The Sun. — London, England, 1845-02-20 00:00:00

IMPERIAL PARLIAMENT. ROUSE OF COMMONS, Feb. 19. The SPEAKER took the Chair at the usual hour. RAILWAY BILLS. Mr. Mackenzie and other Bon. Members brought up re ports from the sub-Committees appointed to inquire whether the standing orders on certain private Bills had been complied with. The Committee reported in favour of the York. and Scarborough Railway Line, the Leeds and Bradford , the A s ht o n and Stalybridge, the Manchester and Leeds (But nley Branch), the Leeds and West Riding Junction, the Hull and Selby, the Kendal and Windermere, the Chester and Birkenhead, the Manchester and Carlisle, the Cockermouth and Workington, the Leeds and Dewsbury, the West York, and other lines. '1 he Guildford, Chichester, and Portsmouth, were reported not to have complied with the standing orders. INCOIIE-TAX. Sir J. MORDAUNT presented petitions from several places against the continuance of the income-tax. Colonel WOOD presented a petition from Worcester ' pray ing that the owne r s of houses rent ed above 61 . in that city should be rated to the poor - rates instead of the tenants, as at present. MEDICAL REFORM BILL. An Hoer. 'MEMBER presented a petition, signed by the surgeons of Wrexham and its neighbourhood, against the Illedical Reform Bill. Mr. HOGG presented a petition from certain East India sugar growers, praying for a reasonable protection against the importation of foreign sugar; also from the East India and China Association, expressing apprehension on account of the proposed discriminating duty between Muscovado and clayed sugar—an attempt which, the petitioners stated, must be attended with trouble, delay, vexation, and fraud. Lord SANDON presented a petition from the Liverpool Peace Society against the proposed additional grant for the navy. Also a petition from certain tradesmen of Bethnal green, praying the House to take measures to prevent the de secration of the Sabbath. Lord ARUNDEL presented a petition from Burton, in Lomitale, in the county of York, against the increase of li censes granted for the sale of intoxicating liquors. NOTICES OF MOTION.—COLONIAL ACCOUNTS. Dr. BOWRING gavo notice that to-morrow he would move for sundry returns relating to colonial accounts. WiNDOW-TAX. Lord DUNCAN gave notice of his intention, on a future day, to bring forward the following motion :—" That the taxes levied on windows were a great burden on the country—unjust and unequal in their operation, most oppressive on those who had to bear them, and ought therefore to be immediately repealed." While he was on his legs he would take the oppor tunity of answering the question put to him the other evening by the Right lion. Baronet at the head of her Majesty's Government, who, he regretted to see, was not in his place. It appeared to he the general opinion that they should go on with the adjourned debate to-morrow evening, and, as he understoi,d all other Honourable Gentlemen who bad notices on the paper for that night agreed to postpone them, it would be most injudicious in him if he persisted in preisin,g his motion. He, therefore, begged leave to give notice that he would bring on his motion on the subject of the window-tax on Monday evening, on the question being put that the Speaker, leave the Chair to go into a Committee of Supply.—( Hear, hear. ) Sir WILLIAM CLAN moved that the petition of George Smith, distiller, and James Scott Smith, rectifier, presented 18th February, be printed. —Ordered. HOUSE OF KEYS. Dr. BOWRING moved for copies of any memorials which have been presented to her Majesty's Government from the Isle of Man on the subject oh a reform of the House of Keys.— Ordered. RAILWAYS—MORNING SITTINGS. On the reading of the orders of the day for Committees on the following Bills:—Companies Clauses Consolidation Bill ; Railway Clauses Consolidation Bill ; Lands Clauses Consolida tion Bill; Lands Clauses Consolidation ( Scotland) Bill ; Rail way Clauses Consolidation ( Scotland) Bid ; Companies Clauses Consolidation (Scotland ) Bill, Lord G. SOMERSET rose, and was supposed to say that he intended to have propased that those Committees should proceed by morning sittings to-morrow, but, on considera tion, he thought Friday would be better. His Lordship's state ment, though of considerable length, was delivered in so low a tone, that it was entirely lost in the gallery. Mr. HAWES, who was almost equally indistinct, was un derstood to ask whether the Noble Lord intended to make this arrangement compu!sory ? Mr. AG LIONB Y said he felt deeply interested in this sub ject, and thereforo had listened with attention, in order to en deavour to catch the Noble Lord's words ; but he regretted to say that not one word that the Noble Lordd had said had been heard by either him (Mr. Aglionby), or any one else at his side of tha House.—( Hear, hear.) But, he would ask, was he right in presuming that the Noble Lord intended that tho•e Committees sould hold sittings, and those sittings should take place on Friday. If that be so, he (Mr. Aglionby) was rather unfortunate in being obliged to object to that arrangement, as he had already made appointments for that day which would prevent his at tendance. On Friday morning he would be obliged to attend as Chairman of a Committee on private Bills, and, therefore, it would be quite impossible for him to attend on that day upon his Lordship's Com mittees. It was not for him ( Mr. Aglionby) to say whether the Noble Lord had acted right or not in making th s arrangement ; but others might be placed in a sitsation similar to his (Mr. Aglionby's), and in addition to that, he would say it was rather to be regretted that those morning sittings had been fixed at so early a period of the session.—( Hear.) Lord GRANVILLE SOMERSET assured the Hon. Gentleman (Mr. Aglionbv ) that it was for the general con venience of the House he - had appointed Friday. SIR J. GRAHAM'S RAILWAY SPECCLATION. Sir J. GRAHAM said that as the House was on the subject of railways he thought he might be allowed to correct an error in fact into which he had fallen when he last addressed the House on the subject of railways. On that occasion he stated that he had never had any connexion with railroads in his life. The general statement was perfectly true, hut it was made in forget fulnes of the fact that when he had the honour of representing Carlisle a railroui was projected, which, it was supposed, would be of advantage to that city. On that account he purchased a share of 100!.—( Laughter, and cries of " Oh, oh")—which he need not a , •sure the House he sold without any view to profit. POST-OFFICE ESPIONAGE. Mr. Mr)NCK TON MILN ES said that he wished to ask the Right Hon. Gentleman a question of which he had given notice the other night. and in putting, that question he wished to do it with all deliberation. When last he had named this matter in the Ilote..e he had eeemed it bstter to give notice to the Right Honourable Gentleman of his intention to put this spe-stion, and to ask what instructions had been sent out to the agent of this country abroad, with respect to the matter on which he intended to speak, and this lie did because he believed it to be a matter of much interest in that House. The question, then, which he wished to ask was whe ther, at the time that representations were made to the !Minister for Foreign Affairs ef the insurrection which was likely to ensue in the Italian States against the Government of Austria, any instruction had been sent out by Lord Aber seen to the Governor or other authorities in the Island of Corfu, that the British Government were in possession of in'ormation respecting such insurrectionary movement, and whether any information or other intimation had been given to the persons at that time in the places under the dominion of the British Government, who were likely to engage in such insurrectionary movement, of their designs being known, and of its having been communicated to the Austrian and ItaPan Governments the movements that were likely to take place, and the I ersons of the parties who were likely to be engaged in them ? Sir ROBERT PEEL said, I am happy to give an ample, and I think a sufficient answer to this question. As the Hon. Member has given notice of the nature of his question, proper attention has been paid to the subject. The Hon. Member has said that a deep interest was telt in this question, and I believe he is; erectly correct in that statement; and he should, therefore, feel it his duty to give a full reply to that question. But lam sorry to say that 1 cannot do so, Sir, without entering fully into the question. —( Hear, hear.) I hope the House will excuse this, and 1 will give the information we poise s as bri. fly and suc cinet'y as I can.—( Hear, hear. ) When the British Go vernment last year received information that an insurrec tionary movement was contemplate I in the Italian States, they felt 'it their duty to put the Austrian and Italian Governments on their guard, and particularly as this movement was organised by individuals residing at that time in possessions under the protection of the British Go vernment. In reply to thin, they had been informed that some parties engaged in that movement were resident in this coun try. His Noble Friend ha I also been informed that the Aus trian Government :had given instructions to the General at that time in command of their forces at Milan, to the effect, that if any attempt was made to trespass on the Austrian ter ritories by insurrectionists from the Papal states, in which it was believed the insurrection was chiefly organised, to resist and destroy the rebels to the utmost of his power, without any further reference to his Government. 'There were certain intimations conveyed to us which led us to apprehend great danger to the public tranquillity in the shape of an insurrectionary movement in Italy. My Noble Friend did convey to the Austrian Government, from time to time, the general purport of any information which he re essved in respect to the proc edings of those who had designs against the tranquility of Italy.—(Cries of " Hear, hear.") He communicated no letter which he had received or extracts from any letter, neither did he state the name of any individual within the power of the Austrian Government. But as it is s•ated in the report of the Select Committee, he did from time to time communicate to the represen tatives of the Austrian Government in this country, the general purport of any information connected with the designs of those whe resided within the dominions of her Majesty—particularly in the Mediterranean—calculated to disturb the public tranquillity. 'The parts wi-ll respect to which apprehensions were chiefly entertained were in the Papal States. My Noble Friend has not a very perfect recollection of the circumstances, having destro)ed such letters as he re ceived, except those of a public nature. He has not now a distinct recollection of the purport of them; but, as far as his recollection serves him, he never saw any communication of a public or private nature which led him to apprehend that a particular attack was to be made from Corfu. At any rate, he never took any steps whatever on such communications; he never communicated either to the Austrian Government, the Neapolitan Government, or to the authorities at Borne ; he never made any rtornmunication to them respecting any par ticular de-igns reedita•ed in Corfu. Consequently, the impression which some ffentlemen appeared to entertain, that these individuals were led into a trap by an act of the British Gover ,ment, is entirely without foundation. So little reason had he to apprehend that any particular attempt would be made f rom Corfu, that ro communication whatever on the subject was made to Lord Seaton, the Gover nor of the lonian Islands. 'The fa ct is, that the at tempt to t k every party lay s u rprise—it ook Lord Seaton by surprise, and it took the Consul completely by surprise. With out referrin g to the ' what were the farts dispatches, Mee ta, in the lonia n he would state to the House It appears that there were residing in own country, on aceru a t t'd''. several persons, refugees from their permitted to reside the ' of political disturbances. They were ra res,edwedilhout molestation. The two sons of Adm v i e r r a y l Bandis. quietly, ,i,iiiuntat.„Cnrfu. They conducted them selvest I x , e c t t ofi n i: g t suspicion :itaein di:ll2idlnhudrasmi., of fhlet only, jpualaenir,fe-tt of the Government . f pears that oa the Ligt,t, twenty-two individuals, and t wents p-eparation Corfu in two small boats, , e.theue • arm ° s whatever was made for directing a foreign att a c k . anl'no It p w e( a i s i t i n . o n t , until after that expedition—if it could, be calle d which consisted of twenty-two unarmed c i,n o d n a i s n v u i l d ex ua f l o s, who soiled from Corfu—that the ss:a A n ust G rtn sui, made rst the Pap I States, and the Bo representations to Lord Seat. n on the subject. l ro h n e g y remonstrated strongly against it. Lord Seaton said h e had been taken by surprise, or he would have made previous communication. The Austrian Consul requested that the British war-steamer there ahould be sent after the boats con taining the twenty-two individuals. Lord Seaton said he de clined sending an armed steamer in order to arrest them ; that he was not authorised to do so ; and that he thought the reports were exaggerated. Lord Seaton said that he felt confident no invasion could be contemplated on the coast of Calabria, but he would send a small );tEs quietly as possible to Otranto, in order to ascertain the ..4errarAlSOW of the project. , That boat had not sailed to ~rl77 l7 ,failik till after the 12th, on the . night of which the tweitftwo individuals had , ' . set sail. Inte lligence . of ~- ~ 0.11 bras given to the authorities there that it might be .., . c.;,....,...,,..... cc:vayed to Naples; but no information upon this subject had .r.,. €1 .\ . ',. ir ? , '-' -..-:-. , e ,, - -- ' • . THE SLN, LONDON, rriutiitsnAr MORNING, FEBRUARY 20, 145. they had found one, and they might find another if they would try. And what did the Irish 'Members expect in this matter? How could they expect to be freed from this tax? He did, there fore, appeal to gentlemen opposite to extend this tax to Ireland.. The agriculture of the country could not be relieved but by extending the tax to the realised capital of Ireland. The land in Ireland was as fruitful and as valuable as any acres in the Irish Member he most cordially approved of the financial mea sures proposed by the Government. Ile believed the proposed reductions would improve the manufacturing interests of this country, and enlarge the market of the Irish agriculturists, who were in a great measure dependent on the English ma nufacturers.—(llear, hear, from Sir Robert Peel.) Ile looked forward to the many gratifying results which he by the report on the division, that they had not, to use a nau tical term one " bout ship" but had recorded their votes in favour motion.—(Laughter.) He would say it was on gro common justice that this motion had been in troduced to this House. The Hon. Member for Dungarvon had appealed to the consideration of the House, and asked the House to deal with the proposition in accordance with the spirit of the Act of Union, by which it would :appear that the Ilonourable Member contended that if this tax were imposed, there would be a breach of faith and good understanding; but he (Sir .1. Tyrrell) would con tend for it that there were very few Members of the Houe who would take that view of this proposition. Upon a former occasion, when M . Bankes made a similar proposition to that House, he called upon the clerk at the table to read the seventh clause of the Act of Union, and the argument then used by that geutieman would have completely upset the arguments of the Hon. Member for Dungarvon, and would not have left him a leg to stand on.—( A laugh.) But the lion. Baronet at the head of her Majesty's Government had said that it would be unjust to impose the income-tax upon Ireland. Now, he (Sir John Tyrrell) held in his hand a report of the sentiments of the Hon. Baronet, uttered upon this subject in 1833, when he said that Ireland should not be exempt from any such im post, as such a measure would be extren ely unjust.—(Hear, hear.) He (Sir J. Tyrrell) was as much averse as any one to any unjust taxation of Ireland ; but in the present pro position it was intended to deal only w;th the rich people of that country.—( Hear, hear.) From the feeling that ap peared to exist in the liou , e upon this subject, he had no hesitation in saying that those who now occupied seats on the Treasury benches, as well as those on the other side, who held commissions in the army, were too much in the habit of regarding their places as family-seats, and all were too often found on the same side of the House. Yes, he yrottld say again, that Hon. Members on the Ministerial side were too often to be found joining Hon. Members on the Opposition side on the voluntary principle—(Laughter)—while those on the Opposition side were to be equally often found supporting the Right Hon. Baronet on the compulsory principle.—( Great laughter.) lie had been led to understand that even now there was a n egotiation going on fur a conciliation measure with Ireland, between the Noble Lord the Member for London and some of the Opposition Members.—(Laughter.) Now, if the papers were in a sufficiently forward state, he would move that they be laid upon the table of the House.—(Laughter.) i o e u d n , t in pecu n i ary matters. —( L aug h ter. ) lie had heard much of justice to Ireland ; but he would say that, if this proposition was not carried, the r e wou ld no t b e y hat was m ean t b y t h e o f ten - repeate d phrase of " Hereditary bondsmen don't k now ."--( Sh ou t s o of laughter.) He was not for taxing the lower orders of th e j l u f s t t h i e i es done e e not t th c a a t r r c Irish people ; but if the income-tax were imposed upon the landlords of that country, he could not agree that the result would not be an outbreak in that country, because those who had to pay it were bound to keep the peace by the best passible security—namely, the preservation of their own interests.— ( Hear, hear.) He had now nearly concluded ; but be fore he did so he hoped, before the close of this de bate, to hear some Honourable Member reply to the unanswerable speech of the Hon. Member for Dungarvon. —( Loud laughter.) There was to be a remission of taxes to a large amount, in Ireland, on sugar and on glass ; and, there fore, if there were not an equivalent imposed, he could tell the House that great discontent would be created, for the cnmmer cial interests of this country were crawlingly alive to such con duct.—( Loud laughter.) Mr. WILLIAMS had listened with attention to the speech of the Hon Member for Dungarvon, but he regretted to say he had heard no arguments adduced in it which convinced him that this tax should not be imposed on the landlords of Ireland. He ( Mr. Williams) did think that any landlord in Ireland, whether he had 1,000., or 10,0001, or 20,0001. a-year, should pay this tax as well as the tradesmen in England, who had: only 15W. a-year profit by their trade. Now the proposition he ( a:r. Williams) would make was, that those persons in Ireland who received their incomes out of the public money, should pay this tax, as well as they did in England. He should like to know why the Lord-Lieutenant of Ireland, who received about 2i),0001. a-year of the public money, should not pay this tax. He would likewise wish to know w by the Chief Secretary of Ireland did not pay this tax? That officer had 500/. a -year more than the Secretary of State for the Home Department, and not half so much to do, and yet he had not this tax to pay. Neither was it paid by the judges of Ireland, who received an aggregate sum of 150,0001. a-year of the public money. He had before him documents by which to prove that in fifteen years, between 1821 and 1841, Ireland paid only one-twelfth of the taxes ; in fifteen years, only one-thirteenth ; and in five yea's, only one-six teenth ; while in the year 1844, the amount of taxes paid by Ireland did not exceed 4,097,0 0 01., and England paid, in the same year, 51,000,000 i. He thought that great injustice had been done to Ireland; but he would contend fur it that in the item of taxes that country had been most remarkably pro tected. It was well known that one-third of the Crown patronage in this country had been bestowed on Ireland— ( Cries of " No, no") —and therefore, if the Right Hon. Baronet did not give good reasons for not extending this tax to Ireland, he ( Mr. Williams) would persevere in his motion. There were many articles of import on which small duties were levied, which cost so much in the collection that it was not worth while to retain them, at the same time that the loss of time and the vexation which the collection occasioned could only be known to the importers.—( Hear, hear.) If the Customs' duties on fifty articles were repealed, the sacrifice of revenue would not be more than half a million.--( Hear, hear.) 'faking the cost of collection of the stamp duties, the income tax, the assessed taxes, and the window-tax, it amounted only to 430,0001., and that was for the collection of 16,850,000/., or about one-fourth of the whole revenue. If all the taxes were collected at the same rate, the cost would be only 1,600,000/. for the collection of 59,000,000/., 93 that a vast amount could be saved by raising the revenue from other sources than the vexatious taxes that came under the head of Customs and Excise. At the same time, he admitted that no one could find fault with the reductions which the Right Hon. Baronet had made, although it was to be wished that he had made more, and chosen other articles. Now, he must say that there was not in the who'e history of taxation an instance of a burden so heavy imposed upon the same amount of population as now pressed upon the people of Great Bri tain.—( Hear, hear.) We were now in the thirtieth year of peace, and the taxation was as heavy as at the height at the war. The Right Hon. Baronet opposite (Sir J. Graham) had written a book—( A laugh)—in which he proved, that, taking into account the state of the currency, although the nominal amount of the taxation in the year 1813 (the most expensive of the war), was 81,000,0001., it was re .lly equal only to 52,000,000/. He could see no reason for the increase of the naval expenditure, which was to be greater in this year of profound peace than it was in 1841, when we had 26 ships of the line at sea.—( Hear) He did not, however, object to keeping the navy which was the best defence of the country, hut he objected altogether to the proposed increase of the arm y.; The average amount of the army in 10 years, when the Whigs were in office (and they had enough to do with war in China and other places on their hands), was 105,059, but now in profound peace it was to be 129,0(h) men, with an increase besides of 2,500 marines, and 10,000 armed pensioners.— ( Hear, hear.) He trusted that when the Right Hon. Baronet came to the estimates he would be prepared either to satisfy the House of a necessity for the i ncrease, or to make a consider able reduction.—( Hear.) When the present amendment was disposed of, he should move that the tax upon income he ex tended to salaries in Ireland. Mr. ROSS would not at present go into a discussion of all the questions which the Hon. Gentleman had introduced. But he would say that his proposition for extending the income tax to Ireland had so much the appearance of justice that he (Mr. Ross) might probably feel it his duty to vote with the Honourable Gentleman if it came to a di vision.—( Hear.) As to the Hon. Member for Bath he would only say that, if the Hon. and Learned Gentleman were placed in the situation of the Right Hon. Baronet, he would not have ventured to bring forward his present proposi tion.—(" Hear, hear, from Sir R. Peel.) There were con siderations of policy which, i n some eases, must weigh against a proposition which had abstract justice in its favour.—( Hear.) The present position of Ireland was so very peculiar, that the income-tax could not be applied to that country, and he re gretted exceedingly the sentiments addressed by the lion. Member for 'lath to the landlords of the sister kingdom. They were at all times ready to subscribe to agricultural and medical institutions for the relief of the deserving poor. He thought then it would be injurious at this period to extend the income tax to Ireland, and he trusted that, hereafter, this debate might lead Hon. Gentlemen to entertain sympathetic views towards Ireland. He entreated them not to turn their hearts against its rni•fortunes, but he felt assured that the debate would not be closed without a bette r f ee li ng b e i ng pro d uce d towards that unhappy country. Every one knew the suffer ings it had lately undergone. It had been disturbed by poli tical comrnotions, and was it right, now that the public mind was becoming soothed, to pass an Act which would disturb the better feeling which was beginning to be engendered ovi th 6 other side of the channel towards this country.--(Cheers.) Lord BERNARD said, connected as he was with Ireland by birth and other ties, he could not quietly listen to the sen timents which had been expressed with regard to the landlords of that country. Before, however, he proceeded to discuss that question, he would ta ke leave to refer to the opening part of the speech of the lion : Member for Dungarvon. The Hon. Gentleman had co mplained that Ireland was not fairly repre sented in the Legislature of the United Kingdom ; but he could distinctly state that this was not the fact. The Hon. and Learned Member for Bath had charged the landlords of Ire land with desiring to shrink from sustaining their share of the burdens which the exigencies of the times required to be im posed on the country. If there was a great financial scheme to be carried —if measures were to be proposed from which it was reasonable to anticipate most important benefits would result, he was sure that the landlords of Ireland would not be found shrinking from bearing their part of the national burden. But the Right Hon. Baronet,when he bi ought forward the income tax, thought it was expedient that it should not be extended to Ireland. What did the Hon. Member for B,th propose? He proposed to do one of two things—he either proposed to tax the real property of Ireland, or else he proposed to tax the whole of the country. Now if it were merely the landed property in Ireland which he proposed to tax, he would tell him that the national exchequer derived an equivalent for the income-tax in the stamp duty. But there was another ground on which it was decided not to extend the income-tax to Ireland three years ago. There was no machinery in Ireland by which the tax could be collected. The expense of its collection would swallow up the larger part of the sum to be collected ; and he agreed with the Right Hon. Baronet that the substitution of an equivalent l was more ad vantageous to the interests of the nation. n the reigns of Richard 111. and Henry VIII. a ta x of four shillings in the pound was imposed on the landed proprietors to prevent absen teeism. In 1775 the tax was reduced to two shillings in the pound. But this all equally failed to bring Hon. Baronet, landed in proprietors to the country. But the Right t h held e out an induce not extending the income-tax to Ireland, it ought to be ment to those whose duty and Inclination ' .ster to the of to reside upon the property, and to minister to theirwants those whom Providence had committed n tended to restrict the tax If the Hon. and Learned M e mber to the landlords of Ireland, how little would it produce to the revenue ! For was it not notor ious that a great proportion of in mortgages, and in the rental of Ireland was paid away estates by their re ducingances- incumbrances imposed upon the these mortgages and in tors ? Was it not equally true that in England, who cumbrances were paid to persons residinghis countr i y ? He did paid the income-tax out of them in t the income-tax to Ireland, be lieve, then, if they were to extend t proceeds of the stam p Learned Gentleman meant to duty. But if the Hon. and Ireland say that the tax was to be extended throughout nsider what had been the gene rally, he would urge upon him to co to the present time. peculiar position of that country up twelve months ago ? He What was the state of that country larg w hen he stated that e spoke from personal experienc e masses were in the habit of being c ol ected ( H ear, , hear, from Sir R. Peel)—for the purpose of intimidating the Govern ment. It must be remembered , also, that at this time dread ful and simultaneous fires occurred, which were accompanied by the most ominous silence amongst all parties, so as to leave ao doubt who were the originators of them. When he looked at these circumstances, and remembered that the judicious comae and the firmness evinced by her Majesty's Government in that_ o Ireland country had restored peace, tranquillity, anti happiness, h thought it unwise to extend a burd en to which would be productive of no practical g cool. He sp oke from p ersonal experience, and h e could assure the house that it would be an unwise step to adopt the a mendment of the Hon. and Learned Member. Men who a short timo ago were engaged in organising large bodies of men, for the purpose of con spiracy, were now laying out their money in improving their farms, and devoting themselves with no secondlhen that was the object to the im proving the condition' of tha country. When case, was it within the pale of political wisdom to come forward and create another source of discord in the country ? As an county of Somerset. What did the manufacturers say to 'this? Why they were delighted with the seheme of the Right Honourable Baronet. It was said he relieved the springs of industry—why, what was the fact? :Manchester was bribed—Glasgow was bribed—and so were Newcastle and Sunderland. They said they could not compete with foreign countries unless their labourers worked certain hours. if manufacturers were honest in their measures to aid the labouring population, they would vote with him in endea vouring to put this tax upon the rich landlords of Ireland. They were beyond any appeal he could make ; if he were a money-lender he might be able to appeal to them, but not dealing in that commodity he could not reach their understandings. But he was about to appeal to those who professed to represent the Irish people. What, did not the Right Honourable Baronet say all his phrases were significant, and he watched him always, not to find, like the Hon. Baronet, that he was a difficult bird on whose tail to put salt.—(Laughter.) The Right Hon. Baronet had put a stamp duty on Ireland, but he asked him to tax the land of Ireland. The Right Hon. Baronet taxed the capital engaged in the employment of labour in Ireland. The stamp duty was a tax on the transfer of all sorts of property, and was almost entirely paid by the middle class of that country, arid a large portion of it tell on both the middling and labouring population. Now the lion. and Learned Member for Dungarvon had hinted to hint, the other evening, that he should take advantage of the adjournment of this debate to read Burke's speech on the con ciliation of America. Now, what was in the lion. and Learned Gentleman's mind when he reminded him of America? Why, revolution ! That the English Government might be fright ened into an unjust tax, because the people of Ireland were in such a turbulent state that they could not put a just tax upon them. That was the intrepretation of considering the speech of Mr. Burke, but he was sure the Right lion. Gentleman could not have had this notion in his mind. The grand argument of that speech was, that America was not politically represented. Did the Right Hon. Gentleman mean to say that Ireland was not politically represented? An HoN. MEMBER—Not fully. Air. ROEBUCK—Wait a minute! They had given Ire land some Members. Where were they now ?—(Cheers.) What was the use of giving them any more if those they had already given them were of no use to them ? They ran from their posts—they deserted them like a sentinel placed in a dangerous situation, who could not keep his heart up to the difficulty of his position, threw down his musket. turned tail and ran away.—( Hear, hear.) They had deserted the ground on which the battle of the people of Ireland must be fought.—(Cheers.) He did not accuse the leading Irish Member upon that occasion—he did not mean him individually, but the whole of his followers, who, like him, had run away. They had done so because in that House they felt they were unable, from their own personal in significance, to gain the attention of Honourable Ale,nbers. That he took to be the rationale of Conciliation-hall. He hoped the lion. Member would abstain, after that night, from plead ing the unequal representation of Ireland as any justification for the existence of unequal taxation between the two coun tries. He would not impose any injustice upon any one. lie would be the last person to sanction an act of injustice, but he wanted the Irish Members to show to him the injustice of his proposal.—( Hear, hear.) If they pointed to the stamp duty, he would say change it, because it was a tax which fell upon the actual capital of the country. He said, then, charge it by all means, and place it upon the landlords of Ireland.—( Hear, hear.) Mark how they had been dealt with. The power of governing the country had been conceded to them. Within the last few years a large portion of the tithes of the country had been given to them, and every man who bought an estate now bought with it some of the tithes of the country. Why should they not be taxed, then, in the same way as the landlords and hard-working citizens of England?--(Hear. ) rhe commercial interests in that House were asked to sanc tion this impost by the small ' bribe" (he might as well call it, as it was, that word) offered them, while they were also called upon to bear with the extra tax upon income, in order to relieve the landlords of Ireland. Now, mark well, his point was not with any class in Ireland, but the untaxed landlords of that country. I Irish landlord paid no assessed taxes ; he came now to this country—to this city, and brought his horses and carriages, and lived here in lodgings, and yet he was not called on to pay taxes for them ; while if he (Mr. Roebuck) wished to ease his infirmities by keeping a horse he should pay taxes for it.—( Laughter.) The Right Hon. Gentleman near him (addressing Mr. Sheil) might keep his three horses and a carriage here if he chose, and live in lodgings, and pay no taxes for them, while he (Mr. Roebuck), if he kept but one horse, down came th e tax-gatherer. (Loud laughter.) Those Irish landlords, those lords of thousands, came to London, travelled to Paris—Brussels—the Nile, came back again, lived here, but—no taxes—(Laughter)--while if he (Air. Roebuck) left his home and took a little recreation elsewhere, there was his house ready to be seized by the iron grasp of the never. failing tax-gatherer, whether he (Mr. Robuck) was there or not.—(Laughter.) Then let the House losk at the la bours of the professional man of this country, who, though his earnings were the result of nights of hard toil, yet had to pay a tax upon income. —(Hear, hear.) The Hon. Member concluded by proposing his amendment, which was to the effect that the property-tax be extended to Irelend. Mr. SHELL said he would commence by saying to the lion. Member who had just sat down, that though he had done him the honour of payin g him a compliment in the allusion he had made, he regretted he could not reciprocate the compliment.—(Cries of "Hear, hear.") His lion. Friend had adverted to the absence of many Irish re presentatives from the United Parliament. Now, he (Mr. Sheil) felt great sympathy with his absent friends, although lie had not thought it judicious or consistent with his duty to his own constituents to follow their example.—( Loud cheers. ) At the same time he should be very sorry to impugn their mo tives, for their case was this, that Ireland was not adequately represented. 'the case they made was, that the county of Cork returned only five Members, whereas the principalities of Wales, with a smaller population, returned thirty-three Members. Many large towns had no representatives at all, whereas every insignificant town in England, with 2.000 inha bitants, returned two Members. They said that they had not the benefit of English institutions. But his Hon. Friend ( Mr. Roebuck) was willing to give them the benefit of such English institutions as the same Church, the same income tax, but not the same registration or representation. They sail that they had tried for fourteen years since the Reform 13 11, to obtain ju,tice.—(llear, hear.) They despaired of success. 'they were overwhelmed by the majority of English and Scotch Members, and they thought it better to try the pressure out of doors.—( Cheers.) Nut by force, but by a gentle kind of violence.—(Cheers and laughter.) They thought that by these means, more effectually than by their presence in Parliament, they might induce that power and the Government] to give them the benefit of English institutions. —( Hear, hear.) The lion. Member for Kendal wished the income-tax to be perpetuated, and the Hon. Member for Bath ished it to be infinite—(Hear, hear, and laughter)—so that between them they would have it a divioc tax.—( Laughter. ) He ( Mr. Sheil) did venture, between Tuesday morning and Wednesday evening, to refer to the speech of the Hon. Member fur Bath, and he did think that that speech contained some most admirable admonitions. That speech was said to be imbued with some of the spirit of a distinguished individual formerly a Member of that House, and he did believe that, on a review of the efforts of that great man, that this to which his ob servation had been directed was the most important, if not the very best. It exhibited that great man in all the fulness of his po , ser, as comprehensive and sound in judgment as he was bright in imagination and brilliant in idea. If the Hon. Mem ber had drawn from such a source, he had drawn with advan tage ; and he did suspect that he observed something of the spirit of his original in those forcible addresses which he had heard in that House when the Hon. Member was warning the Government of the day not to interefere with the rights of the colonies, and when in estimating their supplies he emphatically coejured them not for a moment to attempt to lay hands on the revenues of Canada. Now, what was the course the Hon. Member was now pursuing? He was attempting to induce the Government to violate the very principle of which he him self hail, but a few years ago, been such an able advocate. No such plan as the Hon. Member for Bath had recommended had ever been adopted. For when the income-tax had first been laid onby Mr. Pitt, in 1791, which was before the union, ro attempt had been made to extend the impost to Ireland. The income-tax was re pealed in 1803, at the end of the war. The emergency which occasioned it had passed away. It was always considered a war tax—a tax to be imposed on the arising of extraordinary necessity, and reasons of emergency alone could justify it. On the renewal of the war in 1804 it was again imposed, but even then, notwithstanding all the outlay of this country, it was not extended to Ireland. Neither Lord Sidmouth, nor Mr. Pitt, nor Mr. Percival, nor Lord Liverpool, had ever thought of extending the income-tax to Ireland, and he (Mr. Sheil) did doubt whether after these experiments and occasions— extreme occasions—any attempt to extend such a measure to Ireland could be made of any profitable avail, and he did think that it would be a little, as well as an unwise at tempt, to draw on the confined resources of Ireland to swell the g Aden Vactolus of British opulence.—( Hear, hear. ) It was true that the revenues of Ireland exceeded the legitimate expenses of that country ; it did not exceed the debt of Ire land, but that debt was created by its connexion with this country. It was hard, after suffering all that had been cast upon them by this country, they should put upon them the in come-tax. The ground and quit rents of Ireland had been spent upon Windsor Castle and on the improvement of Lon don. —( lean ) More than a million had been expended of those rents in that way. The Right Hon. Baronet, as he un derstood, intended to extend the means of Catholic education in Ireland ; could not, he would ask them, the ground and quit rents of Ireland be applied to that purpose? He thought to place an income-tax on the people of Ireland would be unjust and impolitic. If they were to extend the income tax to Ireland the lion. Member for Donegal would at once join the repealers.—( Laughter.) He would at once take the Grey Porter view of it, and he would become a sympathiser with the Concilliation-hall. In 1782 the Irish extorted the independence of their Parliament from this country, and there were men who thought before they died to see that inde pendence restored again. —( Cries of " Hear," and cheers.) Before he sat down—which he should very soon do—he should be able to show that, without imposing the income-tax on Ire land, they might raise a large amount of revenue. Saving was equivalent to gain.—( Hear, hear.) He was surprised his Hon. Friend, the Member for Montrose, the other night, should have forgotten his usual topics ; under the influence of the eloquence of the Right lion. Baronet, he seemed even to forget himself. Ile did not say a word about saving the revenue, or economy, or the reductions that might he made in the army in Ireland under a better system of government. His Hon. Friend had often pointed out how two thousand men were enough for Scotland, and the evil of keeping up so large a force in Ire land. But on that occasion his Hon. Friend, who was gene rally as watchful as the dragon that kept guard over the Golden Fleece, was lulled to sleep by the persuasive eloquence of the Right lion. Baronet, and yielded to the enchantments of that fascinating financier !—(Great laughter.) But his Hon. Friend was quite right in the positions he had so often laid down. They could, by conferring good government on Ire land, effect an essential saving. If they would adapt their in stitutions to Ireland, instead of adapting Ireland to their insti tutions—( Hear, hear)—the phrase was an antithesis, but it was fall of truth—if they would adapt their institutions to Ire land, instead of adapting Ireland to their institutions—they would make money of them. Peace was a great happiness; let them not inflict merely a temporary tranquillity on that coun try ; let them make it a perpetual peace.—(Cheers.) Peace would make it a larger contributor to their revenue. Peace would increase its import duties—peace would make it consume more sugar and coffee—peace would enable it to take more British manufactures—peace Would throw open a vast field of enterprise—and its the prosperity of Irelandl they would for all their munificence be usuriously repaid.—(Loud cheering.) Sir J. T YRRELL, after congratulating the House on the :liiierianyotofineloq h u is en o c vr e n p the e y rs h a a n d e h a e h a ib rd it tha a t n eevaenaminpgl,esaoidf, agri cultural cultural distress—( Immense laughter)—yet he hoped it would be conceded to him that distress was in the habit of meeting with " strange bedfellows."—(Renewed laughter.) lie was aware that many Gentlemen in that House were not inclined to support any proposition coming from the Hon. Mem ber opposite, by reason of his entertaining extreme opinions on certain political subjects; but he ( Sir J. Tyrrell) now trusted to the courage of his'agricultural friends around him—( A laugh ) —that they would pluck up their courage—(Laughter)—and tha, he would see by the announcement in to-morrow's papers, thought the reduction in the duty of cotton would produce. So far as Ireland was concerned, a greater loon could not be given, for it would encourage their manufactures ; and when they considered the water power, and the magnificent rivers of Ireland, might they not hope, at some future time, the com merce of t Ise country would be increased. The western part of Ireland was peculiarly adapted for manufacturing purposes; but now they were compelled to go to Liverpool for their cotton. He hoped, however, to see the time when ships direct from the States of America would he found landing their cargoes on the coast of Ireland. Let the House remember the agricultural advantages of Ireland. Ile could assure those Hon. Gentle men who talked so much of the abstract principles of free trade, • . . . that Ireland would posse s the means of affording this country ample and sufficient food, if they would only assi.t her in de ssnloping the resources of the country. if th y would only int prove her situation, he was sure that, at no distant day, she would be able to minister to the wants of the increasing popu- . lation of England. It was his firm conviction that she would yet be the means of saving this country from being humbled in the dust to ask for food from a foreign nation.—( Cheers. ) Mr. BELLEW concurred in the latter sentiments of the Noble Lord, for he believed the resources of Ireland had never been sufficiently developed. He thought it was in the power her Majesty's Government to make her a flourishing and prosperous country.—( Hear, bear.) Be'ore the income-tax could be extended to Ireland there were two things to be con sidered—first, that there was an easy mode of collecting it ; and secondly, that the country was in a prosperous condition, both as regarded agriculture and manuractures. But Ireland was more of an agricultural thaw a manufacturing country, arid they must recollect that only one million of the tax collected in England was contributed by the landed interest. Now how strongly did this show the inexpediency of extending this tax to Ireland, where two-th rds of the population were engaged in agri culture. Before the union the taxation of Ireland had been three millions. But what was the fact between that time—the year Isol—and 1807, the taxation of Ireland had been increased by mere than 500,0001. a year, and this he thought a sufficient answer to those Hon. Gentlemen who thought that a tax of this nature should be imposed on that country. In putting to them this statement, he felt that it was a sufficient ground for his opr.osition to the tax. While such claims were made on property, and while Ireland became in this way involved in the debts of Great Britain in an unequal degree, considering her previous position, was it fair that a property-tax should now be imposed on the country ? He ( Mr. Bellew) asked Euglish gentlemen whether it was right to impose taxes on Ireland when so little c imperatively had been taken away from the taxes imposed upon her ? Much had been said respecting the lighter burdens imposed upon Ireland, as if that were a coerce of encouragement for absentees.—( Hear, hear.) But he felt assured that all those who were intimate with the ac- tual position of that country, would be aware that no such in ference could fairly be drawn, and he did not think that the Hon. and Learned Member for Bath had exercised a wise discretion in now presaing this tax on the country, on which so much had already been imposed which she was not entitled to bear. Mr. NEWDIG ATE said that he would not trespass long upon the House, and that he would not have trespassed upon them at all, were it not that he did not think that the Hon. Gentlemen with whom he acted ought tamely to submit to the calumnies which had been heaped upon them by the Hon. hlember for Bath. Calumnies which he felt for himself indeed —and he did not doubt but other Members on his side of the House felt the same—were as gross as they were groundless and mistimed, foul, and invidious, and unjustifiable.—(Loud cries of " Hear, hear," " Order," " Chair," during which the Hon. Member attempted for a short time to proceed.) Mr. C. BULLER said that the use of such an expression as foul calumnies was clearly contrary to the usage of the House and such as could not be tolerated when used by one Member towards another, and he protested against it. Mr. GREENE said that the Hon. Member was certainly out of order, in the use of the expressions which he had just ap plied to the speech of the Hon. Member for Bath. Mr. NEWDIGATE begged to apologise to the House for the words which had just fallen from him, but the expressions of the Hon. Member for Bath had been so strong, that he felt bound to meet them with terms equally strong. Con nected as he was with the county with which :the Right Hon. Baronet at the head of the Government was so largely concerned, he would have been glad to hear his interpreta tion of the question which the Hon. Member for Bath had brought forward, and the position which he took up. He did think that if a property-tax we .e to be imposed upon Ireland, it would be one way of reaching the absentees from that country. But this he thought would be a miserable policy, and if the Honourable Member for Bath attempted in this way to enlist the Members with whom he acted, he believed he would be disappointed, and if he wished, like the Knight of La Mancha, to attack windmills, he (Mr. Newdigate) thought that he could not have taken a more effective course for se curing his object.—( Hear, hear, and laughter.) Mr. MUNTZ said, that nothing had been said on this part of the subject by which Hon. Members should be influern ed. When he saw that gentlemen connected with Ireland could go there and enjoy the great remission of taxes which was en joyed by the people of that country, and then give nothing for it, he did think that there was no sufficient argument. in the replies to what had been alleged by the Hon. Member for Bath, and ‘shen he saw that those gentlemen could go and take such large sums from that country, and spend them in various parts of Europe, he felt assured, that next to a tax on absenteeism an imposition on realised property was the next best tax. Mr. ROEBUCK said the best argument which could pos sibly be adduced of correctness in debate was the loss of one's temper.—(" Oh, oh," and disapprobaticn.) Sir 11. BARRON said that he felt assured that the House would feel that the Hon. and Learned Member for Bath had totally failed in establishing his results. Bef ire he entered upon the main question, he would beg to show the mistake into which the Hon. and Learned Member for Bath had fallen, with respect to the attendance of Irish Members in that House. He would beg to assure the Hon. and Learned Member, that when he imputed the absence of those Members to any other than the real cause, that he evinced only gross and palpable ignorance of the characters of those whom he maligned, and that he used expressions in their absence which he would not dare to utter if those gentlemen were present ; and he defied that Hon. Member to repeat the expressions which he h-id used, when those Hon. Gentlemen were present.—( Loud cries of " Hear, hear," " Order, order," " Chair, chair." The CH AIRMAN interposed, and said that the Hon. Mem ber was out of order. Sir 11. BARRON said, that what the Hon. and Learned Member said with respect to those Irish Members who were absent was incorrect. But he would now come to the facts; and in giving those facts, he would not depend upon any opinion of his own, on the knowledge of this or that man, either in or out, of the House, but upon returns laid, by order of a Select. Committee appointed for the purpose, on the table of that House. Before 180 I—before the union with this country took place—the Funded Debt of Eng land was 450,000,0001., and, in the year 1816, this debt had increased to 764,000,000/. The Irish Debt at the time he first mentioned was only 28,000,0001., but, in 1816, this Debt had accumulated to 118,000,000/. The Debt of Great Bri tain had not been doubled in that time, while that of Ireland had absolutely quadrupled within the same period. Now, in return for this burden, what benefits had been conferred upon Ireland in the way of taxation? Why, between 1816 and 1842, as much as 40,000,000/. of annual taxation had been re mitted to England; while, in Ireland, the whole amount of relief had been only 2,000,000/., or hardly one-twentieth part of the remission of taxes which had been made to this country. At the time the union took place, the agreement entered into was, that Ireland should bear two-seven teenths of the whole taxation of the Empire. But what had been the case? Had this agreement been adhered to ? No, the amount actually imposed was 2,000,000/. of Ireland, for 15,000,000/. for Great Britain. Mr. Foster, a man of the highest attainments, and who was speaker of the Irish House of Commons, and alerwards judge of that country, loudly appealed against the injustice, but in vain. He knew something of the state of Ireland, and this was the deliberate opinion •f one whose word was to be de pended on, and not of one perfectly ignorant of the subject on which he professed to speak.—( Hear, hear.) On a reference to Hansard's Debates he found that the taxation of Ireland which had been 440,000/. was increased in 1810 to 4,200,000/. and in 1816 to 5,760,000/. Another authority to whom he would refer was Lord Fitzgerald. No one who knew him ( Sir H. Barrow) would suspect him of any strong political bias for that nobleman, and he might, therefore, assume that in citing him as an authority he was citing one on whom all might depend for evidence on the matter in hand. He would refer to a letter of that nobleman, which had been written to Mr. Foster in 1816. That Noble Lord then stated that the people of Ireland paid 45 000,000/. of taxes mare than she contracted to pay at the time of the union; and yet it was said she was not taxed enough ; that the income-tax ought to be placed upon her, as it was the only panacea for all the ills of Ireland. He was confident that every gentleman in the House who understood the question would vote against the proposition of the Hon. Member for Bath.—( Hear, hear.) Ile thought there was in the condition of Ireland that which justified any one in stating that the income-tax, as it respected Ireland, was a most im politic and unjust tax. If they had not laid on a shilling of taxation on Ireland they would, in his opinion, have done no more than their duty.—( Hear, hear.) Ireland required im provement, for by withdrawing the Parliament from her, they had withdrawn a great number of rich landlords, their con nexions and friends.—( Dear, hear.) It was the duty of England to make many sacrifices in order to improve the con dition of Ireland.—( Hear, hear.) At the present moment Ire land was over-taxed; there was not a country in Europe with her resources which was so heavily taxed as Ireland. The landlords of Ireland had been greatly injured by the alterations that had taken place in the tithes, added to which there was a strong dissatisfaction at the. present moment at the state of Ireland; and he trusted that the time was not far distant when all party differences would be laid aside, and Ireland would again become happy and free. Ireland could be governed by the heart easier perhaps than it could by the sword.—( Hear, hear.) Ireland had been too great!) taxed.—( [[ear, hear.) It was true that the Govern ment had now found that out, and were about to increase the grant for education. They had also sent Commissioners to inquire into the state of land in that country, but it would have been much better if they had done it sooner.—( Hear, hear.) Colonel CONOLLY thought if anything was calculated to injure Ireland it was the proposition of the Hon. Member for Bath. The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER said it was impossible, holding the situation he did, that he should permit this question to come to a decision without stating his opinion with respect to it. Whatever credit he should be inclined to give the Hon. and Learned Gentleman who had brought the matter forward on many occasions, he could not give him credit for much skill, or the manner in which he had brought a subject forward that would create the greatest dissa tisfaction in Ireland, and the most disastrous consequences, perhaps endangering the peace of the country itself.—( Hear, hear.) The Hon. Gentleman had expressed himself strongly with respect to the absence of many of the Irish Members from that House during the discussion on that subject. He would give no opinion with respect to that, but he thought it never could be said that the British House of Commons would, in consequence of that absence, neglect the interests of that country. lie was satisfied that that night they woul l prove to the people of Ireland, and those who had absented them selves from the house, that the presence of the Irish Members was not necessary to enforce the House to do justice to the people of Ireland.—( Hear, hear.) He now came to the imme diate subject before the House, namely, whether it was expedient that they should propose an income-tax on real property in I reland.—( [fear, Hear.) In im posing all taxes, they must be guided by the condition and circumstances of each country, or they might place on one a tax that, though it appeared to be equal, would be, is reality, very unequal and very unjust. In 1842, when he proposed the income-tax for England, he had directed his inquiries to the subject of an income-tax in Ireland. The result of that in quiry WP9 that, though they might impose a tax that would prove a neavy burden, yet the returns to the Exchequer would be little, if anything, more than at present. In England they had long been subject to a heavy load of taxation.—(" Hear, hear," and laughter.) They had been accustomed to raise a large amount of revenue, partly by direct and partly by in direct taxation, and throughout this country they .had esta blished a machinery for collecting the land tax, the assessed taxes, and others, that had never been imposed upon Ireland. Therefore we could here collect a greater amount of revenue, at a much smaller expense, than they could hope to do in Ire land. where all the machinery of collection would have to be established. But tot being able to impose the income tax on Ireland, he had made an addiction to the stamp duties in that country, bringing them up to the same amount as that paid in England.—( Hear, hear.) The Hon, and Learned Membet for Bath had proposed that the tax should be confined to real and landed property in Ireland, and he had at the same time told the House that that property was for the most part very much burdened, and that the debts on it were generally held by persons in this country. He would see, there fore, that the amount of revenue to be derived from Ireland would on this account be considerably diminished. The Hen. Member for Coventry had proposed to extend the income-tax to the Government officers in Ireland, but the wording of the amendment of the Hon. and Learned Member for Bath ex- pressly excluded those persons from the operation of the tax.— ( Hear, hear.) The Hon. member for Coventry should also remember that the officers employed in Ireland were paid by Ireland, and if they had exempted that country generally from the operation of a tax, he thought there would be no justice whatever in selecting one particular class, and fixing it on them, because they were more obnoxious to the tax or more helpless than any other class of the community. This was not an occasion on which he could follow the Honourable Member for Coventry through all the remarks he had made on the estimates; they would shortly come before the House in detail, and he should then be prepared to prove to the Hon. Gentleman that they mere framed with a due regard to eco nomy and with a due consideration to the permanent interests of the country. There were other Lion. Gentlemen who had spoken during the evenini, who hod alluded to various political considerations, which they thought re, dered it inadvisable to impose the income tax on Ireland. Into those considerations he did not think it necessary to enter. Having established the position that, as a tax, it would not be productive, he thought it unnecessary to enter into any other reasons for not imposing It. With these observation he should leave the question in the hands of the House, trusting that the House, in the absence of a large portion of the Irish Members, would prove that Eng lishmen do not desire to impose burdens on them, but that their cause would be effectually fought by the English Members whenever Irish interests were concerned. Mr. HUME said it appeared to him the debate had taken a turn that it ought not to have done, from an erroneous view of what they were called on to consider. He thought the income tax an odious one ; but as the Right Hon. Baronet stated that it was to be a temporary one, he should not wish to make any alteration in it as regarded Ire • land. But he thought the Honourable and Learned Member for Bath had been misunderstood. He denied that the income-tax would be an injustice to Ireland, as it would only fall on those who could afford to pay it ; and it should be remembered that Ireland would have a fair share in all the benefits arising from the present remission of taxation. He therefore thought it would be but fair that she should bear a part of the burdens which enabled the Government to make them. The increase in the stamp-duty paid by Ireland was only 229,000/. on a revenue of 454,000/ derived from that source. This was all the equivalent that Ireland paid for a burden of five millions borne by England. In dwelling on the injustice and hardship that would be done to Ireland by imposing this tax on it, the last speaker had really made a mountain of a mole-hill—and he was really quite surprised to hear him. Let Ireland, if she was to have her share of the remission of taxation, bear her fair share of the burdens also. Direct property had not borne a sufficient portion of that taxation ; for the last fifty years the middle and lower classes had paid no less than seventy-four per cent. of the whole amount of the taxation of the kingdom. England paid the tax because it was imposed by the Government, and the Government imposed it with very little consideration ; and why ? because those who did it, and who managed the affairs of the country, suffered very little from the imposition.— ( Hear, hear.) However, as this proposition of the Hen. Member for Bath would cause an entire change in the taxati in of England, which would very much benefit the country, the sooner it was made the better.—( Hear, hear.) He would ask why should not the House call upon Ireland to contribute her portion to this tax ? The change which the imposition of it would cause would be such as had not taken place in this country for the last forty years. It would have the effect of giving employment to thou sands, and benefit Ireland in a thousand ways, which he ceuld not now detail. Nothing could be taore easy than to bring into operation the machinery for the collection of the tax in Ireland ; but, if it should not be imposed, and that other taxes should be remitted in that country, the result would be that the tax would be imposed on the bee instead of the honey, and eventually the hive would be destroyed. He would tell the people of Ireland, that if they claimed equal rights with Eng land, they should bear an equal share of the public burdens.— ( Hear, hear.) He should like to see the property of that country fairly taxed, if the owners of it claimed equal rights with Englishmen ; but, if that tax should be imposed, that was no reason why such threats, as he had heard to-night, of murder, and rebellion, and fire, and all that, should be held out.— ( Laughter.) But, putting all this aside, le would say that Ireland should be made to hear a full and fair proportion of the taxes, and then let her call for equal privileges. —( Hear, and a laugh.) The income-tax, if extended to Ireland, would not be felt as heavily as was imagined, for there were very few farmers in that country who paid 3001. a year, and, therefore, all the burden of the tax would fall on the landlord ; and with regard to those persons i n I re l an d w h o d er i ve d th e ' r i nco m e s from public offices, he would like to know why they should not pay this tax ?—( Hear, hear.) For these reasons he would support the to tion. Sir ROBERT PEEL said he felt bound to declare that he gave the Hon. Member who had just sat down the fullest er, dit for an unusual degree of candour.—(Laughter.) It was most important to the Hon. Member's constituents that they should understand the consistency, integrity, and good sense, which characterised the statement of the Hon. Member in accounting for the vote he was about to give upon this ques tion.—( Renewed laughter.) The Hon. Member had said, in his speech, that if it had not been for the " foolish speech" of an Hon. Member at this aide of the House—(Laughter)—he would not have come to this conclusion.—(Lau g hter.) So that this side of the House h a d t o sa y th e y felt indebted to an indiscreet speech—(Laughter)—for the proposition of the Hon. Member (Mr. Hume) to make a total change in the system of taxation now in exercise in this country.— (Laughter.) Now, was it possible that such a change could have taken place in the sentiments of a gentleman who, for the last forty years, during which he had a seat in that House, had opposed every measure of a financial nature that had been brought forward.—( Hear, hear, and laughter.) But here let him ( Sir 11. Peel) say that, during those forty year 3, he readily admitted the great services that that Hon. Member had don, his country, although he hail never yet given him a vote —( Hear, hear, and laughter. ) However, he should say, he had almost anticipated the result of the Hon. Member's exer cise of his great judgment and perspicuity en this proposition, for he felt assured that he would upon this occasion give an honest vote.—( Laughter.) It should be admitted that, for the last forty years, the Hon. Member had paid the closest at tention to matters of finance, and always opposed what he con ceived to be unnecessary expenditure ; but the Hon. Mem ber having this night declared that it was in consequence of a fiialish speech from this side of the House that he would advo. cate increased taxation, he (Sir R. Peel) had been left com pletely at a loss what to say.---( Great laughter.) He ( Sir R. Peel) almost foresaw what the Hon. Member would have said about lowering the interest of money, and all that, but he should confess he was hardly prepared to hear that the Hon. Member would advocate increased taxation, because of an Hon. Member at that side of the House having delivered himself of a foolish speech.—(Great laughter.) In reference to the Hon. Member who had delivered that " foolish speech"—( Laughter)—let him say that lie most heartily congratulated that Hon. Gentle man upon that most felicitous speech—(Laughter)—for he (Sir lt. Peel) should say that he did think that a higher compli ment could not be paid any Member of the House than that the whole system of the taxation of the country was proposed to be altered because of the delivery of that speech. (Here the whole House burst into a general and loud fit of laughter, owing as much to the humorous tone of the Hon. Baronet's delivery, as to the mock gravity of his manner, while he turned round and bowed to the Hon. Member for Done gall. ) But to be serious, let the House consider what was the meaning of the speech of the Hon. Member. He ( Sir II Peel) was ready to admit that justice would require that this impost should be extended to Ireland—( Hear, hear) —and in the year 1841, when this tax was proposed to be imposed upon England, her Majesty's Government did not decide that it should not be extended to Ireland, until they had maturely considered the subject, and had found by calculation that the expenses of creating the machinery for the collection of it would not at all warrant such a step.—( Hear, hear.) And they had also !mind that the increased spirit duty, and -stamp duty upon Ireland, would prove more productive than the pro perty-tax possibly could.—( Hear, hear.) Therefore the Go vernment concluded that it would be better to require an equivalent from Ireland on account of other taxes than impose the one in question.--( Hear, hear.) Let Hon. Members re collect that no Minister of the Crown that he could call to mind, had proposed the imposition of this tax upon Ireland, not because Ireland should be peculiarly favoured at the expense of England, but because local causes and difficulties existed in that country that rendered the levy of it impossible without incurring an expenditure greater than the income.—( Hear ) But on looking at the immediate effect which would arise from the imposition of the income-tax and the removal of other taxes he found that, comparing the condition of Ireland with that of Great Britain, Ireland would not be dealt justly with.— ( Hear, hear.) Look at the facts. By the repeal of the cotton duty, the English manufacturer was benefited to the amount of 700,000/. a-year, whilst in Ireland the duty was no more than 114,000/.—( Hear, hear.) Certainly it was to be taken into consideration that most of the cotton wed in Ireland paid the duty in Liverpool. But he hoped to see the day when cotton would be imported into Cork, and Ireland would not be depen dent on Liverpool for the supply. —(Cheers.) By the remis sion of the auction duties England would be benefited to the amount of 274,000/., in Ireland only to 11,800/.—( Hear. ) In England the glass duties amounted to 774,0001.; in Ireland only to 5,5471.—( Hear, hear.) These facts established an important difference. (Hear, hear.) He wished he could convince the people w Ireland of the feelings which animated the Government of that House, calumniated as it was in Ireland.—(Cheers. ) For he believed that there would be a universal feeling of satis faction in that House, if they could see the manufacturers of that country enter into equal competition with the manufac turers of England.—( Hear, hear. ) Now, it was with great satisfaction that he heard his Hon. and Learned Friend the Member for Cork say, that in his country, with the prospect of better times, men who had devoted themselves to agitation were now directing their attention to the improvement of their estates. —( Hear, hear.) He agreed in the general proposition that the two portions of the empire should be placed upon an equal footing in respect to taxation, but that was not the pro position which the House was now called upon to affirm. In Great Britain, land, offices, profes sions, and trades, were subject to the income tax. But it was now proposed to subject in Ireland land only to the tax. Thatl was not equality. But in fret land was the property most affected in Ireland by the tax, for if the land. owner resided in England he was subject to the tax, which seemed as an inducement to him to reside in Ireland. After much consideration of the question the difficulties of construct ing the means of collecting the tax, and the different condition of Ireland to England, in respect to wealth, induced him— especially as the tax was only temporary—to adhere to his original proposition.—( Hear, herr.) The Hon. Member for Essex charged him with having cheered the Hon. and Learned Gentleman opposite, when be said the imposition of the tax on Ireland would be unjust. The word he cheered was "- impo litic," nor could he disregard the moral and political considerations which entered into this question. When he looked at the present condition of Ireland, and the pros pects which were opened to that country, when the minds of men were directed from political agitation to their own inte rests and the interests of the people—(Hear, hear)—he thought it would be wise for the House to relinquish the pecuniary advantage of one or two hundred thousand pounds, that might be derived from the income-tax, and to convince the people of Ireland that they were disposed to take an in dulgent view of Irish interests, and whilst they were willing to impose the tax for three years upon themselves, they were not disposed to extend it for the first time to Ireland. lie thought they would be compensated by the reciprocal feelings i of a people whose wants and necessities, and inferior position n re-pest to wealth, they were disposed to regard with kind feel ings.—( Cheers. ) Mr. Sergeant MURPHY said, that he had no appre hensions of the House acceding to the proposition of the Member for Bath, whose brilliant exhibition of talent and sparkling diction he listened to with pleasure, but with no less pleasure had he heard the magnificent answer of his Hon. Friend the Member for Dungarvon, whose speech roust be any thing but gratifying to the other side of the House.— (Cheers and laughter.) He would, however, read for them been received by the British Government until July, when they received a letter from Sir Robert Gordon, our Ambassador at Vienna, stating the facts of the case. The Aus trian Government strongly remonstrated with the British Go vernment for permitting the boat containing these 22 indivi duals to sail, which clearly showed that there had been no collu sion between the two Governments. These 22 individuals did land; the only account the British Government had received was conveyed to them in a letter from Mr. Temple, the British Minister at Naples. The British Government made no communication whatever to Mr. Temple, because his Noble Friend never suspected that 22 individuals, unarmed, and seemingly defenceless, would direct a project against the coast of Calabria. On the 26th of June Mr. Temple in formed the Government of what occurred on the landing of these individuals. He said that a party landed, twenty-two in number, thus confirming the previous report; and, on the night of the 19th of June, they fell in with a small force, con. sisting of a few civic officera and three gens-d'armes. An engagement took place, in which one of the twenty-two was killed. St. Giovanni, the judge of the town, collected a num ber of the inhabitants, by which the project was entirely de feated, and the result proved highly satisfactory to the Nea politan Government, inasmuch as the defeat of the party was owing to the courage and fidelity of the natives themselves. This answer to his Noble Friend was : that as they never suspected that 22 individuals, who had up to the present mo ment resided quietly in Corfu, would attempt to in vade the Italian shores from boats, they had never made any communication with them warning them from it ; at the same time they had never made any communication to the Austrian, Neapolitan, or the Roman Governments, and the reasons why they had not done so was, that they never suspected any such attempt was contemplated. He had now given the only answer he could give. Any im pression that the Government had allured these individuals to destruction was erroneous, and totally without foundation. THE INIAUM OF NIUSCAT. Mr. HUME wished to know whether there would be any objection to the production of the correspondence between the Imaum of Muscat and the present Government relative to the affairs of that country ? Sir R. PEEL hoped the Hon. Gentleman would put the question to-morrow. WINDOW-TAX. Lord DUNCAN postponed his motion with respect to the window-tax, which stood for to-morrow, till Monday. He had stated his intention to do so in the early part of the even ing, and he now repeated it in the presence of the Right Hon. Baronet. Mr. FERRAND wished to put a question to the Secretary of State for the Home Department. Three sessions ago, Mr. Moggeridge was appointed a Commissioner to go into the Inland counties, to inquire into the distress existing there. He had made his report, but it had not been laid on the table of the House. He wished to know whether it was intended to lay it on the table of the House? Sir JAMES GRAHAM said that the report had been reade, but not printed, as far as it was it would be laid on the table of the House. Mr. T. DUNCOMBE said that Members had been in formed that yesterday or to-day they were to be fur nished with the list of the articles on which the duty was to be taken off. Sir R. PEEL said that it had been found to be convenient to arrange the articles alphabetically, and as soon as that was done the list would be laid on the table. SPERM OIL. Mr. GEORGE SMITH wished to ask a question of the First Lord of the Treasury, which was of importance to a large class of persons. It was, whether it was the intt ntion of the Government only to reduce, or altogether to take off, the duty on sperm oil? Sir R. PEEL said the duty on sperm oil was not to be given up at once, but the Government did intend to provide for ulti mately relinqui-hing that duty ; but they would postpone it to such a period as not to interfere injuriously with existing inte rests. He might as well state now, that after the sth of Ja nuary, 1849—( Hear, hear, and laughter)—the duty on sperm oil should cease. SUGAR DUTIES. Lord JOHN RUSSELL asked when the exact resolutions proposed by the Government on the sugar duties would be laid on the table ? Sir R. PEEL said the House would be in possession of the resolutions to-morrow, and he was did hope that he should be able to furnish them this evening. In that case he hoped, in the discussion of the income-tax this evening, the sugar duties would not be debated, but would be left till those resolutions we • seen. Lord J. RUSSELL thought it would be more reasonable for the Right Hon. Baronet to postpone the consideration of the sugar duties till Monday. Sir It. PEEL thought the Hon. Member for Manchester had given a notice for equalising the duties on foreign and co lonial sugars on Friday next, and that there was no objection on the part of the Noble Lord to that discussion having prece dence of the Noble Lord's own resolution. Lor J. RUSSELL had no objection to that arrangement, supposing, after the Right Hon. Gentleman's motion was dis posed of, no further proceedings should be taken till Monday. Sir ROBERT PEEL said, his only object in all this was to prevent confusion in the trade, to which it was of great im portance that the opinien of the House should be known. He should have no objection to the discussion taking place on the motion of the Hon. Member for Manchester, on Friday next ; and on Monday they could take the discussion on the proposal of the Noble Lord. Mr. GIBSON said it was, then, to be understood that the question of the equalization of duty on sugar would take place on Monday next, and fur that purpose, he did not think it necessary to be provided with the particular details of the Go vernment measure. Mr. ESCOTT wished to know from the Chancellor of:the Exchequer, whether any time would be allowed to those who had paid the duty to clear off their stocks? The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER said that it was not the intention of the Government to allow any time. Mr. HUME wished to know whether, as the duty on sperm oil was to be taken off, the duty on common whale oil would also be taken off? Sir R. PEEL said it was the intention of the Government to take off the duty on whale oil, and at an earlier period than that at which it was to be taken off of sperm oil, because the same reasons did not exist in the case of whale oil for continuing the duty for so long a period. Mr. R. BLEWITT, before the Speaker left the chair, wished to ask the 11 ght lion. the Chancellor of the Exche quer a question respecting a paper that had been put into his hands that morning. He referred to the copy of the Naval 1 Receipts and Expenditure for the year ending the 24th of .March, 1844. It was a paper laid on the table of the House, in accordance with the provisions of an Act passed in the fourth year of the reign of William the Fourth, cap. 40, sec. 80. A certificate was attached to the paper in the following terms :--,. We, the Commissioners for auditing the publiq accounts, hereby certify that this account has been audited by the officers under our employ, and we declare the statements made therein to be correct and mtisfactery, subject to the notes and remarks by the Commissioners made thereon." This certificate was signed by three Commissioners, and he wished to call the attention of the Right Honourable Gentleman the Chancellor of the Exchequer to the terms, in which it was written. It was stated to be examined not by the Commissioners themselves, hut by officers under their direction, and notwithstanding they had riot done it themselves they certified that it was correct. This was the most extraordinary document that he had ever seen submitted to Parliament.—( Great laughter.) If these gentlemen are to be paid for this work, and do not perform the duty themselves, he should consider it necessary for him to move that the office be abolished altogether.— ( Hear, near.) Now, what he wanted to ask the Hon. Gentle man the Chancellor of the Exchequer was, what were the salaries paid to these three gentlemen? He wished the Right Hon. Gentleman to explain to this House and the country what he considered to be the value of their certificates. The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER said those accounts were audited the same as any other public accounts. The Hon. Gentleman must be aware that if the Com missioners were to examine every account themselves it would be impossible to get through the public service. WAYS AND 3IEANS. The SPEAKER then left the chair, arid the House resolved tself into a Committee of Ways and Means. INCOME-TAX. Mr. ROEBUCK rose to propose his amendment. He said, as it was understood, that he would this evening move the addition to the Right Hon. Baronet's resolution in reference to the income-tax, of which he had given notice, he would now at once proceed to do so. In the statement be was about to make, he would apply himself to the principles and to the declarations of the Right lion. Baronet, and upon those he would call upon him for his sup port. He would next address himself to the majority of the Right Hon. Baronet, or, in other words, to the agricultural aristocracy on the Opposition benches ; he would apply his arguments to their principles and declarations, and call upon them for their support. He would then apply his arguments to the Irish Members in this House, except such of them as represented the landed interest of that country ; he would re mind them of their principles and declarations, and then call upon them for their votes—( Loud cries of " Hear, hear ") and therefore he would say that, whatever his explanations might be, ho ought to have an ample majority on his motion. Now, in the first place, he would ask, what were the principles of the Right Hon. Baronet ? The Hon. Baronet said that he had a difficulty to encounter, and he proposed to remedy it by the cont nuation of the income-tax. But he went one step far ther, and said he would make such alterations in the tariff as would give an additional impulse to trade.—( Here the Hon. Member was rendered almost inaudible by the noise created by conversations going on in all parts of the House.) The Honourable Member was understood to say he would give a further impulse to trade by re moving certain taxes, and their vacancy he would fill up by continuing the income-tax upon England, Scotland, and Vales, but made an exception in regard to Ireland. But if the tax was to be applied by a rule, he would ask, why make this exception ? He would show that it was not according to the rule of pro ceeding which the Right Honourable Baronet had :laid down for himself in respect to England and Scotland, to exempt Ireland. He thought that when he should have shown that, he would have thrown the onus on the Right lion. Bart., of pro ving his reasons for the exemption. The exigency was on the whole of the United Kingdom—it was common to Great Britain and Ireland, and their united wants should be met by their united means—which meant their united income and pro perty. On that principle the Right Hon. Gentleman taxed the property of England and Scotland. Now he (Mr. R.) would ask him to go one step further, and to tax the realised capital of Ireland.—( Hear, hear.) He did not ask him to tax professions, trade, and even office.—(Hear.) But he asked why should the realised property of Ireland be ex empted, when it did not differ one iota from the other capital of this portion of the United Kingdom ?—( Hear, hear.) He would now approach another part of the question ; and he would ask the agriculturists how it was that they supported the Right Hon. Gentleman in this exemption ?—( Hear.) They came in tones of mingled hope and despair to demand relief ; but the Right lion. Baronet left them as they were ; and when he asked them why they complained of him, they answer like the puny child who has fallen over a stool, " because you did not kiss the place that was hurt."—( Laughter. ) He found means, however, to extricate himself from this exi gency which the Right lion. Gentleman went himself to create or promote. The lion. Member for Somersetshire was complaining of distress. In the most touching strains he spoke of the touching distress of the classes to which he was att.ched, and of the touching conduct of the Minister by wham they had been thus so grievously touched. He hoped that, on this occasion at least, he should have the vote of the Hon. Member for Somersetshire. What were his plans ? He could not tell; but in this measere he had some intimation of the protection of him whom he had created. Had they received any favour at his hands? Had their interests been in any way pro moted? No. But of this they did not complain. They felt that they could get no relief from their burdens ; they f e lt th at t h e exigencies of t h e S tate l e f t t h em iithout re li e f , w h en relief was afforded to (t)lttheeyrtlielass. Y e t o f this ct feel it a grievauce they th did not complain. No ; but they the Right Hon. Baronet had not expressed even sorrow for their griefs. They . had created him—they had brought ittrtils? thv,e,hlarye,attlhie him into li Lxiste n n d ee—they had breathed oefreaturea , z o ha h t a w d a the return s and wl „ s uu r:jady to into he his t no w s • their means, turned round upon them, life only by strangle his creators. By this time they that t h e Right Hon. Baronet had an opinion of his and those who had placed him in his present position foundown that that opinion did not tend to their advantage. He did then appeal to them, and on this occasion he did hope that they would no longer crawl on their bellies. They wanted a leader, an extract from a speech which rruit have gratified the 1 1 1$ 1 ; lion. Bat onet, if it did not parity all those around him. k ...h laugh.) [The lion. Gentleman then read, a midst Mu'_, cheering and laughter, an extract from the speech Conolly.3 A passage in that speech reminded him sit] Of strange association of bed-fellows—( Great laughter)--snh"elp lively crawlers.—(Great laughter.) I e could mit to „, fies s thinking that the honourable and Learned Member fa an old statement, " Who drives fat oxen should himself be fat." s , e , —( Laughter.) The Hon. and Learned Member (Mr. W s , buck) was perfectly justified in complaining of the absence u' o f Co! e . n b c Irish Members ; but he ( Sergeant Murphy; could noshed eethe the reasons which he gave fur that absence. He . his Hon. and Learned Gentleman had been more guarded tone and language. True it was, the Hon. and Learned• e M f l er ber excluded from his censure the lion. and Learned' rod for Cork, but there was one lion. Member to whom P e l e n a d allusion was made. Now every lion. Member present are recollect. the course lately adopted by Mr. Sniiih O'Brien; ifes the admirable spreeh he made on the subj ect of thieer,sl neral state of Ireland—a speech which elicited °a h hes t arobation, and had raised the Hon. Member to the highest a of argumentative orators in that House.—( Hear. be r a s lie ej had no doubt the observations of the Hon. and Les ere Member would be echoed back from leeland, not as obs g er. o , tiens sooting from Protestants or Orangemen, but from trbst tleman whose career might be nisi, in some degr ee, to Hon . of the Irish people. He regretted, too, that when the . _ di d and Learned Member talked of conciliation to America' "oft nut recollect that it was so near akin to Canada. Pester therefore, extremely sorry when he heard him make w s . : rs elo merit. With regard to the motion of his Hcin°;lnsoo and Learned Friend, what was his object ? He callee_ h r e , e them to tax realised property in !I-eland. But ."_"0, was he to find it ? Where would he find a landlord oa ring not struggling with mortgages? Ireland had b een lab° rasa under many ills; it had been pictured by the Hon. and L ei na ,eJ Member as a poor, impoverished country, and y et he ITeelistel to burden it with an income-tax. The resources Of . _,nsyl• own were not yet able to relieve the people from their se.`o,oael and any change in their condition, it was too well kn hat bf be detived, not from the imposition of an i nco me-tax , ; t his the introduction of real and substantial capi tal fe" ifhis country. He asked his Hon. and Learned Friend , the n n ' Sei motion was politic at the present moment? His '4lO bs Learned Friend had declared that ro increas e ong" • O i made to the number of Irish Members, beca use Hp lot people did possess were absent from their pos ts. ',al to answer to that argument was, that he was there to fulfil duties of a representative. He would not enter further 'th, measure, but conclude with a simple protest against policy cf bringing forward such a motion.— ( Cheers.), ra tite( Colonel RAWDON denied that any Irish Memb er, in on that occasion, would be actuated by any mo tives 0 1 e to ela ness, nor did he believe Hon. Gentlemen ePli n ' ite t r support the motion upon the selfish principle that it 01% 1 .0 lieve them from some portion of the burden itnr",, e 4iel l f, income-tax.—( Hear, hear.) He thought it was e, les the Or e ; unwise to introduce the income-tax into Ireland ran • tie; moments of her prosperity. It would press severdiettel• small tradesmen and merchants, and might revive tha, r 1711 0 ; which his Hon. and Learned Friend, the Member °bsaisho, garcon, had sanguinely hoped was hourly being her from this hitherto unfortunate country. 'L e fiol',:s he should not be felt to be intruding on sod [or but he could not but feel a great, objection to this tax! befe l , it was consequently his duty to his constituents to briegoolsi the House one instance from history, which was de e° 111 , n trY• significance at the present moment to the coo .0, alluded to the conduct of this country towards A . „M er i l e to l in h : begged to call the attention of Gentlemen of that lie n- s teo ' tr Iv . consequences of that conduct, before they gave tn s e e ,s, t the amendment of the lion. Member for Bath. i t posed by the country Gentlemen who were Membe es i d ° ol l P e rj, House,' in the middle of last century, that if they e o ,jeifb„j taxes on America that their own burdens would be ° l d 0 0,P,a The necessary means were taken to impose those hu e a e s tsi u. what was the consequence? A few short words w ere 5 asie,f e in the speech from the Throne, and in 1764 c ertai n . l' t duties were imposed on the North American Colonies iss;, consequences very soon appeared. In 1765 a fe w nw o lco were contained in the royal speech—" The attention referee merit was di:ected to matters of importance hav ie , g rbe're v ;til to America; disturbances had arisen there." e rid e so gentlemeniwere astonished. They stood aghast. "iPe saw that they were in the wrong. They saw tb f en o , to , may see now, that such conduct was inworthe trusted that there would be no repetition of this dor vs - t his wards America. The motion before the House ^ n o eieb to tion was a most important one, and if the princiele,,is ess e rs t been used towards America were to be applied in Go vern t "' o o4 Ireland, he felt assured that it would render the , t ele, A o, of that country most difficult, if not altogether itel'' ' ihst ' e rs' the success of this motion would at once bring °n, d is ts, oo , culty. They might defer the day of separation, bu ro ' r A ses' iss ration was inevitable. They 'might adjourn it ' y e f aj perhaps to a distant season, but to adjourn it fore possible. • sia °r ev Mr. CURTEIS would make but a few observatlonm s to sing the proposition of the Hon. Member for Bath ets .tli s . ti e ber of the Commission for the property an d ines° 01%00 felt that it was a tax which materially affected tnewseli:'tiso turing and commercial interests of the country• butcotePsstrl so the landed interests, and his experience on that s, co de r , led him to oppose the extension of this tax to Irelan u d. „....(P o itS which materiaPy depended on the produce of its la n nee ted hear.) If the gentlemen who were c on a t 1 001 the landed interests of the country did , ° he ld against this tax—for, to the tax altoget.ar, 00a,s opposed—he would ask them how their constitesenre.sed ‘ l ,f, io sati•fied with their conduct ?He considered hisnseb e t by his duty to those who sent him there, to oPP °ee s in bore every way. He could not see how the lower eta t h a t could be benefited by the extensity& of this tat to te ti s t olee f or For if the gentlemen of landed interest were to be, ° t he 0 er o!; this tax, it would be impossible for them to aPP'efo; 0 11 0 01 they possessed for the improvement of their esta t ni , it r oll if left free to make such application of their W s "; IhA t o to z r be doing much more good to the country than Os ti a ief ett possibly arise from the imposition of a property d int tax. He believed that the major part of the la n Is t ' he would not say the whole of the landed int er t WOO' major part of those who formed it—were oppose d ;et, si They complained, and justly complained, that the n the'otif Baronet the First Lord of the Treasury had gi ve- r 0 th ll s relief, while he left the whole burden of this " ' s irs' shoulders. He must he considered disinterest' s o voil matter, for he came forward unsupported bid li e v ie l section on either side of the House ; an s he 04 not, rely on the votes of Hon. Members on the b i l l e d P 5 it him ; but notwithstanding this, much as he dis' i • nos' the House to trouble, he should feel it his duty j i,co'; ‘ ,oo' %clue n the main question of the continuance or th,° M o f th e ance of the property and income-tax came before ti ii npo rt rete st ti solation he had, that he fully relied on the s h j t , be r t ,sc' t speeches of those members for Ireland who f s ee ° oo and lie hoped that their votes would be given in,", ts A te tit' r , they might possibly get rid of the nuisance of d a y s , altogether. At all events, he should feel it h!'_,, s ss the sense of the House, whenever the main questioe s t ie before it. f o' o o' 0 eo Mr. BLACKSTONE would not occupy n' he a t oo , of the House at that late hour of the night ; bo on the , a r e pelled to say a few words before he gave his vot. e ht be i d of the Hon. Member for Bath. Whatever Mig ht siee•thitit specting the property and income• tax by the Ri g to h ifil at fac t n net at the head of the Government, it was p„ ou ldn was intended to be a permanent tax, and ne, ; be itarjoS er right that a permanent tax of this kind shout!' _ England, Scotland, and Wales, without incluchegann, 'o ot tO . l He well remembered a letter, addressed by the_ s i s hen, t ts i t .3 for North Essex to the Right Hon. Barone t et hs t u ot P it Opposition in 1838, when the Right Han• IlT e n roal t i thA t e ly in reply, when an attempt was made to repea.s_ ons et...o 0 , during a debate in that House—that it was 1 10 , r in terr .i pt could not be disguised that if they (the lami ru a t ther, hs eit s tbe e l tamed a repeal of the malt-tax, that it Mut h ,. s ore t eo of the imposition of a property-tax ; and "' in ly j ot pe t the result which would in that case most certa, votes sPuses.,f that occasion the Irish Members gave their 4 000 . I c ies i c s; repeal of the malt-tax. He hoped the R . g L n e 1101 1 , • n ,bje would at once assent to the preposition of majesty se for Bath, in order to deal fairly with all her a _ 00 9 , or e s s Mr. WALLACE said that no man in th st • Pl a t pressed a more decided or strong opinion ae: ha d il es g o s e , tax or an income•tax than he had done. at greo,adood that opinion at the time the tax was imposene o f deg in th e He stated then that he had seen such seen out to a, e j that nothing would induce him to give his s d ulT .tocr a lte e . rt s e rr or a property-tax. Things, however, ha bet to l ! F td distinction seemed now to be well understoeobjeenooe oh)esibio perty and an income-tax. He had now n ° _but 11 _,i 0 0 s e s sid perty-tax—indeed, he thought it a just on' ehe s eie't, e tr o d strongly to an income-tax. 'With respect I.73_•l3Atb,het•oysi,i Hon. and Learned Friend, the Member / wa r, ~a st si a _.,•o freely and fairly give his vote againste 1 , ! - nt lei h e l e r; I' l on that vote he had very little doubt h sr t : wev er, ec tly ° be tte r , his constituents.—(Hear, hear.) If " shou ld do l 4) proved of the course he bad pursued , Ives6eutel th I`4 them, "Your representation is in your.e b u t if Y _ o ib r the man, if you think fit—l am your servant, is (,) .000 ap sins I have not served you faithfully, by .all meta . es e t u tati o h. _ n r yourselves." He should vote vi ohout h bee fa r jilt ta 4FO-11 proposal of the Hon. anti Learned Alem_ e Colonel SIBTHORP thought it toabt...: (i f f a u r_ o P ee tot , the motion of the Hon. Member for B t 1 1 e,e ' on tin fi l g et e z il laughter.) He should also vote agai nstold hY the '3 :O a l income and property•tax until he was „ hat it e ye le Baronet at the head of the Government,Joss thr s e eeK o Se , intention to prolong its continuance ts . eL on ..nsirosglttss, ( Hear, hear. ) If the tax was to be _indic ted a wa s England and Scotland, why, he w oulq. du ty t• h e e n' in ution u` to exemptedet Scotland, and? Her r iconsidered voting a I f i o e r d sit hit • id., t J Member for Bath.—(Cheers.) ber l e° P a r er motion of the Hon. and Learned Mern _ r has-log(0e bo w ed , s s atisfacti on wefts"' s i Lord PALNIERSTON said that whatever tu th 70t e° he certainly would have the Lau g, to st e j that evening an unexampled thine . —;s s Who , on ef i.es tteS obtained the support of Hon. MenD w e hose or inio_ o o o , d rally as wide from those entertained had b e e n n i o uy ie 4h . , were directly opposed to him, and He the lion , ..airr,,stesr Member as the poles were asundrc..,,vie, Eon a, L a e n .net lil t ) 00 0 1 ; the Members for Birmingham, Lin e i T on. and thereesl of t h —( Hear.) He was not sorry the hhe though t majoritYee 10°:, had made the motion, because was a f e enLe Wa s era t he le s show the people of Ireland, House, who entertained a kindle was n ot r ( w it , s errY h i& s e d the rut eeeb"-;11 hal been made, but lie regret couched his wt 'r ee OU' ee wards Ireland.—(Hear' hear.tlatlledn'e" %tie° °E ; . „ tll :ha t l b idl7, '" l I!°lenibers e w hice f e gro ge t hear.)Hon anti H e Learned thou gh t there Member were regard to Ireland, anti himself in lan guag o an d di e ot the 14° ber 11 / which he had expressed cool consi der e er A le n il :tela t P ts 3Piaeltmebeersrtowno)uldco, u o l n d t nd thnk y e and whisk, the n est v in uc" ed not wholly to appro been Ai d n ot .e., i s ela a ir made use of, he would havearuseo) "' subject c oo is (hear, bear.) li e (Lord P ....nt w it to. ,te d in t e ' s i s trilg o o on the argument that they station that X i s enorcae'o) mla'otutrbeu . 0 .0 the tax on accouot of thegaglr fact o f a u t4;: js i fat ea .. b 0 ,1 —(Hear, hear) —he thoursht onnerenper g O lan t i i I I r le c?if i b Ireland, it it was not founded died to Ira ulear• ) t he ir t why the tax should not be aPI, e , pe slient that ti e to - otherwise, it was just anti t b t ; fact , 131 , 0 0 04 i r igi",o his eyes t° ~ long had a dere not shut peop they _ o n - . 0 heavy grievance, or we The Hon. 7 . - grou t.oa _ n ot hi st l • considered that they thought t e a Y inc a G . g ig h 1 ; 1 1 complain.—( Hear, hear.) . s He eon w " . Scot t n d, a t motion was pronoset • had not been consistent In a e g u s i r, g t e ‘ t i lw tha "t . a th i l Y , es " h ile d be th e a r e; o rtion " I Y; o earri t 'l a ree• self proposed to apply equality, hfurther •rgt'er A ° equal taxes on Ireland, fore, instead of rroducing ined to a - d Fat ent. n iso n .jiett he count (r so oe s tee e r. quality of which n Irelano, d nthe • f o r e t o tax was to be imposed o t be imp was t re , it no reason why it s hould no . , „here wa s . grou t ' oc len e%o o fr . it was done in England. 1, e xtend it ' n ° joie O hat 0 4 :sieg t England, ani via out tb the tax to Ireland, let them i t s be ilik e nue t o 'l' 1 the • eve T oo, the t protium. m ore r- - ; „,pos' or , Ireland, as it would - 1 1 some t i t the "" ' a ken He, however, thought it woos , he thotig had t bee° - 00 eri t , tis re e j te peeted. They the tax apply to Irelend, view indeed . 0 t heir P lit ty might pi tot, would show that a narro f c ou ntry. th e y e Irell e re P a is i t so subject. If they force the resources n- the c Hear, hear' s fool fle A l i et the prosperity of Irelan the thau,ita. , far lees to the resourses of jenire',. cgibe Itrs'o, t.iodet',,, employe;all the moms t wodid g rt ic on ot o p te to e b i 5 were be , slog' _AO m i g ht be e t x „ 1 ,,, .. n a . an d froin t wo, A o# it, and a c n ap d al r e a b i t iw ies a ; tion to lo e . 00 to it had hitherto done in re a otributi • e that coo she would be able to giv . country would stand io a differs., (olted s- ts .00 19 is empis to do. 'ray of se on them, Ireland. A I 414:4 li, e 1 li t l h, %it, E