The Sun. — London, England, 1836-03-05 00:00:00

IMPERIAL PARLIAMENT. HOUSE OF LORDS, Mica 4. ROYAL ASSENT. The LORD CHANCELLOR, the Earl Of SHAFTESBURY, and the Earl of ALBEMARLE sat at Four o'clock, as Commis sioners for giving the Royal Assent to the several Bills brought up for that purpose. The House of Commons having been summoned by the Yeoman Usher of the Black Rod, the SPEAKER, and seve ral Members, immediately afterwards appeared at the bar, when the Royal Assent was given in the usual form to the following Bills :—The Fifteen Millions Exchequer Bills Bill ; the Transfer in Aids Bill ; and the Dean Forest Bill. Their Lordships then adjourned during pleasure. . --=—.--_ The LORD CHANCELLOR resumed his seat on the Wool. nest at five o'clock. Lord KENYON presented a pe tition from Bushe, complaining of the conduct of a late Lord Chancellor (Brougham), with respect to an appeal, Bushe v. Lock which had been disposed of in the House, praying that it might be reheard, and the Judges summoned, as it was a question involving many points of common law.— (Hear, hear.) He was well aware, that by a standing order, such a petition could not be taken into considera tion on the day on which it was presented ; he therefore proposed to have it read now, and he would call their Lord ships' attention to it on Tuesday next. There was one point which he felt bound to notice ; the petition alluded to some proceedings which had taken place in the House, and therefore their Lordships might think it was irregular ; but as it referred only to judicial proceedings, and not to legislative proceedings, the petition was regular, and ought to be received ; for he did not think the protection of the House extended to its judicial proceedings, for the very forms of the House allowed the public to be present. Lord LYNDHURST had made inquiries of the Clerk et the table, and he was informed that one allegation in the petition was untrue, for there was actually an order of the House dispensing with the attendance of the Judges. The petition alleged that they had been discharged by the then Lord Chancellor. The petitioner prayed that the appeal might be heard on its merits. It was impossible that such a course of proceeding could be taken. The whole of the decisions in the books were against it : of the other facts he knew nothing. Lord WYNFORD would be the last person in the world to ask their Lordships to do anything which would be against the orders of the House. The petition referred to his opinion on the case. He certainly had a very strong opinion upon it, and adverse to the decision which had been come to. Though be had been present at the bearing of the case, the judgment was given without any intimation to him. Lord LYNDHURST said a full year and a half had expired between the hearing and the delivery of the judg ment by his Noble Friend (Lord Brougham.) If his No ble Friend (Wynford) was confined in the country by ill ness, that was no fault of any one's. The LORD CHANCELLOR was aware that there had a very considerable time elapsed between the hearing and the decision. It had been so clearly laid down by the Noble - and Learned Lord, that the cause could not be re heard, that it was unnecessary for him to say one word upon the subject. But even if such a course were allowed to be taken by the rules of the House, he would say that this was a case in which it was necessary for them to look and pro ceed with great caution—in fact, the petition ought not to be received, for it asked that the appeal be re-heard, because it had not taken the precise course which the petitioner, who was the disappointed party, thought was right. He had had the cause decided against him ; he naturally felt sore upon the subject, and now he came forward to say it was a case which ought to have been heard before the Judges. If the petition were riot received, he knew it. would be very adverse to the feelings of his Noble Friend (Lord B.), but he felt it his duty to state his feelings on the.matter. It would be opening a door to litigation, which would - be productive of very great inconvenience, if it was once inti mated that the judgment of that House was not final awl conclusive. Lord LvNnituasT and Lord Wysrean severally posed the presentation of the petition. • Lord HOLLAND said the petition was obiectionah:e in point of form, if it came in the nature of an appeal fro n tt:eir Lordr;hips'docision. What would be the consequeutT of receiving such pap.srs? Why, that it would shake tLe foundations of all property if they even.intitnated that th!y could rehear a question of this sort.—( thought the petition should be dismissed. Lard KENYON agreed in the wisdom of not rehear ing a cause unless there were strong grounds for so doiug. He did not think there 'could be any objection to the ri. 7 ception of the petition, and he believed no reason could he assigned for refusing to allow it to lie on the table. If the question was now to be decided as to whether the peli -tion should be rejected or not, he was quite indifferent. lie left the matter in their Lordships' hands. The standing order relative to petitions ia cases of ap peal having been read by the Clerk, Lord LYNDHURST contended that it would appear from the order just read that the petition contained allega tions which were false, and therefore ought to be rejected. Lord PLUNKETT said if there was any ground on the merits of the question for rehearing it, the petition might be entertained, but such was not the case in the present instance. Lord HOLLAND again suggested the propriety of withdrawing, it. Lord KENYON would yield to what appeared to he the opinion of their Lordships, and consented to with draw it. Mr. BERNAL and others from the Commons brought up the Slave Compensation Amendment Act, and the Capital Punishment Abolition Bill, which were severally read a first time. THE FACTORIES. The Archbishop of CANTERBURY presented a peti tion, signed by 4,000 inhabitants of Oldham, in Lancashire, complaining of the system adopted in the factories, and praying some regulation relative to the hours of labour for children employed therein. He believed the system adopted was most pernicious to the health of the children, and lie trusted that some measures would be adopted to put an end to it. The MOST REV. PRELATE then gave notice that on Monday next he should move the second reading of Eccle siastical Leases Bill. REDUCTION OF EMOLUMENT IN THE SEE OF DURHAM. The Marquis of LONDONDERRY expressed his hope that it was not contemplated by his Majesty's Go vernment to reduce the emoluments of this See, as the Bishop was put to great expense in exercising the rites of hospitality, having to entertain the Judges twice a year, and to keep up two palaces in the county. Viscount MELBOURNE begged to inform the Noble Lord that the Report of the Ecclesiastical Commissioners was that day signed and agreed to, and he trusted it would prove satisfactory to the House. ADMINISTRATION OF JUSI ICE IN INDIA. Lord GLENELG brought in a Bill to improve the Ad ministration of Justice in India. Their Lordships then adjourned. HOUSE OF COMMONS, ilLißcu 4. The SPEAKER took the Chair at the usual time. ALSTONFIELD ENCLOSURE BILL. On the motion of Sir 0. MOSELEY this Bill was read a second time. LONDON AND CAMBRIDGE RAILWAY BILL. On the motion of Mr. CAMPBELL this Bill was read a second time. LONDON AND BRIGHTON RAILWAY BILLS. Lord G. LENNOX moved that the London and Brighton Railway Bill (Stevenson's) be referred to the Sussex list. Captain ALSAGER perfectly agreed with the propo sal, and had no objection to refer to the same list also a similar Railway Bill (Sir J. Rennie's) of which he had charge. The two Bills were accordingly referred to the Sussex List. Lord G. LENNOX presented a petition against Sir J. Rennie's line of Railway. The Noble Lord did not men• tipn the name of the place from whence the petition came GREAT WESTERN RAILWAY. Mr. A. SANDF ORBpresented a petition from an indi vidual of the name of Buxton, against this Bill, and a simi lar petition from the Hon. Member for Cricklade, praying to be heard by counsel against the Bill. PARROTT NAVIGATION BILL. Mr. A. SANFORD moved the second reading of this Bill. Mr. LEADER had had a communication from the town of Bridgewater, in which it was stated that they would not oppose this Bill, on condition that certain clauses were in troduced into the Bill. If the Honourable Member for Somerset (Mr. Sandford) had no objection to the introduction of these clauses, which were intended to pre tect the navigation of the river from injury, he (Mr. Leader) would not object to the second reading of the Bill. If these clauses were not introduced, the navigation of the river Parrott would suffer materially. Mr, A. SANDFORD could not object to any clauses which were i ntro d uce d to pro tect the river, but he could not agree to the introduction of them without knowing what they contained. He wished as much as the Hon. Member for Bridgewater (Mr. Leader) to protect the na vigation of the Parrott, and this Bill was for the purpose of improving_ the navig a ti on o f t h at r i ver . The HON. MEILBER was interrupted by a summons from the Lords, calling upon the House of Commons to attend in the other House to hear the Royal Assent given to certain Bills. The SPEAKER, on his return, informed the House that he had been to the House of Lords to hear the Royal Assent given to several Bills.—(See Lords' Report.) Mr. LEADER said he would withdraw his opposition :o this Bill, upon the understanding that it would not in terfere with the town of Bridgewater. The Bill was N read a second time. ORTHERN RAILWAY. Sir GEORGE STRICKLAND presented a petition from the Hon. Edward Pater against the Northern Railway Bill ; also a petition against the Birmingham and Glou cester Railway Bill. Mr. DUNDAS presented a petition against the Northern Railway Bill. Colonel LYGON presented a petition from a place in Worcestershire against the Gloucester and Birmingham Railway Bill. Mr. R. COLBURNE presented a petition against the Midland Counties Railway Bill. Mr. WIGNEY presented a petition from Brighton against Mr. Stevenson's Brighton Railway Bill. He moved that it and the petitions in favour of the line be referred to the Committee. Lord G. LENNOX said the petitions in favour of it had already been referred to the Committee. MANCHESTER IMPROVEMENT BILL. Mr. BROTHERTON presented a petition from the rate-payers and other inhabitants of Manchester against the Manchester Improvement Bill. On the motion of Mr. MARK PHILLIPS, the Man chester Improvement Bill was read a second time, and ordered to be committed. LONDON AND BIRMINGHAM RAILWAY. Sir H. VERNEY moved for leave to bring in a Bill, to join this railway to the Greenwich railway.—[So we under stood ; but HOn. Members generally speak in so low a tone of voice, and there is such a continued buz in the House during the presentation of petitions, that it is very difficult to catch the names of places.] LONDON AND BLACKWALL RAILWAY. Mr. CRAWFORD presented a petition against the Bill from certain proprietors of alms-houses through whiey the railroad was to pass. Sir,G. STRICKLAND said, if questions were to be raised continually upon the regulations of the Railway Committee, the busines could not be got through. NORTH-EASTERN RAILWAY. Mr. WARD moved the second reading of this Bill. Sir A. LEITH HAY moved the second reading of the North Leith Harbour and Dock Bill. On the motion of Sir J. Y. BULLER, the Teignmoutli Improvement Bill was read a second time. Lord A. CONYNGHAM presented a petition from the licensed victuallers of the city of Canterbury, com plaining of the extra duty on spirit licenses, and praying I;A -relief. MANCHESTER IMPROVEMENT BILL. On the motion of Mr. W. PATTEN, this Bill was :ea , a second time, and ordered to be committed. BLACKWALL RAILWAY. On the motion of Mr. JOHNSON the Blackw Railway Pal was read a second time, and ordered to committed. CROYDON RAILWAY. Mr. \VILKS presented a petition from the Comm' sioners of paving of the borough of Southwark against t Croydon Railway Bill. Mr. F. BRUEN rose, but " 'The SPEAKER interrupted him, and said he was SUIT that the House must see the impropriety of continuing di,:- cussions on the presentation of petitions. BLACKWALL RAILWAY. Mr. CLAY presented a petition from Ratcliffe Highway praying the House not to pass the Blackwalll Commercia Railway Bill. HULL AND SELBY RAILWAY. Mr. B. THOMPSON presented a petition from Hull in favour of this Railway Bill. EXETER AND BRISTOL RAILWAY. An Hon. AinmßErt presented a petition from the pro prietors of the Great Western Canal against this Bill, and prayii,g to be beard by Counsel against it. YEOMANRY CORPS. Colonel CONNOLLY presented a petition from a yeo manry corps in the county of Donegal, praying for reamer 1- tion for their services. He thought it right to present the petition, though he saw little probability of their wishes heir:;; complied with. The SPEAKER asked if the Hon. Member had received the assent of the Crown inr presenting the petition ? Colonel CONNOLLY replied in the negative, and the petition wa=, by leave, withdrawn. ATTORNIES TAX. Dr. BOWRI NG presented a petition from Kilmarnocl., praying for relief from the attornies tax. MEDICAL FEES. Dr. BOWRING next presented a petition from medical practitioners, praying for compensation for.their attendance on Coroner; inquests. DISSENTERS. Mr. WILKS presented a petition from a Dissenting congregation at Bramston, praying for an equalization of civil rights. AGRICULTURAL DISTRESS. Major HANDLEY presented a petition eomplainin - , , , of ;rieultural distress, and praying for relief.—Referred to e Committee. MR. BUCKINGHAM'S CASE. Several petitions were presented in favour of Mr. Buck- ingham's claims. Mr. GORE LANGTON presented a petition from 400 inhabitants of Suffolk, complaining of inconvenience in the exercise of their elective franchise. The Hon. Mem ber, after a few observations, concluded by giving the peti tion his cordial support. PROSECUTION OF TENANTRY IN CARLOW. Mr. WALLACE rose to present three, petitions from the county of Carlow, and in doing so he begged to observe that he should renew his motion for enquiry into the cir cumstances connected with the last two Carlow elections. The petitions were most respectably signed, and in proof of the anxiety of the person with whom be com municated on the subject not to deceive him, some small matters contained in the petition could not be vouched for, and he (Mr. W.) refused to present the petitions unless they knew the facts of their own knowledge to be true. The first petition which it would lie his duty to present was from a person named Murphy, resident in the County Carlow. The petitioner stated that he had lived for some time in the service. of the Hon. and Gallant Member as a " rent-man." He specifies that he has been deprived of 101. a•year, because he was never able to obtain from the Hon. and Gallant Colonel a rent discharge. The petitioner further states that the treatment he has received, has been of serious injury to himself and family, and unless the legislature interferes to protect him and others of the unfortunate Catholic tenantry of that county, similarly cir cumstanced, the most lamentable consequences must be the result. The petitioner further stated that the unfortunate Catholic tenantry were ejected because they refused to vote against the dictates of their conscience. The next petition was from a person similarly situated as Murphy. The petitioner states that he signified his inten tion of supporting the Reform candidates at one of the county Carlow elections, that he was in consequence de prived by his landlord of his right of turbany, which was subsequently offered to be restored to him, if he consented to vote for the Conservative candidate at the next election ; that when the day of elec tion arrived, he was brought into the town of Carlow, along with others of the tenantry, and there locked up against his will in a room, from which h e afterwards escape. The petitioner went to his home, from which he was again forcibly brought back, and conducted to the same place, under an escort of police ; that he aftewards when brought to the hustings, voted against the Hon. and Gallant Colonel, and in consequence brought ruin on himself and family—his tnrbany was again taken from him, and he was ultimately deprived of the land which himself and family had held for , the last forty years. Next came a most extraordinary pe tition, perhaps the most extraordinary one that ever was pre sented to that House : it was signed by 19 out of 22 tenants on the estate of a Mr. Alexander, in the County of Carlow.—(Hear.) In 1831 he induced the petitioners to register their votes—he at that time agreeing with them in politics, and supporting the Reform interest. In 1835, Mr. Alexander changed his politics, and insisted on his tenants doing the same, and supporting the Conservative can didate in the person of the Hon. and Gallant Col. opposite ; that he had endeavoured by every means in his power—by the most expensive system of litigation and lawsuits, to in timidate and annoy the petitioners, whom he had thereby almost entirely ruined—that finding that the officers of justice would not consent to serve latitats, subpoenas, and other law processes he had resorted to the extraordinary step of becoming bailiff to his own farm. They further stated that there was a public combination among the landlords of Carlow, s who had sworn an oath to remove from their estates and properties those persons who - did not vote for their being rectors. The petitioners, who were 19 of twenty-two of Mr. Alexander's tenants, stated that by these proceedings they had been almost ruined — having been called upon not only to • pay what was called the hanging gale, but also the rent which was then due ; so that altogether, in the space of nine months, they had paid three half year's rent—a thing which Hon. Members mug be aware was quite unusual and unprecedented in Ireland. The House would understand that until these systems of coercion took place by means of calling up the rents un paid, this landlord and his tenantry lived upon the very best terms, and it had been made quite plain to him by the whole of these petitions, that this individual had gone to lengths quite unusual—(Hear, hear) —and quite unconstitutional (Cheers)— and which merited the reprehension of the House and country at large. — (Hear, and cheers.) The petitioners stated further that means had been taken to establish an office of police immediately near to the residence of this gentleman, which they declared was not required, for in that district there had been no rioting or tumultuous meetings, or any thing requiring the interference of the police ; and the petitioners believed that these additional police had been placed there for the purpose of supporting the persecu tions that were going on, which they considered had been adopted for the extermination of the Catholic voters of the county of Carlow.—(Cheers, and cries of " No, no.") These facts were necessary to be brought before the House and the country, and he trusted that in this case the House would establish the precedent once adopted, and have these petitions printed, with the votes He should therefore ' propose bringing up these petitions that that course should be adopted, and they should be printed along with the votes : this motion would be for a general and searching inquiry, not leaving out any party or sect.—(Cheers.) He wished to prejudice no party, he wished ample justice done to all ; but if p ar ties had presumed to bring before the House stateme nts not justi fied, the consequences of those statements must fall upon themselves. With these remarks he would conclude hoping that some legislative measures would be adopted to prevent a recurrence of the transactions that had taken place in the county of Carlow. The Hon. Member then brought up the petition. Colonel BRUEN begged leave in the first place to return his most unfeigned thanks to the Hon. Member op posite, for bringing this matter before the House ; for his only wish and the wish of every one in Carlow was that an enquiry should be made into the conduct of all classes and 'all sects in the county of Carlow—that was their only wish. They had been labouring for years, at an enormous ex pense to their tenants ; lout they had been left to suffer. ing evils, which he would venture to assert had never be fore been endured in any civilised country. He would en deavour to reply, in the first place, to the allegations contained in those petitions, and would begin with that of William Murphy. He could not make a better statement upon this, than that which was made in a letter to him (Colonel Bruen), and which he gave to the Chairman of the Committee that was appointed to inquire into bribery and intimidation at elections.—(Hear.) That letter was read before the Committee, and it had been read repeatedly in public—it was a denial of every one of these statements that had been made respecting him. (The Gallant Colonel here read the letter referred to from the minutes of evidence taken before the Bribery and Intimidation Committee. It was also the wish of the Committee, that he should like wise.send for his books, and although he was not bound to produce one of them—(Hear) —or any account whatever of the way in which lie managed his private affairs—( Hear) — yet all books, letters, and accounts relating to the matter were forwarded to him by his agents, and he had offered to lay them before the Committee ; but the Hon. Chairman of that Committee (Mr. Ord), whom he did not then ob serve in his place, said it was not n ecessary.—(Hear.) With respect to this man Murphy, with a rent of only IL/. a-year, he had allowed an arrear of 801. odd to accumulate. —(Hear, hear.) But he was like all the others ;he paid what he pleased, and when he pleased.—(Hear, hear.) Ile (Colonel Bruen) did certainly ask for the rent, and served this man with an ejectment, and he was sure the Hous,i would agree with him that it was almost time for him to think of it.—(Hear, hear.) This man was, not withstanding all this, still in possession of his ground. With respect to the charge of preventing his tenants from cutting turf, he could say that it was as unfounded as ' the others. Originally there had been a turf bog on the estate, but it had not been cut for many years. This man had cut some meadow-land for turf, but lie (Col. Bruen) had directed that a stop should be put to suci a proceeding, and he would remember to put a stop to it when he went back.—(Hear.) There was another matter mentior.ed in the petition to which he must refer, viz.—the charge that he had directed a house belonging to one of his tenants to be pulled down. This same complaint had been made at the last election, and yet a gentleman declared to him yesterday that he saw the house standing subsequently to that period.—( Hear, hear.) He had re ceived several letters and affidavits from the County of Carlow, denying the statements made in the petition presented to that Howe by Mr. Vigors ; but he thought it was not necessary to trouble the House with them. There was one letter, however, to which he begged leave to direct the attention of the House. It came from a gentle man named Dwyer, who was unknown to him (Cal. Bruen.) That gentleman states in his letter that a receiver Lail been appointed by the Court of Chancery on the lands (a Mr. Morris), and that he was necessarily obliged to take proceedings against such tenants as were unable or unwilling to pay their rents, but that he (Colonel B.) had nothing to do with that.—(llear, hear.) With respect to the allegations in the i.e. tition affecting Mr. Alexander, he would state, that happening to know that gentleman, he was not disposed to enquire into the manner in which he collected his rents, or the tithes for which he was accountable from his te nants ; but this he would say, there was not a man to whom the community was more indebted, in the county of Carlow. He came to Carlow forty years ago—he found that part of the country in which he at present resided a waste an:l barren spot—and he showed him (Colonet, B.), within a few weeks, the great improvements which he had made ; so much so, that instead of being a barren waste, without a briar or a bush, it now presented one of the most im proved and civilized appearances in any country.—(Hear , hear.) The most cultivated part of England, he would venture to say was not superior. Neat cottages were built for his labourers, and the country enjoyed the blessings of a paternal landlord, until Father Keogh turned poli tician.—(Hear, hear.) Mr. Alexander was accused of changing his politics, and becoming a Conservative ; but he (Col. Bruen) would state that he was now of the same opinions he always entertained, while lie objected to ben; bought and sold, and he had the manliness to avow it. In the petition presented the other night, it was stated that Mr. Alexander, as secretary to the Tor y Club, hivi determined, like all the Tory landlords in Ireland, to ex terminate the Roman Catholics.—(Hear.) Now, there was absurdity in the very face of this allegation, and so far was it contradicted by Mr. Alexander, that within a few weeks he had finished the building of an excellent house for a Roman Catholic, in which he might be protected from the lib er ators of Ireland—(Cheers from the Oppositio n ) —who felt indignant at his having voted as his judgment directed. The petition also stated that Mr. Alexander had dis charged persons in his employment through political motives. The House would be surprised that this gentleman should not take every precaution, as he was a large dealer in malt, and he would be obliged to have only those persons upon whom he could place the utmost reliance. The fact was that several times servants in his employment received notice from the opponents of all order to quit working for Mr. Alexander, and as he would be subject to considerable loss if His malt remained without undergoing the necessary process, he felt it incumbent upon him to protect his own property, by having proper servants in his employment. With regard to a charge respecting a police station which lie procured to be established, it would be only necessary to state that he lived upon the banks of the Barrow, and caused it to be established to protect him from the assaults of the nightly marauders who infest the county of Carlow. —(Hear.) The Hon. and Gallant Colonel proceeded to read a letter from Mr. Butler, the agent of Lieutenant- Colonel Latouche, in which it was stated that the writer's father had been agent on the property for 33 years, and he himself for 28, and during that period not a single ejectment was had recourse to on the estate. He (Mr. Butler) stated that the land had been let for the low price of two shillings and sixpence an acre, and had been shortly before out of lease ; that upon it there were thirteen families, idle, demoralized, and disturbed creatures, few of whom could write, and all who could were requisi tionists for every illeg al purpose that could be imagined ; that for fifteen monts they held the land free of any charge,and that such as were put out of their holdings received a sum of money each. There was but one widow on the land, and that fact would answer the cry about widows and orphans. The priests and agitators had assailed the landlords in them as every shape. The former were in the habit of issuing, every Sunday, from their chapels at the head of large mobs, " 1 n ' a n d their from take t s h i et e hk threatening destruction, and denouncing their vengeance against those who were the natural protectors of the people. bc—(Loud:l.ll.eyhetshoe them r T i f e rh s oemy o f dt rhae 4 g ‘ ir O t h h h e o , r n u s oehfsr,oI b eds, they pri soners to their own houses.—(Cries of " Oh, oh 1") He did not state a fact that he would not undertake to prove.—(Cheers from the Opposition.) Of many of these cases he had been an eye witness himself.—(Hear, hear, hear.) They, he would again repeat, dragged them from their sick beds, carried them prisoners to their homes, forced them to the hustings, and obljged them to vote against their wishes and interest. he poor creatures said, with tears in their eyes, " How can we help it?"--(Cheers.) If persons were so hardened as to rots differently they were denounced at the altar as Orange men ; their farming instruments were destroyed ; their cattle were maimed, their very wives forbidden to come to them—(Loud cheers) —they could not go on the King's highway with safety ; their dogs and cattle were poisoned, and their servants were set as spies over them. If, after this, the Irish landlords had been induced to pay their enemies in their own coin, and according to their own measure, he would not say that it would be wise to have done so, but he thought it must be admitted that they had received great provocation.--(Cheers.) But if the Irish landlords had done so, he had no hesitation in saying many of those persons would have been in a very different part of his Majesty's dominions.—(Loud cheers.) But the Irish landlords hoped for better days, and that they would meet with a due reward for their forbearance. Such was the liberty that was enjoyed in Ireland, and for the preservation of which certain clamours were rung in their ears. No such thing was known as liberty in Ireland unless it was to murder.—(Cheers from the opposition, and cries of " Oh, oh ! " from the Ministerial side of the House.) Yet the Irish landlords were accused of tyranny and perse cution !—(Cheers.) The question was not whether a free- holder should vote as he chose, but whether the priests were to hold dominion over the whole people of Ireland. The Patriot in Ireland, and the Liberal in England, had each turned a deaf ear to the voice of the c harmer.—(Laughter.) This was not the first, second, nor third time that the landlords of Carlow had been accused of every thing that was bad and atrocious, and now they were at last to be knocked down, as it were, by the hammer of Mr. George Robins.—(Loud cries of " Hear, hear, hear.") In conclusion he would mention an instance, for the facts of which he could vouch. He had bad a tenant, a most respectable and independent man, who, besides having se veral farms, had, to his certain knowledge 2,0001. in money ; this .man had been his suporter in several elections, until the year 1831, when he was con stantly threatened by some of the opposite party which threats had so preyed upon the mind of the wife as to bring on a premature labour ; the man had died since, and his (Colonel B.'s) firm opinion was, his death was principally if not mainly caused by those circumstances. He trusted that he had, to the satisfaction of every right mind, entirely refuted the - calumnious charges that had been made on the petitions which had been presented. After some few words from Col. Perceval, Messrs. Hope, Hardy, and Lord J. Russell, Mr. HARDY proposed that the petition be printed ' with the votes. Mr. WALLACE had . no hesitation in agreeing that that was the most gentlemanly conduct which was the most manly—(Hear, hear) —and he, therefore, should offer no - opposition to the request that had been on the other side • of the House. BREACH OF PRIVILEGE. Mr. ROEBUCK rose to call the attention of the House to a subject which was of great importance to himself. He was not in the habit of addressing the House upon personal calumny, nor would he do so upon the present occasion, if it were not a matter connected with very peculiar circumstances. The House would be aware that some time since a Bill had been brought in for compensation to Mr. Buckingham, apon which occasion he had thought it his duty very shortly to state the grounds on which he gave his vote, and he had voted against the Bill, which was lost. He now held in his hand a paper called the Sheffield Iris, in which certain accusations were brought against him as a Member of the House, and which he considered as an infraction of the privileges of the House ; and it was those privileges he wished to defend upon the present occasion. When the public papers abused him in vague and general terms, if it gave them pleasure, they were welcome for him to do so. As long as the Press kept that line, he had no objectio n to it ; but the moment they brought a definite charge of criminal conduct against him, as the Sheffield Iris had done, he felt it his duty to bring the subject before the House. He felt no pain at the charge ; but it was a most grave one. The article was headed, " Mr. Buckingham's Claims," and called him a perverse wrong-hearted, if not bribed, Radical. They also stated that as he passed from the house they heard the chink of the retaining f e e—(Laughter)—and stated him to be rich in Tory estimation, and in the gold of the East India Company. The Newspaper which he received by the post, did not contain the paragraph of which he complained ; but another, given him by a friend as a guard, did contain it. The reason he brought this subject for ward, was to give the Hon. Member for Sheffield an opportunity of denying his knowledge on the subject. He would only state further, that he had directed his Attorney to demand an apology from the Editor of the " Sheffield Iris"—that an apology be put over the leader, in order that it might be the more humiliating. Mr. BUCKINGHAM said he had no difficulty in stating that he never saw the paragraph complained o f; until it reached him by post in the paper itself. It was not for him to doubt its sincerity, or to offer any opinion upon it---as the time would come for doing this more effi ciently—when it should be the subject of any future pro ceedings. Lord J. RUSSELL moved that the House, at its ris ing, do adjourn till Monday. DIVISIONS OF TIME HOUSE. While the House was preparing to enter on the subject of Supply, Mr. B. HOY thought that the plan of taking divisions it two lobbies had completely failed, and adduced many compa. naive instances of the time occupied under both old and new systems in proof of his assertion, that the former was the better. The time lost after divisions on the present plan, be fore order could be restored in the House, was another serious evil. Ile had made a calculation of the amount of time which would thus continualiy be consumed, and thought he was mo derate in stating it at three hours a day ; and, allowing only eight hours a day as the average space devoted to public busi ness for the four days in the week, the consumption of time would be alarming. It would come to fully three weeks in an ordinary session. As he thought the present mode of taking divisions by two lobbies had received a fair trial and failed, he would now move that it be discontinued. (The Hon. Gen tleman was heard throughout with great impatience.) Mr. G. H. WARD thought the motion quite uncalled for. It would be very absurd to rescind the resolution that they had passed only a fortnight ago, without allowing sufficient time to appreciate the effects. It had not had a fair trial yet. On the first occasion, 75 ayes and 281 noes were counted in three quarters of an hour, which he thought not long for a first ex periment. He was, however, ready to adopt any improve ments which the Hon Gentleman or his Friends could sug gest.—( Loud cries of "Divide.") Mr. WARBURTON was opposed to any return to the de fective old system. They had gone on progressively improv ing under the new system from taking eight votes in a minute on the first and second occasion ; on a following one they took sixteen ; on the seventh division, seventeen ; and ors the last occasion, eighteen votes in a minute.—( Hear.) Lord J. RUSSELL was not surprised either at the length of time or at the inaccuracies consequent on the new plan. It was certainly better than the old one, and had been getting on progressively. Mr. B. HOY would postpone his motion for three weeks longer.—(Cries of Divide.") For his part he desired ?he greatest publicity to be given to votes, and was on that account always opposed to the ballot.—( Divide. ) Mr. WARD thought the House ought now to set this question at rest by coming to a decision.—(Loud cries of " Divide.") Mr. B. HOY—The Hon. Member says that the plan has not yet had a fair trial, and yet he calls on the House to de cide at once.—( Hear, laughter, and divide.) The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER said a few words in opposition to the abandonment of the present sys tem, which were heard very imperfectly in our end of the Gallery. Sir R. PEEL said—lt appears to me, Sir, that there is great inconsistency on the part of the opponents of the Hon. Member, in not allowing him to withdraw his motion for the present. The Noble Lord opposite declares he is not altoge ther satisfied with the working of the prese nt system, and con templates the possibility of a return to the old plan. I must confess that it is my own impression also ; but in fairness we ought to give it a longer trial.—( Hear, hear.) Lord J. RUSSELL said it was a very inconvenient prac tice to bring on motions like the present, when the vote of supply was before the House, and then to withdraw them again without taking the sense of the House. Sir R. PEEL—The Noble Lord objects to the Hon. Gen tleman's withdrawing his motion, in order that we may gain something from experience ; but if we are to have a division, all I can say is, that my experience will induce me to vote for the Hon. Gentleman's motion.—(Hear, hear.) The Gallery was cleared for a division, but none took place, the motion having, as we understood, been allowed to be with drawn. On the re-admission of strangers, we found Mr. BROTH WICK opposing the motion for the Speaker leaving the chair, in order that the House might resolve itself into a Committee of Supply. It was not, the Hon. Member said, his wish to impede the business before the House, but he at the same time must persist in bringing forward the motion relative to the Mauritius, of which he had given notice, unless the Hon. Baronet opposite (Sir G. Grey) fixed some day when it should come on. Sir G. GREY had himself postponed a motion of which he had given notice, in relation to the Mauritius, until Tuesday ; and all he could say was, that if the Hon. Member would consent to defer his motion until that day everything the Go vernment eouldsdo to facilitate his bringing it forward then should be done ; but beyond this he could give the Hon. Mem ber no pledge. Mr. BORTHWICK would at once adopt the suggestion of the Hon. Baronet, and postpone his motion until Tuesday. SUPPLY. The SPEAKER then left the Chair, and the House resolved itself into a Committee of Supply. NAVY ESTIMATES. Mr. C. WOOD then rose to lay before the House the par ticulars of the estimates which he meant to propose for this branch of the public service for the ensuing year. The total expenditure of the ensuing year over the past would be 287,820/. This was on the gross amount of the estimates of the two years as contrasted with each other ; but if they were to confine themselves to the effective service, although there was a difference in the votes for the last year and the present of 305,3011., the real amount of the total expenditure for the ensuing year over the sum voted for the service of the last would not exceed 256,0001. This, however, arose from the cir cumstance of the sum taken last year being for a period of one year and a quarter, and not for a single year. The first item, No. 1, which related to the wages of seamen and marines belonging to the Ordinary-yard craft, exhibited an increase over the vote of the last year, as did also the next item, No. 2. But then it should be r ecollected that this increase arose principally from the augmentation intended to take place in the force of the navy for the ensuing year. As he should state the extent of that increase, before he sat down he thought it right to mention that the increase in the items to which he referred would be 220,0001. The actual increase, however, would only be 204,0001. ; but the difference arose principally from the transfer of the half-pay list. In the Ordinary Depart omf e 2 n 2 t ,o a o s o a l v . i wouldng ofs r , e o s o u O l t/. fromh a d b t e h t o n ar effected, rang em e a n n t d s a w further a d s av beein g. effected in the Navy Pay Office. The next item on which a diffA - ence arose was No. 10. This item related to the charges for naval stores, and the building, repair, and outfit of the fleet ; and it was increased by a sum of 47,0001., not so much because such an increase was deemed essential, but because it was considered that the sum voted last year was unprecedentedly small. Although this item had been increased 47,0001., still, as it was less by 30,0001. than any former vote, except the last, he thought the Right Hon. Baronet opposite would not pretend to say that the increase was extravagant. An in crease had likewise taken place in the miscellaneous estimates, but still it would be found that on a comparison of several small sums in these estimates with similar charges in the esti mates of last year a saving of 3,0001. had been effected. The increase was occasioned by the machinery necessary for car- rying the Bill for the Registration of Seamen into effect, and a variety of other circumstances, among which was the expe dition fitted out to go in search of the whale vessels which were locked up by the ice in the North Seas. In conse quence, however, of information received respecting these ships, it would not be necessary for the expedition to proceed any further, and therefore so large a vote as that proposed would not be wanted.—(Hear, hear.) A saving of 5,000/. had been effected in the half-pay establishment; but there was at the same time an increase in the sum proposed to be voted in the present estimates for the half-pay of pursers in the navy of 7,000/. There was, however, to be a prospec tive reduction of masters, surgeons, and commissioned officers, with a view to diminish the amount of half-pay at present paid, and these, he believed, were the only items in which the pre sent estimates differed from those of the last year. It was true that they had been only able to effect small reductions ; but this was owing to the extraordinary circumstances which had arisen in the course of the year. It would be ob- served that to these estimates explanatory statements were annexed, and that no information was withheld which could, with propriety, be given, or which could at all tend to throw light upon them. The first statement contained the details of the whole service, including officers and ships, as it stodd on the Ist of January of the present year. A prospec tive statement had been called for, but that Hon. Gentlemen must be aware it would be impossible to give. They had thought it advisable to give a statement of the actual condition of the navy down to to the last day of the quarter, and that he thought would be no bad criterion for the ensuing year. The statement specified the different services in which the several ships employed were engaged, and it would be seen that they had kept as near the number voted as possible. The next ex pence related to that which was called the ordinary department of the service, and he should now state the plan which the Government contemplated pursuing on this head. The com mittee must be aware that when vessels were hid up in or- - • dinary, there were a certain number of officers and men em ployed in taking- care of them ; but although receiving the pay of seamen, many of these persons were wholly ignorant of the service. Finding on inquiry that this was the case, a survey was ordered to be made, and the result was that 200 warrant officers were found wholly incompetent to their duties, owing either to age, disease, or unfitness. It was intended that the whole of these persons should be superannuated on pensions, and that the ships now in ordinary should be put in commis sion. By this a great advantage would be gained. The first captains, being placed on full pay, would be en titled to sit on court-martials, and assist in surveys, so that it would no longer be necessary to send a ship from one port to another for the purpose of holding a Court-Martial, as was the case at present. With regard to warrant officers, it was proposed that those who were competent should be retained, and those who were superannuated replaced. The effect of this would be that able seamen would be no longer reluctant to to enter on board those ships when they were required for ser vice, and that ships could be manned efficiently and much more speedily than at present. The way in which this was in tended to work was this ; it was proposed three large ships, three-deckers, should be forthwith put in commission and equipped for active service in all respects except as to the number of men, which were to be kept below the full comple ment. As they would always have a sufficient number of able seamen liable to serve, to make up the full complement of those ships, they could, if necessary, put to sea within a few hours after an order from the Admiralty had reached them for the purpose, and this he considered an advantage of the utmost importance, as it would obviate the difficulty which had always been experienced in getting men when there was a pressing emergency for them. They could at any time trans fer 100 men from one ship to another, and this, too, without putting the country to any additional expense. They would substitute for the superannuated parties 288 qua lified men, end this, with the 342 allowed to remain, would constitute an efficient and well educated force of 630 men, always at their disposal. By this means considerable additional saving would be effected to the public. The third statement related to the Royal Marines of all classes on shore. In the item No. 10 there would be a considerable alteration ; but as it was not deemed advisable, in refrence to the public service, to give any explanations of these estimates, he hoped, as the Government were responsible fur their conduct, the (louse would grant to them in this instance that confidence which had been placed in them in others. The next items to which he wished to refer was contained in No. 11, and here a sum of 43,8281. would be found, which was voted last year in No. 10, under the head of " Naval Stores." The only other head under which alteration had been made would be found in No. 14, in which details respecting the half-pay of officers of the Navy and Royal Marines were given at great length. He had already stated the increase in point of expense, and he would now say what it was they proposed with regard to men. They meant to ask for a vote of 5,000 men more than were granted last year. The Committee would remember what was said when a diminution in the number of men was proposed last year. The Right Hon. Baronet opposite had not only acquiesced in the vote then proposed, but he ventured to express the doubts which he entertained as to the prudence of reduction at such a period. His doubts, as events had since proved, were all well-founded.—(Cries of " Hear ' hear.") He Mr. Wood) begged the House to look at the force in one branch of the naval service. In the packet stations there were 1,300 men, besides no less than six vessels, four of which—four-gun brigs—were employed at Falmouth, and two in the West Indies, for the purpose of conveying the mails. The complement of these vessels exceeded 200 men, so that there were 1,600 men in that one service alone. The present force was not sufficient, for the purpose for which it was re quired—( Hear, hear) —and it was on these grounds, and be cause additional force was called for in all foreign stations to protect our commerce,:that a larger number of men was now asked for than had been granted last year. In the Pacific, where the English trade was rapidly increasing, a demand had been made by the Admiral and Commodore stationed in that quarter for additional force, and the merchants of Liverpool had made urgent applications for having vessels of war sta tioned along the western coast of Mexico, where, also, Bri tish commerce was likely greatly to extend itself, if proper protection were afforded to it. Similar applications had been made by those who traded in Peru, where it was known that revolution prevailed, and that there was no Government able to enforce its own decrees. The merchants trading to Brazil made similar representations. Two British merchant vessels had been plundered on that station. Further protection was solici ted also from the West Indies for the purpose of completely putting down the slave trade, where it was said to be carried on to some extent. The British merchants required an increased force on the Newfoundland station. Similar applications were received from the East Indies and from New South Wales. The Afri can station, as well as those he had mentioned, was repre. sented by Admiral Cockburn as requiring an increase of naval force, as the slave trade was carried on upon that coast to a great extent. It was utterly impossible, in their present situa tion, to answer all these calls. An increase of force was not more necessary on distant stations than on those nearer home. It was necessary to keep diligent watch along the whole coast of Spain. He believed the Member for Sandwich himself (Mr. G. Price) would be ready to join in an expression of re gret that the British force upon that station was not greater than it now was. In addition to these demands, made by their own commerce, there were other causes which rendered some increase desirable. The greatest advantage was to be derived from having an opportunity of seeing ships go through the various evolutions of a fleet. This, he had no doubt, would be admitted by the Hon. Member for Devenport ; but for this very useful purpose they bad not at present a sufficient number of ships properly manned. There would be twelve at sea next June. Compare this with the situation of Russia. She had, at present, in the Baltic and the Black Sea, not less than twenty-three line of battle ships, and eighteen frigates. At present in the Baltic this country had only 10,000 seamen employed, and in the Channel not more than two frigates, with 1,000 men, their line-of-battle ships on the various stations not exceeding ten. He did not mention these circumstances with any reference to the present political state of Europe ; but, considering the ex tent of their commerce, and the great demand in so many parts of the world for the protection of British commerce, he would appeal to the House whether this state of things ought to con tinue ?—(Hear, hear, hear.) It was not of shipping they stood in need, but of men. It was for these reasons he now proposed an additional vote of 5,000 men, and he might fairly say that circumstances would justify him even in doubling that number, and making it 10,000. He would conclude by pro posing that 33,700 men be the complement of the service, in cluding 9,000 marines and 3,000 boys. The question being put from the chair, Mr. G. PRICE complained that the dreadful massacre which took place at Barcelona was not prevented, though Captain Parker, at the time, was in command of a British naval force off the harbour, and was not wanting either in men or officers. Even Don Carlos himself had been received on board a British line-of-battle ship, and there protected. Mr. WOOD said that Captain Parker offered to land a body of men to assist the Government, if required. The offer was not accepted. Mr. G. PRICE felt most happy in receiving this assurance from the Hon. Member. An Hon. MEMBER was glad to hear that the embarrassments under which commerce had been labouring for a considerable time were to be guarded against in future. For want of ade qnate protection, a great deal of British property had been sacrificed both at Valparaiso and St. Jago. Sir E. CODRINGTON said, with respect to the increase of force now proposed, he should wish to see it doubled. He believed that when the rebellion broke out in the Brazils, not less than eight millions of British property was lost from want of adequate naval protection. In answer to an observation from an Hon. Member, Lord PALMERSTON said that at the time the massacre took place Captain Parker was carrying the provisions of the Quadruple Alliance into effect. He was informed there was some likelihood that it was meant to inflict serious injury upon the prisoners ; and he sent to the Deputy-Governor, General Mina being absent, to inform him that, if required, he e ould land his own men to protect them. The Governor, in answer, said there was no occasion ; that all would pass off quietly. These violent proceedings occurred too suddenly to prevent them. Mr. YOUNG said the Hon. Gentleman (Mr. Wood) in his statement made no allusion to the naval efforts now making by France. He had frequently alluded in that House to the encroachments she was making on the coast of Africa. In a late instance these encroachments would have been repelled by force, if they were in s ufficient strength on that coast. It was fit the House should know the outrages committed there, and THE SUN, LONDON, SATURDAY, MARCH 5, 1836. the injuries inflicted on British commerce for want of an ade quate naval force, and in consequence of the blockade main tabled upon that station. Lord PALMERSTON was sorry to hear the Honourable Member express regret that hostilities did no t take f or ce, There was no occasion for the employment of force to , because a communication between the Governments led to a satisfactory explanation. Mr. YOUNG expressed no regret that war had not follor 4 e d. Tile explanation might have been satisfactory to the hoped ble Lord, but not to those who lost their property. fle ;hey would be indemnified. Lord PALNIERSTON said the blockade was put an end to. Mr. YOUNG said it ceased only at the season when trade could no longer be carried on. - Mr. ROEBUCK should be glad to know what CaPt?ri; Parker had to do with the internal affairs of Spain ? he authorised to put down the democrats there as Well a s the Carli3ts ? Mr. WOOD said he was, in this transaction, qui te an in.f : different party. He only intimated to the Governor that, If desired, he was ready to land a party of sailors to prevetl bloodshed. Mr. ROBINSON was quite ready to corroborate the state, ment of the Hon. Gentleman (Mr. Wood) as to the necessiti of increased protection to commerce, without any view to 11 05 ' tilities. It was satisfactory to hear that the proposed addition of men had no reference whatever to war. Were the Mr. HUME was happy to say that these estimates e most complete he had yet seen. He regretted, howev er, ther t was no reduction in the sinecure department. With re s e ec to the increase in the number of men, he used formerly to bea r the same reasons stated for it as he heard now—the pretee' tion of commerce. The commerce of the United S tates wa,g. as extensive as ours, and it was better protected with one -tenth of the naval force. Their commerce was not greater now than it was three years ago.—( Hear, hear, from Mr. Weed.l What new discovery had been made since of comielercia, markets ? If the number of men now proposed was so gr.eall"'t what ground was there for the complaints against the 14 e Hon. Baronet opposite ( Sir Robert Peel)? In 1817 thee,. were only 15,000 men voted, and he then contended that thee, number should he reduced to the standard of 1792. Franc being now their friend, one would think the numbe r of Ur might be still further reduced. In 1820, they had only 23,0 d men, which were subsequently reduced as low as 21,000 an ' 22,000, and then again increased. He never knew a Nal r ' a d Officer who, like his Hon. and Gallant Friend ( Sir Edwa,,, Codrine•ton), would not increase the force as much as he cow The plea that we must be prepared for war was an old arg'l- ment. Of whom were we to be afraid ? Of Russia ? gns sia had only eighteen ships at Cronstadt, and six in the Baltiel ise" Besides, Russia was our ally. Hon. Gentlemen had ra the Russian Bear to such a station, that they had no w beco me e frightened at their own imagination. Why, we were at pe kes with the whole world, and Government had said that there al, every chance of a continuance of that peace. He could on see why the same number of men would not do that we ha d nld 1792. There was no prospect whatever that Russ ia we 'd ever attempt to cope with this country on the sea, and , indee t; with England and France united, it was quite pieposte rolls to expect that any thing was to be feared from Russia, so as 0 ,, render more men necessary. He must be understood, hop ever, as not wishing at all to cramp the naval service, f0r...1,i was most anxious that in that department (whatever he ano be think as to the array), the power of Great Britain should maintained. What he objected to was any unnecessary increastie.; Sir JAMES GRAHAM considered the alterations I °, o by the Board of Admiralty general improvements, and la w n i o particularly as to the mode of stating the estimates. He ;bat glad to see that they were now so plain and intelligible , e f he who ran might read." With respect to the questie n ut the increase in the number of men, he ( Sir J. Graham ) c 0 to ' state that his own experience at the Admiralty had been . convince him that any attempt at a diminution would be N os dicious, and that, on the other hand, there were many rease d. why there should be an additional number of men emplaYe,,,... He had been well informed that, in case of a sudden ern 'en geney, it would be better to go into action with six ships e tat manned, than with ten worse manned • and he thought t we were bound to provide against such' possible cases. I l ly as to the employment of boys in the navy—that had been parlla in consequence of his (Sir J. Graham's) own suggestion, he was glad to find that the Board of Admiralty had n ot °l :be thought fit to act on the plan, but moreover to increasS number of boys employed. He was able to refer the 11 ,% - t to a passage in the last Message of the American Presilii: recommending the adoption of the same system there. \ be respect to the main question—the number of men t ° , e employed—he could not concur with the Honourable .Ni 4,• le.tr for Middlesex ; and, although a proposition t° s ilo crease had never been made from his (Sir J. Graham's) ,her of the House, no proposition to reduce had, on then'e hand, been made. The Honourable Member for Midr-eef said, " Of whom were we afraid ?" As a Menlhe'neid the British House of Commons, he ( Sir J. Graham) s'f-ana answer that they were afraid of no one, but that they everesrbe ought to be, prepared to meet any one.—( Hear, hear.) t he Hon. Gentleman opposite had gone into many de tails fors in purpose of showing that British merchants at various ee c r t ir the world were calling for protection ; but from hi s (..) s ay Graham's) experience at the Admiralty, he was enabled to,ioo that if all the applications of British merchants for protec: be were attended to, an increase of 20 , 000 men would riel-se. adequate to meet the demands upon the naval force. H ° J. Graham) was decidedly of opinion that, under ex isting,fi e . cumstances, an augmentation of the naval force was desi fa ' in Altogether he was prepared most cordially to give his vo te favour of these estimates. Mr. C. WOOD was glad t o have the support 0 Hon. Baronet. With respect to the increase o f f tl i nie t 4 i, : h e the a begged to remind the H on. M em b er f or Middlesex men employed du r i ng peace were ver y different fro nt t ' employed during war, and that the same observation aPP to the boys. pti" Sir R. PEEL—Th e amoun t o f force proposed in t he mates of last year was 24,500 men and 2,000 boys ; r t . baa now there is undoubtedly an increase proposed of not less Dut 5,000 men, as well as an increase in the number of boys. sw ays although the estimate of last year was that only, I bale mlo se%9 contended, in opposition to the Hon. Member for Min s eet and still contend, that the number called for in one Yea r b ' t ee to be a rule for another year ; and therefore, althelig o ats present vote is a considerable increase on the vote o f 185 % 1 0 1. I am not prepared to say that the increase is not nece-toero I do not object either to the increase of this year,- a n Y se 1 than I passed a censure on the estimates of the last, bea n o as must say that when the responsible Ministers of the Cre rr ie d to sure us that the increase is required, their opinion is entit b oo peculiar attention from the access they must necessarilYebo. to information which it might be highly imprudent to tii s ent le rt There is, however, one statement made by the Hon . fl oat . man, the Secretary for the Admiralty, which does not aZit to be in exact harmony with the proposition he makes for increase of our naval force. The Hon. Gentleman tells n s , fo• we are in no danger of a war, and disclaims all idea of aneJoall reign aggression, and yet he says that he hopes the Ilan!twill be unanimous on this vote, because of the moral e ff ect I se e have upon foreign Powers. Now, I confess, I caenat`bere what . moral effect our unanimity can produce unlesg., JD' exists some necessity for it, and here the ne cessity claimed. What moral effect can our unanimity hav e et ' n e ern ; tical Powers? None ; but if at the same time the "°„-a ment considers that a good effect is likely to be pred n o 't tb o should be extremely sorry to disturb the unanimitY House. The Hon. Gentleman tells the House that 'OlOO commerce is in danger on account of the scandalous a t hat carried on in slaves by the South American States, a t t ' r ee it is necessary for that reason to have a protecting t ia' to sa' those seas. This, and the state of Spain, lam botin, e n eti se mit form a combination of facts which call upon the r'se in give the Government .credit for good reason to ask f °l ,, -oat crease of the naval power of the country. The floa s ",:es also see in the relative situation of France and Ata t, c ; i i r s,) i the present moment some cause for an increase.—(C" -e t lyn i ° Lord J. RUSSELL said that it was extremely gr aj e re, ° :, to him to hear the speeches made by Hon. Gentlemen t site, and more particularly that of the Hon. Bar„ °n e l e e ver n : spoke last, confiding as they did in the statement 0 1 ea; ment that the increase to our naval establishment this if f - te tb called for by circumstances. He should confine hirti se d " statement of his Hon. Friend the Secretary of the Alll,l ° 0 0 who told the House that it was necessary, for the protee'llop our commerce, to have an increase of 5,000 men to eu r cs eioa: It was clearly shown that our extended commerc e in cessar4 parts of the world demanded this increase. It was n e ,,ear t " o that we should keep up our navel strength in every t in to which British commerce was extended. It wa s n t bo strength of our army that we were to compete wi th a ci foreign Posers, but in our navy. France had inere n i - , e et ; naval force, and so had Russia. Russia had twentY" e ' v dt 11- t of the line in the Baltic in the last winter, and alt s 0 0 0 practice was to keep only one-third of that force al n : f s, g. s h t of port, for the purpose of accustoming the men to t -e t l e be had, in the last season, kept constantly out of l'e r- Siat i le two-thirds of that force. He did not mean to saY disposition of Russia was other than peaceful ; ba e t e i r i na /- contended that if other European Powers increased ta i ; c e force, this country should not be supine upon that f pe s Mr. LABOUCHERE did not think that in a titne c ° ll the European Powers were justified in keeping 11 1 3 s h u te dli las naval armaments, but as such was the case it linde n ", to r e came England, the first naval Power in the world, n ot t he in her exertions. ma ll 10 Sir G. CLERK congratulated the Hon. Gent; e ; ,fieci Secretary for the Admiralty in having for once sa - Hon. Member for Middlesex. fo r Mr. HUME—He has not done that.—( A langl;:,' a be r be Sir G. CLERK—In the last year the Hon. a ovi. o ( Middlesex moved for a reduction of 4,000 men, 8 : 1 ,h 0' 01 ; 1 1 0 supports an increase, merely contenting himself W" o sig"be a protest. He ( Sir G. Clerk) thought the reasorgostitoob by the Government for an increase sufficient to 'lee House in agreeing to it. The state of our trade on ' ee• , f er fi t American coasts alone would require a considerable e tr t be Sir E. C 0 D RING TON said that there We r ; ea t ari , l t a fi t s l b cl o : o l i sail of the line at St. Petersburgh alone last Emperor was increasing the number: Governl scp, f have attended to what was going on in the 1 31 a c re b e il° 4 ' be the attacks made upon our old ally the Turks. e et t° e a this country was not kept in the efficient state it outfoeer 00 in. At the battle of Navarin he had scarcelY an tte nt• de l board his fleet that had ever been in an engag e e t e lin e gig would rather have, in an engagement, six sail of t 'A t manned than ten sail with inexperienced seamen . o der 0 0 , he had only nine men and a half to work a 321° tour , laugh)—although the necessary complement was r dist Indeed the enemy had fifteen men to each gun. h is e h oe cil Mr. GROTE was certainly disposed to h g o i e v i e d a c . rY e , e or 9 support to the present Government, but he s wish to have statements so important rest upon see' „,. ne than the mere word of the Minister of the da y . o ld Mr. ROBINSON considered that an incredaesiGerti:;:in force was absolutely necessary, as we were ;