The Sun. — London, England, 1847-12-03 00:00:00

A r„, , arik n 3 the Ps;eht Hon. Baronet (Sir R. Peal). _N u : f01h , ; 41 COUlti, in his opinie:. • - a res. is which "og from such a course. tie saw advantage ctrl could result from intetaerence, but belies', d the must be left to cure itself. He was favourable to ite`e_itaosition of SCUM check on the Bank, whose in ti.r_e!it was to keep money plentiful, and especially upon the issue of country bank not+ s. ths4lr. DRUMMOND said that the Right Hon. Baronet and for Tamworth must be a wonderful man, I s luc t his Bill of 1844 be a most wonderful Bill, it either rterld accomplish one-twentieth part of that which had attributed to them.—(Hear, and a la igh.) He rUinmond) was not one of those who thought the with of the corn-laws had anything whatever to do bu h the position in which this country was now placed ; th l, with regard to railroads, he confessed that he by e both the late and the present Government b b een much to blame when, having been warned t(3),, their own respective boards, they ousht which taken some decisive measure to check the mania rit i 4 e the • since 'eh seine time raged. Railroads had served to se interest on mortgages, and he feared the con stquensea Would not end until they had witnessed a great th e s r t i6ce of Private property. The misfortune, too, was, which had been commence d mus t b e finished, and more 1 8 ",eY would be required. 'With respect to the Bill of to he had expected that it was to be the precursor to 'e Putting an end to the connexion between the Go otru tnent and the Bank of England; but it was quite s ss ,, tle lts, from what had recently transpired, that the o de of conducting the business of the Bank had beeu f - I"tely changed. As to over-trading, it was mani tlit that it had existed to an incredible extent. In an t:4 times, when argosies went out from Venice or Ge pssa' t heY carried goods and bullion to exchange for s s auce, and there was in the world no such thing as (ihg by pap er unt il t hi s nat i on h a d c h osen i n its sv.is ettle to get rid of its own race of kings, and to bring i !. 1* a butchman.—(Hear, and laughter.) Hence had ri sen a system of raising a false credit. A most astute c autious mercantile man had stated, " When people lied of solid ca pit a l w ithout credit, they had no know ae of th e commerce o f this country. A man with a t s s - ellal of 10,000/. may legitimately be doing business taree times that amount." So that it was clear 3 3 1 stem on which the trade of this country had suite carried on was perfectly rotten, for it was r the clear to him that a trade cond uc t e d on a cre dit i t , e extent of three times the solid substance a man si t la essed could no t s t an d. How was it that the adver had so much increased in its depth and intensity ? moiety.ey had changed the whole relative condition es pbss. In former times the land was considered sa iL .',,`°lng, and a distinction had been established by 7 °4 law, because it was common sense, between that 1 4 :" was real and that which was personal ; but of Yeara the practice had been to cry down land and al , 114 t cotton ; they had put down the landlords and ex god' the c o t ton lords—(A laugh)—they ha d c h eapene d 3 , but they had also taken from their customers the s: a a til l of buying th em . —(H ear , h ear .) They had list tienes-st° a manufacturer of consummate eloquence, pru th and judgment, who had said that the towns g oo rule th e country. The towns d i d so, an d muc h Iy h it t might it do them.—(H e ar, and a laugh.) The a sa r a l lt bad enabled them to raise colossal fortunes th e ''' s t a starving population.—(Hear, hear.) Under it s ad okPeratives were lording it over them at one time, tele "'riling their mills and sacking their palaces at 1)e It had been said that f r ee-trade principles Is i rr ° 44 ,ed the l an d , an d L on d on was po i nte d to as h av i ng , ten-tative a ` nt enance of those principles, returned as its repro- Th at Nobl e L or d a t t h e h ea d o f th e Treasury. of was th true; but the constituency had taken off some wi th e g r ace of that charm by coupling the Noble Lord con w•—(Laughter.) But on th other hand, the lititituency, par excellence the most enlightened modern d f sa „'lls, had given a reverse judgment, for they had h e go out that the modern Demosthenes must not come s t o r t e, and they had sent in his stead a gentleman who wa m e ach the House how to behave itself.—(Laughter.) Ar s r'l44-CGREGOR said that he would have abstained *err! obtruding himself on the attention . of the House, ssPis it not that, as the representative of a greatncotmhe al constituency, he felt called upon, w $t J e dr e t of commercial distress was under consid h . e e ration, 0 841 - 66 8 a few observations to the House. His Right pith Frie nd the Chancellor of the Exchequer . had d. st t ate , d s 1 great abilit the causes of the commercial res wit l h eh had Visited the country, and although he agreed the - s - hi s Right Hon. Friend in attributing the distress to thteauses, he differed from him as to the degree to th a l s e "aorne of the causes had operated. He conceived es,-,," waseficient harvest and the failure of the potato laeled, sthe principal cause of the distress which pre- L ad - e '-'• With respect to railways, although Parliament he ti rts 3 ed a much greater number of Railway Bills than of ,011ght it was wise to do, he did not attribute much .a• the ,listress to investments in railways, for during p seip Period of unparalleled scarcity which had recently hei ss ' ab ed, be believed that the employment afforded by the -11 Y8 had, to a great extent, relieved the distress of co t s Nor did he attribute the distress to the A c ilk Charter Act of 1844, although he thought that d u , t i as defective, and believed that it would be pro be...." of so much inconvenience that Parliament would thttobliged to remedy its defects. It was his opinion terrible We should never have a currency not con gold ; but, at the same time, he e c h rie elyed that the restrictions imposed by the Bank roamer Act of 1844 constituted, particularly as regarded Il_tland , a grievance, and must necessarily cause much .^.'°nvenience, and some commercial distress. It was matter of regret to him that his Right Hon. Friend the Ch a encellor of the Exchequer referred to the Scotch king system, or rather the joint-stock banks of that , - ntitry, in terms which were calculated to create all 7.stroneous impression respecting those establishments. s _ 4 e believed that to the system of Scotch banking, r,npled with the economy and industry of the people, "ge general prosperity of that country and the great im tr°l'ensent3 made in manufactures and agriculture, must se attributed. The best test of the merits of the Scotch ba nks was to be found in the small number of failures which had taken place, and also in the fact thatofthe est ablishm en t s w hi c h h a d failed nearly a ll had paid in lull their obligations to the public. He begged leave to 8j (1 .4 passage from Mr. M'Culloch'is " Statistics of the e'A t tah Empire," on the subject of Scotch banks : th,:;wing partly to the superior stabilitypedrheraipvsedtofrtohme le as e xtensive proprietary, but more s e a a risk attending the business of banking in R2tlatad, bankruptcies have been very rare among -'otch banks. They have long enjoyed the unli kis a d tee confidence of the public, and from their "tug small sums (10/.) as deposits, and theyaing er sst rate u p on them at about 1 per cent. below market e ste, they have contributed much to diffuse a spirit of er t li°ll3 Y, and to increase accumulation. One-pound the!' We issued by the Bank of Scotland in 1704, and sh,: r ,i 4 sue has been thence continued to the present day; l s - yin 'tet prohibiting their circulation in England not last been extended to Scotland. For many years e t',Y little gold coin has been seen in Scotland.. eo Qcoteh banks make their advances partly by dis aitlient of bills and partly by what are called cash ere- A • 1%0 latter is a very convenient method of issue. slivath account is a credit given by the bank to an in t lidual drawing for it, wholly or partially, as he pleases, o e st il i ltt eing it in the same way—being charged interest Archon the portion he withdraws." A little pamphlet, 1-,n in 1734 by Patrick Lindsay, then Lord Provost sa.'dinburgh, gives an account of the condition of Scot previously to the establishment of banks in that ,s,,s e s . r a stry, snr•Lindsay says:—" We were then stran- Z s r _ to trade. War was our trade and military discipline h profession and sole study. When we had peace ttbr oa u d e , our gentlemen and persons of quality went sh in quest of foreign adventures, and carried it4:_d_tFoog numbers of the common people as soldiers p ill s for foreign service. Many of them were en- Iss c r 0 on both sides in these wars in the low countries." sivnntry had ever developed its resources so exten- I t , W _IY . and so advantageously as Scotland had since the equal l Bank was established in 17 9 7. No country of eult- riclnPulation had made greater improvements in agri tisse 0 and manufactures. It would be unjust in refer t9. the progress which Scotland had made, to with all allusion to the excellence which she has attained ' 4 naval architecture, particularly in the department of st eam tw v easels. Th e admirable steamers which run be e en Liverpool an d Boston and New York were all smiltin the Cly s d el e s , atnhdanit was not going too far to assert, that better vessels Whether for the purposes tohiceie constructed in Scotland, launched from the docky or commerce, never were as: " f this country. All this had taken place under the s S ° and therefore he trusted that Xcal:t system of banking ; to interfere rashly with a system tempt would be made not beneficial results. Let it be unders h too hsd th p a ro l d ie uc d e id d wish to ; see a system of currency in Scotland t which should not be convertible into gold ; all lie maintained a"L!I., that the Scotch banks were adapted to the wants ettte country in which they were established, and an wijecl every purpose which was required of thorn. r• SANDARS said it had been stated that the c arn attribu ni al distress in which the country was involved was fro table to railways, but h e decidedly dissented th 111 that proposition. He should like to know whether ef: co nstruction of railways had sent gold out of the is a u d tit ,r7. Had it caused the exchanges to be against us? e s — it caused the floating capital of the co un t ry to be ns ereed t o fi xe d ca pit a l? Certainly not.—(gear,74'tistuc) It had been said that money expended o n th e -° tion of railways—that railway ca . pital, was all "'Xed e • at ss , caPital. That was not so. If a . s man, for in invested 50,0001. in railways it undoubtedly b ecame fixed, in a certain sense; but what became of the t w .Yers' bills, the sums expended in iron, wages, ; &c.? Provisions were purchased h ma by the a ho ur . employed, by the iron founders, artisans, &c.c. Ire a -- "'s paid in th a t wa y were therefore no drain i tl e° l l the country—they remained in it, and were float regn ea Pital- As to the Bank Charter he thought it it r°llsible, even in times of prosperity, that need !° lll d be operative; in times of pressure, he 1 , hardly express his opinion that the e s s Z te ncY of the country was inadequate for its at It did not stand to reason, when corn was selling g• and Cl. a quarter last year, thut the currency should e c , l e same as when corn was down to 50s. a quarter. d it be said that the distress had not been deeply, tel'n,cloh perhaps indirectly, affected by the operation of B ank eharter ? What a state the mercantile cora sza,snltY Must have been in when they were obliged to oatuiertake the payment of eight per cent. for accommo she r I Now he would tell the Right Hon. Baronet that rade of the country could not have borne such an .1-L P : . s .s t ' the Committee of Inquiry which the Right .-rsaronet had thought it necessary to ask for were -Tpointed, the result would be many, perhaps different titexs....e.di,e.s., would be proposed. However, he (Mr. San • r:t,,,),Pld not object to the inquiry, but he wished to sug &that some temporary measure should be passed, in aritenterini, to suspend the operation of the Bank and re move suspense and uncertainty amongst the e merca ntile int erests. All the mischief that had been do !sea for the sake of convertibility. Had they ac 'wnPlished their designs ? No such thing i He main tained we had no such thing as7convertihility, and what !he , utd JtiggEq , : , that silvt r 5,0t.' , 1 tie tvadc, standard as well as gold. He had mire, been an adv. cafe for free trade, but he thought, as the measure had passed, it ought now to have a fair trial. He did not attribute our recent calamities to free trade, but to the large and necessary importations of grain in 1846. Some disparagement was cast upon the merchants who had been engaged in the importation of grain during that year. He was prepared in that place to defend them. What were the facts ? In January, 1847, the First Minister of the Crown (Lord J. Russell) came down to that House, and recommended the importation of foreign corn upon as extensive a scale as possible. With that view—to encourage the importation of it—some of the restrictions then existing were removed. In July of the same year similar recommendations were repeated—a further suspension of duties took place. Corn was im ported accordingly, and the country stood in need of it. Instead, therefore, of the importers being blamed, they were, he conceived, entitled to the thanks and approba tion of the country, even though some pecuniary advan tages should have accrued from such speculations. Our stock of corn was already growing very low, and in his opinion, before next harvest we should have to send eight or ten millions of money out of the country for grain to meet our actual requirements. Sir W. CLAY should decidedly support the appoint ment of the Committee. He wished to caution the House and the country against expecting too much from the inquiries and recommendations of the Committee, or from the legislation which might follow. Legislation upon these subjects was rather valid to prevent evil than to originate good. It was quite beyond the power of the Legislature to add one single pound to the capital of the country. The utmost it could do was to take care that the country, in making use of a paper currency, should not overstep the limits within which alone the advantage of a paper currency might be safely used. The point of the inquiry of the Committee would be practically his, whether the object of the Act of 1844 had been clFsirable; and secondly, whether that object had been attained. It should be borne in mind that the framers and supporters of that measure had never held it out as a measure that would of necessity prevent fluc tuations. In his opinion, the experience of the last year had afforded a most convincing proof of the value of the measure of 1844. It was to the natural operation of that Act he attributed the beneficial change which had taken place in the course of the last six weeks, and by no means to the relaxation permitted by the Govern ment letter of the 25th of October. As to that pro- i ceeding itself, he by no means concurred in the opinion that it ought to have been earlier adopted. Had the measure been earlier taken, it would soon have been fol lowed by a large issue of paper of the Bank, and the consequent entire derangement of the exchanges. He considered it idle to talk of restriction of the currency ; for, under the Act of 1844, it was made to expand to the fullest extent necessary ; all that was done was to prevent a factitious superabundance of issues. The events of the last twelvemonth had convinced him that something was necessary to regulate the Bank's action. Mr. MASTERMAN said he should not have risen ex cept for the remark that had fallen from the lion. Mem ber for the Tower Hamlets (Sir W. Clay), as to the re cent interposition of Government. He considered that the Committee would be the proper place for discussing the causes of the recent commercial disasters, but he was anxious now to express his opinion that great credit was due to the Government for their recent interference, at a moment when, he believed, the country was never in a more dangerous state.—Hear.) The evil at that time was not so much a want of money, as the belief that there was a want of it ; a panic existed withont any real cause.—(Hear, hear.) He had had the honour to form one of a deputation who waited on the members of the Government; and though, in that inter view, he had advocated some relaxation, he had done so without any wish to give room for fictitious issues.— (Hear, hear.) He had never been favourable to the Bill of 1844. At the time it was proposed he had ex pressed his opinion that no one could say whether the authorised amount of fourteen millions was sufficient ; and that it might be necessary to give the Bank power to issue beyond that amount.—(Hear, hear.) From what was said by the Right Hon. the Chancellor of the Exchequer, he conceived he was now convinced that that measure could not longer work without some modi fication. If the Committee was appointed, its inquiries might occupy a long time; and he hoped that some re solution would be come to by the House in the interim, giving the public confidence that the Bank would be authorised to extend its issues if necessary. He begged again to thank the Government for their timely and valuable interference.—(Hear, hear.) Mr. BLEWITT severely condemned the Act of 1844, and likened its operation to that of an " infernal ma chine." He quoted from the speech of Sir R. Peel, in proposing the Act of 1819, and contended that the Right Honourable Baronet had contradicted his own principles in the Act of 1844. He felt dis gust at the principles which had been pre scribed to the Bank as their rule of action. It would seem, from the way the Chancellor of the Exche- Exchequer treated the matter, that they were first to be ruined before they were to be saved.—(A laugh.) When the letter of the Government was written, had the potato crop emerged from its rottenness, had the great houses arisen from their ashes, or had the foreign exchanges altered at the magical bidding of Wood, the enchanter ? —(Renewed laughter). Not so! though happily now, if all did not go so merry as a marriage bell, at least the bell that rung the knell of commerce had ceased to toll. —(lronical cheers and renewed laughter.) But he was tiring the House.—(Cries of " No, no; go on.") Well, then, he would state his views on the subject of converti bility and the standard.—(Hear.) What the gold standard was he was unable to say ; but that it was something of consequence in the opinion of the Right Hon. Baronet was clear from the fact that he would not have a silver standard at any price. All people were entitled to demand gold from the Bank of England at a certain price. Why should we be obliged to buy gold, not at its market price, but at a price fixed upon it by the bullion brokers ? Suppose the Em• peror of Russia were to take it into his head to ex change his millions of gold for iron rails, or any other product of this country, why there would be no demand for gold at our fixed price, and it would have to lie in the cellars of the Bank useless, except, perhaps, to minister to the diseased faneies of the bullionists.— (Hear, and laughter.) For his part, he could not con ceive whence arose the dread there was in this country of an export of gold. He could see no reason why gold should not be made an exchangeable commodity as well as anything else. When our crops failed we had real cause for dread, but what was the use of shedding tears for the loss of bullion, which was mere dross, and only useful as a medium of exchange. He was anxious that an addition should be made to the subjects for inquiry by the Committee as to the operation of the Act of 1844, and he trusted that would be assented to. On the motion of the Marquis of GRANBY, the debate was then adjourned. RAILWAY BILL. The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER gave notico that he should proceed with the Railway Bill at the meeting of the House to• morrow. The House adjourned at Twelve o'clock. ROUSE OF LORDS, Dec. 2. The Earl of SHAFTESBURY, in the absence of the Lord Chancellor, took his seat upon the Woolsack shortly after Five o'clock. THE SUN, IRELAND.-COERCION BILL. The Duke of RICHMOND gave notice that he should, to-morrow, move for a return of the number of persons who had been tried under the provisions of the Coercion Act introduced by Lord Grey's Government. Lord FARNHAM presented a petition from Sun derland (as we understood) praying their Lordships to adopt immediate measures for the restoration of tranquillity in Ireland. He did not consider the measure introduced by the Government of a suffi• ciently stringent nature to put an end to the system of murder which was the disgrace of Ireland, and he besought their Lordships and the Government to adopt measures of such a stringent character as should effectually put an end to the system of terror at pre sent existing in Ireland. DEFENCES OF THE COUNTRY. The Earl of lIARDWICKE gave notice of a motion after Christmas on the state of the defences of the country. CHIEF POOR-LAW COMMISSIONER. Lord BROUGHAM asked when the Chief Poor law Commissioner would be appointed? The Marquis of LANSDOWNE was understood to say that the subject was under the consideration of the Government. _ DISTRESS OF THE COUNTRY. The Marquis of LANSDOWNE then rose to move for a Select CJmmittee to inquire into the causes of the recent commercial distress, and how far it has been affected by the laws for regulating the issue of bank-notes payable on demand. In bring ing for war d t hi s mot i on, h e m i g ht b e permitted to preface it by some observations on the causes of the existing distress. It had pleased Pr ov id ence to destroy a large portion of the produce of th e eart h , and it was not in the power o f any Gover nment to supply been the reckless admitt e d. the loss ;that fact was ge nerally Another source of that distress had e spe l c a u s l t at t io h n ree wh y i e c a h rs iLad sp b ec e u en indulged in during ears—specu lation which had in _ gone far beyond anything which th e capital o over f thnm the country wou ld: war r an t, and which n o G could be able to supply. Two years ago he had been asked whether he was prepared, und er a ll circum stances, to maint a i n the Bank Charter Bill ; he had said that he was not prepared to commit himself on e th o e m s m u i b t je h c hn t a se t i t f h o a n t ttihmees,uhnjeeiotthenrow anywas he pr e p are d t o more than he should be prepared to say, that becauseadcome a vessel safe of a certain particular constructi on into port under certain circumstances, that, there fore, it was a construction best fitted to cope circumstances entirely different. It w as am with for inquiry; and, therefore, he moved for the ap pointment of this ComFnittee ; but he thought it right, in order to prevent any misapprehension, to state that he did not propose to abrogate the law under which the currency had been regulated for 20 years, and which enforced a metallic standard. It struck him that the main subjects of inquiry would be, Ist, what were the provisions of the Act of 1844 ; 2dly, what were the circumstances producing the present distress ; and idly, what effect had the Act of 1844 had in producing these circumstances.—(Hear.) It had been the opinion of many that the Act of 1819 would be sufficient to establisk the currency , upon a secure basil, but it appesred the under oer. tain circumstances an over-issue of paper had taken a,. , i oit oe , ,lsi , n , the i4ank of Eng land had been on the verge of being unable to comply with the requisites of the law. The Bill of 1844 had been introduced to bring about a state of greater safety, at the same time securing to the country the advantages of leaving as much paper to perform the offices of gold as could be left with safety to the system, and with safety to the country. The Bank was permitted to issue 14,000,0001. of notes, but for every note beyond it must have gold in their coffers ready to meet it. Such were the provisions of the law of 1844. At the beginning of last autumn the commercial world was suffering from a panic unequalled in intensity. The demand for capital was enormous—the demand of capital for railways in 1841. 1842, and 1843, was four millions and a half; in 1844, 6,000,0001.; 1845, it had increased to 14,000,0001. In the first half of 1846, the demand was 9,800,000/. ; up to the second it was 26,000,000, making 36,000,000/.; and, in 1847, it was 63,777,000, thus doubling the demand for capital of the preceding year. Where was all this capital to come from which there was no visible means of sup plying ? He knew not it he should be told that there was some inexhaustible mine of wealth, the ac cess to which had beeen cut off by Sir R. Peel's Bill. He believed in no such mine, and it had only existence in the heated fancies of speculators. This demand for railways had been aggravated by the demand for capital to pay for foreign corn. In 1846 this demand amounted to 5,139,0001. In 1847 we had to pay for foreign corn 14,184,0001. It was to these great demands uponlour capital that he attributed the pressure, and that pressure would have existed whether the Bill of 1844 had existed or not. It, perhaps, had caused the pressure to be felt somewhat sooner, but he believed that the value of that Bill had been proved, by bringing on the pressure gradually, instead of sud denly, and thus avoiding a sudden and abrupt convulsion, which it is the object of all legislation to obviate. He was not, however, prepared to say in what manner the existence of that law may have aggravated the panic, which was itself a great calamity independently of the pressure. With respect to the pressure, he did not think any act of Government could relieve it, but he thought that the Government might act upon the panic. The panic induced persons to hoard the precious metals, which produced great inconvenience, and he believed that the panic had been greatly miti gated by the measures adopted by the Government. The effect of the letter of the Prime Minister to the Bank had been highly satisfactory, and had restored confidence without any infringe ment of the provisions of the Act of 1844. It would be for their Lordships to determine how far they would maintain the principle of that Act or how far they would be inclined to modify its provisions. The operation of the Act of 1844 would form one most important subject of inquiry before the pro posed Committee. He had in 1844 given a silent vote in favour of the Bill, because, admitting the defects of the measure of 1819, he was willing to give this measure, which professed to remedy those defects, a fair trial. It had had that trial, and it would be for the Committee to inquire how the mea sure had worked. He was not now going to argue the question of the Bank Charter Act, but he would say that that Act might exist for twenty years without any such occasion again arising. He was not pre pared to say that no circumstances could arise in which it might not be necessary for the Govern ment or for Parliament to interfere with the stringent provisions of the statute. It would be for their Lord ships to consider whether, under any circumstances, they might not retain the operation of the Act itself and legalize peculiar departures from it. That he considered was a subject for deliberate consideration ; but at the same time he felt that he had nothing to regret in the course that had been pursued, and that the suspension of the provisions of the Act, or the authority which had been given for that suspension, had been attended with the most beneficial results.-- He believed that if any doubt prevailed as to the wis dom of the course taken in this matter, there would be nothing like the unanimity of opinion which had been exhibited by their Lordships on the subject. He trusted this view would be confirmed by the Com mittee which he proposed, and which being fairly or ganised, and consisting as it would of individuals who had thought much on the subject, would, he was per suaded, do much to exchange that species of informa tion which was to be acquired on such a sub ject. The Bill to which he had alluded was not one calculated to lead to party discussions. lie knew that sitting as he did on the benches opposite at the time it was first brought forward, he voted for it. He did so because he felt convinced of the great danger of allowing the inconvenience which had so often been felt from the former mode of conducting the affairs of the Bank to continue; and when the Go vernment of the day came forward with a measure to prevent the recurrence of the disorders which had before been experienced, he felt disposed to accept of their proposal and to give the measure a full and fair trial. He was sure the Noble Lord opposite (Lord Stanley) himself, a member of the Government by which the.measure had been introduced, could not but feel some parental yearning towards his own offspring, and that notwithstanding all that had passed since,that time he would not now be found anxious to attack a measure which he had himself contributed to bring to life.—(Hear, hear.) Having thus briefly vindicated the course taken by her Majesty's Govern ment, he would leave the question in their Lordships' hands. Hehwould himself have perhaps wished that this inquiry had taken place at a somewhat later period, after the immediate tumult of the recent panic had subsided.—(Hear, hear.) But, at the same time, he trusted that the effects of the crisis would not last so long that their Lordships would not be enabled to give the coolest, as well as the fullest consideration to the subject of this inquiry. The Noble Marquis concluded by moving for the appointment of the Committee in the words of the notice, and resumed his seat amidst general applause. Lord STANLEY—WhiIe there are portions of the Noble Marquis's speech in which I am disposed alto gether to concur, and while I agree with him that this is not an occasion in which to enter into any extended discussion of the very large and complicated question, which is necessarily involved in the motion of the Noble Marquis, for the appointment of a Committee to inquire into the causes of the recent commercial distress, and its connexion with the laws affecting monetary regulations, I wish I could agree in what the Noble Marquis ap pears to anticipate—an almost unanimous feeling on the part of your Lordships in approbation of the course taken by her Majesty's Government with regard to this matter. My concurrence I undoubtedly give, cheerfully and readily, in the appointment of the Committee. If an inquiry before a Committee is the only course which her Majesty's Government are prepared to submit to the consideration of your Lordships and of Parliament on this subject, then I think, with all deference for the other House of Parliament, that such an inquiry should not be exclusively carried on before the House of Commons. I think that if an inquiry is to be insti tuted by Parliament, it is desirable that such an in quiry should be carried on simultaneously by your Lord ships' House and by the other House. With this view, and understanding that it had not been the intention of her Majesty's Government to propose to your Lordships the appointment of any committee of the description which the Noble Marquis now moves for, I felt it to be my duty, on a former evening, to give notice of my in tention to move for the appointment of this committee for the reasons I state. I wish I could say, which I cannot, that this, and this alone, was the course which her Majes ty's Government were in duty bound to pursue. Among the causes which were put prominently forward for the meeting of Parliament—and it was a cause which un doubtedly went home to the feelings of every man—l find that of the commercial distress under which the country has been suffering—a distress which I cannot agree with the Noble Marquis in calling recent, but which I would rather describe in the words of the speech from the Throne, " the distress that for some time has pre vailed among the commercial classes"—(Elear)—when that cause existed to an extent that, if the Legislature was to interfere at all, not only justified but rendered necessary the calling together of Parliament im mediately and without loss of time; and I am sure none of your Lordships could consider that the inconvenience of being called together at this unusual period of the year is not more than the weight of a feather in the scale while any palliation of the sufferings of the coun try may be effected by our prompt interference—(Hear, hear)—when that distress has, I say, prevailed to a degree of intensity and magnitude which the Noble Marquis has very far from over-stated (but which I think he has under-stated in the statement that he has just made to your Lordships), and when it has been the cause of Parliament being called together, then I hold we had a right to expect from her Majesty's Government that they should at least be prepared to come forward with such measures as they think expedient for the pur pose, not of removing—for I agree with the Noble Marquis that that is beyond the power of any Parlia ment, or of any legislation—but of palliating the mag nitude of that distress which they put forward as the cause of calling Parliament together at an unusual and inconvenient period of the year.—(Hear, hoar.) We have sat for fourteen days. It is now precisely fourteen days since Parliament was called together, and yet what does the Noble Marquis tell you? How stood the case ? After sitting fourteen days they were at length told by the Noble Marquis that, with re ference to the cause of the distress, he was at present prepared with no observations; that, as to any remedy or palliative of the distress, neither he nor his colleagues had any sugg es ti on t o make; that they asked the House to grant them a committee of inquiry for their guidance; and that as to opinions of their own they had none to offer.--(Hear, hear, from Earl Grey.) For the Noble nn :T a d tu r : h q e cel indeed,se distinctlyo fof ther m e Bank t no o l d Charterpt opinion. o r n.Lordships, Act e f 1844 4t uponas t o thethe commercial distress of the country he wouldiexpress, and Marquisha upon h o ef distressL A N S D of o Wt the E past— N o three t a s or ro four mt rTsl tht A her N rea L et E utrh Y i7suu W r hy it was precisely that distress unusuallym on th s early that period,had cal laenddr whichar lia mosfooferutingnhthee the e ar, immediate hear.) occwasaisonitfornottherZscriruyranngoow, then, that the Government should profess themselves wh.dly unprovided with an opinion upon this deeply im portant subject, snould . go into th e C omm i ttee ent i re l y uncommitted to any viewF, and even entirely free, and with a feeling, as far at least as the Noble Marquis was concerned, that it would be better to postpone the in quiry itself until a much later period?—(Hear, bear.) It would have been far more satisfactory to their Lord ships, and to the country, had the Noble Marquis been Prepared with an opinion one way or the other; at least, tending one way or the other. For himself, he (Lord Stanley) should be sorry to have it understood as his opinion that the principle of the Bank Charter Act of 1844 had been productive of the recent distress. The question was, whether during the period of distress the restrictive clauses of the Act had aggravated the diffi culties of the commercial community. This was a point on which it appeared to him manifest that the Govern meat ought by this time to have formed an opinion. If that opinion was that the restrictions of the Act had not produced this effect then they ought openly and firmly to have declared their intention to adhere . to the measure as it stands ; if, their policy would seem to indicate,as the they c ourse of thought that the restrictions were injurious in cases of pres sure, than they ought to have stated this opinion, and to have formed and expressed some intention accordingly. The Noble Marquis had referred to him as one of the framers of the Act of 1844. He had no desire to shrink from any responsibility attaching to him as a member of that Government under whose administration that mea sure became law, and he would at the same time remind the Noble Marquis that several members of the present Government, and among them prominently tho present Chancellor of the Exchequer, then acting as Chairman of the Committee on Banks of Issue, cordially concurred in the principle of the measure. —(Hear, hear.) But consistently with an entire adherence to the principle of the Act of 1844, as to the accuracy of which inquiry had been exhausted, it was op en t o hi m to assent to an inquiry whether the restrictions imposed by the Act were un wise in themselves, or calculated in any way to fetter the discretion of the Bank i n th e exercise of its f unct ions. This was the point, and the sole point, to which, as he conceived, the attention of the Committee would be directed, in reference to the influence of the Bank Charter of 1844 upon the late crisis. The question would be whether, with a million in their coffers, and the expectation of further supplies flowing in from abroad, the Bank directors were not injuriously restricted by the Act of 1844 from affording accommo dation to commerce.—(Hear, hear.) Upon this point the Noble Marquis professed himself unprovided with an opinion, though the letter of October 25 to the Bank directors would seem to indicate an opinion, and a pretty decided opinion, to have been formed on the subject by the Government.—(lleac, hear.) The course directed by that letter, and which might well hav e been adopted earlier—(Hear, hear)—was a distinct v i olation, a dis tinct condemnation, of the Act of 18 44 ,in that feature of it which had been most insisted upon, but which the Government had thus declared could not, in their judg ment, be maintained in operation under . all circum stances. The act of the Government, in fact, had re moved the very keystone of that beautifully symmetrical bridge to which Mr. Raikes Currie, in the deb a t e on the measure, had likened it. He bad said just now that Hon. Gentlemen had underrated the amount of commercial distress, and that he thought their earlier interference would have prevented much difficulty. He held in his hand a list of mer cantile houses which had actually become insolvent between July and November. The number amounted to 106. From the list was excluded all houses which had entered into private compositions with creditors—all failures on the Stock Exchange, which had been very numerous—all houses whose accounts were not actually under inspection—and that included one firm whose lia bilities amounted to millions; it also excluded all foreign houses, and it omitted as insignificant all houses whose liabilities did not amount to 20,0001. Now what were the results? In July there were 2 failures amounting to £210,000 August „ 16 2,369,000 September „ 26 6,520,000 October „ 35 6,840,000 In all, from July to the period at which her Majesty's Government thought fit to interfere, there had been failures of seventy-nine houses involving liabilities to the amount of 15,969,0001.—(Hear, hear.) Now, he con curred with the Noble Marquis, that it was impossible for any Legislature or for any Government to have pre vented the distresses which had occurred from failures of agricultural products, or from rash speculation, but it was impossible but that among the great houses which had fallen from July to November there must have been some which a more timely interference would have saved, and which being saved themselves might have prevented the ruin of many others dependent upon them. —(Hear, hear.) He had stated the liabilities of those which had failed. That was but a small part, however, of the distress which the panic had occasionedgon.Te, butheir Lordships knew the loss of those which had they knew nothing of the losses of houses that still stood, the extent of whose difficulties made it in many cases doubtful from day to day whether they could carry on their business, though it was certain that whether they carried it on or no, so immense a contraction of all their transactions must take place as greatly to cripple any of the firms with which they had connexion. And here he must observe that her Majesty's Government thought right upon the present occasion to use the word "recant," as applicable to the commercial distress. Now, the use of that word implied that the distress had passed by, and though the Bank of England might be in a better con dition than it was, yet so far from the distress having passed by, he should be glad to find himself mistaken in his apprehension that the worst and severest pressure was yet to come. As yet they had no accounts from India of a date subsequent to the arrival of the news of the great metropolitan failures ; and if he was to believe all the accounts he heard, three months would not elapse without accounts from Calcutta of great embarrassments and disasters, occasioned by the receipt of the intelligence. From this time to January, too, the merchants of London and of Manchester would be receiving back from India bills drawn upon the houses in England that had failed. The effects of the panic, moreover, had as yet scarcely reached the smaller merchant, the retail tradesman, and still less the la bourer dependent on those whose capital was now so greatly diminished. It was his fear that they would soon find a large proportion of these thrown out of em ployment, in which case great and increasing distress was to be feared. The Noble Marquis had said that the inquiry into which he invited them to enter would be a narrow one. Narrow ! what, when all these points were to b e inquired into ; when the subject was the effect of the recent commercial panic —the part which the Bank Charter Act had had in bringing it about—the influences of railway speculation and of overtrading—the conduct of the Bank—the results of a free trade policy I Narrow Why, if this inquiry was narrow, he should wish to know what the Noble Marquis would consider extensive ? So far from the inquiry being narrow, it was his opinion that, however long the crisis might last, however protracted it might still prove, yet that it would be over long before this Committee would be in a position to make a report or even to offer a suggestion. From the tone of the Noble Marquis, indeed, he was almost led to infer that as far as the Government were con cerned the report of the Committee would be a very unimportant one. They would state that they had been sorry to hear of the magnitude of the distress and of its aide-spread ramifications, but that nothing, in their op i n i o n, would have prevented the infliction of a bad harvest or the ill effects of over-trading, and that as for the Act of 1844, nothing had been proved against it. That appeared, as far as the Government went, to be likely to be the result of their Committee of Inquiry. One word before he sat down as to a matter requiring explanation. The Noble Marquis had said, in the course of the evening, that no legislation could make up for the loss in the supply of the agricultural produce of the c ountry, which had led to th necessity of importing foreign corn. Ho (Lord Stanley) concurred in that opinion. An importation of foreign corn to the value of 33 millions, for the purpose of making good the supply which had failed us in our own production, was a loss of national capital which could not fail to cause us great embarrassment. But the Noble Marquis misunderstood him, if he supposed that he (Lord Stanley) attributed to free trade the large importation in corn which had taken place during the last two years. On the con trary, ho had said that whether they had free trade or not the importation must have taken place ; but the argument he maintained was this, that whereas those who advocated free trade predicted from the importation a large export of manufactures and consequent great national prosperity, ho maintained that these effects had arisen without reference to free trade. The Noble Mar quis said that Parliament could not guard against the effects of speculation. He (Lord Stanley) granted that; but, speaking of corn, let him ask by whose act and en couragement was it that the speculation in corn was excited ? Of this her Majesty's Government, he must say, were not clear. They held out to our merchants and shipowners that, let them search all the world through, they would not find corn enough for the people of England—and that if they could find corn enough they would not be able to find freightstob theringit here. Why, they had absolu tily suspended navigation laws in order to tempt this r as h and dan gerous speculation"— in order to invite all the world to send their vessels to our shores laden with grain of every species. Why, was it not too much to turn round on us after this, and say that it is impossible to guard against improvident s peculations ?—(Opposition cheers.) But he need trespass on their patience no further. Her Majesty's Government had thought it right that this important question should be thrown l oosely on the Legislature as a matter for Parliamentary inquiry. H e (Lord Stanley) thought it was their duty rather to have proposed to Parliament a remedy for these evil s . T hey had, however, shrunk from any such course. Having done so, they must, of coarse, take the con sequences. He (Lord Stanley) gave no notice now, but the Govern ment having announced that the appointment of the Committee was the only measure they were prepared to propose to Parliament on this all-important question, they must not be surprised if from other quarters, n o t eoundpledged or bound by ti es of official duty, myor found some some practical measures suggested calculated di rectly to meet the difficulties of the emergency. (The Noble Lord resumed his seat amidst much Opposition ent to ha t d he no N m o e b a l! cheering.) Earl GREY Lord's inquiry, "Why,commeniefedtheby replyingGoverim sure to propose, they had thoughtfthe Nob itn l ecessary to call I the Parliament togeth er? eLord had con sulted her Majesty's Speech at the . commencem en t o f t h e session he would have fou nd in it that the G overnment, though they saw no remedy that they could advanta geously suggest, still had ample reasons for summoning the Parliament. The suffering had proceeded from measures over which they had no control, and the con sequences of which it was utterly im p ossible for them to avert. But the Government bad taken a measure which might have led to a violat ion of the law, and no Go vernment had any right to t ake a measure of that kind without giving Parliament the earliest opportunity el expressing its judgment. No Act of indemnity, indeed, vas necessary, but such measures as the Government shought necessary to be introduced not only were pre pared, but they absolutely had already submitted them to Parliament. If the Noble Lord was himself right as to the causes of commercial distress, it was clear there was no measure more important as a means of preventing the continuance of the distress than some Bill which postponed for a season all demands consequent upon railway transactions. The Government had submitted to Parliament a Bill with that very view, and had pro posed to go as far as it was possible to go consistently with justice and a respect for existing contracts. But the Noble Lord complained that no opinion had been expressed by the Government relative to the Act of 1844. That accusation was surely hardly well deserved. The Noble Marquis (Lansdowne) had said distinctly that, in his opinion, the distress was not attributable to the Act of 1844, and in that view he (Earl Grey) was glad to find that the Noble Lord opposite entirely con . curred with him. The Government were not, of course, prepared to maintain that the existing arrangements under the Act of 1844 were perfect; but when the Noble Lord said that that Act must be faulty because Govern ment had permitted its infringement, he (Earl Grey) was at once prepared to express his dissent from any such view. As had been well said in 1844, whilst it might bo difficult to define where they might depart from the principle established by the Act, yet, extra ordinary circumstances might arise from time to time which would be best dealt with at the discretion of Government. He (Earl Grey), too, dissented from the view of the Noble Lord that the adoption of the Government measure of relief at all neeessarily implied that it should have been done earlier. On the contrary. he (Earl Grey) thought that it should be deferred until the last moment. The Noble Lord referred to the list of failures. No one lamented them more than he did. The calamities were, no doubt, very sad, and almost unpa ralleled. But, at the same time, it was the opinion of the Committee that the houses which had failed, whether from imprudence or misfortune, were not really solvent; that assistance might have maintained them for a time, but that ultimately the failure was inevitable. That was the state of things in the earlier period of the panic. At the end of October, however, all accounts showed that though these failures had not then extended to sol vent houses, yet that these would fail if some measures were not taken by the Government. The panic was then so serious that many were unable to realise money to I meet their immediate demands. There was a desire among the bankers and the public to retain the money they happened to possess, and to get in all their outstanding debts. It was obvious that the whole system of our commercial distress proceeded in an assumption that there would be no simultaneous call -for money. There was such a call. The Government were told that if an assurance were given that money might be had even at a very high rate of interest, that would bring into circulation money that had formerly been withheld. Such an opinion was expressed to the Government from quarters deserving the highest consi deration; the Government believed it to be well founded; they acted upon it, and he (Earl Grey) must say that he thought the result proved that they had not been mistaken. The Noble Lord said that this was a ques• Lion they ought not to turn loose for the consideration of a Committee, but that, on the contrary, they ought to have made some definite proposal with respect to the Act of 1844. Certainly, if the Government had believed that any alteration of the Act of 1844 was calculated to check the commercial distress, he (Earl Grey) agreed that they ought to have done something ; but their opinion was the reverse; their opinion was, that though that Act might require alteration in some parts, yet that its main principles are undoubtedly sound, and that to teach the commercial community to look for relief to what was called " relaxation of the currency," would be to teach them in fact to look to a deception. It was not to devise any remedy of that kind that the Government now asked for the appoint ment of a Committee. What they desired was to see if the Act of 1844 was in its details susceptible of improve ment. One set of persons contended that the Govern ment under that Act ought to be invested with a greater amount of discretion. Others thought that the prin ciple of the Act was not carried sufficiently far, and that too much power was still left in the hands of the Bank of England. It was only fitting that Parliament should appoint a Committee to consider these and such like propositions. The Noble Lord intimated an opi nion that the commercial distress of the country had not passed by. lie (Earl Grey) wished he could take a different view. He was bound, however, to admit that it seemed to him that of the many causes pro ductive of distress there were several still in opera tion, and that they must look forward to still further depression. But, however gloomy the im mediate appearances might be, there was nothing in the state of the country which ought to discourage us, or cause us to fear that at some earlier or more re mote period the country would not, by its inherent rigour and energy, emerge from all its difficulties, and rise to prosperity oven greater than before.—(Cheers.) Various causes had been adverted to for the distress, but amongst others the Noble Lord had omitted to men tion the high expenditure, arising from a high price of provisions, which had affected every family, from the highest to the lowest, in the land, during the past twelve months. When they remembered that for some time last season wheat was at 80s., 905., 100 s. and even 120 s. per quarter, they might find some ground for con sidering that an important element of the distress had been omitted from the Noble Lord's catalogue. When they considered how this had added to the expenditure of every family in the country, and especially of the working classes, and the enormous drain from railway and other causes, they would not feel surprised at diffi culties which had been experienced. But they had just had a good harvest, and if blessed with a recurrence of favourable seasons, the greatest of all drains, that arising from a scarcity of corn, would be at an end. And although railways undoubtedly formed a great drain at that moment, yet it must be remembered that when con structed they would add incalculably to the national wealth. On this account, and having regard to the improved prospects as regarded the supply of cotton from America, he thought that at no distant day this country would again attain her wonted prosperity. His Noble Friend said that the expense of the last year, and the distress occasioned by the large imports of corn, went far to strengthen the arguments of those who had been opposed to the repeal of the corn-laws. Now, he must say that his (Earl Grey's) opinion was precisely the reverse. He could not conceive a combination of circumstances which would more completely confirm the soundness of all the arguments of those who had advo cated a free importation of foreign corn. In the first place, he would ask their Lordships to consider what must have been the sufferings of the population if this importation had not taken place?—(Hear, hear.) As it was, they knew that the sufferings endured by the working classes, in the months of June and July, were of the severest description ; but it was nothing but the free importation of corn which prevented those sufferings from proceeding to the extent of starvation. —(Hear, hear.) If, when the neighbouring countries, of Europe were suffering, equally with our own, and when, instead of exporting corn for us, they were bidding against us in the markets of the world, we had been left to the former law, under which a heavy forfeit was imposed on the merchant who went to the most dis tant market for cargoes, starvation would have been experienced amongst no small proportion of the popula tion.—(Hear, hear.) His Noble Friend then went on to say that it had formerly been asserted that if they im ported large quantities of corn there would be a large increase in the exports to pay for it. It was perfectly true that the exports had fallen off: a fact easily ac counted for by the diversion of a large portion of the capital of this country to railways, by the deficiency in the cotton crop, and by various other causes. In point of fact, however, in the case of those countries from which the largest supplies of corn were obtained, there had been an increase in the amount of exports.—(Hear, hear.) In the three-quarters ending October, 1846, the exports to America amounted to 4,080,0001; while, within the same period in 1847, they amounted to 6,291,0001.—(Hear, hear.) But, beyond that, it was notorious that one effect of the large de mands of corn from America had been to increase the con sumption of British manufactured goods in the United States to an extent which could hardly have been ex pected. The American farmers, making increased pro fits, had increased their expenditure, and a considerable portion of the increase had been applied in the purchase of British manufactures. A similar result had been witaessed in the Turkish empire and in Brazil, in the latter case owing, of course, to the increased import of, sugar. It must not be forgotten. when this question was under consideration, that a large proportion of our ex ports was necessarily affected by the distress which pre. veiled in Europe generally.—(Hear, hear.) The popu lation of the countries with which we principally dealt was almost as severely affected by the high price of food as our own; it was impossible that the inhabitants of Holland, Germany, and France, who were paying extra vagant prices for their food, could consume the cus tomary amount of British manufactures? He (Earl Grey) was not aware that those speculations were inor dinate—(Hear, hear)—he very much doubted whether they had exceeded what prudence required. No doubt some individuals had incurred heavy losses ; but for the interest of the country the importations had not been excessive. For some weeks before the harvest the weather was fine to a degree which was almost unexampled ; and the harvest, which every one thought would be made, proved, on the contrary, early. Had the harvest been three or four weeks later than usual, there would not have been a single grain of corn in the country to spare.—(Hear, hear.) He believed that, as a whole, the operations of the B r iti s h merc h an t s in the corn trade, during the last year, were marked by a degree of foresight, which was not less remarkable than the energy and activity displayed in them—an energy and an activity which, under Providence, had been the means of saving the country from the horrors of famine, and which showed with how much justice her Majesty's Government had, in tho early part of last ses sion, refused to interfere with the enterprise of the pri vate trader by sending ships to America for corn. But even if the corn speculation had been inordinate, he them. All that they had done was _ might still contend that the encou ragedGovernmenthtaodanskotl,arlig. e 1 s t h o e d s u by s pe thend A t h ct e o n f a l v B i 4 g 6 a ; t i andon - that both those suspensions were necessary? He , for e m s e t anbt a could a a n n d y o t i h i doubt one, felt that if they had failed to propose what they had • ' done, they would have been totally unworthy of their position. As regarded the question before the House, he thought, for the reasons stated by his Noble Friend near him, it was highly proper that the House should appoint the proposed Committee. Lord BROUGHAM said that, although the question of free trade might be excluded from that discussion, it could not be shut out from the deliberations of the Com mittee which they were about to appoint. Into the proposed inquiry the whole question would necessarily be introduced. The inquiry would also embrace those railway speculations which had absorbed so large 0, portion of the capital of the country, and the evils of which might justly be imputed, in a great degree, to the Legislature itself. He would much rather provide for the present than scan the past; yet he could not help saying that if there were any parties in the Legis lature whose consciences were free from blame upon that question, it was the Noble Dake then sitting at the table (the Duke of Wellington), and himself (Lord Brougham). Another subject which would be taken up was that of the usury laws, the state of which was very injurious to the landed interest, in consequence of the partial repeal of some enact ments and the retention of others. Unless some thing were speedily done to improve those laws there was the prospect, if not of great agricultural distress, at least of landowners' embarrassment. There would, in fact, be so many subjects introduced into the inquiry, that having been delayed so long he thought it should be delayed still longer. It was not likely that any measure, founded on the report of the Committee, could be framed and introduced before Easter. Why, it would be im possible. to keep out of view even the question of a metallic currency. There were many persons who thought that it was not Sir Robert Peel's Bill of 1844, but his Bill of 1819, which was chargeable with all the distress of the country.—(A Noble Lord cried " Hear, hear.") The Noble Lord who thus responded himself afforded an illustration of what he was saying. He con gratulated the House upon the absence of party feeling on this question; and as regarded the commercial pres sure, although the worst might be over, yet ho thought the evil was by no means at an end. The Duke of GRAFTON was of opinion that the only hope for the country lay in an enlargement of the currency. Lord ASHBURTON hoped in the other House of Parliament, where subjects of this kind more properly came under discussion, some proposition would be made for a direct interference with that Act which was sup posed to have operated so very injuriously. The Noble Earl opposite (Earl Grey) had referred to the subject of the corn-laws, .and there seemed to exist some mis taken impression in his mind as to what had been said by a Noble Friend near him (Lord Stanley) on a former occasion on that subject.—(Hear, hear.) Nobody, he be lieved, had said that the corn-laws were the cause of the present distress, but the state of the importation of corn had certainly a great deal to do with it, though not to the extent supposed, for he did not believe the doctrine Ithat, because a certain quantity of corn had been im ported within the last eighteen months, that therefore the capital of the country had been taken for that pur pose; he meant that capital of the country the abstrac tion of which was said to be one of the difficulties under which they at present labour.—(Hear, hear.) He would remind their Lordships that one of the great objections to the late sliding scale r was the fluctuation of the price. —(Hear.) They might mitigate that fluctuation by supporting their own agriculture, and taking care that a large portion of the corn consumed was of their own production, and if they wanted to derive any lesson from the past year more impressive than another, let them reflect upon the consequences of their lowering their own agricultural production, always supposing the change of the law had a tendency of that kind. He did not think that that subject would have been so strongly pressed upon their attention by the Noble Earl (judging from his general acuteness in debate), if he had had anything of con sequence to present to their Lordships on the subject under deliberation. If he had any forcible arguments to urge lon that subjectl:he would not have gone into a plausible discussion on the operation of the corn-laws. —(Hear, hear.) The great importation of corn had certainly affected the balance of trade, it had rendered necessary the exportation of a quantity of specie, and it had caused the reduction of the amount of specie in the Bank, and had tended to produce that restriction which was the main cause of their difficulties. The Noble Earl opposite had said 1 1 that the Act of 1844 was not th e cause o f th em , b u t h e (Lord Ashburton) would say that the Aat of 1344 had aggravated other circumstances.—(Hear, hear.) Those circumstances, which without the Act of 1844 would not present any difficulties, were transformed into difficulties by that Act.—(Hear, hear.) Reference had been made to the difficulties which had been occasioned by the con struction of railways, but he (Lord Ashburton) would ask, had not Parliament been warned of the danger arising from them?—(Hear.) It did not become him (Lord Ashburton) perhaps to say so, but he would re mind them that their Lordships did not attend to the warnings which he (Lord Ashburton) had given them on the subject.—(llear, hear.) He had pressed those warnings upon their Lordships ' and upon a Committ e e of their Lordships' Hou se , an d had likewise urged them on the consideration of the Earl of Dalhousie. That Noble Lord was as strongly impressed with a sense of those difficulties as he (Lord Ashburton) was, and when they went into Committee he prepared a scale of those different projects for railroads for the express pur- I pose of limiting the total amount. It was con sidered by them that to engage in undertakings beyor.ad the power of the country to effect was objectionable, an d though it night be urged that they were profitable to the country, inasmuch as they absorbed a, great deal of labour, they should recollect that the renst useful enter prises, if carried on with insufficient means, must fail, as they had seen them fail on the present occasion. —(Hear, hear.) lie did not know enough of the details of the 1 West India houses to say whether they had been ad vancing too liberally or extensively in the course of their business, but they had b een utter l y d estroyed b y the i r / Act of Parliament.—(Hear, hear.) It was not true to say this was the work of Providence; a great portion of it was the work of their own hands. It was considered that a very great cause of these commercial difficulties arose from overtrading, and it was conceived that some of the India houses had overtraded. Certain houses in this country sent out their manufactures to India, and a large portion of the trade was carried on on credit. He believed, in fact, that a great deal too much of it had been carried on on credit. But that was no new system; it was not the system of last year, or the year before last, but the trade was going on for twenty years exactly in the same way. The persons engaged in that trade were told all at once that no credit was to be given to them, and those persons were thrown upon their backs ; but it was no improvidence that had caused them to become embar rassed ; they had carried on that trade for a long time, 1 but the altered state of the money laws had rendered it impossible ,for them to continue it.—(Hear, hear.) He apprehended that the commercial character of the country was injured from one end of the globe to the other, whereas in former times it was looked upon throughout the world as the greatest. To show the evil effects resulting from it, he. begged to read a few lines front a circular which happened to fall into his hands, and which came from, a house in New Orleans. It was dated the ;6th November, and here was what was stated in this printed cirvalar :—" The continued disas trous advices from England, and the discredit thrown on the English people s have almost suspended opera tions with Great Britain." Undoubtedly their Lord ships could not help that, but it was for their Lord ships to consider wb.ether these misfortunes had arisen from their interference. He conceived it was proved beyond possibilitae:-eof contradiction that they f may have arisen from the operations of the Bank of England, and these operations arose from the restric tions they had put upon it by the Act of 1844. He would remind ther Lordships that there had been a considerable importation of corn to France, but yet there had been no destruction of commercial credit in that country. The Bank of France had not refused to perform the ordinary operations of business, or taken it into their heads to refuse that accommodation which in other times they had given. When they were reduced so lowas not to have scarcely two millions in their coffers, they went on giving the usual credit to the ordinary trade of the country. The Bank of France, with those means at their disposal, ceased no disturbance of the general I credit of the country, and he understood that through- oat France the general commercial interests of the country were going on as usual. (Hear, hear.) The Government had put upon the Bank of England the necessity of laying on 8 per cent., and that proceeding seemed to him to be most ab surd. The Government, in giving that instruction, must be totally ignorant of the nature of the trade that was carried on. A merchant of Birmingham had mentioned to him a fact which would show the effect of that measure. He said he had a very valuable order to execute, and went. to a banker to obtain assist ance in the usual way to enable him to do it. The banker said yes to his application, but added, " the Bank of England discount tat eight per cent., and I must have seven per cent." T'ae merchant replied that that would bo more than he sh ould make by the order.—(Hear, hear.) He (Lord Aslburton) considered that they should suspend this Act, at id then consider what other form of restriction they should adopt. In former times, with five or six millions in the, Bank, they entertained no appre hension, and freely assisted the commerce of the country; but recently, with eight millions in their hands, they were afraid to do se, and did not assist the commerce of the country. Rut of what were they afraid ? They were afraid of viola ting the Act of Parliament. He had recently a letter from a banker in the country, who told him they were risiu gup their interest to nine per cent. He held that to be destructive of the industry of the country. He thought that it could not move under such a rate of discount, and that it was a mistaken mode of getting out of theix: embarrassments. The Bank of Eng land was at liberty to issue a certain amount of notes without question, and so many more according to the amount of bullion in the Bank. When thez was a diminutive of coin one would t hi nk there should be an :additional circulation of pe time no, on the contrary, when the circulationwasapmecr. But re a amped by a reduction of coin, there was at the am di minution of paper. As to the general questions he was very well satisfied that it should be calmly and carefully inquired into, for he thought that such a proceeding would very probably be atten d e d w ith _ beneficial results. The first thing, however, that the Committee would have to do, was to dispose of the Act of 1844.—(Hear.) It had got a fair trial and was found defective. The Earl of EGLINTON was well aware the inquiry about to be institutsa must of necessity be an exten sive one, but was ruixious to know by what limits its extent was to be circumscribed. He desired to be informed whether it was in contemplation that the Scottish banking Acts of '45 and '46 should be inquired into, as Well as the Act of '44? In a report of a speech delivered by a Right Honourable Gen tleman, in anothe r p l ace, he found that ithad been , stated that: what had mainly induced the Government to interfere with tie e great principle of the Act of 1844, was that an applies tion for assistance had been made to the Bank of Engle nd on behalf of a large portion of the Scottish banks, blo w h was a mistake. Though not p ersona l ly connected with banking, he had a accurate knowledge of man y o f th e Scottish ba n k s, an d h large portion" h e was p er f ec tl y conv i nce d t h at " a of I hem had not applied to the Bank of England for assists Lace. There were 18 banks in Scot land, and h e was confident that not more than a very 1 small portion of them had made any such application. 1 Indeed, ho was strongly inclined to think that the ap plication was restricted to two establishments, and that Ciao of these was a incidern one. (OW .i. •., - , 4 , 1 -'.. ..'':' The Marquis of LANSDOWNE replied, that although '''. ; 7 2 ~..:?_. , no allusion to t h e su bj ect was comprised in the exact _,/{..-::. terms of the resolution, it nevertheless was to be under- -.L--= - -' , -\ )., ..T. stood that th e i nqu i ry should include, if necessary, the \", \ '7; - i Acts relating to the Scottish banks. The Committee would exercise their discretion in the matter. Lord WHARNCLIFFE was of opinion that there should be a distinct understanding as to the footing on which Parliament was to stand with respect to the lank. It would be well to know whether, in case that the result of the inquiry should be to recommend the introduction of alterations into the constitution of the Bank, Parliament would feel itself at liberty to act ac cordingly, and also whether the Bank had given an as surance that it woad acquiesce in such alteration. For his own part he did not hesitate to say that in spite of all he had heard to the prejudice of the Act of 1844, he still adhered to the principle of the measure. Lord STANLEY suggested that the resolution should be amended by using the express words of the Queen's Speech in defining the duties of the committee. The Marquis of LANSDOWNE acquiesced. Motion agreed to. Their Lordships rose at a Quarter past Nine o'clock. '~'+~ METROPOLITAN SEWERS COM- MISSION. The several Commissions of Sewers are renewable every ten years. Four commissions—the Westminster District, the Holborn and Finsbury, the Tower Hamlets, and the Poplar Districts—expire this month. The Metropolitan Commissioners of Inquiry have, in their first report, which has been laid before her Ma jesty's Government, and will be to-day presented to Par liament, strongly recommended, on several grounds, that the whole of the commissions under the power of the Crown should be resumed, and the authority placed in few hands. In compliance with this request writs of szTers in edeas we re i ssue d on Tuesday from the Crown othceChancery to the Commissioners of the several commissions above mentioned, and also to the Commissioners for Kent and Surrey and the Commissioners for Greenwich, the principal sewer districts on the south side of the river. It is un derstood that, on a consultation with the law officers of the Crown, they recommended, on technical grounds of arrangements entered into under some local Acts, that the objects of the Commissioners would be gained by renewing the commissions of sewers for the several districts having the same body of persons named for all the districts. This has been done, and the coma iissious formerly held by between 600 and 700 persons, have been separately directed, as the Sanitary Commissioners requested, to a more limited number of persons, chiefly of those who have paid especial attention to the .subject of sanitary improvement. The renewed commissions are understood to be provisional. The following is the list of names of the noblemen and gentlemen as they stand in the several commissions, which were all iss.ued yesterday : -- The Right Hon. the Viscount Aforpetli, M.P. The Right Hon. Lord Ashley, M.P. The Right Hon. the Viscount Ebrington, M.P. The Hon. Frederick Byng. The Dean of Westminster. Sir James Clark, Bart. Sir Edward North Buxton, Bart., M.P. Sir Henry Thomas de la Beebe, Knight. Joseph Hume, Esq., M.P. John Walter, Esq., M.P. Robert Aglionby Slaney, Esq., M.P. Edwin Chadwick, Esq., barrister-at-law. William John Broderip, Esq., barrister-at-law. John Millar, Esq., barrister-at-law. Professor Richard Owen. Neil Arnott, Esq., M.D. Thomas Southwood Smith, Esq., M.D. The Rev. William Stone, M.A., Rector of Spitalfields. John Bidwell, Esq. Robert Hutton, Esq., F.R.S. Thomas Puckle, Esq. Richard Lambert Jones, Esq. John Leslie, Esq. The number of Commissioners for the sewer districts was as follows: Westminster Commission Holborn and Finsbury Never acted ... Tower Hamlets Never acted ... Surrey and Kent Poplar Greenwich .. ... 134 87 Z 48 S 135 124 Z „ 6 52 `' 671 'The number of the Consolidated Commission is only 23. ALTERATION OF CLOCKS THROUGHOUT THE COUNTRY. An occurrence of considerable importance in a national point of view took place on the Ist of December, when the mails and other trains between London, Liverpool, Manchester, and the north, were, in consequence of the completion of the through communication, placed upon the Trent Valley line, instead of goi ng roun d by Bir mingham. On this occasion, by order of the directors of the London and North-Western, with the concurrence, it is understood, of the Railway Commissioners and the Post-office authorities, the clocks at every station on the London and North-Western, the Midland, Birmingham, and Gloucester, and other lines, were set to Greenwich time. It was at first proposed, in order to obtain the communication of true time, a practice now daily adopted at Greenwich for indicating it, that a ball should be dropped from the upper part of the Observatory so as to touch a spring communicating with all the telegraphic wires in the kingdom, and thus by the striking of a bell give instantaneous true time to Liverpool and Man chester, and all the northern towns. The telegraph could thus from day to day supply any want of uniformity; but owing to the wires not being completed, and not communicating with every station, the dotage was found impracticable. In default of this another plan was resorted to yesterday—that of sending special messengers, each having a chronometer indicating true Greenwich time, to the several divisions of the London, and North-Western and Midland systems, so that Greett• with and London time, in the course of the day, was communicated and established at every station on these lines, the stations amounting to between two hundred and three hundred, and affecting all the principal towns and cities between London and Carlisle and London and York. The authorities of the Post-office have given official notification to the local postmaster at Liverpool to adjust the post-office clock there in accordance with London time, and it is intended that the same shall be the case at Manchester. The Post-office mails are always regulated according to London and not to local time, and the present alteration is found to be expedient in consequence of the i nconvenience asserted to arise from the fact of every separate town having its own time with reference to the longitude of the particular place B. or W. of Greenwich. The promoters of the measure state that to railways the old system of keeping time has been a positive annoyance, from each town or stopping place between London and Holyhead having its appro priate time. The Post-office sends its mandate for the dispatch of a new mail from Holyhead 'at midnight on Wednesday, but owing to the arrangement of " local times," midnight on Wednesday at Holyhead is morning of Thursday in London. A similar discrepancy as to tune exists in all the intermediate places. As regards railway travelling, one of the consequences of keeping " local time" is found to be, that an express train on a journey of 250 miles is 614 hours from E. to W., and less than 7i from W. to E.; and though the speed in travelling is really the same in both instances, by the time-table it is inade,to appear 33 miles per honr from W. to E., and less &an 39 from E. to W. The chief object of the proposed alteration is stated to be that of rendering the move ments of the railway system more precise as to London time, and of enabling travellers from the East and from the West meeting at some common centre, each with a time-piece in his pocket, to be able to keep their ap pointments without first consulting the longitude of the town clock. The municipal authorities and others, who have the charge of clocks in various parts of the island, intend, we perceive by the provincial papers, to ad just them to the London time as nearly as the pre sent incomplete arrangements will admit of. The sys tem pursued at Manchester is thus explained in the Manchester Guardian of yesterday :—The difference of longitude between Greenwich and Manchester is 2 de grees and 14 minutes in space, or 8 minutes and 56 seconds in time; and as the only means of ascertaining with facility, at Manchester, what is the time at Green wich, is by an eclipse of one of Jupiter's satellites; any difficulty of difference of opinion about time might easily be settled, if an order were passed for the clocks to be kept 8 minutes and 56 seconds before mean solar tf_Eie. • or any number of minutes that may be agreed upon. . T he weekly board of the Manchester Royal Infi l rm.e . rY.b:_ . . under these circumstances, resolved thilrceocmkeaninsouLarb institution shall be kept 10 mint! l? m to ut t l r c ansmit the Greenwich time, Greenwich, railway it has been arranged y ion at c s r e rk l : as s i g ll i b ve e n a i c n lo t s h e e arox . t a m t :a s A ti l e ma n tnoact.he Ontim time at r a pThheexsatcat station o'clock t k o t M hi a s nc ( h w es ed te n r • tes before seven; and the left needle on e b s y da e y le ) c m tri o c rn te in le g g at Rugby, Normanton, and Manchester are to be on the alert at ten mum the London instrument is to be held pointingtroethen! lettes E. Exactly at the instant of seven o'clock, G wich time, the needle is to be released, and will return to its ordinary upright position. The clerk at Rugby will instantly, on receiving this signal, release the needle for e a s n t e d r t ; h s e c that lerk w n o il t l more as P r omly h p & n t t c a c :o mm or un t i h ca ree te i N s t e ° c t o r o m n M d a s n a t e nlc n n h' possibly be lost in transmitting the time from London to Manchester. When all the electric wires are complete, and the local strikng striking f s hcoourrsrectthl r y ou s g e h t, ou th t theerewc-oilulnbtresimultaneous country Mn, STROILLOe ;ye P v NEW NOVEL, ...OWN AND COUNT are E's m N " inclined to consider" Town and Country," as the most agreeable, if not the ablest, of M. Trollope s novels. The characters are natural and unexaggerated, the subject is well-chosen, and the story skilfully conducted. The young and beautiful daughter of a Cornwall clergyman is married to an old fellow, who plays off her charms at court for the advancement Of his own ambition. Perfectly innocent at heart, she uncon sciously suffers herself to be made an instrument in the hands of her husband to attract the regards of the Prince Regent. There is considerable delicacy as well as clev erness in the management of this imbroglio, and great merit in the conduct of the scenes in which the Prince is involved. The picture of the vicar's family—the induc tion of his daughter into the ways of fashionable life and the simplicity with which she drops into the lures by which she is surrounded, contrasted with the energy of her deliverance are excel lent, and display insight into springs of character ant emotion which could hardly have been a o successfully dealt with by a writer of the other sex. 'I the sketch of the Prince Regent is capital. The experiu lent was dan ' germs, but it is made safe by tact and dext crity,—Atlas. LONDON, FRIDAY EVENING, DECEMBER 3, 1847. S 1-;