. The committee will come to order. 

This morning, before we turn to our previously scheduled business, we have a very important task, with a tribute to our beloved 

and accomplished colleague, Chuck Grassley. We do so today because this is the committee’s last public meeting of the year, and 

this year Senator Grassley completes 10 years of service as either 

chairman or ranking member of the committee. Today we celebrate 

a decade of his leadership. 

Senator Grassley served a little less than half that decade as 

chairman, and a little more than half that time as ranking Republican member. With this decade of service, Senator Grassley joins 

an exclusive club. In the history of the Senate, only 13 Senators 

have served more than a decade as either chairman or ranking minority member of this committee. 

The sheer numbers are impressive. Senator Grassley has chaired 

148 hearings and 58 days of mark-up. He served as ranking Republican member at another 175 hearings and 51 days of mark-up. On 

nearly every week of a decade, Chuck and I met once a week. We 

have met every Tuesday at 5 in the afternoon whenever the Senate 

was in session. We would get together to go over matters to miniVerDate Nov 24 2008 20:31 Dec 02, 2011 Jkt 000000 PO 00000 Frm 00005 Fmt 6633 Sfmt 6633 R:\DOCS\71016.000 TIMD
2 

mize misunderstandings and to work together just to help make 

this place work. 

Neither of us is very partisan. We are both quite pragmatic and 

practical. We just want to get things done in a fair, honest, straight 

way, and that has been the hallmark of our relationship. I can tell 

you there is no one more fair, more decent and straight, who wants 

to get things done, than Chuck Grassley. 

For most of those years, those meetings have been in my office. 

That is probably because my office is a little bit bigger. But there 

is another real reason: Senator Grassley is notoriously frugal with 

his office expenditures. [Laughter.] 

So I think that is the real reason that Chuck comes to my office, 

and as Chuck often reminds me—in fact, daily when we meet: 

‘‘Max, I like coming here. Your coffee is free.’’ [Laughter.] 

This year, Senator Grassley completes 30 years in the Senate. 

Today we celebrate 3 decades of service to the Senate. Of a large 

class of 19 Senators who took office in 1981, Senator Grassley is 

the sole remaining Senator still in the Senate. Only one Senator 

from the Hawkeye State has served longer. Over the course of the 

last 2 centuries, nearly 2,000 men and women have served in the 

Senate. Fewer than 30 Senators have cast more votes than Chuck 

Grassley. 

At age 25, the people in Iowa elected Chuck to a seat in the Iowa 

House, and Iowa voters have been reelecting him ever since. This 

year, Senator Grassley completes 51 years of public service to the 

people of the Hawkeye State, and of course the people of America. 

Today we celebrate more than half a century of public service. 

One of the reasons for Chuck’s success is that Chuck Grassley 

never loses touch with the people of Iowa. Never. Every year of 

those 30 years of Senate service, Senator Grassley has visited each 

of Iowa’s 99 counties at least once, and for a town meeting, not just 

a drive-by. That was just something that he promised himself, and 

that is yet another promise that Chuck Grassley has kept. 

Senator Grassley and his wife Barbara are also justifiably proud 

of 56 years of marriage, their 5 children, and many grandchildren. 

It is simple, really. The more you get to know Chuck Grassley, the 

more you like him. He passes the airport test. That is, if you are 

stuck in the airport with somebody, do you like the guy you are sitting next to or not. [Laughter.] 

He is decent, he is honest, he is unpretentious, he is grassroots 

Iowa. I might say in passing that yesterday I had a conversation 

with Secretary Vilsack, and someone asked Secretary Vilsack at 

the signing ceremony yesterday on the Pigford-Cobell settlement, 

‘‘Why is Chuck Grassley so insistent in getting this Pigford legislation passed when there are really only about two or three AfricanAmericans in Iowa?’’ ‘‘He calls me all the time,’’ Secretary Vilsack 

said. ‘‘Yes, he’s called me all the time, too,’’ said Attorney General 

Holder. ‘‘But why is Chuck so insistent in getting justice for those 

few African-Americans who live in Iowa, and also the rest of the 

country?’’ The answer is, from Tom Vilsack, ‘‘He is just, at root, a 

very, very fair man.’’ That’s the definition of Chuck Grassley. If 

Chuck sees something that is not fair, Chuck wants to correct it. 

And so, Chuck, we are very honored to be with you today. I feel 

so honored to serve with you, and more importantly, I am very, 

3 

very grateful and very proud to have you as a very close friend. 

Congratulations. [Applause.] 

I now recognize Senator Hatch before I recognize you. [Laughter.] 

OPENING STATEMENT OF HON. ORRIN G. HATCH, 

A U.S. SENATOR FROM UTAH 

Senator HATCH. Well, thank you, Mr. Chairman. I think you 

summed up Chuck’s service here very, very well. In fact, both of 

you have so honorably served on this committee and throughout 

the Senate, and I just have a very deep reverence for both of you. 

This is likely our last meeting this year, as you say, and probably 

the last time our esteemed colleague, Senator Grassley, will preside 

over the Republican side of the committee. I certainly wish to join 

you and other committee members in paying respect to this wonderful man. 

I have been privileged to be a member of the Finance Committee 

now for 20 years, nearly 20 years, and for a good portion of that 

time I have been honored to sit right next to this distinguished 

Senator from Iowa, and it has been a privilege for me. He is like 

a brother to me, and certainly an example as a mentor. His wife 

Barbara is a terrific human being. 

I wish we had the time to go through and discuss the many attributes that are worthy of emulation, but I know that some of our 

colleagues would like to say a few words today in celebration of this 

really great human being. 

Now, I could speak for a long time on his leadership qualities 

and the many landmark legislative issues on which we have 

worked together in this committee and with you, Mr. Chairman, for 

whom I have great respect. And so could we all. I could relate some 

of the many funny incidents that have occurred right here over the 

years, and Senator Grassley’s keen sense of humor; I think so could 

we all. I still recall every time he has yelled at me. [Laughter.] 

We all understand that Grassley yells, but it is something I have 

really enjoyed through the years, between you and me. [Laughter.] 

I could talk a long while about the basic decency of this wonderful man, his love and concern for his fellow Iowans. You hear 

‘‘Iowa, Iowa, Iowa’’ all the time, just as you should. And how he 

fights like a tiger for the interests of his constituencies, and again, 

so could we all. 

But there is one quality of Chuck Grassley that I think must be 

highlighted because it is so important and it is so much a part of 

his character, and that is honesty. He is a truly honest man, as the 

distinguished chairman has said. As much as with any person I 

have ever known, when Senator Grassley gives you his word, it 

means something, and it is like a bar of gold: you can take it to 

the bank. 

I have known and loved this fine man since he began serving the 

people of Iowa in this body in 1981. In fact, when I ran in 1976, 

I did not know anybody. I was a citizen candidate. I had never run 

for office before. I met with two people when I came back here to 

Washington. I did not even know where to go. One was Chuck 

Grassley in the House, and the other was Barry Goldwater in the 

Senate. Chuck was a leading member of the House at that time. 

4 

I have worked right next to him for many years, not just on this 

committee but also on the Judiciary Committee. We sit side-by-side 

on both committees. 

I have seen him up close and in all kinds of stressful situations. 

In all the ups and downs, in good times and bad, I have never 

known Chuck Grassley to be anything but a man of integrity and 

of his word. I think he would rather die than be dishonest and 

break his word. Now, that has been my impression, and certainly 

I know it is true. If just this one quality were universal, our world 

would be much better off. Now that his term as ranking Republican 

on this committee is ending, I want to pay particular tribute to 

these two really fine men. I have seen them work together time 

after time after time. I have seen them get along together. I have 

seen Chuck yell at Max, too. [Laughter.] 

And it has been good for Max, as it has been good for me. 

[Laughter.] 

All I can say is, these are two really fine people, and I have great 

abiding respect for both of them. I think it has been one of the 

privileges of my life to sit next to Chuck on this committee, and 

also in the Judiciary Committee. As he takes over the ranking 

member position on the Judiciary Committee, as a non-lawyer, by 

the way, I can tell you he will run that committee very, very well 

from the Republican standpoint. I think Max, my esteemed chairman, will miss him greatly on this committee as far as being his 

side-by-side sidekick. I hope he will be able to tolerate and stand 

me. It is hard, I know. [Laughter.] 

But that is good, too. Max needs somebody who will keep his 

blood rushing all the time so we can keep him alive for a long, long 

time, and I am very good at that, aren’t I? 

The CHAIRMAN. Yes. 

Senator HATCH. Yes. All right. [Laughter.] 

I love both of them, I respect both of them, and I am so glad that 

I have known Chuck Grassley and Max Baucus for so long, two 

really, really fine people. 

So I have talked so long, but I just wanted to kind of pay tribute 

here to a truly honest and decent man whom I happen to love. 

Thanks so much. [Applause.] 

OPENING STATEMENT OF HON. CHUCK GRASSLEY, 

A U.S. SENATOR FROM IOWA 

Senator GRASSLEY. I hope it will be all right if I stand in this 

particular instance. First of all, before I start to speak, you do not 

know this, but these folks had the benefit of knowing what was 

going to happen and they had prepared remarks, and I do not have 

any prepared remarks. First of all, the nice things that were said, 

I just wonder if you realized I was reelected, and I am going to be 

around for a while. [Laughter.] 

I see faces out there, and as I look at one person, and one person, 

and one person—but I have not been able to look at the faces of 

all of you—there are a heck of a lot of employees and former employees and associates of mine, and I want to thank you very much 

for coming. How come nobody, including my wife, told me this was 

going to happen? [Laughter.] 

5 

Because my staff has heard me say this: in this town, if more 

than one person knows something in this town, it is no secret. But 

obviously this was a well-kept secret. So, I appreciate the kind remarks. 

Reflecting on what you said, I would go back to one of these town 

meetings several times, and it probably happens in Montana too. 

Constituents will be irate about the great deal of partisanship that 

they see on television going on in Washington. I try to answer the 

question this way to satisfy them, that maybe there is not quite as 

much partisanship as they see on television. That is the first thing 

I tell them: you know, controversy makes news. So obviously, if 

there is a lot of partisanship, it is going to make news. 

Secondly, there probably is not as much partisanship as you 

think there is, but there is probably more than there ought to be. 

I said you never hear about Chuck Grassley and Max Baucus working together, and I usually use the figure of 4 or 5 bills over the 

course of 10 years. Except for 4 or 5 bills, everything that has been 

done in this committee has been done on a bipartisan basis, and 

everything that has gotten out of committee has been signed by the 

President, except one that was vetoed, but it was still a bipartisan 

bill, and how we worked together. But you would never hear about 

Chuck Grassley and Max Baucus working together back in the 

grassroots of America, because we are getting along. If we were 

fighting every day, you and I would make more news. [Laughter.] 

So I tried to use our working relationship, which I have to give 

100-percent credit for the idea to Max Baucus. When I took over 

the chairmanship in 2001, he asked to meet with me in the members’ dining room. I suppose he paid for it, because I probably 

would not have. [Laughter.] 

Anyway, he suggested that we meet once a week when we are 

in session, and so we have done that very, very regularly. There 

have hardly been times that we have not met, and if there have, 

it is because something else has come up. It is always our intention, from 5 to 6 on Tuesdays, to work through the work of this 

committee to see what we can do to make the work be productive, 

because that is what the Senate is all about, trying to get things 

done, not trying to stop things from being done. I think we have 

been very, very successful. But the people of Iowa and Montana 

and around the country do not hear about it because, as I said, we 

are not battling each other. 

So that is the working relationship that I have had and the 

working relationship that I intend to continue to have with him, 

even though I am not ranking member, in the sense of trying to 

get things done. I know that Senator Hatch will work the same 

way to get things done, because that is the way Senator Hatch is. 

I do not regret anything about the work of this committee. It has 

always been a helpful, productive, and pleasant environment. That 

is because of the personality of Max Baucus. 

I did not know his predecessor, but I think Mike Mansfield was 

of the view that the Senate was for the purpose of getting things 

done. I see that. I have never heard him describe it this way, but 

that is the way I kind of sense that it is in the spirit of Mike Mansfield, that you see Max Baucus being a productive member of the 

U.S. Senate. 

6 

And so I want to thank you very much for this honor. I wish Republicans did not have these silly rules of 6 years. [Laughter.] 

It shows we are not smarter than the Democrats. And that is not 

because I do not want you to have the opportunity, but I just love 

this committee, and I am going to continue to be very active, even 

though I suppose being a non-lawyer working with all those lawyers, I will have a hard time keeping up. But I am going to do the 

best I can. 

Thank you all very much. [Applause.] 

OPENING STATEMENT OF HON. MAX BAUCUS, A U.S. SENATOR 

FROM MONTANA, CHAIRMAN, COMMITTEE ON FINANCE 

The CHAIRMAN. Now we get down to the business. Now everybody can get back to work. 

President Harry Truman said, ‘‘It has long been recognized as an 

inescapable obligation of a democratic society to provide for every 

individual some measure of basic protection from hardship and 

want. In our country, the obligation of the Federal Government in 

this respect has been recognized by the establishment of our Social 

Security system.’’ 

Today we consider the nomination of Carolyn Colvin to be Deputy Commissioner of Social Security. The Deputy Commissioner is 

vital to fulfilling Social Security’s mission. The Deputy Commissioner assists the Commissioner in carrying out the Commissioner’s 

responsibilities, and these include ensuring that the agency’s operations run smoothly. 

Ms. Colvin, one of your great strengths is your many years of experience working at the Social Security Administration. You understand the agency’s mission and its challenges. You know many of 

the dedicated civil servants who work there. These strengths will 

help you as you deal with the many problems that the agency 

faces. The talents that you have displayed in your previous jobs 

will serve you well in your new endeavor. 

Social Security faces many challenges. High on the list is the 

agency’s huge backlog of disability appeals hearings. The recession 

has exacerbated the problem, prompting a growing number of people to apply for disability benefits. It is worse now; the lines are 

longer. This has made the job of reducing the backlog even more 

difficult. 

I might say, I have been working to reduce that backlog for 

years. I have worked very hard to reduce it. I think it is just an 

outrage, how long it is. I thank you for your efforts to reduce it. 

But the job of reducing the backlog is not impossible if Congress 

provides adequate funding. The agency has made progress in reducing the backlog, but the agency needs to do much more. As Deputy Commissioner, you will play an important role. 

Another challenge is helping people with disabilities return to 

work. We need to re-energize the Ticket to Work program, which 

provides this kind of assistance. Again, you will play an important 

part. 

In recent years, the agency has benefitted from improved technology. These advances can be key assets in the agency’s efforts. 

But success depends on the agency’s approximately 70,000 employees. They must embrace the agency’s mission of public service, and 

7 

they must recognize the importance of their work. You must lead 

them, and I am sure that you will. 

The management associations and unions are important stakeholders. They need to be heard, and I am confident that you will 

do that, too. You will listen. Social Security is deeply rooted in our 

society. It must be nourished and cared for so that it can continue 

to grow and flourish. 

Ms. Colvin, you have been nominated as Deputy Commissioner 

because the President, and we, believe that you possess the qualities necessary to strengthen the roots of this agency, to nourish it, 

and to help it flourish. As you do so, you will be helping to preserve 

and strengthen that measure of protection from hardship and want 

that America calls Social Security. 

[The prepared statement of Chairman Baucus appears in the appendix.] 

The CHAIRMAN. I will now turn to Senator Grassley for any statement he may want to make. 

OPENING STATEMENT OF HON. CHUCK GRASSLEY, 

A U.S. SENATOR FROM IOWA 

Senator GRASSLEY. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. And congratulations on your nomination, Ms. Colvin. It is a privilege to have you 

before the committee. Of course, I know you are eager to get started in this new position. As Deputy Commissioner, you are a person 

who has certain responsibilities and duties that the law and the 

Commissioner give you to do, but you are also a person who has 

to be ready to take over at any time that the Commissioner position would not be filled. 

As Deputy Commissioner, you have the opportunity to participate in key decisions at the highest levels. Your previous experience at Social Security will serve you well in your new position. 

Your advice and leadership will contribute greatly to the success of 

the agency. 

Of course, these are challenging times for the Social Security Administration. Rising unemployment, the retirement of baby 

boomers, and the aging of its workforce have all forced the agency 

to do more with less. Of course, with the rising concerns about the 

Federal debt, there is a desire to find ways of seeing how much 

more efficient any agency can be, not just yours. 

I know the efficiency and the administrative overhead of Social 

Security is probably less than any other department of government, 

but still those are fiscal obstacles that we have to overcome and do 

as much as we can. If you are confirmed, I look forward to working 

with you as a member of this committee to protect and improve the 

Social Security program. 

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. 

The CHAIRMAN. Thank you, Senator. 

[The prepared statement of Senator Grassley appears in the appendix.] 

The CHAIRMAN. I would now like to turn to our witness. But as 

our witness hails from the great State of Maryland, I note the presence of the senior Senator from Maryland, who would like to introduce our witness. 

Why don’t you proceed? 

8 

STATEMENT OF HON. BENJAMIN L. CARDIN, 

A U.S. SENATOR FROM MARYLAND 

Senator CARDIN. Well, Senator Baucus, first of all, thank you 

very much for the courtesy of allowing me to present Carolyn 

Colvin. 

And Senator Grassley, let me join in the tribute of your extraordinary service here on the Senate Finance Committee. We are all 

very proud of your record. I, too, have questions about the wisdom 

of term limits, but I will get to spend a little bit more time with 

you in the Judiciary Committee, so I know that we will have our 

opportunities to continue to work together on the Judiciary Committee. I again congratulate you on your service. 

Senator Baucus and members of the Senate Finance Committee, 

it is really my honor to present Carolyn Colvin. I have known Carolyn for a long time, and she is a person who has devoted most of 

her life to public service. We are very proud that she hails from 

Maryland. I first want to thank her and her family for her willingness to continue in the public sector, using her talent to help in one 

of the most important programs in the history of America, the Social Security Act. 

She has her undergraduate and graduate degrees in Business 

Administration from Morgan State University. She currently serves 

as the Special Assistant to the Maryland Secretary of Transportation, and prior to this position she served as CEO of America 

Group Community Care, which is a company dedicated to caring 

for financially vulnerable seniors and people with disabilities 

through publicly funded programs. So her background is ideally 

suited to be Deputy Commissioner. 

But before joining Amerigroup, Ms. Colvin served as director of 

Montgomery County Department of Health and Human Services 

and as director of the Department of Health and Human Services 

for the District of Columbia, so she brings that experience also to 

this position, heading one of the largest counties in the country and 

one of the most difficult jurisdictions, the District of Columbia. 

She also will be returning to the Social Security Administration, 

as you pointed out, Mr. Chairman, where she served 6 years in key 

executive positions as the Deputy Commissioner for Policy and External Affairs from 1994 to 1996, and Deputy Commissioner for 

Program and Policy from 1996 until 1998, and then as Deputy 

Commissioner for Operations from 1998 to 2001. 

She is an exceedingly effective strategic manager of personnel, 

fiscal, and material resources, and her communication skills are 

simply outstanding. She is highly persuasive in presenting policy 

and technical topics to colleagues, the media, large and small 

groups, and one on one. 

I was very pleased to see the President nominate her to be the 

Deputy Commissioner for the Social Security Administration, and 

if confirmed, I am convinced that she will continue her great legacy 

of public service. 

The CHAIRMAN. Thank you, Senator. 

Before we proceed, Ms. Colvin, I will give you the opportunity to 

introduce any friends or family you may have with you here today. 

Ms. COLVIN. Thank you, Senator. 

The CHAIRMAN. Thank you, Senator. 

9 

Ms. COLVIN. I do not have family present today. My one son resides in Houston, TX and was not able to get in. I think I have 

some colleagues in the back. I will ask them to stand. 

The CHAIRMAN. Would you, please? Yes, have them stand. 

Ms. COLVIN. Stacy Rodgers is the current Deputy Secretary of 

the Maryland State Department of Human Resources, the agency 

I formerly led. In addition, Rufus Mayfield, standing next to her, 

is one of my staff from DC government when I was the director of 

the Department of Human Services there. 

In the front, I have Karen Gooden, who is currently the Assistant 

Secretary of Administrative Services in the Maryland Department 

of Transportation, where I am currently employed. So I want to 

thank them very much for their support and coming out this morning. 

The CHAIRMAN. Well, thank you all very, very much. Give our 

very best to your son. 

Ms. COLVIN. Thank you. 

The CHAIRMAN. It is unfortunate he was unable to make it. 

I do note the presence of someone sitting behind you, the Commissioner. Would you stand, Commissioner? Commissioner Astrue, 

the Commissioner of Social Security. Thanks for being here. I appreciate it very much. 

As is our practice, as I am sure you may know, Ms. Colvin, we 

will submit your statement automatically into the record and encourage you to summarize it in, say, 5 minutes, roughly. We will 

go to questions after that. 

You may proceed. 

STATEMENT OF CAROLYN W. COLVIN, NOMINATED TO BE DEPUTY COMMISSIONER OF SOCIAL SECURITY, SOCIAL SECURITY ADMINISTRATION, BALTIMORE, MD 

Ms. COLVIN. I do, before I start, want to thank Commissioner 

Astrue for being here to support my nomination. I have had the opportunity to talk with him on a number of occasions and look forward to working with him. I also want to thank Senator Cardin, 

although he has left. As he has indicated, he has known me for 

many, many years, and I wanted to just publicly thank him for his 

support. 

Mr. Chairman, Senator Grassley, it is an honor to appear before 

you today as President Obama’s nominee for Deputy Commissioner 

of Social Security. If confirmed, I will welcome the opportunity to 

work with you, President Obama, and Commissioner Astrue to help 

meet the challenges that the Social Security Administration is facing, and ask for your support. 

I have spent my career leading Federal, State, and local organizations through development, change, and innovation. My prior 

work experience, especially the experience I have gained in social 

service agencies, has taught me about our obligation as a Nation 

to the well-being of our constituents. It has taught me that government can take measured, responsible steps to assist those less fortunate than ourselves, while also promoting the kind of earned 

right social insurance programs that America’s workers deserve in 

retirement. 

10 

My years of public service have taught me that I may not always 

have all of the answers, but at least I know the right questions to 

ask. In my tenure as the Deputy Commissioner for Operations at 

the Social Security Administration, I provided executive leadership 

and directed the work of nearly 50,000 employees serving in headquarters support functions, the regional offices, SSA’s 1,300 field 

offices, tele-service centers, and program service centers. 

In addition to my service as the Deputy Commissioner for Operations, I also served nearly 4 years as the Deputy Commissioner 

for Policy and Programs, so I have extensive experience in performance management and leadership of the disability determination 

process and what was then called the Office of Hearings and Appeals. 

Despite significant challenges, I can see many innovative developments at SSA that have occurred over the last 9 years, especially 

in the areas of Internet and cyber services. When I left SSA in 

2001, we were proud of the fact that we had over 10 million Internet users, a number that has grown exponentially. I am excited 

about the iClaims process, other new online business processes, 

video service delivery, and changes in SSA’s national 800-number 

network. 

I was pleased to discover that the Immediate Claims Taking 

Process which was initiated during my tenure has grown tremendously. But the Social Security Administration faces many challenges, as you have mentioned. With this committee’s help and increased funding supported by Congress, Commissioner Astrue has 

made significant progress with the disability backlogs, but it is 

clear that more needs to be done. 

No one in SSA could have predicted the economic downturn that 

has diminished the progress that SSA had hoped to make in reducing the backlogs. Disability and retirement claims are increasing at 

a rate not expected 15 months ago, and, in the inevitable chain reaction, SSA is seeing increases in initial disability claims pending 

and hearing receipts. 

I look forward to being a part of the solution to these problems 

that are so important to the people of our great Nation. If confirmed, my primary goal would be to find common ground to support the President’s initiatives to strengthen SSA’s efforts to carry 

out its mission. The President’s fiscal year 2011 budget request 

supports increases in staffing, which will help to process the spikes 

in initial retirement and disability claims, as well as disability appeals. 

The President also supports dedicated funding for improved program integrity. This investment will help to assure that the government is spending tax dollars efficiently and that benefits are 

paid only to eligible beneficiaries in the correct amounts. These activities are critical to the American taxpayer. To quote the President: ‘‘Social Security is indispensable to workers, the disabled, 

seniors, and survivors, and is probably the most successful program 

that our country has ever established.’’ 

One of the great fortunes of my life has been that my career path 

has allowed me to work on so many of the issues I care most about. 

Human service issues give me a renewed sense of purpose every 

day. If confirmed, I look forward to supporting the President and 

11 

the Commissioner as they work together with this committee to 

continue to ensure that Social Security programs will be preserved, 

protected, and improved for future generations. 

Thank you. I would be happy to answer your questions. 

[The prepared statement of Ms. Colvin appears in the appendix.] 

The CHAIRMAN. Well, thank you very much, Ms. Colvin. 

I have three standard questions to ask, which we ask all nominees. 

Ms. COLVIN. Yes. 

The CHAIRMAN. First, is there anything that you are aware of in 

your background that might present a conflict of interest with the 

duties of the office to which you have been nominated? 

Ms. COLVIN. No. 

The CHAIRMAN. Do you know of any reason, personal or otherwise, that would in any way prevent you from fully and honorably 

discharging the responsibilities of the office to which you have been 

nominated? 

Ms. COLVIN. No. 

The CHAIRMAN. Do you agree, without reservation, to respond to 

any reasonable summons to appear and testify before any duly constituted committee of Congress, if you are confirmed? 

Ms. COLVIN. Yes. Absolutely. 

The CHAIRMAN. Thank you. 

My question: why do you want this job? 

Ms. COLVIN. This is a job that I have worked for all of my life. 

The CHAIRMAN. Why in the world, with all the problems, all the 

things you can do, why in the world do you want this job? 

Ms. COLVIN. Because I think that I can continue to make a difference. As you have mentioned, Social Security probably touches 

the lives of more Americans than any other program. I think that 

these are very challenging times, and we must be able to maintain 

the public trust. We need to be able to improve the services that 

we provide, and it is a lifetime opportunity to be able to do that. 

So I am very excited about the opportunity. 

The CHAIRMAN. What do you think your best qualities are that 

you would bring to this job? What are your best qualities? When 

you think to yourself, boy, I am really good at that, what is that? 

Ms. COLVIN. I am an excellent manager. I am a strategic thinker. 

I am a problem-solver. I care about people whom I work with. I 

care about the people whom I serve. I think the strengths that I 

have developed over the years in strategic planning and performance management are some of the skills that I would bring to this 

job. 

The CHAIRMAN. What are your shortcomings? 

Ms. COLVIN. Probably impatience. It takes longer to do things 

that need to be done because we just have to go through the system. I try to temper that, but I think that would probably be my 

biggest challenge, to continue to create a sense of urgency. We 

serve people whose needs are great. When they come to us, we are 

the last resort in many instances, and they need to be served 

quickly. 

The CHAIRMAN. So, as you look at the agency—you touched a bit 

on this in your statement—what do you see? I am going to ask the 

question in two categories. One, what are some of the issues that 

12 

are most urgent and you must act on right away? Another category, addressing your strategic thinking: what are some of the 

issues that are urgent, that do not have to be solved today but are 

still on your to-do list to get done soon? 

Ms. COLVIN. I think my greatest concern will be to focus on the 

disability backlog. The agency has certainly made progress, but, because of the unexpected increase in the caseloads, the backlogs are 

greater than we had anticipated. There is also the concern relative 

to the length of time it takes to actually have a claim processed, 

especially if there is an appeal. I am very concerned about program 

integrity. 

We must find a way of reducing and recovering the improper 

payments that occur in the programs. I am also concerned about 

the solvency of the programs. I think that it is very important that 

the issues of solvency be addressed sooner rather than later so that 

there is adequate time to phase in those changes that may occur 

and more time for individuals who are going to be impacted to plan 

for those impacts. 

The CHAIRMAN. What are the three major components to addressing the backlog problem? I assume resources is one, but what 

others? 

Ms. COLVIN. I think that there have been a number of things 

that current Commissioner Astrue has initiated. Certainly, resources would be the first issue in resolving the backlog. I do want 

to thank this body and the President for the budget support that 

you have given to the agency to make that happen. 

But there is also the need to accelerate the Internet and cyberspace issues, with the number of individuals who are going to be 

utilizing our services in the future. We are certainly going to have 

to be dependent upon Internet usage, and that is beginning. I think 

that we must focus on performance management. As you know, 

many of the employees at the agency are eligible to retire within 

the next 5 years. Social Security is a very complex program, so, 

when we hire, it takes time. When the agency hires, it takes time 

for them to be able to fully process claims. 

The CHAIRMAN. Thank you. 

Senator Carper? You may, in fact, finish up, because there is a 

phone call we have to take right now. 

Senator CARPER. All right. 

The CHAIRMAN. But thank you. We wish you very, very good 

luck. 

Ms. COLVIN. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. 

The CHAIRMAN. Thank you. 

Ms. COLVIN. Thank you so much. 

Senator CARPER. Senator Grassley is back. 

The CHAIRMAN. Senator Grassley? I am sorry. Senator Grassley 

has walked in. 

Senator GRASSLEY. I am going to have to submit two questions 

for answer in writing because I want you to give them some 

thought. 

[The questions appear in the appendix.] 

Senator GRASSLEY. I have one question that I think you can answer right now. That is, your affiliation with the National Committee to Preserve Social Security and Medicare. There is nothing 

13 

wrong with your affiliation with that, but, since that organization 

actively lobbies Congress on legislative issues, can you give us your 

assurance that you have severed all ties with the organization and 

will avoid any future involvement in its activities? 

Ms. COLVIN. Yes, Senator Grassley. I resigned from the organization October of 2009 when I was being considered for this position. 

Senator GRASSLEY. All right. 

Ms. COLVIN. And so I have no involvement at this point. 

Senator GRASSLEY. Thank you very much. That is the only question I had. 

Senator Carper? 

Senator CARPER. Senator Grassley, some of us had hoped we 

would have a chance to say a word or two in your defense earlier 

today when you were being applauded for your years of service. A 

number of people sort of kidded him about his fiscal discipline, 

about his ability to spend money wisely, including his own. [Laughter.] 

I just want the record to show, in 2001 I had been a new Senator 

here for a month or two, and I spoke to him and introduced myself. 

I said I would like to have the opportunity to come by just to visit 

with him in his office. He said, ‘‘We will do better than that.’’ I 

said, ‘‘How is that?’’ He said, ‘‘Why don’t you come to the Senate 

dining room and we’ll have breakfast together, and I’ll buy.’’ And 

I want the record to show that he bought for me a bowl of oatmeal, 

and was good enough, when I asked also for the waitress to serve 

me half a grapefruit, a glass of orange juice, and toast, he sprung 

for that as well. It has been a joy working with you ever since. I 

owe you a bowl of oatmeal. [Laughter.] 

Senator GRASSLEY. Thank you. 

Senator CARPER. I have just one or two points I would like to 

raise. We are about to start voting, in fact, almost any minute. 

Senator GRASSLEY. I have to go. 

Senator CARPER. I would also say, Senator Grassley, before you 

leave, my mom used to say to me, and these are good words for 

you to keep in mind on a day like today when everybody is just loving you to death, that the flattery will not hurt you if you do not 

inhale. [Laughter.] 

Senator GRASSLEY. Thank you. 

Senator CARPER. You mentioned two words that the folks behind 

me here and my staff have spent a lot of time and energy on. Those 

words are ‘‘improper payments.’’ During the first term of President 

George W. Bush, he signed into law legislation, I think it was 

called the Improper Payments Act of 2002, something like that. 

The law directed Federal agencies, Federal agency heads, to begin 

reporting improper payments. Over time some did; a number did 

not. 

Senator Tom Coburn, with whom I serve on the Homeland Security and Government Affairs Committee, and I began an effort to 

hold hearings and to put a spotlight on those that were complying, 

and also to put a spotlight on those agencies that were not. We 

worked together to pass legislation that I introduced, signed by the 

President earlier this year, updating the Improper Payments Act. 

The legislation says not only do we want Federal agencies to report 

improper payments, we want them to stop making them. 

14 

We also, in addition to that, want agencies to go out, where practicable, and recover monies that have been improperly paid. The 

legislation also indicated that we felt that agency heads, those in 

authority, when they were evaluated, part of that evaluation 

should reflect their compliance with the spirit of this legislation. 

Would you just talk a little bit more about the three aspects, or 

four aspects: (1) reporting improper payments, the requirement to 

report; (2) the requirement to stop making them; (3) the requirement to go out and recover monies as best we can; and (4) the evaluation of agency heads, which would in part reflect their compliance with that level? Would you just speak to that, please? 

Ms. COLVIN. Well, Senator, as you may know, I am not at the 

agency yet. I know that the agency has already developed targets 

relative to reducing payments and recovering payments. As you 

know, the executive order requires that there be an official accountable for that, and that official must be Senate-confirmed. At this 

point, Commissioner Astrue is the only confirmed member at the 

department. 

It is my hope that, if I am confirmed, he will allow me to take 

that responsibility on. That is something that I think is extremely 

important, so I would be prepared to provide you with information 

later about what the agency is doing. But I think that the law is 

important, and we will certainly, if I am confirmed, be complying 

with it. 

Senator CARPER. That is good to hear. I saw a thumbs-up as 

well, so I take that as a good sign. 

Within the last month or so, Congress received a report from the 

executive branch that improper payments, I guess, for the past fiscal year exceeded $100 billion. Most of those were overpayments, 

and some of them were pretty small, and they are hard to recover. 

But a lot of them are not. We made $30 or $40 billion of improper 

payments that are actually probably attributable to Medicare, and 

others to Medicaid. In a day and age when we have a government 

this large, you know and I know that it is not sustainable. 

In a day and age when the Medicare trust fund is expected to 

pretty much run out of money by the end of the next decade, that 

is not sustainable. At a time when we are doing a lot of evaluation 

and we are having big deficit commissions looking at Social Security, we want to make sure the Social Security trust fund is going 

to be around for as long as we have a country. That is not sustainable. 

Another thing I want to ask is, can you give us—this Deficit Reduction Commission has recommended, among other things, extending the full retirement age, I think, by 2050 up to, I want to 

say, 68, and to extend the full retirement age for Social Security 

by 2075 to age 69, and to also move up the early retirement ages 

by a year, I think for each of those two dates, to age 63, maybe 

64, respectively. 

They have also given some thought to modifying the COLA that 

is used to award update benefits at the beginning of each calendar 

year. The term ‘‘chained COLA’’ was used in the recommendations. 

Can you tell us what that means? Just give us some idea of how 

that is different from our current approach to COLA. 

15 

Ms. COLVIN. I do not think that I am prepared to answer that 

question now. I think that all of the options that have been proposed need to be looked at very carefully and examined to see what 

the impact will be—what the cost will be first of all, or what the 

savings will be, and what the impact will be on the individuals. 

Senator CARPER. Again, I am not asking you to say whether it 

is a good idea or a bad idea. Could you just take a moment and 

just explain to us what is meant by the term ‘‘chained COLA?’’ 

Ms. COLVIN. To change the COLA? 

Senator CARPER. Chained, C-H-A-I-N-E-D. Chained COLA is the 

term that was used in their report. 

Ms. COLVIN. I am sorry, I cannot answer that. 

Senator CARPER. Could you just answer that for the record for 

us, please? 

Ms. COLVIN. I am not able to answer that. I do not think I know 

what—— 

Senator CARPER. No, no, no. Not today, but just for the record. 

Ms. COLVIN. Oh, yes. Definitely. I will get back to you. 

Senator CARPER. Yes, if you would. And to explain what is meant 

by that, and how does it differ from the current approach to a 

COLA, if you would. 

Ms. COLVIN. Definitely. 

Senator CARPER. All right. Thanks. 

Seeing no other members of the committee who are here, let me 

ask the staff, is there a period of time during which the record 

would be left open for folks to submit questions? And for what period of time would that be, do you know? Noon Friday. So that is 

noon tomorrow. All right. 

Well, for the next 24 hours and 44 minutes, members of this 

committee, I think, are entitled to submit questions to you. If they 

do, we just ask you to respond to them promptly. 

Ms. COLVIN. I will do so. 

Senator CARPER. All right. Thanks for your willingness to serve. 

Ms. COLVIN. Thank you very much. 

Senator CARPER. We welcome, as well, your colleagues, including 

the thumbs-up that we saw there in the front. 

Ms. COLVIN. Thank you. 

Senator CARPER. Thanks so much. 

With that, this hearing is adjourned. Thanks so much. 

[Whereupon, at 11:18 a.m., the hearing was concluded.] 

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A P P E N D I X 

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