by aprilthird2021 | 2025-04-16 04:05:29+00:00
1. Jews are not a majority in Israel and Palestine combined and Israel has de facto control over all of Palestine and they would describe it as area under their control rather than as a separate state.

2. Non-Jews can never ever ever be allowed to be a majority of the voting populace in Israel, so that's why the ones in Palestine (under Israeli control, on the rez, so to speak) are not given any rights in the country that controls them. The Israeli Arabs would be stripped of their political rights if they ever outnumbered Israeli Jews and you know this very well.

3. I'm not interested in any conspiracy frankly.

> Let's start with the right of return: sovereign countries can make their own laws, which includes immigration laws.

Sure. But I think these ones are disturbing because they make one minority ethnicity, often from abroad, the kings over all the others who live on the same land with the power to remove them from their homes whenever convenient (as happens in the West Bank daily).

> Jews have therefore fled from all over the world to the only country in the world where they are protected, which is Israel

Jews are less safe in Israel than in Europe and America. (E.g. https://forward.com/opinion/536469/antisemitism-may-be-most-...)

But also, I don't think any country "deserves" to exist to right any wrong in the world. Countries force themselves into existence. Israel did the same, often resorting to the exact same terror tactics (yes even the Haganah conducted military operations using civilian buildings as cover) they now bemoan the Palestinians for resorting to to establish their own state. Whether or not it is the only country for Jews is irrelevant to me. Many ethnicities will never have their "own" nation, and some have multiple, but that has little to do with whether I find the exalting of one ethnicity over the others to such a degree that the others must be made stateless and right-less to be good or bad.

> Should they be allowed to emigrate to Israel? I don't think in the history of the world any country has allowed the descendants of a losing army to emigrate to their country.

It's not emigrating to their country it's movement within the same country. Again, the entire problem I have is that Israel needs to strip the people who live in the land it controls of political rights to maintain its ethnic minority led democracy. This is like saying the Native Americans cannot leave the reservations and live among Americans because their ancestors lost the wars against the Colonists.

> There was no such thing as Palestine in the way that you think about it

This is always the least convincing argument because it doesn't matter and it has nothing to do with how Israel must make the people who aren't Jews stateless and rights-less for its ethnic minority democracy to function. You can call them Plutons for all it matters, I care what Israel is doing that's wrong. I don't believe that a national identity that is "new" means anything about whether human beings should be denied rights solely because of their ethnicity.

Thanks for sharing. I am always open to hear other perspectives. Hope you're similarly open to mine