November 16, 2015

1215-1245 EST

Record of telephone conversation AeroCine, LLC RFI

Attendees:

Joshua Parker, Program Analyst ARM

Joseph Hexter, Senior Regulatory Analyst, AFS-80/SAIC

Brian Streem, CEO AeroCine, LLC

Jon Ollwerther, AeroCine, LLC

• Introductions

• Joe Hexter 

o Stating Exemption 11150B to add the DJI Phantom and Inspire 1 was done to help 

AeroCine conduct operations while the seven precedent setting items were being 

reviewed

o Review of RFI e-mail for night operations and UA lighting 

 Request: List of all models to be used

 Request: Description of lighting

• Brian asked about lighting intensity and if other UA had been approved

with a particular type/intensity: Joe Hexter, none that I can speak to

• Brian asked if there was any specific requirement such as distance lights 

would be visible: Joe Hexter, since this is closed set there should not be 

a problem, just provide as much engineering or test data you can to 

support your case for use

 Joe Hexter mentioned AeroCine should provide a Safety Case outlining training, 

and other issues listed in the RFI that are consistent with what the FAA has

requested of others petitioning night operations, e.g. dark adaptation, 

interference with lighting used in filming, and lighting for ground control station

• Brian spoke to CNN and his lack of understanding what the Pathfinder Program is all about

o Joe Hexter provided a basic overview of formal safety panels and FAA involvement in 

the pathfinder process such as R&D. Also, in many instances, the pathfinders pave the 

way for others such as AeroCine and we can leverage the results of their work

• Brian then went through the specific conditions/limitations in the AeroCine petition asking if 

there was anything they needed to support their request:

o Condition 1: revise to reflect the weight of the Aerobo X12, which will be in excess of 55 

pounds including payload

 Joe Hexter: your petition referenced Yamaha and the R-Max which has 

thousands of hours operating time and reams of engineering data. You should 

supply as much engineering and flight data as you can to support your position. 

The Yamaha is in the process of certification so they supplied quite a lot of data.
o Condition 13: revise to allow approval to fly with experienced UAS operators in direct 

control of the craft, while under direct supervision of, and in direct communication with 

an FAA-licensed private, recreational or sport pilot as a VO. Joe Hexter:

 We don’t require any additional information. There are others ahead of you

and we can leverage the analysis that has already been accomplished

o Condition 15: revise to permit night flight operations for closed set filmmaking 

 Brian Streem: we’ve already discussed this

o Condition 21: revise to permit contemporaneous issuance of NOTAM for breaking news 

instead of the current requirement for 24 hour advanced notification

 Joe Hexter: In the past we would not have approved this; however, the small 

UAS rule proposed does not require NOTAMs. I hope to leverage the proposed 

small UAS rule

o Condition 25: revise to permit the PIC to operate the UAS from a moving platform for 

closed set filmmaking

 Joe Hexter: We can leverage others that have submitted similar requests ahead 

of AeroCine; we do not need additional supporting documentation

o Condition 26: revise to permit operations over non-participating persons for breaking 

news flights with a UAS weighing no more than 4.4 pounds

o Condition 27: revise to permit operations over persons in the airspace that is not above 

private, or controlled access property, only with permission from the owner/controller 

or authorized representative

 Joe Hexter: I must be honest in that it would not be proper for me to promise 

anything. You mentioned CNN so you are aware they are participating in the 

pathfinder program. I’m not sure if management will allow AeroCine to get 

ahead of the pathfinder program. The R&D being accomplished will provide the 

basis for future grants of exemption. In the meantime feel free to provide as 

much engineering data and possibly include this in your safety case and we will 

review it.

 Brian Streem: Mentioned if AeroCine could participate in the pathfinder 

programs, stating conditions 26 and 27 were critical to AeroCine’s operations. 

Joe Hexter stated this was not in his “swim lane” but certainly AeroCine could 

submit a proposal to the FAA requesting participation in the pathfinder 

program. 

 Mr. Streem also mentioned PreNav and the drone they were using to conduct 

tower inspections. The PreNav drone weighs less than 55 pounds and has been 

approved by the FAA. Joe Hexter asked Joshua Parker if there would be any 

issues and Joshua stated that as long as the UAS was on the FAA’s approved list

AeroCine could use it.

• Brian Streem asked about his request to use pilots that were not US Nationals; then commented 

AeroCine had not yet petitioned the FAA for this relief.
• Joe Hexter thanked AeroCine for their time and stated no one in the FAA wanted to delay their 

request; however, we were leveraging several petitions that were submitted in advance of the 

AeroCine petition. 

• General thanks and it was agreed that Joshua would be the POC for contact with AeroCine