bill actually two bills proposed by the planning director result conflict between the community plan and short term rental ordinance i would like to show the haiku and then there's two other kinds of permits you can get one of the bed and breakfast the other short term rental home the operational difference between the two the bed and breakfast the owner lives on the property and was a short term rental home owner does not live on the property that's the primary difference there is a number of differences in how the permits are processed cetera but that's the plans there was not however a very specific discussion on this particular policy within the community plan  so community plan says limit visitor accommodations to owner occupied bed and breakfast establishment that are residential in both scale and character and the proposed bed and breakfast should not be situated near the shoreline so avoid the proliferation of this use and subsequent changes to the character of the region's coast then we come up to a ninety five that was that was adopted as part of the community plan this ever specifically discussed was this particular passage in the community plan specifically discussed and did the council make a specific decision on  mind we couldn't find anywhere in the minutes where this was discussed so we're gone ok we have a conflict here and we need to resolve it so we came up with two bill and with the idea that either we're going to change the community plan to allow some short term rental homes or we're going to change the cap within the short term rental home bills to zero situation because the short term rental home ordinance was adopted in two thousand and twelve we consider that to be a more current policy and we would recommend changing the community plans to allow  cap and that would be in accordance with the community plan or change that change the change the cap we have a revised report in front of you today the last time we met on this was july twenty fifth and the commission's findings department great wanted to go out to the community and gather some input so we we went out to meeting we went to the town association on august twenty third two thousand and seventeen and a couple dozen people showed up at that meeting we also went out to the community association meeting on august twenty fourth and at that meeting about one hundred people showed up and it was so this question was lively a lot jobs change the character of the neighborhood contribute to the areas economy those kinds of things was a couple things that we did hear a lot was the protection of the shoreline  i mean that one part in the community plan that says to avoid the changes of the character of the shoreline that was very important to people so we xcept adding part of it except that permits may not be issued for shoreline properties that may affect the character of the nearby shoreline so that would go along with the cap change the character of the nearby shoreline and that's a that's a discretionary decision is a subjective decision but if you think about it is if you had a whole lot  second recommendation  there was also i would say there is also a lot of discussion about enforcement at both meetings hey you got to do more in forstmann on these things the so to the community plan we would propose to add the following sentence and say that illegal visitor accommodations can diminish the availability and affordability of housing for residents and should be subject to strict enforcement actions the exact wording of the stop now i think we would have more problems if we just let them disappear over time but i think the people who've gone through the through the legal process have the right to keep renewing we would support that going forward for easter at the end of the presentation all right so at this point we will open up the door for public testimony and after public testimony we'll take questions from the commissioners and discussion state your name and you'll have three minutes  community we say no more it is always a learning experience when given the opportunity to test on these issues before this board the ultimate goal is to be sure that the community has a voice especially a community plans that govern the rules and regulations of their district i want to mahalo this board for your commitment presented to you is two bills that was originally from the july twenty third in reading the memorandum this morning recommendations are kind of like different but i can only share the short term rental decision and i can only share that in the comments and the people that were there there were a majority short term rental people that were at that meeting and their decision collectively was to prohibit new short term rental we would renew the short term rentals that would be  so how you're going to collectively say that these people no longer can have shirked them until what you're presenting or your recommendation very very hard to do yes you do have one on the mountain on the hill doesn't bother anybody it comments from a young lady during that meeting said that planning to be part means a huge oversight as far as not as far as not apartment i urge you to look at the original recommendations do not allow eighty eight to be a cap to stick with the community plan said on the board so i was like the mediator i heard the high school one was really boisterous and we had fifty plus or more but majority of them to my amazement we didn't see too many brownies out there but they were short term rental people these are the people that hold short term rentals that we want this to be and if there's too many short term rentals they're crowding  i wasn't at the meeting assume there's a lot of people a lot of passion and i see two sentences and that's it after all of this was there a consensus that the i mean isn't that the meeting how do you feel they've got these two sentences with the meeting was it taken was there any kind of back and forth and agreement with the community or was it the plain department sort of absorbing what was what they felt they heard at that meeting planning department heads or what we have more than forty seven i can anyway but the consensus was hearing all of that yes staked out that this was a huge oversight and that they don't want to see any more short term until one gentleman says well i can't get my kids out of the house they're in their twenty's but there's no of bailable long term results or affordable housing for them to move to be in their area in p seven zero eight and i'm also treasurer of the haiku community association here to make a report both as a private citizen and also for the meeting circumstances that happened at our haiku community association meeting on august twenty fourth just for a point of reference we do not include a town in the haiku community association so we have enough trouble dealing with the citizens of this spring in the whole north shore at the meeting on august twenty fourth our mandate and our meeting agenda was to report on the request for feedback from you people regarding the short term rental housing question i'm here to report on what the sort of directors got as far as results were concerned from that meeting and also as a private citizen for my own recommendations i do not speak for the board on my recommendation there are about one hundred people people tend to come to those meetings with an idea of just expressing whatever is on their mind and unfortunately the leadership and the moderation of that meeting failed to kind of keep those voices in check permit limit option two is not to amend the community plan but to change the s t r age limit to no more than is currently part permitted i e forty seven units and no more there was a third option to do nothing and the votes voice vote were as follows to amend the plan to allow the current two thousand and twelve limits there are roughly twenty people who express their approval of that  option was to do nothing there was one vote for that as i stand here today david ross also took photographs of a display of three sign up sheets that we had for people to express themselves in writing i don't have that information in front of me lucianne is on the mainland and david is on vacation so i believe mr spence and others have said that the results are roughly the same i'm sorry to cap off i want to agree to option a to amend for the two thousand and twelve limits agree for stronger enforcement do not lower the s p r age kept a zero and meeting that we talked about earlier for the two of them with the preparation on the water as well as to the current recommendation as stated in the papers you have here before you if you are calling those the do not share personal is that what you grab from the meetings is a well as i said in my statement i feel that the meeting was roughly half and half from maintain the current limits at eighty eight per two thousand and twelve and amend the community plan or reduce the limits to the existing permit a number which is forty seven without amending the community plan from one thousand nine hundred those were the two options and a good morning sharing commissioner i come from a little different standpoint this morning than what you heard i am in favor to amend the haiku community plan in order to allow short term people haven vacation services says this business helps me to provide i'm a single parent help me to provide for my family as well as the numerous local businesses that are also  hired by us to do work for our rental so basically i just wanted to come by today just to humbly ask you to protect our life is industry of my neighbors that have gone through that process is that they are not the problem they're well managed well maintained and i just don't see a detriment to the community and the country i think that most of those what i'm saying is that the problem is the people who have gone through the process and are tearing to the rules the problem i think is that there are more illegal rentals than there are legal rentals i mean i really believe that in in all the talk of of what this is doing to the community i just i'm not seeing any evidence of that from people who have gone into the system i'm seeing them with people that are breaking the occasionally occupied incidentally which is what happened most of the year because the owners are all the people in their own communities in that they're primarily legal the case your mental relatively tiny portion of our community to start with as our housing stock and then the ones that could possibly be uses long term rentals i think is even much much more a question thank you good morning everyone my name is adrienne tom i am fifth generation portugese my great grandfather came to hama in eighteen eighties and lived in a grass shack  managed to learn fishing and hunting with the one hand and he managed to mate or purchase a hundred acres of land for a hundred dollars and this is the beginning of my legacy  of hours and dollars my daughter and i through fighting and crying i decided that getting this permit would be the future for my two grandsons we literally spent i cannot begin to tell you the amount of time and hours that it took to get this permit and then after getting the permit my daughter decided that she really needed my help and i was to helping raise the grandkids so i actually paid the taxes which is six thousand six hundred dollars a year because i am now a commercial property so that i could spend the time with my grandchildren and just recently i started running my vacation rental i have to compete with illegals i cannot begin to tell you with the instant booking on on the sites that allow you to book your properties what the illegals do is they go on there and they list themselves like today and they do instant booking and instant instant booking does is complete the price will go up and it will go down and if i am not competing with the people who are not paying the soon to be thirteen point nine percent taxes not paying insurance not paying the property taxes they can every almost every single time they can get the booking and this is the problem that we're begging for those of us that are legal i cannot begin to tell you how many people i personally know that are illegal that are telling me that i am stupid to have gotten my license they're laughing in my face because i went and got a license ok now that i've said that i want to tell you that i've had people from japan china mexico germany switzerland and presently yesterday three construction guys checked in they're working at the airport i do all my own cleaning i do all my own yard work this is this was done for my grandchildren and i can tell you this land has been in my family since one nine hundred fifty and we're not going anywhere and the experiences the people get when they come to my house is level a hat with a skirt i plan on trying to do a  bit so that we can do cooking underground i plan to if it happens i plan to build a holiday so they can experience true hawaiian state my father planted avocado trees an orange trees there's tons of fruit they love it when it comes and they give them the ok and to conclude i say if you want to go after the illegals get a bond go online book the site and then ask them for their license here there's no one else signed up so anyone else wishing to testify at this time please come forward reeling and i live on oil and one of those in between years we've been working on getting our license for for seven years now and we're not we haven't quite got it we're this close and looking at  rules that you guys we knew when we when we started this that since there was an eighty eight cap and we knew that there was a chance that it could be done or that that could be over by the time without a license and we chose to do it anyway we've got all well over ten thousand dollars  improvements we've had to do the property to be able to make it so that it's been business b and b ready and after going to that much effort to think that we could be shut down now because you draw the line at only those that are that are existing seems unfair on the on a personal standpoint but on on the bigger standpoint eighty eight is still very very few for all of the north shore we used to come to why it is just a visitor we've been your one seven years now and as a visitor the first time we came here it was in the line area and we didn't come back for years to didn't do anything for us however when i discovered the north shore that was white that was the real that was the real experience and that's the type of people that we attract are the people that don't necessarily want to be over in the big vacation areas that are for looking for that type of experience and i think the benefit to why to be able to give it to them so my strong import would be my neighbor's property rather than on mine and each of those things we'd find out not all there is all these mix ups we find out we go we want to get this one thing the issues and then would be after that ok we're done went out to the lady who just was here because i cannot tell you how hard i worked to get this license and how proud i was to have this license and i'm still proud but sometimes  this day and completely self sustainable and my guests come they not just coming to want to experience what it means to be connected to a lion nature they have to go t some teaching they have to learn how to treat my and my chickens because as chickens running around they have to learn how to conserve electricity because i have to create it myself when they leave they leave with a kind of a feeling while i was in tune with nature what is important to me that i have to stay here again and fear about a new rule could come in and i get forced to sell what i have  a year this hardship my husband is turning seventy if i have to sell the land because i could not continue you know what i have to sell it to somebody who's very rich because now how i know everybody could afford it because i need to leave somewhere else and not somebody come and take steps could care as i do with organic planting teaching people and have truly the love of hosting people come where they get something about as well aloha spirit so i really hope that i don't have to come again and testify coming out of fear that you would cancel because i co the ones who do not pay the taxes the ones who are illegal yes they need to be looked at thank you and thank you for all the work you do and i hope th two thousand and eleven so as you can guess from the range of those dates that was a sort of fairly interesting process we have worked very very hard to become legal and we take a great deal of pride in the fact that we please be fair to those who have always tried to be lawful and comply i was interested because i went to both the meeting and the haiku meeting the meeting was beautifully run and with a great deal of courtesy and respect to all obviously there was a concern for illegals that is the main thing that is on people's mind the definition of near the  shoreline should be clearly defined as in the community plan so there is not a great area anymore in the haiku community association meeting which i really thought i was sort of in charlottesville it was  where they were saying that they would tin thousand illegal vacation rentals in hawaii and i was curious as to where that number was coming from because i need some research a couple of years ago because i am legal and i wouldn't know who my opposition was  i came up with a maximum of between one and two thousand illegal they cation rentals so when you hear that they get ten thousand i wouldn't take it very seriously it includes condos amongst other things it's not a thoroughly researched figure so if you're getting plan in sync and be reasonable so everybody is treated with respect thank you very much and the question thank you very much thank you anyone else wishing to testify on the side of the state your name you'll have three minutes thank you my name is molly steele guess i don't own short term vacation rentals i am a long term value resident in the long term renter on the north shore i work on the north shore self employed or working for people who manage both short term became rentals and long term rentals so i see very much both sides i do handyman services i check people in i do all sorts of a variety of work and i see the people i meet the people that come here to come to the north shore as someone else greatly stated that it's the most fabulous part of our island i believe that's why i live there and that's why i love it but i just want to say that as a collaboration for all issue as it is there's problems with short term vacation rentals but those are the fewer problems as a like i said as a renter on the north shore the way the availability for rental all the people that work like myself and want to live there is a big problem in itself i can go to one house and what neighborhood where we do have a legal short term vacation rental check with people in go around the corner to another house where we have a long term rental there's twelve thirteen people living in this house and there's cars parked everywhere and there's it's an amazing thing it has definitely more of an impact on the community than the short term vacation rentals so i would say  big picture listening to everyone and seeing what what the solution is it has to be a collaboration so the short term vacation rental people have to take some accountability for the people like myself that work and have to have a place to live as well and those long term renters need to be reasonable with rents or there needs to be some kind of control on affordable housing for those of us that work for a living and make it a collaboration somehow i mean the short term vacation rentals definitely aren't impacting i don't believe impacting the north shore because i think they are doing absolutely the best they can and keeping their property in the best shape and controlling parking situations and all sorts of things so i would say overall it would be nice to see some sort of collaboration between each and obviously the illegals are a factor in that as well but overall house commissioners my name is katherine clarke and i'm a board member of the maui vacation meanless of the asian i want to be sure that we're not confusing two issues the first being a small number of highly regulated short term rentals and the second being the permanent unregulated operators today we're here to discuss the regulated industry and a potential amendment to the haiku community plan that would align this document reflects current and anticipated conditions in the haiku region and advance of planning goals objectives policies and implementation considerations to guide decision making in the region through the year twenty ten but now we're in twenty seven teams so it could be argued that his plan is not as relevant as it was even seven years ago so many things have changed including the way that people travel when the bed and breakfast and short term rental home ordinances were crafted there was significant community outreach and many meetings in council chambers there were many opportunities for community members to come forth to express support or concern and many took that opportunity to let their voices be heard one of the concerns was proliferation and the community plan caps were imposed to be certain that this was tightly controlled from baldwin beach to way low and up throughout haiku the total number of short term rental homes that can be permitted is eighty eight this control is necessary to limit impact to housing and to address character of la long term lodging for local residents an important issue but many of these properties are occupied by the owners for several months each year so it would never become long term rental is demand there will be supply acting legal rentals the legal market will simply explode operating without the rules imposed on the short term i encourage you to amend the community plan to what happened and the meeting was held much like this one was right here everyone got their say and i think that the views that you just saw presented a preppie pretty accurate to what happened in the meeting there were many people saying leave the ability for legal short term rentals to exist and there were many people talking about the illegals and the problems that that come about as a result of very moment that there was a presentation from the board if you will that went on and on and it went on to the point that people just left the meeting before the presentation was even over and then when the comment period started  diverted to whole other issues issues of wind sovereignty issues of roads having so forth and really nothing good discussion came out of out of that part of the but i think that you've gotten a feel from the testimony up to this point as to what was presented about the now the intent of the community plan i believe was upheld by both the bed and breakfast ordinance and by the short term reynold ordinance that came later ordinances did a couple things they ensured control on the permit is legal operations and they also limited them and that was the key thing about the shoreline picture that if we allow these the whole shoreline is going to be nothing but short term reynolds well with or without the ordinance most of the shoreline is indeed owned by people who don't live in those homes that's just a fact the reality is with or without a permit ing system there's going to be short term rentals on the north shore the idea that the community plan says we shouldn't have them or should have them is really not going to make a difference as to whether they exist the question is do we want to regulate them in some way and the short term rental ordinance attempts to do that you folks are a big part of that because you see these when they come by particularly ag districts and we ensure that the agricultural uses are in place when there's notices going on in this conflict that was occurring according to those to anyone its objectives and policies are to prohibit hotel resort development within the region the community plans for a prohibition against hotel transients vacation accommodation conflicts conflicts with the county's ordinance involving proving that t v are not a county code or the bt county country town of business district by eight members of the county council and signed by the mer in two thousand and fourteen p c t s intent and purposes include preserving and maintaining the country town atmosphere and establishing a means of implementing various provisions of the community located in the south and west and west maui it was never intended to prohibit small transients accommodations such as those currently permitted by the p c t ordinance into a commercial district for up to twelve rooms for further  properties known p c t be one and b two the bt allowance is an outright use approvable administratively without neighbor notification community input access or i believe the best place for small of this amendment will fulfill the purposes and intent of the community plan i believe that the intent of passing the t v or use in the business district was allow some relief to two residential areas by providing two yars in the areas that are already commercial in nature and provide some economic diversity in the small towns i requested the director amend the proposed proposal to the county council regarding an s c r h issue to also include the t v are shore but i want to say i don't think that the forty seven legal homes that have been permitted are what's creating the problem at all and i don't think that if there were eighty eight it would be what's creating that problem i actually think that the permitted number of eight homes is quite low for a realistic balance in the community as far as how many visitors want to stay there and what it could support in a balanced way i am also a junior architect and i work in this industry d problem one of the problems that i see that i think might be very helpful in rectifying the challenges between the code is clarifying the definition right now a hotel resort is basically defined exactly the same as a transient vacation rental in the code and to me those just are not the same thing you know the grand is not the same thing as you know a four room transit be cation rental on the north shore so i would encourage that to be looked at as a possibility  other thing that i you know i just want to mention as you know as an architect i've worked in other states as well and with the one difference that i see in maui county and i've worked in new york and seattle is that a lot of the code here is very subjective which makes the permitting process very lengthy and more challenging for people trying to pursue permits so the language that was recommended here today for the shoreline i think to me that's just a completely subjective code and to me i feel like code should be black and white so that you know when your community members are coming to get their permits they understand what what's allowable what's not allowable and the property owner isn't faced with  subjectivity of the community and of everyone weighing in you know it should be every everyone in our community should be treated equally and the code should support an equal treatment for everyone in our community so i just want to show that thank you  that morning mission is now back in session we are ready to entertain questions and discussions from the commissioner on the agenda item not discussing regulated part of this industry today which i admit is a huge issue and we are taking steps and audrey   we are taking steps towards improving the council put some money in our budget this year to look at hiring a contractor to he bill it was derived from a study that was done some years earlier where the rock the study roughly identified there's probably so many in these different areas we're talking let me start with alliteration cliff aeration meet on rapid increase in numbers so that the definition where we choose to take a definition out of the dictionary or we decide to make up our own diction our own  recommendation for a couple of choices but is it do you want us to just think about those two things that we want to tweak or is or do we have war or levity to broaden it as with any recommendation make to the commission and these are recommendations we back in july we made a recommendation for a police commission select one of these  because to me that's a difference in my eyes  the community plans in my opinion are in the way that the departments and the way the corporation council has always these are guidelines there in that case as a force in effect in so many discretionary there are there's also requirements that permits in order to be granted must comply with the  this particular policy was not addressed to the degree that it should have either by the department or by the us we're gone a discriminatory practice that should be addressed if anything else it should be looked upon as a designated area where it could be spread out money trying to get it legally done and here we have the go on that are getting by and i think if anything else the county council should definitely address how we can because i think that there could be an argument made that properties on the shoreline should be the multimillion dollar billion dollar mansion that sits on the beach it's never going to be  we have an issue with losing access to the beaches yes we do absolutely but that's an unfortunate thing that's not a vacation rental thing so there can be that argument made do i think that we should amend this unfortunate but it's going to be in the eyes of whoever has to make that decision at that time i think that it's important to the community but i think that whoever's making that decision is going to have to make that determination at the time and i do like your example i think i would like to back up to what we are here and we're here it's planning planning you have zoning zoning you have residential hotel t v our you have different you plan different things to be in different areas and every time much shorter rental comes to us is always asking for an exception it would need an exception it was in a t v nobody's against vacation rentals tourism tax dollars or tourist it's zoning it's it's people want to plan and have a vision for a certain area and things change it change from ninety five to two ten but then from and through when they start discussing it and then now with beach change from two ten to twenty seventeen nobody had an idea of the amount of of the lack of lack of accountability people have in the county of maui in the state in the nation where they do illegal things and laugh at people's face the complicity of people working for you legal operations and just you know it's it's not to grandstand but it's that euros you know what our community stands for and our community is d for short term rentals now we've allowed permits we're going to have to decide how we deal with those permits we don't i don't think legally one shoe people invest money in we're going to go to court but i think the normal ways if it does go one way people be able to use a permit to expire and then they may not be renewed i don't think anybody's looking at trying to hurt anybody who came to do a permit in fact if they're coming from this border they got a permit you've had the majority approval of the commissioner saying we like what you're doing we'd like your permit and here's a license and thank you for coming but to have to have so many operations that are illegal to grant permits for illegal ones when we haven't fixed a problem ahead of time  it's a quandary that i don't know how we as a planning commission ten can give a recommendation to a consul who has who has a little bit different view than they did two years ago or five years ago and legally we have to still follow what the legal parts of what we're supposed to do which goes back to zoning which goes back to the community plan and we can recommend to not follow the law but that's hard for me to say it's hard to say i want to disregard the law and disregard what  all our commissions are consuls our legislatures have done since we've become a state and now i think it's bad and i want to start changing i think that there is a process which is the council that things can do it and recommendation i don't see me going what is the twenty first amendment to the u s constitution twenty first amendment to the u s constitution and i answer my own question is the only amendment to the u s constitution that repeals another amendment it repeals the eighteenth amendment the eighteenth amendment prohibition just not going to have still going to happen we do have an illegal issue we do have an enforcement issue absolutely so we have a discrepancy to me this isn't that hard it's like ok we either change the community plan there is a law that says we can change the community plan the county council does the only ones that can do that so we can just make a recommendation and they don't have to listen to it they can say you know i pound sense and say now you me i think that we need to have a law in place to make these things legal so we can regulate them there's a gentleman says it took him seventy seven years in the process right now he's got to fix all kinds of stuff with his property he could have been making money for seven so to me it's just let's let's give people the opportunity to be able to do it right to be able to be legal and i'll get off my soapbox and so what i feel like i'm hearing with that except maybe it should should say except that new permits after the forty seven or something except the permits may not be issued for shoreline properties that may affect the character of the nearby shore so we would have to do that evaluation on a case by case basis on each application as it comes in to say this may or may not affect the character of the nearby so again we were changing our recommendation from offering that property and option my my feeling towards the number is i could support that but i feel that there is a an unbalanced amount of rental properties permanent rental properties and compared to the vast amount of land regulated side we're talking about i think we should strongly recommend to the county council that they look at the enforcement side because that has been a major problem so then why don't we take the same exact verbiage from the one does it say the same thing the other one says should not be situated near the shoreline so as to avoid liberation and this one says not the issue for the shoreline properties  into any new bed in breakfast or short term rental homes should not the situation should not be situated near the shoreline as to avoid the political ration of these uses and subsequent changes in the character of the and then it doesn't resolve the whole enforcement thing but there is since this is such a this is an ongoing issue with these types of uses we're proposing t the sentence at the end illegal visitor accommodations can diminish the availability and affordability of housing for residents and should be subject to strict enforcement act that would be new and we would roughly draw a line so looking at the second sentence in the community plan any proposed new bed and breakfast homes or short term rentals should not be situated near the shoreline if it causes  be situated near the shoreline and then and then i guess my question is why wouldn't we just take that sentence and put that in after eighty eight because now suddenly then we have normally they will send us a link sometimes not they'll just say my neighbor is doing this so then we have to go through the task of identifying exactly where this property is and who is the owner sometimes that's easy sometimes very difficult once we identify the owner we will send him or her for the entity a notice of warning where we give them and this is by our administrative rules we give them an opportunity to voluntarily shut down and sometimes they do and sometimes they don't or sometimes we'll take their of short term rental homes for sick people and then when when once we if you violations again a good portion of people will shut down demand that's all it is it's not good guys against bad guys this is just a reality and if we had ten thousand more homes i think we'd have three thousand to four thousand more cation rentals but as far as enforcement goes i think we can look at the state department live as we wish to operate a four bedroom short term at a home in one dwelling that sits on seven thousand five hundred thirty five square feet in line a application of before you today because there are at least two other s here each is within five hundred feet of the proposed  so you can see it's on a short cul de sac of homes there's beach access to baby beach in that area and then the street is actually very heavily used by beach goers this is a front elevation of the bringing you into the great room those stairs lead up stairs to several of the bedrooms there's one bedroom on the main floor that's the entry to the home and this is the family room  of the kitchen and this is their dining and again looking towards the entry kitchen this is the first bedroom this is on the main floor and better number t of course are the bedrooms have the required textures everything you can see there one of them on the wall there and that's all been properly inspected bedroom number three and this is the master bedroom of their home they have a small and in the back renting a private pool in the backyard and this would be the side of the home we have a s plan here that illustrates that they have on site the easily park for cars and that's in excess of the required amount of parking and i have some photos that a little straight  a little bit better but the cul de sac in this area is all marked and painted red and there are signs that say no parking that's for the fire trucks to be able to turn around in the cul de sac and for terminals there would be a strict prohibition from parking on the street is short term metal were approved and it's in addition to that it's marked red so that they wouldn't park out there we have a main floor plan of the home the second floor which is predominantly the bedrooms so nineteen point six five point zero three zero and sort of lays out nine items the code should be reviewed relative to this application to decide whether it should be granted a permit the first item relates to homeowners associations approval of that use there's no homeowners association or governing board on type ali so this one wouldn't apply to us the second is the existing land use entitlements and uses poly has been a small enclave of luxury homes since it was developed many of these homes have been second homes or traditionally vacation rentals back in the day before it was sort of the unregulated west but they've always been second homes for the most part at this time according to the assessor's rez records six of the eight properties on type ali are file and owners and i took a slice of the neighborhood around it and i have a map that illustrates this thirty two of the forty five lots in the area are off site ownership neighborhood anyway i would submit that second homes frequently function similarly to church terminals in the sense that you have people come in for a short period of time they tend to carry the same hours as  and that kind of thing and tend to be significantly more compatible than say a working class neighborhood where people need to get up at six o'clock and make it to work by the eight o'clock the proposal is consistent with the on the side of the home away from view of the public in the street they have standard county rubbish service so it's not into stated that this would create any particular issues if anything less rather should be generated i think as the home is intermittently used and this criteria the number of permitted church and rental homes surrounding the proposed short term rental and the distance from their property i think is i'm assuming would be the area of the most oversight in this in this one there are several well managed short term rental homes that are approved on  and i would submit for your consideration that just does it make sense to cluster the hotels and kaanapali and mccann of that area it does make sense in certain instances to close for short term rental and this i would argue is a neighborhood where that makes sense because as short term or as second homes these homes are having people coming in and leaving frequently it's just family and friends or business associates those tend to carry the same hours they tend to stay up late or maybe wake up a little later except for when they go for the sunrise and so it would be less disruptive to the neighborhood as a whole to have short term and this kind of a neighborhood than say a working class neighborhood or that sort of thing as i mentioned the parking would be all onsite it would be off peak  from typical working class neighborhoods and all of these homes whether they're second homes or short term rentals typically employ a good number of local folks to do their landscaping housekeeping maintenance and that sort of thing the colors didn't come out very well on this one all of these colors was intended to be yellow yellow on my screen those are properties the locks in this area are in ownership and the ones that you see that are white are folks that receive their tax bill at that address and those would clearly be local  owner occupied properties the gray ones are in trusts and their mailing goes to post office boxes so it's a little undetermined but one could assume that those are owner occupied as well the these color all multifamily rentals and as i'm sure you're all familiar call home a village is now taking off and they'll be bringing two hundred three units i think it is affordable housing to the area and as it relates to affordable housing too i would submit for your consideration that these homes are in the million plus dollar range on chi poly and whether they're second homes or short term rentals these are the ones we need to concern ourselves with displaced worker housing unfortunately in the area we're seeing new development of work or housing providing that need for us sixteen percent of the lots in this area are multifamily and like i said thirteen percent car owner occupied single family homes so i feel like this is a particular area where this kind of use and  clustering of a few short terminals is appropriate it wouldn't be appropriate say my neighborhood where people are going to work in the morning and raising their kids or walking to school and that kind of thing the code dictates that you should also consider the nub number and substance of protest letters to the short term rental i had only received one when it was up until this morning letter and that owner had submitted this letter as concerns were related to parking on the street which can be a challenge on chi poly primarily because that's where most people go to park and then go down to baby beach or kitty beach and so i don't believe that this application would contribute to that problem number one because the cul de sac that it's on is already painted red and has a sign saying no parking and  fact the owner has served on the board before that road maintenance because it's a private road and they work with the fire department to paint those curbs red to keep folks from parking in front of it so that is an area of concern and we certainly have rules that would prevent her in on the street as well and then the density of short term rentals in the area and as i mention the code is not specific about whether density is good or bad it just prompts addition the need for additional review which i think is prudent and i would argue in this area that it is appropriate this is a copy of his letter the second letter that was just given to me this morning really talks about so this is a letter that is concerned about traffic and the number of short term miles in the area the the resident who sent this  so it's not interested that this home would have any impact on her traffic over here for reference the the other petitioner that was opposed that home is right  here inside of a condo complex of multiple homes five of which are currently listed for available for short term rental it's not clear to me whether the objection was to competition or there's just too many in the area there are no r f s complaints on the home and there's no known noncompliance with government regulations and so with that as i mentioned that like to be brief some available for any questions or clarification that you may have we respectfully request approval of this short term rental home permit this leave us have owned a home for over twenty years now it's their desire to keep the home and use it for a good portion of the year they and their families and friends but also have the opportunity to rent get really short because they're coming up for lunch and i know you're all hungry like many others who testify when re mention to our friends manager neighbors that was going to get a permit they laughed at our face they said that we shouldn't do that they're not going to get it is not the right thing to do to keep the house running three years later and many many thousand dollars later for you there we decided to painted red because we wanted to give the fight if after meeting with the fire department we wanted to give on the ball for them to do a complete turnaround rather do a three point turn around they recommended that we do that so we took the occasionally let people park in our driveway especially people with kids because they can walk from far away and don't get in line a we needed a certain distance to make a complete turnaround and collectively we decided that we were paying one side so we had that distance required for the fire truck to turn around  so to get the turn around we took the one side of the called the sac from here actually from here around to their gate and painted the dread this state you can park this gave us the distance required and then yet there's another application that says that they were printed short term rent on they want to be charged for three years tax they had a notice of warning in two thousand and fourteen for advertising in their home so they did come in during the amnesty period and they paid back taxes and they had to submit documentation that i have in my file so were you the one that r s s for the did the research for the say that the property was listed for sale and  application for a short term mental work to pull one way only if you can't get the application because we can't really afford to keep it if you can rent it so that's why it was for sale and then the advertisement that was for rent it was hijacked from us and our pictures and our home and we don't even know who was advertising for rent we had to i don't know what my wife did something she pulled to get him to take it down otherwise we had nothing to do with it what is your asking price for your property two point i think we just reduced it to a while back two point one thank you  twice once for the short term in a home application and more recently for this here each application public hearing as a result of the notice in process two letters the protests are received about the numbers of in the vicinity all of the requests for service filed with the department are closed and there are no police complaints the department would like the my planning commission to decide whether to approve or deny the permit the department's not making any recommendation either way at this time should the committee commission approve the permit the department would recommend approval subject to the twenty two standard conditions and the department would also recommend that the my planning commission adopt the planning department's report the recommendation prepared for the september twenty sixth two thousand and seventeen meeting as i just i look at the the the number in this little neighborhood is turning into really just vacation rental and i also appreciate his comments where he criteria and everything which we would normally just go ok great serial we can come to you with a recommendation for approval in this case it's not a reflection on the applicants so much as it is the changing character of the neighborhood at least in observation so we certainly respect the opinion of the commission more modern i think this is a but it's example of a cluster on the shoreline which i think is even though it's a different lake subject but this is what the problem is but i do agree that if groups were going to choose areas we call it i'd like to say surf mala but i'm not good enough leashes so i'd have to leave but this particular neighborhood you know it when we talk about changing the character  b located at two hundred two forty north pole in cairo in haiku wagner recently purchased fifty percent of the property from the dish yours and had an agreement has an agreement to eventually purchase the remaining fifty percent of the property by issue and i get what you're saying but i mean we're looking at the legality of this now just an end around way of people being able to transfer  you can transfer as you are going to see over the years conditions of permit the way that they are specifically written will change  i went to get a permit and will spence was my planner we were both young then are may not live on site ok but then they came up with a new thing called a b and b and i was told that the t v our was going to be taken away you apply for the b and b now because the t v are no longer going to be renewed so i applied to be in the in two thousand and nine and i got it and then in two thousand and twelve when i came up for renewal well by then my husband had this blood disease that he needed treatment at the university of washington where you take blood and he was going to have a stroke and there's no treatment or now it so when we moved to washington seattle for much treatment for my husband blood disorder and i asked the department i asked i forget his name the deputy director at the time i said clayton yoshida i said clinton what am i should do i've been putting a lot of money into this place my sweat and blood and i mean i painted every wall and planted every tree i'm not giving it up but we have i can live in maui full time so he said i said why can't i have my t v are back you guys took away my t v are you said it was going to be no longer given but everybody else is renewing the t v are as a why why why did i not why was i given wrong advice by my my planner who is no longer in the county he doesn't work for the county my plan or he quit i say why were they given wrong advice that i shouldn't renew my t v are good go for  no one answered that no one can answer that so then clayton your she does that well get you caretaker on your property title and who lives on maori maori resident and you get  its own i mean peoples and the people we get are people coming from mainland that their child is having a child you know grandparents and there's not enough room for them it's affordable you know it's not fancy it's kind of that it's i mean i could i don't pitchers i didn't have never hired an attorney or a consultant for anything there was i mean i always went to the county and they helped me never had  just keep on going because it was unfairly taken away my t v are i mean all the other people that got the t v are at the time i got are still going like oprah winfrey got a t v are at you're you're growing your business by bringing an investor in is that what i'm hearing and not well yeah i do is going to be improvements made investor if it is if your business is this property is a is a is a commercial business and you bring an investor in for fifty percent of your investment i mean of your company that's correct and this investors are also going to live on the property to to keep your b and b but i'm saying it's you also have an option to go for short term rental where you don't need anybody to live on the property but that's a long drawn out process and we have to shut down and since i'll be operating for nineteen years with the perm past year i went to a life change and i nearly died in and this is i cannot do too much work anymore one person and put in another person but you were always only e same case in the ownership of the property and the business or just the business itself  permits are supposed to be sold this becomes a commercial i'm just not here her story and i understand she's got some bad advice somewhere from somebody who is no longer around and i think the two percent plus a circumvention of our loss to try to make sure that i've been be somebody that's always on property renting i think the rage would have been the way to go i still think it's the way to go but when we start we start adding people o fifty percent with hundreds of thousands of dollars values selling the business to just the property which means reselling the permit and one thing i know that was never the intention is these permits are never to be sold it ha s to be individual owner to come and apply for it there might be a short lapse of time between applying for a permit and getting a permanent forty that's just the cost of doing business but i think if  want to buy the property if you want to sell the property buy it i'll sell it on a company going to permit and i don't see a reason why they wouldn't get a permit from us because the thirty fall in other rules or regulations and have a good a good a good record you i'm i'm going to agree with commissioner robinson on this one in that i appreciate the troubles that you've been through in the struggles of life and said this is sort of a circumvention i also think this is precedent setting for us as a commission you know and i don't want to make this too heavy in whatever but if we suddenly say like you know what if they come to us specially firm and we were ok with it we're going to have permission of the commission to change the ownership of that permit it's also not unusual for what you're doing at least for the special use permit this year amending a condition  amendments to conditions early regularly with time extensions those kinds of things permit amendments are not unusual this is just one that is an amended is a qualification for a construction site that the follow certain things on the matter who it is all in the same rules and it is commercial this is a whole new residence that became commercial and they follow certain rules and lots of time for this still have my approval that i can appreciate the distinction between a larger housing project and whatever the case may be both of them are and i do sympathize that the process has changed over time and it sounds like our applicant has made every effort to comply every time we're going to break for lunch we will reconvene at one fifteen works requesting comments on the draft environmental assessment for the proposed replacement project for three one in the parcel three four three two portion of parcel twenty three and portion of director corporation council my name is james planner with the planning department the project is known as the pili culverts replacement project it's located on lower  up in the pili and the project is coming to you in the draft environmental assessment stage manager i'd like to provide a few opening remarks turn it over to glen  geraldo who's representing public works on this project to describe the project briefly and the objective here today is to gain your comments for the draft environmental assessment my role is to capture those shoreline but it is five hundred fifty six hundred feet on a major gulch that connects the major watershed to the p t bay directly and there are condos between the bay along the gulf edge and lower on the p e line the road it is an intermittent stream with drainage control upstream as i said in the watershed it is a public works project and although it's basically repaired in replacement it is a major undertaking with significant mitigation built into it in order to improve the drainage system in the area the project evaluation is three point two one million dollars and it is as i said it's a very important project to move to move forward so any additions to the e a and he could comment mitigation that you can think of add in after the presentation would be great so the major reason the planning department and public works and public works department are bringing this project forward to you for comment is because the project will when it is constructed has very high visibility in the area to complete the culver replacement project public works must close down lower homotopy lining road for probably two months so there's going to be a major traffic disruption and if you know the area there and we'll show you pictures of it so the lower road service is many condos in the area and the main impact from the project probably will be this traffic diversion and budget so it will be highly visible so we want to make sure we get it in front of you guys are today so this is this opportunity today just provides  another public review education outreach for the public with your input it's an additional step in a more extensive education outreach process that will be undertaken with public works with the local community up there and besides the sum a assessment there are also federal and state permit that are required and the planning department has full confidence that the project will be fully through the permit process very familiar with the project site and to depart from the department's initial analysis the project improves the drainage system significantly so those are my opening remarks and with the cheers permission all turn it over to the len rivera to present the project three summary of the project ok thanks and i will turn it back over to you thank  the department of public works is proposing is the proposing in determining agency for the representing public works today is mr to count all the civil engineers for the project are with clue chapter three forty three environmental review process was triggered as this was a county project which involved the county right of way as well as state owned land  drafty a was prepared in order to analyze all the potential impacts of the project as well as mitigation measures for the for the proposed actions a number of technical studies were carried out with respect to water quality biological species cultural impacts and archaeology as part of the draft today and this led to an anticipated finding of no significant impact when the document was published in march of this year and at this point the draft da has undergone agency review and public review and based on a request from the planning department we're requesting review by the commission as well in this aerial map you can see the location and the surrounding areas surrounding uses its back from the purely bay is jim suggested about five hundred fifty feet at its closest point and malka of the project area is the drainage area with a drainage basin structure the department of public works determined that the culverts which as we said passed under the roadway are in a deteriorating condition and that erosion is causing undermining of the embankment below the roadway and to address these these issues the department of public works propose a replacement of the culvert structures with some configuration reconfiguration of the design which will improve the drainage properties and flow conditions to minimize the incidence of future erosion and damage this will involve grading and stabilization of the drainage channel it will involve some roadway improvements currently the traffic lean over the culverts is narrow and it creates a situation where pedestrians and vehicles are trying to cross safely in the same narrow space there'll be some improvements and a sidewalk added which will help address that situation as a improve safety issue the project will also involve some rerouting of the drainage channel i'm sorry during the duration of construction the lines to provide some further information on the proposed project and its technical aspects i will now ask mandy site to step up and address the commission slide shows the existing condition of the cover this is a downstream view of the outlet looking malka there's roughly a twenty foot drop from the outlet to the existing ground level the car the vehicle needs to shift towards the opposite lane to allow the position to cross that you could see the roadways certainly too narrow on the right here shows the overview of the road where clear section as you can see there's no safe routes on either side of the roadway and there is an adequate shoulder with basic project objectives while incorporating the community's concerns by minimizing the amount of concrete within the stream or the channel sorry to provide more of a natural  is no longer the drop and then regrading the upstream side of to accommodate the elevation change in general this is the proposed design it resulted in a combination of various alternatives to the constraints which includes shallow drop in that located here and regarding the channel to accommodate a twenty foot elevation change this is the general plan where the orientation is a little different from the size that we've seen previously the  these features include a vegetative channel stabilisation rate here as you can see and also a vegetated articulating a concrete opens lock that channel reinforcement  also on the outlet side we are doing located along the side and this side of the pre calc walls will minimize curing and provide better construction sequencing for the contractor  so this is a bunch of sections of the channel and the cover the top section shows the four section of the channel including the roadway  safety concerns the next section in the middle shows a section of the articulated concrete open that it's basically a view from the inlet side looking towards mci so the color is not coming out that great but i think up in red is the vertebra which is the head was and you can see the concrete the cover the protest over and then the articulated that extends up to the green section the bottom section also shows the typical china section of the  next over the construction consideration construction and basically take an estimated six to nine months generally the construction sequencing would include installing the bypass  the drain drainage in my then regrade the market channel and install the vegetative channel civilization and reinforcing and finally install planting and open the road  for traffic management the contractor will notify the public and the surrounding businesses through the media such as a newspaper or radio there also be adequate signage along the highway and deter routes to direct traffic project so during construction the following best manages management practices will be installed to mitigate the project impacts a permeable which guard will be placed along the channel of the guard will use water truck for dust control and to minimize emissions of dust to the surrounding properties after construction the contractor will install permanent acquirements an addition to chapter three forty three environmental review the project will be undergoing a number of other permitting processes which i can touch upon here starting with special management area requirements  project is located within the estimate we do know that most of the proposed actions are repair and maintenance type actions which could be considered exempt from development category or since work is proposed within the stream or the drainage channel the army corps of engineers has reviewed the project for potential impacts to u s waters and they determine that an appeal a four five goals is the water of the u s and is under jurisdiction of the court and the project qualifies for one of their nationwide permits categories in the area of maintenance so that permit will be that  application will be prepared and submitted the project will undergo review for a few additional permits section one zero six compliance which relates to historic or cultural resources that would be reviewed by the state preservation officer section for one water quality certification is a federal requirement along with the section one hundred six this is triggered by the corps of engineers jurisdiction over the project area the water quality certification that is subject to review by the state of art of health clean water branch stream channel alteration permit will be applied  for the state department of land in natural resources and county permits will also be required for grading and grabbing and work and county highways community outreach program has been implemented  to provide information about the project and solicit feedback from the public and interested parties this has included a meeting and ongoing coordination with an appeal e bay and beach foundation  community meeting was conducted in august of this year in the pili and another community meeting is to be held to provided additional updates prior to the start of construction so to summarize today the department of public works is requesting the commission's review and comments on the project draft environmental assessment following this the next step w be the publication of the final environmental assessment followed by the additional federal state and county permits which apply to the project so i thank you for your consideration and we would now be happy to take questions and comments the what was happening with the existing cover the flows were overtopping the road because of the elevation was a lot higher so with that we're enforced this portion to accommodate the elevation drop in erosion before and how far i can remember what you called the grouted whatever was on the on the outlet side how far is that going to go from the roadway or the bridge least i mean i'm not an engineer but i would think the water will be going faster than it is currently goes through the culvert and then on the other side i'm also going to make an assumption and maybe i'm wrong that when they built that bridge originally it didn't have a drop it was probably all like we're making it now and just over the course of time the water you rode it on the mackay side and that's how we ended up with a twenty foot drop because you end up with a ten foot drop which turns into twelve which turns into sixteen and i was twenty so i guess my question is as we an engineer but i'm just thinking are we going to have to mitigate that i can explain that i'm going to go back to slide with the section here as you can see this is about forty four f three about four percent at the most and here it's fifteen percent so it's there's a vertical scale to it so it's probably five times the vertical so the water has about forty feet to slow down so that's what decisions here and change your plans i'm just telling you what it is and i look at this i think about that and also when you go to the aerial of this  and now it's going to be i believe ten by five by five so it's going to be a larger so by doing that and also described in the a major we can do that excellent question the second one from mr carter charlie explain how the whole system slows down the water into that in that project there and  then actually those are the two main comments that we discussed i will add kind of one as to clarify here i think something that  farther upstream because of the four five colbert and then go through the valve and then go down into the system so there's a secondary slowdown of major water coming down so i think it's all calculated in but i think what we'll do is we'll add in we'll be able to add in drawings that show the complete system the water flows through here at photos and the explanation of the water channel all the way throughout the channel to include the diesel t based so if you like i can include that i think that would help clarify some of your issues i would thank you i would like to add one other thing because susan berger who is from what is it  e o s who is a consultant that you guys hired basically she doesn't see any problem unless a large storm happens during construction so i would just add that we build this during the non rainy season i know you said six to nine months but that's a fifty percent swing in timeline but maybe do it during the summer doing some time when we're not anticipating a storm excellent question and will capture that we have communicated with the condos there through the feelie foundation that's kind of a consortium of the condos and talked about when their best time is i mean shutting down they shutdown but only on that portion of the culvert you know that was shown on the map it's not their entire lore it's just that one question because they need to be able to actually get in there to do the construction sell but yes highway division on all of this so that is a major thank you for that comment so on to that and so we have those basically those four comments turned back over to  second december thirteenth twenty six meeting as well as the thirteenth july eleventh and august twenty second twenty seventh meeting portions of the regular minutes of the feb twenty eight hundred twenty seven and portions of the july need about fifty percent of them which is fourteen to fifteen sales to go to construction so that's why we're asking for this extension i personally would like to review it as i don't know anything about it whatsoever i would be in favor respectfully of a review of this project just so i can come up t for the sake of discussion  i understand where you're coming from i do get that for me i wasn't here for that particular project when it came before this commission what i'm going to where i'm kind market actually a combination of our price point is going to be from the high four hundred to five hundred so that's the kind of that since there is enough time would be nice to be able to understand what we're approving what we're not approving and right now i have no idea what's being approved or not being approved so that's why i respectfully request seen every things and money is being spent we just got to get on the ball and get some of the money people on it and that was because there was somebody from every single i mean every single department it was only the times when there was somebody from every single department there was a maori person up there that was twice and so all of the presentation