 EN

Astrodienst Forum Archive
Astrodienst Forum › English Language Area › Discussion: Psychological and General Shopping Cart

 My Astro

24.01.2023 at 21:30 [UT]« Previous topic | Next topic

Astrology»

Pages: 1
Chiron - A Little Rock or a Big Problem? (Read 1727 times)

MissteryMemberChiron - A Little Rock or a Big Problem?
« on: 22.07.2008 at 21:17 [UT+1] »Hi Everybody
There seems to be some interest in how Chiron works and affects people both natally and in transit
Some people seem to be affected superficially while others (myself included) are affected to the point of trauma
Posts: 535
Gender:When I had my chiron return I had a major breakdown which had apparently been brewing for years
Anybody out there like to talk about how their chiron works for them?
Go on be brave - you never know, you might get some useful tips on how to deal with this little asteroid oreven better help somebody else to deal with theirs and utilise the healing side of chiron

Back to top
IP Logged
XellosEx Member

Re: Chiron - A Little Rock or a Big Problem?
« Reply #1 - on: 22.07.2008 at 21:23 [UT+1] »I honestly think Chiron is overrated, I might be malicious but in my humble opinion psychological astrologers
are very fond of it cause it allows them to have more customers. If only astrology was more focused on
potentials rather then wounds and negative issues....but I guess it is very human to have some self pity. I thinkalso that some astrologers made to quick assumptions about N
Back to top

IP Logged

MissteryMember

Re: Chiron - A Little Rock or a Big Problem?
« Reply #2 - on: 22.07.2008 at 21:39 [UT+1] »Hi Xellos
From your post it would seem that you are one of those that I mentioned who are affected (so far) only
superficially (lucky you)

Posts: 535
Gender:I make no claim to be an expert but having spoken to a few people that have had heavy duty dealings with thisasteroid I don't think it fair to say that it's overrated.
I agree that focussing on potentials is the most positive way to approach astrology, but often in life you needto deal with the causes of your 'wounds' before you can learn how to cope with life in a more balanced
constructive way

Back to top
IP Logged
XellosEx Member

Re: Chiron - A Little Rock or a Big Problem?
« Reply #3 - on: 22.07.2008 at 21:55 [UT+1] »Quote from Jently on 22.07.2008 at 21:39 [UT+1]:
Hi Xellos
From your post it would seem that you are one of those that I mentioned who are affected (so far) only superficially (lucky you)

actually N is strongly placed in my chart and when it has been triggered by transits I had quite few bad eventsoccurring.
to me N issues are of a philosophical kind, in my perspective chiron is where our dream of reality collapse andwe are confronted with the dark side of what we call reality: society keeps sticking with these perfect models of
how things should be and sometimes in life things just fall a part because of our assumptions that things willturn in the way we want to be, if only we would accept our lacks and limits, but of course it might be my NnO
speaking. Of all the issues linked to N I have heard from most of them are things that are obvious andinevitable, but I guess the more Fiery temperament will find difficult to deal with this sense of limitation.
we will all be castrated by something but isn't this closeness to death that make us more attached to life? tosurrender is to die, this is for me the true meaning of the myth: some astrologers are idolizing self pity andthey have decided not to struggle with their own limits without even realizing that they are imposing
themselves limits which could be overstepped if they just had more will-power and faith in their own resources.
I keep seeing people working out their chart so brilliantly and then they have no knowledge of astrology
Back to top

IP LoggedDoh-Ray-Me
Ex Member

Re: Chiron - A Little Rock or a Big Problem?
« Reply #4 - on: 23.07.2008 at 09:44 [UT+1] »When I mentioned Chiron to someone into science who isn't into astrology I got a scornful response about thelikelihood of it having any impact. A lot of people would probably like to explore the idea of wounds andhealing when they look into astrology. I can't help feeling that if Chiron ruled something else less angsty it
might not get so much attention. The same goes for Lilith. The name Lilith is bound to attract attenion. If it
was called Anthea Turner, would people as drawn to it astrologically?
I'm a beginner-dabbler, so ignorance is bliss in terms of what's influencing me & when. Or is it knowledge ispower? I'm not sure....maybe....but then again?.... Ag
My chiron is in Pisces, my DC.
Back to top
IP Logged
Liebe

Member

Re: Chiron - A Little Rock or a Big Problem?
« Reply #5 - on: 23.07.2008 at 10:20 [UT+1] »Hi everyone,
For me N is kind of mystery,so i'm a little bit confused.
I have NmbASC (12th), and i am a bA
My NrC(12th h a)

NpG(5th h f) that's all i have
I've read that N in 12th house means that the native can be hurt
Posts: 388
Gender:and that can wound easily

What do you

think?

Back to top

IP Logged

anA..
Member

Re: Chiron - A Little Rock or a Big Problem?
« Reply #6 - on: 23.07.2008 at 12:14 [UT+1] »Quote from Lonaria on 23.07.2008 at 10:20 [UT+1]:
Hi everyone,
For meis kind of mystery,so i'm a little bit confused.

N
NmbASC (12th), and i am a bA
NrC(12th h a)

I haveMy

Posts: 326

NpG(5th h f) that's all i have
I've read that N in 12th house means that the native can be hurt and that can wound easily

What do you think?

Well.. I have NmAmBd(12th)
NdmeAScI am easily hurt. But luckily my optimism (Fe 1st) pulls me out of any difficult situation. I always findsomething worth that pushes me ahead. And thanx god I'm not d asc. That would be really.
Back to top
IP Logged
sirius1

Ex Member

Re: Chiron - A Little Rock or a Big Problem?
« Reply #7 - on: 23.07.2008 at 13:08 [UT+1] »I have noticed N more through transits especially those involving Pluto m o n, so I would not class it asuseless space debris, in my experience it shows clearly wounding in a persons chart but also their possibilities
for healing. My N is in l m B, My mother was deeply wounded abused abusive and with a mental illness. I in
turn was abused as a child by her N B n J O. her relationship to her own mother was reflected in myrelationship with her, a vicious circle cycle really one I had to bring closure to. At the same time my motheralways said she did not know what she would do without me N B p asc I. very double
I have a particulareffect on people that they open up easily about deeply held emotional issues. I don't own the gift it flows
through me, A psychic sensitivity which was difficult to deal with in my early life but years of experience insightand understanding I see it now as a great gift.
I have also seen N prominent in the charts of well known artists whose talents are a healing source for thecollective.
The N return 50 year cycle is important, at that point we can consciously start to use our N to help others if
we so choose for we have then come full circle.
Back to top

IP Logged

MissteryMember

Re: Chiron - A Little Rock or a Big Problem?
« Reply #8 - on: 23.07.2008 at 15:50 [UT+1] »Quote from sirius1 on 23.07.2008 at 13:08 [UT+1]:

N

mon

I have noticed
more through transits especially those involving Pluto, so I would not class it as useless space debris, in myexperience it shows clearly wounding in a persons chart but also their possibilities for healing. My
is in, My mother was deeply
wounded abused abusive and with a mental illness. I in turn was abused as a child by herNlmB
N B n J O. her relationship to her own

mother was reflected in my relationship with her, a vicious circle cycle really one I had to bring closure to. At the same time my mother

Posts: 535
Gender:always said she did not know what she would do without me

N B p asc I. very double

I have a particular effect on people that they

open up easily about deeply held emotional issues. I don't own the gift it flows through me, A psychic sensitivity which was difficult todeal with in my early life but years of experience insight and understanding I see it now as a great gift.
I have also seenThe

N prominent in the charts of well known artists whose talents are a healing source for the collective.

N return 50 year cycle is important, at that point we can consciously start to use our N to help others if we so choose for we havethen come full circle.

Hi Sirius,
For the chiron sceptics your post is a nice illustration of just how this little rock turns into a BIG PROBLEM for
some.
Interesting to note that your N is attached to the B which obviously makes it more evident.
Also interesting that you recognised the genetic nature of the problem and decided to end the cycle.
Does this mean that you have had some kind of therapy to 'heal' the problem or maybe you decided not tohave any sprogs thus finalising the matter
I too have BN (and A lucky old me), and also find that people find it easy to talk to me about emotional
stuff which they 'have never told anybody before'. Mine is mI so the l link is there too
I have often been told that I should become a counsellor. Wondering whether this is a common aspect for
professional 'listeners'
Back to top
IP Logged
MissteryMember

Re: Chiron - A Little Rock or a Big Problem?
« Reply #9 - on: 23.07.2008 at 16:07 [UT+1] »Quote from Xellos on 22.07.2008 at 21:55 [UT+1]:
Quote from Jently on 22.07.2008 at 21:39 [UT+1]:
Hi Xellos
From your post it would seem that you are one of those that I mentioned who are affected (so far) only superficially(lucky you

Posts: 535
Gender:)N is strongly placed in my chart and when it has been triggered by transits I had quite few bad events occurring.
N issues are of a philosophical kind, in my perspective chiron is where our dream of reality collapse and we are confronted with theactually
to medark side of what we call reality: society keeps sticking with these perfect models of how things should be and sometimes in life things
just fall a part because of our assumptions that things will turn in the way we want to be, if only we would accept our lacks and limits, butof course it might be my

NnO speaking. Of all the issues linked to N I have heard from most of them are things that are obvious andinevitable, but I guess the more Fiery temperament will find difficult to deal with this sense of limitation.
we will all be castrated by something but isn't this closeness to death that make us more attached to life? to surrender is to die, this is forme the true meaning of the myth: some astrologers are idolizing self pity and they have decided not to struggle with their own limits
without even realizing that they are imposing themselves limits which could be overstepped if they just had more will-power and faith intheir own resources. I keep seeing people working out their chart so brilliantly and then they have no knowledge of astrology

Hi Xellos
philosophical ...... hmmmm
I don't think you could call the sort of wounding which is a result of abuse or neglect philosophicalI have known several people with personal planets attached to N who had the most appalling childhoods andas a result have had a huge struggle with life
People from all walks of life, not only astrologers, wallow in self pity; it is after all another facet of the humanconditiion.
I think Sirius made an important point about the N return. It is only after N has been round the whole chartand back to where he started that people often get to grips with the meaning for themselves and then life
becomes different, often through pain and struggle
strange how often this coincides with a chiron transit

and yes, pain and struggle are inevitable in life, but

Back to top

IP Logged

Misstery

Re: Chiron - A Little Rock or a Big Problem?

Member« Reply #10 - on: 23.07.2008 at 16:14 [UT+1] »Is there anybody out there who has had difficult times with chiron and come out the other side with changed(for the better) perspectives and or lives?

Posts: 535
Gender:I would really like to know if there is a positive side to this one
My partner certainly has, but I will talk about that later when I have a bit more time -( if anybody's interested!
)

Back to top
IP Logged

Misstery

Re: Chiron - A Little Rock or a Big Problem?

Member« Reply #11 - on: 23.07.2008 at 16:18 [UT+1] »Quote from Doh-Ray-Me on 23.07.2008 at 09:44 [UT+1]:
When I mentioned Chiron to someone into science who isn't into astrology I got a scornful response about the likelihood of it having any
impact. A lot of people would probably like to explore the idea of wounds and healing when they look into astrology. I can't help feelingthat if Chiron ruled something else less angsty it might not get so much attention. The same goes for Lilith. The name Lilith is bound to
attract attenion. If it was called Anthea Turner, would people as drawn to it astrologically?

Posts: 535
Gender:I'm a beginner-dabbler, so ignorance is bliss in terms of what's influencing me & when. Or is it knowledge is power? I'm notsure....maybe....but then again?....

Ag

My chiron is in Pisces, my DC.

Hi Doh-Ray-Me
Is your chiron in the 6th or 7th?
If it's the 7th do you project your chiron or wounding onto others i.e. do you attract people to you who are'wounded'
Back to top

IP Logged

MissteryMember

Re: Chiron - A Little Rock or a Big Problem?
« Reply #12 - on: 23.07.2008 at 16:59 [UT+1] »Hi Helen.

Posts: 535
Gender:Just stopped laughing at your post. You write so amusingly
Not disrespecting your N return at all, but, as you put it, it did seem more of an inconvenient, unhappy
disruption than a huge heartbreak
I am definitely wondering whether this is because (as far as I know) your N is not in aspect to personal planets
There seems to be a 2 way split regarding this one doesn't there.
Some taking the little #x?%* more seriously than others. Maybe it's because some are more directly affectedby natal aspects to personal planets
Not really that different to all the other astrological aspects then is it, but for some reason people tend to dis
chiron when other planets/asteroids are given strong acknowledgement for their impact on our lives.
It's relatively early days since she was discovered and maybe when she has been around a little longer andbecome more absorbed into our consciousness it will be easier for more people to get to grips with her

Back to top
IP Logged
Rachael

Re: Chiron - A Little Rock or a Big Problem?

Member« Reply #13 - on: 23.07.2008 at 17:43 [UT+1] »I have N in my 12 at 24 j and it is n a F/O m in d in my 6th.
I just came out of my N return a couple of yrs back. Well my husb passed, along with my father the next yr,
and my mother 6 mo after that! I am still trying to get through things such as me vs others, as I have beenvery other-oriented most of my life, and now I have been left to my lonesome. I think the msg of the N
Posts: 2330
Gender:return for me has been to begin to learn to think of and for myself, rather than others.
Btw it is not to say that people close will pass on a N return, that's just how it ended up playing out for me.
And now N is in k and has recently crossed my Asc at 10 k, so I guess it is further pointing out these things
to me.

Back to top

IP Logged

aquadiver
Ex Member

Re: Chiron - A Little Rock or a Big Problem?
« Reply #14 - on: 23.07.2008 at 18:08 [UT+1] »Hi Jently...thanks for the topic
and Rachael...our stories are very similiar
I am having a N return, combined with a solar/lunar eclipse in August. The last eclipse like the one coming
brought major death in my life, 2 six mths apart and 2 more after that . I also have a natal NnJ, NnO...with
Oe in 2H
The common denominator for me is a DmO in 2H...I see in in the 1999 chart and 2008 one...so I am unerved
to say the least. I also have a JmN natally but the real beans this time is my EnJ 12 H transit right now
I will check in from the looney bin to post my findings...
Oh and, Helen...you crack me up
Back to top
IP Logged
Rachael

Re: Chiron - A Little Rock or a Big Problem?

Member« Reply #15 - on: 23.07.2008 at 18:34 [UT+1] »Ya, Helen and Aquadiver, it's like wth so who do I cook for now? rotf
I guess I must be coming along a little by now, 3 and 4 yrs later, to be able to see the humor in these things.
What I have had to learn is that the answer to that question is that I have to cook for myself!!! Dumb andcrazy as that may sound..but that one question and answer sums up for me my own return..
Posts: 2330
Gender:Back to top

IP Logged

Misstery

Re: Chiron - A Little Rock or a Big Problem?

Member« Reply #16 - on: 23.07.2008 at 21:48 [UT+1] »Hi Rachael and AquadiverWell all I can say is thank #%/* I have had my chiron return

Posts: 535
Gender:. It was pretty (?) devastating.

As Helen said, the guys coming along have sure got some heavy stuff to deal with if our experiences areanything to go by
When I had mine 3/4 years ago my dad died (as a result of which I had a major breakdown) my marriage brokeup, I lost my kids, home, everything except the clothes in my wardrobe.
The good news about chiron?
I'm still waiting to find out

Back to top
IP Logged
Rachael

Re: Chiron - A Little Rock or a Big Problem?

Member« Reply #17 - on: 25.07.2008 at 02:55 [UT+1] »I....I....don't quite know what to think...surely all N returns cannot mean someone important will pass!!!! But
it seems like for a few of us here on this thread, that is what has happened.
Helen, what do you say? Though...hmm...you seem to have had a passing of a different sort, a lifestyle, andPosts: 2330
Gender:then it got resurrected.
Jently said: ".....but often in life you need to deal with the causes of your 'wounds' before you can learn how tocope with life in a more balanced constructive way."
I totally agree with that. And when it is placed in the 12th house, it goes into that never-never land of hazethat one has to work through to GET to the power of someone's natal N. Ugh! Too much work it seems. You
say yours is mI, so I am figuring that would be sorta like a 12th house thing, as well. You ask if there issomeone who has gotten to the other side of N....I sure hope to! Cuz this way is not very productive for me,
and I really need to be moving ON with myself! Lol - well at least we all seem to see the humor in this thingcalled life, and that is surely a step in the right direction.

Back to top

IP Logged

Waybread
Member

Re: Chiron - A Little Rock or a Big Problem?
« Reply #18 - on: 25.07.2008 at 03:24 [UT+1] »I used to ignore Chiron completely. Then when Chiron conjuncted my Mercury in Aquarius, I broke my ankle
while hiking. Chiron rules wounds, Aquarius rules the ankles, and Mercury rules walking. Coincidence????
Two+ months later when Chiron conjuncted my Venus in Aquarius [I have CmD] I had a breast biopsy that,
well, to put it delicately, kind of ran amok. No cancer, thank God, but let's just say that the surgery didn't go
as smoothly as planned, and I will always bear the evidence to prove it. Venus is a co-ruler of the breasts.
I consequently think the effects of Chiron are real, and that we do have to feel the "wounding", not just have itin some metaphorical sense.
Posts: 14740
Gender:I am still waiting for the wisdom and compassion out of those two mishaps that a successful Chiron transit is
supposed to enable. I would love to hear from anyone who got that part right!

Back to top
IP Logged
katewise

Member

Re: Chiron - A Little Rock or a Big Problem?
« Reply #19 - on: 25.07.2008 at 12:02 [UT+1] »Anyone noticed the glyph for chiron looks like a key? N
So what is it a key to?
I'm a beginner but this strikes me as interesting - any thoughts?
Kate
Posts: 243
Gender:Back to top

IP LoggedRachael

Re: Chiron - A Little Rock or a Big Problem?

Member« Reply #20 - on: 25.07.2008 at 15:14 [UT+1] »That's right. Katewise, a key!
I can recall when Chiron first began to be implemented into interpretations. (Read many books on astrology
during the 80's.)

Posts: 2330
Gender:Though I am not 100% sure, (perhaps 90%), I think it was said that the glyph is supposed to represent a
simple circle, with a key on top to unlock the truth found when someone finds the inner problem/pain andheals. It is said of circles that they are complete, like encompassing the whole.....
When a planet (for lack of a better word here) is discovered, the astrological meaning often is decided becauseof what is happening in history at the time - Chiron was discovered in Nov of '77, which is the decade of the
beginnings of self-help, you see. And most of the 'experts' decided that Virgo would be the sign ruled, becauseof being known for health.

Back to top
IP Logged
Pearls

Re: Chiron - A Little Rock or a Big Problem?

Member« Reply #21 - on: 25.07.2008 at 15:30 [UT+1] »I have a good friend that has chiron conjunct mars, oppose uranus. I know he has some issues with his male
identity and has lived as a gay man (HIV poz) for the past 15 years. He seems to have a temper/anger issues(with men) and I was thinking that Chiron has something to do with this. Any thoughts on chiron and mars
conjunction?
Posts: 1152
Back to top

IP Logged

Misstery

Re: Chiron - A Little Rock or a Big Problem?

Member« Reply #22 - on: 25.07.2008 at 17:32 [UT+1] »Quote from Rachael on 25.07.2008 at 02:55 [UT+1]:
I....I....don't quite know what to think...surely all

N returns cannot mean someone important will pass!!!! But it seems like for a few ofus here on this thread, that is what has happened.
Helen, what do you say? Though...hmm...you seem to have had a passing of a different sort, a lifestyle, and then it got resurrected.

Posts: 535
Gender:Jently said: ".....but often in life you need to deal with the causes of your 'wounds' before you can learn how to cope with life in a morebalanced constructive way."
I totally agree with that. And when it is placed in the 12th house, it goes into that never-never land of haze that one has to work throughto GET to the power of someone's natal

N. Ugh! Too much work it seems. You say yours is mI, so I am figuring that would be sorta like
N....I sure hope to! Cuz this way is not very

a 12th house thing, as well. You ask if there is someone who has gotten to the other side of

productive for me, and I really need to be moving ON with myself! Lol - well at least we all seem to see the humor in this thing called
life, and that is surely a step in the right direction.

Hi Rachael,
Yep of course you're rightNot everybody living through their chiron return loses somebody, but, as I said in as earlier reply how difficult
the return is seems to depend on whether N is in close aspect to personal planets - particularly A and B
My sister for example sailed through hers with only a few problems at work and hers is in 6th house aspected
only to outer planets
Rachael can you say whether N has had an effect on you throughout your life or did you only experience it on
the return
JentlyBack to top
IP Logged
RachaelMember

Re: Chiron - A Little Rock or a Big Problem?
« Reply #23 - on: 25.07.2008 at 17:49 [UT+1] »Hmm, well when I first began to get into astrology, N was like brand new. And when I saw where it was placed
in my chart (the 12th), and in what sign (j), I thought oh-oh yep, it's calling me to go deep and heal. Ugh,lol. I must confess, I put some things on the 'back burner' more often than not, other things and people rightPosts: 2330
Gender:in front of me that needed attention through my married life. Little did I know that I'd have such a hugechange in store for me when 50 arrived, omg.
I mean, I thought I was grown up and had matured already! LOLOLOL
But noooo, not quite, it would seem.

Back to top

IP LoggedBlue Hills

Re: Chiron - A Little Rock or a Big Problem?

Ex Member« Reply #24 - on: 25.07.2008 at 19:58 [UT+1] »Quote from Jently on 22.07.2008 at 21:17 [UT+1]:
Hi Everybody
There seems to be some interest in how Chiron works and affects people both natally and in transit
Some people seem to be affected superficially while others (myself included) are affected to the point of trauma

Astrologers say that Chiron is the "bridge" between Saturn and Uranus, but to me, it is the bridge between
Saturn (material reality) and ALL the outer planets, Uranus, Neptune and Pluto (or the "Plutoids" as they are
now called). In spiritual/mystical astrology, these outer planets have been termed Divine Mind, Divine Love andDivine Will.
How can we understand these "divine" concepts unless we go to school to learn about them? We can't just readup about them and think that we know them, we have to be tested, just like in school. That is why, I think,
Chiron is known as the "wounded healer", because in this process of testing (by our "Higher Self"), we make a
lot of mistakes, and have to go back and try again.
These mistakes are our "wounds", and probably why you experienced the "point of trauma". Me too - Chiron isa sensitivie point on my chart where I was once very wounded, and that still holds a scar in my psyche. But thewounding was only a part of my growth process, to teach me the principles of wholeness. You don't have to bewounded again, you just have the memory, but no pain.
In that sense I think Chiron is very much tied in with initiation into a holistic understanding of life, likeastrology.
Back to top
IP Logged
RachaelMember

Re: Chiron - A Little Rock or a Big Problem?
« Reply #25 - on: 25.07.2008 at 20:51 [UT+1] »Hermit, in which houses is his N m E and which house is O opposing from?

Posts: 2330
Gender:Back to top

IP Logged

MissteryMember

Re: Chiron - A Little Rock or a Big Problem?
« Reply #26 - on: 25.07.2008 at 21:07 [UT+1] »Quote from Hermit on 25.07.2008 at 15:30 [UT+1]:
I have a good friend that has chiron conjunct mars, oppose uranus. I know he has some issues with his male identity and has lived as agay man (HIV poz) for the past 15 years. He seems to have a temper/anger issues (with men) and I was thinking that Chiron has
something to do with this. Any thoughts on chiron and mars conjunction?

Posts: 535
Gender:

Hi Hermit
This must be a very hard one for a man to deal with.
I have learned quite a bit about anger issues recently through my partner.
It seems that the anger is actually a shield which hides a deep insecurity around ability (or lack of it) to assert
themselves and their needs.
With NmE I would guess that at some point his ability to do this was wounded and he developed this cloak ofanger.
There are very good anger management courses available which really work, but only if the client wants themto. That angry cloak is there for a reason and without it many are too afraid of their vulnerability, which yourfriend, I would think, is possibly not aware of.
This might be triggered of course by a transit at some point to the conjunction, and for your friend's sake I
hope that happens, as the relief which comes from addressing these issues is huge

Back to top
IP Logged
MissteryMember

Re: Chiron - A Little Rock or a Big Problem?
« Reply #27 - on: 25.07.2008 at 21:24 [UT+1] »Hi Blue Hills
Beautiful post - Thank you
I just pray that one day I will get to that point where the pain is just a memory/scar and I feel whole.
Posts: 535
Gender:A part of me (higher self?) knows that what you wrote is the truth and that one day all this angst will prove tohave been for a reason
Just hope it's sooner rather than later, this #?*> sucks

Back to top

IP Logged

XellosEx Member

Re: Chiron - A Little Rock or a Big Problem?
« Reply #28 - on: 25.07.2008 at 22:47 [UT+1] »Quote:
author=Jently link=1216757848/0#10 date=1216825629]

N is strongly placed in my chart and when it has been triggered by transits I had quite few bad events occurring.
N issues are of a philosophical kind, in my perspective chiron is where our dream of reality collapse and we are confronted with theactually
to medark side of what we call reality: society keeps sticking with these perfect models of how things should be and sometimes in life things
just fall a part because of our assumptions that things will turn in the way we want to be, if only we would accept our lacks and limits, but

NnO

Nof course it might be myspeaking. Of all the issues linked toI have heard from most of them are things that are obvious andinevitable, but I guess the more Fiery temperament will find difficult to deal with this sense of limitation.
we will all be castrated by something but isn't this closeness to death that make us more attached to life? to surrender is to die, this is forme the true meaning of the myth: some astrologers are idolizing self pity and they have decided not to struggle with their own limits
without even realizing that they are imposing themselves limits which could be overstepped if they just had more will-power and faith intheir own resources. I keep seeing people working out their chart so brilliantly and then they have no knowledge of astrology
Hi Xellos
philosophical ...... hmmmm
I don't think you could call the sort of wounding which is a result of abuse or neglect philosophicalI have known several people with personal planets attached to

N who had the most appalling childhoods and as a result have had a huge

struggle with life
People from all walks of life, not only astrologers, wallow in self pity; it is after all another facet of the human conditiion.
I think Sirius made an important point about the

N return. It is only after N has been round the whole chart and back to where hestarted that people often get to grips with the meaning for themselves and then life becomes different, often through pain and struggle
and yes, pain and struggle are inevitable in life, but strange how often this coincides with a chiron transit

it is typical of chiron placements to identify just with the physical wounding omitting completely the sense oflarger purpose and the wisdom which F brings. from an higher perspective everything looks smaller, thedetails disappear and you can start having the intuition of the synchronous events the larger purpose which theego is not aligned to the higher self. unfortunately to most of us it is impossible to perceive the death ofchiron from the perspective of the exchange of his half divine nature with the freedom of prometeus and the
expansion of human awareness which this god brings. Wisdom has a price and a death of some kind isnecessary if you want to welcome change
Back to top
IP Logged
unwoman

Re: Chiron - A Little Rock or a Big Problem?

Ex Member« Reply #29 - on: 26.07.2008 at 03:35 [UT+1] »Hi Jently
I understand Chiron as symbolising the wound that does NOT heal - the various Greek stories say Chiron
suffered an unhealable wound that he carried to his death. So the pain is always there in some way. But the flipside is understanding, and that is what makes wounded people better healers - they understand the pain ofothers because they have experienced it themselves. Like cures like.
I think Melanie Reinhard's book on Chiron is spot on. She quotes someone with Chiron in the first house(where I have it) as saying 'Where there ought to be a sense of ME, there is an enormous hole and a pain
beyond my ability to endure it'. I really identify with this (though I can endure it) and see it as something I can
attempt to heal but that will not go away (My Chiron is strongly aspected too - part of a grand cross with
Uranus, Moon and Mercury). I have recently experienced a few hits of my Chiron return, with the last one still
to come. It has been a hard period for me, but not devastating, yet. While I hope and pray a death is not
involved it is not beyond the realm of possibility.
Elsewhere Melanie Klein writes: "Ironically, [Chiron's] ability to help others was increased by his continual search
for relief from his own unhealable wound ... Chiron describes the repeating patterns which never seem toresolve, although one continually tries to 'make it better' and to search for healing and change".
I don't think astrology benefits by Chiron because of people's self pity. To me it is another symbol that fleshes
out a realistic understanding of life - thank God its name and other planets are not prosaic, but instead invoke
stories and myths that give us some insight into life.
Yours
Un
Back to top

IP Logged

Pearls

Re: Chiron - A Little Rock or a Big Problem?

Member« Reply #30 - on: 26.07.2008 at 03:59 [UT+1] »Quote from Rachael on 25.07.2008 at 20:51 [UT+1]:
Hermit, in which houses is his

Posts: 1152

Back to top

N m E and which house is O opposing from?

It's in his 11 & 5th. My saturn conjuncts his chiron exactly. In synastry, how does this bode?
astro_2gw_40_friend_10601_1910.gif (attachment
deleted)IP Logged

Ceto*

Re: Chiron - A Little Rock or a Big Problem?

Member« Reply #31 - on: 26.07.2008 at 08:48 [UT+1] »Also, we tend to forget the end of chirons story, where, in order to end his suffering the gift of immortality istaken away from him, he dies and is put in the heavens. The wound does not heal as an immortal but his
suffering ends as a mortal. I'm sure there is something in there, a key to a better understanding.

Posts: 1458
Back to top

IP Logged

ragdoll
Member

Re: Chiron - A Little Rock or a Big Problem?
« Reply #32 - on: 26.07.2008 at 10:01 [UT+1] »Chiron can be really difficult. When transiting Chiron conjoined my Aquarius Mercury/Leo moon opposition, I
through no fault of my own severely injured by a prescription medication. The main injuries were to my lungs(Mercury), brain and nerve system (Mercury), stomach and gut motility (Mercury+moon) and indirectly it
caused damaged to the ankles (Aquarius) through defect muscle tone that is one of the effects of the brain
Posts: 253
Gender:damage. This was years ago and it still hasn´t healed.
A few years later, I also saw another effect of Chiron. A few years later, it went over my Aquarius midheaven. On
the exact day of the conjunction, I was offered to do something that I would never had dared doing before in
my life and without thinking twice about it, I said yes. It turned out to be one of the best decisions I have evermade. And here is something really interesting: The offer came from a person who was born in a town in acountry where, if I had been born there, I would have had natal Capricorn Chiron on my midheaven.

Back to top
IP Logged

Cranberry

Re: Chiron - A Little Rock or a Big Problem?

Member« Reply #33 - on: 26.07.2008 at 11:41 [UT+1] »Hi Jently,
From my own experience, when Chiron becomes activated coping is often the only choice one has ... nothealing... not even the formation of a protective layer to insulate the "hurt" and "wounding" from further pain
was/is an easy accomplishment. There is a rawness that remains to the wound. Coping skills that allow
survival despite deep pain is what I found I had to accomplish. Initially ... I thought time would heal thelosses... I was wrong. Time has allowed me to accept the losses.... but the pain of the losses remain.
Some of us are more prone to Chironic events... those with several natal aspects to Chiron will find Chiron
activated more frequently by transit and progression and most assuredly by Solar Arc. Some think those who
Posts: 2516
Gender:have Chiron in Virgo are also very susceptible to Chironic live events. Regardless though, everyone will be
exposed to Chiron's "rites of passage".... when transiting Chiron squares, opposes and finally makes its returnto the natal Chiron spot in the chart. Cygnet is correct in pointing out that suffering a wound that does notheal ends at some point for mortals.... but... another classic hallmark of Chiron is... often the suffering we
experience is not of our making. We did not cause the wound nor are we responsible for the circumstancesthat lead to the loss, the pain and the inability to heal. In the myth.... Chiron is wounded by Hercules during adrunken fight ... Chiron himself did not participate in the drinking of the wine ... nor in the fight that brokeout. He was an innocent bystander, faultless, yet wounded, and left without a cure.
In the meantime, a mortal, Prometheus, had long been in trouble with Zeus - in punishment for stealing firefrom the Gods and bringing it to us mortals. Zeus had Prometheus bound up tightly... an Eagle came eachnight and pecked his liver out causing great agony to Prometheus... and each day he healed... only to have torepeat the ordeal endlessly over and over. Myth says he had been bound a 1000 years when Chiron was
wounded.
Zeus... after a time relented and had promised Prometheus he could be freed if 2 conditions were met:

1.)

An immortal would have to give up his life for Prometheus. 2.) A mortal man would have to slay the eagle
who came to eat Prometheus liver every night.
When Chiron realized he would never heal... and had born the pain for as long as he could .... he went to Zeus,
and offered up his immortal life for the life of Prometheus. Hercules, who had accidently wounded his beloved
mentor and teacher Chiron... was the mortal who slayed the Eagle to free Chiron from the pain he had
accidently inflicted upon him. Prometheus... was freed... Chiron was freed.... and Hercules had done all that
could be done to right a wrong that should never have happened. The wine... that caused the drunken fightshould never have been opened... but Hercules had permitted its opening.
The myth speaks to not only wounding, but to unearned wounds... but also to maverick behavior.. renegade
behavior... as in the kind of disregard that Hercules displayed when he ignored the rule to not open the wine.
In both cases, whether unearned wounding or through maverick behavior... consequences ensued that could
not be fully righted, could not be healed ... no matter how hard one tried... but what one could do... was teachothers how to accept the unacceptable.
In my own life... each time there is a Chiron/Saturn activation, the most severe wounds have occured. Eachtime... it was no fault of my own that caused the wounds. My Mother passed away when I was young child.
Transiting Chiron was conjunct my Mid-Heaven, opposite my IC of "home". The IC/MC is the axis of ourparents.. Mother usually represented by MC. Transiting Saturn was conjunct my Moon... again, the symbol ofMother.
My brother passed when transiting Saturn was conjunct my natal Chiron. Transiting Chiron was in my 3rd
house of siblings.
My husband passed ... when transiting Chiron was conjunct my Sun,Venus,Mercury stellium and transiting
Saturn was opposite the whole configuration.
The worst betrayal I have experienced, and never want another ... happened when transiting Chiron came to an
exact opposition of my natal Saturn.... but... I also had transiting Pluto in the same mix.... that cycle... lasted 5
years thanks to retrogrades.
I give Chiron a lot of respect...

Back to top

IP Logged

RachaelMember

Re: Chiron - A Little Rock or a Big Problem?
« Reply #34 - on: 26.07.2008 at 16:52 [UT+1] »Hermit,....so O is opposing its' own house then. And E is strong in its' own sign, of course. And then he has N
right there with E....does he have relatives? I'd say the person was wounded/hurt by other males, which led
Posts: 2330
Gender:him to turn 180 degrees from who/how he was. And that he is quite argumentative with the people in his life,
because he is continuously acting on his rage at being hurt.
You have your G m his N? You'd bring a stabilizing force to his wound perhaps, and he will learn from you.

Back to top
IP LoggedBlue Hills

Re: Chiron - A Little Rock or a Big Problem?

Ex Member« Reply #35 - on: 26.07.2008 at 20:53 [UT+1] »Quote from Cranberry on 26.07.2008 at 11:41 [UT+1]:
I give Chiron a lot of respect...

I sympathizse with your losses Cranberry. I lost my husband during a Chiron activation and have also noticed
difficult experiences when my natal Chiron - Saturn square is being activated. But I would still be wary ofdesignating Chiron events as always being wounding. From observation of my own life and others, I am coming
to the conclusion that Chironic events are tied in with us being "guinea pigs" in the larger evolution of humanconsciousness.
For example, my husband's illness and attempt at healing seemed to mirror a larger "battle" that was going on
in society about Western medicine (chemotherapy) and more holistic methods of healing, including spiritualand mental attitude and emotional health. His battle with cancer seemed to mirror the battle between scienceand spirituality.
Similarly, my own "wounding" over the religion I was born into, which was "no fault of my own", seemed tomirror the larger worldwide battle of religion - I have Chiron in Sagittarius. It was through my wounding (being
rejected, experiencing predjudice) that I was able to get closer to an understanding of consciousness.
I don't believe in a vengeful God or life force which would have us wounded through no fault of our own, so the
only reasonable explanation of this is that we are guinea pigs, sacrificed for the greater good, so that theunderstanding of wholeness can grow for all of us.
So yes, I do give Chiron a lot of respect! I used to shiver at Pluto transits, but compared to Chiron, Pluto isrelatively easy to understand. Chiron is much more complex - it's not only a combination of Uranus, Neptune
and Pluto, but because it comes before those outer planets in the sequence from the Sun, it is as if we are
expected to understand the tests it brings before faced with them.
(edited for terrible spelling)
Back to top

IP Logged

Rachael

Re: Chiron - A Little Rock or a Big Problem?

Member« Reply #36 - on: 26.07.2008 at 21:14 [UT+1] »".... but... another classic hallmark of Chiron is... often the suffering we experience is not of our making. We
did not cause the wound nor are we responsible for the circumstances that lead to the loss, the pain and theinability to heal...........He was an innocent bystander, faultless, yet wounded, and left without a cure."

Posts: 2330
Gender:Whoa! So then we are not the cause of the wound. Yet we are left to cope with it for all of our life? Yet here
we are, trying to heal when we can't be fully healed? Then what do we do? Surely people can't walk aroundwith the baggage their whole life. I need to understand this a little more clearly.

Back to top
IP Logged
Mystique

Re: Chiron - A Little Rock or a Big Problem?

Member« Reply #37 - on: 27.07.2008 at 02:07 [UT+1] »Hello everyone
lets also remember that Chiron was a great teacher and so even though we all have our crosses to bare, look at
yourselves, you have all shared your personal traumas with wise words to go with each experience....there aremany out there I am sure right now who feel less alone in their own suffering because of what you haveshared.....
So I think Chiron definitely symbolizes our deepest wound while simultaneously symbolizes that, despite thehurting we have a special gift to share to help another in the same way
Posts: 92
Gender:Chiron aspects pretty much everything in my chart ....I have like you all, experienced great loss but amazing
healing as well.
Thanks for the thread Jently
Mystique

Back to top

IP Logged

mistycharm
Member

Re: Chiron - A Little Rock or a Big Problem?
« Reply #38 - on: 27.07.2008 at 04:53 [UT+1] »I don't really gravitate towards the wounded interpretation of Chiron, but, there were two times when I've hada physical illness (lungs collasped) and Chiron was a part of the pattern both times. Both times there was atransit involvement of Mars, Saturn, Sun and Chiron acting as a unit as their aspects together were at the most
20 minutes....so, I just see it as......I could include Chiron or it's just a big coincidence he was there.
Mars and Saturn aspecting harshly in transit I've read though is called a death aspect, so, alone it would explain
the potential for illness I think, but, Chiron happened to be in there too. My natal Chiron is retro in the 5th inAries and quincunx (maybe health aspect) my Virgo Mc by 20 minutes and then trine my Asc, but by four
Posts: 1793

degress.

Gender:Back to top
IP Logged
capricornianaries

Member

Re: Chiron - A Little Rock or a Big Problem?
« Reply #39 - on: 27.07.2008 at 06:38 [UT+1] »I agree that Chiron is primarily the wound that does not heal. Until I learned about Chiron, my current transits
didn't completely explain my life. Right now Chiron and Neptune are conjuncting my descendant by transit andPosts: 244

pluto is transiting my venus too. For me ithe transit is about knowing that I"m not going to "get over" acertain person. It's just always going to be there. There really wasn't anything I could have done. But
realizing this with the archetype has been somewhat helpful. At least a helpful way to look at it. Because a lotof other transits can be about lessons and changes we need to make, but Chiron helped me see that there isn't
a whole lot I'm going to "learn" from this one. Besides what it feels like. Wound is a perfect word.
I like the Chiron myth a lot becaus it speaks a lot to the human conditon. It doesn't tie things up neatly,because some things aren't. I'm glad that people have brought up the fact that its often unavoidable, throughno fault of one's own.

Back to top

IP Logged

Pearls

Re: Chiron - A Little Rock or a Big Problem?

Member« Reply #40 - on: 27.07.2008 at 14:21 [UT+1] »Quote from Rachael on 26.07.2008 at 16:52 [UT+1]:
Hermit,....sois opposing its' own house then. AndO

E is strong in its' own sign, of course. And then he has N right there with E....does hehave relatives? I'd say the person was wounded/hurt by other males, which led him to turn 180 degrees from who/how he was. And that
he is quite argumentative with the people in his life, because he is continuously acting on his rage at being hurt.

Posts: 1152

You have yourG m his N? You'd bring a stabilizing force to his wound perhaps, and he will learn from you.

Hi Rachael,Thanks for replying. You're so right on. Yes. He was abused by his stepfather (sexually and physically) for years.
He comes from an extremely rich family - oil rich. Not that it makes a difference but it just goes to show thathaving lots of money doesn't necessarily bring happiness. He was tied up and locked in a closet for hours andbeaten repeatedly by his stepfather. The state of Texas stepped in an tried to have him removed from thehome. I don't think he was but the abuse ebbed a little. Eventually, his stepfather committed suicide. A
footnote here, my friend was adopted as a baby and has never met his birth parents.
And another right on point for you - He is a debate/speech major in college. Argue you say? Yes indeed! He iscurrently writing a book on persasive arguing and public speaking! Interestingly, check out his Leo sun and leo
moon in his third house of communication. He needs an audience, wouldn't you say?
Thanks again for replying!
Back to top
IP Logged
Misstery

Re: Chiron - A Little Rock or a Big Problem?

Member« Reply #41 - on: 27.07.2008 at 17:59 [UT+1] »Hi Everybody

Posts: 535
Gender:It certainly seems that the contacts to personal planets and the angles are involved in some of life's harderwounding/healing issues doesn't it
I started to say more painful issues, but everybody has their own pain and we probably all feel that our own isworse than anybody elses
I think I was hoping when I opened this thread that someone out there would come along and wave a cyberwandwhich would help me to understand how to get to grips with my own stuff
How unrealistic am I
My own personal wounds AmNBoN have been with me all my life and climaxed in the finale at the return
I want to say something positive but am floundering....
Maybe I just have to learn acceptance, but this is not easy for a cardinal type of personality
UnwomanCygnetRagdoll

Cranberry

MystiqueWispywillow

Capricornianaries

and all those I havealready replied to A Great Big Thank You for taking the time to reply(if anybody out there has any positive information about this little rock to stop it from being a big problem
please post)
Thank you so much for sharing

Back to top

IP Logged

capricornianaries
Member

Re: Chiron - A Little Rock or a Big Problem?
« Reply #42 - on: 27.07.2008 at 18:17 [UT+1] »Hi Jently,
If you haven't already, do be sure to read this article by Liz Greene:
http://www.astro.com/astrology/in_wounding_e.htm
Posts: 244

Yeah, I do believe Chiron is harder than anything...Everything else at least seems to push you toward
something new. Chiron just always seems to be there.
Best,
Sara

Back to top
IP Logged
sirius1

Ex Member

Re: Chiron - A Little Rock or a Big Problem?
« Reply #43 - on: 27.07.2008 at 19:01 [UT+1] »Quote from Jently on 27.07.2008 at 17:59 [UT+1]:
Hi Everybody
It certainly seems that the contacts to personal planets and the angles are involved in some of life's harder wounding/healing issues
doesn't it
I started to say more painful issues, but everybody has their own pain and we probably all feel that our own is worse than anybody elses
I think I was hoping when I opened this thread that someone out there would come along and wave a cyber wandwhich would help me to understand how to get to grips with my own stuff
How unrealistic am I

AmNBoNMy own personal wounds
have been with me all my life and climaxed in the finale at the return
I want to say something positive but am floundering....
Maybe I just have to learn acceptance, but this is not easy for a cardinal type of personality
Unwoman Cygnet Ragdoll Cranberry Mystique Wispywillow Capricornianaries and all those I have already replied to A Great Big Thank You
for taking the time to reply(if anybody out there has any positive information about this little rock to stop it from being a big problem please post)
Thank you so much for sharing

Hi Jently
Maybe you find this excellent look at chiron from Brian Clark interesting enough to read and absorb the
essence.
http://www.astrosynthesis.com.au/articles/articles/the_chiron_cycle.pdf
More articles on this page from Brian Clark who is an Excellent Astrologer.
http://www.astrosynthesis.com.au/articles/articles.html
this is the site of a friend of mine who is hiv+ as long as I am 20+ years, He did something really special with
his N return. he is born on 30 December 1957.

http://www.willenendoen.org/english_home.html

Back to top

IP Logged

RachaelMember

Re: Chiron - A Little Rock or a Big Problem?
« Reply #44 - on: 27.07.2008 at 22:16 [UT+1] »Wow I just read the first link you posted, Sirius 1, on Brian Clark - it is spot on to my own experiences of the
Chiron return! And just Chiron itself in the chart! It talks of feeling suspended and alienated, and a redirectionof a life, and even a bit about adolescence being revisited! That one really caught my eye, because I have even
SAID I have been in my second adolescence in these last couple of years - returning to becoming an active fan
Posts: 2330
Gender:of a group I was a fan of, way back in the DAYS when I WAS 13!!!! What a shocker! I KNEW I wasn't far off inrealizing that I had to go through that to begin to go into the journey of a new life! Wow.
What this is telling me then is that a NEW life is awaiting for us, and without the baggage, that the baggage willbe left behind. For a moment there, it was getting a bit depressing - I was beginning to think that I was justleft behind to wallow in misery of opportunities not taken and all that, if I'd only had a hindsight then. Butthat couldn't be further from the truth. It is an ONward journey, and so a journey I shall take then!

Back to top
IP Logged

sirius1

Ex Member

Re: Chiron - A Little Rock or a Big Problem?
« Reply #45 - on: 27.07.2008 at 22:40 [UT+1] »Quote from Rachael on 27.07.2008 at 22:16 [UT+1]:
Wow I just read the first link you posted, Sirius 1, on Brian Clark - it is spot on to my own experiences of the Chiron return! And just
Chiron itself in the chart! It talks of feeling suspended and alienated, and a redirection of a life, and even a bit about adolescence being
revisited! That one really caught my eye, because I have even SAID I have been in my second adolescence in these last couple of years returning to becoming an active fan of a group I was a fan of, way back in the DAYS when I WAS 13!!!! What a shocker! I KNEW I wasn't
far off in realizing that I had to go through that to begin to go into the journey of a new life! Wow.
What this is telling me then is that a NEW life is awaiting for us, and without the baggage, that the baggage will be left behind. For amoment there, it was getting a bit depressing - I was beginning to think that I was just left behind to wallow in misery of opportunities
not taken and all that, if I'd only had a hindsight then. But that couldn't be further from the truth. It is an ONward journey, and so ajourney I shall take then!

Hi RachaelThank you for confirming your own experience, it is very noble of you
I'm glad to have been able to sharethese links to Brian clark's site and that you have found something of value there in.
chin up and Enjoy your Journey!
Back to top

IP Logged

unwomanEx Member

Re: Chiron - A Little Rock or a Big Problem?
« Reply #46 - on: 27.07.2008 at 23:12 [UT+1] »Dear Sirius 1
Very good links to those articles - thank you!
Un
Back to top
IP Logged
MissteryMember

Re: Chiron - A Little Rock or a Big Problem?
« Reply #47 - on: 28.07.2008 at 22:02 [UT+1] »Hi Capricornianaries
Thanks for the great link. I can never get enough of Liz Green. Some people dismiss her work, but for me it
speaks to my heart. Really enjoyed the article.
Posts: 535
Gender:Thank you

Hi Sirius
Thanks for the links for which I am grateful as they seem to speak of hope and moving forward after a period
of introspection and suspension which I can identify with so stronglyThis was the positive which I was hoping for at the start of the threadYour friend is an inspiration and I thank God for people like him who restore my faith in human nature and dosuch fantastic and much needed work
Peace and light to you both
JentlyBack to top

IP Logged

James Stillens
Ex Member

Re: Chiron - A Little Rock or a Big Problem?
« Reply #48 - on: 29.07.2008 at 01:29 [UT+1] »What a great thread!!
I have N strongly placed, in the 7th house, cusp of 8th, mD in c.
I feel my N in terms of my relations with people. I have close friends, but a lot of them are wounded, up N
alley. However, and I think this is N, a lot of my friendships have ended really bad, even when it didn't have toit did.
But I wouldn't call N a big problem. It's more of a lesson, that at times may be harsh, but in the end, you feel
revitalized.
Back to top

astro_24gw_01_james_2008728_hc_001.85427.9913.gif(attachment deleted)
IP Logged

Debs47

Ex Member

Re: Chiron - A Little Rock or a Big Problem?
« Reply #49 - on: 29.07.2008 at 02:48 [UT+1] »Quote from Jently on 23.07.2008 at 16:14 [UT+1]:
Is there anybody out there who has had difficult times with chiron and come out the other side with changed (for the better)

perspectives and or lives?
I would really like to know if there is a positive side to this one
My partner certainly has, but I will talk about that later when I have a bit more time -( if anybody's interested!

)

My Chiron is in Scorpio 4th house 7 degrees
My husband's Mercury is in Scorpio 8 deg. and his own Chiron is 9 Scorpio.
It is said by some who study the Magi Astrology that those partners who are lucky enough to find their spousewith a Chiron placement, that matches, shows a strong marriage or strength to help one heal.
I never paid much attention to Magi Astrology actually, as relationships, celebrities that they study rather boreme.
But I have to admit that they were correct about Chiron, at least in my life.
My husband actually helped with his soothing manner and words (Mercury), "heal" me.,over time.
In a way I think it's rather mystical in the way it was done.
Sirius: As usual, you provided wonderful information here with those links.

I just downloaded a few pdf files from the links, Thanks they were GREAT!!
After reading the first one, and seeing the Ephemeres, I know now that what I was going through in my late
30s was indeed a Scorpio Chiron Waxing Square. I already knew I needed healing, for an old inner wound, but
until I read this had no idea it was astrologically there and reflected as well.
Thanks again,Deb.
p.s. for the Willen doen site/link I sent it to my daughter who will be part of a large gathering in Washington
DC in late August speaking about the Aids Epidemic. Maybe she can use it or introduce it as a nice site to learn
from. She works for our State in the Aids research area.(grants, etc)

Back to top

IP Logged

vertexMember

Re: Chiron - A Little Rock or a Big Problem?
« Reply #50 - on: 29.07.2008 at 03:08 [UT+1] »Chiron is very significant in my chart. I have it stationary, retro (it went retro the day after I was born) in the
4th house. It is trine my ASC.
Chiron is afflicted in a T-square formation.

Posts: 5576
Gender:

NmF
NoG
NnO

Back to top
IP Logged
sirius1

Ex Member

Re: Chiron - A Little Rock or a Big Problem?
« Reply #51 - on: 29.07.2008 at 13:58 [UT+1] »Hi Jently and all your welcome

N is now exact m K

Ps. Hi Debs looking good and thanks
Back to top

IP Logged

Misstery

Re: Chiron - A Little Rock or a Big Problem?

Member« Reply #52 - on: 29.07.2008 at 16:36 [UT+1] »Quote from vertex on 29.07.2008 at 03:08 [UT+1]:
Chiron is very significant in my chart. I have it stationary, retro (it went retro the day after I was born) in the 4th house. It is trine myASC.
Chiron is afflicted in a T-square formation.

Posts: 535
Gender:

NmF
NoG
NnO

Hi Vertex,
Thanks for dangling that under our noses
Would you like to tell us how your chiron works for you and which houses and signs the aspects fall in?
Do you say it is significant because it is part of t square or because it has a strong impact on your life? Some tsquares, particularly those involving the outer planets are not always as apparent or consciousness affecting aretheyWith those planets involved my (very uneducated) guess
would be that there are some major issues for you
around duty and restrictions/ freedom and individuality, but the houses and signs might render them less soespecially with F involved. A benefic in a t square is always helpful isn't it
JentlyBack to top
IP Logged
Misstery

Re: Chiron - A Little Rock or a Big Problem?

Member« Reply #53 - on: 29.07.2008 at 16:55 [UT+1] »Hey James
Intriguing. Friendships ending badly revitalising? I found that one hard to get my head roundPosts: 535
Gender:I guess with 7th house placement you would expect the chiron stuff to be projected onto your friendships

DN n O. Sudden beginnings and endings then. Is that what you mean by revitalising. Could be a bit
confusing, as with D ruling 7th b friendships/relationships are usually long lasting aren't they but that
opposition challenges that need. Is it a boredom thing
Be interested to know a bit more about this one James

Back to top

IP Logged

Rachael

Re: Chiron - A Little Rock or a Big Problem?

Member« Reply #54 - on: 29.07.2008 at 17:11 [UT+1] »Hi Jently!
Um...perhaps he means because his post says he tries to help them, he gets involved in their dramas, and thenhas to pull himself out. Then when the dust clears, the friend and him reconcile.
Just offering my impression....but we shall see what James has to say when he returns.
Posts: 2330
Gender:Back to top
IP Logged
The Wizard's Eye

Ex Member

Re: Chiron - A Little Rock or a Big Problem?
« Reply #55 - on: 29.07.2008 at 17:33 [UT+1] »I wouldn't say Chiron acts as a bridge between Saturn and Uranus psychologically, I would say it acts as thebridge between Pluto and Jupiter. Charts with an emphasis towards Jupiter and Pluto seem to take a negative
view of Chiron in my opinion, since Jupiter and Pluto speak of abiding with life's laws, ie: death, the urge toheal and to even resurrect isn't given much credence.
To me, the mythology of Asclepius better describes Chironic patterns of wounding and healing than the
mythology of Chiron. The fear of being crushed, emotionally or physically appears to be related to Chiron, as
does the fear of being symbolically stung.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Asclepius
Back to top

IP Logged

Misstery

Re: Chiron - A Little Rock or a Big Problem?

Member« Reply #56 - on: 29.07.2008 at 21:39 [UT+1] »Quote from Rachael on 29.07.2008 at 17:11 [UT+1]:
Hi Jently!
Um...perhaps he means because his post says he tries to help them, he gets involved in their dramas, and then has to pull himself out.
Then when the dust clears, the friend and him reconcile.
Just offering my impression....but we shall see what James has to say when he returns.

Posts: 535
Gender:

Hi Rachael
You could well be right. Just that when James says his friendships ended badly, even when they didn't have to,they did andI found it difficult to understand the concept of it being revitalising
Maybe they are reconciled
I hope James comes back and clarifies or this will bug me
Back to top
IP Logged
James Stillens

Ex Member

Re: Chiron - A Little Rock or a Big Problem?
« Reply #57 - on: 29.07.2008 at 23:25 [UT+1] »Quote from Jently on 29.07.2008 at 21:39 [UT+1]:
Quote from Rachael on 29.07.2008 at 17:11 [UT+1]:
Hi Jently!
Um...perhaps he means because his post says he tries to help them, he gets involved in their dramas, and then has to pull
himself out. Then when the dust clears, the friend and him reconcile.
Just offering my impression....but we shall see what James has to say when he returns.

Hi Rachael
You could well be right. Just that when James says his friendships ended badly, even when they didn't have to, they did andI found it difficult to understand the concept of it being revitalising
Maybe they are reconciled
I hope James comes back and clarifies or this will bug me

I'll clarify, what I meant was that many of the friendships I have had have ended badly, even when they did nothave to end badly, the way they did, that's how it happened. What I meant by revitalized is that after the dust
has cleared and the lessons have been learned, then you feel better in general which is a lesson with N.
For example, I have just ended a friendship with someone and am keeping a second friend at an arm's length
for a while. It was very difficult, but now that the lessons have been learned, I feel a lot better about thedecision I made.
Back to top

IP Logged

vertexMember

Re: Chiron - A Little Rock or a Big Problem?
« Reply #58 - on: 30.07.2008 at 01:16 [UT+1] »Quote from Jently on 29.07.2008 at 16:36 [UT+1]:
Quote from vertex on 29.07.2008 at 03:08 [UT+1]:
Chiron is very significant in my chart. I have it stationary, retro (it went retro the day after I was born) in the 4th house.
It is trine my ASC.
Chiron is afflicted in a T-square formation.

Posts: 5576
Gender:

NmF
NoG
NnO
Hi Vertex,
Thanks for dangling that under our noses
Would you like to tell us how your chiron works for you and which houses and signs the aspects fall in?
Do you say it is significant because it is part of t square or because it has a strong impact on your life? Some t squares, particularly those
involving the outer planets are not always as apparent or consciousness affecting are theyWith those planets involved my (very uneducated) guess

would be that there are some major issues for you around duty andrestrictions/ freedom and individuality, but the houses and signs might render them less so especially withF involved. A benefic in a tsquare is always helpful isn't it
JentlyHi Jently,
It's significant because I definitely feel Chiron's effect, woundedness in the 4th house in a big way. (I don't wantto get into detail) I think Jupiter expands the effect of Chiron in my chart. Or maybe I feel it because Chiron is
stationary in my chart. Or maybe the trine ASC. And it doesn't help the Chiron is afflicted by two malefics.
My Chiron is in a. I read a great accurate description of this in Martin Lass' Chiron book. Unfortunately, I readit about a year ago and I don't remember what it was.
Back to top
IP LoggedVivisha

Ex Member

Re: Chiron - A Little Rock or a Big Problem?
« Reply #59 - on: 30.07.2008 at 01:53 [UT+1] »Hi vertex
Martin Lass wrote two books on chiron one of which has a limited preview on google books where you can readon chiron in aries. Not sure if its the text you read previously but if you enjoyed his work you might like a readanyway.
here's the link
Musings of a Rogue Comet: Chiron, Planet of Healing By Martin Lass
http://www.google.co.uk/books?id=UiYNPFOnLLwC&printsec=frontcover&dq=Mar
tin+Lass&ie=ISO-8859-1&sig=ACfU3U1Y64L_V1z_W-mquE5JbVR54pglMQ
vivi xBack to top

IP Logged

vertexMember

Re: Chiron - A Little Rock or a Big Problem?
« Reply #60 - on: 30.07.2008 at 23:31 [UT+1] »Hi Vivisha,Thanks for the link! Unfortunately, the Chiron in Aries chapter is not available in the preview.

Posts: 5576
Gender:

The book I read was his other book "Chiron Healing Body & Soul" Excellent! I highly recommend it!!
I finally found my copy and re-read the Chiron in Aries passage....so accurate!!
I recommend anyone to get this book. Chiron in the signs, Chiron aspects, Chiron transits are described verywell.

Back to top
IP Logged
SeaGoat72

Re: Chiron - A Little Rock or a Big Problem?

Ex Member« Reply #61 - on: 31.07.2008 at 19:02 [UT+1] »Hi Vertex
I managed to read on Chiron in Aries in Vivisha's book link: you can either run a search for Chiron in Aries, orAries, and go to page 297.
Back to top

IP Logged

MissteryMember

Re: Chiron - A Little Rock or a Big Problem?
« Reply #62 - on: 31.07.2008 at 23:05 [UT+1] »Quote from Vivisha on 30.07.2008 at 01:53 [UT+1]:
Hi vertex
Martin Lass wrote two books on chiron one of which has a limited preview on google books where you can read on chiron in aries. Not sure
if its the text you read previously but if you enjoyed his work you might like a read anyway.

Posts: 535
Gender:here's the link
Musings of a Rogue Comet: Chiron, Planet of Healing By Martin Lass
http://www.google.co.uk/books?id=UiYNPFOnLLwC&printsec=frontcover&dq=Mar tin+Lass&ie=ISO-88591&sig=ACfU3U1Y64L_V1z_W-mquE5JbVR54pglMQ
vivi xHi Vivisha
Thanks for posting this link.
Superb. Should be compulsory reading for all seeking astrololgical and spiritual knowledge and growth
If there is anybody reading this post trying to understand the meaning of life's purpose and struggles I
recommend you read this book
Back to top
IP Logged
Leon Parker

Re: Chiron - A Little Rock or a Big Problem?

Ex Member« Reply #63 - on: 11.08.2008 at 00:02 [UT+1] »hello all, i'm attracted to this thread. and i'm convinced that Chiron play a major role. i've seen too many times
the charts when Chiron is active in natal chart and manifests himself in very unpleasant way.
i found in the natal chiron aspects with Sun and Mars very challenging, especially squares, but not sure about
the effects of transits on these 2 planets personally yet: Chiron square sun or mars take place in the charts
both in the killers and cancer sufferers. there seems to indicate a great deal of poisonous violence, which if notreleased, get infested inside of the body and causing severe health problems. of course i should believe that not
everybody has Chiron square Mars/sun has to be a killer or cancer suffer---other aspects should collude as well,
but the presence of Chiron is just alerting.
i don't know whether others posters have noticed this and could you share your observations.

Back to top

IP Logged

Rachael

Re: Chiron - A Little Rock or a Big Problem?

Member« Reply #64 - on: 11.08.2008 at 00:19 [UT+1] »Well you seem to be right about my husb anyway - who passed from colon cancer in Apr of 04 at the age of47....he has a natal A 7 k m N at 11 k, and the A makes an out of sign o to E at 29 a.
(I've been on another thread today in the In-Depth forum, asking about transits at a passing of a loved one, so
Posts: 2330
Gender:I think I will get off here for today, lol. I need to digest these things, lol. Sometimes, astrology is so right on
the mark, it is almost spooky, lol.)

Back to top
IP Logged
Leon Parker

Ex Member

Re: Chiron - A Little Rock or a Big Problem?
« Reply #65 - on: 11.08.2008 at 16:10 [UT+1] »well Rachael thanks for your information, really sorry for your husband. back to the name of this thread, i dobelieve that Chiron is a Big Problem. but it seems that one can hardly does anything about Chiron---this isquite frustrating for people who believe in the skills of healing of any sort.
i've at hands several chart of victimes of sexual aggressions, all females , all with challenging Chiron placement,
either with Sun or with Mars. sometimes the Chiron conjunction with Sun could also be problematic. but i've
the impression that for men, the story could be the inverse one---men seem to be more likely the perpetrator
or violent acts if ever the violence IS out, i must be biased, but i can hardly mistrust the these charts in front of
my eyes.
Liz Greene says tha the problem of Chiron could run through the family, through generations, but up to now i
can't have any tangible family charts to further the reading.
Back to top

IP Logged

Misstery

Re: Chiron - A Little Rock or a Big Problem?

Member« Reply #66 - on: 11.08.2008 at 19:59 [UT+1] »Quote from Leon Parker on 11.08.2008 at 16:10 [UT+1]:

i've at hands several chart of victimes of sexual aggressions, all females , all with challenging Chiron placement, either with Sun or with
Mars. sometimes the Chiron conjunction with Sun could also be problematic. but i've the impression that for men, the story could be thePosts: 535
Gender:inverse one---men seem to be more likely the perpetrator or violent acts if ever the violence IS out, i must be biased, but i can hardly
mistrust the these charts in front of my eyes.

Hi Leonregarding victims of sexual aggression, I have come across 2 male victims of rapeinterestingly each had Moon/Chiron conjunctions, but no Sun or Mars contacts with Chiron.
Both had Moon/Chiron in Scorpio
I also have evidence of several criminal/alcoholic/drug addict combinations and they all had heavy Neptune andChiron influences............. The pain of Chiron fuelling escapism into alcohol/drugs and the resulting lack ofcontrol in their lives resulting in crime? Very painful for those afflicted with this combination
JentlyBack to top
IP Logged
silveress

Member

Re: Chiron - A Little Rock or a Big Problem?
« Reply #67 - on: 11.08.2008 at 20:14 [UT+1] »I am a beginner to chiron. Does anyone know what it means to have only challenging aspects to chiron, even ina progressed chart?
My chiron in gemini in the twelfth house is square to venus and MC, and oppostion to uranus and neptune. I
Posts: 242

have done the charts of family members and friends and I am the only one who only challenging aspects tochiron. Does this mean I will have a challenging life? At 25, I feel like I've been through alot, at least in theemotional sense. On the upside I've forced myself to face my challenges head on, no matter how hard they've
been.
Would appreciate any input! Thanks

Back to top

IP Logged

Rachael

Re: Chiron - A Little Rock or a Big Problem?

Member« Reply #68 - on: 11.08.2008 at 22:29 [UT+1] »Shawnna Burt says:"....and I am the only one who only challenging aspects to chiron. Does this mean I will have a challenging
life?"No.
Posts: 2330
Gender:Because....
"At 25, I feel like I've been through alot, at least in the emotional sense. On the upside I've forced myself toface my challenges head on, no matter how hard they've been."...which to me means you are working your way through your difficulties, and coming out the other end ofthem! Or will!!

That's what N is about, release from the baggage of the past.

Back to top
IP Logged
Leon Parker

Re: Chiron - A Little Rock or a Big Problem?

Ex Member« Reply #69 - on: 12.08.2008 at 19:53 [UT+1] »Quote from Jently on 11.08.2008 at 19:59 [UT+1]:
Hi Leonregarding victims of sexual aggression, I have come across 2 male victims of rapeinterestingly each had Moon/Chiron conjunctions, but no Sun or Mars contacts with Chiron.
Both had Moon/Chiron in Scorpio
I also have evidence of several criminal/alcoholic/drug addict combinations and they all had heavy Neptune and Chiron
influences............. The pain of Chiron fuelling escapism into alcohol/drugs and the resulting lack of control in their lives resulting incrime? Very painful for those afflicted with this combination
Jentlyhello Jently, what you said is very interesting concerning the "male" victimes of rapes with Chiron/moon
conjunctions. in fact i've read somewhere that women with challenging Chiron/moon are among the high ratesexual victimes as well. but there is no statistical support yet. and though i believe the participation of Chiron
in the chart of any victim, i do believe in other factors which collude with rapes.
crimes, violence alway step from inner impotence.
the affliction of Chiron could render the person strong feelings of hurt, inferioty, humiliation, in one word,
impotence. that's why i think that Chiron is so active in crimes. the violence could give the impression that one
is in control and has the power over another person, which is of course, just an illusion.
the healing power of chiron, for me, demands very high-level consciousness because the compassion andhumility generated by Chiron can only be realized by very deep understanding of pains, firstly, the pains of
oneself, and then, those of others. i think most of the people never come to realize one's own chiron pains in
the first place. and to lighten up the pains, there is a who serial of defence systems in place, and you see
everything but healing.
Back to top

IP Logged

RachaelMember

Re: Chiron - A Little Rock or a Big Problem?
« Reply #70 - on: 12.08.2008 at 20:07 [UT+1] »Leon Parker said:"i think most of the people never come to realize one's own chiron pains in the first place. and to lighten up thepains, there is a who serial of defence systems in place, and you see everything but healing."

Posts: 2330
Gender:Hmm....I don't think it is because they don't realize the pain - people very MUCH realize the pain. But thensome do tend to get defensive and not heal. But I think it is that way because they are just trying to begin towork their way through it, and have to start somewhere.....so it naturally becomes overwhelming to them atfirst. Then, that is where either one stops the healing, or continues through it.

Back to top
IP Logged
Leon Parker

Re: Chiron - A Little Rock or a Big Problem?

Ex Member« Reply #71 - on: 12.08.2008 at 20:18 [UT+1] »Quote from Rachael on 12.08.2008 at 20:07 [UT+1]:
Hmm....I don't think it is because they don't realize the pain - people very MUCH realize the pain. But then some do tend to get defensive
and not heal. But I think it is that way because they are just trying to begin to work their way through it, and have to startsomewhere.....so it naturally becomes overwhelming to them at first. Then, that is where either one stops the healing, or continues
through it.

dear Rachael, i think the level of pains of Chiron is very difficult to be taken into consciousness since it's usuallyunconscious pain running through generations. surely everybody has pains, but those pains compared to the
Chiron's pains were just too superficial.
the poisonous arrow in the thigh of Chiron seems to be the source of his pain. but the real source of Chiron's
pain is his "immortality". you see, to feel the pains of arrow and to feel the pain of "immortality" are really not
the same level thing.
it's only under unconscious compulsions that people get into different kinds of pains at different stage of theirlife, but they are not aware that the different kind of problems/pains might just stem from the same source--that's where Chiron lies. that's why i said that Chiron's pain is difficult to be realized because this pain is justtoo big to be realized.
Back to top

IP LoggedRachael

Re: Chiron - A Little Rock or a Big Problem?

Member« Reply #72 - on: 12.08.2008 at 20:49 [UT+1] »Leon Parker says".....but they are not aware that the different kind of problems/pains might just stem from the same source--that's where Chiron lies. that's why i said that Chiron's pain is difficult to be realized because this pain is justtoo big to be realized."
Posts: 2330
Gender:I dunno.....it is just hard for me to wrap around this concept of never healing....I think this was brought out
earlier on this thread, about being wounded from something/one outside of you and carrying the pain for all of
your days, because you don't heal from it. That would make for a LOT of people throwing self-pity parties andholding tons of resentment....among other worse things than that. Might even make someone suicidal....I just
can't see how this is so that you never fully heal. That you can't get in there if you so desire, and bring out thesource and heal from the wound.

Back to top
IP Logged
Jim Birke

Re: Chiron - A Little Rock or a Big Problem?

Ex Member« Reply #73 - on: 12.08.2008 at 21:02 [UT+1] »Chiron is toooo small, 160 km in diameter and far away.
Chariklo, his pregnant wife is 100 km bigger. Now there is something to consider.
Even though i have both of them conjunct my sun i never use. a small influence.
Useless.
Jim
Back to top

IP Logged

Leon Parker
Ex Member

Re: Chiron - A Little Rock or a Big Problem?
« Reply #74 - on: 12.08.2008 at 21:03 [UT+1] »dear Rachael, i think you hit a very important point with Chiron.
how i could put it better than what is already stated by the sophisticated astrologers. yes it's rather
disappointing to know that there are the pains that could not be healed. after all, all what we study, search,
aren't them for the purpose of getting ourselves healed? what is the point then depite all our efforts, the painis still there?
for me the myth of Chiron is a myth of limits. we all have limits. the doctors have limits, the healers have
limits, the psychologists have their limits. depite of their finest skills, they can not heal everybody, there arepatients who die and will continue to die. the myth of limits tells us also that the life is therefore unfair, injust,the real life is not a fairy tale, the good guys get tortured and the bad ones just finish their days in serenity.
yes even if you can't believe since this is not nice, it is the true face of life. i think Chiron is there reminding usthat "well this is the pain that can't be healed, what you can do with it"?
most of the people can't answer this question because they can't believe, in the first place, that such a question
is appropriate.
Back to top
IP Logged
Rachael

Re: Chiron - A Little Rock or a Big Problem?

Member« Reply #75 - on: 12.08.2008 at 21:22 [UT+1] »"what is the point then despite all our efforts, the pain is still there?"Ya exactly! And we have much more important things in our individual lives that need attention internally or
externally - but if we sit and ponder our woes all the day long over something that remains festering inside, wePosts: 2330
Gender:will be making ourselves nuts!
To ignore is to just have it where we really can't see it, manipulating
ourselves over it at the same time! Surely it is that we have BEEN wounded, PAST tense, and then get to theother side of the wound, present tense, and then understand another with a wound and offer help, futuretense.

Back to top

IP Logged

PearlsMember

Re: Chiron - A Little Rock or a Big Problem?
« Reply #76 - on: 12.08.2008 at 22:19 [UT+1] »I have an exact conjunction (zero degrees) between chiron and North node and they both conjunct venus (fourdegrees). I wonder what nn and chiron conjunction would do for me? Is this a healer aspect?

Posts: 1152

Back to top
IP Logged

Misstery

Re: Chiron - A Little Rock or a Big Problem?

Member« Reply #77 - on: 12.08.2008 at 23:02 [UT+1] »Quote from Rachael on 12.08.2008 at 21:22 [UT+1]:"what is the point then despite all our efforts, the pain is still there?"Ya exactly! And we have much more important things in our individual lives that need attention internally or externally - but if we sit andponder our woes all the day long over something that remains festering inside, we will be making ourselves nuts!

Posts: 535
Gender:To ignore is to justhave it where we really can't see it, manipulating ourselves over it at the same time! Surely it is that we have BEEN wounded, PAST
tense, and then get to the other side of the wound, present tense, and then understand another with a wound and offer help, future tense.

Hey Rachael
Beautifully put. Wonderful words. Please God give us all the grace to live and understand the truth of our own
personal wounds and move forward to help others with theirs
JentlyBack to top

IP Logged

Leon Parker
Ex Member

Re: Chiron - A Little Rock or a Big Problem?
« Reply #78 - on: 13.08.2008 at 17:00 [UT+1] »Quote from Hermit on 12.08.2008 at 22:19 [UT+1]:
I have an exact conjunction (zero degrees) between chiron and North node and they both conjunct venus (four degrees). I wonder what nn
and chiron conjunction would do for me? Is this a healer aspect?

it is a "healer aspect" under the condition that you understand your own wounds first.
Back to top
IP Logged
Mystique

Re: Chiron - A Little Rock or a Big Problem?

Member« Reply #79 - on: 14.08.2008 at 01:06 [UT+1] »HelloLeon interesting points you make and I understand what you mean by the deep wounding that goes beyond
the conscious mind.
Rachael, while I agree with you that we should all be able to access our wound heal it and then heal others, I
have to agree with Leon in that Chiron symbolizes a wound we don't readily have access to and most probably
it is this "soul wound" that triggers our quest for knowledge and better understanding ourselves and ourrelationships.
Every single one of us experiences a hurting mostly through our relationships since they mirror our own issues
Posts: 92
Gender:and you are right we should and do try to understand the wound, heal it as best as we can and move on,
however there will always be something along our journey that reminds us of the hurt and we re-live it in our
minds and hearts so that we can learn and grow from the next lesson....of course while our inner healing istaking place we all go on with every day living, you are right we cannot sit around and certainly we cannot
spend our days singing "cry me a river..."and we know this instinctively and for most of us we find the strength somehow and we keep forging ahead andfor those who are a little weaker than us in a similar situation we do our best to help...this is where we get achance to guide and teach from experience
Chiron was a teacher and a healer and even though its the poisonous arrow that wounded his physical body it
was an arrow from a loved one (his student Hercules) which hurt him...once again Chiron was hurt by a loved
one...remember he was not wanted at birth because his mother thought him too ugly...so we could say this
accidental piercing triggered a past wound and he re-lived the agony of suffering on his own again....
Maybe Chiron's life from childhood to the point where he sacrifices his immortality for relief of pain symbolizes
the journey each of our Souls has to take to reach the At - onement with God...and I don't think we can do thisin just one lifetime....maybe this is what Leon means that the wound is much deeper than just our current
experiences...and the more we try and learn about ourselves just like we are all doing here then the closer we
get to healing all aspects of our original wound.
Just some thoughts to add to my earlier post
Blessings to all
Mystique

Back to top

IP Logged

RachaelMember

Re: Chiron - A Little Rock or a Big Problem?
« Reply #80 - on: 14.08.2008 at 01:22 [UT+1] »MystiqueI see!
That makes sense what you are saying....it will always be there a little, something will make us saddened over it

Posts: 2330
Gender:as we go on with ourself - but what then, we are not stuck in one place with it, if we so choose to go forward?
(Which I am sure everyone would like to do.)You say quest for knowledge and better understanding of ourselves...hmm, I seem to be forever on a quest tounderstand myself and the world at large as well. Can never get enough, lol.
Thank you for making it a little clearer to me.

Back to top
IP Logged
Leon Parker

Re: Chiron - A Little Rock or a Big Problem?

Ex Member« Reply #81 - on: 14.08.2008 at 20:24 [UT+1] »Dear Mysthique,i admit that i still have many difficulties in understand Chiron and when Chiron is now squaring my NN, i am
rereading the writting of Liz Greene and Baraba Hands Clow. i find it still hard, but i think with time i'm bettergrasping Chiron, at least i hope so. the two authors have different perspectives, Liz Greene's portrayal of Chiron
is stark, harsh, but very true and demands a lot of courage of acceptation. Barara's vision is so spirituel thatyou will not lose hope even with Chiron. i think many people know the refrain of Chiron being a "wounded
healer", but the healing power of Chiron was not from the wound, he was already a healer before he waswounded. so it's not because that we are hurt that we can heal others. back to the individuals, the healing
power is already in everybody, but not because of the hurt that he gets from life. this is a point that we often
miss. but i think Chiron''s own wound did finally contribute to his level of skills as a great healer: he understoodthen better than anybody else what the pain was about. yes you won't disagree that some "technical" healers
do not know how their patients feel.
Chiron is half humain half animal. Liz Greene reminds that the hurt of Chiron is in his animal part. this is why
poeple with afflicted Chiron sometime could restore to the violence because it's animal's defense reaction.
Chiron's humain half tells us that the understanding of the pains (starting from those of oneselfs') could
eventually lead us to living with the pains in general, especially those in others. that way the pains indicated by
Chiron would not be projected to others in form of scapegoating.
Chiron's pains are really unfaire, injust, nevertheless, on which we can not really do anything but accepting. theunfaireness of Chiron means that the pains might have nothing to do with oneself, not even with one's parents,
in a word, it's something that no one might understand why it should be there. i think it's something to dowith the notion of Karma. you don't know why, you just have it. in spite of all, Chiron's humain part
understands and accepts this.
i think that's the lesson of chiron: understanding and acceptation. that's where the true healing begins.
Back to top

IP Logged

MissteryMember

Re: Chiron - A Little Rock or a Big Problem?
« Reply #82 - on: 14.08.2008 at 22:46 [UT+1] »Leon Parker says "I think that's the lesson of chiron; understanding and acceptance, that's where the true
healing lies"

Posts: 535
Gender:True, but the wound has to be recognised first and this is where many people struggle I think.
Easier for us astrology followers sitting at our computers able to search for meaning, but for others especiallythose from 'under privileged' backgrounds, i.e. no access to education or mental stimulation, those born inthird world countries, even our brothers and sisters in the west who somehow never benefit from the privilegesthat so many of us take for granted, it is nowhere near as simple as understanding and acceptance.
What of criminals, drug addicts, the poverty stricken and homeless, to name just a few?
These people have the same wounds as us, probably worse, but many, probably most, will never get anywhere
near understanding and acceptance. They will struggle just to survive. True healing in the terms being
discussed on this thread is an impossible dream for them.
Chiron for them is just a wound

Back to top
IP Logged

Mystique

Re: Chiron - A Little Rock or a Big Problem?

Member« Reply #83 - on: 14.08.2008 at 23:28 [UT+1] »You say quest for knowledge and better understanding of ourselves...hmm, I seem to be forever on a quest tounderstand myself and the world at large as well. Can never get enough, lol.
Thank you for making it a little clearer to me.
Rachael, lol! Still, may you always have the guidance you need to achieve your goal
Leon
Posts: 92
Gender:Maybe you are right but remember that Chiron was abandoned as a baby...that in itself was wounding to him.
True he may have been born a healer but its through compassion and understanding of the graces and trials we
all go through that we can reach out and help others while still healing ourselves....and speaking for myself its
through my experiences that I understand a similar wound in another.
A lesson I see with Chiron's symbolism is to reach out and share what we know. Plain and simple....its in all theteachings handed down to us from our foremothers/fathers...help another as I would want to be helped. The
best way for me to help another is through my own experiences, so while I may understand grief and help
someone who is grieving now, you may understand what its like to have been physically abused so now you
help others who are in similar situation...and it doesn't even have to be professionally....everyone of us has tobe aware of others' suffering and like I said earlier those of us who are stronger to help those who are weakerbecause at the end of the day we are helping not only them but ourselves too so we can all keep moving closer
to at-onement with God/Source
JentlyThese people have the same wounds as us, probably worse, but many, probably most, will never get anywhere
near understanding and acceptance. They will struggle just to survive. True healing in the terms being
discussed on this thread is an impossible dream for them.
Chiron for them is just a wound
you are right and for a lot of us the best way for us to help them and all other living beings we cannot help
physically, is through prayers.
Mystique

Back to top

IP Logged
Pages: 1

Astrodienst Forum › English Language Area › Discussion: Psychological and General« Previous topic | Next topic

Astrology»=> Discussion: Psychological and General Astrology

Go