the second to sixty two yes ok well doesn't that apply here and i don't think it does show me how it doesn't apply because in that case i don't think the issues that were raised are the issues that are i had propounded requests to it bitch and you would read all of these previous facts which are in my opinion factual the order was directed to me to turn over those documents to is whether that word or qualifies as an injunction were and that's the real key here because there are borders that are entered requiring counsel to do something by a certain date it doesn't make every one of those orders and injunction not that was really qualified as an injunction or not we wait until there's action taken on counsel's failure to comply with the order that triggers what a contempt issue is wrong in doing this but the point is the order is there we have to rely on the fact the wait is an order final so we can take an appeal not all the order they order is definitely there and the question is that order an injunction words in in three eight nine is it traditional this is not traditional so therefore you know i don't see how there could be any interesting and it in and use those words because sometimes it's difficult to know question the factual information released documents are not privileged under two or one k b two states unequivocally even though a document to be filled rich factual information within th and and then let a perceived that way as opposed to opening on the notes that really have nothing to do with well your honour's i did it buys the court that i'm not turning over the documents you order d ball i discovered order but it would only be the right procedure if it were an injunction and the question is why is that what was in that order and you put that for your site with that that phrase in it except through their right all right i agree and even if it is considered an injunction then we have to consider whether there is a force an effect of that injunction and i've said based upon what happened at that june twenty third hearing right before the host of appeal in this case was filed the court said i'm not going to make you turn over these notes i'm not going to make you destroy them i'm not going to enforce that portion of miami that raises the next question let's say we say this is not an injunction and the case goes back and assuming nobody takes any action to get those notes turned over the issue die but if somebody were to say that if the judge were to enter an order i want you to turn those over he says no and there be contempt and then we come back before possibly yes and i think he how so mention the one hundred sixty five times i make a quick comment about that on the complaint rates and i think even if this court were to determine that there was an injunction despite what's in the june twenty third order the whole issue is notes or destruction was not only regulated procedural of that particular case it was not in ministerial tash not a ministerial order the president chunked of order it direct to turn over documents that i had prepared myself and which we felt were not subject to the court order to return their foreign bashfully request that this cour