evolution why this particular subject and why this book well this book has such deep meaning and significance for me it actually began twenty five years ago when i was in a hot tub with kenny loggins and he was giving me an idea he planted the seed for this book because at the time he was married to this wife julia they were deeply in love and he was just in this deep love and so this idea photographing couples that are deeply in love and getting beautiful intimate photographs and then what i brought to it as it evolved was deep interviews with each couple and the interest is far beyond what i could have imagined twenty years is it possible that you got into their lives easily it was a difficult process to get that you didn't see that you  love zone so i would be putting it out i had display a book and i bought it art supply store and i would literally be cutting and pasting people's pictures as i went along and some of their text and i prodded with me everywhere i went so so it was really like my bible and i was so enthusiastic and my heart was just so deeply intimate that everyone i spoke with the perfect people gave me the perfect referrals so if i was looking for an older couple that had been together most of their lifetime then someone says you know i know this couple carly walter in hawaii and they're just an extraordinary couple they've been together they were refugees from germany and  during the war and they have been through a lot and they had such a deep regard for each other and for gratitude for being alive and for all their children and so every couple came to me from the perfect resources and the perfect timing and i really went for a lot of diversity as as i kept moving with it gain more momentum and i realized i wanted to get as much diversity as i can represent as many people so that is so that the readers can have as great identification as possible with yes and and that's what happened you know it was presented to the perfect young people the perfect people that repression and couples that were pregnant a young blossoming love couple that actually moved apart split apart but but learned how to have cultivate a deep loving connection and friendship with each other so some specifics that i am fascinated by the older people that you photograph and certain things that's happening for me to be older i wonder as a photographer do you see this i think it's a really important question and topic because you know our culture i'll start by pressing i think that in our culture we're so indoctrinated especially in the west to thinking that as we age we need to look young or we need to have the perfect bodies and and that's another thing that i really learned more from working on this book was seeing the absolute beauty in bodies as we age and and  because love transcends form right you know love really goes beyond form and if you were really devoted to somebody let's say you get married you know a year together from the time you're young and you've got these beautiful you know striking baden's you know the likelihood of them looking like that in forty fifty years it's pretty unlikely so so i think it's it's it's really important that we learn how to see the beauty as we age and i'm not perfect with it you know i mean it's just it's so it's not easy to not get be influenced by all of the i'll call propaganda or have touched you know i think it is propaganda propaganda for advertising in one form or another for you know what keeping yourself looking young or thinking that you need to look young so you buy products or you do whatever you need to do and and the truth is that this is what i found is that the more that i'm with people and photograph people that are aging or that are perhaps quite old even in their eighty's and ninety's being able to see and really truly authentically experienced the beauty of the lines and the age and the wisdom and the maturity that life has brought them you know and so i believe that when we see lines on somebody and i i apply this to myself all the time that those are wisdom lines you know those are wisdom tributaries you know to go to the courses and the paths and hopefully the great  photograph is one that creates transformation so in some ways looking at your older images i found them very fueling for me personally so let's talk a little bit more about what's in your book yeah you wait your wife by the way yeah yeah there's a there's a picture of us at the very end it's the lightning it's the last image and it's one shot in the late ninety's when i was heavily involved with photographing us and carla the woman of the oldest couple i was just talking about she's a photographer she wants and she wanted to take pictures of us so that picture where we're embracing i call it the hair shot because we both have a lot of hair going on  every couple there's a couples in the book and everyone when i think about them they i i feel like they all have such great wisdom and what they share because each couple share some such of vulnerable place and before i get into specifics i'll talk about one theme that i would say is coherent if if you were to ask me like what would be the most coherent theme that that we has its way throughout this book and  each couple is sharing and portraying in their pictures i would say it is one of trust and how do we how do we anchor more deeply within ourselves and with our partner in deeper trust and then what does that mean how does that ripple out into a growing evolving conscious partnership so there are so many layers to that and you know i could talk for hours just about that scene because it really leaves its way through every single couple's interview but one i would say one common thing that everybody shares about trust is that it's an inside job right we need to learn how to trust within ourselves first to be trusting within our own inner guidance with our own inner listening with our own inner sense about who we are and and that we get we need to do our own inner work so that we can meet somebody and meet them in that deeper place of trust so that when we do get scared because i don't know anyone in a relationship that has not gotten scared that when we do get scared that we will choose to hopefully sooner or later come around and be willing to open up and learn how to be vulnerable and learn how to have enough trust within ourselves so that we can share our innermost fears our innermost concerns all of that with our partner and allow them the loving trusting space for them to be able to share with us as well and that's that's what i see continues to cultivate deeper and since you break up one of the biggest professional questions in your field that i can ask and that is those couples have tranced but how do you gain their trust me letting the third person into the equation isn't easy yeah yeah you know i i when i was with each couple and even when i came back many years later and did the two male cup on the female couple the same thing apply i would walk in i would prepare in such a way meaning that i would i would greet them and who they are and honoring who they are and their relationship with such a deep level of respect like i'm going into one of the holiest of temples holiest experience and i do sense that that energy transmits when when we are so anchored in that level of on uring and being with a person and just cultivating that  see you know like an avatar you know i see you and when somebody add i do believe that when someone genuinely feels like they are seen by you then they are so much more easily willing to open and feel safe and  not let you in because they know they trust your intention and i think all these couples really deeply god and they really trusted my intention and and of course it didn't hurt in the beginning when i was when i was first starting to photograph some of the initial couples it didn't hurt to have the endorsement of kenny loggins two well known figure to help give it some immediate sort of credibility at that point that that's extraordinary when they talk about your process you have photographed some of the most important people i had the dalai lama tim robbins i could keep going and let's let's talk about some of them for example ok census dialogues put on by association for global methought and all these visionaries were coming from around the world to really dialogue with him about new paradigms for peace for the new millennium and being in his presence and some of the time it was quite close and quite intimate it it really changed my life because i got to witness how one hundred percent present and authentic he was with every single person that he was with anyone that was standing up and having dialogue with him he never lost eye contact unless he was looking over to ask his interpreter something and he was just completely honoring and the first time that i met him when he was come walking up  on the first day of the conference to he sees me on the side of the path i'm taking pictures and he comes up to me and he greeted me like he knew me like i was this long lost friend that you haven't seen in ages and he comes out of the path  so that was like reading that was my first experience with him and and it truly did open me in a certain way where it showed me how a possibility how we can be how we that naming names because every photographer is also gifted by difficult shoot so can you think on a very difficult subject without necessarily revealing oh i can i can say th because i talked about it in one of my talks to him because it was i look back at it and it's funny you know i was james brown and i was doing an album cover for him and first off he before he drives up in a motor the moon and you have you have saturn and all these other planets in the background of the whole point was that it looks like he's doing his moves on the moon and in that in the middle of the universe because the name of the out was called universal james that was his concept he wanted to be the center of the universe right so i put on his music in my in my mind i'm thinking ok i'm just going to have him do his moves while while i'm shooting you know put his songs on  influence on the beatles growing up had such a huge influence on me i would say that they were like my older brothers they felt like you know where where i stay represented when i was a kid because they they hit the scene in sixty four and i was nine years old so really and i was getting into music for that so from the time that they hit the scene it's like i grew up with him and i felt like as they evolved i was growing you know so by the time that i became a teenager they were doing much more sophisticated music and and george harrison was writing these spiritual songs that that really influenced me as well i don't think i realized it so much when i was fourteen but later i really did you know some of them were more obvious like my sweet lord but but a lot of his songs were extremely spiritual and about the oneness and the connection it seems so so books he both harrison a mccartney i had the opportunity to be with in the photographs and and it was you know i felt like after the dalai lama george harrison paul mccartney that i could just hang up my you know i was like ok those are probably be the top three on my list and those all happened you know in the ninety's so but mccartney i had the opportunity to just spent two days of it while he was doing a video shooting a video at skywalker ranch in northern california they were using industrial light and magic and their special effects so he was flying around and so they wanted me to come in and document production stills but then take them aside and do horror trades as well and so at that time it was all filmed in ninety two so i brought a ton of film with me i shot a lot i still have i mean now this is grace i'm telling you that my my career has been laced with grace because because had this been a album cover or going through a record company they would have it would i be to sign contracts they would have taken everything from me i would have  eye out and i wouldn't have owned or had any of this material they might have given me the rights to to use a few shots for my own publicity but that's it but in this case because it was in the context i was sharing  i didn't sign anything over so i own all this material so i'm able to still share it and you gallery showings you know i can't legally with a well known person you can't create products i lest you get their license it's a licensing thing you know so i don't do that but but i'm so grateful that i've got these gems these images that are so diverse both black and white collar and him and a george harrison as well same same applied for harrison of the photos from that that those shows and as i was saying because he influenced me so deeply spiritually meeting him i had the opportunity to share with he in his life a libya for an hour and all we talked about was spirituality meditation and that was one of the it if someone has asked me if i count on one hand your five most significant impacts on experiences in life that would probably be one of them just because he was such a significant teacher for me but but he would not want to hear that he is so humble and if anything to the degree that he did not want any reference of praise or or or even acknowledgment he would interpret in some way like now a year putting me on a pedestal which you know which i would never that wouldn't be my intention but it but it is interesting because when i was with him we had that our deep connection and then before i left i was thinking in my mind i need to acknowledge him because he's no different than anyone else so i'm not going to not acknowledge him because of a concern that i just shared so i did and i just shared with early ninety's he just so did not want to be associated as being as being different than anybody else he had you know he devoted probably more than music he devoted so many years of the last part of his life in his garden being you know and connecting with the earth and so the reason why they invited me during one of the you know during the show to connect with them is because they sensed that i was sharing a similar spiritual a good knowledge meant and and that they could meet me in this in this place of oneness which was which was so beautiful and so moving to me a tougher question for you obviously you referenced photographs that you had done in the ninety's and you were obviously very good oh you would have got to do the i don't you see more now that you did that asked different from this period as compared to that period of not talking about the subject matter but the way that you see is it is it different yeah absolutely as such a question for us because as i continue to grow in a vault and i think deep and in my level of compassion and presence you know just honor people and honor of this earth i believe that when i'm with people it's more clear it's more obvious that that energy gets transmitted even more now and you know so when i think about all those as i did  one of those ships that we're talking about in my thirty's now it was just a time that was that was the time i was in l a that was the zone i was following my passion and and then later when i went to photographing other luminaries as well  but i wouldn't want to go back to that time meaning that i wouldn't want i'd never want to go back to my twenty's and that was hard but least even that i think i wouldn't want to go back to because i so appreciate the level of the greater awareness that i continue to receive as i mature as i age and that's priceless so so just less struggle more of a recognition honoring what's a fifth and what's not you know that's that's something i continue to learn i've had my business almost forty years and i continue but i always learn because we're always getting that opportunity to see to sort of assess whether it's in a relationship with somebody or about a business situation or any decision you made whether it's a flip you know whether it's an energetic that whether it's a fit on many different levels and i think in my twenty's and definitely in my thirty's i was still a lot of the time trying to make something that necessarily wasn't and and as i mature i just recognize pretty quickly if a person if a situation is is an energetic fair or not and and if it's not you know ok speaking of people being at that and i have a plan because i don't want to blanket the earth to say it's a troubled time but it feels like it's a little bit of a difficult time for many people since you have you are steeped in transformational work and teaching i want to give each guest on the show a chance to reflect on what they might offer up for this time either a solution an idea savation do you have any  thoughts you've written the evolution of love and i think you're a good person to ask this question so what i'd like to see happen is that we all use this time which seems very challenging right now as to be the most affective loving conduits for change the change that we want to see and the greater that we are willing every day to start our days from hapless and open to the possibilities of you know how can i show up and do my own inner work and he the most loving presence and greet people that i feel at first with their situations and discover ways to bring light to the darkness in whatever way that we  can and that i believe is as everybody well everyone that has that consciousness and attention because their attention more then he acts that we take from that place the social acts that we take the loving acts  personal the political all the acts that we take will have the opportunity the built the be the be based in what our intentions and if our attention is one of union and oneness and people recognizing that we need at this time more than ever to see that we're all one that there is that time is that the time is no longer here for division where we were where quickly going and passing beyond that point then you know then we can steal more empowered because we see we can feel like we are touching people in a way that's not just from adversity because because adversity only fuels that person