by louthy | 2025-11-06 11:56:29+00:00
Yeah keep doubling down by making irrelevant links to points not made.

> Baby Ford's - "Oochy Koochy (FU Baby Yeah Yeah)": Widely regarded as the first British acid house track, was released in 1988.

Irrelevant to the discussion.

> "Voodoo Ray", the de facto anthem of the period by A Guy Called Gerald, was released in 1989.

Irrelevant to the discussion.

> 'Pacific State' by 808 State - the infamous closing track at the Hacienda at the height of the period - was released in 1989.

Irrelevant to the discussion.

> The reason I bring up 'Pump up the Jam' is that it was the earliest contemporaneous electronic music from any of the Belgian scenes to break the UK charts - doing so in November 1989.

It was irrelevant when you brought it up the first time and it still is now you've clarified why you mentioned it.

> Comparatively the first hardcore techno track of any description released was in 1990. T99's Anaesthesia was probably the entry point for Belgian Hardcore into the UK when it charted in the middle of 1991.

'probably' - the tracks mentioned in my original comment had an outsized effect on the scene. The chord-memory stabs and hoover noises from the Roland Alpha Juno in particular - I have two, the preset isn't usable out of the box, and needs tweaking to get the well known hoover sound to be usable in a track. This is the original preset on my soundcloud [1] for anyone that's interested and isn't tired of this turgid exchange.

Also, hilarious that you think that the charts were even remotely relevant to people going to the raves. You keep mentioning chart based music which tells me you don't understand what were underground music scenes. Yes, some music broke through, but the good stuff was underground.

> Q.E.D. It's hard to inspire a scene when you come after it chronologically.

Hilarious that you think you've proven something. You've mentioned another influence path, I never said that the only influence on the rave scene was the Belgian techno scene. All music is the sum total of its influences. Amongst other influences are funk, soul, disco, ragga, and dub.

Ishkur’s guide is littered with omissions and errors. It shouldn’t be taken seriously. But that wiki does not "whiff of Ishkur's Guide", you just don't like that it agrees with my position, so you're throwing shade on it. 'Energy Flash' is ok, but is still an incomplete view. I don't need to refer to any guide or book anyway, mostly because I was there, and experienced the scene myself, first hand.

> Belgian Techno scene to the American Joey Beltram (who released Mentasm as second Phase)

Are you just throwing shit at the wall to see what sticks now? The Belgian Techno scene didn't just consist of music made by Belgians, as I have already stated.

> at best you might describe Experience as broadly "breakbeat hardcore".

It is old-skool hardcore aka breakbeat hardcore.

> Also "jungle (which alternatively lost the techno style keyboard stabs and piano breaks” - are we completely ignoring Metalheadz as a label? Lemon D/Dilinja in particular who bridged the breakbeat/jungle divide, stabs and piano breaks intact.

Mentioning two mainstream names again says to me you only have a surface level understanding here. And your timing is all wrong.

Metalheadz kicked off in ‘94. The peak year for Jungle was ‘92 before the drum’n’bass sound took over, I even have a mix of 92/93 jungle on my soundcloud [2].

Dilinja’s first release was ‘91 but it was mostly poorly produced hardcore early on. I don’t consider him a jungle pioneer at all, more later for drum’n’bass.

If you're picking those two examples out for jungle it shows you know nothing about the genre.

[1] https://soundcloud.com/paullouth/alpha-juno-hoover-thru-ssl-...

[2] https://on.soundcloud.com/9hcXcouaPEWqGfVOps