by wakawaka28 | 2026-01-12 09:02:10+00:00
>wait, are you saying people who work for a political administration have the right to say whatever they want and keep their jobs, is that your understanding of free speech?

Elected politicians have very limited restrictions on their rights to free speech. I don't remember the exceptions off the top of my head. The exceptions have little to do with the complaints people are constantly raising against Trump.

>It [the first amendment] has nothing to do with employer-employee relationships, executive policy or censorship.

Actually it does, when the government is involved. The government cannot in general legally retaliate against its employees for reasons of speech. There are exceptions to this for political appointees and elected officials. I'm not going to debate the details of this with you, because I don't know them and I don't think they are relevant to your specific gripes.

>The government an allow you to say whatever you want and still censor that speech, technically you were allowed to speak, and others were allowed to hear what you said, but in certain communication media where access to that media is not a right, but a privilege, it can do whatever it wants, that's lawful censorship.

The government could "allow" me to shout into a pillow all alone in my room and call that free speech, but that does not make it so. The government is not allowed to infringe on the right to speech, and that includes impeding the free dispersal of ideas whether they make laws about it or not. They have no general right to deny you the right to publish online or in print, or to transmit your ideas vocally in any way. Of course in practice they do it anyway. Even though it does get away with this sometimes, the government cannot in fact do what it wants without limit. The Constitution is an attempt to peacefully put limits on the government. I suggest you go read up on the history and motivations behind the right to free speech, because you clearly don't understand what it is or why so-called "absolutists" are right.

>they're literally hunting down critics, breaking into their homes without a warrant and kidnapping them -- we're talking about blond and blue eyed US-born americans here.

I don't believe this. If it has ever happened, it was surely an accident. You can't evict 10 million people who were wrongfully allowed to enter the country without breaking a few eggs. Liberals greatly exacerbated our problems with illegal and fraudulent immigration, and Trump is probably not going to even get close to solving it. It's refreshing to see the border crossings stop, at least.

>Trump just started a prosecution of the fed chair (do you know how unthinkable that is??) over renovations or some made up b.s.

Bro, they prosecuted Trump for all kinds of made up bullshit, including a loan that he paid back where the lender had zero complaints. Where was your outrage about politically-motivated prosecution then? I'm willing to let the man cook for a while.

>and that's not even a political organization [re: the fed], he just doesn't like how the facts of the economy makes him look bad

You are right to some extent here but the Fed is political. They cut interest rates based on bullshit numbers when Biden was in office just to screw Trump over. What I'm saying is the stats were cooked before and they tried to set Trump up to look bad. Now he is cooking them to try to make himself look good. It's going to backfire. I think he should just level with people and say, we are suffering for past mistakes but he's working hard to try to turn it around. I don't know if any politician could actually turn things around at this point, but it's better to be honest.

>I don't really have any argument or debate for people like you, how can you tolerate the betrayal of your own country, your own people.

The Democrats betrayed this country by leaving the borders wide open, working directly to incite racial hatred, censoring their opposition, trying to take our gun rights, eroding property rights, higher taxes, blowout spending on government grift programs, etc. I don't want to live in a communist shithole either. There are so many reasons why I cannot support them. Don't get me wrong, the Republicans are not really what I want either, but they are much closer to it than Democrats. Your complaints are way overblown and you don't seem to see the issues with the other side.

>the mistreatment of so many people, and the marching on into endless wars and conflicts like this?

Liberals mistreated conservatives for years. It's nearly impossible to date now as an average guy unless you want to chime in and agree with the liberal delusions about Trump being a Nazi. Straight white men were discriminated against on many fronts, especially if they were perceived to be conservative. When liberals are hyping themselves up to murder conservatives, and openly cheering over their deaths, you know we're not on the right track. The so-called "insurrection" of January 6, 2020 was another debacle where liberals openly lied and hyped themselves up to go arrest grandmas who were in the area. Even after extensive video evidence released to show just how peaceful of a protest it was with cops allowing people to walk through open doors, the Democrats are still gaslighting us about it. The crowd was allowed to get out of control to lodge an accusation of an insurrection, as detailed by Nanci Pelosi on video where she said something like "we've been waiting for this!" after denying the necessary reinforcements to contain the crowd safely. There's much more to say on this topic, but I'm not in the mood to write a book, and I doubt you would read or accept it as fact either.

As for conflicts around the world, this country has always pursued them for the past 100 years or more. Your vote does not matter as much as you think it does when it comes to this. The Biden/Harris administration was totally in favor of war. (So were Obama and Hillary Clinton.) Harris made it clear she would continue with near-unlimited support for Ukraine. We now live in a crazy timeline where historically anti-war liberals are chomping at the bit to keep the Ukraine war going and potentially start a nuclear apocalypse over a regional issue.

Only Trump said he would try to end the conflict. In his first term, he started no new wars and was working to get us out of Afghanistan, so he is/was credible in that regard. But we might be forced to take military action now for strategic reasons, to prevent Russia or China from getting the upper hand. These military issues are complex and can have multiple layers of intrigue to them. The version of events we receive from our media is heavily propagandized. The most common true reasons for war might boil down to "We need to do this to deter enemies" or "We need to do this for resources" or "We will never get money to fund the weapons we need unless we get rid of the ones we already have" and people have trouble accepting the conflict between international policy and their own interpersonal moral code which includes rules like "Don't steal" and "Don't murder"...

>i voted for the conservatives myself, this has to do with you and your loyalty to your country first, and patriotism towards your own country.

This surprises me. But I know there are a small number of conservatives that bought the lies about Trump. You sound exactly like a liberal here, with the exact same complaints.

>You can't even have the bare minimum pride in your country that the poorest trashiest third world countries have after this.

This country has been getting poorer and trashier for decades, throughout my whole life. We've been importing the third world for years. Muslims and communists are taking over. The Bill of Rights is constantly under attack, to the point where even a "conservative voter" like yourself seems to not understand the founding principles of the country or the FIRST Amendment. Our culture is going to hell, money is rapidly devaluing, we can't manufacture much of anything in the US anymore. You are worried about Trump, I'm worried about what is going to happen when the wheels fall off this wagon and a world where China is #1, and all the entitled people in this country suffer a dramatic reduction in quality of life.

>I am not speaking in hyperbole at all, are you perhaps stuck in some sort of an informational bubble? a victim of some deliberate disinformation campaign? Even in 2024 I could have given you the benefit of the doubt, but it truly is confounding right now, how you can hold such beliefs without feeling any shame, or any fear or the cataclysm ahead.

As a matter of fact, I am the victim of a disinformation campaign: the one against Trump that's been running for 10 years now. I used to believe the stuff that they said about Trump, but the more I looked into it the more inconsistencies and outright lies I saw. Although I don't believe the disinformation anymore, I am seemingly beset on all sides by other victims of the disinformation who drag me down.

What was done to Trump is not new in character (they've done it to other politicians such as George Bush and Bernie Sanders), but it is new in scale. The Democrats got drunk on power and tried to ruin Trump every way they could. Have you forgotten the assassinations and assassination attempts, shootings targeting conservatives, censorship of conservatives, political prosecutions, etc.? I'm fairly conservative myself I hesitate to tell people because I don't want to hear their gripes about Trump. He's more or less doing what I wanted him to do: to reign in deranged leftists and communists by denying them the presidency, to reduce or eliminate persecution of conservatives, to reduce absurdities such as free sex changes for prisoners and recruiting of mentally ill and/or incompetent air traffic controllers, to reduce race-driven rhetoric and grievance farming aimed to divide the country, to deport the culturally-incompatible and dangerous invaders allowed in through corrupt processes, to work on national security, to try something new to bring industry back to this country, to end the wars if possible, and a lot of smaller stuff that is worth celebrating.

I wish that the left could appreciate their mistakes and the work that Trump is doing on our behalf, but they just keep doubling down on toxic rhetoric. It's going to get people killed, like Charlie Kirk, the victims of mentally ill trans shooters, that lady who hit the ICE agent recently with her car and got shot while doing it, etc. These deaths would not happen but for insane Democrat rhetoric. The people following ICE agents around to impede law enforcement will have to be arrested, and any local politician who refuses to go along with this will have to be talked down or prosecuted. In the worst case he will have to send the national guard or army to restore order. I support that but I would hate to see it go so far.