The Sun. — London, England, 1850-08-03 00:00:00

vice) le ad; his vi ew cf staten3eL3l the in". f ' duc ted ild com e of d,tCa=tieeon of Public pro. gledla in him i ll , 8 1 .emar ks o— alluded of eV, bu t u , ~,,p d N ed iiatitic s o n sive pr a l oss t, t it' nrotec = g ar Irpos", ioo diSCU S ' # ( 1 0 f bbleh iuct ° os i t i a b ei rit oy % fi lo a rtieJ " tab l6 '', o d jr .° of to bills ,t Georg' len; g oo , ,igh; to o st been nci b e eo rt bad ri tbe; he 66til d 00 to 6 5O pf 5e 9600 0 6. of Abe 3 o der Il ) es tl e 6 , end ,r '00 64 ,4 tdi. be ri o very fe f ib e o oded reol 1p u e rA litle bt you' d n tbo ,sit llll tb ni ° fro — f ' a bo o re • the stea,,, eet q uer , I,l l e 414 (I° o ri ld r 513° 10 $ tteg' Oti th°-----shh.lect, and he believed he was justified in se e e v i . ne• that_B,6oo/, would be the laet sum required to Fro , . w in e sskaiteble accoestnedetien fur Members. He fif4r°",tie 'lle opieion of the Toed aecommodatio n afforded by the Present house, mad he thought it' the new House gave respect to nieem e re spect much accommedstion they ought to be eonle W for hearing the room better adapted and t t,. 6 ey had examined professors; learned in acoustici, ee result was the subject had been left in a daLleer,ds rhaere perplexed state than before. It was not difficult.a `: tiild oot a in which a pert on from a given place could be heard distinctly —but it was difficult to build . a room is which persons coeld be beard equally Part of the room. It was impossible to say what thewould esele_ren requir e th e well in ever ex. P h e .. l ?'e of experiraents would be, but he hoped they sum named in th e vote. i l r• Alderman HUMPHERY believed that a new -Lou. fare much had b , uperio r to the (ice about thought it a which so herevore i t said, would be built for 10,000/., awl he t complete pece of extravagance to throw sera 8 6 001 con silterate:ns(Hear.) 114 Gaol, of the EXCHEQUER, to a tePlg the proposed alteration s by r,:ference _ /114 1 3 oh the table, Isbell that a large Committee of n , x t p a c_ alto. trialPerieuced Members had eerne to the cone!? e . io e . e ll o ' t sj) 1)141:1 "je ll had been adopted was the bs, al d I,,eling sufficient aeeeminodalio". . hanging a 10,411% LACY suggested ihe propriety of • ti e-1;,14, b er 01 harmers round the wells, and placing .„.., . _ 41 , 43 the . d ou ,f any pel,thtaro win ows, be ore incurring k r s , e the echo in i„..IACIeB remarked that by that means i ,0 i Luther c kneehall Chapel had been completely hr"c . the Ii -t It riAL L Pted• d 'the aceotninodatiou in 0. 4* Ty 4•1°11°0 ld b levP il• • 1•• 'mple. If accamin tieti_ wou ~ sueeeent ,) L of _,_,_ , ~,,b . er . ors h , ,un was provided fur a large body l`. eji ~.,,ll —(Loun (I)"`aido, the debates would g o on equally -- - • for 3')O tattlglittr) There would be room on the flohoreh would .beelia!isers, and in the gallery for 150 more, w he believed t o (i1,11t? SufEcient. The estimate now given that the e lee outsid e t lie would suggest anioue . of the 1 • ahole matt under the control ha , ehief, CO utter be placed °late taanssioner of Woods and Forests, any extra ex dbe res onsibl f deviation or pekiitire.s)Lear. e or any (11 ) he lletlirl3. ostioßNE entertained the steno e ra ll e opinionouse would be most done, that the hearing in th made useful in lotalost un .. perfect. Perhaps it might he lieexhibition of 18 51 "IV or other for the purposes of t if the Chen eelie.--(Laughter.) He wished to khow d termination • tvi t h r 4 the Exchequer had come to Y an determination Chan he to the payment of the architect. —(Hear, the orginal e oet ; elle had no scruple in saying that Mr. Berry teOet with Mr. Barry had been broken. Now he should i lk Nen the House . to Pay him 75,000 L ire ?.... fe e to se h Bwas to rece ([l iar h w 0w much Mr. Barry f the Exchequer ke4o; ear-) Did the Cancellor o . _ , , ? II , ar hear.) ke 419 par-) t hat, or enter into a lawsuit --( and more, kelt° leved Alr: Barry could claim that sum his tame when he we ()De could blatne him for indulging it to the Chan eeibra allowed to do so. 110 would P ut , , iet not be better r e fi r af the Exehequer whether it would r quits with i; 5 , 5 .2tir. Barry 15 00004 at once and c__Yoo. II Member f or 'r (aghter. L ) He differed from the l placing the affair hi tiZryleeone as to the propriety ofP a The best and btheaPostantis °f ~.. the Woods and Forests. officer to ma t 4 th e , ea, would be to appoint a paid slid 1109 iness(Hcar.) of sitting is tl 4R believtd that on the last day in different 1)411 11 1 -vv lI ° I W, the facilities for hearing to,,,ad been greatly increased.—Hear. mmodation tor rd k GROSVENOR believed the acco opinion the Zellabere would be sufficient, but was of . in- Sof ,`-srachodition for strangers was altogether ,41ritt--(Ilear) Lord that laft e f 1' --(Ilea„ did not agree with the Noble . ,or mem. lees, etlt a.ceenaaaodation had been provided 1 the debates opt h 4 Pthr to the election of 1841, during 600 Members * ere Tarri'll Registration Bill, more than bagkrcil,,scot on several occasions. b'Am"tENE inquired if any practical inconvenience et e l l e felt from the present House being too small? , eta 69„,813011NE--Yes.—(Elear.) little ineon ooitoe "e,ENE said that perhaps some the ordi• !kr ) , I 8 g h o ps occasionally felt; bat f•ur lirße 4,,,csactof business he considered It sufficiently Members, bitere.b"tic present House would seat 440 , r . ,„.41 , , - A " 4 ,1 new House would sent 468.—(11c,a ) a a 468.—(Hear.) the ee,,' -eelertnen ammenEley contended etight s tate of the House encouraged vice,—(Loud t Letiii,et)--beeause when some Members were una themselves ell ' t eels th e • and amused 114 t eole ner... y went upstair!. I r others went into the kart', 0 B,(feetigliter)7whi s- One Hon. Ober sad le'P.—(Centinued laughter.) should be it-vide:l f-'4,.alielgested that accommodation. Did the Hon. e ieb • r 'net/Libel's outside the House. 1)1 until th or intend h •in Palace-yard 0411, t eta to remain 1 ~h ter.) After I tt o oet en ', 4 ,:ig for a division ?—(Gress etl eiable to think „et rel ',000,0, it was most discreditable seated, and 'gat they tint-half the Members could be hear.) Sh,,,c ester half must remain outside.—(Hear , _ 0 was tilt, "14LL ' Abercrombie - httitto Speak said that when Mr. practice for Mem s to h into ein 1835 it was not the occasion 310 voted in su the lobbies. On that le Nee were all told iiihe protand 316 en the other, and theyy s caleniated to ItZkeiodse,ht I,l9use. The new House than the ilitc ~,, face , or sixty more Members 41 'knelt!. tig, r ' said if he recollected ks:e, , neemptiEety "Ayes e ee tltM he e, I%l cs " went out, and the 11:0Z°1/4 11 °.) hearing in tbe prhee othorlio4o al OHNE thought the the hearing i n t .. th e b l t or he i a l lost as defective as Chancellor of the last f Aoli t 1 W Put a question to I e—(Loud hi te r) without receiving any , rep Y uer hear 14 ' P .0 th 4 Chaecellor of the Excheq, le Ill:'J'Qiilinued laughter.) 1..1). AN (t eELLOR of the EXCHEQU. ER.—Per ^etse-',...atiDli, h r of questions a let - vet i t we ‘er,) wh en a number wait and an -441; them aiils, So) convenient t -• k r , le - o'ether It was true, that by . the con oruperin- t tli ti ' loarr • '25 000 L for 6 in - the tie •it that Y as to b° I)" • ' included fortleol eat. Portion of the building Hon. Member l a 411(idi itlltit% e agreed with the Hon. to a much bedrtor "l'a that 1 °r ' ,at A r. Barry was entitled amount s pothtiet yet )I‘4tlon, but what the p ' I." he was not p e a A tr , ti t o 4iveen settled, and theret ure Gentleman. 'p h ' 11. ost eoell,answer to the Hun. treeing? ~ , th at h e/iteeliel"P,--Llas ho received a ) EQUER replied - 0 h e'ELLOR of the E.Xteli Fordkr pead teeei ~dtG,,,--ved about 25 0001. k of the Noble m lo, the AR.,44-1: concurred in the remar regard to those 4, fartnher ter Middlesex, with h 444 'elne were called tel e eery, Thetraordinary reasons, were was a ;yule, liqd ti, urning them out on divisions (Hear, hear, end tout r) T;tnost barbarous custom.—(hear, endeavour it4ll4qd Ile trusted the Comm 1 Committee woulders as circum -44 WNliduell': accoulmodat_on to strangers to ee',llleetisitow.( Hear.) Exchequer te t - e 7 le ereZ, b.elieveci the Chancellor of the of the con the ".., It 07 with regard to the abrogationas broken bY kot;(tei.atio"l"4Boontract had been broken it w n t he was 11 54 titled (4 4lr• Barry, and on that accou The res ! u.u berhreleh w° stay further remuneration. the rornu -5 l °ll f " Penned by Sir R. Peel fixed at 14°101,1 the completion of the whole building_aure, toeleh.etth:_,l,llsidered the building a complete D f r it Reid t '4447 % Pate between Mr. Barry and _ i He el,4lleaodottrllhle to both parties.—Cllear' ' hea n . e indi- P Q 1 ;4, 1 ') p la the Government to appoint some one t ust it lA le; k; hii',.,' l tthe thew hole affair, and not to in r who 144140 'c"ilatnissioner of Woods and Forests, el l tl bct b t , • ' Ort e , 11/4i fitness to attend to already. d with the h lt ith . 1 1 , tr STUART was disgusle , layed ', ll t) t-44 41 slitavagi a,,e which had been disi' llear, iiiti - , e ..0 the Rouses of Parliament.— ( said tio o Q to ,'Lltirey agreed with what had beenommoda. s ki 4 to th e Provision for the better acc 'lti ' 'me °ere and thought it desirable to put an sten pr, e ,. , withdraw during ,tirspeti 'lce of requiring them to etet th' i Jo t , to ex ttke 'Ca 't4IPPE thought it quite impossible„, under totpt, thi, ti4llialssioners of Woods and Forests t take the leo ibil• IttY• The Government , ash, ity ought to the 4 It4 a p upon themselves of seeing thatpublic.lt N it the dotllatended for the benefit of the to see !3_111c4 Ve t ; °I. the Chancellor of the Excheer ,s'olese,llq4e.,Yl43 not uselessly expended. He . wished ~_ t;h e eeeees Zeoe with regard to the ventilation of win' toSitteild rho COaluilttee-roomi. He had, sa t e , , m _ li COht h4.7‘,01113 during four sesAons,and n '' it'arltt ! ea cl l 'i'lli a " e ll wade in the ventilatien of them.o,, i til e lan lctosvwhetherthe present system r 'set - 'shill • s an i'M.. Mesa i %NI ating the new buildings wa ? He N os, 4"te ,44t the expense of it would' be t 01 of lleltet. leleatine person would have the co;. r Istlet thSPOONt, ii°:l(r e --411 asked whether the ventilation was e e,, _entre' , wriliiEtN ulone or two peraons? New Pa. 11 the t t'd that the whole of the had h t . tlitth eXCIZ ! t i I I 'Red to P on of the House of Commons, Before next te ~ th e %eh br. Reid for ventilation. Be warmed te, sietilielilree'd °43,....btlikliDg would be properly Hors. 'l4O f or 1‘; ill dirt not agree in what the kr ti 'ae eo eentrose had said as to Mr. Barry. T en tit cam torniek ittee hail examined the whole subject, .. ki too k r Le conclusion thatblame was to be 1 m airselon ' laer f- e 3 no . a that they ~,le - te it ,.. ry Or Lute alterations, and e de e ti t ~ • '4 to believe the alteration: were " i Pee, el, • Win. ...t,,%-1 och„--,,,pirGßEly pressed on the House the . 4 4 4 tr " th' "."2 me Outs ible for the expel] I, the t li b Ni t ! hotter. responsible Member 4_41.3,t111:4° 00„11,.4•EYS to with the 1 11ouMem Mr. 1..7e.,,,0t1ett-41/411ht to be responsible. Hitherto largest sums refeeeti f e i: the control over one of the 1 the enera I ,' te le 4111 N ag a Public build' d 'e••• was tilt 'Mote tha t lu g; an ) Commons the new II ot ti lt re 0. fai1are........_ . ouse Its Mr. thought . Opo ti ti lett er u tht 47 .Llear, hear). h e blouse in Ihie'll if h . and to ,uave advised t 0 with 1 / 4 th , lcze 4111/4/0 objected to proceeding th. 44 ere *th e I , thought ou h Y euld be a failure. He u for t r h ltitt ia th e t too-be reater acommodatio in ""o-'"vi lionseg: With re g ard to the plan w41.-mqte ,neonw proposed, be thought it would pro toe hi itilltear.venience than at present existed: — to tit!Y tqettlliery°,riiinstance, if a Member happenedcould tie: etob.the 11,, ofe , question was put, he ding into itre",lP ookeJ4,and glonpt'lo Hanse by . a stair i r e e a find the lilitt t ho `4 taod Litasue,n . is arrival . th the lobby, or tot ~" QII A ~tlq4inst who atone perhaps in ate;tlter ANC Hat he wished , to vote. d ER could m e th at Into th d ult f the EXCHEQU to i„ th, , e !tells of the plan, but had only Peildicg it. ElN'oltinittee were uuanimous in recom kid f oh tlr e of title° held himselfresponsible for the ex ,kr tt\tcY de.,". 49'4 v oted in th' . - -ioti --,lit latioh f rom is aceoueby - t the House, t o ' ll 'll 110,, t Atte bkl the plan, discussing a h e , ! Rh v or t 4,0 h o arser they had .been t It )Vth:elistorlieet the 00,.a wi.thout any ausendmea . e. ta etelteexpee„cii7raat.ion should cease.vt The,oe•Pe h `e e l w as etir te4,,,bt .. e o t Y i the lion, Baronet opposite now ht`pl %tea iidditiea6ai into a wrong ° • lobby the IVt,hl.! se eh ' %a for cot rea.son for maintaining pre. kir . ' hla, go ad for °t Ru!tlg in a hurry to a ehanaber .t , i . ''Cl4t annuale ecinfeaion Id be the resulf. It , wed s ~. 41 1 " if th wou 14 i. I ,,u out I 1 "re could be no success in a e,, h, oy 0, ' 4l Ure a en Welif l 'ele e - il lie f° , ' • eh° shooting of Byng . was MON -ti tto 4 " li eu ' s ' ef TraLlgar. The failure ktot 4:4 aierlb°3 Ayres preceded the success of il • 4411 1Ae u- Ttle impeachment of Maceles• , nottahled, and the decapitation of Laud led to the purity on the 7i - Prcopal bench. Now no such example had been nr,do of a culpable architect. A member of that profossiou tails in every respect, but ' expeuids ao almost incalculable :ur.ount of public treasure. Did it ant follow that if they wished to harn ticcess ful architect tlif'y should set en example, and cut off the expenditure of the pres,nt?—(A laugh.) Alderman HUMPHERY thought this some guarantee should be given by the Chancellor of the Exchequer that the estimate and plan would not he exceeded. Mr. WAICLEY was one of those who thought the alterations in the roof of the new House had produced a great improvement with referenca - to sound. He did not think that the new House had had a fair trial. Every one knew that it was far more difficult to hear in a new than in an old building. The vile was then agreed to. SAYINGS' BANKS. On the next vote, 30,0001. for relief to a certain ex tent to the depositors in the late Cuffs-street Savings Bank, in Dubtin. The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER said that the House was aware that a Committee had see on the subject of the late failures of savings banks Ireland Toe Lord Mayor of Dublin (Mr. Reynolds) was one of the Committee, and he reminded the House of the fact mainly that he might bear testimony ti the zeal which the Hon. Menahsr had shown, and to the services which he hed rendered the Committee on this question. — (Hear, hear.) That Committee had made their report, in which they had referred to the failures that had ma curree, and particularly td that of the Celle-street Savings Beek. in Dublin. Under all tee circuanst inces of the case the Committee had thought it right to recous• mend the Government to make a grant in order to meet part o - the Lases sustained by the depositors in those banks. Sir J. GRAHAM requested the Right Hon. Gentle man the Chancellor of the Exchequer to give a rather more detailed explanation with respect to that subject. They were called upon to agree to that vote without having seen the evidence given before the Committee. He would ask whether that was a unanimous recom mendation of the Committee; and also why the precise sum of 30,0001. had been fixed upon as the amount to be voted? If the claim was an equitable one the entire of it ought to be paid, and nut 10e. in the pound 'of it. He would wish also to know what was the difference be tween the Tralee case and the Cuffee-street case. The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER said the recommendation of the Committee with respect to the Cuffee-street case had been unanimous. A dif ference of opinion had existed as to other banks. The Hon. Members for Kerry, Cork, Stroud, and the Lord Mayor of Dublin bad been in favour of a similar mea sure of consideration being extended to all the other banks. It was not a recommendation of the Commit tee that a payment of 10s. in the pound should be paid to depositors ; but what was recommended was that it should bc given as a sort of charitable donation. Sir J. GRAHAM—A charitable donation, on the part of the Government or the British public? After a few words from the CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER, in explanation, Sir J. GRAHAM said if it was a matter of charity, it became a matter for their mature consideration; if it was ono of justice, it would be unworthy-the British public to make a compromise about it. Ile had looked at the report of the Committee that morning, and he confessed he had never read a report more difficult to understand. He would repudiate the idea of giving charity out of the public exchequer; but if it was a measure of equity and justice, it should be fully and properly met. That was a very important question which they had to consider, and he could say there was no subject which was more worthy the careful attention of the House. They were called upon in a Committee of Supply, at the end of the session, to vote 30,000/. for an object on which they had but so little information. They could not tell where that precedent might end if it were once established.— (Hear, bear.) Ile believed there were some Scotch cases, and also same English ones besides. Ii they were to make a charitable interrention to meet defalcations on the part of trustees, they could not tell to what extent Parliament might be called aspen; but if this present matter were one of law and justice the House should not fail short of its duty, and its assistance should be ex tended to all cases in England and Scotland, as well as Ireland. The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER said the distinction between the Cuffe-street 13euk and the others was this—that in fact it had been insolvent 20 veers ago (as the Right Hon. Gentleman was understood). Twelve years ago the state of the bank had been brought under the consideration of the Governmeatesf the day. It was then thought to compel the bank to wind up its affairs. In 1845 its condition had been brought under the notice of the Commissioners, and they bad recommended the bank to ba closed. But this had been refused to be done. If the accounts had been wound up at the time, the loss would not have been so great. The depositors in that tank, who were of the poorer classes, :seemed to think they had the security of Government for their money; but as there was net the smallest chance of their obtain ing anything for them, the Commissioners had recom mended their case; but, at the same time, they did not consider there was any legal liability. Mr. H. HERBER, I' considered that those depositors being of opinion that in depositing their money in those banks they were doing so under Government security, were entitled to some compensation. Ile could not, however, see that any difference should be made among those banks which had suffered from the defalcation of their trustees. The result of the inquiry into the matter had been, that those depositors had justice on their side, and that the defaulters =fleeted with those banks ought to be punished. If, then, the cause of the failure of those banks lay with the National Debt Commis sioners, why not punish them. In the case of the Tralee Bank, the conduct of Mr. Tidd Pratt had been con demned by the best judges in Ireland; and in the cave of the Killarney Bank, where there were assets, he had awarded twenty shillings in the pound to those depositors who had deposited their money previous to the passing of the Act of 1844, and three shillings in the pound to those who had done so after the passing of thug Act. It was said, that were the elsims of those depositors conceded, those who had suffered from the failure of such banks in England would come in for a share; and he would say, it their sufferings had been occasioned by the negli gence of the Commissioners of the National Debt, as those of the depositors in the Irish banks had been, they ought to be remunerated for their losses. He hoped that some one would take up the question as one of ate tional importance, involving to some extent the national honour, as not until then would that justice be done to those depositors which they were entitled to. Mr. J. A. SMITH said that the Committee on this subject had sat three sessions, and the evidence taken before the Committee during the two past sessions had been published and was before the House. The evidence taken during the present session did not differ in the least degree from that taken during the two previous sessions, and it was not thought necessary that it should be published. The circumstances attending the Cafe street failure were so discreditable to the managers, that while the Committee felt that no blame was at tachable to the Commissioners of the National Debt, yet there were circumstances connected with the case re specting the Communications between the managers of the bank and the Commissioners of the National Debt, which entitled the depositors to the eons miseration of the Government. It appeared that in 1831 there was a deficiency in the bank, and the trustees offered to assign over the assets of the bank to the Commissioners of the National Debt, but the offer was not accepted. There was no doubt that had the bank suspended its operations at that time, the losses to the depositors would have been inconsiderable, and he did not hesitate to admit that Mr. Tidd Pratt had made the suggestion of carrying on the proceedings of the bank at that time. The business accordingly went on uutil 1838, when the large amount of the arrears attracted the notice of the Commissioners of the National Debt. ' The bank finally closed with a deficiency of 64,000/. They were forced to this by the fact that they had re ceived notices of withdrawals which they could not meet on the following Wednesday. At that time they bad 1,9501. in the bank. What did they do? They absolutely distributed this sum among their own friends who had not given notice, excluding altogether those who had given notice. The Committee decided that the deposi tors had no legal claim, but that they had a elaim upon the sympathy of Parliament, which could not be re sisted. And new the question was whether the Chan cellor of the Exchequer was right in giving them ton shillings in the pound, and next whether they ought to take criminal proceedings against the trustees: He cer tainly wished to obtain something from the trustees, confident that wilful neglect could be brought home against many of them, though they might not be cog nisant of the frightful fraud which had been committed, still he thought they ought not to escape without punishment, He was of opinion that the Chancellor of the Exchequer went as far as he could in proposing the 30,0001. to indemnify the depositors. With regard to the Killarney Bank, Mr. Teld Prat was not in any way to blame. The alteration made in 1844, which released the trustees from responsibility, placed Mr. Pratt in the position that he was obligel to pay the depositors pre vious to 1844 before he could pay any one else; the con sequence was, that the depositors previous to 1844 re ceived twenty shillings in the pound, while the others received but three shillings in the pound. This was strictly according to law, but he could not say it was equally according to justice. The case of Tralee was one which he hoped would be the last of the same kind. Before Mr. Tidd Pratt could make an award he was bound to fix the notice on the doors of the bank, but as that was the actuary's house, and be had fled, there was no bank; but Mr. Tidd Pratt did all he could, by serving the trustees individually with notices. Mr. REYNOLDS said the case of the Catrfhee. Cuffs-street e Bank, in Dublin, was a special case, whether trus tees or the Commissioners for redeeming the National Debt were considered. If they bsd complied with the provisions of the Act, and required a return of accounts, or on refusal they had closed their accounts with the bank, as the Act required, they. would have been obliged to wind up their affairs, and the consequence would have been that the depositors would have received, in 1838, sixteen shillings in the pound, and in 1845 fifteen shil lings in the pound. He denied that this should be con sidered as a charity. The money was duo to those poor people by the country, and they had no right to com pound with such creditors. He was told in Dublin it was a packed Committee ' but be said no, it was not a " packed" but a " Select Committee." He did not mean to say that it should be given as a charity; he was not there to do so; but he demanded it as a tight, inasmuch as it was by reason of the misconduot of officers of the Government the failure took plat'. In his o p inion, they ought to pay the entire sum, with interest , to those poor people who lost their all. He, however, accepted it thankfully as au instalment, and acceptei . it with gratitude. With regard to the Tralee and Killarney Banks, groat injustice had been done by Mr. Tidd Pratt, in giving 20;. in the pound to depositors before 1844, and 3s. to those subsequent to that period. Mr. J. A. SMITH, iu explanation of the third para graph of the report, where the word "illegal" occurred 33 regarded Mr. Tidd Pratt, said it was an expression which did not, justly apply to that gentleman. Sir J. G ItteEl.A.ll ele. , ,erved, that until ho receirod his Parliamentary papors Chas morning, he had not the slightest idea the vote would be brought on; and as the evidence was not yet prientil, they were under great obligation to the chairman of the Committee for the ex planation he had given. The question they had to de cide on was of gyeat importance, and they were called on to decide it on very insufficient leers, but he believed that if the case were a just one, it should not be a pay ment of 10s. in the pound, but the entire sum. The vote they were called on to give appeared to him to be an in correct one, for if they paid anything-, they should pay 64,0001., the entire sum due. The Right lion. Baronet then detailed the embarrassment of the Cuff--street Bank in 1831, and in 1838, when they were brought under the notice of the Commissioners of the National Debt; and also in 1845, and in 1848, when the Lank was closed altogether. If all these things could be sub stantiated, is was a case not of charity; but of equity; but, with the evidence they had before them, he vv.s not prepared to express a decided opinion on the subject. The chairman of the Committee had stated that the de positors had no claim either in law or equity. Mr. REYNOLDS—Not equity; the word equity was not named. Sir J. G RAHAM—The chairman certainly used the word equity, and if that were so, if it were for cosepas sion or sympathy, then what claim had the Cuffe-street Savings Bank above Tralee, or Killarney, or Rochdale, I or the other parts of England where failures in savings bunks took place. At that late period of the session is was inexpe'iient, in his opinion, to prese that vote, be cause, it they put it off until next session, they would then have time to consider the whole subject, and to legislate upon it, so as to protect fur the future the working classes of this country. Colonel DUNNE said that no fin ther evidence could be taken, and he therefore saw no reason whatever for postponing the vote until next session. Lord CLAUD HAMILTON felt bound, on the part of the 600 depositors, to return his sincere thanks to the chairman of the Committee for the great care he evinced on their behalf. With regard to what had been said of the mismanagement of the trustees of these banks, the Commissioners of the National Debt knew it, and yet allowed them to go on year by year, from 1831 to 1845. To that monstrous injustice he begged seriously to call the attention of the Noble Lord at the head of the Go vernment, and to impress upon him the wrong and injus tice done to so many thousands of their suffering poor. If the trustees neglected their duty—and they did so grossly—the example was set them by those who should have set them a better example, namely, the Commis sioners for the Reduction of the National Debt. He called in two boys of the age of fifteen as arbitrators. He instructed these sham arbitrators to disagree and call him in. He was called in, and confined him self only to giving advice. If a man was called in he had no right to give any advice till he had made himself master of the subject, which he could not have done, as it is said that he did not feel him self authorised to investigate the affairs of the bank. Mr. Tidd Pratt had, under these circumstonces, recom mended the bank to be kept open. The Chancellor of the Exchequer, with his usual eloquence, did his utmost to prevent the case being made public.—(Divide.) It was creditable to the Right Hon. Gentleman that he had not allowed his former opposition to obscure his sense of justice.—(The noise in the House, and the calls for a division were so loud as to render the Noble Lord in audible.) Mr. GROGAN said he thought the case so strong, and it had been so fully argued, that he thought the vote should at once be agreed to. If they postponed the question for fuller investigation, much suffering, priva tion, and misery, would be felt by the unfortunate de positors. Mr. HENLEY said they were asked to give the money, without the Government laying down one single principle in reference to it. They were not told whether it was charity or justice. It was clear, from the report, there was no legal or equitable claim. If that were so, he thought six hours' consideration insufficient. If it were charity, he had no objection. If it were a claim of justice, they should pay in full. But, under the cir cumstances stated in the report, and upon the statement of the Right Hon. Gentleman, without further considera tion he should be compelled to oppose the vote. Mr. BROTHERTON said there was neither a legal nor equitable claim upon the Government. The trustees of these banks had declined to act upon the advice of the Commissioners of the National Debt, to close the bank. They had, therefore, no just claim, and be should feel great difficulty in supporting it. If they made a grant to any back, they must make it to all. Mr. MORRIS said he should support the vote, and hoped that the grants would be extended to %Vales. Mr. SHARMAN CRAWFORD said that this was not only an English, but it was en Irish question. He put the claim as one of justice and equity. He did not pretend there was a legal claim. Tao poor depositors were destitute of any means of redress. He thought the whole defalcation ought to be made good by the Government. Mr. BRIGHT said, that the case of the Cuffe-street bank was of a peculiar nature, and if the circumstances of the failure of the bank in Rochdale were similar be should feel himself justified in applying to the Government for the whole deficit. The Commissioners of the National Debt had actually connived at the insolvency of the bank. During two years no reports came from that bank to the office of the National Dobt. Some of the gentlemen in that office must have been actually cognizant of the frauds committed in that bank. They must have known that it must be failure, and that they must eventually come to the Go vernment. There was no charity in it. The claim, considering the gross neglect of the trustees and the Government, was one of justice. The depositors in the Rochdale Bank had been paid Its. in the pound by the trustees and from various sources, and they had given a release to the trustees. If the existing law was altered, he had told the Chanceller of the Exchequer that he would vote for making good the deficiencies. But then there was no efficient audit or control. The Cuffe-street bank stood upon different grounds to all other banks. If he was called upon to vote for the pay ment of the whole 64,0001., he should feel himself com pelled to vote for it. The CLIANCEELOR of the EXCHEQUER said that . the case of the Rochdale Bank was described as one of pure sympathy, and it was the same with all the other banks. That did not constitute any claim upon the Government. But the Cuffs-street bank was dif ferently situated, and so the Committee thought. The distinction between that and all others was that the knowledge of the deficiency was laid befor the Commis sioners for the Reduction of the National Debt, which was in fact the Chancellor of the Exchequer of the day, and for valid reasons, as was then thought, it was deemed not advisable to take a step which would have led to the winding up of the whole affair. Judging ex post facto, he thought that a mistake had been made, and as that mistake had been made from a consideration of the pub lic interest, to avoid increasing the panic, that bank had a kind of claim upon the public, but whether it was one of sympathy, of equity, or of charity, he could not pre cisely say. He could not draw a distinct line, but he thought the circumstances constituted a claim, and if be spoke for six hours he could not make the case clearer. That was not the case with any other bank, and he thought he need not say a word. more. Mr. NAPIER said the case of the Cuffs-street bank was not one of charity or sympathy. It was not a mere mistake in the Commissioners for the Reduction of the National Debt, but it was a positive neglect of duty on their part. The depositors had the security of the local trustees and the Government. The statute required them to publish the affairs of the bank, and they had not done so, and if by reason of that neglect, which was resolved upon on grounds of public policy, as exposure would have increased the public panic, there was a claim both in law and justice. The gallery was then cleared, and the Committee divided, when there appeared— For the vote ... a . 118 Against it ... ... 39 Majority ... —79 The vote was then agreed to, and the House se - sumed. Mr. BERNAL brought up the report on supply (re maining votes on civil service), which was agreed to. WAYS AND MEANS. The House then resolved itself into a Committee of ways and means, and several votes for the service of the year having been agreed to, the House. resumed. The Customs Bill was read a second time. The Marlborough House Bill was read a second time. INSPECTION OF COAL MINES. • Sir G. GREY moved the second reading of the Coal Mines Inspection Bill. The necessity for such a measure had been universally admitted, the Bill had received much consideration in the other House, in which there were large coal-mine proprietors; and he had also re ceived statements from the most important coal miners in various parts of the country, approving of the Bill in its present shape. Under these circumstances he would nut detain the House by any lengthened observations, but content himself by moving the second reading. Mr. DISRAELI was somewhat surprised at the state ment of the Secreiary for the Home Department as to the feelings of the owners of coal mines with respect to this Bill. On the contrary, he had received statements f rom some of the most extensive coal proprietors 'objecting strongly to t he meas ure. me Right Honourable Gentleman must also have been misin formed as to the reception of the Bill in the other House of Parliament. It encountered a very determined opposition, and gave rise to a long debate, though from certain circumstances no division took place. The Bill was a most hasty and precipitate piece of legislation upon a most important subject. Whatever might be the opinion feri ng of Hon. with the Mme employmentloe Members a o s c to a p t i h t ,a propriety ciu of esti question he h i e n ter- was not indisposed to entertain upon sufficient grounds, it would be admitted;that.they should clearly see the nature and extent of the proposed interference. He thought that if, at this late period of the session, the Right lion. Gentleman would postpone legislation on the subject till next session, and then introduce a Bill himself, it would be far more satisfactory to all parties than the present measure. sertion. The whole of the colliers were in favour of the measure, and he did hope that . the Right Hon. Barceet would not he eleterrt•d from carrying a measure which would entitle him to the perpeteal gratitude of that valuable class of men. had - 7rr.ercleEi:edDif4rltot: body ibound to state, t' at connected as he was with the gnat coal di s t r i c t o f t hi s country, he approval of th e pr i nciples or this Bill. Mr. HUTCHINS, as au extt o tn f si c v o e al ce o rt w l- n m er in s e a r hgi e m n s e e r t f. saw nothing in the m easure objectionable, and hoped i t would pass into a-law. Mr. WAWN opposed the second reading. Mr. G. SANDARS said he had received from the coal-owners of the West Riding of Yorkshire a general approval of the Bill. • Mr. LOCKE said that while he did not approve the measure he repudiated the censure cast by implication on those engaged in the ventilation of mines by the Ho nourable Member for Bodmin (Mr. W)13). He had him self been engaed in the study of the ventilation of mines, and h e f elt bound to say that there was a body of practice! intelligence engaged in that department that could not be equelled.—(llear hear.) They must not expect that any GOvernment inspection could make the number of accidents less numerous than at present, and he only feared that the effect of the measure would be to cause coal-owners to tranefer. their own responsibility to the shoulders of the Government. Mr. FORSTER, amidst cries of "Divide," said that if the Hon. Member had blamed the men for the accidents in nine cases out of ten, instead of the bad ventilation of the mines, he would have been nearer the truth. The Bill w as t h en read a second time, and ordered to be The eo m i ne g t t j e z d t r o a n t O T n o iti f r d u e d y g next.ment e wat read a thi r d t i me and passed. The Landlord an d Tenant (Ireland) Bill passed through Committ ee pro forma, and was ordered to be recommitted on M on d ay. s Office (Ireland) Bill MUNICIPAL CORPORATIONS(IRELAND)BILL. On the order cif the day for the third reading of the Municipal Corporations (Ireland) Bill, Mr. REYNOLDS complained that the Bill had been forced through the House at every stage at an early hour of the morning. The Secretary for Ireland and the Solicitor-General for Ireland had, apparently, re solved to pass it at " all hazards, when they well knew that if time had been g iven every ward in the corporation of Dublin would have unar.imously petitioned against the deprivation of their rights and privileges.—(Hear, hear.) When the Secretary for Ireland stated that the opposition offered to this Bill was a compact, he should strongly deny that assertion, for no such thing ever existed; but it was natural that a municipal corporation, *hose rights and privileges were violated and swamped by such a measure,- should offer every opposition. pos sible to it. He considered that this Bill was as great a blunder as number one Bill, which from its numerous errors was necessarily withdrawn. He should add that he did not see why he and his constituents should not oppose a measure that tended to deprive the ratepaydrs of their rights and privileges—namely, of the franchise, of which th e y wou l d b e ro bb e d b y t hi s Bill , H e re gretted that th e Ri g h t H on . B erone t (Si r W. S omerv ill e ) should array himself and his colleagues with the enemies of the people of Ireland against the Irish people, and he assured him that he and his constituents would raise popular opinion against him on his return to Dublin. The Bill was then read a third time and passed. The Police Superannuation Fund Bill was read a ae cond time. The other orders of the day were then disposed o: and the House adjourned at Half-past One o'clock. PARLIAMENTARY _DIVISIONS, From the Votes and Proceedings of the House of Commons. FRIDAY, AUG. 2. CRIME AND OUTRAGE ACT (IRELAND) CON- Mr. MUTT, being' connected with the north of .Eng land, h o p e d t h at the Secretary of Stile would not listen to the su ggest i ons of the Hon. M em b er f or Buckingham shire. The Hon. Member said he had received commu nications from extensive coal millers in opposition to the Bill. He should like to know who they were, because he had individually receivel statements from the most Important coal-owners in the district with which he was connected, stating that the Bill as amend e d was per fectly unobjectionable. He trusted, therefore, the Right Hon. Gentleman would carry this Bill into a law this year. - Mr. WYLD said, the necessity for this measure was shown hy;the tact, that 2,000 lives were lost yearly from the defective ventilation in the 4 mines.—(Olt.) What he said was true, and if it was not for the late hour of the night, he would. produce statistical proof of his se- SUN, LONDON', SATURDAY YRNING, • • A - 11 G UST 3, 1850. rates and tolls at intermediate stations. The tendency, therefore, netwithste.nding this multiplication of rail , ways, is to mairea:r. tf - ei iliergee cerriege er or from all stetions et w there ie no corepetifien tl:at, rate which w ill render to the ra:le nes the greatest receipts irrespective of the ei:tanee over which the traffic is con veyed, but depending entirety on what the traffic can afford, and on the maximum rates fixed by Parliament. " This difference in the cost of conveya,uce may have a very serious local effect, giving advantages dependent oe the will of the companies to One towe, port, or dis trict over another, varying Cie relative value of pro perty-, disarrangieg commercial or manufacturing inte rests, and canting fluctuations in a great measure irre spective of geographical position or otherwise existing fecal advantages, which may not preponderate to such an extent as to neutralize and difference in respect of charges made by the railway companies. " The effects and results upon the traffic of' the coun try of this multiplication of railways can only, however, as yet be subject of conjecture, for it will be seen that the greater part of the coreiietieg lines have come into octiie operation during the past year, and that they form but a small proportion of the cases which will arise; se veral other important lit.oa are now in course of con struction, end rapidly appreacing completion, which, els they become opened, will greatly increase the raurnbe.r or cases rfrailee.y competition. The effect to be produced en rnilway companies themselves cannot, moreever, as yet be rightly judged of; nor toe course they will adopt to secure their interests; nor in what manner their pro ceedings will effect the interests of the public. In a few cases, difficulties thrown in the way of an interchange of traffic m.y operate to exclude the public from advantages they might reasonably expect to receive; but probably an understanding will generally be come to by which the companies will divide the traffic in that manner which they may consider naost . <advantageous to themselves, irrespective el the intereses'of the public using their rail ways; but the intricacies of the question arising from these causes are great and various, and have not as yet fully developed themselves, and afforded information to such an extent as to enable any just conclusions to be arrived at as to the inconveniences which may arise, and the measures, if any, to be adopted to secure the' public interests. " By a table incorporated in the report it appears that at the end of 1849 there were about 6,030 miles of rail way which had been authorised by Parliament, and still remained to be completed; that the principal part of the lines opened during the year were among those autho rised in 1845 and 1846, and that the proportion of lines sanctioned in those years, the powers for contracting which have not been abandoned, is very great, being one-third and three-fourths respectively, and a still larger proportion for the year 1847. " From a return prepared in the office of the Commis sioners, which has been presented to Parliament, it ap pears that on the 30th of June last 1,504 miles of rail ! way were in course o f construction, . and 5,132 miles of authorised line had not been commenced, since which time up to the end of the year 576 miles have been opened fdr public traffic. It also appears that the num ber of miles in course of construction on the Ist of May, 1848, was 2,958, as compared with 1,504 returned on the 30th of June, 1849, as being in progress,' and since in the same period only about 1,100 miles were com pleted and opened fur public traffic, it follows that, ac cording to tnese returns, all work has ceased on about 350 miles of lines which were returned as being in pre dress in 1848, and which for the present may be con sidered as abandoned or postponed until more prospe rous times. "It is, therefore, to be inferred that no great length of new line has been commenced since last year, and that probably only about 1,000 miles out of the 6,030 miles which still remained to be opened at the end of 1849 were in progress of construction at that time. " The following table, compiled from returns which have been prepared for Parliament, shows at the respec tive periods at which the returns were made, May 1, 1848, and June 30, 1849, a comparison of the number of persons employed upon railways opened for public traffic, and also upon those in course of construction in the United Kingdom, from which it app.ars that the average number per mile of railway in operation has been reduced from 12,3 to 10.2, or 17 per cent., which may partly be accounted for by it not being necessary to extend the numbers employed in the general management in the same ratio as the mileage of open line increases, and also to the reduedons consequent upon in creased economy and greater efficiency in mechanical details. The reduction in the number of persons em ployed in the construction of lines has loen very con siderable, amounting to 84,361 persons, against an in crease of only 3,280 employed upon lines open for treffie, showing that 81,081 persons who in May, 1848, were actively employed in some capacity upon railways had been removed from this employment, and thrown upon the general labour market of the country. Of this number about 18,000 have been thrown out of employ ment in Ireland. " This, added to the reduction in the previous year, gives a total of nearly 150,000 who have been thrown out of employment, and which will in the course of the current year, unless some great change takes place in railway affairs, be augmented, probably to the extent of 60,000 more, making an aggregate of 200,000 per sons, who may be considered as having been tr.m porarily withdrawn from other occupations by the stimulus which railways received in 1845 and 1846, and who must now seek a livelihood in other ways. THE RAILWAY - B0.4R1). The following is the Report of the proceedings of the Railwaynoersi ie tl.e year 1849 t--- " TO THE QUEEN'S :I:0 2T :EXCELLENT NAJESTX. " We, your Majesty's Commi;sioiters of Railway s , humbiY be-g to lay before your Majesty a report of our proceedings in the year 1849. In this year a very large increase hiss been made in the railway communication of this country, but not to the same extent as in the preceding yet.r, 1848, although larger than in any other previous year. At the commencement of tao year 5,127 miles of railway were open for public truffle, including some miles of mineral redway not noticed in our previous reports. During the year the opening of 869 miles has been sanctioned by the Commissioners, of which 630 miles are in England, 108. miles in Scotland, end 131 Miles are in Ireland, making the whole extent of railway communication at the end of the year 5,996 miles; the proportion for England being 4.656 miles, for Scotland 846 mike, and for Ireland 494 miles, respectively. " By a comparison with previous years it appears that the average length of new lino included in each inspec- ! tion is very much leis then in arty preceding year ; in 1848 the average. length was 13.5 miles; in 1849 it was reduced to 9.5 miles. Tho number of first inspections of new lines, therefore, although extending over a' less mileage of railway, is Lot diminished, having amounted in 1819 to 88, as compared with 87 in 1848, the mileage inspect e d d ur i ng t h e respective perigaris being 869 and 1,182; but a marked difference ha; occurred in the number c f postponements of opening beyond the time proposed by the different railway companies. In the year 1848 the opening was postponed in only 11 instances, whereas in 1849 it was found necessary in 42 in stances, which, with other causes, have required that, altogether, 166 inspections of railways should be made. The decrease in the average length of line included in each inspection may be attributed to the gradnal open ing of small branches and short lines as links to com plete important communications, and partly to the pecuniary embarrassments in which many railway companies have been placed. The difficulty of procuring funds, and the desire to increase re ceipts and to show an increased mileage of railway open for the purposes of public traffic, has evinced itself by many lines having,been reported to the Commissioners by different railway companies as ready for opening and for the conveyance of public traffic, which, upon inspection by officers of this department, have not been found in such a state that they could report that their opening would not be attended with danger to the public using the same. The reports of the inspecting officers having reference to these particular cases, with such others as appear to contain any matter of general interest, are given in the appendix, "By the opening of the East Lancashire Railway from Liverpool to Preston, and from Burnley to Colne, and by the completion of the Manchester end Hudders field Railway by the London and North-Western Rail way Company from Staley bridge to Huddersfield, two entire lines are completed from Liverpool to Leeds, com peting with the Lancashire and Yorkshire Railway, which in conjunction with the London and North-Western and Midland Railways bad heretofore conducted the whole of the traffic between those places. Tho routes are as follow : "On the East Lancashire, by Ormskirk, Blackburn, and Accrington, to Colne, and thence on the Midland line by Skipton to Leeds-89f miles dependent there fore upon the system adopted by these two companies for the accommodation of the traffic. " On the Lancashire and Yorkshire lines, by Wigan, Bolton, and Bury, to Dewsbury, and thence by the London and North-Western line to Leeds-81 miles ; or proceeding flow Dewsbury to Normanton, and thence by the Midland (91i miles) to Leeds, in each case de pending upon the united action of two companies. "On the London and North-Western lines by Man chester and Huddersfield to Leeds (81k miles), entirely under one management, with the exception of the Staley bridge branch, eight miles in length, and another portion three miles in length of the Lancashire and Yorkshire Railway, over which the London and North-Weetern have powers to run. " The route used formerly to he by the London and North-Western to Manchester, thence by the Lanca shire and Yorkshire to Normanton, and on by the Mid land to Leeds, 931 miles. "By the opening of the Leeds and Thirsk Railway from the former town to Wetherby, a competing line is completed for the traffic from Thirsk, the Newcastle coal-field, and the North of England to Leeds, and the manufacturing district round Manchester, shortening the distance very considerably.' The old route by railway from Thirsk to Leeds was 574 miles, to Manchester 97i miles, which journeys can now be accomplished by tra velling 39 miles and 82 miles, respectively. "The Manchester, Sheffield, and Lincolnshire Railway Company have, in the present year, opened their line for public traffic from Sheffield by Worksop and Gains borough to Glandford-brigg and Lincoln; thus confer ring the advantages of railway communication upon a large put of Lincolnshire heretofore devoid of it, and completing as an integral communication in .their own hands another route distinct from those heretofore ex isting from Manchester and Sheffield, and the important districts surrounding those places to the east of England and the Humber at the ports of Great Grimsby and New Holland, opposite to Hull. " By the opening of the North Staffordshire Railway fromeMacclestield to littexeter, and of the Midland Reit way from Burton to the Leicester and Swanning ton Railway, a more direct line is afforded from Man chester and the manufacturing districts, bordesine the North Staffordshire Railway, to Derby and the counties of Nottingham and Norfolk, &c. " By the opening of the Shrewsbury and Birming ham and Shropshire Union Railways from Shrewsbury to Stafford and Wolverhampton, railway communica tion is afforded through a very populous and import ant mineral and manufacturing district which before was not readily accessible by railway. Tho Shrews bury and Birmingham line is, however, at present isolated from the railways east and south of it, and, therefore, does no; as yet give rise to any greet rail way competition by it and the Shrewsbury and Chester Railway with the London and North-Western Railway for the traffic to Chester and laiverpool, except from the town of Wolverhamptoia and its immediate neigh bourhood. " The Eastern Union Company having opened their railway to Norwich, afford to the public an additional line of communication to that town, competing with the Eastern Counties, but dependent on the latter company for the forwarding of the traffic between Colchester and London. " The opening of the Reading, Guildford, and Reigate Railway from Reigate, to connect with the South-West ern line, near Farnborough, and .thence on to Reading, affords a more direct communication between the east and west of England; and the opening of the North Kent line by the same company to Gravesend connects the important arsenals and dockyards of Chatham and Woolwich with each other and the metropolis. " No very important lines have been opened in 1849 in Scotland, those inspected having been principally ex tensions or branches of existing railways of minor impor tance. In Ireland, however, the lines opened appear to the Commissioners of a highly important natere, not only as conferring great benefits on poor localities, but as affording important lines of communication in a national point of view. The extension of the Great Southern and Western Railway has brought the important city and harbour of Cork within a seven hours' .journey from Dublin, being the time at present occupied by the mail trains in traversing 164 miles, the distance by railway between these two cities, and has also served to connect the large and important harbours of Cork and Limerick. Dublin is at present a twelve hours' journey from London, so that Cork may be considered as accessible within twenty hours from London. The opening of the Dublin and B lfast Junction Railway from Drogheda to Dundalk, and of the Dundalk and Enniskillen Railway from Dundalk to Castleblaney, hae reduced the journey very materially from the north of Ireland to Dublin. It is to be regretted, however, that the Boyne river still intercepts this railway communica tion. The bridge, being a very large and expensive work, has not yet been commenced. " The shove are the principal railways open in the year 1849, from the position of several of which, as links connecting other railways, and thus completing fresh lines of communication between different parts of the "country, a great competition arises between some of the principal . cempanies. In some cases it will be seen that they afford outlets to places of shipment for the produce of inland districts, in others they shorten the distance to be traversed between important parts of the country, and in all cases it may bo considered that they benefit the immediate localities through which they pass; but the general effect of this multiplication of lines upon the railway interests, and the extent of benefit conferred upon the public, have yet to be determined by experience. " Where the competition between important. points is not created by integral lines in the hands of only one company, the benefit derived by the public will depend upon the facilities of interchange, or for forwarding the traffic at the points of junction with other lines. This will to a certain extent apply where the railway of one company joins that of a friendly company; but where the forwarding of the traffic de pends upon the facilities to be afforded by a company which may be a rival either for the same, or at some other point for other traffic, it may readily be perceived that there will be a strong inducement on the part of one railway company to impede the traffic of the other, and thus that the public would not derive the full benefit of the two lines of communication, and the shortest, and its all other respects the most advantageous route, may, in some instances, bo effectually closed against all through traffic from another line. "In some cases, although the shorter route would, under an united management, be most advantageous to the public, the more circuitous one, even though not in the bands of a single company, may be productive of the having i it the b e e rlooun longer greatest retu rns t o th a t company which, the traffic to the junction, wou ld , b y sending journey, recei ve ra t es upon i ts own railway fur a g reater mileage distance. This can be effected in a very great degree by ob s t ruct i ons at the junction in the interchange of traffiie, or by charging preferential tolls, and thus the object of Parliament in authorising the construction of the shorter line, on the ground of the advantages to be derived in the c onveyance of particular classes of goods to special markets by a shorter and more economical route, and affording a, larger outlet for their consumption at snore moderate rates, would be defeated. "Competition by railways has also this peculiarity, that they only compete for traffic at particular points, and not throughout their whole length, as, although the termini may be the same, they pass through and serve different districts in their intermediate course, and there fore the reduced tariff of fares and tolls caused by com petition would, under the present condition of the law, "which provides for equal rates for passengers and goods carried over the same portions of railway, and under the same circumstances, only apply to the points at and be tween which that competition arises and not affect the Railways open. if ailways not open. Average Line in 'Average No. of of per c)urse No. of of per - Length per- sons ein- Sta- of con- p er. sans em of sons ployed ti ons. sons pl. yed Line. ein- per strut- I tins. cm- per p:oyed mile. iployecl. mile. 1848. Miles. Mlles. I May 1.. 4,252 52,688 12.3 1,321 2,958 188,177 63.6 • 1849. June 30.. 5,447 55,965 10.2 1,850 1,504 103,814 69 Increase 1,1951 3,280 529 8.4 Decrease 2.1 1,454 84,361 " A comparison ot results derived from stmistlcal in formation, obtained from railway companies by the Com missioners ot Railways, and which have at various times been presentcd to Parliament, tends in some measure to explain the depreciation to which railway property is now s ubject. The increase in the length of line open fa public traffic during each et the years 1847, 1848, and 1849, has been at the rate of 30.30, 24.28, and 21.63 per cent, respectively; whilst the average receipts per mile, from all descriptions of traffic, has decreased during the same years in theratio of about 9.22, 6.96, and 13.27 per cent. respectively, and this whilst the gross receipts upon all the railways has steadily increased in the ratio of 12.49, 16.71, and 12.75 per cent., for the same periods, ending in June in each of the years 1847, 1848, and 1849, respectively. These results cannot be compared directly with any statement of capital sums expended in the construction of railways open for traffic, and which are therefore receiving, or entitled to receive, interest from the net available profits accruing from the traffic on the railways. It would, however, appear, generally, that lines or branches have been made the traffic upon which has either not been developed or has not come up to the anticipation of the projectors, or that railways have increased in a more rapid degree than that at which the resources or the country eau supply traffic sufficient to yield the remunerative returns antici pated from the expectations raised at former periods, when only trunk-lines had been constructed, over which a very large proportion of the present traffic is carried. Probably all these causes have been in operation, to a certain extent, with others, to produce the existing de preciation of railway property. " It may, however, not be uninteresting to consider the nature of this description of property a little more in detail. The following table, compiled from returns pre pared in the office of the'Cotnmissieners, shows the amount raised by railway companies in the country at the end of 1848. " It will be seen that the increased amount raised by shares and loans during that year amounted to 33.234,817/., and that the aggregate expenditure was 200,173,058/., of which 43,664,480/. was raised by loans bearing an average rate ot interest of 4i per cent., and being, therefore, au annual charge upon the permanently invested property of 2,020,334/. " Table compiled from statistical returns to Parlia ment, showing the amounts raised by Railway Compa nies in the years 1848-9, with•the gross receipts for the same period : Amounts raised by nallway Companies. By Loans. Average Total. By Shares. Amount. ,Interest. Rate per Cent. • -- -- Z. X. I Z. Z. 126,149,476 40,788,765 r . • 166,938,241 56,508;578 43,664,4801 2 ,020,334 4% 200,173,058 30,359,102 2,875,715 .„ .. 33,234,817 2,419,098 273,201 .. .. 2,692,299 End of 1847 „ 1848 Increase for 1848 Raised by b 9 corn-1 panics, who have not com menced their works. " ./.Itho.ugh the Commissioners cannot at preseut as certain with accuracy the increased amount raised in 1549, they believe that the total, by shares and loans, will be found to be considerably less than in 1.248, and probably not far exceeding 20,000,000/.; and that, there fore, the total amount expended upon railways at the end of 1849 did not exceed 220,000,0001. " It' the Commissioner s are correct in considering, as before stated, that about 1,000 miles of railway were in course of construction at the end of 1849, by assuming that each such mile has had 20,000/. expended upon it, \V hich it is believsd is \ rather iu excess of the correct sum, if it could be ascertained; and if the amount be still further reduced by the sum of 2,692,2991, which has been raised by 59 railway companies upon whose lines the works had not at that period been commenced, it would appear that at the end of 1849 the 5,996 miles in operation represented a capital of about 197,500,0001., showing for works, stations, plant, &c., an expenditure of about 33,000/. per mile in the construction of the line and the provision of the necessary plant and material for working. " The gross receipts from all the railways in 1849 amounted to 11 , 80 6,0001., from which if the working ex penses he deducted at the rate of 43 per cent., being about an average taken from the published statements of a number of the principal companies, there remains a net available profit of about 6,729,4 9 01., to remunerate the holders of property to the amount of 197,500,0001., or at the rate of 3.40 per cent.; and it therefore appears that all sums raised at a higher rate of interest than this must reduce the aggregate revenue available for the remune ration of original proprietors. "In consequence of the larger rate of interest, 4-a per cent., borne by the sums raised on loans, this pre- rage rate of interest to sharchorers canape be st.ted at were than 3 par cent. on the rggr-date of ell the rail weya in the kingdom at the present rate . 6t' dir!tiend. This, however, may be erpccted to improv e from several causes; amongst others, inTrovements inmachinery conseeuent redaction in working expenses, sled th e regu lar and gradual inc rease of traffla before stated, which it may be considered is due to increased population, deve lopment of trade, and a greater appreciation of the bene fits of railway transit. "From another return prepared to an order of the Rouse of Commons, it appears that in the session of 1849 an additional sum, amounting to 3,155,332/, w as autho rized to be rai se d, o f which 594,832/. may be raised by Jones, which, being added to 143,717,7731., the total amount which at the end of 1848 the various railway com panies retained powers to raise, either by existing or by new shares, or by loans, will give a total sum of 146 ,873,1051., from which, if 20,000,0001. he deducted, being the sum assumed to have been raised in 1849, it would appear that railway companies retained, at the end of 1849, powers to raise the sum cf 126,873,1051.; of this 25,200,3831. was held by iifiyanine railway companies, who at the end of 1848 had net begun their works, 1,507 miles in length, and it may therefore be concluded that a large proportion of this latter sum will, in ad e itoehoofic.oosfor, deduction e os r d to. a hr u; u.i l e ce w t ift i lb a i o o 3 :n n t t P o h h u t e e. rr3ePa;:r.: completion of no a tph ot p e t o :o b b e t w a ho f ob e cu ir r nt l I t t ti:o;oroa commenced, after b e b e e s m o e, d u a t r : t k n a l a i : i ns O n eg t; prodhbiy, us at present sanctioned by t h e L egislature, a large proportion mayor will be commenced, and the capital, therefore, not be required. "From the returns of accidents made to the Commis sioners by the several railway companies, ahstrncts of which are attached to this report, it appears that during the year 1849 only five passengers were killed from causes beyond their own control, being a great reduction on the number thus returned in the preceding year. The number returned as injured by accidental causal beyond their own control has also been very much decreased, being one-third less than in 1848. The whole number of passengers killed in the three years 1847, 1848, and 1849 were 30, 21, and 23; and of persons employed upon railways 124, 138, and 127, respectively. The number of trespassers and other persons neither pas sengers nor employed in any capacity upon railways which have been killed has amounted to 57, 43, and 52 for the three years 1847, 1848, and 1849; of these last three were determined cases of suicide. " Considering that the passengers who availed them selves of the railways in this country fir the purposes of locomotion amp unted in the year 1829 to the very large number of 68,841,539, being an increase of 10 per cent. upon the preceding year, and of 16 per cent. upon the number conveyed in 1.847, it is most . Batista°. tory to perceive that there has not been a corresponding increase in the number of accidents. "In the case of a serious accident by which five per sons were killed and several horses killed or injured on the night of the 10th of February, 1849, near nockliffe on the Caledonian Railway, the Commissioners sent down one of their inspecting officers, who, after in quiring into the attendant circamstances, reported that it was caused by one of the wheels of the tender chang ing its position upon its axle whilst the train was in motion, and so breaking up the road and causing the greater part of the train to be projected down an em bankment about ten feet in height. The luggage-van next to the tender, and a first-class carriage, remained on the line, as also did the last carriage of the train, the injury having occurred principally in a central carriage, immediately preceding a heavy - post-office van , in which the post-office clerk s were employed in sorting letters. It appeared to the inspecting officer that the wheel had been improperly fitted in the first ins:ance in the manufac tory, and as a great number of wheels, fixed in a similar manner, were in daily use upon railways, and the accident had occurred to this wheel after it had travelled from 12,000 to 13,000 miles, the Commissioners caused a cir cular to ho sent to the railway compaines calling atten tion to the remarks of the inspecting officer upon the advisability of an examination of all wheels so fixed, and the adoption of measures to prevent a recurrence of a catastrophe. "The Commissioners think it right to advert shortly to a ease of considerable interest to an important mineral district in Monmouthshire, in which their assistance was sought in the adjustment of difficulties which arose be tween the proprietors cf the Monmouthshire Railway and Canal and the mining and manufacturing interests, to which they afford the only outlet to a port for the ship ment of their produce. This district is one which, as its mineral resources have become developed, has provided itself with canals, and then with tramroads, upon which for many years locomotive engines have been used, as also horse-power. The canals and the principal tram roads are the property of the Monmouthshire Railway and Canal Company, but there numerous other tram ways belonging to individuals and other companies which are connected with them, and to which they afford the only means of arriving at the town of Newport, the shipping place of the district. " The railway company having obtained Acts of Par liament by which they were to adapt their lines for loco motive traction, and to carry passengers, proceeded to take steps for the alteration of their lines from tramways to edge railroads; but as the roiling stock in use was the exclusive property of other parties who worked over the tramways paying toll, the proposed niteration, involving very considerable expense to those parties, as well as prospectively to those who owned the various branch tramways, produced great discontent in the district among the various mining and manufacturing interests, arid memorials wore sent to the Commissioners praying their interference. " These memorials having been forwarded to the rail way company, it appeared that the intervention of the Commissioners might be useful in adjusting the matters of difference, and they accordingly sent an officer to in spect the lines and examine into the circumstances com plained of, whose report having been forwarded to the c impany, they 'expressed their willingness to adopt the suggestions contained in it, as calculated to promote the interests of the company and the welfare of the district. "During the year 1840 it has become the duty of the Commissioners, in consequence of memorials received from seve:al towns and from many influential persons on the line of the Oxf e . d, Worcester, and Wolverhampton Railway, to consider the course to be adopted with re ference to the completion of that railway, under the powers vested in them by the 131st section of that rail way company's Act, 1845, by which it is enacted that, in the event of the Oxford, Worcester, and Wolverhampton Company failing to complete their railway and branches authorized by that Act, by neglecting at any time to proceed therewith in such manner as to afford a reason able security for the completion thereof within the afore said period, it shall be lawful for the said Great Western Railway Company, after giving one month's notice of their intention so to do, to enter upon the said railway, and to proceed with the construction thereof, and to exercise all or any of the powers of the company hereby incorporated in relation thereto, and it at any time the said company hereby incorporated shall, in the opinion of the Board of Trade, fail to proceed with the construction of the said rail way in manner aforesaid, the Great Western Railway Company shall, on being required so to do by the said Board, enter upon the said railway, and shall complete the same as aforesaid; and in such an event it shall not be lawful for the company hereby incorporated, or the directors thereof, at any limo from and after such entry as aforesaid, unless with the special consent of the said Board of Trade, to declare ; make, or pay any interest or dividend upon any of the shares in the said undertaking or to the holders or proprietors thereof, until after the whole of the said railway shall have been constructed and opened for public use.' " A number of petitions having been received towards the end of August and September, setting forth that the Oxford, Worcester, and Wolverhampton Company were stopping their works throughout their whole line, and praying that the Commissioners would require the Great We.tern Company to enter upon the railway and com plete it, the Commissioners communicated with the companies, and caused the railways to be inspected by one of their officers, who reported that it was about half constructed, that a great portion between Evesham and Dudley, including the branch to Stoke, was com pleted, with the exception of the permanent way and stations; that on the part of line between Oxford and Evesham much had been done, and the works were in an unfinished state, causing, in some few instances, inconve niences to the neighbourhoods in which they were si tuated, and interruptions to .the traffic on the public roads ; that in this state the works were apparently abandoned, there being no men to be seen at work on the line, and that the postponement of the works was producing serious injury to them, and was likely, therefore, to cause an enlarged expenditure, if much pro longed. The Commissioners also saw deputations from the companies Oct this subject, and being fully satisfied that the Oxford, Worcester, and Wolverhampton Company were failing to proceed with the construction of their railway, so as to afford a reasonable security for its com pletion within the period authorizA by their Acts, and having given the notice to the companies, they at length called upon the Great Western Company, by a requi sition bearing date the 17th of January last, to enter upon the Oxford, Worcester, and Wolverhampton Rail way, and complete it. The papers connected with this subject will be found in the appendix. " An instance in which the Commissioners had deemed it their duty to interfere and institutelegal proceedings is in the case of the Edinburgh, Perth, and Dundee Railway Company. The 11th section of the Act 7 and 8 Vic toria, c. 85, provides that it shall be lawful for the Post master-General to send any mail guard with bags nct exceeding the weight of luggage allowed to any other passenger, by any train other than a mail train, upon the same conditions as any other passenger. It appears that for some time the mail bags on this line were forwarded under the charge of mail guards travel ling at the fare of second-class passengers by ordinary trains; the company, with a view to obtain a higher rate of payment for the conveyance of the mails, determined to refuse to allow the mail guards to take up or leave bags at any of the intermediate stations, and to prohibit any persons being admitted to the station platforms for the purpose of giviug bags to, or receiving bags from, the guards, unless payment was made for each bag as a parcel. The Postmaster-General being of opinion that this course, if persisted in, would compel an increased expenditure on the part of his department for railway services, and deprive towns on the line of part of the accommodation which they enjoy, represented to the Commissioners that it would be desirable to enforce the provisions of the statute. The Commissioners, being advised that the company are bound to carry the mail bags and guards, as required by the Post-office, have issued their certificate for the law officers of the Crown to take the necessary measures to enforce a compliance with the provisions oF the General Act for the Regula tion of Railways, 7 and 8 Victoria, c. 85. "Tee reports made by the Commissioners on subjects connected with railways in the colonies, which were re ferred to them in 1849, are given in the appendix. The several clauses inserted in railway Acts of last scission by Committees of the House, or at the instance of other TINUANCE (N0..2). Motion made, and Question proposed, " That leave be given to bring in a Bill to continue, for a time to be limited, an Act of the eleventh year of her present Majesty, for the. better prevention of Crime and Outrage in certain parts of Ireland :"—Amendment proposed, to leave out from the word " That" to the end of the Question, in order to add the words " the distressed people of Ireland have borne un exampled sufferings, produced by famine, and by evictions from the soil, with praiseworthy submission to the Laws; and it is the opinion of this House, that it is not just to renew and continue measures of coercion subversive of the Constitutional rights of the Irish People as British Subjects, whilst the redress of acknowledged grievances connected with the Laws which regulate the relations of Landlord and Tenant, recommended to the consideration of Parliement in her Majesty's Speech, has been neglected or postponed," in stead thereof: - Question proposed, " That the words proposed to be left out stand part of the Question ;"- Debate arising; Motion made, and Question put, " That the Debate be now adjourned." The House divided : MINORITY—AYES, 29. Hume, Joseph Scully, Francis Koating,tßobert Tenison, Edward K. Kershaw, James Tennent, R. J. 31`Cullagh, W. T. Thompson, Colonel O'Brien, Sir Timothy Thompson, George O'Connell, M. J. Walinsley, Sir J. Pechell, Sir G. Williams, John Pilkington, James Reynolds, John TELLERS. Salwcy, Colonel Anstey, 'F C. Scholefield, William Moore, G. H. Bass, Thomas Bright, John Cobden, Richard Crawford, W. S. Devereux, J. T. Duncan, C-corge Fagan, William Fox, It. 31. Fox, W. J. Grace, 0. D. Greene, John MAJORITY-NOES, 89. Baines, M. T. French, F. Paget, Lord A. Baldwin, Barry Frewen, C. 11. Paget, Lord C. Bellew, it. M. Fuller, A. E. Parker, John Beresford, William Goddard, A. L. Patten, J. W. Berkeley, Admiral Gordon. Admiral Pennant, Hon. Co: Blackall, S. W. Grey, Sir George Plumptre, J. P. Blair, Stephen Grey, It. 1V , - Pugh, David Booth, Sir It. G. Grogan, Ecitird -- Plowden, W. H. Bouverle, E. P. Gwyn. IloWel • Rich, Henry Brotherton, J. Hamilton, Q. A. 1" Rolmlly, Colonel Burrell, Blr.C. Hamilton, Lord C., Russell, Lord John Cabbell, B. B. Ilatcnell, JAhrx '-‘ Scrope, G. P. Carter, John B. Hawes, lien)timin • ' . Seymour, Lord Chatterton, Colonel Henley, J. 3'. Shell, It. L. Clay, James Ilertiert, 11. A. ' Simeon, John Coeisburu, Alex. Heywood , James ~. Somerville, Sir W. Cowper, W. F. Hobhouse, Sir John Spooner, R. Craig, Sir W. G. Hodges, T.L. ..: Stafford, Augustus Davies, D.A. Hornby, John Stanley, E. 11. Dickson, Samuel Jolliffe, Sir - W. G. '''' Stanley, W. 0. Dodd, ti. Jones, Captain ,'' Thornely, Thomas Damlas, Admiral Labouchere,' Henry Vane, Lord H. Dundee, Sir David Lascelles, W. S.. Watkins, Colonel Dunne, Colonel Lewis, G. C. • . Wellesley, Lord C. Ebrington, Lord Matheson, Colonel Wilson, James Elliot, J. E. Maule, Fox Wilson, Matthew Ferguson, Sir B. Mostyn, E. M. Wood, Sir Charles Fitzpatrick, J. W. Mullings, J. It. Fortescue, Chichester Napier, Joseph Fortescue, J. W. Ogle, S. C. Freestun, Colonel 'Puke, C. w. TELLER!. Hayter, W. G. Hill, Lord M. SUPPLY. (IN THE COMMITTEE.) Motion made, and Question put, " That a sum not ex ceeding 30,t03/. be granted to her Majesty, to enable her Majesty to afford relief to the Depositors in the late Cuffe street Savings Bank, in Dublin." The Committee divided:— MAJORITY —AYES, 118. Adair, R. A. Grey, Sir d. Nugent, Sir Percy i Bailey, Joseph Grey, Ralph W. O'Connell, M. J. Baines, M. T. Grog an, E. Ogle, S. C. Baring, Sir F. Hallyburion, Lord Paget,:Lord A. Barnard, E. G. lialseY. T. P. Paget, Lord C. Bellew, R. M. Hamilton, Geo. A. Paget, Lord G. Berkeley, Admiral Hamilton, Lord C. Palmerston, Via. Blackall, S. W. Hatchell, John Parker, John Booth, Sir It. G. Hawes, B. Patten, W. Bouverie, E. P. Hayes, Sir E. Perfect, R. Bowles, Admiral Rawdon, Colonel Bright, John Reynolds, John Brooke, Sir Arthur li i ii i le o ce y i : bdiv r a - n o ra d o tn :d ll , R T J . o . a b A ile t s Rich, Henry Bunbury, E. H. Hobhouse, Sir J. Robartes, T. J. Caulfeild, J. M. liobhouse, T. B. Hutt, William Romilly, Colonel Chatterton, Colonel Hodges, L. Romilly, Sir John Childers, J. W. Russell, Lord John Clay, James Howard, Lord K. Seymour, Lord Clements, Charles Howard, Sir R. • Shell, R. L. Clive, It. H. Hutchins, E. Shelburne, Earl of Cockburn, Alex. Simeon, John Corry, H. Jones, Captain Smith, J. A. Cowper, W. F. K eating, Robert Somers, J. P. Craig, Sir W. 13. Labouchere, Henry Somerville, Sir W. Crawford, W. S. Lascelles, W. S. Spearinan, Henry Dawson, T. V. Lennart]. T. B. Spooner, Richard Devereux, John T. Lewis, G. C. Stafford, Augustus Dickson, S. Locke, Joseph Taylor, Thomas E. Dundas, Admiral M'Cullagh, W. Tenison, E. K. Dundas, Sir D. Manner?, Lord J. Thompson, Colonel Dunne, Colonel Mal heson, Colonel Verner, Sir W. Ebrington, Viscount Maille, Fox Westhead, J. B. Elliot, John E. Mena, Sir lienry Wilson, James Ferguson, Sir R. Moore, George H. Wilson, Matthew Fortier, Matthew Morris, David Wo y d, Sir Charles o Fertescue, Chiche s t er Most E. M: L. Wd, dames l Freestun, Colonel Maili , ngs. J. R. Goddard, A. L. Grace, 0. D. Naas, Lori Napier Joseph Greene, John •gicholl, John Grenfell, Charles W. Norreys, Sir D. - TELLERS. liayter, W. G. Hill, Lord Marcus Alcock, Thomas Arkwright, George Baldock, E. H. Baldwin, Barry Bass, H. 'l'. Boldero, H. George Broadley, 11. Brotherton, Joseph Cabbell, B. B. Carew, W. IL P, Christy, S. Currie, H. Davies, D. A. Disraeli, B. MINORITY -NOES, 39. Dodd, G. Piowden, W. H. Douglas, Sir C. B. Salwey, Colonel Duncan, George Sandars, George Forester, G. C. Sibthorp, Colonel Graham, Sir J. Smith, Vernon Gwyn, Howel Thornely, T. Jolliffe, Sir W. H. Turner, George Willoughby, Kershaw, James Waddington, H. S. Langston, J. H. Wawn, J. T. Williams, John Sir H. TELLXItB, Packe, C. W. Henley, J. W . Pechell, Sir G. Heald, James 3 L 3 s 0 , u g r, o igt i a : ni , General G O.F . BARON ROTHSCHILD. TO THE EDITOR OF THE SUN. SlR,—Lord John Russell having declared on Friday evening that if the Member for London claimed on Monday to be heard by counsel he would not oppose, the opportunity appears to be given for re-opening the whole case, and bringing to bear on it a new fire of the most vigorous intellect that can be collected within the your Acountry,fter the l the honour to i nsert i n scarcely nec essary f or paper o e f tt y er est y e o r u day d , did me ie me to say I view the circumstance as eminently for- tunate. I am, Sir, your obedient servant, A LAYMAN. London, 3d August, 1850. VAUXUALL.--THE BAL MASQUE. - The " Bal Masqud" was last night attended by the usual votaries of amusements of this sort, and by a large number of persons as spectators of the sports. The great influx cf " charac ters" was at twelve o'clock, when the groups of Highlanders, couriers, brigands, rustics, and sylphs mustered in good force. The dancing was incessant for some hours, the heat of the weather and the density of the atmosphere seeming to invi gorate rather than relax the sinews and muscles of the per formers. The noisy efforts of the monster band excited the dancers to almost uncontrollable agility, and th e i r move merits were certainly more vigorous than elegant. Mr. M. Barnett, the manager of the gardens, and a dozen or two as sistants, kept order and made proper arrangements to pre vent contusion. The supper tables and the saloon were crowded with parties, some in the disguise of masks and dominoes, and some in the happy state of exhilaration which no disguise can conceal. Everything, however, Was well conducted, and though a good deal of somewhat coarse re. partee was exchanged, there was sufficient decorum preserved to restrain without extinguishing the inevitable exuberance of mirth on these occasion% -THE wie b i d g e uo l, ofocc] • 00,00 is of b ; sig o y. to ton siJ S ' t he 110 b' 0 ,aOO, re to r ea f° te r on' on ° Ile'