all the first order of business is a public hearing to review a proposed amendment to the zoning ordinance primarily regulating section nine one six general sign regulations as it pertains to electronic variable message signs just leaving this evening's hearing which advertised any observer report on may twenty fourth and june third of this year the hearing notice was placed on township bulletin boards the township website and cable television council may or may not act on this request this evening prior to accepting counsel and audience comments there will be a ordinance the council is reviewing at the definition of an electronic variable message sign in to work ordinance i didn't understand what was in there in the first place but it's not in there so we added the definition  messed which simply is an electric electrically activated sign whose message content either in whole or in part may be changed by means of electronic program the next existing mall type tenets centers along route nineteen that did not have an electronic message sign or wanted to incorporate one ordinance gave them an additional thirty six square feet of sign to add an electronic variable message sign we feel that we don't need that anymore if someone wants to do an electronic message sign they do incorporate it into their overall  or the next thing is that the proposed ordinance would allow only along the route nineteen cord or electronic variable message  this is not a change to the ordinance but it's in the overall ordinances the message cannot change more than once every twenty seconds sign messages are limited to on premise big business activity only with the exception of businesses can advertise for nonprofit events such as community day for example would be allowed there's language in there to prevent these types of signs from glaring or distracting drivers along route nineteen there is a requirement that the any electronic variable message sign incorporated automatic dimmer control in the light detector photocell to control the brightness of the sign splays are limited to static display that can't be moving flashing hearts to any of the signs on the message can change when it does change it has to change instantaneously you know there can't be any fading dissolving it needs to just go from one message and quickly less than a second go to another message it's very important that if business is a long route nineteen want to have an electronic variable message side multicolor then it needs to be a monument that's a change to kind of a major change to be gordon it's right now you can incorporate these types of signs on existing poles signs o electronic variable message sign they can't have any temporary signs internal lumination are only electronic variable message monuments signs can be double sided with a maximum thirty degree angle on monuments and another important aspect of this ordinance is that only fifty percent of the location sign area can be electronic variable message signs so for example the allowable sign rages on route one thousand range from thirty square feet to one hundred square feet so if someone that's allowed it was actually it was say the seventy's what about existing businesses that have signs and now they want to do this do they have to take signage down in order to accomplish this potentially  sign it is if it's thirty square foot in their allowed thirty square foot and they want to do if it's a mine inside they could just replace put in electronic variableness and sign it fifteen square feet of that just depends so to clarify a business owner could have the building signage and a monument sign that the total can't exceed the allocated number for the square footage of the building building does i'm thinking about this i was thinking about the issue that kind of precipitated this and the fact that there's signage on the building as well as the mo groceries would have to be on a morning resign but if somebody has already has a monument signed they may not necessarily have to replace their sign unless it's too big you know what i'm talking about those polls are that someone message that call sign has to come down in a minute star sign would have to go in its place you know i tend to agree with you know mr lewis i've never been a big proponent of these types of signs and you know i thought that when we first discussed this issue a while back you know mr loose  road or something like that because we're trying to you know maybe benefit one or two businesses that are located in the right ninety corridor or i think that you know once we do this you know i might be a hundred percent wrong and you know maybe we won't get a big flurry of activity but i mean i just don't see the need for it i mean i've driven from you know mount lebanon to here chunk up the business district for a lot lot better word i mean i'm just not in favor of it but you know we're here on the tour to the council and wanted to discuss this ordinance why wouldn't i wouldn't call mike my opinion tends to lean with the mr ball and mr burke question i believe that as a commercial district nineteen is what we have and we need to allow people to utilize that current technology that i'm not wild about the moving signs or anything like that but i think that it's a legitimate use of the technology for that area i do not want it on the side roads i don't want it any smith murray i don't want it on valley you know that some marketing thing and it goes to what mr burke was said you know and you try to get people to know what your product is whether or not the information on that is compelling and would make me stop or not potentially if i didn't realize they were there and saw it i might i mean there are new businesses that come into the timeshare they try to promote themselves and that's just one one tool and i think we need to encourage people to do that and build the commercial i'm concerned wh you said about the content but on the other hand you know they're going to leave they're going to give information that's going to get people in the store that stuff is secondary and i would hope that people would take the high road as far as content worth a thousand words when you look at the messages that you are trying to communicate to get out to the community they are it's very difficult to prove promote an upscale image in read any  so we find that actually doing the full color is a much clearer picture and it does definitely bring you up with the current technology of what's out there today the as far as you know i've been a business owner for almost twenty five years and we've used the traditional black and white letters that you have to get out of it although when you're in the wires letters blow off and half the word to missing but i will say that absolutely positively in a retail business people it does get the attention for people to stop and they're curious to see what you have so when you're promoting your business is very much an interval part of the marketing and being successful what we're doing we are selling higher end products we are selling to  attract to upscale customers to women and they are looking for something that's more tasteful and to do it in the full color digital with the room scene it's the only way you can do it when we did the same images here  impossible to create and it was just night and day and i think that was pretty much unanimous really everybody who looked at it so you can't do anything in the digital sign that you can't do in a static sign so if you're having somebody who wants a very distasteful image of you know about a grower you know whatever they're doing to promote some of the drugs or things like that you could do that in a static image and there's nothing you can do to control that they could put that sign up lot tronic and they're not flashing or not moving to me is just what makes it no different than a static sign it's the same image that's there and the messages are between doing it in a digital where we can actually show a different thing or go back to promoting a community event but at the time when the temperature's something like that just allows us the ability to be able to change it affordably and  case studies on them and it averages ten to fifteen percent in revenue just because customers buy them their clients and they're able to talk to the public and explain what they're doing and we it we do it test after we install a sun and we just have one message up there in just a simple message for example we did one for a care facility we put oakley sunglasses on sale twenty percent off just to see how many people come in because of that one message and it works so just to say that one of the limited businesses on on route nineteen that can advance and help their businesses out so they can stay there for you guys let's all try to say in the full color just helps us so much more specially stacy's situation she's able to put up a room seen to advertise that she does hard wood floors in instead of just saying that it's maybe easier to see a picture than to have to actually read everything about it so if you're just driving down the road you see a nice picture of a floor scene or a carpet in it just simply says the next item on the agenda would be approval of the minutes from the regular council meeting of may twenty eighth two thousand and thirteen and with that the minutes be approved as written anon agenda item an item not appearing on tonight's agenda you can have up to five minutes to discuss any non agenda item is there anyone in the audience in the gallery here that would like to speak to a non agenda item go directed me to send letters out to the property owners on the four corners and three corners we did that we did get a few calls and some questions but we did refresh my recollection as to why they're requesting that we have strong our our policy as you know because the size of the traffic on this road doesn't qualify for automatically to permit one and of the  with number one they have enough parking on site to meet our ordinance they are required to have thirty eight and forty two were proposed to be in there just during busy times  the owners who are here tonight work the agreement out with the property immediately south south across pleasant avenue from where furious will be located their parking lot is oftentimes not possibly for the employees so that the patrons can be close to the building but if we create that is there a concern about a walkway or people crossing that street from a safety perspective should there be a walkway or something of these are pretty high and there are forty mile an hour range and i can't remember that ever happening but this is more of a main road so i am of the opinion we should just do it now so to make that motion further discussion i agree i just wondered whether we could get any economy from the transit company to if they're going to be given to concurrently any anticipated and these that i figure thirty three thousand six hundred thirty seven dollars and sixty five cents markup you want to have any comments on this just in general discussion we did receive five bids appellation was the word better they are thousand lower than that and the second one was the first thing we did was call in some references the second thing we did was we actually michael and i met with with mr pitofsky did to discuss his bid whether he was comfortable with it and how he plans to attack the project you know basically get the savings that he hopes to realize halfs to deal with the disposing of the film material above the bridge which is a significant amount of tear material it's between nine and ten that that would be his responsibility to get property owners permission as well as grading permits and so conservation permits before he can do any of that work correct so the budget for the project was slightly award for the seven hundred thirty three thousand and change and i guess the only remaining issue was the county grant for two hundred fifty thousand which did come through and we don't know if we have an agreement yet but its  entirely favorable it's just put it that way so we were just concerned you know from a reputation standpoint and your standpoint of being able to work with this contractors that's one of the reasons that we called the meeting and we felt it would be nice to meet face to face to just discuss our concerns and of course you know we were assured that the change orders would you know the only time they would occur is if they were val project goes but you know the stock shapers the design engineer now also be inspecting the project you know we may have to step up the inspection hours based on how the project proceeds but i think it would if we cross that bridge no pun intended when we come to  and table or for this type of project we stipulated in the bed that the project should be complete by october fifteenth mainly due to the fact that there is paving involved in it's own up and it's all a state road you know the paving under the bridge and typically you know penned up want to allow you to pave past october thirty first now the fact that you know that it took us one extra meeting to get through the county grant situation you know would have no objection to extending that to the end of october the project deadline but i think that the pinch point there is the planned paving deadline so it's considering a lead time of the beams and it's kind of an aggressive schedule the deadline what is showing says do we have that the thing will be latin finished through the winter well we don't have liquidated damages with them well there are there is a liquidated damages clause in there and with any liquidated damages i mean he have to show that it was circumstances beyond his control it was steve whether some type of meeting with material or utility you know some type of issue that through the schedule off it was out of his control mentioned that people would expect power outages well we don't know yet i mean if we were working with allegheny why spend power and we have a pre construction meeting next week schedule and they're invited so we want to kind of get everything on the table at that meeting and there's a question that it's what will shut it down it's some point that will you know that their main concern is just you know in the heat of the summer with all the air conditioners running in and that's not even from a residential standpoint but it like as mike said it's a main line you a power hospitals and other facilities of need and stuff so they can't just shut it down when the loading is is such so they need to make sure that the loading is low enough that they can safely shut it down and be able to pull off another circuit yes but we're paying right type of thing and i was actually i mean obviously in the tabulation i went through in the book why not right now which items look out of whack him and him being high on it actually in my mind is kind of a good thing because you know we we anticipate a significant you know jostling around of signs and coming up of signs after the demolition of the bridges are worth it to me the fact that he has sufficient money to cover that demolition phase would include clearing and excavation and demo of the structure and you know once they lay the slopes back and get off the road you know that might take a month or hoping and then they can do some field work on the abutments he had given it to us for information purposes related to an assessment appeal has the school board are a have you made a recommendation that we appeal it or not it seemed as if it was an  swimming pool and i would think that that would be ok but i still don't see anything how we're going to address the parking issue because that seems to be a bigger problem with time and the police  well i think they need to keep up the good fortune and one other thing to your speed in the park you know we put in that exercise trail with the stations it seems strange to me we decided to put one station where you have to cross the road the road to use you might want to think about having one of those people humps in that particular area  and then there are other areas where for example you get from the stop sign heading down a field five there you have to walk on the road to  go to the other exercise station there's no walkway there's no path and we want to consider extending the path along that parking lot area  looking to possibly take the firm that was hired to do the value engineering which was the second firm that they interviewed for the project and see if they can get them to complete the design and part of that one of the things we've required is cruel five three seven was to have a value engineering study done and they're also they have there they're saying that if you're asking if we do they do hire see the engineers complete this project we would li i don't i mean i wouldn't consider us to be an agency i would consider township to be an agency in a way is it written here that donations are services to nonprofit agencies in excess of  right and do we know if any of the valuation nearing he's going to cause any first six issues for the residents who are in that area i mean some of the things they were seemed to be valuation hearing out i don't i don't think so you know how you know this works feasibly it's hard to say this tory but that would be what we would be looking at doing here i mean i agree in the winter lived in allegheny county and they were putting in