The Sun. — London, England, 1850-03-08 00:00:00

Manchester with respect to the Clifden unions. The alni. M em b er had stated that landlords were in arrears, lkthat they had reuse i a fair rate. He was not al allowed to give the n ame o f hi s correspon d en t, b u t h e sd (Theehimself to pr ove t h e tru th o f hi s statemen t s . lionoarat,le M em b er rea d t h e l etter, f rom w hi c h it appeared th at t h e three principal estates in the Cats de anion were in th e C ourt o f Chancery—that previous to flip f the district was in a state of great prosperity r a . n d Progres s i ve improvement, but that ever since that ;e m Pauperism, disen-:e and emigration had ravaged it. / ; 1 184 8 a prop r i e t or had offered Mr. Tesistleton, the 4 r De ,_ow Commission er , 1,0001. o f grow i ng grass f or t h e i l 'e 4 which were due upon it, amounting to 400 L, but eY were refused, and the consequence was that the iityaansclitionacl. ever since b een lying q waste. The wrkhouse Some of the best mansions of the proprietors had been converted into auxili try workhouses, and others t i er ' ? shu t uP, though they belonged to families who had iorrnerly spent every shilling in Ireland.) He did not m!now the district himself, but gave tee statement as it ad been f orwarded to him. What he objected to for pee„tlY was the H onour bl e M em b er ' s ma ki ng c h arges e anon 43 ymous informatton, which were, in his ` 411 ", ( xaggerated in themselves, and unwarranted ealu muies on a body o f men , some of whom had, at all " t „e„a, don e t h e i r duty under very difficult circumstances. tion 'or. B RIGHT said he c o u ld not have th e l eas t *cc to the statement which had been read by the Hon. 'tee ealher, because it did not appear in the sli g ht es t de lato invalidate any of the statements he bad formerly ade w i th reference to the unicns in the west of Ire baned; Re could only say that every one of these state -78 Was m a d e on as good an authority as that on ;, ,, h th e H on. Member had made a counter-state lilt that ni g h t, with the exception of one, and that he be ret racted as soon as it was s h own t o b e erroneous . l lo o t these statements were not the question before the ilse"--(flear)—they had had a great many sensible rsals, and some not very sensible ones, referring to la s, before that House, but he had never hard one iiit:te de serving the support of the House, or less h e el Y to encounter the opposition of her Majesty's Go gt;ment, than that of his Hon. Friend the Member for °Ild • supported that motion, because he believed . 4eat.such facts as those alleged demanded instant veri eLl°4 and redress. The Government instituted in pas ea into man things less worthy of notice. If there the s 'i t h rt e xPlosiol, or a boiler burst in a steam-boat on co lt . a ttles, the Right Hon. Baronet would institute a of 4 11188 , 10 n, in order that he might know the cause might l amentable loss of life which these accidents ic e ec easion. Why should the effects of th e wholt pre;aPictions no t a l so b e i nqu i re d i nto an d t h e causes e r i;, e nted f rom operat i ng? Ono proprietor alone had fe t ; e e d no less than 1,025 persons, or equal to 200 le it ,gee, and it had been calculated at a low rate that at Thi s one person in every family thus turned out died. th ey , would give 200 deaths from that one estate. Were If, to inquire into such a state of things as that? 14 1 . 4 the ignorance or selfishness of the landlords, the 4 0 ; had been let and cultivated in such a manner that th e ; t',! , e failure of a single crap they could not sustain Pol i V ei tes, he asserted that neither the principles of Ch as al economy nor the principles of our common 4eritistianity permitted the owners of the soil to commence Bo n „ e a n exterminating system.—(Hear, hear.) The tleii i ,, 4l e . rabe r had talked of proprietors who spent every sp eitt mg in Ireland. He believed that. They notonly le ite: every shilling of their own, but every shilling be et onto the p eo pl e tb a t th ey cou ld l ay h o ld o f , i nstead ille - ' Z g With prudence, moderation, and forethought in h ite nlanageneent of the revenues derived from their es- N u :* The House, he thought, acted with too much ilsea e t tl aishness to persons thus situated. He was not to be het the term confiscation. If the millowners of ko"eillester were to act in a similar way, and leave the vel, P i ta employed and dependent upon them to starve Th e tale, the House would no doubt speedily interfere. te n. Member for Limerick said, that the landlords Sot keltilrush union had laid a rate of 3s. in the pound. the y said that 3s. in the pound was not enough, when t' h aook into consideration the fact that rents were paid N r i.`at Union, and that grants had been given to it from dersiarnent. He said that when the landlords came un ther?ell circumstances to that House for assistance, tlts; ! advance they received was in fact a bonus upon (10;1,etion sad the extermination of the people. If the Ahli,etntnent were to agree to the motion, and send a 11 0 , and firm man to take the administration of the ten e t ' ho landlords would soon see that they could no thi s shift the burdens from their own shoulders in atithinY, and give that employment which they now see ra e 'd- If the Government took that resolut . e and Th i hs e hZ t a e n r, s e i o n ur t s h e e , they would soon see an alteration for general employment of the people. he he Position of his Hon. Friend was so simple that 14, aid it would be agreed to. They would have the 44, 4 41 before the House, and the real cause of Ire thing Misery would reach the light. There was no tebut excess of rates, and if this state of things was Stelii",tintle, nothing remained for Ireland but misery iaryation.—( Hear, hour.) .11/14ra*,°:FLAHERTY said that, while he admitted the tie tt , pa of the Honourable Gentleman whose mo ttleeka before the House, he did not think there was lo b ' a necessity for the inquiry, or that it would lead S od ha good. He was chairman of the union of Clifton, ihy the had to state that the Engli s h propri e t ors did not tlai:uer rates. Surely these proprietors ought t o pay Itatri:e t , e !es or how could the people be supported ? H e e vtos Inform the House that the poor-law was now 4it,i;ag Well in Ireland. This law and the Encumb ere d Ott e . '" Act were well calculated to produce great im kruent in Ireland. t he 14%21-WORE supported the motion, a n d sa id h e ilep' e lt Was due to the p e opl e o f I re l an d to ma k e t h e Th, - e inquiry. :he t 4 ; 41 , 4 0 of ARUNDEL an d SURREY sa id it was lallisf' that there was an excess of misery in Ed -14,11e; " a t hardly ever before existed in a civilized or 414;1 State of society. It was also admitted kw:" landlords had acted unfairly towards the W e th e ' hllt still they did not know tlie to ca t u h s e e erlisresent misery in Ireland. Ile acceded h itt,i be stowed on Captain Kennedy, and whilead..e th e t hat the landlords in Kilrush were deserving of cea lUre a e e .,_ thrown upon them, he must exempt from h lohi e arstlre his neighbour, Colonel Wyndham . . The 1, 4 % n i ' e rd (Lord J. Russell) said they had informs ,athee"angh in respect to the subject under discussion; eoutanded that more information was necessary, 11. L e i th ia w as so, they -ought to . have it. The Right "rehtleumn (Sir W. Somerville) said that frauds 'ell ' ' rre e e at ninitted by the guardians in the Kilrush union. e o 4a should like to have all these frauds laid before Peee tia e• He should like to know how the est ties in 'sla," Were and had been managed for years past. 113 80,; 1 ' all events, he would say, that it was their duty to eta: t hing to save the lives of the people in Ireland.. C'Se i Ole were so degraded by the present state of ,11 !: 1, 1 _st he was not surprised at . anything_ they did, nor i‘ i• gel be blamed for their actions. In supporting the "l a Ple t er a commission it would be shown to the of Ireland that there were persons in that House ittN3loPathised with them in their difficulties. LNah e a lle in that House must be thankful . to the . Hon. 4 for the zeal and determination which he "IsPlayed in bringing the subject forward, It hst • , s(tr andine the discouragement shown to his doing ' 'ear ) • 14;tlf. I LLIAM SOMERVILLE said he did not say 1 lie r ; 4 la had been committed in the union of Kilrush. h eals-e ta was, that such a statement had been made 11,1.4, i e n Kennedy. h t tli e ( IROPE would not detain the House by . a h i ste t . ll ed reply. All admitted that if the facts . which h'sd, f itwere true, the necessity . for an inquiry ex teriaatr Noble Lord objected that they had sufficient b 1 , -. : °11 before them on the subject; but if they had ki l 4t r e - e ` e esrary information required on the question, led eaUres, he asked, had been brought in to.re ee evils of which he complained? If nothing ll c lone for the people, of what use, he asked. 4 4 ‘ 1. s ,elf,information which it was . said they had? kl,C,tee c jef year they were going on in the same It t Ati eh . did not seem as if they were to have any 14 e Ss e - ," of the system. The Hon. Gentleman, in re ltj!tiek..4 the plan suggested by the Hon. Member for Veal' said he had no doubt but if the resources of 111141,i:ere developed, the evils of which she had to ty, $," Would be relieved.—( Hear.) i t tsr. I'RENCII said the Hon. Member for Man eOM th e rents in Ireland had been well paid. lt,4epnt.,lo HT—No, Talid not. kk i tl e v e , Q ßENCll—The Hon. Member said that the N 6 ,`%,„ . ., a well paid in Kilrush and other places he Itiit t ,l 4 9 and he (Mr. F. French) was justified in as lseiLeat the Hon. Member meant to state that rents V l sey' were well paid. He could speale for the west, ye P arts of which the r en t s h a d no t b een p a id f or ail to t e i ta, and in o th er p ar t s f or two years . Wi t h re kika he Proposed in qu i r y, h e saw n o a d van t age t h at tr„te it R a ined by it; on the contrary, he th oug ht it klhkenterlere with the efforts now making by the Go fkhip,itiod others, to improve the condition of the IS e Union in question. P: a ae then divided, when there appeared— t t he motion 63 tElinst it ... 76 11 1 4 ,„ M wa rity ... ..• • "'ton aj s o consequently lost. 13 ss VOTE BY BALLOT. BERKELEY then rose to move for leave to s e t t Bill to protect th e P ar li amen t ar y e l ec t ors o f ttite i titk in and Ireland from undue influence by the op ly sp oi e o ballot. He said that if he were in need of Ik e RY f or b r i ng i ng forward this motion, it was I\t i teh, t et tae the h our at w hi c h h e b roug h t i t f orwar d e r -Iv h h at of the latest. (It was then nine o'cl oc k.) mo p ti s : h ' e et to th e mot i on i tse lf, h e cons id ere d i t o f s ° se s4 . „ i mportance, that until some Hon. Member, ll f ;ste d v a tent f or t h e tas k t h an hi mse lf , undertook it, , I lle 4 „a... r e re n tltinue to press it upon the attention of th e h` t ` l ear, hear.) He found in her Majesty's !6 kt a tis ei.i t he openi ng o f thi s sess i on o f P ar li ament a Oli t ' by c onstitutional maxim. It was to the effect ill is yee,nebining liberty with order, by preserving i.. 114 1, 4 h att . h en table and amending what is defective, you elseltehqttli-i,e fabric of happyti, as the abode 011 free and people. Nothing could a t tle Nt 42titatioual, no sentiment could be mere de rktlttlerePtisaieet but he submitted to the Government hie by Ministerial tree bore suss blossoms the i,,Nrre Pxpect to gather some fcuit.—(liear, hear.) toio h . ,set -18 on of liberal prieciples unattended by e Of% I , V aS much about the same as a strict ob eNl,4 thg_ l igious ceremonies without , Christian deeds. ti q n e t e tit o h to ask the House ans. the Government t I N /v i , as deft:elnaxim he bad just quoted, to amand 00,444 % e t- I 're by interposing a shield between the l i !te iLapt three who for their own purposes attempted e i lte t ,ale at , lll . He knew it was almost hopeless to se,,li e ea seV at ion palatable to the House, but he hoped 04,1 p oe ; claim to their indulgence by avoiding as 4 4 0. 4 . tl bl e the arguments he had used on previous alehl are considered the ballot to be the most po -144 bethose measures of Parliamentary reform l Ubraitted to the House by his R9b• lii Friends on various occasions. Ho considered it to be the primary step to those other measures of reform, be cause it was a stepping-stone to them. Ile thought it less onjeetionable to the generality of Members, because in seeking it they sought to alter no existing instituqun. They sought merely to protect the elector in the dis charge of a duty which they had entailed upon him, and because at present he was unable to discharge that duty, from the obstructions and abuses which had crept into cur electoral system, and which were as notorious as the longitude arid latitude in nevigetion. This simple pro position, simple as it seemed to him, had always hitherto been met with lively indignation. Minister after Minister came down to that House driven to his wits' end to prove that some vital objection existed to a man dis charging his duty sub silentio, even when it was con fessed that ho was unable to discharge it viva voce. This was, in his opinion, a very difficult question to argue against, whilst the arguments in favour of it were, he thought, irresistible. The arguments against it had been gradually dwindling away—they had become " small by degrees, and beautifully less," until, at length, they had ended in silence and hard voting.—(llear, hear, arid laughter.) When other questions of Parlia mentary reform were brought before the House, there was no want of eloquence against them on the part of their opponents, but the moment the ballot was men tioned Hon. Members became perfectly mute. They shied and dodged the question by every means in their power. When Mr. Ward brought forward his motion on the subject, in 1842, the same complaint was made, and the gre ae difficulty then, as now, was to get the Government on their legs.—(liear, hear.) The con sequence was that people believed that they opposed the measure for other reasons than those which they as signed, and the people were ready enough to assign reasons for them. The people believed that they op posed the measure solely because they could not endure to see the upper classes and the aristocracy shorn of their undue and unconstitutional influence.—(Hear, hear.) The course he intended to pursue on the pre sent occasion was to meet some of the objections which had been most lately put on record as arguments against the measure. He found that they had a fresh opponent in the field. He found that they had to contend with the Right Hon. Baronet the Secretary of State for the Home Department (Sir G. Grey). That Eight Hon. Gentleman was formerly a supporter of this men sure. The brilliant eloquence, the acute logical powers of that Right Hon. Baronet made him an undesirable opponent, while his high character, and the important position he held in her Majesty's Councils, made his example most dangerous.—(Hear, hear.) It was for this latter reason that, feeling as he did his utter incompetence to cope with such an adversary, with some hesitation he had re solved to ask the Right Hon. Gentleman to explain some parts of his conduct on this question. He begged to say that he did not assume for a moment that any gen tleman was compelled always to remain of the same opinion. Grave statesmen and Right Hon. Gentlemen on both sides of the House had changed their opinions frequently, and with their opinions bad changed their votes; and he must say, as an humble individual, that he had thought them perfectly right. There was the question of the corn-laws, for instance, upon which the Noble Lord the Member for London, the Right Hon. Baronet the Member for Tamworth, the Right Hon. Gentleman the Member for Ripon, and other great statesmen, had changed their opinions and votes; but, before they did so, they gave that House, the country, and their constituents the most complete, elaborate, and anxious explanations ; and he submitted, that if they had not adopted that course they would have appeared, in the face of the country, as so many unequivocal and naked rats. He (Mr. Berkeley) therefore maintained that Hon. Members who changed their opinions on so important a question as the ballot ought to follow a similar course, and give to the House and the country a most complete and ample explanation. Now, how stood the facts of the case? In 1848, when he (Mr. Berkeley) had the honour to propose and the good luck to carry a resolution— (Laughter)—in favour of the ballot, the Right Hon. Gentleman (Sir G. Grey) did not vote. The friends of the motion first became aware of the loss they had sus tained by that melancholy obituary of departed Re formers—the division-list of the House. The Right Hon. Gentleman appeared in the House on that occa sion; but like the phantoms in Macbeth, he came like a shadow and so departed—he pointed to his vote and glided noiselessly out of the lobby.—(Bear, hoar, and laughter.) When the Honourable Member for Montrose brought forward the general question of re form, he (Mr. Berkeley) ventured to arraign the silent system, and then they had the Right Hon. Gentleman's explanation. And what did it amount to ? It seemed that in 1838 the Right Hou. Gentleman voted with the Government for the ballot, and when Mr. Ward brought forward the question in 1842 he voted with him also. The Right Honourable Gentleman said that his reason for so voting was, that he then represented a cohstituency (Devonport) where undue influences prevailed, and that therefore he had been induced to give his reluctant support to the ballot. In 1847, however, the Right Hon. Gentleman became Member fur Northumberland, and as that was a pure constituency— as ho was then breathing wholesome air—and as he had at length escaped from the foul atmosphere of Devon port, he thought it right to turn round and vote against the ballot; the reason he assigned being, that public opi nion had of late acted so powerfully upon the upper classes that they had become politically virtuous.— (Laughter.) Surely never before had such a reason been given by any statesman for a vote.—(Hear, hear.) It had been laid down by Burke, that when a Member entered the House of Commons ne entered it as Member for England, and that he should not attempt to legislate for the county, city, or borough which returned him, but fur the community at large. He (Mr. Berkeley) left the House to say whether, upon this principle, the Right Hon. Gentleman's reason for his vote on the sub ject of the ballot would hold water. He begged to call the attention of the Government to another ex traordinary circumstance connected,with the House of Grey. In 1837 Lurd Howick. then Member for Sunderland, now Lord Grey, voted aginst the ballot, the reason he assigned for doing so being the same as that now assigned by his Right Honourable Relative, viz.. the increased political virtue of the upper classes. In 1841, however, the Noble Lord, having been defeated in an election contest for Northumberland, turned short round upon his former opinions about the increasing purity of the upper classes, and showed that ho had been talking nonsense on the subject, for at the declaration of the poll at Alnwick the Noble Lord made a most sweeping and unmeasured attack upon the Duke of Northumberland, Lord Tankerville, and his oppo nent Lord Ossulston, for unworthy trickery, for un scrupulously violating their promises, and for unduly influencing the electors. [The : Hon. Member read ex tracts from the Noble Lord's speech at Alnwick, as quoted by Mr. Ward in his speech on the ballot in 1842.] Mr. Ward on that occasion claimed the Noble Lord as a proselyte, and challenged him to support him with his vote. The Noble Lord, however, contented himsef with walking out of the House without voting at all. It ap peared, therefore, that the test of purity of political opinion in the mind of the family of Grey was a Northumberland election. If a Grey was rejected, straightway the commu nity was plunged into the depths of vice; if a Grey was successful, the electors were immediately full of virtue.—(Laughter.) But now, as to the fact of the increased political purity said to be found among the upper classes. There was a Committee which inquired into this subject in 1836. That Committee had evidence laid before it from all parts of England and Ireland — evidence which it was impossible for any one who had not actually read it to conceive. In 1848 he bad quoted in extenso from that evidence, and proved that a general state of demoralization characterised all elections at which anything of party spirit prevailed, and succeeded in establishing cases not to be upset—and he defied the Right Hon. Gentleman to upset them—ot the grossest intimidation, corruption, and malversation, in every pos sible way, of the franchise. As an appendix to the re port of that Committee, he might point to the evidence before almost every one of the Election Committees from that time to this—(Hear)—evidence proving that the same demoralization, the same intimidation, the same corruption prevailed after 1836 as before 1836.—(Hear.) He would ask which was to be believed in preference, the bare bald assertions of Hon. individual Members, be their position what it might, or the evidence on oath taken before so many Committees, backed by the distinct statements of facts adduced by other Members of the House whenever the subject had been discussed ?- -(Hear, hear.) There was the distinct evidence of the Hon. Member for Birmingham in 1848 and 1849, who stated, of his own knowledge, that no election for the great city he represented ever took place without at least 1,000 of the electors being prevented from voting by in timidation.—(Hear, hear.) The Hon. Member did not mention the many hundred other electors who on all those occasions did vote upon intimidation and against their consciences. —(Hear, hear.) The Honourable Member who seconded his motion in 1849—the Mem ber for Macclesfield—showed, from his own experience, the ata'e of intimidation into which the metropolis was plunged at every election ; and he had himself given on the same occasion examples of the intimida tion practised at particular elections. He required the Right Hon. Gentleman to show to the House what in crease in political virtue had taken place in the upper classes in 1848, 1849, and 1850, that should supersede the goodness and expediency of the ballot, which he himself admitted, in 1838 and 1842.—(Hear, hear.) He presumed that the Right Hon. Gentleman would have the tact to avoid, on the present occasion, the obsolete claptrap that formerly served a turn—about the unman liness and the un-Englishness, and so forth, of the ballot —the twaddle about its being cowardly to give a vote and conceal its object.—(Hear, hear.) The Right Hon. Gentleman must see that he might as well suggest it as cowardice for a man to use his watch and then conceal it, since the political intimidator and bully had no more right to your vote than the pickpocket to your watch. Nor, he conceived, would the Right Hon. Gentleman venture to suggest that the English people were less fitted now than in 1842 for the ballot, after the proofs which the Government had received of the sound sense, intel ligence, good feeling, and loyalty of that people, in times of great excitement abroad and sedition, nay, of rebellion at home.—(Hear.) Perhaps, indeed, the Right Hon. Gentleman might contemplate the proposition that the people were less anxious about the matter now, because they did not so anxiously agitate the question. Let the Right Hon. Gentleman beware of such an argemeilt as that, lest he confirmed what was said against his Go vernment—that it refused to reason what it yielded to agitation—(Herr, hear)—lest we justified the character of the Whigs given by Lord Anglesey, that they were tide-waiting legislators, who floe ed in on the tide of re form, who steered with its slack water, and floated hack with its ebb.—(Hear, hear.) To the individual Mem bers who might be disposed to stay also at what they thought slack water, he would give the earnest advice to reflect maturely on the position of things in this year, 1850. The threat of gentlemen on the Opposition benches to appeal to the country must be ringing in their ears—(Hear, hear)—and, ringing there, it could not but bring to their minds the last appe a l of the same sort which led to the general election under the contending banners of free trade and protection in 1841, and to the raults of that contest. If the appeal then was an ap peal to desnoraluatien, what would an appeal now be?— (Hear.) It would be an appeal in which wealth and power, putting on the screw to its last round, would override the towns, and stalk over the counties, trampling on chartered rights more basely and unblush ingly than ever before.—(Hear, hear.) It wou!d be an appeal to strength to dictate to eaknes. , , an appeal to wraith to crush poverty, an appeal to the House of Lords to elect the House of Common=.—(Hear, hear.) He would say one word as to the vain st•eropts of recent legislation to deal with the least of the evils of the pre sent electoral system—the evil of overt bribery. They had made laws stringent enough against overt bribery, but they had entirely omitted the prevention of secret bribery, and of that intimidation by exclusive dealing, which contained within itself the very essence of bribery. —(Hear, bear.) They had, in short, strained at the gnat and swallowed the camel. Exclusive dealing was the right arm of intimidation—the essence of bribery in its very worst form. In the case of simple bribery you gave a man a reward for selling his conscience; you, perhaps, saved him and his family from ruin, from starvation, and the actual positive good ac caring, though no excuse, might be taken as an extenuation. But in exclusive dealing you punished, you perhaps ruined a man and his family, because he f 'Bowed his conscience, and there could be no doubt which was the worst offence. Again, they had passed a measure by which it was impossible for a man to stand against treachery and rascality; he referred to their law of agency, under which agency was definable to be a man's walking arm-in-arm with a can didate, or being seen in his committee room, or placard ing'one:of his;bill, or wearing his colours, and so myth° further fast of any such person afterwards giving a sovereign to an elector being deemed sufficient to eject the candidate, if elected, from his seat.—(Hear.) He had on this point consulted many of the most eminent election agents, and they were unanimously of the opi nion that under this law, after a general election, there would be more seats unjustly declared void on petition than bad ever been declared void before, justly or un justly, from the utter vagueness and unlimitable extent of the definition, and the wide field given t ) simulation of agency.—(Hear.) He had urged this question on the House in the honest conviction that it was a measure due to the people of England, to the constituencies who elected that House, as a measure called for by justice and by humanity; and he now committed his short sketch to them, prepared to receive counter-conviction from any man who could furnish him with it.—(Cheeas.) Lord DUDLEY STUART seconded the motion. His Hon. Friend had endeared himself to the people by his able, unyielding, and in one case, successful advocacy of this most important principle.—(Hear, hear.) He was convinced that there was no question on which the country felt a deeper interest; no object to the attain ment of which they were more thoroughly entitled. It was demanded alike by all who possessed, and by all who sought the franchise, as the only means of giving them the secure exercise of that franchise. Without the ballot the elector could never substantially enjoy the vote which the constitution gave him. The ballot was alike his due, whether he claimed the franchise as a trust, as a right, or as a privilege. In relation to its character as a trust, it was objected that those wbo so exercised, being responsible for its exercise to the non electors, could not consistently conceal its application; but this argument, at all events, could not be justly held by those who resisted an extension of the franchise on the ground that the people were not yet fitted for it; since, if they were not fit to vote, they were equally unfit to control a vote.—(Hear, hear.) If any persons doubted the extent to which undue influence prevailed, he would ask them to look at the different constituencies and see whether there were any in which nu merous electors did not abstain from voting through fear of incurring the displeasure of influential indivi duals, or from the hope and expectation of some reward. Now, the ballot, would, on the one hand, prevent inti midation, while on the other hand it would prevent the possibility of corruption. He felt it difficult to believe in the sincerity of those who opposed the ballot on the ground that it would promote deception and encourage a spirit of disingenuousness, and that it would be found ineffectual for the object it was intended to accomplish. He believed the opposition offered to the ballot arose from a love of power. Its opponents could not divest themselves of a notion that they had a right to direct and govern the votes of those who lived on their estates, or with whom they dealt. They were averse to the measure because they had no confidence in the people, and they had no confidence in themselves.—(Hear, hear) They talked about the just influence of property; but what was the just influence of property? It was this— that when a possessor of property was a humane and considerate man, he would be respected and looked up to by those around him, who would be anxious to know his opinions, and who would probably in most cases be guided, by his views; but anything be yond that was tyranny.—(Hear, hear.) If it were considered desirable that property should have more in fluence, that House had better pass a law providing that people should have votes in proportion to their property. That would be preferable to the present system, which pretended to give people votes, but which was nothing better than a mockery and a delusion. It was said that the ballot would be ineffectual to accomplish the object it was intendei to effect. He would admit that that might perhaps happen in some small places ; but the conclusion to which he came was that the franchise ought not to be continued in such small places, but that larger bodies ought to be invested with the right of electing Members of Parliament.—(Hear, hear.) lie would not say that he considered the ballot would be a panacea for all evils, or that it might not be attended with some dis advantages as well as with great advantages. He was not in favour of doing things in secret, and he thought it would be much better if all electors had the manliness and independence to exercise their franchise without de ferring to the influence of others, and if persons in the higher classes were too bighminded to stoop to intimida tion and corruption. But when he knew the situation to which families had been reduced because electors had given their votes conscientiously, he considered that they ought not to call upon men to make such sacrifices for the enjoy ment of the privilege or right which the constitution had ,placed in their hands. It was said that the ballot would be useless, because the electors would themselves divulge in what way they had voted; but was it likely, when it was important to a man that his votes should not be known, that ho would be so great a fool as to proclaim for whom his vote had been given? He (Lord D. Stuart) thought, however, that it was likely, after a time, that the habit of concealing votes would be laid aside. He believed that if they bad the ballot, the rich and power ful would by degrees abandon their attempts to tyrannize and to corrupt, that things would then be placed upon a better footing, and that the people would not be anxious to Conceal their votes. In the recent discussions on the Irish franchise, they had heard something from Hon. Gentlemen opposite of the leaven of democracy, and of that House proceeding in a downward course. He was not afraid of the leaven of democracy; he wanted the people to have the constitutional right of electing their own representatives, and he considered that, when that House was really and truly elected by the people, and was more in harmony with their wishes and desires, so far from being lowered it would be greatly elevated.— (Hear, hear.) He believed that the ballot would tend to the general welfare and benefit of the nation, and the motion before the House had therefore his hearty con currence. The question having been put, Sir G. GREY said, he would not occupy the atten tion of the House for more than a few minutes, but, as the mover of the resolution had devoted a considerable portion of his speech to a discussion of his (Sir G. Grey's) conduct upon this question, he would in a very few sen tences gratify the Hon. Gentleman's curiosity, by in forming him what were the opinions he entertained, and what course he intended to take on the motion before the House. Ho differed from that Hon. Gentleman in his estimate of the importance of the ballot. He (Sir G. Grey) never had stated that he considered the question one of vast importance ; and when he had supported a motion for the ballot, he had said that ho had no great confidence in the success of the plan. Ho had supported it, however, in deference to the opinions of a large body of constituents, to whom he owed much, and who had given him most disinterested support. That constituency, by petitions addressed to that House, had certainly persuaded him of their desire to obtain the ballot as a protection for some of their number, with regard to whom he stated at the time that he thought undue influence had been exercised, and fir whom he endeavoured to procure the protection they required. He agreed very much in the opinion which had been expressed a few nights ago by the Hon. Member for Middlesex, that the advantages and evils of the ballot were both greatly exaggerated. The more he had heard the question argued, and the more consideration he had given to it, the more satisfied he was that so far from preventing bribery, the ballot, if adopted, would in some constituencies greatly facili tate the commission of wholesale bribery, and in most constituencies would render it difficult to bring home acts of bribery to particular parties. At the same time he thought there were cases where the power of giving secret votes might enable honest voters to exercise the franchise according to their own judgment and conscience, free from external con trol.—(Hear, hear.) He believed, however, that in the vas t ma j or i ty o f cases the ballot, if adopted, would be actually inoperative. He did not think it would be a panacea for intimidation or bribery. Ho considered that publicity was of the very essence of our elective franchise.—(Hear, hear.) He would say nothing about the ballot being English or un-English, but he would say that under its operation the record of the vote would not be, in 90 cases out of 100, the first indication of the intention and opinions of the voter.— (Hear, hear.) Where the political opinions of candi dates were marked and distinct, and where the great majority of the electors were divided into marked and distinct classes, the relative strength of parties was well known, and the candidates knew upon what voters they could rely. He believed, therefore, that if secret voting were adopted, publicity would still remain as the very essence of our electoral system. The question then was —whether it was necessary or expedient to adopt the ballot for the protection of a minority of voters? He had stated that, on the occasion which had been re ferred to, he had, in deference to the expressed wishes of his constituents, but with hesitation and re l uc t ance, having no confidence in the efficacy of the remedy, given his sapport to the remedy they had suggested, The Hon. Gentleman (Mr. Berkeley) bad said that he (Sir G. Grey) stated last year that the political virtue and purity of the elective classes bad so far in creased that he (Sir G. Grey) thought the ballot no longer necessary. The Honourable Gentleman had in vented that speech for him.—(A laugh.) He would ask the Hon. Gentleman where he could find it, for he (Sir G. Grey) had used no such expressions. What ho had said was, that of late years the growing infitionce of public opinion had produced a much more powerful check than formerly existed against the nse of those undue means which had been frequently exercised with a view to induce electors to vote contrary to their opinions. He hoped the Hon. Gentleman would see that that was a totally different thing from extolling political virtue and purity. He (Sir G. Grey) bad spoken of public opinion as expressed through the press, in the country, and in that House, and of the ex p osure w hi c h f o ll owe d attempts to intimidate or corrupt electors; and he be lieved that this afforded a better security than any law that could be adopted by the Legislature. Ile believed that if they were to adopt the ballot they would not protect that class of electors who, with known poli tical opinions, wished to abstain from voting. Their opinions being known, they might still be prevented from voting by undue influence. With regard to the various lights in which the franchise was regarded, he differed from these who treated it as a mere privilege, for he considered the franchise, not as a mere privilege, but as a trust conferred for the bene fit of the community, and which should therefore be exercised in the face of the community. TLeie consi d Tations induced him, in the exercise of his own judg ment, which be felt bound to follow, under the present circumstances of the country, when there was no ap pea'aeco of the ballot being required, when there was no expression:of public opinion on the subject, andwhen ho believed the people:genterally did not desire it—although the Hon. Gentleman opposite (Mr. Berkeley) had by a lucky accident carried his motion by a very narrow ma jority last year—to decline to concur with the Hon. Gentleman in the change he proposed—a change which he (Sir G. Grey) believed would confer anvantages upon a very small portion of the community, and which advantages would, in his opinion, be counterbalanced by the evils which would follow with respect to bribery and corruption.—(Hear, hear, and cries of" Divide.") Mr. M. GIBSON said it appeared that upon these questions of reform they were not to be allowed to have fair debates, for Hon. Gentlemen opposite called for a division almost before the Right Hon. Home Secretary had declared the views of the Government. Sir G. GREY—My*own views. —(A cry of" Hear.") Mr. M. GIBSON was glad to hear they were not the views of the Government, and that this was an open question.—(Hear, hear.) Upon several recent occasions Hon. Gentleman opposite had urged the importance of ascertaining the independent views and opinions of the tenant-farmers of England; and one Hon. Gentleman had expressed his desire that the true opinions of that class, free from all external influences, should be heard in that House. He (Mr. Gibson) was prepared to give the tenant-farmers on opportunity of so expressing their opinions, and for that purpose he would give them the protection of the ballot.—(" Oh! oh!" and laughter.) The Right Hon. Home Secretary had stated that when he voted for the ballot he had done so in deference to the opinions of the electors who sent him to that House; and it was his (Mr. Gibson's) conviction, from the knowledge he had of tenant-farmers, that if Honour able Gentlemen opposite voted in deference to the opinions of those who sent them to Parliament, the tenant occupiers, they would supp ort t h e b allot.— (Laughter, cries of "Oh! oh!" and cheers.) The Right Honourable Baronet had said that the ballot would be inoperative in the great majority of cases. Where, then, was the danger of trying the experiment, if that system might be called an experiment which was in full operation in many other countries ? He (Mr. Gibson) would venture to say that in no other country where the ballot had been adopted would they find the electoral body willing to relinquish it.—(Hear, hear.) The bal lot was required for that minority of cases—if minority it were —where undue or improper influence was exer cised upon electors ; and to say that the ballot would be inoperative in a great majority of cases was no valid argument against it. They might apply that rule to their polic e regu l a ti ons , t o their criminal law, and to other institutions which, in a great majority of c ases , were inoperative—(Hear, hear)—but the question was, did they come into operation in any minority of cases where the protection of the law was re quired ? What public object did they gain by ins: posing publicity as the condition of a man giving his vote ? As they imposed upon every elector the obliga tion to publish his vote, they were bound to show the public advantage of such a restraint. Were elec tors, he asked, to vote as they themsel ves w i s h e d , or not? He believed the House would say they ought to vote according to their own wish and conscience. If, then, by compulsory publicity, they compelled a man to vote otherwise than be would have done with the protection of the ballot, they violated the principle on which they gave that man a vote; namely, that he should use it according to his own conscience and opinions. If, on the other hand, publicity had no effect, and the man voted just as he otherwise would have done, then this obligatory restraint and publicity were of no value. If the electoral body were known to be at liberty to exercise their own free convictions in voting, there would be less of claptrap agitation; a candidate would more maturely consider his speeches when he knew that they would be weighed by unbiassed under standings, whilst at the same time a higher tone of thought would be engendered in the constituency. At present, indeed, many a man would rather not hear arguments upon a public question, fearing that his con victions might oblige him to vote against his interest.— (A. laugh.) That was the case in a great many instances in many small boroughs where considerable influence was exercised.—(Hear, hear.) With the ballot, timid men would no longer be deterred from voting through fear of mobbing, or of having to pas through two lines of men using expressions perhaps not very agreeable to hear. The argument for open voting—its being un- Ergtish, that it should be secret—might be used in favour of requiring a man, when he made his will, to publish it at the church door.—(Oh!) If the genuine voice of the constituency were desired, they should have the protec tion of secrecy in recording their votes.—([Tear, hear.) Mr. J. WILLIAMS had felt it his duty, on behalf of those who desired to use the franchise without per mission from or under the compulsion of their customers to corroborate last year the Honourable Member's (Mr. H. Berkeley's) statements of the disgraceful state of thraldom in which the inhabitants of this metropolis were plunged, and was enabled to point out also the de moralisation of constituencies in Wales—his own native country. The Honourable Member had well remarked, that although for the last few years the screws and en gines of compulsion bad not been resorted to, unless in particular instances, with that fierce determination which marked their use in times of great political excitement, yet it was a miserable argument to pretend that there fore intimidation had gone out of fashion. Let the aris tocracy now, if they could, or at any time, stir up an election, and we should have the same scenes enacted which he ventured to describe last session. Carriages, with their titled occupants, would roll from door to door, as they did in 1841, the threats and cajolery of ladies— (Loud laughter) —being carried to a much greater ex tent with tradesmen than their male relatives dared to go.—(Renewed laughter, and cries of "Hear, hear.") As a plain man—(A laugh)—but, he trusted, an honest one—(Hear, hear) _he was utterly unable to comprehend how Hon. Members could defend the pre sentnot be h onest, and say t h at i t was entrustWthheypresent class of vo t ers w ith the fran foily system. to fran chise, but that a man should vote so many times accord ing to his property ? To qualify one set of men to elect representatives, and then permit that privilege to be usurped by another, was contrary to reason and common sense.—(Hear, hear.) It was in vain to deny this state of things. In the country the landlord alone was always canvassed; and when estates changed hands, the voters adopted the politics of th e new masters. How much better for an auctioneer putting up an estate to describe it as well timbered and w a t ered, abounding in natural productions, pheasants, h ares, rabbits, pike, trout, and electors,—market and polling -place at a convenient dis tance?—(Laughter.) Of all practices most abhorrent to an Englishman was this system of intimidation, openly repudiated, but quietly w i n k ed at and encouraged.— (Hear.) The system had been maintained too long by thoroughgoing Tories and half-going Whigs, until it had become a scandal and disgrace to a civilized nation.— (Hear, hear.) Parliament should extend the suffrage to its permitted limits, and allow men to vote who now re fused, and give the middle and lower classes the power of expressing their real opinions. He should vote fur the ballot. Mr. HEALD entirely dissented from the proposition, that this motion ought to be agreed to on the ground that the electors of this country required the protection of the ballot. Ho did not admit that it would be a pro tection to them—(Hear, hear)—and he begged to state that the electoral body did not ask for, desire, or wish for such protection.—(Hear, hear.) They prided them selves on being known as supporting certain principles and favourite candidates.—(Hear.) As for the minority to whom the Home Secretary had referred, who were they? He represented a popular borough, and he was prepared to state that not merely four-fifths of the con stituency of that borough, but nine -tenths, did not want the ballot—(Hear)—they felt it would be a reflection upon their integrity and their preparedness t avow what were their views on great public questions.—(Hear, hear.) And he honoured that principle.—(Cheers.) He would be the last to part with any essential feature of our English cliaracter.—(Hear, hear.) He was not ashamed of any vote he ever gave ; candidates were examined openly on the hustings, and, as one who was canvassed as to his views, he claimed a right to be dealt with openly and fairly.—(Hear, hear.) There was a small minority indeed in all our constitu encies that was to be regarded under a very different view—a nondescript party—(A laugh) —at every elec tion hanging in the balance—(Laughter) — an d waiting almost till the poll was about to close before they would determine for whom, if the election was nicely poised, they would vote.—(Hear, hear.) Was the country to part with a long-established and greatly honoured sys tem of taking the sense of the constituency of the empire merely to meet the case of this small minority? —(Hear, heir.) The sooner the country was relieved from any kind of premium or advantage, or protection given to that small proportion of the constituency, the purer and the freer, and the more satisfactory, would be the record of the votes of the electoral body.—(Hear.) Mr. BRIGHT felt that it would be extremely satis factory if the very favourable character which the lion. Gentleman had given of his constituency could be believed to be true of the constituencies generally. Stockport was a borough not remarkable for its purity —(A laugh)—for the little cost of elections—(llear) or the absence of tumult at them.—(hear.) lie (Mr. Bright) knew som e thi ng o f S toc k port .— ( A laugh.) It was a town almost entirely supported by the cotton trade; many of the firms there were wealthy and pow erful, employing frem 500 to 2,000 persons, and having influence over all the tradesmen in the town who supplied the articles necessary in the wear and tear of those es tablishments. The large millowner, in a moderate size town, was very much in the position of a large pro prietor of land, having labourers and tenants dependent on him. He himself was in the position he was de scribing—(A laugh)—namely, employing a large num ber of persons, and seeing constantly at his counting house the people employed in the various subsidiary manufactures of the neighbourhood coming to receive $llO4 orders or payment of their scoounte. The ingueuce against which the ballot was intended to guard existed to a very large extent; and it depended upon the mo rality and the conscientiousness of those who had that influence, whether it should be used against the rights of the electors subjected to it.—(lleer.) Without making any charge in reference to Stockport more than Hochdalo or the metropolis, he would ark the House whether, when party spirit ran high, (as it often did in small towns even were there seemed very little to fight about), it was not known that this influence was con stantly exercised by candidates and by employers con nected with all political parties?—(Hear, hear.) He solemnly believed that every man in the House was as conscious as himself that in the great majority of elec tions, whether for counties or boroughs, particularly if the constituency was limited and the contest ran keen, this influence was constantly exercised adversely to the independent and conscientious voting of a great number of tho electors—(Hear, hear)—and the borough of Stockport was no exception.—(Hear, hear.) Tho Hon. Gentleman said that n'ne-tenths of his constituency did not want the ballot; nine-tenths of them did not vote for him—(Oh, oh !)—but he would probably be asked to present a petition in favour of the ballot, signed by a majority of those electors.—(Hear.) In the neighbour hood in which he (Mr. Bright) lived—in Lancashire— where probably the eleetoralclasses whereas independent as in any portion of the kingdom, a great majority of them, he believed, were in favour of the ballot; and the principal reason why the Members of that House did not give them the ballot was the knowledge that with it the returns in many constituencies would be very different from what they now were.—(Hear, heir.) He was amazed at some gentlemen opposite, great sticklers for morality, quoting all parts of Scripture in favour of all kinds of questionable propositions—(Laughter)—Gen tlemen who assumed to be the defenders of the Church and of that Christianity which the Church was supposed to embody—(Oh, oh!)—he was astonished that, seeing the immorality—(oh!) —seeing the cruelty and oppres sion exercised on the part of powerful and wealthy men towards the more dependent classes of the electors, these Gentlemen should oppose a proposition like this, against which the most that could be said was, that it would not do all the good its advocates expected. The time was not very far distant when the whole of this representative system, the franchise and mode of election, would be subjected to a more thorough investi gation and reform.—(Oh, oh! and Hear.) The thing was so monstrous upon the face of it that we were ex posed to the ridicule of every foreigner who examined it.—(Laughter, and cries of "Oh, oh!") And it would. be wise for gentlemen, instead of raising unmeaning laughs—(Oh, ohl)—to adduce arguments, if they had any—(Oh!)—in favour of a system which was ridiculous in theory, and which in practice was found to create great evils and to cause great discontent throughout the country.—(Hear, hear.) Mr. MASTERMAN (who was very imperfectly heard) was understood to express his opinion that it was not desirable that votes should be concealed. He should rather know at all times who were his friends and who were his enemies than remain in ignorance as to the eharacter and feelings of his constituents. Mr. MUNTZ observed that the Hon. Member oppo site had stated the views upon this question of the electors of the borough which he represented, and had told the House that not above one-tenth of them was favourable to the ballot. Now, he should say that as far as his experience went in one borough at least, it showed that a very large proportion of its constituency desired the ballot, and if he were asked to what class they belonged, he should say to a highly respectable class, who refused to exercise the franchise, feeling that they could scarcely venture to do so with justice to their families. He remembered, some years ago, at an elec tion for that borough which he now had the honour to represent, the parties on both sides came to him and asked if he had any objection that they should see his workmen, but they added that they supposed it would be of no use, for, of course, the men were already pledged to vote as he might dictate. To this his reply was, that they could canvass his men if they pleased—that he would as soon think of meddling with a man's pocket as with his vote.—(Hear, hear.) But, though he did not interfere with his men, the application to him in his own borough showed how the system of open voting worked; and it was the same in all manufacturing towns. The majority of the masters were as tyrannical towards the working men as the ladies were towards the shopkeepers. He asked, would they give to men the privilege of voting and not protect them in the exercise of that privilege? Let them look at the effect of vote by ballot in Belgium. It was established there in 1830, and he had every reason to believe that it worked very well to the satisfaction of all men in that country. The ballot was not now a part of our system in this country, but it would soon become so; it would not fail to be so in some time. It was ridiculous to talk of doing everything openly; men did net leave their account-books and papers open to all the world. Colonel SIBTHORP had no objection to make to what had fallen from the Hon. Member for Manchester, but, in reference to the remarks of the lion. Member for Birmingham, he must be allowed to observe that he by no means concurred with that Hon. Gentleman in wishing that England should imitate foreign nations. He entertained a decided objection to the introduction of foreign manners and customs; even the Exposition d'ln dustrie—(A laugh)—did not appear to him so admirable a project as some thought it. He had listened with in finite pleasure to the observations that night made by his excellent friend the Member for London, for that Hon. Gentleman relied on his own integrity and his own consistency, and was never afraid of open voting. Dur ing more than twelve , years he (Colonel Sibthorp) had the honour of a sent in that House,—how long he might continue to retain that scathe did not know, but of this ho felt assured, that his manner of voting in that House would undergo no change. He should despise the voter who supported him in a covert, tricky, un-English man ner, and ho could say in the face of a British House of Commons that he had never bribed any voter, nor ever influenced a tenant. He did not know what the Noble Lord at the head of the Government might say to vote by ballot, but for his part he should never cease to op pose it.—(hear.) Mr. HUME would judge the Hon. Member who spoke last from his own words; be talked of the practice being un-English. Let him look at the clubs of London.— (Cries of " Oh, oh! ') The ballot no doubt might work an unpleasant and extraordinary change in the House of Commons; but he remembered the time when it was de fended by those who opposed it now. As to the state ments by the Hon. Member for Stockport, he could not help saying that that Hon. Gentleman was altogether mistaken—he had libelled his own constituents, for within the last three weeks a public meeting had been held there at which thousands of the inhabitants declared in favour of the ballot. If the ballot were established there would be no bribery, for who would " buy a pig in a poke?" Ho thought that the Hon. Member for London was also mistaken. Mr. MASTEIIMAN said he had never stated that his constituents were against the ballot; what he said was, that they had never intimated to him that they wanted it. Mr. HUME resumed. There had been twenty-five meetings in London recently which had declared in favour of the ballot. Tne Right Hon. Baronet (Sir G. Grey) said there was no demand for the ballot. The reason was that the people knew too well the constitution of the Houso—(Hear, hear)—the fact being that at almost every popular meeting they declined to petition the House of Commons.—(Hear, hear.) He had only this to say, that they who used the ballot to protect themselves acted unjustly, un-English, and unmanly in refusing it to others.—(Cheers.) Mr. HEALD rose to explain. He said ho was certain that neither the Hon. Member for Montrose nor the Hon. Member for Manchester wished to misrepresent him. What ho said was that ho believed nine-tenths of the constituency of the empire, including his own, aid not require the ballot as a means of protection in recording their votes.—(Loud cries of " Oh, oh!") His argument was that such a proportion prided themselves in having it known what were their distinctive principles, and who was their favourite candidate.—(" Oh, oh I") Mr. BERKELEY replied—He said he would detain the House only a very few minutes, for he did not find that he had much to answer.—(Cheer.) He had first to accept the explanation of the Right Hon. Baronet (Sir G. Grey), and to assure him that he had never meant to attribute to him the use of at y words expressive of trans cendent virtues and purity in relation to the upper classes; he only ascribed the sentiment to the Right Hon. Baronet, who had borne him out in this interpretation. With respect to the ballot it would be a cure for bribery in large constituencies, but not in small ones. He had heard nothing to-night that had at all shaken his opinion respecting the ballot, which he did not, however, pretend was a panacea for the evils which he desired to remedy. He was convinced that these small constituencies must, sooner or later, be done away with. It had been said, that if the ballot became a law, a man would be compelled to secrecy; but this was a mistake. A man might go and proclaim his vote; he might march up to the polling booth with banners and music if he chose; but if ho saw that he would be ruined by taking a certain course, the ballot afforded him proper protec tion.—(Hear, hear.) He trusted that he should find himself supported on the present occasion by all those Members who had heretofore voted in favour of the ballot.—(Cheers.) The House then divided, when there appeared— For the motion 121 Against it -• 176 Majority The announcement of the numbers was received with cheering by the friends of the ballot. Lord MELGUND moved for leave to bring in a Bill to reform and extend the school establishments of Scot land. The Noble Lord, who was very indistinctly heard, was understood to say that many defects existed in the school establishments of Scotland, for which a re medy was demanded, and this he intended in some degree to supply by the measure w hi c h ho wished to in troduce. Ho proposed to establish some educational test for teachers, and to raise as high as possible the profession and status of that class of the community. He would give large parishes the power of dividing them selves into districts for educational purposes, and ho would enable adjoining localities to unite together and form themselves into unions for the same object. If l eave were given to bring in the Bill, he would explain more fully on a future occasion the provisions of the measure ; but he felt that at that late hour he would not be justified in detaining the House. Sir G. CLERK regretted that the lateness of the hour had prevented the Noble Earl from stating more at length the nature of the Bill. He would not oppose the introduction of the measure, but he hoped that ample time would be given to consider it in all its bearings before the House was called upon to discuss either the principle or the details, Leave was then given to bring in the Bill. Mr. WOOD obtained leave to bring in a Bill to pre vent the holding of vestry or other meetings in churches, and for regulating the appointment of vestry-clerks. The 13111 was not intended to be one of a compulsory Photo, but to enable parishes of 1:119TO than 1,000 MA RCH 8,181 W. bitants to make a7plication to the Poor-law- Commis sioners for power to extend its provisions to such parishes. It was p roposed to authorise the payment of ve3try-clerks out of the rates of the parish. Leave was given to bring in the Bill. Mr. ADAIR obtained leave to bring in a Bill to provide for the more equitable distribution of the charge for the relief of the poor in certain cities and towns. Oil the motion of Mr. HUME, a return was ordered of the name of each of her Majesty's ships of war in commission and in ordinary on the Ist of January, 1850, and by whom built, &.c.; of the number of ships in commission and in ordinary in each year, since 1828; and an account of the sums expended ou each ship in build. ing and repairing, SE, - ;., since 1828. Mr. BAINES moved for leave to bring in a Bill to make better provision for the contributions of unions and pa:ishes iu school districts to the common fund of the respective districts. The object of the Bill was to re move some doubts that had arisen as to the meaning of an Act passed in 1544 on this subject, and which con tained a number of very valuable provisions. It related to the contributions made to district schools. The ave rages were at present taken at different periods in the various parishes comyrising each union, and one object of the present Bill was to take the averages simulta neously. Again, there was no provision in the present law to add ono parish to a school district composed of a certain number of unions. The Bill would provide for this also, and, as an instance, he might mention that the parish of St Luke, Chelsea, would be added to the North Surrey Union school district. Leave was given to bring in the Bill. Mr. TRELAWNY gave notice that he would ask the Noble Lord at the head of the Government whether any steps bad been taken in pursuance of a sort of under taking given by him (Lord J. Russell) in 1847, that cer tain persons connected with the union schools should have some of the small offices of the State. CHARITABLE TRUSTS BILL. The SOLICITOR-GENERAL moved the second reading of this Bill. Mr. TURNER opposed it, on the ground of the late ness of the hour and the thinness of the House. The Bill was postponed de die in diem, to give the Solicitor-General the first available opportunity to move it. The House went into Committee on the REGISTRAR OF METROPOLITAN PUBLIC CARRIAGES BILL. In reply to Mr. BANKES, Mr. C. LEWIS stated that the proposed compensa tion of the present officers would effect a saving to the public. The Bill was passed through Committee, The House adjourned at a Quarter past One o'clock. PARLIAMENTARY DIVISIONS. (From the Votes and Proceedings of the House of Consoscoss.) THURSDAY, MARCH 7, KILIZUSEI UNION. Motion made, and Question put, " That an humble Ad dress be presented to her Majesty, praying that she will be graciously pleased to appoint a Special Commission to in quire into the social state of the Union of Kilrush, and into the means that may be adopted for its amelioration." The souse divided : MINORITY-AYES, CA. Adair, Hugh E. Grace, 0. D. Packe, C. W. Armstrong, Sir A. Greene, John Perfect, Robert Arundel, Earl of Harris, Richard Pilkington, Jame, Bennet, P. Heald, James Plumptre, J. P. Blair, Stephen Henry, Alexander Prime, Richard Blake, Martin J. Hood, Sir A. Rawdon, Colonel Bright, John Horsman, Edward Reynolds, John Brisco, M. Hume, Joseph Salwey, Colonel Brotherton, J. Keating, Robert Stanford, J. F. Buck, L. W. Kershaw, James Stuart, Lord D. Chichester, Lord J. Lewisham, Viscount Sullivan, Michael Collins, William Meagher, Thomas Talbot, J. 11. Devereux, John T. Mahon, O'Gorman Tenison, E. K. Duncan, Ocorge Monsell, William Thicknessc, Ralph Ellis, John Moody, C. A. Thompson, Colonel Evans, Sir De Lacy Moore, George IL Wakley, T. Evans, William Mowatt, Francis Walmsley, Sir:J. E wart, William Manta, G. F. Wawn, J. T. Fagan, William Naas, Lord Williams, John Fox, W. J. Norreya, Sir D. TELLERS. Gaskell, J. M. O'Connell, Maurice Scrope, G. P. Gore, W. 0. O'Flaherty, Anthony Herbert, H. A. MAJORITY-NOES, 76. Abdy, Sir T. N. Fitzroy, Henry Pelham, D. A Adair, It. Shaft° Foley, J. H. Pigott, Francis Aglionby, 11. A. Forster, M. Price, Sir It Alcock, Thomas Fox, It. M. Rice, E. R. Armstrong, R. B. Freestun, Colonel Richards, Richard Baines, M. T. French, F. Romilly, Colonel Barnard, E. G. Glyn, G. C. Romilly, Sir John Berkeley, Admiral Graham, Sir James Russell, Lord J. Berkeley, henry F. Grey, Sir G. Rutherfurd, A. Berkeley, C. L. G. Hatched, John Shed, R. L. Blackall, S. W. Ilayter, W. G. Somerville, Sir W. Bouverie, E. P. Hildyard, R. C. Strickland, Sir G. Brockman, E. D. Hobhouse, Sir John Stuart, Lord J. Campbell, W. F. Howard, Lord E. Tancred, H. W. Clay, James Jones, Captain Thornely, Thomas Clive, Henry B.' King, I'. J. Trelawny,'J. S. Cobbold, J. C. Labouchcre, Henry Tufnell, H. Cowper, W. F. Langston, J. H. Turner, George Dick, Quintin Lewis, George C 4 Verney, Sir H. Duncan, Viscount Martin, John Villiers, Charles Damslas, Admiral Matheson ' Colonel Wilcox, Brodie Dundas, Sir David Melgund, Viscount Wilson, Matthew Ebrington, Viscount Milner, W. M. Elliot, John Morris, David Evans, John Paget, Lord C. Fergus, John Parker, John Ferguson, Sir R. Peel, Frederick TELLERS. Bellew, It. M. Grey, It. W. ,BALLOT. Motion made, and Question put, " That leave be given to bring in a Bill to protect the Parliamentary Electors of Great Britain and Ireland from undue influence, by the use of the Ballot." The House divided:— Adair, Hugh E. Adair, R. A. Aglionby, H. A. Alcock, Thomas Anderson, Arthur i Armstrong, R. B. MINORITY—AYES, 121. Grenfell, Charles W. Rawd o n, C o l one l Hall, Sir B. R e y no ld s, J ohn i l , a tr ll n y is b , ttr it t i o e r h i, ,, L rd ord Ricardo, Osman Harris, J. A. Rice, E. R. Rom illy, Colonel Hastie, Alexander Romilly, Sir John Bagshaw, John Headiam, Thomas Salwey, Colonel Barnard, E. G. Henry, Alexander Scholefield, W. Berkeley, C. L. Heywood, James Scrope, G. P. Bernal, Ralph Ileyworth, L. Scully, Francis Blake, M. J. 11111, Lord M. Shafts, R. D. Blewitt, R. J. Ilobhouse, T. B. Smith, J. A. Bouverie, E. P. llume, J. Smith, John B. Boyle, Colonel Ilumphery, Ald. Spearman, 11. J. Bright, John Kershaw, James Stanstleld, W. R. Brocklehurst, John King, I'. J. Strickland, Sir G. Brotherton, Joseph Langston, J. 11. Stuart, Lord J. Clay, James ' Locke, Joseph Sullivan, Michael Clay, Sir W. M'Cullagh, W. T. Talbot, J. 11. Cobden, Richard Meagher, Thomas Tancred, 11. W. Collins, W. Mahon, O'Gorman Tennent, R. J. Currie, Itaikes Mangles, R. D. Thicknesse, R. A. Dawson, T. V. Marshall, William Thompson, Colonel Devereux, J. T. Martin, J. Thompson, George IVEyncourt, C. T. Milner, W. M. Thornely, T. Duke, Sir J. Mitchell, T. A. Towneley, John Duncan, Lord Moffatt, George Trelawny, J. S. Duncan, George Morris, David Tufhell, henry Dundas, Admiral Mowatt, FrauciS Villiers, Charles Ellis, John 3luntz, G. F. .. Wakley, Thomas Enfield, Lord Norreys, Sir D. Walmsley, Sir J. Evans, Sir Do Lacy Nugent, Lord Wawn, J. T. Evans, J. O'Connell,l3faurice Willcox, Brodie Evans, William O'Flaherty, Anthony Williams, John Ewart, William Osborne, Ralph Wilson, Matthew Fagan, William Paget, Lord A. Wood, W. P. Fox, W.I.T. Paget, Lord C. Wyvill, Marmaduko Freestun, Colonel Paget, Lord;Georgo Gibson, T. M. Pechell, Sir G. Glyn, G. C. Perfect, It. Greene, John Pigott, Francis Grenfell, C. Pascoe Pilkington, James TELLERS. Berkeley, H. F. Stuart, Lord Dudley MAJORITY—NOES, 176. Ferguson, Sir R. Mulgrave, Earl Filmer, Sir E. Mailings, J. R. Fitzpatrick, J. W. Mundy, William Fitzroy, Henry Niuts, Lord Foley, J. H. Newdegate, C. N. Forbes, William Norreys, Lord Forester, G. C. Oswald, A. Fuller, A. E. Facke, C. W. Gaskell. J.M.: Palmer, Robert Gladstone, W. E. Palmer, Roundell Gore, W. 0. Palmerston, Vis. Goulburn, Henry Patten, W. Graham, Sir J. Peel, Sir Robert Grey, Sir G. Peel, Frederick Grey, Ralph W. Pelham, D. A. Grogan, Edward Plowden, W. 11. Guernsey, Lord Dunmire, J. P. Halsey, T. P. Portal, 31elvillo Hamilton, G. A. Price,lSir Robert Hamilton, J. H. Prime, Richard Harcourt, G. Reid, Colonel Hatchell, John Repton, G. 'W. J. Heald, James Richards. Richard lieathcote,lG. J. Rumbold, C. E. Henley, J. W. Russell, Lord John Herbert, Sidney Russell, F. C. Hervey, Lord A. Scott, Francis llthlyard, It. C. Seymour, Lord Hildyaril. T. 13. Shelburne, Earl of Hobhouso, Sir J. Sibthorp, Colonel Hodgson, W. N. Smollett, A. Hogg, Sir J. W. Somerset, Captain Hood, Sir A. Sotheron, T. 11. S. Hope, A. Spooner, Richard Ilornby John Stafford, Augustus Hotham, Lord Stanford, J. F. 'Howard, Sir It. Stanley, Edward Hughes, W. 13. Stailley,:E. H. Inglis, Sir It. Stanton, W. S. Jerrnyn, Earl Start, 11. G. Jocelyn, Viscount Taylor, T. E. Johnstone, Sir J. Thompson, Alderman Jolliffe, Sir W. G. Trevor, G. Jones, Captain Turner, George Knox, Colonel Tyrell, Sir J. Labouchere,:llenry Vane, Lord 11. Lennard, T. B. Verney, Sir li. Lewis, G. C. Vesey, Hon. T. Lindsay, Colonel Waddington, David Littleton, E.ilt. Waddington, 11, S. Lockhart, W. Walpole, S. 11 Mackenzie, W. F. Walsh, Sir J. B. Martin,tC. W. Watkins, Colonel Matheson, Colonel Wegg - Prosser, F. Maxwell, lion. J. P. 'Wellesley, Lord C. Melgund, Viscount Wortley4S, Aims, Sir H. Miles, P. W. S. Moody, C. A. Morgan, 0. Acland, Sir T. Adderley, C. B. Archdall, Captain Arkwright, Armstrong, Sir A. Ashley, Lord Baines, M. T. Bankes, G. Baring, 11. B. Baring, Thomas Barrington, Lord Batcson, Thomas Bennet, Philip Beresford, William Illackall, S. W. Blair, Stephen Blandford, Marquis llowles. Admiral liramston, T. W. Brisco, M. Broadley, Brockman, E. D. Brooke, Lord Buck, L. W. Buller, Sir Y. Banbury, E. 11. Burrell, Sir C. Burroughes, 11. N. Buxton, Sir E. Cabbell, B. B. Campbell, W. F. Cardwell, Edward Carew, W. P. Castlereagh, Vis. Cayley, Edward . S. Childers, J. W. Christy, Samuel Clerk Sir George Clive, H. H. Clive, 11. B. Cobbold, J. C. Cocks, T. S. Cole, lion. H. A. Colebrooke, Sir T. Coles, 11. U. Compton, 11. C. Cowper, W. F Cubitt, William Denison, J. E. Dick. Quintin Dodd, George Drummond, Home Duckworth, Sir J. Duff, George S. Duncembe, 0. Dundee, G. Dunne, F. P. Du Pre, C. G. Edwards, H. Fergus, John TILLERS. Howard, Lord E. _ _ 3 14sterulan — ,i. RAILWAY SHARE MARKETS. BRISTOL, MARCH STOCK EXCHINGE.—The market to-day has been more animated. The transactions were as follow:—Bristol and Exeter, 31 dis.—Great Western, Quarters, 14.74 ex div.— Ditto, New 17/. Shares, ,7% dis. ex div.—Midland Stock, 40% ex div. LIVERPOOL, MAiscir 7. STOCK EXCHANCIE.—The market was better to-day, and a goad business has been done, the market closing firmly at the quotations. The transactions were as follow : Lancashire and Yorkshire, Consol. Fifths,B% :dis. London and North-Western, 106%—Ditto, New Quarters, par —Ditto, Fifths, >N p.—Ditto, Quarters (C), c. p.—Mid land, 41—Ditto, Halves, 241. 11s. 3d.—East Lincolnshire, 71. 3s. 9d.—Great Western, 59—North Union (A), guaran teed jointly by London and North-Western and Lancashire and Yorkshire, 235—Ditto (11), 164 1 , 9 —Y0rk, Newcastle, and Berwick (Original N. and 13.) Extension Nos. 1 and 2, ork and North Midland, 1234—Datch Rhenish, 6 dis.—Lancaster and PrestoH, p. MANCEIESTER, MARCH 7. STOCK EXCHANGE.—Our share market was very firm to-day, but the amount of business dono was limited. The transactions were as follow : Lancashire and Yorkshire, 44—Ditto Fifths, 83i dis.—London and North-Western, 106 ex d.—Ditto, Manchester and Birmingham (C), Quarters, 9.16 p. Manchester, Sheffield, and Lincolnshire, Prefer ence, 7 c.—Whitehaven and Furness, 14% dis. BIRMINGHAM, MARCH 7. STOCK EXCHANGl3.—Business on our Stock Exchange to-day was very dull. The only transaction was—North Stafibrdshire, 10 ', 7, 4 dis. YORK, MARCH 6. srocA ZXVIAXO3.'"4IIO tZalauction4 to-diy wore NI THE SUN, LONDON,_ FRIDAY EVENING, APPOINTMENTS. WooLwlca, MARCH 7.—Midshipmen—Granville Temple to the Centaur steam-frigate, flag-ship on the west coast of Africa; George Blakeley to the Con flict steam-sloop, attached to the Lisbon squadron. CAPTAIN AUSTIN'S ARCTIC EXPEDITION. One corporal and one bombardier of the Royal Marino Artillery from Portsmouth, and two ser geants, two corporals, and 20 privates of the Wool. with division of Royal Marines, embarked to-day at Woolwich Dockyard on board the Salsette receiving ship for service in the vessels appointed to form the North-West Arctic Expedition. Upwards of 50 men volunteered for the service from the Woolwich divi sion of Royal Marines, and consequently there were great facilities for selecting the best and most healthy for this undertaking. THE DIORAMA. Yesterday we had the gratification of attending a private exhibition at the Diorama, in Regent's-p ar k, and to-day the two pi c t ures th ere on view will be opened to public examination. Of the second, excellent as it is, we shall say nothing whatever, seeing that we re member some years ago the very same production-- the " Shrine of the Nativity at Bethlehem," painted by the late M. Renoux from a sketch made on the spot by David Roberts, Esq., R.A.—exhibited in this very same establishment. The other work of art now to be seen at the Diorama is deserving of some further notice from its novelty. It represents the Castle of Stolzenfels on the Rhine, a romantic and beautiful locality, where, in 1845, her Majesty Queen Victoria was royally entertained by Frederick Wil liam the King of Prussia, on the occasion of her Ma jesty's journey to Saxe-Cobonrg. The whole expanse of the landscape, including the castle, the environs of Stolzenfels, and the blue and winding Rhine, is very felicitously pourtrayed : animation being imparted to the view by the charming natural effects of light and shade produced by the setting of the sun and the coming on of a storm of rain, thunder, and lightning. After the sun has sunk below the horizon it appeared to us, however, that the effect was somewhat marred by the strange green hue of the heavens. Neverthe less, altogether, the painting as a whole, which is the production of Nicholas Meister of Cologne, is ex• ceedingly clever, and by no means unworthy of ad vancing the credit of the Diorama. SP OR.TIN G INTELLIGENCE. DONCASTER SPRING MEETING. Acceptances fur the Graad National Steeplechase. Peter Simple, aged, 12st—British Yeoman, aged, let 121b—Farnham, 6 yrs, list—Lucy Neale, aged, Oat 121b—Rachael, aged, lOst 4113—Ace of Trumps, Ost 41b— Quadruped, aged, lOst 21b—Young Lottery, Iged, 9st 61b—Peetliag, aged, 9st. Acceptances for the Doncaster Handicap; St. Leger Course. The highest weight accepting being under Bst 71b, it has been raised, &c. Foreclosure, 6 yrs, Bst 71b—Meaux, 6 yrs, Bst 61b— Priestess, 4 yrs, Bst 21b—Pelham, 4 yrs, Bst lib—Anda lusian, 4 yrs, 80t I lb—Lnxor, 6 yrs, 7st 81b—King 6 yrs, 7st 61b—Lady I am off, 5 yrs, ist 31b— Good Girl, 5 yrs, 7st llb—Didsbury, 4 yre, 7st 11b—Dulcamara, 5 yrs, ist llb; Laura, 3 yrs, sst 101 b; Timothy, 3 yra, sst 81b. TATTEBSALL'S.—YESTERDAT. With the single exception of Cheerful, on whom a good deal of money was laid out at 4 to 1, 10 to 3, and 5 to 2, the favourites for the spring engagements were scarcely mentioned; the select few were backed for am trifles. The J)erby betting was limited to three or four, viz.:—The Italian, Clincher, Mayors, and Mildew, and did not exceed the amount specified in our quotatiune. Business altogether was exceedingly dull. THE NORTHAMPTONSHIRE STAKES. 20 to 1 agst Duke of Bedford's Mahratta, 4 yrs, sst 111 h 25 to 1 agst Mr. Irwin's Ballinafad, 6 yrs, 7st 71b 6 to 1 offered on the field. THE ALTHORP PARK STAKES. 5 to 1 agst Duke of Richmond's Buckhound 7 to 1 agst Mr. Delamere's Forlorn Hope—taken METROPOLITAN HANDICAP. 5 to 2 sgst Mr. Gratwicke's Cheerful, 4 yrs, 6st—t 20 to 1 agst any other. 800 to 100 agst Cheerful winning this event, and Flying Dutchman the Emperor's Plate—taken WARWICKSHIRE KANDICAP. 7 to 2 agst Mr. Irwin's Ballinafad 4 to I agst Lord J. Scott's Defaulter CHESTER CUP. 29 to 1 agst Mr. Osbaldeston's Fogleman, 5 yrs, 7st —taken 1,000 to 20 agst Mr. Irwin's Horn of Chase, 6 yrs, 7at 101 b—taken 50 to 1 agst Sir R. Pigot's Essedarius, 4 yrs, 7st 91b 2,000 to 20 agst Mr. Osbaldeston's Minimum, 4 yrs, sst 101 b—taken DERBY. 6 to 1 agst Duke of Richmond's Ghillie Callum.— take 7 to 1 agst Mr. W. Edwards na Bolingbroke —taken agst Lord Eglinton's Knight of Avenel agst Mr. Gratwicke's The Nigger—taken agst Mr. Meiklam's Tho Italian-17 to 1 taken to 50/. G to 1 agst Lord Zetland's Voltigour 8 to 1 agst Lord Airlie's Clincher—taken to 350/. 22 to 1 agst Lord Eglinton's Manors—takoa to 1004 25 to 1 agst Mr. Jaques's Mildew—taken to 2001. 3,000 to 100 agst Cheerful winning the Metropolitan and Bolingbroke the Derby—taken. 5 to 2 1 to 1 2 to 1 G to 1 DERBY, 1851. 4,000 to 100 agst Duke of Richmond's Buckhoand—t 2,000 to 75 agst Lord Stanley's Storm—taken TILE CREMORNE GARDENS.-.-At the annual licens. ing meeting for the Kensington division of Middlesex, Mr. Flood, sen., who was for many years the chairman of the bench, opposed the renewal of the licence for the above place of entertainment, on the ground that the proprietors conducted it in a manner which involved a great desecration of the Sabbath. The licence was SRI* pended until the adjournment day, the 20th March; the managers being directed on that day to present to the bench a memorial, stating in Writing how they would conduct the gardens, and if it was approved of, the op position to the licence) would be withdrawn. ILLNESS OF SIR JAMES GIBSON CRAlG.—Great sympathy and interest have existed in the city for several days, on account of the intelligence that the venerable Sir James Gibson Craig was dangerously ill at Riccar ton. The malady is bronchitis. accompanied by frailty natural to an age of 85 years. On Friday, tho symptoms were so alarming that a telegraphic message was sent to London to bring down Mr. William Gibson Graig, M.P., who arrived on Saturday afternoon, and has remained in attendance since. Wo have intelligence from Riccarton up to ten o'clock last night, at which hour Sir James was " no better."—Scotsman of Wednesday. APPREHENSION ON SUSPICION OF MURDER.—At the sitting of the Central Police Court on Saturday a big powerful fellow, named Kelly, was brought up for examination, on a charge of being concerned in th e murder of a female, which was committed last summer in the vicinity of Londonderry. On the circumstances being stated the magistrate, of course, directed that the prisoner should be transferred to the authorities there to hare the case investigated. Ile had been living for some months near New Monkland as a labourer, but had been tracked by the Derry constabulary, one of whom, on the authority of a warrant from a justice there, with the concurrence of the sheriff-mibbtitute, arrested him.. Glasgow Daily Pittil. ! follow: York, Newcastle, and Berwick, 14 E Counties, 7/. 3 s . 9d.—E ast Lancashire, 9l—North-'':sistarn tern. 11. 13s. 9d. --York 4 York and North Midland, P re f erence, 6' . GLASGOW, MARCH 6. STOCK EXCHANGE.—The transactions to-day Icere follow :—Edinburgh and Glasgow, 544—Monklands, 62-- Scottish Grand Junction, 2s. 9d. .AVAL INTELLIGENCE. GIARALTAR, 26.—The Peninsular and Ori ental Company's steamer upon, with the outward East India and China mails, in five days and thre(s quarters from Southampton, arrived here this morn ing, and proceeded at 5 p.m. for Malta and Alexandria, all well. The Janus and the French steam-frigate Laroisier remain at anchor in the bay. The British steamer Pirate, 11 days from Liver pool, and the screw steamer Bosphorus, nine days from Liverpool, arrived here on the 23d, and sailed fur Constantinople. The Peninsular Company's steamer Madrid, six days from Southampton, arrived on the 22d, and proceeded for Genoa, Leghorn, and Civita *Vecchia. She had very heavy weather on the passage out. The steamer Sharpshooter, seven days from Malta, touched here on the 22d, en route to England. The steamer Osmanli, from Genoa and Leghorn, arrived here on the 18th; and the Levantine, 10 days from Liverpool, fur the same ports, arriv e d on the same day, and proceeded. The British steamer Free Trade sailed on the 18th for Genoa. ... The Danish sloop Bonne Esperance, from Messina, put in here on the 18th in a damaged state. 'Wind, S.E., fresh gale, and clear weather. CADIZ, FEB. 27.—A large French steam-frigate (name unknown), arrived here this morning. The 'French screw-frigate, Pomone, 36, remains here. LISBON, MARCH I.—There are no British vessels , . of-war in the Tagus. The Royal Yacht schooner Fair Rosamond, from Cadiz, and the schooner Talbot of Plymouth, are off Belem Castle. VIGo, AlA.aca 3.—The Peninsular steamer Jupi ter, with the outward mails of the 27th February, arrived here this morning, and proceeded to the southward. PORTSMOUTH T —R , HURSDAY.ear-Adm iral Prescott is better to-day. 1 The Lily, 12, ha s b een comm i ss i oned and is enter ing men. She will sail with the mail of the Ist proximo for the coast of Africa, and proceed thence for the East India station. The Dublin Royal Mail Company's steam-packet Royal William arrived here this morning front Cork with the depot of the 7th Royal Fusiliers, which landed at the dock-yard this afternoon, and marched to the Landport terminus of the South-Western and South Coast Railway, whence they left per train for Winchester barracks. The fourth company of the Royal Sappers and Miners, under Captain Craige, of the Royal Engi. neers, will arrive at this port from Woolwich on the 21st inst., to relieve the company under Captain Barry, R.E., which returns the same day to Wool wich. II ..... 0