The Liverpool Standard and General Commercial Advertiser. — Liverpool, Merseyside, England, 1835-04-10 00:00:00

Drip: vial Parliament. HOUSE OF LORDS, MONDAY, APRIL G. The Earl of Shaftesbury took the woolsack in consequence of the absence of the Lord Chancellor, who could nut attend through indisposition. ..Petitions in favour of- the. establiihed church in Scotland; and for church accommodation in that country, were presented from parishes in the counties of Haddington, Lanark, and Edinburgh, by the Duke of Gordon,.' Viscount Melville, the Dukes of Argyll and It ichniond, and the Earl of Ripon. Mr. Roebuck and others, from the Commons, brought up the ill,•gal securities' bill, which was read a first time. On message from the Commons, leave was given to Lord Brougham to attend and give evidence before the English eriu 7 / cation committee. The Earl of ItipoN also presented a petition from Montreal, in Upper Canada, signed by 11,000 persons, expressing their attachment to the existing constitution, and their loyalty to the Sovereign of thase realms, and praying that the legislature would not alter the constitution granted to thtm by the act of 1791, under which Canada had hitherto flourished. THE REVERE:ID PR. WADE. _ _ The Earl of CARNIRVoII presented a petition from a curate of the church of England, complaining that he had not been paid the stipend attached to the curacy since the year 1832, in consequence of the living having been sequestered to meet the debts of the incumbent. It was a case of great hardship; but he believed it was not in the power of the bishop of the diocese to correct the evil. The fault did not rest with the bishop, but was to be attributed to the existing law of sequestration. It was a subject to which he thought his Majesty's government ought to direct their attention ; and he was quite sure that the right rev. bench would give every assistance in their power to a revision of the law. The Bishop of BATH and WELLS admitted that the case was a very hard one, but unfortunately it was nut in his power to interfere. Of the incumbent, Dr. Wade, he would say nothing, because he could say nothing, good of him. After the act of se questration, be could 'do nothing whatsoever in the matter; and he Was extremely sorry that it was not in his power to interfere; but the deed of sequestration put it totally out of his power to - deal with the case, or to lay hold of the money claimed by gie petitioner. An appeal bad, however, been made to their lord ships, who, be was sure, would pay due attention to it, and would agree to a proper alteration of the existing law. Ile was anxious to do everything in his power to remedy the evil, but he was prevented from acting by the law. BUILDING NiiW CHURCHES. Lord BhOUGHANI presented a petition against any grant of public money for the erection of churches. The petition, the noble lord ssii, %tas signed by 1250 persons, churchmen and dissenters, of the parish of Eastwood. Lord K.ENTON feared that the objections' made in many of those petitiOns erase from an unfriendly feeling towards the church, and did not rest on the fact that church accommodation was not wanted. Thus, objections were made to the, building of churches or chapels in Shoreilitch, though the church com missioners stated that accommodation was wanted . for 20,000 persons. The Bishop of . Lostnniv at id, that one of the ~e'reatest orna ments of the Scotth church had expressed himself strongly in favour of building churches at the public expense, because in dividuals would not do so. That opinion Dr. Chalmers bad supported, because he viewed the church as thegreat instrument fur instructing the peopfe. ( Hear, hear.) If that were so, was it not, heatsked; right that the piddle should provide for that instruction ? It was the only effectual mode of instructing the people, and he thought it seas the duty of the public to supp or t it. In the resent instance, he believed that a 'very consider able part o. the papOlation of Scotland were in favour of some such measute. RIGHT OF PEIITIONING IN 'Ttla WELSH LANGUAGE! Tim Earl of Rosst.YN presented a petition from a place in Wales, in which the subscribers claimed the right of petitioning the house in the Welsh language. (Laughter.) Of the original petition, tshieh was in Welsh, be could say nothing, but the translation, which he supposed was faithful, was most respect fully worded. Cin the Earl of SHAFTESBURY putting the question, "That this petition be now lead," there was a general burst of laugh ter. The petition was laid on th e t a bl e . On the motion of the Earl of Mulgrave, who briefly stated the nature of the measure, the brib er y witnesses' indemnity bill was read a second time. On the suggestion of Lord Brougham, who observed that he believed his learned friend the Lord Chancellor would not be able to attend to-morrow, the bill was ordered to be committed on Thursday next. On the motion of the garl of Roseberry, the report of the Lords of Session on the future.eutails bill, and the entails relief bill, both respecting entails in Scotland, was referred to a select committee. DUDLEY ADDRESS. Lord WA n plaid that he rose in that house for the first and possibly for the last time in his life for the purpose of asking his majesty's ministers opposit e , t ouc hi n f a report that has gone abroad. namely, that his majesty's ministers had advised his hon. friend th e meinber for Dudley . to present an address to his majesty front the town of Dudley, in favour of his majesty's present ministers. He wished to learn from his majesty's mi nisters whether that was true ? No answer being returned, his lori:ship proceeded to say that the address to which he alluded r;as a hole and corner one, not in accordance with the feelings of the people of Dudley. and that if it. had been so presented his majesty had been cajUled by the Chancellor of the Exchequer, an it was necessary that his royal mind shuuid be disabused as soon asossible on that important subject. The Duke of Wict.i.tNiiroN said that he had no knowledge whatsoever of the circumstance to which the noble lord had alluded. Adjouined. HOUSE OF COMMONS.—MoNmY. The Speaker Wok the chair at half-past three o'ciock wmpsou ELECTION. Sir JAMBS GRAHAM appeared at the bar with the report of the. New Windsor borough election committee, which was that Sir J. E. De Beauvoir was nut, but that Sir J. Elley was, duly elected for the said borough, and that neither the petition against the return, not the opposition to it, was frivolous or vexatious. _ _ _ The return, having been amended, Sir John Elley took the oaths and bis Acid. Mr. G. Knight also took his seat for the county of Nottingham, in the room of Lord Lumley, now Earl of Scarborough. . . _ The house was occupied for some time in receiving petitions on various subjects. GENERAL MILITARY ORDER. .Mr GRATTAN wished to ask the right hon. baronet whether the order that, he understood was t o i ssue f rom th e H orse Guards on the 17th March had issued, and whether it was a general order, applying to the service of the military through ., out the whole of the empire, or applying to the military in Ireland alone? Sir IL Pi Eil. said that in pursuance of the judgment given by the house some time since a general order had been pre pared and issued applying to the service of the military through out the whole of the empire, when they should unfortunately be called upon to act by a civil. officer. Mr. GRATTAN wished to know if there would be any objection to have a copy of that order laid on the table of the house? . Sir H. HALIDINGic did not know there could be any other oljectiun to that than the unnecessary establishment of a new precedent. The hon. Member might see the order, and might himself have a copy of it. EARLY SITTINGS. Mr. ROBINSON gave notice that on Wednesday nest he would move that the house do resume morning sittings during three days in every week. (Cries of" No. no.") He certain ly should move it; and he begged also to give notice that on Priday he would bring to the attention of the house the subjeet of the motion of which he had given notice on Wednesday last. GOVE.IINOIt tW CLYLON. Au lion. member stated that it was rumoured in the news rnipers that Sir Richard Plaskett was to be governor of Ceylon, and if that were so, he wished to ask the right boo. baronet whether the Cape of Good Hope would he relieved from its pre sent payment to him of £501) a year? Sir R. Pai L had nut heard of any such thing, but when it happened, jf ever it should; that Sir Richard Plaskett went out as governor of Ceylon, he thought it very likely that the Cape of Good Elope would be relieved from its present payment. (Laughter.) He had nut heard that his right hon. friend the present governor of Ceylon had signified any desire to retire! DON CA R 1.0%. Mr. T. DuNcomes; wished 'to ask if the statement he had heard was true that government had sent out a special mission to D u o Carlos, and if so, whether the object of that mission was to oppose or support Don Carlos ? Lord MA nos said it certainly Was true that government had sent out Lord Eliot specially. The object of the mission was, if possible, to put an end to the carnage, bloodshed, and acts of violence that were now being perpetrated—such as the murder of prisoners, and the decimation of villages. When he further stated that the mission was sect out by government with the full concurrence of Spaiu, and also of France, it would not be supposed there was any intention whatever to support Don Carlos. ctiußcit op IRELAND. Sir R. PEEL said it was his intention to adhere strictly to .the engagement he had made, nOt to throw any impediment in the way of the h use immediately- proceeding with the noble lord's resolution, but he felt it to be his ditty to bring to the attention of the house the situation it was in with respect to the navy esti mates. He held in his hand a letter from Mr. Briggs, a gen t lowan who held a situation i n th e a d m i ralty, which stated that the 'art payment to the artificers in the dockyards would be comeltne on Friday next, the 19th" inst. ; and that no supply had heeri.,-gr.anted in respect of that. dther payments would very soon have to be made; for milich no supply had been granted, and the ailtnira;ty had even been obliged already to refu:444ayerients •i n respect of which th e y h a d h a d no supp l y. - 4gaiti; with' respe ct to the,mutiny hilt, if' there were to•he any Easter holidays, which he supposed there must Le, it would he Ilei:e4Sary that the mutiny act should be passed by the 13th inst. Ile would, - however,, as said, nut attempt t o d e l ay t h e Other buslues l at tat moment, by asking fur a committee to vote the navy estimates, or to take into considera t ion the mutiny Lill; but he would allow the house. to go into committee upon. the noble lord's reSolUtion, hoping that no ohjection would be. Made afterwards to any steps that might be deemed necessary to be taken with respect to the two subjects which he had noticed. Lord.Joites Rossini. said he should be ready to support the course proposed by the right hon, baronet, but he would not pledge'hiniself at that moment that he would agree to all the details upon the RONV estimates. Before be moved the order of the d : y for the house genis into cointhittee upon the resolu tion he had the honour. to b'ring forward, he would state the course he intended to pursue. He would not enter upon into a discisssion of how the vote of the house by so large a majority, unit after four nightie discussion,ought to affect the proceedings of ministers or of the house ; but the course he intended to pur sue would be this:—Supposiug the committee to agree to the resolution to-night, he sliould propose that that be reported to morrow. It the house should agree to that report of the .reso lution., then he should move a res o l u ti on t o this effect :—" That it is the opinion of this house that no measure upon the subject of tithes in Ireland can lead to a satisfactolv and final ad. 41 4- ment which does not embody the principle contained in the foreg,uing resolution." Ile would then state what his view: were, and, if honourable members opposite di l trot ancede to it, or if government would not act under the decision of the house upon the resolution, then lie Initiict feel it to be his duty on the succeeding day to move an address to the crowu; but he should not do that tilt after•he-had moved the resolution he had just read, and till he bad seen what the effect of that would be. Sir H. HattotNdE sail, in answer to a questiou, that it was not yet determined what course should be taken with respect to the million act. The house then, upon the motion of Lord John Russell, that the order of the day should he read for the house to resolve itself into committee upon the church establishment, (Ireland,) I went into committee, Mr. Bernal in the chair. Mr. Borthwiek and Mr. Maxwell opposed the resolution. 111 r. C. BAKING WALL: thought that, as there were no sur plus funds, it was not necessary to raise a religious cry in Ire. land, neither was the house called on to pander to the w o r s t of feeliags in that country; and that it was easy, therefore, to get rid of the difficulty, and leave the question of surplus to posterity. He could not but observe that in all ['lab debates, from whatever side of the }Muse they originated, it seemed inva riably to he forgotten that any other party existed in the coon .try have themselves. (llcar,'Lar.) Ile couch regretted that the moderate part! was so little represented in this house, be canse, if so, he felt satisfied that the civi.ization of Ireland, which had hitherto been so touch impeded, would completely flourish. Fur this party so little represented the house was not called upon to act; and lie felt satisfied, though he was no ad vocate fur the members of the sactettorofesston uxixing-them selves.up in the'commoh politics of the country, teat, if some of the Irish protest an t c l ergy cou ld b e he ar d at t h e b ar , or froth seats in that house, they - would well be able to maintain those rights and claims which the noble lord's resolution went to in fringe, and that, with as much moderation as talent, they would secure to themselves numerous friends and tupporteis. (Hear, hear.) Ile asked the house to pause, and to consider whether or not this resolution would lead to a final and satisfactory set •tlement of the question. In his judgment it would be far from leading to any such result. The only two ways by which a satisfactory settleMent could be arrived at was, either by recog nising the protestant church, anti connecting the Roman catho lic and presbyterian churches with the state, or by allowing the religion of the majority to have sway. Although he did not wish now to pledge himself to any measure not at present before the hoilse, he would not hesitate tearlessly to say, that the matter could only be set at rest, and peace anti tranquillity in Ireland established on a permanent footing, by connectiug with the state the catholic and presbyterian clergy ; at the same time he could not for a moment acquiesce in any proposition which should have the effect of diminishing the efficacy and efficiency of the 'protestant establishment.. That establishment had been chargett. as a proselytizing church. He denied that such was the fact, and to it, therefore, on this occasion he should give his support. Mr. LUCAS said that as the reveseetative of a peculiarly pro testant county of Ireland be m i g h t be permitted ta make a few observations. He contended that the surplus revenues of the protestant church, if any, should be first applied to strictly pro testant purposes, such as the repairs of churches and the build ing of glebe-houses, and, next, to the education of the protestaut population. Mr. H. L. BULWER sunported the motion. Mr. F. 13aueat claimed the attention of the committee, and the more particularly as that was the first time he had ever spoken injhe house. The honourable member said:—Nothing has surprised me more its the course of this debate than the cou filching accounts with regard to the real property of the church of Ireland—the discrepancies whiCh prevail in the statements even among official personages who have - been connected with the administration of Ireland. The house had resolved itself into a committee of the eholehouse to consider the question of the Iriih church, particularly as to the appropriation of its re . uenues, and nobody seems to know what those revenues are. I apprehend that they have been greatly exaggerated, and that ' the statement of the noble lord the member for Noah L:inea shire is correct, and that it is, after all, but a poor church. Hon. members seem to have forgatteu, at least it has not been noticed on either side of the house, that the parochial clergy of Ireland, at the time of the introduction of the composition bill by the right hog. secreta r y f or th e home department, harassed by dissensions with their own flocks, and anxious to conciliate the catholic tithe payers, sacrificed in every instance one-gait' of their incomes. In the parish where I lived at the time, the tithe was reckoned at about £1,500, and the clergyman coin .'pounded for £lllO. In the neighbouring, parish the tithe some times reached nearly 1;2,000, and the rector compounded fur £9OO. In the parish adjoining that, the tithe was 1'..1,4(Y0, and the rector compounded fur £700; and in the parish where I at present reside, which I and another gentleman entirely possess; the average rent being £l, or nearly so, the clergyman com pounded for is. au acre, thus receiving, nut the tenth of the produce, but the twentieth of the rent. Now comes the bill of the secretary for Ireland, striking off' 2.5 per cent., and if this be not 'sufficient depletion for the .most plethoric establish ment, sufficient to satisfy every political doctor on the other side, not excepting the great Sangrado himself (the hou. mem ber for Middlesex,) I know not v hat is. But I would grant, for argument sake, that it was a rich church, and that a surplus could be spared; but I still conteud most resolutely that every farthing of such surplus would be inure than 'swallowed up by protestant objects and pro'estant wants. What funds are now wanting fur the building of churches? in the parish where I lived the number of attendants at church were at first about 200 or 300; they increased to six huudi ed. Mr. BAINES, the Marquis of Caaswos, Mr. SCARLET', and Mr. D. RosiarNE, severally addressed tue committee, when strangers were ordered to withdraw. Mr. C. Ituttati and Mr. WARBURTON each addressed tho committee for Some time; during which several members en tered the house, and took their places on the opposition benches. Sir R. PEEL expressed his hope that the next time it was found necessary to put up a gentleman to speak against time, the choice might fall upon some one who had something to say. (Immense cheering and laughter.) The committee then divided, when there appeared— For the resolution 262 Against it Majority for the resolution Lord J. It uss . u.n. gave uotice, that he would to-morrow move a resolution, "that it is the opinion of this house that no measure upon the subject of tithes in Ireland cao lead to a satisfactory and final adjustment, except I it embodies th e p r i nc i p l e conta i ne d in the foregoimp, resolution." Sir IL YLEL reminded the noble lord that there were several notices of motion which must have precedence to-morrow. Lord J. RUSSELL was understood to say that there were only two motions which must necessarily have precedence to-morrow. The noble lord here mentioned one of them ; and said a few words respecting it, of which we heard nothing. The other was a notice given by the hon. member for Exeter for the extinction of church-rates, and he had his authority for stating that he would withdraw it: NAVY ESTIMATES. On the motion of Lord AsltLay, the house resolved itself into a committee of supply. SIR EDWARD CODRINGTON 4ND THE ADMIRALTY FLAG. This buhject, relative to the Devouport election, was renewed by Sir Enwa KO ConamnroN asking whether Mr. Dawson, the secretary to the admiralty, had received any authority from the admiralty board to hoist the admiralty flag at the late Devon port election ? A long conversation ensued, which occupied the committee for a cousiderah:e time. NAVY . Mr.Hustic asked wheth er it was BILLS true that any bills drawn on account of the navy had been refused acceptance at the treasury ? • Lord Asti LET admitted that it was true. Mr. 'loam—What was the reason of such a determination? Lord Astirar.--eSimply this: at the close of the financial year we had no money. It was necessary, if, me paid these bills, that we should take upon ourselves great responsibility; and, under such circumstances we thought it better to delay the ac ceptance of the bills than incur the responsibility- Mr. Hi:sm.-11a: such an occurrence taken place in the office for many years past? Lord Asti eer.—l t is owing to an entirely new arrangement, and therefore cannot have occurred before. Mr. Hine said it really was most extraordinary that navy Lille should be refused; he believe 1 that the occurrence was quite a novelty, and it was one which he wished there might be no danger of seeing repeated. As to the delay which had oc curred and the consequent necessity for haste in now passing the navy estimates, they cruse solely from the ill-judged mea sure adopted by the right hon. baronet of dissolving the par liament. Had it not been for that dissolution the public busi ness would now, in the month of April, have been much further advanced, and if the house had nut by its indulgence iu some degree remedied the evil, much greater iuconvenience would have ensued. He repeated, that the present dilliculties were entirely owing to the policy of the administration, and not to the conduct of hon. members at his side of the house. It was the first time that anything of the sort had occurred for many years. Sir It. l'Eut. took for granted that the ,house would not ex pect him to account for the delay of public business by entering into the policy of the late dissolution. The delay which the boo. member for Middlesex so much deprecated arose, not from the dissolution, but from causes quite remote from that to which the effect was attributed. The main cause of the delay was, that there were in each week only two supply days, and on every one of those days which occurred during the present session some hon. member or other availed himself of the forms of the house to move some important proposition as an amendment to the question of the house resolving itself into committee. He by no means wished it to be understood that he meant to COM plain of those members for the mode in which they brought for ward their motions, for any one who looked ut the notice-book must .see that for all the other days of the week there were 10 or 12 notices entered, and even in the present week, and after being that night delayed till 10 o'clock before they could get into the committee of supply, there stood a notice of an amend ment to be in the same manner made on Friday next to time motion fur going . into comniittee. He quit e acquitted hon. members of any intention to delay public business; he only wished to call attention to the practical effect of that mode of carrying on the proceedings of parliament. Time conversatiOu on this question was prolonged for some time; after it had closed some votes were agreed to, but from the noise and confusion that prevailed in th e h ouse, b ut very few of them were u n dersto o d in the zeporter's gallery. Tllli MUTINY BILL. This bill was passed through the committee, after a discussion upon ,the ill effects of permitting s o ldi ers to wear their side arms when off duty. The marine mutiny bill was also committed, and the house resumed. Mr. 13a0THE1 oN (looking, at the clock) moved that the house adjonru. (It was 20 minutes past 12 o'clock.) '• The question was out put. • After some formal business had been disposed of— r. 111tOTHEItTON again moved that the house adjourn. The qUestion having been put and carried, the house adjourned at half-past 12 o'clock. lIOUSE OF LORDS.—TixsDAy. C;IJA):111ES. • Lord Ban'uuitaitsaid that tie had a petition on a most im— portant subject to present-to their lordships; but he should nut enter upon any discussion' of it, as it related to matters that were more tit for the Court of Chancerythau for their lordships' house. The petition related to the charities of Sheldon Mallet and neighbourhood, in the administration of which it was alleged there were great abuses, and thepetitioners prayed for an act to enable the parishioners to inspect the accounts of the charities and. the deeds, and for other waiters of a similar kind. Be had himself presented a bill to the oilier house of parliament some years ago ou this subject; but it stood over, and nothing had been done in it shice.—The petition was laid on the table. Lord Bitoconasi presented a petition from the royal burgh of Wick, in Caithness, against the grata of public money for the building of churches in Scotland. The petition was signed by 'the provost officially, as presiding at the meeting, and by its ordet and direction. Be had a letter from the cler6ytuan of the place, denying the facts stated in the petition. • The Bishop of, LATH and WEt.ns, in reference to the petition first presented by the no;ile and learned lord relative to the abuses of charities, said that he believed that they sate great in the places to which that petition referred ; but they were now -under the consideration of the most important personage in the place, and there was reason to believethat they would soon be remedied. Lord B aouu nA M presented a petition from the parliamentary borough of Hamilton against the grant of public money fur builtiing churches in Scotland. Lord Hot Lt.:said that they were going to have a church there, and he had subscribed looney for the purpose, fur the old church was at a considerable distance, and they had to go up a very high hill. Lord BRIM:6I.IAM said that the nnblc lord was under a mis take. The Once was Ilatnilton; in Scotland. Ile believed that the Scotch church had not the good fortune of having the noble IoM for a subscriber ; lie subscribed liberally for the English church, but nut for the Scotch. PUBLIC INSTRUCTION. of ExETEIt seeing the noble and l earne d l or d w h o Via of the Commission for Inq u i ry i nto t h e system The a t Bishop ha 4 of public instructi , u in his.place, gave notice that on Thursday he should present-the pe.it:ou of a person who complained t;f the conduct of the commi, , siouers towards hint. ... Lord Bgouo oA M sa id that he was no longer at the head of the commissiun. It was the noble and learned iota on the wool sack. ECCLESIASTICAL COI ETs RILL. The Bishop of ExETEIt presented a petitio n iron, the inhabit ants of Exeter, against the clause in this bill which compeited the proving of all wills in the Prerogative Coml. at Doctor's C om . mons. Also a petition from the solicitors of Crenittni to the same eau!. LONDON UNIVERSITY • Lord Bum. onast, seeing a noble lora opnsite in his place, wished to put to hint a question . on a sul:ject of c o nsiderable importance. lie under'soiod from the • votes of the other house that an address to the crown.had .been carried, praying that a charter tnigot be granted to the Loudon University undet cer, lain restrictions as to the degrees to be there 'conferred. and that an answer had been sent to that address,. stating that this matter had been, as he was welt aware, Wore referred to the Privy Council, unit that his majesty would cause the exainina tion by them. to be resumed, or the resiut of the proceedings there to he laid before the other house of parliament. He wished to know whether any further steps had been taken on the sub ject. lie asked this because, perhaps, the noble lorti might not kno.v the state iu which the proceedings were.. Iu fact, the matter h.ul been ful.y argued by counsel , and tone was taken to consider the result, mid at the time of the disso:ution of the late government he was in correspondence with a noble and learned ftieud, the now Lord Chancellor, who with hint had most attentively listened to the argaments on both sides upon the course that was to be pursued. Ile himself had intended to call the Privy Council toget 'ter upon the subject. Lord llossLyN said that as )et no further step had been taken iu consequence of the address. Ile was aware that the case had been fully argued, and that it stoud over fur toe deci sion of the Privy Council. Lord Vv I-lARNCLIFFE presented petitions from - Forfar and another place in favour of a graut to the Scotch church.— Adjourned. HOUSE OF COMMONS, TUESDAY. The Speaker took the chair at ha;f-past three. DROGHEDA lil.fie'rlON. - . Lord HOTHAM reported to the hou,e that the committee ap pointed to inquire into the Drogheda election had found Carew O'Dwyer, Esq., not duly elected, and the election for that bo rough was accordingly void; but that the opposition to the pe tition against the return was neither frivolous nor vexatious. _ Mr. U. A. iELHAM preSeHiedetitiohs - from Lincoln and Bditan, in favour;of the Islington Mai ket Bill. The Marquis of CLIANDOS presented a petition from the farm ers and graziers of Buckinghamshire against the Islington Mar ket bill. The ATTORNEY-GENERAL presented a petition from Hunt ingdon, against the increased duty on licenses; also, a petition from the debtors in the King's Bench Prison, praying that the bill for the abolition of imprisonment fur dent might piss into a law. Mr. IlannY presented a petition from certain cler , ymen of Bradf;ad, praying for a revision of the Factories' desolation bill, and that the hours of children's labour ►n factories should nut be extended beyond ten hours. Also a petition from H. Lloyd, a catholic clergyman, praying for reform iu the Irish Church. Mr. J. OswALD presented a petition from the postmasters of Glasgow against the tax ou post-homes ; a:so a petition from the Chamber of Commerce of that city, for the repeal of the duty on small stamp receipts; also a petition from the Common Council of that city, in favour of the abolitiou of imprisonment for debt bid. ' , . Mr. C ItUTit Kiis presented a peritioti from three - linuclreil bankers, merchants, and others of [lull, complaining of the precedence given in the bill for the abotitiou of imprisonment for debt on bills and bonds over book-debts,. and expressing their conviction that this measure would never give satisfaction until these objections were removed. Sir J. CAMPBELL said, that he had every reason to expect that the clause in question would be omitted in the onntuittee, and that book-debts would be put on the same footing as debts on bills and bonds. Mr: ill TT said that he could not support the petition, as his feeling was, that the :ate solicitor-general was deserviug of the warmest thanks of his country for this bill. (Hear, hear.) lie was glad, however, to hear that what was considered objection able iu this bill was likely to be removed; and he trusted that when the committee had concluded their labours, such a bill would be preseutc.l to the house as would be entii ely satisfac tory to the country. (Hear, hear.) CARRUTHERS then presented a petition from the trades peutle of Hull, expressing their convictiou, derived from expe rience, that no execution against the goods of cleutors would be found to be an adequate substitute fur imprisonment for debt, either as a satisfaciion of the claims of the creditor, or a punish ment of the debtor; and the petitioners concluded with praying that iu any arrangement which - might be made, the house would not do away with the Courts of Request at Ilult. - Mr. STEWART MACKENZIE presented several petitions from places in Scotland, for the exteusion of the church of Scotland. The same hon. member also gave notice that on the 28th May he should move the re-appointment of the corumittee on the state of education in Scotland. Dr. Bow kING presented a petition from the handlooin weavers of Renfrew, complaining Of distress and low wages. Mr. HANDLEY presented a petition from a place in Lincoln shire, against the ecclesiastical courts bill. Mr. COMPTON presented petitions from Ringwood and Ford ingbriclge, against the increased duty on licenses. Mr. Alderman THOMPsoN presented a similar petition from Sunderland; also a petition grunt the solicituis of that town against the ecclesiastical courts bill. Sir M. W. ItIELLY presented a petition from an individual for the reduction of the stamp-duty on life insurances. Colonel EVANS presented t'so petitions from Westminster :or the repeal of the window tax. Mr. GROTE presented a similar petition from one of the wards of the city of London. Mr. BYNG gave notice that on Friday he would 'rinse for leave to bring in a bill to explain certain plovisiuns of the turnpike act relating to the toll upon dung. Lord AIORPETH presented a petition front Sheffield, for plac ing book-debts upon the same footing as bills of exchange, in the imprisonment for debt bill. SMUGGLING CORN. Mr. Csvi.uv said that an appeal had beep made to him by the noble member for Devonshire to give way to the dis cussion of the resolution on the subject of the application of surplus church revenue in Ireland. He hoped he snould be the last to oppose any arrangement for the public convenience; but, between the motion of which he had given notice (on the subject of smuggling foreign grain) and that of the noble lord, (J. Russell,) there were others fixed for this evening; and if he consented to yield his privilege it could only be upon the under standing that other members shnilirly circumstanced would act similarly. One point weighed with hun very materially, that if he persevered, howevi r long or, however eloquent the specche* might be upon his motion, they would attract but little atten tiou, when other matters so immediately and pe,ubarly intei- Wing. were pending. (,f Lear. ) CHUHCH RATES. DIVETT remarked that he could only consent to post pone his motion (for the extinction of churet-rates) with ex treme reluctance, as it had been upon the book since the com mencement of the, session. It was of the most essoitial import ance that the question should be settled as speedily as possible— the more so as Easter was fast approaching, when these rates were usually paid, and when the feeling of the countri was strongly against them. Last year he had failed in his motion, and he considered himself under no obligation to the noble lord (J. Russell) and his then colleagues in office for any support or assistance; he had, however, strong reasons fur thinking that the right honourable baronet (Sir It. Peel) and the other mem bers of the present government were at least nut averse to a settlement of the question. (Cries of "Order.") He begged pardon: he was not about to discuss the subject, but 'met eV to add hisdecided Opinion that his motion ought not to be delayed ; he only consented to abandon it for the present in deference to the opinion of others, and on the distinct understanding that the same course would be adopted with regard to ail other notices preceding that of the noble member fur Devonshire The CriaNcticLou of the ExcuLQUER concurred in thinking that the question ought to be disposed of at an early period. The motion of the hon. member was for the total abolition of church rates, and it would be desirable to fix an early day for the discussion of it. He was sorry that the honourable member had been cut short in the handsoine compliment. be was about to pay to his Majesty's present government. (Cheers and laughter.) Mr. Divert' added, that if he had been allowed to proceed, perhaps the right hon. baronet would not have been so well pleased with the complitnent. He was most anxious to take an early day, but reluctant to interrupt the regular progress of bu siness by submitting his motion as an amendment to an order Of the day. He hoped that the right hon. baronet would facili tate-him to bringing forward the question of church rates on eu early day. The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER was quite ready to do his best to aid the hon. member on any Tuesday or Thursday. (Laughter.) Mr. Dtvarr subsequently fixed the 14th May fur his motion. Sir JOHN HaNzaae agreed to postpone his motion, Which (like that of Mr. Cayley) related to the illicit importation ot . grain. Mr. A. TREVOR relinquished his motion on the Culla of Pleas of the comity palatine of Durham. OUI RACKS IN ARMAGH. Lord MANDEvir.r.s regretted that he could not follow the example thus set, by deterring, to a future day his motiun-re spectino the outrages in Armagh iu October last. Lord J. RUSSELL suggested that it alight stand for to-morrow. The CHANCELLOR of the. EXcHEQUER remarked that it 'Would be of little use for his noble friend to persevere, since if be did, some other members, who bad conditionally given way, would insist upon their right of precedence. 1)r. LusHINGI ON said that, considering the general feeling of the house, it Would perhaps be impossible to bring oh the motion; but it contained ebarges against the Earl of Gosford, which, if true, ought to prevent him from retaining his situation of lord lieutenant of the county of Armagh for a single hour. On the part of that noble lord, he (Dr. Lushington) denied those charges; and the house would be impressed with the ne cessity of having the matter fully discussed on the earliest pos sible day, (Hear.) lle also submitted that it was a matter of justice to the noble lord to give him priority, as the question affected not only his lordship's character, but the peace and good orderuf the country. (Hear.) „. Lord Acts tisox hoped that if the accusation agains relative,: which had been pending for some weeks, were post poned, it would not be deferred longer than tiil to-morrow. Mr. CAYLLY urged the noble lord to give way to the general sense of the house. Lord M ANDKVILLS consented to defer his motion till to morrow. Colonel VERNER postponed his motion for a copy of the report of the investigation held at Portadowu on the 10th April, 1534. Mr. SHAW postponed .his motion on the subject of the petition from Mr. Thomas Baker. Colonel Ev ANs postponed his motion for some returns from the•office of 1;'oods and Forests; and relative to the clerks of the Court of livquests of Westminster. [nisi( cituricu. Mr. BERN A L brought flp the report of the committee of the whole house on the established church of Ireland. Before the resolutions were read, Mr. SiNcLatn said: I wish to know from 'the noble lord whether it is his intention to move that the resolutions how brought up be communicated tee the Ilmuse of Lords., That house still constitutes a co ordinate branch of the legislature of this country, and no measure can become LAW without its con currence. From the proceedings of that house with respect to a similar question, we have reason to suppose that a proposition tte leastt three a e s like that upon the table, whether preserved in the shape of a bill or in any other form, would be rejected there by h a large a majority as that by which it %las carried here. (Cheers,l Unless one hundred new peers were created for the ptirpore, u t t h it e apprehend it would be impossible to carry through branches of the legislature any means for the diversion of a por tion of the ecelesiaVical revenues of the Church of Ireland to secular purnoses. It is therefore right that the matter should hrouglf tee an issue, that we may ascertain whether House of Lords is prepared to assent to suc h a p ro ceediog. cannot conceive, whatever government may be in office, taut would be prepared to recommend his Majesty its create a hundred priers in order to carry into effect :a resolution regard ing an imaginary surplus.--4 call it imaginary; because lam convinced that on inquiry it will turn out, like the Croker mountains, to have no existence. Instead of a surplus, there may be fund a deficiency ; for the number of clergymen in Ireland, 1 contend, is inadequate to the duties they have to dis charge at least none of them can be dispensed with. I b eg , therefore, that the noble lord will inform me whether he means . to communicate his resolution to the house of Lords? Lord JOHN It ssErL.—The hon. member asks whether I menu to communicate the resolution tar the House of Lords, and he tells me that it is his opinion that it will not Ire adopted there. My answer is, that Ino nut propose to communicate the resolution to the House of Lords; but I do not participate iu ltD. the opinion_ he elite:tains that there is anything in the resolu tion, when presented in the shape of a legislative measure, that will not pass the House of Lords. I fouud my oeitliou upon the precedent which I queted.the Other day as to the course the. other 'House of Parliament adopted upon a very great question—a question which certainly disturbed and excited the religious feeiing of the people of this kingdom more than any ge her that I remember—l mead the question usually known by the name of catholic emancipation. (Cheers.) In the year 1828, after a resolution on that subject had been carried iu this house, by a majority of six, it was determined to communicate it to the House of Lords. It was there moved by the Marquis of Lansdowne; , and. without recollecting the precise numbers on each side, 1 believe it was rejected by a majority of forty votes. That result would ha ve i n d uce d o ne t o thi n k that no bill for ca tholic emancipation would be allowed to pass. History, how ever, informs us otherwise: it. inlet ms us that, in the following 'ear, a bill was proposed to the House of Lords, wWi had re ceived the' previous sanction of the ministersof the crqwn ; • and the measure being recommended by the crown, it passed the House cf Lords by a majority.of ninety or one :semitred votes. (Cheers and laughter.) 'Therefore, with the leave of the hon. member, 1 shall profit by that experience.' (Much cheering.) I do not promise, in the first instance, to communicate the resolu tion; but I feel convinced that when- we have obtained the sanc tion of the crown to the proceeding of this house, the House of Lords will nut refuse to pass a legislative ineatime which, in my opinion, will promote the security of the church of Irelaud and the peace of the whole empire. (Cheers.) Tue resolutions were then read by the clerk; after the second had been concluded, Sir Register PEEL said, this, I apprehend, is the main reso- Lion which we shall betalted upon to vote; it is, in fact, exactly the same that was adopted last night. As there is no rational ground to suppose that the charge from a committee where it was carried, to the whole house where it is to be confirmed, will mak.) any difference iu the view taken of the question, the noble lord will not infer the slightest alteration of opinion in those who resisted the resolution last night, if we do not think it neces sary to press the question to a division. (Hear.) The reason why we d o no t is because the noble lord has given notice of another motion, the purport of which, we have been informed, will be that this house will not consent to any tithe bill of which the principle of the resolution does not form a part. Upon that I shall certainly take the sense of the house, understood ing that it precludes the necessity of wasting time upon the resolution just read. Lord JouN Ilussust then moved the following resolution:. — "That it is the opinion of this house, that no measure upon the subject of tithes in Ireland can lead to a satisfactory and final adjustment which dues not embody the prin ciple contained in the foregoing resolution." The noble lord, in referring. to the principles of the late government, with reference to this question, said the principle on which the late government were disposed to act was stated in a speech he found, recorded as having been delivered by his noble friend, (Lord Spencer,) who sat then on the other side of the house as the leader of his majesty's government. It was this:--" Most undoubtedly the government did think, and he was prepared, as a member himself of the protestant church, to assert, that it ' would be most advantageous to the protestant religion in both parts of the empire not to continue in Ireland that irritation which was consequent upon the present distribution of church property in that country. It was impossible for any man, who • looked with reasonable feelings upon the present system of dis tribution, not to say that so large au appropriation of property for the ministers of su comparatively small a part of the popula tion was calculated to diminish instead of increase the number of protestants in that part of the realm, because it was manifest that much dissatisfaction among the other sects was inevitable. With respect to the right of interference, he could not conceive on what grounds honourable gentlemen opposite, who were op posed to the government ou this occasion, but who had con ceded the right of parliament to deprive one corporation of a portion of its property to confer it upon another, should urge that the legislature had no right to apply the church revenues to other purposes; he meant moral and religious purposes." That was the statement of principle made by his noble friend at the end of the last session, and that was the principle on which, if he had continued a member of that government at the com mencement of the present year, he and those who acted with him would have been prepared to proceed. tie did nut think that any adjustment could be final which continued to leave 75 per cent. of the great sinecure livines which existed in the south of Ireland, or which kept alive those sources iif irritatiou and dis cord which arose from the circumstance of such large revenues being applied to the exclusive beiiefit of the church, while the moral and religious instruction of the greater part of the com munity was totally neglected. Sir'llSNns 11A It DINGS opposed the resolution. With respect to the resolution before the house, he wished to ascertain from the noble lord what he considered to be a surplus? Would he consider the surplus to be that which would exist after the clergy had been paid whatever the legislature might deem it tit to afford them ? or would lie adhere to the line of conduct which had been laid . down when the noble lord the member for Not th Lancashire (Lord Siaule.y) was a member of the government, and when the church temporalities bill was introduced ? On that occasion Earl Grey, the head of that government, stated iu distinct terms that after the clergy had received that which was appoint ed for them under the proposed plan, there was to be a portion of the revenues set apart fur the augmeutation of small livings, the building of churches, and the building of glebe houses. Sir Henry concluded by saying it would be impossible for auy go vernment entertaining the principles and the feelings of honour which the present government entertained, to carry into effect a measure which had engrafted on it such a resolution as that proposed by the noble lord. Ij e wou ld not d e t a i n the house further—he would simply repeat, that if the resolution of the noble lord were to pass, he (Sir Henry Hardinge) would not be time person to bring in a tithe bill embodying it. Lord JOlll4 IlussEsh said he would endeavour to answer the question which the right hon. gentleman had addressed to him. His view in considering the subject was this—in pants of Lime rick or Kerry, whemthere existed a great number of parishes containing no proteftnts or only a very few, there would arise a surplus. in conseqiience of there being too many beneficed clergymen to perform the-duties required on behalf of those protestants. ale should propose to take away the whole reve nues of those benefice s wh ic h were not needed, murder to apply them to the augmentation of small livings, and (we believe) the building of churches and of glebe-houses in Armagh and Down, where sum-h application might be called fur; the surplus then remaining he should propose to apply to moral and religious instruction in the district. Mr. BARING closed Ws sieecli_by,a„vim k , ;f it were th e in. tentiou at the how, that-thecineation of appropriation sliouht be dealt with, surely the fairest and most just course would- he' to introduce a distinct and substantive measure with reference to that subject, and not etnharrass his majesty's-ministers in pass ing a hill which had been brought forward merely for the purpose of commuting tithes and regulating their collection.; ( Hear, hear.) Ha was unwilling to close the few observations which he had addressed to the house without strongly impressing- on them the dancer which must result to the church .from the passing of such a resmution as that proposed by the noble lord, and without declaring it as his decided opinion that if the object of those who supported it was to promote the peace and security of Ireland, they could not have taken a mare injudicious and inexpedielit 'course for the purpose of attaining the .desired end than that which they bad chosen. (Hear, hear, hear.) Mr. HENRY GRATTAN supported the resolution. Alluding to the close of Sir 11. Harilinge s speech, he said it might perhaps be difficult to carry on a government on the principles of orange ascendancy. Mr. SIN(ILAIR thought the noble lord's motion of a revolu tionary character and tendency. (Hear, hear.) •The com mencement was with the property of the church ; the next step would be to relieve laymen from the incumbrance of their property ' eventually, ail titles and distincti o ns w ou ld b e abolished, an d Woburn Abbey might perhaps be converted into one, of Owen's national schools, placed under the superin tendence of Citizen John Russell the eider, (a laugh.) Lord F. EGERTON said, that when he heard hon. members opposite declare that the proposed measure would tranquillize the distracted country of Ireland, ho could not agree with them. The noble lord by whom the resolution was proposed, and his friends, were nnbubtedly a formidable party. But there were other persons whom he (lord F. Egerton) must consider as the leaders in this business. For instance, there was the hon. mem ber fo r St. Albans. The hon. gentleman went much further than the noble lord, for he said he veined the principle iu the resolution because it would bring under the control of the state, meaning of the House of Commons, all corporate property whatever. The hon, member fair Meat h haul termed this questiou a renovation of the catholic question. Now one of the great Eromoters of catholic emancipation, to whom he (Lord F. gerton) had listened with that delight .and enthusiasm with which a young mind ever received the impressions of eloquence —he meant Lord Plunket—had contended on that occasion that one of the great results of emancipation would be to induce the catholics to maintain inviolate the principles. ay, and the pro perty, of the protestant church in Ireland. He (Lord F.Egeri on ) had given his humble assistance to catholic emancipation on that, ground, and he therefore felt himself bound in honour and consistency to maintain the rights of the protestant church in Ireland. Ilow could the resolution be carried into effect but by adopting the principle of proportion ? Now, it' that principle were introduced into Ireland, a nd it were thereby rendered. beneficial to the Roman Catholics in that country to reduce the number of . protestants, the results would in all probability be written in indelible characters of blood and fire, and handed down to shuddering and incredulous pos terity. If hon. members referred to the evidence before the committee on the subject, in 1825, they would find that the tithe question was not tre a ted then as it w as at the p r esent inn went. Dr. Doyle, Mr. O'Conm 11, and the other witnesses, merely spoke of tithes as interfiring with apiculture. It had not been his intention to address the house at all on this ques ti;:n; but when those who opposed tLe resolution were taunted with proceeding t o r i ng th e highly objectionable, unless indis pensably necessary, alarm-bell, "the church is in danger," he telt.hunndao say that. iu his.opinion t. the chur4 was in dan ger; and that present events wer e a jtistffication of a recourse to that expedient., (1 - tear, hear, hear.) The day was at hand alien, urged by no factions purposes, but by the noblest motives that could actuate the human breast, a voice wouA roll like thunder over the island , rousing in every bosom that attachment to our sacred institutions by the manifestation of which alone could they be saved. To those institutions he had thought it his •duty to give- the best support which his humble abilities would permit (Hear, hear, hear!) The Avron:s EY GENERAL concluded an elaborate argument in opposition to the resolution as follows :—\Vhat object had - the noble lord in view ? The practical benefit of the people of Ireland, or the gratificatiou of those who were adverse to the church ? (Hear.) If it were the latter, all he could say was, that after all that had been done, and said, and sworn (cheers), no such feeling ought to exist to be gratified, or if it did exist, no man ought to have the disposition to gratify it. i Hear.) Did the uohle lord think that, by not waiting fur the tithe bill, but by taking this opportunity of bringing the house to some resolution upon this subject, he had hit upon an i iu :enious expedient that would render it impossible for his right honourable friend (the Chancellor of the Exchequer), after the declaration he had made, to carry on the government ? ( Hear!) Upon this part of the question it did not become him to speak much, but •he had a right to adopt as independent a tone as the honourable member for Edinburgh. I sought not (continued the honourable and learned geutleman)-1 sought not a seat in this house—l sought not office under the govern ment-1 derive no heuefit from either. I ant placed here in a situation of independence quite as great as that of any other hon. member, and I can assure the noble lord that as far as I am concerned, if he can form an administ lotion that will perfect and not destroy the institutions of this great country, I, for ot:e, will cheerfolly resign my place to some member of that administration that will .possess the confidence of the people, and that will not abuse that. confidence. (Hear, hear.) But let we wain the noble lord, that if he gr es on, he must be pre pared to see the principle of this resoiutiou Cairied into etrect by others, with whom I cannot think he wishes to coincide. Let sue caution him, as an eminent writer has said of an illus trious statesman (Lord Chatham), that whilst he only intended to hamper a minister, he lost us America ;—let me caution the noble lord, that history, to which he has alluded, do not say of bin:, that while he only intended to hamper a minister, he de stroyed a church and dismembered an empire. (Cheers.) Mr. PERE IN valued the principle of the resolution because it was calculated to give peace to Ireland, and would give in creased and just etliciency to the established church. Mr. Serjt. J ACK sok opposed the resolution. Mr. Gisburne, Mr. C. W. Wynn, Colonel Sibthorp, Mr. nogg, and Mr. Lucas, followed in the debate. Sir ROBERT PEEL spoke at great length in reply, he com menced by &tying that he should not have offered a single word . if it.hail.not been assumed that the was now discussing the same question upon which it had been engaged fur six succes sive nights. But the resolution which the house was now called • upon t , affirm was this :—" That no measure upon the subject of tithes in Ireland can lead to a satisfactory and final adjust ment which does nut embody the foregoing resolution." He had great objection to the form of the resolution, and to the principle which it would establish—a precedent which was per fectly novel, and with respect to which the noble lord himself must have entertained great doubts, since it was an entire de ' parture from the course which he miginaly gave notice it was j his intention to pursue. (Cheers.) The noble lord, in the first instance, said that it' the House of Commons affirmed hie reso lution, he would notify that fact to the crown by address, in or der to euirbte him to proceed with a bill. What did he now propose to do ? lie had passed his resolution ; he proposed to make no communication to the crovvu, he proposed to make no communication to the House of Lords, but he did propose that the House of Commons should inform itself that it had passed the resolution, and that it would hereafter be bound by it. (Cheers.) . The noble lord now called upon the housejo declare that no measure which should not embody the principle of his resolution could lead to a satisfactory settlement of .the tithe question. He objected to that proposition. Ile thought it would be mutt unwise in the house to declare that one single measure could alone lead to a final and satisfactory result. (Hear, hear.) The adoption of such a course was most objec tionable, and he thought that those who approved of the resolu tion origivatly moved by the noble lord were perfectly at liberty to object to his present proposition. (Hear.) A majority of the house—a majority of 25, had affirmed a certain resolution, against which a minority of 289 protested, independently of those who paired off, making altogether a minurit) of about 300 members. , The noble tool now called upon'the house to affirm the principle of that resolution—to declare that all fur ther discussion was unnecessary—that no proceedings in coin .mittee on the tithe bill needed to be listened to—that there was but one measure which could effect a final and satisfactory set tlement of the tithe question, and that was the measure to which the majority of the house had agreed. He (Sir R. Peel) did not hesitate to denounce this proceeding as the tyrannical act of a majority (vehement cheering tot some minutes) ; it was the tyrannical act of a majority, by a proceeding of a perfectly novel nature—a proceeding for which no precedent could be found, to preclude the necessity of further discussion in order to avoid their own conviction-in order to avoid listening to what might be urged in committee, to bind themselves irrevo cably by an unnecessary pledge to the opinion that no measure could lead to a final and satisfactory settlement of the tithe question which did net embody a certain principle. (Cheers.) [Our extracts from Sir Robeit's speech are necessarily short, on account of the length of the debate.] Alluding to Sir. Gis borne's speech, the right hun. baronet said; the hon. member for Derbyshire, who had by his own confessiun been searching after precedents, had been Odd to quote only two authorities bearing on the question of spuliati pips which 'aere Henry VIII. and Captain Macheath. (Laughter.) The heuourable member, after giving loin (Sir Robert Peel) credit for his historical knowledge as regarded Henry V 111.,, was kind euuugh to as smite that he was equally cognizant of the dictum Of Captain Macheath. The Captaiu was a wiser man than the bun. mem ber :he never appropriated a surplus till he got it. (Great cheering and laughter.) The Captain applied hi. surplus to se cular purposes. (Laughter.) So far he resembled the honour able member and his friends, but he differed from them in this respect—that in the first instance he ascertained its existence. (Cheers.) After enumerating several of his objections to the resolution, Sir Robert said that he had another objection against this resolution. That was, that its object was to obstruct the passing of the Tithe Bill. (Hear, hear.) It was a way of no tifying to the government, in a dangerous and unprecedented instinct, " We will not permit you to introduce your measure ; we wilt not allow you to pass any preliminary stage iu which any point could be agreed to; we will not discuss it in commit tee, unless you epee to this resolution." This could be the only motive. Ile hail only again shortly to state that he de cidedly objected to this resolution. Ile objected to it on the ground that the principle of time resolution was unjust; he ob jected to it on account of the manner iu which it had been brought forward—he objected to it because those by whom it was prepated laboured under a want of information as to the sub ject ou which they were legtslatiug. Acting upon erroneous data— not having determined the amount of the property of the church—not knowing how much they wanted for thtapur poses of education, and proclaiming their otject to be a twat settlement, a satisfactory settlement, they had yet established no principle to which the facts, when ascertained, could be ap plied, thus aggravating the danger inherent in the resolution itself. Why "had they not . deterudued how the tithe revenues l ip were to be appropriated? (Hear, hear.) Again, they had nut taken into aecuuttt hew many livings in Ireland belonged to laymen. if they were to deduct the lay advowsous, they , would find a large sum insist be subtracted Iran their estimate of the church property, for he apprehended that they would distinguish between the lay and the clerical impropriator. In the church temporalities bill this was done, and he suppos ed this would be done again, for the noble lord would not deal with lay lauds in an arbitrary manner. The result.of this debate, now continued for seven uays, would only affirm a prin ciple whose practical effects must necessarhy be dependent on the life of every clergyman in the south of Ireland. But what was the condition of these clergymen its the south of Ireland who the house thought were loaded with superfluity? They had been deprived of their tithe fur the last four years. If he had determined to meddle with the noble lord's resolution, which lie had no intention of doing, the first claims he should make would be to provide compensation fur those who had suf fered under, sift patiently acquiesced in, the present system. ( Hear, hear.) If they found such men with wives and families resident amongst their parishioners, were they to be deprived of their right because they had been temperate in the enforce ment of them—because they had shrunk from extreme mea sures—because they had submitted to severe plivutions rather then come into collision with their flocks? (Cheers.) He held in his hand one of many letters he had received on the subject. After stone observations, the right hun. baronet read an extract from the letter:—" I entreat you, if practicable, to create a fund to provide for the widows and orphans of clergymen, which the contemplated reduction of their incomes would render pecu liarly well timed, as many must now be disabled from partially attainiug that object by effecting insurances on their lives. And, lastly, to relieve them from future instalments (together with arrears now due) to the board of first fruits, for loans ad vanced them to build their glebe-ho ..es. I siocer•ly witAk mine was au isolated c.ise, but fr ivan4 are sii:tiiarly circumstanced with myself, they have great difficulties to encounter. l effected the composition to my palish (in 1832) at a sacrifice of £l5O per annum of the income I was for years in receipt of—namely, 12.581; this was voluntarily reduced by meltui.:43o. By the pro posed bill this will be further reduced to £3'22 11.1 s.; mad which I should pay £5O insurance, £4.3 rent, £29 first fruits; leaving a balance of £4OO lOs. to support my beloved wife, ten children, . aud myself, after being above 40 years an un wot thy labourer in the christian viueyard. (Cheers.) A murmur, however, ehall nut escape my lips, fur I feel convinced the welfare of the esta- Ushed church is the object you arid the government are most anxious to promote. Were the second measure adopted (which I have humbly suggested), I should regard as trivial every pecuniarly difficulty .1 might be destined to encounter, for it would console me under them all, and pluck from the pillow of death the only thorn this world could plant there. (Great cheering.) As a small atonement for thus pt esumiug to trespass on you, permit me to offer the accotripevina p ueui , f or w hi c h my eldest son obtained a vice-chancellor's prize. Ise was equally successful with two other poems, but the enclosed is the only one published." (The pathos with which the right hon. baronet read this short extract produced a great effect upon the house.) It had been said that it was riot the resolution but the principle that was emaciated for. It was notbyvisililg the applicationtllidraaingi X/O or £100,(P) trout the Irish church, aud iin of it to one object, that that principle would be carried into effect; but it would nevertheless be fatal to the establishment; and yet this was the principle most anxiously and must unfairly contended for. If he surveyed those men who since the agita tion o f the catholic qhestion had discussed it, and had more than any other, by the powerful application of their talents and strength' of reason, contributed to obtain political equality for the catholics, he found that while they ads ocated their claims they still contended with equal fervour end force fur the religi ous establishments of the country. This was the opinion of Burke. This opinion wits also eutertained by Lord Plunkett, by Sir John Newport, and by Mr. Greitau, WiI)SC sentiments were finis expressed in the last words he ever wrote:-.; " Resolved, that a committee be appointed, with a view to repeal the civil and political disabilities which affect his ma jesty's Roman catholic subjects on account of their religion. " • Resolved, that such repeal be made with due regard to the inviolability of the protestant ;•eligiun aud establishments. Resolved, that these resolutions do stand the sense of the Commons of the Imperial Parliament ou the subject of civil and religious liberty, and as such be laid before his majesty.' These resuiutions c o ntain my sentiments; this is my testamen tary disposition, and I die with a love of liberty in my heart, and this declarationiu favour of my country in my hand." (Loud cheers.) The right hon. baronet then proceeded—" You are attempting to establish a principle, hut depend upon it there will be no limitation to it except in the destinction in its present form of the Protestant church of Ireland. (Cheers.) lam not unconscious of the difficulties by which lain surrounded. lann determitied to make every effort I can consistently with honour (cheers) to retain the situation which I owe to the favour of my sovereign, but I believe that I should place my mutat y in less danger by refusing to accede to your resolution, while adhering to the opluious expressed by Burke, by Lord Plunkett, by the practical couttuou sense of Sir John N e port, and by the testa mentary injunction of Grattan, than by yieldiug to your reso letiou, and thus becomine, a party to the principle which the noble lord has contended ter." (Loud and prolonged cheering followed the conclusion of the right hon. bat onet's address.) Mr. Spring Rice fullossett Sir Robert Peel its time debate. The house then divided, when there appeared— Ayes 285 Noes • • Majority against ministers On returning to the gallery- Mr. BERNAL was bringing up the report of the mutiny bill. On the motion of Mt. L'hoznaurcity the house adjourned at half-past one o'clock. HOUSE OF LORDS.-WEDNESDAY. RESIGNATION op MINISTERS.. The house met at a quarter to five o'clock. The Earl of Shaftestnity sat for the Lord Chancellor. Some petitions having been presented, The Duke or WELLINGTON said, circumstances having oc curred In the other house which have induced minisiers to tender their resignations to his majesty, I beg sto inform the house that they now only hold their offices until their successors are a ppointed. Lord boot:Gk' A M would still bring on his motion on educa tion on Thursday ..next, as that question did not depend un political events. The house lien adjourned. HOUSE OF COMMONS.—WEDNESDAY. Some routine business ha% lug been disposed of, Sir R. PEEL rose, and immediately the utmost silence was observed in every part of the house, when the right honourable tout. proceeded as follows:—Sir, it is toy intention that the mu tiny bill be read a third time, and, in melting that motion, I wish to avail myself of the opportunity which it affords me of signifying to the house that I, in emijunclionwith all my col leagues in his majesty's service, and in conformity with their tumultuous opinion; have felt it incembent, upon us, upon com bined cutisioereion of the vote to which the house came last MOO., anti of our position as a government, to signify to his ma jesty that it was our duty to place the offices which we held at the disposal of his majesty. Ido not hesitate to say that I have taken"; his course with the utmost reluctance, and not without the deepest sense of its necessity, because I felt that being in postession of the confidence of the king, and having received from his majesty the most cordial and unremitting support— looking at the present position of affairs, and at the present state of political parties—looking also at their strength—the numeri cal strength of that great party by which we have heen support ed—l have felt it my duty to continue the attempt of adminis tering the public affairs, as the responsible adviser of the crown up to the latest moment consistent with the interests of the public service. Sir, when Ido not hesitate to avow that re ,uetance, I believe I shall have credit with a, great majority of APRIL 10. 1845. the House of Commons (loud cries of " Hear," from the oppo - sition) that that re.uctance is connected with public principle. (Reiterated opposition cheers.) I have a strong imprission that when a public man, at a crisis ot great importance, under takes the public trust of administering the affairs of a govern ment of this country, he does incur an obligation of perse vering in the administration of those affairs as long as it is pys sible.. Ido feel that no interference with public life—that no disgust to the labours it imposes—that no personal rnortitica tMns—no reference to private feeling, should sanction a public man, on light grounds, in withdraWing from that post to which the favour of his sovereign had called him ; but, at the same time, there is an evil in exhibiting to the country the want im the part of g overnment of that support in the House of Com mons which shall enable it satisfactorily to conduct the public business—which shall enable it to exercise a legitimate and necessary control over the proceedings of this house—a control conferred on it by the position of that confidence. (Hear, hear.) I repeat, sir, there is an evil in that exhibition of weakness to which limits must be placed. (Hear, hear.) I must say that, reverting to all that has occurred since the commencement of the present session—looking to the little progress that we have been enabled to make fioiu the want of that support and confi dence—looking to what has occurred on each of the last four nights, in which his Majesty's ministers have had the misfor tune to be in a minority on each occasion, on Thursday last, on Friday last, on Monday, and on last night, although' that mi nority was a smaller one than that with which we commenced this session—adverting to the fact.that on that occasion we received the support of those who not having general and un;imited con fidence in the government, yet still have given to that govern ment a cordial and honourable support on every question un which it was necessary to give it ; (great cheers.) adverting to ail these considerations, I must say, in my , opinion the time is come when it is incumbent upon us to withdraw from office. In addition to these considerations, the vote of last night—that vote I conceived implied a want of confidence iu his Majesty's govermneut, becaus e it was not n e cessary, i n my cpinion, for any public purpose to come to that vete. (Great cheering ) It was tantamount to a declaration on the part of the house, that the helm had not that cuutideuce in his Majesty's govern ment which emtitled the members of the present government to submit to the -Voneideration of the house the measures of which it had given notice. (Cheers.) The noble lord had signified his intention, if the vote the house had came to last night should meet with its approbation, that he would follow it up with an address to the crown. Sir, I conceived, as great embarrassment of the public affairs would have arisen by the presentation of that address, and as I had no right to think the house would take a different view with respect to it, I thought it incumbent upon me, and in that view I have acted exactly in conformity with my colleagues—l thought that my public duty was—l thought that a public duty was imposed upon we, which I sin cerely felt-1 thought that the time was fast approaching when resignation was inevitable, and that 1 ought not to persevere in a useless struggle, which might involve his Majesty and the country in additional difficulties and inconveniences. Sir, we consider that vote was not merely tantamount to a declaration of a want of confidence, but the vote of last night implied the necessity of a full change of the system its Ireland, so far as the church revenues were concerned. Sir, we considered that that would impose such difficulties in the way of the practical ad ministration of the government in Ireland as to render it in cumbent on us to entet no farther into the consideration of that question. In addition, sir, to tbet fact of the vote being tanta mount to a want of confidence, it also imposed on us the ne cessity of undertaking the practical execution of the laws in Ire land, when a majority—a considerable majority of the house had approved of a principle at variance with the principle with which we set out. Sir, the vote of last night is not an abstract_principie, the practical ex ecu ti on o f w hi c h cou ld b e carr i e d i nto effect by us. Theme way, sir, be points on which the House of Commons may conic to a different opinion to that of the government upon some abstract principle of great importance, hut still there might be such a case wherein the government might govern even hi opposition to the house. (Cheers.) But, sir, the vote of last night places things in a very different position. You cannot leave the question of tithes in its present state. At pre v ent you are in a position in which you cannot remain. lu the un certainty which prevails, you cannot by any possibility enrolee the collection ot tith es . (Ch eery. ) Nothing would-be inure dangerous than to leave the question in its present state. Pro perty of all sorts would be pieced in the utmost jeopardy. Wo could not carry out your principle—(hear, hear)—aud there fore we considered your vote of last night as tantamount to a vote of no confidence. Sir, under these circumstances, if we "had remained in pSwer—if we had continued in the govern meut—we should have been pressed for an immediate settlement of that question upon the tithe bill of which we have given notice, uue of the principles of which was to be the remission of our claim upon the Irish clergy, fur the instalments duo under the million act. (Cheers.) Sir I cannot see-1 cannot for a moment suppose—that the hous e wou ld h ave come to a dif ferent conclusion. I cannot anticipate that the house would have sanctioned that principle—that it would have given up its right to those instalments without the recognition of the principle of the Vote of last night. (Hear, hear.)' Under these circum stances, and having reason to apprehend the delay of a few days would make no material difference; considering also that we must have shortly proceeded with the tithe bill, on which we must have again clashed with the house, we did con sider that the vote of last night was tantamount tai a resolution of no confidence in the ministry. (Cheers.) Being firmly resolved to adhere to the principle of that bill—(loud minis terial cheering, continued for some minutes)—being firmly resolved not to admit the principle of the vote of last night under any eircuiustauces—(reiterated cheering)—under all these combined considerations, we feel it to be our duty—tb be incumbent on us as public nien, respectfully to request his majesty to accept the resignation of our various seals. (Great cheering from the opposition.) Sir, I have therefore to state that we hold office for the execution of public business ouly— and to prevent public inconvenience—until our successors are appointed. Perhaps the best course I cats take will be to_ pro pose a short adjournment. I shall nut propose it beyond Mou day. I' should have made the motion for adjournment at once, bui that there would be an objection to it until another matter had been disposed of. Perhaps the house will feel at this present moment, aud in the existing state of public affairs, that any public discussion of other business will be unneces sary, and I trust that the motion will be agreed to almost, if not quite, unanimously. (Loud cheers from the oppositiou.) If inconvenience should be likely to al ise to the parties interested in the election committee, for which a ballot is fixed for to morrow, the house will, perhaps, meet for the i t orpose of making (het Lenet to i seeseetaeeg nieonvenience, consenting at the same time to the adjourninent till Mouday. It is with a view to preserve the public interests that I move the third reading of the mutiny bill, which I hope will be as unanimously agreed to as the motion for ad)journment. ( llear, hear.) I wish to give this explanation as briefly as possible, and in a manner the least likely to excite any angry feelings. (Tremendous cheering.) The whole of my life lias been spent in the House of Commone, aud I desire that the remainder may he spent there; and what ever may be the conduct of others, I shall always be anxious to stand well with the house, whether in a majority or in a minority. (Renewed cheering.) I well know that under no circum stances of censure or difficulty would I ever have advised the resignation of that great source of moral strength, which con sists in a strict adherence to' the principles of the spirit of the constitution of the country ; for I am sure that adherence vi:111 be the surest safeguard against any impending danger, and that is why I believe myself and my colleagues ought not to persist in carrying on public affairs, after a fair trial, and against tbe decided opinion of a majority of the House of Commons. It is because I have that conviction deeply . rooted in my mind, al though I do sincerely regret the necessity which has compelled me to abandon the King's service at this moment, yet upon the balance of public feeling, I confess that I shall more directly promote the ultimata interests of the country by retiring, than persisting in a fruitless attempt to carry on public affairs. ( Ihe right hon. hart. sat down amid reiterated cheering front ail sides of the house.) Lord Jo NN Il ussaii wished only to state that with regard to the course which the right hon. gentleman had proposed to pursue with respect to the adjournment, he believed there could_ oe no objection to that. With regard to the rest that he had stated, be believed that the right hon. gentleman had only acted in uniformity with those feelings which had actuated the gen tlemen on his (Lord John Russell's) side of the house. (hear, hear, hear.) The house, after the presentation of a few petitions of no public interest, adjourned till Thursday. Sir Robert Peel left the house immediately aftensards, and was received by the assembled cro.v d with loud cheers, The right hon. baronet appeared in excellent spirits, and was followed by a vast number of persons to the Home Office, in Downiag- • street, by whim he was repeatedly cheered. THE ATTRACTIONS OF A FASHIONABLE IRISH WATERING PLACE. (Front Fraser's Magazine.) The town of PASSAGR There are ships from Cadiz, Is both large and spacious, And from Barbadues, And situated But the leading trade is Upon the say, • In whiskey-punch; • 'Tis nate and dacent, And you may go in And quite adjacent 'Where one Molly Bowen To come from Cork Keeps a nate hotel . . On a stuttmer's day; For a quiet lunch. There you may slip in But land or deck on, To taken dipping,. You may safely reckon, Foment the shipping Whatsoever country That at anchor ride; • You come hither from, Or in a wherry On an invitation Cross o'er the ferry . To a jollification, To Carrigaloe, With a parish priest On the other side. That's called "Father Tom." Mud cabins swarm in Of ships there's one fixt This place so charming, For lodging convicts, With sailor garments A floating "stone jug" ilung.out to .thy ; And each abode is - The hake oti I salmon, Snug and commodious, Playing at bagammon, With pigs melodious Swim for divarsion In their straw-binit sty. All round this " hulk ;" 'Tie there the turf is, There "Saxon" jailors And lots of murphies, Keep brave repailors, Dead sprats and herrings, Who soon with sailors And oyster shells; Must anchor weigh Nor any lack, 0! now th' em'raid island, Of good tobacco—. . . :d'e'er to see dry laud, Though what is smuggled Until they sly land • By 'far excels. In sweet Bot'uy Bay. THE ISLANDS OF THE BLEST. (From the Cambridge University Magazine.) The islands of the blest, they say, The islands of the blest, Are peaceful and happy, by night and by day, Far away in the glor►ous west. • They need not the moon in that land of delight, They need not the pale, pale star; The sun he is bright, by day and by night, Where the souls of the blessed arc. They till not the ground, and they plough not the wave, They labour not—never, oh never! Not a tear du they shed, nut a sigh do they heave, They are happy for ever cud ever. Soft is the breeze, like an evening one, When the sun bath gone to rest, And the sky is pure, and clouds there are none 'O'er the islands of the blest. The deep clear sea, in its mazy bed, Doth garlands of gems enfold: Nut a tree, but it blazes with crowns for the dead, Even tlo►rers of living gold. The Lurd-Lientenant has knighted LieutenantColonelC. o. Hastings, Steward of his Household. Sir William o'lllalleb who received the honour of knighthood from the Lord-Lieuteu ant recently; is ensign in the 14th Reginieut.—lrish Popo.. PULPI t ORATOR V.-A certain primitive methodist preacher, some time ago, enlarging on the great moitaiity of the human frame, exclaimed, " Yes, mV friends, when the linters of life are beginning to decay, andthe pegs of nature begin to fail, tlieu down comes the building." 1. 1 11111111