dear dear dear dear dear dear day doing a dear old friend of mine that's needed a renfrew she's rolling on to much of new york city go population as being a person who really he's track of things very carefully she is here to talk about the situation in central park and i'm here to explain to you she's a friend who lives right near central park on th avenue and if i understand i want to check with you  knowing my hand on your hand and your hand she's a lover of nature and so forth and she's got some issues to take up about some thoughts about how we treat new york city needed so good to see it's good to see we haven't done  enough so good to see you welcome back to and then thank you well you're looking great girl now tell me about what are we going to be talking about central park and the people who want to change it well it's not just central park it's all new york city new york ok the parks department is going to pass they've said they're going to pass a rule which didn't go up for a vote with congressional office or the city council or anything they just you know said they were having putting up this rule and it has to be okayed by mayor de blasio as legal department but he said he supports it and he's going to pass it he also said we're not going to enforce prohibit feeding all birds and squirrels and all new york city parks right right right right now the parks department is saying that the reason they want to prohibit it is because when a lot of people feed  that is not appropriate to the animals to these animals and we're animals too yeah ok and they also say that it brings rats but you know and a bunch of other stuff and they say people can go out and look at the birds they don't have to feed them well you know and some of the parks there isn't enough food yeah right for them especially in the winter yeah i mean you could actually you could make them sit in central park there you know there are a lot of trees and so on and a lot of plants although there's also a lot of lawn there's more and more lawn and central park and they're cutting down a lot of trees and they and they they take up all of the dead leaders cutting a tree they're going to go down every tree you know because they're making more pathways for the tourists ok i'm trying to get it values that they're trying to dispose of so you know they are and they take up all of the dead leaves from the lawns you know in the fall and that's where the have a congregation i have a birds and squirrels right there i know you actually and i know these birds and squirrels and i've known them for you know the truth i know them personal yooper and they don't know i hated certifiably been there with her i can see those birds they want to assure part of nature's batter i mean you know just like we have you know it's like so you know it's when i go out there it's a communion of pure love which is what true prayer is what kind of life forms good parts of it were created that were meant to rick recall being and pristine nature whatever pristine nature is and the appalachian but in those parts of the park like the north woods and the ramble they're putting all these new pathways for tourists and they're putting up fences all over the place and and what's happening is that you know we're being overrun by tourists and too we taxpayers for you know for many years have been paying for these parks for our enjoyment we never we never planned to spend our tax money to for the enjoyment of bringing in hordes of tourists and supposedly for our enjoyment you know what's interesting about about you know birds have traditionally been messengers from god from the underworld from the other world from this virtual world with indigenous societies and christianity  that like with pets that were there on their terms you know they there's some people who don't like that and they don't like that they decided to come to us and not to come good now morningstar you will think persons are better than birds most people promoted on one of your other shows was the myth of human supremacy by eric jensen yes derrick johnson is a philosopher and i think he's one of the most important people right now in the world when the most important thinkers and i subscribe to n culture itself that's destroying the planet it's the overpopulation it's the technology for the enemy and the enemy is all the enemies s exactly i mean all of these buildings and everything you know sake it's the whole idea of cities you know if you have a city it's not just the city but the city depends on bringing food from other places mining in order to make the machines fuel in order to get them to run in today's world i mean and we have this what we call cloud technology cloud technology computers and things yeah yeah it was the technology relies on on physical backups that are destroying much of the environment too so it's not a virtual just a virtual reality you know you have to have and then you know like like derek jensen points out you know it's like solar energy and wind energy well you know the solar energy is relying on mining these precious metals from around the world that way sane again i'm sorry world and destroy more and more in the environment we have to mine the metal and so on that goes on it just think of all the metal we had busy to get to make all the cars that are going exactly their cars you know putting out exhaust everything exactly and i read that we only sold  million of them last year and the united states vat but that's what that's what the article said only you know i mean they're trying to figure out how to sell more or they're looking at they're looking for the dow jones to you know they're looking  parameters everything's economic could say everything is economic in modern world there's nothing else with money so there's not going to be anything spiritual left if we need to continue to destroy the environment you are a spiritual person  rule this rule that they're going to put up is an infringement of my religious liberty ok ok because this is my religion my religion is really connecting my religion is reconnecting with with wild animals and in my case it's with birds you know those are the practice my practices are st francis of assisi who preached to the birds and believes that the birds were were our brothers and our sisters in the sun in the moon and so on and and the red road which is a don't know that i don't know that that was so that's my other practice and the native americans looked to the to the birds and to all of the other wild animals as messengers and as teachers they were in each are much stronger they never thought of them as being separate or being lesser than us are and so what happens is that and in our culture we talk about being stewards but when you're steward of something it means that you're protector not just a protector it means that you have the authority over all to decide and we women did not like it when men were our stewards you know when when they had the legal right to decide what was good for us now we're stewards of children because they're not able to to make decisions and i like children really well but you know why we're so words of them but we should not consider ourselves stewards of nature because nature is is comprised of adults with their own rules and they've been here longer they have more wisdom than we have they don't need all of these contraptions that we have they don't need to have buildings they don't need to have you know air conditioning and heating and and cell phones and internet and you know it's like they neurological problems which are probably many many we can trace it to the lead that's in the water here and it's also from the pesticides and herbicides that we put down in the parks from the plastics and so on the toxins that come out of the plastic and and with the heat and the cold and everything and then they preen themselves so they end up eating that stuff that has sort of so over the floor it's all over the place and it's terrible because children are down playing playing and it you and i aren't but it's it gets into the into the scan so they're putting it down in washington square park there putting i remember seeing even a few years ago it was all over the parks and chinatown thank you including co park plastic park and i could see pigeons pecking at this you know this plastic grass you know that's terrible and then but yet the parks department says that we're feeding them the wrong kinds of food but they're feeding them herbicides and all kinds of fine you know it's like you know it's like they used to put up signs they don't put up signs anymore but i said but i'll a lot of human attention and backing into where selling something but i found you know this is a record that somebody round up because of what it has is glyphosate but they don't say that anymore you see they used to put it on the signs but now they're trying to hide it you know so we're ok man's mordred so anyway so they want to prohibit feeding birds and squirrels ok and you put up juicy and there's another when of me feeding a tit mouse in the winter the tip my scum and their you know their resident birds and these are these birds have been friendly with humans forever they've never been domestic birds but they're very friendly and i think you know when i'm out there and i see children hold out their hands and the took most comes and the lights on the hand you see the expression of wonder on their face know and this is this is the only way for many urban children to ever get in touch with any nature at all it's right next to the to the mourning dove right next to the mourning dove you know and it's a hand it's a picture children enjoy this and older people who can't afford to go to a broadway shows or anything they go out to the park and they you know people who are dying if you can assert your bird for ever for ever i mean it's been something that that we do and they jim do you do that anymore no they don't think we should do that anyway it's bad for the birds why well they say one thing is that they become tame and then they start by their own people which is not true birds don't bother me i've got birds and they fly around i you know i talk to them all the time i don't know and seventy eight most people are not aware of this is not true yes that's true it was a rationale because they were savages as well you know you know it's like it went back to the you know to the thirty's and before that to the th century and because we wanted to tame them you know eight it became possible them for them once more to have pipe ceremonies or ceremonies where they and they traditionally make frings to nature all the time to birds and to all kinds of things you know and and the eagle is sort of the supreme what did happen to m they can no longer hold their pipes or moneys in the park and now they're prohibiting feeding the birds and the squirrels which is also a practice and so so it's like there's roading all of our religious freedoms and i teach i teach i  friend i've known you but a one thousand years and every time i can't believe so intervention is waiting for you when you talk about iraq so the parks department shoulders like something out of a movie with this role it's you're going it's going to be up to two hundred dollars fine but somebody told me it's really going to be up to a one thousand dollars because everything that has to do with the parks is up to a one thousand dollars fine and a night in jail so what this means is that i'm maybe going to go to it cannot be developed ok so they really want to get rid of the birds and everything but he told another they can build another irish wall yes so they can start construction and i tell you unless it's in the new york times the money in to appear on the park and there's a little building on it but they want to put up an eight story building office building on it and they in order to do that they need to have a lot change and assemblywoman deborah gl who represents the area has proposed allowing a somewhat smaller plant only seven hundred square feet of development instead of eight hundred and eighteen thousand feet as you see i so want to sing exactly so she's going to support it and the new building industries new york so they're showing their hand to me just before showing their hand with these new york times no if you look on the internet for proposals for buildings in central park i was shocked because most people would never think of doing that ok no this is this is something that already exists word of what they've done at rome and this is a skating rink in central park and they've turned it into for the summer but you see they're doing it slowly into this for the summer they've turned it into something they park it's an amusement park and that's what they want to do all over the park for tourists so they can make money because parks no are private public ownership it's sort of like the privates develop them and then you know it's like we pay the tax money to support them and everything and these private companies come in and they make money on it and they bring in the tourists and this is another project this is another project that they're proposing which is you see there's a glass building all around al around it a building a glass building on all four sides which they say will house eight times the number of people that are in the empire state building that's supposed to be a good thing and it would be down to the bedrock that's what they would be that would be left now they can't do this as long as there's wildlife in the parks they have to get rid of the birds and the squirrels and the reckons and tomato and more to grow up or is there is a proposal now this proposal is obviously not going to go through but you know when people spend money on proposals like this it's because they know that in the future they can get something smaller like like this essentially woman glick when she says she she she favors a little smaller building down in and the  in southern manhattan you know seven hundred thousand feet instead of eight hundred and eighty thousand i mean c'mon you so so what people do is they propose something very big and then they settle for something less and that this is the tower they proposed to put there you know where you go here and people swimming in it that's what they want to sort of bring tower like that is there why with an elevator observation tower for tourists for a tour is seven hundred in twenty days i think feet high so that tourists can go up and down in this glass elevator and they've insulted the local indian spice saying that they've used a basket we've pattern on the as a line up in a basket we have patterns and i told a friend of mine who is a leopard chief about it he was totally and so just by the fact that ducks and so and the reservoir they have to get rid of them in order to do this this is a reservoir you know so it's so incrementally they're proposing a little bit here a little bit here and it's like it's the barbarians are at the gate in this case the barbarians are the realtor didn't like what he wrote and wrote say well look you got new york and it's a city it's not already you've got you've got you've got upstate new york you've got forests all over the place you've got an iran doctors all kinds of nature all over the place and if you  earth and man's ability to change the face of the earth and you think it's running over time well we used to think in terms of progress progress but you see what happened and i did i did too i was part of the mainstream in that  but now i realize that progress is actually destroying the planet well that's precision drawing and that's a pretty strong message very good out loud for you to ring it up yeah good you know now that we've got the internet and so on everything is a lot faster a of people i mean when i was born there were two billion people in the world when my parents were born there was one billion people in the world and now we're going on eight billion and so that's increased buildings increased trash increased mining increased use of water interest we need more energy we need more i mean the sec you know we can't continue like this we want the planet to survive do it was it a mistake to make an automobile well to make a train it's a very interesting thing about the automobiles or whatever progress and new york in new york city they used to have horses with carts right and then a cement part over that a certain point yes the dung became a real problem here because it was hard you know had to be nonsupport it out and so on and the solution was to replace them with automobiles well the only movie was invented yeah ok yeah but look at what the automobiles are doing to the world i not sure  what were they using you know they use energy they're the mining of the steel and everything that goes into that transportation it's a great benefit to have a car well it's not a benefit to the planet well i'm not so sure are people not of benefit to no money or not maybe the plan to be better off there were no people well that were saying it would be better i would if there were far fewer people like there used to be because then when people did damage they didn't do damage to the well let's get let the scale was much smaller this is the only city this is the st city to propose banning the feeding of squirrels and birds but you've got the st is the st one and other places like boston yeah they have a little dispensers feed dispensers or you could put a if the issue is that people are feeding them bread which is not bad or good for them and it's also not good for people i mean bread is just not good for anybody because it doesn't have any nutritional value anymore the way bread used to but anyway so make money that's the american creed is that ok so they're saying look that's that's old or seems to be the only value that really trumps everything else so they're saying that they don't want people to feed them bread because it's bad for them but i show you what there's an  article and you really are building up a door seeing here you know there was an article in the telegraph in london and then the whole bunch of other articles but i only have this one birds are starving because people are told not to feed them bread warns queens  guard the keeper of the swans for the queen who is the guy who has a new joining us who has all kinds of degrees and so on yeah i said please start feeding them bread again because this ones are dying they're starving and he said they're we want to have birds you know i like birds i always do i think they're wonderful they fly and i got birds around where i go if you're homeless person and they don't feed them they're already fun to watch and if you if you say to you know don't feed the homeless know the drinking water is being destroyed because of our progress ok you know what we call progress so how do we deal with it i mean how do we deal with this issue of man's role in changing the face of the earth and man's turn anything around where you're running against you're running up against some you know if somebody is going to change to make money you probably don't have much i literally ran a saturday only thing to motivate societies my little grain of sand that i'm putting and that's my little you know seed because this is what i believe in seeds or life yeah so when i give seeds to birds and i'm giving them life you know i'm offering them life and they're offering me love in your life and everything you know yeah and and that's the only thing i can do it's just going on all over the world as japan oh are all of the civilized way back and i'm feeding birds and squirrels is only in new york city but you can bet you better believe that if it starts here it's going to be st the parks then it's going to be all throughout the city which people have tried to know i think so too but you know i like think that way you know that says he says you know it's like when you talk to people you know who don't want the planet to be destroyed if they have to choose between that our continuing the way of life that we have which makes it possible to have i scream twenty four hours a day busy to have air conditioning i like i ok you're like they prefer to have this civilization that's destroying that by action there's they're supporting the culture that's destroying the planet but he says if you let the animals vote you know the hammerhead sharks and whatever else for the bears was a very i don't want to hammerhead shark did you sighting if i'm swimming in the same location with that shark i'd rather come down and i didn't want to see anything after i thought i was going to die i hadn't seen anything to anybody it was stupid i was stupid and everything but when i came down all i wanted to see was some meant i want to get back to the city there's a there's one dollar to one dollar is is is that you're not allowed to traps or harm them or anything into as you're not allowed to feed them and so feeding animals is under under the title of abuse of park animals sixty's everybody's into their their their cell phones and so on and they just accept things you know because then they can look at nature on their cell phones or something so people think it's terrible but they're not they want to protest what we need is for hundreds and hundreds of people to go to but it doesn't happen anymore because they've controlled people through all of this and plus the surveillance that they have via facebook and google and the cell phones and so on they know who everyone who everybody is what everybody says and then they go and you're getting  more and more they're able to do all of that you know you you would seem to be pessimistic in terms of your specs of the prospects for the human condition i am i mean i think the best thing that can happen is for the only good thing that could happen is for this whole civilization to disappear and it will it will either through a nuclear holocaust or because the planet is just going to get rid of us it's going to collapse because it's not sustainable well that's a big argument that a lot of  about how to make this lifestyle sustainable or about the cultures it's not seen well that we're destroying it with our technology and our lifestyle we are we are virtually we are destroying the planet you don't see you don't believe in  the planet to be back to the twenty's well i think you can see i think if there were very few if there were very a lot fewer people would make it that through some sort of an atomic that that is a real real possibility right now the capability people in washington in the think tanks and in the administration who believe that we could attack russia with nuclear weapons and that russia would back down and surrender which nobody who really knows anything about economic well but the whole thing is they shut it down because it was all prepared on internet and so on like they did all of the the you know the revolutions in the middle east and so on you know the april spring so we're where do we well and what you know you join me and going to jail busy over fine you were to go to jail ok that's that's that's the problem it's going to be one i don't want to go to jail just one night but i awful lot of people who think there's this kind of thing that has to be addressed in general that the planet's on a headlong crash course there's people think that i could get back to where you join me in jail she could someone could go to get our their sites other places other groups of people getting together around these issues you're taking with that our fellow compared treats of the way you think that you could to be a bad what does that say to you and then they have this editor i mean obviously because they're there you know they say they sell their little subscriptions to the realtors well over the years that the subscriptions but i mean you petition to ban the bird feeding of birds in new york city parks you could look at that and you can you know click on it and say that you protested but i mean there are over seven thousand protests on it but i mean that's it's not going to i mean it's  you feel good that you actually clicked on it that you protested but it's not going to change anything ok i mean you know anything is going to change something is an actual action like if we get hundreds of people out there to rally and rallies you  know that would change things but how do i i don't have the ability to organize that found a single person who wanted to help organize so you know i think it's a presidential issue so you could run for president on that well if you're know oh everybody was into technology and so on that's a blight on the pan a planet but if you look at the san bushmen for instance in africa they're now the sand bushman i don't not a blight on the planet the traditional american indians  up you know i was i was excluded from the group ok so it turns out that the person who was organizing the rallies and so on is either a plant or is working for the realtors or has been turned you know because that planet yeah that's more or less your position that's what i get asked for an awful lot of consideration on the part of a whole lot of people i don't understand why there are thousands of people are many people up in arms over this and new york city a lot of the what places a national park or something well people can and awful lot of people can easily hold off a lot of people can't all well it's a big issue it's i can't afford to go to any of those yeah well what we need to do is make people have the ability to lead we have to make people secure in their in their situations well but everything's falling apart how secure can people be in civilization in a culture where where everything is falling on earth and the political process and how it's all corrupt it's all corrupt right so well it's a little hard to know what's to be done and greenland british rail and now it's raining in the winter i mean and we don't pay attention i mean it's like the water is going to rise that's one thing that's going to happen and it's going to it's going to you're going to have another noah's flood that's from little caesars do mighty oaks grow it may be that you're out to some sometimes it happens because there's a lot of general discontent but we've got to say goodbye because we've run out of time on this planet this program need us thank you