avoided the trap of hindsight based on the object of evidence in particular we can powerful evidence for commercial success and on that point the board actually sat our evidence would have been persuasive if left unchallenged so let me address natural tendency to use hindsight when determining angling obviousness and that's the end of the words and why is it not relevant to look at you were looking at one truck was it number eight or so last like that and that's one of the board  was concerned about that there that they didn't say there's no evidence of commercial success they just pointed out that when you determine a commercial success if the pattern covers four hundred products and you come in and show one product you made a lot of money on isn't that probative not necessarily obviously there's there might be success but the extent to which that success is a measure of the  now but why as i don't understand we're talking about commercial success here so i mean the board considered and considered it to be commercial success but they were just looking at not whether that  when you're dealing with one slice of what's covered by the claims so i mean certainly they could be disagreement as to their fact finding and they didn't give it the as much weight is they should of but board said you have to show this i mean this isn't illegal they looked at the they're weighing the factors here and their weight and the strength of your commercial success argument and in that context why can't understand how your answer is judge of men because the board says explicitly given the issues raised by the requestor drive to question the weight that should be accorded the evidence of commercial success so how do you read i don't know maybe i misunderstood what you were answering gentility but they didn't say that commercial success isn't a factor that would be considered in that they would consider evidence that this comes to a matter of how much weight it quickly touch under can i ask you just another thing and i think maybe i'm wrong but wasn't commercial success also affected by didn't the board also make certain findings discounting the extent of with respect to vehicle eight and they concluded that it appears that at least portion one of that success was affected by other matters so are you challenging drug our eighty percent this overwhelming margin of success to about seventy four percent so about five or six percentage points and given the board's determination that it was persuasive as a legal matter that couldn't do that was the commercial success was only shown with respect to this one class eight vehicle whereas a live swath of vehicles are actually covered by the claims doesn't this reference and shout out with respect to clay nine oversight they talk about class eight as being were linked to heavy duty diesel trucks claim nine talks about trucks that have heavy duty diesel engines side and and yet there different ways to treat narcs there were six different ways to treat particulate matter there were different orders we use an oxygen catalyst that has two purposes and the catalyst plus the trap to make sure that there is enough and it was who out of that second mechanism out of the trap after that oxidation catalyst to ensure that the s c r is going to work it's not a simple mechanical putting together their complicated chemical technologies and are and were entirely missed that