The Sun. — London, England, 1801-12-01 00:00:00

Crwlgs, dr. in Ireland, ter the .az periol.—Agrecd to. That' a sum not exceeding sts7l. ;41. 21. be granted for defraying the charges e,ll-ralf.pa7 to re. duccd Officers of the Land, &c. in Ireland . for the same ueriod.—Agrcec.l to. Thitt a sum not exceeding 12671. I”. !rd. be granted for tl4 Pensioi%s to Widows of Officers in Irelan,l for the same period.—Agreed to. That a sum not exceeding .13,8001.1 e granted for elefraving the expence of the General and Staff Offi -ccrs in Ireland far the same period.—Agrecd to. That. a SUill not exceeding 55.551. x9s. ad. he granted for defraying the expeaces of Medicines, Be7. 4 .'ling, Hospital Contingencies, k.c. in Ireland for the same period.—Agreed to. That a sum not exceeding 14,7+81. be granted for defraying the expence of the Out-Pensioners of the Rural Hospital near Kilmainham, for the same veriad.—Agreed to. That a sign nOt exceeding 88,8921. be granted for defraying the charge of the Barrack department in Ireland for the same period. Mr. ROBSON objected to the charge for 13,u-- racks ; he conceived this Country would be in a very bad situation in consequence of the Union she would have so much, to 'pay for Ireland : we should pay this year above a million and a half for her,. He therefore hoped great attention would be paid to the finances of Ireland. .The SECRETARY at WAR said, the Honour able Gentleman argued as if this was a permanent Peace Establishme►►t, whereas it was a mere vote upon account for thrt-c months, that the Country might be prepared, if unfortunately we should not obtain th!.t Peace which he hoped would now be speedily settled. When that period arrived, it xvould he seen that Government would endeavour to lessen every expence as far as possible. As to what the Jonoura`:►le -Gentleman had said about our paying for Ireland, he conceived it to he of very Little .importance whether in some instances we paid a little more or in some a little less ; that was not the way of judging upon this subject. If we had obtained an accession of strength in some of the most important points, it would produce a great saving ultimately to the Public, and whether, there fore, in•some minute articles we paid a little more .er a little less, was very unimportant. Mr. ROBSON reverted to the number of Cavalry employed, which he said was more than was neces sary, and the expence of our Cavalry alone was more than the half of the King of Prussia's Re venizeB. rke SECRETARY 41 W.IR said, the Resolu_ tion upon which the Honourable Gentleman was speaking was passed, but he begged with the greatzst . deferenee to ,that Honourable Gentleman's )udgrnent, to say, that in regulating the number of C a v a lry which it wits necessary to maintain, the Ministers and the Houic wouW. rather be guided by the opinion of Military Meo 'than by' that of the Honourable Gentleman. MP. "MarITART said, that with regard to ionic lead fallen from the Honourable Gentleman re :Telling the accounts between Great Britain and Ireland, and that we paid the expeoccS of Ireland, tit.begged leave to remind the Honourable C7entle diat Irelaild now paid her share towards our Naval expence, which she did not before, and which probably would not amount to less than two mil lions. _ . Mr, COR RY begged leave to remind the I-lon. Gentleman (Mr. RossoN) that when he made ob servat;ons of this kind, he was impugning the whole system cf the Union itself, •and these kind of observations could not answer any one good pur pose, but might perhaps stir up unpleasant feelings 4gainst the Union. _Though the Resolution only spoke of Thrracks, it embraced a great variety of items, such as Candles, Straw, Bedding, and a great many other articles for the Soldiers, which were not specified: • These expellees, however, would necessarily be diminished when the Peace was ultimately arranged. It was to be lamented, that the state of Ireland rendered this force neces sary, but every thing would be done by Govern went to•make it as unnecessary as possible. - Sir ALFORD differed totally from the Hon. Gentleman (Mr. RossoN), whose observations went to strike directly at the Union. Sir 7OHN PARNELL said, this was not a time to be alarmed at expellees for Ireland ; besides the nro.ney that was now Toted need not he necessarily expended, Great savings had already been made in Ireland, and still greater would of course be made, therefore there was no reAun to be appre. bensi-ze of great expence being incurred for Ireland. ie ebarges which it W:l5 now proposed to vote were not wade atjandout, but were absolutely ne- ry. . firr. ROBSON said, he was glad this discussion 'had tfi(en place, as it would nuke the Members of 'orh Countries look •a little into the expences of the other. The Resolution was agreed to. _ The *TLC HET / id/ at WJU? .moves, that sum, got tacreJing 25,r30!. he granted to the Non commissioned Officers and Privates of the different deseriptioas of forces in Ireland, fat small beer for the same period.—Agreed to. That suni, not exceeding :3071. be granted for the allowance ti the Non-eointnissione4 Oaieers, der. in Ireland, white on m arch.—A g reed to. The CII,INC4OR of the EXCIIEQUER said it must be ohserVeci, that it was necessary to pro videfor tl)e Extraordinaries of the Army ; he should ,therefore trove, that a Siam not exceeding 600,0001. granted towards defraying the extraordinary ex peoecs of the Army for the year 13(32. /0:43.5'04V objefted to this sum : he said the* had I.)een not less than Five Millions granted for that purpose, almost at the end of the last Ses sion.of Parliament, tOr there was a sum of two mil. lions granted for Army Extraordinaries, besides a Vote tf Credit for two millions and a half, and this was not more than five month'. ago. Ile therefore would not consent to grant any more, till he knew liow this tar e sum was expended. '• Tie CrIAYCELLoR of the RAVI' LIECUE R said, that the: 'Bin ':alluded to by the Honourable centietnan certainly did pass at a late period of the lair :iession, but the vot for the Army passed at a very - ‘7T;‘,. , period of I.lonotirJbl!:, o;3l2ntle. man, liowc2ver, had, tic' caicuigiuo of his own, made the whole. sum applreAble to dais service {eve. miiious ; he had before had oecasiou to notice. the tlonourable Gentl .elll4ll'S arithmetic, and it OQW ap pearej from the Honourable Cientletnan's own state, ment that this five millions was no wore than four and d half, by two millions for the Army Extraordinaries, and two millions and a half for' the Vote of Credit. The Committee would do him the honour to recollect, at the close of last Session, when he proposed the Vote of Credit, that it 'would be chiefly necessary for Naval Services. So that it appeared that. a large part of this four millions and a half (which the Honourable Gentleman had re presented as being granted at a late period of the last Session for Army Extraordinsries) was granted (be Naval Services, and that the remainder, instead of being granted late in the Session, was voted at an early part of it. The Accounts which the nourable Gentleman wished to sec, could not now be laid before the House, because they were not made up to this period of the year. The Com mittee would perceive that this was - not an al,- plication for a very large sum ; the whole of the Am voted last year was 2.0.c0,0001. and he wished he could assure the Committee that that sum would be round sufficient. If, however, they would recol lea the extended nature of our Military Service, they would not be surprized at some excess. It could not, however, be ascertained till the close of the year, when the Accounts would be made up. Mr—ROBSON said a few words. Mr. ARC HD ALL said, there could be no doubt, after the explanation of the Secretary at War, that the Hon. Member would concur in the unanimous sentiments of the Committee, - as to the money to be voted on account of the Barracks in Ireland ; but he still wished to confirm, if he could, the Hon. Member in his vote, by declaring his own particu. Jar conviction, that the Barrack Depaftment in Ire hind, under the able and vigilant Barrack Master General there, Lord TTRAWLY, was concluded in a manner the most economical. possible for the pub lic interest ; and as to the Hon. Member's trying to mi:ke a distinEtior. on this occasion, between the interest of this Country and that, he thought it a distinction without a difference : since by the terms of the Union, which had been mentioned, it should be recollthed, that the interests of both Countries were now identified, and therefore, that the People of each were, on all occasions, to be es timated as one and the same. The Resolution was agreed tm. Mr. CORRY then moved, that a sum not ex ceeding 300,0001. sterling he granted towards de fraying the Extraordinaries of the Army in Ireland during the year 1802. Mr. ROBSON said, he did not know that the Irish Army Extraordinaries were to be voted this night. Mr. VANS ITTART ,:aid; he had given notice of it on Thursday. The Motion was agreed to. Mr. CORRY then moved, that a stim riot exceed ing 2401. x Ss. sd. be granted for the expellees of the Ports in Dublin.—Agreed to. That a 811111 not exceeding 73841. t 2s. be granted for the charge . of Civil Buildings.—Agreed to. That a sum of 5761. I Ss. be granted for apprehend ing Felons.—Agreed to. That a sum not exceeding 57691.45.4 d. be grant ed for defraying the charge in the Office of Solicitor for Criminal Causes.—Agreed to. That a stun not exceeding 16201. 18s. be granted for defraying the charge of proclamations and advertisements in the Dublin Papers. Mr. CORRY observed, that ertry possible care was taken with respea. to auditing the account; ; that in question, besides the printing the Dublin Gazette,' and other matters,. covered the expence of a ntunher of Procionations -: from the necessi ty of such an expence, this - Country was happily exempt. Mr. ROBSON replied, that at first he had con ceived it to be an annual thing. The Resolution then, that a sum not exceeding 16201. aSs. 41a. be granted to His MAJESTY for defraying the charges of printing the Dublin Ga. zette, was agreed to by the Committee. Mr. CORRY next proposed, that a sum not ex ceeding 8691. 11S.- 3-1(1. sterling, be grwited to His MAJESTY, for the expenses of printing - the Statutes for three month-c, ending zsth of March zBoz ; which was ordered accordingly. Also the sum of 454.11. fos. 7id. for charges of 'printing, stationary, and other disbursements in the Secretary's, Under Secretaries, and other Offices, and for riding and other charges of extraordinary Messengers for three months, &c. Mr. ROBSON took occasion again to express his surprise at what he conceived a very extraor dinary charge with respect to those 'natters, and expressed his doubts of its necessity. Mr. CORRY in reply, recapitulated the various heads which were comprised in the charge in ques. tion, the principal of which were ; the charges for printing the Dublin Gazette, the expence of Pro_ . clamations, and the printing of the Poctunents of various offices, The Resolution was then agreed to. The next item moved, was for a sum not exceed ing 4611. 75. 9d. for defraying the inOdenral ex_ fences of _the Board of Treasury in Ireland. — Ordered. Also the sum of 134. r2s. 3d. for building further offices for the Records, and for ereding ad ditional buildings for the Courts of Justice in Ire land.---4)rde red . The sutn of 49341. I 2S.' /0. to be granted to the Trustees of the Linen and Hempen Manufac tures, under such regulations and appropriations as shall he direaed by Parliament.--,Ordered. The sum of 11531. 16s. rod. to the Board of First Fruits, fortretting new Churches and rebuild. ing old Churches, for -three months. —Ordered. 'The .sum 0f.12691. 4s. 6fd. fbr the use of the Dublin Society for promoting Husbandry and other useful circumstances.—Ordered. The sum of to3sl. 9s. 2d. for. additional .build ings for the use of the Dublin Society, the expellees of a Botanical Garden, subject to the approbA-, Lion nf Parliament.. --Ordered. • . The sum of 4611. tos. 9d. to he applied under the diAettion of the Lord Lieutenant, or other the Chief Governors of Ireland, for the time being, to the purposes of the Farming Society.---Ordered. stru et 13071. 1 ss. 93. to' the Corporation of D'ubl'in, for cleansing, lighting, and improving that City for the period_of three months. • Mr. ROBSON adverted to . the magnitude of this charge, as he conceived it, and considered it in the aonual amount. According. to his idea of .the 7th article of the Union, it was not fair to call upon that House to concur in such 2 charge. He took the Clause to eilaa, that these charges should not exceed their amount, on an average for six years previous to the 'Union. He conceived the charges allowed in the .Aa to be for the encouragement of Agriculture—for pious and charitable ,purposes, &c. The words afterwards were '' to such local pur poses as are therein specified." He could not, how ever, imagine that the lighting and improving the city of Dublin, at the expellee imparted by the Re snlutions, could be within the meaning of the Act ; if it were so, it was certainly beyond his cot-tyre hension. Mr. CORRY acknowledged himself to be at , that time not competent to quote the precise words of the article referred to by the Hon. Gentleman, but should content himself then with observing to the Committee that a similar grant was made last year by the United Parliament. Mr. ROBSON observed, it was by accident he had seen that article this morning, which in his mind, 'confined the charges to such local purposes as were therein described nothing short of such a strong conviaion should induce him to trouble the House with any observation relative to the Union; they should be scrupulous with , respea to that At, by the words of which they should be governed ; the vote of last year - should be no rule 10 . the House now ; if they afted wrong on former oc casions, it was no reason they should do so now. The Question was then put, and the Resolution agreed to. • A sum not exceeding 10381. 9s. ad. for money expended in making wide and convenient streets in the City of Dublin, for the period of three months. Mr. RORSON also in some degree objefted to this Resolution, and suggested the impropriety of the Committee agreeing to it after what had fallen from the Chancellor of the Irish Exchequer, with respe6t to his not recolletling the precise terms of the article in question. Lord GLE4VBERYIE expressed his opinion, that the words of the Article of Union, . adverted to by the Hon. Gentleman, were merely words of refer ence, and not meant to confine Parliament in such matters. Mr. BERESFORD was of she sa me opinion, and added, that the intent of that Article of Union was to secure the continuance of sums for the use of cer tain charitiek. The items in question hid been granted for a series of years, and were, in some de gree, for the liquidation of certain debts contrafted in the performance of those services, under the au thority of the Irish l'arliament. Mr. ROBSON replied, that if such was declared to be the legal construction of the Aft, it may so far be considered- right to call upon this Country for those sums of money. • Mr. CORRY observed, that it was principally his respea for the observations of.a Member of that Committee, which had induced him to make a loose reply ; it was his intention, however; to obtain precise information in that respect. He said, that he recolleCted well, that Ireland had sti pulated for all those usual Grants which were made before the /Viol . Union. Mr. 3. C. BER.EsFoRD. said a few wcrds to the same .efre6t as what had been advanced by his Right Hon. Relative ; and added, that the rele vant Article of the Union was decidedly in favour of authorising the Grants in - question. Mr. ROBSON seemed of opinion, that as the Grant turned not to be fOr the Interest of Money borrowed, not for a new eXpence, but on account of a Debt incurred, it called more than ever for the circurnspeCtionof the Committee. The Question was then put, and the Resolution agreed to. . The next item was for a sum not exceeding 45521• z is. 113. to the Incorporated SoCiety for promoting English protestant Schools:—Ordered. The sum of 34611. ros. 7-Id. to the . Foundling Hospital.—Ordered. The sum of 4651. zos. 9d. for the charges of :he Hibernian ::Marine Nursery for Seamen's Children. _Ordered. The sum 'of 154,51. 4s. 61. to the-Westtnore. land Lock Hospital.—Ordered. The sum of 9131. z6s. rod. to the Hibernian School for Soldiers' Children.—Ordered. The sum of 18461. 3s. to the Roman Catholic Seminary .—Ordered. The sum of 38981. 25, rod. ro the House of Industry, and for the relief of the poor of the City of Dublin.—Ordered. The sum of 691. 45. 7 d. to the Society for dis. countenancing Vice, and promoting the knowledge of the Christian Religion.—Ordered. The sum of z is!. 73. Bd. to the Female Orphan House near 'the City of Dublin.--Ordered. The various items being gone through, the Chair. man put the question for his leaving the Chair, when Mr, RORSON expressed his wish to know if a future opportunity would not offer in which any particular item may 1) regularly discusSed. • Mr. L;W:RY replied, " Thediouse then resumed ; and ordered the Re port to be received to 7 morrow. The Committee of Supply was postponed till Wednesday. EXCHEQUER. BILLS. On the Motion of the CHANCELLOR of the EX CHEQUER, the House then resolved itself into a Committee of Ways and Means, and,Mr. ALEi.E AND.E4 having taken the Chair, The CHANCEL.pRiethi'EXCHEOUER rose,_ merely to state to the Committec the necessity of corning to a Resolution with respett to defraying the Interest incurred in consequence of enlarging the 'Venn with the Holders of Exchequer Bills, from Tuesday till Saturday, as he had stated on a former day : this was done in pursuance of the Resolution for tour days, and he mentioned the regular rate of interest 31-d. per day for the above interval, He then moved a Resolution, for the purpose of carrying the same into effect, to the following import " That all Monks, &c. received by the Cashie. , or Cashiers, of the Bank, shall be 'applied to the Payment of the Interesr that maybe due the zgth of November, rSoi, on certain Exchequer Bilvi pursuant to the Resolution of the 17th of N ove mber) , in like manner as direned by the said Resolution. The C:IANcr.LLoR of the EXCI:EQUER, th en, after recurring, in a very few words, to his State merits, and the Resolutions of the Committee 0 1 ' a forum occ;ision, moved, f:iarthe stnn of rive Nlilliozls by way of loan, be raised on 1.:-xcheque r , Bills." Mr. ROBSON expressed his surprise at sucl i a Motion, for no less than the grant of Five Mil' lions of money, should be mode in sued scat which he seemed to consider as, in so; - :e degrce' taking the }Joust, by surprise. The Cli ANcELLO.I? of' r e E.VCITEQUEg i repelled the idea that such a construction coul d possibly be put on any thing that had ps:ied in ill' Committee that evening. Had the lionourahi c Gentleman given himself tEe trouble to recolleAl or -to consider what had passed on former days the Committee, he could not consider the 11110tioi l then before them as suddenly made. Tile Motion .was only for the purpose of giving effeft to %al° the Committee - lid resolved upon a l rea dy. fuse had, on a former night, come to a deterrriio', titan, that Exchequer Bills to a certain amoun t should be funded. It was obviously understood at same time, that Exchequerßills to a certain amoun t should be issued .to replace them. The Motion be' fore the Committee was. merely, he repeated, for til e ' ,purpose of formally giving effett to what the hatl: already agreed to. Mr. ROBSON stated that he had no idea tha t a Motion ibr a Loan on Exchequer Bills to such amount would be brought forward that evening' He was aware that Exchequer Bills were wantd: but at the same time felt. it was improper to con y so suddenly with such a Motion. No Gelitlern 3o he believed knew, except those connefted wt Administration, that a Vote for Five would go through its first . stage chat evening. 1 4e , wished the Right Hon. Gentleman would postpa; the Motion. He put it/to the House, that tbel ‘‘ stood in the eyes of the Public," who should SC' , that they were scrupulous in voting away its moneP even to a farthing. Mr. BRAGGE obscri , ed, he had a word or O v n ° to offer on the present occasion. He would beg 1 1, tell the Hun. Gentleman, that the Pobiie were 11° so ignorant, or so ill informed, as not to he. able ,- distinguish between new matter brought furwara the deliheratiou of the House, did a procee 4 l if :7 which was merely, as his Right Hon. Friend haa ° "; served, to give effeft to its resolutions on a foro lc ht occasion; and the Hon. Gentleman himself should aware that the same attendan ce i n p o i nt o f nu mber s ' was neither necessary nor expedeti nt the afte r i stages of any Bill, which at its iotroduElion early stages had been duly discussed ; of such Bills was, in a great . decree, re gar d e d ,(*.' matter of rourse., The metal of the measure's ; question had _been already bei . pre the House,. wet' fully , discniiid, and the resukt was e7pressly uncle stood, shat the existing incurnbrance was to cleared away :by4.:fresh of Exchequer No implatition - iokild be thri.r.vn upon thc fiome Sts CcOdela oAthe present occaiion ; a nd no gri:,oo 3 whatever mullexist lot the ides of the Hop. Ci' tletnan, that the . liouse was taken by surptise. Mr. R 0 Ikso4 replied, that he felt it h(s to have made theie.Observations it was right t l4 when millions mete voted away, there should I;e ; proper atiendance . .; L .. besides tlnsf Who were dose' perhaps there were..many Genstemen recently ge n t who may think five tnill::ons of Exchequer fills c°, large tin issue at one,. titr ; he said twenty I\ l leP:i hers were not a sufF)ent attendance for an origir, vote of five mil lions ; from his general par mentary condua, Ministers had ' no right to thiP, him capable of taking an advantage on that scorn; his efforts were to serve, nor to clog the pu b service and insisted he had frequently interfe re r , with good effect....-Hisobjcaions that eveningi, authet occasion, may prove a saving of r3, 0 1 ( 1, per annum to the Public, and in what he had vanced relative to the Secret Service Money, lie s ‘fril incontrovertibly right....if by his exertions could, save only 'cool. to the, Publi;, it was Pra duty to do so. • The Question was then put, and the Resolal was agreed to; after which the House resumed , 1 2 ordered the Report to be received to-tnorrow. MISCELLANEOUS. 0 1 ' The House resolved itself into a Committe d the Militia Bill, Mr. ALEXANDER in the Cl The sEcRE;r4l?y at WAR hriefiy stated Le' il Committee the,mode in which he proposed to hav e h ; c l blanksfilled tip, the principal regulation in vi t 0 was, that the number should be two.filths 0 whole number. of men allowed by the Apt 0t • 39 th of the King. The different blanks were then ordered tc: p i filled up in the way suggeted by the Right P,) Gentleman, who stated Lis wish that the_Bill , the binnks filled up, should be printed, and 0 5 4 tore day taken into consideration. This meeting the sense of the Committee, Chairman quitted the Chair, and the Houseol suming, received the Report, which was, t he b 4 was ordered to be printed, and the Report fort considered Gift Wednesday, fef The Report of the Poor's badges Bill was di e , red till tomorrow. • • .13' Mr. j. H. .ApptNcToN brougut, up rt continuing, for a limited time, an ACt of the 3 9 ; of the King, respeaing the Importation arld ,fr,,,A tatiun of, Corn, and other Provisions, whit- read a first time, and ordered to be' read a ,se' time ro_morrpw. f tn t • Mr. A.i.piArrDlß presented the Report fi 0 Bill for repealing the Aa of the 39th of the Kil j ti permitting the importation of Naval Storey liartilllirgh, which was agreed to by the Ho use ', the Bill ordered to be read a third time to -O0 if engrosseLi. Vge ll The commitment of the Bill for funding quer Bills, was, on, the Motion of the Ckle - j4" Lou of the .ExcavatTEß, deferred t;I1 Viedtles Adjourned a; seven o'clock till to.morrovis 10L3 LOYD g this 2 7th ult. ' telligence. to Finance t ive Body. Ey an art )pear s that Republic ha to Omit a L ved by the The Fren It will bi ts of tart thit evening *lion on I t hisCountr) I.4 nßement 14 a politica Wins t ttst immix found ti honours Nl k We We 111 Orante %lent and. stlfish prine l ion!, could 1 4 1 3tility wi 4 1 disgraccft ki it raili bile anotiO shit nCeSSI cit ke of the ‘ 1 :41 will no e ke, or C Oder w hie Sly cant lay We not k rrea cone of the t roth the `Republic,. I Y, it' cl Ice of su, Fah., beer Il tit here w dittat ,anent to:o YS 130i4ii It Was OV l egotiatior t7usfedi ,rie t * l4l ling the (. .ritsed to r pith a new it 'tight hea Iq the mi lt.irrt of F I last yield (I rll the te! tonli}rOw I ked with