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We cant bargain like that, we do what we think is right on each individual article. Each decision needs to be made on the merits of each individual argument. I dont know what I think about ""tactical victory"" yet, Id like to see some sources that come closer to saying that. I am wary of calling this simply a military confrontation; I am not opposed to something saying that in the military confrontations that took place during the intifada Israel was successful militarily. How that translates to giving a ""victory"" in the intifada as a whole I dont quite accept. Lets get the sources worked out and go from there. Ill look for sources myself, you do the same, but in the meantime I have problems with the sources currently cited. Do you dispute my notes for those sources? If not, would you remove them? nableezy - "