not a permitted use in the p two district based on those admissions the only issue before the trial court was the affirmative matter whether mr gross junkyard operation constituted a legal non conforming news the interpretation and application of the definition of junkyard is found in the zoning ordinance would be and he would be reviewed no no difference needs to be given to the trial court and then in applying the facts area but yeah my position would be that just the application itself without any reservation would be enough to cause it you know then but you would agree that that would be the first court to say that in illinois i believe that's correct yes used over forty forty five years ago and then try to prove that it was continually used during all of that time sense for the same purpose and as many of you know who've done trial work you know they often kind of fall apart on and some cases just turn into sand underneath your feet and other cases where it's like a jigsaw puzzle and everything goes click click click involved in the photos well this is one of these goofy cases where it all went click click click stuff it may not remember what they had for breakfast this morning but they know exactly what happened when they were seven or eight years old or fifteen or sixteen years old or in their twenty's you know i think of charles baker and you're  out to the junkyard and taught him shoot with a twenty two rifle and if he'd come home from school in the third or fourth grade and the right was gone and he was gone as they had you know he's out there shooting rasta junkyard in at it you  and then he goes off to war in and he's only going from town for a four year period when he went off to war in what would have been the vietnam conflict and we're going to defend this country no probably she interacts with the junkyard and but this guy talks about you know buy in parts of the sixty five sixty six sixty seven nine hundred seventy three when he got back and he was working in you know our repair business after he got back in seventy three and you got everybody from the city clerk saying when she was four years old she was taken out to the stinky junk yard and you know garbage pit and throw in there fifteen and sixteen years old with their first cars and couldn't figure out how to get into work and so they would go out there and fred klein or one of the guys that he would let operate on his property script cars council says there's never really indication that any of this was going on before well that's all that was ever going on before that's what i read the transcript that's what all the testimony has is that people saying they go out there they  what's always happened on this property that's what all the witnesses have said every single one there's not a single witness that ever testified that said that this operation wasn't going on from their own was there with the county for thirty five years or something like that mr masterson got in the stands and he has no personal memory of this what so ever and the only to go by was his nose and then he admits that his notes are not accurate and that you know he has down the prior use of the property is light industrial but then he says well it was a solvable in a brick yard previously too and that's not by industrial so he admits he screwed up and didn't get all the product use of this property fred and he says in his testimony that fred klein the owner of the property for all these years just wanted to be left alone stuff and then strip them off anything good and they scrap whatever metal was left to rebuild testifies to this day he's upset with the county because they won't let anybody chain across the end of his gate because people keep dumping all sorts of stuff on his a zoning ordinance the very first one now this property been operated this way since the fifty's and then they pass this zoning ordinance and turn this property even though our lawn oh my gosh i mean can you imagine the ground that this is on i mean i was afraid to drive my car on it for getting a flat tire we're talking you could mine it for zinc and metal and nicole and copper and aluminum and steel and iron all day long in there not to mention the fluids and things that have been on this property you could never build a home on it would not be safe for human beings it's only fit for one purpose that's why the city had their junkyard right next door it is what it is it's not on the main drag it's a couple  you know it's prudent throws you know who knows what's going to pop up out of the ground but i mean there's no more stink there's no more garbage now it's just purely the selfish gene operations going on  really was that was the weakest part of my case and that was the scariest part when i went in but the case law i found and i cited in my freezer indicates that you look at what the true it isn't what the petition for zoning was it's what is the true use was residential zone so what do i have to do to put up my building and they told him and he did but he never stopped on cars i mean i can only surmise but i would imagine he probably didn't want to really talk about getting a license to junk cars urbanite a license to run a salvage operation he'd always been doing it he always kept doing it nobody ever messed with him everybody in town dead wrong when they come in here and say they can raise this issue of the five year amortization period for the first time on you know that nowhere i mean you know i illegal non conforming use nowhere did he give the court an opportunity to look at that five year stance you know or did he give the court an opportunity to decide if it was reasonable and you know in the case law on ability unlikelihood away from them over a period of years and say ok you get five years you get three years to use your property and then you're done maybe that's the taking what else is this property good for after sixty years as a junkyard there's nothing for i don't think it is for you because i think the issues raised for the first time on appeal and i think the showcase says that you can't the supreme court shell case in the three other the two other supreme court cases from seventy five and seventy seven all say that it's axiomatic that a question not raised in the trial court is waved to may not be raised for the first  raised and it hasn't been raised at any time up until when they stood here and raised and so you know and clearly this is a manifest way to be evidence case this clearly there was conflict in having you know clearly they see the facts one way we see the facts another way and yes that you know you've got to give the trial court credit for judging the credibility of the witnesses before and there's no doubt you know they try to say that the judge misapply the standards he was trying to be nice he was trying to explain in layman's terms to these people he was trying to say that you know they ever since that's our issue and in council agreed and we went to war and we had a fun trial and they lost on the facts not really on any big question of law the question came down to the fa and there's no doubt in the courts mind of the fact that it was a joke then it's a junkyard now it's basically the same operation they take ours and they strip off the good earth they sell off the metal i could go through all the different witnesses testified that they did that through the years it's not necessary it's in the transcripts and sure you guys have seen it and bunch of good old boys who never had much in life and worked hard you know trying to scratch a living out of what they could of different car that's all this property is good for it's all it's ever been good for in that frankly having to this lucky that they've got a responsible operator today that runs in the clean operation again there was no there was no discussion of representation by him or mention of the sounds in operation whatsoever or any but he doesn't need his only authorities permission to be a preexisting i'm good for you if this happens by