=== bdrung_ is now known as bdrung === maco_ is now known as MsMaco === mdz_ is now known as mdz === dholbach_ is now known as dholbach === fader|away is now known as fader === cjwatson_ is now known as cjwatson === freeflyi2g is now known as freeflying [13:50] hi i hope iam not gatecrashing [13:50] who can tell me how i can become an ubuntu member [13:50] http://www.ubuntu.com/community/processes/newmember https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Membership [13:51] InDuS: either of those links should help you out [13:51] ok i did all that [13:51] so i was told to come here after those [13:51] i created my page etc [13:52] also, i promote foss in my country etc [13:53] that membership page says to apply in there ,but i cant find any links to do so [13:54] There is an ubuntu-mobile meeting scheduled to start in 6 minutes. You can bring it up during that meeting, when it is time for new business. [13:54] ubuntu-mobile meeting? hmm whats that about? [13:55] Stick around and find out. [13:55] ok [13:55] InDuS: please see pm or come into #ubuntu-locoteams [13:59] Hey all [14:00] NCommander: Around? [14:00] #startmeeting [14:00] Meeting started at 08:00. The chair is NCommander. [14:00] Commands Available: [TOPIC], [IDEA], [ACTION], [AGREED], [LINK], [VOTE] [14:00] lool, yes, I'm just kinda noe feeling very good [14:00] dyfet, persia, paulliu, ogra, plars: ping [14:00] GrueMaster: I think he's talking general membership, not just mobile [14:00] * plars is here [14:00] poop [14:00] poop yourself! [14:00] :) [14:00] lool, hi [14:01] * GrueMaster props eyes open with toothpicks. [14:01] * NCommander snores loadly [14:01] ok [14:01] loadly? [14:01] Apparently NCommander is loaded [14:01] better than yodely [14:02] [link] https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MobileTeam/Meeting/2009/20090811?action=edit&editor=text [14:02] LINK received: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MobileTeam/Meeting/2009/20090811?action=edit&editor=text [14:02] NCommander: I added a couple of entries to the roadmap which I'll explain when we get there [14:02] [link] https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MobileTeam/Meeting/2009/20090811 [14:02] LINK received: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MobileTeam/Meeting/2009/20090811 [14:02] oh [14:02] thanks [14:02] better [14:02] :) [14:02] [topic] Action Item Review [14:02] New Topic: Action Item Review [14:02] [topic] NCommander to investigate https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/vnc4/+bug/338148 (co) [14:02] New Topic: NCommander to investigate https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/vnc4/+bug/338148 (co) [14:02] Launchpad bug 338148 in vnc4 "Needs new version from Debian: fails to build with removal of mesa-swx11-source" [High,Triaged] [14:03] c/o yet again, this bug is up for grabs if anyone wants it [14:03] NCommander: What needs to happen so that you can make progress on it? [14:03] I think it's basically calling for a merge [14:03] lool, time, its not a trivial merge [14:04] Ok [14:04] lool, it requires sucking in the X11 headers, and it isn;'t very clear how it comes together [14:04] [topic] !GrueMaster to retest on i386 https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/linux/+bug/337809 [14:04] New Topic: !GrueMaster to retest on i386 https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/linux/+bug/337809 [14:04] Launchpad bug 337809 in linux "APIC error on CPU 0" [Medium,Triaged] [14:04] This requires me setting up my CrownBeach again. Very low priority (unless someone says otherwise). [14:05] * NCommander wonders if we should just remove it from the list [14:05] [topic] Specification Review [14:05] New Topic: Specification Review [14:05] [link] http://people.canonical.com/~lool/mobile-status.html [14:05] LINK received: http://people.canonical.com/~lool/mobile-status.html [14:06] Thank you lool [14:06] outdated ! [14:06] that too [14:06] ogra: Is it really? [14:06] ogra: Which spec? [14:06] * NCommander had status changes last night ... [14:07] both of mine i updated status this morning [14:07] you should really run the update before the meeting [14:07] [topic] lool's status [14:07] New Topic: lool's status [14:08] outdated :P [14:08] ogra: Oh right, I'm still running the generation daily and pushing more frequently [14:08] Pushing an updated one [14:08] done [14:08] thanks [14:08] NCommander: I think we wanted to ultimately drop per people status [14:09] Ok now we have this page with the status of each spec as reported by each owner [14:09] hmm, it doesnt respect linewraps in the Status entry [14:09] The idea is that everybody opens it, takes a look and asks any question [14:09] * ogra needs to take that into account [14:09] * NCommander much perfered us just giving a quick status line each meeting but ok ... [14:10] I have a question about https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/mobile-karmic-arm-cloud-builds [14:10] I actually started writing real code to my cloud builder, but it's not dong anything useful yet [14:10] Oh good timing [14:10] haha [14:11] plars: So I kept deferring work on it, but I really believe it's useful and I started architecting the source code and playing with boto code samples [14:11] lool: cool, so that answers my first question of "is this expected to happen this cycle?" [14:11] But it doesn't advance the spec significantly [14:11] I'll update it when I have a first pass to push [14:11] I expect the first thing will be creating a couple of vms and tracking their status in a local sqlite [14:11] lool: the spec says approved, but there are not valid work items on the whiteboard, so I was kinda confused by what kind of shape it was in [14:11] And start/stop basically [14:12] plars: Hmm good point I need to add valid work items to that one; I forgot about it when it got off the list of specs in error [14:12] plars: Thanks for pointing it out, I'll document them [14:12] Hmm nobody told me but the counts in the second column are wrong too [14:12] I need to fix my SQL [14:13] i have one about softbootloader: i had a task to review the softbootloader spec, lool nicely reminded me of that today, i looked at it but the UDS discussion was never merged or taken into account it seems, there are external and team internal action items listed in the BOF discussion, what happens to them ? [14:13] ogra: I guess we list them all as work items and the spec owner is in charge of proding the other people to make progress on them [14:13] quite late for that imho [14:13] ogra, the way we discussed at UDS, and what happened in reality went in two very separate directions. I need to rewrite the spec to match reality (or change reality to match UDS) [14:14] right, thats clear, what wasnt clear to me were the four action items that even have personal assignments at the bottom of the BOF discussion [14:14] ogra: I hate the fact that this spec got deferred from jaunty and we actually would have benefited from it in a couple of cases already [14:15] yes, indeed [14:15] and i'm happy to research my action item, but it showed never up on my todo list [14:15] ogra: That said during the sprint I sat down with NCommander to document actual work items in the wb [14:16] I'm not sure you have one in that list [14:16] [action] NCommander to redraft softbootloader spec to make it match reality and clear up action item list [14:16] ACTION received: NCommander to redraft softbootloader spec to make it match reality and clear up action item list [14:16] NCommander: Thanks [14:16] lool, because the spec was never updated with the discussion notes from last UDS [14:16] Are there other questions on the status of specs? Everybody done digesting? [14:17] lool, are you going to be around in say an hour to help merge the d-cd code and stuff? [14:17] what's the scoop on mobile-karmic-moblin-remix? [14:17] NCommander: I have meetings all afternoon [14:17] lool, bugger [14:17] NCommander: I accepted the task on monday and will do it sometime this week [14:17] ogra, how about you? [14:17] lool, did you talk to tbm ? [14:17] But I cant be bothered to do it right now [14:17] ogra: No [14:17] lool, right, I understand, I'd just like to nip this in the bud [14:17] NCommander, thats only adding the two new files, right ? [14:18] People might remember me calling them the whole of yesterday too? :) [14:18] fine to merge that if it doesnt touch other code [14:18] ogra, two new files, and then a modification to make-web-indices to add the dove [14:18] Me being davidm's fallback means my number of meetings basically doubled [14:18] wasnt that already there ? [14:18] i'll look at it [14:18] ogra: The idea was of course to review the actual image creation script [14:19] lool, indeed [14:19] ogra, very cool. I am expecting dove squashfs's to build (they almost built yesterday so ...) [14:19] i took a glance on the weekend already [14:19] build is in progress [14:19] NCommander: You actually pasted a meeting URL from Aug 11th at the beginning of the meeting instead of today's [14:19] I need to poke the kernel team though on the dove .config; I think initramfs support fell off [14:19] [link] https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MobileTeam/Meeting/2009/20090825 is the proper one [14:19] LINK received: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MobileTeam/Meeting/2009/20090825 is the proper one [14:19] lool, >.<; [14:20] lool, sorry, I'm suffering from a massive migrane at the moment and the world kinda fuzzy [14:20] I'm removing the crap in the wiki page too [14:20] NCommander: Hmm why is there no entry to review roadmap stuff? [14:21] [link] https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MobileTeam/Roadmap [14:21] LINK received: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MobileTeam/Roadmap [14:21] I dumped a couple of things on this page, it looks ugly -- I know [14:21] lool, I thought we stopped using that [14:21] What I'd like us to do is to periodically check we didn't miss any desktop seeds updates [14:21] or aren't missing any UNR upstream release [14:21] I have been [14:21] I also do that [14:22] StevenK: Ok, so status is that we're all up-to-date and can close this topic? [14:22] lool: When my u-n-r-d-s gets uploaded, yes [14:22] StevenK: (I added these entries due to critics on missing desktop features in UNR; I expect it will disappear once we move this to the integration meeting) [14:22] StevenK: Ok, so just pending an u-n-r-d-s upload; thanks [14:22] Has gwibber been added to the seed yet? How about removing xscreensaver-gl? [14:23] Yes, but it won't appear [14:23] GrueMaster: We're waiting for a new gwibber, 2.0, so that we can promote the new one to main [14:23] gwibber is in universe [14:23] ah [14:23] ETA? [14:23] StevenK: I'm fearing this might not make it before FF :-/ [14:23] GrueMaster: It's in the hands of Ken van Dine [14:24] well, thats what we have an exception process for [14:24] I'd like us to take a glance at high importance bugs [14:24] Starting with UNR [14:24] [link] https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/karmic/+bugs?field.subscriber=ubuntu-unr [14:24] LINK received: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/karmic/+bugs?field.subscriber=ubuntu-unr [14:24] StevenK: 417001 is the one you're about to upload, right? [14:24] lool: Right [14:25] lool: I wasn't going to close it until FUSA is sorted out [14:25] StevenK: Isn't LP #410655 fixed with new clutk? [14:25] Launchpad bug 410655 in netbook-launcher "netbook-launcher crashed with SIGSEGV in IA__g_type_check_instance_is_a()" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/410655 [14:25] new FUSA landed today btw [14:25] StevenK: Ok fair enough [14:25] "indicator-session" [14:25] lool: Not sure, it looks like a different stacktrace [14:25] StevenK: Ok; can you make sure you track this with njpatel before A5? [14:26] Right [14:26] armel bugs next I guess [14:26] [link] https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/karmic/+bugs?field.subscriber=ubuntu-armel [14:26] LINK received: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/karmic/+bugs?field.subscriber=ubuntu-armel [14:26] ogra: How goes with 417009? [14:26] oo.o [14:26] i didnt contact mterry yet ... we only discussed it last night [14:26] Ok [14:26] will do so after them meeting assuming he is up now [14:27] lool: StevenK: I'm working on that...it's a bit strange [14:27] ogra: tomboy? 391124 === imlad|away is now known as imlad [14:27] njpatel: Ah, nice [14:27] njpatel: Thanks for the update; can you assign yourself to the bug? [14:27] will do [14:27] well, seems like its deeper down in the mono stack and i'd really like to know what dyfet found [14:27] since he said he dug deep into mono and found issues during his banshee research [14:28] ogra: It looks like dyfet isnt around though (probably sick); if you have spare cycles to chase this it might be clever to start on it [14:28] 391588 I'll skip since it's both non-critical and assignde to dyget [14:28] *dyfet [14:28] well, someone from the mono team asked for another debug output today [14:28] i added that [14:28] 383240 is mine; I suck, it's been assigned to me for weeks but I didn't find a large enough slot to just do it [14:29] 385325 is blocked on clarifying the plan with asac [14:29] there is a plan for karmic ? [14:29] I'm surprised Bug #418265 didn't show up on the list. [14:29] Launchpad bug 418265 in linux "Warning in ehci-hcd.c:911 on kernel 2.6.31-5-imx51" [Medium,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/418265 [14:29] i thought we'd just update to new upstream [14:29] 2.6.31-5-imx51" [14:29] ? [14:29] thats totally not buggable [14:30] GrueMaster: Is ubuntu-armel subscribed to the bug? [14:30] close it as invalid and wait for a proper kernel [14:30] yes [14:30] GrueMaster: If the team isn't, thqat [14:30] * StevenK sighs at this keyboard [14:30] GrueMaster: Only karmic targetted bugs show up there [14:30] ah [14:30] well, but please ignore imx51 kernels that dont have a 100 in the ABI [14:31] This was on Friday's image. [14:31] GrueMaster: source package is linux-fsl-imx51, not linux [14:31] everything before that is missing about 130 patches [14:31] targeted at karmic now [14:31] lool, not for 2.6.31-5-imx51 ... [14:31] Sure enough it shows up on the list now [14:31] there linux is right [14:31] GrueMaster: Can you please retest with latest kernel from linux-fsl-imx51? [14:31] Should have a >100 ABI [14:32] marked as invalid [14:32] If it is in the latest image, sure. [14:32] GrueMaster: It is [14:32] there are *no fsl patches at all* in 2.6.31-5-imx51 only one that enables the basics [14:32] ogra: I'd rather call it incomplete [14:32] anyway [14:32] no [14:33] doesn't matter, needs retesting and can be reopened [14:33] right [14:33] Next week is A5 [14:33] [link] https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+milestone/karmic-alpha-5 [14:33] LINK received: https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+milestone/karmic-alpha-5 [14:33] Specs targetted there are the toolchain one (will change just after A5) [14:34] Support for Ubuntu Desktop on Freescale SoCs ; should be ok [14:34] Support for Ubuntu Desktop on Marvell SoCs ; pending a debian-cd merge and I'd expect final fixes [14:34] NCommander: Do we have instructions in testing the marvell images? [14:35] lool, our kernel lacks initramfs support ATM (found that out last night), so even when we get images, they are unbootable out of the box [14:35] NCommander: Which bug is that? [14:35] lool, I'm filing one now, since I just confirmed that was the issue about 10 minutes ago [14:35] NCommander: This is critical to A5; please file + milestone + ping rtg + amitk + bjf [14:36] NCommander: Action on you to document testing instructions? [14:36] Since we dont have a custom uboot on the boards [14:36] GrueMaster: Determine if any default applications should be changed in UNR [14:36] GrueMaster: It looks like it's not going to make A5 given the number of open actions [14:36] [action] Document livecd bringup for the dove boards [14:36] ACTION received: Document livecd bringup for the dove boards [14:36] [action] NCommander to ocument livecd bringup for the dove boards [14:36] ACTION received: NCommander to ocument livecd bringup for the dove boards [14:36] GrueMaster: The only item there for you is the CD image size work [14:37] GrueMaster: But I think it would be good if you'd personally chase people to implement the actions [14:37] aka nag :) [14:37] Which I'm still waiting on [14:37] I can't really do that until the other two items are done. [14:37] GrueMaster: We all know you're good at nagging us :) [14:38] Ok then. StevenK, NAG - get on removing the xscreensaver-gl and other items on your TODO list. [14:38] rss-glx too [14:38] StevenK: You have action to drop xscreensaver stuff from the seed and to add gwibber to maximus blacklist; do you think you could do that this week? [14:38] Is there any reason not to seed gwibber before 2.0? [14:38] thats way bigger iirc [14:38] It is seeded! [14:38] GrueMaster: Yes, that requires main promotion of stuff which we're not going to need [14:39] so useless work :-/ [14:39] It's in the seed list, but germinate won't check universe [14:39] So there's no point asking me twice to seed it [14:39] Well ok, it's in the seed text but not in the task [14:39] What we need is promoting it to main when 2.0 comes out [14:39] StevenK: Do we want a new action to do that in the work items? [14:40] Yeah [14:40] I'd like a pointer to the spec, too [14:40] StevenK: added [14:40] https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/linux-mvl-dove/+bug/418618 [14:40] Launchpad bug 418618 in linux-mvl-dove "dove kernel lacks support for initramfs" [Critical,New] [14:40] StevenK: https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/mobile-unr-karmic-applications [14:40] Since the size reduction work won't involve desktop application removal, but mostly back-end stuff, it can wait until gwibber 2.0 is on board. [14:41] [link] https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/mobile-unr-karmic-applications even [14:41] LINK received: https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/mobile-unr-karmic-applications even [14:41] GrueMaster: I dont understand why it should wait? [14:41] GrueMaster: we want to start getting the ISO size down before we add more stuff to it IMO [14:41] It's already too large and we plan adding gwibber [14:42] That calls for making room now for the oversize + gwibber's size [14:42] So that I know what my goal for size reduction is. Otherwise I may need to do that work twice. [14:42] Size reduction may be ongoing [14:42] It certainly is for the desktop [14:42] GrueMaster: You want to get below 700 MB to start with and preferably way more; all space saved allows for more langpacks [14:42] ok [14:42] So don't count on only doing it once, things change [14:43] GrueMaster: If you dont know where to start, slangasek has been taking care of ISO size of the desktop [14:43] and others [14:43] ok [14:43] GrueMaster: So it might have good advice on where to start looking [14:43] s/it/he [14:44] I figure I'd start by diffing the manifests. [14:44] heh [14:44] calling slangasek an "it" is rude :P [14:44] Ok any other things to discuss on A5 tasks? [14:44] blueprints or bugs [14:44] ogra: Yes; typoi :-( [14:44] indeed [14:45] I guess we're done [14:45] NCommander: Any other topic for today? [14:45] [topic] Any other business [14:45] New Topic: Any other business [14:45] going once [14:45] twice [14:45] three times [14:45] I'd like to ask for feedback [14:45] Are people okay with the meeting changes? [14:46] As experienced today [14:46] My internal jury is still out [14:46] and i'd like everyone who finds some spare time to regularyx look at http://qa.ubuntuwire.com/ftbfs/ [14:46] I personally perfer going around individually and asking status, then have the open discussion [14:46] Well, we're done quicker. [14:46] GrueMaster, not really [14:46] ogra: We could review this if there was an associated timestamp with the FTBFSes [14:46] well, we didn't go over, and we're not close to it [14:46] there is still a lot armel stuff that can be fixed ... [14:47] ogra: Currently the list doesn't show the recent versus old ones [14:47] lool, well, its always the latest upload [14:47] only pointing to the FTBFS logs [14:47] ogra, it doesn't show packages that FTBFS in jaunty that haven't had a karmic upload [14:47] ogra: No, I mean we want to look at the recent FTBFS, not all of them, during weekly meetings [14:48] NCommander: I think it was quicker to do things the way we did and carries the same information [14:48] well, that would require to intersect -changes with the versions showing up there [14:48] Except people can a) do it before the meeting and b) people can do it async [14:48] lool, *shrug* [14:48] Anyone got anything else? [14:48] I'd like to close the meeting [14:48] * ogra likes the new meeting form btw [14:48] ogra: No; just keeping track of when the FTBFS was added to this page [14:48] though it requires that you prepare indeed [14:49] If there's nothing else [14:49] Going once [14:49] I guess we're done [14:49] And re-run the generation script :-P [14:49] twice [14:49] StevenK, ++ [14:49] StevenK: I switched to @hourly already now [14:49] three times [14:49] StevenK, ++ :-) [14:49] Ok [14:49] everyone have a good $TIME [14:49] #endmeeting [14:49] Meeting finished at 08:49. [14:51] GrueMaster: Just as same as the Juanty Moblin. [14:51] ? === bdrung_ is now known as bdrung [15:02] mdz,Keybuk: TB now? === ivoks_ is now known as ivoks [15:02] cjwatson: if you like ;) [15:02] you're the chair I believe [15:03] cjwatson: hi [15:03] I do hope not, I chaired last time [15:04] we said we'd decide the chair by e-mail and then I think forgot to do so [15:04] by rotation I make it Keybuk's turn [15:04] ok [15:04] #startmeeting [15:04] Meeting started at 09:04. The chair is Keybuk. [15:04] Commands Available: [TOPIC], [IDEA], [ACTION], [AGREED], [LINK], [VOTE] [15:05] [TOPIC] Per-package uploader application: Yulia Novozhilova (MC mail) [15:05] New Topic: Per-package uploader application: Yulia Novozhilova (MC mail) [15:05] [LINK] https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/motu-council/2009-August/002183.html [15:05] LINK received: https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/motu-council/2009-August/002183.html [15:05] any actions to review from last time? [15:05] there were several [15:05] Keybuk: do you have them conveniently available? [15:05] (I do, I think) [15:06] cjwatson: err, I don't think so [15:06] oh, dholbach said t hat Yulia had to leave early, so we should do that first [15:06] oh, ok [15:06] ignore me [15:06] /ignore mdz [15:06] hi, I'm Yulia:) [15:06] (maybe not) [15:06] cjwatson: really? I have to unignore him for these meetings [15:06] juli_: hi! was just trying to find your IRC nickname [15:06] welcome [15:06] I do really have to leave early === bjf-afk is now known as bjf [15:06] the packages involved are: [15:06] # netbeans [15:06] # libnb-platform-java [15:06] # libnb-javaparser-java [15:06] # libnb-svnclientadapter-java [15:07] all of these packages are in universe, and the MOTU Council approves [15:07] juli_: it looks like you've been the defacto maintainer of these packages for a while now [15:07] Keybuk, yes.. i'm working on them more than a year [15:08] in fact, I believe you created a couple of these? [15:08] hmm... no. I updated them. but I created another:) [15:09] juli_: who've you been working with to upload these packages? [15:09] juli_: has anybody else been helping you out with them? [15:09] parsia helped a lot [15:09] (persia?) [15:10] the other sponsored my updates [15:10] Emmet Hikory [15:10] juli_: various people, including you, commented on the small number of people involved in Java packaging, and this has been a problem for some time. How do you think we could improve this? For example, are there ways that the "grunt work" of the packaging could be simplified to make it easier for people to focus on more significant improvements? [15:11] or is it just a fundamental mindset difference, that most of the people who develop in Java don't do so by way of system-provided packages? [15:12] for me the biggest problem was to find sponsors and to read and remember a huge amount of information about packaging and ubuntu processes [15:12] (FWIW I don't see any problem with this application but figured you might have some thoughts on this while you're here; we could take the discussion to a different forum later if you're really rushed) [15:13] so I believe if we have more java-experienced MOTUs everything will be ok with java-team [15:13] mm, it doesn't help when people have to load state about a whole different environment into their heads in order to sponsor [15:14] mdz: any questions ? [15:14] Keybuk: none [15:15] cjwatson: any further questions? [15:15] cjwatson, ok, lets talk later about java-team... another problem is my slow typing, so I believe we'll talk later if you don't mind [15:16] -ETIMEOUT ;) [15:16] [VOTE] Per-package uploader application: Yulia Novozhilova [15:16]