many items we get through before six thirty they will transition into that public hearing war go through some the project details open it up for question and answer if there's that interest as well so that's what tonight's late looks like questions and concerns from the public agenda you can find the engine in the back and we also would appreciate if everybody would remember to sign in in the back seat two for leaving the scene if you haven't done so already thanks for doing that you are just council on an item that's not on of cation for compliance for town roads bridge standards and network inventory and also the v trans annual financial plan for how to use any questions or concerns in regards to the concert agenda fund raising pool committee last week they have met and started their work about developing a fund raising plan setting some fund raising targets and were looking for more information from us which was really helpful and useful they're meeting again on wednesday evening here and people are interested so at your next meeting on the twenty first we will be bringing to you the follow up information that you requested when i was last on your agenda which was some cost analysis on those necessary items from the pool on the add on items that information's also been shared with the fund raising committee a timeline to get to an august bond vote and some more information about other community services programming so that will be coming to on the twenty first we're really going to try because the full committee is meeting this week we're going to get their feedback after their meeting and send you that memo either the end of this week of the very beginning of next week so you'll have it week out from the twenty first  meeting we've been talking about the master plan process as we're in the have a staffing they can see with our plane zoning manager we are finalizing an agreement with c c r p c for them to come and help facilitate that project through the adoption of a new master plan hopefully in the winter early spring next year they've agreed to it we have got we have authorization from the state to use the municipal planning grant we secured last year to fund that work so it's not only money but it's  facilitation help that will ensure that that project continues on even during the stuff and you can see also want to let you know that we have about five months ago we stood up a safety committee with representatives from all of our unions and management to have the people doing their work really inform us about areas where they felt we can make safety improvements training opportunities whitman xandra it's been functioning really well kudos to john cho who's the chair of the committee and julie who stops that  since that's been stood up we've had a strong training for all of our staff which is training that's run through the cities and towns back injury prevention for the public works team in the fire department and prevention to try and ensure that they're healthy tax credits so that project is moving along fairly quickly they have to start construction in late summer it will require the closure of one lane of east allen street during construction because they're built with the form of their building right up to the sidewalk there coming and we'll provide that that traffic plan once it's finalized with the engineers but then this weekend was really fun so to have days day was a huge success we filled up an entire dumpster with our friends and neighbors cleaning up the city races it's the most he's experienced since he's been here which is awesome and thank you to everyone who came out and participated in that making windows from sees perspective also as a huge success want to thank the organizers for putting together such a well run event and of course our public safety crews who were on duty most of the weekend supporting that event just wore on events may nineteenth we have three other  hosted the housing commission convening what they called it on april thirtieth at the o c c have representatives from i think all but two chinning county communities talking about what they're doing to promote the housing development really interesting conversations and coming out of that c c r p c agreed to host a series of more targeted conversations about specific tools that have been used across the region so what about housing trust on conversation of the pool was was a big conversation the concern of the commission is that we don't scale back to the extent that it really doesn't satisfy the needs of the community so  find a suitable of vendors pretty competitive and if it doesn't pan out there's going to be possible conversation about you know how do we relocate the library the library presented  have a better understand what the community wants in terms of services so there may be some conversation with united way which is pretty skilled at doing needs assessments in communities so that pretty much capture on you know affordable housing it was a great experience to really hear from all these different towns and cities what they're doing and it was a royal opportunity to be able to connect with some of the you  know towns and cities that are doing some pretty interesting things to support and grow affordable housing the will of the group was we'd love to reconvene and maybe we'll do a deep dive about certain topics  one of the ones that rose up to the top was housing trust that are now becoming more and more prevalent and how they're really effective in cd projects for low income portable housing so we'll stay tuned for gathering again to learn from our other towns and cities out there doing some good work around portable housing thank you so let's see it was on april twenty third myself jesse and seth sat down and met with david share from the attorney general's office to discuss the when you see fair impartial policing policy and we did convey what we'd all express coming out of here from counsel that we would like to see there is of the policy that they believe were not in compliance with act fifty four outlined in a memo so i believe our understanding from them is that we'll have that shortly so i guess we'll just have to wait and see for the written memo from them on kind of where is the policy they're taking issues with and we'll have some time to digest that and deliberate on here and go from there there's a public safety commission meeting tomorrow night here at six thirty the public safety commission is going to be joined by lawrence sampson who is on our planning commission to discuss municipal master plan so that would be a great opportunity if folks from the public want to come out and kind of be a part of the work that the public safety commission is going to be providing input on the master planning process definitely encourage folks to join us and then the night jesse mentioned public safety heroes day  which in addition to there being a bouncy house which i feel like it's a gigantic garage will also be our brand new shiny stuff in a fire engine so if nobody has had a chance to see it yet it was down  just to reinforce and just he said cannot be more proud of all the work that staff did this weekend to accommodate a massive festival takes over the entire city i mean i think our report indicates we really had no incidents of any sort of off just a really positive function what it was like to work with our staff and the job that you all did so great kudos thank you think for supporting those events in allowing them to happen our community and doing such a good job with them so says also did a resolution ray thanks for your work around that as well and in honor of arbor day in great great group did a lot of awesome work planning commission and the housing commission met since we last met so it's been busy housing commission i think we're going to see some priorities party statements from them very soon they've kind of mapped out very similar to what the planning commission did when they were starting their work hey this is reframing you've gotten the high level back here f housing of what their goals are but they've been putting some really thoughtful work together around what their additional tools look like with a little greater specificity about what specific outcomes of the striving towards while also continuing all those conversations about what it is they're targeting and how those numbers are going to be reached planning commission really rebuilding think suggested for all her support there in terms of new membership but just an incredibly high capacity high powered group a lot of discussion about agreement of timelines and you're also seeing now liaison's from the plane commission go out to other commissions as those as each of the other commission areas feeds into the master plan there's going to be a planning commission member really assigned to follow that work in keep interactive updates going back to plan a commission about what's happening so it's not kind of a cram at the end and obviously  it now to see if there's anything confining about it from a legal perspective but expect to have it out to all of you in the next couple meetings for consideration and it will be late summer before we hear sort of final stance on  governance and what that's going to look like for potentially moving that conversation  negotiating with all parties about how best to move forward purdy ordinance if there is there's been no formal complaint made yet but if there is we'll need a hearing within seven days so there is a possibility that we will need to do that between now and your know personally and who brings a lot of commitment to volunteerism moving from burlington to music you're very glad to get her and thankfully her track record of community participation has continued as she's crossed the river so i'll let you sort of speak to your interests in joining the commission and i think it may have some questions about background but for more i said a really solid addition to the group and some really awesome perspective to bring to the table sure hi everybody yeah so my partner and i moved here in october and we we were really excited to join the community and we have been volunteering in the library and we're just so amazed at all of the work that the librarians my interests and community services commission and since then i am starting to get involved gardens and places like that as well and i'm very excited about the main street project and the public are initiative  always just been part of my d n a i grew up in a small town in vermont and it was just what you did you had to be part of the library you you you know you just supported your community i think for me specifically i i i have i do things professionally and i can't always do all of my interests in my professional career and  kids and working with kids and working with kids in the community is a really important part of something that i can't do professionally anywhere and so that's a big part of it things that i've done in the past  mentoring and working in maker spaces stuff like that comes from my interests in both working with kids being an artist doing stuff like that can report the financial outcomes and it also gives us an opportunity to be able to project the last quarter to give the state of bonding and yourself the council an opportunity to see what lies ahead and as you can see and i'll try to make my report as brief as possible of the know you have a public hearing go through these very quickly because i sent you a memo everything seems to be in order financially for the city all of various operating funds and various of budgets are looking pretty good the general fun as you can see from my report looks good for the first nine months of the fiscal year and with the outcome of fiscal year we are even though it looks like we have one hundred forty seven thousand dollar deficit there was an item there are items in there that you have pre approved spending on some of the f y seventeen surplus to the tune of about two hundred thirty thousand dollars you pre approve that and that's included in the operating cost that you see within the general fund budget so when you with food when you full those back in it looks like we'll end up the year with a proposed eighty three thousand dollars surplus now it's not as great as it has been over the last couple of years but it is good it's a positive fee which are in our financing means the city has run their general fund budget very efficiently and very cautiously and the managers of done a good good job of making sure that they check and track all their expenditures revenues look good saw as far as the general fund budget is concerned it looks like we'll end up the year with that kind of a surplus we'll give you a better perspective on that once the audit is done this summer but i'm very pleased to announce that we will have that kind of a proposed surplus of some eighty thousand dollars and a quick questions on that will run through these quickly because i know you've got two other things to do ok the rest of the funds the basically the three enterprise fund which is they have water fun the waste water fun and the parking garage fund which consists of a combination of two funds all look fairly well the water fine is in a very healthy mood looks like it will do pretty well at the end of the fiscal year and even though we're how it's twenty eight thousand dollars deficit we have projected a fifty thousand dollars deficit when the budget was proposed and we use the that money we will get that money from the water fund reserves in this case only use twenty thousand dollars of that of our proposal the rather than the fifty and that still leaves us something to put back into that reserve fund and that water fun is a healthy fun and we can very it's not on there very quickly when we talk about the capital reserve reserves the waste water fund which is the sort of sanitation funds basically a look pretty good even though again there was a there's a perspective of having a very large deficit but that was built into the budget we understood that when the budget was presented that you approve that way back when and we have proposed that we would probably end up with about a using one hundred to one hundred twenty four thousand on a reserve in order to keep that fund floating in this particular case of it's like use probably close to four hundred sixty but again the waste water fund the reserves in the wastewater funding is substantial and saw that that's ok we'll use some of the reserves but we had planned on doing that anyway so it's not going to causes a great deal of grief there are some expenditures in there were necessary and they were built in the budget you approved they were done and it looks like that but it's going to come out ok as far as the it's a far far as it's progress is concerned the parking garage one is basically a combination of two fines it's the on street parking and the parking garage and we keep them separate simply because of the fact that there are companies that govern the parking will look better than one hundred thousand dollars projected surplus of the end of the year people are using the parking they're paying their parking etc etc so that's going exterior really well and we do that particularly through one of the local b with credit cards and people are used to it now so they go to the kiosk and away we go the parking garage is pretty much governed by pretty much governed by some covenants because of the fact that it's under bond and in that particular fund looks like we'll break even at the end of the year why is because you can't use that surplus money for nothing but the parking garage and any access my mc comes out of that if we had a surplus it would have to go into the tiffin that's governed by policy so we don't have any real major control over that but that's fine looks like whatever was budgeted will be spent the revenues will be collected and that fund will end up with a zero balance again and that that that that minimal two hundred thousand dollars reserve will keep in place for other things that we can use for its operation the other funds that i report to you are basically what we call special revenue fund their community justice program the rental registry program tiff the community or bryan community center and economic development programs the through the justice of the community justice center is basically a breakeven because not because they're special revenue finds we need to use no taxpayer money for those particular fund they're all self supporting and so whatever they are budgeted for whatever grants are applied for is what they use the community justice program will end up with again a balanced budget nothing the same revenues versus expenditures but in this particular case this last year the city paid back twenty thousand dollars of a previous grant that came out of their expenditures and in simply did not cause any deficit if i actually allowed the program for breakeven so that was a an excellent feature of the gift on the other hand as i said the minimal is an interesting one because the tip relies on both the property taxes that come out of the fifth district  as pilots and things of that nature unfortunately as i said in my middle to you in the as far as the to fist concern this year we had a couple of pitfalls number one is we we we received last revenues from property taxes then we had expected something to the tune of two hundred eleven thousand and we also had a pitfall as far as our own leases are concerned they didn't get paid and that was about three hundred forty dollars or so if you put the two together you got better than half a million dollars that we did not receive although we will expand what we have said to in the budget that you folks approved that's going to lead us to rather large deficit we had anticipated a deficit of one hundred ten thousand when we started the year in a budget process we'll end up with a five hundred sixty thousand dollars projected deficit with these two convience that i've just mentioned being fulfill the you know the fortunate thing for us there is the fact is that the to ft does also have its own reserve operating fund as well as its capital fund and that five hundred sixty thousand dollars can come out of the t reserve the only the only thing that we need to be cautious of that particular fun is that as you can see from my report we started the year with seven hundred eighty three thousand in that reserve fund for the gift if we expend five hundred a very almost a break even a bunch of time looks like we'll end up with about fifteen or sixteen thousand dollar deficit at the end of this fiscal year with projections that's pretty good that's a pretty good balanced budget  o'brien community center of course is something i'm sure that's been on your mind for all the time because you you need to wrestle with an enemy and you've heard many many stories about particularly from us and finance at the beginning of the year we had budgeted that we would probably end up with a projected sixty thousand sixty seven thousand dollar deficit it looks like based on the fact is we really haven't got the rental from the tenants that we wanted to pay it looks like we may end up with something around the vicinity of one hundred ten dollars and i know that is on your agenda talk about over the course of next several months on what to do with that we've heard stories about what's going to happen here we don't know but i'm sure that the city manager and will keep you abreast of what's going on with o'brien and you can wrestle with that one of the things that just remember that the o'brien community center will be folded into the general fund next year because the auditor say we can't keep it as an enterprise fund it's not self supporting the community in economic development is the problem in the first time we've we've reported this to you that that fund has three hundred thousand dollars in revenue i the end of the year but i'm sure that we can we can sustain that as time goes on all told you know as i always like to conclude when i do the oh i'm sorry let me back up again there are some other community services special revenue funds you know that the gardens this that they you know whatever they could know also also forty five they're all look look like they're really coming along well they're all within balance they're all taking care of themselves there's no such actual city money taxpayers money to help support those so there are self supporting and they're going very very well they're very well managed so off you know this really isn't you know there's a lot of those little funds that you know just pick up a lot of people who have reported to as i just tell you those special revenue funds for the community services programs for the community here are beneficial to the community you know they're all in dallas they're all looking really really good what i can say is that you know from a standpoint of the of the enterprise fund the general fund all the special revenue funds that i've mentioned things that their nature we've got a good handle on you know things are being managed very well they're very efficiently run they're very well managed and people are very cognizant of that the fact is that the monies they spend to keep the supporting programs going for the city are bay are going to the benefit of the city so your your your city manager and her ministration or managers or just on an excellent job and they give kudos to them is there any question on that this is kind of a general overview of the all of various funds that i've i've talked to you about any questions for interest for jim if there's anything that you'd like to see differently in our reporting in the future please let me know and we can we can do that but we're trying to give you a flavor of all you know financially because you know having been in finance a so long as i have i know it's very very critical that you understand where the dollars are coming from and where they go and where they should be at a certain point in time and that's why we use benchmarks and we use that twenty five fifty seventy five percent of the say at this time of the year you should be sort of after this with your expenditure if there are print down we take a very critical look at it and that's what's nice about this time of year when we can make our proof three month projections to give us an opportunity to balance out and do some reallocation within that last three month period that is very very helpful so you get a chance to look say this is what we project you will probably look like at the end of the fiscal year it even though there are not to look it looks for some time don't even want one pick on a bank don't for it because it would be more expensive than what you and you have the funds to do that the only thing is and we keep a very close watch on them because of the fact is that it is it's kind of like a savings account if you use it all up it's gone you got nothing left then you have to do something drastic and that's that's not a good way of manage the last thing is is citizen we're going to have to keep this to two to three minutes in addition to the reporters  funds that we have for all the various different operational activity and they could be like i said they could be a reserve fund for both companies and awful racial needs what i've tried to do in the first three years is the say if we've got money sitting there let's put it the use let's make money on the money we've got just sitting there let's get the most we can get out of it so over the course of the last three years we've been working towards you know what what can we conceivably invest and be very cautious about our investment and rather than leave it in a checking account that are in the you know point four point five percent that we can put it into another another investment instrument and we've done that we've managed to get to that point now talking to the various  department managers and city manager and what have you we've now reached that point we said ok we're going to take our first baby step and we did we figured that there was enough money sitting in reserves of the waterfront and the wastewater fun and some of the  money that we could invest about eight hundred seventy five thousand dollars we took out a one year cd we got a cd rate at two point zero nine percent basically it's a maturing cd so we will end up with a yield of about two point one three that's a lot better than point four and so we'll make some money there there's other monies that are still sitting there idle but we're looking at how can we invest them over three six nine twelve month period and to be very cautious because it is taxpayer money and we want to make sure that we don't blow it and it's not like investing in the stock market it's not our money it's somebody else's money so we're very cautious that's great we appreciate your work to get that  planning efforts and long term thinking about fund balance the fund balance that we still have remaining for x y seventeen as well as whatever we develop from this here we're going to be flagging that for you see see where those dollars sit we also want to be very  careful to articulate that when we're talking about the use of one time money for fine balance for for example the cloud migration thing we talked about recently that's in addition to the thirty days cash on hand you have and in addition to the act of the capital funds we've set aside so questions or concerns we've got both the engineering team here is wells and this is the staff who've worked really hard on this project for the entire time so very similar to the last i'm often they end up to move around as much as questions if you just pop your hands up while if there's something you've got a question about walt on the screen and let's talk about it before we move on so maybe just you know just open up by saying if you want to introduce the project team just for acknowledgement there's a lot of people doing a lot of work on th go vote in very similar system short of ballots and used to sing on a typical town meeting day so what do you actually voting on what you're going to have on it is a yes or no question do you authorize a c yvonne twenty three million dollars for mainstream validation and that's really as simple as it is there's not of a number of other items on there or another or a number of other authorizing factors it's it's that one question that will be there so if you were to vote where we've assembled the basics of the funding package world where the state federal subsidies in resources that are available to us to get to all the final numbers on those those and in these take things to a point and they stop and they say we need to see that there's public support in your community for this and that's what this book's about it's about getting that authorization to be able to go for the full funding mechanism organization so we can't take it any further without that if a yes vote were to come like for example for the tax rate what we would need to do for want of water waste water fees and what impact we think a one percent sales tax owes to those other revenue sources we're talking about using to help pay for the product or we'd have to gauge based on what we've learn from those other funding it is what the impact of those numbers look like and then council would have a final say based on this vote if the vote for yes to make total pull the final trigger on the project ok so that's an important factor now the other questions come because we get past the vote right we're going to keep communicating with the public about this is where we're at this is how things should read out and this is what the numbers are looking like so it does not mean that there won't be another opportunity for input it doesn't mean that this is the one opportunity to vote something a little tricky about that is where we are also building up funding packages that are dependent on subsequent things so for example we're going to talk about in a minute or two the general fund potential impact of the general tax rate break we don't just implement that automatically you actually have to vote in approved next year's budget and you do that you'll be voting to authorize us to adjust the tax rate as we're going to propose to do beverages meals and rumors other public are also have to vote to authorize that as well so that's kind of the voting with just sticks in terms of what happens if the vote were no you know it's not going to stop us from having to spend money time and energy on main street will just look at it differently you know we'll talk about why we decided to do the project in this manner in the next few minutes but a no vote would baseless in this back and draw more of saying ok this is what the community consist council you know i think what we've tried to say is right now with our funding methodologies the way we're staffing them up from those proposals as we've looked at between a four to six percent increase in taxes you know from a historical perspective i think you can get a philosophical feel of exactly how those bodies felt about increasing taxes by looking at the fact that we haven't gone over two percent in several years i think it's a pretty constant government but you are correct th theoretically turning that over to the council if there is a yes folks that that's true you know i think you would be a far pressed i'm not going to speak for everybody who's sitting up here but if the whole project at the tax base you're talking about about sixteen percent sixteen sit increase that's never been something that anybody said any kind of appetite for either that's sitting up here for my conversations correctly for all from wrong about that but it's a big part of the reason why this project came for the timeline that it did is because of the funding opportunities we have help subsidize it and keep it cheap to me to make that simple if those were suddenly not there if they were suddenly not available to us i would think that that would be a very large strategic conversation discussion in especially if we've said to the voters through this process we think four to six yes it could be more could be less we want to be clear about that because if it comes several technical disagree since we couldn't come back for a second there including restrictions on the funding mechanisms once those federal funds are obligated for example or the state commitments are done the train sort of starts leaving not sort of starts  yes vote and the funding package that actually comes before me just speaking personally was really different than that four to six percent i wouldn't view moving forward with that project as an alignment with the intent of the voters who showed up in the polls and gave food so i think from my perspective if the package that were to come back is incredibly different than what we're actually putting out a lot of the community to vote on i wouldn't feel comfortable going forward no questions on funding mechanics for the more common so going back to this idea of what the goals of the project were and why we prioritize it you know the first thing is this isn't a new conversation to try to say that really consistently this is something that when you say he's been a topic for well over a decade is a need for reinvestment main street and main street being a key place that we think from a vibrancy and development perspective is going to be a focus so during most recently the last seven years specifically we did the gateways planning project that we did the base code evolution and development of that planning work and then we also did the master transportation planning process each of those planning processes create a very similar vision for what main street should look like when people talk about walkability people talked about making it more pedestrian friendly people talked about making multi modal for bike and bus as well a more friendly for those tapes there and then just quite frankly we just have infrastructure there this between one hundred thirty and one hundred forty years old so we also from a technical perspective  saying hey the growth that's happening on main street you know in the in the gateway process in the information good up these we said we want this to be a denser area of development we want to keep our neighborhoods our neighborhoods downtown and downtown and then we want to spread the success of the downtown into these gateway corridors east st miles of the ave main street the infrastructure that's there does not support that growth does not support that work that's currently starting there that you're seeing take root form a scone was successful right you can start to see some of the investment taking place on main street did what we asked it to do and this is a way to coming back and supporting that from an infrastructure him play so modernization mainstreet you know getting back to those key principles that people in voiced over and over again through all those play and processes of this is not some project that's pulled out of the hat this is been a long running conversation and you know that a big piece of that has been through the development of we have a lot of conversations in here about how we balance the tax growth rate how we balance our groundless growth and it can't every time there needs to stuff's not going to cost less next human does this year it's not the way it works it's going to cost you two to three percent more to buy a not so that example right now but a possible serial that then it's going to this year just this everything we buy in the city's going to cost us two to three percent more next year to pay for than it did we got to get that money from somewhere we do that by turning back to taxpayers each and every year with residential homes and saying we have to increase your taxes percentage or we try to grow and get a little bit more balance in our in our in our tax base you know in the best  example probably in the state is when you skis the opportunity we took in the risk we took with the downtown redevelopment where we turned twenty three million dollars worth of property in one hundred ten million dollars worth of property off of smart growth investment in infrastructure and that's that's worked it's worked really well and worked as intended and it's going to it's actually a large part of again why we can do this project is that growth so that's that's a lot of the thinking behind what push this project for now maybe i'll look back to you guys and if you want to talk a little bit through sort of where we're going to this what it is and what it looks like sure so john if you're on the public wo proposed work we're looking at is streetscape utility infrastructure there are utilities and some traffic signal variance so here's kind of a quick profile plan view of what projected off to the right strong water was a strong water and green infrastructure was a really important component to integrate into the plans so you can make out here some of the infiltration strong water filtration rather than putting it all into catch basins trying to get some of that back into the clear interior cost estimate that came out of the process speech he did so there's a lot of numbers on here but this is where we come up with twenty three million dollars just in summary it's about eight billion dollars in municipal utilities so water wa or city to slow down and create more replace and about six point five million to underground the overhead utilities that will improve the static of the street and able that full build out of main street over time you don't see on the side it's pretty probably pretty hard to read from the audience but broken down by phase of the project as well in this presentation is on our website if you want to go and take detail planning right it's sort of when there's a problem in the legislature of communities where we do we create commissions or we create study groups or we commission reports to be developed or we initiate planning processes that's what we do that's like the government answer for everything when there's a problem or an opportunity either one what's really cool is when we get to take those planning processes and actually turn them into it and action right and that's a lot about what this project is about history and seize upon an opportunity where we did a process here years ago to come up with mr t g mission statement back here and we create a word cloud based off the responses we ask people tell us your top three reasons why you either things came back to us and we came up with the following slide as the heating vision statement and we way investments and we prioritize budgets now we use this as our guide to say are we hitting one of these benchmarks with whatever we're spending the money on  it the question was did check all these boxes and we felt like it did break and economic vitality does it create new opportunity for business development it absolutely does number two musical infrastructure it's one of our biggest stretches  there and lowers the cost of the well and then say healthy connected people does it create an opportunity for people to build community around spaces to walk more and there's no child that gets to school the touching main street for example  financing district is be true twenty twenty four that is on pace to be paid back and in twenty twenty four we are talking about for committing a percentage of those funds to help pay for this project  half million in the hundred ten million that it's worth now so that difference that money is actually going to parrot that when that that's expired it actually rules back in your general fund which is a great thing it's a great egg for the from the hip and that money is available it's also disingenuous we've consistently felt to just hand it back to the tax rate and just do across the board definition of the tax rate doesn't mean that that can't be done in some interim but to not know invest some of that money that has been built from that and back in the infrastructure to us has consistently not sounded like a good policy and we wanted to be ahead of this conversation and talk about making sure we have a plan as twenty twenty four arrives not be scary at the end so the fix things we can measure is what's the inflation of cost of goods and cost of construction over the course of the years the answers around two to three percent three to four percent from a from a infrastructure failure standpoint it's a much more complex question because instructions and tell us when it's going to fail just does so i don't know if you guys had been thinking along those lines and with confidence  to talk numbers but i'll just also say from an opportunity cost him point we already have one housing development that meets the definition of providing affordable housing in the community that was scaled back because there was to signify in additional costs of the built in the project budget because there is infrastructure surprises since they started to this is the biggest commercial use and housing development that's located where o'brien's pub used to be that project actually have the accurate and we demonstrate that increased expense over time the other thing that we have talked about as a project team when we talked about potentially scaling the project or phasing the project is that an advantage of doing it all at once is that you're excavating once you're paving once you're disturbing the ground once if we start responding on a piecemeal emergency basis those costs are going to be born again and again and again i want to be in st i'm not sure if there's an industry standard of the percentage that adds to a project but it certainly would be more in aggregate would be more than the present day value of twenty three million dollars to do it comprehensively and then finally the man has mentioned this earlier but you know per one of the significant purposes of coming now is we believe that there is the significant subsidy to the project from the state and federal government that may or may not be available in the future so i think it's hard to to think about that  uncertainty of that subsidy coming back to the city if we were needing to do this on an incremental basis sure because when you do it it's not right along the lines of what you're saying but i did hear something really interesting the other day that i thought was pretty comparison but a one mile stretch of dorset street on it was in one thousand nine hundred ninety five and they did the same work of you know underground in the lines a lot of similar street redesign and that project cost between fifteen and sixteen million dollars somewhere in that range so for thirteen years later for a really similar project in size to potentially be doable for twenty three million dollars i just thought was that was pretty motivation interesting to me  lucy so certainly spread over for a fixed income family we understand any of that has an impact and they have this as a is a burden right and causing the folks to make adjustments their budget why again if you come to the two hour marathon sessions on budget sessions of the school each year one thing we talk about a lot of now when we put our budgets the get there is we know there are some large infrastructure needs coming we have chronically underfunded if the structure in the city would you see for decades this is not a problem that we're that we're unaware of and have become increasingly constrained on and one of the reasons why we've tried to keep these increases low it would be awesome for us to be able to drive more soft services and more program and we would love to do that we think it's effective it makes implicit great place to live but i think we've been very cognizant and two percent point nine nine percent point seven three percent one point two one percent two percent tax increases over the last five fiscal years of the city really doing our best our part to keep our tax rate increases as l this would come forward so i do appreciate it doesn't mean that each of those tax attacks that have you know impacts on households we do or we do appreciate that but i do want to point out that one of the reasons why we've tried to keep those are operational costs did with the ten is controlling what the development looks like we've pretty much talk deciding what that tax base was going to look like and those developments were part of those conversations so we very intricately built that to say if this does what it's supposed to do it'll pay for itself what's very different about main street is we're not buying any property we're only using the existing city proper that's there and then it's up to the people who are in the private pieces of the property to make decisions about what happens in those pieces of property when we want to form a base  year three years ago the idea was to increase opportunities for density at mainstreet that would allow folks to find opportunities to use some of those properties differently or tranquilly and allow for it so this density  part of the idea there is that increases groundless value growth so we have that then a five properties others are economic development officer in and they've done a lot of work on a define of what potential looks like and what properties you know we think are going to go up and then main street but that is very private focused so we have not built our models super contingent upon additional tax rate coming in one would say that that's a conservative way of doing it not hedging on those featuring believe you know in talking about scaling back the project in that area i do believe that putting the lines underground just as a function of appearance also that the above ground lines do have an impact for what some developers on doors to say if you're thinking about someone your house please let me know and that's that's that goes back to to some of that work we're doing with the housing commission is to talk about what we can do to retain affordability in the community and we've people all and that's a that's the conversation with this is that we're not we're not reopening in making that decision again we're trying to build off of a decision we made when we updated when the when we went with more of a scope we made that decision to move things closer to the street and try to use the street the city property there differently and to try to create an atmosphere that was that morgan feel quite frankly and more public by vibrancy feel  that decision got made three years ago so we're really working now to support that the best we can and move forward and part of that is very utilities was always in that kind of long term vision and then the other just kind of a general point that we're trying to make several times is it's it's more expensive more disruptive from a technical standpoint and yes the price tag to do just the water portion of it might be six and a half million dollars but you still have to convert it back up when you dig you dig the hole you've got to fill it back in and the question is are we going to if we did one piecemeal part of it would we just put what's there back on top of it and that would take what properties are selling for a person with their value that if you have a hold on for example that we assess that eighty thousand dollars that sells for one hundred thousand dollars and that was our average our common level or appra will be eight percent so that they say eighty percent of one hundred when they hit certain benchmarks you're required to do certain things are percent ninety two so it is as much as it feels like things are happening people are seeing increases actually from a pricing perspective that's not really mathematically accurate so it's there's advantages and we you know we have a decision point where the state makes us do it there's justifiable times for attitude where we could do it it's an expensive process it's it's not cheap to go back through and reassess everybody so  then if you go the next i just say in terms of how are we looking at paying for it folks haven't seen these numbers yet what we're talking about right now in general terms is that four to six percent in general funding greece right so that's the that you know we've fixed that but we want to say that that's right now we're modeling this got us at you know point made here was a good one that you know there's not probably a really strong appetite if we put something forms of this is where it isn't it comes that the public actually voted in favor of three years ago one percent on rooms meals and beverages so we're starting the conversation with business owners and getting feedback on that  something that they've heard before once we got the vote to authorize voters to authorize us to implement that last time we actually set it aside because we were in the process of setting up a parking and we said from the implementation standpoint that's a great point is we are going to go to whole we are really the only connected kmiec us that has a similar economic scale that does not have a one percent tax so one thing we have very direct and feedback on from the business owners is they really appreciate it if you can tie it to something and show them what the value is and something that they can also point to their customers for and to so we've appreciated that and another thinking has been maybe there is th opportunity future to tie it to specific projects for a specific activity like you said doesn't mean that if this doesn't go through we couldn't come back and look at other ways to do that right now though for those funds are expecting an event one hundred fifty thousand dollars of revenue that w back to the question about you know how much you might get back from development of the redevelopment a powerful tax that would be used why we don't assign days to it we do understand that from a return on investment standpoint both because of it's different than redoing the car street it's different in the economic impact is different the funding streams are different from the residential streets with this does due back to the doves question about what the cost of not doing it is is it means that we don't spend capital monies we might otherwise be spinning to grow into the main street they will be pigeonholed with these funds and offer us more flexibility to do those other streets with her general capital funding support yes  work so of i understand i understand your perspective and i you know i think we're trying very hard to do a project that is going to hopefully make enough three years of lack of investment that's part of the vision of what we're trying to accomplish with this and it's it it's a that skew no we understand that and there are here is to try to make the information is really available possible give you all a clear understanding tax increases up there is to try to show that leaf we've tried very hard in the past to be very fiscally responsible hasn't been a free will and tax and spending type of environment despite the fact that we are  what will become our largest infrastructure investment since the downtown redevelopment and one of the largest projects that the state sees so it's a it's a huge opportunity and one that again we're very respectful of everybody's concerns are best to try to mitigate those but we do put this this project for a very confidently that it sheaves that vision and has that return messmate for voters in terms of what the outcome of the community will look like so we'll open it up now and see if there's any comments questions concern from council and from the public perspective to this did just two and a half hours the the last go around so that wasn't very figure that is a little weird and it's different than a lot of other bond forwards and so i understand under uncomfortably about it resting with the council after rather than back to the voters likely with the time frame there is another votes are authorization for obligations so with any bond vote we take it is ultimately up to the council whether to move the project forward to i don't know i did not ask our legal question our legal counsel that specific question what i can tell you is that may not have passed muster with the state and federal funds so one of the reasons to move this forward now is to really understand from them what they are at what level they are willing to subsidize the project and if there was uncertainty in that in that wording they may not have seen that as a true commitment from the community that this is an important project going forward and therefore either not subsidized it or subsidized it at a lower  taxes and that's not enough it's not a range type of function so that's been my past experience with that so i think we saw as problematic a couple of bills and frankly we really struggled with what to put in these presentations because we've done modeling out there and then what comes back we want to be really thoughtful and careful about that messaging and leaving room for council to make some adjustments to the final let's say the difference between tapping future to revenue  at us at a certain click is a difference in the percentage takes you from four to five percent if you make that strategic decision to use less of the to forever now and instead have a general funding crease of five percent those are type of balance of conversations we could have to in terms of those how those numbers might fit together a there narrow the field in the scope of driver's experience and slow them down and that's actually a very intentional thing in this case the roadways will be getting more narrow that also tends to slow people down in the addition to that a lot of thought and conversation during the former base code discussions centered around the number of curb cuts main street has several properties that have multiple curb to create common space opportunities in the back so that's something we think is going to really start to unfold and lessen some of that turnout traffic that we're seeing because i would just add also it's often a first of all perception that this is just a drive through place on your way to someplace else is a major part of the aesthetic features and the idea behind this is absolutely the same thing on our street  that that's something that takes time to change and takes time to change people's perception that again they can just fly through i mean you see all the time people really exciting ten miles per hour the speed limit in still hocking at people that go faster  because they're trying to get through from some of those to somewhere else and that's where as a community have to also make a stand and say you know why are pestering safety in our experience living here is more important than that person getting to burlington two minutes more quickly environments in our community do i need understand we're part of a broader regional transportation network i do and we have to we have to plan that sandbox and we benefit from it but at the same token we need to prioritize that's coming to fruition as as intended we're seeing that investment up there do we think it will lower the barrier and increase some of those opportunities we do so does that make sense you know you becomes a tricky thing because those costs and escalate fairly quickly and if it's not predictable to us you know we would essentially actually create like a super fund to address those types of things because each project in that part of the issue is it's pretty patchwork up there in terms of any fixes that have been done maybe were done one way and one decade and then any fixes or additions that were done in another decade were done differently so every time we open up the earth it's a learning experience and we find out what's underneath there so it's number one it's not predictable and number two from of funding financing perspective that we just mechanically be a little bit challenging because we just have to set up a fun and then how about why that differently or how to apply that similar in a similar vein to each development would be would be a little challenging you know the one thing that we have talked about is in the future using for example we have we have a loan fund for housing we've talked to you in one of the housing commission goals is to talk about use of those funds we have a quarter million dollars that is sitting there that people take out different types of loans to home treatments of we've got conversations about whether you start to use some of that those funds towards lowering barriers for affordable housing development the future so those are the types of conversations we're going to have about maybe investing some funds to get targeted outcomes but to just pick up a half from a specific development is that can get that can be complicated morally and ethically our housing finance agency and she used her grad student says as the labor on it so live together housing needs assessment they gave us a number of recommendations for steps to take in regards to maintaining our growing afford ability options in the city one of the keys was setting up a housing commission we've stood up the housing commission they've started doing their work one of the second primary outcomes was to start using a gentrification assessment tool and putting together data on a regular basis to really measure a new stuff coming in what's it mean to the mix what's it mean to the percentages and what's coming and  we have those available must say in the housing commission is working through a number of different policies policy considerations you know they're looking at things from inclusionary zoning to if you displace it you replace  council and if i recall correctly in the discussion we had before voting to move forward the special election for the sponsor councillor mason to raise some concerns they agree with wholeheartedly that we don't necessarily right now gentrification as a result of those changes and so i think as a part of our vote to move this forward we did also ask that some of the goals that the housing commission as a commission have established to look at come we get a concrete timeline of when and how they're going to be examining that work moving forward so i think that's something the council is expecting because we did want to see something a little bit more concrete of yes we know this work needs to be done with see the plan on how between us the planning commission and the housing commission we're actually going to examine these and make sure to get those guardrails in place in the program and if i can just pile on a little i think the other thing the council's done as being very intentional about supporting active affordable i think it's thirty five forty percent affordable housing units with market rate housing and house homelessness prevention units which is a project the council supported with a lot of support that got the tax credits this cycle to to have that project realized this year that they've already put in those principles is to be very better driven ensued there is a lot of there's been a lot of bad calls and decisions made off with people's perceptions and misperception in a lack of understanding of the actual information in the past and so there's a lot of information available on the housing commission so if you've got some more i want to get a view on that so or energy efficiency so far the units that have been developed have not received the incentive based on the development of housing and so from my perspective it's important that we get ahead of this curve sooner rather than later because the development that's happening the incentive program does not seem to be doing what we had intended which was to incentivize more development for housing on the gateways so that we don't have pockets of affordable housing in other parts of the city but not  to the citizens so if we have a guest go tomorrow i see that as you know like i think it's got up to us to go into some serious deliberation about approving the project so  know the question from the public yes no right and we look forward to seeing everybody at the polls tomorrow between seven and seven again that's after one two three barlow street which is the senior center that shares the parking lot also  just important to note that the city cost which we're partnering in burlington there's a fifty fifty split the city cost the estimated cash and it would be around thirty thousand five hundred project scrapers this is a badly needed one you know point out to burlington that we're at the point where there are some spaces where there's enough room for somebody or something to go amount the there's going to be a split between burlington and when you see so the construction cost is three twenty five ninety but there's also design injury cost and construction inspection costs so they're also ta but to that point there is a group that has been put together that is looking at the future of the bridge right yes so the next public works commission there will be a updated cassy report for sewer and waste water so i can't take full credit because in july our accounting staff put a lot of this work together a great job so we what i'm showing here is that basically under water distribution side we have roughly twenty six percent of our allocation remaining for capacity and that using some typical flows that's you know roughly nine hundred forty two houses  we've got pretty adequate capacity at this point on the sensory sewer side very similar we have roughly thirty two percent of our treatment plant process  totally hit the brakes and do a moratorium on development because they lacked water waste water capacity which you know in fairness to everybody involved is the responsibility of this body working with you guys to make sure we're looking far ahead that we're not setting ourselves up to outpace our our capacity our capabilities on that front and in the past we've done a really good job as a city of staying ahead of that and that's pasture ations of leadership you know sometimes we a significant amount of funds to additional work passed you want a new tank was put up on water tomorrow so this this is good news so i have a question about given the fact that the development is not in single allocations is the remaining allocation for the phone call filled out of the tip district so when we think about building out what d or our home town project on their own patients going to come out of the test that's already being held in the allocation over so it's a very good for different types of businesses to pass a bit so you can have a restaurant for example which happened a few times in risky where they got a residential allotments to commercial buildings which is in the flow together a little bit but while we're going through so on the agenda piece wanted to give a quick update on the thrive budget and staffing situation that was a request that had been put out during the budget process actually as some of the changes were track were anticipating at this point and in the year right around breakeven based on the quarter three report that we have in our system here we always see our per year is a little funny in that it doesn't quite truck with the  year so we typically see kind of bigger financial hits at the beginning and end of the year because summer is a more expensive program for us to run so we may see that shift a little bit but i think we're trucking in a pretty comfortable space right  now to be again right around that projected break even point which is good certainly enrollment wise you know some numbers here that i think certainly with summary see a trend that is concerning in that we've talked about of that you're seeing i looking at some ways to address i do think we're starting to see a rebound a little bit in early in all the numbers which is positive for this coming summer season but you know there's been a lot of changes in the summer program since i started  encouraged to see the rebound this year after school i think we talked a lot through the process of having interim folks in different positions that we intentionally kept that under pretty suppressed last year and it was good positive to see that rebound we've seen more total families serve but i think in job changes that have led to changes in their subsidy levels something was with financial issues who had to discontinue a couple instances of behavioral issues that just kid kiddo's were appropriate for the program we're offering so that's one that i think in a given y you can't predict that adequately but you know again i think total number of families serve is kind of back on track with where we've traditionally been which is good and i was encouraged to see both vacation camps perform well this year for a city that was a good sign position and so we didn't have a lot of luck in casting in that and so we have kind of decided at this point to hold pattern to that end of the year he's been in ratio a bunch so that's limited some of the role that recruitment that we can do because of those hours being put license child care which means that we're regulated by state child care regulations which is that child development division and so within those regulations we have requirements for number of stock that we can have ratio of children to st f sizes so it's sort of a constant numbers game on top of all the other health and safety regulations that we have to follow yes or a credit program which is  and some people might not yet what is thriving yeah yet so thrive again is our license state licensed child care program the wrong after school and during the summer months so that's pretty running since well before my time here when i started the city about six years ago that person was running out of the o'brien center so just as a comparative the first year i was here i believe her after school home that is twelve because we have the challenge of getting kids from point a to point b with no consistent transportation and we're doing a lot of vision questing across the community with me to six kindergarteners in tow so moving up to the school was a huge deal for us and we saw our numbers just about triple i'm not first here so that has been a great thing and then summers while we base out of the school and that's largely been due to our efforts to dovetail services with the the summer school program of the school runs so for many years we ran a can essentially competing summer camp program with the preschool program and sort of finally decided that we were competing for the same so we now run you know if you look at our program brochure we run a lot of half day weeks reason being that the schools running have the programming in the morning and then we pick up the ball the afternoon and take kids to five thirty so that's one of the big pieces with the yeah any questions on current year stuff and for kind of jumping ahead to looking into your crystal ball a little bit soon i guess the twenty six from summer going to get back up to eighty to ninety kids i think we're seeing we're seeing some different aroma patterns in that program i think there's a lot to dot but i think we will rebound closer to that forty five or fifty number  i think where work spec thing i did as i just said we are going to actually run this summer two classrooms instead of three i think that gets us closer to having a maximize ratio of staff to students so i think it's a manageable number and again i think it is looking at our daily enrollment versus our total enrollment it allows us to serve i think the number of families we've been seeing and keeping our daily numbers you know comfortably within ratio that's one of the tricky parts of this is that weekly enrollment and daily in a moment are two different beasts so you've got to make sure on a given day that you don't have all those could show up and then you're out of compliance and ratio and of course that's the day that the compliance visit happens and then you get you know sl but also you you take some risks and overall at times because you know not every kid shows up on every day so that's sort of the i think the art of it is figuring out exactly what that looks like and making sure that you've got numbers that cover the bottom line but also keep you within compliance and and with health and safety standards so you know it's not i'm personally not a straight line calculation i wish it were but well on to the future we can certainly bounce back of questions emerge so looking ahead you know again just sort of to reflect back to the budgeting process at the time the leadership proposal had proposed to bring additional portions of cures to his position back into the program budget and out of the general fund so in years past had been a third in the general fund or two thirds years past so that led to a deficit budget for the coming year which we kind of all knew was going to be an outcome of that in the short term so that's that nine hundred thousand dollars number that was there that was a number that was there during the budget process and we sort of discussed it up and went on a positive note with the extension of promise communities grant we have been able to carry some of that grant funding into the next year so that's about less than a thousand bucks so that will help bring that negative number less negative so we're projecting at this point with that known graham money about an eleven thousand dollar deficit which is actually a palatable one for us to cover the cuts about ten percent of our program  reserves to cover that cost are carrying about one hundred thousand dollars at this point in private revenues start reserves so not a pattern that i think we want to carry on year over year over year but i think to kind of kick the tires year one that's a palatable dip into the reserves to to do that so i guess questions on that front certainly a mention here some other approaches that we're anticipating taking as we look ahead but you know grant funding is as good as your grant approvals and getting getting that funding awarded so we will certainly be looking for that opportunity but that's not that's not hard money that we can guarantee we are thinking to look a little more closely at our twenty one c partnership in particular can you have the next summer and what that could do for us in terms of maybe leveraging some grant funding there fact that hasn't been part of our how we would leverage that funding traditionally but i think there's some flexibility to look about so and then as i mentioned to you i think you know some are being a good example of trying to get ratios and staffing sizes down to a point where there were really maximizing wilmet number versus the number of stuff we have on board and again that's we tend to err a little bit lower than maximizing ratio because i think from a program quality perspective if you've got two people and twenty six kids in both classrooms it's it's pretty nuts on a given day so i think trying to keep that number of students a little bit warmer gives a better experience for the kids that we're serving so in with pierce's upcoming very exciting event that we're  we that's the person doing business rate i mean we have a person who value who's going to be on a leave and we feel like to stay in regulatory compliance we need to back fill those hours in that role so that's certainly money that we're there happy to spend i do want to mention and i didn't i should have perhaps made this more clear in the memo but one of the things that i did do as i was looking at the eighty five hundred dollars number is carried out in our part time salary budget that had been presented back in january so as i looked over the last couple years that our staffing levels for part time staff in particular we have typically come in below what our budget number was so there is some some wiggle room there that i felt pretty comfortable saying we could absorb that eighty five hundred dollars in the budgeting number that was already there without increasing that eleven thousand dollar deficit if that makes sense and again i think summers are great example where we're going to have one last classroom of stuff so we're just doing things and i think we'll see dividends financially from doing so his position has been active ratio so when we say short staffing it means that our director is is in reassuring the kids for the summer we're going to staff classrooms ideally it's your way that the director is not the choir to be in ratio the entire time all the time this summer we'll be able to have that flexibility and start doing some of that work and then also by having those folks here's the enough person overlapping for hopefully hopefully back a couple weeks you know a lot of the proper work for for the fall will be done under cares he's watched the newtown person is really sort of managing the ship for summer so we've got some depth of additional death with that person for some time you know really generally july that will give us a couple weeks of pierce's position was two there was a summer thriving a school thrive so i can better words in the decision was made to combine those into the one full time position because it gave some additional strategic capacity management that stink consistency of programming development all the development that's from all the feedback from the public really paid off with pierce's hard work in the attaining of the additional star when it comes to the ratings of the program so i think that would be really challenging under the previous set up with two different directors basically for half and half of the year so it was great to see that doing built back in to get that capacity free to do things you you know one of the items we did is shift some of the thrive responsibility general fund this year in the past it's been a self sustaining fire and in doing so asked that we get some kind of regular check ins on how it's going or how it's bouncing so we have  namely an interest to the conversations around trying to get really childhood at the center which as you know we've kept you i think pretty well the loop as to progress there or has a lack of progress unfortunately it's been a hard slog i think there's been a lot of professionals and really dedicated folks around the table trying to make this happen as mentioned in here we did get information not from the last operator the chucker operative that we've been working with as a possibility i felt pretty strongly that we needed as a promise community effort at least to take a step back from trying to land childcare at their brand center at this point one thing i do want to reiterate i think it's mentioned in here is that the group is by no means stepping away from that effort entirety i think it's just that we're feeling like at this time through the screen funding trying to get child care capacity center based approach expanded at the  working for us and i think given the pressures of the building budget and the need to season some things change they are we just we kind of i think exist exhausted her ability to sit and wait for it to happen it's disappointing i think as you can see here there's a lot of challenges within the broader system that i think we're falling victim to you know my hope was that we'd be able to sort of spearhead some changes there and unfortunately i think we're we're finding that the challenges are pretty pervasive and we're ready to take a step back from that of conversation with the state today about that so if you can give just a quick update on sort of the executive summary of that conversation with steve so at the time that we wrote our road map on which was so the way t given originally here we ended up with two years to create the plan of what that was going to be some sort of backwards for a grant process and so that kind of was made our bread map which was the document that was the culmination of two years of work one place in your community that you can go so that was what i am that we had in our roadmap and so as childcare has made its own wants and desires now we're repurchasing our efforts on trying to do this something that you would even be willing to consider in the answer is definitely yes you know we have essentially three things that we need so you put out there very clearly which is like rationale i'm timeline something else deadline to the state is the twenty twenty eighth i think twenty twenty ninth so at the end of this month the socially so are our thought at this point would be to go to the state and say here's here's a plan yes or no and then to bring that plane back here to i think the partners at the table namely the school the family center are both very excited about it and again we've had a lot of conversations over the last year or two years with other service providers who are trying to get into the community and i think as we've how heard this a little bit at the commission meeting with the library that space actually is becoming in some ways a defacto space where social workers are making me with clients supervised visitations are happening and not environment that's not working great it's  not the most dignified way for those service providers to provide their services and it's not a great experience for other peterman's here isn't comfortable so i think it could provide some opportunities to bring further partnerships into the city to better opportunities for the little ones which is the whole point of this promise communities journey that we have been on so so i think that's a little bit of the long and short the timeline and the pressures of this project it's just now is not the right time but there's definitely a competitor on the table to keep the ball rolling and try to figure out another opportunity in the future so which is exciting so then obviously you have the skill out of the difference in our budget is there's a short section here but i think with some of these other conversations getting a little bit more fleshed out over the coming month you know again i expect we'll be back to you early june that the latest with some updates on what that will mean for the building budget is us potentially so high there for a minute before we kind of go into the other work of the ground so does that say you would resent this bursting at the seams and potentially needing to move do you think part of it is this this is like secondary is that you're saying like if that moved over that maybe the library sees as it is and there's an additional area multiple different scenarios and one of the challenges of having this conversation publicly is there are only so many there's only certain things we can share about that i'll tell you there is an interest in thinking about how the library  have not to be discussed or staffed up or budgeted for when not so is there an opportunity to co locate the hub with the library and wonder the if we were to do that is there a better use of that seems aligned you know we tend to think so too i mean there's a lot of early childhood services in those different pockets they're happening in that building so having the ability to kind of bring out all together and have some glue to hold that would be appealing well not not that this conversation is moved forward at this juncture but in the vision process regarding the potential relocation someday of city hall and what a functional municipal facility that support better support and in terms of cremation with other communities it's a little sticky because it is such a community center brand there isn't a great interest in serving families outside of when you ski so a lot of the partners there were so i have a question about the child here i mean we are moving on but then it sounds like there's still conversations happening i'm wondering to what extent the strings that were the things that we did as a group was reach back out individually to a bunch of providers that who didn't comply basically to kind of ask that question of what was it that kept you from being in the mix for the us we had some requirements around for subsidy families and what we found in talking to providers is that twenty five percent is kind of the sweet spot where programs are still eligible to participate in the state meal program but that number is not so low subsidy really it's it's been a while so it's not keeping up with the market costs in talking to those providers though and saying so if we move that requirement down to twenty five percent would you even in their current operations just to sustain what they've got so i don't i don't think the requirement to serve when you see kids was a deal breaker if you think there's there's ample need in the community to fill child care and it's disappointing that we're not able to do that given the resources that are being put on the table to support that expansion is trying to understand is that the strings that were attached to the grant or a barrier or is it just more systemic i think aliar or systemic yeah and then again i mean i think your point is well taken there's a point at which banging your head against a wall is probably a fruitless exercise but i think again to hear earlier point that the need is so pervasive and clear that i think the people around the table are pretty committed to trying to make something happen and there's a there's a breaking point where that stops making sense but you know i think the the interest  seeing from the phone proper community and the partners that have remained around the table for this entire duration indicates to me that there's a will and says now how do we find the way to make this work it's just it's going to take some time  it's been it's been grueling way and a frustrating again i think not reflective of the amount of her work that's gone into it which outs are a supporting role but here we are thinking yeah on a positive no and i put this at the end tensional this grant has done some good work on it and i don't want to lose sight of that so i think you know the sort of final section here highlight some of the good things that have come today from the us some of them very much systems level you know providing some consistent core data training for professionals across different sectors down to individual investments like buying a kid a bed who's been sleeping with their siblings and having a hard time getting to school and being engaged there so you know i think we've really tried to look at deploying this funding at different levels of the intervention and you know i think objective of going back through this list and seeing today what we've accomplished it does it feels good like these are things that are going to make a difference for families and kids in some cases a period mediately in very acutely in some cases you know here's down the road but it feels encouraging that there is some good work happening it's tough that the main focus of the grant hasn't come to fruition but again i don't want to lose sight of the hard work and good work that's happening on the edges of that too so i want to make sure who some of those details here for folks to see but appreciate th school on this topic of how we address the issue in ford's been certainly from my a huge visual when from what i can see so that's that's great so the the very hot oh really reminds me of the one stock center department lever you know we're just back way successful way to get people services so if you were to go for it it's wildly successful what happens after senator the great question so i think the plan for the graph awning at this point is to really create if we were to go ahead with this approach really to create a space for that work to happen and and continue to work for christie's position my position to sort of the lead leverage the resources and partners that we have we're not intending to use the graph i mean just for a staff op or you know kind of best as operating costs that are going to come in here in year out i think it's really acknowledging that this is work that again is kind of happening in dark corners around the community and giving it some space to breathe the hope is that we can continue to partner leverage those those other agencies as other resources out there and then i think look for creative opportunities in the future i think suddenly you've got a space where he got a little he traditionally some will work to be going on some grant funded projects some pilots you know i think it becomes a really interesting space to do the work which again we just that's based as exists at the moment in the community for those families so yes so we were not looking to invest in any kind of ongoing costs through the screen that's not the who looking at trying to bring a project for that would have moved more to negligible impact on the budget in the us who are looking at right now especially with existing person or in the building a library space that is already paying right to ourselves you know we looking at some ways that we may move those pieces around the board in a cost neutral i got to that's the that's the exercise right now but models is to what extent is the city want to subsidize these opportunities for arc and i think that that's a hard conversation groups of us have had over the last year to you but i think it's a reality i have to do it i have to and you know the sales pitch we've gone off the rails for it was always that it would be as close at least as close to finding a financially sustainable enterprise as humanly possible meaning that the revenues for the building would generally offset there and that the taxpayers wouldn't be subsidizing at least the building so that that's something that was pitched the taxpayers that we have now been honest about and saying that nothing the movies are dishonest about it but there was definitely some and binge in vicious penciling that was done in its inception about what the potential revenues on rents looked like such you know we made in mission this year this just isn't working integrate it back into the general fund so each to citizen that's made now going forward is not just are we going to borrow more from the reserves of the units it's a dollar for dollar impact to the tax rate and that's again i think part of we're really working to make sure they're we're doing things cost neutral compared to what we are doing now and the building is definitely at the center of that thinking that's why if you walk into ray's office right now and you're very decisionmaking programming pastie and leeway in the future we need to have a larger conversation of that property and the the property itself offers a lot of different opportunities and  potential and at some point you've got to look at that and say well what else can we get for this to offset the cost of it because it's not being the land itself was being utilized and that was this question we had