The Sun. — London, England, 1840-02-07 00:00:00

EVENING EDITION. had been several times before the House, and he bad never seen a larger attendance on such ecei lions than the present. He should therefore recom mend his Hon. Friend to take his chance of a divi sion to-night, when, if he found himself in a minority, he could postpone his motion. Sir P. TRENCH said it was his intention to divide the House. He admired the talents of Mr. Gurney, but be agreed with the Chancellor of the Trxchequer, that the House ought not to be made the arena of ex periments, by which the Members were put to incon venience. Mr. BENNETT said he was a very old Member of the House, and was agreeably surprised, on first seeing the new light, to find that though a little gloomy at first, on taking a paper of small print from h►s pocket, he found he had not been able to read for many years parts so well as on that occasion. He was perfectly satisfied that this light was the best the House bad yet experienced. He should, therefore, vote at all events for a longer trial. Mr. BRISCOE said he was not so old a Member, nor was his sight so defective, though not so good as it had been. He felt it difficult to decide upon the subject, but was, on the whole, inclined to think he gave the preference to the present. With respect to the mist, he thought it did not arise from the light, but from the dust which arose from the numerous holes in the floor for the purpose of ventilation. There were Gentlemen engaged in the gal.ery above to whom the light and its effects were of the utmost con sequence, and he had taken it upon himself to ask them their opinion respecting the present lights, and they were unanimous in its favour.—( Hear, hear.) He certainly would vote for the Bude light. Col. SALWEY considered that they were greatly indebted to the Hon. and Gallant Member for his re peated attempts to enlighten the House. He thought " 'Twas sweet to view, from half-past five to six, Their long wax candles with short cotton wicks, Touch'd by the lamplighter's Promethean art, Start into light, and make the lighter start." Having seen it in that light, he should certainly sup port the Hon. Member's wax-candle motion. Strangers were then ordered to withdraw. The House divided, when there appeared— _ .. For the motion 69 Against it 5O Majority —l9 On re-entering the House we found Mr. BARNEBY moving for leave to bring in a Bill to remove from Counties the expense and liability of repairing the highways over bridges, and the three hundred feet next adjoining to any ends of the same. Lord GRENVILLE SOMERSET said, if the present measure was introduced, it would throw the expense of these repairs upon parishes or private indi viduals. Unless the Hon. Member explained how the expenses were to be defrayed, he should feel it his duty to oppose the introduction of the Bill. Mr. WARBURTON also objected to the Bill. If the parties who repaired the road and repaired the bridge Were different, complaints would be made that the repairs of the one had injured the other, and actions wouldrbe brought by the district surveyor against the parishes, or private individuals, upon whom the re pairs 'of the road would tall, on the ground of their having injured the bridge. The common sense of the matter was, that the--repairs of both should be vested in the same individual. Mr. BAINES thought it would be an injustice to the trusts if any additional burdens were thrown upon them, and therefore he should oppose the Bill. Sir C. BURRELL said a few words in opposition to the Bill. Mr. JONES could assure the House that most of the turnpike trusts in the country were in A State of bank► - uptcy, and it would be most unfair to throw any additional burdens upon them. Mr. BARNEBY replied. He believed, that under the present system, great frauds were practised upon the public. The expenses would not be greater upon the parishes than they were at present. He trusted, therefore, the House would allow him to bring in his Bill. The House then divided, and the numbers were— Against the introduction of the Bill, 52 In favour l7 Majority 35 TURNPIKE TRUSTS. Mr. FOX MAULE rose to propose resolutions of some importance to a very considerable interest in the country. Since he had put the notice of his motion upon the books, it occurred to him that he might bene ficially change the terms of the resolutions which he had to propose, by striking out of the second resoluti3n the reference made to previous Acts. The resolutions, as he wished the House to pass them, were—" That nothing herein contained shall be deemed or construed to exempt the turnpike-road by this Act authorised to be made, from the provisions of any general Act relating to the consolidation or other improved arrangement of turnpike-roads, which may pass during the present or any future Session of Parliament. And be it also enacted, That the tolls levied or to be levied under the authority of this Act, and the money to be subscribed or borrowed on the credit thereof, shall be applied, Ist, in the payment of costs and expenses relating to pro curing and passing this Act ; 2dly, in defraying the ex pense of erecting turnpike and toll-houses, and repair ing, widening, altering, and amending the said road, and defraying all other necessary costs, charges, and expenses attending the same; idly, in paying the interest of the monies borrowed, or to be borrowed ; and, lastly, in paying off. the principal monies borrowed or to be borrowed under the authority of this Act." Sir C. BURRELL said a great deal of capital bad been embarked in these turnpike trusts, and it would not be quite fair to depive them of the advantages upon which they had calculated when they had so em barked their money. He hoped the House would con sider the lamentable state in which many of these turn pike trusts were, before they proceeded to legislate upon the subject. He would recommend the withdrawal of the second resolution for the present, and bring it forward at some future period in an amended form. After an observation from Mr. GOULBURN, Mr. FOX MAULE consented to withdraw the re solution. The other resolution was then agreed to. Mr. WALLACE moved for a return in columns (in continuation of that of last Session) of the number of causes instituted in the Court of Session of Scotland, between the first day of November 1839 and the 12th day of March 1840 ; showing the number thereof en rolled before each of the Lords Ordinary, the number finally decided, and those still in dependence.—Ordered. Mr. -R. STEU ART brought up the Repot of the Committee on Ways and Means. The House adjourned at Seven Minutes past Ten o'Clock. HOUSE OF LORDS, Fail. 6. The LORD CIIANCELLOR took his seat on the Wool k at Five o'Clock, when sac ANSWER TO THE ADDRESS. The LORD STEWARD (the Earl of Errol) appeared at the table, and said—l have had the honour of laying the Address, agreed to by your Lordships, before her Majesty, and I am charged with her Majesty's most gracious answer, which I will now proceed to read. " I will give directions that a full inquiry be made into the important matters on which you have addressed me, and you may rely on my determination to discourage all doctrines that are dangerous to the morality and religion of this country." Upon the motion of the Duke of WELLINGTON, her Majesty's moat gracious answer was ordered to be entered on the Journals of the House. The Duke of RICHMOND presented petitions from the Ministers, Elders, and Inhabitants in the counties of Kinross, Aberdeen, and Banff, against the cytem prevailing of intruding ministers on parishes against the wishes of a majority of the inhabi tants ; also one from the Magistrates and Town Coun cil of the Royal burgh of Banff against the above prin ciple, and complaining that the Commission of the General Assembly had suspended seven ministers merely for obeying the law. The Duke of WELLINGTON presented several petitions from the County of Southampton, praying the House to take measures for putting down the abomi nable doctrines of Socialism. The Duke of SUTHERLAND presented several petitions in favour of the Corn-laws. The Earl of RIPON presented a petition from an individual named Smith, who stated that he felt very much interested in the spiritual welfare and condition of that part of our population engaged in maritime affairs, and he begged to state that a great portion of this class was in a state that was much to be lamented, and he prayed for inquiry. The Bishop of SALISBURY presented several petitions against Socialism, and praying that steps might be taken to put down an institution lately founded by that Society in the county of Hants. He had received some information on the subject, with which he would lot then trouble the House, but be would have much pleasure in putting it into the hands of the Government The Marquis of NORMAN BY laid on the table a report from the Tithe Commissioners of England and Wales, and a report from the Commissioners of Stamps in Ireland. PRINCE ALBERT'S ANNUITY. On the motion of Lard MELBOURNE, the Stand ing Orders were suspended. and Prince Albert'i An nuity Bill was read a second time, committed, read a third time, and passed. TRINITY COLLEGE, DUBLIN. Lord FITZGERALD asked a question of Lord Normanby relative to the celibacy of the Fellows of Trinity College, Dublin, but the question was put, and the answer of Lord Normanby returned, in so low a tone of voice that we were unable to make out the effect of either. ',— Lord KENYON wished to know if the Fellows of the College had taken an oath with regard to celibacy, and if they had afterwards been dispensed from it Lord NORMANBY said that there certainly could have been no oath taken in the case, as it would have been impossible to evade the f orce o f it. There was merely a statute which might be suspended. DIVISIONS IN THE SCOTTISH CHURCH. The Earl of ABERDEEN preserittA petitions from various places in Scotland praying that no Ministers should be intruded on the parishes of that country con trary to the wishes of the people. The Noble Lord pro ceeded to say that their Lordships were, perhaps, in some degree aware of the state of agitation and excitement which existed in Scotland on the subject of those peti tions. Ho said in some degree, for he believed that such of their Lordships as had not personal knowledge and information on the matter would find it difficult to form any conception of the nature and extent of the feeling which prevailed in that country in consequence of the proceedings of the Church Courts and the Civil Tribunals there. The Noble Viscount opposite might however, be aware of it ; and he was sure that the Noble Viscount would agree with him in lamenting the distracted state of the public in Scotland, and the inevi table consequences to the good order and peace of the country which would ensue from the continuance of such a state of things. That was not the time to enter into any inquiry into the nature and the causes of those dissensions which so unhappily prevailed. Nevertheless he would now state his conviction that the principle of what is called non-intrusion had always existed in the Church of Scotland, for it had been recognised and effect had been given to it more or less at different times. He should say that their Lordships ought to have re course to some legislative measure having for its object to restore the peace of the Scottish Church, and to heal and compose those dissensions which now distract that country from one end to the other. In saying that, however, he wished that the Lord Chan cellor should understand that he did not presume to question the decision pronounced on the subject last Session by his Lordship, and which had been made public by a Nobleand Learned Lord then absent from the House. He not only entirely acquiesced in that decision, but he was convinced that it was perfectly just and well founded. He thought it was a decision favourable to the Church of Scotland, and to the moral character of the people of that country, both of whom would have been likely to have been injured by a continuance of that law which the General Assembly had attempted to establish, but which their Lordships had pronounced to be illegal.—( Hear, hear.) He should conclude by asking the Noble Tiscount opposite whether it was the intention of her Majesty's Ministers to introduce any measure, having for its object the re moval of the difficulties which now surround the subject ; and if so, at what time he wished to bring it forward. Lord MELBOURNE said he was aware of th 3 im portance of the subject to which the Noble Earl had called the attention of their Lordships, and of the consequences which might follow from those proceedings. The matter was under the consideration of Government, and as her Majesty's Ministers had not made up their minds on the subject, it would be highly inexpedient for him to enter into any explanation at that moment. The Earl of ABERDEEN supposed that there was some measure under the consideration of the Govern ment, and he hoped that when that measure was in troduced it would be adopted by the Cabinet, and would not be made one of those open questions, by which the character of the Government was rendered equivocal. The Earl of H ADDINGTON hoped that no mea sure of the Government would confer upon the people an arbitrary and irresponsible power of rejecting and adopting Ministers according to their caprice. CHINA. Lord ELLENBOROUGH inquired whether the Noble Viscount opposite (Lord Melbourne) intended to give the House any information respecting the pre sent relation's of this country with China ? Lord MELBOURNE said that preparations were making to lay before the House the fullest information, —(Hear.) STATE OF THE NAVY. Lord COLCHESTER rose to bring the attention of the House to a subject upon which he had occupied them in the course of the last Session.—(Hear, hear.) He had then endeavoured to bring the attention of the House and the country to the undefended state of our own shores, and he now intended to move for the return of papers which would show that little change had since taken place. He might lay himself open to the imputation which had fallen upon others, that he made his motion from party motives, or that, for the sake of attacking Ministers, he was exhibiting a weakness that did not exist, or one which, if it existed, he ought not to expose to foreign powers. To the first objection, which was only per sonal, it would not become him, or the subject which he had undertaken, to make any reply. To the second he could only answer, that foreign powers were already too well aware of that weakness which we took too much care to conceal from ourselves.—(Hear, hear, hear.) The first return for which he would move was. a re turn of the number of seamen and marines voted for in the Session of 1839. He knew that 35,000 was as great number of men as had been voted since the peace, but that was no suffi cient answer, for the number of men required for our marine depended upon the nature of our relations with foreign powers, and their state of preparation. The second return he would move for would be the distribu tion of those seamen among the different stations abroad ; and the third return would be a return of our forces upon the home station, showing the number of officers, seamen, and marines at home, describing the number actually afloat, and those on shore, on the Ist of. December. That appeared to him to be a question of the very greatest importance. Our home force consisted at present of only three guard ships of 120 guns, but they were manned by only one-third of their full complement of officers, seamen, and marines ; and, therefore, were not able to render any efficient service against an enemy who might penetrate to our shores. There was one frigate of 36 guns, and some smaller vessels as schooners and cutters, and that was the whole force upon Which 'the safety of our shores depended, unless it were those ships which were being put into commission for the purpose of going to a fo reign station, or those who had come home to be paid off, having completed their period of service. In judging of what would be a sufficient force for this nation, it was necessary to look at what force other nations were able to send out. Russia and France were the two great nations with which we had to compare ourselves. Rus sia had last year had in commission in the Baltic 28 line-of-battle ships, 18 frigates, and in the Black S ea 13 line-of-battle ships, wit a proportionate number of smaller vessels at both places. In the present year that force had been much increased, as he had been in formed from authority upon which he could rely, and that power had now no less than 30 ships of the line in the Baltic. When this subject was mentioned tioned last year, it was stated that these ships were old, and defective, and that their crews only went on board for practice for a few weeks in the summer. He was mistaken if the Noble Earl opposite was not convinced that the case was quite otherwise ; he be. lieved that officers enjoying the confidence of the Go vernment had seen these ships, and reported that that they were not pasteboard ships, but were new ships and well manned, and altogether completed in an excellent manner. Russia then had no less than 40 ships of the line—nearly 30 frigates, while our home force con sisted of three one-third manned guard ships. Then with respect to France, it appeared from the official budget laid before the King of the French, that there had been voted folthe service of the year 1840, 34,000 men, being within 1,000 of the number of seamen voted for the service of this country, although we had colo nies scattered throughout the world, and had a most extensive commerce to protect, while the colonies of France were few, and near the mother country. Twenty-three thousand of the men voted were divided among eight sail of the line, two ships answering to our guard ships. 20 frigates, and 20 steamers ; and by the same returns it appeared they had a reserve of nearly ten thousand men, consisting of seamen, marines, and marine artillery.--( Hear, hear.) The ships of France were of a more powerful descrip tion than those of England. Of the 40 sail of the line of France, one half was kept ready for the peace service, while the other half were placed on slips, so that they would be ready at a minutes' notice, for the French ships were not laid up in ordinary. England would not. bear a comparison with France in defence of her shores or in finding reinforcements to send to distant shores in cases of emergency. The Noble Earl last year stated that he preferred seeing ships in the Mediterranean, or at Lisbon, to lying idle in the ports of England, and that ships at Lisbon were equally ready for service as those in England. With respect to that he begged to draw their Lordships' attention to a circumstance that happened two years ago. It would be in the recollec tion of Noble Lords that in the month of Pecember, 1837, news arrived of the insurrection in Canada, and it was of importance that ships should be sent out im mediately. Unless he was misinformed there was only one disposable ship in the English ports at that time, viz., the Inconstant. In order to send out troops it was necessary to call ships from different places. A ship was called from the coast of Spain—she came home and embarked troops in a fortnight. The Her- cules was called from Lisbon, but was not ready to send out till the 23d Feb. Had she been in England, and a disposable ship, she would have sailed in January, and he considered there had consequently bten' a tosi of six weeks. He therefore could not., think that ships lying at Lisbon could be considered so available as if they were in England. Having this insufficient number of ships at home, he wished to call the attention of their Lordships to the great increase which had taken place in the navies of foreign countries. The Russians kept up a navy manned with disciplined seamen all the year round. Franco had all her seamen registered, and therefore she was ready at any time to man her fleet with secrecy and with dispatch, and she had been in creasing her navy for years past. It did not there, as it did in this country, take six weeks or two months to man a ship. In one instance a s hip h a d b een put in co mmission the 9th of May, an d after going round to almost all the principal ports in the United Kingdom she had been unable to complete her compli ment of men until December. And this did not ap ply to seamen only, but there was a great difficulty in finding officers. On account of the slowness of promo tion officers were unwilling to serve. There was a Commission now sitting to inquire into this subject, anal therefore he would now only allude to one very deserving class of officers—he meant masters' mates. These were gentlemen, who. having served their time as midshipmen, had passed for lieutenants, but had not been appointed. These gentlemen had no esta blished rank, and no comparative rank with the army, and were not entitled either to pensions or half-pay. This was not a very agreeable situation for young men, and accordingly they found that many of them had left the service. Many of them, young men, had been up wards of twelve years in the service. From a return laid on the table of the House of Commons, last year, he found that there were 210 mates who had passed their examination eight years, and consequently must have been eleven years in the service. Of this number seven had bean in the service eighteen years ; fifteen for seventeen years, and twenty-five for fourteen years. He hoped that this valuable class of officers would receive the most favourable consideration of the Noble Earl. He wished also to draw theirLordships' attention to the propriety of continuing pensions, granted to men for length of service, to them while they were employed ; at present they were not entitled to them when they were employed, and the consequence was they left the service and went into the merchant service, or even into foreign service ; and thus their example was lost to the service, and great difficulty would be found in getting them back again, if their services should be required. There was another regulation which was not now continued in force. Whenever a ship had been paid off, her officers were passed to flag-ships, and there her most valuable class of men were retained in the service. So much for the manning of ships. Another evil arose from the smallness of the squadron on the home station. Of late years the squadron had been assembled for general use. This was a point of the highest importance ; for how ever well manned and trained individual ships might be, if they were not accustomed to exercise together, they were not able to perform their evolutions in the manner necessary in engagements. He believed since 1831 there had not been a squadron assembled, and conse quently the greater part of young officers had hardly ever seen a ship perform her evolutions. It had also been stated, that though there were no ships on the home station, still, now steam had be come so great a moving power upon the sea, it would be very easy to procure sufficient of them for the defence of the coast, from the great number there were of merchant steam vessels. But though it were true there were a great number of these, it would be found they were not of a description for warlike purposes, though some no doubt might be so used. From a valuable report on steam-boat accidents, he begged leave to read two opinions on the capability of steam vessels. Speaking of the quality of the present steamers, Messrs. Curling and Young observed, " In some vessels materials of a very inferior description and perishable quality were employed, in others the connection between the parts were defective, the fasten ing were inefficient, and the workmanship bad." Again, they observe that, " Shipowners only look to the splendour of the saloon, while the safety of the passengers was lost sight of ;" therefore vessels such as this, which would hardly bear the weight of their own engines,would be quite unable to bear the weight of heavy guns. He should move for a return of the number of ships launched and laid down since the year 1835. If he was not mistaken, those returns would show that the naval force upon our shores was altogether insufficient for their protection, and that there were by no means adequate provisions to maintain the naval interests of the country in foreign quarters. If any war broke out our marine was in such a neglected state, that not only would we lose our sovereignty on the seas, but we would become amongst the weakest of naval powers.— (Hear, hear.) Lo'rd MINTO said, that a great part of what had fallen from the Noble Lord might have better been re served until the papers were returned. He entirely acquitted the Noble Lord from any factious mo tives in the anxiety which he had very natu rally shown as to the condition of the navy. At the same time he could not help observing, that during the whole period that the navy had been reduced to the lowest ebb—when the pressure of economy weighed so strongly upon the Government as to induce them to withhold those supplies upon which the existence of the navy depended—(Cheers)—when those extremely po pular reforms were made by which' the efficiency of our marine was unquestionably impaired—not one word was heard from the Noble Lord, or from other Noble Lords—(Cheers) —in reprobation of that unwise sys tem.—(Cheers.) It was only since a new system had been adopted—it was only since the Government had adopted measures for rendering the navy more efficient —it was only since double the number of ships had been laid down that had ever been upon the stocks since the peace —it was only since those changes bad taken place that Noble Lords came down to the House with complaints as to the neglected state of the Navy. The Noble Lord had gone into many observations and details, into which he did not find it necessary to follow him. The Noble Lord had sketched out a discussion en the entire state of the navy, for which he (the Earl of Minto) had not been prepared, even though it were advisable to detain their Lordships long upon the sub ject. There were, however, one or two points in the speech of the Noble Earl, on which it was necessary for him to say a few words. The main ground of com plaint with regard to the present condition of our navy, and the only one which appeared to be of much weight, was that our fleet was not at present sufficiently strong. Now, he should say that the question was not whether we had more or less ships now than at other times, but whether we had enough for the exigencies of the coun try.—(Hear, hear.) He should say that we had enough. It was true that we had not a fleet sufficiently numerous or strong to cope with the whole fleet of Russia, if that fleet were put in condition against us— we had not a fleet to meet twenty-seven or twenty-eight sail of the line in the Baltic, and about a dozen in the Black Sea. But he never met 'a Noble Lord who would say that, in a time of profound peace, —at a time when there was not only no probability that we should be exposed to an attack from Russia, but when there was a moral certainty that we were in no such danger—he never met a Noble Lord who at such a time could say that our fleet should be pre pared for imaginary perils. It was said that the French fleet was now very large—he would not deny that the French were preparing, and had actually a very considerable naval force. Was there anything, how ever, that would justify us, at a time when we were acting in harmony and concert with the French Go vernment, to say that we were exposed to any danger either from that power or from Russia, because we had not a large fleet of line-of-battle ships lying at the Downs or at Spithead ? If they were to be obliged to be prepared for those supposed dangers, no national re sources could maintain the extensive establishment which would be required ; and if we were to have, in time of peace, as large a naval force as in time of war, _ _ it would be better to commence hostilities with other powers at once, and have a chance of destroying their force. We had now three ships of the line in foreign parts. Circumstances had rendered it necessary of late to send out a considerable force to the Mediterranean. Our naval force there had been in creased from eight to ten, and afterwards from ten to twelve, sail of the line. That left a large disposable force in our ports, which would be ready for any em ployment which might be found necessary. There were now, he thought, four sail of the line at home, and two on their return from the Mediterranean, where there were, nevertheless, twelve still remaining. He should observe, however, that the number of ships varied from month to month, and from week to week. At some periods there might be only three or four ships in the home ports, while others were employed in going out to the Mediterranean to relieve those already there. He should again repeat, that there was nothing in the state of the country at home, nothing in our prospects or relations with other countries, that could render it desirable that we should have a larger home force than we were at present maintaining. It might be said, that if we had a large force at home, England might more easily send a large force to the colonies. He would ask,however, if any demand had been made on them which they were not ready to answer ? Satisfaction and surprise had already been expressed at their readi ness in sending out vessels, and, in the course of a few months six line of battle ships were to be seen on the coast of America. The English Government had at this moment 22 sail of the line in commission. It had twelve in the Mediterranean, it had four in other quarters ; and there were therefore six sail ready for any service that might be thought necessary. He should say in addition, that if any circumstances did arise which might render the equipment of a larger force necessary, he would not shrink from coming down to Parliament and asking for larger means. As far as the condition of the ships was concerned, there was no thing to be desired. We could at this moment have forty sail of the line ready at a very short notice. A comparison had been unjustly made as to the weakness , of ear ships compared to those of France and other countries. As .regarded a portion of our fleet, that was perfectly true. Ours was an old fleet, and our vessels could 'not all . bie in the same condition as those of other powers. The English Go vernment had not many large ships, but the ships they had employed were those which they thought fit for the service in which they were engaged. Ministers were told to look at the large vessels of France, and to see our inferiority to them. It was true that the vessels we had in the Mediterranean were not large ones; but they were sufficient for the particular purpose for which they were destined ; they had been sent out for the purpose of co-operating with the fleet of France, and if it had been necessary they could have sent out instead of them three-deckers, with a full complement of men. The Noble Lord spoke of the delay which had occurred in sending out ships to China , and said th ere t h e Go vernment had been obliged to send to A mer i ca f or a frigate, to send to tbeAndromedallotheyhad no t b een obliged America—furthermore, the Andro meda was not going to China—he had no hesitation at all in saying that they had plenty of disposable ships, and had it been at all necessary to send them sooner it would have been done. Then, with regard to manning the ships, he believed it would be found that the complement of men now serving was mush TH SUN, LONDON, FRIDAY, FEBRUARY 7, 1840. larger than any peace complement heretofore—nay, he would say, that in many cases the complement was much larger than the complement of any ship in which the Noble Lord had served since he held a Commission in the Navy. Io some instances they were very near, in some instances they were actually larger, than the , complement in the same rating during the last war: Then, with respect to the position of the working and petty officers, it would not become him to say a word on the subject, as a Committee presided over by the Noble Duke opposite were yet sitting to report upon the case of that class of officers. He would merely make one remark, and that was, that the case of those officers had been rendered much more comfortable un der the present system of naval management than it had been at any former period. Then it was com plained that they bad no squadrons for manoeuvring ; but it was to be remembered that they always had fleets in the Mediterranean, where they were constantly ma nosuvering, which had been already of essential benefit, and had saved the country very large expense. He could assure the House that whenever he conceived it to be necessary for the defence of the country, or for maintaining the navy in commission upon a proper footing, for maintaining the efficiency of the ships already existing, or for replacing decayed ships with new and larger and better ships, and, above all, to increase the efficiency of the navy by makinc , a large increase to the power of steam, when ever it became necessary that any of these things should be done, he would not hesitate to come to Parliament for the power.—(Hear, hear.) Such had always been the course he had hitherto pursued, and he would continue to do so in future. He had no objec tion to offer to the production of the returns asked for. He would give them reluctantly, but if they were pressed for he would give them. There was one, how ever, which he trusted the House would pause be fore it ordered—it was the continuation of a return --- " also of all ships building or ordered to be built du the same period ; with their state of forwardness." He did not think that that was a proper return to be made public. He would have no objections to give the information privately to any Noble Lord, but he did not think it was a proper return to be laid upon the table of the House ; he would leave it to the dis cretion of the Noble Lord whether he would press for it or not. The Earl of HARD WICKE did not think that the Noble Earl who, had just sat down had at all an swered the case made out by his Noble Friend. He'had not shown that there was that great profundity of peace -a-that utter safety from war which rendered it unneces sary for us to do more than think of our own firesides. The Noble Earl stated that we had large fleets in the Mediterranean, and that he could fit out forty s ailof the line at any moment, besides having a fleet going to China ; but he had not met the case fairly and justly. He asked why we had never heard those complaints before, at the time when the navy was at its lowest ebb—it was because we were then clearly at peace. There was not only peace abroad, but there was satisfaction ; there was not even one thought of war. What was the state of things now ? Our colonies in America in an unsettled state, and the whole coast of America swarming with French squadrons, who, when it pleased their fancy, made bucanneering descents on those States whom they fancied had injured them, actually at war in India ; tdifficulties in China, where they were sending a fleet o settle another war. If the Government had so many ships in the state of preparation that was boasted of, why was not that squadron half way to its destina tion before this time, in place of being yet idle in our ports.—(Hear.) The Noble Earl boasted that he had a sufficient force to meet the Russians, but was he prepared—had he a sufficient force to meet the French ? Our fleet in the Mediterranean con sisted of fourteen sail of the line, while the French had twelve sail. The complement of men for those twelve sail of the line was 8,222, while the war complement of the fourteen English ships amounted to 8,710 men. In guns also the English had an advantage to the amount of 224 ; but, when they looked at the frigates, the balance was altogether in favour of the French. The eighteen French frigates scattered over the world had 7,995 men, while the twenty-four English frigates, also scattered over the world, had only 5,406, giving a balance in favour of the French of 2,449 men, which would enable them to man the remaining ships. Then, again, with regard to the calibre of the ships as well as of the frigates, the French had greatly the advantage of the English. He would venture to say, that al though he had not the slightest doubt that, in ability to manoeuvre, in all respecting the handling of a ship, the English were superior in every way, but that the great disparity of force rendered it very probable that our officers would look with great anxiety to that duty which they might be called upon to perform at some future day. Then the Noble Earl included in his six disposable ships the three flag-ships. How were they to be manned? The Earl of MlNTO—lmmediately from the Ordinary. The Earl of H ARDWICKE was not aware that that could be done, because, if so, why cause ships from foreign stations to go immediately to other foreign stations ? Why not use those ships which he boasted of as a reserve? The treaty of last year entered into be tween the French and English Governments to regulate the fishing upon the two coasts, had never been carried into effect. The fishermen of Dover and other places on the coast complained that they were as much op pressed as ever, and that, because the Noble Earl had not a ship out of his reserve to spare, in order to see that it was carried into effect.—( Hear, hear.) The three lag-ships lay in our ports with only three lieu tenants, instead of eight or nine, and with men enough merely to wash and keep the ship clean—beyond that he did not think they were worthy of the name of ef fective ships. The Noble Lord said he could equip 40 sail of the line at once. He could not man one line of battle ship without great difficulty -,-without drafting men from the flag ships. The officers, upon whom the whole responsibility would fall on, in case of a war, looked with great anxiety upon the constant and in creasing practice of the officers of foreign nations. How could our officers, after 24 years of peace, have that de gree of experience which could warrant them in going out with perfect confidence against other officers who were constantly at sea, and although they should be ac tuated by the same loyalty and affection for the throne, attachment to their country, and love for their profes sion, would they, if called upon, go out with the same attachment to her Majesty's Ministers ? Did their conduct to the profession warrant it ?—(Hear, hear.) The Noble Lord had shown how ready he was to serve the political party to which he belonged, and to promote the connections of those who stood side by side by him in election contests. Was that a course which would satisfy the country ? Would the nation be satis fied that those forty sail of the line would go forth well manned and well officered—officered by men who had the welfare of their country at heart, and who had confidence in the Ministers by whom their opera tions were to be directed ?---(Hear, hear.) He did not believe that the Noble Lord was adverse to the maintenance of an efficient naval force. But the Noble Lord acted under the influence of that pressure which had weighed upon all their reforming Govern ments. They, began by a reduction to the amount of 4,420,0001., and they were obliged to increase it to upwards of five millions, showing an excess of 969,7001. above the former estimate. That was a larger sum than the Noble Duke beside him had added to the expenses of the navy during the time that he had been in office.—(Hear, hear.) Those re form Governments had all to answer for.—(Hear.) The Noble Lord (Minto) had thrown out a hint, that his Government should be obliged to go to the House of Commons to ask for more money for the navy. Then, in what state was the country placed by those reforms of reforming Governments ?—(Hear.) Was England obliged to whip it up, in order to •be on an equality with France, which was now looking on with satisfaction at the condition of our navy, and was anti cipating the time when she would beat England ? He believed that he had now answered most of the observa tions of the Noble Lord at the head of the Admiralty.- But there was another to which he referred with great diffidence ; he meant the young men of his prbfession. The means of their education had been in a great measure disregardedt--(Hear, hear.) They were shut out from th4dvaptiges of the Seminary at Sand ford, and the means of education which the Government had substituted were totally inOequate. In' getting rid of that seminary, her Majesty's yinisters stated that they would provide for the instruction of officers on board ship. But in fact there were only twenty three inst/actors in the whole navy. But the Noble Lord skicla itliat he had provided for the education of thirty young . -men on shore. Now these young men raultbe taken from the sea at the very time when their educit.tion would be best formed on board ship. They were, brought to school upon land at the very time when they ought to be at sea.—( Hear.) They were to .be polished off and finished at a land school when their active services were required in their ships.— (Hear, hear.) Why did not the Noble Lord leave the College at Sandford as it was, and introduce besides those efficient instructors of whom be boasted on board ship, to induce young men to hold a keepfast, and rule up what they had learned at College ? At the college, they not only acquired a knowledge of the mathe matical parts of their profession, but they were also in structed in those languages which would be useful to them in their traversings of the wide seas. They were taught drawing, an acquirement of which in numberless cases they could avail themselves to the advantage of the service and to their credit. They had, besides, the paramount advantage of practical instructions in the dock-yard.—(Hear, hear.) He had now said all he thought necessary, and he would not trouble their Lordships further than to say, that whilst the Noble Lord, and the Cabinet with which he was connected, were occupied with affairs at home, and were discussing the Municipal Corporation Bill for Ireland, the whole liberties and the inestimable insti-utions of this country were placed in extreme peril by the inefficient state of the navy.—(Hear, hear.) Lord COLVILLE could not allow the observations which had beep made in respect to the neglect of the navy :n other times to pass without an answer. In the - , times referred to England held her naval superiority without a rival—without a competitor::---(Cheers.) The case was now altered ; for even France had held out something like threats that she would contest the dominion of the seas. The Minister of Marine in that country had stated in•his last report that there was a necessity to provide for three cases—first, for an imme diate state of war—(Cheers)—secondly, for an imme diate state of peace—(Cheers)—and, thirdly, for a na val depot.—(Hear, and cheers.) He did not wish to treat this as a party question. But he could not forget the time when the victories of Nelson and Wellington gave protection and prosperity to the commerce of Great Britain. We were called a nation of shop keepers in consequence of the taunts of Napoleon, but • what would we be at the commencement of a war if the efficiency of our navy was sacrificed to a paltry economy ? He regretted that the resources of the country were wasted in silly and ridiculous experiments, such as the penny postage, which was so absurd that the Noble Lord who introduced the measure said it could not succeed ; and when he moved that the Bill be read a third time, gave every reason that it, should not pass. The change which had been made by the reforming Government in the power and usefulness of the East India Company, was not only the cause of great loss to the revenue, but it had led to involving us in those difficulties with China, which might give full employment to the forty sail of the line. He ridiculed the idea of young men being made good officers by ex perimental manoeuvres in the Tagus, and of the steam vessels superseding the renowned ships of war to which England owecliher glory.—(Cheers.) Lord MELBOURNE said that he really did not expect so lengthened and large a debate upon the ques tion before the House. Their Lordships would there fore excuse him if he was not prepared to go into the discussion. But there were some observations made by the Noble Lord who spoke last but one, which he could not allow to pass in silence. It was stated by that Noble Lord, that in the recent times to which he re ferred, no attention had been paid to the subject of the navy. The Noble Lord remarked that the diminution of the naval force had taken place in time of perfect peace, when the world enjoyed a tranquillity which offered no prospect of interruption, and when the minds of men were not prepared for any attempt to contest with us the dominion of the seas.—(Hear.) When were those times? What times did the Noble Lord refer to ? He (Lord Melbourne) remembered no such times—he declared that since the termination of the French war he remembered no such times. Did the Noble Earl refer to the Administration of the Noble Duke in 1828 and 1829, when the Russians were marching on Constantinople—did he mean to say there was no danger in those times, when the Noble Duke was only restrained from actively interfering in the affairs of Europe, because he believed the Russians would fail in that expedition ? Did the Noble Earl al lude to the year 1830, the terminative year of the Noble Duke's Administration—the year in which the French, contrary to every representation of that Noble Duke, entered into an expedition against Africa, and which was now regarded as one of the greatest dangers of this period ? What period was it then that the Noble Eat) had referred to in which these matters could be viewed with indifference in consequence of the settled state of Europe t He (Lord M.) confidently answered there had been no such time. There had been no period since the termination of the great wnr of the revolution, in which it was not the duty of a statesman to attend to the situation of the navy, and he confidently stated, as far as he could understand the statement of his Noble Friend, that there had been no period at which greater attention had been paid to the subject, and greater at tempts to retrieve former errors, if errors they were, than during the Administration of his Noble Friend, who now presided over the affairs of the Admiralty. It was very easy to make calculations of the strength of the navy of Foreign Powers—it was very easy to point out dangers in various quarters of the globe, and to say there was not a sufficient guard in this place or that place. Why it was impossible to have sufficient safe guard in every quarter and at every point.—(" Hear," from the Duke of Wellington.) With an empire so extensive as ours was, and with the difficulties which always would be arising, it was perfectly impossible, with the finances and resources of any country to be always in a state of preparation on every point. Risks and hazards must be run somewhere, and some points must be exposed to chance. The only course to be pursued was to have as large a force as it was possible for the country to maintain, and to dispose of that force with the greatest skill, in order to give assistance in the easiest and readiest manner to every quarter. - The Noble Lord had said that the Russians were always ready. It would be absurd for him (Lord Melbourne) to form any opinion upon the merits of the war force of any power. It was true such was the case with the Russian navy, but he would not give any opinion on what would be the merits of the Russian forces when employed. The Noble Lord also said the French could man their fleet with great ease, from having their sailors registered. He (Lord Melbourne) knew that that was the case, but he also very well knew what the opinion of persons high in authority in France about their own navy and the character of their own sailors was. He knew very well that from the circumstance of the short time during which their men served, and from their never returning to the service, there were many persons in that country who despaired of their navy ever reaching ' a great degree of efficiency. Therefore he could not entertain the desponding notions which the Noble Earl had attempted to inculcate upon the House upon this subject. But the Noble Earl went further than that, for he not only elevated the foreign service, but en deavoured to depreciate entirely his own service.— (Hear.) He did not spare himself nor the officers of his own grade and character, and he attacked the skill and experience of those officers—he said they had neither skill nor experience. Earl of HARD WICKE—No, no. Viscount MELBOURNE—You did say so ; you said they had no experience compared to the foreign service. _ _ Earl of H ARDWICKE—I beg your pardon. I stated the officers had not at this time equal experience, generally speaking, to the officers of the French navy. The French navy have no more officers than are ne cessary to command their ships, and to be of service ashore. They, therefore, come in rotation. Look at your navy ; it is so large, and the order in Council obliging an officer to serve six years before be can get flag, therefore pushing the old officers forward, that therefore your officers have not experience equal to the French. Viscount MELBOURNE observed that that was what he stated the Noble Lord had said—that our officers had not experience equal to the French, and the Noble Earl had likewise attacked the spirit of those officers, for he said that in consequence of the difficul ties they would have to undergo, the inferior situation in which they would be placed, and the in feriority of their means, that he could not help contemplating with apprehension the re sult of their services. He (Lord Melbourne) did not believe that. He believed there was that sanguine confidence among naval officers which had always dis tinguished the service, and which would always carry them through. But the Noble Earl had attacked the patriotic; zeal of the whole of the service, for he said if there was war the officers would be unwilling to come forward under the present Government—that they would be unwilling to come forward to serve their coun try if that country should require their'service. The Earl of HARDWICKE—No, no: Viscount MELBOURNE—I understood the Noble Earl to say so. The Earl of HARDWICKE—No. Just allow me to explain. Viscount MELBOURNE said that sort of interrup tion was very irregular, and the Noble Earl had better wait until he had finished.—(" Hear, hear," from the Duke of Wellington.) The Noble Earl, as he under stood, stated that officers would be unwilling to come forward to serve their country on account of the manner in which his Noble Friend had dispensed the patronage of the service, and referred to the circumstance of the late appointment to the Governorship of Greenwich Hospital. In that appointment he (Lord Melbourne) begged leave to say he was as much responsible as his Noble Friend—perhaps more so.—(Hear, bear, hear.) From all he could learn of the state of the navy, he did not wish to say anything respecting the comparative merits or services of officers, but he did not believe there was any individual who had a greater claim to that piece of preferment, than the officer who had been appointed. But, however that might be, and however his Noble Friend might have dispensed the patronage of the navy, he did not believe, whatever feeling might prevail on that subject, or what ever dissatisfaction might be felt, it would, in cases of difficulty or'danger, as the Noble Lord supposed, have any effect on the feelings and spirit of the officers of the profession; and with respect to their not feeling con fidence in themselves—with respect to their not feel ing that superiority over the enemy, which they always had felt—the Noble Earl might express his own feeling, perhaps he might not so feel —(A laugh)—but he (Lord Melbourne) did believe that the general feeling of the navy seas that which it had always been, and that their spirit and courage would never be found wanting, on any occasion upon which they"might be called forward. The Noble Lord had stated that he did not consider this a party question. (Hear, hear.) He (Lord Melbourne) could not think so. The Noble Earl had not treated it in a spirit of impartiality. He (Lord Melbourne) admitted it to be a question of the greatest import ance, well worthy the attention of that House and Q f the Governn:ent ; and' though he could not participate in the, apprehensions of the Noble Lord opposite, and could not think there was at this p resent period any greater apprehension of the disturbance of peace, or that there was any call for greater military exertions, yet it was at all times necessary to see that the navy was in a fitting state of preparation, and that it bore some ,thing in proportion to the navies of other powers ; and that in times of peace we should keep our services in proper order, so as to use them effectually in time of war. He (Lord Melbourne) entirely admitted that principle. His Noble Friend, he was sure, would be ' happy to receive any advice on this subject ; but he could got help thinking that advice might be given in a tone less tinctured with party spirit, and more characterised by real and impart►al patriotism than that which had prevailed during this debate. - The. Earl of WICKE begged to say a word in explanation. What he had stated was, that officers, when called upon to act, ought to have an affection towards the Government, but that he did not think the way in which the patronage had been bestowed of late in the navy was likely to create that affection. The Duke of WELLINGTON must say a few words on this subject. The Noble Earl at the head of the Admiralty had stated, very fairly, that the proper time for adverting to this subject, in order to ascertain whether the fleet was equal to perform the service required of it, was after the papers should be laid on the table of the House,—(Hear, bear.) That was not the only question which came before their Lord ships on a discussion of this description. They must look a little at the state of the service for the last three 1 or four years, and that would be an acswer in a great degree, not only to what had been stated by the Noble Lord at the,becid of the Admiralty, but likewise an, an swer to the Noble . V iscou nt, w h o t h oug h t proper to dravi their Lordships' attention to the state of Europe' and the world, in the years 1827, 1828, 1829, and 1830. He (the Duke of Wellington) had alwayi understood that in the year 1830 the navy was fully equal to the performance of all the services required of it.—(Hear, hear.) He had never heard that the navy was smaller or less efficient than it ought to be at that time. Indeed, so efficient was it, that he believed the Noble Words opposite, when they succeeded to office, in 1830, made a very large reduction in it (Hear, hear) and therefore the Noble Viscount's speech, begging his pardon, did appear to him to be one of the most ridiculous speeches he had ever heard in that House. In 1828 and 1829 the fleets of the principal maritime powers were in co-operation together in the Mediterra nean, and, he was :not aware that there was any notion of going to war, or that the navy was not sufficient`to' perform all its duties. In December, 1837, the Noble Lord came down with a message from her Majesty, in forming Parliament that a revolt in an important part: of her Majesty's dominions in North America had taken place. He (the Duke of Wellington) at the very moment took the liberty of giving a little bit of advice to the Noble Viscount opposite, he had desired and entreated him not to consider that in ' which he was engaged as a little war, but recom mended him to form his fleets and armies upon such a scale as that he could carry on the war in a manner worthy of a great country, while, at the same time, he would be enabled to perform the peace service of the empire so as to give protection to the commerce of her Majesty's subjects, prevent insults to her Majesty's flag, preserve her Majesty's subjects from .the consequences of illegal . and improperly-esta blished blockades, and at the same time be ena bl e d t o perform all those services which the Government of 1827, 1828, 1829, and 1830, had performed during a period, as the Noble Lord had said, this country was threatened with war, without either complaint or re proach, or misfortune, or disaster, or distress. First of all, he (the Duke of Wellington) contended that the service was neglected ; and next, that at this moment, that was to say, more than three years after the period at which that revolt was mentioned to the House, the Noble Lord was not nearer to a settlement, as far as his military means were concerned, than he was three months after it commenced. The cause of that was, the neglect of Noble Lords opposite to provide suffi cient means, first, to settle that affair, as this great country ought to have it settled ; and, next, to call on Parliament to provide the means to en able them to perform the peace services of the country as it was their duty to do. That was proved by their being obliged to call ships from the Gulf of Mexico and other stations. He admitted there . was a necessity for attending to Buenos Ayres and other parts of the world, but at the same time there ought to have been large fleets and large armies upon the coast of America, in order not only by military force to put down any rebellion existing within her Majesty's dominions, but likewise to give that political and moral support to her Majesty's officers within her colonies, so as to prevent any interference of any description whatever. If a military and naval force had been kept up, as it ought to have been, we should not have had impending over the country, in 1840, that same contest which had been impending over it three years ago at the commencement of this affair. But was that all? At the same time that they went to war in North America they were at war in Asia, and more particu larly were they carrying en a maritime war in that quarter of the world. They were at war in the Per sian Gulf ; nay the Admiral himself was in the Persian Gnlf with the greatest part of the squadron ; and he believed that the Admiral was in the Persian Gulf car rying on operations at the very moment that those af fairs were under discussion in China, which had led to our recent disasters there in 1839. At that time the Admiral, instead of having been, as he ought to have been, in the Canton River, was at that time engaged in the Persian Gulf, and they bad now got under their consideration accounts of trans actions in the Canton river up to September, Oc tober, or November, seven months after the period at which this contest had occurred. These mattere were known in this country in July or August. There was but one frigate there—she was totally unable to do any thing ; since that arrival another disgrace had occurred. A blockade had been proclaimed, and that blockade had been obliged to be raised, and that the Noble Lord called providing for the exigencies of the peace service.—( Hear, hear.) This must have been known ;o the Noble Lord as likely to occur before the month of March last. The Superintendent must have known that he had this opium question hanging over him, and that it must sooner or later come to a crisis, and that he would stand in need of naval protection. He must have given notice of this to the authorities in India, and among others to the Admiral on the station, and if the Admiral had had that notice, he must have gone to ' the Canton river if he had not been detained by the military operations carrying on in the Per sian Gulf. The Noble Lord at the head of the Admiralty must have known that a fleet could not go in a few days from the Persian Gulf to the Canton river. —(Hear, hear, from Lord Melbourne.) The Noble Lord ought to have provided a fleet for the pur pose of carrying on the war in Asia, and besides that to have provided the means for performing the peace ser vice. Her Majesty's subjects in other parts of India required protection, but they had not the means of affording it to them. They could not call the fleet from the Persian Gulf, and therefore they had suffered this disgrace—therefore they had suffered the loss al luded to by his Noble Friend, and they would suffer still further disasters, losses, and disgraces in the Canton river. —(Cries of " Hear, hear.") This was a consequence of the system of a great nation carrying on a little war—that was, of supposing any war they got into could be a little war. A great nation had great concerns pending in every part of the inhabited globe. k had subjects requiring protection everywhere, and they forgot that while they went to war on the coast of Asia, or in North America, questions would arise everywhere, and that they could not properly carry on the peace services in all those quarters in which protection might be requisite.— (Cheers.) Now he supposed they would call that fac tious.—(Cheers.) But after having said that three years ago he had not manifested any intention to withhold his assistance from the Government in any way in which it could be useful, whether by vote or by advice, or by personal exertion ; he had been always ready in any way to give them any assistance—(Cheers) —and therefore ha would not allow himself to be called factious.—(Cheers.) He had never said anything in that view. —(Cheers.) He had said all he had said in order to be of use in any way he could, and he had only spoken of it now because the Noble Lord had thought fit, for the purpose of taunting his Noble Friend, to allude to the state of the navy in 1828, 1829, and 1830. Why there was no more comparison to be instituted between those points of time that there was between the present time and 1740, and the Noble Lord might just as well have instituted a comparison between the two last as between the two first. He thought his Noble Friend had been entirely misunder stood and misrepresented in what he had stated respect ing the feelings of officers in the navy—(Hear, hear, from the Earl of Hardwicke)—and certainly his expla nation had set their Lordships right on that subject. What he had said was this, that in consequence of the small number of vessels employed, and the consequent ' small number of men employed in them, there were not the means for the instruction of officers of high rank and station in the practice of the service, and :not having this opportunity of practice and of seeing the inanceuvres of fleets in large bodies, they had not the experience that the officers of other ser vices had ; and that this deficiency was calculated to cre ate a want of confidence in themselves. But what he had understood was, that in foreign services there was a greater proportion of officers always in the prac tice of their profession ; but he had by no means un derstood his Nobl e F r i end to state that the naval offi cers of this country were either wanting in confidence in themselves, or wanting in confidence in those over whom they were placed. On the contrary, he had known a great many gentlemen in that profession, and he had always had the highest respect for, and the ful . lest confidence in them ; and he had always endea -1 voured to emulate them in the service in which he had himself been employed, and in nothing had he ever wished to emulate them to a greater degree than in having not ! ally confidence in himself and the officers of rank with whom he was co-operating, but i n a ll th ose w h o were I under his command. It' would be impossible for him to enter into all the details adverted to by the Noble Lord, but he must say, that having sat on that Com mission, the Noble Lord at the head of the Admiralty had stated he must do that Noble Lord and the offi cers of the navy the justice to say that it was impos -1 sible for men to have taken more pains than they had done to adopt every suggestion that had been made in the improvement of the service in every way, so as to render it more advantageous and desirable to old officers to continue in the service,so as to give it the ad van tage of their experience, but to induce others to enter it so as to secure to the public every advantage that could EVENING EDITION. Ibe derived from experience and activity. He felt ita duty to state this much on this occasion, and he hada a doubt that when the report came before.the public that not only everything had been done that could have been suggested, but that the service had been rendered more efficient than it had_ been before the commission was appointed. There was one topic which had ,been ad verted to by his Noble Friend, which had been replied to by the Noble Lord Opposite, oh which he would not now give an opinion ; but in a discussion of that descrip tion, if the Noble Lord thought that the patronage of the navy had not been fairly disposed of it was hardly surprising that he should state that opinioh. He had never heard a discussion of that kind in which the topic had not been discussed, but he was not able to come to any decision about it. It was a subject on which the minds of men were naturally jealous, and he thought it a justifiable' topic for his Noble Friend to have in troduced: .He felt himself justified for the partiae had taken in this debate—lie knew well what his own motives were for what he had said on all these sub jects, both now and on former occasions. —(Cheers.) He had stated his opinions again that night, becausche felt that the Noble Lord had neglected the protection of the insterests of his country i n t h e Chi nese affair, and the country had reason to regret that that neglocti had. taken place, and .if they did not mind they would have another misfortune hap pen in that quarter. The fleet for China bad not yet sailed. These things had happened in China eleven months since, and they had not yet sent out a s i ng l e ship, That did not look like providing far the proper performance of the service in that part of the world.—(Cheers.) The Earl of ABERDEEN would remind the Noble Viscount that if the Noble Duke bad made no remon strance at the time of the French invasion of Algiers, a certain pledge hid been then given by the French Government. He would ask how that pledge had been fulfilled ?—(Cheers.) Had not that pledge been given the expedition never would have taken place—that pledge would have been fulfilled to the Noble Duke.— (cheers.) But the .French knew with'whom they had to deal. They knew they might safely trust either to their indecision or their apprehension. The Earl of MINTO said the Noble Earl had thought proper to attack him on the ground of misap propriation of the patronage of the navy. He was glad, that he had thought proper to bring forward the appointment of Admiral Fleming. He had no desire to flinch from the responsibility of that appOintment, and he thought Admiral Fleming was worthy to fill it. He did not know to what the Noble Lord had intended to allude when he commenced his attack. He thought they were going to have the Plumridge case over again. He did not fear inquiry as to the manner in which the patronage of the navy had been disposed of by him. He would ask the Noble Lord when he thought he had a fair case against him, to bring it forward. With regard to the officers 'of the navy being deficient in experience, which the French officers bad an opportunity of acquiring, he had great pleasure in stating that the discipline and skill of the officers of our navy were the object of wonder to the French ships that were lying alongside of them. He was anxi ous of not losing that opportunity of bearing wit ness to the skill and activity of our naval officers, and he had found that those officers who had been out of the service for some time, and bad been re-appointed, had, after that interval of repose from active service, been found performing their duties with all their origi nal skill and energy. Lord EL LE NaOROUG H wished to ask. the Noble. Earl whether it wTs true, as had been stated, that tb: t officer bad never been in action ; because he had re ceived the highest situation as to emolument to which a naval officer could be appointed ? The. Earl of MINTQ did not .know how often ; but he had understood Admiral Fleming had been in action, although he could not take upon himself to state this. But this be knew—that Admiral Fleming's ser vices had been for )ears of the most active kind—that be had exhibited great skill and energy, and that few had gone through more arduous duties than he had done. Lord ELLENBOROUGH said as the Noble Earl did not know if Admiral Fleming had ever been in ac tion, and as the Noble Viscount had stated that he had made inquiries into the merits of the respective candidates for the appointment, it was not possible but what he must know the facts of the case. He would, therefore, ask the Noble Viscount if Admiral Fleming had ever been in action. Viscount MELBOURNE—I really don't know.— (A laugh.) I have always taken into consideration the general services of the officer, and I apprehend that there are many distinguished officers in the Navy who have never been in action. Lord ELLE N BO RO UG H—Narne. Viscount MELBOURNE—I don't wish to name names, because I may be wrong ; but I may observe that fighting is not the whole of a sailor's duty, nor of a soldier's either.—(Laughter.) Lord ELLEN BO ROUGH—But 5t is the sort of service for which they have always obtr,ined distinctions. Viscount MELBOURNE—I dor,'t think so. Lord COLCHESTER replied; he denied that Admi ral Fleming had ever commanded •a ship in action ; and with respect to distinctions, he liras one of the very few Admirals who bad no honorary distinctions after his name. He held in his hand the Navy List, from which it appeared that there were no less than nine distin guished officers his seniors. If Admiral Fleming had been appointed to an active command in the fleet, there never would have been a word about it—(Hear, bear) —but what they complained of was, that a usan in the prime of health and strength should have been ap pointed to Greenwich Hespital. As he understood that there was some objection to the latter part of the return, he would withdraw that portion. The return, as amended, was then agreed to, and their Lordships adjourned at a Quarter to Nine o' Clock. SPORTING INTELLIGENCE. TA m .. ERSALL'S—YISTIanaV. THE DERBT.—it will he collected from the quotations that Confederate has again displaced Theon and the Angelica colt, and has established himself as first favourite. This was not the effect of any heavy outlay, as the betting was far from brisk, nor was it the work of a moment, for until late in the afternoon it would hate been difficult to say which had the call of the four, viz., the three already me ntioned and Launcelot. The business transacted towards 'the close removed all doubt, and, contrary to our anticipations, the " country nag" was once more " 'iirst in the throng." Theon was backed three or four times at 15 to 1, and appeared to be a shade better than Angelica, whose friends kept rather, quiet. Launcelot was in force ; 16 to I was obtained once, but was not offered afterwards : we cannot, quote him at more than 15 to 1. Bokhara was in as much estimation as ever, and left off at an improvement of a point on Monday's price. Muley Ishmael and Ottoman were at 20 to 1 each, the former with one backer, the other with none. DittoWardan, who gave Way a point —no takers less than 30 to 1. Gambia was also a trifle behind his previous quotation. St. Andrew was backed once at 25 to 1. but the current offers against him did not exceed 23 to 1. If we add that Prince Albert was in much favour with some. parties who introduced, and have throughout• supported him, we shall have said all that is neo cessary on this stake. Ties OAKS.—Nothing was done about the favourites, several offers to take 4 to 1 abOut Crucifix, and 20 to 1 about Black Bess, having been made in vain Teleta opened at 25, and closed at 20 to 1, both taken ; and 30 to 1 was laid and afterwards offered against Shereen. Two THOUSAND GUINEAS S TAKES.—Ottoman, Crucifix, and Muley IshMael were severally backed at 7 to I each ; but Confederate and the Angelica colt, who are clearly the prin cipal favourites, at any price ; 4 to 1 was the highest offer we heard on the field. Two THOUSAND GUINEA STAERS. 4 to I on the field 7 to 1 agst Ottoman—taken 7 to 1 agst Crucifix—taken 7 to 1 agst Muley Ishmael—taken 50 even between Ottoman and Wardan—taken 50 even between the Angelica colt and Confederate—taken THE DERBY. 14 to I agst Confederate—taken 15 to 1 agst Theon—taken 15 to 1 agst Angelica 15 to 1. agst Launcelot--take 16 to 1 17 to 1 agst Bokhara—taken 20 to 1 agst Muley Ishmael —taken 20 to 1 agst Ottoman —taken 23 to 1 agst St. Andrew —take 2.5 to 1 26 to 1 agst Gambia 27 to 1 agst Warden 35 to 1 agst Prince Albert—taken and afterwards offered 40 to 1 agst Monops 50 to 1 agst Fitzroy—taken 2000 to 25 agst Bro. to Heron—taken 2000 to 20 agst Drake —taken 700 to 10 agst Sir,R. Bulkeley's lot—taken 1000 to 10 agst Mr. Osbaldeston's lot—taken 1000 to 50 agst Fitzray and Prince Albert—taken 600 to 500 on Muley Ishmael agst Ottoman—taken 600 to 400 on Angelica agst Muley Ishmael—taken THE OAKS. 13 to 1 agst Filly out of Rowton's dam 20 to 1 agst Teleta--taken 30 to 1 agst Shereen HER MAJESTY'S MARRIAGE.—BeII's Life in London, of Sunday, February the 16th, will contain full and authentic particulars of the Nuptials of Queen Victoria and Prince Albert, illustrated with Engravings from Drawings taken on the spot, of the Interior of St. James's Chapel, the Altar, the Precession from the Palace, the Attestation in the Throne room, and Orand Wedding Banquet, together with Portraits of the Illustrious Couple. Price of " Bell's Life," M. A Sa turday edition, which may be had 200 miles from London on the Sunday.—Office, 170, Strand. Early orders to agents are advisable. TIIE NEW HISTORICAL ROMANCE " LADY JANE GRES. "—We . are requested to state that Mr. Colburn, of Great Marlborough-street, has 'this day published " Lady Jane Grey," an Historical Romance, by the Author of " Roy ston Gower," - , ‘,‘ Fair Rosamond," 87c., in 3 vols. post Bvo., which can now be had at all the Libraries. Mr. Colburn has also just published a *Second Edition of Captain Chamfer's New Nautical Romance, " The Spitfire," in 3 vols. pest Bvo., with a Fine Portrait of the Author, and three humorous Illus trations by Phiz. Among the numerous parties which will take place on Monday next, en honour of the Royal nuptials, we understand that several gentlemen intend celebrating the joyful event in a supper at the Jane Shore Tavern, Shoreditch. SEAMEN S HOSPITAL SocIETT.—At the an yeualgal court of the governors of this corporation, held sterday, the secretary read the report of the committee, which corsraeneed by stating that, notwithstanding the T r "; sive demands made upon its funds, the society had offt - , e ,, u , to lief to all who needed it, an d that not only to Bfitise foreign sailors. , .