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Gumption, will, etc. (Read 185 times)

lioninrain
MemberGumption, will, etc.
« on: 10.06.2009 at 00:13 [UT+1] »What would you all say astrologically, would incline a person to just give up easily?
What houses, signs or planets, etc.?
I'm having a hard time distinguishing, whether this is real or an act - usually I can tell, but not lately. Don'twant to be unkind, but I'm really beginning to wonder.

Posts: 1554
Gender:I thought at first, perhaps Mars. Not sure though - mine is in it's fall in d, and I've never felt that way always have been able to pull myself up, so don't know.
Maybe even survival instinct, F? or A even?

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CindyLu

Member

Re: Gumption, will, etc.
« Reply #1 - on: 10.06.2009 at 03:45 [UT+1] »My first thought was that the keywords for e are "I Will", which would correlate with the A. Might tie in witha, too, being the exaltation of the A - "I Am".

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Eloize Deschaux
Ex Member

Re: Gumption, will, etc.
« Reply #2 - on: 10.06.2009 at 03:52 [UT+1] »I have a 1st house El at 17 degrees sibling who always gives up. But I'm thinking it's more the m to Gl in
the 1st that is the cause of her "Restricted tenacity". Rather than the placement itself.
Hm...:
maybe EoI? I have the placement and my fighting spirit can be non-existent sometimes. At times it's thecomplete opposite. Really, there's no telling when with I.(ImIC in IV oEg in 1st)
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Waybread

Member

Re: Gumption, will, etc.
« Reply #3 - on: 10.06.2009 at 08:01 [UT+1] »I would think harsh aspects from Neptune to personal planets. With Neptune opposite sun, for example, theego gets "blurred" or "dissolved." Neptune square Mercury suggests pessimistic thinking. Neptune challenging
Mars might "erase" that person's sense of drive and initiative.
Maybe the sun or Mars in the 12th, the "house of self-undoing."
You don't have a grand trine, by any chance, do you? Sometimes life actually goes sufficiently well for these

Posts: 14740
Gender:people that they don't develop the kind of initiative demanded by tough squares or oppositions. They might
do OK with a high school diploma, rather than pursue that graduate program that would really put them where
they want to be.

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Ceto*
Member

Re: Gumption, will, etc.
« Reply #4 - on: 10.06.2009 at 08:10 [UT+1] »E, I, I have the opposition which tends to sidetrack me, I will start in one direction and end up in another. I
don't know if this is giving up, but it is very difficult to get back on track when I am pursuing another castle inthe sky.

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Belgian Waffle

Ex Member

Re: Gumption, will, etc.
« Reply #5 - on: 10.06.2009 at 10:53 [UT+1] »Quote from Waybread on 10.06.2009 at 08:01 [UT+1]:
I would think harsh aspects from Neptune to personal planets. With Neptune opposite sun, for example, the ego gets "blurred" or"dissolved." Neptune square Mercury suggests pessimistic thinking. Neptune challenging Mars might "erase" that person's sense of drive
and initiative

I thought saturn aspecting mercury was more in the line of negative thinking (but saturn has structure andboundaries, while neptune has ... what does it have actually?
)
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lioninrain
Member

Re: Gumption, will, etc.
« Reply #6 - on: 10.06.2009 at 11:00 [UT+1] »Waybread, it's not actually me that I am wondering about, but a couple of people in my life at present.
Began as helping a friend of some friends of mine - My friends have run like hell from the situation, and I'mreally beginning to wonder myself....Kinda torn here I guess - don't want to desert them if they really are that
down & out, but on the other hand...geez.
Too much to go into, but wonder if it's me, being unwilling/able to see it for what it is, or not.
Posts: 1554
Gender:I do possess the capability of cutting it off/out if need be, but rarely do that. Been going on now for about 6
months and I'm tired

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lioninrain

Member

Re: Gumption, will, etc.
« Reply #7 - on: 10.06.2009 at 11:28 [UT+1] »Hey, I just thought of somethingThat FIN is in my 11th house, do you think that could be it?

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Eloize Deschaux
Ex Member

Re: Gumption, will, etc.
« Reply #8 - on: 10.06.2009 at 11:40 [UT+1] »Quote from Belgian Waffle on 10.06.2009 at 10:53 [UT+1]:
Quote from Waybread on 10.06.2009 at 08:01 [UT+1]:
I would think harsh aspects from Neptune to personal planets. With Neptune opposite sun, for example, the ego gets"blurred" or "dissolved." Neptune square Mercury suggests pessimistic thinking. Neptune challenging Mars might "erase"that person's sense of drive and initiative
I thought saturn aspecting mercury was more in the line of negative thinking (but saturn has structure and boundaries, while neptune has... what does it have actually?

)

Imagination, faith, ability to really nuance things...
I mean when I do "use my will" it's not often in a crushingly assertive manner. It's not that bad. I notice I often
find "plans of actions" easily but lack the will to do them. We have this dilemma...
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rookishMember

Re: Gumption, will, etc.
« Reply #9 - on: 10.06.2009 at 13:32 [UT+1] »lioninrain - what sort of situation are you talking about? Are they looking for financial support, or domestic
support or marital support? It's difficult to pinpoint without a bit more detail so we can see the potential toactually be incapable, or lazy, or manipulative. If you see what I mean.

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lioninrain
Member

Re: Gumption, will, etc.
« Reply #10 - on: 10.06.2009 at 23:04 [UT+1] »Just trying to figure out if I'm the last sucker standing I guess...
Started out when an acquaintance asked me months ago if I'd mind giving rides to some people who'd bothrecently lost their jobs, and a couple of other people were already helping them out too, so it really wasn't any
big deal.

Posts: 1554
Gender:

About 2 or 3 weeks into it, everyone else quit helping, & it seemed to be just me. Ok, still doable, just had toadjust a little, no big deal.
We went from a ride here & there to the store, job searching, etc. to court appearances, jail bailouts, groceries,
half the rent, utility money....
THEN, I find out they have a car, it just has a busted radiator hose, so I got the parts, dropped them off about
2 weeks or so ago - last time I was there, they were still sitting there in the bag.
Another friend of mine gave them a refurbished computer so they could look for jobs online, but it seems tohave only spawned a computer game addiction - and I mean heavy-duty - we're talking days at a time here.
So in taking stalk of the situation, seems like the only thing any of us have accomplished in trying to "help"
these folks, is we are all really tired and we have possibly delayed the inevitable, but other than that, it's been ahuge waste of energy.
Then I thought maybe it was just me, getting tired and cranky - but I don't think so. They just don't seem tohave any kind of "get-up-and-go" at all, strange really. I could understand for a short time, but this has been
going on even before I started "helping", and that's been all year so far - so probably 8 months or better
they've pretty much just been sitting there.

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Waybread

Member

Re: Gumption, will, etc.
« Reply #11 - on: 11.06.2009 at 06:14 [UT+1] »lioninrain--For your own well-being, pocket-book, and sanity, I hope you will firmly divest yourself of thissituation. How many ways to say moochers, sponges, schnorrers, deadbeats, leaches...?
There are probably several charts to look at here. These people's [a couple??] for behaving so badly, and thenyours, for "helping" them for so long.
There's a point at which helping becomes enabling.

Posts: 14740
Gender:I've read any number of your posts and you seem like a super person. You don't deserve or need these people
in your life!

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loulouaz
Member

Re: Gumption, will, etc.
« Reply #12 - on: 11.06.2009 at 07:07 [UT+1] »Quote from lioninrain on 10.06.2009 at 23:04 [UT+1]:
Just trying to figure out if I'm the last sucker standing I guess...
Started out when an acquaintance asked me months ago if I'd mind giving rides to some people who'd both recently lost their jobs, and acouple of other people were already helping them out too, so it really wasn't any big deal.

Posts: 1185
Gender:

About 2 or 3 weeks into it, everyone else quit helping, & it seemed to be just me. Ok, still doable, just had to adjust a little, no big deal.
We went from a ride here & there to the store, job searching, etc. to court appearances, jail bailouts, groceries, half the rent, utility
money....
THEN, I find out they have a car, it just has a busted radiator hose, so I got the parts, dropped them off about 2 weeks or so ago - lasttime I was there, they were still sitting there in the bag.
Another friend of mine gave them a refurbished computer so they could look for jobs online, but it seems to have only spawned acomputer game addiction - and I mean heavy-duty - we're talking days at a time here.
So in taking stalk of the situation, seems like the only thing any of us have accomplished in trying to "help" these folks, is we are all
really tired and we have possibly delayed the inevitable, but other than that, it's been a huge waste of energy.
Then I thought maybe it was just me, getting tired and cranky - but I don't think so. They just don't seem to have any kind of "get-upand-go" at all, strange really. I could understand for a short time, but this has been going on even before I started "helping", and that's
been all year so far - so probably 8 months or better they've pretty much just been sitting there.

Could be bad karma , you know, you owe them something from a past lifesounds to me that they remember you from some place& now are reaping the 'benefits'.
Honestly though, it does sound hilarious in one sense, you have got to tell them to stop taking advantage ofyour kind, sympathetic nature.
They have been taking you for a ride mabe you have been encouraging them in some way, but not meaning to
if you know what I mean. Have you all thought about going for some past life regression together ? ( going inseparate cars of course) to find out where the problem of their dependence on you stems from.
Would you be the one who pays for the therapy ? or you could have a whip round... ie you get a whip & whip
their arses out of your life once & for all
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unique_astrology

Ex Member

Re: Gumption, will, etc.
« Reply #13 - on: 11.06.2009 at 07:50 [UT+1] »Quote from lioninrain on 10.06.2009 at 23:04 [UT+1]:
THEN, I find out they have a car, it just has a busted radiator hose, so I got the parts, dropped them off about 2 weeks or so ago - lasttime I was there, they were still sitting there in the bag.
Another friend of mine gave them a refurbished computer so they could look for jobs online, but it seems to have only spawned acomputer game addiction - and I mean heavy-duty - we're talking days at a time here.
... so probably 8 months or better they've pretty much just been sitting there.

lioninrain,
You gave it a fair shot and have stayed with it long enough to know that you are not judging themprematurely. Take a good sized man (or 2) along with you, tell the sponges the same you have told us about
the parts for the car and and the computer and let them know (as nicely as you desire...or not) that you aretaking back what they are not using or misusing (something about not having the money to throw away onparts they will not use and the computer hindering them instead of its intended use as a help tool) and thatyou have exhausted your money and patience in trying to help them and will do no more.
I have helped many people and given some up to 6 chances but when they continued to abuse my kindness as
though it were a weakness I put them out of my life. It seems as though you have reached that point in thissituation.
Has the recent conjunction of Jupiter with Neptune and Chiron aspected anything in your natal or progressed
chart?
Bob
ps - They will not dry up and blow away.
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lioninrain
Member

Re: Gumption, will, etc.
« Reply #14 - on: 11.06.2009 at 10:54 [UT+1] »Quote:
Honestly though, it does sound hilarious in one sense

You know, it really does - since writing it all down for you all, it's plain as day!

Posts: 1554
Gender:Funny how when your tripping over it all in your mind, it seems more cloudy. They really are "nice" people
though, just to talk to them, but honestly I haven't been able to bring myself to go back over there since I saw
the car parts still sitting there, and have been feeling guilty about it - no more.
I think my conscience is clear on this one, or maybe it is karma.
Bob, Yes, I forget sometimes about transits, when they aren't directly over a natal planet, but the INF issquaring a lot of stuff for me.
They are more than welcome to the car parts - they may need them if they ever decide to get up & at 'em - myparting gift.
I don't think my friend would dream of taking the computer back either - he usually has 7 or 8of them, a hobby of sorts for him.

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