The Sun. — London, England, 1839-03-19 00:00:00

!EVENING- EDITION. ANTI-CORN-LAW DELEGATES. (YESTERDAY.) The Delegates met yesterday afternoon (as usual), at Brown's Hotel. J. B. SMITH, Esq., in the Chair. Mr. Hawes, M. P., Mr. C. Lushinv,ton, M. P., Sir Edward Codrington, M.P., and Mr. Dennistoun, M. P., were present. The CHAIRMAN announced that a letter had been re ceived from Lerwick, in the Shetland Isles, inclosing a copy of a petition, signed by 5,800 of the inhabitants, being one-fourth of the whole population of those Isles, for the total and immediate Repeal of the Corn-laws. This petition was a very important one, as the Shetlanders contended that the Corn-laws affected them more than any other class of the community ; and they looked with peculiar interest to the proceedings of the Delegates. He undemood if a general measure for the repeal of the Corn laws were refused by the Legislature, the Shetlanders in tended to apply to Parliament for a Bill for their own special relief.—( Loud cries of " Hear, hear.") They felt that the existing Corn-laws were grossly unjust towards them, as they could not grow their own provisions, and had no other means of obtaining their bread, but by ex changing their fish for the corn of other countries, and he thought Parliament was, at all events, bound to take their case into consideration. Mr. WIGHAM, of Edinburgh, corroborated the statement of the Chairman, and was afraid those poor people would find propriet , rs of land there to oppose their wishes as well as here.—( Shame, shame ) Mr. JOSEPH STURGE wished to correct an inaccuracy that he made the other day with regard to the imports f em Ireland, which arose from his not knowing what was the official mode of turning flour or meal into quarters. Ile held in his hand the official return, and he found it was stated by Sir R. Peel that 3,474 000 qrs. was imported in 1138, including manufactured meal and flour, and that misled him. There teas an official standard for reducing it into quarters, that he w..s not aware of; but it confirmed wh a t h e had stated relative to the repeated decrease of the imp r. tation of wheat into this country from 1 " 1 .32. We coald not expect to obtain any larger supply of wheat flour from the land in future.._-( Hear, hear.) He hoped th It Daniel O'Connell would bring before the House, before the conclusion of the debate, some of those en -I:ghtened viers that he had expressed to the Dele gates. He (Mt. Sturge) considered that the Delegates were ander a great obligation to that Hon. and Learned Member for taking up the question so warmly as he had done, particularly as there was a large portion of the Fish e'rnmunity of opinion that the Corn laws should be up held.—( Hear, hear.) He recollected an instance in which one of the correspondents of his (Mr. Sturge's) house sent a bill of lading for wheat, net at all wanted in this coun try, sta in his letter that the people of Ireland wcro in an ext - ernaly distressed ccndition, that they were fercing, open the stores to get food ; and it so happened that at the time the poor Irish were starving even on .potatoes, the food that ought to have been given to them for consumption was sent to this country.—( Hear.) He hoped this' fact would be mentioned to the House of Commons, for he was certain that the sufferings of the agricultural poor of Ireland were increased by the opera tion of the Corn.laws —( Hear, hear.) Mr. CeeDEN Viould be glad if the example of their friend Sturge, in correcting an error into which he had fallen, were folloeed by Sir Robert Peel.—( Hear, hear ) Iln wished that the Honourable Baronet would correct some of the fallacious statements he had made the other night. If he did not do so, he hoped tine would La atTyrded to some Hon. Mt.reher to answer him. One cf the gr atest fallacies of the Right Honourable Baronet teas in his allusion to Mr. Grote's speech, who ex pretsed an opinion that the increase in the importation would not be more than 230,000 quarters. In alluding to tie.it Slr Robert Peel made one of his triumphant bursts of exultation, in which he was cheered by his supportera, and exclaimed, " What, are we to upset the whole established arrangement regarding the Corn trade, for the purpose of get ing only 250,000 quarters m than we have hitherto done.—( Hear, hear.) Th Itiglit Hon. Baronet ought to have known that it was not reerely that this country had to pay the duty on the . 2;0,000 quarters of corn imported, but the tax levied by our own landlords on the 14,000,000 quarters grown at boree.—( Hear, tear.) It would become the Delegates to vindicate th emse l ves f rom t h e c h arge w hi c h Lord - Mel bourne had brought against the opponents of the Corn laws, of " wildness" and " madness"—( Hear, hear, bear)—and for that purpose it would be well that a Committee be appointed to ascertain the amount of reve nue raised from the duties for protecting British manufac tures, which could be easily learned from the revenue tabh.s. He (Mr. Cobden) had a statement in his hand, slyiwing that for an average of four years ending Jan 5, 1833, the duty levied on the importation of cotton manu factures, was 4,9921. ; on iron manufactures 20,6911. ; on linens, 15,3571.; on woollens, 20,4121. ; on silks, (the principal item,) 192,8731.; in the whole something under 300,0001.—( Hear, hear, hear.) The duty paid upon corn imported for four years ending sth Janu,ry, 1838—the average for that period was 2 66,2321. ; so that the whole financial difficulty of the question was less than half a million sterling annually. And that was the obstacle upon which Lord Mel bourne had represented the opponents of the Corn-laws es " wild" and " mad." He (Mr. Cobden) would take upon himself to say that if no other mode could be de vised by Lord Melbourne fox supplying that deficiency the manufacturers would themselves find the means of raising the sum. They would consent to any tax, even the worst of all taxes that could be devised—upon their steam vower itself, if in return they might enjoy an un restricted freedom of trade.—(Hcar, hear, hear.) He would move, in conclusion, that a Sub-Committee be appointe3, consisting of the Chairman, Mr. Plint, Mr. Sturge, and Dr. Bowring, to inspect the revenue returns, for a series of years, to ascertain what amount of revenue was collected by duties levied for the protection of British manufactiies; and to report their opinion as to the best means for making the result known to the House and to the country. Dr. BO WRiNG thought the question of prohibitions ought also to be examined into. He would just mention a case which had come to his knowledge. A vessel from the port of Hull had been wrecked a few days ago on the Dagger Bank, and was conducted in safety to that port by a poor Dutch fisherman, who, when desirous of'selling his lord of fish, was told that our prohibition of foreign fish was preremptory, and that the fish must be thrown into the sea.—(llear, hear.) The duty on the importation of foreign corn, was but a part of one great and perverted system, characterised by an unbrotherly and malignant spirit,—( Hear, hear.) Mr. Noon cordially agreed in what had been said by the last speaker, and could confirm what had been stated by Mr. Johnson, on Saturday, respecting the Brazil trade. Our principal articles of export were hardware, lead, &c., and the returns were sugar, coffee, cotton, &c. To show the fallacy of the operation of the present law relating to these articles in Brazil, he might mention a circum stance which had transpired within his own knowledge. A vessel had arrived in London which had taken in a oargo of coffee in Holland, and gone round the Cape of Good Hope, so as to bring it within the limits of the East India Company's Charter. The duty on the coffee from Brazil is ls. 6d. per lb. ; coming from places within the limits of the East India Charter 9d., and from the West India Colonies 6d. For Brazil coffee only 465. could be obtained in consequence of this regulation, while West India Coffee of the same quality would fetch 903. to 955. As regarded sugar, within the last month there had been imported into the City of London from Holland from 800 to 900 hogsheads of sugar, to be exported again to the Mediterranean. Our vessels were thus driven out of their natural employment, and we were obliged to pay an extravagant price for the produce of those countries which were taking from us an immense quantity of our manufactures. Mr. BOULTIIER said, the worthy Chairman would do him the justice to admit, that when first he had the pleasure of his acquaintance at Birmingham, he placed several papers in his hands to show that the Corn-laws, enacted to keep up prices to a certain standard, had not only failed, but produced exactly the contrary effect ; and that grain had always been lower under the operation of a protective sys tem than when the ports were open. This opinion he had advocated to the utmost of his power from the passing of the Act of 1815, to the present time ; the avowed object of that Act was to keep the price of wheat at 803. per qr. At the first meeting in this place, he endeavoured to obtain the assistance of a Committee to ascertain and report upon the effects of the Corn-laws, by a reference to authentic documents. Had his suggestion been adopted, he was pre pared to prove, from public documents, that the landowners were more injured by the Corn-laws than any other class; but the Committee was objected to, because, it was said, proving his ease would injure their cause. He could not comprehend how truth could be injurious to any cause, and nothing would lead him to suspect the justice of any cause more than the fear of its advocates to face the truth—and further, he must say that it was rather inconsistent in gentlemen to cry out so loudly against the House of Commons for not devoting much time and enormous expense to hearing their evidence —they themselves having refused him half an hour, un attended the outlay of a single shilling, for a similar purpose. Haviug, for twenty-four years, considered the misapprehension upon this subject to have consigned hundreds of thousande or millions of our fellow-creatures to want and misery, and, in numerous cases, to absolute starvation, not from high prices, but for want of the means to purchase food at any price, he bad felt it to be an imperious duty continually to renew the abject both here and at Manchester to the aunt)) z. , nce, he feared, of those gentlemen 40 differed from him in opinion. He hoped those gently en would be kind encugh to attribute his pertinacity to honest mo tives and not to a spirit of opposition. Mr. Porter was considered a great authority upon subjects of that kind. It was highly gratifying to him to find the opinions be bad advocated so long and so anxiously, unequivocally asserted and clearly proved in the pamphlet then in his hand, as well as by many of the speeches during the present discussions. If it were possible to induce every Member of the two /louses of Parliament to read this little work, he would not say another word upon the subject, but as his own re cent experience showed the extreme difficulty of per suading people to listen to evidence in opposition to their preconceived opinions, he felt called upon to make one more rffort to lay the facts of the case before the Legis lature, in such a manner as would be attended with the least possible trouble on their parts. He therefore moved : " That a Committee be appointed to select as many im portant facts from Mr. Porter's pamphlet, or any other source, as can be compressed into the compass of a letter, and that a copy of such letter be transmitted to every Member of both Houses of Parliament." Mr. JOH'SSON said the motion of Mr. Cobden was not yet disposed of—it would be better to dispose of it first. The Hon B. M wish ed fact to the URRATto state one P e . 6 .gation.. In - going home to Glasgow from Mauches- Le , , ne happened to travel with a farmer, and as he wished there should be no mist a k e upon the matterabe would men tipsotho €. a year from was Mr. Ewer, w h o rente d to t h e amoun t from Lord Zetland, and he (Mr. M.) was e. as.toniabed to find that he was an ardent favourer the abolition of the Corn-lairs. In addi t i on to b e i ng a farmer he wa s a l arge drover , and he said, in 1836, when he w it 7 ,1, - g e m t ti nt o u nl i y as e g t ; for marketa ils grain, he w as se lli ng h i s to greater profit, and two beasts for one he could now dispose of. The reason was obvious—that which the artizan saved in bread, he was en abled to lay out in butcher-meat. The resolution was then put and carried unanimously. On the motion of Mr. JOIINSON, Mr. Boultbce's letter was referred to the same Committee, Mr. WILLIAM MORRIS drew the attention of the Meet ing to one effect of the unequal prices of food here and on the Continent, whereby many families of narrow incomes were tempted to reside abroad, and the country had to sustain the loss from the withdrawal of such expenditure. —Adjourned. IMPERIAL PARLIAMENT. ROUSE OF LORDS, MARCH 18. The LORD CHANCELLOR toLk his ;eat at five o'clock. Lord ROSEBERY presented a petition from the isle of Bute against further endowments to the Church of Scotland. Lord REDESDALE presented a petition against any alteration in the Corn-laws. Also a petition from a parish in Surrey praying for the adoption of a penny postage. Lord STRANG FORD presented petitions in the ab sence ef his Noble Friend, from Morpeth and Alnwick, against any alteration in the Corn-laws. The Duke of CLEVELAND presented a from the Union of Durham and York, praying the House to make such an alteration in the Poor-law, as will afford easy and more effectual means of punishment for offences in bastardy. The Marquis of WESTMEATH wished to call the at tention of the Noble Marquis opposite to the fact that on the last occasion on which he (the Marquis of West meath) drew the attention of the Hduse to Irish affairs, that Ito stated the Noble Marquis had libe rated a criminal from the gaol of Mellinger, without requiring bail from him, and that the Noble Mar quis had on that occasion roundly contradicted him. Ile had since written to Ireland under an impression that his original information was true, requesting to be fur nished with the best information on the subject, and he now had received confirmatory evidence, namely, a copy of the letter of Mr. D, um mond, Secretary to the Noble Marquis, in which he communicated his Excellency's commands to the gaoler to liberate Thomas Cook, confined in the gaol of Mullingar, from custody, without bail. He could not now help ex pressing his astonishment at the Noble Marquis's contra• diction, and of stating that in his opinion such a course of proceeding was not calculated to facilitate public business. The Marquis of NORMANDY said he did not see any thing so extraordinary in the step he had been taking. On the occasion to which the Noble Marquis referred he spoke from a memorandum in his own hand writing, which he then held in his hand, expressive both of his intention and of what he did, which was, that if the man should behave himself well for two months that he should then be discharged upon giving security. He did behave well, and in a petition presented to him at the expiration of that period, he stated that he was prepared to give security, himself in 201. and two others in 101. each. Such securities were requested to be taken, and the man ordered to be liberated. He (the Noble Marquis) had never known an instance in which such an order to take security had not been attended to, although, as the Noble Marquis seemed so certain that there had been an omission here, he could not take upon himself to say there really had not been. NATIONAL CON VEN TION. (YESTERDAY.) Mr. NIARSDEN, Deputy fro — m Preston, in the Chair. MISSIONARY REPORTS. The Secretary read letters from the Missionaries. Mr. Cardo's letter stated the great progress which they were making in Cornwall with regard to the principles of the Charter. A great meeting had been held at Plymouth, which was attended by three thousand persons, and many of the middle classes confessed themselves converted to the opinions of Radicalism, and finally signed the petition in great numbers. It also gave statements of meetings at Stone-end, and Devonport, attended with the same results ; also a letter from the Missiom.ry to Somersetshire, stating that the petition from the city of Bath will be forwarded next week with 12,000 signatures attached. This letter com plained that the sum of 5/ , remitted from that place, through the Birmingham Committee, had not been ac knowledged. This gave rise to a long discussion on the many omissions which had taken place by that Committee in giving particular accounts of several sums from different parts of the country. It was finally arranged that this subject should be inquired into as soon as possible. A letter was read from the Missionaries sent to Essex and Kent, describing their success in the neighbourhood of Colchester. Dr. TAYLOR read a letter from Glasgow, giving an ac count of a great meeting which Lad been held there. The account of which meeting occupied three columns in a NlThg paper cf that city The meeting had passed a vote of confidence in the Convention. REN r.—Bradford 5/ , Brighton 31., Preston and Chor ley 51., Colchester Si., Alloa 3/ , Clackmannan 21., London District, exclusive of Marylt.bone, 101. ADDRESS TO THE CITIZENS OF LONDON ON THE POLICE BILL• Mr. SANKEY said, that although he was not quite pre pared to bring on his motion for an address to the citizens of London on the New PaLee Bill until to-morrow, yet the necessity for despatch was so evident, he felt that any deficiency on his port would be overlooked when the im portance of the subject was considered. He would, there fore, in accordance to the wish of the meeting, proceed to it at once. When it was considered that in Ireland the worst consequences had attended the introduction of those who may be properly termed Gens d'Armerie," it was not wonderful that the people of this country should take every means to resist the introduction of this measure of police. In Ireland it was this system which fostered the rebellion in that country, and, it was evident that the au thorities wished to bring on the same results, thereby sub jecting this country to the same nefarious influence. They ought not to be surprised at this, when it was recollected that Ireland was the school of British statesmen. It was in that unfortunate country that those were trained who were to be hereafter the persons whose duty it would be to administer the affairs of this country. In that arena were they to be initiated in the mysteries of Government, who would in future have in their hands the destinies of Eng lishmen.—( Hear.) This was unfortunate, for, as the feeling of tyranny which was then inculcated, was not only not got r;d of in their transplantation to this country, but they omitted no opportunity of attempting to substantiate the same system of tyranny on the people of this country. Mr. Sankey continued to express his hostility to this mea sure, which he said was only the prelude to a system of centralisation and rural police, which was intended to be adopted in this country by the Whig Government, who ever were willing to insidiously infringe on the people's rights.—( Hear, hear, and cheers.) He, therefore, would submit to them an address, which purported to offer the assistance of the country at large to the citizens of Lon don, to aid them in their endeavours to oppose the intro duction of a measure fraught with principles of hostility to every species of self-government. He then read the address. The Marquis of WESTMEATH wished to know from the Noble Marquis if he knew when it would be convenient for the Irish Office to produce papers which he had moved fJr respecting the transaction at Mullingar. The Marquis of NORMANDY could only say that he had sent for the papers. FREE LABOUR IN JAMAICA. Lord SEAFORTH wished to know from his Noble Friend, whether any papers had been transmitted by Sir Lionel Smith on the subject of the working of free labour in Jamaica, beside those already laid on the table. He made that request at the instance of a very numerous meet jug which had been convened on the subject, and it would be extremely desirable that the House should be in pos session of all the papers on this subject possible. The Marquis of NORMANBY said there was every intention to present every paper possible, so as to give the fullest information on the subject of the free system in Jamaica, v:hich it was desired should be carried into effect. Whether the system as recommended had been carried into tact he had no means of knowing, as Sir Lionel Smith had not made any communication to the Colonial Office. When he first saw the agent of Jamaica, who had presented certain papers to the local magistracy of Jamaica, and who had inquired of him if he had any objection to produce the papers, ho informed that Gentle man that he intended to lay those papers on the table, and if the Noble Lord would now move for them, they should be forthcoming. Lord ST, VINCENT was sure that the Report could not be complied with, as it was an exparte statement ; and if the Colonlal_Office gave credit to that Report it would be led into error. Mr. O'CONNOR, in seconding the resolution of Mr. San key, gave a great many illustrations of the evil effects of the police in Ireland, among which were two cases of the interference of the police in actions for debt, when they shot one man and stabbed another, and notwithstand ing their doing so, those unfortunate persons so wounded, were tried and convicted for making any resistance. He said he had a vast number of letters from the different Secre taries who had been inflicted on Ireland, giving directions to the magistrates in that country how they should conduct themselves in gathering all the information possible as to the opinions and actions of their particular neighbourhoods. The only one of those Secretaries who gave those direc tion s in anything like a gentlemanly manner, was Sir Ro bert Peel. He hoped to be able at some future day to give these letters to the public. He was glad the Morning Chronicle had reported the determination of the country, as expressed in the meeting at the Crown and Anchor on Saturday night ; and if the reporter of that journal were now here he would thank him to take down his words, when he said that the country was prepared to take their stand against the system of centralization which was sought to be acted on in this country. Mr. O'Connor had great pleasure in seconding the address of Mr. Sankey. Mr. WHITTLE and Mr. RtetiAnusost supported the ad dress. The Marquis of ANGLESEA presented a petition from the minister, churchwardens, &c., of the parish of Amlwch against the appropriation of surplus revenues, arising from the Union, of the sees of Bangor and St. Asaph, towards the augmentation of bishoprics in England. Lord ERROL presented a petition from Aberdeen, praying for Church Extension in Scotland. the - Duke of s ARGYLE presented a petition to the same effect. The Marciitig•of INTE presented a petition from Ayr shire and other parts to the same effect. Lord HADDINGTON presented a petition from 1132r wick to the sam4 effect; also a petition from a place in the county of Oxford against airy alteration in the Corn-laws. Dr. TAYLOR said that when in France in 1826, the Go vernment of that country did their best to increase the police force there. For the purpose of getting up excuses for this increase, the Government procured the bodies of the deceased persons in the " Hotel Dieu," and had them paraded in the " Morgue," or Dead-house, with se veral stabs in their persons, and gave out that they were persons who had been murdered in the streets of Paris during night. This they did to create a necessity for the police. He was one cf a Committee appointed to watch over this conduct of Government, and never was there any outbreak but what had been produced by Govern ment through disguised policemen. This line of conduct would be adopted here, and he only hoped that the same result would attend it. That if the Government measure, so contrary to the custom of the constitution of this country be attempted to be enforced, there was no doubt but that the three glorious days of July might be enacted, and if such should unfortunately occur, woe to those who who would be the occasion of making this great people rise in opposition to the infraction of their rights. Mr. Isleesom and Mr. PITKRATHLEY supported the ad dress. The latter gentleman read a letter from Ashton and Mansfield, which stated that the Government was already organizing the rural police force, having sent down to that neighbourhood forty of the London police, who employed their time in breaking windows, and instructing the youth in pelting each other with snow-balls. Mr. CARPENTRR said that the address should also be directed to the people of the seven counties which the new Police Bill took in with its enactments—namely, Middlesex, Essex, Surrey, Sussex, Berkshire, Bedford shire, and Buckinghamshire. It was evident it was only the first step to the introduction of the rural police through the country, from the fact of striving to subject these counties to its horrid influence. He was glad that this Bill was brought forward, as it would tend to arouse the country to a sense of what was their duty.—( Hear. ) Dr. M'DowELL seconded the suggestions of Mr. Car penter. He said that if a rural police should be introduced, Scotland would not submit to it. They would repeal the Union which bad subsisted between it and England, if any attempt should be made to encroach on their remaining liberties. —( Hear.) Dr. FLETenza would not recommend the use of dag gers against the police, as Dr. M'Dowell had, but to have always in their hands a loaded bludgeon, and if any of those kind of soldiers of the Government, for soldiers they really were, should attempt to molest the person of one of the subjects of the realm, let him use that bludgeon in a manner that should not require a second blow to do its work effectually.—(Hear, hear, and loud cheers.) He concluded a long address by solemnly saying, That if re sistence is necessary to oppose the Rural Police Bill, Rs- SISTENCE THERE WILL BE.--( Long andcontinned cheering. ) Mr. SANKEY then replied, and said he would be happy to adopt Mr. Carpenter's suggestion to withdraw his address. He then went over the Bill, and showed from it there were twenty new crimes created, of which the whole superin tendence was given to the police. The address was then ordered to be re-committed. The meeting dissolved at three o'clock in order to make preparations for the dinner to Mr. Frost. THE MAILS.—STEAM CONVEYANCE TO AMERICA.—We, are extremely happy to learn that her Ma jesty's Government have entered into a contract for con veying the mails, by large and powerful steam-vessels, from Liverpool to Halifax, and thence by branch steamers to Boston, and in the summer to Quebec. The mercan tile interests, not only in the North American colonies, but also in the United States, will be gratified to learn that, instead of a monthly communication as formerly, steamers will now be despatched on the Ist and 15th of each month. The enterprising contractor has engaged with those able and scientific builders, Messrs. Wood, at Port Glasgow, to build three ships of 1,000 tons each, in which Robert Napier, Esq., is to place engines of 400 horse power. From the past success of Messrs. Wood and Napier, we doubt not when these vessels are on their sta tion, in April, 1840, they will be quite unrivalled ; and, moreover, that the acute observation of " S am Slick," that " the route via Halifax is the shortest way to New York," will be verified to demonstration.— Gasgow Courier. CURIOUS CASE.—At the Moot Hall, Colches ter, on Monday, Mr. Samuel Powell was summoned for nine shillings' arrears of church rates. Mr. Powell pleaded that be had tendered the money on the overseer's demand being made. The overseer said that the defendant offered to pay him in farthings, and as that was not a legal tender he refused to accept them. The defendant contended that ii was a legal tender, being the current coin of the realm. On a reference to the 56th Gco. 111., cap. 68, it was dis covered that no other money than silver was a legal tender under forty shillings, and none but gold above that sum. The defendant was ordered to pay the rate and costs. Chelmsford Chronicle. EXTRAORDINARY SALE OF HARDWOOD.--ft There was sold on Tuesday, by Mr. George Wilson, of Blackball, auctioneer, at Drydgn, the property of George _Mercer, E sq ., f our pl ane -t rees , w hi c h brought the sum of 771. sterling; a price, we believe, that has never been ob tained in Scotl an d b e f ore f or trees o f t h e sa me description. The wood was purchased for the purposes of machinery.— Scotsman. Carli❑ Sunday was celebrated after the usual annual custom, at the Hole-in-the-Wall, Fleet-street, where upwards of 12 bushels of grey peas were prepared for men of the North. The origin of this singular feast is as follows :—Many years since a battle was fought at New castle, when the inhabitants were on the eve of starvation, a vessel entered the port (on the fifth Sunday in Lent) filled with gray peas, which were fried in oil, and thus saved the lives of several thousand persons. THE SUN, LONDON, TUESDAY, MARCH 19, 1839. r isoned for three months. He knew they had committed a grave offence—he had always said it was a grave offence, and had always differed from those who had treated it as no offence at all. But they had been heavily punished, and he trusted mercy would be extended to them. He had made anxious inquiry of those who had communicated with them, and was assured that if they were released, there would be no expression of an unreasonable nature—nothing but an expression of gratitude for the mercy shown to them. CRIME IN IRELAND. The Marquis of NORMAN — BY wished to ask the Noble Lord opposite (Lord Roden) in what shape the motion, of which he had given notice for Thursday, would be brought forward. Earl RODEN said his intention was to move for a Com mittee of Inquiry with respect to crime, and the cause of crime in Ireland. POST-OFFICE REFORM. Lord BROUGHAM presented a Fetition from Chel tenham, praying their Lordships to adopt Mr. R. Hill's plan for the reduction of the rate of postage. The Duke of RICHMOND presented a similar petition from Huntingdon, in Sussex, and observed that he had ever been or opinicn that the rate of postage ought to be reduced if it was wished to keep up the Post-office reve nue; but he bad not had time to read the voluminous re port of the Committee of the other House, and therefore could not pledge himself to an op i n i on as to w h et h er M r . R. Hill's plan might or might not be carried into execu tion. CHURCH EXTENSION (SCOTLAND). Lord BROUGHAM said, he bad now to present this rather unfortunate petition from Glasgow.—( A laugh.) He meant as regarded himself only; but he found it was a very important one, and upon examining it he observed it was signed by 40,587 individuals. The Duke of RICHMOND.—If the Noble and Learned Lord had only read the outside of the petition he would have seen it related to Church Extension. Lord BR 0 UG H AM did not like reading the outside of things. lie always looked at the inside.—( Hear, and laughter.) The petitioners strongly urged their Lord ships not to grant any additional endowment to the Church of Scotland, and stated that the declaration of the Noble Viscount at the head of the Government, that it was not intended to make any such proposition on that subject would give great satisfaction to the country. The Earl of ABERDEEN said the Noble Viscount must have held different language at different times, if the petitioners were correct, because he had given a positive pledge that acme proposition with regard to granting money would be made in the course of this Session. Lcrd MELBOURNE said that all lie had stated was that the Government had not come to a determination to make any proposition on the subject. Lord STANHOPE had a petition to present upon a subject of much importance, and seeing the Noble and Learned Lord opposite he would take that opportunity of stating his belief that among the marry hundreds of peti tions which the Noble and Learned Lord had presented on the question of negro slavery, there would be some in de molition of white slavery, and no doubt some in favour of the abolition of the New Poor•law Bill. The petition he had to present was from the parish of Ruringfield, in Suf folk, against any alteration in the Corn-laws.—( Laughter.) Lord BROUGHAM must tell his Noble Friend that he must not lay the flattering unction to his soul, that any of the petitions he had presented were against the New Poor-law, he bad never but in one in stance presented any petition to the House but what had been examined, and an abstract made from it ; but in 99 out of 100 cases, he opened the petition and read the prayer of it from the petition ; accordingly it went through three processes, it was examined and an abstract made, it was read by him at the table, and was afterwards read by the clerk at the table—how then could there be any mis take ? He had presented many petitions in favour of the Poor-laws from persons of good and sound judgment.— ( Laughter. ) . _ Earl STANHOPE presented a petition from a person in Huddersfield (as we understood), stating that be was 91 years of age, that for upwards of 50 rears he bad con tributed to the poor-rates—that up to a late period he was in the receipt of 4s. per week from the parish to which he belonged, but it coming to the cars of the guardians of the Union, they, acting under the directon of the dic tators of Somerset-house, reduced that allowance to 2s. Even a Poor-law Commissioner or his Deputy could scarcely expect a man arrived at such an age to be able to work ; he was not, and accordingly his goods were seized, and he and his aged - partner were compelled to go into the confinement of the workhouse. He had been a religious man ell his life, and now complained that he was deprived of the liberty of attending the worship of God, in his own holy temple,—he was unaccused of any crime, yet he was imprisoned, he was separated from his wife, and he prayed for the restoration of the system, under which the old Poor-laws were administered. Lord E LLENBOROUGH considered that there must be a great deal of misrepresentation in the state ments of the petition which had jut been presented. There was one undoubtedly, for the Commissioners had nothing whatever to do with the case. It entirely rested with the Board of Guardians in the country, he had no doubt that upon investigation, it would be found out, that the poor old man, had relatives who would in some way be enabled to assist him, and that what was given by the Board of Guardians was merely given in aid of that assistance. He trusted that there were some feelings of humanity pre valent amongst the Boards of Guardians, and that in par ticular cases of distress they would not think themselves bound by the general rules. Earl STAN HOPE begged it to be understood that he did not rest his hostility to the New Poor-law on the ground of individual cases of hardship. It was on account of its general character that he opposed it. He had no doubt that in the present instance the Guardians had acted ac cording to law. He relied, however, upon the statements of the petitions, as they came from an individual of the highest respectability, for whom he had the highest regard. Lord BROUGHAM hoped that the Noble Earl would have no objection to send a copy of the complaints that were made against " the three dictators of Somerset House," as the Noble Earl had been pleased to call them —(Laughter)—but who were in reality three most worthy, most honourable, most laborious individuals, who spared no pains to effect a proper discharge of the very responsible, but by no means agreeable duties which they had to perform. He could assure their Lordships that where a charge in which the Poor Law Commissioners were accused, or a charge in which they were implicated was brought forward, they presented every detail with a most searching inquiry. If the Commissioners were implicated in this case, they would court inquiry—if the Board of Guardians only were implicated they must exculpate themselves. Earl STANHOPE thought those three most worthy, most honourable men were working like moles in the dark. Surely they must have seen the late accounts of hardship and oppression of the poor which had appeared in the newspapers, and which it was impossible for any person not devoid of the natural sympathies of mankind, to look at without feelings of horror and indignation, Lord BROUGHAM would make a very fair, and a very respectful proposition to the Noble Earl. Indeed he would challenge him to adopt it. Let him give notice of a motion that he should bring forward all the charges that be could collect, supported by real names, against the Poor-law Commissioners, and then he (Lord B.) would un dertake to meet his Noble Friend on behalf of the Com missioners, as he did last year. Here he (Lord Brougham) could not help remarking, though he could not imagine what the reason might be, that his Noble Friend was not quite so ready to meet him (Lord Brougham) as he was last year.—(Laughter, and hear, hear.) Earl STANHOPE begged leave to assure his Noble Friend, that he was quite as ready to meet him as ever. He would not trouble their Lordships with a vast package of complaints that were in his possossion, but he would give notice that he should move for copies of the corre spondence that may have taken place between the Poor law Commissioners and others, respecting the cases of A, B, and C, &c. He should give names hereafter. Lord BROUGHAM had no objection to this., Earl STANHOPE now said that he should much pre fer that cases were investigated in the precise and quick manner pursued in courts of law, instead of in the dila tory, digressive, indeterminate, vexatious, ineffective, and inconclusive mode adopted in a Committee. He (Earl Stanhope) wasted much time in the Committee of last year, and he found that instead of exploring truth, the Members were desirous of making those witnesses, who gave and confute opinions con t . e themselves. e t o the New Poor-law, to con found Lord WHARNCLIFFE, as a member of the Com mittee, said that the witnesses were merely cross-examined. He admitted that cross-examination was sometimes not a very agreeable operation. Respecting the petition presented by the Noble Earl, he (Lord Wharncliffe begged to remind their Lordships that the Duke of Portland was Chairman of the Board of Guardians of that Union, which was near Sheffield. He was sure no one would think the Noble Duke likely to encourage inhumane treat ment of the poor.—( Hear.) The Duke of RICHMOND, another member of the Committee, assured their Lordships that their conduct had been perfectly correct. He would also remind their Lord ships that in cases similar to that complainedof, that the Ma gistrates could not order the oversee Now they would be re lievedw h they were new system wss better than the old, for rs t fo o r r m e e ti r e l v y e t p h e e rsens in not belonging to the parish. ple L ee or i d n if they belonged to the Union in which frCorn laws. distress.—( Hear.) N Y ; Yorkshire, L ag i a F in F s E t apnryeseanitteerdation a IRISH POOR-LAWS. Lord MOUNTCASHEL complained that it was still found that in Ireland, a person who had property in several electoral divisions could vote for the election of Guardians in only one. He asked how soon should that injustice be removed ? Lord DUNC ANNON said it bad been already removed. The Irish Poor-law Act, as amended, received the Royal Assent last Friday. Henceforward a person in that coun try should have a vote for the Guardians for each electoral division in which he should have property. Lord MOUNTCASHEL presented a petition from a place in the county of Cork a gainst a repeal of the Corn. laws. The Noble Earl then proceeded to make a few ob servations to their Lordships on this im p ortant subject, par. tieularly as regar d e d Ireland. He was sorry to perceive the other ni g ht th a t t h e Noble Lords who spoke in favour of a re peal of th e C orn -l aw s, seemed to throw Ireland overboard altogether.—(Cries of " No, no.") Ycs, he repeated, they appeared to sacr ifi ce Ireland altogether, although Ireland would be the greatest sufferer if the Corn-laws were repealed. It was well known that a great portion of the resources of Ireland were derived from the exportation of corn and pigs to England.—( Laughter.) Now, if t h e Corn-laws were to be repealed, that exportation must be in a great degree discontinued. The next evil consequence would be that the sowing of potatoes, which now manured the land before the sowing of wheat, an d which sustained a great body of the people, would bo very much diminished. The labourer now in Ireland worked for Bd. a day, and could scarcely procure food enough for himself and family, but if the Corn -laws were repealed the supply of potatoes, upon which he now mainly depended, would be fearfully curtailed, and his wages would he reduced to 4d., or perhaps 3a , a day. Now he would leave it to their Lordships to judge how a poor man could support a wife and children out of such wages ? He would further remind their Lordships that the estates in Ireland were generally largely encumbered; besides the interest cn mortgages the landlords had to pay interest on debts and jointurs s and other liabilities. It would be impossible, therefore, for the best and kindest of the landlords to re duce their rents, for their engagements must be met. The same arguments would apply, in a great degree, to the landlords in England ; but he (Lord M.) was really per suaded in the long run that the manufacturers would lose more than the landed interest, for their own market would be ruined. According to Mr. INl`Queen, that eminent statistician, the whole annual value of the manufactures in this country were 272,000,0001., this was proved by the returns in 1838. The whole value of the the exports from this aggregate was 43,000,006/,, the rest was consumed at home. It was therefore clear that the home market was by far the most important to the manu facturers. Now the principal consumers were the land owners, the farmers, and labourers—he would beg of them not to impoverish those by a repeal of the Corn-laws. In another point of view he would state that the manufacturer would be more rapidly ruined by a repeal of the Corn laws than the landowner, because it would be much more easy to strike a doquet of bankruptcy against a manufac turer than to compel a landlord to sell his estate. Now the whole of the landed property in Great Britain and Ireland was worth 3,258,000,000/. Suppose that the Corn-laws would diminish the value of rents by one-third, and taking the estimate at twenty years' purchase, more than 1,000,000,000/. of property in land would be destroyed, an amount that was 200,000,0001. more than the national debt. Further, ho would remind their Lordships that we were the bankers of the world. Now was it not probable that in the event of of a repeal of the Corn-laws, the mul. tititude of foreigners, now fundholders in this country, would sell out their stock and invest their money elscwin re, thereby producing a heavy fall in our funds ? There would also be a vast diminution in in the use of all exciseable produce, arid he was sure at last that the Ministers would not have revenue enough, not only to pay the interest on the national debt, but also the expenses necessary for the support of our in stitutions. The Government would then be reduced to the very serious dilemma of having to impose additional taxes, or to raise money by loans. Now if we could not raise corn enough at home, he thought we ought to en. courage our North American colonies to raise cum for us. The duty upon corn coming from that country was, as the law now stood, 6s. a quarter, until the price reached 675. Now he n . ould suggest that it would be politic to re duce.this duty to Is. ; this measure would strengthen the union between us and the colonies ; it would stimulate them to cnitivate corn, and would ensure us a safer supply than we could ensure from foreign countries. Viscount GAGE presented a petition from the Guar dians of a Union in Oxford, complaining that the manner in which the mother of an illegitimate child was obliged by the Poor-law Amendment Act to swear to its paternity in a public Court of Session, was exceedingly cruel and degrading, and praying that a Bill might be passed autho rising Magistrates in Petty Sessions to make an order on the father of an illegitimate child, and commit him to prison in case he should not comply with it. Their Lordships then adjourned. HOUSE OF COMMONS, iIIARcH 18. The gallery was not opened till Half-past Four o'clock, in consequence of the notice of Lord Barrington for a Call of the House. The Noble Lord withdrew his motion. Lord GEORGE LENNOX presented two petitions from parishes in Sussex against any repeal of the Corn laws. Mr. LUCAS, presented a petition from Ulster, praying that Presbyterian soldiers might have an opportunity of attending chapels of their own persuasion. Mr. G. E VANS presented petitions from Limerick, against any alteration of the Corn-laws. Also, a petition from Dublin, in favour of the vote by Ballot. Mr. LOCKHA RT presented a petition from Renfrew, against any alteration in the Corn-laws. _ — Mr. JONES presented petitions from Carmarthen, to the same effect. Lord A. LENNOX presented petitions from Chichester, against the Ecclesiastical Duties and Revenues Bill. Mr. Alderman THOMPSON presented a petition from the City of London, against the Metropolitan Police Bill. Mr. BRINE S presented a petition from the West Riding of York, against the Beer Bill. Mr. WILSON PATTEN presented a similar petition from Lancaster. Mr. PEASE presented a petition from the North Riding of the county of York against any repeal of the Corn-laws. Mr. BLENNE RITA SSETT presented a petition from the Grard Jury of the county of Kerry, in favour of the existing Corn-laws. Sir G. STRICKLAND presented a petition from the West Riding of the county of York in favour of the Local Courts Bill. Mr. SMITH O'BRIEN presented two petitions from Limerick praying for the full benefits of the Union. Mr. MARK PHILLIPS presented petitions from Manchester against the Highways Bill. Col. PERCEVAL presented petitions from Ro.com mcn against any grant for National Education in Ireland. Also petitions from different parts of Ireland in favour of the promotion of Railroads in that country. Captain EGERTON presented a petition from Chester against any repeal of the Corn-laws. Mr. GOULBURN presented a petition from the University of Cambridge against the Ecclesiastical Duties and Revenues Bill. Mr. WALLACE presented a petition from the Cham ber of Commerce of Edinburgh, and a place in Fife, in fa vour of Mr. Rowland Hill's Postage plan. Lord JOHN RUSSELL presented a petition from Stroud, praying for an alteration in the Act for the sale of Beer. Mr. F. FRENCH presented a petition from certain landowners of Connaught, praying that the benefit of rail way communication might be extended to that province. Lord MAHON presented a petition from Hereford against any alteration in the Corn-laws. ' — Mr. L BOI.TCHERE presented a petition from a newspaper proprietor of Somerset, praying that he might not be compelled to insert advertisements relative to insol vent debtors at a low rate. Sir B. HALL brought in the Marylebone Gas Bill, which was read a first time. IMPRESSMENT. Mr. HORSMAN gave notice that he would, after Easter, call the attention of the House to the subject of Impressment. LOSS OF TIMBER SHIPS. Mr. PALMER gave notice that he would on Thursday move the appointment of a Committee to inquire into the losses of timber ships. He st4.ed that he frP V t"— Urdsouse in concurrence with the Government. TAXES UPON LAND. Mr. BAINES gave notice of a motion fer returns, showing the amount of taxes paid by owners and occupiers of land, as such, in the year 1838; and showing the pro portion those taxes bore to the general burdens of the country. Mr: GIL LON gave notice that he would move for a return of the amount of Post-office duty paid from January, 1838, to January, 1839, EXCHEQUER BILLS. Mr. HU\IE gave notice that he would move for returns, showing the annual issue of Exchequer Bills for public works, from the first establishment of the office to the present period—showing the amount issued and the amount repaid in each year—the amount of interest paid to the Commissioners, and the amount paid by the Government— in order to ascertain how far the issue of such Bills had been profitable or otherwise to the country. PERSONS IN CONFINEMENT FOR CON TEMPT, OR FOR REVENUE OFFENCES. The 'fox. MEMBER also gave notice that he would move for returns of the number of persons confined for con tempt in any of her Majesty's gaols in England and Wales, and a similar return for Ireland. And returns of all persons now confined in any of her Majesty's Gaols, or in any of the Houses of Correction, for offences against the Revenue Laws, distinguishing the number of offences, and the amount of the penalties inflicted. Mr. GOULB URN said that certain papers on the table, relative to West India affairs, were confined to the reports of the special magistrates. He was anxious to know whether other reports had been transmitted. Mr. L A BOUCHERE said that the papers laid on the table on Friday last comprised in substance the whole of the communications from the West Indies. Some correspondence had been received from Mr. Burge, and no objection would be made to its production if any Hon- Member moved for it. PYASTRIiN WARS. Lord ABERDEEN wished •to ask the Noble Vis count opposite, with reference to the papers which had been printed, whether it was his intention to give any explanation of the war in which we were now engaged in the East ? or to produce any additional information to the House. Lord MELBOURNE said there was a good deal more information to be laid on the table, and that it was not his intention to offer any explanation until the whole of the information was before their Lordships. Lord ABERDEEN wished to know whether any ad ditional information that was to be supplied would be in cluded in correspondence between certain Chiefs, (whose names we did not hear), before the declaration of war was made. Lord MELBOURNE was not exactly aware whether it would or not. Lord ABERDEEN then said, that as that was uncer tain, he should now give notice, that to-morrow he would move for a return of that correspondence. Lord MELBOURNE said that if the Noble Lord would furnish him with a list of the documents he had wished, he would probably be able to give him the neces sary information. Lord ELLENBOROUGH said that he had furnished the Noble Viscount with a list of papers some days ago which he wished to have laid on the table, but the Noble Viscount had given him no information yet respecting those papers. The Earl of RIPON wished to know from the Noble Viscount whether the papers to be produced refered to our affairs with Persia. Lord MELBOURNE said the papers would contain a full statement of our relations with Persia, from the time of Mr. Ellis's mission. Lord ELLENBOROUGH w;shed to know whether the Noble Viscount wished to make a motion on the pro duction of all the papers. Lord MELBOURNE said he had not stated that he should make any motion, but simply that he should offer an explanation. _. _ The Earl of FALMOUTH presented petitions from Cornwall against the Beer Bill. CORN-LAWS. Lord BROUGHAM presented a petition from Congle. ton, praying the House to abolish all restrictions on the free importation of corn. The Noble and Learned Lord observed that he had read this petition very carefully, in order to avoid the possibility of falling into the mistake which he made the other night.—(Hear, hear, and a laugh.) He had heard that some people did not like to have a certain French General opposed to them because they could not sleep with one eye without being detected by him ; but he thought that no one would be able to sleep even with half an eye, so as to escape the vigilance of his Noble Friend on the cross bench (the Duke of Richmond). He begged, however, to apologise for the mistake he had made. It was an error that any one, except his Noble Friend, might have fallen into.--( Laughter.) But his Noble Friend was the cause of that mistake—(Renewed laughter)---for it would be recollected that he produced, with some sort of triumph, a resolution of the Chamber of Commerce of Glasgow stating that that most respectable body was decidedly against any repeal of the Corn-laws; and nodoubtthatseemed avgearyinsftavhoiumrab(lLenrd Brougham)forthe doctrine ,of o r f the Noble Duke, and it looked as if the manufacturing and trading community were in favour of the existing restrictions. In consequence of what the Noble Duke had said a deputation of most respectable persons, consisting of Mr. Sturge, Mr. Walmsley, and two gentlemen from Glasgow waited on him the next morning to inform him of the state of the case, and they said, " In order to show you there is no ground whatever for supposing that that is the feeling of the mercantile classes of Glasgow there's a petition for the total repeal of the Corn-laws, signed by 43,000 inhabitants of Glasgow." On coming down to the House at five o'clock, the officer gave him the petition, and said it was a petition from Glasgow, which naturally led him to suppose it was the petition which had been men tioned to him. The petition certainly looked as though there was room for 43 000 signatures, and he had no idea there were two petitions from Glasgow signed by so large a number of individuals. That was his excuse for having taken it for granted that that was the petition mentioned to him. PRISONS DISCIPLINE (SCOTLAND), The NOBLE and LEARNED LORD then presented a peti tion from the Commissioners of Police for the borough of Paisley, for the purpose of amending prisons and prisons' discipline in Scotland. BEER BILL. Also a petition from the Magistrates and inhabitants of Stroud, for a repeal, or for such alteration of the Beer Act as would prevent beer being consumed on the pre. noises. In presenting this petition the Noble and Learned Lord observed that he was in the hands of their Lordships as to what course he should pursue with regard to his Beer Bill. He was disposed to fix it for Friday, tl.an their Lordships would have the inconvenience of a debate the night before which would probably last till a late hour, The Marquis of WE STMEATH—WiII it be an ad. journed debate? Lord BROUGHAM—I caution the Noble Marquis against using that word, because whenever it is used an adjournment takes place. Adjourned debates are a griev ance—( Hear, hear)—and do very little good to the ques tion.—(Cbeers and laughter.) After a short discussion, it was agreed that the second reading of the Beer Bill should be fixed for Friday next. GLASGOW COTTON SPINNERS. Lord BROUGHAM then presented a petition from the five Glasgow cotton-spinners who were convicted in Scot land about a year and a ball ago of illegal combination, and who were now under sentence in the Hulks. From some unfortunate mistake, they had been kept for two years in prison, and for the last twelve or fourteen months they had been confined to the hulks. They prayed their Lordships to interfere in their behalf to obtain mercy, but he would much rather beg the attention of his Noble Friends in the Queen's Government to this subject, because they had already suffered two years imprisonment, the greater part of that time in the hulks, and if they had happened to commit the same offence a few miles to the southward of where they did commit it, namely, in England, they could only by law have been im- AFFAIRS OF PERSIA. In answer to a question put by Sir Y.6IIAITAM, Lord PALMERSTON said that Mr. M•Neil had ap plied for leave to come home in the course of last year, and he intended to do so whenever the state of the public service would enable him. When the state of the discussion with the Government led him to retire from the Persian territory, he left on the frontiers a Charge d'Affaires, who was instructed to remain there, to await any communica• tions which he might receive from the Persian Govern ment, and transmit them to the English Government. Therefore the Charge d'Affaires was in a position in which he would be enabled to carry on any communications with the Persian Government, with a view to the adjustment of the differences which existed. INDIA. Sir J. HOBHOLTSE, in answer to a question by Sir J. GRAHAM said that it was not intended to lay on the table, before Easter, certain documents relative to the Governor-gener a l of India. METROPOLITAN POLICE BILLS. Sir B. HALL said the above Bills were of much import ance to alt the metropolitan boroughs, and created a very considerable sensation. They stood for a second reading on Friday next. He wished to ask the Noble Lord whether tha Government intended to proceed with them before th© Easter recess? Lord JOHN RUSSELL said it was not intended to move the second reading of these Bills before the recess, but they would take an early day of proceeding with them after. POOR.LAWS. Mr. T. DUNCOM BE wished to ask a question of the Noble Lord. The Poor• law Commissioners had issued an order to several Unions, directing that the clerks of such Unions should act as returning officers in the election of Guardians, in place of a barrister of a certain standing. He wished to ask the Noble Lord whether that order had been presented to the Seciet4ry of State before it was issued ? Lord JOHN RUSSELL did not think that the order alluded to was a general order. It was a special order, and therefore not liable to that section of the Act. Mr. T. DUNCOMI3E—Was he to understand that the question had been submitted to the Noble Lord or not? Lord JOHN RUSSELL—The question was sub mitted to him as to the propriety of making an altera tion in the mode of electing Guardians ; but ho did not think that the order had been submitted to him as a gene ral Rder. Mr. T. D U NC 0 MBE said there was a very strong feel ing prevailing, that the elections taken by the clerks would be illegal unless the order had been submited to the Noble Lord 40 days previous to its promulgation. It was consi. dered that all orders made by the Poor Law Commisioners Lord JOHN RUSSELL moved the Order of the Day for the House going into Committee of Supply. Mr. T. ATT WOO D said he intended to move an amendment. It was his determination to take the sense of the House on the question whether or no it should be a recommendation to the Committee of Supply to re consider the vote of 34,165 men for the Navy. Now when he looked at the state of the Russian navy, and at the state of the navies of France and America, and when he considered the state of our foreign relations generally, he thought the House would agree with him in opinion that it was fit and proper that the vote should be rescinded. It was a most serious subject, and in the course of a few mouths it might be too late to rectify the error which was about to be committed.—( Hear.) The words "fearful vengeance" had been made use of by the Secretary for the Navy, but it was acknowledged that the Russian fleet might run to Sheerness, or might take Portsmouth, and, after the breaking up of the Baltic ice, destroy that great English naval establishment. He would be glad to know, in such a case, from what quarter of the world they were to inflict fearful vengeance. Suppose the Russians entered the Black Sea with twenty-eight ships of the line, and suppose they burned Sheerness, and landed ten thousand men at Portsmouth, how were they to exact fearful vengeance. They had got eleven sail of the line in the Mediterranean, and two in the West Indies. Perhaps, in the space of three months, they might have 15 sail of the line in the Thames ; but if the Russians followed them with two fleets of twenty_ eight and ten sail of the line, how were fifteen line of battle ships to contend with 38 with any chance of success ? Night after night they had received notice that the Russian fleet was armed against England.— As to their being the friends of England, there was not a man in the House so gross a fool as to believe that. They might as well believe that Louis Philippe was the friend of England.—(Hear, hear, and a laugh.) No man who bad read history, or studied human nature, could believe such a thing. Russia had been gathering power for twenty years to plant a dagger in the heart of England, and her fleet at Cronstadt would be as surely brought against them as the Constantinople fleet on a rmer occasion. They might depend upon it that Russia would give them no notice, but, seizing ' the proper opportunity, she would run her fleet into the Thames. What security had they against such contingencies? When De Ruyter swept the Chan nel and burnt Sheerness what defence had they? The Russians spent more money in their diplomacy than they did upon their army ; they had got spies in evtry camp and Court, and half the press of Eng land was bribed by them. Many of the gentry of England were influenced, he would not say bribed by Rus sia. There was not a Gentleman in that House who would not acknowledge that the disturbances in Persia and India had been got up by Russia—as for Egypt, she was a mere tool of Russia, and the East India Company had acted wisely in taking possession of an Island in the Persian Gulph, and another in the Red Sea —one of these was a hook in the nose of Persia, and the other was a hook in the nose of Egypt.—(A laugh.) No man in his senses could doubt that the disturb , ances in Canada, and perhaps those in Mexico, had been got up by Russia. Our Navy was not in a condition to enable us to interfere with effect, in Mexico, in India, or even in England itself. We were not in a condition to meet any of these contin gencies, and it was proper for us to guard against them. A little matter might create war. There was not an En glishman who did not feel a blush of shame whenever the word Vixen was pronounced.—( A laugh.) Even the Radi cals blushed who never blushed before.—(Loud laughter. ) No man was a greater enemy of war than himself, but the way to avoid war to be always prepared for it. Let the fleet be put in a proper state, at all hazards and at all sacrifices. If we were to suffer the Russians to acquire an immense fleet in a time of profound peace, and not put ourselves on a corresponding establishment, we were the greatest fools that ever existed. We ought to have a fleet competent to beat the Russians with absolute certainty ; it ought to be manned at all hazards and all cost.—( Hear, hear.) There were 30,000 of the best English sailors in the American navy, and he (Mr. A.) would have every one of them back again. But it was said, " how will you get them ?" Why, pay them better than the Americans pay them.—( Hear, hear.) But where were they to get gold? Let them look at the mortgage rentals and the funds. The Russians, these barbarians, if they c ame , the Hon. Member for Kilkenny would say, "buy them off." (Mr. flume—" No, no.") We bought off the Danes 10 or 20 times, and the more we bought them off, the more they came.—(Loud laughter.) H e wished the safety and honour of England to be protected. What, when they gave 20 millions to the negroes, could they not afford five millions to British sailors ?—(Hear, hear.) Could not our Pension-laws be altered ? Could not our Navy be made equal to that of the American sailors? Why did they not mtke the Royal Navy of England the most attractive service in the world ?—( Hear.) CORN-LAWS, Mr. FIELDEN rose to address the House, but Ac he t inaudible that we could scarcely catch a sentence of wu! be e said. He thought the crimination and recrimination tbeteep taken place in the course of this debate, would hav e f t ee much better spared. To give the House a notion t hst state in which the manufacturer was, he would state rac, in 1826, for manufacturing a certain fabric, the ma ntl e be turer got 15s. 4d. ; in 1810, for manufacturing the oan l c h s got 9s. Bd. ; in 1834, 75., and in 1839, ss. And if en ilia reduction had taken place in the price of manufaclub'ere, cotton goods, there must be something wrong sogier et ioa But this was not all—we were increasing the pro ° ,oo beyond the supply of raw materials, as would be s' o e from the circumstance, that 3001bs. of cotton in 18 1 7 , r 8 sli duced 344 yards of cloth ; whereas, in 1830, 10 4 the same quantity of cotton produced 388 yards; ' ri d 07 and 1838 it produced 564 yards, and in 1837 it produce _ 0 yards. (The Hon. Gent. was here interrupted 1100 of " Order, order," and the attention of the Spealt er hid directed to an Hon. Member in the Gallery, Yeu ° ,,se procured a candle, and was very quietly reading a ° O. paper. The Speaker having intimated that it 045 t he trary to the rules of the House to read a newspeP er e i,eo " offending Member" withdrew.) He hoped the Pico would not be led away by speculators and theorists• lotto, proposition to establish a free trade in corn is as monl b bt of when it was recollected that they had a public t he 700,000,0001 or 800,000,0001. If the House granteo(gr, present Committee, he hoped they would allow bin' the Fielden) to prove before it the distressed state Coro. hand-loom weavers. What he would suggest, if ca ll° laws were repealed, was that the Excise-laws shoula b d otre repealed, and all those taxes which pressed upon the in t, be of the people should be taken off. In addition to the laid would propose that an equitable property tax shouldboefos on, and that would, in some degree, relieve the peer dad burdens which pressed upon them. Mr. Fielden con9„ s ot by apologizing for having trespassed so long on the t ` P " the House. b lig bt Mr. S. O'BRIEN could not expect to throw Mll e D OI upon the debate, but, representing a large egri cil i eilig county, he felt it his duty to state his reasons for en tie se to the opinion he had formed upon the svbject.--( sli ce bear.) His constituents were favourable to the maintensone of the present law, but it a pp eare d to him that p od change was desirable in th e p resen t s y s tem. It aPP'thet to him that any amount of foreign grain required bi r d er• country could be imported at from 40s. to ess. per qu e e t ge The next question was, what was the amount of tbej eoe ply that could be obtained at that price. The Hon. re st ber for London, whose opinions were entitled to void weight. had said, that about a m illi on o f quar ters e 'ettl he imported annually, under a sy s t em o f f r ee-tran e ,' hs to considering that nearly three milli o ns o f quar ters wil l ie been imported in the present ye ar , s i nce th e great price, it appeared to him that the Honourable d a te bees calcelations were founded on erroneous ~ 0 The present question had b een t rea t e d as a 10 ° 00 question. Now he conceived that the landlordsi ter est were unencumbered with f a mily c h arges , h a d less ill OA in the question than any other class of the agriceltu p ee With respect to the tenants, it was clear that by e fe r, of the Corn-laws a large quantity of land would be t",„" je li• out of cultivation, and thereby farms would be V:0 0 dated, and capital annihilated. If that would be tu"„d be in England, it would be much more so in Ireland; s t " te gel would venture to say that nine out of ten of thef t ' s ,' the that had taken place in that country had arisen tr e : s ete" ejectments that had been brought against poor teed to Considering that a repeal of the Corn-laws would pro; the injury of the poorer classes, he was 'l be,: pared to accede to it. In his opinion those ' - re sn , beneficial interests in land in Ireland would be g ia eli injured by the total repeal of the existing C 01.% pr e to many would be utter ruin, and h e f or on e Wag n 0 if r pared to inflict that ruin. As regarded the labourers/ORO could get employment in other cases he might be e h , 0 1 about the measure, but that could not practicallY b l ed! effect of its working. He was not f o r taking t he w fo r ; English labourer ftom the w o r k th a t h e had hithe . lowed and sending him into lanes and manufactori es ' t hr effect of the repeal of the Corn-laws would be t° de al; large village districts into pasture, and that would be e peP, mental to the labourer. He was sa ti s fi e d that th e ' w o' of the Corn-laws would throw hundreds of thon g l e ptiP, l : labourers ont of e mpl o y men t. Th en came the grey; how far it would be be ne fi c i a l t o th e m a nufaett l i c e would certainly have the effect of reducing the P : r b tb wages, and thereby enabling them to compete er` i , t , p 0,5 foreign manufacturer. He would admit also that t "0 1 " sons from whom the supply of corn was obtained 01 0 become customers; but then th e h ome ma rket Ir O lost to a great extent. He d ou bt e d w h et h er the ads' afitslri l ieu to the manufactures tt e repea l o f t h e C or n-10 0 , e t if f be so great as it wa s i mag i ne d. With respect to °lite nufacturers' workm en , it was c l ear f rom t h e stateinetheliP the Hon. Member that t would be no advantage t° ,,, O h l) ; Looking to the ad van t ages an d di sa d van tages' - 0 e t"e fessed that he thought the balance was in favour se er principle of maintaining protection. He was at 0 110' time willing to admit tit would be proper to C oo t b re whether some alteration or modification should sosebt made in the law so as to prevent the fluctuations th e a selg 4 continually taking place.—( Hear, hear.) H e w I' l l . ; that the question ought to be fairly considered. ~a t ee' r , self he was prepared to come to the conclusion t " „ r te P s e e nial corn should be permitted to come into the P - s i n fectly free. He would give a bounty upon anY g, r here d i came from the Colonies in preference to any e ' et est,"ll He thought there ought to be a fixed instead of a n u " Of " duty. He thought consistently with the intereotholl; parties that a fixed duty ought not to be less ~hap atiellee Any thing less than that, in his opinion, would n e , to ° l b any good purpose. He was as anxious as any ° I La the price of corn low, but that must be effect be a consideration of safety to all parties.—(H es "pre tc o, He held this to be a question of protection, or fi n e nt ieln A s t tion. It was a motion brought forward by e,`" e ce og,, e , e rt who said he would take nothing but repeal--W° 0 3 , 1 ; 1 1 what he (Mr. O'Brien) called a protecting duty 11"; fe hear.) He would not consent to anything less t" - cos e ," o t of 12s. He did not think any Member of the did A '' b e ment would consent to so small a duty; and b i e hon l 'er wish his vote to be misconstrued, and that h°" h e u ° supposed not to be an advocate for the repeal 01 • f o r laws.—( Hear, hear.) obe r, op Sir J. T YRRE LL th oug ht th e Hon. M„cr 1 rep' Wolverhampton had sho wn hi s di scre ti o n in r t sh e s e when the subject first came before the House, tin,j e s e r e. be heard by counsel and witn esses a t th e bar. It eo r e P te' ing the deepest censure on H on . M e mbers, Ol e / sented those districts, th at t h ey h a d no t s lylw r tali ce. her to „or,. selves able to discuss a matter of so much hie Mcn? d es o o of wishest e G Government, e t r l n i e m a e g n r t i , o (Hear, hear.) He lamented that there was fee ll • h tu o ral re interests. It w a s „ A ble r to cumstance that we were indebted for the rnie e '4 o olhe'oo' sition of a fixed duty, by the Noble Lord the the a bf Stroud, who must be considered as representinepoteore resented either th e this co' vernment, and that proposition had only been suPsee betted one solitary petition when the proposition first es ro se the House, aud four since. The I who reP i° ,a gent emen og o , as e the manufacturing interests had a great ach;_a n , t , rn• " D id, ing the President of the Board of Trade wit e e D e , oec u r ieeo time ago he made a speech on the subject, ev i ,u ad r res e ,' ft five hours and a half, but since that time b e , l e ; i e ugb' s i e or the most solemn silence in the House.- - 'r 1401 1 ' was curious that after four nights' debate tue,... ish Mo7 ect , ber who just sat down was only the second Ji be suV o ip who hadexpressed ts t Du b° his sentiments for co o l but seeing the Hon. and Learned Memberd ebate ° vicar' / his place, he hoped he would not allow the a r o cr • c 'f s f to a close without stating his °lemon. o The only argument which he had heard in f av t hc pri e e' derate fixed duty was that it would equ alis% effect °fthan corn, but he contended that it would have thec_etaiettebes sibling capitalists to speculate with greater r of balosto before. He also hoped that the Cbancello I 13 • e ts sslen v quer would favour the House with his s entut? e n , st bee _ t he the amount of the proposed fixed duty, as t c o on hers of the Government had been complete l i e t ell e subject.—(Hear.) t i e 1 4 '" b of & II 11 r. W, WOOD would rot a:ldrs:s - e ee the oP length, but there were some statements in were general orders that were addressed to more than one Union. The order in question had been addressed to up wards of fifty Unions, and therefore it was very generally considered to be a general order, and therefore not Legal unless it had been submitted to the Secretary of State forty days before its being issued. Such being the state of the case, such a. strong feeling existing in the neighbourhood of the metropolis, he had thought it his duty to call the atten tion of the Government to it, especially the attention of the law officers of the Crown,,so that the question might be set at rest. Lord JOHN RUSSELL—The Commissioners could send the order first to one Union, and then to another, but that would not make it a general order. EDUCATION. Lord STANLE Y—A few weeks ago the Noble Lord stated that the Government had appointed a Commission constituting several high Officers of the Crown to form a Board of Education. He wished to ask whether the Go vernment intended before the Easter recess to lay before the house any statement as to the extent of power and authority which the Commissioners were to have, and also with regard to the principle upon which the Board was to be guided in the distribution of any money to be granted by that House. Lord JOHN RUSSELL said that documents should be laid on the table stating the names of the persons and the nature of the duties they were to perform immediately after Easter, and a considerable time beforo any vote of moneyNl ould be required on the subject. _ _ Lord STANLEY understood that a sum of 10,0001 had been voted in 1835 for the erection of model-schools in England; he wished to know if there was any account of the disposal of that money ? Mr. BARING was sorry the Noble Lord had not given him notice of the question, and he would have been kble to have given him an answer. answer to a question from Lord ASIILEY, Lord J. RUSSELL stated that he proposed to take the Army Estimates on Friday next, and also the Army and Navy Estimates the Monday following. Therefore, no ono of these Bills, to which the Noble Lord alluded, would be brought fnrward before the Easter holidays ; with :respect to the Factory Bill, he proposed to take it on Friday, the 12th of April, after Easter, and the Ecclesiastical Duties and Re venues Bill, on Monday, the 15th of April. CANADA. Sir R. PE EL wished to impress upon the attention of her Majesty's Government the necessity of legislating with respect to Canada during the present Session. ARMY'ESTINIATES. Sir HENRY HARDINGE said that he understood, on Friday evening last, that it was arranged that Honourable Members should be at liberty to discuss the qu , stion of the force upon the bringing up of the Report. Now he doubted very much whether that could be done if it was brought up to-morrow. Lori JOHN RUSSELL said there could he no ob jection to tho discussion to-morrow if there was time sufficient. Lord [JO WICK said that it was his intention, with the permission of the House in Committee, to take the vote for the men and part of their expenses, and when he proposed taking the other part of the expenses, that then the general discussion should take place. Sir H. HARDINGE—On Friday? Lord HO WICK--Yes, on Friday, if it was found con venient. Sir H. II ARDING E could not object to that arrange ment. He wished, however, to ask the Noble Lord a question relative to the amount of the force. He wished to know whether the amount of force about to be voted was the entire and whole of the amount of force to be proposed for the year, taking into view the Indian and North American Provinces of this country. He did not ask whether there was to be a supplementary vote brought before the House, but whether, according to the information now before the Go vernment, it was considered to be a sufficient vote for the pre sent year? Lord J. RUSSELL said it would be impossible to an swer that question now. All that could at present be said was, that the number of men proposed to be voted was the number considered necessary at the time when the esti mates were framed. Sir FL HARD 1N G E said it certainly was important to know whether the amount to be proposed this evening was the amount whch the Government now consldered sufficient.-_( Hear. ) Lord HO WICK said the answer to that question would involve the statement as to the difference between the present system and that of former years, which he would be prepared to make on Friday. He should now only propose to take a vote for 3,000,0001. the remainder of the estimate, 350,0001., he would post pone till Friday, when there would be ample opportunity for any observations on the subject. IRISH RAILWAYS. In answer, to a question from Mr. LUCAS, Mr. F. FRENCH said he could not consent to post. pone his motion respecting Irish Railways till after Easter, CONTROVERTED ELECTIONS. Mr. C. BULLER begged to ask the Right Honourable Baronet, the Member for Tamworth, what course be in tended to pursue with respect to his Bill r,..gardiug the trial of controverted elections, whether there was any hope of its coming on before Easter, and whether it would come on upon a Wednesday ? Sir R. PEEL said the Noble Lord (J. Russell) had held out hopes that after Easter a day might specially be set apart for the Bill. He hoped it would not be a Wednesday—(Hear, hear)— for the subject was of such great importance, that it was desirable that the sense of the House should be fairly taken upon it.—( Hear, hear.) He would not press the Noble Lord to let it come on before Easter ; but shortly after be trusted it might ; because the second reading of the Bill having (as we understood) been carried, and an alteration of the present systeM therefore determined upon, it was highly desirable that the nature of that alteration should be as speedily as possible fixed.—( Hear, hear.) EXPENSES IN CANADA. Sir H. HARD INGE wished to know whether any ac... count of the expenditure of the half million, voted last year on account of the extraordinary expenses in America, would be given, and what would be the estimated sum taken this year for the expences in Canada? Lord HOWICK said he was enable to answer the question, but he believed an account would be presented. As to the estimates for the present year that was a ques tion to which he should have to advert on another occasion. The honour of it was greater than any other country in t he world, and the national pride of -every Englishman velis , thank God, not yet gone. If 20 more line-of-bat tle ships were fitted out, he should be content. Looking to the whole circumstances of the navy of the country, he felt it t o be big duty to move that it should be an instruction to the Co m: mittec to re-consider the vote of 3-1,160 seamen an marines, and whether it would not be advantageous, in t he present state of the country, considering its foreign rela tions, to make a considerable increase. The SPEAKER—Who seconds the motion? Mr. T. ATT WOOD—I suppose some honest manwill. —( Laughter. ) Sir J. TYRRELL seconded the motion. The CHANCELLOR of the _EXCHEQUER con sidered that it was contrary to the practice of Parliament for any Honourable Member to propose an increase aeo n the number proposed by Government. Mr. HUME considered it was the duty of the Govern ment to propose an increase, if it was thought necessary, and not an Hoe. Member. Mr. ATTWOOD said that he did not propose a rota for more money. All that he suggested was that there should be more men.— (Hear.) Sir R. PEEL said if the Hon. Member had p ro p osed that the subject should be taken into consideration, he would have adopted a course that could have been pursued bf the House, but having moved an increase of men 11 thought the House, consistent with its usual course, could not entertain it. The SPEAKER having read the instruction Of t he Hun. Member, Sir R. PEEL said that he considered the present que e " tion one of great importance, and as well worthy the atten tion of the House. His (Sir R. Peel's) point was tht g i that it was necessary to keep strictly to the prineiP le ° not increasing the- estimates proposed by the Crow n.-- (Hear, hear.) of Mr. T. ATTWOOD said if he could get the sens n the House on this most important question on any oth er occasion, he would not press his motion now.—(Cheereld Mr. PLUM PTRE said if the Hon. Member Iva frame it as an address to the Crown he would second Mr. T. ATTWOOD said he would now change it int ° an address to the Crown if the House would allow hint•--. (Laughter, and cries of " Oh, oh.) The Hon. Member ultimately withdrew his motio n. Lord HO W ICK (the House having resolved itself to a Committee of Supply) then proposed a vote for t" Land Forces (on account) of 89,000 men (we believe) . .„ Mr. HUM E said if it was understood that an opportuallid wou'd be afforded for considering the subject, he tenu not object to the vote.—Agreed to. NAVY . Mr. C. WOOD proposed to take E-STIMATES 700,000/. on aec° lll/t of the Mr. N H l UME s avy Hafaid pa th y, Scc. cb ere was no vote to which he had stibt, an objection as to that for the half-pay and the dead-w ei g e ot The vote, hoe ever would pass under the same engag ell ' as the previous one.—( Hear). Sir J. G El AiNl thought that as the whole vote I but 720.000/ 700,0001. was a large instalment. —( 11 11 Mr. WOOD consented to taCe 500,000 L, which li la agrec.d to; as was also 500,000/. for pensions, I.io The,ooo/ for other allowances. House hat ing resumed, and the Order of the D i/ hiavng been read for the adjourned debate on the SUPPLY-COM MITTEN. EVENING EDITION.