fraud well it's actually a sequence i believe that the first thing that set up the whole situation was the exclusion of the color documents from state farm's regular document response exclusion of the documents from the state farm response is the first step and then the second step and the thing that we thought was the most outrageous thing was the and what we think is really bad about that is if you just call that business as usual seems to mean that every time you're in a complex situation like this with multiple parties and you get a third party and keller was saying i've been gone a long time i don't have anything relevant to this case and it was reasonable for mr do little to believe keller he's got no doolittle had no any of that then it would have been easy to challenge the representation at that time but we're not actually talking about challenging what was said in the letter but we would have to be challenging is the fact of the representation and that is the thing that we think is really wrong with us they found out a little know not what they set out to do a little you talking about the comment afterwards no they presented a document which said we represent color that means keller has authorized or at least comes to what we are saying we're telling you keller has no documents keller's been gone a long time he doesn't know anything about this and he doesn't want to be bothered they told us that keller was telling us that and so you have a big case and you know a list was telling the truth when he didn't know was the killer had not even authorized or consented to any of that keller says i didn't make those objections and that's the that's the real problem it's the it's the fact that the representation didn't exist when the objections were made and the way they were phrased if you look at it it's not just the florida constitution and privacy and stuff like that i don't want to go rooting around in my files as an old person who's been gone a long time for material brains are relevant and they said that when the chief executive of state farm had a letter couldn't be terminated and well they got a letter one year old when they did that and they had a nine hundred seventy four video from keller where he explained under the title of the independent contractor arrangement they must present facts not just that show that there was a discussion between counsel not just that there was a misunderstanding or even misstatement and i emphasize that we have to accept those statements for purposes of this proceeding we obviously do not keller called state farm and said i don't know anything about this can you take care of this state farm told mr keller that it would take care of the subpoena on his behalf state farm represented by oric then respond any independent conversations with mr keller well there are nothing alleged in the complaint there's nothing left in the complaint as to any communications is it is controlling legal i had not talked to him at that time i privately have are any any i mean you seem to be beating around the noise source of all his depositions taken now what do you know now i know that there were a number of communications between mr keller and state farm that on an ongoing basis that to my knowledge there was no knowledge that certainly i had or mr burke had as to what documents m like those are programs that were instituted in the one nine hundred ninety s frankly i couldn't understand what they were seeking in the subpoena many of the documents mr keller might have had presumed were documents of state farm would have produced it was my full expectation after making the objections but if counsel had something in mind specific they would come to me and we thrash it out counsel and pursue it disagree with the characterization of court accepting the allegations as truths that are there with the objections to sharp practice on the other side should have been just a strike to catch you at that record i believe the district court said that the representation was appropriate based on the allegations the objections were appropriate and the conversations that were alleged between mr burke and between counsel that they did not amount to fraud even assuming that they occurred because in fact at that time there was every ability for counsel to pursue nothing was directed to the court no as evidence was presented by state farm regarding mr keller and in fact the court was in fact aware that this did not occur in a vacuum the court was fully familiar with the proceedings below the court mr goodloe well how can you possibly say he doesn't have anything without asking him do you have anything again you're not making it up again your honor i did not have any discussions with what i see you i mean a whole mess of you again your are i don't if you want to drag him in here you know you're i'm just trying to respond to your questions and i honestly don't know what miscommunications mr birkhead with margo you should know well and that's part of the problem your honor i was trying to limit myself to the allegations of this complaint had plaintiffs filed their motion in a timely fashion we've been able to have a complete record complete with declarations by mr google and declarations by mr grech and declarations by myself t different from what state farm had provided that we have provided the agency executive manual which is exactly the same thing so the notion that somehow there was some smoking guns that mr keller had that were withheld in order to somehow mislead said that they could not have and did not get three minutes keller is very clear this is rule twelve heller is very clear in the complaint you contacted state farm ask them what the case was about he expected to hear back from them on the terminations issue the one surviving member of the people who changed the contract we actually couldn't go directly at him because he was represented by or we thought but i think  wasn't represented by or represented state farm and they sharply fooled us i think it is right in hazel atlas and humphrey and hazel atlas which is the one that said when you have something like this you don't you have to bother about the