The Sun. — London, England, 1850-04-16 00:00:00

THE SUN, LONDON, TUESDAY EVENING, rz,tcellor of th e E xc h equer) stated as to relief front ".alv3n, W 113 this, th at h e proposed a measure IN ith rc te stately', the lo ss u p on w hi c h wou ld b e somew h ere "'t 300,0004 ; arid another mea.,ure with regard to h hity on b r i cks, the loss upon which would be some cver 450 000/ two • tk; - the ogethr, a loss , • , or, a .13, • Jou 000/, The Hon. G e ntl eman said, t now e tba, - he Chateellor i f f the Exchequer) had, somehow or - 'er, a surplus of 300,0001. But ho was at a loss to my , whe nce i t was to come. When he stated that the assure he Proposed with regard to stamps would in- Ave a loss of somewhere under 300,0004 ho at the oairette time stated th at h e proposed to relieve transactions of"':' i sMa ll amount, as h e had done, and increase those .„_ ar ger amount ; an d t h at upon a b a l ance h e s h ou ld .',,3oooooL—(llear hear.) , 1 411 : DISRAELI said the Hight Honourable Gentle .":„.."ad, spoke l of an ad vale? cm duty; as well as of the a, e 'ten of a lower duty, which was to be accepted as kraPensation in relief of small proprietors. But what c, „the Honourable Gentleman mean to do with the 3 ,00 1. in that case ? To't ilk of a balance was a very iarenient fiction, but there was nothing said of a ba '' ate when th ere was talk of a com p ens ation. The ,`" eleraittee was now told that the loss on the b a l ance Za t, ld be 350,0001. T hat was not the or i g i na l id ea of uu dgel. In fact, i t now turne d ou t th a t, instead f 4,tremission of ta , x_ktion, there would be an increase the CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER stated i t tine tlY that th ere was to be an ad valorem duty, a l , tt lowerine• h , the lesser duty without increasing the Ater would he a equivalent to a loss of 300,000/. th . _ GOULI3URN wished t know on what principle loss in question had been calculated, The Riqht k UentletUan said that if the duties on large and small - ertk tie -age3 w ere rsduced one-haif, the loss would not be ‘i ther e re than 60 0001. Th e .weoullidA hNeCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER said ' stietitsn a great loss on conveyances—the 20 0 ,,,,,,,0n that branch alone was calculated at The increase in small transactions, it was ze-11 vv ould help up t h e resenue ; an d it was r th at parti es would get instruments stampe d here t. ~ - etoicr. 40 ho had n ever got them stamped before. H e cal - - "(1 at „, g would sornethin be gained on this aa .well -enga ge ,. I %V' 11ACKENZIE asked how it was proposed evaded 1 ift.r re t e h . Bta mPing a large transaction? It might be The - r ,",N"ing of this Act as it was before. va s "aANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER said it mnot worth while. V? ' e It e E NLEY said the sum of 60,000/ fixed by the Lime Gentleman was so precise, that it was clear et e roust be materials in the possession of the Go t! I I!caent whereon to base it. He, therefore, thought CTireresation should not be withheld from the House. r A ' TT°R NEY-GENERAL said it would be seen ou l id e e °_ l3:l P 4 railve estimate of conveyances . that there uc a considerable saving in transactions up to Th em:nu:ion stain p of 9L would suffice to that 14 111 . e Prom that to 100,0 01. the scale was nearly the o * 4 , r 1 ,,,,_ 110 present. Conveyances beyond 100,00 / in . ss e 4 t i -Y ,'"' r e. The proceeds of the present scale were 4,4 4 8 , 1/ which was equivalent in stamps to Ss ' 61 . The loss on conveyances, therefore, s)f be 266,299/. 4s 63 assuming the same number trilesaetions aft r " ssing of the Bill as before. If tb from F e- f pa -•- s and following stamps lit Ire added ; wey er W : .. stsvo e u as ld e3 am or ou ) n e t ar to_ 309,0001. All that, to tii,"" of course a matter of estimate. plain in the matter. The Hon. Secretary for the ry im Skid he could obtain no return of the stamps on , leSancest_but the Attorney-General, nevertheless, it °Ned the !louse exactly what the amount of the trans irbeehawaere. He was, therefore, in possession of data „ The net been communicated to the House. ore CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER could 11 to . a " 438 , but he could not prove a gain in this in to „'• The Government knew the number of stamps ii r equired "e Market, but they could not tell how many would for mortgages, or how many . for convey s : 1 11 • They could only calculate a certain amount fur 1111. ass, PI -4,-ILLINGS said the 151. stamps were not ap t a ble to ' atsamt c onveyances • the • were only used in mote , settlements. He had it from good authority of preeeeds of the stamp duty on the conveyance frameson/11°a of from 10,000/. to 15,000/., and on settle 11' mcie 12,000/. to 15,000/., were 4,500/. or 4,600/. t ,„n, theta mall for mortgages, it would give an average li i r'' )Cl°L ; but taking two-thirds as mortgages and one lt as settlements , and taking off 4,500/, it would t t , 7Ye 14,25 0 4 t o 7ould Reducin g this by omissions to 1 2 , 000 /., 4,50 0/ iv e the stamps 30,001., a number equivalent ix tiir U• WILLOUGHBY said the Bill imposed new " 13 a s, which ought to have a full discussion. Under the lat he f leases would be taxed for instance : tl ne CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER said ioe r° wet no absolutely new tax in the Bill; but he fi te 'ght it would be more convenient to call attention to ? points in question as the clauses were proceeded with. BRIGetTof said there was an almost universal B i irVoa that the Bill would increase taxation, in placeof 14 tr,l'ally relief. As few Hon. Members wero conver tt with the nature of the Bill, he suggested that i !MiU.l(.l be sent to a Select Committee, to whom the whole nn of stamps could be referred. He was favourable y, an ad nuainiubeivaaanieeerdaenivpyrdoutaptxeyliataybut he wished one of a lower per a mts than that fixed by the Bill, which in his opinion hit erh _ . it stood upon all large transac e SOLICITOR -GENERAL said if the Bill was 11.0,:e;:tteSclellevs Chiomeziettheeee,there would be a number of sitl,t_ r ton itself would be absaonledtealybig wh b e lu re e b it oo w k a ; a b . ut ß th e e . sit "dint eh, he believed the forms of the House would 4t this ;re iTht of such a course of proceeding. He believed cou ntry would be greatly benefited by the re -9il 'ale .. 0 1 ; „ ); ,'" he also believed that there would be a loss lj to 3 00,000/. on the whole transaction. /Ltenia • ","'CRELL backed the suggestion of the Hon. t "r 'er Man c h es te r . He also thought the Bill should b. hew'' barer in a S e lect Committee. The Bill would lay teatee Y ta x upon land, inasmuch as conveyances P els er ..r : oPerty, whil e mor tg ag es represented debt. re In 5 4% e r 1 2 1 °D, lanad val o rem duty of 8 per cent. would be Pose, Jut ) and as muc h as there was any ground to ins to l ‘e rt. i ie S r A vt l) he L d E , IR said that the more the Bill came' e it. A:pheremseonrte fgeneral comprehended would bet h i e t s objections bearing; the At of the Government itself were not of 'te nor with with one another on the subject—the Chan -reor of the Exchequer stating one thing, and the At :lYGneral stating another. • As regarded Ireland, ta Government in his opinion had taken a most unfor et 1 4 te moment to apply the provisions of the Bill to that of t a rl trY, seeing that it Was almost impossible to dispose e a _ large estates which existed there under the cri c., ialpered Estates Commission. The purchaser would di s et it f set te the ad va l orem duty upon the stamp, an d de el it s , real the purchase money. But there was another th e ifteteserving the consideration of the House —namely, 4 0 , 1 ,„.'Ne class of proprietors who might be able to pre sal L01e; a portion of their property by effecting volunt e e r ? . t • of the remainder without coming within the op _ of the Bocumbered EA sees Act. The proposed . 4 mien would operate very severely upon them.. .The k etaveriercial classes in Belfast, Dublin, Cork, Limerhc .r , Waterford had been unable to communicatedt theei ls udt e s to the Government, and the bankers an d interest were in the same position. Under these et littorustnces, he hoped the Government would ~such with the Bill at the present moment, or, at n al! efr a, that ample time would be allowed for its con jatioia before taking the next stage. :.litiegir.olleUntllereE:roluld not understand the objection of the oPposite, because, if any class would t v h e benefit from the raising of this measure it would w _ o y rr „. ‘ , e proprietors and purchasers of Irish property, h Isis,' d be enabled to sell portions of property under fete. at• a reduced duty.—(Efee.r, hear.) When they Ait,.aasured by. the Government that the amount the le te ;` l ° l l under this Bill would bo less than under it Ai -ecl a t eYstetn by the sum of 300,0001, he considered eted d th e t 'Y Of the Ilouse' to support the reduction. It was by ar , l 'Ythe decrease on the smaller sums would be met th e s ee eterease on the larger ones; but he considered tinderoPosed distribution more equal than the former, te to'a i iv hich a large mass of property had been exemp ite l t he r n e :i to of ' the community at large. He t 0 aff,'°lntaittee would proceed with .the Bill, in order to beau swelter , the smaller proprietors who had hither r. e , Ilea oppressed. were no NOLLY said that as many . Hon. hd M e e e m m b e er s a t is eee mic i t ; vrepared to go into the discussion, a ho trustedSive answers bad been given by the Government, 'tiderei the Committee would defer the further con- Lord of the Bill to a future time.—(Hear.) 'teppe . '"p u ,,,_. RUSSELL could not see how the postpone the 4, 1 "u0 Bill for . a week or a fortnight would assist I.l o o,, r e et which 11 n Members had in view. The %tie; 'unalbor for Carlow o objected to the proposed altehr eiveti-,,," account of the condition of Ireland. That ? - of ly e did not apply merely to the present consideration uriug the but to its consideration at any period the d tati e „ end would, if successful, defeat c•onsider for of the Stamp Acts altogether. The subject had . N4 l ll lll / 3 ' Years attracted public observation. The In lttho_,ltuyoctif the stamp duty on land had been remarked 13 ' 11 Y in writing and at publicng to in nap ti s, but by quirey niraittee of the House of Lords, appointed d the e int) tho inequality of the Stamp Acts an te.sitt hardship inflicted on the smaller proprietors by the th att':Y. charge placed upon them. Last year we : dee e zi te tl°ll of the Chancellor of the Exchequer nOder--d to the subject, ,which the was brought e r e e notice of the House early in the flop nt session, and about a month ago his Right • 10 , Pliend- pointed out the nature of the measure da lch he intended to propose—namely, to diminish the ef s e J, I smaller conveyances, and the transactions • eater Proprietors, and at the same time to make duties h ad ajger transactions more equal. After thedetailseat tee_en given, and the resolution proposed. malty mentions were received by his Right Hon. the ohnt_°ll.B4l endeavoured, as far as possible, to obviate ha io ns which had been raised.—(Hear, hear.) But, 1": ? ul d ask, would no inconvenince arise from dFliq - R the measure for a month, and keeping the public in great inconvenience of the intentions of the House?—(Hear, hear..) . "'ee_.t inc onvenience always resulted from the . postpot . ie pt 9f measures of this kind, many transactions being tie tela Ogee aneeatice. If there was a genera l agreem ent P r inciple of the measure , let the Committee at 'u so,-,g o into a co nsi d eration of the ' details, in order that j eeti progress might be made.—(lfeer, hear.) The ob e) o r made by t h e H on. Member for Bridport applied und e xisting Act as mu c h as t o t h e measure now thi nk co nsideration. Th e H on . G ent l eman seemed to for k that a man with an estate of 50,0001., mortgaged not t 2° ' oool ., would b e i n a wer:e position than a 0•-• w ith an e s t a t e worth 20,0001., mortgaged for t o '• °(11 . But thi s was not a matter for Parliament fo_ into, If, however, th e o bj ect was good ,/,f, anything it applied equally to the present Aci. a ; %mount of duty on property exceeding 5,00/ , 1 2 4 , 1 ;4 more than 10,0001., sobs ; but exceeding the stamp Rag 25/. The ection, therefore, was not tenable; bat that and all other objections would be be:t , r considered as they arose on the different clauses.— (Hear.) Mr. MO WATT Paid, when ho considered that the effect cf the Bill would he to facilitate the transfer k f small portions of land—that it would relieve the pressure of stamps upon mortgages, conveyances, &c., having re lation to small propeleire, while it would extend the equitable principle of ad valorem taxation to large pro perties—he was at a loss to discover on what ground the measure could be objected to. Mr. MITCHELL said his remark was intended to show that whilst the duty on mortgages ought t be as low as possible. the amount would now be 31,/. for what was formerly charged 251. Mr. HEALD said, that after giving a portion of re lief out of the surplus revenue, the Bill would increase the taxation on interests of more than I,oool.—(Near, hear.) He wished to know how much the Chancellor of the Exchequer calculated the Treasury would lose by granting relief in eases up to 1,000/ ? The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER. said upon all conveyances up to 1,300 i. there would bo a po sitive relief. Upon all conveyances from 1,3001. to 100,0001. it was the same, or nearly the seine thing; for whilst et present the amount jumped from thousand to thousand, it was proposed to make it jump from hun dred to hundred, and the consequence would be that the stamp on every sum between 1001. and 500/. would be diminished, whilst above that sum it would be increased. He calculated the loss to the revenue upon the whole of the conveyances, upon some of the mortgages, and on leases, would be somewhere under 300,000/. By the alteration which he proposed tonight, in reducing the stamp duty on mortgages and bonds from one-half per cent. to our-quarter per cent., he expected to incur au other loss ; be', believing that by so doing he could in crease the number of transactions on which the stamp duty was laid, he calculated the loss upon the whole of the two schedules to be from 330,0001. to 350,0001. Mr. LAW said the object of the Right lion. Gentle man ems stated to be a reduction of the duty on amoucts under 1,000/., and his calculations were based on that sum, and he (Mr. Law) believed there existed a general desire to relieve these parties who were liable to the payments to that extent. But these existed on that (the Opposi tion) side of the House such an " ignorant impatience of taxation," that they were not prepared to receive any additioual burden.—(Hear, hear.) Mortgages were very ill able to bear a stamp. Mr. SPOONER remarked. that the Right Hon. Gene tlemau had not answered thesViestion of the Right Hon. Member for Stockport, who wished to know what would be the loss upon the reduCtion inhere should be no ad dition. Lord D. STUART believed the Chancellor of the Exchequer would show a great increase from the pro posed alteration. But at all events it would be a great relief to the poor,' and a step towards a fair apportion ment of taxation between the poor and the rich. In many cases the poor man paid 40 times as much as the rich, but by the Bill he would only pay about twice as much. Ile was surprised that the Hon. Member for Manchester should wish to delay the measure, which was calculated to facilitate the transfer of those freehold properties which the Hon. Member was so desirous of placing in the hands of the middling and lower classes. Mr. Alderman THOMPSON trusted the Committee would proceed with the Bill, which would confer a great benefit on persons making transfers not exceeding 1,300/. —(Hear.) But whether it might be wise to give the ad dition asked for was another question.—(Hear, hear.) Ile hailed the Bill with seti!faction, considering it a step in the right direction; but, in recommending the Com mittee to proceed with it, he was not at all prepared to adopt the ascending scale.—(Hear.) Mr. MULLINGS said the Bill was in a most imper- Lct state, and required much more consideration, inas much as it proposed to tax property which had hitherto not been liable to stamp duty, such as annuities, rents, Government debentures, &e., from which a considerable revenue would he derived. The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER said if the Hot. Member would submit his suggestions on the subject to the Government they should receive careful attention. Mr. SANDARS thought they ought to be informed what would Le the actual loss on the remission of taxa tion, without reference to the expected increase. He also pointed out the heavy tax inflicted on parties who had to register memorials in the register counties of York and Middlesex. Mr. HUDSON advocated the postponement of the dis cussion for a week. He bed been in communication with gentlemen connected with the legal profession, who had pointed out many objections to the measure; and be thought, therefore, that some further time ought to be afforded for its consideration.—(Divide, divide.) After some further conversation, the first clause was agreed to. On clause 2, Mr. SADLEIR wished to know how the case would stand with instruments executed prior to the passing of this measure. He knew that one of the most eminent conveyancers, who had carefully examined this clause, thought that the greatest difficulty would be found in affixing the proper duty, and to know whether they would come under the old or new law. The ATTORNEY-GENERAL said, if the Honour able Member would refer to the end of the first clause, he would find the difficulty removed; for it was there provided that the 'old duties contained in schedule A should Le repealed, except as to so much and in such parts of the said duties respectively as should have ac crued in respect of any deed or instrument signed or exe cuted, or which should bear date before or upon the sth July, 1850. So that all duties and all penalties on deeds executed before that day would come under the old Act, and those executed subsequently under the new. Mr. R. PALMER asked if the exemption in favour of building societies was to be continued? The ATTORNEY-GENERAL was understood to say that no alteration would be made as regarded the exemptions. The clause was then agreed to, as were clauses 3 and 4, after a short conversation. On:clause 5, which makes all persons receiving moneys for stamp (lades, and misappropriating the same, debtors to the Crown, Mr. HENLEY wished to know what would be dove with the deed in such cases? Was the party who bad been defrauded of the stamp duty to be deprived of the use of his deed? Mr. WALPOLE asked bow a good title could ever be made to the estate of a solicitor under such a law, for how could it be known to what extent he might be a debtor to the Crown? Mr. LAW asked if a party who bad paid the amount of duty so misapplied would be allowed to have the benefit of his deed on proving that he had paid the money? The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER was un derstood to say that the stamp would be made good in such cases. The clause was then agreed to. On clause 6, which raises the penalty on deeds stamped after execution from 51. to 101., and makes other altera tions in the mode of imposing it, Mr. SADLEIR protested against the innovation con tained in this clause. At present parties were enabled to get a deed stamped within sixty days after execution in Ireland, and six weeks in England, without any ex planation or affidavit. Had this practice worked ill? Had it led to any fraud, or bad there been any complaint from the solicitor of stamps, ur any protest ngainet it? None whatever, while many very important classes of the community would be found strongly in favour of maintaining the present system. It was most unwise to multiply occasions for adminiatering oaths, and he knew many who entertained strong objections to making the long affidavits which were often required for the pur pose of stamping deeds after the prescribed period had elapsed. He objected, moreover, to giving the Commissioners the discretion of requiring oaths at their plea sure. The ATTORNEY -GENERAL said that under the present system an affidavit was required after the ex piration of six weeks. That alteration was found neces— sary in consequence of the frequent occurrence of cases in which the duty was not paid at all until it became ne cessary to sell the estate, and then after a lapse of years the stamp was impressed on payment of the penalty of 5/. He knew an instance of this kind where a man held an estate for five•and-twenty years without paying any stamp duty at all. At the end of :that time the estate was sold, and it was found that a stamp of 1,00/. was payable, and this was obtained on payment of a penalty of V., the vendor having enjoyed the interest for 25 3ears. He knew another case of the same kind, in which a deed bad remained unstarsped since 1834. Alter some further discussion the clause was agreed to. Clause 7 was agreed to after certain words had omitted, on the motion of Alderman THOMPSON.been On clause 8, Mr GOULBURN thought this clause would impose an additional charge on the public, by allowing station ers to charge as they pleased for stamped paper. The ATTORNEY -GENERAL said that at present a vendor of stamps charged what price he pleased fur all stamped paper, except receipt stamps. It was proposed by this clause to put receipt stamps on the same footing in that respect as other stampF. The SOLICITOR -GENERAL said that there was no profit on receipt stamps to the seller. After a few words from Mr. CARDWELL and Mr. FORSTER in opposition to the clause, Mr. HUME thought that Government ought to fix tl:e sum which sellers of stamps should charge. If the clause was not altered, be should move it be struck out. The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER said he would not insist on the clause. Clause struck out. On clause 9, Mr. SADLEIR understood the Chancellor of the Ex chequer t 3 state that it was not intended to impose any duty on deeds at present exempted. He wished the right Hon. Gentleman, if that was his intention, to state so decidedly. The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER would state his intentions when they came to the schedule. The clause and the remaining clauses were then agreed to. On schedule A (the repealing schedule) being pro posed, Mr. MULLINGS wished to introduce certain words into the.schedule for the purpose of reducing the duty on agreements up to a certain amount. Mr. HU ME wished to know what corresponding duties the Hon . Member proposed to enact ? Mr. MULLINGS said he had a clause which he would propose to introduce into schedule B, respecting corresponding duties. At present he proposed to insert in schedule A words to the effect that in agreements con taining less than 1,080 wordy, there should be a duty of 2s. Gd. ; and for every other 1,080 words, a further duty of 2s. 6d. The ATTORNEY -GENERAL said that, as the law at present stood, agreements containing under 1,080 words were charged with a duty of 2s. 6d., and for every further 1,00 words. As he understood the pro posed alteration, the. effect of it would be tO keep the first charge of 23. 6 4 . as at present, but to make the second charge 2.. 61 instead of 555. That would cause a considerable loss to the revenue. After a short conversation, Ine CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER said the Hon. Gentleman had not given notice of his proposed amendments, as he had of his clauses; and as his propo sition would involve a loss to the revenue, he thought there ought to he some time allowed to consider it. The CHAIRMAN asked whether the Hon. Member intended pressing his amendment? Mr. MULLINGS—I do. The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER said he bad not had an opportunity of considering the proposal, and only wanted time fur that purpose. Mr. HUME suggested to the lion. Member not to press his motion to a division under the circumstances. Mr. ROEBUCK also said it was only fair to give time for the consideration of the proposition. Mr. HUME—Give notice. The amendment was then understood to have been withdrawn, and schedule A agreed to. The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER then moved that schedule B should be agreed to. In doing so he said he proposed to make a reduction of from one half to a quarter per cent. He proposed to reduce the duty upon bonds for any sum not exceeding 501. to from se. to 24. 6.1, and not exceeding 1001. from los. to ss. Mr. GOULBURN said he did not approve tho principle of an ad valorem duty being appliedin mattera of revenue. If they were prepares to go on with that principle they would make the lower part of their scale so low that it would entail considerable loss upon the revenue, while they would les obliged to make the higher part too high. Mr. ROEBUCK wished to know whether it was to be supposed just that the poor man, who only wanted to borrow 101., should pay as much in proportion as the rich one who wanted to borrow 10,000/.? The small sum to the indigent person was of greater ronsequence than the larger sum to tho opulent man.—(Hear.) Mr. GOULBURN said ho had at an earlier part of the evening stated his opinion with respect to the bene fits derived by the community at large and the com mercial affairs of the country from affording facilities for the execution of securities for advances of large sums of money. By imposing heavy burdens upon such trans actions they imposed restrietiuus upon the employment of capita', which would act in a very injurious manner. If they were going to fix an ad wiloremjduty it should be done so as to press lightly upon the lower party. Mr. ROEBUCK said if the Right Hon. Gentleman wished to make his rule from the bolt of the scale to the higher part of it be would agree with him; other wise he would oppose him. Mr. DISRAELI said if they adopted the ad valorem duty, he agreed with the principle that the first step ought to be moderate. The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER said at present there was a duty on bonds exceeding 501. of 55., that he proposed reducing to 2s. 6d.; and he proposed making a proportionate reduction on the present sm . () of duties like that which he had stated. He proposed that the duty on no bond should exceed 25/., no matter what the sum. By the present law, if a trader or shopkeeper wanted to borrow 5001., he had to pay a stamp duty of 12L, while the party who wanted to borrow 500,0001. only paid 25/, That was an injustice and an anomaly which he wished to remedy. After a short conversation, in which several Hon. Members took Fart, An HoN. MEMBER (whether Mr. Mullings or Sir li. Willoughby we could not ascertain) was understood to move as an amendment that the sum of 1 s. bo substituted for 23. 6d. in the proposition of the Chancellor of the Exchequer. Mr. DISRAELI said what they were then endeavour ing to do was to construct a new system, and while doing so they should try to construct it upon a just principle. —(Hear.) The Right lion. Gentleman the Chancellor of the Exchequer alluded to what was anomalous and monstrous in the old system, as if they were responsible for it more than himself, and as if that reference was an argument for the course he had pursued on the present occasion. The Right Hon. Gentleman argued as if there were two questions before the House—namely, the con. sideration of the interests of the rich and poor. As far as he understood the matter, he conceived they were en gaged in an endeavour to be equally just to the poor as well as the rich, and it was said the ad valorem system ought to be carried into effect with respect to both. It was necessary that in any initial step which they made in that matter they should take up that position, that while they relieved the poor as much as possible they would impose no improper or impolitic burdens on the more wealthy portions of the community. He should support the motion cf . his Hon. Friend if be proceeded to a division, as he hoped he would.—(Hear.) Mr. ROEBUCK said there was another element in the whole of that discussion which had been left out by the Hon. Member for Buckinghamshire. They had a reve nue to raise. The Bill itself was a most mischievous Bill—one of the worst that could be introduced. It was one only for raising money, and as such he accepted it under an impression of ies direful necessity. But he would put the question, what was to be received by that Bill. If the House took his advice, they would throw it out of doors altogether. It was a most mis chievous Bill, because of its interference with the ad ministration of justice, and could only be tolerated on the score of the revenue which they were told was to be raised by it. He would like the Chancellor of the Ex• chequer to tell them what would be the amount of reve nue raised if they began with Is. instead of 2s. 6d. Mr. BANKES said, that question had not arisen from a necessity, but a surplus in the revenue.—(Hear, hear.) It was that extraordinary incident of a surplus which had given rise to the present discussion.—(Hear.) He confessed that his impression of that portion of the sub ject, when listening to the debate on the budget, was very different from what it was at present. He had then heard nothing of an ad valorem duty.—(Hear.) lie had heard nothing but of some small relief applicable to the land. But if he was in error it might be so. However, they had now come, it seemed, ti an ad valorem duty; and if it was to be an admitted principle, let them prove how they were to act upon it.— (Hear.) Mr. HUME said he believed it would be better to begin at Is. than at 2s. 6d. Ile had been informed that if a considerable reduction was made in the amount of those duties the humbler classes would very much in crease the number of their deposits in large offices; so that the Exchequer would perhaps suffer no loss from the alteration. Mr. HENLEY said it should be remembered that they were dealing with a surplus, and not with a defi ciency; and as, according to the calculation of the Right Hon Gentleman the Chancellor of the Exchequer, the reduction from 23. 6d. to Is. would only entail a further loss of 48,0001., they should not be deterred from ef fecting that reduction by the apprehended loss to the revenue. The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER said it was true they Were dealing with a surplus, but if they were to calculate too much on that surplus they would soon lose it altogether. He proposed that the duty should be reduced from 1/. to 2s. 6d., and that would surely in itself be a very liberal measure. After a few words from Mr. Henley, Sir 11. Wil loughby, and Mr. Mullings, Mr. GOULBURN was disposed to think that as to bonds and mortgages, being for the relief of persons in distress, it was better policy to place the duty too low than too high. The Committee divided, when there appeared — For Sir H. 'Willoughby's amendment ... 164 Against it Majority against the Government ... —29 The announcement of the numbers was received with load cheering. On the motion of the CHANCELLOR of the EX CHEQUER, The CHAIRMAN reported progress, and the House then resumed. The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER said after the decision which the Committee had come to, which involved a most serious loss to the revenue, ami which, if adopted throughout the Bill, would render it impossible for him to go on, he must ask the House to allow him time to consider the course he should take. Although the amendment applied only to bonds, the principle involved mortgages and other things. He should, therefore, take time to consider, and would post pone the further consideration of the Bill till Monday next.—(Herr, hear.) Mr. CARDWELL begged to ask the Right Hon. Gentleman the President of the Board of Trade whether the Bills relating to the mercantile marine would be pro ceeded with on Friday? Mr. LABOUCIIERE said they would not come on, as ho proposed taking the Australian Bill on that night, and he should not be able to fix any evening for their discussion. SECURITIES FOR ADVANCES (IRELAND BILL. On the order of tho day for the second marling of this Bill, Mr. J. STUART raid the present Bill was introduced for the purpose of facilitating the operation of the Sale of Incumbored Estates Act. lie had, in the early part of the evening, suggested that the House ought to bare some authentic information on the subject. That infor mation appeared to him indispensably necessary to authorise the House to pass the Bill. He had com plained that his Right Hon. Friend the Solicitor-General for England had discharged duties which did not pro perly belong to him. It was the duty of the Irish law officers to attend there and guide the House by their in formation and advice. Now, they had not had a scintilla of information from the Irish law officers. Nothing could be more absurd in the course of legisla tion than that the party in charge of a measure, when asked for information to guide the House as to whether the measure was proper or not, should declare that he was not in possession of any au thentic information. Whether the Irish Solicitor- General had any information to give them he had yet to learn. He had, in the early part of the even ing, asked' three questions. First, whether any sales hai taken place under t he E ncumb ered Estates Bill ? inany orders had been made by the Com sale of encumbered estates, and how smmeicasonsnyi°d3wlyee'rrsbeofnowr the now in operation, but under which no sales had been effect , c 1 ? and the third question had reference to the enactments in the proposed Bill by which parties were enabled to purchase estates, paying only half the purchase money, and without any personal responsibi lity for the payment of the other half. lie did not think that such a sale had been ever heard of in any country in the world. He wished to know if any proposals had been made to purchase estates on these terms ? He pawed for information.—(Hear, hear.) He thought the House would consider it but reasonable not to ale low such si Bill to proceed to a second reading until that information had been obtained. Having given the Hon. and Learned Solicitor-General f.ir England due notice of those questions, and be having suggested that the returns which would give that information should be moved for in the usual manner, and having refused to allow them to be moved for at once, it was, he thought, only reasonable to move the adjournment of the debate until that infermatice was furnished,—(Hear.) The SOLICITOR-GENERAL f,:r IRELAND and the So- i LICIT)R GENERAL for ENGLAND rosn to:Tether, which e!icAed much cheering and laughter from the Opposi tion benches; the latter llon. and Learned Gentleman gave way, and The SOLICITOR-GENERAL fir IRELAND said he felt it his bounden duty, notwithstanding that the answer to these questions had ben postponed, in conse quence of the personal affront to him.elf, to ray a few words,_(llesr, hear.) With regard to the Solicitor- General for England having the conduct of the Encum bered Estates Bill, he begged to say that the measure was originated by that Honourable and Learned Gentle man before he had the honour of a scat in that [louse. (Hear, hear.) The subject had been long under consi deration with those parties with whom the Hon. and Learned Gentleman had advised in Ireland, wl.ea ho (Mr. Hatehell) had no expectation of a seat in that llouse.—(Hear, hear.) With regard to the present measure, although it had been introduced after he had become a Member, still it was engrafted upon and formed part of the same code. Tho Lion. end Learned Gentle man opposite must have been aware of that fact. With regard to the questions he had asked, he was surprised that the llon. and Learned Gentleman had not extmded to him the usual courtesy of giving him notice, to pre vent his being caught by hasty answers. Although he (air. IIa•chell) ha.,l been charged with not having answered the HOB. and Learned Gentleman, the notice of these questions had actually been given to his lion. and Learned Friend the Solicitor-General for England I.le put it to the good feeline , of that House whether that was just or not? —(Hear, hear.) lie could only at pre sent inform the Hon. and Learned Gentleman, nut having had an opportunity of cansulting the Com missioners, that sales had taken place, whether they were five, or seven, or nine, ho could not say, but he could say that the statement might be seen in any of the Irish or English newspapers. With regard to the orders, they bad been numerous, but he could not state the precise number. Thu third question was, whether any sales had taken place on the terms of paying half the pur chase-money. Now he must a4c the Hou. and Learned Gentleman whether he hal ever read the Bill, because if he had he would find that there was no such clause in the Bill. The purchaer was required to pay the whole of the purchase-money into the Bank of Ireland, and all he was then at liberty to do was to burrow half on the security of the title.—(Roars of laughter, and vociferous cheering from both sides of the House). lag hoped these answers would be satisfactory to the go). and Learned Gentleman. Mr. STUART hoped he would be allowed to explitin. He gave notice of the questions he intended to ask ef'the law officer of the Crown who had charge of the Bill. Finding that that Hon. and Learned Gentleman was not informed on the subject, he thought it but due to the Solicit ir-General for Ireland toinforca him of the questions he had asked. He" begged to assure him that be meant him no discourtesy whatever. The 13th clause of the Bill distinctly stated that one-half of the purchase money should not ba deemed a debt due from the purchaser. Mr. HUME hoped that the progress of a Bill that was so necessary would not be impeded by the amend ment cf the lion. and Learned Gentleman opposite. Mr. M. O'CONNELL said that the Honourable and Learned Member had not satisfied the House that he had read more than the 12th clause of the Bill. The first clause required the whole amount of the. purchase money to be paid into the Batik. In consequence of the whole amount. of the purchase money being required to he pad under the existing law, property was sold at a great disadvantage. By that mornings papers they were informed of a fine estate being sold fur only 61- years' purchase. Sir J. WALSH appealed to the candour and fair dealing of the House not to force so important a measure on at that advanced prod of the night. It was impos sible at that hour to bestow the adequate attention upon such a subject. Mr. ANSTEY hoped the Governinent would perse vere in urging forward the measure, which wee one of the best Bills brought forward for Ireland during that session. The lion. Baronet opposite, who now objected to this measure, which was to enable more purchasers to come forward, and thereby to procure for the owner a higher price for his property in Ireland, had himself complained last session o! the existing law, by which he said estates would be sold for an old song. Lord J. RUSSELL hoped the House would not occu py any more time by the discussion of this question. We have unfoi tunately got into a custom latterly, when a Bill was proposed after eleven o'clock, of discussing fir a considerable time whether or not the Bill should be introduced. The question Ras a sim p le ono. If the house meant to decide that uo Bill should be introduced after eleven o'clock, we might as well a d j ourn the House at that hour. He did not think that that would be a wise or convenient course.—(Hear, hear.) Let us, how ever, not argue the question from eleven to one o'clock. Mr. DISRAELI, as a general rule, quite agreed with the Noble Lord. At the same time there were circum stances connected with the present measure which should induce us to modify that opinion. The Noble Lord must remember that the House had been engaged up to the present time in the constant discussion of a subject of a very different character. And as this was a question of great importance, in respect to which the Noble Lord behind him (Lord Naas) had already notified his intention of moving an amendment to the motion for the second reading, he trusted that it would not be considered unreasonable if they objected to proceeding with it at that late hour. Ho was most un• willing to enter into a series of divisions for the purpose of preventing the progress of any measure ; but he put it to the Noble Lord to consider the position in which the House would be placed if we commenced the debate now, and if the Noble Lord ne it him were to make his statement against the passing of. the Bill which he con templated making. We should in such a case be kept here until four o'clock in the morning. That was a course which he did not think would be fair or conveni ent for the House to take. By stopping discussion now the Government would not succeed in advancing the pro gress of the measurr, for that discussion would be taken upon the next stage of the Bill, - and in all the form and sustained character as the House would have had on the second reading of it. This was no hostile movement got up to prevent the progress of the measure, but the reasons he had already stated were, ho thought, quite sufficient to justify a postponement of the present question. • Mr. HENLEY hoped the House would not fail to notice what had been stated by the Hon. and Learned Solicitor-General for Ireland—namely, that this Bill was part and parcel of the Encumbered Estates Bill of last year. These measures proposed to deal rather vio lently with property, and it was therefore important that the present one, at all e v en t s , should be well con sidered throe it was passed • into a law, They had al ready passed the Judgments Bill this year, which should also he viewed in connexion with those other Bills. By tho Judgments Bill they had exempted for the future land in Ireland from antecedent judgment. The Bill would simply enable a man to throw over his passive creditors, and to stand possessed o f his estate as if nothing had happened. — (Hear.) Now could it be ex pected that any respect would be had for the large mass of property in other hands, if estate through puisne creditors were thus treated? They had in the n ews p a p ers an instance re corded of a man who, under the o p era tion of this Act, bought back his own estate. U n d e r the operation oftl e refu three sed Bills,to put whethista s chance would thatthat court, ll3anh a a n v d e who cheat his creditors?—(Hear, hear.) If considera tion was to be shown to men wh ) threw 20 or 30 per cent. of their creditors overboard, what would Govern ment do for those men who slid not want anything of the sort, but who wished to act honestly and fairly to a ll? He did not think Government were acting fairly to what he would call the honest part of the community of Ireland. He was only anxious to call the attention of the House to the statement made by the Hon. and Learned Gentleman the Solicitor-General, as to the reasons why he would not undertake this Bill. Sir G. GREY said one of two things must be done, either the Bill must be discussed on its merits, or the discussion must be postponed. The Hon. Gentleman (Nlr. Henley) had made a speech on the merits of the Bill—he should not follow that course, but he would ask the House not to take the Hon. and Learned Gentle-. man's'interpretation of the Bill. As the discussion on the merits was not desired he was willing to postpone it. Ho must, however, remark that Government did not, as stated, oppose the wishes of Irish Members in this matter, for no Irish Member had yet signified any opinion. If it was the wish of Irish Members, or, in , deed, of Honourable Members generally, to enter on , a _discussion of the principles of the. Bill now, he should not offer any opposition, though certainly twelve o'clobk was not the ,best time to commence such a discussion. If time were lost it was not the fault of GOvernment, but must be attributed to the course adopted by the Honourable Member for Newark. Mr. Me J. O'CONNELL said nothing was more un fair than the suggestion of the Hon. Member (Mr. Hen ley) as to the intention of the Bill. There was a class which this. Bill would particularly serve, and that was the puisne creditors. There was a class which it would not serve, and that class was the great capi talists who hoped to go over to Ireland, buy land at less than its value, and sell it sot as to make a profit.—(Hear.) Lord NAAS gave way o make a Friend, because he thought the question could to more satisfactorily dis cussed by the proposal nude; But lie hoped theliouse would allow him to put off his statement for the present until a more eligible opportunity. Colonel DUNNE was convinced that the Bill, instead of raising tho value of estates in Ireland, would depress it, and he was sure that Ito money, as was anticipated, would be lent on estates. The SOLICITOR-GENERAL would move that the del ate be'adjourned till Thursday next. Sir L. O'BRIEN wished an order to bo sent to Ireland to suspend the operation of the previous Bill, as it had been proved that an estate had recently been sold for a year and a half's purchase. The debate was then adjourned till Thursday next, MEDICAL CHARITIES (IRELAND). On the motion for the second reading o f this Lord NA AS objected to the proposition. Sir W. SOMERVILLE said his object in moving the second reading if the Bill was that be might have an op portunity of hearing rerna - ks and objections before he made his statement. Ile had no wish to press on the Bill, but he thought it would be adiisable to have the second reading acceded to et the present time. He would make a statement with reference to the demerits of the present system.—(Great interruption.) He would not go into a long statement respecting the demerits of the existing system in Ireland, as he was satisfied every one acquainted with the existing system condemned it. The present system was unequal and expensive, and he pro posed to remedy those defects by a central board and superintendence. This system was approved of by nearly every one who was a friend to Ireland, and every one ad mitted, to do any practical good, it was necessary to have a central board. He promised to remedy the evils of the existing system. The subject for their consideration was, how they best could husband their resources, and lessen, if it were possible, the amount of rates collected. Ile believed that there might be a saving of 20 0001. a year effected. The present subscriptions, c iuld scarcely be cage i voluntary. Under the poor-rates not more than one-half would be paid by the. occupier—the other by the owners of property, who now paid, or who ought to pay, subscriptions for such an object. In 184 S, the sum charged upon the poor-rates fur temporary lever hospitals was 80,0001. This, however, was not a mere question of economy—it was a question that in volved the first of charities—the attendance and care of the poor. Various objections were made to the mea sure; but they were rather objections to details. He wished hilly to consult the interests of the medical pro fession, of whom he could not speak but in terms of the highest praise. lie was anxious that the Bill should be read pro forma, in order that he might introduce several amendments. Sir D. NORREYS had wished to save his Right Hon. Friend the trouble of making. a statement. The Bill containtd a dangerous principle—that of establishing a medical board separate from the general administration of the poor. He thought that all the medical charities should be transferred to the - puor-law board. He ob jected to the establishment of a medical board, as it was only pandering to the vanity of the medical profession in Ireland. Why did not the Government exercise the power they had under the poor-law in establishing dis pensaries and fever hospitals? Mr. G. A. HAMILTON said that there was a gene ral opinion that there should be a change in the ma negement of medical charities in Ireland. Ile suggested that his Right Hue. Fiiend should withdraw this Bill, which was a very objectionable one, and introduce a new Bill, when they might discuss a Bill upon prineiple. Lord J. RUSSELL remarked the principle of the Bill could be discussed afterwards, by having the B:11 now read pro faring. By that means they might dis cuss the best manner iu which medical charities might be managed. Ater a few words from Mr. F. FRENCH and Lord BERNARD, The Bill was read a second time, and ordered to be committed. The Process and Practice (Ireland) Bill, as amended, was considered, and the amendments agreed to. The Indemnity Bill was passed through Committee. EXTRAMURAL INTERMENTS. Sir G. GREY rose to move, in pursuance of notice to that effect, for leave to bring . in a Bill to make better prov - sion•forAbe interment of the dead in and near the mat opelis s iT.,119,84t, Hon. Baronet said the House was i awe e. that by an Act pissed in the last session of Par liatnect power was given to the Board of Health, under certain circumstances, to inquire into the state of the burial-grounds in the metropolis and in other large and populous places in the kingdom; and if the result of that inquiry showed that the mode of conducting buria's was prejudicial to the public health, the Board was further empowered to prepare a scheme, and submit the same to Parliament, for prohibiting a practice so prejudicial to the public health, and substituting for it the system of extramural in terrn ea te. In the exercise of there powers the Board, in the course of the last year, instituted extensive inquiries into the state of the burial-grounds in the metropolis and its neighbour hood, and in certain towns of the United Kingdom; and they had prepared, in pursuance of the further powers given to them, a scheme, which was embodied in the re port that had now been some weeks upon the table of the House, that scheme being applicable exclusively to the metropolis and the immediate neighbourhood. The beard bed considered this important subject in two points of view—first with rererence to the effects of the existing practice upon the public health, and next its effects upon the solemnity and decency of burials. At that hour of the night (a qaarter to one) he should not think of stating at length the purport or nature of the evidence collected by the .Board of Health, and which formed the basis of the recommendations embodied in the scheme contained in the report lying upon the table of the House. That report had attracted mach of the public attention, and be believed that most Hon. Gentle men were aware of the nature and purport of the mass of felts which had been collected by the Board of health, and upon which their report was • founded, as well as the Bill which he had now the honour to ask leave to intro duce. [The Right lion. Gentlemen here read a passage from page 50 of the report, giving a summary of the facts which came under the notice of die board. Without entering further into the evidence con tained in the report, ho said he would at once pro ceed to consider the general recommendations of the Beard of Health. The substance of those recommenda tions was the 'prohibition of interments within the me tropolitan districts, and, as a consequence, a complete change in the practice of interments. After considering various ways iu which the practice might bo altered, they recommended the appointment of a commission, expressly vested with powers fur carrying out this object. and which powers they then went on to enumerate. The Bill which he had now to propose was based upon this report, although it did not follow the recommenda tions of the board precisely in all their details. On the present occasion it would be sufficient if he contented himself by simply stating the main provisions of the Bill, reserving matters of smaller importance and of mere &tail until the Bill hod been printed, and placed in the hand; of Members. It was proposed in the first instance, in accordance with the recommendation cif the board, to form a district to be termed the " Metropolitan I3urial District," the parishes to be comprised within which would be enumerated in the schedule ef the Bill. They constituted the district which was generally known as the " Registrar-General's District," with the excep tion of some outlying parishes, which, on account of their locality and other circumstances, it was thought right should not be included. For this district it was proposed that burial-grounds should be provided within or without the district to be placed under the cotitrol and management of the parties who were to be entrusted with the execution of the Act. It, was proposed further to give power to these parties to take any of the cemeteries which had already been established under Acts of Pirliament in the district, upon making compensation to the companies to which they belonged, with a view to shutting up those which, upon inquiry, should appear unfit to be continued as places of interment; but with regard to others making use of them as burial-grounds to be established under the provisions of this Bill. Every such burial-ground so to be provided would, like all the great cemeteries hi therto established, be divided—one portion being conse crated, with a suitable chapel, for the use of members of the Established Church; the other part being left for in terments for persons of other religious denominations. — (Hear, hear.) Power would also be given for setting apart any portion of the burial-ground to the use of any other Christian sect who, upon religious grounds, re quired a separate) place of interment. Ater this, powcr was to be given to the Queen in Council, upon the report of the persons who would be entrusted with the execu tion of the Act, and after due notice, 'to order the' dis continuance of all interments in the burial-grounds end grave-yards within the district. And this pro hibition might from tithe. to .time be extended until the system of interments should be altogether discontinued throughout the metropolis, with a saving of the existing rights in : vaults, but having regard to the necessary. precautions for the preservation of the public health. The Bill then proposed that the inhabitants of the parishes whose burial-grounds might be closed under the operation of the Bill should have the same rights of interment in the new grounds as they bad in the present burial-grounds within their parishes; and that power should be given, without the expensive process called the faculty process, to remove bodies from the old places of interment to the new burial-grounds. The parties entrusted with the execution of the Act would also be empowered to pro vide houses of reception for the bodies of deceased per sons—an arrangement which would be of peculiar be nefit to the poor residing in a confined atmosphere and dearly-crowded dwellings.—(Hear, hear.) One great practical difficulty in the way of the adoption of a sys tem of extramural interment was felt to be, the placing the poor in the same position with regard to distance as they were at present. In order to remove this difficulty, means might be devised and provided for the convey ance of bodies to the places of interment, and for con • ducting funerals in those grounds at specified and mo derate rates.—(Hear, hear.) A large portion of the revenue of the London clergy was at present derived foam burial fees; and justice obviously required that compensation should be given both to the clergy and to the official persons who were connected with the exist ing burial-grounds for the . loss of fees which they would incur by the proposed change of the law. With regard to the clergy, looking at the large proportion of their incomes which are composed of those fees, it had been •thought ,necessary to continue the compensation to them beyond the existing incumbencies, as in some parishes the clergy would be left almost without the means of support ; but power would be given for re vising, from time to time, the matter of compensatioe. With regard to clerks and sextons, and other officers, it was proposed that compensation should be given to thee tenure of the respective offices which they held. The Board of Health, in their report, stated that the re ceipts fur the interments in the new burial-grounds would be ample to cover all. the expenditure to be in curred under the Act. But as it would be necessary to make provision for the immediate purchase of burial grounds, and fir other expenditure, before any large amount was received in the shape of fees, power would be given to borrow money on the future payments under the Act, and also upon the security of a rate which they were to be authorised to levy, and which was not to ex ceed the annual amount of Id. in the pound, in the event of the fees and payments being insufficient for the ex penditure. With respect to the parties to be entrusted with the execution of the Act, the Board of Health had recommended that a commission should bo specially cons tituted for that purpose. There were , however, ob vious objections to the creation of a new commission, unless some indispensable necessity could be shown for it; and it was thought by her Majesty's Government that the members of the Board of Health were fully compe tent' to the task; and upon the whole, in the first ite stance, the very best parties for effecting the recomme dations which they themselves had made. To a ger extent, also, the existing staff of that board might be made available for the new Act. It was proposed that, instead of constituting a new board, one paid member should be added to the present board; and it was thought that with this addition, and with the help of such sub ordinate officers as might be requisite, that board would he competent to establish a system of extramural inter ments throughout the metropolis.—(Bear, hear.) The House was aware that the Board of Health had only a temporary existence, the period for its duration not being extended beyond August, 1853; and it might therefore be necessary eventually to continue the opera tion of the Bill by some other agency. This circutn stance,however,afforded a security that before the powers of the Board of Health expired the attention of Par liament must be called to the working cf this measure, and - an opportunity would be afforded for correcting any defects which experience might have discovered in its operation.: Before he sat down be wished to express the sense which he entertained of the ability and efficiency with which the Board of Iletilth had discharged the —,--- (From the Poses and Proceedings of the House of Commas. 1110NDAr, APRIL 15. STAMP DUTIES BILL. (IN THE COMMITTEE.) Schedule B (Bond in England or Ireland and persona' bond in Scotland given as a security for the payment of any definite and certain sum of money not exceeding f 01.) : Motion made, and Question proposed, " That the Duty be two shillings and sixpence:"—Afterwards, Motion made, and Question put, " That the Duty be one shilling." The ComMittee diviled: MAJORITY—AYES, 164. Egerton, Sir P. Meagher, Thomas Ellis, John Mahon, Lord Esnlyn, Viscount Mandeville4Viscount Estcourt, .1. IL B. Manners, Lord J. Fagan, William March, Earl of Ferrer, James Mast erman, J. Fiiincr, Sir E. Meux, Sir Henry Floycr, John • Mitchell, T. A. Forbes, William Moody, C. A. Forester, G. C. 3ltindy, William Forster, Mathew Naas, Lord Fox, S. L. Neeld, John Galway, Viscount Newry, Viscount Goddard, A. L. Norreys, Sir - * D. Gooch, E. S. O'Br ien, Sir Lucius Gordon, Admiral Ossulton, Lord Gore, W. R. 0. l'acke, C. W. Goulburn, Henry Pakington, Sir J. Granby, Marquis of Paltrier, Bounden Greened, Gilbert Plowden, IV. 11. Greene, John Plumptre, J. I'. Greene, Thomas Rendlesham,',Lorel One rtisey, Lor.l Renton, John C. Gwyn, Rowel Roliick, J. A. Hall, Sir Benjamin Ilushout, Captain Ilainllton, O.IA. Stu:llor, Jelin liarris, Captain Salwey, Colonel Harris, Richard Sandars, George Hayes,!Sir E. Seymer, Henry Ker Heald, James Smith, John B. Ilencage, G. 11. W. Smyth, J. 0.: Henley, J. W. smythe, George Henry, Alexander Sotheron, T. 11. S. Heruert, H. A. Spooner, Richard Hervey, Lord A. StafT.rd, Augustus Ileyworth, Lawrence Stanley, E. H. Hildyard, R. C. St:phensou, Robert Hodgson, W. N. Stuart, Lord D. Hotham, Lord Stuart, 11. Howard, P. 11. Thompson, Alderman Hudson, G. Tollemache, John Hume, Joseph Turner, G. J. Johnstone, Sir J. Verner, Sir W. Jollitie, Sir W. G. Verney, Sir:ll. Jones, Captain Vyse, H. Tier, Richard Waddington, 11. S. Kershaw, James Walinsley, Sir J. Lacy, G . C. Walpole, S I Legh, G. C. Walsh, Sir .1. B. Lennox, Lord II G. Walter, John Lindsay. Colonel Williams, John Locke, Joseph Yorac, E. T. Lockhart, W. Lushington, Charles Mackenzie, W. F. 31`Neill, Duncan Aglionby, H. A. Arbuthmott,•Hugh Archdall, Captain Arkwright, Baillie, H. J. Bankes, George Baring, 11. B. in lii 4, tr s r , i , n T g h to o n, ina3 Vis. Iteckett, W. Bentinck, Lord 11. Beresford, William Bernard, Viscount Best, John Blackstone, W. S. Blair, Stephen. Illandford, Marquis Illewitt, Reginald Boldero, 11. . Booth, Sir It. G. Bowles, Admiral Bramston, T. W. 13recnridge, Richard Broadley, 11. Brooke, Lord Brown, W. Bruce, C. L. C. Buck, Lewis W. Buller, Sir J. Y. Iturroughes, 11. N. Carew, W. I'. Castlere3gh, Vis. Chandos, Marquis Chaplin, W. J. Christopher, R. Clerk Sir G. Clifford, 11. M. Clive, It. 11. Clive, Henry B. Cobden, It. Cocks, T. S. Cole, H. A. Colvile, C. It. Conolly, Thomas Devereux, J. 1. D'Eyncourt, C. T. Disraeli, B. Dod, J. W. Duckworth, Sir J. Duke, Sir James Duncan, George buncombe, 0. Dunculi, John Dunne, ColonA East, Sir J. Edwards, Henry TELLEES. Willoughby, Sir II Mailings, J. IT. MINORITY—ROES. 185. Adair, R. A. Grenfell, Charles W. • Palmerston, 'Viscount AnAey, Thomas C. Grey , Sir Georg e Parker. Jutm Ashley, Lord Grosvenor, Lord R. Peel, Frederick Bagshaw, John Grosvenor, Earl Perfect, It. Baines, M. T. Ilaniner,lSir John Pilkington, James Baring, Sir F. T. Hardcastle, J. A. power , Dr. Barnard, E. G. Ilastie,,Alexander Power, Nicholas Bellew, It. M. Basile, Archibald Vawdon, Colonel Berkeley, C. L. G. Ilatchcll, John . Rich, Henry Illackall, S. W. Hawes, B. Romilly, Colonel Blake, Martin J. Ilayter, W. G. Roanlly, Sir John Bouverie, E. P. . Headiam, Thorne* Russell, Lord John Boyle, Colonel Heathcoat, John Russell, Edward S. Brockman, E. D. Ileneage, Edward Rutherturd, A. Brotherton, J. Ileyweod, James Scropc, G. P. Browne, It. D. Hoblibuse, Sir John Seymour, Lord Buxton, Sir E. . Hobhouse, T. B. Shell, R. L. Carter, John B. Ilodges, T. L. , Shelburne, Earl of Cavendish, C. C. - Ilollond, Robert Simeon, John Cavendish, G. 11. - Howard, C. W. Smith, J. A. Cavendish, W. G. Howard, Sir It. Somers, J. P. Childers, J. W. llutt. William 'Somerville, Sir W. Clay, James Jervis, Sir John Spearman, 11. J. Cletnents, Charles Keispel, G. T. Talbot, J. 11. Colebrooke, Sir T. Xing, P. J. Tancred, li. W. Coke, E. K. Labouchere, Henry Thompson, Colonel Cowper, W. F. Langston; J. H. Thornely, Thomas Craig, Sir W. G. Lascelles, W. S. Towneley, John Da , ryinple, Captain Lewis, George C. Townshend, Captain Davie, Sir 11. , . Littleton, E. It. Trelatvny, J. S. Dawson, T. V. Loveden, Pryse Tnthell, 'teary Duff, James • Afackinnon, W. Vivian, J. 11. Dundas, Athniral 3PCullagh, W. T. Wall, C. B. Dundas, Sit' David 2‘r(tregor, John Watkins, Colonel Ebrington, Lord Matheson, Colonel Wawn, J. T. Ellice, Edward Manic, Fox Willcox, Brodie Elliot, J. -E. • Milner, W. /d. Wilson, James Evans, William - ,Mon.sell, William Wilson, Matthew Fergus, John ' Morgan N. K. Wood; sir Charles Ferguson, Col. Morris; David Wood, W. P. Ferguson, Sir R. Mowatt, Francis Wrightson, W. B. Fitzpatrick, J. W. Mulgrave, Earl Wyld, James ' Fordyce, A. D. O'Connell, M. J. Wyvill, Marmaduke FOrteSelle, J. W. Paget, Lord A. TELLEB.S. Freestun, Colonel Paget, Lord C. Hill, Lord Marcus Grace, 0. D. Paget, Lord,George Howard, Lord E. . ' POST-OFFICE SUNDAY DUTIES. A return has just been issued, giving a history of the measures recently adopted for the reduction of Sunday labour in the Post-office, and showing their results. It appears that the movement on the question originated at Bath, where, in consequence of a me morial which had been presented to the Government, the Sunday money-order business was abolished on the 6th of February, 1848—a step, however, which was followed by a petition, signed by 4,752 persons, against any further curtailment of accommodation. Before the lapse of a year the experiment which had been successful at Bath was carried out generally, and about October, 1848, inquiries were set on foot to ascertain the practicability of assimilating the Sunday deliveries of letters in England b those in Scotland. Fears wore entertained that the measure would be met by strong complaints, but it was thought that if it were accompanied by an arrangement for transmit ting the " f ,rward" letters through London on the Sunday the advantage thus given on the one side would counterbalance the restriction on the other. The plan in this shape was accordingly submitted in February, 1849, sanctioned by Parliament in August, and carried out on the 28th October last. The addi tional force employed in London on Sundays in con sequence of this arrangement turns out, notwith standing the false reports circulated in every direction at the time, never to have exceeded the original esti mate of 25 persons, who were entirely volunteers, and it now appears that on the 20th January, owing to the satisfactory working of the system and the facilities it gave fur simplifying other arrangemets,t this force was not only discard ed altogether, but i was found that the labour of the ordinary force of 27 persons was considerably lightened, and that it will even be possible, by some plans now pending, to re duce that number to 15 or 16. Within the last two years other measures of Sunday relief have of been diligently prosecuted, the most imp these being the establishment of the late delivery on Saturday n ights at a distance of 6 miles round London, whereby, with increased con venience to the public, 191 men have been wholly relieved from Sunday duty ; the diminution of busi ness at the provincial offices by the discontinuance of m a large nu mber of Sunday mails ; and the disuse of money pre-payments on Sundays for all inland letters, so that the offices are now generally closed at 10 in the morning. On the whole, it seems that the result of the various alterations patiently carried out by the Post-office authorities in the midst of the mistaken hostility directed against them, and without incon venience to the public, has been, first, to withdraw the money-order business on the Sunday from 436 provincial post-offices in England and Wales and 234 offices in Ireland and Scotland ; and secondly, as re gards the delivery of letters, to give relief to more than 6,000 persons, and, on the average, more than five and a half hours each.— Times. en- Mr. FERRAND.—The Leeds latelligencer of Satur day says:—" The proposition which Mr. Ferrand made to the farmers of the Pontefract polling district, that they should form a 'Farmers' Wool League, is causing great ex citement among the farmers of Yorkshire. A requisition from the farmers, inviting him to meet them in Doncaster on the2Oth, is in course of signature at that polling district. Meetings are being arranged for the Beverley polling dis trict on the 27th ; for the Malton polling district on the 4th of May; and it is expected that meetings will take erby pl h ace in quick succession at Richmond , Snaith, Selby, Wet, Ripon, Knaresborough, Thirst:, and other agricultural towns ' in this extensive county." rADVERTISEMENT.j—THE EARL OF ALDI3OROUGH AND Ilouowev's PILLs.—An astounding cure by this miraculons medicine, arter every other means had failed. See extract from his Lordship's letter, dated "Villa Messina, Leghorn, Feb. 21, 1845. Professor Holloway —Sir : I beg to acquaint you that your pills have ef fected* cure of a disorder in my liver and stomach 'which all the most eminent of the faculty, at home and all over the continent, had not been able to effect; nay, not ever the seat These , wondterful pills win cure any dieease of the liver or stomach.—Sold (also H o ll oway ' s Ointment) at Professor Holloway's Establishment, 244, Strand, and IV al inedicino Tailors throughout the olTtlised world, ex right con ward man, t in ighly r In duty that the sim ment Id Le be a d in at be those have 'tamp mess- rose qae6- esent wired erred t wait mea- Lrties. a just m the ?Iltage It the I, and chair Cpared mort nor, Ithtesad x ford )t fur wvuld could !ertnin )110e. t Wen ' 1 )13 tined 'e !tall n the 2e it -with roa UI able wilell Le -POW one - U. pool. ►h: ior trio" coy tie; ant el of re' Crete ax ;ent• t boss 10 hod ion 1 1 ° bur. Roo refer - be in' F whe t Right beer., !. es OW s we re 3t, pD tic* twTb# . ` o II ben~:, rheauld, ' in fac t '' hear-) t Dei env r , Ups. R....0ft, APRIL 16, 1850. duties imposed upon them, and of the value of tl at great miss of information which they had collected and em bolied in their report. The thanks of the public were especially due to the Noble Member for Bath (Lord Ashley), who, as an unpaid member of thet board, had most assiduously and usefully devoted many mont h s o f his valuable time to carry out the objects of the board, aid to obtain information on the subject to vvbich this Bill referrei. lie (Sir G. Grey) would only express his cortEal concurrence in tt,e hope expressed in the con• eluding paragraph el' the report of the Board of Health, that their inquiries and recommendations might prove emireatly conducive to the public health, by leading at no very distant time to the discontinuance of the great evil of intramural interments. Mr. LACY asked whether the sum of 1 1 2,000 Z a year would be required for keeping up the establishment created by the Bill, and what would be the probable amount of rate necessary to be levied? Sir G. GREY said those were matters of detail that could be more conveniently discussed when the 1.301 was before the House. The amount of the necessary ex penses could only b 2 estimated ; but the penny rate was proposed merely as a collateral security, the Board of Health anticipating that the tees and payments received for burials would cover all the expenses. Lord ASHLEY observed that it was cenfidently hoped that there would be no necessity what -Ivor for the rate, and it was merely proposed as a matter of secu rite, and to eaable the Commission to raise the neces sary funds. Sir B. HALL expressel his obligation to the Right lion. Home Secreta , y fir having brought forward this question, and hoped the Bill would very speedily pass into law. He wished to ask whether the commissioners Appointed to carry out the measure would be 11 quire(' to !ay thi it proceedings and aecounta before the House? Sir G. GREY replied that the Bill provided that ab stracts of their proceeding: and accounts should be an nually la;(1 before Yarliatneet. Mr. WILD hoped tho R;ght Hon. Baronet would take measures for aiolisbiog the post-horse duty charged upon horses engaged in conveying hearses. Leave was then given to introduce the Bill, which was brought in and road a first time. The House adjourned at a Quarter past One o'clock. PARLIAMEN TAR Y In V ISIO COURT CIRCULAit. The Queen and Prince Albert took a drive yes terday in an open carriage and four. Th:: Equerries in Waiting, Lord Charles Fitzroy and Lieut.-Colonel F. H. Seymour, attended on horseback. La Comtesse Rossi attended at Buckingham Palace, for the purpose of singing to the Queen yesterday afternoon. Her Majesty and Prince Albert were accompanied by some of the junior branches of the Royal Family ; and their Royal Highnesses the Duchess of Kent, the Duchess of Gloucester, and the Duchess of Cambridge, were also present. Mons. Eckhard presided at the pianoforte. his Royal Highness Prince Albert rode out on horseback yesterday morning, attended by 'Lieut.- Colonel F. 11. Seymour. Their Royal Highnesses the Prince of Wale", Prince Alfred, the Princess Royal, the Princess Alice, the Princess Helena, and the Princess Louise, took their accustomed exercise yesterday in the gardens of Buckingham Palace. _ Her Royal Highness the Duchess of Kent, at tended by Lady Anna Maria Dawson and Baroness de Speth, dined with her Majesty at Buckingham Palace last evening. A deputation from the Great Northern Railway Company, consisting of Mr. Denison, Mr. Packe, Mr. Cubitt, Mr. Baxter, and Mr. Coates, had an interview with the Commissioners of Railways yes terday, at their office in the Board of Trade. Earl Waldegrave had an interview with Lori:John Russell yesterday. Mr. Liddell had also an interview with his Lordship yesterday, at his official residence in Downing-street. rne Marquis of Lansdowne (Lord President of the Council) is recovering from an attack of gout. The Earl of Zetland had an interview with the Right Hop. 11. Labonchere yesterday, at the office of the Board of Trade. Lord Monteagle had an interview with the Chan cellor of the Exchequer yesterday. Mr. John Wood, Chairman of the Buard of Inland Revenue, had also an interview with the Right Hon. Baronet yesterday, at his official residence in Dawning-street. A deputation from the Yorkshire and Lancashire Railway Company, consisting of Mr. Heald, M.P., Mr. Grenfell, M.P., Mr. Bright, M.P., Mr. Henry, M.P., Mr. Holdsworth, Mr. Gile, Mr. Hawkshaw, and Mr. Derbyshire, bad an interview yesterday with the Commissioners of Railways. Dispatches were sent off yesterday evening from the Colonial-office for the Governor of the Cape of Good Hope. THE ARCTIC EXPEDITION . MIERDEEF, SATURDAY.—The Lady . Franklin, Captain Penny, and the Sophia, Captain Stewart, sailed from this port to-day for the Arctic regions, in search of Sir John Franklin. The two vessels were hauled out of the docks at two o'clock, and left the harbour amid the cheers of some thousands of spec tators. The Ledy Franklin is a first-class clipper brig, built fit Aberdeen ; and the Sophia is equally strong, though less sharp in her model, and was built at Dundee. The expedition is under the command of Captain Penny, who volunteered his services, and in recommending him to the Admiralty, Sir Francis Beaufort says— " The daring but prudent conduct that Mr. Penny is said to have evinced on many occasions, together with the large experience that he must have gained during whole life among the ice, as well as the ambition he ax presses to distinguish himself is this noble enterprise, on which all eyes are turned, lead me to think that it would be wise to let loose his energy, and to give him the op-2 portunity fir which he begs. I may add that I believe, this would sensibly gratity Lady Franklin." C iptain Penny has been to the Arctic regions almost every year for the last 20 years. He went to Davis' Straits first as an apprentice seaman, and had the experience of his father, who had then been long known as a captain of one or other of the Aberdeen whalers, and soon after his apprenticeship was com pleted he became first mate, and then a master him self. When commanding one of the Aberdeen whalers in 1839 he gathered some information front an Esquimaux, which led him to believe that there was an unexplored region in the Straits, abounding with whales ; and having got the young native to come to Scotland, he managed to educate him -so arto he able to line out a chart of the unknown bay, and to give such an account of its geographical bearings as enabled him next season to explore it, and to open up a new source of supply when whales failed in the or dinary fishing-ground. In this way, and in various. • other ways, Cipt. Penny gained an acquaintance with almost every inlet and sound of Davis' Straits ; and it is well known that he has been able to add consider ably to our stock of knowledge of the icy regions of the north. He has a most perfect conviction that Sir John Franklin is yet alive, and is to pursue his search in the first instance in Admiral Jones' Sound and the Wellington Channel. The Lady Franklin and Sophia have 25 men each, including officers, and are provisioned for three years. They have each a full supply of coalr, but are to re ceive additional coals from the Pacific, of this port, which vessel took out a large quantity when she sailed the other day for Davis' Straits. All the appoint ments of the vessels are of the most simple and prac tical description. They have boats similar to those of the ordinary whaler; ice anchors, ice saws, warp ing apparatus, and every sort of machinery necessary to enable them to make way through the ice. There is also a full and complete assortment of geographical and astronomical apparatus, and, what is of no small value iu this important expedition, a large amount of discretionary power conferred on the commander. NAVAL INTELLIGENCE. PORTSMOUTH, BIONDAY.—The Bulldog steam-sloop, Commander A. C. Key, hauled under the sheers to be paid off to-day. She was dismasted, and will bo put out of commission to-morrow. The Griffon 3, Lieutenant Thurburn, lately from Rio, till be paid off here to-morrow, and refitted forth with at an exercise and instruction brig for the seamen appteLtices about to be entered at the port of Cork. The Yorktown, American line-of-packet ship, arrived at Spitheal last evening. The prightly steam-vessel, Acting-Master Allen commanding, returned from Plymouth yesterday. The Royal Yacht Victoria and Albert is receiving ber e boilers iu the Steam basin. The Crocodile, old troop-ship, for some time past the depot or f7a2;-;hip of the Commander-in-Chief on the Irish station, is ordrred to this port to be raid ofl; being w _mil out. We hope a respectable ship will be sent to carry the flag of Rear-Admiral Dixon, for it is neither eredoable to tl:e service nor to the country that such a wretched old meal-tub as the Crocodile should be flag ship at a pore where some of the finest vessels in the world a!n constantly putting in. Wind S.S.\V., strong, and cloudy weather. PLYMOUTH. APRIL 13.—The Hon. li. Dundee, Storeksepor-General of the Navy. arrived on Wednes day at Moorshead's Royal Hotel, Devonport. On Thurs- Cay 1 e inspected the various stores in the yard concocted with his d-paittnent, and on Friday examined the new system of payments recently adopted. Her Majesty's steam-vessel Sprightly arrived from Portsmouth today with marine artillery for the Archer ble an-vessel. 'l'l>o Sharpshooter stram-.ressel, which put back with damage yesterday, was towed up the harbour t ).day by the Sprightly, to coal and hare defects made good. The Lily brig sai;el with the mails for tho coast of Africa on Wednesday. The I'etrel packet will be taken out of deck on nuiday. Tha Alert brig will be paid off on Tuesday. Wind N.W.; strong breeze. APPOINTMENTS. ii'ooovictr, APRIL 15.—Second Master Graham H. MIN (1348), to the Sparrow, 6, surveying -vessel on the so uth -cart coast ci Ire:and. Midshipmen Charles A. It. Pocock and Henry L. II01(:er, to the Victory, 101, flag-ship at Portsmouth. Master's Assistant William Hewlett, to the Fisgard flag-ship at Woolwich. The Pioneer screw steam-vessel, Lieutenant• Co mmander Sherard Osborn, bad her steam up to-day, and. her screw-propeller having been previously shipped, the water was let into the docks to try the working of the engines, and they appeared to work well. RAILWAY SHARE MARKETS• - - BRISTOL. Amur. 15. STOCK EXCHANGE.—Our share market was batter to-day, and prices are considerably firmer. The transactions were Bristol and Exeter, 35 dis.—Great Western. 49—Ditto, 17/. Shares, 9 dis.—Midland, 33 1 ,4 —Taff Vale, New, LivEßrooL, Arnir, 15. STOCK EXCHANGE.—The transactions to-day l ic o ele 13 a s s . follow :—Lancashire and Yorkshire, Consol., Fifths. 90. c. dis.—Ditto, Preference, 111,i—Lancaster and Preston, Midin Quarters, 13 East Lancashire, 61,-4 —Leeds and Bradford, 90—London and North-Western , 102—Ditto, New a Q duarters, dis.—Ditto, Quarters (C) , 6s. 3d. C. Ditto, Halves, 2$ die. South -Eastern and Dover, 13— Ditto (No. 4). Registered, 4N— Sheffield' B. and Div., 1 dis.—York. Newcastle, and Berwick (G. N. E. Pur chase), 6 per cent. till 1850, 7% di MANCHE STER, Arum 15. STOCK EXCHANGE.— The share market is still depressed, and little business has been done to-day. rho transactions were—Birkenhead. Lancashire, and Cheshire Junction. 19 dis.—East lincashire, 614—Ditto, Quarters, 1 9-16—Lan cashire and Yorkshire (West Riding Union), 9LA dis.—Ditto, Preference, 6 per cent., 11%—London and North-Western, 1003i —Ditto. Manchest er and Birmingham, Quarters (C), 5-16 c. p.—Manchester, Sheffield, and Lincolnshire, 12 1 , 4 n. —Ditto, Preference, 6 11-1 6 —Ditto, Sheffield and Lincoln shire, 2 15-16—North Staffordshire, 10 / 4 dis.—Soutli-Eastern and Dover, Thirds (No. 4), 4 % North Union (A), 1644. YORK, Arnie. 13. STOCK EXCHANGE.—The transactions to-day were as fol low :—York, Newcastle, avid Berwick, 11N —Great Northern, 5% —York and North Midland, Preference, GI. 65.3d.—Leeds and Bradford, 93—North British, Preference (guaranteed 6 per cent. for live years, and 5 per cent. in perpetuity), 44. ----- ESCAPE OF PRISONERS.—Before the court closed at Cockermouth, on Tuesday, one of the bailiffs, apparently in a state of ~r eat alarm, informed the chairman that two prisoners, Walker and Smith, had made their escape from the lock-up, and wee nowhere to be fonnd. It appeared that they had cleverly s uc , :eeded in locking up the keeper in the cell destined for themselves. and then fled. They had then sought shelter in a wood belonging to General Wyndham, where the boy Smith was discovered about two hours after wards, having lamed his knee so as to prevent further flight. Walker still remains at large, having hitherto eluded the search of the oflicer2 in quest of him, Carlisle Journal. o ld rti t° bill abet 001 3 ' ord s f w o ) , Oh' I , I