this is the time in the place for the board of appeals for the city of holland we are here to consider applications for variances and or special exceptions this board must try to interpret each application as it relates to the ordinance this board is not empowered to rezone nor take any action that could be considered rezoning applications need to meet a number of crucial tests in order to be granted for those of you who are here and have already answered those questions in your application we're going to go through them again tonight there is a procedure guide available we ask that you come to the microphone to speak and that you state your name and your address when you do so as a reminder for everybody there are people watching at home and they can't hear us unless we talk into the microphones so please do that we typically hear the applicant first and then anyone supporting the application followed by anyone in opposition to it at that point we typically close the public hearing and deliberate and render our decisions you're welcome to stay for the deliberations in the rest of the meeting there is no opportunity for further public comment though after we close t hearing if you do elect not to stay you may call city hall after eight thirty tomorrow morning to learn the results of the various items couple changes to the agenda i'd like to take an unfinished business and move it to the top of the agenda is understand we've got a fair amount of the audience here to talk about that one and then we will talk about one forty four west tenth street immediately after talking about one forty eight west tenth street since there are very similar and after we approve the minutes at the end of the meeting we'll have elections all right with that sharon ninety seven east twenty third street exception for the accessory do if certain conditions exist thirty nine dash one eighty five eighty one thirty nine dash one eighty five g now i've got several letters   we have one is not in favor of that one is from adriana hill her biggest concerns these are quite lengthy letter so that just highly concerns these are posted on the website she is concerned about the size of the construction of the building seem to be imposing the integrity she's concerned about the integrity and character of the neighborhood she stated that she did not have any communication with mr banner and also again that the size she feels that the size could be reduced quite a  for neighbors in the city he's writing it as a lifelong member of how the community a resident of the downtown area and he is in favor of it i have one more this is from micah matthews he is expressing enthusiasm also in favor of their a t u he says it's designed this welcome back sir thank you thank you so i'd like to begin by addressing two matters that i need some clarification on first is a question about the distinct and unique roles of the infill review the planning commission and the zoning board i've understood that the infill review addresses questions of how my proposed garage an accessory dwelling unit appropriately fit into my surrounding neighborhood whether my design is consistent with the neighborhood characteristic in terms of height scale and proportion in my previous public hearing the rates specific questions about height scal proportion past the motion to affirm that the square footage of the rooftop deck of my previous design should be included in the overall allowable square footage of my building plan so i want to so it's clear that this decision by the z b i was motivated by concerns of height scale and proportion again these are questions i had understood to be settled in my in full review and in full review that was then supported with approval by the planning commission when they reviewed my proposal in terms of and their language height scale and proportions so the second matter of clarification is in regard to the access that my fellow neighbors and residents and khalid have to the correct information about my design proposal as well as its process of approval and the current permission allowable in the ordinances so yesterday one of my neighbors that was already mentioned came to my understanding that she was writing in opposition to our building because what i learned was some misinformation she thought that i was asking that i am asking for special permissions from the city and in talking with meghan i learned that she not only did not understand what an age is but she didn't already know that the city has allowed permission for eighty use so with this new information this neighbor friend wrote the city and rescinded that opposition so i am then left to assume the other neighbors like meghan perhaps even my neighbors and  proximate distance from me one has written in who i have actually talked with very very lengthy and given her lots of information i don't know why audrey would say otherwise i want to be a good neighbor try to communicate these details to her so perhaps there are many other neighbors that are confused not just about eighty use but also about the unique role of this particular hearing in terms of th so this neighbor had written her initial opposition to my design that special permission should not be given to me because my building would not correspond to the quote history and a statics of the neighborhood and again i was under the assumption that these are concerns that had already been settled by the infill review and with the planet commission's approved support ok so i'm left concerned about how this will take into account any other opposition from neighbors in regards to a static site scale proportion and matters which i again already said i thought were settled so this lack of clarity exacerbate an already very difficult process in a way that makes it very easy for my neighbors to unnecessarily develop speculation and suspicion about what i'm up to in a way that cuts to the kind of neighborliness that i have from the beginning tried to earn that kind of trust and patient confidence in one another so i'm not surprised by my neighbor's confusion or any of the other neighbor's confusion since i've been working on this process since december and still confused about what is permissible i'm confused about what is the unique distinct roles of the info review planning commission and zoning board appeals so in regards to the design that i'm presenting specifically tonight there's a few things i'd like you to take into account this is my fourth drawing i draw your attention to this to demonstrate that i have been willing consistently from the beginning to listen to my neighbors and then that the last hearing to listen to your concerns and i have accordingly tried to adjust to to come up with a design that is less egregious less of a hindrance to my neighbors i very much want to build something that is more helpful and more agreeable to them in my previous hearing i virtually wondered if the members of the z v a are truly willing to allow aid to use in any form because the truth is that a t u does it changes the dynamics the character the feel the vibe of a neighborhood that's going to happen size scale proportion is going to be affected and i believe that my my design will add character charm and value to this neighborhood so i've asked many other friends and neighbors to come and be present at this hearing to represent a large portion of our community that does agree that this design is good for a community so if my friends and neighbors could stand that are in just to the west so i have reduced it to twenty two by twenty their garage is just over twenty two by twenty two and in terms of height my initial drawing back when i had the dream of designing this w shipping containers that initial height had the height of fifteen feet which is the exact height of my neighbor's garage right now now that i have tried to listen to their concerns reworked my design with something more traditional that looks a lot looks exactly like my my current primary dwelling the pitch of the roof because of the way that these things worked that the height is now twenty two just over twenty two feet which is just seven feet taller than the garage existing i'd also like to know that my neighbors to the west of not only built a garage but they also put a sizeable addition to their house they're building expansions across their property far more than double the size of what i'm proposing in this drawing further there is a precedence of a larger garage across the street from me ninety four east twenty third that is a large garage serving a duplex which is the size of twenty two by thirty six feet long in terms of the proposed four hundred forty six square feet of this proposal this is one third of the size of my existing dwelling if i'm allowed to include the square footage of my home's deck and the front stoop and i took this liberty to include these measurements in keeping with the rationale of the motion that you passed in your previous hearing that the measurements of the deck what i thought would would be a nice roof top deck should be included in the overall then i should at least be able to count my deck towards the overall size i'd like to conclude by saying that your approval of this present design is not just significant for my family but also for the good creative many many creative people i represent in holland i'm not asking for unfettered reckless change here i believe that i have more than adequate adequately gone through a vetting process that's led me to adapt and change my design four times to something that is much more modest and fitting and hopefully agreeable to my neighbors and all these neighbors who have joined me here to support this building proposal want for hollande to continue to be a more willing and open to new different types of people with different types of gifts interests skills and a static tace represented amongst these people gathered here and those that have written letters are visual artists musicians writers stay at home parents plumbers builders pastors doctors nurses organic farmers nonprofit employees college professors doctors nurses pastors and graduate students the still design i'm proposing tonight represents the kind of creativity that these people who bring many levels of value to our community want i know a steady stream of people over my over ten years in holland who have moved away to grand rapids or saugatuck or douglas and beyond for syslog because they've been given the impression that holland is a closed community that resents and resists vibrant creative change i hope your decision tonight will prove them wrong in approving our building design you're expressing that holland is a place that is forward thinking resilient and courageously creative so i thank you for your patien throughout all this process i've got a couple questions that we need to go through here sir think we've been through before i'll ask them just so that everybody here on the board hears the answers water and sewer city the eighty you meets all the required setbacks yes or no question we got stuck on last time the eighty you has one third the footprint of the principle structure or less  numbers here i do my best all right thank you it's a proposed eighty you comply with the maximum height requirements of twelve foot for a single story and twenty four foot for two storey all right you've got a floor plan of the eighty you showing a kitchen bathroom and sleeping area that you've submitted right there you are right and then in your opinion is the eighty you compatible and ok thank you thank you anyone else to speak in favor of this application come  house really stripped it and build it from the outside up to be really up a beautiful figure in the down town hall and facility holland community and which case you can see the design of his house in the at the time and diligence he has to make it look really really fantastic for the community so i saw his plans for the e u and you can see from his architectural drawings he's putting that same detail into it so this idea that it would be an eyesore somehow into the community i think is the exact opposite i think would really bad add to the value and be an attraction for people who want to enter that community that people are invested in want to continue building it up so i can say be more supportive of josh josh his plan right thank you anyone else  my name is jonathan gapper i live at sixty three west twentieth street and want to voice my support for josh and susan as accessory dwelling unit i've known the banners for the past eight years and have continually been courage and inspired by their commitment to nurturing community and relationships here in the city of holland they have opened their home to me and so many others and their involvement in the hope college community organizations like it they farm in just a couple examples of their desire to make holland stronger through deep relationships and hospitality and after hearing of this idea from josh and seeing the plans i was excited for what it could offer to the core neighborhoods of holland the development of a to use throughout the city is an exciting opportunity and i believe that the banners have created a fitting and a beautiful design for their structure think it would be an architectural compliment to their home as well and this attention to aesthetic and architectural excellence can only be seen as a positive for the city ok i don't have prepared remarks but i do live about three doors down from the banners and have done for me rachel billings and my address is eighty three east twenty third street so you can calculate precisely how far l five and as soon as they moved in so the neighbor there be an upstanding neighbors there upstanding members of the community susanna is a professor of english yes they are both writers musicians brewers artists but normally in a free society i think those are considered an advantage rather than a liability they're not known to do any illegal drugs have loud parties set off fireworks thank god you know for those in our neighborhood  so my only other taishan has been that every time josh has a project he tends to saw off some part of his fingers so as long as he can refrain from doing that on this occasion i think it will be a wonderful addition to the community as more people are looking for more ecological dwellings as well where space is not wasted i think this is a wonderful addition to that i saw the two of those gorgeous little six many houses just a few days ago that we now have at the corner of sixteenth and central and this seems very much in accord with my name is dennis taylor and i live it one twenty two east twenty second street and my wife and i had the pleasure of sitting in our sun room and watching their house be renovated the outside of the house and this was just recently and i believe that what the work that they've done on their house that the dollywood or the that the it to you would be the same type of wonderful thing i mean and it would add value not only to the neighborhood but to city hall or all right thank you hello my name's truly it's eleven sixteen powers avenue in grand rapids michigan but i'm a professor of music here college is going to be my fourth year teaching and as that looks to be more  at as being a very positive impact and something that i would appreciate and love to live around so as i kind of look to move here to holland this is something that is really attractive to me  support my name's jared to meester i live at fifty west twenty first street just to speak from the perspective of a first time home buyer i purchased my home at the end of tw fifteen and people like josh and susanna and kind of the creative energy that they're looking to be able to promote through this eighty you is the reason that i graduated left tallent and then decided to come back because there are people who are creating in and doing really beautiful things so i voiced my support for this thank you thanks plastic and manufactured products on the exterior the house josh didn't even want to put cement board on the outside of the house as i had originally planned he wanted the the pure look of cedar wood signing just as it was put up when it was built originally so the integrity that they show in the architecture and to preserve the building the way it was intended to look is something that i've done for the lake shore homes my builders lake shore homes across  lake shore north holland and to have somebody do that in town after seeing the trends that we've we've gone towards petroleum based exteriors i mean it was it was a good breath of fresh air for me i love to be a part of those projects and no doubt i've kind of been a part of the process help josh look at materials for how we were going to do the aid you it was approved and the same integrity we approached it with the same integrity that he approached when he did when he did the house  so there's no doubt in my mind that the quality of the project is not an issue the architectural design of the house fits perfectly with what we've got going on and really more important for my generation is how we're going to move into the future you know where generation may have to take care of our parents you know maybe the era of nursing homes is over and this is a step in that direction for caring for the ones who cared for us when we're young so i'd love to see these type of structures go up in holland despite the size or the footprint of the lot and some people are just not blessed with big lots but i don't feel like that should prohibit the surface structures going up so i just applaud them for taking  anyone else to speak in favor of going once going twice all right let's look to the other side of the coin anyone here to speak in opposition ok seeing none i'll close the public hearing what's the pleasure the board on this ite i'd like to make a motion to approve the construction of the aid to you in ninety seven east twenty third street i support i've got a motion by van der an answer porque by libby and i get findings of fact please approved through the residential and fill the applicant has submitted a proper site plan it will be between the minimum of one hundred twenty square feet and a maximum of seven hundred twenty square feet an area they will be connected to city water and sewer the location for the proposed aid you will meet all the required setbacks baby you has a footprint of one third or less of the principle structure eighty you comply with the maximum height requirements of twelve feet for single storey and twenty four feet for two storey the applicant has submitted a four plan showing kitchen bathroom an appropriate sleeping area and maybe was compatible  harmonious with the character of nearby residentially developed properties ok dan do we have what we a building at their home at two twenty one west eleventh street the building would be sixteen feet high where the maximum height is twelve feet this building would be located in the historic district is required to have a certificate of appropriateness and meet other conditions for the board to approve the request thirty nine dash one eighty five f how do you think i you are the ems i am the applicant stacy carr friend from three two one west eleventh street right and we are just applying to have a high variance we went through all the restrictions with the historic district ok and so so you've got your certificate appropriateness you yes you're planning on meeting all the building fire safety and other applicable codes yes and the negative impact to your anybody else's property of building in a rebuilding not that i'm aware of no all right anything else you want to say no i appreciate your time any questions from the board for the applicant ok thank you ok thank you anyone else to speak in favor of this application anyone in opposition all right now closed the public hearings was a pleasure the board are ready to make a motion ok make a motion that we approve the request to twenty one last eleventh street for the special exception for the project second alright motion by libby second by bedard findings of fact the applicant does have a certificate of appropriateness issued by the storage district they have agreed to meet the fire safety codes the building codes and it appears that there will be a negative impact on the adjoining properties all right so we have what we need that we do all right sharon davis of seventeen feet for a variance or sixteen feet for a special exception with a variance needed for the ten foot eight inches wall height where the maximum is nine foot thirty nine hundred eighty five looks like we stopped being easy just in case of a technical questions but my name's bryant at home so my wife and i own the property at one forty eight west tenth street ok we are seeking the variance for garage height and w infill review with time with city employees that was approved and we believe and we tried to respect the neighborhood as best as possible having a detached garage in this neighborhood even though we're outside of the historic district so we can go up to nine to nine foot on the side wall and you need ten foot one and then eight and my reading there right  here i'm seeing five foot eight inches so i'm a little confused on what what exactly you're looking for  billings is measured to the middle of the row system you can see in that drawing you know so he's got a he's got a ten foot wall you're sitting on a six probably a six inch revealed foundation and then at that pitch and that with a that grudge that puts that just under seventeen feet measured to the midpoint right there ok so all right where i was i think i was getting confused as i'm trying to add five foot eight and ten  all right so we come to work questions that we need to to dig into here so for a variance what's unique arrogance nothing is unique about the site the home was very specifically designed to be consistent in scale and proportion the size of the garage is consistent with the home which is because estate with the height of the home and the interiors of the home and the roof pitch is all very identical done very intentionally to fit the neighborhood ok you're saying it's done intentionally to fit the neighborhood you would be adjacent to the historic district we yes we would be across an alleyway of a private association yes right to add just a interesting comment on that we were one of the first homes to go to infill reviewed  before the historical commission surgery theirs and so we intentionally had a detached garage to intentionally be more neighborhood appropriate to our surprise after that the historic district started approving attach grudges so all of the homes in the had tatra grudge it's easy all the homes across the alley in the historic district actually have attached grudges some of which are consistently taller than s just an inch yeah right thank you so something unique might be that you're justice certainly any negative impact to any surrounding properties we do not believe so i have not heard anything myself any questions from the board for the  ok thank you thank you well wait a minute before i before i let you let's go back up that was the variance conditions let's talk about special is the additional height of the garage necessary to allow the roof slope to match the pitch of the principal structure yes it is the roof pitch at least for over twelve yes it is the wall height at least five feet no more than nine feet the wall height is larger than one feet ok all right we're going to have to challenge there are the bottom chords of trusses designed for twenty pounds or less per square foot of live load yes right will edition have a positive or no impact to the joining property we believe so yes is the proposed building been approved through the city's infill process yes all right any questions from the board on those set of criteria answered my name is tim batts i'm one forty four west tenth street not quite there yet but ok i own the property there so brian's my neighbor great guy there again i see is gradually day and watching it being i don't have a problem one with that cell there again i'm going to be up here in a few minutes and we're going to go through the same thing so ok just reverse the roles you know i think his his house aesthetically it matches his grudge matches what he's thank you anyone else to speak in favor and he won an opposition ok i'll close the public hearing any discussion go ahead i was going to ask about he made mention of something some energy then could you give us that could you give us that term the energy item at a good foot that wall yes she's putting up right now a diagram of what an energy field looks like it raises the risk system up a little bit so that enough insulation can be placed over the double top plate of the wall it's a way of preserving energy and creating a reduction in in ice development on the i think she's putting it up three to one and there i is that included in the dimension the ten foot well that's correct well that's not correct that is that's that is not in the ten but one heights that is in addition to that and so that was a special condition so that they could provide additional insulation above the double top pl any of the discussion there question so there was with pleasure the board exception in unless they got a variance to the nine foot one right so but and like we talked about if you're overweight the variance any way you do a very it's very everything being it get it done that's right to make a motion by that that a motion five endure and support by libby making new words here chuck can you give me findings of fact sure there is a unique circumstance and the direct proximity to the historic district neighborhood this is that it is the minimum necessary to do substantial justice to the owner or neighbor neighboring properties or the variance will cause positive or no impact on the front of properties property values or use of enjoyment of property in the what i'm saying is you created a motion that motion was voted on and writing down writing so you could also say well we're going to take a look at something different you know you could do the special exception with the wallet change is there an interest in doing a special exception for the garage site ok and actually in this particular case this one would probably would have a tissue with the sixteen feet as well i think we're done unless someone on the board really wants to push this through four  i'm not hearing any takers ok one forty four window forty four yeah one forty four west tenth peter lake peterson representing tim in brenda betts is requesting variances and or exception to construction and accessory building at the home he is building at one forty four west tenth the building would have an average height of fifteen point five feet forty especially exception with a variance needed for the wall height of ten feet six inches where a nine foot son blake peterson is not here he's actually my builder too so i live at one forty four west tenth street lak scuse me i don't live there yet but i own west one forty four west tenth street we we nt through the infield process we went through zoning we went through building buildings are now being constructed so this variance comes at a shock to both myself and my neighbors anyway you can see the design of the property we spent a lot of money in architectural drawings and so forth we thought that we went through the proper channels to have this built and at which point it's well under way  i don't see any negative impacts on this it fits in well it fits the design of our house you can see that little circle window on the top of it that's that's huge for aesthetics for my lovely wife  so but anyway yeah in a nutshell that's why i'm not sure what i'm applying for or that was done by my son you know so i was out i answer what i can all right circumstances or physical conditions of the property are we looking for especially i was looking at the variance we've got a v we have to do the same thing that there's the only thing that is this similar to that from this to the to the one the previous one is this does have an average height don't less than sixteen feet ok whereas the last one had sixteen and a half it's just the design of the house i mean we put a lot of time and energy into this house to make it fit and look like it was a historical type home i've spent a lot of money way more than i wanted to and  building experience has not been off to a great start it should be a fun a fun event and we've had these issues and this this is this is kind of kind of a sad thing but yes anyway  yeah ok the need for the variance was not self created correct strict adherence to the requirements would reasonably prevent you from using the property correct ok this is the minimum necessary correct and is there any impact on properties absolutely not all right any questions for the applicant from the board all right thank you him so one forty eight west tenth street i believe that that's home is architecturally consistent with the neighborhood i believe it fits in very well with the historic district that borders and it support their motion for a variance or special it's all right thank you anyone in opposition ok i'll close the public hearing with pleasure the board think through this here we got a three to two we don't have so if you turned it the other way we would only have three votes to pass so it's denied but you might need to make that motion through it so you know let's let's if that's the case let's just open it up for additional motions and maybe include it that way even if we make one motion too many all right that's fine better than the mess up make it so rather rather than go that way let's go the other way let's do a motion to approve it and then we make sure we're on the right side of the where we we did the other one already so the reason this one was any different was because we did a motion tonight so can i get a motion to approve it motion to approve ok i'll second all right so motion by will be second by vendor and findings of fact well the unique circumstances are the properties adjacent to the stork district as far as wishes to install windows in the east wall starting with the second floor and continuing to the fourth hour while he is to be construction the property line where the michigan code building i'm sorry the michigan building code does not permit self created issue thank goodness thank goodness because this is all created intentionally but for the better of the community so yes we own the property a sixty west eighth street and we would like to build this four story building of which three stories the upper floor floors will be apartments to make those apartments as nice as possible we would like to put windows on three of the walls so we're allowed windows no problem on the on the north and on the south but on the east we have a little bit of an issue but we have kind of a unique situation here in that we also own the property to the east so as the owner of the property to the east of this parcel we would like to propose a solution to the code requirement of no windows on the east side so the solution is that we would propose to use the equivalency and move to code seven o five point eight and the way to do that is if we offer to put a five foot air easement over the property to the east which would prohibit construction in that five feet on the east parcel so if we put the air easement over that property to the east nothing will ever be built there so then we can switch detect who's done the code research on the design david dervaes and i would like to let him do a little their presentation on that if you don't have any other questions for me go for  with progressive eighty representing them on the screen there that is showing what the building code requires right now no windows because we're right there on the property line to be able to build it you would that's what it would look like which you know when you see the building is not going to be the best looking building around just because it and for the units and things it's just not going to work out very well at all so because the client owns the building next door we do have an opportunity here to be able to adjust and still stay within the michigan building code if you can put up the next one to e p one hundred sheep that shows what were yes that's one so if you can see the blue line there that's above the the holland sentinel building right it's that guy that's the five feet so it's five feet that be east that were coming out so if they were to sell or if they did decide themselves to add on to the home sentinel building they would not be able to build into that area by having that question the do do that walk in your discussion then right we'll feel it should be five all right yeah five feet is all you need the building code divides it into if you look at the table seventy five point eight you get zero to three feet three to five three to less than five then there's five to ten so the property line to the proper line so the six feet will be would help us the same as the five feet i would later i would like to address that  when i got on with it it all comes under the you know it it all comes under the definition of fire separation distance those measurements on that chart are made to the to the point at which a fire separation distance is measured and  that's either to go back to the debt the definition section is to the closest interior a lot line to the center line of a street alley or public way which this area easement is kind of construed as a public  way or to an imaginary line between two buildings you know so to to allow for any portion of the of the the windows this is is a kind of a pseudo public way because it's being cleared so the nets to the center line of that so the building that the proposed to make it to build the measurements made to the center line of that and then in the if they do an addition on the central building at that point as well they will be also held to the same condition that is to the center line of that space so to be allowed to do any windows you really have to have three point one feet to the centerline and the three point one feet from the satellite to the sentinel addition or whatever you want to hold right you know that makes it just over  correct yeah and so you're really you really need to have your aries meant to be over six foot wide six point two i would agree with that ok all right  right that's what you meant all right so oh ok so we're at six are blueline at six point two that will allow us to switch over in the michigan building code two seven six point one point seven zero six point six point one fire walls and a step to building which allows you know basically we can put windows in we are restricted and how much glass we can put on  are restricted in it's a one hour rating in the as the every step up yeah if you can leave that same picture up please yeah that's a good picture yeah you can see you can see the outline of the sentinel building in white there then we have the red which is straight out of the building code that's thirty inches where we can't we can't do anything openings at all then in the orange piece we can have openings but they have to be fire rating openings record out so we need fire ready glass we need something of that openings as in windows and then in the area above that we can have that's a one hour rated wall but we have we are allowed so many so much percentage of glass that we can have openings in there that are not rated i believe it's twenty five percent right offhand and we're at like twenty one percent and i think seventeen percent or so all these ratings that you're showing here in and the level of protection that you're showing with it remain the same should someone build on top of the site with the correct with that six foot spacing still apply correct they would still apply and then actually the whoever would build above the set know they would get the same options they would have to have the same type of ratings basically what's happening is you're getting farther and farther away from the building that means the raid instance step down so if the central building was on fire right there within thirty inches were no openings fully one hour rated and then as we of that window would not be included even though it's awfully close to the red line yes that is the in the commentary which is actually on the other side they have a diagram but again fortunately the building code on shows straight they don't show steps of that nature so you interpret it as straight up that's correct  yes it does yeah you sometimes you don't try to make sense of the building code it is what it is  all right so the proposal on the table from from you then is can we put that picture back up please thank you the you will be fully compliant with the building code for a stepped building and you will ensure that it remain compliant by providing an air easement at least twice the  distance from that the building calls out from the face of the building to the centerline of the easement yes i think we want to be a little bit flexible with that number based on what their proposal is as long as it meets that chart attorney and also record on the deeds both buildings you know and thing else you want to talk about don't any other questions from the board for the applicant aright anyone else to speak in favor and he want to speak in opposition right will close up a public hearing and a discussion amongst the board lets the pleasure of the board provided an alternative method that meets the intent of the code as far as keeping the separation of buildings with openings and i don't believe that this would be a situation that would home yeah we can put that on there was part of their application anyway whether yeah yeah we'll put that condition on there that it does have to be ordered for both  something if the i guess i'm just being overly guarded if the situation changes so that these conditions aren't there anymore the safeguards that the applicants require at their expense to bring the building to curb illegal in other words gets past a billion apartment puts a couple of new windows in there that if it's not to say these windows are no longer three or three quarter hours that at the expense of the owners of the building that those situations will be resolved yes so they  if the circumstances change where they don't have this protection anymore that it will be you their expense to make sure that the bill is brought into code and current code compliance  record i'm looking for a special exception which would allow my business partner who is not my spouse it's a business partner to be able to work out of my home so in the application i addressed all the points that were there the business would be conducted in the basement area the home less than fifty percent of the basement area materials would be in it area there'd be no outside structure there'd be no noises vibrations mo best odor heat glare impacting the neighbors there be no ons television parking i did submit a picture of the home i have plenty of space at the top of my drive in front of the third stall were my business partner could park there is road space as well but there is plenty of space at my home so you address some of these but i'll run down all right yeah yeah i know i wasn't quick all right is the home business clearly incidental and secondary to the principle residential use of the del residential character ok just trying to trip you up their home business will not generate noise vibration smoke dust any other nuisances correct it will be no electrical interference materially impair the intent and purposes of this chapter for the public health safety and welfare correct all right you're going to have a sign you know all right you had a housing inspection in accordance with this section of the city coverage yes ok only one home business yes home businesses not exceeding fifty percent of the floor area of one story or and fifty percent of the detached excess and there are two parking spots available for onsite and or on street immediately in front of the premises correct ok yes that's everything that's all o to say no thank you ok anyone else to speak in favor the application anyone in opposition closed the public hearing is going to make this motion make a motion that we probably know my job there is a manager of broadband services i'm responsible for the fiber infrastructure and you probably know we're in the process of building a new fiber plant in downtown holland  that fiber plant requires a head and where all the fibers terminate and after much searching and working with the city to find a spot we found this little tiny spot behind the seven street parking garage you guys i think have seen the  diagrams this is a small utility space the the extra generator that is emerging provides emergency power for the parking garages in this area and the space is used typically in the winter to store snow as they pull snow off of the garage so it worked if tuck it into a corner back there the proposal i have before you shows the footprints and  what else can i tell you trish can you scroll to the picture what size is it again the size of the hut is the hut has inches by twenty six feet nine inches ok and appears to be is correct eleven and a half ish by twenty correct me up dan you may have seen my planning  commission application that has some diagrams for actually a smaller hut we're considering are smaller ones so part of your decision process might consider that we will be building something of this size or smaller and also the height of the hut is actually shorter than the parking garage so we'll be invisible from the street access to this is done very rarely by our technicians to plug fiber cable ok so we have once everything terminated just does this thing run absolutely it's a communications hut similar to what base what you've seen around town there's plenty of cabinets that the b p w has today the transformers and whatnot this is just like that's a little bit larger because of the sheer number of fiber optic cables and network electronics we need so this is a c c three and so the  there's no public access it's a utility building right now the section that he's applying for is applying to to not have is up all building shabnam of one primary entrance opening to the adjacent sidewalk of the street in which the building fronts does this but there's this building front on a street or doesn't have a sidewalk there a judge doesn't frown on a street and it won't have a sidewalk it's just something for right needs need for the variances and self created in my understanding is not self created yes and strict adherence is unreasonably burdensome in my opinion is the minimum necessary yes any negative impact from keeping you are allowing you not to put in a sidewalk no no negative impact and any questions from the board site i'm thinking is there something to the last is there is there will catch to put a sidewalk to the west that the in this is really talking about the city sidewalk not access to a sidewalk this section is for the downtown retail areas really we're talking about ordinance which isn't really meant to regulate utility buildings it's normally when you when you erect a building downtown you have some street furniture which includes  sidewalk in the idea behind it is that if you need to provide access from the sidewalk to your store you know whatever else  the one comment is there's other open space on this property to the west up against the neighboring parcel i worked with the city the city considered that property is potentially being developed and  in order not to interfere with any visuals in that area we decided to tuck it back into this corner behind the curve ramp so it's hidden away more often when you see someone process starts but once it's up and running we won't be in there much at all  this is a mock up i think as we go further the door may not actually face to the north we may have a face to the south and integrating with the parking garage a little closer and we're go suss that out and that would be part of our building permit process with dan to make sure that we're in north and proper who are there to write right just to complete the record this building is utility building being built downtown which is own c three which has a large number of regulations which are more fitting towards the pedestrian friendly environment in addition there are a number of scenarios that this does not just because one was not allowable not that they chose not to do it i think that it just wasn't it wasn't considered when they were mrs rev wright this scenario was not considered by by ordinance they need to come here and hopi are is an option that's correct any and any parking ramp right in front of it had the same scenario right place department yeah i know what it's what i was trying to do is clarify that it's not that planning commission decided not to grant a no p r for this they don't have the option of no that's not the case they had the option to they just had didn't think that this was going to be necessary oh i'm saying this is they didn't think that they have there maybe you know p r down the road on this th that's true and in this situation there is not a no b r it's not because they didn't didn't think we should have won it's just that they they didn't think it was necessary food for thought ok i think i know what you're talking all right and the questions for the i think thank you very much a body here to speak in favor anybody in opposition anybody anybody all right close public hearing with pleasure the board let's make a motion to need findings of fact jump we're jumping the gun here all right there unique circumstances or physical conditions of the property that are not due the applicant's personal or economic difficulty the variant the need for the variance is not self created strict adherence to the requirements for the reason the owner from using the property for the permitted use this is the minimum variance necessary to do justice the variance will cause positive or no impact on the surrounding properties that's all ok sherry in europe davis yes maybe yes back in february twenty seventh see this board heard an appeal from building men for life for the property at three seven the country club at that meeting there now sorry was that they construct a six foot tall solid fence along the west side of the property so the applicant contacted our office they put up this material and they wanted to know if this match the criteria of the college facts staff was not able to you make that determination so we request seen an interpretation from the bard already my name is jeff entries i'm a lawyer here in holland i work for billing man for life and excuse me your address all six six my office address a six six five hundred thirty six avenue suite one hundred holland had jeff will display they all have ts in front of all these t v s right and basically a solid means it's got to have three dimensions and this can't be something  yeah if you can be but the why don't you give her the whole stack of there you go on the microphone and talk through it so yeah this is a nice chain link fence this is the chain link fence exists along the property in there for probably one hundred years you know that we would have to cut down in order to put a fence in order to put a wooden fence provided you put the fence on the property line yeah yeah right and there's about twenty to twenty five feet distance between the property line there and the structure of three seventy country club you can also see on the right on the view past the fence that's the neighboring property yeah that's taken just roughly another ten feet closer to adams road sixteenth street again that shows like there's huge massive trees that would have to be cut down in order to put something on that property line if you could switch to the next one that shows the fence that we've that we put up that is green in color  it's just another shot of the property line and all the trees on that shot picture i just took like two or three hours ago and that one is  just north of quincy street there's there's a industrial commercial building and they have that fence in front of a it's black you can't see through it it provides screening  so basically what i'm asking is for this board to determine that of solid funds means what it means in the dictionary which is you have to have something that's not the offense with holes in it and that that type of offense meets the definition of what a solid fence is simply by definition  and has to do otherwise would cost cutting the trees down or most of the trees down which i know from having served on other public boards before we don't want to generally speaking we don't want to cut down trees or they're good for the healthy environment it's it would make it look much less of an attractive property  both from our side and from the neighbor and the neighbors who are trying to deal with here so i'm confused on the how does the fencing material impact whether the trees have to stay or go well that's a good question obviously the the flexibility of the fiber screen that you have there means that you can put that around a tree for instance you could  rather than cutting a tree down or going down half the tree which is going to kill the trees and basically it doesn't serve any purpose it's only a negative to put that requirement a bit of wood fence goes up and there you can look on the other side of the on the on the proprietor one sorry tricia the fence on the other side the one and the box on the bottom left hand side right there  over that's the fence on the other side of their hundred foot lot which is you got holes through that as well you can spray can see through from on the picture from forty feet away hundred feet  for a special exception for persons with an accommodation and requesting an accommodation so the application for the accommodation was approved with conditions one of the conditions was that they install a six foot solid fence along the east property line anyone else to speak in favor seeing as we have an empty room anyone in opposition all right i'll close the public hearing what's the discussion amongst the board  saying that the fabric fence is not a solid fence or something that affects do we need to that we need to sweeney something that the board makes a boat on that but gives us some help with interpretation of what a solid fence ok what we think would make us elephants my intent was a wood fence or one of those for example if you set a wood structure or a wood fence and you had slats to put on summer with that have met your condition as well of being a solid wood fence the intent with solid fence i  potentially so i think it also from an aesthetic standpoint mean part of their original application was to create an environment that was residential in nature of these you know and so for the residents of the property that looks and dust real to me just my own two cents but you know if it was your backyard so i one hundred percent coverage perpendicular to the fence and they can have up to down to fifty percent coverage or something when viewed at angle you know that's i used to live in places where where they had requirements that you had to see be able to see through the fence at an angle but you could see you know it could be solid perpendicular and that i think make him a material won't be enough if we just say specifically what we that i think in this case we're saying this doesn't need it and that's solid fence well i would like to get to preponderance of the board's vote on that so you know that it's not one one person on the board deciding on that so i don't like it in the motion yeah we'll do a motion we're just trying to craft what that needs to be and so i think that you guys are going to live without some sort of a percentage coverage or that i think that's adequate we're in the process of redoing our fence ordinance freestanding permanent priest and it's probably as appropriate i'm sure but that way then we have a straightforward answer so something effective a solid fence is has the following properties it's constructed of stone blah blah barrier for privacy freestanding permanent and i think because of the performance standards that it sounds like you're headed towards i think i don't think we're going to be able to be specific instance a celebrating to a certain decimal level but i think the word maybe reasonable sound will that were for city staff like ok so i have a solid fences the following properties freestanding rigid fence made of wood concrete p v c or other similar materials providing reasonable visual and sound blocking properties that sufficient we still have some things on the board we have to elect officers for the year with the progress right right i was just going there we got meeting minutes to approve from june twenty second i wasn't here you know someone was here want to make money the motion to approve the meeting minutes from june twenty second support all right motion by endurance support by davis all in favor anyone else here let's look around the room and see if anyone else has anyone else care to put their name to leave the circus any other candidates to be nominated for chair i think it's time to close those right seeing is there is only one candidate for chair yeah nominations for vice chair don't everybody jump at once but i just want to remind you i just want to remind all of you that there are two all tournaments ok that i'm not sure about that we have to check but i think it a permanent member would be a much better choice so that with those are down to two what are the responsibilities of the vice chair when i elect not to be here your chair i would like to nominate that is the next meeting as to my coven where in celebration day for michael ware and some service on the board all right we will think michael then we're at our next meeting for his service on the board all right and he is so we got a motion do we have any support to close the meeting support oh thank you