The Sun. — London, England, 1844-02-09 00:00:00

LAW. INTELLIGENCE. COURT OF EXCHEQUER, Feb. 8. (Nisi Prius Bittinks before Baron GUINET and a Special Jury.) THE ♦TTORNET-GENEIAL V. FOGG, The trial of this cause, of which the opening was stated in our report yesterday, was resumed at the sitting of the Court this morning. Several witnesses were examined to discredit the testimony of the approvers Ritchie and Bird, produced on behalf of the Crown ; and other witnesses were examined, who explained or contradicted many facts of a suspicious nature, tending to criminate the de fendant. It appeared that twenty of the missing bales of tobacco were taken from the wharf by Scrivener, and it was also proved that if the cart and van separated at Stepney Church, as deposed to by the Crown witnesses, they arrived together, or nearly at the same hour, at the Thames Police-office, where the defendant de livered theBo bales he bad seised. hir MESMER addressed the jury in reply, on' behalf of the Crown, enforcing on them the necessity of making an example of the defendant, if they believed him guilty, as, being a police officer, it was peculiarly his duty to protect the revenue against fraud. Baron GURNEY read over the evidence, which occupied a consi derable time, and the jury retired at half-past three o'clock and remained in deliberation for some hours, but ultimately returned a verdict for the defendant. THE ATTOINST-GIiNERAL V. JOHN WOOD. In this case, which was an information filed by the Attorney. General for the recovery of certain penalties alleged to have been incurred by the defendant by means of his having unlawfully un. shipped divers quantities of cigars without the payment of the duty, Mr. TREL►oss said the Crown bad consented to take a verdict on the first count for the penalty of 2,189 L Verdict entered accordingly. TAE ATTORNIVIMIZNERAL E. A. GARDNER. In this case, which wee similar to the preceding one, Mr. Tinsman said that the Crown, by consent, would take a verdict on the same count, and for the like sum of 2,1841. The verdict was then entered, as in the former case. TEE ATTORNEY-GENERAL V. EDWIN WOOD. The defendant in this case was understood to be the brother of John Wood, and in partnership with that individual and Henry Gardner, • Mr. TIENGIBi here too intimated that the Crown had consented to take a verdict on the first count for the penalty of 2,1844 Verdict for that amount entered accordingly. TRZ ATTORNEY-GZSMRAL V. BEINNZR. The defendant in this case, it will be remembered, was the foreman at Westbrook's Wharf, at which the tobacco was landed in Scrivener and Fogg's cases. A verdict was taken by the Crown, by consent, for the single pe nalty of 2001. THE ATTONNEY-OXICIILL IP. PETTIT. This defendant was the carman of the same wharf, and, loge. ther with Skinner, had concealed the 20 bales of tobacco which the lightermeo Reekie and Bird had kept back as security for their payment. A verdict in this case was also taken by consent for the penalty of 2006, BANKRUPTCY COURT, Feb. 8. (Before Commissioner Sir C. F. WILLIAMS.) IM RE CHARLES JAMES MATHEWE. This day was fixed for the insolvent's, the celebrated comedian's application for his interim order. The balance-sheet, the sub stance of which we subjoin, had been filed by Messrs. Lewis within the time prescribed _by the statute, and was exceedingly voluminous. Mr. M. Chambers, with Mr. C. Jones, appeared as counsel for Mr. Mathews ;! Mr. E. James opposed the insolvent for Mr. Anderson (his brother.ltrlaw), and, at a later stage in the course of the proceedings, Mr. Cooke appeared for certain creditors who had not obtained " renewals" under the former insolvency of Mr. Mathews, but who now sought to share in the benefit of the offer .which, conjointly with his wife, he now offered to his present creditors. Mr. Chambers, for the insolvent, said he understood that there . were only one or two opposing creditors; that Mr. James was • retained for one, and that not being now in Coen, the other op posing creditors might at once proceed, and thus materially save the time of the Court. The Learned CommlSMONea was disposed to afford every accom. modation to all parties, and the only objection to proceeding in the absence of the Learned Counsel was, that one case might be auxiliary to another ; both the parties should be present. Mr. C. Jones considered that the creditors who might think proper to oppose the insolvent could not be prejudiced by the Court entertaining the proceedings at once. Mr. Roberts said, that having instructed Mr. James in this matter, he was aware that the Counsel's main ground of objection was, that the insolvent had no locus standi whatever In this Court. The debts and liabilities now upon the face of his schedule amounted to 8,1111., of which upwards of 3,0001. had been volun. tars ly renewed, and contracted by fraud. The Learned Conausstoesa—A serious charge, if you can prove it, and ought not to be made if you cannot. Mr. Reberts—Then, Sir, if not a fraud, at all events much to the prejudice of his other creditors. The Learned Cowentaterwea—lf negligence of duty or supposed prejudice to others constitute crime, then, I fear, we shall have many criminals in this Court. Mr. Roberts said that Mr. Commissioner Merivale had decided, in recent cases, that where an insolvent renewed his liabilities after his discharge from the Court without the means of paying them, that such conduct constituted legal fraud. Mr. Chambers was sorry to hear that any such decision had . -. been come to, for in many cases the renewal of a debt might arise from the most honourable intentions. The Learned Commisstdiven—And, I may add, that it might emanate from the highest possible principle of mind, and the best feelings of the human heart. It forms, in many cases, the very essence of integrity. There is an old adage, that what is hostile to the law of God cannot Wile law of the land. Any creditor who cannot attend here to-day may come forward upon the insolvent's application fpr his final order. Mr. Roberts said that be now attended for a judgment creditor for about 301., and for Me. 'Anderson for 6001. Mr. Chamber( suggested that as this application was merely for an interim order, that any examination of the insolvent as to the various items in his balance-sheet, had better be deferred until the application for the final order. Mr. Jaines was prepared to contend that the insolvent could not, and ought not to obtain the benefit of an Act which was only in tended to protect the unfortunate debtor. In June, 1842, Mr. • Mathews was discharged from debts and liabilities amounting to upwards et 901.111141/ , strut an Wnwribor, 1040, be sled big petition to be discharged from the Airther sum of 8,111/. Surety, then, it was not fora person under such circumstances to seek the benefit of the Insolvent Act. He had no family—he was receiving, toge. . ther with his wife, nearly 1001. a week—Madame Vestris was not even put to the expense of finding jewels for her stage orna ments; and yet, within a few months, had Mr. Mathews contracted the enormous amount of 8,11 IL of debt. The Learned Comm:sstowea—What portion of that sum was for the renewal of debts from which he had been previously dis charged 1' Mr. C. Jones—About 4,4411. Mr. James—Well, taking that to be so, it appeared that from June, 1842, to November, 1843, Mr. Mathews had been living at the rate of 3,0001. a year. , Sir C. F. WILLIAMS-4 have a very strong opinion on the sub. ject, but I shall not suffer myself to be led away by first impres sions, nor without hearing evidence; but I must say that there is something upon the face of the balance-sheet which is extremely startling. Mr. James—lt appeared; that in consequence of the issue of several Brits and executions, and the stage.door having been Mutest besieged, Mr. Mathews was obliged to quit his engagement, sod for that no, blame was imputable to him. Mr. Mathews re. eeirect 5001, upon the 3d of November. With this sum in hand, Mr. and Mrs. Mathews proceeded to Paris ; they went away in an omnibus and four—they took with them some thirteen or fourteen Packages of different articles ; but in less than one month every farthing of the 5001. was expended, besides 701:, his week's salary, which he had in his pocket; and even their plate was pledged the night before their departure. Mr. Mathews was to be pitied for his emSirr asswients ; but if anything like justice wer e t o b e d one to his creditors, he shduld not with perfect impunity be permitted to expend 6001. in less than one month in Paris. Immediately upon his return he' obtained his protection from this Court, and had since been in the receipt. of 701. a week, yet nothing was done for the creditors- - Such - e case should find no favour in this Court. *hat was given up for the creditors! Why, a sort of contract had been set forth upon the face of the balance-sheet, by which he proposed to give up - 1,3501. a-year of his and his wife's joint salaries, deducting the payment of an annuity for 3501. a-year, for whiCh the Marquis of Abercorn was security. Such an offer, he contended, was a mockery to this Court; it was a mockery to the creditors. Sir C. F. WiLLlans--And the jewels of Madame Vestris, which for costliness were the admiration of the world, where are they gone? Mr. C. Jones---1 deny that .Mrs. Mathews has any more jewels than she now begs she may be allowed to retain upon the payment of 3/. a.week for their use. The agreement specially provides for the payment by equal monthly parts, out of both their salaries. Mr, Mathews was then sworn, and in examination by Mr, James, stated that at his last discharge his debts and liabilities chiefly owing to the difficultie s at t en di ng his lesseeship of Covent., garden, amounted to 29,0001., of which sum, however,only 4,0001. was upon hisown, account. The properties were retained at the theatre. Of the 4,0001. he had renewed about 3,0004 I felt bound in honour so to do, for I was very peculiarly situated, as many persons came voluntarily fotward to assist me, and one gen tleman, knowing my difficulties, lent me 2001.,saying, " Mathews, I believe you to be a man of honour, and take the money, for I know, when you can, you will return it to me." That debt, amongst others, I renewed, but I never granted any renewal for a pecuniary advantage. In the case of a debt to Mr. Wolf, I re newed it for 1001., and be said to me, " take the odd money less the discount," which I did. I renewed also to Mr. Levi and Mr. Geldslide, who bad become bail for me; and I will again swear that I renewed nothing for any pecuniary consideration. Mr. Cooke here applied on behalf of certain judgment and ether creditors under the insolvent's former insolvency, but to 'whom no renewals had been given, that they might now be per. matted to come in and share in the benefits which Mr. Mathews eras willing to give his other creditors. Mr. Chambers objected. A discussion ensued, and the Learned Commissioner decided that he could not grant the application. ' Mr. Sheathers contended that the statements of his Learned Lhiend (Mr. James) were, to use the mildest terms, founded on - error ; and besides, as the question had, to a considerable extent, Put on the character ofa public matter, it could not be disposed of •• , withi', mature deliberation. Mr. C. Jones.—This discussion has originated from the sugges . lion thrown out of adjourning tee examination until the day fixed for the final order ; and if rip will allow rne, I will just add a word Or two. Mt Mathews's debts amount to 8,1001. ; out of this sum Creditors to the extent of 4,6001. have signed to the proposition made ,by Mr.. Mathews, for the gradual liquidation of their clainis ; 2.0001. 'snore are willing to accede to it, but have not tiiiten'the trouble-to come here to-day ; thus creditors to an extent cif 6,0601. out of 8,000/. are willing to accept the terms proposed by Mr. Mathews.. . •--, e • Ir. Jecnea- I This is the first I have heard of this agreement ; but -. -adfhe teem has the power . of 'adjourning an insolvent's examine. tfori for a few days without granting an interim order, I suggest that that - ~... • ,would be the best to adopt, and the public would not be ....., t ?. un inJ!c; - after reading or hearing this examination, as not to delay t , n_eif ?pinion 'until the whole case was gone into. ... Sir C.l*. Witetawa -'Mote complete justice I would willingly adjOurn the case, that • c e may be done to the creditors and Mr. Ma thews ; but if there is be exPeetetion Of any solid benefit being the ~. result, an adjournment wotdd he w - te t time, granted, Chambers-1 l 'Annui* heti: of adjournment is • • granted, and Mr. Anderson,rwho no e w t eomplains, looks carefully into theft traniactionshe will be of a very different opi n i on a t th e .. ••'' next meeting. Mr. C. Mathews here said he wattled to Make a fe w observations In regard to the statement m a d e in respect to m jeeellery, which was, that in th e year ' 1837, when l i rc at hi athews's got into difficulties, and before h e h ad the pleasure of kno wing bet, ruse had jeteellery worth about 1 , 1 00/., and at that t r iris Pima' neceesary not only for - her to se ll h er property, but e sh i e t was obliged* to raise money upon her jewels ; and her adviser then rid;- °ibis - is - yeur stock :he trade,"--and such was really the. fact—fer though-_Wiely seem to be an absurd thing, the greater - 3 ''apoiltiott Or. tors in country theatres were ladies, and, conse v. -.:splently.-being well dressed was absolutely requisite. A good a , -averdrobe was her stock in trade, and which gave her a supe ejoeity . over many others: Mr. Watkins, who had raised _ a • the money for these jewels, said that by paying three pounds —per week, she could have the use of them, and go all over the world with than if she liked, and since 1837, no one had troubled themselves about them. At the time of the last insolvency, they wore placed in the hands of tr. Watkins, who asked if they might be-placed in the hands of Messrs. Storr and Mortimer upon the saseeterpls as he had held them. He (Mr. C. Mathews) had got , initOfseverfil legacies by reason of them, for upon his arrest by Mr. • - ;_li,ontan, °utile ,nilght. of his benefit at Liverpool, he had to get / 'a " ' eykipah thorn. .He had always' paid 60 per cent except to Mr. (k _.. _ : reerion, "the had. never taken any interest, and be (Mr. :' , ,,,jiatliaTi) eeidd assure ore Court, that besides a few eaglet of ?:i' . .), : : - .....7_ NI ft B very trifling value, Mr& Mathews had had no jewellery what. ever, excepting those, which for the use of, she paid at the rate of 31. per week. Sir C. F. WILLIAMS did not wish to be niggardly: in permitting an allowance to an insolvent; but still, a man in misfortune must not stand upon stilts, but come down, and settle with his creditors who were suftbring. A man of honour, in such circumstances, would be the more respected by the public the more he abridged his expenses. Mr. Mathews said the 501. a week included 101. for personrl ex. penses, lOL for wardrobe expenses, 51. a week for a carriage, which was much cheaper than a hackney cab, and 51. for servants at the theatre. Mr. James thought that 51. a week for a carriage was too much. Mr. Mathews—l can assure you it is cheaper than hiring a cab; for in the first place we have to go to rehearsal, then Mrs. Mathews has to go and make the necessary purchases for the ward.. robe. We have seldom time to get a dinner until three o'clock ; and in the meantime I have to run round to stop the mouths of creditors for 2,0001., at 60 per cent. ; and for the last five years I have never had time to study a part except in a cab. I can do no more than offer my creditors the one half of what I earn. Sir C. F. WILLIAMS.—i think it is extremely liberal. Mr. Mathews said his reason for coming to this Court was to avoid angry discussion, by making a proposition of giving half his gains, or 1,3001. a year, in liquidation of his debts, which he thought would have put an end to all bickerings; but if he was to have discussion, while he was paying, why then it would be prefer. able for him to go to the other Court, and bear a sentence of six months' remand, for defending actions and obtaining discounts, for then he might have time! to study moral philosophy, but at the same time he would get rid of the 8,0001. Treat me and Bog me too is too bad. Mr. Chambers said that Mr. Mathews bad acted very unad. visedly in going to Paris. After some further discussion an adjournment was agreed to, till the 17th instant. The schedule, which consists of 27 double folio pages, states that the only property which he has consists of wearing apparel, to the amount of 504 while the gross debts and liabilities are 8,1111. 19s. 10d. ; he has no credits, and no debts due to him, Mr. and Mrs. Mathews realised, by provincial engagements, from January 17 to March 31, 1843, for twenty-three nights, at Dublin, 6101.; sixteen nights at Edinburgh, 6401. ; for six at Glasgow, 2641. ; for two at Newcastle, 60/. ; and for five at Liverpool, 2001, From April the 19th to November the 14th, 1843—in April, 140/. ; in May, 2801.; in June, 280/. ; in July, 2801. ; in August, 2081.; in September, 280/. ; in October, 280/. ; and in November, 2481. ; making a total of 4,3621. CENTRAL CRIIIINAL COURT. OLD COURT. (Before Mr. Justice COLERIDGE and Mr. Justice CaassWELL. John Davis, alias John Bliph, 22, and Henryßobinson, 40 were indicted for a burglary in the dwelling-house of Edwin Leaf, in the city of London, and stealing a quantity of ribbon, and some bandanna handkerchiefs, value 50/., his pro perty, and George Hirt, 47, was charged with feloniously receiving a portion of the property, knowing it to have been stolen. Mr. Clarkson conducted the prosecution, and Mr. Wilkins defended Hirt. The other prisoners had no counsel. Several witnesses were called in support of the charge against the prisoners, but it will he unnecessary to give their evidence in detail. The premises of the prosecutor, in Cheap side, were entered on the night of the 10th October last, by the means of a skylight, the glass of which was removed, and the property mentioned in the indictment stolen there from. It was proved that very shortly after the robbery, the prisoner Hirt was found dealing with a portion of the stolen property, which he sold for 251. to a person named Mosenden, in the Minories. The other prisoners were taken into custody in a room in their joint occupation, and upon a search being made, a number of duplicates referring to other portions of the stolen property were found on their premises, as were also a quantity of skeleton keys, and other house breaking implements. Mr. Justice Cresswell having summed up, the jury almost immediately returned a verdict of Guilty against all the prisoners. Mr. Wilkins moved an arrest of judgment, on the ground that the indictment merely charged the first-mentioned pri soners with having burglariously entered the premises of the prosecutor, and stolen a quantity of ribbon, and did not charge them with entering the premises with intent to steal. The Court overruled the objection, and the prisoners were called up for judgment. Davis and Robinson, who were proved to have been before convicted of felony, were sen tenced to be transported for life, and Hirt was sentenced to be transported for ten years. The Common Sergeant sat in the eTening, but the cases disposed of were of no public interest. LLOYD'S SHIPPING. CAUTION TO MARINERS BOUND TO MANILLA. The ship St. Paul, arrived at Salem from Manilla, off Puneym, on July 11 last, saw white coral rocks under water, and found five, six, seven, eight, and 40 fathoms water, and then no bottom with 20 fathoms. These rocks are about three miles S.E. by S. of Sand Island or Day Shoal, and are not laid down in the charts. ' VESSELS SPOKEN WlTlT..—Gertrude, Lisbon to Harbor Grace, lat. 47, lon. 40, by the Zerilda, arrived at Milford. Blair, Calcutta to Leith, 4th inst., off the Dogger; James, Cape de Verds to River Plate, Ist inst., lat. 1 N., lon. 20 IV., by the Blair, spoken as above; William Pitt, Marseilles to Mauritius, Dec. 24, lat. 24 S., lon. 26 W. ; Henry Thompson, London to Jamaica, 19th ult., lat. 26 N., lon. 23 W., by the Bee, arrived at Liverpool. Echo, Tobasco to Hamburgh, the master and three men sick, and supplied with provisions, by the Mercury, arrived at St. John's, Newfoundland. Jane, Hamburgh to Valparaiso, 16th ult., lat. 37, lon. 15, by the Julia, arrived in the River. FLANDERS MAIL. BRUSSELS, FEB. 4.—We were not informed of the date of the death of the Duke of Saxe Coburg. We now learn that it was on the 28th of January, in con sequence of an attack of gout in the stomach. To-day, at noon, the King received, with the usual ceremony, the great deputations sent by the Senate and the Chamber of Representatives to offer to his Majesty the expression of their condolence on the death of his brother, the Duke of Saxe Coburg Gotha. His Majesty returned very gracious answers to the ad dresses of the Presidents, and of the Senate and of the Chamber of Representatives, observing that, if he had lost a beloved brother, Belgium had lost a sincere friend, who loved that country, which he often visited, watching with pleasure the improvement of its public works, its manufactures, and its advance in the sciences and fine arts, of which he was an enlightened protector. A great number of Members of both Chambers had joined their respective deputations, and his Majesty seemed to be much affected by these marks of sympathy. RusslA.—(From the Agram Gazette.)—A disagreeable event in the military school at St. Petersburg is said to have caused an extraordinary sensation among the Rus sian Nobility. One of the masters, having the rank of a general, who had something odd in his manners, was laughed at by the pupils in his class, all of them sons of noblemen. He complained, and at length laid the matter before the Emperor, who looked on it as a very serious breach of military discipline ; ho went himself to the in stitution, and addressed the class very seriously. When he threatened all with severe punishment, five youths declared themselves to be the guilty parties. They re ceived each fifty blows with the cane, and were sent to serve as common soldiers in the army of the Caucasus. The nobles consider the first part of the punishment as a violation of their privileges." SPORTING INTELLIGENCE. TATTERSALL'S—YESTERDAY. CHESTER CUP. 14 to 1 agst Mr. Collett's Cattonite 15 to 1 agst Mr. W. Dawson's Merry Andrew —taken 16 to 1 agst Mr. Lancaster's The Prior—taken 22 to 1 agst Mr. J. Tuting's Tacita 20 to 1 agst Mr. Bristow's Pharaoh—taken freely 25 to 1 agst Col. Cradock's Pagan—taken 25 to 1 apt Lord Westminster's Martyr—taken 30 to 1 agst Mr. Stephenson's Freedom—taken 40 to 1 agst Mr. Speed's Everton—taken 40 to 1 apt Mr. H. Stebbings' Celeste—taken 1000 to 20 agst Mr. Igoe's Broken Down—taken 1000 to 15 agst Mr. Minor's President—taken. Nothing worth mention was done en the two leading fa vourites ; nor, in short, were any in request, except the Prior and Pharaoh, about whom the odds above quoted were not obtainable at the close. Business generally was very flat. DERBY. 30 to 1 agst Mr. Ford's lot—taken 6to 1 agst Mr. John Day's The Ugly Buck—t freely 8 to 1 agst Mr. Crockford's Rattan 16 to 1 agst Mr. Lichtwald's Leander 17 to 1 agst Col. Peel's Leander—taken freely 25 to 1 agst Lord Maidstone's Cockamaroo 35 to 1 agst Mr. Thomhill's Apprentice 35 to 1 agst Mr. Payne's Vat colt—taken 2000 to 40 agst Mr. J. Osborne's Mount Charles - 1000 to 100 agst Orlando and Leander —taken 500 to 50 agst Leander and Cockamaroo—taken 1200 to 400 Ugly Buck and Rattan —taken The Buckites, fonder than ever, increased their invest ments to a large amount at 6 to 1, took 1,200 to 400 about their pet coupled with Rattan, and still were not "convinced." 11 to 2 was the closing offer on the field,:and Bto 1 against Rattan, whose friends stood out for 9to 1. Leander had a numerous party against him, and so few to "bear up," that we cannot well quote him at less than 16 to 1 ; the only bets we heard were 15 to 1 in hundreds, early in the afternoon, -and 1,000 to 100 against him jointly with 'Orlando, at least two points above the market price, and of course taken ea gerly. Orlando was backed freely at 17 to 1, and anything above 25 to 1 would have been taken about Coekamaroo. No other change. [ ADVERTISEMENT. SUPPLEMENTS GRATIS WITH THE " DISPATCH." Every Week during the GREAT NATIONAL TRIAL AT DUBLIN A succession of SUPPLEMENTS GRATIS WILL BE P 1 WITH TIIE DISPATCH. The First on SUNDAY, February 4, con taining Mr. Sheil's Speech, a gem of oratory... The Second (of the full size of the WEEKLY DISPATCH) on SUNDAY, February 11, con taining the Speeches of Mr. Whiteside,- Mr. O'Connell, and other Leading Counsel who may address the Court in the course of the Week, for which the services of several Short hand Writers of Eminence have been engaged„ ; The dimensions of the succeeding Supplements will be re gulated by the importance of the matter; but the last Sup plement will be also of the full size of the DISPATCH, and form the early portion of the trial, and embrace the proceed ings from the commencement to that stage at which the first begins, so that every subscriber to the WEEKLY DIS PATCH will be in possession of a complete and faithful re cord of this great national trial—a trial which must become a matter of history, and ever be regarded as an event of un usual importance. A BIOGRAPHICAL SKETCH of MR. O'CONNELL will precede the account of the Trial, which will be written by a Gentleman intimately acquainted with the " great Agitator," mid consequently one who has treasured up many reminiscences that will render the Biography a paper of general and absorbing interest. The SUPPLEMENTS, forming a great number of columns; will be printed uniformly with the DISPATCH, and contain a quantity of information equal to at least an Octavo Volume of Orders receivedpages by every Bookseller News and Agent in the United Ki ng d om, and at the Dl SPATelliDffice, 139, Fleet -street. I DEATH OF THE HONOURABLE LADY BURTON.— The Honourable Lady Burton died on Monday last, at her reel.. dence at Clifton. She was the widow of the late Hon. Sir Francis Burton, G.C. H., twin brother of the late Marquis of Conyngham, and sister to Lord Cloncurry and Lady Dunsany. Her Ladyship leaves two tons to lament her lose. rBLISHED • IMPERIAL PARLIAMENT. • ' HOUSE OF LORDS, Feb. 8. The LORD CHANCELLOR took his seat on the Wool sack at Five o'Clock. ACTIONS FOR PENALTIES ON GAMING DIS. CONTINUANCE BILL. Lord BROUGHAM, in the absence of the Duke of Richmond, moved the second reading of the Actions for Penalties on gaming Discontinuance Bill. Their Lord ships were aware that the Legislature had at various times passed laws for the suppression' of gambling, and among those laws was one imposing certain 'penalties on parties who should lose more than 101. at a sitting at any game. The courts of law had chosen to apply this statute to horse racing, although he was at a loss to understand how they could come to such a conclusion ; yet such was the case. The Legislature, however, always reserved the power of pre venting its decisions being abused, and in the case to which he referred, many must respectable persons, among them many Noble and Hon. Friends of his own, had had qui lam actions brought against them to recover penalties to an immense amount on account of their having betted on horse-races. These Noble and Honourable persons were merely desirous of encouraging manly sports, and of improving the breed of horses, in which we surpassed all Europe. :They were ignorant of the law on the sub ject. They betted, and when they lost they paid their bets honourably ; but many of the persons with whom they betted were dishonourable persons, who refused to pay when they lost. Steps had of late been taken at all respectable meetings to drive these dishonourable persons from the turf, and, not from any honest and honourable motive—not from any desire to put down gambling, but from motives of mere spite—these persons had raked up the penal clauses of these Acts of Parliament, and had brought qui tam actions for the recovery of penalties against these noble persons. He did not know the exact amount of the penalties sought to be recovered, but one Noble Friend of his was liable to 68,0001., another Noble Friend to 102,0001., and a county Member, a gentleman whose character stood very high, to no less than 120,000/. The whole amount was probably 300,000/. He understood that all these actions were brought by the sons of the keepers of places, the name of which respect for his audience prevented him from stating.—(Laughter.) But it was notorious that these actions were brought by the keepers of gaming-houses of the worst description. He had no knowledge of gaming whatever, but he had been assured that the case was as he had shortly stated it. What the Bill proposed was, not that any prospective law should be passed, but only that the bad parts of the old law should be repealed, and some good and sound provisions substituted in their stead. It was proposed that, on application to the Judges in chambers, an order should be obtained to stop the pending actions on pay ment of the costs out of pocket of the parties bringing them. The Bill had the full approval of the Chief Justice of the Queen's Bench, the greatest common-law Judge in England. He proposed also to add a clause, on the third reading, for suspending future actions, as, if they did not, the moment the present writs were ended new actions would be commenced. Lord CAMPBELL felt much pleasure -in supporting the Bill. He was assured that the actions were brought by infamous persons—that was clear—either for the pur pose of extorting money, or to avenge themselves for some supposed wrong. At the same time he thought the Noble Lord, out of respect to the grave and venerable sages of the law might have spoken less severely of the decisions pronounced for the last hundred years in Westminster Hall on this question. The Act against gambling, included " any other games whatsoever ;" now horse-racing was a game ; chariot-racing was a game ; it was one of the ancient Olympic games. He agreed that the common informer was a pestilent cha racter; but the law had hitherto given them the penalties on convictions and the costs of action. He thought to deprive them now of what the Legislature had always awarded them was unadvisable. The Bishop of LONDON did not intend to oppose the • second reading of the Bill. Some doubts that he had felt with regard to it had been removed by the Noble and Learned Lord who had moved the second reading. He apprehended that the third clause only extended to such a time as would enable the House to give a due consideration to the subject. Lord BROUGHAM—Nothing more. The Bishop of LONDON said, the principle of admitting common informers to give evidence was similar to that which admitted particeps cri minis to give evidence against their confederates. The whole proceeding appeared to him somewhat ob jectionable, and partook of the nature of modifying the existing laws on behalf of the rich at ,the expense of the poor. If poor persons incurred debts and responsibilities which they were unable to pay, the Legis lature would not interfere on their behalf to relieve them from the payment. Unless they also made the law stringent and salutary against gaming, he thought the present Bill might be considered as rather favourable to it. Ile could not approve of any measure that tended to encourage betting, especially among the poor. They might leave the rich to do what they chose with their property, but they ought to interfere to protect the poor. Lord BROUGHAM said the law had always ad mitted common informers to put the law in force. It was a great anomaly, but the law having trusted to the popularis actio, and confided to common informers the work ing of different Acts, he thought it ought not now to deprive these men of their costs out of pocket, and the penalty also. But were they to go on for ever on this most bar barous system, with no one to watch over and enforce the laws, no public prosecutor, the enforcing of Acts being given either to the worst possible characters, or to the offended and aggrieved parties ? The want of a public prosecutor was productive of great mischief. He knew a case in which forgery to the amount of 5,000/. was committed at Plymouth, and the party escaped, by his friends subscribing and buying off the prosecutor, so that when the trial was called on, no one appeared. He remembered once to have seen a most respectable gentleman —a man worth 20,000/. a year—standing in the dock to be tried for his life on a charge of murder ; and he believed That his not being of the same sect as the grand jury entered very much into the cause of his being so charged. The murder consisted of not his, but his bailiff's, having neglected to hang a lamp across a road which he was getting mended, in consequence of which an old woman lost her life. He should never forget the indig nation of the Learned Judge when he asked where was the grand jury, and had ascertained that they were gone. The man, of course, was acquitted. This was an instance of the system that he deprecated of committing the execution of the laws to the irrre sponsible conduct of private individuals. The Bishop of EXETER said it was his painful duty to give expression to sentiments at variance, not only with those of the Noble and Learned Lord who had just sat down, but also with those of the whole House. It appeared to him that the law of the land having given certain rights to these informers, the Legislature should he reluctant in repealing them. It had been said that the sovereigns of the country for the last two centuries had, by giving King's and Queen's plates, encouraged this sort of amusement. In the reign of Charles the Second, however, who had very much encouraged that species of amusement by giving such plates, a statute was introduced to put down, what ? Not horse-racing—not to restrain betting—but to restrain excessive gaming. Now what was the great plea upon which the Clouse was called on to put an end to those outrageous cases ? It was, that if those actions would proceed, it was possible that all the damages that might be awarded would amount to half a million. He ven tured to ask any of their Lordships if that were not execs sive gaming 'I hey were asked toput an end to the statute which would check that excessive gaming ; and why ? because the Legislature found that there were persons base enough to avail themselves of the faults of others, to enrich themselves. But it must be remembered that the law gave to these very individuals the right of action. It had been said that this was not the first time that a measure of this sort had been brought before their Lordships. He was aware of a remarkable case that had reference to the penal ties incurred by the clergy. A person availed himself of information obtained in an office, to inform the proper authorities that certain clergymen being resident in one living were not resident at other livings in their possession. Of course the Legis lature gave them relief from the action that was brought against ,them, but it was coupled with the condition that they should be allowed a certain time to put up a notification of their intended absence, and that if such notification were not well founded, then that the ac tions should proceed. Thus the Legislature in 1814, in that case stepped in to protect the objects of the law. That was a precedent for their Lordships to follow and it, was for their Lordships to consider whether the parties who came for relief in the present ease, had offended or not against the principle of the law, which it was now sought to repeal. The object of the law they were called on to suspend—was to prevent excessive gaming ; and the question to be considered was, whether those parties who now came before the House had or had not offended against the principle of the law. He had come down intending to propose that the Bill should not be proceeded with for six months, but, after hearing the authority of the Lord Chief Justice on the subject, he would content himself with saying " Not Content." Lord BROUGHAM said, that although it was quite true that the penalties to be recovered against some of these parties were:very heavy, the fact was that they were not -their own debts. It was well known that a man's friends betted for him in various parts of the country, and thus the aggregate sum was made up of various independent debts. He should move an amendment with regard to costs and the limitation of time, on the third reading. Lord CAMPBELL said the ground on which he supported this Bill was, that the statute in question had become obsolete, and no action had been brought upon it, for, he believed, fifty years. According to the law of some countries, as of Scotland, for example, this desuetude of the law would be tantamount to its repeal. In this country, however, it could be revived for vexatious and oppressive purposes. When the object was to put the law in force for such purposes, and not tocarry out the just intents of the law, he thought the Legislature ought to interpose to stop those actions. After a few words from the Bishop of EXETER,- the Bill was read a second time, and ordered to be read a third time to-morrow. THE TEACHERS OF SCHOOLS (IRELAND) BILL. This Bill was read a second time. The House then adjourned. HOUSE OF COMMONS, Feb. 8. The SPEAKER took the Chair at Four o'Clock. METROPOLITAN IMPROVEMENTS. Mr. T. DUNCOMBE presented petitions from St. Giles's-in-the-Fields, and St. George's, Bloomsbury, complaining of the manner in which the Commis sioners of- Woods and Forests conducted what was called the metropolitan improvements. The peti tioners stated, that in order to carry out these improve meats the Commissioners pulled down streets, but they THE SUN, LONDON, FRIDAY' EVENING, FEBRUARY 9, 1844 showed no disposition to build them up again. The consequence of this was, that trade in the particular neighbourhoods had been stopped, and the petitioners prayed the House to call upon the Commissioners to proceed more rapidly with their work. The Hon. Member also presented a petition praying for Universal Suffrage. GRIEVANCES. Mr. WALLACE presented a petition from Pollock shaws, in Scotland, praying the House to take into its consideration the grievances of the people before grant ing the supplies. - METROPOLITAN BRIDGE TOLLS. Lord EBRINGTON presented a petition, praying for the abolition of the Metropolitan bridge tolls. TEA DUTIES. Mr. WILSON PATTEN presented a petition from the merchants of Preston, praying for a reduction in the duties on tea. ARMY ESTIMATFS. Sir H. HARDINGE presented the army estimates, by order of her Majesty, and gave notice that as they would be printed and in the hands of Members in three or four days, he should move them' in Committee of Supply on Friday, the 16th of February. NOTICES OF MOTION. —BRAZILS. Mr. LABOUCHERE gave notice that he Would, on Thursday, the 22d of February, bring forward a- motion respecting the relations between this country and the Brazils. CRIMINAL LAW OF SCOTLAND. Mr. WALLACE gave notice that he would, on the 22d of February, move for a Select Committe to inquire into the administration of the criminal law in Scotland so far as related to the punishment of prisoners. COURT OF CHANCERY—COMPENSATION. Mr. WATSON gave notice that - he would, on the 22d, move for a Select Committee to inquire into the orders for compensation made by the Court of - Chancery with regard to persons filling the offices of Six Clerks and Waiting Clerks under the 6th of Victoria, and for an inquiry into the emoluments of those officers before the passing of that Statute ; and into the amount of compensation due at that time, and for seven years after the death of each officer ; and into the circum stances relating to the passing of the Act ; the appli cation of the money raised thereby, and the propriety of continuing the same.—{Hear, hear.) SLAVE TRADE. Lord PALMERSTON stated that he would postpone the motion of which he had given notice last night with regard to the slave trade, till this day fortnight. LAW OF MASTERS AND SERVANTS. Mr. MILES gave notice that he would bring in a Bill to amend the laws relating to masters and servants. Mr. FERRAND gave notice that, to-morrow evening, he should put a question to Sir James Graham, unless in moving, this evening, his announced Bill for the amendment of the Poor-law, the information he sought should be elicited. Lord Chief Justice Denman having, on a recent occasion, declared it to be the unani mous opinion of the Judges that, in some cases, it was necessary to break in on an Act of Parliament ; and it having also been decided that the mother was always the proper party to be appointed as trustee to her own children, he (Mr. Ferrand) proposed to ask whether, in the Bill which it was intended to bring in to amend the Poor-law, the Government had inserted a clause for the purpose of prohibiting the mother and child from being se parated in the event of their becoming the inmates of a workhouse. _ THt AMEERS OF SINDE. Lord ASHLEY, in rising to bring forward the motion of which he had given notice, in reference to the Ameers of Sinde, said it would have been more agreeable to him self, and not a little so to the House, if the subject he was about to introduce had been brought fore ard by some Member of greater importance. He had waited until the close of last Session, partly to see whether any other Member would undertake the office of speaking in behalf of these impri soned Ameers, and partly in expectation of the arrival of certain appeals from India to her Majesty in Council. These appeals had not arrived, but why they had not arrived no one could say. It might be that their pos sessions being confiscated, they had not the means to forward or to prosecute them ; it might be that it was out of their power to do anything in their own behalf, on account of the rigorous imprisonment to which they were subjected. But whatever was the eause, it was most fitting and necessary that justice should be done to those unfortunate princes— (Hear, hear)—and the na tional honour of the country vindicated. Now, having felt most deeply that the question should be entrusted to other and abler hands, he had, since he gave a notice on the subject last session, determined altogether to abandon it, not from any want of confidence in themerits of the case, but on account of his own incapacity to do justice to it. But when there appeared in the columns of the Morning Chronicle—an important paper—a letter bearing the signature of Sir Henry Pottinger—and such a letter—(Loud cries of " Hear, hear")—from such a man—he did feel that it was his duty no longer to shrink from the task of bringing the subject before that House. In this remarkable letter Sir Henry Pottinger says —" I lamented over the fallen state of my old friends, the Ameers, of whose case I all along said, and ever shall say, under all circumstances, and in all states and parties, that it is the most unprincipled and disgraceful that ever tarnished the national honour. No explanation or reason can, in my opinion, justify such proceedings towards them, and I know more of them than any man living. You cannot use too strong language in expressing my disapprobation and disgust at these proceedi ngs ." True, true to the very letter. These unhappy princes have strong claims, and he asked, in their name—what he would not ask in his own—that the House would be kind enough to give him a patient and even a favourable hearing.—(Hear, hear.) With the permission of the House, he would now proceed to state the history of our connection with that country, and the claims which these princes put forth to the consideration and sympathy of the British Parliament. These princes, whose case he was now bringing before the House, are —that is to say, were dum regna erant—a combination, or federation, of crowned heads, ruling conjointly under the style and title of the Ameers o f Sinde ; they ac quired their country by conquest, and ruled over a people of dift'erent language and religion from them selves, but if that was to be used as an argument against the Ameers of Sinde, as he perceived it was used in ene of the minutes of the• Governor-General, that argument would recoil with ten fold force upon ourselves. Why, what were they in India ? If they allowed this to weigh a single instant on their minds as an argument for the course of proceed ing against these fallen princes, it-would be retorted with tenfold vigour upon ourselves. The Ameers were recog nised that country by several suc cessiveas Viceroys rn e g ro o j v ' e so o f rs flnodia. They endeavoured to in stitute friendly relations with the Am eers o f Sinde , l a v n i t d h thendeavoured Bcouldu riatci British e to empire.pt Fromr h o e v m e to them that nothing but be nefits from an extended intercourse 1758 to 1799 the East India Company passed through every variety of favour and disfavour—of suspicion and fear—of confidence and jealousy; but at last, in 1801, a treaty was made between the East India Company and the Ameers. It was the first docu ment in the blue-book, and contained this passage : "There shall be eternal friendship between the British Govern ment and the Ameers of Sinde." A second passage stated that "unanimity shall never cease between the two nations." The same thing was declared in a new treaty in 1802, by which the relations of the former treaty were expressed in still stronger terms. The Ameers asserted that they had faithfully observed the conditions and spirit of the treaty. Those who espoused the cause of the Ameers said that the British Government had completely violated the treaty. To form some estimate of the character of the two parties it would be well to refer to history. They would find by a book lately published by a most intelligent author, that the demeanour of the Ameers towards the other States was most peaceable. Could the same be said of uobject of our e ff or t s i n I n di a was s to Now obtai t n he primary eand unrestricted navigation of the Indus, and scruple after scruple was overcome in the minds of the Ameers, who acquiesced in each request made to them for our political advantage. In the year 1832 we obtained the partial navigation of the Indus, and, in 1834, the Ameers made further concessions to meet our views. In the second article of the treaty of 1838, it was conceded that the British Minister should reside at Hyderabad, with liberty to change his residence as he thought expedient. From this time up to 1840, there was a spirit of suspicion, of fear, of alarm, and of everything likely to excite distrust on both sides. We then called upon the Ameers to perform their part of the treaties which we ourselves had violated. In 1840 the rebellion broke out at Gwalior ; large bodies of troops were then sent through the country of the Ameers, and if they had been at all in hostility to us it would have been of the most alarming consequence to the British Government in India. They would find in the accounts of Lieut. Postans, who was at the time a resident in Sinde, that the Aineei s at that time gave to the British Government the most cordial co - operation. The importance of their aid under the circumstances was rendered unquestionable by the evi dence of Sir John Keane himself. He said, in writing to the G ov ernor -G enera l , t h a t it would have been impossibl e to have p rocee d e d if t h ey h a d left Sinde in a state of hos tility. New, after this, the difficulties of the British Go vernment in India increased, but as those difficulties in- creased there ;asnOdi;PQtion shown by the Ameers to diminish their friendship. They would find, in the ac count of Lieutenant Postans, that at the time the affairs of Candahar assumed so fearful an aspect as to direct at tention to that quarter that the chiefs were left in full possession of their property. There was then nothing in the conduct of the Ameers to suppose, that any hos tility existed, although at that time they might have materially injured us, if not have crushed the few troops which then occupied Sinde. This, it must be remembered, was at a time when all India was anxiously watching to catch the spark of rebellion, and to strike the blow which we were then endeavouring to ward off. But still the Ameers were true to us, in spite of the efforts of political subordinates, to vvhoni was en trusted the duty of stirring up, as much as possible, the minds of a fiercely bigoted Mahommedan people. Let the House observe what forbearance they had shown; let them observe the precautions which were taken not to offend either on one hand or the other. The manner in which the Ameers then acted was strongly indicative of the faith they entertained towards this empire. There could be no doubt that they were then subjected to great temptation by ever y a rgument that could be used on such occasions by the disaffected, the resistance to which arguments was looked upon as almost an apostacy in their faith. Yet, in spite of this, they had continued true to the British Government.—(Hear.) All this was borne out by Major Outtam. He stated in 1840 that the conduct of the Ameers was most peace able, and greatly facilitated the progress of the troops. The Governor-General himself also wrote, and bore the same testimony. The Governor-General said that the conduct of the Ameers towards the officers and towards the troops in their passage through Upper and Lower Sinde was most friendly. nil was all the evidence which could De show, of those famous circulars. On the 22d of May, the Go vernor-General sent a letter in which he stated his final conditions to Major Outram. Let any one read them and say, whether they wer e no t mos t harsh and severe ; but little time, however, was allowed for deliberation, an army having been assembled on the frontier; the nego tiations which we proposed were backed by the presence of a considerable force—violence naturally begot vio lence, and distrust and dismay pervaded the whole country. It was wholly impossible for the Ameers to control their subjects, and they made an attack upon' the house of the Resident. Then followed a battle— the Ameers were beaten and carried into captivity, and thus those famous treaties, which began by declaring the inviolability of the country, were wound up by the imprisonment of the Ameers and the conquest and an nexation of Sinde to our empire in India. But those princes were charged with treachery. No doubt they were —of course they were—charged with treachery. Every one who undertook to establish such a weighty inputa tion against them would of course be provided with a precious pretext for it. But where was the proof ? Again and again he (Lord A.) asked, where was the proof that those persons were guilty of treachery, either to the person of the Resident, or to the rights and privi leges and power of the British ? No doubt there was great distrust among the inhabitants—no doubt there was great desire to get rid of our troops—and no doubt they availed themselves of whatever opportunities pre -sented to effect that purpose. But was there not a cause for the course of policy which the Ameers had been compelled to adopt? He would pass by all the violence of language on both sides, and would come to the simple facts which must have produced that effect upon the Ameers, and compelled them to enter upon that course of intrigue and distrust which ultimately was used as an argument for their destruction and ruin. In July, 1838, the Governor-General, having determined to carry on a system of operations in Affghanistan, was desirous of putting Sindian affairs in such a position as would best favour his ambitious intrigue. He therefore directed a letter to be sent to the Resident in Sinde, in which there was this famous passage, " The Governor-General is averse from contemplating such a result as a refusal on the part of the Ameers to enter into a composition with Shah Soojah." Such a compo sition as what ? Such as might be conducive to their interest ?—such as they upon due deliberation might think desirable for their independence ? No such thing. " Such a composition with Shah Soojah as the British Governor may think just and reasonable." That was a pretty way to treat an independent State. But this was not all. He then went on to say, "In case of refusal" what was to happen ? That they should retire from the negotiation, lamenting that it had utterly failed ? No such thing. "In case of refusal temporary occupation should be taken of Shikarpore and of so much of the country adjacent as may be necessary." Nor was even that all : still more was demanded. " While .the present exigency lasts," said the Go vernor-General, " you may apprise the Ameers that the article of the treaty with them"—(the House would remember with what difficulty the treaty of 1832 was obtained)—" respecting the freedom of the Indus, and the transit of military stores, must necessarily be suspended." They must recollect that nothing had yet been charged against the Ameers. Subsequently, in deed, they were involved in intrigues with the Court of 'Persia. He did not mean to defend their policy; but' he would simply ask, whether they had set - " - them an unblemished example ?—(Hear, hear.) Whether_ their own performance of treaties and open and honest dealings were so manifest that they could fairly call upon the Atneers : to lay aside all in trigue, and not resort to that plotting which, was the usual subterfuge of the weaker party? Theinterval was filled up with the observance of conditions, and all anger appeared to have passed away. But in November, 1838, there occurred a demand of far greater importance. The Governor-General signified his desire to occupy for a time the fortress of Bukhur. Now, the extreme value and importance of that fortress might be best gathered from the words of Sir Henry Pottinger. Sir Henry Pottinger, in a letter, set forth the advan— tage of which that fortress would be to them. The ces sion of that fortress would put Roostum Khan's friend ship to the test. He begged of the House to bear this in mind, that they might hear the recom pense which the old man received.—(Hear, hear.) Sir Alexander Burnes was employed in the negotiation for the cession of the place, and in a letter written by him it was said, "If you do not get the place you must take it." And this was .the way in which they dealt with the independence of those people, and now they were surprised that the Ameers re sorted to intrigue, for the purpose of defeating them. On the 25th Sir A. Burnes writes thus :—" It is with the highest satisfaction I inform the Governor-General that the fortress of Bukkur has been ceded to the British Government on the terms proposed." He trusted he was not wearying the House by entering into these details. He would now show what pangs it must have cost the Ameer Roostum Khan to have ceded this place. In a letter written by Sir A. Burnes, he said the consternation of the Ameers was very great when it was signified to them that this fortress was demanded. The whole family of Roostum Khan were opposed to its being given up, and they consi dered the honour of the country was involved in the mat ter. This showed the greatness of the concession made for the advantage of this country. Sir Alexander Burnes, writing in December, 1838, says, that he visited Roostum Khan, who told him he experienced the greatest difficulty in ceding the fortress of Bukkur, and that his whole fa mily opposed his giving it up. He told him he was an old man, and had but few years to live; that henceforth he had nothing to do but submit, and be the humble and obedient servant of England. Now all the use had been made of him; and in Decem ber, 1841, Lord Auckland, actuated by a high sense of honour, and feeling himself bound to redress the acts of violence and of wrong which had been committed, directed Sir James Carnac to do all he could to make compensation. Such being the case, let the House imagine the dismay and disgust with which the Ameers must have heard the announcement which followed, when after such wishes of the Governor-General when after such a long period of conflicting friendship -after snch services as they had rendered to the British Empire, came forth this verbose and grand epistle to Major Outram. The Secretary to the Gover nor-General wrote to Major Outram to say, " The Governor-General directs me to inform you, that he contemplates taking possession of Kurrachee and the island of Bukkur." Now he did ask that House, was-there any amount of distrust—was there any species, of self-defence—which it was not justifiable for these Ameers to resort to to defend themselves against the unscrupulous endeavours of the English to retain their possessions ? He (Lord Ashley)_ declared his solemn conviction that they had no ground, no right whatever to charge these Ameers with treachery, even had they taken the most decided and determined mea sures to drive the British, not only from Sinde, but from the Indian possessions altogether. Now, to turn to other evidences in these papers. On the 4th of June, 1842, the Secretary to the Governor-General writes to the political agent at Sinde, and says : " The Governor-General has learnt with regret, but without surprise, your opinion of the infidelity of the Ameers." He proceeded—" The Governor- General wishes to be informed if your troops are in such a position as to make it easy to annex a portion of the Ameers' possessions to the British empire." So that on the single opinion —the mere opinion, of the Governor-General:as to the infidelity of the Ameers—the political agent was to proceed to cut off an enormous slice of their possessions, in order to annex it to the British Crown. Well, was it to be supposed that Roostum Khan was not apprised of this ? If they supposed that he, know ing these things, would not take every means in his power to save himself, they must have peculiar opinions of human nature. Sir Charles Napier, who of course was in direct and confidential communication with the Governor-General, says in a letter to that high functionary—" I have always maintained that we only want a fair pretext to coerce the Ameers." This was actually announced by the representative of the Governor-General, and was it to be supposed that while all this was going on, while all these schemes were hatching, the Ameers were going quietly and un heedingly on—living as it were in a fool's paradise? At a subsequent period the Governor-General writes to Sir Charles Napier as follows :—" I adhere to my original intention, with respect to the Ameers ; if any one of them commits an overt act, his possessions shall be confiscated, and he shall depend for subsistence on the charity of his friends."—(Hear. Now this was written at a time w h en we were assem bling horses, men, and materials at v Sukkur ; and could it be matter for surprise that the Ameers became uneasy, and prepared to take measures for the safety of themselves and their possessions? On the 27th of November Sir Charles Napier writes to the Governor-General:—" I have made up, my mind that although war has not been declared, nor is it ne cessary to declare it, I will at once march into the territory of the Ameers." How then could it be wondered at, that the Beloochees, excited by national pride and religious enthusiasm, should take the alarm, and prepare to act? Why, Major Outram admitted, in one of his letters; that it was in consequence of the advance of the British army that the Beloochees would not be restrained, and also (and let this fact be marked) also that the I meers bad been occupied the whole day in endeavouring to dis perse them. This brought him to the most important docu ment of the whole—the minutes of the Conference between Major Outram and the Ameers, on February the Bth and 9th, 1843, just p rev i ous to t h e b attle of Meeanee. It was most important, because, although it had been commented on both by the Governor-Ge neral ant by Sir Charles Napier, they had left untouched the mo s t ma t er i a l part o f the statement. The Governor-General repeated the charges of treason against the Amecrs, and urged them as an argument to justify their dethronement. The Ameers in that con ference in reply to the charge of having written trea sonable letters to two of the chieftains, asked why those letters were never produced ?—(Hear, hear.) That included the whole case. Why were the Ameers not afforded an opportunity of proving that they had never written those letters ? He appealed to the House to do the Ameers justice—(Cheers)—and justice could never be done them, until they had had _an opportunity of disproving these letters. It had been said that a comparison had been made of the band-writing, but Meer Nusseer Khan denied that those letters had been written with his authority. His words weree' If this letter is in existence show it to me." The document was not produced. Had such conduct ever been heard of before ?—(Hear) Would it be tolerated in any of our courts of justice ?—(Hear.) Would the law officers of the Crown defend it ?—(Hear, hear.) He asked fur justice for the Ameers.—(Hear, hear.) He asked for that which was theirs by the rights of human nature.—(Great cheering.) One letter, it appeared, , had been produced. The Ameers asked to see it, and the reply Is as on the part of Major Outram,' that that letter had been placed in the hands of Ali Murad, who was suspected of having forged every one of the letters.—(Hear, hear.) That letter hail been put into the halide of Ali Mural if it eould have been produced rit ought to, have been produced. That paper was never shown to the Ameers. Whatever might be the result of the present motion he trusted that the treatment which they had experienced with re gard to that document would not be suffered to pass without the marked reprobation of the House.--(Cheers.) However, the Commissioner proceeded. "The ques tion is," he said, " whether you will or will not accept the new treaty ; if not, the army under Sir Charles Naper will continue to advance." The Ameers replied—" If the army advances, our Beloochees will not be restrained, and we shall be blamed for the consequences." The Commisioner said it was in their own power to prevent' them. The Ameers said, " We deny the charges on which the treaty is . imposed, but still we _will subscribe it." Major Outram proceeded=" The Ameers bes me to write to the General to delay his march, and to say that if the British troops did advance it would be impossible to restrain the Beloo ches." On the 10th February, Major Outram wrote to Sir Charles Napier, stating that he had sent off Fitzgerald with a dispatch on the previous night, announcing that the Ameers bad subscribed the treaty. On the 12th, he said " these fools are in the utmost alarm, in conse quence of the continued progress of your troops." He said " he feared that they would be impelled by their alarm to assemble their rabble with a view to defend themselves. On the 13th, he wrote that the Aineers of Upper and Lower Suide had accepted the new treaty. But now it was to be observed, that so desirous were these Ameers to maintain peace with the British empire, that in their steps, to accomplish this object, they ex posed themselves to the obloquy of their own people. Major Outram wrote that the Ameers were execrated for their dishonourable submission to what was termed robbery, and that they hazarded their own lives t guard his person. Major Outram wrote that the Ameers had sent to him to say that the Beloochees were quite uncontrollable, and that they had begged him to leave the residence as soon as Asible, stating that they gave the advice from pure affebtion. Then occurred the attack. He must take the liberty of remarking upon the slovenly and incorrect manner in • which these charges had been made, which involved such enormous consequences. Sir Charles Napier, in writing to the Governor-General an account of the battle, said, that on the 'night. of the 14th the treaty was signed, and, on the morning of the 15th, the residence was attacked, and the Governor-General, in his pro ; clamation, repeated a statement implying the utter treachery of the Ameers. Whereas, by referring to the documents they would, ascertain that the treaty was signed on the night of the 12th, and that between the 12th and the 14th the Ameers endeavoured to dismiss their people, and warned Major Outram of the danger in which he was placed.—(Hear, hear.) He complained " very • much of this sloven lines, and of the refusal to show them the letters. Bat he had another complaint to make ; he complained of those running comments, those foot-lines, appended to the letters of .Major Outram, which he thought were highly objectionable, unless it should turn out that Major Outram had seen them. The Ameers were defeated and dethioned. In the dispatches of the Governor-General the Ameers were spoken of as if they were responsible. The Governor-General, writing to the Secret Committee, said the Ameers were entirely masters of their own troops. It seemed to be doubtful even now that such was the case. The Governor-General admitted since then that the Ameers had not control over their troops ; and if this weak and miserable Government was unable to restrain even those who were said to act fur it, was it not cruel that they should be held responsible for deeds 'over which they hid no control whatever ? He care'ully abstained from touching on the original policy I. l kaaiding the annexation of the territory of the Aineers. .tae. did besitate to say that he still entertained very strong opinions on r the. subject, but he would consider the deeds of whif. he A)oke.rin the abstract It was utterly impossible that theie'Princes could be supposed to have entertained ,any hostile intentions- to, wards this country. Why, if they had, would they have left their women and their valuables in our power? would they not have taken the ordinary precautions ? (Hear, hear.) "Would they have left those things which they valued most at Hyderabad—all their treasure, and their wives and children ? If they, had intended to march out and conduct hostile operations, it was mani fest they would have disposed of them, and . sent them westward. They had on former oc c a s i ons done so ; not do so then ? - Was it consistent with common sense —was it in the course of common reason—that at a period when our troops were almost defenceless and in ' significant in numbers, that the Ameers would not have fallen on them, but reserved' their attack for a period at which our troops were numerous, and they had no reason able chance of overcoming them ?—(Hear, hear.) But even if the Ameers had been guilty, had they not been already sufficiently sacrificed ?—( Hear, hear.) Let the House consider the position in which the Ameers were placed. They had been deprived of their throne, of their rank, of their property, and of all inde pendent sustenance f or th emse l ves an d the i r children. they had been imprisoned and exposed to the greatest privations. He 'would take the liberty of reading a portion of a letter which had been addrespd to the Go vernor of Bombay, by one of the captives. The writer said—"l have received a letter from the ladies of my family complaining that 565 rupees per month, allowed by Sir Charles Napier, is not sufficient to keep up their establishment" The House must recollect that what would be .a fitting establishment here would be consi dered as almost pauperism with the Ameers. This fact, contained in theletter to which he had referred, was con firmed by a private letter which he (Lord Ashley) had received from Bombay, dated the 28th of November, in which it was stated that 'the grant to the ladies was in sufficient, and although application had been made to increase it yet that application had not been attended to. Unless the accounts contained in the letters from Hyder abad were grossly exaggerated, the condition of the poor women Was really wretched, without their lina , bands, brothers, or sons,-.or any one to whom they could apply for consolation: As a prison allowance no doubt the allowance to .the Ameers was liberal, but, as if it were any allowance to the same persons at large, it was contemptible. Was it the intention of the Govern ment that they should be treated as prisoners ?—(Hear, hear.) In a letter he had received from Bombay his correspondent stated that the Ameers had been thrown into the deepest grief, as they be lieved that they were to be, prisoners for life. They were surprised that such a return should have been made to them for past services. —(Hear ? hear.) They stated that while the Beloochees were in a state of in's'urrection, they remained quite tranquil, and they stated that they were entirely innocent of the charges laid to their account. It appeared that the two sons of Post Mahorned had been confined in separate prisons, and their separation had plunged their mother into the deepest distress. She stated that it would much lessen her grief if they were allowed to be in the same prison together. He would next refer the House to a letter of Sir Charles Napier, and hi doing so he did not wish to cast any invidious reflection upon that gallant and dis tinguished officer. He thought that Gallant Officer was entitled to every honour that the Crown could bestow upon him, to the thanks of the House and of the country for his gallantry. But still, speaking for the Ameers, he felt bound to draw the attention of the House to this letter, in order to show the spirit in which the inter course with them had been conducted, and the insults and degradation towhich they had been subjected. The letter was dated on the 18th of March, and was addressed by Sir Charles Napier to the Ameers in captivity at Hyderabad. (The Noble Lord here quoted from the letter of Sir Charles Napier, in which the Gallant General stated that he was surprised at the false hoods the Ameers were telling him in their letters, and that if they continued to tell those falsehoods, he would not kill them as they had ordered their people to kill the English —an accusation, observed the Noble Lord, which has never been proved—but that he would put them in irons on board an English ship ; that Shere Mahomed was a weak man, and would soon be destroyed, and so would they unless they abstained from a repetition of their falsehqods. Was that language that ought to be used to defeated men ?—(Hear, hear.) Even convicted felons were permitted to urge a good character in miti gation ofpunishment, and the House should not forget the services of the Ameers at the time when we had experienced reverses in Affghanistan—when the country was in a state of the greatest anxiety—when our Indian empire was in danger, they had faithfully rendered us every assistance.—(Cheers.) In 1841, supplies were de manded of the Ameers, and were liberally bestowed. Detachments of our army were marched through their country, not only without opposition, but with their free concurrence and cordial co-operation. They had done everything they could to serve the British empire. If they had been our enemies only in our prosperity, it should be rememb ere d th at t h ey h ad b een our friends in the period of our adversity ; and on those grounds he called upon the House to interfere in behalf of men who had been stripped of their public honours, of their private property, and transferred to the solitude of a prison.—(Cheers.) He would not enlarge upon their love of hunting, or their treatment of their subjects; that had nothing to do with the question. The question was one of justice.—(Hear, hear.) Let them contrast the conduct of the present. Governor-General towards the Ameers, with that of the illustrious Cornwallis towards the sons of Tippoo Saib. He, the hereditary enemy of the British in India, had delivered up his children as hostages, and, as had been recorded by Mr. Mills in his " History of British India," the Marquis of Cornwallis hid received and treated them like a fatber.--(The Noble Lord then read, amidst loud cheering, a paksage from Mr. Mills' work, relating to the reception and treatment of the sons of Tippoo Seib.) When, seven years afterwards, at the final overthrow of Seringapataro. those princes were taken with arms i n their hands, how different had been the treatment which they had experi enced from that which had been experienced by the un fortunate Ameers ? A fortress had been fitted up for their reception, and a liberal allowance made for their support. Such was the treatment which they had ex perienced from th e M arqu i s of Wellesley. They had been our hereditary foes ; they had been brought up in hatred of the British name. Their father and their ; grandfather had wrought as much mischief. They had been conquered in a conflict, the last of a long war. To the Ameers we cwed much. If they had been once hostile, they had been oft times friendly, and if they had been conquered in one fight, that fight had been the beginning and the ending of an unwilling hostility.—(Loud cheers.) He had often been told that our empire in India was founded on ?pinion. Ile would ask, was it on the opinion of our Justice, or of our force ?—(Loud cheers)--and he would appeal to the House to mitigate that despotic power which it wasoperhaps, necessary to entrust to those to whose car e was cmfided the Government of our fndian Empire.—(Loud cheers.) But despotic power might be generous and just, and man y m en believed that are ra ay e Christian e m pi re wou ld contr ib u t e to elevat7ismaisd these is the people o f I n di a . Wh et h er by such me Great Britain w ou ld h o ld the empire of the East, re mained to to seen. At all events they had not made _a very auspicious beginning.—(Hea.r, hear.) If they made no more accessions to their epIP # ire let them not lose 1 , 1 what they had through injustice., Let them nod 0 4 , 0 1 at the awful rk-view ; let th ere b e b e no caus e for. to regret their confidence, and to exclaim, Heu pietas ! heti prisca fidesi- . • a d We perceive no hope of j us ti ce f or us till Almighty, on the last• day, pronounces his aivar° (Loud cheering.) The N o bl e L or d conc l u d e d byl,, ing for an address to the-Crown, praying that her , jesty will be graciously pl ease d t o t a k e i n t o her c4O sideration the situation and treatment of the Anwei Sinde and that she will direct their immediate res t° , o lion to liberty, and the enjoyment of their e ststes , ` i with such provi s ion for th e i r f u t ure maintenance „. be considered a just equivalent.• I The motion having been seconded. Mr. ROEBUCK began by . justifying himself As o the course he pursu e d w ith regar d to Si n d e . lie ef, given a notice on„the suoje e t l as t sess i on , b u t the 1341' 4 relating to it were not then ready, and he gave the e,s4 Best notice he could in the p resent sess i on , b u t he ",: t: been anticipated by the N o bl e L or d_ H e did not T he to complain of the co n d uc t o f th e Noble . Lord, ,b ° wished to justify th e course h e hi mse lf pursuea• ftsi thought the Noble Lord took too narrow a vie* -° _„o whole case—too narrow f o r so ser i ous an d so sole, proceeding. It was easy, no doubt, to produef dividual instances of op rress i on , b ut i t was the u u `o ness of that House .to begin with the b eg i n ning, to consider who commenc e d th e affair, When it to s fic e luntary, and when it became the inevitable conseclt s t of what had been done by the predecessor of the pr!;7 o Governor-General.—(Hear.) It w ou ld no t do to f, O ll view of the question at any particular point. /1!: - Wi take a short review of th e hi s t or y , o f Si n d e , and st divide it into certain great epoehs. lip to tke the fair 1834, the object of the English Government was fa re , fair and legitimate purpose of 'enlarging her comm e t o and thereby diffusing the advantages of civi ii ' a d s throughout the Eastern world. After that their) f o r ceedings changed when Lord. Auckland depart eu fo s India. Before coming to the immediate subject b e l o the House, he would give a brief outline of the Pe'' te of Sinde. It lay in the valley of the Indus til o s Sea to the Suilej, with an imaginary • line ` - `ll O ll -eastward to where the Sutlej disembdgues tern, westward of the mountains of Hindostan, and the tory of Gaulpoor was the boundary of the Eastern. tion. The Great Dourannee empire posseased 5° ,1 which was governed by th e G o l ora tr ib e. Ab o ut sel l er years ago the Sovereign of the country, whose of 'seelidant was still alive, was expelled by the it,t,Le who since governed it. The whole family of the possessors 'were destroyed with the excen o t one or two who _ escaped, an d th e desef°oo of the original possessors was actually in existenee,* present moment. Si r Ch a rl es N ap i er , i n one • e! letters, - Says that he had a l e tt er . from this inal ! itio, offering to him half his rev e n ue if h e restore d binl kingdoln. His name w as Ti mour , an d h e li v ed i „o tb e Punjaub. Thus, if it was a question of humanity , ; s o ought go back to the son o f th e l eg iti ma t e soverr so The Ameers having got possession of the king. le , England was desiro us o f en t er i ng into commercial to tions with them, and a factory was established to country which they- thrust out from jealous _feed i er In the year 1809, th e gran d leading figure, was loon Bonaparte, and thi s country stiputated•w"' ref Ameers Ameers that the French should not be allowed t 0 e l l, the country In 1816, a treaty was entered into, Y ;sl them which was renewed.. in 1820, with. - .the ati,dels stipulation that the Americans. as well as the .F et were to be exchided. When Lord William Bentin e ' sir to India, he believed it would be a benefit to this c i e t be try if he could enlarge its commerce by way ° ,„ 4 tlt l Indus. He sent Lieutenant Burnes' according", ""e O ll Court of Lahore, ostensibly for the purpose"of taking s ole fine white horses up the Indus to Runjeet Singh. 00 asserted object was one thi n g, b u t th e rea l o ne 0 survey the Indus, thus showing the corrupt nat ° :" 92 ie English poliCy. When Lieut. Burnes went -in l' t . b y • Sinde, he• was met by eve ry p oss ibl e opposition, blir'sch tortuous and unworthy course, h e was enabled to to the.Sullei. So far, however, .there was little to fi n tit -blame in any one. Wh a t nex t f o ll owe d WO 5 t r eo lir the consequence of the negotiations carried on by f eti net Pottinger. This t treaty, made in 1832, .w as i tati,' important-one. As all other tr ea ti es , so did this . : i g commence with swearing e t erna l friendship_( A n 4. —and with a mutual declaration never to look 7Oss, grasping eye upon each oth ers p ower or down el In that treaty, there were three conditiotg et el the utmost possible 'importance f or the Pali . ; to understand, because, in reference to them he 4 10 0 Roebuck) was •about to bring against Lord ' All e 0 e charges of the most flagrant treachery that ever o icb lie man had been g u ilty o f. Th e fi rst condition We d t o he called ••their attention' was that which bl o itsri English not to•bring any description of arms or A is e, stores up the river or on the roads to Sinde--( 0- , the second condition bound the English not to' l/ 0 any armed vessels or boats; and the third conditiVe that no English merchants should be allowed to setts pt' Sinde, but-come as occasion required, and having froili acted their business, they should at once return see; the country. Now, thus far, they had g ot W tk e t 'Osto 1834, at which period the British fauthorities e. ° ,010 into a' treaty with the Ameers. In this treaty (authorities. Ameers they ratified all the conditions of the ' o ejec' -treaties, adding to them certain- new clauses. "The re ( o ll9 in this—the object from th e fi rs t,stb oug h k e pt as ca n el' in the back ground as possible—was th e o pening e a to Indus. In the last-mentioned treaty, it watearraltg j isti put duties and tolls payable in a particular waY' tits' now-te,the most extraordinary eve n t i n a ll theie 004 actions. idea at this tim e became, prevalent ,° 0 10 the rulers of India of danger to the English denr, • ,, o ) in India from atte m pt s on t h e part of hussits. I " is ot was looked upon as i n fl uenc i ng Persia, Persia looked upon as influencing Aff g hanistan, 7,„i for the p urpose of - defence, it wa s Pr l o tet' to fit out and, sen d an ex edition against Affghttni This was in th e year 1838. Whilst this idea was hr e , ;o • ing in the minds of the rulers of India, Colonel r oti lio ger was directed to undertake further negotiations•e:4 the Ameers, and . proposals were made by him of °_,,tse remarkable description. Hitherto in all our interc;sl, with Sinde, all had apparently been fair and abov e t' r i o io The play, however, was now over — som ething s e ' t hcif was about to be enactednadi like the t i g er *N o , ho s native jungle, it was found that though the P a ar iV hitherto been velvet to the to uc h, it was soon to io the with a terrific and crushing effect. Every loal is i-ir House-and the count r y k new t h e h i story o f Bog pre' terference in India, how stealthily and carefully w_,tiol!, ceeded, step by s t e p, till the precise moment fo r r 7a, arrived, when we did act indeed ! It was the this country never to i nterfere in Ind i a or 50 4, tbs else, without ge tti ng something by it. Wh a t ( 0 ° way Lord Au c kl an d set a b out hi s d es i gns ? 36 0 to the Ameers of Si n d e (se* " Blue Book," P. l ';r t° 38), requiring th e i r consen t to ra i se a b o dy of 0 o 0 00 be stationed at their capital. Such *as the proP they Mit ) made to the Ameers of Sinde ; and in ti nera'y hesf' knew too - well what they had to expect.—( lo° ;.'estal They had seen India overrun, province by P od 0 0 kingdom by kingdom, by the British pewer" - bo t t° t seen her advancing steadily and stealthily. . t i o g -surely—they saw the finger of fate was po l o bie de g ., them, and this was the last step in that inexors. tiny which was to bring their own un fortunst e r t 4if i ' j pality under our sway.—(Hear, hear.) T ll° l o e which we made was denied. What matter? 1% the t he we do? Why we put the screw upon 100 0 threatened them—we told them we would let t tenS", Sikh monarch amongst them. The Ameers our . to o .6 well knew the consequences of not receding- 0 grel e. islands. They had got a commercial treaty wit h s rea l e r and, as we called ourselves, , a magnanifoe u lo ose They had entered into a treaty with us, one e as cii% which especially prohibited us from having. °T s ropo6 his, a ;, or raising an army in Sinde—and yet - was th ' .tion made to them. They had, previouSlY t °. e •schei e cepted a Resident of us. No w was ma tured tu 000 2 t,„ of advancing on Aff g h an i stan, an d hereirl he origin of all. the • evils—(Loud cheers fromt" e goo; tend benclies) - -herein was the source wk e ,,"he net waters of bitterness—(Cheers)---andl3llo",se charged Lord Auckland and the Right lie u 's si the Member f or N o tti ng h am (Si r J. Hobholl s e Pale cause of all the evils th a t h a d s i nce beset our 11 r all t: empire, Of all the disasters in AffghaniStan, °.` the s • a- • o is' miseries which had befallen alike the Inu la tho * no t European community.—(Loud cheers froln, tos tre ,; t e terial benches.) How did he (Mr. Roebuck) A the is that charge? One of his resolutions charge': rc ss Governor-General, first, with injustice Ameers, and next, with conduct which deitlec)'its‘teoll(l;oll43oCt;,Y. want of anything like a sound, wise, annat i° , oo4 .lio t to s Well, he had said that in 1838 he had enter jolt ut , treaty with the Ameers of Sinde, and before , t , to s o ge dry with which it was written, before the Yea to dingle Lord Auckland actually took it upon hiros e i di d it i1!,, 5 11 of the whole principality of Sinde. And he bones way"lle set on Shah Soojah to relinquish for coo_4cll,o claims to supremacy over the country, ~_°'!-Las of the payment of such sums as—as what ?T on be determi ne d un d er negotiations to be F t t h Go/ e w e carried on by whom ?—carried on by the Br' c ued, ment.—(Hear, hear.) Now, unsolicited, liz7 ou an obo undertockto make ourselves mediator betroost, f o r dependent'country and a poor unfortunate ou tu ' e sell e t/ lived on our charity, and,whom we set tiP eere l li''' our own purpose. He had no army, h so o .P l o sl anything. The army was called us h, et , but it was• recruited by the 1 4n i f . 10 ° th e by the English, officered by the Englis having 0 .. to it was the . English army, and these power of this army to back us, the Ameers, thus adding insult to injurssenvei t he _l' e ' ro 0,11, e i ! Pottinger was, now sent with what was . _f u tile f itae tto t partite treaty, het was warned not to let ro adft, h d laid dowwei; know anything about it until everything wh io n t_ to then he was to announce the penalti . es ri t o ° . _ re el _f_,„ would be subjected, in the event of their t h l: y b thek D t e li t t the payments to Shah Soojah, as regul under te ll we d ' then fe ` -? ee t° mission a e n r i nm in ent t . he Colonel transac ti P o o n t s ti N n ,: g h e ie r b e against the 1 4 p the Ameers loudly exclaimed a e , G o eerla „ r e t The Enos to e which they were subjected. „soar ha vail on Shah Soojah to reduce the chin's "L ow , st o ' bo then insolently promised they would . el - 1 0 , - ,l __,, ie h he it on the AmeerS to a reasonable amount. re _, these thingsßight, brought down there, and have to hear c by the 'lit te not a downright insult to their understansouP soned on, as doubtless they would o ff,pri lion. Baronet (Sir John Bobhouse), as Isere w e ol a d common sense and common honestY ( a , verY os h dared to set up a man as a king who, _thus. t. so Soojah would never have - dared to opeable inteigjoh° ment we did so, would have starved but n t s n iou u Th eo the Ameers of Sinde but for our abom t h e se - tion s. Hobhouse) had the hardihood to P a glorious ojsk and yet the Right Honourable Bar' i j o n ai net (s ir thing' upon us and the world as great and g 5 , 0 10 _, 11 The next paragraph went on to say that " °" 0 , 110 e "; had arrived with his own army." His ~o yesn or„. t he carrying out the palpable fiction. The t . .s bu t . at ._ a ral " advised" the Ameers to the enter i nto, to 00 01 , same time suggested that it might be proper t° a ai9.P°. su e them to come into, his views, and if thtre__Z in . 51 0,4 tion among -them to the contrary, his - 1 1?r u _ op friS Se'w would regard the demoastretion of such ~;,'~.~ -- s.