The Sun. — London, England, 1822-02-22 00:00:00

OUTRAGE AT GLASGOW. . The house in Clyde-street, immediately to the east of the town" hospital, which has been occu pied for some time by Mr. Provand, partly as a dwelling, and 'partly as a manufactory for paints, was last night (Sunday last) completely sacked by an infuriated mob, every pane of glass being broken, and the whole furnitNre torn down and tossed into the river., The cause of this outrage is discreditable to the intelligence of the popu lace, for it is said they .were collected together, and urged on, by the report that a number of children had been seduced into the house from time to time, and made away with for the pur pose of making red paint with their blood.— Some who were above being gulled by such non sense, got an idea that dissecting operations were carried on in the house, and they became equally indignant at the unfortunate proprietor. These stories have been in circulation for some time, and are said to have 'originated in two chil dren looking through one of the windows, and seeing some of the clothes of the workmen lying on the' floor, besmeared with red paint, they re ported that. murder had been committed in the house. There were four previous attempts made, • three of them on Sunday evenings, to raise a mob about the house, but the boys who then collected were easily driven away by the inmates.. Last evening, however, there was a determined point made against the house, and the assailants were Many of them well-grown men. The attack .commenced, as usual, by the younger descrip . 'tions throwing stones at the windows, to which succeeded the more important operations of breaking open the doors and windows, tearing down the furniture and throwing it into the street, froth whence it was speedily conveyed into the Clyde. I t,was four o'clock when the mob began to act, and none of the Magistrates being immediately at hand, it was about five when the Master of Police arrived with some infantry, and soon after 'the Lord Provost, who had been previously on the spot, returned with a party of cavalry. Before this, some police-officers had come to the place, and carried off a few prisoners, but they were totally inade quate for any effectual resistance. Some gentle men, thinking that the appearance and remon strances of respectable people would bring the mob to reason, made their way into the house, but they were so rudely assailed, that part of them were glad to effect their escape, and the remainder barricadoed themselves in the upper floor. The arrival of the military put a stop to all further attack ; indeed the mob had left themselves nothing to do in the way of demoli tion ; but there being little appearance of disper sion, the Riot Act was read, but not acted upon. Upon the arrival of the military a number of prisoners were made, six of whom were taken in. the house. The evening became gradually more tranquil, and the cavalry returned to their barracks about 12 o'clock ; but a party of the in fantry, with some of the police, remained in the house all night. The loss occasioned by this in famous outrage will be severely felt by the inhabitants, as it is provided by the last Police Pill, that they are to be assessed for all damages to the city committed by mobs. The Magistracy have offered a reward of '2OO guineas for infor mation which may lead to the apprehension and conviction of the offenders.—(Glasgow Herald.) LAW INTELLIGENCE. COURT OF KING'S BENCH, FEB. 21. STREET V. SMITH AND OTHERS. This was an action against the Hundred of Ossulstonc, to recover 331. 14s. the amount of damage done to the COURIER Office in the Strand, by a tumultuous mob, which assembled on the night the Bill of Pains and Penalties was given up in the Rouse of Lords. The breaking of the windows and the amount of the repairs being proved, the Jury found a verdict for the Plaintiff, damages 331. 14s. Q:IAPPEL AND ANOTHER V. THE CALEDONIAN SOCIETY. The plaintiffs sought to recover 2711. for publishing select music. It appeared that a dinner was given in 1815, at Free „n'asons' Hall, to promote a Charitable Institution, called the "-aladonian Society, and on the occasion the Company were t ntertaineci with %ocal and instrumental Music. The late Se clitary of the Society, some time after, gave the plaintiffs an -:der to publish and sell the music for the benefit of those who I %'re objects of the Charity. It was accordingly printed and Ptthlithed by the plaintiffs ; but the Secretary having with c'z'awn himself, payment was resisted on the ground that the ' , Tiler had not been given by the defendants' authority. The plaintiffs failed in proving theliability of the defendants, 4 t41 am nonsuited. OAKS','. CRAUFORD. , In this case Captain Oaks, of the Guards, sought to recover ; 20 guineas paid for a blood h ose, repres e nte d to be sound, but which turned out lame. t rne plaintiff, through the medium of a friend of the name of - "carpe bought the horse at Newmarket, and soon after dis v-QvcredVe lameness,which according to the evidence of a ve 4nary surgeon had been long incipient. It was supposed the 1 t .gad been lamed in training for the Derby Stakes. t r:eze Jury found a verdict for the plaintiff for the whole of Iteney paid, and the subsequent keep. COURT OF COMMON PLEAS, FE8.21. CRIM. CON.-IiAYES V. BONUS. This was an action in which the plaintiff, C. Hayes, sought to ~; ' c,c4vcr damages of the defendant, Wm. Bonus, Esq. for 4 'unal conversation alleged to have takeniplace between him ,„twi, the wife of the plaintiff: The.damages were laid at 5001. ' ' 1 ! plaintiff was in comparatively very humble circumstances, t r lq, was in the service of a bookseller as a foreman, and was ilin business necessarily greatly from home. The defendant fa ng a roan in opulent circumstances, an "army agent, and was advanced in years. Some witnesses attempteL.l to prove the -rr runality of the parties, but their evidence was utterly in 41ViLle. e " erjeant V A u aL TAN, on the part of the defendant, comment on the details of the case, which were, he said, the most t l T 4 'erfully revolti ng th at ever h e h a d me t w ith i n th e c o u rse of 4 „ , f-penence as an advocate. 1.,,,-;ttref Justice DALLAS, in summing up, said it was imps ;twto see th at t hi s was not an attem p t to get money , an d h e de d that, in his opinion, it would be unsafe• to believe the Tear thwitnesses who deposed to the fact of the adultery. di n e Jury , without an instant's deliberation, returned a ver et e defendant. THE MARKETS. CORN EXCHANGE, FEB. 22. W e have very large arrivals coastways, and also a good sup- NY by land samples, but we still continue in the same inactive Mate as to sales, having so few buyers to-day, that it is diffi ult to say the actual prices, but we consider them merely no n:anal for all kinds of grain, and the inferior still remaining without purchasers, though offerred on lower terms. SMITHFIELD MARKET, FEE. 22. There was a regular supply of Cattle at market this morning, and good meat sold at the same prices as on last Monday, but th at of an inferior description was heavy sale, and the prices i uwer. The-price of Hay remains the same. Bee f ............ 2s 8d to 3s 10d j Veal Alittton ......... 2 $ 8 4 to 4s 4d f Pork PA RI. J AMEN T. NOUSE OF LORDS, THURSDAY, FEE. 21. ASSIZES. The Loan CHANCELLOR, brought in a Bill to enable Judges of Assize in case of delay and in terruption in their arrival, to open the Assize en the day following that specified in the Commis sion, on explaining the reasons of their delay.— Read a first tine and ordered to be printed. STATIONARY IN IRELAND. The Earl of DARNLEY' seeing a Noble Vis count in his place, wished to remind him of the pledge which he had given last year, that an in quiry should take place in the mode of supplying Stationary to the Government Offices in Ireland, a mode which he (Lord D.) considered as attend ed with gross abuse and loss to the public. He wished to.know, whether, during the residence of the Noble Viscount, and of his Majesty in Ireland, an inquiry had been instituted into the conduct of the individual charged with those practices—an individual of whom it was but jus tice to say, that during the King's visit, whatever other allegations might exist against him, he had conducted himself in a manner w hich did him the highest credit, by using his best exertions to give effect to the conciliatory recommendations of his Majesty. Should he find that the promised in vestigation had not taken place, he should think it his duty to bring the subject once more before their Lordships. Viscount SIDMOUTII said, that it was in conse sequence of an assurance given him by the late Right Hon. Chief Secretary for Ireland, before the Noble Lord had made any motion on the subject, that he felt himself authorised last year to state that an inquiry would take place. When in Ireland, he had again spoken to the same Right Hon. Gentleman, who had informed him that an inquiry was at that very moment .proceed ing. Of its result, he (Lord Sidmouth) was ig norant. The Earl of DAnNLEy knew that an inquiry had been instituted, and, Papers laid on their Lordships' table sometime since ; but it was in consequence of those not being satisfactory, that he had called for further elucidation. Viscount SIDMOUTII had been informed by the late Chief Secretary for Ireland ; that it was on the very points which the Noble Earl had re presented as not satisfactorily explained that the inquiry was pending. After a few words from the Earl of Luta- POOL. The Earl of atnNr.ry stated, that unless some information should be laid on the table upon this subject before Easter, he should consider it duty to bring the question before the House. ST:ITE OF THE COUNTRY. The Earl of Liveiteoot had requested a few hours, when their Lordships last met, before he answered the question put by a Noble Marquis, respecting the most convenient course for bring ing the state of the country before the House. lie could now say, that he would be prepared at an early day to move for certain Estimates, similar to those which had been produced in another place, and for other documents calcu lated to throw light upon the state of the- coun try, before any measure was brought up from the other House. As he understood that Monday would not be a convenient day, be should pro pose Tuesday next, and should move that their Lordships be summoned on that day. The Marquis of LANSDOWNE concurred in the arrangement mentioned by the Noble Earl. He did not wish to hurry the House into a prema ture decision with respect to the measures pro posed, or even into an expression of its senti ments ; but when such important objects as Taxation, the Funded System, and the Currency of the Country, were in question, he thought it proper that their Lordships should be well in formed on the subject before the Bills were brought up from the other House. Once re ceived, it would be too late to have an effective investigation. The question was then put and carried, and their Lordships were ordered to be summoned for Tuesday next. AGRICULTURAL DISTRESS. Earl STANHOPE held a Petition, signed by 6 or 700 owners and occupiers of land in the coun ty of Kent, who complained of Agricultural Dis tress, and prayed for Relief and the Reduction of the Taxes. Ile did not think it necessary to enter at length upon those topics, as they were to be discussed on Tuesday, and he hoped there would be many opportunities to inquire into the causes of that general and unexampled distress which now prevailed. He did not agree with those who attributed it to the great importation of corn which had taken place some years ago, for its operation could not have lasted so long, and the prices were higher when it lasted than they were now. Neither was corn the sole pro duce of the country which had been reduced in value. Cattle was equally depreciated, and yet there had been and could be no importation of foreign cattle. Some maintained that ex cess of production and not excess of importa tion had occasioned the existing distress, but the real cause was one much more natural and more difficult to remove—excess of taxation. —The prices were the same in 1792 as they were at present, and there was no distress, be cause only fifteen or sixteen millions were then raised in taxes, whereas the enormous sum of 55 millions was now levied from the people. The same distress existed in other countries, where taxation, hearing no just proportion to their na tural means, was imposed to support great mili tary establishments improper in time of peace.— The only remedy was to reduce the public bur thens to the same amount as the value of the currency had been lowered. For that purpose the interest of the national debt must be reduced 30 or 50 per cent., and if any such proposition was made, he should be ready to contend that the measure was a just one, and involved no breach of public faith. The revenue had been described as flourishing, but it had not been stated whether the taxes were paid by the people out of their capital or out of its produce. He believed that in a short time they would not be paid at all. He called upon their Lordships to pause and meditate before they ventured cn that fatal measure, the resumption of Cash Payments. If it were attempted to force it into execution, nothing but national bankruptcy could ensue.— intreated their Lordships to look at the state of Ireland, which did not arise from po:itical or religious causes, but from the distress which had originated in 1819, when the measure for resum ing of Cash Payments was adopted. He in-, treated them, in justice to all the great interests' ; which were at stake, in justice to the people, ,1 who were suffering so deeply, to turn th e ir mind to that abyss of ruin, now open at their feet.- 1 They stood on the brink of a precipice, from which it might not be possible to retreat without difficulty, but beyond which they could not pro ceed without ruin and destruction. The Noble Lord concluded by moving that the Petition be laid on the table but on account of some infor mality,he was afterwards allowed to withdraw it. The Marquis of LANSDOWNE presented a Pe tition from certain Occupiers of Ltnd in the County of Dorset, and the adjacent parts of the Counties of Milts and Wilts, praying for Agri- Cultural Relief.—Read and laid on the table.— Adjourned. HOUSE OF COMMONS. Mr. WYNNE took the oaths and his seat on his re-election. Mr.lfrumeim, from the Office of the Commissioners for the reduction of the National Vein, presented certain papers from that Office. Ordered to lie on the tab)e. A return was or. tiered of the flax and . tallo‘y,imported into Great Britain, in the course of the last year: COLONIAL ThADE. Mr. BERNAL wished to ask the Hon. Secretary of the Co lonial Department, to state, as the fkct was that there could be no foundation for a report, which had found its way into the public papers, that an Order in Council had issued, authoris ing the opening of the trade between the West Indies and Americas 31r. WILAIOT was happy to make the statement requested by the Hon. Member. There was no law authorising the issue of such an Order in Council ; the Act giving such a power having expired six months after the Treity of Peace. AGRICULTURAL DISTRESS. •Sir J. SEBRIGHT presented.a petition from the Owners and Occupiers of land in Ilertfordshire, - _complaining of Agricul tural. Distress. A Petition on the same subject, praying for a reduction of taxes, and for Parliamentary Reform, was pre sented by the same Member.—Both Petitions were ordered to lie on the table. M. LOCKHART presented a Petition from certain Owners and_Occupiers of Land in Suilblk, complaining of distress, and praying for protecting duties upon the importation of foreign produce.—Ordered to lie on the table. _ Mr. BENETT (of Wiltshire) presented a Petition from the Land-Owners of Wilts and Dorset,complaining of Agricultural Distress. The Hon. Member said he could vouch for the accu racy of the petition, and for the respectabitity of the petitioners. Ordered to lie on the table. Mr. DENISON presented a petition agreed to at the late Surrey County Meeting, and signed by the Sheriff. It com plained, the Hon. Member said, warmly, but respectfully, of the distress and pauperism into which the agricultural interest had fallen. It attributed much of that distress to the wasteful expenditure of the public money, and the want of a popular representation in Parliament ; audit prayed for the repeal of the taxes upon salt, malt, soap, and candles, and for a Reform in Parliament. The Hon. Member added, that at the Meeting in question, an amendment to the original resolution had been proposed by a Noble Lord, nearly connected with tie Noble M.Arquis opposite, stating that " the measures proposed by Ministers for the relief of the country could not be effectual." This was a strange circumstance, coming as it did, from a quarter connected with Ministers. As for himself, he thought the measures alluded to, and especially that of an issue of Ex• chequer Bills, would add to the burthens of the country, and assist none but contractors and stock jobbers. Sir JOIN RAMSDEN supported thepetition, and thought with the Hon. Member for Surrey, that the measures pro posed by Ministers for the relief of the country would prove inadequate. Indeed he considered that the shilling a bushel upon malt had better have remained in the pockets of Minis ters than be offered to . the Agriculturists as a relief for their distresses. It could have no effect but that of disgusting them. He could assure Ministers that he wished them to keep their places as much as they did themselves; but it was on condition that they shewed some sympathy for the sufferings of the people, and consented to a Reform of the Parliament, with out both of which he would never support any Minister or any set of men.—The Petition was then ordered to lie on the table. LONDON AND - BLACKFRIARS' BRIDGES. Mr. Sheriff GARRATT presented a Petition from the Lord Mayor, Aldermen, and Common Council of the City, praying, that leave be given to bring in a Bill to provide for the repairs of London Bridge.—Referred to a Committee. The Worthy Sheriff' presented another Petition from the name Persons, praying for a similar Bill with respect to Black friars' Bridge.—Ordered to lie on the table. EXTENTS IN AID. Mr. W. SMITH, referring to a former motion for a Return of the number of Extents in Aid issued within a given period, moved for a further Return of all Extents in Aid issued from the 31st of December last up to the present time. He made this motion in consequence of the extension of these writs hav ing caused so much discontent in the country, that a disturbance was very likely to follow. Mr. WODE 110 USE was glad the Hon. IVlernber had made the motion, and trusted he intended to found some ulterior measure upon it. It wa.s a subject, an examination of which would disclose the most flagrant abuses. Mr. GRENFELL concurred in opinion with the last speaker, and expressed his belief, that of all abuses there was no one which more than the present called for the interposition of Par liament. He knew a case of recent occurrence in the city of London, in which one creditor had seized nearly the whole or his debtor's property, to the injury, not to say robbery, of all the rest. The motion was then agreed to. Mr. BERNAL moved for an account of the application of the sum granted last Session of Parliament for Army Extraor dinaries, and the application of the Balance upon the Grant of 1320.—Ordered. Mr. LUSHINGTON moved for leave to bring in a Bill to rectify mistakes in the last Land Tax Bill. Leave was given, and the Bill was brought in and read a first time. Sir M. W. RIDLEY gave notice that he should on an early day move for a return of the receipts and expenditure of Green wich Hospital. Mr. Alderman WOOD said that as the motion of a Noble Loid (Althorpe) had excited much interest, he was willing to postpone his notice respecting the City Petition to the 28th 17.9 t. and he postponed it accordingit. The CHANCELLOR of the hXCIIEQUER (with the permission of Lord Althorpe, whose.notice•had priority) moved that the Report of the Committee of Su'plAy be brought up. The Report *as brought up ; and on the question that it be read, Sir R. HERON wished to know, whether the House could now be informed of the expenccs occasioned by his Majesty's Coronation ? The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER said, the ac. counts were not yet made up. Mr. CALCRAFT wished to know when the proposed relief frofn the additional Malt Tax would take effect ? The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER answered, in July next, when the present Act would expire. air. BENNET said, it would be in the recollection of the House that last session certain inquiries were made of the Right Hon. Gentleman opposite relative to Mr. Theodore Hook. It was then said that the opinion of Mr. Solicitor-General was about to be taken on the question whether any criminal pro ceedings could be sustained against Mr. H. He (Mr. B. wished - to know whether the opinion had been obtained, and what measures had been taken to recover the balance due frun Mr. H. to the public. The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER answered across the table in a very low tone of voice, and we could hear no more of his answer than an assurance that Government had taken every means in their power to recover the money. The Report was then read a first and second time. WAYS AND MEANS. On the motion of the CHANCELLOR of the EXCHE QUER, it was ordered that the House should to-morrow re solve itself into a COmmittee of Ways and 3leans. Mr. BENNET moved for an account of the Monies due from Mr. Theodore Hook to his Majesty's Treasury, and of the measures taken to recover the same, with the names and descriptions of his Sureties. Lord JOHN RUSSELL wished to ask a question of the Noble Marquis opposite. It was known that the Spanish Go vernment, by a wise economy, had resolved to leave off the custom of permanently sending Ambassadors to Foreign Courts. In consequence of this regulation, he apprehende4 ou: own Ambassador at the Court of Madrid might properly be withdrawn; but he understood that the Gentleman who was there at present' had been made Secretary of Embassy from being Secretary.of Legation. . . . The Marquis of LONDONDERRY said there would be no saving by withdrawing the Gentleman alluded to, for he would in that case be entitlal to a pension. The arrangement was that he merely retained his rank. STATE OF THE COUNTRY. Lord A LTHORPE rose to bring forward his promisedato tion on the State of the Country. He felt the necessity of bring ing forward a specific motion on this important subject, be cause the Noble Marquis, upon the • former discussions, had declared that no Member would Be pledged by the result of them to support or to oppose- any particular measure. He (Lord A.) was therefore desirous to call upon every Gentleman to express his sentiments upon the present distressed state of the country, arid upon the proposals which had been made by Mi nisters for the relief of that distress. If his object were merely to discuss the plan of the Noble Marquis, his address to the House would be short enough ; but as he wished to state his own views, he feared he would be under the necessity of going somewhat into detail, though he assured the House' he would be as brief as possible.—(Hear, hear, hear !) A doubt had been expressed as to the effect of 'taxation ; and there were not wanting some who bad alleged that taxation formed no part of the cause of the present distress. Until the present Session he had never known it to be neces sary to argue that taxation affected the price of produce.— (Cheers !) - Agricultural - produce was at this moment at no higher price than it was in 1792, and be believed the price of every thing else was risen. On a former night the Noble Marquis had estimated taxation upon the agricultur ists at only one-fifth of • their rents. How the Noble Marquis had arrived at this conclusion, or from what data, he was not able to ascertain ; but it was not direct taxation alone which pressed upon• the agriculturist. It was almost impossible to calculate the extent to which he was reached byin direct taxation. Taxation must increase the price of labour, and this must press particularly on the agriculturist ; for as the oavages 1:4 the Agricultural labourer were only sufficient to proa cure him the common necessaries of life, . it followed that by so. much as his wages failed in procuring tlo.te necessaries, by so much must he be a burthen on his parish: In manufacturing districts he conceived the case was somewhat different, for, as the wages of the manufacturing labourer afforded him certain luxuries, a diminution of those wages would, in the first in stance, reach only his luxuries. But with respect to one as well as the other, he took it to be clear that taxation affected the price of that which *as produced by their labour.—(Hear, hear, hear!)_He feared that he might not be able to express himself so distinctly as he wished—(Cheers.)—thr he knew there were many members in the House possessing a deeper knowledge in the science of political economy than he did.— Assuming, however, that he had succeeded in shewing that taxation was one cause of the present distress, he would submit that the proper course to lessen it was to diminish taxation.— He conceived it would be wrong to endeavour to raise the price •of produce ; and that the wiser plan would be to make great retrenchments, and thus enable produCe to be raised at a smaller expence.—(Hear, hear, hear I)—A surplus of five millions over the expenditure ot; the present year was confidently - ex pected. Ile thought it advisable that taxation to this amount should be taken off. He admitted, that in general it would be 1 impntdentjo lower taxation, so as to niake it only meet the ex-'I penditare with that of the . year 1792. It had been said that this was not a fair cornpat:son, because at that time Mr. Pitt was reducing as much as possible. Ile (Lord A.) knew not what air. Pitt's plans were at the time, but he was sure there never was a time when reduction was so necessary as the pre sent. Ile was aware that the expenditure could not be brought exactly tn the state of 1792, and he would make fair allowances accordingly. The Army Estimates of that year amounted to 2,370,0001.; but the pay had been increased since that period, so as to make a difference of about 72.1,0001. This with two millions fOr half pay made something more. than five mil lions. The Estimate for the present year was 7,443,0001. He was not prepared to say in detail how much this could be reduced, but that was a question which might be discussed af terwards. He was satisfied, however, that if the House de prived Ministers of the revenue, there would be no doubt of their finding the way of 'eduction. The Colonies he thought might support their own forces, especially as it had been ar gued that they were generally looked to as increasing our strength rather than our commerce. In the Navy Estimates of the year 1792 and those of the present year there was a difference of upwards of two millions. These he thought should be reduced upon the same principle, that when Minis ters were compelled to reduce, they always fouls. the means. The Dock-yards at Chatham, Portsmouth, and Plymouth, were till tne establishments of that description which he thought necessary. The money expended upon that-at. Shee rness, for instance, he thought was money thrown away. It was originally constructed on account of the difficulty of get. ting ships down the river, but that difficulty had been removed by the invention of Steam Engines. The next department was the Ordnance, in Which establishment, upon a comparison of the year 1792, there was nn increase of 501,0001. after allow ing for the difference of pay. In the Civil List, upon the same comparison, there was an increase of 5g1,9.171. If Mi nisters were disposed to reduce, he was satisfied upon this statement they could.—(Hear, hear I)—Supposing them in clined to do so, the next question would be, whether the money proposed to be applied by the Noble Marquis could not be better disposed of. The only object proposed by the Noble Marquis was to raise the price of the Funds. He (Lord A.) was told by practical men, that it would have this efFec4; otherwise he never could have believed that a sum compara tively so small, could have had any perceptible influence. As the average transfer of three per cent. Stock last year was 1,200,0001. a-day, and as the suns proposed to be sent into the market would in the yee! make but one-50th, he could scarcely believe it was possible for such a proposition to produce any visible effect, particularly as the Stocks rose while we were borrowing on the Sinking Fund. He would, however, admit that the effect would be to raise the price of the Funds. The plan of' the Noble Marquis was to reduce taxes to the amount of 1,500,0001. this year ; another million next year, half a million in the next, and_ao on to five millions. But would it not be better to reduce the five millions now, now that agriculture was almost in a ante of ruin, and that every day produced the downfal of sonic one engaged in agricultural pursuits ? The question in fact was, whether some better mode could not be adopted of disposing of these five millions ? He objected to any artificial raising of the Funds, for they would naturally rise with the prosperity of the country. These five millions would be actively employed as capital, if they were at this moment taken otf. In that he called upon the House ea once to approve or disapprove of the plan of the •Noble Marquis. If the House approved of it, it• would be vain to move for any other reduction. He was aware that 1 1 there would be a technical objection to his motion ; because there was no proposal of Ministers distinctly before the House, but he trusted neither the Noble Marquis nor his Colleagues would take advantage of this circumstance. Indeed, he should be as content to lose his motion upon such an objection, as he should be to gain • it, upon a discussion. The object of the motion was to call upon the Country Gentlemen to say Aye or I No : and to say whether or not the reduction of a shilling in the bushel upon the malt tax would satisfy them.—(Cheers.) He concluded by moving, " That it is the opinion of the House that the reduction of taxation, propoged by his Majesty's Mi nisters, is not sufficient to satisfy the just expectations of the 1 " peop e. . Mr. ROBINSON said, that however premature and unfair he might have thought some of the propositions of the Hon. Gentleman opposite, he had no•such objection to the motion of his Noble Friend, to whom he gave credit, - not only for his motives, but for the manner in w‘hich he had broaght his mo tion forward. Nothing could be 1. as consistent than the con duct of Ministers, if they were to think of meeting the motion by a technical objection. In fact, the question must be de cided upon its merits ; Ministers naked for the decision of the House, and they even thanked his Noble Friend for having brought forward a motion which would call for that decision. In looking at the plan which had been submitted by Ministers, and the plan of his Noble Friend, they were never to lose sight of the circumstances under which the present question was discussed. The question was not reduction, or no re duction ; but whether reduction should take place beyond the surplus revenue, or whether the integrity of the surplus should be maintained with a gradual and progressive reduction ? This was the issue between him acid his Noble Friend. It would be remembered, that this was the first time within nearly forty years that the House was enabled to discuss the appropri ation of a surplus revenue.—The surplus itself was produced by the reduction of expence and the improvement of revenue. It was unnecessary to follow his Noble Friend through his de tails ; for they might be and probably were correct. But even if his Noble Friend could satisfy the House that by increasing the reduction they would increase the (surplus Revenue, that would be an additional reason for raaintaining the integrity of the Sunking Fund. He (Mr. R.) would always say, " Main tain the Sinking Fund, uphold public credit, and then reduce if possible." But, in all events, the wiser course would be to preserve the Sinking Fund. He agreed with his Noble Friend that other and more convenient opportunities would occur for discussing details ; and he could assure his Noble Friend and the House, that Ministers proposed the Resolution in favour of Retrenchment last Session with a full intentto act upon its spirit. But when they looked at what was desirable in the way of reduc tion, they were not to overlook what was n ecessary for the safety of the state. lie was perfectly aware that Goverarraent were here open to an imputation from. those istici chose to make it but ii could notbe denied that it was the duty of Government tntake care that all the public establishments were efficient for their purpose. The A'-my, as to numerical force, had been reduced to the lowest point consistent with safety ; and as to the reduc tion of the naval. arsenals, it would not be too much for Goversi meet to expect some :resit for their wish to preserve our na tional supremacy. If they had neglected the means necessary for that preservation, his Noble Friend would be the first to, regret it ; for the state of the country would. be such as to bring upon the memory of Ministers the deserved contempt of pos terity. His Noble Friend had said that the country was ruined_ The distress cf the agricultural interest he (MLR.) admitted : he deeply regretted it ; but in looking at the situation of the whole country, other interests mustbe examined as well as those connected with agriculture. He was sure that' if those who , wished to work upon the feelings of a partictaar 'class, instead of addressing themselves to the. pressure of distress upon thst one class, would look at every other, they would not be able in justice to represent them as being in so deplotable a condition. The excess in the revenue furnished a proof that the pressure was not partial. Whenever an excess of tile same description had been announced before, there had alwayS been plenty to spew that the hopes built upon were a mere fallacth; that,it was but a spit of the Monenit ; that the result would snow that it was all vain speculation, and that it would end in disappointment. That, however, was a kind of argument that had not been attempted in the presentcasd; and those whiltookedat the improvement which was every where exhibited wOula find that the expectations. raised from it did not rest upon any such unsubstantial and san dy basis. The increase was found to be not in one, gilt in every branch of industry. There was not one source of revenu-e to which the improvement did not apply. It was" iod only in the consumption of the people of the country that the increase was seen, but in the foreign trade also. That increase in cell stimption could not take place without a previous increase us the meana of consumptioe-(llear, hear 1)-and how was it possible to admit that to be the case without allowing a corre spondent increase in the comfort and case Of the people ?- .(Spear hear !)-Ile adverted at the outset to their having 'a surplus income over their expenditure, and the question was not now whether they should reduce taxation, but rather in what mode that reduction should be made. His Noble Friend (Lord Althorpe) was not -to suppo.e that his .Majesty's Minis ters had not directed their attention in the first instance to the nature and substance of the proposition he had brought for , ward that night for the reduction of five millions of taxes.- Such - a proposition he knew • was very palatable, and if his. Majesty's Government had desired to acquire popularity even to the extent cf perpetuating their own power, they could not have fixed upon a better expedient than coming down to that House with such a proposal.- e (Hear, hear !)_ They admitted in the abstract the principle of reducing taxs ation, and certainly did not mean to deny that the reduction of five millions of taxes would be felt as a great advantage to the nation. But it was questionable whether attempting. relief in that way would not eventually leave greater evils to be contended against than those it would be intended to remedy. The reduction of the Sinking Fund, which was the first step to the proposed measure, would, in his opinion, be an unwise and fatal departure from the system which had been so properly adopted and adhered to by this country.-(Hear !)- He had scarcely ever heard any one, of whatever side in po litics, or whatever view he took of financial questions, object. to the principle of a Sinking Fund in the abstract. lie could understand the objection raised to the continuance of a system, which should take away that with one hand which it should restore with the other; but he certainly felt himself quite at a loss to comprehend how the employment of an actual surplus in the Revenue in the support of a Sinking Fund could be objected to. His Noble riand opposite (Lord Althorpe), ad mitted that he was opposed in his opinion in this respect by practical men connected with the public Funds, who under stood the management of their own interests. And indeed it must be plain to all who were capable of appreciating the mat ter, that there was a beneficial effect in sued an application of money, beyond the mere releasing of a certain mount of debt. Thatlis Noble Friend should think otherwise couldnot appear strange when coupled with the motion that a departure from the system which had been so long acted upon, and to which the Government stood pledged, would not leave the effect of diminishing public credit. It appeared to him (Mr. Robin son) that no one step, that they could take would tend more to scatter dismay and apprehension amongst all classes in any way connected with, or affected by the public faith, than the abolition of the Sinking Fund. Did he not view it, however, in this way, he should still have a strong feeling of hostility against such a step, as he could not but view it in the light of the forerunner of a more desperate attack on the funds.- (Cries of No !).-He would explain why lie thought so. They had been told in plain terms that they were not to contribute to a Sinking Fund, because they could not afford it. This they were told was to be justified by that severe necessity, the ultimum suppliciuin of tae Learned Gentleman opposite (Mr. Brougham): It was by this they might be driven to do that which, said the Honourable and 'Learned Gentleman, in the same breath, " God forbid I should recommenti."-(Laughter.) Here then he should be able to explain his view of the case.- The destruction of the Sinking Fund would affect public cre dit to that extent, that the relief intended to be given would be rendered less efficacious, and then would grdw up that ne cessity which was to justify that desperate and fatal attack on that species of property, of which; he had designated the des truction of the Sinking Fund as the forerunner. They all knew that many people of this country looked with a jealous eye at tire National Debt. They were taught, by pernicious doctrinea s widely disseminated, that the stockholder was a sort of hoard ing miser, who found his own thrift in being a canker on the interests and prosperity of others. But what was the stock holder in reality ? Were there not. many whose all was cen tered in fended property, and how great a portion of it was not the produce of the savings of laborious industry.-(llear 1) He confessed that he for one had not that in his composition as a Statesman, which could enable him to take advantage of the Pretext of necessity to assent to a measure of such a natures-a / Then he would beg the House to consider the two plans pro posed for their adoption. That of his Noble Friend (Lord A.) proceeded upon the assumption, that a reduction of taxation by demolishing the Sinking Fund would not be productive of arty evils to the country, through a diminution in public credit. it certainly might be admitted, for the sake of argument, to be problematical ; but he (Mr. Robinson) thought it would create very many and magnitudinous evils. But the plan of his Mat. jesty's Ministers was so far preferable that it combined 'two principles of unqualified good-first, the creation of a clear Sinking Fund ; and second, a reduction of taxation. There- • fore, whilst his Noble Friend's proposal was not free front doubt as to its operation, that of his Majesty's Government possessed clear, unqualified good. He hoped, therefore, the• House would not hesitate in their choice. His Majesty's Go vernment, he assured them, had no other view but to avail themselves of the situation of the revenue to apply it to the re lief of the country in the most beneficial way. He was glad his Noble Friend had given the House an opportunity of getting the question at ;est -( Hear, hear !)-H e appealed to the II ouse to support his Majesty's Ministers in maintaining the principle of the Sinking Fund, with confidence, because they had done nothing in the present instance to give cause fOr withdrawing that confidence they had enjoyed fora series of years.-(.hccra from the Opposition.)- lion . Members might laOgh, but it was clear they - had possessed the confidence of the House, or they would not have met with their support. But he'would also fearlessly appeal to the people, because he believed the people of this country to be the most just en earth.-(Hear, hear!)-- When they were in distress they naturally looked up to Parlia ment to provide them a refuge from the pressure of the mo ment, and they were equally apt to attribute to Government, the origin of their distresses. God forbid he ahould blame theirs harshly for so doing, as it was in human nature to do so. But they were not unjust or Ungenerous, when the hour of adver sity had passed. They bore anger as the flint bore Ere-it emitted a spark and straight was cold. It was became he felt conscious that his Majesty's 31 inistel shad done what they ought to do, in the situation they were placed in, that he felt assured the people of England would do them justice as Parliament heel • done.-(Cheers.)-For the reasons he had stated, he should oppose the motion of his Noble Friend (Lord Althorpe), and meet it by proposing two Resolutions as an Amendment. The Right Hon. Gentleman then read the Resolutions, which were in substance as follows :- I st, " That it appears to this house that a net excess in the Revenue above the Expenditure of the United Kingdom may he estimated as likely to amount for the year ending sth Jan. 1823, to 5,260,0601. exceeding by 260,01)01. the amount of clear surnlus Revenue, which, by the Resolution of the Btii June, 1819, the Honse deemed it expedient to provide for the reduction of the National Debt in the form of a Sinking Fund. 2d, " That this House secs with satisfaction, that by the operation of this surplus, connected with the diminution of the Five per Cent. Stock, a diminution of taxation may be accomplished, by wiiich a greater benefit to the country will aecrue than was held out by the Resolution of 1819 in ques tion." The first Resolution laving been put from the Chair, in the shape of an amendment, Lord J. RUSSELL said that he was so far from agreeing with the Right Hon. Gentleman who had just tat down, in the opinion he had expressed, that a great reduction of taxation would not be wise, that he thought such a measure was the only one that could confer essential benefit on the country at this mo ment, and was the only one at all likely to appease the suffer ings of the people. The Right Hon. Gentleman, he thought, might have spared that part of his Speech which related to the Sinking Fund. Let the House only recollect how much they had heard of the wonder-working effects of the Sinking Fund of Mr. Pitt. It was but lately that tke shade of that States man had been invoked in support of it, and r)owit appeared they tger, ton's. a. at Ence from J• 'arty )uke ouse rday ; .acy !'tufe nar one Mr. egal le is DS. nes - 'n.nn !lira de- lied- xdg, wh o I a his eu- e a DN, , ser led .es- bi? Ice le- :tle 0:. up at tge te.