nothing clued in children citizen welfare virtue or the environment is safe from profit exploitation perhaps one word best summarizes wal mart capitalism seems poised to terminate our species singular focus on profit must give way to social democratic priorities for there are jews might just feel what walker and i will learn how to take on big business and when all around us and what we see we see oceans of poverty and islands of obscene wealth we see and that's just that's all around the world is the richest two hundred twenty five people have more wealth than three billion people around the world and that's not just internationally here in the united states you have an incredible polarization of wealth the top one percent has more than ninety five percent of ordinary working people in this country and so that's an argument for really jettisoning capitalism and going to social m i would say fundamentally this system is not working for for the immense majority for working people and rape and regular middle class people working class people it's not working for us look at how the hair millionaires in the billionaires it's really that's that's one that's less than one percent why should all society be organized around what they want rather than what ninety nine point nine percent needs now is that we hear that a lot one percent have ninety five percent of the assets in america is that documented ye i know that in michael moore's movie capitalism a love story i believe something of that order was mentioned you also talks about some time in the movie did you hear hear that term problem and i did i think michael moore makes it's a brilliant film capitalism a love story he really he lays out the picture really well of how this how that how corporate greed is out of control it's not about his greed or lack of morality it's that it's at the core of the system capitalism has only one goal which is to maximize profits and that means to showing the environment that means cutting corners if that means having sweatshops so be it you've got to maximize your profits and if you don't your competitor will and they'll drive you out of business this is the race to the bottom  people who refer to it yeah that's and that's that's what karl marx actually pointed out one hundred fifty years ago i mean a lot of said about marx to make fun of him but the reality is he said he called it he called it perfectly said this system is not you have an endless race to the bottom it never ends if we lower wages here we'll have to lower it again tomorrow you know that mexico used to be the main low wage production platform and now it's china and now companies are pulling out of china because it's getting too expensive there and they can produce cheaper that's why socialist think working people need to stand up for our for our interest in our rights in a man's a living minimum wage demands single payer universal health care to say the wars in iraq and afghanistan are not serving our interests so i don't have any objection people standing up for their interests big business is doing that the problem is we ordinary working class people we're not doing that and it's a one sided class war that's going on where you mention wal mart and i think that's code for you know sweat shop  over time without pay no rights no you're not everything will just take a look they've become it's not accidental that they become the world's biggest corporation or one of the top five or something and why is that is because they're the most from they're the most ruthless in driving down wages and driving down prices to maximize their profits and that's it's not that they're bad it's that they're playing the game of capitalism most successfully and the more that they grow the more they drive their competitors out of business they open up a shop in a town or tons of small businesses even mid sized businesses get driven out of business so there's no way that more warm wal mart is going to wake up one day and decide that your people living wages well if they do though they're going to face some harsh competition because other companies are going to drive race to second to second wal mart starts taking it easy you think their competitors are going to jump all over that so that's why we need to get we would say we need to get to the core of the problem which is the which is the profit motive and the owner and the domination of the economy of politics the media by big business capitalism is terribly going to spiral down down down and that's basically the argument against it the only thing that can check it is when working people and movements of auditor people begin to stand up and organize and fight for our rights that's the only reason we have a minimum wage in this country it's only reason we have social security or unions or forty hour work week or the right to vote is because we stood up and fought for if you don't have that check the if capital is given free reign like it's been given over the past has yet big business is very good the politicians are very good at telling us to tighten our belts and suck it up for the common good but i don't see goldman sachs and wall street in the health insurance companies doing that they don't they don't look what's the best interest of society would be to get rid of the health care profiteers and the health care bureaucracy and actually institute a single payer health care system but no we've got to suck it up and do what's good for them that's what that's what they want to do we're seeing concentration just about every sector of the economy the airlines the telephone definitely the exact same place so that's the thing what you know we can slap on some regulations you can temporarily be a band aid but the underlying logic the underlying dynamic is we continue to push for more more concentration of wealth we look at the economic crisis what is that what's been the end result of that rather than the big wall street companies being brought down to size you have this huge consolidation on wall street and a huge increase in their power and then they're the ones calling the shots in congress and saying this is not allowed in the finance reform bill this is every call that a democracy didn't marx predict one hundred fifty years ago good capitalism will head towards co ops of corporations and consolidation of money and political power he absolutely did and that's actually it's amazing in the light of this economic crisis marx's writings like the communist manifesto as being more and more widely read and more more more more even caplets commentators are being forced to acknowledge that marx made it as they say to well a few good points in his analysis they don't like the political couzens he drew that workers need to actually organize and build political movement based on their own class interests but they have to acknowledge that he did have a perceptive analysis of capitalism so you're recommending that people pick up the book communist manifesto if they can get beyond the word communist and read it and learn something about marx definitely and for a more you know for a more modern take that deals with like today's world should check out our web site www dot socialist alternative and this is where they'll find some books that are recommended and get some understanding of yes it was and then we think yeah exactly we have tremendous material at the b p oil spill which is a disk disgraceful example of how the short term profit profiteering that big business has the consequence of that i mean b p to cut a few maybe a half million dollars yup and the crazy thing is that's totally rational and logical on the basis of capitalism if and if and it's maybe extreme but it's what every corp every big business every every one of the big businesses that they do maybe that b p s maybe a little more wild and a little more more of a cowboy but shell and exxon and microsoft and boeing they're doing the same fundamental thing now how does imperialism and war fit into this it's blemishes of capitalism is the overwhelming majority of you and ice taxpayer of our tax dollars is going to feed the pentagon machine and how are we benefiting from it no halliburton the big oil companies boeing's not and even off the quarter yes blackwater but not even the boeing i want to clean up the boeing workers they're not the ones really benefiting it's the owners the owners of boeing which are the ones that are more than happy to kick the boeing workers onto the street and attack their healthcare pensions they're the ones collecting the benefits from it but even if they are benefiting in the short term they're going to lose in the long term and the world is more sustainable and conflicts just run through the globe and that is the anarchy of global capitalism there's no planning there's no rational they're driving blind they're flying the airplane blind no one has any conscious control over the system so yeah even from their own interests in the long term it's in a blow up in their face that's what's happening in iraq and afghanistan but in the short term they see the opportunity grab the oil they see the opportunity to extend their power and influence the middle east and they grab it isn't this just the classic program of taking what you want their resources abroad and then you know we want them so we'll take them we can use pretext to get them we're seeing that happen in a lot of countries we've seen the whole thing about weapons of mass destruction who takes that seriously now it was a total fabrication and just a smokescreen and the real issue was that bush and us capitalism wanted to teach saddam hussein a lesson impose their power in the middle east because of the resources and to get their hands directly on the oil in iraq so it's all about resources and cheap labor and forcing open new markets for the goods that can be sold in that counts a lot more than human rights and workers rights and that's that's really regrettable you know we're talking this evening about capitalism can't be tolerated and that we need a socialist alternative tell me what that socialist alternative would really be go beyond the words and get into this facility just back up a second cap was and can be tolerated it's a question are we willing to tolerate it i mean it's been around for two hundred years the question that i would  ask is are we prepared to put up with more unemployment we prepared to put up with more corporate bailouts with more destruction our environment or we're going to do something about it we're going to do something we think we need to get to the root cause of the problem the essence of the problem not look for some band aids but actually to greed capitalism we do i mean you're absolutely right if capitalism is on checked if we do not take action to put an end to this system it will take down the world's environment it will take down billions of people already paying the price for the system  a band aid earlier is there anything we can do with capitalism is everything just a band aid or does the system have to be chucked and socialism brought him we have to start the first place to start is beginning to organize and building mass movements of workers and the poor and the middle class and we fight socialist fight for every possible reform we can squeeze out a system like single payer health care like raise the minimum wage to a living wage of twelve so you're saying that the socialist alternative is living wage health care  organized decisions massive public works programs to create tens of millions of jobs and massive investment in renewable energy like wind and solar and hydro power and taking the big wall street banks into public ownership ending the wars in iraq and afghanistan those are immediate things that we need to organize around but the thing is they're not enough if we simply stop there look take the the the labor movement in one thousand thirty s one huge gains but now all those gains been rolled back so if we want to really actually make those reform stable and long lasting we need to take power out of the hands of corporate american put power into the hands of working people that is a more fundamental systemic change a social event to me to be done any time soon we need it today a socialist alternative well that's why we have to start by beginning to get organized and building mass movements to fight back like the are we talking generations it is it's a serious struggle but we have to start somewhere if we if we can there's only so long you can rationalize defeat and and make excuses for our for impotence we actually have an enormous power once we become conscious of our power look they cannot produce anything without our labor they cannot they cannot run their war machine without working class people middle class people getting into the military they need draft you know they need to go out and get it's not the sons and daughters of george bush are the ruling class that are fighting these wars it's us so what's lacking is consciousness of what our interests are and being organized around that and once we have that there's no force on earth that can stop us what you're talking about organizing in unions there is unions are just about moribund that how are we going to get people into unions and beyond unions into a social alternative organizing it's a great question  it's got we got to start somewhere we have to begin organizing look if you the civil rights movement if we were having this conversation in one thousand nine hundred eighty or one nine hundred fifty and i would tell you in ten years that we were about to see the biggest mass movement against racism and segregation in the history of this country a lot of people laugh but that's exactly it happened it happened pretty fast actually in this country or enormous changes out of the civil rights movement and the same thing the labor movement when the great depression hit in one thousand twenty nine the labor movement was as small as it was today and it was out of the great depression one reason we saw a massive strikes general strikes workers occupying their factories out of that tens of millions of workers joined unions so it can happen really fast we can look at that look at greece today workers all throughout greece or there's been five general strikes the past few months and that happened within months and you know we can turner our sights on south america i know that peru ecuador bolivia that is where all of their standing up to consume their organizing for their own people's interest definitely and it's a real example how working people do have power throughout all of latin america there's been massive movements that have shaken big business and global capitalism and u s imperialism they've actually and it shows that change is possible they haven't they haven't overthrown capitalism which is what's missing but they have shown it is possible to have radical reforms that make a real difference in people's lives and actually living standards have gone up literacy has gone up access to health care living wages but it's very unstable and big and the ruling elites in latin america and us imperialism is doing everything possible to underpin undermine those reforms they will use their military power to push aside an overthrow democratically elected government they tried that in two thousand and two a chavez in venezuela and they of thousands came out in the streets and the military coup plotters were forced to flee and chavez was restored to power and it shows the potential power that working people have when we get organized we're prepared to fight but this is we speak of revolution here socialist revolution you're the one using those words actually i did it i didn't say that but it's not an overnight event it's an incremental event is what you're arguing well where we think we need to get we need to begin organizing for our for our interests and our rights and if that if that means if capitalism can't afford what we need then we can't afford the system so you mentioned earlier that we control corporations who ultimately do our labor our labor creates all the wealth without our labor not not a wheel would turn no no you know if by if i think a great examples of bill gates passes away tomorrow do you really believe that windows operating systems and microsoft office and stop being produced but if the workers go on strike they can't do it how do you explain somewhat of a socialist democratic europe of france as the best health care in the world yet we certainly tied for we see that  scandinavia they require that you take paternal leave nobody in europe goes without an extended vacation you know we have in the u s we have the short the longest workweek and the longest number of hours worked  europe is an example of what can be won when we have a strong and fighting labor movement social movement through massive struggle it wasn't because the european caplets are nicer than here in the united states it is because they came under enormous pressure from below from the working class they were forced to make concessions like you mentioned but those concessions are under attack they are in a desperate race to catch the way that big business the ruling elite in europe sees it is they're in a desperate race to catch up with their competitors in the united states and they're under there constantly attacking the care and pension and education the free education systems that existed that were won in europe so it's not socialism its reforms that were won by workers in europe under capitalism and those reforms are under constant attack marks talked about the struggles that what you're describing here is the struggle the people are going to have to make they're going to change history they can't wait and that sometimes will be incremental sometimes it will be abrupt change that's basically the more capitalism fails the basic message  of of marx and the socialists is that no one will liberate the working class except ourselves that we and the working class that's not we're not just talking about like a few and we need it doesn't clued industrial workers we're talking about wal mart workers  starbucks workers microsoft engineers everyone who works for a living which is the vast vast majority socialism is going to the movement of that vast majority the working class for our self interests which is really the interest of society as a whole  and out of that we can actually end that the exploitive destructive system of capitalism it's a negative is not going to come from above or from on high it has to come from below and that's why it's the most democratic way of organizing society it's an demand that it was able to set its own terms and the guilds form would form unions but let me ask you don't you expect some out all out opposition from the ruling elites that control money and political power and definitely there you be naive and not to think that they will do everything in their power by any means necessary to maintain their power and privilege and wealth all history shows that and that's why we have to be organize and build our own independent organizations and movements and institutions like and our own media they control the media we need our own media a labor movement needs its own media we need our own political party why why do we keep voting for the democrats republicans which are two completely bought owned by big business they have two parties why can't we the vast majority the millions why can't we have one party that's not just sharing the wealth it's actually control to if we just divvied up everything that would solve the problem wouldn't that we just beggar the rich the root problem is controlling the factors of production and your democratic process you're exactly right it's not a question socialism is not just about redistributing the wealth and taking some money from this guy and handing it to that person though of course there is a need for a massive taxation on the rich and big business and wealth redistribution that direction as a first step which is just carrying out social policy through taxation yet and right now here in washington state the poor and working middle class we pay a lot more in taxes than bill gates and paul allen but back to your original question socialism is not about just redistributing the wealth it's about having a system that actually is more productive that's actually more democratic that more systematic the education for generations in america how are you going to overcome what people might feel when they hear socialism or the your marx or the you're going for good for communism well yeah i for the fox news of the world it's not just fox news they're just the most extreme they are are bang their search their complaints servants of their corporate masters and they crack the whip on them and tell them you know you got it you got to spread you know you got be scared of social and communism you have to ask why the reason is actually it's up it's a it's an honor that they attack socialism it tells us that it's something that's a threat to their interests a threat to big business they don't they don't tell us they don't they don't attack wall street they don't they don't attack the free market so the the people who are the owners of this mass and there's only five corporations that really dominate the mass media in the united states they're serving corporate america and that's why they've been put producing this this this garbage in this myths about social commerce and also shows them is is about actually having a society based on the interests of the vast majority working people rather than a system based on big business and they're finding in the example is actually well funded by corporate interests sneaker money is getting into the tea party and it's not a citizen therefore as he said all differently very cool totally backed by fox news and what they're doing is they're tapping into legitimate it's quite you know the tea party movement is tapping into real anger that exists at the bailout of wall street which socialists were completely against it wasn't socialist who bailed out wall street it was big business it was george bush and barack obama the democrats republicans who together in a bipartisan way represents the interests of their big business backers and they gave out bill trillions to their to their buddies on wall street socialists are completely against that the tea party and it was massively unpopular in this country the tea parties tapped into that but they're directing that anger against big government which is it actually exact opposite of what's needed what we do need is public works programs create jobs for working people we do need to take wall street under democratic public control to stop them running rampant over our economy many people going to really appreciate how close we came to be tyranny in one thousand thirty four big business didn't feel interests were served and there was a near coup in the united states you want to explain that absolutely it's a great example it shows they will not be constrained by any democratic rules or laws or norms if their interests are under attack they will do everything in their power to defend themselves and right in one thousand thirty four there was a section of big business  see above corporate tyranny and that's key that's a key lesson for us today like one of the key things that's going to stop these wars in iraq and afghanistan what stop the war in vietnam was a mass uprising over a belly and of rank and file soldiers there all the military is made up of working class people that went into the vietnam war many pundits agreed yes it was i mean it was a mass movement in the u s but decisive was that them anti woman spread into the into the ranks of military and tens and soldiers just basically what a mas s need one third of the of soldiers at the height of the end of war were a wall and that's what we need to stop these wars in iraq afghanistan as we as soldiers need to start organizing and saying no we're not going to fight this war that's why should we die for for  empire and oil because it really beyond that we don't have a good reason for being in afghanistan pakistan iraq and god help us maybe iran really soon it's totally futile the you there's no way the u s can win in afghanistan or iraq that we're going to have to withdraw the issue is are we withdraw now or how many years it's going to take and how many more u s soldiers are going to be killed and injured and how many more civilians in afghanistan iraq going to be killed but we have the same result either way philip this is been very interesting i hope a lot of people have opened up to the fact that there is an alternative to greed capitalism that is failing us certainly feeling very the working person so terribly and it may be structural that maybe these jobs are not coming back they're going off sure  they're not going to get back in we're not going to have the kind of lifestyle standard of living that our parents enjoyed reading our grandparents enjoyed this is very the specter of a great depression is not eliminated help us out of this quandary you're saying a socialist alternative concluded for us what do you want people to do give them some parting words the most important people need to get active we need to get involved and start organizing out to join our organization social term or join an activist organization in your community you can check out our website social terms you can call our phone number two zero six five two six seven one eight five and get active we're doing two campaigns this this summer and in the fall one is against the make is to make b p pay for their oil spill and to bring them into democratic public ownership and ban offshore oil drilling the second campaign is to organize against the budget cuts happening here in washington state but all across the country where we're seeing enormous cuts in funding for education to issue hikes layoffs of teachers and students and teachers and and community members we need to organize to stop these attacks and public education you can contact us to get involved our campaigns thank you very much you dispel the myth of the ethical corporation and you've made people aware that it's up to them they've got to turn out and do something and insist upon social democratic principles i want to thank you again philip walker's social national organizer for socials alternative thank you thank you it's been a privilege