The Sun. — London, England, 1844-02-02 00:00:00

T JAE SUN, LONDON, FRIDAY MORNING, FEI3RITARY 2, 1844, lee eonntry, and he called upon them to reconsider their course. if the Right Hon. Bat-inlet would only postpone the address • till Monday, in order to afford an sipport unit y to the people of knowing what rt V as that the address contained, he was sure if the Right Hot i. Baronet would adopt that course, as quick as the post C OO . (1 bring them, the grievances of the people would be ?on sed into that House. Now it was his intention to move two amendments, he considered the distress tha' existed in the cut ntry was owing to two causes, one the existence of the colaws an d ot h er proh ibi tory enactments. wh i ch i f put 11 11!; enil to would remove t h a t di s t ress an d su ff er i ng , an d t h e o th • sr was the great increase of taxation. Her Majesty, in her c: set ch—or rather her Ministers, in their speech—had been c ions upon that subject ; but these taxes caused misery to the eo plee--( Hear.) He regretted to see taxation increased to the !t!int it had been when it ought to be reduced. Then, again, !I respect t o t h e i ncome - tax , t h at i mpost i ns t ea d falling on the wealthy had fallen very heavily on the Pot Ter classes. He believed the larger portion of the Pi 4 T people had been obi ie ed to pay that tax, si the trouble of get'ing it back was such that the money l e :berms considered wort h i t . Th e Right Hon Baronet did not theta, as he did in 1828, that a Finance Committee should I aPPointed to see Inhere the excesses of the expenditure had "en place. Ile thought her Majesty ought to have called 1 4 on I .ser Ministers to look to the distresses of the people. hat was the use of having peace, when they were obliged to up a war establishment ? He was anxious that 1 7 a House should not be led away by a species of trickery. th ?hey wished for an example of the evil effects which must let ,ow from any breach of faith with the public creditor, Ito look across the Atlantic.—( Cheers.) He had always ° DI 'used everything like a breach of faith ei.h the public xe tttor, a:though he saw these on the benches opposite ,_ ll a o e had, i n t h e i r specohes and their writings, recommended a r of the public fesitb.—( Cheers and laughter.) F. r every rend that was withheld from the public creditor, the country Je st millions.—.(;d ear , hear.) They had recently had Zee "ate* a the effect of uphoitting estblic credit. at (occurred in Virginia? There had been considerable aulty in ni. s i n g funds to meet the interest of the debt. Lae Governs( s had recommended the House to raise a tax to Pay the j e t s .. est due to the public creditor. A small sum, am° unt insf t about 800,C00 dollars, had been raised for that trpose ad be and • the effect had been that the stocks which to ? e en at 45 or 50, rose immediately to 70 and by a Three-fourths of those funds were held .habit an t s of the States who thus found that their capital ; i f doubled, an d th a t they were able to exchange it, and to 07 . tt for any p ur po s es which they might require. Every 't ate in America which had broken faith with the public ere thheayd suffered, would suffer, and ought not to recover had regained public credit, by paying their creditors. , a s a greed with the Right Hon. Baronet as to the necessity of ~r l--n taining public credit. That person was the greatest ( W en ' Y to the working classes who should recommend a breach 4 ' o public faith wish the national creditor, for the working saes would suff er more severely in consequence, than any The most effectual way, however, to maintain the pub "! credit, was by a reduction in taxation, to lessen the burden 'of the people.. If less were taken from them by the income 'tax, they wot Ild be more effectually enabled to contribute to the either taxes o the country. The public credit would have been snore effectually preserved if, instead of raising five millions by an income- tax, a reduction had been made in our establish :lr. All that was wanted was that they of sh d `set free labour, the industry and the commerce cerantry.—Loud cheers. ) They had ships rutting Wow their harbours for want of employment, with which they scareds Lave been turt,i4tecl if we had had free trade. Ile g y eat lY pitied the ship-owners, for the had been the thei, est monopolists, and they were now paying the penalty of folly. Much had been saidabout commercial i m pro.ement. :cr . the Right Hon. Baronet look to every trade except those dnected with the woollen and cotton manufacture, and he 'would see nothing but distress. Our condition could not be a 'wealthy one as long as there were millions of 'Money un em ployed and capital lying dead. Nothing 'hut extending the outlets for our exports, could furnish the ; Means of employment. They were told that if they did this it 'would not give increase of employment ; but he dented that position: Evert those States in which the most tetringent regulations existed against our commerce, had been !aompelled to take more articles from us whenever we relaxed `tut' commercial code. Our commerce with France had been tre bled, There was not a bushel of wheat imported which did not live additional employment to the people. It did not lower the price of British produced wheat, but it afforded a full meal to otiose who hail only before had half a one.—( Hear, hear). ne articles of butter and cheese had not been affected by the tariff, although a Noble Lord, speaking in the enlightened :iinty of Buckingham, had complained that the farmers had -;en ail ruined by the duty having been taken off cheese—( A la ugh) —and when they looked at the article of live cattle— 'Why the w h o l e o f the cattle imported in the course of last year `tcou'd not have made a single breakfast for the working people '°f this country. They had every right to complain of the Right Hon. Baronet, because he would not carry out the 'same principles of commercial policy which he had enunciate d . ''(Cheers He believed that over-taxation was one of the evils under which this country was labouring, and he t " ( might that many of those evils had been produced the conduct of the Right Honourable Baronet. ith regard to the subject of the revenue, if it were properly Looked into and fairly stated, it would present a very different '...lPPearanee to that which it was assumed to have by the Ministerial party. If they would deduct the amount :received for the income-tax, the revenue derived from eorre and the amount received from China, I nstead of speak i ng i n the glow i ng terms w hi c h t h ey did of our financial situation and our returning prosperity, they would End their a sser t e d i ncrease s i n k d own into a revenue less by a million and a half than that of last year. Re verting to the condition of the 'working classes, let them look at the reduced rate of wages, end they would be compelled to say that they were in any INbut a gate of comfort. When the time arrived at 'Government the Right Non. Baronet at the head of the `eovernment would propose a continuation of the income . be he wo u ld b eg t h em t o b ear i n m i n d th a t there would ... s e no occasion for it, no necessity whatever for -it! furthe r infliction, if they would only do away with the t trarnaaels of industry, and give to capital its fair and legiti mate expansion. The Hon. Gentleman (Mr. Cardwell) in' :seconding the address to the Crown, had said much in :praise of the home market, holding it up as the best, if not the only one for this country. Why, for his (Mr. Hume's) part he could see no difference between the tome and the foreign. When a man could sell his articles better at home he would sell them at home, and if he could .find a readier market or a better price abroad he would sell ;abroad.— (Hear. ) Here people were constantly protesting Againit foreign markets, and holding up home mar kets as the only good for the country, and what was our actual condition? Take the agricultural parishes. Were they not now burthened by persons thrown upon them for relief, thrown back from manufactures, which were rendered Idle and unproductive by the very system which Tie (Mr. Hume) complained of, but of which lion. Gentle men opposite desired the continuance. These poor people, thus thrown back upon the agricultural parishes, were so thrown; by their own narrow policy and unjust laws. Let them give employment to the people, awl they would very soon tad all their difficulties at an end. Their disasters were not 'limited to one class of the people—the agriculturists were suf fering the same as the manufacturers—they were both to be • 'Pitied, and ought to be rellev.el. In order that these matters 'night in a proper way be brought under the attention of the ho should move certain paragraphs to be added, by ay of amendment, to the eleventh p iragraph in the proposed e t.. tes (The Hon. Gentleman then read his a nendment, eth l l , l , e ,", was to the effect that the industry oi the country was by laws of repression which ought at once to be re •;„;''''eu, and the principle of free trade fully acted upon—that °floPolies should no longer be permitted—and that her Ma having announced the prospect of continued peace, very , tons ieerible reductions might and ought to be made in the Naval and military services, and the various overgrown esta - ishment s o f the country.) The force now in Ireland was b larger than that of 1792. It was a question of importance both 4 t 9 Irel an d and• England whether such a force should be con tinued, Why wa s it mai n tained? Because they would not au justice. When the rton. Member for Cork introduced the Z" t i"ja of repeal in that House, he opposed him, believing at repeal would be injurious to the best interests of both entries, But they must now make their selection between t wo courses ; they must either remove the well-Sonneed coin- Plaints of the Irish people, or they must let them have repeal. ,(Hear, h ear .) If he believed th a ' justice would nut be done 0 Ireland by the British Parliament he would himself become r epealer.—(Hear, hear.) What was the feeling of Irishmen themselves in reference to their present He had in his hand a copy of -a petition t hey t o b e presented to t h at H ouse, not b y t h e r iff- ra ff, w h o were told- were•the only supporters of Mr. O'Connell and 2. 4 , 'but at a meeting at which the Duke of Leinster pre (Thed Hon. Member then read the petition, which de 5-`4hed the state of Ireland as one of deep-seated and wide ?cad discontent, and stated that the petitioners considered at until the causes of complaint were removed, peace could nut be secured on a lasting tooting). He thought the Right ... 11 ?e• 'Baronet (Sir James Graham) and the Noble Lord his . I rleague, might h ave - le arne d so mething from their experience 1 1 834, when, as• Members of the Government of that day, th ey brought iu a Coercion Bill for Ireland. What was the Zbult of that measure? Why, it was a perfect failure. f wh en, subsequently, injustice ceased, when a desire was mani cited to remove all causes of complaint, Ireland immediately res Ponded to the new feeling ; and at one time the army was re duced fro m 20,000 to 8,500, and troops were sent over to "isist in maintaining the peace in Yorkshire. What had oc curred since ? They had refused justice to the nation, afte r an pledging themselves to remove all • grievances , d ,„„ t e country was deluged with a naval and military force w hich was a disgrace to any Ministry in a time • o f Peace. 'The Noble Lord, who had proposed the address, said that he did not wish to raise any topics of dispute. Why, i ress they s t a t e d w h a t th e y we re prepared to do, the Mi rY Were shirking their duty.—( Hear, hear.) They wanted the Moral Moral courage to bring the subject fairly before the House, • and they did not redeem the pledge which they had given, to ( p }: o pose all measures w hi c h m i g ht b e necessar y f or the welfare toe country. r. S. CRAWFORD said he wished to move an amend ment, to that p ar t o f th e a dd ress w hi c h referred to the esti mates. He wished to add to the paragraph the following Wo • r ds •--" To assure her Majesty that her faithful Commons will be always desirous to vote such supplies as may be found Just and necessary fur 'the public service, but that under the circumstances of the country we shall deem it our first most import an t d u ty to inquire into the various grievances c j!Teplain e d o f b y her people. an d to d ev i se suc h measures as shall ` l 7 most effect ua l f or t h e re moval of alljust causes otcomplaint." ` was their duty to inform her Majesty of the causes of the Z ° f lll tplaints o f the people. That House was the proper organ eu turnunication between the people and the Crown. They P i " o se ued no other, and it was therefore their duty to represent I ,° h ier Majesty what the wants and wishes of the people were. t o eePeoPle had at various times represented those grievances t uat House, but their complaints were not listened to , and B ` ...' 'eY theref ore b el i eved that they were not f u lly or fairly repre tito o , her ted in that House. By representing their grievances to the Majesty m i g ht, if she so thought fit, desire her • of t l : ter a to inquire into their grievances. They complained great a ccumulation of property whi:e the destitution of the body of the people was every day increasing. They corn - les s , e that the means of living of the working classes were icu ?ed, and that while the taxes on food were continued they law llutd_o give relief through the administration of the poor- He would not at that time enter Into the subject of the Or -law, r I though h e h ad strong opinions upon t h e su bj ec t. becam e the gr i evances of the people were not inquired into, i t their duty as Members of that House to Take all fair and 1.450 1141 e mean s to force their consideration upon the House, Rn d If possib le to obtain redress fur them. It was to be rebgarettedt Throne,h '. at . references were not made in the speech from to snake but that not being done, it was their dwy it - athose references in the address. He maintained that p omits of the peopdluet,y I s ° 1 their • stability to inform the Crown of all the com the and it was the best means of securing when there.. of the Crown. It was with that view he brought --braard as amendment nothing , nfeeling speech cabsolutelybut accounts ro that s perity . who a n innit , great distress pervaded the great mass of the corn ), so severe that the population could not be afflicted with sne th and at th e same time subordinate to the law, the Crown ei em T 9 beinform e d o f t h e real state of the country. He had re 'rnup,tr in structionsthe , f rom hi s constituents at Rochdale to adopt es which he now proposed. Of course he meant no that i nta i at ' a ' - ' but it, tht - extJl , it rlf.tiL to give Belltatiies of tiou whith tney ought to receive trom the rep resi ft the people. He should not press on - the cbnside uo the R9use any arguments on the subject, further than to move that the amendment be added to the 10th paragraph in the address. 'The address, which was an echo of the speech, and the amendiaents, hiving been put by the Speaker, and no Member rising to address the House, strangers were ordered to with draw, when Mr. WARBURTON rose to address the House. He did so because he thought that any Hon. Member who intended to vote should state his reasons for doirg so. If the Hon. Mem ber who had moved the amendment—he alluded to the H on . Member for Rochdale—meant by that amendment to stop the supplies until the grievances of the people were redressed, lie could assure him that that was not the vote he was hicined to give. Formerly, when the Crown ventured to commit Mein hers to the Tower, to stop the supplies was a justifiable pro ceeding. They knew one another well ; they knew that civil war was inevitable, and that the House of Commons was fully prepared to support the cause of the people. In those times the evils of stoeping the supplies were not of the extent which such a proceeding would now entail on the Crown. Colonies at that time this country had none ; but if they stopped the supplies now they would throw all the foreign establishment of the country into confusion. Formerly the Crown had va rious revenues by which it was supported, but now the reve nues of the Crown were little or nothing. At that time the stopping of the supplies was just ; but it would not be so now. He thought with the Hon. Member for Montrose that the estimates were capable of large reduction, and that in addition to that reduction a larger deduction might be made in the naval and military service of the country. A con siderable alteration might be made in the collection of the revenue. When he came into the House he had no intention of addressing it, but as his vote might be liable to misrepresen tation if he gave it for the motion cf the Hon. Member for Rochdale, he thought it right to say thus much, and with this explanation he should vote for the Hon. Member's motion. Mr. WALLACE had not, when he entered the House, en tertained any intention of addressing them that evening, but he felt bound to offer an explanation of the vote which he in tended to give in favour of the amendment which had been proposed by his Hon. Friend the Member for Rochdale. He agreed with his Hon. Friend the Member for Kendal, as to what had been the former practice of the House, but to such a condition had the people now been brought, that the House must proceed a little faster and a little further than they had hitherto clone, .or they would be brought to a stand still.— ( A laugh). This was not a time to be fastidious, and he would support the Hon. Member for Rochdale in his attempts to stop the .supplies whenever he might be of opinion that circumstances might require it.—( A laugh). Hon. Members might laugh, but perhaps they might have an opportunity of judging on the subject before the cession was over.—(Re newed laughter). He did not say when he would do it. He would not say whether he should do it on the first occasion that the supplies were proposed, or not, but whenever he should see occasion he would do so most assuredly. He supported the amendment of the Hon. Member for Rochdale. Lord JOHN RUSSELL would have been satisfied with giving a silent vote against the amendment of the Hon. Mem ber for Rochdale, had it not been for the speech of the Hon. Member for Kendal, and for that of the Hen. Member who had just sat down. After that speech, however, lie thought he might as well take the opportunity of delivering his sentiments, not only on the motion now before the House, but on the eeneral address, which had been so ably moved and seconded by the Noble Lord and the Hon. Gentleman opposite.— ( Hear, hear). With respect to the motion of the Hon. Member for eochdale, if the Hon. Gentleman meant to say that the House of Commons ought to have the power to inquire into and to redress grievances, why, if the majority of that House were persuaded that it was fit to inquire into certain matters, and thought that certain remedies were necessary, he knew of nothing in the address which could prevent such a ma jority from engaging in such inquiries, or from adopting such measures ; and the insertion of those word s p ro p ose d t o be in serted by the Hon. Gentleman would be totally unnecessary.— ( Cheers). But if it meant that it was intended that a minerity of that House should stop the proceedings of the majority should stop the necessary supplies—necessary, not for the pur poses of the Crown, but for the maintenance of the honour and safety of the country—if the meaning was, that a minority would stop the supplies until opinions which were not those of the majority should be forced upon them by obstruction and delay—he would at once say that to steps of that kind he would `never give his sanction, and that he would never give any vote which should tend to that purpoie.—( Loud cheers). He thought that in the first ease there was no need to introduce the words proposed, which were merely superfluous; and in the second case, he was glad to embrace the earliest opportunity to express his dissent from projects which he had seen had been broached elsewhere, of forcing the opinions of a minority, by means of obstruction and delay upon a majority of that deliberative House of Parliament.—(Cheers.) With respect to the speech from the throne, and to the address itself, he was glad to find that the topics touched upon were treated in such a manner as to meet with his concurrence, so far as his vote on the address was concerned.—(Cheers.) The Hon. Member for Montrose had said that it would be the better course, as there were so many topics touched, that the House should have time to deliberate, so as to form an opinion upon each topi'. According to the method which Lad in former times been adopted with regard to the speech of the Sovereign, it might, perhaps, have been advisable to adopt the plan proposed by the Hon. Member for Montrose ; but according to the method which had been adopted of late years, and which, perhaps, was more adapted to our own times, it had been more usual, both in the speech and the address, to treat the various topics touched upon in such a manner as not to oblige the House to come to any opinion on matters of doubt and controversy—not to call upon the House to express any decided opinion except upon questions which had been over and over again discussed, on which Members were tolerably agreed, such, for instance, as the maintenance of the legislative union with Ireland.--(Cheers.) On other topics it had of late years been usual to thank the Crown for the com munication which had been made, and to reserve those other topics for separate discussion or separate motions.—(Cheers.) With respect to the annexation of Sinde for instance, if he had been called upon to thank her Majesty for having under taken a military aggression against Sinde, he must say he should. be anxious to pause and inquire before expressing an opinion on the subject, but the address had been very properly framed, and it only called upon the House to thank her Ma jesty for the information she had been pleased to communicate to them, and for the promise of further papers and information. The Hon. Member for Montrose had complained that there had been twenty-three different topics introduced into the address, but while these topics were treated in this manner, he apprehended that if there had been 53 instead of 23 different topics introduced into the address, the House would have very little difficulty in paying the compliment to the Crown of agreeing to the address without a division. There was one topic which had been treated of in the speech, not, however, in such a manner as to preclude him from voting in favour of the address, but en which he thought it necessary so say a few words. He meant the state and condition of Ireland.— ( Hear, hear.) He agreed that while the proceedings to which allusion had been made were pending before the judicial tribunals in Ireland, it would be impossible with a due regard to the proceedings of the Courts of Justice to discuss topics which involved the conduct of persons who had to defend themselves before those Courts. It was therefore impossible at present to discuss those questions fully. But he wished now to be most decided and pointed in precluding himself from any supposition that he gave his approbation to the conduct which had been pursued by the Government —to their most unfot tunate proceedings—onto the measures which the Crown w.s now pursuing or proposed to pursue with refer ence to the calamities which now afflicted Ireland. With the few word: he had thus uttered he quitted that subject. A friend behind him had just reminded him that he liz.d given notice of his intention, at an early day, to bring the whole state of Ireland under the consideration of the House. and he fully intended to du so, subject, however, to the circumstance that by the time he had fix .'d fer his moti, n, the trials now pending would be brought to a close.—(Hear, hear.) If this were not the case—it at the time fixed the trials were still pending —then he shoeld venture to oak the House to give him the preference of the earliest day after their con cluson.—( Hear, hear.) There were several topics treated on in the speech, in which he was most happy to express his concurrence. He was very glad to find that with re-pest to China a commercial treaty had been made between the two countries likely to be advantageous to both, and that the Chme:e Government :and our own had both been of the same oninion, that the advantages we had obtained for ourselves should be extended to all other nations. H. quite agreed in the sentiment expressed by the Hon. Member for Montrose (Mr. Hume) that conduct like this was becoming such a great nee ion as England, evincing as it did a conciliatory and noble feeling towards other nations, and a continued and un abated confidence in our own resource, and enterprise.—( Hear, hear.) He was glad also to find that after the panic which had been expressed at the exceeding might and power of the Emperor of China—(Loud laughter)—that the dread which formerly pervaded those now on the other side of the House at the almost irresistible strength of three hundred millions, had somewhat abated—(Loud laughter)— and that it was now with them matter of congratulation that we had not submitted to the ignominy—( Hear, hear)—of having British subjects confined and threatened to be put to death if they did not agree to certain peremptory terms. We had vindicated British honour ; and so far from the result being as calamitous as they it was predicted it would be, our just demands had been enforced by the naval and military skill of the commanders and forces, and by the diplomatic skill of Sir H. Pottinger, acting under the directions of his Noble Friend the Member for Tiverton (Lord Palmerston) ; and we had obtained terms which, so far from being dishonourable, gave hopes of advantages greater than even they had a right to expect.—(Cheers). The speech alluded to the good under standing which we now enjoyed with France, and to the pacific relations which existed between us and the principal Powers of Europe. He most unfeignedly rejoiced at these intima tions, and trusted that our policy would continue to insure that good understanding. He (Lord John Russell) was one who had been frequently taunted on the subject of the French alliance—with being too fond of that alliance, in contempt of other alliances with the more despotic Powers of Europe. It was imputed to them that, after. the alliance had lasted a considerable time, they were the cause of breaking that alliance and good understanding. He was happy to find, by some declarations recently' made in an Assembly of another country, by persons of autho rity—by the late Prime Minister of France and the present Minister of France—that if there had been any decline in the intimacy and good understanding, that such was not owing to any act on their parts, but because France, for various rea sons, and from various motives, began to look to other ideas and other feelings, which, as he thought, she ought never to have done, and then the good understanding between them would never have beets impaired. With regard to the treaty of July, 1841, he was most happy to find, from the Minister of Foreign Affairs, that France had now reverted to her ancient policy, thereby signifying that, for a time, there had been a depar ture from it. That ancient policy had been to maintain the integrity of Turkey by the protection and assistance, not of one or of another, but of all, the great Powers. In that spirit they had acted, and in that spirit he thought France ought likewise to have acted. But, unhappily, she had wan dered from her usual track, and turned to worship some Egyp tian idol—(A laugh )—that for a time had charmed her. But glad was be to find that she had deserted that new track, and returned once more to her ancient and her true policy. Glad should he ever be that our good under standing was renewed with that great country, which he looked upon as one of the most intelligent and power. ful in Europe, distinguished alike in letters, arts, and arms. Other parts of the speech turned upon the present state of our industrious population. Ile was happy to hear from the Hon. Gentleman who had seconded the address, that there were great signs of improvement in the manufacturing districts. He had no doubt that although there had been exaggeration in some quarters, much real and solid improvement had taken place. If they came to inquire into the causes of that improvement they would no doubt find that one of the greatest causes was the abundance of the harvest of last year and the year before. He was making some inquiries the other day with respect to the price paid for food by some poor families. He found that in one family there was this year a saving of one shilling a week for the consumption of bread. If they considered the number of families who must be in the same condition, it seemed not improbable that some millions had been saved in food, to be devoted to the purchase of clothing and other things of which the poor stood in need. It was obvious, therefore, that the bounty of Providence had much to do with the improvement to which reference had been made.—(Hear.) This was quite independent of any policy which might be adopted with respect hyear doubted hardly whe th whether, iif quotedthey i t no favour. r T o he ea particularneyxperi had a law prohibitine the import of cor n, t h e effect w o u ld have bc-i) vcry ctitf , r^nt. , t!, Mereher ence of law th e ; lastfcir for Montrose had tpi?ken on that subject, lie would 's metre to Rightsay a few words as' to the disadvan ta g eous p osition of the lauded interest and the farmers as to the p olic y of the Hon Baronet. There were many schemes bearing upon this subject. One was the old scheme of protection for all articles of British industry. That policy still had numerous advocates. Another opinion was the direct reverse of that, that. there ought to be no protecting hes at all, that there should be no taxes except for the sake of revenue, and that they should beware, in improing taxes for the sake of revenue, that they I did not do anything by which the price of any article of domestic industry would be enhanced. There was a third opinion, which was the opin'un held by the Right Hen. Gentleman, and very nearly that held by himself ; that although the first opinion was totally erroneous, and although the second was absolutely true, yet, in the condition of this country, having to raise the interest of a debt of 800 millions— }evine', also, to appoint numerous establishments—and having, for these purposes, laid on many taxes at various times, and of various kinds, some pressing on one class of industry, and some on another—in making the change from what was erro neous to what was true, they should make it with great caution, and they should rather look to having a fair competition, with some advantage to their own consumers, who had been, hitherto, unduly favoured, than go at once into a system of total and entire freedom. Now this last principle was, he conceived, that upon which the Right Hon. Baronet had founded his tariff two years ago. But the fault of the corn-law was, that it did not carry the principle far enough. The corn-law, if it were good for anything, was founded on the principle of protection to British iudustry. All those who now defended the corn-law defended it upon that ground. It was a law which was left alone ; it was a law which was repudiated by their policy with respect to all other articles; and it was a law which could not be defended, except upon a theory which they themselves (the Ministry) said was indefensible.—( Hear, hear.) Now that appeared to him to be placing the whole landed interest at a disadvantage. If they said. " Let all classes of British industry be protected, for that is the true principle," they might tie up the corn-laws in a bag with the rest of the laws, and they would then have strength to resist any inroads which it might be attempted to make. On the other hand, they might .defend making corn a source of revenue. But whilst, as regarded other articles, they had adopted a moderate duty, as regarded that article in which the majority, both in the House of Lords and in the House of Commons were deeply interested, they had a duty of 40 per c tit., that duty shifting and changing in a way which every commercial man declared to be irreconcilable with sound principle. When, therefore, gentlemen attending agricultural meetings expressed a hope that the Right Hon. Baronet would come forward and declare that the corn-law was binding in all perpetuity, he did think that they made the most extravarrant request that ever he heard.—( Hear, hear.) The Right Hot:. Baronet told them last year that he. did not mean to alter the corn-law that session ; but that as regarded the future he must be guided by the condition of the country, and the probable effect of any new commercial law. He thought that was the only answer which the Right Hon. Ba ronet could fairly be expected to give ; but he would be much surprised if he now found him saying, " I am so enamoured of my law, that I am determined to stand by it."—( Hear, hear. ) He spoke thus much with regard to the subject introduced by the Hon. Member for Montrose He did not know anything more to add, than that he gave his concurrence to the address. He did not want any addition made to it of the kind alluded to by the Hon. Member for Montrose, and he would give his de chled negative to the amendment now proposed.--( Hear.) Sir R. PEEL said that, before adverting to the motion of the Hon. Member for Rochdale, or the observations of the Noble Lord, he was sure the House would excuse him for expressing the satisfaction with which he heard the speech of his Noble Friend who proposed, and the speech of his Hon. Friend who seconded, the address.—( Hear, hear.) The Hon. Member for elontrose, who was their political opponent, stated distinctly that he never heard an address moved and seconded with greater judgment or with more ability than on the present occasion.—( Hear, bear.) He was sure the ability they mani fested, combined with the sincere and unaffected diffidence exhibited on their own parts, gained for them the favourable opinion of the House, and he hoped that the favourable opinion of the House would induce them to overcome that feeling of distrust and diifidence, and to apply their abilities to the service of the country.—( Hear, hear.) It was his duty to state his decided opinion upon the amendment of the Hon. Member for Rochdale. He apprehended that motion was intended as the foundation of measures to be adopted for the purpose of stopping the supplies. If he concurred with the Hon. Gentleman in entertaining the opinion he entertained with regard to the advantage of introducing more of the democratic prin ciple into the Constitution, he should be equally energetic in deprecating the course indicated by him.—( Hear, hear.) He could conceive nothing more injurious to the popular prin ciple of the Constitution than the abuse of the privilege which a minority of that House possessed. The power of adjourn ment was one which it might lie well to act upon on certain occa sions, hut it was given under the greatest responsibility, and unless used with great caution by Hon. Gentlemen they would strenuous uwoeurse advocates. --( only injure the popular principle and those interests of which ) boundrrhe Hon. to Gentleman Chehewerass.suppose—sad stop the supplies till the people obtained a redress of grievances. But what various opinions were there with regard to those grievances, and the mode of redressing them? and if the Hon. Gentleman, and those who acted with him were to form the Government of the country, and possessed a great majority, they would be setting an example which might he used against themselves, and a p:ivilege, intended for other purposes, would be used to obstruct the the public business.—(Laughter.) The privileges of a minority were important as a protection against an oppressive majority, but he had seen no case in which a mi nority would be justified in resorting to it. But, above all, that great instrument which the House possessed of stopping the sup plies was one which it was of the utmost interest to them should remain intact, and one which should not be inconsiderately and unjustifiably used, bat reserved for some great and important occasion. —( Cheers.) It was not to be resorted to because a small minority differed from a great majority as to what was right. He had seen many occasions in which, at the com mencement of a session, the Hon. Gentleman, and those who sat on his left, came forward with strong declarations as to their intentions, which in the course of the session they saw reason to alter ; and he had - that confidence in the good sense and sound judgment of the Hon. Gentlemen which induced him to call upon them to reflect, and to consider whether, being the guardians of 'this great popular instrument by which popular privileges, interests, and rights, might have to be defended, they ought to resort to it on trifling and unimportant occasions. —( Cheers). With regard to the speech of the Hon. Member for Montrose, he agreed with the Noble Lord that it was much better to abstain from introducing anything into the speech from the Throne which might lead to a division, and fur this reason, that if it were otherwise, the Government would possess a great advantage. They knew the entire ef the speech, and if they wished to carry any partieular paragraph in the address, they might by a large majority do so by getting pledges of opinions from some parties and by issuing summonses fur their friends to attend. He thought, therefore, that it was better if possible to avoid anything that would lead to a division. The Hon. Gentleman (the Member for Montrose) had said that it was impossible fur them to give the consideration worthy of the House of Commons to the 23 p • aragraphs of the address in a few hours. He said that they should at least have 24 hours ; but he (Sir R. Peel) very much doubted whether the important and various subjects alluded to in the address could be satisfactorily decided even in that time. The Hon. Gentleman did not show his usual modesty and dis trust in his own opinion, for notwithstanding the shortness of the time he came prepared with three or four amendments, and he called upon the House not to lose a moment in pledg e ing themselves to them.—( Laughter.) He thought that it was for the public interest that they should not raise a sepa rate discussion on all the matters introduced in the speech. He was of opinion that the present practice was far preferable to the ancient practice of reading it at the Council the day before. He was glad to hear that the general tenor of the speech met with the approbation of the Noble Lord. With regard to Ireland, the satisfaction with which he heard that approbation of the Noble Lord was not much lessened by the small taunts with which he indulged in the course of his speech. With regard to France, the No ble Lord, in his own vindication, referred to a period when there existed a difference of sentiment and action between this country and France. He would not refer now to the causes which produced those differences, but he contemplated, and he believed the House concurred with him in contemplating, with great satisfaction the re-establisment of better feelings between both countries—(Cheers) --and he thought it was ' infinitely better not to disturb that feeling by any refer ence to former times till a period arose when they would have an oppportunity of discussing the subject. The discussing the amount of blame to which each party might be liable, would be likely only to revive animosity, which could effect no good purpose; but he saw with satisfaction that the House was almost unanimous in expressing their satisfaction at the re-establishment of better feelings between both countries, upon which the interests of peace and civilisation so much depended.—(Cheers.) When in Opposition he never con-' cealed his sentiments as to the policy of having a good under standing with France, and it was better that he should explain what he meant by a good understanding.—( Hear, hear.) He did not mean any secret engagement which might give offence to others. That understanding ought to be patent and open. They sought not to interfere with the prerogatives or rights of others. —( Hear, hear.) They coveted to invasion of terri tory. They desired not to diminish the just influence of others. They wished not to propagate opinions with regard to the systems of other countries.—(Hear, hear.) Their ob- ject was not to weaken the affections between the people and the Sovereign—( Hear, hear)—but the time was come when they were to ask, whether the interests of those countries were op posed to each other—whether there was any necessity for their fomenting party feelings?—(Cheers.) If there was no obstacle to a good understanding existing between the two countries, it was for the interests of hu manity and civilisation that that good understanding should become established.—( Hear, hear, and cheers.) Did England covet any of the possessions of France, or France those of England? Did the: desire any extension of territory at the expense of each other ? Were their institutions op posed ? They had each a representative Government, and they had each responsible Alinisters. On the part of this country he would say at once that he was perfectly certain that a good understanding could not be cordially or permanently , maintained at the expense to either country of any con cession of any point of honour, or any compromise of prin• ciple.—( Hear, and cheers.) It was virtually necessary for a cordial and permanent understanding between the two countries that it should be known there were no secret . engagements or special contracts with which any other country could find fault. On the part of England, he could say that no concessions were made by France, or the French Government. There was no compromise, no concession of any right, or of any kind, in any particular whatever; but, from the position of both countries, standing as they did, at the western extremity of Europe, and almost similarly situated with regard to that great quarter of the globe on the other side of the Atlantic, and governed by similar institutions, there was nothing to prevent a friendly under standing between both countries. But if there was to be in every country in the world, a French party and an English party, he could only say that England and France would be the curses of the world. There would be no advantages in constitutional institutions. He had read that very day a letter from the re presentative of that country in Athens, that able and distin guished individual, Sir E. Lyons, which proved that a good understanding should exist between France and England. It was by the understanding which subsisted between them that Greece now possessed a limited monarchy with all its preroga tives. The letter to ,which he referred was dated on the 10th of January last, and he rejoiced to know that M. Piscatory, the Minister of France, decidedly approved of what had been done by both Governments. The representatives of one class of opinions in that House—the representatives, if he might presume to say so, of extreme po pular opinions, and the Noble Lord opposite, the head of a great party in that House, declared their concurrence in the sentiment he ventured to express. The great body of the people of this country had no wish to refer to past animosities, and those national antipathies, which ought to be buried in oblivion. They admitted the glary of France—that it was inferior in military gory to no country in the world—that it obtained that reputation in war by the skill of its great com manders, and the national valour of its men ; but he hoped that France herself—and her great and powerful—would not think it necessary to stir up hostile feelings for the purpose of securing to her a reputation of which she could not stand in need.—(Cheers.) He hoped that this general concurrence of the House of Commons as to the value of having friendly relations subsisting between both countries would prove to France that this was also the honest opinion of the people of England.--(" Hear, hear," and cheers.) NobleeWi a i r Lred i e n sp ohr i de . t r i‘ t o Tbihj lreland ee , syp,i3n i he sopne would i se speech hf th the Government regarding mi tat t e ti he l at c ohuand example trb ye. o n f the Td he e.. wottlti bs - muntatn,l, and tho:p wl,o violated it would he , tried before the legally coustitutt a tribunals of the country. It was impossible to refer to the subject of the present legal proceedings, without, in some manner or other, prejudicing ' the parties who were the subject of it. The Noble Lord fixed a particular day for his motion regarding Ireland, anticipating that the trials would have then concluded. On that occasion the political state of Ireland would be brought under the consideration of the House, end he would, therefore, abstain altogether from reference either to the particular subject of the trials, or to the events neces sarily and immediately connected with them. The only other subject of very great importance was the subject of the corn laws. The Hon. Gentleman stated that in 1840 he (Sir R. Peel) had complained that the Government had not brought under consideration the important question of the corn• laws in the speech from the throne. He remembered havin; made these'observations, and considering the magnitude of the subject, and the complicated interests involved in them, he thought it was the duty of the Government, as they had made up their minds regarding the question of the corn-laws, to intimate their intentions through the speech from the throne.—( Hear.) The Ilonourable Gentleman said that as the subject of the corn-laws was not mentioned in the speech from the throne, he apprehended that they did not mean to alter the corn. laws.—(Load cheers from the Ministerial side of the House. Amongst which the vehemence of Colonel Sibthorp's cheer w as distinctly audible, and excited laughter from the Opposition.) If the Government had it in contemplation to submit to the House a proposition for altering the system of corn-laws, he would have thought it his duty to mention it in the speech from the throne. The Noble Lord said be thought the agricultural interest, which he sometimes defended—(Laughter)—had a right to complain of the course the Government were pursuing. The Noble Lord said there were three cliffs rent opinions regarding the corn-laws. Lord JOHN RUSSELL—I said with respect to commer cial policy. Sir R. PEEL—One of those opinions was, that it was de sirable to protect articles of foreign produce--that the present protection was not sufficient —that they ought to be regardless of the imports from foreign countries, but. that the true policy was the protection of native industry. Another opinion was the total and immediate abolition of all duties—a protection which merely existed as the means of raising the revenue should be incidental. A third opinion war—and the Noble Lord said that he thought he had the honour of concurring with him (Sir R. Peel) as to the general principle, namely, that although it was true in a new state of society there should not be protec tion to native industry, yet in a country having such vast into. rests, burdened with so large an amount of taxation, it would be dangerous at once to apply the abstract principle of free trade, as they would thereby incur the risk of disturb ing capital and injuring vested interests by the removal of that protection. He thought it would be wrong to apply to this country the principles that might be abstractedly right, and he thought such application would produce confusion and distrac tion.—(" Hear, hear," from the Ministerial benches.) The Noble Lord said the difference between them lay in the fixed duty and the fluctuating scale. He ( Sir Robert Peel) re tained his own opinions, but he agreed so far in principle with the Noble Lord regarding its application.—(Hear, hear, and cheers.) The Noble Lord proposed protection by a fixed duty; he (Sir R. Peel) thought it was better secured by a sliding scale. The Noble Lead said that the Members of that House and of the other House of Parliament had Sub jected themselves to an imputation by maintaining protection ; but would they not, if a fixed duty were established, be also sub ject to that imputation ? The Noble Lord asked why this tax should bs hid upon foreign corn, and not upon home-grown corn; and the Noble Lord instanced the cases of barley and malt,as a proof that revenue was raised from home pi oduce. If revenue (he said) were raised on barley and malt, why should it not be raised on home-grown corn ? Why not pursue as to %heat the same course as to barley, and why not subject the fos eign and the home barley to an equal duty? Ile stated last )ear, not because it is as in the contemplation of the Go vernment to alter the present law, but when pressed to make a declaration on the part of the Government—he did say that he would not, under all circumstances, pledge himself to adhere to the present law, for he thought that was a course inconsistent with the duty he owed h:s Sovereign and his country. He did not say that because he contemplated a change.—(" Hear, hear," from the Ministerial benches.) The Hon. Member said that there were two courses—either to maintain the pre sent law or to repeal it. As for the fixed duty, he thought it would be impossiole for the Government to maintain that. He (Sir R. Peel) thought whenever the present corn.lavvs were repealed—whenever that revolution took place in the present system of corn-laws, he ( Sir Robert Peel) would not be the supporter of it. He said now, as he said last session, that though he would not think it consistent with his public duty, be would not conciliate support by en gaging to adhere, under all circumstances, to a par ticular law he repealed, he did not contemplate any altera tion in the present law. The price of corn since the operation of the present law—( Renewed cries of " Hear, bear," from the Conservative benches)—the price of corn since the ope ration of the present law was as fixed as at any former period. Let them look to the price of corn for the last 4 or 5 years, and its variati'ins. He held in his hand a list of the prices of corn for the last 54 years—since 1790—the average price of wheat was 50s. Id. In 7 years of that period the average price of wheat was less than during the last four or five years. He thought the present law had operated favourably. He hoped that the general state'of the country would justify the expectations re garding it in the Queen's speech. Trade had revived in some of its most important branches, It should be remembered that great changes were made in the commercial policy of this country in the year 1843. When he (Sir R. Peel) last year stated in that House that there were indications of the improvement of trade, his observations were scouted with derision—that nothing could be greater or more hopeless than the depression. The iron trade was still in a depressed state, but he hoped the consumption of that article in branches of manufactures in which it was much used would cause its im provement. With respect to the revenue he would not pourtray its condition in bright colours. In the present year the usual deficiency , had been avoided, and there was amply sufficient to meet existing charges.—( Hear, hear .) He hoped the Go vernment had met Parliament under improved circumstances. —(Cries of " Hear, hear," from both sides of the House. ) Looking to their foreign policy they had not adjusted all the questions of difference in the United States, but they had re• moved those immediate obstructions to a good understanding which two years ago threatened the relations of amity between the two countries. In France, without a concession of either Government, he was justified in stating that a friendly under standing between the countries had been established ; that friendly understanding would be mutually advantageous to them in every quarter of the globe in which their interests weree concerned. He hoped that that de pression which caused so much suffering among the working classes—would at last be converted into grow. ing prosperity. There still existed in many parts of the country distress which they could not view without sympathy. Ile hoped they had been justified in stating that they (the Government had fulfilled their duty, and that they had met Parliament after having fulfilled the promises which they made, and the prospects which they held out, and that they had not been wanting in their duty to the Sovereign or to the country. The Right Hon. Baronet resumed his seat amidstgreat cheering. Lord PALMERSTON said he had viewed with great satis faCtion some of the announcements made. It was very grati fying to learn that the distress which continued so long and so severely was beginning to disappear—that the revenue was beginning to recover, and, with the addition of the income-tax, was likely to exceed the expenditure. Whether these results would have happened earlier from the measures which the Govern. ment, of which he (Lord P.) had been a Member, had proposed was another question. —( Laughter from the Ministerial benches. ) He would imitate the example of those who had preceded him, in not referring to the state of Ireland. He could not but remark upon the dilemma which his Noble Friend and the Hon. Members on that side of the blouse were said to have been reduced. It was said that one was for a fixed duty on foreign corn, and another for levying home. If the latter was admitted, it was said why not abolish all customs duti es. But there was no i ncons istency whatever—they levied d ut i es on the importat i on o f many articles coming from a b road, and there would not b e any a duty in consistency in imposing a duty upon all corn produced at without imposing a dutyh om e . The doc trine of the Right H on. Baronet was much more ex tensive than they were a ware of. They were for an i n direct u o t r y n on r odue corn e dcoming at from abroad on e duty, and no good reason had been s h ow n why foreign corn should not be subjected to an indirect taxation as well as oth er commodities. He p general satisfaction at th e successful terminationaripticofatthed in the eopelra tions in Canton, and which had been so satisfactory in their results. A treaty had been laid on the table, by which he was glad to perceive that all the privileges which had been granted to England had been extended to every other country, in the world ; that was a very wise and fitting condition. Whether the proposition was made by the English Government, or by the Emperor of China, it was entitled to commendation. Sir ROBERT PEEL —It was a suppl eme ntary treaty. Lord PALMERSTON—N o man could feel more strongly_ than himself the desirableness of coatinuing on terms of amity between this country and Prance, and would prove mutually advantageous. It had been lately stated in the French Chambers by o n ne c ie e the greatest Ministers that country ever had, that between years IMO and 1836 there was a most cordial union between that had had that country and England, and the effect of that unio n fthe world. a most material tendency in preser v ing the peace o They were constantly taunted during that period ofe six headof the (Hear, hear. ) f years— certainly not by the Right Hon. Baronet, at th t to which he then belonged and with which he immediately surrounding him, but by personswas now acting , Government, nor by the Honourable Members of ft thattha t moment pary with being subservient to the policy of France. lie (Lord Palmerston) stated, whenever that unmeritedreproach made, that that alliance would last u long as theinterests policy of the two countries, real or supposed, were identical ; and that when those interests, real or imaginary, were no longer identical, whenever they began to diverge, the alliance would at once become less cordial. The interests of the two countries had become less identical, not because England had parted from France, but because France choosing, as she had a full right to do, to change her views , was made, and the policy of the two countries necessarily became divergent. b ß e u e t am he e m m u o s s t t s a a p y that pare in n t,th tht transaction e a eoorsewhiah E in ng s l v a h n ich divergence drursnedlvas the same which she had marked out for herself long before, and which she had steadily followed out with the eo-operation naitreatehnaedd any her r s f e r l o fi m sh t o h b e e un happy ets j of France. Their course of policy from the first was to rescue Europe state of from in view, and if she had h ad the misfortune to differ with France, she at least differed fr om her along with the other Powers. Glad was he now to find tha t the co ldness and irritation which t the Syria. dangers Eg which h d Bever h succeeded those events bad disappeared, and that now a cor dial and complete understanding existed between the two countries. He could not, however, avoid expressing some re all respects the same which s o stron g l y and happily marked the grets that the results of this co r dial understanding were not in union of the two countries on the former occasion. The re sults which followed the good understanding between France and England, from the years 1830 to 1836, were, he was proud to say, conducive to the interests of liberty and happi ness of mankind in general. The result of that understanding was, first, that Belgium was rescued from being subdued and annexed by force to the Netherlands. The next result was that Portugal was freed from the despotism of Don Miguel, and admitted to the enjoyment of free and constitutional govern ment. The next result was, that Spain enjoyed the inestima ble advantages of popular institutions ; and another advantage of that alliance was, that the two nations laid aside their jealousies as maritime Powers, and agreed upon those treaties of le3l and 1833, which, by conceding the right of search, aimed the most effectual blow in putting down the slave trade. Now, if he looked at what might probably be the result of the present union between the two countries, he was sorry to say he could not see, nor dare he hope to see, fruit of the same kind. He saw—whether in consequence or not remained to be proved—he saw in Spain, that that person, who, by the admis sion of the Right Hon. Gentleman opposite (Sir R. Peel), had been the main cause of peace and the chief preventive of anarchy—he saw him expelled the country, popular liberty suspended, military license triumphant, and Spain governed by proclamatiems instead of by law.—( Hear, hear.) That was the state of Spain. He greatly feared that another result of this alliance would be, that the progress which had been made towards the suppression of the slave trade would be interfered with. That, indeed, those treaties which had produced this progress were about to be rescinded; and he would tell the Right Hon. Baronet and his colleagues, that if they were done away with, a great blow wou l d be given, and a great injury inflicted on the general inter e sts of humanity.—(Hear, hear.) The Right Hon. Baronet (Sir R. Peel) h a d a d verte d to t h e fact of the treaty which was s i gned last year between England and the United States, as having removed all causes of present misunderstanding, and facilitated most materially the settle ment of others. H e (Lord Palmerston) regretted to say that lie could not see, in the last speech of the President of the United States, when. speaking of the Oregon territory, -any manifestation whatever of that feeling of conciliation and good will which they were so positively assured was to he the result of the treaty of last year.—( Hear, hear.) He saw exactly the same language with regard to the Oregon territot as they had been accustomed to see with respect to the North-Eastern boundary—the same talk of arms—the same advice to establish mili•ary posts.—( Hear, hear.) He could not, therefore, but fear that the same arguments which had been successful with England, in regard to the North-Eastern territory, would be used by America, and expected to prevail in regard to the ferr;tery on the shores of the Pacific. In February, 1842, it would be in the recollection of lion. Members the speech from the throne annourieed that Government was in negotiation with several Powers, which it was gusted would lead to conventions founded on just principles, and which would lead to great commercial advantages to all parties. Now they had never yet heard who were these several Powers, nor what was the result of these negotiations. It might be presumed, however, that amongst the Powers thus alluded to were France, the United States, Portugal, Spain, and Brazil. He (Lord Palmerston) believed that with none of those Powers hat con ventions been concluded. They perhaps would hear, if not that night, then in the course of the session, what were these negotiations, and what were the results of them. They knew that with the United States the determination of the English Government to maintain the sliding scale forbade success to any negotiation—they knew that with Portugal negotiations had not succeeded—they knew nothing likely was to be done in Spain—they knew there had been negotiations with Brazil, and questions might probably be asked, negotiations being at an end, why they had not there been successful ? They had indeed been informed that the cause of the want of success was this—that the British Government said they were prepared to admit Brazilian sugar, the product of free labour, but not sugar the produce of tree labour; and, consequently, qa ell het events considerably slaver y modified.th country The o ff, mus ( bfe the abolished, or r o Government might have been made in good faith, but if it was, then it showed littla knowledge of the feelings, habits, and prejudices of the Brazilians. He (Lord Palmerston) would as soon think of asking English gentlemen to abolish the corn-faws, as expect to see the Brazilian Government abo lish slavery. '1 he one was just as likely as the other. Ru mours had prevailed of the intention of Government to pro pose some considerable ameliorations of the criminal law. If such intention did prevail, they might reasonably have ex pected some allusion to it in the speech from the throne. To it, however, ho could offer no objection, for instead of pledging them to so many things, as supposed by the Hon. Member for Montrose (Mr. Hume), it pledged no one to anything. In deed, there was nothing in it, and, therefore, he should give his vote for the address in answer to it, and against the amend ments which had been submitted to the House.—( Hear. ) Mr. ROEBUCK said the debate of that evening presented a most ex'raordinary spectacle. He had always learned to be lieve that the time for the proper consideration of the subjects which had only been hinted at was upon the occasi , n of making an address to the Crown. But the Noble Lord the Member for London (Lord John Russell) had taken to the error that an address to the Crown was a mere form, and that sentiment had been re-echoed by the Right Hon. Baronet at the head of the Government, so that they were to understand that the bu siness for which they had met there was merely to listen to two speeches delivered by gentlemen in somewhat extra ordinary dresses, and that such was to be the sum and substance of that night's debate. Ought it to be believed that at the moment when the very union was threatened that nothing was to be said on that matter or on other questions of vital policy ? For at that moment they must all know that the danger was imminent of a dissolution of the union. They could not escape from that danger, and yet at that precise moment were they called on by the leaders on both sides of the House to be silent on the subject. Did that become the position of parties in Parliament, did it become the position of the Ministry, to be utterly silent, callous as it were, in such anxious and vital cir cumstances, to the happiness and prosperity of the two countries? There were at present two particular questions which deeply interested and agitated the two countries ; the one the corn laws, and the other the legislative union between England and Ireland. And both these questions by both sides of the House were consigned to entire oblivion.—( Cries of " No, no.") He thought great danger would accrue to the union by the course of conduct which the House chose to adopt that night. —( Hear, hear). He thought that the House was playing O'Connell's card, when it allowed the report to go to Ireland that it suffered the present proceedings in that country to pass without comment.—(Cheers). They were doing all they could to effect the separation of the two countries in passing over altogether the question which agitated all Ireland from end to end.—( Hear, hear). O'Connell would say that the House had done more for him in passing over these questions in silence, than he could have effected for himself.—( Hear.) Whatever might be the result, upon the Noble Lord the Member for London must rest the sole responsibility, because he stood forward as the great leader of the Liberal party in this country, of passing over those two great questions, the repeal of the cern-laws and the repeal of the union.—( Cheers). He (Mr. Roebuek) was obliged to put aside the substantive motion which he had intended to bring forward respecting the grievances of the people. He did not at all agree in the opinion that the trials in Dublin would be affected by the discussion which he had proposed to bring forward. But he was obliged to postpone his purpose, because he was deserted by the great body of the _Liberal party in that House. . Lord HCIWICK did not think that the Hon. Gentleman who bad just'sat down had rightly represented the opinions of the Right Hon. Baronet opposite, or of his Noble Frie n d w ho sat near him. He (Lord Howick) did not think that because the House did not enter into a discussion of all the topics which might be alluded to in the speech, the address was a mere form. It would be very inconvenient on the occasion of moving the address to enter into the discussion of a great num ber and variety of topics.—( Hear, hear.) The Hon. and Learned Gentleman had said, and said truly, that the present state of Ireland was highly momentous. But he would ask the Hon. Gentleman whether it would be convenient to take up the discussion of these two great questions, the corn-laws and the union, in a debate upon the address ?—( Hear, hear. ) The Queen's speech was of great use in laying before the House the general topics of the session. But if the House was to go into a discussion of each of these, it would be a useless waste of time, since the subjects must come before them one by one in a more tangible form.—( Hear, hear.) When, therefore, the Hon. and Learned Member said that in voting the address without the discussion of those subjects, they were consigning the grievances of Ireland and the corn-laws to obli vion, he had most grossly misapprehended both the Right Hon. Gentleman and .his Noble Friend.—( Hear, hear. ) On the part of his Noble Friend and himself, he would say that not one moment should be lost in bringing before. the House both these topics. At the same time he must express his moat entire concurrence in what had been said on both sides of the House, that it would be most inconvenient to bring forward those questions respecting Ireland during the present trial.—( Hear, hear.) It would be impossible to discuss the measures which were necessary to give peace to that unhappy country, the objects of the present trials, the policy of the Government, and the manner in which the prosecution had been conducted. Could they enter into a discussion of that description without appearing in that Howe to be making speeches which would be addressed, not so much to the House as to the jury which were to try the case?_( Hear.) It was an evil, unavoidable in trials of this description, that they enlist poltieal feeling, and there was in Ireland no evil greater than the effect of political feeling upon the administra tion of justice.—( Hear, hear.) hat was the curse of Ireland—( Loud cheers)—and ,could it be wise to make the jury -box now, more than ever, the scene of party warfare ?—( Cheers.) No; but he trusted that when the trials were concluded, his Noble Friend would bring these subjects before the House ; and he trusted that the House would see the necessity of taking measures, before too late, to rescue Ireland from the danger with which that country and the nation were threatened —(Cheers.) As to the corn-laws, he tho fight the question too large to be discussed on an occasion like the present ; yet he could not help remarking upon what had fallen upon this subject from the lion. Bart. opposite. The Right li on . Gentleman had said that he would not con sent to a fixed duty for the sake of revenue, and he made that declaration in such a manner as to render a compromise be tween the two parties impossible.—( Hear, hear.) Whether the Right Hon. Gentleman was a good friend to the agricul turists, or was consulting their interests in making such a compromise impossible, it was not for him to say; but he thought that the time for compromise was not yet gone by. When the Hun. Gentleman, and those who acted with him, came to that determination, they reduced the question to this: " Are opinions to hainehissuehe had we to maint a i n th e corn • l aws, or i s the i mportat i on o f corn t o be free.—(Ch eers. ) Th at was t h e state to w hi c h t h e ques tion was now b roug h t.—( Cheers.) And whenever i t was brought he s 1 (Lorda vowed s i i o n w e ' c k e h ) e w fi n r u s l t d se a t d h f o e r o e t n o t h t l a s e oin t House in Parliament, and on the hustings, in a purely agri cultural county, in favour of the free importation.—(Cheers.) After the opinions which the Right Hon. Baronet had expressed it would be idle for those upon the Opposition side of the present House of Commons to make any propositron for a fixed duty. But if the Right Hon. Gentleman should hereafter re-consider his opinion and give them the offer of a compromise, he (Lord Howick) for one would gladly close with the offer.—( Hear, hear.) Before he sat down, he must express his cordial con currence in those principles of foreign policy to which the Right Hon. Baronet had given expression. He believed that there was no greater curse to the world, to civil sation, and humanity, than the carrying on in every court in Europe, a petty struggle between a so-called French and English party. —( Hear.) He abominated the whole system.—( Cheers. ) He thought th a t we ou gh t to abstain from giving advice to other nations at to the mode of their carrying on their own affairs:--(He ar , hear.) When our Mi n i s t er ven t ure d t o g i ve his advice to th e Court at which he represented us, he grew, by little and little, more exasperated against these whom he could not infinence, and more attached to the party which ap peared to yield to his counsel. In nine cases out of ten where this conduct was pursued, two factions were raised—a French faction and an Fnglish faction • and the unfortunate country became . the prey of both.—(Great cheering.) He cordially agreed with the Right Hon. Baronet in depre cating that sort of interference, and he could not help object ing to one expression made use of by his Noble Friend, the Member for Tiverton, in adverting to the affairs of Spain. " The late Regent hadlfallen from power, and the state of things was such as one could hardly describe as a military despotism." Now he (Lord Howick) concurred with his Noble Friend in regretting what had recently occurred in that country. But i at the same time he rejoiced that the Right Hon. Baronet and the French Government had abstained from taking any part in those affairs.—( Cheers.) He hoped that the people of Spain would settle their own affairs without any interference, for he thought that was the only way in which they could return to a state of security of person and property.—( Hear, hear.) He did not mean on that occasion to pursue the topic further, but from had what fallitn from gentlemen on both sides, he did not think he could have abstained from troubling the House so far. —( Cheers. ) Mr. WYSE could not allow it to go abroad, that the repre sentatives of Ireland were insensible to the condition in which the country stood at present, or that they would lose any op portunity of expressing their indignation at the condition in which it was at present placed, and their anxiety about the dangers to which it was exposed, or that they shrank from the expression of their opinions on one side or the other. They did net wish to throw any obstacle in the way of justice, or to interfere with the sacredness of the jury- box ; but, at the same time, he, for one, was determined not to allow that debate to pass over without expressing his opinion that all the questions connected with the present pro ceedings in Ireland should be gone into on the earliest occa sion. He went home to his constituents with the statement that nothing had been done for Ireland but a Bill of Pains and Penalties, and he came back to that House with feelings of still greater exasperation and indignation. The result of the course which Government was pursuing would be, to leave only two parties in Ireland, whose animosity to each other would be more bitter than ever had been known even in that country. The question was now raised, whether the future rule of Ireland was to be in the spirit of judicial tyranny or as a close corporation? The O'CONOR DON entirely concurred in what had fallen from his lion. Friend the Member for Waterford, and he wished it to be understood that if he concurred in the ad dress they would take the opportunity of bringing the attention of the House to the grievances of Ireland. Mr. MILNER GIBSON wished to explain its a few words why he would vote for the amendment of his Hon. Friend. The proposition of his Hon. Friend was simply this. He wished the majority of that House to redress the grievances of the people at the same time that they provided for the expenditure of the State. Ile was glad to find that the Right Honourable Gentleman at the head of the Government had taken the advice of the Noble Lord the Member for London, and that he had given a pledge not to maintain the existing corn-law.—(Cheers.) He (Mr. Gibson) drew the inference from the speech of the Right Hon. Gentleman, that he Would not yield to any unreasonable re quest from the agriculturists to pledge himself to maintain the protective system. They could plainly see in the speech of the Right Hon. Gentleman, that when he intended to maintain any particular line of policy that he would pledge himself to maintain that policy. They saw that he would pledge himself to maintain the legislative union between England and Ireland. He (Mr. Gibson) knew perfectly well that neither the Itight lion. Baronet, nor any other Minister in the present. state of the country, would authorise a speech which pledged the Go. vernment to maintain a protective policy ; or that any Minister addressing the House upon his general views would do any thing more than say "at the present particular mo pent. I have no measure to submit to the consideration of Parliament." The Right Hon. Baronet bad taken a most judicious course. lie had left this an open question.—(Oh, oh.) Ile had pledged himself to no longer a period than a month. lie had said that if the abolition of the corn-laws were to take place within a month it. would be most disastrous to the country. He (Mr. Gibson) defied the flight Hon. Baronet, or any other Miniater, to stand up in his place that evening, and say in so many words, ".I will maintain the existing corn-laws." i e (Mr. Gib s o n ) was g l a d t h e Ri g ht li on . Gentleman had taken that course, because he differed in some measure i•h his lion. Friend the Member for Montrose, that it was desirable that the Right Hon. Baronet should pledge himself on the question—especially if he pledged himself to maintain the protective system.--( Laughter ) ing the authority the Right Honourable Gentleman was in the country—know ing the great consequence attached by the occupying tenantry to any distinct enunciation by the Right lion. Baronet with respect to this question. If he were to do so the pro prietor of the land would say to the occupying tenant, " I'cll may have faith that protection will be maintained—you may agree to pay higher rents—you may contract. safely to take leases at. higher rents, fur the Rig - ht lion. Gentleman will never give way." That would be the course taken by the landed proprietors if any distinct pledge were to be given by her Majesty's Government. He (Mr. Gibson) hoi t ied the oc cupying tenantry of the cc untry would see how unstable a foundation they had in former times rested upon. He hoped they would see how dangerous it was to place faith in any re. presentation that protection would be maintained. He (Mr. Gibson) would take the advice given by Honourable Gentlemen around him, and not trespass longer on the attention of the House, as there would be other opportunities of discussing these important ques tions. But he !.ailed with great satisfaction the movement which the Hon. Gentlemen opposite had taken upon themselves to conduet, in support of the protective system. lie thought it quite right, if they believed that the protective system was for the benefit of the labouring classes or the great body of the industrial community, that they should express their opinions in public, and all he asked of them was to confine themselves to rational argument and to intelli ent reasoning, and not allow themselves to be betrayed into abusive and discreditable language.— (Cheers and laughter.) The use of such language could not be justified on any side in the discussion of public questions. He could only say that if ever he had been guilty of it himself he would be very happy to express his sorrow for having been so betrayed. All he desired was that that this question should be discussed, by the two great inte rests of the community in a rational and intelligent spirit ; and he believed that if it were continued in that spirit, the landed proprietors would see that a system of free trade was more conducive to the commercial and manufacturing interest than one of restriction ; and that if free trade were to be adopted, the landed proprietors themselves would share in the general pros piirity which would accrue to the country at large. Sir R. PEEL thought it was hardly necessary for him to answer the Hon. Gent:eman. Ile apprehended the lion. Gentleman meant to be facetious, because he was himself smil ing. The lion. Gentleman had said that Ile (Sir R. Peel) was the advocate of the abolition, within a month, of all pro• tection to agriculture. That he (Sir Robert Peel) had said was that if such a measure was carried within a month within.. but disorder and confusion would ensue.—(Cheers. The Hon. Gentleman said that all he (Sir R. Peel) had said en the subject of the corn-laws was that he was not prepared to consent to a repeal of the corn-laws wehin a month. What he had really said—anti the House would recollect it, was that the Government intended to propose no alteration, and that if they had intended any alteration it would have been mentioned. The Government had never contemplated any alteration, ani they did not then contemplate any alteration. He said he believed that every man who well considered the duty of a Minister of this country who proposed to conciliate support, would see that on the part of the Government, in matters relating to the imposition of a duty not involving a great public principle, he could not involve an eternal principle. Mr. PLUMPTRE confessed that after the speech of the Hon. Member for Manchester he would not have been satis fied. But after the explanation of the Right Hon. Baronet he felt perfect satisfaction. He represented an agricultural con stituency, and he felt convinced that the speech of the flight, Hon. Baronet would prove perfectly satisfactory to them. He could assure Hen. Gentlemen opposite that they would never succeed in putting down the agricultural interest by clamour and combination. He trusted the Government would be firm in their determination to uphold the agricultural interest, for if it were once injured every other great interest of the country must suffer. Mr. BROTIIERTON said, that although he intended to vote with his lion. Friend the Member for Rochdale, he wished to guard himself against the supposition that he intended to enter into a compact against the granting of the supplies. He would never do so, because he believed that such means would never attain the object they had in view. lie had lately been waited upon by members of his own constituency, who had called upon him to enter his opposition to the granting of the supplies. his answer to them was, were he to grant their reqwst, they themselves would be the first to turn round and condemn him for having done so. They would discern that a small minority were wasting the whole of the session in useless divisions against the majority, while the grievances of the people remained unconsidered. He could never agree to such a course as that. With respect to what had fallen from the Hon. Seconder of the address, he (Mr. 13rotherton) was ready to admit that improvement had taken place in some of the branches of our manufactures ; but in making that ad mission, lie must say that there was every reason to expect that that improvement could not continue. lie must confess that he did not draw the same inference from the speech of the Right Hon. Baronet as the Hon. Member for Manchester. Ile fully understood the cheer which followed the declaration of the Right Hon. Baronet, that a fixed duty would not be pro • posed by him. The country would soon see who were their mas ters. The landed interest would press them to starvation point, and then, relaxiog a save them from actual death. it was clear the Right lion. Bart. intended to keep up the sliding scale. If it should please Providence to afflict us with another bad harvest, what would be the condition of the pet). ple? Were the landed proprietors determined to keep up their protection at the expense of the lives of the people? He, white he had the power, would use every er,desvour to get rid of this law, which was a disgrace to the statute book. lie saw the lion. and Gallant Member for Lincoln present. Now, he had read in a newspaper, that at a meeting where he was present they talked of the League, and the language used by them ; but it was said that if Mr. Cobden came to Lincoln shire they shculd throw him into the river.—(Laughter.) Was not that holding out a premium for assassination ?--( A laugh.) Were men to be threatened with being drowned when they went to a place for the purpose of doing good? Now, there was a Mr. Chaplin, a great landed proprietor, he was in possession of upwards of 20,000 acres cf land, which within the present century was not worth Is. an acre, and now it was worth 255., and yet that individual wanted protection.— ( Hear, hear.) What protection, he would ask, had the poor man ? None.—( Hear, hear. ) It had been attempt, dto be shown that lie had protection, that protection was given to the farmer and labourer, but neither one nor the other had been shown.—( Hear, hear.) And now the landed class clung to protection because it was bent ficial to them. He felt no doubt that the people would feel the injustice of these things, and would so be enabled to put an end to them. Mr. VILLIERS and Mr. MUNTZ rose together, but the latter gave way, and Mr. Villiers proceeded to address the House : Ile felt greatly indebted to his lion. Friend, the Member for Montrose, for moving the amendment he had done. lie had mentioned the subject to him, and his (Mr. Villiers') only reason for either not seconding the motion or moving it was that, it was his intention to bring the corn-laws b 'fore the House in a distinct form.—( Hear, hear. ) He must confess that lie did not altogether think the mode adapted by the lion. Member for Montrose the most. efficient mode of breigitig so important a subject before the House.— ( Hear, hear.) file constitnencies had had the subject most ably and faithfully dis cussed before them, and they ought to have an opportutnty of asking their Members which way they intended to vote. 'f his subject had been brought under the attention of the consti tuency by a great combination of intelligence, worth, and in fluence, but no fair discussion had been taken on the subject in that House.—(Hear.) Indeed he felt that this question must. be discussed out of doors, and, in fact, carried there, before it could be carried in that House.—( Hear, hear. ) And if there was any doubt upon that subject that doubt had been removed by what had taken place that night ; because the Right. lion. Baronet at the head of her Majesty's Government had shown that he felt he could not maintain the present system or abandon ir.—(Hear, hear.) That was the situation of the question. Those who took independent views of the question felt it was not tenable or consistent with the interests of the people. 'I he Right Hon. Baronet felt that by the principles of the Constitution he could not abandon it. The Noble Lord, then Member for the City of Londoinhadtaid, in so many words that it was necessary for the landed interest and the aristocracy, and that they had a direct interest in the question.—( Hear.) Since the revolution of 1788 the aristocracy had governed the country. The Government was not the Government of the Queen, but the Minister was the Minister of the landed pro prietors ; they it was who governed the country.—( Hear.) It was not, therefore, to be wondered at that the Right Hon. Baronet would not alter a law which he knew if he did he would not be safe in his place in the Government for a month, or a week, or a day ; in short, that his Government would lie at an end the moment he abandoned a system from which the people suffered so much, and the landed proprietors received such benefits.—(Hear, hear.) The protective policy was the most important question that could be agitated in this country it was the question upon which everything must turn in the country, for it effected the physical condition of the people in every respect.—( Hear, hear. ) The• present protective system could not be maintained consistently with the good of the people of the country. lie thought it did not become the Right lion. Baronet to countenance demonstrations against the proceedings of the Anti-Corn-law League in order to en deavour to persuade the people that the repeal of the corn ' laws would be injurious to them. lie had read a work in the Foreign and Colonial Review, in which he believed the Right Hon. the President of the Board of Trade, had some share. The Government were claiming praise for the improvement of the general condition of the country ; but what were the causes of the fluctuation that had taken place in that rendition they were not told. Now the whole of the question was handled in the work he] had alluded to, which had been just put forth, which was a consideration of the commercial policy of the pre sent Government in lowering the duties and the tariff. It was in that work viewed under five heads : —lts effects on trade; on increased demand for manufactures ; increased demand for employment ; its effect cn shipping ; and its effect on egrienl tune ; and in that work the very arguments held out by those who were advocates for free trade were prominently- put forth. It was said it was impossible to have free trade and protective duties ; this very work proved that by free trade the people would have cheaper clothing, cheaper dwellings, and cheaper every thing, if they had free trade.—(Hear, hear.) This work stated that its effects on trade were reduc tion of duty, increased consumption, and increased trade. That in every respect increased consumption of foreign arti cles led to increased demand for manufactures; that in creased demand for employment would be increased by free trade ; that its effect on shipping was to increase the foreign trade, and also the demand for ships; and its effect on agri culture was the importation of cattle ; and that an extensive improvement in trade would follow, and be participated in by agriculturists. These were the sentiments that had been put forth under the especial patronage, he believed, of the Presi dent of the Board of Trade. That Right Hon. Gentleman, last session, had been charged with being the author of a particular article in this Review, and he did not deny it. Nov was not this, he would ask, trifling with the people? The population of this country was increasing at a ft ightful rate. It had been said that distress was decreasing. For his own part, he believed that there never was such destitution known as was in London at the pre seet moment. Was it not horrid to see women destroying their children sooner than that they should starve, and was it nut a lamentable thing when people committed crimes in order to hurry them into prison, because they were more comfortable there than in their own homes ? And jet they were told no change or alteration was to be permitte d to t a ke r acr e i o n these laws, whatever may be the consequences to ht an adherence to them.—(Cheers.) Whatever mg t e the consequences to the people, the landed proprietors had deter. mined that if one iota of those duties were diminished, bye which the rents were increased, they would not permit the Minister to retain his place.—( Cheers and counter cheers.) lie believed that in bygone times such intimations might have been privately conveyed to a Minister; but he believed that never before lead announcements been publicly made, so indecent, so haughty, and so dictatorial as: those which had been recently made by the landowners at their various public meetimes.—( Loud cheers. ) They had openly threatened that if the Minister did not do that which was the most injurious to the interests of the country, bus which, at the same time, increased their rents, he should he put out of office. —( :beers. ) Such was ti}e language held by Noble Dukes and Noble Lords at those meetings. There was no abuse which had not, at those meetings, been lavished on the Right lien. Baronet. For himself, he bad no wish to see the Right lion. Baronet removed from office. He would as soon that the Right lion Barnett should be in office as any other person who supported the restrictive system ; but what was to him a source of regret, was to see—lie hoped the Right Hon. Barone would excuse the term—the want of spirit which the Right lion. Baronet exlabited,—(Cheering and counter. cheering. ) Why did he not turn Fiend upon these eeaple—( A laugh from the Tory benches) —why did he not show to them their utter helplessness wi bout him.--(immense cheering from all parts of the House.) Why did he not show to them how utterly unable they would i.e to administer any system of Government without him ?—( Chet( rs)—how, with all their rank, and property, and pride, they were compelled to fall back upon .persons of ()dent, and experiance, and capacity ?—(Loud cheers.) If the views which the Right. Hon. Baronet enter tained were just and scund, why did he not carry them out, and rely upon the people ?—( Loud chaers.) By that means be wou'd maintain ,hat high standing, and attain that sound rep uta'ion, for the sake of which alone he had said that he valued office.—( Loud cheers.) Let him set at defiance that miserable party which urged him to do that ehich would he injurious to the county. They had not the capacity to manage the affairs of the nation, even if her Maje-ty should send to the Duke of this, or the Duke of that, to form an Administra tion.—( Loud cheers.) t%'hn wete the victims of pride on the one side, and of avarice on the other ?- the people.— ( Hear, hear, and cheers.) Could they, then, wonder •that, as a representative of that struggling people, his Hon. Friend the Member for Rochdale, should make a motion to stop the supplies and to create confusion when they were suf fering under- such great and erring grievances without any hope of redress?—( Loud cheers)—or could they wonder at the influence which his other lion Friend (Mr. Cobd , n) who did not go so far as his lion. Friced the Member for Roch e( ile, whodid not desire any organic charge—could they be sur prised at the influence %%hi ch he had attained over the ()pinions of the people—(Loud cheers)—when justice was thus refused them?—( Loud cheers.) bile they re faseel to do justice to the people, what right had they to complain of his efforts?— (Cheers. ) Could they wonder at the power of that great combination of which he was at the head—( Loud cheers) — j while the people were suffering such evils and were hopeless of obtaining redress?—( Loudetheers. ) He entreated the Right lion. Gentleman to consider the state of the people, and if they treated their distresses with indifference they would find that they hail committed the greatest error that a Government • could possibly commit.—(Cheers.) Mr. GLADSTC)NE rose to explain. The lion. Gentleman opposite laboured under a misapprehension. lie had made a quotation from an article which had appeared in a recent number of a periodical publication, and had accused him (Mr Gladstone) of having been the author of that article. Now, not only was he (Mr. Gladstone) not the author of the article, but he was not aware who was the author, and he had never read a line of it.—( Cheers and !atwitter.) Sir JOILN HANMER said that. when the Right Hon. Member for Wolverhampton spoke of the sufferings of the people, he tom lied a chord which vibtated, not only in his (Sir J. Hamner's) heart, but in the hearts of all those who sat on his (the Ministee ial) side of the house.—(Loud cheers.) Whe ther the landowners were right or wrong in their political economy the statement that they were at all regardless of the in terest or of the suffering of the people was untrue—(Cheers) —an.l could be rebutted—(Cheers)—by every act of every gentleman belonging to the landed interest who had conic for ward in public life.—(Cheers.) He thought it was by no means difficult to discover some of the causes of the distress to which the Right lion. Member alluded as worthy of being seriously investigated by Parliament. He depended greatly upon our fareign t rade.—Cheers. ) Now, all trade consisted in a double gyration. Hon. Members opposite had specially adverted to free trade, and he knew that it was the opinion of many persons that they should establish free trade with all the world, without the slightest regard to the duties which foreign I nations imposed upon our productions. Now, it appeared to him that it stood to common sense that when an import duty was unfairly placed upon our productions by foreign nations they must operate upon the whole course of national exchange. The labouring population had suffered greatly from deprese shin from whilleh they were now recovering gradually, he be lieved in consequence of the good harvest. Free trade was a good thing.—(Cheer.s.) Ile only wished to see it carried into effect—(Cheers)--when he denied that that was free trade which dist egarded the impediments thrown in the way of trade by other nations. lie knew that many high author-oh s were against him—he knew that Mr. Deacon Hume had said that it would be fir their interest to diminish all duties on their im. ports, regardless of the conduct of foreign countries in that re spect; but, with all respect fcr that gentleman, he must beg leave to deny the conclusions to which he had arrived.—( Hear, hear.) lie hoped the Right Hon. Baronet would follow up the line of policy which he had commenced last year, of treating the colonies as integral parts of the mother country. With the colonies we could always have free trade, without any fear of hostile tariffs ; and, considering their variety and extent, there was scarcely any commodity which we could not obtain ft= our colonies. He trusted to see our colonial trade fully developed,, and our trade with foreign countries increased, on the reciprocity principle, and by that means the demand for labour in this country would be increased, and its indus try developed. lie hoped that the demand of the people in Ite42, when, unfortunately, instead of exhibiting the effects of their industry, they were forced to show their desti tution ire the public streets—he hoped that the demand made by the people of a fair day's wages for a fair day's work would never be obliterated from the minds of the Members of that house.—( Cheers. ) Any man who could forget it was un worthy of a seat in that House.—( Cheers. ) That question was at the bottom of all the evils of our social system. He loped the attention of Parliament would be ermstantly directed to tt ; and he considered that the colonies afforded a constantly incr.. wing sphere For th.. en.rloy:nput of ,ur capital and of our labour, and he trusted that through those means the desires of the people might be accomplished.—(Cheers ) Mr. GIBSON rose to explain. He should he curry to misstate or misunderstand the sta'ement of the Right lion. Baronet. Ile had understood the Right. Hon. Gentleman to soy, in reference to a change in the corn-laws, that he did not contemplate any change, but. he did not understand him to say hat the maintenance of the corn-laws s betted permanently form a part of his policy, or that be would, under every cir cumstance, adhere to the protective system.—(Cheers. ) He did not understand the Right lion. Berm-let to say that he would maintain the present corn-law system as part of his po licy.— (Cheers. ) Mr. SCAR LETT thought it. was singular that on the first occasion on which a gentleman connected with the Anti- Corn-law Ceague should have addressed the House during the present session, he should have accidentally, no doubt, misre presented the declaration of the Right lion Gentleman. He congratulated the House or, what. had taken place, as he con sidered it of the utmost importance that the declarations: of the Right Hon. Baronet should be resoled from the misrepre sentations of the Anti-Corn-law League. He distrusted the Anti. Corn-law League, and no one who had not wit nessed it would believe the state of vexation and irri tation which the proceedings of that League had in flicted on the country. It had prevented the outlay of capital on land, and had impedA the improvement of agricul ture. it had been stated that the League intended to interfere in the election of Members to that House. fie took that opportunity of protesting against such conduct as a gross breach of the privileges of that. House. —( Cheers and laughter). If it was a gross breach of their privileges for a Veer to int, tiers in the election of Members to that House, how much more was it a breach of their privileges for any body of men to enter into a great combination—a conspiracy to raise money for the pur pose of inte;fering generally in the election of Members of Parliament? Such a body was never before known, tor could it long exist consistently with the public safety. It was attempt big to sow dissensions between a'l classes of the country, to in timidate the I. gislat ure, and to unsettle the public mind upon great questions lately sett'ed by l'asliament, in contempt of Parliamentary authority. The authors, the promoters and the subscribers of the League, taking upon themselves, as they did, a sort of dictation to the country, ought to he regarded as en gaged its a great criminal conspiracy, deserving of every dis couragement and of every mark of displeasure. Mr. MUNTZ said he felt that he should not be doing his duty to his constituents and the country if he suffered the speeches of the Right Hon. Baronet and the Noble Lord to pass wi•hout obseevati ,n. Ile had learned to his surprise that they were all in a state of prosperity. It was singular that he always heard the best report of affairs away from his own town. With all the boasted improvement, however, there was scarcely any alteration in the price of manufactured articles, and no one article had advanced in price up to that moa merit, and some had even been reduced. The question of mployment was a question of profit. The middle classes were glad to be the medium of feeding the lower, but then they themselves must receive some profit in return for their investments.—( Hear, hear.) He would advise the Right Honourable Baronet not to halloo till he was out of the wood.—( Hear.) An advance in prices—sueh an advance as would secure a fair remuneration to the em plojer—was necessary to seeurepermanent prosperity.—( Hear.) A good deal bad been said about improvemeot in the state of the revenue. Undoubtedly it was nothing but right that the income should be equal to the expenditure of the country, and he had supported the property-tax, because he believed that that mate of increasing the revenue was less open to objection than many others. But when they considered the sum which hod been raised by the property-tax, and added to (hie the Chinese money, he did not see that there was any great cause for congratulation. If those sources of income did not exist, where would be the increase ?—( Hear, hear.) It was scarcely to be supposed that the Noble Lord anti the Right lion. Ba ronet knew any more about the state of the country than they were told, and no doubt they believed in the alleged improve ment ; but from his own knowledge he was enabled to state, that sa nicely were the English balanced with foreign manu factures, that if they were to rise only two-and-a-hall per cent., the English trade would materially suffer. Let them not boast or brag of improvement until they saw that it was based on a permanent foundation. Mr. M. PHILIPS said no one would more rejoice in the improved condition of the country than himself, but he believed that the improvement was exaggerated ; at present it was very limited in indication, and it was too much to conclude that they were entering on a certain career of prosperity. The im provement was rather in the condition of the people from extra employment, than in the profits of the employers.—( Hear. ) lie regarded the low price of provisions as having made a most material change amongst the operative classes, and he wished he could conclude with any degree of certainty that further legislation in the same direction would produce that effect in a greater degree. Ile regretted that the speech of the Right Hon Baronet would convey to the minds of those who had been enduring so much suffering, that they were not to look for re lief at his hands by means of any alteration in the laws which regulated the price of food in this country. Ile was apprehensive that wheat would rise before many months had passed over their heads, and so surely as a rise took place so would the ability of the working classes to purchase manufactures be diminished. He did not, therefore, derive such confidence as some Hon. Members ap peared to have done, from present appearances. It was to be remembered, too,. that the price of the raw material of the cotton trade was from ? I d. to 1:d. per pound higher in this than in other countries. Ile extremely regretted this result with reference to the exportations to China, as he feared there wood be a large export of British manufactured goods w hich es ser t re not suited to the real wants of the country. The.tesa and they on was one which necessarily involved the s ug e ar tr d a u must relax the latter it they wished to push. tth,.whidctehlevtleitdh China. Nothing had been done, he re peated, r as of s expect great relief to the suffering he p t e the community. Is wee only by alterations in the duties on sugar, corn, and other that permanent prosperity could great articles of consumpt io n , be secured. With reference to the amendment of the Hon. Member for Roc hdale, after listening to all the arguments high he had broug ht forward, he must sa y that he could not concur' in the course which the Hon. Gentleman was taking, and he felt compelled to record his vote against the amendmen*. Colonel RANA/DON said if he acquiesced in the course which the Noble Lord proposed to take, it was only because ha believed that a more fitting time would present itself for dis.. £0 Try hey, p " in" b o or ea3a Ws.' Itsis ) neel e tigbt fts': igb:l Una be Lord be e n b le a res_ 0 '176 its ° t° wA rd se i t n but hef reg. ';a ,ur . ge flnO