the fight for legalization of marijuana has never been easy and it's still not as evidenced by the recent collapse of a months long effort in new jersey and the battle still raging in new york a key issue in both is how do we ensure that legalizing of cannabis doesn't just make for another privatized corporate monopoly but instead repairs the harm that's been done by the war on drugs legalizing cannabis repairing the economy grass marijuana cannabis call it what you will it's recreational use is already legal in ten states with many more soon to follow among other things that means big bucks are at stake here in new york where governor cuomo is now pushing the democratic controlled legislature to move forward on legislation the market is estimated at more than three billion with a b dollars new york city alone could realize more than three hundred million dollars in taxes on top of an additional four hundred million for the state but who will benefit from this windfall will legislation legalization lead to corporate control and profit for a few or can we seize the opportunity to create a more equitable economy and even provide reparations to those largely black and brown people who were previously criminalized by the war on drugs here to help us avoid getting lost in the weeds three campaigns and board member of the green worker cooperative and mary pryor no pun co founder of can occlusive created to facilitate fair representation of minority cannabis consumers well all i think we we have to work on what i write so the latest news as we are recording this is that african american legislators at the state level here in new york are threatening to block legalisation because they're not getting what they want because find out what's going on them why and could they actually block governor cuomo legislation getting this in the budget what comes next yeah i think what you are seeing right now is that it's actually been advocates and communities of color really telling their legislators this is what we need for this to move forward that we can't go to a place where we legalize recreational or adult use for marijuana and then get to a place where communities that have the most impacted don't have access to being a part of the business and we have to get to a place where if everyone's acknowledging that marijuana criminalization was bad for communities then they need to reinvest in those same community and let's not be euphemistic here i mean they say that four times as many african americans got arrested and i think it cost aerated or at least prosecuted for marijuana use even though use is almost the same in every yeah i think the but the biggest thing about talking about this particular issue is that oftentimes people make light they make puns but what has happened has had real consequences on communities of color in particular cell black and latino new yorkers were getting arrested more than everyone else even though data consistently shows that white people are using and  at the same rates and it's not just people getting arrested it's people getting kicked out of their homes people being deported people losing custody of their kids people not being able to pass background checks for jobs people being on the state central registry until ten years after our last kid turns twenty eight so like these are the consequences that have happened and so rightly so communities of color are demanding that the government can't come to the table and say we have decided that we did this wrong and now we're just going to move forward you actually have to address all the things that happened to us and this money that is forward should be a part of that equation all the money has stark sort of precedence for a situation like this and i'm thinking post prohibition legalize our goal and suddenly you have white drug you know little stores exploiting low income communities i don't know if we have any models well i mean honestly there's models that haven't really been formed within the current cannabis situation in the united states al for nicola yeah i mean car audio there is no community reinvestment part of any tax or legislative break out of anything that's happened in terms of cannabis only type of item that you've seen come across in different states in different cities and me to getting it sealed so the record will still appeal if you do a background check and it'll show up but it will be a sealed record you won't be able to see what the exact charges that's what new york allows itself to be able to do with a good work for you or against you if people have no idea what the record to be honest with you against you we already judge the formerly incarcerated at me by the who has a record on there and i don't any way in terms of a job right so there's that as an issue secondly there's not really a real understanding as to we're talking about models out of work community  billion that's been generated in tax revenue none of that has gone to communities affected by the war on drugs california doesn't have that provision as well massachusetts doesn't have that michigan doesn't have that there is no equity program that started day one with this and as expungement that's all fine but what's the release plan for those that are currently in prison will they be able to get out with it be able to have access to job training without job training lead to pathways in the industry none of that has been segment color which i live in washington heights one of the highest community one of the communities with the highest incarceration rates for my rwanda and i think about all the people in my neighborhood or the other young people that i know on and on boats that i know they have been impacted by this unfair war on drugs and if they wanted to enter into the market one they because of the these past the rest of them are going to qualify for a loan from any bank they're not going to have the background or the education and training to start their own business and they're in the barriers to and entry to enter into this market is so heavy and so hard the work of quarks is a solution because it allows people to pool their resources together create their own by laws and be able to govern for themselves and they can choose to hire formally cross r people because as opposed to the workers on who gets to work and manage and own and operate that business so the bad news is there's no great model out there the good news is new york gets to be a great model that's right new york gets to get this right because new york was the first one of the first states to realize that we shouldn't criminalize marijuana in the first place in one nine hundred seventy seven we decriminalize marijuana ahead of all the other states a lot of the other states in the country and so the ideal thing for us was would be three things for us and we are all a part of a statewide coalition called stars like new york which is really addressing all the collateral consequences so not just focusing solely on sealing records but also dealing with the child welfare the immigration the housing the employment issues that are at stake so that includes feeling vacating whatever the record is and then also dealing with all the other collateral consequences to we need to earmark the money that comes out of that is generated here for communities most impacted there's a very clear map of which community should have access to those funds because there's a clear map of which communities were criminalized for the substance and those communities should have access and the decision making power to what they want their communities to have based on this funding and then through this conversation around equity is how do we make sure that this market that we create is not overrun by out of state heavily capitalized people coming into space how do we position small business owners and farmers in new york so also be a part of well how do we i mean we just did a story on this show about urban agriculture and you've already got local farms doing local production many of them co ops up against huge industrial yorkers and it stays in new york so there are taxes more taxes are generated by new york as if these in new york state so this reinvested for the money stays in the community and in so we're able to continue to reinvest back into our because co op owners a group of owners don't tend to flip the exactly outside and they don't and they don't put the money in offer funds mary and just to be even more direct about this new york has to get this right so there are several major states really just waiting to see what we do pennsylvania florida a lot of the amendments that are happening in michigan right now michigan just made its aura board which is the the licensing and entire provisioning of just creating what those regulations look like there are a lot of states that have just elected to even go recreational that don't even have the frameworks and push it new york is a conversation in a lot of different state houses across this nation so we're talking about new york getting this right and why it's important this will be the domino that sets off the trigger for anyone else to adopt any type of policy shaping the creation of adult use and making it a fair and equitable space for everybody to have a chance so that's why this is a very important matter and all eyes are essentially on us right now one thing we haven't mentioned is we're talking state change and we'll talk more about it but there's also the federal backdrop and you've got sort of book has a marijuana justice act that he's put forward he's running for president or wot of other potential presidential candidates of people that are running in the primary have signed on to bookers plan what's the role of federal here and is there any likelihood that we could see any movements well for a federal level when it comes to banking and finance there's already been conversation in the house and bills being created to talk about removing the provision of to eighty which is on a schedule one drug there's a forty to seventy percent tax on profit from what you receive within a cannabis implant touching business so for example there are people that have to make payments of like one million to even fifteen million all cash to the i r s you cannot put it in a bank you cannot put in any type of i don't know i'll just reach into my own pocket here you can go into your stock and you know so that's a big hinderance for a lot of folks in this business especially if you do have a cooperate specially if you are a small business and big businesses you know they have to make that pay and it even shutters a lot of places that could be changed at the federal level it's banking legislation that's fed to chill for this year yes however new york key state and a lot of what happens if even think about it a lot of the top people that are noticed you know see schumer and gillibrand their new yorkers these are people that are mentioned in our news funnel almost every day from the federal level so a lot of these looking jeffries a lot of these people are in d c so new york is a state that's being waged so much because it brings in so much capital and so much money into the entire nation in general so what happens here upon federal maybe twenty twenty maybe twenty twenty one but people are starting to use this as a way to run and promote federal decriminalization and to make it federally lynnette right now when we think about the marijuana justice act it is so much of it is shaping the conversation and the debate of what cannabis regulation leads to look like and so when you see senator booker really having conversations about you know people can talk about legalizing it but we can't legalize it without expunging it we can't legalize it legalize it without restored of justice or reinvestment and he's really taking the tenants that are very clearly anchored in new york and bringing it to a federal level and forcing the debate to address that well let's talk about that because what we're really what i'm really hearing from you is thing where we want to do legislation that's a whole lot more than legislation that in fact this is an opportunity to model a kind of planning a kind of commitment to reparations i want to say  we haven't seen in years i think this conversation around cannabis regulation calls to question a lot of societal economic issues right and a lot of what we have invested in and around criminalization this conversation around  moving to a place where we're removing something away as a tool of criminalization the conversation is what do we put in it put in its place not just by we are no longer criminalizing these people but this this activity that was made a licit was also an economic engine an economically underpinning for communities that have been shut out of traditional markets right and so if we're taking that away as well that's a destabilizing force so this question that is being called is a larger societal issue and so it's less about a big role for government and more about like how do we actually want to create sustainable economies that are not built on the capture and criminalization of communities of color i mean it's not too much if you read angela davis if you read michelle alexander reconstruction that we might get right do better is that going too far i'll say this year a couple stats that make about west than six percent of businesses are owned by black people of color  individuals and so are the plant touching business in cannabis the amount of women that own businesses and cannabis has dropped from being in thirty thirty thirty three percent in twenty fifteen to now twenty five percent around this year and women of color just women so we don't even know the numbers a moment ago well first of all when you talk about single digits lexan six percent of all businesses are owned by black people of color so that includes women as well women in general black women receive less than point zero two percent of established funding and capital within startups just science cannabis removed so it's not like there's a level playing field at all there's no level playing field here big can of this runs essentially the industry in the united states small businesses every day citizens do not have a real chance of being able to enter this industry unless they're aware of the capital items that hinder everyone essentially so this isn't again just a matter of yes the system in this seems to be repaired at this it's a be restored if this needs to focus on investment this is a focus on decriminalizing the plant but as far as business this affects the economy for people to be able to even like generate and pull into and given to attack again it is requiring us to do some planning around the economy that right you've had decades of saying we don't plan the economy not socialist one of the think one of the interesting things one of the best things that we can hope for to come out of this is that once we if we even get a portion of what we get in passing legalizing cannabis it sets a model for all types of other businesses to also have the same type of principles to include more people of color to include more women to have to hand have more access to finance and capital in the economy so we're not just fighting for cannabis legalization of social equity we're basically fighting for an equitable feel so that everybody gets to eat from the food that they raise and i think the conversation is it's a big one right it's like how do we want to create an economy and the thing is it's really important to say that legalizing cannabis is not going to cure the ills of capitalism relies on cannabis is not going to end racism this is one way to reduce the harms of structures that are harming communities right but we can't put on huge ideas on this substance and think that it will save all societal ills but but it means that we have the more space to be innovative to do different things so how do we shift this pitcher and i know mary are but well everyone of the table is involved in this as you said we came into the story knowing that the context in which this conversation has been happening has been mostly about jokes about people getting h h you're saying this conversation is actually about how do we structure our economy it's interesting space for a drug policy alliance to be in because we are coming to this issue as a criminal justice issue a social justice issue but in our work we are now creating space for an industry and so how do we make sure that whatever space we've created does not continue to exploit the communities that we're fighting and well i'm all in favor of talking about the economy i'm just asking how do we shift the the imaging or the  foundation of america i was one of fifty sixty thirty twenty people that represented anybody that was considered black or person of color so the rooms i was in was pretty much filled with people that were considered either white or jewish or ethnic european to say that you know what we think about what planet use is is racist ignore ties and stereotyped off jump that's due to the fact that we have the drug war which started with nixon were mostly it was a way to criminalize bracken brown folks as a way to like you know create an imbalance in the fact that civil rights allow for people to actually have a potential chance in this economy so they created the drug war putting drugs into communities there's that and then in one thousand nine hundred seventy s making the plane illegal that was a material science and racism issue again due to the influx of mexican immigrants coming into the country and the racialized propaganda created around reefer madness where people would say that black and brown bodies were going to rape white women so i just say all of that to say we can't ignore that all of this in terms of why things are prohibited or due to rebury stigmatized ill not factual identities or any ideas of what people are actually doing with the plant it was a medicine it was used in all types of pharmacy items back in the eight hundred seventy nine hundred and one thousand nine hundred so there's that existence what we've lost and what we're just even trying to do it can a cool this just show that every day people that look like me that work like you consume this planet this isn't an item that should be scoped and fear are wrapped in stereotype and because we've allowed that to happen for almost a hundred years it's an anointing that everybody has to do what it can't be though is this white washed prints in taishan nobody that is of color using the plant words just like wilson white women that get to like drink tea and laugh about it with their kids and go to soccer practice when we know that's not a look around from one direction didn't work to try to tell people that affirmative action was not about black people yeah it did not work so this won't work either but also i think i think when you ask about the narrative the narrative is already shifting right right you are already seeing people like that the how you started the segment which is like black elected officials are saying we will block this if this is an average for this doesn't benefit our community that is the conversation where our conversation is being shifted to this conversation where everyone is like we can't spend decades criminalizing communities then learn how to profit off this particular behavior and then leave that community out everyone is having that conversation they're having at the federal legislation on stage which is why you see the marijuana justice act being framed that way having senator cory booker talking about that alexandra steele cortez's talking about it everyone the framing of the conversation is shifting you have governor saying we have to do this in a way that does not enrich corporations and actually empowers more communities so if you go back to where we began about what this looks like if we get it right in terms of opportunity what people can do  would be able to do do you want to address that one the one of co ops in this cannabis bill is still being discussed because it's like it's need to the legislator i mean there are a lot of people who are now in office we're doing a lot of teaching in education about how in the most known as the ox local co op like everybody understands that and they in so we could be is that we can have less in new york city we could have produced that we get we go to a farm and we get if produced by a farm co op that we now process it in new york and then sell it at a store from new york city and all of those a worker owners and all those profits gets distributed amongst them they get to decide like what are we going to do with the property they pay their taxes then i want to also important things about corpses that we have a principle seven that we have to also give back directly back into the community we have to use our profits to continue so we can continue in doing education programs or we can do music programs or whatever or coding schools or but it's so the ideal world this is that the cannabis legalization everybody is working in some sort of cooperative in my dream contributing making money and bringing dream world back into the community and i just want to also just touch on the fact that the dialogue is not just happening and once a legislator there's tons of community forums happening or throughout new york state and people should really look them up and go to those needs to really find out what's going on and talk directly to the people who are involved in this campaign so marion cosigner if we have a story if we get this right what's the story that we tell the future about what happened in this moment what do you tell someone fifty years from now we do fifty years from now if we get this right i think we say we did not shy away from the role that race played in the in where we were starting from that we actually centered people that were most harmed by criminalization so people have been arrested for marijuana and people have lost their kids people that have been deported and we built the legislation and the conversation around those things and educated the legislators to buy in to what was important so that people could remember that it was people that we were fighting for as opposed to profit i would say that we can say that we were the first of actually formulate a pathway right that that hasn't happened globally or nationwide right pathway is the biggest thing that people need across the board to be able to even tap into the wealth that is in cannabis and it's a big it's very very big and i'd like to add t this this was done by people based evidence by actual communications not reports and studies that are now mostly are biased against us and are usually extract information to be used a manipulator in their own particular way so that it was really people cent community centered coming from our experts the community so that that's something that's i think is unique there the people are informed this you have here that future you're in good hands welcome people to right now to make this a reality one of the ways that folks who plug in is by following organizations that are doing this work so for example drug policy alliance has been working across the country really trying to figure out how do we push ballot initiatives or push legislation and so but in new york if people want to get involved we're all a part of a coalition called start smart new york and folks can go to that website as smart dash and wired dot org and sign up as an individual you'll get updates if you have are connected to an organization you can also be a part of our coalition build but a mediately people can join us in albany we're doing weekly visits to elected officials call your suddenly members in your senators and tell them you want marijuana justice now all right thank you all it's great talking with you we will continue this conversation and make that future that you mentioned real you watching the laura flanders show legalizing cannabis isn't a silver bullet but it does present a unique a much needed opportunity to create equity and economic justice and  opportunity to restore communities most harmed by the war on drugs one hopes conversations like this will open the door to broader conversations about barriers to access lack of resources capital land redlining