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Midpoints-specific questions (Read 967 times)

28buckMember

Midpoints-specific questions« on: 30.01.2012 at 00:43 [UT] »To all midpoint users,
I have not yet found anything in a text that says anything on conjunction of midpoints, that is something like
A/B=O/I where the = means conjunction, not o tThis must be a combining of energies of all four planets because aspects to that point will activate all four
planets at once.
Posts: 793
Gender:I have got my own notion of what this may mean but in natal interpretation I haven't seen it describedanywhere yet.
Does anyone know of a reference to this, or have their own notion of how to use it?
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Catalina

Ex Member

Re: Midpoints-specific questions« Reply #1 - on: 30.01.2012 at 01:33 [UT] »As far as a natal interpretation, I don't know, but I would be interested in your sharing how major transits
conjunct this point have manifested. I would think a very busy and significant time would be the result.

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28buckMember

Re: Midpoints-specific questions« Reply #2 - on: 30.01.2012 at 01:38 [UT] »I will have to research that a little.
I also have two other shared midpoints with planet pairs that are not conjunct, so I really am interested inhearing if anyone has experience with this configuration.

Posts: 793
Gender:Back to top
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James Alexander

Member

Re: Midpoints-specific questions« Reply #3 - on: 30.01.2012 at 08:34 [UT] »HelloYou have not mentioned what ORB these two midpoints are to each other.
Additionally, we don't have the added clues of how these midpoint planets are relating to each other, etc. (ie.
the rest of the chart as modifier)Posts: 423
Gender:From a strictly symbolic perspective, I would expect this to mean an undermining of your relationships throughinner rebellion, discontent, disillusion, and relationship issues which are different than they are perceived.
I'd be interested to hear what has happened when these two midpoints have been activated in the past.... it ismost likely some undermining, separative element rearing its head in relationships...
Peace
James

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Re: Midpoints-specific questions« Reply #4 - on: 30.01.2012 at 11:18 [UT] »28buck,I have also wondered this same thing. What about mid point trees, what's the concept there?
If a midpoint is an integration point between 2 principles, having them stacked on top of each other doesn't

Posts: 348
Gender:necesserally mean they directly interact. Maybe they just get triggered at the same time, or with the sameenergy in case of Natal aspects, and their effects would manifest simultaneously. Maybe there would be some
confusion about whats what in the individual or maybe it would be just like a person always having coffee with
toast, and never one without the other. Or ice-cream with anchovies if the planet energies aren't compatible.
Does that create a new flavour, or are you always aware that every icecream you have has anchovies in it.
I hope my musing don't sound completely idiotic.

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echo-echo

Member

Re: Midpoints-specific questions« Reply #5 - on: 30.01.2012 at 11:19 [UT] »Quote from James Alexander on 30.01.2012 at 08:34 [UT]:HelloYou have not mentioned what ORB these two midpoints are to each other.
Additionally, we don't have the added clues of how these midpoint planets are relating to each other, etc. (ie. the rest of the chart asmodifier)

Posts: 348
Gender:From a strictly symbolic perspective, I would expect this to mean an undermining of your relationships through inner rebellion, discontent,
disillusion, and relationship issues which are different than they are perceived.
I'd be interested to hear what has happened when these two midpoints have been activated in the past.... it is most likely someundermining, separative element rearing its head in relationships...
Peace
James

I was under the impression that 28 buck used that just as an example for the broader principle.
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James Alexander
Member

Re: Midpoints-specific questions« Reply #6 - on: 30.01.2012 at 11:33 [UT] »Hello echo x2
Re: "...just an example for the broader principle."
He mentioned "I also have two other shared midpoints with planet pairs that are not conjunct, so I really aminterested in hearing if anyone has experience with this configuration."
Posts: 423
Gender:There he seems to be specifically inquiring about "this configuration", ie. the specific one, NOT just a generalx/y = u/v question.
At any rate...understanding the specific case can often lead to a greater understanding of the general case.
In case not... realize that any x/y = u/v circumstance leads to two immediate cases where:
x+y-u=v
andx+y-v=u
These two can (and most likely will) have two different meanings. Both are satisfied because a 4th point (v infirst example, u in second) "satisfies" the first part of the equation. These will have specific individualized
meanings if u or v are personal points.
Peace
James

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28buck

Member

Re: Midpoints-specific questions« Reply #7 - on: 30.01.2012 at 13:02 [UT] »James,
Thanks for the response. The orbs are very tight, which is the only reason I would even consider them.
A/B=15f04 O/I=15f24 for one pair B/I=8f20 and E/O=8f25 for the other.
I also have midpoints at O/B_node=10g05 G/J=10g25 and G/F10g32.

Posts: 793
Gender:Let's get to the real point of this inquiry.
I am asking how having two or possibly more midpoints conjunct would be read in the natal chart when there isno planet at the midpoint itself. Sure transits will activate both of them. The question is, does having
midpoints conjunct in a natal chart in fact combine their energies in a significant way at all times, like a normal
aspect would?
I don't have much to research this with right now so I thought I would ask here if people who use midpoints
have considered this configuration and its meaning in the natal chart. I have some books on order and I will
research it further myself, but the question is interesting in its own right.
Although I didn't ask for a reading of what that specific combination would mean, by giving an answer you have
implicitly answered the first question in the affirmative, i.e., that they do combine in normal expression, which
is similar to my own thinking on this. Do you in fact hold this view?
Looking at a midpoint geometrically suggests it is a balance point where energies combine and then can easily
be tipped in either direction. Or they can balance each other, but it is like a zero point node combining theenergies, while the position of each planet is a node of maximum energy for that planet. The energy at thebalance or zero point is easily tilted in either direction, therefore very sensitive. Since different pairs share thesame sensitive balance point, the action or state of one pair can affect the state of the other.
I decided to list and look at all the midpoints in my chart and found there were these ones very close together,and I also wonder if this is common.
When Saturn last transited the 15f midpoints this was a time of great tension and a lot of behind the scenes
attempts to discredit me by team members at work. I did feel isolated and attacked but was eventuallyvindicated. There were no significant outward events at that time and I was not very aware of what was
happening behind the scenes at that time. This point is in the early part of my 5th house, but I haven't seenhouses used much in midpoint analysis thus far. Do you use them?
You said this:"From a strictly symbolic perspective, I would expect this to mean an undermining of your relationships
through inner rebellion, discontent, disillusion, and relationship issues which are different than they areperceived."
I would have to mostly agree with this statement but I was a bit take back with the negative interpretationright off the bat. Personally I will normally give the positive and negative expressions together and evenemphasize the positive until I hear more. But maybe there is a reason for sticking with the negative when a"malefic" is involved, such as human nature easily falling into the lowest possible expression available
I'lljust shake that one off!!
At any rate I will tell you that that time was definitely pretty close to hell and made me rethink the kind ofenvironments I am willing to put myself into and to examine my part in the whole mess. In the end it was apositive change that came out of the resolution of the situation.
Did the "relationships" key word you used come from the A/B midpoint? Although relationships were involved
they were work relationships and not even very friendship like at any time previous to the covert warfare.

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James Alexander
Member

Re: Midpoints-specific questions« Reply #8 - on: 30.01.2012 at 14:19 [UT] »Hello 28buck,
Re: "...by giving an answer you have implicitly answered the first question in the affirmative, i.e., that they do
combine in normal expression, which is similar to my own thinking on this. Do you in fact hold this view?"

Posts: 423

Yes, however, I don't use them that way. In other words, two midpoints being conjunct is not something that I
would normally ever consider in a natal reading. On the other hand, please know that most Uranian astrologers
I believe would very much say that they are probably significant.

Gender:For example, if you have Sun/Moon = Venus/Mars we can see that as:
Sun + Moon - Venus = MarsandSun + Moon - Mars = Venus
Though these both are derived from Sun/Moon = Venus/Mars, they are different in meaning.
Additionally, in your example, Sun/Moon = Uranus/Neptune, remember that Sun/Moon is an intensely personal
midpoint...it is concerned directly with relationships, with how you resolve the male-female split within, etc.
Uranus/Neptune (involving no personal points within itself) is a generational midpoint. Everyone born on thesame day as you will have Uranus/Neptune midpoint in basically the same location. The Sun/Moon will be quite
different with just a few hours difference in birthtime.
Though I would not tend to use these in Natal Analysis (there are way enough factors already to answer mostquestions), it must/should be noted that ANY Transiting, Primary Directed, Secondary Progressed, Age
Harmonic, etc. that contacts one of those midpoints will be simultaneously contacting the others. The second
factor may well show itself as a MODIFIER in how you experience activation of the first factor. In that sense,
these two DO have a special relevance with each other.
Re: Positive/Negative
Yes, of course there are just as many positive manifestations possible as negative. Uranus/Neptune could relate
to anything from temporary loss of consciousness to lack of emotional balance on the "negative" side to inner
illumination and sudden spiritual insights on the "positive" side. As Sun/Moon relates to relationships and ismade up of two personal points, the interaction of transpersonal issues is more often stressful than calming,
more often felt and remembered for its disruptive effects...however, of course, both are always possible. Often
there are events that relate to both the positive and negative sides concurrently.
Re: "This point is in the early part of my 5th house, but I haven't seen houses used much in midpoint analysis
thus far. Do you use them?"No, personally, I do not use them this way. They are most commonly used in terms of modifiers for specific(single-factor) points. Additionally, certain ones are very informative. If you have any points = Sun/Moon, that
3rd point is probably very telling in terms of issues in relationships. Take two different charts, one with Jupiter= Sun/Moon and the other with Saturn = Sun/Moon. (Of course other factors in the chart can significantly
modify this, but) normally, the Saturn pictured person will have more suffering, loneliness, separative elementsin their relationship experiences, where the Jupiter pictured person will have more happy, expansive experiencesin relationships. [This is subject to the "all other things being equal", which of course never actually exists in
the real world.]
Re: Sun/Moon as per relationships
This normally relates to romantic type relationships, but is not limited to that. We all have an internal split
between the more maternal/"female"/yin elements and more paternal/"male"/yang elements. We try to resolve
this split in various ways, but especially through relating to people so that the weaker (projected) part is playedout through someone else, with the ultimate idea being a balance created. The person may work this out in his
romantic relationships, but that is not to say that this issue isn't also worked out in other relationships (work,
other family relationships, etc.) as well.
Hope this helps!

Peace
James
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28buck

Member

Re: Midpoints-specific questions« Reply #9 - on: 30.01.2012 at 14:50 [UT] »James,
Wow what a great post. Thank you for sharing all of that, and it does make sense.
May I ask where you stand on the inner experience/outer event continuum?
What I mean by this is a transiting planet makes a contact and most of the time it is delineated as such andPosts: 793
Gender:such event may/will happen as an outer event, but it may be an inner event that happens, like an experience,revelation, transformation, or even resisted then resulting in a lot of suffering.

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James Alexander
Member

Re: Midpoints-specific questions« Reply #10 - on: 30.01.2012 at 15:40 [UT] »Hello 28buckThank you! Glad you got some usage out of what I wrote and that you find some relevance in it...
Re: Inner experience / outer event
Well, there are many theories...and I will approach it differently... I will say that it doesn't matter.
Posts: 423
Gender:No, I'm not daft... Any more, I don't work too hard to try and predict concrete events (open-ended events
that have no definite start or end). What is much more important is the MEANING that is trying to be
imparted, not the events.
It is like the difference between what is really wrong with someone (medically) and the symptoms that theypresent.
If you have Pluto conjoining your natal Venus... this signifies a change in values... a restructuring of the priority
list of your LIFE. This can happen in many, many ways. You might have a long relationship that first worked
for you...later became habit...and now, is holding you back from your development. Many things can happen
both internally and externally that can "push" you to change this internal sense of what is important to you.
Someone you're in a relationship with could die... you could come into a large amount of money.... etc. etc.
etc. Yes, the Astrology will very likely help you see what is most likely, I am only saying that that particular
event, though seemingly important to the client, is actually secondary in importance compared to what the
Universe is "imparting" to the person. Remember, this symbolism can turn up in several different ways, bothinner realizations and outer events. You might predict correctly two important ones and completely miss themost important one. The real importance is the MEANING of what is happening, not specifically what ishappening. (this is slightly controversial...many will disagree, but you can read that in their answers to yourquestion)
Saturn comes to the Sun, generally, your ego needs are not being met in your current circumstance. You needa different method to "shine" before the world and Saturn comes along and gives you a feeling of lack TO
INDUCE CHANGE. The inner realizations and outer events are of course important...and in my perspective,these inner realizations are much more important, because they have the potential to color your perspective
over everything that happens...but really it is this idea of pointing yourself in a different direction so that you
are in a position to get more recognition, to more fully come into your own, etc.
Now, of course, there are often practical questions in a reading where you have to try and find a usefulanswer...but in a general sense, they are all (forming aspect by forming aspect) trying to "force" your gaze in acertain direction. To alter YOU... often in order for that to happen, your outer world has to change in order tomore fully make this happen. Uranus coming to the Node can suggest many possible scenarios... you mightsuddenly end a relationship... you might suddenly start one...someone in your circle might even die, but what
we can say FOR SURE is that the themes of Uranus (personal individuation, freedom, progressing) arecontacting a point that relates to your associations, especially familial ones...and so ANY of those previously
listed events could happen or several of them, but they're ALL for the purpose of injecting the parts of your lifethat relate to the Nodes, with a big bolt of liberating freedom, expressed by Uranus.
Many things can happen... if there are many open-ended circumstances in the person's life, it is very likely that
one won't see all of them through the astrology and (my point) even if you could, that's not what is so
ultimately important (except to control freaks)
Look back at the last major transiting factors that really stirred things up in your life. Look at the events (tothe best that they can be understood) and try to see how they were leading somewhere, how there was a
PHILOSOPHICAL/PERSPECTIVE push along certain lines. Seeing this push is virtually always at least as
important as any SYMPTOM of what is at work in the larger picture. I guess my advice is...use this method to
not emphasize knowledge as much to use what knowledge is there to lead to wisdom.
Take care,James

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IP Loggedpracticalastrology

Ex Member

Re: Midpoints-specific questions« Reply #11 - on: 30.01.2012 at 19:06 [UT] »Hi 28,
I have Sun/Moon and Mars/Venus midpoints totally conjunct within seconds at 8 45 Taurus. This has broughtme very strong relationships with Taurus folk though not necessarily people with planets at that precise degree.

As a Sun Leo and Moon Aq, I do not resonate with that sign too well so I always wondered what the....were allthese Taurus people doing in my life, until I discovered midpoints, Well the midpoints show they are not thereby accident, and with Pluto in Cap about to trine that point I might figure out what the hell they are for..
However as I was born with Sun opp Moon and Mars square Venus, it is unlikely I would find that midpoint
easy, if it were the shared midpoint of a trine and sextile then I'd be flying or flowing, but this one is awkward
to the same degree that I find my own integration awkward.
Well I never got that far at explaining it all to myself, so thanks! Hope it helps you too
PA
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ThomasMember

Re: Midpoints-specific questions« Reply #12 - on: 31.01.2012 at 03:25 [UT] »Quote from 28buck on 30.01.2012 at 00:43 [UT]:To all midpoint users,
I have not yet found anything in a text that says anything on conjunction of midpoints, that is something likemeans conjunction, notPosts: 222

A/B=O/I where the =otThis must be a combining of energies of all four planets because aspects to that point will activate all four planets at once.
I have got my own notion of what this may mean but in natal interpretation I haven't seen it described anywhere yet.
Does anyone know of a reference to this, or have their own notion of how to use it?
ThanksI think this is noted in the books by Noel Tyl and by Don McBroom in "Midpoints". You can go to Tyl's site andcheck with the forum members there.
it does indicate activating all four planets at once and adding the readings together, modifying one another.
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IP Loggedecho-echo

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Re: Midpoints-specific questions« Reply #13 - on: 31.01.2012 at 07:54 [UT] »Quote from James Alexander on 30.01.2012 at 11:33 [UT]:Hello echo x2
Re: "...just an example for the broader principle."
He mentioned "I also have two other shared midpoints with planet pairs that are not conjunct, so I really am interested in hearing if
anyone has experience with this configuration."

Posts: 348
Gender:There he seems to be specifically inquiring about "this configuration", ie. the specific one, NOT just a general x/y = u/v question.
At any rate...understanding the specific case can often lead to a greater understanding of the general case.
In case not... realize that any x/y = u/v circumstance leads to two immediate cases where:
x +y - u=v
and
x +y - v =u
These two can (and most likely will) have two different meanings. Both are satisfied because a 4th point (v in first example, u in second)"satisfies" the first part of the equation. These will have specific individualized meanings if u or v are personal points.
Peace
James

Thanks for you reply James,
Turning it into a mathematical formula has helped me understand. But just to clarify, does that mean that each"double midpoint" have four alternate interpretations as each planet can be made to sit on the other side of theequal sign? How can a single midpoint have one interpretation and a double have four? Which one would you
use in what case? Or is it just a matter of emphasis for clarity.
What am I missing?
I have C/G =F/I as my closest set, so if you like to use that as an example Ill take what's given
does that make me mentally C dull G and and hopelessly confused I when trying to broaden my perspective

F?

Since my E sits 45 degrees (Celcius) away from this point, does that mean I get increasingly frustrated atmyself for not getting it?
Just joking
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James Alexander
Member

Re: Midpoints-specific questions« Reply #14 - on: 31.01.2012 at 12:02 [UT] »Hello echo-echo
Thanks!
This info was basically paraphrased from an article by Arlene Kramer.

Posts: 423

The particular planetary pictures are an answer to a question. It depends on the question, just what you arelooking at to find the answer.

Gender:In the example we were discussing...yes, there ARE four different planetary pictures possible from that one
dual-midpoint. To a Uranian astrologer, each one of those left sides of the equation can have a specificmeaning. The right hand side "answers" that particular question.
Remember that in a normal midpoint, we are saying that the point midway between the two is an "emphasis
point" for the themes relating to the two planets together. With the dual-midpoint, yes, I would say these two
midpoints are "bound together" in a way, but there are other ways of looking at it.
Look at some of the online resources for Uranian Astrology and you should see that there are MANY planetary
pictures of the form, A + B - C means THIS. [Janus software (and perhaps others) has the ability to show you
the reference point for formula of the A + B - C nature...showing you where point D is on the dial.] If A + B C has a particular meaning, then a 4th point will answer the WHAT about that particular picture. Additionally,
say there is no planet at this point that is D, then the planetary picture can still be satisfied by dynamic planets
coming to this location. In this case, it answers not only the WHAT (sometimes) but also the WHEN.
I must mention that I am not what I would call a Uranian astrologer, though I do use some of their methods
from time to time.
When reading for someone, if they have (say) Saturn = Sun/Moon, then I will be very aware of that whenreading for them. If they have midpoint = midpoint, then I very, very likely will not be aware of that particularconnection. (We do have to limit out some of the more secondary factors so as not to be mislead from the real
"bells" [Noel Tyl] in the chart.)
Still, if I were examing my chart for the umteenth time, I may very well be looking at something like that justto see what I might glean about it. (ie. I am already super-aware of all the main elements of my chart, so
perhaps could augment SOME element of it, by this added info)
Re: mathematical formulaYeah, that helped me too!
Peace
James
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IP Loggedecho-echo

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Re: Midpoints-specific questions« Reply #15 - on: 31.01.2012 at 12:49 [UT] »Quote from James Alexander on 31.01.2012 at 12:02 [UT]:Hello echo-echo
Thanks!
This info was basically paraphrased from an article by Arlene Kramer.
The particular planetary pictures are an answer to a question. It depends on the question, just what you are looking at to find the answer.

Posts: 348
Gender:In the example we were discussing...yes, there ARE four different planetary pictures possible from that one dual-midpoint. To a Uranianastrologer, each one of those left sides of the equation can have a specific meaning. The right hand side "answers" that particular question.
Remember that in a normal midpoint, we are saying that the point midway between the two is an "emphasis point" for the themes
relating to the two planets together. With the dual-midpoint, yes, I would say these two midpoints are "bound together" in a way, butthere are other ways of looking at it.
Look at some of the online resources for Uranian Astrology and you should see that there are MANY planetary pictures of the form, A + B- C means THIS. [Janus software (and perhaps others) has the ability to show you the reference point for formula of the A + B - C
nature...showing you where point D is on the dial.] If A + B - C has a particular meaning, then a 4th point will answer the WHAT aboutthat particular picture. Additionally, say there is no planet at this point that is D, then the planetary picture can still be satisfied bydynamic planets coming to this location. In this case, it answers not only the WHAT (sometimes) but also the WHEN.
I must mention that I am not what I would call a Uranian astrologer, though I do use some of their methods from time to time.
When reading for someone, if they have (say) Saturn = Sun/Moon, then I will be very aware of that when reading for them. If they have
midpoint = midpoint, then I very, very likely will not be aware of that particular connection. (We do have to limit out some of the moresecondary factors so as not to be mislead from the real "bells" [Noel Tyl] in the chart.)
Still, if I were examing my chart for the umteenth time, I may very well be looking at something like that just to see what I might glean
about it. (ie. I am already super-aware of all the main elements of my chart, so perhaps could augment SOME element of it, by thisadded info)
Re: mathematical formulaYeah, that helped me too!
Peace
James

Thank you for your reply, that cleared things up tremendously! I agree about leaving such 'obscurities' until
after the fundaments of the chart are understood. I tried to tackle midpoints too early once in my astrologicaljourney and it left me reeling with too much information, so I thought it was overkill and left them. Now,
several years later, I've chewed on the 'meat and potatoes' (if youre wondering about the constant foodanalogies I have dAsc with B in the 3rd) of my chart for so long I decided to give it another go. And behold!
Its amazing how they have given so much rich detail and specifics. One thing Ive noticed is a sense of
immediacy if I can put it that way about the interpretations. Its like they describe real time mental processes for me anyway - it has a more practical applied feel. Having said that its just my initial impression.
Perhaps the basics of the chart allow one to ask the right questions from the planetary pictures/midpoints. I will
look more deeply into Uranian astrology now - a new Google journey!
Thanks again
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Maggy Cassin
Member

Re: Midpoints-specific questions« Reply #16 - on: 31.01.2012 at 13:27 [UT] »Interesting question......as are all the answers. In my experience if you have a planet at a midpoint it is a sortof feature of your personality - say Sun/Moon=Ur - distinct. However, if there is NO planet there, I have foundthat transits (to that exceptionally personal midpont) can often trigger an "out of character" experience to the

Posts: 244

person. So A/B (with no planet at m/p) is transited by O the person would behave in a O way or havepersonal dealings with O types - or perhaps on a material level start a computer course/think about studying
astrology/ up sticks and move to another place. Because its a transit, it passes, and does not remain a greatfeature of the character/chart - or is that too simplistic?
It does seem to complicate the picture by having multiples there, or perhaps makes the meaning more subtle
to grasp?

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Alice Portman

Member

Re: Midpoints-specific questions« Reply #17 - on: 31.01.2012 at 23:26 [UT] »In these situations people almost always associate with others who have a planet on that midpoint structure.
These people activate it and make it manifest in your own life. So they tend to work according to the natureof the activating planet of the other person.
Posts: 2541
Gender:Therefore these one of the 'relationship' factors to consider when you are doing synastry.
Like many people I have few of these degrees that are activated by midpoints but not by a planet or angle,
however the degrees are prominent in the charts of my family and friends and respond very strongly totransits, progressions, directions, age harmonics etc., in my own life.
If you are doing rectification this really, really needs to be considered because these 'empty' degrees can bevery powerful indeed if they have more than two midpoint structures activating them and/or if they involve thelights or the rulers of angles and especially if the family charts have these degrees. If you don't consider them
they can give a false positive to a time of birth.
For example, I have what I call a 'disaster degree' in my chart. It was activated in the Cyclone I went throughby transit and I am always cautious of anyone who has a planet there because the degree has come up so often
in problematical areas. This empty degree is the focus for a few midpoints, including Pluto/Ascendant andSaturn/Chiron. When I found my husband's time of birth I was beyond words when I discovered this was his
Vertex degree
Needless to say, the marriage was a disaster!
Alice

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28buckMember

Re: Midpoints-specific questions« Reply #18 - on: 01.02.2012 at 03:17 [UT] »Tosh,
I did use the example of a transit activating a midpoint, and if two midpoints are conjunct, then it would
activate both necessarily. But I was not asking nor thinking about one activating another. I am asking about a
combining of energies. Activating implies an action, something added. My question is about combining, always
being in relationship.
And I am asking if anyone uses it or understands it this way.
Posts: 793
Gender:

The description of planetary pictures by James does seem to be working in this way, but I have yet to readabout them from the source materials.

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Alice Portman

Member

Re: Midpoints-specific questions« Reply #19 - on: 01.02.2012 at 04:23 [UT] »I am trying to remember back to the early days when I learned Cosmobiology. I think Doris Greaves worked
with these structures but am not sure. I have always used them in the way I described above.

Posts: 2541
Gender:Pam Rowe was a long term pupil of Doris Greaves and is a skilled Cosmobiologist so she might be able to help
you in this area. Her contact details are here: http://www.astrologycosmobiology.com.au/contact.htm
Alice

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Re: Midpoints-specific questions« Reply #20 - on: 01.02.2012 at 08:52 [UT] »28buck,I am sorry, it seems that I misunderstood your OP question. I will try to delete my previous post so as to avoid
further confusions.

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Lennox Cap

Member

Re: Midpoints-specific questions« Reply #21 - on: 01.02.2012 at 09:33 [UT] »Hey There 28Buck
I have just started researching midpoints and have found some good websites ... and have purchased the PDF
books on this one www.midpointastrology.com

and they are great reading

Sorry, I don't know how to copy links but here are the websiteswww.claytentylor.com
Posts: 990
Gender:www.cosmoastrology.com
www.midpointastrology.com
Also, Cafe Astrology will do a midpoint interpretation chart with three months transits, solar arcs andprogressions for about $6. I checked mine with my solarfire program and it seems accurate and certainly
according to them I have amazing things coming up so if nothing else it was a very happy positive read.
Good luck

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Maggy Cassin
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Re: Midpoints-specific questions« Reply #22 - on: 01.02.2012 at 10:49 [UT] »Alice, I had never thought about the relationship aspect of midpoints so deeply as you have done. Also that's agood tip for rectification indeed to see what happened when transits occur. My most noticeable one is at 19 Ar= A/B, O/K, A/O,C/E,D/K,B/K. The asc falls exactly on the midpoint of all of them. In my mind
most of them give a similar message, i.e. a lot of contact, association with others but have to admit transits ofPosts: 244

the heavies there have brought huge changes personally, as they would.
Also at 4 Ar is another big line up BUT no planet/angle.

E/O, G/J,D/E,K/MC,O/I,A/MC,B/E - when

J transited this point right on time end of 2010 my husband had an eye operation in which they administered
the wrong gas behind his eye and basically blew it up making him permanently blind in one eye. He lost his job(working for a major company world wide where travel was vital) he was unable to do that, was retired early,
the awful battle for the pathetic "compensation" still goes on more than 2 years later. My point is: because I did
not have a personal point there, it happened to him (i.e. someone else) though of course the effects all roundhave been drastic (try living with a high flier who now makes it his hobby to look what is going mouldy up theback of the fridge whence he has never looked before!!!) . I do think the story is well signified in the midpoint
tree here.
This is a long way of asking the question: does having a planet/angle there mean it is more personal to you,than if the point is empty and you experience it but as a consequence of relationship?
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James Alexander

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Re: Midpoints-specific questions« Reply #23 - on: 01.02.2012 at 12:12 [UT] »Hello Alice,
That link, http://www.astrologycosmobiology.com.au/contact.htm , shows up as a dead link.
Remember when it was last active?
Peace
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28buckMember

Re: Midpoints-specific questions« Reply #24 - on: 01.02.2012 at 13:34 [UT] »Quote from _Tosh_ on 01.02.2012 at 08:52 [UT]:
28buck,I am sorry, it seems that I misunderstood your OP question. I will try to delete my previous post so as to avoid further confusions.

Oh no need to delete anything. I was just clarifying the main question in the inquiry.
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28buck

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Re: Midpoints-specific questions« Reply #25 - on: 01.02.2012 at 14:47 [UT] »Quote from James Alexander on 01.02.2012 at 12:12 [UT]:Hello Alice,
That link, http://www.astrologycosmobiology.com.au/contact.htm , shows up as a dead link.
Remember when it was last active?

Posts: 793
Gender:

Peace
James

If you drop everything after the .com.au then it takes you to the main website.
The contact page must have been removed.
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Alice Portman
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Re: Midpoints-specific questions« Reply #26 - on: 01.02.2012 at 22:17 [UT] »Quote from Maggy Cassin on 01.02.2012 at 10:49 [UT]:
Alice, I had never thought about the relationship aspect of midpoints so deeply as you have done. Also that's a good tip for rectificationindeed to see what happened when transits occur. My most noticeable one is at 19 Ar =A/B, O/K, A/O,C/E,D/K,B/K. The asc

falls exactly on the midpoint of all of them. In my mind most of them give a similar message, i.e. a lot of contact, association withothers but have to admit transits of the heavies there have brought huge changes personally, as they would.

Posts: 2541
Gender:EO GJDEK

OIA

BE

J

Also at 4 Ar is another big line up BUT no planet/angle.
/ ,/ , / , /MC, / , /MC, /- whentransited this point righton time end of 2010 my husband had an eye operation in which they administered the wrong gas behind his eye and basically blew it up
making him permanently blind in one eye. He lost his job (working for a major company world wide where travel was vital) he was unable
to do that, was retired early, the awful battle for the pathetic "compensation" still goes on more than 2 years later. My point is: because I
did not have a personal point there, it happened to him (i.e. someone else) though of course the effects all round have been drastic (tryliving with a high flier who now makes it his hobby to look what is going mouldy up the back of the fridge whence he has never looked
before!!!) . I do think the story is well signified in the midpoint tree here.
This is a long way of asking the question: does having a planet/angle there mean it is more personal to you, than if the point is empty
and you experience it but as a consequence of relationship?

What and interesting and sad story Maggie Cassin, I hope your poor husband finds some other outlet for hisenergy!
Does your husband have a planet or angle or house cusp on your empty midpoint tree?
I think that these points will naturally work with transits, progressions, directions etc, in the way you
mentioned in a previous post and if people consider midpoints it will answer quite a few mysteries as to whysome degrees respond to transits when there is nothing there.
Otherwise, they are your midpoints so are personal to you, but seem to need to be activated by someone orsomething else and you relate to that person according to the nature of those midpoints. For example, my
Pluto/Ascendant-Saturn/Chiron midpoint tree is quite a heavy one so if someone had natal Mars there it ishighly likely that that person would bring upheaval and heartbreak through a Mars action - maybe a car
accident, or a fire or a sharp object and this would be personal to me, but activated by the Mars person. If
someone had their natal Jupiter at that point it is possible they would be helpful or protective, or evenstimulate a healing process. So I would feel quite uncomfortable around the Mars person and enjoy the Jupiterperson.
The contacts seem to work quite similarly to the midpoint interpretations in Ebertin's classic, "The Combinationof Stellar Influences" .
It interests me that I naturally avoid people with heavy duty planets there and, though I am at times drawn tothose with the Sun there, it never quite works out - there is often a misunderstanding of some kind.
Alice
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28buck

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Re: Midpoints-specific questions« Reply #27 - on: 02.02.2012 at 01:50 [UT] »Quote from Lennox Cap on 01.02.2012 at 09:33 [UT]:Hey There 28Buck
I have just started researching midpoints and have found some good websites ... and have purchased the PDF books on this one
www.midpointastrology.com and they are great reading
Sorry, I don't know how to copy links but here are the websites

Posts: 793
Gender:www.claytentylor.com
www.cosmoastrology.com
www.midpointastrology.com
Also, Cafe Astrology will do a midpoint interpretation chart with three months transits, solar arcs and progressions for about $6. I checkedmine with my solarfire program and it seems accurate and certainly according to them I have amazing things coming up so if nothing else
it was a very happy positive read.
Good luckThanks Lennox Cap,
These look interesting.
The links showed up just fine.
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Maggy Cassin
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Re: Midpoints-specific questions« Reply #28 - on: 02.02.2012 at 21:06 [UT] »Alice, I'm astounded.....I never looked at midpoint comparisons - no, he has no planet/angle/cusp for my
empty midpoint tree but my first, biggest one - his asc. is 19 Cap, while my main midpoint is 19 Ar so I am
totally amazed by this! it makes huge sense, but I have never looked at midpoints from a relating point ofview. Thanks, life will never be the same...! I use midpoints for every chart I do and often they provide that
Posts: 244

extra eureka moment when I feel a chart finally makes sense. But its a whole new world in the light of what
you've said. I suppose your developed instinct tells you when a tricky relationship stirs a midpoint - I'd havethought the Sun was good but I suppose it could give a dominated feeling on the other hand.... I do think all
midpoints are quite subtle except for those with a planet at A/B, B/C and E/G, as well as those involving
the ascendant.

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28buckMember

Re: Midpoints-specific questions« Reply #29 - on: 03.02.2012 at 19:29 [UT] »Quote from Maggy Cassin on 01.02.2012 at 10:49 [UT]:
Alice, I had never thought about the relationship aspect of midpoints so deeply as you have done. Also that's a good tip for rectificationindeed to see what happened when transits occur. My most noticeable one is at 19 Ar =A/B, O/K, A/O,C/E,D/K,B/K. The asc

falls exactly on the midpoint of all of them. In my mind most of them give a similar message, i.e. a lot of contact, association withothers but have to admit transits of the heavies there have brought huge changes personally, as they would.
Also at 4 Ar is another big line up BUT no planet/angle.

Posts: 793
Gender:

E/O, G/J,D/E,K/MC,O/I,A/MC,B/E - when J transited this point righton time end of 2010 my husband had an eye operation in which they administered the wrong gas behind his eye and basically blew it up
making him permanently blind in one eye. He lost his job (working for a major company world wide where travel was vital) he was unable
to do that, was retired early, the awful battle for the pathetic "compensation" still goes on more than 2 years later. My point is: because I
did not have a personal point there, it happened to him (i.e. someone else) though of course the effects all round have been drastic (tryliving with a high flier who now makes it his hobby to look what is going mouldy up the back of the fridge whence he has never looked
before!!!) . I do think the story is well signified in the midpoint tree here.
This is a long way of asking the question: does having a planet/angle there mean it is more personal to you, than if the point is empty
and you experience it but as a consequence of relationship?

Maggy,
When you write 19a= string of midpoints, is this a 90 degree sort so that anything within an orb of 19
degrees Cardinal sign will be = this midpoint?
I am reading a book that used the 8th harmonic for those trees, so twice as many possible points are =. Thissoes make some sense, but for now I am just sticking with the actual conjunction when I consider A/B=O/I
for example.
Get the big fish from the net first I would say
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Maggy Cassin
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Re: Midpoints-specific questions« Reply #30 - on: 03.02.2012 at 20:54 [UT] »28Buck - hello.....I was taught to reduce everything to 45 deg (same as 90 really but tighter for convenience).
In other words, all planets and combinations are reduced to between 0 Aries and 15 Taurus. I have an ancient
program which calculates this and find it critical in a natal chart to look at which midpoints are highly focal. Of

Posts: 244

course (the bugbear) is that the time is accurate, even if minutes out an important midpoint can be missed.
We used ONLY midpoints within one degree - i.e. 0 Aries to 0'58 say - they have to be that "strength" as often
you get something either side. In the end I suppose it is emphasis we're after as usually there is enough goingon in a chart but the closest aspects are more fundamental - in my experience (but in the hallowed footsteps ofCharles Carter etc who suggested tight orbs as a way of eliminating the noise so to speak, and concentrating on
the essence). This is a good thread.....

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Re: Midpoints-specific questions« Reply #31 - on: 03.02.2012 at 20:56 [UT] »28 Buck: Sorry, I did not answer your actual question - yes, anything at 19 deg of any cardinal will aspect that
midpoint - its qurie opps and conjs we're interested in - the "hard" aspects which produce concrete events.

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Maggy Cassin
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Re: Midpoints-specific questions« Reply #32 - on: 03.02.2012 at 20:57 [UT] »squares (opps, conjs) that was meant to be!

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28buckMember

Re: Midpoints-specific questions« Reply #33 - on: 04.02.2012 at 00:09 [UT] »Maggy,
Ok that's what I thought but just wanted to be sure
I haven't gone that far yet because I am still digesting the symbolism of the midpoints and contacts by direct
conjunction. This is quite interesting stuff. I am reading a book called Harmonics, Midpoints and AstroCartography , that may not be exactly correct but the closest by memory that I can come right now. They use
the 45 degree sort so each 45 degree segment is mapped on top of each other and then to a a midpoint tree.
Posts: 793
Gender:Yes, I very much agree with the tighter orbs than most folks do to "get the big fish first"
One of the things I read and am working on is to look at the one or two closest midpoint contacts. I have avery very close A 11h57 = C/D 11h59 midpoint contact.
But I just don't see this in myself at all. I can get inspired and write some poetry, but I am also kind of grizzly
at times, or even a lot more of the time some would say
Another very close conjunction is I 28g29 = A/E 28g12
For some reason I am having trouble seeing this in myself so far. I have read the standard meanings in a coupleof books, but it just isn't "grocking" right now, if you know what I mean

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Maggy Cassin
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Re: Midpoints-specific questions« Reply #34 - on: 04.02.2012 at 07:53 [UT] ».....I'm wondering how old you are 28Buck - that could be a reason you don't recognise the signatures of theecombinations (yet). Any planet in h adds more than a tint of waspishness, and sometimes downright sarcasm
and black thoughts! but the D in that midpoint probably softens this in your case - what I suggest (to comePosts: 244

to grips) is to go back through the ephemeris and look at transits to that point (12h) by planets at the same
degree in b ek and see what happened then. The A/E= I may be hard to grasp because its I after all,but its related to your sense of being masculine - perhaps you're an animal lover, or secretly give money tobeggars on the streets because there is compassion in this one- you could test transits to 28 g mn#o in thesame way....they may relate to actual events, or (now Alice opened my eyes) you experienced them throughanother, i.e. a consequence of a relationship.
A good book to read is Harmonics in Astrology by John Addey. On the inside cover of mine I found aquotation from a painting exhibition (The Spiritual in Art) I went to here in the Hague in 1987 - it was said byMario Merz (painter) in 1883
"Numbers and geometric bodies as in figures like circles, crosses, squares, carry within themselves specificoccult and ethical knowledge. Knowledge of numbers imparts knowledge of the Universe itself." Profound, isn't
it, and especially in relation to midpoints I feel.

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28buck

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Re: Midpoints-specific questions« Reply #35 - on: 04.02.2012 at 16:03 [UT] »Quote from Maggy Cassin on 04.02.2012 at 07:53 [UT]:The

A/E= I may be hard to grasp because its I after all, but its related to your sense of being masculine - perhaps you're an animallover, or secretly give money to beggars on the streets because there is compassion in this one,,,,,,

Posts: 793
Gender:This symbolism I had not put together yet Maggy. This statement of yours is true. I do both. Both of our dogs
we got from the animal shelter and I donate to it and give to the needy. I give money beggars because theircondition touches me. Funny how some simple symbolism can be so completely accurate sometimes
I am naturally sensitive to unfairness (28g=I=A/E) and I will go out of my way to protect or stick up forsomeone being treated unfairly, or under attack, and this does mean physical danger at times. There issomething of the protector of the abused, or even just unfairly treated. I have always been that way. No
thinking is required. Action is involved. Very nice Maggy, I think I am getting the meaning of it. I can see thearea of my life that it manifests as. It is no longer an abstract concept. (insert here the smiley for gratitude)
Would you like to give the Am C/D at try? it is the closest of all midpoint contacts and involves the A andtwo personal planets.
Both the degree of my A and I are already important points because of what they are and other aspects tothem, like C ruler of AC mI. I am trying to really "grock" this --get the "gestalt" of it, if that meaningful toyou.
-- a side note, the book "A Stranger in a Strange Land" is where "grock" is defined as a complete knowing.
Gestalt is not so exact, but somewhat similarGreat read by the way, although it may offend some very straight christian folks.
Don't be fooled by the innocent sounding and open minded questioning. I am a geezer (56 yrs) with many
years of experience\Thanks

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Maggy Cassin
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Re: Midpoints-specific questions« Reply #36 - on: 05.02.2012 at 08:57 [UT] »28buck: Grock sounds very Lord of the Rings to me........good word. In midpoints all signs are irrelevant - it ispure number, thus the planets are in their natural (unaspected) state. Imagine C leaning on a lamppost at thecorner of the street, smoking, jumping from foot to foot, looking around nervously, eyeing the service station
wondering if he could do a quick grab and run job (he's young, the trickster and opportunist and has no
Posts: 244

character until coloured by another planet). Along comes D in a georgous dress and she smiles at him andspeaks to him. He is immediately different because she likes him so he is cooperative and chatty, curious about
her. Here comes the A striding confidently down the middle of the road. They notice his purpose and D calls
out "Where are you off to with such speed on a sunny day?" He goes over to them - its a known fact (even in
astrology) that a woman's presence makes men behave in a more civil manner!!! "I'm off to the courthouse toadvise on a dispute" he says. "Take us with you!" cries C, who can spot the holes in the opposition's argument
at 500 paces and is deeply curious.....D smiles, puts her hand on his arm and says "We'll make sure everyone
gets a fair deal".
That's it really - this one would be in the charts of mediators, negotiators, counsellors who look for the middle
ground (= D keeping the balance) after listening (C) to all sides and then A makes the judgment. If E had
been in the mix instead of D you'd get an adversarial type, talking up the difficulties/stretching the fight.
Ebertin's midpoints are wonderful but sometimes a bit old fashioned - so this is a good way of visualising them
- the planets are really focal here in combination with number - pure pure!!!

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Re: Midpoints-specific questions« Reply #37 - on: 05.02.2012 at 11:18 [UT] »Quote from Maggy Cassin on 03.02.2012 at 20:57 [UT]:squares (opps, conjs) that was meant to be!

Add to them semi-squares, sesquiquadrates, inconjuncts, quindecile (165 dgr)
Here is a link for some further investigations.
Some MP are considered more important, f.ex AB and planets involved with the luminaries.

http://cafeastrology.com/astrologytopics/midpoints.html
Bibbe

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28buckMember

Re: Midpoints-specific questions« Reply #38 - on: 05.02.2012 at 16:23 [UT] »Quote from Maggy Cassin on 05.02.2012 at 08:57 [UT]:
28buck: Grock sounds very Lord of the Rings to me........good word. In midpoints all signs are irrelevant - it is pure number, thus theplanets are in their natural (unaspected) state. Imagine

C leaning on a lamppost at the corner of the street, smoking, jumping from footto foot, looking around nervously, eyeing the service station wondering if he could do a quick grab and run job (he's young, the tricksterand opportunist and has no character until coloured by another planet). Along comes

D in a georgous dress and she smiles at him andA

speaks to him. He is immediately different because she likes him so he is cooperative and chatty, curious about her. Here comes thestriding confidently down the middle of the road. They notice his purpose andPosts: 793
Gender:D calls out "Where are you off to with such speed on asunny day?" He goes over to them - its a known fact (even in astrology) that a woman's presence makes men behave in a more civilmanner!!! "I'm off to the courthouse to advise on a dispute" he says. "Take us with you!" cries, who can spot the holes in the
opposition's argument at 500 paces and is deeply curious.....

C
D smiles, puts her hand on his arm and says "We'll make sure everyone getsa fair deal".

D keeping theC) to all sides and then A makes the judgment. If E had been in the mix instead of D you'd get an adversarial

That's it really - this one would be in the charts of mediators, negotiators, counsellors who look for the middle ground (=balance) after listening (type, talking up the difficulties/stretching the fight.
Ebertin's midpoints are wonderful but sometimes a bit old fashioned - so this is a good way of visualising them - the planets are really
focal here in combination with number - pure pure!!!

Wow what a great story. I would have never seen it that way
this sense of fairness, especially CmI.

I thought it was the g planets that gave meYour story seems to combine the meaning of the two midpoints we are discussing here.
After giving I=A/E some thought, I get the image of the knight in shining armor, protector of the innocent
and those under attack. My wife's friends have called me that at times. Using ones power A/E in the pursuit ofones ideals I. Combining with A=C/D as you have described makes a very strong case for an individual thathas a keen sense of fairness, and takes action in defense of fairness.
This does explain some strong traits I have that have not been adequately described by other natal
interpretations.
Do you frequently see the action of the planets through this kind of little story?
It was quite creative and really made the point clear.
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Maggy Cassin

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Re: Midpoints-specific questions« Reply #39 - on: 05.02.2012 at 20:08 [UT] »Nah! but its a demo of how to use the images of planets - I is always silent, hard to describe, that's why incombination with personal (ABC) it affects the personality greatly but in silent ways - i.e. doing good (orbad) by stealth, it has a sort of mute effect, O is always noticeable and outrageous, E instantly recognisable
Posts: 244(think Russell Crowe in a bar, rather than a good frock in the arena....)etc. When I taught that's how I got
them to recognise planets, its just fun but the messages stick. I thought J might be hard to see, as it is so
subtle, but they always got the power of it somehow. Anyway, it is an illustration of how 2 or 3 planets can bevery descriptive, and you CAN try this one at home.....

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beyond the stars
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Re: Midpoints-specific questions« Reply #40 - on: 05.02.2012 at 22:30 [UT] »The only midpoint I really take all that seriously (since there are so many of them, one could go crazy withdata, and ultimately, my head really does spin) is the A/B midpoint. I have found that that particular point
has proven to be incredibly important for a lot of reasons. For example, I had progressed B conjunct my natal

A/B midpoint last year, and someone I was very close to died last year; his natal ASC was exactly conjunct my
A/B midpoint. There might be other factors, but I tend to stay focused on only one or two influences at atime, otherwise that "big fish" has a tendency to wriggle out of the net.
BTW, 28buck, it's spelled 'grok'.
Posts: 1005

One of my more favorite words, though probably not conjunct my A/B

midpoint.

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Rahu

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Re: Midpoints-specific questions« Reply #41 - on: 06.02.2012 at 00:30 [UT] »to answer the original question about midpoints of midpoints, in ebertin's [u]the combination of stellat
influence[u], he does introduce double midpoints but only briefly .
rahu

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28buck
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Re: Midpoints-specific questions« Reply #42 - on: 06.02.2012 at 04:23 [UT] »beyond,grok? really? well I could believe it
do you remember how it was defined in the book?

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28buckMember

Re: Midpoints-specific questions« Reply #43 - on: 06.02.2012 at 04:26 [UT] »Quote from R a h u on 06.02.2012 at 00:30 [UT]:
to answer the original question about midpoints of midpoints, in ebertin's [u]the combination of stellat influence[u], he does introduce
double midpoints but only briefly .
rahu

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Gender:Thanks for that. I haven't read that book yet but need to get a copy.
We are talking about common midpoints, right? like A/B=O/I?

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beyond the stars
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Re: Midpoints-specific questions« Reply #44 - on: 06.02.2012 at 04:53 [UT] »According to Wikipedia, the font of all wisdom, here is how 'grok' was originally used and its meaning, byHeinlein:
Grok means to understand so thoroughly that the observer becomes a part of the observed—to merge, blend,intermarry, lose identity in group experience. It means almost everything that we mean by religion, philosophy,
and science—and it means as little to us (because of our Earthling assumptions) as color means to a blind man.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grok
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The part about losing identity in group experience sounds very Neptunian.... You could look at the midpoint
between Neptune and Sun for more information about this, perhaps?

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28buckMember

Re: Midpoints-specific questions« Reply #45 - on: 06.02.2012 at 05:03 [UT] »Quote from beyond the stars on 06.02.2012 at 04:53 [UT]:
According to Wikipedia, the font of all wisdom, here is how 'grok' was originally used and its meaning, by Heinlein:
Grok means to understand so thoroughly that the observer becomes a part of the observed—to merge, blend, intermarry, lose identity ingroup experience. It means almost everything that we mean by religion, philosophy, and science—and it means as little to us (because of
our Earthling assumptions) as color means to a blind man.

Posts: 793
Gender:http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grok
The part about losing identity in group experience sounds very Neptunian.... You could look at the midpoint between Neptune and Sun for
more information about this, perhaps?

hmmmm, it sounds like the author of that article added a bit of his own interpretation, which may be necessary
for an "event" like that
now I'm going to have to get a copy and find it again myself
great book
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28buckMember

Re: Midpoints-specific questions« Reply #46 - on: 06.02.2012 at 05:15 [UT] »Quote from beyond the stars on 05.02.2012 at 22:30 [UT]:The only midpoint I really take all that seriously (since there are so many of them, one could go crazy with data, and ultimately, my head

A/B midpoint. I have found that that particular point has proven to be incredibly important for a lot of reasons.
B conjunct my natal A/B midpoint last year, and someone I was very close to died last year; his natal
ASC was exactly conjunct my A/ B midpoint. There might be other factors, but I tend to stay focused on only one or two influences at areally does spin) is the

For example, I had progressed

time, otherwise that "big fish" has a tendency to wriggle out of the net.
BTW, 28buck, it's spelled 'grok'.

One of my more favorite words, though probably not conjunct my

A/B midpoint.

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Gender:ermm, are you female?
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beyond the stars

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Re: Midpoints-specific questions« Reply #47 - on: 06.02.2012 at 06:44 [UT] »erm, let me check and get back to you...
I shall begin to include biological data from now on in my posts; who knows what species might be observing
us from afar, carefully noting DNA?
I do watch too much Doctor Who, I swear to god. Plus I just came from a Torchwood marathon. Forgive me.

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Maggy Cassin
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Re: Midpoints-specific questions« Reply #48 - on: 06.02.2012 at 07:42 [UT] »Buck, thanks for recommedning a Stranger in a Strange Land, by the way - I haven't heard of it. I
automatically assumed you had COSI (Ebertin's book) - that will really open your eyes.
Beyondthestars, yes agree the A/B midpoint is THE most important, but ascendant aspects play out the sameif the time is right. Alice said rectification could be worked back through midpoints and I do agree. It often
Posts: 244

gives a clue to a hidden side of a person. My grandson has A/B=O - he's a AbBf, and is exactly that type- slow, considerate, careful...so I was wondering how it would manifest. When he was 8 I looked at his 4 airplanets and thought well you can blow some sort of instrument.....I found a clarinet teacher. He wasn't keen
but I thought its handy being portable (he lives half the time with us) and also even if he just learned to readmusic that would be something.
He's taught classically, immediately loved it BUT in the music shop we came across jazz books for clarinet. He
said lets get one, and is now completely hooked on jazz. He was actually too shy to play inf ront of his teacher(who offered to stand behind him!) so I sent her a clip of him playing. According to her he can do somethingothers can't - improvise. It can't be learned or taught she said, you have it or you don't - he has no idea how
he does it and thinks nothing of it. That was just over 2 yrs ago, he's now 10 and playing Take the A Train andTake Five etc - but is still clumsy, with not very good motor skills - except when he's playing the clarinet his
timing is spot on, his fingers fly....he's like The Hulk, completely invisible until he plays and then he getsmasterful. Vocation I find to be the best use of astrology, you can always find something someone is good at.
That's where midpoints tell you something extra.

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Sagitaurean

Member

Re: Midpoints-specific questions« Reply #49 - on: 07.02.2012 at 13:41 [UT] »Quote from 28buck on 04.02.2012 at 16:03 [UT]:
Would you like to give the

Am C/D at try? it is the closest of all midpoint contacts and involves the A and two personal planets.

http://johnsandbach.com/?p=371
Posts: 186

Sun: A potential master of beautiful communication. The ability to be very persuasive when one speaks orwrites. Goals attained through the use of diplomacy and artful communication. An egotist in love with his or
her own ideas.

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28buckMember

Re: Midpoints-specific questions« Reply #50 - on: 07.02.2012 at 18:31 [UT] »Quote from beyond the stars on 06.02.2012 at 06:44 [UT]:
erm, let me check and get back to you...
I shall begin to include biological data from now on in my posts; who knows what species might be observing us from afar, carefully noting
DNA?
I do watch too much Doctor Who, I swear to god. Plus I just came from a Torchwood marathon. Forgive me.

Posts: 793
Gender:Ok ok, no problem, but then you will have to accept me calling you "dude" now and then.
For some reason I thought you were a woman, but then I got a sense of a harder edge in some of your posts.
So now I will call you dude. Safer to be surprised that way than the other, e.g. the crying game way LOL
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28buck

Member

Re: Midpoints-specific questions« Reply #51 - on: 07.02.2012 at 18:34 [UT] »Quote from Sagitaurean on 07.02.2012 at 13:41 [UT]:
Quote from 28buck on 04.02.2012 at 16:03 [UT]:
Would you like to give theplanets.

Posts: 793
Gender:Am C/D at try? it is the closest of all midpoint contacts and involves the A and two personal

http://johnsandbach.com/?p=371
Sun: A potential master of beautiful communication. The ability to be very persuasive when one speaks or writes. Goals attained throughthe use of diplomacy and artful communication. An egotist in love with his or her own ideas.

Hmmm, I'll take the first one definitely, the second is useful, and the third, geez, who doesn't love their own
ideas
But seriously, those are concise, specific and cover the range of possible realization.
In my case each one is true to some degree or at different times.
I am able to examine my own ideas, even if I love them

LOL ROFLMAO

Thank you for that input
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Sagitaurean
Member

Re: Midpoints-specific questions« Reply #52 - on: 07.02.2012 at 22:54 [UT] »Eh yea, 28buck. Sorry about that last one, wasn't too sure sure how you would recieve it but decided that theidea he was trying to convey would carry. Not to be taken literally, methinks.

Posts: 186

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28buckMember

Re: Midpoints-specific questions« Reply #53 - on: 07.02.2012 at 23:50 [UT] »Quote from Sagitaurean on 07.02.2012 at 22:54 [UT]:
Eh yea, 28buck. Sorry about that last one, wasn't too sure sure how you would recieve it but decided that the idea he was trying to convey
would carry. Not to be taken literally, methinks.

Oh don't worry about it, I thought it was good that the full range of possibilities was given.
Posts: 793
Gender:I looked at the website for the I=A/E and it gave pretty much only negative meanings for that one, like theold neptune is bad news traditional thinking.
I think he missed half the boat on that one

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PhoenixNoodleSoupRe: Midpoints-specific questions
Ex Member« Reply #54 - on: 13.02.2012 at 23:41 [UT] »Hi Everyone, Buck28, I hope you do not mind a question here that I have about midpoints? It possibly
touches on your question in a round about way (for some at least). Generally, I give more "importance" tomidpoints that are conjunct specific planets or the axis (using orbs I seem to recall I derived from Alice
McDermott, which I read in other sources) and in the main I use meanings inline with Ebertins COSI classic; Myquestion is regarding the "near" and "far" midpoints : should they (and if so), how should they be considered?
Especially if the "near" midpoints are conjunt planets and the "far" midpoints may or may not? Is thissomething worth considering?
Thank You in Anticipation, Kevin
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James Alexander

Member

Re: Midpoints-specific questions« Reply #55 - on: 16.02.2012 at 09:52 [UT] »Hello 28Buck,
Re: Sun = Mercury/Venus(From Don McBroom), your life purpose and ego definition can be accomplished through beautiful, harmonious,
balanced communication, thoughts and ideas; having a way with words.
Posts: 423
Gender:

Peace
James

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beyond the stars
Member

Re: Midpoints-specific questions« Reply #56 - on: 17.02.2012 at 23:56 [UT] »Quote from 28buck on 07.02.2012 at 18:31 [UT]:
Quote from beyond the stars on 06.02.2012 at 06:44 [UT]:
erm, let me check and get back to you...
I shall begin to include biological data from now on in my posts; who knows what species might be observing us from afar,
carefully noting DNA?
I do watch too much Doctor Who, I swear to god. Plus I just came from a Torchwood marathon. Forgive me.

Posts: 1005
Ok ok, no problem, but then you will have to accept me calling you "dude" now and then.
For some reason I thought you were a woman, but then I got a sense of a harder edge in some of your posts. So now I will call you dude.
Safer to be surprised that way than the other, e.g. the crying game way LOL

You know, I don't usually bother responding to this sort of post, but I really must say that your tone seems
oddly confrontational, given the previous lack of meaningful interaction between us; at least, 'meaningful' as I
define it. I personally would need a lot more interaction before I would bother wanting to know someone's
gender identification. I generally see that as no one's business, unless you and I were to have established somekind of personal dialogue, which we have not.
So: call me dude if you wish.
Life is way too short for this sort of thing, though; at least it is from my perspective.
See ya.
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28buckMember

Re: Midpoints-specific questions« Reply #57 - on: 20.02.2012 at 02:16 [UT] »Quote from James Alexander on 16.02.2012 at 09:52 [UT]:Hello 28Buck,
Re: Sun = Mercury/Venus(From Don McBroom), your life purpose and ego definition can be accomplished through beautiful, harmonious, balanced communication,
thoughts and ideas; having a way with words.

Posts: 793
Gender:

Peace
James

Hi James,
Thanks for the input again. I think this can be true, having a way with words, at times.
I suppose it is because of the planets involved, but it seems to be sort of a lightweight influence in my life.
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