by invalidname | 2025-06-29 06:55:29+00:00
> I'm not anti-immigration as you accused me of, far from it

Nope. I asked if you would be as judgemental towards any other ethnic group. Notice that the immigration in question (in massive numbers) happened for the most part in the 19th century. There was a big push when the country was formed but it was related to the existing WW II displacement of population.

> but I think you need to accept the fact that emigration en mass to any part of the world is not natural and will definitely causing instability.

Sure. But it happened. My ancestors didn't have much of a choice and neither do I. It happened and people need to get over it.

> The situation in Israel cannot be justified similarly as if the Muslim want to emigrate en mass back to Spain. However you never answer my questions what's your personal opinions regarding this similar hypothetical situation?

Why would I care about Spain?

You're trying to create a false equivalency and renegotiate history. Those are mute points. I get exactly why the Palestinians didn't want Jews to return to Israel, I don't blame them for that. Did I give a sense that I did?

I also understand why they started the war in 1947/8. It was objectively stupid on their part as history shows.

> I'd really appreciate if you can provide the valid references of the verses for the dubious promised land narrative in the Quran and Bibles with respect to modern Israel (not ancient Moses time).

You must have me confused with someone else. I'm an atheist. I don't give a crap about the promised land and neither do most Israelis. We were born here, it's as simple as that. Our lineage was displaced a lot through history and we don't claim ownership of everything that was stolen from our ancestors.

You're debating as if you're in the 1940s. This debate is mute. Almost all Palestinians were born outside of what is today's Israel and most Israelis were born here.

> Another interesting potential fact is that most of the current Palestinians are actually the descendents from the original Jewish people living in the ancient Judea time that have converted to Islam.

That is nonsense. Since Jews were literally murdered by Romans that would not have been the case. Islam didn't exist at the time. Notice that you're grasping at straws trying to invalidate an entire people, would you feel OK trying to invalidate the history/ethnicity of any other race other than Jews?

> I think Israel govt can and should check the Palestinian people ancestry based on DNA test accordingly.

There is actual DNA relation between Jews and Palestinians, but DNA doesn't work like people think it does. It doesn't tell us anything much. We do call Arabs/Palestinians cousins in Hebrew because religious people do believe we are related and descendants from the same line.

> If that's true it will make the current Israel govt as self-hating Jews or self-hating Semite.

Nope. Not a thing.

> Potentially, some of the Palestinians may have higher Jews ancentors percentage from the ancient Judea Jews population than the emigrants themselves.

There is no way of knowing that. What we do know is where some Palestinians came from and its often Sudan, Yemen etc. There's a strong genetic connection between them and the north African/Yemenite population though... A huge amount of them were work immigrants who came to the region in the 1920's and encouraged by the local population as a contrast to the Jewish immigration. This goes both ways.

> According to reluable sources only a few percents or around less than 3% of land properties were legally bought by the Israel Jewish community from the Palestinians.

Wikipedia says 6.6% and it's generally very anti-Israel https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jewish_land_purchase_in_Palest...

Your mistake is that you assumed incorrectly that Palestinians owned the land. They did not, half of the land was purchased from other owners.

> But honestly, even if we take your inflated claim of legal land purchases at 7%, do you honestly think the Palestinian would sell the Jews the remainder of the 93% land if the British and the Palestinian authority had not stop the land purchasing exercises?

Again no. You assume Palestinians owned the other 93% of the land which again isn't how territories work. The number is much much lower. Most of the ownership was by public land, churches, mosques, etc. The actual number is open to debate but is indeed in the 40+ percent. Here's the thing: most of it wasn't in the area where Israel was originally formed. Even after 1947, most of the Palestinians were still on their owned land. In fact, they often still are if they didn't run away during the war.

I agree it's terrible that people got displaced and lost their land. Hell, it happened to my family dozens of times. It sucks. But I don't expect to go back to Morocco, Lativa, Germany (the list goes on) and ask for the lands back. Its gone.

> I cannot recall any incidents where the South Arican black news broadcasting stations, people houses, schools, hospital, house of worships, etc were indiscriminately and systematically decimated from the air by the South African govt at the time.

You're again confusing Gaza and the West bank. It seems there's too much information for you to process.

Gaza is on its own. That's a war.

The west-bank is where I would argue there's a far more severe problem. Unfortunately, the government is using the mess in Gaza to make matters worse in the west-bank.

> Do you not know that throughout history for over more than a thousand years never ever have any Muslim authorities totally expelled or decimated the Jewish population.

That is far from accurate but the point is true that Christians have been far more murderous towards Jews in history. That's part of why we're paranoid and rightly so.

Just to correct the false narrative I suggest looking up: Almohad Caliphate (12th century). Orphans Decree under Zaydi Imams in Yemen (20th century) and Mawza Exile in the 17th century. Allahdad Incident 1839 in Persia and Safavid Era Forced Islamization in the 17th century (and another incident in the 14th century). In Morocco through many centuries and as late as 1790 there was forced conversion.

But yes, the Christians were far worse. This is all before the formation of Israel when things got really bad and Jews had to escape.

> I'd strongly suggest you read the The Hundred Years' War on Palestine book

What makes you think I haven't read that and countless others on the subject?

I'm amazed that you're trying to explain my history to me and assume we don't all know this stuff. We live this stuff every day and are exposed to the "other side". I'd argue that you are not, you think of this entire conflict in simplistic two dimensional terms. You overweight facts that have absolutely no relevance to the current situation and mix two completely different situations/narratives. You also look at the situation in the completely wrong way.

This isn't about Palestinians vs. Jews/Israelis. It's about moderates vs. extremists. The moderates are a huge majority here and just want peace/compromise. However, extremists keep burning everything down and forcing us into conflict that we don't want.

Hamas is a death cult, it will never surrender its purpose to destroy Israel. If it survives it might be able to strike a blow that will give the extreme right in Israel the power to do the unthinkable.

The problem is that most westerners are acting as chaos agents by providing unintentional support for Hamas. This strengthens the Israeli right-wing and is ultimately bad for the moderates on both sides, but mostly bad for the Palestinians. Those are the facts that you're conveniently ignoring.