The Sun. — London, England, 1806-01-28 00:00:00

and the Country were Liaa ler so co'•us;. tie was sure that the Hon. Gentleman, and those who brought forward such Motions, looked only to the interests of the Country. nut, at the same time that he Was ready to allos them every credit for the teitude of their motives, he could not al-, together divest himself/of an idea of the possibility Of men's minds being biassed under particular curnstances, and in consequence of certain situa *ions. He felt, htiwever, no objection to , : second the, Hon. Gentleman's Motions. PA UL' (with some warmth) disclaimed any soit of connexion with the - Nabob of - Oude, with whom, or any other' Native PoWer of India, he had nut t communication than he had with the Em peror of Fiance on this subject. His conduct was founded on principles which he was not ashamed to -OWN, and should - never depart from ; and.iu bring ing forward charges against Marquis WELLESLEY lie was guided by a sense of public duty against a person whom he considered as,a great public delin quent. On the first Motion being put from the Chair, Sir T. T. METCALF said, that similar Motions o those now brought forward had led to nothing but great trouble ..and expellee. He trusted, there fore, that the House would pause before: it would consent to grant Papers, under such circumstances, to any individual, however reapeetabie he may be was one obje&ion he felt to the Motiorp.of the Hon. Gentleman. There vas another too,. which equally weighed within his . mind.' The Papers that had already been produced bad got into the hands 0' translators, through whom the Freuch. -Govern ment had obtained the information they contained ; circumstance.that had proved inateriahy prejudicial to the interests of the Company. The importance Of it to the French Government was such,. that Bo naparte would have sacrificed hal(the revenues '9f France to obtain it. Besides, he would ask, whether ' the present was a proper time to agitate such ques tions ? Under the influence of-these objeections, he should feel it his duty to divide the House. When a Member was conscious of being ,aetnated by a sense of duty, he should not be asilanted to avow his feelings. The Hon. Gentleman had said, that, the Papers, when produced, would criminate the tesiduCt of the Noble Marquis ; but this he begged leave to deny, as he was convinced in his conscience chat no one of them would affect the public or pri vate charaaer of that Noble Lord ; and if it were possible for him to attend in that House, he was sere he would say in reply to the Motions, " Give the Papers." Besides it would have the most dan gerous effea if it should be thought. on the Conti- Tient of India that all the Treaties and Engagements that had been entered into with the Native Powers, could be rescinded by a Vote of Parliament. The lion. Member had disclaimed any connexion with the Nabob of Oude, and yet lie bad seen that Po tentate later than any other Member of that House. It was certainly competent to Parliament to inquire into the conduct of Marquis WELLESLZY but this was not the time, and for all these reasons he should certainly take the sense of the House. Mr. FRANCIS hail not been in the House when the Motions were proposed; but as - in adverting to the • mischiefs that had arisen from similar notions, the Hon. Baronet seemed to allude to those made by himself, he felt, it petvssary to say a few words. If any mischief had arisen from the produaion of the Papers he had moved. for., it was chargeable only on the Board of Controul, which bad the power of deciding which of them might be produced with safety, and was at liberty to withhold such as could not be published consistently with the public inte rest. As to the objeaion respe&ing the expenee that would attend the printing -the Papers moved for, it might have some weight with vulgar minds; but it was na to be'tolerated in that House, when an Inquiry was, to be instituted respeaing the.manage nrient of the Affairs of India, the revenuos of which were estimated at fifteen millions. With respea to his own opinion of Marquis WELLESL.E.Y'S he had stated it to the House and to. the Country, .and saw no reason to alter it. He was I.lot to be awed or intimidated into an abandonment of his principles. The on. Baronet had stated, that con sJderable danger arose from the intelligence derived to the Enemy from the puolication of these Papers ; but he was of opinion, that the- Enemy had gained more information from M.irquis WV LLESLEY's inter cepted Correspondence, which had.been published In the Moniteur, and afterwards translated into all the London Papers, from which only the public ob tained the. Information, though the contents of the Correspondence ought to have been hing before transmitted diret to the Governors. of the India Compny. He was himself not aware of any dan ger that could he apprehended from the produ&ion of the Papers ; and that there had been no objeaion felt to granting them on that score, .he appealed - to the-declaration of the Noble Lord ,who is, or lately was, at the head of the Board of Controul. That Noble Lord had said - that he saw no possible objec- . tion to their being produced.. Mr. PAUL also stated, that Lord ,OASTLEREAGH had intimated to him that he saw no - posSible objec tion to his Motion. _ Mr. WALLACE confirmed the statement of the Hon. Gentleman respe&ing the Adoration of his Noble Friend, and added, that it was the wish of every Member of the Board of 'Controul to grant every document that might be produced consi,,tent ly with' a regard to public duty, and to the interest of the Company. Sir T. 7'. METC4LF withdrew his opposition, and the Motions were selkrally agreed to, with the exception of a verbal, amendment in one, at the suggestion of Mr. lArm4,AcE, fur the omission of a sl,,knication of an item of expence for secret, ser vices, which he affirmed had never existed. PUBLIC 114 ARK OF RESPBGT TOTHE MEMORY OF THE LATE RIGHT HON. WILLIAM PITT. Mr. HENRY LASCELLES rose, pursuant to his notice, and addressed the House to the following effeet - :—lt is my anxious wish, Sir, in conclueting the melancholy business of which I gave notice on Friday, to endeavour, as much as possible, to pre vent a revival of those political differences which existed during the whole illustrious career of the dis tinguished Person on whose memory it is the ob jett of my Motion to.confer some signal mark of na tr9iiatrespeti. I am desirous, that without involving Cm consideration of such topics, •an opportunity should be At/ !ad of bestowlog on the manory of so great a man such a distinmishedlributt as w*lid be conformable with the feelings of this Home, 'and of the Nation, for I am' sure these feelings are ge neral, and Ate honourable to the community, as to the reputation of the party that is the obje& of it. 'With this view, Sir, I shall studiously abstain from enumerating the various events that have formed the great and leading features. of his brilliant Admini stration, and 814 therefore avoid enterin g into a' consideration of these subje&s, which might lead to a discussion foreign to the objeCt of my Motion. I do sincerely avow my feelings of regret, feelings which must operate on the mind of every Inan who values the interests of his country, and whiCh are generally diffused through all classeS of the community for the loss of a man so illustrious, so eminently distinguished, and so ,disibterested, and whose constant and unwearied efforts were ever di reited to promote and advance the interests of his country, whose transcendant talents and singular abi lities had uniformly acquired him the admiration of his Country, and of Europe. (Hear, hear, hear !) HaVing stated thus much, I shall be satisfied in this • instance, with submitting my Motion to the. House, which is literally the Same with the precedent that took place in the glorious instance, of his illustrious father (Lord CHATHAM). I am sure. that no man will deny that the son was as great a man as the fa ther. I have adopted the very words of the prece dent in the case of Lord CHATHAM, and abstain from any further obServations, because it would be matter of regret to me to offer any thing to the House that might give tise to any difference of opi nion on a subje& on which unanimity is so desirable. I have, however, one word to address to those Gen tlemen who are of opinion that I should delay my Motion till after the discussion, of another Motion for: an Inquiry respe&ing some part of the Admini stration of the much lamented obje& of thy Motion. If we look to the twenty years, during which that illustrious Personage had guided the Administration of his Country, every measure of which had received the unqualified approbation of tliat'Country, we shall not discover any reason' for such delay.—BeSides - , - feelhig as I do Dray _the subje&, and persuaded, as I am, that the feelings ,of the House and of the Country are in unison with mine, it would ill come me to put off the Motion of which I gave no~ tire, on the g round of a • bare possibility that some errors might be discovered in Treaties which have: not yet been laid before the House. Having said thus much to account for my condu&, I think I sliould do wrong in not proceeding with my Motion. I shall conclude, Sir, with moving, . • " That an humble Address be presented to His MAJESTY, that, he would be graciously pleased to dire& that the 'remains of the late Right Hon. WM. PITT be inierred at the public expence, and that a Monument be ereEted to his memory, in the Colle •giate Church of St. Petec, Westminster, with an in .scripticn expressive of the irreparable loss the Nation has sustained by the death of so excellent a States man." The Marquis at TITCHRIZLD seconded the Motion. He had opposed the measures of the Right -Hon. Gentleman, during a great part of his political career,-but was not, however, disposed to refuse any cm , sistent mark of respect, as a tribute to the inte grity of his charaFter, and his rare and transcendent talents. He would not be understood, in voting for , this Motion, to mean any condemnation of the line of conduct{ he had himself pursued, whilst opposing the measures of the Right Hon. Gentleman, now, unfortunately, no more. He had since aeled with that Right Hon. Gentleman, but though ranked amongst his political friends, he had not enjoyed his private friendship. In the support he gave to- the preseht Motion, he was actuated solely by his ad miration of his virtues and extraordinary talents, which might be justly appreciated without the ad .,vantage of familiar or friendly intercourse. He thought the House called upon to pay some signal mark of its respect, in this instance, by perpetuating the memory of a•Member so 'able, so eminent, so distinguished, and disinterested (loud cry of hear !.) On the Motion being put from the. Chair, Lord FOLKSTONE, with regret, found, that though he felt as sincerely as any Gentleman for the occasion which had given rise to the Motion before the House, he could not, consistently with his sense: of public duty, assent to it. He alloWed the Hon. Gentleman who had brought it forward every credit for the manner in which he introduced it (hear ! hear!), and should follow the example he had given in abstaining from the discussion of any topics that might lead to the revival Of past differences. The Hon. Gentleman bad stated, that the merits of the ' Right Hon. Gentleman were' such as to deserve some signal mark of the respect of that House ; on this point he differed with the Honourable Gentle man, and, Without entering into the consideration of these, he should barely state the ground of his , opi nion to be, the result of a comparative view-of what had-been the situation of the Country when the Right Hen. Gentleman had first come into office, and what it is at present: -On this ground, therefore, if he should be followed by any other Gentlemen, that .might think with he should feel it his duty to divide the House 'Upon the `Motion:' Lo q LOFTUS was .so completely convinced of-the great and brilliant talents of the lamented ot , ..jet-i of the Motion, that he could net•content him self wiffi giving-a silent vote on the. occasion. He most heartily concurred in the Motion. Mr. HAIVKINS -BROWN had had the honour ' of a seat in that House- during the whole period in which the Right Hon. Gentleman, whose memory was now proposed to be honoured with some signal mark of the approbation of the House, had presided in the administration of affairs. During the whole of that period he had supported all the measures brought forward by that Right Hon. Gentleman, as best calculated to promote -the essential interests of the Country. It was difficult for him to point out any instance in preference of the eminent services rendered by him to the State. -He had raised the public credit in an unexampled degree, of which the Home would be satisfied on his stating a single case. The Public Funds, when the Right Hon. Gen tleman came into office, when the Country was in a state of profound Peace, without an Enemy in Eu rope to apprehend, were not so high as at present, atier all the horrors of the French Revolution, and • - while the Couirry 'is engaged in a desperate and ex pensive contest. He should not detain the House . . 'Unger from Ore-question, for which their felings seemed to be impatient. Evely Gentleman would suggest to himself a criterion of the transcendent merits of - this great man ;• but; fOr his own 'part, he should, without entering frarther into the subjeet, content himself with the case he bad pointed out, and conclude with applying to that great, that emi nent, that admirable Statesman, what had been,said of Augustus 'Ozsar, " that be had found Rome built of wood, and bad left it built of marble." .Mr. TULEY ADDIWGTON considered the present question •as arising out of the long series of services which had been performed by the illustri ous object of the Motion, during a great part of his public life. To the extent of those services, and the distinguished and exalted talents by which they were performed, he most readily assented, because he had every opportunity of witnessing the former, and estimating the latter. As to any other subjects that might be objects of inquiry or discussion, he did not think they had any reference to the present Motion. But in saying this he did not wish to be. understood to mean thereby any drawback from the siner.e satisfaction he felt in giving his entire assent to the Motion. Mr. IVM. SMITH felt how unpleasant a situa tionany-Gentleinan would be placed in who shotild oppose a Motion brought forward and seconded in the same manner as the one then under discussion. But he alsb felt, that consistently with his sense of public duty he could not:accede to it ; .and, -painful as the performance of such a duty most be, he could not ShrihkfrorriTthe task. The performance of his duty in the present instance was the more paint it to'him, as he extremely regretted the loss of the eminent and distinguished person who was the objea of the Motion. No Gentleman who had opposed that Right-Hon. Gentleman's measures, nor any friend who deplored him, could More sincerely regret his loss, ..He too had had the . honour of a seat in that House during nearly the whole of the time that Right Hon. Gentleman had been in office. He had, during that tune, frequently witnessed the exercise of his great talents and transcendent pow ers, which he had often contemplated with admira tion and awe. - He felt one ground of obje&ion to the Motion on public principles. .In the Motion the Right Hon. Gentleman was represented as an excellent Sthesman; If he were called upon to vote thanks .(thanks unfortunately could notnow be, isoted)--=if he were called upon to vote some :mark of respea to his memory for his disinterestedness as a Statesman, he should readily concur ; but when he was to vote this mark - of respea to the Right Hon. Gentleman as an. excellent Statesman, he thought himself bound to consider whether that character' belonged to his measures and administra tion. With a view to such estimate, he knew. of no criterion but a consideration of the state of the Coun try at the time he came into office, of his conduEt whilst in office, and, of the preqent state of the Country. However, this would occupy too -much of the time of the House. EVery Gentleman would make the comparison. in his own Mind, and .deduCe a result for himself. The result in his mind -was, he confessed, unfiwoUrable to the Right Hon. Oen tleman. But be.had another . objeCtion,_ of a More private nature, to the Motion, and which applied particularly to himself. He had 'been placed in the situation which• he filled in that House by, the frages of a - large body of men; who certainly did nut . consider the Right Hon. Gentleman an excellent Statesman. They had eleaed him because' they 'thought his principles honest, and that he would op:- pose 'that Gentleman's measures. How could he .then return to his constituents after such.an appro bation of the Right Hon.. Gentleman's Widotri as a Statesman, which so directly contradiaed his 'ort - ner : .opposition to his administration ? He-believed the Hon. Member who had brought forward the Mo tion to have been aauated by the purest motives; ,and'he was sure every Gentleman sincerely regretted the'loss ; but on the principles he had stated, he felt it an imperious, tho' a painful duty, to oppose the Motion. . Mr.PYTCHES had hoped that the supporters of the Right Hon. Gentleman who was the objeet of 'the Motion, and his abettors, would have appeared on this occasion with becoming silence and desola tion (a loud laugh, and some symptoms of murmurs). 1 He had, as much as any man, admired the ableness of that Right Hon. Gentleman's elocution, and the ,eleCtricity of his reasoning (a laugh, and loud cough ing). He was not, however, in despair respeaing the emanation of some sparks from his genius. He was in hopes that the House would produce as emi nent talents, when lie contemplated the large spread ing shrubbery of genius which was shooting up so many heads.—(Lond and general laughing and cough ing, and the Hon. Member ceased). Sir. ROBERT BUXTON had not expe&ed that any debate would have taken place' on this subject, but rather that the Gentlemen on the other side would have readily concurred in any mark of respea, to the memory of that much-lamented and very . eminent Personage, that all sides of the House would have agreed that he had been a truly great man, and have acceded to the proposed tribute to his memory. But he had been disappointed. The reputation of that illustrious ornament of his Country, however, would not depend upon the extent of the majority by which this, or any such Motion might be car ried ; his-fame would go down to the latest pbst&- rity cotineaed with the history of his times, attested by the Records of Parliament, and immortalized by that Constitution which he had saved. His remains may crumble to dust in his grave, but his reputatiOn, will live in the admiration of a grateful posterity. Marquis. DOUGLAS. felt k painful to be obliged by a sense of duty.to oppose this motion for a mark of 'respea to the memory of the Right Hon. Gentle man who was the objea Of the motion. lithe Gen tleman who had brought forward - this motion had left his ashes in peace, they would have left the House in the situation in which it ought to remain. He was ready to assent to every thing that had been said of the great and eminent talents of the Right Hon. Gentleman, and to admit that the House ought to be grateful for his services on many occasions.— . The success, however, of measures alone could en . title them to such distinCtion as was now claimed. It was not sufficient that a man should have talents and eminent public virtues, his. measures Should be successful, for it was the result that would decide. , — With regard to the form of the motion, he objected also to that. The comparison that was instituted, be 7 tween the Right Hon. Gentleman and his illustrious fattier, did not appear to him just, because the dif 4erend hetWeen the twe persons was. vac -y He, toe, could drag comparisons, but he shOura forbear dwelling an 'such topics. tie s'iould ask, howev,4i;, what was the Sifuriticn of the Country with a view to its internal strength and external rela tions after the seven-years' war, and whether the present state of the Country could be compared with it There was another circumstance to which also he might advert. The public . had not yet rested from paying the laSt tribute of respea 'to the memo ry of the immortal Nelson. Would, he asked, •the - same crowds have followed the bier of that illustrious hero if he had-lost a British Fleet ? If not, it was evident that'suceess should crown the effort in order to entitle the individual to any mark of national gr a :. titude. He had done his duty in opposing-the mea sures of the Right Hon. Gentleman, but he should hat 'now disturb his ashes, over which he would walk with veneration. 'lle could, if he were dispoSed, take a review of the situation of our finances ; he could even advert to a transa&ion of the last Session; wherein a Noble 'Lord now suffering under the cen sure of the House had been proteEted by the Right Hon. Gentleman— (some slight disapprobation).--, In obedience to his sense of duty he felt him Self bound to oppose the motion. A MEMBER who spoke under the Gallery, 'but whose name we could not learn, expressed his . sur prise that any opposition should'have been made to the motion ; and declared that, in his opinion, the last five months of Mr. Pitt's Administration formed the mast brilliant period of his whole political . career. Lord TEMPLE (ik a Mite' ihai indicated inncit and sincere feeling) rose to express in a few Words the grounds upon which he assented' to the motion. It might be supposed, he observed, froin the close connexion by blood which he had with the eminent person who was the objeLa of the motion, - that he would have sat in silence till the House had decided on the question. But. as he had lately differed "on several public measures with that respected person, he thought himself bound to state the reasons _that induced him to vote for the motion. In doing sO was. influepced: by the knowledge of the transcend ant talents, and the purity and disinterestedness with which he had discharged the duties of the office His Majesty had committed to his charge. Impressed with these sentiments he could support the motion ; and in doing so he bogged to state, that he re presented the feelings of every member of hie family. IVINDHAM.—PainfuI as be should feel it to make any objeaiouto the motion, couldnot, eon. • sistently with his duty, omit to state the grounds upon which he felt that he could not assent to it. It would be desirous that ; .unanimity-should prevail on such a subjeaeif that unanimity did not involve a violation of principle and duty. Nothing could be more satiSfadory thail a nampliahee with the tnjunEtion which some of the Gentlemen who had spoken had recommended, namely, that all party-feelings; all past differenkeis and . animosities, should beforgottea. Nothing conld•be easier to him than to bury all ani mosity,because he felt none. No man could feel more • sensibly than biMSelf every sentiment of admiration fix the rare qualities of the Right Hon. Gentleman than He_ felt this admiration of his re splendent : talents in every instance,'hnd came. to the present, discussion with that impression which must be produced by the death of a great and eminent 111Ril: Bin if even this were. a question of feeling, it might even then be necessary to observe- how far it might be proper to share the distresses of others, o to in cinlge theirs at the expellee of others. It - was right for them to examine how far they could indulge , their generosity - at the 'expellee of their public • duties, . The duty they were then to perform .was one of the most iMportant they could have to exer cise, namely, the adjudication of 'the greatest re ' wards that could bebestowed upon an individual. He begged to examine,for he wished Gentlemen to under, stand what was the nature of the proceedings in which they were engaged, upon what grounds it was they were to assent to the present Motion. Was •it meant to be said, that all exalted transcendent talents were to be so rewarded ; or, was it meant to be laid down, that such talents only,when long directed to the pub ► lic service, were proper objets of these diStinaions or were such talents so direeled officially, only to be . rewarded ? or was the prospea of the distinetion to be extended to talents generally and perseveringly directed to the public service, without the claims of official situation? If high talents generally, that hate been long - direaed to the public service, be fit ob jeds of such rewards, then there had been many persons both in this and the other House; that had most eminently merited them by long,"pfle(tual, and unwearied application of resplendent talents to the service of their country. If it was meant to say, that great talents officially exerted, only Were tit ob jcdts of such rewards, the, position was false, and to assent to it would be better to their fe&n ings than their duty. The event that had gives rise to the present Motion he sincerely lamented, and he was equally inclined to regret the impossibi lity.he felt of acceding to it, because, by the line he should pursue, he should be obliged to contraditi the wishes of those With whom he was anxious on all occasions to concur. in the opposition he felt to the present Motion, he was inclined to annex. n con dition to the possession of great talents that they should lie exerted for the great benefit of the Conn . try. It Might not be amiss to take a nearer view of this subject, and this would explain the nature of his feelings. ReWards, like those now proposed, were alwayS conferred for great Naval and Mi litary Services, and almost exclusively so. Why t Did not the .Statesman who direaed their operations, and laid the plans upon which they a&, as welt as : provided the means that enabled them to tri umph, require as great abilities for the perform ance of his office; as they in the execution'of their enterprises? . Why should not he then 'beentitied to the same honours ? Because their exploitstame home to the feelings - of every man. He that routs the armies of the Enemy, and he that destroys their fleets, makes his way directly to the hearts of every man. A very memorable instance had lately been seen; in the instance of the tribute of national geati :tude that had been paid to the memory of ihe mortal Nelson. Every person in the community, from the highest' to the lowest, from the richest to the poorest, from the 1 - IIGIst exalted to the most hum ble, 'vied with each other in willing homage . to such transcendent Merits. There was no heiVit that did not Vibrate with the most lively m6t:s.i.s. • No man 'euuld.wistake. But it was not to serve the interest_