# Transcribed Interview of Angela McCallum, (December 8, 2021)/2:26pm

Layout 2
​[2:26 p.m.]
    BY
Q All right. We're going ta go back on the record.
I just have a couple of questions for you, Ms. McCallum, about the kind of back and forth that we had before our lunch break, and then my colleague, will talk to you about a few more documents, and then we hope to be able to wrap up, send you back on your way.
So just to recall our discussion earlier, you were telling us about a project that you were given, assignment that you were given while you were working for the Trump campaign which involved making phone calls to State or local officials in certain States during the time period after November 3rd. Is that right?
A Yes.
Q Okay. And I think the States that you identified for us where you made calls, either you or one of your colleagues that was working alongside you on this project, were Michigan, Georgia, Arizona, Nevada, and Pennsylvania, some combination of those States. Is that right?
A Yes, some combination.
Q Okay. Great.
And, Ms. McCallum, is it accurate to say that those States that we just identified at the time that you were making these calls, which you've told us was in the very end of November or early December, that those were States that were being contested by the Trump campaign?
A I'll preface it by saying, you know, I'm not a spokesman for the campaign. I'd like to reiterate, I was not involved in any conversations of strategy or, you know, ​plans that the Trump campaign was making. But l assume that would be an accurate representation, but I don't believe that I am, you know, the full—the correct person to ask.
Q Understood. But as far as the context of the calls that you were being asked to make, did you understand at the time that the reason why these States were selected for calls was because the Trump campaign was contesting the election in those States?
A Can you repeat the question?
Q Sure. Not asking you to speak, you know, as to any legal strategy of the campaign or anything, but for the context of the assignment that you were given to make calls into these specific States at the time that you were given it, did you understand that the context was because the outcome of the election was being contested by the Trump campaign in those States?
A Yes, I believe that would be accurate to say that.
Q Okay. Did you make calls into any other States other than the ones that we've discussed that were sort of in your earlier responsibilities considered battleground States? One example might be Florida.
A Not to my knowledge.
Q Okay. And do you have any—did you have any understanding at the time as to—actually, let me rephrase.
Would you agree that the reason why you were not asked to make calls into a formal battleground State like Florida at the end of November or early December is because the Trump campaign was not contesting the outcome in that State?
A I believe that to be the case, but if you want a more clear answer, I would recommend asking whoever gave me the job assignment.
​Q Okay. I think that's it.
Before we go back into the documents, I'd pause.
Ms. Lofgren, do you have any questions?
Ms. Lofgren. No, I'm fine. Thank you.
Okay. Okay. Great.
    BY
Q Great.
Ms. McCallum, I'm going to turn to the document behind tab 19. It's a pretty lengthy spreadsheet that you produced to us with the Bates 1528.
A Uh-huh.
Q Do you see that? And you can take some time to look at it. I'm not going to ask you about all the specifics, but if you want to just look through it and refresh your recollection as to the document.
And I'll say that this was how it was produced, unfortunately, to us. It was in a PDF format, so that's why it's hard to follow, which is also why we're not going to get too specific, because it is hard to follow where certain rows fall in connection with others.
A I'm just taking a moment to review. Sorry.
Q No, that's fine. Absolutely. Take the time that you need.
(Pause.)
A Okay.
Q So my first question is, we've been talking about what seemed to be like a spreadsheet that listed different elected officials and you had assignments and you would call the elected officials you were assigned to.
Is this the spreadsheet that you were referring to or some version of the spreadsheet that you were referring to earlier in your testimony?
​A Yes, this is.
Q Okay. And can you tell us, how did you use this spreadsheet?
A I mean, you can see on there there's, you know—it's obviously redacted, but contact information and the name of the senator or representative. And then, you know, you can see where it says caller. And then, you know, you can see in there VM for voicemail, notes, things like that.
Q And caller, is that who is assigned to call the elected official?
A Correct.
Q On the first page, so it's Bates 1528—
AA Yeah.
Q —there are six States. So it's Arizona, Georgia, Michigan, Nevada, Pennsylvania, and Wisconsin. I don't think we had mentioned Wisconsin before. Do you recall that Wisconsin was part of the States that you and your other colleagues were calling legislators in?
A I don't have any memory of calling anyone in Wisconsin. Maybe there were calls. | mean, this was over a year ago, so I don't remember much.
And about this first—this first page, the 1—the 1528, this very first page in here, I don't remember ever using this page. You know, like I mentioned earlier, it wasn't like one person was assigned to a certain State. You know, I'm not sure really who or why this was made. Maybe this was an idea and then it just wasn't followed up on.
I just want to be clear, you know, it's not like—like this list that I was the State point of contact and it says Georgia beside it, and I just want to be clear that that's really not the case—
Q No, thank you.
A —of how things played out.
​Q I appreciate that. And I was going to ask what State point of contact meant. So you're saying that even though it says State point of contact, and for you, for example, on this document it says you're for Georgia, in reality it didn't really play out that way and you all were helping out each other in the different States.
A Right, and it really didn't play out that way. Also, because we talked about earlier, you know, we were all making calls into one State at one given time. You know, it wasn't like we were splitting up and doing it like that, so—
Q That makes sense.
And when it says—and you might not know this since you're not familiar with the first page, but it says State, I think, point of contact. Do you know what that refers to?
A I think those are names of people who were working in the States at that time. I'm not—not entirely sure, you know, what their involvement was there. Like I said, we didn't use this first page at all, so—
Q For, like, Georgia, which—where it says you're the point of contact, understanding your testimony that that's—you know, you all were helping each other out, do you recall a Cooper at all being involved from the Trump campaign in Georgia?
A The name Cooper doesn't ring a bell to me, no.
Q For Michigan, there's a Shawn Flynn. Do you recognize that name?
A Yes. Shawn also was a contractor for the National Republican Senatorial Committee, so I met Shawn when I was in Georgia.
Q Okay. And—
A And I believe he was the State director for election day operations in Michigan. I can't confirm that for Jesse or Jefferson though. I don't know who they are.
Q And for Shawn Flynn, when you said he's the State director for election day ​operations, that's for the Trump campaign?
A For the Trump campaign for the State of Michigan.
Q And you're not sure who Jesse Law or Jefferson Thompson—Thomas, excuse me—are?
A No, I don't know who Jesse Law or Jefferson Thomas are.
Q For Pennsylvania there's a blank. Do you have any idea why that would be blank?
A No. I mean, I'd like to go back and say that this wasn't a spreadsheet that was ever used, so I don't know what's on here.
Q Understood. And do you recall while you were making the phone calls, is this the spreadsheet or some version of it that you were making your notes on that we discussed earlier after you were able to make contact or maybe left a voicemail with an elected official?
A To the best of my knowledge, yes. You know, I don't—yes.
Q And when you made these calls, and understanding it was a lot and it's been a long time, do you recall any of the elected officials that you called asking for, for example, evidence of alleged election fraud or voter fraud?
A Can you repeat the question?
Q Yes. When you were making the phone calls to the elected officials in at least five of the States, because you don't recall Wisconsin, do you recall any of the elected officials that you were able to actually talk to ask you for further evidence or further information about alleged election fraud that was taking place in their respective State?
A I don't remember any, you know, specific calls, you know, no one representative or senator comes to mind.
​To answer your question generally, yes, and like I told you, I didn't have any background that I was given with the script, and I wasn't, you know, prepped to answer questions like that. So I would just take note of it and move on.
Q And take note in the spreadsheet and then someone else would deal with it, presumably a superior, like maybe Michael Brown?
A Maybe. I don't know if anyone ever followed up on any of those.
Q Okay. Thankyou. Let's —I want you to turn to tab 10 and the document behind that. It's two pages, beginning with Bates, I think it's 606. You can take some time to review the communication.
(Pause.)
A Okay.
Q So my first question is, do you recognize what or do you recall what application you made this—you had this communication with?
A Google Voice.
Q Okay. And do you recall this specific communication that we're looking at in tab 10?
A Specifically, no, I don't really have a lot of memory of it.
Q So my question was, it seems to me, and you can tell me if you remember this or not, that you might have called this individual and they couldn't talk so they just texted you right back.
A Uh-huh.
Q Does that seem accurate?
A Yeah, that seems accurate. From reading this, that's also what I would assume happened.
Q And after reviewing the document, based on the context, do you believe this ​concerns the State of Georgia?
A Yes.
Q Now, just look at—
A Just because it says Georgia voters.
Q So if you look at your response, and you can look, I think, page two—or, excuse me, Bates 807, has your full text. "Absolutely. Thank you so much for standing up for Georgia voters!"
A Yes, so I would assume that it is about Georgia.
Q So in that text message, you say, "Please look out for further contact from the campaign or Senate/House leadership on how to help correct this attempted fraud."
So my question is, do you recall what you were referring to when you said "this attempted fraud"?
A That's the same language that's used in the script, so I would direct you back to my answer on that.
Q So what you recall is you were just using language that had been provided to you in the script for, say, the State of Georgia.
A Correct.
Q Okay. And do you recall if you ever followed up—and I believe if you look to the first page, which is Bates 606, it's Senator Summers. Do you recall if you ever talked on the phone with Ms.—with Senator Summers?
A I don't recall, no.
Q Okay. Do you recall if you had any further communications outside of the communications that we're looking at here?
A No, I don't recall.
Q Okay. Go to tab 12. The first page is Bates 597, which is what I was going ​to ask youabout. You can take a look—take a chance to review.
A Yeah, I have reviewed.
Q Okay. So is this the part of the text chain that you said that it was a random person texting you and you couldn't recall—
A Yeah.
Q —or you didn't know who they were?
A This looks like the same—same exact text chain where—that we talked about earlier. And, you know, I'd like to repeat, I don't know who sent me these and so—
Q So—
A Anything on this page, I've never seen, so—
Q Okay. So this first message, "Well done!", exclamation point, from , that phone number, you don't know who that is?
A No idea who that is.
Q And that link that's provided, it looks like it's a LinkedIn post. Do you recall clicking that link to review what was in that post?
A No, I don't think I would've clicked on any of these links.
Q Do you even remember this text chain?
A When I was doing my document review, you know, I obviously found them and O remembered, "Oh, someone sent me, you know, seven messages in 1 week with links." And, you know, beyond that, I don't have any memory of it.
Q So you're not sure why you received the text as part of this chain of "well done"?
A No, I have no idea. No one—I–I don't know. As you can see, I did not respond to any messages that were ever sent in this chain.
​Q Got it. Let's—if you could turn to tab 13, it's one communication, Bates 1514/
A Okay. I've reviewed.
Q So if you look at the first message, it’s from Michael Brawn. He says, "Alright. This is now the EDO Michigan team. It's Tulip + Flynn." And the date he sent this, I believe, is December 1st, 2020.
Is that accurate based off of what you're looking at?
A Yes.
Q Okay. Do you know what EDO Michigan team or the EDO Michigan team refers to?
A I believe that just refers to, you know, the group of people I had said making calls, Kerrick, Chelsea, Madison, myself, and directed by Michael Brown, plus Shawn Flynn.
Q And do you know—and EDO, just for clarity on the record, is that election day operations?
A Correct.
Q Do you know why he was calling it election day operations if it was December 1st when he sent the message?
A No.
Q And do you know who Tulip is?
A Tulip is the name of the street that the office in Philadelphia was on, so—
Q In the Trump campaign office in Philly?
A You know, I'm not sure whose name was actually on the lease at the building, but that's where, you know, like I mentioned James Fitzpatrick earlier, the State director, that was his office space that he was working out of, would assume that the ​Trump campaign's name was on the lease.
Q So it's not—Tulip does not refer to any specific person?
A No. It refers to a place, which I guess he's referring to all of us as Team Tulip.
Q Okay. And Flynn, you said, is Steve Flynn?
A Shawn.
Q Or, excuse me, Shawn Flynn. And what was—how did he help with your effort in terms of calling elected officials?
A He was the State director for election day operations in Michigan. So, you know, I guess he was looped in on what we were doing. I don't have any specific memory of how this call went with Flynn or what Flynn said on this call, so—
Q De you recall if Mr. Flynn, Mr. Shawn Flynn, was involved with any of the other States in the outreach that you and others did to elected officials there or just in Michigan?
A I think that's a question you'd have to ask Shawn. I believe it was just Michigan. He wasn't looped in on, you know, any other States that we were making these calls in, to my knowledge.
Q Was Mr. Flynn ever at, like, the meetings that you all had in Philly?
A Shawn—I did not see Shawn Flynn in person until we were fully working on the Senate runoffs in Georgia. That was the first time I had met him in person.
Q And about when was that, when you were fully working on the Senate runoffs in Georgia, if you have an approximate date?
A Yeah. So like I said, our contract officially—well, my contract, and I would assume Shawn's contract also, started on the 1st of December. But we arrived in Atlanta, Georgia, I would say, sometime between the 7th of December and the 9th or ​10th of December, very early that month, so—
Q And is this chain kind of an example of, you know, Mike Brown saying, "Here's the team, this is our assignment, and we're going to, you know, meet up and then call elected officials"? Is this kind of an example of that?
A Yeah, this would be an example of us texting about, you know, one of the meetings that we've discussed previously.
Q And "we" meaning us today?
A "We" as in, yes, us in this room.
Q Okay. Great.
Let's go to tab 17. And this is a lengthier communication, so please take your time to review it. And this is Bates 1501 is the first page.
A There's a lot of these.
(Pause.)
Okay.
Q So my first question relates to this first message from Mr. Brown. It's sent November 30th, 2020. So his message is, "Good morning. We are going to call State leadership across the country later today. We may set up in the Union League or in my room, but we are going to win this thing. We are going to explain the process for legislative redress and tell them how to send representatives to th"—and he forgot the "e"—"electoral college. They've heard from lawyers who failed to explain it. So we will. And we will convince them. There's no team I'd trust more to do this. Touch base at 10 a.m. Be ready to deliver."
So my question is, he says, "They've heard from lawyers who failed to explain it." Do you know what he's referring to in that sentence?
A No.
​Q Okay. Did he ever talk about lawyers who weren't making arguments that they should be or not in a way that he felt was effective?
A No, I have no knowledge of that.
Q Did he ever say how you all could deliver any sart of message in a more effective way than lawyers?
A No.
Q So it sounds like you don't really know what he's referring to here with "lawyers who failed to explain it."
A No. I mean, as you can see, I also never responded to these messages, so—
Q And a little bit further down, so Madi, Madison Crawley responds, "Copy."
And then Michael Brown responds, "We're gonna be lobbyists. Woot."
Do you know what he means by "lobbyists"?
A No, I don't. I mean, I think that was partially, you know, exaggerating, jokingly. But, again, you'd have to ask him for what he meant. That's at least how I interpret this message reading it now. I don't know what he meant. That's something for him.
Q Did you ever ask him what he meant by, "We're gonna be lobbyists," what that meant?
A No.
Q Do you recall him saying that other times, that you all were going ta be lobbyists?
A No.
Q If you turn the page to Bates 1502, at—so November 30th, 2020, 7:53 a.m., Chelsea Barnett writes, "Got it." And then Michael Brown responds, "Waiting to hear from Roman. But let's be ready."
​Is this an example that you're saying, like, Michael Brown would, like, report to Roman and Roman would, like, give instructions far purposes of, like, the script and making calls to elected officials?
A I don't know. You'd have to ask Brown, you know, what their relationship was and what they discussed.
Q Okay. Do you recall hearing at times that Michael Brown was waiting for instructions from Roman? Do you recall that just in meetings or talking to him?
A I recall that, you know, reading it now, reading it over text message. And Michael Brown reported to Mike Roman, so in any instance talking about any task it would not be uncommon for him to say, "I'm waiting on Roman to respond." I feel like that's a typical boss-employee relationship.
Q And if you turn the next page to 503, there's a draft script. And if you go to 505, I think it's a—he makes some—there's some slight changes.
Do you recall if this is the script that was used? And believe this related to Arizona based off of the wording and the message. And this is on Bates 505—1505.
A You know, I don't recall if this ended up being the final version or not, no.
Q But looking at it, does this look like they generally have kind of similar language and it—
A Yeah, going back to the one—you know, like I said earlier, it was slightly—I guess it was slightly tweaked for each State. But this language looks the same as the draft we talked about before the lunch break.
Q And that was a draft relating to the State of Georgia, I believe?
A The one we talked about before lunch was about Georgia.
Q Okay. Do you recall ever calling any governors or secretaries of state as part of this project?
​A No. I don't think I've ever spoken to a governor or secretary of state at all.
Q How about any U.S. attorneys or representatives within the U.S. Attorney's Office of anywhere in the country?
A No. I don't know what kind of attorney Linda Kerns was, the one who I said I just drove to and from the meeting, but that's the only attorney I can think of that might be relevant.
Q So—and no—don't recall any calls made to, like, district attorneys within any of the States—
A No.
Q—that you're making calls to? Okay.
[Discussion off the record.]
The Witness. Okay. Sorry. I don't really know what a district attorney is.
    BY
Q Not a problem, that's fine.
Ms. McCallum, O wanted to ask a question about timing. Does this text chain that we've just been reviewing in tab 17, does it read to you like this was the first one of these call projects that you were given?
A Yeah, I think that would be safe to say, that this was very likely the first one.
Q Got it. Okay. So since it seems like the script is being developed on these texts, and we reviewed other scripts that were more stand-alone documents, do you think it's fair to say that this document that is dated November 30th kind of helps ta pin down when those calls were made, that they would've been after this date of November 30th?
A Yes, I think so.
Q Okay.
​ Ms. Lofgren, did you have any questions?
Ms. Lofgren. Nope.
Great.
Ms. Lofgren. I'm just fine. Thank you.
Wonderful.
    BY
Q Okay. Sa let's—how about let's turn to tab 18, with Bates 1571.
A Okay.
Q You can take a minute to review it.
(Pause.)
A Okay. I'm ready.
Q So when we had just talked about tab 17 with Bates 1501 that referred to Arizona, and this also appears to refer to Arizona, is that right, this script on tab 18?
A Yes, that's correct.
Q And I don't think we had asked you before. Towards the beginning of the script it says, "I wanted to personally reach out to you on behalf of the President as you will be a crucial part of President Trump's reelection."
Had President Trump ever asked you to make these calls himself?
A No.
Q Okay.
A I'd like to reiterate, I did not write the script.
Q Understood. And so this script, do you know who wrote this script for Arizona on Bates 1571?
A Yeah. I, you know, was comparing it to the documents we were reviewing earlier, this script that's on 1505 and beyond, on the 17 tab, yeah, and they don't seem to ​vary significantly. So my assumption in looking at this is these were the, you know, more slight changes.
Q From Mr. Brown?
A I assume.
Q Okay. In looking at this, it looks similar to the other—kind of the other scripts we've talked about today.
A Yes, it looks pretty similar, yes.
Q Okay. And if you go towards the bottom, it says—there's a sentence, "This effort is happening in other States where fraud was rampant, including Pennsylvania, Arizona, and Georgia." I wonder if that might be—it looks like it might be a typo if this is about Arizona, but that sentence refers to other States, and Arizona—
A Yes, I would assume it's a typo. I also don't know if this is, you know, the final script that was followed.
Q And here, if you go towards the bottom, it says, "When there is a resolution to appoint electors for Trump, can the President count on you to join in support?"
Did you do any work as part of your role for the Trump campaign involving any resolutions to appoint electors for Trump?
A Can you repeat the question?
Q Yes. Part of your job responsibilities for the Trump campaign, did you ever do any work to help support a resolution in individual States to appoint electors for Trump?
A No.
Q Okay. Do you know what that refers to, what "resolution to appoint electors for Trump" refers to?
A I don't.
    BY
Q Oh, one question about this one, just on the back of that page in tab 18. There are some additional talking points under the heading, "Curveball Quick Tricks."
After looking at those, do you recall whether you ever delivered these talking points after the script on the previous page?
A I'm taking a minute to read through them.
Q Sure.
A No, I don't remember. As I stated earlier, mostly what I did was leave voicemails. There are very few people that I actually spoke on the phone with. And my conversation with them would be whatever is recorded in the notes in the spreadsheet exhibit.
Q Okay.
    BY
Q Did you ever do any in-person meetings with any of the elected officials or only voice—through phone calls or text?
A No, I never met any State representatives or State senators.
Q So if you want to, let's see, turn to tab 20, in that first document, Bates 1648.
A Uh-huh.
Q And this is also a longer communication, so if you want to take your time to review it. So I want to ask you very detailed questions about it.
(Pause.)
A Okay. Yeah, I think we can go ahead and review this.
Q So did you have a chance to review it?
A Yes.
Q And does this, reviewing the communication, does this relate to your work ​for the Trump campaign?
A This relates to, I think I mentioned it earlier, with the Wisconsin incapacitated voters research, which I don't know if I stated this, but after I left Philadelphia, at that point I was fully focused on the Senate runoff in Georgia. And with this conversation and this project being the exception, I solely worked on work related to the NRSC and the Georgia Senate runoff. This is the only other thing that I did for the Trump campaign after I left Philadelphia.
Q Understood. Yeah, sol was going to ask, because the date is December 23rd and it seemed a little bit later than—
A That's correct. That was what! was referring to is right before Christmas when we were all at home. This is the research that I was talking about.
Q So when—like, were you working through a list?
A Yeah, I can explain this a little more. I'm wondering if it's a little bit out of order or—
Q I think some—the photos I think you were trying to show, which was great, like the entire chain, so there's sometimes repeats.
A Right.
Q But it's just to capture the whole conversation. So it's a little confusing in that way, but it should be in the right order. It's just you might see, like, duplicates.
A Okay. So this started with, you know, Pete, Peter McGinnis, who | mentioned worked, you know, in an assistant role for Mike Raman, reaching out ta myself and Madison Crawley about doing this research.
So Peter provided Madison and myself with a list of incapacitated voters in Wisconsin. And basically the idea was we just googled their name or, you know, Facebook search bar, something like that, to just see if they were actually incapacitated ​or not.
Q So I recall from your production you had—there were, like, Facebook posts—
A Uh-huh.
Q and I think it looked like you were doing internet research on individuals and, like, where they were maybe at certain points of time. 1s that potentially, like, related to this project?
A Yes. So—and it's been a while, so correct me if I'm wrong, but incapacitated means, you know, you are stuck in your home, for lack of a better word. So I think their reason—reasons—they were on vacation or something, you know, during election day would be part of the reason as to why they, you know, maybe were not incapacitated.
Q Did Mr. McGinnis or anyone else ever say why—what this information was being used for?
A There is—I'm sorry. I'm looking for it. I know it's—so he does respond, and it's the last photo in this. It's 1654. He responds and says, "Email sent off," you know. And then the next message says, "Jon said we did an awesome job."
I don't know who Jon is. It's clear that he sent an email to someone and then Jon responds and says we did an awesome job.
Q And with respect to, if you know, the "47 hits total," would that be 47 individuals who did not appear incapacitated?
A I would assume so.
Q Okay. And it looks like this—all this work was done in the span of maybe a long day. Is that right?
A Yes, this all just seems to be from one day.
​Q And so this was the only type of project that you did?
A Right. And then with this day Peter and Madison and myself would, you know, regroup and say, "Hey, you know, how much progress did you make?" things like that, during the day. But after that I never heard anything more about this project.
Q If you go to the second to last page, it's on Bates 1653. And if you look at Ms. Crawley's response towards the bottom of the chain, "Yeah, my volunteers just wrapped up 801 stuff, so I need to take care of that."
Do you know what "801 stuff" refers to?
A That would refer—during this time period Madison was also a contractor with the National Republican Senatorial Committee. That would be related to work being done for the Georgia Senate runoff.
Q Okay. Great.
A And to clarify, my message right before that was I said I have stuff to catch up on with Christina. Christina was also a contractor with the National Republican Senatorial Committee.
Q Okay. So there was some overlap and you all were—
A Correct, and I was working with Christina again on things solely related to the runoff at that point.
Q Understood.
Moving right along.
[Laughter.]
If you can turn to tab 21, and that's another text chain, just a couple of pages, Bates 1576,
A Uh-huh.
Q Take some time to review it.
​(Pause.)
A Okay.
Q So my first question is, do you happen to—after reviewing this communication, da you have a sense of when this communication toak place? Because we don't have a date on this. We have—
A I see that these messages on the second page, they have a time stamp of January 5th at 11 p.m. I believe that the messages sent before that were also from January 5th.
Q Okay. That's helpful.
A But we can confirm that.
Mr. Brothers. Yeah, that shouldn't be too hard to confirm.
Q Yeah, after if you want to just confirm the date, that'd be helpful.
A Okay.
Q Thank you.
And in his first message, Mr. Brown says, "Mission accomplished. About to Uber home." Do you know what he was referring to when he said "Mission accomplished"?
A I really don't.
Q Okay. And I see that—I believe it's—this communication is just between the two of you. Is that right?
A Madison Crawley is also in this group message.
Q Okay. So it's three people.
Do you know, with—it looks like someone hearted that message.
A Uh-huh.
Q Do you recall if that was you that hearted the message or Ms. Crawley?
​A If it's blue, that means that I put a heart on it; and if it's not, it means that someone else did, which would either be Madison or Michael.
Q So for maybe the, "This has got to be the cover a book"—I think he forgot "of"—"a book I write one day." You hearted that message.
A I did.
Q Do you recall why you hearted the message?
A I don't. And, you know, I responded after that and said, "Pretty freaking awesome. No joke." I was mostly referring to the photo. I thought the photo was cool, you know.
I'm a low-level campaign staffer. Anytime anyone goes to Capitol Hill I think it's cool, so—
Q So was it your understanding that when Mr. Brown took that photo he was in front of the Capitol in Washington, D.C.?
A It looks like a selfie taken outside of the Capitol Building.
Q Did Mr. Brown ever tell you what he was doing in Washington, D.C., around January 5th?
A Not specifically, no. I knew he was there. And part of my job with the NRSC is I helped Michael Brown with a lot of his expense reports. So I obviously knew he was there because he wasn't with me in Atlanta, and I was compiling expense reports for him. And did the same thing for James Fitzpatrick, basically just gathering up receipts and entering them into Concur, so—
Q So you don't know what mission he might have accomplished on January 5th?
A I don't.
Q And you don't know what book he could potentially write and use that photo ​of?
A I do not, no.
Q Outside of this text communication with Mr. Brown and Ms. Crawley, do you recall having other conversations with Mr. Brown about what he did in Washington, D.C., on January 5th?
A Really the only conversation I had with him is, you know, "Hey, while I'm gone, will you help with my expense report?" And somewhere in the document production I believe that there are messages related to that too, but I could be wrong.
Q So—
A Yes, that would be the next tab, the message after the 22nd. Those, you know—when he gives me the date, January 2nd, I believe that this was referring to a missing date on a receipt, so—
Q Yeah, so we can turn to tab 22, which is Bates 1578, since you brought it up. And I wasn't sure if this related to the doc, the conversation in tab 21.
A Yeah, I believe that these were going on around the same time as the group message with Madison.
Q Okay. In his—in that chain, if you look, he says, "Just landed. I've never flown clutching my bag before." And you write, "hahaha, that bad? Just finished it. Whenever you want to look over." And his response is, "Just didn't want to let the docs out of my sight. Thank you. I will look shortly." And you write, "Oh, duh. I assumed you were talking about turbulence."
Do you recall, did he ever—did Mr. Brown ever tell you why he was clutching his bag while he was flying to D.C.?
A Well, he does say after that that he didn't want to let the docs out of his sight. I don't know what documents he's referring to, assuming he was flying with ​whatever he was at the Capitol to do.
Q So he never—Mr. Brown never told you what documents he was bringing with him to Washington, D.C.?
A No. I mean, the only context I have is the docs. I don't remember any conversations from that day or ever about, you know, what he's referring to.
Q So Mr. Brown never told you about any meetings that he had in Washington, D.C., around January 5th?
A No.
    BY
Q Could we go back really quickly to the document behind tab 21, Ms. McCallum, on the second page—
A Yes.
Q —that you produced?
So Michael Brown, after the exchange with the photo that was on the previous page, writes, "| should probably buy Roman a tie or something for sending me on this one."
Do you think that refers to his boss at the time on the Trump campaign, Mike Roman?
A Yes.
Q Okay. And then he writes, "It hasn't been done since 1876, and it was only three States that did it."
What did you understand him to be referring to there?
A I honestly have no idea.
Q I'll note, this is on—this exchange happened on January 5th, the day before the U.S. Congress was set to convene for a joint session to certify the outcome of the Presidential election on January 6th. That's right?
A Yes.
Q Correct?
A That's—yeah.
Q Yeah, okay. Does that help to jog your memory about what Mr. Brown was doing in D.C., what the documents were?
A I mean, I think you'd have to talk to Michael Brown to ask him specifically ​what he was doing there. You know, if these things are happen—if this conversation is happening on January 5th, I assume that it has something to do with what's happening the next day.
But like I said, I was working for the NRSC at that point in time. I had, you know, no job assignments related to the Trump campaign during the, you know—during January at all, so—
Q Okay. But you were still working with Michael Brown, right?
A Yes, I was working with Michael Brown in the capacity of he was also a contractor with the National Republican Senatorial Committee, as was Mike Roman.
Q Did you understand Michael Brown to be focused exclusively on the Georgia NRSC work, or was he also—was he at that time still working for the Trump campaign?
A I would assume, based on this message, he was still working on Trump campaign, you know, assignments, but I really can't confirm that.
Q Okay. I note in the context of January 6th that 1876 is the year of a contested Presidential election.
A Okay.
Q Does that bring up any recollections for you about conversations that you had with Michael Brown about his trip to D.C. and the documents that he was bringing with him?
A No. I mean, like I said, no one talked to me about anything related to that. And at that point I was working in Georgia, and at that point the only things that people talked to me about were volunteers coming in and out of the office and what we were having for lunch that day and, you know, if there was enough office supplies because the runoff was taking place on the 5th. So anything that I did on the 5th was related to the Georgia Senate runoff.
​Q Okay.
    BY
Q Do you know if Ms. Crawley traveled with Mr. Brown on—to D.C. on January 5th?
A No. And to that, I'd paint you to—on it would be the second page on tab 21, where Michael says, "What's the mood in the room?" He's referring to the room that we were all in for—while we were working for the NRSC, so basically the headquarters office of the runoff. So, you know, Madi responds and says, "still pretty high." So Madison and myself were both in that room in Atlanta, Georgia.
Q Okay. And so did you have to expense this report—expense or help process Mr. Brown's expenses related to this January 5th trip to D.C.?
A I wouldn't know that. I would assume, you know, that's obviously not something the NRSC would pay for.
Q Okay.
A If you look at it, you know, on tab 22, he's talking about a receipt on January 2nd.
Q Yep.
A I don't know if there are any receipts after that.
Q Okay.
    BY
Q Do you know where Michael Brown works now?
A I don't, no.
Q Okay. Are you still in touch with him?
A Occasionally. I don't know if he's currently employed.
Q Okay. And now what about Mike Roman? Do you know where he works ​now?
A No clue.
Q Okay. Are you still in touch with him?
A No.
Q Okay.
A Not regularly at all.
Okay.
Maybe we can just ask, Ms. Lofgren, before we conclude, any questions from you?
Ms. Lofgren. No. Thank you very much for asking.
    BY
Q So we just wanted to just turn to January 6th.
Where were you on January 6th, 2021?
A In Atlanta, Georgia, at the Georgia Republican Party headquarters office.
Q Did you get a chance to watch the rally that took place or the event that took place on the Ellipse on January 6th in Washington, D.C.?
A There was—in the room that we were working out of there was a projector that had some media station on, FOX News, C-SPAN, something of that nature. So I would've watched is whatever was being broadcasted on the news.
I don't remember watching any part of the rally specifically. I obviously remember looking at the TV and seeing, you know, what was going on on January 6th.
Q And when you say what was going on on January 6th, are you referring to the attack on the Capitol Building? Is that what you're referring to, or you're referring—
A Yeah, I remember seeing that on TV, you know, media reporting on that, and obviously the building was shut down, things like that, updates that were media ​information.
Q With respect to the event on the Ellipse on January 6th, did you have any involvement in the planning or organization of that event?
A No. O mean, I'd like to go back to what I said earlier. With the exception of the Wisconsin research, I did not do any work for the Trump campaign after I left Philadelphia in early December.
Q And I think you understand what the select committee is looking into. Do you have any information to provide to the select committee relating to the attack on the Capitol on January 6th, 2021?
A I do not.
Okay. I think that's it. We'll go off the record. Well, it's 3:25, and I think, based on our conversations earlier, your objections are noted for the record, but I think at this point we can close the deposition.
Mr. Brothers. Got it. Sounds good.
[Whereupon, at 3:25 p.m., the deposition was concluded.] 3:25 p.m.
Certificate of Deponent/Interviewee
I have read the foregoing ___ pages, which contain the correct transcript of the answers made by me to the questions therein recorded.
———————————————————— Witness Name
———————————————————— Date