grand you might be on mute mr the ground wait wait wait well once there's circumstantial evidence i'm a realist you're kind of getting the point that you know when when jones says this is the guy you know in the hospital room that's of course pretty impressive testimony but there is other circumstantial evidence that links  mr goodloe to this shooting the clothing that he's wearing where he's located and the fact that there are alternative explanations doesn't mean that a trier of fact couldn't accept the state's account of this he's wearing you know the black could he's got a jacket over it i will note that if you look at up it was quite cold that night in chicago it was nine degrees or so but there the point being that there's circumstantial evidence so even non testable the guy's lying there in the cart and not probably thinking about what's going to happen in court some day but where's that where's the harm well i think there's no was an on going emergency when they present titian or at the back in his st argument is that the threat of the shooter on the loose was over prestige it was already just that argument assumes that police actually knew that fission ribs shooter and least didn't know that entirely reasonable for the police not to consider the threat of a shooter on the loose if over a just because they found someone who matches the somewhat general description exact role you have to consider the scope d of the threat they were facing and and here we  as there as here the police didn't know if the shooting was part of a private dispute between the shooter and jones or all they knew the shooter was on his way back to his job was offered to open fire on the paramedics years wanted to be on his way to the next target on this list  fisher's nd arguments is that regardless of what jones had said from the back of the indians there was no possibility of an ongoing emergency because the show identification of the ambulance was twenty five let however long i mean i wonder you know i suppose hypothetically every criminal case it's ever been started maybe it was somebody else involved you know do we just keep these things open forever no and you're  before at a different location and this report had no difficulty at all finding that the threat from the shooter at large in public was still ongoing so whatever the period is after which the threat of a live shooter dis and the emergency ems know that twenty five minutes is not that period and certainly the only public it was not a reasonable under these facts and circumstance just a formality that would alert him to the fact he was responding to we all as detectives rather than st responders can i ask you a quick question about these three witnesses that he feels would have really made the difference i mean surely if the jury had heard testimony from other people that you know this is the neighborhood that low lives and he's dropping off you know see young and he's these otherwise innocently around there wouldn't it have been possible for the jury to have said look they just rob the st guy that they saw the zillion people where black could ease in chicago on days that it's frigid  and but you know having other witnesses is not the same thing as conveying one's own view so why isn't this a prejudicial  he lies about his name to the police and his right hand test positive for gunshot did they test his hand right there at that moment for the residue and i believe it was subsequently return policy but certainly under these facts it's not objectively on reasonable we're the only power courts find that there was trial that fischer never told about any of these women's only trouble about a different witness who he didn't know her last name and hamilton phone number so none of these witnesses were ever brought to counsel's attention there's even potential for those reasons and the reasons  discharging a firearm connection with the death of mr jones so they acquitted him of personally shooting mr jones and edward logons did say that he did not see mr goodloe at the scene mrs lovett her testimony changed so many times it was difficult to witnesses they were identified in the police reports but then also on the state's witness list so surely council had a duty to investigate potential witnesses who were going to just very quickly on the confrontation clause issues i would know that it sounds like we agree that the court improperly considered hindsight as part of its analysis and it is true they also said that the police couldn't you know were one hundred percent sure that they had gotten the right now if that is the victim have seen no treatment and there was no suspect in custody and counsel mention that in that case it was twenty five minutes time limit or time gap but it's not the time that matters a conduct during that time here we know for sure that the police officers detained apprehended put in handcuffs mr goodloe brought him to the see if they believe there was an ongoing emergency it would have been exposing him to it there's going to be no reason to believe they would do that all of the court has any other all right well thank you very much to both counsel and mr le grand i believe that you took this case for the court and we appreciate your health to the court and to your client in the