in new york which is part of a broader expanse of public access as if it was around the country but welcome very much and i if i may just say i'm my media door left as an old friend of conversations and the publisher of the book is just now coming out that has been written by by gordon parks and i want to show that now but the publisher of that book is that david thin of the david of the root of can group and david welcome very much like you and i do program and let's let them see right at the outset this is the book th very much to the conversation we're going to want to talk about the book and about mr turner and that sort of thing but i wonder maybe you could you're a legendary figure as it were could you share a little bit now you understand you just celebrated your th birthday  up you think it makes a person stronger having that kind of a base rather than one some people who are successful have a really fit pull tyler that having that solid emotion you know background of a loving family is good equipment good quick if you live was a white teacher good name of this mcclintock who was a class advisor for the black kids and she invited us not to try to go to college but of it was a the scottish poet he knew that i was interested in film and he had saw a picture of mine and he saw a picture in mind of this of the ocean and a rough sea of it with which was you must be talking about  everything how does a thing get translated into because we want to not lose the fact that you were also went into film directing and you directed the learning in reading the book that you had written how does that work would it be like to film we were thinking cinema graphically it for you came to it that way but i'm saying because you've had your hand in photography good in fact i've read german folderol as a writing poetry music film all of these things and you came him i don't want to have to study how to do this thing if i'm really excited about it i'm going to do it you think so yeah yeah he i think that's really important it doesn't know how to read music and i guess his composed you know all this music that's quite wonderful and all these different ideas come to him and he he does marvelous thing sometimes he does things that no one else in the you know i know how much of that that has an educational philosophy behind it and that sort of thing and the most important thing is if you've got somebody who's really motivated in doing what it is they want to do that's a very important part of the human condition i think like in terms of how much do we have to instill in people gauge in your head about how valid it is but i have a delusion that this thing is pretty valid and some people somewhere did a program study of human consciousness and they said they were trying to measure the state of mind whatever good that it's about eighty five percent valid this old system that i'm referring to and they were trying to measure the creative stands or a career aid of an individual being in a creative state of mind or something and then they tried to date it they tried to have a test that made it chronologically that is at what age is that it and that in cross culture across the world it went and it peaked at about five and then from there on for the mass it just went down like that you know we end up like us but that creative stand that able that curiosity that created sense in that in thrall like that's important isn't that something that's really important terms of what education is about rather than a lot of different pieces of facts and so forth and set up graduate schools to get everybody so specialized out into a very small subject that the never think about everything become a threat but he you know he had that kind of a and that it's a big question of how people are going to live it but the idea of having a life where you're engaged yourself in terms of your artistic you're given sense of is it is there only a few or do you think is it only the few that are gifted human beings or i just saw my grandchildren this week and i swear called the sun stalker and it's recommended highly it's about the painter turner and the life story and the autobiography is incredible to him to something that is what a life what an interesting life maybe they make a film of it giant figure in terms of american world culture gordon parks i pleasure we're coming back next week gordon once again thank you really very much for coming it's great pleasure thank you ok until next week