What to do to enhance private sector participation to REDD-plus
including by market approaches?

Panel Discussion

Panel Discussion: What to do to enhance private sector participation to REDD-plus including bymarket approaches?
Moderator: Osamu Hashiramoto (ITTO)
Panelists: Malgorzata Buszko-Briggs (FAO/UN-REDD)
Nyi Nyi Kyaw (Forest Department,
Ministry of Natural Resources and Environmental Conservation, Myanmar)
Tamotsu Sato (FFPRI)
Sandro Federici (IPCC)
Makoto Ehara (FFPRI)
Takahiro Morita (JICA)
Maiko Uga (Ministry of the Environment)
Sylvia Mayta (AIDER, Peru)
Aya Uraguchi (Conservation International Japan)(Hashiramoto)First, I would like to explain the intention of this panel discussion and how we will proceed.

The title and topic of this panel discussion is “What to do to enhance private sector participation to
REDD-plus including by market approaches?”

We will have an initial presentation relevant to this, after which

the speakers of the morning and afternoon sessions will come on stage.

We will then raise a number ofquestions to them and proceed with the panel discussion.
First, I would like to explain the background.

REDD+ activities are mainly being run with publicfinancing from funding by large international organizations and bilateral cooperation.

However, in order toscale up REDD+ activities, larger and sustainable activities are required.

For this, various countries andstakeholders agree that there is a need for more private sector participation.

In light of that, we would like toidentify and discuss the challenges to get private sector to participate in REDD+, and how to overcome thesechallenges.
We will begin with an initial presentation from Dr. Aya Uraguchi of Conservation International Japan.
Dr. Uraguchi, after studying ecology at the Graduate School of Environmental Earth Science at Hokkaido229

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University1, joined Mitsubishi Research Institute2 to support the formation of forest projects using carbon
credits in Japan and overseas, and to conduct research on biodiversity, etc.

Since 2010, she has in charge offorest-related projects in tropical countries for the sustainable development of nature at Conservation
International Japan.

The title of her presentation is “JCM REDD+ in Cambodia.”

Introductory Presentation
JCM REDD+ in Cambodia
Aya Uraguchi (Technical Director, Conservation International Japan)
Types of private sector participation

There are various patterns for private sector to be involved in REDD+.

With regard to REDD, there isa question of whether there will be a transfer of emission reductions (ERs) across borders.

If there is nointernational transfer, then those ERs would be applied to the NDC of the host country, but if there is aninternational transfer of ERs, then there are a number of patterns for private sector participation.

For

instance, they could help to develop a project, or they could purchase their credits from the project.

Someentities might want to join an existing project midway.
Each have their own characteristics.

If we look at the scale of funds, to launch a project, a large amountof fund is required, but the purchase of credits can be started small, even from a one-ton level.
various risks in doing a REDD project.
still being developed.

There are

The forest has to be protected and the governance mechanisms are

The risk is larger if you are involved from the initial stage of the project, but inversely,

if you are participating in a project late and just buying credits, the price of the ERs will be higher than if you
were involved in the project from the beginning.
who buy them, it will not succeed.

Without stakeholders who launch a project, as well as those

Mitsui & Co. 3 has been involved in a project with the Ministry ofEnvironment of Cambodia4, and with Conservation International to carry out a JCM REDD+ project frominitiation.

I would like to explain about this project.

https://www.global.hokudai.ac.jp/
https://www.mri.co.jp/en/
3 https://www.mitsui.com/jp/en/index.html
4 https://www.moe.gov.kh/
1
2

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What to do to enhance private sector participation to REDD-plus
including by market approaches?

Panel Discussion

Summary of the business model

There are not many private sector companies who are investing in REDD+ now.

We would like toidentify what the keys were for this kind of private sector participation in the hope that it will provide us somehints for further opportunities.
This project is being carried out in the Prey Lang Wildlife Sanctuary in Cambodia.
Phase 1 and hoping to move on to the bigger Phase 2.
of the Prey Lang Wildlife Sanctuary is the target.
providing additional philanthropic support.
Cambodian government.

We are currently in

In Phase 1, 120,000 hectares in the Stung Treng part

Mitsui has provided the initial investment and is also

In return, Mitsui will be obtaining carbon credits from the

They may also acquire additional credits, and fees for that will be used for futureconservation activities in Cambodia.

The roles of Cambodia government and Conservation International areto promote management and monitoring, and to help with livelihood development for the communities.
In Phase 2 in the future, the target area will be expanded to the entire Prey Lang Wildlife Sanctuary to anarea four times the present space, so 430,000 hectares.

Also, in Phase 2, Mitsui will acquire carbon credits

where the Cambodian government and Conservation International will continue to manage particular areas andhelp with community livelihoods.

In terms of the current status, in March 2018, an MOU was signed between the three parties.

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Implementation of protected area management including patrols, as well as livelihood development, is being
carried out on the ground.

Related to REDD, the JCM REDD+ guidelines were adopted in May 2018, with the first edition recognized
by Cambodia.

We are currently developing a methodology for this project.

Our first submission was in

April 2019, and we have revised it several times and resubmitted the methodology document.

We are hopingthat the methodology will be approved, by the latest, next month.
We are also working on a project design document (PDD) for the REDD+ project.

It is near completion.

With regard to nesting, which means harmonizing between national, sub-national, jurisdictional, andproject levels, there has been a lot of debate on harmonizing the numbers there.

The REDD+ Task Force

has issued a technical note on nesting, and it has indicated that all existing and future projects will have to benested from January 2021.
We are planning to do our first monitoring and verification exercise in early 2021.
Background and keys

Let me now explain the background and key success factors.

First, foundation.

In terms of thefoundation of this project, having a good relationship with the host government is important.
JICA expert in the forestry sector staying in Cambodia for a long time.

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There is a

Conservation International Cambodia

What to do to enhance private sector participation to REDD-plus
including by market approaches?

has also been working in Cambodia for a long time.
good relationship with them.

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We have a MOU with the government and also have a

There is also a strong interest from the stakeholders in Cambodia.

very important for the society and economy in Cambodia.

Forests are

In fact, the Cambodian government had asked

Conservation International Cambodia to help out with this effort.

We were familiar with this region.

We

got funding from the Global Environment Centre Foundation (GEC) under the Japanese Ministry ofEnvironment, and they did a feasibility study for us.

However, we were able to provide community support

with funding from another donor from 2015 for two years.

Second, partnership structure.
Conservation International Japan.

How the partnership started was in spring of 2015, Mitsui contacted
We were starting from scratch to develop a relationship with Mitsui.

was three years before we signed an agreement with Mitsui.
to develop a relationship.

2015

In order to establish a contract, we worked hardConservation International Japan and Mitsui served as contact points to coordinate

with the government of Cambodia, as well as the Conservation International headquarters.
for in-depth communication with the Cambodian government.

There was a need

Conservation International Cambodia andthe Mitsui Phnom Penh office helped to coordinate with the government of Cambodia.

There was a change

in structure of the Cambodian government in the spring of 2016, and the counterpart for this project changed
from the Forestry Agency to the Ministry of Environment.
designated as a wildlife sanctuary.

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At the same time, the Prey Lang area wasPanel Discussion
Third, methodology.

The Ministry of Environment of Cambodia and Conservation International are

working together to develop this wildlife sanctuary.
are doing follow-ups in the field.

Conservation International Cambodia and JICA experts

Importantly, there were experts of FAO and UNDP at the Ministry ofEnvironment in Cambodia who we would work with.
REDD+ projects that we coordinated with.
regions.

There are also other NGOs in Cambodia doing

We were able to understand the situation in Cambodia and otherWe were also able to get an idea of the direction for the future as we developed the project.

Japan, we worked with the Forestry Agency and the Ministry of the Environment of Japan.

WithinAlso, Mitsubishi

UFJ Research and Consulting 5 (MURC) and the Institute for Global Environmental Strategies 6 (IGES)
checked our initial draft.

Fourth, nesting.

We are grateful for their timely help.

As for the development of recommendations, I cannot explain a lot because of time,

but for nesting, UNDP hired a consultant to develop recommendations for nesting.
International and Mitsui also got consultation from that expert.

Conservation

Our project will be nested in 2021.

We aregoing to revise our methodology and PDD with the assumption of nesting.

Fifth, efforts to stop deforestation.

5
6

The most important thing is to stop deforestation.

https://www.murc.jp/english/
https://www.iges.or.jp/en234

We are doing

What to do to enhance private sector participation to REDD-plus
including by market approaches?

management of the protected areas.

We are also trying to improve the livelihood of local communities.

Furthermore, we are doing some interesting work with the communities.
other funding.

Panel Discussion

We are also working to fill gaps withWe are trying to strengthen the management framework for protected areas and also trying to

make a foundation for developing small businesses.

Sixth, regular reporting and communication.

Between Mitsui and Conservation International, there is aformal monthly exchange of reports on law enforcement.

We combine on-ground information with satellite

information in a deforestation map that is shared on a monthly basis.
finance report that is shared.

We also have a six-month activity andOther than that, we utilize e-mail and phone calls.

transparency so that we can share our problems before they become serious.

We are trying to maintain

Conservation International, theMinistry of the Environment, and Mitsui have a quarterly face-to-face meeting in Phnom Penh to confirm
progress on the project.
Important things for enabling this model to work

In order for such a model to work, there are a number of key factors.
the relevant parties in the host country.

We need good coordination withAdditionally, we also need to work with international organizations

working in the host country, as well as NGOs and other players in Cambodia.
stop deforestation, but that is easier said than done.

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Second, it is very important to

Not only NGOs, but there are other people who arePanel Discussion
serious about stopping deforestation.

We need to work with them.

We also need to work with direct

stakeholders such as the local community members, as well as local government officials.

Furthermore, weneed to work with experts in the various relevant fields such as forest management or livelihood development.

Third, REDD+ projects have high risk, so sharing of information and transparency among partners isvery important.
manner.

Issues, large and small, are occurring all the time, so we need to share these issues in a timely

Fourth, we also need flexibility in budget.

Our activities are very diverse, and at the same time, thesituation in the host country is dynamic, so things that were not expected often come up.
funding is inadequate.

Often the initial

We need to get additional funding or we might need to change the allocation of theinitial budget based on the needs.

We need an environment that provides flexibility for that.

Fifth, there isa need for real demand for credits generated.
What is needed to promote private sector participation?

Regarding key factors for encouraging private companies to participate in REDD+ projects, privatecompanies, with a small scale of funding, can buy the credits.
someone buys the credits.

REDD+ projects will not move ahead unlessIf companies have a larger amount of demand or funding, then private companies

could start a dialog with potential project partners.

I think that is very important.

There are a number of things that the government of Japan can do.

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In order to increase the demand forWhat to do to enhance private sector participation to REDD-plus
including by market approaches?

Panel Discussion

credits, perhaps we should apply for eligibility under CORSIA’s Eligible Emissions Units system.

We alsoneed to also identify the path towards meeting the nationally determined contributions using these credits.
We also need some risk reduction schemes.

For instance, it might be good idea if the government ofJapan could purchase some of the remaining JCM credits that have not been sold.

We also need to think

about compatibility with other schemes such as VCS.
There is a technical burden to support the methodology.

As with the first case, we require a lot of support

from the relevant groups, but it would be nice to facilitate the use of existing established methodologies inorder to reduce the burden of that in the next edition.
Finally, it would be good for JICA and the Japanese embassy to support coordination with host countries.
Discussion(Hashiramoto)We would like to have all the presenters today to come up on stage, and we would like to start

the panel discussion.

For this panel discussion, we have prepared three questions.

The first question is “What are theexpectations of local communities and investors to the REDD+ projects?”
are needed to promote private sector support to REDD+?”

The second question is “What

The third question is “What kind of technicalsupport is needed to promote private participation in REDD+ implementation?”

After hearing comments

and opinions from the presenters and experts on these questions, we will open the floor for further comments
and questions from the participants here today.
What are the expectations of local communities and investors to the REDD+ projects?
(Hashiramoto)

I would like to start with the first question.

and investors to the REDD+ projects?

What are the expectations of local communities

Dr. Uraguchi talked about the efforts of Japanese companies andCambodia, and Ms. Uga talked about how there are still no international rules for private companies toparticipate in REDD+.

Under this background, with what kind of interest are private companies wanting toparticipate in REDD+, including CRS and ESG investing?

First, I would like to hear Dr. Uragachi’s opinion

on this.
(Uraguchi)First, rather than having asked the communities, as an NGO, we look at the expectations of

REDD from the communities’ perspective.

The communities expect REDD to be a change of lifestyle.

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The

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forests have been destroyed in order to sustain livelihoods.
way.

We have to transform that to a less destructive

It takes a long time to change the way people live, so REDD+ should provide an environment that canallow such long-term change.
As for investors, European and American companies especially expect a very large amount of emissions
reduction in REDD+.

The feel that REDD+ can provide a good opportunity to achieve SDGs, and they

think it is a very good project.
it comes in a big scale.

The private companies also really expect it to be predictable, especially when

The private companies would like to know in advance what kind of results,

organization-wise, their investments will give, how the market will be, and also the future outcomes ofsuppressing deforestation, when they plan to join REDD+.
(Hashiramoto)

Sylvia, you provided a similar experience in the field in Peru, inviting private sector investment

and cooperation with the local community.
(Mayta)What are your views?

I agree with my friend, because local communities are looking to improve their livelihoods, as well as

food safety for their families and future.
conserving them for the future.

They conserve the forests, once they understand the importance ofAs they are now facing some environmental changes, they understand thatwith these projects, they can benefit in the long and short-term.

They are waiting to improve their livelihoods

and generate income for their families.
And for investors, we have experience with some investments.
changing in the market.

We also know that the price of carbon is

They want to show their interest in these activities to reduce the impacts of climatechange and they want to receive an income for their investment in the future.
(Hashiramoto)(Mayta)Would you briefly describe the investor’s view on the return on investment?

In our case, we give or return to the investors their investment through our carbon credits that we

produce in the project.

This is the way that we are working.

I do not know if they have another mechanismof return on investment.
What are needed to promote private sector support to REDD+?
(Hashiramoto)

I would like to move on to the second question.

support to REDD+?

What are needed to promote private sector

It is a little more specific than the previous question.

First, I would like to hear Dr.

Nyi Nyi Kyaw’s opinion on this.
(Kyaw)

Before answering the question, I just want to talk a little bit on the private sector investment in forestry

in Myanmar.

Myanmar has forests, but now some of the forest area is decreasing due to several reasons.

Formally, forests were managed at the government level, but starting from 2006, the Myanmar governmentchanged the policy.

Since 2006, the land was leased to private investors and companies who were encouraged

to have private forest plantations in Myanmar.

This was only for commercial purposes.

have timber, pulp, paper, and other forest products.

They wanted to

Nowadays, there is a lot of interest from foreign investors.

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What to do to enhance private sector participation to REDD-plus
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They would also like to have forest plantations in Myanmar.
Actually, they have to have corporate social responsibility activity.
have the forest plantations.

That is why they are now willing toSome companies are investing in the mining sector.

like to have reforestation activities in Myanmar to access carbon credits.

Some investors would also

From the government perspective,

we need to have adequate and accurate detailed information on the land use in Myanmar.
To access carbon credits, we have some experiences in implementing CDM mechanisms.
speaking, it is very difficult to even register the CDM project according to UNFCCC.
the REDD+ strategy.

Properly

We initiated to have

We then would like to have investments, especially from the private sector.

We arenow preparing a strategy for private investment in the forest plantation and reforestation measures.

We arealso thinking of zero net deforestation in Myanmar, with the target of zero net deforestation by 2030.
There are also some forest areas beyond our management.

For example, some companies want to haverubber, oil palm, and sugarcane plantations even in forested areas where we are unable to manage because they
are under the Ministry of Agriculture, Livestock and Irrigation.

That is why we are thinking of informationon land use change in Myanmar to provide to the private sector, otherwise they cannot get any carbon credits.
This is what missing in Myanmar right now.
Myanmar has also participated in the JCM process.

We have an agreement between our Ministry and theMinistry of Environment, but I am not sure if we have a clear mechanism for REDD+, especially for theprivate sector.

This is also a gap for the private sector to participate in the REDD+ strategy.

In the case of Myanmar, all land belongs to the government.

We can lease the land to the private sector

for a certain period, but REDD+ is a long-term investment.

We should also develop an administrative

procedure to lease the land for REDD+ activities.
Again, a market mechanism for REDD+ and technology transfer to the private sector are still lacking.
The local entrepreneurs have very limited knowledge on REDD+, so we need to raise awareness among theprivate sector to participate in REDD+.

We also need technical information for the private sector and market

mechanism to invest in reforestation and afforestation measures for REDD+.
(Hashiramoto)

I would like to ask the same question to Ms. Uga.

After your presentation, there was aquestion and you explained what has been done and what were some problems.

Could you also provide some

additional explanations of market approach, international benefits of mitigation, and JCM?
(Uga)

We have been discussing what the Japanese government can do to promote private sector participation.

The government should take the lead in making the rules and provide more visibility for the private sector, as
well as support the development of markets.
the Paris Agreement.

We need to do further work on the challenges of Article 6 of

We should make use of the knowledge and experience we have gained since 2013 fromhandling JCM, operating projects, and developing rules to help lead in international negotiations.
In addition, although we have JCM already in operation, in the case of REDD+, there are still bilateral
discussions ongoing for the development of the guidelines.

Together with that, we should utilize the lessons

learned from countries with ongoing projects to find ways to help countries who have not yet started.
In the past, the Ministry of the Environment supported projects in Indonesia and Laos.

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Although I

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mentioned that Laos is developing their methodology, with the support of JICA, they are in the process ofapplying for results-based payments of the Global Climate Fund.
they already have an ongoing project for JCM.

While Laos is heading in that direction,

We have discussions underway with the Laos government on

how to implement nesting with Laos, and various numbers have been shared.
Their methodology has been developed in Laos.
Climate Fund for that.

JICA is applying for result-based payment of the Global

Laos is heading in that direction.

We already have an existing JCM project.

We arethinking how to nest that within Laos.

Various numbers are being shared and discussion is underway with theLaos government for achieving nesting.

Under REDD+, while this may be called a pioneering initiative, wewill be facing many new challenges.

With the development of various rules along the way, we hope they will

become applicable to other countries in the future.
Also, as Dr. Uraguchi mentioned, there is a need for a market.

JCM, propounded by Japan, originally

started with the goal of reducing 50-100 million tons of emissions by 2030 through government funding, but
the Paris Agreement’s goal is much higher.

Government alone cannot achieve the target.

remains limited to governments, the ultimate goal of the Paris Agreement will fall short.

If the use of JCM

The Paris Agreement

will come into effect with this in mind, so governments need to think of how to obtain more private sector
funds.

We need to seriously buckle down and work on that.

(Hashiramoto)You introduced CORSIA a few moments ago.

of such a mechanism?

What is the background for the development

How does it relate to the discussions on market mechanisms?

significance of that activity?

What is the

From the perspective of other businesses, what is the outlook?

If you have

any information, could you explain to us?
(Uga)

Regarding CORSIA, civil aircrafts are emitting a lot of greenhouse gases by flying between countries,

but this is currently not covered in the UNFCCC.

In this regard, CORSIA was developed the civil aviation

sector to deal with the emissions, which are projected to only increase.
(Hashiramoto)Dr. Ehara, could you respond to this question?

(Ehara)From a research institute perspective, as for what are needed for private sector support, I have threepoints.

First, we need to think about the ultimate goal of REDD+ as achieving the 2°C goal, while protecting

the environment.

It does not matter how much private sector support is gained for REDD+ or how much

we protect the forests, if we do not achieve the global reduction of greenhouse gases, then there is no purpose.
We need to continually make sure REDD+ is contributing to the global emissions reduction target.

Checkingthat is important.
The second, we need not only public financing, but also financing from the private sector.

We lack a clear

mechanism for REDD+ that includes keywords that have come up such as predictability, rulemaking, and JCM.
Those are what we need.

For that, if we think about having a net-positive impact on the environment, we

also need nesting as well.

If we do nesting and the private sector also participates, it is important to understandthe different socioeconomic backgrounds of each project because each project may have different risks.

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If

What to do to enhance private sector participation to REDD-plus
including by market approaches?

the type of forest varies, then the ease of access may also vary.
and planted forests are different.

Panel Discussion

For example, the backgrounds of plantations

To properly understand the contributions to mitigation, there needs to be a

way to evaluate and prove that there has been a real contribution to mitigation taking into account differing
deforestation and forest degradation risks.

After the allocation of reference emission levels, they should beallocated again following actual results, but to do so, the rules for allocation should be determined in advancein a way that satisfies everyone.

If that is done, I think it will be easier for businesses to participate.

Finally, regarding another research, I have the experience, three years ago, of conducting a questionnaire
survey to a section of listed companies asking the question, “What are the challenges for Japanese privatecompanies to participate in REDD+ activities?”
companies.

We found three different types of Japanese private

The first were businesses interested in REDD+ for the credits, or the goal of profits.

second were businesses interested in REDD+ not necessarily for profits, but for CSR reasons.
a combination of the two.

The

The third was

They were companies interested in REDD+ initially for CSR reasons, and once

the uncertainties with the mechanism became clear, would covert to credits for an actual source of profit.
Those are the different types of motivations and views on REDD+ that companies have.

We have tounderstand that and effectively incorporate companies into REDD+ and forest conservation activities,
whatever their objectives or aims may be.
What kind of technical support is needed to promote private participation in REDD+
implementation?
(Hashiramoto)

I would like to move on to the third question.

promote private participation in REDD+ implementation?

What kind of technical support is needed toThis is more of a technical topic.

First of all,Dr. Sandro Federici, you have already talked about the methodology of national inventories and reporting, but
because this question is very relevant, I would like to hear your view.
(Federici)

It might seem like I am sponsoring my work, but it should be taken as supporting the way that

REDD+ activity shall be reported using the IPCC guidelines.

By doing so, the use of IPCC methodologies

for reporting on REDD+ activities make them automatically compatible with and able to be integrated in anational greenhouse gas inventory.
together in a national system.

These allow having various project activities in the country, integrated all, Furthermore, the use of the IPCC guidelines and the integration intogreenhouse gas inventories makes the results of REDD+ activities also comparable with other sectors.

This

allows the fungibility with other sectors which is a fundamental characteristic for offsetting.
The main challenge for such is probably in the definition of the baseline.

However, as the baseline is justa historical value, there is no any obstacle since the greenhouse gas inventories are a time series of annual
estimates of current emissions and removals as well as of past emissions and removals, the trend in net GHG
fluxes does automatically show the result of the REDD+ activities in terms of mitigation, if any.
Unfortunately, there is not much knowledge, especially in the private sector, about the role of national
greenhouse gas inventories in the Paris Agreement.

Awarness should be built because it would make easier

the monitoring and reporting of REDD+ activities and more trustable the results achieved, in the end.

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Indeed, one of the main aspects is the credibility, trusting what each project reports and what the private sector
is finally buying.

As a national system covers the entire country, integration into a national system addresses

permanence, since greenhouse gas inventories are going to be produced very likely till the next century, whichis the timeframe according to which permanence should be assessed.

Indeed, if we do not win the climatechange challenge in this century, we will have other problems than permanence to deal with in the next century.
In the end, it addresses permanence, as well as leakages and displaced emissions because everything is reported
within a national GHG inventory.
On the other hand, such integration into the national GHG inventory implies that the liability of future
reversal, of results achieved, moves from the project to the country, and the country shall be aware of that.
On the other hand, the country benefits from the project implementation because of producing revenues,
technology development, social development, and other environmental benefits.

The country will get all ofthese benefits, but it will be liable to keep dealing with these activities for the future when the project ends.
Finally, the integration within the national GHG inventory addresses also the famous double accounting
problem.

Since, everything included within the inventory is counted only once; although achieved mitigation

can easily then be disaggregated among various projects.
In conclusion, the national inventory report of the national greenhouse gas inventory is a framework thateasily addresses all technical challenges for REDD+ reporting.

Of course, the integration of REDD+

activities within the national GHG inventory requires a solid agreement between the hosting country and the
projects developers.
(Hashiramoto)I think we could understand the need for capacity building in many places.

I would like to ask the same question to Mr. Morita of JICA.
breadth of JICA’s activities.

In JICA, there are many REDD+ projects, as well as developments in technicalresearch and capacity building.
(Takahiro Morita)

In your presentation, you introduced theBased on that experience, I would like to hear your view.

As Mr. Hashiramoto pointed out, the fact that implementing countries have varying

situations needs to be taken into account.

Contrarily, as Dr. Federici talked about, UNFCCC imposes universal

requirements, and the pathway to reach there has varying degrees of gaps depending on each developing
country. Of course, the goals we should achieve are universal, but because implementing countries have various
needs, we need to be flexible in our responses.

I think that will be the challenge.

On the other hand, on the part of private sector participants, I think Dr. Uraguchi’s presentation summed
it up quite well.

Depending on whether the REDD+ business is being implemented for profit or for credits,

the necessary technical level will be completely different.

Furthermore, as Dr. Sato of FFPRI said, consideringthat the private sector participants have varying levels of technical capabilities, high level results can beproduced with time and money, but the cost would be extremely high.
between target goals, inputs and effects.

We need to hit the right balance in

I think the support for enterprises and private sector participants

will be designed based on that.
On the contrary, if a single company were to have such a big accounting system and monitoring of
information, it would be quite costly to the company and carry several risks.

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In that case, I think it would beWhat to do to enhance private sector participation to REDD-plus
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Panel Discussion

it would be good to have some sort of knowledge sharing for the technical support to hedge costs and risks.
Finally, from the perspective of strengthening technical initiatives, I think it is important to have politicalcommitments to support the technical developments.

As Dr. Nyi Nyi Kyaw introduced, zero-net

deforestation in Myanmar has targets that are clearly set for investors and supporters to easily understand.

We

tend to think that deforestation has risks, but Myanmar was successful in presenting and transparent andeffective framework.

The Myanmar government clearly set their policy.

I think the approach in Myanmar isa good practice because technology works based on policy commitment.
(Hashiramoto)

Lastly, I would like to ask Dr. Sato of FFPRI.

You broadly talked about the significance ofmonitoring, but because you have been engaged with research and private sector companies related to REDD+,
could you give us your views on technical aspects from a broader perspective?
(Sato)As presented by Dr. Uraguchi and Sylvia, the improvement of livelihoods of local communities or the

positive change of local people are important, but at the same time, as I presented, it is important to haveparticipation of the local community in projects such as carbon monitoring.

I am not sure if it could be called

technical support, but I think translating capabilities could help to communicate the methodologies that wehave developed to the local people and communities.

By having a translation process, the local people canbetter understand the need and benefit of conserving forests and also improve their livelihoods, as well as froma forest carbon monitoring perspective, make long-term monitoring possible.

Measuring techniques are being

updated and evolving every day, and with the same cost, we will eventually be able to enjoy more accurate
information.

However, this requires long-term monitoring, so we need the cooperation of the local

community to support that.

What I want to say is that we need to have the additional step of translating

technologies into simple words.
Another thing is, as Sylvia mentioned in her presentation, within a single community, there may be multiple
forest areas and landscape designs.

For example, a forest can have many functions such as carbon fixationand the conservation of biodiversity, but also importantly lumber production.

You may have different values

in depending on the forest and the forest’s role, so I think you need to have a specific plan for each forest.

If

possible, it would be nice to propose a scenario that fits the specific local community and provide them multiple
choices, which may motivate them to participate in discussions as well.
Having multiple suggestions such as technological translation and landscape design scenarios, will allow
the communities to help in their own way.
(Hashiramoto)We have asked all the questions to everyone.

Through hearing everyone’s opinions andpresentations, one point that I think is important is the technical aspect, and the rulemaking and capacity
building for that.

Another point is that, while we still do not have clearly defined international rules yet,companies are investing for CSR and ESG investing reasons.

In addition, other than a focus on CO2

measurement, there has been an emphasis on community livelihood, markets for produced goods, andbiodiversity conservation as well.

By including a range of aspects, including those pertaining to SDGs,

investment can be made more compelling for investors.

243

I think that is important.

Panel Discussion

Q/A(Hashiramoto)We still have time, so if there is anybody from the private sector in the audience who isinterested in REDD+, we would like to seek your opinion.
as a company.

You do not necessarily have to belong to a private sector organization, but we would like tounderstand your perspective and issues.
(Q1)

It would be nice if you could share your interest

Is there anyone?

Thank you for a very interesting discussion.

I will not tell you the name of my company, but I work

for a company in Japan involved in petroleum development.

As you know, petroleum and gas developing

companies are interested in carbon offsets based on REDD+ in order to achieve corporate emissions reduction
targets.

For instance, an Italian oil company is planning to offset 20 million tons a year by 2030, or a French

oil company is aiming to offset five million tons a year by 2030.

They have been declaring these goals bybasically supporting REDD+ projects or other projects that apply the concept of REDD+.

Following their

example, we are aiming to offset one million tons.
As Dr. Uraguchi presented, we are in a position to purchase credits from existing projects, as well asinterested in joining projects.

We need to think of both of these types of participation.

involvement leads to larger costs.

Moreover, project

We are thinking of 2030 as a target year, as the Italian and French companies

mentioned earlier have announced very aggressive reduction targets for 2030, but we are just starting to buildfrom now, so we will probably not be able to reach that.

Mitsui & Co. began in 2015 and have made good

progress, but the actual credits will not be available until next year or the year after that.

We are taking both

approaches, but for the time being, we need to look for projects that have a fixed amount.
Furthermore, we understand VCS will be used for REDD+, but once the compliance regulations of theParis Agreement are established, we are wondering how the transition will work out.

Due to that, we havethought about buying credits from existing projects for the time being, and leaving if necessary.
Certain companies have declared that they need to offset one million tons through REDD+ by 2030.

Inthat context, should such a company start buying existing credits, set a fixed amount to buy, or begin their own
project?
(Q2)

I would like to hear everyone’s suggestions for a balanced solution.

I am from Daikin Industries in Osaka.

reduce greenhouse gas emissions.

We make air conditioners, so we think it is our obligation to

We have projects for the promotion of energy-efficient products, and wehave also been working in forest conservation with Conservation International since 2008 as a contribution tosociety.

We have done projects in seven places around the world over the last 10 years, and currently have an

ongoing project.
There was a discussion about what level of quality is needed.

Our company is contributing to society

mainly through CSR, so to be honest, we do not want to have too much risk.

We have donated about 500

million yen over 10 years, so we want to be able to show our commitment and results.

We are wondering how

to do that, so if REDD can demonstrate a positive impact, we would be interested in participating in REDD+
projects.

That is why we are closely watching the scene.

244What to do to enhance private sector participation to REDD-plus
including by market approaches?

(Q3)

Panel Discussion

I used to work at Nippon Steel, and have done work in technical development.

company that makes iron and burns about 100 million tons of coal every year.
but it is a big environmental problem to everyone.
emissions from agriculture and other areas.

Nippon Steel is a

That is the natural situation,

Looking at our history, there has been an increase in CO2

It was a concentration of 180 ppm of CO2 before the Ice Age,but since agriculture started, it increased to 280 ppm.

We are currently up to 440 ppm.

rising and more and more typhoons are coming.

Looking at Chiba Prefecture this year, if the CO2

concentration increases any more, it will be impossible for people to survive.

Temperatures are

Therefore, I think reducing CO2

needs to be a common goal of humanity, and each and every country needs to look beyond their own interestsof each country and work together.
not stop their forest fires?

Why does Brazil continue to cut down its forests?

Why does Australia

It is probably because there are people living in those place.

How can we stop

the cutting down of forests?

We need to think about that, not to mention President Trump who says thatthose efforts are not necessary or that climate change is a lie.
such behavior.

We need to change our attitude and not allow

We need a consensus with not just the private sector and companies, but with all parties.

I

have a request to the government, specifically the Ministry of Economy, Trade and Industry (METI), theMinistry of the Environment, and the Ministry of Agriculture, Forestry and Fisheries (MAFF).

You haveyour own ministry-specific goals, but you really need to have a comprehensive approach for developing amechanism.

If you do that, then regardless of sector or background, we will be willing to participate andcooperate.
In addition, I would like you to really appreciate what has been done.
recognize the reforestation that Japan has done.
about 20% of coal use.
(Hashiramoto)2030.

I would like you to properly

The reason for that is that all that reforestation amounts toI think that contribution should be acknowledged.

There was a very ambitious goal expressed by a company of offsetting one million tons by

Are there any suggestions from the panelists?

It may be challenging, but what do you think, Dr.

Uraguchi?
(Uraguchi)

To the person who posed that question, I would love to talk to you after the conference.

are very right that it does take time.

As for how much time, it depends on the case.

You

In the case of Cambodia,

they recently had a change of government, so I think they took more time than initially expected.
At the same time, I want to point out two things.
UNFCCC.

First, the word nesting is going to be integrated into the

In order to gain approval from the UNFCCC, it is going to be very important to achieve

integration or nesting.

We have to be aware of that for the development of projects.

Second, we say “project level.”

For example, if you look at the number of REDD developments in an

area, the number of cases of development in recent years is very small.

It is not just REDD, but there isgoing to be more demand for emissions reductions, so we will need much more project development.
Those were my two points, but I also think not just being involved in one project, but having a portfolio
and multiple projects may be beneficial.

That is what I feel.

245

I would like to exchange information later.

Panel Discussion(Takahiro Morita)

For me and JICA, it really encourages me to hear such statements.

Throughout the day,there have been a lot of discussions, but we have to take immediate action in this particular area.
there is a great demand for funds.

However,

Whether it is CSR or credit, we are ultimately heading in the same direction

to achieve the same goal, so I would really like to see JICA, as a public entity, play a facilitative role.

I hope toexchange opinions after this seminar.
(Hashiramoto)Regarding the comments made by the third person, there is an individual from the Ministryof the Environment here today at this meeting, as well as representatives of JICA, so I think they are mindful
about what you have stated about acknowledging the reforestation efforts in Japan.
I would like to hear Dr. Federici’s suggestion for the first question.
(Federici)

The Japanese National Greenhouse Gas Inventory Report includes emissions and removals

associated with the forest plantations.

Thus, Japan is taking all benefits of all CO2 removal that these forest

plantations are achieving, because if you look at the national greenhouse gas inventory, in the end, you have a
total net emission which is the sum of all the emissions minus the removals that all forests including these
forest plantations have.
(Hashiramoto)

Nothing is lost.

That is very interesting.

We are past our allocated time, so I would like to ask Dr. Buszko-

Briggs to provide a wrap-up of the discussions, and then I would like to conclude this panel discussion.
(Buszko-Briggs)

Thank you for this very interesting and encouraging discussion, as well as the encouraging

statements from the floor.

I will try to wrap up this very broad discussion on a number of topics related to

REDD+ from local community expectations, the private sector, technical aspects, the role of the government
and policies, as well as our overall role as an obligation to humanity.
On the expectations of local communities and investors, let me wrap up by pointing out four issues thatwere expressed by the panel.

What is needed?

We need long-term involvement and commitment.

REDD+ projects usually require a long-term perspective.
issues highlighted by several speakers.

The impacts on livelihoods and food security wereWe can put these on the top of our list.

From the investor side,

assessing risks before involvement and the choice of risk strategies was another key issue.
On the enhancement of private sector participation in supporting REDD+ projects, I will make a coupleof points.

I want to thank the Director General from Myanmar for presenting a very interesting case fromnational experience.

What you really highlighted mostly was adequate information on land use and the needfor land use planning tools, methodologies, and integrated land use planning that can actually facilitate
government involvement in discussions with the private sector on allocation of different lease agreements andother involvements.
There was an issue highlighted that was related to technology transfer, as well as the building up of
knowledge on REDD+ of local entrepreneurs.

Some speakers pointed out the government role in taking thelead, making roles, and providing more visibility to the private sector which is a very important part, in addition
to the development of knowhow from existing JCM projects and the sharing of lessons learned with other246

What to do to enhance private sector participation to REDD-plus
including by market approaches?

similar mechanisms and the overall REDD+ community.
nesting or integrated approach.

Panel Discussion

There has also been an interesting discussion about

There is probably enough substance to have a separate discussion on thatissue, but certainly credibility was also a part of the specific requirement under the technical aspects that werehighlighted.
On the third question, there are four points to highlight.
Sandro, which is that baselines are still challenging.
in the room agrees on that.

I will start with the first one, pointed out by

We need to have credible baselines.

I think everybody

The lack of knowledge by the private sector on national greenhouse gas

inventories was also pointed out.

By building this knowledge, we can build more trust, which can thenfacilitate further collaboration and integration of international systems to facilitate in addressing permanence,
displacement of emissions, leakages, and double accounting.
A few other issues were pointed out by previous speakers and which were policy improvement andcommitment to support further technical discussion on technical aspects of REDD+, as well as the very
important point of translating complex technical ideas into simple words.

With this, I will end my wrap-up.

Thank you very much.
(Hashiramoto)With this, I would like to conclude the panel discussion.

round of applause to all the panelists.

247

Once again, please give a warm