comments from commission members are we discussing both issues still the rezoning and the plan you can i think we've moved on to be but that's ok ok because i do have a question and it probably fits under the plan development and that would be what the homeowners association have any requirements for the number of rental units that would be allowed within the that that is i do read my e mail is that we will get to that i just want to let you know that it is a done and i will be able to find it i'm looking at the paper copy and i'm trying to find it to and that's specifically for the benefit of everybody that states when units may be rented in the development however the maximum number of units that may be rented it any one time should be should be twenty that probably should read should not be greater than twenty five percent of the total all rental shelob by the city rental registration in its program and that would be an and the applicant has stated actually in previous meetings that they would have no issue with that requirement being in there as you heard the last meeting with the there are two other developments in grand rapids they only have one rental uni both of them right now just to quickly before we get into the resolution but i just want to add that a staff is recommending approval of  resolution which basically encapsulates the villa's of how and development plan and i think that we need to go through the resolution definitely because there's a lot of important information in there but we  probably it's ok with the chair should probably hear from the applicant because there were a number of questions and stuff that were posed to them by the public and by planning commissioners at the last meeting and so before we get into the longer kind of slog through this resolution we may want to afford them the opportunity to talk and see once maybe where you want to get public comment to any all right our counsel dave called in and we are absolutely thrilled and excited to be here today to review all the work that has been done since our last public airing as mark was mentioning we'll keep our remarks brief but detail as the plan or staff report recommendations for approval is very thorough i am also fully confident that there's only insight plan application working as we are presenting a very refined plan that is the result of the input from the planning commission planning to rector neighbors municipal planner city engineer zoning administrators fire captain board of public works and the to a county parks director i am very thankful for everyone's efforts to accomplish the shared goal of a well designed and planned community for the specific site there's owning process has called it covered all the incredibly important aspects for a project such as this such as park access storm water drainage traffic density green space neighbor neighbor buffering tree preservation are single level homes and resident demographics there is one aspect that has not been fully chronicled and that is the positive effect that the villas of holland would have on those who currently live in the area and need this type of housing in order to help give them a voice we put together a very brief video of some of our current residents sharing how ours are step communities improve their you jason i'm also certain that the villas of holland would be a blessing to many long time holland residents their children and their grandchildren in fact we've been contacted by many holland area residents during this process who want to move to the villas of holland and we've been forced to start a waiting list and this list has now grown to seventeen prospective homeowners from the area we look forward to the opportunity to fulfil their needs with your approval with that i'll turn it over to jason thank you meeting so i had better turn west planning commission meeting we had some questions and recited some homework and we've been working diligently with the city engineer with staff and with others to address the questions identified today i'm going to present resolutions to these issues that were raised and to thank staff and city departments for their detailed and thorough efforts and time invested for us talk about the  stormwater the geotechnical site plan details in park interest her trail access some of that we've talked about already but i'll just give you our perspective one of the questions that was asked was what does a buy right plan and why is it relevant and at the start of the process staff directed us to put together a by right plan to show how many lots can be built under the current our one zoning on this property and to that end we created a single famil plan having consistent lot sizes with the r one zoning and with a neighborhood to the property into seventy one buildable single family lives we then looked at utilizing the same areas as for our type of project as permitted under a p r d's owning and we created a layout depicting seventy six units on the same build a ball areas based upon our conversations with staff it was clear to us that we needed to protect the ravine area if at all possible based upon the history and specific concerns and as an applicant we wanted to present an approvable proposal during this period he application process we w with staff to submit a concept plan showing sixty eight units and a clubhouse for review in january finally a review of eyes that concept into the detailed design in front of you today this plan preserves the six point nine acres of wood revealing permanently under the are one that allows a public park access and it falls three units under the permitted uses currently zoned in summary based upon the cumulative feedback of the stakeholders and staff and neighbors we have progressed from a seventy one unit by right plan down to a sixty eight unit p r t plan to show the second question we were asked to work on or to improve a storm water management system and we've touched heavily on that so i'll keep it brief we received the city engineers report during the last planning commission meeting and then we revised the stormwater system to improve  base and functionality as requested in that correspondence we then met with the city engineer to review his comments and our improved design to accommodate the stormwater and that improves he has approved that system in the email yet you referenced earlier this improve system will be maintained by the condominium association permanently and as mark also noted the ottawa county parks department has reviewed and approved the same permit third we were asked to provide some further clarification on the geo technical aspects of the site specifically we were directed to provide confirmation that our layout and our hillsides and slopes are buildable given the existing and groundwater conditions and to that end we retained a third party geotechnical engineering firm with extensive experience in the area as mark mentioned to evaluate our site for the buildings the layout and the construction methodology they prepared this report which we reviewed with the city engineer in the building inspector going through the details technical recommendations and in that same email the city engineer has noted  support for our third party review fourth of the staff memorandum that asked for some additional site plan details and to that end we've provided revise drawings to address those it those items as noted we've added street lights at our three primary intersections we have labeled the proposed road slopes as seven percent maximum which complies with our one zone in designation we have shown our traffic controls including our stop signs or speed limit sign locations or pedestrian cross walks we have depicted our front side and setbacks provided a road cross section for the city engineer including drainage and next slide please and we've provided our detailed landscaping plan revisions in accordance with the last staff memorandum including the materials quantities and locations of those plantings next life last but not least we were asked to clarify the park trail access location  material and just want to provide a little bit more history on that during the pre application process the city asked us to contact the out of a county parks to coordinate a potential trail access system or trail system access point the county specifically only wanted one pedestrian access from the north end of country club drive as their improvements in amenities are on the north side of the park they did not wish to create additional parking or maintenance on the sell side of the park additionally there park only currently has two access points one on the north side where all of the amenities are and the other crosses the road to pop up park so we are adding a third access point to the park and they have not asked us and it's our impression based on meeting with them that they do not desire any additional access points so it's at their direction that we've proposed what we have  proposed we will be providing a public easement to the city allowing permanent access for pedestrians to the park we are proposing a six foot wide concrete sidewalk consistent with city standards and a two foot grass shoulder on each side for maintenance and accessibility and then we are proposing to a narrow country club drive north of legion park and add roadside swales as part of the drainage improvement for the intersection as well which would make on street parking north of legion per drive unlikely from a physical standpoint next slide please in conclusion we've worked diligently the past several months to present a thorough and well thought p r g insight plan design for the billows of holland and we've worked extensively with staff over the past couple of weeks to further refine and improve our design we believe that the stakeholders have accomplished  resolution to our site layo our stormwater management our geotechnical design our site plan details our part and our park trail access we're very pleased with the end result of this purity application process  we thank everybody for their effort and input and we cordially request your approval of this addition to the holland heights community i just want to say that i live in this neighborhood and i walk from the country club now down to the out of county park and for those who are concerned about parking i think people who live in the neighborhood we're not going to park there we're going to be walking the path that the developer has graciously agreed with the city and the neighbors to put in the parks i want to thank you for that because i think that's a real asset to our neighborhood to be able to continue to access that as we have been now that the country clubs open to anyone else i want to say that you know people in the other parts of the city probably are going to drive they're going to go in use that out of a county parks parking lot that's on papad drive they're not going to be parking on country club or legion park drive they'll be parking at the out of country parks lot i've heard that as a concern from people i also want to share that you know i put out through my social media asking for comments from people that i'm connected with and i only heard a couple of negative comments the majority of people in my neighborhood that i've spoken to who are residents of holland heights are strongly in favor of this  the concern that most of my neighbors have is with rental units because of what happened out on sixteenth street with oxford court and abbey court and stratford way and i think that's the issue in holland heights it's not so much density as it is quality housing and i want to thank mr angles for the quality housing that he's proposing here and i don't see this as anything other than a win when you've reached out to the neighborhood and the community to the people who are directly affected you've worked with the city of holland and i see this as a model that i help other developers will take upon themselves to use when they come before us so i will be voting in favor of this thank you question first they do their drainage thing and by whatever reason whoever notices whoever controls those sort of thing it's a term and there's a problem happens the stormwater system will be privately owned and it is going to be incumbent the condominium association or the developer if they still want it to correct whatever situation may arise the resolution clearly states that it's condo association and the developer to fully maintain it if they don't and something comes up  they will be alerted i'm sure the d e q will be alerted if it's a big enough issue and remedies will be taken care of i mean that's really kind of the way we we address the issue right now but after the first good rain a year and a half from when people move then it's an issue what happens if i understand what you're saying and if it's inherent in the design of the system that it's a bad design yeah and in retrospect it well you know they're designing to permit requirements i just thought i'd comment briefly that the association as you noted mark will be responsible to maintain the system if it breaks will be responsible to fix the system the city will have all of the powers it has with respect to enforcement  stormwater ordinances and those back to enforcing what is ultimately approved obviously a question as to well what happens if it's not designed right i mean is an issue that would have with any project i assume but you know of course that's why the developers hired values that i've had these fish back and you know obviously respect does a good job or everybody wouldn't use and i do think of course what you point out that it could be design fault really is is always a potential option i think it's highly have open to the public right now but i am planning on opening at  would have to way i do it thanks thanks tom so just to reiterate so say should be responsible for maintaining the store the stormwater system fixing the stormwater system if it breaks fishback is designing the system fischbeck experience design engineer jason can probably address a little bit terms of experience and i think i've used push back but everybody is wrong at least once and you know only cure is so much you madam chair yet i haven't flipped out in heights now for thirty two years ok and we're not going to solve this issue ok there's always the one hundred year rainfall and it's happened three times since i've lived there and i've had you know a river in my backyard and i have a city storm drainage system in my backyard so i don't even think we need to go down this road i think what they're proposing is more than adequate if we want to talk at some other point about storm training in the city of holland i think that might be the condo association yeah they're they're responsible for it it's a private storm drain system so that is what i heard now am i misunderstanding that no that was  right and i'm ok with that as long as the city doesn't have to be responsible for that it is a private system so that the private developer and the county in the cities drainage is not impacted because it's not crossing over involved the city at all it's county county land and it's a private sewage system coming standard storm water system coming off the property is the city involved in that is the city involved in them getting a permit from the no it's an issue between the developer in getting a permit from the regulating agency and they get approval from the county to pass an order i mean where i mean we're going i'm going i'm going if there's an issue it's really not doesn't affect the city at answer i want to hear ok in the resolution and we get to that discussion ultimate laid the city is always going to reserve the right to enter and work on these systems if the private party for whatever reason is not diligent in doing it we reserve the right to do that and if we incur costs which we would we would assess them back to a condominium association from country club down into the park that when i can answer for you the city has asked that we grant permanent to the city and we were constructed to city standards and then we will pass the maintenance responsibilities and obligations to the city as well ok thank you this is more of a per se drill question from the staff if the developers wanted to do anything with that what did area would they have to come to the planning commission or what would be the procedure for that if they wanted to do any improvements like building something in there yeah a structure yes if they want to get down there and in clear some pathways for their own little private trail network i would say sewer can go down there basically whenever they want they could do tree removal activities they could do other things down there that you know to take care of their investment our investment the city's investment so i mean that could be done obviously without coming back here one more question the width of the walkway down into the county park you said it was feet originally had you said ten further conversation with the city and with the park it was determined that it was best to match the city sidewalk to give it a pedestrian feel and to make it obvious that it was a continuation of the city's sidewalk into the park so it's consistent with what on on country club drive right now which is to be tying into the end of their existing sidewalk and continuing into the park ok so we will have maintained the ten foot with foot shoulders if it ever wants to become blacktop members i am going to open it up for a public hearing we heard from a lot of people last week last time last meeting but there's any other additional comments or questions that anybody has out there in the public hearing at this time you have to talk in the microphone everybody is watching out of town post nine eleven hundreds creaking in phase five our subdivision we had some flooding issues at all county actually came in to fix it and then assess the neighborhood for that so can freestone eight forty five you state street i'm not opposed to this development i think with a lot of linda's comments they have addressed a lot of those issues that people had the thing i would ask for is that the county greenway outdoor discovery center greenway and a lot of groups have worked for a long time to protect that area and so when i hear someone saying well it's ok on their own property good and if they need to cut some trees down or some other things that's what's holding that property together the trees the root structures don't just hire a landscaper that puts in pretty flowers on the hillside please put in appropriate landscaping that will hold that together that will capture runoff it'll lessen any flooding or some of the flooding that goes on out there when you look at what's happened it's now a nature area so any buffer from there the typical term green space or landscaping in holland for a condominium complex means lawns and pretty flowers it does not mean the landscaping or low impact development are some great standards out there we've come a long way so i know there's going to be some grass and some pretty flowers that's ok but when it comes down to what runs off into the park what runs off into the river because we know that everything that goes from santa or the storm sewer goes into the river everything goes off the properties goes directly into the river it doesn't go anywhere else so please please please we've worked long and hard to make that into a beautiful native natural area and to be used by a lot of people and there's some great manicured areas out there for disqualifying and for other activities but the majority of it has a county and a lot of people work really hard to maintain that so with the housing that's there please pay attention to what's in your neighborhood and do the best you can thank you you names lauren pure bolt would be one of your close neighbors seventy eight country club road we've bought a piece of property three years ago and went from site condos and brought it back to our one developed three houses there recently and i just wanted to make sure the developer knows that when it rains hard that is a very impressive lake down there  very frayed nerves i've only lived in holland heights for one year out of my entire life but i took pictures of it and i was more than impressed and had i lived on that hill i would have yeah i wondered about liable for this there was so much water coming up that hill we just started taking pictures it was beautiful i was glad i did not live contingent to it and i just wanted to make him aware whether looks out their rear windows after a hard rain is going to be worried and impressed you my name's john moore and came here with my wife amanda two and a half years ago we bought property on the part drive one two three legion park drive and one of the reasons that we bought that house was because it's in a quiet neighborhood on a street that has not very much traffic and so i guess one of my biggest concerns is the traffic that will be coming down our street and some of the questions because as i sit here and listen to all this i get more and more questions can you tell me will there be any requirement for an amber structure upgrade for any of the surrounding neighborhoods for like streets and utilities were to the sewer in the water and all of those utilities access into this property  the existing sanitary sewer is out in country club road as well as the public water main and they will be getting access to those utilities from those mains in country are well that's part of my question yes and how about the roads where the roads require now there's going to be more traffic on both leach on country club and region park drives so is that going to require any kind of an upgrade for the for the road surface for there are the curbs and gutters or anything like that in certain about taxes and i'm concerned that we would be supporting their extra costs with our tax money  well in regards to a traffic i have the latest a traffic counts legion park drive between linden in legion court the latest traffic count we have there is one thousand five hundred fifty cars and that was taken in may of two thousand and nine so that's that would kind of go along with your statement that it's kind of a quiet type road country club road north of road so looking at those those figures to street network out there should be way more than adequate to handle the amount of traffic that's going to be generated by this development i know the maybe he could just tell us you know off the top your head jason connector a local connector type of street you're going to have other streets that connect into the streets going to get you out of the neighborhood and those are based on an engineering criteria of supporting x amount of weight next month or where we don't have we don't necessarily going city so that's like they do out in the county i did find the page here and there indicated that the development will generate three hundred thirty two trips yes what was that number again three hundred thirty two projected trips per day and that's just on any given average day which peter you said is about half of what a single it and can i make a comment i mean i've lived there thirty two years now in that neighborhood when it was the country club and people be in and out of there for golf they'd be in and out of there for me else they'd be in and out of there for wedding receptions special events chamber would hold events there i don't think this will impact the traffic in the neighborhood as much as the country club that's just my personal opinion i've been there thirty two years  right well i just want to point out well let me just point out also that a lot of the president multifamily dwellings that you pointed out were on what seemed to me like boulevards major major throughways waverly street things like that this is really this is a twenty five mile an hour speed limit down through our street so if this is not really what i would consider a major way r utilities are adequate are more than adequate to meet the sanitary sewer and public water demand for this development i think the traffic issue it's i mean we've talked about that the streets should be able to handle that in regards to the property values you know based on what the developers indicated that the housing prices are going to any other public comment hi my name is i'm in a more and i live at eleven twenty three beach park drive my concern is and it's a question more than a concern i think  what sort of an opening will you have to this development at the end of legion park drive will it be a stop sign will it be a signal will it be a gated community i couldn't make out from the pictures what's going to that's a great question and it's our full intention and the city engineer has reviewed and approved that we will convert that ninety degree free flowing intersection to a four way stop with pedestrian cross walks and stop signs and we've provided documentation on our site plan to indicate that for the record i'm sorry i just heard about this two days ago so i know this is really a big surprise to me and i've only heard rumors are you going to build any kind of site sidewalks through the neighborhoods for it's just going to be existing sidewalks the nose ahead  development you're asking well you know in the neighborhood going to development we i heard a rumor from one of my neighbors that there might be a sidewalk down my property which is on the north side of park drive that i know there's to my knowledge has been no discussion of the only sidewalk we're talking here within the public right away there's one leading from the development down to the park ok a long country club only one country on the east side ok thank you it's well built the owner said that you've been very impressed with the management and the condo association the strength of the neighborhood really depends on the condo association and she's very pleased with what they've got we live directly across the ravine and so we see what goes on there at night and late at night there are a lot of cars and out of there that obviously don't belong there you know during the day it's one thing but at night and i think as you say that property w eliminate whatever's going on there at night the other thing is the city lost a big tax base when the country club went out and this property has been sitting there for a long time and honestly i think it's about time we did something and i think this is a good proposal so i would ask that you support it thanks i mean the questions or comments from the public wrote because i think that's probably more quick except i would like to say that his staff of been very proactive in seeking our advice on the development and  i have no trouble at all with the floor plans or the no step concept in general i think it probably is a need for how i began my letter by saying two weeks ago we submitted several reasons why we continue to support the our one sounding primarily because the surrounding areas are one maintaining our one robey salt and consistent character and density for holland scuse me smaller scale buildings and drivers will conform more closely to the unique site without extensive excavation public streets retain the access openness and walkability of the heights so we're going to be losing the idea of public streets in that area tonight i would like to suggest several things that does not do these include  several things p r d's are not intended for uniform building style and placement throughout the site p r d's owns are intended to foster creative site design including multiple building styles and footprints specially designed to conform to varying site characteristics secondly p r d s are not intended to result in loss of natural site features such as all the large existing trees interesting landforms or central pedestrian access to the new company park from public streets again p r d's are not intended to slopes going down to the bottom of that ravine and i don't think fifty plus people i know i would not be able to negotiate that on a regular basis a comment was made about the existing cart path access i think you made that comment about how treacherous it is and we do have young people that run up and down that for track practice but it's a very difficult slope and the existing slope into the  much steeper than that so my contention is that the green space should be interspersed in the development to be usable by the residents in addition to that the steeply sloping  readily negotiable by pedestrians especially in inclement weather so i'd like to see more green space around the units are not intended to increase unit density p r d's owning is mainly a tool for clustering development and interspersing green space within the building area p r days are intended to fit new development into its surroundings in a complimentary way please consider the view the county park users will have of the proposal can you point i'm talking about the view of the slope as it goes down to the county park the uniform placement of the units all the units are the same all the spacing is the same as i look at that i'm seeing a view from the park a uniform row of buildings that are eighteen feet at the highest point that's where the the peak of the building and they are all perched atop eight to thirteen feet of fill of fill dirt on top of the existing slope that's there so the compacted fill slope is very steep all the way down to either the property line or the hundred year flood plain line finally p r g as they are intended to create gracious and spacious grounds by concentrating development areas please consider the entrance point there is no open space if you know sitting area or vehicle pull off space to facilitate ride sharing or a city bus stop and this seems like a great spot to extend city bus transport to right now the bus stops at country club and eight thank you very much thank you public hearing is still open anyone else wants to come up with any questions or comments all right i am going to close the public hearing at this time there any other discussion or questions from commission members you know i'm going to ask our city engineer who's was here if you would come up here and just talk what you just went over here you gave us an e mail brian by the way your name has been used more here than any others names so thanks for being here trouble if you could just comment your e mail was rather short email but just your thoughts about storm water and the geotechnical study that you looked at and i think discussed with some others but just your your overview and your comments on those two items trying not to get into too much detail here but you know we took the initial look at this with with jason and we did have quite a few comments on the first round of exchange of information basically but i've actually been pretty impressed with what jason is given back to the city in response to those  comments i believe looking at this that from a geo technical standpoint from an engineering standpoint that all the bases are covered so you know what was discussed earlier i caught a little bit about the road design and all that stuff  what mark what mark said is true you know these are local roads they're not going to see a whole lot more traffic other than what's there now i mean you know we've got the trip numbers and stuff like that obviously that traffic was there at some point in the past when they when the country club was there so i'm pretty comfortable with the way things are are shaken out here with regard the four way stop i guess i'd like to just comment on that a little bit  you know we've we've discussed that at the traffic committee level and i think everyone is comfortable with that four way stop regulatory signs such as stop signs do need to get to the council for a final approval  you know that's the process that i see happening at this point that you know that would go back to the traffic committee you know make sure that there is a positive response there which i think there will be and then that would go to the council for the and sorry the public hearing is closed y anyone else on the commission have any other questions or comments something staff does have this resolution prepared for you i don't know to what extent you want to go through it and i mean we can go through it section by section and rather be methodical if you want to or we can just open it up and if you have any comments questions issues problems with any of these we can discuss them i guess i'll just start by saying we did eddie couple items this morning some of the latest revisions and one of those was an item that linda came up with and that's on the middle of page eight of  the hard copy that i gave you and that's that's dealing with rental dwelling units so we've already discussed that with some additional language that went in there in regards the technical requirements in that starting at the bottom of page six requirements are the applicant shall smitty detail geotechnical report to the city engineer and city building official that addresses ground water and soil stability issues in relationship to the construction of structures on the site the report shall be provided for review and comment by said officials prior to the issuance of any building permits on the subject property geotechnical certifications that document that all development infrastructure and foundation slash structures were built per the plans in accordance with the geotechnical report supplied by soils and structures show be submitted to the city engineer and department which includes the building inspector after all the development and infrastructure has been installed and after all foundation structures have been constructed so we're we're basically requiring them to certify that all the buildings that they build out there and all of the streets and infrastructure and everything is is built further geotechnical reports i mean obviously that it would be doing that but we're going to require that they the technical report and geotechnical report or will vera engineers i think i mean this is going to be the onus is going to be on the developer and soils and structures kind of acting as well their souls and structures as working for the applicant but could kind of be a third party person watching over all the stuff as they get into the ground water excavating issues as they're building foundations and if they should come upon some groundwater as they're building a foundation or whatever you know you're going to have some very qualified people on the site there that will know what to do when issues arise so i do i don't think that bryan intends to be ope there at all really monitoring as as things go and i mean that's not really his role it's going to be the role of the of the applicants engineers certainly are our building inspector will be out there should this development be approved he's going to be out there he's going to be very busy out there and he does an inspections for all foundations as is there going and he has to approve  foundation permit and so city people will be out there on the site also in addition on page five section number four identifying that a sump pumps required for every  building foundation for just church into the storm water system so each home in the neighborhood or just the ones in the area of where the wetland or where the water seems to be permeating through the ground yeah this is kind of a a standard section that carried over probably from another development i mean all of their development is going to be slab on grade so they're not pumps maybe aren't going to be coming into play there they're certainly may be under drains for these foundations i'm sure every building is going to have an under drain soul and that and i guess maybe i'll say what word is that water going to go jason is going to go be directed into the street stormwater system ok yes is the answer yes ok and then one more final question where the construction traffic and the no weight limits i think you mentioned earlier what impact will that have on the road system there and as the other  person mr moore i think has mentioned how will that affect his taxes and repairing the road etc you know obviously if they're moving a lot of earth no weight restrictions we've got issues of water out there are some possibility of damage to the roads well as i understand they're going to be keeping all the soil on site so they're not going to be trucking that around but yeah there's going to be a lot of trucks and i don't know bryan i mean in greg we're not including any kind of performance bond or anything for adjacent streets we don't we haven't typically done that from what i understand with development   they'll be resurfaced those are costs to resurface roads are borne by the entire city so all the residents pay for that so it's not like a particular susman to the properties are long they had street if it's determined at some point time  curves and gutters are needed along those streets then those particular parts of the project curbs and gutters those would be assessed to adjacent property owners and if there were sidewalks parts of those as well but typical resurfacing if that's needed for as a result of this project all of the citizens of the city would be you know they pay that through our street resurfacing fund thank you greg so i would not be assessed on a front  i'm a bit of clarification just on the whole soils and structures things they're employed by the developers correct yes so they're really not an independent third party we were asked to get a geological report so we hired the most prominent company in west michigan to do so if the city would like to pay for that report we don't have to pay for that report i don't know of any other way to do it somebody has to pay them for their time and i guess that wasn't my question really was i and i i understand that's what they actually are i just want to make sure that we understand that's what they actually are you know their integrity would be on the line as well and i've used them they're good yeah but when i when mark says they're third party they're not think what i want to be for him but in other words they're not part of our organization right no part of our company thank you and i guess i'll just add and i don't know the speaker for that to this or not but but brian is very comfortable with the structure i am and i use them all the time i'm just want to make talk about the public easement down to the county park and the way we have it worded right now is that that easement would go to either the city holland or county parks a final determination has to be made in regards to that and i know we kind of have a little bit of differing of opinion as to this is being in house staff as to who maybe should own that and be responsible to  surprised does it have to be determined before this gets voted on i don't believe so i think it's just important i mean the easement is going to be owned by either the city or to a county and not a public entity and whoever gets it will maintain it will be yes ok so i mean we were kind of going ahead assuming that the city would probably want to just because it kind of makes sense it's going off from our right of way it's one of the reasons why we asked them to put in sidewalk sidewalk lasts for forty fifty sixty years so maintenance really should be that much of an issue just to reiterate it will be concrete yes yes ok quickly moving on to something else that may be of interest  to the question mark police commissioner does everyone feel like they've read through this comfortable with yeah ok all right then mark don't waste any more breath i won't ok does anyone have any other questions about the resolution as it stands we have just had one correction that we discussed earlier correct yes about the rental anyone else feel as though they would like to make a correction on here locations without driving great idea is going to be available through the easement on the so the road there or the transportation department actually put a bus stop there some day well i mean that's a question for  know that you know as demand develops evolves within their their system network you know they are they are responsible to or they have made changes in the past and they're  looking at potential changes so i think in the future should you know demand develop for max trance it service in this area i think that they would seriously look at it is the space available is what i'm saying are you  be able to address that i know that out in holland heights soar which is the abby court oxford and stratford way neighborhood association they did petition max for a new bus stop at stratford  this point either questions comments or emotion and we should be voting on one of the time right yes we're doing  here my few is that this can be a great addition of neighborhood i've heard the concerns about the geotechnical and some of the others and i've got to rely on the engineers and have a lot of faith and brian and the others that ok this is going to work if i'm envisioning what those developments going to be that you know the views from the park and so forth could be even more positive than a standard single family neighborhood type development so i just think it's going to be a great addition to this part of the city and so with that i'll make a motion that we approve the site plan we prove the resolution for the site plan with the addition of that the units not exceed the twenty five percent rentals at any point  next we go home we still have to continue our meeting the reason owning aspect of this will be going to city council i believe greg for there is there next regular meeting next week wednesday yes october third and that will be going to city council for a first reading of an ordinance amendment and so they're there if city council everything goes as planned with city council they would be looking at a second reading and actually potentially adopting the rezoning then the third wednesday in october which within the elite the seventeenth and then doesn't it thirty more days after that for hearing at this time if they have the second reading also so thanks mark you know i just want to let everyone know out there that we truly appreciate and take into consideration all your comments and everything so we thank you for coming tonight this is a hot topic it's been a hot topic for years so i'll just thank you for coming tonight and being involved in this discussion now continuing on any new business no none communication than petitions getting a public hearings there are none oh you need one yes  actually we have a request from central avenue christian reform church for the planning commission to hold a special meeting on october fifteenth to hear a site plan review request of theirs and i'll give you the background to that if you've been past central avenue c r c church right now they are doing some work out there working in their parking lot and doing some drainage approve ment's and so forth actually our building inspector of construction plans that he was reviewing literally yesterday and said wow i think that this needs site plan review the property is own c three district which means it has to go to the planning commission because virtual a you know you could have a one square foot discussed that they they do have the legal option of moving forward with an at risk building permit to put in their foundation the building inspector does the prove those at risk you know and they elected they're not going to move forward with that so we did receive application from them this morning they are under the gun weather is going to go south you know within the next month they don't meet the notice in requirement so typically they would they would have to wait till their october twenty second meeting but they are at they have requested that you consider holding a special meeting on the fifteenth  i thought it first there i don't know what they're doing there at first i thought they were just redoing the the blacktop and i see all this heavy equipment coming in you know the construction signs going up mats like what in the world is going on here and then i was going to ask you about that today because it's like what's going on yeah they they intend to put it's about a twelve hundred square foot addition on the north side of their building so they would be  into that existing parking lot area and then they want to put a covered drop off area standing north to pry within ten feet or so  motion that we schedule the that we deny the special planning request and go ahead and schedule it for the twenty second  been going through this process and it's a great addition to the neighborhood out there and it's it's really enjoyable to work with a very responsive developer there some certain challenges out there that we're all concerned about  living in southern california and watching them tear hell sides as steep or steeper you know it's a simple process and it can work very easily and well since most of the homes in southern california don marvin loud and clear with you know the whole his whole line in probing questions stormwater drainage off the side i just i really think that that's that's another important conversation it's a policy you know discussion that has to come up and wither we want to continue with the current regulatory requirements that we have or do we want to do things differently kind of in light of this whole project clarity thing and i mean are there better ways of doing it i don't know you know i don't know but i you know how much more land would be affected by these changes that's available to us in holland or just any other project that would happen i guess that's my question well look i think this is rather unique and my biggest concern i think that project i thought was a good project i think it's boring but i think it's but as long as and i don't really care if they slide down the hill you know makes no difference maybe they tend to do that a lot in california but what happens what happens when they do or the stormwater is not correct or if we're all going on best guesses here and what and who takes care of it and what's the course of direction i'm going to assume that there's certain watchdog groups out there that are be keeping an eye on this thing and then yeah thirty doesn't make me happy but that's ok you know you're not down there you're not you don't know that you know i walk there all the time  that with proper clarity and with every we are in the watershed and that really that we ought to start having that conversation about what's going into the storm sewer and you know god knows i'm not a tree hugging environmentalists i h specially with the clear lake project right so we really need to it's probably something that we should put on one of our agendas to have a discussion as a policy meaning again clear like agenda money being spent to clean up like mack we should be very respectful of what's going into it well that's a really good point because you know we don't only have the underground storm drainage systems i have an open storm drain system that belongs to the city of holland in my update on the city's stormwater inventory and because this kind of up that alley too is part of the clear like match up project  because this is what it is that the planning commission has to hand and well it's a big question i mean it's a big question because it's you know every time you review a project those kinds of questions will come up council alternately has to adopt accept project clarity as a program they want to work with what are all the bells and whistles that go along with that what are the best practices that suggests you need the bryans you need the county drain you know people go oh god get this that we actually use gays and but maybe a little education and we have somebody from project clarity that we could have come in and just explain what they're doing and what their concerns are and things of that ilk so that staff i already did nine all right i've got one and that's sort of an after the fact communication jerry asked me when we walked in about a meeting that was held last thursday and some of you received notices i'm guessing maybe not everybody did this is a meeting over on vander altie actually at the fire station over a column park fire station it was edgewater resources is a consultant the city is using for a number of projects one of those is to evaluate the crossing at extreme crossings and circulation back and forth from the neighborhood to college park and even across college park drive as it comes around the bend and so it's trying to  trying to evaluate concerns that the neighbors really raised and come up with some options for what kind of improvements might be made edgewater was great in their interaction with the group there was a lot of discussion a lot of but who asked really good questions and was very insightful about sort of the nuances of pedestrian movements and traffic movements and all of that but we heard that from a lot of people at the meeting a lot of concern and i think a lot of comfort that edgewater a has a lot of good information to work with and be that that they shared some ideas and possibilities that give a sense that there could be some good solutions coming so are you suggesting that maybe we need a new ruth represent thinking retirement an intern is there some hope and expectation of a project going forward there soon while they are under contract to put together a plan i don't know the time schedule off hand but they are you know working quickly to deliver something ultimately it will be what is that final project and what is the cost of implementation and how was it received by city council they approved the contract with edgewater to pursue this  supportive of trying to get to the answer to this yes mark i do have one item i see that talking about it new student representatives we do have our  so she were welcomed i mean her and i know today we were planning commission means veronica we typically at four o'clock we have a study session and we sit over there and it's much more it's much more informal and laid back tonight we kind of they did things a little differently but at our next meeting two weeks from now we will soon be sitting over there and maybe we can kind of do better introductions and so yeah  weeks thank