The Sun. — London, England, 1821-03-07 00:00:00

PARLIAMENT, HOUSE OF LORDS, MARCH 6. Petitions ~ vcire presented by the Bishop of from ;he A rchtleaconry of Chiches ter. against the Reinan Catholic Claims ; and by the Earl of Liipicatcli, from the Chamber of Com. merze of Licoerick, complaining of ,Fraiids• in trAinz thie ANer . c.gs hi England, through SI hid: an immense quo.ntity of Foreign Oats were lately impvrted,,to.te great detrirhent of thz. , tire-and - CoMMerce Of - Ireland ; and also corn., pfaiOtig - of thejr.n . rie . C.::ents to the Introduction of Irish Spirits into Evgllttyl. - His Lordship ob served, he was happy to learn that a measure vat; in progress . for Letter regulating the mode of tAing the aV. erge ; and that-with regard to .Iri.:lCipicits, a fair and equitable arrangement was in contenti.•lation.—Petitions ordered to lie upon the Tahle.—The Offenders' Transportation BM, and the General in'.:losure Bill, were read a second lime, and committed for Thursday.— Adjourned till Thursday. HOUSE OF. COMMONS. - - A Clerk fronl the Bank presented:paTsurint to nrd,r, ri Return of the Public littlances t 1 itit hands for • Ft tin) , up to the COI ut Jasonary last.—Ordered to lie A111:1-101.7SE WINDOW TAX. CienerlC f;ASC:OYNE presented a Pctition from certain_ 1-etaiLStiopheepers of Liverpool, complaining of the. Tax upon the Windows of tlktir Warehouses; and praying relief. From' t..bls Tii X the - Petitioners observed, that merchants and Others were e xe m pt, whale it was eery oppressive upon them. The.,C , ..lfant ()dicer was apparently proceeding to make fur tfirr statements. when • The SPEAKER interposed, and submitted to the Gallant Gens)ral, whether, as this was a public Petition "which might cteate'ciiscossion, it would not be better to postpone present it:t it until the private business was gone through. • General GASCOYNE observed, that he did not mean to say u;uch:ruore, and he coirld not apprehend any discu-sion upc;ri Merely presenting such a Petition, which he wished to hare laid upon the 'rutyte preview' to the discussion respect ing the Window- the( that was fixed for this evening.—The Petition was utdered to lie on the Ta'ile. AGRICULTURAL LIORSES. Mr. CITRWEN gave notice of his iritetitnm to more, On the tt.th of . April - next, fur the Repeal of the Agricultural llcrse Duty. COALS A Bill eras brrintst In to prevent Frauds in the Adrueasnre meat of Coals to the sicinity of the Thames within cer tain districts.—Read a first, aud ordered to be read a second AGRICULTI 7 RE, &c. :Mr. DAVENPORT presented twelve Vaitions from certain Occupiers of Land .and Grtqeers of Corn, in the county of Chester, praying a consideration of 'their distressed stale, and complaining, that the present rate of inwort duty upon FO reign Corn, did not afford adequate protection to domestic Grower, or encourage him to pursue his industry, much less to extend his exertion.. 'the Hotionrable 'Member conclud sid, with declaring his. emit e concurrence in the sentiments icf the Pet itiuncrs. Tio . “' Petitions rie.te ordered to be on the table, and to hr printed; as were several other Petitions of the same nature, which weir presented by Mr. bartes Dursdas, from Berk• Mitre. The latter Petitions prayed, that the Committee to be appointr4 this year, to consider the cosr of the Aori cultnrists, might be invested with riinelt more e:stended powers than these granted to the Counuirtee of the last Session. t±P.TEIS presented a Petition, which, he said, wa , moat respectably signed by a number of persons- who as.cupied no less than 20,000 acres of Land in Stissex, and which Fray- TA/ relief from the present distress of Agriculture. The Peti tioners stated that. in their upinion, n o relief cupid be afforded try any thing short of such a tax, upon the Import of all Fo. reign Corn, as should be equal to the difference between the expense of growing Corn inToreign nations and iu England. Such* tax aloes eitulerserve, as the Petitioners conceived, to znrceed adequate protection to the Agriculture ut this country. ordered to lie nit the table. Mr.I)ICKINSON i;resented a Petition from certaiu Wool len Manufacturers, in Somersetshire, praying' for the repeal of the Ditty lately imposed upon the Import of Foreign V. oul. Ordered to lie on the table as was a Petition, to'the'sante from the Woollen Matinfacturers of Shepton Mallet, In. the same County, which was presented by Sir Thoma. Lethbridge, who rdeclared that lie Old not at,all agree with the opinion of the Petitioners, although lee felt it _his duty to present their Petition. ifir.•llY.NG presented a. Petition from certain Occupiers of Land in the Courty of Nlidillesex, who were in possession of :shout 12,000-acres of:land, and who prayed that, for the re lief' of the distressed agricultorists, a further Duty should be imposed upon the import of Foiteign Corn. 'train,' the pro priety of attending to the case of the agriculturists, consider ing that in the comae of last Sessions tin less than 2SO Pe titions' were .presented to, that House - upon the subject, which Petitions were signed by abure 100,000 orisons, who were occupiers of many millions of acres.—Ordered to he laid an•the Table. the motion of Mr JAMES, Copies were ordered of the Correspondence which had taken place, with the Estimates presented, and . the Expcuce incurred, witlirespecCtu Bar racks at Carlisle. Mr. WKOTIESLEY; after stating that his ,bject was not , to propo.e any alteration in the BanlirtiptLaw, but merely to arses the administration of that law, with the . otlicets acting in exeeutioivolit, put under certain regulations., p stpuned limit Tuesday west bia p.romised motion with respect to the regulation of the sew' Bat.kruptcy Court. Mr. SYKES presented a petition from certain importers of fora let ,Kitiptou Hull; complaining of the state of the Coo II Lists. and particurarly of the law lately enacted to re sl rain the I a; put t of foreign. Grain. , The Petitioners also emu pl,,iiresi•of tire evils - arising to the courary front the measures ta4test to hasten the Its:stir/rot ionof Caste Payments. They dis claimed, however, any' wisto to return to the system which had e eisted 'for S. inatty years of restraining tie Bank front making CaSli Payments. • Ott the cent: cry, it was their de , sire todtave the country gratlnalfy relieved from that .s)stem, in the hope that upon the complete-lean in plum of Cash Pay ments the evils which afnieted us miglifeease.--=Ordresl_to .lie on the Tattle. Mr. WESTERN presented Petitions, -complaining of agri cultural. distress, 'front Chelmsford a int itoinfordj and also tenor I*,noo m Oceir piers of Land in ESseX, whose. farld'amotirtled to 'alone 350,0 up acres. -The. Honer Aleolber• declared, that he wily agreed with the sentiments of those Petili4t.actes, anti thertefrinion, that ti. , r . sli•tresS ... as .. lll a great . oseastre - owi , ig to the iusdeqoate protection afforded to agri culture teyahepresent rate of duty npsin the impost of Foreign Corn. • A fte!''zi few 'woicis from Sir E. HARVEY in support of this P,t hint]; it was ordered to lie On the Table. Sir F,A . .)Ni :st.NVEY. presented a Petition front the Trustees rrf Water Works,' with respect to the Bills samttelrof the Act of Charles it. is were:RA.(4 .- - .ltu,ldiatg. alum the Wharfs or sides of the fyln 3 ,Vq:.. ; Tctavie..l9 I...and,in,pridge,: and prayiog to he Conip,l against the said Bill. Mr. C. CA lIV Kiel' rose uit correct a iniataltei which appeared to. exist with reg. , 4rit to.the Bill allsidek to by the P.etit loners. That Bail, het.. could astute the parties who signed this Peti aS well as others, slid by-no ort:ans propose to trench' upon the rights of any body, its only objectln;ing tn•sreure the rights vt particular persona against nit existing grievanee. Sir J. YOItKE, understandLrig that the object of this bill was to cereal the law preventing 4eer,ons front hitilding on thelitmeJiate side :if the Ricer •Pharnei fr4ur Lorillon Bridge to the:letup-re, felt lumscif called' upon to oppose it: for 0 WAS the.repoaelt Foreigners, upon our ideas .of taste and coneeinetice, that we had Milt large quart noble river We had'Uot•Sileo eitAks as were on - the banks of the Srirtr ~..S,Paris, and on theltrivon Tie, at Bordeaux, as • well as in othe'r..plaes hick lee tufit seen. Mr. C. CA,I.VP.:fIy °bores:el; that it the Gallant Officer senitlihixtenst his nautical ..exen rsions from'. :he Temple to London. Btiihte, - 14..wauLd..sec how very little sef the ground on either side was e'en now without a building, and that cOnse • Tandy his g'itilitracheii:e iiriaproVement, fry assimitafintr : the banks ofithe . Thaines', which weir `crowded with tea .le and its appendages, witholmse of the. Seiite ,which lead no trade whatever, couo,only he indulge-et in his imagination. Sir- W. CURtllS'spoke in faterur s the Bill. The Petition was , ordeeol 10..1ic sin. t I% Mr s I..ocF,HAftl%presented a Petition-from certain Occu pies pf Land iii Herefiirdshire. prayitig relief. These Peti tsotOrs.-,llTe Gentteman nbst•reed,'ilid not by any means protio?e-4s tiMcb qte. funds.for relief of the land, nor did they suggest agcy new tistriliutiGo of taxation. They were eat, indeed. Advocates far any such measures. They only ob served, that the adoption of such measures rnizlit become a • nrrtssfti l y alterrrat:te,.if the .agricultini , t's were not entibitd to pa; tbeir proportion of the pnblic taxes, by the establish ment of an adequate protertin duty against the import of foreign corn, -Ind thus. granting to agriculture; the nitric se entity- .against competition Itott 'via; present afforded to mnitifact nres. Ord,ervit to lie on Mr. lIONYWOOD presented a Pet - onm front a•gvsat and re•pectahle bot , y.of the Agriculturists of Kent,. praying the !loose ter tahe into .consideration the titAnialleled distrits ander which Aoiculritre wai at preslAt, it!if had- Itek:ii for some titan suff,riug. • NVith-the s.-iititntotts - of the Petitioners he frilly catrctltted, espcertlly in their tl,sire to be telictod by a rrkloction of taxatii , il,rtott by tell - et - 1;1)1(15.in and economy in those branches of out vied-anti-military tiepartntentlktwhirh hail rows} so excessive through the long anti unnatural WM' iu !rich the country bad been so long engaged, had to which war. with its c..nitequences, the .distress of the country :was mainly owing. Sir E. ii.N-ArCIIBUIL-deciared, that be was by _ nu means dispotert to oppose . this - Petition, although he most say, that he could not consistently concur in many of their sen timent 5. _ ItOtERT WILSON said, that Tie oivedit to the inter , ests and opinions of his Constituents to submit a few olise_rva-, tions upon the subject to• which this Petition referred; he lamented the distress of which I he.Agrienituriits eomphincil; het he lamented nearly as Mitch the delusion. under which' they were Wing; fur, instead of calling fur a'rednetion of that enormous taxation, which was the cause of all the cala mities undtt which they, is common with the other classes of conimunity, at present laboured, they applied for more protecting duties against the import of Foreign Corn. But . he cant Mord Gentlemen to bewate of making any stleh'pro position, as it must serve very considerably to inrit ate and dis-: content the public mind, and so to aggravate the. evils Which at present afflicted the country. The fizsllant °Slicer, how ever, conclnded with Sayit)e, .that he 'should trot oppose the inquiry proposed:by the Petitioners. lIONYWOOD observ4d. that if his Gallant Friend would refer to the words of :lie Petitioners, he would find that they suggested no such remedy for existing distress, as he appeared to thuds. and that their main request was for au inquiry into their situation. Sir R. WILSON disclaimed any intention to apply his re marks to the Petition presented by his Honourable Friend, of which be fully approved, as it applied for economy and re trenchment. But what- he had said was clearly applicahle,to other Petitions presented to the course of the evening, which distinctly desired the establishment of further • protecting Duties. The Petition was ordered to lie on the 'fable, as were Fifteen Petitions complaining of Agricultural Disirrts, which weft presented by Mr. GdOCH, from) tinffolk. The Honour4ble Nlember stated' that these Petitioners occupied above 100.000 acres of land. . The Pe►ition presented by Mr. S. WOrtTLEY last night, was ordered to be printed, upon the motion of that Honour able Gentleman. RIVERSIDE BUILDING. Mr. T. WILSON liTeiented a lietiti‘m from certain Mt,r etrants and Traders si . f London against the Bill toe allowing the further Erection of Buildings un the side of the Thaone. towards London ,Bridge, the petitioners urging that such erections-would interfere with the'beatth, light, and conve nience of the inhabitants of London. Mr. C. CA INERT observed, that these petitioners, instead of residing in the vicinity of the Thames, were resident about Crooked lane, in the centre of the City, and could hate no particular connection with the hanks of theriter. , Sir J. YORKE remarked, that the last speaker appeared to think that no one could feel any interest about the Plaines who did not reside upon its banks. But it so happened. that although he (Sir .1.) was not once oft lie happy ducks who tioat• ed shout this user, he was vvry- much interested in the p're serration of its beanie and ciineenienee; and therefore he meant to Vutc against the Hon. Member's 011.—This Petition was ordered•to lie on the table. Pt;TITION. Mr. COKE; presented a Petition front severrl Agrimiltot * in Norfolk. praying for relief; aid - complaining partiestlarly of the late duty on Malt, and the Agt it:ohm - al Horse Duty,— He said that this.was a ser! jest of so much importance, that it was a matter of stirprise tnat the Government should not. have been the first to talre it up.. But instead of that they threw cold water an the complaints.of the Agriculturists, and resting upon their majorities, they pass e d by the . necessity which seas every:day more and more manifesting itself for their. interposition ; the principal, object attic Petition was to.reptal the last duties imposed on Malt.. He Was-sure that by carrying economical measures into. a few only of the branches of expenditure, the amount if this tax might easily he met, tic had no hesitation in saying that he was no friend to protecting ditties, for he thought-the principle of them was bad in any point of view. and wholly ineffectual for the particular object they had in tiew. The House would observe, for instance, that when the duty was laid on. the importation of foreign wool, it was front ,80 to 84s.— After the laying ore of the duty it fell to 455. ; and lie would :lA, was it much above 355.' It was not then a pro tecting duty he would wish to see proposed as a remedy for the distress of the Agriculturists. No; he would relieve them by a reduction of taxation; that, anti that only was the renieoly from which any benefit could be expected.-- Some affirmed that our -distress arose frsiiir the over quan tity of prinictiort—tome declared - that it •was attributable to an " ignorant impatience of taxati o n;" some again said that our distress was occasioned by an excess of population. But the real truth was, that 1/0 reniedv could he expected to lie provided for the universally admitted miseries_ of the people, without a change of system. If those who usually supported fslinistets, and enabled them to keep their influ ence in the Councils of the state, world still continue- to do so in spite of 'be alarming progress of distress, arid in spite of.the inability or the omit ioQncss, ot those Ministers to go abOut looking - for a remedy; then the, landed tarn most unite, and force ',Ministers to a reduction of taxation. Let them try what that would do toward; relieving the people— and if-it failed—if the - reduction of taxation f-tiled to stop tire approach to britilirtiptey. then he wou'od say boldly, that the funds :mist Ire resorted to—there must be a reduction of the debt sonic war or another. lie trusted that the Honourable Niember for Suffolk, who was one of those .who usually sop ported Ministers., and who were fire cause of all our evils, was sincere iii his motion that night, and that his proposition was not the result .of some collusion bet wren him and Nlinis tests, for the purpose of keeping tip the delusion IA the Conn try; at least he feared that the Hon. Member voted for the Malt Tax; and if so, be would not place much confidence in his zeal for a remedy for the public distress. Mr. lIIP.CI - 1 referred to,a doCument which lie held in his h a nd f o r the purpase of showing that - Cie effect of opening the ports was trot to depress.thQ price of corn for a c ritsider able time afterwards fur lie said, that when, the Torts were opened in 1816._ it was apprehended tliat the comitty was SO glutted with corn, that the ports wool,' not be ()twilid for a lung time. But the fact proved otherwise, for in three months afterwards the price- ot grain rose so high, . that the ports were asain opened. Mr. GOOCH rose to say, that lie bad no view whatever of supporting any taxes by .t be motion he Shoolti submit. There was no_eollusion whatever between him nod the Government ; lie should havelteett, ashamed of hiruself if there . w3s, arid •still more would he have lite!r h•banled_ if there could have been :toy collusion on such a subject at the piesent period of dist ress.—(Cheers.) Sir EDWARD KNATCHBUI.I. made,a few rerriarhsson 1 he" question, bat said his chief object in rising was-to rep - test the -tuzinber for Abingdon to consent to the past poorment of his motion till to-anorrow (Cries of " No, no,". from the opposite side), on account of the great importance of the motion on agricultural distress, which stood for this !tight. Mr. MAB KRLY said, the Hon. - Member for-Surrey (Mr. 11.Sitintter) had called upon him, arid made a similar request, hut be had assured him that he neith.r - could Mir would . conseut to postpone his motion. The motion which he shotild , have the holibur of 3oinnittitrg to the' House was one ;o f as • great importanee-ms . that upon the Agricultural Distresses,. and he hoped he should be able to satisfy the House, that it would furnish the means of remedying those distresses. Many Gentlentru interested in this motion were.waitingin town foi . the result Of it , :4111.1 it doutd not be postponed witln n a grea t injustice both to' theta - and to himself. Mr. H. SUMNER said that Ina reason for wishites. 111 e Hoir. Gentleman's nrotion to be post potied.was that many. country gen 4 h.fuen whose attendance -at the discussion itt the Aglicultura.l distress appeared to him of infinite importance, woulddre obliged at this time to heavetuwri on aetnunt 'of the assizes. ": • _ Mr. STUART- WOItTLET said, be . considered.the parer read by the lion. Gentleman (14r. limrelt) most mischievous. All he was anxious for was a 'Committee tO investigate the abide siii.ject. Mr-. II G. BENNET submitted that the army estim ties ought to bepost potted till Friday, that the iletals necessary for their elucidation might. he fairly before the Noose,' and su 4 s,ated that the Host Member (Mr. Gooch) should post- Pone his _motion till to-morrow. Lord CASTLETWAGII consented to the po , tparsemerit of the Army F,stinrites till Friday. and stated at the saute time that all the returns moved for were printed. • ' Mr. CCIA.W EN made a few observatiutis on the question before the House.- The Petition was then brought up, read, awl ordered to lie printed. pOWER OF JUDGES TO FINF.A DF.FI:NDANT. . . . Mr. HOBROUAE slid, thit he th/m4ht ihe Member on the floor (Mr. Nlalterly) was right in not posttion :mg his motion, he could not sot press the importance nf t h e . Petitions Which he held in his folios, ngaiott the ' , fl ye r of itriges to fine 4 tleicndAnt while defeirCe. Bat a; the subject wight occupy some time, he contentcd'hituse!l now with giving notice that he would', wetent'the Petitions to morrow. 4GRICULTI.7nAL LAMB 'presented a Petition fear- t!,; occupiers of 'l , lO in the . county of Hertford, evils plaining ut Agrit tritium, llt , ttess• '‘CHARLF.S BURRELL prestilted a - sitflilar Pt:tillon from the neighbourhood of St ey'rline: io SusseX. Mr. .ft SUMMER. prestuted a rirnilar Petition front Surrey. BROWNE pr.esented a siurilar Petition from Ryc.' Sir T. ACLAND presented a :similar Petition from Barn-. staple. Mr. 3. P. GRANT moved for detaPed accounts...l the Me dical-expellees of tree Army , ftre-t he present year. PKITHA UMW INSTITUTION. Sir RONALD FI'AtOUSSON moved for an account of the expenses ot• this Instautiou since its COMllleflCTUlelit, dif3lll - tr,C salaries of Sir William Adams and in Ler Mr dicAl :Wend:tots, and the allowances to servants. Mr. F. LEWIS hoped ilrit the . Mot:General wiittld follow up hiS present motion, by moving fur a Coniniittee of Inquiry, in order to give att. individual (air Adams).of the greatest truth:mitt. and streets in curing disrasei of the'eye. an oppor• tunity of vindicating his reputation, and proving the merits of the institution over which he presi.leit. 1%1- 11. G. BENNwr said he felt most anxious to ascertain the merits of. the iostitution, and hoped that the result of the inquiry at the War-ounce, and before • the. Doke of 'York, would be laid before tlie House. Sir C. LONG concurred in the'prupriety of 'referring the whole sobject to a Contain tee of that blouse, without which it would be extremely *diffieult, amillst so many contradictory staterriChts, to come to a satisfnetiiry conelnsion. Mr.J. P. GRANT said, that if his surtaestions some years ago had been attended to, the present state ut doubt and eon troversy MI the stbjeet,would trace tJeVII prevented. hie ha> for the fullest investiotioa. Sir R. FERGI.:SSON sail that nothing was more his wish than that th e subject should , he referred to a Committee He believed that Sir William Adams W 34 at raritn. e with the Medical Statf k of whom he knew several Gentlemen. Than whom none could :lie noire learned, route 14• Ni• et. bee, and more useful, end for their sakes he Was . ankimis for inquiry. Mr. F. LEWIS es pktinvd.—The motion was then agreed to. Mr. J. B ENETT presented a retition from several thousand clothiers of Gloucotershirse and Wiltshire, complaining of great distress, and rtaying for relief: Mr. H. GREY BENNEr g r ave make, that he would move to-morrow fm - the production of Papers relative to t he Inquiry at the Horse Guards into the nieirts of the . Ophthalmic In -stituti‘')n. AGRICULTURAL DISTRESS. Air. PRICE presented a petition from Occupiers of Land in the County of Hereford, complaining of Agricultural Dip tursq.--Ord,rrd to be ' , rioted. Mr. GOOCH postponed his motiors for a Committee to in quire into the Agricultural Distresses. NAPLES. Sir R WILSON trishcrWr put qnestion to the Noble Lord opposite, omen a. subject of eVelt,itai ional importance. He could assure the Noble Lord and the notice, that in putting • this question to the Noble'Lot (1, he was actuated by nu hostile feelings to the Family of Naples ; for the maxim, pro Rege ct Patric, teas one which, in his opinion, ought to he ph‘ei red by a W r nation &iggling fo co nstitutional free doer. He begged to call the Neible Loro's attention to a parogiaph a L'etter from Sir W. A'Court to the Duke de (alto, dated Naples, Feb. I I, wh;ch had appeared in the pub;ijc. Patiers. It stated, that the English Government would intrsfere in no way with the affairs of Naples, unless such interfrrrnee should be rendered Indis pensable Sty anr perSonal insult or da,,,or to which the Royal Family might lec,expoied. 'Snell being th'e language of the British inist er's official Note, 'he wished to ask' t he Noble Loi'd, under what eircumstrincei the neutrality of England teas to be Violated; and "whether,'in the event of the Neapoli tans deeming it necessary to tahe any Mehsures against Their Sorerenefl, that neutrality tries to be entirely broken, and this country to become fort liwi• h an active and zealous Tilly of the Holy Fraternity ?.Such was, Ce1t:6105 . , the necessary infvf. enee, if the Nobie Lord kauctioned the let los of the Letter. • Lord CASTLEItEAGH said, tire only observation wb•ich he felt it necessary to tnal.;e on this OCl:aritllt was, !him if the Honourable Member thought fit to call for t protinction of any document, it was competent to him to move for them, and to state to the - Honse'the grounds of his motion. Sir it. WILSON de:tinted nutking any motion. REPEAL. OF THE .HOU.S.F. ANt.) vViNDow DUTIES. Mr. MAaERLY rose to bring forward the mo- . tiotr; of which he had given notice,.for the Re peal of the DUties - on Inhabited. Houses and Windows. afraid, he said, that in .addi lion to the difficulty and importance of . the sub- ject which he'.was about to bring under the con sideration of the House, he rose under some disadvantage, because' it might be supposed by sonic Gentlemen to. interfere with another sub ject; the. importance of. whivh he wag perfectly ready to admit. He iouldn - ssurethe Hon.Mem hers for Suffolk, Kent, and Surrey,: that he had_ framed his motion with a view to the relief of the agricultural distresses and, he. trusted he should have their concurrence in the. measure which he was about to propose. He feared he should be under the necessity of .tresPassing more upon. the indulgence of the House than: he could wish, for the subject was one which necessarily involVed a.' great deal of detail. It was not hisintention to call upon his Majesty's Ministets for the repeal of those or any other duties, without offering. a provision as an equivalent, and the provision which, he contended, was 'capable of being'suc cessfully administered, was economy., He trusted he should satisfy the House .before he sat down that economy might be enforced to a much greater extent than had been hitherto attempted; and that by a vigorous and practical application of it, the public expenditure might be reduced to the amount of at least 3,000,0001. He supposed he should be met on the other side by the usual statement, namely,_ that. his plan..was imprac ticable—that the thing could not be. done ; but if this was the ouly• answer he was to receive,' it was high time that his Majesty's Ministers should resign the Government 'of the 'country _to those who were ready. to take it with the responsibility of conducting the affairs of the .country upon a reduced scale of expenditure. He bad always _thought that the very basts --- of was economy, and this was a principle, the application of which was more especially called for, at a time when •the country was labouring under the pressure of an enormous funded and unfunded dela. Whatever remedy was applied to the existing financial em-1 barrassments, we were bound to preserve the national faith which had been pledged to the public creditor. 'Whether the public debt had been contracted in. one currency or another, was of no importance ; it had been fairly and openly :contracted; and 'we were hound to keep our faith and pay- the interest of it as long as we were able. It was admitted on all hands, that the distresses which pressed upon every - class of so ciety, :called loudly for some species- of Parlia mentary relief. It - Was absolutely impossible that the people could continue, to pay the same • amount of taxes under the burthen - ofwhich they were now suffering,—.Both the agricultural and the trading. claSses were now actually. p. wing taxes and rent out -of their capital, and not out of any profit which they derived from their property r or trade. Under such circumstances, the House !. was bound-to take-into its.most serious considera tion, whether, by the-application of a system of economy to the public expenditure, some degree .of relief might not be afforded to the distresses of the people ? Before en.tering . upon the itnme . diate . subject of'his motion, it Would- - be necessary. f for bliss to gointo some detail, not ouly - as to the .present state of the fin'ances, but as they existed f at a for Mer period. The period which he had selected was the year .I7A, because in that year there had been a cessation of war long enough to enable. Mr. Pitt to bring down his budget, as for a year ofTeace. I n the last yoar,,no part of the public debt could-be reft-rred to. watekpenditure ; these twOpariods therefore might be fairly carripar. ed. The tlon.Membertheul tool; a cmnparative view of the income and expenditure of the country in the last year, and in the year 1792, and entered into an elaborate statement,. for, the numerical details of which we refer the reader to another part of our paper. The lion. Member stated, hat the reg;ori of his having selected these tw•o years was, that the finances were on both on a peace establishment, some years . after the conclusion of any war, and therefore the circumstances in which the nation was placed at both- periodi being so similar, trite compariSon ought to have more weight. In accou n ting for his"statiug the Un funded Debt at 46 millions instead of 31, he said that there were 8,806,5591. not included in the returns of :the outstanding Exchequer Bills not provided for, I%hich formed part of the Unfunded Debt, and which ought to, be added to the, 31 Millions outstanding and unprovided for on the sth of January. To theSe Were to be added the 5,600,000/. on the - Sinking Fund", whiCh Made the stiff) total of Unfunded Debt forty-six mil lions ; with respect to the five millions on the S•inking - Fund of 1821, it was fair to estimate it in this way; for if the Right Hon. Gentleman arose to retire, his successor -Would expect to find that debt . without charge, but - he had taken the Sinking fund by inticipation. In - remarling upon "the vast difference of 19 million, which existed between the expencea of governing the country at the two periods of 1792 and IS2O, lie obseerved to the Right Ron. Gentleman that there were some items of expence which might be set off; and which had not been included in, his statement for the former period, but they could not account for such a difference as nineteen millions: -He knew that it would be said, that in the course .of ,a long and expensive war, cor es tablishrnents had been necesarily increased ; he knew this, and believed it to be difficult to cut them down, but it did not follow, that when the country was, so greatly distressed,, they ought not to be cut down.L-(Hear, hear I)—The Go vernment said it must keep faith, and .protect the national honour ; true--but if it. was neces sary at any time, and expedient to put the -cowl, try in a state of war, it should be enabled to gait► its strength and confidence by a wise econ omy during the Continuance of pea Ce. It could not recover the capabilities of Which _a • lavish ex penditure had deprived it by,increased taxation; that could only still surther enfeeble its resources and reduce its crippled powers to a state of More. desperate exhaustion. Its only refuge and hope, whether it was intended with more security, and would rise in the grandeur of its former power among the nations, was determined l. rigourous, unsparing economy.—(Hear, hear then went on to show that a large saving might be made in the Customs and Excise, as he looked upon tlu per centage of collecting as improperly high. He knew he would be told, that Commis sioners had been named for the purpose of inqur ing into those subjects, and he was willing to be lieve those Commissioners would, discharge their duty with zeal and tidPiity ; bat Chen iC Fhould lie recollected, that the Commission was app intett not for purposes of reduction, but of replation. lie would gii-e them credit for making, somo little reductions, but ,not in the way that the country required, and that the situation in whiCh we ,stood made it imperative. As the Customs had fallen off, how was the misfortune to be repaired' The only remedy was saying, there was no other way of meeting a diminished income but by 'a restricted expenditure."--(Hear, hear, hear.)--L-Besides, the Commission was no= . minuted by the Crown ; it was not appointed by the House, and, consequently, the instructiow upon Which it acted. were not such as it would have received had it emanated from the Repre sentatives,of the People.----(Hear, hear.)—ln re ferebce to his Sixth Statement, lie said, 'that ti -Finance Committee had 'been appointed by the House, and had made a Report in 1817 on the charges estimated for the governing of the coun try in 1818. • He adverted to the words of the. Fourth Report of that Cominitteca, as contained in the statement, where it was said that other expences . might arise, but then there could . 'be reductions made at least equivalent to thetn.—: After having gone into :the comparison between' the expellees of the last year and that in the Re port of the Committee in 1817, he . proceeded to say, that-the chancellor of the Excheqtler had spontaneoufly brought down a Resolution of economy and retrenchment to 'the • House in 1819. His the'ory of economy might be seen from that Resolution ; the facts before the House and the country would enable them to judge of his practice.--(Hear, hear.) ..--There was a strong and imperious reason why Parliament f.hould proceed immediately to make the necessary re trenchments ; it was that by so doing some ye lief would be • afforded to the numerous classt>s of distressed Petitioners, whose complaints were daily heard in that House and resounded through the . country. It . was a duty of humanity, jus tice, and ,prudence, to Which they were equally bound, as men, as citizens, and as legislators. What hope could the country have of any. sin- cerityliu the repealed professions of retrench ment, if the Estimates of 1821 were not'lopt lie low those of 1817 ? But the Right Honourable Gentleman had given no credit for the reduc tion of the prices in the necessaries and conveni encies of life, but proceeded in expenditure on the same rate as if they had not been at all depressed. Tlds was not fail% There were, he knew, alloW ances that must remain fixed, but then there were many, articles which Government had to pur chase, Which had fallen 25 or 30 per cent. If Government. then went on as if no such depres sion of prices had taken place, it was evidently, in that point of view, ,spending, more than it had any right to .spend. There must be . a con siderable ving, for instance, in the articles of iron, tiMber, hemp, 4c. for they had all been considerably ditniniibed in P!ice. On . this account alone, at least one 'million Ought to be saved, and by a practicable reduction of the pence of collecting the revenue, another aiilliv might .be saved. After some further obseriva. tions of the same nature, the •1 on Member went on to shew that the expenct o the taxes was excessive. Be considered the income . on which the Property Tax had been assessed to be about 150 millions, orat least 120, out of which there was to he taken 4.5 . Per cent. on the gross taxes, of which 2.2 per cent. was on the direct taxes, and 23 per cent. on theinterest of the National Debt ; but it was-impossible to follow the re 'sults of the indirect luxes through all their rami fications. On the 23 per cell t.or the interest pf the - Debt no reduction could - be made„'and therefore all, the reduction should take place on the (.22 per cent. - Jie ; then entered: into:a view of 'the state of the Ag.riculturists, and said, that in agricul ture it was not the consumer but the grower that paid the taxes : for the price.of corn now, when the expenditure of the country was so. high, was the same with that of 179, when the expendie- ture was lowest. rl'ltris the farmer sold his bushel of corn at the price now which he did then, !it had a very different quantity of taxatitm to dis charge. He had, in fact, with his unimproved" resources, to bear the gradual increase of rent and taxation for the, last thirty years, and thus • that increased• taxation must be 'paid out of , his capital.—(llear !)—lle was net one of those who thought that it would be right to remove a. burden from one class of . the community to place it on another he would not, therefore,. propose that the farmer should he relieved at the expencat 'of the manufacturer or fundledder ; the only:re lief for all was in ecoiomv, and not by break ing faith with the public creditor.--(llear!)--e- Ws debt had the security of a national bond, ;lint such an obligation was not to be rOrfeited. The • nation that . did it would pay a feaff)ll peDaliv, • the - violatiOn of its faith could sOt eud iu danger - and dishonour. Ile had heard trdoctrioe • stated in that House by many from whom, he w a s sorry to hear it ; lie hoped that nothing but hank- , ruptcy or inevitable ruin would ever realiie it. and such events . might, by the prerattLimt of a due system of retrenchment, be averted.. lie was sure that the fundholder did not wish fo se& the. other classes of the comnmity too severely _ . pressed upon ;•. it was not fus wish to have an ad • flitional million as Security, it bestisecnrity as inn satisfisnipeople.---(Ciseers.)—He hived tl'at night his Resolutions would he supported'bv alt those ieterests, who wished ,veil to.the com Mort cause of the country—by the fendholder, whose security he would have strengthened—by the agriculturist, whose taxes he would haVeredrickt —and by all men of all parties, who wished to save. their country )y the only practicablenteans, namely, economy and conciliation, 'which alone: could give internal security and repel foreign . aggression.--e(Chetrs.)—The Hon. - Meddler the.o `moved -6'l hat the Fjntrtee rotnmittce Pm:minted by this tintr‘ei. having Mated in their 4th Report., on the sth of June, t 517, that the Estimates for the Supply of the Year 1818, wero. Hs follow:—?'or the Army 3,500,000 L ; the Nai'y 6,900,000 i.; the Ordnance 1,1 50,0001. and the Miseel la neon% ; • making a to'al id- 17,359,0;7;01., and that the Surp'les fin. the - . Year 150 sxceeded It.ose,foT sl,s-hr thy sum of 1,9a3,:?001.;. it i. theri•fore expedient that the supplies fur 1840 should not exceed th,isr for fhe fortni:r.sear." The Hon. Member stated that it Was his inteise tion to propose following.up the resolutiOn motion for a reduction of 50 per cent. upon all Duties on Inhabited liotisev and lifintiOt . t*, frjru and after the 50 .91 .- January nest ; thus giving tt year's intervention before the change cool& op e rate. . . The CIiANCELLQII of the Ex..rariotrEß menced by.sayiitg, that he wont,' confine himself . to the leading topics the lion. Member , had 'mentioned iri his e_neral view of the finances . of the country. —lle was net prepa'rek nor ;n -deed was it necesSary 3 to follow him through La his statetn.i.nts, rnoreespecially. as his motion,did notof necessity give occasion to those statement`! It was worthy of remark, that the subject or that motion was the taking off one-half of the ditties on inhabited houses and windows; yet almost the . only topic of finance front WilliCh he had re frained (hiring the whole cOurse-b:Lhis speech; Was the • tax on windOws::---(llearl, hear! on the Benehes.)-Ife had indeed •gene into . aver' laborious and extensive investigation of the • finances of the country, under the ditferent he;:ds • and as far as was -nec?ssdrY be would follow bitn, and endeavour ti she either.tvlieic his • st.te rnents were incorrect or his inferences unfair% lie had rested his arguments Mainly on the tie cessity of having founded them upon the girt , Iditference •between the expendiftire of tho country at different periods. In pursuance - or this plan, lie had contrasted the expenses the year- 1702 with• those of 100; but the House ought to recollec.t, , that the merits of the year 1792 were' the loWest that -the country had experienced Siii.Z. - e" the Ameri can war, and in fact the votes of supplies fir that year were never aCtnally'realized on that ac count. M. Pitt found it necessary tO'elth:ri,e the expenditure beyorrd what bad beco -o Xed for that year ; and before the • clo'se of it - '.au . angmenta;- tion,was found to he indispettsible-----(seme Men- • bers on the QppOsiCion 'Benches said it was the: commencement of a war) ;---certainiy part of Citi/. additional income . was 'di - sposed of in prepara tions for a new War, but not all. flowerer, sup posing even the .vote - of •supplies for the year t,-`.2 . • had been realized, still the Honourable Oentle-• man should in fairness- make some deductioiu. from the expentrature of the last year, which could not affect the expenditure of the year 9'2- lie had contrasted the sum total of 7,71.1,QW 1 ,:. belonging to that year, with tile sum total cat 19,313,0001. of tht. last One—[Here Mr. Maberly said; across the Table, that he made the latter sum twenty six -millions in his view of finance -7 (the Chancellor of the Exchequer) thottO!'; that it would be More for the' sake of clearl le r and accuracy to set aside that six millions for ' e • present, ialuding the .xpetices - of•collectingl &" • and contrast the actual expenditure of both 1 ) " riods, Even i r that tvero the. case, it,was ueces sai-y, hi order to come to a just conclusion, to de duct frdm the expences of 1820011e -whole of the .• heavy; pension establishment in the Nava l anci, Military Services, _&e. whielthad beets incurred. by the late war, and which would leave the• 19,313,000/. - less by 5,000,0004; as no soch de- . i d u u ti c 2 ti , m t u h . e stt p s eti to sib b i e i ernstandbelionzit:tieatetxhPaerittFeLt.