and claim thirty two all began by addressing claims thirty two which recites mixing poly all raw materials and green tea to make memory foam all refer to this foam as green tea although claim thirty two also recites using this green tea memory foam to make a layer of a mattress of focus first on the memory foam but even if it was ridiculous did open the i mean there is no green tea memory foam mattress and judge shoes the examiner said that he had two references and the amount of reference was the reference that taught green to memory foam he said lines twelve to thirteen that's just an error a mistake the mistake i believe is from the misconception that of the word molding the examiner thought that molding has something to do with mold for example in target seventeen of lin molded foam molding has nothing to do with mold a molding is an extradition with a constant cross sections that like the molding in there in the room it creates filaments is like making pasta you can make spaghetti which is the filament where you can make lasagna which is the sheet state you can make the composite where inside is a spaghetti and can be t so as water or fluids flow through a filter something is washed out so if it's the molding which is very small filaments that create a normal when mash but what you want and why can't you just go it's a bit of a filter i thought of almost an admission that you had that their memory foam could have an open self on no i believe that was a misrepresentation in in flow through it so you can have some cells that are that are open but if the majority of cells are open fluid can flow folks through it so you can have particularly from the air go through or a memory  can't go through you might have a couple that's what makes your hand you know the same as you can see that's a little bit but air can flow through that you put a poor pitcher water on here it's not going to go through like on your bed it's just forms of conduct so the entire disclosure maka motto is filters and the foam and example eighteen is suitable for making a filter still aka moto without question brings green tea into the poly all oma area whether it's ridiculous to your non retake elated and then we have lynn that goes the rest of the way why isn't that moto teaches memory foam and that was the basis for the combination he said she said foam produced by komodo is used to make bedding rip materials that's the reason to combine and you have this preparatory so why does it apply to all the examples including a not because it says it only applies to molding the that example with the bedding that paragraph starts with the powderpuff there are two of filter header pots are fine example eighteen true and you can make a powder puff from the ridiculous to some of the examples eighteen or you can make it from the non living fabric but this example here on kong thirteen is only about molding and the betting there is for example the sheet putting ask you about sorry i don't interrupt you but up on the gr calling thirteen so we may go if we disagree with you about that if we find that the phone that is hot by our comodo could be used as a metaphor slayer even if it doesn't specifically include memory of is that in conjunction with land enough to render you obvious i would argue that akhmad has nothing to do with mattresses you don't i understand but but i'm asking a hypothetical if we disagree with thought claims that are directed to a green chief on layer of the mattress in light of these prior to the teachings the board is correct in finding that these claims are obvious on appeal now the examiner i believe that the examiner was correct in saying that kind of explicitly stated his current troop rotation that the materials would be broadly related to mattresses cushions and pillows and actually if you look at specification twelve he would seem to use similar wording there if you look at paragraph seventeen he talks about how in his present invention to manufacture a foam that can be made into a pillow c so i don't think there's any reasonable argument that betting couldn't be read this probably so i wanted to point out that oh an appeal continues to argue that the okamoto reference should be read narrowly in that example eighteen even though it actually states phone is made should not be read to mean phone because of other teachings in the reference and this is an unreasonably narrow reading that wasn't adopted by the examiner it was in the top to the board and that argument is c so they're talking about in example eighteen cosmetic puffs and filters aren't they those are the two examples that they provide as what the phone could be used for  the possible uses of the foam and you can imagine cosmetic puffs and filters that are very different structures which would seem to suggest that example eighteen is just teaching generally how to make the foam which appears to be a well understood and we are known that these are two distinct uses and so then the examiner found that if you look at a reference like len that he says you can use foam and mattresses as there doesn't seem to be i also wanted to pick up on mr o's arguments about claim thirty two mr o makes distinguishes claims thirty two from claim twenty one for the first time really in his reply br of in his original brief to the board and in his opening brief to this court these two claims are argued together and they were characterized as having a green cheese layer of foam in the mattress or in a memory foam mattress and this is the argument that the board responded to in its opinion and to the extent of the claiming something else mr o should have made that argument earlier so the board is correct in its findings in this regard as well specification that's just wrong science you can all of that is ice assign a with polio and that makes many different kinds of songs that statement would suggest that all all all it's just wrong science the second argument was that the appellant waived the right to say that the claim thirty two recites memory foam and that the board took that reasoning over all the way through even in our in our blue grief we argue that acma does not teach memory foam that's not relevant for claim twenty one through open for claim thirty two and they were arguing