2017-04-22 NSSAT - The Logos Is Central, not Experience - Dream Exploration: Eldar
Channel: Pierre Grimes and the Noetic Society
Date: 09/03/2018

2017-04-22 NSSAT - The Logos Is Central, not Experience - Dream Exploration: Eldar
(Poor audio for the first 0:02:25) My (inadequate) notes on the discussion/chat this morning: (another episode in the "What Does It Take To Listen?" series..) Initial discussion between Eldar and Pierre about The Matrix Pierre's claim: The problem with our society is that it does not understand the Prometheus myth. Hope destroys Mankind (Pandora): all the Abrahamic religions Charlemagne hoping for reading/writing Belief/denial - Barbara lifts the conversation by reading from a book she brought in: " Plotinus and the Path to Liberation " - PG: The problem is that Man ignores or doesn't believe his every day experience - What answer do you get from asking, "What is seeing, hearing, thinking?" - The whole problem of the game of meditation is that you don't need to meditate. You'll just eventually stop what you're doing - Parmenides and Xenophenes: don't look for the One, but the Self. It assumes you ARE there (already). - Plotinus uses Aristotelian/Platonic terminology, which brings in all sorts of problems but allows you to make the   2nd hypothesis (divine luminosity , brilliant light of being) the ultimate reality - The mandala-like quality of dreams - Tibetans making sand-mandalas.. Following Milarepa. These reflecting the brilliant light of being - The Brilliant light of being, as lovely as it is, is an image, a manifestation. And this is Plotinus' problem. - Recommends Evans-Wentz who lines up the teachers according to a hierarchy. Tilopa the final of the 3: the wisdom teacher. E.W. describes Tilopa's teaching as a gñana yoga, all about the Self ( Secret Doctrines .. chapter 4) - What are you meditating for? It's our every day experience. - Every night we are treated to a multimedia light show, therapeutic - Plato, 9th book of The Republic: the importance of dream studies. but he does not describe/detail how - In the Dark Places of Wisdom , Peter Kingsley - Eldar's dream   - what is necessary to play the game?   - Why don't we write the dream in terms of its /content/? When we're writing, we pull back and write in a     different style, "I went from here to here, then i did this other thing, blah, blah." Why?   - We don't realize that seeing is reflecting. We believe that experience is central. That's bullshit. It's simply     not true.  It's only through a logos that you can recover it (the meaning) or see it. Logos is Central, NOT Experience - Pierre's dream   - first, the "New York Times" dexcription (essentially, false)   - then, "what was it LIKE? what happened to the fear? gone. what took its place?"   - you don't/can't see without reflection   - (to Julie) that also means you have to be willing to be rude.   - better than, "feelings", which is insufficient, "states of mind"   - Pierre to JH: he keeps asking her, "What do you want to know? What do you want to ask?" (rather than just     accept an answer) - next week, show Greg Pallast's documentary, "The Best Democracy Money Can Buy" - Also, Pierre proposes for a later NSFRI (after we review the list of his propositions) that we sit around in a semi-circle, talking about what is meaningful to them when reading Proclus' propositions. Text of Eldar's dream: 21st April ‘17  Eldar I've moved back to Germany with my parents and were now living in the apartment we used to live in, together with my dad’s parents. We’re driving home from Hagen. As I sit down next to my mum I get an urge and remember about a talk I heard about how women appreciate small things, so I put my arm around my mum. She’s very receptive and leans into me. She says: "You know, when you were a kid I used to come home sometimes and not even acknowledge you, I would just ignore you. That was bad." I say: ”I don't quite remember, but I'm not saying that didn't happen, it probably did." She says: ”Often when I get home, your grandparents have forgotten to turn off the light, so I make sure to turn it off right away." I say: ”Are you comfortable here now? Are you settled in now that were back in Germany?" My mum skind of stretches and says yes. I say: "It’s pretty interesting, you’re still at a point where you’ve spent more of the time of your life in Europe than in Australia, it’s still less for me. " I pause and then I say: ”For me... I’m..." l was about to say that I don’t like it here and that I wanna go back to Australia, but I decide not to ruin the family moment and take it in a different direction, so I say: "Yeah, I like it here." She says: "we’re settled in, but we could do something to get even more settled in." I say: "Hey why don’t we cook something, some meat that we used to cook in the apartment and that will make us feel even more at home." My mum agrees. I say: ”Yeah, let's stop at a store on the way and I’ll buy us some meat!" addressing my dad who is driving. She says: "Yeah, there is that supermarket on the left!” I say to my dad: "Yeah, do you know that supermarket inside the shopping