which is with john that which is presented by m s i the movement of spiritual inner awareness a movement dedicated to awakening the spiritual heart within each of us john rogers the founder and spiritual advisor of m s a the founder and president of the institute for individual and world peace founder of the heartfelt foundation and other organizations dedicated to improving people's lives john rogers a bestselling author and he has been teaching and conducting seminars for many years but after john rogers speaks we'll tell you how you can obtain more information about him as a there's a great deal of misconception about the movement of spiritual and awareness and there's no way i'm going to be able to clear it up tonight because as soon as i say something you're going to take it and make it something else let me try it because it can be fun i get amazed when i go home and watch back the tape and listen to seminar then i get letters from people that tell me what happened and i realized we were not in the same movie at all my movie had angels and god and the holy spirit and years had words and swear words and misinterpretations and the wrong title for the seminar and so i just go with mine anyway i get heavily criticized for living my own life according to the spirit of i know in the same like every time i get criticized for that i get a better and better and better but i think i'm at the point now about one hundred percent i don't know how it can get much more on the full side to my cup runs over in with t v makeup on that looks a mess so i don't want to do that particular part if you're not going to leave everything here and i'm i just will tell you anything i want to and you sort out what you think works for you that's the general ground worl i lie and you try to catch me i know some of you think that's absolutely unfair but let us just do something because since i've been traveling now you ladies you've been with me so you you have to you have to still  vote so as i start this they they start to snicker because they know what's going to happen when we've been doing retreats and i'm working with the spirit with people somebody come up and ask a question and i hear it says there are at least two ways  there with egg or spirit all over my face or whatever the case looks the worst that's what i'm doing and so then i have nothing to do except to entertain until i got a pretty good that going until the spirit gets the information back around to me but to continue on with that it's an evening of liars anybody here  liars dice you and i when to i reel good at it because i just tell the truth every time and somebody always thinks i'm a lie and everybody else is lyon and i it so i call them on it they haven't figured out the way to play liars dice is the lie but just out of curiosity and some of you are older than some of you others some of your pretty young but i'd like you to notice when i ask for this participation type of thing to notice who and around you doesn't have their hand raised because then i want to tell you what their li i might tell one you don't want told but it won't matter it will still be yours but just out just out of just out of pure unadulterated curiosity how many of you have ever told a lie in your life just ra now listen if you raise this high you might as well raise that the because you know it's not a little lie ok that's good now that's just shows that we have a room full of liars that doesn't make anybody bad it's just we've done that right and how many of you who told lies are really good people see there is a second big lie the but but it's ok is that because we really do lie well there are other types of lies let's just look at that how many of you have ever told something to someone that what you heard you added something on to it that wasn't part of what you're originally heard right ok so we all know we got exaggeration in on the lies how many of you have ever done this when this one is this is a way out one you might be walking down the street or going to your table in a restaurant or somebody is walking by your table and you know they can hear what you say and now the clear blue sky you just up and tell a lie like something like well by me at least five thousand of those shares and the person walks by and they hear the person the op well i first discovered this a few years ago walking in an airport with a friend of mine and we were going down to our gate and on the way down there was a big open area where they sit for a lot of people for for four or five gates as we're walking by there i'm walking next to the people there he turns to me and he says something like well i'll just take fifty thousand dollars worth  and then i stop and turn around looked like this i said why did you say that he said well i was just trying to press some people who were sitting there i said impress them with what you said with the idea that i would buy fifty thousand dollars worth of it i said fifty thousand dollars worth of what it is that anything that they want to put in their min i said why did you do that you're never going to see them again he said well they might be sitting in the same section of the plane we're in and if they're sitting in the same section of the plane when they come in they'll remember what i said and if we have a conversation i'll be one up on him to start with now i know his mind was more shrewd than mine and maybe it's shrewd than some of you and maybe it's not maybe yours are still much more sophisticated but just out of curiosity have any of you know you have how many of you have ever walk someplace and just up and through a throwaway statement like that for no real good reason you're deciding it's for your daughter's prom dress and so you add something to the information because they're walking by and they've never heard before and i'm not going to ask you to raise your hands because see you have to sort of tailor this to the situation of each person and all i did was give you what i would call a generic type of one so if all of you can lie when you feel like it and have lied when you didn't feel like it and added on to whatever you heard even though it wasn't true and passed around information and just throw away information to people that maybe they heard maybe they don't why can't i do the same thing this is called for the freedom i give you i take to myself so now that you know when we were doing that i had my hand raised also i wasn't leading you in prayer i was also i was also confessing my sin i was saying i do that too but when i do mine it and you walk away and people are watching like this to see what on earth you're doing where you're going which plane you're getting on because they want to ask you some questions but they never seem to find you when you do a strange number now i only told you that because i'm spiritual inner awareness is backwards just like telling the truth by lying is backwards  say we say tell me the truth then we lie boss comes in and says did you call everybody on the list you say yes because you go just a but he's out the door so he doesn't hear that just about or there's some sort of way that people have of saying yes and you think it means yes but it really means yes i heard what you said any answer and if i answered it would be no i did not do it some of those are when they ask a question you say yes i heard you that doesn't mean yes i call anybody it means yes i heard you but we want to hear what we want to hear i was recently working with the young man and he said  really want to know god i took it it was word i didn't know it was like  so i said well one thing you can't have to know god is a narcissistic complex and be self possessed by your own vanity and he goes i   beside himself with anguish gee i really felt bad think that i was the cause of the anguish because i was giving a stepping stone of how to get there the person really said i want god in my terms to justify my thoughts and my reasons as i have them and that will be the god for everybody now see everyone's got that god already right you ever do something and you feel so self righteous about your information and you say god is that not right if it's wrong tell me and silence and you say therefore that's right and we play the game all i would like to suggest you people do that is your god is just a little too small the god we're talking about has to be large enough to be over everybody in this room at least so for us to frame that in a workable definition we say then i want for the highest god or the highest good of all concerned at that point a lot of the lying and stuff stops because you've got to start including your neighbors the person sitting next to you in the information that you're putting out you can't make an emotional statement of commitment without putting your body on the line to fulfill the commitment that's apocrypha see if you don't do that if you decide you want to make the decisions then you have to be responsible for those decisions and accountable for the results and when we find out that that's what happens to the boss we decide we don't want to be boss will we'll step down the line a ways and pass the buck to whoever is going to do that but it is an absolutely amazing thing the deviousness of human consciousness in the mind that when we want something we will say almost anything to get we even get to the place where we start promising one hundred camels two thousand elephants two hundred tigers a wart hog and they were you getting all those sous i get what i want from you i'm going to start looking them up and so we say bring those first and then we'll decide if i want to do that we say no i don't want to do that now let's translate that over to spiritual topics we say i want the kingdom of heaven i want god does that seem like an unreasonable request for a human being to put  want god i want to know god i want to walk and talk with god some of us go no i want to be god he want to talk with anybody else but i want to be got i'm not talking at quite that level of ego i'm talking a little humbler state called just say no or side when i asked a question or give me a signal if i get to that door before somebody sneezes there will be a god  in the meantime i'll throw pepper in the room to help ensure the results of finding this and so we go through very strange rituals and very strange procedures to try to guarantee the informational idea that there is an omniscient being who doesn't really know who we are what we're doing then if there is one that knows that why are they letting these other people get away with the things they get away with now what you've done is immediately taken this great god and reduced it back down to your idea of what's right and wrong immediately you brought it back down our job as strange as it may be is to keep god up for god belongs in the sense of a great cosmic lord but we also have to keep in mind that all the scriptures that are sacred and i'm not talking about all scriptures because some of them are sacred i mean some of the stuff you've written i'm sure isn't sacred even though you might think it's a scripture sacred would be that the presence of the spirit of god is manifested in the words  a written there and that presence of the spirit of god in those words will witness to you the thoughts of god to your spirit and then you can know what is taking place in the spiritual realms so that's one way that can happen but how much of the bible or the qur'an or some other book do you have to read until you get that information well all you have to do is read one scripture in one church take that same scripture to another church and let them read it and then compare the two interpretations of come out of it and you know that you've got to read a third scripture because those two are going to be somehow in opposition are not so god said what i'll do is i'll just stay in the kingdom of heaven and never a thought that was really fine so they go to temple they go to synagogue they go to other places and they pray to god but it's sort of ridiculous to sit and pray to something in an empty room that's called talkin to yourself and if you talk to yourself there's something wrong with you so they put up something up to the front room so it looks like you're talking to somebody i mean if you're if you're talking to a statue rather than to yourself that's a little more saying if the statue talks back well you got a miracle and a lot of religions that the statues talk back i've often thought that was remarkable i went there and they decided that they were talking that day so i if you're god and that statue doesn't like me i'll just go home early but then we found out that along came a guy named jesus the said the geography of heaven has b the people around him said this guy's going to get in trouble he started to rewrite where things are and how they work watch him now of course that's what jesus was saying he was going y you know watch what i got i got a message you know and they're all saying we're going to watch him like something he doesn't want of course he wanted it so they come up to his they says the kingdom of heaven is at hand now if the kingdom of heaven is a hand there it is how much further you have to go well seek first the kingdom of heaven and all else will be added unto you air that doesn't do it i'd like it to do it because then i would have to do a thing else except make things with my hands so somebody said could you define  little bit more closely he said well try this one then the kingdom of heaven is within you so you go great in my churches you're not going to see this very far off is it ridiculous not to the people who are doing it do i make it sound ridiculous i make everything sound so i mean i even sound ridiculous so what difference does it matter but least when you walk out of here you're going to have a look at all the different things so that if you've got something stuck inside of you that doesn't belong there you can start moving it out so you can get what really belongs there there and you're going to do that according to your own speed not mine then he said something really interesting he said suffer little children to come and to me for such is the kingdom of heaven so there's a big question what are little children like everybody says innocent i you people who got little kids know they are not innocent they get into all sorts of things but how old is the child that he's talking about is it two months old two years old  night how old is this child when does a child stop being a child and start becoming something else well jesus at twelve said i got to be about my father's business so that would be an adult level at twelve so it's got to be something lower than that if we take it down to about a year old there's one thing that's going on with that child that is not going on with anything else and for sake of just pinpointing it is called original learning the child is learning originally all the things it is continually having newness all the time it's coming new the kingdom of heaven then in all the parables is said to be that that brings for great harvest that that is so valuable you'll sell everything to get that that is pure and not even corruptible that that is innocent that that is a riginal so guess what we can't come to the kingdom of heaven with preconceived ideas about what it is we almost have to absolutely wipe the mind which we're not going to do i mean we've all studied long hours to educate th heaven now i thought he was playing a real trick because if the kingdom of heaven has all of that in there that we're all seeking for it's everything and you seek the kingdom  heaven and all else will be added unto you why would you want anything else so we seek the kingdom of heaven out of the consciousness of greed i'll seek the kingdom of heaven find it then i'll get the rolls royce then i'll get that girl and i'll get that house then i'll get to smile and i'll get that job and i'll get this and i'll get that then i'll do this then i'll do that nowhere in any scripture does it say that's going to happen but it still says seek first the kingdom of heaven now right there at that point you have half of information about h there is a rule inference that up to this point what you've got so great big warehouse called heaven inside of you and there's nowhere house man to get the stuff out to you so jesus made a really profound statement he said this that i do you're going to do an even greater because i go to my father prior to that he told somebody my father is in heaven and i'm going to go to my father and all the things you ask in my name you will receive but there's a catch in the phraseology because a lot of us have said oh jesus please help me with my illness with my baby with my relationship with my car running out of gas please lord have a service station open i know i should've gotten there earlier boo boo forgive this boo boo haven't open and you run out of gas and you go lord where were you when i needed you i asked in your name what is it when we're asking in a name spiritually the name of something is what the something is what that something is i we'll be following this if you can name somebody you can control them very seen a bunch of dogs going down the street and you  and wanted to a turn their head look in and keep going somebody else yells out max max comes out of the pack of dogs and comes home because he knows the voice he knows that's his name and he's now controlled by the one who called him and he is a brilliant to the will of the one who called him so there's a statement in there that very few people have caught in this called more appropriately if you ask in my will keeping my will foremost for you then i will give it to you well listen if you've done all that you don't have to ask because it says in another place even before you ask i know what it is you want and i'm starting to supply it so why i guess what he's talking about is when you sneak up on something that he didn't know about and you decide you want to do a pop quiz on him to see if you can supply something amiss it's got to be something procurator like that but how can you pop up on him when he says even the hairs of your head are counted and god knows all of those how could just sneak up with a sneaky question he probably know that also but sneaky is not in god's so that one gets cast aside there is a a real tremendous thing about working with the spirit in the spirit in god's will in god's will for you if your will be for god remember the all statement many are called but few are chosen why if you were call of god he goes you know you come on and you don't go why why would you not go if you recall because it isn't called that way it's called in your spirit not in your intellect or in your ear and usually we don't know we have a spirit a soul until the spirit enters into it stirs it and gives information to our spirit who translates it to the soul down through and we pick it up and know the reality of something independent from our thinking not only that we get electrocuted crazy time it was no crazies you're right no crazies voices i'm the lord you go right lord that's the lord everybody else in the room gets up and walks out ok lord you ruin all my friends what have you got mine says come back next week now tell you if you ever notice in the bible that he's always testing because i always got test i mean if i showed up on monday i showed up is go bring something else on tuesday jesus you know i'm just load myself down for this voice and i show up on tuesday says pretty good bring your kid on wednesday oh me you want to use my kid to you fine you bring a kid he says put the kid on top of the stuff take this match and light it you got your kid forget it just take out your knife and slit his throat you know this is my kid you want me to do that you want me to go buy this voice that i hear this it do all this and then you want to kill my kid right you've got a point to make you've got a point what's what's the point what's the point is it just kill the kid so what if i don't do it this is a kill you say ok kid i get another kid in that sort of the thinking we do so you get ready to do and he goes never mind the guy goes and then the time is that the kids throw because i was going to say never mind i'm g s a lord that don't do that i've only got two more kids at home you know what do you want well you read the bible you find stranger things and what i've just said in there of course it's not quite that way by put two stories together otherwise it's not interesting because it's very boring but when you go home and read it you're separated out and then you put it back like i did because it's more interesting but just about the time you go to sleep story goes don't you're the kid here and we're going to play this game let there be look and this is supposed to be spiritual because now i just want to see if you do it you know what a father said no because well you could have had all that laying down there that you were looking at you go oh that land yes right so as far as you can walk in three days you have all that land you start to illegals walk geez you got more restrictions you got more rules you got more regulations what is it you want from me he says obedience i want your beauty and i want your love to be obedient and i watch you do it willfully and when you do all that i'm going to give you everything and even to your children could you put that on paper is this is can we get this down where i could i want to check it goes no i am the lord god t speak of to the and when i say it it's done a who might argue with some voice it appears like that so take off and you do it then you find out messiah and he says there was a man can't call john bab just came walking ahead of me say repay and be baptized and receive the holy is somebody didn't do it and they really didn't do it because he said repent be baptized then receive the holy spirit why didn't you do  see rabbi i didn't know if the holy spirit was worth me repenting for because i have a little bit of what the holy spirit's about then i'll decide whether i want to repent because it doesn't work that way you've got to change your ways first anything other than you doing you know what the word repent means to turn from not to look at as you walk away from means to turn from and what we now today call that changing your lifestyle just a modern statement of you've got to change your lifestyle if you're going to have something different in your life if not you're going to have the same stuff you've always had so they said if you want the kingdom of heaven you've got to stop doing this thing to always produces this junk you think and i'm tired of it jump so just turn from who take my junk when i turn to don't worry there's always somebody after junk don't just don't work in it turn around he says repent he says if you look back to the old way you'll be turned into a salt lick lot's wife didn't believe him she turned to look back and says oh my god that woman looked back again to go that salt lake but if he turned back and looked why didn't he get turned into salt i'll tell you why because like every good herdsman he was making sure the herd was in front of him so he didn't lose any of the sheep of the cows or promise that was in store for me now we come to a modern day thing see if you take the bible and put flesh and blood on it all of a sudden the darned thing comes alive right now and you say hey we don't have to read this valve that i am one who art thou we can put it in plain everyday english and communicate the same information without getting caught up in the tradition all we have to do is come to the behavior that is required in cycle synthesis says if you change your behavior you change your attitude now we have some psychologists and here some psychiatrists you know if you're walking like this so we say change your behavior and walk a little more up what happens the energy flows up because you're pulling up the energy coming up you feel it because hey this feels good your mind immediately goes out to find a good object to put the feeling on because we've got to make things match in this world that's our prime job is make things match even if they don't make a match so we have some to talk about later on so then we get a happy thought with this happy feeling and it all started out by just standing up straight now most interesting thing is they're telling people don't run because i've ever seen people who are running a long distance pretty soon they're running slopping like this and there are things flopping all over muscle structure going out ligaments going up problems in the knees problems in the ankles some doctors delight is running down the street want to say now is get out and walk vigorously for ten fifteen minutes and change the pattern of your walking if you walk with your right foot forward mostly this time walk more foot forward that throws the physiology of the body off and makes it reach into great in a new way and you start to feel different about how your body is working you start to feel differently you're not going to feel the same old junkie you're going to feel differently in that differently and the doctor said this is good for you and you start to get better lungs you hit up some stairs and before where you're at the top one and i are walking like this go you say progress i'm progressing that progression is all spirit working in through the body we've got ample ample evidence of the spirit in the body what we don't have ample evidence is the soul in the spirit so what we do is we go to pray we know that body activity changes the conscious mind so we know that walking down the street thinking about our problems and praying is not fruitful because the emotions drag because of the content of the mind you've done that you know that so we say i'll go to church with i shake up your physiology let me tell you and you get down there and you've got a needle down god you know that when you found me you will have found a fool but you know i've been a fool all along because i've done all these other superstitions they haven't worked i'm going to do this so we kneel down we pray and we watch here but in the got their hands like this or like this so they go oh postures the postures of god it so you posture why you prayer and you say you do that and you get up you walk out nothing's happened so you go the he wasn't busy maybe he wasn't here i'm going down to church down the street i have some friends said god is down there and so now we've got god geographically located in structures can you understand the foolishness that we will start to go into can you imagine why we lie because we're hearing people lie to listen about profound sacred things and if they can lie about that why can't we lie about just a little ordinary thing there's no problem with that everybody's lie in fact lying is one of the most useful tools you will ever have as a human being to protect yourself against all the unimaginable and imaginable it is a talent i had a friend that was going home because he found out his daughter had a story to tell his mother and he wanted to get home and watch her develop this skill of lying because she was going to have an ability that would last her all through her life i suppose he wanted to make sure that he knew what it was and how she was going to tell it so he could pierce it and get around it well we played the game called  get away that deceive all's fair in love and war and then we come before the lord to say lord if you would just give me this one i will not ever again whatever it was that you were forget it the deal's off i kept my side the bargain you didn't keep yours it gets into the religious circles where they take a plex of money they passed on to give you money give me when i give  me now that's not too far away from the way a lot of these things work but does that make it bad or wrong that is just another ritual where we're ritual doing something all the time hoping that this ritual will connect somehow with a spirit of luck and therefore we will get to win the lottery and therefore we will get to get all this and then we'll get all this and we'll get all that and if you stop to think about it to get all that you'd have to receive all that lottery money on one day for at least six million dollars but they give it to you like twenty five thousand dollars a year for the next thirty years you go son of a gun i won't be able  y that stuff that's the way the games played there is a strange game that's played with humanity and we're not wising ourself up to the fact that the spirit inside of us is the spirit that is in god we're not wising up to that we are wising up the fact that we are psychologically different from other people around us and we do screwy psychological things and therefore we think that because of what we do that's who we are or because of what we read that's who we are or what we eat is who we are or what we drive as who we are so that would make me a ferrari avocado and there would be no human being here if all that work that way we know it doesn't and you have the same time are worth enos our worthwhileness to come before god is based upon what we do what we think what we haven't done and what we have thought and yet the scriptures say all of them every god takes you as you are not your body not your mind not your emotions not your personality you that you this being talked about had better be found out what that is because that's the one that's gone and the rest is going to the dirt and that gets to be a slow sobering time because you're saying well doesn't the personality survive after death the part that's good goes to the soul the part that's no good disappears goes back to nothingness so what then do i have individuality as much as a soul individualize is that you do how do i know that travel into the soul body and take a look has anybody done it hundreds thousands of people are these near death experiences no these are soul transcendent experiences where you're wearing the chair and you're aware that you're going up out of your body and your where you moved into the spirit and you're aware of what's there in the invisible and you get to look at an amazing thing is you get to look at it directly as it is not as it's reflected to you through your eyes here in the body as it is the most remarkable thing is when you see people for what they are you absolutely fall head over heels in love with all of them you just can't stand the beauty that is god in everybody it is astounding we get to know about it because we'll get joy i will get that happy feeling or we'll get that something comes up we go that if i could just keep that forever i forgive everybody everything i do i forgive everybody everything we come down we say except these couple things now and so we're laying out bargain systems we can't do that we have to say it's all forgiveness or it's a none forgiveness see ninety nine percent is a bitch one hundred percent a breeze if you sit down to do ninety percent or eighty percent spiritual exercises you're going to have failures and that personal failure will take you to do something else if you sit down and you say this is it this is one hundred percent or it is all and i want to do this within god's will and i don't know what that is and yes lord i'm going to wait on you and you can take just as long as you want to because the spirit in me is a spirit in you and through that i'm calling you you will receive a manifestation of the whole spirit or the holy spirit it cannot be denied to you when you enter into the spirit of god and the spirit of god is very simple let go and let god let go relax let god be patient so you're patiently relaxed but eternally vigilant because there's a sneaky little place in the scripture that says and the lord comes like a thief in the night that doesn't mean he comes from the sons down that means he comes in the darkness of your mind when you are your most negative miserable person the lord will come creeping through in the backside of it and you will see him he said a light came on the world in the darkness didn't know it w will only believe what it can taste and yet you go on oxygen all day long and you can't do anything with those so you play the game of contradiction on one hand and total acceptance on the other that splits the personality that starts to get character disorders that starts to get us into psychotic breakthroughs where we feel like we're going to explode and split we finally come to the place where we say oh fall and i picked you up you'd know it was me i go wow you've got a great sense of humor one of the signs of the presence of the spirit of god his humor when you go to somebody and they start to tell you jokes and you start to crack up and you don't know why you're laughing because they're not funny in that comes deep in the belly and it's just starts to move and you get to go home you find out your backaches gone your legs  you think gee a good laugh sure helps that burn controllable vibration of humor that comes up is the healing of your spirit in you matching the healing of the spirit of god you know what the problem is nobody's told us they tell us how to get pregnant how to have babies nobody tells us how to have the holy spirit and god and how to die and go to heaven and those are things that are happening to us nobody tells us it you'll find out that you have to die to find out now you come to my church that will guarantee what kind of a guarantee do i get it's on paper here in the bible if i get to take the bible with the lambs if it isn't true how do i collect trust me i'm saying no no no no check it out there is a way there's a method to go in and find out but you have to get past the mind you have to be able to call on the spirit above you through the sacred names of god and when you're connected to those you keep calling them it's like calling a dog all of a sudden it shows up and you're on your way a buffet and the mine still sitting down here going ect and you're up there looking around serenely going look at that blabber mine and just keep talking that's something that i'm not telling you as a fantasy i'm telling you that as an alternative to the way you know god you can give him light not walking down the street in your car in your bathroom in the shower in the tub anywhere the important thing  is is get the and light and john rogers closing where it's where they shan't which means the blessings already are the blessings the ideas and the concepts which you've heard are just a small part of the abundance of material john roger has shared with us over the years if you would like a free book by john roger journey of a soul call this number one eight hundred eight nine nine two six six five you can send e mail to service desk at m s i e dot o r gene or write to that which is post office box five one three one three five los angeles california zip code nine zero zero five one dash one nine three five this has been that which is with john roger thanks for joining us single person mission or something like that i saw it as a we all know those of us who one violence and war and things like that to stop i want to change your question that i saw in this particular situation is the willingness to go in the middle of it and just actually start talking and meeting and in some ways getting in the midst of