Thread: The Pledge of Allegiance (part of American schools)

Traveler said Are pledges in general necessary? What about the oath of office that our elected officials say, or the pledge that our military in the USA say upon entering the armed forces? Are there benefits to that, and does it translate to the Pledge of Allegiance? Click to expand... First, I feel that in today's modern, cynical, media driven world, pledges have little significance to most people. Most people likely mouth the words without any particular feeling about what they are saying and many probably wait until the person to the left of them says the words, because they don't remember them by rote. I think we may most often identify the people who do take the pledge seriously, because instead of mindlessly mouthing the words, they let us know that they object to some portion such as ... under God .... In other words, they care enough to be concerned about saying words they cannot believe in. I see little value in these kind of pledges accept to the extent that they do identify those core elements of what we as a nation might believe in and stand together on One nation Indivisible a Republic Liberty Justice I get one nation, but do sometimes wonder if we truly are one nation for all. But I think it's an admirable goal. We fought a civil war to drive home the point that once in the club, there is no out. We can argue about what liberty and justice for all means, but I think we all agree its a goal worth struggling toward even as buildings burn in Ferguson and we see the difficulty in applying this laudable goal to the practical realities of today's complex, ugly world. So while I may question the need or benefit for this kind of pledge, I don't really question the values expressed in it on an abstract, theoretical sense. But under God? Last month, an atheist airman at Creech Air Force Base in Nevada was denied reenlistment for refusing to take an oath containing so help me God. After this requirement was challenged, the Air Force changed its policy. I don't think the nation is at greater risk, because an atheist airman who served his country honorably and was able to affirm leaving out the so help me God language when he first joined, because the policy changed when it was time for him to reenlist. And now that the Air Force has changed its policy and this language so help me God is optional, why do we include the language in a pledge of allegiance that should focus on those things that bind us together as a nation? The inclusion of this language also undercuts the idea of a nation where the freedom to believe or not to believe in religion and how we practice that religion is enshrined in our Constitution. While I don't feel these pledges do much for our nation. I do think there are things together that we can do, which may serve to bind us together as a nation. Let's see. My dad used to talk about basic training and survival school and prisoner of war training and some other training that he did. He went through basic training a long time ago, but he told me that there was strength in knowing that everyone you worked with he was Navy had gone through this training together. He talked about his SERE training and how it was some of the roughest training he had gone through and that sometimes, he would picture people going through SERE training when he was doing something hard and it would make whatever he was currently doing seem easier. I think some sort of national service where everyone put in a year between high school and college might have value in binding us together as a nation. But the pledge? At a minimum, I strongly think we should drop the concept of under God and I have a lot of confidence that the Supreme Court if it ever considers this issue will find it unconstitutional. In any event, I appreciated reading your thoughts Traveler, even if I don't agree 100 with you. I think every debate is strengthened by hearing from both sides.