fact about both motive and pretext and you bring up a good point judge ginsburg because you're interested in what i'm saying and you didn't hear me properly you asked me to repeat mr may or a guy during his job interview for the position at issue in this case was not and was not once asked to repeat what he said or to clarify he is a gentleman who originated from nicaragua he has a very heavy accent and as he  attested to when he doesn't know people very well they're always asking him to repeat himself and to explain what he said but here in this case the three headless asked him no follow up questions and never once is your argument anything more than that the reasons given were perfect if someone else was ok there is evidence of outright bias the fact that the two of the panelists have been  of everything he said about his qualifications for instance was a pretext the height of discrimination pretext in an on selection case there are other ways one of which is to show that the reasons are unworthy of credence and we've done that because the reasons they give for each selectee the reasons that mr beaver the selection official give reason that that's a way to show pretax is the same reason it's just pretext that they didn't listen to him during his interview because they weren't really interested in his qualifications so he hasn't degree in network he has an associates degree which is unusual for people in this line of work the people who are selected don't have degrees its on his resume he said it during his interview which one of the panelists wrote down but mr beaver says he had no degree false reasons about network and about project management which other panelist said were not the criteria two is that they completely mistake his qualifications mr bieber even say he didn't have a track experience which is clear on his resume that out as a weakness at all instead what he does is he after the fact after he selects coulter and looks at his qualifications after that he says well these are the politicians we were looking for all along even though the vacancy announcement experience with cisco low voltage and fiber optics i understand now that you're saying well actually that was never important that's just reverse engineered to make it seem like it should have more but actually that seems like there's an indication of the record of that was deemed to be important really interest prioritized mr beaver says that mr me argot doesn't have them even though there is evidence that he does have them he then says although the most important that one of the other unions that is important is resume that he is building on a mission systems work the only way to do building on a nation system is within is network so he doesn't use the correct phrase bass neck but again that's being really picky with building right and bass net is all the buildings but if if john coulter has that snare then it can't be true that you can only do bastin if you work in the shop where many experience when the bass note went down mystery oregon assisted the n c s shop in bringing it up to speed now mr colter was also outside of e m c yes so if you have to be  african that he would ignore these things and i think that's where the evidence i him calling him caviar instead of having r and mocking him laughing at him when he walks in the room interrupting him when he speaks not you're right it is not  then the question is have they ever made fun of you two directly and he said well they and then they've got to refer to those three men he says they call me straight out to my face caviar but i'm not a very sensitive man and the aspect somebody coming in my face and doing something i prefer them to mean my face than in my back so he's clearly saying that those that those three have said to him face that that is completely marking who he is now is evidence that they don't take his candidacy seriously and that they weren't listening during his interview he said that they laughed at him  smirk when he talks they look at him and they don't take him seriously you know he's got an education above and beyond what most people in this field have gotten because he knows he has his heavy accent he has his of course johnnie walker of behalf of the architect of the capitol your honor so much of what my colleague says is simply not supported by the record in this case and when you get past characterizations and you look at records you see a clear and consistent record th supports summary judgment in this case you see a record that supports mr beaver's justification that the reason that he selected mr williams and mr quarter was about qualifications his qualifications start in the vacancy announcement these are not post hoc rationalisations  they can see you know what specifies skills and experience in areas like d t c programming graphics generation fiber optic cables either net cables and network equipment network routers and switches which we know university in two thousand and three which is over a decade prior to the selection so he has some networking experience but that that was key to the decision here is that john colter had experience with these specific network the same office as the suit he worked in there if there was a so mr mayor works in what's called the jurisdictions specific office there are different buildings as part of the architect of the capital's campus the capitol is one of them where he works there's also a central office the overarching umbrella office of which is project project management it's called mr culture was in that central office that the specifics of office that he was applying to he was  picture of and contextual picture of mr beatrice testimony mr leader was being asked specifically whether or not mr mayor had any experience working on the level of the building automation system infrastructure that mr with the central office where he worked which maintained that higher level infrastructure and he also testified just a few a few pages later in his deposition that mr holder by virtue of his engineering position in p p m had done some work on the bass net aspects at the capitol visitor center specifically the network equipment the internet cables and the fiber optic cables and you also see that listed in mr coulter's resume so i mean the operative that's not supported by the specifics that follow just because you worked with mr beaver subordinate in an unspecified capacity at an unspecified level does not mean that mr bieber would have knowledge that he has meaningful experience on the bassinette certainly not the type of experience that would overcome mr coulter's have i haven't johnson's johnson's testimony than my own as quote the most knowledgeable person in controls and on the bast network i've met in my ten years working for the architect of the c i don't know which way that cuts because then i think we're talking about whether this should go to a jury or whether it's obvious that it shouldn't and i think disputed facts go to a jury rather disputed words and semantics do not and if you get past the semantics and you look at the specifics of this case there's no dispute about what the building automation systems infrastructure at the architect of the capitol looks like we know that there are a number of components sensors and air conditioning units and such at the building specific love and that we know that on the greater camp technologies in his resume and then those from his interview indicate that he disclosed no experience with those respects specific technologies that make up what mr bieber referred to as the bassinette in fact each of the three interview panelists specifically noted th he professed weakness in the area of by the optic cable that's one of the key technologies of the bassinette so there's no dispute as to what it is that mr new york has experience with the technologies that make up the part of the building on nation systems certain respect to a specific question and he said as i recall he said in answer to that question that he didn't realize what position he was applying for he thought he was applying for an engineering position in p p m mr mr maritz resume does no p p m it's not it well it's not a reason as i say right now i don't know that a jury could find it to be knowingly false i understand the resume says one thing both to the interview panelists both independently testified that mr mayor indicated some confusion about precisely what position he was a point where but this is it's a tangential issue that does not go to the architect of the capitol's reasons for the selections of mr williams and mr colter there's nobody cation that they didn't fully consider mr mayor as hannity and his skills and not have enough experience with those i guess what confuses me a little bit is if those are what make up bass now if that's a little part of what makes up experience with bass and he did have experience with bass and which as you say there's maybe some confusion bassinette means experience with those that's it seemed to be the way the people were generally describing it is that those are constituent components of basnet and so if he did have experience with bass and he says he did as he says he did the use that term and i would i would say that that's a fallacy of composition just because you have an experience with a part of something does not mean you have experience with the holes at the record is is uncontroverted and very clear that the know well i have an engineering degree and degree and i'm not a computer person but i know that ether net is how you been doing networking in computers for the last twenty years so he has a degree and network he knows about each of them so for mr bieber to see that he has no experience in eastern when the man has those three areas and he was did no work experience in any of those three areas while he may have a degree in network your honor i think that that you know this court has held that that in close cases a reasonable jury will defer to the expertise of the selecting official and here i don't think it's a closed case you last time so i'll be quick and just refer to the record in response to some of the questions that the panel asked mr beaver said in his deposition testimony that the alleged confusion that was during your hacking out when he asked question number seventeen of the interview which is why you want to join the m c s but if you look at the notes that were taken contemporaneously both of the other camelias on three eighty five and three of the seven of the joint appendix wrote down that when he when mr me or go was asked why do you want to join even so yes he said something to the effect of more of a challenge and to use his education more so those are contemporaneous notes taken at the time of the interview by the other two panelists why would why would mr beaver make that up also watson in the palace testified that network was an add on skill and that project management was not something that the word seeking and mr wallace also said that project management wasn't something they were seeking to get that was the primary reason given for the non selection i also point you to the fact that was you me or a guy not only listed his degree on his resume but included his transcripts and it will cause me to your understand more about the courses than i do but i see here that he took courses in routers and switches and network infrastructure design in an advanced configuration of routers and switches that to me again bolsters your point that he did have the knowledge i don't think actually that mr beaver even look at the application because he