The Sun. — London, England, 1822-05-08 00:00:00

115.kosi. lie also postponed the Commercial Statutes Repeal Sill to the same day. The second reading of 'the Warehousing Bill was postponed x.r.til.Monday neat. AGRICULTURAL REPORT. The 3larquis of 'LONDONDERRY • moved the Order of the Day for the further consideration of the Report of the Agri . cultural Committee. . On the question being put that the Speaker do leave the' Mr. CURWEN rose for the purpose of asking the Noble Marquis (Londonderry) if he would agree to go at once to the consideration of that part of the Report relative to the scale of duties, instead of discussing that part which proposed the grind it: g and exportation of foreign wheat ? The Marquis of LONDONDERRY admitted that the scale cf duties was one of the most matenal - parts of the Report ; and to appeared to acquiesce in - the suggestion of the Hon. Member to Cumberland. A" desultory conversation then took place, in which Mr. Goods, Mr. BiNETT (of Wiltshire), and the Marquis of LONDoNDERAT participated. Mr. LOCKHART commented strongly-on the conduct of Ministers with respect to this question. The Noble Marquis should. not have been satisfied by detailing 'to the House the -plans of others ; he should enter into some proposition on his own responsibility. ' The Marquis of LONDONDERRY interrupted the Hon. Oentleman, and said, " I 'am ready to do so." . Mr. LOCKHART immediately sat down. Ilr. ATTWOOD contended that the fbundation of a great political change was laid by. the conduct which Mi nisters pursued.- All the propositions which they had sub mitted to the House on the subject of Agricultural Dis teaser were obscure, inconsistent, . and inconclusive. The Ilon, Gentleman then contended that the Increase of taxa .tion since agriculture was in .a . flourishing condition was in —proportion to the increase in .the value of the currency.— The price of corn at the termination of the last war was 1245. the quarter ; and it was now from 475. to 495. the limner, and the taxes, instead of having increased one fourth, were now actually doubled. He thought it im possible to ma intain the doctrine that taxation was not the eauae of agricultural distress. What, he asked, became of the doctrine of an Hon. Member (Mr. Ricardo), that recurring to a metallic circulation made no more than a difference of 10 per cent. in the value of money, when that difference was by no means adequate to account for-the present difficulties?— When they came to examine the. state of the country they a taund that the taxes were now 55,000,0001. 'double what they had been in -1792. • So-large an amount he thought sufficient to iiire an idea of. What the nature of taxation was.—(Hear; .hear !)-1f they found that the standard of money could not L a 'higher price than at present, they then fixed an accu mulated taxation. He then thought it of the greatest import awe to.fix a proper standard .of value, and the best mode of knowing what..standard prices could bear would be by recur ring to experience as the guide. The highest price which was aver obtained, up to the period.nf the commencement of the last Twar, for corn was 478.9 d. For the half century preceding the war it was generally 395. sd. the quarter, and from that back to 1603, '9s. 4d. 'making a difference of only Id. ; which showed hOw little effect the operation,of the standard of currency then fixed dyad produced; and he saw no reason for now altering it. 'NI r: RICARDO observed, that the Hon. Member who had Jest sat down had fallen into some errors, on which he thought it was necessary to put Ilan, right. The Hon. Member had spoken of im as if he were du. advocate for a paper circula- lion. He oke of him as if he atad not been the first to cry . out agains that system. The Hon. Member alluded to a ~' pamphlet which he (Mr. R.) published on this subject, and he was willing to trust the truth of his argument to what was S .atcd in that pamphlet as to remunerating prices, without which the farmer could not go on. The Hon. Member spoke -.a him as if he were responsible forall the alteration which took 'elace in the value or money in 1819. A 'Treater depreciation its the value of the currency had existed before 1819 than had existed then, but for that depreciation he (Mroß.). was not re sponsible ; however, that evil was then remedied, by the Bank .itself. He maintaineal that the difference between the value of , wiper and gold was not more than 5 per cent. But whether the difference was 20 or 50 per cent., how was he (Mr. R.) respon ;ale for it ? He proposed a measure which would have made the i itculation of gold unnecessary, but the 'Muse did not think it 'eaeident to fol' e - v it. The principal difference between him eta! the Hon. Member was as to the alteration in the currency. He (Mr. R.) maintained that alteration was not more thanllo . per cent. Ile believed that depreciation, as applied to the currency, was not generallyunderstood; for the currency might Le depreciated, while it increased in value. If he were asked glee gold was the best standard, he would say because it was always the standard.; but if Parliament had not passed the -all of 17147 ' the country would not now be exposed to the ,Cl - 11S arising from the fluctuation of the currency. If the Hon. Member meant that corn should be. adopted as the standard, h, would have no objection to it, if it were less variable than aeon ; but no invariable standard could be adopted. He could a.e: sanction the argument that all our distress was attributable to taxation ; ,he,(Mr. It.), had a large extent of land, and not re:cumbered with debt and. what he suffered was considerably maze than what proceeded frole taxation. After taxation there wag more suffering between the landlord and tenant. The Hon. ilifernber made a mistake in the prices.of corn at former periods. Previous to 1744 die price was 325. the quarter, and from to t, down to 1782, it was 435. the qua -ter, whiCh proved I hit a considerable increase had taken place i i the price during there 'years.. He .did not mean to contend that taxation was rk". - A a burden ; on the contrary he thought every sixpence taken -from the pockets of the people was a pressure, but though he sslthitted this, he was not so blind as to say that taxation was tae cause of all our distresses. If that were the case, ought not a •t.l.e merchant and. manufacturer, who paid taxes as well as the eaericulturist a to be equally affected by them? He contended that tote; theory was insufficient to account for the existing distress. oit might be asked if taxation were doubled, would not the price of corn be doubled ? He would admit it, if taxation were laid entirely on corn, but not otherwise. If the tithes and ,roars-rates were doubled, which immediately pressed on agri culture, then he admitted the price of corn would be doubled. „He knew it would not be agreeable to the House that be should aeo enter into the defence of his propositions. He thought taco: could be no doubt of the validity of the principle for otL'eili. he contended, and which appeared to him invulnerable. If:. ATTWOOD explained. . l'ae House then went into a Committee on the Resolutions. The Marquis of LONDONDERRY rose, and said that he :theaght it would be more for the general interests of the country, if Hon.-Gent. confined themselves to some practical .rind' of the subject, and did not wander into extraneous ques ,tioas—aliear, hear.)—The great interests of the country would be sacrificed by travelling from the propositions which were ..tien;ected to the consideration of the House. He thought the ,ff:n. Member (Mr. Attivood) ought to have reserved himself far the question which the Hon. Member for Essex was to fbriaie before the House. lie (Mr. Attwood) adverted to the bolijon question, which brought forward the Honourable ofifernber for Portarlington, the gladiator on that subject. AT! would take a more limited field, and confine himself to a nar:ower view of the subject, with a hope of effecting aome practical - good for the country. He believed they .weze all ,agreed that something, ought to be done to regu late the iinprirtatiou of corn, by a duty. Not less than ,iivc plans had been submitted, all of them endeavouring so 'aim at some change in the existing system. But he .now wished to conic to the three principal questions -which he had to offer to the consideration of the Committee.— .The' first ; was, as to . the preeise point at which the ports .shoerithbe opened. The maximum , now fixed was 80s., but vrlicn the price rose to that amount, the ports, by the exist ing law were opened, without any regulation whatever.— With the exception of the Hon. Member for Somersetshire :(Sir T. Lethbridge), and the Hon. Member for Wiltshire -qtr. Benet:), • who had proposed two resolution in opposi -taao to the principle, they were all agreed that there ought t 4. be some corresponding relaxation of the price at which loreigit cornahould be imported. He was far from thinking that distress arose from want of sufficient protection, for he yeti, knew that protection could not give prices. In his opi niora the price even of 70s. was in itself a prohibition in or dinary years. He would now advert to the two resolutions uproposed by the Hon. Member fo r •P•ortarlington (Mr. Ri do) and his Right Honourable Friend (Mr. Huskisson).— `Tbe - former proposed that foreign cern ..should be admitted 4:ori :a general principle, when the price rose to;7os, ; but that a prior entry should be given to corn in warehouse, at a price of ,80a.-; and. that ifthe market price should rise to 80s., then that fereign corn ahoUld be let in, subject to a duty. He had him .-silf proposed that the ports should be opened at 655., subject to a duty of 20e., which, (addinglOs., the expence of bringing the corn here), would make the charge 30s. and the whole amount sis6t—a price 'that, he thought, would be.a..complete protcc dor— However, before any thing practical was decided. upon, pubilc opinion was to be consulted. He knew that an idea ,prevailed among a great body of the agriculturists, that it would not be expedient to open the ports before the price rose to 00. t. But he felt no alarm at the proposition of the Hon. IYieenber for Portarlington, or at that of his Right Hon. Friend; \fee if the::duty was to be of an operative character, it was meter to begin early than to wait till a glut of foreign corn was thrown into the market. However, he did not himself oopose any siteratien of the price at which foreign corn aaolad be admitted. Yet, as there was a great mass of fo reign corn now in the warehouses, he thought it would be ad.' oiisable to allow it to be 'brought-into the market sooner than She lew, as it now stood, permitted. Upon this point, how ever, the Hon. Member for Somercetsliire, , and the Hon. 111 ember for Wiltshire, were very tenacious, opposing the ad itasiai,:en till the price rose to 80.5., except in the case of ,corn ' which had been in warehouses for a certain time. Now, with respect to the scale of duty, the Hon. Member for Somerset shire proposed 405., which he afterwards offered to reduce to 355. ; but he might as -. well have said that we should not have any importation of foreign corn at all, unless the price could be Unnaturally forced up, _for a duty of 355., with the addition of 10s., the.expense of importation, would amount to an actual prohibition. It would be quite impossible that' the foreign grower could ever supply us upon such terms. If the Honour able Baronet supposed that an expenie of 455. could be chargettonsan article that already cost Bffs. in the market, he supposed a 'measure that, if carried, could not last for a week. He would ask if the House would not repeal the Bill in one sitting ? He could not conceive any delusion greater than to sanction such a principle. As to the pro position of the Honourable Member for Wiltshire, it par took so much of the nature of the other that he could by no means agree to it. The Honourable Member proposed a duty of '24a., which, with the 10s. added, made 345. a charge infinitely too high to remain as fixed, when the price rose to 80a. This, likewise, amounted to nothing short of a direct prohibition, and could not be admitted as a general principle. Looking to the proposition of the lion. Member for Portarliagton, he found that it was for having a fixed duty always in operation, and that it should he eegu lated on a moderate scale. This proposition differed from that of his Right Honourable Friend, inasmuch as his Right Honourable Friend would make his duty of 15s. not fixed in all cases, but liable to alteration according to circumstances. It appeared that the lion. Member for Portarlington so far agreed with the Hon. Member for Somersetshire and the Hon ourable Member for Wiltaliire as to propose that a flied duty should be continued under any circumstances of the market. But he (the Marquis of Londonderry) would con tend that it was impossible to have a fixed duty after • the prices rose to a certain height ; and he would not hesitate to say that, from his own views of the question, he should prefer a fixed duty, without any import price at all. It was quite clear that, in the present unnatural state of sup ply, no fixed duty could be adopted,, for it must he regu e lated with reference to the price in the market, which now was not to be taken as a standard fur ordinary years.— He could wish that the :House were to get rid of ihe.com plexity of the law with respect to the averages ;"'but this, was not the time for making„ the experiment: Public opi nion was against it. HOW could, he persuade those to try it who were against lowering the prices of corn from 80s. to 70s. the quarter ? If •he could for a moment bring him self to believe that it would be wise ,or prudent to adopt the proposition 'of the Hon. Member for Somersetshire, 'or that of the Hon. Member for Wiltshire, he should readily give either . his support; but he found that both were at variance with every principle of, sound policy. He came now to con sider the more moderate duty proposed by the Committee, that of 12s. ; and he might be allowed to inquire what must be its effects, if there were no change in the duty till the Price rose to 80s., the market price being 90s ? The duty of 155., as proposed by his Right Hon. Friend, 'with the 10s. addition, would make 3 charge of 255. ; and supposing the price to be 90s. in the market, 255. taken from it would leave 655. to the foreign importer. It was then to be considered what quan tity of corn would be thrown into the market by such a regu lation. The value of corn on the Continent was entirely below the standard of former years; arid here he wished to correct an error into which some pee-sons had been led re specting a statement of his on this subject. He had never denied that corn might be brought into this country at 30s. the quarter, for corn was now in a state of unnatural de pression all over the world, and, he knew that it might be got out of our own warehouses at 358. ; but it was to 'be observed that this was not a remunerating price ; and 'legis lating, prospectively not for an unnatural but a natural state of things,.the House would not take it as a standard.— He had said,that, according to the proposition of his Right Hon. Friend, the. foreign importer would have a clear price of 655. Now let them see what quantity of corn this would ' bring into the market. It would certainly bring in, all the corn in the warehouses, which at present was an immense quantity. This he thought was a risk that ought not to be run in an unnatural state of the market. A fixed duty would certainly be vary desirable ; but it was not to be reconciled to the price in this country, which must always be influenced by that on the Continent. An influx of foreign corn must invariably keep the market down, and he knew of no remedy against the effect of importa tion but to take, in aid of duty, an . import price. He was willing to allow that it might be advantageous if the principle of an import price could be got rid of altogether, but at pre sent that was quite impossible. The Noble Marquis, after recapitulating some of his former arguments upon this point, then s proceeded to read two extracts from the Report of the Agricultural Committee of last year, with the view of show ing that, though the Committee thought a fixed duty advisable, yet:it conk! not be adopted in the circumstances of i:•.e country, nor could ary thing more be effected than a modification of the existing law,• suited to the necessity of the occasion. The Corn mittee said that we had no; arrived at that state of things in which a sound and permanent principle could, be adopted with respect to the Corn Laws. His own opinion certainly was, that no such alterationliad taken place since last year, as woulil ad mit of the experiment being now made. Ile had no doubt what: : : ever that if we were in a natural state of things ; the proposition of his Right lion. Friend might be adopted with great advan tage ; but as the circumstances of the country now stoodeit did not appear to afford -sufficient security. He knew thdt there were many who wished, if possible, to get rid of the Corn Laws by sonic measure which should be conclusive. Such a measure was certainly. xery desirable, but he was persuaded that this was not the time for carrying it into effect. All par ties were anxious to come to some decision, and the Hon. Member for Portarlington evinced as great a disposition to ac commodate as could be expected foam an individual tenacious of a particular principle. However, that Hon. Member proposed two points of duty, which appeared incompatible with each other. But now he thought that the House could not do better than to take a measure of adequate precaution, suited to the character of the present times. The proposi tion which he had himself submitted to the Committee, he thought calculated to open a more ample field to commerce than that which they finally agreed to ; but as the latter was preferred, lie thought it proper to acquiesce. The Committee proposed a duty of 12s. with an augmentation of ss. for warehousing. Having offered these observations as to his own views of the subject, he should now submit the proposition of the Committee to the House, and he hoped that a difference of two or three shillings in the scheme of duty proposed en a mo derate scale would not have the effect of embarrassing the House while deciding on so important a question. There was nothing. which was more to be deprecated than aggravated pro tection, and any impression of that nature was calculated to agitate and disturb the public mind. The Noble Marquis con cluded some further observations to the same effect, by moving the third Resolution, upon which, lie said, the debate might take place. Sir T. LETHBRIDGE defended the arguments he had hitherto advanced on the question. He admitted that it was ' the duty of the House to legislate for the whole people, and not for any particular class ; and he was greatly misunder stood if he was supposed to advocate the contrary principle. If there ever was a time when the state of the country called for a different system from that which now prevailed, it was the present. He thought that a duty of 355. could not be thought too high, when the state of the market was consider ed. An experienced merchant in the City informed' him that he could supply him with wheat at 265. the quarter.— It was said that the present law gave the landholder a mono poly, but this he altogether denied. In February, • 1819, not less than 2,500,000 quarters of corn were imported, and of that glut 800,000 quarters yet remained in warehouses.— It was no wonder that English buttee could not fetch 6d. a pound, when Dutchmen sold theirs for 3d. a pound, and got a good profit by it, after paying the freight and duty. The English cheese experienced a similar fate. Therefore it was in vain to look at this question simply with a reference to corn ; and if protection was not carried much farther, the agriculture of the country could not support itself. This was the time then to protect agriculture and it was abso lutely necessary to do so. As to the public creditors, it was :unjust that they should receive the whole of their interest solong as the country was in its -present dreadful state.— (Hear, hear !)e--and it was high time also to cut off the tail of the Right Honourable Secretary's Bill, which passed three years ago. It was with these views lie should now bring forward the Resolutions lie had to propose. It had been said that we could grow our own consumption ; and if that was :the . case, what necessity could there be for importa tion ? It was treating the landholders with the greatest levity .to legislate on the principle of the Resolutions that came from the other side of the House ; and he believed the day was not •far distant when the landed interest would be annihilated, un less they stood firm by each other in defence of their rights, and in opposition to the miserable systems of economy origmat- ing with Ministers. The Hon. Baronet concluded with mov ing as au amendment, a Resolution, declaring that it was ex pedient for the protection of agriculture against foreign compe tition, that certain rates of duties should be laid on importation, higher than those already proposed. It stated the duty on wheat • at 355. per quarter, and proportionate duties on all other articles of foreign produce, being of the same kind as those produced by. English farmers. The Resolution and Amendment having been put from the Chair, Sir F. BURDETT rose.—lie was disposed to agree to what had been said by the Hon. Bart. rather than to what had fallen from the Noble Lord. The Hon. Member had, however, made a complaint that there was no disposition to hear him on behalf of the landed interest. He could say on his own part that he certainly had paid the great:eat. attention. 'He considered all the measures proposed by the Noble Lord on this subject futile. The lion. Member had the merit of taking a clear view of the subject, when he proposed duties on corn and other articles which must prohibit importation. The lion. Member wished corn might rise again to 120 s. the quarter.—(A cry of " No, no !")—Sir F. Ituniett then observed, that if the sum was not so high, the Hon. Member was not consistent. His opinion was, that if the price of corn could not be kept up to that the country could not be relieved. lie was not certain whether the Noble Lord was more in earnest or less in joke than he was yesterday . The Noble Lord had been trifling with the House, and if he .(Sir r. Burdett) had a musical voice, he might sing—" Cease your funning." The Noble Lord (Lord Castlereagh) Iratt been doubtful whether this measure was to be acknowledged as one of his progeny, or whether he should declare it was no offspring of his, and abandon the character of foster-father, for the purpose of acting the part of midwife. It was to be - lamert.2d the measure did not catch the vital air and die.„-(A laugh.)—The Noble Lord had told them to consider *what ought to be the amount of duty upon importation ; his opinion was, there ought to be no duties at all. Before theyapplied a remedy, they ought to inquire the cause. The Noble Lord, who ought to be the . best judge upon the subject, appeared to have the leait information. The Noble Lord threw himself upon any person that would be kind enough to give him information. The measure was recom mended because it would . do no harm, but that which did no good might do a great Meal of harm. Time, which was to act as a physician, would increase the disease. It was main tained by a Noble Earl in another place, that superabundance was the cause of distress, and that the reduction of all the taxes would not aflbrd relief. If that was true, there must' be some cirzumstances in the state of the country beyond re medy,-and then they might ask what measures had brought it to that state ? He couldnot agree to the view taken by the Honourable. Member of political economy. It was the appli cation of sense to objects connected with the interest of the country. . What the Honourable Member Meant by it, he did not know. He supposed - the Hon. Member meant low prices, laugh,) but, with respect to: superabundance, that decla 'ration was not supported by facts. The Agricultural Report said , there had been no superabundant harvests. The fact waS,' the departure from free importation had lowered the price: Since there had been no importation, the evils which were: the subject of complaint ha 4 in, a great degree increased. The.currency of the country haddirninished, so as to occasion considerable distress. Many had• been ruined by it, and left Rk,e ; itsli in a pond after tlie wafer _had been drawn off. The - Corntaws had been mischievous. Reduction in every branch. of the public expenditure oughtlit.be made. It was disgrace ful, in the presetiase,of ,the...focintry to have a Civil List ex- Penditure'of AI cOinitiets ought to he revised and redncell..._-.The.proverbtsaid= 4 c The least hair bears upon the camel!S back,."....When,the people were sulFering, the smallest relief was acceptable. - ,ITe considered the_Noble Lord who re- POStituistertnfitleif to i i he . thanks bf the House. He ,es,pressed.a hope That,the. Noble Lord would not fail to take up some other point of itseless. expence : there was no difficulty in chi:dee::: The Noble Liirdniight look to diplomacy and find ground for reduction of salaries. With respect to the mea sure he really was fighting with—" Trifles light as air," for nd one''' knew Whether the: Resolutions were real or illu sory. -Perhaps •the Nbble Marquis would give it up as he did yesterday. The lion-Baronet then called upon the Country Gentlemen to defend their fields, and transmit their estates to thtir children. They could not support their righti and pro perty by voting for miserable vacillating measures. They were treated as children. It had been said that faith must be kept with the public creditor. He admitted that posi tion, but faith ought to be kept with the whole country. There was no reason why the public creditors should receive more than they contracted for. The currency ought to be looked into, and contracts with respect to the value of money put right. The Government had appeared so imbecile that they had lost the, confidence of the country. The Noble Lord had left the rudder of the' State to move about in the storm. The Noble Lord was a bold man—he expected to get into harbour by cessation of the tempest, but himself and others knew they must perish if they suffered the fury of the e le ments without more skilful pilots.—(Hear, hear, hear.)—The time of affording relief was always put off: Committee after Committee, and Session after Session, notwithstanding the petitions with which the 'table was loaded. Those petitions were mostly well founded, indeed all of them were so; for if taxation was not the cause of low prices, yet in conjunction with the existence of low prices it carried the distress to a de gree which was altogether insupportable. He was persuaded that this distress was now so great that it was impossible the country could go on much longer without another set of Mini sters.—(Cheers from the Opposition.) Mr. ROBINSON thought that the Hon. Baronet had chosen a bad opportunity for throwing out his invective.— (Cheers from the Opposition ; returned from the Treasury side.)—He did think that the Honourable Baronet dealt in in vective, and that his opportunity was ill chosen.--(Repeated cheers.)—lf the Honourable Baronet thought as he expressed himself of the Administration, let him call the House to an une, ...vocal vote upon their conduct, and then he (Mr. R.) should be quite prepared to meet him upon 'that question._ But when he considered what the present question was, and the great divergency. of opinion which prevailed upon it, it -did appear to him the% they should not attend to the wishes of die Petitioners and of the countfy, unless they confined them selves to the consideration of some specific measure as apJ plying to the difficulties of the question, arid not to-go into that sort of attack and invective in which the Hon. Baronet had in dulged. Although it might' be true that some Hon. Gentle men on the other side, and'although it might be true that some of the Petitioners might wish for their removal from power, yet the great majority of the Petitions pointed to a specific course of measures very different - from the subject which the Honourable Baronet had introduced.—(llear ' hear the reduction of taxation to the extent wished for by the Hon. Baronet and others were to be carried into effect, they must do it by lowering the interest of the debt.—(Cheers from the Op position.)—lt was well to find that so many Gentlemen oppo site expressed themselves so unequivocally upon this subject, for their object would now be • seen.—(Cheers from both sides.)—And if that was their object, it being a question of an importance and magnitude . not to be exceeded, it was still more necessary for them to exclude from its considera tion the presence of invective and party feeling.—(Cheers.)— He had always professed his belief that no measures of altera- ' tion in the. Corn - Laws could afford immediate relief, because the distress•depended upon low prices. When he first intro duced a measure upon this subject to the House, he did not regard it as a good, but as a necessary measure, because he did not like the principle of restrictions upon the corn trade. Yet he fc;t that they were called upon now to remove a spe cific defect which existed in the present law, and that he would be.ready to do. The question really was, whether or not the proposed measure was calculated to remedy that particular evil, which the Report of the Committee of last year repre sented to be a grievous one,, and one susceptible of remedy.- - - This was the object of his Noble • Friend in moving the re appointment of the Committee. If they did not want to abro gate the kW, they mitst-restore its operation ; and the scale of duties now proposed appeared to him calculated to accomplish that object. When the Hon. Baronet attributed the distms to taxation, he knew not how they would account for its existence, even to a greater degree, in. all other corn-producing countries. Yet all these countries, as well as Spain and Portugal, who did not grow their own supply, either had established, or were about to establish, a_system,of restricting duties. With regard to the subject to which he had first alluded, if the Hon. Barn net thought the removal of :the present Ministers from power was thethily me a ns of 'relieving the agricultural distress he had.- better persuade the cOuntry, and -if the country, the House to remove them. But lie would tell the Hon. Baronet, that his taunts:would pot induce them to alter the course Which they' conceives) to bebost.suited to _promote the true'in terests of the country., r , : . Sir J. NEWPORT expressed his doubt whether, under the present circurnstandeS, be Wi se to tamper with existing laws upon the subject of corer. Mr. RICARDO said, ain't as he 'considered the distreis of agriculture to depend upon Ile system of our Corn Laws, he thought this thtproper timelfor delivering his sentiments upon 'the question. -He contended:that there was an inconsistency an the arguments of his Hon—Friend (Sir F. Burdett) when he admitted at first that abundance would produce'distress, and decrease the value of prodtiee. He was aware that his Hon. Friend afterwards correctedihe'admission, and said that abun dance would not reduce the value of produce beyond what it would be reduced by small crops with' high prices. Ile after. wards applied the first argument to the currency. Now the fact was, that an increase in the quantity of any particular ar ticle did not necessarily reduce its aggregate value. Suppose, for instance, that such an article as superfine cloth were wholly unknown in this country, and 10,000 yards should be intro duced. It would necessarily be distributed among the rich, at a very high price. If this quantity were then to be doubled, and there should be 20,000 yards introduced; although the yard might become cheaper, yet the aggregate value of the 20,000 yards would be greater than that of the 10,000 yards 'before the quantity was increased. If they then doubled the quantity to 40,000 yards, the same result would be obtained ; but if they went on doubling until they had supplied all classes of the Community, and then they doubled the quantity again, then, undoubtedly, the aggregate' value would be decreased. The same with respect to Corn. Such an effect must follow, be- cause the consumption of corn must necessarily be limited.— But the currency was an exception to this argument; because money could he applied to all purposes, and its employment had no bounds. Any increase, therefore, in the circulating' medium would only affect the prices of produce in a.certain increase of but not at all upon the same scale as an of any other supply for which there was a limited demand. He contended that our system of Corn Laws had produced the distress complained of, and that the resolutions he should move were calculated to remove the evil. What he pro posed was that there should be ten shillings duty upon the importation of corn, and a bounty of 7s. upon exporta tion. It was impossible that there could be a greater relative difference betwixt the expenses. of other countries and the grower of this country than 3s. Protection up to 70s. he considered to be equal and fair, even under the existing distress. In calculating that 10s. would bn a sufficient protec tion, he had allowed for all the particular taxes paid by the home grower over those of other countries. The evidence taken before the Committee shewed that all the taxes did not amount to more than one-tenth of the produce ; therefore a protection of 10 per cent. would place them upon an equal footing if others payed no taxes at all. He proposed fixed duties, because he considered it an injustice to the farmer that they should not be fixed. Indeed he was advocating the cause of the farmer, and was a better friend to him than many Honourable Gentlemen who pretended to be more so. From the evidence of Mr. Solly it appeared that corn grown in the interior of the country could be shipped at Dantzic and im ported here at not less than 665. Now, the Honourable Mem ber for Wiltshire had said last night that a remunerating price to the grower of this country should be Bs. 4d. that amounted to 675. a quarter. The Honourable Member for Cumberland gave in his evidence that 655. would be a remune rating price. How then could they ask for a higher propor tion than a duty of twelve shillings, as his Resolution proposed? It would, he thought, be most unsafe to legislate upon acci dental prices. The doing so would be the seducing of the agri culturist by offering him high prices to cultivate; and he would be exposed to all the consequences of extraordinary importa tion, which would certainly be caused by those high prices. Ile really thought the argument of his Right Hon. Friend was, in this respect, more free from o bj ec ti on th an th at o f t h e Noble Lord. lie (Mr. R.) took it to be indisputable that the price of corn in this kingdom would necessarily be 15s. a quarter more than that of any other country. He proposed a bounty ; and he assured Hon. Gentlemen who were afraid of bounties, that the one he proposal would operate only on particular occa sions. The evidence of Mr. Took and Mr. Jacob on this sub ject was quite decisive. From the various arguments which he had heard offered as to the cause of the distress, he could only say that, in his opinion, the consequence of superabundance had not been sufficiently appreciated.. At- that late hour he would not enter at large into the question of the evening ; but he would just bring one fact under thenotice of the Committee. He had carefully examined' the Report of the Bank Committee in the year 1797, which referred to the circumstances of the Bank for a considerable time previous ; and he found that in 1782, when the Bank had only eight millions in circulation, three millions were withdrawn, yet no considerable inconve nience was occasioned by the circumstance. The Honourable Member having apologized for engaging the attention of the House at that late hour, then sat down amid universal cheering. There was now a general call tor adjournment. The Marquis of LONDONDERRY 'said he had no doub that, in consequence of the great importance of the subject, the Hon. Member for Ipswich (Mr. Lennard) would not pre s his intended motions for to-morrow respecting the Libel Bill. At all events the Chairmaa might be directed to ask leave to sit again to-morrow. _ _ BENETT (of Wiltshire) then attempted to address the House, but the cries of " Adjourn, adjourn," rendered his voice inaudible. Mr. B. however, persisted in exercising his right ; when the Chairman assuring him that he would to morrow be considered as in possession of the House, he yield ed to the declared sense of the House, and sat down. Mr. CuitwEN also attempted to engage the attention of the House • but not a single syllable of the f e w w o r d s h e u tt tre d could be heard. The House immediately resumed ; the Chairman reported progress. and obtained leave to sit again to-morrow, (this day.) T. he other orders of the day were then disposed of, and at ONE O'CLOCK the House adjourned. CITY, TUESDAY EVENING. Consols for Cie Account opened this morning, at 7914, and were very steady during the day. At no time was there a greater variation than 4 per cent., and they finally closed at the opening price. Mr. VANSITTART'S Five Million Scheme is not considered as a public measure, for no private person is likely to be concerned in it. Should it be contracted for, a corporated body, it is thought, will alone be able to manage a concern, the profit of which is distant, and in the minds of many is also uncertain. The plan is understood by all, but its practicability is not so obvious. The universal opinion, how ever, is, that it will not be contracted for unless on terms highly advantageous to the Contractors; and Merchants, who do not intend to have any thing to do with it, think, that the profit had better be given to the Sinking 'Fund, for they ' cannot comprehend the doctrine of levying five millions a year (the asserted amount of the Sinking Fund), from the present ge neration, for the benefit of posterity, and at-the same. time of re- 1 lieving themselves of Taxes to the amount of two millions and upwards annually, and throwing the payment of these Taxes on their descendants, for whose sakes they now burden them selves with a Siakin b . e. Fund. Merchants think that the only benefit will be to the Ministers, who already have the ap pointment of Commissioners for managing the Sinking Fund, and will also have additional patronage in forming another Board for managing the plan for thwarting the op era ti ons o f the Sinking Fund, - and for rendering the efforts of the present generation to redeem their debt nugatory and unavailing._ In Foreign Securities, little business is doing. The French Rentes have fallen to 88. The Prussian Bonds are 864. Colum bian old Bonds have risen to 100.4. The Six per Cent. Script 86i 4., and the Six per Cent Bonds paid up 854. Spanish New Fives are 63g. 63i. In the old, no prices are quoted. Danish Fives remain at 85 ; and Neapolitan has been established at the value of 69. Russian Sixes remain at 82, and Fives at 76. The Austrian Metallic Fives are very dull at 744 a74}.—Coffee, of fine quality, is 3s. to 4s. and all inferior sorts full 2s. dearer. Sugar is steady, but Rums are very dull, at 20d. a 2s. a gallon.— Some Odessa yellow Tallow of the best quality has been ex posed to public sale, and sold at 345. to 345. 9d. St. Peteisburgh yellow Candle Tallow is still held at 395. but in real value it cannot be called more than is. above the best quality from Odessa. —Flax is extremely dull ; twenty-two vessels have already passed the Sound loaded with this article, chiefly for Scotland. Hemp also is very unsaleable. The price at St. Petersburgh on the spot was 98, occasioned by the early demand from America. For contract it was 80 to 82, chiefly for English account.—The public are much indebted to Mr. Husitissoer - for his attention jo their.interests on the subject of licenses. Beer has fallen this day a halfpenny a pot, but this is not sufficient. The pub lic brewers, no doubt, have a just right to charge for their pro perty just what they please ; but the people have an equally Just right to expect from their Government permission to buy their Beer where they can procure it cheapest. They there fore hope that some law will be enacted, by which every person who pleases so to employ his capital and his abilities, may have free permission to sell his be.er, and this can only be accomplished, in justice to the poor man, by re. pealing the present Duty on Beer, which the public brewer pays, and placing the same amount on malt. The trade.can never be thrown open until this be done, in addition to grant ing permission for any person to sell beer who keeps an-orderly house. It is well known that under the present Licensing System, when the tenant has Complained to the landlord that his custom was leaving him on account of the bad quality of the Beer which he was forced-to sell, the answer on more occa sions than one has been a recommendation from the landlord to get a fiddler into the house, which, in one way or another, would increase the consumption. This is a good plan for keeping a house orderly under the present licensing system. Mr. BUXTON'S explanation of the preference given by the Ma gistrates to his house, Messrs. HANBURY and Co.. is any thing but satisfactory to the inhabitants of London. The evil in a country town is, however, ten times greater, for there the poor have no choice. They must either drink what is given to them, and that at a high price, or want.— The House of Commons is employing itself at present to little purpose in regulating the future importation of Foreign Corn. The whole quantity imported since 1791,' until the present period, is little more than one year% consumption of England and Scotland, taking one quarter of wheat annually to each soul; and if any thing like los. a qr. of duty was imposed, the importation in one year would not exceed a week or ten days' consumption. All the plans at present before the House do not give permission for foreign importation of Grain until the average price of 'Wheat is advanced to a value, which nothing short of famine can ever make it, as long as gold and silver:continue the currency of the kingdom. An effectual redress for Agricultural Distress may be produced by natural causes. A free importation of foreign grain would deprive the different nations of Europe of all their excuses for placing restrictions on our commerce ; to make tede as f ree as air will instantly enable the British merchant to give remuner ating wages to the productive classes, and when the people have money to pay for their wants, consumption of agricultural produce will be doubled. The farmer will lose not more than ten days consumption of grain annually by foreign importa tion, and be will reap the benefit of steady demand and fair prices for all he can grow during the remainder of the year. A short time, probably, will prove the advantage of liberal intercourse.—{Morning- Chronicle. PARLIAMENTARY PROCEEDINGS. HOUSE OF COMMONS. Martin, 7 0 die Mail, 1822. BUTTER TRADE (IRELAND)—Petition from Sligo, in favour of Duties on Importation ; to lie on the table, and to be printed. BRISTOL Poou BILL Romps—Glasgow and Inchbelly Bridge, Read !: third time, and Plymouth and Stonehouse . and passed. NEWCASTLE-UPON-TYNE TOLLS BILL GAS LlGHT—Glasgow —Bill presented, and read a first time. CORN LAWS—Petitions of Owners of Land in the Counties • of Buckingham, Gloucester, and Suflialk, and the Hundred of Cosford, against lowering the importation prices—to lie. on the table, and to be printed. Two Petitions from Sussex, and two from Kent, against ditto--to lie on the table. GREENWICH CHURCH BlLL—Further time granted for making the Report till Wednesday May 15. SALT TAX—Pet:don of Drysalters, and others; resident in Bit . - mingham_, for a Drawb a ck on S a l t use d i n their trade ; to h o on the table, and to be 'printed. RAILwAY CANAL—G —Severn and Wye loucester and Berkeley I . Bills to be mgrossed. ,•,, LIVERPOOL WATER BlLL—R e p or t f urt h er considered ; B ill re-committed to former Committee ; leave to sit on Monday next, and, to report on Monday May 20. • AGRICULTURAL DISTRESS —Petitions from the Hundreds Of Mitford and Forehoe—to lie on the table, and to be printed. MESSAGE FROM THE LORDS--That they have agreed to Carnatic Creditors Bill ; Dover Gas Light Bill_; Leith Walk, Yarpole and Presteig ne, and Leicest er an d P eter b oroug h Road Bills; Chorlton Row (Lancaster) Lighting Bill ; ‘Bris tol Port Bill • Great Yarmouth Ch urc h Bill ; an d Ellingham and Ibsley Illants) Inclosure Bill, without amendment ; Wigan Gas Light Bill ; and Duxford (Cambridge) Inch:- sure Bill, with amendments. STAMP DUTIES RELIEF BlLL—for explaining and• amend ing certain Acts relating to Stamp Duties, 'and for extending relief in cases of spoiled Stamps," presentdd, and read a 1.,t time, to be read a second time to-morrow (this.day. SILK LACE DUTIES BlLL—repoltedi; to be read a third time on Friday. PAVING, &c.—Sommers Town—Petition of the• Rev. Arthur Robinson Chauvel, Prebendary of St. Pancras, against.; to lie on the table. NAVIGATION BlLL—till May 20 1 ANCIENT COMMERCIAL STATUTES RE- I . • , • PEAL BlLL—till May 20 ' Committ ees do IMPORTATION OF GOODS REPEAL BILL . • ferred.' till May 20 WAREHOUSING BlLL—till Monday next COLONIAL SECURITIES BlLL—reported ; to be read a third time to-morrow (this day). • • NOTICES OF MOTIONS for ,THIS DAY. 1. Mr. Lennard,—To repeal Act (60 Geo. 3, c. 6.) for more effectually preventing Seditious Meetings and Assemblies —Also to repeal Act (60 Geo. 3, c. 8.) for the more effec tual prevention and punishment of Blasphemous and Sedi tious Libels :—Also, to repeal Act (60 Geo. 3, c. 9), Se:" curity given by Publishers. 2. Sir Robert Heron,—To alter the Law of Settlement of the Poor. 3. Sir John Newport,—Bill to authorize occupying Tenants in Ireland to tender in part payment of Rent Receipts ibr Grand Jury and Parochial Assessments. • 4. Mr. Bankes,—Vote, British Museum. (In Committee or Supply.) 5. Mr. Courtenay,—Bill for consolidating and amending, the I _ws relating to Prisons. ORDERS OF THE DAY for THIS DAY.: 1. Recognizances 13111—Second Reading. 2. Scottish Turnpike Roads Bill—Second Reading. 3. Insolvent Debtors Act Amendment Bill—Second Reading 4. Capital Crimes Defence Bill—Second Reading. 5. Scottish Commissary Courts Bill—Second Reading. • 6. Royal Burghs Accounts Bill—Further Consideration or Report. 7. Seditious Meetings Amendment Bill—Further considera tion of Report. 8. Sheriffs Depute (Scotland) Bill—Second Rendng. 9. Supply—Committee. 10. Ways and Means—Committee. 11. Malt Duties Repeal (Ireland) Bill—Third Reading; 12. Stamp Duties Relief Bill—Second Reading. 13. Passengers Regulation Acts—Committee thereupon. 14. Stamp Duties Act--Committee thereupon. 15. Agricultural Distress Report—Committee thereupon. 16. Colonial Securities Bill—Third 'Reading. PRICE 0. THIS DAY AT Bank Stock 240 239. 1 . 3 per Cent. Red, 78 77i 78 3 per Cent. Cons. 7 8 iiij 3i per Cent. Old 4 per Cent. { New 941 i 5 per Cent. Nary Ann. 102 4 1 1 Bank Long Ann. 19 13-16ths 11-16ths 13-16ths . PRICE OF IRIS Bank Stock 2421 Gov. Deb. 3i per cent. Stock, 34 per ct. Gov. DA. 4 per cent. Gov. Deb. 5 per cent 2i 2 Stock, 5 per cent... 2} Treasury Bills, 5 per cent. City Debentures, 5 per . . cent Lying in Hospital 4 per ct Exchange on Lon, HIGH WA TER AT LONDO. Morning, 24 minutes after 5. STOCKS NE O'CLOCK. Imp. 3 per• Cents. '74 77i Irish 5 per Centt.' India Stock India Bonds s9s. 57 4 . South Sea Stock -- Excheq. Bills 3 1 pr. Bank for Cons:Act ........ Cons. for Account. ....•••• [ STOCK, MAY 4. A g Grand Canal Loan, 4 p.ct. "" —Ditto 6 per cent. ..• 71i — Royal C p a it n t a ° S Sto ck to c k............ Royal - - 'ide-street Cert. 6 per ct. Do. Deb. with Gov. Sec— — Pipe Water Deb. 5 per ct. Do. Ballast Office Govt. Sec. I 5 i)er cent ' lon, May 4, 8. BRIDGE TO-MORRO:* Evening, 48 minutes after__.: THE SUN. SOLEM QUIS DICERS FALSUN AUDE.IT . 2 LONDON, WEDNESDAY, MAY 8, 182'2 The Paris Papers of Sunday contain Weill' gence from Vienna to the 24th ultimo, at whi ch date the Austrian funds bad again fallen a fford' ing a strong presumption of the approacilig commencement of hostilities. Private letters from Petersburgh and Germany speak of wa. as certain, and there appears no doubt of the Mar ch of the Russian armies towards the frontiers cif Turkey. The fallowing are extracts : " VIENNA, APRIL 24.—The great point here now. LI 7 know whether the P or t e or R uss i a w ill fi rst commence hostio" ties. It is certain that the Reis Effendi promised Lord Strang' ford and M. de Lutzow, that the Porte will not tire the fast shot. If the Divan keeps its word, it will be for Russia to de ' termine the period of the commencement of the campaign' It is believed here that the Russian armies will not be ready t"' about the middle of May. It is supposed, however, that th: next month may entirely run out before the neg Constantinople are officially broken off. " There is one very remarkable fact which is stated to' ds/ as certain, that a military organization is now making in ° et " sarabia of all the Greek refugees, Moldavians, Wallitchi ans ' Bulgarians, and others generally designated under the onzu! of Heterists, and that all those refugees who have already tna' c war upon the Turks will form a corps to be commanded by a Russian General, and make part of the Army of the South under the orders of General Wittgenstein. These wen a le estimated at 7,000, but it appears they will shortlyhe cons' derably reinforced. This corps will continue to wear s W a in, if the inte , o uniform with a death's head on their helmets. gence of the organization of this corps be confirmed, it Is v °dation' s certain proof that Russia no longer reckons on the maintainaTl' of peace. `'' 4 l and du' At the Exchange to-day, the Metallics fell, to 1 Bank Actions to 659 1-sth. NUREMBERG APRIL 28 The letters from st• P . ete r tl- . burgh of the 19th Of April state, positively, that war 14 as re. 41 e1 C!, 4 v ent tile wh ic l eft. frorri ktf, 4 ,