your call to order the july eighteenth two thousand eight hundred meeting of the shouldn't county regional planning commission on i understand that we now airing live on you tube so to start this for nothing on the concern agenda deliberative agenda that's been called to order are there any changes to the agenda during no turn are there any of the members of the public would like to make a comment on items not appearing on our next item on the agenda which is an m p o matter is the fiscal year two thousand and nineteen through twenty two transportation programs first of all is there a motion to open the public hearing twenty twenty two so i'm just going to give a little bit of background about what it is and then we're going to talk about this to fix this most of you probably heard parts of this presentation before but i just want to get us all on the same page and a refresher for everybody else what we're doing so just to put it on tax of all the work that we do here we kind of start you know with the broad view that the ego's plan the metropolitan transportation studies and then really from there get into more location specific projects scoping studies where we really start to develop projects to address issues that are identified  p and also in the planning corner studies and then from there is the funding is trying to get projects cued up to be funding and that's the the tip the step the capital program there is a statewide transportation improvement program that is similar to what we do here the tip becomes part of the stepped capital program of the state budget and construction so so everybody is aware that we are a metropolitan plenty organization with the only m p o in the state of vermont and the tip is a federal requirement so we have to do this as an m p the tip is it's a list of projects out prioritize this a constrained multi year list of federally funded transportation projects and operations in the m p o region and just some points in that sentence the tip must be fiscally constrained and that means it has to be based on money that we actually expect to be available and to be county to the projects that are listed on the tips are things that we actually expect to be able to do it must cover at least four years that's in the federal ra thinking and it must be updated at least every four years we typically update it every year there's a lot of changes in projects every year so we like to just refresh it every year and the tip authorizes the obligation of federal funds and this is an obscure but important point is that the tip is not a budget document it's and it's a planning document the obligation is the process of setting funds aside to fund phases of projects what we do in the t obligate funds for projects that then are going to be spent at a later date so i think the important thing to note with that is that the spending in the tip is a little bit earlier than when you actually see construction count their chickens until they're awarded to a trying to keep the chicken thing i mean i really can't but yes the obligation is what gets the ball rolling the project rolling  this based on a continuing comprehensive transportation planning process carried out parker of labor state the m p r and transit operators so the way that we do the tip is spelled out in federal law as is what's in the tip we have to all work together and we have to work with the  we have to work with fremont transit and it's a collaborative process project in a to have to be ready to spend the money so this is this is actual money that's coming  in our tip and it's approved by this body we're vitrines as a boat it becomes part of the tick yes but that does not guarantee that it makes it into the state capital program elemental between the tip of the stick and the state's capital program ye money at project gets closer to construction and yes so every year we refreshed the the estimates so you know the planning phase they're very they're very conceptual they're very general right by the time we're getting to a point that guess we're getting better at it than we used to be but i think it's just part of the planning process the project development process is things things change so i don't it doesn't it doesn't give them a lower rank necessarily i mean in theory what you say is true it affects cost benefit but i know it's never knocked a project that i know sections there's an introduction that's just some background information what the tip is there's a section here that's new about performance measures which is a just a little general right now because we're still developing those concepts but we do have to weave performance man performance measures throughout all our planning processes and one area will be and there's an adoption resolution there's a glossary and then there's a map and i'll say a little bit more minute so section two is a list of actual the projects and we'll talk to them in a minute section three is some tables and charts and financial information which we also talk about in more detail page one of the tips just very quickly just to orient you it's the projects are or organized alphabetical by town they have a c circusy number that doesn't really have any significance other than for us project name sometimes there's four columns those are the federal funds and each of the four federal fiscal years these are federal funds only they don't include state and local match and then there are spaces for the project annually p e primary engine airing our view is right of way be a note here that says the most common note says funds to be obligated and after white eighteen were currently in f y eighteen so that means if that were the note there would be no dollar amounts here that just means that the project is supposed to be finished this year there are some circle turn of comments in the bottom and some places to if you see any comments or questions about it and you can let me know and then this double line just give separate some other project information there's the total cost information here that includes the state and local match federal funds obligate so these are a little bit of an oddball these two columns the federal funds obligated through f  together you would have the amount that was spent prior to f y nineteen i know it's a little bit confusing but if you have questions and ask me please use category we divide projects into categories and i will also talk about a little bit more  document page for i think four or five or something like that if you want to see it more carefully it's also on our website so you can zoom in and look at all the projects in the family are its color coded by year and then different  symbols for different project twenty two total of two hundred forty two point one million so that sounds like all a lot of money so this chart kind of puts it in a in a historical perspective so that we can see how it relates to past years i color coded the burlington international airport projects in green and the reason i did that mostly is because of this really large lead in twenty seven thousand so i wanted to make it clear that that it's not all money coming to us so the airport projects that there are grants there the airport improvement program grants for planning and development they go to the airport they're not money that we are able to use for our purposes so this blip was really some major runway reconstruction to happen in twenty seventeen so other than that if you look at the blue columns we're kind of going a little bit and we had some high years and seventeen eighteen and nineteen twenty twenty one twenty two are a little bit more in line with where we've been in the past so important things you know from this chart is that the projects in the tip base th is developed based on projects being ready to go and that's why there's a lot of variation we don't have a set dollar amount that we program to but trans is working on a lot of different projects and bringing them forward rather than go through this table and it's going to flash the names of projects i'm just going to do this quickly if you had something that you wanted to ask about but i'm just kind of lay it out by category so i said before the projects that the tip is  we look at products by category aviation we talked about that before thirteen point four percent of the total in the steere thirty two point five million combination of air film projects noise mitigation and terminal and air bike had this is the largest number of projects on the tip in a category eighteen projects but it's only two point five percent of the total these are grant projects mainly by compared grants and transportation alternative grants and we've noted before that the transportation alternative program is going to storm water i believe for one more year so these are older projects sidewalk grants that was a program that says your pussy used to have that we don't anymore and  there's one circle turn to the sidewalk project to six million bridge preservation eight projects here fourteen million five point nine percent of the total mainly state bridges the bottom to our in project will support can ride and that is supposed to be under construction next year new facility major roadway upgrade this is a category of only six projects but it is the largest  dollar category to twenty four point seven in the twenty four point seven percent of the total fifty nine point nine million parkway x sixteen x seventeen exit twelve crossing connector and market street and i'm going to say a little bit more about this category in a minute and all of these to the champagne parkway supposed to be under construction next year exit sixteen the year after crescent connector is supposed to start this year market street next safety traffic operations and i ts a large category of projects these are in our state and signal projects fifteen projects at seventeen percent of the total and and this is an important category because it keeps it helps us keep the agreement in transit based on them being a transit operator new services that are funded with congestion mitigation air quality funds there's f d a grants that he has applied for and really is an disable programs and the last category storm modern veyron mental there are fifteen projects here they're generally smaller projects one point seven percent of the total cost these are to beach mainly to be trans grant program stimulus will highway and storm water mitigation program and transportation combination of the roadway projects fifty one percent of the total goes to these categories so the highest amount goes to that new facility major roadway upgrade and the next tice's transit so a tax meeting there was a conversation about that scuse me that new new facility major roadway upgrade and how high that is and how does that relate to our history so  put this chart together which i know is really very busy but what i want you to notice is the bottom so these are all the categories going from two thousand dollars to two thousand and seventeen and i think the one th first thing to note from this is how much everything changes here here the funding by category is very variable but the bottom the bottom slice whatever you call it but the bottom piece that dark blue is the new capacity category so what you'll see is that while it was a high percent in the current tip it does not reflect the way that it's been in the past and it's generally quite low but it was high in that period of three or four or four or five of the three or four five six and that was when we constructed shelburne road kennedy drive that when you ski downtown project there was funding for the circle a way for champlain parkway so back created that way but for the most part it is a goal it is a goal in our plan to maintain the existing system and that is in fact what we do and we've been trying to do sixteen and seventeen premiers and then the point i was going make to is you know those of us who may have sort of looked out and noticed over the course of the last decade there hasn't been much in the way of increased capacity in shipping county mr blair stuart when he was commenting on the fission plan you know the road we can spend some quarter improvements are probably the wrong way to go and yet they're getting a big dose this year and maybe the other issues issues may need to be prioritized going right and we will be doing that in the future i think we only have one performance measure that has been approved so far i just think it would be nice to know which measures nation you should be down to oh well we have to do that category i think the category also the new facility major roadway upgrade also considers some when we're talking about exit twelve exit seventeen and sixteen there's also some significant just means of the existing system that becomes part of those facilities as well seventeen  requires a new reconstruction of the bridge over the interstates so there's it's a combination of different factors but yes i agree with ray i can hear what he said and i know this will be something that will look at kind of whole system performance the other aspect that i think this is more we're getting to is also how we prioritize further and so that christine's been doing a lot of work with the transit of new projects selection  prioritization process so i think they'll be coming up to the board here in the fall to look at that and i think that will actually move us further down the road to understanding prioritizing things and how they fit in your package a balance about what is part of that but my arm and basically it's that we follow the laws that we don't discriminate that we maintain competition and i want to compliment the staff on the briefing materials on the plating certification that's the first time i had somebody present to me in one thousand eight hundred nineteen years on this body why we do these types of things you sit there and you don't know why you do that was very so it is i would move that we authorize the chair to sign the certification of the planning process letter to the appropriate federal authority they further discussion of favor s executive committee and full commission meetings as well as the regular meeting times of various committees there was one change that was me by the executive committee and their recommendation to the full commission that took place before this meeting and that is to change the executive committee meeting scheduled for september five two thousand and eighteen to august twenty ninth two thousand and eighteen and that is due to the support of issues of september five so the recommendation of the executive committee is for the proposed set of schedules with the one change of september five to members on that committee we don't need to fill those blanks so right now our committees of the members on the different committees are are ok but if you'd like to either get off or get on the committee this is a great opportunity to let the chair know once and certainly to the extent on the drive home you suddenly have the peson in decide you want to serve we will accept your interest after this this is the squirrely process in our bylaws where the chair stablish is in the points committees and members with the concurrence of the full commission so if there could be a motion of concurrence largely the same as what you saw i believe in your may board meetings so just to clarify just to bring everybody up to speed again we have two processes outlined here one of them is our process to look at active fifty review and we were suggesting not really to change that based on changes that were made to work it just plan will continue to be focusing not review only news and transportation specifically and then our section two forty eight review process is proposed to be change and here we discussed this at length again and in the may board meeting and what you got in your packets is you know all the track changes or the changes that have been made throughout this process the highlights in yellow are specifically changes that have been made since that meeting so either based on comments that we got from you or a couple clarifying questions that we got from our planning advisory committee so  just going through those really quickly on page four is the first change basically just clarifying a substantial difference in our process for commenting with that also clarifying that we were you both advance notices in petitions and clarifying that we'll continue to be working with municipal staff as were going through this process and making sure that we're getting the town or the cit views on whatever on whatever viewing and then we do have a couple changes that we're suggesting and we had a chance to talk to the executive committee about this just now based on some comments we heard from jeff thank you they're very helpful on clarifying the difference between when he executive committee can essentially act on its own to participate in a section two forty eight process and when that needs to come before the full board so previously the language in there basically said that the executive committee may decide to bring it to the board and there weren't any standards for when that would happen and so we do have these standards outlined in our two fifty section of this policy and basically what it says there is that if we're saying something good we're saying that the project is in conformance with the original plan and it's you know we don't have any concerns about transportation and the executive committee can go ahead and approve that letter and we'll send it in if we're saying that there's a problem with the project and we're trying to stop essentially stop or register negative comments about the project  polls board would get involved and so essentially what we are proposing to add here and this is what you have in front of you with the green highlights this is page six and seven of what you got in your  is essentially to say the scene thing for section two forty eight so what we're proposing here is that the decision to intervene we can still be done by the executive and we're suggesting that remains that way because the notice the notice of intervention that we would put in doesn't have to say that we're having you know that we're doing it for negative comments sometimes will intervene to stay to stay as part of the process to give ourselves the option to submit comments later and depending on when the board is meeting it also can present a scheduling problem to get that notice in with the board and so what this language is proposing is that the board has to take action if we're submitting something that again says something negative about the project problem all kinds of noises tonight so yeah the other there's another dimension to this and we empower the executive committee of organization to do lots of things and in the interest of the fish and sea and dealing with routine matters that don't rise to the level of board consideration and i appreciate the head it's that we made to make it conform with our act to fifty approach in terms of when it's appropriate for the executive committee in may be contested cases to come to the full board but i hope that both of that two fifteen to forty eight certificate of public good proceedings that our executive committee should feel empowered to come to the board to get feedback on projects even if they're not contested even if they executive committee believes that there are positives and the hypothetical that i threw out what if we had a nine hundred acre solar farm that went into three three of our member communities none of which were represented by a board member on the executive committee and that even though we are we support renewable energy and maybe it's a fantastic project it doesn't violate any of our stricken areas and on  slopes that we would think that the executive committee would at least come back to the board if the schedule allowed to solicit feedback and direction from the board not necessarily from the standpoint that we think it's consent tested but so that they don't have to take the responsibility particularly if it involves a project where none of the members of the executive committee are represented in the community member community that's impacted so i appreciate the issue of being clear about when we intervene particularly in contested cases but i would hope our executive committee will feel comfortable as they always seem to be coming to the board on issues that maybe are significant but not necessarily contested just to get feedback from the board in terms of how we're executing in serving our member communities and so this was very to me very exacting the board centric and not that our deck of community would become a junta or something like that we just wanted to make sure that there was a sense in our writings and even if they weren't formally in case  these this language that there would least be some informal protocols where the chair but suggest to the executive committee that we should at least inform the board even if it's an informational item and solicit feedback and that's helpful i mean the tension here of course is there are times when deadlines would necessitate quicker action by the executive committee but especially in the p c context you get your pre filing forty five days ahead of time and if there is a project of significance that implicate concerns which may or may not alternate lead intervention but it's is of a scope and nature that it's worthwhile to take and have the entire commission way and i agree one hundred percent  and so this is an effort at and courage now i'm not saying you can only bring into the commission under these circumstances but you absolutely do have to and in fact what we have discussed is the scenario where because of a deadline we get an appearance or intervention in but then bring it to the commission with the ability then to withdraw if alternately the commission sides of the lies so we had that discussion i was thinking of more lines  renewable development i mean you come across here and you read all the stuff there is a lot of red and you in this language and i realize we're going into an area we've never been  a further discussion question only means by which the executive committee would come back to the board and without understanding that move the staff recommendation second and further discussion is looking at the process that municipalities will be able to go through now that we are fingers crossed going to have our own determination of energy compliance on the ecos plan as of august hopefully  will now be able to give the same determination to municipal plans that have followed the same energy plating standards so this is really i think an example where there is a point that there's been quite a lot of text added to this document but it doesn't it can be summed up pretty quickly so in the memo that was included with this essentially what we're doing here is proposing that there are really four additional steps that a municipality can choose to take so as a reminder in his energy planning is not required of municipal it is they can still have a regional plan that's approved and confirmed by us  having an enhanced energy plan is something that gives benefits to i mean it's a county so the biggest one as you'll see on page one here is getting this substantial deference for your unit supposedly indies and lindy's policies and conservation measures so this is as we discussed at the regional level this is different than the due consideration that would be given to these policies without the determination of energy compliance a higher standard of review which can be beneficial we think not that there is no case law about it so hopefully it will be be beneficial this point this we are looking for any action by the commission the first time you've seen this is an opportunity to raise any questions or comments and then over the summer time if there are comments that come to mind and secondly my question is directed more of the executive director between this and the previous agenda item this is a load of work for us as an organization and normally you know i like to ask the question when i see the expansion of what we're going to do put into writing a we have the source of funding to support it and b is this new amount of activity between both of these agenda items going to replace anything in what it was we were doing prior to accepting and taking on these was the woodies that are i mean clearly if they're replacing lower priority items it's the right thing to do but is it in any way going to affect the way we support  or anything like that because i'm assuming that this is all going to be coming out of a c c the planning grant that we get and i know that we've been ramping up but this just seems like a lot and we want to make sure that it's not making it difficult on you for staff resources and also financial resources to execute on these responsibilities thanks for bringing up that question and it is definitely a shift and for better or worse and both the two forty eight in energy planning work we've obviously been doing a lot more of that work the last couple years the state did provide the public service department funding for some of this energy planning work and for  is that we are budgeting more of our a c c d contract for this kind of work for the permit and and c p g review for two forty eight and realizing that we're going to need to mean and i mean realistically i mean we do try to address every demand we get you know and if it doesn't fit right now you know we're often in a situation saying well come back to visit a few months and see if maybe we might be able to help you once we get over this little peak so please let let me know if you feel like your town is not getting something they asked for but by a large i think we've been able to accommodate all the requests we've been given point broader issue was going to be as this happens and then the next issue is or something like that pretty soon we're going to be cutting into work services and so if we can just keep our eye on the ball and that if we need to bring it to our attention and then we need to take it to the proper c c d or somewhere else we should do that and we should do that with our other sister organizations in the i think through over the course of the last few years energy component and the water quality component has been expanded significantly and as the should and county regional planning commission where in all of that and once sort of that transition is made i would expect that this r p c and the others are then going to value way and how that affected and will affect going forward their ministration an operation and see if there are long term changes that need to be nature recognize that you know we've been providing this is the third year of energy funding and the same thing for the water quality of the basin planning work is more than it ever used to be and they've been providing funding for that and i can say it's fully adequate funding but they have been trying to address the energy and is there more to do and how does that get funded and these of all of them in there be another issue that will come up that will be a multi planning effort and pretty soon our staff is all tied up doing all that stuff and we forget we don't have enough energy and remind you that this board had considered recommendations for improving the permitting system a couple things to note about that one is the well the first why i bring this up the legislature has formed this commission on the future back to fifty they are having public forums around the state and big correction here it is not september tenth it is on september twelfth at the ox club in burlington will be having the forum in this area there in of there have been ten or twelve around the state and you know most six or so whatever but this is the only one that's in the northwestern part of the state so chanting county chris senator pearson is is on this and there's a number of other legislators so there is at least up positioning that they are hoping to come up with some recommendations to improve and they've been focused on that to fifty i want to make one point to you all is that when you read the language of that bill that authorize a commission it's not just act to fifty and if you look at our position here on these two pages you notice it's not just act two fifty that we're talking about and i was very purposeful that we talked about improving the permitting system because some major issue in vermont's permeating system in or around back to fifty is the lack of inner gratian of state and municipal permitting and so i think that's one of the big themes that at least i'll be trying to work on we have a few bullets in here about that that would really help us where a lot of the frustration comes in the current process which is a developer's talking to the state they hear one thing and then they talk to the town to get  d this way then they have to kind of bounce back and forth between state and municipal there are other suggestions in here some some bigger some smaller but this is our guidance right now for participating in that  to kind of look at this familiarize yourself with these points and odds are pretty good that we may want to for you know a little working group or something to see and evaluate and react to what comes out of that commission and legislature nobody wants to open that endorse box because they don't know where it's going to go but this commission was formed on the fiftieth anniversary back to fifty and there are some committees with a legislature suited to each other have been looking into various aspects of act two fifty reform they are conducting these public forums and then there is going to be proposed legislation that's going to coming out of this process so we can anticipate this next legislative session  being some some real and earnest discussion about changes to act to fifty both in the areas of reforming it sure there will be suggestions to narrow it and there are the suggestions to expand it  we as a commission will want to start thinking about again this year cogitating over the summertime what given the fact again as is always the case we have a number of different communities that invariably have different views about those various issues is there common ground such as the november twenty fourth teen paper that we can agree in an advocate for as a commission are there other areas that we should  be advocating for and what role should we try to take early in the process because as we all know as a practical matter the earth earlier you get and the better chance you have of your views holding forth later on in the process as opposed to trying to jump in in the eleventh hour so those are all things for people to think about because it doesn't look like there are going to be so serious consideration of changes to act or nov fourth for two thousand  and i want to also know free will if you will feel free to touch base with with me if you have some thoughts are about improving our position as as a body and and also regina virginia's been participating in a lot of  working groups on this works out as well so if you have other thoughts or issues that are coming up the two from your municipality that should be addressed and then the second major thing i want to mention is that we were just talking of the energy planning work hear from the public about our energy planning work so if you're interested please come on down as katherine you're going to be there is a chair of our energy committee i think it will be there is the chair of the commission so others are more than welcome