made and keeping in mind that we have read the briefs and we are intimately familiar with your case and there's quite a bit of yes ok great all right and as i'm sure you know the microphones in front of you are for recording only they are not for amplification so if you would keep your voices up we'd appreciate it a regard to allegations of me please so be a legal proceeding take does not mean however that they have legal proceeding law enforcement should lead criminal procedure is all that's all the events that happened after the nice letter was sent including defendants communications with the state's attorney occurring in the context of not the case here so when you talk about protections in place for work repeating these statements that were made to police even though the university is supposed to by federal law with these procedures in place legislative proceeding or some other proceeding that warrants is a warranted warrants absolute immunity that's fine to see that because someone initially y however longer you know down the road said you know right it's been two years we really can't we're not going to file criminal charges in this case in the meantime skewes also pursuing the procedures that the our institute has in effect for moving students which is really her because what she says this most recent having a stalking her she won to get rid of him she wants to be not privileged unless there are indeed of reliability and these subsequent proceedings there must be something to produce act the victim or the  be accused from unlawful statements but in illinois the constitution provides the at we may speak freely subject to defamation  allusion to cross examination there as you know here it was a testimony i mean you know it's not like you're giving us the best record to make this sort of know he was not told exactly what the what these men what the allegations were no i'm sure your client would like a lot of discovery i'm sure he'd like to have you know more conversation about this the question is whether or not there ought to my client doesn't take any thrilling talking about this but he believes he's been treated them fairly and he hired me to try to prosecute that nance what i'm doing it's not it's not a game it's not record it simply simply inappropriate  motion to dismiss so my insurance in the complaint must be taken as true and my allegations are they act he was not allowed to cross examine he was not given any process he was not victim changes depending on the procedure adopted by the school that she happens to go to or which she has no control might have been the victim they don't have any input into what procedures a school security was privilege correct and right there in the course of the investigation that ensued at the school of the art institute her repeated allegations of the same events that she reported to security our privilege depends on the procedure adopted by the school that the art institute over which she has no control she's supposed to determine ahead of time by looking at the determine that i would say that the record is not clear at this point what she knew what it was what happened before the board what was considered all of those things a ever says the burden is on the victim to determine in advance whether repetition of the allegations against the accused to an internet body investigating them in the school wouldn't she i think the presumption is they at if you make a statement it should be true and you are subject to the constitution and if you make a false statement you may be in jeopardy i don't i don't know i understand what you're saying but what we know what you're talking about here is three people who are all students of the same school the alleged misbehavior took place and campus ok and when the first one of the victims first decided to complain they went to campus security and there was campus curious a boy might want to go to tell the truth the you presume to tell the truth they asked with the school had to rely on it she was telling them the truth and then they proceeded so students of students know all that they can be subject to  lawsuit for defamation for falsely reporting sexual harassment by another student will that encourage or discourage such reports and at schools i think we need to encourage the lawful truthful reports there's no doubt that this is an issue when i am talking about is it hasn't matched in the complaint which are bound to accept at this moment this was not a truthful these were not truthful statements e s you could have decided that she was not credible and representation would have been that nothing happened to your client and she would have been found to be not credible i don't know if there's a punishment in line you complain about behavior and then what it just drops off the chart because there's no way to get it through word there's no way to take it forward without repeating what you said you know you have to draw a distinction between criminal proceedings those would be absolutely privilege but here except you're forgetting mr son private school campus with rules that they established which although it's now not clear from any of the briefs in this case maybe it was in  would that mean this handbook is given to the students and this court has already decided that once you accept the terms and conditions of the handbook and accept being a student at the school you're sort of bound by those rules as to the rules you  live by on campus and that's fair because it's a private institution equal right to say this is what we will tolerate this is what we want to tolerate so once the student becomes aware of it in that in that student guide to the student handbook or however it's given to th students then also includes the process that they're going to use to hear any problems which really put it in their hymn book it's the spirit here's how the groups that all by the way you're right to bring an advocate if you want to a person of your choice your right to be conduct procedure states that the person process is whole educational needs her and it's not a criminal proceeding again it says it's intended to be educational in nature it allows the student an opportunity to respond to recall but as recently as you know if we don't we don't know we don't know maybe your colleagues know yeah this recently as august two twenty eight team your client was held to be somebody who had no business being a where near the defendant in this case right based on testimony in a legal proceeding in front of a judge let me say that is at least as recently as august to twenty eighteen your client was forbidden from having any contact because of testimony that was given before a judge here in cook county about the behavior of a she kerry then the indiana supreme court consider whether or not there were any sort of protections in place to to in effect punish or discourage individuals who make false reports then the in the note of supreme court did not reach a under federal law all schools like the school of the art institute a little tired to follow up on the points of sexual assault in fact they must appear they must report numbers at the end of the year to show that happens when students make those statements for the be required by law exception and it doesn't apply to the statements by the victim the only statements are required by law yes i understand that the university is required by law to conduct an investigate these crimes but then punishments and hold them liable if they choose to participate how this will conduct a thorough investigation if it does are terrified to participate in those investigations the third reason that the absolute restatements of a line are indeed privileged within the same you are proceeding in this case don't confused we're not talking about a criminal proceeding we're not talking about anything other than a student conduct hearing that is not a continuation of  anyone to defend something like this is we we've seen you have two years the investigator conduct investigation and the interviewed witnesses many witnesses between current and former students in the councilor education program and so forth decision that they do not make a final decision they make a recommendation and in this case to police you blind me who made the final decision an individual who was in her discretion could have done and did whatever she wanted to do so that this is not a border's the ets let me hearing how that ends in determining this that or the other this is the least one person in her further increase gender equality and she said it's not one or the other it's both we have a system of justice where people who are too scared to process so it's just applying to this field what we have applied generally that's why me asking you to do to apply in this case what we have done in illinois generally and recognize the interest  both the alleged victim yeah and some of the uncertainty that they may face but also the rights of the hughes who maybe well