but i don't know how you think we can on our own law well i want to address that question i think your honor the act you have a rule of law stands for the proposition that if this court in one of its handle holds for example that there every single my search decision that applied the statute of limitations to our acquaintance and there is no discussion in any of those cases of whether or not there is a statute of limitations a reasonable excuse for the delay or whether there was willful misconduct that obviates the ability to use the defense in the first place on the day and jack why talk about any of that if you got more than three years and you have a statue of limitations the  us that the remedies are subject to principles of equity both injunctive relief you've won damages and the right to an accounting and section one one eight tells us their act we have a unique situation we have a situation a little merit where we're trying to deal with protecting the public from being ripped off by products that are what they claim to be and we try to protect the rights of the intellectual property owners from doing basically stolen by fraudulent misconduct duping the public and you can have situations where there are slight damage you can have situations where there is little profit and you can have the kind of verse of both of those propositions three hundred maybe i and i obviously wasn't very clear in my question i was trying to get you off of the statute of limitations and the field you wanted to play on i mean you want to play on the field of latches i take it you're strong argue all right so if we're playing on your field my quick point was it's way over the statute of limitations so you've got a presumptive life is still a situation i finally understand your question your an reasonable way even on the latches playing field given than two years expired before that i ran into problems with his first you a number of years without doing anything and your honor the central thrust of the entire plaintiff's complaint and the plaintiff's opposition's blow words you won't see anything in my brief to this court there is trying to argue there judge collins did not have discretion to look association between their product and dr theo so you so you mean only that in fact leno that they were infringing and th they were causing confusion in the public and they knew that they were causing a false association and the reason i could be part of this not just part of infringing it is your honor and i'm just getting that standard from  infringement that is used elsewhere in the copyright act providing for infringement that is used elsewhere the copyright act sorry there's two purposes of the willfulness to exception to or edges justice for that they stopped in two thousand and one being willful it doesn't mean that they escaped the eye of the law for the conduct between one thousand nine hundred seventy not this works your client didn't move in two thousand and one your client didn't move in one nine in two thousand one what that doesn't mean they're not answerable for their conduct prior to two thousand and one if their conduct was deliberate intention your client could have waited to the year twenty five twenty five and bring the cause of action theoretically suspends latches just seems to me to impossible to preserve your honor i think that my answer to your observation which is certainly passed through my here is there under section one one one seven the trial judge is supposed to consider the willfulness of the of the misconduct the damage done to the public the damage done to the intellectual property holder the length of the way which it is jack was in some cases thirty years and determined in equity what the problem result should be which may be that i don't care how wrong the conduct was i don't care how much the public was hurt you waited thirty years it's too late but district words analysis which was fine assuming that it was and there was no explanation reasonable explanation for delay after that well i think tribal issue fact about well i mean they are true genuine bad guys all right but thanks doc and there is nevertheless no reasonable explanation for delay after that  company to walgreens that said yes we want this song the label because of its merchandising value there is absolutely no question of intent and i don't believe that you get out of your misconduct because you finally stop it i heard on the news the other day that john gotti jr is you know convinced the jury that that's available as a defense that he removed himself from the criminal enterprise so it doesn't matter that everything he has is the fruit of you know killing people that's the problem here and by not having filed within the statute of limitations you didn't inject yourself to equitable considerations i mean that's the problem and if somebody happens it's too late you've waited too long well i also have to say that i think the application of lack as well and stassi in the law is problematic here in one sense because what you're after is a monetary recovery and you can call it equitable because somehow it can be characterized as an accounting but the thrust of the argument is to allow a monetary recovery which ordinary people i had to created in the subtleties of a lot might be tempted to call damages without regard to the statute limitations and i'm reluctant to push the a please the court excuse me my name is john on again and i represent the defendants apple e's and with me it's michael liberty honors i've listened to the argument just now and it appears to me that the court fully understands the argument forth in our briefs and i'm quite happy to to rest on those briefs and to entertain any questions that you might  could you turn that bottle so i can see the label and then hold the book up cleansed whatever wrongdoing there was but even as to the first label if you were to look at it your honor this label is medicine i guess i shouldn't call it that the even having a drug because they're not getting the benefit of the program and i think they probably have exhausted my explanation of why there is no time for in there stops the