senior plan and geoffrey wheeler vice chair barbara of cannot be with us this evening so the i believe we are not initiating any public hearings is that correct raised by both plan points raised by the board and the points raised by neighbors who were concerned about the project correct so let me begin by asking the applicant mr peterson if there's anything you wish to say and then i'll add trying to you and spencer and ask if either of you wants to do a quick summary of this approach is that peter sagal you know what i want to say is there was a lot of issues that were minor issues that were questioning the compression choice which obviously wooden building a house you have to run compresses or to build a house that was dressed in a way that they thought the baby that compresses for the air conditioning might be making too much noise we did disport check that proved the same as every other  and i'm not for me to speak for him but he can come up and looked at all the planning board conditions he and i conducted various site visits did as karl said did work with the applicants to revise some of the issues outstanding issues reach out to others that are also called into play here for example the director of facilities gerry boyle and so this checklist is a result of all that work it's explains what the you know i just approach was a stab at finding a way to take the process that has been going on for a little over a year believe and bring that into a final document and just will reduce the number of things that fall through the cracks thankfully to zero great and i'm sure was its purpose absolutely community development noted that it was replaced by p v c vinyl barn style and saying can you tell me what they rationale was for that subset well  one of the issues that has come up and this is not the first time this has come up is that this landscape land bridge from concord haven't you unfortunately the applicants are coming to us after the fact and so in this situation the same thing happened the applicant came after the installation of the fencing and had we been we didn't necessarily see it as an issue  approved and so as a result you know it didn't even occur to us to even question if we start as cedar style fencing where the cedar heights was the descriptive point of the fencing not necessarily cedar fencing and it wasn't until really you pointed out that we really thought what is a cedar fencing or pseudo style fencing because certainly the border fencing was what was in that style was certainly  point that was one of the points i was brought up with in the e mail chain was with respect to the door ability and appropriateness for a school yard and which point answer did conduct its conduct some research online reflecting also upon that we realised that there are other types of fencing that's around school yards and playgrounds so it wasn't a story that we did and it wasn't as a reprieve either one was just that this would on the one hand this would not seem a particularly good time to set a new precedent on this on the other hand and would versus final is something that appears in our just signed standards in general  for the general residence history it's probably something that we want to return to when we look at what we're going to be revealing i guess the design standards when we reconvene in september because they've now be now provided that the applicant doesn't have a problem with like if some kid puts a ball through the thing i cracks and i want to time but just maintaining the fence i don't see an issue with it that would be the only downside that i could see you know i read i mean it join me just in general i agree but i think liz what you said you know this is not the place and in this my tickler project you know but i think going forward we need to be as consistent in applying our our definition and look carefully style versus actually what we're talking about materials and if it doesn't speaks to the whole process i said unfortunately he's not the only applicant that this really happened words occurred after the fact we've been talking with glen about inserting for a meeting with spencer to review all the conditions everything prior to the actual granting of this prior to him doing the special permit to develop or so that hopefully that means you will make it clear that you can't just go ahead and do things they have you there are certain things that have to come back to this board to be reviewed and we could write with greater clarity in the special mean now the applicant can receive any occupancy permit and that will automatically terminate the thirty day camp prairie permit and we don't have to do anything we don't have to do anything  applicants somewhat more guidance beforehand so that we could try to eliminate an additional session in which we simply review the landscape plan and where we got and that we were able to do that because we got substantially better landscaping plans to start with so perhaps we can just take it from the top and see what people's comments are under this the second item under general guidelines if it goes directly to not reducing but it doesn't suggest a plan with the base condition so that we know what's there first other comment that i would make is that that that is that statement i have a problem with any rate because it says should never be reduced below what is fair sometimes people buy these houses and the you could even state it positively then that proposals to to reduce the existing landscaping shall be submitted as part of the application that know where the three dots between landscaping and green lines i don't see the quote in there that that their lips is four and the picture book american norman rockwell years normative and i don't know if everybody agrees with that i thought there might be some pushback  i think it is so let me try the following i think it is helpful to have one sentence me there is a lot to most of single resistance and i think that it would be useful to have a ordinary things and i don't know i don't know i don't know if if it's see that something is coming from just because something coming from you or from us and i don't know if that's coming from the neighborhood itself and i don't know what the perception is that you know the image perceptions that the neighborhood has of what their neighborhood is and this specially with the demographic changes taking place in the neighborhood that might not necessarily be what's represented with their plants their summer easy summer i think it would probably we could certainly i think once we have the board's comments we can certainly go back to the citizens group although they certainly were represented and supported in the town meeting i don't it would be interesting to hear what we've had a number of applicants that have come forward and have challenges some of those concepts for the norms and the neighborhood and i don't know if there's a different sentiment about that it might be worthwhile to hear that as well rather than hear from people who were part of a movement that was two years ago at this point so i don't know that's just the these larger additions that are being proposed by the op can so i think or that i think to just gets to the gist of what we're trying to accomplish which is if you want to put a significant plant addition on your house when we want some significant plantings because we would like to look like it has been there you know we're talking about preserving a character in the neighborhood and these things this discussion contributes to that as we work on further defining  warden oh i think so i think that i think that i totally agree with you our lives but i think if you were to ask the tree warden if you liked the use of the shade master locust i think he would part of like some of the requirements that we've put forth like for instance to our car could have a new when they did the old sand the complex and they went with the four to four and a half inch calipers i think it did wonders for it yeah checked yeah because i think it's a great opportunity i would agree with you carl it's a great opportunity for some nice trees to be put back in because let's face it we have a losing trees all the time and when th think there that would almost seem like street trees even though they're on the applicant's property well i i also appreciated the comment that spencer made about not not forcing st trees to be between the curb and the sidewalk because there be a lot of situations i like the way this has been written so that there isn't flexibility right to respond to the specific proposal corrections i think that's why i even had got earlier saying and instead of saying we're progressing to preserve the character of residency we're actually trying to from proof it in so that so that the the the the construction of the building is accompanied by a step up and in the quality of the landscape now i think it's great because i think it's something that's overlooked and i think it's something that needs to be very closely looked at because i think if someone's again coming before this board looking for relief because they want to at her dish and i think that again it needs to be done so that it's  agree since you did you have any additional most i mean is this obviously reflects many of your comments in the current draft that was there anything you wanted to do  went to school for landscape architecture but then went to work at a large nursery that never was thirty five but they have the credentials to be able to do the same line of work as a landscape architect i don't know how the board goes about retaining  language but i don't agree with that because i think that i totally hear you saying because of the good nursery comes up to one of their designers i think it's great i think it's great and it's not as costly for the applicant a twenty nine jason road and i think that the plot here and this this is something that we have not necessarily done before but you know we will we'll have a given so this is an experiment if you will with just giving the board we've already voted yes but just making sure that what what actually got it down on paper corresponds with the and i suppose as an example just take twenty years this comes to mind because looking at twenty nine jason road and i would plans to make sure that that third floor attic really the ceilings are really low enough that it doesn't turn into another unit and i don't think i mean obviously a community development work through those things with the applicant and they are on the plans but i think it would be when we when we get to the point of review and approve i think those are things that we will that we would want to good i think in their condition too to include those things in the conditions just so that the applicant is on notice that they'll be looked at more absolutely not ok but i am i am pointing out that they were final with the understanding that the ceiling height it's in the attic would be lovely enough that you clearly were not creating numerous additional that are correct yes and i think the process would be better if those and we didn't say and bring the plants back to us one more time right with those things mar because it's it seemed close it seemed ok and so on but it seems to me to be the issuance of the conditions surrounding the special permit might be a good place to pick things up when we're where landscaping plans where you called out each of the conditions and make sure they're laid out that way because that like when the when the project is over it will then you go back and you fill in the answer twenty and you can just listen to it and it will be clear whether these things happened or not he didn't go into terms of process yes in terms of process we've gone through this it's all been approved what we're talking about now in light of the let's say for example the dentate project that we just did and we have the checklist for the final thing when we go and we say yes they did everything that they were supposed to do or there were issues and all of that then we can go back and take a look and check that so we can go through the process like we did so what we're saying here in terms of process we we do what we did and but here we should have this kind of document for when they come back to us or at the end to say yeah you know it's all done they can issue the certificate in the walk and see where they have to do other things because i was getting unclear about that right where we were and in terms of that that same format that spencer developed for and it probably i mean if i'm following what you're saying it probably should be given to them when the special permit it's granted them exactly when they get that document from community playing they should get this too with the note that by the way here's what you can do and also here's what we're expecting you we're going to take but look at this when you've completed your construction to really they were the every different issue has a different color conservation is green i'm bumming gas yes whatever historic district is great is only what appeals is blue so the inspectors when they get a building permit application are to go supposed to go to the of thing too will be interjecting spencer into that review to make sure that something doesn't slip by that the when the building permit application is submitted you know this but again i think that because we had planned here at the beginning in the fall i think we should have this would be a wonderful type of work group or project to kind of work with the professional staff and the office of community development so that we know what the different  that has to be clearly understood what the steps are and who's responsible for what then that's all that it really should be it shouldn't be about whether or not you know ten inch columns were installed or not but here in the general comments it's it calls out that the time stamp would contain the finally approved landscape plants interior for print and exterior elevations so just continue i mean continuous with that thinking we've focused on landscaping what they should be some of the concerns that were called out in the on the building particularly the the third floor or the the attic space  was a question that was left open so what i'm curious it sounds like it's a we've got a case that's going on for rehearing and there are different issues and concerns raised at each hearing that they may not be brought up again th and the question of whether as part of the final review we want to keep it review and approve landscape in which case we would probably want to have some sign that we might want to sign up from the building inspector saying for all the non landscape conditions i looked at them and it's up to you i mean that's something we can think of  isn't one of the ways things fall through the cracks is we get to the end we don't necessarily see they may come to you but the board doesn't see the plans with that change  i'd have the fine feeling that if we do live here we was talking about and we just are very thorough in our conditions and the building inspector does have his orange or red folder before they issue their signature on that building card which the applicant needs to get the process going in terms of getting an i q permit and not signing that unless everything lines up conditionally the way it's supposed to line up so i think things will park and even with the post office how's that going well we just got the plan sent to us on friday the rhythm of law to be the space relocated and there are trying to get the barber out as for the authority yeah yes i am what i was thinking yes and so he is in the process of that talking to the postmaster to get something that that speaks to that issue and that's i mean assert one of the things who get money with respect to the running list issues in that the conversion of those two conditions is that there's no reason why that are you looking for that running list in the conversion of those into conditions at the time that you then are making a decision on the special permit similar to three ninety yes yes yes yes yes yes and so the question then is at the time that you are going to be reviewing and start making a decision on a special permit you should you would like that document that at that point in time or was that not what you were speaking of you simply say i'm sorry if i'm not as my question clearly he and his ideally yes ok because i don't want  is really wonderful i mean because it gives us from point a to point b where we are i mean from point a to point c you know where we were and you know these things work all week and and as the evening goes i mean i guess i can take it away i mean geoffrey spencer beloved and part of weiss from toll brothers along with myself met and discussed the issue about meeting up against the the the sixty two bedroom limit and there were a number of units that were in question so what we did was floor by floor unit by unit building by building we went through  the plans and what we did was we identified units and i'll use this is just as an example of our work for the work group was what we did was we looked at a a one bedroom that was a one bedroom plus a one bedroom plus is that looks like they had an eleven foot by eight foot den or study that looked like it could lend itself as a second bedroom and we identified those units and we came up with a list and it's in your pack so you have the map in front of you just to make out we kept the green dots are the three hundred foot notice area they will get by law they have to receive notice of the public hearing the red and outlined  blue is the neighborhood in this case it really is a standalone neighborhood yeah and it sort of seemed to yeah i don't know if you can really separate it there i mean yes there was the quick break yes there's a lot there's a lot of them but i was like there's just no way you can i didn't feel great separating anything five cases who everybody is very anxious to get before you come in the next several days i don't discuss all the other stuff you're doing five cases and some of them aren't going to necessarily be slam dunk yes i we met we met with some residents of the district who are interested in looking at the subdivisions that are potentially taking place in the neighborhood and looking at maybe what could be done to control those examine those who is a very preliminary meeting we had people who were there who had worked on the g r and people who had worked on the single residen to sort of give them guidance and jeffrey and pencil were there as well it was a preliminary meeting just to sort of introduce the topic and they've gone away and they have their homework to do this summer and they'll be back to us in the fall will we'll have a better idea sometime in the fall where it's going potential for significant activity at some point and so it's better to catch it sooner rather than later i think that  when they reach out and to the community their response is that they get over one of their cases yes yes well we should thank them for us you know which is why you know five cases that are pending  so we we may end up working in if the if i'm on the five there are one or two seem to be straightforward will work the man on the can in the eleventh but the primary purpose of the tenth is that it's a it's going to be held in the beach street center some of that it can be televised and so that it can accommodate whatever number and  but i would my expectation would be that at least an hour and a half to two hours would be available for that i mean just on bell like a school with half an hour for other things  on the eleventh again we will work we will try to work in some cases but the primary purpose of the meeting on the eleventh is to discuss waverley and pleasant street there should be some tuesday in august read yet so we just approved the sect and go we didn't approve the twenty fifth we need to approve the twenty fifth as well so i move that we approve the meetings of may twenty fifth twenty seventeen second  these on friday yes i made changes so and i think the question that that i have is that the driveway is required because is is really because of the placement of the building by the school that made the driveway as a fire safety issue required from his point of view and that my question to that effect well i death to them i remember we were so i mean attorney came was if you they built it you know why didn't they built it elsewhere kind of or whatever but they create a can reconfiguration of their parking lot in such a way that would still meet the fire access you know with out having the road at all and and i don't think we've got to that i don't think we've got an answer i don't i don't i think we heard something to the effect that land and they were putting up an addition there ok and we've gotten the dover amendment can work right we have had to do many things to stop them from doing that you know the road just happens to at a minimum they would have had to probably have come up with a different design to accommodate a new world holding our barn and they call it if they didn't have the road and sa certain about that as i don't know if at some point we should briefly go when barbara's around the next time we meet into executive session you can't know what the public hearing is you know because if there's no typically it's about the purchase