sign instead of three years that statement was incorrect but that was a statement was made so i guess what i'm trying to understand is  if the test is whether there was credible evidence or credible information is the statement by that sergeant  beyond that why do we need to even focus on the title decision you know that if we find that the board that it was arbitrary and capricious for the board not to consider your arguments re probable cause why do we need to go beyond the title issue also has implications in and given what we know now with the facts turned out to be there's no credible evidence to support that he made certainly a false statement one of the fences that he was tied with was that he made a knowingly false statement that's just simply they did refer to saying that well he should have updated the school that he and moved me in the form since you're supposed to update us if your circumstances change right if the form does say that and the sworn statements from  records there was nothing they did they never got a statement or the rest or never made a statement or disagree that kind of code actually had told him this is a regular story i made a statement to disagreed with your interpretation of the regulation was interviewed by c h p if you actually look at that interview statement they never see any interview never actually was specifically that they asked her about intent of code they may quote presented and this is a quote presented the are you referring to the fact that the cia of and the remains of war went back and yet we don't think that that is the war purpose is not to go back and correct or or an end and change what the criminal investigation that occurred several years earlier in the if you're here we can just clear this away so he challenge that before the board in the board didn't say anything about it he challenged it in the district court in the district court didn't respond any challenges and here and in your reference to that issue well you just told us that this is an issue before us if so you must concede that he's probably raised he's rapidly raised it in reconsideration in the district  then they didn't raise it on summary judgment so there was no there was nothing for the court to in the district court to consider and you walk us through the difference between a credible evidence believe that the individual may have committed an offense what that means is then they can title that individual their name is placed on the title in walk of the cia and the investigative report of investigation the probable standard requires a judge advocate to review it and to determine if probable cause is present so that would be the same standard that you have and any other one reasonable suspicion and so thousand and five to two thousand and seven and if attention information comes to his attention that that was in error presumably his belief that the orders terminated that he was going to move in the same with ok bracketing all that that's obviously of more factually new arms point but if putting aside the application for extension its denial and the new change of station order that came down in late may of two thousand and seven at the time that lieutenant code put in his application his then current order i believe the sergeant thought he's been current order expired in july of two thousand and seven and only did he later learned that it expired on its face by its terms was was set to expire m so he makes out a statement but then whoever else is in charge of the investigation and doing the report would also have the underlying initial station assigned yes of course up to the needs of the navy as you know he's a military and he was told then prior to that and at the district court he specifically said it's an undisputed fact that he was told early in two thousand seven that his current worst but there are certainly now what what the the board's position was is that he knew that they were now changing everyone seems to agree and i hear you that you've said that very carefully and i understand that everyone seems to agree that lieutenant code heard by word of mouth earlier into seven thousand and seven that he would be reassigned earlier did his hearing that news invalidate his two thousand and five to two thousand and eight order if you can validate them your honor it seems in what the because what you just in change of the orders hearing that by word of mouth changed the underlying or changed his understanding of that if you see it everybody's understanding of what was likely to happen changed and i expired on july two thousand and eight because the reshooting have written july two thousand and eight in that boy that's correct your what was he supposed to have written to become to be completely honest the on that you're only going to be one hundred percent true and accurate he would have to say that he didn't he didn't have an expiration date of his words that he had projected rotation be in july two thousand and eight but that he had been told that his orders were going to expire prior to that violation right and and that code asserts in the government doesn't appear to dispute that he didn't receive the letter denying his requests for extension until may th two thousand and seven that's my understanding that's and still be fals and that is that in this case to her made it is the mother was being investigated for a travel card fraud in this part of the investigation they got a statement from her that said my son is not a role the school in california because i want him to come to you now with me century which is they found that it was correct that he was not enroll in school in california he was actually rolled texas but that statement was deceiving and falls because he couldn't have been enrolled in school california had been rolled somewhere else and not been a resident of california the military's understanding of what a false notice of it says that when you are asked basically what your assignment is you can put down what schooling your current you know piece of paper what your orders you have to be completely truthful and honest in the book but i mean the form doesn't say tell us you know what you've been told or what your best of your standing is it sounds like what's the journey remember the wording was basically what's your president sign so what you're saying because the form also hasn't been near please update us if and when things change so it wouldn't be consistent with your interpretation for them to also have that other language in there with what would your honor that's to complete sure if there isn't a specific expiration date and that you are now projected to leave at some other time i think you would have to it's do you have any information whether they asked her about that conversation they could report or no your honor i have no information they asked her about it and i there is no information in the record that the registrar provided a statement on that so they said would you is there any chance you would have said that to him to a person in this situation and she said there is no chance because as she then read the rules governing attendance he would not have been  right is this is the school military or is it a contractor was the relationship between that department of defense activity it is a department of defense agency the intimate in the in the board's decision it may not be directly stated that same way but it is indicating the you can keep the dates and when the registrar made that statement and that the fact that he didn't submit changing just puzzling to me why the discussion is why doesn't remove these children as opposed to you know what they could expel those children as soon as they now again i think your honor if there  some some of them the way the military works is the day they expect much of the individual and if mr cohen knew that his children were not eligible to go to that school it was on him to disenroll those children who removed him from the school in the registrar would not really have any knowledge that they were going to start in twenty million seventy two thousand that and that what the registrar understood from the statement from over the call if we agree that it happened from written code was that he was given orders in june i'm sure the registrar simply assumed if he's going to be leaving in june and his children are eligible he then those children will not attend school they will be they had only been in world so they hadn't actually started school so the the false pretense in this case would be lieutenant come sending these kids to school you know on august th two thousand and seven even though they were in elizabeth to attend and knowing that they were to attend although he also says and that reading that i think it's called for me and that the policy statement about the school there is a policy by which children once and role even if there's a change in a makes sense for continuity of education of the children you might be allowed to stay and that's correct or if that happens when the school year has already started because i understand th but he says that the registrar said don't worry about it if there are any enrolled you you know you can move and they can stay for continuity so and i don't see anything addressing his claim that  it as a matter of his book actual and reasonable belief that how he could have thought that he's getting this boon of the puerto rico school even while he's out of texas is because that's what he baseline to be you know you you enrol and then there after things can change but but the children can continue and that may be your honor but the only evidence in the record was his declaration in the works specifically was not credible what they found was that it was not corroborated they found that it was less credible than the other evidence that they had because it because he didn't have that corroboration from the right sure even though they believed it was easily obtain and in fact it ince assuming that the the registrar would would not be willing and i don't see why the ridge door would be willing to make such a statement if if it was if it was helpful to some of these in the rd look what if staking that he's asking about this school year but he's asking about this school year and next school year and so so he hangs up and sinks it everything is fine but this is really just a misunderstanding where he sticking one thing in the registrar sticking something else if that's the case your honor i would go back to the regulation again in a military officer someone who's experienced and someone who's been rolled his children in school several times would know what the what what the rule rules require you would probably have to ask for some clarification from the registrar as to whether it meant bill which school year meant  because i think if you're if you were saying that he didn't call her and ask her that i think she would have to say it's about this school year that you're asking about not about the upcoming school year because they're closing down the two million sixty thousand and seven about the title decision and the information the file he said it could have other consequences were code he mentioned it could threaten his security clearance and other things you have any response to that he said true probable cause bearing on criminal activity but if it weren't criminal if it were unintentional but nonetheless unjust is there a separate mechanism that the military would pursue you know innocent mistake yes but but my understanding is they need a company and somehow they had that accompanied him there's a parallel school in texas on the base where they might have gone it can still i'm not aware of that if there is there maybe your honor that somehow i'm not everywhere throughout the  department of defense but there there or and so the titling does have that effect it does have that effect i don't know of any other to answer your question from nd to go away so i don't have any other avenue for the department and the department of defense would take but i think that would be something that the final answers would have to determine if they want to do that ok thank you thank you