preliminary engine engineering study for the mean streets bridge get us up a really good evening e mails and phone calls on what we said we come back to the board which you know what's plan for the design of the bridge what it might look like any issues since you've gotten the memo i have talked to and if we want to include the fixes to the spalls on the bridge or maybe to that have wall he would support that we're going to be you know well within the costs that were allocated for the project the only issue there is whether to do that we get hung up on a whole lot of permits because we can do to fish or bridge without touching those and handelman a different day right so we've got to do a little bit of print perm and research to see where we go with it otherwise recommendation is that you time frame we're going to have to use that so the plan will be to do in the spring time and go out in such a way we don't really affect the school that's the other issues on the law school kids walking through that area and i do think i forgot to mention because you're too we did go over visualize how much water we're talking about the difference between what my average water usage was and what i got below the six hundred forty three thousand gallons water is roughly five hundred twenty five thousand gallons of water so i sort of didn't experiment the other day i took a five that you guys know i'm in that business every day and i have thirty employees there day if we have a girl who is running i would like to think for two days today we would know not seven seventy three days we would have to be close i mean i don't know how we would miss something like that the board of civil authority we have big taxes in the rules when we can evade taxes and unfortunately a lot of the time a story like this it's we've got certain rules that say you know you can't you can't evade the taxes  if the money is old then we and the staff can't come up with a good reason for why the money's not why you shouldn't pay the money then we have to go with the staff but in this case it seems like we should i can make care so i will move that we abate the water sewer component in the penalty and split the cost of the water bill to and charge five hundred sixty two you get to school on  time so only the one that you were recommending was the one that  these projects to have some impact on school property either just in terms of the aesthetics sightlines but there's also the possibility of needing to have an expanded boundary in an easement or something like that and listening to the planning commission there was a little bit hesitant see in terms of of the year not being sure what what the village trustees what the village what does the village want to do with the school how much latitude we have with the school and to negotiate with applicants for what happens around the school and my assumption is if i did want to go and say this deciding what they want to do so i would rather than trying to just transmit that information but with a phone call i thought it might be a nice opportunity for i not all of us want to go or two of us want to go one of us wants to go to the next commission meeting and say basically we want you to advise us we want you to look at the development that's happening there with the one in active application in the secondary conceptual plan and to sort of look at this as a whole integrated piece as our former colleague commission members you know i don't want to sell something you with the task of doing it but maybe they may have some questions about it that they want to bounce off us when is the next scene i think it's in about a week community it is a high school students when they get out at three o'clock right got a fight with one of them last week i know but i was so eager to meet it and it's people just trying to get the kids to school or get to work so i do and whereas george will be retiring on november third two thousand and seventeen and whereas george has concluded over thirty three years of dedicated service to the essex community and whereas george has served the essex police department and the remop law enforcement community exceptionally well for decades as an officer supervisor and commander and whereas george supervised and mentored many subordinates fairly and with good humor as a first line supervisor and commander and whereas george is recognised for his contributions to the wider law enforcement community through his many years of service in law enforcement now therefore be it resolved that the select board board of trustees  manager on behalf of the citizens of the town of essence here by extend our gratitude to george for as many years of service to the people of that six they s forget that the police department started in the village and then it became part of the community as a whole george was near that time but it's still somewhat sympathetic to that concept  village about it is it is a departure from using procedures that i don't see any of us getting a sense i'm not sad about it i know the consistency is important in local government and i'm raising the if you know because it's inconsistent with what we've done and i just want to know going forward recognising  existing memorandum of understanding between the village and the town regarding combining the public works department of the village and town and in the year three have that in the here which we are in right now we were  tasked with assessing the progress and the members of that committee were myself in the interim around from the trustees and i take minutes to come from the select board and justin rather do listen as instruction resident and was also the public works the city of south burlington who was serving as our outside technical agent simply by the m p u and justin provided an outstanding resource to us so we met six times over the course of the summer and we utilized as many resources as we could and i would be remiss if i did not demonstrate the effort that has lots of this binder in here we reviewed minutes from multiple select board meetings and trustee meetings a topic we talked about multiple aspects of what we needed to assess and that we determined that our job was to determine whether we had been successful partially successful or unsuccessful in seven different criteria which i think more me on the next screen for this  integrated village highly budget the town's general fund providing component and the elements of an integration study reducing cost reductions or quantify it will provide a management and engineering assistance coordinating activities of mutual support developing procedures and implementing tools for infrastructure management and providing timely quality public works services to residents and businesses in the town and village our inclusion as a committee was that all of these criteria were met with success that the two hartman's proxy gether was still doing their jobs very well and there were no significant issues that we uncovered trying to follow  some additional resources that we use in public works integration study minutes for meetings and annual reports from the town in the village examples of joint project work provided by dennis and rick the results of the survey that went to village and town employees regarding the unified manager position because some of their responses had to do with their ability to do their jobs and how it works departments public works budgets for fourteen fifteen sixteen seventeen and recommendations are we maintain we recommend that we maintain the existing m o u without change until it expires in june of twenty thousand at that time or over the course between now and that time we conduct or at least initiate a series of studies as outlined in the further in the report and extend the m o you from july first two thousand and eighteen until the studies are well underway or completed and the goal is to fully consolidate both public works department eventually but we recommend going through these studies that we suggest and we don't recommend a particular time because there's just a lot of work boards decide to pursue this path should be based on the step benchmarks that are established as a result of the studies that we undertake so it's all a process of informing more and more and more so that we're very clear on what we're doing over time the specific recommendations affect personality finance resource management and recommends under the personnel umbrella cross training staff between the village and the town identifying and institutionalizing common best practices and procedures aligning rules and regulations analyzing in a mining job descriptions and establishing at some point in the capital project planning funding and implementation process and finally studying and establishing guidelines for assuming future debt for equipment and projects and for joint bonds that use them for a heavy duty the same for all staff this is this could be in ten year time really could be a five year time the boards could decide to do some or all of these recommendations there are some that could be done simultaneously some that are going to have to be done one time so we work very hard on trying to understand the complexity of both the part i think with the help of our with the help of dennis and greg and lauren and pat we were able to accomplish that and i know this is the report that we submit we are interested in hearing both boards questions and comments and i think the step that we are looking to take we're going to keep the m o u in effect as it is we're recommending that and so i don't see any of this being implemented during the budget cycle that we're getting ready to go and i think that's a little too early would you agree with that  yes it may be another you know spring and summer cycle town meeting and village meeting are complete and we have a new manager that we can turn our attention to this again and start i how would that happen you know in a consolidated public works who would make that decision where would that money come from i know that this is these are things to be quote to be to be figured out but my question is just globally just suggested as we have something like this on the agenda later on what is the overall difference in the items to be worked out if we maintain the status quo in terms of governance two separate talks are two separate boards versus a consolidated government does it make things easier or harder the conversation change what what should we be doing in terms of the overall there is the if you see an overlap there is a lot of overlap there is that necessary conversation to be having or can we have to be having to start a conversation about consolidation of public works has nothing to do with consolidation or any change for the changes in government any thoughts about that  think because some of the more challenging aspects of what needs to be studied go and pull in particular the rolling stock and the capital projects budgets i think they would go more smoothly and would result in better business practices for both communities and we need a result in more predictable tax equity for both communities if those conversations happen as a single point because yeah i mean i'm one of the things that we did talk about was did i break you know did think how things were proceeding have anything to do with the actual people that were involved and if the people for the future consider the public works roles as opposed to the individuals and people retire people quit you know so we were very lucky to have the having separate discussions and you are going to get together from here on how do you see how do you how do you see let's just say let's let's back away from the governance just in just in terms of going forward with this what what sort of discussions would we have where we would have to have the two boards sitting together aside another committee how would you go about doing that if you you know we said we're going to the recommendation i'm guessing we're we're going to stay with the model you're recommending we continue so we're probably continue didn't find any horrible things going on but you know if we want to we said ok wait let's start moving in and start to implement some of these recommendations who what would be the body and the search it stands for we having the discussion for how to go forward with  staff expertise on cross training staff is another thing that we should not be touching it's something that staff can handle and they can report to us how it's going but studying and implementing a similar role and stuff i think we should talk about that because it touches taxation and we can rely upon the expertise of our financial staff and our public works staff to guide us in that conversation so i would want to you know i suspect  capital program perhaps looking at an outside third party to look at that that's best done my view is not this is sort of by committee but on direction of the manager to assemble those players which might include board was identifying as though you mention like some key measurable benchmarks and setting targets and having that kind of guide the m o right there we can choose to do two or three you for three years but i thought we had a i thought we had put it i'm looking for it in here and i can't find it now and i can't remember if it was part of the earlier draft and i missed it if you take it now but i thought we had talked about extending it another three years come july first two thousand and two so that let leads me to questions as we're talking about these judy will you is your preference that makes them at its to this solve things we were tasked to look at where things were make some judgment on where they were and and based on what the himmel you that's in place had said there was basically four choices that we then needed to period of time during which time we will look at pick out the items in the food area and maybe even establish the schedule so people are comfortable when items might be done and that becomes clear footprint for where we want to year commitment as you just said will put them on an upcoming joint meeting agenda and go forward with it but i think i'd like to get if we want to just get back to should we think the issue of just accepting  that you but there was definitely plenty of devil's advocacy over the course of the summer i would definitely say and dennis and rick and justin in particular were really heated disagreements over the contents of the reporter and we edited it you know as a group i think of the things i would say made up of trustees and slip board members if we wanted to have a vigorous debate about the points i think she's point is really well made that there were some people  strongly about things that others but at the end of the day we agreed that the recommendation by the committee should be a unanimous unanimous recommendation and so there were several say that he was very excited to be a part of the community because they think he felt like he had experiences he could share i remember when we were doing the interview process there were a couple of others voice to hear and maybe the committee heard it through you but it's specifically said that you didn't talk to staff in the field so that raises a flag for me to just ask the question really representing  we have a separate department that operates from station so they're not it is a little bit of you know cats and dogs i mean not if it were at each other it's not the point work well together but we function differently and so we maintain that through this process where there's been a certain amount of independence on both the town and village but we're getting together monday for a winter operations plan we're going to go over some things for three or four hours have lunch together and all of duel of good things so we can do that and we've helped each other out where we need to help each other out but it's not until you have really one department tolly you you're not going to have that total integration of skills because quite honestly a operator in the village doesn't need to run a greater in the town and quite honestly can't afford to waste time training him to run a greater when he's never going to run there so you need to look at it from that perspective so the we've operated for most employing them and get to the meat of the question there's been almost no difference other than the fact that we may send a crew down to help our crew up to help out in their their morning the difference between how one group does it build a survey that was going to be distributed to to the staff of the village and the town and i started to form the questions for that survey and that's where basically the input that we were getting was that would be a waste of time and it would be a waste of valuable time and so we we abandoned that idea because it was no more time but it was the staff's time that we didn't want to take it and we also but we didn't i personally was a little reluctant to let go somehow getting some input so we called for the results of the unified manager survey because then we had standards to provide them to us because the now the collection of some kind of input from staff and when we went through them sure enough there were common definitely related to efficiency of the public works department how i get my job done so we actually did get it wasn't the same set of questions but we had a on a sampling of what staff felt about the changes that were happening in the village and town and rick in tennis at length explain all of the public works in consolidation work that these boards have task them w to governance discussion and i think it's come up a couple times that we have we've had this discussion going to have to have the discussion but but how should we approach it what what kind of documents do we need what kind of setting do we want to be and what what just sort of globally what is the approach how do we want how do we want to move after this because i think we we're in the process of hiring a municipal manager we are in the process of consolidating or working out some kind of a consolidated continue consolidation of the public works departments clearly the momentum is moving us towards changing such changing things the way they are that's for sure  so we i think there's a desire among some of us most of us that we want to kind of feel that the that the two boards have some kind of a global understanding of we're all this is going in how we want to how we want to approach it what kind of have this weird village situation where villages get to do pretty much what they want never seen this before and i said well i don't know it not sure if it's but it's pretty common in vermont but one thing that we might want to do it some point if we began a discussion would be to have someone who could really speak to us about the history and the significance in the legality and so forth of the of the village child relationship just as a sort of a background information that we would have going forward so that would years ten years twenty years fifty years we really do need to think that far out sometimes we do not very  yeah i mean kind of along the same lines i always like to look at what are all the options and we're looking at those options so all of those you know like that where you're saying bring somebody in that sort of has the history expert on this crazy i think rather than rather than kind of having this preconceived notion of what the solution is there's all the indeed a violent merger the boards will last the departments have to happen first so if we can find a way to get t v off the shelf then i guess we're stalled out and just be realistic with each other that a bottom number of your starts with love from guns the higher you for me and then markedly different from what our friend is receiving these boards to be so i hear you all ready to really step forward in a way that i don't think is aware of it i think it's too bad you didn't come over here and i'm thrilled right now by what i'm hearing and what your vision is for moving forward by everyone sitting here and i know i sound a little goofy right now but i'm  i think i would just echo trying to talk to people that have been through this before and i know there are at least two minutes of these that have done this and to where of i don't know that we've ever invited anybody from either one of those to and the process hasn't gone that far yet but i'm thinking that maybe the next step would be to get do you know i look at rockingham and bill's fault bill falls as a village and rocking in town and they have one of the things are into it interesting they have a lot of mutual develop it wards and they have this this piece written into their charter where their every choir is going to meet five times a year the to the select where the trustees regardless of who is on the board whether they like it or not they have to sit down and meet and talk about stuff i mean that there's a lot of interesting situations where to just from time to you know for much unique we all know that but there are still lessons to be learned from neighboring states so you know if just i'm just going to pick a name i don't i don't believe they've done this with greenfield mass for example if they had that type of situation is there anything to say that we could not reach out to them and just invite them up here  bottom and work up it doesn't work as well as we're going to talk down that neck in that respect and i just i just was thinking about that thought you know as dennis was saying we're doing it is really people down below don't really notice it so much so opportunity for us to to talk to really you know flesh out some of the ideas that we had in and have our e v a s challenge and so forth but there be any interest in trying to do that with both  come but i was just thinking if we didn't approach had work session like this retreat scenario it might be a little more conducive to really getting in getting into more to do the background scotian in the dialogue and i don't know that that's a good idea something that people would least we don't commit to it now but i was even thinking that we could do it with lunch and we might even be able to do it by taking out room up getting lunch room up at the essex so we could feed whoever comes from members of the public also be presumably i would imagine with a new manager coming on but there's got to be interaction with your board and a new manager here prior to that pride or anything like that happening but that would be enough to be a casual setting for the new manager  gathering this information now and maybe every joint being we have a standing agenda how are we doing with the information or does anyone have any more information that they want to consider or here's and we can do some of that getting to the other thing i want of the same was it's great to look at what existing communities are doing and see what existing models are out there but let's remember that we are just as special as rocking him  unusual ideas timelines you know this is a very clean slate and we're probably one of the only communities in the country having this conversation so were they and are the sacket let's consider also  can't recommend it says each of us have although each of us had recommendations about what we'd like how about instead of assigning some of the task of researching all this how about if each of us takes this home and does does our own homework and put it together and put it into some kind of a document plus we could winnow we definitely tell us the areas that we still need to do research and write i mean if we write come write become a document and didn't become a tool  have assistant management experience two with county management experience four with municipal department head experience and fifteen new related experience so that he said that there is that  tune in to channel seventeen or get our minutes could could all of a sudden have a leg up on the on the prop on the application process so we kind of thought to to sort of keep it keep it trying to keep the a little bit confidential  what exactly it is we're looking for specific candidates we probably because this is an employee an employment situation a personnel situation we probably wanted to do that in executive session ok that's and that's the only reason there's nothing and don't want we don't want to we don't want to i mean again if someone gets the questions and someone doesn't ahead of time it gives it could disadvantage some people as opposed to others  so we just would kind of like to keep as much of this we're trying to do as much as we can in open session but thing is this is a certain point where information we want to try to keep it here so they're not we're not giving one with that how about that would that be ok with everybody is you using i don't see a reason not to do it we just dress a little hesitant to give someone an advantage over over other people so why don't we say as soon as the questions are sent out then we'll we'll send you a  just for the sake of fairness i mean we were trying to strike the right balance here in terms of openness openness and you know understanding that this is ultimately a personnel decision let me take the extreme we would be releasing anyone's name if so how do we decide these panels so that we have to make that decision and i would add one important piece of information which is in the input sessions for example the input session that we offer that don offered on a week ago on saturday he had three people apply to that session and so don wasn't feeling well so he asked if he asked us if it would be ok if you just call those people which means they got an hour of his time which was better for their important but my point in saying this is that i'm not sure if we did another broadcast into the community do you want to get involved in another input session that i think it might be worth our while to say we have to actively recruit some people and we're going to have to pick out some people and send on those maybe send on a group of resumes and not resumes but that's part of the contract is that there will be a preliminary interview panel that they're going to not us but of another group of people and what that group of people who the who is in that group it could be anyone he's open to suggestion it could be employees it could be people that you know that are professional business people it could be just members of the public and so they will form a group that will do a preliminary interview of these of this of th response and then you'd want to get into the question of saying well people have had like like any was that input session tonight so we dawn would dawn would have the names of all the people who are input such as we want people outside our borders we would use what we could do is maybe it may be broadcast it say but i would just caution us that we may have to step in and recruit some people and if we want to just as we said we just want to pick out ten professional people you know business people are professional working people out of the community in the village of the town and there the panel boom that's it that would be ok we could do that  tried every way because i think if you're going to ask i'm going to listen to fifteen interviews is that if i hear that correctly you i wouldn't want to just assign someone to that and assume that they have time in their life and the desire to do that so i would be moving in by the time you got to the give and take that you will have with the questions and answers you might learn something about how quick they picked up on certain things is it's an outside perspective the radically that this what we're discussing now i think in your bones up to about it would be so much trouble having here and the other thing is that i'm just curious i'd love to ask him or maybe some of you know this in this process  now and the thing is is that next and i could go and talk to don and say oh ok don will explain it all to us and who which band was doing what and when the interviews and tours and everything but then if we communicated that all out to you we can have a big online discussion about in three questions and wait a second so it i think we're going to have to do is try to really have clarity by our next joint meeting about this i don't think i'm not sure nov if we did not have that open discussion about that so are there any legal implications of correcting the motions twenty four years old actually the way it was before you came from below so i saw that you're right why wouldn't