The Sun. — London, England, 1857-06-09 00:00:00

IMPERIAL PARLIAMENT. HOUSE OF LORDS.—(YESTERDAY.) The LORD CHANCELLOR took his seat on the woolsack at five o'clock. The Earl of. MALMESBURY presented a petition from Hammersmith, praying for an equalisation of the poor-rate. The Earl of EGLINTON presented petitions from places in Scotland against the admission of Jews into Parliament, and in favour of an inspection of convents. The Earl of MALMESBURY presented a petition from the proctors of Doctors'-commons, praying for com• pensation in the event of the Probate and Letters of Ad- ministration Bill passing into a law. The Earl of DERBY presented a petition against the Sale of Poisons Bill. Lord AVELAND presented a petition from the Poor Law Union of Spalding, Lincolnshire, for the better regulation of beer shops. SECOND READINGS. On the motion of Lord REDESDALE, the following bills were read a second time :—Chepstow Gas, Peebles Railway, South Devon Railway, Reversionary Interest Society. CASE OF MR. SHEDDON. Earl GREY presented a petition from Mr. W. P. R. Sheddon, complaining, amongst other things, that, by a decision of the Court of Session in Scotland in IEO3, and of this house in 1808, obtained in his infancy, he Lad been deprived of his estates as a natural born subject of this realm, and as the legitimate child of his parents, and of the means of investigating in any courts of law the question of such statutes, and causing the same to be recognised. The petitioner prayed for such relief and redress as to this house might seem fit. The noble lord called the attention of their lordships to the state ments contained in the petition, which he stigma tised as one of the greatest frauds ever perpetrated. The chief actor in the transaction was a gentle man named Patrick, who had arrived at a great age, and filled a high position in society and in the honourable profession to which be belonged. He had carefully perused the whole facts of the case, and he had alio read the statement of Mr. Patrick, and having done so, he felt it his duty to bring the subject under their lordships' consideration. The noble lord then proceeded to give an outline of the case; in which he entered at some length into the birth and parentage of the petitioner, whose father, it appeared, had the management of a mercantile business in Ame rica ; but on the breaking out of the American war his estates were confiscated, in consequence of his having espoused the royal cause. In 1778 he went to Bermuda, and on the conclusion of peace he re-visited New York with a view to their recovery, but was unsuccessful up to the time of his death, which took place in 1798. Before he died he executed a deed respecting some property,of which he was in possession of in Scotland, which he left to his son. This deed could not be found. Amongst other things, the will contained an i n j enc ti on th a t hi s son should be sent to Scotland and there placed under the care of Mr. Patrick a nephew of Mr. Sheddon, sen. Mr. Sheddon was married in America, and the issue of this marriage was two children—the petitioner and a daughter. To avoid the marriage, which was per formed by civil declaration, being questioned, anoth , r marriage took place in Scotland. His lordship then entered into further details, bearing strongly on members of the Patrick family, who, he alleged, had denied the legitimacy of the petitioner, and withheld his property, both Scotch and American, to which he was lawfully entitled, and concluded by moving that it be referred to a select cammitiee, The LORD CHANCELLOR said the question was one cut merely personal, but invo'ving a principle. He acknowledged tho correctness of Lord Grey's statement in the main, but defended the Messrs. Patrick from any suspicion of fraud, and argued upo❑ the invalidity of the first marriage, and that the case bad been already de cided, and ought not to be re-opened. Lord BROUGHAM said there were two questions— first, bad their lordships been led into a wrong decision by ignorance of the first marriage ; second, could they on that fact being proved, supply a remedy by re-open ing the case. A similar point had been raised in Laurie's case, where a divorce bad been obtained in Scotland and a fresh marriage had been contracted there. In the course of the discussion it appeared that several of their lordships had done the same thing themselves—Lord Erskine, the Lord Privy Seal, and the Archbishop of , Canterbury of that day. Lord CA MPBELL suggested that Lord Erskine was married by an episcopal clergyman. Lord BROUGHAM apologised ; he had not written Lord Erskine's life. (A laugh.) He thought, under the circumstances, that an inquiry should take place. Lord ST. LEONARDS had decided the original case against the petitioner on three grounds—lsr, that the petitioner, as an alien, had no locus ; 2d, that there was no fraud proved against Mr. Patrick; 3d, that there was no marriage in 1790 proved. Lord LYNDHURST said the fact of the first mar riage, now first heard of, placed the case in a new light, and opened up another question for fresh decision. Be sides, at the first trial, the petitioner was a boy of six, and the present defendant was his guardian. He had first tried to set aside the original decree for fraud, but the Court held that no fraud was alleged. Now he came forward with the fact of the previous marriage of his mother and father in a valid manner, as but now first known to him, but before known to Mr. Wm. Patrick. He considered the first marriage as proved. His lord ship supported the motion for an inquiry. Lord CAMPBELL protested against the course sug gested by Lord Lyndhurst. The case was one in which if injustice had been done it could not be remedied. They had, after 17 days' discussion, decided that there had been no fraud, and Robert Patrick had been in possession of the estate since 1608. It could not be altered. Lord EGLINTON spoke in high terms of Mr. R. Patrick and of Dr. Patrick, the inspeccor-general of hos pitals. The later marriage of Mr. Shecidon would not legitimise his children. He thought Mr. Patrick badly treated, and that Mr. Sheddon's case was no better than before. The Earl of ALBEMA.R.LE thought Mr. Sheddon's family had been shamefully ill-used. Mr. Patrick's cha racter in that house seemed to stand high. In New York they called him "the biggest scoundrel that ever came from Scotland." The LORD CHANCELLOR, rose to order. Such lacguage was not even legally justifiab'e. The Rix.' of ALBENIA:Rfsg stood corrected. Their lordships ought to grant the committee. Lord LYTTELTON supported the motion. Lord REDESDALE opposed the motion for a select committee. Earl GREY, in summing up the discussion, made some severe remarks on the interference of the Lord Chancellor. Mr. Patrick was represented as highly re• spectable, but base acts were unfortunately of late not incompatible with appearances of respectability. They required evidence, not testimony. Mr. Patrick had plainly concealed the evidence of the fiat marriage. He foresaw the difficulty in re-opening a case judicially de cided, but even if Mr. Sheddon were to lose his property he must not be divested of the lights of a British subject. He would recommend a committee to examine the petition. After a few words from Lord BROUGHAM, Their lordsh;ps divided. The numbers were— Contents Non-contents Majority The motion was therefore negatived. Their lordships then adjourned. HOUSE OF COMMONS.-(YESTREDAY.) The SPEAKER took the chair at four o'clock. NEW MEMBERS. The Earl of FIFE took the oaths and his seat for Banffshire. PRIVATE BUSINESS. The followirpz bills were read a third time and passed : —Cork Gas, Great Yarmouth Britannia Pier, Mayor's Court of the City of London, North Eastern Railway (Capital), and Traiee and Killarney Railway Bills. The tolloviing bills were further considered and ordered to be read a third time :—Bri , lgewater Mar kets and Fairs ; Burslem and Tunstall Gas ; Tyne Im provement ; Wycombe Railway ; and Banff, Portsoy, and Straithisle Railway. ELECTION PETITION. The SPEAKER announced that the recognizances of the election petition in reference to the borough of Cashel were unobjectionable. DIVORCE BILLS. Colona PATTEN nominated the following select committee :—Mr. Walpo!e, Mr. Massey, Mr. Eitcourt, Sir John Pakington, Sir John Yarde Buller, Mr. Head lam, Mr. Banhara-Carter, Sir Erskine Perry, and Mr. Adderley. TUE SLAVE TRADE. KINNAIItD prevented a petition signed by up , wards of 1,500 of the principal inhabitants of the Island of Jamaica, compl ,fining of the non-enforcement of tr,aties with Spain, relating to the abolition of the slave trade, and the consequent met a,t, of slavery in Cuba, and the difficulties of free labour competing with slave labour in the Spanish colonies. NETLEY HOSPITAL. Sir D. NORREYS gave notice that he should, to pr morrow, ask for the oducti on of papers and plans lative to the erecti on of Netley Hospital, and also ask be Secretary fur War if he had any statement to make in answer to that of the bun. member for North North amptonshire in the debate on Friday night. ECCLESIASTICAL COURTS AND REFORMA TORY SCHOOLS. Sir G. GREY . gave . rotice that he should, to; 'o introduce hat 1:"11 f 13u al u s cl ot ° i n n report,ttrhoe ‘ morrow, ask fiir leave Ecclesiasticnl Commitoenc.ry dnce a Nil for the c- n`wn ref "raa%ery schools in England. EDUCATION. Mr. HENLEY, in the absence of Sir J. Pakingtoo, suffering from en t3Celi . e .t, gave ► otice that the ri4lit hen, harucet wont! nit be able to hi in.; on his motion on education on Thursday next. AIO REMAIN LAWS. Mr. HADFIELD asked the AC.orney-General whe iher it was intended t , ) bring in a bill to amend the inert main laws in E , gland, and to assimilate the laws there to those of Scltland and Ireland, and especially to give facilities to transactions for charitable institutions con nected with real, lerviehold, and copyhold estate, founded upon valuably consideration in money, rent, and other wise; and whether the same be by way of purchase, mortgage, lease, or otherwise howsoever ? The ATTORNEY-GENETZAL said that the Govern ment slid not intend to introduce any measure of the I kind this session. SUPERANNUATION ACT. bi . D. O'CONNELL asked the Chancellor of the Exchequer, when the Government would bring in the bill for the amendment of the Civil Service Superannua tion Act! The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER said that the report of the committee was under the considera tion of the Government, but they had not yet come t') the decision to introduce a bill on this subject. Certain questions had been submitted to the actuaries which had not yet been received. They were to be presented in a supplemental report which had not yet been laid before the house. MUNICIPAL BURGHS (SCOTLAND). Mr. BAXTER asked the Lord Advocate, if he in tended, this session, to introduce a permissive bill, pro viding for the extension of the Municipal boundaries of Burghs in Scotland ? The LORD-ADVOCATE said he intended to intro• duce such a measure, and pass it this session. HARBOURS OF THE UNITED KINGDOM. Mr. BAXTER asked the Secretary to the Treasury when he intended to move for the select committee to inquire into the harbours of the United Kingdom ? Mr. WILSON said he hoped to move the committee early next wek. THE CAPE. Major S. WORTLEY asked when, without in any way lessening the force at the Cape of Good Hope, it was the intention of the Government to remova the 6th, 45th, and 73d Regiments, whose period of colonial ser vice had expired some time, and to replace those regi ments with three others ! Lord PALMERSTON said the question was answered on a former occasion, viz., that though their term of service had expired, the requirements of the service would not permit their return home at present. The arrangements for moving troops, he thought, had better be left to the Government tha❑ discussed in that house. (Hear, hear.) STATUTE LAW COMMISSION. Mr. WARREN asked the First Lord of the Trea sury, whether any and what steps had been taken by the Government towards carrying out the recommenda tions cantained in the last report of the Statute Law Commission, and the views of the several witnesses examined before the committee of this house, appointed to consider the propositions in that report ; and whe ther an officer with a competent staff had been ap pointed, as proposed by the said committee, for the pur pose of attending to all bills referred to that officer, and reporting exactly to Parliament the state of the existing law, and how it would be affected by the proposed alte rations, and especially after a bill had passed through a committee to examine it and report immediately to the house what had Lean done by the committee, and whether that committee was to be reappointed ? Mr. BAINES said that the committee, on the dissolu tion of Parliament, reported the evidence taken, but (lid not make any recommendation. Considering the number of committees sitting and about to sit, the Statute Law Commission would not be reappointed. The Govern. ment had under their consideration the appointment of a Minister of Justice, and if that be done, much that the hon. and learned member asked would be matter for that functionary to consider. NAVAL OFFICERS.—GREENWICH HOSPITAL. Sir GEORGE BROOKE PECHELL inquired of the Secretary to the Treasury, whether the case of certain naval officers of Greenwich Hospital had been favourably considered, which was referred to the Treasury by the Board of Admiralty, praying they might be placed in the same position, with regard to the receipt of half pay, r.s other officers of that establishment ! Mr. WILSON said that only the governor and de puty-governor of Greenwich Hospital received half-pay in addition to their civil salaries. The case of the Chelsea officers was different, because the whole of the emoluments of the officers of Chelsea was less than the civil salaries of Greenwich Hospital. The Government did not intend to make any alterations in this matter. TRANSMISSION OF MAILS TO AUSTRALIA. Mr. ADDERLEY asked the Secretary of State for the Colonies, whether any and what arrangements had been made for the transmission of mails to and from the Australian colonies, including the branch services to South Australia, Vaa Diemen's Land, and New L-30,- land ; and if not, what steps were being taken by her Majesty's Government towards completing the same Mr. WILSON said that arrangements were made for the conveyance of these mails, and carried into effect, in August last, to the satisfaction of the Governmen'. Two branch mails were to have been established under the contract, between Melbourne and Tasmania on the one hand, and New Zealand on the other, but it had not been carried out, owing to a misapprehension. Instruc tions, however, had been sent to the local authorities to carry them into effect. THE SUN, LONEON, TUESDAY EVENING, JUNE 9, OATHS BILL. On the motion for the second reading of this bill, three petitions were presented from synagogues in favour of the bill. The bill was then read a second time without oppos tion, and ordered to be committed on Monday next. THE CIVIL SERVICE. Viscount GODERICH on the motion for going into committee of supply on the Civil Service Estimates called the attention of the house to the last report of the civil service commissioners, and to the present system of admission to the civil service. The noble viscount referred to the report of last year, to which he called their atten tion last session, as well as to the speech of the right hon. gentleman the Chancellor of the Exchequer on that occasion, which induced him (Viscount Goderich) to withdraw his motion, from an impression that a great change was to be effected in this branch of the service, and said that, after reading the report laid on the table of the house this year, he felt much disappointment to find that no ad7ance had been made in the right direc tion, that of open competition. The noble viscount, who was less audible thanusual, read avariety of extracts from the reports in support of his views. In pass ing, he remarked that he found the examiners of the nomination of the right hon. gentleman the member for Wells (Slr. Hayter) in the Excise and Customs, ap peared to be less stringent than in other departments. (Laughter.) He had no desire to urge the Government to adopt hastily any extended system, but that they should progress and not retrograde. He had no desire to take the subject out of the hands of the Government, but if he considered the answer of the Government unsatisfactory, he should take an early opportunity of again bringing the subject forward. (Hear, hear.) Mr. BASS wished to know who had the power of nominating or recommending persons for the civil service, and on a former occasion when he asked for in formation, he was referred to the commissioners reports. He had examined them very carefully, but ke had been unable to find what he required, which was of great interest to the public. He asked for an ex)la nation if offices were filled up by patronage as in for.ner times, or by examination, and if so, what was the course to be adopted ? Mr. RICH supported the movement headed by Vis count Goderich, and expressed a belief that there must be some insuperable objection that prevented the Chan cellor of the Exchequer from carrying out competitive examinations. Out of 376 vacancies that occurred last year, 66 were given away on competitions. Of these 43 were given in the first six months, and but 23 in the last 6 months. The remaining 310 were given away on nomi nations. In the first 6 months the number of persons competing was 41 to each appointment, and in the last 6 months the average competing only amounted to three to each appointment. Mr. MALINS said that a short time ago a young gentleman applied to him for a nomination, stating that he was desirous of submitting to an examination, and that members of Parliament could nominate. He told the young man that he did not understand what necessity there was for a nomination if the examination was to be open to the world. He however gave him a nomination, which was returned in a few days, with the intimation that it was of no use, and the young man then inquired where he was to apply for a nomination. He told the young man that he was unable to give him the least in formation upon the subject, and from that time to this had been unable to ascertain how a nomination was to be obtained. If a nomination could not be obtained without Government influence, the result would be that there would be no such thing as a real competitive examina tion. He trusted the restriction would be removed, and that those who desired to submit to an examination would be allowed to do so without having any such diffi culties thrown is their way. The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER said the hon. and learned gentleman was so accomplished a law yer, was so well acquainted with all branches of civil jurisprudence, and so well versed in acts of parliament and all other sources of law, that he should have thought it highly improbable to be asked by the hon. and learned gentleman for information which ought to be within his own knowledge. (A. laugh.) The order is council, issued two years ago, regulating the examinations for admission into the civil service, made no alteration in the power of the crown with respect to nominations for the civil service. When a proposition was made that all situations in the gift of the crown in the civil service should be open to competition it was explained that such was not the effect of the order in council, but that the power of nomination vested in the crown re mained (untouched—that it was part of the preroga tive of the crown to make the appointments and fix the salaries, which were afterwards voted by parlia ment. With regard to the principal departments— such as those of the Secretary of State and the Admi ralty—the nomination was by usage vested in the head of the department. The nominations in the revenue depart ment, the audit board, and some other boards rested with the heal of the Government for the time being. Such was the usage with respect to the civil service, and he should have thought the hon. and learned member re quired no information on that point. That would also be a sufficient answer to the question put by the hon. member for Derby (Mr. Bass) a few days ago. On a former occasion he (the Chancellor of the Exchequer) expressed an opinion that it was not desirable that em ployments in administrative departments should be thrown open to public competition. Such a proposition at one time received the approbation of the public, but the Government thought it would not be an expedient mode of filling up vacancies, and proposed that all per sons entering should be subjected to an examination, to te-t their efficiency. That examination had been conducted by efficient pereons, and the results were embodied in the reports. It had been asserted that the Government had pursued a retrogressive course, and had lost a portion of the advantage they had at one time gained. Now, so far as regarded the execution of the order in coune,p, and the examination of candid a tes fo r the civ i l service; there had been no retrogression, and the system Lad been enforced with great strictness and re.u , larity. The numb er o f candidates registered in the first' half-ye.ar had been 29 per cent., and in the secood half year it amounted to as much as 38 per cent. What he had stated was a proof that the system was efficient ; and the answer which he bad given would aptly to the whole ofi the system established under the order in council; The Government had not only never probssed any intention to ibtrodtwo a tlsteeu of open competition, but they Lai, on every occasion when the subject was introduced, ex pressed their objection to that system. The real practical matter at issue between the noble lord and the Govern ment was, to what extent the plan of voluntary competi tion amongst the limited number of candidates selected by the heads of departments should be carried. What he stated last year was, that it did not appear to him that the system of competition could be applied with advan tage to that class of officers in the civil service who per formed for the most part mere mechanical duties—such as watching, and duties of mere trust ; but that with re gard to clerks and other officers in the inferior depart ments, in whose cases a liberal education was expected, a competitive examination amongst a limited number of candidates, chosen.by the head of the department, would be conducive to the public interest. His noble friend now at the head of the Treasury had acted on that principle, and had found the system work satisfactorily. With re gard to the diminished number of competitive examina tions during the last half-year, he was not aware that such bad been the fact ; but he presumed that it had arisen from some accidental variation in the number of vacancies. The system had been adopted by the Trea sury, the War Department, the Home Department, the Colonial Department, the Board of Trade— A❑ HoN. MEMBER—Not the Board of Trade. The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER—WeII, the Board of Works and some other boards. The heads of these different departments had voluntarily adopted the system. His noble friend had not felt himself justified in making it compulsory ; but it had been recommended as the practice of the Treasury, and a majority of the supe rior departments had carried it out. That mode of filling up vacancies had led on the whole to the choice of can didates most qualified for the public service, and most likely to discharge their duties in a satisfactory manner. The Government did not intend to laydown any inflexible rule on the subject, or to depart from the order in coun cil. The manner in which the appointments had been made had proved to be satisfactory, and in taking a general view of the manner in which the system had been administered he believed the house would come to the conclusion that a great and important advance with respect to the nomination of candidates to the public service had taken place since the first introduction of the order in council. (Hear.) Colonel SYKES thought the heads of the departments ought to place a portio❑ of the patronage to public com petition. The system of nomination must necessarily be 'neffective. He was quite satisfied there would never be a want of competition, for he knew many instances of lieutenant-colonels and others on half-pay competing for offices not of the most dignified nature, the salaries of which did not exceed 601. or 701. a year. Mr. VANSITTART wished to know on what prin. ciple the Government granted or refused nominations for candidates ? The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER—On the ground of efficiency. (Laughter.) THE ITALIAN LEGION. Mr. M. MILNES rose to put a question to her Ma jesty's Government respecting the engagement entered into with the Argentine Confederation for the reception and employment of a certain number of the officers and soldiers of the Italia❑ Legion, and to ask whether the authorities of the Argentine Confederation have adhered to the stipulations of that agreement ! At the conclu sion of the war the Government made certain arrange ments by which a portion of the foreign soldiers employed by this country were sent to the Cape and to Canada. An offer was made to the Italian troops, and a document was issued by the War-office which offered them some remarkable inducements. They were told that Parana was a perfect paradise, that it produced enormous quan tities of fruit of every kind—that ice was a thing alto gether unknown—that butter and beef could be bought for a penny a pound ; but beyond all these recommen dations there was another perhaps still more attractive, for they wore told that the women were remarkably handsome—(laughter)—extremely industrious, and a great many of them without husbands. (Continued laughter.) The troops were told that they would re ceive a considerable portion of territory at a very mode rate rent. The result was that a considerable number of the men belonging to the Italian Legion accepted the offer ; but he understood that the arrangement had not been properly carried out, and that, instead of finding themselves in a flourishing colony, they were wandering over the country in a state of great destitution. He wished to know whether these men were actually in the condition which he had described. Sir J. RAMSDEN thought the explanation which he was about to offer would satisfy the house that there bad bee❑ no breach of faith, either o❑ the part of her Ma. jAsty'i Government or the Argentine Confederation. At the conclusion of the war the Italian Legion was dis banded at Malta. A considerable number of the men re turned to their homes, but the remainder, amounting to rather more than 1,000, were not allowed to do so. They were then brought to England, in order that they might avail themselves of the opportunity of going to North America or the Cape of Good Hope. Shortly after their arrival in this country negotiations were entered into with their government. and 700 •f them were allowed to return to Italy. At that time an agent of the Argentine Confederation was endeavouring to procure a number of emigrants, and he applied to the Government to induce them to use their influence with the men who had not obtained permission to return to their country. The Government declined taking any part in the transaction, and referred the agent to the men themselves. His terms were accepted by 350 of those persons, and they were sent out in two vessels. On the arrival of the first vessel at Parana the men disembarked, and found w ages extremely high, not less than from 4s, to ss. per day. They were to have a grant of 28 acres, with 61 a day for the first year, 4d. a day for the second, and 2d. a day for the third. Finding they could obtain so large a re muneration for their labour they applied to be released from their original terms. The Government complied with their req lest, and two thirds of them were released, the other third determined to look at the place where the land was which had been allotted to them. They found it much further off than they had expected, and applied to be all - iwed to return to Parana. Some of them went on shore ; they refnsed to proceed further, and demanded their liberty. This of course was granted them immediately, and therefore it was entirely of their own accord that these men had been released from their stipulations, and not by any compulsion on the part of the Government. He might state that he had seen a let ter from an English gentleman who had lived a great number of years in the Argentine territory, and he stated that the wages of unskilled labourers there was from 4s. to ss. a day. THE OATHS BILL. Sir F. THESIGER said that he wag anxious, for the information of the house, to inform them of the course which he intended to take with regard to the Oaths Bill. In accordance with the intimation he had given be had offered no opposition to the second reading of the bill, but he was apprehensive, from the cheering which had accompanied the second reading, that there might be some misapprehension, and he therefore wished to state that in committee he should move to add to the oath these words :—" And I make this renunciation, abjuration, and declaration willingly and truly, on the true faith of a Christian." ALDERSHOT. Sir F. SMITH said, having been second in command at Aldershot, he was aLxious to show that some of the statements made the other evening about the en campment there were incorrect, and he wrote to Gen. Knollys, the commander of the camp, who had written him in reply a statement of the condition of the camp and of the employment of the troops. The honourable and gallant officer then proceeded to read extracts from the letter, to the effect that it was not true that the troops were not taught to pitch their tents, as they had been under canvas as long as the weather permitted. Cooking in the field formed part of the training. A class of officers were instructed in military sketching, and forts were constructed on the banks of the canal. All the roads lately finished had been completed by the soldiers. With regard to the state of the huts there was only one hut in the whole camp out of repair.. The whole of the gravel had been spread by the troops. Then the Barrack master wrote and said, with reference to the huts, there was not the least appearance of decay ; they were light, airy, and wholesome ; there was but one instance of any of them having given way ; the roofs were water tight, and would last many years. The SPEAKER then left the chair, and the house went into c )mmittee. The fist vote was 151,744/., to make up the sum of 227,711/. 2d. 9d. for the educational and scientific branches. Cu!. NORTH said there were many items in vote No. 12 on which he should be happy to have the opportunity of addressing the house. Sir J. RA. - MSDEN said the hon. and gallant officer would have an opportunity of making any remarks he might think fit on that vote when the report brought up. Mr. RICH called attention to the charges made for youths at the Royal Military College at Sandhurst. A committee sat on that subject two or three years ago, and it was stated that the total cost for education there, including all branches, was 801. a-year. It appeared, however, that they charged all but the sons of officers 1251. a-year, which, with extra charges, made it 1501. Ilc thought that was a hardship.. Mr. HENLEY remarked that be had the same objec tion to this vote that he stated the other night to No. 12. The hon. and gallant member for Caine the other night, after enumerating the various advantages supposed to be derived from Aldershot, went on to state the disadvan tages oar generals laboured uuder compared with French or Russian generale. He stated that if a Russian or a French general wanted to wiite a despatch be could ac company it with a sketch of the ground, but an English general had no one about him who could make a sketch. He (Mr. Henley) could not eay whether that was true ; but it was stated by a rnibtary man of some reputation, and if it were true all he (Mr. Henley) had to say was, that the nation had been expending a great many mil lions of money, and had not got their worth for it. So far as the vote itself welit, he had NO objection to it, but he thought it would be desirable that things so distinct as the ordnance survey and the salaries of instructors should he kept distinct in the votes. Mr. BLACK bro aght forward the claims of the Scotch military academy at Edinburgh, which he said had produced many geed officers who bad served in the Cri• mea. He thought Government ought to sanction the in stitution. Forty :loturnissions were given yearly to Sand hurst ; they might grant to the Edinburgh academy one commission yearly. Major W. 3 .RBURTON observed that in every other country except Ours admission to the staff of the army was only t , ) be obtained by severe competition. In our country tnere was a remarkable contrast to this state of things. Out of 216 who bad obtained certificates in tb• senior •Department at Sandhurst, only 15 were employed on the staff' during the late war. Appointments to the staff should be (span to competition among officers of a certain rank, lie hoped at any rate that they would wipe away the reproach that in our army idleness might be int lulged in without remark, and that energy, genius, and ability met with no reward. Mr, E. ELLICE, jun., agreed iu the observation that it was inconvenient to have so many items in one vote, but at the same time it was not his intention to move any reduction in the ordnance survey, as he did last year. His opinion remained the same, but the house did not agree with him. He believed that Government was opposed to the expense, but the house backed up certain members who were interested in that survey. The house decided last year that they would have a survey on a scale of 25 inches to the mile. The com mittee recommedned a vote of 50,0001. a year for ten years, but he found the vote Ibis year had been reduced to 130,0001. He hoped, though it might appear in opposition to what he had already said, that the survey would be got on with, in order that they might have an ordnance survey completed for Scotland some time in the course of their lives. He had a return, which he had moved for, showing what had been expended, and what was going to be. The aggregate was 963,000/ , but the report of the committee last year put it down at 917,000/ , so that there was an increase of 46,0001.1 Then he found that last year the progress in Scotland was 407,000 acres out of 20 millions. He warned the house that this survey would cost enormous sums, and that if they did not mind they would have what Sir C. Trevelyan aimed at, not only a survey on the 25. inch scale for Scotland, but also for England and Ireland. which woul I cost six or seven millions, and would involve a new department to revise the surveys every two ye trs. Sir F. WILLIAMS, referring to some observations made on a previous evening by Mr. Henley, said there were no doubt officers in the British army quite able to make plans. There were always such persons to be found on the bead Quartermaster• General's staff ; but there was not attached to our army, as there was to the foreign services, a topographical corps, who might be detached with any major-general or brigadier -general, to draw for him a sort of comprehensive plan, without which no re port, whether in writing or by word of mouth, could be completely intelligible. He (the gallant general) hoped that in the reconstruction of the staff a corps of this kind might be formed ; and also that officers intended for the staff might be expected to pass a year in each branch of the service, so that they might become practically ac quainted with each arm. He agreed, too, with the right hon. gentleman that soldiers ought to be employed in the works at Aldershot. Those works were a part of their businsis, and they ought not to receive extra pay, which only led to drinking and insubordination. He hoped like wise that the soldiers, while in the camp, would be taught to make gabions and to tie fascines ; that they would be employed in sapping ; and, in short, that they would be instructed in all matters relating to field fortifi cation. If that were done, he. was perfectly certain that England would never regret any cost it might entail. Sir D. NORREYS, returning to the question of the survey of Scotland, suggested that the debate should be taken on bringing up the report, and that on that occa sion the discussion should be a complete and final one. Mr. WEGUELIN directed the attention of Govern ment to the engraving department of the Ordnance-office which he said was not in a satisfactory condition. Sir J. RAMSDEN assented to Sir D. Norrey's pro posal. With regard to the education of staff officers, and indeed, of military officers generally, in field fortification, be could assure the house that the subject had engaged the most careful attention of Government. In corrobora tion of that remark he might refer to the general order issued from the Horse Guards some time ago, in which it was directed that after Jan. 1 next no officers should be appointed to the staff without passing an examination with regard to all the branches of the service. At present an officer went down to Aldershot several days every week to give instructions to officers in strategy, making re connaissances, and things of that nature. He (Sir J. Rsmsden) was happy to add that more officers were de sirous of receiving instruction from that gentleman than he could receive. (Hear.) Mr. W. WILLIAMS hoped the question would not be postponed. No time was so suitable as the present, and the question was one of great importance—a ques tion between 250,0001. and above a million of money. Lord ELCHO, on the other hand, supported the pro posal for postponement. In answer to Mr. WiLunts, Sir J. RAMSDEN said that nearly the whole of the. cultivated districts south of the Forth and Ciyde were now surveyed on the 25-inch scale ; and it was intended to proceed with the rest of the cultivated districts on that scale. Sir H. VERNEY expressed himself strongly against the unsystematic manner in which the survey of the country had been carried on. They had been promised a uniform survey on the 8 inch scale, which would have served :or all the railways and other great public works. That plan was rejected, and no less than two millions and a half had been spent on surveys for the purposes of the Tithe Commissioners. He protested against the 25-inch scale as unnecessary and extravegant. Mr. E. ELLICE (St. Andrew's) said the hon. baronet was in error when he said that all the cultivated districts south of the Forth had been surveyed on the 25-inch scale. In point of fact four or five of the most important coun ties in the south had been surveyed on the six inch scale; and . the work would require to be done over again. (Hear, hear.) The LORD-ADVOCATE deprecated the continuance of the conversation if the subject was really to be dis cussed on a future occasion. Sir W. JOLLIFFE said it argued a great want of common sense to go on making surveys on a large scale of districts in Scotland, of which no one wanted maps, to neglect districts in England of which there would be a scale of the maps large; enough to remunerate the Go ♦ernment for their preparation. Lord ELCHO defended the 25-inch scale, and invited the house, by way of preparation for the postponed de bate, to study the blue books of 1854 and 185 G. Mr. WYLD recommended that the surveys should be made a great scientific school for the army. That was done in foreign services, and the consequence was, that those services were greatly superior in topographical skill to our own. During the last war the Government was actually indebted to the gentlemen who went out to con struct the railway for a really good chart of the ground before Sebastopol. He recommended, therefore, that officers of the army should be allowed to volunteer to ac company the surveyors, and that their expenses should be included in the cost of the work. Sir F. SMITH could assure the hon. gentleman that the plan would fail. What was wanted for a work of this kind was not pupils, but persons of experience. Sir W. CODRINGTON said that experienced persons were no doubt required for the public surveys, but that was no reason why officers should not be allowed to ac c)ropany them for the purposes of instruction and prac tice. The hon. gentleman must be in error as to what be had stated about Sebastopol. A very accurate plan was made by an officer of the 23d, then on the Quartermas ter-General's staff, and that plan was the foundation of all that was done. No doubt greater education was de sirable, not only in officers of the staff, but in all officers; but in comparing our service with foreign ones allowance should be made ter the difference of circumstances. With us the staff was composed of regimental officers, abroad the staff was a department separate in every respect (Hear.) Referring to what bad fallen from Sir F. Wil liams, t h e gallant gent'e man sai d t h at a topographic corps would be an important addition to the army. No doubt there were very competent persons on the Quar termaster-General's staff, but they had other things to attend to besides mere map -making. Mr. E WART wished to know when the Government measures of military education would be brought forward Mr. WYLD said that it was notorious that our officers possessed less shill in drawing plans than was found in the French, Russian, Austrian, and Prussian armies. If a war were again to break out not a third of our officers would be able to make a reconnaissance, and to bring the general a plan of the ground. General WYNDHAM would admit that our officers were not so au fait in such matters as were those of foreign services. Still, during the last war, the best plans were made by British officers. (Hear.) Sir J. RAMSDEN said the education of officers had engaged the most serious attention of the Government. In the report of the recent commi,sion their first recom mendation, and the one on which they laid most stress, was that a board or council should be appointed to con sider the whole question of military education. A coun cil had accordingly been appointed, and bad been di rected to draw up a scheme. The points on which they were more particularly requested to give their opinion were these : first, the examination to which candidates for their first commission should be subjected ; secondly, the examination which officers should pass through pre vious to promotion up to the grade of captain ; and, lastly, the qualifications required for the staff. As soon as the council had drawn up their scheme it would be submitted to Parliament. The vote was then agreed to. The following votes were also agreed to :- 17,3051, rewards for distinguished service, &c. 41,994/ , pay of general officers, not being colonels of regiments or battalions. 3 7 8 ,7061., full pay of reduced and retired officers. 127,3781., pensions to widows of officers, and allow ances on the compassionate list. 39,8631., pensions, gratuities, and allowances to offi cers for wounds. On this vote, Colonel NORTH observed that officers who were seri ously wounded, if the wound were not equivalent to the loss of a limb, were not considered entitled to a pension. Many had been ob,iged to quit the service on this account. He hoped that an alteration would be made in this respect. Mr. W. WILLIAMS complained that it was impos• sible for members to keep pace with the rate at which these estimates were voted; some of them comprising a great number of items. It would be bettor if the chair man would announce the number of the vote. Lord A. V. TEMPEST referred to the case of the wounded officers, and pressed for an answer from the hen baronet. Sir J. RAMSDEN said this was a most complicated question. In regulations of this kind some definite line must be drawn, and it was not prudent to step over it. These regulations had been in force for a great number of years, and could not be altered without reconsidering the whole system. The suggestion would be considered, but he could not on the moment promise any alteration. Sir C. NAPIER said the line laid down was a very hard line, and the sooner it was altered the better. An officer might receive a wound which would permanently affect his health, though he did not lo7e a limb, and yet he got no pension at all. If these regulations were formed on those of the navy, they were formed on a very bad model. (Laughter.) By an order in c. , uncil, the Queen had power to grant pensions for severe wounds. The officers of the army had done their duty well, but they had not been sufficiently cared for. It an officer got wounded twice in his thigh he got a pen sion ; but if he received one wound in each thigh he got nothing. What could he more absurd than that I Lord PALMERSTON said it was most desirable that the Government should have power to grant pensions in the cas es re f erre d to ; b u t it was most essential that the regulations s h ou ld b e such as to remove all ground for suspecting partiality. The loss of a limb was a clear and defined case ? if they were to go beyond that, it would be impossible to draw a line which would be EatWactcry. And why should incapacity from a wound. • entitle to a pension more than incapacity from disease ? Besides, an officer serving abroad might, under these circumstances, be entitled to a pension, which could not be claimed by an officer at home. He thought that any alteration would give rise to great dissatisfaction. Sir C. NAPIE l?, repeated that the Government bad not acted up to the regulation which empowered her Majesty to grant pensions in the cases referred to. After a few words from Colonel NORTH and Lord A. V. TEMPEST, Mr. ROEBUCK said the evil arose from a pre conceived rule, instead of each case being judged by it self. The real question was whether a wound disabled a man. A man who lost his arm was still fit for service ; one who was shot in the lungs was not. Surely the lat ter was entitled to a pension as well as the former. He appealed to the patriotism of the house in favour of such men. Mr. BRISCOE advocated an alteration of the system. Lord PALMERSTON said that each case was consi dered on its merits, but the merits of each case were measured by the regulations. Were it otherwise, there would be sure to be a clamour raised against the decision. There was no way of deciding these questions but by a fixed standard. In any case where an officer was so se verely wounded as to be unfit for service at home or abroad, he clnceived that a pension would be granted. Mr. ROEBUCK said that the loss of a limb could never be equivalent to the loss of the eyes. The rule was a bad one whieh made the loss of a limb the only condi tion of a Sir W. CODRINGTON said there was a separate consideration of each case by the medical board, but he still complained of the rigidity of the rule. The officer ought to have a discretion and to use it honestly. Sir C. NAPIER said no change of the law was neces sary. All he wanted was to see the regulation carried out by which her Majesty had reserved to herself the right of granting pensions in cases where they were fat to be deserved. Admiral WALCOTT said the house ought to know the instructiocs on which the medical board decided on these eases. Sir J. RAMSDEN said these regulations were corn prised in the War-office regulations, which were in the hands of every officer. Mr. ROEBUCK again referred to the case of officers who lost Weir eyesight, and asked whether the loss of both legs was considered more than the loss of one ? Lord PALMERSTON said it was impossible to say what class of injury was the most severe ; that depended on circumstances. It was impossible to make a regula tion to meet all individual cases. Lord A. V. TEMPEST said the law of pensions was now so uncertain that officers did not know whether they were entitled to a pension or not. He hoped Govern ment would promise their early consideration to the matter. Sir J. RAMSDEN said that officers who bad been seriously wounded, but had not lost a limb, received a year's pay as gratuity. At the end of that time, if the in jury continued, it was renewed. Lord A. V. TEMPEST referred to a case in his own knowledge, where an officer bad received a year's pay, but did not know whether it would be continued. Sir W. CODRINGTON advocated a greater discre tionary power being vested in the medical board. The vote was then agreed to. 20,841/. Chelsea and Kilmainham Hospitals. Sir C. NAPIER asked whether the major and adju tant of Chelsea Hospital received their half-pay in addi tion to their salary t Sir J. RAMSDEN said he was not prepared to answer the question then, but would make inquiry. Mr. W. WILLIAMS referred to the large charge for Kilmainham Hospital, which bad only 142 inmates, and 44 of them were officers of the institution. Col. NORTH thought, as one-half nearly of our army was composed of Irishmen, it was not too much that an asylum should be provided fur them. He believed the pensioners in Kilmainham were comfortable, and if not they could leave it. Mr. WILLIAMS did not say they were uncomfort able, but contended that they would be better provided at half the cost if the money were given to them to live with their friends. The vote was agreed to, as were 776,6881. forbout-pen sioners, and 83,0001. for superannuation allowances were also voted to complete the sum required for the year. On the motion that the resolutions be reported to the house, Mr. LOCKE complained of the excess in the charge for the Hospital at Netley, as compared with the original estimate. The estimate, as submitted to the House of Commons was 150,000/. ; and now they were told that there was an excess of 110,0001., making the total cost 260,0001., for an hospital to accommodate 1,000 persons, or at the rate of 2601. per man, a sum for which a good 15/. or 201. house might be built. He wished to know whether it was intended to proceed with this costly building 1 Sir J. RAMSDEN explained that when it was first determined to erect the hospital in question a sum was put down in the estimates for it, estimated upon the average cost of building such institutions according to the old plan or at the rate of 1501. a man ; but before any further steps were taken, a commission of medical and scientific authorities were consulted, who recom mended considerable modifications were necessary. This increased the expense. When the proposition was ori ginally submitted to Parliament these improvements were not contemplated. Government did intend to pro ceed with the construction of the hospital. Admiral WALCOTT threw out a suggestion that the ordnance and other warl►ke stores now at Woolwich ehocld be distributed at Portsmouth, Plymouth, and other pl tees. Sir J. TRELAWNY believed that the modern hospi tali in Scotland cost at the rate of 401. a man; but here was a hospital that cost 2601. a man. Thelmotion was then agreed to, and the house resumed, the resolutions being ordered to be reported on Thursday. The resolution payed by theconsmittee of supply on the army estimates on Friday, was brought up and agreed to. 1857. THE SOUND DUES. The resolution of the committee of the whole house on this subject was brought up and confirmed, and a bill for the redemption of those dues by the payment of 1,125,2061. was ordered to be brought in. JOINT STOCK COMPANIES BILL. The bill passed through committee, the clauses being agreed to without discussion. FRAUDULENT TRUSTEES, 44c., BILL. Oa the order of the day for the second reading of this bill, Mr. Sergeant BINGLA.ICE said it was not his inten tion in any way to impede the progress of the bill ; on the contrary, he earnestly desired to give it his fullest support. There was no doubt that in its general com plexion the bill was a good one ; at the same time, from one or two of its provisions he felt bound to dissent. The clause in the bill to which primarily be wished to direct attention was that which dealt for the first time with what were termed ordinary breaches of trust, not breaches of trust on the part of bankers, but of ordinary trustees, with respect to the management of property, He might state as a fact, that there were nothing so varied in their aspect as breaches of trust. A trustee, for example, might commit a breach of trust by lending money to his own cestui que trust, although no loss might nitimately accrue to the estate. Now, that was a breach of trust which the House of Commons would be but little inclined to punish. Again, a trustee might com mit a breach of trust by using money for his individual purposes, although in the result the property might not suffer. That, too, was a species of breach of trust which the house would be rather indisposed to punish. On the other hand, there was the case of a trustee using money for his own purposes that might icadvertantly bring down ruin and distress upon the person whom be ought to have protected. Now his principal cause of complaint against the present bill was, that while it at tacked the fraud it did not attempt to interdict the act which the source and origin of that fraud. He would, therefore, ask would it not be wise to insert a clause in the bill declaring that where a trustee employed monies for his own advantage, and it should turn out the estate lost by the transaction in case he was not able to make good the deficiency, that then he should be sub jetted to the criminal law of the country. For years past he had been familiar with the administration of the criminal law of the country, and he knew well therefore, how difficult it was to define what was meant by the term with intent to commit a fraud. But that very want of preciseness would bang in terror over trustec', and the result would be that every sensitive man in the country would throw up his trusts. Under the 12th clause of the bill no prosecution could be undertaken without the sanction of one of the judges of the superior courts of common law or equity, or that of the learned Attorney General. Now that was a provision which he thought most objectionable. He did not know whether the judges themselves had been consulted on the point ; but he had, at all events, strong reasons for thinking that the great majority of them would be very strongly disinclined to have such a task put upon them. A judge must not be a judge in his own mind without prejudice, but in the eyes of his country he must be above suspicion. He ventured to offsr those views as suggestions to the Attorney General. He hoped that his hon. and learned friend woad introduce a clause preventing trustees from using the fuods of the ecstui que trusts, so that in the event of any losses being in curred, which could not be made up, the parties should be made liable to punishment. There was no duty, how ever onerous, connected with the fut;ictions of our judges which they were not anxious to discharge. It would, he thought, be very hard to impose such a duty as this measure involved upon them. (Hear.) Mr. NEATE said he could not understand why the members of the house, forming the bank committee, should be precluded from entering into the question of private trusts. It wa s muc h b etter to preven t th ose crimes from being committed, than to punish theca after they had been committed. He would suggest to the bank committee, whether they ought not to recommend all bank directors to keep their accounts in such a way as to render them open and intelligible to all whom they concerned. Mr. ROLT said the bill dealt with several cla7ses of offences—cffecces by bankers, brokers, and other agents, and offences by joint-stock companies. Ile wished to illustrate the obj-c'Aons be enter tained to the measure in reference to that part which proposed to deal with offences of trustees. He thought that as the measure was, it would infallibly lead to the preventing of gentlemen of character and sta tion from accepting the duties of complicated trusts, and it would, therefore, be throwing those offices upon per sons of an inferior station, or of some legal tribunal, or of some department of the government, and which of those alternatives was the worst he did not pretend to say. The gist of the offencc3 on the part of trustees was this—the appropriation of money or other property by any p:rson who merely held such property for the bene fit of other parties. Now, it should be observed that there was not one ease out of 100 in which this apprc priation did not take place with the hope of the offend log party being able tp replace the money taken on tha morrow—in a week, a month, or some other fixed time. i But it was not intended by the government that the re storation of the property should remove the offence, if it could he ever proved. Let them but consider the cases to which this bill wool.? apply. The offences cf appro priating the money of another to our own use, and that of appropriating stock or chattel property, are quite dif ferent in their character. If in the first instance the party become unable to repay it he became criminally insolvent; and the law was strong enough to punish him. He ob jected to take such cases out of the category of those of fences that were already dealt with in a special manner. He would take the case of a trustee whose duty it was to collect money, and whose further duty was not to in vest it until he obtained a certain amount, or until upon a given day. Well, then, that person lodges such money in the bank as ho was bound to do. In the outset he a would say that in 99 cases out of every 100, the most innocent person would place such money with his own in the bank. There would, morally speaking, be no criminality in that, and yet by this bill it would be considered a breach of trust. The next step that would follow would be this—he draws upon the banker and appl es that money to his own purposes, expecting to be Ale to replace it in a few days by certain securities which he holds. The securities fail—he becomes a grossly criminal insol vent. But how venial was the offence of such a man compared to the individual who rashly speculates or gambles with the money of another party ? Ho would would tette another case. A man engaged in trade makes his will with the full expectation that his pro perty will be realised. His death happens earlier than usual. The trust is that the assets should be realised and divided between the adult and younger members of his family. Those adults were also the trustee', who feel that if they deal with the property literally as they were told, it would only realise a few hundreds, whereas if they carry on the trade some time longer it would r thousands. But this bill would treat those par. es as offenders guilty of a breach of trust. Now he (Kr. li.) asked what sensible man, under such circumstances, would take a tru-t with such a charge hanging over him ? On the whole it appeared to him that the mea snre required anxious and careful consideration. If those objectionable features be not remedied in committee he was satisfied that it would lead to some general trust board being established ; perhaps the Board of Trade might take cognisance of those duties. (Laughter.) He would be glad to assist in rendering it as perfect a mea sure as possible, so that it would realty have the effect of preventing fraudulent persons from enjoying the fruits of their offences. (Hear, hear ) The ATTORNEY-GENERAL admitted that a bill of this importance required the most scrupulous and careful consi aeration. Although he was willing to ad mit the great eloquence of his hon. and learned friend, he confessed he was quite unable to comprehend his meaning. The learned sergeant had lectured them upon a somewhat fan.iliar text, that prevention was better than cure ; and eald that they should inter dict the sources of crime. Now he (the Attorney- General) could not exactly understand the word. He could not see bow they were to interdict the sources of crimes of this nature except by putting altogether a stop to the relations between a trustee and a cestui quo trust. So long as there were guardians, there must be trustees. So long as a dying man commits to some rela tion the trust of his children, and with them his pro perty—so long of necessity there must be those relations and connections. Now, if the learned serjeant would only try his band at legislation on this subject himself, and would embody in his measure his interdict of the sources of crime, he (the Attorney -General) would be most happy to consider well its details, and if he suc ceeded in his object the world at large would treat him as a great benefactor (Laughter.) The house would re member in how many statutes it had been provided that the sanction of one of the judges or one of the law offi cers of the Crown should be given as a preliminary to the institution of any criminal proceedings. The hen. and learned member bad spoken of the bill as brought in on the spur of the moment, under the influence of recent events. But this blot on our jurisprudence had long engaged attention ; and that this bill did not owe its origin to present events was clear from the fact that the existing law bad proved sufficient to meet the cases which had lately created so much scandal. He ad mitted the difficulties of the subject ; but the evil which existed was one for the removal of which there was the most pressing need, and he did hope that they would not be deterred from an attempt •,to legislate by the mere presence of difficulties. He admitted that the language, or even the provisions, of the bill, might re quire amendment in committee, but he trusted that it would eventually leave that house one worthy to be added to the legislation of the country, and an effective mode of redressing a great and oppressive evil, and a great opprobrium to the jurisprudence of the country. (Cheers.) The bill was then read a second time, and ordered to be committed on Friday. GENERAL BOARD OF HEALTH BILL. This bill was read a second time. SAVINGS' BANKS BILL. On the motion that this bill be read a second time, Mr. A. TURNER said that the bill was of so much importance to Manchester that he wished to offer a few observations upon it. The establishment of savings banks had been a great advantage to the industrious classes, and he thought that the security of Government should be extended to all depositors in them. There was a mutual obligation existing between Government and savings banks ; for if the one gave the benefit of se• curity, the other afforded a fund of 55,000,0001. or 36,000,000/., which placed an immense financial power in the hands of the Government, which they had not hesitated to use. The Government was about to give additional security to savings banks, and it was neces sary that they should have some power of irspection over them. But they might go too far, and unnecessa rily interfere with well ordered banks. He might in stance the cases of the Dullin and Rochdale Banks, in which the Government officers ought to have found out the deficiencies which existed much sooner than they had. In the instance of the Manchester Savings Bank, its affairs were administered in a matter quite satisfac tory to the depositors ; and in such cases there should not be any unnecessary interference on the part of Go vernment officers. He knew that the present Chancellor of the Exchequer, and the present Comptroller-General, did not wish to interfere unnecessarily in the manage ment of savings banks ; but there were clauses in this bill which gave large powers, and which future Chancellors of the Exchequer and future Comptrollers General might use unnecessarily. He should have wished that the bill had been referred to a select committee, but he should notoppose the second reading. He wished that the Chancellor of the Exchequer would give expression pub licly, as he had in private, that it was not his intention to interfere with well-managed savings banks. Mr. GROGAN was glad that the important subject of savings banks had-been seriously taken in hand by Go• vernment. The depositors would now have the security of the Government for the repayment of their deposits, but he trusted there would be no unnecessary interfer ence on the part of the Government with the managers of these institutions. The Government ought to ar range a scale of salaries and a rate of interest, but be yond that they ought not to go. (Hear.) Mr. MAGUIRE said the bill was popular in Ireland. For his own part, he was willing to allow the Govern ment a little tyranny if it would only preserve the pro perty of honest labour from the hands of rascally officials. (Hear ) The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER had had no other object but to promote tire interests of the depositors. (Hear, hear.) It was admitted on all hands that the present state of the law with reference to sav ings banks was unsatisfactory, for the responsibility of managers and trustees which once t xlsted had been re moved, and no substitute had as yet been provided for it. (Hear, hear.) Unquestionably he (Sir G. Lewis) had not thought of interfering with the legitimate influence of the managers and trustees, or to diminish their aseful labours. All that he had wished was to guard the in terests of tIA public exchequer; with that view he had felt it his duty to propose a certain control over paid officers. That control they would find set forth in the first and second clauses, and they would see that it was barely sufficient for that purpose. The hon. gentleman the member for the Tower Hamlets said that the Government wished to introduce a number of stipendary officers who would be under their absolute control. Tbat was a mistake ; the only stipendarios that would be appointed by the Government would be merely the inspectors and auditors, who would not be local officers. (Hear, hear.) Moreover, the fact had been overlooked that the bill would not be compul ory ; but that it would be com petent for any bank to continue on its present footing With regard to the savings bank account, if the bid be came law he should be prepared to lay upon the table full information on that subject, and even to submit the whole management of the money to the investigation of a select committee. (Hear, hear.) The chief part of the deficiency had arisen from money being over credited to the banks—that . was to say, it had arisen from the banks having revived back more money than they had paid in, and not from varying the securities by different governments. He did not know how the hon. gentle man arrived at theconclusion th a t a m illi on o f mon ey bad been lost by varying the securities ; but he should think that less than half a million would be nearer the amount. (Hear, hear.) With regard to the proposed regulations, he (Sir G. Lewis) had neither acted blindly nor was be prepared to lay them on the table. It had been his wish to be guided by the most experienced offi cers, but it was impossible to frame a code that would suit ;arge banks and small ones, well conducted banks and ill conducted ones. (Hear, hear.) The bill was then read a second time. JOINT STOCK COMPANIES ACT AMENDMENT ~~ BILL. On the motion for the committal of this bill, Mr. C. FOSTER was understood to appeal to the Vice-President of the Board of Trade on behalf of a bank and company which he named. Mr. LOWE said the case alluded to would be mere properly provided for in a bill which he should introduce with r; 3pect to joint I tock hanks. At the same time, he must say that the formation of the company in ques tion was running a very col.siderable risk; because, al though the promoters had obtained very eminent legal opinion, and although the regist7ar was quite juitifiA, with that opinion, in registering the company, yet if it should turn out that the opinion was after all wrong, the parties would find not only that they had not limited liability, but that their association was not a legal corn. parry at all. The bill then wont through committee pro forma for the purpose of introducing amendments. ALEHOUSE LICENSING BILL- Ibis bill was real a second time. MARRIED WOMEN'S REVERSIONARY INTEREST BILL. Oa the motion for the second reading, ar E. PERRY had a bill on the same subject, but of a totllly opposite character ; and he had postponed it in order that there might be a discussion upon the principle they both involved. He should therefore move that this bill be read a second time that day fortnight. Mr. MALINS—My bill has nothing to do do with his bill. (Laughter.) The house divided— For the second reading Against it 6 —145 The bdi was then read a second time, Sir E. PERRY giving notice that in committee he shoji]. I propose an amendment enabling married women to retain their right to reversionary property. PIMLICO IMPROVEMENTS AND PUBLIC OFFICES EXTENSION. Sir 13. HALL moved for leave to introduce a bill to extend the time for enabling the Commissioners of ber Majesty's Works to complete improvements in Pimlico and iii the neighbourhood of Buckingham Palace ; also a bill to make further provision for enabling the Com ►nissioners of her Majesty's Works to acepiire a site for additional offices for the public service, near Whitehall and her Majesty's Palace of Westminster. Leave was given. The bills were brought in and read a first time. SHEEP, &c., CONTAGIOUS DISEASES PREVEN• TION BILL. Mr. BENTINCK nominated a select c'bmmittee on thi. bill. Agreed to. The CHANCELLOR, of the EXCFIEQUER brought up t')e bill upon the &mud dues, which was read a first time. Tiro house adj)urned at a quarter before 1 o'clock. PARLIA At EN TABY DIVISION. HOUSE OF COMMONS.-'TUNE 8. MARRIED WOMEN'S REVERSIONARY INTEREST BILL. Order for second reading read ; Motion made, and Ques" tion proposed, " That the Bill be now read a second time :"—Amendment proposed to leave out the wow "now," and at the end of the Question to add the words " upon this day fortnight ;---Question put " That the word ' now' stand part of the Question :"—Tho House • divided ; Ayes 151, Noes 6. AYES-151. A ddcrley, C. Gc.ddard, A. Philipps, R. Archdall, M. Goderich, Vis. Philips. J. IL Atherton, W. Greene, John Pilkington ' J. Ayrton, A. Greer, S. Pinney, W. Ball, E. Grcnfell, Chas. Platt, James Baring, T. Grey, K. Powell, F. Barnard, T. Griffith, C. Price, W. Beach, W. Haekblock, W. Pritchard, J. Beale, S Hall, Sir B. Ramsay, Sir A. Beamish, F. Hankey, T. Itebow, John Bennet, Capt. P. Hardcastle, A. Ricardo, 0. Bentinck, G. Hams, J. Ridley, G. Black, Adam Hassard, M. Roebuck, J. Blackburn, Peter Bay, Lord J. Ruupell, W. Bowyer, G. Hay ter, W. Russell, Sir W. Brand, 11. Henley, J. Scholedeld, W. Bridges, Sir B. Hodgson, W. Sey trier, H. Brocklehurst, J. Holland, E. Sheridan, R. B. Bruce, Lord E. Bomb v, W. Smith, A. B. Buller, J. W. INgestre, Viscount Smollett, A. Caird, James Ingham, R. Somers, J. Carnac, Sir J. Johnstone, IL B. Somerville, Sir W. Christie, Samuel Jolliffe, Sir W. Spooner, R. Clifford, C, C. Jones, D. Stanhope, J. Cobbett, J. M. Keating, H. S. Stapleton, J. Codrington, General Ker, IL Steuart, Andrew Cogan, W. H. F. Kershaw, J. Stewart,'Sir M. Collins, P. Knatchbull, W. Stuart, Lord J. Cowan, C. Knight, F. Sykes, Col. • Cox, William Lewis, Sir G. C. Talbot, C. Craufurd, E. H. J. Lidnell,ll. G. Thompson, Gen. Cross, B. Locke, John 'Townsend, J. Crossley, F. Lnv, e, R- Trefusis, C. Damer, L. M'Cann, J. 1 relawney, Sir 2. Davey, IL M'Cullagb, W. Turner, J. A. Dodsnn, J. Maguire, J. Vansittart, W. Estcourt, T. Malnwaring, T. Warburton, G. Evans, T. W. Mangles, C. E. Warren, S. Farnham, E. Manners, Lord J. Western, S. Farquhar, Sir W. Matheson, A. Westhead, J. Fitzgerald, W.ll. S. Melgund, Viscount Whitbread, S. Fitzgerald, J. Miller, T. Whiteside, J. Forde, Colonel Mills, T. Wickham, li. W. Forster, C. Mowbray, J. R. Willson, A. Foster, W. Mulgrave, Earl of Wilson, J. Fortescue, F. Naas, Lord Wingfield, R. Fortescue, C. Neate, C. Woods, H Freestun, Col. O'Connell, D. Gallwey, Sir W. Ogilvy, Sir J. TELLES& Gard, R. Paget, C. Gifford, Earl of Palmerston, Viset. Malins, R. Glyn, G. Pease, 11. Miles, W. • NOES-6. Dillwyn, L. O'Brien, P. TELLER/. Evart, J. Stirling, William Perry, Sir E. North, F. Willyams, E. Raynham, Viscollll' Country Markete, CHELMSFORD-JUNE 5. To-day we had a fair supply of wheat, which boa ready sale at the prices of last week for best samples, 911. inferior qualities scarcely maintained those prices. Spril corn of all kinds very little doing, and the prioe4 iv er unaltered. Wheat, white, old, per s. qr.3l new 3I red, old 29 new 29 Barley 35 Chevalier 4O Grinding 35 Malt 73 Chevalier 75 a. 0 . per qr. 24 3 ,,. ° Partridge 41 White ******* 39 47 , Boili ng 39 4 , 6 , Dun 3 1 3 ,., Beans, Tiek 35 40 Harrow ticks 39 4S Mazagan 34 Ditt o , new 34 38 71 i Oats, 70 I Peas, Official Statement of the Quantities of Corn, &c., receit in the port of London, from the following ports, fi . '" June 1 to June 6, both inclusive. i v? XI 4.; 1 .7): A --,-, A o 1 ,.; rs . 4 1.2), Colchester Harwich Leigh laldou 245 -- 241 -- 252 -- 11225 9-7 72 - 35 0 335 COLCHESTER— JUNE 6. A moderate supply of wheat to-day; which sold 11 1 the prices of last week, but the trade was flat. Beans an peas very scarce, at about is per qr. advance on the leo week. ,Prices to-daywere as follow: Wheat, white, 66s t o 700; rod, 56s to 625; barley, 44s to 483 ; oats, 26s to 28s ; bean Mazagan, 383 to 40s; middle and small, 42s to 465; Pe"" white, 38s to 42s ; grey, 42s to 465. 'KIRKCALDY—JUNE 6. Wheat and oats to-day experienced a ready sale' 6 1; last week's prices. A slow sale for barley. Small suPP , of all kinds of grain. Wheat. Barley. Oats. 1 ri„ e4/ 111 First 583 Od I s 33 Od I upd n s Second Third 32s Od I 313 Od 1 28; Ud I " COAL MARK) Prices of Coals per ton at s. d. Walker Primrose .... ..... 13 9 LT.—JUNE 8. the close of the market. Wallsend, dia. WaUgand a &o. s ' e i IFramwellgate l5 6 Hough Hall 17 6 South Hutton 1 5 17 Tees 6 [Eaton Lambton l7 s 18 ,'Trimdon It, 45; sold, 40. Braddyll l6 0 Kepler Grainge Riddell l4 3 Kelloe 16 3 Whitworth l5 6 Ships at market LOCAL SHARE MARKETS. LIVERPOOL, JUNE 8. STOOK EXCHANGE.—The market is dull to-day, 40 .1 prices are a shade lower. Eastern Counties, 118-- - -P; ( 1 Lancashire, 9q—Great Western, 63i i—London th North Western, Eighths, -- 14 83A I ° ,, r r e Eastern, Berwick, 22—South Eastern, 2211 4-I,aneasm i and Yorkshire, 1008. MANCHESTER, JUNE 8. A STOCK EXCHAN G E.—The m ar k e t was qu i e t to-uayffaint with rather easier rates. L ee d s , 1001—Midl an d s . 83 & 6/. Manchester, Sheffield, and Lincoln, 42i i f 3—Ditto, d. Pref., : 1 1 p.—London and North-Western, Eighths. l ot h —Eastern Counties, 11i— E a st L anca shi re , 97-B° o , Eastern and Dovers, 224 3-16 —Grand Trunk of Can ed 16. BIRMINGHAM, JUNE 8. , L w ith STOCK ExcHANGE.--There was a husk mark e t, -, prices firm. London Eighths, I dis. —Midlands clos ei o 55—Birmingham Banking Co., 31i —Birmingham Staffordshire Gas, 101. The bar silver brought by~the last West i s X. e r steamer has been disposed of yesterday at 61 d•. ounce, being an advance of gl. upon the price reau g for that t,y the previous packet. BIRTHS. OF A BON. On the 7th inst., at Thurloe-square, the wife of Th° l3lsll Bush Saunders, Esq., of Lincoln '® -ion. Oa the Bth inst., at 9, Strand, the wife of Mr. Staunton. OF A DAUGHTER. pyroe, of On the Bth inst., the wife of Mr. Walter .Bro London-wall. 11 01°3° On the Bth inst., at Lewisham, Mrs. Francis Firth. MARRIED. r un On the 6th inst., at the Church of St. George the e"'„,,ot, Queen-square, Mr. Frederick Andrews, of Store•e"ios Bedford-square, to Mary Ann, only daughter of the Mr. George Russell, formerly of Fenchurch-street. Jo be On the 6th inst., at St. Margar e t' s , LothburYP, Schofield, Esq., of Tokenhouse-yard, and rarer ° tet Winchmore-hill, Middlesex, to Ellen, youngest de u rV' G of the late Robert Blomfield, E sq ., o f H em l e y, Sufi On the 6th inst., Miss Anna D Gurney, of North roes Cottage, Norfolk, aged 61. J, $l. On the dth inst., at hi s res id ence i n G renv ille-roa wok , John's-wood, aft er a short illness, Douglas Jerrold, '''' aged 55. aE , On the 6th i ns t., a t th e R ec t ory, P ewse y, Hon. and Rev. Frederick Pleyden Bouverie,_aged On the 6th in s t., a t th e M oa t, Ch ai i ng , Kent, I ' l out Cclonel Percy Groves, aged 85. ea 69 ' On the 6th inst., Daniel Olney, Esq., of Tring , „ a g„ s irig" On the 7th i ns t., a t hi s f a th er ' s r es idence, 31. - 13-e sop' ton-park-gardens, James S. Dodd, Esq., of 6, Upp er mour-street, Portman-square, aged 27. d At Basingstoke, Mr. Charles Simmons, jun , On the sth inst., at Porchester-terrace, .110 , , Esq., of Lineoln's-inn, aged 52. O U n n t t h h e e 6 s t t h h i n i n s s t. t. ; j a o t h D u Halifax, Yorkshire, aged 60. eHnomld'srwk-ohritlb, F E r s a q n ., Pi o s f iSilioarvirlsLodge' LONDON : Printed and Published. by MURDO you''so of No, 112, Strand, Printer, at Th; Sun 011 ice• tv 112, Strand) in the Precinct of the Savey, in the COo° of Middlesex, Tuesday, June 9, 1e57. NY I tt }l nn le a raj, The C 'PM Lc "nne be ~ -us Pend ~.4 t the 'toaday and at • , 111; am Run, 0) Ch 4rln4 90 . Hial Wad,. teEtve ~_,. 9 .15 11, 0 5. 0 11. 0 • k 45 . . , 183e T ; g by the a th Leav — e 9 .30 2. 0 Sped 1.30 7.30 Pull p " 0 Part ar Passe, 14 'sted b `neir la; \_~ 1111111 Mill ?got of the tors w ori Z 0 go out also n Will iooder riage e ture en booki n parry' s stre e t ; Jenny Darti^i Ct. at - t - 6, from Charge Wedn, Thurs ( F riday Orde tender c Ply frgo F INEact to !Ass The eac eonsen Train 9 a .m. after tt , Fare is Gd IVog eeconi Cin‘ 8.5 and the tra 3 .45, 5, '►he train fi days. Lon 3 Stand ._ On T 'with co nri evil Pare , Or, E A SpeCi ' a Ys, ft 'onclon I Ar able so me stomas %,a), Th Dq t. Nr as Jest th e Ai, F e t en . Tltl aeroid ° ia ii ;alpe, 14 1 8 e, tg 'tr ee „ to w 4IAG tft ect