first is that the court viewed the that an eligible matter and an abstract level that was beyond what the courts require here's a fair here's something that i maybe thirty six to seventy two and eleven call eleven find fifty three talks about the scale ability of the system is different about the location because under the all methodology the old technology is described in specification you'd have to monitor every single of hundreds or maybe thousands of components of the system in order to understand how those yes sensors or old are the types of material being collector old art the significance of the inventive part of this invention is that you have stead of having to monitor all of the components of the system you can select clearly put sensors a particular locations so that you can measure those using the other components the model the virtual system model which is a static model developing the systems created by so if you can't show it to be about it well as it is you're not there when and and paragraph ninety four is a very complete specification in ninety four what page this would be appendix ninety four in your briefing in below that with the inventors invented was this more elegant solution of detecting all this information by using a much smaller number of sensors strategically positioned throughout the grid system we talked about strategically we didn't say through our small boxes strategically putting sensors in the system because that's what the path of the patterns described through the specifications right so i guess what i'm saying i just don't remember the specific argument that what this invention represents is a significant reduction in the number of sensors that need to be used in order to accurately assess the health of a power grid well what we said the selectively rather than putting sensors on every site i don't think we've actually said using fewer using lasted but the whole pattern is based on the idea that well because because it says the data acquisition opponents connected to a sensor configured require real time data put from the electrical system it could be one it could be more but but i think there are what we need to get to here is is what is the novelty of this system where you have five systems or ten sensors of what it is you're really meaning in step two or given or no i think first on making a step  of abstraction the court use terms like reflecting reacting to predictive deviation as the one that that is directed to that's not true if you that were the case then fear would real time no more than that your honor because you can do it in real time but in addition to that there are the features of this path the virtual model there is no virtual model and power and electric power there was no analytics engine that made comparisons between the static data that the engineers developed at the time and the new data that was coming in from these sensors there was no threshold and the threshold systems are going down air traffic control systems are going down radar systems are going down and you remember i remember how that what that did to the air traffic system since two thousand level one once in chicago there was a fire they decide i guess to getting back to electric power group yes i mean again that was a power grid like your power grid it was collecting information about the status of the power grid which is also what you're doing here it was analyzing that data and then displaying measurements from the different collected data it was displaying results of the analysis of that data and then it was also displaying something called the composite indicator for reliability that is an indicator of power grid vulnerability which sounds like again it's displaying after analyzing the data displaying some information about predicting what are the potential problems with the power grid and so that in its own way sounds like it's creating and visualizing for the use rather in fact it isn't a claims electric power was simply a broad abstract statement of what could be done as a matter of fact if this part of not done away with our electric it would have absorbed our cat not preempt the world but limit you have to the virtual system are one engine that is a soccer program that model is the original concept of that of this electric power system and tell you what it should be doing based on manufacturer specifications what systems age over time they degrade and then problems occur like arc flash and failures you have an analytic sentient configured to monitor both the real time data coming in and benefited greatly from ellipsis computer simulations techniques and such techniques are relatively well developed but they have not been applied in real time that e g for real time operational monitoring and it is contending is that the abstract idea itself the concept of updating the prediction model when there is a sufficient deviation from world world it's admitting that that's innovative and that's useful and for purposes of this case we can concede that the i think kiyo invite the court's attention if i may do you can see the real time element of that that to that that  parked up day in response to prediction deviations that is as far as you know based on real time data yes that was also done that was done in electric power i'd invite the court's attention invite the court's attention to appendix sixteen eighty five so appendix sixteen eighty five is what power analytics told the district court was the focus of their invention and it sixty eighty five  minor but necessary element of the inventions that focus on the use of that data to calibrate and or synchronize the model of the virtual electrical system and use the new values to generate new calculations for the virtual system model that is a data solution to a data problem that respects the data problem there was that prediction models they call the virtual system model same thing got out of the day the solution was to update the model when the deviation from the real world exceeded a certain threshold the power analytics in this brief in their opposition was fairly consistent that that these many disadvantages through employment of the power analytics server and they explained that the patents ensued solve problems and quited the system operations with functionality that did not exist previously and three stated that prior to the inventions reside in the patents ensued if that is the virtual system model and its employment to excess sessile electrical system set as prior  quote did not incorporate real time bad data and their accuracy was compromised as a result doesn't that convey the contention that the elements of the asserted claims don't reciting matters which are well understood routine or conventional to a person of skill yes trotter but only with respect to what the trial of the district court correctly found as being the abstract idea on the page that your honor cites on sixteen eighty eight at the bottom we see at line twenty three the twenty four when the differences between the electrical systems current status and the virtual system models calculated calculated outputs exceed the threshold the inventions initiate  said what they said was inventive was the subject matter of stop what they did not as a matter of law distinguish step one and step two they conflated it and for an inventive concept and step two they went back to the abstract idea they said no one before is updated the prediction model when there was a deviation a threshold and that of course is irrelevant under the law so that's what they don't do is to say you come up with any unusual or new way of doing conventional virtual model applications can be used for creating a virtual system model of the patent specification and it's their invention is not having a virtual system model or software for creating any combination of components whose operations can be monitored with conventional sensors so there is no do data here they are not the path doesn't say where we come up with some new sensor to detect some new electrical property of a system the data is old the sensors are all the data acquisition hub is all servers were old the client terminal was all the displays were all all of the equipment was all nor does the specifications suggest unlike ba ninety four and appendix ninety four column forty one at line thirty three they're admitting that centrally this can be done with any type of computer system so line thirty three quote the embodiments described here and can be practice with other computer system configurations including handheld devices dot dot dot mainframe computers and the like the embodiments can also be practiced into stripping computing environments where tasks are performed by remote processing devices that are linked through a network but the claims don't require that certainly and that's simply a them body so they're saying any computers any arrangement of computers and then finally on this point column forty one same column appendix ninety four lines thirty fifty eight fifty nine fifty eight fifty nine close in particular various general purpose machines may be the very consistent the specification all of the hardware all the combination of hardware is know and then if i compare that to electric power at appendix nine forty five you know because i look i think you're your own the only issue you have is step two and whether a person of skill would say that the what they assert is the real time nature is new and and that might be a question of fact it to try so show me why it is a lot to reason one is a procedural so we moved for summary judgment and per the local rules we said there is no the cheery will dispute as to any any genuine dispute as to any material fact in the local rules they needed to come back and say otherwise they needed to identify material facts that were generally disputed that's important i mean that day and so i did not and they cited not in their opposition brief they pointed to no material fact that was generally disputed in the argument same now want to appeal they said well we couldn't have because birth time or came out the the real time aspect of could could arise from two things one you have some better hardware that is now able to do real time which they don't think mitt conventional or it could be simply the idea it's like oh let's let's not if you organize the system in a fashion such all the old components but all of a sudden it updates because it's drawing from fewer sensors and and able to analyze differently it updates everything faster and recognizes problems faster when you disagree that's at least a question of fact if the claims we cited some new configuration of software we  twelve from electric power group so a column thirty one electric power group claim talks about every site calculating and updating new data as part of its data solution created an input to the algorithm agree no data like that what i'm talking about is the output the what is output is a new analysis so for instance a column thirty one line twenty one it says quote stability metrics derive from analysis of the measurements from the data streams so part of the method is to get the input data old data and you create these dynamics debility metrics at line thirty power system received information from sensors could have been the same sensors this past talking about himself to talk about have the data streams are collected in real time and then detecting in analyzing events in real time yes and then finally as judge and referenced earlier at line forty five deriving a composite indicator of reliability that is an indicator of power grid vulnerability that is a prediction model this is used this was used to prevent blackouts allow up an operator to look at some screen and see some indicator that you have a reliability problem so we submit that this case can be decided on started decisis that patents claims and the electric power system claims are directed to a data solution to a data problem and use generic hardware and therefore ask the court to affirm the district court just a hypothetical the the principle you're espousing at a day to solution to a data problem that sounds really broad and could feed into a lot of things like for example some kind of system for predicting the path of a hurricane where with each passing day you know you want to try to figure out if this hurricanes going to hit new york and with each passing day you get better and better information because of the hurricanes on the move and then you can alter the the model for figuring out how it's going to hit new york city just maybe just jersey so we need to we need to figure this out and and so there are big data solutions out there that seem to be very valuable and so therefore you would think instinctively ought to be part of the patent system so when you say data solutions the data problems are and not pat now which will i wonder if things like my hypothetical get swept into that algorithm that allows you to take data that's already been collected and the algorithm somehow gets more accurate results then i would suggest probably not patent eligible however if it's more like deer where there is a functional relationship between the mental aspect and some physical data collection like the thermocouple in the in the old that that would be bad about that and clearly i guess i don't need to decide no and that's you know want more sensors to get the real time information but you have to read that lie the specification that says that we're not censoring the entire system but that's not the major point the major point here is that what judge wallace said is that this is different and it's like the hurricane system this is not preempting the world we have a very specific set of machines and software programs that limit our invention to the specific elements here and those elements are the inventive balance of the calibration and synchronization those are found anywhere else and they were not in if you read the specifications very explicit they just get a real time data is important and not having that sense of the whole system is important but getting that data and doing the right thing with it which is of comparing it to the old data so they can see changes in the system and then recalibrating that model so that that model knows what the system is actually doing and synchronizing that data is an operator gets a picture