the president of the subcommittee on the western hemisphere will come to order the fact that this is something that we could not look the other way and just pushed back for a couple of weeks i'm i'm very glad that we were able to go i was hearing i want to thank my  my colleague mr mack for his cooperation and in expediting this hearing let me start by saying that i am deeply concerned with the recent events in h and have called on today's hearings to focus our attention on the crisis i must say that we had asked the state department to participate in the hearing and i  to the state department to send a representative when we request it and i understand that they may be things that they i would not want to could not say and we would respect that but i  must say that they need to respect the congress and the wishes of congress and better not be a pattern of any kind i realize that there is a delicate negotiations going on and they don't want to jeopardize those negotiations and neither do we but frankly i think they could have come and we would have understood that certain things could not be said so i just want to make it very clear for the record that if this is some kind when we ask for their appearance and i want everyone to take note that we expect them to appear when we invite them and i and many other people are deeply concerned with the before delving into the details i would like to state very clearly it is my strong belief that the military should not have deposed president elias and whisked him out of the country we can all discuss the events leading up to the removal of president's elia and i intend to do just that i think there are many good points to make on all sides and we have excellent panelists who will testify on different aspects of the situation and will agree or disagree with each other but in the end our hemisphere cannot tolerate what is essentially a military coup we don't want to go back to the bad old days when that was commonplace  in our hemisphere and i think that this certainly has the remnants of it and is not something that we should tolerate but that being said as you say on the other side of the coin president elias efforts to hold a referendum on whether to create a constitutional constituent assembly to change the hind or and constitution is also very troubling to my understanding that behind door and constitution contains several clauses which cannot be at least ten years as for me i'm not a scholar of the hunter and constitution and will not even pretend to be an arbiter of hunter and law or these clauses that's for the courts and political institutions of doris to decide but as an observer of the region and having watched the run up to the recent crisis i think it was clear that virtually all major one door and political institutions and actors opposed presidents elias after not only were the supreme court congress in july its own attorney general against him i'm told even members of his own political party and the influential catholic church were hostile to alliance efforts to change the constitution i do think this matters when the entire political establishment speaks and expresses daya concerns the president needed to listen to everything i can see why he did not this is not to say that those who deposed him where an angel is either not only am i deeply troubled by the removal of president ally and they whisking him out of the country but i have also heard credible reports of human rights violations in the aftermath if the de facto government wants to live up to its assertion that it was defending democracy is no better way to do so and to respect the views of those with whom you disagree and the clampdown on fundamental freedoms and protect all peaceful dissenters and moving forward i'd like to now discuss of the united states to be a true partner of countries in the region in which we are neighbors with respect i think the administration is taking a giant step forward insisting that commitment for this excellent diplomacy and mediation efforts on the hunt calling for president's elias restoration to office and as i mentioned secretary clinton has jump started a mediation effort led by the nobel peace prize winner winning president of costa rica oscar arias with this very strong u secretary of state and her team and i navigating the diplomatic waters at this time and i hope that a compromise will come about however  as much as i defend the oas and you all know yesterday on the house floor i strongly oppose removing money from the oas i must question the expelling of honduras from the am a strong supporter of the las and that's i said i spoke on the floor of the house of representatives last night on the on the floor talking about not removing money from the l y s but i'm concerned about their actions to suspend hours i think you have to be consistent in what you do and in a time when we drop the suspension of cuba and we suspend honduras i think it sends an inconsistent message to the region in the world i think consistency is important with consistency you have credibility i must also say i'm increasingly troubled by efforts throughout the hemisphere to change constitutions so that leaders of certain countries can stay in power after their terms and we see a pattern here in many countries and i think it's a dangerous pattern and it's not a pattern that we should support i think we need to shine a bright light on the dangers of this anti democratic trend and so i say well the oas right rightly condemned the removal of the president's ally in hunter s i believe it should also criticize a stripped away from respect to constitutionalism and the normal transfer of democratic power if a constitution in any country says that a president cannot run for a second term i think that suspending the constitution as was done in many different countries enabling the leader to continue is a troubling trend so i would like to conclude of the same way i began i believe what took place in honduras was wrong and deserves to be condemned but the complicated story doesn't begin or end there it's my hope that this hearing will dry out many of the issues surrounding the remov hank you mr chairman thank you for holding this hearing today it is very timely i also want to thank the witnesses for making yourself available and being here and we are very interested in to hear what you have to say and maybe pick your brain a little bit so thank you for being here let me just start off by saying that this was not a military coup and if somebody if there was any if there's any fault here it is on mr he is the one that at every turn turned his back on the people of honduras and his own constitution which he pledged to uphold as we hold this hearing parties from all sides are meeting in coastal rica to negotiate a peaceful and democratic resolution but it is important to look at the whole picture who are the main players how did we get here and who is meddling from the outside now mr chairman we have a man who refused to listen to the honduran supreme court a man who refused to listen to the honduran attorney general a man who refused to listen to the door in congress mr chairman this is a man who tried to undermine the legislature judiciary the attorney general the human rights commission business associations and four of the five political parties represented in the national congress including his own party i am interested to hear what our panel has to say on this not only that mr chairman this is a man that when told no by the court took it upon himsel zelaya the more we find a man who believes he is above the law untouchable and clearly a man who has no respect for democracy i also look forward to hearing from our panel on the links between hugo chavez and mr  a since he was exiled mr zelaya has been flown around the hemisphere on venezuelan jets the ballots that were going to be distributed for the illegal referendum were printed and flown from venezuela furthermore are reports that mr zelaya has been involved in drug smuggling from venezuela and other places and south america also there is little doubt that mr zelaya violated article thirty nine of the honduran constitution which clearly states that quote administration now stands with the likes of chavez morales and not with the honduran people while we all want a peaceful and democratic resolution now is not the time to stand now is the time to stand for freedom and with the hundred armed people in their fight against the tyranny of the wall of arion revolution mr chairman thank you again for holding this hearing and i look forward to hearing from our panelists later mr chairman i just i opinion i believe the oas is a dangerous organization that is not that is not fighting for freedom or democracy but instead standing in the way and giving an myriad of issues so we can certainly discuss that because we have seven very excellent panelists and i want to hear from them i'm going to restrict opening statements to two minutes for each person will go down the down the line i'll start  try to do it in two minutes first of all i think that we've come a long way in the united states from where we were in two thousand and two where there was a coup d'etat in venezuela and within forty eight hours we represent we support the  military government and usurping the constitutional authority whether it be and honduras or in other parts of the including venezuela and i would hope that we would see our country providing the leadership for  a couple seconds here first of all i talked to some people to state department yesterday and they told me that they wanted to give the central american integration system headed by mr arias a chance to try to resolve this by getting all the facts and i think the facts are not clear of course but nevertheless they wanted to give him some time and that was the reason they said they didn't want to appear today i disagree with that they should be here but nevertheless that was the reason that they gave i just like to reiterate what the ranking member said and i thought he said it extremely well and that is that the the arrest warrant was issued by the supreme court that ordered the armed services to arrest mr ilaiah now in the united states if an arrest warrant is issued the police go out and arrest them and they put him in handcuffs and they take him to  in this particular case the military was told to do it and they did it and so when everybody talks about this being a military coup i just don't get it there was an arrest warrant issued by the supreme court the president had violated the very serious leadership crisis unfolding there i believe it is vitally important to take a deep breath here and just simply look at the facts understand the objective truth about honduras civil democratic institutions terms of office however by the same token i can't see where anyone can say that if you take somebody out with an army and guns put him on a plane and as he tries to come back  therefore condemn that country if we start doing that we'll have to look at every country in the world and who they associate with and that certainly would make any sense so i think it's a very complicated situation i hope that we can get to the bottom  because he wouldn't give them the judgment that he wanted not saying it was right to do it here and nor was it right to do it there this is a really a complicated situation and i hope we can come up with a solution but once again in the union when a country is taken over by the military that country is suspended from the african union they do not tolerate because once it happens it all happened there and will happen at the next place institutions and evolve into a hugo chavez type of audit track i think what is particularly disconcerting for me is the fact that no american official at the u s embassy in honduras or the state enemies of the united states and yet the administration has refused to speak with the institutions in honduras like the supreme court the congress or even the president to fully understand what happened and why  it has been removed i look forward to hearing from the witnesses as to why the administration continues to ignore the will of the honduran people and the rule of law and what can be done to the according to or i find that interesting that's irrelevant to this i'm sure some of the people are well intentioned but i did know and i think it's important that and i haven't heard outrage expressed by anyone including members on the other side about the statements of the provisional foreign minister but let me tell you what he had to say about the president of the united states i like the little black sugar plantation gentleman's time has expired mr you know ho being a witness is you have to listen to all of us before we can listen to you that's the price you have to say i'm sorry let me ask our witnesses to please keep their testimony to five minutes  u do not have to read you statements if you don't want to you can ask that they be submitted into the record and they will be as if they had been written as if they had been repeated and you can just summarize and that might be might be better i'll leave it up to the to the witness let me mention all of our witnesses michael shifter is vice president for policy at the interim american dialogue welcome perez is a former hundred foreign minister and and sutcliffe and is here today representing the honduran chapter of the latin american business council welcome and sara stephens is the executive director of the center for democracy in the americas we welcome you and last but not least  e president of iraq associates and a former assistant secretary of state the western hemisphere welcome and we'll start with mr shift real critical test for the u s government and for the what happened on june twenty eighth in honduras was a rupture in the democratic order a democratic process that i think was properly censored by explored other measures before resorting to such a confrontational response which did not work and in fact seemed to only have hardened positions on all sides might have also tried to anticipate and prevent heated before it reached a boiling point alert mechanisms a difficult and there are sensitive questions about sovereignty but this is an essential function appropriate for regional bodies like the oas the head on collision h should have reacted to the oas has indeed been passive and silent in dealing with the democratic order in other situations there needs to be a way to focus on improving the inter american democratic charter and the way it is applied and implemented in latin america one idea not restrict the use of the chart of secular branch but also extended to other branches of government to the opposition this could and i hope this case shows the wisdom of working in concert with regional partners to seek solutions that reflect common sense and progress what are anchored in the rule of law to your question thank you the you pull the microphone a little closer than your man angle ranking member and the other distinguished members of the committee thank you for inviting me today i will not provide a summary my statement which i request to be included in its entirety in the record my name is in the past i have served my country as the minister of foreign affairs i have spent this week as part of a diverse delegation of other concerned honduran citizens visiting with many members of congress while we have made some progress in creating greater understanding of the history and context of what has happened in my country i want to share with you some facts and observations that have been lost in the intense media coverage example charged with crimes against the form of government treason abuse of authority and power and the supreme court ordered his arrest before he was taken out of the country result of the very serious criminal charges against him i can only speculate as to what the military did and why taking them out of the country could have been the result of a terrible dilemma is possible that the military which was properly ordered by the honduran supreme court to uphold the constitution thought it would be more prudent to take him out of the country rather than hold him in custody relevant facts what i will attempt to do in the short time that i have is not so much to rehash those facts but perhaps to provide a broader context for understanding the realities the crisis of supposes to convene a constituent assembly to draft a new constitution should have taken place honduras would have embarked on a path similar to those taken in venezuela bolivia ecuador and to a lesser extent or earlier in nicaragua were elected presidents have a process of constitutional reform that checks and balances strengthen the power of the executive branch and create alternative inadequacy of mechanisms of representation and the failure of economic growth and international insertion in the last several years to overcome the demick poverty and inequality  and the military's role in throwing out of the country reflect political systems inherent and the absence of mechanisms and a legal framework to resolve political conflict through political means past i was at times an adversary but always friendly always civil and of course my friend who i consider a very close personal friend and chairman angle and i happen to also be a personal friend and the reason i wanted to start out that way is that this issue calls for bipartisanship civility and calls for dialogue and i represent a client so i'm not speaking for myself there were d i'm here to talk about solutions as our great president reminds us looking forward rather than looking backward and i believe chairman ranking member max ha agreement on two things one is mrs elia violated the law there is no doubt facts are facts with all due respect to michael powell as mr olson know there was a lot of law breaking going on the supreme court voted fifteen to zero in the desire broke the law that included eight members of his political party elected justices the congress one hundred twenty four to four including all the members of his political party voted that he violated the law his own attorney general the human rights commissioner that is independent of the government as it is has supported the finding that he had to be removed from office because he violated the constitution with the self executing clause that says if you try to extend your term you are automatically removed from the presidency now having said that my clients believe that looking back with the wisdom of hindsight it could have been done differently that night that the army decided to whisk him out of the country and i'm not afraid to say that with the wisdom of hindsight it probably should have been done differently as long as those of you and i know congressman delahunt share that view are also willing to share the distaste for a president that regarded himself as above the law and every institution in honduran society from the church to civil organizations to business organizations to the liberal party to the national party to the supreme court to congress every institution bound this president as putting himself above the law if both facts are stated by my friends on the democratic side where i am affiliated and my friends on the republican side we can then look forward as president obama and secretary clinton want us to do and argue about past history so now let's look forward together secretary clinton secretary clinton did a great service to present arias a nobel prize winner and saying let's have dialogue and let's find a solution one that is going to take time that doesn't involve immediately parachuting it is a lie a back into one that recognizes that there is a compromise necessary and my client favors such a compromise and that is about dialogue and finally whatever the solution cannot be imposed by the united states by my friends who are democrats or my friends who are republican it has to be a honduran solution right now every institution in honduras in every public opinion poll taken supports this civilian government there is no military running this government supports this government but also want to peaceful solution solution between the leaders of honduras as well as mr zelaya and under the auspices of president arias and secretary of state clinton i can see no better way than dialogue and ultimately a peaceful solution thank you thank you very much  today i'd like to begin by simply expressing my sympathy to the people of honduras for the violence and political turmoil they've experienced in twenty eight it is understandable and perhaps inevitable that their crisis has tr fact their interests and ours are in alignment in that context let me make that point first i believe that the goal of our policy in our diplomacy should be resolving this crisis in a matter that restores the constitutional order to honduras and returns president to office we need to stand with the region in saying loudly and clearly that military coups cannot be regarded ever again as acceptable alternatives to democracy would hope that we could speak with one voice on whether it was appropriate for military force to be used against the president after all the top legal adviser for the honduran armed forces told the miami herald we know there was a of which i was his attempt to undermine democracy in this hemisphere or as a green light to the continued spread of hiv still authoritarian under the guise of the mark democracy the removal of presidents from office two weeks ago has been referred to mainly outside against the autocratic intent of the executive many hundreds insist that these actions save democracy by preventing from establishing the kind of twenty first century socialism that is being established in countries of latin america under something called the alb alliance invented and invented by castro and financed by jarvis we must find a bipartisan way to defend the true democrats in honduras i respectfully suggest to this congress that one way to do so may be to ask the elected this house of representatives would have been about four hundred fifteen to eleven with a few abstentions you our representatives in congress more than anyone know that when nearly all the freely elected members of the nation's congress such bipartisan support to such a momentous measure there must be an unusual reason in honduras that reason was genuine fear for the future of the country i freely admit that i'm not an expert on wonder and law and therefore not qualified judge the legality of this action i would also point out however that most in this country and other countries who have rushed to condense removal are at least equally qualified to judge how can the so called democratic community allow cuba venezuela bolivia and other countries that have either destroyed self rule or in the process of doing so to determine the standards of democracy in the region alba has a consistent modus operandi so burtt the foundations of self rule such as free elections and referenda gain power concentrated in the hands of the executive steadily diminish civil liberties and then change the rules and even the definitions of democracy to remain in power and definitely through any means necessary including force in my opinion what took place in honduras on june twenty eighth when the military moved to lie on order greenport should have been handled differently as an american i would have liked to seen charges better publicized in advance of the arrest authorities not military forces arrest i would not have expelled them from the country but would have detained him and given him the opportunity been his actions like any other accused felon but i'm not one hundred i did not feel threatened by venice while on cuban and other foreigners in the internal affairs of my country as did the honduran armed forces and i've been to one during living peacefully in the united states as most of us in this room do i would have heard the exceptionally enunciations of the catholic church and the protestant churches protesting abuses of power at the same time however when does not have to be a honduran to understand the anger of the average citizen as a documented and repeated instances of gross dishonesty by melson his family and members of his cabinet i cannot excuse the zeal with which the military broken the house but it may be explained by said illegal misuse of the police and military to take over private propert forces assuming they even have such a position admitted a criminal error in handling a case i'll submit the balance of my remarks for the record i remember in conclusion let me say that it's always an honor for me to be asked to testify before the u congress because i've never taken the freedoms this country has afforded me for granted i'm an immigrant to a cuban american who lived under two dictatorships in his native country then sought enslaved by communism i've been privileged to serve our government in and out of uniform for over fifteen years i fervently exercised my civil rights because i was lost those rights and know how precious they are i urge this congress not to condemn hundreds durance for defending their even if we may not approve of the one mistake to which the military have already confessed thank you very much thank you very much let me say that we can see that our very distinguished  panelists excellent testimony composed of a wide range of views on the subject and i think that we we've heard a lot of good points from a lot of different people united states has mentioned has been instrumental in putting together those discussions senator secretary clinton has been very helpful in doing this if i could close my eyes and say well what kind of a possible solution or compromise can come out of these negotiations i would the most probable thing to come out would be a return to power of mr as elia to finish out his term which i believe is four more months and then have a new election as was scheduled in h i would bet the house that that would be the solution that would come out and like anyone's comments on that would that be a viable compromise and is it something that you think would be likely to come out of these solve this but i can offer some principles that are in alignment with what you just said and what my clients believe the one principle most important is the rule of law needs to be upheld so any solution that involves a discussing one is that the rule of law is very important it is a lie and has to acknowledge that and you need to acknowledge that the supreme court his own party and the congress and all the other institutions have found him to have violated the law and yes to be held accountable as the people who may have violated the law by sending him out of the country in the middle of the night so there may be a solution that is equal handed about giving both of those violations in return for certain commitments but the principle is the rule of law and the second principle is democracy and security that goes with a democracy and elections as you mentioned must take place and there must be a new president someone from his party is running and someone from the opposition party national party and the other parties are running  those two principles the rule of law and some agreement on how that will laws to be applied equally and democracy and security i believe that president arias can bring the parties together to achieve those two principles   improbable that a resolution to the crisis could be found that does not include the president's elian's return to honduras at the same time what he attempted to  do that the supreme court in the congress has found in violation of the constitution should not be allowed to take place i think it might be entirely reasonable to prevent deepening polarization between now and the month of november to attempt to move up those elections make sure that they are fully observed not only at the time of the balloting but before and in the period afterwards to guarantee that the political process goes forward in  open and democratic fashion without intimidation without violence i would think that there may be some role for an international observer mission under the auspices of or the united nations  establish itself in honduras as a international mechanism to help hundreds overcome polarization i believe that the country is deeply divided probably in favor and against   hope that that what mr davis has has described as the need to look forward and not to become entrenched in the positions and principles that have been articulated up until now will be possible because it here and to those deeply entrenched positions will lead to a continued stalemate and i think what's needed is a way for both sides to be flexible in order to break this impasse i think  one of the things that i hear again you know the people arguing that the president's ally is removal from power was constitutionally appropriate and the troubling thing and even people who in the panel who are saying that president a liar violated thank you mr chairman you know it first of all i appreciate the testimony from everyone and it's such an important hearing because what we're trying to get our arms around is  democracy in latin america and not all constitutions are written the same but it is clear and you don't have to be  expert as someone mentioned on the panel on the one of my colleagues mentioned earlier to understand that norrin constitution you just have to read it and it is clear in article two thirty nine of the constitution of honduras that by the order of the supreme court which we have which we can read which says to arrest the president that the military was just acting out the constitutional responsibility passed to them by the supreme court i don't it's not that hard to figure out you don't have to be a scholar you just have to read it  this idea that this is a coup is so disturbing to me that you would could say with a straight face after hearing the testimony from the panelists and the members that sit up here the military is not in charge of honduras therefore you cannot have it cannot be a military coup the military acted on the rule on the order of the supreme court so i think we need to someone needs a paradigm shift someone needs people need to understand and stop calling this a coup the negotiations that are going on right now is that the base of that is that this is a coup it's going to be very difficult to get to a solution that follows the constitution of honduras and anything other than something that follows the rule of law in the constitution of honduras sets a horrible precedent  mr davis i was very interested in your testimony and i understand it's on on behalf of your client so i want to ask you this does your client believe that this was a military coup  my client wants me to answer that question based on the facts and the facts are there is no military person in charge of this government the government is now de facto being run by the successor under the constitution the president of the congress so the word military would be inappropriate as far as my clients are concerned on the other hand i think my clients would agree with the chairman that there's nothing in the constitution that allows somebody to be shipped out of the country in the way that it was done so the wisdom of hindsight is not about his removal as president that under article two thirty nine as you said is expressed please state it is an automatic automatically loses office under the wording of that constitution and my colleagues here who talk about democracy seem to want to ignore a constitution adopted after a military government in honduras ruled in one thousand nine hundred two and that constitution  sacrosanct on durance as ours is so the constitution said he had to be removed the supreme court fifteen to zero agreed and so did all the members of his party but the issue of whether he should have been whisked away in the dead of night by the army is what's troubling and it is not an easy to dismiss and for my client standpoint they are troubled about that and i can only say that what i am authorized is the wisdom of hindsight statement that i made it should have been done differently but just remember the context the president of honduras led a mob the president himself you can see it on you to lead the mob that overtook the army guards into the barracks to see these ballots had been shipped in by mr chavez now that's just a fact and the atmosphere was fearful of physical safety and it was that context that i believe with the wisdom of hindsight something was done that should have been done  the business groups the churches all of these groups came together to say that the removal of the of the president was the right thing to do certainly they could also come together to say we don't think he should have been blown out of the country and hondurans could have figured out the right course to go to make sure that that didn't happen again that the constitution was followed that the all of the witnesses for being here at what is a very important hearing and i think that you know gives us a lot of food for thought and i don't want to jump ahead of ourselves because i do believe that  democracy in the honduras may be but the real action of the countries in central and south america who are upset about what is taking place which has caused them to sit down inside a work together to resolve this so that we do not turn thank you congressm president and he's the man who was elected this parliament rewrote the constitution to allow him to be president for life and i remember thinking not again not again not again we have it happening now it almost happened in honduras unanimously as everyone has said here all of the democratically elected government are trying to uphold the rule of law now as doctor grapples with this whole issue of what to do it seems to me one of the top questions has to be prosecuted i don't know how those kinds of charges just get swept under the table people in honduras in every other country want the rule of law understand that the minimum wage was raised a lot of indigenous people were supporting the can anybody speak about that group i haven't heard them mention they were and supportive of the school they wanted them out a personal raise the minimum wage a person who came to new york where in an organization called the central american black organizations made up of african people of african descent throughout central america to simply upheld the law congressman and found that he violated the law but if i may say i would hope you would not support a cutoff of aid which will hurt the poorest people and honor us and to have the united states government cut off aid where the people who will suffer the people who are least able to cope with the cut off of that aid i hope that both democrats and republicans would not support a cut off aid at this very important one one thing we do to military and much of the aid goes around the government and so i certainly couldn't see us continuing giving support to someone who was taken out of office by the army and i just want to conclude prostitutes the blacks and whites that is my job however i like this little black sugar plantation worker who was present the united states i don't want to sound like for that attempt and then subsequently was elected this is not a defense of the venezuelan government but i think all of the people that have so passionately spoken on behalf of the rule of law have not mentioned the fundamental role of due violations fundamental rights have been restricted such as personal liberty detention for more than twenty four hours the right of assembly as well as freedom of movement to leave and enter and remain in the territory of honduras don't think that the the congress of the judgment of the supreme court of another country well let me tell you cuba has a constitution and there are those who are talking out of both sides of their mouth let me that's right well and they were also the nuremberg laws in germany if you want to defend a crucial and important hearing i probably beg to differ with my dear friend i think it is important for constitutional government to comment on the process of government i would offer this i think it is good news that the president of costa rica and secretary clinton are in the engagement process that mr davis and i thank you for that here is my offer and suggestion one i'd like to ask ms olson very quickly do you think the pause that we have on aid is positive secondarily i'd like to hear from anyone who wants to answer whether or not there would be an acceptance of the return of this president to finish out his stated constitutional terms because that is the crunch of what i believe is the fall this was a coup this was a direct disruption of government this was using tools that i don't believe are written in the honduran constitution is a coup written in the constitution if you can point to me that i will say that this meeting i will end on that note and ask  about the pause of a it is not a complete elimination and anyone else that wants to answer whether they would accept the negotiations of secretary clinton and the president of costa rica i thank you very much mr chairman are you back and let me say the name  secondly i did want to correct the record by congresswoman lee the business community did not support violating any constitutional or legal procedures regarding shipping mister need to be prosecuted and that is the rule of law and i'll let the parties themselves decide if and when he returns how the rule of law is going to be upheld and still as president obama always tells us necessary clinton always tells us let's come together in dialogue and find a solution where there's no bloodshed where we can restore the rule of law that is why secretary clinton has done such a great job here and letting present arias try to mediate while i agree  must one has anything they really must say i want to thank each and every one of you for a very very important testimony for what i consider this very very important hearing this subcommittee