The Sun. — London, England, 1850-05-01 00:00:00

TILE SUN, .... tv , , t k ,, 4104 existed fJr the sal ar i es b e i ng ng`'n l Low. The truth was, it was harriesiratitote a correct comparison bF homer of the two periods. The salaries patd ha teriod were far in amount a, n. Gentleman had any idea cf . Vela whieli they were paid ; and one of I te,,,pseaea3 in the public service was the slid the s ubstitution ' re - a , lar Lalaries z,1,,, ofregular tea, s',!,l far than what was received under f 1i ,,,, ibe old system had been put an end dh e 't the irregularities which took place wa ke, rope if undue reduction took place. t 4 ) a statement made by Mr. Bromley, 4 °4 of chief clerk of stores in the Navy - Itr, f t 01 1001. a year, from 1763 to 1784. that ttli4ro!or,ei,ort of the Committee on fees, r a f / ' Ur. Bromley was but 1001. a-yea , '4, i5 e e 4 1,,,, ; (2 "0/. a-year. S 3 that his actual ' l litte ee '...',T salary of 1001, amounted to ' , sa c) i le the Year 1817, many yea's after ' bro t h ° ' t hed, the same Office was filled by Mr. ,04 other at a 6xed salary of 7401., being little I/41 !.thirci (' ai l' the the Polument s reviously (m- ,il year • it the scale p f salary rn1849-50, o e h e rlz ot the stores was fixed a t 504 to Sa cs 4141 to rise 201 a-vear until it atta o ined lita tt , f 650/. When they compared d l , hat t rt i they then existed with the re 'ille f 0 '' a t i Since taken place, the differ the 00 4 ,1 1 - to be enormous, though no doubt, da te a,'" of salary for both periods was only `letail':ent inertaSe was very great.—(Hear, i'lltlacite a great number of similar cases, Ittetoot Nall be just the same. Then there d prehileaplurality of offices. That system had k a ltl tal t „ t4 a o great extent; but it had now ',a- Ibis was another circumstance tha Ilia „a,4laparison of salaries now with times ' a ' e 'a livould afford no true criterion of the ~,,,,e:oluotents which had really taken place. tab Pt 41 done away with the systcm of d oe I pe eev, kid they had at the same time ilitetirDrreance of public duties—if Govern- II le ted `he • s t zt , e practice of making It ' t 5 1 )137: s-1 4'n the actual reduction would to thewer,,than any return th_ e a m t a c e o d uld fu b r e_ .ota., 4ite.. 4 9 b e e must say, d eth el int .: to amount of to reduction that ela h o effect,, would be cruel and un 'ettittigf4t degree. A. publication had been 'Alb „,°,,r,th the number of persons em- alai "'ale service in France. The amount btt lvEi 't ::al hot permitted to . be given, .b a u r. t Nih tt at ell at 266 500 persons. rho !lc . LtiPloyed .eenld be formed of the number of per jtptkrt,,ho,eitoaca,tille public service of this country, about , , ts, 1 ,„ I Y employed was somewhereo , a ..,ea, • , there • ,estry i, ~, he did not really believe 11111 ~ a tile world where the public service ; , Is k ~ 3 0 fete , , small nest' o 4 ) I,_ p%ons, and at such how far t 7 ' sf aeb`ste would not presume to say I'4'°lly rseris would be disposed to accept ., , S L ., °- a Person h o ldi ng da ce yet having - Nll4 -°r e than he hoped Cite l ife g i, e ~. coo department, experience in t tt taslit,a,no Credit if he said his 1 ; 4 4 ih ' - ‘ 4 'nal that the servants of the publi . c, tt y 4 eakZugheat, were by no means an ove . rpaid t°f ah oP tle e of v.n unwise redaction iin the pe 4 i. etatit public servant was, tba. h .. it ti vsta "' t u lose the advantage of his Ee' tkVatira establishments would get them awa?"., I :;tiairlltsitle or Government to attempt •), tk; s aes, to e ollara repoy way to induce ,44 keeP t Leas -' to keep hero we. lis tsb er and e • s His ex thatS p u b lic , at -tar remuneration. t h e con the olhcor did :not lead him to . _ t( ) ''ilf th e ,P,,.',1?,11e departments were at all crier .i.v'retairull,e service bad first-rate men, theyeasily II d, ter it lest they they were not _ R wh. e sPoke froth that s' lea t , eoa experience when be saidxf,r_ ~,,tlei.ot .-hdFil to discourage or d a mp the e i n. aa'ekiilslthhe servants would prove a real ,I 4 . e service He Lad always thought the ~•tif„agbt to the l 'Nfafaaelie , w and-ifservices ala 'tit."' seta servants ; the public had true A t, ere ,to discourage them. le 4 - cl ali t ‘, and wished to retain them, they firmly be m4ll b '3 4, 1 tile lien• Gentleman's m 4 - 5 % e - eau ' d a ) k d e , ,se great and lasting H o e tion, if car -414 n0t41146. public servants. The publicwbo Y be better done by those This ',Ol e fett4 alld not heart service.. a If In • Nil, ~,t4 be a sound principle—it was . :.'le-",.,ttle alt prix .establishments acted upon, 'q had w„V 'ale business, they only got men (Hear, . Ci.,,tl;:etlatiekt,,..in their work, they would be i tl Pe,„,al netrailo work not well clone.—(Bear, that bi bl e tv, Wish to express any opinion contrary settl4" tel t i t "e Motion of the Hon. Member, h '44 p r her Majesty humbly e . l lit t h e . esented to th, (1 la ever be be made of the salaries service, 4 pki 14 11 / ."'ll be graciously pleased to direct r e 4, 1 law ,''iera department of the public . P rd b • `°ajust aad o f the I na ett gh A adequate reduction thereof, a ,les,' , ,'a to the efficient performance ex t e-antirsty hi s sentiments s e.nt . itnents of the motion doi 7 1 / 14 i tt a. opinion. Ile held that economy as j'aele a ~e 4 u p o n , and practised consistently now /4 r,j'a estal e .' a/a that opinion Government _ ql. k ,tit th', 44 i a , would continue to ' wish' 'Loose a other business, ' at i a l; ~, .). pass to the motion which act. tla 4 to ,f`' negative directly a m act.—(fleas.) he would ,?Ill'eva.., eeti;ure on Government, t'slq 48 clhes t time the pi e Ri,o Go r ton, hoping at the sal u p to ssia, to Government credit for acting 0 _ _ _ k i t 4! di dntaaking such reductions as were ou of the Oo t •'', e e;a,", ° , and efficient performance true t1 . 1 4 1; 41 eei tt . ' " i ng, in his opinion, the only 41'•)t,i-eklq,DN't, Y.--(Cheers.) V 'l', 511ai,... eaving put the question, t , t 1 oOpp his that the ke the li ', expressed opinion lc, youor% G to a vote . tel , th e 0 entlernan did not amount, if it did? He N,ttlal,„etlaern‘\z°,7!sament. But what ' the elk x ltam t oe ti ,i, 411 1 not care a farthing whetherLaugh h"a e l, "ered it in that light or not.—( - of Yki: P l l ierir ft eta the speech of the Chancellor la a t ) 40 4 „,,at there were to be neither reductions the Ex ; kt,„:ts.tl dtutkl salaries. The Chancellor of ~,. ,___ of t k l ,,%tt NI : 14 4 eeraparis between the anaire .. IN4 11- Y Etild those en Great Western Rau -NI y. 40 ose of the be analogy 44 1 414 C ases b og. lll There was no H e had a t ( i iti .4 ktaii---liot the least in the world. 7 , lilt, 44 00waY share in his life--(Laughte ele st - p r s a stravv about the situation inwhich that 1 1‘ i n a g an d eorapany had got itself, except . 0 _ N,' '444. - ,, euti,, - that" the fair salaries 1 4, 14 ,,_, . tance cut down. k ), he ret qttatigable servants had been . 41 ki• ' h ad Peetedrailw d* trs in their private ca -1 i h a o ties:, aydirectors they en atti ti, ia r espect tuition in sayiug that e wh -11 business li e ° l , lattr, i , able men to transact their of ts, l tet i ", r0e.i,,,411er wards tocast them off because ... .er 4 slee k; manner in which tlktki arsee i ta , gonad extravagant deal had vi, i t h , " en conducted. A great and litatittai wh. reductions which had taken place, what did ie, r ee l had had been removed; but v ill 4 0 ' Iletions amount to when the salaries he.r illy, 41100:leers in the state —men who passed their t:c j i,l l l ' 1 11 88' end who lamentable ' ignorance in ca business, I et a 0 , se kith, an' business were untouched , 4 ‘ ,ill i''''.) ILI believed' in his soul that the b a c til' akse - t 4(1 ,,,a 4 e0 of r Majesty's Ministers t , act4a. that if it were not for the exertions o 'k ") oil ..._,''''.,g clerks the public business r Oat . Atom h t = t h e Treasury t, i4 g er.) It was on reasons 44 t I ltI l elari s : 14 w,, as required. He saw that k i Xii , %li t - 4 1 the individuals who adorned price v i l ti z (l aa ?.t a be r educed in proportion with 0_ c kor, qieti4rter-) In former times a Chancellor .n of Iht)lirsirt, eellid not stir abroad unless w l the to 1 44' 41 1ea rahl by four horses, but ne travel t f , so,„ natal cla ss, kieutleamn opposite might and ta, l 4e . l'ti'eola be a 'a, like any other passenger, respee.. it k ,Nt h ittr e , ,tt bit the wiser. Now, with , o t , '4 'lto "s`' need' the process 1 thr \ft 4 %mil ewornen, and . their re ilti ~,\ is t i tt* x ad been recently adopted in Oty 44 4 41 1.)---he disapproved altogether of makingr. i h ea „ 4 ! aarkarke table commodities for sale and bartre nd jo, t r c tiv e pti "' ti ght be found for them at home, a i, '4 marry'ees but for the vile 6 ' A 'ln of importing blue 3 ' ' goods of the di% bier„(anaa, e cheap and nasty _ . nlto t'llitinl"`er)--and thus encouraging ht o f our t4;pvt,,i, firtiz,haud embroidery. to the damage that s t ,' ~,,,4 0 1 114 2, It was to the free-trade stems 04. '' 4 t s , e ' or the povert Ywhich our countrymen \ 11, ' "kip, ere laa e • a -r -htery • Then, bey a,,, a t eas _ . tiring under.—.(Laughter.) dm to ea l , e ; ll 4 ti 7: l ' , l l to the forthcoming nonsensical , 1 4 4 ( la rd it ~.! Exhibition of 1851 "—(Laughter)— Pa whom ita 4 arty i aala duty to wary all persons with _ ...... atelp t,aeodll'aetlee Writ t go near it—(Laughter) • tist,‘'Nit„d could come a Q f it.—(Laughter.) H e had k 11 t " Plac( • for the most has eli '' ill e h ad told ,Istiere he resided o to London i, of 4tr e et , is_ tne people not to g __hihi 'la t ,' ) eat. l was a 1,41. --( Laughter)—because the . e. , - 4 1 - sh - "'inah 1 1 object of which would 11, t , l r ttge , ug,t ie on y and °s he foreigner to send his cheap (Laughter.) h i Vd e , itli e t.lqit'llle obit-.elf theY were not wanted-- 'to his ,` p e; fif the opportunity to exhibit . . Ntal et g decant illett of the foreigner's skill—so he put in tp41„.., _,r. --(Laughter.) Yes, a decanter— ;l4.on ollikllea't ueettater, and the rice of the impositt _ irlthiteo--(lialighter.) No p w, he asked, how wasa list;44 iasilLtitrY, who was accustomed to eat roast o _ a 'red .iii ), t .A stron after the manner f ho area %I, 5 Com et ale, •gners w dek ,tt/ Wh br P e with those nasty fore h i o manefac. el,' ie e y . alit ers s ad and sour krout, and (L w d laughter.) eta trea a . at sixpence a piece?--.-°° • us me - ni t ' as rud e Waa too bad that the industrious to get ftlleelay,,, w agon labourer who was unable corn_ a ' ll e •t ti o ea h l a .tet for a fair day's work, should b e on 1 ; 41) tettitaituptlite to fatten the set of idle fellows e . com a, lit tihe:loas ewnell---aughter.) H e w " fl i ' t hestte thttittitt tta ba .... o , l lld be made, because self in Th Honourable tro e(ltill. for extt_ewould prevent - be thanks of tip, P' f or ut_f rdshire deserve.l t . h he had Ile f c , °N oma oe able manner in which i% 'NI t 44 40136 He hoped he would con (C t ki ate it :' et any t i i . 'ea, i 4 , , and, if so he might depend upon 114 NAl l ti's shape ' which he a 'lle oro Pe of a shot at the enemy, pon Wev eoUld give hi t - t‘ l er, ti l l k al.—(Laughter.) He did al) , b e at oll _ ,t 1 that much impression could be made sk,.. ea ch. .),- aeons of lion. Gentlemen on the Tree llajOaleto 4 dissolution of Governmenuld be the lee 4 Se °. Let th , hey .. vtt wh o ~._ ere be a aissolution, and then t an , ntll loil eem e io would com e in and who wotaid go out d TlQ4ot,upriataill•---(Alaugh.) They might then has", !), f,t`teutte ofg,t, independent Ministry, and an indepen- IIN% tred k'emmons, for they had seen gh th 411 eo e"--(tati ht et th elud ed, g er.) The lion. and Gallant GFri- Na t ,,e a ataid great merriment, by observing kit ,saess,,a, wll 3 , to restore this country to her former tpl)44tina ." ake her th surrou tes a . shd , a envy and terror of . nd etteti oashiewb refuge and asylum far all who might be beepkir, ( peasi or r*?., was to stimulate the honest aodunre , b;_ pill,„„!et.o.pinion on the part of Hon. Gen tlem en. ) . ' t ete ratl ia t l t Ot t o 14:a41. SoT stated that it had very seldom 'alb er tas th at ,I. ocid, c omprehensive, and terse a kip 0 1' () f Which had been made by the Hon. post %red . It ordett t,,,, with t Ire. The contrast that it presented Ikata,;_h mar r ellly of the Right lion. Gentleman 114 ed, and he was certain bad made an UP% th e , • - 11114 4 9f 1199. Quweeng.,„.. WIIDNESD AY EVENING, MAY 1, 1850. had said that he thought it would be an erroneous ex- i tailing the salaries of those servants. What he objected of the Exchequer, and as if it was their business to Paint the position of the chief clerks and virtual Ministers 0 p e ctation on the part of the public if they were led to Ito in the motion of the lion. Member was, that the mo- in rosy hues the prospering fortunes of a flourishing State in Downing- street, nor upon the statement o f th e su ppose that any great relief could be afforded from a Lion did not allude to the possibility of reducing the communitY.—(Cbeers and laughter.) In the meantime lion. Member for the West Biding, that he would no t reduetion of the salaries in question. With respect to number of the public servants, but awelt only on the whilst the Hon. Members and his friends were claiming vote for the motion because it, would affect the wages o f the c hanges made in the excise duties, t'to duties on I reduction of their suleries. The Hon. Gentleman and credit for getting up a now agitation, a change had come the country. Wages were already affected, an d th e y g l ee s, an d the auction duties, it had been said that the Lis party had supported the motion in a wey which al- over the fortunes of the classes with which they who sat believed that there was no part of the community w h o expectations he had suggested had not been fulfilled. moot led him (Mr. Cobden) to infer that there was a on that (tho Opposition) side of the House were con- would not in that respect be affected. Hon. Members H e b eg ged to say he thought that his anticipations in conceeled sting in the resolution, and that it was meant fleeted. They teund that in consequence of their di - might try to avoid the consequences of the m otion, an d these ma tters had been to a great extent borne out, for as a retalietion for the fall in the price of certain corn- minished means they were unable to meet the charges to evade the responsibility which hung over their h ea ds, th e a bolition of the glass duties and auction duties had m odities.—(iler.) lie had heard with much satisfac- which the Legislature had imposed on them, and they but they could not evade it. Na man in that H o u se ena bled them to effect a considerable saving in their tion the speech made that evening by his Hen. Friend naturally sought relief in a legitimate way, .oft The'redue - could evade it, arid least of all those c lamorous es t a blishmeuts. By a return made in 184 G it would be the Member for Montrose (Mr. Hume); and it certainly then of expenditure, as leading to a reduction axation, Patriots who founded institutions and s o c i e ti es found that every anticipation which be had entertained a ppeared tri him that everything in that speech had gone was the means of relief which first suggested itself. In tor financial reform, who entered that House an d pro had b e en fulfilled. He had stated that he thought the ag ainst the motion of the Hon. Member far Oxfordshire. accordance with that sentiment, they (the Opposition) Posed, in unison with those institutions, i m p rac ticable reduction of those duties would afford a gr ea t o pp or . His lion. said that the wages and the sale- had proposed and supported various propositions. They propositions, and that moment they were brought to a tunny of diminishing the establishments which they r ies of personsemployed in the public offieas were not in (the Protectionists) had been subjected to imputations pint at which they must decide upon' a d e fi n it e sum , were then obliged to keep uP. And what was the result? general excessive, while he a dded that those persons from Hon. Gentlemen, some of whom were so distin- levied for a particular object, fled from the test. Neither Why, no less than 450 persons had been discontinued m ight be reduced i umber. But the Hon. Member for guished as to occupy seats on the Treasury bench. He the plea that the Government was in Barger, an d t h at in the particular departments alluded to, and a Oxfordshire had loots ight of all that, and had only pro- did not refer, of course, to those unfounded Statements wages would be affected, nor any other shadowy subter savine of no less than 52,0001 - had been effected posed a sweeping reduction o f sa l ar i e s. Th e n o te Mein- which, i t an excited ta quoque, were excusable at a late fige that might suit their purpose that night, would re for the country. That did not show that the expecte- her and another Hon. Gentleman who followed him hour o f the night in a d e b a te. But when the Noble vent them being condemned by the general voice of p the dons which he had held out were not fulfilled, Th a t s - e med to have gone out of their way for the purpose of Lotd, because they had given votes the object and effect country.—( Cheerte) He did not know, an d h e did not the Government desired to maintain those offices a ll u d e d a t ae king him or haying stated that the best mode of of which were to remove burdens from the community, care what might be the causes of the un i versa lly au ,. to for the purpo.ie of patreueeee he thought was as en- reducing the national expenditure would be by effecting charged them with the intention of breaking faith with knowledged distress which many Gentlemen had referred tirely unfounde las it was unjust to accuse them of keep- a reduction in our armaments. The Hon. Gentleman the public creditor and destroying the finances of the to. He had his own opinion on the sele;ect. Like the ins up the army and navy in order to find places , f or t h e a pp e ared to think that he (Mr. Cobden) had said that no country, he made an imputation which Was little autho. H o nourable Member for Oxfordshire, he aid not sup _ younger branches of the nobility. So far from w i s hi n g re d u ctien c ould b ade except in our arneame.eits. But died by facts, and had supported it by an allegation pose that it proceeded from one particular cause. H e to increase the expeates of the Treasury department, he what he had said - in 1843, and what he then repeated, which was purely imaginary—vize.that he and the gen- had no doubt that an evil BO complicated, so general, thought every Chance of the Exchequer would be was, that no material reduction could be made in tleman who usually acted with him had voted for the was occasioned by many causes; but he thought that it most anxious to make as many o f C het ons as he could. our expenditure—no reduction such as would be repeal of the window•tax. Now he maintained that they might be traced to one predominant cause, the conss- Having heard of the ammuut of the rein f voluntarily fhlt at the fireside of every fimily in the country un that side of the House had given no votes for the re- quantal of which were injurious, and which would be made by the Government, and having had proof of their if that costly item, our military establishment, was mission of taxation _which et not authorised by ultimately more than injurious.—(Hear.) But what he de4re to carry out all fair retrenchments, he did no t d e _ to rema in un f ou ched, What w ere the reductions the state of the public finances; neither had they given wanted to call the attention of the House and the coma sire to imply the sort of reflection upen them w hi c h w hich h a d been e ffected s ince he h a d made that any without a due consideration of the claims of the try to was this, that the result was no longer ques that motion would be likely to cast. He thought the stet 'meet? Why, he had found that in the year public creditor. But he admitted that their votes tioned. At first, when they talked of distrees, they Government had given profs of their desire to re d uc e 1848.49 t he ex p e nses o f our m ilitary establishments, bad also been guided by a duo consideration to the were told there was no distress, and that the country every expense which might be reduced. The p rese nt i nc luding the ex pense of the Kafir w ar, had am ounted claims of theirsuffering constituents. The Tory party were - was prosperous. They were now told that it Was true motion had no reference to the salaries of great offices. to 18 , 700,000i e wl' i ' e the whole of the estimates now charged by the Hon. and Learned Gentleman the that there was very great distress, but that it was not He could confirm from long personal experience ell of the present year, for the army, the navy, Member for Sheffield with "nev-bern z.al for atone- occasioned by any legislative measure, but by railroads. that had been said in justNeation and approbation of the and the ordnance, amounted to only 14,300,0001. That my." The advocacy of economy had been considered Well, he asked, who was responsible for railroads? — conduct of those who filled the offices of G o v ernm ent t ac t, h e thouht, afforded a strong justification of the by that Hon. and Learned Gentleman as something fo- (lit'ar.) Why. those great men who ought to be the in the public department of the State. He would statement he had made in the year 1843. lie believed reign to the na t u re o f their great political connexion. guides of the House, their tutors in political instruction, ask the House to look to the changes which took that a considerable reduction in the national expenditure He (Mr. Disraeli) would like to know what great linen- and the guardians of the public conduct. Did they not place with respect to those public departments. Suppose might be effected by a change in our system of pensions cial reductions had been made inthis country in modern stimulate railroads in that House?—(Cheers.) Did they a new Government came into power, how much must and superannuation allowances. He did not see w hy times ex cept by the Tory part; his He did not take the violent step of making the attendance on they not depend, for a certain time, on the kn ow l e d g e t h er e s h o uld be sperannuation allowance for any civil not refer to times far remote, but if Hon. Gentlemen Railway Committees compulsory, in order that no time and experience of those who filled responsible s it ua ti ons serva nt. The case of such a person was totally would run their eye over the history of this country might be lost in forming competitive lines? W ere no t t h e in public offices?—(Hear, hear.) Let them take the different from that of a man who had had his limbs from the period alter the independence of the United young etas of England admonished not to lose their time case, for instance, of the late Mr. Brookbanks.—(Hear,) s hattered in the military service. He did not see why States uP to the passing of the Reform Bill, they would in making speeches, but to devote their time t o R a il wa y D i d , note very Chancellor of the Exchequer who had any civil servant who, during 30 or 40 years, had been find that every great measure of public economy and Committees? Was not that the advice of great statesmen? ever come into office know how much he ought to rely in the receipt of a good salary, should have a claim on financial reform had been effected by the Tory party.— Well, what was the conduct of the great middle class, who Ironical cheers.) Why, what did they do when they ought to be the governors and guides of the country? on the experience and knowledge of a gentleman like the country for a pension during the remainder of his ( passed the Reform Bill? They destroyed that Govern- It used to be said that the time was come when England that?—(Hear.) Let them go through all the public life. Reference had been made to the Select Committee offices—it would be found to be rho same. An Hon. which had been appointed the other day to inquire into meat which they were now obliged to bring forward as was to be governed by a few great towns, but that Gentleman had said that the rule now of all the public the salaries of the higher class of public officials. He had the model Government of political frugality.—(Hear, was when shares were at a premium of 150 per cent. It offices was increased work and diminished pay. And voted for that Committee, althought it had been opposed hear.) The Right Honourable Gentleman the Member was then that it was said there should be no House of certainly if the number of papers now passing through by his Hon. Friend the Member for Montrose. His Hon. for the University of Cambridge (Mr. Goulburn), who Lords, and the House of Commons must b© recomitructed. • ' the Treasury were compared with that c.f twenty years Friend said he did not see any use in a Committee. But was then Chancellor of the Exchequer, might look back What had been the result of the superior energy, enter since, it would be admitted that the duties there had he (Mr. Cobden) could not agree with him upon that upoa his career as one which was not at all common in prise, and sagecity of the great middle class, especially more than doubled. It had been said that the officials p o i n t. The Committee of the import duties, fur which our times — a career in the course of which be had twice in the great towns of the north of E ng l a nd? Why, it there did not work enough—that they did nothing his Hon. Friend himself had moved, had done more than effected a great reduction in the interest paid for the appeared that more than 100,000,000/. had not only been at night ; and several allegations of that kind any other to carry free trade. And, agair, he believed national debt. Yet the House d just been told of lost in railroad speculations, but lost, it appeared, by had beets made. Ile would nek the Noble Lord that the Committee on the African squadron would ulti. the new-born zeal" of the h e artryy.(ier, hear.) not keeping accounts. And theta were the men who the Secretary for Foreign Affairs whether the ser- mately lead to the removal of the African blockade. The The gentlemen who passed, or who were the creatures had been all over England denouncing the farmers, be vices of the gentlemen in the public departments report of a Committee might not by itself benproductive of the Reform Bill, had produced a Parliamentary Go- cause they cultivated land without keeping accounts.— with which he was conversant were not always of any important matt ; but the evidence totsbrough before vernment which the Hon. Member fur Moetrose knew, (Laughter.) Well, what was the predominant cause of available at all hours, and whether they had not always a Committee often influenced public opinion cheerfully given their assistance whenever called upon ma t er ial extent. He felt great regret in differing upon disasters to the country; and the Hon. Gentleman, no to support the motion of his Honourable Friend to by their sueeriors.—(Hear, hear.) What was the posi- that occasion from his Hon. Friend the Member for doubt, looked back with saiefaction to the time when night? He thought it was mainly occasioned by that lion in that public department? A young man was Montrose, whose labcurs in the cause of economy no one he found more economy in an unreformed Parliament legislation of 1846 which affected the interchange of placed there for two or three years on a small salary, could doubt or mistrust. But it appeared to him (Mr. than had ever been effected by a reformed Parliament. the most important eommod , ties between different not calculated to meet his expenses, and ether some years Cobden) that upon that question his Hon. Friend had Those gentlemen who had received their education in countriee. (Hear, hear.) He ;had always been of service he received an allowance of 2001. per annum. made a speech upon one side, whiie he was about to reform and financial associations, and who did not of that opinion, and he bad always expressed that Now it was net the amount of labour which was to be vote upon the other. For his humbly objected to a ro. condescend to look into the history of their country opinion. The Noble Lord had said to the Tory considered s 0 much as the amount of trust reposed in duction of the salaries of the class of Govern- beyond a few years back, now came forward and an- party, "If such are your opinions, why don't you brina those parties.—(Hear, hear.) The Szcretaries of State merit clerics; he objected to the reasons given for that flounced that they could n ot su pport a motion which had forward the question ? " Gentlamen on his side of the could not discharge their duties without entrusting most reduction; ho did not wish to ace blame cast upon fiee Public economy for its object, ascause it had originated House were quite aware of their deficiences ; they were important state secrets to many individuals not in therms.. trade by making it the pretext for curtailing the emolu- in the new-born zeal of the Tory party I What was the often reminded of them by the eminent, honourable, he session of more than 5001. a year.—(Hear.) It was ments of useful public officials. He e did not wish to motion of his Hon. Friend? It was a motion might almost say illustrious persons about them ; they not, then, the quantity of labour that was to be borne in make it appear that this country was less able at present in perfect accordance with many Parliamentary could not attempt to rival others in eloquence and pelt. remembrance so much as the great extent of honourable than it had been before the adoption of free trade to pay precedents —in perfect accerdance with many mo- td sagacity and forethought, but at all events they • confidence reposed in such men—(H e ar, hear) —and those who were engaged in its service; he did not wish lions which had been made by Members of were not weak enough to allow their campaign to he he thought it would be most injurious to the to see any class excluded from the benefits which free the Tory party within the last fifty years. It chalked out for them by their opponents.—(Hear, hear, public interests of the country to undervalue or trade was, in his belief, calculated to confer; and he was much more than that: it was a motion in perfect Iv- and laughter.) However, he would tell the Noble Lord underrate the services of those who, if they should therefore give his vote against the motion of the cordanco with the exigeacies of the times.—(llear, hear.) very candidly why they did not bring forward the ques• had not the fortunes had at least the feelings of Hon. Member for Oxfordshire.—(Hear, hear.) That motion, however, bad encountered the anticipated lieu. They did not think it was a question to be gentlemer. For his put, he had great ples sure in bear- Mr. HENRY DRUMMOND expressed his surprise opposition of many eminent individuate. It had been settled in the House of Commons.—(lleir, hear.) in; his testimony to the efficiency and fidelity of those that so profound a political economist as the Honourable opposed, of course, by the Right Hon. Gentleman the They thought, that whatever the decision of the House who filled the su b o rdinate offices of our public service. Member for the West Riding should have referred t o Chancellor of the Exchequer, who at the beginning of upon it might be, it could not be satisfactory to the —(llear.) They were worthy of great trust. He had the case of the agricuAural labourer in the way he bad the session—only a few weeks ago—announced that country. It seemed incidental to - human nature rims had fallen below the mark which he had autici- that wisdom was (wily to be acquired by adversity ; heerd in other They of means existing for acquiring done. Tile Honourable Member ought to be aware that P a k now ledge o f i m p or tant se crets and documeuts; but the case of the agricultural hammer was a peculiar one, pated, and who had' the hoaourable courage to confess and when the country had arrived at that pitch of s uf. he had never known an instance in this country of any because the effect of the poor-law was to prescribe for teat he trusted a rise would soon take place, but who bad ferieg which should teach it the great lesson, he suc h i m p u t a tion on t h e h onou r o f a public man even in him a minimum of wag's below which it was impossible that night vindicated his opposition to the motion by his had no doubt the country would s ettle the question th e h um bleet l in g o he h ea r.) When he had the to go .—(Hear , hear.) The Honourable Member also researches into the books .. , f the Maryleboue Vestry, tor itself, without troubling him or the Noble L o rd a t h ono ur o f filli n g t h e o ffi ce o f Fi rs t Lord of the Trea- did not seem to be aware that the amount of wages which Proved that prices had risen. That was the must all in the m atter.—(Hear, tear.) Sure he wa s that no Bur y, h e h a d b een a ll owe d 300 e a y e ar each for the F a paid to individual labourers was no criterion of the important part of toe statistical information of the Right other s ettlement of it would be permanently satisfactory t w ee; o f t wo pr i va te teere t a ries. Of course he was emount of wages which labourer;, in general, earned. Hon. Gentleinan.—(Hear, hear.) Then came the oppe. to the couLtry.—(Hear, hear.) Whichever wa y t h e obliged to take those gentlemen from the Treasury and In . many parishes, where s t he wages appeared statue of a still more important party—that of the Right Howe might vote, the people out of doors would be die he could say that if they had 10,000 L a year they could to De high, great numbers or Persons were wholly Hon. Gentleman t h e m em b er for te am worth; and ter- sati,fied. Even supposing a substantive motion for the not perform their duties with more zeal, fidelity , and unemploy ed, a nd, consequently, the amount o f tainiy, as far as his observations went, they were retracing of their steps in commercial legislation were, quite uuanawerable, because the theatre on which the as desired by tbe Noble Lord, proposed to aassemblyel efficiency than they had done.—(Hear, hear.) Now if wges paid ought to bs considered with reference the present motion meant anything, it meant that there o a ths whole population of the district.—(Hear, hear.) Right Honourable Gentleman had played was of a lie pledged the other way, and even supposing it ought to be a revision of the salaries of such men as It really would be satisfactory if Ministers would mired, although of a classical character—it was con- proposers would not achieve a result which, as prudent these; and he felt bound to oppose it, because he have the kindness to declare, once and for all, whether fined to Downing-sliest. One would have supposed men, they should desire to accomplish; because it was thought it wuuld inflict a wound on men to whom the the country had gained or lost by their measures. from the observations of the Right Honourable Gen- by slow degrees, by the salutary experience of suffer public were under great obligations. He admitted that To-night the House had been informed that the coun- tleman, that the subject of the motion of the lion. lug, that the various classes of the community must in forming new establishments it was a fair con- try had not gained a farthing; whereas, at the begin- Member for Oxfordshire was to curtail the salaries of arrive at that charge which assuredly they Would )3 - sideration to be taken into account that the prices of nines of the seseion, it was asserted that our gain those mysterious and rare individuals who were virtually and-bye arrive at.—(Heer, hear.) Before ho sat down provisions were lower now than they had been formerly; amounted tit not less than 90,000,000/.—(Hear, hear.) the Government of the country. The Right Hon. Gen- he would make one observation which he thought the but in considering.the case of those who had spent s o m e P e rhaps the question was an open one with the Minis- tleman had -referred tot he late Mn. Brooksbank, as if Noble Lord would do well to reflect upon b e f o re b e 20 years or more in the public service, he did n ot think try, and they had not, yet arrived at any satisfactory con- they were about to invade the innermost sanctuary of again talked of ideas of this kind coming un der th e that was a matter which ought to be taken into account elusion with respect to it. His reason for thinking it Dewniegtstreet , and to deprive gentlemen who din- read of a wildgoose chase. It seemed to be the convic just now. A Committee had already been appointed just and politic to reduce salaries rather than to dimi- charged responsible and important duties, and were en- time of the Noble Lord and his friends that the notion for inquiring into the salaries of the higher class of pub- lush the number of persons employed was this:—There trusted with most important secrets, of the rewards which of a recurrence to the com mercial system that h a d b een lie officers, with a view to ascertain whether or not it had taken place a general reduction of the prices of ar- th bad so dearly won. The Right Hon. Gentleman abrogated was perfectly . insensate, especially so in a Was advisable that those salaries should be reduced, tidies of consumption—a reduction brought about not by bud argued the whole case as if they were merely deal- country where democratic sympathies so g reatly pre- Now he should state his opinion upon that subject with- any partial cause, but the result of a system in which ing with some 100,000 d or 200,000/. a year. Was that veiled as, very fortunately, they did in this country. out any hesitation. His opinion was, that those who Ministers and gentlemen opposite were now triumph- the case? On the contrary, had not the Hon. Member Ile would remind the Noble Lord that there was a na filled the highest offices of the state in this country did ing.—(Hear, h ea r.) M a n, like all animals, was gre ga- for Oxfordshire, in his ingenious and thoroughly trust- don, a nation not second in power even to our own great not receive an amount of remuneration in the slightest rioue, an d t h e re we re on ly two w ays of moving g rega. worthy argument, shown that they would have to deal and powerful nation, where the reaction so ridiculed had degree greater than that—he would not say to which they rious herds—you mus t a tt ra ct them by the clover in with an amount of not less than 7,500,0001.? Now, did actually taken place; that nation, moreover, being one were entitledbut than that which the public interest front, or i m pel them by the g oad behind. Now, he the observations of the Right Hon. Gentleman apply to in which the democratic influence was immensely more required should be attached to the situations which they was for a s trong g overnment; he cared not whether that theme?—(Hear, bear.) The Right Hon. Gentleman powerful even than it was in England; he spoke o h th e held. While he entertained that opinion, he also believed it were monarchical , constitutional, republican, or any- had drawn a most interesting picture of himself, over- United States of America . —( Hear, hear.) Before the that those who filled subordinate offices in th e s t a te we re thing else.—an Governments in this coun- whelmed with the cares of state, and supported on each Noble Lord again told them that a recurrence to th e cu m. at least equally entitled to consideration and protection; try bad bean strong in Pest years, by bribing the side by a private secretary—the one with 300/. a year, mercial code under which this country so long and so and with that conviction he should vote for the motion boroughmongers—by bribing the Lord Lonsdales.--pee and the other with 150/. Now, what would have been greatly prospered was a wild phantasms, to be rejected Which implied that the sense of the House ought not to Memberimmediately behind Mr. Drummond here uttered said it' Lord Hardinge, after one of his great victories, hy every sane man, let him reflect that the phantasm& be taken on the PrePosal of the Hon. Member for Ox- en exclamation which caused considerable laughter.] had written home a dispatch, in which he stated that in was accepted in America.—(llear, hear.) In a House fordshire.—(Hear, hear.) It was unfortunate that the Honourable Member should the thick of the fight he had been supported by two where there was such frequent eulogy of American in- Mr. COBDEN said that oftke °n l Y argument he had have interrupted him in the midst of a compound sub- aides-de-camp, the one an ensign and the other a lieu- stitutions, and American conduct, and American inlet heard advanced in favour the motion then under their stantive.—(ek laugh.) He was saying that former Ad- tenant—that they were men in whom he had greatly Int, he might fairly expect that the admirers of Ameri consideration was that the salaries of public officers ministrations found it necessary to bribe the borough. trusted, and to tne faithful fulfilment of whose arduous can politics would in time also become admirers of A.me should be reduced ' in proportion to the r e duction w hich mongers, in order that they might be able to carry on the duties be was much indebted, that they had almost Ea- rican economies.—(Hear, hear.) lie for one was not had of late years taken place in the Price of commodities government, and now Ministers must the bribe financial crificed, and had certainly hazarded their lives in that desirous that the great and inevitable reconstruction of of every description. Now, if he were to admit the va- reformers for the same purpose. The great lords and great victory, but that he had a most painful feeling our commercial system on principles favourable to native lidity of that argument, he should be a party to a g e. the arittocracty, it seemed, had a monopoly of the army, when he remembered that one of them had only 300/. industry—not to the cosmopolitan interests, so dice. , neral reduction of wages in this country (H ea r, h e ar) and did not want commissionerships and smaller offices; and the other only 150/. a year?—(Cries of " Oh, oh I" quently and so sincerely advocated by the Gallant —for that would naturally be regarded as a war on but the financial reformers did want them for their friends and " Hear, hear.)' lie maintained that the cases were Colonel—should take place in any other way than in wages, lie objected to any proposed reduction of wages and relatives—(Hear, and laughter)—aud therefore quite parallel. But ho would ask, did a young man who the United States, as the consequence, merely, of sharp hy a BWeeping tote of that House—fir s t, b ec ause he there would be plenty of speeches from those gentlemen desired the post of private secretary to a Minister of experience, and under the influence of popular senti thought it would be imPractieahle , had nest, beeause he out of doors in favour of retrenchment and economy, State look to the immediate wages be received ? No: ment.—(Cheers.) believed that no ground had been sho wn f ur such a re e w hil s t, in that House, they would vote only in favour he looked to the immediate reward cf the confidence of Lord J. RUSSELL said, that at that hour of the duction. It had been stated by the H on . Member f ir o f i m practicable propositions, and when a practical ro- his chief, and to the future rewards which were open to night he would endeavour to confine himself closely to Oxfordshire, th since the years 1828 and 1829 there pos i t i on , lik e t h e p re s e nt, happened to be brought for at him. That, therefore, was an amiable but ad captandum the motion before the House. The Hon. Member for had been a general reduction in the prices of articles o f war d, they would be all found voting with Ministers answer,which had nothing whateverea do with the motion Oxfordshire proposed an address to her Majesty for a consumption in this country. The !lon. Gentleman had against it.— (Hear.) before the House. After the Right Hon. Gentleman revision of all the salaries in every department of the aelealated in Yet:onion at from 23 to 25 per cent.; and gip W OOD said, that free trade had had the happy followed the Hon. Member for the West Riding. The public service, with a view to reduction. His first objec t, e had argued that there ought to Lb a proportionate effect of making, not only the Hon. Member for Ox- Noble Lord the other night seemed a little angry with tion ta the motion was that it was unjust.—(Hear, hear.) reduction in the amount of wages. B ut he (Mr. Cob- fordsh i re, b ut t h e con stituents whom he so able repro- him and some of his friends for having gone into the When he moved for a Committee in a firmer session, he den) did not see that that consequence necessarily tel. seated, econom i s t s; f o r a farmers' club established in same lobby with the Hon. Member for the West Riding stated that the Government had made a revision of the lowed from those premises. Ther e might h ' a a v a e " bc -t ea ' a Oxforsh i re ; „ I . t h e avo wed object of maintaining agri- sail his friends. He seemed to think there was some- department of Stamps and Taxes, and that many re reduction in the Price of commodes in conseq uence cu lt u ral p r otection had not long since dissolved itself, thine . very dangerous in being connected with duetions had been made in that department; to the of improvements in the mode of producing them; the farmers declaring that the question of protection was such allies. The Noble Lord during his varied career amount of 250,0; he stated the number of persona ironmongery might be theeper in consequence of the at end. The present motion was not so rough and rude had had groat experience; and one would have supposed who had been reduced in thet department; and ho stated discovery of the hot-blast, and, corn might be c h ea per i n it s f o rm as that proposed by the same Hon. Member he would have been the last person to find fault With likewise that with respect to offices belonging to the exe in c onsique3ce of the employment of guano and the last year, which co ntemplated the r eduction of all salaries such " compact alliances. —(Hear, hear.) But the eutive Government a careful revision had been already adoption of a system of efficient d ra i ggge• —(C r i es of to the extent of 10 per cent. The Right lion. Member Noble Lord need have no serious fears on the subject. made in several of them; that in the Home-o_ffihceenannielare " Hear, hear," and " Oh, ob. e in ', But if the cheapness for Stamford made an excellent speech against the Hon. Those votes had already effected a salutary purpose. the Treasury very considerable reduction n s d was dwing to disheverie3 science, why, he sh o uld a sk, Member's motion last s ession, in the course of which he. The House had that night had a frank avowal from the in the number fh of persons amp peye d d ha that n ail the ought not the WeekiingidiaLseei! a% we ll as all other mem _ showe d t h a t out of 23,000 persons employed in the civil great leader of the Financial Reform Association that a other o'c were to ,esubjected 'ar reductions. bars of the community 'e ' - ' e y en *"ted by their introdue- service of the Government, 20,000 had incomes under proposition of e a s weeping nature' —never mind Ws (Hear, hear) lie Was s urprised, therefore , to hear the tion? Hon. Gentlemen opposite sp o k e as if el classes 100/. a year. It was therefore e vident that the re duce reaso ns—should not receive . his support.—(Hear. hear, Hon. Member for Montrose now m aking the statement in the country had of late years su ff ered redactions i n l i on p ro posed by the Hon. Member would chiefly apply and laughter.) That was something which the Proteee that the Government refused all revision.—(Hear, beat) their incomes. But he den ted that that had been the to p e rsons in receipt of very moderate incomes. Persons ti o ni,ts pad e ffected, and as there would n ecessarily be He had , moreover , ffi recently Proposed a Committe e to cafe; lie denied that ren ts had been reduced.—(Haar, in the c ivil s ervice of the Government were very far from g reat an xiety telt by her Majesty's Ministers to & F r ame consider the o teal salaries of persons holding seats in hearsj Ile debid thet as i. .te and he would distinctly say that in the antral rule there had of late being extravagantly paid. It came within his own p u blic b us iness, it would be g ratifying to them to tind that the two.nonste.s,ofjudicial officers , and of the diPlomatie years been a reduction 0I rcatti in Emgland, In the north k n owledge that gentlemen who had started from the there was now not the slightest- fear that the " sweeping establi f sb e h d le e its readiness to do of England he might say . there had been fee, snots ret i t le- Universities with him and entered into Government motions" which used to occupy the notice book, and pro- f a ce 0 airletheoenlretovispiroonpna!reeaandyadedffreeestaed,toantdheofctrhoewure fari lion, and ho did not anticipate a red uct i on . But so f ar „ff iees in preference to professions were now, atter craetinate the termination or the session—such as the Sion g gon",nas though no revision had taken place, was an ' n w a t h u i r c e h o h f a t ' : e do m n o e e was it from being true, that a reduction of pr i ces lines .. ma ny years' service, in the receipt of only 2001. or 300/, motions for the repeal of taxes, the extention o h f the fraarn sarily led to S redlietion 4) f wages, that he main- a year. Looking at the ominous introduction of the c hi se , an d th e like—would b e eve r again they h t tioirrwufeada. usonjinasut_cihmzEPauenatdart,iwhonehaincE hilascithoefmaGraunavifetrs!et tabled the tendency vtaS the very reverse . Th e re - wo rd n wages" into the motion and arguments by which by Hon. Gentlemen opposite, because (t duction o# lerien led td en increased d eman d, a nd it had been supported, the country WOuld look upon its tionists) had established this great political thraudth•that more. 'occa- lion of the lion. Member for Oxfordshire, made, be it the increased de mend produce d a tendency to an adoption by the House as a declaration that wages must when a liberal motion was prosed parried.it_ prnert revision nailer d ntu t ac o nhd t co h itr e crue u dm tm s o ta s .n t c p e o s s , sible extent in the (Cheers, remarked, after the Hon. Member had heard a advance of wages. Hon. Gentlemen opposite seemed be reduced in consequence of the adoption of free trade, atonally the chance of T being an w reaping peatedly from the Government its determinatio u n re tO to be ignorant of the fact that there h a d of late and, under these circunastances, he felt bound to vote and great laughter.) hey years ekiated a gonefal tendency to an advance of wages ageinet the resolution.reduction .( blear, hear.) The only con thii eoariatiy; ffut he could say, without fear of con- Mr. DiSRAELI—There was one thing at least upon h th a e d to " the new-bora zeal 'of elusion to be drawn from the Hon. Gentleman'e motio tradiction that daring tire feeent rtahpaitdnrfe;hutltrseoafeivteheir tactics, war a' n d e e la ! n s f t sur i bt c an i dr a e l ,ba r ei e en t n ; e r ir m se. diminution of the prices which the House *and the country were agreed, notwithe financial reformers mudstelatrafuatstatalevbelnetery.y hear.) The pro- fidence in the proposals of the I G ha o t ver h n e me ll n e t d , a n n u cl e t e h inl al of commodities, there had existed a tendency to an in- standing some delicately-toned dissentieut murmurs that party who for that crease of wanes among the very persons by whom the which had been breathed that evening, namely, that the louring to effect l t ay b'ect..--(lleart then, was to ask the House be conceived it to be the duty cf the Government to re coteradditieebbad been produced. Among the operatives pressure of taxation on the country was excessive.— position of his whether they could not effect a retrench- sort to soccer her mode of revision.—(" Hear," from Col. in Leicester and in Nottingham, there had of late b een a (H ears hear.) From all classes of the community, from to consider e 7,500,0001. Who doubted Sihthorp.) The Hon. and Gallant Member, with his stieceseidn of ettikes, and an increase of wages unknown all partiee in the State, from every part of the kingdom, went with regarddi e t utß the Government said, " Leave it accustomed candour, accepted that interpretation. But for fifty years treforee---(Hear, hear.) _How, then, could the declaration was heard that retrenchment was not only that they cou i _ .0 it.„ But the Protectionists had of- the motion contained something more than this. It Hon. Gentlemen opposite come forward and say t h at the d es i ra ble but necessary--(Hear.) The Hon. Member to us ;wea 11 d rienjd, it to them, and instead of accepting the would be, in his opinion, an objectionable proposition s that the wages had taken a leading fered to leave country was in such a state of distress ages of for the West Riding and his friends should bet he t. They offer the Government had appointed a Committee.— did it merely extend to the Government of the day, nereons employed by the Govermen of reduced? part in encouraging the cry for re reric mn • pub ,e He observed that the Chancellor of the but it further proposed to have an accurate revision of They neifelt te well tell him that the wages the agri- announced that a vast measure of reduction of the pu ic (Hear, hea .e The Rinht pub cheered. , Hon, Gentleman was, the salaries and wages in every department of the pu . cultural labourefe bed been reduced.—(llear, h ear .) expenditure was absolutely necessary, and,to do the Hon. Exc b t, glad to get rid of the question by This transferring tic service. Let him first advert to the salaries. . n Now, he could s s a l y that for the last fife years agricultn- Member for the West Riding justice, it must be admitted no dou sibility of Minist C • ers to a ommittee. proposal as to salaries must be taken in oonjunetao_ • different position fter the recess than the respon roc laboiltefe ha ' been placed in aT from that , he no sooner entered the House a r rhe Chancellor of th e E xc h equer d e nied having with the motion which the Hon. Member for Oxford - any other class of wages in tbis cournetdry.o,ed The had, he proposed a resolution atoeiwhichthe epithet " sweep-dfe g c heered.] The Right Hon. Gentleman's voice was too shire made last year, in c onjuction with portions of his during the whole of that peeled, be l l ed thue to such a ing," which it now appe t . • h the Hon. i Gentleman_ la hter.) agreeable to him, it was i m possible to mistake it.— speech that evening, and in conjunction, too, with _h the state that their wages only enabled m . to obtain a liked, was felicitously applies le.—( ear, d an uagnother (Laughter.) lie assure d H o nourable Gentlemen declaration just made by the honourable Mem seanty subsistence for themselves and their families. There could be no doubt, also, that amongst We Riding who had an abstract admiration of retrench- ber for Buckinghamshire. The declaration was That Ee ealled the elavery state o f wages. He did not class with which the Hon. Member for the par' nt but wh f'd f•h t ' th tth hd b a great reduction in the me ~ 0 were a ral to vote or it, ta it was a ere a een blame Hon. CidntietVern apposite for that—it had been a was not very closely connected, although be w 55 a as disa reeabl down sale- rices of the necessaries of life, • and that there life, g the last fifty years. tially so —namely, t he ag ri c ultural class, there existed. ge to him as to them to cut p ortionable reduction in the general rule in this country doling to which they nes ; but had not society arrived at such a state in fore there should be a prop , „... When the price of food rose, the g t . . w a ea of the agricul- sincere conviction that the public burdens vous character. The England that they were forced to take that step? That salaries of public officers. hear.) 'Jae would , tutal lettouters were raised in propor ion, and when the were subjected were of a very grie was the cause the was question, and that night they would be made to at once, that the reduction .. the Government had made labourers w e r e r®- stion then naturally occurred —what nterely different Principle —(Hear, price of food fell, the wages of re que , , did . were never able to of this?—how it happen that if 1184 - 50 a country answer it . —(Bear, —Meter, hear.) Allusion had been made to had gone on an e d done was this:—Whenever duced in proportion; 30 that unit ear havin hear ) What they had they d uantit had greatly increased, whose capital, the dreadful position of a clerk with 1001. aye g • ptirehelse more than a certain e 9 .y of food. whose population .. I mutated whose corn- 10 or 20 per cent. taken from him; but was his position found that mores arsons were employed than were wanted riots he maintained that, it was said, bad aurprising y emu , vice, they had But oven itt the agricultural dist . reduced the number by duction of money wages, merce was vast, and whose manufactures were so in- worse than that of the labourer ?—(llear, hear.) The for the public ser d otherwise notwithstanding some partial re w as alleged) so prospering, should be lion. Member for the West Riding said be would not superannuations an to the necessary point; the labourers and their families, had b een, on the whole, genious and (as .make -re uc d dons according of 'and that 11 to the current price of f life would b ' If moderate ice better fed since food had been sear a ns t , ashoulde combine to tell the Legislature that 'ustice because it would be a condemnation of the new necessaries o e, in ,is opinion, unfair and et bog in the year 1847—the boasted yhoti agricultural pros- classes in it , not nly grievous but intolerablei— j s stern ' . He would tell the Hon. Gentleman that this new unjust to that gre . y of persons who were employed perity.—(Hear, hear.) He said t a . the reduced price their burdens %sere o 5' During several years the Legislature not a condemnation of the new system; but it was one in the public service .—( Hear, hear .) The Right Hon. of commodities afforded no reason whatever why the (Cheers.) ld Mem er b fo r Tamworth hadsaid esolution calling on the had been engaged in reducing that class of of the consequences of it. Its condemnation wou House should pass a sweeping r •Its person having experience in the b • service would pu he which pressed moat sensibly on the come in due season.(Cheers.) But one of the resu . 1 genera reduction of the taxation I,hen he commended Government to enter on a so highly the services of those gene to theposition f industry. er many years past million after of the new system wee, that- they were all obliged, in wages of labour. Let them look of springs o tleman who were permanently employed in the public ere Hon- Gentlemen s op- m illion of taxes had been removed from the shoulders consequence of the increased burdens of the people, to de artmerits. clerks in government offices. W tr . New , P As to the comparison set up by the Hon. clerkshat class with which the Hon. M e mber for the West examine the public expenditure of the coun y posite aware of the number of those who re- oft t d this Member f Buckinghamshire or between those gentlemen nnected.—(Hear, hear.) Nearly 9 000 000/. here was 7,500,0001. to begin with. ale wante , ceived salaries less in amount than the wages paid to many Riding was co . . ~ . .He did not w hat and , a generals aide-de-camp it was altogether skilled artisans ? He found from (Hear, hear.) aof taxation had d . been remitted, the object of that ream- fairly to be understood out of doors. o f the Right futile. —(llear, hear.) It was these gentlemen, civil employes them se l ves s i on being to make the bur en of imposts more easily them to run away with the sentimentality and sup - in thevarious de pamphlet put forward by the permanent he M ceber for Tamwortb , . service of the departments, on a different question from that then under the coast - borne by the favoured class, and when all that had been Hon. Gentlemen t e ,11 and in- who carried on the whole machinery of the gevernmerat, of duration of the House, that among upwards 13,000 done the Hon. . Member for the West Riding and his pose that they were dealing with a very sulfa hard- ow . the chiefs of which were liable to change with every re- Government clerks, upwards of 8,000 . _were receiving friends came to . parliament and said, "Only repeal the significant sum i d'stributed among a very , such thing. Ile estimated voluti o n o f opinion in or out of the House. It was ese e and we will beat the world." Well, the corn- working`men. They were no under 100/. a year.— (Hear, hear.) Did Hon. Gentle- oorn-laws would probably lead to a sential to the public service to have men of such expo of those clerks laws werere ealed, but the world was notyet vanquished. that _the motion, if carried, men opposit ® propose that the salaries _ r This being the state of affairs, the lion. saving ni 1,0,90,0004 per a . should be reduced? (l hear.) He agreed with —(Chee s.)on their conduct would j udgment UP departments; and he venture to say that were the ot the Member for the West Riding, and his friends, who, out those who would forma. those who thought that among a large proportion h t important questi • h re gard to t tf on were present Government to go out of office in consequence civil servants of the Goner the salaries were not of doors were proud of being thought h the leaders of What !het night wit ed ti nof ex- hard-w rking men, who were suffering hardly. Th e o f a ny vote of the House or other circumstance, and excessively high. He also thought that the would have they called a new m . ovement for t e_ themselves ue o in the House m ° llit not be permitted to ride off from the come- lion. Gentlemen opposite were to succeed them, they a better chance of reducing their expenditure by dual- penditure and taxation, had conducted ' To t e upon the sentimental (Inception of would not be in office a =single day before they Wishing the number of the public servants than by cur. HOUBO that evening as if they were so many Chancellors (maces of their To , . • • , - • il3e.Y ,al~ry I up- three with to ss" eight iaries. aced iu lace in• ting lice‘ shment . '. Ltion of .. o uncry id bee) Gentle tba )f then i• a e eons- flic as Werat 11113 , ies 1 1, had Lvd coDt l)ek%au 9e ' to la eP 'event to, revel' 0.1 , ° e of ider stla. of is w )1114 ,WO , ? re° cost• ) 13315 rerc ad' LONDON (Hear, hear.) His Hon. Friend had addressed the Rouse with no party spirit or party purpose, and his object was not, as intimated by the Chancellor' of the Exchequer, to pass a vote of censure on the Ministry.—(Hear, hear.) So determined, however, was the flight. Hon. Geutleinan to prevent the full discussion of opinion me the subjeer, that he had charged the Hen. Member for Oxford with making an attack upon the Government. He (Mr. New degate) had vet to learn that a Government had the right to to forbid an expression of opinion upon a ques tion of expendituae, and still less had her Majesty's Government a right to preclude discussion on the pre sent occasion, as they themselves had, by the appointment of a Committee, admitted that inquiry into the public ex penditure was necessary and expedient. It did not follow by any means that because the Chancellor of the Exchequer had instanced cases of the St. Kathe rine Docks Company and the Great Western Railway Company, who had been imprudent, that the House of Commons was not to inspire into the expenditure of the country, or advise her Majesty's Government upon the course which they considered it most desirable to adopt. —(Hear, hear.) Those corporarions were altogether alien to the suhjeet-matter of the present motion. The object of his Hon. Friend was not t i discharge the pub lic servants engaged in the various departments of the Government, nor was it even by implication to cast cen sure upon the Ministry, but it simply amounte d to this, that inasmuch as we had arrived at an epoch in our commercial policy which had caused a decline in the value of ail the necessaries of life, an opportunity was afforded thereby for a revision o salaries, and for an inquiry into the remuneration of the labour of the public servants. He could show the House, by reference to circumstances which had taken place in years gone by, that the present proceeding was not without precedent. He would allude to periods sub sequent to 1703—the period chosen by the Chancellor of the Exchequer—and he could show that, in the year 1801, the salaries of the artiz ens employed in the Ord nance-office had been increased, under the sanction of Mr. Pitt, in consequence of the high price of food and the necessaries cf life. At that period it a•as proposed to increase the salary of a Mr. Rose, but he, to his credit be it said, declined to receive it. on the ground that he had other sources of employment and did not require it.—(hear, hear.) He could also state that, in 1810, the Excise officers of Edinburgh had memorialised the Treasury for an increase of salary, and that, in 1812, the Commissioners of Excise had petitioned for an in crease of the salaries of their department, and that Lord Liverpool, who was then in office, granted the applica tion, on the ground that inasmuch as food and all the necessaries of life had become exceedingly dear, it was just and reasonable to increase the salaries of the public servants. He had alluded to those cases, because he considered them important, and applicable to the point under consideration. The reduction in prices that had recently taken place operated to the advantage of the recipient of fixed money incomes. A reduction of 25 per cent. on au article like 100 sacks of wheat, worth, say 100/., was an advantage to the owner of the salary equal not merely to one-feurth, but to one-third of the whole cost. The low rate of wheat hail been adverted to by his Hon. Friend as a p roof of prosperity. Great delusions had taken place on that subjf et. The lowness of the rate of interest arose from the fluctuations in our commercial and monetary regulations. The money market was often glutted because the investing parties had no profitable means of employing their capitol. He rejoiced that his Hon. Friend. who iutroduced the mo tion, had shown beyond a doubt, that if Government had the will they could effect very great reductions in the salaries of the public departments, for, as he had pointed out, those salaries exceeded the amount paid for the army and navy services. That being the case, he would recommend to the Honourable Mem ber for the West Riding (Mr. Cobden), when he next addressed parties out of that House, to tell those parties that there was another way of practising economy than by reducing and weakening the delences of the country, and that he would not venture to affirm, as he had been doing, that there was no other mode by which economy could be practised than by reducing those establishments. His Honourable Friend had shown that Government had a sum of seven millions and a half with which they could deal, the whole of which was paid to parties resident in this country, who were deriving the full bent fit of the reduction iu the prices, and in respect of whom reductions could be made in consequence. In the pay of the soldier they could not make reductions, for more than half of his life was passed in foreign countries, where he was deuied the advantage from the reduction of prices in this country. Should they deal with the consular establishments, they were in the same situation ; tut, taking into considera tion the whole question, he would leave it to the country to decide who were the true poli tical economists. Was it his Hon. Friend who recom mended that a per-centage, equal to half the advautsges which the holders of those salaries were deriving from the reduction of prices, should be taken off the salaries; or was it those who, like the Hon. Member for the West Riding, proposed to adopt the expenditure of a year long past, without at all considering the altered circum stances of the then state of things and the present? To his mind there could be no donut as to which of the two parties were operating in the right direction. The one adopted the expenditure of 1835 as the Shibboleth of a movement, and toe the basis of an agitation, in order that by means of it they might get introduced into that House motions which they were sure the common sense of the Members of the House would not allow them to support, and then to go forth and hold up to the ridicule of inflited mobs the men who opposed their foolish motions; but who were, in fact, contending for reduc tions in the expenditure in the only competent and just ground on which it could be granted. The other party were those who demanded those reductions in the man ner he had just stated, and as those demands were just he hoped the House would show on that occasion that it would respond to them. After a lapse of a short time strangers were ordered to withdraw, but Mr. HUME at length rose, and said that he considered the motion of the Ron. Member for Oxfordshire one of a practical and useful nature. With respect to the Com mittee appointed :by the Noble Lord, he did not think any thing useful would result from the proposed inquiry, which was limited to three branches of the service, and on which the Government possessed all the necessary in formation. The Noble Lord was well aware of the du ties of the officers appointed by the Crown, and nothing but the will was wanting to carry out such reductions as he might think necessary. What was the proposition of the Noble Lord ? A Committee "to inquire into the salaries and emoluments of offices held during the plea sure of the Crown by Members of either House of Par liament, voted in the annual estimates; and also into the salaries and emoluments of judicial officers in the superior courts of law and equity in the United King dom, and into the retiring pensions allotted to the judges; and also into the expense of diplomatic establishments charged on the Consolidated Fund." He (Mr. Hume) thought the inquiry ought to be extended to other branches; and he should have advised the Noble Lord to adopt the motion of the Hon. Gentleman in deference to public opinion.—(Hear.) He aid not think much re duction could he made in the salaries of the clerks, but he was of opinion that their number might be consider ably diminished. The country would not rest satisfied unless further inquiry was instituted. But after the speech of the Chancellor of the Exchequer, he did not think that any one could expect to see the inquiry ex tended. Lord J. RUSSELL—It is now going on. Mr. HUME was aware of that, but he wished a re. vision of all departments. Not that he was disposed to refuse adequate salaries. Quite the contrary. He would willingly increase salaries and pay of all kinds, provided they could get rid of the enormous amount ex pended in pensions and half-pay. To say that all salaries should be reduced to a certain ext , nt would not be fair. He was surprised that the Chancellor of the Exchequer should have alluded to the parish .of Marylebone. A more unfortunate instance could not have been referred to. He had himself spent three Saturdays in investi gating their accounts- The auditors compared the ex penditure of fifteen different parishes, and it appeared that Marylebone was the most extravagant of them all. —(Hear, hear.) The object of the present motion was inquiry. No injustice was contemplated by it, nor any reduction that would impair the public service. What objection, then, could be urged against it of any weight? He was ready to support any proposal likely to be beneficial for the country. He did not think the motion attributed any blame to the Government, and he should veto for it without intending to impute such blame. He regretted the Government should have ob jected to the motion, because an impression would goforth that they were not desirous of inquiry. He thought the Noble Lord should have followed the example which he himself gave in 1830, when he obtained the appointment of a Committee to inquire into the salaries of beads of offices. The reductions that had recently been made in the Customs hid worked well. If a partial revision had produced beneficial results, a general revision would pro duce much greater. They might deal with the whole revenue, excepting the parts of it allotted to payment of the interest of the national debt and the civil Bet,— (Hear, hear.) lie had no desire to touch tie civil list.' The readiness with which her Majesty had come forward with the proposal that her inco - tae should be made liable for the income-tax ought not to be forgotteme--(Hears) He hoped the House would not consider this a party vote. They were t vote for tt e and it was thsoir . duty to promote . ere as trustees of the pu bl i c pe lle ts economy. lie should air. ROEBUCK wished, in a few words, to explain the principle on which he should vote. He intended to vote for the motion, though he thought it a Mak itte•- less one—a motion, in fact, almost esithollt meaning, yet he intended to vote for it.—(lleac ; hear.) The the previous question ; but he would hal , e Chancellor of the Exchequer had, he understood . oved tion greater injury if he had dealt 'With it o el' it i er e w t i h s e e. ma if the Right Honourable Gentleman cad acceded Pe the motion—a motion which had • ''ue meaning Was hot in its words; a purpose—of which n relight forward for and TAM eonld not elY.eet Wh.t Itte but in its inten t , mover into:Asa—if the Right iloinekliable Gentleman had " P eeded to such ittoreeh, 'ne would have gained tn pcceularity'of bring:an economist by consenting to a mere truisme4ltear, hear.) Let them understand the pre% pre4tlbts, for he liked to deal with gentlemen fired With this new-born zeal for economy. It was for a humble 1 address to her Majesty, praying for a careful nevi- sion of the salaries and wages paid in every deport ment of the public service, with a view to ade quate reductions therein.—(Hear, hear.) But that was not rill; there was a guarding clause—" due regard being had to the efficient performance of the several duties." Was not this precisely the rule on which Mi nisters of the Crown had always acted ? The Noble Lord might have accepted a proposition so qualified without any hesitation. He wished to know who the parties were whose salaries it was proposed to revise? He ' , greed with the Hon. Member for Montrose, that the f set of more persons being employed than was ne cessary er ou la be played a b rea :f o o nrefotr hecountry inquiry. as' ti t t o a th g e r r e e a! numeration of their public servants. They ought to understand where they ought to give. He was not one who grudged adequate raytnent to the hard-working servant. Sinecures were another affair. The lion. Baronet the Member for Marylebone had put his linger on a remarkable item. He hoped he should have the support of those great economists when he came to deal with sinecuree as he proposed to do. With reference to the motion before them, he lied a curious return relating to the several establishments in the public service. The h'ghest yeas the Treasury. At present 37 persons were employed in managing the affairs of the Treasury. It appeared that the average age at which per sons began service in the Treas ur y was twent y years. Every man of business knew that a great deal had to be learned as to the mere business of the office, however instructed a person might enter it in other respects. If a man possessing the highest university honours were placed in the office, he would be as a child as regarded the business to be done. He would go there as 'a learner or s tudent in the public, service. He entered at the ag e of 20, with a s he of 901. a year. He must be there two years before any rise of salary can be granted. At presen t the clerks in the Treasury were divided into four classes. The salaries of the first class were from 901. to 1001. a-year; I on an average a clerk would he 32 before he obtained 2001. a-year. The salaries of the se cond class were from 100!. to 5001.; on an average a clerk would be 50 before he got his 5001. a-year. The question was, were these gentlemea far t he y were gentle men overpaid? The salaries of the third class were from 5001. to SOO/. a-year. The last class are those with salars of 1,000/. a-year; but before that salary could be obtained, the age of 59 must have been reached. —(Hear, hear.) He was talking of the ordinary work ing men—not of those with political influence to push them on.—(llea", hear.) Now, looking to the habits of this country—for they must look to habits —looking to what a man must go through before ha could tit himself for the office, and looking to the po sition he must hold in a great town like London, where he had to meet others in the position of gentlemen—was it to be said that a man was overpaid who, at 60, found himsel f at the highest salary in a public office of 1,0001. a year?— (Hear, hear.) Would any man who lead devoted his years to the law think himself overpaid at 60 by obtain ing 1,0001. a year?—(Hear.) Then let them consider the position of the clerk. From day to day his family depended on his being able to perform his duty in his office. In dealing with such men it was only fair to take into account the ordinary exigencies of society. Was it to be said that, the State should be niggardly to such men, when, if they had adopted a mercantile life, they would have been better paid?—(A.a Hon. Member— " No."] An Hon. Gentleman said, no. Why, let them take any large mercantile establishment. Let them take the Bank of England. It appeared that the cashier had 1,4001. a year, with a free residence; the assistant cashier, 1,0001.; the accountant, 1.2001.; and the as - sistaet-accountant, 97 01 . a year. Th ere was no niggard liness either in the disposition of the East India Company with respect to the payment of their servants.—( Hear.) Those servants were well paid, but they were efficient men, who worked well, and, considering the nature of their duties and the offices they filled, they were not overpaid. But making all these admissions, knowing the policy of Government, and maintaining, as' he did, ' that all those who rendered good service to the State ought to be well paid, he would ask the Noble Lord at the head of the Administration whether it would not be wise to disabuse the public mind of an erroneous impres sion which might be made upon it by his opposition to the present motion to have a full and complete inquiry into that subject—not for the purpose of passing a slur on the Government, for it could not be impeached upon that occasion, being only in the position of other Go vernments? There had been an opposition got up against the present Administration such as few other Administrations had been pressed with. It was an op position of an anomalous character. The peculiar fea tures of the present opposition were, that by legislation on the subject of cur commercial policy, that protection which was formerly given to the productions of the earth had been taken away, and therefore Gentle men on that (the Opposition) side of the House had been suddenly smitten with an extraordinary love of economy.—(Hear, hear, and laughter.) Those Honourable Gentlemen found, and he was delighted to observe it, that the system which had so long prevailed ought to be discontinued, and then said that as there was no protection for them there should no longer ba protection for anybody else.—(Hear, and laughter.) But the people of England were a generous people, and he would try the question in the way in which the House was called upon to try it in the case of the bard-working men in our public offices.—(Hear, hear.) Men in high stations were generally working men. The Honourable Gentlemen on the Treasury benches at the opposite side of the House received what were called large salaries. He did not think these gentlemen were overpaid, although it might be considered an unpopular sentiment to give utterance to. He had heard it stated that the heads of many departments of the public service were overpaid. He confessed he did not think such was the case. Then, if they were not—if neither the heads were overpaid, nor the subordinates overpaid, it could only be in the number of persons employed that the al leged extravagance existed, and the required reductions made. He thought the Noble Lord would do well, there fore, in permitting that inquiry to take place. The Go vernment had an interest in that in which the interests of the country were concerned; and therefore he consi dered it would have been better for the Government not to have resisted the motion. When, therefore, he and his friend the Hon. Member for Montrose went out into the lobbies upon that division, they were not voting in opposition to the present Government, but merely fer an inquiry as to whether the service of the State was per formed at a rate which the State ought not to pay. He again reiterated his impression that the Government ought not to have resisted an inquiry into that matter. Why should not an inquiry take place now? Why should they have such a subterfuge with respect to it as the moving of the previous question? The Noble Lord conceived that the present was an inconvenient time for such an inquiry (" No, no," from the Govern ment benches.) He should read the ordinary forms of the House in the manner in which they were generally taken. It was said that this was not the proper time to entertain the subject, when the previous question was moved in answer to the motion before them. Now he would like to know could there be a better time than the present to entertain the subject before them? In what state was the country? It was in circueastanees of varied tran3i aorta— with a new commercial policy instituted, and the prices of the ordinary necessaries of life greatly fallen. — (Hoar.) No man could expect anything on the part of the country but an acquiescence in the determinations of that House.—(Hear, hear.) He could conceive, then, -no combination of circumstances more favourable than the present for such an inquiry, tier could he fancy any thing more impolitic than the opposition offered on the part of the Government to that motion. He believed the people of this country would be most generous in their payment of their deserving public servants, if only made aware that good and efficient services hal been rendered.—(Hear, hears) He did riot think there *as one intelligent working man in the empire, who got his bread by the labour of his own hands, who would not aid the Noble Lord at the head of the Government in paying those who did efficient service for the State. He would oppose the motion of the Government by which that question would be avoided ! , because he thought the people of this eountry had a right to have that question settled nore.—(Hear, hear.) Sir R. PEEL and some other Hon. Members rose to gether. There were loud calls for the former, and the rest having given way, the Right Hon. Baronet proe ceeded to say that he agreed etith so tiitich df what had fallen from the Lion. and Learned Member who bad just addressed the House, but particularly with regard to the services of those occupying subordinate places in the offices of the state, and the obligation clue from the pub lic to them for the fidelity and integrity with Which their service were performed ; that he was sarptised, tigreeing with so ninth the: had been said, he should cern() to a dilteretit conclusion from that at which the Hon. and Learned Gentleman had arrived.—(Hear, hear.) He (Sir R. Peel), however, put a different constreetion on the intention of the motion of the Hotiodrable Member for Oxfhedshire, and the tiiiiilnht in vehitilt it had been met, namely, hy moving the previous question, ;loth that construction put upon them by the lion. and Learned Member who had just spoken: He did riot Understand the Honourable Membet'a ilicition as one asserting that an inquiry should be instituted into the , salaries of all the chief offices of the Statee—iritd the diplontatiC and judicial depaitOellta vat s o'. ti!.t.l t 4 .ot think the non. Gentleman's object was to lead to a Par liamentary investigation into those matters ; but he rather inferred that the R9n, ckent)erpan'a resolution went to impose, on the ( cAeinEeht that duty sought to he itnfoead 'Oh it by the motion introduced a alien time since by the Hen. Member for Buclei t uglianisliiie Mr: Disraeli), that the UoierittiAtent should be tno party to make the k 4 ..teeSsary reductions, and to ißtroduce a ett:2ie for that purpose to the House, ehowipg where reductions were possible. (Hear.) The Hon. and Learned Member who hist addressed the liouse said that the roorie,n edit:Wiled a triaistia; anal therefor i e;,ojig i ht to he Agreed to. Bow he (Sir IL Peel) appreneuueu that a great many truisms htid been introduced from time to time into that HHditse urging ouFdit riot tti be acViesced in.—wear, and laughter.) If the doctrine of tee Ran, and Learned Gentleman were correct, every Mot ß ion which implied a truisci onghl - „to aSSoptCd to. ow he (Sir R . Nei? lietteit the House of Uommons ought iqtlti Vote for truisms unless they had a practical effect. —(Hear.) Ile Considered the justification of the present resoiation iblArfeied 06 t 4 iciiii4 4 . fiiiitlOOg of the Pee'titive Government, and it ought not, therefore, to be agreed to, unless founded Upon some act. done, or was calculated to effect eodte direct object: lie did not, think the Yheilen cVas biought forward in a bona fide spirit, and that it was calculated to tend to the impression, that great reductions could be made in the salaries of public offiCetS Wiihoutretienphing thosee Which vtete not suffi cientiy paid. it was oeee.. onld notpontinue that delusion that he vot ed as he intended to_ i t Y, h o a r i h e e s said wags let every inquiry be made hy those h voted a for t the entitled to dd Wpe4n; therefore, in ° I 8 might be made in every department of t epu p i l e eL it ta ti :w 4 a u sn st o i t °l3 proper p ci timeil riot; tecttottnstidehttrawnebaYtlit.'teehtii t t ;:to e n . n 45, ciidGentiottlec P w eel) his t t bad been quoted as his observations. He (Str 62 o;r ti ectl i y a stateallild nt the t o s u a b a t s a p u e . : e c ß h u f. o f no dimin tbau ion and military establishments were reduced, had not laid down the position that unless the grea nava l could take place in the public expenditure. tHenhtande said that there was a genera l im p ression, l l whole of the expenditure ther e could be a reduction. to —(Hear, hear.) That expend iture had amounted 48,000,0001.; but it was a g reat delusion on the could of the public to suppose that a reduction take place to the extent that had been mentioned_ Ile had stetecl hat tho necessary expenditure amounted to 3 5,000,000/., t and that the utmost that cou ld be dealt with, was 13,000,000/. lie had not implied that any re dtiotic ‘T.t cottlA be made iu t he civil establishments, J;Io neat been for )atly his in- OU.ti mica )COL, had iddi- part ruled been ntry. see sup had cidEs I that ; per- r 4 'I