moment of silence for the tragedy that unfolded last night in las vegas our sympathies go out to the many victims their families and friends and we commend the heroic actions and courage of the first responders thank you like to welcome everyone to tonight's select board meeting and remind you to sign it if you haven't already i think many of you did so thank you and if you could put your in exchange what they ask for under the memorandum of agreement is for us to try to get people to sign up with the fish and see vermont and and collect their information that they basically name an address to give to efficiency vermont so there's a there are legal obligations in the document frankly i do not think of the town's lawyer but reviewing it i think it's questionable enforceability but i'd i don't want to go out in front of that and sign on behalf of the town without checking either with the town manager first or with the collectibles so i thought i would bring it out but i think it goes a little bit more broadly to what types of things should we are we ok to maybe consult with the town manager or consult with a select four before we  press to have been making real progress because we have we now have a committee that has will clearly have a quorum and we've got good agenda items but we also don't want to get out ahead of our city ok and how is it time sensitive it is because only they'll only allow efficiency to model only allow certain number of communities or organizations to join and they've been pushing up for us to join and i sort of see it as a as a first effort for us to sort of galvanize our resources and attention try to get a facebook page up start using the term on the energy tracker which allows us to get a lot of it collect a lot of information about what people are doing effectively and also helping promote either businesses in essex or businesses who operate in essex to try to improve efficiency salvia coles i think so our next meeting is on the fourteenth is that too late you know that might be a little too late that's neighbor who runs a boarding house next door to me the tenants are still there and they smoke every fifteen minutes three of them and the smoke is coming from my house that has not been resolved this is still a problem i'm told that he has asked these people leave they will not leave me while the smoke is coming in and not only is it smoke but they doing this are all hours of the day and night from the morning until three in the morning while they are doing it to throwing garbage on the ground the garbage keeps coming on to my property whether it be cigarette butts candy wrappers stuff like that so there's a health issue involved in this they're using their phones and making noise at all hours of the day and night and it's just pretty disgusting i shouldn't have to do deal with this i am asking this board to give me some relief from this in the form of an ordinance that requires one hundred fifty foot spacing from my premises to wherever they're going to smoke if they want to smoke in my house their house fine i don't have a problem with that but they're going to smoke outside i want that space so i don't have to deal with the smoke the noise and the dirt reasonable like if you want to smoke smoke inside your house do not smoke outside because you cannot control that smoke that smoke comes in my garage comes in my house who is protecting my health and we've had this discussion and before the these people choose not to be cooperative they've been asked to go to the other side of the property they do not do this ok so we have tried this it doesn't work we need to step this up to something different so again even on private property telling people they can't smoke within one hundred fifty feet of their property well we have ordinances that says people can't burn fires on their property unless certain conditions are met when you're smoking that's like burning a fire it produces smoke it produces on healthy effects that affect other people and because this is done a lot you know we're not talking about that once in a while they go out every fifteen to twenty minutes there's at least three different people doing this and then they are other activities going along with this that are disturbing and it is not working ok i would love for it to work it has not work we need to step it up to something else the landlord tells me that his lease says there is to be no smoking on the premises whatsoever and they do what they please so so we both have problems with  when the wind's blowing where you are but the prevailing winds are out of the northwest which is blowing right towards my door so on as far as the other issues with trash as i've been over there i probably did five or six  found that there have been problems between smokers and nonsmokers across property lines usually involves renters but sometimes it involves homeowners and in general i mean there is no real clear cut way to follow this but in general when courts have to decide they generally decide in favor of the nonsmoker that's what was clearly indicated in some of the things i looked up the other piece of this is even with these tenants who we don't know if he's ever going to get these people out of what the story is he tells me that they're not supposed to be smoking at all he he he allows them to smoke outside but they basically don't listen to him at all anymore he did tell them the smoke in a certain spot and they basically go wherever they please you know sit in the driveways in the and their driveways twenty feet from my house so that kind of things as far as the dirt in the garbage it's a problem of candy wrappers every day candy wrappers blowing over there the landlord said he had a problem a hole in the garbage can but why is this hole only allowing candy wrappers to get out you know these are the obvious questions and i ask i can also tell you that  in this past winter i basically caught about six to seven different mice in the house in the last thirty five years i have never caught that many over the thirty five years so is this have something to do with them well i don't know usually it does that's the kind of thing so now the other question is are we making a enforceable ordinance will who's going to fight it are they going to take it the court orders i mean if we if we put this ordinance through you know and why shouldn't we be trendsetters why must we be the followers we have a problem this is the way we're going to fix it maybe this is something that other municipalities may want to consider is that don't people have the right to get clean air in their own homes so we've seen since they discuss with the board level and see what those options are which ones we might be able to pursue that could help the transit come of was the manager me speaking easy if your first it hasn't been tested by the courts and so therefore you would be the first one that tested and been quite first thank you for wanting to volunteer in our community on the essex energy committee and if you could just give us a little bit of your background of who you are and what your interest is for being appointed to the energy committee so i'm speaking main this is the big room  have spent a life time being in love with this beautiful earth and for i grew up in a home where conservation and sustainable practices were part of the fabric of our life so it's a it's a way that i've lived for a very long time and i'm very passionate about the so i guess i came you know given my much more advanced age i came to this  passion for not overusing but trying to be as sustainable renewable as possible through through an entire lifetime that blessing and that's never left me and given the states the challenges i think the at least the science seems to be very clear around the additional challenges we're experiencing with climate change etc i realized well i want to say david and i david b my husband realized when we moved to vermont which was two years ago that we needed that just working on the micro level  in our own home was insufficient if we are in love with this place and this planet and we have the time and the energy then we need to be working at the systems level so feel like i'm sitting up very tall here yes i usually do anyway but anyway so that is i'm not sure with that the answer to your question that's that's the how and the why of it yes what brought me here ok and  entire career but i'm much newer to that to the understanding of how important that i can't just david and me working on this that our house is wildly insufficient at this point and so the s six energy committee was the perfect opportunity to try to participate in positive things and provide some leadership in the community and then advance even that the state level for us to become the can't give you an exact number but i say my last one was number six or so yes six six or yes i'd say six and i didn't eat yes i've been a six letter they're very active already ok yes that true well since you've been here long it would it help me maybe this question will come up and i know you have many things on your agenda but the piece i didn't say is that i'm a very active member of three fifty four ma and i have a leadership position in in the burlington know and have had a leadership position for many months now in terms of supporting their campaigns to promote alternatives and a set everything i was just talking about the sustainable so i have and have a great deal of reading that i've done as well in these areas yes and have fairly knowledgeable about some of the legislative initiatives and some of the science behind things like that or the other questions from the board so needless to say you know when the meetings are held and i do have time for them  night and have a discussion that come out and make a decision then somebody from the manager's office will give you a call tomorrow to let you know excellent so one of the again thank you so much for i wanted to step forward and and and volunteer on the committee hello david if you would like to join us at that table over there with the microphone thank you so much for wanting to volunteer and be appointed to the energy committee if you could give us a little bit about your background and what your interest in wanting to be appointed to the energy committee background how far back you go whatever you're comfortable  worked all my life but i'm retired worked in a variety of things and the reason i would want to be a member would be to assist my community and being and the number of meanings i believe yes i have i've been to at least two my memory serves me well thank you ok so you obviously know what day they meet yes i do yes i do yeah and my yes it is absolutely and i have i have the time to do it to you so i can i can definitely be a contributor and not simply someone who shows up  session at the end of the meeting tonight have a discussion come out make a decision with you from the managers or contact you tomorrow urgent thank you so much step forward in our community and volunteer like this  then to the next item of business which is business five b it's an update on the essex town center of the next town center planning project then tonight we have dana to kick that off and she has some guests and  power point right ok so why don't you come up to the table there will be great to have you by the microphone make sure scott gets you and everybody can see what's going o was to update in one nine hundred ninety one town center master so twenty five years later it would come a little bit stale and had not had really stood the test of time given certain regional market forces and demand for housing and number of things what we want to do with the town center because it's it's one of three areas designated for growth  what we want to do are and going into this was to bring the town center alive and into the twenty first century so we hired the se group out of burlington and jason hoover is one of our all stars on the group he's an essex resident and we've been pretty hard at work with the se groups and some sometime in last winter we formed a steering committee to act as a sounding board as this project went on the steering committee has important stakeholders and residents we want to get a broad representation in a diverse selection of people and appearance then we did a survey and that was really great because four hundred people responded to it and so we got a pretty good sense of where people are in this community about what they want to see in the town center and jason is going to address that when he gets into his presentation and the next thing up for us is an open house on october eighteenth here and any one day  so we're really looking forward to a good turnout there still left to do is drafting the implementing regulations and we are meeting with sharon murray who is part of the se group team tomorrow saf is to start talking about how do you translate a lot of data gathering a lot of mapping and a lot of resident input into a regulatory program that is going to meet the needs of the town for maybe the next twenty five years in our town center which is our growth area so what does this look like what form to do we want do we go up do we go out  this is all left in the hands of the community members we're listening and we're trying to translate what we're hearing in these different settings into what is going to be a guiding document for some years to come then we are going to start the regulatory phase of it and the planning commission will be highly involved in that have its work sessions have its hearings as required under the statute and then we will go before you this the regulatory phase will start sometime in the near i don't know when exactly it's going be no come to you but it will be sometime in two thousand and eighteen i would hope and that's really that's where the rubber meets the road so we're going to be cited to bring the implementation process forward to you so with that i will turn every jason great thanks dana so i have a series of slides to go through that hopefully would just give everybody a general sense of the project its history where we have been some of the thinking and concepts we've heard from the community and sort of draft versions of what the what the console team has come up with what i think he is today and where we're going to go from here please feel free to jump in at any point if you have any to reimagine the six town center and the focus of our work is very community based so this entire process in set up to get as much community input in many different formats as we can it's not really going to be a successful outcome successful solution you won't really get to what issues are if you don't give the community is an opportunity to listen and to comment on what their thoughts are and what their feelings are and what their experiences are so that's a that's a core part of what this process we're going through is the community involved all the way through so point for our evaluation of this project what has been successful in the ninety one plan what hasn't worked so well try to figure out why it has worked so well and where do we go forward from here to reimagine town center so the first step is to assess what's happened what works what doesn't as i just said i'm trying to understand the influences document the pattern of where we started from where we are today and where we want to go you to have a process by which we want to explore some of those parameters to address the goal of the community to find out what the goals of the community are for those goals and we're going to go through the vision in process reimagine what that ninety nine hundred ninety one plan is what it wants to be and come up with a new to give you an overall sense of what the timeline is when we started this project in the end of two thousand and sixteen that a gathering we did syndrome work as you know mentioned the fly the whole entire area review the regulations took a look at the plans you know where we were how things would have what happened with the ninety one plan why didn't meet its goal we then the stablished the steering committee and that's a committee that we meet with on a regular basis to help several times since then early june to early july put out a of a survey they mentioned we got an incredible response to that survey i think there were actually four hundred one or responses communities really involved in this process process they have a lot to say and we have a lot of listen so from that survey again we data we we gather some data we've done some internal thinking as far as the consultant goes we've met with the steering committee several times since then and we're getting ready for the next public workshop which is going to occur on october eighteenth and that again will be in this room it's going to be a span people come and go and sort of put their schedule once we've gotten through that process public workshop will take that information with us to the media a couple more times and we'll come up with a draft plan which is the written version of what we think were analysis as well as the graphic of the master plan architectural care for some of the other ones of this master plan process that we're going out of that draft plan that will help us come up with a regulatory toolkit we like to call it bring the final plan i confront of this group of like sign that's the general time so as i said the first processed first public process we went through was the focus group on may twentieth the basic notion of that focus group was asked two questions e t c today and e c t tomorrow easy today is what works today so there were a couple of sort of overriding comments that came out of that focus group it was a smaller group it was a really nice saturday the weather was great so those are not the best days to kind of have a you know for public input that likes to be outside not inside talking about things like this but so the e t c d c t today basically we ask questions about how does it work today how do you feel about today for retail residential recreation  commercial transportation circulation testing connectivity you can see i've sort of highlighted some of the higher the some of the finer points the the bigger bill of points of the responses and all of those are these improvements for the overriding theme of e t c today was seen to be shopping in entertainment history rock fifteen should be a traffic or lot of traffic go through that section of town and keep traffic going although there was some caviar that a lot of individuals feel like independent input into the survey and with the side that analyzed it i believe it's a hundred fifty two hundred page document in minutes there's a lot of information there all of this is available on the web site i believe so we are currently in the process of just to help explain where we are what we consider the e t c the bigger square bassline work indicates our study area  where we zero in with greater color is what was originally seen to be the as extern center so you can see it included in the the golden triangle all the way you have old stage road hours road fifteen the two residential neighborhoods the sort of book and the golden triangle are indicated in yellow school with the historic district which exists on the east end of fifteen of the four corners intersection we consider there to be a transitional neighborhood in between historic district and what i'm here is called new town center and then we have of course the the new town center which is the outlets  there's corner some of the residential stuff units on the side of the way so we're actually challenging the notion of or the this this dredge the breadth of the t c and actually since this drawing is was created were for changing the boundaries again and will probably change a little bit more as we refine the process going forward but basically what you can see is we're we're thinking the town centers are route so you can see the from the previous plan the sort districts a little bit bigger and actually what we're thinking now is the historic district grows a little bit further west along fifteen to just on the east side of the high stuff or shopping center so we're in the process of sort of the further sort of refining in defining what those of those neighborhoods are there's an overall vision for the town center of this as draft stamped all over because we're still having conversations internally with ourselves  e three different options for the overall vision statement for the town center the first one would center around there is a mix you grow center some other detail in there but just the basics of it is number one is so then we taken it a step further and again as i mentioned we have the three really three districts the three neighborhoods the transitional neighborhood the historic neighborhood and then we sort of stumble over yes it's town center in town center district we've renamed the town center district as the mixed use center neighborhood just so we do some of that confusion and that mixed use center neighborhood is really the area we're talking about around the ses outlets  as identified in the focus groups recreational access to recreation trails multi use bike past earth of great importance to this project into the community so we're exploring how those connections happen within all of the her neighborhood within the town center how does open space get incorporated into the town plan how was it there access what happens along the route fifteen cord or from a pedestrian pas switches think vital process there's the flyer there's the next plug that's the october eighteenth we're going to start to get into architectural character something everybody loves to talk about is architectur and what things look like both from a residential standpoint mixed use commercial retail lots of things to talk about what's next following that so we have the october eighteenth workshop will meet with a select  this project so they're not actually stock or potential consultant team member women lanphier there will be with us here on the october eighteenth the image on the left is actually only five stories it's not six the ground floor on a little bit the last part of this is what is the pounds for role and what is a select force role going forward so there are certainly some things to talk about from an infrastructure improvement standpoint water and sewer parking and the other infrastructure example is when we examine the town centers address and there's like a rate residential phasing program that's impose on it if we end up going for a dance or town center or a taller town center so that we sprawl out then we would have to make changes to the residence of hazing so that might be a part of our regulatory package that we hadn't really conceived of before but we don't know we don't you know the town isn't exactly saying you know we want to go up but as planners and consultants we want to really flesh this out thoroughly because the town also says we don't want sprawl we don't want to see growth spreading out from our town center into our rural and conservation areas so that's sort of a dichotomy in a process like this and we have to tread the line because we're hearing two different things from the community no sprawl but junk up in our town center so that's why you have  that that package we're going to add on some things that have been our in our list for a while you know administrative things housekeeping that we as in a straight hours have been we really need to accomplish and a few other things but we don't want to wear eight way this thing down because we wanted to go out there we want don't want to have a bunch of other kind potentially controversial dani amendments they could c will be in the ordinance changes but it might not be all you have on your plate or not our plate is very big so they selected pieces from that yeah i mean our plates is going to take years we have a lot of stuff having to do with the protection of our forestry resources perhaps revisiting the conservation so division design process we've got a lot of energy planning to do we've got housing to do we've got all sorts of stuff there is literally going to take us years but the next round of regulatory man in them is going to be this project with a few more things tacked on that we really need to just get out of the way that's you any other questions for dinner yes ok thank you for taking us through that and giving us an update as to where you are and we look forward to a water model that was developed from back in history i guess i did some in college but they're all done by hand in fact there's a common test in the p e licenses to give a simple model because as one of these in order of things we had to keep working around to funny get area we knew we had some situations over there where we had the need for increased fire flow because it is one of the growth areas of town it is one of the larger industrial ports of the town in terms of the businesses there and probably we will not too far from now will come to the board on which is to increase the water line in the fort to provide the additional fire pressure and the model helped us decide among a bunch of alternatives where was the best place to put a larger pipe to service that area at the least cost and so on air and i made a conscious decision about two years ago to basically model the rest of the town the upper area as a separate water district in the lower area based on pressure and where they get where we get our water from and  look at that upper area we had identified any significant problems we do know that and i think dana knows this the town center area has it's one of those areas that's relatively high compared to where our tanks are which  the lower pressure area it's not a low pressure is just lower than the rest of town if you down by river road we have more pressure than we ever want to use you go up into town and found center it's normal you get up to the area around the four corners the pressure start to drop off and so the question becomes one of having a model of a level that we could calibrate which we've done we had the same firm perform the service for  factors of pipes and dimensions of pipes to see if you have a model that can predict that if i went to another hydro we had tested what would def low be and so we've been able to do that so we have a calibrated model it's cost important enough i'm most every new develop the comes in the door specially the larger ones especially the industrial sites in saxon hill and town center you know if you were to go to mostly stories whatever you need to have an idea what what the impact is and a lot of times the impact of a high flyer flow in one part of town is not obvious because it may in fact be sufficient in that area and you may find a short distance away that your pressure is deficient because of the fact that you're going so much water out of the system at that point so we believe that we want to utilize this and i most every case of the major develops a commune we're not going to it for single house or you know couple inside vision flexible we think it needs to be run so that we can in fact i have the results of that in our hands because there's no single engineering from that is model the whole town so they're going to give us a model of the impact of a development on the immediate area but it's really not what's the impact on the entire system and we need to know that because like i say sometimes it surprises you again i'll use an example and susan wilson road area one of the areas that has low pressure over there is up on the high point  elevation you're building your site and then we would run the model and we would know what the impact of that is directly without having to rely on a third party consult providers information that we may or may not know they run an accurate model  and i'm engineer i trust engineers but i trust a model we've run better than a model that someone else may have or to be quite honest so what we thought we an appropriate way to go about this was to identify criteria when we would use the model we listed for a developer that requires the addition or extension or just feed units for water infrastructure we're going to add another subdivisions additional pipes that should be modeled that's pretty easy to  flow we want to obviously run it there and then we may come about that there may be an inkling on our part that the model needs to be run because of our knowledge of the system that maybe another party might not have because we deal with all the time so those are kind of the four criteria but we will essentially set up to fee the first one would be a base fee which is never going to pay back the cost involved in the model that would help recruit some of those costs and then the second part of the fee is a pass through cost to run the model we've actually signed a contract and we were going to do this whether we collect the fear or not because i think it's the right direction to go we sign a retainer contract with any to run the model and they've indicated that the maximum they would charge would be seven hundred fifty dollars a large project a small project it may be as low as a couple hundred dollars so to go with that if a developer came in and wanted identify one to go through the process we would run the model but charge them in the cost of range probably from a low of five hundred dollars to a high of a thousand for a larger project i don't believe any engineering firm can develop a water model anywhere near those kind of costs and so we've already absorbed those costs but i think there should be a charge for us running that and that's why we come to  you sometimes the state may command when they review a project record fifty that might say we want some additional modeling we would be glad to do that but that would be a separate charge this is kind of the baseline to say we're ok in terms of reviews we're ok in terms of approvals those kind of things so the way we were to this was that we requested the slick would approve the water model and the and design criteria i do not have a problem with the board wants to think about this and have us come back but i think it's a good way to proceed i believe under the current regulations the planning commission has the ability to charge a fee for review we have not really done that but we can and this would fit into that process so it's not like we're creating a new model we just haven't used the model that's been in place probably ever since i've been here we've absorbed all those review costs this is the start i think of trying to get some of those costs back we're in a way that we feel feelings are what we can and i don't think that's the case i think that it probably comes back i mean some cases we've identified potential difference between three and four i know in the through for end of the last catch all kind of like you know other work is required if for was out of there we could work with the first three fine because i think i was going to cover ninety nine percent of the situation hydrants we also do pressure tests and we always flush the same hydrant i was we try to flush the dead ends and all those kind of things so we we continually develop flow one hundred data every deposits in the pipes are piping system is not other than those old metal pipes and a lot of those are actually older service connections in the four you're not going to see a large a to ration will we continue to do it to run a check in a model yes   i think they're good they would be happy with it because in this it relieves almost every project major project comes up we're asking the question you know what's the impact what's the flow what's the pressure what's going to be impact and then we're back with them sometimes saying you need to look at a little larger area than just the exact the surrounding pipes and justice just have an engineer sit down and run even a simple model this is the cheaper version it's actually going to save the money over the long run and it looks like the the larger project it would most would be about a thousand yeah i would we're not trying to make money off of us we're trying to recoup some but i think the indication is that allows us to numerous times with regard to approval of projects in terms of appropriate feet could be charged for new developer for sidewalk construction do you provide do you require a feed  require them to actually put a sidewalk in the required just right of way and it's going back and forth and i have to be honest i don't think that in the approvals of with gone through we've always been consistent across the board so we wanted to try we came to the board with a whole bunch of requests for the regional planning commission for the work plan one of which was to look at the sidewalk impact the have c c r p c go out and funded study to look at that and come great good clarification my name is jonathan slice in on the project manager and also the technical lead my team in aristide's we completed this sidewalk impact the and when i say sidewalk it is actually a sidewalk and a shared use path it would be something within the public right of way so it's not a recreation path in the recreation areas so that is what we're focusing in brian davis is here from the regional planning commission they have funded this study with them with the local match from the from the town of e so i the few slides here just to go through the general process i want to be somewhat brief i know you have a long meeting and save some time first questions there's a report that you should have sorry for all of you in the report that you should have goes into a lot more detail in terms of how the numbers were derived the purpose of this presentation is to give you a little bit of context and to let see if we can get some feedback on some of the values that we've tried to determine  which really is up to the town to select a way forward now the town has already impact fees so i may not have to go into this level of detail but it's within your your statute your rights you have a capital impact or human capital improvement plan and these projects would be stipulated within that if we select which projects to go forward in but you've been running an impact fee and and he would follow the same administration protocols that you currently have and greg as a point of no we did maybe not finalized but it amend an existing ordinance for the recreation impact fee which i do have and discussed in this presentation but we were going shared use paths were a bit of a it wasn't clear whether the recreation impact fee covered shared use paths or not and what we did it says explicitly remove that element out of the fee value and then recalculate that the net impact fee for the recreation impact fee and so that now is set  of it was a ordinance that the town should be able to now adopt and we rolled in the shared use paths into this project into a separate impact  the general procedure for developing impact be as follows this this simplistic table which is that we identify the facilities affected by growth the underlying assumption there is that you where there is growth and that growth would require additional infrastructure and additional services by the town then we identify the particular capital projects that should be funded by impact fees that would be funded by that new development and then we would develop a formula to compute the impact  and then lastly adopt a few ordinance and we're at the point today where we have developed a formula we have a range of fever al use for you to consider and lastly is that the ordinance would be a simplistic that we've already crafted that the content of it it would be determining a fee value and set up some of the waivers and exemptions that that may be applied political as greg stated this is follow on to a comprehensive bicycle pedestrian plan of both the village and the town carried out and again as a funded study locally from the town and the regional planning commission and that was wrapped up in adopted in late two thousand and fourteen this plan provided a comprehensive review of the future growth of the existing needs and future needs that the that the town and i'm really going to talk about just the town now that the town would have going forward and we've been also separated the bicycle piece out of this and only looking at the pedestrian component so looking at the first box that we have going forward is that the growth we've participated in a planning study that's been carried out at the regional planning commission and looking at population growth as well as employment growth within every municipality in the county including the town and the village of essex and we've determined that an approximate growth rate of point five five percent annual average rate would result in a net gain of approximately six hundred new residents over the next ten year horizon on average fifty nine to sixty residents per year would be expected into the town itself then moving quickly into the non residential space we went into this with an assumption that the fee would be imposed on both residential and nonresidential uses it became a logical question trying to understand who uses sidewalks why did they use them and it was determined that in this basis we have a formula that i'll show in just a minute that we try to work out the percentage of use within nonresidential versus residential so going forward with the assumption that we would have nonresidential users participate in this impact fee we had to get an idea of the growth rate in nonresidential square footage developing impact fees you typically develop them on a on a unit that is quite standard and easy to calculate and not subject to a lot of variation within within projects and so the square footage number for a non residential use was preferred that that aligns well with trip generation estimates often water and employees are also somewhat related to the square footage of particular land uses that this chart here shows the hockey stick if you will and it for the most recent years in the town we see that there's clearly been a significant increase in nonresidential permits that have been applied for in the town and actual space constructed we envision that that will moderate and we've selected a ten year rolling median this is what this chart represents and then we've also looked at the forecast in terms of the employment for the next ten twenty years in the town from the regional planning commission and we've determined that the basis of about ninety eight thousand square feet per year would be an appropriate number to base the growth on and that would result in somewhere about fourteen hundred new employees over the next ten years it's a sizable number the regional planning commission demographic forecast result in about nineteen hundred workers over the next ten years for both the village and the town so the town is taking up the majority of that estimate and from the conversations that we've had on the project committee that that made sense given the amount of land area and the industrial uses and some of the land development potential of the town has when we look at the growth we net result in about six hundred new of residents and fourteen hundred new employees from that we look at developing an impact one of the say first the bike and head plan gave us the foundation in which we felt comfortable developing a multi modal and non roadway based or somewhat a nontraditional impact but it's a sidewalk and sidewalks now have been given the full legitimacy of capacity and transportation capacity in the eyes of  legislature and so we have more and more we're seeing sidewalks and multi modal paths come up within impact fees the bike impaired plant gave us that foundation to identify that there would be a need in the future and they created a list of projects that we were looking at investigating and when we are selecting which projects might be eligible for this particular impact be the first thing that we need to check women developing impact fees those that the growth would demand some of those additional services or the additional capacity of the sidewalks this table not going to go into it in detail but the orange rows there the orange numbers gives us these standards of service or levels of service that for sidewalks it's not a absolute science or at least agreed upon standard of service such as pressure or or something on a water line unfortunately so we've we've looked at miles of sidewalk and shared use paths per one hundred bedrooms and we've looked at also miles per for thousand square feet of non residential space as well as miles per employees and in all of the metrics that we've used is that if we just continue on our current capital funding trajectory we're not going to keep up by maintaining that same miles per unit as growth happens within the town so we're expecting that residential development continues non residential development continues and if we are only putting in the amount of money that we have today allocated to sidewalks we're simply not going to be a little forward to build the amount of sidewalk linear feet that that population would we deserve based on their current expectations are standards as of today so this is the first check in that provides us a logic if you will to say we need more infrastructure and then it creates that nexus for impact fees to say that growth should pay for some of that new capacity so that we can maintain a standard going out to the future now going into the project selection is that the project that plan identified over twenty projects that might be relevant for the town with a pedestrian focus we narrow that down we looked at really what would be a possible construction horizon within ten or fifteen year period and the reason why a ten or fifteen years that impact fees have to be expended on a project within six years of collection and so what this gives us is that we would expect to initiate some projects sooner and then we would anticipate some projects at the end of that six years would just be starting on kind of that ten year project if you will because you're allowed to pay for pulmonary design and engineering and the initial phases of projects this table gives you a snapshot and will go into more detail later but we have fifteen projects that have arisen from a prioritization process that was also carried out within this study fifteen projects of pedestrian projects that we identified would be eligible for impact fees it's unlikely that you know horizon of a ten year plan such as this that we'd be able to financially afford or physically construct fifteen projects and therefore we've kind of focused on maybe between five and ten projects might be more realistic and trying to develop an impact fee to initiate those top five or ten projects what this table shows is that the total cost as well as the local match that would be used which is comprised of our dedicated capital spending spending stream which is forty thousand dollars budgeted per year on sidewalks as well as then any impact the dollars that would go into those projects that's with a cumulative matches and then those of the human have miles of new projects that would be added to the existing mileage this table i'm not going to go project by project but these are our top ten projects that were selected based on the master by compared plan and then prioritized within the study this priorities a process was was done with the project steering committee it tried to account for safety connectivity and as well as construction feasibility which also had a cost component to it to develop a total score it's somewhat outside of the focus while the actual project is important when we come down to it we're trying to identify mileage as well as what total fever alue we think that we should we can afford and so what we recommend is that this project list gets identified in the ordinance and say up to this amount of money and up to the because at the end of the day dennis needs flexibility the term in which sidewalk project might be the most appropriate to fund at any particular year and so we would recommend is that this list meet maintained and then we should identify then which project would be funded on any particular year and so this this prior ization process is just helpful but it gives us kind of the top down if you will that no more than ten projects would be funded probably by impact fees that's that's the focus of this fee we're doing a cost per thousand square feet and how we got there is that we identified what percentage of the sidewalk capacity is associated with residential uses versus nonresidential uses and it uses this typical to process idea and which we understand the magnitude of growth which is six sixty percent to seventy percent nonresidential and thirty percent residential and then we made an assumption based on their degree of usage and we said residential users they have seven days a week and potentially we don't know who's who's home and who's not we set up to for twenty four hours they could be using the sidewalk versus the nonresidential users we said they're there for five days on typical and a typical working eight hour working day and so then that way we came up with a weighted average that on the end at the end of the funding we're putting sixty four percent of the sidewalk on residential fees for says six thirty six percent on nonresidential as we said the residential unit is bedrooms i first mentioned six hundred people population new pricing what what's the connection there we did do in an essay investigation that's in the report in terms of understanding people per household the number of bedrooms for household and trying to trajectory and it's been a recent average that we felt comfortable extending into the future approximately one hundred twenty three bedrooms per year is the is the median number that have been constructed of last five years and we continue that up to the future based on the number of bedrooms per household as well as the number of households per year being developed and the population we've kind of fact checked all those different numbers to feel comfortable that the number of bedrooms that were arriving at about one hundred twenty three per year aligns well with that sixty residents per year that's been on average is that we're building more bedrooms then and residence that's been the typical pattern the nonresidential square footage we've broken this into five key land uses a combination purposes which are all your hotels and short term stays commercial which is all your professional offices as any any other professional yes industrial uses a pretty standard there the k through twelve is private and public schools and retail uses and what we've done there is understand the typical square footage that's associated per employee in the different land uses and we understand their current employment numbers and that we have an idea then of how many new employees we have and we've broken them up into those different sectors and we're applying a nonresidential fee across two or treating all nonresidential equally if you will a combination makes as much sidewalk use as an industrial use however in this table what we show is that a commercial use is one hundred sixty percent more intense than your current average non residential building so i apologise if we can go into more detail in question of this i don't want to belabor this table there is more and more description in the report i want to kind of get to the next table which is the more worthy of consideration but the last thing i will say about this use is that this is a standard procedure for nonresidential uses is that some residential uses have less intensity in terms of employees per square footage than others and so a fee that would be assessed to an on residential use it would be hopefully more fair based on the appropriate degree of the impact and that's what we're really focusing on in these is maintaining that connection this table here is kind of where we want to have a discussion and where they select board needs to reflect as well as we're going to meeting with the planning commission and then we have the top five through ten projects as well as all fifteen on this table in the different columns and then as we come down this we see the total project cost and then we start getting down to how much money is out of that total project cost attributed to growth and that local impact the amount that's that fourth line on that table then we take that thirty six sixty four split and we apply it to residential versus nonresidential that's what you see below the residential line and the nonresidential we see the different total impact fee dollars associate the different uses and that row seven i guess it is or six the sidewalk fee per bedroom that's kind of the end story if you will if we look at impact fees and how it would affect residential development going in this in the town what this table orients here is that if we funded the top five projects every bedroom would be charged one hundred six dollars impact fee versus if we funded all the top ten it would be charged four hundred seventy dollars her bedroom that's that range of values for the impact fees the nonresidential side follows that same trajectory and if we can maybe use the accommodation use for instance it goes from twenty eight or twenty nine dollars per thousand square feet up to one hundred twenty eight dollars and change per thousand square feet this table will be adjusted by credits that we provide and that's credits are simply a chance to reduce the probability that any project that pays impact fees will pay for the same project twice because property taxes are also funding these same sidewalk projects there is a potential that any new development they pay their property tax as well as paying the impact the and so there's a small credit off of the impact fee to reduce that probability and that's what's currently in the ordinance for the recreation impact fee as well that's right that's frankly where we are we've come to and that's the end of the report that we have we have all the derivation of the values and we have the rationale for this the next steps that we have is that we need to get an agreement on what fever value would be appropriate and then understand whether there be any waivers or exemptions that we would recommend for instance we would probably exempt any private or shooting any public school expansion nope no sense really in the town paying the town itself so that could be an appropriate  exemption of the impact fee and then whether there's any waivers such as maybe affordable housing or any land uses that we want to incentivize there might be some waivers and by using my terminology they're very carefully is that a waiver admits that there would be some degree of impact but an exemption would say this land use where we're excluding any consideration of impact what i will close on is that part of the impact of the process is that you want to ensure that you're not developing any excess capacity and you're not burning growth by providing a better standard of service then and today and what i will tell you is that you'd have to find all fifteen projects there before you're approaching that level of standard of service so you should have confidence that while the fees might look relatively high relative to your zero today but you can find all top ten and in essence you're still foot you get lost with with them but i think one important things is if you look at the total project cost of the total local amount in each case our sumption all these projects as we're going to have to go after grants to do the project there are large projects and so part of the issue is how many grants can you obtain for patch over a ten or fifteen year period in our experience has been some years we get lucky some years we don't get lucky right now be transferred in a lot of money in there stormwater th other money and put it into storm water so there's kind of almost a little bit i hate us right now in terms of that money so you know it doesn't look good next year we'll put in a grant get money i don't know but historically we usually have had a grant of somewhere between every two to three years so i mean if you've got a couple but it's generally been along that timeframe so that gives you a range if you're talking a ten to fifteen year period you know top five is probably fairly realistic an optimistic that we could do i'm realistic top ten or top fifteen in a ten or fifteen year period it's probably stretching what we've been able to get in terms of grants and so those numbers are based on grants i mean that's that's  reality i think that the other thing is when you look at that then it becomes a cost prevent them and part of the issue with all of these and i don't think that's why any of us have come yet to the board to say we suggest a number o is that it is a cost placed on developers however right now that total local share building site up to it we're not building maybe as many ways as we should because we don't have the financial assistance to do it it's also a delicate situation because if you're unlucky enough to have a piece of property that's sitting right in one of the growth areas you're going to get hit with a pretty big impact or we're going to we'll go to the planning commission and fight to get a pretty big impact  don't always win be quite honest i mean that's if the planning commission makes her own decision i'm not saying it's good or bad enough altium i'm just saying sometimes we would argue that there's a side of this really needed there in the developer is a better argument and we lose at the same point  time there are projects that are going on in another part of town where we probably won't build a sidewalk in the next ten or fifteen years or path but if they're all developing and they're all utilizing our facilities should some of those funds go into a central pot that we can put towards those projects on this list that we need the most so we're spreading that damage amongst a lot more people so to speak or that cost we're trying to get the costs back to a point we can put them to use it doesn't really do us any good if the approval says build a sidewalk on the end of old stage road with hex going to use it for houses and they go off a cliff at the end doesn't make any sense but should they pay an impact be where we could use that to put a path or site alkali fifteen maybe up here between the village and the town center and so that's part of the argument of why it makes sense to perhaps our intent was to have a study that if at some point this goes forward and we adopt this and i know that you're going to go the planning commission and talk in about of the same time so it may come from the comic planning commission fact you guys in terms of how we approach this but i think that's going to be a decision has to be made by the select board if we are going to do this and create this type of impact the that it would apply across the board to a new development  and it's something that if we get to a point where it's not adoptable at least we've had the discussion because up to now we haven't had the discussion and to me the basis for this is the type of thing that if someone said i'm going to  town of essex we've got a technical basis why we chose a bit of your fee that i think would stand stand up in terms of the technical analysis they were before quite honestly they are not i are often put in the stop spot by trying to come up with impact fee for development and it's really inconsistent and hard to do and we'd rather have as a matter of policy rather than a couple engineers trying to figure out what a fair cost is so it's more predictable to buy the developed yeah ok questions for but i don't know if i have that they the full answer and that would be a great question to come back to you with but typically sidewalks are rolled into a transportation impact and that's on the order of typically been well i could say seven hundred to a couple thousand dollars per household and so that's it would be a fever you to be associated for this type of mr infrastructure probably around that two hundred dollars or bedroom would be associated to that would be more burlington right now but that's very early days are other questions and regarding the the dedicated funding the forty k per year  list but in the in the study here it's teach last year's of his it's just the way we just we've been funding it in recent years is forty thousand dollars a year and the capital fund i suppose you could always reconsider it but that seems to be what we've been doing  acceptable gives us some money in the sidewalk so i'd like capital budget for when grants to become available that we can try to match that and then the follow on to that is just for clarity  understanding that two percent capital taxes across the entire town right so we're we're take that forty thousand dollars but only funds sidewalks are going outside the village correct or do we know right so this is try to enable that wish of the community to try to do better connectivity the by allowing the sphere you can then better manage what pieces get connected so as you said on the stage you wouldn't have to put in a sidewalk then nobody would use and in general is it about a million bucks per mile or so of the of sidewalks on average about so all the work that would be survive by walking in the street not the best but it works but they're in or take a small subdivisions with a cul de sac sidewalk on one side i think that's pretty much what the planning commission has done and in a lot of recent cases seems to be adequate  fifteen no way you need you know it's i mean it's really dependent you know if you have fifteen thousand cars a day on the road or even ten thousand or seven thousand you need and you need one people to learn to walk you need sidewalks on both sides if you have that one hundred cars a day in a shorter road than you can get away with one or in some places maybe not prefer to have at least one but there's a lot a lot of roads in town that were built you know back in the sixty's that don't have any sidewalks at all so a couple of clarifying questions if a developer is required by the planning commission to put in a sidewalk on their current project but they then exempt from having to also pay a fee because they've already done their part if it was a sidewalk lank that was not within the list of projects that are in the top ten let's say in this ordinance then they would be required to put to pa impact and install that sidewalk if they install a sidewalk that overlaps with the project list depending on how many projects we identify that we want to spend if the sidewalk overlaps that list then they would be given a or minor subdivisions or in law hartman's or anything like that but i would say it's every bedroom that comes through a get his own apartment so what kind of pushback to expect developers they could see the advantage for the residents would have a pushback from the developers this is at a cost to the project it's going to be standard practice throughout union county yes ok and i think funding multi modal transportation infrastructure this is a way that has has come forward in terms of its science and the and the evidence and as you said by school district plan that came an initially provides a real good foundation for the needs and articulate that there is a community of i think keeping it running as a separate fee it is it's slightly unique but i think it gives you a greater clarity and transparency versus other communities that may roll it into a general transportation impact so the benefit to the developers that  would be more predictable than zero it is the the i mean they would when they know that what they're going to get clearly out of this fear is that there's no balancing act between a roadway improvement versus a sidewalk in this case some of those areas and sort of done studies for certain regions or networks and implement these based on impacts to those areas as opposed to a town wide transportation and that's usually more really  right we've done there's really three principle areas in the built up there's a there's an impact in the second hilary of but that's it's based a little differently it's based not only on the volume and where it impacts you have to look at where exactly that traffic going and  where the needs so it's more immediate maybe over a five or ten year period for example you guys all sat through the roof fifteen on ellen martin study we only have a signal down at the bottom of sand hill and river road so that's want it solved but at least from a transportation point of view it's a signal level of services ok it's not some is going to pop up any time short so up in the upper area our biggest concern is that fifteen intersections are also biggest concern is that with his fifteen at the essex center areas is a third in fact she based upon build out that goes back to here we also have an impact from put on the gravel road and that is pretty much uniform again should we get some of those couple years ago to impose impact so on projects that impact the state highway they're charging impact we already are charging an impact and so we've had a negotiate some of these impact fees we recently had a fifteen and it took half a dozen phone calls and three engineers to convince the state and they came around ultimately not to charge and in fact be because the project was small and so far away from their intersection but if we go to the planning commission with a request in fact the for that development in the transportation agency does also we've doubled that developers cost for the same need and so those we've had to back off wouldn't go she so some of those plans impact fees we've had to say we will take a share of that we were in the past that was ours let's put towards the project so you can the see it's collecting on these larger projects especially whatever happens in the town center we're going to be fighting with the state over who gets the traffic in fact we don't have to fight if we do on the western walkways if we adopt this kind of a cost for you so tonight you're looking for the slick or to accept there were four and then it would get finalized and then come back to us for potential adoption i think it tended the intent was to bring us all to the planning commission so they can see it ask questions get their input look at the ordinance that john's drafted will have a chance to go through it and then come to the board and he's got one clarification and i think i think i heard both of you say it but just one clarification that this is this the currently exists within the recreation impact fee which he said than we were pulling there's more discreet and specific basically this is this is more specific and it's more detailed analysis that jonathan nursery did is way more in depth than the sidewalk a point of the reckon packed the but yes right now the wreck in fact the this previous wreck he had an assumption of the value per unit of development and so simply that's been eliminated and so the fee was reduced by that value so we remained the and i move the dislike or accept the report has submitted and direct the staff to develop an implementation plan in consultation with the plane commission and conservation trails committee for adoption by a select where they hear any second and then a second some corrections to it and i appreciate those corrections that will make those there they don't change the substance but they do add record so i appreciate that that we will do we did put this on the web page who could get any public input to my knowledge we have not had any ok i was going to ask you that question did you get any we have not had any the we're going to the trustees at the following meeting you know we're planning to go ahead i think there's there's just and i don't want to drag this out i'll answer any questions you have but i think that there's two things that are important one as most years but this year more than ever we're working with new people  when you need to learn to plow in my view you don't really become a good a really good plow driver for about five years you can do it in three and we have confidence will put people in the larger trucks but we've lost people and we've not gotten those new people trained yet to the level where we can interchange employees if we have someone two or three people get said we're going to be short really parking trucks in some cases because it isn't worth taking the risk of taking an employee who may be great in a pickup truck or mate may be great in a low profile and put them into a large truck and put them on sousa wilson or five o'clock a truck with bad visibility are simply bad visibility to us knowing yes it's and so we've got we've got a lot of train to do for this winter we plan to do that but a lot of it is it's half art have science and it just takes time to get there one of things we have done and we've increased the scope of it this year we have hired a contractor to do and it's in the report you look at the maps to do the town center area and we've expanded that a little bit because it is our crew is used to working on a certain type a road cul de sacs main roads gravel roads they're not used to plowing the burlington type of situation which is what the town center is becoming and when you have sidewalks that are fifteen feet that extend from the curb to the front door of the business and the public sidewalks which they have up there and you have angle parking which i have up there it takes special equipment to do that and it takes people committed to do that and so we have contracted with the same firm we used last year but we've expanded their contracts somewhat it does come in  expense so were last year's contract was a certain dollar value were about fifty percent more cost this winter and my hope it with the about the same budget is as the year previous year or maybe even cut a little my hope is that we through smart salting practices and smart operation would reduce our other costs that we don't go over budget on with our operations so those are the only two messages i have otherwise there isn't much changed in the in the mention calling five one one ok but the website is a website too and the other thing i've noticed this happened it's only happened in the last probably six months but from our local road used to be run by the same st michaels crew they're no longer are there run actual danger transportation and they've been real good at providing no weather forecast directly to the towns and so when we had all the summer storms coming through quite honestly they were there were a reminder we're in they'd be busy doing something and all the sudden i get an e mail from them indicating what the weather forecast is coming for tomorrow and you can expect high winds in th so that's another source we haven't put in here but it comes directly to us it's not really a public source of this but it is public but it comes comes to us directly so maybe that's another one wh two years ago two years younger we it was at one point it was i think thirty years something like twenty five or thirty and we raised that we took a look at we went and went to lowe's and very got prices and lower cost to buy the lumber and buy the simple mailbox and it came in at about forty five budgets yet in the first two comes are the actual budget for the same year span twenty five twenty six twenty fifteen twenty sixteen but in the second two comes the first one is the actual switch twenty why or you we used we had a different numbers for the village in a little harder to come by because the way they do their accounting but what we tried to show i mean in it is the fact that in fifteen sixteen we were you know it was a it was a mild mild winter and you can see that by what we in the budget was based upon historically with kind of an average winner so i mean that's that's what i was trying to show with those two numbers on the other one we in sixteen seventeen  we had a pretty tough winter and you can see the difference there the overtime hours we didn't spend a lot of time or over time but all but we had a lot of ice storms which used up a ton of sand and so that's kind of obvious and then the salt was was again kind of comparable to of the previous year's budget and what we used in an easier kind of showed what a high year was and then this shows the budget that we're going into this year kind of just trying to give a relationship between what we  did in different time frames and how they're kind of really and that's all i'm trying to do it would trying to do a whole budget comparison and i could have done to sixteen seventeen actual to sixteen seventeen budget to seventeen eighteen i could have added another column i just left  off i think and so the they're just different snippets of information right there just as an indicator it's an indicator of what occurred during that timeframe  just wanted to mention that i didn't really want to get leave name in the paper but i know you all probably read the article about culture esther and the problems they're having in terms of on the private roads yes and decisions were made and it's difficult but this kind of a document i don't see any more makes our job much easier because of the fines what or what we do you define and we provide it to you but in the end result you define what you want done and then we try to meet that standard and if you're a community that hasn't done that then you start to get into problems in terms of will why are you flying my street or why are you not doing this or that and it's not throwing darts in the community is not intended at all it's just there's a the this year we had a significant underspending of the public works budget and it was cos of last summer we did on purpose but it's really hard ahead of time sometimes to figure out where we're going in various things one thing is the biggest there's two things but one is the police parking lot when doug was still here we talked about that at length and we knew that within the budget for the police department and with the settlement was made in the parking lot there was not going to be enough funds left in the capital fund to pave that parking lot and so we talk about the decision was it would take it out of the public works paving budget and we would have done that it would have been an accomplished fact were it not for the fact that the spring was so wet and we just could not get to it and get it done until the new physical year so that money really went on spent on paving projects because we were just picture going to reserve it out and save it for that purpose so at this point i mean there's a couple choices one this request is that you actually take it from the unspent two thousand and seventeen funds and dedicated to that purpose the other option is it would have to come out of capital funds which i would my perspective a prefer to do or you take my savings and put it back into the general fund and then you end up with the issue of how much is left in the general fund over a year your base value that are you talk about the fifteen percent or whatever else and this is a way to solve a couple problems one is to take it from the unspent highway funds and put it to the purpose for which at least we intended to use it which is to pay the parking so that's that's one piece of the request but to do that it's an action the slug what has to take and the other one is i know i've sent memos done with other meetings you've had i'm not sure if you've seen the one i don't know if it's for this meeting of the next meeting to go it's one on we went ahead and applied for some stormwater grants and by the time we've given you the memo to explain the fact we're getting ahead of you we got the grants which is great however there's not enough money in the kitty to pay for the local share of those grants so we've got to work through a program of how we're going to do that we did not we under and some of this disproportionate was not really due to the whispering of the problems of trying to get the project done earlier like the police department was this was really do the fact that the state has been slow to put out the new requirements we expect a new amas for  it around the first of january with a whole bunch of changes in there that require us to do a lot of stuff for foster mobile so one of the grants that we've got and we've been working with the village closely one of the grants that chelsea put in the village for was for fifty thousand dollars ten thousand local money which is coming about a capital stormwater account to develop a fosters control plan for the town so we know when the new permit we're going after move phosphorous but how do we do that is it just fixing up the gravel roads is it rebuilding some of your storm water basins is it building new facilities where we get the best bang for our buck to meet the standards so in the midst of all this we've used up a lot of our stormwater money but the state is trying to push out as much money as they can quickly the basically so the powers that be which is e p a and on up the food chain that were that were onboard to get the lake cleaned up so they want that money out the door there's another whole round of grants that are coming in november and i'm going to meet with the village and with annie and with the stormwater committee and talk about do we go out on a limb and pick some projects and put them in for grants before we even have a phosphorus control plan in place because we have a good chance of capturing that money now because by the time everybody gets their plans done everybody's going to want the money right now if i don't it's going to sound terrible but there was shelling out the door take it and it's long as you can guarantee a local shared some point time and it's a valid project will fund it so now is the time to get on board with that so it i mean quite honestly it might mean that the thirty thousand dollars isn't a lot but it goes into that papa help us maybe offset some of those grants but at some point and i'm kind of jumping ahead of myself we may come back to the board and say it might be a good idea in the springtime to go for a bond issue for some dollar value of funds that one grant we've already gotten as well as some other grants if we put in four we may get because if we can get eighty percent funded versus future green funding which is probably going to be from the engine natural resources a fifty percent we're crazy not to grab the money now we just have to make sure we pick the right projects to lever to have money to leverage i mean if if i don't know how we're going to do this the one project that we're talking about at one point five nine zero it's kind of like a great idea it's part of a full restoration plan but how we can afford it we put in the grant we got it so now we've got to come up with two hundred some thousand which is a lot better than having to come up with one point five million and we've got to do out of it and we're going to have to do the foster so do we start to look at how do we put together a financial package to leverage those grants and do we go after more grants so the next deadline is in i think of ember twenty second so a decision we're going have to talk about it and see if it's in question we're going to i think at this point we have to figure out how to make the capacity i know it's if any looked at me and goes looking for it done i think but if we're going to have to and i think that's what we have dan foreign aaron and myself and we've got to figure out a way to process the grants and get the work done some of these grants make take two to three or four years to kota when we're actually constructing them so we've got some time and we may have to build up some more capability we may have to as a part of the grant package we have to contract some of that inspection work out that we want to do ourselves but if we don't jump on the train now and concern that it's going to leave the station without us and sell it's this thirty thousand is a part of that request but it's really a small dollar value compared to really what we're going to need and i'm not talking about a bond issue that's millions of millions of dollars but it may be a half a million dollars you know it's still a big bond issue but some point if we're going to do this and we want to get the money early it might be worth going to the voters on and we're required to do it we're required to do it so if it it makes a whole lot of sense and i my gut feeling is the voters will accept that knowing that we've gone after them pro active fiscal year seventeen budget in fiscal year seventeen actual and that's going to have eighteen budget the one thousand projected where do these monies show up in that or do they watch they would show up as if you approve this motion prove the recommendation it would show up as an actual expenditure or a costing against f y seventeen fun so instead of selling public works as being underspent by ninety thousand dollars the sum of these two which is thirty eight five five nine and thirty it would be reduced by sixty eight thousand dollars i'm sorry cindy or i'm sorry this doesn't cascade into further years because you've got you've taken work that was supposed to been done and if i seventeen were doing it in eighteen but we only had a full slate of projects retain it it will shift it's not going to slow anything would it may i mean the decision that doug and i had come to earlier was that we were going to have to find a gap to pay for that for a king live or that was going to again have to come out of fun balance or out of the capital reserve as the same are about time what the timelines will see that timelines we've accomplished we put out all our projects forbid this summer i think the only difference is that what we what we also do  is and it's a certain amount of mother nature controls i never spend all the dollars that are available to me for what i would call dated summer construction sidewalk in the fall i always postpone and save some of those dollars till spring because quite honestly if we have a terrible winter and those costs go up i don't do some things in the spring that we had planned to do to basically pay for a tough winter converse lee if we have a light winner and we save money i will try to use that money  to fix some other projects of need to be done sometimes once in a while mother nature steps in and says that's a great plan i'm going to reign the whole month of april may and june and you're not going to spend any of that money that's partially what happened this year in addition to what happened with the with the police department that's partially what happened so we caught up but i can't guarantee that in another year we're not might not be in the same position it's a certain degree of risk  says i moved the select board to authorize the transfer of thirty nine thousand six hundred four dollars and twenty cents in highway the school year and seventeen fund business item five g it's adoption of revised conflict of interest policy break you show us what's going on here the conflict of interest policy a chair last meeting on september eleventh we accept them and gave me some feedback to take back and put into the into the policy which i did most of my stuff moving some contradictory language an article eight and section eleven when  one noted her noticing that the vice chair can be the point person for having discussion of the chairs one potentially having conflict of interest for minor changes beyond that looking at it again with a couple other questions came up of definition of a gift that's in five c what exactly is a gift terms of conflict of interest and what would reach that criteria and also in section eleven point  every year in the us well let me most of the times those quote unquote gives really are paid for out of the marketing budget from year to year by the agency issuing them so when the fair has its ribbon cutting ceremony to open the new season they send out a number of invitations and along with the invitations is free parking and entrance into the fair and by going to years the value of those tickets were zero they've they've always made sure there was zero and explain that they came from the marketing budget they weren't it wasn't a gift of any way manner shape or form then any value moreover when events were not sold out they also had marketing strategies that allowed them to give gifts of people who come to the various events just put people in stands sort of thing so i would not view those as gifts whether it's worth twenty dollars or twelve dollars or whatever whatever because that is of the point that it doesn't benefit us financially in any way manner shape or form and our job we our presence benefits them so recently irene myself max we're at the ribbon cutting ceremony at three o'clock in the afternoon fair a lovely day it was a short ceremony which is to the best ceremonies but you know we were able to park and then we could walk around inside look around and go home and i think quite a bit of money there so you didn't know for years i helped the economy so th bids or any of those kinds of things which generally include things that just come to us as employees somebody got one hundred dollars here for plowing the road a couple of winters ago and couldn't except that we have gifts come through the door all the time of the holiday season chocolates or other delicacies and so we put them out for everybody's use rather than insult the giver so that says and so this is coming in vendors coming in employees anybody can have a child but whatever the gift was so it's something that we've been made hypersensitive to we in in government for in human the many years because if it's proven that somebody did take a gift for an award for a bid and recommendation let's say to the select board that's serious stuff that that that award can be vacated and that person could get into a lot of trouble not just being fired but perhaps even more so we've we've been hypersensitive gives a long time so that the thing i find that would have been troubling in this sense because it's there but that's why i will come back in april to give you the three sixty  about that more and my and maybe maybe i mean can share some clarity on this i was wondering if this was associated with the chair being a member of an a committee that was reporting out to the select board and i'm wondering if we should consider i don't know if it's appropriate to make it a requirement that a day if the chair is a member of a committee that is reporting to this like board that they not chair that that sportsman of the meeting or whether that would simply be covered under the question of conflict of interest because i think it could be considered in that you know but but it's slightly different because it's not recusing yourself you get to leave the room kind of it's a different scenario where giving up the gavel for a portion of the meaning is different than leaving the room so it's not excuse it's not the same thing so if you i guess you have a conflict of interest here we go i mean this is a way to save you if the chair has a conflict of interest or there's a perceived conflict of interest associated with the committee that that that the chair is participating and what is the proper path i don't i don't believe the proper path is that the chair would have to recuse themselves and leave the room because that's what are conflicts of interest policy says the way it's written right now so yeah so well it has or no no no i'm not saying i'm not saying that it is i'm not saying that it is that's not at all what i'm saying what i'm saying is that if there's a well there's a perception of conflict of interest what do you do it is fully up to an individual to say yes or no i can deal with this conflict of interest and i can i'm going to stay in the room but is it always the you know if if if the chair says well maybe you're right maybe i am coming to this into this room with a bias because i've been on that committee and i've helped form the the position of that committee and i think it's inappropriate for me to run this part of the meeting the only recourse th state that person has is to recuse himself and leave the room that may be appropriate or is it not i don't know if it is on a if that's he is there is there an option of relinquishing control of the meeting you know is this is this is really i'm sorry is physically to the select we're not specifically you have to salute the chair any chair if if there's a conflict of interest or perception of a conflict of interest or concern by the chair that they that they're participating by running the meeting could taint the whole discussion of the select board how do you deal with that the discussion right of i don't know that the intent is to make it a requirement that the chair relinquish the gavel if if they're they're participating in the committee i think the question is the question is if if if the  question the chair would need to ask themselves is is there a perception that i'm i'm i have a problem here or will i have a problem or do i want to risk having a problem and i think it's still the same way with a recusal is a personal decision i'm trying to figure out why we're kicking the can one more time here i don't think there's that many changes and i don't see why we couldn't as i've seen them in changes as a manager you like and i'm still trying and i have no idea why the gifts of recommendation for what the definition of gift is he would change the private to executive session and add real or perceived in front of a one in a book so he's taking notes to say what would come back in april is off and i mean we're going seems like we've got we modify this every year right so why not make the changes now and then during and then have a fresh document for the next use months and in bring it up again in is clean copy ready to be signed was accepted into temper can be adopted now based on the last discussion with a few more points have come up tonight and when we bring take a look again at the april i can incorporate those changes or we can pick it out two more weeks to have those other changes considered and usually this is done in april it's one of those things that you look at in april and then i think i dropped the ball as far as the transitions are going on to the back up again  there's nothing that says you can't offer that as a as a so yeah i'm kind of leading with mike i think maybe they get one because that needs to be kind of brought into focus how that should be maybe that one is motion to accept it and changing number five to refer to the conflict of interest policy suba just i mean i think that that conversation at the last meeting about good and the one that we were just having here where the if there is some the the highest in reading the conversation or if they are coming in from then you know another assignment to report out i think that that goes with the example down for number nine i would propose saying something such as if there is a real or perceived bias on the part of the chair the gavel should be passed to the next in line for the duration of that i generally am very just certain about that because we all have opinions including the chair and the chair opinion may be in direct conflict with somebody else's  for good reason both sides so it could appear to be a biased because he's or she has a opinion that's different than that of others and to have be perceived as reason to pass the gavel is doesn't make sense because if somebody says something that the chair doesn't believe is in the best interest of the community  he has an obligation or she has obligations to say what's in what they believe is in the best interest of the community that could be perceived as advice now he's he's five she's  reference to the impartial so i think we're just expanding it's already a given that the chair should be acting in any partial or unbiased way when we in discussion not to say that you don't have opinions and at some point you can jump in on make sure that the the the order of the meeting proceeds in a way that reflects the impartiality in the end it's it's  because this was a gesture of luck as well as for the work in recent memory and since we're the ones with that memory maybe he was us to put that in here so that in the future years down the road if it happens again there are ways to make sure that it doesn't on all the way  it just like a conflict of interest we can't force there the the board can force a conflict of interest decision on somebody i think is this it's a similar thing i think it needs to be the that the chairs  discretion and certainly i guess the other members of the board can question it but it still leaves the chairs decision more special than even the ice you've spent hours waiting for a nine will come up in a memory never saying wait a minute i'm not feeling right and i think we have to really look listen to them yes we are but our power should not be abused to shut people up in the army just cause we don't want to hear what they're saying and i think you're there so what's the motion select for computer use policy is adopted the idea is that it's going to make a lot more easy to distribute packets easier to distribute updated materials it's going to save a whole lot of staff time van drivers deliver other packets all told just in terms of staff time and probably save at least twenty six hundred dollars per year that does not include printing costs these are some microsoft surface pro three tablets that we have put together policy for it and walk me through the policy this is develops on the most part with i t in the manager's office kind of talking  updates to them and what happened with damages and death in the news things that we hope to avoid but never bought some point some happy to answer any questions about it but the idea is to accept the computer use policy tonight  bring it back on the sixteenth to have adopted with any tweaks changes that are necessary and then schedule a training with the entire select board authority staff to walk you through how to use these and what to expect t from the weeds of some of the policy stuff that's laid out here ideally talking to i t preferences to have the meeting happen or the training or station meeting happen with all of you in the same room so they can see everything once  are item to do list two documents that we need to read and sign the town of essex electronic communication computer use agreement this is the one for you for normal and the other employees also correct and the last that it's has not been updated since two thousand or the two thousand so there's a draft in the works right now and the idea is to get that to you on this account as well ok and then i just noticed that the the next one says  the village website or the shared storage location you can go off and google something during a meeting if you need to know a culinary means or know nadya's to keep everybody on the same page so i have a laptop that need to be hooked up to that border i can pull up that not under twelve j i always transport the equipment with in the case provided by the town we will provide a case and there's a few other instances in here where reference to some stuff that went see go through training but get into updates this reference to showing up at least ten minutes prior to meeting his or because once the meeting starts you not have access to your that's the that's the risk  so we try to turn off your computer sometimes or turn it on in the takes three five ten minutes to load to do the system update it's just great to have to say not now do you i would have to so we're talking about saving lives that will be in general by doing this i'm just wondering if there's a cost associated with digitizing current paper base resources for example i know on my shelf back in the old day we got a personal handbook a select word handbook the chart of the musical code a policy book holiday listings and i and the union contracts all in different binders are my shelf i'm not so sure that sue has any or all of those now because they were less paper based and we're just we don't print out as much stuff but you know we'll travis be putting all that stuff i like i think that's important for all five of us to be on an equal playing field as far as what documents we can access and what's the cost associated with that because i don't want this to be frame win when there may be some cost to doing this but we haven't really done that i've seen and i haven't missed a meeting sort of a three sixty on is this the direction we want to move in and why i remember doug last spring saying get back to me having feedback and he never the memo that i recall that said i got the feedback on board it says this and this were proposing doing tablets and this is why these are the pros these are the cons i don't have anything like that and it's so different than when dennis comes here or anybody else with an issue and we spend a half hour talking about all the different sides of the issue so i'm really taken aback by sort of the haste that i feel that we now have a policy we're cost pros cons i'm just really amazed that this is such a different process or lack thereof than anything else and stand up for example tonight and i'm just i guess it's a point in some ways  i feel like we're under pressure because the tablets of our human purchased that's twenty seven hundred dollars that's been spent and i just feel like is that a lot of money as much money as travis is going to save so i guess it's as much money as you think it is but we spend that all the time here pretty quickly and pretty easily and i just wish you know i hear i was reading about the type of leader they you suspect and i hear that the force around now and they've got better track balls and better keyboards why do we get the force  threes i just have a lot of questions about the whole thing so feel free to answer or not but i just wanted to express that this just doesn't only one we did have with the so you wanted to keep people i don't think we had a conversation i remember in the budget sessions setting aside some money in case we go this route and then doug said we're going to talk about this get back to me if you have feedback that i never saw a memo from doug but like i said maybe i missed it that laid out the pros and cons of possible cost the possible savings place of that three sixty that were so famous for and i just am a little surprised to be getting  in the affirmative when the conversation came up that there is a potential to be disrespectful or rude or give the appearance of being rude in a discussion in a discussion  but you can have the same thing with paper if you're talking to me and i'm writing down what you're saying you don't know that i'm paying attention to you you want me to look at you when you're talking and then i can't write so you still give the impression of perhaps being  but i am ready to move this forward to be honest with you i am not really quite sure what else we can have staff do that's going to  discouraged but this is in the early conduct of business where we just we have proposed changing or you know taking out the word discouraged and so now is forbidden from this new policy of gun from being discouraged from using my phone to forbid and using my phone since i'm just feels like we took a step back rather than a step forward because mine doesn't go back as long as most years but i can go back and find something in a house with people folder of like unfinished business that's going to be at the coming meeting right so that i can find a way and you know do we have that kind of well i don't maybe it's moot but it is we just have this public works committee right where and during that meeting i did bring my laptop in because of the reference materials and it was easy to have it so i guess in the future that would have been a no i i really don't think that we should have personal devices being able to go onto a personal device in addition to having select board machine and the reason for that is just because it just it it leaves us open for getting either text messages or e mails from people in the audience or people who are watching on channel seventeen or any of that stuff during a meeting which i think is just that i just i just think that's horrible  need we need to be able to work the five of us and do the work that we are charged with doing without getting interrupted or getting that so to speak  from from people outside the meeting during a meeting afterwards no holds barred people get ahold of all of us at different times about different  things again i i go back to what greg said earlier if there is something that needs to be looked up and i think i can do it and put it up on the screen for all of us to be able to use rather than getting distracted with going and looking for it you know yes i do i love i love the idea of using the myth of using the laptops i  think that's ever been something that's something i just hold the slack for members to a higher standard than that and i would never expect anyone to do that and if they did that that's a bigger issue that we have to address and can be called out but i don't think that we  so what's the use of force closure policy and stop ok i'm handing out four different articles because i was looking online because i was very curious i know it's not popular to look at the science behind issues but i thought i would look at the science behind the issues and see if come together by saying that if you look at the facts like what happened when that's a very easily found as well as retain if you're screening but if you are reading something in depth and it's abstract that's a concept that you need to get a big picture view paper is the way to go and so again i'm i'm just me there were being sort of corralled into using a screen when i think setting policy is sort of the highest form of abstract got to be doing that three sixty about the act of actually writing something down that puts it in your brain and keeps it there longer and helps you think better so again i just see this huge missing piece in what we're being asked to approve today and i understand how it could have slipped your minds i'm not looking to me lay blame i just want to say there's many articles online to this effect and i just disappointed that the science of this has not factored in at all in addition to the actual cost of us fine i would say look you can still take it when you know whether you print something up or not so i i'm in favor of it i think like i said before i think it's going to be some getting used to give us accepting this policy as is written here today is a gate for getting the training schedule then i would be in favor of moving forward with you that exist except that with the modifications ma i move that the select board except the select bird computer you should use policy for adoption of a future meeting and to allow staff to schedule a time for training including service and those things and go that extra mile to volunteer and do things that's old and old recollection that we have from the very first time we had it and i know that there was some discussion on that  we are not an extra mile city in our practice other than the and option of the proclamation  citizens collectively the extra mile in personal effort volunteer ism and service and whereas the town of essex is a community which encourages its citizens to maximise their personal contribution to the community by giving them giving of themselves wholeheartedly and with total effort commitment and conviction to their individual ambitions family friends and community and where is the town of e community which chooses to shine a light on and celebrate individuals and organizations within its community who go the extra mile in order to make a difference and lift up fellow members of their community and where is the town of essex acknowledges the mission of extra mile america to create five hundred seventy five extra mile cities in america and is proud to support the extra mile day on november first twenty seventeen now therefore the town of essex select board does here by cook proclaim november first two thousand and seventeen to the extra mile day the i port urges each individual in the community to take time on this day to not only go the extra mile in his or her own life but to also not all those who are inspirational in their efforts and commitment to make their organizations families community country or world a better place to the next available select board meeting  giving you a recommended format for an evaluation for the future manager and then you can use it right beside me in any way for the next manager you have a copy of that format and we can do it this two way discussion on the effectiveness of the board manager relations and what can be expected i mean you have an old dog here has been around for a long time we're going to have a brand new one i think the expectations need be discussed so that you don't unfairly hold the new person to the same expectations that you would have me by thinking that we're going to talk about  my my suggestion i made would be given the fact that it was now darn near ten forty a m we still have agenda items to go to postpone  hundred percent of the mike said because of the hour i tend to forget i mean i tend to get what i'm saying sometimes says late if you don't mind having a reversal of executive session the next meeting so that we can do this or have it at the dust good and i think you kind of touch and i was really challenged with why we were a value range at this point in time given that you're retiring in the intent of feedback is for the opportunity for  a valuable use of it but i would i would feel that it's inappropriate at this point for us to actually you know it and i agree that i just don't want it and then the other thing in the prior line and we take out the quotes because it's a yes close paraphrase but it's not your condensing what she said in the minutes and then finally on one fifteen we insert the red text that i scribbled at the bottom that  got it never mind and again move this like born into it into executive session to discuss the evaluation of a public officer in accordance with one vs a section three one three three and to include the town manager in deputy town manager need we need the second one then to