The Sun. — London, England, 1851-02-12 00:00:00

1-4, oNlief 4 1Pfutttoit 4,4 • 14. .Tv 5- SUN OFFICE, Seven o'Clock. I MPERIAL PARLIAMENT. (THIS DAY.) HOUSE OF COMMONS. The SPEAKER took the Chair shortly after Twelve o'clock. SECOND READINGS. The following Bills were read a second time, and ordered to be committed:— Dublin, Dundrum. and Rathfarnham Railway. East Lancashire Railway. Killarney Junction Railway. Liverpool Docks (Alteration of Management, &c.) London and Blackwall Railway (Branch to Haydon-square, Whitechapel, &c.) London and Blackwall Railway (Extension of Time for the Widening, &c.) Perth Petty and Market Customs Amendment. St. Helep's Improvement. South Staffordshire Railway ( Branches to join the Birming ham. Wolverhampton, and Stour Valley Railway, &c.) South Wales Railway (No. 2). Ulster Canal and Union hallway. Wicklow Harbour. On the motion of Mr. W. PATTEN . , the following Mem bers were appointed as the Committee of Selection : —Sir Robert Ferguson, Mr. Evelyn Denison, Mr. Sotheron, Sir John Yarde Buller, and the Chairman of the Committee on Standing Orders. PETITIONS. Mr. THORNELY presented a petition from Wolverhamp ton against the window-tax. Sir R. INGLIS presented a petition from a town in Nor folk against Papal aggression ; also several petitions from Wednesbnry and other places in Staffordshire. A great number of petitions to the same effect were pre sented from several parts of the country. Mr. WYLD presented several petitions from St. Mary's, Islington, and other places in the metropolis, against the window-tax. Mr. HUME presented several petitions from places in Scotland against the Bible monopoly. Sir J. TROLLOPE presented petitions from places in Lincolnshire praying that farmers might be exempted from the payment of the income-tax. Mr. HAYTER presented a petition from Somerset praying for the abolition of copyhold tenure: Mr. REYNOLDS presented petitions from Downpatrick and other parts of Ireland praying for the remission of the duty on paper. Mr. WYNDHAM GOOLD presented petitions from the board of guardians of the Newcastle Union, county of Limerick, against the rate in aid. Sir WILLIAM CODRINGTON presented a petition from Stow-on-the- Wold against Papal aggression. Lord BURGHLEY presented a petition from the parish of Great GourbY, - in the county of Lincoln, against Papal ag gression. Colonel PENNANT presented petitions from the inhabi tants of the parishes of Eifionydd and Bodfern, in the county of Carnarvon, against Papal aggression. Mr: VARNHA.M presented two petitions from the county of Leicester against Papal aggression. Mr. PLUMPTRE presented a petition from the congre gations of Dissenters at Portsea, Landport, and Gosport, against Papal aggression. Sir ALEXANDER I.IOOD presented petitions against Papal aggression from several parishes in the county of Somerset. Mr. MOODY presented petitions from a Dissenting con gregation at Yeovil, from Norton and Pendomer, against the Papal aggression. and from Pendomer against the admission of Jews into Parliament: Sir JOHN TRULL'/PE presented a petition from tenant farmers of Holbeach, Lincolnshire, praying to be relieved ftom Schedule B of the income-tax, by its total abolition; from Welbourn, Colsterwortb, Carrington, and Frithoville, zgAinst Papal aggression ; and from solicitors at Holbeach against the certificate duty. Mr. SMYTHt presented thirty-two petitions from pa rishes in York in favour of the repeal of the window duty, and one from York against Papal aggression. Lord CLAUD HAMILTON presented petitions from Favonagal, Billy Faddy, and from the parishes of Newton Saville and Donagheady, in the county of Tyrone, praying thatlreland may be included in any meaure passed to repel Pap a l aggression. SUPPLY. The House then went through Committee of Supply. PAPAL AGGRESSION—ADJOURNED DEBATE. The order of the day for resuming the adjourned debate having been read, Mr. P. HOWARD observed that if a retrograde step were taken in this country, such as was proposed by the'measure of the Government with regard to the recent measures of the Pope, he knew not where it could be stopped. Although the Right Honourable Gentleman the Member for Northum berland had stated there was an unanimous feeling through eat the country against those measures, no meeting ore the subject had been called in the great county of Lancaster, but that great mart of manufacturing industry had looked on with philosophic calmness and repose, and waited with patience until the time when truth should prevail.-(Hear, hear.) In many other of the large towns in the kingdom there had been an exhibition of feeling directly against memoralising the Queen. In Leeds-the town council considered that any interference by the Government would be a violation of that religious freedom which prevailed in this country, and in several other places the same feeling was exhibited. As there had been no violation of the law, how could it be said there was any aggression? The law officers of the Crown hail not been enabled to find out any statute which made these proceedings of the Roman Catho lics illegal, and were they to retrograde in their policy in order to pass pains and penalties on certain religious forms of worship of a large body of her Majesty's subjects? It had been said that the Synod of Thurles had interfered with reli gious liberty by making certain suggestions relative to the education of the people; but the House would recollect that when the Right lion. Getlemau, the late Home Secretary (Sir James Graham), introduced a general measure of edu cation, it was opposed by the Wesleyan body, who, together with other religious bodies ' was mainly instrumental in throwing out the measure. He alluded to that circumstance to prove that other religious sects had expressed as decided opinions on the question of national education as the Synod Thurles. It was the opinion of Lord Castlereagh that the institution of bishops was a beneficial substitution for the immediate superintendence of the See of Rome. In his letter the Supreme Pope had addressed himself to the Catholics alone of this country, and in his relation as their spiritual father. It was his anxiety for the spiritual welfare of the Catholics that he had written this letter, and not from any desire for territorial ag gression. This country had obtained Canada by a treaty stipulating to maintain the Catholic religion, and it was as mu ?h the established religion there as the Protestant reli gion was here. England was not the only country where hishos of a foreign nation were established-Constantinople ha}a patriarch for the Greek, Latin, and Syriac rite. The ad dress of the Cardinal-Archbishop was directed only to the Catholic archbishops, and it was an axiom that a document only applied to tho s e t o w h om i t was a d dressed; and, i f he might without impiety quote it, the highest of all authorities had laid down a rule by which the application of it might be interpreted-" Whose image and superscription is this?" With regard to the measure, and that particular part of it which interfered with charitable bequests, with the rela tions between man and his pastor, he could only ray that the law officers of the Crown would find not only their intellectual ingenuity, but their physi cal endurance, tried to maintain this enactment.-(Hear.) Ile would ask them as Englishmen to say whether they would be content to pay for rights without receiving the in dulgence to which they were entitled?-(Hear, hear.) Humble as he was, he had to the best of his ability replied to, and he thought answered, the speech of the First Minis ter of the Crown. He had not violated the sanctity of re ligion, he had in no respect, so far as be was aware, in any way interfered with or offended the feeling/ of any sect or party-(Hear, hear )-but he would have violated his own conscience if he had not, while injuring no other creed, to the best of his ability defended his own.-(Loud cheers.) Colonel THOMPSON rose, but was anticipated by Mr. NAPIER, who said that it was asingular circumstance that this was the third time that they had been called upon to consider whether they should legislate respecting the as sumptions of the Roman Catholic bodies of this country.-( dear, Lear.) He thought that a good an swer had been given by the address of the Prime Minister of the Crown to any doubt that might be entertained on the subject. - (Hear, hear.) They were called upon by the very terms of the motion to assent that they were bound not to interfere with the religious liberty of any portion of her Majesty's subjects.-(Hear, hear.) He had heard this ag gressive act of the Pope excused, palliated, and in some cases indirectly denied, but from no quarter had he heard it de tended.-(Hear, hear.) It was, in fact, without any right for defence, for it was. if considered with reference either to the common or statute law of the realm, totally opposed to the British Constitution.-(Ories of "Hear, bear." The Government were perfectly ju s tifi ed i n the intr oduction of this measure, for the aggression of the Pope was equally in jurious to the feelings and interests of the people and to the Church in England, to the welfare of the nation at large.- ( Hear, hear.) From all the reading which he had enjoyed, from all the interests which had expressed their opinions, and still more from an authority higher than all-from one who bad left the privacy of his retirement and the enjoyment of hie leisure to state his opinion in public, for the common tteat- he had learned that this fact of the interference of a "'reign sovereign was altogether unjustigable•-(llear,hear.) The authority to which be had alluded was Sir Edward Sug tine than whom a more erudite lawyer or able judge did not ""teL(Hear, heater Now, if that was the case, were the Government net right in bringing in a measure to repress that aggression? (The lion. and Learned Gentleman then cited the words used by Sir E. Sugden in his condemnation of the act of the Pope, and was loudly cheered at the end of the quotation which he made from Sir Edward's speech.) Some lion. Members had said that the law had not been violated, others that a law could not be made, and others again, bolder still, had asserted that if a law was made it would never be obeyed. He (Mr. Napier) said that the law should be obeyed.-(gear, hear) If the present act of the Pope was contrary to British law and the British Constitution, which he believed it was, but y et the means necessary to repress the aggression were insuf 'ficient, then was it requisite to pass another law which would confer the powers ample enough t o obviate the evils to which they were likely to be Subjected.- (Hear, hear.) The conferring of such powers was necessary, not only for the safety of the churches in England and Irelandt,Wboutultn._ necessary might(Loud ry fearlessly assert for the welffarre theof ta l e whole a world._ dicers.) It was necessarytor the State, it was necessary for the people, but above all it would be a measure most merciful to_ the R_ omen Catholic laity themselves.-(Hear, hear , and cheers.) He believed _ that for the sake, of religious liberty they were bound to abide by the law of • c•og Near, hear.) However much be bad been opposed to the passing of that Act, he still f e l t that it was requisite for all parties that they should abide by its provisions. The, Hon. Members for Sheffield and Man chester had loudly declaimed against the proposition of the i dinister. What did they mean by religious liberty? If he they meant t h e exercise of the most bigotted intolerance would be able to understand them, but if their words ware to be taken in the literal sense of the terms in which they were uttered, he must confess that he was totally unable to recon ' rile their assertions with acknowledged facts.-(Hear, hear.) He firmly believed that no class was more opposed to the ag gressive act than the Roman Catholic laity themselves.- ( Hear, hear.) He had the other day met two of his own constituents, who had stated that from their own knowledge they could say that the attempt to coerce their minds and Consciences was to a great portion of the people of Ireland utterly abhorrent, and that any laws which were calculated to regulate the power of the Romish.priesthood. woirld,r,be A blessing, to the country. -(Hear, hear.) An Hon. Member who spoke the other night, had stated what he believed to be the sums of money vested in the bishops as trustees ; and when twitted upon the THE SUN, correctness of his assertions, had said that he got his returns from the Stamp-office. Hel (Mr. Napier) had inquired at the Stamp-office, and found thati no such returns could be made there—they came from the Prerogative office, and they contained only the returns of five bishops; and the House would, perhaps, be a little surprised to learn that the Hoo. Member had only been mistaken in the amount of those returns by the trifling sum of 768,3801. —(Laughter.) This was a specimen of the manner in which an attempt was often made to mislead the House by a statement of figures. The Hon. and Learned Gentleman then went on to assert that ever since the passing of the Act of 1839, the Government patronage had been conferred more on the Roman Catholic than on the Protestant community, and cited his own profession as an instance of the way in which the former had in numerous instances been preferred to the loss of the latter.—(Cries of " Oh, oh," and cheers.) Few had been the promotions, he said, of the Protestant barristers, while he defied any one to show a single instance in which a Roman Catholic of any standing had been overlooked.—( Hear.) Equally so was it the case with the Romish and Protestant ecclesiastics. While we believed the Roman Catholic religion to be wholly opposed to the Word of God, and at the same time placed Roman Catholic bishops over the head of peers of the realm, we gave rise to this suspicion—either that we were not honest, and not earnest in our opposition to their doctrines, or that we were politically afraid of them ; and we induced the suspicion, particularly to the Court of Rome, that we were not in a position to deal with this aggression, and thus encouraged that Court to setup an ecclesiastical domination over private liberty and social re lations, and everything else which Englishmen ought to hold dear. The Hon. and Learned Gentleman then referred to a letter written by Lord Clarendon in 1848 to Archbishop Murray, requesting him to be the medium of a communication to the Pope. for the purpose of obtaining his consent to the carrying out a system of education for the Ro man Catholics in Ireland, and condemned the impo licy of a proceeding which had the effect of placing Eng land in such a humiliating position before a foreign state. It was now said that we had encouraged the Pone to his act of aggression, that we had put Roman Catholic bishops over peers of the realm, destroyed ten Protestant dioceses in Ireland, and given a grant of 30,0001. of the public money for the establishment and maintenance of Maynooth College; and it was argued from these premises that we either had no objection to a re ligion with which we so courted and coquetted, or else were so afraid of it as to be compelled to succumb to the Roman Catholics. If we were to assume the attitude of an independent Government. and defend this aggression on the integrity and honesty of the Constitution, let them, in God's name, have some fit minister of their affairs, and not crouch at the feet of the Pope, and ask him whether the Government of this country should administer a system of education to the people.—(Hear, hear.) Then came a rescript of the Pepe to the different Archbishops of Ireland in October, 1848, directing that sacerdotal meetings should henceforth be held throughout the country in accordanee with the rites of the Roman Catholic Church. Dr. Wise. man stated that among other reasons which led him and others to believe that no reasonable objection could exist to the restitution of the Roman Catholic hierarchy, not only in Ireland had Roman Catholic bishops been recognised, and even duly honoured, but the same form of govern ment had been gradually extended to the greater part of the colonies. The same view was taken by the highest prelate of the Established Church, by the Bishop of Oxford, and the Dean of Bristol ; but if the rational, calm minded, and religious people of England, and their opinion was not to be mistaken, he believed that the policy adopted in Ireland had encou raged the Roman Catholics to do otherwise than what fair policy ought to have permitted them to have done, we should take a straightforward course, and tell them that we think fit to come back to the Liturgy and the Bible, to the right government and to the constitution of the country ; and, also, that we shall pursue a right mode of proceeding for the future.—(Hear, hear.) The Hon. and Learned Gentleman concluded by stating that he should give his cordial support to the measure. Mr. KEOGH said, if he believed this Bill was inconsistent with the principles of religious toleration, he thought such an impression must at once be removed, when he saw his Hon. and Learned Friend, the Member for the Univer• sity of Dublin, whose career had been one independent course of advocacy of religious liberty, give it his cordial support.—(Laughter.) That Christian forbearance which the Hon. and Learned Gentleman in and out of the House had always shown to his Roman Catholic fellow-countrymen, that peaceful attitude which he at all times presented, not alone to the people of Ireland but to this House and the country at large, when he was desirous of granting religious liberty to the Roman Catholic people, must have assured the mind of the greatest sceptic. The course which he took years gone by, he (Mr. Keogh) sup posed was no justification at all of a man who thought it his duty to pronounce strong opinions against the acts of the Legislature. He had somewhere in the course of his reading seen the name of Joseph Napier, who was once the secretary of the Brunswick Club in Ireland— (Laughter)—the avowed object of which, the merest tyro in the political history of the age would recollect, was to set the acts of the Legislature st defiance, provided they affected the supposed rights of the Roman Catholic people.—(Hear.) Yet he came down to the House—a wonderful concession on his part, and a great exhibition of Christian resignation—and stated that he had not altered his opinions. He had not even condescended to say that he had changed one tittle of his opinions with regard to the Roman Ca tholic Emancipation Act. Havs.ng done that and other things which he should presently allude to, he thought the Hon and Learned Gentleman should 'not have come there to lecture Irish Members who felt it their duty to op pose the introduction of the Bill, and to read them a lesson on independence.—(Hear, hear.) He had stated that that protestation was an exclusion to preferment in Ireland, but he found that a Roman Catholic could not be a fellow or scholar at the University of Dublin; and also that, out of twelve judges in Ireland, three only were Ro man Catholics. Out of five Masters in Chancery, four were Protestants; ; out of thirty-three assistant-barristers, twenty fiveuweee Protestants ;:and, lastly, that the two judges of the Bankruptcy Court were Protestants. If the list of stipen diary magistrates in Ireland were examined, it would also be found. he believed, that the proportion against Roman Catholics was three to one. (Hear, hear.) All the law officers of the Crown were Protestants. — ( Hear, hear.) Was that equality? The fact was, that Protestanism was a high qualification for office.—(Hear, hear.) It had been said that the Catholics were under their priests; he denied such a statement, and no one, he could assure the House, would treat more curtly any attempt to interfere with his private con cerns by Catholic priests than he would. — (Cheers ) He would be the last man to interfere with the prerogative of the Queen, and the first to assert her undoubted right to the crown of England. The country might thank God they had such a Queen on the throne—( Hear) — one who was determined to support the Church of England. There was no intention on the part of the Roman Catholics to insult the country, and the Protestants were bound to believe in their sincerity.—( Hear, hear.) The Pope had every reason to believe that his conduct would not be unacceptable to the Government of this country, and therefore he could not be accused of intentionally offering an insult to this country. So far from the Roman Catholics being ready to submit to the decisions which had been come to at the Synod of Thurles, he could assure the Noble Lord at the head of the Government that at the very time when this synod was sitting, there was a movement going on among the influential Catholics of Dublin against this synod, whica was stopped by the celebrated letter of the Noble Lord. Had the Noble Lord considered the effect which this measure would have upon the Roman Catholic Church of Ireland. It would have the effect of superseding all episcopal functions. Had the Noble Lord considered this? Was he ready to frame an indictment against any prelate who might, per chance, break this law? They had sufficient laws on the statute book which were not intended to be acted upon, but if it was intended to put this law in execu tion, was the Noble Lord prepared to consign the Roman Catholic prelates to the lowest den of felons?— (Cheers.) Mr. ANSTEY, referring to the feelings of the Roman Catholics of Ireland, cited the contempt with which they had treated a recent bull sent there by the Pope. The titles which the Roman Catholics bore, and would con tinue to bear, whether this Bill passed or not, were not de rived from the Pope, but by an unbroken succession from St. Patrick. He thought the Hon. Gentleman who had just sat down had made out a case for excepting Ireland from this Bill in a manner which it was impossible to controvert ; the Papal bull with which they had to deal was ad dressed to England alone, and referred to English titles only. There was one point which had been observed neither by one side pf the House nor the other. The powers of the vicars-apostolic were continued throughout the whole of these changes, so that in this respect the Bill was defective But it was defective in another respect. The Bill provides that all moneys vested in the Roman Catholic bishops for charitable purposes should be vested in the Crown. New it was perfectly impossible for any court of law or equity to enforce any writ for the estreating of such trusts, and even if they could, there would still be another obstacle. No provision was made for the direction of moneys arising from trusts already in existence. Then, with respect to the power of the synod to regulate these funds he might cite the case of the Church of Scotland, a foreign church to all intents and purposes so far as his argument was concerned. The, church ''always recognised the power of the temporal authorities to deal with these funds exclusively of the eccle siastical officers, and when the separation took place be tween the established Church of Scotland and the seceders the trusts were all regulated by the usual courts of law. In three different instances appeals had been made to the Eng lish Court ofChancery, and in all of them the authorities had been compelled to eject every one of the trustees who had acted in conformity with the trusts which they fulfilled. —(Hear, hear.) Then, again, with regard to the opinion which had been expressed, that this edict of the Pope was in accordance with the feeling of the Roman Catholic clergy, he would say that such opinion was quite erroneous. Al though the clergy were anxious for the elevation of their faith, they were still opposed to the establishment of any new authority from a foreign power. The Hon. and Learned Gentleman read extracts from petitions from portions of that body to the Pope and Ca r dinal Wiseman, deprecat ing any foreign interference, and stating that they desired a power to snake a canon law for themselves, founded upon the ancient canon law of England, and said that it there fore depended upon their present legislation how far such power should be granted, and how injurious or beneficial it might become. That power had not been granted, so that the Romish hierarchy was, after all, only a contemplated fact ; and the Bill which the Noble Lord proposed to introduce was not only feeble and ineffectual for the object which it was intended to effect, but absolutely mischievoue in its character. He would now proceed to anticipate the objections which might be _m_ade to his remarks. Until 1844 the ludo-Ronan Catholic Church was subject to the Romish Pontiff without an y restraint.— ( Hear, hear.) In that year a rescript had been . issued to the Archbishop and cl er gy of Goa, requesting them to do Theycertain fe lfelt things that without p th ora s l p p ec ow ify er . authorityunonfectehsee unnecessary they could not obey the who on their appli pealed to the late Pope Gregory provlsior! of that rescript, and ap hthicohutitth W e II n cation issued a precept, stating that he should abidethey by the rules established by his predecessors, and all stated that the coincidence of the temporal power was absolutely necessary for carrying out any charitable trusts with which the clergy might be invested. lie should have proposed in the enactment that all bequests to the Roman Catholic Church in England, both past and in prospective, should be vested in certain trustees. The ques tion before the House was one which made it necessary that ' Hon. Members should fall into the same mistake as the Government, and confound the case of Ireland with that of England.—(Hear, hear.) The English Roman Catholics were anxious for legislation on the subject, though not in the spirit of this Bill, while the Irish Roman Catholics repudiated all legislation whatever which should interfere with their present status in Ireland, and he thought both bodies were equally in the right. He should take the earliest opportunity when the Bill came before the House to move the omission of every word which related to Ireland, and propose such amendments as he deemed necessary for the protection of the liberties, property, and rights.of Eng lish Roman Catholics. Great laughter was occasioned by nearly ten. Members rising at the conclus i o n of the Hoe . Gentleman's speech, each endeavouring to catch the Speaker's eye, but they gave way to Dlr. SPOONER, who supported the measure, but depre- cated any discussion until it had been laid before the House. Ile thanked the Noble Lord (Lord J. Russell) for his able and determined letter, and his bold, manly, honest, and con stitutional speech, in which he introduced the measure to the consideration of the House; and he trusted he would ex cuse him if he said that the explanation he gave of the Bill, and the second explanation given by the Attorney-General, had fallenconsiderably short of what was generally expected. He trusted, however, that when the pill came before the House it would exceed such explanations, as far as it fell short of the Noble Lord's letter and his speech.—(Hear.) If the Noble Lord found himself placed in aposition of insur mountable difficulty with regard to the passing of a mea sure, he should advice him to throw himself on the country, and if he did so he might rely on the support and confidence of the people.—(Hear, hear.) Mr. A. J. B. HOPE observed that his opinions on this subject had not yet changed. He complained of the speech which the Member for the city of Oxford had macla on the question. That speech would have well become the repre sentative of the University of Oxford, but it ill became the principles of the Hon. and Learned Gentleman who de livered it.—(Hear, hear.) This measure bad no other ten.. dency but to compel the priesthood of Rome :to act sin the dark ; it might prevent the publishing of pastoral letters and such like documents under the signature of Nicholas, Archbishop of Westminster, in newspapers, but it would not prevent their being lithographed or printed,eand sent through the Post-office.—(llear.) Of what use was this Bill then? It had been dictated by mistaken big try, and he doubted very much whether it really conveyed the views of the Noble Lord who proposed it.—(Hear.) The Roman Catholic hierarchy had done nothing which the law could touch them for, and as they had only sought for and obtained a position, be contended that it was unfair to pass an ex post facto law to meet the case.— (Hear, hear.) There was one view of the subject which he was rather surprised had not been more generally dwelt upon. Bills had already been before Parliament in which the Pope was recognised as a Sovereign Pontiff, and his authority acknowledged; and it was therefore highly unjust to say now that the Pope had exceeded his legitimate power in establishing this hierarchy.—(Hear.) Nor could it be said after this that the Government was ignoront of the fact that the Pope claimed spiritual authority over the Roman Catholics of this country. Indeed, until this alleged Papal aggression, that authority was never denied, but now, for sooth, because there was a little noise out of doors, the Noble Lord and his Government found it convenient to en tirely shut out the past from their consideration.—(Hear.) Col. THOMPSON had no wish to quarrel with his brethren who professed the Roman Catholic religion, but he did really think that an aggression had been committed in this instance by the Pope.—(Hear, hear.) Some Honourable Members 'had asked where was the aggression; but, if instead of asking such questions they would rook for it in the right place, they would find plenty of aggression.—(Cheers.) A French General brought the Pope back to Rome over the dead bodies of his subjects, and, with Waterloo in his memory, he no doubt advised his Holiness to send a message to England, or why should there have been in this message an allusion to the family of James the Second, a representative of whom, or rather one claiming to be a representative, was living at this moment in America. - (Hear.) France knew all this, and so did her Majesty's Government, for last session he handed them one of the ma nifestos of this representative.—(Laughter.) Besides that, he understood this representative had, during the three days of July attempted to pick a cparrel with a member of this House, while, if he was not mistaken, the representative had been making kind inquiries after him, because he had made use of thewords," obsolete dynasty of the Stuarts."—(Laugh ter.) It might have been consolatory.or complimentary to this country had the see of Rome created one of the members of the English aristocracy a cardinal e but no,that would not do for the French General ; he wished to engage Spain in the war he bad in view, and therefore a Spaniard was selected for the honour.—(Hear, hear, and Oh, oh.) Now such things were neither, politic nor wise, and the only construction that he could put upon it was that the Pope desired to pursue an aggressiye course.—(Hear, hear.) Nor was the part France had taken in the dispute to be ad mired, for he had read a statemet. in L'Unicers which re presented that the time had come when Protestantism must be put down by . the force of arms.—(Hear, hear.) He belonged to the society of Methodists, and he happened to know that branch societies of that body bad been estab lished, which was perhaps well known. Now just fancy if these branches, remembering the days of Agincourt, bad set up a claim for the Crown of England to the kingdom of France, did the House supposfe for one. moment that their existencelwould have been allowed ?—(Hear, hear.) Would not the French Government have had a right to view them with jealousy had they even entertained such a notion?— (Hear, hear.) Well, then, that was precisely the case here, and he for one only regretted that the provisions and penal ties of the sth and 13th Elizabeth were not modified and once more brought into force again.—(Hear, hear.) Mr. HUME expressed his surprise that a man like the Gallant Colonel, who had always been the friend of civil and religious liberty, whose every thought and every vote had, up to this moment, been in favour of Liberalism, should talk of going back to the pains and penalties, and all because France had been guilty of some insignificant arrogance.—(Hear, hear.) The Hon. and Gallant Member was advocating nothing less than persecution, and he there fore could not help fancying that he had fallen into some mistake.—(Hear, hear.) He must have been misled by what he had heard about America, and he begged and prayed of the Hon. and Gallant Member to reconsider the determination he seemed to have come to. - (Hear, hear.) He had no doubt but that the Pope had been misled by those men in the English Church who were engaged in betraying instead of instructing their congregations.— (Hear, hear.) He thought it was not fair to bring in a measure of this nature while the laws affecting Ca tholics in England, Ireland, and Scotland, were different, The Noble Lord had called upon them to put down aggres sion, but he had not stated what aggression was. He should have liked to see the Bill which the Noble Lord had intended originally to have laid on the table; but it was evident from the speeoh of the Attorney-General that the measure about to be brought in was very different from the measure which the Noble Lord would have brought in had he laid his Bill on the table on Friday night. He deprecated the introduction of any such measure as a measure of per secution. He had hoped that the last rag of this persecution would have been swept away. How could they hope to reduce taxation by reducing the establish ments, whilst they introduced measures that wore irritating to a large portion of the population of Ireland and the,Canadas ? Heegreed with the Hon. Member for Maidstone, that this was a retrograde measure. They had 45,000 troops in Ireland; how could they hope to reduce this number it they by such unjust measures as this irritated the Irish ? Why was it that Ireland was a disgrace to us ? Why, because we maintained the remnant of these persecuting laws. The Irish Church was to be maintained, and the maintainance of the Church was the foundation of the evils of Ireland, and he found fault with those who were hounding on the Government to measures of persecution. Mr. SPOONER denied that he was hounding the Govern ment to adopt measures of persecution. Mr. HUME asked what then was the meaning of the speech ofithe Hon. Gentleman ? He wished to express his deep regret at the encouragement which the Noble Lord at the head of the Government, the leader of the party which had suffered so much from the " No-Popery" cry, now seemed ready to hold out to that very s e ine of persecution. The first measure which the Noble Lord ought to have brought in was one to set his own churchmen in order—what use was it to guard against the wolf without when there was a wolf within devouring those placed in his charge? He believed that the temporalities of the Church had much to do with the present movement. If the Church had been set in order long ago they never would have :heard any more of Papal aggression. It appeared to him that the 'Noble Lord was afraid to trust his own principles, he was afraid to expose his own faith to the activity of Roman Catholic priests. But he (Mr. Hume) believed that there was no moral danger of this sort, except from the comparison which might be instituted be tween the priests of the Roman Catholic and Established Church. It had astonished him that the Noble Lord should have taken the step which he had. For his part he would have free trade in religion, and let him who had the best defend it. The only way to keep the Church of Eng land was to abolish all sinecures and pluralities. It gave him the greatest pain to see the commencement of a system opposed to the procceedings of the last twenty-five years, and more especially commenced by the Noble Lord. He rose principally to express his opinion that if the Noble Lord wished to keep the wolves out of the Church, he should first extirpate those who were already within it. If he did that he should receive his cordial support ; but he would find himself in greater difficulties than he imagined if he expected to pass the measure in the shape he proposed.—(Hear.) Mr. A. OSWALD said in the county of Ayr, which he represented, not a single meeting had been convened, nor had a single encouragement been held out to the Noble Lord to enter upon his present course of proceeding. He trusted the Noble Lord would meet with no support in Scot land. He believed the act of the Pope was purely a spiritual one, unaccompanied by any temporal provision, and he was at a loss to see how it could be looked at in any other light. The Hon. Gentleman alluded to the Free Church of Scotland, and observed that though the old dioceses of the Established Church were selected, and a general assembly periodically held for its more perfect go vernment, no interference was made by the Government. Now was there any difference between this act and that which had been attempted by the Church of Rome?— (Hear, hear.) The Free Church of Scotland had done nothing more than that which had been attempted by the Pope.— (Hear, hear.) Whatever argument applies to the act of the one authority applies equally to the other, and he was therefore profoundly surprised to find that the Noble Lord ( Lord John Russell) had abandoned all the principles of his whole life. The precept by which Cardinal Wiseman assumed to himself the title of Archbishop of Westminster, had not been signed by any regularly constituted authority in this country. The Noble Lord might draw distinctions between the two cases but he confessed himself /quite incapable of seeing any difference between them, and he should like to see how the Right Honourable Gentleman the Secretary at War (Mr. Fox Maule) could reconcile his conduct in the one case with his conduct in the other.—(Cheers.) The Right Hon. Baronet the Secretary for the Home Department said that all England bad raised its voice in favour of some Bill, if not of this Bill, for the repression of this aggression; but until he saw that opinion acceded to by his Hon. Friend the Member for the University of Oxford (Sir R. Inglis), and endorsed by the Hon. Member for Warwickshire (Mr. Spooner), he could not by any means•join in that opinion. The Noble Lord (Lord J. Russell) had complained that the act of the Pope was an invasion of the supremacy of the Crown. If the supremacy of the Crown was to be interpreted as the Noble Lord bad interpreted it, then he must say that it was as gross an act of tyranny as any that he had ever heard of.—(Cheers.) He could assure the Noble Lord that there were those on that side of the House who were quite ready to go over to the other, and who were quite as able to manage the public affairs as the Noble Lord himself ; and if he persevered in giving this interpretation to the su premacy of the Crown he might rest assured that the in tolerance which had caused civil broils to be engendered for nearly 200 years would excite against him an opposition with which he would never be able to contend,—(Hear, and cheers). The Noble Lord would not have dared to introduce that mea sure unless he had thought that those with whom he (Mr. Oswald) acted had been irretrievably distressed. —(Hear. hear.) He ensured him that such was not the case, but that they were prepared to act together. - (Cheers.) By perse verance he would arouse the feelings of all these who as members of the Church of Scotland had themselves and by their ancestors lost both houses and lands for the sake of religious liberty.—(Cheers.) As the proposed Bill now stood, it was neither more nor less th an an act o f t h e v il es t persecution.--(Loud cheer!e) Lord JOHN RUSSELL—sir, I can well allow the observations of the Honourable Member for Montrose (Mr. Hume) to pass without comment seeing that he has given his consent to the introduction of the measure. The Act against which this Bill is directed anyanycou ntry potentate over t which h c i o c consti tute t b i- e is contrary to the public law of ever y countr y i n Europe. t l u t t w e as dir n e o c t tio pe n rm s fo it r t t e h d e b s e u ' subjects not exercise sovereign authori t y . Secondl y , it is eon trary to that public authori;y for any power to be exercise or any title to be married, particularly where it that ject s law of for LONDON, WEDNESDAY . EVENING, FEBRUARY 12, 1851. interferes with royal authority without the consent of the Sovereign of that country.— (Hear. hear.) With respect to the arguments which have been used against the introduction of any measure on this subject after what has been said by my Honourable and Learned Friend the Attorney-General, and after the many other able arguments we have heard in support of the adoption of some course for re pelling this aegression, I will not at present enter fur ther upon the discussion of that question. But, Sir, we have heard arguments from the Hon. Member for Mayo, which arguments have been enforced by the Hon. and Learned Member for Athlone, for the purpose of showing that we are not justified in noticing this aggression. These argu ments resolve themselves into two points. The first is a general excuse for the conduct of the Court of Rome, on the ground that we had by our conduct misled the Court, and that it was justified in believing that the Government of this country was not opposed to the establishment of this hierarchy ; and the other argement resolves itself into an attack upon the consistency of the different members of her Majesty's Government, and some particularly upon that of myself. Now, Sir, with regard to ;he first point, I will not recall to the recollection of the House what passed in 1843 and in 1845, but I will merely remind the House that anything that might have passed at Rome during Lord Minto's mis sion to that city would not have induced the Court of Rome to imagine that her Majesty's Ministers would consent to the appoitment of any hierarchy in this country, for after Lord Minto had left Rome, I myself dis tinctly declared in this House, that the Government would not give its consent to any measure for the establishment of Roman Catholic episcopal sees in this country. So that no misapprehension whatever could have existed,en that point is clear, for that declaration of mine was welt known to all the Roman Catholics in tois country immediately that it was made, and was no doubt at once communicated to Rome, so that it is impossible any misapprehension could have existed at the Court of Rome on this subject. It is evident, there fore, that this measure was adopted by the Court of Rome in opposition to the Government of this country ; it was dono in opposition to the Crown of this country, and the effect was to erect sees and to give to the holders of those sees power to govern not in Asia or Africa but in Westminster and Middlesex, and when such was the case the people of Westminster and Middlesex naturally thought that none ought to have power to govern them but those who were authorised to do so by the law of the land. The Hon. Member for Mayo says, that not only has the Pope erected these new archbishoprics and bishoprics, but that he has also put an. end to the Archbishopric of Canterbury and the Bishopric of London. Now it that assumption be correct, I am at a loss to understand how it can be contended that there is nothing in this to interfere with the rights and dignity of the Crown. I come now to another point which has been urged by the Hon. Member for Athlone, namely, that this measure is to tally different and quite inconsistent with my fcrmer decla rations.—(Hear, hear.) Now, Sir, I am not about to say that it is not so, or that my former declaration did not amount to this, that I thought it was purile and cihldish to fear anything from the pretension of the Pope to create English bish ps or archbishops—(Hear)—or that that opinion is consistent with those opinions which I now entertain and have just pronounced. (Hear, hear.) But, Sir, I think I am justified in saying this, that what ever may have been my centidence in respect to the Roman Catholic ecclesiastics—whatever may have been my confidence with respect to the conduct of the Pope—l :have found since that time that that confidence was misplaced—(Cheers) —and I therefore thought it better clearly and plainly to avow that I was mistaken in the opinion which entertained for merly on this subject—that I had trusted too ,much to the forbearance and respect for the Sovereign power of this country evinced by the Roman Catholics, and there fore, seeing that my confidence was misplaced, I brought in thismeasure as more according with the altered views that I now entertain. Then the Hon. Member for Athlone says that when I made these statements, and renewed these opinion I was bidding for office, and I wished to conciliate the public feelings of Ireland. Now, so far from that being the case, after I came into office in 1846, on moving the Reli gious Opinions Bill, I stated then the views which I am not prepared to avow now, I stated then that I thought that the admission of any bulls might be allowed, that I did not think any bulls that could be introduced would make any difference in the rights of the Crown; but, Sir, I must say I think I am entitled to expect from a Gentleman who sits in this House as a Roman Catholic, and who has taken the Rom,n Catholic a little credit for motives with which I have been actuated with respect to the privileges of Roman Catholics.— (Hear, hear.) For it does so happen that, for fourten years previous to the passing of the Emancipation Act, that I held a seat in this House whenever I could give a vote for the purpose, I gave my vote for the admis sion of Roman Catholics to a seat in this llouse. (Cheers.) And Sir, moreover, at the time I did so I felt that I was acting at the expense of the confidence of friends— against the opinion of the Prince then on the throne against the opinion I then believed of the great ma jority of the people of this country.—(Loud cheers.) I did so, feeling with the man of immortal honour—Henry Grattan—at the time when the name of Henry Grattan of great renown—at a time when Henry Grattan was renowned for his great eloquence and great Public service.—(Cheera and laughter.) I pur sued that conduct until 1829, when Sir Robert Peel introduced the Bill for the admission of Roman Catholics into this House, and on the second read ing of that Bill Sir Robert Peel said with great candour and great manliness, which did him the highest honour, that the measure was due to the exertions of Mr. Fox—to the exertions of Mr. Gratten— to the exer tions of Mr. Plunkett—the exertions of those who then then sat opposite to him, by whom he said the measure was originated, and through whom he hoped to be in a position to carry it.—(Loud cheers.) I was one of those who sat in opposition to him, and voted constantly in favour of the Roman Catholics ; but at a sub sequent period, when Sir Robert Peel introduced an Act for the endowment of Maynooth College, Hon. Gentlemen will recollect that there was great popular feeling in this country, and that there were hardly any of us who then sat in opposition, who did not receive many letters from onr con stituent, saying that our seats would be in danger, and we would never be elected again by our constituents if we voted in favour of the mearsure. Sir, with very few excep tions we supported that Bill, and it gave us very great pleasure to be the means of carrying it. (Hear.) I will not at this time enter into other subjects, but I think the conduct of my public life has been such that it is not be coming for a Roman Catholic to rise in this House to say that what I did in 1844 and 1845 was merely done to conci liate popular opinion. Sir, I wish as much as possible that Roman Catholics should have the full enjoyment of re ligious political, and civil liberty. I do not think I should ever be induced to introduce a measure by which they would be preventec having their own mode of worship according to their own belief, or by :which they would be prevented in consequence of that belief from obtaining the privileges and honours of the State; but when this is done 1 will not be frightened Sy the word of persecution, from asserting the due authority of the Crown and the independence of the Government.—(Loud cheers.) I do not think we ought to submit to this, which I must again repeat is an insult to this country.—(Hear, hear.) I think, at all events, we should have a Parliamentary declaration which should free us from the stigma and shame of having sub mitted to have our country so parcelled out, as if it were a conquered and submissive country. —(Cheers.) I believe we may do so without infringing in the least degree on the religious liberty of the Roman Catholics. (Cheers.) lam sure that if it can be shown in any way that by this Bill religious liberty will be infringed, I shall be ready to discuss those objections, and to re move any words by which the worship of the Roman Catholics may be interfered with. It has been justly said by a Noble Friend that if the Holy See had bsen pleased in proposing ex officio to make bishops over the Catholics in communion with the Church of Rome; if he had confined his spiritual authority to the Roman Catholics, as the Free Church of Scotland has confined its authority to its members—if such had been the case, I do not think we should have had reason to complain, but I do complain when, according to the letter of the document, and when, according to the known laws of Rome, all and divers persons are required to submit to a foreign dominion.—(Hear.) I do trust that we shall be allowed to introduce this Bill, and in the first stages of it I shall be ready to defend its provisions. If he could not pretend that his present course was in con lomity with his previous declarations of 1835, he was sure the House would allow that he had sufficieetly strong reason for altering his convictions. Mr. MOORE appealed to the justice of the House. He had never entertained the slightest idea of asserting that the Pope had the power of abolishing Protestant dio ceses • he left such fanci es as that to the N o bl e L or d . W hat he had said was that the Pope had the power of alter ing and regulating all Roman Catholic dioceses. Mr. FAGAN rose amid loud cries of "Divide," to move the adjournment of the debate. Mr. LAWLESS seconded the motion amid continued up roar and cries of " Divide, divide ;" but it being now six o'clock, the SPEAKEIC declared the House to be adjourned. STATE OF TRADE. (From the Manchester Guardian of this day.) MANCHESTER, TUESDAY. —Our market has suffered a further depression. Both the home consumers of yarns and the shippers to India and to the European continent still hold aloof from the market; and the con tinned abSence of demand occasions a more marked a eak mess in the rates than was observable last week. Prices [Lay be considered as merely nominal, seeing that there are not offers sufficient from buyers to test them ; but they are certainly lower throughout than they were at the date of our last report. In goods, also, there is a general tendency in the same direction. The decline in 40-inch shirtings from the late highest quotations is now practically lid. to 9d. per piece; for, though some pro ducers may not be prepared to yield so much, others are. We hear of some sales having been effected through such a concession as • is here named. • The want of confidence in cotton is that which most presses, in a direct manner, on our market. This want of confidence is just now in creased more by the evidence there is of a like feeling in the States, than by the augmented receipts at the ports. But another cause of our dulness is the fact that orders are rapidly running out; and, as usual, business of any weight is in abeyance, until the rise which ensued upon the last active demand has subsided sufficiently to induce renewed operations. ROCHDALE, MONDAY.—There has been a very flat market to-day in flannels, and the merchants have pur chased very sparingly, at low prices. There has been considerable inactivity in the wool market; the dealers have been very eager to sell, and prices may be quoted rather easier. MACCLESFIELD, TIIESDAY.—WO have no improve ment whatever to notice in the demand fur manufactured goods; makers being more inclined to hold than do business at present offering rates. Some houses have commenced working short time in anticipation of, the present general fittness continuing. The throwing mills are working full time, although the demand for thrown silks continues_ inactive. Prices, however, re main very firm; and we hear of no disposition to do business except at full rates. No alteration iu raw silks, quotations remaining the same as for some time past. alluDDEnerrELD, TUESDAY.—There has been a fair business transacted to-day in the Cloth Hall amongst the lighter goods of a low make, for the American market. Most if the warehouses have been flat during the wtek. There is not much doing in the wool market, the manu facturers only buying tor immediate demand, although there is not any likelihood of a reduction in price, as the lots that will be put up at the approaching London sales are not very large. . • HALIFAX, SATURDAY. - The - trade in our Piece Hall is pretty much as it has been for the last f.ew weeks. Damasks are in good request ; and low lastings are not mad e j a sufficient quantities to meet the demand. In the state of the yarn and wool markets there is no change, except that the unwill►ngness to operate seems to in crease; and pries are stationary. LEEDS, TuEsDA.r.—We have had a dull market at the Clues Halls to-day, and there is little change to notice in the woollen trade since our last report, In the wareht;uses a little more has been done, but business is not brisk. A STRANGE BIRTH. A somewhat delicate, though abundantly ludicrous, case, was brought under the notice of the magistrate at the Auderston Police court, a tew days ago. A strapping young woman, who called herself Murray, and stated that she belonged to Ayr, was charged with having at tempted to steal from the premises of Mr. Witherspoon, spirit-dealer, Main-street, Auderston. The defendant, accompanied by a female named Crooks, and who, by the way, chances to he known as a pilferer wherever she can find the opportunity, went into the premises of the atoresaid Witherspoon, and being shown into an apartment, called for some liquor. They were nut long seated when Murray took suddenly unwell, and maintained all the symptoms of having been seiz.-d in labour. Her case appeared so be urgent, and the poor woman could not be removed. In an egony of appreheesicie, as the dread of an unlooked-for addition to his household, the landlord ran out of the house for medical assistance; but, as the fates would have it, though he called on no fewer than five doctors, they were all out of the way. In this extremity he summoned to his aid the services of an ancient female belonging to the almost extinct class of " howdies," and, as fest as circumstances would permit, hurried hi r to the shop, where the poor suflerer had by this time been acc,enmodated with one of the private apartments o the family, and everything done for her comfort. 'The bustle and confusion consequent upon the above having reached the ears of one of the constables, he , went into the shop, where, seeing the woman Crooks bustling about from place to place with extraor dinary alacrity, he took occasion to warn the landlord of her character. A few minutes after this Crooks suddenly disappeared, and, following close upon her absence, the sick woman gave intimation that she was likely soon to recover from her indisposi tion. • The quickness of her recovery excited some un pleasant surmises that the whole affair bad been a "do," and with this impression the young woman was re quested to submit to an examination, which, however, she resolutely resisted. Female aid was, however, ob tained, and to the infinite astonishment and amuse ment of all, the expected " piccaninny " proved to be nothing more alarming than a bun dle of children's clothes, the bulk of which had at first deceived the experienced eyes of those by whom she was surrounded. Her recovery was so ['tepid that she was able to walk to the Anderston Police office in charge of a constable. The object of this curious and novel dudge was, no doubt, to afford an opportunity to her companion Crooks to appro priate anything she could lay her hands on during the bustle. In this, however, no progress appeared to have been made, us .nothing whatever was missed. The young woman was detained in the office till Monday, to ascertain from Ayr what sort of a cha racter she bore in that quarter, as nothing was known against her in Glasgow. The report being favourable. the magistrate, Bathe Watson, iu consideration of the time she had been incarcerated, dismissed her with an admonition, and a caution never again to attempt any such tricks on the public.— North British Mail. FRENCH RAIL WA Y TRAFFIC The following are the last returns of the gross re• cGipts of the principal French Railways : NORTHERN.—From Jan. 29 to Feb. 4: Passengers 156,881 i.; goods, 227,858 f.; total, 384,739 f. ROUEN.—From Jau. 26 to Feb. 1 : Passengers 50,807:.; goods, 76,386 E; total, 127,193 f. IlevßE.—From Jan. 26 to Feb. 1 : 16,417 E; goods, 34,830 f. ; total 51,047 f. ORLEANS.—From Jan. 27 to Feb. 2 : Passengers, 56,201 F. ; goods, 116,867 E; total, 173,068 f: BORDEAUX.—From Jan. 27 to Feb. 2 : Passengers. 26,329%.; ;goods, 44,312 f.; total, 70,641 f. VIERZON —From Jan. 27 to Feb. 2: Passengers, 25,363 E; goods, 45,910 E; total, 71,2781. BOULOGNE.—From Jan. 27 to Feb. 2: Passengers. 11,243 E; goods, 13,2591.; total, 24,502 f, DIEPPE.—From Jan. 26 to Feb. 1 : Passengers, 2,808 E; goods, 6,644 E; total, 9,452 f. NANTES.--From Jan. 25 to Jan. 31 : Passengers, 13,338 E; goods, 13,848 E; total, 27,186 E tiTuesnuao.—From Jan. 29 to Feb. 4 : Passengers, 53,113 t.; goods, 64,284 f.; total, 122,397 f. Passengers, „ BALE.—From Jan. 20 to Jan. 26 : Passengers ? 16,521'. ; goods, 17,287 f.; t0ta1,33,808r. MONTEREAU.—From Jan. 22 to Jan. 28: Passengers, 7,595 f.; goods, 14,736 f.; VAR.), 22,331 f. CHARTRES.—From Jan. 20 to Jan. 26: Passengers, 22.468 t.; goods, 12,615 f.; total, 35,0831. LYONS. —From Jan. 19 to Jan. 25 : Passengers, 90,022 f.; goods, 32,170'.; total, 122,1921., The Reformers of Colchester have had a meeting and have resolved to give a public dinner to Mr. Hardcastlo, their Liberal Member, and to Mr. Wingrove Cooke, who fought Lord John Manners at the last election. ARRIVAL OF HER MAJESTY AND THE COURT. Her Majesty and Prince Albert, accompanied by their illus trious children, and attended by Viscountess Jocelyn, Lady in Waiting; Lord Dufferin, Lord in Waiting; the Hon. Misses Paget and Dawson, Maids of Honour; the Hon. Col. Charles Grey. equerry to the Prince; Lord Charles Fitzroy, Equerry in Waiting; the Hon. Colonel Alex. Gordon, Equerry to the Prince; and the usual suite, arrived at Buck ii:ghatu Palace this afternoon, at two o'clock, from Windsor Castle. The illustrious party travelled by special train on the Great Western Railway to the Paddington Station, whence they were escorted to the Palace by an officer's party of the 16th Lancers. Tile Queen was received at the Palace by the Master of the Horse, the Lord Chamberlain, and the Lord Steward. POOR RELlEF.—According to a return to Parlia we it, obtained at the instance of Mr. Baines, the President of the Poor-law Board (yesterday issued), the amount of the decrease in the expenditure for in-maintenance and out-door relief in the halt-year ending Michaelmas last, compared with that of 1849, was 197,1161. The amount expended to Michaelmas, 1849, was 1,846,8581., and last Michaelmas 1,649,7121. On the Ist of January, 1850, there were 931,328 paupers in the receipt of relief, and on the Ist of January last 862,328, showing a decrease of 68,579. Of adults and able-bodied paupers in the same period the decrease was 26,634. There were more than 54,000 widows on the Ist of January, 1850, receiving out-door relief, ani last January they were reduced to about 59,090. IMPERIAL PARLIAMENT. HOUSE OF COMMONS, Feb 11. Lord C. MANNERS preinn:ed two petitions from Le:c.s.ershire, one against the Papal aguression, and the other prayiqg for the repeal of the !milt tax. AGRICULTURAL DISTRESS. Mr. DISRAELI (in continuation from our Third Edi tion of last night) said—The Honourable Gentleman, the Member for Westbury, proved, last year that all the im importations had ruined the importers— (A laugh) and no gentleman has done more to prove that France could not send us a quarter, and that the greedy millions of the United States were ready to devour all the grain that could be produced in the Mississippi valley.— (Hear, hear.) But, Sir, notwithstanding all these assertions and predic tions, the difficulties of that important Glass, the owners and occupiers of the soil, do still continue.—(Hear, hear.) The mention of the United States recale also to my mind that there are other parties to statements like these—and men, ..00, whose opinions have influenced legislation. There is in this House a country Member—a gentleman representing an agricultural constituency, but who is intimately acquainted with all the interests of commerce—one of the merchants in the world, the Member for South Lancashire (Mr. W. Brown). I well remember that Hon. Gentleman telling us that the English producer had no reason to apprehend danger from foreign importations, inasmuch as he would have a natural protection in the article of freight. The Member for South Lancashire says that freights, with reference to any danger to be apprehended by importations from th e United States, are equivalent to a protection of I Is. p er quarter. But, Sir, how does that turn out? Is the fact so? On the contrary, an eleventh part of those eleven shillings would more aceurately describe the result.—(Cheers.) And then, as regards the Continent of Europe, and places more contiguous to our own country, we have arrived at this re sult, that freight is no protection whatever—(Hear, hear) — and that the expense of the transport from the Continent to England is not greater than from port to port in this country. (Hear, hear.) Now, Sir, Ido not say this with a view to build upon it an argument in favour of retracing our steps. That is not the argument I am going to introduce. The legislation which you have adopted may be beneficial; but still—politic as may have been your course, and beneficial as may have been its consequences —you cannot deny that all your estimates have been wrong, and all your calculations erroneous. (Cheers and laughter ) After five years' experience, I cannot resist the conclusion that, in those great controversies which led to this legisla tion, great injustice was done to the character and conduct of the British farmer.— (Hear, hear.) In all those discussions, and in the preliminary agitation out of doors, representa tions were made to this excited community which, unfor tunately, but unjustly, conveyed the impression that the farmer was an unskilful and slothful man.—( Hear, hear.) It could not be denied, that under the abrogated system, whose virtues I am not now eulogising, and whose policy I am not now vindicating, there were some great facts which none could gainsay, though few would listen to. It could not be denied that the British farmer however stigmatised, had succeeded in raising from the soil a greater amount of pro duce than any other cultivator in any part of the world — (Hear, hear)—and it could not be denied that the acre which at the time of the American war yielded twenty bushels of wheat,•yielded, at the time the corn laws were repealed, thirty-two bushels.—(flear, hear.) It could nut be denied that, within the space of a quarter of a century—from 1821 to 1846 —the population of this country had increased at the rate of 3 per cent., and the produce of wheat at the rate of 64 per cent. (Cheers.) It could not.be denied that these men, who we were daily and nightly told were so deficient in energy and enterprise, had themselves, in 1845—at a time when not one of them dreamed that their protection would be withdrawn—imported from the remote coasts of the Pa cific a curious, novel, and valuable manure, to the amount of 4,000,000 cwt.—(Hear, hear.) Let us, after five years, do justice to the characters of these men. They were told that their compensation was to be increased .production from the soil. I remember when the eminent Minister who pro duced that change remarked -no doubt under the convic tion of some great inevitable necessity, but, doubtless, also with some pangs for the clas4 that had been accustomed to look up to him as their defender,—l remember when lie said, that it was in the increased production of the soil that the British farmer would find his compensation; and that he had such confidence in the progress of science, and in their energy, as to feel that they would be able to battle with and to keep down all the difficulties with which they might have to contend. Yes, Sir, I remember Sir Robert Peel saying, that no man could have failed to see that the power of production of the soil was but half developed. But it is notorious that the theory of mineral manures that was to be the source of compensation for th e dh frome utterly cultivators . of our own soils — it is notorious that that theory of m i nera l manures has broken down—(Hea r , h ear ) —that it is not succeeded by any other, and that it is re cogn i se d to have rodu c been e of foundedthe results o n greattLtaat were f fallacy, , plication. I remember that, when this great controversy commenced in this House, we then treated it as a farmer's question; and it was thrown into our teeth by our adver saries that it was not a farmer's, but a landlord's question. I find that it is still believed that rent is looked upon as a sort of ancient exaction—a kind of feudal tallagimn, the reward of conquest ; and that, when we talk of the difficulties and distress of owners and occupiers, it the owners of the soil were prepared to sacrifice what is, called rent, those difficulties would vanish and disappear.--(Hear, and laughter.) I should think that a majority of gentlemen on either side of this House will agree with me that in an old country where there is a great breadth of land, and where cultivation is carried on to so great an extent, rent is an economical result as certain and inevitable as harvest is a natural result following seed-time.—(Hear.) The only way by which you can terminate rent is, to throw every soil out of cultivation but the very best—( Hear)—and the only way by which you can prevent the very best from paying rent is, by loading it with such imposts as that, after production, nothing is left for the average return of the capital employed.—(Hear.) Now, if that is a thing which science sanctions, I want to know what becomes of that barbarous outcry against rent from persons who are great authorities on such questions as these—(Hear)—and if it is not a vulgar error we are circu lating among that community whom we ought to lead and to enlighten, when we hold out to masses of the people that any endeavour to seek redress for the difficulties of the owners and occupiers of the soil is only an attempt to maintain the rents of the landlords?—(Loud cheers.) I think that the whole tendency of our laws is to pluck out a cla:s from the agricultural hierarchy, and to bring our agricultural' communhy again to two classes—the proprietor and the peasant.—(Hear, hear.) Sir, I have thought this House would excuse me if I ven tured to make these somewhat preliminary observations be fore calling attention to the subject I wish so sincerely to adhere to in the subsequent discussion ' my object being tie bring this House to this point— on 'b o th sides to forget the past, and not to allow the feeling of controversies that have now endured for more than five sessions to affect the clear ness of their mental vision, but in a temperate and impartial spirit to endeavour to recognize the causes of the distress that afflicts a suffering portion of the community, and if'pos slide, to find a remedy for it.-(Hear..) And, Sir, that there may be no mistake as to what my object in this motion, I beg to state what that object really is.—(Hear.) In the first place, it is not, as we have been recently told, a debate' on the condition of the people. I find the condition of the people described in those paragraphs of the Speech from the Throne that have, at my request, been read at the table. I accept that . condition of the people. It is one of general prosperity concurrent with the suffering of a parti cular class. Do not tet me, then, be met to-night with re ports of Poor-law Commissioners or of R eg i s t rar -G enera l s .— (Hear, hear.) I trust that no Gentleman will rise to-night, and say that this motion is a direct or indirect attack on the new commercial system.—(Hear, hear.) It is in con sequence of your commercial system—(Hear, hear) - that I have made this motion, to adapt, if I can, the posi tion of the owners and occupiers of the soil to that commercial system. Nor let any Gentleman support me to-night, under the idea that this is an attempt to bring back protection in disguise.—(Hear, hear.) Nothing of the kind. I adhere to what I said last year on that subject, severely, strictly, religiously.— (Cheers.) I said that I could not, in this Parliament, make any attempt to bring back the abrogated system of protection ; and I gave my reasons tor that opinion at the time. I deeply deplored the circumstances under which that change took place, and that a Minister and a Government that were pledged to uphold that abrogated system should have abro gated it. I think that on that subject there was a clear cause of quarrel between the then. Parliament and the con stituencies. But I cannot furget that, immediately after that change had taken place, there followed a general election (Hear, hear)—and that an opportunity was afforied to the constituencies, even if betrayed, to recal the abrogated system they had deplored.—(Hear.) I for one cannot consent that the laws that ought to •regulate a great nation should be made the shuttlecock of party strife.—(Hear, hear.) Nay, if I thought that by any chalice majority I could bring back protection I would shrink from attempting it.—(Cheers from the Ministerial side.) That, Sir, must be done out of the House—(Cheers)— and by no chance majority, but by, if not a unanimous, at least a prepon derating expression of public opinion.— (Hear, hear.) Why is it that the cultivator of the soil, when we all re cognise as a man of energy and enteepriee, • cannot compete with the foreign producer? Sir, I believe that the reason why the cultivator of the soil in the United Kingdom is at this moment embarked in a helpless contest with the culti vators of foreign soils, is to be found in the weight of taxa tion to which the cultivator of the soil in England is ex posed.—(Hear, hear.) The taxation of this country, gene rally speaking, though time has mitigated it, and circum stances stronger than time—is universally acknowledged to be over that in most other countries. Unfortunately, the agri cultural classes bear their fair proportion, and more.- e -(Hear, hear.) What I wish to do this night is, to ask you impar tially to survey your financial system—if impar tiality is possible in finance. Let us suppose that some distinguished, foreigner -one of those, for instance, about shortly to visit this country—one interested in economic pursuits--let us suppose such a man. struck with the wealth, and energy, and industry of England, desir9us of forming some general idea of the way in which the taxation of England is raised. Of the great mass of our taxation, I _will take three items, together forming an amount of nearly fifty millions sterling., Those fifty millions are produced; first, by external imposts; secondly, by what is termed inland revenue; and, thirdly, by local contributions. By customs, excise, and local burdens, you raise nearly fifty millions. Now, what, at the first glance is the character of this great sum? This distinguished and inquiring foreigner will learn that nearly one-half. of your external revenue is raised by your not ,permitting the cultivators of your soil to produce .a particular article.—(Hear, hear.) If he go to your inland revenue, he will observe that more than two thirds of it is raised by means of a colonial impost on this class of the community.—(Cheers.) And if he take the third portion of your taxation—the local contribution—he will find that seven millions, or more, of the twelve of which it consists, are paid by the agriculturists—(Hear) and the whole of it levied from a very limited class of the commu nity. These are the principal features which the foreign in vestigator would observe in looking into our financial ar rangements. Let us examine this system now in detail. I take, first, your customs; and I find that a fourth of them almost is produced by a law which prevents the British cultivator from producing a crop of tobacco.— (Hear, hear.) And then I may be told, in extenuation of this extraordi nary law, that the land of England is not favourable for that production.—( Hear, hear.) That is an obvious suggeee Lion for a finance Minister; but the ingenious and distin guished foreign r will remember .that nearly every country in Europe does produce tobacco, and some of them very good tobacco—nay, that in Holland such good tobacco is grown that it is exported to Havannah for the purpose of being made into those eigais which are smoked iu Eng land.— (Hear, hear.) But I might tell him that there are some soils, in the sister island especially, that have great capabilities for the cultivation of tobacco.—(Hear, hear.) I think, in days like the pres e nt, w hen a Minister rises from his seat on the first evening when Parliament meets, and solemnly warns the farmers of England over the table, that the time is come when they can no longer depend on the wheat crop, it was eminently inconsistent and unjust to support laws which at the same time prevent him from producing another crop.—(Cheers.) And here I must ask the Noble, Lord some explanation of a remarkable expression of opinion on his part, the other night, but of which I was not quick enough to take notice at the time. The Noble Lord said that he deplored the rapid transition which had occurred with reference to the .condition of the owners and occupiers of the soil.—(llear, hear.) The Noble Lord expressed his regret at, the rapid transition from the old to the new system. Ido not understand what is meant precisely by a "state of transition." We have, not now only just arrived at it —the state of transition is ac- conaplished.—(Cheers.) But, I sin sayprieed that the Noble Lord should be the Minister to deplore the rapid mode in which the transition has been accomplished, because I re member this, when the late Government, by a sagacious and ,prudent law, tried to prolong that state of transition, the Noble Lord found great fault with Sir Robert Peel'on account of his attempt to prolong that state of transition, the brevity of which, the Noble Lord now says, is the chief source of agricultural depression.—(Cheers.) The Noble Lord even wished to form an administration which should not give the farmers even the transient benefit of the law of Sir Robert P ee l: Lord J. RUSSELL—I supported Sir Robert Peel. ' Mr. DISRAELI—I happen to recollect that there was ,a division— ( Hear)—and if the Noble Lord voted against his own proposition, I have rothing more to say.—(Laughter and long continued cheering.) I will not dwell longer on the subject of tobacco, or even touch upon the effect Pro duced by foreign sugar upon the produee of this country ; but I will come to another branch of the revenue, amount ing to 1 5 ,000,0031., more than two, thirds of which is raised by a colossalimpost upon one crop of the British agricul turist. Who can deny that the tax -upon the barley crop forms more than two-thirds of our excise ?- 1 -(Cheei - s.) Was' it not monstrous for the farmer to be told that he must no longer depend upon the wheat crop, while the laws, of the country loaded with this enormous tax the next crop to which he would have recourse?—(Cheers.) Remember . - what this crop is. That the farmer is to be prevented feom , depending upon his wheat crop may be grounded in some de gree in wisdom, It may be said that there s' better wheat in ' the world than British wheat, good 'as it is; but no one , will pretend that any barley is better than British barley.— (Cheers.) So we may no longer produce wheat, while we main. tain laws to restrictthe growth of barley.. We are counselled. not to produce a crop in which we have sc arce l y a n y rivals, and at the same time we are prevented from produc ing a crop in which we have no rivals whatever. This is the effect, with free trade, of a financial System framal with reference only to a protective policy. But I may be told, that if we dare to rid ourselves of this impost, we must lose' the monopoly of the malt market. Really, Sir, in this 'Age, after what we have gone through, what we are enduring, and what we must be prepared for, it is too much' to kOld • out as a consolation this miserable rag 'of monopoly—the . monopoly of the salt market:—(Loud cheers.) Why; if foreign bailey , will•not bear a voyage, malt will bear it worse. --(Cheers.) If we are not afraid of the foreign importation .of barley, we may - have still less fear of foreign malt; and the best proof of this is, that we never get good beer ex cept in Eugland.—(A laugh.) - How is it. that we have a great export trade in beer, if foreign malt is of so superior a quality ?—(Cheers.) We obtain on our malt, it is true, a drawback.' but an imperfect one; but we send out our beer, and it is 'the. best , beer in the foreign market.— (Cheers.) It does appear to me, Sir, that the case of the land, as far as the barley crop is concerned; is one of the most complete cases, if we look to abstract justice —and to abstract justice we are forced by'your ( Cheers) - ever submitted to the consideration of Parliament. I have shown, that of our external revenue nearly one-half is produced by prohibiting in agreat degree ; and restricting in another degree, the cultivation , of the soil, while at, the same time the British farmer is exposed to the competition of the ivhole woticle--(Hear.) I have shown also that two thirds of the inland revenue is produced by an enormous taz on one single crop of the British , cultivator of the soil.—.. (Cheers.) I now come to the third division of the amount of revenue of which I spoke, namely,' that produced by our local burdens. I last year asked the House whether it was not a favourable opportunity to treat the whole question. of these burdens, the injustice of which was acknowledged ; but the inconvenience resulting from relieving the land fr ont them :was equally obvious. —(Cheers.) , I asked the Hope whether, wnen .we had a surplus revenue, and when the agricultural Merest was the Only suffering interest, it was . not a favourable opportunity to perform an act' of public justice to the land, and • show tile land that we really did sympathise with its distr,sses.—(T,oud cheers.) That motion, 1 may say without vanity; was -temperately con ceived, because it received the approbation of a large party in 'this House - (Cheers)—although it was not carried. I then showed the enormous' injustice Of making the land, .pay. , 7,000,000/. out of 12 , 1 . 00 , 00 01. CI 't axat i on, r a i se d solely, for public purposes, and which ought to have . been , paid out (Jr, the public exchequer; but to-nieht I wish the 'House to ieet our case of injustice in an infinitely stronger light.—(Cheers4: I have now shown, that out of nearly 50,000,000/. of in come, .nearly one-half of the external revenue is raised by prohibiting or restricting the produce of land ; that two thirds of the inland revenue is derived , Irom an -enormous impost -on one production of the land and -that seven twelfths of our local revenue is raised by direct contribu tion from the land.—(Cheers.) It is not necessary for me ----------- i e tee now I t t r o us e t nt t e h r e a d t i a s l c l us u s p io o n n o t f he la l s a t subjectessrgseionis ;et frees flocalubt7dens, asise:t memory of the House. At a ny rate. since r debate, the truth of this question has greatly aslyk c c e _ ti ; (Hear.) Originally, I had to discuss the -abstract el:1;o of the justice of =king ee erybody pay to the poor-ra.te„eort it was then a matter ot dispute whether or not the es" a la t he of the poor was a general obligation. Since last question has greatly advanced. I have- before M? _r_u da dence . taken by a Committee of. the House of -Lau.: o pointed to consider the question of local aisessmen,to the case of the Government, as represented t a n k° los Member for Heretordshire (Mr: Corn wa ll Lewis), " thoug ht brought to this question alit those powers of theP L e t eat Which have distinguished him in all his eu rsuits, li neuv e talent for investigation for which he is Pr e -e t e e 110 0 ' (Cheers.) And what• is the. acknowled g ment of ee w heys Member for Herefordshire? He has given tic" t%'. eyo rs l question.- (Loud cheers.) [The Hon. Member rs:Le. tot it extracts from*the evidence . of Mr. Lewis,` to the etl. "" was neither just nor equitable to make taxes whi c h s „ Acu ity national character locally chargeable, the prattle l o or we rs of collection being the only fortnidable obstacle t t he l ' op er. equitable practice.] The Hon. Member, viewing e t alent taut subject ot local taxation with • that a bility r ain et at dal for which he' is always distinguished, has ar a pt' very truth which tsar ecarcelv tolerated two Ye7 era rto (Loud cheers.) • I have now to recur in a certain eo , , b b ar local burden', but it will be to Some which I have ". u „ w ith tofore dwelt uponaaburdens on the lend not inixeaeeaccoe local revenue. I could go at great length into the el tithe, bat time will only permit me' to sketch you_.,'„ ie4 tiA its bearings.' I have alreedy referred to the currls"%et made to the first Minister of the Crown on the l' e u l il ud tbe I-4e by Lord George Bentinck. I need not re l " ter tb/ 4 a NI House. t hat the , fall' in agricultural produce g. ite pose f was then assutned by that eminent statesman a 3 the ri"° result in the thange of the' law, as aeicribed bY _ to toss a quarter of wheat 'bei n g. 455. Now it •i s little lie p ace 378. - -( Hear.) W hat as the consequence of a feuel.eesrg upon the tithe commutati o n b ur d en ? The tithe roe,. isee appointed for the year 1851 is 96/. lls. sd. len ' l il t,. i la, But the farmer only receives, at present prices, 73 ' the I" ' ; the difference at this M o m en t b e i n g 231. Bs. 6d. ell ell t elt! and in order to'realise th a t difference he "hay t° s to P re"P r quarters of wheat.-- (Loud cheers.) Accor ding _ wle, prices, then, under the law of tithe commu t a tion t t e t : cte rs has to pay on every 10a/. a forfeit of twelve 11 . 0 at Is l , wheat. That is the effect of tithe commutation. ~ce Ol t not going to dwell on that' point; for the el f :l i re/o' o commutation, though a griev ous , i s but a trani cre epect s o wish rattier to point out th e ac tion of tithe , ' sari, j t e of commutation, on the cu lti va tion of t on the owners as well as the occupiers' 00 0 1 been held by the greatest political economists, tna"sceeet" e teeek read amounts to a rate of not less than 5 per c--n I will read a few extracts from a work on taxu e t i aa 'leadP., illeCulloch, bearing on this subject. He is a Ir Gentl eili. " - t) he was a free-trader before many Honourable 1.0 6 el e in this House were . free-traders. has vni great ability on the subject; and he is psirticala i l i i, ios s , the talent with which he sums up evidence. d once pupil of Ricardo, a• great and original thinker , all .etieg ornament of this House. Mr. M'Culloch was the a ll 'e 1845; previous, be it remembered, to the repeal ° the oic°:o laws, • and speaking of the effect 'of 'tithes aeon e d ealY ' ar ) and occupiers of laud, and in so doing, he t estot eesc , principles of that great man, Mr. Ricardo --W o gs, L AO [The Hotta Member quoted at length several P t s tree ass . , purport of which' was, that, under a system, ° 01 11 ' 1 0 the incidetits of' tithe were completely changed : ce tera h e longer-raise prices or rents,- and it 'would, th" . be: ;P i ,/ wholly upon the owners and occupiers of 10 ,1 ; 00 ,0 tie could -not bring about a great nat ional tiff the psi . ' to removing a burden which ought to be borne b.vis would and lacing it upon any particular class. Tb „Wi t° l. flagrant injustice, and, therefore, foreign corn,,, titbe . „.o, subjected to a duty which would countervail,ree i 0 of (Cheers.) That was the opinion of Mr. M'en" ( Neal t " a t but, in-leso, he published a new edition of to e t hat w",il Nations," by Dr. Smith, and in the appendi 2t t° .aat a fter -o' he again republishes his" Treatise on Tithes." hi , pre; ce the advantage of five years' experience, with all cereal ceptions and prejudices in favour of' einancipai t ":,,l3o; :of with particular feelings on th e su bj ec t of the ee r r,y on eellc h ro . with similar views to those en t er t a i ne d by the be re ties the Exchequer, who always exp ay ects prices to i ts , a I li n 00 7 ; flounces his former opinion. lie rs, in 185 ticilla ti t think there will be realised those unfavourable an)....elltee anticipations, that is, of ,present pricee-(C li C e r edja ste also they should, the commutation may be reducedteeeare.) a do a countervailing duty laid on' foreign corn."- - ( e L f ce pet ° er r is not my proposition.-(lionical cheers.) I ' l '. e t the i r aa any proposition at Present.. What I wish to ele eae tbs n. .' is sent moment is fo show to you-to prove °Li distress only way to account for the present agricultarad cbeer/..4 that . the agriculturist is overweighted-(L °4 e s sira lj3 l9 that his energies are ex h aus t e d an d his resea l. ' ot her a e, by an enormous mass of t axa tio n , to whiell t l e o ften of producers is liable.-(L ou d c h eers .) But tit ea tn ethli'a e ell and may be said to-ni g ht, "that there is ' u e tha t 008 what you say cannot be denied-it may be t reo tric €o o the customs ditties are obtained by prohibiting or 0' agricultural produce-it may be true. that two' tips' inland revenue are raised by an enormous irnP ave o.tif e e . e o: , agricultural product -we cannot deny that s t h of the local taxation are directly contributed ilTeoptioi 0 cultural purse -but then the land enjoys many e uie oe 1 0 0 -(Hear, hear.) I am going to meet that sta te e e e an S tbe the advocate ot the agricultural interest, but as u ce aeale c iat only for truth, one whose sole object is t° te n i l blie 6g.) bitter controversy whi c h i s injuring the la c eeet , te el of this country.-(Loud and long continued o de; w ill lam going to see with what justice this reply t hee ' t o: if there be great exemptions enjoyed by . the l an ear on D ot place before public opinion my impartial decisich dO point. I will not attempt to state anything vit t . l „ e ts O d e OS sincerely believe. My whole ease depends er! "if the/ t est gutnents; and it is open to gentlemen opanae de u 'otral e at er to prove any statements erroneous, or to de n ', I Tha eat ion my conclusions are fallacious . - (Loud cheer' i rt eide" rr tion of agricultural exemptions bring me t o the c i f tO rro t of another branch of our system of revenue, n ain , - grei,t tre venue derived from stamps.-(Cheers.) A vet' and State exists with respect to the operation of the iegsc , .. the'of bate duties, and if Hon. Gentlemen will investiga,'" oat' to of the case, I think, arrive at conchla i n i - fore P let to the opinions which they may now hold witil r o you t et e this description of taxation. lam prepared to 8 , 1° ,,er at this moment, of' the 1,200,000/., which is.PaT fi rd,...(oo for probate duty, -50000/. is paid by the, 'l3 - ill /Oa hear)-for though Mr. Pitt did not carry h' s te ali ee ee) real property liable to this tax, he aged sold under wills subject to; the tax.-( duty r ece t o I will show you that five-twelfths of the leg s 'Y ffl emb ar e er/s t ! is paid directly by the land-(Flear) b u 'f re ntal te also, that leasehold property, and all e celea.s a mein bereeed kin tTthauxteestaoistearle6gbacurydedniastyu.ponWihaeund.....irtuieg re the 't` - 6 11° e n s t e ri At a te _ du ty; o il trade of the fanners payS legacy and lir( )b3 can ces,j t f r oo l notewhn we add to these. the stamps upon ° nye ' . etaP tc ' s c ; he found that the agricultural classes are e l ' forin e e r er their share of taxation. I well remember , llfTr j u a elit rood' casion, that the Hon. Member for OrkneY j made a great point against the owners and occul ter , as e re when he - reminded - the House that the wi n ) 131i 1 04 horses of the farmer were untaxed.- e ' e also e atie (Hear he ir ' e' ul) rf not the windows of the man who keeps a sut'a eh els' earl,: from taxation?-(Hear, hear.) And sb n o ° u t a r . :: s ," b of the manufacturer untaxed • and why " Id n et (I be free, which is the machinery of the fa „ rtu d e re n otj C a pd 'hear.) These arc little points, but they (Hear, hear.) When lion. Gentlemen rise in t ot , tb to is talk of exemptions front taxation, they agli t . a tst ilP d is l ,llt e arrangement' lately made with respect to the Let s td its ver much in favour of the manufacturers• ta a con t i t member, in discussing this question, that ther e l ane ll eo lo l able burden of the public revenue, to tine for f o r t~ or 2,000,0..0/. per anntim,e which has been rais e d century and a-halt from the land, and the 13 ; 1 1 3e bY e a ri tf et tp that isthe land tax-(Hear, hear)-a tax, a pplf e " was not intended by the original projectors to terongliei` rv e the land.-(Hear, hear.) I have now gon e f prof ;be one exception, almost every important fest ure :tie o ;li t dal system, and I have ••reviewed the ts 2t a ri g °P e al e °, -country. generally, with reference to its bee at 'OlP - ea/ - owners and occupiers of the land-upon t6 Ol r aped class of her Majesty's suects who `are -- con t ' e r - eli culties, depression, and distress, and wa ° tb suffer them in a country where, as we Ar e eelP” the Sovereign and by the Ministry, as c glee t eeneo Ma s i er community are in a prosperous condition. (of Ofeee, I am not surprised, when I see all this burd en the inse t t ‘ o that the owners and occupiers of land find resP ec irstr'o, difficulties, in the present state of the law R at- erea t e , - ess;,) irnportatiota of . foreign corn, 'Mid 'are sufferlnb Wit On the contrary, I atn obliged te tonsider . 10 Y;0..-a‘ c Oe" is that the present' system has been' carve ,. fti ono to re I am obliged to consider what is that wun de t r he cr e e teld t) by which the financial system, which was all P protection, and whiclaprotection alone uphel d, ' es t teln ; a ge, able to work in a countr when that entire %pee a r ea' tection has been sweptaway.-(Loud 'es ° l.' the ° fi e° We may, to some extent, account for it bl ital'l t oll t .a .°ll which 'have been made uon accuthulated esP tee y elv hear.) It is very possible that some clas ses etie ni o r V ills o where they are living upon the capital of one P a lle t ill' ce alt e -(Hear, hear.) This is a result which Id ° t l ,t eat!, be wondered at.-(Hear.) But the great finaao-oeteietione which has occupied my attention cannot be s e ee g e r er/' this sad hypothesis; because I see before Methg Y machinery by which we have been carried thr e e 0 101:i it/' restricted industry, undiminished taxation, antuairall'loo4:4 ports. - (hear, hear.) We know that a gr eil o arale S te , testrunaent was brought into the House by st i - I , e o°,o Its r, ' ter, whose pride it was to introduce this n a dv ott ko" virtues lam not here to challenge, but the ° a . ''„es t h r ; to owners and occupiers of land I wish to it 0 8 t'''ad es e a what this wonderful financial instrument weei ieatt apt property ands income-taxa '" Remember (s" . 1), t"" e iou' y Peel to the gentlemen of the Mancheiter school)' der that you should have your cotton free, th e e. bes ea t 4 or ne t ° to the imposition of the property tax."-( 11e3- ilOt ; r i r , o Pre nerous and . confiding inan.e-( Hear.) And hi_a t el t e f e u ' 'dew' instrument'this remarkable system has been e ,plis°, (P, e l - ration, conducted in ita course, and has - ac e° 'i law 'ha be sults.- And what is the result of' this financia _ ltte is 0 hear.) Was it the manufacturers and rnerciw 'su b set'! , together and said to . the Minister, '` Ola -$ "6,000,00 N. a year, and We will -keep ale 'a : 0 06' 6 e te, system:" Had they done this it would n et the . " e e 0P ) been a La &bargain fur the owners of land; i f We I ; DiO r ;# might have said, subscribe what you will, but ( elea'.'ooln c o restricted imports we ought -to be - extniP t ,. -- t e alld u l ette n e l But when I look to the:returns of the prop e' te se e ecis'a, tax= this mighty and mystical sun, under 1 !.., r . 4 07, the , systein has gone on-I find that a rawer the oe w ee fres' les P from the owners and occupiers of land; oc cur ) ; whose rents have been reduced, and from the t „oat tbs . make no profits.-(Loud cheers from the coun b ry it 7 eos' you ask me what are of remedie, and s ir , „ill t e cet ill t t l,; the. owners and occupiers of land require? S esh as the representative ' Of an Undivided lengelaevet the industry of whose inhabitants e V r Pfle ' `the ''cultivetion of the soil, and as . t t a"ose g ell ;ecl ° 0 1 ; humble and -inefficient one L knows of a _ et . , who share . m opted ns in - this flouse - :,"' y iett l justice.'-(Loud cheers ) est e ask you that obe bo je o prohibit or restrict our industry.-(I te c l o direct, e oth e We'ask you that you will not levy tIPO.II arty -to ' l d for public purposes, to •which few, thro °llP e i ou nt ef . elasses are subject. We . ask . , You- not t i,.5,3 in t he of y 0 to according to 3 our own account,- the onl.L' e ' i bta aiells pet 0 , in a state of transitionary distress, h one ce ar t , financial . and coMmercial hat a ia a 'be w est. a hat we ask. We Think that your e yet ‘ e o . ask u s duative of difticnity and distress, andet .' a nd i, u c jarel istitueme, r e ' ou cur aein.-,d3aa-speakirig for my cot eels a , er ai constituencies 'Whose property and idiel_e.the On 4 rand 1 -I yuti at once to renal' , a e. pressure, and 'let' us be fairly Weighted : ire s e , a in to : (Loud cheers from the" country - party.) , _ e " eit )0 0 . e pt from . entering into the competitiou vial n s a,evei t : but I w thought fit to open to our energies, dear the ii s a t e rn re g i g t3 le ef - manacled:--- tu rtictila r ce lrfe et v Parliament' esides being Alernb?rs for paretic e a m P ole co e nter ,lill ev iAte to t' t prepared,.impartially'and temperately, ci 8, and I have no heaitation in saying ot nc d.to. r ui t io e(uLtesuadre cheers metatbieturl; remove ropy ili I ta i sli ro le t e e u s t t i :t h g hE i I f l d t s i t i s m t i t r s s e e s bt s m j e o r :r g -ti s s e re ic p i v i heivee:ispy fed 6 10 , sion fairly with the House, th 6 a s t e‘ci l 2%0%1 enter wn ,evo 1., • • thi s takl lit an aPp, thei e ; 'NA stv e , Iro n ;% '2 And Ph e , to X l . l k t .eri t ett • Yea `4, 4ko (hp V 111 '4 blnt' • Il te t • th e of 1 reel !'%t i i/ Pk4 t:, urui l it frj e , )4. 4 41 t1,,L 4 1; d per • se t , b ee tf) L e , w a , \.(!r Wi t ti to • Voi 1 1r , do 14, 11 0 , co l tp till llel tip . of 4a, k te Of