the certification requirements of fifty thirty two required of the attorney general or their designated successor as given in the c f r and which this court is made clear is the united states attorney certifies to the district court one of three things the only one being position must be the dream was doable and proceed on the i think that the first two positions definitely turned on that that finding the certification position does not by you know you're absolutely correct that that should be the default setting cases in which the juvenile represented herself or himself to be an adult and there was no conflicting evidence and then they've gone on from there if you have you found any case from any security district in which the precise point was that there was evidence going both ways i did not i'm making this an issue of first impression for this court and i think in this case it is something more than ambiguity that have been to call the mexican consulate the mexican consulate official testified at the age determination hearing that one starting of this individual here and then if the database and it immediately popped up that he in fact had been voluntarily returned to mexico on october twenty eighth less than a month before his arrest in this case that showed up didn't i mean it was very confusing reading the record with regard to watch showed up on the federal database but i gather and frankly there seem to  information out was turned back to rodriguez p and say you provided me with x birthdate is that your real birthday and riddle he answered him affirmatively and turned to him and saying but last time i asked you yourself your birthday was x was like your birthday right excuse me i'm sorry without under fifty thirty three until they've spoken to the consulate or or a parent's right to go pee and make contact with them explained to that adult individual rodriguez peace rights and then a violation of section five zero three three why wasn't it a harmless error when they saw him driving the truck fleeing from the truck with the the aliens they are well i think that the financial gain issue  evidence from the other material witnesses the other indians who were smuggled who indicated that they have but was there something different about the information that came out via the confession rosarito he actually admitted not that he confession i think there also may have been different issues under this court's decision reasoned decision and united states versus lopez about when he came into the united states and those timing issues some of that evidence would have been provided by the material witnesses but most of that was provided by two and the rest of the juvenile delinquency act which fifty thirty two specifically rest on congress's notion of passing the act that federal jurisdiction is not the place where juveniles should be handled in the first instance and that well i think that the reason to think they're thirty two is an act of the way it is and they're written the way it is is as is gatekeeping method and so while she may have to send somebody else to do that it still has to be done and she still is the one responsible for signing that that certification and basically making sure that it isn't clear that she has to sign the factual sting's opposed to the declaration that there's no federal interest it's clear that she has to find the start of the case and fifty thirty two lays out what troubling well i will agree with you on this point you are correct that in the education hearing he did not bring up knowing about the three juvenile horse and that i mean he certainly created the impression anybody who juvenile and probably at least on your theory to a speedy trial act provision that that was didn't become operative for her about a month later should have been operative a month earlier if he had been forthcoming well i do believe that is inconsequen mr sounds are new as mistreated lou is recognized and is judged history recognized rodriguez p was aware that depending on whether he was a juvenile or adult could manipulate how he was going to be treated so we don't have any cases in the only cases we have that addressed whether or not they knew he was a the person was a juvenile come after the fact but why does that matter for purposes of interpreting the statute that's protections the constitutional protections were applied now what i think this circuit has not quite done but should do is adopt the procedures that were provided in the salgado complicates  you give the government some leeway if they reasonably should have known or some such standard that congress didn't choose to put that standard into this into stacking and i'm not sure the basis for reading that ambiguity was he didn't say anything and there was a past record of being a juvenile delinquent but he was he was standing now only once but twice i'm an adult and there was good corroboration behind that and that's what confession and if so then we look at the prejudice caused by the confession and i did so he was he was interviewed in the absence of his guardian parents counsel whatever right and i think it the very least there has to be some some weight given to the fact that it was his fault at least at least fifty percent i would tend to say more that he was i could never tension because of what he said and what he insisted and that's why he didn't give the protections that we need to have an evidentiary hearing as to whether the violation was the cause of the confession as if assuming that we found that there was a five a three three violation i don't i don't believe so you are because there's no question about the fact that there was there was the court specifically found both judge houston and the magistrate judge that he intentionally set an adult and they both found that that's not the issue i mean the issue is whether we're still mean that there was a violation aren't is there a way to tell without an evidentiary hearing that the violation didn't cause the confession well two things they would would have been a violation but for his misconduct but second we also know that in a different case if there was a there was a reasonable if there was a reason to think that this guy might be you know clearly injury but this is rodriguez even at the late liturgy that we found with seventeen years ten months all sitting there on a computer at least that was not clear and again even with that information none of that was any more any better evidence than what they had he could he counsel your  that it was not possible on the evening in question for officer cells or to confirm absolutely and beyond reasonable doubt true age mr rudd rigaud p who apparently had numerous until it's proved conclusively to the contrary what burden or or prejudice does the government or the community or california suffer if he's treated as a mistakenly say so he is treated as if he was seventeen and when in fact he's nineteen he just looks seventeen well we have a couple reasons it's a criminal case he was just driving the wrong when the freeway endangered sixteen illegal so and i think that is a legitimate interest for pursuing the the case here and you know that they complied with the constitutional protections that were permitted and what we're dealing with is whether the regulations were complied with thank you very much thirty seven but i could be wrong and i don't have it in front of me but interestingly enough in this case to write a real key was not housed in juvenile hall after he made a claim of being a juvenile what happened to him is he was detained and placed on administrative segregation at the relying on that is some reason why we can't process when there's ambiguity we can't process them as juveniles is somewhat ridiculous when and in this particular case when there was a ambiguity they just left the juvenile and isolation at the imperial county jail which seems to be more across the border really is encountered these people before he's gone through the whole procedure he's told different ages at different times depending on what he thinks is in his best interest and in fact has been sent there across the border as  been using the protections of the g i and his age as a story in the shield is the light by the fact that once he was told he was charged criminally he still didn't say that he was a juvenile so clearly he wasn't all that savvy because that would have been the time to bring it up not