time once again for community form and we're very lucky to have with us live in the studios this morning allison mcdowell also with dow is a parent and researcher into the dangers of corporate education reform she was present this last march this year here in seattle of a talking titled future ready schools how silicon valley and the defense department plan to remake public education us and thank you very much for coming in and spending time with us  i'm very glad to be here thank you so much for having me so tell us how did you get interested and involved with the issue of corporate education reform right well i'm a parent i have a daughter who is sixteen in the public schools of philadelphia and we're sort of a crucible for many different aspects of education reform we've had multiple superintendents from the proto cademy we've been defunded our schools have  numerous of our schools have been closed teachers laid off and about three years ago i became involved in the opt out movement for high stakes testing because at that point i felt that if we were able to withhold the data from that system we would try to be able to slow things down because they were using that testing data to close our schools so i worked on that for a number of years until i saw that the landscape was starting to change and a lot of it was leading up to the passage of  every sin succeeds act that passage and it seemed at that time that our school district which is challenging in many respects was all of a sudden actually interested in opt out and making that  sharing information materials pennsylvania has a legal opt out right on religious grounds and making materials available in various languages and something just didn't compute in my head i'm like well even if it were entitled the fact that they were interested in engaging with us on that made me sort of question why that was and then so post s s a it became clear that the shift that was going to be taking place was away from the high stakes end of year tast and more towards embedded formative assessments so in our district we've seen an influx even though there isn't funding for many other things lots of technology coming in chrome books every of all of the students have google accounts google runs our school district even though they say fill estie dot org their google accounts and each student their e mail address is actually their student id number so to access a chromebook as soon as you log in you know all of that information is tied back into their id number so the technology was coming in many schools were doing multiple benchmarks assessments so there was less and less time for actual meaningful instruction throughout the school year and there were more and more tests taking place many computerized so at that point we were looking into like what did this mean what was the role of technology and the interim testing in this movement and so i had come across my i bill i have a blog it's called wrench in the gears it's a wordpress blog i have a lot of information there and it's all very well documented and linked to my colleague emily thomas who's a teacher in maine who's seen this firsthand she has a blog save me in schools and so i found her blog and at one point she said you know you know only click on this link you know if you're willing to go down the rabbit hole and at that point it was it was a website called global education futures forum and they have this agenda for education up to twenty thirty five and it is their their projection and it he was former gates foundation and has his own consulting firm now and is based out of seattle and but anyway minute so they have sort of what they call a fourth site document of sort of projecting based on trends and patterns where they see things going for education like over the next twenty years and so really they have a very sophisticated map and all you have to do is sort of look at their map and then match it up to current events and you can see like where they're pretty much on target we're with where things are headed and they're they have some really interesting info graphics and one of them it's a very decentralized system so education is just like the individual at the center so everything you're hearing personalized learning and individual education plans like it's one big person and you're the center of your own universe and sort of around you there aren't teachers or schools it's many sort of digital interfaces and devices and data gathering platforms and this idea that education is a lifelong process which i think all of us generally with but the idea that your sort of chasing skills in this new global economy and like constantly remaking yourself or like the gig economy and what that means and managing your online reputation not just your skill sets but your mindset and your social outlook and your behaviors and the role of game if occasion so there are many many elements to this that if you look into it i think raise a lot of questions and increasingly really over the past five years there's been a lot of discussion about remaking education reimagining education you know education for the twenty first century future ready schools and i think for the most part parents and community members have been left out of this conversation of what really does future ready schools mean and the folks who are running the conversation are running the agenda are largely coming from attack background and this is something that's built up since the mid ninety's when the advance distributed learning program was set up within the defense department in the part education to have like you know tech learning for all americans which you know again i think we all need to be tech knowledgeable the question is how is the tech used and how in control of your education are you and your educational data so anyway a lot of this is being driven by interests of digitizing education and really through austerity mechanisms pulling out more human interaction out of the equation so we're seeing things that a number of years ago detroit had a kindergarten where they would have one hundred kindergartners with like one teacher and a couple of aides and a lot of technology so there are lots of questions increasingly about the use of technology especially in early grades and i know in washington state there have been a big push for tablets down to the kindergarten level our children are being part of the sort of larger experiment that has health considerations that have not been closely examined him in terms of eye strain audio components even hygiene with earphones the wife i asked specs and then also the data collection so  there's sort of this grand experiment going on for future ready schools and parents and community members are really aware of the fact that it is an unproven experiment and what the implications are long term and it's being driven heavily by corporations that are producing these platforms the software the electronics behind the scenes because no one knows this is going on except select group of administrators and teachers yeah well so they have there are a number of like pilot districts so the idea is sort of you get a beachhead and then you roll it out you convince me to have very sophisticated marketing manuals like education elements they say this is how you do it you know first you have a social media campaign you get the young teachers who are really into tech and you train them up in the way that you want to do things in the name mentor all the veteran teachers and then you get the principal on board and then you have the parent meetings and it's again within a if you understood it as like selling a corporate product as opposed to public education it might not be so disturbing like for me i find having this sort of corporate approach to marketing a new approach to public education that's what i find disturbing  i've called this education two point zero because i think we're about to see a shift from the earlier version of privatization which was the high stakes end of your high stakes testing vouchers  charter schools those things all still continue but they've they were never the endgame so they have been used as a way to destabilize the landscape of neighborhood schools in many cases they've been used to you know acquire real estate to further sort of gentrification insider contracts like there are many aspects that allowed that to become a profit center but there's going to be a point of diminishing return where it's sort of like all the easy pickings have been taken and if you're pursuing sort of a tail or a stick model like the ultimate efficiency lean production cyber education is the end game so creating a system of education that really has very little in human resources there's  folks within pearson and i b m and microsoft who are looking at ai like everyone will have your own like artificial intelligent like learning sherpa for your life you know when this isn't just k twelve this is forever you know someone on your shoulder telling you what you should be doing next  but removing the humans out of the equation and putting more technology in place so i think that's what this shift to education two point zero is going to be about is largely cyber but i think most parents at this point are not comfortable with that model they would say you know and i will admit like there's a small group of kids who are highly motivated for whom a cyber exclusively cyber model may work i mean a lot of the research shows that for most kids the outcomes are not  great so what they will be selling is project based learning and that's what you hear a lot about coming up like in the next couple of years but those projects were necessarily be linked to schools so you'll hear more and more about any time any place anywhere any pace learning so they're looking to d disconnect education from physical school buildings and actual teachers in classrooms to sort of what's called a learning ecosystem model so something that's more free flowing you're just out in the world collecting skills and that's what was so interesting about like the common core state standards set up and i know a lot of states have sort of rolled back or renamed them but the idea of having education tied to very specific standards was a way of adam education and making it available for digitization so if education is a human process of growth and development that's very murky to try to put in a metric right you need bits and bytes and so if you create an education that's strictly around standards and like sub standards and little sets you can just aggregate those and collect them or not collect them and run that as data in a digital platform so that push toward standards yes it allowed for school report cards and value added modeling and things that hurt schools and teachers but it also normalize the idea that education was less a human process and more people collecting things like collecting skills and standards which is what you need for like a competency based education approach so you talked about some of the specific examples one of the advantages to going to your site is you have links to so many different documents from the very  corporations and people that are producing the systems and one of the examples you talked about in your talk back in march was something called tutor me that was involved kids getting pulled out of class to go basically a i icons talking to them and they become attached to it yeah yeah there were there were a couple of there's a couple of interesting things i had sort of a slight thing who's teaching your children because increasingly it's not necessarily their classroom teacher but the chap out was actually reasoning mind which is a math program it was developed in texas and so it's bam like long running in gotten a lot of funding both from public and private sources about refining sort of a personalized learning towards math but kids were interacting with these online chat bots and developing connections and relationships to these online presences in their math program  i'm in pennsylvania so a lot of a lot of things are developing in pittsburgh they have a whole initiative called remake learning in pittsburgh which i believe is sort of early stage learning ecosystem model and a lot of that is coming out of carnegie mellon because carnegie mellon is doing a lot of work on ai in education and they have something called alex so they like the idea of peer based learning and that sounds attractive like yeah kids like to learn from their peers this is their version of peer based learning is that you have a giant avatar cartoon peer on a screen and the children interact with this appear on a screen so that's something that's being piloted in southwestern pennsylvania right now and then to mate is actually a different variation but they were pulling kids out of class away these were young children from their classroom setting to put them in a computer lab to do tutoring with a corporate volunteer skype and an online platform so in this case it actually was a human being but this wasn't during school hours this was not a supplement to classroom instruction this was in lieu of having direct instruction with a certified teacher or being put into an online platform with a corporate volunteer and you know it turned out a number of the sponsors of that program had ties to defense contracting industries you know how burton and booz allen hamilton you know things that you might want to question is that you want your second grader spending their time chatting with you know in lieu of having their second grade teacher teach them reading so again there is this shift away from from teachers there's there's a model that's going on right now within many one to one device districts so districts where every child has their own device young kids often have tablets or her kids have chrome books in high end districts you might have an actual laptop with some harddrive on it the clean christian institute or in a satanist institute they've been pushing blended learning so blended learning is this new model where there are a number of different ways you can flip classrooms which many people have heard of but there's one called a rotational model so children only have direct access to a teacher a third of the time like the cost would be split into three groups and you would be with a teacher for a third of the time doing peer work a third of the time and doing online work a third of the time so again it's a way of increasing class size supposedly like supposedly the quality time you have when you're with the teacher with the ten kids instead of thirty is supposed to be so great even though maybe you only get fifteen minutes what's happening in other districts is they're saying the time or kids are not with their teachers and they're just doing online work they don't really need a teacher present they could just have an aide so that's again in terms of pushing out professional teachers is that well if kids are doing online learning maybe you just need an american or volunteer in the room to make sure that no one's hurting each other you know when that they're on supposedly on task you know i think that's a worrisome trend and even though they'll sell blended learning as you know very tech forward and future ready the kids don't love spending time on these devices like hour after hour after hour and my concern as a parent is we're all starting to realize what the implications are for big data and how we interact with online platforms either in social media or other adaptive situations and how that these devices are actually gathering data on our cells so they they gather information through keystroke patterns they all have cameras they all you know the tablets have touch sense so you know theoretically there's body temperature and pulse senses like there's many many elements are they all being used now now but there is that capacity for using them to give elop that level of engagement  to understand how you're interacting with these programs and that's being developed through with the army research lab and u s c their institute for creative technologies and they are developing a lot of this is being developed in conjunction with the defense department for their interactive intelligent tutoring systems and with the navy actually which is relevant to seattle a lot of these early prototype intelligent tutoring systems  been developed specifically with the navy in mind training very specifically in computer programs in optimizing that but once they develop the infrastructure then they're able to apply that in nonmilitary settings and so it's making its way out  so there's a lot of data that can be collected in the other the other push that you'll start to see is a game a fixation so games like gaming in schools and kids games like parents love games that sounds so fun but i think what we have to realize is there's a lot of behavior old out of that's coming out of the two that we're not necessarily aware of and so this push for game of cation are sometimes like game of fide classroom management systems so google has something called class craft and all the kids have avatars and like if they're behaving in class they can you know they earn points or have points deducted in your own teams and you can save your team member or not and with the s s a having passed you know they'll tell the story that like we care about more than just test scores we really want to care about the whole child we want to you know we care about children as individuals really they want to collect all of this data not just on your academic skills but on your behaviors and your mindset and are you gritty and are you a leader or are you you know flexible are you resilient and these these game of five platforms whether they're run by the teacher or gaming that's done through the students in these simulations and also a r v are augmented reality virtual reality games that you're starting to see  there's just a lot a lot of information going through and you have to wonder how is it being used one of the privacy implications and also one of the feedback loops being created in terms of how you interact with the platform is it reinforcing aspects of your personality that you may or may not want reinforced my concern as a parent is within these adaptive learning systems i don't want an online system that has to learn my child to work i don't want a system that has to know everything my child did for the last six months to operate properly because i think that becomes problematic how do you ever have a do over like is it just always building and reinforcing certain patterns of behavior and how you it's they i think they presented as flexible and personalized but in many ways i think it's limiting in some of the documentation you present have systems that want to pay attention to whether a person that is working with the program is getting bored or falling asleep or whatever so they're like watching like you know the i literally to see if it's like where it's wandering off to you said they potentially could be checking your temperature here are they doing it right now i don't know that the imp but the capacity is there and all the data is being saved somewhere and shared in some capacity we don't know and i think it's very unclear and i think there are many parents who are very concerned about privacy and working that angle of controlling what data goes in i mean i think all of us are aware that when something is up in the cloud you know even if there are promises made about privacy and protections that nothing is really safe up there in terms of from hacking or even just legal like is very the education records sort of privacy has a lot of loopholes you know anyone who many of these organizations companies and third parties are designated agents of school districts so they have access to the same metion and i also mention navi because the other shift that we're seeing happening is the shift towards creating an education system that is geared towards workforce development that the children at younger and younger ages showed should be identifying their passions and finding their personal pathways to the workforce in the economy and so now  d is one of a number of companies that does strength assessments and surveys and many states you can't get your diploma unless your child does a complete battery of assessments personality assessments through nabih on switches third party program also linking towards like their future college plans and other things linked in and in very very detailed information about people's family situations so again the amount of data that's being collected on many many different levels to supposedly like guide students moving forward into the economy i think it merits a larger conversation and i'm not saying that everyone needs to agree with my position but i think that the the agenda that's being moved forward is being done in a way that for the most part parents and community members there's not been a consensus reached with us that this is ok that this new version of school is what we desire and being a parent in the philadelphia school district  when these new systems are have been implemented you know and the potential use of gathering of all your child's data i mean have you been consulted on that prior did every time they bring in a new system do they let you know  we have another piece of software here that potentially could be you know data mining your kid you're ok with that so i think on the plus side because we have been so severely defunded  haven't seen quite as much of an influx of tech yet although i anticipate it's coming we've just had a big rollout of minecraft i think in schools that's their new thing that there are there are all there are a number of schools like within turnaround sort of that  are being piloted for these one to one devices i will say that there was an opt out form for google apps for education which is and i also opted in my child out of google apps for education i may have been the only parent in the fall of the school district who did that and it makes it complicated because again there it's convenient you know it's a nice up you know way for teachers not to have to carry around lots of papers and they have kids put it all on their google drive  but i think we're all starting to be a little wary about the amount of information and power that google has you know in the world and what the implications are for that so i think if people have concerns around some of these pr aspects you know that's that's a potential starting starting place is to opt out of google apps or education and see where that goes or even have targeted like device and data strikes during school year so we don't get an a notice every time there's a new program i guess long story short just a few minutes left and again some of the companies in addition to defense department having early hooks  into education reform and online learning some of the companies involved and heavily invested in this as an example like halliburton and booz allen which to me that's a booz allen which is also heavily tied into mention in addition to attack we also have global finance interests involved because in the s s a there are provisions for pay for success which is where they're looking to use private venture capital to affect educational outcomes either right now it's in universal pre k also early literacy so we need to be aware of the role that pay for success is going to play in this and that's essential like moneyball for government where they're looking to save money i mean there's a conference that they they put this together evidence based policy that's what they call it that sort of the code word is that if you can come up with a computerized program that will give you specific success metrics venture capital can make money on that so a lot of global finance interests in impact investing interests are looking i believe in education as a market a futures market in student education data to have more information of that on my blog but social impact bonds and pay for success are a critical piece to understanding why education is be digitised also sheila packard microsoft i b m the tech interests some base camp school micro schools are another big component of this these value model private schools if vouchers go through that we're going to be seeing a lot more of that the tech is also focusing on montessori school models and very high end have rocket ship academy which are sort of stripped down versions for low income districts and but they're also marketing tech to affluent families and aspirational families as being sort of future ready so it's really a there's many different branded versions of education technology and so long story short if you have a kid in the going through school or you know anyone you care about then this would be something to look into yes understand how much time they're spending on devices advocate that school budgets prioritize human teachers and reasonable class sizes and not data mining not adaptive management systems and have this conversation in your community is education about creating opportunities for students to learn and grow together as a community or is it these isolate isolating personalized pathways where people are competing against one another and i think that's a larger conversation we all need to have in our school districts are where speaking with allison mcdowell she is a parent and researcher in the philadelphia school system produced a series of future ready schools how silicon valley and the defense department plan to remake public education and again your website is wrench in the gears wrench in the years dot com all right well if that were forced out of time i want to thank you very much for coming to spend time with us this with cardinal macintyre for those of you from the catholic community and at any very in nineteen eighty one you have heard all of the background of people working toward the coming of the tritone submarines and all of the things that they were doing in fact the submarines had not yet arrived and carol and i were down in southern california we were increasingly upset about the whole nuclear arms race the union of concerned scientists had put their clock up to a minute before midnight that people on the east coast in the plowshares were doing things and we were reading the fellowship of reconciliations magazine and things like that about mali russian people that in the spring up the california coast looking for a group that we could work with and we stopped at santa cruz and we stopped at places in the bay area we stopped at the  community that was operating in santa rosa and then we had heard about a group called ground zero in washington that we didn't know anything about but we came on to visit them and at that time jim was in jail but we visited with shelley and we just knew this was the place that we wanted to be so in september of that year we moved up here and we're here for eleven years all through the eighty's and into the ninet and fortunately for us jim and shelley had just moved into a house over at the railroad tracks and so we moved into their trailer in c bit that was just perfect  so it was a very intense time because when we came there was a whole turnover of people involved in the community and all of the sudden there were new people coming  renee chris cocaine from cleveland jean clark came from new york georgian linda greenwald came from montana iris and tom came from i think new york so we were from all over the place didn't know each other and there was all of these things that needed to happen and the first thing that was said to us is we need to start publishing a newspaper so that was the first thing i remember meeting that grace and johnny and talking about the newspaper and so that all got started we continued the leafleting campaign that had been going on and then the whole thing was focused on the ohio and so i am just going to tell you a little bit about the preparation part but then the other three people were actually out in boats and they'll tell you about that in the beginning we were holding weekend retreats when people who were interested in what was being called the peace blockade would come to ground zero and talk about what that might be lying and i mean you can imagine all the kind of wild ideas there were about putting boats in the water and being in front of the submarine but it took a lot of reality checks in terms of what we were really talking about how big that submarine really was what could we really do and also what was possible to do and then we started having people come and talk to us and they started talking about things like how many minutes you could be in the water and not get hypothermia and that was the end of that you know and so it got it got very  practical about the risks involved and then people started making decisions about whether they thought they could do this whether they wanted to do this lots of people were really jazzed about doing this and then as the reality began to city and people were looking at them i willing to give my life for this because when they started talking about the undertow from  the submarine and what could happen to a boat that was very close to it and in the midst of all this we were thinking that we would do the blockade out in the hood canal and then the navy decided  closer to the time that there was no way anybody was going to go into the hood canal and so we had to move out into the streets of one to few to and you can imagine the difference in the water  especially those of you from the northwest so there was a lot of prep time and i'm running over the time here but eventually we moved to the straights and the support group had a year on land that was right across the hood canal bridge and to the right i guess that's north and we spent our time out at the y cooking and providing for all of the people that were in the boats and at that time it was about fifty people actually in boats and there were probably another fifty people who were doing so poor work so we were cooking three meals a day for close to one hundred people and they'll tell you the rest  i just want to say that whether you come into your own voice and clarity and decision to make a difference in the world whether it's that you're becoming a parent or a good neighbor or that you're doing direct action it you can never do it alone so i was you know i've heard people talk about the movement for a new society yes they trained me in non training and how to run a great meeting with say an f o r catholic worker i'm a lutheran so in one nine hundred seventy three i was consecrated as a lutheran deaconess and my journey with johnny started a year later as we came to the northwest from chicago and we really wanted to connect with peace communities and so the catholic worker was a natural way to do that we decided to live in portland we opened the roundtable house of hospitality and ran that for fifteen years and i was once we made it to ten i said dorothy we did it and we we five more years so community is the foundation for action and paul libby who passed away two years ago was my support person on the peace blockade and i love the fact that i could i could see him working in the yurt cutting up onions joyfully and with glee and his wife mary  taking pencil to paper and just simply drawing somebodies portrayed and giving life in that action the piece blockade which i did not go into easily because i was a mother of a four year old and a two year old and during the preparation we we would go and we would practice and we had to practice because the window of opportunity was going to be very  defined for us and i got a phone call i we didn't stay with all of the other people that some of us stayed on the s s plashers we stayed in houses and i got a call that i needed to go home and paul drove me all the way to portland where i had the most challenging conversation with johnny ever and that was yes i'm going back because he was like how did you do this when i'm in jail for six months at a time how do you run the catholic worker how do you do the soup kitchen how do you raise our children i can't do this to which i said yes you can you have a community around you  i went back up and yes it was a blast i must say there was only one real serious problem with it i didn't get my birthday cake it was on the peacemaker in the oven and they wouldn't give it and maurice summary was wonderful what she didn't say was very few days after we arrived jim and shelley went on a speaking trip across the nation and they said oh while we're gone would you keep an eye on thomas their young son who was living in the basement of the tracks house and we said sure that that should have told us something we thought we really thought we had talked about and read about and prayed about entering into this part of our life journey we had no clue and fortunately we were with a group of people who took this path and nonviolent resistance very seriously and so we learned along with the other people who were new in this arena and we had very regular meetings to discern together almost everything which did just except for where we dumpster it and how we made the soup of the day that sort of thing but that learning has been so important not only during our time here but since and so i guess i just want to put a word of encouragement and to any of you who are considering taking what may be a next step in your own personal journey towards a deeper expression of your own understanding of nonviolence be brave and find others to coming we did not know when i'm going to read a few pieces from an article that i wrote back in that period immediately after the coming of the ohio just because it's st than i could be the evening headlines on aug twelfth red fourteen arrested as the triton submarine sweeps into its home base that's the quote headline of the paper although the media this is me writing out although the media had given extensive coverage for over a week this was press media t v media radio they still did not sailboats that had its beginning over seven years ago in the birth of the tried and campaign in the lives of shelley and jim douglas and janet and bob aldridge and before them countless others of the pacific life community and our countless retreats workshops vigils house meetings as well as nearly four years of weekly leaf ting of the base workers had led up to this moment the navy had consistently refused to disclose the date of the submarine's arrival our best guess placed it coming sometime in august six months earlier we had set the august eighth as the date for the possible coming around that time and planned a large public rally resist trident celebrate hope and i've seen some t shirts here today because it was a very important for us to join those two things the resistance and the hope that it was creating so that that became our campaign  message the cleland indians welcomed us on to their land because they are free nation and so a rally to which seven thousand people came took place on their beach  bless those waters and the crew of the ohio as well as the row boats and the sail boats and the people of the peace blockade and so i'm going to skip bunches here  can read about it in the archival copy of crowd as a hero but i wanted to give you an idea of the numbers of boats so here was the scenario not knowing the arrival date exactly  the boats one minute waited and practiced a number of the people we discovered had never been in a rowboat did not know which way to put or what's it called or they were literally i'm not making that up so we practiced on our good friends in port townsend had made these small little boats and and they were designed to last two weeks i think we had practice much longer than that already in the sub hadn't even come so it was a very nice thing so we had to keep practicing and every day we would practice and every night those supposed wish slept on the boats and those of us that wanted to go on shore could i don't have time but we could talk later if you want about the pacific peacemaker that was a fifty four foot sailing boat that came from australia with the crew had its whole long journey they are eleven thousand mile journey to be part of the blockade and what happened on that day when the ohio finally came i believe kim will say something about hi i'm kim wall i came from well maybe you could say the suburbs of chicago originally which is not a suburb oh i was supposed to do this  and from ten years in the military after which we settled in bellevue washington and lived a relatively suburban style life three  a retreat with the archdiocese of seattle on disarmament sponsored or co sponsored by archbishop hunt housen i had heard about his tax resistance issues and we had begun to tax raises sort of out of the blue along with joyce and being an american who also were doing that and we had a lot of publicity and bellevue about this and a lot of resistance about it and  then in january that retreat happened and it was out ground zero right here with the old buildings and i experience something of a change and they talked about the peace in detail that was to take place sometime next year when the first trident arrived i was overwhelmed both by the base we visited all the gates we met in a you're the yurt that was built by care and someone was mentioned who is mentioned earlier there were about ninety people and after that process i went home and thought about it and they said they were having a meeting at elliott bay book store in seattle and she talked about it and bill went with me and i sat on the steps that have openings on them and elliott bay and they were downstairs in the meeting area and i turned around and went back to bil it was way too much for me and never went to the meeting as the spring progressed i was involved with p s r my husband was a speaker for p s r and we were really involved in a lot of peace issues but then like a letter from jim and shelley about participating in retreats about the blockade i went in may early may and decided to be in the blockade and the blockade was quite as has been described a major turning point in everyone's lives those who knew me had to put up with me those who loved me and my family and friends had to put up with me it was a an extremely intense time and a huge decision which i did make to do this and i would say certainly it changed my life forever i've continued to be part of the ground zero community all this time was some breaks and in many ways that it changed so many people or affected so many people i vessel to the base and they were having a welcoming for the trident which was in port we came in on this huge coast guard vessel having been apprehended and taken out of the ploughshares which was and she was in my book they were we were on this boat together and there's no time to tell but we headed out from the pacific peace pick maker and they preempted us basically the coast at us and we were able to do what we planned but we did get out toward the submarine apprehended us and let us go which is a brief way of saying a lot of and that is another story very risky and very scary and they were never apprehended we were the second time we approached we went out and we were arrested and put on the big vessel and just sort of the people who all the people i loved and all the people i knew except the ones that didn't like what i did which there were quite a few but the others like the guy it under water sports where i had been in my wet suit we had to wear w and the federal marshal who after we were in court that night with schweigert up there as the magistrate his he's on the door up there we've got the door from his court room by tacoma from tacoma and he did this hearing and there were all these people downstairs in the court room was filled in the monks were in the front row it was really powerful powerful night powerful day and the federal marshal who had been kind of meeting with me off and on during the day at bangor was standing at the door and the pacific peacemaker people had given us pins which were kind of you know not too available but they were for the boat that boat that they brought from australia and he asked for my pen as i left the c i gave him my pin and then i got outside in steve hirsch from new york and that's all i know about him s from my t shirt so that i'm able to kind of get out of there so it's been a life story thank  that's when the sun rose the next morning it was the first of may and they all