The Connecticut courant, and the weekly intelligencer — Hartford [Conn.], 1782-10-08 00:00:00, page 1

Frora the New-York ROYAL GAZETTE, Sept. 10, 1782.
HOUSEof COMMONS, Tuesday, July 9.
YESTERDAY in consequence of the expedition formed,
that Mr. Fox would explain tbe cause of hisrt fignation,
the greatest crowd perhaps ever remembered, flacked down
at the house by twelve o'clock, and before one, not only
the lobby but every avenue leading to i; was compleatly
filmed up. When the speaker came it was with extreme
difficulty that way could be made for him, and as soon as
he had entered the house rhe strangers in the lobby forced
open the door, and the gallery was filled in aninttant. Af
ter this, the strangers out of the house were so numerous,
that they reached down into Westminster hall, and many
hundreds continued about the lobby, until the house broke
up.
The members came down very faft towards three o'clock,
and as soon as the speaker had taken the chair, there were
at least four hundred in the house. Amongtt the strangers
were the Dukes of Devonshire, Rutland and Richmond, the
Earl ChoJmondly, Lord Viscount Townshend, Lord Scar
borough, Lord Wentworth, Lord Gage, and a great many
persons of rank and fashion.
The pressure upon the door being opened, was so exceed
ingly great, that many persons were much hurt, some even
trampled under feet, and others so fatigued in getting in,
as to faint away afterthey were seated.
[Here follows a debate on Colonel Barre's pehfion.]
GENERAL CONWAY, having expressed his opinio.,up
on this matter, thought it incumbent in him to touch
upon another affair of more importance, and which refped-j
ed the resignation of a certain right honorable gentlemanl
lately high in office, the loss of whose services he, in com-|
mon with the public, deeply lamented. He thought this a 1
.matter of the highest consequence to the public, and that ;
they ought to be informed of every particular refpe&irg it.
For his part he did not care how much the world were ac
quainted with it. He would bq as explicit as the nature of
the business would admit of. As to the reason of his con
tinuing. in office, it was entirely in consequence of the fame
fyUem of measures being continued as that when he and
the honorable secretary (Mr. Fox) went into office was laid
down. He knew of no difference. He did not know that
it had been departed from in thelmalleft instance, or that
it was meant to be done. If that should be the case or ap
pear to bein view, he pledged himfelf to the house, that he ,
would not only resign, but from that very moment oppofc:
the Minister to the utmost of his power. At present, now-;
ever, as he saw no departure from the system that was laid
down, or any intention to depart from it, he did not think;
he ougbeto quit the office he held, or delete the ministers ;
he had aded with. #
The honorable gentleman said, it was nothing new for ;
him to give an opinion 01 the American war. lie had of- ;
ten spoken of it vety fully, and he believed that gentleman
even to this day were quite undetermined upon it.' For
<hispirthe had always considered the panting indepen
dence to America, as an evil that was forcing itfclf upon
this county. At hrft he conferred he had been muchag rinit
Jr, but various circumstances had occasioned him co alter
his mind, and he was now convinced, that the granting the
'independence of America, was the only means of bringing
about a peace with that country, and he undeiftood tn;trie
'prefect ministry were fur granting the indtpendfnee of it.
If they were not, he was greatly mistaken ; he did not pic
tend to the shining faculties and fplended talents of the
right honorable gentleman (Mr. Fox) but ne d:dlay claim
to a common u mer Standing, and if he did know ary thi^g
at all, he certainly knew, that he was promoting, by his
continuing in office, the independency of America. This,
he thought ought to go abroad as soon and as fully as pof
fibli, for he th rught it very material indeed, that the pe< ;de
of Americashould know, that the piefent ministry had the
beib intentions towards them.•
The honorable gentleman thought the debate that had
or^en upon the reGgnation of the right honorable gentle
rain (Mr. Fox) of rich vaSt consequence, and of so ferrous
a nature, that too much open,cfs could not be tiled on the
occ, fion. He would therefore Rate to the house, the arti
cles which th : prefentminidry Cuofcribed to, upon coming
into office, which Mere five; and not one of which he could
venture co fay, had in the lead degree been departed from.
'The. live articles were :,
Ift. Th &the independency of America should be
made the basis of all negociation for a peace.
2d. - That the independence of the thirteen States of
North Americ, should be acknowledged in the
mode .of accomplishing or bringing about a peace
with them.
fl. That a reform isnecedhry in theexpenAfu eof
public money, and all ufelifs and uauecefuq 61
ices.
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4th. That the mifeondua of East-India delinquents
should be enquired into.
jth. That though the p erogative of the crown
should at all time's be properly supported, a reform
of the representation of the people is necessary, in
order to make it the more agreeable to the coniti
tlition.
These, the right honorable gentleman said, were the ar
ticles which the miniUry agreed to, and which, in his opi
nion, they would abide by. He therefore could not fee a
ny occasion for breaking up the administration. For his
Eart, there were little niceties h ' did not look at, nor was
e ever influenced by the third of power, and squabble af
ro titles and places, which ochers appeared so fond of. He
aded from principle, without regard to any roan, or set of
men; and when the present minister should be found to de
viate from the fy liem laid down, he would no longer con
tinue in administration. But at piefent, he did not know,
that he had in any refped departed from the principles be
held, and consequently that he ought to give up the Situa
tion be held,
With regard to the division in the cabinet, which the right
honorable gentleman (Mr. Fox) had aligned as a principal
cause for leaving the administration, he did not think it at
all surprising that eleven men, of which the cabinet is form
ed, should Sometimes differ in opinion,; but with regard to
the independence of America ? he thought that they had al
wayshad one mind abcuoit; and he did not, he declared to
Ged,know that they had any waysdeparted from it. When
he could with any reason fufpeDit, he would renounce the
prefect minister, and henceforth attack him to the utmost
of his power-.„
Mr. Fox rofeagain, and began by observing, that during
the long time he had fat in that house, he never rose with
such a preifure on his mindfror in a Situation so truly im
portant to him. He had however, two things that would
uphold him ; the one was, chat whathe had done hid met
the Saclsfa&ion of his own mind; and the other was, that
there were those who were plea,cd to think he had done
right, and concured with him+n the opinion he had of the
prefentminiltcr. This he Said, was but a Secondary relief,
but itwas a very great one.
The honorable gentleman said, the right honorable gen
tleman had read a paper over as the attielcs es agreement
between the ministers, that he never saw, or ever before
heard of. He was very sure that when he was in office, no
such article was agreed to as the independence of America,
he merit the unconditional independence of America ; and
if themiriitry had adopted i: Since he left them, he was ve
ry glad that his being out or office had induced them to do
what rhiy would never do while in office. The honorable
gentleman and he, hefaid, had Sometimes been together in
opinion, and many times in opposition ; but however much
they might leave differed in opinion, he had never before
ditfered'ia point of fad. He had, indeed, Stated to the
house, chatthere were niceties which he could not fee. The
right honorable gentleman, he was very sure, had too much
magnanimity of mind, too much generality of difpoficion,
and coo much co,mplaifance about him, to lee little niceties
that a minister might wish he should turn his eyes from.
Sue what could he fay of those niciticj ? He would tell the
honorable gentleman, that whathe termed niceties were in
faft what he law, as leading immediately to the deftiu&ion
of tris country. The honorable gentleman mig^t possess a
fie underftanJing, but whatever his ideas might be, he
would tell him, that they were all nothing,unless they went
into rhe minutiae of things. It was the minutiae of every
thing chat conHituted its worth and excellence.
He had been charged by the honorable.gentleman, with
having betrayed a thirst after power, but in what manner
had that appeared ? He had determined to resign, not be
crufe be con d net grasp as much power as he wished, but
bee rule he ciul 1 not any longer a& with his colleagues.
That this was the case, and net that he had any improper
ambition ; he w mid appeal to the right honorable gentle
man himfelf; for he was hire he would do him the justice
to recoiled and to admit, that the question about the inde
pendency of America, was a stated in the cabinet before
the death ofrhe Masottis of Rmkii^ham, and that he had
a&ially lignified his intentions of resigning before thatvery
u so tunatecvent took place. He again appealed to the
lighuhonorable gentleman, that he had intimated his reso
lution to resign, before the death ofthe, Marquis of Rock
ingham was known, and even on the very day when there
was ggcat reason to hope he wouid live. He therefore
could°not be fufptded of resigning from any disappointed
viewsof being hft Lord of the Treasury. He considered
himfelf as pollening the cor licence of the people, and if he
had continu'd it adiiinillrafion, he should have mod
shamefully abused it, for tbe people of England would have
thought every thing wasgomg right, whereas he knew no
thing was doing but what tended to the dribu&ion of the
country. The people had fert hire into tbe ministry as
their watchman, and he had thought it bis duty to let them
know the danger they were in
He was willing to allow the ight honorable gentleman
every praise that was his due, and he was ccrraii.ly quel to
any man for the purity of his intention ; but at ten time he
laid this, if any one should ask him who, of all the men
that ever lived, had dpne this court, most trilchicf, he
would fay the honorable gentleman, lie then went into a
history of his political life, which he treated with an equal
degree of ridicule and contempt. In 1766, he came in
with the noble Marquis, whose loss had been so much 'la
mented, and when that admirriltaticn he formed was Tap
planted by the adminiftr^tion, that brought this country to
the brink of diftru&ion, the honorable gentleman joined it,
and continued with it till he saw that they were no longer
to be supported. In the fame manner the honorable gen
tleman came into administration with the late Marquis on
the 27th of Match lari, and has since joined the very men
that have fuperceded his ministry, and who mean to pursue
a system of measures they had unfortunately opposed. He
doubted not but that the right honorable gentleman's stay
with those men would be of a vety short duration, and that:
he would, before long, be glad to make his retreat from
them. He should hot, therefore, be angry with him and
his friends, that were erecting a rortrefs, i.i which ic might:
take shelter when he should find himfelf, as he trusted he
would before long, obliged to fly from thole men he was
aiding with and Supporting, in the fame way he did the ad
minittration that before supplanted the noble Marquis's ad
ministration.
The honorable gentleman said, he bad always consider
ed himfelf a person that house could fend into administra
tion as one in whom they could confide ; and while be con
tinued in it, it would be very natural for them to confider
every thing right. As he could fiat be of that opinion, and
as his being in office would mislead the public, lie had no
other way in which to shew himfelf an honest man, but to
resign. Nay, had any one individual ele&or of the city, he
had the honor to represent, m ked his opinion of the mini
stry, he could not have given such a one of them, as would
have justified his continuing in office. He declared upon
his honor, that he had no private motion for bis conduct.
He always had, and always would aft upon public grounds.
Had he not given proof of his public Spirit? Was it nothing
to girt up a fplended Situation ? A molt lucrative office ;
and extensive patronage ? To fay that he had no ambition,
or that it was a matter of indifference to him, whether he
was poor or rich, would be highly ridiculous, and what he
would not :ffea. He had his ambition as well as other
men, and alto his desires of wralth ; but thele be had relin
quished to the more pleating impulle of an honelt mind.
The emoluments ofhis office had been rather convenient to
one who had not a large fortune to boast of, and his Situa
tion was highly acceptable to him, because it enabled him,
to oblige thole he loved and refpedai, and who had Served
him molt disinterestedly. The honorable gentleman again
returned to General Conway, and amongst a variety of ob
servations of the most cutting nature, said, that if he had a
thousand ideas, he would facri fice them again and again,
to the being will with those for whom he conceived a par
tiality.
The honorable gentleman drew a comparison between
the late noble Marquis, and the present Silt Lord of the
Treasury, and was of opinion, that it would by no me^ns
tell to the disadvantage of the former. He reprobated and
derided the idea of the present minister continuing in pow
er, and doubted not but that the rime would shortly come,
when those who did not fee as be did, would behold the fol
ly and wickedness ofthe prefertjftem. He knew that eve
ry influence would be tried, and he knew that influence was
great ; but be knew they had not the confidence of the peo
ple, arid that they would never be able to pad thcmfrlves
upon the public as the ministry Lord Rockingham formed,
but would be properly, known, as being of the very fare
complexion as the old ministry § whose mifcondud had un
done us.
He took notice of the honorable gentleman's assertion,"
that the King was at liberty to appoint his own minister;
and did not mean to dispute the right, but he had at the
fame time a right to resign ; that right he had exercifed,'
not fram any perfonalfconfideration, but because he had the
confidence of the house when he went into administrations
and was therefore bound in honor not to Stay any longer in
it than while he could approve of its measures. He replied
to the pbfeivation, that it was not extraordinary, that when
the cabinet confined of eleven men, there should be a dif
ference ofopinion. This be said would happen with an,
body of men ; but what he meant by a divided cabinet was,
that it was wellknown thatthe members of it would vote
differently from each other before they came to bufigefs.
The honorable gentleman concluded by observing, that
Nu. 924.