before deciding on an issue or application the board must conduct a public hearing in accordance with act two thirty one nine hundred seventy two the applicant or their representative will have full responsibility to present the issue and provide evidence that their request is within the guidelines established by the state construction code the act of the applicant may be called upon to answer questions by the board members any interested person who present will be good given an opportunity to speak it is important to note that the authority the board is live in it to the analysis of the submitted proposal the board cannot make suggestions or propose alternatives this responsibility lies with the applicant so with that that's my preamble anyone doesn't want to stay for the extent of this you can call city hall after nine o'clock tomorrow morning to find out how it turned out and with that  application is from central west linn church for an addition exceeding the height in area requirements of the state construction code in actually it's just the area not the height ok do we have someone here to speak the application model of our facility showing both the newly constructed and renovated areas on the left is our new entrance into the church from the west which consists of two sets of doors with the vestibule at the bottom of the screen is the entrance to the worship center from the lobby now we are in the main lobby having just entered the new west entrance such that where you just about the worship center is on the right and straight ahead is a new welcome and coffee area just in front of our gathering grounds now we are in the east lobby looking towards the new west entrance the sanctuary entrances are on the left and the gathering grounds is on the right traveling to the west we're looking into the new legacy room on the left and the new next gen hub to the right heading into the legacy room we're now looking towards the west through the glass wall at the opposite end of the legacy room we're looking to the east out towards the main lobby to the left and there is a unisex restroom into the center there is a sink and countertop for food drinks and snacks we're now back in the west lobby looking south towards the new next gen hu this is the entrance and check in for the new next gen hub on the upper level zooming out we now have an aerial view of the next gen hub looking over the upper and lower levels now we're entering the upper level of the next gen h looking down the stairway to the lower level basketball court we are now on the lower level of the next gen hub looking into the gaming and play area at the back of the gaming area is a counter for light snacks including a say we're now looking from the lower next gen hub into the gaming area and the new next gen worship space through the glass roll up doors now we're entering the new next gen worship space this is an aerial view of the next gen war ship space now we're back in the west part of the main lobby looking to the east towards the gathering grounds the sanctuary entrances are on the right and the new legacy rooms on the left traveling  east through the lobby we're entering kid central and the entrance to the new kids play land on the left is the gathering grounds in the middle is a new stairway leading to the lower level and on the right is the check in for kids play land this is an aerial view of the kids play later our sanctuary and main lobby are at the top of the screen gathering grounds is just to the right now we're traveling to the lower level of the kids play like the new stairway can be seen in the cent kids play land to the left and the new entrance to the multipurpose room or the old gym on the right new men's and women's restrooms can be seen straight ahead outside the multipurpose room the entrance of the multipurpose room or the old gym is shown on the right here we've just stepped into the multipurpose room this is a view from within the multipurpose room looking towards the main entrance out towards the kids play last finally this is a view of our facility showing our worship center on the right with the main lobby just to the left of that the new legacy room is shown just to the left of the lobby at the bottom of the new next gen hub in a worship space is shown just to the left of the new legacy room thanks for watching we hope you all now have a better understanding of the soon to be renovated and newly constructed areas of our facility thanks for watching that we're very excited as a church what this project brings down only to central but to the community the playland aerial survey by one hundred twenty five hundred fifty people or kids i should say and i might be open to the public no charge and i'm just the way we feel we can measuring give back to the community the part we're talking about tonight is the lobby that you first saw we watched the video and the worship center and we built the worship center in two thousand  followed all the colds the lobby that we have the lobby off at the time because of construction costs and now we were looking at finishing that no reason why we're looking at federation and legacy or always we really want to be sensitive to our older generations  grass if you ever been there if you look at the video here you'll see the one way it's large is why you see this soon as you leave the worship center you see the exit doors are twelve of them it's very easy to see the other right now there's only four of them  and we just feel that that's that's less a sure what life safety code is trying to do by the letter of the law and then the other thing is a large public assembly and i feel even kind of bad talking about this but we've always in fact we've got a tabletop necessary follow the fire code when you exit and stuff like that we have practiced drills with everyone going out one way or if you look at the prince and how it was drawn i mean we meet fully meet the code as written but the exit to the west is only exceeds the i should say exit we're going to our percent more exit doors and in the code requires we're going to visible clear shorter and wider paths negress that's required by the code if you look at the narrow hallway to have to go down to exit the way it has to be by code you can see by going through the lobby as soon as you leave you'll see the exits additionally just to go farther than what the code says we were done provide additional automatic smoke detection in the main lobby and back of house area as to just a father or i should say increase the awareness if there's a trouble or smoke that we feel that would give us more of an active time to react i shared it with sandy and dan but we actually have evacuation policy that we do drills and helps us perform some of his exercises and we feel just by again by doing the lobby as just a better exercise in trying to force people down a narrow narrow hallway and i think it just makes it again a safer place while this is required by code if we do this addition but just another step of improvement if we would go ahead with this project with your blessings of course a whole lot of aid area would be all fire protected which now it's not and it isn't a different fire zone a different fire area but yet you make the whole facility i'm a low safer we have a fire alarm system a p a system so that we can give directions join evacuation even through we do drills i don't know if you've been in central that we have a large screen or sixty foot l e d screen in front we actually have give directions but it also as you look at the area it's not like we create an office space we're just increase in the public assembly area so all the construction that finishes all rated for public assembly which of course gives  doing it always required by code i don't see this reoccurring in most situations or in situations i think because a unique structure of the size and how we do ministry that the exits would just make sense to do it the way we're looking at it and  mile i met with the chief teenie and showed him his life easier if you were there and walked all the worship there when they posed the fire wall because there is a wall there now and you can even see the exit when you come out on the angle if you look at these drawings but if you take that because it's a siamese twin if you go to the other door would be the same door an exit right away you see you see the doors it's right there for i'm yeah and the distance is actually shorter than if you had to go around a wall or walk all the way that i got i don't remember seeing the one from the insurance company but that's really possible that it went to sharon instead of me  they feel that this would be the right move to do so ok thanks  kind of the original part of the church and to the upper right the next the and into the lower right of the cypress hall those were all added on in sequence and separate it with fire walls because churches today they're occupied more than just the few times a week and that's the reason for the code change so today if we were to build we could not build it that big right but so we would like to ask for the variance to continue with the original intent and just add that little portion of the lobby which is in green there to the part to the existing worship center and the rest the rest of the additions and whatever color is easter color and those are all separated from the existing structures by a two hour wall and that's completely compliant was today skulled so the only thing that we're asking is that we are allowed to add that lobby was just to quickly summarize i think some of this is doing well very well increased required us with by nearly three hundred percent were required eighty eight inches of the grass with and we're providing two hundred fifty six with the  edition and in the worship center i think there's a couple of distances on there to travel in this light just very common sense obvious that it's a better situation to have it open to be able to see those exit doors the addition of the smoke detection additional that big sanctuary on the bottom in the lobbies that currently fire suppressed yes protected and classrooms so there is a very i mean after we're done were almost entirely fires suppressed questions from the board i have a question could you explain to me what the current eager us plan is if there was an emergency without the addition of the widened lobby how do people accept from this area if there was an emergency without making this improvement for this hallway right here you come out so you come out here and you follow the exit signs down this way and come up the door here at the same time the people from the balcony this would be coming down the stairwell would be exit here and that's kind of an interesting thing right now that's that number eight that i brought up that we only under the maximum allowed for that exit right there but then the people from this point here would come out this is a center right here would come out  this way this is actually from this pew right here is the longest distance is i think it's two hundred thirty two feet as it is now if we would do this because where the exit doors are this would actually become a shorter coming through here through these doors or actually become a shorter route that it would be  today so basically this half on the first floor goes this way but this half of this half of the i should say quarter of the floor this way goes this way the corner here goes all these doors in the corner here goes out these days doors and then the bilby splits in half comes out this way down the stairs and down and down the stairs and out this way and your question you know what i'm interested in is if if you assume that the exit going that way i'm not sure sure what direction that is but it's west you left i mean there's there is no i and my idea there would be like impeded exit and a more open access so if you were to come out of that sanctuary and you had an emergency and you had to decide whether to go left or right at that part of that decision isn't so much how quickly you could make of no but he was there would be sizing up the situation and if it was all jammed up on that side you would go out the other way we feel that's what that's one of the reasons we discussed it becomes more active if there's a mass exit because of some other reason you can make that value decision and see what's happening weather wise experiment still farming actually but if you by why was it designed that way to begin with i mean why i assume that that that lobby was designed as part of the sanctuary when it was all built to begin with there wasn't why was it designed if it's insufficient and you want to add space to it why was it designed that way to begin with i would not say it's an office so efficient i would say it meets the letter of the code like i said it's within eight people and the reason why we dropped this off was strictly because of cos when we originally did this in two thousand it was a twenty two million dollar project and it one time we discussed not having any live in here to save costs but the way that we could decide to do that was we planned for putting this in some day  eight people so that's why i feel so strongly and have kept in ten years here he knows me very well that why we just feel this is the right thing to do because how much we're going to increase the safety not only for fire code compliance is co looks at it but just for a general safety of the amount of people there and there are sunday morning or any special of them ok so there there is a fire wall currently between the light blue and fire wall between the gray area on the bottom and the lobby here yes or no oh you're talking here you know i'm talking where you ok right no that's an else no it is it's not a rated firewall sprinkled it was a little area right here as only area that would not be you mentioned this in your opening statement but could you please reiterate it for me and perhaps the board but could you please describe for me why these conditions just fine as friends are general they're neither general nor reoccurring in nature you know for all churches if you will i think you mentioned it was a unique situation structure and shape just elaborate on that and i think it's a little bit you look at the shape of the structure how you see how it lays i'll you know how the wall how they proposed the fire wall because of where we ended construction at the time during the first phase and now to add on to what we can add any square feet without putting a firewall there so i think the thing that really abnormal is because it was created was such a narrow hallway it's legal but such a narrow hallway to start with now in today's society to be able to increase it  it's a normal situation because we can't we can't move or it was created equal were created start with originally i think that that's the biggest one how how it lays i'll if you look at each arrow here each one of these is absent so when you look at the structure of how the new uses out as a separate facility a separate building with a connection somehow we'd look at doing different things there was a tease bill for the way we do ministry to separate away itself just the cost of doing ministry and it really be a i have a question and this is a question that architects i guess did you consider any alternatives besides the one that you've come up with for better e q s for that lobby out to the left you consider other alternatives when you were looking at this design especially understanding that there would be a code problem is that the o l alternative is the the other alternative is to make this a firewall and keep the lobby configuration in this narrow exit access out of the back of the sink or workshops that are like it is and build a fire wall right here which obviously what we would do is it was keep existing while we build a new to our fire wall next to that so there'd be no visual or passage type connection between these two spaces and then there would be a fire door there that in the event of a bird he would obviously close so basically you know fact it isn't  at that point is that expansion of the lobby any longer so it so fire is one emergency that you have to prepare for but there are other emergencies as well as with as you alluded to  so if there was a need to exit the what is that large area to lobby the sanctuary if there was a need to exit that sanctuary were there any other alternatives that you looked at besides that fire wall to get people to get people out of that area we did not because as duane mentioned per the letter the current code it it it meets all the requirements and then when they look at their your operating procedures your exit policy and training and things like that there is direction but so we did not so as we were considering these additions  looking at ways to improve the situation i currently exist which does meet the code at this point i mean you know meeting from my point of view it's difficult to grant the variance because we face these requests a lot from lots of different applicants and so we try to hold the line we try to understand the code and stay with it so to me it's not so much a code i mean if i were the architect and i'm not the architect i would be i wouldn't necessarily just look at the code i would try to understand the whole situation and if there were other emergencies besides what was addressed by the code i would wonder whether there was a way of getting those people out of there without this kind of improvement unless unless you're satisfied with meeting the code in a situation where you have to evacuate all the people out of that portion of area well again we weren't satisfied in that we wanted to improve the obviously looking at the code and today's code being able to to do that created created identified this this problem so we want to improve it but perhaps i can answer for this question maybe that goes back to what we originally talked about why this is unique situation if there were to be any expansion as i see it you have to put that firewall there otherwise there's no expansion and as the structure is laid out existing right now that current eager asked that hallway how wide is that it's about eight feet or less it's about eight feet wide and it's a funnel so regardless of whether or not it's fire deplorably situation with the shooter or or some other situation that eight foot funnel exists right now so if there's going to be any expansion effort it's going to require that wall which again maintains that existing funnel this seems to be a situation where it can alleviated for any exit situation regardless of why that that were to take place whether it's just to meet the code standard or exceed the code standard in in trying to foreshadow possible reasons why you would have to accept so in some cases for a marine this right and you know anyone please correct me because i want to get this this right if i'm not ring this right the current situation is actually more dangerous than the proposed situation and there's no way around the current situation given that that wall exists right now correct and that's exactly what i was going to say no matter what we do to expand we have to add that lobby or a space there for creating that space and the only way to do it is to separate what the two are wall so the next step would be can we open it and make it more safe and make it more cohesive so to answer your question we have looked at it many many different ways even to the point of you know splitting the whole same way you can split the same tree never make it smaller so there's really not any year day you can lob off to make that square footage work so that's why we you know we want what the consultants and you know they saw the actually do so what we actually see so if i understand what you're asking pardon me from my questions what you're asking for is a variance to allow that green area to be built and that's the extent of your request for the varian is the worship center in the lobby by adding that four thousand feet in an open sort of format improves egress and then beyond that we're standing as part of this edition and this edition torp if i can just say one way more that access something like me what we're just requesting is that we can move that firewall back thirty four feet to that area there so that we have thirty four foot distance where it shows here without having a line door in there that would be open  any other questions from the board for the  all right thank you anyone else here to speak in support of the application anyone to speak enough  peanut gallery comments there so i've looked at this with progressive and also with central and walk to the space and going through the three d video kind of bring it back to that  really in my mind does make it a safer space another point that maybe wasn't brought up was the number of arkansas is not changing so it's still the same number of people going through those exits but it's like they said three hundred percent more grass area so it has my support and just wanted to bring up a couple other points there hearing discussion amongst the board i don't really have any discussion per se other than i think the unique situation presented here i've walked and been through that building the structure and the hallway as it exists right now really does operate to serve as a funnel and to maintain that funnel seems to defeat the intent of the code if they did nothing and continue to use the structure as is that final would exist and would be less safe if they are going to go through the time trouble and expense to expand this and then to still maintain that existing layout exit strategy seems counterintuitive t code and if in my opinion they've presented that their plan exceeds the intent of the code given that they are going to make a change  there my comment to other board members is that the final that currently exists today was designed by the church when a compromise was made because they ran out of money they decided to compromise that eager ass and create that problem now maybe at the time they didn't feel like it was a problem or that it was somehow be handled differently but my sympathy for the situation is less because that was a created problem that somebody decided to go ahead with i i also agree with you that given that this problem exists today the only way out of this is  to try to help them solve the problem but i think i'm reluctant to go along with it because it's a problem that they've created themselves some architect several years ago decided this was the church leaders decided to compromise on that and create this problem for them so respectfully disagree with that reasoning and as much as when the building was built in two thousand that was sixteen seventeen years ago when they entered the design and planning phase the population the number of the people there you have attendees of attendees children and now children's children in some case and it grew and perhaps exceeded their foresight or vision and that the standard for which i'm applying this towards is the health safety and welfare of the people that are tending not the lack of foresight or cut corners or budgetary reasons that may have existed at the time or or may have not if there is an opportunity to create a safer situation for anyone who attends there whether it's a regular church attendee or to look time leasing the facility in order to have a concert for people from out of town if we have a situation an opportunity to create a safer situation that addresses the health safety and welfare in my opinion i think would be remiss not to act upon that at least an applicant out right let's keep in mind as it's built it complies with the code that was in effect when it was built they're proposing some way to improve the safety of the structure it's the only reason they're here is because they want to make it better it's if they want to leave it the way that it is they don't talk to us and so the question is you know does this make it better and if it does why would we  yeah i would also agree so far here that it seems over period of time here that they've been taking measures to constantly improve the safety and  adequate or the intended use yes it sounds like a very small margin at this point and i would feel terrible to you know see this come in the housing and construction appeals that we've seen for residential units some historic homes second floor the height of the ceiling didn't meet our standards but if we could have hardwired health safety and welfare so i'm ready to measure or i'm ready to make a motion unless there's more than just like to make a mother comment i completely agree with the whole final issue but i think the fact that there's one hundred twelve acres there and that there's additional land that we could potentially they could potentially build up and we were willing to consider that as an option this is a very large church and you know there's a lot of people that go there which is great but at the same time if there's there are other options i think on the table potentially to allow the church to be able to expand by building another facility another building that's separate from this building that maybe it's connected by an underground people in the church and i think that that's an option and all that so let's say a little bit with two is so let's say we flush out that idea and they build an underground tunnel build a new facility  postpone this the funnel as it stands still exists for the main meeting area whether it's it's the churches worship service or i'm sure there's other events there but i keep going back to the old time concert so they packed that place that situation still exists regardless and to me this is an opportunity to remedy a situation perhaps unfortunate and how it got there but when i consider if i were attending with my family or my children i would appreciate a safer situation regardless of how it got there than a less safe situation and as presented tonight i'm convinced that this is perhaps a unique situation i agree totally with michael i have been stuck in that funnel for supper minutes before trying to leave events that if you know some of the newer concerns aside from the fire that they're talking about now active shooters we didn't talk about that it's in years ago but i wouldn't really want to be stuck in that funnel right now if something like that were happening and that has nothing to do with the addition that it's making improvement would create a situation that is less safe than without the viral continue and i think that the performance of the building with respect to this variant is adequate for its intended use and also does not substantially deviate from the performance required by the code for the health safety and welfare of the people in fact the plan is laid out exceeds the intent of the code there are two hundred percent more exit doors the doors are more visible the distance to the exit doors are shorter there will be additional automatic smoke detectors which we can put in there as a condition of the committed updated fire resistance to the materials in addition if we are not to do this it would create a situation where people would not be able to see the exit doors as well and it would deplorably that was taken to consideration i also believe that the specific conditions justifying this variance are neither general nor recurrent in nature and lee this is a unique situation  the did build this within code at the time construction but now that has created a layout in the shape of the current structure that is that prevents expansion  when you take in consideration of the size the size of the building and that there's no other way to expand this overall creates uniquely safer situation and conditions there i would propose  be that the area which is requested for the variance what they applied for must remain consistent with that which is proposed i would like the condition that they maintain or improve the the fire and smoke evacuation policy and that they install or maintain a voice alarm system and corns for code nine zero seven that five to the two that  ok so i'd be looking for a motion to approve the meeting minutes that is amended a motion all right support meeting is april twenty eighth april twenty eighth anything else on the agenda that we need to address