Genre: Forum

( Originally Posted by paddy__power ) Of those mentioned I would go for Royce given that in the OP you say you want answer based on their influence today. Gracie influence is massive in MMA. true , in that gracie demonstrated the usefullness of bjj in competition fighting. but he wasnt a mixed martial artists, he relied entirely on submissions. it was maeda that came up with the system from practice from his own experience of japanese jiujitsu and judo, and taking elements of boxing, wrestling and general no holds barred 'street fighting' and passed it to the gracie family. but then you could argue it was bruce lee that first formally came up with the idea of cross training martial arts in his system of jeet kune do- he also helped the americans get out of the idea of points system fighting and move to full contact ( Originally Posted by Indo-Chinese Food ) true , in that gracie demonstrated the usefullness of bjj in competition fighting. but he wasnt a mixed martial artists, he relied entirely on submissions. it was maeda that came up with the system from practice from his own experience of japanese jiujitsu and judo, and taking elements of boxing, wrestling and general no holds barred 'street fighting' and passed it to the gracie family. but then you could argue it was bruce lee that first formally came up with the idea of cross training martial arts in his system of jeet kune do- he also helped the americans get out of the idea of points system fighting and move to full contact I agree with pretty much all of this except that I think the idea of cross training existed so was popularized by Lee rather than created by him. Not sure why you negged me for mentioning KG. If we are going to have Silva on the list we should definitely have KG on it (assuming you are not a judo hater in which case fair enough I guess). ( Originally Posted by paddy__power ) I agree with pretty much all of this except that I think the idea of cross training existed so was popularized by Lee rather than created by him. Not sure why you negged me for mentioning KG. If we are going to have Silva on the list we should definitely have KG on it (assuming you are not a judo hater in which case fair enough I guess). not created by bruce, in fact there were already records of 'kumite' going on in east asia long before he arrived in the us, as well as prize fights all over the rest of the world. but he did the most to popularise the principle of being multiskilled in various styles as oppossed to be rigidly loyal to only one school, as people were back then and i didnt neg you dude, although i personally dont necessarrily agree that kanos influence was great beyond creating judo- which in essence was jijitsu with much of the more lethal martial combat stuff taken out and simplified. but this thread is open for everyones opinion so ive no problem to hear yours. i put andersen silva becasue he is a multi trained mixed ma, incidently claims bruce lee to be his biggest inspiration in that respect, and that he is effectivly unbeatable amoungst the current crop of mma fighters, even at 37 odd. i could have included fedor too i supposse, but silva is a much more diverse fighter ( Originally Posted by Indo-Chinese Food ) not created by bruce, in fact there were already records of 'kumite' going on in east asia long before he arrived in the us, as well as prize fights all over the rest of the world. but he did the most to popularise the principle of being multiskilled in various styles as oppossed to be rigidly loyal to only one school, as people were back then and i didnt neg you dude, although i personally dont necessarrily agree that kanos influence was great beyond creating judo- which in essence was jijitsu with much of the more lethal martial combat stuff taken out and simplified. but this thread is open for everyones opinion so ive no problem to hear yours. i put andersen silva becasue he is a multi trained mixed ma, incidently claims bruce lee to be his biggest inspiration in that respect, and that he is effectivly unbeatable amoungst the current crop of mma fighters, even at 37 odd. i could have included fedor too i supposse, but silva is a much more diverse fighter I, again, agree with essentially all of this. I love Silva, he is excellent to watch (although my favourite fighter is probably Brian Ebersole or Forest Griffin [maybe Penn if you like MMA) but I just think that in terms of influence KJ deserves to be included for the reasons you acknowledge - judo is used widely and the theory behind it is very different to Ju jutsu. With regards to the neg: I am able to see who negs me and know that you did - it may have been an accident though which is obviously fine ( Originally Posted by paddy__power ) I, again, agree with essentially all of this. I love Silva, he is excellent to watch (although my favourite fighter is probably Brian Ebersole or Forest Griffin [maybe Penn if you like MMA) but I just think that in terms of influence KJ deserves to be included for the reasons you acknowledge - judo is used widely and the theory behind it is very different to Ju jutsu. With regards to the neg: I am able to see who negs me and know that you did - it may have been an accident though which is obviously fine yes on my refresh i can see that now, i was trying to rep the guy abive you but your upgrade of the website few months back just makes my page scrolling lag bigtime - feel free to reset it i think silva demostrates how limited mma talent is currently, he has a black belt in judo also i think, but he has hardly had to use it in the ufc. he describes himself largely as a muay thai fighter, and id say his knees are up to that sort of standard. but obviously his ground grappling is as good as anything in competitve mma, and his striking well above anything in the ufc. i used to like penn, he is a bit of a legend himself in bjj circles, and a decent boxer in his prime. ( Originally Posted by Indo-Chinese Food ) yes on my refresh i can see that now, i was trying to rep the guy abive you but your upgrade of the website few months back just makes my page scrolling lag bigtime - feel free to reset it i think silva demostrates how limited mma talent is currently, he has a black belt in judo also i think, but he has hardly had to use it in the ufc. he describes himself largely as a muay thai fighter, and id say his knees are up to that sort of standard. but obviously his ground grappling is as good as anything in competitve mma, and his striking well above anything in the ufc. i used to like penn, he is a bit of a legend himself in bjj circles, and a decent boxer in his prime. That's cool, I couldn't care less about rep but in this case I thought it might be indicative of your opinion of KJ. Glad to clear it up. I don't know, I think Silva is very impressive - he makes good fighters look pathetic. As for Penn: he was incredible at BJJ, he gained his Black super fast having trained with Ralph Gracie and has taken almost every fight he has been offered worth him bothering with regardless of weight class (he lost narrowly to Lyoto Machida for example). His book is a good read if you're interested ( Originally Posted by paddy__power ) That's cool, I couldn't care less about rep but in this case I thought it might be indicative of your opinion of KJ. Glad to clear it up. I don't know, I think Silva is very impressive - he makes good fighters look pathetic. As for Penn: he was incredible at BJJ, he gained his Black super fast having trained with Ralph Gracie and has taken almost every fight he has been offered worth him bothering with regardless of weight class (he lost narrowly to Lyoto Machida for example). His book is a good read if you're interested i know a great deal about penn, hes something of a legend amoungst bjj practioners, he went from never doing any bjj to becoming the first non-brazillian black belt ever to win a world championship, inside jsut 5 years of training. shame he never really made the impact he should have done, based on his talent. and i think silva is fighting at a time where he is head and shoulders above anyone else ufc can offer. id like to see him in a Thai rules fight against someone decent , to see how good his striking really is, hes made to look superhuman against regualr mma cagefighters,