The Pennsylvania packet, or, The general advertiser — Lancaster, Pa.;Philadelphia, Pa., 1782-09-14 00:00:00, page 2

W'PRH^^) , , ,
The following may be a matter of curiohty to many
of your readers, and the public in general, which
contains a catechism relative to the English nation
al debt. , *
„ n SUPPOSING this debit to be only t9s*
Quefticm id. millions of pounds sterling at present,
altho'it is much more, and that it was all to be count
ed in Killings, that a man could count at the rate ot
ico (hillings per minute for 12 hours each day, till e
had counted the whole, how long would he take in 0
' Ans. One hundred forty-eight yeats, one hundred
nine days, and twenty-two hours.,
Q. 2d. The whole of this sum being 3900 millions
of Killings, and the coinage flandard being [l%™°
(hillings in the troy pound, what is the whole weight
''&'’ Sixty-one millions, (even hundred fifty-two
thoufanl, four hundred and feveimt, fix, t.r% pounds.
Q. 3d. How many (hips would carry this weignt,
suppose 100 ton in each ?
A. Three hundred and fourteen mips.
Q 4th. How many carts would carry this weig it,
suppose a ton in each? , ~ fio^
A. Thirty-one thousand, four hundred and fidy-
The breadth of a (hilling being one inch,
if all these Killings were laid in a strait line, c°e°
one another's edges, how long would the line be that
would contain them?
A. 61552 miles, which is 9572 miles more than
twice round the whole circumference of the earth.
O. 6th. Suppose the interest of this debt to be 3
end an half per cent, per annum, what does the whole
annual interest amount t 0?..,„
A. Six millions, seven hundred and seventy thou
"q P ;h° d How doth government taife this interest
"'&''% taxing those who lent the principal and o-
Q. Bth. When will government be able to pay the
''A. 'When there is more money in England's treasu
ry, than there is in all Europe.
Q 9th. And when will that be.
A. Never.
* At present it is said to be at least 230 millions.
From the New-York Royal Gazette.
HOUSE of COMMONS, July 9,
MR. Fox, in the course of his speech, declared
that his motives for resignation were, a diffe
rence refpefting the means of peace with America;
the earl of Shelburne having determined to make in
dependence the price of peace, but himfelfhaving
maintained that American independence, in all its ex
tent must be firft declared, and that then overtures
towards peace might be made. He could not call this
contrariety of opinion by such gentle name as a (hade
of difference, for he verily believed, that on the deter
mination of this one point depended peace or war, de
pended therefore the ruin or salvation of these empires.
That on this question, a council had met on Wednes
day fennight, wherein he had found his voice [re
garded - that on the Sunday following (being the day
preceding lord Rockingham's death), he had again cal
led together his majesty's confidential servants at his
own house, where, finding the fame question, after
renewed dispute, again carried against him, he had for
mally declared his fixed intention to resign, but that be
ing persuaded not to disturb Lord Rockingham s mind,
by so instant a step, he had waited until his lordship s
decease • and the noble earl's succession to the vacant
place, had rendered it perfedly clear to him, that
those measures which alone he could advise, and for
which alone he would bear responsibility, were be
come far less likely to be pursued.—He had differences
also refpeding the East-India company, and said, that
after the example of losing a western world, it behoved
miniftersto fee to it that they lose not an eastern world
also. Mr. Fox also hinted that there was an intenti
on in the earl of Shelburne to restore to the crowd the
exercise of its negative; he feared least the long disuse
of this part of its prerogative, might render such inno
vation alarming to the people. “ What (said he)
when parliament is at last brought to speak the pure
language of the people, to have one foul with them,
one desire with them, oh ! now it would become neces
sary for the crown to bring its negative into exercife.''
General Conway said that he could not yet fee so
great difference in that right honourable gentleman's
sentiments, as to warrant him in the breaking up of the
cabinet; their principles still appeared to him to be
the fame, though in the prosecution of the fame prin
ciples, among eleven people, there would be, for he
must be allowed to call them so, a shade of difference.
The honourable gentleman had done him the honour to
ascribe his continuance in office to that weakness of
understanding which he laboured under; no doubt,
therefore, it was owing to his weakness in that part,
that he could not really fee what great difference it
made, whether you give the Americans independence,
by throwing it at their heads, (which was all the right
honourable gentleman had wished to do) or whether
you bring it in as a condition of peace ; that for his
own part he had little doubt of procuring peace with
them ; and, peace procured, the end of each would be
Mnfwered. As for what theright honourable gentleman,
through his wonderful sagacity, might forfee in the in
tentions of the earl of Shelburne, he would only fay
that he could not think, at so awful a crisis as the pre
sent, when unanimity was so essential to our negocia
tions, and to all our measures; an apprehension that
the firft lord of the treasury may, five years hence,
intend measures not altogether corresponding with the
right honourable gentleman's individual sentiments,
was a fufficient reason why the right honourable gentle
man should, at this time, withdraw his abilities and
support from his majesty's councils.
Mr. Burke, being interrupted in the outset of his
speech, by some members crouding towards the door,
said, with some agitation, that his deep refped for the
Mr. Burke then adverted to that part of general
Conway's speech, in which he had ascribed the feceffi
on of the party to their wonderfully nice understanding;
for his part, he pretended not to any nicety of under
standing, he had been used to read plain books; and he
remembered to have read even in his infancy, of the
Little Red Riding Hood, when the wolf came peeping
through the fence, and said, he was grand mamma—
"But what great eyes you have." "Othat is that I may
eat the better." Well, said Mr. Burke, we know Little
Red Riding Hood was eaten up, and yet we are want
ing to try again, whether the wolf will make us as good
a grand mamma. Mr. Burke concluded with apolo
gies for the warmth he had (hewn in the beginning of
his speech.
The honourable William Pitt said, he could not think
the retreat of the right honourable gentleman (Mr. Fox)
warrantable, at a crisis like the present; that his lingu
lar abilities marked him to be public property, that
whatsoever he heard that night, went only to cpnvince
him that the struggle had been a ftruggk for power,
and that the quarrel had been a quarrel with men and
not with measures. An honourable gentleman (Mr.
Burke) in one part of his Speech, had talked of Cata
line and Cato, as if the earl of Shelburne, 'and the right
honourable gentleman (Mr. Burke) were an apt pa
rallel : the honourable gentleman had said, “ would Cato
fuffer Cataline to become a consul ?" He should ask
him in return, " Bet would Cato have taken Cataline
for his colleague ?" He had therefore to learn yet, why,
having once embarked with the earl of Shelburne in the
fame vessel, that noble earl pursuing still the fame
course, the right honourable gentleman should carry
competition so far as to forfake the (hip in this hour of
its extremity. The loss of the late marquis was great
indeed ; it was enough to have loft him ; he con'd not
therefore 1 ut deplore that a calamity in itfelf acknow
ledged fufficiently great,fhould draw after it consequen
ces so unfortupate.Mr. Pitt, in the course of his speech
hinted, that his majesty had offered him a place in the
new administration, which he hoped he had not impati
ently aspired after.
Mr. Fox, Mr. Burke and Mr. Conway, having been
often up to ex plain.
Mr. Lee, solicitor - general, said he rose to declare,
that he was among those men who could not give their
confidence to the new firft lord of the treasury, and
that he had therefore given notice of his resignation.
A right honourable gentleman had said, it was men
and not measures that were obnoxious. He begged to
know what it was that made measures but men ; it was
like talking of effeds without causes; and be infilled,
that whosoever aded in subordination to any admini
ftration,ought well to confider whether its leaders were
men of whom he had had such experience as inspired
a confidence in them ; hecharged the earl of Shelburne
with having changed his sentiments in the refped of
granting independence to America; declared that his
verfality alone was enough to condemn him as a mini
fler ; and after making a handsome eulogium on the
character of the marquis of Rockingham, added, that
having praised the dead, he should be glad to praise the
living also, if people would but give him the fame
materials.
Mr. Pitt rose to reply ; at half past ten the motion
for adjournment was carried.
General Conway towards the close of his speech, so
far forgot himfelf, that in the course of mentioning the
duke of Grafton, he said, “ it is known I owe much to
him; I owe to him my feat in parliament ; it is one of
the duke's boroughs that I -" The house calling him
to order, the general recollected himfelf and said, that
by speaking so long, and by running into so familiar
a way of conversation, he had indeed exceedingly for
got himfelf; no man would be more glad to fee an a
mendment in some of those boroughs than himfelf, or
more willing to forward it; but the notoriety of these
things without doors was such, that he hoped he
should be forgiven for having departed a little from ftri&
order: the house smiled and he pursued his speech.
HOUSE of COMMONS,
July 2. On the report being brought up of the bill
for compelling persons who hold patent places in the
Weft Indies or America to reside on the (pat, and to
perform the duty pertaining to their offices.
Sir George Saville rose; he said, from the principles
which he had ever held relative to America, it would
ill become him now to fit silent when a bill was in agi
greater part of that house, and his ineffable Contempt
of those, who, at an hour like thfa when the fate of
Britain hung suspended, and when - here the
members taking their places, Mr. Burke proceeded :
He declared, that he had no confidence in the new
administration, that they were a thousand times worse
than the last with all their fins on their head. He
confeffed he had had some parting pangs on quitting
his place, that he loved busy life, that he loved, of
all things, that place with which his majefly, in great
goodness, had vouchfafed to honour him; he loved
the view from his window into the Park; he loved to fee
soldiers exercised, and he believed every man that
knew him, would fay, that he was fond of business.
He pretended not to great things, he had been (pend
ing all his life in railing a little ant-hill, but it was
all kicked down, and he had now such another ant-hill
to begin again: that from his nature he would have
never chose the cold climes of oppofition,but he had ever
been forced into it ;' it was a melancholy thought- but
that h e now believed he was doomed to spend his
whole life in opposition. He solemnly protefled, that
a total want of confidence in the new firft lord of the
treasury was his motive of giving up a very defireable
place. After passing great eulqgiums on every part of
the character of the late marquis ; he said, he thought
the proper fucceff^r to such a man would have been
whosoever was mod like to him ; that the duke of Port
land was a man remarkable for uniting, in himfelf, all
those talents of the head and heart, which had diflin
guithed that most noble marquis: but it was singular
that the facceffor of the late noble marquis was in every
single refpe& totally unlike him. The noble earl might
have his virtues—but they were so different, that
he could not find in him the least trace of his departed
friend.
tation, which, though not openly, yet in its consequence
exercised legislation over that country. This he was a
fraid would cause jealousies in America, and if they were
inclined to enter into a treaty of peace, it might inter
pole many difficulties in the way ofit. He declared he
was more suspicious of the bill, knowing the quarter from
whence he underflood it originated. No man in the
kingdom entertained a higher opinion of the noble lord
Shelburne who firft introduced the bill, than he did;
for he believed there did not exist a more refpedable
character, one possessed of greater honour or integrity ;
but notwithstanding he admired the many good quali
ties he possessed, yet as a politician, there were many
doHrines he maintained which he could never fubferib©
to, particularly when he expressed his enmity to the
independence of America ; and it was therefore natu
ral for him to disapprove of a bill which seemed to of
fer terms to America, to induce them to submit to the
authority of this country. If he was miflaken in his
interpretation of the bill, and that it was only intended
for the purposes which the preamble of it set forth, that
of obliging persons having patent places to perform the
duties of their office, in that case, as we had now be
longing to us so (mail a share of America, there could
be, in his mind, no objection to leaving out that part
of the bill which refpeaec lAmerica, especially as we
would, by doing so, remove any suspicious which might
arise in the breads of the Americans from passing in
its present form; he would therefore move, that the
word, “ America, and" be omitted.
The attorney general said, he was amazed how a
bill, so simple in itfelf, and f© very expressive of the
objed, for which it was brought ' in, could be so mifcoa
ftrued, and meanings tortured out of it, which he was
persuaded, never entered into the head of the noble
lord, from whom it took its rife. There was no one
who did not wish to perplex and confound the bufinefa,
that could not at once fee the whole purport of the bill•
it was nothing more but ah obligation on those persons
I who received emoluments, to perform the duties of
those offices, from whence they derived these benefits.
This was so fair a proposition, as no hones lman could
with hold his effent from ; and therefore he was asto
nished how gentlemen could endeavour to persuade the
house, or themselves, that this was an aft of legislation
of this country over America. But even granting
it was, where is the bad consequence of it? Where is
the mifehief, that can arise from it? Are there not vo
lumes of ads concerning America now existing? And
could this bill, more than all other laws now in force,
prevent a treaty of peace being set on foot between
both countries? Undoubtedly it could not. The Ame
ricans, from the very firft, did not pay such great de
ference or refpeH to our a&s, as to prevent themselves
from entering into any measures, which they might
deem advantageous. He said he could fee no possible
good which could arise from a difeuffion of this nature•
on the contrary, he conceived it might prove very
prejudicial to the nation. There were many persons,
he believed, who from not knowing, as well as he did,
the good intentions of the honourable gentlemen who
opposed the bill, would be apt to fay, that they were
influenced by a desire of sowing jealousies between this
country and America, in hopes of preventing, or at least
retarding any accommodation, which was likely to take
place.
Mr. secretary Fox intreated the honourable gentle
man who made the motion, to withdraw it, as he be
lieved, if he persevered in it, and that the house came
to a division on the fubjed, it might have that tenden
cy, which he so much dreaded would be the confequene
of this bill, that of raising jealousies in America. The
honourable gentleman, nor no man, could suppose he
would give his assent to any bill, which might be the
means of Amer ca acknowledging any fubjeßion to
this country whatever ; for he now in the most solemn
manner, declared for himfelf, and for the rest of those
ministers who had similar sentiments with himfelf on the
fubje&, when in opposition, " that they would not
continue a single moment in office, if independence
was refufed to America." It was on that idea
they took a (hare in his majesty's councils ; and if
any contrary doßrine should prevail in the cabinet, he
pledged himfelf to his country, that he and his associ
ates would retire. In admitting the independence of Ame
rica, he meant, he said, it should be done in the most
unconditional and unequivocal manner. Thus much
he thought it necessary he should fay, to cpnvince the
honourable gentleman, that he believed there was no in
tention by this bi 1, of prevailing on the Americans to
their allegiance, at least he had no such intention, for
he assured the house, in a most positive manner, he
should never give his consent to any attempt, either to
coerce America by force, or even negociat'ion, to de
part from its declaration of independence. He trusted
therefore the honourable gentleman would give credit
to what he had said, and would be so kind as to com
ply with his request of withdrawing the motion.
Sir George Saville said, so much confidence had he
in the right honourable gentleman's declarations, that
he had no longer any obje&ion to withdraw his motion.
Mr. David Hartley, general Conway, and Mr. Stan
hope, spoke a few words.
The bill was then read a third time and passed.
The following Memorial was drawn by a few of the
neighbours of the deceased, to preserve is their fa-,
milies the Memory of the worthy Man.
ON the twiftti of the tenth month, 1780, died
THOMAS THOMAS, of Richland, Bucks
county, in the 62d year of his age. A man,
who through the course of his life was eminently diflin
guifhed by bis great integrity and examplary piety.
In him were amiably joined the principal virtues that
adorn the chriflian; a true evangelical charity crown
ing the whole. In him the poor, the widow and the
fatherless, had ever a sincere fympathyfing friend and
liberal benefactor; to these his memory will remain
peculiarly dear and venerable. He was many years
an honorable e^der, and overseer of Richland monthly
meeting; faithfully labouring and cheerfully (pending
himfelf in the difeharge of tlie duties of those import
ant flations ; religiously applying himfelf with un
wearied diligence to cultivate peace, brotherly love
and righteousness, through many painful exercises and