to interview apartments project key you know except public testimony for public testimony you have three minutes to speak he's a dinner for yourself at the microphone and  mr chair we have three testifiers signed up currently in the chamber the first test fires dave daily on it will be testifying as a representative of the realtors association he'll be followed by subsidize an average worker will not be able to afford housing cassady defined that average working class resident as earning eighty percent of the area median income the project before you today saying that sixty percent area medium income because it can only a project is the first viable project to aim at that segment of the income ladder him our county and yours the council is now faced with a question that we as a community had been invading for quite a while what to what extent is the house community subsidized in the new housing needs of our community traditionally we expected the developer and by extension the residents of the new development to pay for any off site improvements that are in any way related to the project direct impact fees water schools waste water parks and i have a charge attached to my testimony and charged to projects in charge of projects and he hey come to about thirty thousand dollars a year if if we ad the cost of building out say to north south collector road to the number was school eight and when that happens we no longer have a viable project this is not to minimize the importance of the concerns raised by the neighboring community but the existing paradigm which the developer gets tagged with every conceivable was a improvement simply won't work and project aimed that housing hotel maids shop clerks and section eight recipients we need we need a new paradigm a new way of looking at the equation that will actually attract more of these projects if the neighbors concerns about extending the north south collector or correct that perhaps the county meaning all of us will have to provide the means to build it out these developers are offering a way to pay their fair share of impact fees over time that too may be part of a new paradigm but for now we need a yes we're on the first step toward entering our housing failing to build houses for these residents will only be an option if you're ok with mr chair the next as far as mike moran he'll be testifying on behalf of the key a community association and will be followed by daniel  oh carroll and committee mike are into the key a community association as we had the unusual opportunity to already address you on this proposed project twice is there anything else to say well some claim i always have something to say but we keep receiving input reinforcing our position and while we encourage individual guys to come testify most decline for a variety of reasons and ask the association to voice their concerns for some the term testify is intimidating so just to summarize we have we give full support for affordable rentals but we ask why not abandoning required infrastructure primarily the north south collect the road and the environment please make sound decisions here for your constituents please do not rely on the volunteer planning commissioners down the road with your limited ability abilities you have been chosen by the community to make the overall best decisions taking everything into account if you decide that this developer does not need to build this road segment what comes next will taxpayers pay for it or will it just be ignored as all manner of development all around is built with no plans for infrastructure professionals and residents hay was developed with little or no planning and while we cannot go back is it not inside he to do the same thing over and over expecting a different result schools commercial and residential development in key hay while they and mckenna march on but no new way to transport the users no safe bike ways so they can't use bicycles and no new or expanding road for support this particular affordable housing project mean except from contributing to your essential infrastructure which is the completion of the north south collection collector or the say a segment which runs adjacent to this property advise that department building development without providing adequate infrastructure is like building a house of cards and it's going to come crashing down under its own weight because there's no infrastructure so we need the transportation infrastructure for many reasons we need the north south collector road we need to complete it for we're number one safety reasons and key a road especially for mcdonnell is going to the key here is not safe for pedestrians and cyclists i walked that segment of the key here route when i did the torch march around recently it is very very dangerous to walk along key he wrote we need a north south collector road as a means of safely moving our families our children from north to south where they have safe areas where they can buy can walk so primarily it's a safety reason and this impacts our whole community and then it's an economic reason too because if you're stuck in traffic and it takes you longer to get to work it's going to cost you money and tourists who come to our resorts in wailea they don't want to be stuck on pure line in traffic you know they come from that they don't want to more of that when they come here so we need those north collector will complete it and this this the time and the place ok like i said i've never done this before so i'm just going to read from my notes bear with me please i'm a hairdresser and mark allow and i work on the community we do family prices in my shop and what i'm hearing from the community the despair in the community about no rental housing is really upsetting so i'm going to go ahead and read my notes and then i'll be done i came here today to ask one question what is being done right now to create quality affordable rental housing for mali's longtime residents and families more and more families that had a home are slipping into homelessness because one all the property has been sold to my brother wants to move in three zero we can make more money if we ran it out as a vacation rental no respect for the renting family i have lived in san diego las vegas palm beach florida there are little communities of duplexes one story apartments built to be rental communities for working people and you have to have good credit to live there working class people the more that i read the more it looks like the county council in the planning commission are making it very on appealing for developers to want to build something like this so now there's a new law making it easier for a homeowner to build another ohana in his backyard take the responsibility off the backs of the county and the planners and the mayor these private landlords can do whatever they like my clients tell me their stories about crazy landlords that behave like tyrants make up the rules as they go along the asking rents right now come nowhere close to wage the teachers their hair that i do they tell me the little children come in to school clean fed homework done and they get to go home to a vehicle or a tent how would that feel the families i'm fighting for are the ones that had a rental home for years and lost it for the reasons i've mentioned and now there is no where to go there are zero rentals out there right now we are the southern boundary the vicinity of requested exemptions and modification as proposed by the  infrastructure you know i know we have to deal with the north south collector it's located near infrastructure it's located near jobs near services schools community center par all those kinds of things that all adds towards the affordability when you don't have to spend so much time so much gasoline on your car to drive everywhere so we think this is a it's designated for urban growth within the maui island plan as i recall part of it is designated for housing but and part of it for commercial but that's what the two one age processes for is to as a short cut good projects for you know from the the regular multiple year process you know in order to get the affordable housing on line so request we do not support the idea of deferral of the fees but we have some other options that might accomplish the same thing although we haven't received plans for the project our estimate is that it would be served by probably about a four inch meter which would cost about half a million dollars for water system development fees and as everyone knows we've been trying to balance our needs for infrastructure versus these fees so we're concerned about losing half a million dollars of needed revenue we have a couple options rather than deferral of fees the first would be to modify the water system development fee ordinance similar to the county waste water ordinance which says very specifically affordable housing is exempt from the fees that would allow us when we do our rate analysis to raise the other rates to generate the same level of revenue so it would be built into the rates to support this if you look in my letter referred to the exact now accounting code i think it's a fourteen point three four point zero ninety which for waste water says for this very project it says that affordable housing schools churches are automatically exams so when wastewater does their rates they take that into account so that's something the council could do rather than making a case by case determination about whether or not certain projects are eligible it would it would set the whole class so that's one thing you know we of course support if that was the council's policy the other would be to simply use the affordable housing fund to this and that equal amount of money that could be then used to pay the water system development fees so there would still be a you know revenue of the amount needed to balance the project preference would be use of the affordable housing fund and the reason is affordable housing fund everyone contributes to that's the purpose of it either through rent which goes somewhat to property taxes or property taxes directly everyone is contributing so everyone would be helps to subsidize this project if we just give an exemption from water rates that means only the water users are essentially just having to raise more money to subsidize the project so either one works they would both not be project specific i'm sorry the the general exemption for affordable housing projects would apply to all projects that fit these criteria and the other option would be hand picked by the council  about which projects would use affordable housing funny so we think either of those is better than just simply deferring the water system development fees which just create a hole in our budget that just creates another problem for later on so  more than happy to answer any questions but that is what we think is the best way to move forward we certainly support affordable housing we can be part of it we just think there should be an overall policy and not just hand picking projects as they come because it just leaves a hole with managing the water department our history our history to my recollection has been almost everyone has asked for either deferral or exemption from the water system development fees and we have no records nor memory of it ever being granted important it's never been granted that you can remember no one on staff remembers this us no one on staff can arbor a case where the council in a two one g or two the similar number of units and she said to me that it's probably going to be the same size meter but he could be a little less or a little more depending on you know that would be do you talk a little further suggested at the last committee meeting and then we had another condition just to clarify the timeline so the first condition reads the following prior to issuing a building permit road widening lots must be subdivided from the property and construction plans approved to the satisfaction of the department of public works for all road widening lots and the north south collector road and in addition to that the next condition states prior to the granting of a permanent or temporary certificate of occupancy for the final building in the project whichever comes first the applicant shall have completed improvements deeds and related subdivision processing requirements to the satisfaction of the department of public works for all road widening lots and north south collect a roadway departs and have road be lots dedicated to the county of molly at no cost to the county  chair and committee members what we're proposing is to have the improvements that we are we are requiring to be done and to have the roadway a lot subdivided out and dedicated to the county prior to the issuance of the building permit and the certificate of occupancy as far as their improvements along the north south collector road when if this were a regular project what the applicant would be required do would be frontage improvements along the property the project so and what the applicant has has asked for was an exemption from that however they are going to be coming in and doing frontage improvements curb gutter sidewalk pavement to travel which includes two travel lanes as well as a bike lane and so we were satisfied with that most other tool on each applicants come in and ask for total exemption from curb cut or sidewalk but this applicant has actually asked and requested that or suggested that they do google thank you for being here so can you elaborate more on what is expected from the developer for the collector road the car the north south collector road they saw from the beginning of the project which is that first entrance all the way to the edge of the the project line so they would do curb gutter sidewalk there what the applicant has asked for in their exemption is to just do their frontage improvements up until that second entrance to the south so they are coming in and doing the curb cut or sidewalk and then doing a i think we've talked to them about doing two eleven foot travel lanes so you have to travel lanes that eleven feet each and then an additional bike  lane i think it was another six feet so that's actually more than what they had originally had requested previously but when we talked with them in came up with some other suggestions they agreed to doing that additional six feet for the bike lane so that's actually more than what we've requested and then in the conditions that they've they've agreed to we are able to  have that portion of the north south collector road dedicated to the colony at no cost sometimes what we have to do is go in for a land acquisition and that takes a really long time but in this case they're willing to dedicate to the to the county before their certificate of occupancy or building by the time their certificate of occupancy is  granted that portion of the north south collector road would be county so we felt that it was a big big thing for them to agree on ok well make fred happy anyway thanks for being here this afternoon i really appreciate it i need some clarification can you help me so that i'm clear you know we keep hearing about the collector road and it seems to be a major issue in a stumbling block to getting approval of this project we have the developer and we're pretty clear about what they're going to do and thank you very much for you know making clear for us how we're going to get the rest of this road what is the status of this project can you tell us ok chair the status of the project we do have this portion of the new south collector road are the steps for twenty twenty for construction  current be in this fiscal year budget we have for the council approved monies to call and move forward with the design of the north south collector road so we're starting off with the design and the planning efforts and then in the states step for twenty twenty that's when we are anticipated to go in for construction and that's that's where we're at with this project but having the developer do their front portion does help i know there was a request to have all of it done and but we felt we were comfortable with what have it and that that's that's one of our that's our priority right now is to get the north south collector road we do we recognize the need and and that's something that i know my director wants to have completed as well as many others in our department as well good work thank you very much ed makes me a lot more calm about the whole thing and i'm very excited to see that develop are willing to do their share more than their share of the more than what they normally required to do so thank you very much thank concerns can you help me to understand what the concerns would be and how it's addressed by our department culvert in question we did have staff review it but they don't have any concerns about covering it  i think maybe i can defer to the project engineer to give you more information about the gulch and how it's how it functions and what flows through you know we had talked about that the last time but from the department of public works our staff didn't have any concerns of about the proposal for that culch thank you of my staff or the project engineer for this project highway of year two culverts at the site visit if you notice there was an open chandra came down and some time oh a number of years ago when the bits of brothers on this property they put a portion of this have to do is significantly affect the project in that we would not be able to build as many units as being proposed as well as we have to cut the parking down significantly i see ok thank you thank you for that it's a kid thank you very much for being here this is really important so as an engineer you're comfortable closing up and covering or doing whatever you're going to do to that gulch is not going to cause any harmful effects on the things below it it's my opinion that it would not my concern of leaving it open besides not being able to build as many units and parking is an issue for  proposed some suggestions one of the things he talked about was possibly using affordable housing funds to pay for these water fees and i'm wondering if there's somebody from budget or finance or somebody who does with money who could address that maybe if they're not here they might might come later or  assigned a committee hopefully shortly if that goes through and is approved i do not estimate that there will be much funds available in the affordable housing fun to cover these types of costs based on the amount th was awarded to the county's coolum other projects as well as the not you project i think is if we're going to be a very minimal balance left after this r p process is completed question ok we haven't already awarded those dollars we've just put out direct and received proposals yes by so that's correct so we have the ability to modify the amount we give me yes that will come before committee shortly and then you'll have the opportunity to review and make recommendations ok thank you thank you jeff  to pay for water development my concern and i think we've discussed this and we've talked about it in the past could we could this project hold on its own five hundred or six hundred thousand that we're referring to as far as developing the water because we've never given exemptions in the bass and we're not going in the future as long as i mean i'm not going to support that but could with this project which stand  my understanding in consultation with corporation council in preparing our requests for exemption is that the outright exemption of the fees wouldn't be consistent with existing rules but because this project is requesting a deferral that that appears to be an option that could be feasible so it so i think that the project would you know he could really use the assistance and would request the deferral now to the question of whether or not that's a make or break cost line item for this project i think that the  project manager i shall roger because he's going to be available i phone you know could specifically speak to whether or not that's that will you know break the project so when would we be able to hear from or should be available by phone at this time now she's on on standby now where we're discussing this issue on the water meter which we're looking at around half a million dollars about five hundred thousand dollars for the water meter fees and you know as far as deferral we have discussed that and also there was talk about exempting which we haven't done the best and i don't think we'll do in the future and so i was wondering you know if we did away with that and you guys picked it up entirely would that break the deal as far as this project is concerned very clear this is a fifty five total development is about fifty five million dollars so what we're talking about at the two moment is actually no five hundred thousand dollars or impact to the project pushe you know quite frankly relatively small in comparison to the size of all of the cost going into the project so i think in short cancer quest and if we are required is currently work questing county a maui affordable housing funds are requesting workforce housing credit you know in addition to what the code allows and those sources of funds are all combined to make this project work so the more development costs that are put on to the project the more needed a project will have to fill other gaps so you know obviously it just  you know in other ways and it's my belief that this is one of them that i would rather not get involved in and you know i have to comes on to other sources coming in and helping and very appreciative of that but thank you for your answer and i appreciate it then  i'll let other members ask questions thank you  hundred percent of the whole thing credits in order to make all this work to make sure that i heard the question was what i believe the question was asking me whether the educational work for housing credits that we're requesting whether they're needed to make the project work correct thank you to sell those credits on the market which in our research you know it's not it's not that it doesn't go through the county at this point but not research to beat the market pays it out eighty thousand dollars per credit so that in time becomes equity now and we don't get it and to work complete and we have the project units up and running and they're serving you know families that are meeting our income requirements but we that equity that the project w attain by increasing the amount of units that we can balance housing credit that we can shall we very much effect the feasibility of this project at that point and about fourteen million dollars as a  the event that the project doesn't meet the extra credit we would either a not sell them or b give them give any funders save for the credits to the county to use for future affordable housing go as i stated earlier this month again any additional value to the project received from work for selling work for that we have reviewed the exemption list there are two actually two items two points of clarification that we just like to bring up today because basically or are assuming the the chance to make sure everything's crystal clear i think that the same as what the project has been presenting throughout the process throughout throughout our year and two on each occasion process but i think that i just want to make sure that the language is certain the first item relates to the roadway improvements that we've been discussing there's two triggers for road improvements the first one is the subdivision trigger and we have that listed in our exemption list but there's also a building permit trigger and so we just want to make sure to make note of the building permit sugar and so i would propose that we would like to add that in on the exemption list add an item f number to and that language would be exactly the same as item g number two with the exception that the language would read an exemption from section sixteen point two six b point three six zero zero improvements to public streets and then the language again would continue on exactly as item number g two and basically what that would do is that would say that the roadway configuration as we're proposing it to be developed would be developed after the trigger for subdivisions as well as after the trigger for building permits the exemptions that you chair i can't give you an answer on that right now i i don't know what that exemption some boat know enough to read it all in research explaining propose a change yes or we have a chapter sixteen point twenty six b point thirty six hundred of our of the marconi code that essentially is a section in our building code it's a new section regarding improvements to public streets and as mr hart had indicated earlier there is a trigger in building permits you know and when there is no subdivision involved the next trigger would be at building permit that's where you would have frontage improvements required so the exemption that they're requesting is essentially the same in this one exemption from this section of the chapter it's basically you know any kind of frontage improvements that you have you would be required if you came in for a building  permit and it's very similar to our subdivision code in chapter eighteen where the subdivision would trigger frontage improvements so it's it's it's the same in the department would this in support of that in support ok in language an exemption from section was the code sixty sixteen point thirty states i'm sorry sixteen point twenty six b point three six zero zero of  code improvements to public streets and then basically the same language to allow for construction for the park portion of the north south collector road adjacent to that project site comet to be in conforman question i was just basically rest on the testimony of the applicant and the department that you wanted to look at or address within the exemptions of page one two or three yes thank you very much chair if i may there's one other point it's item g three regards the underground in a future utility lines the application is is open to underground any new utility lines that are triggered but we would just like to add the clarification point of keeping any existing utility lines above ground which the condition states but but also that includes the relocation of existing that those be able to be relocated as above ground lines and so for that amendment what i would proposes is that in the second line of item number three be granted to allow for existing i would i would propose and the relocation of existing above ground utility lines and they would be the conclusion of that proposed amendment in the purpose of that would be to clarify that the relocation of existing above ground utility lines would be covered by the same exemption from underground existing to allow for existing or relocation of existing above ground utility lines would that be have any effect to the department or you have an opinion as to that works but would you like that there also thank you that would be our intent record thank you chair i would just say that the modification to g three to allow for relocating existing above ground utility to also be allowed for modifications welling's and units for our working people those who are in dire need and i just came back from a waffle and as i drove along the streets coming in to the airport again the same ten cities really believe this is a golden opportunity to really fill a gap in an area where there's a lot of people that need work force housing who are employed who could really use this help so my hope that those who oppose it for whatever reasons will understand that this is something that's really dire needed direly needed in our community and in the what specially insult my we i hope more will come forward in the future this could be to post a child this could be the example that we can do in other communities in the near future i hope that with this success that others could be brought forward and that we could get more affordable rentals and maybe doing the next step is affordable housing so that our residents can continue to live work and reach their family show that working people is what we're talking about right now and so it's my hope that jordan this will be the like to see more like this built but let's you're the first one done and let's see how it works out tha back to comment and thank you for your recommendation i know i know she's trying her hands up and saying come on let's do it let's let's have  have the use of rentals available for our families our money families and i'm sure the housing department can come in as to why the a submit at this as a for their  the more affordable rentals i mean i think we all had our entry level before we actually were able to buy buy a home we started of renting and  that's what we want for our young families and saw i stand in support of the we know we have some flaws and i just hope we will meet the residents concerns and how we can work together i can't pass up the opportunity to say how important this is today you know we talk a lot about affordable housing we talk about can being concerned about where people are living or where they're going to live but for us as a council the most important thing that we can do is to move projects forward and i totally totally understand and empathize with people that are concerned and have brought up their concerns and i feel a lot better about those concerns today after we've listened to some of the explanations this afternoon about the norse celt collector rude and about you know things that people care a whole lot about but i think we need to move forward you know the other thing is i want to caution the applicant that i want to see something happen i only have let's see three months more this year and twelve months next year we have like we have like fifteen months left mr victory you know and i own this console and i would certainly hope that this will move along reputably i certainly don't want to be here ten years from now and this will be something is sitting on  a shelf somewhere you know the need is imminent it's here it's now and so we're trying very hard to stretch to meet your needs and i hope that you reciprocate by keeping the faith and moving the project forward as quickly as you can and i understand quick in really in government time and quick in regular people's time is very different but let's do it in your time not in government time let this train get this done we need an example we need someone to show that it can be done and we need to be able to sure that the people that we're trying to help yes it can be done and we can do this so i'm going to be in support of this essentially because i want to move this forward and i want to see people moving into homes so we're going to rely on you and let's make our dreams come true for everybody thank you  water system development piece yes yes no i'm sorry i moved to remove number three i apologize i forgot about that thank you for reminding me second ok thank you and you for the discussion