for the settlement yeah that i do not like it smacks a bit of anti semitism but the jaffa was ation of jerusalem turning jerusalem into israel east jerusalem and israel in ways that no israeli government has done in the past because with all of the criticisms one may have of the previous israeli government left and right we have treated the complexities of jerusalem with a great deal of reverence it is my interpretation of these events that the withdrawal from gaza is being treated by mr sharon as an opportunity to allow israel number one to get a green light from the administration in washington for the cloverleaf rooted wall around jerusalem which we designated borman establishing an israeli spear of influence in greater t to interpret the presidential letter of april of last year in a way that would allow that wall to be aligned and to allow israel to appropriate east jerusalem and to turn the nonviolent state of equilibrium with palestinians with this taking place i believe otherwise and believe this not only to be impossible but so contrary to israeli interests and i'm here is an israeli and as a zionist and not because of my friendship with the palestinians as strong as that might be so strong that it may jeopardize the very viability of israel as a homeland for the jewish because my perspective contrary to mr sharon's is number one that a west bank that is dismembered into a nonviolent equilibrium jerusalem is an enormously stable city it does not deserve its reputation of being nitroglycerine it does deserve a reputation of being a small atomic device it's not every random bump in the road that sets off the city it is critical mass and that what i am describing to you is a change radical in proportions to such an extent that i believe it will destabilize so that's the short and there will be a quarter of a million palestinians who are not members of the world zionist organization on the israeli side of the wall in the drew slim area alone the second dimension is if you believe that the palestinian people a palestinian leadership now or in any time in the foreseeable future ten twenty years from now or world public opinion will allow for a dismembered noncontiguous palestinian state to take place well fine i don't believe that that will take that will happen but it may well be that we will build so many facts on the ground a wall goes up can come down the israeli government is correct in saying walls and fences are reversible line those walls with massive settlement in the irreversible reversal becomes irrelevant now if you believe that you can est due time the palestinians will have contiguity by a road or tunnel that would lead from one part of the state to another in the absence of a viable and contiguous palestinian state there's no other solution but there is another consequence and that consequence is the binational consequence it's not a solution it's the permanent balkanization of the  there's a bomb talk in the israeli left by the way among palestinians we've reached the point of no return the two state solution is gone it's no longer possible i don't buy that certainly not in the jerusalem area which i think i know rather well but if of these other neighborhoods in the south are built i believe that the two state solution will be jeopardized to such an extent that there will be no palestinian state but there is no palestinian state there will be no jewish state as well now it is not only the route of the wall that has come to fruition at this time but a number of schemes to line the wall with settlement activity the most prominent of this is will show you the visuals here but in order to describe this imagine the temple mount being the center of the face of a clock led to mean  in the west bank with its approximately thirty thousand residence is the largest settlement in the west bank it's something of a consensus in israel my lead to me will always remain under israeli sovereignty and there has been some palestinian understanding about the necessity of that being the fact the e u one plus one is a scheme if the heart of the temple mount is the center of the face of a clock o'clock watch now strange things have been happening anyone construction began about nine or ten months ago illegally nobody intervened and certainly not the administration here in washington when the matter was brought to the attention to high levels in the administration once again the work proceeded it was only after the washington post exposed this by an op ed by myself and by the reporter in jerusalem that the works were halted in the first week of september of last year since that time but hind the scenes the israeli government has taken action to expedite the statutory planning of the one it has not taken place yet yet in recent weeks perhaps for internal consumption in israel mr sharon and his spokesperson have periodic lee reported that each one is about to take place he one could take place if the statutory planning is completed as soon  as this coming summer when the plans are completed and the lands market now what the government the government response to the united states government response doesn't have to tell  secretary of state after secretary of state president after president over eleven years have told prime minister after prime minister after prime minister each one is a very interesting idea it's so interesting that you might using our superior clout and strength to determine what the borders of israel are regardless very much on the palestinian street there are already people saying album us in is selling jerusalem in order to buy gaza you don't need to be a financial expert to understand the relative value of the stock something arab in islamic stock exchanges of jerusalem and gaza acquits in gaza what the administration has to ok we're going to recognize those realities that need to be agreed upon about existing settlement blocks but that is not a green light to radically change the terrain in the interim we're not abandoning the roadmap to talk about a settlement freeze we're implementing the administration need not invent anything new it has to abide by what it's committed itself to and if it does that i think that we will get through these next months with the two state solution still a life filling that i believe that the decisions that will be levels number one additionally this was intentional today it's it may not be but it's clearly the case the existence of the wall is nowhere compatible with the dignified have been true major terminals and that's it into the city given the pew many pressures that are now going to be eleven checkbooks eleven checkpoints are grossly inadequate in number in planning in scope i do not see this changing in any significant way the human there's going to be a humanitarian disaster now let's put things in perspective humanitarian disaster of janine and  would check the two or three thousand people i said can't be i have a thousand receipts from the bus company the judge says on topics like this you don't argue go check come back next week and tell us how many people you counted twenty three thousand we're only off by an order amount of troops and the army comes in and says we're going to build a checkpoint where thousand people in our will be able to get through but most of those twenty three thousand people going up go in between seven o'clock and nine o'clock in the morning so they're going to be waiting on line for three or four hours so the planning doesn't anticipate so that's one level and i don't see that changing significant i don't believe that israel can possibly achieve by physical means what we're trying to achieve we can accrue limited tactical advantages for a period of time but i don't believe that this is going to create a stable state and it's going to be workable the second dimension that you're pointing to is what this is doing to the holy land ok and when i say holy land i'm speaking to you as a christian but for me as a jew as well jerusalem you know the only industry that has ever succeeded in jerusalem is result and the christian narrative in jerusalem today cannot be lived out i need not tell you that and the muslim narrative cannot as well things that israel the first law that israel passed in hundred sixty seven was the law for the protection of the holy sites to provide universal access not let's not ignore that this is taking place against the backdrop of hundreds of people killed by suicide bombings we're the past four years it may have been a necessary evil let's pray that the evil is dissipating and get rid of the necessity yes when it comes to the i'll use the term barrier i mean wall to th you think it's wall and fence to those of you think it's a fence the route of the barrier is an issue of the following very closely but especially in jerusalem i think a little push for the israeli government to help consider what it is already considering and that this thing doesn't really work and you don't need to be a genius to walk around these jerusalem around the wall over there and look that this doesn't work but there are other alternatives and the most prominent one is what's known as a demographic alternative if you look at my maps and i apologize for being so quick with them it's hard to keep up with dan here sorry what you're seeing here is a proposal by the council for peace and security that goes along demographic lines more similar to what will be the future border if we follow the clint pair meters a says whatever's arab with interest coming up how soon sovereignty and whatever jewish here blue will come and with the original barrier or at least the government's barrier following the municipal boundary of jerusalem effectively cutting off palestinians from palestinians a demographic line  services social services etc but i think this perhaps is more manageable and with one eye looking at permanent status you know could be a good alternative another issue with this is that the internal security apparatus within israel doesn't see you know in really good terms including two hundred thousand palestinians on the israeli side of the barrier simply because  they're not going to love it but it's better i mean when you have to ask him people not all power same people or the same thing and definitely you can point if you have to generalize between move to satellite towns like all wrong around here his mum and others and when we have proof we as israeli policy of created is basically a contiguous make up of blue and orange i d s namely use jerusalemites and true west bankers i d s mixed allowed in this municipal line that was you know only on paper now this municipal line because of the barrier takes hold on the ground effect cutting off the contiguous makeup of palestinian livelihood if you would so allowing that make up to remain in place i think  should be viewed favorably by palestinians politically obviously they can you know encourage surrounding jewish neighborhoods of this through some more large segments in the area you know they can come public and say this is ok but this is definitely much better hug and cutting off is true some from the rest of the west bank we have a family squabble politically i think the line is not terribly different from what we see here there is no unilateral solution by physical means in jerusalem can't be done thirty seven thirty eight years every israeli government tried to create facts on the ground that would make the city inseparable we largely succeeded israelis and palestinians are like siamese twins sharing vital and less vital organs our mood has changed and we're like spoiled brats saying oh my goodness history is storable trends don't turn on a dime they don't have a steering wheel of a b know we created those facts we now are not capable i believe of unilaterally separating out although dan's line in many ways i believe has the air of historical november belief in the framework of an agreement not outside  it so one answer to the answer is that definitely the ability of this line to be sustainable is its ability to allow for relatively free access of is jerusalemites palestinians holding b from east jerusalem where they reside to west europe somewhere some of them probably a significant amount or the the test cases that we have until now and i'll put the government's line back up there are two prominent neighborhoods that have been kept outside of the line in many ways done it here's a sharon's guy for marking the bear did divide jerusalem just a little bit one is up here and let me mark it up for you  enter the cards but their access in and out of the city has been not a success story to say the least and and so that the president or if you would the experience that we have so far with allowing  through some ice to cross from one part of the bear to the other one was not that good but again with a change of strategy and some you know help in maintaining high tech passes perhaps this could be done one last thing and not less important is what exactly does that israeli government envision no matter what route you put down for the other side of the barrier you want to create something new  sustain itself on the other side of the barrier or you don't and especially if you go along the demographic line one proposed by the council for peace and security you definitely need to help create something truly independent on the other side of the barrier maybe i forgot to mention politically obviously this is very explosive this is really dividing jerusalem if you would however through dividing along the graphic lines of falls right in place with permanent