The Sun. — London, England, 1832-01-27 00:00:00

atituents and the country the vote which he felt himself c onscientiously bound to give on the question now before it. The question seemed to him a very plain one. Was there a treaty, and what were its conditions? The con ditions were few, and stated with sufficient perspicuity. They were, in fact, but two—one, that the parties were bound to ply the money, even although a war should break out between them, and the other, that if the union be tween Holland and Belgium ceased, then the payments were to cease also. This point of the continuance of the payment in the event of war was one of the strongest ar guments possible against the construction of the Hon. Member (Mr. Rice), because it chewed plainly all the conditions on which the payments could take place had been foreseen and provi , led for, and, therefore, there were no proceedings nor no Conferences to be consulted with respect to the true construction of its terms.—(Hear. hear.) He thought, therefore, the time must came when the payments must cease, and the Government had really no discretion left with respect to the course they were to pursue towards Russia and the parties interested.—( Hear, hear.) He could have understood the propriety of the Government making some concession, and consenting to some sacrifices, for the purpose of avoiding a war ; but that was not the case here. It was the separation of the two countries which was to regulate their decision ; and he re peated they had no alternative but to avail themselves of their situation to get rid of the burthen which the treaty had imposed on them. He could not understand the propriety of the argu ment of the Hon. Member (Mr. Rice), that the smallness of the sum made any difference. The sum was five millions and a half, and it was the bounden duty of the Government to relieve the country from its payment. He had been anxious, indeed, that the question, important as he considered it in every point of view, should not be brought before the House incidentally, as on the present occasion; but that time should be given the Government to look at the propriety of retracing their steps.— (Hear.) Why, indeed, had they not considered it themselves in the first instance, instead of consulting the Law Officers of the Crown ? The Law Officers of the Crown indeed! Why, it was a question so plain and so easily seen through, that none but a Law Officer of the Crown could misunderstand it.--(Cheers from the Opposition.) Why did not the Ministers trust to their own good sense rather than consult them ?—(Hear, hear.) He admired the candour with which the Noble Lord (Althorp) had admitted, that if they had erred, it was through bad advice.—(Cheers and laughter, with, as we believe, some expressions of dissent from Lord Althorp). He certainly did understand the Noble Lord to say that, doubti having arisen as to the construction of the Act, they took the opinion of the Law Officers of the Crown—(Hear, hear)—and a pretty broken reed they had leant upon.—(Cheers and laughter.) He must again say he regretted that the Government had not trusted to their own good sense. He would call on the House, however, to be cautious how they gave their consent to the course which had been pursued, by in any manner supporting the principle laid down, and he hoped the Noble Lord would see the propriety of admitting the error that had been committed, and at once tell them he was ready to recall what had been done. He had listened with attention to the speech of the Learned Gentleman (the Solicitor. General), and he must say that not one word he uttered had the least reference to the Act of Parliament, which was the only thing with which the House had anything to do.—(Hear, hear.) One, and not the least of the matters to be deprecated in the proceedings of the Government was, that, with all the doubts they entertained of the propriety of their course, they commenced paying on the sth of June that twenty thousand pounds which was followed by another pay ment of eighty thousand pounds, although Parliament was sit ting at the time, and might and should have been consulted.— (Hear, hear.) If it was intended that the House of Commons should have any controul over the public expenditure, or the disposal of the national resources, he contended that the Go vernment should have, under such circumstances, applied for the sanction of Parliament before they commenced such a pay ment.—(Hear, hear) If the country was to renew this pay_ ment, which must be continued for forty or fifty years, there was not a man in Europe who would not say that England was consenting to pay this money as tribute to the great Powers of the north, in order that they might not interfere with her ar rangements ; and he would say, if this opinion was allowed to go forth, it would be most prejudicial, as well as disgrace ful. On that point, as well as others, he regretted what had b , en done. His duty to his constituents required him to pur sue but one course. The principle involved in the question, and all the circumstances attending it, compelled him to vote against the Government, and he implored every Hon. Mem ber in that House, who had a due regard to the exercise of a proper controul over the public expenditure, to consider well before he sanctioned the course which had in this instance been pursued.—(Hear, hear.) _ . . . The ATTORNEY-GENERAL contended that the Act of Parliament was merely intended to give effect to the treaty, and that it was to that treaty, as Lord Grenville well observed, they were to look, in construing the fair spirit and intentions of the parties. The honour and good faith of the country was, he conscientiously believed, bound up with the maintenance of that treaty, and with the payment of the money, under the cir cumstances in which they were placed. Some severe reflec tions had been cast on the course pursued by the Law Officers but it should be recollected that the Law Officers, when their opinions were asked, had no option but to give them on the documents laid before them ; and he thought it would be found that the conferences and negociations which were con. nected with the treaty plainly showed there was a something intended by the parties beyond what was expressed in the treaty itself. When the subject was mentioned a few weeks since, he understood the Hon. Gentleman opposite to agree in the views taken by the Government of the binding nature of the treaty; but to have complained merely that Parlia ment had not been consulted. In his opinion there was no question to be submitted to the consideration of Parlia ment.—(Hear.) If the Government had come down to the House of Commons, and asked its consent to enter into the engagement or the payment of the money, that would have been an admission that the treaty was at an end, and that a new one was become necessary. It might happen, too, that Parliament would not give its consent to the execution of the treaty, which had been concluded by the King, with the advice of his Ministers; and thus one portion of the Legisla ture would he found entrenching on the privileges of the other. It was the province of the King to make treaties, and to see them carried into execution ; and when it was clear that the treaty remained to be fulfilled, he apprehended that the Go vernment were not bound to consult Parliament.—(Cheers from the Opposition.) Had the Government come down on the eve of a general election, and asked that House whether it was to fulfil a treaty which would cost the country five millions of money, it was not at all improbable that the Members would have refused their sanction, under the fear that at such a time a contrary decision would lose them their seats. He was satis fied that the country was bound in honour to fulfil the treaty, although he much regretted the necessity of expending so *winch money on such an object. The power of executing the treaty was vested in the Royal Prerogative. The Ministers were responsible for the manner in which it was exercised, and he believed England would rue the day it ever departed from that principle of honour and good faith which had hitherto cha racterized all Its proceedings. Sir JAMES SCA RLETT said that the doctrine of the Hon. and Learned Gentleman was a little singular, for he seemed to contend that the King was to make treaties, and the King was afterwards to construe them when they were made, and Parlia ment had nothing to do but to follow quietly where it was led, and make no inquiries on the subject. If his Hon. Friend bad any other documents than those which were not before the House, he could understand the meaning of his arguments ; but he (Sir J. Scarlett) apprehended that Parliament was bound by what was before it, and nothing else ; and when he looked at the words of the treaty, he really found great difficulty in con_ calving what argument could be produced for him to cope with. —(Hear, hear.) Unless there were other documents, not pro duced, he really could not understand on what his Honourable prul Learned Friend had founded his opinions. Where the vic.ofing of a document was ambiguous, they might be permitted to los at the circumstances of the case, and to take one docu smut in connection with others, for the purpose of coming to a right conclusion ; but in this question he wondered at the inge. nuity of those who could give the words of the treaty any con struction but one—namely, that when the two kingdoms were Owered, or the Sovereignty parted by fraud or force, then the payment was to cease.—(Hear.) Sir F. VINCENT was understood to oppose the motion. Mr. O'CONNELL adverted to the caution which ought to be observed by the Law Officers of the Crown in giving their opinions, and he illustrated it by reference to the facts of the present case. As a lawyer he must say, and he said it with re gret, that he had not heard a single particle, even of a legal ground, to justify the course Ministers had pursued.—(Cheers.) Looking at the terms of the contract, he found an express limi tation, and what was it ? It was to last—not until a certain sum was paid—not for a particular number of years, but until a certain event occurred ; that was to say, until the Netherlands should be severed from the Sovereignty of Holland.—(Hear, hear.) If that event had occurred, Great Britain was rid of the necessity to pay five millions of money. Then came the ques tion of moral honesty ; and he should say, that the suffering people of England were robbed of five millions of their hard earn ings if Ministers consented to pay a farthing more to Russia. The question was, what engagement had the Act of Parliament sanctioned ? The Act was founded upon a resolution of the House of Commons, which was recited, and according to that, he that took a farthing out of the Exchequer for the purpose of handing it over to Russia, was guilty of a spoliation of the people.—(Cheers.) He might regret the effect of the vote be must give, but, as a lawyer, he had no choice. If Ministers had additional documents or treaties in their hands to justify their proceedings, why did they not produce them, and if ne cessary, ask for another Act of Parliament to enable them to do that which now they had no power to do ? Mr. SINCLAIR spoke from under the Gallery, and from the cheers he received from the Opposition benches we presume that he supported the motion. Mr. a ROBINSON had never heard of a case requiring so little hesitation : and he said that he should be utt er ly ashamed if he allowed any of the arguments (if such they might be called) of the law officers of the Crown to induce him to vote against the motion. Dr. LUSHINGTON—Whatever might be thought of the treaty, the only question was, whether, under the circum stances that had since occurred, the British Government was bound to perform the obligation which, it was admitted on all hands, it had undertaken. It was necessary to come to the consideration of the question with a mind free from prejudice, and reluctant, to convert to our own advantage events not contemplated at the date of the signature of the treaty, Great Britain was bound not to Holland, but to Russia, and tent to consider the question.—(Cheers.) No payment was to be made until the sth of January.—(Continued cheers.) Nothing could have been more easy than for the Noble Chancellor of the Exchequer to have come down, stated his doubts upon the letter of the Act, and demanded a new one, to carry into effect our equitable engagement—if such, indeed, existed.—(Cheers.) The question was if, under the joint authority of the Convention and an Act of Parliament, the Noble Lord was justified in paying the money ? He did not know whether there were or were not any secret engagements, but on the words of the treaty he cer tainly had no authority.—(Cheers.) The Noble Lord wished to interpret this treaty as referring simply to severance by ex ternal violence ; but what authority had he for this ? The Soli_ citor-General, indeed, quoted one of Lord Castlereagh's speeches —but in that very speech he found it mostfully declared that the payment was to be continued so long as it was payable accord ing to the terms of his Majesty's engagements, as specified —as specified in the Convention.—(Here the Right Hon. Baronet read some extracts from a speech of Lord Castlereagh's, in explana tion of the treaty of 1815.) But then, said the Attorney-General, do not take the treaty in English. No, it was too plain—it spoke positively of the separation by severing—that is by force; or by passing away—that is by some other mode of transaction. —(Cheers.) No, said the Attorney-General, look to the treaty in French—(Loud laughter and cheers.) Well, let them look, and what did they find ? Soustraire ala domination—as an swering to pass from; and that this could mean no sever ance from external, he proved by quoting the words of the Dutch Minister, who, in alluding to Luxemburg and Limburg, spoke of their separation from Holland by the words de les soustraire a l'autorite legitime—to express the passing away of these provinces from Holland without foreign force. Nothing could in his mind be more futile than the arguments which had been advanced on the other side. The first was, that England was a party to the severance ; this was clearly proved by dates and events not to be the fact, yet the Ministers held it fora ard, and seldom had he seen men who, to escape from a blunder, were so eager to charge themselves with a crime.— (Loud cheers.) For, from our relations with Holland, a crime it decidedly would be if the separation had taken place in the words of the Attorney-General by our procurement.—(Loud cheers.) if we were a party to the severance, equally so was Russia; therefore why should we be asked to continue this payment, the object for which it was made having ceased to exist.—(Cheers.) The argument for its permanency, under all circumstances, was perfectly ridiculous. If Belgium became of its own free will united with France—if the Duke of Nemours had accepted the Sovereignty which was offered to him, would we, in addition to losing all the money we had, conjointly with Holland, expended on the fortresses, be likewise compelled to continue this payment to Russia ?—(Loud cheers.) In a word, if France were to get possession of Belgium by intrigue, or any other way but absolute force, would we be compelled to continue this payment to Russia ? Oh, the thing was utterly ridiculous. The Right Hon. Baronet then read the resolutions, and observed that if there ever yet was a syllogism in which the two premises con.. tained the conclusion, it was that of his Right Hon. Friend, as expressed In his resolutions. The Noble Chancellor of the Ex. chequer, however, said he did not object to the major, nor to the minor; but he was so arbitrary as to the conclusion which was obtained in them, that he insisted the House should object to that.—(Great cheering) They had two courses to pursue with re•pect to this question. If they voted against the motion they for ever precluded themselves from the possibility of disputing this payment. On the contrary, if they supported it, they reserved to themselves the right of considering the nature of the alleged honourable obligation. He hoped those gentlemen who had supported Reform would yet reserve to themselves the humble privilege of deciding on this simple question—and he could only say, that if they now voted in conformity with the Ministerial wish, they would afford an argument in favour of Reform stronger than their reason or their ingenuity had ever yet devised.—(Loud and long-continued cheering ) Lord PALMERSTON confessed he had never heard a case supported in that House by such contrary arguments. In fact they were at perfect variance with one another; and even his Right Hon. Friend (Sir Robert Peel), notwithstanding the at tacks which he had made on the Government, adnuited that, as he had not seen the papers which had been laid before the Law Officers of the Crown, he could not form an opinion. Was this country to take base advantage of the words of the treaty for the purpose of preventing Russia from advantages on account of conduct in which she was no party ?—(Hear.) Was it a crime, to endeavour, as his Majesty's Ministers had endeavoured, to avert war and perpetuate peace ? They did not choose to in volve Europe in blood. Having been parties to that separation— having not called upon Russia to exhort her military means to prevent that separation, but having gone hand in hand with her to affect that separation, were Ministers now to turn round and say to Russia, .‘ We have gone along with you for eleven months in friendly negociations, w th a view of preserving the peace of Europe, and now we have got you to the point—(Hear, hear)—and Belgium is separated from Holland, you must pay us back that money which, under the simplicity of heart, was paid you ?" He should be sorry to belong to any Government that con ducted its affairs upon principles so base and contemptible.— (Hear.) The principle laid down by the Right Hon. Gentleman was, that the separation of the two countries had taken place, but he had not shown when • and he (Lord Palm ers t on ) was not aware, up to that moment, that the King of the Nether lands had acknowledged that the Sovereignty of Belgium bad passed away from the House of Orange.—(Hear, and laughter.) He denied that, according to the fair spirit of the treaty, the case was one which justified England in attaching to Russia the forfeiture, which was the object of the resolutions. The resolutions meant a great deal—they were intended to fix the censure of that House upon his Majesty's Ministers. If, in deed, Ministers deserved it, let them be so censured ; but let not Hon. Members be entrapped into a vote—(Hear, hear) — on the alleged ground that this was merely a postponerrent of a money payment to Russia. Important, too, as the question was to Government, it was not less important to the character and honour of the country.—(Hear.) He felt that England was bound bygood faith and honour to make the payment. This was his opinion as a man of honour and a gentleman —as an adviser of his Sovereign he felt that the engagement still subsisted ; and as a Member of the House of Commons he thought the payment should continue.—(Loud cheers.) If the resolutions should not be negatived, he should not envy that man who had to conduct the future negotiations of the country, for he would be taunted and told that negotiations with this country was useless enter ing 11 upon, as it was probable they would never be performed. Mr. PAGET then rose and moved the adjournment of the de bate to Tuesday next. the engagement was to be gathered not from one article, tell to consider the question.—(Cheers.) No payment was to be ' SPIRIT OF THE PUBLIC JOURNALS. tage of this our own act to escape from Our pecuniary engage-' CHOLERA MORBUS, OFFICIAL REPORT. made until the sth of January —(Continued cheers.) Nothing ments. Such conduct would be eminently dishonourable in a but from the whole treaty, explaining one part by the context more easy than for the could have been * Noble Chancellor of the private person, and he could not consider it otherwise in a of another . another. The Emperor of Russia had entered into the treaty Exchequer to have come down, stated his doubts upon the letter The latter years of the late war, and the first years of the tion." His Lordship added that .. he had taken the opinion COUNCIL OFFICE, WHITEHALL.—(THIS DAY.) under the expectation that it was the undoubted object of Great of the Act, and demanded a new one, to carry into effect our peace, were to Great Britain the most costly era in her eventful of the Law Officers of the Crown as to whether Government was compelled to make the payment, and that opinion coincided -- - - DAILY REPORT of CHOLERA CASES. hi . to . ry. The facility of coining money out of rags, and of Britain to to preserve and maintain the consolidation between equitable engagement—if such, indeed, existed.—(Cheers.) The -- Holland and Belgium, and in his (Dr. Lushington's) judg. tani n eto t n was pa if, under the joint authority of the . . Convention and tainin loans to an amount, tempted our Government to acts of with his own. The The position fl • Lordship , that the only • o us cause rs .. , the S, most indefensiblet There seemed to be no • . the of Parliament the Noble Lord was justified in paying of separation contemplated was external force, was stoutly corn- . ego th ' 110 ment, the obligation could not cease to exist in consequence of money ? He did noeknow whether there were or were not any limit to the drain which the Ministry and the Parliament were batted. Mr. Pollock contended, that whatever the cause of the as.- CU . 0 a r, 0 8.. 0 'I? the occurrence of circumstances never contemplated by the secret engagements, but on the words of the treaty he cer- disposed to make on the public resources , — they seemed to have disseverment, it left the King of Holland and the Government Placa. . .g.d s 4 c ) .:S 'Jr..> aal cl. , parties. The object in 1814 was to make it the interest of tainly had no authority.—(Cheers.) The Noble Lord wished no idea that our wealth could be exhausted, or that present pro- of this country in precisely the same situation with regard to the 2 4 Itri3Et ^. E g Russia to maintain the consolidation of Belgium and Holland • to interpret this treaty as referring simply to severance by ex-. tusion would lead to future embarrasssnent. No foreboding that stipulation ; and as to the argument drawn from this country 4 01 . . ? 00 oord So.. CZ - - Z q g ae rai:: 0 c;.• • 0 ' ternal violence ; but what authority had he for this ? The Soli- felt of a day of reckoning,—no anticipation was entertained having been a party to the severance, equally so was the Emperor C 4 ^' : and Russia, at this moment, expected the treaty to be fulfilled citor-General, indeed, quoted one of Lord Castlereagh's speeches we should afterwards groan under the pressure of those burdens of Russia ; and if so, what right had he to demand the pay- ---- in its true and indisputable spirit. The Hon. and Learned —but in that very speech he found it mostfully declared that the which our prodigal liberality imposed. We preached a Eu- ment ? Mr. Horne contended, that family relations would have Jan. Gentleman supported this view of the question by reference to payment was to be continued so long as it was payable accord- r a opea ra n crusade against French despotism, and r e ic f l o t n he cru ,,e induced the Emperor of Russia to interfere to prevent the sepa- Sunderland the sth article;and contended that Russia would be able justly ing to the terms of his . Majesty's engagements, as specified —as 8 81e . W he re ver any army read y t o fight ration, and what, he asked, had prevented her interference, but speafied in the Conventzon.—(Here the Right Hon. Baronet read offered into the field, ' and having at las t ' our money to bring it to charge Great Britain with breach of faith, if she did not ad- some extracts from a speech of Lord Castlereagh's, in explana- secured our triumph,. we still continued our liberality and ex - that the question resolved itself into two parts. Ist. Were Mi. here to an engagement, solemnly entered into, merely because tion of the treaty of 1815.) But then, said the Attorney - General, trava g ance, from a habit of giving and spending, and wit h nisters bound either strictly and legally, or if not strictly and le- Gateshead unforeseen events had occurred. The spirit and not the pre. do not take the treaty in English. No, it was too plain—it a .t t i ota a l n A'org a tf t ul i n oa es n s a that paper m a o t ney mu t st no t paid lossin gaily, by equity and honour ? 2d. Had Ministers authority North Shields and cise letter of the treaty ought to govern the decision of the spoke positively of th t e ha s t ep ta ari s on ni ly o s t e h v e e r ring d — e th o a f t t is ra t a f o o t r i c o e n ; ? 1 become o permanent debts, of which 'lt g i r s ea not always so a u n nS un de r the e the a la m w e t n o t m v a ,e k r e e t r lii n e e pa i r eg en u t i ? t t I f t e h ey ht n t o o t and 25 18 8 1 5 20 105 38 House. It would be a waste of time to enter into a nice dis- r (C y h P err s s i S g No, ay said the Attorney-General , orl look to the treaty * easy to pay the interest. Among the nations which shared most down to Parliament to ask for authority. y y Sir ou ldward caovnecleuerecel Hepburn Colliery 25 2 0 0 0 2 6 2 cussion of the value of particular terms, when it was obvious in French—(Loud lauter and cheers.) Well, let them look, largely in our liberality, in 1814 and 1815, were the Dutch.— with an appeal to the former professions of Ministers, and ob that the plain intent and meaning of the Act was, that the and what did they fi nd ? Soustraire ala domination—as an_ H avi ng formed the political union between Holland and Bel- served, that if they now gave the sanction of Parliament oche e Newburn swering to pass from; and that this could mean no sever- ', we seemed to think it our duty to secure the contracting ament it would not be ssible without in'ustic to • pi , , j e, withho Wa l ls en d treaty to which it referred should be honestly and faithfully g Parties inan outfit , domestic establishment, and a dowry. We t h e ' es a. ance from external, he proved by quoting the words of Pa payment next year. Mr. Hume, Mr. O'Connell, and a number carried into execution. Here was a positive obligation—void the Dutch Minister, who, in alluding to Luxemburg and began in 1814, when by the treaty of August 13, in that year, we of Members who usually support Ministers, deserted them on 23 only in one case, which case, in the spirit of the treaty, had not Limburg, spoke of their separation from Holland by the words en g a g ed to p a y to Sweden 1,000,0001 . on account of Holland ; to this occasion, and on a division, the numbers were—For the firs t Earsden Colliery... /24 032 4 028 32 4 in fact occurred. de les soustraire a l'autorite legitime—to express the passing advance 2,000;000/. more to assist the King of . the Netherlands in and second resolutions— 25 away . of these in provinces from Holland without foreign force. improving and extending the defences of his kingdom; and to Ayes Sir E. SUGDEN was at a loss to discover the slightest groundll • h H o ll andsuc h f ur th er c h arge s the union of bear equa y w i t h Nothing could his mind be more futile than the arguments Noes 239 Haddington and vi_ on which Government could justify their extreme anxiety to which had been advanced on the other side. The first was, that Belgium with Holland might require, to the amount of other So that Ministers had only a majority of 20. A subsequent divi- cinity, N.B. 24 4 0 0 0 4 54 94 pay away the public money to a foreign Power. He was, in- England was a party to the severance ; this was clearly proved 3,000,0001. Thus we paid or undertook to pay_6,000,0004 by one sion left them a majority of 24. The smallness of the majority deed, surprised at the extraordinary course taken hy the present by dates and events not to be the fact, yet the Ministers held it t .a re n a d t a y lo u r n o r! e e r t t a lie e p o Txt of IV einni f d y s i o ntt e h n li e n a l o i l tahsees/asTieotnhae- is a sutticient evidence of the narrow escape Ministers have had. Tranent, N.B Ministers, who had so o ft en vaunted their desire to spare the forward, ,htniier awnedresealodom eager h ad t 0 he eh s a ee r seen men tin no v , ea t o w i e t s h car or f i r in om e. a 1 the West Indies , —while we sugenlered to him all the otherDua Many tefo of e r t a h oasnedwwheor were, swelled ooon t r h se e n a u w m a b r e e r o s f of th t e he dan mi e n r o t r o ityre which NO - Ftli Berwick, N.B 24 0 2 I 1 0 1 3 2 resources of the people, and had talked so loudly of the respon- (Loud cheers.) For, from our relations with Holland, a crime it colonies in an improved state, which we might have kept as con- they exposed the country by a ' vote calculated to Injure Mini- —.---- sibility of the national representatives. Nothing could be more decidedly would be if the separation had taken place in the words quests without any indemnity at all. Out of the last engage- sters ; but knowing how keenly the country at the present mo. Total 2OO 1 88 127 156 205 12575 $l7 ment, or the 3,000,0004 not similes to any specific bjec, but r and from places where the disease has ceased, inconsistent than the language of the Attorney-General. A of the Attorney-General by our procurement.—(Loud cheers.) meet resents anything like disregard of economy, or carelessness . if we were a party to the severance, equally so . was Russia; to be employed jointly with a similar sum from Holland for the in money matters, they durst . not hesitate . In the House of hich no returns have been thi d and . from w s ay few nights ago he was engaged in warmly maintaining the f urtherance of Dutchobjects, the trea t y o f the t wo grew therefore why should we be asked to continue this payment, the rights of the people, and this evening he had been even more object for which it was made having ceased to exist .—( Cheers.) Holland and England, with Russia, in May, 1815. His Belgic into the discussion at present. a • majority; • laming Chronicle. ..r . ...... latrannnn• in hi. annnnrf of file ororturn•ilro of the Crown ThP a•ollnlPnt cnr it, TsPrnIPTIP/IPV nntipr oil circumstances, was Majesty, in the fullness of his gratitude to the . Allies fo r having Grand Total 2634 902 We were not aware that the Anti-Refo ere had data ;,,...1 Sir E. SUGDEN was at a loss to discover the slightest ground on which Government could justify their extreme anxiety to pay away the public money to a foreign Power. He was, in deed, surprised at the extraordinary course taken hy the present Ministers, who had so often vaunted their desire to spare the resources of the people, and had talked so loudly of the respon sibility of the national representatives. Nothing could be more inconsistent than the language of the Attorney-General. A few nights ago he was engaged in warmly maintaining the rights of the people, and this evening he had been even more strenuous in his support of the prerogative of the Crown.— (Cheers.) Upon this point he had talked in a strain that no Tory Attorney-General, at any former period, had dared to em ploy.—(Much cheering.) The King negociates treaties—the King made treaties, and the House of Commons had nothing to do with them, but tamely to vote the money for carrying them into execution.—(Hear, hear.) The words of the treaty were perfectly clear. The condition on which it was to remain in force no longer existed, and Ministers had no right to call upon the people to furnish sums which were no longer due. A more dangerous doctrine than that of the liberal, reforming, public-money-saving Attorney-General had never been broached within the walls of Parliament; and if it were well-founded, Reform, indeed, was necessary.—(Cheers.) It was singular that those who had defended the course pursued by Ministers had all taken a different ground : the Noble Lord (Althorp); whose plainness was certainly praiseworthy, although it had been quite sufficiently applauded, had dwelt only upon the treaty: the Hon. Under-Secretary (Mr. S. Rice) had endeavoured to shift the onus upon a Noble Lord ; while the Attorney-General, relying upon.his law, had talked of other documents, by which the opinion of the Law Officers ofthe Crown had been guided. As to the Right Hon. Gentleman's law, he (Sir E. Sugden) most solemnly declared that he had heard none.; and upon the subject of other documents, the Right Hon. Gentleman (Mr. S. Rice) and the Attorney-General were at issue. The whole was the plainest and clearest case possible ; the words of the treaty were, " passed away and severed ;" and he would ask whether Belgium had not " passed away" from Holland— whether Belgium had not been severed from Holland ? (Hear, hear, hear.) Words could not be more express; and unless it could be shown that Holland and Belgium were still united, there was an end to the treaty. Hard as it was that our money should go into the coffers of Russia to assist in the views upon Calcutta as set forth in the Moscow Gazette—(Hear! and laughter)—he doubted not that there was not a man in the House who, if Ministers came down to the House and made out a good case, would have refused them the grant.—(Cheers.) But when Ministers ventured to act upon their own responsibility, and assume the right of disposing of the public money, he considered that they should be visited with censure. In conclusion he exhorted the House to sup port the motion : if they did not, they would for ever conclude their right of resisting the payment of this money. The ATTORNEY-GENERAL explained. Lord J. RUSSELL contended that economy was, on the present oceasion, altogether not of the question, when a narrow regard to it would lead to a violation of the national faith. He could not for one sell the faith and honour of England for five millions.—(Cheers.) All his opponents, he remarked, had relied upon the express words of the treaty.—(Hear.) Now he asked if this was a question of the mere letter of the treaty ? They had the opinion of the Law Officers of the Crown that it was not; they had the opinion of Lord Grenville that it was not. —(Laughter, and " no, no.") Did he not state he could not hesi. tate to pay the money, having the sanction of the high legal and political authorities ?—(Laughter)—that the construction of the treaty was to be according to the spirit.—(Loud laughter.) But let him put the case, as it were, for Russia. Might not Russia say to us. You were a party to this separation, and you make it a reason for withholding those sums of money, which you en gaged to pay as long as the Netherlands remained entire—a separation, too, which I have not yet agreed to, and which I, therefore, deny to exist ?—(Hear, hear.) He observed that the Right Hon. Gentleman (Mr. Herries) ought not to have come down to ask for a vote of censure on the Ministers without first applying for papers. How, he would ask, were the Government to act with becoming dignity, if they were to be thus liable to the censure of the House of Commons with out the producticn of full information upon the subject in de bate ? If, indeed, Ministers were entirely unfitted for their situ ation—(Cheers from the Opposition)—he accepted those cheers —(Cheers, and laughter)—the intention of this motion was to drive them out. It was for this purpose all previous inquiry had been withheld.—(Cheers, and laughter.) They might come under the pretence of economy, with their taking sound of retrenchment, which they knew they could not carry into effect—(Hear, hear)—because, having a regard for the honour of England, they would not violate her engagements. But their real object was, to attack a Government that was engaged on a measure which they were anxious to overthrow.—(Hear, and no, no, and laughter.) In conclusion, he hoped that those Hon. Members who spoke of the Noble Lord (Althorp's) can dour, would not impress upon his character the disgrace of having given away the money of the country without due authority, and due consideration for the honour and good faith of England.—(Cheers.) Mr. W. W. WYNN had not seen his Noble Relative's letter, nor had he an opportunity of communicating with him ; but he believed it was quite impossible that Lord Grenville could have expressed his concurrence in that construction of the Act.— (Loud cheers.) He said it was the duty of the Noble Lord to have produced papers, when he should come down with the case to the House. It was not for him now to complain that the House was in want of information.—(Cheers.) He denied that there were only two parties to this affair—Russia and Hol land. There was a third party—the people of England; and the House of Commons sat as Judges on the question, and as guardians of the public purse. Were they to understand that this payment was contrary to the words of the Act, and at the same time be told that they would be committing a breach of faith in not paying it ? Indeed he thought, if the payment were to be continued, Holland could make out as good a case for it as Russia, since it was originally given as a compensation for the Dutch colonies. He would support the motion. Lord J. RUSSELL explained. The latter years of the late war, and the first years of the peace, were to Great Britain the most costly era in her eventful history. The facility of coining money out of rags, and of ob taining loans to any amount, tempted our Government to acts of the most indefensible extravagance. There seemed to be no limit to the drain which the Ministry and the Parliament were disposed to make on the public resources,—they seemed to have no idea that our wealth could be exhausted, or that present pro fusion would lead to future embarrassment. No foreboding was felt of a day of reckoning,—no anticipation was entertained that we should afterwards groan under the pressure of those burdens which our prodigal liberality imposed. We preached a Eu ropean crusade against French despotism, and we paid the cru saders. Wherever any army ready to fight was to be found, we offered our money to bring it into the field, and having at last secured our triumph, we still continued our liberality and ex travagance, from a habit of giving and spending, and with a total forgetfulness that paper money must be paid in gold, and that loans contracted at a great nominal loss become permanent debts, of which it is not always so easy to pay the interest. Among the nations which shared most largely in our liberality, in 1814 and 1815, were the Dutch.— Having formed the political union between Holland and Bel. gium, we seemed to think it our duty to secure the contracting parties in an outfit, a domestic establishment, and a dowry. We began in 1814, when by the treaty of August 13, in that year, we engaged to pay to Sweden 1,000,0001. on account of Holland ; to advance 2,000;000/. more to assist the King of the Netherlands in improving and extending the defences of his kingdom; and to bear equally with Holland such further charges as the union of Belgium with Holland might require, to the amount of other 3,000,0001. Thus we paid or undertook to pay 6,000,0004 by one treaty, under the pretext of indemnifying the King of the Nether lands for the Cape of Good Hope and some useless possessions in the West Indies,—while we surrendered to him all the other Dutch colonies in an improved state, which we might have kept as con quests without any indemnity at all. Out of the last engage ment, or the 3,000,0004 not de;tined to any specific object, but to be employed jointly with a similar sum from Holland for the furtherance of Dutch objects, grew the treaty of the two parties, Holland and England, with Russia, in May, 1815. His Belgic Majesty, in the fullness of his gratitude to the Allies for having driven the French out of Belgium, and for having added so many fine provinces to his Dutch dominions,—.or in payment of a part of the expense which they had incurred in pursuing their victo rious career across the Rhine,—agreed to make them a present, or a compensation, of some 4000,0001. or 5,0041,0004 sterling. The other Allies gave up their share of this windfall to Russia, which had led her armies farthest from home to settleour western Europe, and had suffered most recently from the common enemy, against whom they had all combined. It happened very conveniently that his Russian Majesty had before contracted a debt in Holland to Dutch capitalists from which this present or indemnity would release him. As it was thus for a Dutch object, England was invited, in terms of the treaty of August, 1814, to contribute her share, which was to be limited within 3,000,0001. sterling. This Russian loan amounted to 50,000,000 of Dutch florins, and of this sum Holland contracted the pay the half, or 25,000,000 of florins, and England the other half. The second article of this curious treaty is couched in the following words : " Art. 11. The future charge, to which their said Belgic and Britannic Majesties shall be respectively liable in equal shares on account of the said debt, is to consist of an annual interest of 5 per cent. on the said capitals, each of 25,000,000, together with a sinking fund of 1 per cent. for the extinction of the same, the said sinking fund being subject, however, to be increased on the demand of the Russian Government, to any annual sum not exceeding 3 per colt ; the same to be payable till the capital of the said debt shall be fully discharged, when the aforesaid charge for interest and sinking fund shall wholly cease to be borne by their said Belgic and Britannic Majesties respectively." England and Holland have paid the interest and sinking fund on this loan of 50,000,000 of florins, from the beginning of 1816 to within the last few months, when Holland ceased to make her part of the advances. By the operation of the sinking fund the sum of 25,000,000 of florins has been reduced to little more than 21,000,000, the interest of which we have paid up to the present moment. The reason why Holland has declined to continue the payment, and why our Government has been censured by the Opposition for not doing the same, or at least for paying without obtaining a new sanction from Parliament, may easily be ex plained by an attention to the nature of the valuable considera tion on which the contract was founded, and the particular sti pulation of the fifth article of the tripartite treaty. As the money was advanced to indemnify Russia for enabling the King of Hol land to obtain Belgium, the payment of the loan was only to be continued so long as Belgium was to form part of his dominions. The following is the article to which we have alluded : " Art. V. It is hereby understood and agreed between the High Contracting Parties, that the said payments on the part of their Majesties the King of the Netherlands and the King of Great Britain, as aforesaid, shall cease and determine, should the possession and Sovereignty (which God forbid) of the Belgic provinces at any time pass or be severed from the dominions of his Majesty the King of the Netherlands previous to the com • plete liquidation of the same. It is also understood and agreed between the High Contracting Parties, that the payments on the part of their Majesties the King of the Netherlands and the King of Great Britain, as aforesaid, shall not be interrupted in the event (which God forbid) of a war breaking out between any of the Three High Contracting Parties ; the Government of his Majesty the Emperor of All the Russians being actually bound to its creditors by a similar agreement." With this explanation the debate on the subject in the House of Commons last night will be the more easily understood by the general reader, though we have left ourselves no room to enter upon an examination of the delicate and difficult question to which the treaty and the mode of executing it have given rise. We may only remark by the way, that if Ministers have not acted with perfect legality in continuing the payments to Russia, they have at least acted, in the opinion even of the Opposition, with the most scrupulous regard to the sacred honour of the country; and that if they have erred in the interpretation of the law, they had previously neglected none of the ordinary, ap. pointed, and constitutional means of obtaining the best legal opinion which they could consult on such a subject. Are the Opposition prepared to say that they would have broken the na tional faith without taking advice ? or that they could appeal to other advice than that of the law-officers of the Crown in a clueer tion which involved its maintenance? The House supported the Ministers by a majority of 24.—Times. The everlasting subject the settlement, or rather the unsettle ment, of Belgium, was brought forward last night in the House of Lords by the Earl of Aberdeen, who certainly has contributed all in his power to throw fresh impediments in the way of ar rangement. Long as the question has been before the public, the important consequences attached to it, in connection with the general peace of Europe, combine to give it an interest only second in this country to the question of Reform itself. Bel gium is undoubtedly the Minigters' weak point. But let not Lord Aberdeen exult too confidently ; for the weakest part of the weak policy adopted by this country towards Belgium and Holland was the first step of interference taken in conjunc tion with the Holy Alliance, and under the auspices of Met teraich and Castlereagh, to build a kingdom out of such discordant materials as could not, in the nature of things, be expected to endure. It was in 1814 that the foundation of all this jugglingand legerdemain was laid by Statesmen, to whom Lord Aberdeen and his colleagues look as miracles of sagacity and penetration. It is well for Lord Aberdeen to talk of the in justice of separating Belgium from Holland, when every body knows that Belgium had separated itself from Holland. It was not the act of our Government, but the act of the people of Bel gium; and though we are willing to admit that it was an error on the part of Government to have interfered one way or ano ther in the dispute, it was less erroneous, and less objectionable, than if we had interfered to keep them united, in spite of fate, for the purpose of showing how consistent we could be in absurdity. The question, be it observed, as put by Lord Aberdeen and his party, is not a question be tween interference and non-interference. They would still have interference, but to please them it must have been an inter ference upon one side, and that the side of the Dutch, to put down the Belgic revolution. But would that be the way to pre vent war ? The Senator who could envy Russia the figure which she cuts in this transaction may possibly discover advantages in the prosecution of such a war as would be likely to arise ; but as for peace, a man might dream of it in his sleep to be awakened by the din of battle. The whole history of the negotiations af fords matter enough for objection to those who regard it upon its own merits, and with reference to the true policy of non-inter ference; but it is not for meddling politicians, who quarrel with the popular cause, in favour of which they suppose our Ministers to have been influenced, and not with interference itself—it is not for such politicians to denounce the conduct of others, at the moment when they pronounce their own willingness to embark in schemes more ruinous and less defensible. To the report, however, we refer our readers for the particulars of this important and interesting debate—Morning Herald. We were not aware that the Anti-Reformers had determined to have aregular field-day against Ministers. Such, however, was the case, and their conduct, we trust, will be converted to useful purposes by his Majesty's Ministers. In both instances the at. tack on Ministers was a failure—the motion of the Earl of Aber deen being negatived by a majority of thirty-seven, and that in the House of Commons having been proved to be utterly base less by a speech from Lord Palmerston, who distinctly chewed that the alleged blame did not rest with the present Ministers, but with the arrangements previously entered into. We regret that such a bone of contention should have found its way be. tween the Ministers and their friends, and more es pecially that such a man as Hume, the most unflinching and uncompromising advocate of the Reform Bill, should, either for good or for evil, have lent his strength in support of an anti- Ministerial motion. Now is the time for union ; for union even in the teeth of glaring errors • for what would be the conse quences of disunion compared with the consequences immediate or remote, of a Russian Dutch loan ? We only mention three of them—a Tory Government—anarchy—and revolution. We ought to add, that in the Commons the Opposition met with a defeat similar to that which it sustained in the Lords—the num bers, considering the total number of Members in the House, being triumphant in favour of Ministers.—Morn. Advertiser. The discussions in both Houses of Parliament last night were highly interesting and important. In the House of Lords the Earl of Aberdeen introduced the Belgian question, and, in an elaborate speech, moved an address to his Majesty that the whole of the negotiations on the subject should undergo revision. This motion, equivalent in fact to a vote of censure, gave rise to an unusually long debate. Earl Grey attempted to meet the charge founded on the embarrassments which at present involve our foreign relations by affirming that those difficulties had been bequeathed to him by his predecessors, on whom the responsibi lity therefore rested. The Duke of Wellington, who, we are re joiced to say, appeared in excellent health, replied to this in sinuation by observing that though his Government had undoubtedly induced the belligerent parties to agree to a sus pension of hostilities, he had studiously avoided giving a guarantee to secure that desirable object, though it had been continually urged upon him. The present Ministry on coming into office immediately ventured upon that dangerous step so studiously avoided by their predecessors., and to their rashness in so doing was to be attributed the unsatisfactory and embar rassed situation in which they were now placed. We beg to refer our readers to the admirable and triumphant speech of the illus trious Duke. On a division Ministers saved themselves by a majo rity of 37. The affair of the Russian Dutch Loan was brought for ward in the House of Commons by Mr. Herries, who delivered a very able and lucid speech on the subject. The question at issue's sufficiently simple, and may be thus briefly explained. By the treaty of 1814, which united Belgium to Holland, England assumed the obligation of making, in conjunction with Holland, certain payments to Russia on the loan, in the way both of interest and liquidation of the principal. This treaty also stipulated, as plainly as words could express it, that such payments should cease and determine if ever the Belgian provinces should be dissevered from the dominions of the King of Holland. The separation thus contemplated having taken place, Holland on her part has withheld all further payments. Not so, however, the Government of this country. With all their professions of economy, and in defiance of the letter and spirit of the treaty, our present hopeful Ministers have continued up to the present time to appro. priate the public 'Toney to the purpose of these payments. In doing so they have acted not only without the sanction but in direct violation of the agreement entered upon with Parliament ; and it was well observed by Mr. Herries that if the House should allow such a proceeding to pass unnoticed, it would in effect surrender its controul over the public purse, for Parlia ment had voted certain sums to be paid under particular cir cumstances, but to be no longer available under a certain con tingency expressly specified. What secret views or motives may have prompted the extraordinary course taken by Ministers we know not; certain it is that their conduct has been utterly un justifiable, and so they necessarily feel it. Never, we will ven ture to affirm, were any set of men exhibited in so pitiable a situation as were Lord Althorp and his colleagues last night. Defence was of course out of the question, but in the excuses at. tempted no two of the party coincided. The feeling among all the Members of the House who have the least claim to independ ence was most unequivocally manifested, but unfortunately for the honour of Parliament and of the country a majority have re ceived and accepted commands and are bound by pledges, as ex press and positive as the terms of the treaty of 1814, to vote with Ministers on every possible question that can arise. They last night performed their degrading task. On the two first resolu tions of Mr. Herries, which were simply declaratory of facts, the previous question was carried by a majority of twenty. On the third resolution, which amounted to a vote of censure, Minis ters escaped by a majority of twenty-four.—Morning Post. N.B. Ten eases and two deaths are stated to have occurred at Preston Pans. , (Signed) PRICKS OT THE STOCKS T} Bank Stock - 3 per Cent. Red. 92 300 i 3 per Cent-Cons. ...... ...82%%ki 3% per Cent. 90Y4 Ditto Red 90 WA 90 New 334 per Cent. ....89%%% 3 per Cent. Ann. 1726 .... - 4 per Cent. 1826 9 914% Bunk Long Ann. to expire Jan. 5, 1860 16% 7-16 Oct. 10, 1859 l6 7-16 Jan. 5, 1860 - Jan. 5, 1880 - Aprils, 1880 ..... Jan. 5, 1870 - PRICES OF FOREIGN ruxbs Austrian Bonds . . ...... Belgian Scrip Brazilian bonds Buenos Ayres Bonds Milian Bonds Colombian Bonds Ditto, 1824 Danish Greek Bonds Ditto, 1825 ........... 20 Guatimala...... .......... Mexican Bonds 1825 .35% ERRATA.—In our Parliamentary Sir E. Sugden rose together, i for the " latter," it should be part, for " Mr. Horne," read Mr. HUNT said the vote of gentlemen on this question would be as anxiously regarded by the country as any vote of the ses sion. He alluded to the contrast between the speech of the Attorney-General that night and his speech at Nottingham, of which some few victims had, ere this, probably expiated their crimes. A vote of censure was the least thing which should happen to the Ministry.—(Laughter and cheers.) He would not go so far as to impeach them ; but he would willingly vote for making them pay the money out of their own pockets.— (Laughter and cheers.) Sir R. PEEL rose amidst loud cries of " Adjourn" from the Treasury Benches. He said he hoped at least that those gentle men who clamoured for adjournment would not accuse him and his friends of wishing to delay the Reform Bill.—(Loud cheers.) Seeing the arguments which had been brought forward in oppo sition to the motion, he did not suppose the House would con sent to an adjournment.—(Cheers.) The question did really lie in a very small compass. What was the real character of the question ? It was not if there existed on the part of this country ,an engagement—an honourable obligation. The question was whether a subordinate department of Government was justified, by the term of the Act of Parliament, in making a payment to Russia, in the same manner as before the separation of Belgium from Holland? When, therefore, the Noble Lord (Russell) said that nobody had given an opinion as to the honourable en. garment, the answer simply was, that nobody was prepared to express that opinion, because he had not that Information which would enable him to form an opinion. When the Noble Lord laid the documents on the table, he might have a different opinion upon the subject from that which he had at present, and far was he from wishing to derive any advantages from a technical construction; for if an equitable or moral obligation could be made out, he cared not for the letter of the law. But he would not consent to pay money by virtue of an Act which gave no authority for the payment of that money.—(Cheers.) There could not be a doubt that they were not justified by that Act. If there were secret engagements had not the time arrived now, after the lapse of 15 years, when, without inconvenience, they might be laid before Parliament, and the nature of the engage. ment which they involved publicly declared? Or if the time had not come, it was decidedly the duty of Ministers to communicate to the House, by a message from the Crown, that such engage. ments subsisted, and that it was not consistent with the good of the public service to make them public.—(Loud cheers.) Or, if recent events made it fitting that we should persevere in this payment, then, likewise, should Ministers have come down to the Housef Commons and declared the fact ; and if they could not disclose all the circumstances, ask for a vote of credit —(Cheers.) But certainly they should not have taken that most unwarrantable course of vindicating this issue by authority which did not exist.—(Loud cheers.) But the House of Com mons never would support such an erroneous, such a gross con struction of the Act of Parliament.—(Cheers.) The very course pursued by Government proved their conviction that they were doing that which was not right. The Chancellor of the Ex chequer sheltered himself under the wing of the Solicitor-Ge neral, the Noble Paymaster crouched under the gown of Lord Grenville—(Loud cheers, and laughter)—and finding Lord Grenville's authority against him, and as a last hole wherein to rush, he earths himself in Reform.—(Loud cheers.) He said his opponents brought forward the question to defeat Reform, and this was a bait for those who had truly and honourably sup ported him in the Reform Bill.—(Loud cheers.) Was there ever an argumentum ad kominem so childish ?— ( Loud cheers.) So, because men had agreed with Government the Reform Bill, they come to surrender the humble privilege in terpret a simple treaty and A ct of Parliament. —( Continued cheering.) And as to what th e Noble on of being able to Lordhad said about sur prise, he could distinctly declare there was n ur o ise. Lo d cheers.) So far back as the 15th of ere h r h a himself stated his doubts upon the question, and recomm endede Then followed several cries of " Go on ;" mingled with 44 Ad jourd, adjourn!" Lord ALTHORP then rosy, and expressed a hope that the Hon. Member would withdraw his proposition for adjourning the debate, as indeed the debate had come to a close. He beseeched the House to come to a decision of the question, as it was one which affected his Majesty's Government, and it would be acting unfairly towards them were the matter not pressed to a close. Mr. PAGET then consented to withdraw his proposition. Mr.IHERRIES, in reply, said that it was one of the most extra ordinary features in the debate which he had ever witnessed, after eight hours' discussion, to find the Noble Lord,the Foreign Secretary, gravely talking of the separation of Belgium from Holland bei9saft doubtful, and in the very teeth of the King's h or rng Berries) r t i r es m o e u n g t Parliament.—(Hear, fairlyH a r a , n h d ear. ) irie ec q h ue a s t ti l o ' n e un answerably put by himself and those who thought with him, and he trusted the House would accede to his motion. _ _ _ --------- Lord PALMERSTON denied that he had so stated the fact respecting the separation of Belgium from Holland. What he had stated was this, that he had great doubts whether the King of the Netherlands admitted that the sovereignty of the country had departed from the House of Orange.—(Hear.) The House then divided on the two first resolutions, when the numbers were— Noes 239 Ayes 219 Majority for Ministers The remaining resolution was then put (strangers be ng still excluded) ; when there appeared— Against it 238 In favour 214 Majority for Ministers The orders of the day were then put ; and, at a Quarter to Four this morning, the House adjourned. SHIPPING INTELLIGENCE-(THIS DAY.) FROM LLOYD'S. DEAL, JAN. 26.—Wind W.S. W.— Arrived from the river and remains, the Duchess of Athol, Daniel, for China. About noon this day the hull of a vessel was seen on the Godwin Sands, " Wm. Atkins, of Dublin," marked on the sails, supposed to have been schooner rigged. PORTSMOUTH, J.st. 26.—Wind N.E.—Sailed the General Hewitt, Bankier, for the Mauritius. LIVERPOOL, JAN. 25.—Arrived otf port, the Scipio, —, from Charleston ; and Ann, M'Kenzie, bound to Demerara, put back leaky. SCILLY, JAN. 24.—The Hecla, Jameson, from Dundee to New York, commenced discharging yesterday into boats, there not being sufficient water for the pier. The cargo is apparently in tolerable good order, and the vessel does not seem to have sus. tamed much damage. MARGATE, JAN. 26.—The Harmony, Edwards, from Bangor to London, has been stripped, and all the stores, materials, &c. landed, and part of the cargo. The Herd, Gagner, from Sierra Leone to London, has dis charged a portion of her cargo, part of it damaged, and will be repaired without landing the remainder. THE FUNDS.-(THIS DAY.) CITY. TWELVE 0' CLOCK. We have no arrivals this morning of any consequence, not even a ship letter has come to hand. THE FUNDS. There were keen and long-continued debates in both Houses last night, arising out of our connection with the Netherlands. The proceedings in the Commons commenced by a motion of Mr. Perceval for a fast. The Hon. Member moved the Standing Order from an idea that none but very sanctified persons like the Members of the House were a fit audience, to one whom he evi dently conceives to be especially favoured of Heaven. His speech seemed to say, " Come not near me, for I am holier than thou : these are a smoke in my nose, a fire that burneth all the day." He began by displaying the usual tact of priests, in anathematis ing a want of reverence to himself as a want of reverence to God. " He rose," he said, " to address the House in the name of Our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ, who is exalted King of Kings and Lord of Lords ;" and added, with characteristic modesty, " it was for the glory of his name, and in his name, that he implored the House to attend with reverence to one add r ess i ng them in his name. Does not the Hon. Member remember the maledictions pronounced against those that take his name in vain ? In a country blessed with the presence of a whole army of the suc cessors of the Apostles, is it not presumption in him to thrust himself forward as a divine messenger ? Where are the dignitaries of the Church ? Has his Grace of Canterbury become a dumb dog, that Mr. Perceval must make himself the spiritual organ ? How can we expect the multitude to respect the powers that be, if this layman step forward to reproach them with their silence in an emergency, when, if we are to believe him, if we do not follow his advice, all the curses that ever took effect on a nation are about to overtake us ? Why have none of the Spi ritual Lords stood up in their high places to demand a fast ? Why have they not avail.d themselves of their access to Majesty to rescue their devoted nation from the calamities that Mr. Per ceval denounces ? We would have the Church to look to it. If every man, on the strength of possessing the inspired volume, is to claim reverence as an expounder of it, what may our Aposto heal Church hitherto so jealous on this subject, expect ? We are sure that if the Church had been aware that the nation were on the point of suffering one-tenth part of the plagues denounced by the Hon. Gentleman, they would not have been silent, but spoken the truth in season and out of season ; and we there fore look upon the address of the Hon, Gentleman as an in direct mode of conveying reproach against the Church, for be ing backward in its duty on this occasion. Ministers have yielded to the Hon. Gentleman's call for a general fast. He thought " they had assented to it more for the sake of getting rid of the question, than for any better motive." This places either Ministers or the Church in a grievous dilemma. Either the Church has demanded a fast and been refused, in which case they have put an affi•ont on the Church and granted that to Mr. Perceval which they refused to the Bishop:.; or the heads of the Church have failed to recommend that which Ministers show by their concession to Mr. Perceval they deem necessary to avert the dangers suspended over the country, and this would be condemning the Church of neglect of duty. But we shall leave the parties to settle their respective shares of merit or demerit—and pass on to humbler matters. Mr. Herries brought the subject of the debt from which Russia was relieved by Holland and England before the House, in a distinct speech, in which he recited the stipula tions of the various treaties which had been entered into by the Government of this country on the subject. The strongest sti pulation was one in the second treaty, which declared " That it is hereby understood and agreed between the high contracting pa rties that the said payments on the part of their Ma j esties the King of the Netherlands and the King of Great Britain, shall cease and determine, should the possession and Sovereignty (which God forbid) of the Belgic provinces at any time pass or be severed from the dominions of the King of the Netherlands, previous to the complete liquidation of the same." Holland had ceased to pay her share; but in spite of the probibition contained in the treaty, and notwithstanding the example of the other co artner, Ministers had continue d the p a yment after the Belgian provinces had passed from the King of the Netherlands. " This Was not, he contended, a debt from this country to Russia, but only a debt in concurrence with Holland. Yet the conductwhich had been pursued would go to show that it was a debt from this country to Russia, not with the concurrence of Holland, but alone.' Lord Althorp contended that it was not a question of economy but good faith—that it was perfectly clear the provision against disseverence clearly contemplated external violence, and not internal commotion. " The Right Hon. Gentleman (observed his Lordship) had said the object of the treaty was to cause the union between Holland and Belgium by paying part of the loan to Russia—that it was made for the benefit of Russia; and the intention was to make it the interest of Russia to prevent the severance of Belgium from Holland. In short, that England was bound to pay a share of the loan, in order to induce Russia to use her influence to give protection to the union of the two countries. Now, for himself, he thought that it would be dis honourable, after being parties to a breach of the condition-- namely, the union between the two countries—to take advan. The important debates last night in both Houses entirely ab sorb the attention of the public, who are eagerly reading the variout speeches with strict attention, which are viewed in diffe rent ways according to self-interest, particularly amongst the stock-jobbers. The Bulls are of opinion that Earl Grey's speech upon the affairs of Belgium is candid and honest, and the latter part which we give is pacific, it is as follows : fi He had no reason to think that Russia, Prussia, and Austria would not ratify: the treaty; and if the present negociations should be broken off, he should be happy if any other means equally honourable to this country could be adopted for securing the peace of Europe, but he believed there could be little pro spect of siich an issue. The unanimous feeling, however, of the four great Powers of Europe led him still to hope that the whole matter would eventually be brought to a satisfactory conclusion." But the Bears are of opinion that the Duke of Wellington's speech is of a very warlike tendency, and that the 'four Powers will not ratify the treaty without the sanction of the King of Holland. These, at present, are the various opinions of the great speculators, in consequence of which the Funds remain very steady, without any business doing. We stated a few 'days since that a hint was given to the King of Holland, that in case he refused to ratify the treaty that King Leopold would take a large body of Poles into his service. This is confirmed to-day in a French Paper. According to accounts from Antwerp, it appears that some symptoms of insubordination had prevailed in the corps of miners, owing to the soldiers having refused to take the oath, in consequence of which several officers have been arrested. They write from Bologna of 15th January, that the Austrians have marched a corps of 2,000 men, with four pieces of cannon, to the mountains of Bettona, where they have fortified them selves. This movement is to cut off the retreat of the patriots, who are going to Tuscany., Consols, which left off' yesterday at 82% for the Account, opened at 82!4 sellers ; this decline may b e attributed to the French Rentes coming lower by the estafette, (65t 90c.) owing to the report of the Opposition in France going to bring forward a motion to deprive the Ministers of making use in future of the sinking fund. HALF-PAST ONE. All the speculation in the cityat the pres ent h ouris in regard to f ore ign politics, and various are the topics of eonversation o n the subject. By some it is asserted that if thitewKiliingcaoufse a changeholdsHollandof out il3 nui f ss o et r roy fa. Commons, any The, n length m n os sa, l of also mt givesrfp e r ttoy greatco whackr a iopes to the Anti-Reformers the Ministers h a d i n th e i that they are losing ground ; but all this at present is only what the French call building a Chateau en Espagne and mere specula tion, but no doubt in a few days we shall have more po s iti ve in formation' to communicate on the subject. Consols continue rather heavy, at &i 9 for account, and 82 1 ,4 % for money, with little doing. We have this moment learnt that two commercial houses of im portance had stopped payment. THREE 0' CZ 0 CK. Consols, 82i We have received yesterday's proceedings of the Court-Martial now in the course of holding at Bristol, on Captain WARRINGTON, but from the unusual press of Parliamentary reports, we are unavoidably compelled to postpone them till to-naorrow. Report, when Mr. Baring and t is stated that the House called for the " former." In another " Sir Wm. Home." eslllli* "IP,* LONDON, FRIDAY EVENING, JANUARY 27, 1832. The proceedings in Parliament were last night of unusual interest, and in their consequence of an important character. The Opposition, not content with having already repeatedly discussed the Bel gian question, renewed their attack on Ministers, under the pretext of the Russian Dutch loan ; but they were defeated in both Houses. Lord ABERDEEN'S motion, which was in effect a vote of censure, was rejected by a majority of 37. In the Commons, Mr. BERRIES' series of resolutions respecting the Dutch loan were rejected, after two divisions, by a majority of only 20 in the first and 24 in the second division. The smallness of the majority is to be ac counted for by several of the Reform Mem bers, Mr. HUME, Mr. O'CONNELL, and others voting against Ministers, simply upon the ground of economy. The real question at issue was the propriety of Ministers paying the stipulated portion of the interest on the Dutch loan to Russia, after the separation of Holland and Belgium had actually occurred—a contingency provided for in the treaty, Holland refused to pay her portion in consequence of the separation —and the Opposition last night contended that England ought also to have refused paying her portion. Ministers argued, and with justice, that if England ceased to pay her portion, war with Russia would be the consequence. Under these circumstances Ministers felt that they would be hazarding the peace of Europe, at a mo ment when its preservation was of the most vital importance. Placed in this dilemma, they acted more in the spirit of the treaty than according to the letter. In a strictly legal sense they had ne right to pay it. It was in this view that Mr. HUME and others opposed them, but as a matter of national honour and good faith, they felt bound to do as they had done. The question is unfortunately one on which much may be said on both sides, and the Opposi tion so considered it, forgetting that if in power they would have done just as Ministers had acted. Next to the fact that the people of this country pay the money, is our regret that Russia should be nefit by it. We direct particular attention to the closing ob servations in the Duke of WELLINGTONS speech last night on the Belgian question. His Grace there pretty broadly insinuates that the passing of the Reform Bill will be the signal for civil war. In deed he not only insinuates this, he absolutely holds it forth as a threat. " Their Lordships," his Grace observed, " had of late heard a good deal about foreign war upon this subject, and about civil war upon another subject; but he would call upon their Lordships not to take alarm at these threats, for there was no danger of either, unless the system of the Noble Lords opposite were adopted." So the truth has come out at last ! If Ministers give up Reform, then there shall be none, if they persevere, then there shall be a civil war. Really his Grace is wonderously condescending in offering this mild alternative to the country t It is 'a pretty convincing proof, we think, that conciliation has not yet made much progress with the Ultra party. But we tell that faction, that bluster as they will, their day is past ; the KING, the Government, and the people, are too strong for them. Reform is the only effec tual measure to prevent a civil war. Neither the French nor German papers received to-day contain any news FRENCH FUNDS, JAN. 24.-Five per Cents., 96f. 95f. 95c. 96f. 96f. 25c. 20c. 15c. 10c. sc. 10c. sc. 96f 96E sc. 26f. 96f. 10c. sc. 10c. 20c. 25c. 30c. 35c. 45c. 35c. 40c. 35c. 30c. 40c. ; Four per Cents. Rentes, 80f. ; Three per Cents.. 66f. 65f. 90c. 66f. 66E sc. 66f. 66f. sc. 15c. 66f. 65f. 85c. 95c. 66f. 66E 10c. 35c. 40c. 30c. 35c. 40c. ; Rank Actions, 1,610 f. ; Rente de Naples, 77f. 15e. 77E 76f. 75c. 77f. 76f. 75c. ; Royal Spanish Loan, 73 72% 73 73%; Rente Per petuelle d'Espagne, 53 53 1 ,E %53 53% 5353% 1 ,4 ; Haytian Loan, 220 E-Exchange on London, one month, paper, 25E 35c.; money, '2sf. 30c.; three months, paper, 251. 20c. ; money, 25f. 15c. NEW STRAND THEATRE. This theatre was opened for the first time last night. The en tertainments were preceded by an address, written by Mr. J. A. Williams, for the occasion, and spoken with much effect by Miss Cleaver (from the Theatre Royal, York). There were many hits at the conduct of those managers who are gifted with " patent right," which were eagerly caught by the audience, and loudly applauded. The address was succeeded by the national anthem of " God save the King," sang by the whole company, and was most lustily cheered. The first piece was entitled " Profes sionals Puzzled, or Struggles at Starting,"which abounded with wit and humour, and was, from beginning to end, a ",slap" at the patent houses, and their conversion from legitimate acting to the arenas of wild beasts. We were highly gratified at the merits of the performers, most of whom were before un known to a London audience. " Mystification" and " Loved Frailties" followed ; in the latter piece the well-known comic powers of Mr. Rayner, the proprietor, were displayed to great advantage, and he was loudly cheered. We must not omit to notice Miss Matley, Miss Cleaver, and Miss Ferguson, whose performances throughout the evening displayed great talent. An apology was made for the indisposition of Mrs. Waylett, whose character in " Mystification" was ably sustained by Miss Cleaver. The following address was spoken by Miss Cleaver : A woman speak a prologue! who before, Ladies at least, e'er heard of such a bore? In Epilogues, I grant, it is their duty To learn your pleasure, and with smiles salute ye : But so it is—'till something else diverts ye, They've sent me forward just to make —a curt'sy. Well, here I am.—Aye, all 1 see's compact, I vow our Manager has shewn some tact. But, Heav'ns ! No Gallery ! Iliads and Oddysys !" 'Tis downright trea son 'ga i n s t the Gods and Goddesse s . No matter ! leave their Godships and their spous es , o Mino r., fu s ty, black, e,hlsle iii n jealous. In charity, to aid the larger Rouses: For much I fear, if signs I read aright, Like Schedule A, they're in a woful plight, While we, more fortunate, may chance to b e E n f ra nchised by a clause in Schedule C. These Majors, in good sooth, are pretty f e ll ows, ttohoeb,Tr paf t be the Jury, te l n Certain your verdict will be just and tr ue— You the Grand Jury (to the Boxes), Speci a l J urors, you (to the Pit). all Let them their cause to quibbling lawyer s t rust, But W a i r t if onboasts, ventne y We fear no actions while our own are just. In this our little sphere we meet to-night, Without monopoly, or " Patent Right." We stand for justice and will never waver, Nor grasp at aught—except your special favour. Expect not here the majesty and grace That beam'd from Siddons' splendid form and face; Expect not here the lofty mien and mood Of Caius Marcius—by the Volscians woo'd ; Expect not here that Tragedy will sweep Through five long acts—at best to make you weep. No, here we mean in lighter wares to deal, And hope to make ye laugh as well as feel. But e'en these walls, unblazoned yet in name, May not unhonoured be, or void of fame. Merit may here her virgin blush display, The modest dawning of a radiant day. The vet'ran, too, with laurels covered o'er, May here, perchance, still reap one harvest more. The Comic Muse may here her levee hold, With wit for spangles, and with sense for gold ; Troops of light spirits round her gaily glide, With Humour broad, and Laughter at his side; New Jordans and new Fanny Kellys start, To teach us nature, and to touch the heart ; Mundens and Listons of a future race, Triumph in matchless excellence of face; And, with the sanction of your genial smiles, You here may find a rustic Tyke or Giles. On such slight grounds we humbly plead our cause, Ambitious but to merit your applause; Happy, 'midst rivals North, South, West, and East, To be, though last, in your esteem not least. But one word more—our Manager requests His warmest greetings unto all his guests. Ladies ! to you he charges me to say, His grateful homage he shall ever pay; But, for my part, I think it not less due, Kind gentlemen, to add our thanks to you. Permit me now to bid ye welcome here, And wish ye, each and all, a glad new year. COURT CIRCULAR. Their Royal Highnesses the Duchess of Kent and the Princess Victoria rode at Mr. Fozard's Riding School, on Wednesday. Mons. Moreno, the Minister from Buenos Ayres, and the Right Hon. Sir Frederick Lamb, transacted business yesterday, at the Foreign-office. Prince Talleyrand, the French Ambassador, had an interview with Viscount Palmerston on Wednesday, at the office of the Secretary of State for Foreign Affairs. Viscounts Palmerston and Melbourne visited Earl Grey, on Wednesday, at the Treasury. transactedSirFrberuiscikn business yesterday y t a h t e th L e ie c u o te lo n n a i n a t i-o G iti oy c e e rn . or of Malta, Mr. Lester M.P. for Poole, an d Si r J o h n Byng, had interviews with Viscount Goderich on Wednesday, at the Colonial-office. THE MARKETS.-(THIS DAY.) CORN EXCHANGE. The arrivals of all descriptions of Grain this week are con siderable, with a good return of Flour. We cannot quote (any article lower than on Monday; but business is exceedingly limited at that day's prices. Flour of secondary:qualities is ot. fering at lower rates. ARRIVALS. Wheat. Barley. Oats. I Flour. Irish English 16 9,434 632 qrs. s,64osacks. 7,117 , Foreign - --- brig. WM. MACLEAN. Secretai [IS DAT AT ONE O'CLOCE. New 5 per Cent. — India Stock .... .... 193 Ditto Bonds 1:;9 pm. South Sea Stock 91% Old Annuities -- New Ditt0.,...... ..., --- 3 per Cent. Ann. lEx. Bills, X1,000...13 12 13 pm. Ditto .. ... Ditto Small 13 12 14 pm. Ditto pin. Ditto Advertised Bank for Opening India fer Account . Cons. for Feb. 28 92%5 THIS DAY AT ON! O'CLOCk. Neapolitan. 0000000 •••••••••• •••••• Peruvian B onds ...... ; - Portuguese Bonds Prussian. Old Ditto, New Russian ipanish, 1321......... ......... 1823. —• French Rentes, Sp. c. --L Exchange -- - 3 per cent....... Exchange —t Dutch Scrip 40% DIED. On the 25th inst. after a few hours' illness, Lady Sarah Tour nay Staines, the wife of George Gunning, Esq. of Frindebury and Dent de Lion, in the county of Kent. On Friday last, at his residence, '7B, Marlborough-street, Dublin, aged 49 years, Alexander Nimmo, Esq. civil engineer, F. R. S. E., M. R. I. A, M. G. S. L , &c. These honorary distinctions are but as dust when weighed in the balance—when compared with the sterling talent and intrinsic merit of this excellent and lamented individual. Eulogium is unnecessary, as the word Ireland alone will be both his most merited monument and suitable epitaph ; no man so well understood . the rem e di es re quired for its practical evils ,• and the effects, not alon e o f his foresight, but his actual works, will be felt long after the very remembrance of his name will have passed away. As a theorist and scientific member of his profession, he has left no equal; and, in conclusion, it may safely be said, '• the British empire, in general, has sustained an:almost irreparable loss."—Li verpo ol Courier. PRINTED AND PUBLISHED BY M U RD 0 YOUNG, AT THE SUN Orrics, 112, STRAND, LONDON.