The Sun. — London, England, 1804-04-21 00:00:00

IMPERIAL PARLIAMENT• HOUSE OF PEERS, FRIDAY/ APRIL 20. THE Duke of GRAFTON took the Oaths and his Seat. THE IRISH MILITIA AUGMENTA'rION BILL. Lord HOBART moved the second reading of the Bill for Augmenting the Irish Militia. The Noble Lord said, the principal. inducement with His Majesty's Ministers for bringing forward the present measure, was from eeonornical motivei.= He understood some objections would be offered, but he was not aware of any which could be reason_ ably made. Undoubtedly the opposition of a Noble Lord (GRENVILLE) to the other Bill on the ground of reciprocity, might, in that Noble Lord's mind, be considered as te,nable ; but he must con fess it appeared to him, that the opposition was carried on merely for the sake of opposition. He was warranted in saying thus much, when it veould be recollected that during the late • War, that Noble Lord had, :as a Member of , His Ma. jesty's Councils, 'sane9..ioned a similar measure.— He wished, however, Noble Lords to understand that measures are now pursuing, to augment the dis. ,posable Force to the amount of 25,000 more than at present ; consequently it would be seen that Go. verntuent are not inattentive to their duty,:The Noble Lord adverted to the observations which. had been made the preceding evening, respeaing the Correspondence carried on by a NOW. Lord (RE DES DALE) in Ireland, and observed, , that he had never before that evening, conceived that private Cor respondence ought to be made the subject of public avowal or disavowai on the part of Government..—, He then moved the second reading of the Earl SPEJNCER, professed that his objeCtion to this I*Zastre did not originate in any opinion which be might. have formed on. the .Letters 41.19dC_Ct.t.o. by the Noble Sec It Ermay of STATE. with respect to the principle of the measure, he must condemn it altogether. It is impolitic at the present moment to take so large a portion of the Firce as to,opo from the defence of Ireland. He must also contend, that it is impolitic and unwise to matte such an ad dition for limited sets ice only. We ought stO add To our disposable Force, and therefore he. would re. commend, that instead of increasing the' Militia of Ireland at the rate of four guineas per . man bounty, that Ministers should give even the bounty of ten guineas for an eqUal number for general ser. vice. The Noble Earl was happy to.congratulate the House upon what they.had just heard from the Noble SECRATARY of STATE - , namely, that it is in contemplation to augment the disposable Force ; but he could not . help observing,-plat the whole of the measures of the present Administration were caleu. ' s ated to thwart and cross each other. Be concluded with giving his decided negative to the Mdtion for the second reading. Lord GRENFILLE would not enter into any length of discussion on this day, as many Noble Lords beside himself were much fatigued frorn . the length which the debate of the ptececling evening had taken. He wished it; hoWever, to be onderstood, that it l:vas not because his opinions were changed. He should take another opportunity of discussing the measure, and. would not suffer any observations. which might be made by Noble Lords opposite, re. speding the Ads which had passed during the time in which he formed a part of the Administration, from giving his decided opposition to a measure which he considered as one of the most weak, futile andltierilenieasures which have disgraced the pre. sent Ministry. Whatever might have been the Onsto - ttigii of the Ads to which the allusion had been made, the House would recoiled the difference . of situation in which the Country is placed at the present period, and at the time to which the Noble Lord had alluded. If MiniSiers could not discri, minate,, the House and the Country would ; and no thing should deter him from delivering his senti ments openly and fairly as an honeit Member of Pat iiarneot. He 'trusted the proper notice would be given of the 'next stages of the Bill, as many Noble Lords not present wished to discuss it. The-L'',,RP CHANCELLOR assured the Noble Lord, that Ministers were not afraid to meet him 04, , ;44 friends, whenever they chose, in defending any of their..measures, weak, puerile, and what not, as he had described them. He hoped, however, that 4hen'theNoble Lord considered that •the measures ..,• which he was now objecting to, and characterizing by suds 'epirbets, were similar . to, thoogh infinitely . t):ertf - t th4h thos . e which he. hiniself had introduced,. that he Would cease to speak of them in such terms. He "was sorry tOfthink that the Noble Lord and his friends felt so much indisposed after their, last night's fatigue, and assured him that Ministers felt like giants refreshed, and shugqbe ready *to meet . the Noble Lor:i in any future stage of the Bill. He assured The 'Noble' Lord, that however they at present differed in politics, it Was his wish that they shoulei never feel otherwise thin they had hitherto done to each other, 'and that they shOuld continue to view each other as friends. He shOurd - therefore second the Noble Lord's Motion. After_ . 4 few wotds in explanation, from Lords PAL/1,1114LE and HAWKESBUU, it was understood that the Bill should go 'into a Committee on Mon. day ; if no Amendments were made; should be re. ported that day; and, kaahat event, should be read a 3d time on Tuesday, when the debate on the princi_ . pie will take place. The Bill was accordingly read seCOnd time, and ordered to' be committed fin Monday. IRISH MILITIA Tp.ANSFER BILL. The House resolved itself into a Committee ; in which Ibe Bishop of St. ASAPH drew the attention of Noble Lords to an inconvenience to which, in his ?, , inion, the officers and.privates of the Irish Militia, who should come over under the authority of this would be subje6l. The Laws of Ireland, and tiirticularly the 3ist of the King, allowed .persons i-ofessing the . Catholic Religion to become mem bers - of the Army and Militia in that Country : but _that was not the case here. By the ist of Geo. Lall persons entering into the Army were obliged to L. 'take the Test, the Paths . of Supremacy and Ab juration, and in case they should not, would he sUb jefl. to various civil inaraities, besides a fine of soot. 'He wished that the Militia of Ireland, who, in consequence of the present.Billohould come over; here, should be proteded against, ; the oper4tictkof that Penal Law. This brought on a long conversation, inAyhich the LORD CHANCELLOR, Lords HAWK Gattivr LLE, CARNARVON, and ELLENDOROUGH,, took part. 'The latter Noble and Learned Lord delivered his . opinion, that the Irish Militia convict here Would. conic over with all the privileges and immunities that they were entitled to under the Militia Laws of their own Country. ,He thought it would be very hard indeed,.. if, when they - came over here from princS„ pies of the purest patriotism add loyalty, that they should be covered .with penalties and disabilities. It: was his opinion that they would not be subject to the operation, of the Mutiny Law of this Country ; however, if there . was ,no otherobjeaion to it, he thought it wooid not be improper to introduce a special proviso to proted them -against the possible application of the provisions of, the English Mutiny AEI. The. LORD ,CHANCELLOR did not see the ab , solute necessity 'of any such provisO; however, whether or not, he thought it would _ be right to-de kr the, consideration of it to some other stage,of the Bill. Ti may be as well done on receiving the report, or. on the third reading of the - Bill. The remaining pro Visions of the Bill -were, then read, and the further:discussion of the proviso, pro_ posed by . Lord ELL ENI3ORotIGH,' reserved till Mon. day, to which day the Home adjourned. MUSE OF COMMONS. FRIDAY, APRIL 20. THa Ballot for the Ilchester Committee was made this day ; but_ the Members_were sworn in before our admission to the Gallery. When the Gallery was opened we found Mr. ROSE upon his legs. He concluded with moving, That there be laid before the House an Account of the Permanent Taxes from • January x 8,03, to January xB4, distinguishing the antount:srf these : of 1803 from those of 1 804; which was accordingly ordered. Mr. Secretary YoaKE moved that the amend ments.made by the Lords in the . Volunteer Bill, be taken into consideration on Monday next, whichAvas agreed to. Mr. Secretary YoR Kg moved also that ibe Mili tia Officers' Bill be taken into consideration on Mon. play next; which was also agreed to. HOSTILITIES IN INDIA. Mr. KINN/Imp said, that he had to call the atteutioo Of the House to a subjea of-much . _ ance ; but as the Motior he had to make had been decided in another place, ,he should not trespass long on the attention ofpGentlemen. He meant to move: for4ccounts of all. Communications made to the different Governments in India, respeaing his Majesty's Message, and the aaual commencOneut of-hostilities. He therefore proposed, that an hum ble Address be presented to His Majesty, praying that His Majesty may be pleased to give directions that the dates of all the. Dispatches transmitted by land or by sea, to the several Presidencies in India, and communicating His -Majesty's Message of the Bth of March, as well as the dates of the Dispatches transmitted in the same way, between that:period and the rupture with France, ,be laid before the House. He observed; that there appeared, on the part of His Majesty's Ministers, •a considerable de gree of remissness and inattention in sending out to India information which was so every necessary to the welfare and safety of - . our possessions in that quarter. The King'sMLssage, of the Bth of March, was known at Calcutta orr the z4th of June ; but it was hot until the middle of July that the official in- telligence reached India.. On the 13th of July, Ad. ' miral LINO'S arrived at Pondicherry, and the t+th, the. following day, he received his orders from FranCe, in pursuance of which he cut his cables, and • sailed for the Isle of France. • It was not until 'th'e 14. th of August that the Dispatches sent by -Goyerl ment, reached Bombay. Thus, there appeared t 6 be on the part . of His Mjesty?.s Minister!, a deree of negligence which was highly culpable. As to St. Helena, : they had not thought proper to send any Dispatches Whateier.to that Settlement, and the only intelligence the Governor had of ther . King's iNilessaU, and the ru4- k ture with France, was from . a ,prize_ taken by an English Vessel, and sent into that place an the arnith of OttobFr. If any misfOrtune h a ppened to out—tr44e i n indiq, from Admiral LI. NUB'S 'Squadron, it would, however, be satisfaelory to knoW that every precaution had been taken for its safety. The Motion was agreed to. Mr. KINNA.IRo then inov,ed another, describing the dates of_ the Dispatches, as received by the se veral Presidencies, and Vale Officers commanding in India by land and sea. • • Lord C ASTLEREAGII said, he did not clean to resist the Hon. Gentletnan'-sMOti , Jn, but, if lie. did, his opposition would be on the ground that it did not go quite. far enough. He had to remark, that the Hon. Gentleman had not thought proper to do that which was customary,' to give notice of his present Motion ' • yet he should not, therefore, objet} to it, but should content himself with repeating what he had befOre said on both the Messages. in March and in May, that instruaions had been sent by the earliest means' to all. the Presidencies in India, for the regulation arid direlion of their condud. - The Motion was agreed to. ARMY OF RESERVE SUSPENSION BILL. . 'Mr. Secretary YORKE moved the Order of the Day, for a Committee of the. whose House on the Army of Reserve Mt Suspension Bill. The Order having been read, Mr. Secretary YORKE stated, that when he had proposed the Committee. on. the Bill for this day, he had hopes that all the Clauses . which he meant to propose in the Committee, would have been pre.. pared before 'this day. This, .however, had been found itripratticable, and he, therefore trusted the House would consent to have the Order p o stponed to Wednesday next. Qn the question that the Order be postponed, Mr. PITT felt himself involved in some difficul ty by the Motion of his: Right. Hon. Friend. He had given notice, or rather an Hon. Friend had given notice fot him, of. his intention to s tate 1.1." opinions at large on the subjea, in the present stage of the measure. His intention was to oppose the : Motion for the Speaker's leaVing the Chair, for the purpose of stopping the further progress of the Bill, in order that, instead of a Bill for Suspending the Army of Reserve Ad, another measure might be introduced more likely to be effedual for the 'Public Service. Of this measure he had given no tice previous to 'the Recess, . and had been induced . to postpone it in compliaoce.with the wishes of His Majesty's Ministers. Whether the. Right Hon. Gentleman was prepared or not with the Clauses which he mew to propose in the Committee, was indifferent with "tesped to a discussice,' in which he trusted to convince the House, that the Bill ought not to be committed ,at all. The reason he assigned-for putting off the Order for going into the Committee, was undoubtedly good against the Committee, but could not apply to a diteussion, which Gentlemen had been led to expect on. this day, and the obje& of which was, to prevent the .further progress of the Bill : if he could convince the House , that it ought not to be proceeded with at all. It was his intention, if the Motion were to have,been persisted' in for pin into. the Commit. 'tee, to have opposed the Speaker's leaving the Chair, and after explaining the nature of the mea sure which he thought most likely to meet the exigency of the times, to propose the postponement of. the question for a. Weekaor.a fortnight, in order to afford Gentlemen time to turn the subject in their minds, and to forth a sound and deliberate judgment on. it. The House would recoiled, • that he was not now pressing the question precipitately forward, but anxious to bring under its. serious con sideration an important discussion, after repeated notices f hear ! heat ). He was disposed, there fore, to propose an amendment, by substituting Wednesday se'anight or fortnight - for Wednesday ; but should forbear . moving it, till he should hear what further reasons the Right Hon. Gentleman had to urge in support of his Motion; • /qr. Secretary YORKE stated, that 'when he had proposed on Wednesday last to defer the Commit tee on the Bill, he was induced to fix it for the first open day. He liatltintended to have prop i psed Monday, another important question having then stood for this day, and when the arrangement rela. tive to the question took place, he felt no °Nation to fix the Committee for this day, hoping-that - the new'Clauses would be then prepared. It.vvas neces sary to frame those Clauses with great nicety and ; precision, and therefore the more time was.neces -sary. It was important that the discussion of this measure should not be' postponed further than was absolutely unaVoidable, and therefore he could not consent to postpone The consideration of it longer than Wednesday. It would, nevertheless, be open to `the Right Hon. Gentleman to urge his reasons to the House for a further delay on that or, on any other day; and to explain the plan - which appeared to his .mind more likely to be effeEtual to the Public Ser vice, in order; if it 'should appear to the House preferable to the one now before it, to get rid of that altogether. The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER, 'hoped the Right Hon. Gentleman would not press his 'amendment ; his °hied Was to obtain a further delay than was proposed, and might very consist. ently be pressed if -the .Motion,of his Right Hon. - Friend was, for the House to go into the Committee this day. The Right Hon. Gentleman could not be fettered nor embarrassed by agreeingeto the present Motion ; because, if he should think delay rteces, nary; he might propose it on . Wednesday, on the Question for the Speaker's leaVirg the Chair. — The - Right Hon. Genfleititan had certainly, in com pliance withwhat he had - stated to be the wishes of His Majesty's Ministers, consented to defer his prOposinon until after the measure in their content= plation should undergo a discussion. No discussion had yet taken placeon that subject, and as he un-, tierstood the Right Hon. Gentleinan to have con. sented to postpone his proposition until that should rake place, he did not think he would press it in this instance. But he thought an acquiescence in the Motion of his Right Hon. Friend due to a cir. Curnitance to which he could not regularly ad. sett ; but the faa Was, that many Gentlemen who hid intended to take . a part in the discussion; were absent in consequence of an intimation from his Right Honourable Friend, that it , was, his 'intention to apply for this delay. This was really the fad, and it was certainly not attributable fo 'aoy unfair motives. If, however, he could ascertain the general sense of the House, to be for proceeding with the Bill, he should not object to it, though it would ben reeolleded, that the words 'of his Right Honourable Friend '(he hoped 'to have the Clauses ready by this day), implied a doubt whether he could he prepared to proceed with the Bill. Mr. FOX thought the very reverse was the ease ; and that in place of feeling doubts as to this 44y, the Right Hon. Secretary hatl been On a for mer day prepared to proceed with the discussion, which he had pot off expressly in consideration of the applicariOn on the pa,tt,pf the Right Hon. Gen tleman (Mr. PITT), unless, ~ perhaps, being deter- Mined to defer . the consideration of- it, he thought he might as. well make a compliment, of the delay... (A laugh.) : But If he was less ready on this than on a former day to proceed, was there not reason to suppose that on Wednesday he should be less pre. pared to proceed than at present ?—(A laugh, and a cry of " Hear. l Hear P' .. ) . lb 4)is case, he was of opinion that there was no sufficient reason for the House tOdefer the discussion. But the question was in much abler hands than his, and he should not interfere further. Mr. Secretary YOR.KE, stated, that when the day was fixed for the Committee, he had expressly declared that he could ,not be prepared with the Clauses on Thursday, but hoped to have them ready on this day ; and- as the Hon. Member was not present ,on the occasion, he appealed to the Hon. Member (Mr. LoNG) who had made the application. Mr. LONG assented.. , —Mr. Fox explained. • Mr. PITT. One, of the reasons which induced him to press, the diScossion; was a desire to consult wish to bring , forward. the discussion on this subjeet previous to any" of the other,discuSsions of which . t t h her re w lu a ft s' att i c l e i , the Convenience v h e a n d ie i n le c e e: l of i t y l e le . n. Ho l u t se. w . a s A:o i therefore, he consented to his Amendment; but as he had the strongest desire to accomm date those vvi' ( :',: duty it was to bring forward and arrange the Pnh ii i 6. measures, he should not press it in this instance. r must say, however, that he did not yield to arg ui clients. He certainly could not perceive any apOe 3r ; ance of a thin attendance, and if all public measur% were to be marked in the progress by the arts ance of such numbers, there would be no reason to , complain of the Legislature. He did riot think, ti t regular, nor altogether consistent with the for e . • due to the opinion of the House , t o antici p ate It h decision ; but when the Gentlemen on the gent below Mm declared, that they were not readY I. meetithediscussion' as they wished, it was not h,ts desire to orge them to it. - But as- they had p re' : pitately prOdticed the absence of certain Gentletne; who had intended •to attend r he trusted, that from regard to the convenience of 'those Gen tlemen tfb ; were then present,..no' further application w ould b, made for.delay, for helooked to ;this discassion 3: a most important objed, in laying the foundation tot an efficient Regular Army, both now and hereafter . .The Committee Yeas, alien postponed. to Wean t ", day. Lord PORCHESTERVVe notice of a Motion O t t Copies of any, and *hat Orders had been se nt o o h to Officers commanding in: India to - detain Fre ß 7 Vessels, &c. for Friday next, r in Mr. Fox also gave notice of a . Motion io r a . Account of the Transports. that had been tA1. e43 4 1 . 0 for bringing over the Hanoverian Troops .I°t. - • same day. Red The House went into a Committee on the ReriVe of the Committee for carrying into effeet the for making an Inland Navigation between Invert! _6 and ,Fort William, in Scotland. The Commit'o came to a. resolution, that a Bill should be brou o j• in fdr making a further provision for making ! maintaining the said Navigation. The Houseb e t, • resumed, the Report was ' brought up, the Rei°'-' tion agreed to, and a Bill ordered accordingly. ye The CIiANCELLOR of the ExcHEQuEtt t n . notice, that in the Committee of Supply on int), day -he should move for a grant for making a P . • vision for that purpose. CO , AO , Mr. ALEXANDER, on the Motion of the fte .CELLOR of the EXCHEQUER, brought up the "00-'s port of the Committee of WaYs and Means. 0 " , question that the Resolutions be read a second tim e ' ' • kes . Mr. JOHNSTONE re-urged his former nu e Jiia . tions to a large issue of Exchequer Bills. ~, stated; that there were at present 24,800,000 P:„-:, chequer Bills outstanding, which, by the operat',"' . of the plan proposed by the Right Hon. GentlenlPl, would beincreased to 25,300,000. The a mount i i Exchequer Bills in the market , at . the same pe,r l° ,, . i of the.last Session, did not exceed 20,000., 0 00. 1 . ,' Hon. Gentleman then urged .the propriety of mak7 a Loan for t 5,000,9001. rather i ban for 10,000,00°". ' whiCh would reduce the amount of Exchequer P I to be issued, by 5,000,000, on the g round t h at might be -necessary to cad out the Volunteers tr. permanent duty, or that the War Taxes s hould oral deficient, and that Exchequer Bills would be foll o o the best resource in either case. Another res s . ° t h was, that if the market should be overstocked'''. or Exchequer Bids, ' that it would be necesal,,se, fund them-next year, when the Minister aol'''Gen- t to provide for the Loyalty Loan. The 1 44 ' 3 was tleman dwelt at some length on the subjs.:lt 411- . replied to by al r -Mr. TANSITTART,'who agreed in the g en s e t o principle, that an excessive issue of Excbeeper, P o; , would be injurious to , the - Country, but dent : ; id s that was the case in the present instance..--- I'l than were no Bills outtitanding of_ an earlier date di , April, 1803, and from the quantity discharge I. the market required ,a -new :issue. Those no o' u r , standing would be materially diminished this Ye a ke and as the whole expenditure of the year was to w r provided for by the Ways and Means of the Y o ' s without including Exchequer Bills, a large anint l if .. of them would be paid off in the course of the r e -`a i s and the quantity in the market, at anY pert f. would never exceed thesquantity at any fo r incl. ' ‘‘) respondent period. s' . A conversation ensued, in which . i t , Mr. JOHNSTONE stated, 'that, from s"bsa tentive investigation of the Pt ice Currents hen-00 found that Exchequer Bills had been at a disc;cut of One per - Cent. from Ist January to th e Pet a time. Mr. DENT also stated, that they vver e `. l :ost discount. Mr. VANSITTAET and the Co As ct e - ttaa of the ExcHstouna stated, that the Bid' (- h- en in , been at a discount were only those that ~bei rea a hi " -- e terest cf three pence a day ; none of thos e ' li d. the present Government, bearing an inte te ' t °"- . a day, were at a discount. , . thou sv The Resolutions were agreed to, as eh, a .. 00 resper s ting the pay and clothing of the M"jcsea. the allowance to Militia Officers 9 • Bills wer Or . • accordingly.. CATHOLICS IN THE IRISH Mr. DILLON said, he was not aware wh,eniceft gave his vote in favour of the Irish Militia '-',: t ii, Bill, that the Roman Catholics in the Irish W r _ ik " . t o as soon as they came over here, would bet e b' s 1 , 0 4 the penalties of the Statute of , Geo. I. v ", s ode to know, whether the Right Hon. Gentleman (41.0, toditrriet: site had provided any remedy for such Rte n c : o !', tholic Militiamen, against those penalties ? Il li t to he should, on an car!) , day, subm it a Motion to .House on the subjel. i 44 0. The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUE R° , 6 ,0 1 the Lon. Gentleman might ha v e answered hi 9 "ap, question. He could not have p rovided any relc4o. but by a Legislative measure, of which t he b een Gentleman would have been aware, if it hail' blot i brought fdrmvard. He had only . to observe, !to, there was nothing applicable to the Irish Mlitil°' which was not equally applicable CO the Irish Ca lo r lies in the Regiments of the line, nor had (her thing more to apprehend. bel t° Mr. KINNAIRD moved, that there be laid c m* the House, an account of the Dates of all Di s i )a , t oc iii sent out by the Secret Committee of the'East:dia, Message, Company, to t h e different Presidencies. in : e d* from the Bth March,. the day of H is- JO. Mr. KINNAIRD gave notice, that on,Nion"?l get Mai e. l it should Move- an bumble Address t o , filv i; - that there be laid before the. HUtIsCI,3 "'" 1 till the rupture with France.---Oruci, I* Officers on the Half:Tay. Adjourned kill IViondaY, liamba Lisboa II Yl isth whitl Fren( a Ge Fran, of Pi at tl this their fore rack reee' the doul thei any as 14 com CI I hap foul Ca, the Re