Northern Times. — Liverpool, Merseyside, England, 1857-06-20 00:00:00

TELEGRAPHIC NEWS. [By British and Irish Magnetic Telegraph.] THE BESSARABIA. FRONTIER. At five o'clock yesterday (Friday) evening, the Plenipotentiaries representing the great powers, assembled at the foreign office, Paris, for the purpose of signing the convention respecting the * new frontier of Bessarabia. IMPERIAL PARLIAMENT. _ (By British and Irish Magnetic Telegraph.) HOUSE OF LORDS. FRIDAY. The House met at five o'clock. RETIREMENT OF BISHOPS. Word Redesdale drew attention to the resignation of the late Bishop of Norwich with a view to show the necessity of making some definitive arrangement for the retirement of prelates and the status and privileges, especially in regard to seats in Parliament which they should hold afterwards. The Lord Chancellor argued that the law at present was sufficient to etable a Bishop to resign his see, and his seat, being held in virtue of his Episcopal office, terminated with his leave of that office. A stipulatior had been made by the late Bishop of Norwich for a pension on his re tirement. The noble and learned Lord intimated that but for the abrupt termination of the last session, a general measure would have been introduced respecting the re tirement of prelates. A discussion ensued after which the Smoke Nuisance Scotland Amendment Bill went through committee. — ..The Transportation and Penal Servitude Bill was read a third time and passed. ti,The House adjourned at half past seven. HOUSE OF COMMONS.—FRIDAY. a The Speaker took the chair at four o'clock. ADULTERATION OP FOOD. P'" Mr. Schofield gave notice, for Thursday next, of a bil for the prevention of the adulteration of food. WEIGHTS AND MEASURES. In answer to Colonel Gilpin, „„ Sir George Grey said that the Government were no' prepared with a measure upon the subject of weights and measures, but a bill dealing with the question was brought in by the member for Stafford on the previous night. FAIRS IN IRELAND. In reply to Mr. D. O'Connor, Mr. W. Herbert said a bill on the subject of fairs and markets in Ireland would shortly be laid on the table by him, but looking at the present state of public business, he did not think there was any prospect of passing it in the present session. DESIGNS FOR PUBLIC OFFICES. Sir B. Hall, in reply to questions, stated that the successful designs for public offices would be exhibited in Westminster Hall, after the decision of the judges (which was expected on the 25th) had been given. At the same time the models for the Wellington Monument would be exhibited in the centre of the hall. On the motion that the house, at its rising, do adjourn till Monday, The motion for adjournment was agreed to. THE GENERAL VALUATION OF IRELAND. In answer to Mr. Grogan, The Chancellor of the Exchequer said it was not intended to make any change in the mode of raising the expenses of carrying on the annual revision of the general valuation of Ireland. SUPPRESSION OF THE SLAVE TRADE. Sir Charles Wood said it was the intention of the government to increase the number of cruisers on the coast of Cuba for the suppression of the slave trade. THE ROCHDALE ELECTION. f General Thompson presented a petition from John Newall, parliamentary agent, stating that a sum of £5O had been offered to Alexander Rothwell, a witness in the case of the Rochdale election petition, by Peter Johnson, of Rochdale, to induce him to go to New Orleans; in order to avoid giving evidence before the committee. The petition was read by the Clerk at the table ; and John Newall was ordered to be called in. That gentle. man accordingly appeared at the bar, and in answer to questions put by the Speaker, confirmed the statements contained in the petition. In reply to a question from Lord Palmerston, the wit ness stated that his informant expressed himself dissatis fied with the offer of £5O, thinking £lOO not too large a sum. (A laugh.) Alexander Rothwell was then called, and stated, in answer to questions, that he came to London to get out of the way of the agents both of the petitioners and the sitting member. He came to London in May. In London he met a Mr. Lord, who took him to a public house, to Peter Johnson, who offered him the bribe of £5O. He was to meet Peter Johnson at the same place that evening. He had received money at the Rochdale election from the agents of Sir A. Rameey. He borrowed the money to come up to London. Since he had been in Lon don he had not received anything from Mr. Newall. Lord Palmerston then moved that Peter Johnson be ordered to attend at the bar forthwith. WMr. H. Macauley observed that it would be unprece dented to ask a man whether or not he was guilty of misdemeanour. Sir G. Grey said that tampering with witnesses of that house was a high misdemeanour, and punishable with great severity; and he apprehended that a man ought not to be proceeded against for the offence without his having an opportunity of being heard. The orders of the day were then proceeded with. THE BOMBARDMENT OF GREYTOWN. Lord C. Hamilton asked what steps.had been taken by her Majesty's Government to obtain compensation for British subjects residing at Greytown, whose property was destroyed when that town was bombarded in 1854? Lord Palmerston could not help characterising the proceedings as violent and cruel, reflecting no credit upon the government who ordered, or the officer who executed the order. The question, however, had to be considered as one of international law, and the law officers of the crown decided that the inhabitants of Greytown had no claim to compensation. Lord Lovaine remarked that the British Consul's house, with the flag flying, was set on fire, and condemned the cowardly policy of England towards the strong power of the United States. Mr. Roebuck ridiculed the explanation given by the noble lord, that it was the duty of the country to protect Grey town from conquest, and to allow bombardment without interference. The conduct of the American Government was dishonest, and if the offending power had been China instead of America, they would have heard immediately of insult •to the British flag, and reparation would have been enforced. Mr Bentinek observed that there had been for some time a want of determination to resent outrages committed by the Ameriern Government, and condemned that policy as more likely to promote hostilities than to avert them. The Attorney-General denied that in any case the right to demand satisfaction for outrages by America had been given up by England, and expressed regret at the course which the Government had been compelled to take. Mr Disraeli considered the explanation of the Govern ment most unsatisfactory, contending that it was a viola tion of international law to bombard au untortified town. • The French Government had sought redress though the English Government had failed to do so, but he believed that public opinion being brought to bear upon the matter would lead to a different course being adopted. Lord John Russell approved of the course taken by the _ Government in regard to the claim for compensation, but thought that explanations should be demanded, as to the insult to the British flag. The case of China had been referred to, but our conduct there had been most flagitious, and so totally oppoied to justice, that it was a precedent he hoped would never again be followed. After an uninteresting discussion upon miscellaneous Subjects, the house went into COMMITTEE OF SUPPLY. ViThe following votes were agreed to, with more or less discussion—£39,69l for royal palaces, £60,000 for public • institutions, £26,669 for furniture, &c., £75,781 for royal parks and pleasure-grounds. The Chairman then reported progress. THE ROCHDALE ELECTION. THE SUPPLY OF CJTTON. countries which have been enumerated. But the only place to which we can look for an immediate, a continued, and, in a moderate course of time an adequate supply, is India. (Hear, hear.) To this it must come at last. (Hear, hear.) India was a cotton-growing country, and a cotton manufacturing country, long before Manchester was known I might almost say, or at least before it had assumed anything of its present position, or had dis tinguished itself in the manufacture of cotton. (Hear, hear.) India can still supply your wants. (Hear, hear.) I shall not enter into that question myself, because there are other speakers to follow; but it has been suggested that India can supply not onLy what this country wants, but everything which America wants, if there should come a period, as come probably it will, when the whole system of slavery will be done away with, and America will have to look to some other country, possibly to supply even her own wants in cotton. (Hear, hear.) Now, gentlemen, all I have to say is, that I consider it is your duty to support this association. (Hear, hear.) There is no use in a number of gentlemen coming down here and making speeches on this platform, and endeavouring to excite you about what you ought to be already in a ferment about. (Hear, hear.) You ought to be exciting us and compelling us as your representatives in parliament, and the other members who honour you with their presence, and many other members who, although not present, will, I am sure, be glad to aid the meeting to do something to forward the object in view. They tan assist you, but then the effort must come upon your part. (Hear, hear.) You must make known your wants—you must speak in a loud voice, or else nothing will ever be done. (Hear, hear.) Mr. OLIVER. HEYWOOD seconded the resolution in a ledo,the i ped and able speech. The CHAIRMAN then sailed upon Lard Stanley to support the resolution. Lord STANLEY in coming forward, was received with enthusiastic applause. He said : Mr. Mayor and Gentle men, I am sure it is unnecessary for me to say, as Mr. Turner and Mr. Heywood have said before me, that I have come here for the purpose of listening, and not for that of teaching. It would, indeed, be presumptuous upon my part to suppose that I am capable of instructing the community of Manchester upon a subject with which the interests of Manchester are so vitally bound up. But Ido wish to hear what, upon this subject, Manchester has to say. I wish to confer with you—l wish that we should take council together—l wish that we should join in devising suoh remedial measures as the present emergency may seem to render needful ; and having devised these measures, I hope and trust that I shall be enabled to join with you in enforcing them upon the legislature, and upon the executive of the country: (Hear, hear.) NOW, gentle men, fhe first point that I think it right to note is, that the importance of the question now before us, namely—the deficient cotton supply—is not temporary, but permanent, and that it has ever a tendency to increase. This can be proved by half-a-dozen figures—they are very short —which will afford the best evidence of what I am con tending for, and which, therefore, I may be allowed to read. I take up the last report of the Inspectors of Factories in the United Kingdom, and I find that the horse-power of those factories was, collectively, in 1850, 134,000 ; in 1856, 161,000. I find that the looms of the United Kingdom were, in 1850, 301,000 ; they were last year, 370,000. I find that the spindles were, in 1850, twenty five and a-half millions. Last year they were thirty-three and a-half millions. These figures show an increase of about thirty-three per cent. in a period of seven years. Now, even those statistics do not afforded a full measure of the rate at which our productive powers are increasing, because, as we all know, machinery is driven at much greater speed now than it used to be some years ago. I have tried to obtain information upon that point, and I find it stated upon authority, on which I think I may rely, that the increase of speed may be taken as averaging about the proportion of seven to six, when compared with what it was eight or ten years ago. Now, putting these two calculations together, the increase in the number of spindles of thirty-three per cent., or rather more, and the increased speed at the ration of seven to six, you will have indicated a total increase of the productive power, to the amount of between thirty-nine and forty per cent. Taking another test. I find it stated on official authority, that in the manufacturing districts the increase of the last year,lBs6, over 1855, was over 2500 horse-power, and about 10,000 additional hands employed. Now, I have only to assume, what I think I am entitled to do—that the 2,200 and odd cotton factories in the kingdom, have borne the same proportion in the increase of their productive power to the 3,000 factories of other descriptions. eI have only to assume that the cotton trade has kept.pace—as I believe it has done—with other branches of manufacturing business, of late years, to show that the increase in the productiv e power of that business isan increase of about forty per cent. If I take again a test of a different kind—l mean to say the imports of the raw material into the United Kingdom I find that the amount of cotton imported in 1841, was 488 million lbs.: I find that the amount in 1856, was 1024 million lbs., showing a consumpion which has, in 15 years, more than doubled. (Hear, hear). Now, it is important to us to inquire whether this is an exceptional or whether it is likely to be a permanent state of things. In my mind it is not exceptional, but likely to be permanent. (Cheers.) I say nothing of the vast regions of the world still to as great an extent as ever wholly unknown to us, but which we are now opening to our commerce. I say nothing of Africa, of central Asia, of China, or of the Indian Islands, because, whatever speculation we may form as to the future, there is no very large increase of trade to be ex pected from these quarters immediately. But, I would tako these countries with which we are already dealing to a great extent. I find that the 'United States are doubling their population every twenty-five years : I find that some of the British Colonies are increasing at an equal rate of progress : I find that the French people are throwing themselves into commercial pursuits with an energy and an enterprise which we all know them to possess, but which they never had applied in an equal degree to those pursuits before. (Cheers.) We see that the continent of Eu rope is generally peaceable, and, so far as material prosperity goes, we see that it is prosperous. Seeing these things mid looking at the present and the future,' think it would be difficult to predict when the limit will be to the develop ment of British commerce. (Hear, hear.) With our coal, with our iron, with an uulimited supply of capital, of industry, and of mechanical skill, it would really seem as if the districts of Lancashire were dsstined to be what they are called, the workshop of the world. (Hear, hear.) Why, at the present mo men t it is a matter of statistical calculation, that if you ta l e Manchester Exchange for one c e ntre, and St. Paul's for another centre, and if you draw a circle with a 30 mile radius round each, you will find a larger population included in the 30-mile line surrounding Manchester than you will find in that surrounding London. (Hear. hear.) Now I do not mention these circumstances by way of boast ; I name them for this purpose. I name them in order to show that it is not enough for us to make provision for the inquiries of the present —we must also make provision for the certain requirements of the future. (Hear, hear.) Now, gentlemen, to what extent is the community—l do not say Lancashire alone ;I do not say any one class—but to what extent is the whole com munity affected by a rise in the price of cotton ? We are now paying for cotton Bd. per lb.—that is to say, taking the consumption of last year at a gross sum, we are paying for our raw material the amount of thirty-four millions sterling. The price of cotton leafs been as low as 11 per lb., and in our present circumstances, taking it as 1 have stated, the difference between the price at 4d, and the price at Bd, is a difference of seventeen millions, or pretty near the annual cost of an European war. (Hear, hear.) To pat this into more intelligible figures, one may say, that every penny increase per pound in the price of cotton, causes a loss to the country of four millions and a quarter, or not very much less than the in come tax of Sir Robert Peel yielded at the time when he first put it on. Ido not know whether it is worth calling your attention to this fact connected with the subject. I quite agree with what has been said—that this is not a local, but a national grievance. (Hear , hear. ) At the same time yen will observe that all manufactries and all branches of business hare of late years shewu a tendency as it were to concentrate themselves together round some local centre. (Hear.) The woollen trade of late years ha's been concentrated in Yorkshire, the worsted trade in Yorkshire, and Worce-tershire ; the flax to a great extent in Ireland, the si'k business in Cheshire, Derbyshire, and Nottingham, and the cotton business ' more exclusively than ever, has been concentrating itself in Lancashire and the adjoining districtetiof Yorkshire. Ido not mean by this merely e. , lrat we all know, that the actuel amount of business done in Lancashire is greater, but also that the proportion which that business bears to business of the same kind done in other partwof the country is greater now than ever it was before. (afar, bear.) Well, then, gentlemen, we have seen that tete demand is increasing, and that it is likely to increase. We have seen that the price is rising. We have seen the vast loss caused to the community by a Might in crease of price, and we have seen that that loss falls pri marily, though not exclusively, upon this and the adjoining county. (Hear, hear.). I may just note here, in passing. that the difficulty which we experience from the rise in the price of cotton is likely to be much more severe than thet which would be felt from the same cause in foreign coun tries, and for this reason, that in England our cotton manu facture being conducted with greater efficiency, that is to say, with greater economy than it is in other notions, the met of the taw material constitutes a larger proportion of the entire cost of the production in England than it deos in any other country. (Hear, hear.) Now, as I take it, the state of things of which we have to complain ranges it , elf under two heads. We complain of the insufficiency of the supply, and we complain of the precarious nature of 'he supply. The first of these points, tilt fact of the insaffi cient:supply, is obvious. The mere fact of a rise in price proves it, and upon that, therefore, I need not dwell. The second question, namely, the ptecerions nature of the supply, involves some political considerations, but these considerations are so obvious that I need hardly teach upon them. In round numbers, we take three-rourths and more of our entire consumption from the United States. I need not say that to take so large a proportion of an indespensable article from one single source of supply renders us practically and entirely dependent upon the country, whence it comes. Bear in mind that this is not a question merely of the probability or improba bility of that which we all trust and hope is impossible—a war between the countries. There are two other Causes either of which might have the same effect. The one, which I confess I do not regard as very probable, is the possibility of social disturbances in the Southern States of America. The other, which is far more probable, and against which no human foresight cm guard, is the possibility of a failure of the crop in that country. Now, you will say that, separately, thechance of any one of those events—the chances of war, the chances of a rising in the Southern States, the chance of a failure in the American crop—is very small. But recollect that which every child knows, and which is a mere matter of calculation, that however large may be the odds against either of those events singly, the chance as against them collectieely is only one-third of that amount. I do not want to over state this part of the case. Ido not for a moment deny that the dependence of two nations, commercially situated as England and the United States are, is by the very nature of the case mutual. I do not deny tha there is a state of dependence which necessarily tends to international peace, and is so far an advantage. I only say that, carried to the extent to which that de pendence is, and liable as our supply is to be interrupted, —not merely by politicil events, but by an accident against which no foresight can provide—the dependence is greater than is either desirable or safe. (Hear, hear.) Bear in mind, after all, that the state of things to which I have referred is one of comparatively recent origin. There are, I am told—for I speak upon better authority than my own—old men now living, as my Lord Lyndhurst, for instance, who can remember the time when not a single pound of American cotton vas sent over the Atlantic to this country. (Hear, hear.) I believe lam about right in saying that the length of time during which we have been dependent upon America for our supply does not date further back than the life of our present prime minister. Bear in mind, also, that this state of dependence is far from diminishing, it has been increasing year by year. I shall not weary you with figures upon that, point, but I look to the year 1801, to the beginning of this cen tury, and I find that at that time of all the cotton imported into the United Kingdom, America contributed forty-five per cent. I find that in 1826 America contributed seventy-two per cent., or less than three fourths of the whole. I find that in the years 1852-3, and 1854, taking an average of those years, the proportion contributed by the United States, was eighty per cent., or four-fifths of the whole. So that you have not merely the fact of commercial dependence, not merely the fact that that dependence has arisen within the life of many people now living, but that it is an evil, and a danger, actually increasing from year to year. (Hear, hear.) I come now to what will probably be considered as the most difficult as well as the most practical part of the subject. Is there anyaemedy which we can apply for that state of things ; and if there is, what is it Now, although I think it is to one quarter principally we shall have to look, I do not think it desirable to look to that quarter solely and exclusively. (Hear, hear.) I think there are various parts of the world into whose capabilities for cotton production it is at least worth our while to en quire. I saw that a meeting was held the other day in British Guiana, evincing a great interest in the subject, and shew- ing an anxiety to see whether they could not do something to relieve at the same time their distress and ours. A. question which parliament will have to ccnsider upon other grounds, but which bears materially npon this subject, is, whether any means can be taken by the Government of this country to furnish the British West Indies with supplies of more ' efficient labour, and with that labour in greater quantity than they have received in the last two years. The immi gration of coolies from India into,the West Indies has been successful, so far as it has gone ; but the number of immi grants has been comparatively limited, and their stay only for a Efhort time. They have to come and to return a die tance equivalent to one-half the breadth of the globe. I name it merely as a matter to be considered, and not as one upon which I would now venture to express any defi nite opinion.—Whether all the means we have hitherto applied for putting down the African slave trade, having proved only partially successful, we might not more effectually destroy that trafic and at the same time benefit ourselves by sanctioning and recognis ing an immigration of free Africans, under such conditions as the government might devise for the purpose of guarding against any abuse to which such an emigration wonld be liable. (Cries of " hear, hear.") Now, turn to another part of the globe. I attended a meeting held on the subject of the cotton supply, a few weeks ago, in London, at which Mr. J. B. Smith, whom you well know, read us a very interesting lecture, and in the course of that lecture he told us of an experiment under taken, and, so far, successfully carried through, by an inha bitant of this town or this neighbourhood. Th experiment was, to encourage the native chiefs upon the west coast of Africa to cultivate cotton on their own account, supplying them with the seed, and with the requisite instructions, and to take their cotton from them at fixed prices. Mr. Smith read the details of the experiment. It was not upon a very large scale, but so far as it has gone it appears to have been singularly successful. Now, t think the associ ation would not waste its time if it was to inquire into this branch of the subject, and if there is a possibility of doing anything there, then I have no doubt that instuctions might easily be obtained from government to all British authorities resident in those parts, to assist and encourage, to the utmost Of their power, those who might be willing to embahk capital in such an undertaking. (Hear, hear.) I say nothing of the capabilities of Algeria, because it is under another government and beyond our power; nor do I say much of Natal, nor yet of Australia, because although I am told there is nothing in these countries, either in climate or soil, unfavourable to cctton growing, still the circumstances of a new colony are such, the demand for the actual necessaries of life so great, the prices of labour are, as we all know, so high, that although these countries may be useful auxiliaries as regards the future, I am not sauguine as to either doing much for us at present. (Hear, hear.) But there is another part of the world in whose affairs I think we may usefully interest ourselves—l mean the Turkish empire. (Hear, hear.) It is well known thet in the last cen ry Turkey sent cotton to this country. It is well kawn that Asiatic Turkey has vast districts well suited for the purpose of cotton-growing, and that all required to open those districts to the English markets is, first, access to the sea, and, secend, a better security than th e cultivator has hitherto had. Now, the latter is a political question, and, as such, if British capital comes to be in vested in that part of the world, I have no doubt our government will take it up. With regard to the opening of the cotton districts, there is one scheme now before the public of which the main object is to secure a direct and speedy communication with India. I mean the Euphrates Valley line of railroad, which traverses about 150 miles from the Mediterranean to the Euphrates, and there joins in with the navigation of the river, or may be continued by rail down the Euphrates Valley. I have nothing to do, speaking in this room, with the political aspect of the question, or its possible effects upon India. I think, however, that the scheme is worth your support and en couragement, on account of the fact that the proposed lice passes through cotton growing districts and will open to British enterprise a vast tract of country, which is at present absolutely closed. I believe the promoters of the plan have already obtained a partial guarantee from the Turkish government, and are noviOpiak ing every exertion to obtain a similar guarantee from the Government of this country. B it, after all, gentle men, whatever we may do in the various parts of the world to which J have referred, can be only upon a compa ratively small scale. (Hear, hear,) I do not venture to say what are the prospects of success in each case res pee ively. I only say that each of the subjects is worth investigating, is worth analyzing, is worth reporting on, in order that if nothing can be doae, we may at least be assured that it is from no want of care or attention upon our part. (Hear, hear.) But after all it is to India, to British India, that we must at present turn our attention. (Loud cries of hear, hear,) In India we have the Govern ment of the country iu our own hands. We have a people singularly docile, submissive, and not unsuited for incluse trial pursuits. We have a command of labour which is practically unlimited; and, notwithstanding the opinion commonly entertained in this country of the populous state of India, there are still in that country vast districts, vat!; tractii. of land, which are c , naparatively P. !bully uncultivatee, (Hear, bear.) There is, I really believe, in the mind of any rational man no question whether the cotton supply of India coull be made larger. The only qeestion is, whit means should be adopted to meke it so. And here, if I may be permitted, would offer very humbly, but very earnestly, one word as a suggestion to the members cf this association. Theelndian field is a very wile one, and to any person who takes-an interest in public affairs ; one peculitrls tempting. No doubt there are great social, and political reforms. which may b ultimstely. if not at present, possible in that country. The subject of the double government, the subject (n Ind an police and juditature, the subj , ct of the Lined revenue, the creations relating to the wars which from time to time have heen.un ertaken.--thee are all topics of the grea s importance end interest, end upon which in the proper place I should be the last person to deprcelte discussion. Bat they are very wide suhjec. s. They are comparatively vry little known in England, that is, the amount of accurate knowledge respecting them is but small ; and they are subjects so wide and so extensive that I am afraid if we, in the interest of cotton growers or cotton consumers, attempt to go into them, we shall find that we are wasting and dis-ipating upon many questions those energies which, if we want to ;ender them as effective as they ought to be, it is our busieess to concentrate upon one. (Hear and cheers.) To one of the points I have mentioned I would allude for a moment, because there is in the public mind a certain degree of misapprehension about it. We hear a great deal of the impediment which the means of collecting the land revenue offers to the cultivator in India. It is said that the revenue is levied in an arbitrary manner, and that, therefore, the cultivator can make no profite, because they are taken away from him by the government. Now, I am not going into the question but I believe that in past times there have been, and until very recently there were, great abuses in that respect. (Hear, hear.) But I have heard lately, from the highest authority, that in the cotton-growing pies of the country, in the presidencies of Bombay a , d Madras, the plan of a fixed assessment for thirty years has been adopted. a plan which is equivalent to a thirty years lease to the tenant, and which, undoubt edly, if it is bona fide carried out, gives sufficient security and sufficient profit to remunerate the cultivator. (Hear, hear). Ido not say that there is nothing which may be amended in respect to that matter. I say only that I. believe the worst abuses which had been complained of are either removed or are in process of being so. But the two Indian requirements with which we have to deal, and with which it is in our power to deal practically, are the two great wants ; the want of communication, and the want of irrigation. (Hear.) In India—and there are some here who can speak with more practice , knowledge than I possess—water is money, with a supply of irrigation almost any soil would be productive, and without it no soil would produce anything. The native prieces and sovereigns of India in times past—people upon whom and whose governments we are accus tomed to look with some contempt, as being merely barbarous—understood this practically, much Letter than we do. I shall not weary you with details upon this ques tion, but I can illustrate it by a single fact, which came under my own personal knowledge. The province of Mysore has only come within the last 20 or 25 years—l think only within the last two generations—into the hands of Great Britain. It is, therefore, a fair sample of what has been done by native governments. The area of Mysore is 36,000 square miles. The number of tanks arti ficially made for irrigation, and the greater part of them made wholly or partially by the government, is 27,000. The total area of tanks, and the surface kept artificially under water, for the purpose of irrigating, is 1,800 square miles, or one-twentieth part of the whole. Now, these facts I can vouch for. I can give you my authority for them. It was a gentleman, a very distinguished officer, who at that time was, and I believe still is. at the head of the Mysore Commission—General Cobham. I took it down at the - time, and on the soot, and about it there could be no mistake. I will give you one more instance, and then I have done. Sir Emerson Tennent, who was employed at Ceylon in an official capacity describes one of the many artificial tanks or lakes which were there constructed in times of unknown antiquity, by races not unly wh , se existence but whose memory has passed away, for the supply of water to the surrounding country. The one be examined had en eEclosure of ten miles one way, by twelve or fifteen the other. The retaining walls were seven miles long, and an engineer, who was with him, computed that the cost of putting up that wall alone would have amounted to £900,000, with all our modern appliances and means of engineering. He states that there are in the northern part' of Ceylon, iu districts now waste and desert, thirty other tanks of somewhat similar construction, and of varying siz ; some of them larger than that which he visited. These facts you will find in Sir Emerson Tennent's book upon Ceylon. These are two samples—Mysore es it is —Cey ion as it was Of what was done to supply the material wants of the country by chiefs and sovereigns, whose mode of government in every other respect we might probably, with great justice, condemn as barbarous. We hear a great deal in this country of the Ganges Canal. No doubt it is a great work in its way. No doubt it is very creditable to England to have under taken and to have carried through such a work. But put the Ganges Canal by the side of these ancient public tanks, of which I have spoken, and then compare the immense resources of the British empire with the probable resources of those who undertook those ancient works, and see on what side, if we argue justly on the matter, the balance ought to preponderate. (Hear, hear.) Now, when we speak of matters of this kind, what is the answer which we receive from the government of India? "All this is well known already; we know how desirable such works are, but where is the money to come from for their con struction ?" Now, Ido not answer these objections merely by recommending greater economy in the adminis tration, and stricter maintenance of peace with our neigh bours. (Hear, hear.) These are very good things, and I believe they should both be more attended to than they have been. (Hear, hear.) But we can not now go into discussion of those subjects without provoking a great deal of political controversy. I believe that the question of roads and the question of water supply may be detached from every other. (Hear, hear.) If they are to be dealt with effectually at all, they must be dealt with by loans. (Hear.) Now, I can quite understand that there is in this country a great aversion to the idea of increasing public debt either at home or in India ; and considering the man ner in which debts are usually contracted, and the pur poses for which they are contracted, that aversion is not unnatural. Of course, it requires no argument to show teat if a State borrows one hundred millions to lay . out in war, or to lay out in supplying deficits of civil adannistra tration, the State so borrowing and so expending, is three millions a-year poorer from that time forth for ever. (Hear, hear.) But it is quite a different thing when you come to talk of borrowing one hundred milliions, at three or four per cent, as the case may be, for the purpose of invee ing it in an undertaking, which former experience shows, is certain to pay something like 10 per c.nt. (Hear, hear.) In that case, there is no national, loss-1 here is no dimunition of the national capital. On the contrary, whatever difference there may be between the return obtained, and the interest which has to be paid, is so much clear gain to the government and to the community. (Cheers.) Now, this is a matter which we cannot afford to pass over, because it really goes to the root of the ques tion. If the Indian government is to wait to open up the communication of India, and to develope the resources of India until it can afford to do SD, out of the income of the year, the Indian government must wait for ever. (Cheers.) If we are to wait until we are rich, for the means of becoming rich, why, we must remain poor until the day of our death. (Hear, hear, and cheers.) These ought, I think, to be no confusion on the matter—There ought to be no confusion between the debts incurred for the pur poses of public works, and the debt incurred, necessarily incurred, in wars, •or for general purposes of adminis tration. (Hear, hear, and cheers) The one should be kept entirely separate from the other, because in the one case it is an investment, in the other a dead loss. (Hoer, hear, and cheers.) And, although I know that financiers enter tain a great objection to such a plan, still, I cannot help saying that in my judgment—l do not give it as worth much—loans contracted for such a purpose, it being certain that it will yield a return which will more than cover the interest, ought not to be charged Upon the community for ever, but converted into terminable annuities, and paid off at the end of a reasonable time. (Hear, hear.) Well, now one word more and I have done. I feel that I have de tained you very unwarrantably—(cries of " no, no," and "go on.") One may be asked—" If these things are so self-evident, if the benefits to be obtained are so self-evi dent—if the thing is obviously desirable to be done—what is the need of all this pressing, and why has the Indian government not undertaken it long ago ?" now, my answer is, we should not judge of the state of India by the state of England. There are very few Europeans resident in India who have any, other than an official connection with the country. (Hear, hear.) It is not worth a man's while who goes out as a young officer, or a young civilian—and bear in mind that officers and civilians even at this time form the great mass of the Anglo-European public —it is not worth the while of those whose con nection with the country is purely official, who aro limited in point of time, and who are looking forward to the prospect of a return home, to throw themselves into movements of this kind with the same zeal, the same ardour, and the same enterprise with which you, whom I address in this room, would take up a movement which immediately and directly concerned yourselves. . (Hear, hear.) It may be said that the natives ought to do so, and perhaps the time may come when the public opinion of the native community •will have greater weight than it has, But at present that community has very little voice, and very little influence in the administration; and therefore, I say, unless these questions are taken up in Englanti, w and unless they are- taken up here with reference to Eng lish interests, I am not very sanguine of their being taken up with effect at all: (Heiir, hear) Now this seems to me to be one of the most practical functions which this association can perform, to get information upon these points (Hear, hear.) Let us avoid political discussion-. _ Above all, do not let us get mixed up with Indian politics. (Hear, hear.) Lst nfikeep to those two subjects alone—the roads of India and the irrigation of India. (Rear, hear.) I had somehow passed over what I intended to say about Indian roads, lot me therefore just make this one remark. We are in d nger of being misled upon this subject by the precedent and example of England. We think that bscanse costly lines of rails, intended for very high speed, are buit Able to this country—which, bear in mind, had, befbre railways were constructed, a enapleto canal communication suitable for all purposes of heavy traffic—we are apt to think that because high speed and costly railways are suitable to England, they are equally suitable to the wants of India. Now, I believe—and when I say I believe I am only quoting the authority cf those whose opinions are much more valuable than mine—l believe that system of pro ceeding would be a great mistake. (Hear, hear.) In Colonel Cotton's book, some most valaab'e information will ba found upon the subject, and I think it would be well worth the while of the Association to s ate simply, briefly, and make public in a popular form, some of the facts and arguments contained in that book. But I would say in one word that what is wanted for India is, not so much costly and rapid lines of communication laid down in a few parts (tf the country, hid down from point to point ; but what is wanted is a comparatively inexpensive, even although it may be a comparatirely slow system of commu nication, extending over the whole face of the country. (Hear, hear.) In short, in this matter, at present what we ought to fellow so far as we can, and where differences of soil and climate do not stand in our way, is not the example of Fnglaud, but that of the United States of America. (Hear, hear.) Gentlemen, I believe I heve now gone through all I had to say, I shall not detain you longer, I can only 4,dd that I have joined this association with feelings of cordiality, and with a most earnest wish to promote the object which it has in view. (Hear, hear, and loud cheers) It in volves no political antagonism ; it does not set class 'ageinst class; it aims at no victory except the victory of English knowledge and intelligence, and energy, over apathy and ignorance and sloth. (Cheers.) We do not ask of the Stare to conquer fresh territo ies for our use. We ask the State to make use of those which it already pos sesses. We do not rejoice in—we do not desire—the political subjection and humiliation of the native population of India. What we do desire is to compensate, so far as is in our power, the people of that country for the loss which we have caused of their political freedom, by enabling theta to share in the material prosperity of the race which has conquered theirs. (Cheers.) If we say that to promote the prosperity of the people of India is also to promote our own interests, we are thus only saying in a prac tical manner what we all know to be true in each man's case, that *that which is our duty is our interest also. (Loud and enthusiastic cheers.) Colonel WILSON PATTEN, M. P., supported the resolu tion, expressing sanguine hopes of the issue of the project regarding India, and statiag the result of an effort made for the purpose of growing cotton in Tangier. Dr. GEORGE Buss; of Bombay, addressed the meeting in explanation of the capacity and resources of India for the objects in view. Mr. THOMAS S. MORT, late member of the Legislative Council of Australia, urged upon the attention of the meeting the suitability of many parts of that country not only for the growth of cotton, but also to produce silk and to rear the vine. The resolution was then put and unanimously carried. Mr. EDWARD WATKtN, M.P., proposed the second reso lution in an able speech. The resolution was as follows : —4' That this meeting hails, with satisfaction, the forma tion of the Cotton Supply Association of Manchester, and pledges itself to use its best endeavour to promote the objects of the association ; and that the petition to the House of Commons, now read, in support of the con templated measure of Mr. J. B. Smith, M.P., on the affairs of India, so far as that motion has reference to an increased supply of cotton from that country, be adopted by this meeting." The Petition was read, which set forth the views and objects of the Association with regard to the cultivation of cotton in India, and the reasons which necessitated the steps at present taken. Mr. JAMES PLATT, M.P., seconded the resolution. Sir ALEXANDER BADMAN, M.P., supported it in a few words. Mr. CHRISTOPHER BusuELL, of Liverpool, was also called on to speck to the reselution, which he advocated on the grounds of philanthrophy and humanity, as well as those of expediency, in a brief but eloquent and forcible speech, which drew down loud applause. The resolution and petition were then unanimously adopted. Mr. ASHWORTH moved a vote of thanks to the members of parliament and strangers who had attended the meeting, which was carried by acclamation. The proceedings closed with the customary vote of thanks ,0 the chairman. THE ATLANTIC SUBMARINE TELEGRAPH. —The alterations Mahe United States corvette Niagara, Captain Hudson, are nearly complete, and to-day she is to leave Portsmouth for Liverpool, to ship her portion of the great Atlantic telegraph cable. Six cabins, a portion of the steerage, and a portion of the engineers' department, the bulkheads of which have been taken down, have been thrown into the area reqiiired. There is a circle in the wardroom, occupy ing two-thirds of it at least, which has been enclosed and planked almost to the beams. There is a flooring also on the deck, and this will be covered with sheet lead, and be laid with about 500 miles of cable. The stanchions under the beams are secured by iron trusses; „the fore-hold is also undergoing the like alteration, and one of the coal bunkers in the fore-hold has been knocked away to give additional room, temporary bunkers having been , made — one on each side on the main deck. A guard is being made to cover the propeller and protect it from fouling or being fouled by the cable. Captain Hudson and Lieutenant C. H. Wells were entertained by Rear-Admiral Superin tendent Martin at dinner, in Portsmouth dockyard on Tuesday evening. THE LORD LIEUTENANT ON TOLERATION.-011 Tuesday, the Lord Lieutenant, the Earl of Carlisle, was present at an examination of the pupils in attendance upon the Marlborough-street Schools of the National Board in Dublin. When the business had concluded, he addressed a few words to the teachers, having first congrtu lated them upon the satisfactory results which ha l been exhibited during the examination There is one practcal suggestion which I would ask your leave to make to you before you all disperse on your several paths; and it is this—l am happy to Fee amongst you who now sit before me, as well as amongst thoss who are gathered behind me, members of different religious persuasion!. Now, I trust I should be the very last person to call upon you to undervalue the importance of yaw different religious convictions; but I think you will yourselves have been able to ascertain during your sojourn here how much rood and worth there may be amongst the members of different persuasions--(applause)--and you will have derived no better lesson here than if in your future lives, you inculcate those results of your own peppy experience upon those who will be placed under your charge. Inculcate upon them the love of learning, for that is your special mission as schoolmasters ; inculcate upon them the love of God, for that is your foremost duty as Christian men ; and as a branch, a main branah of the love and the measure of your own experience here, inculcate upon them the love. of one another, and may the blessing of the Almighty L always with you;' WHAT WALICER MUM Dee—He must get leave front the Adminlitiation to snake private war upon Costa Plea and Nicaragua, for the recovery of his boats and the re opening of the Transit line by fillibusters at the point of the bayonet. That the present .Aeinainieraion will feel disposed to engage in war with Central America, for the restoration of the Transit Line and the steamers to Messrs. Ceirrison and Morgan and Walker, there is no reason to be lieve,more especially as Costa Rica and Nicaragua are making arrangements to re-open the Transit with Amerieen capital and under the immediate protection of our own government. Costa Rica and Nicaraguastand ready, and will soon offer to make a special treaty with the Government of the United States for the protection of the Tran , it,.and will guarantee all well-established rights and charters made to citizens of the United States ; but this treaty must rest upon an equitable basis, and will provide equally 19r the rights of all the three nations upon the basis of non-intervention and suppression of piracy in every form. Great Britain would undoubtedly favour such a treaty, and would willingly become a party to it ; but the national jealousy of our people will snake it prudent for her to remain as much as possible in the background, and claim only for her own subjects the same rights that are ac corded to citizens of the Unittal States. Efforts will be made by the leaders of fillibusterism to persuade the administration that a large and influential party in Nicaragua desire their return, and wish to have the government of Walker re-established. That a disaffected faction does exist in Nicaragua there is not the least doubt. This party is composed of persons who latterly united their fortunes with those. of Walker, and are con sequently regarded as toties and traitors by their own countrymen. They are generally persons who have a large admixture of negro blood, some of them West Indians and other foreigners, who settled and acquired property in Central America.—New York Times. • THE NORTHERN TIMES.-:-LIVERPOOL, SATUR JUNE 20, 1857. PUBLIC MEETING IN MANCHESTER The Speaker then asked whether Peter Johnson and John Lord had been ordered to attend, to answer charges in reference to the Rochdale election. The Sergeant announced that John Lord was in atten dance, but Peter Johnson was not, though the order had been served upon him. A warrant was ordered to issue to take Peter Johnson into custody. John Lord was then called, and in answer to the charge said, he had never attempted to induce Rothwell to leave the country, but he had heard Johnson offer £5O towards his outfit if he would go to New Orleans. The accused having withdrawn,! The Attorney-General suggested 'that the case should be referred to a select committee. The suggestion was adopted; and after some discussion upon the matter, a conversation took place as to whether the accused should be liberated, under an order to attend before the committee. Mr. Butt moved that Lord should be recalled and ex amined, to show whether there was a case to justify his retention in custody. The motion was opposed by the Attorney-General. On a division there appeared, For the motion 42 - Against it Majority - 55 The following committee was then nominated :—The Attorney General, Lord John Russell, Mr. Henley, the Attorney-General for Ireland, Mr. Horsman, Mr• S. Egerton, Sir H. Willoughby, Mr. Roebuck, Mr• Macauley, and Serjeant O'Brien. An order was then issued for the attendance of Lord and Rothwell- In a committee of ways and means a vote of £8,000,000, ont of the Consolidated Fund, was agreed to. The house adjourned at two o'clock. (FROM OUR OWN REPORTER.) A meeting of the Association for the Supply of Cotton and the public generally, was held in the Town Hall of Manchester yesterday, for the purpose of taking into con sideration the present inadequate condition of the supply, and the best means to be taken for its remedy. The proceedings opened at eleven o'clock, by which time a large meeting had assembled in the large room of the Town Hall.' The chair was taken by the Mayor of Manchester, James Watts, Esq., of Abney-hall. Among those on the platform were the Right Hon. Lord Stanley, M.P., Colonel Wilson Patten, M.P., Mr. J. A. Turner. M.P.. Sir Alexander Ramsey, M.P., Mr. Platt, M.P., Mr. Watkins, M. P., Mr. Oliver Heywood., Mr. Christopher Bushell, Liverpool ; Dr. George Buiet, of Bombay; Mr. Thomas S. Mort, Mr. Corbally, Liverpool ; Mr. Clegg, Manchester ; Mr. Eiward Ashworth, Boltor, ; Mr? Entwistle, and a large number of gentlemen representing commercial and manu facturing interests in Manchester, Salford, Bolton, Roch dale, and other towns and portions of the surrounding districts_ The CHAIRMAN : Gentlemen, most of you who'are here are 'aware of the object we have in view in holding this meet ing. It is to endeavour to increase the growth of that most valuable article which we require in this country—cotton —(hear, hear)—and, if possible, to obtain it from all parts wherever it can be got, in any country. Allow me to say, that I hope the merchants of this city, who are not imme diately interested in the manufacture of cotton, will assist the association by their contributions, and by their annual subscriptions. (Hear, hear.) I shall at once, without de taining you for a single moment, call upon the mover of the first resolution, Mr. J. Aspinall Turner, to come for ward. (Load cheers.) Mr. J. Aserearz Tuaregs, M.P. for Manchester, then came forward to propose the first resolution, ..and was received with loud cheers. He said: Mr. Mayor, and gentlemen, it is a very short time ago since I received the resolution, and I was not at all aware that I should be called upon to address this meeting at so early a period. I do_ not think it quite right that I should be called upon to do so, because, although I am one of the members for Manchester, and, perhaps, on that account the compliment has been paid to me, yet I have come here rather to hear than to sae-,k, because I wished and expfc:ed that this meeting would have been more a spinner's meeting—a demonstration on their part to excite members of parliament and others to aid them in carrying out the object which to them is all-important. (Hear, hear.) As chairman of the Commercial Association of this city, this is no new subject to me, for I have been almost tedious in adverting to the subject for the last twelve years. But I must say that the subject has been treated with very great apathy and indifference on the part of the trade. (Hear, hear.) Now the wolf which I said was approaching, is actually at your doors, and now you are rousing yourselves, and I hope vigorously, to drive it away. To say that this large district is reduced to the necessity of assembling and associating its members together, and form ing a body like the Cotton Supply Association; argues some neglect in years gone by, fur we have arrived at a period when famine is among us. I believe that most of the mills in this district are now working, as a matter of fact, at a positive lose. (Hear, hear.) I believe that many of them have ceased to work for many hours in the week, and that the work-people in consequence must be suffering very serious distress ; and unless we can supply the deficiencies and can bring about a better supply of the raw material which we all require, the evil will be aggravated and the prosperity of this district in my opinion, must very rapidly decline. (Hear, hear). Gentlemen, are your mills worth all the money for which they stand in your books at present, working at a positive loss ? When you come to take stock, dare you value them at the amount of their cost ? Do you not consider that it will be necessary to take off very soon a serious diminution of their value ? (Hear, hear.) I think you will find it so, and I think the poor-rates will increase, and I think that, last of all, Sir George Grey will be rather disturbed in his mind with regard to the peace of this dis trict. Now these are very serious considerations and we ought all to take them into our anxious consideration. The resolution which has been put into my hands is to the following effect :—" That, in the opinion of this meeting, the supply of cotton to this country is inadequate to the requirements of the manufacturing industry, and, being almost entirely derived from one source, is uncertain of quantity and unduly fluctuating in price ; that this meeting believes that the colonial and other dependencies of Great Britain afford ample resources for the cultivation and development of the cotton plant, and that it is the duty as well as the interest of the British nation to aid the promo tion of the efforts by means of which its growth may be extended, not only in the British dominions, but in all accessible countries." Now, this resolution says that we have only one source of supply. That is, perhaps, going a little too far, but certainly the great bulk of our supply, and our most useful cotton, comes from the United States of America. To show that it is an uncertain and fluctuat ing supply, I have only to refer to some tables in my hands—but I shall not weary you with statistics— which go to show that whereas in 1847 we had, when our import was only 1,234,000 bales, our stock at the end of the year was 451,000 bales, or twenty weeks' consumption. Now at the end of 1856, although we imported double the quantity we did in 1847, or 2,467,000 bales, we ended the year with a stock of only 332,000 bales, or only eight weeks' consumption. (Hear.) Is that a satisfactory state of things, gentlemen, with new mills springing up around us, in the expectation which once existed that there would be continued and regular employment for them, and yet you had not, at the end of 1856, more than a supply for eight weeks' consumption of cotton ? What was the crop of the year 1856? The crop in the United States of America, on 'which we prin cipally depend, was three and a-half millions. At the last annual meeting of the Commercial Association, I ventured to predict that we should have a deficiency of supply from the United States of America of half a million bales in the crop of cotton. Now, what is the fast It is the fact that up to the present time, not arrived yet at the end of June, whereas the cotton year is yet three months off its conclusion, there is a deficiency to the amount of 25,000 bags more than what I have stated, being about 525,000 bags deficiency in the crop up to the present period, therefore, that part of my prediction has been amply realised. (Hear, hear.) Now if, at the end of the year 1856, having a crop of 3,4 millions, you had only eight weeks' consumption in stock, how will you end the year 1857, when the crop is diminished by half a million of bales? (Hear, hear.) Certainly yon can only keep a stock of cotton in this country by diminishing the hours of labour. What does that mean? Just exactly the state of things at whieh many of you have already arrived—no return for your capital, and no adequate and profitable employment for your workpeople. (Hear, hear.) Now, how are we to remedy this state of things—for it is high time to set about a remedy ? You have associated your selves together as a Cotton Supply Association, not to grow cotton, for it has been suggested to us often that it is our dnty to do so, and it has been asked, why do not the Manchester spinners take the matter into their own hands, and go and grow cotton? People might as well ask, why do not the buyers of tea, if there is a deffieient supply, scud out persons to grow tea in China —or if there is a deficiency in the supply of sugar, why do not the consumers send out capital to the plantations to grow more sugar ; or why do not , the consumers of wool keep sheep in Australia. But that, I think, would not be the legitimate way of proceeding. It is a legitimate way of proceeding for you to come together and furnish some funds—not very large, but some funds very small compa ratively with your present losses—to associate your selves together, to put the money into the hands of an active committee—and that active committees can be formed in Manchester, I think has been tolerably well proved in years gone by—let them endeavour by every means in their power to disseminate information with regard to the in creased price of growing cotton, to remove the :obstacles which stand In the way of an adequate supply, and to point out what are the obstacles in various parts of the world, and in some particularly, which will be hereafter attended to, regarding the growth of cotton, and to do what they can in every legitimate way to assist in furthering our great object. (Hear, hear.) You can do much by competition, but by desultory and individual efforts yon can do nothing. Among the countries to which we have to look is Africa. In the north of Africa the French are doing a great deal. In Algeria, I know that great efforts are being made by the. French, and the French Government are doing just the thing which I think it is their du`y to do, developing the resources of the country of which they have taken possession. (Hear hear.) On the west coast of Africa, my friend Mr. Clegg will tell you something of what has been done, and I believe he will tell you a somewhat more satisfactory story than I can I have tried that part of the world. Perhaps he may tell me that I have not tried it the right way ; but I have made an experiment there, and knowing the negro character myself, I have little faith in their working steadily in the occupation of cotton growing. In the south, although Natal is admirably adapted for the growth of cotton as to climate, there will be for a long time a great deficiency of labour. I have no very great faith in Natal as a cotton growing country, although it may supply a little, lu Australia, something may be done, but I think it only holds out a very distant pros pect of relieving us of our wants. We must look for something more near, or else while the grass is growing the horse will be starving. (Hear, hear.) The West Indies have been mentibv.ed ; I have more expectation of something being duns there than I have a the other