The Sun. — London, England, 1839-07-31 00:00:00

L 4 c_ - 72- j . ' •• t )4- A• . 1 ..,. -... '•-,-..,0-, 444116 F' : ii .., t . , - ' • -..,- , •.)- , ' l -', •.' ' , • ~......._ ...,..- 4. , . _ : ~' y~ EVENING 'EDITION. pass that measure and it would have the effect of ( bringing back the affections of the people. He felt assured that no man could prevent him from succeding to the extent that the people would know that there were some—at all events, there was one—in that House, who duly prized that most invaluable right which was inherent in them.—(Hear s hear.) The people did not meet now except in circumstances ad agitation—they did not meet except with feelings so inflamed that they were likely to be led to mischievous acts. The best disposed of the people were not as sembled. Now if meetings could be established on the footing which he proposed, these disorderly proceedings would soon be terminated. The tine was now come when the upper orders could not stand aloof, and if they meant to live in safety, they must mix with the people and show themselves as their fellow-men and brethren. If these meetings should be held and the ministers of religion would attend in order to sooth their passions, they would render petitioning one of the most glorious instruments in the hands of pro vidence to raise the country to a pitch of pros perity which it never yet had attained. The second object which he had in view, would be one of a not less important nature, and not less difficult. It was a circumstance which certainly had struck him as remarkable, that on the very night when he was called on by the Speaker to give notice of his motion, Moaday, 15th 1 July, th e fl ames were r i s i ng i n the Bull Ring at Bir mingham, proving that the passions of the people if not controlled would produce fearful results. A feel ing was prevalent among the people that they were not called upon to obey laws in the making of which they had no share.—(Hear.) No sentiment could be more dangerous, or more deeply to be reprobated. But this showed what was rankling in the minds of the lower classes, who, having just knowledge enough t o see the narro w sp h ere in wich they were placed, and having thus their discontent stimulated, were natu rally irritated, and their dissatisfaction had now arisen to an alarming height. There were some in that House, who would vote for Universal Suffrage, and many who voted for Household Suffrage—which in reality meant Universal Suffrage. Now, he obje c t e d to t hi s, because he beli eve d it altogether unconstitutional. One of the great principles of the Constitution, but unhap pily not in modern times sufficiently regarded, was, that there existed a broad line of difference between direct and indirect taxation ; that there was a vast difference between telling a man that he must, if he drink beer ox tea pay a little more for it than if it were not taxed, and the sending a tax-gatherer to collect, in money, a certain portion of the annual profits of his lands or houses, and that 1 it was to the latter only the principle of representation co -extensive with taxation applied. To establish Uni versal Suffrage would be in fact to leave property with out protection. Indeed, the Hon. Member for Old ham, had now on the notice paper a motion as coupled with Universal Suffrage, which would have the effect of a property tax. Under these circumstances, looking on the one hand to the ruinous consequences that must result from the in troduction of measures such as that to which he had alluded, and on the other to the practicability of safely giving a certain degree of influence to the masses of the people who were at present not qualified by the posses sion of property for the exercise of the franchise, he wished to consider whether it was not possible . safely to devise a plan for this purpose. He knew he should be met by the argument of the difficulty of showing at what point he would stop. His proposal was, that a meeting of the unrepresented inhabitants of every pa rish in England should be held in a quiet and orderly manner, which meeting should elect foremen, whose power would endure for a year, and the person so elected annually should have the right of voting at every elec tion for Members of Parliament which should take during the year in the county. He believed by this plan he should be adding 15,000 persons to the con stituency, and this he considered no trifling boon to the unrepresented portion of the community, and as it was natural to suppose that the men so elected would be among the most intelligent, energetic, and active of thei r class, h e cons id ere d h e s h ou ld b giving them great in fluence by giving them this right of voting in the election of Members of Parliament ; and if eventually the sys tem should be established in Ireland and Scotland, the addition to the constituency would be double the amount of what he had stated, and as these men would most likely, having the same interests, be inclined to act together, no Member of Parliament but would be inclined to treat their representations with respect, and thus they would form a medium of communication and influence with Members of Parliament. He bad no doubt that many would think that Universal Suffrage, as compared with the plan he proposed to adopt, would be considered a prudent and cautious measure. He thought that there was much in the working of the Poor-laws that might be alleviated. They should depart from the system of treating the labouring classes as mere machines ; if they assembled them together for the purpose of discussing their rights, they wou ld d o more for them than all th e relief that was given through the medium of workhouses. There was another subject to which he would just advert, which was with respect to the uncultivated lands in the Colonies ; if those were given to the poor great good might be effected, He might be told that what he pro posed would change the face of society in this country, but to those who said so he would say that the great landlords of England were not any one of them en titled to hold their land except in connection with certain duties which they owed to their fellow-men. It was not for him to trace through history what those duties were, but he felt bound to say, that the system that had been going on for the last two centuries had led to absenteeism, which had had the worst effects. He had now nearly concluded what he had to say ; he had carefully abstained from making use of language that was calculated to do mischief.—( Hear, hear.) England was the greatest nation in the world ; but were the lower classes in it in as good a condition as other countries ? Certainly not ; the lower classes in India we* far better off. He believed there was in this country a great uode.veloped power of improving its condition. It had been said that poverty was easier remedied in the United States, because those States were surrounded by a boundless wilderness, where the poor might always find land. But there was as much waste land in this country as in the United States. Besides, we had Colonies possessing admirable climates and fertile soil. All these were points which the people might well consider. With views such as those he had thus stated, he had submitted his present propo sition. He was sensible that having began late in life his Parliamentary duties he was very incompetent, in many respects, for their discharge. He certainly did not recommend his suggestion as likely to prove the fortunate panacea for all our social ills. He had brought it forward, believing it would be beneficial in its results but with so little of obstinate or predeter mined prepossession on its behalf, that it now occurred to him at the elose of his speech, that be had not asked any one to second his motion.—(A laugh.) But he could not conceive that a proposition so intimately connected with the interests of the people would not want a seconder. Mr. HODGES seconded the motion, which having been put, Mr. HUME said no motion should be made for securing to the working classes of this country a due in fluence in the election of Members of Parliament, with out having his support. The present proposition ap po.:ared to have that end is view, therefore he should support it. He might state that in Scotland, in all the boroughs, it had been the regulation to have annual meetings of all the inhabitants, to consult upon the com mon good—the original design having evidently been that contemplated by the Hon. Member, to give every individual some interest in the management of affairs within his particular locality. Though the Hon. Mem ber had stated some things in which he (Mr. Hume) did not concur, still to a proposition calculated to give the people greater influence in the election of Members of Parliament, he was anxious to afford his support. The Hon. Member had not, however, stated in what way he meant that his object should be carried into effect, though, doubtless, he would be prepared to do so, having paid considerable attention to the condition of the working classes in this and other countries. The result of the Hon. Gentleman's experience was, he (Mr. Hume) feared, too much against our working fellow-countrymen, for both in America and India— degraded India—the lower classes were better off than in England. Yet this country possessed every requisite for rendering lif e agreea bl e an d h a ppy. To aid, if possible, in discovering the causes of this difference, he (Mr. Hume) should undoubtedly support the motion for leave to bring in the Bill ; and he believed that any man who brought in a mobsure tending to make the population of this country more satisfied with their situation than they now were, would confer a benefit on his country, The SPEAKER—WiII the Hon. Member divide ? Sir C. GREY—Why, Sir, there does not seem to be any opposition.—(Laughter.) I certainly wish the question to be put. The question was accordingly put, and about two or three voices were heard both for the " Ayes " and the " Noes." Tke SPEAKER declared that the " Noes" had it. Sir C. GREY said he would not put the House to the trouble of dividing —(Hear, hear.) TRIAL OF ELECTIONS BILL. A message from the Lords announced that their Lordships had agreed to the T r i a l o f Controverted Elections Bill without any amendments. CHURCH-RATES. Mr. T. DUNCOMBE said he was about to bring before the House a case of great injustice and oppression. It was the case of a person who had been long confined for the non-payment of Church-rates, in Chelmsford Gaol. The real ground of: that imprisonment was evidently that he was a Dissenter from the Established Church, and an active partisan of tire Liberal cause in the county of Essex. Thou he was a poor man, he (Mr. Duncombe) hoped tlittt the House would not entertain the idea that therefore religious scruples and conscientious faith could not influence him, as they might the greatest and most distinguished. And provided he should make out a case of hardship and ill treatment on account of reli piagia,OD44l,oll3, he trusted that the House would take measures for preventing the recurrence of such cases. at least after next Session. This case had first been brought fdrward on a petition which had been pre sented by the Hon. Member for Leeds (Mr. Ba;nes), whd was not now in his Place, from John Thorogood, who cortiplained that he bad been confined in Chelmsford Gaol for the non-payment of ss. 6d. Church-rates. A. subsequent petition-had been presented by himse' f (Mr. Duncombe), complaining that the former petition bad not been attended to. and that lad, the petitioner, had been treated, if possible, with increased rigour. He (Mr. buncombe) had asked the Under Secretary of State for the Home Department if the Government were aware of the manner in which this individual had been treated, complaining, as he (lid, that he had been treated as a felon ; that he had been confined for six months, eighteen hours of the twenty-four, in solitary imprisonment ; that he bad been allowed to see his friends only as felons were, and that he had been re fused permission to see his wife on Sundays. Now the Visiting Magistrates of the county of Essex had laid a statement before the House in their vindication, wherein they admitted the cause of this individual's deten tion to have been the non-payment only of five shil lings for Church-rates. They said, however, that he had not been treated as a felon ; they stated that he had not been confined in the felon's prison. He (Mr. Duncombe) had inquired and found that although this individual was not at present confined in the same prison as the male felons, he was confined in the same prison with the female felons, and in the prison in which the male felons had till recently been placed. As to John Thorogood's being treated as a felon, that could, of course, apply only to certain particulars. But this he stated, that he was in fact worse situated than a felon in this respect, that a felon's confinement was limited, and definite ; whereas his, (Thorogood's) imprisonment was unlimite and indefinite. It would only be termi nated by death, unless the House interposed to put an end to it. The Visiting Magistrates further stated, that this person had much better lodging than felons, that there were nine good rooms on the debtors' side of the prison, of which he might have his choice. Yes, but on what terms ? Not without paying more to the Go vernor than his circumstances would permit. They further stated that he could work at his trade as a shoemaker. True, but only under certain regulations, and having the sale of his goods effected by the Governor, at very disadvantageous terms compared with what he might obtain himself. In answer to the charge that he was only per m itt e d t o see hi s f r i en d s i n t h same hours as felons, the Visiting Magistrates lightly replied, that, " to debtors, felons, and John Thorogood, surely the twenty-four hours were alike." It did not require the sagacity of the Essex Magistrates to inform the House that to all persons the twenty-four hours were alike ; that was not the complaint of John Thorogood. His complaint was, that, by harsh regulations, the twenty four hours were as irksome as twenty-four days. The regulations of the Warwick gaol, which had been re cently referred to, were merciful, in comparison with those of the Chelmsford. At Warwick prisoners might see their friends any time between eight and half-past nine in summer, and eight and nine in winter. Then, as to Thorogood's not being allowed to see his wife on Sundays, the Magistrates themselves admitted that out of about thirty Sundays during which he had been confined, he had been allowed the company of his wife only four Sundays. Now he (Mr. Duncombe) did submit to the House whether such inflictions as these were consonant with the spirit of Christianity? —(Cries of " Hear, hear.") Why not have adopted against Thorogood some more effective and more sum mary proceeding ? Why imprison him for life ? If it should be suggested that the man only wished to ac quire notoriety as a kind of parochial martyr, he (Mr. Duncombe) would say nothing was further from the fact. He held in his hand a letter from this individual to a friend, written before it was known that the case would be brought under the notice of that House ; written, evidently, in real sincerity of feeling, and show ing that he was a man of strong religious principles. While the law as to Church-rates was neglected to be enforced in large and populous towns in deference to public opinion, there was something savouring of cow ardice in thus singling out individuals in humble life, for oppression and punishment. The House might not at once be prepared to release this individual, but they could at once express their opinion respecting the pro ceedings—proceedings which reflected no credit on the Essex Magistrates, nor on the Government who allowed the question of Church-rates to remain so long in a most unsatisfactory position. Three years ago, the subject having been brought fdrward by the Chancellor of the Exchequer, it was subsequently referred to a Committee, who had eat a short time in 1837, and the whole of 1838. The instruction to that Committee having been, to ascertain what would be the possible and probable amount of any increased value that might be obtained by an improved manage ment of Church Lands. The appointment of the Com mittee was considered by many at the time as only a decent way of shelving the question. And when they reported, they left unsettled the very point they were directed to decide, for they stated that they could not positively calculate the amount of improved value. So that after all the question remained just where it was. God only knew where it would stand next Session. At all events, he hoped the House would now pledge itself to consider the subject practically, at the earliest possible period, and express an opinion upon the pre sent transaction, which might shame these Essex autho rities and the persecution they allowed—a persecution alike cruel to the individual concerned, and discredit able to the Established Church.—( Hear, bear.) He begged to move, " That whereas it appears by certain papers laid before this House, that John Thorogood, a Protestant Dissenter, has been confined in her Ma jesty's county gaol of Essex, since the 16th of January last, for neglecting to appear in the Consistorial Court of the Bishop of London, for the non-payment of ss. 6d. being the amount of Church-rate assessed upon him for the parish of Chelmsford ; and whereas, during this period, the said John Thorogood has been treated with uncalled-for severity, it is the opinion of this House, that the imprisonment of the said Jobn Thorogood is not only cruel and unjust, but reflects great discredit upon those at whose instigation these proceedings were instituted, and under whose sanction they are so perti naciously and vindictively continued ; and while this House laments that it has not the power of affording immediate relief to the said John Thorogood, yet it is of opinion that it will be the duty of the Legislature at the earliest possible period of the next Session of Par liament, to make such alterations in the existing laws for levying Church -rates, as shall prevent the recur rence of a like violence being ever again inflicted upon the religious scruples of that portion of her Majesty's subjects who conscientiously dissent from the rites or doctrines of the Established Church." On the SPEAKER'S asking who seconded the motion, both Mr. EASTIIOPE and Mr. HAWES intimated their assent. The question having been put from the Chair, Lord JOHN RUSSELL said he had only a few observations to make upon this subject. He would not enter, as the Hon. Member for Finsbury had entered, into the general question of Church-rates. It appeared that the Hon. Member had inconveniently mixed up two questions, both in his resolution and his speech— two questions which were wholly distinct. Whether or not John Thorogood had been treated with undue and improper severity in the gaol of Chelmsford, was one distinct question. Supposing, for the sake of the argument, that this person had been treated with un due severity—the Hon. Member went on to argue that the system of Church-rates being cruel and unjust, ought to be changed. But it did not by any means follow, that because John Thorogood had been treated with undue severity, that therefore the Church-rate system was bad.—(Hear, hear, hear.) A man taken up for felony, or for any offence, under the best of laws, —might be treated with improper severity while 'con fined in gaol—but what- g round would that be for abolishing the laws against house-breaking or forgery ? The Hon. Member, therefore, had mingled two ques- tions wholly unconnected, and in his argument had constantly confounded them. One of the complaints was that John Thorogood was treated as a felon, to which it was answered by the Magistrates that he was not, for that he was kept in a room 15 feet by 16, 19 feet high, and that he received many indulgences not usually allowed to prisoners. It was said that his imprisonment was indefinite and unlimited—unlike that of the felons. It was the law of England that any person not appearing to answer a citation before the Ecclesiasti cal Judge (Dr. Luslaington), must be imprisoned without any definite term of confinement being fixed ; that state of the law might or might not be bad, but it did not follow that a man was ill-treated, because he was under that law confined for an indefinite period, or that he had any right to complain either of gaoler or Justices, who, if they received a man sentenced to con finement by the law of England, and treated him in the best way under the regulations, could not be blamed be cause the law affixed no exact date for the termination of the imprisonment. It could scarcely be considered, again, any very severe hardship that a person could only see his friends from ten to four every day.---( Hear.) There was one point which had not been adverted to in the petition printed for the use of Members—it had been said that no person was permitted to visit pri soners without an order from the Magistrates, and that his wife had only received four such orders during the whole . period of his imprisonment. The Magistrates stated that the wife having obtained this permission, had joined her husband, and that he had showed himself at the window ; a crowd had collected, and he had ad dressed them on the hardship of the state of the law by which he had been incarcerated. The Visiting Jus tices being of opinion that this ought not to be allowed in a gaol, had refused to allow him any longer the in dulgence which they had previously allowed him. He was of opinion, looking at the whole case, that the Jus tices had not imposed upon him any measure of seve rity greater than was required for his safe custody. With regard to questions of the law, he must say, that le, for one, did not wi s h t h e present law on that sub j ect to continue. He wished some satisfactory plan could be devised, whereby the funds necessary for the re quisite repairs of the Churches could be obtained in a TIIE SUN, L less objectionable, and leas onerous wanner than at present. A plan had been proposed which had not re ceived from the House the support necessary for the carrying it into effect. He must at the same time state that, however anxious he might be on this subject, he did not wish to see any plan for abolishing Church-rates without an equivalent, as he did not think it would be fair to say that the Church should depend for its re pairs entirely on voluntary contributions, but he did not think it tieteSsafy to enter into.the consideration of that question at present. The Hon. Gentleman had ' said it did not appear that this individual had at all wished to exhibit himself as a martyr ; he must differ from the Hon. Gentleman, as he thought that a person could not be considefecl hi any other light, who would, most conscientiously, no doubt, submit to go to prison rather than pay .ss. for a rate, although he might con sider it a most unjustifiable infliction. The Noble Lord, we believe, concluded by moving the previous question by way of amendment. Mr. HARVEY was not surprised that the Noble Lord had characterised the subject in the manner he had done. This was a great subject, although it was about the apparently insignificant amount of five shillings. He knew the difficulty that Members of the Legislature had in suppressing their derision when they heard that a man should suffer him self to be imprisoned for the amount of 55., which, whether important or not in a pecuniary point of view, was of the utmost importance on the score of principle. He agreed with the Noble Lord in the dissection he had made of the subject between the payment of ' Church-rates by a person dissenting from the Esta blished Church and persons placing themselves in con tempt by not appearing to a legal process, because he fully admitted the necessity that existed of compelling every person to yield instant obedience to the mandates of the law. But why did they not have recourse to the same means in this description of contempt of enforcing obedience to the mandates that they did when property was concerned ? If an answer were withheld to a pro ' cess issued from the Court of Chancery, a man was not allowed to remain in contempt by submitting to perpe tual incarceration ; he was not allowed in this way to deprive a plaintiff of his property ; but if he refused to return an answer, an answer was entered pro confesso, and he was not permitted to remain in contempt. The reason of this was obvious, because the matter in contempt related to property ; but when it was a question of conscience instead of property the cases were perfectly different. If a person in con tempt in Chancery was compelled to put in an answer, why, he would ask, was not the same course pursued in matters of ecclesiastical demand—why was not his an swer also taken pro confess() I' Because this course would be inconvenient to those interested—because pro ceedings of this nature were undertaken against this man because he bad rendered himself disagreeable— therefore it was that this legal persecution was applied to him, and it was so applied to him because he had thought and acted for himself. He believed he was speaking in the presence of many Hon. Gentlemen from Essex, who knew well that in all cases of dispute concerning tithes, or rates, or ecclesiastical dues, where the matter in question did not amount to 405., the parties might be summoned before a Magistrate, who might issue a war rant against his chattels for the amount in the same way as for rent, or for any other debt. Why was this not done in the present case? He would tell the House the reason. Because John Thorogood was an inconvenient man in the town of Chelmsford—his opin ions in religion,and his conduct in politics were obnoxious. It was well known that the town of Chelmsford was a great citadel of Conservatism, and disrelished all attacks on their opinions, especially in all matters where religion was concerned. Therefore it was that they had deter mined in every possible manner to harrass this man, and had issued a process for the recovery of ss. 9d., the expenses attending which amounted to 61. He would wish to know from the Noble Lord his opinion as to the propriety of this method of proceeding. Was it right —was it just—that because a man objects to a demand of ss. 9d., which he in his conscience believes to be unjust, that therefore he should be saddled with an expence of 6/. ? What would be said if a Member of that House had a demand made upon him for 100/. —and, speaking of Members of that House, they must talk of hundreds and thousands of pounds instead of shillings and pence—what would be said if that Member were to reply, It is no such thing, you have no right to make this demand, I owe you 901., which I will pay you, and no more. I shall not pay the other 10/. The person demanding the sum refuses the 901., and the first process that is issued is attended with an expence of 6001. torecover this 101. Why the whole House would be up in arms—all party differences would be sunk in order to apply a remedy to the evil, or at least to institute a rigid examination into the merits of the case. Yet here was the case of a poor man, a shoemaker, who has a demand made upon him of ss. 9d., equal in amount to half a week's salary—he liked to use that word salary in addressing the House—he says, You have no right to make this demand—l am a Protestant Dissenter—l never go into your Church—l s h a ll no t pay it —my conscience will not permit me so to do. Or he may say It is not a legal demand—there is not so much due—l paid you one half year's rate only six months ago—there is now only due ss.—the party demanding refuse to enter into discussion on the subject ; but say, We will have all or none, will you pay us? Yes, or no ? The man answers No! but subsequently he advises with a friend, who says, There can be no doubt that it is a direct robbery but rather than be subjected to the expense and inconvenience of defending your rights, I should advise you to submit to the demand. The man takes this advice, determines to submit to what he considers a robbery, and offers payment—but he is told ss. 6d. won't do now—you have let the thing go too far, you must pay 6/. additional for the privelege you have enjoyed of being subjected to the Eccle siastical jurisdiction. He had presented a peti tion to the House that day from two of his constituents who had been subject to the process of these Ecclesiastical Courts. Measures were brought forward in that House for augmenting the salaries of the Judges, which were sure to pass ; but when inquiry was asked for into the practices of these Courts, or into a subject connected with them, the House was told that the subject was too large to enter on. Was the House aware of what these Ecclesiastical Courts were ? Was the House aware of the ecclesiastical tyranny existing in this country ? The subject had been denounced by an Hon. and Learned Member in most eloquent terms, in terms of such a nature as almost to lead one to doubt the sincerity ; yet still no inquiry followed ; and to morrow evening there would be before the House a Bill for increasing the salary of an Hon. and Learned Mem ber, who already received a splendid salary as one of the Judges of those Courts. Was the House aware that there were seven distinct Ecclesiastical Courts ? He would quote what Blackstone—for on these subjects ha liked to quote Conservative authority—he would state what Blackstone said on this subject. He described these Courts as the remnants of Papal tyranny which even the Reformation had left. There were seven of these Courts, into any of which an unfortunate indivi dual might be dragged. He stated this in the pre sence of the Honourable Member for Oxford, who had all the weight of the Colleges on his back, and whose attention he wished to draw to this subject. There was first the Archdeacon's Court, the authority of which was confined to the locality of the Archdeaconry in which it was situated—from that they might be.introduced into the Consistory Court, as was exemplified in the petition which he had that day pre sented, in which Mr. Apsley Pellatt had stated that, having received a summons to appear in the Consistory Court, because, as the summons assumed, he was de sirous of it, that he might escape expense, have prompt justice and the benefit of the advice of Doctors learned in the laws, in reply to this, Mr. Apsley Pellatt had stated that he would rather the case should go before a Magistrate or into the Archdeacon's Court ; so that these gentlemen, who were actuated by a most re ligious desire for truth, began by stating a glaring false hood out of their regard to religion. Mr. Apsley Pellatt went before Sir Herbert Jenner, and stated that lie was not desirous of coming before the Consistorial Court at all, and as for having the advantage of the advice of a Learned Doctor he should almost con sider it an insult if he were to offer to engage him, for all the Doctors had sworn to uphold the Established Church, and how could he think of offering him a brief, with a heavy fee, to argue in his favour against the payment of a rate for the support of the Established Church? The complaint against the Doctors was a heavy one, although the payment might be light. He had appeared and had pleaded his own cause, and thus, as far as he was concerned, saved the expense of any Learned Doctor for himself, although the costs he had had to pay amounted to between 201. and 301. for the Learned Doctor employed on the other s id e . B ut this was only a preliminary judgment. If you were displeased with the Consistorial Court, by an addi tional payment you could obtain an introduction into the Court of Arches. Now, what was the Arches' Court? Formerly the Archbishop of Canterbury used to sit in judgment in the Church of St. Mary-le-Bow, and as there was no great difference between a Bow and an Arch, this was the origin of the Court of Arches. But thi s was not all. If dissatisfied with your position in the Court of Arches, you could, by a further payment of forty or fifty pounds, obtain an in troduction into the Court of Peculiars, which was an assembly of grave men, rendered signally significant by all the paraphernalia of wigs and other helps to wisdom. —(A laugh.) You might then pass into the Prero gative Court—(A laugh)—and if still dissatisfied, thank God that you lived in a land of liberty and of law, and that you might still find refuge in the Court of Dele gates.—(Loud laughter.) These were blessings bes towed upon us by the Church of Rome, at the time she was anxious to bring all things into subjection to the Papal authority ; and if you were defeated in all these six Courts, the tender mercies of the law had provided relief by instituting the Court of Review.—(Laughter.) He knew that in a question of this sort many of the Members would say the man was a fool not to pay such a paltry sum as ss. ; but the amount was not the question. It was a question of principle, not of money ; and there ought to be some method of deciding these questions in a prompt, cheap, and efficacious manner. INDON, WEDNESDAY`, He was not vindicating the conduct of John Thorogood' in refusing obedience to a process issued by a court of law, because he was for upholding the law—but what he did complain of was, that the same rule was not ob served in this case as when property was concerned. But, in the consideration of the Legislature, property was evely thing, and personal liberty was of no value. — (Cheers.) It might be said that it would be no use bringing forward this case of John 'rhorogood ; but it would be of use, because it was only by bringing for ward cases of this nature that the attention of the House and the Government could be aroused to this subject. Let them look at the cases of Lovett and Collins. How many thousands were then suffering the same hardships in prisons, to which these men had been subjected, whose complaints never had, nor never could reach that House! It was only when, in political cases, that—be would not say the best feelings of our natures were excited—that individual cases of misery had a chance of finding a hearing in that House. They in that House were altogether too restricted in their views ; they lived in u world of their own in St. Stephen's, more intent upon the gratification of their own conceits than upon regarding surrounding circum stances, or upon inquiring into, still less redressing, the grievances which affected the great masses of the people.—(Hear.) But he would advise them to direct their serious attention to the facts ; for though the Ministers of the Crown m i g ht sa y it was in convenient, to inquire into them—though Honour able Gentlemen might wish to proceed to the Orders of the Day—though they might desire to enter into discussions on finance, or arguments for the increase of our military force—or for appointing constabulary au thorities—still let him say that this was not a whole some method of legislation, and if they were to proceed thus, it would not conciliate the affections of the people. —(Hear, hear.) He deprecated this mode of dealing with questions emanating from the popular power —indeed he thought the time was now come when claims of that sort ought to suggest to our minds ap prehensions which had been too long delayed. Mr. BRAMSTON said the petition of John Tho rogood contained two charges —one against the Magis trates for excessive cruelty, the other against the parish officers for prosecuting him on the ground that he was a political partizan. The facts were, the petitioner during that part of his imprisonment from the 20th of May to the 27th of July, 1838, had been treated better than any of the debtors—he had one of the best apart ments in the gaol ; he was permitted to receive books and refreshments ; and in that period he had not received less than 383 visits. If his business had been " ruined" he persevered in his resistance to the demand for the rates, in full knowledge of the consequences which had been clearly detailed to him by the Churchwardens, who if they had not proceeded against him, would have neglected their duty. He would oppose the mo tion of the Noble Lord.—(Question, question.) Mr. T. DUNCOMBE moved to omit the words reflecting on the treatment Mr. Thorogood had received. Sir R. H. INGLIS opposed that proposition. Mr. HA WES then proposed the same suggestion as an amendment. Mr. EASTHOPE wished to say a few words not in reference to that individual but to the law. He believed neither the Magistrates, •nor the clergy of Chelms ford, nor any party in that House, were pleased with the law as it stood at present. They might call Mr. Tho rogood an obstinate man, a fanatic, if they pleased ; but, at all events, here was a man suffering for the sake of conscientious scruples, incarcerated from the 10th of January till the 23d of July, because he felt bound to refuse to pay ss. 6d. Church-rates. The man suf fered under a papistical law, which he wondered should have been so long permitted to con tinue. He wondered exceedingly that the Right Hon. Baronet, who wa§ so distinguished an opponent of Po pery, should thus cling to a remnant of it. He was astonished the Right Hon. Baronet was not anxious to remove what was a disgrace to the Established Church. He would implore the House to regard this individual case with singleness of purpose, and to remember that John Thorogood had been so many months incar cerated for refusing to pay Church-rates, an impost which the House of Commons ought not to continue.— (Hear, hear, and Question, question.) Two divisions took place. The first on the question that the original words be retained, and the numbers were Ayes 2O Noes 44 Majority The House then divided on the previous question, and the numbers were— Ayes 42 Noes 22 Majority . 2O The amended resolution was carried without a further division. ROYAL ACADEMY. On an re-admission to the gallery, we found Mr. HUME presenting petitions from" Mr. Doo, the engraver, and from Dr. Birkbeck, and others complain ing of the conduct of the Royal Academy. The Hon. Member then moved that the returns ordered on the 14th March be made forthwith. The Hon. Member stated that it had appeared to him these returns were a matter of course, but in consequence of the proceed ings of the Royal Academy, it had become a matter of serious importance. On the 14th of March he had moved for a return of the amount of money received for admission, and of the number of persons who visited the exhibition of the Royal Academy of Art, in each of the years 1836, 1837, and 1838, distinguishing the amount pain for admission, and the amount paid for cata logues, and also the sum paid for salaries to servants. Also for an account of miscellaneous expenses, and the number of students. This was merely a continuation of the ac counts presented by the President and Council of the Royal Academy in 1836, and it had not occurred to him there would be any objection to these returns. He did not understand how the Royal Academy could say they received no assistance from the public when they had accommodation in one of the best situations in the metropolis, and for which that House had voted 43,000/. Was that no assistance ? He believed no instance could be mentioned in which an Institution so circumstanced had attempted to evade the call that the House had made on it. The income of the Royal Academy when at Somerset House averaged 500/. a year, and the public had a right to know whether that income had increased or decreased since they had left Somerset House ; and how fir it was right they should occupy a public building at so he avy an expense to t h e public. Their refusal raised the question whether they had any right to occupy the building. An HON. MEMBER moved that the House be counted, and the Gallery was cleared. On our re-ad mission we ascertained there were 40 Members present. Mr. HUME said he was aware that any Hon. Member had a right to count the House, but he thought it extremely unfair to interrupt the business of the House at this late period of the Session. If the Hon. Member did not think this a question of importance, he (Mr. Hume) did. He contended that the Aca demy acted as a blight upon art, and was most injurious to it. The Royal Academi cians in claiming exclusive merit overlooked the Dublin Academy, which had produced Sir M. Shee, and the School of Edinburgh which claimed Wilkie and other eminent men. The academicians after stating the lectures, &c., which they had given, said they had esta blished an annual exhibition to which all artists without distinction are allowed to send their works. Now so far from exhibiting the works of artists on fair terms, the academicians had every advantage in the selection of best places. They stated that they had gratuitously educated, according to the best principles of art, nearly 2,000 students, the most promising of whom have been able to pursue their studies in Italy at the expense of the Royal Academy. Now, would the House believe, that out of that number only 1,5 had been sent to Italy ? (Hear, hear.) During 68 years the amount paid for the education of artists abroad was 4,5861.—(Hear, hear.) In 70 years the amount received by them was 2,52,000/. The salaries of the academicians paid out of this, amounted to 73,0004, and yet their petition went to show that their services were gratuitous. The pen sions in the same time amounted to 12,000/., the ex pense of the annual dinners, to 19,7004 the expenses of the exhibition to 36,000/. and there was an unapropriated fund of about 40,0001. Their annual income amounted to 6,400/., out of which, the sum paid to students at Rome was about 1201. Petitions had been presented from various quarters, in favour of the returns ; among others, from the Society of British Artists, who stated that they had formerly petitioned the House that they might be placed on fairer footing in relation to the Royal Academy—that they acknowledged with gratitude the provision made by George 111. for the encouragement of the arts, by granting a magnificent building for the use of the Aca demy—but that this privilege had been abused by that irresponsible self-elected body, who had combined with the jealousy of private competition the tyranny of public authorities ; and they prayed the House to make abso lute the order of the 13th of March for returns from the Academy, which would afford means for instituting a fair comparison between that and other similar in stitutions. There was also a petition from Dr. Birk beck, and the as worthy arts thy and sciences , attention and oth er di st i ngu i s h e d persons, connected w whose h o o f s e t h eH opinionsaase as wtehree self elected Royal Academy ; they stated that they learned with surprise, that a public body, receiving public aid, should claim exemption from the authority of Parlia ment ; and from the obligation to furnish information which might be useful to the community. They sub mitted that exclusive privileges to particular bodies were rather prejudicial than otherwise to the interests of the arts—that all societies for the advancement of the arts should be treated alike by the State—and that it was anomalous to permit a Society to enjoy the be nefits of public assistance, without the duties of public responsibility.—(Hear, hear, hear.) The information required by the House from the Royal Academy was furnish e d w ith ou t h es i tat i on b y o ther institutions—in this, and f o rei gn co u n t r i es — w hi c h yet received no pub lic aid. Now there was the petition also of Mr. Haydon—who might be represented perhaps as an enemy to the Acade m y — as a disagtointed man—but he certainly had displayed great zeal for the arts ; VIII( 31, 1839 perhaps it would have been more for his in terest had he shown less of this zeal, for it might be that had he been more cringing and sub missive to the powers that bc, he would have been more fortunate ; was it to be borne, however, that an artist who had displayed zeal for the progress of the arts should be rejected by a Society, professedly in tended for their advancement. The statements of Mr. Haydon, however, he need not particularly advert to, they were before Hon. Members. The returns he asked for, let him observe, had been granted several years previously, and he only wished them to b e con tinued. Sir Martin Shee had addressed a letter to him, not over respeCtiul—directed to Joseph Hume — (A laugh)—making a peatmal question ei,it—and using strong terms towards him, which only shovie.; that lie had no arguments.--(Sir R. Inglis, " Aeadl) Well, he would : Sir Martin said that, notwithshlnd:;ing dilettanti drilling which he (Mr. Hume) had recei*n . t!, he had not been sufficiently enlightened on this sub ject ; that the fine arts did not seem his forte--(A laugh)--that his sensibilities were not exquisitely acute— that in matters of taste he was not much of a critic— (Laughter)—that he had indulged in course invective against the Royal Academy—and had shown more of personal enmity and rancorous virulence than of a liberal desire for the prosperity of the arts. Sir Mar tin went on to deny that the Academy received a shilling from the public. Now he (Mr. Hume), re peated what he had often said, that the grant of a mag nificent public building was equivalent to a considerable grant of public money.—(Cries of " Hear, hear.") He asked for these returns not to satisfy himself, but the public, who had a right to have a full knowledge on the subject. The Hon. Member concluded by moving for the returns of which he had given notice. Mr. WARBURTON seconded the motion. Sir R. INGLIS moved as an amendment, that the order should be rescinded. The Hon. Member for Kilkenny had stated, with somewhat too much confi dence, that Parliment might call the Royal Academy or any other body before them ; that might be true, but the question was, would they come ? The motion of the Hon. Member for Kilkenny wag, in his opinion, extremely uncalled for, and unfair. If the House made any grant to the Royal Academy, there might then be something on which to found the motion ; but as it did not, he considered the motion unjust. The Hon. Mem ber for Kilkenny had called the Royal Academy in terlopers; how could that be the case, when the key of the present place which they occupied was placed in the hands of the President of the Academy by the Sovereign himself ? The bitterest enemies of the members of the Royal Academy had not dared to impeach the integrity of their administration ; and since that Society had been established they had actually expended upon national objects and works of art no less a sum than 300,0001. The Hon. Member for Kilkenny had said that the Academy had acted as a blight upon art ; he denied that it had done so, firmly believing that under its auspices the arts had been nourished and fostered. It should be recollected that from 1795 to 1814 the Continent was hermetically closed, so that it was phy sically impossible for the Academy to send students to Rome. The Hon. Member had alluded, "ad invidia," to the sum of 19,0001. being spent in dinners, and the exclusion of artists not academicians had been men tioned as a grievance. He would ask who paid for that dinner ? Did the House pay for it ? No ; the Academy, which had never received any grant from the Government. There was not another institution of the sort in Europe which was not supported by the State, and in this the richest nation in Europe the Academy had never received so much in money's worth from the State as the King of Bavaria had expended in one year for the promotion of the arts in his capital. The Academy, so far from being a monopoly, was open to any artist, and with regard to the choice of places, he knew that one academician, Mr. Leslie, had with drawn a picture of his own, lest it should interfere with that of a brother artist ; and the President, Sir Martin Shee, when he was a member of the Hanging Com mittee, had actually refused to exhibit. This brought him to the attacks of the Hon. Member for Kilkenny on that gentleman. He had accused him of having expressed himself in a different tone before and after he became President of the Academy. He was elected a Royal Academician in 1800, and did not publish the " Elements of Art " until 1809, so that, at all events, he was a Royal Academician at that period. He would admit the proposition that, where there was money there should be inquiry, but in this case there had been no money, and more than an adequate return had been made for any moneys' worth. According to this principle, the House would have a right to inquire into the affairs of the Athaseum—that stood upon Crown Land—and what difference could it make whether the rent was paid in money or in services. It had been said that the dignity of the House was concerned in enforcing obe dience to this order—were the Royal Academicians, on receiving a paper, impressed with the magical letters J. H. Ley, Cl. Dom. Corn., to bow nine times to it, and prostrate themselves obediently before it ? He would ask the House, were they prepared to go further if this return were refused? for he could answer that a great deal more would be required to enforce obedi ence than the issuing another order, signed " J. H. Ley, Cl. Dorn. Com." They bad already got into a difficulty respecting privilege, to which he would not further allude. But by rescinding the order, it was said the House would admit that it was in the wrong. The House had before made ill-advised orders, and re scinded them. It had made an ill-advised order now, and he hoped the House would do the same that it did in the case of Samuel Wells. Mr. HOWARD seconded the amendment. He would not deny the right of the House to the return.— (Hear, hear.) But they aught not to exercise that right inquisitorially. They should consider the feel ings of the gentlemen of that Institution, by whom so much had been done for the country. Mr. HAWES said he concurred in the motion of the Hon. Baronet, and considered that his Honourable Friend the Member for Kilkenny, had made no case for the enforcement of his order.—(Hear, hear.) The returns in question were new—they had not been made before ; they could only be justly called for on the ground of a direct public grant, which was essentially a different thing from the mere occupation of a public building. It was not sufficiently recollected that the Royal Academy had originally received a direct grant from the Crown of apartments in Somerset House. which were only relinquished in consideration of re ceiving those they now occupied in the National Gallery. —( Hear, hear.) But could the mere grant of a public building justify a call for an account of every farthing received or paid by the academy, of the money earned by the industry and the genius of the Members.— (Hear, hear.) As to the question whether the institu tion of such an academy was beneficial to the arts, let it be recollected that, unlike similar foreign institutions, the academy was not supported by Royal bounty—it received nothing from the country—it asked nothing —(Hear, hear, and cheers)—and the names it had produced had shed a lustre upon British art which had never been surpassed.—(Hear, hear.) Some per sons, indeed, considered that the arts were injured rather than benefited by any direct aid from the Crown or from the country. Suah was not his (Mr. Hawes') opinion'; on the contrary, he believed that the direct patronage, whether of the Sovereign or the pub lic, might be greatly conducive to the interests of art. In fact it was impossible that it should be otherwise for the arts must depend on the patronage of a compa ratively narrow and select circle of the educated and re fined, and could not rely, as manufactures might, on general trading principles.--(Hear, hear.) F rance , i n the reign of Louis XIV., had derived, under the saga cious Administration of Colbert, incalculable benefit, from the direct Royal bounty an d p a t ronage g i ven to divers manufactures, as of porcelain, tapestry, &c.— (Hear, hear.) Tue public, when they granted the use of some half dozen paltry rooms, had only the right to demand an account of the state of those rooms ; but to say that they thereby acquired a right to look into into every item of the expenditure and receipts, was really monstrous.—(Hear, hear.) It was said that it would be highly beneficial to the public that the ex hibition of the Royal Academy should be gratuitous ; so it might, and it would be equally so that the Water Colour Artists' Exhibition, and that the British Artists' Exhibition should be gratuitous—but could it be expected ? As to Hampton Court Palace exhibition that was maintained by annual grants from the national funds, and the pictures were the property of the country,—(The Chancellor of the Exchequer— "Of the Crown.") Exactly so, but they had been vir tually surrendered to the public.—( Hear, hear.) Really he could not see the justice—above all the policy—of entering into this petty kind of warfare with the Royal Academy,which had for the last fifty years been of such 'great service to the arts, and had acquired a reputa tion which had covered Europe.—(Hear, hear, hear.) This proposition would violate the clear private rights of the Academy, and would be a most ungrateful return for the benefit of the country.—( Hear.) Mr. WARBURTON reminded Hon. Gentlemen that they had much wandered from the question, which was, whether or not the Royal Academy should or not furnish the account which had been ordered ? The Academy received from the public about 3,000/. a year, therefore they had a right to produce those returns. The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER could not allow this subject to drop without making a few observations, first with respect to the right and authority of the House ; secondly, as to the furtherance of the Fine Arts ; and thirdly, as to the welfare of the Royal Academy itself. None of those considerations were opposed to each other—they were , i n f act, iden tical. With respect to the p owers o f t h e House he was rejoiced to find that there was no denial of its power in the petition, although the Hon. Member for Oxford had in fact denied them. He thought the course pursued by that Hon. Member was calculated to do much harm, as nobody could doubt in a case where the public was concerned, that the House had a right to have the fullest information. He regretted exceedingly that this contention had arisen, and he was only at a loss to know from whence it originated at all. —( Hear, hear. ) He could not see why the Royal Academy should choose to set at defiance the orders of that House, their having done so made EYE Li v lING EDITION. Lord P j , A .. ar • , 1 - kLMERSTON said those papers had sz "-ki l --. 'j i -Y, e ' . from Portugal about three weeks ago. ."'""1" D. BROWNE withdrew his motion. After MR. RUDKIN'S INVENTION. a desultory conversation, certain returns eon 'fleeted with the trial of the above invention in the Public ; Distilleries were, on the motion of Mr. ELLIS, orde red to be made. I he Slave Treaties Bill went through Committee. BANK OF IRELAND. ''. Clic Bank of Ireland Acts Report was ordered to be Tee( !ived on. Thursdlv. SOAP DUTIES. . The Soap Duties Regulation Bill went through 1 Commi!ter.t.. - 1. I.IIU F----- matters look suspicious, and le ` sial.—(Hear.) to , suppose they had something to cone • ."'eciety now With respect to the building which the r t precisrAy had, they held it, as had been stated, up / se. He the same grounds as they did Somerset Ho "` ?. called hoped some day or another the public would b , aio. , c. upon to occupy the whole of that building wit. " 1 v ings or statues, to which they should have gra tui:cous access. Let the Royal Academy prove its riL ;ht to all accommodation at the expence of the public, they should have apartments on the most liberal 'cal°. Isere He fully recognised their merits and claims, but w and information only was required by the public, as in the present case, he thought they ought not to refuse , `',he papers ; he would support the demand. Sir R. PEEL also admitted the right of the Ho use to interfere in this case. The question was, woul dit be wise to exercise that right ? Would it deterio rate 1, "-om the merits and usefulness of that body ? He v, r ,,,,,,- the frailties to which the race of artists were liabi'e, ;f a man had not his picture placed %Iv:1c re he desired, lie might think there was a conspi osey , to oppress h im,, and this, though the applicatio noY a single Member of Par; lame nt, single artist t° a .. ss still open to the House. He ask ed might given rise to a most vexatious inquiry. .„- - 1. e t , n . sidered the question w,. ( ;ddle cx, the Hon. Member for L. 4 Si, where the former r, ~s- turns turns spoken of by him exis. u in the evidence of tin Mr. HUME said they were • • Academy of Arts; President and Secretary of the , .1 July 1830. before a Committee of the House i, i i,ingenuous state- Sir R. PEEL—That was a most c ment. He found, then, that there was . 'eally no for mer return, such as he thought had rea.llY, existed. Therefore, they would be perfectly justifiable in re scinding their order. He hoped to see the day when ' they should have a magnificent palace of art built for the people in the most magnificent part of Hyde Park, that we no longer should be ashamed 10 show the stranger from Munich the gallery of Charing-CT? SS, which was infinitely inferior to the one provider in that capital with about one five-hundredth part of the in- ' come which we possessed.—(Hear.) The income of the Society was about 5,0001. a year from the shilling visitors, and they had 47,0001. in the funds. Their patronage was dispensed in the most liberal and just manner. The members, in a great de gree, gave up their right of admitting strangers. The admissions took place by ballot. The President (Sir A. S' see) hid no salary ; the Keeper had 160/. ; the Trea surer" had NU per annum ; the Secretary 100/. ; the LibrariOn, Attending three times a week, 80/, The dinners cost 30 0 /. a-year, but in the sixty years of their existence the SOcietY had expended 240,000/. on the education of a School of Arts, for the benefit of this country, which r,lfil,sed to institute one. Further, the Institution had disp' em sed 30,000/. a-year to distressed artists. Since 1810 tht2v had elected as academicians Sir D. Wilkie, WestmaCo.o' Smart, Raeburn, a Scotch artist, whose merit won i.. 3 , wa y ; Nesbitt, Mulready, Jackson, Sir F. Chantrey, 0 0. 1 1 ins, Daley, Wyatville, Constable, Ettie, Stanfield, skrslold, another Scotch whose fame had (From the London Ntlto Price Curr en t o f J u ly 30.) artist ; Gibson, an artist of Rolah l, ,„ SUGAR.—For West Ina is Muscovado Sugar during the reached this country ; and Cocks.'"", and other great past week there has been a brisk and general demand from +ed several eminent P names. There may have been omit. ‘sich he had read both grocers and refiners, and the merchants have obtains a men ; but he contended that the list w, an advance on previous rate s of Is per cwt. would show that the Society had fulfil. e 4 the main This afternoon the biddi, 3gs were animated at a public object of its institution, namely to give tn.(' greatest sale of 100 hhds Barbadoes Sugar, and the prices obtain ed encouragement and support to men o f merit, and were 6d to Is above those o t the last auction, fine fetched thereby to secure for the country the benesst of 68s to 695, good 67s to 67s 6d, and goo d m id 66 s t o 66s 8 4 a school composed of men of genius.—( Hear, hem 1%) per cwt. REFINED.—Prices have advanced is since this day we, ell _.. He had seen as many instances of disinterested gene - I rosity among artists earning a bare subsistence as among for Refi e n n e d d 8g276dd5,t080853t,,0 for Bls are the present rates for standard hi in s . good Bastardsreuet. the first Nobles of the land.—(Cheers.) When he b-r°vL' s ' o. ld freely - , and Pieces h hay , recollected the generous spirit manifested by his re- d n: any parcels of crashed have been in sold at 3 c is 6d , vered friend, Sir Thomas Lawrence, and the disin- A 6" , o. f the refiners are not inclined to enter int ° terestedness of the present President, he must say that in c ` on. sracts under ;tss ; for 10 lb. Hambro loaves f a u n r a t h e s ° r the artists of this country had manifested a feeling that been p a id f o r several arcels. Of Dutch 150 did them credit as artists and as men ; an d w h en h con- 40s to 41s has casks have been' sold deli,ierabl e on board in Amsterdam at sidered that this spirit had ar i sen un d er t h e f oster i ng 32s 6d; the price ' here is 33s 6d per cwt. care of this Institution, lie feared any i n t er f erence w ith Marna-rms..,.._i his afti :moon 5,898 ba g s sold at price s ' such an Institution, and should vo t e f or resc i n di ng t h e 6 d to is above thc,'se o.ki the last auction, fine yello w order for the return, fetched 66s to 67s 6d, got ,d 65s to 65s 6d, middling 643, , Mr. E WART thought the denial of these returns to 64s 6d, low middling ,q3t 'to 63s 6d, good brown 629 ., n_ti vr to 61s, dingy greyish would create the very interference which the Right low middling ditto. 60s ba r 63s to 63s 6d per cwt. Hon. Baronet so much deprecated. It was not neces blic sa is , 2,575 bags Bengalgood to sary to show any misappropriation of funds in order to fine hi tleetloettaeb—e fetched u .. d .. e 6d, mid togood mid 65s justify inquiry if the benefit of the public required it. 6d to 66s 6d, washed and 6 dtoam6t. p 8 % Ciss to 665. Manilla good The Right Hon. Baronet in reading his list of Royal brown at 20s 6d to 21s, good Ink ld,ling yellow 22s to 22s 6d, Academicians should recollect they made themselves a elm- Java good and fine yellow with s trength sold at 24s 6d to racter under a system of freedom in art, and that the Royal 255, good mid 23s to 23s 6d, or cl grey 235, good mid to Academy had only elected them after this eminence had good grey 24s to 265, and washed, .2,15 to 24s 6d per ewt. s been attained. As Chairman of the Committee, he This afternoon Bengal was sought after, and 870 bag . s of last week, and could bear his testimony as to the difficulty experienced at auction supported the advanced rat`e, in getting the President of the Academy to answer the sold at 66s to 67s for. good middling to , coodwhite. for He' yeito questions put to him. He contended that, as the Aca- FOREIGN.—Wc have to report a quiet market vannah refused for and Brazil Sugar, 39s to 40s h as been demy occupied rooms the property of the public, thisgood ualit of the former brown demptions of the i House had a right to inquire into its concerns. If the latter ' On rather Y easier terms.. For yello w Havannah Academy would embrace the principle of open compe- former rates are asked, 9 8s 6d has been refu. sed for float tion, it would be greatly to its own advantage, and ing cargoes. to the advantage of art. It was an opinion gaining MoLAssEs.—ln \Nest India there has been .a fair busi ground every day that acade.enies were not of ness doing privately at very full prices, middling Deme advantage in forwarding the arts. Ile did not agree rara has been sold at 33s 6d to 345, better 3 4 s 6d to with his Hon. Friend, the Member for . Lambeth, as to 3 5 s 6 d, and fine Antigua at 35s 6 d , good 35 s ; for t h e the good done to art by patronage. Barbadoes, which were taken in at auction last Tuesday, . Mr. POULETT THOMSON could not vote for 35s 6d has been refused. COFFEE.-This afternoon prices were firm for all de the motion of the Hon. Member for Kilkenny: Had he been a Ro al Academician, he should not as a scriptions admissible for home consumption ; ther e wa s no' public sale of West India, and the small quantity offering matter of prudence have refused these returns, bec3ilse privately prevented business of moment ; 187 bags Ceylon; he was convinced that the more their affairs were knoivil and 20 bags Havannah were offered at auction, the formes the more would it redound to their credit. But he did sold at barely previous rates, viz., good ord at 101 s a 1025, not at the same time think that any grounds had been 1 the latter fetched 54s 6d a 56s 6d per cwt. made out for the production of those returns if it were TEA.—There was a brisk demand for black and green against the feelings of the Academy. His earnest Tea in the middle part of last week, but more particularly_ for Twankays and the common ordinary blackish leaf advice to the Academy would be to afford every in descriptions of Congou, and the advanced rates previously formation, but he should be sorry that any refusal establish l ed were fully supported ; Company's Congou _I c' should stand in the way of their receiving from that y at Is sicl to Is sid per lb, but during the last few House any assistance which they so well deserved. s°l3 freely I been less - in all probably days there asdoing He was not surprised, when he considered the on accosisst of the near approach of the public sales, ID language made use of, that the Academy holders reoain firm. should entertain some feelings of irritation. H e CINNAMON"..—The public sales of Cinnamon, which was at a loss to know what was meant by commence d yesterday, concluded to-day ; the attendance calling this a privileged body. It had received from of buyers was ,mall. The sales comprised 2,516 bales and the public nothing more than a set of apartments, and 282 chests Ceylon and (bales Malabar, of which about it devoted a greater sum to the encouragement of art 1,570 bales, &c. were disposed of at prices which esta than any suns that could be supposed to be the annual blished a decline on the , April sales of 3d t o 4d on fine value of those apartments. This was the cheapest second and third qualities, and from 4d to 6d on all de way that could be devised of exciting the ambition of scriptions. Some lots of the first quality were afterward s artists. In the establishment of the School of Design put up for re-sale at 7s 9d, and second quality at 63 OP he had applied to many artists, and among others to but found few buyers at thosu rates. Royal Academicians, not to the P res id en t , b ecause On.s.—Southern at 24l 5,: a 24/ lOs for goo d , an 1d 23 he did not wish to have th e A ca d emy m i xe d up 5s a 23/ lOs for mid dark quality. Sp Lin with a t 931 19 3 ._ a . 931 15s for second, and 851 for inferior quality. with it as a body. He received the support of Sir F. seed Oil at 25s 6d. Chantrey, Messrs. Cockerill and Eastlake, and Sir Au- • d of 475 SPICES.—To-day the public sales consiete gustus Calcott, and it was owing to their assistance that chests Ca • I.; ii pkgs sm ignea, 322 bags Bourbon Clove!, _ via , the school was established ; he did not receive assist- Mace, and 35 pkgs Nutmegs ; the Cassia Ligne!, 609 ante from other artists, although he had applied to them, principally sold at rather better prices, middling fetched and he believed there never was an institution that had to 66s 6d, mouldy 54s 6d, beetle stained 54s 6d to 569 1 more effectually answered its end th an th e R oya l A ca- the Cloves went at is ld to is 2d for middling dark ; t h e demy, and therefore he should vote against the motion Mace sold at 4s 3d to 6s, and the Nutmegs were Par,l, of the Hon. Member for Kilkenny. sold, good brown at 5 s 3d to 5 s 6d, and nferior 4s 8a ' Mr. WYSE would support the moti o n f or th e re - 4s lid per lb. turns, believing them to be called for, and that the public were entitled to have them. He thought that returns not only of the Royal Academy, but every public In stitution, ought to be given yearly to the public. Lord JOHN RUSSELL could not give a silent vote upon this occasion, he entertained no doubt that the House had a perfect right to call for these returns, but it was another question whether they should be called for without sufficient rea son being shown for their production. The Honqurable Member for Wigan had said that it had been almost settled on the Continent that Academies did no good in the furtherance of science. That was a question that ought not to be discussed on a motion like the present. He trusted the House would not agree to the returns. If a more liberal system was required by the Honourable Member for Kilkenny, let him bring that subject pro perly forward, and not endeavour to do it by a side wind Mr, HUME replied. The House then divided on the motion. There were— For the motion Against it Majority against it SIR JOHN MILLEY DOYLE. Mr. R. D. BRO WNE went into a statement of the merits of this distinguished officer both in the services of Great Britain and Portugal. After rende r i ng great assistance to Don John the Sixth and Don Miguel of Portugal, he was thrown into prison, and treated with the greatest indignity and cruelty. His claim for compen sation had been admitted in 1832. Mr. FO`..X. MAULE brought up the Report of High. ways and urupike Roads Rates Bill ; also the Report of the Grat id Jury Cess (Ireland) Bill. The oth .er Orders of the Day were then disposed of and the He use adjourned at a Quarter before Two. THE MARKETS-(YESTERDAY On Tuesday the postman who takes the letters between Foxbouse and Hathersage was attacked , at three o'clock in the day, at Millstone Edge, b y three fellows, who beat him most cruelly with bludgeons an d then robbed him of 131. in gold and silver. The pop r fellow could hardly crawl with his letters to his journey s end, when, having given informati on of the robbery, Mr - James Cocker, and eleven picked wor k m en from his fac tory, succeeded in apprehending th e thieves, who con fessed the robbery, and were comm it te d f or trial.—z"g field Iris. SETS OF PLATED DISH COVERS, with STRONG SILVER EDGES, may be selected of various Patterns, price 161. the Set, or Sets of the same Pattern in the Argentine Metal, quite equal to plated in appearance, price Sevee and a Half Guineas the set. The Set consists of one cover 20, 18, 14, and 12 inches in diameter. A Set of Four Plated Corner Dishes and Covers are offered, complete, for Eight Guineas ; or a Set with richly ornamented Edges, Handles, &c., for Ten Guineas. The Handles take off the Covers, the Set thus forms Eight Dishes, when required. T. COX SAVORY, Working Goldsmith, Silversmith, and Watchmaker, 47, Corn hill, London (Seven doors from Graceehureh-street.) SHEFFIELD PLATED WINE COOLERS. A. B. SAVORY and SONS, Manufacturing Silversmiths, 14, Cornhill, London (opposite the*Bank of England), have for choice in their warerooms a Selection of PLAIN and ORNA MENTAL ICE PAILS, to which they wish to direct attention. The price of the Plain Tub-pail (now much in use), 10s. the pair ; the Classic Vase (very neat), 101. Bs. the pair; the Victoria Pattern, 151. the pair ; the Dresden Cooler, 191. the pair, &c., all of whit.. are strongly mounted with Silver, and have Silver Shields for Engraving the Crest or Coat of Arms. A pamphlet is published, with drawings of the above and other articles of plate generally, which may be had en applica" tion, free of cost. Sir S. LUSHINGTON estimated his claim for compensation at not less than 10,0001. Sir John Milley Doyle was unwilling to bring: this subje4 forward, but he was forced to do so in consequence of the neglect which his claims had experienced. He would not detain the House longer than to call their attention to the petition of Sir John Milley Doyle, K.C.8., presented on the 25th of March last ; and to move that an humhle address be presented to her Majesty, praying that her Majesty may be gra ciously pleased to give sueh instruction to her Minister at Lisbon as may procure the immediate satisfaction of the " award" made by the British Government, and " demanded" from that of Portugal on the 13th day of April,lB32, as compensa ti o n for personal injuries and losses sustained by the p e titioner, during the de facto Government of Portugal, in the year 1828, under Don Miguel. Lord PALMERSTON could assure the House that this claim had not been neglected by the Govern ment. The Government of Portugal bad recently transmitted to this country the grounds on which they resisted the claim. These papers had been referred to the Queen's Advocate, and until his report was received it was impossible to say how these statements affected the claim in question. Under these circumstances, he thought the House would see it was inexpedient to come to the decision to which they were asked to come by the Hon. Member. Mr. O'CONNELL considered the a nswer o f the Noble Lord was satisfactory, but submitted to the Noble Lord the propriety communicating with f thewit L h or S d ir P J A oh L n m A E L ß D s o rr y o le N on saidno su bjc final be come to adverse to thes e claims, weititi. o d l e a ci g si i o v n i n could u s l i ( r l J. M. Doyle the fulle s t opportunity of being heard. Colonel Colonel SIBTHORP hoped the law officers would come to a speedy decision. BIRTHS. On the 28th inst., at the Rectory, Aldham, Essex, the wife of the Rev. Robert Durant Buttemer, of a son. On the 28th inst., at St. John's-hill, Battersea-rise, Mrs. William Herring, of a daughter, still -born. MARRIED. On the 30th inst., at St. Mary's, Bryanston-square, the B ev. Lord Arthur Herv e y, to Patience, eldest daughter of John Singleton, Esq. On the 21st of June at the British Consulate, Madeira, Ro bert Dart, Esq., to Eliza Jane, eldest daughter of Jain° Gough, Esq. On the 29th inst., at Debden Hall, William Talbot Crosbie, Esq., of Ardfert Abbey, Kerry, to Susan Ann, third daughter of the Hon. Lindsey Merrick Peter Burrell. On the 26th of July, at Bangor, Ireland, James Hamil ton Ward, E sq., Commander R.N., son of the late Right 1 1 "" Robert W ar d , of Bangor Castle, to the Hon. Elizabeth Dorcas Blackwood, d aug h ter of the L or d D u ff eren an d Claneboye. DIED. On the 30th inst., at Egham Park, Surrey, Agnes Emily, th e young es t c hild o f Lieutenant-Colonel Salwey, M.P., ag ed 4 months. On the 12th of April, on her passage from India, on Wa rd the ship William Money, Madeline, wife of Lieutenant Alex - , ander Humfrays, of the Bengal Artillery ; and on the 25th a' the same month, Emily, their only child. On the 19th inst., at Paris, Jane T. Wilson, eldest, daughter of James Wilson, Esq., Chief Justice of the Mauritius. On the 24th inst., at Hammersmith, Elizabeth Sarah Gallant, eldest daughter of the late Captain Mason, of Harwich, Essex' On the 29th inst., in Baker. street, Lloyd-square, Clerken. well, Mrs. Louisa Whiteley, aged 44. On the 29th inst., at Kennington-common, Anne, eldest daughter of Thomas Shepherd, Esq., of apoplexy. London : Printed and Published by MURDO YOUNG' fJ No. 112, Strand, at The Suit Office, No. 119, Strand, i n the coe.rity of Alie!ilesex.—Wednesriar, July 31. 1 IRISH MARKETS. DUBLIN MARKET NOTE flr the WEEK ENDING JULY 26. From 36 0 1,646 Whe at, per barrel 20 stone... 0 Bere (1 Barh.ty 1,280 Oats 0 Flour, per cwt.... 8 c'imo 0 Oatmeal 8 stone Sold to 'Bakers only. I 6,281 Cwt. Flour , , 743 1 Firsts 22 0125 6 i 21( .. 4 Avers ge price of Wheat and Flour 65, 4.1. per sack. Receipts of Flour, from 225. Oct. to 255. Ot ' Seconds Sales of Do. 18,00:3 '- from 19s. 041. to 225. 0 , Tnirds from 10s. Od. to 12s. Od• PRICE OF BREAD. Qu.s rtern Loaf 10(4. 1 Half Quartern sd. CORK MARKETS July 27 Wheat (pe .—/ 29f, t.)21 - zs Od. to1•17s. 0 : 1 .10ats (per 14. t.) ...115.61. f l d. % to 165. Barry (per 165t.)13 0 22 6 (Flour (percwt )...16 0 24 u • Oatmeal (per cwt.) 12s. Od. t0'16.-(. 6d. 1-3.m , f, 4d. to 7d.—Mutton, sd. to tid.—Veal, 4d to 6d. Pu)l3, 4id. to s(l.—Fresh Butter, 10d . to lid, per lb. PRICE CP MATER. To the Merchants. 1 , is - st Quality B6s von . S. l 8.1 1 , 1. ir.d For. ' ll ' ll 68 Fifth 48 Sixth ' ...--, To A vorage• 40 0 3 0 !ti 0 2O 0 Is 11 —o 0 0 —o 0 0 To the Country 77g. , CLON MELL MARKETS.—JuIy 27. Per Cwt. d. s. d. s. ii. s. d. '• n 04 . New Butter ... ......SS oto 00 0 Hides (raw) oto 4 n O a tmeal .... . .1 9. 0 12 3 Bacon Pigs 38 0 40 . Rendered Lard...... - 0 52 0 Heads ........ 2B 0 .-- 6 Per Bag. 32 0 Flom'. Second ..., 0 44 0 I Flour, Thi r d 5........— 0 .—:l„Tousehold.... 0 42 0I Fourths. 2'l 0 - Per Barrel. 4 0 ;43: •to 00°O ' 6 Rapeseed.... al 0 —0 1 Barley 13 0 14 6 0 Here . 8; 4 10 0 1 Coals Per Stone. 4 6 Wheat .........„ / 8 110 1 Tallow (rough) 4 0 t. 4 oats gyn.,. 0 h (1 9 1 Potatoes KIL to 378 Pd. A B l e a er it ( K pe E r T lb S . . Wheat per barrel)3os.od... Barley 20 0 22 0 Mutton Oats ........ ...... 12 0 14 6 Pork B Flour utte r ( ( p p e e r r . 1ia w g t . ) . . ) ....... 0 3 0 0 0 0 4 0 0 Veal .. .... ... .... .. 0 D 8 0 Fresh Butter 0 0 i Bacon Pigs ... ..... .33 0 .10 0 Salt Ditto Coals 1 0 „I 2 Potatoes (per st.) 0 2 0 3 ..~F: z 3 tf. 4 4V - s"' ? • , •., .