The Sun. — London, England, 1851-07-16 00:00:00

THE GREAT EXHIBITION. 1 providing themselves with rolling stock, but secure the of the line on much more reasoable terms rn Th 3 crowds of visitors which the various exeursion "1"4 ' t h a n they could possibly work it t or thes Ives. Oa trains brought up to town a: the end of the week are 1 , the gross earnings reaching from 142,0001. to 200 0001., beginning to show uerceptibly on the numbers at the 1 the Great Western is to be one-third for werk- Great 'Exhibition. Yesterday was the most crowded Which the Exhibition has yet experienced. and the \ incl.. expenses, and the Oxford, Worcester, and Wolverhampton two-thirds for themselves; so that when police returns show an increase of at least 10,000 - the revenue amounts to that sum we agree to work the o v e r any former occasion. The following are th e num line for 33 per cent.—again a very great advantage to bars up to five o'clock:— them. If the line produces only 142,0001. the interest There had been admitted— At 11 43,199 reasonable way, indeed a more business-like way, 12 is to look at this agreement under the circumstances 1 •. 64 58,492 which we think most probably will occur. Looking at 2 .... 3 .................... 69.273 4 ................................. 72,019 the Bristol and Exeter C imp ►iny—is it unreasonable to expect that% line like the Oxferd.Worcester, and Wolver -5 ................................. 73,446 ham too 90 miles in leneth, and running through such a At this time 14,844 persous had left the building, but district as that from Worcester to Welverhsnipton, can the most crowded period was about four o'clock, when field a less sum than 4,000/ a week? Assuming that there 'were more thin 62 000 persons present, and the y mighty stream could seem) find room to lbw along, so proves the state of the gross revenuo, the following will choked and crowded we re the various avenues. At the be the effect of the arrangement which is now made. first opening the temp-rtsure was about 65, but it rose If the receipts amount to 208,0001. a-year, they will during the day to 74, at which it stood at four o'clock be thuentuie i s applinterested:— Ttie total number of visitors at the close was 74,122. Deb ••• ......---- Other preference claims First Charge £82,000 Working Expensei. Up to 142,0001 gross receirra ... £60,003 Between 142 and 200 0001, one-third 19 334 Above 200,0001., one-half . .• 4,000 ••• 83,334 ••• ••• ... £35,000 ••• 47,000 ••• GREAT WESTERN RAILWAY. A special general ineteing of the proprietors in this company was held yesterday afternoon at the Paddington Ststion, for the purpose of consi4.,ring and approving, or otherwise, of an agreement entered into between the Oxford, Werces er, and Wolverhampton Railway Com patty of the one part, and the Great Western Beltway company of the other part, on the 20th instant, for a lease, on certain terms and conditions, of the undertaking and eorks of the termer company, from a Junction with the Oxford and Rugby Line at Wolvercot. near Oxford, to a Junction with the London and N o rth-Western Rail way, near Show-hill, for the period of 999 years. Charles Russell, Esq., the chairman of the company, presided. Mr. C. A. Saunders, the Secretary, having read the advertisement convening the meeting, The CHAIRMAN said—Gentlemen, at the half-yearly meeting, which was held at Bristol last year, I enters i at some length into the agreement between the Greet Western and the Oxford, Worcester, 'and Wolverhamp ton Railway Companies. I stated that from some papers which bad just then been presented to Parliament by the R,silway Cammiasioners, it appeared that a very full case had been laid by the Oxford, Worcester, and Wolverhampton Cerapany before an eminent Chancery barrister, whose decided opinion it was that u t u h m er al:l.es a w Ito agreement subsisting between the two o pinion has which could be enforced in equity, and that since bean very strongly confirmed by the judgmentan de livered by Lord Cranwurth on the occasion of appli cation being made for an injuection to stay an agree meat' which has rec e ntly been entered i n to between the Oxford, Worcester, an d Wolverhton and the London a and North-Western Coneetinies* list though there were no legal agreement bet ween the two companies, and though the agreements which had been made had been rendered null and void tious of the Oxford, Whoyrctehseterip,oceedine and resolu and Wolverhampton Company "se" ' and notb"nevertheless, act of the Great Western. Company, we, _ had the same reasons for an all iance between the two companies which originally actuated us, and which, if possible, had become still stronger and more cogent, and we e xpressed to that company our willing ness, to aelept any scheme for the renewal of the con nexion which we could feel ourselves justified in sub mitting to toe proprietors. Several meetings were held b e tween the directors of the two companies and several arrangements were proposed between them. but none of theM were such as we could accept. From the first it had been attempted to insti tute against us a claim that our guarantee to the Oxford, Worcester, and Wolverhampton was on an un limited, and not a limited capital. That claim is con trary tc factos evidenced not may by verbal, but by writ tenteammunications, which passed between the two com- Pini O4 Ii; is cmitrery to the policy which has been in variably edopted by this company, as we never enter into any arrangements with anv other com pany whi c h are not str i ct l y defined. - We steadily and, I hope, successfully resisted that claim, and I am sure you wiU approveof our having done so.—(Elear.) It was attempted to be proved also to us that we shuttle raise the rate of guarantee from 4 to 5 per cent.; but as no substantial rtasons were assigned for this change, ex cept the necessities of the Oxford, Worcester, and Wol verhampton Company, we 44 not think that, in the po sition of our company, we should be justified in proposing such an alteration to you. It was proposed, also. that we should undertake the lease of the Oxford, Woroeiter, and Wolverhampton Cumeany, from Os- ford to Stourbridge, at a mileage rent proportionate to the whole rent of the entire line, but as that would give to us a must unproductive portion of the line, and scarcely bring us to the verge of that district from which we exptcai 1 to derive the greatest portion of traffic, I am sure you will also think we were right in declining tnist proposal also. It was then proposed that we should ourselves undertake the coaipletkou of the line from Oxford to Worcester, and leave the Oxford, Worcester, and Wolverhampton Company, with the aid of other northern companies, to complete the portion from Worcester to Wolverhampton. This again would only give us the unproducave portion, - and hat d over the productive portion to other companies. Tni, also we thought it would be improper for tie to accept. It has been. said by those not acquainted with the facts of the rate, that we throw overboard the -Oxford, Worcester, and Wolverhampton Company. I have rated to 3 ou the leadeig proposals which were trevie to ua and I have done so riot tor the purpuce of reviving any difference aeteeee the two comport s, but for the purpose of our o su j übti flew ion in answer to the alteeatious which every day are put flab, and also its order to satisfy your minds that no pro posals really ever were made to us such as we c•iuld have been juetifiel in enter taining. But our opinion also was, that the time had not arrived when any egret-meta could be made with the Oxford, Worcester, and Wolverhampton Corn peny. I thought that the common interests of the two companies were so intimate and so important that the time must arrive when such an sgresment would be made betweeu us; and I confess I thought also that those opinions were entertained by persons connected with the thrord, Worcester, and Wolverhampton Company. I. was, then, with the greatest aurpris • Viet we heard ut the aer •em- of that was entered into between that c .m- ' piny and the Lemon and North-Western Company. leT , suce terms as th..se ceutained in that 'eve, in nt were ever proposed t, us, or even hintt d to us; but that agreement having actually bi'eii entered into between those two co , .p , stoes, we did riot think it right to ffer any counter proposal, as was suggested to ea by tasty persons. We did net think it heneurehle to etitleavour to seduce one compeey from an engagement which it hed made with meatier, whether it were wise or unwise, legal ter illegal, by the atnr of higher terms.—(H=ear.) We do think it worse fur your interests to enter into a race of competition with the North-WE-keen, Company or any other company to see which should outbid the other in ordetatoobtaisi possession of any line of rail way.—(Elesa) Such a course we did nut think either ju aceus or cre ditable—such a course uever has betn adoptea, and SUi,h a course uever shall be adopted in this company.— (Ceeers.) Bet, gentlemen, we entertain a decided opinion that the agreement which had been entered into wee in itself illegal, and we were determined to bring the; question to the test of a court of law. In the course of the proceedings it was suggested to us, indeed it was urged on us by counsel, that it would be unreasonable to ask a court of law to set aside an agreement with another company it we were net prepared; , to give another in substitution of it ; and, under these circumstances, we authorised our counsel, in the event of the agreement twine proved to be illegal, and in the eveat of the Court thinking that it was light so to do, to state that we were prepared to give fully as sgood terms to the Oxford, Worcester, tune. Wolverhampton CompanY, as those of which we lied deprived them. The Vice- Chancellor (I.ord Cranworth) granted an injunction for staying that agre ement, anti though he evaded the question of 'Eva ) , he expressed his own very - decided opin i o n that the agreement was illegal. This decision, for practically it is a decision, was of great im portsoce to us in many ways. It was valuable as affecting. an important question, which was then at issue ; it wa s valuable:us ad ee a ng many other ques tions of the same or a similar cearacter. It cans, very opportunely to s h o w that agreements, however large the promises they contain, or powerful the party from whom they proceed, are utterly fallacious if they have pot the .sanction of the law, and that a p o li c y su btle and temporizing, ra th er than sound, practic a l, and far-sighted, though it might involve others, as well as i h,, s g, who pursued it, in liti gation and expense, beneficial only te the lawyer s w h o " vis " l it. and injurious to every other person, sell, as the it. able result,3vi,could not contend against th e enactment" the'l sw on the principle of public policy, as il; it f `' u ad written in the acts and proceedings of the Legielatute, and t . in tb • end fail .--( Hear.) , It is too late t o taina r p o n of l obstructing lines or systems of railway, which not t only have been sanctioned, but which are almost finished . I n t ve 's idle to think of ob structing alliances a ka l- "a • • I • local posi tion, public convenience , tion, common ietereste, d I agreements have determined e andit ie the an aettis a-- of wisdom but uf common P 021 Se, to p B r, I will not say ee t o meet ehe condition of circumstances, our mealur i n 1844 et 1845, but as they mist inevitably as they existed 2 and to elimihish by rational precautions exist in 185' , r.. range gip n t s truce evils which no humans and prudential a w aver, which every passing day brin• power can no nearer to consum wake, and whichever .progessive movement more sev • er I and mare inten s e, if Koch arrangements be not aa ,pasS,..-The decision of a ceurt of e el • a a • Sea free the handle of the Oxford, equity eying and Wolverhampton CompanSa they intim it r e c ci es ter, 'heir readiness to enter into the negetiati to Us s ells and arrangements have to-day to s • which we . . , submit to you as the resailt of our negotiatio . ne. Tee p . rirn.ey ar t s meet purpose of this Ox - usti W itidiep•—sanie p • 1 orceenr, and Virolverhempto nCompany was to raise the to complete their lin ne cessary m'ineY , e, and to render the capital w hich they ._ h av e . already it producav-. product iv-. It has been ascertained spent on cnnal stun of 82,000/. I A items taut for ' 4l 'i P ur P t-35° an 3 d oenturea, and 47,000/. 35 0014. to pay interest on e SlSfy - • f the preference, shares that meet he te py Suteatat on . , ' • of 82,000 e is ma e. the thereerre, or ate 3. This same first charge on the gr im, rev° l u e s of the Oxford, Were , • setter, and VV‘iilernmiic"" 11"wlj under retch soiled se- )i even before the payment of working exp,uises, acid en. C avity that there can be little drub, that they will be eeeeted to raise the capital the y require on Charge on nrlt exivantstrl ous terms. The secend . • i 6 . 0 000/, the grei d rev cues of the comptey -a ,_,, Western Com a year, Which is to be paid to the Great . Ws pkivr w,,lttknz . x enter so long as the recetets of ~.__:tlaa filaill'Ssii. 142,a0pa a year. 600001. on 142,000/. is 42 I , lte•t atAt.; WA tail Oxford, W orecutev, and Wolverhatnp '—' 10$ eiliPlo l .l l at es therefore, not only tarred the cosi of Dividend to original shareholdprs — Two-thirds of the excess between. 142.0001. and 200,000L.............38,666 One-half of the exces* above 200,000/...... .............. ........ 4 000 42.666 £2OB 000 This nearly 3 per cent. on 1.450 000/., the share cspt •tilvoefry the original shareholders. This 42 6661 which I think it reasonable to expectits rom the eb th r w tt ar rangement into which en tered. The a dvanta g e to the Oxford. Worcester, and u we have now Wolverhampton Company may be briefly summed up ihus,—that it enab les them to raise the funds neces sary for the completion of their line, that i , insures their getting that money on reasonable terms, that it saves them the cost of renewing the rolling stock, that it insures the working of the line on amen more advanta4eous terms than they could themselves possibly work it, and gives to the original shareholders every reasonable expectation of a moderate dividend for the money which they have invested. To the Great Western Company the advantages are, that we reduce the exonst s of our line a little more by working their line on the terms I have men tioned, that we shall bring a considerable addition of traffic over our main trunk line, and that we shall have given to us, in comm o n with a ll the oth r original shun - holders, a reasonable expectation of deriving some return for the 180,0001. which we have invested in the Oxford, Worcester, and Wolverhampton Com pany. These are the direct pecuniary advan tages which we shall derive from this agreement. There are other important advantages if we regard the arrangement as a distinct arrangement —(Rear.) I believe that in every point of view the arrangement is desirable both to the Oxford, Worcester, and Wolverhampton and the Great Western Companies, and we (the directors) have the fulls-st confidence, therefore, in submitting it for your adoption.— (Cheers.) The epitome of the agreement, as already published in The Sun, was then read to the meeting. The CHAIRMAN alien moved that it be received, adopted, ratified, and confirmed. After a very brief discussion the motion was unani mously agreed to, and the meeting immediately after wards separated. OXFORD, WORCESTER, AND WOLVERIIAMP i ON RAILWAY. An extraordinary general meeting of the shareholders of this company was held yesterday at the London Tavern, for the purpose of considering an agreement for a lease to the Grt at Western Railway Company of th e line from Oxford, through Wolverhampton, to the Lou don and North-Western Railway, near Show-hill, for the term of 999 years. Captain Rushout took the chair. The CHAIRMAN opened the proceedings by ap :logic ing to the shareholders for appearing before them in hi• present position, which he said was caused by the seces sion of the late chairman. The present objict of the meeting was to saucticn an agreeffienc with the Grew Western Railway, negotiations for tv , ich had been commenced in consequi-nce of the late judgment of Lord Cranworth, in the case of `' B-man v. Rutiord," . that the former agreement entered into with the Lindon ono North-Western Railway could not be legally carried out. The agreement now proposed with the Great Western would be equally beneficial to this company, and at the time of the hear►eg of the cause to which he had alluded, Mr. Bothell, the counsel fir the Gres Western, had professed the readiness of the company to use all their endeavours to carry out a fair understand ing. The agreement which was now laid before th , shareholders would, he thought, completely carry out the obj,,cts with which the company bad first beet. formed. The Hon Gentleman concluded by movie g that the directors of the company be empowered to carry out the agreement, of which we subjoin au ab ..trac The Oxford, Worcester, and Wolverhampton Company agree to complete their undertaking between Wolvercot (near Otto d) and a junction with the London and Nona- Western Railway, near Wolverhampton, in a substantial Manner, with a double line of broad gauge railway, and ad ditional rails as prescribed by Act of Parliament; and to lease it when completed, with the requisite stations, skit lines, and other accommalations to the Great Western Ra way Company, for 999 years; the 4 latter providing all the ' necessary locomotive stock, &c., to work the said line. " The Great Weste n Company covenant to pay 5,000/. per annum to liquidate the debenture interest of the lessors, which sum is to be reserved to the Great Western Company as the first charge on the revenues of the railway. They are further to trawler to the Oxford, Worcester, and Wolver hampton Company, out of the gross receipts as defined in the agreement, a sum not exceeding 47,400/. per annum, to de fray preference d vidends. and other liabilities of the lessors. " The annual sum of 60,000/. (subject to a contingent and proportionate reduction when 82,')001. shall not be requireo for the foregoing purposes out of the revenues of the line) i, to be the next charge on the gross receipts, to defray the working exoens s, rates, and taxes of the line which are undertaken by the Great Western Railway Company, sub j,ct to such reimbursement. "The e:;c-ss of all r ceipts up to 203,000/. per arnum to be divit ea in the prop ,ri ion of two-t hints to the 0 <ford, Worcester, arid Wolverhampton Company, in respect of their capital, and ore-third to the Great Western Company, in respect of working expenses; and all receipts be)on 200,001. per annum to be divided in equal moieties between the two.companies. " Provision is made by clauses for insuring the proper traffic to the line, and developing it; as well as for an equal mileage distribution of rates, &c., for throm..b traffic passing over both railways, and for working any portion of the line, if partially openel, before the completion 01 the uneertaking. " The Stratford Canal, the Stourbridge Extension Canal, and the Moreton Tramway, are to be worked by the Great Western Company, and the revenues thereof first appropriate,l to discharge interest upon certain liabilities in respect of them, the balance belonging to the Great Western Cumpauy, to de fray working expenses, &c. " Accounts are to be kept in proper form, and to be open to iespeution by the directors and officers of the Oxford, %Vor ceater, and Wolverhampton Company. Recourse is to be had, in all cases of difference, to arbitration, under clauses inserted in the agreement, and an extended agreement is pro vided for, with powers to the two boards to give full effect to it." _ . A SHAREHOLDER suggested that the correspondence between the Lueedon ano North-Western Railway Com • piny, and the Word, Worcester, and Wolverhampton Railway Compauy, on the subject of the late agreement, should be read. Mr. Themes, in seconding the adoption of the reso !Litton, said that no such correspondence had taker, place. Both 'parties, on hearing the judgment of Lord Crauworth, had resolved to consider the agreement as void. The directors of this company, therefore, felt themselves bound to listen to the overtures of the Great Western Railway Company ; and though on its first appearance the agreement was not so beneficial as might have been wished, as a larger sum would now have to be earned before the original shareholders came in for any benefit, yet in its ultimate results be had no doubt it would be even more reivanta• geou'. The London and North• Western certainly had renewed their offer, but the solicitor of this company ad vised the directors that it could not legally be carried out, and the shareholders would see that it these nego tiations had been renewed they would have had to en counter, perhaps, another Chancery suit, and certainly a strong Parliamentary opposition. In answer Lou' question from Alderman THOMPSON, Mr. PARSON, the solicitor, said that it must ba evident that it a nitre ow gauge line Were laid down between Ox ford and Worcester, as well as the broad gauge, the Great Western could not be expected to lay down a single gang., between Worcester and Wolverhampton. Mr. alderman THOMPSON obj.cted to being handed over to the Great Western Railway bound hand and foot. Thu most advantageous course would be to com plete their own road without any arrangement with any Other company whatever. To deprive them selves of the narrow gauge between Oxford and Worcester would be a most suicidal act, more particularly now that prejects had just been set on lout for m e l t i ng Shrewsbury and railways from Hereford to from Hereford to Worcester on the narrow gauge line. He should oppose to the utmost the c)efirmadoo of this ag reement. The Hon. Alderman conc luded by moving as an ame n d ment t h e appointment of enter i ng i nto any agreement whatever, and that t h e meeting adjourn to this thy month. d o i f e a nc eym uniltee of five shareh o ld ers to consider she tape- Mr. BRATT seconded the amendment . Mr. .L.a.WfteleCE said the whole poi n t was whether t e t t present ud, by h egire: tn er4t WAS us beetficial as that f ormer l y London etas N rth-Western Railway. lii his ()pillion they were now blindly Surrendering u p' f li this he Great Weste rnwhich to was dain pr most valuable portion of t heir property, and e na bli ng t fur them in South the immense Wales. Th e feet was that. the two greatest companies in the c ountry were biddin g for up parfirnog in this someway their favour, and he thought time Ought to be given to th e s h areholders to c,msider *blob offered the (. 1 - 7. s: t ele& themselves by a mill and hasty n-stost advautages, He trusted that they woulls net m eteensiderreg tea matter. Before sitting down he wished to ask the Chubeeee whether In;ght be formed wiitt the Lio neva' had not devised the draft that such tldo of aa an agreement, da t ..gve:4:tebemu oath-Westerndtt t:oywr-heG:ceehr Hallway, legel and h.tallog? Mr. PAesuN-s explained h W ef e li st d er r n aw ß i ai u l P wa h ; Ut e ri p Solicitorzn e d subatte‘d re to e m tf ( i . of the nn n nd a o g n and North eitor-Generel. very that clause, however, er en t t a S i b ;e li d d" re silt entailed an , the necessity of the company going to Parlaa. THE SUN, . A*: c'` „~,_"~. te_3 LONDON, Act, and it was this consideration which had induced the directors to tern to the Great Western Company. Mr. TowNLEY objected to the present agreements, end contrasted them with former agreements proposed by the Great Western Railway, by which a 4 per cent. dividend was guaranteed to the shareholders of this company. He was astonished that the directors had been so short-sighted. H 3 should certainly support the amendment. Major COURT suggested that the original agreement alluded to by the Hon. Gentleman who had just sat down should be reverted to at once. Ever since that agree ment had been abandoned the company had been going wrong. Mr. COHEN contrasted the advantages which this ' company would derive from the two companies who were candidates for their alliance. If they agreed with the London and North-Western Company, from the re ceipts of 150 0001. this company would receive 29,3841, and the Landon and North-Western 14,3601., or a din , deed of 2 per cent., and all excess to be divided equally b-tween the two. From an agreement with the Great Western Railway, from a receipt of 100 0001. this com pany would only get about 21 1 Is. 61. per cent. Again, the agreement with the London nod North-Western Rail way would save the expenditure of 300 0001. and b- able to borrow money on the credit of that, railway at 4 per cent., and aivo to borrow money on the Great Weetern Railway. If the worst came to the worst they could work their own line—(ll-ar, hear)—and he was sure that with the increased advantages of the present de) they could do it with a much higher dividend than many other railway companies. Mr. PARSONS defended the agreement on the ground that It was more advantageous than the former agree ment with the London and North-Western Railway, and that in fact there was no other path left open for this company. 'l'be one distinguishing element in the last agreement was certainty, whereas in the other there was an uncertainty both of expenditure and receipts. This last agreement, also, could be carried out immediately without any further experience. The London and North Western were not iu a position to deal with them. l'he traffic of this company was a London traffic, and in his opinion the Great Western Railway was the most advantageous line to carry on their traffic to London. Mr. Sergeant GASELEE commented on the anomaly of the solicitor of the compile) , making harangues in fa vour of a scheme which he would receive the pay of the company to carry out in another place. Unfortu. nately, on the last occasion, he had just. the same advo cacy in favour of the London and NA‘ch-West-rn Ra.l - Company. It, however, he had such confidence in nia case, what objection could there be to wait and al low even body else to satisfy themselves that the ad vantages were as greet as had been represented? He, ror one, could not forget the breach of faith which the Great Western Railway had once been guilty of. He would rather subscribe for a Bill against the Great Western, than favour them in the least. He would, however, not enter into the rela ive advantages of the two schemes, but entreat them to consent to the amend ment fir a delay, to give time for consideration. After a considerable altercation the original resolution was withdrawn, and the amendment agreed to. Mr. Uzelli, Mr. Lawrence, Mr. Walker, Mr. Brett, Mr. Caple, and Mr. H. Grisewuod were appointed to form the committee of inquiry. The meeting then separated, after a vote of thanks to the Chairman. MARKET INTELLIGENCE. (From the London New trice Current, July 15.) SUGAIL—To-day larger transactions took place in West ludia Sugar, in consequence of then being sellers rather unc?er the rates of Friday, boll for grocery and refining qualities. The public sales of 218 hbds 36 trcs 151 nrls Barbldoes went off flatly at a reduction of 6d per cwt, and several lots were taken in: the part sold realiv.d fine yellow 38s 6d to 40s, good 37a 61 to 38s, mid 36a 6d to 375, low 35s 6d to 36a, mid to fine brown 34s 61 to 354, and two lots mid to good grainy yellow 38s to 404; 30 hhds 15 trees 260 brig Trinidad in part sad at easier rates, mid and good brown at 33s 6d to 345, ord to mid yellow 34s 61 to 35s 6d, and 37 hhcht ord yellow Demerara 34s 6d per cwt. REFINED.—To-day there was little passing in refined goods for home consumption, still brown lumps cannot be obtained under 46s per cwt, there being no increase of supply. The crushed sugar market is quiet, with sellers at rather lower rates. MAIIRITIUS.—This afternoon Mauritius sugar met with little attention, and of 4,178 bags at auction a part only sold, whilat rather lower rates were in some cases ak n—fine 3 allow Falling at 38s to 393, low to good 34s to 37s 6d, ord to fine brown 31a to 343, refining sorts 33i to 383, and a few small lots grainy yellow 40a to 41$ per cwt. EAST INDIA.—This afternoon Bengal sugar met with attention, uud the rates übt lined were generally equal to those of Fri, ay. At auction 3,455 bags were chiefly disposed of ; good mid to fiue white Benares went at 40. 6d to 425, low to mid 38. to 40 , , damp and washed 37s 6d to 41s, mid to tine grainy white 44. to 475, good .end tine soft yellow 363 to 37s per cwt. There was uo public sale of Madras, and little was done privately. FunErarr.—To day there was little desire evinced by shippers ur home dealers to operate in Foreign Sugar, although there were sellers rather under the rates of Friday. At auction 80 hhds 44 tree St. Croix sold at 41s to 44s tor good and flue brigEt yellow. BloLessEs.—Toe demand continues limited for all 'Suns, 'ma there are sellers rather under the rates exist perviously. West India of low to fine quality can be )b mined at 12s 61 to 16a, Bengal and Mauritius 12a, Juba and Porto Ittco 14. to 14 , 6d. The rates paid for ,uw to fiue Jamaica Honey are 30s to 55. per cwt. CoooA.—Biitish plantation ha, been more in demand. 4f id bt,tf.r rates are untamed tor Trinidad, the supply at , oarket b ing limited. At auction 230 bags sold st 45. to 47s for good to title red; low and mid grey 36. 38s 6 l ; but Grenada is .till to b:p obtained at from 32. to 40. p- r cwt. In F reign operations are trifling, d this and Para at 253 to 27.; and Guayaquil at 29.3 to 403 per cwt. _ _ eUFFEE.—This afternom Native Ceylon Coffee was , perat,i in with reluctance, although rather lower rates were acceded to: of 1,100 bags at auction, a part only old at 37a 6d t> 38, for ord and good ord, and at 33. to 37s for damsged. For Plantation Ce lon the market has teen qui t, -tint in some cases 1 wer rates were taken ; at sue ion 170 ca,ks 200 bags were only in part sold, mid .t 50s to 523, I,w mid 48s 6d to 49s 6 1, fine to fine fine ord t 2, 6.1 to 48., itifrrior 38s 6.1 t 42,, sad pea berry 56, tid to 585. Of Jamaica 34 casks realised 50. 61 to 52.. or low mid and md, being tull rates. Of P.,rtu Rtco 170 pkgs 700 bags were nearly all taken in, at firm a es. from 42s 6,1 t. , 49a 6d tor good to fine ord, but .;hi , fly at 453 to 45. 61; 2 980 nags Costa Rica. mid are; g,,od 55s to 595; 38 bales Mauna sold at 38a 61 for lam aged. TEA.—Public sales will take place on Friday; at pre ent the quantity declared is 10,000 pkgs, In I,w and good c Ammon Congou large transactions have again taken taken place for home consump , ion at 10i I to lid, and •hippers are sill operating. Th e re i,, only a limited quantity on off:T. For medium or rather strong blackish leaf a fair detn4nd exists at Hid to la Odd, good to tine sorts are operated in more tretly at 14 Id to Is 7d per lb. Several transactions have taken place in o.iloo e ir, at Is to is 81, and there is a firm mit ket. To day operations were upon a small scale, in consequence of the pubic ewes declared, but rates are not lower. RICE.To-day the private operations in East India Rice were trifling, and at easier rates. At auction 687 bags 11-ngal were taken in, good white at 93 61 to 103, and small broken 8s 61 per cwt. SPICES —To-day at public sale 119 bags 46 pockets Bengal Ginger vvere taken in at 17s 6d for mid export sort, being above the value. Smarrs.—Leeward Island Rum has been purchased with relucance, and is. to be obtained at, is 411 to Is sid proof. For East India there is a quiet market, with sellers at is 3d to is 3 1 proof, and larger parcels are on (4I -r. Demerara has been purchased with reluc tance, and there are sellers at Is 10,1 to 2s 3.1 for 30 to 40 over proof. In Jsmaica operations are immaterial. The value of tine 34 to 39 pir cent over proof is 3, 3.1 to 4s 3d, good mid to good 38 to 35 over 24 7d to 3s 2(1, and low to mid 30 to 33 over 23 31 to 2. 6 , 1 per gal lon. Brandy met with little attention from s'ip vers or home dealers, and there is an increasing stock. Cognac hest brands of the vintage of 1850 can be obtained at 4,4 d to 4s 63, 1849 ditto 43 6(1 to 43 Bd, 1848 ditto 4s l 1 , l to .5s 1(1, older 5s 51 to 7s, low and mid sorts 2,6 d to 3s 4d, and Bordeaux 2s 2d to 2s 3d. In the value ot Bri ish-made Spirit no variation. Geneva met a slow sate at Is 711 to is Bd, and fine is 9,1 to 24. Imanao.—To-day during the progress of the sale 2.156 chests have been withdrawn. 2,628 chests (including 1,743 chests withdrawn) passed the sale. Proprietors nave bought in 585 chts, lesving 300 sold. Of total quantity which has now passed the hammer (10.128 tents), 4 233 have been withdrawn, and 2.562 bought leaving 3 328 sold. SALTPETHE.—To-day Saltpetre met with little atten tion, and prices declined 3.1 to 61 p-r cwt. At auction 1,059 bgs Calcut'at part sold; very fink 2i refraction went at 29., mood mid 11 to 12k per cent 25s 6(1. COCHINEAL.— Altnough there are sellers rather under previous rates, only a limited home or export d- mand has been experienced. Of 300 bags at auction not above one half sold; Honduras, silvers low to mid went at 34 to 3s 3d, common to fine bl-cks 34 64 to 4s 9d, Teneriffe 3s 7d to 3,9 d, low red Lima 23 6d to 2s 10d; Mexican was token in, silvers 3s, black 3s Id to 34 3d. OlLS.—There is an increasing demand for Seal Oil; pale selling at 301 10: to 311. Other sorts are rather scarce, and in better request at 281 to 30/ per tun. Cod continues to meet with little attention, and is at 361 lOs to 375. There is an improviug demand for Southern, and the rates paid have been 291 to 321 fur low to fine. In Sperm desire is evinced to sell good and tine quality at 821 104 to 841 104 per run; whilst lower rates are looked for. Headmatter has been operated in at 901 ti 921 p r run. In Lins , ed Oil a good dell has beta done home comsumpti prices are also firmer, and rule at 324 34 to 32, 61. F ir d-livery c nsid,ranle contracts have been concaided at 318 91 to 325. In Cocoa Nut prices are on the advance; Cochin at 313 to 32, 6d, Ceylon 30s to 324, and Sydney 28s 61 to 293 6,J. In P.lm ILA much done; and fine quality is offered at 27s 6d per cwt. For Rape Seesi Oil en advance is apparent; brown realising 32s 6.i, pale 33a 6d, and Refined Foreign 34s 64; for forward delivery contracts have hers entered into at 344 6d to 353 fur refined. In Olive many purchases have b e en made, arid rates arc firm; Gallipoli at 381 to 394 other sorts 361 0) 371 lOs per tuu. TALLow.—Dealers op-rite with caution for present delivery, but lower rates are not taken; and fine Russian Candle is held for 37s 6d to 37, 9d per cwt. There is, however, more demand for the last three months of the 03 year, el te da is s q w r i t u a b t a o i n n a a r b a t g e a e t. firm a t ( c . )39 365., e 3 t 9 c i a 6 sh d. , o lto s m o e . nava ot a large slimly. HOSIERY. —We Jaye had a Itttle wire inquiry for goods in the h-rne market consequently a few nt re frames aseptritcoe of work again, about the same a s i t h as b een for the especially dr awer and s hi r t frames. The last woutb..:Nottivham journal WEDNESDAY EVENING, JULY 16, 1851. and he could not ct!culate th loss on these sinvle arti cles of wheat and wheat fl.air at less than 2,600,0001., or almost one-sixth of the entire valuation of the country. —(Hear, hear.) In such a state of thing-3, it was not to be wondered at that persons c mnected with agriculture should be dissatisfied with their position —(Hear, hear.) With rrgerd to the immediate question before the House, he had entered into correspinci , nce with all the millers in Ireland, and had obtained very valuable infor mation for the benefit of the House. He had ascer tained that the value of 349 mills in Ireland was not leas than 1,487.3101.; and, with regard to 321, he had before him a detailed statement of the time they were now workintr. Only 39 millers stated that they were working full time, 7 not full time, 6 three-fourths time, 6 two-third time, 81 half-tim ' , 48 one-third time, 18 one-f ,urh time, 5 one-six h time, and so on. Here the Noble Lord read a numb , rof indivi- dual statements, to show the actull condition ot mills with which they were connected, the har.d, em ployed, &c., and gave it as a conclusion at which gen. tlemen well-informed upon the matter had arrived, that the number of soul+ dependent on the corn milli in Ire hind amounted to 123 000. From all parts of Ireland the information was, that great distress existed among those, conneettri with the mills; and he b.iteved there was not one mtlier in that country who could say he was in the same conditi..n that ho had been in before the recent changes commenced.—(Hear, hear.) Now, us to the cause of all this distress, he presumed no one would deny that it wad ocoisioned entirely by the enormous importati nof foreign fi 'ur; and, seeing tat the d►s tress had been much accelerated within the last ye-dr, and that the importations of French fliur dated from thit period, he wont,' confine himself chiefly to th 4 point. It had been said the other day that Normandy bad become to all intents and purposs4 an English county, and the facts relative to the importation of flour from that part of France seemed to bear out the asser tion. Now, this stye of matters was not foreseen by ,he authors of the measure of 1846. It was always con tended 'hat we had nothing to tear in this country from French flour; but how had the prophecies on that point been verified f it appeared that in 1849 the quantity of wheat flour imported from France was 287.502 quarters, and in 1850 it was 550,000 quarters. In the last quarter of 1850 the importation was 165.000 quarters, and in the first quarter of this year it amounted to 226.547 quarters. showing that the importation had doubled during the first quarter of the presort year as compared with the last quarter of 1850 —(Hear, hear) -According to a atatetnent made in the report of a Committee of the French Assembly appointed to inquire into the subject of grinding and exporting grain, it appeared that in the year ending August 1, 1850, there were exported from France 418,549 quarters et wheat, and that in seven sub sequent months the quantity exported was 554.443 quarters, while in the first of those periods there bad been exported 506,000 quarters of flour, and the latter period of seven months 525,000 quarters.—(Hear, hear.) It had been stated in another place that the French miller was restricted to the produce of the French soil. But the French miller bad the privilege of grinding foreign wheat in bond for exportation. That such was the case appeared from inquiries made by an Enghsh 1 miller who had seen the statement that the French miller was restricted to French produce. The &Jur ground in bond must be exported within 20 days from the time of importation, but not a single pound of flour was allowed to be imported into France. There was nothing to pre vent France from grinding the gr.iin supplied to this country from . the shores of the Mediterranean; and the privilege of grinding in bond, it was understood, would be exercised to an enormous amount. It was a curious circumstance connected with the increase in the fin port of foreign corn that the price of bran, pollard, and the coarser sorts of flour, had been materially enhanced, as appeared from returns and calculations in his possession. It was the practice of those who advocated the policy which had for some years brew predominant to underrate the capabilities of the classes affected by that policy; but he thought there was no thing so unfounded as the assertion that the English or Irish miller was inferior, as regarded the application of machinery, to the French miller. The principal art in milling consisted in the entire separation of the flour trom the bran; and the great test of superiority in manu facture was lightness of bran and comparative weight of flour. As regarded the quantity of flour he got from a quarter of wheat, the British miller was not interior to the French or the B-lgian; and he had, besides, the com mand of the best machinery, the superiority of this coun try over all others in that department being evident to every one who visited the Great Exhibition. One of the most successful mills in France, indeed, was called 't the English mill," in allusion to its having obtained its ma chinery from this country. But the miller ot this coun try was beaten by the French miller, bPeause he had labour cheaper, aas less taxed, and enjoyed protecting laws, because the Govs-rnmet.t, instead ot opposing his manufacture, and throwing every obstacle in his way, had from time to time taken his case into consideration, and done everything a Government could do to increase and foster the manufacture of French fl tut.. France had car ried out that policy still more since 1846; and the re commendations of a commission to whom the subject had oven referred showed that the system most appreved in France was one which had a tendency to encourage the retention of the coarser kinds of grain in that country, and the expertation cf the finer qualities. There was a remarkable contrast between the large increase in the impertation of Li iur fruta France anti England and the diminution in the export of linen yarn from Eeglaed to France, that export having fallen to 1-30th of the i xport in 1842. The question on which he ai.ked the upiniou of the House was wnether they were prepared to continue without alteration a system which tree produced such evil results? He had proved that an interest second to none in the country, the interest of the manufacturer of wheaten flour, was in a more distri ssed state, perhaps, than even that of the farmer. How long would they continue that system? How many classes would they see destroyed before they admitted that it had not done all they had exoected? The present system was no more one of free trade than it was of anything else; it was a system of protection to the foreigner. Those with whom he acted might be accused of being monopo lists, of wishing to increase the price of food to the la bourer; but their answer was that they desired the market thrown open to their own produce as well as to that of foreigners. They desired that corn grown on the hanks of the Mississippi or the Etbe, or on the sh ees of the Baltic, should compete on fair terms, should pay the same contribution to'tne state, and be subject somewhat to thy same charge+ as that grown by the British farmer. —(Hear, hear.) Oa the same principle they asked the interposition of the House on behalf of the miller and the manufacturer. He believed that the country at no very distant period would be prepared to reconsider the subject—(He sr, hear)—and revert to a principle which was so deeply implanted in our nature that it even found expression iu the language which described the first law of nature —" -11-protection."—(Hear, hear.) The Noble Lord cencluded by proposieg the motion. LABOUCHERE observed, that thou,h it was not his fortune to agree with the Noble Lord either in his conclusion or his argument, yet he willingly bore testinemy to the industry the Noble Lord hat evinced in making himself acquainted with the facts of the case, as well as to the temperate manner in which the sub ject haa been introducee.—( Eli ar, hear.) The motion of the Noble Lord, however, ought rather to have been one asking the House, not to restore protection to the Irish miller, but to restore the corn-laws; tor, thouga it only asked the House to go into Committee to reconsider the case with respect to the Irish millers, yet it was im possible for the House to reconsider the case of the Irish millers without reconsidering that ales of the Engtish. If there vies to be protection at all, the farmer had as great a right to it as others—(Hear, hear)—but if the tiouse thought their recent policy erroneous, he (Mr. Lebouchere) hoped they weuld take some other mesh of expressing that opinion than by assenting to the motion of the Noble Lord; and, it they did net mean to restore protection as a principle, they did nothing but delude this class of men by the proposal brought before the House. tie thought he should be able to show, not that individual mil lers did not suffer distress, for circumstances had changed, but that as a class there was not the slightest ground for asserting that they had not had quite as much em ployment within the last few years as previously. Nei ther did he believe there was any reason to suppose that the British millers were not just as able to compete with the foreign millers as any class of British niantifec• turers were with foreign. The argument of the Noble Lord with respect to tne wages of labour was applicable to other branches of industry as well. With respect, to the question, whether a special case had been made out fir giving protection to millers as a class, he did be lieve that nothing more preposterous could he urged. It was proved to demonstration that the millers of the United Kingdom had, since the repeal of the corn-laws, had as much to do as before. The produce grown in the Molted Kingdom had not diminished. There was a great import of breadstuff's; but in what form? Mainly in grain. He had a statement of the quantities of wheat and wheaten filar imported into the United Kingdom within the last ten years. Iu 1841, 2,409,000 quarters of wheat were imported, and what was • quivalent to 360,000 quarters of wheat fl mr; in 1842, 2,717,000 quarters of wheat, 322,000 quarters of wheat flour. He should not detain the Rouse by reading the numbers for each year. In 1847 it appeared that 2.656,000 quarters of wheat were imported, and 1,808.000 quarters ot fl mr; in 1849, 3,845,000 quarters of wheat, and 959,000 quarters of flour; in 1850, 3 ; 754,000 quarters of wheat, and 1,101,000 quarters of flour; and for the three months ending sth of April, 1851, 1,105,000 quarters of wheat, and 382,000 quarters of flour. All mt the w l 1 er h s eoaft th imported iscou in the shape of g nt, y. Hehada retur r n ain als w o e w nt hi t c o h the millers of this county. He had a return also which re lated to Ireland alone, hut without the equivalent in quarters being given for flour. In 1846. 82,000 quarters of wheat in grain were imported into Ireland, 43,000 cwt. of wheat fl iur; in 1847, 238,000 quarters of wheat, 442,000 cwt. of flour; in 1848, 297,000 partere of wheat, 122 000 cwt. of fl stir; in 1849, 543 000 quarters of wheat, 218.000 cwt. of flour; and in the three months ending the sth of April last, 415,0(10 quarters of w h eat , and 99 000 cwt. of fl itir, or about 25,000 q 'rimers. In point of fact, he behoved a great alteration in the circumstances of the trade was going on, one which was in operation before the change was made in the laws regulating the importation of grain. There were parties at that very moment extending their business in the metropolis. He was informed that near Blackfriars an immense menufacture existed, the parties being able to turn out 7,000 or 8 000 sacks of flour from 70 or 80 pairs of stones. In all respects he be lieved such millers were able to compete with their fo reign rivals. Competition had acted as a stimulus, and be was told the greatest improvement was taking place in milling both ht: re and abroad. At Deptford an inge nious improvement had been introduced, a hioh had been attended with eminently successful results. He could entertain no fear us to the successful competition by the millers of thi country with those of every part of the world. With respect to the export of fine wheat from France and the retention of pollard for home consump tion, he should only remark that if it was worth while `-‘ IMPERIAL PARLIAMENT. HOUSE OF COII 'IONS. July 15 COUNTY COURTS FURTHER EXTENSION BILL (Continued from our Afternoon Edition of yesterday.) The A r cORNEY-GENERAL was quite ready to adopt the suggestion of Mr. Csrdwell, that there should be a uniformity of practice, and that a party should be allowed to employ an attorney, a barrister, or any other person whom he might select, with the simple condi tion that the latter should be approved by the judge. Mr. CROWDER also thought the best plan would be to adopt such a clause as that suggested by the Hon. Member for Liverpool, and secure an exclusive or a free audience neither to the attorney nor to the barrister. Mr. AG LIONBY was in favour of a uniform practice. Mr. COBDEN thought the best course for the Com mittee to adopt was to establish free competition in the county court business. Mr. MULLINGS said the eff-ct of the proposed clause would be to give the barristers the privilege of receiving instructions trom an attorney, but it would preclude an attorney from receiving instructions in a similar manner from another attorney. Now, he thought the same scope ought to be given to the attorney as was conceded to the barrister. After some observations from Mr. Forster, Mr. Cruw(kr, S,rgeaut Murphy, and Mr. Williams, the clause was amended as prop,sed, and agreed to. The House resumed, sod the Chairman reported pro gress. SUPPLY. Mr. BERNAL brought up the report of the Com mittee of Supply, which was agreed to. The House adjourned at Hilf•past Three to Half-past Five o'clock. The House resumed at Half-pait Five,o'elock. PETI PIO NS. Mr. ANSTEY presented apetition from Yonghal, praying for an alteration of the law in regard to the im portion of foreign flour. Mr. DIVET C presented a petition from Exeter, pray ing that the Crystal Palace might be maintained as a winter garden. Mr. ROCHE presented a petition from a place in Cork in favour of Church reform in Ireland. Mr. DISRAELI presented a petition from Liverpool, prayi❑g tor an alteration of the law respecting the im- portation of foreigii fl ,ur. HARWICH ELECTION. _ _ Mr. BANKES gave notice that ha would to-morrow move that the new writ for Harwich should not be issued until the minutes of evidence taken More the Com tnittee had been printed and laid on the,table of the House. SELECT COMMITTEES. Mr. EWAR then rose to move, according to notice, the following resolutions on this subject:-1. That the number of Members composing Select Committees be reduced (except when special cause be shown, to the satisfac ion of the House, for enlarging that number) to seven. 2. That tho Members appointed to serve on Select Committees be itelected by a Committee of Selection. 3. That it be the duty of the Committee of Selection to choose only such members to serve on Select Committees as may declare their uoility to give their regular attendance at such Committees; and that the Committee of Selection ascer tain this fact from such Members beforehand. 4. That it be en obj-et of the Committee of Selection, in the formation of Select Committees, to combine a due proportion of the younger Members with the more ex p •rienced Members of the House. 5. That three Mem peril be held a sufficient quorum of Members for Select Committees." He believed that by reducing the number of Members on Select Committees to five, and by taking away all local interests, Committees enjoyed more of the confidence of the House and the country. About fifteen years ago the Committees consisted of forty Members; but very few of them usually attended. A change had taken place, and that change was for the advantage of the House. The resolution he proposed involved two main principles—the reduction of the number and the enforce went of attendance. Iu all legislative bodies except Parliament the number of members on committees was small. In France it was only nine, and it was found that the practical working number was only seven. The re duce 4 Dumber, was found to answer in Committees upon Private Bills. By rendering the attendance of Members constant, service would be done for the public; this, however, could only be effected in the first instance by adopting the smaller number. His (Mr. Ewart's) obj-ct was to render tne proceedings of the House more simple and more effee ive. Mr. HOW-MUSE seconded the motion. Mr. E. DENI3ON saw great inconvenience from the selection being confided to a Committee of Selection as contradistinguished from the present Committee of Se.. luction : it would also impede the action of the latter Committee. He considered it would be impracticable to consul,. each Member as to whether be wished to serve on a t_lorntnittee. At this time of the session it would hardly be desirable to come to any conclusion upon the nautiln, seeing that all the Committees were formed; and ne, therefore, suggested that the motion should be de ferred to next session, when it might be referred to a Select Committee. Sir R. H. INGLIS said all the arguments used by the Lion.,Gei:oleman in 1839 were now available against his proposition in 1851. The resolution respecting private Commi , tees had worked well; but there was no parity between public and private Committees. and conse quer' ly he (Sir R. EL Inglis) could not agree to the motion. Nei , h r the House nor the Government could consent to relinquish the power of nominating Select Committees on important national subjects, besides which the selection of any Committee of Selection would no; give satiAtactiou to both parties. The practice at pr e sent was to appoint no gentleman to a Select Com mittee who bad not signified his intenti,n to attend on such Committee. He suggested that any report of a Committee should be signed by the Members who con curred in it; and he concurred in the recommendation of his Hon. Friend to refer the whole subject next ses sion to a Select Committee. Mr. HOBHOUSE supported the motion. He com plained of the t xclusion of certain Members from public Committees, and maintained that the representatives of the people is P a rliament should be pares inter se—equal among themselves. He could not agree that the House would riot wish to pert with the power of nominating Sleet Cemmiltees, seeing that in practice the House had already parted with it to the Government or to the m jirity. The simultaneous appoint ment of one Member also to serve on several Corn ell,. tees was a decided grievance. He, therefore, thought the plan of his Hon. Friend a great improvement on the xistiog ssstetn. Although seven or eight years a Nlernber of teat H use, he (Mr. Habhou-e) had never weir called to serve on a single Select Committee. governed )much p th o e wer ci t m o n g t i r v y : ya le s a der of the Opposition the s T o he it s e G overnment however;e, , ea m rn a n i nt t eh t e nt e r : , oir t: rt i e r o t i u tth a we l nomination of the Members. Mi. C. LEWIS could not support the motion. He appieh , nded that if the plan in question was adopted, he inqoiries before C untnittees would not be satisfac etry, unless the practice of allowing counsel to be heard was introduced. This he did not considttr possible; sod +here ore, as he believed the proposal would produce far greater evils than exist, d, he felt called upon to give it his,dceided opposition. Mr, HUME said the mode of election was not based upon a right principle. Though many competent Members were unjustly excluded from Committees, the result of his experience showed the greatest difficulty in obtaining the attendance of those who where nominated tu these Committees. Taking an average, it would be found that in a Committee of fifteen no more than seven attended. He would therefore reduce the number of Select Committees to that fieure, but he would also make . attendance compulsory.—(Hear, hear.) He con sidered that the Committee of Selection hal acted un justly i n p l ac ing Members of that House upon private. Committees to prevent them serving on public Com mittees. and he hoped the Government %soul.' entertain the eubject in such a manner as to produce some antis fact try result. Mr. BRO MERTON was not sanguine as to the eff-ct of the change proposed by the Hun. Member, seeing that public and private Committees were conducted in a very different manner. He thought that when gentle men manifested the possession of information and ability they were generally selected by the House to serve on public Committees. At the same time, he did not wish to stand for a moment in the way of improvement. Mr. E WAR replied. He would be satisfied if his resolution were referred to a Select Committee. It op peered 'to be generally admitted in the course of the do nate that some change in the present system was neces sary. He did nut absolutely limit himself to the number of seven, but he maintained that be was quite consistent with himself when he proposed the reduction of the pre sent number of members on Select Committees. He could not, however. consent to put off his motion until next session, as he considered the present was the proper time to entertain the subject. Lord J. RUsSELL could not consent to either of the propositions made by the Hon. Member. He was not, however, opposed to the appointment of a Select Com mittee upon this subject, it the House was disposed to entertain such a proposition, early next session. He did not believe that any object could be attained by the ap pointment of such a Committee this session. On the suggestion of Mr. HUM.E, Mr. E W ART consented to withdraw his proposition. The motion was accordingly withdrawn. MILLING INTEREST IN IRELAND. Lord NAAS rose to move that the House should, on a ftuure day, resolve itself into a Committee to take into consideration the present sta e of the milling interest in Leland. The Noble Lord began by referring to the manner in which the interests of agriculture iu Ireland, as well as its linen and other manufactures, had for , miserly been cherished and fosterei by the Legislature. Toe linen trade was now comparatively lost, and he was prepared to prove that the important inters st referred to in his motion had also been involved in ruin—results product d in both cases by the legislation of that House. —(Hear, hear.) It was formerly the practice of the Irish m.llers to purchase large supplies of grain during the period that elapsed between harvest and spring, and to export flour into the English market with great ad eantege to themzelves and to the country to which they belonged; but that trade had now completely ceased, as they wore beaten out of the field by the enormous im portations of American and French flour that took place. —(Hear, hear.) He found, from the returns of the B oar d of Trade, that in 1845 this quantity, of wheat ex ported to England Wad 372 009 quarters.; 1850 it was only 76,000 quarters, being a decretists of 79 per cent.—(Hear, hear.) Of wheaten meal and fl , ur there were export' d •to England in 1849, not less than 1,422,9u0 cwt.; and in 1850 only 397,00005:it5., being a decrease of 72 per cent.—(Hear, hear.) But the loss did nut end here, fur Ireland had been obliged to im port these articles. Last year she imported 2,200,000 quarters of wheat, of which about. 1,000,000 were from feretgn parts, and 570,000 owl. of wheat NO and flour; to s , nd p,llard here it would bi sent; and wh , n it w 45 said, hJvi ungratefully Franca trevs us," no must say that he was not deterred by the p they of France from bdieving that it Wzii the. ieterest of chip country to pursue tile policy with which it had identified itself. Un der the recent system, it was not denied that tha linen manufacture of Ireland had grealy thriven; and looking back for a period of 16 years, since the comme , cial system had been liberalised, the exports by this country to France bad incr , sqed (he sp la from memory) from 400,000/. to 2,000,0001. He regretted the restrictive policy to which France clung with so much tenacity; this country had the greatest interest in the pursuit of industry by that great and ingenious nation; hut, if he believed this country had an interest in paralyzing 'he commercial system of France, he should anticipate that result, from adherence to a apron which he knew to be absolutely incompatible with any great extension of her commercial and ma .olacturing interes , s. France c , uld never encer the great fi l i of a owp , titi ,11 with Am- rica and Grelt Briain till she f+eed herself •rom those sh•Ackles which this country had had the wisd.im and the . . courage to get rid of. He - did not know that it was ne c-ssary for him to detain the Huns, ; he should abstain from rveri , g into details, for he was not diApos,cl to ground his opposi ion on minute calculations. He reo4-d it rwher on the g rt-ts t principle oa which he hop , d the House would take its stand. Ile N 'Lae Lord had talked of the palltal itij,try brought by the tree tr,de measures nn part cular classes. ile (Mr. Labouchere) wag afraid any chomp iu commerce, even from WA to good, must al Nays produc th,st result. But. surely, they were not without their com, , E,nsations. He had seen the other day a document not prepared in a Government oflre or brought torwurd by m-n advocating any system of political economy, or any political party, but by per sons eng , lged in works of 13 , nevolence. He referred to the reports of thosm who, a., district visitors, were en g' ged in visiting the haunts of the lower classes in this mighty city, reports given with referents , . to the cundi tiun of the industrial classes for the last two years by _ . medical men, clergy men, and others. They all stated chit a great and manifest improvement had taken place in the physical coudition. outward appearance, moral habits, and cleanliness of those classes, and in every par ticular, owing to their greater comfort; and in many in stances the result was traced directly to the increased means et obtaining provi-ions ch. apt. These were objects on which it was worth while for that House to legislate; and if they were satisfied that, by their recent legisla tion, these objects had been promoted, that not only the physical state, but the moral condition and the political contentment of the great body of the community had been promoted, he hoped that they would pause before, inconsequence of any partial case being stated in favour of any portion of their countrymen, they abandoned the policy they had ad ,pled, and that they would prefer that which ought to be the great object in all their delibertis lions, the general benefit o► the great body of the people. On these grounds he entreated the House to refuse its assent to ins motion, agaiout which he should give his decided vote.—(Hear, h• ar.) Mr. .S ruAta stated, that to raise the whole ques tion with reference to the case of one class was what, the Noble Lord desired to do. his own constituents had complained, in a petition, of the injury ieTheted on them by the repeal of the corn-laws. It woull not answer for the Government to slight the complaints of a suffer ing class. The millers, it might be said, were the last persons who ought to complain; they were merely the manueaeturers; and it was the fact that they were complaining, and not without reason. Their request was a modest one, namely, for it quiry whether they could not be relieved from the consequences of le gislation, which had affected them iu common with others. France adhered to a system of protection, so did the most eminent statesmen of America. A writer in the United States had prognosticated that not only the Mayor of Stockport, who was a miller, but the eleyor of Manchester, who was a cotton miller, would come to Parliament with the same c implaint.--(Heur. hear.) He rec .mmended the Noble L"rd at the head of the Government, and the Right Hoe. President of the Board of Trade, to study the Transatlantic writers, one of whose works aptly expressed obj-ct aimed at by his Noble Friend, namely, " The Harmony of lotereste, Agricultural, Manufacturing, ant Corn tnerciae" Ministers appeared to have had for a text-book Franklin's "Rules for vneking a Great Empire a Little Otie," and the rule " If people make complaints, don't listen to them, and tell them they must suffer," had been faithfully wetked out in lieta,tid From refeterices made by Sir R. Pe.l to Adam Smith's deecriptien of the agricultural b dy. it was to be interred be intended to make them some compensation. lie considered that they had by their 1-eislation sacrifi , -ed, for the benefit of the menuractur• ing class, the itieeests of the %%hole agricultural populite two—of all cone, reed in the produce of lend (lir• city and indirectly, whether as landlords, tenants, millers, mortgawes, or tradesmen. He warned the Manchester cream millers and steam loom weavers that their con dition might before lone be similar to that of the corn millers. The Mayor of Seickport, who was a miller and manufacturer, supported tree-trade measures, tied thought he would beat the world, but his anticipations had been disappointed, he found that the French miller beat him. and be had gone to the wall. The Atuericin manufacturers might betore long put the Manchester milli re of cotton in the same position in which the Fr. nch corn millers bad put the English corn millers. He held in his hand a letter from Mr. Thorpe, or Newark, au extensive miller and walst.r, relative to the compfraiive merits of English and French machi nery. (Toe Hon. Gentleman read the letter, the writer of whim stated teat as Lord Grey had told the liouse that English millers did not know their business, and held up the French millers as superior to them, he (Mr. Thorpe) could only say that if he had below-el the French se stem he would have figured in the Gazette lung ago; and that French grinding, instecd ot bin held up as a pattern to English millers, would be a dis grace to thew.) He (.4r. :quart) thought, thi.n, that it did not become the Government to taunt teis suffering and complaining class with want of skill, and to tali upon them to expend furth-r capital. lie hoped the Reuse would agree to the motion of the Noble Lord, for he considered that by negativing it they would incur very serious responsibility. Mr. C. ANSTEY said that he supported the motion, because he believed it woted tend to the advantage ot Ireland, particularly as it did not in the least interfere with free trade, as was thought and represented by some Members. However, he should say that be felt it his duty that it would be proved that there was a necessity for such a measure for the 'agriculturists of Ireland, now burthened with taxes beyond their oceans. He hoped that the House would admit of a Committee, and if such were allowed, he was prepared to show that the millers in Ireland were buffering much and that if Parliament did not interfere the people must nee. sasrily suffer. Mr. E. B ROCHE said Ow he wished to adhere to the question ot the Irish millers, without touching in the least on free trade.—(Crtes of " Hear, bear.") He wa s a inaeutacturer of wheat him•elf, but he denied that wheat was a raw material, and he asked the House to say if he was not to have protection for what he pro duced? Why should the miller have protection for what he produced? The result of special protection to the miller would be that if they got corn into this country tree of duty, with a prohibition in respect of flour, the minor witted say, " I will only give you such a price for your wheat as I pl.ase, having at my command a larg , supply ot that erticee against a cempetion, in which I aeu guarded." The fact was that he millers of Ireland had not applied themselves to the improvemetit of their machinery so much as the French millers had done, althetigh since the adoption of tree trade measures con siderable ivaproverni•uts lied been made by the millers in respect of toe machinery; and while he would be willing to support arty motion which would ben. tit. Ireland, he considered that their best security now was to tuily carry out tee principles ot tree trade; and believing that motion was au infringameut upon those principles, he would vote te.taiiis it. Mr. NE WDEGA.TE supported the motion. Thi. was the reinplast case that it was posible to conceive. The millers of Irela-cl were injured as well as the millers of England, and they, trerefore, demanded iequiry inti. their case. BAweeita 1845 and 1849 there was an in erease in the importation of wheat if err into the Unit d Kaugdom of 242 per cent., and that certainly was suffi cient to show treat the millers had suff.red to a great extent. Then the importation of wheat into this country from Ireland had fallen riff to a very con siderable ext,nt sins° 1845, the dimunition bring in wheat. fl ,tir, and mime al, upwards of one million cwt. Toe plain fact of the case was, that the importation of wheat into the United King iota within the last few years had increased one-half, while the importation of wheat and wheat flour into England from Ireland hed decreased more than our-hale which was a very signifi- cant sign of how the present syteem was tending France, from being an importing country, as regarded turn, was now an exporti. , g .me, and .a French states man stated. that since 1844 five millions of acres were brought ieto cultivation in France for the express pur pose or suppl3ing the English market. The same thing occurred in the northern pa, is of Germany, and at home they had the millers complaining. Yet the millers were determined to do nothieg , o relieve the distress, tut al foe ed it to cure itself. He reed a letter from a miller in Wakefield, in which it was contended that it was im possible for the English millers to compete with the French, in consequence of the heavy rates an d taxes 10 which they were subjected. In his (Ir•Newdegate's) opinion, the Noble Lord who brought forward the mu don only did his duty to his country in calling the at tention of the House to the distress existing among th e millers in Ireland. Mr. WILSON con t en ded that if any argument was to be drawn from the importation of flour and wheat dur ing the last five years, it must be in favour of the miller. From the übservatiens made by the Noble Lord, it might be inferre d that because Fr ance en d protection, the peop le enjoyed grs at Prosper i ty. Now, he enntreded tha t if the Ellwish far mer su e. fered, the French farmer stiff .red &ill more, es may be seen from the re port of the Minister of Commerce, lately published. The N o ble Lord else mid that the French wince was enabled to grind fl iur in bond, and then to export it to foreign countries, and undersell the English miller in his own marke t. Nothing could be more fallacious than such an argument. France was divided into sections, and although the miller there was permitted to grind wheat in bond, and then ex -1.30r, i, , he was obliged to import an quantity f ro m the section in which be resided. The Noble Lord bald the English and Irish miller had butter m .chinery than the French millers ; but how did it happen that the French miller was enabled to grind his flour and send it to Olessa and then untkrsell him, cud even (1,, so in the English market? English men by their ingenuity were often axle to overcome the difficulties of climate, and to compete with foreigners in all parts of the worl t. He alluded to the Government mill at Deltterd, which was, he believed, the most per fect in the kingdom, and in which a new improvement was lately made, by which a great saving of time, labour, and money was eff-ctrd. He knew a gentleman who had a mill in R e eding, where he ground flour on the old system, whereas, in London, where he had another mill, he worked ou a r,ecv and improved principle, simi lar to thst in use in France, line was able to obtain two or three :hidings a quarter mere for the fl iur i L ndon than in Readine.—(Hear.) These facts are worthy of being known. The Noble Lord refers to a rule in France with regard to grinding hard wheat in bond, and that only soft wheat was allowed; but in that the Noble Lord was mistaken, for the hard wheat was the best for grinding. The charge for meterage, which the Noble Lord stated to be a disadvantage to the English manu facturer, was peculiar to the city of London, and did not apply to other outports. It was impossible to say that the English miller was placed under any disad vantage as Cjg.) pared with the French miller. It was also to be observed that the improvement in the con struction of mills was being adopted in this country.. Besides, the duty on coal imposed in France, gave the English miller an advantag,f. There was no d. that there was in Ireland a ditnielution in the cultivation of wheat, and that the Irish milk rs, depending on their own produce, w. re placed disedeantage as cempared with those in London aid Liverpool, in being obliged to inv• port corn from Colonel DUNNE bad no great sympathy with mUlerso for they had been violent free-treder:, still there was cause of joy at their repentance. The argument in fa -our of free trade was the increase of the comforts of ihe people, but that was not the case in Ireland. With regard to the millers, they iinporned stones from France, upon which they paid a duty of 10 per cent. He eon tended that the millers should be protected, arid he was sure, if the Committee was granted, it would be shown that free trade was the ruin of Ireland. Lord NAAS replied. He observed that all the thee. rerical and h)pothetical statem. nta made by the Hon. Member for Westbury would not countervail the tact that the millers of this country and of Ireland were in state of great distress.—(Hear, hear.) With respect. to :he Blaekfriars-bridge mill, to which reference had so often been made, ho had been over it, and conversed with the gentleman who constructed it, and his answer was, that that mill was commenced before the law of 1846 was passed; that it was commenced at a time when the millers thought their trade was likely to increase. and be a profitable one, and when matters were in a different position from what they were now.—(Hear, hear.) As el the new invention to which the lion. Member for Westbury had referred, he begged to say that the pa tentee had failed to convince the bast millers in England that it would be of any value to them, and that they were not likely to adept it.—(hear, bear.) Mr. MACGREGOR rose amid loud cries of " Di vide," and " On, oh." The Hon. Gentleman madie se veral ineffectual attempts to address the House, but was received with calls of " No, no;" Oh, ohl" and " Divide;" amid which the Hon. Gentleman ex claimed that he would move the adjournment of the House. Mr. HUME hoped his Hon. Friend would not press his motion. A division then took place upon Lord Natts's motions when the numbers were— Fur the motion... ... ... 93 Against it ... ••• 128 Maj rity against the motion ..„ —35 Mr. BANKES gave notice of the terms of a resolution for to-morrow, relative to the St. Alban's' election wit nesses who have withdrawn from the United Kingdom. Mr. G. A. HAMILTON moved fora "return of the number of cases of cattle and sheep stealing reported by the constabulary in the countie3 of Westmeath and Rot common respectively during each of the three last years, ending the Ist day of June, 1651; of the number of persons committed for trial or bailed for such offence.; of the number of such persons convicteed; of their sentences, and a statement of the names and cases in which such sentences have been commuted, or pardons granted, up to the present time; whether in each case the commutation or pardon was recommended by the judge, and the nature and date of such commutation or pardon," The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER and Sir VV. SOMERVILLE opposed the motion, we toe ground of the inconvenieoce and injustice that might arise. Mr. O'FLAHERTY thought some such return web called for, as an impression prevailed in Ireland that shrep stealing offenders had been allowed to come back atter being transported. Lord J. RUSSELL could not agree to the motion as it now stood, b cause, unless there was some case of very grave deliuqueucy on the part of the Irish authorities, it would n. 11 3, proper for that House to take the prero gative of the Crown into its hands. He would recom mend the lion. G. ntlennan, therefore, to withdraw the motion, and bring it forward, on a future day, in a less objectionable shape. Mr. DISRAELI should be sorry to support any Mo tion that would aff ct the prerogative of the Crown, but he could see nothing in the motion that would have that tendency. It, however, the last sentence of the mod , U were omitted, viz , that relating to the commutation being recommended by the judge, &c., he thought there could be no possitde objection to it on the part of the Govern ment. Lord J. RUSSELL was quite willing to agree to the w:to that alteration. Mr. HAMILTON consented, and the motion, at amended, was agreed to. Toe orders of the day were then disposed of, and the House adjourned at a Q layer to One o'clock. HOUSE OF LORDS, July 15. The LARD CHANCELLOR tOuk his seat upon the Wool' Rack at Five e'elt,ek. GUNPOWDER S I'OWAGE (LIVERPOOL) BILL. Earl GRANVILLE moved that this Bill be referred to a :el, et Committee. - - Lord REDESDALE presented a petition from the proprietors of property on the banks of the nerseee praying to be heard by counsel against the Bill. The motion was agreed to. PETITIONS. The Earl of ST. GERMANS, in presenting several petitions against the Ecclesiastical Titles Assumption Bill, took occasion to recommend to the attention of the Government a pamphlet, written by Mr. Eneas Mee, donnell, on this subject. The Noble Earl also presented e-veral petitions praying for the preservation of the Crystal Palace. • Lord WODEHOUSE presented petitions from the Cape of Good Hope in favour of a constitutional go' veremeut. ST. ALBANS BRIBERY BILL. Lord BEAUMONT postponed the motion for tte Committee on this Bill. THE CAPE OF GOOD HOPE. The Earl of DERBY ruse to move, according to no tice, that the papers laid before this House during the present and the last session of Parlia ment relating to the settlement of a constitution for the Cape of Good Hope should be referred to Select Committee. He had heard with great regret that it was the inti ntion of her Majesty's Government to oppose this motion. He could assure them that he brought forward this motion in no spirit either of personal or of party hostility to the Govern' merit. He had no wish to add to the embarrassments of the Noble Earl opposite at the bead of Ihe Colonial office ; his object was rather to relieve those errib4rrassments, and to endeavour to naiti" gate the force of those elements of, he Was afraid he root cad it, disaffection at present existing in that colon)** The colony was what was commonly called a Crown colony. It had been acquired by conquest, and its insu' iutions were w belly granted by the Crown, but the Crown, having once granted those institutions, had not the power of withdrawing them. (Hear, heart) Many of their Lordship e, perhaps, were 0 6 aware of the exact history of the colony, and there' fore he should have to go at some length into the history of the different proposals which had been made to r conferring a represental ive Government on the colony ( Ile Noble Earl then shortly related the history of the cotes.) , in 1842.) Its the year 1842, when 138 held tine office of Colonial Secretary, a petition hau presented to him from the colony on the eunjeet c interring representative institutions on the colooe- He had, in reply to that petition, written a dispstehe in which he pointed out the difficulties which stood in the way of complying with the requests of that petition, and stating his desire to have an answer from the petitioners on the subject. This was in April, 1842, and no answer bad been returned to it up to the autumn of 1846. At that time the Noble Earl opposite assumed office, and he sent out a dispatch . to Sir Henry p o ttinger, directing his attention to that dispatch of 184 2, to which no answer bad been re' turned an d e tteing that it was t h e d es i re o f her M, i i„ ty e e Government to confer representative Intel . tutiens on the colony. Its 1848 Sir Henry Pottinor s successor, Sir Harry s m i th, answered the dispatch hi. f o rwarding to the Noble Earl a dispatch, which set forth. the view of these in authority on the subject of confer" ring representative government on the colony. E. now el'llet the ateetei of the Need*, Earl to his miser prehen:ion of the views which he (the Earl of Derby) had talin on that subject. In the commencement of the year 1848 Sir 11. Smith, who bad then succeeded to the gov p e a r t e c m h e o n i t E.ri of. tine Cape of Good Hops, answered th e dispatch Grey in 1846 by forwarding to him th e views of h is °Metal advisers on the course suggested by that Noble Earl. Sir H. Smith had laid that dispatch . before Mr. Porter, the Attorney-General of the coloni~ . with a View of eliciting his opinion how representativ e institutions could be best introduced into it. His opinion , with the questions of Earl Grey, was also submitted to Mr. Montague, the secretery to the Colonial Gover' nor, to the colonial treasurer, to the collector of customs , to the chief justice, and to the two puisne judges. The question. whether representative institutions ought to b e introduced into the colony was scarcely submitted te those intelligent public officers—the question appeare d to be limited to the mode of introducing them. OP Montague said,— "It appears to me, therefore, that I shall best serve his Excellency by abstaining from all theoretic or ab' street discussion on general principles of the good er evil likely to result from the establishment of a represen' to ive form of government in this or any other deign' de ncy, and by endeavouring, to the best of my ability, I° ,, furnish him with such information on the points referre d to, as will enable him to form some estimate of the el; rent and character of the difficulties which had occurre d to Lott' Stanley, and to vthich Earl Grey so pointedif refers." Another said, " That the period had arrived when a. re ° presentative government could be safely extended to th e Cape of Good Hope." Another skid, " That a repro' seutative government was a bold experiment, but it cool ( ' not be well avoided." What he wished to paint out to the consideration of their Lordships was this—that thes e gentlemen did not give their opinion as to the propriety of introducing representative ILISLItULIOIIB into the colonP but as to the plan of introducing them which would b e , the safest and the most practicable. Two eery le," gentlemen bad serious misgivings on that point. Porter, who was a great advocate for free institution s ' closed his opinions with these words:— " I have ventured to term a representative assembly e l the Cape 'an experiment;' his Excellency, who WWI e the colony and the people well, will not, I think, consider . :ice.