The Sun. — London, England, 1806-03-29 00:00:00

'~ b eta a - Vote of Credit nd nd - 60 , 27000 • 2„000,000 Joint Charge England and Ireland ,C.13,§69w0.0 Add .England's - separate Charges. • • East India (.'..otriparty - - t,06a,003 Deficieriey - Malt thity, 0364 - - 34,006 Ditto, Ways and Means, tBO5 . -, 1,7:4.630 Interest on Exclictpret Bills - , t,erk.Y,6os. To payoft:sl.pelCgots• ? ' 1797, at sth • Ditto, loth Odober j eD .J,200,000 ---------- 5.247,000 Total Supplies - - IS 9+1.00 0 • - Deducton account of Ireland as olow . - 5.39 ~,L. on account Of Engiznd ' - . - Deduct on account of lrelaud, t7t It of the above sum ‘,l 43,669,0001: ' C 5, 137 4 5211 Deduct also 2- 'ply for . Civil List and other Charges 43; 611 07 2, 16,,000 Z 5.3974518 WAYS AND MEANS. Malt and Personal Estates Mities - - 2,75a,000 Grants worn Proceeds of Snips captured prior to . the War - -•- 1,00.0,000 I oitery - - - - 380,0c0, Surplus 'Consolidatql Fund tooth of April, 1237 ' 3,500 l oco t War . Taxes -_ - 19,50 , 0,000 Deduct as likely to be outstanding at 5111 Apill, 1807 I, 500,000 -18,ope,o'oo iB,oso,noo Loin .4 ,3, - 636,000 He wishedthat he had been able to state to the }louse, that the btu - then - 4 which he had found bin], 'self "'under the necessity Of Pi•oposin•T to impose 6 • tipon'the Country were light, but it ‘Vas - iMpUssible - for him to do so. He .- was far from, thinking. light - and • easy ; ' but he Should • think ill of the rCoantry, he • should- think ill of 'himself as belOhnig 'to' ttat'Conntry, if he could for tit rpo that they.would be borne. with the con valley alidjortittide Which were the prominent and 'distinguishing features of the chara4er of the -Mita litants of Great Britain. If the People did • feel •CheertuLinthe. present crisis, when; fthin the failure of other modes of assistance, we were left to iest on our -ow), • means and _strentli ; if they ;were firmly and unanimously determined-to carry on the present contest with spirit until war 'became 'lolonger necessary, and until , very thing van:tame o •map Wai ,secured to theni, - he. most attrionte that cheerfulness, and that 'detennination,, to the confidence that they.ergertained that resources 'and revenuea of the State would be applied economt ically. He believed' that such a feeling of confi dence did exist in the Country, .and certainly tf.ever men were committed to abide - •by their principles, • they were the present Administration, who, should they be/it - Wilted to depart from the system which it ;vas their duty to' pursue, must retire loaded with shame and disgrace: This, however, tie trusted, :would be , fa`r from toe .case. The labours of the • 'Commissioners of Naval Inquiry, from which use Public had already derived : so much•advantage ; .and the labours of- the COMmissione,rs of Ntilitary In quiry, recently instituted, who, he trusted, would . emulate the uilig - ence. and patriotism of the feigner, pust atford to the Administration abundant op . portuoities •of shewing their vigilant attention to .the proper administration of the public purse.!-- When he stated that Ministers were in the liighest degree desirous of following the Suit,- gestions of -those Boards, and wtien lie stated, that in his department steps had' been already 4aen to_ prosecute for and reoover, the sums lost to the Public in the West Indies, and to remedy the abuses in that• Country; which lead' oten allower.i to retrain a perennial source or fraud, rapine, and misapplication of the public money—When 'he made the i.e statements, he was aware that he only state. oral ..‘l4,nisters felt their duty, and were re bolved to do - their duty. if he indulged any pride in the financial detail which he had just laid Wore the House, it ,was., this, that it was entirely open and Without concealment. He had ever been Of opinion, .that the publicity and notoriety of the financial affairs of Great Britain had been the 'prime source of her strength and,success. He trusted this frau kuess; and absence of disguise, ,Would never be departed from. Like The old itoinan,tuo . raiist, he. would wish . so to build his habitation that - every cor ner Shonid.be - open to.every eye, and every , passenger become a. spe&ator of what was going on. He believed if there were a. system in the world to which this sentiment might be jtisily aoolied; it was the, system of the Finance of Great Britain. If mere was any point which he was more ambitious to attain than another; _it was o. character of promoting that (knowledge and publicity. He should look to it on .all occasions, and. consider it as inseparably connected the discharge of his duty, to tits Country. Tne Noble Lord concluded With towing his first resolu • tion. • • • , FRANCIS a gave great credit to the. Noble Lord for his accuracy and laboriousness'; he had• even exceeded the high expectations which - he had for Med Of him. There were two passages of the Noble Lord's speech.to which he Wished to dired 'the attention of the House. The one gave hint-as much satisfaction as the other did dissatisfaeLon.— The first was, that he had been able to find means to persuade the Bank DireEtors to deduct the amount of the Funded Property at the Bank, which a few years ago, under "the pretence : that .it would cause a 'derangement of their books, they had refused to do. Tare last was the great increase- of .the tax on pro . verty,, which he. was convinced would ditTusezeneral • dissatisfaaidn. did not think with the Noble Lord, that it was desirable to make this sudden ad • N'ance frothsi3t , and a quarter to ten per cent. in pre- Terence : to•a gradual.advanel and he Wished..it had been defended on the score of , necessity rather - than of policy. -Having nearly .doubled it, still, how-does the irnposing t of the sum of ten per. cent. secure the Country against a subsequent.gradual increase ? • Lord RE A liY PE,TTY, in justice to the,Bank Diredors, thought it hiS duty to declare, that be coming sensible Of the inconveniencies that had been stistaingd.by the Public. on account of their former refusal to deduct the amount of the • Property Tax Irani 'the dividends, they had agreed to take upon theinseles that office. With regard to what the Hon-, Gentleman had said on the Property-Tax, he could only repeat that in his opinion, the Public would be better pleased to see 'it carried at once lo that ,point . bey - oncl.which there was. no apprehension of its•being - urged, than to find it gradually, and of .course indefinitely; advancing in atnourit. Mi.: ROSE would not follow the Noble Lord through his statements: there was no point to which Were several which he might avail hiinself of at a future oppoxttlnity tirmake some - trifling.comments., What now 'called hint up was, to express his soft6 w . that the 'i\loble Lord IRA insinuated that - -the late Aelthinistratipri had allowed the pechlation in - the Wose Indies to go on unchecked, when the fail was, that a,13111 had:beembronght in by that Adininistra— tion to , appoint Commissioner's, I.vho were -sent out to the NVet Indies to investigate these abuses. Their. Re porty as laid be tore the Law Officers of t he Crown, who mold explain why they were not proCeeded on. With: re and to • the publicity of the Finances,, of which the Noble Lord had said so mdch, was it pos- : sible that he could make them more, public than they had hitherto beep—than they had, indeed, been originally made by the Great Man whom the Conn try was yet lamenting ? He would just ask' the Noble -Lord a single question ph one part of the new impositions. He had .mentioned his intention of increasing the per centages on CnstomS from a • fourth to a third; which Would materially ihjure our . martufaaures, - unless certain drawbacks were alloW- ed. Nothing had been said about these draWbacks; did the Noble Lord mean to grant t . heni ? Lord HENRY PETTY, in reply, said, that- be had ititimated his intention of allowing' these draw- backs. With regard to the charge made against him by the Hon. Gentleman, of having insinuated blame on the late Administration, his - answer *was simply that he had never named them. He could not be _ _ supposed as yet to know much of the efforts that had been used to check the abuses in' the West In- dies • but this he,knew, that therstill existed. Mr. ROSE and Lord H. Pwrry severally explained. Mr. PERC.VAL wished that the subject of the West Indies' had been excluded from the Noble Lord's speech. If no dire& charge had been hatei►_i ed, a pretty,considerable one had . been insinuated against the late Ministry. The Reports of the Com missioners • had beets laid before him in his -official ,situation, but they were .so loose, that,it ,was impos sible :to institute any proceedings on 'them.. • He `thought the House much indebted to the Noble Lord for his luminous statement, which had given him, for one, much. pleasure; and he would only hint at some parts of it which were in a certain degree ob je6tionable. The most prominent was,' his having '"proceeded to vote the Ways "and Means before .the Supply ; and on this subjea he Wished that the No ble Lihd had treated the system of his Honourable Friend (Mr. Rose) more kindly. He had, however, allowed the Ways and Means to exceed the Supply several nailliOns. The Noole Lord's Right Hon. Friend, by his. side, (Mr. Fox). could tell him 'how Air this was a constitutional pra&ice. He approved of the, general spirit of the Budget, but thought that some parts Would not be adequate to what was ex peeted from them. This remark applied to the ex emptions from the Property Tax, which he appre• 'herded would require modification. There was another tax which he thought it would be extremely difficult.to :carry into •effea he meant that. on .ap praisementS ; his supposition on this head at i ose from his knowledge of the manner in'whicli the tax on au&ions is id frequently been evaded.' Lord HENRY PETTY. re-stated some of the items of the Supply and of the Ways alid Means, and contended that the former exceeded the latter above seven millions. With regard to the-exemp tions on the Property Tax, he thought that the new mode by re-payment to small annuities, &c. Would .be attended with much facility ; because, having once obtained their certificates, on producing them in the succeeding years, they would be entitled to the same adVantages. Mr. PERCEVeIL ObserVecils' that the Noble Lord in his calculation had not included' the War Taxes, the produce of which, though certainly they were not proposed this 'day, ' was necerttieleSs forthcoming. to the Exchequer. . Lord HENRY PETIT replied, that the 'War Taxes reqqlred a specific application, which they had. not yet received, before they could be fairly calm.; hated upon.. Mr. 110.ST:still contended that the Ways and Means 'atforded •a large surplus beyBnd the Supplies. 'SECRETARY FOX allowed that the Ways and Means ought not to surpass in extent the Supply. But it .was' the. principle of this rule which ought to be attended to. The War TaXeS were an anamoly. They were' not applicable to theleneral exigencies of the year. If the situation of the Country permit. ted it, they might be devoted to the reduction of the National Debt; o to any other purpose that the gislature -might think fit. At the same time, he could not but confess, that a considerable inconveni 7 ence was incurred by opening the Budget before the amount of the' expenditure bad been ascertained. This was an inconvenience very similar tothatwhich took place last year with regard to the Subsidies. It was an inconvenience, but no more • it did not 'trench en the principles or the practice of Constitution. As to the blame which his Noble Friend had been 'accused of casting on the late Administration;'he re .colleCted having heard him distinaly praise one pro jcti that originated in that Administration, he meant . the Sinking Fund. In that praise he heartily ad purred. But it seems his Noble Friend had censured the apparent inattention to the disorders and abuses iu the. West Indies. It .certainly did appear extraor dinary, that in'a period of ten years-0 cry of Aro no from t/ie Opposition Benches)-=well then, that in a period of eight, six ; or fire years, hoth ing..elfeanal had been done on that . subjea. It was`very possible, however; that difficulties might have arisen in it not easily obviated. As to what had been said on the different modes of taxation, bethought that the duty on apiraisements would either be produ&ive itself, or render that on Au&ions much more so than it was at present. The exemptions from the Property Tax would, he confessed,. be• attended with some diffi culty. At present, great frauds were praised, and often little relief obtained. 'This was a inea sure that had been not lightly considered, .aild he trusted that the House would afford their assist ance in improving it still farther. . With regard to the ambunt to which the Property Tax was propOsed to be raised, he thought it much less obje6tionable to bring it, to a-large round sum at once, which should be understood to be its limit as a permanent War Tax, than brgentle gradations to induce the Public to apprehend that it might ultimately he carried far ther. He confirmed the statement of hiS Noble Friend with reFpea to the determination of Government to ready as much as possible the abuses that had been discovered, or that should be discovered,' by the dif-.• fcreut Boards of Inquiry, and .deter ded iiun from. mOit fOr this determination. He lAA given a noble to which he was convinced that lie would al , lA , Jy . s. adhere. He governed i s proceedings by this, sound principle—:-that a disposition . manifested by a Government to attend' to, and to.remedy abuses, was the best way of securing theeonfidencepf the people; and of induCing them to' bear the burthens which the necessity of the State impoted , Upon then), Mr. 1108(E and .Mr. Fox severally explained. Sir P. GIBBS corroborated the sta,ternent of his Learned Friend (Mr. Perceval), as to the proceed- ings , on the Repcirt of the-Commissioners appointed to investigate the affairs of the West Indies. Mr; HUSVSSON likewise confirmed the asser tion, that very•possible Means bad been taken to inquire into and to check the abuses in the West In dies. Several of those abuses had aeldallybeenre 'thedied,' among them was the extravagant premium on Icing bills. ,He 'passed a high etilogitut On - the abi lity of•the Noble lord, and was happy - to hear him give the House and Country a solemn pledge- and assuFance, that the wise system of Finance formed by .his Lite • lainented' friend would continue to be atted upon. The - pri&iple of this system• was, 'to raise as large a :supply as possible within the year, and thus to endeavour (o keep 'down .the debt. He then entered' into an elaborate discussion of the ar- tides conipo3ing the Budget, 'and though .he highly approved of them in general,. yet suggested a number of minute improvements. In the "state ment of the deficiencies of the Ways and Means for the-last year, - he contended .there must be some error; he defended the ,memory of his ever-to-be-la :lented friend. from the impUtatiOn : winch this . supposed deficiency naturally cast upon it. Having thus completed his numerical statement, he ; expressed his wish that he could add, that the burdens necessary in order to defray the charges of .the.year were light and easy,' but he felt the impos sibility. The Taxes proposed by the Noble Lord were as little liablQ to objection as any others that 'could be laid on. The arrangements respecting the Property Tax had his intire concurrence; and-what ever unpopularity might attach to the adoption of them, he was ready to encounter his share of it by giving the'measure his decided support. As to the Three Millions due to the Bank, which would be payable on the sth 'of' April next, and were to be lent to Government at three per cent: the interest on which would amount to gu,cool.- per annum, the Noble Lord had net stated how he was to provide for the discharge of thiS interest. VANSITTART, in a' clear,.perspicuous:, and. able 'manner, defended the statements, of his :Noble Friend': 'he expected that the excess of the surplus of the COnsalidated Fund, if it shodid exceed the sum at which it. was :taken, 'would cover any de ficiency.that might take. place in_ any other. part of the Way's andAleans„ . He was hvpy•w find, that the Measure proposed to be aaoptes.l with respeft to the exemptions frum the Property Tax, met the con currence of the Gentlemeil opposite ; and he would put it to the candour, of those Hop. Gentlemen, Who were acquainted , with ' the opinions of an il lustrieus -Person now no more, whether he had not been sensible of great inconvenience from the man ner in which. these, exemptions had been alloW4d. The H9nourab)e Gentleman also took, the oppor tutney of claiming for his Noble Friend (Lord mouth) the merit, of having. originated, at least since the covinencement of the , present War, the system cur raising a great proportion of the SupplieS within the year. . . • Mr. STUB . GES BOURNE confirmed the statd, ment of his Learned Friend (Mr. Percival) that the late Board . of Treasury-had taken every possible step to put a stop to, and punish, the/rauds and abuses that had taken place in the West Indies. • • . Lard TEMP-LE was,, not inclined to impute any blame to the. late. Administration on this subjea, but could not omit to state what had come of, ficially to his knowledge. Whatever steps had been taken for the punishment of the offenders, none ap peared to have been taken .to prevent their' recur rence ; particularly as to the omission to bring the premiums on Bills to the account of the Public, and with respect to false vouchers: •. Mr. HUSKISSON repeated his former asser tions, that every means possible had been employed to prevent the recurrence of the evils, and,insisted, that many abuses that were contained in the Re ports,of the 'Commissioners no longer existed. Po sitive instructions had been given to the Commissary General not, to allow .any,Bill unless accompanied with a Certificate from the Governor or Command ing Officer, dtt64ed by three credible. Witnesses, that it was drawn according to the then actual state of the exchange. , • Mi. G. ROSE • thought the Hon. Gentleman would do well to search the RecordSof his office for Docil 7 means' on the sunjea, The. 'Noble Lord by exa- Joining his own office (the Army Pay-Office) would find by the Mintites there preserved,. that:very of--' fi!clualsteps had been taken to put.a stop to the _ex isting abuses. The preservation of these minutes in the office was a regulation. made; by • him, (Mr.. Rose) ibr when appointed to the Pay .Office he. had found nothing in it to dire& him. ;' • Mr. HUSKISSON, Lord Th;MVLE, and Mr. PERCI VAL,' severally . said ,a few words in explanation. Mr. Secretary FOX was.glad to / have the autho rity of the i Hon. Gcutleman (Mr. Rose) to shew that credit might be taken for the improvements in office, without intending. to ,cast any , impqtations upon their predecessors in office: The Right Hon. Gentleman hid taken credit .for his ingproveinent in the Pay-Office, without intending to throw any blame on his predecessors. ',‘ • •.. Mr. LONG thought ,the •Noble, Lord had.not ac counted, for the mauu in which the .90,0061. a year interest.on the three millions.dne to the Bank was to be provided for. , • . :Lord . PETTY replied, by txchequer Bills. The 'several .Resolutions Were then put: separately and agreed tog..and. the House being returned, the Report, was ordered to be received to-e - tofroW. Adjourned till to-morrow (this.(l4). R 1).1 (YCK.) YESTERDAY. Bank Stock, shut . ' Inni...Borids, Navy 5 per Cent. 9 2 Ina ..xtitf. ,t,,ii• .. 5 per Cent.. 1797, bliu: Exch.iilll,, 2.., 15.,35. as:dis. Dish 5 pet Cent. 1 Oinnittin 3j4 ,?. 4. • . 4 per c cut. shut -: i 3 per c celei . I 4::et're..4, 3 per Ct. I{cd shut • . 1 1mperia1 ... 3 . 13.J t_. :it 6..„X 3 per ....s.t. Colls.- 6,1.1E1' Ditto Ann 9 t. to Bank 1. Ann.•Aut • Pak for open, 2071. Ditto Shun Anil. strut India tor open. ig s , ItidiaStaek, .11kit - Coni. fir April is, 6cii 6.0 i CE ,THE COMIVASSIONEng FOit IIiVISLiG AND. DIOE-;T - ING THE CIVIL. AkFAIRS OE HIS MAJESTY'S NAVY. (Concluded from our Paper of Yeiterdify.) The Revolution took place within tWo mo nths after the business of the C9mmittee was completed ; but the Naval regulations were wisely 1:41 unaltered; the of the Admiralty coenued for some time to be carried on under the innidiate dire'aia of Ate l iug, .by Mr. Pepys, till the arrival of Au.,1*,•:11 Herbert and Capt. Russell, from ' the Fleet, into whose hands, he sas-s, " he silently let it fall ;" and )inder the system thrilled by the Duke of , York, with his aid, the Civil •Governin t ell- O. r has ever since been carried on. 'We have stated those proceeding,: tl;e more filly. -not only because the system under whiclk the civil affairs of the Navy has ever. since been conduaetd, .was then met.hod*(l and settled ; but' because the circumstances gave very usolul information, and hold 0111 an example which well deserves attetition in the present times. The rapid decay of the Fieet, and the waste of stores, eurtii g .those few years of supinimeSs, from experience, how esential it is to the satt,-:,, of this Country, that the most effeetui,4 means showd be taken to guard agitist any ncr iigeoce in f e Dock-yards ; .and thi. 7 great work or re=establish:ng the Fleet, and restoring order, indstrv, and disci pline•in the Dock-yards, accoa pti,iied in s, rt time by the Commissioners then chosen wit., so much care, proves, in the most convinc;ng n) .nu r, how much depends on, lining the civil i-i,fairs o' he Navy ,placed under the management of men of at ability, professional knowledge, and unit - am -I.v • - t industry. And we think it our duty to reccinroe, to Government, that in the choice of their) do th ti-,- circumstance.but that of their being- the fittest can he found for the execution of the varioii Important dirties they are to undertake, ma; o re garded. It is far from being our intention in what it may be our duty to, propose, to depart. from the princi ples on Which those ancie.nt regulalions and orders are founded. They have stood the test of time, and have been found by long trial to be ; well adapted to th,). great objexlS'of their institution ; but those or ders and regUlations, tjmugh in every way suited to the state of our Naval - . Force as it Lien stood, have necessarily reqUired many additions, in consequence or die vast increase of that force which has sax.: taken place; and close additions havitig been orca sionaiiy made 'as-. circumstances have occurred, the principles., of the general system which they were meant only to extend, do not appear to have been alwa) s. kept in view : different orders have found in certain cases incompatible with each other; some have beCome obsolete, and those given io Dock-yardliave not, on all occasions, been given to the rest; though necessary to preserve uniformity in the.management. The inconvenience arising ftom those causes,-na turally increasing with the progress tif , time, and the exteusioa of the service, the attention of the Admiralty came at length to be, necessarily callei to it ; and in their orders to the Navy Boa rd, the 524th of• June, 1764, and gad of June, Paha, they stated,." that though the orders and iustruaioes given for the general government of the. Yards and Ordinaries maybe sufficient for the wise 'purpose's •intended by them, . yet. as they are dispersed with. out enter or method in a variel of I ,V3rrants dillereat times, through a long Series of years, ...aLaasi they do not afford, in a proper and clear manna:, • the- information necessary :or tile eunduaof tie OffiCers and .Workmen of the Yards ; and they therefore dire Ct. the Navy Board to proceed im mediately to arrange and digest the said orders and instruetions under proper. heads, so as to coiepose one uniform body and system out of the whoie,, e!k ing care where there are any repetitions oldie same order, to adopt that where the sense is most eel - y explained, and best enforced ;" "but the arrangement thus proposed, owing to various causes, has never been dallied into •effe6.l - ; - and, from the line great addition to our Navy, and the accumulation ot or ders , • and instructions in consequence of i a still issued without any retrosped •or systematic regu- i larity, the evil which the Admiralty had it in view • to remedy is now immensely increased ; and the bringing into clear and regular order, what i s a t , present a great and undigested mass, is a work of :.o great magnitude. and difficulty, that it could not rea a • sonably be expeated to be accomplished by a .Board loaded, as the Navy Board has Leen, with busi ness.. Great progress was, however, made by one of our number, while he was. Comptroller of the. • NaYY: dbook, in which all Orders and . Regula tions, prior tea the year 1786, were classed and di- . ' gested under distinct heads, which 'he had prepared, was submitted to the perusal of the Commissioners • appointed in lin, to " Inquire into the fees, gra-e !Wit:es, perquisites, and eniu.dments of the several- Public Offices, and also into the abuses that may in the same ;" who, in their Sixth Report, thus express themselves, « The numerous regulaa• dons and standit b aa orders, which have fr om t i me ' . to time been made fur the (rood government of the Dock Yards, require to be' b reviewed, put in :order, and conneaed, so as, to be referred t 6 on every occasion ;" and they add, " The Navy : Board .have, since the Peace, had the measure 'under consideration,' rind a considerable progress • has been made, Abet - eft.. ,We have, seed and exaa--' 'mined the mode of its execution, which we highly:• ;appt — ove, and recommend being -carried fully into • etfect." . And the Commissioners of Naval 'lnqui ry, appointed in 180 , observe, - that, " The s: essity . ct revising ,the Instruetions, and digesting . lie inlinense mass of orders which . liae since been given to the:Officers of the ,Yards, was Seen by the., late Earl Heave, and. Sir Charles • Middleton, when .• they presided .at the 'Admiralty and Navy boards; and the latter:had made some progress in so useful.. work- when 'lre quitte:i - ,the Navy Board ; out , since that time the suhjeta ha 4 not been adveriA • to; .no steps have heea taken for forwarhi v hies. work; and it seems to Nave' been -laid asal.-, and wholly:forgotten:" In 'another part of tie sa:ue Report they add, "It is mutti to be' regretted- te..t ' this very useful work was ac,:ompkished, as it have greatly facithated the business of - a as a ,- vock-varde, and of or 'ad to the ,Nasy _Boaiat a Coniprtaensive -slew to the standing regulations, whereby : they would have ben enabled fa keep a better check u2on the due oLoservance. of -them, I '-~ ~:,~ I ,C`? r ~~~