The Sun. — London, England, 1822-02-14 00:00:00

PARLIAMENT. (OUSE OF LORDS, WEDNESDAY, FEB. 13. In the Appeal Case of " the Representatives of the late Sir Henry Vane Tempest v. Burton and others," the LORD CHIEF JUSTICE delivered the opinion of the Judges, and judgment was ,postponed till Monday next. The Marquess of BATH presented a Petition from the Inhabitants of the Vale of Taunton, praying 'for Agricultural Relief.—Laid on the Table.—Adjourned. HOUSE OF COMMONS. - . MISCLLANEOUS. 1. rd LOWTHER presented a petition from. Kirby Lons. dale, praying for a protecting duty on the importation of Fo• Grain.—Ordered to lie on the Table. ,Bililt were brought in to erect a Church, to he called Saint Lobe's Church, and to establish a Wholesale. Fish Market, se ,Liti4 4 l)ool-.-Read a first time, and ordered to be read a second, .14r, R k PX,E4 fOok the oaths and his ,seat. MR. FLANIGAN. • • Mr. Alderman WOOD presented a Petition from an indi !Muni who complained of bring much ill turd in Ireland.— !The Petition set, forth that the petitioner had been conspired -against by a party of Orangmen in 1817. That he being in custody s.ook alum a little way off the road to a domain he -,,lionging to him to receive some money that was due, and this sioptluct on his part bad been construed inteeateescape and an assault on the Officer. In the absence of the Noble Marquis .(thittiarcinis of Londonderry) he was unwilling to bring the .subject forward, but the importance of his doing so had beep atrongly,nrged on thepart of .the Petitioner, as it prayed for a copy ofan information, which it was of importance to obtain before the ensuing Assizes. In the present situation of file ;wintry, when economy was so much talked of on the other aide,nlthe House,. lie must not venture to move that the Pe-• tition should be printed; he should therefoie only propose, for the present, that it should be brought up. PP El a thought the course pursued by the Hon. Mem bet was perfectly reasonable. He was ignorant of the name of the petitioner, awl perhaps he had never heard it, though the circumstances mentioned in the petition were stated to laayskoecurrekwhile he held the situation of Chief Secretary to the Lord Lieutenant of Ireland. Doubting the policy and seen the possibility of any interference on the part of that Howe wills the Government of Ireland in this case, be could not ,object to the bringing up of the petition, tbe,utotion for printing it being postponed. the Petition, which was from Thomas Flanigan, of Sligo, "seas then read. PirePAEL said he had, in the first instance, presumed that he Might be ignorant of the name of the Petitioner,but now lie had heard it mentioned, the individual was so notorious, that he knew him well. From inquiries which he had already made into his case, lie was bound to say that the present Pea tition tontained gross falsehoods. 'Abe Petition was ordered to lie on the Table, • • 1 - AGRICULTURAL- DISTRESS. Sir E. • KNATCH BULL presented a Petition fruit the Owners'and Occupiers . of Land in the Eastern Division of the County of Kent; complaining of Agricultural Distress, and praying:relief.--Ordered to be printed. .other. Petitions of a similar nature from the same County • were presented by the-same. Honourable Ittemher.—Ordered to be printed. A Petition was presented from the. Owners and Occupiers of Land et -Henley on Thames, complaining of Agricultural .Distress.—Ordered to be printed. .Mr. CURTEIS presented a Petition from the Owners and lOccupiers,pf Land in the Rape of Lewes and Penenley, corn plaining of Agricultural Distress. '1 hese Petitioners had al ready called the attention of-the House to their case, but had only.- been answered that they must wait with patience : they had done . so, but had experienced n o r e li e f. They had called on Parliament to save them from the injuries which they en dured fkom the wanton and unnecessary importation of the cheap and ,untaxed corn of other countries. He concurred with them in their view of the subject, supported what were called the reveries of " Webbe Hall," and thought such pro tection desirable. He entered into a brief examination of the merits of the system of averages, which be considered to he one that never worked well. The. Warehousing System did not meet with his approbation, and he thought it would be 'better to give the King in Council power to open the ports, in case of any sudden eniergency,than to persevere in the system at present acted upon. He was friendly to economy. This he had proved by the votes which he had given on the first day of the Session, and on Nlonday last, when motions, not rile best tinted, perhaps, had been submitted to the House. Bat, he had voted as he did to redeem the pledges which he had given to his Constituents, and he proposed to continue to act on the same principle. He was of opinion that con .siderable benefit would be derived from a small issue of Ex ohequer Bills. The, tithes now levied on the farmer de manded consideration; but whether, nit!) respect to them, ay; alteration could.be made that would afford relief to the isuded interest, he was reit prepared to say. Mr. ELLIS did not wish to enter into a general di4cusion :.)the,topics which had been brought forward by the HUH. .Gentleman on this occasion.; but be could not sit there and not notice the argum e nts wich had just Keen urged en their nonsideration, which arguments had been disclaimed, lie be lieved, at, every county meeting. Those who attended the meetings in Sussex, he could nut say whether or not they were the sense individuals from whom this petition came, had deetared it to be their opinion that nothing could relieve the existing distress but economy, retrenchment, and diminished taxation. The .Hon. Gentleman supported what he rightly called the reveries of Mr. Webbe Hall. They were indeed reveries that went to maintain the idea that the sintie prices could now be obtained fur corn that had been paid during the war. A heavier priee could not he paid by the consumer and it must therefore he the endeavour ,if Parliament to enable the farmer to grow it at less expence. The plan sug gested by a former-Committee for keepitig imp the price of corn could not now he resorted to. The Legislatut e must do what they. could towards putting the farmer on a level with the grower of corn in other countries, and this would save both the trade and the manufactures of the country, which would be placed on a basis not to be shaken; and till that were accomplished, .they Must remain in the slime feverish state' in wiiich they had been seen erer,sinct the French re voint ion WODEHoUSE re7retter4to hear that the Han. Mem ber for Sussex.wris one of disciples of Air. Wehhe Hall. if such we.re the fact, his case wa, desperate. This he would without pretending tOknow mote than'tvery other Mem ber might ktmw, that no party —at' least no extensive party, would . act in the spirit . of those principles Which the Hon. ~Gtmllentaa bad .nnfortunately adopted. • Mr, HUME thought the Hon. Member for Sussex conic forFa rd to- complain of the conduct of-the House with a ,rety had grace, after the hoc of conduct which he bad pur ,•!,:ord. He begg e d t o a sk i n 'Wh a t i ns t ance h a d t h at H on. G.-tolerant-I voted for - any of the reductions which had been called for iit tlte course of the last -Session ? 11 he had voted fir none of them,, he had not dime what he might have done to aid the petitioners, and the plans which he had suggested fur their relief, lie (Mr. Hume) reizardrd as visionary. The Petitirm was then .brought. up ,and trai :and ordered to he „printed. .• Sir -W, GUISE presented a Petition from arse ral Occupiers of Land .ia•the County of Gioncestei, Vraying that the Agri fotet eat may be protected, by laws similar to those which protect the Mercantile totes - est.—Ordered to be printed. Siryi. pu.Rns moved for a return of the turns declared •by the Chamberlain due to tlie Orphans' Fund, applicable to the liquidation of the de-ht.—Ordered. The Non. naranet Hien moved for returns of the stuns paid ...weekly on accouqt of coals and wine to the Orphans' Fund.— Ordered. HE'iITHCOTE moved for accounts of all the grain and Hour seat ehoused under. the Act of the late King, and remain ing in warehouses, in Jan. 1822.-- , Ordered. Mr. MAUI:LEY moved '(or accounts of !he quantities of flax, dressed nod undressed, imported in the fears 1821 and :8 --Ordered..... : , • - • • •• • Mr. fIUME looKed for returns of the establishment and expense of the V4ccine Board, with th e sa l ar i es ? h o d patties of the persons attached,--i'llis motion was wade in the can yjetion itiat Iw o . thirds of thu grant, annually voted to that roahlirlirtient, aright he saved, without _injustice to any of the individuals c,ssinected with raisers were ordered. - The flop. Mesa *-x. theu, -moved fur a rout intuition - of flue return granted. last par of the Dumber of ;Half-pay Okras in England awl ,Irc!attd, awl the total amount of the cluarp fur the lame. • • He then moved for a return of the total number of first ap : . pointments of Comets raised to the rank 1.1 Lieuteilatitv; of Lirotenints tiii.,Captains; Captaips to Majors.; and Majors to Lieutenant4;o6.ols distinguishing the nuwhr•r of each, -ht-tween Jaroary.'•Lti3l; And January 182?, .anii the total• amount of the. , sz/ple, and dittjnguisking ivhrther with or wit hont ourchoe..l.—Ordered. . - • . . . Mr. fiIDME . next nioted . for returns of ail defaulters in the rohJi..;.Seavice; in the.Arnay; the Navy, in the Civil Depart nt, *Moog the_Coropaissioners of -the foar and a half pri cents., or any other branch of the public service since 1810. —Ordered. He then moved an Address to his Majesty, praying 'for a return of the total establishment f the Mint, with the names of the officers, the salaries, and allowances of each, and spe cifying where houses were provided, or house rent allowed. —The Motion was agreed to. Mr. LIISHINGIQN brought up an estimate of the wages, wear and tear, and ordinary expenses the seamen and marines in the Royal Navy.—Ordered to be laid on the table. Mr. LUSHINGI'ON, seeing the Hon. Member for Aber deen in his'place, begged to ask if he bad any objection to postpone his motion, which stood for to-morrow, relative to the ditties on Hawkers and Pedlars? Mr. HUNIE postponed his 'notion till to-morrow fortnight. Mr. DAWSON brought -up the Reports of the Commis sioners appointed to inquire into the state of Public Chari ties.—Ordered to he printed. On the motion of Mr. Huma, the Order of the 11th Febru ary, relative to fees received by Officers in the Court of Ex chequer, was discharget). A Petition was presented from 403 occupiers of land in the county of Warwick, complaining' of Agricultural distress.— Ordered to he printed. Mr. DAWSON brought up a Report relative to the situa tion of per Sons under sentence of transportation.—Ordered to be laid on the table. CONVICTS' LETTERS. On the Order of the Day for going into a Committee of Supply being moved, for the purpose of postponing it, • Mr. HUME,. seeing the Secretary of State for the Home Department in his place, begged to take this opportunity of mentioning, that a letter recently addressed to him by a con vict on board of the hulks, had been opened before it came into his hands: He wished to know by what authority this had been done ? Mr. PEEL said, the practice had been to open all letters coming from convicts, lint having done so, to forward them to their destination. The same regulation was acted upon at the Penitentiary. If the regulation were adopted at all, it ought to be acted upon grin rally. He could see no reason why a letter addressed to a Merrher of Parliament should be ex cepttd from the rule. If this were allowed, a Member of Par. liament might be made unconsciously the instrument of fraud, as letters might be inclosedunder his cover, which he might forward by the post without knowing their contents. Of the propriety of the regulation, he thought no doubt could be en tertained. It had been the menus of defeating repeated efforts at escape. In April, last, four convicts would have effected their escape but for this regulation. During the night they bad sawed away four iron bars, and were only prevented from accomplishing their purpose by a guard placed on the outside of the prison to intercept them, inconsequence of information which had been obtained in the way he had described. Were proof wanting of the importance of the regulations in ques tion, it would be furnished by the Hon. Gentleman's own cor respondent. Since the letter to which the Hon. Gentleman ha 4 alluded, that very individual had been detected in a gross attempt to commit a fraud, by means of a letter which he had written, and which had been opened. The name of the man lie believed to he .Jones ; and he had recently been de tected in an attempt to commit a fraud on a very respectable person. Mr. HUME wished to know at what date the fraud referred to by the Hon. Gentleman had been committed? He had seen the Captain of the vessel in which the individual al luded to was placed on the last Sunday but one. and then nothing had been said against the man ; but, on the con trary, his conduct had been mentioned with applause. Mr. PEEL could not say at what precise date the fraud referred to had been committed; but he apprehended that it was very recently, and most probably since the time men tioned by the Hon. Gentleman'. The man Jones had written a letter wider another name, and it was by this that he had been detected in a fraud. . Mr. BENNET thought no answer at all had been given to the complaint of the Hon. Gentleman. tie thought a convict ought not to be prevented from. complaining of any griesance or ill treatment to a Member of Parliament. If surely a person acted improperly, the consequence was, that he lost that remission of punishment which was generally allowed to those who behaved themselves well. The point at issue was not, whether a convict might send a letter to A. 11. or C., but whether or not he should be permitted to send a letter to a Member of Parliament without being liable to have it first opened. He did nut see why any penitentiary regulation should be copied to authorise the officers of a jail or the bulks to open a letter so addressed. He would read to the House a passage from a letter written by Lord Sidmuuth, dated November 9, 1814, which ran thus:—" it appears that a practice of opening letters from prisoners by the officers of jails has obtained, un der an impression that they have a right to du so."— (Lord Sidmouth here made no allusion to the practice of opening letters addressed to lentbers of Parliannent.) " I feel it necessary to state," his Lordship continued, " that it is my opinion the law will not justify such a proceeding." Phis was tire opinion of Lord Sitintouth in 1814, but now, forsooth, a letter was nut to pass, even to a Member of Parlia ment, without being first opened. Could it be supposed, that arty Member of Parliament would correspond with a telon for improper purposes? They could only act on such letters, to do good, by inquiring into the abuses they set forth. He and his Hon. Friend, un the letter in question baring been re ceived, had gone dovvn no the writer of it, to examine the complaint. They inquired into the matter, in the presence of the parties, and the result was, the statement was pi overt to be completely false. Hr thought. it was desirable that per sons in that unfortunate situation should have the power of appealing to a Member of Parliament, on' the treatment they experienced. Mr. PEEL did not see that any new light bad been thrown on the present question by the reference made to the letter of "Lord Sidmouth. lie thought, in the course which had been pursued in the case now referred to, that there existed no disposition in any quarter to withhold information on such subjects front Members of Parliament. Mr. JAMES complained that a letter, which he had .written to a person in connernetit, who was not a felon, had been opened. He had put a letter under a cover, and sent it to au . • . .. individual in a prison, with a request to the jailor that he would not open it. The jailor had replied that.whe - ther he .did 'right or wrong, he had thought it his duty to open the letter. He would appeal to this House, whether this was proper? . - Mr. BROUGHAM thought it right to take this the earliest opportunity of entering his protest against the principle con tended fur by the Right Hon. Gentleman, that a letter ad dressed to a Member of Parliament might be opened before it came to him. Good God ! it this practice were to be coon.. tenanced, where were those privileges whic h were said to be given to them, not for their own advantage, but for the good of the ',curie, on which they never faded to lecture when any individual was brought to thric Bar. The case mentioned by the Member for Carlisle (Mr. James), of a letter sent from a Member of Parliament to a prisoner, was a different case, but he was convinced that the privilege of a Member of Parliament gave him as good PI right to receive his let ters unopened as it did to claim exemption from arrest. His letters ought to pass free-and unaffected by any regulation of gaols or hulks. To say they ought nut to pass, because the privilege might be abused, was . to say nothing, unless it could be proved that Melt other privileges were not likely to be abused, as all of them had been. With as much reason . might their privilege of freedom from arrest' be taken front them, because they might avail themselves of it to cheat their creditors, as many former Members of that House had done, as Withdraw from t hem the privilege of receiving their let ters unopened. Whenever this question came to be tuoved in a more regular way, he should have no hesitation in _saying, that beyond all doubt a gross breach of their privileges had been committed, whenever a letter addressed to'a Member of Parliament had been opened ..b . efore it was forwarded to its destination, on any pretence whatever. Mr. DAWSON said, the letter which had been opened was not one that bad been sent thrinigh the post•ofiice, hut one that had been given to the care of an individual. No harm had been done, as it appeared to him, seeing the letter was not detained. . fhe Committee of Supply was then postponed till Friday. ,1: r. JAMES gave notice, that Oil the Thursday in next week, he would call thu atlention of the House to the prac• Lice of opening letters addressed to Members of Parliamtut. DISMISSAL OF SIR ROBERT WILSON. Sir R. WILSON said, were the motion whi c h h e h a d now to make limited to a personal or private object —were it one that concerned only himself, deeply as he might feel that he had been outraged and aggrieVed, for vaeibus reasons, some of Whieli might be disclosed in the course .of what he had to offer, he should have been disposed to submit in silence. But knowing. that the public were interested in it—that the question affected even the. safety of the subject, he should feel that he might be, reproached with. : a dereliction of duty if he refrained from bringing . it before the Hom.c. ArduOuS and painful as the duty was—and most arduous".and painful he felt it to be,L—yet was he most 'happy that the moment was at length arrived, when, in the face of his adversaries, in the face, of-that House, and consequently in the face of Europe,' he could redeem the pledge which he had given to his constituents, 'and vindicate his character before a generous and confiding public. He need not solicit the patience of the House. He was sure of its being granted with alit courtesy which was- the characteristic of a British House of Commons. When he gave notice of his mo tion,lie. had asked a Noble Marquis on the opposide side of the -House if the papers which he desired to have' produced would be granted. The answer which he had received left him no al= ternative but to adopt the course he now took—that of bringing all the circumstances of the -case into disciission. Though his adversaries had preserved a most unjust, injurious, and unman ly silence before, and denied him all insight into their reasons for taking the course they bad pursued, he might be excused for expecting that at the meeting of-Parliament they would have been most ready to give him the papers he had called for, and fully prepared to substantiate some charge against him. He had the more right to expect that when he saw the Government join ed by Gentlemen who professed to act on the principles of a Noble Baron in. the other House, who had declared " that he hoped he shhuld never see the day . when the Government of this country would withhold any information that might be necessary for the justification of .an arraigned individual."_ The more he thought of it, the more he was surprised that in this country, the boasted sanctuary of justice, he should be de nied a knowledge of the facts on which he had been arraigned in secret councils and on ex-parte statements, and adjudged by a clandestine process. He was not there to question the right of the Crown to dismiss its officers, but to-prove that what had been done was in violation of the British Constitution, and an infringement of military law. He would shew that the course taken was against the just rights of the army, and against those of the peopleof England, anti .went to disqualify Officers from sitting in that House, and doing their duty to their country, necessary as it was that such persons should be diffused through the army. The prerogative so exercised appeared dangerous for all bad purposes, unnecessary for all good ones, and had never been used—arbitrarily he meant, but to abuse the right of an individual, and to the prejudice of public welfare. But the question he would propose could not be said to trench on the prerogative of the Crown ; because he believed,• and he hoped his confidence was not misplaced, that neither this nor any prerogative could be exercised but by the advice of respon sible Ministers, nor carried into execution but by responsible agents. There was a time he well knew when the principle, A I DEO REX, ET REGE LEX was contended for. Ile knew that the Judges of England had contended that the King of Eng land had a right to determine what should be the law of England, and that it had been pretended he was authorised to punish, be cause he had power to pardon. He knew that there had been gene rals who were such traitors to their country as to threaten that they would hang those Judges who controverted this doctrine, and there had been a King who maintained that as it was blas phemy to God to call the Scriptures in question, so it was trea son to the King to doubt that what he did was law. These opinions, however, had been corrected by the Revolution of 1638. He would now call the attention of the House to the character of the parties, and the circumstances of the case.— First of all there was an Officer, of twenty-nine years standing, who, though he had no pro o f s o f his services from the Govern ment, had obtained from his Commander-in-Chief those distinc tions and professional rewards to which he had aspired. This Officer had felt it to be his duty, as he declared to God, to op pose the Ministers, as being injurious to the power, the interests, and the character of the country. He was cashiered; but was this degradation from rank intended to make him powerless to do wrong ? or was this step taken from some morbid feeling of resentment--from some malignant political feeling ? If such were not the case, why was that portion of his property which had been vested in his commission confiscated ? Why was this unprecedented step taken against an individual. It had been supposed that his dismissal from the army necessarily involved the loss of his money, which had been vested in his commission. This was not the case, as would be seen from a letter of the Commander in Chief. That letter to which he alluded, in con sequence of the new regulation made in 1814, set forth, "that Officers holding regimental commissions might have the option of retiring from the service by disposing of the same at the regulated value." Why then, that regulation being in exist ence, had - he been cashiered, and thus subjected to that pu nishment which the Legislature regarded as next in severity to the punishment of death ? Was it resorted to with the miser able feeling of inflicting pecuniary privation ? or was it the object in view to impair his circumstances, compel him to give up his seat in that House, and seek a refuge in a foreign coun try ? It was painful to him to call the attention of the House to his private circumstances, but he thought if he did so, their sense ofjtistice would make them sympathize with him. It was notorious to the world that it' had pleased Providence to afflict more than one member of his family with the greatest of all human calamities. When it was seen that Ministers under suchtcircumstances had attempted to levy domestic war against him in order to injure the prospects of his unoffendmg child ren, he was sure that there would-be one feeling on the subject —that it was done in - aggravation of calamity. The course taken had been most injurious to him. This he would prove by what had occurred in Prance. Several officers of high rank who were not in any way hostile to him, had every where stated that they were satisfied and persuaded from his removal, under such circumstances, that if brought to trial, greater punishment would fall on him, and greater disgrace on his family. The Ministerial Journals insinuated the same thing. Not a clay passed in which he was not made the subject of sonelibel, which the parties knew co u ld n o t be visited. in a Court of Law. An Officer of his standing., rank, services and description being thus dismissed, the fair inference was, that it was because he had degraded himself. by some unworthy act. What circum stances, he wished to know, ought to deny an officer, who had served his co u nt r y i n so man y b att l es as h e h a d, that protee don which the humblest man in England had a right to ex pect from the law of the land ? He called on the (embers of the House, as a part of the Legislature, and as men fof justice, to protect him. He conjured them, on this occasion, to dismiss all party feeling, and to give .him that mea -1 sure of justice which they would desire for themselves, for their children, and for their relations. If he had been guilty of any offence, the army that the country had a right to know wh a t th a t o ff ence was , that it might serve as an ad. monition to others. What was the object of punishment ? example. But what benefit .could result to our military esta blishment by the infliction of punishment when the crime was concealed ? Such conduct was not a mild act of justice; it was an act of no justice at all. The principle was atrocious. Even the Turk, whom it had been the object of the Government to sustain, when he used the bow-string to strangle, or took off the head of an offender, condescended to make known his crime by affixing a label to the victim's breast ; and was he to be denied even this poor boon ? The conduct of Ministers in this case he regarded as part of a system of terror—the pre cursor of a military government. If the House sanctioned it, they consented to make Officers in the Army the blind instru ments of the Sovereign's will, and made nugatory and fruitless the wise regulations and generous labours of their ancestors. He had done all in his power - to avoid bringing this matter before the House. He had used every exertion to keep it in the official channel. He went to the Commander in Chief till he was forbidden to appioach the Throne ; he went to the Secretary of State till he was prevented from prosecuting per jury by the conduct of persons in office. Placed in this situation, what remained for him to do but to bring his case before the House of Commons ? He would now proCeed to the facts of the case. The task which he had to perform was difficult; as, not knowing the charge preferred against him, he had to grapple with shadows, and to imagine an accus a tion. But he would tell the, truth—the whole truth—and would endeavour to do so with all the circumstantial details he could give ; and he called on those Membeis who had been present at the scenes to which he should direct the attention of the House, to remind him of any circumstances that lie might omit, as he could declare, upon his honour, that there was nothing which he so much desired as to bring all the facts fairly before the House. The Government would not deny that his dismissal originated in some disaffection, growing out of his conduct on the 14th of August or some other circumstance connected with the demise of her late Majesty. The Honourable Gentleman then proceeded to detail what occurred hi the following terms :--" I was at Paris at the house of Count Orloff, on the 9th August, when I was informed by the British Ambassador, Sir Chas Stewart, that a telegraphic dispatch had just been received, announcing the death of the Queen of England ; t mention that circumstance because it was stated that the news was brought to me 'when,' was dining With a party of thirty officers, whom I had shocked by the manner in which I disclosed the event. Ministers can ask the Ambassador where I received the news, and what were the feelings I expressed on the occasion. I determined on leavin g Paris immediately. The Hon. Member for Coventry (Mr. ' Ellis) was there, and kindly consented to wait till the 11th, from Thursday till the Saturday, up to which time that Honour. able dentleman, who is now within the House, can stat i c that w e knew nothing more than the decease of the Queen. Leaving Paris on Saturday, we travelled all night, and were within a pest or two of Boulogne when we met a French courier, and from him I learned that her late Majesty had desired that her remains might be conveyed to Hanover. [" To Brunswick," one or two voices said.] —I think the Courier said, that she had desired to be conveyed to Hanover. We were at Bou logne on the 12th. Having crossed the Channel, I immediately wrote 'to Dr. Lushington, to say, that I had just arrived in Erigland to pay the last. duties to her Majesty, and that placed myself entirely .at his disposition. If the Learned Gentleman is now in the House, he will confirm this part of my statement. I wrote a letter to my son to ascertain where the Executors of the Queen would be found in the afternoon of the following day.' We arrived in London on the 13th, between two and three o'clock in the day. My son told me that the Executors were then at the Queen's house, and a carriage was waiting to convey them to Hammersmith. I went there, but was too late. I then went.to the house of Mr. Alderman Wood. He told me he was just going to Brandenburgh House, and kindly offered to take me with him. The Hon. Member for Ellis—l mean the Hon. Member for Coventry, was ,present, and agreed to go with us, and I beg of him to confirm or dis prov‘e this part of my statement. It was always my intention to attend the funeral in one.of the mourning coaches which it was expected would be provided by Government on the occa sion. I mentioned this to Mr. Alderman Wood,.who informed me that he had been refused a place in one of them, but added, " You perhaps may be more fortunate." , I replied, " I shall not put myself in the way of a refusal, and expose myself to an insult like that which you have received." We went to Brandenbugh House, and waited there till after five o'clock, but no executors came. While there, I had no com munication with any one but those of her Majesty's house hold, and the persons employed in snaking the arrangements for the fitneral. We left Brandenburghe House shortly after five, and crossed to the Queen's house, avhere we found Dr. Lushington and another executor. We found them engaged in a controversial communication with Government, and not cer tain whether or not the funeral would take place on the next day. I was informed that if I went to the Freemasons' ta vern at nine o'clock, the Hon. Member for Aberdeen would be there, and he would be in communication with the execu tors, so that I could know from him whether the funeral would take place on the following day. Mr. Alderman Wood invited me to dine with him, and said he should meet Mr. Bennet at his house. I could not accept the invitation ; and I said I should be obliged if Mr. Hume would call on me on his way to the Freemasons' Tavern, and tell me the result of the corre spondence with the Earl of Liverpool. The evening passed away, but Mr. Hume -did not come,_ so.I determined to go t o the Freemasons'iTavern, thinking he might have been pre vented from calling. I was shewn into a room where about a dozen persons were waiting for Mr. Hume. I was asked to go up stairs, but I refused to do so, as I had no inforniation to communicate. I then returned, and got back so quickly, that my relation, Lieutenant General Bailey, could hardly believe that 1 had been to th e Freemasons Tavern. His words were—" Rapid as you are in your motions, I can hardly be lieve that you have been there and back in so short a time." I, however, had been there and back, and had gone on foot. This is important, as going there, I know, was con sidered material matter of charge. I then went to Bruce's, where 1 knew I should meet the Hon. Member for Ipswich, and hoped to see Dr. Lushington. The lIOn. Member for Ips wich informed me that he was not there, but was expected at a later period of the evening. Dr. Lushington and Mr. Wild came at a late hour, and were then engaged in framing 'ano ther letter to the Earl of Liverpool, and still ignorant whether the funeral would take place on the next day. It was agreed that we should meet on the following morning. I accordingly rose the next day, and went to Mr. Alderman Wood's. There mounted a little chesnut handsome hack horse (and not, as I know was said in the information given to Government, a tall dark thin horse), belonging to the worthy Alderman. Having mounted this horse, we went to Brandenburgh House. On the way a Member of Parliament overtook me, and I conversed with no pe rson b u t h im on t h e roa d ; and he knows that we had then no information of any obstruction being intended. I remained at Brandenburgh House till eight o'clock. While there I had no communication with any one but some of the household of the late Queen and the persons employed under Government to conduct the funeral. ' It was indeed hardly possible that I should, for the police officers with much force prevented those from going in who thought they had a right to enter. When the f u ne r al was about to move, we were re quested to go down into the room w h ere the coffin of her late Majesty remained to hear the executors' protest against the re moval of the body. We went down, and the protest was made. The authority by which the body was to -be removed was then demanded. A paper was shewn. I saw it. The paper was not signed by any Secretary of State or by any other-person ; it was merely the programme of a procession. It was then that I spoke to Sir G. Nayler, who was there; I know not exactly what character or office belonged to him on that occasion, but he officiated on the part of the Government. I told him that there were several Members of Parliament, who, with myself, wished to pay a tribute of respect to the deceased Queen, and if it were not objected to, we proposed to ride by the side of the procession. Sir G. Nayler replied, that was not regular—it would be contrary to rule established in such cases. " Your place," he added, " and that of all the other Gentle Men, must be after the last mourning coach." I immediately communi cated this to the Members who attended. We proceeded through a heavy shower of rain to Kensington. When half way between tho turnpike and Ken s i ngton Church, there was a halt. We halted for above an hour, when some one came and told us that a barrier had been raised to obstruct tI e procession, and that the soldiers were attacking the people. I remember. we rebuked him, and he was especially checked by the Honourable Member for Shrewsbury, who said, " You are reporting that which is false—putting such rumours in circulation may lead to mischief—hold your tongue."— Some of the people wished to follow us, but we turned them back by saying—" You cannot go with us." We then went forward, and I fell in with a detachment of the Blues, and had some convaisation with their commanding officer, whom I knew by f a ce, although I did not knoiv his name. I believe him to have been Colonel Bouverie. He had then sent a mes sage to the Earl of Liverpool, to know whether tire procession was to pass the City or not. He concurred with me, that that would be the best mode of preventing violence and disordena- A baggage waggon had at that time been drawn up across th lane by the people for the purposes of obstruction. The Of ficer in question then remarked—" I am here only in the command of a guard of honour, and . I have no authority for performing any other duty ; but the people are doing very wrong, and particularly towards the soldiers, whose baggage they have stopped." I acceded to this, and immediately went forward to try to induce the people to remove the_ waggon, and set it at liberty. I went, in the company of my Hon. Friend the Member for Aberdeen, and addressed the people. I told them that the soldiers would want their baggage and other com forts at the end of their march upon so wet a day, and that if the waggon was detained they world be subject to every in convenience on their arrival at Windsor at night. This had the desired effect, and the people said -" Oh, yes; put the horses to, and let them go on." The Commanding Offic er im mediately acknowledged my services in the most unequivocal manner. I then went up a lane, where a servant seeing me so wet, kindly asked me to take shelter under a gateway, wh'ch I did, as well for the sake of myself as my horse.' I after wards returned, and went on towards Hyde Park-corner. On the road we were met by a Gentleman who came riding on horseback, and told us that Sir Robert Baker had given orders for the procession to go through the City. So far from any hostile feeling exhibited at that time, the people seemed quiet and pleased. After going On • very peaceably, to our surprise, as soon as we had p asse d the Hyde Park ga te, the heads of the foremost horses were turned up Park lane. The people thought they had been deceived, and sheweil I signs of resentment. The Gentleman who said that he had re ceived the promise of Sir B. Baker that the funeral should pass through the city, was questioned, anti compelled to repeat what he had before stated. The hearse eventually proceeded through the. Park : and when we-got -to Stanhope Gate, there was a slight stoppage. I then saw an Honourable Member of this House gallopping down the Park, who saluted us in pass ing, and who I concluded was going to order up fresh troops.L. Immediately afterwards a party of cavalry did advance up the Park, and the people-being vexed, made-use of irrit kting lan guage. But I saw no stone flung at that period. Upon ad vancing towards Cumberland Gate I saw what I should call the refluent population coining from thence. I afterwards learnt that a report had been 'confidently spread and believed that the Life Guards were cutting down the people. But they were only then clearing the ground with that regularity and dispatch which their duty warranted. Upon my arrival at the gate I found it shut ; but a man who knew ma, and whom I did not know, immediately' opened it and let me pass. When I was through the gate I found the Blues formed in regular order round the hearse ; but the Life Guards were broken and. scat tered about exactly in the state of cavalry whom I have seen repulsed, or having failed in a charge. They had evidently departed from all order or command, and whatever might have been the original-provocation, of which I knew nothing, I saw clearly that -there was no necessity for the continued firing which was then going on. I therefore sought for the Command ing Officer, but without effect. I then asked a party of men whom I saw fire whether they had received orders to do so ? They said they had not received orders, but that they had been ill-treated.—(clear, hear !)—I then went to another party who fired in the direction of Ty-burn Gata, and I asked them the same question. They said they had received no orders to fire, but that they had been grossly ill-treated beyond what men could endure.—(Hear,-hear !)—I then saw a man, who from his dress I took to be a Marshall - nail, and he came up to me and said, " Sir Robert, they are only firing blank cartridges to frighten the people." I then moved on, when a pistol was fired, and a ball passed so close to my face that I put up my hand to see whether the blood followed it. I immediately turned round to. the quarter from - whence I supposed the shot proceeded, and I saw men deliberately re-loading their pistols. I then said, without the slightest warmth or anger, " This is disgraceful; you see the people are unarmed : do not disgrace your conduct at Waterloo, You have had cannons fired at your heads, never mind a few stones." So c oo l and collected was I, and so devoid of any thing like intemperance when I said this, that I did not even accompany it with an oath. I then saw a gentleman in plain clothes, mounted upon a caval ry horse, whom I supposed to be a magistrate. I went up to him, and entreated him to take the command of the military force, to have the officer by his side, and net to' let him quit it. That Magistrate at, the time made use of a remark which would fully justify my view of the soldiers' conduct. But I shall not repeat it, .as I would 'rather have it from the mouth of the gen tleman himself at the. Bar of this House.-.-(Cries of "Speak.") —I should rather not repeat it at present.—(Continued cries of " Speak," from sonic Members behind the Honourable Knight.) —I will not repeat it now, because I am determined in no wise to . he an accuser upon the present occasion. My object is to defend myself.—(Loud cheering.)—l- then saw the gentle man whom 1 supposed to be th e C omman ding Officer of the party, and I told hint he ought to be with the Ma gistrate. lie said he had given no orders to fire—(Hear, hear, hear !)—and that he was sorry that any firing should have 'taken place. I then brought the lagiStrate to this OiEcer, who I understood was Major Oak. I should here reined' . that when I spoke t o th e so ldi ers i n t h e manner I have stag to the House, they appeared to feel the rebuke; and - infal there was no firing after that pe r iod. M a j or O a k es then 0` that his men had done the duty for which they were sent there' which was to clear the road at Cumberland-gate, and he show°, therefore take th e m awa y. Il e t h en w h eeled, as if to lea' them past the hearse, through a great crowd of the people, ;tel. where there w e re a grea t many l oose stones. I then said, 1 you will allow me to make a suggestion, I think it would be better to turn up some of these streets to the right, than for the men to go through the midst of the people under existing eir; cumstances." He said that he would execute that plan, and accordingly wheeled his men back and turned up a street t° the right. While the party were turning round the corner, a large piece of the pavement was thrown at them, and struck a soldier violently on the casque, and the .man. behaved with re markable temper and patience. But I declare that during t'° time of the tirin g.w hi c h I saw, thc.throwin g of etones.waitO' partial, and riot such as to call for such severity_ .Soon afttr . ,_ this, an officer of th e Bl ue s cam e up w i tha party of menewirt fresh orders from the Earl of Liverpoel h I:wentett the of* . n ' and said, " You a r e , p er h aps, not aware eV what has pa e laciuh between the troops and the people, and that the latter havetdaw fired upon. Th e y are di spose d ' to renew the" disturbance e s>9d as you have only six men, you had perhaps better retire, g e r* have no farther d u ty to perform." The officer acquiesced . 11 ° my opinion, .and said, that' as lie had exec u t e d, hiseduty,'he would thkehN Men. away, which be accor di ng l y did. Some", thing then entan g l e d the wheels of th e he arse, and the, peOPL° . shewed a disposition - to take advantage of it, to turn the how down another street towards the city., I and hey friends iotr fered, and actually had the hearse put into its proper aralpre' scribed route. The Honourable Member. then stated, -tha t lie fell into his place in the procession, and went on with it without further interruption. The 11 on.• Gentleman wag understood to say, that be returned•to his own house to dinner. The Noble Marquis opposite ought to h,e o e that this was. tler • case, for he must u nd ou bt e dl y have int - veinal, when it had been regularly given in evidence that he dined somewhere on the. road that night, and drank a toast, which in itself was moat lod ger, if not treasonable. He afterwards went to. Harwich ; and with regard to a tr a n sact i on w hi c h occurred. there,. he covilw. appeal to his Honourahle Friend the Member for Winchelsea , as to the part which he took in it.v.iiiiem.laetttoenctlheed.bthode'yreonflot,; i r: of her Majesty' s rema i ns from the church, as a mark of - respect due to the illustrious deceased but he had n o s h are i n t h e controversy which ensued; 1.111.10 he returned to town, he was told by his friends of various ru mours which were afloat, and one told hint that he was at least to be hanged, drawn, and quartered, for directing and planning . the obstructions made by the people on. the day -of, the Queen's funeral. For three days these rumours continued to be repeat ed, He was proud to say, that he possessed the friendship;.of Lord Harrington, the distinguished Nobleman who commanded the First Regiment of Life Guards, and he repaired to lira; to inquire what line of conduct lie ought to adopt. ne found that Nobleman from home, but he mentioned the subject to, his gm Meanwhile the•report s con ti nue d , an d sonic said, that he was to be turned out of the army ; others, that he was re be sent before a court martial. In this situation, he was advised and rather disposed to make a •statement to the Commander-ill - Chief. Eventually, however, he decided that it would not be consistent with his situation, and his friends agreed, that it would be altogether inexpedient. lie then det erm i ne d on' waiting up on his Royal Highness the Commander-in-Chief- He did so, but found that his Royal Highness was at Brighton. He could not think of following him thither to interrupt him with his own personal business. He therefore saw the Military Secretary of the Commaiider-in-Chief, Sir Herbert Taylor, to whom he made a represeptation of the whole facts of the case He told him also, that he was ready to inset the reported come plaints in any shape which it should please his Royal highnesa that they should be brought against him. Ile teen told him that he had left two of his children in Paris, totally unsettlede and that he asss Obliged to go there, where he should be reads , t° receive any commands from the Commander-in -Chief. Sir H• Taylor then made a minute which was in effect, " That Major, General Sir R. ‘Vilson call e d u p on Si r H . T ay l or on the 23c1 of August, 1822, and stated that many calumnious reports bar - • ing been in circulation regarding his conduct on the 14th of August precedingt—he did not feel himself at liberty to make a representation to the Commander-in-Chief thereupon, be that he was ready to meet them at all times and to rebut them' The Hon. Member stated that at the same time, lie did giro Sir Herbert Taylor a statement of the facts for his own infor mation. Not receiving any communication from Sir H. Taylor up to the sth of September, he then went to Paris. After being • there some time, on the 19th of the same month he received a note from Sir C. Stuart, stating that he.wished to see him as he had, something to communicate to him from the Ministers. Be' fore going to the Ambassador, he happened to enter one of the public coffee-houses, and there lie saw in a French Paper an ' extract from the English Courier, announcing that he had been dismissed from his Majesty' s service. Upon waiting on Sit Charles Stuart, he received from hint the following note, signed by his Royal Highness the Command6r-in_chi e f : _ " Sin—l have it in command from his Alajesty to inform . you, that his Majesty has no further use for your services." • Thus, he found that, in two lines, lie was stripped of his rank, and plundered of his income. —(Hear, hear, hear!) --1 0 would say plundered,—(Cheers) —and a stain endeavoured to be cast upon his. character. With regard to his Royal Highness . the Duke of York, he knew, and should always consider, tha t he had acted only in conformity to the King's commands. He should always have to f ee l grate f u l to him for repeated acts 0 .1 • • kindness manifested towards him ever since his connection wirh. the army. He imm e di a t e ly wrote a l etter to t h at illustrious inthe vidual, to which he should only refer, as it had been published in • every shape. On September 24, he felt it necessary to write to Major Oakes, upon a statement which had appeared in the public prints, which was so devoid of truth thanhe felt a strong necessity for noticing this calumny, although ha overlodked • others. On the 25th of September, he received a letter -from .. his Royal Highness the Duke of York, which consisted of ow' line. It was as follows :—" Sir, his Majesty does not deem it proper to comply with your request." He arrived in England on the 7th of October, and•was still desirous of obtaining justice from the military authorities; he therefore made another ap plication to the Commander in Chief, in which he referred to his former statement s , an d po i nte d out t h e impossibility. ore contradicting secret report. He stated his willingness to Place himself under the jurisdiction of a Court Martial, notwithstand ing that his dismissal {had removed hint from it. He did this. because he knew there was a precedent for it in the case of Sir George Sackville. The answer he received was, that having • laid before his Majesty all the former communications, his Royal Highness did not feel justified in proceeding further with the matter. Thus, he found his original sentence (.00.- firmed. Yet he did not despair. He still thought that if he could prove the falsehood of the reports which had been circu -I..ted against hint, he should receive justice at the hands of his Majesty. He accordingly applied to Lord Viscount Sid mouth, for copies of the evidence which he understood some persons to have given ageim t him, in order that he. might prosecute them - for perjury, when he was told that he' had not applied through the proper channeL In the next' place he went to Sir It. Birnic, who gave him a minute of some evidence which had been deposed against him, but which the Magistrates at the first investigation found to be false. He then heard that there had been some evidence taken in the office of the Home Department about his having been seen with a pewter pot in his hand, encouraging the people to tumult and disturbance. He applied again to Lord Sidniouth; a nd was told, that the Noble Viscount did not consider hirnselfjus tified in granting the request. This might be official justice, but it was -not consistent with the principles of justice re cognized and acted upon elsewhere. It now becamohis duty to advert to the correspondence between himself and Major, Oakes, which, as it had not yet been communicated to any but his immediate friends, was of considerable importance.-- The Honourable Member then read a letter from himself to Major Oakes, dated Paris; September 24th, 1821, stating, diat he had seen a report in The Times newspaper respecting 's . conversation between them, which it was desirable should be contradicted, as it was not founded in fact, ;led was of a most injurious tendency as a fabrication. The letter further stated, that so far from any thing hostile having take?' place between them, Major Woes would recollect that their conversation had been meet friendly and courteous. It then ref err.d to a conversation, in which Major Oakes was „ said to have denied g i v i ng or d ers to fire, and Sir R. - Wilson advised that Officer to act under the direction of a Magistrate, and to turn his men in aparticular direction when leavin g the ground. In reply to this, Major Oakes wrote that he could not consent to make himself the organ of contradiction to the various rumours which were circulated, and if' he did so in this case, he must in all. fie admitted saying to Sir R. Wilson, that lie had not given orders for the men to fire, and hlso that he received a suggestion from him as to the party turning. down King -street. But he had no recollection of any courtesy.' which passed between them, or of having said th a t h e re g r etted the firing. The Honourable Member having read the let ters' begged to observe th a t M a j or O a k es on l y state d t hat he did not recollect these cirtuaneances; therefore there was no discordance bet ween t h em . Having thought it his • • duty to get all the information he could in vindication ot his own conduct, he had also applied to Mr. White, the Magistrate, with ,whom he lead conversed on the day to• queition. He applied to that Gentleman ' therefore, to answe r the following question s :—" Did in or did I not, on the 14th of August last, during the time of the funeral procession', • express in your presence my anxiety for the res toration .9 1- tranquillity ? Did you, or did yo u no t, o b serve me t o act J e n . conformity to that expressed a n x i e ty ?" He mentioned to • White, at the same time, that he should Make use of his al! swers in Parliament or elsewhere,' if he • should' have occasion , solo do. The answer which he recel - i,'ed from this Igagiss4 .