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Child Abuser Natal Charts (Read 765 times)

Magic Toenail
MemberChild Abuser Natal Charts« on: 22.08.2013 at 02:08 [UT+1] »I know that Saturn in the 5th house is sometimes an indicator, but are there any others?

Posts: 68
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starcave

Ex Member

Re: Child Abuser Natal Charts« Reply #1 - on: 22.08.2013 at 03:37 [UT+1] »Quote from Magic Toenail on 22.08.2013 at 02:08 [UT+1]:
I know that Saturn in the 5th house is sometimes an indicator, but are there any others?

Probably the very same things that would indicate one as being a victim; endless cycle; my two cents
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Akvelina
Ostergaard

Re: Child Abuser Natal Charts« Reply #2 - on: 22.08.2013 at 05:06 [UT+1] »Ex Member

I just looked at 2 charts of people who definitely abused their children, and I wish I had their birth times but I
was still shocked - BOTH of them had AmD opposition one or more of the outer planets! One of them has
AmDmN n O and J; the other person has AmD n BmG!

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SandboxMember

Re: Child Abuser Natal Charts« Reply #3 - on: 22.08.2013 at 06:06 [UT+1] »I have A loosely mN loosely nO. I was ill-treated as a child.
As I am not married I obviously never had my own children to abuse, nor have I felt the need to abuse anyone
else's.
Unfortunately I get to deal with a lot of abused animals in my weekend job. I often think how weird it is thatno one cared when I was abused but these animals seem to find their way into my life.
Where was my "me" when I needed them?
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Magic Toenail
Member

Re: Child Abuser Natal Charts« Reply #4 - on: 22.08.2013 at 08:48 [UT+1] »Quote from JustInes on 22.08.2013 at 06:06 [UT+1]:

A

mN

nO

I havelooselyloosely. I was ill-treated as a child.
As I am not married I obviously never had my own children to abuse, nor have I felt the need to abuse anyone else's.
Unfortunately I get to deal with a lot of abused animals in my weekend job. I often think how weird it is that no one cared when I wasabused but these animals seem to find their way into my life.
Where was my "me" when I needed them?

Posts: 68
Gender:Thank you for your work! You are a material, living angel for helping the most voice less and victimized
creatures!

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Sandbox

Member

Re: Child Abuser Natal Charts« Reply #5 - on: 22.08.2013 at 11:15 [UT+1] »Quote from Magic Toenail on 22.08.2013 at 08:48 [UT+1]:
Quote from JustInes on 22.08.2013 at 06:06 [UT+1]:

A

mN

nO

I havelooselyloosely. I was ill-treated as a child.
As I am not married I obviously never had my own children to abuse, nor have I felt the need to abuse anyone else's.
Unfortunately I get to deal with a lot of abused animals in my weekend job. I often think how weird it is that no one caredwhen I was abused but these animals seem to find their way into my life.
Where was my "me" when I needed them?

Posts: 3096
Gender:

The mother has AnN. Da has AnO but that was emotional abuse, not the hardcore
They both have G in 5H
Hope that helps.
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EnigmeMember

Re: Child Abuser Natal Charts« Reply #6 - on: 22.08.2013 at 16:11 [UT+1] »Abuser murderer of two and possibily four women. No sexual abuse alcoholic and Demerol addict. Youngest
beaten and tortured. Jedi Mind trix type of abuse akin to interrogation techniques old style. Was abused bymother as a child. Grew up in wealth not poverty. When sober very eloquent and a copious writer. When
induced...freaky scary. Into B and D.

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Magic Toenail

Member

Re: Child Abuser Natal Charts« Reply #7 - on: 22.08.2013 at 16:25 [UT+1] »^ Wow! Interesting Chart! Thanks Eyesis!

Posts: 68
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Astrochologist
Ex Member

Re: Child Abuser Natal Charts« Reply #8 - on: 22.08.2013 at 18:24 [UT+1] »A look at some of the most famous/ well known child abusers. Most of them are Aquarians. I mean
overwhelming majority.
Chart details Im not too sure of though.
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azureMember

Re: Child Abuser Natal Charts« Reply #9 - on: 22.08.2013 at 18:53 [UT+1] »Quote from JustInes on 22.08.2013 at 06:06 [UT+1]:
I haveA loosely mN loosely nO. I was ill-treated as a child.

As I am not married I obviously never had my own children to abuse, nor have I felt the need to abuse anyone else's.
Unfortunately I get to deal with a lot of abused animals in my weekend job. I often think how weird it is that no one cared when I wasabused but these animals seem to find their way into my life.
Where was my "me" when I needed them?

I also have very close connections to animals and was at the vet today with my cat, and for some reason I
explained to the vet my very close connection to them was because of long standing emotional and physicalPosts: 1503
Gender:abuse and isolation as a child.
And I could tell from her reaction she was the same. It was very odd because I'd never put the connections
together before.....and now I'm reading this today.
FWIW I dont think that physical or sexual abuse is more hard core than emotional abuse, it's just that where
there is physical or sexual abuse, there is always emotional abuse. And where those are present that emotional
abuse will be much, much worse. I hope this makes sense.
I'm not sure if you can trace an abuser from their chart. It's the entire person after all, that has become
unhinged and lacks empathy.
Both my parents lacked empathy. I don't know how I survived it, but it was probably that I had a very strong
sense of self. As I get older though I feel more fragile as the memories are stronger...and therefore moreconnected with the child that suffered.
My father was A l but he had B in a m O...his temper was explosive. He was an alcoholic and a very cruelperson who had a lot of self loathing which he acted out.
When he died I went to the funeral to check he was actually dead. And it had been so long since I'd seen him I
couldn't recognise the body...he looked so small!
I guess it was good to see he can't hurt me anymore. Of course, as an abuser he lied and blackened my nameto everyone...this is how they work, it's all about control. He cut me out of the will and convinced everyone I
was mad...so it hurts me that my family have scapegoated me and believe his rubbish. Basically there is a lot of
self deception involved in any abuse situation IMO...he was a ranter.
My mother isi and g rising but honestly, she just collapsed under the strain of it all. She became crazy andtook it out on me. It was awful....but I can't forgive her for some things even so, she just had no boundaries atall. She wasn't safe to be around. I find myself retreating from people these days. I should be more social but
people disappoint me a lot.
Yeah but it is a healing thing to help others, and animals are the most vulnerable. My cats are getting older
now...both around 13 years so it will be a huge loss when they go.
I could tell when the vet told me about the loss of her cat, that it was the most devastating loss she'd
experienced. That meant she was talking about something else as well. We just knew. So I felt safe to tell herthat about my childhood which I'd never told a vet about before.
I have D in the 6th. I just understand animals...not all, but most I can connect with. I give them space to bethemselves and mirror them back...they love that.
Also I have A in the 5th in a, so my sense of self saved me a bit.
My cat will not eat unless she has thanked me first with a nudge of her head on me...and the vet said her cat
was the same, would not eat unless a cuddle first.
That's a deep bond.
(Sorry if off topic...)Back to top

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EnigmeMember

Re: Child Abuser Natal Charts« Reply #10 - on: 22.08.2013 at 22:58 [UT+1] »You are welcome Magic Toenail!!! Love the name.. and azure when speaking of experiences and such its ahealing thing. And helping others to heal. Hopefully I can volunteer at family guidance to help others.
Alcohol and water fuels pains and emotions which can be explosive.
Saturn fifth intercepted Sag. Broke the cycle of abuse.

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Sandbox

Member

Re: Child Abuser Natal Charts« Reply #11 - on: 23.08.2013 at 05:42 [UT+1] »[quote author=azure link=1377133688/0#9 date=1377193986]Quote from JustInes on 22.08.2013 at
06:06 [UT+1]:

Of course, as an abuser he lied and blackened my name to everyone...this is how they work, it's all about control. He cut me out of thewill and convinced everyone I was mad...so it hurts me that my family have scapegoated me and believe his rubbish. Basically there is a
lot of self deception involved in any abuse situation IMO...he was a ranter.

Posts: 3096
Gender:It's interesting that human society chooses to ostracize the victim rather than the abuser. This serves tofurther validate the abuser's behaviour, allowing abuse to continue ad infinitim.
I'd be interested in a study of charts of people who break out of the mould and take a stand against theabuser. Some brave and obviously rare aspects happening there
If you were mad and bad the animals wouldn't trust you. Animals are not dumb.
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Allison Powell
Member

Re: Child Abuser Natal Charts« Reply #12 - on: 23.08.2013 at 12:25 [UT+1] »I have Saturn in the 5th house,not well aspected,it makes me shy and social situations are difficult,I,m also
attracted to older men......but I,m not a child abuser.
my Capricorn sun is unsuspected conjunct the ic.

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EnigmeMember

Re: Child Abuser Natal Charts« Reply #13 - on: 23.08.2013 at 13:53 [UT+1] »I did post a chart of an abuser.. maybe the signage and aspects do not conform with what people would
assume?
I do know abusers saints geniuses selfish giving etc. cannot be determined by one sign or one planet and it
does astrology harm to do so. It takes a whole chart perspective and a look at many charts and see if there is arecurring theme.

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alice bEx Member

Re: Child Abuser Natal Charts« Reply #14 - on: 23.08.2013 at 14:00 [UT+1] »Eyesiswhy does water fuel the emotions? alice b

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Magic Toenail

Member

Re: Child Abuser Natal Charts« Reply #15 - on: 23.08.2013 at 14:22 [UT+1] »Quote from Allison Powell on 23.08.2013 at 12:25 [UT+1]:
I have Saturn in the 5th house,not well aspected,it makes me shy and social situations are difficult,I,m also attracted to older men......but
I,m not a child abuser.

my Capricorn sun is unsuspected conjunct the ic.

My mother also has Saturn in the 5th in Leo, she was also not abusive (but seemed helpless to stop my father

Posts: 68
Gender:from emotionally abusing me and herself). She too is shy. She is also afraid of getting touch of her creative side(drawing, painting, playing keyboards, writing) because she is afraid she'll not be "good enough" which istypical Saturn talk. But I hope with her recent health scare, she'll take up a creative hobby, which I think she'll
greatly enjoy. I wasn't saying all people with Saturn in the 5th are child abuses, but it could be a warning signin some people.

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EnigmeMember

Re: Child Abuser Natal Charts« Reply #16 - on: 23.08.2013 at 14:32 [UT+1] »Quote from alice b on 23.08.2013 at 14:00 [UT+1]:
Eyesis why does water fuel the emotions? alice b

OK Alcohol fuels emotions and um throughout astrology water signs are emotional receptive intuitive etc...
read all the posts written by those who have water as sun moon or strong in the chart. I would think it isobvious. Does it bother you that my father had Cancer Moon and rising with Grand Water trines? And why?
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Giving props to both Magic Toenail and Starcave

for the significance of Saturn 5th the abuser Mars 4th

Saturn 5th conj in Scorpio the abused Saturn 5th Sagittarius.
In my old man's chart I am thinking the Moon Pluto conj and he does have several retrograde planets as will asa Kite running from 12/1 to 6/7th..
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zippyMember

Re: Child Abuser Natal Charts« Reply #17 - on: 23.08.2013 at 16:54 [UT+1] »Quote from starcave on 22.08.2013 at 03:37 [UT+1]:
Quote from Magic Toenail on 22.08.2013 at 02:08 [UT+1]:
I know that Saturn in the 5th house is sometimes an indicator, but are there any others?

Posts: 8143

Probably the very same things that would indicate one as being a victim; endless cycle; my two cents

I agree. Not only an endless cycle but often what is shown in the chart can indicate a preponderance for,whether it be victim or perpetrator.
I find Pluto and/or Mars strong in the charts (sometimes Uranus), in conjunction or in hard aspect to eachother, often from the 2nd to the 5th or 8th to the 5th, or to the 5th cusp, it's ruler, or to planets tenanted in
the 5th. Often with Mars and/or Pluto tenanted in the 5th. Sometimes the 5th ruler in hard aspect to the 5th
cusp or planets tenanted in the 5th.
http://www.astro.com/wiki/astro-databank/index.php?title=Special%3ASearch&se
arch=sexual+abuse+victim
http://www.astro.com/cgi/sub.cgi?sumode=gresult&gquery=relationships%3A+Chil
d+Abuse+Victim&fulltext=Search+astro.com

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Tham58
Member

Re: Child Abuser Natal Charts« Reply #18 - on: 28.08.2013 at 13:08 [UT+1] »Quote from Astrochologist on 22.08.2013 at 18:24 [UT+1]:
A look at some of the most famous/ well known child abusers. Most of them are Aquarians. I mean overwhelming majority.
Chart details Im not too sure of though.

Posts: 456
Gender:Bingo.
My younger brother.
Principal Engineer at Western Digital in Malaysia, earning
close to M$ 20,000 a month.
I've received feedback that nobody there likes him. Shouts
and hollers at his subordinates as if they are stray dogs.

Aquarius rising, Saturn in First House.
Stellium in the Eighth House.

http://s20.postimg.org/hq0ysj8ot/image.gif

Note that Ate, the asteroid Goddess of evil, mischief, obsession and delusion is right at his Sun. Jupiter is also
exact at Algol in the Fourth House of the home.
Abused his second two-year old son from the end of 2008 till mid-2009. Out of options, with none of my othersiblings daring
to intervene, I had to resort to spiritual sources to save the kid,which, luckily, they did.
He has now turned the same child against me, teaching him
to call me a ''piece of junk'' and ''Fai Cai'', literally meaning''worthless piece of wood'' in Chinese.

Personality not unlike Heinrich Himmler, quite seriously.
Indeed, note that asteroid Lucifer is also in his Taurus in the Third House, squaring his AC and DC, as in
Himmler's case. It also trines his Sun, while it quincunxes Himmler's Sun.

'' Asteroid Lucifer resides in Taurus, retrograde in the third house of lifestyle, communications and practicalskills along with the karmic South Node of the Moon, an indicator for past lives and the shadow business ofsocial status-quo.
The asteroid is in square with the Ascendant-Descendant axis within a few minutes, therefore the Luciferiancurrent would heavily influence crucial relationships between himself, partners and enemies. In Taurus and thethird house, Lucifer would be interested in absolute control over information systems, lifestyle and the social
functions of nature, including reproduction.
The asteroid is also quincunx to Himmler's Sun, reinforcing the proclivity to project any potential consciousness
of atrocity onto vehicles of organizational necessity and executional efficiency. ''http://mysticmarguerite.com/WebDocs/Texts/GreedPowerAsteroidsII.html

I believe he has mental instability in the form of multiple personality disorders - essentially overlapping
schizoid, schizotypal, paranoid and narcissistic personality disorder.

You can see what he has been pasting on my door overthe months.

Might the experienced astrologers here be able to detect mental instability here ?

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EnigmeMember

Re: Child Abuser Natal Charts« Reply #19 - on: 28.08.2013 at 13:39 [UT+1] »From Café Astrology
Sun square or opposition Pluto
People born under a challenging aspect between the Sun and Pluto are prone to inner tension and negative,
self-destructive behavior. When things are going well, they suffer from fears that something will come along tochange that. Their thought patterns can be negative, and if not kept in check, they can seriously undermine
their happiness. Constantly worrying that the rug will be pulled from under their feet can easily become a selffulfilling prophecy. Sun-Pluto have tremendous power and strength--when they learn to accept and use that
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strength, instead of fear it, they are some of the most effective, insightful, helpful, and healing people around!
One of the most prominent characteristics of these aspects is the tendency to be intensely dissatisfied with theirpersonal accomplishments and expressions of self. These people put a lot of pressure on themselves regarding
their own endeavors. A child, for example, with a challenging Sun-Pluto aspect may work hard at a piece ofartwork, decide it's not right, destroy it, and start all over again. This same child will be especially disturbed ifthey feel people are watching as they create their artwork. This is a simple example, but it's quite descriptive ofthe tendency for these people to be dissatisfied with their creative self-expressions, and to want to hide theirexpressions from others until they feel the output is "right". This is largely due to a perceived inability to
express or reveal their true personalities to others. They experience a simultaneous urge to express themselves
and to hide themselves. They struggle with a deep need to control themselves and life itself. Rarely are SunPluto people completely satisfied with themselves. They are especially sensitive to criticism, and feel the need to"redo" themselves often. There is a marked fear of losing control, and this might stem from some traumatic
event in childhood, or the childhood might have been crisis-ridden or emotionally-charged in general. As such,these people are often intensely fearful of, or threatened by, change. This can express itself through attempts
to control their lives such that they can manage their fears of being taken off guard. Of course, this generally
backfires!
Another characteristic of these aspects is an intense need for privacy. They fear being exposed or invaded.
Again, this is an expression of their dissatisfaction with the self they are projecting, and they are generally
uncomfortable with their evolving ego. They seem to undergo many identity crises, and they feel the need tocontrol what others know about them and think about them. Their fear of exposing themselves might cause
them problems with others, who may begin to mistrust them, presuming that if they are so protective of theirprivacy, they must have something sinister to hide. The truth is, they struggle with a dissatisfaction withthemselves and their fear of being exposed is really about a fear of being vulnerable, as well as a manifestationof their own identity crisis.
These people are quick to read between the lines. They need to be careful, however, to avoid reading negative
or dark things into situations or people. They need to know that if their tendency is to hunt for dark "truths"
rather than unbiased truths, this is a self-destructive behavior that stems from fear. Many people with these
aspects are overly attached to things, habits, people, and their past. At the root of this is an intense fear ofchange that would threaten to make them vulnerable. Still, Pluto's goal is to transform through change.
Inevitably, Sun-Pluto people will have to face their fear of change and accept that they need change in order togrow.
We all have a dark, irrational side, but people with Sun-Pluto in hard aspect are forced to confront it andintegrate it into their personalities. It can be a challenging process, especially because the Sun rules all that is"light" - the rational, conscious mind. The Sun is noble and righteous by nature. Aligned with Pluto, it can havea hard time accepting the darker, intense, and often irrational Pluto energies into one cohesive whole. This is
the challenge that Sun-Pluto face. If these people find themselves using manipulative tactics to get their way, or
attempting to control others through subversive tactics, it is a clear cue that they are mishandling Pluto
energies. It is a powerful indication that their self-image is low. There is little satisfaction derived from getting
our way through manipulation. It only serves to make us feel less effective in the long run and on a personallevel. If I were to win a favor by using subversive tactics, what will it prove to me? It will reinforce my feelingthat I am not effective just by being myself. And, effectiveness is something Sun-Pluto craves.
JL's father was an Aquarius with Pluto in Leo opposition... I am amazed she survived. Maybe her Sun d Pluto
go but I see this opposition or square in any sign as a potential. Not always but often seen in abusive charts.

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Re: Child Abuser Natal Charts

Gayle 61
Member« Reply #20 - on: 30.08.2013 at 00:09 [UT+1] »eyesis hi
a quick eyeball at that chart u put up and I,d concentrate on...

Posts: 1823

sun in 5 th , children, quincunx pluto in hidden 12 th
mercury in 6 th mind and health , quincunx Neptune in 2nd, values.
astro health experts would have a fieldday with this chart .
so sorry for anyone who got trapped with this one.
G

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EnigmeMember

Re: Child Abuser Natal Charts« Reply #21 - on: 30.08.2013 at 22:44 [UT+1] »Wow you see it Gayle61!!! He was declared sane in 69 but one psychiatrist did recognize his issues. He wasextremely intelligent also which helped him rationalize his actions. From the outside very handsome.
His chart is fascinating. I was the one trapped Gayle and you could not describe it better.
I think the quincunx is his suns only aspect also. He was forced to marry. I can't see the chart but I will takenotes on it. Pretty wild stuff. Thank you.
Edit that venus jupiter conj in capricorn forming tbe oppositions wow. I may post a synastry because it may
make a case for both Lilith and Chiron too
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EnigmeMember

Re: Child Abuser Natal Charts« Reply #22 - on: 30.08.2013 at 23:23 [UT+1] »Here it is. Note his Chiron and my Lilith and nodes..

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Tham58

Member

Re: Child Abuser Natal Charts« Reply #23 - on: 31.08.2013 at 03:53 [UT+1] »Heinrich Himmler's chart.
Posts: 456
Gender:Aquarius ascendant.
Lucifer at the cusp of the Third House in Taurus.

Ixion, the murder asteroid, is right at the violent 25 Leo.
Note also that another murder asteroid Tantalus, Jupiter,
Malin (the Devil) and Uranus are conjunct.

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Re: Child Abuser Natal Charts

Gayle 61
Member« Reply #24 - on: 31.08.2013 at 06:19 [UT+1] »HAPPY BIRTHDAY EYESIS.
the dads chart shows the ruler of his 2nd is the sun from where the Neptune mercury quincx flows so id tend totie that in too.

Posts: 1823

I haven't yet looked at your mentioned chiron and Lilith yet.
thams nudge re ixion shows your 4 th hs ixion square dads Jupiter in 6th
dads ixion square square your Saturn in 5 th
dad has moon ssq his vertex in 5 thmars ssq his eris in 9 th
his 5 th hs Saturn ssq his natal MC
your natal moon is ssq Uranus 1 st and 9 th
your moon in 9 th quincx to pluto in yr 2nd will have u twisting to alter your values from family " roughness"maybe the ecl early nov in your 4 th might be of help to end some issues?
I cannot enlighten u with explainations of some of the above but hopoe some bright spark here can.
anyho, something u might want to investigate further, meanwhile have a happy birthday and astro return.
thanks tham..

will have a closer look at that chart, meanwhile I have all the family charts out over the floor

again thanks to ixiom etc .........

g

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Re: Child Abuser Natal Chartssewit

Ex Member« Reply #25 - on: 01.09.2013 at 11:52 [UT+1] »Quote from Eyesis on 23.08.2013 at 14:32 [UT+1]:
Quote from alice b on 23.08.2013 at 14:00 [UT+1]:
Eyesis why does water fuel the emotions? alice b

OK Alcohol fuels emotions and um throughout astrology water signs are emotional receptive intuitive etc... read all the posts written by
those who have water as sun moon or strong in the chart. I would think it is obvious. Does it bother you that my father had Cancer Moon
and rising with Grand Water trines? And why?
Giving props to both Magic Toenail and Starcave

for the significance of Saturn 5th the abuser Mars 4th Saturn 5th conj in Scorpio theabused Saturn 5th Sagittarius.
In my old man's chart I am thinking the Moon Pluto conj and he does have several retrograde planets as will as a Kite running from 12/1
to 6/7th..

I seem to remember reading about this effect of alcohol on our inhibitions in the book Im Ok Your Ok, T
harris, or The Games people Play Eric Berne, but could be wrong title. Anyway it went home with me at thetime after locking up a few drunks for D & D and rarely drank too much except after break up from hubby
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Re: Child Abuser Natal Charts

EnigmeMember« Reply #26 - on: 01.09.2013 at 15:51 [UT+1] »To both of you.. Gayle thank you for your insight the utter plutonian theme with my sun Pluto conj. has
demanded death and rebirth daily. Each time I climb the spiral a bit higher. I do still resent losing Mom at suchan early age. But I have used my experiences to help others with a modicum of success.
The chart really speaks loudly. Will share my astro view after tomorrow.. holiday.
Sewit his Neptune screams escapism. And yes I had that book years ago. Funny my older sister who did notexperience the abuse still wails victim..moon in Scorp. Will never see how good her husband and bis family
have treated her..sad.
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viola magmar

Member

Re: Child Abuser Natal Charts« Reply #27 - on: 02.09.2013 at 22:27 [UT+1] »I went to check an old friend's natal chart, drawn in my early days into astrology and forgotten there. Quite anumber of years ago, when we last met, he told me a story:
his wife had become an alchoolic. She accused him, in their place of work, of abusing their two children. He
claimed that was'nt true. They were both professors in the same school.
I even thought it might have been her deed and that could have been the reason why she started drinking.
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Gender:

But now, after going through this thread, I went back to his chart. Here it is...
v

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