welcome to new beginnings with care and where we celebrate the creativity courage and wisdom of people creating change we highlight those who charge you parts make new life and career choices and face turning points welcome to new beginnings with karen dell and i am so pleased to have joining me anthony lopez who is oh and managing director of those who are group he is also chairman of board of pro spot acoa which was formerly known as the national society of hispanic m b a tony welcome thank you yes good to be back again i am so pleased to have you back again we have been talking about leadership in the past and i wanted to talk to you because when we talked in a prior show we touched a little bit about on diversity and inclusion and you know in today's business environment that is definitely not only a buzz word but it is something that organizations are focusing on more which is a great thing because we are living in a global economy where we're doing business in rapid speed around the world with people who look different from us right and even here in the u s there is the whole notion of diversity so i wanted to spend some time really exploring this subject with you as it relates to leadership and as it relates to your work with pro spawn ika ok that's great yes so my it my journey on diversity if if i want to say where it began relative to the workplace yes because obviously we all have a journey of diversity from the moment particularly if you're a person of color yes my case i'm from puerto rico soon began obviously much earlier but my and all back then jane jay was what i would say a pioneer in companies taking the lead in working on diversity and inclusion as an imperative as a business imperative to not just promote for a healthier workplace and a more balanced workplace and a fairer workplace all those things are great but there has to be for them a business rationale to do it right there has to be a why do this it's not just because it's the right thing and it isn't just about equal opportunity and although all those things are important yeah those are good but there are business imperatives so back then jane jane i was with one of the change it companies called avocado started to put most of the management and ultimately employees through diversity awareness training and as one of the few persons of color back in the company back then at least in the location i was in we got to go to a lot of those because they discovery right what's what's it mean what is diversity what a different dimensions of it because while we may see color as one dimension of diversity that's very obvious or gender the other obvious one we both know there is a number of of different dimensions of the varsity but the company embarked on a journey to really help people become aware of their own self and perhaps our own biases and importantly how they relate and how you let those play out or not in the workplace so so ninety's and as most corporations really started to get out the bad ones yeah i would agree and so companies started to appoint ch diversity officer right which back then were sort of new and novel most major responsible companies now have somebody who looks after that that area certainly in change and continues to be a leader in that space and so the journey you know took off and there were i remember days early in my career where you didn't have a meeting with without diversity being on the table for socially that sort of turn down a little bit  into the years two thousand and perhaps between two thousand and two thousand and ten the topic if you recall was happening then right we had some economic issues securities severe companies all companies started to right size who had just arrived there all the diverse candidates and then just you know hired and so all of a sudden i think diversity probably took a it took a hit and it probably took a back burner approach right it was no longer the thing that was being to and so here we are in two thousand and seventeen two thousand and eighteen moving into a hard to believe almost twenty twenty right and we're still talking about diversity inclusion we're still looking at numbers that still don't add up where people of color women specifically in say boards of directors and perhaps a little and latinos are absolutely poorly represented relative to the percentages right yeah and so i guess i started to ask myself what's going on why hasn't the needle moved this fight all the attempts despite all the work good work and despite organizations like responding and many others others to hispanic alliance of corporate responsibility has said there's all these organizations who have as one objective latino and women in asia and in the uk all have as their objective this desire to move the needle forward  creating the pipeline creating the pipeline and importantly getting that pipeline accepted into major corporations at leadership positions that he didn't board positions right but the needle hasn't moved as dramatically in some cases there are bright stars yes right there are companies that lead the way and and should be applauded for their efforts absolutely but more than they should be applauded for their efforts karen they are benefiting from the result because the data are clear clear and so it blows me away is that despite that yes we don't get there and so the question is why not yeah why aren't we moving beautiful so why aren't we and that's the question that i think now organizations like guy whose mission is is really to and bold and able latino professionals to reach their full educational social and economic potential you know  be bold and but there are other organizations doing the same thing and there's even one now focusing which i'm privileged to be a part of the latino corporate directors association we're focusing on getting more latino talent executive latino talent ready to go and identified to be so that when boards of directors are looking for the next candidate they don't scratch their head and say well we just can't find the right because that's what they say absolutely that's what they say they talking about corporations leadership and boards perhaps are not being inclusive enough and they need to hold the mirror up to themselves and say are we trying hard enough right right the h r director of the h r v p can't be the only person in the organization that is asking is that slate of candidates and i'm looking diverse enough right don't tell me you can't find them read schools that you go to great what companies that you go to where did you go searching great because if you say you can't find a diverse candidate today you're simply not trying hard and i agree i agree with all of the social media linked in right you know facebook and you know there are so many others that you can identify people but also these organizations i know for a fact that the national black m b a sociate it's got to be approaching almost forty years and factor celebrating yet a big milestone this year thirty years right so so that is you know thirty and forty years of executives matriculating through not only their corporate experience correct but also the education that is offered through these programs right and many colleges and universities have also partnered with these organisations to take students who are still in school and get them prepared through case studies in other it's of competition so that they're ready to go so i agree with you they're not that they can't be found oh there they are there and they're ready and like you said there's no pipeline of them i think again data beans published i think spencer stuart just published a paper recently that talked about and i'll use women representation specifically where it's it's a fraction of the number that it should be right now the good news is and i just attend event in new york where i heard from some experts about the trends and what's going on with with with the appointments that are being made to corporate boards of directors and the trend is encouraging but if it continued at the pace that it's going no it would be twenty fifty before there was parity is now dead doesn't make sense to to have to wait so what can we do what must we do to accelerate that happening right and i do think that despite the little we seem to have had in two thousand and twenty ten and maybe even now i think the dynamics seem to be building again and i think the organizations are once again recognizing the value of the need the imperative embracing this moving past the awareness stages and knowing because let's face it the next generation is growing up with a whole different set of values relative to diversity that where he did and rate and so forth group i feel like i've got a phenomenal opportunity right because whereas in bigger companies that i was running before like it and so healthcare i had you know under my responsibility over four thousand employees and yes i certainly feel like it impact culture at a fundamental level and i certainly could take a interest and i think this is what leaders must do where where you say am i championing diversity the way i should and my promoting women  at you know at the rate that i should be promoting going to my offering them the same up activity and perhaps even more so right am i am i making sure that the slates are are not just diverse but that i'm really pushing my team to say make sure and it's not because it's just the right thing to do it's because the diversity of thought that comes with that in a room increases productivity increase productivity revenues or group i certainly am hoping that i can impact that as well right  i was just at a holiday party some weeks back at the end of one of our company meetings actually two of them went to california and one in new england in the boston area when i looked at that audience and her group i saw you know millennium goals very very talented passionate younger people in their career and first i felt like i can't believe i'm a senior citizen in this room because i'm not that all the way but then i thought i looked at the room and it was you know lots of young energetic passionate men and women right people from india people who are white people and i thought ok this is a lot more diverse right than it was when i was their age right so i was encouraged by that that's wonderful but i was also encouraged by the fact that i can make sure that that externally exact continues and there's where i think leaders may now be living up to what they should be doing and where you know since i write about legacy leadership make that a part of your legacy absolutely make make a part of your legacy be that you're known as a champion of diverse candidates and people and then you can point proudly to a number of people who would say yeah tony help my career along and develop me and make sure that that slate represents not just people who look like you and sound like you  but perhaps people who don't look like you don't sound like you don't think like you already if that's a slate of people i think that's a good legacy to have no i agree and i think there are many many more organizations you was thinking of korn ferry i was thinking of catalyst short which focuses on women in talk about women in leadership and women in boards so there are a number of organisations that are doing research here in new jersey there's the executive women of new jersey they work with you see who does a study of new jersey based companies that have women on their boards at least two or three and actually new jersey myself and i certainly don't want to be the first thing that people say whilst he's a successful latino man that's not what i want to say right right i don't think anybody who is a person of color or woman wants to be identified first and foremost with that yes label right i think that i i want people to say this is a successful business leader who put others first lift try to live to the traits and skills of a leader that he you know writes and talks about has a track record of success oh by the way he's had a few failures and here they are from which he learned and he moved on so that's what i wanted to say right and and the fact that i'm l and the fact that i was raised in puerto rico and that spanish is my first language is part of who i am and makes me who i am and if that benefits the companies that i've been with which it does it has because for example i speak spanish well in almost any company that does business outside the u s speaking spanish is a good thing absolutely or any foreign language for that matter particular spanish which covers you know all of latin american a lot so europe so you could having that extra skill and having the upbringing that i did that i did which makes me think different than my white counterpart or my african american counterpart is a value to the company absolutely right so i don't want them to say he's a latino leader i want to say he's he's a leader oh isn't it great that he's got the latino background which gives absolutely and i think most of us who are people persons of color would would say don't don't start with the divorce you're describing right but but but embrace it recognize it and promote it because unless that's really what individuals are looking for i wanted to kind of turn the conversation to see what do you think organisations should be doing you know we talked about rightsizing and you know the numbers we think are down in some respects millennial zur coming and they've grown up with more diversity than perhaps you and i did we kind of came through where people were integrating yeah yeah now they've come up and they're for the most part great kid and not only are they integrated here in the u s but they also are use to other cultures yes even if they haven't left right because the technology is so powerful that they can experience other cultures the connectivity between cultures sure is so much stronger it's kind of built into what i call twenty first century cultural competency yeah you know these youth are coming up and they know what's going on here in india and pakistan and they know more connected much more connected so how do you think organizations can leverage that diversity i think you hit right they have to have that are part of the dynamics unfortunately however they have grown up in a very different environment and a much more global environment and many cases they've traveled significantly more than you probably you and i probably did when we were their age right level of when i look at a resume and i talk to you know an m b a recruit out of whatever school and you know they've been hiking in the himalayas or they've you know they've done all the stuff yeah they have right and it's part of it's part of their make up right and the social media aspects of it in the whole globe ballot healed their thinking is certainly broader than you and i probably had at the same stage in life so you ask what can companies do about that embrace that  right i heard from one of my partners and it's a rip we were talking about the young audience that i mentioned that we have in this company because we do have a relatively young group of people and i said man a lot of energy that we have to channel and a lot of energy that we have to sort of you know get them on the right track and also the thing and then he said to me and it was a great correction to me says a lot of young energy that we can learn from and i thought well here i love me enough for get that so the answer that i have for your question about what can companies and what should companies do is we get all this talent and you try to put it into the bucket of what your company is and how you do work and all that sort of thing make sure you're not constricting them in that bucket right that you're really taking all this it's almost like learning from your what do they have what how are they thinking and how might i modify my thinking now doesn't mean that all of a sudden you know you've got everything every company needs to have you know unlimited p t o and all the right thing read seem to be the millennial thing of doing but by all means stay alert and open to what they have to teach if nothing else the way they view the world yes right back there i have a grandbaby now maddy and she's in the discovery phases right she's  eighteen months old and so she's everything is new that leaves a new then he has everything is new some watching and i'm observing and i'm saying she's she's learning everything new from the first time and if we as adults and we as leaders can scan remain open to learning from the first time being able to see that and see it through the lens of a millennial or from an yeah and so i was just reminded of that myself why when you're right i see not just what i can teach them yes they're teaching what they can teach me absolutely and so i'm always trying to stay a little bit alert to that listen more carefully yeah and not just go immediately into fatherly mode right right and so big companies led now by people hate to say it my generation our generation right let's not stay stubborn must not make the same mistakes of perhaps the previous generation made right and think well we got here now we know it all now follow me it's we got here now we got here because we're smart and we can learn and modify and that keep doing that yeah exactly well you've also introduced another dynamic which is part of diversity and inclusion the intergenerational workforce and you might have five generations right you have the great generation you have the the boomers yeah you have the x or the wires and now the millennial right and each coming with their own set of notions and backgrounds like what they don't what they don't like their opinions and learning to leverage and work together because each has  something that they can contribute not only to the organization but to one another and leveraging that can be very very powerful for innovation for productivity for product let me  your specific example that highlighted that for me it has so health care company i was with just before i joined his or it was a very international very global company in fact at one point my  direct staff composed of amazing people vice president level and director level people men and women at one point the only person who reported to me who was in the same location that i was at was one morning joslin peterson only person who reported to me other than my my terrific admin brenda they were the only two people everybody else who was on that team all reported and lived in different parts of the world while every time we had a conference call it was inconvenient for somebody who's there were even the west coast all the way in japan right literally right the other dynamic besides that was a language not everybody english was a first language in many cases it wasn't  so what i had to learn to do which was not easy for a guy like me listen really carefully through the accents and realize that while they say they're struggling to say what they want to right right and there's another thing that companies can do is say teach people how to leverage their city yes don't just say leverage it right then you say embrace it right teach them how yeah give them those simple miss right yeah ok when somebody speaking with an accent make sure you understand what they're saying and if you don't pause and ask why we tend to speak a little bit fast absolutely particularly puerto rican tend to go a little faster i had to learn and have to be reminded often by my colleagues when you're speaking slowly then all right because we love to hear what you're saying but we can't you give up right and when they hear it they have to translate it absolutely and then understand it right absolutely these this is where companies are think need to start moving from just making me aware of the versity and encouraging me to adopt it yeah but actually enabling me and teach me how to effectively yeah and i think that is so very powerful we're going to leave on that note perfect as i think that's really what that's that's what companies need to do