The Sun. — London, England, 1851-05-20 00:00:00

T _ll E SUN, . LONDON ~ Ate. DUNCOMBE—Bat what about the releript? Lord J. RUSSELL said it woe quite clear that even IF fee consented to discuss the pre arable it would 'wed to t , r thing practical, for then the Hon. Member for Fins ul try would ask fur the rescript. If, then, they laid the t.t script upon the table thu Hun. Member would ask for . e authority to prove it to be the one upon which they ~,1 1' ! are l eg i s l at i ng . Why, when they were discussing the tl . l of 1829 he might as well have asked for the proof y. the fact o f ce rt a in Roman Catholic bishaes assuming scopal titles in England and Ireland. Why as to the to, , . Ann the matter was notorious, and required not any Utter a few words from Mr. T. DUNCO ÜBE, in reply, 1 Ir. MOORE reminded the Noble Lord that when 0 , aight Hon. Gentleman the Member for the Uni v er . lutztre' 1 )f. Oxford ventured to express an opinion upon the the clause, the Noble Lord said he could not have read ", ~ reamble of the Bill, and unless he read the pre tallatu ait was impossible he could understand the first m a tt se. That was then an argument in favour of ,rt r discussing the preamble of the Bill before the ati see. Ir. AGLIONBY thought that the Noble Lord him -074 was to blame for so much time being occupied in hu • way. He did not think the statement of the Noble : (11 of at all satisfactory. No doubt it was the general Itt tom to postpone the preamble; but this was a mea ',.to a which did not fall within the general rules. It was • in principle or form an ordinary Bill. He con .l ded by saying, that if Hon. Members wished the PIN amble to be discussed, he certainly would support that t il l 'position. I 1 r. KEOGH said he gave notice of a motion that the P" a' able should not be postponed, but should be clis !"8 9CI first. There was a complaint that they made no fro; :Poss. He could tell the Noble Lord why they bad t no progress that night, or since the Bill had been ntrc .duced. Ho wished to take the Noble Lord out of 1 tie liffieulty. The reason Nia3, that he had not defined PliAtt he wanted to effect. He stated that he did not „en ire to go beyond the necessity of the case. Why "t 1 n did he not state what it was that was necessary, a T l ,,cO I what the necessity recpired. Ee did not 00 that. 4 ‘ t was constantly chopping and changing. He first g l .l •es up a clause at the instance of the Irish Members, ap I then, under pressure, takes a clause from the Hon. 441 ember for Midhurst. He takes from the same party a pit ice of the preamble, and then, on the other side, gives 111 a bit of the preamble. He did not know his own el aid. Then he struck out four lines from the ori d nal Bill after he (Mr. Keogh) had challenged the llt w officers of the Crown to state that the allege,- ti ens contained in them were true in law and in fact. he Noble Lord framed his Bill by balancing between 01 aposite parties. Not fixing upon anything definite was ale reason they made no progress with the Bill. The Noble Lord gave facilities to other gentlemen which Alley did not possess, on finding that the Honourable limber for Midhurst gave notice of an amendment =which originally stood in the first clause, and now stood :fin the second. This arose from the accidental meeting f• , f the Hon. and Learned Gentleman the Attorney ( General, by which his amendment would apply to the ' present form of the Bill, but they had not the good for tune to meet an Attorney-General in search of a pre : amble, or a Minister in search of a clause.—(Laughter.) ' The consequence was that an amendment of his would : not fit the Bill. He asked was that fair? The Noble Lord said it was the universal practice to postpone the preamble, but that was because the Bilis introduced were based upon some principle clearly defined. Was that the case in this instance? At one time the Noble Lord , said it was to repel Papal aggression—at another to pre ' Tent synodical action—and then it was to meet a wide spread conspiracy formed against civil and religious liberty. The Attorney-General said it would prevent 'synodical action. Was that the object of the Bill, or .had the Noble Lord retired from it? He was an ious to take the preamble first, because he felt .he would be able to show that it was not true, and if they overthrew the very basis of this measure, the super structure must necessarily fall to the ground. He had a petition to present the other evening against the Ec clesiastical Titles Bill, signed by a perish priest in the diocese of Raphoe. Knowing that the Hon. Baronet the Member for Oxford took exception to similar signa tures, he asked if he would take an objection to this pe tition, when the Hon. Baronet answered " diminionis." Re would not notice it. The preamble referred to a re script giving titles. Now the only rescript of the Pope 'Which they knew of was that of dividing England into dioceses, but in that rescript there was no mention Made of Cardinal Wiseman's name. Then the Attor ney-General, when he explained the object of the Bill, gave a different version from that urged by the Solici tor-General. The Hon. and Learned Gentleman then contended, that the section of the Bill which made it H iegel for archbishops and bishops to take titles, would repeal Use Charitable Bequests Act. The 15th section of that Act enabled parties to bequeath money to the Commit wieners of Charitable Bequests, for the use and benefit of archbishops and bishops of the Roman CathoPsc Church in Ireland. If a bequest was made to, for instance, the Roman Catholic Bishop of Cork, be would not be able to receive this bequest, be cause it would be illegal for him, under this Bill, to take upon :himself the title. Sir F. Kelly, Mr. Brodie, and Mr. B addeley held that such would be the effect of the clause: in the Bill before the Howe. No answer had been given to this.—lt was, therefore, the blunders of the G overnment, and not the hostility to the measure, that c Bused the Bill to be delayed in its progress. The SOLICITOR-GENERAL said it would have been as well if the Hon. and Learned Gentleman should have stuck to the precise question before the Committee --namely, whether or not the preamble was to be post poned. Instead of doing this, the Hon. and Learned Gentleman raised up a host of objections to every portion of the Bill, and treated the House to ingenious arguments as regarded the effect which this Bill would have upon the Charitable Bequests Act. He reserved to himself the power of replying to this objection when the proper time arrived.—(oh!) Surely no argument had been urged to show that the preamble should not be postponed until the clauses were agreed to. Such was the constant practice of Parliament. He denied that the Bill was at all changed.—(Laughter, and cries of " Oh, oh.") The object of the Bill was to pre vent the assumption of titles, but it was shown that certain clauses in the Bill would have interfered with the functions of Roman Catholic bishops, and these clauses were struck out, and all the alterations that had been made in the Bill had been with the view of carry ing out the original intention of the measure, without in terfering with the functions of the bishops. He denied that any communication bad taken place between the law officers of the Crown and the Hon. and Learned Member for Midhurst since Friday night last. He per fectly agreed with the Right Hon. Gentleman (Sir G. Grey) that there was every propriety in inserting the Hon. Member's preamble as a declaratory clause in the Bill. Again, the Hon. and Learned Member for Ath lone (Mr. Keogh) raises a very strong objection against the insertion of the word " dean" after the word " bishop," but, for his part, he could not account for such opposition on such trivial grounds.—(oh, oh.) He was also astonished that the Right Pon. Gentleman (Mr. Gladstone) should hazard his opinion by stating that there were new features in the present Bill, for he assured the Committee that there was nothing new what ever in it.—(Laughter.) The gallery was then cleared for a division, but none took place. On our return we found Mr. REYNOLDS addressing the Committee amid general expressions of impatience. He complained that the Attorney and Solicitor-General had thrown no light upon the matter, and he called upon the latter Hon. and Learned Gentleman to answer this question :—Did he mean by the preamble of the Bill and the few clauses that were included in it to interfere with the free action of the Catholic bishops and clergy of the United Kingdom in the aischarge of their clerical duty? Did he mean to repeal the provisions of the Bequests Act, or to direct attention merely to that rescript of which the Hon. Member for Finsbury said they ought to have a copy upon the table? At present they were dis cussing the matter in the dark, and he thought he was warranted in moving that the Chairman should report progress and ask leave to sit again.—(" Oh, oh:') Mr. ROEBUCK, who was scarcely audible, said no body could be more opposed to this Bill than himself, but, if they were to govern the country by means of a deliberative assembly, certain forms of order were abso lutely necessary,—(Hear, hear.) He was sure he was addressing gentlemen who would believe that be had the same object as they as far as regarded their opposition to this measure, and that he would do all he could by fair argument and by au open and honest opposition to put an end to the Bill; but he entreated Hon. Gentlemen from Ireland, as they had a regard for their own coun try, not to condescend to this species of opposition. — (Loud cries of " Hear, hear.") Let them go to a divi sion. Let them be beaten. They would not be : con quered because they w ere beaten.—(Hear, he believed that the sooner the Bill should be brou g ht into action as a law the bette r, because so soon as it hear.) became li m a law its impotency woul d be discovered, imbe cility of the Government t hat framed would be made notorious to the world. Let the Government have their Bill; that was the way to do them the surest mischief; but he entreated Hon. Gentlemen from Ireland toa notdopt a fair, honest, open oppositi on.—(Cheers.) Let them trifle with the forms of the House, which a long experi ence had enabled Englishmen to use with advantage. Don't let it be said that it was reserved for gentlemen from Ireland to prove that the Hous e of Commons cou not govern itself.—(Hear. hear.) Mr. MOORE fully appreciated the advice which the Hon. and Learned Gentleman had just tendered them, but how stood the case? Her Majesty's Government bad that day introduced a Bill into the House which every Hon. Gentlemen, with the exception of the mem bers of the Government, had stated that he did not un derstand, and even the Hon. and Learned Gentleman himself, who bad as acute a mind as any one in the House, had said that he could not understand it. It was unreasonable to call upon them to proceed with the Bill under these circumstances. Mr. ROEBUCK quite agreed with the Hon. Gentle man that the postponement might be asked for the pur pose of letting the subject be understood. Mr. MOORE—That is my object. Mr. ROEBUCK—But a proceeding having that object did not begin with a discussion as to postponing the pre amble, and then accumulate opposition by a motion to report progress. They ought not to take any course which might expose them to the imputation that they were not fighting fairly.—(Hear, hear.) If they said openly that they w ere not in a position to fight the Bill because they did not understand it, they ought to sat at once, " Give us till to-morrow." But they had been dis cussing the preamble, and now came to a second prop ' titian that the Chairman should report progress. Mr. MOORE observed, that the Hon. and Learned Member tor Sheffield had not been present during the evening. The Hon. and Learned Member for Athlone had never put his amendment. There had been nothing hut a desultory conversatien.—(Oh, and a hough.) The expression was cot his, hut hod been applied througboui the evening. That desultory conversation was raised oa the statement of the Attorney-General. The opponents of the Bill had never raised a dhieussion on the question that the preamble be postponed; L t repe.eoed that the Hon. and Learned Member fur Athlone had not raised the question. The Earl of ARUNDEL and SURREY thought it would be alleived that to the last moment they had dis cussed the postponement of the preamble; and the Hon. Member for Dublin had moved that the Chairman should report progress. He (the Earl of Arundel and Surrey) hoped the Hon, Member would withdraw that motien.—(Hear, hear.) If they divided on the post ponement of the preamble, which did not affect any part of the Bill, he trotted the Government would not press the Committee to proceed further to-night. Mr. P. HOWARD begged to add his testimony to that of the Noble Lord.--(Reer, hear.) Mr. REYNOLDS stated that none of the appeals which had been made convinced him he was wrong in taking a division. The Committee then divided. The numbers wore — For reporting progress 30 Against it ••• ... 271 Majority ..•• --241 The Committee then divided on the yestion that the preamble be postponed, when there appeared — For postponing the preamble ... 253 Against it Majority ... —213 On entering the gallery, we found The Earl of ARUNDEL and SURREY expressing a hope that the Government would not press the House to a consideration of the clauses of the Bill that night. He trusted they would allow the Chairman to report progress, and obtain leave to sit again; and, if no one else did so, he would make a motion to that effect. Sir G. REY said, the greater part of the Bill turned upon the first clause, and it was important that as soon as possible they should proceed to the consideration of it. At that hour of the night (20 minutes after 11) it was not unusual to enter upon business of a similar kind, and he therefore thought they should proceed Mr. M. J. O'CONNELL appealed to her Majesty's Ministers whether they could ask the House seriously to go on with the clauses that night. Mr. REYNOLDS said, it occurred to him that both the Noble Lord the Member for Aruudel and the Lion. Member for Kerry bad claims upon the Government, for neither of them had voted against Government on the division before the last. They went to the library.—(A. laugh.) He should be glad to know what they gained by going to the library? He did not think they were likely to get much information, nor had much courtesy been extended to them now.—(Hear.) hear.) What did the 12 or 13 Members who were op posed to the Bill, and who went to the library, gain by going there ? He made these remarks in order that a few who opposed this Bill of pains and penalties might ace the necessity of standing together.—(Hear, hear.) They gained nothing by political gentility; they gained nothing by bowing and scraning to the Trea sury benches.—(Hear, hear.) The Honourable Mem ber fer Sheffisld had appealed to him not to press his motion for the Chairman reporting progress, but he could not, as a Catholic Member, acquiesce in that view. He should like to know what the Honourable Member for Sheffield had gained by the course he had taken ? Why, the Right Honourable Gentleman (Sir George Grey) refibed to postpone the consideration of the measure till another day. He gave the Government notice, however, that, without pursuing any course that could be called factious—(A laugh)—there was a sufficient number of honest men in the minority to pre vent their passing a single clause that night—(Rear, hear)—no matter how many divisions might be necessary for that purpose. Mr. ROEBUCK said, the Hon. Gentleman had asked what he gained by doing what was right?—(Hear, hear.) He would reply that he believed a large majority of the people of both countries would acknowledge that they were honestly opposing this Bill when they acted on the principle of the Constitution as embodied in the rules and laws laid down by Parliament.—(Hear, hear.) Any attempt to render those rules mischievous must tend to injure the great cause of constitutional government. — (dear, hear.) He did not mean to express the slightest disrespect for the strong feeling of Irish Members en this question; but they would do well to consider the strong feelings of English Members, who had fought the great battle of constitutional government in that House before there were any Catholic Members from Ireland connected with it.—(Hear, hear.) He recollected well that Mr. O'Connell never acted in the way now pro posed; and, though in 1833 and at other times he was nominally beaten in that House, his victory over the Treasury Bench was nevertheless most significant and striking.—(Hear, hear.) He must say, however, to the Government that there was good reason for post poning the clauses of the Bill. The alterations had been made suddenly, and it was but fair that time should be given to consider fully the bearings of the measure. He hoped the Government would give the Irish Members no reason to say that they were opposed by a tyrant majority, but that they would afford them at least twelve hours to consider the clauses so suddenly intro duced into the measure.--(Hear, hear.) Sir R. INGLIS said, reference had been made to a tyrant majority, but he would ask the House whether they could not conceive such a combination as would justify the appellation ief a tyrant minority?—(Haar.) Repeated divisions had been taken—in one instance he believed the majority wcz nine to one—and he must say that, in such circumstances, it might be the duty of the Government to protect the House against a tyrant minority.—(Hear.) The Earl of AItUND EL and SURREY expressed his extreme regret that any Catholic Member should have said one word against eery Protestant Member who sup ported their cause in that House, still more against one who bad supported it with so much ability, zeal, and dis cretion as the Hon. and Learned Member for Sheffield had done. He trusted the Government would yield to the appeal which that Eon. and Learned Gentleman had made to them. Sir F. THESIGER hoped the Government would ac cede to the application. It was important that they should do so. Government had adopted the amend ment of the Hon. and Lsarned Member for Midhurst, making a declaratory enactment in the Bill applying merely to the rescript of the Pope of the 29th Septem ber, 1850: the Solicitor- General had said, in answer to Mr. Gladstone, althoug h that declaratory enactment applied solely to England, that it would have such an effect upon the law th at the judges in Ireland would feel themselves bound by it, and would consider any similar brief in Ireland to be illegal and void. He (Sir F. Thesiger) assumed :From that statement that it was the intention of the Gov ernment that any similar brief in Ireland should be deemed illegal and void. If so, it would be better that the, t intention should be declared on the face of the Bill. It had therefore occurred to him desirable to introduce an amendment into the first clause, to make it apply not merely to the particular brief to which it was. at present directed, but to all similar briefs and rescri les both in England and Ireland. It would be impossible lea enter into the consideration of that amendment at the preser t time. He therefore hoped the Government would eecede to the appeal that had been made to them fur allowing the Chairman to report progress. Mr. GEACH said ho had hitherto voted against the Bill, having been pledge( I to do so, but be did not feel it right to join in the co u rse taken by the Hon. Member for Dublin, which he cot sidered was frittering away the time of the country without any practical use. Sir G. GREY said th at after the division, considering that the previous discutesion had turned very much on the first clause, he thwught it was the duty of the Go vernment to ask . the Committee, having regard to the public time, which the Hon. Gentleman (Mr. Geach) had properly said should enter into their consideration, to go on and make some further progress with the Bill. But, as time was now p assing, any discussion that might now take place it was clear could lead to no practical result in the way of a d 'saucing the measure to night. It was true the Bill was not delivered to Members be fore that morning, and that certainly was a ground for acceding to the proposal for reporting progress; ho therefore only hoped t hat on coming to the Bill on Friday next, which was; the first day they could ap proach it, they would 'be allowed to go into Committee at five o'clock, and th g proceed with the consideration of the clauses. The House then re lamed; and the Chairman re ported progress, and obtained leave to sit again on Fri day next. The Hainault Forest Bill, and the sale of Arsenic Regulation Bill were semerally considered in Committee. The Appointment to offices, &c., Bill passed through Committee, and the report was brought up and ordered .o be received. PETITIONS. Lord CAMPBELL presented a petition in favour of the Copy hold Eafranchisement Bill, from Noma gentle men who, under the present law, had had several valuable racehorses seized as en heriot. The Eerl EGLINTON presented, from the borough of Ayr, the meat numerously signed petition that had ever been presented from that place. It was against Papal aggression ' and lee could bear witness to what had been stated by the Noble Duke (Argyle) tie to the feeling generally prevailing in Scotland againA this ag gression. The Noble Earl presented several petitions to the same effect. Lord CAMPBELL would bear witness to the feeling in Scotland on the subject, and ho had to present several petitions from parishes in Scotland against Papal ag gression, which bad Leen signed by the whole of the in hahitanta mole and female, of those perishea The Eerl of SANDWICH presented a petition from places in Huntingdonshire, praying for a restoration of agricultural protsction. Lord S i'ANLEY presented several petitions with a similar prayer, and he was convinced that before any loug time had elapsed they would be compelled to pay attention to the claims of the landed interest. The Noble Lord also presented several petitions against Papal aggression; also a petition from Belfast, praying for the establishment of an Irish Transatlantic packet station. The Bishop of OXFORD presented several petitions against Papal aggression. The Earl of WINCHILSEA presented several peti tions complaining, of agricultural distress. Earl FI TZ WILLIA 32 presented a petition from Not tingham, against Papal aggression. Lord STANLEY presented a petition in favour of the New Brunswick and Nova Scotia Railway. The Earl of WALDEGR AVE presented a petition in favour of the Copy hold Enfranchisement Bill. EXPENSES OF CRIMINAL PROSECUTIONS BILL. Lord CRAN WORTH moved the second reading of this Bill.—Agreed to. PROPERTY-TAX BILL. The Marquis of L ANSDOWNE moved the second reading of the Income and Property-tax Bill. This was the Bill of the session, which was of the greatest financial importance. He believed that however imperfect the wording of the amendment introduced into this Bill by a majority of the House of Commons— introdaced into this Bill in opposition to the wishes of her Majesty's Government, might have been, it would not affect the legal effect of the Bill. But he would call the attention of their Lord ship to the provisions of the Bill, and although he was not one of those who could be considered as an advocate of direct over indirect taxa tion, and although no one was more aware than himself of the imperfections of this tax, which imperfections had been most ably set forth by the Right lion. Baronet, now no more, who had first proposed this tax, yet he felt bound to propose the renewal of it as atemporary measure. He was convinced that Parliament never could remedy the glaring inequalities of this tax, and he thought it was the deity of Parliament to make these immense burdens as palatable as possible. But these objections wore subject to two qualifications, the first being how far by the continuance of this bur den they could facilitate the importation of raw prcduce into this country, and how far by doing away with other taxes they would so increase the revenue, by encouraging increased importation and increased consumption, so as to enable them eventually to do away with the income-tax itself. Without troubling their Lordships with figures in any detail, he would ask them whether they really thought the tax during the time it had lasted, from 1842 till the present time, had in any visible or tangible form crippled or diminished the commercial prosperity and revenue of this country? If he asked himself this ques tion he found an unanswerable reply in the state , of the revenue, not only in one particular portion but in every pert. They had at this moment to provide 50,000,0001. of revenue; they hail still to provide for the burdens arising from 787,000,0001. of debt. What had been the progress of the revenue since 1842? 48,084,0001. was the whole amount of the revenue in 1842. Since that time 10,251,0001. of taxes had been repealed, and in 1850 the net revenue was 52,810,0001., showing an increase of income of 4126,0001.; so that the entire amount of the taxes which had been surrendered in the course of the ten years had been nearly restored and replaced by that development of the increased prosperity of the country which had taken place under the income-taxd They had, by the employment of that tax, given to the reproductive industry of the country a power which could not other wise have existed, and they had placed themselves iu that fortunate position in which they had to consi der, not how they were to obtain a surplus revenue, but how they were to dispose of it. But as that sur plus was not sufficient to enable them to get rid of the income-tax altogether, he believed they could not pursue a wiser course than to continue the tax in its present form, and to employ it for the purposes pro posed by her Majesty's Government—namely, for the purpose of reducing the duties on those imported articles coffee and timber, and of removing the window tax, which not only pressed heavily on persons of every class in this country, but also, at the same time, most prejudicially affected the sanitary condition of the great mass of the people. The repeal of the window-duty would tend greatly to improve the physical condition of the working classes, by procuring for them more light and air, and a better class of dwellings, in conformity with one of the gi eat tendencies of the present age. They had every reason to believe that a reduction of the duty on coffee would lead to an increasing consumption of the article, and that under that change the revenue might reach the amount produced by the higher duty; for that was precisely what had happened on a pre vious occasion. The fact was, that when the duty on coffee bad formerly been reduced, the amount of the duty had actually increased in the course of four or five years. Then, again, with respect to the reduction of the timber duties, he found that since the proposal upon that subject had been submitted to Parliament, a new impulse had been given to ship-build ing and a reduction in the price of timber had already taken place. The Bill then before their Lordships was but a traascript of the Act which had already on more than one occasion received their sanction, with this ex ception, that it would relieve the tenant-farmers from a grievance under which they had complained that they had hitherto laboured. The tenant-farmers had until the present moment been compelled to pay the tax on one-half the amount of their rents, but under the amended Bill then before their Lordships any tenant who could prove that his profits had fallen short of that assumed amount would be entitled to a proportionate reduction in the charge to which he would be liable. The tax was only to be continued for one year, and at the p t h o e r s t e u n c i i t r y eu o m f s t e a o n n e s e i d a e h r e i n gbeltiheevedwhthoalet, expiration of that period they w o u ld again have an op qwuietshtiaond.a oregard r to public credit and to the promotion of that develop• merit of the national resources which they might carry still further by persevering in the policy they had hitherto adopted, they would feel it their duty to adopt the Bill as it had been sent dean to them from the other House. He therefore moved that the Bill be read a second time,—(Hear, hear.) Lord STANLEY said the Noble Marquis had moved the second reading of the Bill upon two grounds—first, on the necessity of maintaining the public credit of the country, and on the impossibility of finding a substitute tor the income-tax in the present year; and, second, on the ground from which be (Lord Stanley) dissented, that it was necessary for the purpose of extending the pre sent commercial system, and for facilitating the impor tation of those articles of foreign produces, the importa tion of which he (Lord Stanley) believe;:t had already in flicted such injury upon the agricultairal interest of this country.—(Hear, hear.) The Genternment had brought up a Bill, the passing of which,, in some shape, was ne cessary for maintaining the credit of the country. lie was not the person wive would contend that, in the course of this year or *.rie next, they could dispense with a certain portion of the income-tax, and he, and those who acted with l' Am, would not sanction the rash and reckless reduction of taxation which would make the country una,iele to meet its expenditure.—(Hear, hear.) As the reresent Bill was a money Bill, their Lord ships bad not the slightest power to alter it.—(Hear, hear.) The question was, whether they would sanc tion the renewal of the tax for one year, on the ground stated by the other House of Parliament, or re ject the Bill altogether.—(Hear, hear.) By rejecting it, about five millions would be struck off the anticipated income, and taking the present surplus at about two millions and a half, they would, by rejecting the Bill, reduce the surplus to a deficit of similar amount. He thought, under such circumstances, they could not hesi tate how to act. It appeared that a blunder had been committed in the Bill as it now stood for continuing the tax for one year, and the Noble Marquis had said that that blunder had been caused by the introduction of the amendment. He (Lord Stanley), however, thought that the blunder was in the Government not taking care that the amendment agreed with the other portion of the Bill.—(Hear, hear.) They might, however, pass the Bill, blundering as it was, or reject it altogether. He had not for his own part any desire to offer opposition to the Bill, notwithstanding its blunders. •He agreediin what had been said by the Noble Marquis opposite, as to the impossibility of altering the Bill as' altogether to avoid inequalities. In point of fact the income tax, as it at present stood, was anomalous in theory and had inequalities in practice. The anomalies might be diminished, but he agreed that they could not pass a Bill upon the subject that would be in every respect just.—(Hear, hear.) He could, not give his consent to continue this anomalous and unjust measure, not as it had been proposed by Sir Robert Peel, as a temporary Bill merely, but as one bound up with the taxation of the country, and kept up for the purpose of carrying out that commercial system to which he was opposed, and which had already been the means of effecting so much loss and injury. —(Hear, hear.) Ile was of opinion that the House of Commons decided wisely in coming to the determination that the measure should be reconsidered at the expiration of the present year.—(Hear.) Ho thought that House had decided wisely in determining that whether it was to be conti nued for two years or for three years, they would in quire whether, at the expiration of the present year, the anomalies and inequalities could not be reduced and made less oppressive in their operation.—(Hear, hear.) He thought, however, the House of Commons acted wrongly in not adopting the proposition of a Right Honourable Gentleman when he proposed that, without endangering the public faith or the public cre dit, the House should declare that at the earliest pos sible period the tax should be reduced, and that it should not be continued for the indefinite reduction of indirect taxation. The House of Commons had not thought proper to take that course, but had determined that the tax in its present shape, should only be conti nued for one year. Their Lordships had not passed any opinion on the other measures of her Majesty's Govern ment, but he (Lord Stanley) would be prepared to go into a discussion of the policy which had been pursued when the proper time arrived.—(Hear, hear.) It, ape peered that in order to accomplish 1111 indefinite' deve' CUSTOMS BILL. On the mug In for tho second reading, Mr. HERRIES appeitled to the Government not to press so important am' asure at so late an hour, when many Hon. Members w: ho were opposed to the Bill were absent. The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER said, it was rather a hard task Hon. Members imposed on him. The Right Honourable Gentleman blamed him now for bringing on the Bill. The last night it was before the House he (the Chancellor of the Exchequer) had been blamed for not proposing the Bill because it was unopposed. He would postpone it. Motion withdrawn. The Gunpowder Stores (Liverpool) Exemption Re peal Bill was read a second time. Leave was given to Lord SEYMOUR to bring in a Bill to extinguish the right of the Crown to deer in the New Forest, and for other parposfas; and the Bill was brought in and read a first time. On the motion of Mr. S. HERBERT, the Select Com mittee on the Passengers Act was noniinated:—Mr. Clements, Mr. Hawes, Admiral Bowles, Viscount Melt g und, Mr. Adderley, Ir. Ver non Smith Mr. William Miles, Mr. Divett, Lord Naas, Mr. Sergeant Murphy, Sir John Young, Sir Thomas Birch, Mr. Willcox, and Mr. Efenley. on the motion of Sir W. G. CRAIG, the Select Committee on Annuity-tax (Edinburgh) was appointed: D ee des, Mr. John Benja m i n S m i t h , Mr. —Sir William Gibson Craig, Mr. T u f ne ll , Sir George Mr. Me, Forbes Mackenzie , Viscount Melgund, Clerk, BouTe rie, Mr. Heald, Dr. Power, Sir David Dundas, Mr. Smollett, Mr. 13unbury, Mr. Edward Ellice, and Mr. Adderley. On the motion of Mr. M. J. O'CONNELL, Mr. Keogh was substituted for the Earl of Arundel and Surrey on the Mortrnain Committee. The House adjourned at a Quarter before One o'clock. HOUSE OF LORDS, May 19. The LORD CHANCELLOR took his seat upon the Woo: at Five o'clock. 1 : 11 arse to proceed in the usual mariner; namely, to post 'Be the preamble until they had discussed the clauses e the Bill. He had, upon the f.ugge - s;ion of an Hon. lernber, consented once to diLeuss ttsr. preamble first; Jut, from the difficulties that subscquer&y arose in con ' sequence he was warned against agreeing to such a course • again. T UESDAY M. A Y 20, 1t351. PARLIAMENT EXHIBITION Were it to be asked—What is there for Parliament still to do, and why should it sit till the middle of August, there are people who would be at no loss for a reply. There are people, that is to say, who at all times and seasons, and under all possible eircumetances, will advise the immediate commencement of the most arduous un dertakings, to bo pressed with the greatest rapidity, in the face of the most formidable obstacles. What is there for Parliament to do! Parliament has to reform itself. Parliament has to deliver the administration of law from abuses a thousesee years old. Parliament Ism to give• the metropolis what it ha s no t— mun icipal matt tutione: Parliament has to solve a hundred problems t that have long been vexing tae brains of journalists, and converting shiploads of good paper into unreadable pamphlets. Consult these people, and at twelve o'clock on aay Saturday night they would have the Cabinet summeeed and Parliament assembled for the immediate enactment of household suffrage and vote by ballot. On the principle that good deeds are never out of season, they would have Parliament set about the entire recon struction of the British Constitution at the very moment when it is difficult to muster a House for any purpose whatever. We are perfectly aware that we shall not please all men by suggesting the consideration of time and place; but believing, as we do, that there is a time for all things, and that opportunity is one of the first conditions of success, we must say that just now it is not very easy to answer the question, " What is there for Parliament still to do, and why should it sit till the middle of August?" The Great Exhibition has killed everything else. The Court, the two Houses of Parliament, the nobility, the gentry, the commonalty, the army, the police, carriages, cabs, and emnibusses are all dancing attendance upon it. The shops are unfrequented. The places of public amusement are comparatively deserted. Even the rail ways lore their summer excursionists. Hampton Court and Greenwich exhibit in vain their horse chestnuts in bloom and their whitebait in season. We question whether even the great Derby -day will attract :to large a fraction of a million as it hat usually done. The tall plant in Hyde-park has smothered everything in its neighbourhood. The Exhibition is London; the Exhi bitiou is the Parliament; it is the British empire; it is house end home; it is drawing-room and sstudy;part and is d p arterre, conservatory , and promenade; it is club; it ie shop and bazaar, theatre, picture gallery, paaorame—everything,, in a • word, which es m an or a. . woman wants in the metropolis. The potsessor of a season ticket, with a small surplus for cabs e or, in default attract; a geed pair of legs, is set up 'for the eessou. In a palace large enough to be a .glaes.case for Versailles, or Windsor Castle, filled with all that is ingenious, precious, beauti fal, carious. or rare, he walks at large, monarch of all ho surveys. From the regalia of Indian dyeasties to the last invention of Europeau science—from thermic manu factures of people who dwell by the desert, or under the' llountains of the Moue, to the patent for separating the long and short fibres of wool, which is to found a new family of millionaires, everything that the eye can gaze on or the mind can comprehend, invites admiration. There is no door to be opened—no wants intimated—no importunity to be repelled—no purchases expected. To' all appearance some twenty or thirty theusund of this metropolis have resolved to erajoy themselves in this palace till they are compelled to Le content with two days in the week, or to be lost in a crowd still larger than themselves. But such days aed such insatiable wanderings are very exhaustive. Even two or three bouts amid " the hum of zealous " is enough to knock up a strong man ; and we question whether, since the war, there ever was such an amount of physical and mental fatigue us there has been in this metropolis every eveniug since the first of this month. Parliament cannot continue to sit with any effect in the face of so powerful a rival, and with so great a drain en the strength of legislators as well as of all other classes. June and July, too, have other attractions, which will begin to hold up their heads and exert their influence, should the novelty of the Exhibition wear off. The season will probably be one of more than usual hospi tality; for there is hardly a family of any position or means in the country that will not find its way to town. With so much to distract, and so much to fatigue, it is useless to say that Members of Parliament ought to be at their posts, to make a House when wanted, to support their party, and do other political drudgery. They ought perhaps, but nevertheless they will not. The session will be the struggle of a sleepy man under a long and heavy sermon. He may open his eyes, shake him self, and pinch himself, but all to no purpose. After a hundred convulsive efforts at attention, he will be utterly unable to state either the text or the subject of the dis course. He will have lost an hour, and gained nothing bat the discredit of an involuntary inattention. Perhaps the House of Commons ought to do more this session; but, in matter of fact, it will do no more. It will only waste its time, and injure its character by an obstinate and slovenly perseverance in its duties, when it has neither the heart nor the strength for them. Under such circumstances the sooner it shuts up shop the better for itself, and the better eventually for the business of the country. — Times. HER MAJESTY'S STATE BALL. The Queen gave last evening a State Ball at Buck ingham Palace, to a most brilliant Court, the invitations exceeding 2,100. The arrangements were similar to the first reception; this season, the entire suite of State Saloons being opened and brilliantly illuminated with handsome crystal metres and gilt chandeliers; the Gar ter-room and Ante-room at the scu.h end of the Picture Gallery wore also opened for the accommodation of the numerous visitors. The choicest exotics and fragrant flowers were tastefully arranged in the alcoves behind the elevated seats reserved for her Majesty and her Royal guests, both in the Ball-room and also in the Throne-room; groups of flowers also adorned the Pic ture Gallery and the Grand Hall. The company began to arrive soon after 9 o'clock, those having the entree alighting by the temporary gar den entrance, and the general circle entering the Palace by the Grand Hall. All the visitors were conducted by the principal staircase through the Green Drawing room to the Picture Gallery and the Grand Saloon. Her Majesty the Queen and his Royal Highness the Prince Albert entered the Grand Saloon at a quar ter before 10 o'clock, accompanied by her Royal High ness the Duchess of Kent, their Royal Highnesses the Prince and Princess of Prussia, his Royal Highness Prince Frederick William of Prussia, his Royal High ness Prince Henry of the Netherlands, his Royal High ness the Duke of Cambridge, their Royal Highnesses the Duke and Duchess of Saxe Coburg Gotha, his Royal Highness the Duke Ernest of Wurtemburg, his Serene Highness the Prince of Leiningen, and his Serene Highness Prince Edward of Saxe-Weimar. Her Majesty and her august circle passed through the assembled company in the Grand Saloon, and were con ducted by the Lord Chamberlain to the Ball-room, where Mr. BOOFES quadrille band was in attendance. The general circle followed the Queen and Prince Albert and their Royal guests into the Ball-room. The Queen wore a blonde dress over white silk, with coloured flowers of various kinds worked on it, orna mented vith bunches of flowers to correspond, and dia monds. Her Majesty's headdress was formed of a wreath of flowers of various kinds to correspond with the dress, ornamented with diamonds. Her Majesty opened the ball with his Royal Highness the Prince of Prussia, in a quadrille, at five minutes be fore ten o'clock; the vis-a-vis being his Royal Highness the Duke of Saxe Coburg Gotha and the Duchess of Sutherland. The other members of the Royal party joined in this quadrille. After this dance, a number of quadrilles, waltzes, and other dances were performed in the Ball-room, by Mr. Boose's quadrille band. Dancing afterwards commenced in the Throne-room, (where Jullien's band was stationed) with The Great Exhibition Quadrille ...... Jullien. In the orchestra were Herr Kceaig (cornet a piston), M. Collinet (flageolet), Messrs. Baker, Cooper, Doyle, Lavigne, Cioffi, Jarrett, C. Harper, Anglois, Collins, &c. The following dances were played by the band during he evening:— Quadrilles. La Tempests, from Halevy's Opera. The Nepalese •• • O. • • • Jullien• Enfant Prodigue Auber. Valses. Straus. K a r l B u ller. .•• ••• Polkas Karl Buller. lion. Capt. Mildmay ••• Doyle. Dabutanten ••• MaliWe La Mandolins ... The Crystal Fountain ... Die Zapfenstreich ... Polka des Poignarda The Koh•i-noor ..• Golops• „ Karl Buller. The Amazon and Tiger . . Jullien Jullien.. The Review ••• The Derb ••• t h e e vening the co m p an y were served with rei. frepshuoarienng the in the Garter-room and the Green Drawing. room. A State supper was served with regal magnificence, soon after twelve o'clock, in the principal dinner-room, on l on g ranges of tables; the splendour of the service h e i g htened by the consummate taste of the deco ra tion. They were most brilliantly lit by gold candelabra. COURT CIRCULAR. The Queen and Prince Albert, accompanied by the Prince and Princess of Prussia, Prince Frederick Wil liam of Prussia, the Duke and Duchess of Saxe Cobourg Gotha, and the Duke of Wurtemburg, left. Buckingham Palace at nine o'clock yesterJay morning, to continue the inspection of the Exhibition of the Works of In dustry of all Nations. The Royal suites consisted of the Hon. Beatrice Eyn,,e , the Countess A. do Hacke, Baroness Wangenheim, Col. Hon. C. Grey, Lieutenant- Colonel F. H. Seymour, Major von Boyen, Lieutenant Heim . z,and M. B. de Treskow. Her Majesty end Prince Albert returned to Buck ingham Palace at half-past eleven o'clock. The Prince of Wales and Prince Alfred, attended by Mr. Birch, also visited the Exhibition. The Duchess of Kent, accompanied by the Pr i n ce of Leiningen, and attended by Lady Fanny Iloward, Baroness de Speth, and Sir Georg e Coupe'', also in spected Exhibition yesterda m orning. • Prince the Frederick William of y Prus s ia, returned to Buckingham Palace on Saturday night f ro m Liverpool. u r; visited the The Duke and Duchess de Nemo Queen yesterday, and also paid a visit to the Duchess of Kent. Princ© Albert, attende d by Lieutenant-Colonel jth therin cess esterday Seymour, rode out on horseback w y. Alice, In the afternoon the Queen,c accompanied by the Princess of Prussia and the Duchess of Saxe Cobourg Gotha, took a drive in an open car riage and four; Colonel the Hon. C. Grey end Lieutc nant-Colonel the lion. H. Boyle attended on horseback. Pr i nce Albert, accompanied by the Prince and Prince IFrederick Wall= of Prussia, the Duke of Saxe I to know ,y the Bill, as it origi innisterial, 'use would that the Le second of a clan 6tes of Ire )e the coa ed the ec that Act• n so read , might be Now be rubt as to Act; but were right e so still; hey would giceded in could pre e there to 7hether he benefit of wed Gen hat would to Irish, ~t English isely the Lops stood. would alb !cal the her the .ration? e object ler dis h© Bill. to pro- was of 'tan the )licitor overfill tend to diocese I to th°, g D ve' ra ctical piritual ciently. )7 pro' illegal an th e bat the in Ire never 3 03 0 Y et into [ of the , n) was La how, In CS' no of p of $ t issue on this ;nty of oaation )point - D. itf' i t the ishee di d 6 , the be re' of th° better EVENING-, lopeasent of the present commercial spteno, they were to have an indefieite reduction of indirect taxation and direct taxation, for the purpose of increasing theimports tien of foreign corn.—(Hear.) By such a course they were sacrificing a large amount of revenue annually, which would ene'ele them to relieve the preavere of the income-tax, and while they wore lesion; revenue, they Were not gaining in the price of the article which would compensate for the loss of revenue. As to the reduction in the duty on coff,x, he thought it was inflicting injury on the colonial grower, while the consumer did not re ceive compensating advantage. He knew it could be said that the reduction in the consumption of coffee was to be. ascribed to the adulteration of that article. That would be raising another question which made the conduct of the Government incompre hensible, by refusing to bring in a measure to prevent the adulteration, and to protect the consumer. He could not understand the conduct of Government in not re medying that evil. He did not know that the country would derive the advantage anticipated from the reduc tion of the duties on coffee and timber. He thought the country would lose by the latter reduction.—(Hear hear.) There .had been no fall in prices commensurate with the reduction of the duty, and the consequence was that the foreign producer was the gainer.—(Hear, hear.) As regarded the measure now before them, the question was between the adoption of the Bill an it stood, or its rekntion altogether. Their Lordships had not the power to make any alteration. The Noble Marquis had taken great credit for one reduction which had been effected in direct taxation, and !au (Lord Stanley) was not going to say that the abolition of the tax in question was not an advantage. But in doing away with the window-tax they bad imposed •on the same class of that community a house-tax. The window-tax altogether was levied upon 500,000 houses, but the house-tax would fall upon 400,000. The tax was so charged as to exempt a certain portion of that class who claimed the exercise of the elective franchise.—(Hear.) Now he did not know why there should be that sacrifice of revenue.—(Hear, hear.) It might be Very convenient to increase the influence of certain metropolitan Membora ; but he could not see why the owner of a 10/. house should be exempted from ail taxation.— (iiotti - , hear.) He thought they might have obtained all the sanitary advantages by doing away with the window-tax, and laying a house-tax to the same extent; or they might have retained the win dow-tax, and enabled the parties to compound for it, and permitted them to open as many windows afterwards as they might think proper. He regretted her Majesty's Government had proceeded on so objectionable a prin ciple, that while the income-tax was admitted to be a temporary measure, taxes were being taken off, and they were continuing to bring down the revenue so nearly to balance the expenditure, that it was impossible they could any year have a sufficient surplus to enable them to do away with the income-tax.—(:fear, hear.) How ever the Government might make professions on the sub ject, the country would come to the conclusion that whatever' they might say in theory, in practice it was their intention to continue the income-tax. He (Lord Stanley) was, however, of opinion that it was their duty to take measures for doing away with the income-tax as soon as possible.—(Hear, hear.) The Noble Lord concluded by.sayiegi that it was not his intention to offer any opposition to the second reading of the Bill. The Earl of MALIIESSURY, wished to ask, upon what assessment the house tax was intended to be taken? If upon the poor.rate assessment, that varied in different parts of the country; and if upon the income-tax assess ment, which was supposed to be more fair and more ge nerally equal, new c omnsissiouers would have to be ap pointed when the income-tax should cease—and we were surely not to assume it to be perpetual. Tho Marquis of LANSDOWNE observed, that the House-tax lull had not yet passed, and the subject was under consideration in the other House. The Noble Marquis added a few words which were inaudible in the gallery, 1 1 but we believe they referred to there being means of having the poor-law valuations equalized. The Earl of MALMESBURY repeated, that these local aese.ssments varied 20 or 30, if not 50 per cent., from the real value in - some cases; and nothing could be more unfaii than to base the house-tax upon them. L ;rd BEAUMONT apprehended that there were always two columns, one stating the rack-rent, the other the rateable value. The Noble Lord seemed to ima gine that the second column would be taken ; that would be monstrous, for one part of the country would much more than anoter. But, if the plied with, there was h a fair and corn ltpahlewetnehbaaecacophuaenyetinnogefotmhe gross value; and upon that the house tax might be based. The Earl of MALMESBURY did not think the law was observed in that point ; he thought the Noble Lord (Beaumont) was mistaken as to the practice. Lord BERNERS considered it a duty to endeavour to make the law as little objectionable as possible, and would, therefore, inquire whether the Government con templated any cheek, .upon frivolous and vexatious sur charges ? The way in which the tax was assessed in some pacts, in Leicestershire foeone, excited general in dignation. There might be one, check by allowing the appellant his expenses. The Noble Lord also suggested an alteration in regard to the number of commissioners who had to decide on such cases. Lord MONTEAGLE agreed that it was desirable to cliMinish any oppressive incidents of the tax, but must say that, considering the circumstances of its introduc tion, there being but one gentleman remaining in office who had been acquainted with the previous tax, nothing could be more praiseworthy than the moderation and good sense with which this law had been generally ad ministered.—(Hear.) It would hardly be politic to diminish the powers for enforcing a tax so easily evaded. —(Hear.) But ho should be sorry to be considered as approving of such a tax as this, except upon the ground of necessity. In great exigencies it was to bo regarded as our groat resource; and when the safety and inde pendence of the country were concerned, objections vanished. In fact, it was almost analogous to the press gang. But it ought to be reserved for a great occasion, and especially we ought not to get blindfold into a sys tem of perpetuation under cover of a periodical renewal, without a revision to see how it could be made just and equitable.—(Hear.) It was even more dangerous when renewed for only a short period, because at every re newal the Government mast make sacrifices of other taxes, not because they disapproved them, but because they were unpopular.—(Hear, hear.) Like other leases, there was a fine to pay on renewal.— (Hear.) It was proposed for three years, and we had had it for nine; it was to - produce less than 4,000,0001. a year, and it had produced above 5,000,0001.; the Go vernment asked for 11,000,0001, and had got 49,000,000/. --(Hear, hear)—and yet it was to be renewed again.— (Hear.) And why? Because we had been repealing various indirect taxes. No doubt 1842 presented a case of emergency; but, saying nothing of 1842 or 1845, it was impossible to deny that if we went on after the fashion of 1848 no one could see any end to the conti nuance of the income-tax.—(Hear, hear.) It was pro nosed now to commute the window-tax for a house-tax. The repeal of the former house-tax was forced upon a most reluctant Government; and when the new house tax got into play, we should have the same agency brought into action, and probably with the same success, as in the case of the former house-tax. The small as sessment of great houses would he produced as a griev ance. Great mansions paid heavily to the window-tax, but, taking ~ t he only just test, the test of value, and not of cost, the King's Arms or the White Hart in the county town would seem to pay in a greater proportion than the country gentleman's house.—(Hear, hear.) It was suite right to give relief from the window-tax with a view to purposes of health; but in this commu tation the new tax would be placed in a position of greater danger than the old, and we should have a larger amount of the public revenue in a position of danger. He was satisfied that if they wished to maintain the public credit, and the means of supporting the public establishments, they could not let the property-tax re main on its present footing, at the risk of an adverse vote of the other House, or of an adverse pressure out of doors. Last year .the Government, with the prospect of the discontinuance of the property-tax before them, gave up 1,100,000/. of public revenue, including some 500,0004 or 600,0001. of stamp duties, for which he had never heard any one out of doors express the least thankfulness. He considered that it would bo most dangerous to place the credit of the country to a great or an increasing ex tent upon the foundation of direct taxation. In 1842 his Noble Friend the Secretary for the Colonies (Earl Grey) expressed his sense of this danger, and called upon P ar liament to consider what would be their situa tion if the oppressive nature of the income-tax should make the country refuse to submit to its continuance, and how much embarrassment and how much danger to the national credit such a state of things would occasion. He thought when they found the proposition by Govern ment of an income-tax.for three years met by a resolu tion of the other House that it should be continued for roachi that n only one, that the results contemplated b an y d his Noext friend e i ni a g e h tu j determine iVy app g, year that this tax should be ienPda might t en h t to call altogether th Theyhad heard it said , and it was not denied on either side of the House, that th e a g ricultural interest was at present suffering the greatest depression, while they had eirdisLcoonrdtignhuiel;; He wished before he sat down attention to a, singular fact. been told to-night that the interests of productive in dustry, as represented by trade and manufactures, were, on the contrary, flourishing. Now it was in some mea sure a demonstration of the evils incident to the pro perty-tax, that that tax upon agricultural property, even in a time of distress, had gone on auge menting, while the amount of the same tax derived from other descriptions of property, trades, professions, and commercial profits, had diminished, although they were told those interests were most prosperous.—(Hear, hear.) He would take the comparison of two years. In 1343 the amount of property assessed to the income-tax under schedule A, which, he admitted, comprehended mills, buildings, and other things besides land, was 85,000,0004, and in 1850 it had risen to 94,000,0004 He found that the property assessed under Schedule D, which included all the interests admitted to be the most prospeteui, had fallen off from 63,000,0001. in 1843, to 54,000,000/. in .1850.—("Hear, hear," from Lord Stan ley:) This hid taken place concurrently with an in crease in the official value of exports from 131,000,0001. in 1843, to 190,000,0001. in 1849, and an increase in the value of imports from 70,000,0001. in 1843 to 1 05,000,000/. in 1849. He considered that the general financial con dition of the country was satisfactory, but he thought they ought carefully to consider whether a tax of the nature of the property-tax should be continued upon light grounds, and especially upon a principle which extended to its perpetuation, or whether they should not reserve such resources for great and important exi gencies. Earl GREY said he would first answer the question of the Noble Lord opposite with regard to the mode of assessing the income-tax. The Noble Lord had stated that he thought the same remedy ought to be given in cases of surcharge under the income and property-tax as in cases of surcharge in the land • and assessed taxes, and that the general body of Commissioners should have esevoice in the matter. In the case of the income-tax the difficulty had arisen from the Secrecy which is iusd been considered, and justly considered, advisable to p7eserve with regard to the exact profits and business matters of a private and confidential nature. Accord irgly the Act had providrd that seven Commissioners should be selected from the GlMmissioners of Land and Aesested Taxes, to whom an appeal should be made in the first instance, with an appeal, if desired, to a special cDmesissioner. He was afraid that. the appeal could not be carried. further consistently with an income-tax, and with that secrecy. which was due to the private affairs of individuals,—(Hear, hear.) With regatd to the observation of the Noble Lord who had last spoken, he was not about to express any opinion .very different from that which he had formerly ex pressed as to the objectionable character of the income tax as a fixed tax. He had expressed that opinion very etrongly in 1342, and he still entertained that opinion; but at the same time he was bound to say that experience had convinced him that the immense advantage procured to the country by means of the income-tax was worth the sacrifice which had been made for that purpo3e.— _ _ (bear.) The Noble Lord had remarked that the income tax had been calculated only at 3,500,0001., and for three years; while it had produced upwards of 5,000,0001., and had been continued for nine years. It was the pro ductiveness of the tax beyond what was anticipated that formed one of the reasons why he should be reconciled to its being imposed. In 1842 his opinion was, that for so small an amount as 3,000,0001., it was hardly worth while to resort to so objectionable a tax as an income tax; but when, in consequence of its greater productive ness, the Government were enabled to make reforms in our financial system, that result was one well calculated to alter the opinions he at the time entertained. It was with extreme astonishment that ho had heard the Noble Lord opposite assert that the imposition of the income tax had enabled the Government only to get rid of taxa tion the relief from which had been felt by no one — Lord STANLEY—I spoke with reference to the pro posed redaction in the timber and coffee duties. Earl GREY—The statement of his Noble Friend near him (the Marquis of Lansdewne) appeared to him con clusive as to the advantages which the country had de rived from our late commercial policy. Hi 3 Noble Friend had told them that nutting the income-tax out of the question, the amount of taxes remitted since 1842 had been not less than 10,000,000/., and that notwith standing such a remission the loss of income did not ex ceed 700,0001.—(Hear, hear.) Indeed he might say that by the remission of taxes which never went into the Exchequer, hut which fettered trade, the total amount of relief given was not over-estimated at 20,000,0001. — (Hear, hear.) He should not follow the Noble Lord through all the taxes to which ho alluded, and which he thought ought not to have been repealed. He was, however, surprised that his Noble Friend should have adverted to the reduction of the stamp duties as an alteration not worth the sacrifice of income it had en tailed. It was the fate of Chancellors of the Exche quer to bo very little thanked for their services, but his Right Hon. Friend had considered what was best for the public, and had deemed the alteration worth the sa crifice. It had been admitted that the schedule of stamp duties was one full of injustice and int Tiality— that it pressed on smaller transactions in a manner that rendered these transactions frequently impossible, and that it placed obstructions in the way of transfers of property, and other commercial end business transac tions. By a small sacrifice of revenue the stamp duties had been placed on a fair footing, and the reports re ceived from solicitors throughout the country proved that the effect of the alteration had been relief to an almost incalculable extent on transactions among persons in the humbler ranks of life. The full benefit of such reduc tions might not be reaped at first, but their Lordships might depend upon it that every obstruction taken out of the free career of industry and enterprise was at no dis tant period productive of the moat beneficial effects. Amongst all reductions which had been made he believed few were likely to be more beneficial than the alteration of the stamp duties. He thought the Noble Lord opposite must in what he had stated on this subject have entirely misunderstood what had fellen from his Noble Friend near him. The Noble Lord had represented the proposal of Government as implying a determination gradually to get rid of duties on customs, and to trust for revenue entirely to direct taxation. Where the Noble Lord found grounds for such an interpretation of his Noble Friend's speech he was at a less to know, for his Noble Friend had specially guarded himself against saying anything that could jus tify such an implication. Perhaps their Lordships would allow him to state what he conceived to be the real principle of this Bill. He considered the object of the Bill, not to be to get rid of custom duties as distin guished from other indirect taxes, but to get rid of those taxes, whether of custom or of excise, which were ob structions to the industry of the country.—(Hear, hear.) He might remind the Noble Lord that a very large por tion of the revenue which had been sacrificed in conse quence of the income-tax bad been derived, not from custom, but from excise duties ; and that the reduction of the duties on bricks and on glass bad been no incon siderable items of relief. Never had two articles of tax ation been so judicioutly relieved. Their Lordships were all aware of the brilliant display is connexion with the manufacture of glass that the metropolis exhibited at this moment. The improvement in the manufacture of glass had been going on, for the last few years, from day to day; and dated from the time when the exciseman's in terference was put an end to in the works. Although the reduction of the brick duty had only been made last year, still it had been most beneficial. A landowner himself, and, like others, feeling the pressure of the times, ho was yet sensible of the advantage of the reduc tion of the brick duty with reference to buildings and useful works. With respect to the proposed reduction of the duties on coffee and timber the Noble Lord opposite seemed to think that the consumer would not be be nefited. Only on Saturday last he bad read in a news paper the circular of one of the largest commercial houses in this country as to the effect of the alteration of the timber duty. Though the Bill had not yet passed, the reduction had been in operation for some weeks, and the statement of the firm to which he alluded was, that as regarded colonial timber there had been no re duction in price. He was fully prepared for that, because for some years the import of colonial timber bad been con fined to timber of a peculiar quality which the Baltic timber seldom came into competition with. But, as regarded Baltic timber, the circular stated that the consumer in many cases benefited to the extent of two-thirds of the reduction of duty, in other cases to the extent of a half, and in some cases to the whole extent of the reduction. He believed that that was even more than the Chan cellor of the Exchequer had calculated upon as the im mediate effect of his proposal. The extraordinary ac tivity in all those trades in which timber was much used —such as ship-building—proved the advantage which would be gained to the consumer by the alteration. With regard to coffee, the Noble Lord thought that the reduc tion of the duty would bo injurious to the colonies. He had had communications with persons growers of coffee in the colonies, and though it was not usual for persons engaged in a particular occupation to recognise the re duction of any protection enjoyed by them, yet none of the persons had said that any disadvantage would result to them from the proposal in question. Ceylon alone produced a larger amount of coffee than this country consumed, but the protection it enjoyed was utterly valueless, for the surplus produce regulated the price. On the other hand, the reduction of both duties would be of the first value to the Ceylon planter, be cause it would extend consumption. The Noble Lord had complained that the Government had done nothing to check the adulteration of coffee, but had rather fa voured it than otherwise. Not only the present Go vernment, but also that of which the Noble Lord had been a member, had found it impossible by restrictions or by excise interference to prevent adulteration. The other day, when visiting the Geological Museum, he saw some specimens of very pure chalk, and was informed that it was used for adulterating the best Durham mus tard. Ile believed the only remedy was for the con sumer to deal only with the respectable trades man, who sold a genuine article; but as regarded coffee the present measure, as far as it went, would check adulteration; for any reduction of the price of the real article must hold out less inducement to substitute for it an adulterated compound. He did not think it would be advisable to establish an exciseman in every grocer's shop in the kingdom to prevent the adulteration of coffee. He should add, with regard to the continuance of such a tax as the income-tax for a single year, that he concurred in the observations of the Noble Lord who spoke last. It was a dangerous measure, but it was one for which the Government were not responsible. After a few words in explanation from Lord BER NERS, Their Lordships adjourned. PARLIAMENTARY DIVISIONS ,From the Votes and Proceedings of the House of Commons. MONDAY, MAY 19. ECCLESIASTICAL TITLES ASSUMPTION BILL. (IN THE COMMITTEE.) Motion made, and Question proposed, " That the Pre amble be postponed :" Whereupon Motion made, and Ques tionl put, " That the Chairman do report progress, and ask ,eave to sit again." The Committee divided : MINORITY—AYES, 46. Howard, P. H. O'Flaherty, Antkony Hutchins, E. J. Power, Dr. Keating, Robert Power, Nicholas Lawless, Cecil Roche, E. B. M'Cullagh, W. Sadleir, John Magan, W. H. Salwey, Colonel Maher, N.. Scully, Francis Meagher, Thomas Somers, J. P. Mahon, O'Gorman Sullivan, Michael Moore, George H. Talbot, Morgan, 11. K. Vane, Lord;II. Murphy, F. S. Wall, C. B. Nugent, Sir Percy O'Brien, J. O'Brien, Sir T. O'Connell, John O'Connor, Feargus Armstrong, Sir A. Arundel, Earl of Barron, Sir 11. Blake, M. J. Burke, Sir Thomas Corbally, M. E. Crawford, W. S. Devereus, J. T. Buncombe, T. Fagan, James FoX, Richard M. Fox, W. J. _ Grace, 0. D. Grattan, Henry Greene, John TELLIZO. Keogh, William Reynolclo, John Higgins, G. G. Horsinan, Edward MAJORITY-NOES , 26`2• Question again proposed, " That the Preamble be post• poned :"=Whereupon Motion made , a nd Question put, " That the Chairman do report progress, and ask leave to sit again." The Committee divided : MINORITY —AYES , 30. Grattan, Henry O'Brien, Sir T. Greene, John O'Flaherty, Anthony Hi gg ins, George Power, Dr. - Keogh, William power, Nicholas Lawless, Cecil Sadleir, John Nagan, W. H. Scully, Francis Maher, N. Sallivan Michael Meagher, Thomas Talbot, J. H. Moore, G. H. TELLERS. Morgan, H. K. G. _ R O'Brien, Johla eynolds, John Keogh, William Barron, Sir 11. Blake, M. J. Blewitt, Reginald Corbally, M. E. Crawford, IV. S. Devereux, John I'. Fagan, James Fox, IV. J. Fox, Richard M. Gibson, T. M. Grace, O.D. MAJORITY-NOES, 271. At the rent audit of the venerable Duke of Port land, held at Morpeth on Thursday last, his Grace, with cha racteristic liberality and consideration for the sufferings of others, made a return of no less than 35 per cent. to his numerous tenantry in the COulltY of Northumberland.—New castlc Journal, "If 'l7, Cebourg Gotha, and Doke Ernest of Wurtembnrg, rode out on horseback -at the same_ time, attended by Lieutenant-Colonel F. H. Seymour. 2. - A deputation, consisting of H. H. wilson, Sir G. Staunton, the Right Hon. Holt Mackenzie,, Sir Her bert MAdock, Si: Cimrles Malcolm, Colonel Rairlinson Colonel Sykes, Mr. H. T. Prinsep, Dr.. J. Bird,'Mr. G. Forbes, the Hon. H. Stanley. Mr. Atkinson, Mr. Fer gusson, Mr. Bland,_ Mr. W. L. - Strachey,. Mr. Ravensbaw„ and Lir. R. Clarke, ,had an interview with laird John ll'esterday, at his official regilecco iu -Palvoing strcet. Mr. W. 0. Stanley had an. interview yesterday with Sir George Grey, at the Home-office. Dispatates were received yesterday at the Colonial- Uffier from the Governor of the Canadas, and.irem the Geverners of the other North American Colonies. Dis patches were also received from the Lord High . Com missioner of the Malan. Islands, from the Governer of Ceylon, and from the Governor of Western Australia. The Judicial Committee of the Privy Council sat yes terday. The Lords present were, the Chief Justice of the Court of Common Pleas, the Chancellor of the Duchy of Cornwall, the Judge of the Admiralty Court, and Sir Edward Ryan. The appeal " Lomi v. Ash well," (from tho Prerogative Court), part heard, was heard. SPIRIT of the PUBLIC JOURNALS. TIMES.—The extraordinary transformations which the Ministerisl measure, no longer properly called the Ecclesiastical Titles Bill, has undergone, and seems likely to undergo, lead th e con t em pl a tive mind t o some cur i ous speculations as to the noble science and much 7 practised art of preparing and passing Acts of Parliament. The first question relates to preambles. The practice is in preamble last. Mr. Keogh is f a e n v x e i ll s o f t o e otiaaski take e i r t i eign this instance first. Other Mem- no, preamble at all. The I p !s re rs tan c t o i n e s i id ,. e s i a • i t t l i is tA t , ctloieurteainneetht principle of the Bill; and ascertain a principle c if i . e i a t r b ly a a be s t o o u r n e d w ui e a a t x t i e m in t p i t a tc l , eg a ic so apply >}t; Arr. lieogh'e view would seem no t to he devoid of plansibifity. It err- Willy seems :more stitillectory to select- rz sound prin ciple and frame at= Abt upon it, than to pass the Act first, and then fish out its prineipleo from its details afteresrds. Much also may be said in favour of hating no preetiable - at 41:11. If - the original pferimble can be struck our, and another of totally different ten dency can be inserted, the enacting part all the time remaining precisely the same, it is not easy to see whet useful part in the constitution chi, law .the preamble can perform.. But besides all these different questions as to the nature and use of preambles-to which this Bill has glve - n rise; there is yet another, mere press ing and-practical than any or them—the question as to the propriety of having two preambles quite independent of each other, and leading to different conclusions. The Ministerial measure as it or i g i na lly s t oo d was simple and intellig iiel6 enough. It recited a mischief, the vio lation, namely, of the 24th action of the Emancipation Act, by the assumption of territorial titles not strictly within its provisions —and extended the section so as to re re medy the mischief complained of. This manner of t re ating the suhisct hai its f au l ts, b ut i t was at any rate clear end consistent wish itself. Th e m i s f or t une was , that it neither touched the grievance of which the nation complained which it required. T grievance was not so much the infraction of the 24th section (..f th e E manc i pat i on hcr appliedcomplained c;fne remedy Act, about which nobody troubled themselves very much, es the intolerable insult received by the Crown, the Church, and the country; end the remedy required was. nut the extension of what Mr. Disraeli calls petty penal 1-gi-lation, but the vindication of the national honour and independence. People whose minds were full of the Rescript and the Pastoral were surprised and disl leased to find themselves, in the very heat and tur moil of agitation, called away from the exciting ques tions of the present to discuss them under the arbi trarily-selected and ill chosen form of an attempt to patch up the provisions of a penal law of more than twenty years' standing which no government had ever attempted to put into execution. The view of Mr. Disraeli, in Friday night's debate, which is substantially the same as that announced by Sir Frederick Thesiger and Mr. Walpole himself on the second reading of the Bill, was also simple and coherent as ori ginally expressed. That view was to substitute for the Ministerial measure a Bill which, avoiding the prudery of appearing to forget the very circum stances to which it owed its origin while they were yet loud in every one's mouth and fresh in every one's mind, should deal with realities instead of shadows, and, as it was undoubtedly caused by the Papal rescript, should be framed with exclusive reference to it. Such a Bill would be, as Mr. Disraeli phrased it, a purely retaliatory mea sure. It would meet the overt act of that great con spiracy against the liberties of Europe which Lord John Russell announces, and which the confiding leader of the Conservatives affects to believe, by a counter move proportioned to and directed against that act. Hera again was a clear and logical Bill founded on a notorious aggression, and applying to that aggression an adequate remedy. The preamble to such a Bill would be, of course, a recital of the Papal rescript, and of the acts done under it. The Bill itself would declare the rescripts and the acts to be illegal and void, and inflict some punishment on those who put the rescript in use by as suming titles confirmed by it, or giving it effect in any other manner. Here are two perfectly distinct ways of treating the subject—the first, by patching up an old law; the second, by making an entirely new one. The original Ministerial Bill could not have omitted Ireland from its provisions without deviating from the spirit of the section which it undertook to amend, and intro ducing an entirely new principle under pretence of ex tending an old one. The Bill not pretending to 'be formed on recent occurrences, but simply on former legislation, it may readily be conceded that to have ex tended the 24th section of the Emancipation Act to England alone would have been to have introduced an iuvidious anomaly against which the Irish Churpla would have had every reason to complain. This neces sary consequence of the form in which Ministers cut the measure was not the least among its defects. Bat if the Ministerial Bill necessarily included Ireland, the pro position of Mr. Disraeli and Mr. Walpole of founding the Bill on the rescript as necessarily excluded it. Alt the logical considerations which drew Ireland into the one enactment rendered it inadmissible in the other The Papal rescript had nothing to do with Ireland, and any measure really founded on the rescript could only embrace that country by forcing on the premises a conclusien wider than they could support, or by adopt ing new and complex principles, and so marring the simplicity and coherence of the original design. Thus, Mr. Disraeli, while be announces that he can only consent to a measure of strict retaliation, tells us in the same breath that it must extend to Ireland, and tilts lose the very_ retaliatory character for which he stipu lates. There may be abundance of reasons why the Ro man Catholic Prelates of Ireland should be subjected to penalties and r'strictions. It may be necessary to the security of the Protestant Establishment, it may be re quired to repress synodical action, but it certainly never can be required or justifisd on the ground on whiPh alone Mr. Disraeli puts it—that of retaliation for ag gression on England. The absurdity which Me; Dis raeli has announced in general terms Mr. Walpole _fiP'S worked out in detail. The Bill, as he frames it, and as Ministers seem disposed to assent to it, has sf really two preambles, distinct from, and independento the other —one true the other false; one natural, of truly exposing the arti ficial; one introduced for the sake in motion, the other causes which have put Parliamen t d. g the measure to a case to give an excuse for ete ' norm compatible with its not covered by its principleiptheremay not be reasons, such ob jects. We do not say that the conduct of Primate Cullen; and as the Syncd of Thurlesh with Government measutres of educe lion, which might interferenceht render it nece ssar y t o con trol with more stri t h e conduct of the Roman Catholic bier- his ever ctnes o o d. y r i g ht to But we do say that Ireland are hy in complainlrela when thesymmetry of the Bill has b een purposely in mu tilated and destroyed o r d er to thrust h e r into a quarrel in provoking which she had no share, t h oug h the penalty is to alight equally u p on h er head. it might have been too much to ask that she should have been made an exception to a measure in whose scope she was naturally included, but it was not unreasonable to ask that she should not be intertwined by an odiods parenthesis with a measure complete without her, and whose organization her presence only serves to destroy. But the more strongly we are impressed with these convictions the more clearly we see that the most devoted member of the Irish Establishment would have no right whatever to complain of the absence of Ireland from the quarrel between England and the Pope—the more do we feel the helplessness of the condition in which her Parliamentary champions have placed her.. Instead of urging on the House the propriety of di scr iminating between the cases t o w hi c h the rescript did and those to which it did not a pply, we find them labouritig e O : 5 of ear nestly as Mr. Disraeli himself to confound th e e the their own ancient and firmly-settled hierarchy with tottering and new-fangled titles of 111lethoine and Wise man. THE VAUXHALL MURDER. h Y e sterday evening Mr. Pay ne, the City re sumed the inquiry, comme nced by im afort night since, into the cir cumstances attendant upon the death of Henry James Chaplin, a police-constable of th e L division, who was killed b y the violence offered to him by several his duty. The names of the jury having been called over and r e' w xr division. s answered to men while in the discharge of ina T d— he deceased was a police-constable in hA i s • division. He was 33 years of li e always bore t ag l e n , spector ' Car ber e had already stated, 0 character of a steady and well conducted several men in custody and awaiting further examination for having murdered the deceased. He deemed that the in n . There as* evidence lie had already adduced would be sufficient for the purpo es of s the prosecution, and theref h ore e had not The come pre eto bring for d war any more. CORONER, upon this intimation, read over the de positions taken at the former examination, and then p r oceeded to charge the jury, explaining to them the different circumstance s which constituted' the crimes of murder and manslaughter. He cited several instances, showing the difficulty of determining the precise bound ary between the two offences; bu t added, that in the present case no difficulty could exist, as all the circum stances seemed to indicate that it would be their bounden duty to convict the prisoners upon the more serious charge. Here was a constable , proved to be a m ild and steady man, assaulted with such violence that ho sur vived it but a short time, by a set of men to whom he had given no provocation, but with whom he was remon strating in the due execution of his office. He thought, that whatever might ultimately be the result of the case, these men ought to t be, indicted for the capital offence. After a few minutes' discussion, the jury returned a verdict of " Wilful Murder" against Pattick Cane and John Thickey. The CORONER then issued his warrant in the usual form, and round over the witnesses to give their eaidaVe at the trial. N 7.• ft ,