The Sun. — London, England, 1850-02-27 00:00:00

Ei Shoul d '— , find th at b e had efficiently in s t ruc t e d i n theitems . ° Sr ' h(.° l'dUCatiOrl ; and the oth er weos the formation Of : w sohool s; . and th ese he (Mr. Fox) propose : should ~ r . r ce sohool s — schools to which any inhabitant of tltle r r nsil or distrct would have the ri to send his ci - 'hre tree bstw eee the eges of seve n and thirteen, without Cpviarge, without any di st i nct i on of treatir etit or training' th ne religious pLcrilierittes iecule tto I, but leaving to :thlsis the right—the inalienable right—to have their rea instrueted at fixed p?riods, in whatever religion 0 t 'Y tato t thiek proper.--(Hear.) IL) proposed that, ics ving the school, each child who had conducted ; ru self to his master's satisfaction should have a pre kiint of books. made to him, and that the duly Scriptures 8-osla • those books. He pro p,,,,_, was form a portion of D , u that the tcacher should be made as independent as i ) l d s r i ble; that he should ' be appointed, and that he should t i l:''alisNible, by the local education committee, but ;e 4 ,,, t, in ease or diunibsal, he should have a right of ap- . s a l!? the E location Committee of the Privy Counci, , 0 1 instances should occur in which a district would be t(l ( e , '.4l `'''s or so iseglectfol of its duty as not to under n,' to p-evid f •the dti .' •• in the supply of educe te , • e for e seem.) 4 - " " Would give the Committee of the Prtvy Council 1:1Slit to step in and remedy the evil. To masters ‘ i v r ,, )ll rive reasonable saleries • he would fix the a k E itl- ' llll l o'-', those salo ..' at an amount ' which would li ved to , the m a res . p r e u c s tabl:‘ social position. He be (lll°Autl that to he a ins . ttsr of the utmost possible cense lantl'u. lie relied on the sshoolma,sters for the ad - ;1 1 ;' ) Illent of (due ition. He believed that it was only lurceutgell. their instrumentality that the House could oa ths p ep 'ter and brighter rerei•ts among the children of 11 , l l e than those which they at present witnessed. ttai d tr i tl 'ted there was nothing in that scheme . which h a g UP offensive to those various religious bodies which lion "doubted! done so much for the cause of educa- Wo ud He proposed no restraint upon them. His plan sh i l - ,P, 1 1t an end to that interference which the trustees lh I' s; nail occasioned so much vexation. If members of tinetitablihhed Church were to erect a school placed l'tie,„llle direction of a clergyman of the parish, and /a r ,""e bishop as a visitor, but which sent out f thri to bi shop a certain number of pupils qualified to take r l!ir t dP l s as members of a civilized state, his scheme oped.}tilre'carcl them f o r the work they had done. He bt n til at bissenters also would find the measure un- Ntetiir,-,nable- Their schools, also, would be free from ' 0 ( r h lt ''''' In fast, he was inclined to adept . , i o n n r e e e fer b e e n e c n e 4;1,4 subject, a distinction which had Nisi drawn by the Hon. Member for Surrey . I , 4 's fa,. brurnmond) between education and in -10:i'.41. 13y education he understood a complete l t1;1"-sa drawing out of the mind, which could a o ff n ee y . rate work of a highly-gifted teacher, or of the 411 i1,s PQ ' r ellt or master. By instruction, on other s he t„''' understood the communication of knowledge— thel kil l 1 - " it ' in g of the faculties. That was a . low . er ta s s - .11 Dtnw" Un fortunately the only one which it wa the l '''etiCy - 7. r of legislation u to accomplish through '110,,, 0 sc hoolmasters. There was another class to 'le - a " e r c ould not hel looking, and whose co-operation Ne: 4 4, ° ' the utmost ! ilisportance that they . should en -I%se-Ltit t b he meant the working people, hr r - i e r, ar en ra le atter t — o be trained ; for without that co anon 40 effor e ts re of the Legislature, or of any . other Nis' -I'll t hatsubject could lead to the beneficial ye ii ehi, . . lt teir 4 It was so desirable that they should produce. h ' u lete r. 4 1 gnee of that class was, he feared, very . . muc o h f A r ,.. r °0 4 1 -e ' by those who had not had opportunities Rl, -.4°ll :o, co rumunication with them.—(Hear, hea d r.) e sal-what class there was a sturdy intelligence ana " c ues "actise which recoiled from charity which t : r Y at , 9 ' ' not unwarranted, sometimes i l ' ti e fi ti lphi ll eh lt a i ti r n o r d a ru i n e s t t a l b ru l e es d t s h u e s m picions of their superiors, to read books which had 1 11 1 4 ,, t 'ese titte n I )3 7Pu :heir betters in society for the 1,11111, seta , they believed, of producing a par et-zt s. i n on their minds. Now, he thouhtthat sesto 4 , --111 1sss of intellect, which was the unavoidable T h at c : llli tuent of self-culture, without the possession of tab e -steresl advantages, was entitled to respect. t ,711cisth,'"Ple were indisposed to send their children h o . 'tit ' - w b l ch thee l oked upon as charitable este is tla ) 8 °l ' which "'the ° thou ht were founded for the ltli . e of, lAi v r eselytisin y te their children to some . particular p a i nt ''i n tlS L (l 'nonaination a . A society of working men in 2; " put forth a manifesto which contained a PittsitUPoathat subject, which was, he thought, well p'l4 ) r g k of the attention of the House. (The . Hon... I t ,' es t ere read the passage, in which the writers ex 1,5-2s:aciol:_irndnetermination not to allow their children Q . eqe„r'l ed among religious sects, and strongly d.e -elltrt,'lOse dissensions amongst the members of dif• th t 'lglous denominations which had deprived . them Il lf' t e alls of saving their children from ignorance, Ill ,t tr°,_i were,p degradation.) He believed rya h4:c, the opinions of the real workine• men, .'4414: incalculable advantage would . be derived' from : 1 44 4' t4 ' co - operation of . that class in a more ex ,Ps„b!Ystens of education. It was expected, per i lis ' at he should say something of the cost I, l ` . kfs,„ l) , l _a , a, which he . proposed. Now it would be '''h lt '''elon upon his part to produce figures upon ", 41 tsi hallbiect. But he would remark that the first im r,s'ha?,"t2,ll the mind was very likely to lead to a highly OttirCA estimate of the outlay which the plan would i' l %s T he association for education in . the county of tili4s,s,-t,:r„lial made their calculations with great care, tt tie "ad found that they couldsupply schools for laest ,r e 0 . rate of 4,id. in utl,,. education of the country bya they ( '',lla l „ " s, They had further found h that could es education of adults as itia''ul. Crliailstlrof schools t i - or of t h e ti. in the pound. That ILmliirte h cl. _ ever en by a rate ._, po i „ ~y. . , was or a complete provision of schools, 'i,' oil.r. Fox's) plan was merely proposed to sup sl,,qlf,,,ting deficiency. Then, again, he would reen 4"it. '' 'lnns° that, after education should have be 4 1 t„i'illor 'general d effective, they might reason ":l4setil7ll4t:o7). a gr a ea n t diminution of the expense of 4 14 e I!: g. lltuperism, of punishingcriminals, as well as o' i t p• '... 53 es of property by theft—and further, the l i N ltt „' c PaYers would receive in the education of their 1,".t,,,, e nnipensati,n for their contributions to the p t ' 4l . 4 , 11 " of such a system as that which he pro fit, fete " he had said before, he should rely mainly 1:11101:1.ilers for the success of any scheme of that de etten',ubli in that reliance he felt warranted _ b e y ad th e e f I, t Grave o bservation cf the Noble Lord at the h ' !iti tl , a llc uellt ' made in that House three years ago, 1 Air,„' topic of' education had been under ohs 'ith T he Noble Lord said upon that occasion— Vtlol l 45 a lways been my opinion that you could never t ° (l +L Y r aise education in this country until you i!ll,i.tN`:", condition and the prospects of the school it;Lls.i, I C'olv that was the object he (Mr. Fox) had VA bi-. row the salaries which he proposed *tr i , f) tlti la -t t a lare- If any person doubted the importau '.p — 'tors in schools, he would direct the attentton 1 4,' L lsl e et ,sun to the state of education in the Isle of plan. ta;l'its r ,:,,Man was perhaps the most perfect . specimen d . Pa„s% - f .'" of a community universally and highly e u t ill' 411 11 1 . " as regarded the use of ink and . paper. Every in Si t it itt ere had its school; and the inhabitants we . re . 1 11 1 1. (,` c ' i t . society in which the power of public opinion S.:itAl>at to bear upon individuals. Parents in the I. ‘l' t h ' ,: a ' ri were even subject to a penalty if they did not „ 1 ,, is nee which would not NOl t , '4ldrerl to school—a thing . t 'ol,l IV ' t a ; tti in this country—and yet the children , 41 I '., . l e l in the most deplorable condition which .. ,N Cclt. ' b 0 conceived. The Bishop, in writing V i ls h,-culreittee of the Privy Council, said that 'lt,7, l l 'l Z u Plan for raising the condition of the s.chotohle t7N,',lvolra adopted, the education granted 0 1: Id he 4t: 11 - ,i'l be useless and the children t ere w 1 ' 1115 4 in useful knowledge by those of every oth . er ;tr ;,,, the country. It was not on the pupils ,1a Y 4 14. 4 a . ,''utr, colleges that he (Nit.. Fox) would merely o „'''tr,'NuitkrYing out that measure. The professt i o t n had f ' l V . tr o i's , ter had sunk in this country because d in t k 'se L ls, t'ttllLe encouragement which was require t , 1 81,." A ' th;, ti ule people to devote themselves heart welland ~Nt h 'si C. oc cupation. He believed that persons l 'i cj i lli „ - ', 4. that work existed in considerable numbers I , l N t ;:t . 11 ° ;',, t11 ,,e country; and he thought of the school „l,rr, ,ur the poet—na s c i lur non . fit. There was a r s tt .t Uls ts`; e4( leticy in some minds which enabled them „\ l 'ihr% - ,`" With children and to accelerate their prod tYp,,lisktrt-gu want of which no amount of learning could j,V,liti o - ,, Wear, hear.) He wouldthrowope h Ni .ll N . ,,''' ) r masters; he would .. make aptitude for i,';,, - util e ' great test in that competition; an then he (i l s, i llist i '' r eward good teachers. Their function was s'N,',th e tn , i ght well be deemed . sacred, and they de lttO I T 'lest honours which society could bestow.— t lZ l l: ti by i't: own that the House would judge that 4 1 4 t tl i ta , s 7l . l . importance and interest, and not by the kt Iv si, iiverteect manner in which he had brought it 0 1 4, 4 til i u tle . He merely . wished at that moment • fl 'lll i i tha t l , should be laid upon the table of the ti; kl -it should be printed; and that the House 'll(tktio e e l shouldtake the measure into their con e-tiSitilth* ~_e payed the House to think of the con ppq,,,to.nlitis on thousands o . f children in this cA It YNA } I think of the crime which had thriven in a trn t iCb. t heh-, e h oped to see bring forth better fruits.. He tt ' i 'leikll y . ' to think of those localities which were : 4 l- 1, 1 I ' l :"th forth hordes of untutored savages in t thi t ?l t e k r 4 4477 1 17 d to de . rive from civilization only Iq h k , r c ue, l ,_ for becoming t themselves a more un- Pq ., tti tilt ° l 4 o ";latice to society. He would have them klip`s. n let, gaols and hulks, and of our Vlail t tlet a 1 . !s; he would have them . think of the 0014 4 , 1 114_ 4 4r, and security which might be spread N Isitlpi4 the homes of the well-disposed by the ge -1 ti4 ,,tr''',, zl ,4 the nd the moral conduct of the people ; he ,P 4 1 0 3, 4 1 1 t il IC_ eh ttr nil_ look to higher motives—to motives of le I' l4 cue s , ' ',Acter—and to consider that the intellec •)'o4; li tte r i or lustre of our country had ever been a ia l , c tta Wa ia r en to that of its supremacy in art! and t' •:,% - „wh• I ,— , have them look to those still higher 4, 45 1 . 1 ,,,U 1 tt e e - e ' o W o ll . ll the purposes of civil society should tit h,tilvici4;oPlished, would yet remain to be realised t.; 11 k 1 3. 141 w e ' ll ,' who by the means which they could Ote l fo s o _ 1 , 1 _ 1 ( 1 be better qualified to fulfil te good eici,"t-e.Zolch he had been formed by his beneficent t l fus t atieZ!,em) The Hon. Gentleman concluded "kls Dra too -.' cheers by moving for leave to bring le in in a 11, 1 1 t., a m ,:tig the secular education ot the peop , ,r) L A _A...ye tiles. h `t( i 44 1iq„4 ,. .,igEny,...5 anxious to render his testimony to Vas, d b rou 'u , l . ability with which the Hon. Gentle 4`,'Nt l ie b,Plt that subject under the notice of the 'l)t il tN ob e yed that the Hon. Member had rather yktttlyttlistir overstated the deficiencies in our il,llll,:iihcift:f(itrlt.nrto° education. Th e pl ans which had L 1, 1. '0'1 0 1 heth the extreme parties upon that cile-- failed; and he did not see why they L'it P, l. th e length leave it to parishes to tax them 11‘it tht3sis iNuTT!cotaution of that object. li i l ti, l el s i, :i'tS.arid Lord J. RUSSELL rise together; 1.144`1ef, otter-.eon s h aving given way, the Hon. Baronet 0 4, te.,,th the speech of the Hon. Member for ~t tll ' tlVlltdgE"d to he and ability of which he readily N . ), Pini on J 4 1 , Prs • ---he had waited in respectful silence to 'tit of 1( 1( otsi „tim e th souse Member of her Majesty's Go -147p1, u• hi l „,,'' Proposed measure. ~ n 4t e , e _eti dd,' ?i f t - , - ;I L again rose, amid some laughter, the permission of the Hon. C 1 Q v 5,;',1%,..1 ress the House. The Noble Lord said ON 4;cul• Friend the Member for the University ctried 10 have expected that some Member A THE SUN, of her Majesty's Government should rise and state what view he took of the motion of the lion. Member for ()leihem, he did not hesitate to say that ho hop( d the House would not refuse permission to the Honourable Gentleman to bring in his Bill.—(Hear.) He thought that no one could doubt, in the , first place, the importance of the subject, and, in the next place, no one could say that education wits in such a state in England that no further measures were re quired upon thu subject; that there was not much to be lamented in the present deficiency of the means of edu cation; that there was not much which good men de plored, even in the education which was given; and that there was not yet more to be deplored in the ab sence of education among the great mass of our people, whose instruction, and still more, whose training in re ligion and morality, deeply concerned the welfare of the whole community. If that were the case, the only other question that retrained was, whether the Hon. Member for Oldham had approached that subject in a fitting spirit—(flear, bear)—whether he had been deeply im pressed with the importance of the task he had under and whether the object he hail in view was to provide for the better education, not of one portiere net cf one sect, hut of all classes of the people in this em pire.—(Hear.) He thought every one should acknow ledge that the spirit in which the Hon. Gentleman had approached that question was one worthy of the sub. ject—(Haar, hear)—that he had stated full and ably the rresent deficiency of education, that he seemed clearly to perceive in what that deficiency con sisted, and that whatever might be the merits of his proposal, his inclination was to produce a plan which should not excite jarring contentions, but should rather tend to unite the various opinions prevailing upon that subject.—(Hear, hear.) If that were the case, he said, there was good cause to induce the House to agree to the request of the Hon. Gentleman that he should lay that Bill on the table of the House. As to the further questions, what were the difficulties which surrounded the subject, and whether the plan proposed by the Hon. Gentleman would overcome those difficulties, what was the manner in which the plan proposed by the Hon. Gentleman might be viewed by the public and by those who were at present engaged in the promotion of educa tion, and whose services in that cause the House was bound to honour, those were questions on which he thought it better not to attempt to express upon that occasion any imperfect views, which would not, perhaps, be correctly founded on the measure which the Hoe. .Member meant to introduce. He, therefore, altogether declined to give any opinion at that moment with respect to the plan proposed by the Hon. Gentleman. That, he thought, was afar better course, than that he should either commend that plan prematurely, or make to it objec tions which, after all, could not, perhaps, be founded on the merits of the case itself. This only he would say, that he thought that, perhaps, of the whole state ment of the Hon. Gentleman the part in which he most doubted the accuracy of the allegations was that in which be had alluded to the failure of the efforts made for the improvement of popular education of late years. His (Lord J. Russell's) impression rather was that al though the great efforts which it had been proposed that they should have made three or four years ago had not led to as large an extension of education as they had anticipated, yet it had been attended with a con siderable addition of its blessings. Whether there was a failure at present in the desire and the means of carry ing on education, that again would be a matter for sub sequent discussion. All he should then venture further to say was that he thanked the Hon. Gentleman for the spirit in which he had brought that subject under their notice.—(Hear, hear.) Frequently as he had been dis appointed in discussing that question, he could not but hope that, whether or nct the plan of the Hon. Gentle man should be adopted in the shape in which he had proposed it, such a plan of general education discussed with temper in that House might tend to advance that great cause in which society was deeply interested, and he should certainly cordially concur in giving his assent to the introduction of the Bill. Sir R H. INGLIS said he willingly admitted the temper and the ability:with which the Hon. Member for Oldham had introduced the subject. But at the same time he could not coincide in the principles on which the plan of the Hon. Gentleman rested, or in tho objects at which he aimed. The Hon. Gentleman had said that the question no longer was, whether it was or it was not good that education should be diffused. But the point on which he (Sir H. H. Inglis) was at issue with the Hon. Gentleman was as to what was education. According to the Hon. Gentleman it appeared to be the instruc tion of a man in those branches of learning which terminated with man in this world—(Hear, hear)—and the omission of every consideration of the eternal destinies of man, for which this world and all its concerns were but a most fleeting preparation. The Honourable Gentleman had said that the education of the people was less advanced in this country than in Prussia, in Saxony, or in other continental countries. Bat he (Sir E. H. Inglis) thanked Heaven that the people of England were sufficiently educated to have saved us from the excitement which prevailed a few years ago in Prussia.—(A cry of " Oh" from Mr. B. Osborne.) The Hon. Member for Middlesex cried " Oh," but ho (Sir H. 11. Inglis) believed that the Hon. Member had reason, in common with the rest of the people of this country, to thank Heaven for the charac ter displayed by its inhabitants on the ICth of April, 1848; and the people who had displayed that character must, he felt persuaded, in some way or another, have re ceived the advantages of a good education. He would not on the present occasion enter into questions of detail. He wished the House to bear in mind that they were asked to give their assent to a Bill which proceeded upon the supposition that a system of secular education was desirable for the people of this country. The Hon. Mem ber admitted that he did not wish to interfere with any existing system of religious education, but wished the education provided by the State to ba secular or temporal. Ho admitted, nevertheless, that religious, education was • the greatsst boon a child could receive —(Hear, hear) — and then to show how his arguments and his facts might be retorted on themselves, went on to say that notwithstanding this great boon he could not but admit the practical conclusion to he a great increase of crime. [Mr. Fox intimated dissent.] Did ho misrepresent the Hon. Member? He stated as the result of the reports of the different gaolers and inspectors of prisons, and in. spcctors of schools, that religious acquirements were no evidence of morality. Mr. FOX said his position was that you could not give real religieus instruction unless you bestowed on the mind so much of other knowledge as rendered it a fitting soil to receive the germ. Sir R. H. INGLIS was willing to take the position as the Hon. Member had now put it, and could confidently refer to those schools in which a religious education was given, and ask whether secular education was seen there coincident and in juxta-position? The Hon. Mem appeared to think that in those schools where religion was taught nothing else was taught. Now, though he never would consent to admit that anything could be put in competition with that which was destined to fit a child for eternity, yet he asserted that at that moment, in the greater part of the schools to which ho had re ferred, and with which ho was acquainted, as large a proportion of secular education was afforded as would be found in any other schools. This was a question of fact upon which he could only state his own personal conviction and belief. However, as there ap peared to,:be no intention to divide the House, he would merely recur to a proposition to which he had ventured to call the attention of the Government some time ago —namely, that they should make up their minds AS to what encouragement they would give to lay members of the House of Commons, to amateur Members, in bring ing in these Bills. Let no man feel himself aggrieved if the Government, on the first movement of any subject, should say at once, " This subject is good, and we ought to take it up; and this is bad, and neither you nor any body else ought to take it up." The time of the House would be greatly economised if the Government would thus interfere with the discretion of private Members. He did not mean to say that this subject was one on which the deliberate consideration of the House would be unwisely exercised, and he, therefore, would not refuse permission to the Hon. Member to lay his statement for mally in the shape of a Bill before the House. But he earnestly hoped that ultimately the House would nut as sent to any measure which proposed to give the reci pients of education a system which terminated with this world, leaving them to acquire from their fathers and mothers—whose ignorance he had admitted—that know ledge on which their ultimate happiness depended. Mr. M. MILNES agreed with the Noble Lord at the head of the Government in thiuking that it would be better to postpone the discussion of the question till the second reading of the Bill, and would nor, therefore, re ply to the arguments of the Right Hon. Baronet who had just sat down. All that would be admitted by allowing the Bill to be brought in would be that religious and secular education rested on different grounds. The one was capable of advancement and encouragement, and the other not, and therefore the State might legitimately interfere in the one, though not in the other. Mr. HUME applauded the course pursued by the Hon. Member for Oldham, who, to prove the inadequacy of the present system, had not depended on his own know ledge, but had referred to the most able and independent authorities. He denied that his Hon. Friend had advo cated a system of secular education alone. The Hon. Baronet had asked what was education? He had always considered it to be that mental training which fitted a man to be a good member of society, and a good life led to religion. Neither had his Hon. Friend proposed any system of State education, but merely that property should be made locally available to supply the deficiency which existed in the education of the people. He hoped that all would co-operate in so modelling the Bill as to secure a general scheme of education for the coun try at large. Mr. PLUMPTRE had understood the Hon. Member for Oldham to state that the deficiency of education was so great in this country that not above one child in thirteen of the riskg generation enjoyed its advantages. Whether he had rightly collected the words of the Hon. Member or not, he evidently thought the education of the people at the present time very deficient. The Hon. Member very liberally stated that it was not his intention to interfere with schools already established, whether in connexion with the Church or otherwise; but his intentions were prospective; he merely wished to fill up the gaps. He wanted, however, to know from the lion. Member what clan he proposed to introduce into his new schools. If he understood him rightly, his schools were to be open t o th e c hild ren of persons of all denominations, but there was to be no religious instruc tion whatever, end the children were to be left to such instruction as they could get from their parents or others. The population of the districts in which these schools were to be raised up, however, the Hon. Member pro posed to tax 4 id. or 6d. in the pound.—(No, no.) All he could say was, that if such were the plan which the Hon. Member proposed for the education of the great mass of the rising population, ho for one most solemnly and religiously protested against it. Mr. B. OSBORNE quite agreed with the Noble Lerd in thinking that the most judicious course would be not to enter into details on the present occesion. In fact the way in which the detaila bad been mistinder stood showed that they were not in a position. to dis cuss them. He could not, however, refrain from paying the humble tribute of his praise to the whole, extensive, and statesmanlike view taken of the subject by the Hon. Member for Oldham. He was sorry to add one word of bitterness to the discussion, but he must take this oppor tunity of proving that he had had the benefit if some education by expressing his sorrow for having Allowed an involuntary 4. Oe" to escape him when the li se. Ba ronet the Member for the University of Oxfort insti tuted the parallel between this country and ?Tustin, which, coming from so good an historian, he was sur prised to hear. The Hon. Baronet might have told them that as in Prussia there existed a highly educated people without a representative government, the natural course of events was to upset that state of things in which, in fact, there was taxation without repro• sentation.—(Hear, hear.) The Hon. Baronet - went fur ther, he alluded tc the 10th of April. Now he remem bered but one passage in history to which that rebellion could be likened. and that was the rebellion of Lord Grizzle in Torn Thumb. The Hon. Baronet asked what was education? He (Mr. o,borne) had had, ho would not say the honour, because he regretted that he had ever been there, hut he had been a member of one of the Universities. He was sent there to receive, not educa tion, but instruction, and he knew not any year in his life which he more wished to forget, and when he reflected on all the vice and the little learning which he saw while he was at Cambridge, he looked on the two Universities as great hindrances to all proper education. He was the more inclined to support the scheme proposed, because he saw in it a strong assimilation to what he thought the best mode of education—namely, the national system in Ireland; and in conclusion, he could not help suspecting the philanthropy of that man who would deny the people education save on the condition of instilling into their minds his own particular prejudices. Mr. NAPIER was rather surprised to hear the Hon. Member for Middlesex fasten on the University of Cambridge the bad habits which he appeared to have acquired.—(Cheers and laughter.) Although the Hon. Member might have found opportunities for indulging in vicious pursuits, he might also, it was to be hoped, have found occasion for the development of virtuous habits.—(Hear, hear.) The Hon. Member had adverted to the Hon. Baronet's observation as to the conduct of the population of Middlesex on the 10th of April, but perhaps the intelligence of that district might be judged of by the representative they turned out and the one they put in. The House would have an opportunity on the second reading of the Bill of fully discussing the whole system of national education; and he trusted that the same spirit would be preserved which had marked its intreduction.—(Hear.) He concurred in some part of the Hon. Mover's views, but differed from him at that point where ho wished to separate secular from religious oducation. The proceedings of the association were of great importance. He had looked into its pro ceedings, and had derived much advantage from it, be cause, although there were many things with which he could not agree, still he thought it best to do like the:bee and extract all the food that was to be found there. In Manchester a meeting was called a short time since, for the purpose of discussing this very question, and a pro position was submitted to it in the spirit of that brought forward by the Hon. Member for Oldham, and yet, after full discussion, an amendment was carried of a very op• posite character. He hoped sufficient time would be given for full discussion, and he thought it better that a Bill of this kind should be brought forward by a pri vate Member than by the Government, as the latter might, perchance, invest with a party character a ques tion which ought to be calmly and patiently considered on its own merits exclusively. In conclusion, ho could not but express his satisfaction to see an endowment proposed and advocated by the advocates of the volun tary system.—(Hear.) Mr. COCKBURN regretted the allusions made by the Hon. and Learned Member for the University of Dublin to the Hon. Member for Middlesex, as it was desirable to avoid all personal and irritating topics on a question of this nature. This much, however, he would say of the constituency of Middlesex, that with the integrity and intelligence of their present Member they had every reason to be satisfied. He felt called on, as a warm supporter of the general principle of the measure, to en ter his emphatic protest against the view which the Hon. Baronet the Member for the University of Oxford had taken of it. He denied that it was a system having re gard only to the concerns of this world. He did not so understand it.—(Hear, hear.) The Honourable Mem ber for Oldham to him appeared as deeply impressed as any man, that if you could combine religious with secu lar education, it would be most desirable f a. the State to do so. Why, then, were they separated? Because it was found impossible to combine them in one sys tem, as it would be impossible to obtain the con currence of either the Established Church or the Dissenters. But it was said that religious education was by far the most important. He freely ad mitted it ; but if you could not, as a measure of national education and policy, have both, was that any reason why you should not have one?—(Hear, hear.) Did the State at this moment maintain any sys tem of State education? None whatever. Schools were established by the exertions and contributions of individuals; and was there anything in this Bill to pre vent the continuance of the system? Certainly not. Would any one contend that education in this country was in a more forward state than in Prussia? At all events would any one deny that the education of the people of England was very far from what it ought to be?—(lleir, hear.) Mr. W. MILES reminded the House that in 1839 a proposition was made to separate secular from religious education. What did the country say to it?—(hear, hear.) Was there not a cry raised against it from one corner of the kingdom to the other? Did not the Church of England and Dissenters alike approach the House with petitions, and did not a Noble Lord, now a member of the other Howie (Lord Stanley), bring forward a mo tion against it, and though in a minority, did he not very nearly carry his motion? Did not the Archbishop tf Canterbury move certain resolutions condemning the principle then brought forward? It was not his inten ion to enter into the question. He should be happy to took at the Bill, which he hoped would be discussed with the same good temper and forbearance which had marked the present debate. Nothing would do more good than a general discussion upon the whole system of educa don, which he should like to see settled by Act of Par- dement; but while he was prepared ; to discuss it with temper and forbearance, he would not sacrifice one iota of his opinions. Mr. LAW was very glad that an opportunity would be afforded for discussing how far an interference with education could be justified by a body not immediately responsible to Parliament. With reference to the Hon. Member for Middlesex, ho had not understood him to assert that a good education could not be had at Cam bridge, but that a good education might turn out fruit less.—(Hear, hear.) The Hon. Member, however, must have made up for lost time, for he never could have sat in that House as the representative of Middlesex, unless he had taken great pains to become at a late what he might have become at an earlier period.—(Hear.) Air. NE WDEGATE wished not to misunderstand the Hon. Member for Oldham. As he understood him, the inspection was to be carried into the secular education Of every school of every denomination, and on the re port of that inspector as to insufficiency, it would be competent for the Government to establish schools on the principle proposed by the Hon. Gentleman, and to rate the inhabitants. Mr. FOX said the lion. Member had in part mis understood him. The foundation of his plan was the deficiency of education in different localities. The means of ascertaining those deficiencies already existed to a great extent in the documents which the Committee of the Council had accumulated by means of the reports of the inspectors. In a district such as that under the care of the Rev. Mr. Dawes, in Hampshire, to whom the cause of education was under such important obligeions, the task would be easy enough. His national school was conducted in such a manner that not only all the children of the parish, but even those out of the parish, attended it; farmers' children and labourers' children sat together, and received the same instruction; and all the inspectors would have to do in such a case would be to report that the education was satisfactory. Where all the inhabitants of a district were of the same religion, they might incorporate religion as much as they pleased; but the cane was different when the population con tained members of various denominations. He did not mean that religious education should not begin till secular education had finished; on the contrary, be meant that they should go on together, continuously and concur- rently; but he could not think that mountains and stars taught infidelity, or winds and waves heresy. He did not wish to press the measure through the House, and would conclude by fixing the next stage after the Easter holidays.—(Hear, hear.) Leave was then given to bring in the Bill. JURISDIC rioN OF COUNTY COURTS. Sir G. PECHELL presented petitions from Brighton in favour of the motion of the Hon. Member for Lewes. Mr. FITZROY having presented petitions in favour of extending the jurisdiction of the County Courts from Berkshire, Birkenhead, Chichester, and Lewes, said, in moving for leave to bring in a Bill to extend the juris diction of the county courts from 201. to 50/., it was not his intention to trespass on the House at any length. The principle for which he contended—namely, cheap access to justice, had been already conceded in the estab lishmen of these county courts. No doubt it was desir able at first that the sum should not be a very large one, in order that sufficient experience might be obtained of the working of these courts ; but he believed that it was within the knowledge of any gentleman who knew anything of the subject that the results had been most satisfactory to all parties interested in the working of these courts.—(Hear, hear.) Indeed the public had already given its verdict in favour of these courts—(Hear, hear)—for it was known that the number of suits that had been already brought into these courts, although they had been only three years in existence, amounted to considerably more than I,ooo,ooo.—(Hear, hear.) The proportion the suits in these courts bore to the suits tried in the courts of Westminster Hall was not less than four to one. The great objection that he understood would be urged against the motion he was about to sub m it to t h e H ouse was, that it would affect the interests of the legal pro fession; and he had no doubt that their profits would be considerably diminished. Although of course he hail no wish to see the profits of aey class of men reduced, yet it was desirable that they should n o t g i ve such encouragement to the heaping up of legal expenses as would i be a practical denial of justice to a large number of the community. All he asked of the House was to extend to the creditor of 501. the same protection that was already extended ;to the creditor of 201. He would mention one or two cases to show the inconvenience of limiting the jurisdiction of those courts to 201. There . was now be fore the court at Colchester a person on his petitition as an insolvent. Ile was the plaintiff in an action—his cause was at the bottom of the list, and he and his wit nesses had been kept there a whole ,week. The conse quence was, that although he got a verdict for 32/., the amount Qf his demand, With 1304 costs, and although he. LONDON, WEDNESDAY EVENING, was a successful plaintiff, he was a loser to the amount of 301., the costa having amounted to 1801.; and, in ad dition to that, the cost of an interpleader, which was 30/. more, reinced him to the condition of an insolvent Was it, desirable that he should be told to surrender 12/. of his debt because the county court had only jurisdiction in cases of 201.? The next case was that of a suceesful defendant, the question being whether the plaintiff had or had not sold to him a certain quantity of chemical prerarations. lle was ii succesful defendant to the amount of 50/., but his costs amounted to 80/., and the plaintiff told him that the law-suit had cost him 300/. —(heir, hear.) The last ease he should men tion was one in which the plaintiff, although he re covered the full amount he claimed, lost 591. I Is. 2d. The only real objection that could be made to his pro position was, why should they stop at 501.—why not at once make the sum unlimited? So fsr as he was concerned he should be at once prepared to assent to that, but he believed there must be some arbitrary limit. His reason for proposing a limit of 501. was, that he should thereby get the support of many Hon. Members who would not otherwise support him. He appealed to the House to ask any respectable solicitor whether he would advise his client to go into one of the superior courts of law to recover 50/. He believed nothing was of more frequent occurrence at present than to have the amount of the claim reduced so as to bring it within the jurisdiction of the county court. The Hon. Gentleman referred to the remarks of a morning paper on the subject of the local courts in India in corroboration of his views, and also to the observations made by the Attorney. General in the course of the last session, when he (Mr. Fitzroy) proposed a similar measure to the present. The objee• lion then taken was, that there should be an appeal. He begged to say that the present Bill did contain classes for the purpose of giving an appeal.—(Hear.) With regard to the objections urged by Sir G. Grey on a previous occasion, he would remind the Right Hon. Baronet that it was not so much speedy justice which these courts secured, as it was the affording the poor but honest defendant an opportunity of paying the debt by instalments. The Hon. Gentleman concluded by moving for leave to bring in his Bill. The ATTORNEY-GENERAL said, as it seemed to be the wish of the House to receive the Bill of the Hon. Gentleman, he should not interpose any objection to its introduction.—(Hear, hear.) He felt it his duty, how ever, although he believed he was taking an unpopular course, to point out the objections he entertained to the principle of the Hon. Gentleman's measure. The cases referred to by the Hon. Gentleman of sums of 32/. and 421, would be equally applicable to sums of MI. and 52/., and it might to-morrow be urged as a hardship that these also could not be recovered in the county courts.— (Hear.) The sum of 20/. had been fixed upon after very long and earnest consideration, and there were the strongest possible reasons for fixing the maximum at that sum; 201. had been laid down by the judges of the superior courts as the sum fur which a man could not b e arrested— that was fixed as the sum which was unworthy theex penses of litigation. The measure, as it at present stood, had been in operation two or three years, and had given, he believed, very general satisfaction. What effect the extension of the jurisdiction might have in enabling parties to obtain an extension of credit, by th e f ac ili t i es of recovering it would hold out, remained to be seen. At present the county courts were little more than an experiment, and he urged the House not to interfere with them unnecessarily. If an appeal was given in the higher courts, he apprehended the law woald not w or k satisfactorily. Again, there was the right of examining the plaintiff and defendant on their oaths—that might work very well with regard to small amounts, but in larger sums he feared it would be too much for the honesty of the parties. If an appeal was once given in , all cases above 201. they would destroy their efficacy, and they would dissatisfy the large body of suitors who came before that 'court to recover smaller sums, by showing that there was a different law for the poor and the rich. It would, in his opinion, shake the confidence of the public, and violate the principle on which they were established. In his posi tion ho could have no personal feeling or interest in the matter. At the same time he did not mean to object to the introduction of the Bill; but he could not pledge himself to give it his sanction at any future stage. He thought the principle the Hon. Member wanted to intro duce was a most dangerous one, and unless th e y h ear d some better arguments than had been urged by the Hon. Gentleman that night he hoped the House would not be induced to adopt the Bill. Sir G. PECHELL said, originally no one Was so strenuous an advocate of the measure as the Hon. and Learned Member for Chester. When he had introduced a measure for the purpose of extending the jurisdiction of the Sheriff's Court to 501.; the present Lord Chan cellor had supported him, and Baron Rolfe had assisted him in introducing it. The fact of many parties aban• doning a portion of their claims in order to bring the debt within the jurisdiction of these county courts was the best proof' of the estimation in which they were held, and the popularity they enjoyed. He hoped the Hon. Member would be successful in carrying his measure. Mr. CLAY supported the Bill. The Hon. Gentleman had not stated whether he was to extend the appeal ts) all debts, or to those only above 201. He did not think the additional burden thrown upon the superior courts by these appeals would be of so much consequence a that great weight of business that world be taken elf these courts by the transference of business to the county courts. Mr. HENLEY regretted to find that the Hon. and Learned Attorney• General had given his sanction to the introduction of the Bill. It would be only consuming another night in discussing its principle, if the Govern ment was prepared to throw it out at a fature stage. It was admitted on all hands that these courts ha l worked extremely well, and so sure as the sun was in the hea ♦ens, if they extended their jurisdiction they would de stroy their utility. It was on that ground that he opposed the measure. He wished to know whether Hon. Mem bers who were disposed to do away with imprisonment fir debt for all sums under 201. were disposed to extend it to 501., or to all sums? If they did so where were they to stop? He regretted, under these circcmstances, that if the Government had a strong objection to the Bill they had not at once thrown it out. Sir G. GREY had great doubts as to the expediency of extending the jurisdiction of those courts. He had last year stated the grounds on which he objected to ex tending the sum from 20/. to 501. Mr. FITZROY—That Bill was without an appeal. Sir G. GREY admitted that there was that differ ence, and it was impossible also to deny that there was a strong feeling in the country in favour of the exten sion of the jurisdiction.—(Hear, hear.) The difficulties, however, that beset the question would be best seen when they had the Bill before them, complicated as it was by the proposition for an appeal and the admission of a bar, and the other attendant circumstances of ordinary courts of law. The principle of these courts was only com patible with the a ',indication of small stakes. He should be curious to see what was the extent of the appeal which the Hon. Member proposed to give. If the appeal was to go to the superior courts, the whole value of these jurisdictions would cease. He entertained grave doubts as to the policy of disturbing the present arrange ment, because he believed that any step of the kind they t iolt would utterly destroy the value and utility of that system of jurisdiction. Lord I). STUART was glad the Government did not intend to oppose the Bill, and that they were to have an opportunity of discussing its principle more at length. lie hoped that in a future stage it might find more fa vour in their eyes. He considered it exceedingly de sirable that the jurisdiction of these courts should be ex tended. Ile found, by returns that had been laid before the House, that the proportion of cays under 20/. and between 201. and 50/, tried in the superior courts of London and Middlesex, was extremely small, and that was a strong argument in favour of the extension of the jurisdiction. He regretted the Government had not taken up the question. But if his Hon. Friend did not succeed he hoped he would move for a Committee of inquiry into the whole of the subject, which was one deserving the serious attention of the House. Mr. H. BERKELEY took very much the view of the Attorney-General with regard to the effect of the pro posed measure. He feared that the extension of the ju risdiction of these courts would materially affect their utility and value. It was very doubtful whether it would be possible to admit the bar to such a court without first altering the nataro of the judges. He trusted that the Government would not yield an inch from the position taken up by the Attorney-General. Mr. MULLINGS, as a retired practical lawyer, would give his cordial support in favour of bringing in the Bill. Ho did not, however, agree with the lion. Mover, that all the great expenses incidental to the superior courts went into the pockets of the attorneys. The pleadings alone were enormous to bring the case to an issue. The parties went down to the assizes with all their wit nesses, having previously given enormous fees to their counsel. They were then often obliged to wait for seve ral days before the cause could bo tried. For all these proceedings the attorney did not get one farthing beyond the money he expended; and at last he, perhaps, had the pleasure of recovering .50/., after having incurred an expenditure of 601. or 701., while the unhappy plaintiff had probably to pay 401. or 501. by the way of extra costs. He thought that these county courts had conferred the greatest benefit upon the country, and that benefit would be considerably increased by extending the jurisdiction of them to claims of 501. He hoped that the proposed measure would also go so far as to bring in equitable matters, which in the ordinary course of things did not come within the cognisance of a court of law. He did not think that there would be any difficulty in allowing appeals, provided tho party so appealing was required to give security for costs. Mr. J. WILLIAMS said it was not an uncommon thing in the trade to which he belonged to sue persons owing 30/. or 351. i n th e county cou rts, the clai mants t h us consenting to aband on th e excess over 201., in or d er to render it recoverabl e i n th at wa y. But the eff ec t o f t hi s was to give encouragement to fraudulent debtors to refuse payment until they were compelled by these courts, being thus assured of being able to get rid of their liabilities in an easy way. Great injustice would be done t o a ll such claimants if the jurisdiction of these courts was nut increased. Leave was then given to bring in the Bill. BRICKS AND TIMBER DUTIES. Mr. HUME then rose to move that this House, taking into consideration the condition of the cottages of the labourers of this kingdom, and the want of adequate accommodation for their families, is of opinion that a drawback should in future be allowed on the bricks and timber employed in the construction of cot tages the rent of which shall be under 41. per annum, as a means of lessening the expanse of their erection. He hoped that the same unanimity as had existed in the discussion upon the previous question would prevail in the consideration of the present motion. Early in that session he took en opportunity of reminding the Go vernment that if they had any money to spare it might be applied with great advantage in such a way as to give elTe..t to such a proposition as the present. Much to the credit of the House and the country a strong dis position was manifested recently to pay attention to the comfort and to the health of the hitherto-neglected poor and working classes. With that view a board of health had been appointed to remove every nuisance affecting the health of the community. Local Acts were also passed for the purpose of attaining this desirable object. As, fur example, an Act was passed for Liver pool to prevent the occupation of apartments below the surface of the ground. They had re ceived reports from every part of the country as to the manner in which the working people were lodged. These went to show that the most valuable portion of the community—the labouring classes—upon whom, after all, the prosperity of the country depended, had been neglected in a great degree by the Govern ment, who had the direction of everything that affected their health and comfort. The expense of building cot tages was so great as seriously to endanger the moral and social condition of the people. He had visited within the last two months many of the cottages of the labouring classes, and be found in some of them families of eleven and twelve children brought up without any separation so reeeesary far the promotion ef decency and morality. Speaking generally, he was informed that there was a duty of ten per cent. levied upon the value of hrieks. When they looked at tl; e dwellings of the poor they could scarcely blame the father of the fi rmly for withdrawing from it occasionally to seek for ereater comfort, which was afforded him in the public house. Ile was thus induced t o s p en d hi s money upon intoxicating drinks, leaving his family destitute and unhappy. There were from 26,000,000 to 30,000,000 gallons of ardent spirits consumed by the popula tion. This enormous consumption could only be ac counted for by the fact that there was no inducement to the working man to remain at home, for he had no comfort or enjoyment at his own fireside. The poverty and uncomfortable state of his hou-e tended to alienate the man from his abode, and to leave his family desti tute. At the early part of the session he put in a word for these classes. It was well known that many poor men who earned but 9s. or 10t. a week could not afford to pay more for their lodging than Is. a week. It was also well known that one of their little cottages could not be built for 501. or 60L He wished the duty to be re moved from bricks altogether. He was satisfied that if this duty were removed the benefit would not be con fined to the poorer classes; the advantages would be felt by all classes. By the return which he held in his hand it would appear that the amount of duty received for the last ten years from bricks was, on an average, 481,3181. a year from England, and 13,4401. from Scot land. He did not wish to limit his observations altogether to bricks, for it was of equal importance to the health and comfort of the people that the window duty should be removed; and he was sorry that his Noble Friend (Lord Duncan) had not had an opportunity of bringing forward the question that night. The Government, in their endeavours to carry out their sanitary mea sures, ought to see that these duties upon windows and bricks were calculated to thwart and stop that progress that they would otherwise make in the im provement of the health and condition of the people. Looking at the low wages, and the want of comforts among the working-classes, he was astonished they were able to manage as well as they did. The removal of this and other taxes would add greatly to their comforts. On this ground he hoped the House would express its opinion in favour of his motion. Upon the question being put, Mr. LABOUCHERE said, the Hon. Gentleman had frankly stated what was the intention of this motion— namely, to elicit the opinion of the House as to the duty on bricks; and that the duty on timber was, to use his metaphor, in the same boat. Now it was deemed right not to pledge the House to any particular remission un til they had heard the financial statement of his Right Hon. Friend. But if the House were not of that opinion, he said he would oppose the motion on the terms in which his Hon. Friend had stated in his mo tion. Who was to define what cottages cost? He had seen them built at great expense, and which certainly could have no claims for exemption. He thought in a case of this kind there ought not to be a drawback, because if granted it would open the door to a great deal of fraud. If there were, too, a drawback upon timber for cottages, then they would be asked for a draw back upon timber used in ship-building and in mines.— (Hear, hear.) Then he doubted very much the policy of encouraging the building of a low class of cottage. He mentioned these things to show what caution should be used in cases of this description.—(Hear, hear.) As to the remission of duties on bricks and timber, it would be contrary to his duty on this occasion to express his opinion. Until the announcement was made by his Right Honourable Friend in his financial statement he would not pronounce an opinion one way or another, and he said it would be premature for the House to de clare its opinion as to a remission of taxation on any particular matter. This motion was on its own merits inexpedient, and ought not to be adopted; he, therefore, opposed the motion. Mr. DRUMMOND thought the conduct which it was proper for a Minister of the Crown to pursue in such a case a: this was not that which was most proper for a Member of the House to adopt. When the financial statement had beets made, then Ministers would say that the case was then made up—that it was then too late to listen to any other proposal.—(Hear.) He believed it was not the intention of the House to do injustice to the poorer classes—that when injustice was done it was be cause the House was not aware that it was doing injustice. (Hear.) If the relief now asked for were granted, he admitted that it would not be universally felt, because it would be of no use in the northern and other parts of the country, where there were abundance of mate rials for building; there were, however, other parts of tie country, and especially those with which he was best acquaint .d, on which this relief would confer a very great beusfir. A gentleman anxious to build cottages for the poor could not do so at a less expense than 1001. each. In such places, a tradesman from a neighbouring town could build the same sort of cottage, let it for 10/., and the occupier made the rent by letting the rooms to whole families, and thus, while the gentry were endea vouring to give three rooms to each family, the plan was destroyed by some adjeining tradesman. In consequence of lessening the size of farms, he foresaw that there must be a very great increase of farm buildings. Now, much expense was caused in building by the high price of bricks. The tax increased the price of bricks by two thirds. In some places the benefit would be very small, in other cases it would be very great. He hoped in sup porting this motion there would b e no sneer aga i nst him and others of having ulterior nr.:tives, in voting for a repeal of the tax, which they would vote for, because they conceived it would be an essential relief to the agriculturists. Now, he vot al for this, though he did not vote with the Noble Lord against the window duty— they must have hou ses — t h ere was no use in windows without houses.—(L aug h ter. ) He would oppose the remission of any tax w hi c h did not b ear d i rectly upon the working classes. He said he did not want to em barrass the Government; but he said if they wanted money, let them not take their taxes from the poverty of the country.—(Hear.) Mr. BET° supported the motion. He could point out cases where 20 persons were found occupying two rooms. He believed the remission of the duty on bricks would put an end to this evil. Until it was at an end there could be no classification of the poorer classes. Lord C. HAMILTON was glad the Hon. Member for Montrose had brought this subject before the House; he only regretted he bud not brought it forward in a more comprehensive manner. There was no question that more materially affected the well-being of the work ing classes than this. Mr. MITCHELL said, if the Hon. Member should go to a division on this subject, he would support it. He differed in the opini on th at h a d b een ex p resse d on this subject by the Right Hon, the Presideut of the Board of Trade, that such motion should not be brought forward until the statement of the Chancellor of the Exchequer bad been made, and no proposal for a remission of tax ation submitted to the consideration of the House until then. At the present moment a drawback was allowed on all timber used in the erection of churches; and he did not apprehend that, with a vigilant control, there would be any danger cf fraud if a drawback were also allowed upon bricks. Should the lion. Member for Montrose again bring forward his motion, however, he trusted that be would give the, House some idea how fraud was to be avoided. Being of opinion that a good case existed for a revision of this tax, he should sup port the motion of his Hon. Friend. Mr. R. PALMER agreed with Lord C. Hamilton upon the prudence of not pressiug this motion at this moment. But he was strongly of opinion that it would be exceedingly advantageous to repeal the duty upon bricks altogether, and that such a measure would be quite as useful as a repeal of the window-tax.—(Hear.) It' the Hon. Member intended to confer a benefit upon the owners and occupiers of small cottages, he would be doing so to a much greater extent by proposing the total repeal of the duty upon bricks than by this proposition for allowing a drawback. Mr. HEY WORTH supported the motion, and ob• served that he thought this discussion would lead, ulti mately, into a general revision of the duty upon every article that entered into the consumption of the people. Mr. HUME, in reply, said that his object had been to ascertain the opinion of the House, and it appeared that that opinion was decidedly in favour of an entire and total repeal of the duty.—(Hear, hear.) He was not much in the habit of proposing half measures, and in doing so in the present instance he must confess hear.) Thethat he had signally tailed.—(Laughter and hear, lion Gentleman then intimated that, with the leave of the House, he would withdraw his motion. Motion withdrawn accordingly. MANAGEMENT OF RAILWAY TRAFFIC. Mr. RICARDO moved for leave to bring in a Bill for the better regulation of railway traffic. The H on. Me mber briefly alluded to the numerousinconveniences which were attendant upon the present system; the want of uniformity of tolls—the danger incurred by the pas sengers in having to change carriages upon their journey —the mariner in which the " points" were worked at the junctions, and other evils and inconveniences; and said that the object of his Bi4l was to provide an efficient remedy with which lion. Members might make them selves acquainted immediately upon the Bill being printed.—Leave given. Viscount EMLIN moved f r leave to bring in a Bill to amend the laws relating to highways in South Wales. Mr. C. LEWIS admitted that there did exist certain reasons why the highways in South Wales should be under a separate system of management, and being of that opinion ho would not oppose the motion of the Noble Lord.—Leave given. EXTRA-MURAL INTERMENTS. Mr. LACY moved for leave to bring in a Bill for pro moting extra-mural interments. The lion. G e ntleman said he dared say some Hon. Members would be startle(, at his project; but the proposition was simply to ow railway companies, with th e sa n c tion of the Railway Commissioners, t o hold cemeteries. lie proposed that, after having obtained the approbation of the share holders and the Commissioners, these companies should be empowered to pur c hase a sufficient quantity of waste land at a convenient distance, say twenty-five or thirty miles, from the metropolis, and thereon construct a ce metery, lie yr as onTinced OM ;10 ciao general come- FEBRUARY 27, 1860 Motion withdrawn. Tho orders of the day were then read:— FIRST DIVISION. Lord Chancellor MARQUISES. Breadalbane Clanricarde Donegal Devon Grey Granville 111nto Strafford Waldegrave BARONS. Ashburton Campbell Colborne PAIRS. EARLS. Besborough Carlisle Charlemont Craven Lord De Freyne Earl of Suffolk Lord Milford Marquis of Anglesey Lord Dufferin tery would be sufficient for the metropolis; and that by giving the different companies this power, it would t e for the public benefit, at the Fame time that the compa nies themselves would find it to be a good commercial speculation.—( Laughter.) Sir G. GREY had not very clearly collected the real purport of the Bill of the Hon. Gentleman from the ex planation which he had given; but, in principle, he thought that to empower railway companies to become cemetery companies was most objectionable. As the whole question must come before Parliament at a very early period, when the report of the Board cf Health would be before them, he trusted the Honourable Gen tleman would not for the present persevere with his Bill.—(Hear.) Lord ASHLEY said that last year the duty was en trusted to the Board of Health of preparing a scheme for the consideration of Parliament on this subject, and that that scheme had been prepared. But he was sorry that it was not yet in the hands of Hon. MemberF. It would be ready in a few days, however—he hoped to morrow or Thursday morning —and until it was before them he thought the House should not proceed with the consideration of the Bill of the Hon. Member for Bodrnin. Mr. LACY merely wished to bring i❑ his Bill, in order that it might be seen and considered side by side with the report of the Board of Health. He believed that the House would find, upon consideration, that without such a measure as he proposed they would never be axle to carry out any compul.ory Act for preventing int rments in cities and towns.—(llear, hear.) Mr. WYLD was surprised that the Home Secretary should have opposed the introduction of a measure of this kind. He thought his Bill would not clash with any recommendation which was likely to emanate from the Board of Health. He therefore moved for leave to bring i❑ this Bill. Mr. LABOUCEIERE said it was always an ungra cious task to oppose a Bill on the motion for leave to bring it in; and it was so i❑ this case, especially where the Hon. Gentleman had directed great attention to the subject. The Hon. Gentleman had done him the honour to convey information to him from time to time as to the objects he had in view, but he telt it so be a duty ho owed to the House, as the result of that information, to say that he thought the House ought not to allow this Bill to be brought in. He thought the Bill was founded on principles which the House never could sanction. He was opposed to thrusting upon the Railway Commis sioners Inactions which were so foreign to their sphere of operations. He really thought there was no chance of the Bill passing a second reading. Mr. AGLIONBY did not think the Bill was open to the objections which had been stated by the Right Hon. Gentleman. He begged to ask the Hon. Gentleman whether there was any compulsive powers to take land, or whether the powers were permissive only ? If the powers given were only permissive, why wait for the re port of the Board of Health? Hitherto in all legisla tion on the subject they had been bound by considera tions of pounds, shillings, and pence, and the interests of those who were to receive burial tees. Mr. LACY said his object was to make the major part of the powers compulsory, the minor powers might be taken as compulsory. _ _ Mr. M. J. O'CONNELL thought that the report of the Sanitary Commissionera should be laid before the House before any measure of the kind was brought in. He thought the Hon. Gentleman would best consult the convenience of the House by postponing the motion till the report of the Commissioners, which the Noble Lord the Member for Bath bad stated would be on the table in a few days, was fairly before the House and the country. Ax :EloN. MEMBER hoped the lion. Gentleman would not divide. After a few words in explanation from Sir G. GREY, The motion was withdrawn. THE BOARD OF TRADE. Mr. MOFFATT moved for an address to her Ma jesty for a return showing the names of the members c , f her Majesty's Privy Council constituting the Committee appointed for the consideration of matters relating to trade and foreign plantations ; the functions of the said Committee ; the number of members of said Committee that constitute a quorum for the dispatch of business ; the number of times the Committee met in the twelve months ending Dec. 31, 1849 ; and the number cf mem bers of said committee that attended each meeting. This motion was made on account of the present alarm which prevailed in consequence of the new and extensive powers assumed by the Board of Trade. Groat anxiety was felt to know what really ware the functions of the Board of Trade. Mr. LABOUCHERE said if he objected to this motion ho assured the lion. Gentleman it was not from any wish to refuse the information required. But no Parliamen tary grounds had been made fur the production of this return. He could give the names of those who consti tuted the Board of Trade, and everybody knew that the Court Circular would give this information. The lune _ . tions of the board had been fully described by Mr. John Leferre, and he (Mr. Labouchere) objected to give the information in the shape of a return. It was not the practice of the board to transact business as a board, though it included numerous members of the Privy Council, &c. The usual course of business was trans acted on the single responsibility of the head of the department. _ _ 'Mr. MOFFATT said that after what bad fallen from ;he Right lion. Gentleman he was satisfied. COMMONS ENCLOSURE BILL Read a third time and passed. PROCESS ANI) PRACTICE (IRELAND)-SALA RIES ANI) COMPENSATION BILL. Committee thereon. Howe resumed. lieport to be received tn-morrow (this day). Mr. FOX brought up the Sccuhr Education Bill, which was read a first time. The House was adjourned at Twelve o'clock. ECCLESIASTICAL COMMISSION BILL. HOUSE OF LORDS, FEB. 25. The following is a list of the blinolities on the Fccleii astical Commission Bill : BAUONS. Dunally Eddisbury Elphinstone Foley donteagle Saye and See Sudeley Wodehouse Wrottesley Marquis of Salisbury Marquis of Londonderry Lord 1)e Lisle Earl Somers Lord 1)e Ros SECOND DIVISION. Lord Chancellor EARLS. MARQUISES. Granville Dunally Breadalbane Grey Elphinstono Clanricarde 3liMto Foley Donegal Strafford Saye and Sale EARLS. Waldegrave Sudeley Charlemont BARONS. Wodebouse Carl.sle Campbell Wrottesley PAIRED AFTER THE FIRST DIVISION. Lord Monteagle Earl of Cardigan Lord Colborne Lord Walsingham Lord Eddisbury Earl of 3lalniesuury BARONS. TO THE SECRETARY OF THE BRADFORD REFORNI ASSOCIATION. Sir,—On Monday the 25th, an extraordinary scene was enacted in the House of Commons, by the persevering opposition of the anti-Ministerial side to the progress in Committee, of the Bill fir increasing the number of voters in Ireland. The ground stated, was the absence of some Members at the Irish As sizes. Of course each side thought it was taking a prudent course ; though the prevailing opinion seems to be, that eight divisions with increasing majorities on the part of the Government, ranging as high as 2i to 1, were a charitable mode of doing away with any damage which might have been received from ,the smallness of the majority on a preceding evening. The result, however, was, that not one step was gained towards the progress of the Bill. If any body in Ireland is disappointed, he must set it down to the politicians who could not stir a step without their men at the Assizes. In the early part of the evening, the Government made some damaging admissions, received with shouts of laughter by the House, on the subject of not issuing the pieces called florins. If the Government had their wits about them when they withdrew from the coins a stupid phrase, con demned long since by the good sense of our ancestors, why did not they stand to it, and who were the parties before whom they quailed ? If they knew they had not the courage to resist the outcry which bigots and serviles might raise, why did they volunteer the occasion? It is this building of walls to run their own heads against, which has ever been characteristic of the Liberals in the Go vernment. But if the Government have no plan, their enemies have. It is all portion of a scheme for representing them as what the bigots call " godless," and so proceeding from less to more, for the chance of any retrogression towards the illumination of the middle ages. On Tuesday a motion for removing the duty on Attorneys' Certificat es was postponed, i n a way which was not considered as favourable to ultimate success. The hardship in this case appears to be, that a particular class should be subjected to a duty on the exercise of their calling, when they pay all the other taxes to which members of the community are sub ject. The plea sometimes urged, that they throw the duty on their employers, is of the ordinary class of fallacies with which questions of the incidence of tax ation are encumbered. The motion of the Member for Oldham for leave to bring in a Bill for the promotion of Secular Educa tion, was successful :o the fullest extent. A result undoubtedly to be attributed to the able and con ciliatory manner in which its introduction was con ducted by the mover. I am, Sir, your obedient servant, AN OLD REFORMER. London, 27th February, 1850. GENERAL STEAM NAVIGATION COMPANY.---The 50th half-yearly general meeting of this Corporation was held vest-relay at their offices, 71, Lombard-street; John Wilkin, Esq., i❑ the chair. The directors' report and a statement of the accounts of the half-year ending the 31st December last, were read to the meeting. The report having been unanimously adopted by the proprie tors, the usual dividend and boaus were declared, when the meeting separated, highly gratified with the you tiuttin prooperity of the C9raPtiDY. FROM THE LONDON GAZETTE OF TUESDAY. BANKRUPTS. Abraham Wheeler, cabinetmaker, Buckingham, to surrender March 12, at half-past eleven, and April 11, at one, at th e C ourt of Bankruptcy. Johnson, official "signee, Basinglaall-street ; Shuckburgh Risley, Doughty-street, Mecklenburgh-square. James Starkey, carpenter, Old-street, St. Luke's, March 12, at two, and April 16, at eleven, at the Court of Bankruptcy. Edwards, official assignee, Sambrook court, Basinghall.strcet ; Hine and Robinson, Charter house-square. Charles Joseph Carttar, solicitor, Greenwich, March 12, at twelve, and March 26, at eleven, at the Court of Bankruptcy. Stansfeld, official assignee ; Nias, Cop thall-court, Throgmorton-street. John Berryhill Cross, watch maker, Cornhill, March 16, at one, and April 13., at ele ven , at the Court of Bank ruptcy. Johnson, official assignee, Basinghall-street; hemp, Henrietta-street, Covent-gar& n . John Dale Woodcock, cateLderer, Leecis,,March 12, at twelve, and Apra 9, at eleven, at the Leeds District Court. Hope, official a,:ignee, Leeds; Middleton, Leeds, George Matthews, music teller, Monmouth, March 12 and April 9, at eleven, at the Bristol Dif,+.rict Court. Aura:min, offiAal assignee, Bristol ; Nicholas, Mon mouth; Bevans, Bristol. Loui, Bernard Chaffin, bookseller, Bristol, March 12 and April 9, at eleven, at the 13ristol District Court. Miller, official assignee, Bristol; Strangways, King'._ road, Gray's Inn; Whitington and Gribble, Bristol. DIVIDENDS. In the Country. _ _ L. Elliott, jur., Rochdale, Lancashire, chemist and druggist, March 21 , at twelve, at the Court, Manchester —S. 'Taylor, Poynton, Chester, butcher, March 21, at eleven, at the Court. Manchester. PAYMENT OF DIVIDENDS. 11. G. Astle, 6s. 4d.. on Feb. 28, or any subsequent Thursday, between a even and two, at the office of Mr. Pennell, Guildhall-chamber:, Basingball-street. E. Mumford, 55., on Thursday, Feb. 2S, or any subse quent Thursday, between eleven and two, at the office of Mr. Pennell, Guildhall-chambers, Basinghall-street. L. Alexander and W. Bardgett, first and second divi dends of 2s. 2d. and 6d., on new proofs, on Thursday. Feb. 28, or any succeeding Thursday, between eleven and two, at the office of Mr. Pennell, Guildhall-cham bers, Basinghall-street. R. F. M'Queen, is. O'd., on Thursday, Feb. 28, or any subsequent Thursday, between eleven and two, at the offiee of Mr. Pennell, Guildhall-chambers, Basing hall -street. W. 11. Trencher, ss. 10d., on Thursday, Feb. 98, or any subsequent Thursday, between eleven and two, at the office of Mr. Pennell, Guildhall-chamberr, Basing hall-street. W. Minton, Is. Sid. on Thursday, Feb. 28, or any subsequent Thursday , eleven and two, at the office of Mr. Pennell, Guildhall-chambers, Basinghall. street. J. Parrish, did., on Thursday, Feb. 28, or any subse quent Thursday, between eleven and two, at the office of Mr. Pennell, Guildhall•chambers, Basingball-street. G. W. Wheelhouse, York, banker, 35., on Tuesday, Feb. 26, or any subsequent Tuesday, between eleven and two, at the (Ace of Mr. HeFe, Leeds. E. Ryder, Birmingham, jeweller, Bs., on any Friday, between eleven and three, at the office of Mr. Whitmore, Birmiagham. NOTICES OF CERTIFICATES. At the Court, Basinghall-street. L. Davy, King-street-terrace, New North-road, and J. Davy, South-street, New North-road, builders, March 22, at half-past one—R. Jones, Castle -street, Holborn, commission agent, March 21, at eleven—W. Tyer, Gos port, boot and shoe maker, March 20, at twelve. In the Country. J. Dixon, Liverpool, grocer and tea dealer, March 21, at eleven, at the Court, Liverpool—J. R. Wright, Leeds, currier, March 21, at eleven, at the Court, Leeds—B. Ramsden, Dewsbury, Yorkshire, bone merchant, March 21, at eleven, at the Court, Leeds—G. M. Cowley, Not tingham, bill broker, March 22, at ten, at the Court Not tingham—J. Bowers, J. Bowers, and Sarah Ann Bowers, Worcester, grocers, March 2.5, at twelve, at the Court, Birmingham. CERTIFICATES GRANTED. F. Burt, Plymouth, boardinghouse keerer, bookseller, and stationer, certificate of the third class—ll. Pinhey, Plymouth, grocer, certificate of the second class—T. Martin, Nicholas-square, Hackney•road, licensed victu aller, certificate of the second class—J. Reid, Edgware road, Bexley-heath, Woolwich, Rochester, Chatham, and Maidstone, draper—J. Addington, London-real, South wark, oil and colourman and varnish manufaztarer, cer tificate of the first class—W. A. Reeves, Maidstone, cabinet maker and upholsterer, certificate of the first class—J. King and J. F. King, Well-row, Isling•on, huilders—E. L. Blackman, Lombard-street, tailor—J. Morrison, Craven-street, Strand, tailor, certificate c f the first class—R. Belson, Norwich, plumber and elaizer, certificate of the third class—J. Ward, Bishopsgate Within, chemist and druggist, certificate of the second class—H. Bennett, Chatham, corn dealer, certitir a'e of the second clays—J. Turnbull, Scarborough, Yorkshire, linen and woollendraper, certificate of the first class after twenty-one days from Feb. 21—II. Corbett, Madras, merchant and comission agen', certificate of the first class—R. Gibbs, Birmingham, and Northfield, Wor cestershire, corn dealer, certificate of the first class. PARTNERSHIPS DISSOLVED. H. Fawcus, sen., 11. Fawcus, jun., and J. Stephenson, Seaham, Durham, ship brikets—T. Boughey and L Allkins, Newport, Shropshire, bendware and turnery manufacturers—J. Laycock and J. N. Hanson, hueup, Lancashire, iron and brus , founder--11. G. S. Borth wick and G. A. Wilson, Newcastle-open -Tyne, mer chants—J. Murton and L. Mum's, Sfiardles and Man chester, bleachers—D. Bransfy and W. Nanner, Basiog stroke, corn dealers and millers—A. M‘Connell and A. Forsyth, Monks Coppenhall, Cheshire, drapers—T. Chat•avvay and M. Chattaway, Birmingham, carre-s W. Tucker, sea., W. Tucker, j un , and T. Tucker (so far as regards T. Tucker), hatchet, Buckinghamshire, butchers—Mary Ann Murray and Sarah laort, London wall, ostrich father manufacturers—T. Laycock and J. Jackson, Gate Helmsley, Yorkshire, proprietors of the Gate Helmsley Retreat—F. Wilson arid J. W. Swale, Hanway-street—F. G. Spray and G. Nevett, engineers —T. 11. G. Snowden and L. A. Pollock, Ramsgate, at torneys—W. H. Bensted and C. Higgins, Maidstone, hoymen—E. Tomlinson and S. Cooper, Walsall, Staf fordshire, ironmongers —J. Scatterthwaite and S. Jack son, Ulverstone, Lancashire, ironmongers and grocers-- R. Battersby and J. Telford, Liverpool, ironfosin ders—J. Edwards and E. J. Scruggs, East aireham, Norfolk, painters—J. Baker and W Baker, Bristol, tilers—S. Druce, P. Lord, and J. Sheldon, Ensham, OxfJrdshire, coal merchants —W. Richards, J. Richards, and R. Richards (as far as regards R. Richards), Penzance, mercers and drapers— J. Pickering and G. Alexander, Wilson -street. Fins bury, dyers—H. Ancell and C. Fagg, Norfolk -crescent, Ilyds-park, Grove-road, St. John's-wood, and Church street, Lisson-grove, surgeons—S. Billingsley, jun., W. J. Miall, and 0. J. Williams (so far as regards W. J. Miall), Harwich, shipping agents--J. Hudson and R. Hudson, Hartlepool, Durham, ship brokers—E. IL Junes, W. J. Jones, T. B. Jcnes, R. G. Jones, A. Jones, and T. Jones (so far 9i regards E. H. Jones, W. J. Jones, T. B. Jones, and R G. Junes), Birmingham, iron founders. INSOLVENT PETITIONERS. Henry Phipps, Southnewington, Oxfordshire, gardener. David Thomas, Cardlf, Glamorganshire, paint-r. John Spencer, Loughborough, Leicestershire, horse dealer. Merena Edwards, Were, Shropshire, farmer. John IVildon, Great DritHeld, Yorkshire, tailor. Joseph Nicholson, Gil at Dritfield, Yorkshire, cover. Thomas Grimbly, Stratford-upon-Avon, commercial cle2rk. Frederick Fisher, Snave near Brookland, Kent, farm Robert Palmer, Cullompton, Devonshire. mason. William May, Yatton, Somersetshire, sue tioueer. John Backnell, Hockworthy, Devonshire. John Masons, St. George, Gloucestershire, servant. Walter Carter, Bristol, commission neut. William J. Come, Ct,athaii, tot wsconi.t. William J. Youlton, Bristol, accountant. John Hiekmutt, Rochester. Henry Dawes, Great Malvern, WoreestGrshire, coach proprietor. David Wood, Huddersfield, Slubber. seurca SEQUESTRATIONS. W. Ferric, Anstruther Eastate, Fifeshire, dealer in shares and printseller, to meet within the Albert Hotel, Cupar-Fife, Feb. 28 and March 28, at one. J. Howie, Glasgow, undertaker and carriage hirer, to meet within the Albert Tavern, Glasgow, March 2 and 23, at three. A. Ballantine, Musselburgh, grocer, to meet within the Star Hotel, Edinburgh, March 4 and 22, at two. J. Smart, Elgin, builder, to meet within the Royal Hotel, Elgin. March 4 and 25, at one. J. C. Reddie, Edinburgh, insurance broker and writer to the signet, to meet within the office of Clay and Black, Edinburgh, March 4 and 25, at twelve. Tea /caw NOVEL, by the author of " The Disci pline of Life," entitled "Pride and Irresolution," i s published this day by Mr. Colburn, and may be had at a ll the libraries. Also, 2. The Scottish Coval e ie dit , io by James Grant,;Esq.„author of " The Gordon Highlanders," &e. 3. Adventur e s of a Goldfinder, written by him self. 4. The Petrel, a Tale of the Sea, by a Naval °Meer. 5. The Wilmingsons, by the author of " E m ili a W ynd . Mait landbarn." of s 6 u . P assages nn y Side, writteni o the Life b y herself,of Alrs Margaretsecond 7. Leonard Normandsle; or, The Three Brothers, by. the Ron. C. Stuart Savile. [ADVERTISEMENT.] INTRAMURAL INTERMENTS. —The important report of the Board of Health; the remedies stated and recommended, on which the Bill will le founded for the consideration of Parliament,aero carefully abridged and originated in last Sunday morn ing's Ob.server, to the txtent of four folio columns and a half. The Observer is regularly published, at four o'clock on Sunday morninge, in time for all the earl,T Sunday morning railways. On Sunday next, March 3, the Observer will le printed with an outiro new type, from the foundry of the Messrs. Figgins. Price of the Observer, 40 columns, 6d. [ADVERTISEMENT.J—An Awful Bad Leg. with 15 Wounds in it, Cured by Holloway's Ointment and anHaselbury, Extract of a letter from Mrs. Sarah Eastment ! Pills.-- Extract To Professor Hol near Crewkerne, dated April 16, 1549. manifested themselves in my left leg, w e . i in from thenceCheltenhaml went Hos fula and King's evil, and at one time low a y , Sir—About aboutpitah and m y a n c therei e. there in also ;bey failed to effect a to King's College Hospital, pronounced Fnrfour monthsas your Ointment and Fills in this state I commenced uslng . Sold by all Dru • t cure, and I was obliged to return home a complete cripple; which have perfectly cured my I . !F .., . 2441 ega d % an ee r l e a w b a i s e Ludorti end at Professor Hollows,' ll Z:ltiftllulnleto4