The Sun. — London, England, 1806-06-27 00:00:00

10 .TIS E OF C 7 .1 1 71T 0 ,N l r S TIWItiDAY, JUNE 26 A person from the Customs presented the Ac counts ordered yesterday upon the Motion of the Lord Advocate of Scotland, relative to the Shipping concerned in the Trade of the East Coast of Scot land, .Bcc. ; • which Account 'was ordered to lie on the Table, and to be printed. My. HOJHOU6E brouff.ht,up the Report of the Irish Export and ifhport Bill; whiCh was agreed to, and dic, Bill ordered to be read a third time.. . • Mr. S. 'LEFE,VRz presented' 'a - Petition froni certaip Merchants, Traders,' and iTishrhot%ers, , and from the inhabitants of Brighton, in favour of the Brighton ? Jetty Bill.,—'7Ordered to lie-,on the Table. , Mr. TititE..'Y presented a Petition friorp certain Butchers and Felli - nongers, resident within fifteen Iniles'of London, against the Flaying Bill.—Ordered to lie on the Table. ,The LORD ADVOCATE of ScoTLANn rose, pursuant, to-notice, to move that the Report of the Committee, 1.803, felative to a Light-house at the Bell; oW.Cape Rock, on' the Eastern Coast -, of Scotland, should be raerred to a Committee of the NA:ole Konse.-- 7 Ordered, and that the said' Comrtitteo should -sit to-morrow. • ,• Mr. GRENFELL, presented a Petition,fromihe Lop. don Assurance Ccimpany, against the GlObe Insur ance Corporation till.--LOrdered tole referred to the Committee upon the said Bill, and that 'Counsel should be heard in support, of the said Petition. Mr. CALcRET mayed,. pursuant to notice, for leave to bring in a Bill for granting CoMpensation to the Proprietors of Certain Lands at Chat) - iarn; Wbol ~t ich, and .Warley Common, upon. which, in .con sequence of an A& Of the 44th .of His Majesty, cer tain Buildings had been erected for . the "ase of. the Ordnanee.-.;-Leavegiven.. - -The Bill was accordingly brouaht in, read a first and:ordered to'he read . 4 Se . eon -c' d time to-:morrow.. • • Kiti6 brimight• in a Bill for amending the Post- Is; with a view to prevent, the . secret con- ve-an-e of Letters, to the injury of the Post-Oifice - Revenue.—Read a, 'first', and ordered to. *be read a second time onTuesday., Mr..l-iosHuuSE brGught up the. Reporfof for 'regulatirg'the Office of the ReeiYPr-ciektaral of ' the Pest-Office, Sze.; which was'agreed to, 4 0 the Bill:ordered to be read a third' time tb-ruorrOl.v; 1 Mr. Rbsu priesented aPetition; from the Tr` stees of the British Museurn, praying 44 to complete the purchase of Mr. Townley's Colle&ion, and to finish the Bnilclings ereeting fpr,thp use of that Insti tution. LOrd H. PETTY laving communicated His . Ma jesty's consent to this Petition, it was ordered to lie on the Table. . . The Irish . Revenue Jurisdi&ion Bill was re , di , se-i cond time, • and committed for Monday. • Sir Jonri. ITEM/ PORT gaVe notice of a Motion for to,.morrow, which, from the low tone of Voii:e in which he, spoke, we, could not hear; • and-the _Right .1-lon. Baronet was equally. inaudible in another no-; tice which - he gave in the course of the evening: The House,. in a Committee, went through the Irish Distillery Bill, and the Report was ordered to be brought up to-morrow.- • IRISVI POOR RELIEF BILL. Sir JOHN NEWPORT brought in this Bill; and on rnoviog that it be read a first time, • .• _Mr. BAGWELL thanked the Right - Hon. Ba ronet_ Fir 1413 lictz,vt-icrix..t., - d[l3' 13111, UuL hended there Was a point or two on which they may have sonle difference of opinion. 'As the law vas already, Grand Juries had the power to raise 4001. on counties, and 2001. on cities'; the consequence of wh"ch was, "that in those counties :which had cities; there were houses of industry, supported,lay , the aggiegate snip ; but in those counties - whiCh had no cities, the contrary .was 'the case ; and he there fore hoped that. power would be given to the Grand *JUries, of the latter to make up that: de 'ficiency, as many of the counties so .situated in Jre- . land possessed more: opulence than sorne of, those which .had cities.. From the time that this.assssinent of 400,1. upon counties was first.granted for the-poor, it had never been iuereased,..although for other pur poses rates had been made to the amount of 30,0001. and the people themselves were. Se' anxious to have provision made for, the pbor,' that hotises were built by private subscriptions, rising in a gradailon of from one to. too guineas. It should be remember ed - that - th6re:Were no poor laWs in Ireland; :and he hoped it would reinain so, for the -cOuntry Was too, poor to support the extravagance OF then . ). 1- - Mr. FOSTER considered this as alaiv professing to assist that. Of 1772, for taking .up idle, persons,. And .obliging them to" work.. That Mt :was only carried into execution' in Dublin,- where there etas now the stun of Q0,(V01 paid annually'for the sup ,port of vagabonds ; and Dublin being..considered as the centre, all the other. counties entirely • Lie gleaed them. • If.the Bill was, as he supposed; in tended‘to compel Grand Juries to extend their powers ,n this respect, he should vote. _against it, and par-, ticularly as he thought it V far too late in the Ses sion -to press, a measure .which had before been frequently a4itated and rejected in the Irish Par liament. Mr. ILIGUE,LL said there 'were houses of in dustry in ether places besides Dublin, but that, they were'supported by private subscription, 'gir J. NEWPORT explained, that if the Right Hon. Gentleman (f'lr Foster) attended to the Bill, he would find it expressly provided,- that one 'half of the henseS should be appropriated 'to the correc tioh of, tiagabonds and sturdy beggars, and the ::half to the relief of the needy poor. The Ilight Hon. 'Gentleman -was also wrong m supposing that this was the - first tiine of let , ies for this .purpose being made ,compulsory upon Grand Juries,, of' which he 'quoted two or three instances, and the quly computsion was on the Counties : ,which hart houses of industry, to maintain them. As to the t:harge of bringing. it forward so late in the Ses -1;iou, he appealed to the rccolleaion of Members, *healer he had not made the same propoSition last Year. in the early part of this Session, he. was, for a time, kept out of uis seat, by what he must .consi der 'ery improper poceeding. •Suice then, ,his time had been fully oc:upied, as, would be proved by The ;2 1 -etti. Mass , of businesS - he'had already brought for' !kyar4 and, late as it may be, he hoped he may now he perr..itt-d to p ith a measure I.V . hieh hetelt ti e:sserittai lo; the of hia Country. • !,!1/...41_,E.UNDL11 said, that however a;agree abid'it may he to Qppwe a measure,' the, objeU of Which was professed to be humane gild charitable, he must obje& to all neyv and partial, schemes, as hitherto the relief held out to one class of the poor in Ireland fell heaviest on the other.poor part of it. The greatest part of the Taxes of the North °Tire. land . s was'paid by people inhabiting houses of about 5). a year, and as" no other property there but lands and houses Contributed to the payment of'the Poor, he .was desirous of haying some more general mea sure. \ Mr. PARNELL said, it was imposble to travel over the high roads in'lreland without being -sen sible of the necessity of this measure ; and as to the Objeolion of' its falling heavy on the land owners, they were a description of persons in that country best able to bear it. 'r. The .Bill wasttbert read a first, and ordered to be read a second time to-morrow. VO LUNTE ERS. Mr. C. WYNAE said, ,that in consequence of something he had heard was tnentioned in the House yesterday, he thought it necessary to state, that no communication whatever, was made to the Volun- teers from the 'Executive • Government since the tst of VebrUarYlast, and that there existed no disposi 7 tion whatever to withhold any information that might be desired upon the subject. Every Paper that had been 'ordered was already before' the House ;'and if the - Honourable.Colopel; 'who alluded 'to this sub je& yesterday thought proper to . move for others, they would, if forthcoming, be immediately granted. Here the Honourable Member read the Papers rela'- five to the Volunteers which' had been vritten from ,the Secretary of state's Office since January last J . and expressed his readiness to accede to any Motion that might be made for their produtaion. - The 1406. Member took notice of the Order for Regular 'Re turns frOm the several Volunteer Corps; with which Order the Corps under-the command of the Hon. Colonel had not complied ; and before. the Ron. Colonel had ventured 'to charge a public Officer With neglect of duty, he ought to have taken care, - if not to perform his own public duty, at leaSt to be better informed as to the attention of others to that _paint. Colonel BASTARD disclaimed , the intention of Vputing , any negle&. to the Pfficer to .which the on. Member alluded. The: Hon. Colonel would ;150' glad to have all the Volunteers on thessame e.sta tilishment; and therefore did not objea to the pro posed change. As 'to the' Returns which ought to have been made from the Corps. under his corn- Mand, he, had to state, thatialthotig o h the Comman— der of five or six 'battalions, .he left altogether the.; drawing of pay : andsthe making Of .returns to Abe Comminderg s Of the several Battalions, he being himself unable to attend to such things, from ',his connexion with the Militia; with whom he gene rally was, out of the County in which the Volun teers alluded to were stationed. The Hon. Colonel concluded with moving for Copies of the Letterspd., .dressed by Mr. Smith, of the 'Secretary of State's Office; to Mr. Moore, of the War-Office, dated Jan. 27, and Feb. 1.; And also of that addressed by . .Earl Spencer to the Sedretary at War, in March last. The two first Letters were ordered, and upon the Motion being PIA as to the last, Col. 13.4STARD expressed a hope that the Vo luntFers would know, ere long, upon what footing they were to stand, as much confusion resulted from the uncertainty in which they were at present placed. Indeed, the evil was such, that he could witlFdiffi-'. ‘..1.11v - I.:vml r, he had influence, -until their fate.should be knowm Perhaps this uneasiness might have arisen from mis representation, but certainly the regulations respe&- ing the Volunteers ought to be announced . with all convenient expedition. ' Mr. WY! VE was surprised that any such un certainty should prevail, as the Hon. Colonel alluded to, for it was already very explicitly declared, that aniong the great .majority of the Volunteers, who, were 011 the August allowance,. no change what ever has taken place, excepting, the redndion of the drlli . serjeant's pay. 'And as to thoSe on the June allowances the intended change was very fully derstood.' • With regard tb the other 'point in. the•Honourable Colonel's speech, upon the • sub jeEt of the future • regulations' of the Volunteers; they were: of course to act .upon the regulations at present existing until the new regulations were cqmmunicated to them. These new regulations were already in a'very forward train, and would be sent to the several Corps as scoop as 'they could . he prepared. Upon the conduct o f th e H on . C olo nel, or his Corps, be meant to make no other remark than was warranted by fad. As to drawing for pay, he could not say that the Hon. ColonersiSub-Com .manders had negle&ed their duty upon that point nor, indeed, 'did he ever hear of any Volunteer Offi cers who were at all remiss in drawing for pay: but he was enabled to state, from Papers he held in his hand, that notwithstanding the utmost endeavours. on the part of the' Secretary of Slate's Office, rand. frequent exhortations to the several Conn - nal - Omits, to make the regular, Returns four times a year,' no Return had been .made from the Corps under the Hon. Coroners : command on ,any of 'the' quarterS ending - in the months of August, December, or April last. : • • Mr. LONG asked the Hon., Gentleman,, if .he was competent to answer; whether it . was meant that if any of the Corps upon the AOguSt allowance should be ret.luced in number, they woUld. be at liberty to admit new Me m b ers , un d er t h e same re gulations as formerly ? ) Mr. C. WYNNE, answered, certainly, until fresh regulations should be made out. After a feNV Words from Mr. S. 13bURNE, Mr. - IVYNN.NE repeated, that no diminution of allowance' to • the Augu s t V o l un t eers would take place ; at the same time he begged to be understood as not pledging himself to that point. The Motion was agreed . The Newfoundland Trade Bill was read a second time,and committed for Tuesday next. Mr. Wylk[E brought up the Papers ordered on th r e'MOtion BASTARD.—Ordered to die on the Table. BANKRUPT LAWS. The SOLICITOR GEIVER.'4L'i-q'se, pursuant to notice, to tiove for leave to bring in a Bill to alter and amend the Bankrupt Laws, or rather, he hid, rnore'corre&ly speaking,' tO *remove certain defeas in those Laws. It' was , byci no his intention to attempt the amendment of the whole of the Law upon this 'Sdbjeet, but to remove :Certain gre at defects, rnischievou; consequences of . , • which were -every day observed, and most sensibly felt, by all who had any opportunity of consider -Ing 'the queZtion.lis objea, at present, siinply. was, to introduce some regulations which were obviously . 'necessary. According to the existing Bankrupt Lass-s)i any acts done, or debts contracted by-the Bankruptk in the course of the period which intervened tween the committal of the a& of Bankruptcy and the taking. out of the Commission, was,e - as it affeaed the creditors, completely annulled. Thee evils resulting from this provision were of the Most serious nature, for it often happened that a bank rupt had sold a real estate, and received the money for it, after the committal of an a& of bank- • ruptcy ; and yet, unless, according to the A& of the 21st of James I. such sale had taken place 5 years before the commission was taken out, the purchaser was deprived of his purchase, and it became the pro perty of the. Assignees of the bankrupt. Another *evil resulting from the present law was, that if money Was lent to a bankrupt at any time during the period just referred to, sisch money was liable to be distri-, buted among the creditors, and the lender was not, any 'more than the purchaser of the estate, 40-wed : even the small consolation of receiving a dividend, or any portion of his money, from the bankrupt's areas, -nor had he, indeed, any remedy at all. The Learn e . ed Gentleman referred to the Aas which it was his, object .to amend, and proceeded to observe upon their nature, the principle of all which was to Protect the debts of a tFlizfide creditor's bankrupt. That ad, the HouSe insist bp fully aWare; which in law was, an at of `Banlsruptcy, was by 40 means an a& of notoriety, nor even such generally as a Creditor - could by .the ' utmost vigilance contrive to IsnOw. In Tnost cases, inOed, it was an, a& knoWn only to the bankrupt himself, or any of hiS servants, who by his dire6tion denied his being at home upon a creditor's calling foi him, Why then, the Learned Gentleman asked, should such mischiefs as those he had described' be "alloWed to accrue to . min liable f,i3 deal With "a bankruPt Under such cir cutnAanLies ? nd why should their ignorance 0f 7 .4b event, which it was almost impossible for the;:n;t9 know, be permitted to inVolVe the forfeiture Oieir just claims ? • But these We're not all the.evils*liich 'the present Law produced ;' for *it was not . _let se- 'were against the bankrispt lOiself than - it was against his creditors. The avowed principle ofaj , Bankrupt Law was, that when a bankrupt gave up all his property he should be discharged lions au his debts. By the Law as it now stood, that principle. ss,as not acted upon 3 fiar the bankrupt's.total oleaSe from.the Commission did not protect bhp frorx;lthoe debts which he might, perhaps , unknowingly, have; contraaed after the committal of the a& of bankruptcy, which led to such Commission. Thereforethe bank tui4 was placed in the extraordinary situation of be ing called upon to pay that which he could beset° property to pay, unless he were guilty of an atlef felony. What he had already stated theLearneel Gen tleman conceived quite enough to impress upon rlie House the necessity of amending this law. But there was a still.greater evil than any he had menticuisd produced by the present system. If, after a (lOrn mission had been taken out, an at of bankruptcy, was proved anterior to 'that 'upon which the Com mission was grounded, all the proceedings of :Such Commission were void, and the- Commission was superseded. In consequence of which .the as signees, who were „inside responsible for all the bankrupt's property they possessed, or had previously snid_ utare plarpil in .4 cithatino of extreme hard ship: It had not unfrequently happened, and indeed, in the course of his own experience, he had known an instance in which a first, second; or even third com mission had been set aside in this way. In that instance, as no doubt in others, the obje& was to defeat the proceedings taken against the bankrupt, by whom, with that intention, the anterior adts of bankruptcy were kept back. If then, in addi tion to the Injuries , thus arising to the bankrupts; the assignees, and the creditors, one cdnsidered the enormous expense of actions depending - on the corns mittal of acts of bankruptcy; the amoont'- - of Or; bankrupt'S --property dissipated in such anions, and with no other object in general than mere litigatian s it was impossible not to teel astonished that the 'Uw! should have been suffered to remain so long in its present :state. , Three modes were suggested, the Learned Gentleman stated, of remedying the evilS complained of--The first was,, entirely to abolish, one, of the great principles of the present BankrOpt Laws, namely, that no man should be considered . bankrupt until the time at which the Commissien, should be taken ont. But various objections ,of fered against • this suggestion, arising out, of the expedients notoriously resorted to ; by bankraspta fraudulently disposed. Another provision I.yas, re-, commended, that . no Commission should begrant:eci unless the ad of Bankruptcy aliedged by the tioning ,creditor had taken place a certain,. time be t fore the Commission, a ccor d i n g t o the advice of some.; three or six Months. But to this recommendation fie knew of several Objectitins, which urged at least the , propriety of a much greater distance of time. - When it was considered how relualantly creditors in general took out a Commission of Bankruptcy, how , frequently they granted a deed of trust in order to avoidbringiog expense and trouble upon themselves,. or disgrace and ruin upon the bankrupt, and when it ryas recollected that those deeds were often protraaed much longer than six months, he trusted the House would . feel that no such period ought to be fixed; But, although great inconvenience and - injustice might result from such an arrangement, :still the law was not to be left as it stood. It appeared to him, that without fixing , atiy period upon 'this point, bona fide debts "contracted by the bankrupt at any time before the commission should he recover-, able from the edeas of the bankrupt, notwithsarld ing any previous ad of bankruptcy. This seemed to be the, only remedy fairly appli c abl e t o th at p art o f the Law; namely, thatall honest debts contraated-1 all payments made—all conveyances and engage ments entered into by thebankrupt, should be . good and valid, notwithstanding any previous ad of.,bank ruptcy, provided the person or• persons entering into such contracts, or lending such money to the bankrUpt, should have no notice of such an 'ea of bankruptcy, orknowledge ofthe bankrupt's insolven cy. He pi-oposed too, that as to such debts, the, bank rupt's certificate should be a protection ; as complete 4s with regard to . any debts elaiMed under the Coin inisSien. Another objets of the Bill he meant isl bring forward, 'would be, that no ConnuiSsion of Bankruptcy shogld be superseded in consequence of pievious ad# pf baplipptcy hankrUpt , . ; and Rise, that debts eonfraaet by the baekrupt, which were not" payable until, after the Comm - .,ion was taken out, shouid be prOvable under the Co.umis sion, whether they were simple debts or those for which securities:were given. The Learned Gentle. man concluded with:observing, that those were the only objedts which the Bill he proposed to bring for.. ward had in view. LLeave -was given. to bring in the Bill; and the At torney and Solicitor Generals, with Mr. Percival, MV. - Morris, and others, were appointed to,prepare and bring in the same. -Mr. }eon ons E brought up the Report of the Com mittee on the propriety of granting certain Salaries to the new Commissioners fox Auditing the Public Accounts; which was agreed to ; and it was ordered that the Gentlemen appointed ta prepare and bring in the Auditors' Bill; do make, provision pursuant to the said Resolution.-A similar Order was made to the Gentlemen who are to bring in the .Greenwich Pension Bill, upon the gesolution of the Conunittoi upon the Prize Ae - 1- whiCh sat yesterday. TRAINING BILL. "On the Motion of Mr. WINDHAM, the House went into n Committee on the 'General Train ing the dOmmittee YORKE..observed, .that there were many inaccuracies in the ' - yet as he was a , friend to the general principle, he had baeu willing, that it should go into a Committee, in order .to see what Amendments should be made. It was desirable that we should have such a Bill on our Statute Boolt, , net only on account of the training, but be. cause such a measure would tend to talend the Ali ! . litia and Volunteers in such a manner as to form a Second line for the *qv. But be objeded to the; Bill---first, it differed from the *measure whith be bkid- - proposed in 1803, in dill, that jet. Went. to re strain the prerogativ e of the. Crown, whereas Iliad . extended it. r-fis next objeftion was, that the pro. visions of. the, Bill did not 7 extend to North Britain, and, he. could not 'see why. Scotland should be .tempted. As to the Volunteers of Seotland being better trained,' and the necessity, of this. 'pea, sere .being therefore superseded as far. as rest)eeted that part, of Great'Britain, - it ought to be constdereci ; tilat 'Posit of iheSe Volunteers .had been on the June allowances, and that when-these were taken await , lit was likely-that their 'numbers would be muett . 'diminished. , He' concluded by moving,. that word . " Englancr_ be left . out, and that the wads " great Britain". shoula be' iiib4ittited In- its stead. • ; • • • Mr. •triNDIMAT 'stated the reasons why the provisions of filq : ,i34" 1)61,4.1d not immediately tend , to Scotland. in rise first place, to a great pare of.that coUntry,:espkially that part called the High;- lands, - the - Bill woOld not apply,. and.besides, froll I.the general' habits, of the people it, w:ts less ilec0;; ! sary. In Scotland, the 'people wire also biiter trained and more military than here. ,T 4 state of the Volunteers, was superior, according to'Nvh4 he I., , bad learned—not in'point 9f numbers; for 'he did ;.not knoW that in - this respe& they exceeded their • ,..proper proportion, but i n p o int o f di sc ipline. Rut then came the obje&ion, that the numbers of 'the Volunteers would be much diminished by with 7, drawing the June allowances. Though gen t loriien seemed. to hold out such considerations as theset .somewhat in the way of, a menace, yet he Via willing to hope that-this menace or expectation ill-founded. .It ought. to be considered, that if the allowance wens diminiahcd; the duty was also nished. To that part of Scotland called the LoW: lands 'certainly the Bill might be more anlipable but still it was thought proper to try the experi. ment in England, and not td inclilde Scotland in the first Anstance. There might b e rea s ons why '`it should not extend to Scotland atall, though he ther thought it might at some future time ; bt.4 at all eventsit would be impr u d en t t o exten d it to Scotland now: Another reason was the advar t -ced state of the Session, when many Gentlemen of that Country were out of town; and, therefore, he wobl4 . oppose the Amendment. Sir .1,1:174,5 PULTENEY saw no reason why . the provisions of the Bill should not extend to SOt- , land. It might not apply to the Highlands- ] kit why, not extend to, the Lowlands, which was the more populous•part of the Country, and that pin too which i.vasJnost exposed to attacks from tne opposite Coast. He allowed the excellence of t!e Volunteers in that Country ; but it was to be cob;. sidered, that on account of the distance from the 'Capital, there was but a ptnall reguL , .; 'force' kept there, acid therefore it ought to have the advantage of every other mode of defence. - Whether Or ,not the Volunteers would be diMinished he. should nOt say ; but he hoped that, whether ;he provisions of the Bill, were to be, applied to Scotland this yell - or not,- they should be afterwards applied ,• to it. . , Air. PERWALObserved, as to the point of ..the Bill's not being applicable to-Scotland, that. 010 provisions of the .Bill of 1803 had c it tad, extended to that Country. Th e reasons given;fer not extend ing this measure to Scotland were, perfeetly nuga . tory ; for they would, apply equally! well to many parts of Wales, Cumberland, and.Westinorland,.ih thelnountainous distrias of which the .population was very much scattered. . But at. any rate- there was no reason why the Bill should : not extend to the •Lowlands of Scotland. Though -the people might be more military and better trained,'still. the Icing:ought to ha ve th e power of calling them out; and .this he might exercise according, to his discre tion, and exempt particular districts ; as circum stances. should require. There was no difficulty in' executing the Militia Laws in Scotland, and why should not this measure be extended to that Coun try, when the principle was the same ? But then it had been said that the Volunteers Were in a better ~ state there. It was certainly- to be considered that these were to be deprived of the June allowances, and scarcely any motive but, their ,zeal would re main to keep theM too ° lther ; and here the teasop ing of the Ministers themselves, that a variety of motives, such as the Ballot for the Militia and the Army,ofßeservb, were necessary to induce men to c9ntinue in the Corps, might be turned against them selves. He would certainly, therefore, support the Amendment. Colonel ,tkOOD observed; that the Militia Laws were new in Scotland, and had at first occasioned considerable dissatisfa6tion there. , He thought, therefore, that it Would be better to wait for ancthm year before the principle of thi3 Dal should be ex. tended to Scotland. •