twenty minutes late money time for rebuttal yes a few minutes yes your honor i believe fifteen minutes will suffice for the city ok thank you very much thank you shows that the events that led to the incident on december seventeenth with the entire tank of chemical alum emptying into basin three and a failure to initially discover that only could have occurred based on a series of very unusual events all separate inspections by specific which were specifically ordered by the operating engineers will all have been trained to do the right thing and take note of these things they were specifically told check all chemical tank levels reports came back each rather than what the facts i mean you're just stating what's in the name but i'm highlighting these particular facts for a couple reasons there were findings that were made which seem to be against what i believe as you said were levels were going down and appear that what they were doing the washing tract was resolving the problem but it was not resolved it wasn't there wasn't at all clear at the time you yes but the point i'm getting to is that all prior situations that have been about to seize on the past various problems of one sort or another every single time the staff has been trained and has called him wherever he may be of any problem he relied on that practice there's only so much he can do i mean he can sit in his office and watch youse and that we're going to get the bloke like correct thing to do for lack of a better time but there was nothing more he could have done at that point othe i think that the city would have had a bigger problem in trying to convince everybody else to terminate him i don't know that would have been the case are they are going to be made here are retaliation for prior loss and i think that while we didn't spend a lot of time on that issue the penalty that was imposed and that increased the terminations the charges that he was charged with even though the facts that show any of that many of these charges for example not checking the sense unless you consider the possibility calibration so while i don't think they would have enough ammunition to convince this court trial court judge or maybe even the personnel board to get rid of them the point that he has his job of trying to find points that go directly to that issue or judge where we argue was at the hearing officer made a number of findings that simply had no basis in fact  that were not only were there is no evidence to support some of these charges but the testimony of the city's own witnesses contradicted and then there were some of the charges that became charges which never work charges i'm one of those for example would be  the alleged failure that there was no protocol testing procedure in place to check the tank alarms and i don't know really how the parent office came up with that but they haven't was very clear not just from the stuff like that m a witness for the city that he had that system in place that was always there before we even came to the point yet he was faulted for not establishing that procedure which r d was in existence and that's one example which then got compounded with of even being performed there was a situation where we were trying to argue that the penalty was not proper appropriate because he was the only person disciplined at any level of discipline no warnings  own investigation to see who else may have been responsible and that suddenly became an argument charge against him with regard to the results of the elements is that he talked to anybody before he left me did he say to possibly levy to the situation yes that is a factor that was cited correct i mean we're looking in hindsight and yes there are things he could've should've done better perhaps and that's why we never try to challenge the demotion issue as a penalty but to then jump to the next step under all the facts going on not least the trauma nation that's where we have a huge disagreement the plant is just enormous and most of the train second thing is planned in the country yes or the world actually i think there are things that go on to get fixed without any notice to not only just with the fact that me but some of the people who are meeting below him because of so many things going on they are they discount always know to call him mostly on the cell phone because he can be anywhere at all he had a planned side of the plant wherever so for him to say hey i'm leaving really wouldn't have much of a bearing because they know to contact him if he's in his office or he's out in one of the areas in the plant or on this day that the say something isn't any what he wished he had done that definitely yes but given all the signs at the time things were under control and it wasn't just most effect that any of that laughter left without telling people w leaving the situation with enough in control at that point that both see that and now star was specifically sent there to see what's going on see how they could help and what they can do they left oh so it wasn't just this fact that even this false sense of security and i think the final point all make here is that it was clear that there was no single event or incident or charge based on the your own reasoning at the hearing officer of the board that led to the termination ignores the fact that he never knew that was even being formed the first ones as one example there is no reference on the record to you it says in this effect that he had a twenty two plus year career there as absolutely no reference at all the hearing officer decision or the personnel board decision beyond that that his record was beyond exemplary he had risen up to ransom very very fast in his double promoted several times he provided at all in his entire twenty plus year career none of that was considered rather was like always been a long time employees ok well we'll think about that although not with nothing really consider the other you have to look at the talent here you can't look at one individual thing yet you left the plant yes should have other plants second guessing now perhaps we should not have but you've got to look at what was going on at the time with all the levels of the chlorine i'm sorry ph being one hundred percent normal and the  one hundred percent fine no problem whatsoever so yes shave stay longer perhaps yes but on the situation i don't think you can agree that a termination human emotion but germination we're talking about was appropriate in that might add they specifically or they looked at evidence in mitigation and considered progressive discipline including perhaps emotion and decided recently that on these facts commission was an appropriate remedy in your honor notwithstanding mr fact benny's past history of some good service to the city there are first offenses where terminations is an appropriate remedy this was one of those cases what factors in the record you say support that the ultimate sanction terminations would be appropriate in this that the individual responses and the responses of his employees that he was responsible for as individual in charge of the total operation of the plant and i might add under the instant response model adopted by the department of water management he was the commanding incident was spotter had unique responsibilities and therefore its appropriate hold and unique accountability is in his response to this particular incident and as you you probably guessed wrong or really the facts of this aren't really  know what was done for the most part we know it was not done for the most part so i think the focus on really what those facts show about mr effect babies leadership judgment communication inability to follow through  a position where he could be trusted with a position in the department of water management which has as its core mission providing clean water to over five million people across the chicago area and hospitals schools and neighborhoods that they  rigidity that prevented him from being able to pursue it remedies were before potential other causes he went to his office worked on paperwork to check in a couple of times what the hourly rates were assuming the hourly to ability levels looking at is someone that doesn't have the demonstrated to billy's to to make these types of judgments make these types of decisions to make decisions and get information to the people it needs to be gotten to pay attention to what's going on take into account changes in evidence as it occurs over time and your honor those types of qualities would be present whether he were in charge of the plant or in a more immediate level in the plant someone you see as some sort of task and volved with the production of clean water even those positions that help inform supervisory capacities and intermediate level and we can see what some of the duties word some of these intermediate employees were mr skidd office and others and you can take a look at what they were called upon to do in this record attaining information transmitting investigation to determine whether there was a chemical cause when in fact a chemical cause was a very likely culprit right from the beginning that's the reason they check to take the tank levels to begin with that's why they check the tank flow calculations to begin with because there was a suspicion there were three potential chemicals that could have really caused these problems at the plant kori flora sulfate but those are the usual suspects he was too quick to rule was out and even when mr struggle came to the plate and n he goes back to his office after that three o'clock and doesn't communicate with mr c doubtless after that if he had been taking the level of accountability that's required for work and employee he would have been engaged in the process going back to one of the final points mr erlich and here you have an individual who received glowing reports and situations that require immediate  somebodies previous record and when you're talking about the motion versus termination the board clearly did give some consideration to his past record of service to the department it's in the record they note that they considered it the amount of weight they should be given to it is in the discretion of the board  they did not give it enormous weight at least in light of the other evidence of the substantial shortcomings of mr fragmenting and i think meet it in a case like this where the stakes are so potentially secondary failures these are substantial shortcomings the kinds of substantial shortcomings that the law provides are grounds for not just discipline but termination and then the board appropriately balance those issues out given the heigh potential consequences of this conduct of the sins of omission and commission the departure without clear communication to anyone and ignoring mounting evidence that would have maybe lead to him reviewing court that looks at this and including below here on earth circuit court level where they had some additional questions they got some additional responses from the hearing board and the identified a number of grounds in the circuit court said yes it's those are within the sound this question of the hearing board collusion so they did have a second chance they should have known that maybe the record was over sparse on why the motion was not appropriate or maybe we should look at other things before we say we want terminations and to do that i don't think we have to second it's just too old it's not working and used to be replaced why they can fault think that me for not relying on scott in that situation is beyond me and it's not just like that he stood up was very clear for the same points there's an argument that the drop sheets show that the allentown one thirty five had dropped and that fact that he should have gone to check that number one spouse insulted knowledge that the control room engineer had that information should have brought that up the the argument is made that while slugs in the past occurred but these are really tiny slugs and only very very short period time with the sensors get fouled up it depends on the size of the slug a tiny slug short time in this situation given the drops in the ph in the huge rise into betty they want think in some tiny little slug they would think in a fix luck that's going to take time to go through the system and as it went through the system indeed the levels dropped so there's nothing to show why that with the if you get there level but the way above these people are very well trained educated and smart start at a master's environmental science then with water just for for over twenty years what doing one of perfectly ation issues for ten flocculation check the whole bunch of things every which thing ruled out chemical cause and that's what it's lying to start and see back up that time and no one said at that point you know we really don't think that's correct we think you should do x y and z or how about x y and z except that if express no doubt of any kind of that point in time all that information went to steps including backwashing fast and say time out come out let's go back a look at these things ok no problem six for us so to suddenly say after the