The Sun. — London, England, 1857-02-21 00:00:00

rbtrbi Wbition SUN OFFICE, Six o'Clock.l SWEDEN. The following is the text of the royal speech de livered by the Viceroy of Norway at the opening of the Storthing on the 9th inst. `` Good gentlemen and Norwegians—Not being able to preside in person at the opening of your discust•ions, It is pleasing to me to leave the task to the cars of my Well-beloved son, the Prince Royal, the choice of whom ae *Viceroy of Norway has so well responded to the wish ci the n a ti on . I t i s w i t h paterna l joy an d gretitude that I see him surrounded with the love and confidence of the loyal Norwegian people. The proposition for °acidify h ing paragrap 14 of the l law (inter dicting the absence h of the Viceroy from the kingdom for more than three months in the year), which will be pre sented to you, has for object to reconcile the sojourn of ,the Viceroy in Norway with the exigencies resu lti ng from his position as heir to the throne of Sweden. unr friendly relations with all the foreign powers are n ot changed. In 1855, a treaty concluded with England and France strengthened the bonds of friend ship which united me to the Sovereigns of these two states. The Storthing assembles under happy aus- Piece, In spite of threatening appearances, the late few Years have beheld the welfare and commercial develop- Meat of the country increase, and have thus given us additional means to Rapport the charges which the in crease in the price of all articles of first necessity has t hr own on us , as we ll as on the majority of the states of independence of the kingdom, and the ulterior devel opment of the wealth of the country, justice and equity, not less than the true interest of the state, counsel me to ameliorate the position of the tGovernment functionaries—a measure which is rendered t h ece lleavy by the dearness of food—and to propose for a at purpose a considerable addition to the budget. I t , !Pleased to be able to point out the means of at -Inlng that object without causing any sensible in crease in the present taxes. The union between Nor- Z a 3' and Sweden becomes every day more intimate. I o re compr e h en d e d to its fullest extent the great work i lcy late f a th er — t h e union, so importan t f or th e in ePendence of the North, of two nations whom na ln re has made brothers. M efforts are therefore ?°llitantl directed towards the realisation of this sacred i nheritan c e reciprocity, friendship, and confidence, th respect for the rights of each ; community in affec• o : for our native country, loyalty, and ail that can ;!. tribute to the honour and independence of the two kingdoms. Animated with this idea, I have caused se yore.' affairs of common importance to the two countries tbe examined by a commission composed of Norwc rpe and Swedes. Propositions and communications the reciprocal .1 . be thus submitted to the Storthing on the subject commercial and maritime relations of t he two ki ngdoms, and on the bases of the taxes to be established for the maintenance of our independence. I : b c l P e e, , during th e present sess i on of the Storthing, to be to communicat e t o it a satisfactory result of the ;? e gotiation s opene d w i t h the D an i s h G overnment rela :,l_ve to th e S ound dues. The report on the situation of 'ue kingdom, which will be laid before you, presents in ° ne Part an account of th e d e velopment of public wealth, trod in anoth er th e na t u r e o f th e a ff a irs to the eolu ,„11 of which I have to call your attention. In soli "ng the- bl ess i ngs o f H ea ven on your labours, I re main, with all Royal kindness, your affectionate Sove reign, " OSCAR." After the Message had been read, one of the minis ters gave an account of th© situation of the kingdom during the last three years. The Viceroy then de clared the fifteenth ordinary Storthing of the king dom of Norway to be open. The President of the S torthing expressel to the Prince Royal the great s atisfaction which the Norwegian people felt at see irlg him at their head, and then all the assembly cried out unanimously, " May God protect the King, the country, and the kindred nation." The Vice roy returned to his palace, followed by all the mem bers of the Storthing • and other speeches were de li/ered there by hi s Royal Highness and the Presi dent of the Storthing. In the course of his speech, the latter said, "The presence of your Royal High ilese wilL encourage us in our labours, and will give us th e means of executing them in such a manner l i !Ei to insure real advantages to the country, for we l'eow that you love the liberties and rights of the People, and that you will always desire what is good and just. We are convinced that all the legitimate Wishes of the national representatives will obtain Your zealous support." NIPERIAL PARLIAMENT. HOUSE OF COMMONS.—(YESTERDAY.) THE IRISH POOR. In answer to Mr. MAGUIRE, Mr. BOUVERIE said that in consequence of his not receiving the support he expected last session in the bill he introduced on the subject, he did not intend to bring In another bill of the kind this session. He would, how ever, consider any bill the hon. gentleman might intro duce on the subject, and if he could he would support it. Mr. MAGUIRE said that he woul I adopt the sug gestion. • ORDER OF VALOUR. Captain SCOBELL asked the First Lord of the Trea sury when the Order of Victoria for Valour would be fist into operation, and whether he had any objection to the statutes and regulations under which that Order bad been established being placed upon the table of the house '1 Lord PALMERSTON said that the navy list of those entitled to the Order was complete, and that the army list was nearly so. As soon as it was complete the list would be published. He would lay on the table the statute referred to. THE MEGARA. TROOP-SHIP. Sir J. PAKINGTON moved the adjournment of the house to put some questions to the First Lord of the Admiralty, relative to the ship which left Portsmouth With 50 troops, and had to put back in a few days from the vessel having sprung a dangerous leak. Re said that he had received communications from some of the officers on board the ship stating that 'when the ship was about ono hundred and forty Tulles from land she sprung a dangerous leak, and tons ' s f water came in every minute, so that the cabins were flo oded. He gave a detailed account of the state of the whip from the information which he had received, which, Ile said, was at variance with the former statement of the First Lord of the Admiralty, and there was ne glect in sending] the ship to sea in such a dangerous state. Si C. WOOD denied that he stated or admitted on former occasion that the ship was sent to sea in a dangerous state. His information was derived from a report made to him, which showed that the ship had been sent to sea in, as was believed, a sound state, but that on exam i ning her in Plymouth dock, it was found that two snow holes, about the size of a man's finger , were op en seven feet below the water line, through which th e water came, but only in such quantities that it could be kept down by a band-bucket. The ship w" propel ly in. apected before she went to sea. The right honourable baronet read the reports of the various officers in re ference to this ship, which confirmed his previous state ment. Ne pains were spared to render the ship sea worthy, and the officers of the ship inspected h er b e f ore sailing, and expressed their satisfaction of her condition. The report of the military officers showed that the arrangements for the troops were satisfactory. He re peated his former statement that she left port in an efficient manner, but that she met with rough weather, and was injudiciously pushed against the sea which s t ra i ne d h er, and her leakage was an unavoidable accident from stress of weather. He did not think the dockyard officers werq to blame. PERSIA. • Mr. LA.YARD referred to the rumoured treaty that had b een s i gne d b e t ween Russia and Persia, by Which a portion of was with a question of . th regard to our the Turkish territory bad been ce d ed to Russ i a. It g re at importance t o this country Indian possessions , and required an ex pl an ation from the Gove r nment ; and if he had asked for an explanation, or had made remonstrances to the Russian Minister in this cou n t ry' Re asked if the Persian negotiations at ned of the Paris h a d been broken off, and he co rnyi delay of th e production of the papers relating topersial .Lord PALISIE RSTON said that be knew no thing of member. such treaty, except that stated by l at Paris It was not true that the Persian negotiations rea had been suspended or interrupted, and he had no an , the bon. son to alter his former opinion as to the result, . o a, under.these circumstances he considered a discussion t . the matter in th at house must have a very It jurions effect—(hear, hear)—and he asked for a little further delay before laying the paper on the table. It would not have been right for her Majesty's Govern ment to interfere, or make an y remonstrance w i t h the Russia n Minister ' on such information as that given to the house. SHIPPING OF GOODS. VanNEWDEGATE called att ent i on to the present adopted at the cu s t om -h ouses relative to the return of imports and exports of goods at the various ports, and put a question in reference to it. Mr. WILSON said that the tables were produced by tlsile,ll--.oard of Trade. S o far as his knowledge went, knew of no order for any change in thi s matter. It mi ght have a pp eare d that where there was a laxity of infrme.tion, ve the clerks of th e Custom House might ha called. on the merchahts and desired the, ra to be mare particular in future,. - DESTITUTE SOLDIERS' WIVE& Sir 3 TYRRELL again called the attentioa of the tinder Secretary for War to the destitute state of the soldiers' wives and children outside the camp at Colchee ter. They amounted to 130 families. The women were suffering the greatest rsisery. One woman with seven 'children had On One day but a pennyworth of potatoes and a halfpennyworth of greens to subsist on, and had it not been for private charity, the consequen ces must have been frightf u l. There were 30 young married females living on a penny a-day and the women and children bad to sleep in hovels, and wherever they coull The misery arose from the stoppage of the soldiers' pay , . Mr, FREDERICK PEEL said alit instructions had been given to General Gaccoigne, who had the command of the camp at Colchester ; and, until he had received his report he coul , l not state anything decisive. It would be a bad precedent to afford relief in this instance from the army fund, and to break through the army regulations, in reference to soldiers marrying. He saw no reason for their marrying— #aughter)—for they were very young men, and were only enlisted for 10 years. BILLETTING SOLDIERS. but it was produced much more by the visitation of Provi dence. We had had three bad harvests, and we bowed to the decree of a Power before which even Parliaments must with humility bend. Bat this is the first time that a Chan cellor of the Exchequer has come forward with a plan creating an enormous and increasing deficiency—(cheers) —and that, too, in the face of a House of Commons, the cardinal point of whose financial policy his beea through out its now long'existence to accomplish the extinction of the income tax. So that we have brought oar finances to this position,—that the year 1860—when the policy of 1853, on which the hope and expectation of Parliament and the country have rested for the extinction of the in come tax, was to have been accomplished—is to witness not its extinction but its perpetuation, and instead of receiving that relief from taxation to whirls wo bave been looking forward with such anxiety, we an the n to be called upon for new taxes to meet a deficiencywlsi chma y amount to not less than 10,C00,600/. (Hear, ban )I ) am, of course, perfectly aiding to admit that fi,geres of this kind must be received with considerable indalgnme on beth sides of the house. (Hear, hear.) There m ay be counter vailing causes which to a cert a i n ex t en t may alter t hese calculations; the consuming po wer f or i n stance; on w hich so much of our finaucial syste m ver y p ro perly rests, may increase, though we most remem b er th a t it isat the pre sent moment a consumin g p ower a t hi g h pricer, and there fore we must not rest too mu c h on th a t. But admi ttin g that your customs may i ncrease , thi s groa t fast remain s, that in the year 1860, if we p ursue th e fi na ncial plan intro duced on Friday night to its consequences, itatead of wit nessing the extinction of the income tax, we than have to grapple with a colossal deficlency. Uudler Wire drawn stances I thought it my duty to place en the table tho re solution to which I am about to ask the home to agree. Let ns see what, if I am right in my estimateof the con sequences of the plan of th e r i g ht h on . gentleman, would be the wisest and most t em p era t e course to adapt. If th e home really believes that we are menace d by deficiency, what can be more judici ous th an t o procee d neon this ex cellent principle of financ e — w hi c h, i n d ee d, oust be t he ' basis of all sound financi a l sc h emes —t o a , ljcst the esti mated income and expendit ure i n suc h a manner as is b est calculated to prevent a defi c i enc y, an d then it pursua nce of a policy to which I believe thi s h ous e is pledged to pro vide in the best manner we can f or enabling ?ar li a ment in the year 1860 to remit the whole of the income tax , as was promised to the country in 1853. That is the obj ect of the resolution which I placed on the table; but no Boner had I given notice of this resolution than a moat extraordi nary change occurred in the financial world. The right hon. gentleman the Chancellor of the Exchequer was at the table--the house being in Committee of Supply— moving a vote to which there was no opposition, and he took advantage of that opportunity to offer to the house a supplement to his financial statement of the preceding Fri day, introducing elements, in my opinion, entirely incon sistent with the statements, arguments, and plans which he had provious!er laid before u'. I am not complaining of this; the right hon. gentleman has a right, of course, to make two financial statements if ho chooses —there have been Chancellors of the Exchequer who have made even more--(langhter)—l am only putting before the house a narrative of these incidents. And what was the right hon. gentleman's statement of Monday night? It was appa rently addressed to my resolution, which was then in the possession of the house. He said, very frankly, I own, I can answer the motion of which notice has just been given at once," and, mentioning mo , he said I seemed to fear a great deficiency in the years 1858-9 and 1850-60, but that there was in reality no fear of any such deficiency. " I will tell, you," said the right hon. gentleman, " what are my estimates of the expenditure for those years" (he might have told us on Friday, but that is nothing); "aod I will tell you bow I mean to meet that e xpenditure." his The for those gentleman, years, and with they great varied frankness, very gave us but not in any degree so as to a ffect m y argmument con , from the figures which I had assumed before he made that snp cplluesniroenntwarays j s u ta s t t e , m on en e t a , c l h ea y vi e n a g r , a th v e a r s e t fore,if y first deficiency. "But," says the right hon. ge ntleman, "there will be no d e fi c i ency , because we aro going to adopt the expenditure of 1853-1." No doubt if the Government bo going in 1853-59 to adopt the expenditure of 1853, that is an important element in the consideration of the financial plan. But if that be the case, although I do not complain for a moment of tho pre vious criticisms into which I bare been betrayed by the right hon. gentleman making his statement on Friday— which I considered to be a statement of authority —Incon sistent with that which he made on Monday, I say if that be the case, and if we aro to take the statement of Mon day, as I do without complaint, as the authentic state ment, what are the irresistible inferences which we are to draw from it? In the first place, one naturally asks if there is to bo that vast reduction in 1858-9 which is to prevent these enormous deficiencies, what is the reason that the reduction has not some effect in 1857-58 ? (Hear, hear.) Let us know what are the causes which will enable the Government in 1858-53 to make a reduction of which, according to the representation of Friday, no hope was held out for 1857-58. (Hear, hear.) If I go through all the beads into which the Chancellor of the Exchequer ela borately analysed the estimates which had not been intro duced by their respective Ministers on Friday--if I go through his analysis of all the causes of excess of expendi ture in 1857-58 over 1853, I cannot find—except in that poor item of " unfulfilled contracts," for which a large es tanate, including gunpowder and timber, would be 500, 001.—that any of them, according to his views, would be less influential in 1858-59 than iu 1857-58. But now, after that statement of the right Lon. gentleman, I want the house to consider this :—What would bo the effect if in 1857-58 the Governmet t would do that which they say they aro prepared to do in 1858-9 ? Let me show to the house the effect of that upon our income and expenditure. We are to fall back in 185i-59 to the expenditure of 1853-54. Now, the gross expenditure of 1853-51, as stated by the Chancellor of the Exchequer on Monday, was 55,810,00 1 /. Add to that the increased charge of flu debt, 716,0001. ; a 1(1 the Exchequer Bonds to bo paid off in 1857.58, 2,000,0101; add also the Sinking Fund for 1857-53, 250,000/., and the total will be 58,6136,000/. That is an estimate for 1857-58, drawn up on the expenditure of 18 , 3-54, which is to be the basis of 1858-59. Now, this is very important; and let me press it therefore upon the at tention of the house. Having ascertained that we might have an expenditure of 58,836,0001., let us see what the the income of 1857-58 would be on the supposition that the income tax was not increased beyond 53., and that there was no increase in the tea and sugar duties. The income estimated by the Chancellor of the Exchequer on Friday was C 6,361,000/. From that deduct for the 2d. on the income-tax, 2,000,000/. ; deduct also the tea and sugar duties, which I take at 911,0001., and we have then the income for the ennui- g year 63,455,000 1 ., against an expenditure of 58,836,000/. We thus should have, according to the new position of Monday, a surplu s theat end of the year of upwards of 4,000,000/. in the ex chequer without adding any now taxes whatever, without increasing the income tax, which ought to be only 5.1. in the pound if we adhered to the old system, and without adding to the taxes upon sugar and tea. The right hon. gentleman, then, by the statement which he made on Mon day, has opened a most interesting subject of speculation which I ain sure every hon. member must appreciate. (Hear, and a laugh.) Now, how do we stand in t his mat ter ? because it is exceedingly ' difficult to deal with a finan cial statement which has apparently two c olours and two forms and aspects. If the statement of Friday be the au thentic statement, wo aro about to be landed i n a great de ficiency, and there is no hope whatever of seeing the end of the income tax in 1860. If, on the other hand, the version of Monday ho the orthodox version we not only get a re duction of the income tax immediately, and we not only have no recourse to those indirect taxes which have created so much odium out of doors, an 1 which are so much opposed here, but we have a fair prospect also of getting rid of the income tax in 1860 altogether. But it is impossible that two results can be more different. (Hear, hear.) If wo are to adhere to the budget of Friday, it's deficiency ; if, on theother band, we aro to fall back, as we were told that we were on Monday, to the expenditure of 1853, we have be fore us the most rosy prospect that a financial Minister ever introduced to the House of Commons, especially at the termination of a War. (Hear, hear.) I should think, then, that a debate upon the scope anti tendency of these financial propositions is not at all irrelevant or unneces sary. Now, I know it will be sail that in the estimate which I have offered there is an element as regards the last two years of the right honourable gentleman's plan, assuming that ;he really adopts the expenditure of 1853, w hi c h I emitted ; but I assure the right honourable gentleman that I have not forgotten it, According to the estimate of income and expenditure for 18 - 1 and 1858 t w h h a i t ch th t e h r e e drawn np on the basis of the expenditure of 1853 I have shown to the house that without any increase of taxation whatever there would actually be left in the exchequer a s wO r tl p l l a us b e e x l c e a ft ed i i n n t ghreaCe° q °ll;e7 t a h b a o t u i t s tli to a t sum right hon. gentleman will obtain by that large portion of the war income tax which is not yet paid. That is the exactaum probably which would be found as surplus in the exchequer. Otherwise, without the war income-tax for 1857-58, the expen diture and income would exactly balance themselves you took the expenditure of 1853 . The right tb,e expenditure of 1853 ther e is an item of vast amount B h u o P n P . ° g li en t t l h e a m t il, however , may say to me, " But if you take a w hieli Will enter into sagealculation of 1858-59 and 1859- in 1857.58—1 mean the charge ta i a war debt of 1,500,0001. There for the sinking fund for 1857-58 did balance fore, if the income and expenditure :2. f . CO—which is h ot. inclu Lo war income themselves rafter that surplus derived from tax wa r s deducted thorl) *meld be a deficiency o x Nee', upon those to o 4 i 0115 ' 4 \ -1V B i"."ltgCant that, ' firant you established the e xpenditure of 1653 ati the Basle of your operations and if on did All thatl have sketched out ; that you would find a deficiency iii corisequence 4 of the sinking fund for the war debt of 1,500,000 1 . for the last two +ears of the right hon. gentleman's plan. But remember that we surpluses and eollor of the Exche quer's have hi the dicliequei : a WOO upwards of 4,000,000/. I do not mean to say that that 4i000,000/, can legally be ap plied at the present moment to the liquidation of the sink eesl4:h is :—lelere you sink ing fund, or even to the payment of the exchequer bonds of Monday y f 1853, carry on but atev s e e r e , ba lancesth e lai ist twoto rigidy e ar st:o permit The la of the c respecting ha queer; applying it without tippertling to Parliament,; can,what b y t the fallingeff e back k the to statementthe esestablishments i o s f h m M e o n n t d s and with a large surplus at the end of the current year of the affair§ of the totinirY Without any new upwards of 4 3 003,000/. in your exchequer ; but in the last two ears of the right hon. gentleman's plan th ere w ill b e a deficiency ill conseqUenee of the action of a Special sinking fund for tho liquidation of the war debt, But when we recolleet that that large balance has been ebtained by war taxation in a time of pe4ce / do not see ally the Chancel lor of the Exchequer, instead of imposing new and vexa tious and edieue taxes,upon the people, should not come forward and ask, the House of Oemmoas whether in equity that sutplets bf 4;000,000/1 might riot be Spplied to the liquidation of the war debt. (Hear.) In that cage, accord ing to the statement of Monday, the right hon, gentleman might carry us through the three years of his scheme with out increasing any of our taxes, and might he enabled to deeloVith the income.tax by th ,d of the terminable an + snail other moans as might th .d • nuities en, ee. , , en provi entiaby arise. (fear.) What a different plan nay t,:s; r alaa:.faaliQr . of the Eachequer adopted ! The Chancelor of the Exche p_ , ei ill this state of the financ es ; co mes forward and pro poses new taxes: The Chancellor of the) -lao h aqUer enters into an essay as to the comparative merits of direct and indirect taxatiop—a barren subject for this house and the country, for whatevei their relatiVe inbriOi mak be,it is clear that our revenue must be derived both from direat and indirect taxation, and we must appeal to both to a very large extent, But the Chancellor of the .Exchequer finds himself in this position, according to the I"riday view, that he comes forward to propose the most odious of direct taxes and the most odious of indirect taxes. (Cheers.) Sir, with regard to the income-tax, I am not on.) to show that this house will resist a fair introduction of direct taxation in our system, but direct taxation has never taken a more in tolerable form then in the income tax, (Loud cheers.) It has been condemned by the voice of the country and the decision and policy of this house. I aced not enter into the catalogue of its enormities—that it is unjust, unequal; and inquisitorial. There are very few who have listened to me who have not had personal proof of therm qualities. (A. laugh.) These are grievances which are not to be borne in time of peace and with the income tax as a permanent feature of our national system. In a national emergency these grievances are not felt. At such a moment private omission of provision for the Persian war. I will not dwell upon the fact that this country is at present at war with distant countries, but that in these estimates no pro vision is made for the expenditure to which those wars will lead. lam still willing to believe that we are to have peace with Persia, and that we are not at war with China. It is, of course, impossible entirely to shut out the know ledge of existing circumstances and the consideration of their influence upon our finances; but I will, as much as may be, remove them from the question, and will, if pos sible, confine myself to the financial fuels and the financial speculations which have been introduced to the house by the Chancellor of the Exchequer. In the year 1857 58, then, we are to have an expenditure of 65,475,000/., with an income of 66,365,000/. The house will recollect that one of the most important items of that estimated income accrued from the income tax itself. The right hon. gentle man besides the 7,000,000/. which ho will obtain if we raise the tax 2d., will be in the enjoyment of 4,250,000/. sterling arising from the produce of the war income tax. Now, sir, having stated to the house the expenditure and income of 1857-58, I want to put before it also the income and expenditure of the year 1858-59, the second year of the right hon. gentleman's plan. As regards the income, I have taken as far as I could the figures which were afforded to me by the right hon. gentlemen. The house will understand that any figures that I read, unless they have been furnished by the Government, I offer, of course, with diffidence; yet in my general conclusions I havegiven so large a margin that if my views are right in the main the results will not be affected by any inaccuracy on the score of figures. This, then, is the estimate for 1858-9,the second year of the right hon. gentleman's plan :—He took for 1857-3 the estimated revenue from the Customs at 22,850,000/. This calculation suppeseel the duty on tea to be ls. 7d. per lb. instead of le. 9d., the rate for the current year; and it reckoned the duty on refined sugar at 18s. 4J. per cwt., i• stead of eoe But in 1838.9 the duty on tea will be 2d. less per lb., and that on refined sugar Is. Bd. less per cwt. I, of course, have the greatest difficulty in forming an estimate of our probable loss on tea and sugar, in the event of the Chancellor of the Exchequer's proposi tion for 1858-9 being accepted. I therefore offer, unaffsct edly, rather a suggestion than 'a formal statement of figures ; but I have estimated that the loss may be on tea 46a,000/., and on sugar 442,0001., making together a total of 911,000/. I take the Customs, then, for 1859-9 at 22,339,000/. ; the Excise at 17,000,0001. (being the figures of the right hon. gentleman) ; the stamps I take at the same amount as in 1857-B—viz., 7,450,0001. ; the land and assessed taxes at 3,150,0001. ; the income tax, reduced to 7d. in the pound, I take at 7,000,000/. ; the Post-office at the same sum as in 1857-B—viz., 3,000,0001.: the Crown lards at 265,000/. ; and the miscellaneous revenue at 1,200,0001. The total income from these various sources will be 61,404,0001. [The Chancellor of the; Exchequer here made a remark impunging the accuracy of the right hon. gentleman's calculations.] I think that my figures will be found to be correct, but I:shall not stop to go over them again at this moment. Now for the exoenditure of 1858-9. I take the estimated charge for the debt at 28,550,000/. This, of course, ought to include the interest on the whole of the war debt ; but there must be deducted from this charge the interest on the 2,000,000/. of Exche quer-bonds, amounting to 70,0001., which will make 28,480,0001. Next, I take the charge on the Consolidated Fund at the same scale as in 1357-B—viz. ' 1,770,000/. ; th e Army I take at 11, 1 -23,0001. ; the navy at 8,109,000/. ; the packet service at :365,0001. ; the civil service at 7,250,000/. ; the collection of the revenue at 4,215,000/. ; and the super annuations at 475,000/. This gives a total of 62,889,0001. There are two other addition d items, the first of which is the 2,000,000/.of Exchequer-bends payable in 1858-9; and the sum of 1,50000/ for the sinking fund in the same year. These items added to the former total produce an aggregate of 66,389,000/. I ought to state why I have taken the army, the navy, and the civil services at the same figures as the right hon. gentleman reckoned them for the year 1857-8. The right hon. gentleman, when he made his financial statement a week ago, in applying himself to the ' discussion of the great estimates, entered into an elaborate argument to show us that no very considerable reduction could be looked for on these items. The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER—That is this year. Mr. DISRAELI—I beg the right hen. gentleman's par don. He will have an opportunity of following me in the debate, and it is not necessary that ho should interrupt me. But, unfortunately, on Friday last the whole tenour of his argument was that on the whole of these items— the army, the navy; and the civil service—the increased charge was of a permanent character, because he compared the estimates of 1857-8 with those for the throe years im- ' mediately before the war, and stated that the current year is theporiod of transition from war to peace. The current year has witnessed a vast reduction in our expenditure. But, our present estimates not having been laid before us by the Minister of the Crown previous to hisfinancial state ment, I will take the liberty of introducing them now in detail, and show from analysis the excess of the present over the corresponding estimates in the time of peace. I will prove, in fact, that there is no ground for reduction with the exception of one item, on which the right hon. gentleman laid very little stress -and I believe rightly so—viz., the unfulfilled contracts. He analysed the expenditure under , six distinct heads; and, though I will not weary the house with minute detail, I must recall this circumstance to the right hon. gentleman's recollection, to show that his argu mentscannot apply to 1857-8, the ensuing year. Indeed the whole or his reasoning tended to convoy to us the impression that, exclusive of the unfulfilled contracts—to which he attached but small weight—the principle of reduction could not be carried out to any appreciable extent. With regard to the navy, having given us five great items of excess, the right hon. gentleman said that one of them was for an in crease in the marines and coastguard. This, he told us, was the result, not of a war act, but of an act passed in time of peace. He next informed us that the price of pre visions is high—rile of the other causes of the increase ; thirdly, that the scientific veto was augmented ; that the fourth cause of additional expense during the ensuing year is the item of unfulfilled contracts, which I have al ready mentiono , l. We have very recently obtained some information that will guido us in ascertaining the amount of the last-named extra charge, and we may, I think, safely conclude that it will not be very considerable. Then the right hon. gentleman said that the vote for steam ma chinery and coal would be grez.ter than before in conse quence of the progressive introduction of steam power into our navy—that owing to this circumstance we must look to an additional expenditure, permanent in its nature. Then came the increase in the factories in which to rep dr our machinery, for enlarging our docks, and for the exten sion of the packet service. Now, none of these items for next year, with the single exception of that for unfulfilled contracts, is for purposes of a temporary character. There foee I do not suppose that the right hon. gentleman antici pated the possibility of making any reduction upon his estimates. Continuing the line of remark to which ho has called my attention by his interruption, and coming next to the army, hero again we had from him the same descrip tion of analysis. And the house will observe, whether we look to the artillery branch, to the creation of new military trains and a new hospital corps, to the item of 223.0.01. for warlike stores (the result of unfulfilled contracts), to arti ficers' wages, or to education, works or buildings, that the result of the analysis was that, in the right hon. gentle man's opinion, reduction was not the meals by which the financial arrangements of the country could be carried into effect. Threfore I believe lam perfectly justified in taking for the expenditure of 1858-9 the same estimates as he proposes for the ensuing year 1857.8, and in neither case adverting to the existence of war, or to the possibility of fresh misconceptions, which might lead to an increased expenditure. The consequence of that will bo that, with an expenditure for 1858-59 of 66,300,0001., and an income of 61,000,0001., you will have an apparent deficiency of about 5,000,0001. sterling. This, then, is the result of the second year of his plan. I think I may fairly ask the house whether this is not a result which should at least call upon us to reflect, and whether, before wo sanction finan cial arrangements whioh, upon the face of the statement of the right hon. gentleman, threaten such an issue in the second year of his scheme, it does not become our duty, previously to going into Committee of Ways and Means, to examine the whole scope and tendency of the plan of the Government, and clearly ascertain its probable effect 1 But if the second year of the scheme leads to a deficieuey of 5,000,000/., what becomes of the year 1859-60—its third year, and the year, too, which is to witness, according to the general idea of the house, the extinction of the income tax'? All the causes of deficiency which prevail in 1858- 59 equally prevail in the ease of 1859 , 6:' § with the addition of another reduction of the duties on tea and sugar: • Sir, I shall not attempt to estimate exactly what will be the amount Or the decoild reduction of tlioo duties; bat the house will see that the general effect of the right hom gen tleman's plan would be that nit the end of its third year we should And An at , dumitlated lieficiendy, according to his stathibent of Friday last, about 10;000,0001. This is what would hapjion just off We have arrived at the point whe n We ought to trace off the income tax. prodticing 7,000,000/s sterling. That appeared to me to be a very grave position of affairs. (Hear, hear.) who *o h m be the oondition of this canary iry in the Year 1860 at the termiiiatielti of tile right hob. gentleman's plan, it 'fourid itself with an aeon mtilated deficetick of perhaps 10,000,000/.3, and at th,e sane time Were asked te renew the income tai t all kfioW what would bo the inevitable consequences of a proposal to renew the income taxi withaeonvietion in the country that it was to Near a Dernianentreatire of oui finaiicialsjtstem I vellture to say—as I said the other night— that every con troversy which has beeri appeaSed; though not settled, by the belief that thA iiientht tat was to d'eas6 in iBtile wdttld be reaived. (Hear, hear.) Every class, every section that is now under the belief that it entered into a compact with the Chaneello of the Exchetier of thA i tiine *gold come forward te demand the fgason Why that compact was violated, (Fear, hear.) Yon would have one body of inen who would say, " It was because we were told that the income tai wlul'oeitse in 1860 that *e Submitted to the pueceisied duty.- (Hear, hear.) The Irish mem bes'—l believe the income tax is not very popular in Ire land—(hear, hear) —naturally, remembering tho Vecullar circumstances under Which th6y were drat led into this ferY properly donee forward and Airy "We aea e llieseed in the extension Of the initonie hi tolreland because we Were told That it *as part of a system which secureci s ata extinction at a particular period." (Hoar.) As for England itself we can form some ulea by the agita tion of the last autumn of the, r;haiaictef of the questions which would arise kiiike. Graduated scales, distin ctions of assessments—the old quarrel between precarious and high incomes--whether trade Profita are to r6y as high a rate as rents de4ved rrefii kear property or the dividends of the nublie creciitor—whether professional remuneration is to he taxed at the same rate &en AS, trade . profits — who are to be exempt—these are the queatiolis which you would then have to discuss,; and under what circum stances ApParently, according to the financial state meht of the right hen; gentlemau, with a a l astaCceuittlated the t t ‘ll.e w e h as c a h the a r h t o l fi d atth arrive. ear ber rassrnent, and instead of the prospect of the extinction which the right hon. gentleman introduced or even mitigation of the tax § y the Very ir4oesibilita'd its : • F a h i o n t .:_ ii m g ei e c a n i t c o l e a al l u n i extinction, seemed to me to be insured by the policy which was very p W op e ula h r av i e n on was supported Friday nig b h y t, the groat body of gentleman a this n house, u financialn se to , systemnoticewhch ken it ranged over a wider territorly and n tnhi : t n wohpipcohs the basis right ef bon. that gentleman scheme wa was occupied t he extinction e other That was a prospective system also but the income tax, and every measure of importance connected with it some relation to the year 1860, Ix t which time that e nc was to take place. But the new scheme of prospective xt finance has a peculiar and distinctive feature of its own, not the extinction, but the perpetuation of the income tax' Wo have before in this country suffered under deficits, as, I dare say, many hon. gentlemen remember. They have been a cause of great anxiety to this house, and of deep despon dency in the country generally; but at any rate we can say this of them—that they were the consequence of misma nagement anti misfortune. They came unexpectedly, they accumulated gradually, and ,though they assumed at length, from their vast dimensions, a formidable and menacing character, still everybody was obliged to allow that, how ever deplorable such a result might be, it could in a great degree be accounted for by inevitable causes. We had a deficiency in the year 1841, which no doubt was to be traced iurAome measure to a reckless reduction of taxation in 1839; of the In reply to Mr. COWAN, Sir G. GREY said that notice would be given of the clauses to be introduced into the Mutiny Act. NEW WRIT. A new writ was moved for North Leicestershire, in the r )om of Lord Granby, called to the Upper House. RETURNS. Several unopposed returns were ordered. WAYS AND MEANS. THE BUDGET. The erder of the day for going into Committee of Ways and Means having been read, Mr. GLADSTONE presented a petition from a com mittee of West India planters and m erchants, ex p ressing the surprise and disappointment with which they bad learned the intention of her Majesty's Government to pro pose the continuance of the war tax upon sugar. They re presented that if the proposal should be agreed to they would be subjected to serious loss, that the supplies of sugar would be discouraged from coming to this country, and that the sugar-market would be annually disturbed for a series of yeais. They therefore prayed the house not to adopt the scheme of the Government. On the question that the SPA'AKER do leave.the chair, Mr. DISRAELI rose and said—Sir, before the house proceeds to consider in committee the financial arrange ments of her Majesty's Government I ask them to adopt the resolution of which I have given notice. In offering some statements and arguments to the house, which I hope may persuade them to adopt that resolution, it is nay in tention, so far as I can, to conduct the discussion in that temperate spirit which I think discussions of this nature essentially require. This is a financial debate, and so far as I am concerned I shall not introduce into it any topic which may in any way lead the house to depart from the consideration of those financial details which are now before us, and a sound judgment upon which appears to me to be of the utmost importance to the community at large. We have, and always will have, great differences of opinion in this house on political subjects of importance, whether fo reign or domestic. I dare say that differences of opinion will always exist in this house as to the manner in which our foreign relations shall be conducted, and there will also be differences of opinion upon subjects such as that which occupied our attention last evening—namely, as to what classes shall be the depositories of political power in Eng land ; but there is one question upon which there ought not to be a difference of opinion in this house—namely, the importance of maintaining our finances in a whole some condition, and of taking care that the Government of the country do not impose taxes which are unneces sary. Now, I willingly and at once approve the course which has been proposed by hor Majesty's Government with regard to the war income tax. Since I have devoted attention to the subject I have always considered that the existence of that impost involved a public grievance. Considering the spirited manner in which the people of this country supported the Ministry during the late war, —considering the generous and almost lavish manner in which they placed their resources at the disposal of the Government in that arduous struggle.—l think it would have been a groat political mistake if the people had dis covered that they were saddled with a heavy burden which did not in its origin cerise from their own free will, and which, according to their understanding, had been ob tained almost by a clerical error in an act of Parliament. I have no doubt the people of this country are prepared at all times to endure such burdens and to make such sacri fices as they tbink are necessary for the public advantage; but if they make a sacrifice they require—and I think it is not unreasonable that they should require—that at least they shall make it of their own free will, and that it shall be an act of their spontaneous devotion. Now, when we doubled the income tax to carry on the war there is no doubt that the whole community heartily acceded to the proposition. They agreed to double the income tax in order to carry ou the war, and they consented that the in creased impost should continue for a year after the war had ceased. That was clearly understood throughout the country, and by all classes of the community. The lan guage by which that burden was entailed upon them for another year was introduced into an act of Parlia ment of comparative insignificance, not into that by which the tax was doubled, and it certainly was not at the time understood by the great body of the people that the consequence of our legislation would Le not merely to double the income tax, but to enfor.e that double tax; granted for carrying on the war, for two years after that war had ceased. When the people discovered this they were surprised and indignant, and it became in my mind, not a financial but a political question —a question whether it was politic to allow the disposition of the people, which during the war bat been so ad mirablo, to be soured by such circumstances, and whether, if wo continued pedantically to adhere to the let ter of the bond, wo could in future emergencies appeal to popular feeling with equal success. Considering that this was a political and not a financial question, I deeply re gret that her Majesty's Ministers should have permitted that agitation to exist which in the autumn did prevail on this subject. I know it may be said that Parliament was not sitting at the time, and there was therefore no meaesof communicating to the country the disposition of the Go vernment to evince their sympathy for the spirited man ner its which the people had supported them in the war by conceding to their request of exemption from this doubled tax. But, though Parliament was not sitting, there are other means of communicating to the country the intent ions of the Government, there are morals either by a speech or by a letter, by which we know that public opinion can be tranquillised or can be agitated, and I regret vary much that her Majesty's Ministers did not think it consistent with their duty to coinmunicaae to the public during the autumn the intention which they have since announced in Parliament. The noblelord the First Minister, for example went down to ILnchester because he wished to express to : the country his opinions upon an important political treaty. The noble lord might when this agitation had assumed a disagreeable character, when not merely a grievance was : complained of, but the very principles upon which the tax was to be continued were discussed, have availed himself of similar machinery, and havecommunicated the determi nation of the Government to redress this public grievance. However, we were disappointed in that respect. There was another opportunity at which that communication might ar ve lwva have naaannms oc been eleuon :st graciousl yoo;dlualtindhndi tsnlineoiueSpeech dpnes would m bee ccle a hu d ref e enhr: :atremh: have It t beho w dreno. war nTs moatho, a ir; thfoatnhte gracious tpoi announcedppi aoetnr opportunity u n i opening tsoio o tn f hyg P aia. lso s e iste subject. re d _ f w a I s dealingen i mentioned ed with that a what I strictly the first night of the session th a t I s h ou ld as k the opinion n of ow the sa h y, ou t s b e a u t pr eo t n h political question, and not with a fi nanc i a one ' • that I be lieved there was a great public grievanc e which ou to be redressed ; and that I thought it advis a bl e and proper that the redress of that grievance should take placeimnse diately after Parliament assembled; and that, as the Minis ters themselves did not offer ouch redress, I thought it was consistent with the duty of a member of Parliament not s connected with them to make the attempt. In so doing it was not my intention to interfere, nor did I consider that I in any way interfered, with the financial arrangements of the Chancellor of the Exchequer. I did not ask him for his budget; I did not ask him for his estimates, If the Government had, on my motion, taken the opportunity of announcin g their policy with respect to this grievance, they would net have been pressed for their financial measures ; they might have brought them forward after the expiration of an interval of a month from this time. However, those measures are before the house, and it is necessary that we calmly and accurately discuss their effect. f3ir, I have 21 , 3 wish at any time to indulge in prospective fineneta .i. agree that it is more convenient, I shottld say tiost convenient, in discussing the financial position DI the country, to con , fine ourselves to the current year, whose fortunes Vve are endeavouring to lay before the house. (Hear.) But On the present occasion, remind the h ouse ;L • sin commenting upon if I prospective finantee I must ae a which is, it its character and proVlsions, essentially pro f_P_7" (Hear, he ar .) It i s no t I who have introduced the P t eepective element into our debates on this subject it is for e t Chancellorhe house of a theExchequerrrpectre budget himself, foundedwupon hasho hon. g en tl eman the pan= Other budget eminently mem p b r e o r s prospective—vie., University the tha t of o f the right Oxford (Mr. Gladstone) for the year 1653. The Chancellor of the Exchequ th er e , tti Other night, did not confine his ken to only upon that, On the commencementcontrary, and cal of the ensiling year. butthe right hon, gentleman, hot ' to finances fora position night—the night on vehrc e ll l ; : ; cl of three sketched the posit' also upon another occasion, of . the Exchequer with re gard statement, under theutahme name i u g f h t h 15ean e nt made a n t his ßu years.mfi m rs e t d u ti p O d ° p his t il u l4 v c t i e l j a w ) a y s l adopted I shall be able to doand said, that and in the course of the next threegiesars." The"ri other things If h in t h y üb pila g n is e n this and tleman did more than thi s . not merely as regards his schemes,plan i3. is protpecrite, not pockets ; because ho proposed br takes also as l'eg l ev i e d for a period of pa t uu hree ,r time,Malt our slid which are oven to yei trst, a_ea 'which arc to be Therefore, those who vary during that s about to should find fault with the motion whic in troduce to the notice, and I hope to the tec a ce m [i of the p ose that house, on the ground that it interferes prospectively with the finances of the country—though I do iio stt upon mature reflection frach an objection will b r e urged— must have forgotten the budget of the Chancellor of the Exchequer, and the nature of the financial arrangements which we now have to discuss. It is, I repeat, the Chan , seller of the Exchequer who has, by what hn tans his " plan," introduced the prospective element into our i 11 11:44: is utterly ucupsosnioteshe, tc.lraint giesmuettnetralywibmicphoshsiohlpetotpoofto impossible to offer any critictsm ttn wa the schemes which he has submitted to our tieti'7,, unless we consider their bearing not merely upon the present year, but also upon the subsequent years befare the period arrives when, as we had hoped, the inco' A e tax was, according to thealantge ment of 1853, Ihave which the wo general el • ~Jet ions to offer to that plan upon k ric h ' dilated on Friday evening. I thin hon. gentleman to cease. Now, sir, cause financial embarrassment, and to render the remission thitt the inevitable consequences of that pla will be to difficult but absolutely of the income tax in 1860 not merely impossible. These are the two great, o bjections which I en tertain to the financial plans of the Chancellor of the Ex chequer, as elaborately described to the house on Fr i day night. Now with permission of the hous e, with very little appeal to figures, and that as su cinct a s p ossible, I will e ndeavour to show the grounds on which I int end to support these obj ect i ons ment to make expenditure aryl- I com e • recollect upon the estimates of that the which the ' hoffered for the year right hon. at this moment very little corn-, 1857_58 . I ng t hon. gentleman accuracy or do not want to inguire captiously into the wisdom of those statements. The house will penditure for the ion ' ex gentleman estimated the _ which was to he year 1857-58 at the sum of 65,474,000/a defrayed by an income of 66,365,00 0 /., g a surplus revenue of between /. I do not, this, e t oo,oZO!,and ? , 30, 11 00 t 0 he iu mentionioo THE SUN, LONDON, SATtIRbAT EVENING, FEBRUAR Y 21, 1867, grievances are absorbed in public patriotism, and no one thinks of its injustice, its inequality, and its inquisito rialness, if he believes that the honour or existence cf the country ie at stake. (Cheers.) In such an emergency no ono criticises the tax; but just in proportion as it is ex empt from criticism at a period of public danger, the mo ment a period of tranquillity returns you will find a re action of odium to that degree that the tax is, perhaps, more criticised than it deserves. (Hear.) But the result is that income and property tax is the most odious form of direct taxation, and I protest against that easy mode of argument which prevails, and which holds that any per son who opposes the income tax is opposed to direct taxa tion. (Hear.) When I oppese it it is as the most odious main e thearticlebe Ex chequerou e article more than another which, in my opinion, the Chan of:l.form i e onerdn l o oci. f d is efe i,tsoth gifetroaeEixdcoexatgbtciathtotaoenexq upon atio inflict. whichimpost? t , w h e what a h t i ni s re , t e Exchequer o o f tl y gh ar t li n a lt en to tt i r n y te co rf m er b e in w a i t t i h: n. it h l i l f e o r th o e f r the tea duty. (Cheers.) I do not say this for the con despise and repudiate such ideas. When I had an oppor tunity my views on this subject were sufficiently shown. I had not the glory of carrying the reduction of the tea duties, but as the organ of Lord Derby's Government, I was the first British Minister who tried to grapple with that question. (Cheers.) I therefore express the deep conviction of try own mini on the subject, anal I say that tea is the very article that the Chancellor of the Exchequer ought to have dealt with, and that the mast odious of direct taxes and the most odious of indirect taxes are not the sources of revenue that ought to have been selected when in the face of the papers I referred to to-night it be comes a matter of controversy whether any ne w taxes at all are required. indeed it appears to me from the Chan cellor of the Exchequer's statement of Monday, which I take from the observations of the right hon. gentleman to be the authoritative one, that we should waste our time in criti cising the former budget. Well, then, if the Chancellor of the Exchequer has really determined to fall back on the expenditure of 1853, there is no cause for any now taxes at all. Now, sir, I know that some gentlemen aro very much alarmed at the word "reduction," and, Sir, unquestion ably rash and precipitate reductions, aiming at no precise object, and founded upon no precise information, are the most dangerous courses to which Parliament can ever have recourse, and ought never to be sanctioned by this house. But, on the other hand, it is certain that wise reductions, aiming at distinct and practical objects, and founded upon ample and authentic information obtained by experience and research, aro measures which, of all others, deserve the respect and approbation of Parliament— are the mea sures of all others which it is not only the privilege but the duty of this house to sastain and originate, and are the measures which are most entitled to public approbation and gratitude. (Cheers.) When some gentlemen, there fore, are alarmed at reduction, I am surprised, and I am tempted to recall to their recollection what is the reduc tion which appears to terrify them. In 1e'.52 it was my. lot, as the organ of the Government, to accept the esti mates prepared by our predecessors at the moment we suc ceeded to office. In the course of a few months circum stances were very much changed. there were many con siderations of an alarming character. The political hori zon was clouded. There was grea t alarm in the public mind that the defences of the country were not sufficient. We had to consider that difficult question, and although our Government was weak, we resolved to come to Parlia ment with supplementary estimates, the principal object of which was to secure that this country should have an effi cient navy and an efficient ordnance. We came to Parlia ment—not, be it remembered, to a friendly Parliament — but on our representations Parliament instantly supported us. I believe I may say that the money entrusted to us was skilfully and efficiently employed, and I believe that no money ever voted by Parliament was more skilfully and more efficiently employed. Witness what. took place in our navy and in our artillery. But the necessary con sequence of the supplementary estimates of the Govern merit of Lord Derby was that when we retired from office our successors accepted entirely the policy which we had originated in improving the defences of the country—a policy which they completed in a manner that was deserving of all praise. More than that, they enlarged those supplementary estimates, and the consequence of Lord Aberdeen's Government following that policy was a still greater increase of the estimates. The estimates mounted after us to more than 2,000,0001. The house will remember that when the Chancellor of the Ex chequer talks of reduction he talks of reducing the esti mates not even to what they were in the time of Lord Derby's Government. He is not going to reduce them to the sum they amounted to after they were increased by the sup plementary estimates. Sir, I ho e e that hon. gentlemen on both sides will well consider this question of reduction. We have before us several very singular precedents upon which the House of Commons has acted on this subject. 1 need not dwell upon what took place in nl6, although it ma; be well that hon. gentlemen should remember these circum stances. You had a King's Speech in which the estimates were described by the Ministry as having been prepared with the utmost regard to economy. The income tax was then ten per cent. The country gentlemen came down to Parliament, and protested against the income tax. It was the country gentlemen who mainly terminated the income tax in 1816. It was not, however, merely the country gen tlemen who protested, nor was it the precipitate action of men who acted upon the impulse of the moment., and not from thoughtfulness. The income tax was opposed by ma;.y eminent merchants of the day, and also by the greatest mer chant that England perhaps ever had—Mr. Baring, the late Lord Ashburton. He took the most decided course on the subject. He was a man of singular ingenuity, but of a pru dence amounting to timidity. Ile was of all other men most deeply interested in the maintenance of the public creditor this country. And what did Mr. Baring say ? Mr. Bering said, "You must terrninee this income tax entirely ; you must listen to no compromise," for the Chancellor of the Ex chequer of that day was prepared to accept a reel action of the income tax toy per cent. As to any plea in excuse for the income tax that there was a tail of exponees left by the late war, " believe me," said Mr. Baring, " that if you listen to occupied war Waterloghwtbe rt w.)L! by yta : dte t hoow:pnriohll armies. nibseoeevineeesur. rememberd. i . wtiG s g a rh p el p ha e ata a dwy r B . ehlianairctt increased be A ito:hrs. aloea The rtd i andn:b battle a a n:i r sdf , y debt during the previous 12 months 67,000,0001., and yet under these circumstances, Mr. Thrins was sanctioned and supported by the country gentlemen of Eoglaed in demand ing the abolition of the income tax. (Hear, hear.) Oa that occasion Mr. Baring declared— " That it was impossible, as long as ministers could show any tail of the war expenses that they would give it up. If they could once get the tax fixed in time of peace they would gain their object, and not a member of the house would see the end of it. No one who bad the least experience of the conduct of G ,vernment could doubt that, instead of producing redemption of debt, it would produce wasteful establishments and extravagant expenditure. It would only be by ridding the country of the tax that Ministers would be induced to practise economy." Are not the opinions of such a man to have their influence on us? (Hoar, hear.) What happened? On the 25th of March the house threw down the income tax. In May the Chancellor of the Exchequer came forward with a new budget, and it was found that we could get on extremely well without this 16,000,003/. of taxation. (Hear, and laughter.) That is a very striking historical instance familiar to the house ; but there is another instance that occurred in our own time—au instance which very many now sitting in the house must have tram witnesses of, but which I am sorry to say almost every gentleman has forgotten. So vast and rapid have been the events of modern times that the recollection of what oceurrei in 1118 with respect to that members. memory ([Tear,but n daycial statement, came forward, nut trusting,lending cor rect, oven his Chancellor of the Exchequer to make the fin the Premiership and the First b to it all the authority b ie of Lord of the Treasury. He toll the house that there was a deficit, and that the state of affairs demanded that they should be vigilant and watch ful. He then proposed that the income tax of 7d. should bo raised to ls. Now, that was no slight proposal. Five pence did not then bring 5,000,0.0 1 ., fur my Irish friends had not then the opportunity of contributing to the 'Ex chequer through this medium—(laughter)—but they will perhaps permit me to say that if they support the financial proposition of the Government they may rest assured they will have to pay it for many a long year. (Cheers and laughter.) The Government of 1848 wanted to get 3,500,0001. additional into the Exchequer, and their pro position was to raise the income tax to is. What hap pened? Why nobody listened to it. (Laughter.) The Government wore told that if they wanted 3,500,030/. they must find it somewhere else. The noble lord (Lord J. Rus sell) withdrew his proposition, and he got his 3,5J0,000/., in another way. (Hear, bear.) That was another instance in which the house and the country by their determination prevented an increase of the ineome tax. (Hear.) Now, sir, lam for wise, not wild reduction. (Hear , ) lam for reduction with a definite object, founded on definite know ledge. Ido not want to confine my criticism to the mili tary and naval estimates. There is another branch of the estimates which I think might be subjected to wholesome criticism. Let us examine those estimates. Don't let us attempt to do anything that would frighten the " oldest inhabitant" from his financial propriety. (Laughter.) We are proposing no measure which will be hostile to public credit ; but, to my mind, we are taking a course which will confirm public credit, and which will not add to the —lens of the people. (Hear, hear.) Let us do of our buy.- -es did in 1816, and as we ourselves did—though preteceiesa. it—in 1848. (Hear, hear.) Let us sup we forgottea +he Exchequer in his wise policy port the Chaiicellor as . +bat awful budget of Friday, of Monday; Let its forget • its propriety. (Cheers, which has frightened the isle from. . our minds any and laughter.) Let as dismiss free.. tea dutiei increase of income tat, any increase of tee. r The Neither appears to me to be necessary. (Hear, heir., I , t Chancellor of the Exchequer has now got upon the es% fail, and we shall support him in the policy which, " Bette: late than never," he has now adopted . . .( Hear, hear.) But, is this change in the policy of the Minister any reason why I should change my resolution ? My resolntion appoars to me to be peculiarly necessary to the position in which we fi n d ourselves. We don 't wish t o express anywant of con fidence in the Governments which, re we heard yesterday, would lie likely to alarm some very influential members of the house. We don't want to t a ke the government o ut of the hands of the Administration, and g ma nta* . c v a Perim- ommittee Th is a coursesoe which I would committee never recom mend. don t w at ish to the res takitlg, tir eve n sharing, poneibility of the Govern ent. (Hear.) Dot nia therefore, carry out this resolution , in which I think lays dorm the right principle on which our finance should alwia7hia e rest—the fundamental and cardinal o f finance to wc policy is house should ever adhere ; `nth consideration, or let ul feqUire th at ; before we take emeuts of the rather before 1.0 sanction; thafinanoialarraZ G overn ment, we must he s e the estimated ineom.; !tn't e 1 - p e nditure adjusted in the manner OA will appear boat ca. - culated to Secure the country against the risk of a deft. a s e ney, (Hear.) Surely, that is the principle on which we ought to act, remembering that i*At I have said is the cardinal financial rolicy of this house, arid the mode best ca leeiated to thr ow by at: }MO,' without financial eirbar- t a balance which will ,liow the entire remission raesmen , of the income tax. I think that is a traletion the Go- vernment 'nay accept, and all I shall do will be t? aek them . Go to set upon it. If they will act upon that resolution, if they will really adopt the policy which on Monday api!eayed to bo in the ascendant., and take the estimates of 1853 in the m anner then set forth, I, for one, have iy) wish to embarrass the Ctoterninent acting in such circumstances. (Hear, hoer.) If I saw a bona tide determination on the part of Government to carry such a policy into effect, I would even cou nsel those who m I mi g ht be presumed . to influence to offer some assisance to the Government in those t rances though not care even for the first year—though I think increased taxation is unnecerary—and would be readily in some degree to give my assistance to the Govern reent in such an e nter p rise. If we saw that in 18tiO we were to get rid of the income tax—if we saw that there ' Ras to be no considerable permanent increase of the duties on tea, I would be disposed to make some sacrifice to meet the convenience of Government. But if the policy of the Go vernment is this—that,though we may make sacrifices by thi s increase of direct end indirect taxation, we are only in the end to be landed in a deficit, then I think the House of I pound. (Hear , h e 1 Commons cannot too speedily and decidedly interfere to ; bear in mind that aar.' At the same time, the house should sum of 1 9 00 Oa has been taansferre I prevent a result so calamitous. (Heara In the belief that from the Consolidated Fund - to the annual votes, which is if the house will sanc ti on thi s reso l ut i on we s hall be able ; a transfer of expenditure , not an increase, and merely ap underß thi s ut S h i altogether to avoid new taxation by wise and wdl-consi- j pears under a different head dared reductions, I now place it in Sour hands, and dour- t late years a great increase thehead ( t i mend ii, to the impartial but earnest consideration of the ' in a great measure to with so much favour in the P hioe•Y which has been received there echarge,hae been owinge of House of Commons. (Load cheers.) advocates among honourable gennsazimall The question having been put, TJER said—Con- forcing charges of a local nature to the national particularly found oartanc_, perhaps the house opposite, - of trans- The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQ UER As it is a matter of some im e will allow me to state to them P s e e p ri e e h s otfheitems of exchequer. lica.. civil estimates. aidering that when, on the first night of the session, the right hon. gentleman gave notice of a motion on the in ; th i'nd meter which are now charged ; county e)me tax, he had evidently considered the subject with There is the item of criminal prosecutions in great deliberation—considering that although ho announced merly paid out of the county rate, 250,000 e ' s am e f for ol.. his intention some days afterwards to persist in that mo- Scotland, .12.J00/. ; maintenance of prisoners in the unite d . tion, he has since allowed it to disappear from the notice kingdom, 126,0001. ; Poor Law charges, Ds wee 1 constabulary, 146,030/. ; the same for Ireland, 644 list—considering that the motion now before the house is Making altogether in relief of local rates, 1,297,000(. Thera a motion substituted for the one originally presented—and has been also a transfer to the civil estimates of an item of considering that the right hone gentleman, who holds so 216,0001. from local fees in County Courts. There is also eminent a position in this house, and is so experienced in a charge, which must ho considered to local expenditure, for eencation in Great B i le a ic in the nature of re li e f financial affairs, has, we may assume , thoroughly invests- which this year amounts to 523 , 000 / , and for Ireland to gated the matters u pon which h e h as spo k en , I cannot, sir, 181,000/. The branch of science and art takee 43,t 0 2 1., but congratulate myself at finding that he has offered scarcely and these three it MY; make together 755,000/ The total of any objection to that whichis, properly apcaaing, the finan- items of this class is 2,320,0001. That d i is a stt l. l 3n o c e ll ge i x . cial pl m of the Governmen s . With the exception of a few eperena-elietuareod which i t c l l :e hasrsl beauue,f i„ 1 growing, u f which n any execu ' tive Go n : remarksupon the absence of estimates of the extraordinary verument w ill fi n d it se lf comps asively powerless- The expenses of the Persian wa-, andalso of what be thought fit next charge which will come upon those yecre is the to call the Chinese war, and soma general remarks upon the charge for debt. If thi revenue should b I found insum odiousness of an income tax and the odiousness of a tax on eject, atter defraying the service of the year, to defray the repayment of debt charged by law on those yews, iawi 1 f tea and sugar, I do ne t remem b er th a t the right 110 D eentle • P course he open to Perdement when that time arrives to man introduced int o hi s a efe ress 2 , single observation bear- consider whether any other arraneemf nt may be riled; f a ing upon the financial plan of the year. With regard tothe the discharge of that obligation. I should be extremely want of an estimate of the expenses of the Persian war I sorry if I thought that anything would interfere with the have already stated that we shall present oue, and I included payment of the four series of exchequer-bonds which stand for payment in the present and the three succeeding years. in my stateme n t o f F r id ay l ast a sum of about 260,000/ At the same time if it should be found that they can only which we estimated wo u ld b e th e amount of the first per- be imposing on thecountry taxes of a very onerous descrip tion of the extraordinary expenses of the expedition that tion—if the financial pressure is severe—of course it wilt we should have to defray. It is therefore not correct te say be open to the Parliament of the day to consider whether that there is no estimate of any portion of those expenses. the burden can be distributed over a greater number of What the right hon. gentleman calls the Chi nese war has years. At the same time my hope and conviction is that it will be possible to defray them in the years when they been carried on by vessels upon the station, and no extra- fall due. (Hear) But with regard to the sinking fund ordinary expenses which we could lay before the house have which is doe in the same years a different reason applies. hitherto been incurred. As to the right hon. gentleman's I ought, that sinking funperhaps d to explain to the house the way in which originates. The sinking fund for the general declamation on the subject of the income t ax , I three loans of 6,000,000/. 5 000 000/ and 5,000, 0031. was think, consideringthe number of years during which that ma d e to commence in the sa m e , manner as the incom e tax tax has now existed since it was proposed for the second was made to cease—that is to say in a year after the Ist of time by Sir R. Peel—years of peace as well as of war—that April succeeding the ratification of peace. That was the t o h u e ra fi e rs o t f two l loa ns, w,r because utz third they loan were was contracted contributed the home will hardly expect thatl should enter into a for- i n a n s t e h th e c mal dissertation as to the policy and necessity of that tax after the war, and therefore a definite period was fixed for under certain circumstances. With regard to the tea and its payment. When the first and second of these loans were sugar duties, which, the right hon. gentleman declares to contracted the duration of the war was quite uncertain. It be the most odious of imposts, I really am at a loss to know might have lasted sor 10 years. If it had lasted for any upon what ground they are to be so designated. period of that sort,it would have been impossible to pay out • of the annual revenue the exchequer-bonds that would have Mr. DISRAELI—OnIy the tea duties. become due during its continuance, and it would have been The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER—Fora long absolutely necessary to raise new loans for their discharge. time tea and sugar have been included among the articles Bat as the war happily lasted only 3 years,it soheppens that the first payment out of the sinking fend upon the three upon which a Customs' duty has been levied, and the duty is not - subject to the obje c tion of being a protective duty, loans falls in the same year as the Exchequer Bonds; and hence arises a great accumulation of the redemption f the inasmuch as these articles a r e prcdnoedexolusively abroad, debt in those three years. The house will observe that the They are also articles of general consumption, but they oc- amount to be redeemed in the present year is 2,250,0001. cupy a position somewhat above that of mere necesftaries, In each.of the two next years the sum will be It would be a perfectly legitimate financial operation, 1 3,500,000/ i such as bread and meat, and for a series of year s th ey have Parliament should think fit to do so, to postpone that sink been regarded as proper subjects for taxation. l am there- ing fund for three years. The only effect of such postpone fore at a loss to know whythe right hon. gentleman should ment would be that the first loan, for example, instead of stigmatise the duties upon tea and sugar [Mr. Disraeli being paid off in 1873, would not be paid off till 1876, and repeated that he bad only mentioned the tea duty] so with regard to the other two. It might be found desir ble to adopt that course, for when so largo a sum as peculiarly odious, or why he should condemn me for 3 ,500,000/. is to be redeemed within a year, and that re • having selected as an object of taxation an article upon demption takes place by the purchase of stock by the Go which a greater amount of duty than is now to be raised verument, they raise the price of stock as against them has in time of peace, up to the present period, been levied selves, and the redemption is therefore effected on nubs for a long series of years. I must assume, then, that the c demption terms. I hav e no t s t a t e d th e f u ll ex tent of the re fer There areptiozfdebt no w which would be going on in those three financial plan of the year, or the budget — that term being ea annual payments upon terminable confined to the estimate of expenditure at first submitted annuities to the extent o f abo ut 4,000,000/. Now, the au to the house in committee of supply, and to the estimate nual charge of these annuities, if they were made perpe ,of ways and means provided to meet that expenditure— tual, would be 900,000/. The difference, therefore, in the 1 having been placed before the house, the right hon gen - three years e between the cha rge u p on th ose terminable an faeman can scarcely make any objection to that budget, unities and upon them if converted into perpetual ennui -1 and I may regard myself as fortunate in having escaped ties would be 9,300,0001., which represents with tolerable almost entirely from his censure. (Hear, hear.) But in accuracy the annual extinction of the debt. And, therefore, the excursive flights which the right hon. gentleman took if in those three ye Ira the whole of the debt represented in over the regions of finance he was not satisfied with re- the return which I hold in my hand were extinguished, marking upon the estimate of revenue and expenditure together with the payment of the terminable annuities, for the year. but he commented upon the plan which I we should redeem 18,550,000/. of the debt at the end of proposed of fixing the taxation for two additional years. those three years. I have explained to the house that I I may, perhaps, remind the house of the constitutional did not undertake to make a budget for the next two i nractice with regard to the determination of revenue and years, and that, according t o an y seasona bl e com p u tation ex p e m , liture. The expenditure of the country is partly of expenditure, and also making allowance for those legi fixed be Act of Parliament—that is, it partly consists of timate arrangements which may be resorted to with re the interest upon debt payable by Act of Parliament, and gard to the redemption of the debt, if Parliament should of charges upo,7 the Consolidated Fund fixed by Act of so determine, there can be no ground, as far as we can Parliament ; and it; madly consists of annual votes in com- judge , fur anticipating that financial embarrassment mittee of supply. theere two branches of expenditure are (involving a defiiiency of 5,030,030/4 in a future year now about equal, the aui6net payable in the present year, which the right hon. gentleman has depicted in such alarm under Acts of Parliament, baingabout 32,003,000/., and ing colours, and whi c h h e sa y s wou ld ren d er th e extinc the amount voted in committee o . c supply being also about tion of the income tax impossible. I have, I trust, shown 32,000,0001. It is possible, when the estimates are laid on that that part of the right hon. gentleman's speech which the table, when a plan of expenditure is prop osed u p on the consisted of a demolition of an imaginary fabric—vis e , the responsibility of the executive Government tc the house, balances in the next two years between revenue and expen• to form a financial plan or scheme of revenue and e.pendi- diture upon which I had relied, together with an imaginary ture for the year, and that is what I and all pereune in deficiency--is wholly founded on error and on a misappre my position have done. But I will venture to say that hension of the very elements and conditions of the question. no Finance Minister upon any occasion ever presented Can it be said with any truth that I have opposed any ad to the house a plan of expenditure for any future year, ditional or artificial obstacle to the extinction of the in (Hear, hear.) Such a thing is perfectly unheard of. come tax in 1860 ? I think I can convince the house that so \ The great majority of taxes are fixed by permanent far as I have done anything in that respect I have rather acts of Parliament and levied from year to year until afforded facilities for its extinction. I have merely proposed Parliament thinks fit to get rid of them, and other an addition to the income tax for the present year, which taxes are fixed for a period of years. Formerly there wore the right hon. gentleman himself not only does not object certain annual duties, such as the sugar duties, but they to, but of which he says we have a right to avail ourselves. have now been discontinued, and at present all taxes aro I have proposed that the income tax for the two next years fixed for a perpetuity or for a period of years by Act of shall be 7d. instead of sd. in the pound, and I think that that Parliament. I thought it my duty to propose, finding is by no means a burdensome increase. An income tax of Id. in the pound would be Ss. 4d. per cent., and therefore that the ta and sugar duties and Vie income tax were con tinue,' for c es c e r tai n ti me , th a t cer t a i n alterations should the addition of 21. in the pound to ad. will nlyadd 16s. Bd. be made in the rates of those duties and of that tax. The per cent. to 2/. ls. p er cent., thereby paean) the per income tax was limited to continue for three years, and I centago of 2/. 18s. 4d. That a t., thiu g oannot be proposed simply to alter the ra tes o f th e t ax d ur i n g those regarded as a very heavy burde p n ro u p T e n e 'any scale of fortune. three years. The tea and sugar duties were to fall by So far as the change which I in the income-tax regular gradations to a certain amount, and wore to be makes any differtuce ' revenue fixed provides a n a dditi ona l fixed at that amount. All that I did was to propose cere for those two years. And the same i s th e case with regard talc alterations iu these duties, but I never submitted to to the tea and sugar duties. At present those d u ti es are the house a plan of expenditure for a future year—for any upon a deacendiug scale. I propose to arrest that descent, year beyond the present. (Hear, hear.) Neither on Fri- and, therefore, so far as those duties are concerned they day, when I first addressed the house on this subject, nor will teed to increase the revenue for the two next years. on Monday, when I gave an explanation supplementary to The change which I propose, so far as the remission of the my former address, did I attempt to give any estimate of income tax is affected, manifestly facilitates and does not expenditure for a future year; and if the right hon. gentle- obstruct. (Hear, hear.) Then with regal dto the pro man will look to the statement of former Finance Ministers vision which may be made fur the discharge of the debt —for instance, at that of Sir Robert Peel when he intro- in these three years, if that debt should be discharged duced the income tax, and at those of the various Chan - to the extent of 9,250,000/., the reduction of the into cellors of the Exchequer who have renewed that tax, he rest in 1860 compared with the year 1857 would be will find that on no occasion did they attempt.to give an 313,000/. I may, perhaps, be liable to the charge of at estimate of expenditure for more than one year. There - tempting to penetrate too far into the future if I read to fore, when the right hon. gentleman talks of a " defi- the house an estimate which I have prepared of the re done? he introduces an idea whollyforeign to the subject. venue in 1860-61. The revenue of a future year can be (Hear, hear.) In order that there should be a deficiency estimated according to the existing law ' • but it is other it is necessary that there should be a comparison between wise with regard to the expenditure, because it depends revenue and expenditure, and if I had made an estimate of upon the annual estimates which are prepared by the Go expenditure for future years, and had compared it with verument of the time being, and have to be submitted to the revenue, and the right hon. gentleman had then found Parliament. When , therefore, I make an estimate of the there was &deficiency, he would no doubt have been justi - expenditure for 1858-9, for example, I can estimate that fled in saying that I hal created, as he called it, a colossal portion of the expenditure, which is fixed by Parliament, deficiency ; but I never asserted that the changes of tax- such as the annual charge in respect of the consolidated ation I had proposed would create either a deficiency or a fund ; but all the rest chi the estimates must necessarily be surplus. (Hear, hear.) On the first night that I male a f ra med upon mere conjecture. Supposing, then, that no statement I abstained from all mention whateverof future alteration shall be made till the year 1860 in the taxation years, but on Monday, when the right hon. gentleman which I have proposed, I estimate the revenue of the year had s given notice of the motion he has Low made, 1859-60 at 62,265,000/. There would be a loss in 1860 . I thought it would be convenient to the house to know upon the tea and sugar dutie s (ev e n takin g into ca l cula what was the revenue which I calculated for the two years , income ' tion the increased consumption in that year) of about - to which that motion referred, and I accordingly rea I a n 1,065,000/. There would also be a lossupon the of. the . estimate of that revenue. The totals of that est i m at e were tax of 3,650,003/, because the payment of half not stated by the right hon. gentleman exactly as I stated venpenny tax would fall due in the following year. In re them. The totals which I stated were 62,300,0001. for the year 1858-9. and 62,265,000/• for the year . lBs , d-GO and I 0 1 spect of miscellaneous I estimate a loss . of , 100,000!. The total loss, therefore, to the revenue in le6 • , compared o said that if you compared that revenue thewith expendi- That I with that ' of inthe previous' year, would be 4,815,000/ and the revenae lB6O-1 would be 57,450,0001. If we may tare of the year 1853-4 you would find no deficiency. the an d was the statement I made , t akin g the last year before add for improvements o ther b r a nches of the public re war, .we get a total of of 665 0001 as ,standard of compar ison, because, if I had taken as venue au assumed sum 58,115,0001. The expenditure of 1853-1 was 55,840,000/. , my standard the estimated exp enditure of the p resent year r I should have taken an esti mate which has not been agree d I which we may take as a standard of comparison, approving r it or not as we think fit. I deduct from that sum the cliffe to by the house, and whic h, moreover, relates to a year of renpe between the interest of the debt in 1861. and the in any hon. gentleman may w ake the com p arison for himself, great peculiarity—the first year after the war. However, I terest of the debt in 1853—viz., I,6o,oooa—which is either of the revenue, such as I have stated it , with t h et formed by deducting from the terminable annuities, which ex penditure of the present year, or of that revenue with expire in 1861, and which amount to 2,146,000/., the ad the expenditure of 1853 ; bu t, wh atever y ear may be t ake d ditional charge of interest which has accrued during the as the standard of comparison , I must b e understood as d e - war. The expenditure of the year—assuming always dining to make any positive estimate , or to g ive an opinion that of 1853—is thus reduced to 54,200,0004, as as to the amount of expenditure of any year after the pre- against an income of 58,115,000/. The house may sent. With regard to the argument of the right l hon. take that estimate for what it is worth. I h ave gentleman that there will be a great sum , which wilacrfe expressed no opinion upon it, and refer to it merely for the ululate, to be defrayed in the year 18f 0, by whic h t h e di f- purpose of showing thatthe plan I proposed does not throw ficulties of repealing the income tax will be increased, I any obstacle in the wayof the extinction. of the in come tax wish to call the attention of the house to a few remarks. • At the same time I do not undertake to make a budget for to the latter part of the resolution before in 1860. With regard to that question I feel myself blea assenting more than one year. I express no opinion whatever as to tal lel ial of It gays that it would be expedient to " pro the probable expenditure for a year after the present. Ne- vertheless, I shall take a general view, so as to throw some p lace it in the power of Parliament light on the possible financial position of the country in the v i de for such le e b se ala m n a ce y of revenue and charge respectively inat the year 1860 two following years. The revenue estimated for the yearn t the income tax." I do not in the least 1858-59 and 1859 . 60 is, as I have already stated, about gather to re mi t that period . , without embarrassment to the finances, alto -62,300,000/. I holdin my hand a statement of the gross re- result. All persons must wish that anyonerous tax, which deny that it would be extremely desirable to realise that venue of everyyear since 1830, There is only one Yam. from lie income tax is alleged to be , should, by the increasing 1830 up to 1853 in which the income exceedssB,ooo,oool. The t p r osperity of the country, be found unnecessary for the revenue which I have provided resulting from the alterations of taxation will be at the lowest 62,265,000/., being nearly ourse lves nublie service. But it seeme to me that we cannot bind down to any sort of pledge, or to any formal con -4,000,000/. greater than that of every year prior to 1854-5. fession of faith as to the possibility or probability of Par- Since 1854 the revenue has been 64,000,000/. for 1854-5, lisment being able to remit the income train 1860. (Ireni and 70,000,000/. for 1855-6. In the present year ear the re- cal cheers and laughter from the Opposition.) Each gen: s C u S e it h abstain remisremission i o f from ofm taking venue will amount to about 71,885,000/. The nue for tieman may calculate the probabilities for himself, and if any measure which. taxation either difficult or next year is estimated at 66,365,0001., being the year 1857- ' for which I propose the present budget. Then we come a b, , ' years 1858-9, when the revenue is estimated .t might w e choose render we improbable. What I maintain is, to the that the proposal which ..,..„ • 62,300,uuut. --aud 1859.60 at 62,265, 0001. Have made, so far from incre • be • naafi- i ncre asing the difficulties, mid. 62,303,0001., .lid le income of that amount will 1 gates and lessens them, and ,whether a prob at,. =., years. Notwith- offers every reasonable pros; re of those two . t which cient for the expenche:' f the right lion. gentleman I e fi P u e a n neial ad • we t can hold out at present of a satisfactory standing the disapprobation . a , -de a comparison with the to m . jue ment in 1860. Beyond that point it appears must again be allowed to instite The expenditure then was 1860 e impossible to go. If the state of expenditure of the year 1853-4. ti, be :.wised in each of or . should admit with advantage of the remission, wholly 55,840,000/. The revenue proposed when cons, with , . almost entirely, of the income tax let us trust to the these years is 6,460,000/• in excessthe incomes of the ;ears. wisdom and patriotism of Parliamen t . in that yea ffeet r to e . that expenditure--that is to say, the change. (Rear hear.) with the exp enditure ofl f, on the other hand, it cannot 1858-9 and 1859-60, as compared : turn out from a • , surplus of 6 460,0001. We must . a • a verge circumstances which , sre , tk i Qi , of 1853 4, shows a . . may be regarded without the gift of .prophecy foresee that tha o°°,,e';iiseP iti. a Parliamentary point of view, what the income tax is • d only e re a - r fle as the first charges on that income. I will at once assume _ impossible, we shoid which the ST pointment looking at the importance of our national defences, . and weaken the respect in b an abstract that,try" Y • ht. ment is happi l y for the army and navy will be the first held if we led the owl tancesmig the expens esireuwB fro al charges. Comparing the estimates of the present resolution to year with expect a remission whit ! ar) There o , the estimates of the last year before the war, there is au ex- put beyond our power to grant. ' l ' ( i teno ur of the resoln cess of 4,000,0.01. We certainly cannot reasonably aati- though there is little in the gene:,ot see that any advaa • -ate that excess should continue at its present amouna'e tion to which I have toobjeot, 1, to to it. It would be open `a• -ream everybody will admit is due to its being the tage would arise from our assen 1. . give rise, perhaps, tea Some ia.. veoula b fle e a war. [Mr. Disraeli—The second year ; to much misrepresentatio n ; . n d therefore I shall vote in first year a . _ _ t it udibg , the chair. I shall neithe r ing is important.] e It • the first is . year after the disband- k 3 angerous misunderser le avi". but Ft • ing of our armies, and atiiiz the return of our army from faJour of the speak the resolution, din to c . hall ask the house' to foreign parts. Unquestionably greatdi ffi cultyis experienced afffran nor devr_ of the day and gC omm ittee of Waya in making reductions suddenly in the army and navy, and pan to the s orZr h a v i e w te r , croontia, of t he the practical qi cation in military and naval establishments, and we must consider and Mea:ilaetion of the war t income tax. (Hear.) a t no Prae teal result. It caa Pro that a largo portion—l will not say how large, but a large of the re t, , , ,,, ea u le hatof The solu 1 e eeond portion—of the present eacess is due to the peculiar einem- A T „ -- e re o effel - ,:a (hear, hear .and a laugh)—and even if stances of the present year. What reduction we may beable s saaa i n n this fund ourselves down to this sort of political to make in future years is a matter on which I can now we were nwriot understand how we should be nearer than we express no opinion. It will depend on many causes, test, 1 e3 te t he attainment of the end which the right hen. many of which no doubt are 'within the control of Ws_ are lean opposite and all of us mast have in view- viz., house, but inasmuch as we have not yet been into Cesv ilt til t ' ' em anent and satisfactory settlement of our finances. tee of Supply, and the estimates have not yet under! ion tiiiieal.) so much fur the latter eras p the resolution. The any debate, it would be premature to offer an o a ittunctionformer pdrt seems to me, so fa I can apprehend its the extent to which they may be susceptible of coo t o a meaning, to be equally objectionablet 'lt asks the house to in future years. That they will admit of :atm: ( fgear, , resolve that "it Would be ex pedient, 'before sanctioning greater or less extent I deem absolutely e r cie n ill Servi ce ' the financial arrangements for the ensuing year, to adjust hear.) We then come to the estimate for . n reduction than the estimated income andexpenditurein the manner which and I confess that offers greater difficuslity swing to the great shall appear boat calculated to secure the country against the army and the navy. This hiss be es' 0 late years in that e br branc h the risk of a deficiency in the years 1858-9 and 1859.60." increase which has taken place off the estimates for that to I confess I am not quite clear as to the meaning of that pa of expenditure, so that now .au ~ een,o oo/ a t 7d , in the ragraph, by which I apprehend the right hon. gentleman Service amount to rather morn %int: nee tax 5- say, they exhaust the whole f the N•