2018-04-21 NSSAT - Proclus - Commentary on Plato's Parmenides (Book05, Sec's 982,987) - Proclus' 4-
Channel: Pierre Grimes and the Noetic Society
Date: 2018-04-30

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 2018-04-21 NSSAT - Proclus - Commentary on Plato's Parmenides (Book05, Sec's 982,987) - Proclus' 4-part Dialectic, Plato's Hippias, and the Zen Ox-herding Pictures

{ 20180421NSSAT }

 Dialogue(s): commentary-on-platos-parmenides;greater-hippias;three-pillars-of-zen Chapters: book05 Sections: 982,987SynopsisAnother great Saturday dialoguing informally with Pierre.Pierre suggests that Proclus' 4-part dialectic is either unclear in itself, or that Proclus is discussing something else. At the very least, the four words he uses (as they are translated in Morrow/Dillon: 'Definition', 'Demonstration', 'Division', and 'Analysis') do not correspond to the way we use these words in modern English.Proclus' 4-part dialectic is discussed in Book 5 of Morrow/Dillon (see References, below). (Today we specifically focus on pages 982 and 987, but the whole section begins at the beginning of Book 5.)Pierre suggests that since the 'Ideas' being discussed (i.e., what academia incorrectly calls the 'forms' or 'ideas' in modern parlance) are really 'states of mind', that we instead use the four ox-herding pictures (from Kapleau's book) to understand Proclus' dialectic.The Greater Hippias (which we read for the last two NSFRI's, April 13th and 20th) is also discussed in the light of a potential student's (or even just co-dialoguer's) for being able to (later) study dialectic.Pierre also makes reference to an unpublished 4-page manuscript he had written (and had handed out to the group in the past), The Ox-herding pictures for Philosophical Midwifery.ReferencesGlenn R. Morrow and John M. Dillon, Proclus' Commentary on Plato's Parmenides, Paperback ISBN-13: 978-0691020891, ISBN-10: 0691020892; Hard cover 0691073058. Princeton University Press.  Plato's dialogue, Greater Hippias, transl. H.N. Fowler, in Plato: Cratylus. Parmenides. Greater Hippias. Lesser Hippias. (Loeb Classical Library No. 167) ISBN-10 0-674-99185-0. Harvard University Press.  The "ten ox-herding pictures" are displayed in the back of: Roshi Philip Kapleau, The Three Pillars of Zen: Teaching, Practice, and Enlightenment. ISBN-10: 0385147864, ISBN-13: 978-0385147866. Anchor Books.More infoNoetic Society Home PageAbout Pierre and Philosophical MidwiferyThe Pierre Grimes and the Noetic Society collection here on archive.org.