region at that time no u s flag vessels had been attacked by pirates in the general conclusion among our witnesses was that ships should focus on implementing the anti piracy measures that have been identified as likely to fraud attempted pirate attacks such as transiting the one of africa and night and at the highest possible rate of speed and employing non lethal measures such as water hoses now however we convene in very changed circumstances to u s flag vessels the maersk alabama and the liberty sun have been attacked by somali pirates one of the attacks resulted in the taking of an american captain richard phillips hostage he was freed only through the decisive intervention of united states military forces including including navy seals will eventually kill the pirates holding captain phillips after it became clear his life was in imminent danger these attacks against america alabama and delivery son of a first known pirate attacks against the united states flag that's all since the end of our war with the barbary pirates in the early eighty's hundreds of these attacks conducted by young men from the desperately poor nation of somalia who have threat that our nation must confront that said united states flag merchant fleet has always been able to rely on the protection of the united states navy to ensure its safety as we saw with the mass alabama that navy is more than capable of handling this karen threat nonetheless at the present time it appears that united states flag fleet is essentially being left to handle a team even security needs by itself o may twelfth the coast guard issued maritime security directive one zero four dash six which purports to quote provide the maritime industry with specific risk based measures to  attacks including tensing through established transit lines we live in erratic course changes and travelling at the highest possible speech additionally the directive requires vessels to supplement will supplement ship  crew with on door on armed security based on a partially specific vessel threat assessment conducted by the operator and approved by the coast guard and the boat whil best our nation appears to have to offer a merchant mariners at this time is instructions on the steps they should take to protect themselves it is not at all clear to me why the navy or in the absence of a willingness to act on the part of the navy the coast guard isn't providing imbarked to military personnel and a few u s flag vessels that transit the one of africa region most of which i know assets are far from the scene of the attack and sadly in the time that it takes a navy to respond to an incident another hostage situation may have been created putting another united states mariner at the mercy of pirates who have already announced their intention to take revenge against us mariners for the deaths of their pirate colleagues in the maersk alabama and then given the realit direct payments to us flagged ships to ensure that they are available when the government needs them given this isn't it in our national interests to utilize the very limited u s military resources that would be necessary to protect our u s flag fleet rather than leaving them to implement their own defensive measures we look forward to hearing from eyewitnesses on this critical issue today and when that i recognize  crew and ultimately by our military forces despite this and other successes somali pirates are currently in control of at least fifteen ships and as i said our last hearing i think this type of piracy cannot be tolerated by the united states or the international community and this hearing provides us with a chance to examine the ways to respond to the ongoing and widening threat as a result of the continued piracy off the coast of somalia many in the maritime community  looking at ways to enhance security of merchant vessels including the placement of armed security personnel aboard ship operating in high risk areas of vessels crew has every right under u s and international law to defend themselves and the vessel including the use of deadly force however i do have some concerns about just how a vessel operator and crew goes about arming the vessel how many personnel should be armed what are the training requirements can arms be taken into foreign ports and what are the legal ramifications for the crew and vessel owner if the vessel is defended using firearms i hope that we will be able to address these issues and get some of the questions answered today recently the coast guard issued new security guidelines that vessels operating in these areas must comply with several of these new guidelines will require changes to vessel procedures and i look forward to discussing with our witnesses from the operating and labor communities how they intend to implement these changes and also look forward to hearing your views on whether the united states military personnel should or could be placed on board u s flagged merchant vessels as a deterrent to piracy lastly i hope the coast guard will address how they intend to certify or monitor the capacities added aboard u s vessel vessels piracy is a major concern to our nation and the american taxpayers and indeed all the world americans are directly paying into maintaining an anti piracy presence in the horn of africa region and consumers well to malee absorb the increased costs associated with rising insurance rates and rerouted to lengthen voyages due to the threat of piracy incumbent on us to examine ways to minimize and in fact and this threat and its impact on world commerce and our own national economy want to thank the witnesses for their testimony today and i look forward to adjusting these issues and others with a subcommittee as we move from you grammar that's morning mr chairman distinguished members of the committee and i appreciate the opportunity to appear before you and discuss maritime piracy and the coast guard's role in addressing this threat to freedom of the seas to the safety of shipping and most importantly to the safety of mariners in response to the threat of piracy off the horn of africa the coast guard has been working closely with our government and industry partners with the international maritime organization and through the international contact group on piracy off the coast of somalia to strengthen preventative measures for merchant ships and to develop international regimes for the prosecution of apprehended pirates we've also been involved operationally by providing forces within the limits of our capacity to do so to the u s central command which some of which have been interned assigned to scene counter piracy efforts although many nations have provided naval forces to the region to counter the threat of piracy it remains equally important for merchant vessels to take appropriate measures to reduce their vulnerability to attacks to best identify realistic measures particularly in light of evolving pirate tactics the coast guard has working closely with domestic and international maritime industry leveraging longstanding relationships forged in our transportation safety and security roles as new security guidelines are developed the coast guard updates its requirements for u s flagged vessels to modify their vessel security plans plans which are required by the maritime transportation security at the mechanism by which we convey specific anti piracy planning requirements is the maritime security directive which you mentioned in your your s the most recent directive pertaining to and site anti piracy measures was released last week and we are continuing to work with the industry and the interagency to implement its provisions it's important to note that the two u flagged pirate attacks that were were mentioned in your in your statement mr chairman the maersk alabama and the liberty sun each had self protection procedures in place and their crews were prepared to take the appropriate actions this exemplifies the kind of pre planning that we want all of us ships to undertake internationally the international maritime organization has been very active on this issue as head of the u s delegations imo the coast guard has been deeply involved with other flag states and with industry n g o s to revise anti piracy guidelines placable to international merging fleets piracy is on imos agenda for the maritime safety committee meeting scheduled to convene next week in london and we will actively participate in that meeting the coast guard has also actively participated in imo sponsored regional initiatives to improve international governance including the development of the djibouti code for regional cooperation we've assisted the state department in the development of bilateral a bilateral agreement with kenya for the prosecution of apprehended pirates and we have been heavily engaged in the contact group on piracy off the coast of somalia in this latter effort we co lead with the u s maritime administration the working group focus specifically on industry self protection measures when piracy events do occur with communications among involved u s government agencies is exceptionally important mechanism for doing this is a maritime operational threat response process where motor motor has been used in over six hundred cases since it was first established in two thousand and six however the recent alabama and liberty sun cases where the first ones related to piracy post incident debrief within the interagency indicate that the process worked very well it ensured complete coordination among multiple agencies having direct responsibilities for different aspects of the government's response as mentioned earlier the coast guard has forces in the region under the operational control of the u s central command coast guard law enforcement detachments have been specifically assigned to combine task force one fifty one where they augment u s navy vessel boarding teams these teams have been directly involved in the apprehension of pirates in several recent cases the law enforcement detachments expertise and vessel boardings at se as well as collecting evidence providing witness statements and handling suspects has been an asset to centcom in closing mr chairman i want to assure you that the coast guard is committed to fulfilling its statutory and regulatory responsibilities for the safety and security of u s merchant vessels and crews we will remain engaged with the industry in the implementation of anti piracy measures identified in the directive as well as with the international maritime community through our role in imo and the contact group thank you for the opportunity to be here today and i look forward to your question mall short commons sort of thank you sir addressing piracy is important to the united states and to the world frequencies is crucial for national security and international commerce duties strategic the gulf of aden and there were one hundred twelve pirate attacks of those hundred twelve private pirate attacks forty two were successful by the numbers that's less than half a percent now we can ignore pirate attacks and we aren't suggesting that but  the low numbers have grave implications for us with regard to military allocation of resources further the targets that we're talking about as you pointed out a very difficult to track and we're not engaged in pirate attacks they blend in with the rest of the traffic further when the attacks are rapid and short duration and hard to respond to in any timely fashion even if you just over the horizon finally after the attacks are concluded the pirates managed to get to their safe havens and blend in with the population and are difficult to get to for several reasons not the least of which is sovereign territory the point of this is that for the reasons i just stated it is regrettable that there is no clear understanding that the global military forces much like civilian police orses cannot always intervene if a criminal strike as a result may shippers have been slow to invest adequately in basic will cause to unite piracy measures that would render their ships far less vulnerable working with other departments and agencies we're working on a comprehensive strategy and we're seeking engagement for other nations to deal with the threat of piracy today in a gulf of aden for example there are thirty four vessels from other from over fifteen nations working together to stop this thread the conclusion d o d will continue to respond and support u s flag vessels but at this present time that's all we can do thank you thank you very much  chairman and distinguished members of the committee i appreciate this opportunity to testify about the growing problem of piracy off the coast of somalia my name is charles i can and i serve with in the office of african affairs at the office of the secretary of defense reducing incidents of piracy is important both to the united states and to the international community piracy endangers innocent mariners disrupts commerce causes economic damage to shipping companies and contributes to instability ashore especially in somalia from a regional perspective our goals as mr frothingham has said are deterrence disruption interdiction and prosecution but achieving these will be challenging for several reasons first the challenge of space the pirates operate in a total sea space four times the size of texas which is over a million square nautical miles secondly there is no effective and reliable central governing authority or capacity in somalia at the moment pirates can operate with impunity from coastal fishing villages as long as they have the support of the local somali clan leadership the regional governments in somaliland and point land have demonstrated some capacity to provide limited services including law enforcement in most respects somalia remains on government allowing pirates to use coastal villages as safe havens third even when pirates are captured serious gaps remain in the international community's ability to prosecute them for their crimes and thus create an effective legal deterrent although all states may exercise jurisdiction over pirates as a matter of international law some states still lack the appropriate domestic laws to prosecute pirates in their own courts when the act of piracy occurred the high seas other states have appropriate domestic legal frameworks that lacked the prosecutorial and you dish will get past the to effectively hold pirates accountable in this regard we applaud kenya for agreeing to take on the task of prosecuting pirates in such a large area of water and with so many other critical national security priorities it is not possible for a military to prevent or intervene in each and every attack but with the appropriate industry lead on board security measures in place the vast majority of pirate attacks can be sorted most pirates are opportunistic criminals whenever possible they will focus on the easy targets and avoid the difficult our main task now is to assist commercial carriers in making their ships hard targets thank you for offering me this opportunity to testify and i welcome your questions and comments thank you very much the morning chairman cummings ranking member low beyond members of the subcommittee i'm pleased to have the opportunity to appear before you today to discuss the serious threats coming from the ongoing piracy problems in the waters off somalia throughout two thousand and eight and continuing into two thousand and nine  global piracy situation has grown substantially worse particular in particularly an ever expanding area off the coast of somalia where more than twenty thousand transit each year the impact of piracy has been very significant but the american public has only recently become aware of the situation with the attacks on two american flag vessels both of which were carrying food aid cargo for somalia acts of piracy threaten freedom of navigation implode and the flow of commerce off the horn of africa piracy attacks disrupt the flow of critical humanitarian supplies in most instances pirates demand millions of dollars in ransom for the release of hostages ships in cargos press reports indicate that in two thousand and eight pirates received an estimated thirty million dollars in ransoms for the release of see jack vessels in two thousand and eight forty two vessels were seized by pirates operating off the coast somalia and globally eight hundred eighty nine eight hundred eighty nine mariners were held hostage by pirates as part of ransom demands in two thousand and number of attacks continues to rise but the success rate has been reduced we had a recent spurt in april though that was a little bit out of character with the rest of what's been going on in total there have been more than twenty seven successful see jacqueline's in two thousand and nine with more than four hundred seventy six seafarers captured and one seafarer was killed by a pirate attack last year last week excuse me the gulf of aden which links the mediterranean sea in the suez canal with the indian ocean is one of the busiest shipping shipping chokepoints in the world an average of fifty commercial vessels transit the gulf daily and many of these vessels are vulnerable to attacks on average about one u s commercial vessel enters the area each day and on any given day about three to seven vessels are in the in the waters that we're talking about many of these u s flagged vessels carry department of defense cargo bound for operations iraqi iraqi and enduring freedom and u s flag vessels transiting the region also carry humanitarian cargoes generated by the s agency for international development or other international organization organizations to the horn of africa including djibouti somalia and other countries in east africa or south asia early this year merritt intensified its efforts in the fight against piracy to further improve coordination between industry and the various navies participate in the gulf of aden to provide voluntary assessments of security on u s vessels to further establish best management practices to prevent piracy and to bring industries perspectives and ideas to the inner agency process since maritime labor is uniquely vulnerable to pirate attacks with mariners killed harmed or held hostage as part of ransom demands merit has included maritime labor in discussions and meetings the most recent merit broadly focused industry  interagency meeting was held on april twenty third at d o t headquarters merritt has also participated in senior level industry and government discussions and scoping sessions with the defense transportation system focus led by u s transportation command and the national defense transportation association military seals committee the most recent meeting of this kind included vice admiral gortney firsthand perspective as the commander naval forces central command the united states leads efforts to enhance presented international industry develop best practices to it at the contact group winery in cairo in march b m p's to counter piracy at the contact group  merit has also supported the dissemination of counter power sea guidance and we have worked to better the coordination between military civilian operator operators in the region merilahti quiets provides us flag projected schedules in the waters off somalia to malia to the national maritime intelligence center and vessel tracking information on us like vessels to appropriate military authorities since the recent attacks there are additional b m p's that have been learned and these are being about you waited and we will provide our views to coast as they as they consider directives given limited military resources available to fully protect commercial ships shipping in the waters off somalia there is an increasing focus on the issue of shipping companies hiring private armed security personnel to protect their vessels while transiting the off somalia however there are many complicated factors which must be addressed before the industry as a whole can adopt these recommendations these include the need to develop appropriate standards for armed security providers compliance with ports state restrictions on arms aboard merchant vessels entering many ports in the world consideration in reaction to the potential escalation of violence due to the presence of arms on board commercial vessels issues of safety for the crew and bessel rules of on the use of force design constraints of vessels to carry additional personnel insurance and liability issues and many other related factors clearly clearly the maritime industry needs a government of government's assistance in this area to set or guide standards and measures of performance and m actively engaged with other agencies in understanding and developing the needed guidance on the use of armed security the u s coast guard recently issued an updated marsac directive that requires the employee implementation of several security protocols many of which are similar to the development of implementing guidance on the use of armed armed or unarmed security most recently married engaged the marine insurance industry to determine the effects of piracy some of the piracy situation on insurance rates and the effects on insurance of carry armed security personnel aboard for their ships the concerns of insurance companies have been made clear the use of private armed security teams has not been fully addressed in terms of rules on the use of force ports take control and fire arms the certification of security personnel and vessel crew and safety doesn't crew safety all of these issues raise serious liability considerations from the standpoint of the marine insurance industry and underwriters who share their concerns on the absence of standards the need to bet security firms potential liability implications to the owner insurer and security firm and the potential escalation of hostile actions going to have to wrap up that will increase the pressure had the opportunity to hear we will do everything up with a comprehensive plan is that what you said when do you anticipate that happening i think it's an ongoing effort working with the inner agency and international community and many of the efforts that the admiral was talking about our participation is there one with the other partners and agencies so i don't have a deadline right now and it depends on the actions of a lot of other factors that we don't control now that we have our own you working on that plan to start with respect to engagement with the international community yes are we are  see as the next step is encouraging other flag states who operate merchant fleet to adopt the same best management practices so they will harden their ships as as was described the hardship is i square nautical miles making it difficult for naval or law enforcement ships and other assets to reach the scene of a pirate attack quickly enough to make a difference and to quote you also noted that th relatively low incidence of pirate attacks has implications for how we allocate military assets in the quote and you noted that the d o d is fighting two major wars and it's faced with many competing demands its resources and then you know that many of the resources most in the man for the counter counterparts the activities such as intelligence surveillance and reconnaissance assets are the same assets that are regionally required elsewhere in the world wouldn't it wouldn't be possible and relatively inexpensive just place for a five person teams i've been barred to military vessels in the one of africa region military seal of command we also embark security teams numbering twelve or less that are trained and on commercial vessels charter only to carry duty cargo but on our charter that goes for six months or longer we train members of the crew five members of the crew to beyond and provide security for that vessel is less than that we don't have that training imbedded in the program so if it's  hundred eighty one hundred eighty days or less carrying a duty card we don't train crew members to do that that that's based on allocation of resources and the risk and force protection involved with the interest in the cargo that we're shipping you know something up or something that's come about recently because of all the problems how long that's been i mean whether this been something that's been happening over the years also want to know whether there has been any consideration to expanding that because again we're looking for practical solutions and sounds like that since i mean this is something you'd be doing to a degree and just wondering what what you're against all the combat command so they're in demand and pay common other places as well we do that based on the resources then and the threat that we're facing in the requirements that the combatant commands levy on the that gets to the question of the vessels that i was describing of the six month leases or longer carry an exclusive duty cargoes they are given the status of sovereign vessels and we do that as as a protection of the sovereign vessels vessels less than six months carrying duty cargo and mixed cargo or non duty cargo are not considered to be sovereign vessels and we would ask them to rely on their own devices vessels and u s citizens be left to essentially defend themselves fred i couldn't help but note that you state that and i quote this is a this is a context in which our actions will be most effective when hiring when private partners take proactive measures themselves in the post so if a foreign threat was attacking americans say in washington d c would you recommend it the best response would be for those under attack i hired hired private security guards and strengthen the defenses around their home why is the situation different when the attacks against americans are occurring outside the united states as well another good question sir thank you it's been a couple of things one of one of things you characterize them as a foreign attack on washington d c of course we wouldn't rely on homeowners to defend against an attack from a foreign threat to united states however we consider pirates criminals and they are treated that way in the world therefore we would take measures that would be anti criminal measures we think that most of the attacks can be forwarded based on the measures that are being recommended by the maritime administration and being approved in the coast guard's planes we think at this time that answers the i'll turn it over to the ranking member the members of the unions that represent our nation's merchant mariners are concerned because it appears that the d o d is not taking the lead in protecting u s flagged merchant vessels is it the case that protecting u s commercial shipping is no longer among the primary missions of the united states navy and if so when exactly did this change in mission for our needs take place i don't know i'd have to go back and read the mission of the united states navy to refresh my recollection but i i believe that defect defending u s flag vessels is a mission of the u s navy i don't think it has changed but it's  mission said that has to be balanced against other requirements levied by the present united states and based on what congress wants us to do we will of course defend u s flag vessels and we'll continue to do so we consider got a very important emergencies katrina showed us that we weren't except for the coast guard and i just wonder when if things got worse what we'd be looking back saying that we wish we had done things right now i mean to prepare there's a book that i just read called peaks and valleys and it says that when you are in your valley you need to be preparing for your peak peak you need to be preparing for your valley and it just seems that i just worry that when it comes time for the rubber to meet the road we'll discover there's no wrote could you explain what you mean by ability or right you're you're on a vessel you're part of the crew you're under attack by pirates can you defend yourself you have the right and ability to defend yourself i certainly agree have the right i can't tell you whether they had the ability to defend themselves because of the hands on the ship with that in mind do you think crew members have been definitely under u s law for incidents to make her want to wrestle if they're responding to an attack try that one i believe they do there that is a risk that that that that the crew has and i think it is one of the things that we need to be very careful about an hour with our expectations of cruise i think the fundamental  responsibility of a carrier to protect his vessels with lethal lethal or non lethal measures is a reasonable expectation it raises a lot of issues though and what we in the government need to do is when we establish security directors we need to address those those variables as well as we can i can assure you that there's a lot of work being done in the inner agency on this coast guard has the lead on directors i don't want to speak for them but they have pulled in maritime administration and other agencies to try to address the serious issues that are raised in this environment that we're talking about so we don't pretend it is easy  have if they do something irresponsible in while trying to defend themselves i think that's that's a great area that is in the eyes of the beholder so certainly this whole situation puts cr in jeopardy we've had a couple of instances where military force i believe military forces have have fired on fishermen thinking they were pirates and it raises a lot of legal  issues certainly if it's a soldier does that it's different than if a mariner does that a mariner i think is personally liable and a whole host of legal issues come cascading down on that  there's a lot of discussion whether from the industry and from all interested parties on what is the best way to protect and to defend ourselves  chairman indicated his belief that the united states navy should should actually just play a part of the role we haven't had much discussion now about if the navy or the coast guard is able or on willing to play that role what about what's a thought about a team of private contractors that are former military that have military training but are not u s military that are hired sir there are a number of companies that are already doing that hiring private security to protect their ships and their crews so we know if it can be done one of the reasons we included that option  our maritime security directive is because it has proven to be very effective deterrent to pirate attacks and a recent briefing by admiral gortney from the central command nab santis unable component commander he indicated that in twelve cases of pirate attacks on merchant ships that have had to embark security teams they've all been successfully repel so in many cases just the  demonstration that the ship is protected is sufficient to dissuade a pirate from continuing the attack so they are very effective so that might be something that will be looked at as a possible recommendation as as folks unfold on developing a strategy yes or that that is in fact included as an option within the maritime security directive armed or unarmed teens i know it's a complicated issue  and my time's expired but just a quick observation that we're taking our time as we should and there bridey of different legal in all kinds of issues involved with this but i venture to say that if there were an incident tomorrow s like vessel where u s citizens were harmed or killed we'd have a whole different attitude about the urgency with which we're dealing with this and the measures with which we'd be willing to go to tha often is people and i'm not talking about you all just somebody in general people look at a problem and they say it's hard we're going to deal with an idea what is going to deal with it and then actually you know five years go by ten years go by but in the meantime a lot of damage is done and some kind of way we've got a set that's why this committee has consistently set timetables because we realize that that unless you measure something unless you set some time tables nothing may happen that's a problem and we can't simply cannot afford for nothing to happen and so that's why i asked you a surprising him you know exactly what you all timetable was with regard to this and i promise you i'm going to this is our much appreciate you having this hearing today i want to compliment even though he's on the second panel to vocally for his statement i think a lot of people have outlined a problem and the only real solutions i saw were in his statement so i want to direct this to the gentleman from mary had this vocally point out that in order for american flag they'll sort of carry weapons that twenty weapons is that per vessel or  sir i'm not certain of the provision i would imagine that that is per scene good to get a clarification get a clarification arthur so i think he talks about a temporary export license and then i'm going on to telling i would think that's your job and maybe a year ago it might not have been your job but if we are a maritime administration that's in the business of promoting maritime commerce for our nation i would think one of the resources that you can provide them is to say if you're going to be delivering something to somalia if you can be delivering something did you bootie if you can be delivering some to the united arab emirates these are the rules we've made calls ahead of time and this is what you should anticipate the second thing is since it is a very real problem going back to said the maersk alabama should never have been hijacked it was fairly fast and had house odds so it didn't so according to your rules they've already broken that rule and there are a lot of tankers that are a lot slower and a lot lower and they are vulnerable and so again mr mr chairman i think we really have two options and i very much appreciate your willingness to do something number one in the short term we have to decide whether or not we as a nation are going to put our folks on board and there are a lot of ways to do that coast guard port security teams individual augmentee is from the navy reserve and it goes for reserve from the marine corps reserve i guarantee if the call went out to man vessels on a temporary basis until we came up with a nation national program you would have hundreds of volunteers to do just that secondly on the long term i agree that it's probably ought to be done by the private sector because we are involved in two simultaneous wars and we need to do to come up with a set of rules but the maritime administrat needs to be going to twenty two c f r getting a clarification for these companies what they can carry have an agreement with the nations that we're going to be calling on as far as the exchange of weapons if we have to lock up weapons while we import if we have to lock up weapons weren't for domestically there has to be some clear cut rules and you would think our nation would be taking the lead in letting people know what they need to do and we're not doing that and again both of you are exactly right you know we tried to do it on the cheap and lost over twenty aden because we didn't have waterside security on the cole and almost lost a billion and a half dollar warship in addition to those twenty sailors we try to do air time security on the cheap and resulted in two planes flying into the twin towers and the third inning up in a field in pennsylvania that probably would hit the building across the street and another plane that hit the pentagon were trying to do this on the cheap and every one of those they also if you had it exactly right your statement here the care in american military cargo or american aid cargo it's our stuff and we have to defend our stuff because it's got our flag on the back of our crews on board and it ought to be something that is when people say well why should i have an american flag vessel it's because we're going to defend our stuff that's the difference between having american flags or flag convenience i appreciate you having this hearing and we ought to take the lead and if we don't do it through this committee and we need to do it through the armed services committe absolutely mr i was just sitting here and i was just thinking about being effective any fish and and one of the things i'm hoping that we can do that both sides can do is come together with our recommendations the foot regard to what needs to be done and present them to defend and so the coast guard so that we let it be known the things that we think ought to happen now they are trying to come up with a comprehensive plan i just think that that we need to coming out of this committee at least make our recommendations to them that's things that we're going to have to do i'm sure as a legislative body but i think that this matter is of such urgency that we need to do that and we need to do it soon and the things that you just recommended and some other things that i've been thinking about such as training extending this training but we'll get to that but i just think that we've got to make we've got to put it on the committee the appropriators etc we're probably going to have to prepare a floor amendment so that everyone can vote on it once rather than going through multiple committees and dragging out forever but i much appreciate your willingness to address this enough and at the very least we ought to be dictating a part of the cost of getting that contract to others to deliver military aid or food for peace program that you're going to have to have an on crew on board and we recognize that there's a cost associated with that we set up the rules as to what the minimum crewing ought to be we don't need to come up with a lot of rules of engagement we need the people on the scene at that time making the rules of engagement i just think that would make more sense but thank you very much  place whenever the coast guard deploys in a title ten capacity we do so at the request of a geographic combatant commander so in this case it would be central command  sent so we don't self deploy it's always in response to a request for forces from from the geographic commander the forces we have in theater right now are there on on that basis that the  competency to to engage in this kind of mission yes but as as you well know sir very much constrained by capacity so should i request come in from the combatant commander we would do everything we can within within our capacity limits to provide the requested resources but then they would centrally work for a combat commander and take their tasking from the combatant commander and i think this question has been put to the entire panel that let me revisit  term that that is great i think they have a right to defend themselves clearly but if they do the wrong thing under the wrong circumstances that they have they're going to have legal issues that they're go  if you're talking about naval vessels it averages about one hundred seventy thousand dollars a day and how many vessels were involved pending on the times or two to three ok and how about aircraft i would say we had at least a couple aircraft involved i understand some of those be classified the reason i asked the question is i've been briefed on this issue both overseas and domestically and it's my understanding that basically what's happened is that the shipping industry has made a cost benefit analysis and they've said well the cost of putting up a crew on the ship and arming the men and cetera et cetera i just high enough that they figured out the probability of getting a ship taken over and the pain a ransom there's what the pay the ransom it's a kind of reinforcing bad behavior it strikes me but on top of that they're socializing the costs in other words so they decide well we'll pay the ransom but if it's u s ships u s crew we're going to feel obliged to rescue those guys and i'm glad we did and credit our seals and their all the other folks for doing it but it a huge cost to our taxpayers and i'm just wondering about if it's not time to change that cost benefit ratio in some fashion meaning you don't just get to say uncle sam and the seals and the navy and the marines and air force and ever else plays along going to rescue you you've got to put up the scratch and roll it into the cost of your products to me that's got to happen as chairman i just and i'd welcome the gentleman thoughts on that it just doesn't seem that the cost benefit ratio as it currently works works out fine for those guys except if we lose a valuable life or we lose precious cargo but talk to us a little bit about that cost benefit ratio if you  would it's a little out of my line sir but i think you're right i think it's where you allocate the cost the consumers of the goods will have to pay the extra cost is the industry pays the cost of protection which is maybe a good place for it to be if we don't do it that way then the taxpayers pay the cost whether they consume them or not so average out the i can't comment on the cost benefit analysis by industry perhaps that's best left to the second panel but i can tell you that collectively within the interagency and also in our government and industry dialogue there's i think of opinion that we don't want to have another u s ship boarded by pirates so our collective goal is to not get into that situation overall there's a another aspect of the cost benefit ratio as i understand it and that is that just given the size of the area and the mobility the pirates and then certainly the taxes it's virtually impossible to patrol it you know we have token ships out there and they can respond within a certain amount but that's not hard to see where token ships are and you just go somewhere else and so not only is it costly it's also ineffective and inefficient and i just don't see another way other than arming the ships at sea and and having the owners pay for it that you're really going to achieve the desired result sir can i please can i just add something with respect to the cost benefit analysis we've commented that most of the ships in those waters most u s flagged ships and as waters are carrying some kind of government cargo d o d or food aid in both respects the government will include in the in the in the payment the government payment for services will include the cost that the carriers are bearing and we are putting those costs into the calculations we need the cooperation of carriers to know what those costs are obviously but we will put those into the fairways reasonable rate calculations so that they do not by themselves bear the cost do you mandate that they be armed vessels with some high risk vessels that are highly vulnerable may only be able to obtain a maritime security approval if they are in themselves i mean we're talking about low and slow understand it and it was protected by gurkhas armed with knives truly and they were hauling a pretty valuable cargo and as tough as a carcass is i think it's crazy if that was the security at the time and it sure my belief is that there ought to be a bright line that says you attack an american ship ship or an american crew you've got a high probability getting killed and mr chairman i think that it's out of this committee for nothing less than this that every pirate anywhere on earth knows if it's an american ship and it's an american crew and you try to take it down the guys on board are going to do everything they can to kill you and they will be armed and capable of doing so tha thank you very much mr chairman and my first question is just for the paddle in general and we've been focusing clearly on the situation the gulf of aden and off the coast of somalia but do you see the risk of piracy expanding to other places in the world for example when i was in the navy back in the early ninety's the straits of malacca near indonesia were considered to be the high piracy areas but any other areas that are developing to be a   a piracy hotspot for quite a while it's still an area of concern and one of the main differences is that there are there are coastal nations there that have applied resources to tamp down that problem that doesn't necessarily exist in the horn of africa another region of the world is off the coast of nigeria where we have a number of u s flagged offshore supply vessels operating there and the oil and gas industry which are often subject to essentially armed robbery it's a different modus operandi they don't seize the vessels and hold them ransom but they go on board the vessels and rob them at gunpoint for valuables so to short answer yes there are other areas of the world where we are concerned one more question regarding the somali pirates and their sophistication do they seem to be still just a group of independent operators are we seeing some sort of coordination amongst different pirates when they're out there on the water and coordinating their attacks against merchant vessels in the area some aspects of that will be classified but we do they they appear to be some cases independent operators there are various clans they're involved in this do they do sometimes provide each other assistance but and in many cases they are independent operators just sort of sort of entrepreneurial and in some cases this is almost a business proposition someone puts up the money recruits people to do it decision is made about who will get what percentage and then they essentially ally and wait and look for an opportunity it's  essentially opportunistic criminality it's not organized crime per se but there is a low level degree of of organization and in if i could continue sir in regard to your previous who are relatively developed and you have capabilities and who agreed to work together we don't have that in the gulf of aden now yemen has a coast guard i think i can't speak to their mission but i know that they are involved in counterterrorism  missions somalia does not as i said in my statement it doesn't really have a functioning government somaliland implant land do have somewhat functioning governments and in fact there is a point land coastguard which does function but it is very poorly equipped very small numbers and eventually what we would like to do is get to the point where we could build up those kinds of capabilities around that area so that they would have their own ability to to address this  issue yes or in the straits compared to the you said four times the size of texas is the air you deal with off the coast of somalia i mean the straits is pretty narrow so those choke points and and you can get it coming through one last question  coast guards to secure directive vessels operating the horn of africa region must resubmit their vessel security plans with additional security protocols regarding terrorism piracy and armed robbery by next monday and i just want to get an update on that how receiving will vessels be placed under operation restrictions prior to the proof of any amended plans and will they be required to meet the standard checklist of security member measures with certain requirements  apply only to certain class of the vessels and there was a very short time frame fifteen day timeframe for people to acknowledge that they had received a maritime security directive and then to implement a lot of the measures that are contained within that directive in that short timeframe we've knowledge it will take longer for the companies to actually submit their revised plans and in some cases the measures may take longer to implement so we're foster say that you're working on coming up with something did you hear that you guys give the chairman a specific date of when we could expect that i remember hearing him asking for but i don't ever remember hearing your respon you're correct we should we have no time certain that we're doing it's a complicated process involves a lot of factors that we don't i haven't got the time can you give us enough time that we could expect no ma'am mr chairman i would just say that in my opinion the comic's operable to come before this committee to give a testimony and not be prepared to tell us when we could expect to get further information it may be complicated but what happened on the sea all of the american people and across the world witness was also complicated and for you to come to this committee with no timetable in my opinion is unacceptable and i would recommend that we send a letter to the  that's what this is all about we have learned as legislators that and some of you have never before the subcommittee so let me tell you what this is about and i'll give you back your time  then they wait long enough so a new congress comes in sometimes a whole new group of people know new chairman everything's new and then it starts all over again and you find that you have going on is america around never getting anywhere fast what i would suggest is that you are the commander in chief's very words the urgency of now and that's where we're getting to we're trying to get this done because we we have a limited amount of time to act period you know this is and i say it over and over again this is our watch this is our watch and if we fail to act then i i am convinced don't necessarily control is the international aspects of how the plan is being carried out the plan is being under n s c control we can certainly provide that for you there are four working groups work groups one has to use me sir with all due respect i've only got three minutes of talking and i get it ok what i'm saying to you is we need for you to get it what our chairman just said is this is on our watch if you haven't watched newspapers lately i'm not going down for you i am not going down for you not addressing the concerns that are going to be said because what's going to happen is if this happens again next week they're going to comes our committee the american people and say why didn't you take action and what i'm saying to you i'm not carrying that boat for you it's your responsibility you can have you say you have this basic plan but what we've said in this committee is your plan isn't working you don't currently have a plan in to determine if in fact ok we've got these contractors whoever's security that are on the ships and they shoot and they kill somebody what's going to happen then so your plan have to go further than what you have because you have not given authority to these various security people that god forbid you go in and you make a mistake and you shoot someone that you should not shoot then what happens i'm kind of familiar with whitewater blackwater and so on you tell me what is the perception across the country with blackwater and what happened in iraq i don't think it's positive and we had to work to establish standards that we as american people can believe and say yes we might have contractors but if we're going to have people on out there doing these things they have to follow certain regulations from what i've heard in this committee you have not established what those regulations are and because you have it that makes us liable and for me what i'm saying is that's unacceptable and i'm not willing to carry that for you what i'm willing to do is to ensure that we fix it and so with all due respect you have a plumbing area planned but it needs to be adjusted and so what we're asking is when do you think with these international groups and whoever you have to work with when do you think you can make those adjustments my expectation would be as if you can't tell us now you would come back in writing to this committee and say this is the time frame that we think we can adjust and oh by the way i would suggest you have a plan b because judging from an article that i saw that was tuesday may nineteenth the organization that's supposed to work to do some of this has backpedaled on what they feel they need to do so we as americans are going to have to decide if the international community doesn't figure it out what are we going to do we still have that responsibility and my question is when are you going to come up with that plan finally i would say i think it's wrong to suggest that there would be private companies private individuals to do this work and in the words that you said sir it's a great area and it's in the eyes of the beholder what happens to that individual who shoot somebody and unfortunately kill somebody they're either going to be hung up and read on on the back of some ship or other people another ship is going to be hijacked and i don't think that should be a great area in the eyes of the beholder it should be clearly identified what is the process what is the engagement process what are you authorized to do because otherwise we're all on the hook for this and as i've said i'm not willing to be on the hook for so we need to come up with a plan and work that plan and i think we're completely within our jurisdiction to ask you to give us a plan know and i'm going to yield back who's now my time is expired or they can have all the liability insurance that they want this is the united states of america as someone on the back of the ship shoots and kills someone who should know been responded to in that way that bad for all of us if you haven't learned that in the last eight years we have not made progress it is our responsibility to do what's right and that means is they have a contract and they're on an american ship we're liable for what will be perceived of how we respond it's a bigger responsibility that we have and i when i'm pushing that to you is to say we need to meet  tough and i don't think we're doing it thank you thank you very much  and i'm just curious we we had a tough time getting defensive come to this hearing and i'm sitting here and i'm just wondering is this something you just you guys just don't like is it is such a messy issue that you just don't want to and i'm not trying to be funny i'm very serious when i have an organization that and i'm not knocking you know i need to understand this whose job it is to defend this country and when we have a situation where like this p problem and then i asked a very organization that is supposed to defend the country to come in and talk about what they see what their position is and then for us to have different so getting you to come here i wonder what that means and i must tell you it pains me tremendously and then i listen to the testimony and i went on to say anything with them why listen to it it seems as if there is a i'm just wondering is there a m i'm missing something that we are on defense department to defend us but then when i call the defense department in to what they doing to defend us the defense department doesn't want to come in help me with that they may just be candid with us i mean if it is there an issue that they and we are we missing something with all candor here i'm not aware of any reluctance to come testify it was phenomenal reluctance phenomenal and i don't i don't and that's why i'm saying is i would not say this if it did not paint me it's literally painful because it makes me wonder what this is all about and i'm saying to you is that and i think that's what you're you're probably seeing a lot of frustration on both sides here because we want to see something happen and and then defense comes up in defense says well we're working on it because guys says we put out some directives basically saying you know do the best you can and so i'm trying to figure out then we ask for a plan well we don't know we'll see what we can do i mean this is the united states of america and i'm missing and i'm just i'm sitting here i'm trying to figure out you know sometimes i feel like i'm missing something  so so you all do want to come up with a plan a comprehensive plan you don't know when you go to come out with a plan do you have any idea any idea just give me a ball thousand and eight it's posted on the marriage web site it's available it has three identified lines of action in it i want to come if you wish i can delineate should it be updated in light of changed circumstances possibly so it was never intended it was intended to be a living document and how alive is it when was it last updated if you know well just came out of december two thousand and eight sir ok and so do you so you look at it recently i have a copy of it in in this sir so will you take a look at it and tell us whether you think it ought to be updated yes or no i think it is a it is a good plan this is been the subject of a great deal of discussion among the inner agency and we where is the navy we'll i'll just say this will always respond to u s ships in extremis where and when we can but there is a matter of physics involved and i won't cite the statistic again of the space out there but in both cases that have been mentioned the maersk alabama and the liberty sun in both cases the bainbridge the u s s bainbridge was able to respond within a reasonable out of time and was able to respond effectively as we saw so there is a plan as it is being executed these international groups as the admiral referred to are part of that plan the united states is leading on that and in fact the reason that there are international forces out in the gulf of aden right now s operation at the land to the creation of combined task force one fifty one by nav sound others nations which are not part of those coalitions with the coalition maritime forces well and other nations such as russia and china and india which although they are not part of those coalitions coalitions still operate and coordinate with each other and in fact the military operational coordination is going quite well so that was part of that plan and we have marched through some of those things and i think we probably probably could be looked at i will leave that to my superiors to take a look at that but the interagency has been engaged on this i can i can testify to that  think it's better to respond then to prevent i think it's always cheaper to prevent sir and it's made difficult to respond and that may be you know my earlier comment if we are requested by the combatant commander we will do everything we can to provide the requested resources but we we do not self deploy so it's always under the auspices and at the direction of the combatant commander kathy sir thank you very much captain eighty we have a lot of italian americans down my way but not that name so please forgive me again you know we are under a lot of pressure to balance the budget one of the things that comes up in my town meetings is what does marriott do and i say well they run the merchant marine academy another net i'm not so sure i really think that this is a time where you can prove to the american public the value of merit i think it ought to be your gonna zation that is looking around the world where the ships are going reaching agreements with those countries coming up with a plan of what weapons can be carried on board in the short term we know there were hiring blackwater type crews for our military i'm sorry for vessels carrying military cargo in that part of the world so we have a pretty good idea of what that cost per ship to make that transit it ought to be our policy and it ought to be your policy since you're the maritime administrator that says we're going to have that on every american flag vessel carrying american cargo it means yes we're going to buy a little bit less of something making that transit it also means we're not going to have a national embarrassment or the national shame of losing a vessel losing american mariners and you need to be coming to this congress immediately we can fix a quite frankly where we've got a lot of other challenges and we may not do it as well as you do to see that do it that it's done right the first time for a lot of reasons and so i would hope that you would make some suggestions to this committee because otherwise this committee's going to be sending some mandates to you and i think we ought to be doing this in a cooperative manner given the expertise of your association in the expertise of the people that you have access to on a daily basis and well back to some of the points that were raised by twenty two c f r and any other challenges we have and we have a very short period of time the defense authorization bill is going to be in committee on the seventeenth of june it will be on the house floor before the fourth of july that is one of the mechanisms to address this and we are going to need your suggestions before then but we have permission  of ongoing dialogue with that those regulations the i tire regulations international trafficking in arms regulations are managed by the department of state we are in direct contact with the department of state on those regulations and on the arms export permissions and the individual capacities by which mariners can bring weapons on board a ship it's cumbersome right now but state is aware of the issue and is looking at providing interpretations that would ease the ability for ships to bring in bark security teams on board with with their weapons privately provided teams also you raise the question about port entry by foreign by u s like vessels into foreign ports that is an ongoing concern and in fact one of the reasons that maritime security directive did not mandate armed teams is the recognition that some countries will not permit that but there are also many and i'm sorted to trouble your line of thought but this is a gift of the american people to those contracts it is more than fair for us to say these are the strings attached to that gift we are not going to put our fellow americans or that vessel at risk to deliver  of food or whatever it is in a case a military cargo then we're there for a purpose a different purpose yes sir and if you're going to allow us to use your port if we're going to pay you to use your board to unload this military cargo again these are the strings attached we're going to protect our people we're going to protect of ale so that's a reasonable cost of doing business i think we're in violent agreement ok i get it i hope we would both have a violent said of urgency on the yes sir and i had a briefing in bahrain  december and more or less quote the navy admiral when they see an american flag they back off well that's no longer the case is so now that now that we know they have attacked american vessels then we have to respond in a much more aggressive manner and so one other point i just for your awareness department of state has issued a demarche to two other countries to actually determine what restrictions they would have on the entry of foreign teams into their ports and as that information comes in we will provide that certainly to the industry and we'd be happy to provide that to you thank you thank you sir if i could can i respond to it from the standpoint of mer ad i mean we are we have been very very involved in a separate i we are not the regulatory authority on the security directors but with respect to all of that we've been working with coast guard and we've been in the inner agency on the issue of the the port states with respect carter presents we will get very involved with that we will work with state department i believe your your intervention is is a good one and we will take a very aggressive look at that and work to get those protocols worked out from the standpoint of delivery of food aid into these countries can you get back with me within two weeks as to what your initiatives have been i will give you a yes or we will give you what our initiatives are and we will give you a plan thank you situation of piracy in the gulf of aden and in the indian ocean it's a problem that exists in part in large part because of the desperation of the pirates himself which is therefore tied to the  social and economic conditions on that in somalia and you know an open ended commitment of our navy and our coast guard to that region protecting us like vessels or being part of join my concerns about my concerns about the the use of our men and women are having even security detachments on us like vessels has really derives from that point that when when does this end otherwise we'll be doing this all again it will be an open ended commitment with a growing number of priorities in the world for for military  international community's turnover about one hundred forty six pirates of the law enforcement officials in various countries for prosecution how many of those have been captured and have been actually released do we have that number i can try and get the best i don't have that number with me today and it changes depending on what the reporting was sure i'd appreciate that that number as perhaps as a marker to see how successful or unsuccessful the the prosecution  efforts have been are there any as well significant non liquid assets held by pirates that it would be possible to freeze and is that a realistic approach to combat in piracy either that w probably know the end of it all part of themselves but the base is basically the clans that are running the operations that's a that's a great question and part of the problem is that it's very very hard to track we're working on it and we have been able to  and into act next week in new york at the meeting of the contact group on piracy off the coast of somalia we're probably going to suggest that there be a group establish group it's it's done at the u n but it is not it's not a u n organization but it does take guidance from the two u n security council resolutions eight hundred forty six one hundred fifty one that refer to piracy off the coast of  somalia but it is that it is a group in accordance with the counter piracy action plan which directed the inner agency to stand international contact group that was done so in january in new york shortly after this plan came out and it was spearheaded by the issue but it is difficult and what mr frothingham says is accurate is that a great deal of this money does stay within somalia and i'm sure you've read the stories about the dollars in the cars right so it's it's something that does need to be focused on is to not testifying will be michael rodriguez executive assistant to the president of international organizations a master's mates and violence director of legislative affairs american maritime officers and mr augustine telling us executive vice president seafarers international union thank you mr chairman let me say at the outset that we really appreciate your comments and the comments of the rest of the committee i think you all get at the problems that we are facing every day with our ships operate around the clock in the persian gulf to delivering military cargo is into iraq so the threat of piracy is one that is very real to us the primary principle that we follow and we send our vessels they are is the protection of our crews and for a number of years we have firmly believed that the way to protect our crews and our vessels is to provide armed security and we have provided armed security on a c t vessels for a number of years even the navy and the coast guard has flat out said that if you want to protect your ships the way to do it is to provide armed security and we do that being said there are significant legal and regulatory problems that we think need to be us flag have sailed secure in the knowledge that we sailed under the protection of the u s navy until now the navy seems as you indicated reluctant to provide  armed security for our vessels and we think that this is an achievable solution in the short and near term we understand there is a million miles of ocean out there and to attempt to deploy fleets to protect on board the three to seven u s flagged vessels that regularly operate in that area seems the most cost effective way to very rapidly provide security for ships that being said if the d not going to provide that security for u s flight that's a long and let me also so add that if the navy or coast guard were to step up and provide the kind of security that gives another inducement for others to register under the u s flag and as a one of the largest u s flag operators we think that encouraging people to fly the u s flag is a good thing but if d o d is not going to provide those that support for us and leave us to defend ourselves and our government needs to help us and the first thing that they need to do and mr taylor referred to this is to fix the i talked to regs and allow us to adequately arm our vessels we currently do are more about fools but we do it through a regulatory work around where because we cannot purchase weapons for our vessels and put that as part of this current equipment on the  vessel the only way we can get weapons on our vessels is for the crew to sign for these weapons as personal sex obviously that raises liability concerns for them and it creates all kinds of problems trying to get vessel the weapons on the ships as a recent example about two months ago we loaded a military cargo at a navy base in charleston south carolina we tried it we showed up at the front gate with our weapons asked for an escort to the ship with our weapons and we were not permitted to enter the base with our weapons we had to move our ship to a commercial pier to put weapons aboard to defend a military cargo even when the navy says the only way to assure protection of the ships is to put weapons on the ships so we need to get the regulatory fix for this problem to allow us to adequately arm in addition to that the u government has got to work with foreign governments to allow our ships to enter their ports again mister taylor noted we are giving food aid cargoes to these countries and they are not permitting arms vessels are arm ports where that is a problem so the government needs to address that we also need to be confident that we have the full support of the united states government if we run into a problem out there and i'm not talking necessarily about responding with navy ships i'm talking about this if we get into an armed conflict and unfortunately we haven't had that happen and i will say we have been approached by pirates are armed security team went out on the stern brandish their weapons the pirates turned around and went the other way but if we have a problem we need to know that the state department and the coast guard is going to support us like mariners and u s flag owners if other countries start to raise problems my testimony points out a number on a number of other kind of detail issues that we think need to be addressed one of course is the liability concerns that were referenced in the prior panel and i'm happy to answer any further questions on that thank you mr jim thank you very much mr chairman mr lowe beyond the distinguished members of the committee thank you for the opportunity to testify on the important issue of piracy as you know one of our vessels the u s flagged vessel liberty sun was attacked by pirates off the coast of somalia on april fourteenth just two days after the incredible rescue of captain phillips of the ma alabama thankfully no one on the crew of the sun was injured despite the vessel being hit by four rocket propelled grenades and automatic weapons fire and the sunrise safely in mombasa kenya on april fifteenth the liberty sun was on the humanitarian mission of mercy to deliver much needed u s government food aid to east africa forty seven thousand metric tons of food as a gift from the american people the son's cargo alone is enough to feed two hundred fifty thousand people for a year in several african countries including somalia without revealing operational details for fear of assisting the pirates i can say that one of our vessels is almost always in or near the danger area at any given time so we take the threat of piracy very very seriously our company and our crew implemented enhanced precautions to make our vessels difficult pirate targets prior to the recent incidents captain dahlan gross and the rest of the crew followed our company's security plan and kept their cool under fire no boarding occurred and the crew did everything that could reasonably be asked of them at the time of the attack our anti piracy security measures exceeded federal and international requirements the only thing we couldn't do was shoot back we also wish to thank the u s navy for their prompt and effective response to the incident and are especially grateful to gen duncan mcnab and admiral and rondo of trans com for the help in the liberty sun incident mr chairman i know you would like us to focus on lessons learned we believe the first lesson is to acknowledge the foresight of congress in enacting the maritime transportation and security act of two thousand and two under that act bono's are required to conduct vulnerability assessments and adopt vessel security plans for approval by the coast guard in the case of our company we adopted prior to the mayor schell about me incident stringent vessel security plans containing every measure recommended by every international organization to make our vessels difficult piracy targets our i already is the safety and security of our crews for example the crew of the sun had raked fire hoses over the stern to create a virtual flood wall of water coming off the ship when the bainbridge arrived the crew informed captain gross that they had never seen so much water coming off a vessel in addition the crew erected plywood barricades over the stern of the vessel the second lesson that we should all recognize and deal with are the limitations of these passive security measures it is unwise to assume that such security measures will be sufficient in and of themselves to protect american lives the maersk alabama institute constitutes a game changer in this regard after the incident self proclaimed pirate leaders issued direct threats against the lives of american merchant mariners therefore mr chairman i urge our government to adopt more protective measures for u s flag vessels we greatly appreciate the navy's response to the liberty sun incident and we are grateful to both d o d and the european union for the cooperation we've received to date but responding after the fact as you pointed out in our view is not the most effective means of protecting the few u s flag vessels transiting the pirate danger zone we urge the government to consider embarking small numbers of u government security personnel on those very few u s flagged vessels that transit the high risk pirate infested areas in our view small embark security teams are a more effective deterrent than patrolling the entire million square miles of ocean that are affected also using small security teams is a much more cost effective response than attempting to patrol the million square miles i'm also reminded of a bit of history on this point of dealing with pirates the first federal naval force which became the u s navy was authorized in the naval act of seven hundred ninety four for the express purpose of dealing with pirates in the words of the law it had become necessary to have a navy to provide for and i quote protection against the depredations committed by the algerian corsair is on the commerce of the united states we would hope that these roots run deep in the navy continues to provide the protections against modern p collapse the third lesson we should consider is the possibility of arming our u s flag vessels and making the legal changes necessary to do so heretofore merchant vessels simply have not routinely carry firearms it is true that we have an unquestioned right of self defense under us statute dating back to eighteen nineteen but more recently enacted state department arms export regulations make it difficult to arm vessels additionally ship owners risk being second guessed in both  u s and foreign courts for self defense of measures that were common in eighteen nineteen in light of the recent threats to u s merchant mariners we respectfully request congress consider clearing the legal obstacles that currently block shipowners from arming our vessels in self defense to protect our crews when it is appropriate i believe sir that we are doing all we can within the law to protect our crews we look forward to working with you and other members of the subcommittee and other leaders to bring the u s law up to date i also hope we can come to an understanding that we can switch from a no firearms regime to an armed protection regime overnight shifts need protection now not months from now in the interim we will need either government security teams or naval vessel escorts in the danger high risk transit the piracy problem has correctly been described as an international problem that needs an international solution but we should not let the complexity of the international problem deter us from addressing what could be done in the united states right now to protect our american merchant mariners on u s flagged vessels and most especially those on missions for the u s government thank you for inviting me to appear and i be pleased to answer any questions you may have thank you very much mr johnson thank you mr chairman and members of the committee as the president of waterman steamship corporation and central gulf lines both of which are section two u citizen companies that own and operate thirteen u s commercial vessels in the international and domestic trades i appreciate the opportunity to address the continuing threat of piracy against commercial vessels in the u s flag and in a national fl fleets waterman operates the maersk alabama under charter and is the employer of its crew who are engaged in the recent piracy incident off for the coast of somalia last month the safety and protection of our dedicated vessel cr have been and continue to be our primary concern given the nature of the military and commercial cargoes that we carry the u s flag vessels watermen central gulf frequently ply the trade lanes through the gulf of aden and other waters off the east coast of africa likewise a significant portion of the u s flexibly engaged in foreign trade operates in these very waters consequently unimpeded navigation in these same waters must be maintained to preserve the commercial viability of the u s flag merchant fleet and its ability to support the nation's economy and at military interest however as we know all too well the threat of piracy continues to exist in the gulf of aden and small the bas that's threat directly affects us security foreign policy economic and other vital national interest just a few weeks ago mascon watermen directly confronted the reality that very threat the president of the united states and his administration are to be commended for the measured and effective response to the piracy incident additionally our country should be extremely proud of the u s navy and its highly trained personnel for their actions and certainly the single focus of our entire company was to work towards the safe return of captain phillips and his crew who are proud members of the m m a p m e b a n s r u but the nation national will and that of our u s government must be appropriately directed to eliminate the threat of piracy in the horn of africa region we all recognize that the long term solution is to work multinational each eliminate the flow of monies to the pirates and assist an  viable government in somalia in the interim immediate steps must be taken to protect u s and international interest in the region therefore i would offer to the following observations for purposes of further discussion and action by the s government while the u s government works closely with its international partners to diplomatically restore civil order and a stable working government within somalia we must suggest that the basic elements of fear food and money should be the focal points as they are a volatile catalyst for continuing piracy activities in the gulf of aden in somalia basing fear in that warlords and other threaten families of young men whom they seek to recruit into  piracy food in the fact the warlords and other control a large segment of the population in somalia and use food as a weapon to faustus support for pirate activities third money and the vast sums of money brought into somalia through these pirate activities only serve to create a destabilizing and reckless desire for more and more while those solutions will take time to accomplish we must address the media needs to protect us an in national flag shifting from the threat of piracy are companies continue to work closely with the u s coast guard the department of defense and other u s government agencies in the development of best practices and hance information sharing arrangements equipped to take nonlethal and other protective measures in the event of pirate attacks to harden vessels until help arrives and the use of deadly force and other lethal action should remain the province of highly trained experience military or security personnel additionally we must continue to work with our multinational partners to expand errancy patrols in forstmann activities against parts overall and we believe that  properly coordinated plan then balls all affected countries the us alone arms operators maritime labor insurance companies cargo interest and related parties can substantially reduce the threat of piracy while also decreasing the overall protection mr chairman i would appreciate the opportunity to test i appreciate the opportunity to test that on this vital important matter confronting our nation in the shipping industry we stand ready to assist you in your efforts to address the threat of piracy against all th association for maritime union sitting here appreciate the opportunity to testify before you this morning merchant mariners our organizations represent crew u s flag vessels that frequently operate in waters where the threat of piracy is the greatest our members deeply appreciate your leadership mr chairman and scheduling this hearing we look forward to working with you and your subcommittee to formulate responses to the threats posed by piracy which of the greatest measure of protection for u s flag vessels and their citizen cr american mariners working in for the u s flag vessels transiting through the gulf of aden around the co horn of africa and into the indian ocean continue to face an immediate and ongoing threat from international pirates make no mistake the pirates are targeting vessels as evidenced by the administration's response to the recent attacks on the u s flagged vessels most alabama and liberty sun the u s navy and its personnel have the ability and expertise to effectively respond the navy officers and sailors attached the u s s brain ridge executed the extremely difficult mission of rescuing captain richard phillips master of the most alabama while it is true the pirates never took control of the of the alabama while the sun we the united states have to assume the circumstances will be different should the pirates hijacked another american flag vessel and the result may not be quite as for two is the u s merchant marine is the forethought of defense the united states cannot allow pirates to force the american flag from flying the oceans of the world nor can we allow these criminals to drive american citizens out of the maritime industry absent a u s merchant marine on forces overseas would have to rely on foreign flag vessels and crews to deliver their necessary machinery equipment and all the supplies the mariners aboard those foreign flag vessels may not be willing to deliver cargo for the purpose of supplying the u s military as was the case in the first gulf war in  consequently we are extremely disappointed that the popping of the fence apparently decided that preemptive protection of u s flag vessels and u s citizen crews is not their responsibility we strongly believe first and foremost that is the responsibility of the u s government to provide the necessary protection to life and property aboard u s flagged vessels flying the u s flag is an extension of the united states itself regardless of where the ship is operating the unions believe the most effective way to protect its u s citizen crews is to attach a handful of mill terry personnel each vessel transiting pirate infested waters we understand the waters of the gulf of aden where recent pirate activity has been the greatest encompasses enormous area yes international coalition of navies is now patrolling these waters but nonetheless that's a still being hijacked the area is just too large to patrol we also understand that private industry needs to assume some responsibility and any agreement between the international maritime community must be balanced applied equally to all nations and not economically disadvantaged the u s flag merchant marine a maritime unions up repaired to consider any and all steps that may be necessary to protect the lives of the men and women we represent we believe that attaching private security teams aboard vessel may provide some measure of protection against pirates acts these non us military teams must be properly equipped and trained to take aggressive action when a vessel is under attack however it should be noted that there are serious concerns and risks throughout the maritime industry regarding this approach the employment of private security detachments have raised command and liability issues which must be thoroughly considered before proceeding in this fashion in addition to jam and we would like to address the issue of arming the crew we categorically reject the notion that this should be considered the best or even a primary solution to the problem piracy or that it is the answer to the threat posed by pirates rather we believe it should be considered as only one part of the overall comprehensive response such a program shouldn't compass only the most highly qualified mariners on each vessel who as determined by the shipowner master had extensive training and expertise in the use of weapons conversant we do not believe that an individual should have access to arms aboard the vessel simply an exclusively because he happens to hold a certain rating or license we would ask mr chairman that you and your s vandeleur you wrote in your testimony that maritime labor the extremely disappointed that the department of defense has apparently decided not to accept primary responsibility for protecting the united states flag vessels and the s citizen crews is a very strong statement why do you feel that way we fly the american flag and we feel that we should have force protection in dangerous waters and you've indicated that we send through the gulf of aden or operating in the persian gulf has armed security from them on they hit suez to the moment they leave suez so every one of our vessels has an armed basically eaten the cost of providing arms security on our vessels because of our concern for the safety of our crew that being said and it was pointed out here we are carrying u s military cargo  we believe that the u s government if they're not going to provide military security which they think we think they should the u s government ought to assist with the cost of providing arms security to protect our bow says mr chairman if i could just answer our opinion is that it's the sovereign's responsibility to protect the u s flag fleet and it's u s citizens abroad it's the history of the navy i believe that it was thomas jefferson that sent the marines before the navy was even constituted to clear out the pirates on the barbary coast in africa now libya which were attacking u s flagged vessels i believe no one has a problem with cost to us are we're willing to pay for it the implication that we are not that it's a money issue it's not really the question it's a legal issue there are some people that have put armed guards on vessels there are others my attorneys tell me that there are too many uncertainties both with regard to the ayatollah regulations and more importantly being able to get into the recipient nation's ports because they are the ones often on the food aid cargoes that bar the use of weapons so i don't believe cost is an issue i believe we need to clear the impediments if the government's not going to do what all of us believe is their job then let us help ourselves by providing that security but we need to clear the legal impediments and the uncertainties that exist to do that we not form crew members or have them have access to firearms but let's work under an assumption for a minute that the military is not going to or does not deploy personnel on us like vessels and arming the crew for whatever reason is determined to be a necessity now you talked a little bit about what procedure should be followed like to you to just make sure i understood correctly what criteria do you think should be followed to accomplish this and specifically who on the crew should be authorized to either carry or have access to firearms and what kind of training in your view would be necessary for them to do this first on the training part it would take at least a comprehensive course of getting used to using certain weapons shotgun rifle even an a k forty seven because that's what the pirates are using and you can purchase them in somalia for thirty dollars as far as who would have access to the firearms it would always be under the control of the master of the vessel but who would be able to utilize it in my opinion it would be any one of the top officers not necessarily the top for what it was ever willing and trained to utilize them and i'll fall back on on arming the crew is that if it is the only alternative it's because we don't want to bring a knife to a gunfight and that's what we're being asked to do now since two thousand and three we have trained sgt approximately six hundred people in small arms training what we call small arms course and that six hundred includes one hundred forty coast guard men by the way they are trained at small arms training pistols nine millimeter riot shotgun and fourteen and m sixteen semiautomatic weapons they are trained how to use them and they are trained on how to safely handle them but there is no amount of training that we can give them in that short period that's going to prepare them to take in consideration the rules of engagement it takes a long time for law enforcement officer to take a short time to teach someone how to shoot a gun it's a little bit longer to teach them when to shoot the gun so although we can take the practical training is going to take a little bit longer  if they give us a little beyond just a just a kind of go back and put in a little bit make more a little more clearly what our perspective is we prefer to have our military security teams on board our vessels because they would be acting as an agent of the united states government and from our perspective as labor liability attaches personally to our masters and our officers on board those ships now that attaches whether we have an armed private security team on board or if we're carrying the weapons ourselves so that's that's why we have such a strong statement on why we want military teams and there w before of how that might happen reservists for some time puerto rican national guardsmen were deployed on board vessels so there's there are ways to do this if there's a willingness to do it and that's where our disappointment is that there seems there is no willingness in terms of the training we train our people to basically use the weapons but when you start to talk about using the weapon and ramping up the use of force onboard a ship that's training that that is very specialized and someone just munch mentioned it's not how to use the weapon it's when to use the weapon and again those liabilities attached to people personally and we've mr chairman we've mentioned in this committee that there  are there's a tendency around the world to criminalize seafarers for their actions and their mistakes and this is something that we have very very deep concerns about so that's why when we say we want our security teams on board the military is for second we didn't pay a tribute because we wouldn't do that and we wouldn't pay a ransom because it would be call it that but in order to get our ship back we paid money to the folks who held it so  we're willing to play the analogy out fully let's find someone to negotiate with and start paying ransoms and i don't think the u s government is going to do that and i wouldn't wouldn't want to happen anyway that way sides we need to think i'd like to do some follow up at some point actually perhaps not not today but with some of the folks here in the labor community understand and send their concerns a little bit more the rules of engagement are an important issue and one of were potentially negotiating with other countries to be part of that joint task force the e u also has their own task force the chinese are there operating independently there's some talk that the iranians are going to  deploy a destroyer and an oiler as well and you know there's enough of a mess of rules of engagement among four or five different communication problem as well so it might be very particular it might be a situation that would never exist but then on the other hand i don't think we necessarily saw the maersk alabama situation happening either so thinking about who's going to be armed who's going to be protecting which ships on the ship itself is partly a discussion that you know we have to consider within the broader context of who whose militaries are deployed out there who's helping to respond to which pirate events because you are going to be in a position of having to potentially be communicating and or receiving help from folks that you know maybe didn't expect to get help from my only point is it's it's it's it's a complex picture out there and i want to be helpful in trying to  simplify it as much as possible to ensure the protection of the goods ensure the protection of the ship and sure the protection of the people on the ship and so i you know that's the direction i want to head on and explain where i'm coming from on this issue mr parrot mr larson thank you and i appreciate your thoughts i just would like for the record for it to be known that the chinese government is this courting chinese ships in the  area russian government is this courting russia russians are there to the belgians are taking care of belgian ships after two of their ships were hijacked and the french are now taking care of the friendships so it's not unprecedented that national governments protect the nation state of their flag i'd also suggest with apologies some of our good friends and all those countries that they're not doing much else in the world and so my my my issue there is the the the other commitments that our u s navy has and coast guard has in the rest of the world we just we need to take that into consideration if we had if we had a three hundred thirteen ship navy which we're trying to get to  and we don't have it this would be a much simpler discussion to have my only suggestion is to have to have a broader conversation about what our priorities are and then worry including the this priority and how we get that support and and security out to you and we're trying to get to that three hundred ship navy i know that i know the exact ships that we put out there and it wouldn't be destroyers would be l c s to be flying around sixty knots and there's no way these guys would rather be able to run away from us it would be great but we're not there yet but just so you know i mean that's why we're here we're here because if the government can't do it because it's overextended then we need to be put in a position where we can do it ourselves and we need to remove the legal impediments that stand in the way and we need to do it quickly we need a sense of urgency here i'm for all of it i'm for solving it i just want to be clear that it's not a matter of picking up picking some up and putting down but are i just just to point out again we you know we understand that putting one hundred ships out there is neither realistic nor effective and that's why we think armed security teams you know for less than a crew of one ship we can protect the u flag with respect to rules of engagement that's obviously a concern but we need to have rules of engagement engagement that absolutely permit the people on the ship to make the decisions that they of you for your testimony i think that you understand that we're going to do everything in our power to move this situation along what form that will take i don't know but i promise you we will w ork with the coast guard and others not defense department citrusy what we can do to bring clarity having been a small small business man and i always tell people in government that the one thing that business folks and the they need people to make decisions so that they can then do what they need to do when we are in the suspense gray area is basically what it is it causes all kinds of problems and in this instance possibly it could cost lives so we've got work to do i promise you i promise