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Fifth House (Read 5162 times)

Waybread
MemberFifth House« on: 08.12.2008 at 05:10 [UT] »I would love to hear your thoughts on the 5th house. Is it more than the "party house" or the fortune-teller'smeans of saying how many children someone will have?
I have read many descriptions of the 5th, but they are quite a stew: the house of children, love affairs [vs.
permanent relationships], light amusements such as gambling, recreation [cf. re-creation], creativity, and selfexpression. Is there a common theme here?
Is the power of the 5th stronger than stressful aspects to planets in this house? I have 3 planets in the 5th,
including my sun. I much love the family and recreational meanings of this house, but with Saturn opposite
my sun and with my ruler of the 5th in my 12th house, gambling is not one of my past-times.
Posts: 14740
Gender:How do you experience your 5th house? How do you make sense of it?
[A great quote from the Mormon faith that may shed light on it--the gendered language is in the original:"Man is, that he might have joy."]

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vertexMember

Re: Fifth House« Reply #1 - on: 08.12.2008 at 05:31 [UT] »Isabel Hickey describes the 5th house as the "house of hidden karma". I wonder if anyone knows what she
meant by this.

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Personally, I have BE South Node all conjunct in the 5th house. I don't like gambling either. I think its
because these planets are sextile Saturn.

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caplady
Member

Re: Fifth House« Reply #2 - on: 08.12.2008 at 08:47 [UT] »I have a 5 house stellium, jup, sun, mer, sat.

Don't gamble at all, took parenting responsabilities seriously,

and when I try to create something it takes me ages thanks to saturn. Don't like parties, prefer small quite
gatherings.
5 house is also about investments - I like to save $.
Posts: 400

Capricorn and saturn definately define this house for me.

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Member

Re: Fifth House« Reply #3 - on: 08.12.2008 at 09:48 [UT] »My 5th is in i, the planets in it: CmO, FmSN and I
It is not only love affair, I also heard that it is the beginning part of the relationship. Long relationships belong
to the VII, but every relationship starts in the 5th.
I don't gamble, and anyway I only have luck with these things if I don't take them seriously. Card games andPosts: 49

cards (so Tarot as well) belong here for eg. They say you buy the lottery ticket in the 5th, and win in the 11th.
It is the house of not only children (11th from the VIIth: the gift of love relationship is the child), but
education in general. People with strong 5th can have good teaching skills. People say to me that I often soundlike a teacher even when I am just discussing something... which is not always my purpose.
Investments, own business, risk-taking belong here as well as creativity, the source of self-expression (both theneed, the ability and the possibility). As far as I noticed on myself this kind of creativity originates in our childself. If you can set yourself free, and you are not afraid keeping in touch with the child in you, that brings
creativity. The freedom and inspiration of creation.
As the 2nd from the IVth it can signify the earned money and financial matters of the father (or mother if theIVth and Xth are switched).
This karma thing someone mentioned: As the 5th is the 6th (karma, work, service, etc.) from the 12th (hidden
karma, solitude, sickness, etc.), in this sense it can support the karma. Maybe in the 5th we have the chance towork, serve, teach, educate, etc... in order to fulfil our hidden karma, even though we are not aware what it is.
I.e. that is why for eg. the relationship is more than just joy or gift - In my opinion it always has a deeper
karmic meaning, and in the shine of the above thoughts I hope you see it too.
If anything else comes to my mind I will come and share.
Thanks for the topic.

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scorpio_me
Ex Member

Re: Fifth House« Reply #4 - on: 08.12.2008 at 11:04 [UT] »CIDAh in 5th, squaring Ee in 2nd, and K in e ... There's a theme there about Leo/5th house which has
to do with subjective (that is, "I") experiencing joyful living, all senses engaged and pleasured. No interest in
any serious work - if it seems too 'grown up' I'm not interested - though I can work for days without sleep if
it's a creative project and I am passionate about it.

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Humble IrritantMember

Re: Fifth House« Reply #5 - on: 08.12.2008 at 11:52 [UT] »I think the 5th is many things to many people, but i do think the 5th is the place that one can work on what
they give....that makes up who they are....its the place to develop self expression....for no other reason but tomake oneself more vibrant and whole....
its the place i think one has to go, before they can be a benefit to anyone in the 11th house sense.....to cometogether as a group, one needs to have some idea of what they are/ and what they are able to contribute..andthe 5th is the place one does that....(IMO)...
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Gender:

The 6th is a house of service...to others, but i really think the 5th is where we serve ourselves...and our own
pleasures in life...
I bet its a highly neglected house for some people...and an overworked house for others....
saw between the two..(not too strange with gemini intercepted in this house?)

I must say i see-

I would like to ask waybread..... would you put gardening here in the 5th?
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Plutomoon
Ex Member

Re: Fifth House« Reply #6 - on: 08.12.2008 at 12:15 [UT] »My 5H is an empty shell, in cancer

how dull is that.

I don't have children so that meshes with the house being empty, i guess.
As for affairs, there is no doubt that mine start in H7 and sometimes straight out of H8. Cancer men are very
drawn to me, maibe that is 5H working a little magic?
I have an aversion to gambling, maibe because i come from a family of notorious debt-ridden gamblers. I've
visited a casino once, it was one of the most depressing places i've ever visited.
5H a mysterious vacuum in my chart...i just don't seem to 'get it'. Though i am highly creative. I wonder ifother people with empty 5H has a more tangible experience of it?
Interesting to read about.

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Multiple

Ex Member

Re: Fifth House« Reply #7 - on: 08.12.2008 at 12:53 [UT] »quite a strong house in my chart. it's cusp is virgo and it has G m E and also J in libra contained within thehouse. quite a heavy combination really for such a fun, un-serious house. I think f makes it more of a cerebral
thing and the conjunction dulls any real spontaneousness.never got into gambling although I have learned
texas hold-em this year.I like strategy,planning that sort of stuff.if i'm ever going to do anything fun, I reallyneed some sort of plan before I do it and if it doesn't meet up to my own specifications I often go without, J ,all or nothing. some with relationships, it's pretty much all or nothing, incredible intensity or cellebacy.
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Pengwin
Ex Member

Re: Fifth House« Reply #8 - on: 08.12.2008 at 13:12 [UT] »Well to me it's the social side of things. You decide who's coming in the 1st, you work out what to bring in the
2nd, you call up everyone in the 3rd, work out who's hosting in the 4th and it happens in the 5th, the 6th iscleaning up afterwards, the 7th is the new friendships you get from it, the 8th is the things you want to forget
about that night, the ninth wondering when the next will be, the 10th trying to save enough to make sure you
can have another one soon, the 11th making sure you keep up to date on group politics and when everyone
elses things are happening, the twelfth making sure you keep the friday night smashes from everyone you don't
want coming, then back to the 1st where those 11th house group politics and social calendar come into playagain.
The 5th house is associated with flings, social gatherings, meeting new people (the opposite of the establishedfriendships of the 11th), recreational and casual activity, children and acting like children.
The sun here would make you appear like a child to others.
The moon here would make your temper short lived. (keeping with the quickly passing theme of the 5th).
Mercury here would give a quick and at time childish thoughts.
Venus here would lend itself to flings?
Mars here would give rushes of energy and you would feel more energetic when surrounded by people.
Jupiter here would make the person more popular with others and also good with jokes.
Saturn here would make the person grow up fast and although 5th house matters would be on the mind there
would also be hesitancy in doing those things.
Uranus here would make the energy even more erratic and unpredictable.
Neptune here could mean you only really like and want to drink with friends.
Chiron here maybe you feel better when in a social setting or when you're down you find yourself seeking out
friends.
Hope I'm right with this explanation

And to Waybread I'm loving the quote...

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Anka*

Member

Re: Fifth House« Reply #9 - on: 08.12.2008 at 13:24 [UT] »Plutomoon,interesting that you say your 5th house in cancer attracts cancer men. I've often wondered whether our 5thhouse isnt only about what we are attracted to, but also what we attract. After all, the 5th house is about
creative self-expression, so isnt it to some extent an extension of our ascendant? Almost, like a secondary
ascendant which shows up particularly in everything related to 5th house affairs. So considering that the 5thhouse also relates to love affairs, maybe your 'secondary' ascendant shows itself particularly in that kind ofsetting. I've certainly noticed that in my own case my 5th house does show when I'm trying to attract s.o. I'mcancer ascendant with saturn in the 1st, but my 5th house is ruled by venus in capricorn square uranus andPosts: 348
Gender:uranus is also sitting in my 5th. I'm not only attracted to uranian energy in men, but i think thatvenusian/uranian theme shows in how I act to attract. When I feel comfortable and I'm at my best i become
quite sociable, very charming with a somewhat quirky sense of humour.
So yes, would also be interesting to hear whether everyone finds your 5th house shows who you attract (notonly who you are attracted to) and if you see your 5th house as a kind of 'secondary' ascendant?
Anska

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Plutomoon
Ex Member

Re: Fifth House« Reply #10 - on: 08.12.2008 at 13:46 [UT] »Hi Anskainteresting questions you raise - and interestingly, 3 cancerian friends have been on the phone to me whilst i've
been on this thread (2 cancer suns, 1 cancer moon) and another moon cancer friend on email. There could besomething in the air, something to learn about cancer and 5H here. Great!!
i think you could be on to something about an ascendent like quality. I am not particularly interested in cancer(romantically) although they are gorgeous cuddly well-meaning people that i have great rapport withemotionally and also share good sense of humour, and touch!! but i quickly feel suffocated by them and theenforced nurturing (independent sag moon here), and often there is that 'mother thing' in the backgroundthat's very unsexy...so i've never actually had a proper relationship with a cancer. Years back i had a lover,an italian cancer, who was force feeding me, literally always cooking for me or otherwise trying to feed me, sothat just had to stop. Shame, really. He was an excellent cook
I'd love to meet a sensuous cancerian man that is free of mother issues and has a normal relationship withfood! That could be a match made in heaven for me
list...

Maibe another one for the Best Christmas Present

So do you flirt/attract with your uranian humour, Anska? And how?
Great description of the social zodiac, and the planets in H5, Pengwin!!
Look forward to hearing more about peoples 5H and attractions to/from.
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mistycharm

Member

Re: Fifth House« Reply #11 - on: 08.12.2008 at 14:18 [UT] »I have Mars in Aries in the 5th. From an astro angle, I've been mostly interested in how to see the children
aspect of this house for me. I've been looking at my houses through traditional methods lately and the sun in
my chart seems to be a stronger ruler over my 5th house matters. This is interesting to me and actually makes
a lot more sense now because my sun is in Scorpio, a fertile sign.

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Anka*
Member

Re: Fifth House« Reply #12 - on: 08.12.2008 at 15:20 [UT] »Quote from Plutomoon on 08.12.2008 at 13:46 [UT]:Hi Anskainteresting questions you raise - and interestingly, 3 cancerian friends have been on the phone to me whilst i've been on this thread (2cancer suns, 1 cancer moon) and another moon cancer friend on email. There could be something in the air, something to learn about
cancer and 5H here. Great!!
i think you could be on to something about an ascendent like quality. I am not particularly interested in cancer (romantically) although
they are gorgeous cuddly well-meaning people that i have great rapport with emotionally and also share good sense of humour, andtouch!! but i quickly feel suffocated by them and the enforced nurturing (independent sag moon here), and often there is that 'motherthing' in the background that's very unsexy...so i've never actually had a proper relationship with a cancer. Years back i had a lover,an italian cancer, who was force feeding me, literally always cooking for me or otherwise trying to feed me, so that just had to stop.
Shame, really. He was an excellent cook

Posts: 348

I'd love to meet a sensuous cancerian man that is free of mother issues and has a normal relationship with food! That could be a match

Gender:made in heaven for me

Maibe another one for the Best Christmas Present list...

So do you flirt/attract with your uranian humour, Anska? And how?
Great description of the social zodiac, and the planets in H5, Pengwin!!
Look forward to hearing more about peoples 5H and attractions to/from.

Hi Plutomoon,interesting that your cancer 5th house shows in your cancer friends. With my libra ruled 5th house and uranus
in the 5th most of my (close) friends are aquarius sun signs or strongly uranian and they also have the libra
signature somewhere in their charts. So friendship (because of the having fun together-aspect) isntt only an
11th house thing, but clearly also linked to 5th house affair.
I had to laugh so much at your force feading cancer ex! Had some serious deja-vue going on there because it
reminded me so much of my best friends mother....also a cancer..... My friends birthday parties used to belegendary because of her mum's (well meant) but completely uncontrollalbe feading. Just the other day myfriend and I ended up laughing tears because we remembered one particular birthday party where two of thechildren ended up throwing up because they just kept eating like robots all of the things her mum had put on
their plates...So anyway, yes cancer and food or nuturing really is a big theme..
Yes, when I try to be flirtateous it's definitely by trying to present myself as someone charming (venus ruled
5th house) but also very different. I cant say how, it's just that I catch myself making some quirky, off-beatcomments. However, as I think I mentioned, this kind of flirting behaviour only comes through when I feel
comfortable and relaxed....or maybe after a glass of wine. I'm strongly capricornian (Sun, mercury and venus +saturn in 1st and saturn ruling my 7th house) so there are huge barriers to really have fun and express
myself (5th house). But the 5th house it's really how I like to present myself and how I like to flirts, it's
basically an expression of myself when I'm at my best.
Anska
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Jupiter's Daughter

Member

Re: Fifth House« Reply #13 - on: 08.12.2008 at 16:01 [UT] »The underlying theme of the 5th is creativity - creativity is PLAY in the best sense, in that you do things
without preconceived notions as to the end result. (note that attitude is everything. one can PLAY games, or
one can COMPETE - once one becomes attached to outcomes, it is no longer a 5th house matter, IMO) play is
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important because it is when "playing around" that new possibilities can come into being. any creative
projection of the self belongs here - so it can be art or children. so you can push yourself here, but you alsoneed to be open to anything happening. this lack of seriousness and being open to something new is why
flirtation belongs here. also the dare-devil "what happens if if I try..." of risk takers - and I do think saturnseriously dampens this house. self expression also belongs here if it is conducted without regard to theopinions of others....(otherwise, it ain't self-expression!)
I don't think of the 5th as being temporary as it is here we open up all kinds of new things - so it can be ahouse of beginnings.
and I do think that this house is sorely abused and neglected in modern life.
re: karma - I do not know what this person meant - however, we can consider two things: 1 - self expression is
likely embody one's past experiences (thus therapists observe children at play to diagnose abuse issues, etc) 2 it is when giving up pre-conceived notions and taking risks that one can creatively break through oldprogramming/karma

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Multiple
Ex Member

Re: Fifth House« Reply #14 - on: 08.12.2008 at 16:40 [UT] »I saw this a while back which is quite fascinating as it touches briefly on past life and karma in some of theinterpretations: http://www.dkfoundation.co.uk/BookKarmaHouse5.htm
was wondering if anyone had the book? and whether it goes into a lot more detail and depth about each planetin the houses?

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Emma279

Ex Member

Re: love is hard work
« Reply #15 - on: 08.12.2008 at 20:53 [UT] »jupiters daughter, great post, saturn in capricorn in 5th here well aspected - i can relate to alot of that - saturnin the suns house also squares my sun which is like a double whammy though that square is quite wide although this placement can mean a lot of heartache and unhappiness and finding it hard to enjoy yourself/lifeits quite workable, you need patience and faith and just to lighten up and not take things so seriously because
then you do miss out on alot - although saturn always means business so is short on the flirty fun thing, which
i'm sure wehave other aspects in the horoscope to help - my moon/jupiter in sagitarius for me is the antidote i guess on the mega bright side saturn in 5th gives you, like the level 42 song goes, lessons in loveoh yes, fell for 2 bosses in my youth - both were capricorns!

the hesitancy in grabbing happiness, seizing the day, just enjoying yourself is very evident from my experience,
i'm getting there though in older age - god must have stuck it in my chart for a reason
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Silversoul
Member

Re: Fifth House« Reply #16 - on: 08.12.2008 at 21:37 [UT] »My 5th house is my most crowded house, with 3 planets in g and one in h. Unfortunately, all 3 of the Libra
Planets are the so-called "malefic" planets: E, G, and J. Fortunately, the same also includes F h, plus G'splacement is exalted. Unfortunately, these planets also square my 2nd house A and C in d.
Anyway, I guess you could say the way I experience my 5th house is that I love to party, but that it often getsme in trouble.

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Evescaduceus

Member

Re: Fifth House« Reply #17 - on: 08.12.2008 at 21:38 [UT] »Isabel Hickey most likely formed the association of the 5th House with "hidden karma" from a brief passing (orpossibly a more in-depth knowledge) of Vedic astrology, where the 5th House is very clearly identified withpoorvapunya, or past life credit. In Vedic astrology, planets in the 5th House may suggest gifts from past
karmas. Also, karma-generating actions in this life affect the planets of this house most obviously, because the
5th House acts as a kind of gateway to the "Other World".
I have a 5th House stellium as well, with the Sun, Mercury, and Venus in Capricorn placed here. Many of thePosts: 1181

posts mentioned that they do not gamble. I don't gamble much either ($10 on the lottery when I'm feelingflush, but I've never so much as pulled the slots). However, the 5th House is more properly associated withrisk-taking, and gambling is only one form of risk-taking. The kid who is the first in their family to go tocollege takes a huge risk. The soldier or the athlete is always taking risks. So does anyone who starts their own
business. These are the sort of behaviors I look for when I see a 5th House stellium.
People talk a lot about creativity with the 5th House, but to be honest, a stellium doesn't seem strongly
associated with it. Significant trines to 5th House planets seem to be a stronger indicator, but even this isn't
always true.
As Persephone mentioned, the 5th House is the beginning of the relationship. Steven Forrest talks about
having to "get out of the 5th House" in order to make a relationship last, and it is true that most of the charts I
have seen with very busy 6th and 7th Houses seem to be more involved in lasting relationships/marriages thanthose with a crowded 5th House.

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Pixie Vixen
Ex Member

Re: Fifth House« Reply #18 - on: 08.12.2008 at 23:25 [UT] »Hm, well my 5th house is rather empty and only has my Vertex in it (j), but interesting enough someone told
me of something I had never heard of;This chart is for... well, if you think of G as being karmic, right- then do this... this chart might help you findout your "karmic paths" in this house;
Go and draw up a chart of your birthday but of a different time, so you find the exact degree + sign of your
Saturn as your ascendant, alright? Take a look at this chart and then perhaps you might have found some newin site;In my G chart (27 h is my natal G, so it turned to become my rising in that chart), I have my a stellium inthe 5th, so perhaps it is my "destiny" or "karma" in this life to somehow be creative in someway,
music/writing/etc, or maybe somehow to figure out my past woes with love affairs () or maybe somehow
work with kids in the future/perhaps adopt (had intense 8 hour back surgery last year, so I don't think it would
be wise to have a kid ever in my lifetime);(Oh, also I've always felt very *in tune* with small children and am very good at taking care of them/getting
them to do things/relating to them/etc- perhaps that's just because of my Arian nature eh?)
Other than that, in the natal chart, I believe that indeed it can be a house of creativity/love affairs, childrenalthough, I admit with F transiting over it right now, it did indeed... perhaps influence my "overindulgence" intrying to date this year
. It did at least help bring back my writing creativity, but right now it seems to havefallen again... well, ah not fallen but just not enough people around to rp. (well, they are all very busy do tothe holiday season + school + life drama + etc)
Right now I'm having a FmVertex transit and... I can't say nothing big has happened because of that, but atleast I did get invited down to Austin for New Year's!

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PearlsMember

Re: Fifth House« Reply #19 - on: 08.12.2008 at 23:45 [UT] »I have a stelluim in the 5th at 29 degrees of leo - pluto, uranus, jupiter, moon and south node. (I have threesigns in my 5th!) I see my 5th house as light-hearted and quick with a smile. I'm never looking for attention
for myself but have a deep appreciation of others that want attention. I liked the class clown! I'm a great
audience if you're funny! I'm always looking for the humor and "play" in any situation. I like people who know
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how to play - make me smile and I'm yours forever.
I have one child who is a heavy karmic relationship. (You should see our composite!)
Someone mentioned the 5th as having to do with cards - I read tarot. Just picked up the hobby not long ago
and have a real affinity for it. I don't gamble, except for the occasional lottery ticket. Can't draw a straight line,
no artistic or creative talent whatsoever. Once again, when someone else has artistic talent, I think that's neat.
Currently have a saturn transit in my 5th and have been having back problems. I keep hurting my back, sort ofout of the blue.

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Member

Re: Fifth House« Reply #20 - on: 08.12.2008 at 23:45 [UT] »I have vertex in 5th too i, plus D and the trouble maker (for me) I as it's got some horrible aspects like oG
I wasn't remotely maternal in anyway until I had children, not domesticated at all, I just studied hard. I mustbe rather fertile as all were very lovely surprises but my first 2 were conceived on the pill. My eldest was
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Gender:conceived after just 2 months with my now husband. As soon as I had him that was it, I was besotted. I havean attached approach to parenting, I breastfeed until they self wean, cosleep, use slings etc Nobody saw thatcoming at all. They (my mum mainly) thought I'd be cold. We always joke we used all our luck up on having
amazing children (and they are gorgeous too, I'm always complimented on their looks which I read is a D 5ththing). I even love giving birth, I had a homebirth with the youngest and has to be one of the most amazingdays of my life.
I don't know much about vertex.

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Das Stavrou

Ex Member

Re: Fifth House« Reply #21 - on: 08.12.2008 at 23:47 [UT] »Psychologically i feel it relates to "I enjoy being" -- we use our fifth to shine light - by loving being. I'm not a
proponent of traditional astrology so bear with me i'll just throw in a few things here. I believe the house ofchildren in actual fact represents the inner child. Children are able to tune into light/joy incredibly quickly andfor no reason. Which is the sun shining brightly just because. As adults i think we have that clouded by theharsh realities of the world and the fifth house shows how we can reclaim touch with that inner expression oflove and joy. I have a Mars Uranus conjunction here and i cannot help but get excited whenever i can be that,
opportunites to challenge untruthful dogmas - create embarassing situations to bring people back to earth
away from their saturnine towers etc etc.
Not to say that a planet must be present to utilise the house, not at all. I've quite a few performers have strong
energies here, and note i say performers --- tis more the act of expressing and performing that this house deals
with. An expression of the identity that is loved.
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PearlsMember

Re: Fifth House« Reply #22 - on: 09.12.2008 at 00:06 [UT] »Quote from mstray on 08.12.2008 at 23:45 [UT]:
I have vertex in 5th tooi, plus D and the trouble maker (for me) I as it's got some horrible aspects like oG

I wasn't remotely maternal in anyway until I had children, not domesticated at all, I just studied hard. I must be rather fertile as all werevery lovely surprises but my first 2 were conceived on the pill. My eldest was conceived after just 2 months with my now husband. As soon

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as I had him that was it, I was besotted. I have an attached approach to parenting, I breastfeed until they self wean, cosleep, use slings
etc Nobody saw that coming at all. They (my mum mainly) thought I'd be cold. We always joke we used all our luck up on having
amazing children (and they are gorgeous too, I'm always complimented on their looks which I read is abirth, I had a homebirth with the youngest and has to be one of the most amazing days of my life.

D 5th thing). I even love giving

I don't know much about vertex.

I can relate to this post! I breastfed until my son self-weaned and we co-slept. I'm a big bad momma bear andvery protective. My son is very beautiful. If I had a nickel for everytime I've heard that... moon, jupiter, uranus,
south node and pluto in the 5th.
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ShayeenEx Member

Re: Fifth House« Reply #23 - on: 09.12.2008 at 03:59 [UT] »If Saturn interferes with a planet in the 5th House, how does it make that planet manifest? I have F in the 5thHouse, but it is o by G. Maybe this manifests as me not feeling lucky, or good enough? I don't know. Anyone
else have a planet in the 5th with a not so positive aspect to G? Or even G in the 5th? (Would that denychildren in some way?) I do have a big heart and love other people's children as if they were my own. I feel likeI have more in common with a child more than an adult which...I don't really like about myself.
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Waybread
Member

Re: Fifth House« Reply #24 - on: 09.12.2008 at 06:01 [UT] »Great replies, everyone!
Persephone has pointed out that meanings of the 5th house are far greater than the pleasure-seeking, risktaking, children interpretations, notably if one uses derivative (derived) houses. To cite another example, the5th house would also mean income from real estate sales, as the 5th is the 2nd house (money) from the 4th(real estate in the sense of one's home).
Humble Irritant may recall that I am a passionate gardener, mostly of vegetables. I think a consuming (no pun
intended) hobby operates on multiple houses, not just the 5th, which is probably why committed hobbyists
find their interest so engrossing. In the case of gardening, sometimes it is very creative (5th), notably in
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Gender:designing an ornamental garden. It generally is a lot of hard work (6th house), but it also has a spiritual link to
the land for many gardeners (4,th, 12th, or 9th house). Then, I get to eat the vegetables (4th.)
Pengwin's tour through the houses re: parties was hilarious.
Many of the above comments made me wonder how true the old 5th house descriptions are today. If the sun
indicates one's basic identity, and its house location, "where you shine" or "where you feel most like yourself", itdoesn't quite sound like we have a bunch of poker players here!
I have two young adult children, of whom I am extremely fond; and I also tend to feel most like myself whenengaged in some kind of outdoor recreation like hiking or camping. So this seems to fit the 5th house. On theother hand, even with the notorious reputation of Venus in Aquarius in the 5th, I am one of the mostpuritanical people I know!
I have spent most of my adult life in two long-term marriages (7th house), notin love affairs. So this part doesn't seem to fit at all. I chalk this up to a strong Saturn, which makes me
wonder whether a heavy planet can outweigh the supposed effects of a house.
I just came across another meaning of the 5th house, which is that it is about one's passions. Does this sum it
up more efficiently?

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Re: Fifth House« Reply #25 - on: 09.12.2008 at 06:19 [UT] »I dunno waybread.....passions??????? hmmm.....
Ive just looked up "passion" in the dictionary..... and i'm glad i did, because from what i gather, "passion" is aword that links to external things outside ones self....It is not that the spark is created within the body, butinstead is something that happens from the external, to the inner....(somewhat)
I thought the 5th is more like a way to show, to manifest, the internal......to the outer....
Posts: 935
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persephone
Member

Re: Fifth House« Reply #26 - on: 09.12.2008 at 10:11 [UT] »Well, for me passion can be of many kinds. And I think it comes from within, some people have it innate, somepeople need to be triggered - the external other to discover this experience, because they have less in normal
situations. Some people are passionate in their jobs, but not in relationships, some people are just the
opposite.
With my full 5th house I am a very emotionally passionate person, although other aspects of my horoscope arealso responsible for it: hAJnB, eAC... and las but not least, my 5th and all those planets are in i.
Posts: 49

The 5th house is also known as the house of 'sex' if this is an aspect of what you refer to under the term
'passion'.
I think the passion and sex you put in the 5th is the playful one, with the aim of joy, pleasure, interaction,
giving.
The other sexual house - also highly passionate - is the 8th as far as I know. But this house raises a different
aspect. It is rather the posessive, everything or nothing kind of passion. Where you lose yourself completely, or
demand the other to do so.
If you allow me a comparison, I would say the 5th is the lighter, the 8th is the heavier side of the same thing even if you refer to passion or sex or whatever connected. They belong together like light and shadow - btw theruler of my 8th is in the 5th...

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Plutomoon

Ex Member

Re: Fifth House« Reply #27 - on: 09.12.2008 at 11:47 [UT] »The original meaning of the word passion is suffering. As in the passion of christ...
For me when people talk about their passions; meaning their hobbies, interest, ideas they feel a keen and joyfulinterest in, to me is not really the same as passion. Passion is intense, it's the tipping point where ecstacy can
become suffering, and suffering become ecstacy. Passion is transcendental and serious business. But then myidea of passion comes from 8H (venus conjunct neptune in scorpio) and not from the 5H. The descriptions i've
heard of 5H is just way too light and fun, to have that element of intense suffering and torment that would
make it a passion.
Oh welll, that's just me waffling on. I know sod all about 5H
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Mina75
Member

Re: Fifth House« Reply #28 - on: 09.12.2008 at 13:07 [UT] »5th in c. yeah.. I'm a gambler
I'm stimulated by competitive interaction, fun.
I feel very good with kids, spontaneous; I think I'm great into the big sister role.
I was flirting a lot when a teenage; I still love the very beginning of seduction; I love young people.
Its ruler C is 8th m J; let's say joy is a serious thing

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Multiple

Ex Member

Re: Fifth House« Reply #29 - on: 09.12.2008 at 13:50 [UT] »Quote from Shayeen on 09.12.2008 at 03:59 [UT]:If Saturn interferes with a planet in the 5th House, how does it make that planet manifest? I have

F in the 5th House, but it is o by G.

Maybe this manifests as me not feeling lucky, or good enough? I don't know. Anyone else have a planet in the 5th with a not so positive
aspect to? Or evenin the 5th? (Would that deny children in some way?) I do have a big heart and love other people's children as ifGGthey were my own. I feel like I have more in common with a child more than an adult which...I don't really like about myself.

yea I do I have the saturn mars f conjunction in the 5th which is o to my sun, venus, ascendant in c. also G
squares neptune in the 7th.
I have often thought about maybe not having kids. I think kids are great and I can see myself playing with myown for hours and hours but it's the whole responsibility thing,it just feels like such a heavy burden.especiallywith my life structured the way it is now I really can't see myself being the best father I could be.

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RachaelMember

Re: Fifth House« Reply #30 - on: 09.12.2008 at 17:25 [UT] »Quote from Mina75 on 09.12.2008 at 13:07 [UT]:
5th inc. yeah.. I'm a gambler

I'm stimulated by competitive interaction, fun.
I feel very good with kids, spontaneous; I think I'm great into the big sister role.
I was flirting a lot when a teenage; I still love the very beginning of seduction; I love young people.

Posts: 2329
Gender:Its ruler

C is 8th m J; let's say joy is a serious thing

Me too a 5th house c with C in the 8th I still flirt but then again just talking, love words and reading writing
them talking, I am forever a kid and curious about people, what makes them tick.
(But in my chart C is mI).
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simonida

Member

Re: Fifth House« Reply #31 - on: 09.12.2008 at 17:27 [UT] »Hi everybody
My 5th hose start on 27 scale Copricorn and there is onlyC in it on29 scale.I emphasize the scale(level,degree)
because I think it is also very important for interpretation.A long years ago some astologer told me I will have
Posts: 44
Gender:"clever children" And todayI can confirm that is true,both of them are wide comonly educated,both in theirnatal chart haveF in 9 th hose
But if I conect 5th hose with love,creativity I am more k at that aspect of life than j, espacially because the

O at 1st hose and C is ruler of asc and 10th house.

Also I have read 29 scale is scale of culmination and my C and F of my older daughter are just on this scale
I am interested to Your coments about scale-theory
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Re: Fifth House
ShriSaiganeshEjyotish
Member« Reply #32 - on: 09.12.2008 at 18:25 [UT] »dear members,
to share my practical experiences, when planets came to the 5th house i lost employment during transits ofsaturn, jupiter, ketu, rahu, uranus - meaning negation of the 5th house of services; did well when saturn moved
Posts: 7385
Gender:to the 6th, jupiter moved to the 6th, rahu/ketu in the 6th - in trine with the 10th house and the 2nd house saturn/mars/rahu natal 2nd house as per vedic chart.
lord of 6th house jupiter in the 11th aspecting the 5th - have two children, during 5th house transits planets
oppose the jupiter/conjunct pluto in the 11th, hence could be additional cause for loss of employment/position
5th house standing for position/ministership too.
fifth also stands for relationship of our liking, my fifth saturn is conjunct mars in the 2nd house, liked my wife
when i made my choice for marriage - technically qualified in maths, hardworking, enterprising in approach,value addition to the family, ofcourse we quarrel a lot too.
according to vedic astrology lords of trine and a cardinal house cause a raja yoga - have started as an assistantin hr and rose to position of head-hr when jupiter transited saturn-mars with promotions whenever jupitertranisted enhancing my position with pleasant surprises during those years - 5th house is the house of surprises
too.
5th house is the 9th from the 9th house - depicting karma, have low marks in the vedic astakavarga systemassigning weightages to each planet and the houses, hence frequent bad luck too with long waits for
employment once lost and frequent periods of gloom and disturbance in the family.
5th house, house for children - house of saturn, current uranus transit sort of rebellion from children causing
alientation.
fifth house for intelligence and education - saturn/mars/rahu conjunction in the 2nd - completed graduation
with difficulty alongwith work/early job managing to pass out; was a merit student during school days which
faded out as i reached the metriculation stage.
born 6th jan 1956, 01-57am, tenali/india, maleno regular employment since 2002, seeking job again since dec 25th last hoping against hope.
hope the above spontaneous sharing of my personal experiences will add to the study of the 5th house, which i
realise while reflecting on the 5th house thread.
regards,

kshantaram
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Re: Fifth House

yukionna

Ex Member« Reply #33 - on: 09.12.2008 at 19:10 [UT] »Hi,
If I think of the 5th house, the first that comes into mind is authenticity. It's the place where we express who
we truly are in an authentic way. And that can be anything, from kids, art, sex, to cleaning dishes if that
happens to be the expression of who you are
Yuki
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Re: Fifth House

Pixie Vixen
Ex Member« Reply #34 - on: 09.12.2008 at 23:49 [UT] »Quote from persephone on 09.12.2008 at 10:11 [UT]:The 5th house is also known as the house of 'sex' if this is an aspect of what you refer to under the term 'passion'.
I think the passion and sex you put in the 5th is the playful one, with the aim of joy, pleasure, interaction, giving.
The other sexual house - also highly passionate - is the 8th as far as I know. But this house raises a different aspect. It is rather theposessive, everything or nothing kind of passion. Where you lose yourself completely, or demand the other to do so.
..

Technically the 8th is "the house of sex", although you can associate the 5th with sex in terms of "having fun"and obviously in a love affair you might have sex, yes? You can get "creative" with sex and it can become ahobby/etc, but I believe the 8th is the House where sex is "soul binding", to have sex to have a union of thesoul rather than possibly a short term dating relationship or to "have fun" with it.
Obviously hobbies/creative pursuits can lead to someone feel rather passionate about it and such, so thus
people can associate sex, to a degree with the 5th, although I honestly associate it when perhaps I think of sex
in a very casual way rather than connecting, if that makes sense;
I don't find the 8th and sex being possessive unless you want to list the possible negative aspect, so on theflipside the 5th house and sex can be rather too casual/brief passing fancy, as if you are using it as merely ahobby/creative pursuit rather than a way to "be closer" to someone. Maybe someone who uses their 5th houseenergy to delve deeper into sex is a porn star or a prostitute? Or maybe they have casual sex all the time andcould care less if they are really being truly intimate with the person, on more than physical level.
Also, they could work maybe in a "sex shop" selling all sorts of costumes/toys/etc or in relationships, evenserious ones, they might see it as the most important part of the relationship, the "creative sex" part. Hm, tobe simplistic though with this, maybe the person would just be super creative in bed!

Again, demanding the other to do so is not really an 8th house thing rather than a... negative trait, so thesame could be same of the 5th, demanding the other to take it lightly/more playfully rather than seriously. If
the other doesn't lose himself completely, then you should probably move on and let go of that whatever thatwas.
So yeah, technically both houses can be thought of passionate, but in different light- perhaps one is morecreative and one is more soulful.
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Humble IrritantMember

Re: Fifth House« Reply #35 - on: 10.12.2008 at 02:02 [UT] »technically the 8th is not the house of sex AT ALL!....

but i am NOT going to argue this, on waybreads thread, unless she says i can!

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Re: Fifth House
Leogirlwithcancerrising
Ex Member« Reply #36 - on: 10.12.2008 at 02:10 [UT] »Quote from scorpio_me on 08.12.2008 at 11:04 [UT]:CIDAh in 5th, squaring Ee in 2nd, and K in e ... There's a theme there about Leo/5th house which has to do with subjective (thatis, "I") experiencing joyful living, all senses engaged and pleasured. No interest in any serious work - if it seems too 'grown up' I'm notinterested - though I can work for days without sleep if it's a creative project and I am passionate about it.

Same applies for me OI in 5th as well
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Pixie Vixen

Ex Member

Re: Fifth House« Reply #37 - on: 10.12.2008 at 02:18 [UT] »Quote from Humble Irritant on 10.12.2008 at 02:02 [UT]:technically the 8th is not the house of sex AT ALL!....

but i am NOT going to argue this, on waybreads thread, unless she says i can!

Alright, I'm not going to argue traditional versus modern Astrology with you missy, if that's what that is allabout... in modern Astrology, it *is* the house of sex- I've seen far too many arguments in other places online
about this though so, think what you want~
http://www.astrology.com/aboutastrology/interpreting/houses/house8.html
But check this out too, very interesting blog entry:
http://blogs.astrology.com/astrology_for_artists/2008/09/the-5th-house-sex-fun-g ambling.html
I do have to agree, 5th in being the house to have sex for the sake of sex rather than something else~
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Multiple
Ex Member

Re: Fifth House« Reply #38 - on: 10.12.2008 at 03:37 [UT] »Quote from Pixie Vixen on 10.12.2008 at 02:18 [UT]:
Quote from Humble Irritant on 10.12.2008 at 02:02 [UT]:technically the 8th is not the house of sex AT ALL!....

but i am NOT going to argue this, on waybreads thread, unless she says i can!

Alright, I'm not going to argue traditional versus modern Astrology with you missy, if that's what that is all about... in modern

Astrology, it *is* the house of sex- I've seen far too many arguments in other places online about this though so, think what you want~
http://www.astrology.com/aboutastrology/interpreting/houses/house8.html
But check this out too, very interesting blog entry:
http://blogs.astrology.com/astrology_for_artists/2008/09/the-5th-house-sex-fun-g ambling.html
I do have to agree, 5th in being the house to have sex for the sake of sex rather than something else~

I kind of agree but don't really see 5th house sex as being sex devoid of any deep meaning.like for instance it's
not all stuff like one night stands,sex without meaning or emotion, it can depend on the individuals really...
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Pixie Vixen

Ex Member

Re: Fifth House« Reply #39 - on: 10.12.2008 at 03:41 [UT] »Quote from Multiple on 10.12.2008 at 03:37 [UT]:

I kind of agree but don't really see 5th house sex as being sex devoid of any deep meaning.like for instance it's not all stuff like one night
stands,sex without meaning or emotion, it can depend on the individuals really...

Yeah, of course it's not all like stuff with one night stands, or sex without meaning or emotion, it really does
depend on the person, but I just meant that... sex there is different from the interpretation of sex in the 8th, I
honestly never really associate sex with the 5th, but probably because I have so much in the 8th that anythingthat is not "all" instead of just part of the way or nothing is pointless to me- not that the 5th cannot havemeaning/depth, but...
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Re: Fifth House« Reply #40 - on: 10.12.2008 at 04:38 [UT] »Quote from Pixie Vixen on 10.12.2008 at 02:18 [UT]:
Quote from Humble Irritant on 10.12.2008 at 02:02 [UT]:technically the 8th is not the house of sex AT ALL!....

but i am NOT going to argue this, on waybreads thread, unless she says i can!

Posts: 935
Gender:Alright, I'm not going to argue traditional versus modern Astrology with you missy, if that's what that is all about... in modern

Astrology, it *is* the house of sex- I've seen far too many arguments in other places online about this though so, think what you want~
http://www.astrology.com/aboutastrology/interpreting/houses/house8.html
But check this out too, very interesting blog entry:
http://blogs.astrology.com/astrology_for_artists/2008/09/the-5th-house-sex-fun-g ambling.html
I do have to agree, 5th in being the house to have sex for the sake of sex rather than something else~

pixie, its not just trad astro......but your bias anyway, with your loaded 8th house......dont worry, if i had aloaded 8th house, id want it to mean sex too....
if anything the 8th is sex for the sake of having sex...seeing as the purpose of sex is for procreation, then the
5th fits fine!

Back to the 5th....
i like the astro wiki-en view of the 5th.....http://wiki.astro.com/astrowiki/en/House_Five
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Pixie Vixen

Ex Member

Re: Fifth House« Reply #41 - on: 10.12.2008 at 05:01 [UT] »Quote from Humble Irritant on 10.12.2008 at 04:38 [UT]:

pixie, its not just trad astro......but your bias anyway, with your loaded 8th house......dont worry, if i had a loaded 8th house, id want it tomean sex too....
if anything the 8th is sex for the sake of having sex...seeing as the purpose of sex is for procreation, then the 5th fits fine!

Back to the 5th....
i like the astro wiki-en view of the 5th.....http://wiki.astro.com/astrowiki/en/House_Five

Then I seriously have no idea where you come up with this
! I do know that there are others out there thatthink the House of Sex can be thought of as the 5th, but *the* house of sex is the 8th- it is the house of the"little death".
The 8th for the house of sex for the sake of sake? You do know what the 8th is, right? It's the house of
Death/Rebirth/Transformations/Regenerations/Suffering/Inheritances, taxes, blah blah etc... so the 8th uses it
for things *beyond* simply sex, so you are agreeing with me a bit in saying that the 5th can be associated with
sex for purposes of procreation hm? That's actually a good point, considering the 5th is the house of Children.
As an 8th houser, I have to say that when I have sex, *I have sex*, just as anyone can have even if they havean empty 8th house- I do it to see someone for *who they really are* and deny someone who simply wants tohave sex for me just for the sake for sex, because that is rather shallow don't you think?
The 8th is anything but sex for the sake of sex and no I don't believe this in being the house of sex justbecause I'm an 8th houser, sex isn't my favorite activity in the world! Even if my 8th was empty I'd still
believe this...
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Humble IrritantMember

Re: Fifth House« Reply #42 - on: 10.12.2008 at 05:18 [UT] »If you want proof.....go to the horary thread, and have a look at every pregnancy question...significator isalways the 5th....children, sex for procreation, pregnancy......5th.
Ask some of the 60 or 70 year old astrologers on this forum, who have been doing this forever...sex for
procreation...the 5th...i bet most of them will agree with me....
Im not saying the 8th doesnt have a place with sex, but falling pregnant....5th 5th 5th.....
Posts: 935
Gender:you do make me mad...you know that dont you.....

(what are your chart details again....i wanna compare our charts)

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Pixie Vixen

Ex Member

Re: Fifth House« Reply #43 - on: 10.12.2008 at 05:29 [UT] »Quote from Humble Irritant on 10.12.2008 at 05:18 [UT]:
If you want proof.....go to the horary thread, and have a look at every pregnancy question...significator is always the 5th....children, sex
for procreation, pregnancy......5th.
Ask some of the 60 or 70 year old astrologers on this forum, who have been doing this forever...sex for procreation...the 5th...i bet mostof them will agree with me....
Im not saying the 8th doesnt have a place with sex, but falling pregnant....5th 5th 5th.....
you do make me mad...you know that dont you.....

(what are your chart details again....i wanna compare our charts)

Um, alright- to have sex you don't necessarily have to have children, yes? I have never in my life had sex tohave children and I might not ever in my lifetime so, I believe you are confusing the topic a bit;
When I say sex, I mean the act- I do not mean what could happen afterwards if accidental/on purpose,
although there are some Christian fundamentalists or Baptists and most definitely some Catholics who believethat sex is merely a way to procreate plain and simple, not for anything else.
I was saying the House of Sex is the 8th, not that the House of 5th wasn't the house of procreationthat the 5th can lead to children, most definitely- so I have been misinterpreted.

! I know

If you wanted to bring up your argument, I would suggest next time making it more clear what you mean- you
meant that the 8th house isn't the house of procreation and the 5th leads to children, yes?
And you somehow irritate me, but that's a given.
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Humble IrritantMember

Re: Fifth House« Reply #44 - on: 10.12.2008 at 05:32 [UT] »ok....i cant be arsed banging my head against a wall anymore....
sorry waybread, i tried...i wasnt going to keep going....
back to passions and the 5th....

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pegasus17

Ex Member

Re: Fifth House« Reply #45 - on: 10.12.2008 at 06:05 [UT] »Quote from Pixie Vixen on 08.12.2008 at 23:25 [UT]:Hm, well my 5th house is rather empty and only has my Vertex in it (j), but interesting enough someone told me of something I had

never heard of;This chart is for... well, if you think of

G as being karmic, right- then do this... this chart might help you find out your "karmic paths" inthis house;
Go and draw up a chart of your birthday but of a different time, so you find the exact degree + sign of your Saturn as your ascendant,
alright? Take a look at this chart and then perhaps you might have found some new in site;
In my

G chart (27 h is my natal G, so it turned to become my rising in that chart), I have my a stellium in the 5th, so perhaps it ismy "destiny" or "karma" in this life to somehow be creative in someway, music/writing/etc, or maybe somehow to figure out my past
woes with love affairs () or maybe somehow work with kids in the future/perhaps adopt (had intense 8 hour back surgery last year, so

I don't think it would be wise to have a kid ever in my lifetime);(Oh, also I've always felt very *in tune* with small children and am very good at taking care of them/getting them to do things/relating
to them/etc- perhaps that's just because of my Arian nature eh?)

Other than that, in the natal chart, I believe that indeed it can be a house of creativity/love affairs, children- although, I admit withtransiting over it right now, it did indeed... perhaps influence my "overindulgence" in trying to date this year

F

. It did at least help bringback my writing creativity, but right now it seems to have fallen again... well, ah not fallen but just not enough people around to rp.

(well, they are all very busy do to the holiday season + school + life drama + etc)
Right now I'm having a

FmVertex transit and... I can't say nothing big has happened because of that, but at least I did get invited down

to Austin for New Year's!

I've done that Saturn on the Asc chart too. Many years ago.
And a Sun chart, and a Moon Chart, and a Venus, etc.
All the planets. It was very interesting.

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Re: Fifth House« Reply #46 - on: 10.12.2008 at 06:06 [UT] »Well, despite having Venus in Aquarius in the 5th, I sure don't fit some of the racier interpretations of loveaffairs given above!
I think in the 5th, sex qualifies as an amusement. An earlier generation of men might have termed the 5th the"wine, women, and song" house. I think in the 8th, sex is both a product of marriage/a long-term relationship(the 2nd house from the 7th, and noting the traditional meaning of the 7th) but also part of the deep mysteryof sex-birth-life-death-rebirth. I have a book on rulerships in astrology, which primarily gives sex to the 8thhouse; but secondarily to the 5th. For some relationships, sex obviously partakes of both houses, and possiblyof the 7th, as well.
Posts: 14740
Gender:I am often perplexed in astrology that a single house can have so many different meanings...multiplied if one
uses derivative houses. I find it difficult in a blind or near-blind chart-reading to get a grasp of which meaning
will be uppermost in the person's life.
Maybe one theme to revisit is investigating the ruler of the 5th. I don't work with natural house rulers, but thiswould be the sun. In my own chart, the "accidental" cusp ruler would be Saturn, as I have Capricorn on thecusp of the 5th. I have Saturn in Virgo in the 12th, so I don't dare gamble (plus I have never liked the sleazy
feel of casinos or on-line games--how Saturnine izzat?
) Saturn aspects each of my 5th house planets: aquincunx, a tri-septile, and a wide opposition. So it doesn't seem as though the "party house" will be loadedwith light amusements with this kind of configuration.
Anybody familiar with Tarot cards? The major card called "the sun" may get at the possible Inner Child meaningof the 5th house.
H. I., you're right on topic! W.

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pegasus17

Ex Member

Re: Fifth House« Reply #47 - on: 10.12.2008 at 06:11 [UT] »My opinion is that sex is the eighth house.
Secret affairs can be a combination of the 12th & 8th houses.
Fifth is for love affairs. And it represents the child(ren), how the parent treats the child or how the parent
views the child, and the other parent of the child(ren).
My own fifth house is empty.
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Humble IrritantMember

Re: Fifth House« Reply #48 - on: 10.12.2008 at 06:19 [UT] »i might be on topic, but i am sick to death of the bloody 8th and 5th...........why does it need to be so freaking
difficult.....and why do i always have to be wrong against such people who call me missy.....
ARRR GGGGGHHHHHHH.................................im a smart bloody woman, but always look hopeless on thisforum....
Im gonna end up giving up on astrology...i dont know anything apparently.
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Mina75

Member

Re: Fifth House« Reply #49 - on: 10.12.2008 at 08:28 [UT] »for me 5th could be sex, as a personnal expression, as a way to feel better, to feel confident, to express joy;
generously, but with some narcissism.
8th could be sex as a mystical experience, as a fusion with the other, to be lost in it, to be transformed.
5th as being a proud parent, 8th as giving birth (transformation-death-reborn).
Posts: 2785
Gender:5th is Leo, 8th is Scorpio.
let's say sex is Fire & Water

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Member

Re: Fifth House« Reply #50 - on: 10.12.2008 at 08:33 [UT] »Quote from Humble Irritant on 10.12.2008 at 06:19 [UT]:i might be on topic, but i am sick to death of the bloody 8th and 5th...........why does it need to be so freaking difficult.....and why do ialways have to be wrong against such people who call me missy.....
ARRR GGGGGHHHHHHH.................................im a smart bloody woman, but always look hopeless on this forum....
Im gonna end up giving up on astrology...i dont know anything apparently.

Posts: 49

I think you shouldn't, the truth is always somewhere halfway. We learn from each other not only when we wantto, even if the arguement touches a sore point.
I think the two houses just show the different faces and possibilities, meanings of the same thing we call sex.
And that is logical for me. What I wrote previously I learnt it from my former teacher, who has been dealing
with astrology for over 40 years. He mentioned the same thing you did as well, sex 'resulting' in children isdefinitely in the 5th. Mixed it with other meanings of the house comes the playfulness and creativity, etc. But as
the "little death", the transformation, etc. is a Scorpio analogy - and we all know Scorpios - sex is a perfect fit
for the 8th house as well... but not only the positive side, think about the will to control and the difficulties ofletting go. So this kind of sex is rather a serious transcendental experience, technically more what we call
simply 'sex'.
Plus in my opinion that is the best in astrology - you need intuition and creativity to synthesize all the possible
meanings and still catch the one appropriate analogy. The houses don't have meanings in themselves only, it isa whole system, a wonderful and dinamic system, and we need time to really get all the meanings and go alongwith the flow of the horoscope.

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ErinleeEx Member

Re: Fifth House« Reply #51 - on: 10.12.2008 at 15:20 [UT] »In my b 5th house, I have F and F rules my 12th house, where I have I. Then my 5th huse ruler D isretrograde and m IC, SN, and N
I have 3 kids who are all very creative (mainly art and music) yet I seem to struggle with my own creative
energy, in that I'm rather scattered...have very tight FoE.
I'm responsibile, yet still like a kid myself. I have so much fun being with kids, not just mine, all of them.
Kids in general seem drawn to me, I tend to bring out creativity in children, but still struggling to bring out myown creativity. I've been very unlucky in love though, but I'm the biggest hopeless romantic.
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Re: Fifth House
Leogirlwithcancerrising
Ex Member« Reply #52 - on: 10.12.2008 at 23:09 [UT] »Quote from Pixie Vixen on 10.12.2008 at 05:29 [UT]:
Quote from Humble Irritant on 10.12.2008 at 05:18 [UT]:
If you want proof.....go to the horary thread, and have a look at every pregnancy question...significator is always the
5th....children, sex for procreation, pregnancy......5th.
Ask some of the 60 or 70 year old astrologers on this forum, who have been doing this forever...sex for procreation...the
5th...i bet most of them will agree with me....
Im not saying the 8th doesnt have a place with sex, but falling pregnant....5th 5th 5th.....
you do make me mad...you know that dont you.....

(what are your chart details again....i wanna compare our charts)

Um, alright- to have sex you don't necessarily have to have children, yes? I have never in my life had sex to have children and I might
not ever in my lifetime so, I believe you are confusing the topic a bit;
When I say sex, I mean the act- I do not mean what could happen afterwards if accidental/on purpose, although there are some Christian
fundamentalists or Baptists and most definitely some Catholics who believe that sex is merely a way to procreate plain and simple, not foranything else.
I was saying the House of Sex is the 8th, not that the House of 5th wasn't the house of procreation
children, most definitely- so I have been misinterpreted! I know that the 5th can lead to.

If you wanted to bring up your argument, I would suggest next time making it more clear what you mean- you meant that the 8th house
isn't the house of procreation and the 5th leads to children, yes?
And you somehow irritate me, but that's a given.

I have OI KJ 5th house,and have never wanted children ever. But I am very creative,love music andphotography. Not very sexual either btw
Also,I am attracted to "outcasts" and "strange" people.
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Re: Fifth House

Pixie Vixen

Ex Member« Reply #53 - on: 10.12.2008 at 23:30 [UT] »Quote from Leogirlwithcancerrising on 10.12.2008 at 23:09 [UT]:

I haveOI KJ 5th house,and have never wanted children ever. But I am very creative,love music and photography. Not very sexual

either btw
Also,I am attracted to "outcasts" and "strange" people.

A e with 5th house planets in the natural house of e, yes yes how nice!

It is indeed the House of Creativity though, oh boy is it! I've known of people with 5th house planets...
especially inner ones and yeah, they were creative.
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Re: Fifth House
Leogirlwithcancerrising
Ex Member« Reply #54 - on: 10.12.2008 at 23:35 [UT] »Quote from Pixie Vixen on 10.12.2008 at 23:30 [UT]:
Quote from Leogirlwithcancerrising on 10.12.2008 at 23:09 [UT]:

I haveOI KJ 5th house,and have never wanted children ever. But I am very creative,love music and photography. Notvery sexual either btw
Also,I am attracted to "outcasts" and "strange" people.

Ae with 5th house planets in the natural house of e, yes yes how nice!

It is indeed the House of Creativity though, oh boy is it! I've known of people with 5th house planets... especially inner ones and yeah,
they were creative.

Hehe..You like the e's dontchah
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Pixie Vixen

Ex Member

Re: Fifth House« Reply #55 - on: 10.12.2008 at 23:46 [UT] »Quote from Leogirlwithcancerrising on 10.12.2008 at 23:35 [UT]:Hehe..You like the

e's dontchah

They always fill my heart with glee
! I've never met one in person that I didn't like... but I haven't
met *that* many, just a few. It's just that my best friend is one and another close one that I cherish, so.

So let's here it for the Lions, rawr

! From one fire sign to another <3/e <3 rant
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Re: Fifth House
Leogirlwithcancerrising
Ex Member« Reply #56 - on: 10.12.2008 at 23:52 [UT] »Oh well

LovelyBack to top
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LeogirlwithcancerrisingRe: Fifth HouseEx Member« Reply #57 - on: 10.12.2008 at 23:57 [UT] »I'm more of a little pussycat; Miiiaaooo

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Das Stavrou
Ex Member

Re: Fifth House« Reply #58 - on: 11.12.2008 at 03:05 [UT] »Quote from Humble Irritant on 10.12.2008 at 06:19 [UT]:i might be on topic, but i am sick to death of the bloody 8th and 5th...........why does it need to be so freaking difficult.....and why do ialways have to be wrong against such people who call me missy.....
ARRR GGGGGHHHHHHH.................................im a smart bloody woman, but always look hopeless on this forum....
Im gonna end up giving up on astrology...i dont know anything apparently.

Why does the opinion of another have so much power over you?
Now that is a question to ask of your eighth
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Humble IrritantMember

Re: Fifth House« Reply #59 - on: 11.12.2008 at 03:53 [UT] »I dont like patronized, by being called missy, by someone younger than myself.

also, if you want to look at why i am like this, take a look at my chart ok.
13/01/75 7.16am frankston australia
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Penguin Trauma
Ex Member

Re: Fifth House« Reply #60 - on: 14.12.2008 at 21:32 [UT] »Has anyone (who's a parent here) looked at the 5th house, and it's relation to their children's signs?
For instance - my Dad has a loaded 5th house, Scorpio Mercury, Sagittarius Venus and Mars. My sis is a Virgowith Scorpio moon (Dad's Mercury in Scorpio) and I'm a Sagittarius Moon and ASC with a prominent Venus(Dad's Sag Venus and Mars)My Mum has no planets, but the house cusp is Capricorn - my sister's Ascendant.
In turn, my sister has 5th house Saturn in Gemini - daughter is an Air sign (her Gemini), and son is a double
Capricorn (her Saturn).
I dunno if that's just coincidence, or something to look at. Gonna have to look at other people's charts, who
are parents.
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Member

Re: Fifth House« Reply #61 - on: 15.12.2008 at 00:37 [UT] »Humble Irritant:
Change your name to just "Irritant" as in no way are you humble. I have noticed you constantly annoying
others in threads and I am sure much of this is your Mercury square Uranus-(I am guessing) and some otherghastly mix. You tell people not to be patronizing and yet that's exactly how I would describe yourcommunication with obnoxious thrown in. I have left threads or not wanted to be part of them because ofyour presence. You speak as if you wrote the book on some of these theories. Everyone is here contributing
Posts: 6447
Gender:and learning-the 5th and the 8th house are houses of sex in different measures...and therefore are somehow
linked to contribute to children birth etc.

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Re: Fifth House« Reply #62 - on: 15.12.2008 at 02:08 [UT] »Quote from _Inanna_ on 15.12.2008 at 00:37 [UT]:
Humble Irritant:
Change your name to just "Irritant" as in no way are you humble. I have noticed you constantly annoying others in threads and I am suremuch of this is your Mercury square Uranus-(I am guessing) and some other ghastly mix. You tell people not to be patronizing and yet
that's exactly how I would describe your communication with obnoxious thrown in. I have left threads or not wanted to be part of thembecause of your presence. You speak as if you wrote the book on some of these theories. Everyone is here contributing and learning-the
5th and the 8th house are houses of sex in different measures...and therefore are somehow linked to contribute to children birth etc.

Posts: 935
Gender:this couldnt be done in a PM Inanna?
you know, i had two people last week write to me and tell me they loved my posts....
.......if you care to explain what the actual problem is, via a pm, without the insults, then i will see if i canrectify anything.....
peace and love to you

edit a bit later:.....nothing i have done on this post, comes close to the insults youve just given me......'andsome other ghastly mix'.....I have no time for this rubbish....
Its so good of you, to use your skills to understand someone rather than berate them.......a gold star for you
Inanna..........
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Waybread

Member

Re: Fifth House« Reply #63 - on: 15.12.2008 at 05:13 [UT] »I think that personal attacks belong in PMs or maybe in another thread. Or just forgotten. I was hoping we
could discuss the 5th house on this thread.
Anyone?

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TommyMac1018
Member

Re: Fifth House« Reply #64 - on: 15.12.2008 at 07:43 [UT] »From my personal experience, the 5th house is tied directly to our experience of the Divine Child inside of us,
that symbol of unlimited potential and immortality, our opportunity to directly glimpse our innate divinity;
planets placed there represent gifts or features which belong to this Inner Child, or our experience of him/her,and when they are honed, honored, and given creative expression through whatever means -- and there arequite a few available, as long as they are original and individual -- we gain an intuitive sense of our own
uniqueness or specialness, and achieve some sense of divinity. That is, to become a god, to live forever,transported to a heightened, mythic, and archetypal realm. And this holy and indeed dramatic experience is thelink that binds having children as well as having sex to the fifth house perspective, not to mention the creative
artist, though creativity can exist on many other subtler levels.
Posts: 111
Gender:This honing and honoring conceit in my opinion is glimpsed in parenting, and our "children" as they aredescribed by the 5th perhaps are merely projections of the Divine Child inside of us, as if we are acting out ourlittle prince(ss) that lives within through the literal act of birthing and raising progeny without. After all, ourchildren, with all their lives ahead of them and their fresh energy, drive, and exuberance, are excellent hooks for
the Child inside. Planets in the 5th describe how we experience and interact with this internal child, so whenviewed from this perspective, we cannot be surprised that a 5th house Saturn has stern, sober, responsible
children, ones that he raise with strict discipline. Compare him to a woman with Jupiter in the 5th, and all her
kids are high spirited and imaginative and prone to excess, while she herself raises them with a liberal hand.
These scenarios aren't that removed from acting our own seventh house planets through our partners.
But as stated above, our "children" can mean other things besides just literal kids. And remember, some of us
cannot have children, or bear no need for literal youngsters around them. "Children" taken on the metaphoricallevel implies anything that represents the innocent, unlimited potential inside ourselves. I work in retail, and a
few years ago I had a store manager who was a Leo with many planets in the 5th in her horoscope. She wasadamant that she didn't ever want to have children. But with her, the store itself was her child, and she worked
to give it optimal expression as a symbol of her own individuality, something that would outlive her and gain akind of stellar prominence. The store was an expression of her abundant creativity, and thus, the 5th reallycauses us to re-evaluate our perceptions of children, both our own and others, and what it truly means toparent.
Another key word that keeps coming up in reference to the 5th is "creativity". What might this mean to"create"? Curiously, the root of the word means "to cause to grow" which brings back the idea of parenting andchildren. When we truly create something, we are making something out of nothing. This implies imagination,and to the ancients, the imagination was seen as magical. The imagination is something holy. Consider theidea: when an artist sets herself before a canvas and begins to paint, or when a musician plucks the strings of a
guitar, or when the performer opens his throat to sing, they all bring into existence something literally out of
seemingly nothing besides the imagination, like the gods of myth who create the manifest cosmos from chaos.
That's why creative people inspire so much awe in others, because we intuitively sense that have some gift fromthe gods or life to be able to do what they do. It truly is like magic. Creativity, like literal parenting, makes us,
however fleetingly, divine, and I feel personal divinity lies at the core of this house. And with the 5th, thecreativity serves the purpose of giving us an intuitive flash of ourselves, because when we create, if we are notwholly ourselves, it is not legitimate and not real expression.
And finally, sex and romance as expressed by the 5th should be very easy to understand because it is simply
another avenue where we are afforded the opportunity to be wholly ourselves, naked, unashamed, innocent,and through the rapture with another, exalted to that great, glamorous and mythic realm, and express all our
procreative fertility, like Zeus with Danae, or Yahweh manifested all life in merely seven days.
With all of this heightened drama going on, planets that are placed in the 5th, at least from what I've seen,
have a tendency to be magnified in their expression, to be dramatized and mythologized, even when placed inearthy signs. Or at least, they demand to be, because the Divine Child within us, much like children, don't wantnothing less than everything. And when we magnify something, we literally shine a light on it, like the lightfrom the sun, or a theatre spotlight, focusing it and making it the center. So heavy 5th house people are oftenvery self-centered, or at least should be, because their focus lies so deeply within. They are often somewhat
childlike, spontaneous and exuberant, because they have such deep dialogue with the Eternal Child inside. And
they can be extremely creative, or at least afforded the opportunity to determine the deeper meanings behindcreativity, because their sense of self is so bound up with that high ideal.

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Erinlee

Ex Member

Re: Fifth House« Reply #65 - on: 16.12.2008 at 16:31 [UT] »Quote from Penguin Trauma on 14.12.2008 at 21:32 [UT]:Has anyone (who's a parent here) looked at the 5th house, and it's relation to their children's signs?
For instance - my Dad has a loaded 5th house, Scorpio Mercury, Sagittarius Venus and Mars. My sis is a Virgo with Scorpio moon (Dad's
Mercury in Scorpio) and I'm a Sagittarius Moon and ASC with a prominent Venus (Dad's Sag Venus and Mars)My Mum has no planets, but the house cusp is Capricorn - my sister's Ascendant.
In turn, my sister has 5th house Saturn in Gemini - daughter is an Air sign (her Gemini), and son is a double Capricorn (her Saturn).
I dunno if that's just coincidence, or something to look at. Gonna have to look at other people's charts, who are parents.

I just checked me and my children's dad charts...both he and I have F in the 5th house. I have F in b, andhe has F in l. Our Son has a l A and b B, and his 5th house just happens to be i, and the ruler F is in

k 6th house and part of a stellium...he's got FmImO.
Then our daughter has A B C D E F J all in i...She's got a stellium in the 5th house with the A m B m

C m J, and then DmEmF in the 6th house.
Her MC is the same as my 25 degree l A and her NN is at 26 degrees g, same sign and degree as her Dad's
1st house O.
Neither seem like a coincidence to me

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DeniseS
Member

Re: Fifth House« Reply #66 - on: 19.12.2008 at 08:01 [UT] »I have three planets in the Fifth House--A, C & F. I don't gamble at all, but I'm super interested in the stock
market, different investments, etc. I've bought & sold stock, and I have mutual funds, CD's etc and it's worked
out well for me (even in the bad economy I'm still doing okay). I am very creative--I like to write, draw, play

Posts: 29

all kinds of games--card games, video games or whatever. I haven't had much going on in the love affair
department (I was married really young) but I do have children. Someone in the thread above me said that noone thought they would be a good parent until they had kids, it was the same thing with me too.
Quote:The sun here would make you appear like a child to others. Mercury here would give a quick and at time childish thoughts.
Jupiter here would make the person more popular with others and also good with jokes.

The first too definitely apply, because people treat me like I'm a little kid at times even though I'm 34 years
old. I feel like people are always being patronizing towards me and it drives me crazy. I don't know about
Jupiter though---well, I sure as heck couldn't be less popular with others.
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SUNinLEO

Member

Re: Fifth House« Reply #67 - on: 19.12.2008 at 08:52 [UT] »my only planet in fifth is A

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uni_ureMember

Re: Fifth House« Reply #68 - on: 19.12.2008 at 09:09 [UT] »Even I have A of c whereas my little kid has O of lPosts: 307

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Re: Fifth House« Reply #69 - on: 19.12.2008 at 19:51 [UT] »I have j in my 5th house. Also, I have Ceres in k and M in j in the 5th house. What does this mean?

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Night Sky
Member

Re: Fifth House« Reply #70 - on: 19.12.2008 at 20:31 [UT] »Quote from grrrlriot on 19.12.2008 at 19:51 [UT]:
I havej in my 5th house. Also, I have Ceres in k and M in j in the 5th house. What does this mean?

I got that too Grrlriot,
Posts: 993
Gender:j on the cusp of house 5 with Ceres and M Square 3rd houseA.
The only thing I can think of is to look at where G is, as this would be ruler of 5th.
Don´t really know what to make of it.

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grrrlriot

Member

Re: Fifth House« Reply #71 - on: 19.12.2008 at 20:36 [UT] »Quote from Night Sky on 19.12.2008 at 20:31 [UT]:
Quote from grrrlriot on 19.12.2008 at 19:51 [UT]:
I havej in my 5th house. Also, I have Ceres in k and M in j in the 5th house. What does this mean?

I got that too Grrlriot,

j on the cusp of house 5 with Ceres and M Square 3rd houseA.
The only thing I can think of is to look at wherePosts: 451
Gender:Don´t really know what to make of it.

Thanks for the reply, Night Sky!
is in h.
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G is, as this would be ruler of 5th.

Everyone I've asked has been confused on this. lol I'll post up my chart. G

birthchart14_001.gif (attachment deleted)
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Night Sky
Member

Re: Fifth House« Reply #72 - on: 20.12.2008 at 00:19 [UT] »Quote from grrrlriot on 19.12.2008 at 20:36 [UT]:
Quote from Night Sky on 19.12.2008 at 20:31 [UT]:
Quote from grrrlriot on 19.12.2008 at 19:51 [UT]:
I havej in my 5th house. Also, I have Ceres in k and M in j in the 5th house. What does this mean?

I got that too Grrlriot,

Posts: 993
Gender:j on the cusp of house 5 with Ceres and M Square 3rd houseA.
The only thing I can think of is to look at where

G is, as this would be ruler of 5th.

Don´t really know what to make of it.

Thanks for the reply, Night Sky!

Everyone I've asked has been confused on this. lol I'll post up my chart.

G is in h.

Grrlriot, I am as interested as you in finding something on this combination. But since you have the exact sameplacement as me what with having hG in the 2nd house, I am intruiged by your experience of it. If you haveeny experience of it at all.
My hG is t my f Ascendant, which I think of as a killjoy placement.
Here is something I found which I thought interesting:
Quote:
I have Capricorn on my 5th house cusp, which means that Saturn rules this house. From my astrology books, I learned that this is anunfortunate placement. Nothing squashes fun like grim-faced Saturn. (Now you know why I'm writing about 5th house anhedonia!) With
Capricorn on the 5th, the astrology books said I likely couldn't have children; if I did, they would bring me grief. I did have my son late inlife (Saturn can delay matters). But so far Branden has brought me far more joy than trouble. The books further suggested I would
experience inhibitions and insecurities in my creative life. Because I knew nothing about astrology, I spent my twenties as a freedomloving hippy, I wanted to be creative. I wanted to write the great American novel. Then I decided to be a short story writer. Finally I was
hoping to at least write some haiku, but none of these artistic dreams, even as they shrunk, panned out.
Eventually circumstances required I take a job in the corporate world - the very thing I had avoided for years. To my complete surprise, it
was fun! I loved it. I found the joy that was missing from my hippy decade. I stayed at that job for 16 years and happily climbed its
corporate ladder. Even more surprising, in my spare time, my artistic life blossomed. I finally became a published writer. The structured
Capricorn world stimulated the energy in my 5th house. Had anyone suggested this beforehand, I would have thought them nuts. Nor do I
think working in the corporate world is the solution for everyone with Capricorn in the 5th. You have to experiment. Especially you must be
willing to try things you might otherwise resist. The key to this house is spontaneity - and the willingness to take new risks. Pleasure often
arrives in surprising packages.

From here: http://www.astro.com/astrology/in_dgfifthhouse_e.htm

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Member

Re: Fifth House« Reply #73 - on: 22.12.2008 at 22:20 [UT] »Quote from Night Sky on 20.12.2008 at 00:19 [UT]:
Quote from grrrlriot on 19.12.2008 at 20:36 [UT]:
Quote from Night Sky on 19.12.2008 at 20:31 [UT]:
Quote from grrrlriot on 19.12.2008 at 19:51 [UT]:
I havej in my 5th house. Also, I have Ceres in k and M in j in the 5th house. What does

this mean?

I got that too Grrlriot,

Posts: 451
Gender:j on the cusp of house 5 with Ceres and M Square 3rd houseA.
The only thing I can think of is to look at where

G is, as this would be ruler of 5th.

Don´t really know what to make of it.

Thanks for the reply, Night Sky!

Everyone I've asked has been confused on this. lol I'll post up my chart.

G is in h.

Grrlriot, I am as interested as you in finding something on this combination. But since you have the exact same placement as me whathG in the 2nd house, I am intruiged by your experience of it. If you have eny experience of it at all.
f Ascendant, which I think of as a killjoy placement.
with havingMy

hG is t my

Here is something I found which I thought interesting:
Quote:
I have Capricorn on my 5th house cusp, which means that Saturn rules this house. From my astrology books, I learned
that this is an unfortunate placement. Nothing squashes fun like grim-faced Saturn. (Now you know why I'm writing about
5th house anhedonia!) With Capricorn on the 5th, the astrology books said I likely couldn't have children; if I did, theywould bring me grief. I did have my son late in life (Saturn can delay matters). But so far Branden has brought me far
more joy than trouble. The books further suggested I would experience inhibitions and insecurities in my creative life.
Because I knew nothing about astrology, I spent my twenties as a freedom-loving hippy, I wanted to be creative. I wanted
to write the great American novel. Then I decided to be a short story writer. Finally I was hoping to at least write somehaiku, but none of these artistic dreams, even as they shrunk, panned out.
Eventually circumstances required I take a job in the corporate world - the very thing I had avoided for years. To mycomplete surprise, it was fun! I loved it. I found the joy that was missing from my hippy decade. I stayed at that job for
16 years and happily climbed its corporate ladder. Even more surprising, in my spare time, my artistic life blossomed. I
finally became a published writer. The structured Capricorn world stimulated the energy in my 5th house. Had anyone
suggested this beforehand, I would have thought them nuts. Nor do I think working in the corporate world is the solution
for everyone with Capricorn in the 5th. You have to experiment. Especially you must be willing to try things you mightotherwise resist. The key to this house is spontaneity - and the willingness to take new risks. Pleasure often arrives insurprising packages.

From here: http://www.astro.com/astrology/in_dgfifthhouse_e.htm

Thanks, Night Sky, I appreciate your reply, as always.
That is quite interesting. You have G in h in the 2nd
house too? Do you have an experience? What house and sign is M in for you?
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Night Sky
Member

Re: Fifth House« Reply #74 - on: 22.12.2008 at 23:24 [UT] »kM ohA

Posts: 993
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grrrlriot

Member

Re: Fifth House« Reply #75 - on: 22.12.2008 at 23:53 [UT] »Quote from Night Sky on 22.12.2008 at 23:24 [UT]:kM ohAOh ok.

Thanks, Night Sky!

Posts: 451
Gender:Back to top

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Night Sky
Member

Re: Fifth House« Reply #76 - on: 23.12.2008 at 03:37 [UT] »I forgot to answer the first part of your question.

G in second house is about self worth as far as I worked it out. You have it t Ascendant too.
Not having stuff you wanted as a kid, getting old clothes and stuff from car boot sales. I´m not sure how itties in with the 5th house though.
Posts: 993

2nd rules resources as well as income and it determines how you value yourself.

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grrrlriot

Member

Re: Fifth House« Reply #77 - on: 23.12.2008 at 03:52 [UT] »Quote from Night Sky on 23.12.2008 at 03:37 [UT]:
I forgot to answer the first part of your question.

G in second house is about self worth as far as I worked it out. You have it t Ascendant too.
Not having stuff you wanted as a kid, getting old clothes and stuff from car boot sales. I´m not sure how it ties in with the 5th housethough.
2nd rules resources as well as income and it determines how you value yourself.

Posts: 451
Gender:Thanks, Night Sky! Yeah, I'm not sure how it ties in with the 5th house either. By the way, How can you tell if ahouse or planet is on a cusp in a birth chart?

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Night Sky
Member

Re: Fifth House« Reply #78 - on: 23.12.2008 at 06:31 [UT] »Quote from grrrlriot on 23.12.2008 at 03:52 [UT]:
Quote from Night Sky on 23.12.2008 at 03:37 [UT]:
I forgot to answer the first part of your question.

G in second house is about self worth as far as I worked it out. You have it t Ascendant too.
Not having stuff you wanted as a kid, getting old clothes and stuff from car boot sales. I´m not sure how it ties in with the
5th house though.

Posts: 993
Gender:

2nd rules resources as well as income and it determines how you value yourself.

Thanks, Night Sky! Yeah, I'm not sure how it ties in with the 5th house either. By the way, How can you tell if a house or planet is on acusp in a birth chart?

So many questions.

Don´t mind answering though, since you have such a similar chart to me.

The cusp is the beginning of the house. Cusp of your first is 20f aka the Ascendant. You can also get cusps ofsigns, but these are not really helpful, planets are either in one sign or another.
Go with the houses. You have iF on the cusp of 4th house because it is 7 degrees away from it. ( I have thatexact same placement too) So Jupiter will eventually progress into the 4th house in a few years time.
You also have A on cusp of 7th house. Read up on both 6th and 7th house Sun.

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Claire de Lune

Ex Member

Re: Fifth House« Reply #79 - on: 23.12.2008 at 14:49 [UT] »Excellent post TommyMac, you are really getting into the deeper meaning of the 5th house. I particularly likethe way you recognise how Leos and 5th house people can treat other people like their own children and how it
is possible to have children of the mind and of the spirit as well as the body.
Something else which is often lost when we look at the 5th house is the connection between the Sun (as thenatural ruler of the 5th) and authority, leadership and responsibility. Another classic meaning of the Sun in the
natal chart is the father, but we never see the role of the father discussed in relation to the 5th house. I havenever bought the idea of the parents being ruled by the 4th/10th house polarity, none of the explanations I
have seen really do it for me, I see the IC as being far more important in terms of our roots and our earliest
memories.
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vertex
Member

Re: Fifth House« Reply #80 - on: 23.12.2008 at 15:29 [UT] »Grrrlriot,
Can you take your off-topic questions to another thread? This thread is a general discussion on the Fifth House.

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Claire de Lune

Ex Member

Re: Fifth House« Reply #81 - on: 23.12.2008 at 16:34 [UT] »Quote from vertex on 23.12.2008 at 15:29 [UT]:
Grrrlriot,
Can you take your off-topic questions on another thread? This thread is a general discussion on the Fifth House.

Spoken like a true Leo. Someone has to take authority, leadership and responsibility around here ...
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grrrlriot
Member

Re: Fifth House« Reply #82 - on: 23.12.2008 at 19:13 [UT] »Sorry about the off topic stuff...I'm moving it to another thread now.
Getting back on the subject of the 5th house.... I have 5th house in j and h G, does anyone know what thatmeans, if anything?

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Multiple

Ex Member

Re: Fifth House« Reply #83 - on: 23.12.2008 at 23:15 [UT] »Quote from Claire de Lune on 23.12.2008 at 14:49 [UT]:
Excellent post TommyMac, you are really getting into the deeper meaning of the 5th house. I particularly like the way you recognise how
Leos and 5th house people can treat other people like their own children and how it is possible to have children of the mind and of thespirit as well as the body.
Something else which is often lost when we look at the 5th house is the connection between the Sun (as the natural ruler of the 5th) andauthority, leadership and responsibility. Another classic meaning of the Sun in the natal chart is the father, but we never see the role ofthe father discussed in relation to the 5th house. I have never bought the idea of the parents being ruled by the 4th/10th house polarity,
none of the explanations I have seen really do it for me, I see the IC as being far more important in terms of our roots and our earliest
memories.

Interesting post there claire. So it seems 5th would also indicate ones attitudes towards leadership authority
and responsibility, that makes sense as it e 's house. same is true of the 10th relating to the sign j and the
1st relating to a. something I was thinking about when thinking of the subject of alpha personalities in thisthread: http://forum.astro.com/cgi/forum.cgi?num=1229906949
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Claire de Lune
Ex Member

Re: Fifth House« Reply #84 - on: 24.12.2008 at 14:29 [UT] »Quote from Multiple on 23.12.2008 at 23:15 [UT]:
Quote from Claire de Lune on 23.12.2008 at 14:49 [UT]:
Excellent post TommyMac, you are really getting into the deeper meaning of the 5th house. I particularly like the way you
recognise how Leos and 5th house people can treat other people like their own children and how it is possible to havechildren of the mind and of the spirit as well as the body.
Something else which is often lost when we look at the 5th house is the connection between the Sun (as the natural rulerof the 5th) and authority, leadership and responsibility. Another classic meaning of the Sun in the natal chart is the father,
but we never see the role of the father discussed in relation to the 5th house. I have never bought the idea of the parents
being ruled by the 4th/10th house polarity, none of the explanations I have seen really do it for me, I see the IC as being
far more important in terms of our roots and our earliest memories.

Interesting post there claire. So it seems 5th would also indicate ones attitudes towards leadership authority and responsibility, that makes
sense as ite 's house. same is true of the 10th relating to the sign j and the 1st relating to a. something I was thinking about when

thinking of the subject of alpha personalities in this thread: http://forum.astro.com/cgi/forum.cgi?num=1229906949

A good way of understanding what it means to be an alpha personality is by looking at the behaviour ofanimals in their natural habitat, and I am thinking particularly of the work of Desmond Morris of “Manwatching”
fame. In the animal kingdom the alpha male (or female in a matriarchal society) achieves his position as leader
because he is the strongest, largest and loudest of the pack, and he fights for territory and status so he canmate with as many females as possible. It is a lot more complicated for homo sapiens of course because
human beings have the power to reason and what appears to be aggression can often be a mask for feelings ofinferiority, an over-developed defence mechanism or a morbid sensitivity, so it takes a thorough examination of
the natal chart to work out who is an alpha personality and why. So it is the animal signs and houses whichshow us where the aggression is, and for pure aggression and willpower I look to the signs and houses ruled byMars and Pluto; for the desire to dominate, lead and control I look to the signs and houses ruled by the Sun
and Saturn.
There are lot of people who do not accept our connections to the animal kingdom (witness the rejection of
Darwinism by the Creationists) and I certainly accept that we are at the top of the food chain, but I think we
can learn a lot by stripping away the mask of social acceptability and seeing what lies beneath. Trying to workout what motivates people to be an “alpha personality”, how they try to achieve it and what happens when they
do not succeed is where it gets interesting! As far as the 5th house is concerned I think we need to rememberthat as the house of the ego it could be described as the place where we can see the into heart of the person,
and most of us only show our true selves when we are children. If the house is empty, look at the ruler of the
5th house cusp and see how it fits in with the rest of the chart, particularly the Sun.
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Multiple

Ex Member

Re: Fifth House« Reply #85 - on: 24.12.2008 at 22:51 [UT] »Quote from Claire de Lune on 24.12.2008 at 14:29 [UT]:
Quote from Multiple on 23.12.2008 at 23:15 [UT]:
Quote from Claire de Lune on 23.12.2008 at 14:49 [UT]:
Excellent post TommyMac, you are really getting into the deeper meaning of the 5th house. I particularly likethe way you recognise how Leos and 5th house people can treat other people like their own children and how
it is possible to have children of the mind and of the spirit as well as the body.
Something else which is often lost when we look at the 5th house is the connection between the Sun (as thenatural ruler of the 5th) and authority, leadership and responsibility. Another classic meaning of the Sun in
the natal chart is the father, but we never see the role of the father discussed in relation to the 5th house. I
have never bought the idea of the parents being ruled by the 4th/10th house polarity, none of the
explanations I have seen really do it for me, I see the IC as being far more important in terms of our roots
and our earliest memories.

Interesting post there claire. So it seems 5th would also indicate ones attitudes towards leadership authority ande 's house. same is true of the 10th relating to the sign j and the 1st relating toa. something I was thinking about when thinking of the subject of alpha personalities in this thread:
responsibility, that makes sense as it

http://forum.astro.com/cgi/forum.cgi?num=1229906949
A good way of understanding what it means to be an alpha personality is by looking at the behaviour of animals in their natural habitat,and I am thinking particularly of the work of Desmond Morris of “Manwatching” fame. In the animal kingdom the alpha male (or female ina matriarchal society) achieves his position as leader because he is the strongest, largest and loudest of the pack, and he fights for
territory and status so he can mate with as many females as possible. It is a lot more complicated for homo sapiens of course because
human beings have the power to reason and what appears to be aggression can often be a mask for feelings of inferiority, an overdeveloped defence mechanism or a morbid sensitivity, so it takes a thorough examination of the natal chart to work out who is an alphapersonality and why. So it is the animal signs and houses which show us where the aggression is, and for pure aggression and willpower I
look to the signs and houses ruled by Mars and Pluto; for the desire to dominate, lead and control I look to the signs and houses ruled by
the Sun and Saturn.
There are lot of people who do not accept our connections to the animal kingdom (witness the rejection of Darwinism by the Creationists)
and I certainly accept that we are at the top of the food chain, but I think we can learn a lot by stripping away the mask of social
acceptability and seeing what lies beneath. Trying to work out what motivates people to be an “alpha personality”, how they try to achieve
it and what happens when they do not succeed is where it gets interesting! As far as the 5th house is concerned I think we need toremember that as the house of the ego it could be described as the place where we can see the into heart of the person, and most of us
only show our true selves when we are children. If the house is empty, look at the ruler of the 5th house cusp and see how it fits in withthe rest of the chart, particularly the Sun.

So by acting our true selves (as seen by our 5th house) we show our characteristics including our tendencies
towards alpha and beta behaviour.
Good point.
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IP LoggedWonder Fish
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Re: Fifth House« Reply #86 - on: 26.12.2008 at 06:43 [UT] »Quote from Waybread on 08.12.2008 at 05:10 [UT]:
I would love to hear your thoughts on the 5th house. Is it more than the "party house" or the fortune-teller's means of saying how many
children someone will have?
I have read many descriptions of the 5th, but they are quite a stew: the house of children, love affairs [vs. permanent relationships], lightamusements such as gambling, recreation [cf. re-creation], creativity, and self-expression. Is there a common theme here?
Is the power of the 5th stronger than stressful aspects to planets in this house? I have 3 planets in the 5th, including my sun. I much lovethe family and recreational meanings of this house, but with Saturn opposite my sun and with my ruler of the 5th in my 12th house,gambling is not one of my past-times.
How do you experience your 5th house? How do you make sense of it?
[A great quote from the Mormon faith that may shed light on it--the gendered language is in the original: "Man is, that he might havejoy."]

Interesting thread ...here is my view that I can truly attest to because I, too, have a stellium of 5ths.
party?
Not at all, contrary to most astrologers' believe I'm extremely shy, reserved, and very little outgoing.
relationship?
Power struggle has always been problematic for me. I hate being told what to do, very stubborn, and would
rather do thing at my will, on my own, and comfort. When dealing with others, I always prefer my standard
over them but because it's part of life I must adjust. This means at works, I always giving up all kind ofconcessions, licking boot, eating humble pie so I don't get fired. In my personal life, I'm extremely detached
and always preferred to be left alone, even at works too! I'd would rather have no one near me as I can't standmost people. For some reasons this house seems to radiate a lot of energies, don't know whether it's good or
bad but even the most strangers pass me by would make grumbling noises. I swore I fkn hate grumbling
noises, "ahem this ahem that" argghhhh! There were times when I felt like I just wanna throw punches andteach those attention deficit numb nuts a lesson. This pet peeve makes me wonder if it would be possible they
could change the 5th house description to that of the opposite polarity, i.e., 11th.
love affair, parenting, and children?
I'm not even married either and I doubt I'll ever will given to my past child abuse and toxic relationshipbetween my parents and I. I just don't foresee it coming so I'm going to put this one on neutral. And I don't
really care whole lot for it either. This is where I have to strongly disagree with most astrologers as theirdescription does not fit me very well.
creativity?
I have a grand trine in fire so it's not only the 5th that matters, sometimes I'm feeling a little delusional.
Pornography has been a problem for me when feeling depressed and I hate it. Maybe I should castrate myself,
maybe that will solve my problem. I believe some Aries chick had discussed this in another thread before sothat thread merits good knowledge-base should anyone here interested in having further reading. Sorry, I
could not recall who posted nor what was it titled.
money?
Very few astrologers ever bother acknowledging this is the best position out there if it aspects positively to theright sign. I'm doing very well at the stock market, still not an expert but I've always been making positive
return without regards to which direction the market chooses. So the more volatility the higher I get for myreturn. And it appears that I'm getting better and better with time. My parents had always been telling me I'll
never make it, I'll be a failure for the rest of my life, and even had booted me out of their home multiple
occasions when I was not able to contribute some income to pay their bills (this is when I was a teenager). So
yeah I'm quite amazed at myself and would be dead on positive that all my accomplishments and successes had
something to do with the 5th house.
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Neptune's StormEx Member

Re: Fifth House« Reply #87 - on: 27.12.2008 at 20:08 [UT] »The two people who left the biggest impression on me both had 5th house Suns. Both of them had all the
positive and negative effects of Leo/Sun: when you were around them you truly felt nourished by their creative
glare and your creativity was spurned on in return, however at other times they truly acted as if you merely
revolved around them and you were keft feeling burned and scorched.
One of them especcially had an almost dangerous tendency to view just about every human encounter as agame of romance, possible souters were often viewed as chess pieces who they were dueling with in a courtshipgame. My experience with 5th house individuals tells me that romance and love is never a simple affair for
them, its imbued with truly epic consequences and significance.
Here is Astrotheme's list of celebrities who have a dominant 5th house:
http://www.astrotheme.com/celebrites/dominantes/h5/1.htm
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Arihant
Member

Re: Fifth House« Reply #88 - on: 28.12.2008 at 11:21 [UT] »Quote from Neptune's Storm on 27.12.2008 at 20:08 [UT]:The two people who left the biggest impression on me both had 5th house Suns. Both of them had all the positive and negative effects of
Leo/Sun: when you were around them you truly felt nourished by their creative glare and your creativity was spurned on in return,however at other times they truly acted as if you merely revolved around them and you were keft feeling burned and scorched.
One of them especcially had an almost dangerous tendency to view just about every human encounter as a game of romance, possible
souters were often viewed as chess pieces who they were dueling with in a courtship game. My experience with 5th house individuals tellsme that romance and love is never a simple affair for them, its imbued with truly epic consequences and significance.

Posts: 3812

Here is Astrotheme's list of celebrities who have a dominant 5th house:
http://www.astrotheme.com/celebrites/dominantes/h5/1.htm

Thats today's most insightful post..
Particulary even after so much been said about a cadent house , (after all), you are able to throw light for a
fuller understanding of house 5..I have also got some material ...devotional & divine love love ..angle of house
5..but i shall type & copy paste..in coming days ...
Thank you , Neptune storm for sharing your insights...
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Alice T

Member

Re: Fifth House« Reply #89 - on: 28.12.2008 at 13:37 [UT] »I have Venus in the 5th house. This is how I perceive this influence:a) love of people and life in generalb) love of creativity (music, writing, making things)c) a romantic streak in my nature (a tendency to fall in love very easily and quite passionately with myimagination running wild; the Venus is trine Pluto)d) love of children (have two), getting on easily with them; involved in free time activities for children(volunteer in a playgroup)
Posts: 1435

I love the fifth house. It is the sunniest part of my chart, one that keeps my head above water when the lesssunny ones make their presence felt

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akastarMember

Re: Fifth House« Reply #90 - on: 28.12.2008 at 15:39 [UT] »TommyMac1018

Posts: 52
Gender:[quote author=TommyMac1018 link=1228713057/60#64 date=1229327029]
Planets in the 5th describe how we experience and interact with this internal child, so when viewed from thisperspective, we cannot be surprised that a 5th house Saturn has stern, sober, responsible children, ones that heraise with strict discipline. Compare him to a woman with Jupiter in the 5th, and all her kids are high spiritedand imaginative and prone to excess, while she herself raises them with a liberal hand. These scenarios aren'tthat removed from acting our own seventh house planets through our partners.

I have both F and G in my fifth, what sort of mum am i going to be? im not very happy about motherhood.
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akastarMember

Re: Fifth House« Reply #91 - on: 28.12.2008 at 15:49 [UT] »so as you see my fifth house is pretty full
but i dont find myself being any more creative than the rest of the planet.
Posts: 52
Gender:im very far from enjoying life, having fun, doing things just for fun, buying stuff because i like it, i always hated
parties.
i never wanted to have children, although i rationally changed my mind and have one now, i do find it all thetime very difficult.
someone was saying something about sex and 5th house. i dont find sex any special experience.
im too serious to play with other men, so no love affairs.
regarding my C in 5th i do find it difficult to express myself..
so this is how i find my fifth house.
im not finding anything good here and i dont understand it.

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Re: Fifth House

Jupiter's
Daughter« Reply #92 - on: 28.12.2008 at 16:38 [UT] »MemberAka I've never seen such a packed 5th house - very interesting as all the planets either tenant or connect by aspect
to the 5th, centering on the min-grand trine JoDnIPosts: 1767

I expect that with Saturn hovering on your 5th cusp, you are beginning to feel the obigations adn
responsibilties of 5th (children?) very intensely, and will continue to do so for the next 3 years, more or less longer than usual since your 5th is vry large. are you anticipating starting a family soon?
moon in the 12th suggests you have issues with motherhood, and perhaps with your own mother virgo on thecusp of 5th says that you take raising children seriously and suggest a thought out approach that might be a
bit perfectionnistic or dry - Mary Popins at best, Felix Unger at worst - but the ruler mercury intercepted in libra
5th gives the potential for a more loving approach though you might have to hard for it.
PLuto and saturn here indicate having to deal with control issues, and perhaps also tending towards being a
disciplinarian, and jupiter sextile your mars uranus conjunction suggests taht you might sometimes lose yourtemper and go overboard - but with the sextile, this is much easier than the square and might instead
represent an exciting O and penetrating h approach.
Keep in mind that Astrology is prevention, if you pay attention - your virgo cusp might relate well toMontessori techniques - my understanding of this is that if used as intended, Montessori works with the natural
curiosity and energy of children to guide it in productive ways rather than attempting to repress it throughdiscipline and domination.
you have potent stuff that can help you, the above mentioned mini grand trine, the "finger of the world" ofmoon-neptune jupiter, the biquintile of moon to saturn. with pluto in this house, you have the potential to findyourself transformed and healed through the purification of old programing, and also the potential to have avery powerful affect on many. it is here that you most influence the world and find your power.
I am wondering if you have health issues that will impact your care of your children? or your spiritual sense of
duty may have an impact - something of the sort is suggested by neptune in the 6th , which can of course
have other meanings.
sun conjunct jupiter and saturn suggest that your purpose centers on teaching - jupiter representing expansion
and exploration and saturn representing the discipline necessary to learn. these are the two necessary elementsof education.
look closely at your moon in 12th, very likely, the moon motivates everything in your chart. (fan chart shape)
Please do not see this as a "bad" chart. it is challenging, yes, but with the potential to do great things. likehandling a jet plane......
I am wondering if you have thought about teaching young children or opening a daycare in yourneighborhood?

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akastarMember

Re: Fifth House« Reply #93 - on: 28.12.2008 at 16:57 [UT] »Jupiter's Daughter
I shall probably write you somewhere else as this is meant to be a general thread. But as we only mention 5thhouse, it should be ok.
Posts: 52
Gender:I have one child (she is 2) and I find it really difficult. I do like her, but I feel my life is now limited in every
aspect and feel I should have waited longer to have a baby. Im very impatient with her, I always found children
under age of five "stupid". So, thats my answer, no young children and no daycare for youngchildren as a job! I
work with people with severe learning difficulties and mental age mostly below of my daughters and I find itvery very difficult (longer I do it, less I feel ok with it).
When I was younger I spent 8 years leading a group of scouts and I had kids from 5-12 years. It was great. But
I dont think I have the patience I used to have at that time.
Oh, yes, perfectionist very much, I honestly expect my daughter to be able to do everything before all otherchildren. It doesnt work so far
Yes, I do like Montessori idea, but I need to learn a lot to guide my daughter in the right way.
My only health issue might be my inclination to depression, anxiety and stress.
My relationship with my mum? well, I like being far from her, we dont cry on each other's shoulders, but wemight one day. But thats another story.

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Re: Fifth House

Jupiter's
Daughter« Reply #94 - on: 28.12.2008 at 17:16 [UT] »Memberinsight is power.....
interesting as saturn will leave your 5th house around the time your daughter starts school - it will get better!
also remember that when saturn transits the house, it demands much but yields great results afterwards.

Posts: 1767

neptune in 6th could mean depression.
try to be kinder to yourself! you have already given so much to the children (and the childlike) around you!
I visit elementary schools all over town as a visiting artist, and I see how stressed the teachers get, and I sensethat every one of them (with the very rare few who have transcended the chaos and found a way) feels theyshould have been kinder, more in control and that their children should be better behaved, and that if otherpeople really knew how things were, they would be exposed as impostors. with virgo ruling the house andsaturn tenanting it, you are likely to feel inferior and guilty here, even when there is no cause.
they did a study years ago that determined that when we are angry/critical, it takes 9 incidents of warmth andpraise to make up for it. so forgive yourself your lapses and make sure you give much more praise and love.

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akastarMember

Re: Fifth House« Reply #95 - on: 28.12.2008 at 18:02 [UT] »Jupiter's Daughter

Posts: 52
Gender:when I read about Saturn transiting through my 5th house I thought it would be better give up on college(study photography), since there will be a lot of struggle to express myself creatively during this period. I feellike its not fair that this is happening to me at the time (well G will enter my 5th this autumn, but its dancing
around my F) when I decided to do something with my creative side. Hmm.
Or is it actually going to happen opposite? That I will go through lot of battles, but will feel even stronger urge
to produce better photographs, maybe even try some other kinds of art?

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Re: Fifth House« Reply #96 - on: 28.12.2008 at 18:35 [UT] »Quote from akastar on 28.12.2008 at 16:57 [UT]:
Jupiter's Daughter
I shall probably write you somewhere else as this is meant to be a general thread. But as we only mention 5th house, it should be ok.
I have one child (she is 2) and I find it really difficult. I do like her, but I feel my life is now limited in every aspect and feel I should have

Posts: 1405
Gender:waited longer to have a baby. Im very impatient with her, I always found children under age of five "stupid".

Have you thought about learning a bit about neuropsychology and young children? I've looked into this over
the years as housewifery is dull and I need to learn how everything works. As I have 3 children this was an
obvious choice (I wasn't interested at all before having them).
It really is quite amazing what is going on in that little head, it's not obvious at all, all the little connections
being made.
The Science of Parenting by Margot Sunderland is particularly interesting, like learning about toddler tantrums
how that relates to which bits of their brain has developed and which haven't. The Social Toddler is also aninteresting read.
I personally wish my children could have a Steiner education and I like the work of Alfie Kohn.

I was wondering about transits and composite charts. I was just looking at mine with my husbands and saw G
is transiting our 5th house (in which we just have J). Could this be why recently I've felt so numb and down
about us?
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Krista ShippMember

Re: Fifth House« Reply #97 - on: 28.12.2008 at 18:49 [UT] »I have an 'empty 5th'- holding only Juno m Pars fortune <h>
The ruler J is m Ce <in the 2nd; C rules 3rd & 12th>
receives a p from aF in 10th...

Posts: 15841
Gender:With NO agenda- I have always woven 'magick' regarding men in my Life..
Most likely this can be attributed to lB forming a p to all those d planets...
So- when I read a post about an 'empty' house- I try & emphasize how
there is so much more connected to it..
My2,
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Re: Fifth House

Jupiter's
Daughter« Reply #98 - on: 28.12.2008 at 19:10 [UT] »MemberQuote from akastar on 28.12.2008 at 18:02 [UT]:
Jupiter's Daughter
when I read about Saturn transiting through my 5th house I thought it would be better give up on college (study photography), since there
will be a lot of struggle to express myself creatively during this period. I feel like its not fair that this is happening to me at the time (wellG will enter my 5th this autumn, but its dancing around my F) when I decided to do something with my creative side. Hmm.
Or is it actually going to happen opposite? That I will go through lot of battles, but will feel even stronger urge to produce better

Posts: 1767

photographs, maybe even try some other kinds of art?

Multiple astrological themes often express simultaneously, so I would no rule out going back to school to study
photography. I would expect doing to to follow Saturn's agenda - a real grind with lots of demands andrewards later. venus in 3rd and neptune in 6th favor creative work, and neptune is hovering around your MC
right now with jupiter getting ready to enter the 9th so some college is very possible.
with pluto and mars in your 7th, I expect that your marriage is undergoing stress and needs transforming, andthat is greatly contributing to the load you feel - with sag and neptune on the DEC, it is possible that the "freespirit" that attracted you to your husband is translating into "not there when you need him" I presuming thatyou are married. Are you?
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Alice T

Member

Re: Fifth House« Reply #99 - on: 28.12.2008 at 19:25 [UT] »akastar: When Saturn transited my fifth house some 7 years ago, I landed the most creative job in my life ... auniversity lecturer! I remember the euphoria of preparing my first lectures and seminars ... I loved every
minute of it! It was a very creative time in fact. The only Saturnian influence was that I was without a boyfriend
for a year. When the transit ended, I met my life partner ... and both he and the job have stayed with me tothis day.

Posts: 1435
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Jupiter's
Daughter

Re: Fifth House« Reply #100 - on: 28.12.2008 at 19:54 [UT] »MemberGreat story, Alice!

Posts: 1767

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Member

Re: Fifth House« Reply #101 - on: 28.12.2008 at 20:01 [UT] »oh alice, you are so positive. i have seen your other posts and you are really full of sun (i wrote fun by mistake,but both apply)

Posts: 52
Gender:jupiter's daughter, me and my husband have nearly identical houses, his asc is 27c51
i wouldnt say we are having any exceptional problems other than troubles with our neverstopping daughter,some wee money issues, who who doesnt have it? i would rather transform our flat and get a separate room formyself than transform our mariage. its just a reaction to yours"with pluto and mars in your 7th, I expect that your marriage is undergoing stress and needs transforming, andthat is greatly contributing to the load you feel - with sag and neptune on the DEC, it is possible that the "freespirit" that attracted you to your husband is translating into "not there when you need him" I presuming thatyou are married. Are you? "Back to top

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Jupiter's
Daughter

Re: Fifth House« Reply #102 - on: 28.12.2008 at 20:06 [UT] »Memberinteresting - still pluto does not "leave nothing but footprints and take nothing but pictures" when it passes
through a house, I wonder what it's affect will be on you? but that is a subject best left to another thread!
best wishes -Posts: 1767

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chatcat

Member

Re: Fifth House« Reply #103 - on: 28.12.2008 at 23:53 [UT] »As the 5th is Leo's house it is the area of ego expression and creativity including children. It is leisure andpleasure activities such as hobbies, holidays, also pastimes such as gambling. It is romance and love but
uncommitted, that belongs to the 7th of partnerships. Where the Sun is and its aspects adds to the picture.
The ruler of the 5th and where it is can indicate the type of children you are likely to have.
Posts: 1967
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OMGphoebe
Ex Member

Re: Fifth House« Reply #104 - on: 06.08.2013 at 00:14 [UT+1] »With the current A B position in Leo, thought I would bump this up as it's a golden mouldy.
At the beginning of the thread in reply #5, Plutomoon shared that with an empty 5th house with Cancer on thecusp,
Cancer men were drawn to her. I think there might be something in that.....
With i on the cusp of my empty 5th house, I married a Sag, almost married another Sag [the wonky
experience withthe first Sag put me off] and have had significant relationships with Geminis [to the exclusion of otherrepresentatives of the zodiac...meeeehhhh]
With Pluto doing a dredging-transit through my fifth, I am gaining anappreciation of why Isabel Hickey calls the fifth the house of hidden karma.
Some nattering about that here http://noeltyl.com/discussion/index.php?topic=833.5;wap2
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=idGdC4MlokU
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truegem620

Member

Re: Fifth House« Reply #105 - on: 07.08.2013 at 03:34 [UT+1] »OMphoebe,
That is interesting about the 5th house cusp. Mine is i- and I married a man with iB
My husband's is k- and he married a woman with kB
I never noticed that before.

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OMphoebe
Ex Member

Re: Fifth House« Reply #106 - on: 07.08.2013 at 04:02 [UT+1] »Going to be not noticing this from now on! One of my neighbours who has beena staunch friends these last 7 years is also A i and one of my best penpal buds
for years was A i .

Has got me musing over the 'hidden' Ophiuchus scorch-mark in Sagittarius and how the polarity of thatmanifests in Gemini....quick & dirty guesstimate 28 May - 15 Jun.

Quote:
Now what about Ophiuchus, the Serpent Bearer? Because this is also – only – a fixed star constellation, it has no astrological relevance.
The Sun passes through it nowadays between 29 november and 17 december, which falls into the astrological sign of Sagittarius.
http://www.astro.com/astrology/in_ophiuchus_e.htm

Infamous last words....

Gemini May 21-June 21
Sagittariarse Nov 22 - Dec 21

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unique_astrology

Ex Member

Re: Fifth House« Reply #107 - on: 07.08.2013 at 04:25 [UT+1] »Quote from OMGphoebe on 06.08.2013 at 00:14 [UT+1]:
With

i on the cusp of my empty 5th house,

With my Neptune in your 2nd, squaring the cusp of your 5th, had we ever met I might have flamboozled you
and absconded with all your moolah.
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OMphoebe
Ex Member

Re: Fifth House« Reply #108 - on: 07.08.2013 at 04:35 [UT+1] »Quote from unique_astrology on 07.08.2013 at 04:25 [UT+1]:
Quote from OMGphoebe on 06.08.2013 at 00:14 [UT+1]:
With

i on the cusp of my empty 5th house,

With my Neptune in your 2nd, squaring the cusp of your 5th, had we ever met I might have flamboozled you and absconded with all yourmoolah.

You mean you would not have been my best customer?

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elish

Member

Re: Fifth House« Reply #109 - on: 07.08.2013 at 06:46 [UT+1] »Quote from Clairevoyante on 28.12.2008 at 23:53 [UT]:As the 5th is Leo's house it is the area of ego expression and creativity including children. It is leisure and pleasure activities such as
hobbies, holidays, also pastimes such as gambling. It is romance and love but uncommitted, that belongs to the 7th of partnerships.
Where the Sun is and its aspects adds to the picture. The ruler of the 5th and where it is can indicate the type of children you are likely to
have.

Interesting, I have neptune in 5th house and it is nA in 11th
Posts: 655
Gender:I remember years ago when I play a bet in lottery and I win some sometimes
though I was a teen thattime,I just choose the numbers and my cousin or brother will be the one to pay for it

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Re: Fifth House« Reply #110 - on: 07.08.2013 at 08:10 [UT+1] »e rules my 5th house. e is a sign I seem to almost never meet.
I have E (f) in my 5th and I attract a.
My A is in my 6th, AmB, AqE.
I have no children and don't want any.
My hobbies are shopping, excercising, writing, reading and watching movies/tv series.
I don't date and I don't gamble.
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Lindac7

Member

Re: Fifth House« Reply #111 - on: 07.08.2013 at 10:30 [UT+1] »With nothing but Black Moon Lilith in my 5th house, I believe that explains a lot concerning my feelings toward
people in authority.
Not only do I not trust that people in those positions actually belong there, I don't
trust their judgment or their integrity. I would certainly never want to put myself at the mercy of any of them,and frankly most of the time I feel I could do their jobs better than they do.
In addition, with my MC in Leo (Uranus conjunct it), I see myself as a better authority figure than most - I'm
not boasting, I do actually have strong leadership qualities, which I have received positive feedback on after
displaying them. I had to laugh when Claire de Lune mentioned the 5th house representing our feelings toward
those in authority, considering what Black Moon Lilith represents. It fits me perfectly. I also prefer to be myown boss.
Posts: 2029
Gender:Black Moon Lilith is also in Pisces, so Neptune rules my 5th house, and my Neptune is in my 12th house,
conjunct my Scorpio Ascendant - once again, an indication of someone who prefers to be their own boss.
I also have no children, which is again no surprise with BML in the 5th (and a barren Gemini Moon in the 8th).
I've never been a gambler, either - and for me, sex is not something to play around with - I've always taken it
seriously. With Moon in the 8th trine my 12th house Sun, and Scorpio rising, that's pretty much a given, me
thinks.
I'm only too well aware of the powers represented by the 8th house, and I don't regard themlightly.
In fact, all my 12th house - 8th house emphasis makes it difficult for me to lighten up, relax and enjoy my
Pisces 5th house with poor Black Moon Lilith in there all by herself. I'm actually afraid of all the negative
potential that playing in a Pisces 5th house could bring (think drugs, addictions, etc.).

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unique_astrology
Ex Member

Re: Fifth House« Reply #112 - on: 07.08.2013 at 10:47 [UT+1] »Quote from OMphoebe on 07.08.2013 at 04:35 [UT+1]:
Quote from unique_astrology on 07.08.2013 at 04:25 [UT+1]:
Quote from OMGphoebe on 06.08.2013 at 00:14 [UT+1]:
With

i on the cusp of my empty 5th house,

With my Neptune in your 2nd, squaring the cusp of your 5th, had we ever met I might have flamboozled you andabsconded with all your moolah.

You mean you would not have been my best customer?

No. Never pay. Flamboozle and abscond. Sun in 2nd opposite Pluto in 8th, both square Jupiter conjunct Saturnin 5th with Pluto trine Asc and Sun sextile Asc. Mars in 1st and Neptune in 10th.
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OMphoebe

Ex Member

Re: Fifth House« Reply #113 - on: 08.08.2013 at 05:34 [UT+1] »Quote from unique_astrology on 07.08.2013 at 10:47 [UT+1]:

You mean you would not have been my best customer?
No. Never pay. Flamboozle and abscond. Sun in 2nd opposite Pluto in 8th, both square Jupiter conjunct Saturn in 5th with Pluto trine Asc
and Sun sextile Asc. Mars in 1st and Neptune in 10th.

Yeah, that would be right, you auld skinflint!

Just so you know and can enjoy the discombobulation:

you've rolled an apple across my 5/11H axis and it's every mangy Pluto seafaring dog for themselves.....
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unique_astrology
Ex Member

Re: Fifth House« Reply #114 - on: 08.08.2013 at 09:45 [UT+1] »'twas but an apple from an apple tree, not anything from the tree of knowledge of good and evil. Saturn istrying, perhaps for one last time, to get me to retain some of those fruits as we poke and peck.
Not to worry with Mars guarding your 11th and Jupiter ruling your 5th while trining your MC at once.
At first glance it would seem you have good intentions towards meself with your progressed Jupiter just 3/4 ofa degree past me precessed Sun in right ascension but closer inspection reveals your progressed Mars at
124°01' tangling with my progressed Pluto at 125°21.
As for the not paying, you have to understand, it would have gone against the grain of your empty 2nd houseto fill up your coffers. I may be a gregarious Aquarius but me Saturn conjunct Jupiter keeps me grounded (andprotective of me money).
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unique_astrology

Ex Member

Re: Fifth House« Reply #115 - on: 08.08.2013 at 09:53 [UT+1] »Something is rotten here. Has the site been hacked? I see the degree symbol is not printing correctly
but is OK in my past postings.
Just scanned my computer and all is well with it.
When I look at the post without logging in the symbol appears correctly. After I log in it is wrong.
The problem is with this site. This edit at 4:23 my time
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OMphoebe
Ex Member

Re: Fifth House« Reply #116 - on: 08.08.2013 at 10:24 [UT+1] »Quote from unique_astrology on 08.08.2013 at 09:45 [UT+1]:

As for the not paying, you have to understand, it would have gone against the grain of your empty 2nd house to fill up your coffers. I may
be a gregarious Aquarius but me Saturn conjunct Jupiter keeps me grounded (and protective of me money).

'Scusi moi, Scrooge McDuck, I understand that you are using my astrology to justify your penny-pinching. How
rude! And it is not your G m F that is keeping you grounded me ol' china; it's the weight of the gold coins inyour pocketses......
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unique_astrology

Ex Member

Re: Fifth House« Reply #117 - on: 08.08.2013 at 10:37 [UT+1] »Ack!!! The New Moon opposite me Mercury has caused me me to lose me grip. Here yer go. Have a pint.
This is me residence chart.

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OMphoebe
Ex Member

Re: Fifth House« Reply #118 - on: 08.08.2013 at 10:52 [UT+1] »Oh my goodness! Rockford Illinois - flash to "League of their Own" and the Rockford Peaches...
http://www.aagpbl.org/index.cfm/teams/1943/rockford-peaches/2
I am half-way through the only I m N transit I am going to cash in for this life time. I have to rid myselfof all the false or irreverent irrelevant structures in my life. Apparently my credit rating was one of them...
oh well....
Here's to singing for me supper and ducking rotten apples from the peanut gallery!
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unique_astrology

Ex Member

Re: Fifth House« Reply #119 - on: 08.08.2013 at 11:19 [UT+1] »Oh Rockford. Known to some wags as "the screw capitol of the world." as it was the major fastener producer inthe world for a long time. I was told that as just about everything needs some kind of fastener to be held
together that Russia had ICBMs targeting Rockford.
When I first came to Rockford, I was amazed to find that there were 3 patent attorney offices in this burg as I
had been to large cities that did not have even one. A trip to the library and some reading soon explained thereason for their presence.
Sadly, those salad days are long gone as the energy crunch (and taxes, I believe) took a massive toll on
Rockford's employment picture and thousands of jobs left for greener pastures. Once one of the best towns in
the country to get a good paying job in a factory, by 1983 Rockford had the highest unemployment rate of any
place in the U.S. and still is in the upper ranks after all these years have passed. Of course with highunemployment rates you usually get high crime rates and that is true for this town.
Rockford Village, April 1, 1839
Rockford Inc, Jan 3, 1852
There was some sort of snafu and it was accomplished on Feb 8, 1853
My source was an old friend on the city newspaper many years ago. I have not checked the dates personally.
Testing the degree symbol again: 123°45'.
Edited: Adienst, you have a problem.
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EnigmeMember

Re: Fifth House« Reply #120 - on: 08.08.2013 at 16:18 [UT+1] »I have a difficult time understanding mine...
Pluto rules the cusp, Sagittarius is intercepted and Saturn sits
there with my Vertex exact..
My family comprises 1 Scorp, 6 Saggies counting step mother et al, and 1 Capricorn..
Fun relationships that end but friendship continues have been 2 scorps... still Besties after all these years.
Marriage to Aries but not sure if we would have lasted the long haul if he had lived. Loooooooooooved him andstill do but friendship was a key factor...
I have profited from careful speculating.... Five card straight, stud, progressive etc poker. Fatheri taught me
Posts: 5489

as a child...never bet more than you are willing to lose...
best poker game... came down to me and Petei;
pot was up to the 100s... he ran K,Q,J,10,9, I ran Q,J,10,9,8
love quiet intimate entertainment with one or two others, good food, drink and smoke... good conversations
ideas the best and great connection for humor... lighting preferably low...Bright Light Bright Light...hurts theeyes. too much Sun gazing...

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SibyltaMember

Re: Fifth House« Reply #121 - on: 08.08.2013 at 18:58 [UT+1] »I've got an empty fifth house with aquarius on the cusp, and I certainly, well, have a lot to do with aquariuses!
To me the fifth house represents something really important, as do all the houses. It's the realm of being
comfortable and, well, formed, in a social way. There's nothing at all shallow about that. It's easy for introverts
Posts: 20

to dismiss it as unimportant, but if there's one thing astrology should teach us, it's that no aspects of character
development are unimportant, and often the most important ones are the easiest ones to ignore. We dismiss
the houses we do for certain reasons. What reason is there to dismiss the fifth? Perhaps it's simply easier for
people with a lot of anxiety to stay inside. That's valid, of course, but we should always keep the fifth house in
mind.
What's between me and the fifth house? This is a question I ask myself, because I am rarely socially
comfortable ever. I think I just need to become comfortable in the four preceding ones, first - I need comfort in
the first house's vigor, the second house's hygiene, the third house's curiosity, and access to the fourth house's
private repose. Then I'll know what kind of social circumstances would be the most freeing for me, rather thancondemning basically all of them as shallow or awful, as is kinda currently the case...

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OMphoebe
Ex Member

Re: Fifth House« Reply #122 - on: 09.08.2013 at 04:27 [UT+1] »In the methodology of Profection Years the Fifth House corresponds to the ages:
4
16
28
40
52
64
76
88
I got married when I was 28 to a A i and with i on my 5H cusp, he was a great boyfriend. He was also the"Transitional Guy" and I soooooo missed the target with honouring that dynamic and breaking it off. His sister
was one of my good friends at the time and I broke my own previously established rule from my teenage years.
Brothers of friends are off-limits.
I do not know about the brightlightbrightlight; I did have White Dress Fever and was under the spell of elevator
muzak [Slice of Heaven - Dave Dobbyns]. This Saturn transit over natal I is killing me....killing me I tell ya!!
Somebody turn it off.....I suppose the fact that Saturn has to barrel through my 5H to make its return might
be a hidden bogan trap..

My Jupiter is a real bathplug!
Oh yeah, at the time we exchanged vows in All Saints Anglican, transit J m B was helicoptering natal I
so....slam-dunked that one.
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Re: Fifth House« Reply #123 - on: 09.08.2013 at 07:42 [UT+1] »h on H5 cusp, but most of the house is occupied by i with FmI and E in that sign.
Contradiction in words. How can you have fun with h? Especially when J is in f..o E..
It's so damn hard for me to let myself emerge in enjoyments. I just don't have the affinity. I'm too stiff withchildren too. I get bored easily especially with very young ones.
When I have the right transits though, the i part will shine out and I enjoy greatly being abroad, experiencing
different cultures, and sometimes I just want to go and never arrive. Being on the road is fun.
I have a eA/i ASC daughter and I hope learning from her I can overcome my difficulties in this area.
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OMphoebe
Ex Member

Re: Fifth House« Reply #124 - on: 09.08.2013 at 08:12 [UT+1] »Well, with h on cusp of 5H, did you at least have fun practising making children?

I like being on the road too. That movie "Bodies, Rest & Motion" comes to mind.....wonder if thathas 5H themes. Been so long since I saw it, I can't remember.
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Re: Fifth House« Reply #125 - on: 09.08.2013 at 08:33 [UT+1] »Quote from OMphoebe on 09.08.2013 at 08:12 [UT+1]:
Well, withh on cusp of 5H, did you at least have fun practising making children?

Nowdays I have no problem with that, but even sex used to be a crises area for me, based on certain difficulties
in feeling safe in the relationship. I have a very sensitive bladder (h) and before I got pregnant I wasconstantly having cystitis after sex. Imagine what fun it was! I had to take every kind of antibiotics until I
developed severe allergy to some. I almost died of a consequent kidney infection, as there was no medication I
could have used.
I could have been a victim of sex (H5 h), had I not discovered a natural medication that I can take regularly.
So nowdays I'm OK with sex, and finding my long term partner and feeling safe enough really liberates me(fixity). Though I'm not kinky or into S&M staff as it could be the case with h/f.
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OMphoebe
Ex Member

Re: Fifth House« Reply #126 - on: 09.08.2013 at 11:11 [UT+1] »Mmhm.....cystitis....remember it well; fear of the urethra.
You do realise, ramez, that medical astrology
is a 5H pursuit of mine and I am going to not take the p*ss for a change of pace.
Back in 1983, a few months before my father died, I went on a kangaroo shooting trip with a bunch of friends,
out Strath Creek/Flowerdale way here in Victoria Australia [think Deliverance country but no Burt Reynolds]. This trip was about me
and the other two sheilas getting dumped at the Flowerdale Hotel to play pool, feed coins into the juke-box
and drink Bacardi & Coke while the blokes went off spotlighting. It was middle of winter here, brass-monkey
weather and I was the only sheila that knew how to drive and I do not do 'dump at the pub'. So I convinced
the other girls to come out for a drive and they were all "Aww, the guys might come back early" and I was"Yeah...so? They left us the car keys."
A few days later I had massive stabbing pains in my lower back and thought I had copped a "chill on mykidneys" because it was below zero as me and the girls were hooning about in this panel van that didn't haveheating. I was diagnosed with pyelonephritis ; a urinary
tract infection that I had not connected, until now, to 'not feeling safe'. I thought at the time it was therevenge of the dead kangaroos that the blokes had shot for fun, not for the freezer.
About 4-6 weeks ago I came across the Chaldean order of rulerships for the houses with places Venus as theruler of the 5th & 12H and I have been exploring that in relation to biocosmic astrology Considering Venus asthat which attracts for integration and tentatively looking at the 5th house as being where the earliest
indications of an underlying health issue [on all levels] may rear their head.

Quote:
5th House: Venus (Chaldean order), Venus (Joy of the fifth house), Mars (domicile ruler of Scorpio the universal sign of the Thema
Mundi’s fifth house).
Venus (pleasures, pleasures, pleasures!, as we have double Venus here and the fifth is trine to the first!, gifts, honours, affairs). The fifth
aspects the first, hence, it must also indicate persons that have relationship to us. In this case it will be children as children give pleasures
to the native. Venus and Mars give significations of childbirth (and the hardship that comes with it), the carrying of child i.e. the labour ofpregnancy, the act of procreation (sexual act itself with or without pleasures), corrupted pleasures, etc.

http://www.skyscript.co.uk/forums/viewtopic.php?p=51463 Look for astrojin, second post in thethread.

Hmm....and by what standard are "corrupted pleasures" measured? I heard that Presbyterians had aprohibition on sex because they feared it might lead to dancing...

Biocosmic (medical) astrology
http://www.sunherb.com/an_astrological_guide_to_health.htm

Edited:Bingo! I was 22 then and in an 11H Profection Year - I copped the mirror of the 5H - major issues with sexual harassmentin the workplace and being treated as life-support for a vagina. The Social Club of this employer was a big deal-you had tojoin or else you weren't 'one of the team'.

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Ex Member

Re: Fifth House« Reply #127 - on: 09.08.2013 at 12:55 [UT+1] »Throughout the months or rather years of fighting with my own urinary tract I came to realise how many
women actually suffer from this. It's incredible. I wonder if it's some product of our time..it must have beenreally hard before antibiotics came into the picture.
And it's something that is actually life-threatening, as when the immune system is not in top condition.
Even my urologist said he was stunned by the number of patients (all women) he had had with this problem.
And there seems to be no real solution. Taking antibiotics is only effective until germs start to be immune toall. Besides they can have serious side effects.
However I'm sure it's all decided in the head. Since I gave birth to my daughter four years ago I only had one
terrible attack on my bladder and it was because I mixed the three "no-nos" during one day: went swimming,
not changing my suit when it became wet, ate very spicy food and had sex to really celebrate the day. I was
honestly not thinking about my urinary tract that day, as my big problem seemed to have passed by then.
Seems it still hasn't. But I didn't need antibios during this whole period.
Thanks for the links, I'm trying to digest the info!
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OMphoebe
Ex Member

Re: Fifth House« Reply #128 - on: 09.08.2013 at 13:24 [UT+1] »I am wondering if it is a product of our chemical-contraceptive times. I just checked my diary from 1983 and ugh! I contracted this pyelonephritis two weeks after I took the 'morning-after' pill, which back then was
double/triple
doses of the Pill. I had a E return on the table at the time and E is a domicile ruler of the 5H.

nuts

I am going to chuck all this in the 'sacral chakra' basket and let it steep for a bit. Until 2019 which is when
Pluto will
nicky-woop out of my 5H.
Used to be an old chestnut that if a woman had problems, having a child would sort things out....blow the
cobwebs out
or something.....I dunno. Just remember that was one of the old wives' tales 'cure-alls' for everything from
irregular
menses to boredom.
Also got told, when I was a kid, that sitting on cold concrete would give me haemorrhoids. I suspect that isn't
true.
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Re: Fifth House« Reply #129 - on: 09.08.2013 at 17:10 [UT+1] »You might be into something, OMphoebe. Artificial hormons and hormon-like chemicals are in abundance in our
food products and they are even in the water.
That commonplace about childbirth being good for everything still exists, I heard that from my doc too.
Ironically it worked in my case which I think is because of psychological reasons rather than what I think people
originally imply in it, namely that women get hysteroid and all kinds of deseases without the aid of a huge dick(like every commonplace it has some truth in itself, but the penis is only part of a male, it will hardly do
without a nice person attached to its end).
By the way I had T J o NJ and m NE in H5 that time. It had just started.
And no, I don't think that sitting on cold concrete gives you haemorrhids either.
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SeventhMember

Re: Fifth House« Reply #130 - on: 09.08.2013 at 18:23 [UT+1] »I don't see the correlation between 5th gambling. Gambling seems more 12th house to me.

Posts: 559
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OMphoebe

Ex Member

Re: Fifth House« Reply #131 - on: 10.08.2013 at 03:22 [UT+1] »Quote from ramez on 09.08.2013 at 17:10 [UT+1]:
You might be into something, OMphoebe. Artificial hormons and hormon-like chemicals are in abundance in our food products and they areeven in the water.
That commonplace about childbirth being good for everything still exists, I heard that from my doc too. Ironically it worked in my casewhich I think is because of psychological reasons rather than what I think people originally imply in it, namely that women get hysteroid
and all kinds of deseases without the aid of a huge dick (like every commonplace it has some truth in itself, but the penis is only part of amale, it will hardly do without a nice person attached to its end).

J o NJ and m NE in H5 that time. It had just started.

By the way I had T

And no, I don't think that sitting on cold concrete gives you haemorrhids either.

I had tr. Chiron n I moving towards my MC at that time - the wounded sheila

I would have loved to havegotten hysterical over a huge appendage yet was only mildly frightened by smaller samples....

My T J i o N J lobbed in my 4H with M transiting H5 and she brought somebody as pure as the driven
slush into my orbit who taught me how to play the 'get out of jail free' card. I am still reaping the dividends
from that investment I made in what, on the surface, looked like an amazingly poor decision. Paraphrasing
Rumi:
Gamble everything for lustIf you are a true human being.
Half-heartedness does not reach
into majesty.
Define 'gambling'?
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Waybread
Member

Re: Fifth House« Reply #132 - on: 10.08.2013 at 04:02 [UT+1] »Quote from Seventh on 09.08.2013 at 18:23 [UT+1]:
I don't see the correlation between 5th gambling. Gambling seems more 12th house to me.

The fifth has traditionally been the house of amusements of various sorts. Taken from a Renaissance-era maleperspective, amusements included gambling, love affairs in the sense of casual sex for pleasure rather thancommitment, and the theatre. The 5th has been nicknamed the play house or the party house. "The Strip" in
Las Vegas is based on the premise that gambling is a form of amusement!

Posts: 14740
Gender:In terms of whether one would experience gambling as a form of entertainment or not, look at how theplanetary ruler of the 5th house cusp is situated, and the aspects of any 5th house planets. So, for example, if
Saturn is ruling the cusp of the 5th, is squared by Pluto, and is located in the 12th, this person would probably
not a gambler make.
Perhaps if Jupiter rules the 5th house cusp and is happily situated in the 2nd house, you would find one of the
lucky gamblers.
I don't know if there is a commonality between children and amusements once one grows up and beyond
Toyland. Certainly some people retain that childlike persona throughout life. I think the association of the 5th
with one's children is far older than the amusement part, as it shows up in Hellenistic astrology texts.

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Krista ShippMember

Re: Fifth House« Reply #133 - on: 10.08.2013 at 04:09 [UT+1] »h rules my H5- holding only vertex & Juno
Natally -J e- H2 is m C & p NFa- H10- m MC
I am a very good poker player...
I am drawn to gambling- but can get too intense about it
Posts: 15841
Gender:More often than not- I win

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OMphoebe
Ex Member

Re: Fifth House« Reply #134 - on: 10.08.2013 at 11:33 [UT+1] »From the vaults circa 2007
Quote:The genes (the idea/ image/ concept/ master plan directing life (the fifth) and material building (the second)/ the aim of survival of thespecies - according to Döbereiner) are in the eighth.
Richard reply #39

http://forum.astro.com/cgi/forum.cgi?num=1197536023/20

Dobereiner who developed the Munich Rhythm Theory....

Quote:The 2nd quadrant: Instinctual feelings press up to connect the inner (4th house) with outer experience for the orientation of action. This is
the emotional or psychic energy, or libido, leading to creativity or the urge to give birth to forms (5th house) through "inner
pictures" (evidently unconscious archetypes). But this needs a polarity, an encounter from the outside, which takes place in the third
quadrant and which acts as a projection screen, or a visible embodiment, making a connection with the inner archetype. This quadrant iscompletely internal as opposed to physical and only here do we actually experience things emotionally. In the 6th house we have to adapt
our self-expression to the prevailing external conditions and limitations and this is how we function in the world as individual and rational
persons.

http://www.radical-astrology.com/articles/articles/others/dobereiner.html

And another thread on the 5th House from 2011 - 5 pages long
http://forum.astro.com/cgi/forum.cgi?num=1298392221
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OMphoebe

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Re: Fifth House« Reply #135 - on: 11.08.2013 at 04:17 [UT+1] »Found this 5-part series on The Sacred Geometry of Chance in the blogosphere....
I am a writer. I am someone who writes.

I don’t write for money or fame. As one of Sting’s lyrics goes:

He deals the cards as a meditation
And those he plays never suspect
He doesn’t play for the money he wins
He doesn’t play for respect
He deals the cards to find the answer
The sacred geometry of chance
The hidden law of probable outcome
The numbers lead a dance”
http://sexualityinart.wordpress.com/2013/08/01/the-sacred-geometry-of-chance-par t-i/

The Thema Mundi has Cancer rising with Scorpio in the Fifth House......does anybody else look at how theThema Mundi adds
another dimension to their natal chart?
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Cor Leonis
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Re: Fifth House« Reply #136 - on: 11.08.2013 at 04:47 [UT+1] »Define lust?

Quote:(The warrior) knows that death is stalking him or her and won’t give time to cling to anything… And thus with an awareness of death,…

Posts: 693

and with the power of own decisions, the warrior sets life in a strategic manner… and what the warrior chooses is always strategically thebest; and thus the warrior performs everything with gusto and lusty efficiency!

not what many of ya'll thought of first, admit it...
Quote from OMphoebe on 10.08.2013 at 03:22 [UT+1]:
Quote from ramez on 09.08.2013 at 17:10 [UT+1]:
You might be into something, OMphoebe. Artificial hormons and hormon-like chemicals are in abundance in our foodproducts and they are even in the water.
That commonplace about childbirth being good for everything still exists, I heard that from my doc too. Ironically it worked
in my case which I think is because of psychological reasons rather than what I think people originally imply in it, namelythat women get hysteroid and all kinds of deseases without the aid of a huge dick (like every commonplace it has sometruth in itself, but the penis is only part of a male, it will hardly do without a nice person attached to its end).

J o NJ and m NE in H5 that time. It had just started.

By the way I had T

And no, I don't think that sitting on cold concrete gives you haemorrhids either.

I had tr. Chironn I moving towards my MC at that time - the wounded sheila

I would have loved to havegotten hysterical over a huge appendage yet was only mildly frightened by smaller samples....

My T

J i o N J lobbed in my 4H with M transiting H5 and she brought somebody as pure as the driven slush into my orbit who taught

me how to play the 'get out of jail free' card. I am still reaping the dividends from that investment I made in what, on the surface, looked
like an amazingly poor decision. Paraphrasing Rumi:
Gamble everything for lustIf you are a true human being.
Half-heartedness does not reach
into majesty.
Define 'gambling'?

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OMphoebe

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Re: Fifth House« Reply #137 - on: 11.08.2013 at 05:48 [UT+1] »Death doesn't stalk me.....I slowed down so it could catch up and walk beside me.
Have another go at trying to scare me?
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Cor Leonis
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Re: Fifth House« Reply #138 - on: 11.08.2013 at 08:12 [UT+1] »Lust, asked you to define lust, context was provided in that vein.
ducker and diver.
Quote from OMphoebe on 11.08.2013 at 05:48 [UT+1]:
Death doesn't stalk me.....I slowed down so it could catch up and walk beside me.

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Have another go at trying to scare me?

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OMphoebe

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Re: Fifth House« Reply #139 - on: 11.08.2013 at 08:31 [UT+1] »Quote from rasalgethi on 11.08.2013 at 08:12 [UT+1]:

Lust, asked you to define lust, context was provided in that vein.

....mmhmm....you kinda needed to have been a bit clearer about that and worded it better. Where
did you extract that quote from, because it would help to be able to place it within the context ofthe full body of writing in which it appears.
Wonder if the 5H covers plagiarism; copyright issues to do with theft of intellectual and creative property; orin this case, inadequate acknowledgement of the source material.
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EnigmeMember

Re: Fifth House« Reply #140 - on: 13.08.2013 at 16:40 [UT+1] »Lust along with sex is eighth house or so I thought.. I considered the fifth as leisure activities not obsession as
in lust or even sex. Leisure is things like vacations, activities that are recreational, like the family barbeque orentertaining. Gambling is recreational for some people but when addicted no longer is in the realm of the fifth.
Gambling is also of the realm of Poseidon/Neptune along with horses and traditionally Jupiter I believe. A friendof mine has Venus 5th and she and her hubbie will vacation to Atlantic City or Charlestown which are gamblingareas.
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But maybe having Pluto as 5th ruler gives cause for small intimate groups rather than loud boisterous. I canfind leisure when alone and will actively seek solitude.
Would Arts and Theatre be associated also with the fifth? I consider these very recreational and enjoyable. Like
going to the Corcoran gallery and meditating on a Matisse or some other classic artist.

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Mikko S.

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Re: Fifth House« Reply #141 - on: 14.08.2013 at 03:01 [UT+1] »I associate 5th house with Leo, it's where my ascendant is and the sagittarian influence is strong in me. 5thhouse, ego? I do find longer trips somewhat enjoyable, like taking a train 500km north, despite of having mybutt hurt from all the sitting, i and OF & SN in my 5th. I guess that's the sagittarian influence. Things I'minterested in I find to be in the 5th, but the interest is like "drawn towards to it", a warmer and more personal
Posts: 784
Gender:sort of interest.
I like to gamble too, but it's not good for me, the h stellium I give into can make it hard to let go of it, andF in 5th, you're prone to take more and more of whatever poison it is.
South Node in 5th though, dont know how that has manifested, except that my 5th house related interests
turn out bad way too easily, they're a thing it's easy for me to fall back to, not challenging to yourself.
There's also certain dogma in my 5th. Dunno if it's because of Aries in 9th, governing sagittarian issues, or justthe fire influence, but there. In one hand that house is very natural, following it's instinct, but on the other
hand it's a house where it's not easy to change your ways.

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EnigmeMember

Re: Fifth House« Reply #142 - on: 14.08.2013 at 15:47 [UT+1] »Good read Mikko!!! I have Saturn there intercepted Sagittarius conj vertex i which is dead on my AB
midpoint and Scorpio on the cusp! And the Sun/Node midpoint exact on my Apex yod Moon...
People forget that the Ascendant is How OTHERS perceive us.. Which can be very different than the reality as
we all know with pictures that display illusion tricks of the mind. (I).
I too have leo rising but I have B 00 Aries. But may actually be in the last minutes of Pisces in the Ninth. I canbe fixed but my love of learning and Virgo sun which too loves learning makes me open to new ideas. Don't likebeing stuck in ruts, mental emotional or spiritual...

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SNode in your fifth Sag covers what you already understand.. covered ground. NNode Gem would seem torepresent a need to learn new things by being open to who you friend. As in going outside your typical crowd.
If intellectual, go hang out with some folks who work with their hands. We call them rednecks or some othertype of people that would represent something outside your circle...

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Re: Fifth House« Reply #143 - on: 15.08.2013 at 05:50 [UT+1] »I have noticed that when venus transits my fifth I always seem to go out to clubs and such and do a lot morepartying. Which is about half of what I do the whole rest of the year combined it seems. My fifth is ruled bypluto. My north node is there also but in Sagittarius.

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EnigmeMember

Re: Fifth House« Reply #144 - on: 15.08.2013 at 14:21 [UT+1] »Very interesting Mojoloco, maybe it is Pluto ruling that makes us recluses. Venus transiting the fifth, yes I cansee pleasurable indulgences taking hold. I too notice a little more social activity like small gatherings andentertainment. Sad that since I replied the others have not responded.

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Somers69

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Re: Fifth House« Reply #145 - on: 16.08.2013 at 05:56 [UT+1] »HI All,My 5th house is ruled by Cancer (late degrees) with a very proud Leo Venus in 'da house!
Posts: 2535
Gender:This is how I think my Leo Venus in the 5th plays out Generous to a fault - especially for children. My niece and nephew and friends children are the best dressed kids
in town.
Always getting the drinks in! I hate it when girls don't pull their weight in that department and expect the boys
to pay for everything.
Love a good party - especially in my 20's and 30's - loved going out partying until the wee hours of themorning. I never wanted the party to end - one place would shut I would be like "Where do we go next!"
Artistic - I paint, draw, ready handy with my hands making things and I play piano (those things might also
play into my Pisces ASC)Love beautiful things - homewares, fabricPlayful in love - I'm really like a Leo in the love dept Grrrrrrrr
My 5th house Venus is also at the apex of my minor talent triangle (with 3rd house moon and 7th house
Mercury/Jupiter conjunction) - should be doing something professionally with my artistic talent.

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EnigmeMember

Re: Fifth House« Reply #146 - on: 16.08.2013 at 15:32 [UT+1] »Somers69 were you reading my mind????? I was thinking of that very combination since the discussion flowed
into Saggie 5th! Was wondering of Cancer or Taurus for example and Venus there!!!
Oh yeah says Venus Leo 1st!!! EEEK that makes me Scorp Pluto cusp seem so dark in comparison..
Yesindeed I guess the fifth does cover things like dating and such.. enjoyed your description Somers69.. says
Eyesis from the crypt. and just got new insight that I was searching for...

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Somers69

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Re: Fifth House« Reply #147 - on: 19.08.2013 at 03:58 [UT+1] »You are very welcome Eyesis!
I was hoping I might win the lottery with Venus in the 5th but with the big fat square to natal Saturn that isprobably unlikely! Damn it!
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Re: Fifth House« Reply #148 - on: 19.08.2013 at 08:19 [UT+1] »Intriguing thread.
My 5th house is empty, and it has l on the cusp; jI rules it from my 2nd house, with no major aspects
other than that q from hJ (I is r kA/D).
This house is generally nebulous to me, except for whenever there is a transit. When F transited a few years
ago I "gave birth" to a full science-fiction manuscript; this was interesting because I had just graduated college
and my 2nd House iO and jI had me whining (yet again) about how I possessed no "tangible skills."
Suddenly, I had confidently produced a significant piece of self-expression that I intended to bank on; what'smore, I had done it using my "intangible"talents.
I love the annual A and D visits to this house; it gets so much easier to be spunky

I tend to think about the Sun/Leo/5th House as personal glory: the specialness that shines out of one and thenature and circumstances surrounding that light. It describes the special things that only we can achieve, whichmakes us heroes (I am a fan of the hero's journey view of the sun). It describes creativity and self-expression inthat it shows how everything we do (make, create, impress) is stamped by our uniqueness ("that is sohim","this is so her") which flashes out of us naturally; sort of how we give birth to our children naturally, andthey look like us without us having to do anything about it. It has to do with attention calling (different fromattracting) and ego-shaping identifiers.
The (Leo/5thHouse)/(Aquarius/11thHouse) axis addresses the balance of personal glory versus collective glory;
how important one person is, as weighed in contrast how important the collective is. It relates to how by day
we see the glory of that one big, indispensable star we call the sun while at night we the glory of the collectionsof stars that we call constellations.

O is transiting my 5th right now, so I'm looking forward to that awakening.
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EnigmeMember

Re: Fifth House« Reply #149 - on: 19.08.2013 at 15:36 [UT+1] »Quote from Somers69 on 19.08.2013 at 03:58 [UT+1]:
You are very welcome Eyesis!
I was hoping I might win the lottery with Venus in the 5th but with the big fat square to natal Saturn that is probably unlikely! Damn it!

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I have Saturn i Fifth trine Venus.. small gain through lottery. But squares sometimes demand focus andcontinued work to resolve!! Find a set of numbers and play those... and wishing you luck. Maybe luck through afriend partner or lover!!
When you mentioned children I realized with Saturn the old traditional definition of this placement meant loss
or troubles through children. Sad but the first came very true. Since then I have emotionally removed myself
from those with children particularly younger. I did finally meet my granddaughter. She is beautiful and truly
gifted. Her 00 Cancer moon compliments my own 00 Aries moon and my mothers 00 Scorp.
But with Pluto ruling I do find pleasure in digging studies of an archeological or anthropological bend. I love
looking in the nooks and crannies where others fear. Always been interested since childhood things of unknownor hidden nature. and yes studies of a more bodily nature also. Fascinated with certain things...

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EnigmeMember

Re: Fifth House« Reply #150 - on: 19.08.2013 at 15:40 [UT+1] »Gaebryal I too love your thoughts... personal vs collective glory. Leo is the natural 5th and loves to shine. The
more altruistic of this would be that how you shine can infect others to shine as well. It is hard for others(11th) to stay moody or angry when you let your light shine with no expectation of glory. This is the part ofLeo people do not grasp. Leo will do things because they enjoy it.. it is their Pleasure!! no ego trip.. this is also
5th.

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olympias8

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Re: Fifth House« Reply #151 - on: 19.08.2013 at 16:06 [UT+1] »My 5th house is ruled by Jupiter and I have G E O Vertex and I in it..
I like gambling, but I know that I am one of those people who shouldn't - that's why I avoid it most of thePosts: 187

time.
And yes the lottery.. I could dream about (I) what I'd do with a big win for hours.. I play every now and thenand I truly believe that in one of these days.. yea..

- whatever

Sometimes I think the 5th also tells us something about our role in society ?
Also about competitiveness in general etc ?
I have so many opposite energies in the 5th and find it really hard to tell
how they interact with each other and what they cause.
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IP LoggedGæbryelEx Member

Re: Fifth House« Reply #152 - on: 19.08.2013 at 21:12 [UT+1] »Quote from Eyesis on 19.08.2013 at 15:40 [UT+1]:
Gaebryal I too love your thoughts... personal vs collective glory. Leo is the natural 5th and loves to shine. The more altruistic of thiswould be that how you shine can infect others to shine as well. It is hard for others (11th) to stay moody or angry when you let your lightshine with no expectation of glory. This is the part of Leo people do not grasp. Leo will do things because they enjoy it.. it is their
Pleasure!! no ego trip.. this is also 5th.

I agree with you emphatically, Eyesis. I admit that I once also thought of «ego» as a four-letter word (anAquarius trait maybe?). Sorry for talking about A-e-5th House in such lump terms.
I have a very close friend whose kA is conjunct F, and he has a huge ego. It is only occasionally annoying
when he insists upon monopolizing your attention span; sometimes, he'll get your attention playfully, just to
have it. It's like he wants to be the sun at midnight, when I'm trying to sleep. But as I've lost anxiety about all
those assumptions regarding ego (arrogance, attention starvation, presumtion) I've been able to reallyappreciate how he constantly, lovingly works to help his loved ones achieve that crucial sense of specialness
about themselves. He is always pointing out to others how important they are. He is very successful andenterprising in endeavors that benefit humanity (i.e. renewable energy), and I think it is because he has such a
powerful ego. I think that while k people teach us that we are all important, e teaches us that we are each
important.
Everyone should develop some sense of self-importance and destiny ("it is up to me to do this","look what I cando"). That is how the individual can make their personal contribution to the collective: through he own
specialness. It is important to be able to "be the center of the universe" (in a positive way). Feeling that things
are dependent on one can foster a very potent sense of empowered responsibility; a sense of personal glory
drives us to accomplish feats that honor ourselves and others. And isn't that the stuff of heroes?
As a person who has struggled to understand A/e/5th house matters, I've come to find that some people
that feel anxiety about «ego» sometimes confuse their own difficulties with self-expression and spontaneity for
humility (or prudence).
The positive e/A/5th house person feels, out of love, that is up to her to be the champion and they shine
brightly in the process.
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Re: Fifth House« Reply #153 - on: 20.08.2013 at 05:25 [UT+1] »Eyesis, I agree with your post #140.
I am all for significance in astrology, but I also think the 5th is the "lighten up" house. It's OK to kick back, andwatch something mindless on TV while eating popcorn. It's OK to go skiing, or weight-lifting, or needlepointing, or window-shopping. If you have little children (or grandchildren) the 5th is where you get down on
the carpet and play with them. It is whatever takes the burdens off your shoulders. It is the house where
people giggle at jokes and can laugh at themselves.

Posts: 14740
Gender:Trying to make the 5th too, too serious misses its entire point. (Sort of like killing a joke by trying to explain it
to someone who still doesn't get it.)If the ruler of your MC or 6th house cusp is in the 5th, you might want a job in therecreation/leisure/entertainment industry; but really the 5th is not about jobs or careers. It's about whatrevitalizes you after a rough day at the office. Better still, you want your job to be fun. Whatever fun looks
like to you-- you could be a chemical engineer or a hair dresser, yet really enjoy it.
I don't gamble, but clearly a trip to the casino is a recreational activity for all gamblers except the gambling
addicts. Card playing falls in the 5th: any regular bridge, poker, or canasta players here? It's where you have
fun with your friends, never mind who wins or who loses.
In terms of love affairs, the 5th is also the light-hearted flirtation or, for some, the quick and easy, no-stringsattached sexual encounter.
The 5th house is the birthday party with balloons-- whether it's for a child or your 80-year old grandmother.
It's enjoying the rainbow. Or enjoying a walk in the rain.
Traditionally the 5th dealt much more with children than it seems to today, with the declining birth rate inmany countries. Jupiter in the 5th used to symbolize large families of children prior to the era of birth control.
As the house of the child, it is also the house where we can enjoy feeling young. It is seeing children as asource of happiness.
The Mormons have a great saying, "Man is, that he might have joy."It's OK to have fun.

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EnigmeMember

Re: Fifth House« Reply #154 - on: 20.08.2013 at 15:26 [UT+1] »Ahhh there's a little of my not understanding mine too well Waybread.
I have never been on a date andnever been on vacation. Seems that ole Pluto cusp and Saturn Vertex kind of put the kabash on things. Seems
my simple pleasures or triumphs are met with someone else's pain like getting some work and found out thesame day that a friend's family member died or something of that nature. Buuuuut when I do chill I definitely
get the fun on. Maybe Pluto gives me strange ideas of fun (no psychocreepy stuff though
Like a rainy day a good book and my imagination...

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Lee Rutland

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Re: Fifth House« Reply #155 - on: 20.08.2013 at 19:36 [UT+1] »Quote from Eyesis on 13.08.2013 at 16:40 [UT+1]:
Lust along with sex is eighth house or so I thought..

You are probably one of the Woodstock Generation who came to be told that "sex" was just a "thang". It ain't
nothing. It's just a thang.
We have lost sight of what Sex really is....a coming together, a death, a rebirth, a mind-altering, life producing
experience.
Posts: 3301

And that is what the 8th House is about. It is all those deep emotional confrontations, the hidden, dark sides ofus that our close relationships reveal.
The 5th has always been (to me) a joyful creative burst of the uninhibited child in all of us, and is called our"lovers" probably because of that passion of your first kiss.
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Cranberry
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Re: Fifth House« Reply #156 - on: 20.08.2013 at 20:29 [UT+1] »People could start here to help envision the 5th house. leastways, I've always liked Dana Gerhardt's thoughts
and articles.
http://www.astro.com/astrology/in_dgfifthhouse_e.htm
Cran

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EnigmeMember

Re: Fifth House« Reply #157 - on: 20.08.2013 at 23:03 [UT+1] »Good read Cran...the pleasure of simply being. Sometimes silly and giggly or quiet in my thoughts. Nature. Will
continue with thoughts on this.

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EnigmeMember

Re: Fifth House« Reply #158 - on: 21.08.2013 at 13:16 [UT+1] »Quote from Lee Rutland on 20.08.2013 at 19:36 [UT+1]:
Quote from Eyesis on 13.08.2013 at 16:40 [UT+1]:
Lust along with sex is eighth house or so I thought..

You are probably one of the Woodstock Generation who came to be told that "sex" was just a "thang". It ain't nothing. It's just a thang.
We have lost sight of what Sex really is....a coming together, a death, a rebirth, a mind-altering, life producing experience.
And that is what the 8th House is about. It is all those deep emotional confrontations, the hidden, dark sides of us that our close

Posts: 5489

relationships reveal.
The 5th has always been (to me) a joyful creative burst of the uninhibited child in all of us, and is called our "lovers" probably because ofthat passion of your first kiss.

No Lee born about 10 years too late for that

I am the generation that looked back upon the olders like mybrother and shook my head. Pluto conj Sun Virgo. And with Saturn in the fifth seems that frivolities are a little
harder to obtain. I deleted my post because I thought of it and realized you were calling me a frivolous S---In the 22+ years I have been widowed I have had a total of 5 relationships of which they hoped I would bethere sugar momma lol. I generally dislike putting very personal things on board but I must defend myself.
Combined I have been celibate 20 of those 22 years.
So certainly that does not sound frivolous to me.
What I fail to understand that as you being a "professional" astrologer you can give in depth analysis to others
going into great lengths.
With Saturn intercepted 5th I would have thought your insight would have been a bit less personal.
If you do not like me then please leave me alone. I do not appreciate my life and its agonies of losing myhusband and children frivolous.
I would certainly appreciate if you please give an analysis based on the rest of my posts and my question anddelete your post. I do not appreciate being slyly called a whore.

If you notice I have not approached you on the forum and I noted that you only quoted one sentence. Yes I amvery hurt angry and embarrassed. Seems to fit well with my posts in the 4*Leo thread.
Thou art a coward Lee Rutland and if you do answer me do not come off with this What are You talking about
with a million question marks.
I wish for you to quantify why I must be anything.
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Lee Rutland

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Re: Fifth House« Reply #159 - on: 21.08.2013 at 23:07 [UT+1] »Eyesis, I think you have finally flipped.
What I wrote was a general statement. It did not refer to you or your chart in any way. It was a blanket remark
to introduce my theme, then on to the general definition of the 5th House.
You got a serious burr under your blanket over nothing......

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Rikki-Tikki-Tavi
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Re: Fifth House« Reply #160 - on: 22.08.2013 at 10:18 [UT+1] »Quote from Cranberry on 20.08.2013 at 20:29 [UT+1]:
People could start here to help envision the 5th house. leastways, I've always liked Dana Gerhardt's thoughts and articles.
http://www.astro.com/astrology/in_dgfifthhouse_e.htm
Cran

From the Dana Gerhardt article on the 5th:
One of the basic tools of Cameron's program for releasing blocked creativity is what she calls an "Artist's Date."
This is a fun excursion or play date with yourself alone--that you must commit to once a week. It can besomething quite simple and inexpensive, like walking through an unfamiliar neighbourhood, just to take in thesights, sounds and smells.

Well, that's weird!
When Juno [no planets, just this pet rock] was transiting my 5th house I joined an online group of creatives which
was when I first heard of Julia Cameron and The Artist's Way.

Julia has a few Youtube videos. This is one from February 2007 in which she does a useful bit on recognizing"Wet Blanket" people.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q3KLocmjJwI&feature=related

Oxford Astrologer did a mini-profile here...
http://oxford-astrologer.blogspot.com.au/2012/05/unpacking-my-library-artists-wa y.html

I like Dana Gerhardt's perspectives as well, keep coming back to them.
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Darker StarEx Member

Re: Fifth House« Reply #161 - on: 22.08.2013 at 14:10 [UT+1] »Quote from mstray on 08.12.2008 at 23:45 [UT]:
I have vertex in 5th tooi, plus D and the trouble maker (for me) I as it's got some horrible aspects like oG

I wasn't remotely maternal in anyway until I had children, not domesticated at all, I just studied hard. I must be rather fertile as all werevery lovely surprises but my first 2 were conceived on the pill. My eldest was conceived after just 2 months with my now husband. As soon
as I had him that was it, I was besotted. I have an attached approach to parenting, I breastfeed until they self wean, cosleep, use slings
etc Nobody saw that coming at all. They (my mum mainly) thought I'd be cold. We always joke we used all our luck up on having
amazing children (and they are gorgeous too, I'm always complimented on their looks which I read is a

D 5th thing). I even love giving

birth, I had a homebirth with the youngest and has to be one of the most amazing days of my life.
I don't know much about vertex.

I can relate to this. I have k on the 5th, with F there making some lovely aspects to BDEO (except thepesky o to G). People thought I, the c would be a cold/harsh mother with no warmth, akin to my OWN c
mother.
I showed them! My daughter's k stellium is smack dab on my F. She's still breastfeeding as a toddler (loves
her milkies LOL), we cosleep (when she wants) and I used a sling as well. I had to have a C-section but reallywanted natural, I just had complications. I feel such a heaviness from her since her G is in my 1st, and she
definitely kicked my butt into shape. However, her stellium in my 5th really made me open up and enjoy thesimple things in life. Like, picnics in the park, cuddles, kisses, picking flowers, fingerpainting, going down slides,
etc. She is one happy, giggly kid because she showed me how to be one happy, giggly adult.
I feel like it's better to build a healthy foundation rather than mess it all up and try to make it up when your kid
is almost 30.
been there.
So, that's my experience of the 5th. It didn't really get activated until I had the little one. Otherwise it was justdabbling in some ceramics, good luck here and there, and a strong interest in music.
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EnigmeMember

Re: Fifth House« Reply #162 - on: 22.08.2013 at 14:13 [UT+1] »Quote from Lee Rutland on 21.08.2013 at 23:07 [UT+1]:
Eyesis, I think you have finally flipped.
What I wrote was a general statement. It did not refer to you or your chart in any way. It was a blanket remark to introduce my theme,
then on to the general definition of the 5th House.
You got a serious burr under your blanket over nothing......

Posts: 5489

No one ever became great by belittling another Lee and it is obvious that whether I overreacted or not that you
lack any kind feelings or thought about me for what ever reason.
And you never answered why you assumed I was of the Woodstock generation.
What did you mean by that?
To quote You Must Be of the Woodstock Generation...
And geez nothing worse that passive aggressive people RTT... referring to the Wet Blanket evidently you are
unaware that this person and I have gone round this circle before and this is just part of a pattern with a past...

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Cor Leonis

Member

Re: Fifth House« Reply #163 - on: 22.08.2013 at 14:38 [UT+1] »Quote from Gæbryel on 19.08.2013 at 21:12 [UT+1]:
Quote from Eyesis on 19.08.2013 at 15:40 [UT+1]:
Gaebryal I too love your thoughts... personal vs collective glory. Leo is the natural 5th and loves to shine. The morealtruistic of this would be that how you shine can infect others to shine as well. It is hard for others (11th) to stay moodyor angry when you let your light shine with no expectation of glory. This is the part of Leo people do not grasp. Leo will dothings because they enjoy it.. it is their Pleasure!! no ego trip.. this is also 5th.

Posts: 693

I agree with you emphatically, Eyesis. I admit that I once also thought of «ego» as a four-letter word (an Aquarius trait maybe?). Sorryfor talking about

A-e-5th House in such lump terms.

I have a very close friend whose

kA is conjunct F, and he has a huge ego. It is only occasionally annoying when he insists uponmonopolizing your attention span; sometimes, he'll get your attention playfully, just to have it. It's like he wants to be the sun at
midnight, when I'm trying to sleep. But as I've lost anxiety about all those assumptions regarding ego (arrogance, attention starvation,
presumtion) I've been able to really appreciate how he constantly, lovingly works to help his loved ones achieve that crucial sense of
specialness about themselves. He is always pointing out to others how important they are. He is very successful and enterprising in
endeavors that benefit humanity (i.e. renewable energy), and I think it is because he has such a powerful ego. I think that whilepeople teach us that we are all important,ke teaches us that we are each important.

Everyone should develop some sense of self-importance and destiny ("it is up to me to do this","look what I can do"). That is how theindividual can make their personal contribution to the collective: through he own specialness. It is important to be able to "be the centerof the universe" (in a positive way). Feeling that things are dependent on one can foster a very potent sense of empowered responsibility;
a sense of personal glory drives us to accomplish feats that honor ourselves and others. And isn't that the stuff of heroes?
As a person who has struggled to understandA/e/5th house matters, I've come to find that some people that feel anxiety about «ego»

sometimes confuse their own difficulties with self-expression and spontaneity for humility (or prudence).
The positive

e/A/5th house person feels, out of love, that is up to her to be the champion and they shine brightly in the process.

Those are interesting and helpful observations Gaebryel. Yet, And isn't that the stuff of heroes? Well, yes, butremember that suffering is also the lot of heroes.
That is the tragedy. That pain and suffering are our lot and we cannot escape that fact or fate, only learn fromit in terms of, as a 20th century hero puts it 'CONSCIOUS suffering' for after all, when you talk of heroes andbeing important, that is what leads to the suffering. Consider Achilles in the Iliad. And the list continues in the
Greek Pantheon and Myths, but while I do very much agree with you and enjoy your writing, I am also saying
that, in the greater scheme of things, we are not very important at all. This is the part that is always difficult
to accept for the lesson is subtle. But the Universe is always ready to provide, so if you (when I say you here I
mean someone in general) will not 'do the job' or 'step up to the plate' then someone else always will. This is
why I like what you say about how people can do what they can do BECAUSE they can do it, for how great isthat!!
But I suppose Pisces has to say that in the end it really doesn't matter, and if we remember that,then the fleeting moment becomes poignant and the impossible happens!
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Girt by Phoebe
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Re: Fifth House« Reply #164 - on: 22.08.2013 at 16:36 [UT+1] »Quote:
author=Eyesis link=1228713057/160#162 date=1377177198
And you never answered why you assumed I was of the Woodstock generation.
What did you mean by that?
You Must Be of the Woodstock Generation...
And geez nothing worse that passive aggressive people RTT... referring to the Wet Blanket evidently you are unaware that this person andI have gone round this circle before and this is just part of a pattern with a past...

Eyesis, too right I am unaware of the history and past patterns because I first joined this Forum in mid-May
2010.
My post was in reply to Cranberry link to Dana Gerhardt's article on the 5th house and Dana's reference to The
Artist's Way. For the record I was not inferring you are a Wet Blanket either Cranberry.
I too, am curious about what is meant by the "Woodstock Generation" comment because I was 8 years old at
the time and I want to know what my parents were so worried about that I couldn't even have a tie-dyed Tshirt. I would ask them except they have both been pushing up daisies for a long time now.
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Astrochologist

Ex Member

Re: Fifth House« Reply #165 - on: 22.08.2013 at 18:27 [UT+1] »Empty 5th house cusp Aquarius

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Lee Rutland
Member

Re: Fifth House« Reply #166 - on: 22.08.2013 at 18:52 [UT+1] »Quote from Eyesis on 22.08.2013 at 14:13 [UT+1]:
Quote from Lee Rutland on 21.08.2013 at 23:07 [UT+1]:
Eyesis, I think you have finally flipped.
What I wrote was a general statement. It did not refer to you or your chart in any way. It was a blanket remark to
introduce my theme, then on to the general definition of the 5th House.
You got a serious burr under your blanket over nothing......

No one ever became great by belittling another Lee and it is obvious that whether I overreacted or not that you lack any kind feelings or
thought about me for what ever reason.

Posts: 3301

And you never answered why you assumed I was of the Woodstock generation.
What did you mean by that?
To quote You Must Be of the Woodstock Generation...
And geez nothing worse that passive aggressive people RTT... referring to the Wet Blanket evidently you are unaware that this person andI have gone round this circle before and this is just part of a pattern with a past...

OK, one more time.
I made a generalized statement, using the attitudes promulgated by the generation of the '60s, which madesex a casual affair. That attitude has permeated our society.
It was, IN NO WAY, a reference to you Eyesis, or anyone else in particular for that matter.
THE POINT I WAS TRYING TO MAKE WAS......our society has lost sight of the overwhelming, life-changing
bond that comes from a man and a woman coming together, one so powerful that it can actually create a life.
I'm not belittling you, Eyesis, I'm not even talking about you, for God's Sake!
Read what I wrote, girl!!!!!

Jeeeezzzzz....
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Lee Rutland

Member

Re: Fifth House« Reply #167 - on: 22.08.2013 at 19:13 [UT+1] »Quote from Girt by Phoebe on 22.08.2013 at 16:36 [UT+1]:
I too, am curious about what is meant by the "Woodstock Generation" comment because I was 8 years old at the time and I want to knowwhat my parents were so worried about that I couldn't even have a tie-dyed T-shirt. I would ask them except they have both been pushingup daisies for a long time now.

My God, have I gotten that old???? I didn't even stop to think that that would require an explanation, but I see
that much time has passed.

Posts: 3301

OK, for all you younger folks out there...there was a time....when I grew up....the only way one had sex was tobe married to a woman.... End of story, that was it.
Your only other recourse was to go to a prostitute, and they were not held in high regard.
Sex didn't exist outside of marriage. It didn't happen. Now, I know it did, on occasion, people wound up having
sex, but women were not inclined to do it, and were not under any pressure to do so.
Then, along came rock and roll. Elvis started it, and Jerry Lee Lewis and a few others. They got us to thinking
about sex, dreaming about it and then came Woodstock. It was a music festival in New York. It changed theworld. People went there for days of music and drugs and the sexually charged atmosphere was like a bomb
going off. Nothing has been the same since, and it opened a door of sexual freedom that has totally changed
society.

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Ex Member

Re: Fifth House« Reply #168 - on: 22.08.2013 at 19:38 [UT+1] »Quote from Lee Rutland on 22.08.2013 at 19:13 [UT+1]:
Quote from Girt by Phoebe on 22.08.2013 at 16:36 [UT+1]:
I too, am curious about what is meant by the "Woodstock Generation" comment because I was 8 years old at the time andI want to know what my parents were so worried about that I couldn't even have a tie-dyed T-shirt. I would ask them
except they have both been pushing up daisies for a long time now.

My God, have I gotten that old???? I didn't even stop to think that that would require an explanation, but I see that much time has
passed.
OK, for all you younger folks out there...there was a time.... when I grew up....the only way one had sex was to be married to a
woman.... End of story, that was it.

Thanks for that, Lee, but next time you tell that story can you start with......Once upon a time...... I believe
that's the rulefor bed-time stories. I'll let it slide this time, however must warn you, if you do it again, I will be obliged toreport you to the Storytellers Ovates & Bards Union for a breach in ethics and attempting to instigate areformation of a cherished tradition without due consultation with other SOBs.
I grew up in Australia. We had Sunbury Rock Festival.

I wasn't allowed to go to that either......

http://www.abc.net.au/archives/80days/stories/2012/01/19/3411566.htm

PS: I was conceived out of wedlock....could the 5th house be where double standards pay rent?
« Last Edit: 23.08.2013 at 11:33 [UT+1] by u193951898 »Back to top

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starcave

Ex Member

Re: Fifth House« Reply #169 - on: 22.08.2013 at 20:34 [UT+1] »j 5th house puts the "g r o a n" In Virgoan rising. It's empty in my chart.
Very little relationship/ sex this lifetime. Supported by 7th house G afflicted, Uranus in first, and even pure as
snowflake Vesta at 0 Libra. And I don't enjoy parties or gambling. And I have no children. I'm pro choice in myabortion stance, mean old Saturn ruled 5th. I do enjoy concerts. And creating music or visual art.
I suppose inner life has always been substantial enough; raising family not necessary in soul's evolution thislifetime. Love that word evolution. Like we start off as bacteria and continue leveling up to finally becomesuperkinetic disembodied superangels from the Pleiades or something. (Not there yet, still stuck and unable todefeat the boss at end of level 5)
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EnigmeMember

Re: Fifth House« Reply #170 - on: 22.08.2013 at 22:48 [UT+1] »Thank you veeeery much..peace flowers and all that. Actually sex was wild then too but it was hush hush andnot spoken of. That's why we had Shotgun weddings
And I was my older sibling's alibi so they could dowhat young hippies did. I went all over the place except for Woodstock. I did go to the 1776 club as a childwith them and was let in just because. This became Cellar Door which became the production company.
And being upset bexause they were blaring Hendrix and I was supposed to be in bed... They were my biggest
influences. I didnt do much of the sex thing but plenty of other.

Posts: 5489

It was soooo cool to skinny dip and be free flowing witbout fear of being hurt or harmed. If there was any wellit was all unseen under the water. Oh yeah...freezing river water sigh.
Oh Once upon a Time...
I feel Saturn in fifth taught me fun was funner when the bills were paid.
Pluto Scorpio Love Georgia O'Keefe Edgar Allen Poe and things that make me go hmmmm.

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EnigmeMember

Re: Fifth House« Reply #171 - on: 23.08.2013 at 14:02 [UT+1] »Empty houses signify areas of focus which would make your outlook conservative (not political) mind you
Starcave. The ruler of your fifth and its condition may give a clue as to how you enjoy yourself. Fifth would not
be values or views for that is second house. Fifth is children entertainment friendships and such from all I havebeen able to gather. Dating was mentioned and since we have this On-Line dating thing going on I wonder
about Catfishing and such. I watched this show a couple of times and man I felt bad for some of those who had
been Catfished.
Catfishing is when someone uses anothers picture or hides their true identity to attract someone... sad whenPosts: 5489

they meet up the reality is a far cry from the image.
http://avatars.fyre.co/a/26/9233d0317f95fd7141c1750cc154634c/50.jpg?v=1372741445
That's me in that itty bitty picture.

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EnigmeMember

Re: Fifth House« Reply #172 - on: 23.08.2013 at 14:08 [UT+1] »Quote from rasalgethi on 22.08.2013 at 14:38 [UT+1]:
Quote from Gæbryel on 19.08.2013 at 21:12 [UT+1]:
Quote from Eyesis on 19.08.2013 at 15:40 [UT+1]:
Gaebryal I too love your thoughts... personal vs collective glory. Leo is the natural 5th and loves to shine.
The more altruistic of this would be that how you shine can infect others to shine as well. It is hard forothers (11th) to stay moody or angry when you let your light shine with no expectation of glory. This is thepart of Leo people do not grasp. Leo will do things because they enjoy it.. it is their Pleasure!! no ego trip..
this is also 5th.

Posts: 5489

I agree with you emphatically, Eyesis. I admit that I once also thought of «ego» as a four-letter word (an Aquarius trait
maybe?). Sorry for talking about

A-e-5th House in such lump terms.

I have a very close friend whose

kA is conjunct F, and he has a huge ego. It is only occasionally annoying when heinsists upon monopolizing your attention span; sometimes, he'll get your attention playfully, just to have it. It's like hewants to be the sun at midnight, when I'm trying to sleep. But as I've lost anxiety about all those assumptions regardingego (arrogance, attention starvation, presumtion) I've been able to really appreciate how he constantly, lovingly works tohelp his loved ones achieve that crucial sense of specialness about themselves. He is always pointing out to others how
important they are. He is very successful and enterprising in endeavors that benefit humanity (i.e. renewable energy), andI think it is because he has such a powerful ego. I think that while

k people teach us that we are all important, eteaches us that we are each important.
Everyone should develop some sense of self-importance and destiny ("it is up to me to do this","look what I can do").
That is how the individual can make their personal contribution to the collective: through he own specialness. It is
important to be able to "be the center of the universe" (in a positive way). Feeling that things are dependent on one canfoster a very potent sense of empowered responsibility; a sense of personal glory drives us to accomplish feats that honor
ourselves and others. And isn't that the stuff of heroes?
As a person who has struggled to understandA/e/5th house matters, I've come to find that some people that feelanxiety about «ego» sometimes confuse their own difficulties with self-expression and spontaneity for humility (orprudence).
The positive

e/A/5th house person feels, out of love, that is up to her to be the champion and they shine brightly in theprocess.

Those are interesting and helpful observations Gaebryel. Yet, And isn't that the stuff of heroes? Well, yes, but rememberthat suffering is also the lot of heroes.
That is the tragedy. That pain and suffering are our lot and we cannot escape that fact or fate, only learn from it in terms of, as a 20th
century hero puts it 'CONSCIOUS suffering' for after all, when you talk of heroes and being important, that is what leads to the suffering.
Consider Achilles in the Iliad. And the list continues in the Greek Pantheon and Myths, but while I do very much agree with you and enjoy
your writing, I am also saying that, in the greater scheme of things, we are not very important at all. This is the part that is always
difficult to accept for the lesson is subtle. But the Universe is always ready to provide, so if you (when I say you here I mean someone ingeneral) will not 'do the job' or 'step up to the plate' then someone else always will. This is why I like what you say about how people cando what they can do BECAUSE they can do it, for how great is that!!

But I suppose Pisces has to say that in the end it really doesn't

matter, and if we remember that, then the fleeting moment becomes poignant and the impossible happens!

Very cool outlook regarding Heroes and the Mythology behind them. Odysseus, Theseus, Heracles all exemplify
the Leo Glory image!!
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Girt by Phoebe

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Re: Fifth House« Reply #173 - on: 23.08.2013 at 14:54 [UT+1] »I have an empty 5th house and as a fisherman's daughter, I know what to do with catfish.

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EnigmeMember

Re: Fifth House« Reply #174 - on: 23.08.2013 at 15:08 [UT+1] »Don't know bout you but Ize grapples them, slapz em around and fryz them on Fryday!!! Intercepted 5thlike a whale that house swallowed a whole sign and then some...

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EnigmeMember

Re: Fifth House« Reply #175 - on: 24.08.2013 at 15:09 [UT+1] »Quote from Lee Rutland on 22.08.2013 at 18:52 [UT+1]:
Quote from Eyesis on 22.08.2013 at 14:13 [UT+1]:
Quote from Lee Rutland on 21.08.2013 at 23:07 [UT+1]:
Eyesis, I think you have finally flipped.
What I wrote was a general statement. It did not refer to you or your chart in any way. It was a blanket
remark to introduce my theme, then on to the general definition of the 5th House.
You got a serious burr under your blanket over nothing......

Posts: 5489

No one ever became great by belittling another Lee and it is obvious that whether I overreacted or not that you lack any
kind feelings or thought about me for what ever reason.
And you never answered why you assumed I was of the Woodstock generation.
What did you mean by that?
To quote You Must Be of the Woodstock Generation...
And geez nothing worse that passive aggressive people RTT... referring to the Wet Blanket evidently you are unaware that
this person and I have gone round this circle before and this is just part of a pattern with a past...

OK, one more time.
I made a generalized statement, using the attitudes promulgated by the generation of the '60s, which made sex a casual affair. That
attitude has permeated our society.
It was, IN NO WAY, a reference to you Eyesis, or anyone else in particular for that matter.
THE POINT I WAS TRYING TO MAKE WAS......our society has lost sight of the overwhelming, life-changing bond that comes from a man
and a woman coming together, one so powerful that it can actually create a life.
I'm not belittling you, Eyesis, I'm not even talking about you, for God's Sake!
Read what I wrote, girl!!!!!

Jeeeezzzzz....

Dang ya know I would have never thought anything if you hadn't quoted me and given astrological input. There
was no need to quote me.
You must think I'm thick in the pate.. good try. Just sayin. I am thinking Joe Wilson if you remember.
And yeah same goes for others. Timing is everything.
Guess my Saturn trines and sextiles help me recognize.
And to add my progresses since Pluto rules the natal..
Don't mess with Texas. It looks like Chiron on the far end of my fifth.

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MoonMagic
Member

Re: Fifth House« Reply #176 - on: 25.08.2013 at 05:55 [UT+1] »Hi, I am still at the earlier stages of learning astrology. But this is one very fascinating topic. I am getting
deeper and deeper. I consider this a kind of hobby but I am always one to say I have no hossssssssssssbbies topeople when they ask. I just see anything I do as a hobby. I think of everything as a learning experience. I
think everything I do is important to my personal growth. Most of my planets are on the bottom half of mychart.
My fifth house is ruled by i at 20d, my F is in Taurus at 8 d in a 5 d approaching to my MC which is at 12 d
Taurus.
I have the South Node at 23 d i, then [ at 24 d, C in j at 4 d, Vertex at 17 d j m my B in j at 18 d.

Posts: 522

Creativity is a huge part of my life and has always been. I learned about painting, fashion design, then I got
into dance, did some theatre training, I always sang, but stopped for a while, and did a bit here and there for afriends band or voice over jobs, then I got tired of myself. As I had learned and spent so much money training
myself. I had no real training in music. I just said the heck with it. I am going to try. I just completed two
music videos they are on youtube. Albeit I am little older now and am trying to see if I can do it full time andhope to succeed. Being on stage is very natural for me. I was always doing that kind of stuff when I was a kid.
I Leo ac. hmmm
I think my A in i which is very close to the end of the 4th house is more like a A fifth house but there is apart of me that has always wanted my own home of which I have not been successful in securing yet in my life,
but has always been nagging at me but that must be my need for a sacred sanctuary represented by my IC in
Scorpio with my Venus conjunct with two degrees ane nd I have neptunei n scorpio that needs .me to havethat security and feeling of sanctuary.
The thing is that my Jupiter is inconjunct my sun and my sun is square my three planets in the 2nd house.
Mars/Uranus/Pluto in Virgo. I have two oppositions coming from Jupiter to my Venus and my Neptune. I
think my great kite is helping a lot though. I am much better now at getting things finished then I used to be.
I also have Jupiter rx too and that makes me feel like a really late bloomer plus having that Jupiter rulingmy5th makes me a bit like I do not care but my Cap in Mercury and Moon there really push me to be moremature.
So, A, SN, [, C, Vertex, Moon, and M there too but I do not know much about that point.

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Lee Rutland

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Re: Fifth House« Reply #177 - on: 25.08.2013 at 13:48 [UT+1] »Quote from Girt by Phoebe on 22.08.2013 at 19:38 [UT+1]:
PS: I was conceived out of wedlock....could the 5th house be where double standards pay rent?

I would have thought that the 5th was where double standards were born...the rationale for what you wanted
to do in the first place.
The rent comes due in the battleground of the 8th.....when you realize what the heck you have done........
Posts: 3301.

The 5th is that blissful moment when all seems heavenly, and nothing can go wrong.

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Girt by Phoebe
Ex Member

Re: Fifth House« Reply #178 - on: 25.08.2013 at 17:05 [UT+1] »I vote for using charts without houses!

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Lee Rutland

Member

Re: Fifth House« Reply #179 - on: 25.08.2013 at 18:08 [UT+1] »Quote from Girt by Phoebe on 25.08.2013 at 17:05 [UT+1]:
I vote for using charts without houses!

I have done that. It is quite possible. You have your horizon and meridian lines and you can get a good idea
about a person without ever dipping in to the tiny details of house position.

Posts: 3301

Actually, some clients I have we fixate on some major issues they have, and haven't gotten around to the little
details at all.

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EnigmeMember

Re: Fifth House« Reply #180 - on: 25.08.2013 at 18:21 [UT+1] »That explains a lot.
Which could lend to gross assumptions. And explains why when you have interjected
never given anything close to an accurate not a reading. Has often made me wonder of your vetacity Lee. With
all your You ares and you musts..

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Cor Leonis

Member

Re: Fifth House« Reply #181 - on: 25.08.2013 at 19:20 [UT+1] »Quote from Lee Rutland on 22.08.2013 at 19:13 [UT+1]:
Quote from Girt by Phoebe on 22.08.2013 at 16:36 [UT+1]:
I too, am curious about what is meant by the "Woodstock Generation" comment because I was 8 years old at the time andI want to know what my parents were so worried about that I couldn't even have a tie-dyed T-shirt. I would ask them
except they have both been pushing up daisies for a long time now.
My God, have I gotten that old???? I didn't even stop to think that that would require an explanation, but I see that much time has

Posts: 693

passed.
OK, for all you younger folks out there...there was a time....when I grew up....the only way one had sex was to be married to a
woman.... End of story, that was it.
Your only other recourse was to go to a prostitute, and they were not held in high regard.
Sex didn't exist outside of marriage. It didn't happen. Now, I know it did, on occasion, people wound up having sex, but women were notinclined to do it, and were not under any pressure to do so.
Then, along came rock and roll. Elvis started it, and Jerry Lee Lewis and a few others. They got us to thinking about sex, dreaming about
it and then came Woodstock. It was a music festival in New York. It changed the world. People went there for days of music and drugs
and the sexually charged atmosphere was like a bomb going off. Nothing has been the same since, and it opened a door of sexual
freedom that has totally changed society.

I was part of the cast of hired talent for a gala celebration earlier this summer in which we (the talent) were
hired to represent/portray various eras. I was cast as the 1960's.
My partner and I were a big hit at this party, about a thousand or so bankers.
When we made our entrance on-stage, after having schmoozed a bit, a big roar erupted from the crowd. It washot, and unexpected, as they did not cheer for the other decades like they did for us. (Pssst, they cheered forme and my antics)

I didn't really do anything though other than smile real big, strut, and have fun with it.
Afterwards one of the other fellas, from another decade, said he could hear the roar of the crowd erupt offstage.
I started to see how rockstars and stand-up comics and other performers can get hooked.
Something very gratifying about applause.
Anyways, the point of this story is that afterwards whilst mingling with our clientele, one senior VP, an elegant
and youthful looking lady, was chatting to us, began talking about Woodstock, which she attended and partied
hearty, apparently, (I could not believe this as she did not look old enough to me, but she said she was there)
well, she says:
Quote:
There was a lot of sex and drugs in those days

I of course, being me, had to ask her:
Quote:
Which did you enjoy more?

Her response was epic!
complete silence.

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Re: Fifth House« Reply #182 - on: 26.08.2013 at 04:59 [UT+1] »Quote from Lee Rutland on 22.08.2013 at 19:13 [UT+1]:
Quote from Girt by Phoebe on 22.08.2013 at 16:36 [UT+1]:
I too, am curious about what is meant by the "Woodstock Generation" comment because I was 8 years old at the time andI want to know what my parents were so worried about that I couldn't even have a tie-dyed T-shirt. I would ask them
except they have both been pushing up daisies for a long time now.
My God, have I gotten that old???? I didn't even stop to think that that would require an explanation, but I see that much time has
passed.
OK, for all you younger folks out there...there was a time....when I grew up....the only way one had sex was to be married to a
woman.... End of story, that was it.
Your only other recourse was to go to a prostitute, and they were not held in high regard.

Posts: 14740
Gender:Sex didn't exist outside of marriage. It didn't happen. Now, I know it did, on occasion, people wound up having sex, but women were notinclined to do it, and were not under any pressure to do so.
Then, along came rock and roll. Elvis started it, and Jerry Lee Lewis and a few others. They got us to thinking about sex, dreaming about
it and then came Woodstock. It was a music festival in New York. It changed the world. People went there for days of music and drugs
and the sexually charged atmosphere was like a bomb going off. Nothing has been the same since, and it opened a door of sexual
freedom that has totally changed society.

Wow, Lee! You are a scholar and a gentleman. Or else you have one very dry sense of humour.
I think we are roughly the same age, but yes, there was tremendous pressure under the old double-standard
before the late 1960s for girls to have sex before marriage-- in part because the guys who were not as
restrained and gentlemanly as you were seemed to feel that their male identity was tied up in bragging rights.
Not to mention the biological fact that the male sex drive peaks at something like age 17. Girls on dates incars on dark nights were under a whole lot of pressure, believe me.
You remember the old "good girls"/"nice girls/bad girls tropes.
This was also in the era when virginity before marriage was highly prized-- and girls tended to marry a lot
younger than they do today. Girls who got pregnant out of wedlock were either expected to marry promptly(including at young ages) or else to leave home to have the baby discretely somewhere else and automaticallygive it up for adoption.
Poor women of colour under different social rules did raise their out-of-wedlock babies, but it was verboten for
middle class white girls.
Woodstock was all about "free love" (you remember that, Lee!) and a lot of drugs, notably LSD.
Sex as a 5th house matter does treat it like recreation-- not like an actual relationship with actual emotional
attachments involved. That's 7th house territory.
Then children are a 5th house matter, too, regardless of the circumstances of their conception.
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Re: Fifth House« Reply #183 - on: 26.08.2013 at 14:04 [UT+1] »OhhhhhKay Sex Sport or Sport Sex as I used to call it...

ugh. Of course this trickled down to some whileothers learned from their older siblings to not take it there. My brother's escapades lead him to the doctor
several times.
He has Sag on his 5th cusp. Guess Jupiter expands more than the mind.
I would think sex without any meaning after the initial experimentation would become Robotic Impersonal and
Boring... this gives a Mercenary feel which is contrary to Leo/Sun (natural domain) and Loyalty which is a very
positive Leo trait...

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There is Duke and Albert... Both are heads but Albert has the brain and Duke just has a head and does notthink...
I kept the sex thing within the bounds of 7th and 8th with the one who could hear my heart's song and hecould hear my song.
I cannot relate to this description and therefore took offense.
That is why my description of the fifth is a bit purist.. children entertainment pleasures (not sexual necessarily)
and how we enjoy ourselves.
Sorry but some people just rub me raw... Aaargh.

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Re: Fifth House« Reply #184 - on: 26.08.2013 at 15:02 [UT+1] »Quote from Eyesis on 22.08.2013 at 22:48 [UT+1]:

I feel Saturn in fifth taught me fun was funner when the bills were paid.

I twiddled my chart and using the Meridian house system, G j is in my fifth.
I found this in my online meanderings :Quote:
One popular misconception about Uranian astrologers is that they don’t use houses. In fact, the seasoned Uranian astrologer uses six housesystems for each of the personal points. The Meridian House system is probably the most important of the six since it represents thenative’s point of you. This house system is divided along the equator rather than the ecliptic and, therefore, the houses are more or lessequal in size. The First house of the Meridian system is also known as the Equatorial Ascendant and describes how the person sees himself.
The point known as the Ascendant may actually fall in the 12th house of the Meridian house system.
The Earth Horoscope or houses of the Earth have 0 Cancer as the Tenth house or MC and 0 Libra on the First house. Therefore, a personwith Sun in Sagittarius would have the Sun in the Third house of the Earth. The Earth Horoscope represents the earth and the generality; itis how the person operates in the world.
The Ascendant is the First house of the Ascendant Horoscope. Subsequent houses occur at equal 30-degree intervals. The AscendantHoroscope represents the person’s connection to their environment and how they operate in a specific locale.
The Sun Horoscope is found by using the Sun as the Fourth house cusp. Subsequent houses occur at equal 30-degree intervals. The Sun
Horoscope represents the physical body as well as the relationship to the father.
The Moon Horoscope is found by using the Moon as the Tenth house cusp. Subsequent houses occur at equal 30-degree intervals. The Moon
Horoscope describes the emotional life of the individual as well as the Mother.
The Node Horoscope is found by using the Node as the First house cusp. Subsequent houses occur at equal 30-degree intervals. The Node
Horoscope represents the intimate or karmic connections.

swiped from http://capecodastrologer.com/articles-posts/articles/what-is-uranian-astrology/
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Re: Fifth House« Reply #185 - on: 26.08.2013 at 15:13 [UT+1] »Saturn in the fifth does not mean that pleasure and enjoyment are squashed but more like life is best enjoyedwithout worrying that the electric money was spent and the power is shut off. Mine is in Saggy so there is aninteresting balance between expansion and contraction. In Capricorn it becomes more concrete and will readmore about that placement.
Cool! I like houses because say Cg can have a basic meaning and aspect can tell if expression is easy or hard
but when I say Merc Libra Fifth then that really gives it depth, it tells me that this person finds Pleasure andEnjoyment in matters of Mercury in Libra.
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The fourth as the Sun house does not ring at all for me... I have Jup Nep and NNode there on the traditional
IC. As traditional house of our roots and of endings which transforms through the 8th and 12th I relate withthose descriptors ie Unusual home environment tendency toward nervous disorders toward the end of life if
measures are not taken.
I feel a lot of the newer astrology tends to muddle and makes it hard to define and give Individuality for we areeach very unique and if someone is doing chart analysis aka reading for someone muddling things would not beof help.
Neptune in the sixth warns of dangers through drugs, anesthesia or alcohol. In a houseless chart this would not
be indicated. So if someone comes to me asking why he is sensitive to drugs the first thing I would look for is
Neptune in the sixth house and work from there.
Maybe it will be useful for a specific task but I like what we have.. which is copious to say the least.

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Re: Fifth House« Reply #186 - on: 26.08.2013 at 15:22 [UT+1] »Self analysis is kind of daunting and I seem to do that a lot here...

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Re: Fifth House« Reply #187 - on: 26.08.2013 at 15:26 [UT+1] »Yeah, I think this forum isn't good for my sixth house.....further twiddling has thrown I in the 5th [moonhoroscope] andD in the 5th [sun horoscope]
I'm getting motion sickness.....
PS: I just remembered all the concerts, festivals and other cool things I got to enjoy for FREE when I was a
volunteer senior First Aider with St John's Ambulance [G] A nice alchemy of keeping my skills up-to-date andsaving money - stepping up to the place with taking on responsibility does have its perks. Also my dad was a
Security Guard and he would smuggle me in to things like the Royal Melbourne Show and the Melbourne Cup
for free. Saturn in the 5th works for me.
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Re: Fifth House« Reply #188 - on: 26.08.2013 at 15:47 [UT+1] »The Uranian thing would be great in the Other astrology section.

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Re: Fifth House« Reply #189 - on: 26.08.2013 at 15:52 [UT+1] »The Other astrology section is where Uranian things go to die.....anyways....hypothetical = creative = 5thhouse.

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Re: Fifth House« Reply #190 - on: 26.08.2013 at 16:20 [UT+1] »Quote from Eyesis on 26.08.2013 at 14:04 [UT+1]:
OhhhhhKay Sex Sport or Sport Sex as I used to call it...

ugh. Of course this trickled down to some while others learned from theirolder siblings to not take it there. My brother's escapades lead him to the doctor several times.

He has Sag on his 5th cusp.

Guess Jupiter expands more than the mind.
I would think sex without any meaning after the initial experimentation would become Robotic Impersonal and Boring... this gives a
Mercenary feel which is contrary to Leo/Sun (natural domain) and Loyalty which is a very positive Leo trait...
There is Duke and Albert... Both are heads but Albert has the brain and Duke just has a head and does not think...

Posts: 5489

I kept the sex thing within the bounds of 7th and 8th with the one who could hear my heart's song and he could hear my song.
I cannot relate to this description and therefore took offense.
That is why my description of the fifth is a bit purist.. children entertainment pleasures (not sexual necessarily) and how we enjoy
ourselves.
Sorry but some people just rub me raw... Aaargh.

OK Lee I do apologize but dang...^^^^^
Waybread has a writing style that I can understand very well and her view allowed me to see yours clearer.
I am of a gentler mean and transits have been kind of wonky. Whether you are a good astrologer I have no idea
as I have had no real experience except for the afore mentioned.
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Re: Fifth House« Reply #191 - on: 26.08.2013 at 22:37 [UT+1] »Eyesis, I can see where Saturn in the 5th could put a crimp on your "Girls Just Wanna Have Fun" mode, but
perhaps you do use it to advantage?
Maybe a hobby like collecting antiques or reading old books.

I just checked Rex E. Bills, and he lists Saturn as

the ruler of:
Agriculture, architecture, castles, cellars (for wine storage perhaps?) gardening, plus a lot of ailments and theherbs to cure them. The first few might suggest some tourism possibilities, the latter ones, herbalism as ahobby.
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Gender:Taken very seriously, of course!

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Re: Fifth House« Reply #192 - on: 26.08.2013 at 22:43 [UT+1] »Yes I do those things and the grape. As.I said to Phoebe there is a history there with the one.
Having Sag Saturn is pretty lighthearted actually one of the lighter positions or is this to impress??
Meowch... darn Lee you get all the girls wonky...

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Re: Fifth House« Reply #193 - on: 26.08.2013 at 23:44 [UT+1] »I am officially bored now Scotty Beam me up... Ciao.
Was replying to someone with a cool thing about her fifth house. Guess she read this dumb s*** and bailed
don't blame her. I havent been self sufficient all these years to take crap...thats Sun Pluto 2nd talkin.

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Re: Fifth House« Reply #194 - on: 27.08.2013 at 14:03 [UT+1] »Quote from Waybread on 26.08.2013 at 22:37 [UT+1]:
Eyesis, I can see where Saturn in the 5th could put a crimp on your "Girls Just Wanna Have Fun" mode, but perhaps you do use it toadvantage?
Maybe a hobby like collecting antiques or reading old books. I just checked Rex E. Bills, and he lists Saturn as the ruler of:
Agriculture, architecture, castles, cellars (for wine storage perhaps?) gardening, plus a lot of ailments and the herbs to cure them. The firstfew might suggest some tourism possibilities, the latter ones, herbalism as a hobby.
Taken very seriously, of course!

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Well consider this in the mid 70s to late 80s at least in the Mid Atlantic well I helped provide the party
favors...and many including Moi had a ball as a result of my Grateful adventures!!!
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Re: Fifth House« Reply #195 - on: 06.09.2013 at 08:00 [UT+1] »with Ge and j/k in my 5th H cusp l take fun and the rest of the 5th H matters very serious indeedlwork in creative fields and l can't find the time to party only if l am involved in it somehow (performing, etc) l
don't like playing games (expect for PlayStation/computer games) l was never into gamblingwhen I was transiting my 5thH l did loads of drugs and l lived this illusion life on all levels also on theromantic level..parties and more parties. One big illusion and deceit
it was good as it was. Glad it's over though!
back to my natal chart l do not want children although l like them but l am always treating them like adults
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Gender:somehow and l like to explain things to teach them things. l think l'm not much fun for them
When l was little l would do the same with my dolls, l'd play the teacher to themso l guess not much haschanged!
the older l get the younger my friends get, it used be the opposite. l enjoy young people now as l get older
even if l still have my older friends as well. this is my experience of my own 5th H

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