attempted to draw a map of the internet to some extent trying to be geographically correct insofar as you can do this with the internet but it really tries to show all of the different relationships relationships that would need to be maintained on the internet and the issue of trying to verify you know who is on the other end of the connection or the other end of the connection and that's really what we're trying to address here incidents you can find real examples of significant problems but there are also problems we see these problems every single day every single day of the week i'm particularly looking at this every e so just sort of quick run through if you're a end customer or a customer network you know your upstream provider may well be saying okay i can take your traffic to so then you have route hijacking so again as i mentioned this is more intentional so this is where once or twice a year but this is happening every day of every day of the week then you have ip spoofing so there's sort of two main issues here so requests and send them back to the to a completely different machine which is the intended victim and that's the origin of a lot of most distributed denial of service attacks so again not a good thing to robust security measures doesn't actually bring immediate benefits for an individual operator really that everybody or at least a majority of networks need to be doing this for this to be effective so it's very easy to say well okay if i do was a little bit surprised by this myself but it's really quite surprising but even very large networks just simply are not aware of they have routing incidents and they're not they're not they're not aware of where they're occurring once we started to put together haven't really got there yet with reference security and we need to adapt that sort of thing that we need to shift the paradigm we need to shift the paradigm here so we need to accept that there are some things there are certain practices that should be done and should be and the other is using applique ai which is i would say slightly newer although it's still been around still be possible for about ten years at least so rational security controls  problem that pretty much anyone could put anything in there and perhaps the bigger problem is that if you have a network actually has to take have to actively update that information so let's say they practices that have been around for quite a long time on the internet and bring these together into some well defined actions which can help you know what hopefully eliminate all of the most common threats to the routing system so this is nothing new under the were at spoof packets coming coming from telia we could check where they were coming from but they haven't had any we haven't got any information for this month and then unregistered prefixes here as well these are the list o so that's also having an impact as well so yeah so the evidence suggests you know this is still early days and you can perfect thank you so much kevin and so we have gotten in a couple of questions during your presentation and i was thinking that we could walk through a couple of them right now so  string i think you know for a large network probably every day perhaps and certainly the observatory it rolls over every day so the it's not real time but it's usually within twenty four hours you will see something