The Sun. — London, England, 1839-03-01 00:00:00

NATIONAL CONVENTION. YESTERDAY. Mr. PETER BIISSEY in the Chair. Letters were received from Nottingham, Boston, Pentrug, Barnsley, Darlington, and Merther Tydvil, approving of the measures of the Association, also en closing rent from Manchester, 10/. ; Bolton, second remittance, 13/. ; Liverpool, second remittance, 101. ; MarAi-green, Wigan, 21. 10s. ; Derby, 101. ; Perth shire, 10/., second remittance ; and from Armagh, Ireland, 1/. The announcement of these receipts of rent was received with loud applause. Dr. WADE read a letter from Sutton, in Ashfield, stating that a large body of infantry had been marched intq that place on Saturday, and billets were made out for four troops of Cavalry, who were expected to ar on Tuesday. All this preparation was (the letter sail) for the purpose of searching the houses of the 13b9urers fur the purpose of disarming them. It also sail the town was quiet, but in a very excited state. After disposing of some financial business relative to th, intended mission to the country, the meeting dis so!ved, first giving a vote of thanks to the Chairman. SPORTING INTELLIGENCE. TATTER SALL'S—YEsrx.RDe Y. THE DERBY. G to 1 agst Lord Jersey's lot 7 to 1 agst John Scott's lot—taken 17 to 2 agst John Day's lot 1 is 2 agst Lord Jersey's Bro. to Bay Middleton—taken 17 to 1 agst Duke of Rutland's Flambeaa i 7 to 1 agst Mr. Bowes's Erin-go-Bragh—taken 20 to 1 agst Duke of Richmond's Meunier—taken 25 to 1 agst Duke of Cleveland's Kremlin—taken 25 to 1 agst Col. Anson's Zimmerman—taken 2; to 1 agst Lord Albemarle's Tros—taken *5 to 1 agst Lord Jersey's Ilderim—taken 25 to 1 agst Mr. Bowes's. Epidaurus 25 to 1 agst Lord Westminster's The Lord Mayor—taken 26 to I agst Colonel Pt el's Dey of Algiers--taken 30 to 1 agst Duke of Richmond's Bulwark—offeml 30 to 1 agst Lord Lichfield's Gulnare colt—offered 80 to I agst Mr. Bowes's Accelerator—taken 45 to 1 agst Duke of Grafton's .lEther—taken 51) to 1 agst Mr. Wreford's Wapiti—taken 50 to 1 apt Sir G. Heathcote's Oronooko—taken 50 to 1 agst Sir G. Heathcote's Chimborazo—taken Sit to 1 agst Lord Jersey's Cain cclt 1000 to 10 agst ilr. Clark's Dragsman—taken 1000 to 10 agst Mr. Bowes's Rustan—taken 1000 to 15 agst Mr. 3lostyn's Hugh Lupus—off& red 10u0 to 15 agst Sir G. Heathcote's Valaincourt--taken ' 4 II i PFING INTELLIGENCE. (LLOYD'S.) CUSTOM.HOUSE, FEB. 28. VESSELS ESTERL INWARDS.-Sophia, Langlois., from t. Michael's ; Union, Rommens, Ostend; Cog, Trepey, 'herliour g ; Earl Liverpool, Lomax, Ostend ; Mediator, haraolen, New York ; Archemede, Denetro. Genoa; St. !harles, Lamy, Calais ; Juno, Bornhoff, Schien ' • Augusta, Ll(lfiely, St. Michael's ; London, Rumbert, Hamburg; Venus, Coke, Teneriffe; Antwerpen ' Brillen, Antwerp — ; :''air h, B eer , S e vill e ; L ou i sa , Elli o t, St. Michael's: Rose, lailie, Demerara ; Beau Ideal, Forbes, Altea ; City of 3onlogne, June, Boulogne ; William Jolliffe, Pashley, .-.al:;is. 1 VF.SST Li ENTERED OUTWARDS. Giraffe, Strannock, to 1 Rottcr.la,n ; Emcly, Petrowsky, Dantzig; Levant, Cundy, t Malta ; B!ake, Haddon, Hobart Town ; Phenix, Lefort, Havre ; Unicorn, Mullens, Elsinore ; Fortitude, Wilson, Hobart Town ; Samuel, Walters, Hamburg; Gazelle, Tomiinson, Hobart Town; Glenelg, Sheller, Bombay; Carraean, Irving. Mauritius. CLEARED OUT CARGO. —City of Londonderry. Ellis, 1 Lisbon ; Phoenix, Leford, Havre 2 - Earl of Clancarty, Williams, Rotterdam ; Neptune, Block, Ostend. BA LLAST. —Wit , beach, Buf ham, Dantzic; Sarah, Love, Dantzig. i STRANRAER, FEB. 26 :—A small galliot, with loss of I mainmast, has put into the bay of Luce, and is discharging her cargo, (coals.) SUNDERLAND, FEB. 24:—The Verbena, Hinchcliffe , _ _ from Wells to this port, ran on shore at Hendon, about a rile south of this port, yesterday, but was got off to-day, i and towed into harbour with damage to hull and cargo. I WATERFORD, FEB. 25 : -Th e Alert. Duggen, f rom I Cardiff to this port, was l os t on th e n i g ht o f th e 21 s t i nst ., at the entrance of the harbour. PARIS, FEB. 26 :—An English Schooner struck upon the Point du Dent, during the gale of the 19th, 1 0 0th, and 21st. inst., but came off, and has been towed into St. Vaast full of water. IThe Jeune France, Delaporte, from Cherbourg to Ma-- , tinique, put back to the former port, 21st inst. with damage. ST. JAGO DE CUBA, JAN. 15.—The Duke of Clarence, 1 from Whitehaven to Swansea, put back to-day in distress. ' GRAVESEND, FEB. 26.—Arrived the John Punter, from Mauritius ; Juno, Lingsound ; Eliza, Jersey ; John and Eliza, ditto. Feb. 27.—Arrived the Emma, from Cal. cutta ; John Fleming, ditto ; Mediator, New York ; Het c, St. John's ; Sophia, St. Michael's : St. Charles, Colfi ; Santander, Genoa ; Union, Ostend ; Cog, Cherbourg' ; Undine, Jersey; and London, Hamburg. Sailed th 3 New Grove, for Rotterdam. VESSELS SPOKEN wyrn.—The Adelaide, from Batavia to ! Rotterdam, 13th Dec., in lat. 36. S. long. 21 E. ; Geori:_e Wilkinson, Bombay to Liverpool, 30th ult., in lat. 5. long. 26. ; Glenarm, Manilla to London, 31st, in lat. 7. long. 2E. ; Duncan, Java to London, 11th inst., in IL:. 29. long. 43. ; Mileton, Cape of Good Hope to London, i 13th, in lat. 33. long. 43., by her Majesty's ship Wolf, arrived at Portsmouth. EAST INDIA SHIPPING. A RRIVALS.—Her Majesty's ship Wolfe, Stanley, from the East Indies, at Portsmouth, sailed from Madras, 29th August, Trincomalee, 27th October, Capeof Good Hope, 4th January, Ascension, 27th January: Diadem, Walker, from Bengal, at Liverpool,-sailed, Calcutta, 25th Jul;, Saugor, 4th August, Mauritius, 30th October, Cape of Good Hope, sth Dec.; Sultan, Pool, from Singapore, eff Margate, sailed 28th October, St. Helena, 7th January ; and Science, Rowland, from the Cape of Good Hope at ~.. i :Cowry, sailed 2d January, St. Helena, 14th January. 1 ARRIVALS AT ST. HELENA.-Nickerie, Bunnemeyer, Jan. 7, from Batavia, sailed Bth, for Rotterdam ; Alex mdre, Margotin, 7th, from Bourbon, and sailed 9th for Nantes; Lady Raffles, Biles, 7th, from Calcutta, and sailed 9th, for Lcradon ; Meedon, Hogg, Bth, from the Cape, and sailed, 10th, for London ; Richard Cunning, Pain, Bth, from 'Calcutta, sailed 10th, for Liverpool ; Dortcnaar, Martens, 8, from Batavia, sailed 9th, for Rotterdam; Mary, Frazer, , Sumner, 8, from Singapore, and sailed, 8, for New York ; Sir John Rae Reid, Cumming, 8, from Mauritius, and sailed, 10, for London ; Adolphe Fanny, Villebogard, 8, i from Bourbon, and sailed, 9, for Bordeaux ; Cambrian, . ' Paul, 0, from Mauritius, and sailed, 10, for London ; Queen Mab, Ainley, 10, from Calcutta, passed for Liver ,,' pool ; Solide, Canncva, 10, from Bourbon, and sailed, 10, 1 or I3ordeaux ; Pionier, Barjal, 10, from Madagascar and i ,rtape of Good Hope, anti tailed, 10, for Nantes ; Melrose, I N:„;,- , 1son, 10, from China, and sailed, 10, for London ; 1 p a 1,,, ,, Piancert, JO, from Mauritius, and sailed, 10, for London ; Cre:.. f e. . 13c $ 14 '!WP 10, from Bourbon, and sailed, ! I 0, for Bordeaux ; A :2 ,,, u ,th i , ..„,::,s, 10, from Batavia, and ' sailed, 10, for Amsterdam; . BrOtherg, . I L•pmpson, 10, from Timor, with 1800 barrels of oil, bound to Lo don i Con ' conlia, Kohue, 11, from Singapore, and sailed, 1, 1 .; for 1 Hdrnburgh ; Jcune Lance, Lannes, 11, from Calcutta, 1 and sailed, 11, for Bordeaux; Stoningtou ( A), Rue, 11, 1 from whaling, for New London; Seid, Said, Mauclerc, 11, 1 from Batavia and Bourbon, and sailed, 11, for Nantes; Glet,arm, Grut.iber, 11th from Manilla and the Cape, and I sailed the 12th for London ; Ann Maria, Middleton, 11th, 1 from Whaling, for New London ; Apprentice, Casen t head, 12th, from Mauritius and the Cape, and sailed the t I,2th for London ; Sunda, Greig, 12th, from Calcutta, and !niter; the 13th for London; Isabella Cooper, Currie, 12th, Coo Calcutta, and sailed the 14th for Liverpool ; Blakely, li u Jrnes, 12th, from Calcutta, for Liverpool ; 1 Oratma, Watson, 12th, from the Cape of Good. Hope, ! and sailed the 12t11 for London ; Norfolk, M'Gildoconay, If th, from Mauritius in 28 days, passed for London ; George Wilkinson, Brown, WI, for Bombay, and sailed f :be 12th for London ; St. George, Crawford, 12th, from ' i aritiug, and sailed the 12th for Livoapool ; William Parker, 13th, passed the island ; Swallow, Witteye.embe, 13th, from _Vozamb4ie and Cape of Good Hop. pasiiej 1 for London; Onyx, St:we - Ai, 14th, from whaling, cth i 500 barrels of oil. DEPARTURES FROM ST. HELENA..—Th. Robert Sure cold, Danvillie, Jan. 8, for Nantes; Amelia Thompson, I. Dawson, Jan. 9, far Amsterdam. lARRIVALS AT MAURITIUS.—The Calypso, Smith, Nov. 3Q - and Atlas, Hunt, Dec. 2, from London. __ 1 A RRLYALS . . . " AT THE CAPE OP Goon HOPE.—Her Ma ljeety's ship Jupiter, Dec. 26, from Cork and Rio Janeiro ; Swallow, Wir i bycombe, Dec. 29, from the Mozambique ; 1 'lope (steamer), Cox, Dec. 30, from Algoa Bay, in fifty. four hours. V E v;Ets SPOKEN WlTll.—Tbe George Wilkinson, 4, Livcrocoi to Bombay, Jan. 30, lat. 4, 49. N., long. 26. 24. W. ; aitinarm, Grueber, Manilla to London ; Jan. 31, tat. 6. ~ , ,q). N., long. 28. 11. W,; Duncan, Wardle, Jaya to , Feb. il, lat. 29 22 N., long. 43...9• W. ; 1 INF.11!on, Hogg, Cape of Good Hope to London, Feb. 13, lat. 32. 56. N., long 42. 313, W. ; Favourite, Robinson, 1 Calcutta to Liverpool, Jan. 22 , of f A scension, b y her Ma -1 jelty's ship Wolfe, arrived at Portsmouth. The Harriet, Rockwell, late Jewett, bound to Boston, has put into Tobermony, leaky, and with loss of sails, &c., the Master, second mate, and four of the crew drowned, off Burra Head, in endeavouring to obtain assistance from the shore. UNEXPEOTED DISCOVERY OF JEWELLERY IN A BALLA4 9 HEAP. —On Friday morning the workmen employed in removing the ballast heap at Howden, for the purposes of the Newcastle and Shields Railway, discovered a quantity of jewellery, consisting of gold and silver N etches, snuff-boxes, dessert spoon and knives, rings, earrings, sod other articles, wrapped in flannel. During I the day as much of the property was disposed of as Possible. A gentleman of this town, returning from I Shields, learnt the particulars, and suspecting from the - circumstances that it might probably be the pro ! Pony which was stolen some years ago from the shop r)f Messrs. Wright and Co., immediately on Ms ar. royal at Newcastle gave information at the Police Station, and some of that body went down on Saturday morning to investigate the matter. They have succeeded, f t v!e understand, in obtaining possession of severe! ar zles ; but nothing like the quantity that had been found, he difficulties they had to contend with were very treat so much so that th w e re threatened by tishier. , w wo_rkmcn if they ' persisted in retaining the property. to right has also been very industrious in trying identify any part of it which might come under his oscrvation and was yest er d ay at Shi elds for that purpose . It is a singular fact connected with this matter, which we have been put in possession of, that on the day after the above -named robbery took place, upwards of a hundred tons of b4last were deposited upon t h e h eap in which the ar. tidies were found.-- Tyne Mer cury. IMPERIAL PARLIAMENT. HOUSE OF LORDS, FEB. 28. The LORD CHANCELLOk took his seat on tho Woolsack at five o'clock. Lord RIPON presented a petition from the Deanery of Ripon in reference to the state of the Church in Canada ; also a petition from the inhabitants of Ripon in support of a National System of Edu cation upon the Church of England principles. Likewise petitions from different parishes in Lincclnshire against any alteration in the Corn-laws. The Earl of SHA FTESBURY presented a petition from Sherbourne, and also from another parish, against any alteration in the Poor-laws. Mr. Crafer presented papers from the Treasury. Mr. Dawson presented papers from the Board of Trade. The Earl of HA DDINGTON presented a petition from Linlithgow, and also one from Newburn, in the county of Fife, praying for Church Extension in Scotland. Lord ABERDEEN presented petitions from Berwick upon-Tweed, Lauder, Paisley, and a great many other places in Scotland, praying for increased means of in struction in that country. MURDER OF LORD NORBURY. Lord CHARLE VILLE said he wished to call the attention of the Noble Marquis opposite to a paper he held in his hand. He had hitherto most anxiously avoided making any allusion to the murder of the late Lord Nor bury. He did so, in the first instance, from being unwilling to allude to that subject in the absence of the Noble Marquis. He had avoided alluding to it since the return of the Noble Marquis, because he had been anxious to have certain papers through his hands be- Eire he brought the circumstances under the attention of the House—( Hear, hear)—and it was not now, though his duty compelled him to enter into it, his intention to venture into any particulars which he could possibly avoid ; hut after having read this paper, he felt that he should be guilty of a great dereliction of duty if he were not to call the attention of the Noble Marquis opposite to it, and to ask him either to confirm the statement he (Lord C.) was about to make, or to refute it if in anything he uttered he was incorrect. He could only state facts as they came within his own know ledge, and to them he should adhere. He was the first Magistrate who arrived on the spot after the murder ; and as far as his information went, he could declare that no such insinuations or reports as were contained in this pape reached him then, nor up to this hour, from any decent or respectable source, or any source worthy of the slightest credit or dependence. He had hoped thLa the remarks of a Noble and Learned Lord upon the first night of the opening of this Session would have put an end to those slanderous imputations about some well-formed shoe or some neat-heeled boot; but notwithstanding the refutation that was offered in some other assembly—notwithstanding the explanation there and then given, he found in a Dublin Newspaper—whose circulation might not be very exten sive, but from its supposed connection with a certain indi vidual its opinions were calculated to have and to create a strong impression on the public mind in Ireland—he found on Wednesday last, the 20th of February, in that paper, a repetition of those statements, rather in an aggravated form, perhaps, and changing the insinuations against an in dividual to some mysterious allusion against others, but still repeating the statement, and repeating it in a way that now called for some explanation. The paper he held in his hand was the Pilot Newspaper. The knowledge of this paragraph had come to him (the Noble Lord) by accident, and he had been fortunate ,nough to procure the paper itself. The article to which he desired to call their Lordships' attention was as follows But there is an object at the bottom for the party. The fact of the well-made shoe goes to disprove the slander of the factious Lords on the poor people of Ireland. Its object is to intimidate the Liberal press from stating the facts by imputing to it the adhering by that statement to a libel on a Nobleman. We shall not be thus intimidated. The cha racter of that Nobleman stands too high to be impaired by a statement that an assassin wore a neat shoe, or by any general statement about reports, or by the insidious commentaries. * • * • We repeat the assertion —the assassin, whoever he was, wore a well-made boot, or shoe, not a brogue. Yes, it can be proved, and will be, whenever there is a trial. The pattern of the shoe sole was taken ten minutes after the murder by a respectable person, upon whose authority we state it." He begged, in the presence of their Lordships, to contradict the entire of this statement. But if that fact were true, he would ask if anything more convincing could be recorded to prove that a conspiracy did exist in Ireland ? If this respectable person, within ten minutes, prepared with tracing paper, took a pattern of this foot mark—if his ends were honest—if his intentions were just —if it were not a pre-formed and a pre-arranged plot, he would ask why no Magistrate was informed of the circumstances ?--( Hear, hear.) Why did not that individual, whoever he was, appear before the Coroner's inquest ? If he was told that that inquest was not fairly chosen, he would say that several gentlemen—he was not aware of the precise number—but several gentlemen holding the strongest and most liberal opinions, were members of that Jury ; several leading Roman Catholic gentlemen of great respectability were on that Jury. He (Lord C.) attended that inquest. Within the Court, and without it, they called, and repeatedly called, and inquired if any one was there prepared to come forward with any evidence. No one did appear, but the paper went on to state—and to this he wished to call the Noble Marquis's attention—it stated, " the policemen who visited the spot in the morning all stated in the hearing of several persons, whose testimony we can procure, that whoever did it wore a well-made shoe or boot, small at the heel." The Marquis of NORMANBY—Does it state one or more policemen? The Earl of CHARLEVILLE—It is several. It states the policemen. " This we state upon positive authority. It is the fact. The assassin of Lord Norbury wore, we believe, a well-formed boot or shoe, and not a brogue." This was in large Roman capital letters—" We charge no one—we insinuate nothing against any one— % e cannot formally accuse any one—we only say that there have been various reports, to some of which we have given circulation. We disclaim having directly or indi rectly charged any one with the murder. The Mail threatens us with an action. We give them perfect liberty. Our reporter will be our evidence." He believed that per son was the informer upon the occasion. " He can state who was and who was not called. Curious things must come out. Lords Oxmantown and Charleville may get a sifting but we shall stand clear." He was the first magistrate who arrived after the murder. The first words he spoke were in giving an order to the chief constable of police, who was in attendance with a large force of men, in order to take possession of all the ave nues leading to the spot. The orders were given by him in his capacity of a Magistrate. Up to that hour he had never heard from any authority the slightest in sinuation or ground for that most extraordinary statement. The Noble Marquis being then the Lord Lieutenant of Ireland sent down to investigate the cir cumstances attending the murder the Provincial In- , spector of Police, attended by a Stipendiary Magistrate, namely, Mr. Hill. If the policemen knew any thing of the circumstances, they might have no confidence in him ( Lord Charleville), but surely they must have confi dence in their own officers. He knew that confidential Reports were sent to the Irish Government, and the Noble _ . Marquis could correct him if his impression was erroneous. He begged again to state, that he had no object in address their Lordships, except to give the most distinct denial to these statements, in order to tranquilize the public mind in Ireland; for he knew it had been very much distracted upon the present occasion. He did not 1 ,,, 2 nt at all to punish the Paper, or in any way to call it to account, but he begged to set these imputations at rest, for he knew that the topics were brought forward with the sole object of keeping iitt,picion from alighting upon the real perpetrator of the crime.—( Hear, hear.) Having such an object in view he thought that ho was justified in troubing their Lordships. He trusted that the Noble Marquis might be enabled to put an end at once and for ( ver to those, in his opinion, InObt false and absurd reports. He was, perhaps, the; first person who visited the spot on the morning of the mnreler. He saw nothing to lead him to suspect any such report to have foun dation. The identical tracks of boot-marks which e44d been described by the Pilot were, no doubt, the tracks 1440 4.Y himself, as he was on the spot, probably within the ten minute aii,e,dod to, Later in the day he was engaged in the examination of wittiossc.s. Other Magistrates attended, and ordered a plan of spot to bp taken by the Clerk of the Works and the surveyors in at toloUnre. fie did tell a friend of his upon the occasi )n, a Learned ocw.lemp,n, that if any track was made by a well-40 4 e boot, it migh; hive been made by the boot of Mr. Toiler, tl.'2 second son of bcrd Nprhury who was then upon a visit id his fathor.—( ifear, hoar.) ( 4 . system of warfare now was cai•rving on upon all the'con;. stituted authorities of Ireland. It was not long ago that it was stated in a Newspaper of that country that the murder was committed by policemen in disguise. Tot the same Paper contained an admission that the policemen warp generally of very good character. The Marquis of NO RM ANB Y—What is the question which the Noble Earl wishes to ask? The Earl of C HARL WVILL E—Whether any infor mation has reached the Noble Marpis whiph at all inclines him to suppose that the marks which were found upon the vot correspond with the description I have alluded to ? Th e iferquis of NORMA NB Y said he was sorry the Nob:e . Earl' AID4iOI 1)4114 occupied so much time in reading a long article which by (the Marquis of Nor manby) had never seeti. But 1 4 8 would answer the question of the Noble Earl to the !lest of his power, reserv ing anything he might say upon the condudt of the investi gation, and the zeal and activity of the officers employed and the co-operation they ought to have received, till a future and more fitting occasion. The question was whe ther any information had been received by the Go vernment tending to confirm the suspicion that there was seen a foot-mark corresponding with the boot or shoe worn by one of the higher orders.— Ile had no hesitation in informing the Noble Earl that he bad never received any information which could have led him to believe such a circumstance in Ireland possible, till he heard what had been reported in the public papers with regard to a statement of an Hon. and Learned Gentleman in another place the of there was such a foot-mark it must be attributed, to the cause which the Noble Earl had now stated. Mr. Brownrigg, the Provisional Inspector, employed in the in vestigation, had been constant communication with the Government. He (the Marquis of Normanby) htd asked him whether he believed it possible that such a foot-mark could have been observed by any person without his having perceived it. Mr. Brownrigg replied that he had never heard of such a thing till mentioned by an Honourable and Learned Gentleman—that he (Mr. Wownrigg) bad investigated everything, and that hp bad never observed any such circumstance. That such in formation could hare been given by a police constable was impossible, because an office - A - in that corps would, recording to his duty, have doubtless cornmk:ricated such information had he obtained it to the Chief Con stable, by whom it wc,uld have been communicated to the Stipendiary Magistrate, and 47 hint to the regular Government authorities. Lord LyNDHURST then rose and said—My Lords I am tlC,flirQlls o f puttiig "pestion to the N o bl e Viscount. Lord BROUGHAM—Is it about the present ques tion? Lord LYNDHURST—No. Lord BROUGHAM—Then I just wish to explain that I did not, as it has been stated, commit such dis respect to your Lordships last Tuesday, as to leave the House without putting the motion of which I gave notice —it was put before I went.—( Hear, hear.) APPOINTMENT OF LORD EBRINGTON. Lord LYNDHURST—My Lords, I am anxious to put a question to the Noble Viscount. At no distant day the Noble Lord, who has been appointed to the office of Lord Lieutenant of Ireland, stated, in reference to the Irish Tithe Bill, that though he did not approve of that measure he should support it, because he considered the effect of it would be to render the war that was then waging against the Protestant Church in Ireland more formidable. My Lords, the direct and necessary inference from these words is this, that the Noble Lord who uttered them is de sirous that the war then waging against the Protestant Church in Ireland should continue, and that it should be come of a more formidable character, and I wish to ask the Noble Viscount whether, when he re commended the Noble Lord to that office, he was aware of the observations to which I have refer:ed ; for, if he were, the state of things in Ireland, with reference to the Protestant Church in that country—aye, my Lords, and as to the Protestant Church in England—is disbearteu ing, indeed.—(Loud cries of " Hear, hear.") My Lords, the natural consequence of the appointment is that the Noble Lord should be desirous of giving effect to those sentiments, that he is desirous that the war waging against the Protestant Church in Ireland should continue and assume a more formidable character. My Lords, the whole influ ence of the Irish Government, one must naturally suppose under such circumstances, will be used for the purpose of stimulating that war, and giving it such a formidable character— ( Hear)—or if the - Noble Lord is restrained by the obligation of his oath, to which I beg to refer the Noble Viscount, still it would be supposed by those who have been engaged in that war, that by pursuing it with inveteracy they would be acting consistently with the wishes of those at the head of affairs in that country. —( Hear, hear.) But, my Lords, there is another in ference which will inevitably be drawn if the Noble Viscount answers my question in the affirmative. That inference is this, that the Noble Viscount himself has adopted these opinions, and it will amount to a declaration of war on the part of the Noble Viscount against the Established Church in Ireland—and I will add, against the Protestant Church in this country. I ana desirous, therefore, of putting this ques tion to the Noble Viscount, that he may have an opportunity of making the necessary explanation, and, if possible, of removing the alarm, which I can tell the Noble Viscount has arisen, from these supposed words. I wish to ask the Noble Viscount whether, when he recommended the Noble Lord to tie Lord Lieutenantcy of Ireland, he was aware that the Noble Lord had made the observa tion to which I have alluded.--(Hear, hear.) Lord MELBOURNE—My Lords, in answer to the question of the Noble and Learned Lord which refers to a debate that passed in the other House of Parliament— ( Hear)—l beg leave to say that lam not aware of every expression or every sentiment which may have fallen from any Noble Lord upon the subject of the Irish Church, and I do not know that I was aware of that peculiar passage— if he uttered it—which has been attributed to him by the Noble and Learned Lord. But lam perfectly aware that my Noble Friend has always been friendly to the measures which we have introduced for the purpose, as we conceived, of strengthening the Irish Church ; and I am perfectly aware that the sort of imputation which the Noble and Learned Lord has upon this occasion cast upon my Noble Friend, were the imputations which were cast upon us for those measures ; and I also know those imputations to be utterly unjust, utterly without foundation. And therefore, though I do not know if I was precisely aware of every sentiment which my Noble Friend has uttered, yet at the same time I beg leave to say I was perfectly aware of my Noble Friend's opinion on this subject; and I think there is nothing in those opinions which unfits him for the high office to which he is about to be appointed by her Majesty —that there is nothing in those opinions which gives any ground for the alarm which has been expressed by the Noble and Learned Lord, or the inferences which he has drawn from this appointment. Lord WHARNCLIFFE—I never, on the whole, have heard a more unsatisfactory reply than that just given by the Noble Viscount (Melbourne). My Noble Friend (Lord Lyndhurst) did not ask whether the Noble Viscount appointed to the Lord Lieutenantcy of Ireland is supported by Government, but whether he has supported the measures of Government by steps which lead to something more—in fact to nothing else than the ruin of the Protestants of Ireland. (Hear, hear, hear.) I have the honour of the acquaintance of the Noble Viscount, and I believe that he deservedly enjoys the esteem and regard of all who know him, and for his sake I am sorry that he is going to Ireland with that speech affixed to him—for the inference deducible from those expressions were of a most dangerous character.— (Hear.) Let us not deceive ourselves, my Lords, upon this point, It is not irregular to allude to what has been spoken in the other House. The Noble Lord goes to take upon him the Government of Ireland, with the expressions attached to his name which must ex: cite the jealousy and fears of every Protestant in that coun try, and the hopes of every Catholic, by encouraging him to think that under the Noble Viscount's Government he would be nearer the object of his wishes. I regret this ap pointment, not so much for the sake of Ireland as for the Noble Lord.—( Hear, hear.) With respect to the Go vernment who has appointed him the inference is, that their act is a clear proof that the measure which they pro. posed with respect to the Protestant Government in Ire land, is not intended to be a final measure.----( Hear, hear.) The Marquis of WESTME AT H entirely concurred in what had fallen from the Noble Lord who had just sat down. He was of opinion that another Administra tion like that of the late Lord Lieutenant, would materially endanger the institutions of that country. The Noble Viscount now appointed should remember that he was the trustee of our youthful and inexperienced Sove reign, and that he went to govern a country which was in so inflammable a state that the addition of another torch would explode a mine that would cause her Majesty to lose her third Crown. As an instance of the dangerous use which was made of her Majesty's name by certain par ties in that country, he begged leave to read a placard which be had received from the county of Westmeath on Tuesday last. The notice was to the effect that a meet ing of the Precut-For Society would be held at Castle Pol lard on Sunday the 24th, at one o'clock, for the purpose of extending a branch of the Society over the Barony of Dennycour, in that county—" God Save the Queen"— ( Hear, and laughter)—thereby associating the name of her Majesty with those of her enemies whose object was to impose on the credulous, ignorant, and unfortunate—but amiable people of that country, who, if they were under proper government, would not be subject to the agitation which disgraced them in the eyes of Europe, and in which the present appointment was too likely to . cOntinue them. The Marquis of LANSDOWNE thought that the question put had been satisfactorily answered by the Noble Viscount. He begged leave to add his testimony to his Noble Friend regarding the Noble Viscount who had been appointed to the government of Ireland • and if ever there ' was a man who enjoyed the esteem, the respect, the at tachment, the confidence of all who knes him, it was the Noble Viscount who had just been appointed. So far he concurred with the Noble Lord opposite ( Wharncliffe), but his deduction was quite of a contrary character ; and so far from its being a matter of regret to him, it gave him great satisfaction to see the Noble Viscount, possessing such extensive confidence, selected by her M ijesty for the important trust of the Lord Lieutenantcy of Ireland. In this somewhat irregular conversation in which your Lordships have been engaged, in consequence of a ques tion put, it has been attempted by the Noble and Learned b;rd to select some phrase reported to have been used by the Noble Viscount, but reported only, I know not with what truth—l know not when it was—l know not whether correctly stated or not, for the purpose of creating an injurious impression against the cha racter of the Noble Viscount, and endeavouring by imputations to damage the character—to damage the name with which he goes to Ireland to administer impartially the government of that country. Now, my Lords, I say that is not just, and I say that I shou'd appeal in justification of her Majesty's choice, not to any expression selected and picked out for that purpose, but to the general character of the Noble Viscount and his attachment to the Constitution of the countay—( Hear, hear)—to his character and his attachment to the Church to which he i 4 elongl, and to his moral character in every respect point ing him eut as adapted for that situation. And, my Lords, I must say that lf there is a Noble Lord in this flow.° who I should think was interested in any particular expression used in one House of Parliament, not being selected and made use of in the other without its context, as a dis qualification for office—l should have thought it was that 2;lohie acid Learned Lord. Lord , LYNIMII44T—I beg to assure the Noble Marquis, with all due siibmission, that X tim not ashamed of any expression I have ever used eiiher in 'this or the other House of Parliament.—( Hear.) I know the ey.etepOot to which the Noble Marquis allud es , ar,4 I have over. and Oyer again qplained H ear . )1 pe'r'fectly the Noble IVlarqnis!s allusibn; and 1 am not ashamed to have used that expressinn.-.411ear.) 'll 4 , Noble Marquis charge s me with having made en a tt ac k upon 1,4 e Of the Noble Lord, but I sa id nothing whatever of the geheral character aod eondact of the Noble Lord. I alluded to certain expressions of a very marked character, which he was said to have used in the other House of Parliament, as the foundation of the question which I put to the Noble Viscount. The Noble Marquis charges me with having exercised ingeauity on this ciccasion, but there was no necessity for it—they were distinct—that they were uttered, I am quite certain— because I took great pains to inquire into the fact. I fi n d them in all the most correct reports of the Noble Lord's speech. They are verified by the statements of persons who were present—(Hear, hear)—and, I may add, that imme diately afterwards they formed the subject of observation and commentary to a Noble Lord, a distinguished member of that House. lam confident also that the Noble Lord will not deny that he uttered these words. What were these words ? The Noble Lord said he did not approve of the Bill itself, but he should support it—on what principl e ? because he was satisfied that the effect of it would be to render the war then raging against the Protestant Church in Ireland more formidable.—( Hear.) What inference could be drawn from these expressions, but that the war should continue and that it should be of even a more for midable character? It is on t h a t I place my finger, and I ask whether it is proper in the present state of Ireland, —notwithstanding the high character of that Nobleman—. notwithstanding his high principles as a Protestant—whe. ther it is proper to place at the head of affairs a Noble Lord whostated publicly his desire that the Catholic war now raging against the Protestant Establishment in that island should continue to be waged, and continue with a character still more forroidah!e than it has yet assumed. Is it not fair to infer that the Noble Lord is desirous of carrying into effect the policy which he encourages and approves, but if the Noble Lord finds himself restrained by the obligation of the oath I„,hicb, as the first Minister of the Crown in that country, he is obliged to take, is it not natural that all those per. sons who were endeavouring to pull down the Established Church will feel that their exertions are secretly counts. uauced by the Government, and that they wish the war ShOula be carried on with increased ferocity against the THE SUN, LONDON, FRIDAY,-EVENING EDITION,-MARCH 1, 1839 Protestant Establishment of that country. lam glad to hear the Noble Viscount state that he was not aware of those expressions having been used, because the inference would be that he adopted the same opinions, and justified the use of expressions which were an open declaration of war against the Protestant Establishment of Ireland. Lord HOLLAND—Are we then to understand the Noble Lord that any speech delivered in the freedom of debate is treated as a disqualification of any individual ? My Lords, I never heard any doctrine so extraordinary. I hail not the satisfaction of hearing the Noble and Learned L ifd's speech, in which he introduced the question, but it seems to me the most extraordinary that a person, for words used in a debate on a particular subject, after a lspse of a year or two, should he disqualified from office. A NOBLE LORD-It was in July last. Lord HOLLAND—Even if it had been yesterday, he was old enough to remember persons twitted with speeches which they had formerly made who had held offices of the highest nature. —( Hear, hear.) Even supposing the speech was correctly reported, which they could not know—a ques tion which was likely to come before this House, this very day, perhaps would show a breach of the rules of the 811 - 1 of Rights, that a speech in that House, or in the other House, was not to he questioned out of the House; and ens it to b questioned by the Queen's Ministers—was it to be questieued by the other House? It was a proposition utterly untenable in law, and the only way the Noble and Learned Lord could have of bringing it forward, was by bringing on the motion. Lord WICKLOW and Lord BROUGHAM, both rose at the same time, and endeavoured to be heard. Lord WICKLOW said that the Noble Baron entirely mistook the question before the House. Lord HOLLAND rose to order. Lord BROUGHAM then rose and moved that the House do now adjourn. He did this that the Noble Earl opposite should be in order. (Hear, heat, hear.) I❑ moving that the House do now adjourn. he did not mean to interfere with the Noble Earl's observations What he had to state should be confined to the remarks of his Noble Friend (Lord Holland). Lord HOLLAND said he was speaking to order. Lord BROUGHAM said he was speaking to order too. Lord HOLLAND—But the Noble and Learned Lord made a motion. Lord BROUGHAM said so he did, but— Lord HOLLAND said there was . no question now be fore the House. There was no question under discussion, and he thought it would be much better that the Noble and Learned Lord should have the opportunity of bringing questions regularly forward. Lord BROUGHAM said they seemed now to be very generally agreed that the whole of this had been disorderly, hut in this respect they had only been going on as they usually did.—( Hear, hear.) He had ❑ever been more sstonished in his life than to hear his Noble Friend, who seas not only one of the great organs of Order, but one lof the great supporters of the hereditary law in this country, and who ought to be best acquainted eith the Bill of Rights, fall into the most absurd—he said so with every possible respect to his Noble Friend, and meant it only as a►gumentt—the most absurd mistake he ever heard committed, to fancy that the word " question" in the Bill of Rights meant to apply to Ties:lotting a speech in that House, whereas it meant that the individual should not be indicted or impeached upon it. He remembered that the late Mr. Huskisson once told him that that word ought certainly to be removed from the Bill of Rights, in refer ence to a question which had been put to the late Mr. Charles Yorke. It was as it stood a mere quibble on the word "question ;" and he heard Mr. Huskisson say that if any one would move the repeal of that word, he would second it. Lord MELBOURNE, as we understood, said that Mr. Huskisson had voted for it. Lord BROUGHAM said that he could say nay to that, because he himself had said to Mr. Iluskisson, If you object to it, why did you support it? Upon which Mr. Iluskisson decidedly said he never did support it. Lord MELBOURNE, as we understood, said that he bad moved for the commitment of Sir Francis Burdett. Lord BROUGHAM said that that was for writing a libel; but would any body tell him that an important or unjustifiable speech in the House of Commons was not a fit ground for Ministers to advise her Majesty upon in the appointment of an individual to an office ?—(Much cheering.) It would be no punishment to Lord Ebring- ' ton not to be made Lord Lieutenant of Ireland. —(Hear.) He should think—no man having a greater respect for that Noble Viscount than he (Lord Broughahn) had, agreeing with his Noble Friend opposite, that so far from its being a punishment not to be sent to that country under these circumstances, and under the e•eieht of pressure under which that Government must now be admistered, by those who entertained such sentiments, he should look upon it as an escape—% respite—a reprieve from a punishment.—(Cheers.) The observations made respecting a speech of his Noble and Learned Friend's, three years ago, which ho did not hear, only astonished him next to the gloss which had been put upon the Bill of Rights. There was just this difference between the two—his Noble and Learned Friend had denied that speech. —(Cries of " No, no.") Well, but he (Lord Brougham) understood that the Noble and Learned Lord had given art explanation of it which made it assume a different aspect. Lord LYNDHURST, according to what we could hear, observed, that he had repeatedly explained what he had then said. What he had then stated was, that the people of Ireland and the people of this country were two races, and he certainly, in speaking of the people of Ire land might have said they were not one race but instead of ti at he had used the word alien. Lord BROUGHAM was sorry that his Noble and Learned Friend had used that phrase ; his Noble and Learned Friend knew that he (Lord B.) was sorry for it. They had discussed it in private, and his Noble and Learned Friend knew his opinion upon it ; but the misfortune was, that if a man used an unfortunate phrase, explanations came too late. If the question had Peen the sending of his No ble and Learned Friend over to Ireland immediately after his using that phrase he should not have been the Minister to have sent him, and if the subject of conversa tion now was not explained, he did not think that he should be one to advise the sending of the Noble Viscount. However he had no wish to go into the matter further, and he only wished his observations to apply to what his Noble Friend said. Viscount STRANG FORD was understood to ask whe ther a Noble Lord ( Londonderry) appointed to a high fo reign missson, had not been called to account in ano th er place for his political sentiments and speeches, and whether his appointment was not in consequence rescinded ?--[No answer was given to the question.] Lord HOLLAND believed that he was now in strict order to answer the arguments of his Noble and Learned Friend. His Noble and Learned Friend had entirely misunderstood what he (Lord Holland) had said on the Bill of Rights. It was only in allusion to the question for to-day respecting the petition, which was for leave to examine the proceedings in that House, that he had no ticed it. But at the same time, knowing well how dan gerous it was for him to differ with his Noble and Learned Friend on such subjects, be could nut allow his argument to be considered by him (Lord •Hol land) as well founded, narrowed as he supposed, he had brought it merely, to the question of impeachment. As to any remark upon the privilege of the Crown, respecting the fie edom of debate in Parliament, the Noble and Learned Lord's observations had no application. It was extremely un u etal to be engaged in questioning or discussing speeches made in Parliament, as grounds of qualification or dis qualification to hold office. He did not know what the speech was that had been referred to, but he had reason to be lieve there were different reports even of that speech ; and if speeches were to be made the subjects of inquiry, there ought to be some mode of ascertaining the truth of them, and he did not know how that mode was to be adopted, unless there was to be some way of trying it. The Earl of WICKLOW said, that as he believed he was now in order, he would make a few observations. The Noble Lord opposite had got up, knowing he was out of order, made a statement at full length, and when he (the Earl of Wicklow) got up to reply to him, the Noble Lord interposed the order of the House, and stated he was out of order, because there was no motion before the House. That might be justice—it might he love of order in the mind of the Noble Baron, but he believed he was the only person within those walls Who had such a sense of order or justice. The question put by his Noble and Learned friend did outgo to the point stated by the Noble Baron— it did not go to the extent a bother he would appoint to an official situation, a person who had at a former period in the course of debate, made use of some intemperate expression which he might wish to recall. No doubt no proceeding could be more unjust than that. but no such question had been put. —( Hear, hear.) The whole of the circumstances of the CO.BO must be taken together. In the course of the last Scssion Bill was brought forward by her Mejesty's nr,i*ters, pro fessedly, as they stated, for tlee puspese of settling the lone ro titine l, n r g o t t e r s a t n a riog n u t i l e i tY h - , tl r a e t h cl i es k portion of the E m pi re . I n (I!sputed point'with regard to Titt les •i n Ireland.' p purpogn = • , - rengtnening joiihic or the debate, - the Noble Lord to whom refer_ etsee beef been made, and for syloeie personal character no b Ody had a greeter ee s eessi 'Oin he himself had, took ocea soe to state"that he was opposed to that measure, but sup ported it le:cause he thought it would be the groundwork for future wars and eonteete ageinst she Church. Then his Noble and Learned friend had said i‘ Do you with a know ledge of that declaration—with a knowledge that the Noble Lord has declared hta hostility not only to the law, but his hope that the warfare would he still persevered in ?—do you with that knowledge send the Noble Lord to be Geyer o; of Ireland ? " The Noble Viscount aoswered with great tipsitation,—( Hear, hoar.) Ho felt the dilemma in which he had placed himself and the Government. He did not state--" I was not aware of it," but be had said—" I e Q p „ .l know whether I was aware of it or not ;" that was a very ominous answer coming from the Noble Lord. Under those circumstances, his appointing such a person and hie continuing to persevere in that appointment was equivalent to a declaration on his part and on the part of Government that they were determined not to mainta in the law which they themselves had brought in in the cours e of the last Session ; b u t th at th e y were determined to proceed still further in a warfare against the Church in that country. lie moat solemnly asserted, and he had authority for stating it, th at t h e d ec l arat i on ma d e by the Noble Viscou n t (Ebringt on ) had, long before any such appointment as this sweanstincloenntts had emplatecdr,eatcerdeagtreedat sens ation at the tim e t h ey grea t sensation. If th ose were uttered, what would be their effect now, when th ey saw that individ ua l, whose wo rds as a Member of the Le gislature ca use d suc h apprehension, c hosen as t he person to govern I re l an d ?—( H ear .) le e would tell the Nobl e Vis count f nt o opposite that settlement the of the qu estion, and which h e h a d measure be had passed l ast Sea ihoped would have a tendency to do so—he begg e d to state that th a t measu re w ou ld be altogther frustrated, if the Nro)ble He Viscounttrusted th perseveredeNoble Lord would ag a i n reflect in the appointme n t .— (Hear.) this app o i ntment , an d see ing the danger likely to resu l t Iron ' it , would be induced even now to with draw it. Earl RODEN never rose i n the House with greater pain th an h e did on the present o ccasion ; be cause there a'as no individual who had had hada lived together i n early life gr eater regard for th e N oble Viscount Whose appointment had give n ri se to this discus in the closest intimacy, and whatever difference there might be in their political views, he should ever esteem that Noble Lord's private character. But he conceived that the subject which had been introduced to-night was re.e of the most serious importance. The Noble and Learned Lord who had so candidly brought forward the subject, would gain the regard and the thanks of all persons in Ireland who were anxious for the protection of the Protestant interests in that country.—( Hear, hear.) Ile could not but think that any Noble Lord going to Ireland es Viceroy with this speech at imped as that which was to guide his councils, must create exceeding alarm in the minds of ell Protestant people, and that it would be a great triumph to those wh , were opposed to them on this important subject. The Noble Marquis opposite had taunted the Noble and Learned Lord with only referring o a particular expression in the speech, now a matter of his tory, made by the Noble Viscount in another place. He thought that for the sake of justice he might be adowed to read the whole of the speech as reported, and then their Lordships would be able to say whether the imputation cast on the Noble end Learned Lord by the Noble Mar quis opposite was not unjust in the extreme. The report, which he lied found in their Lordship's Library, stated that Lord Viscount Ebrin; ; ton said—" I am desirous of saying i,nlv a few words. 1, for one, entirely concur in what was lately said by the Noble Secretary at War, that this Bill will be a mere adjournment of the question. I have ever considered the exist(-nce of a Church Establishment so utterly disproportion, - d to the wants of the people (as that of Ireland), a state and a disgrace to the Protestant reli gion, aid a great mist'. eriune to the country. I should not be induced to support the Bill if I thought its effect would be to prevent that reduction of the Irish aeablishment which I believe will soon be extorted by the unanimous demand of the people. If I could see in the present state of parties any prospect of carrying into effect the principle of appropriaiion, consideretien weatever could lead me to listen to a compromise. I shill vete fo,. the Bill only because I expect that so far from proienting a thorough reform of the Irish Church it will, let throwing the payment of tithes into the hands of thus e - /V o has. more power and influence than the present payers, render the war now waged against the Church more formidable. I support the measure, not because it is as good as I should wish, but because it is as good as can be hoped for at present." He would ask the Noble Viscount whether those were the sentiments of her Majesty's Government by sending the Noble Viscount to Ireland? He thought it would be more candid, more fair, and much better for the country at large, that the people of England, as well as the people of Ireland, should know whether it was the intention of her Majesty's Government to destroy the Protestant religion in that country by sending over a Viceroy holding such sentiments as those he had alluded to, but which perhaps the Noble Viscount opposite might perhaps in his place deny. He for one trusted that their Lordships would ',ever consent to any measure which might be intro duced, or which might arise in consequence of this ap pointment, having a tendency to interfere with the Protes. tint religion in Ireland. It was the Protestant Establishment in Ireland which had been the depositary of all that was true and good in that country, and if they attempted to destroy it in the Sister Island, that attempt might be made in a few weeks upon our own land: He had before ad dressed himself to those Spiritual Lords who sat in that House upon this subject, and he would call on those Right Rev. Lords who were the legitimate guardians of the Church, (and be it remembered this was the United Church that was attacked,) to stand forward in this hour of Pro testant danger and Protestant conflict, to uphold their re ligion. He had felt it his duty to express these sentiments, when he saw such danger threatened, for he was convinced that Protestantism in Ireland would be the protector of civil and religious liberty throughout the country. The Bishop of LONDON wished to give notice that lie should call the attention of the House to a late pro ceeding relative to the Marrirge Act. Lord BROUGHAM—Oh, stop a moment, let us dis pose of this first.—( Laughter. ) The Bishop of LONDON begged the Noble and Learned Lord's pardon. He thought the discussion was concluded. Lord BROUGHAM said he rejoiced that he had given iris Noble Friend an opportunity of making an explanation on this matter, and he would now withdraw this motion.— ( Hear, hear, and a laugh.) MARRIAGE ACT. The Bishop of LONDON gave notice that he should to-morrow present two petitions from a clergyman respect ing the administration of the late Marriage Act, which was a subject of great importance both to religion and moraliy. He gave notice, because he meant at the same time to move for the production of correspondence between the Regis trar-General and the Guardians of the neighbourhood iu which the clergyman resided. on this subject. BEER ACT. Lord BROUG HAM said that finding there was no inten tion of proceeding in another quarter with a Bill of which he had given notice, he had telt it his duty in redemption of the pledge he hart given, to call their Lordships' attention to the aubject of the Beer Act, and to state that he should press the second reading of the Bill, but he could riot name the day on which he should move the second reading, until he learned when the Neble Duke ( Wel lington) was likely to he pres nt. Some Noble Lords on the opposite side said " rtft~•r April." POOR LAWS (IRELAND), Viscount DUNCANNON moved the third reading of :his Bill, adding a clause which should substitute the word " Electoral Divisions" instead of " Unions," whereby, according to the intention of the B;11, though not accord ing td the misnomer, rate-payers having property in seve ral districts, should have a vote in the election of guard. tans for that locality. The Earl of WICKLOW concurred in the observa tions of the Noble Viscount. The Bill was then read a second time. INDIAN AFFAIRS. Lord ELLENBOROUGH moved that papers might be laid by her Majesty's Government before the House il lustrative of the actual teems of the negotiations between the Governor-General of India and Runjeet Shin;, and :he expedition of Shah Shooja to Singapore in 1834; also with respect to the negotiations with the Government of Ca bool. Viscount MELBOURNE assured the Noble Lord that her Majesty's Government were most willing to lay what ever information they could before the House, not only re specting Indian affairs but those of Asia generally, and papers containing that information should shortly be laid before both Houses of Parliament. Lord GOSFO RD presented a petition from a place in Worcestershire against the punishment of death for murder; and also a petition from the Missionary Association of Not tingham for the abolition of the tax on idolatry in British India. Some other petitions were presented, and their Lord ships adjourned. HOUSE OF COMMONS, FEB. 28. The SPEAKER took the Chair shortly before Four o'Clock. Mr. Crafer presented papers from the Treasury. Mr. GLADSTONE brought in the Newark Gas Bill, which was read a first time and ordered to be read a se cond time. Lord D UNG A NNON brought in the Llangollen Roads Bill, which was read a first, and ordered to be read a ,econd time to-morrow. Lord ELIOT presented two petitions from parishes Cornwall, signed by upwards of 2,000 persons, against any alterations in the existing Corn-lags, 'Sir G. STRICKL AND presented a petition from Ileckmansworth, praying for a repeal of the Corn-laws. Lord SANDON brought in the Liverpool and Man chester Railway Improvement Bill, which was read a first, and ordered to be read a second time. Mr. BARING WALL presented a petition from South wark against a repeal f , f the Corn-laws. CHURCH-RATES. Mr. BAINES presented a petition from an indivilull confined in the gaol of Chelmsford, in Essex, who stated that he had been 23 years residing in Chelmsford—that he had been summoned by the Rev. Thos. Brookshaw for ss. 6d., alleged to be due by him for Church-rates—that itc disputed the validity of the rate on account of its inequality, and the magistrates refused to adjudicate. On the 14th of November he was cited to the Consistorial Court, but did not attend on account of the elcpnw, and on the 16th of January he was taken into custody and lodged in gaol. The petitioner prayed that Church-rat.- might be extinguished, and that his case might into the consideration of the I - huie. r'- , Pvcnotice that he would ca ll - ofl taken —le lion. 110,nb er attention of the House! to the subject on a fut.::„ .1 , 07. .Ht.TRCH EXTENSION . Mr. HOPE jOHNSTN presented petitins from severP), orishea in Scotland O in favour of Chur o ch Ex ce.wdort. CORN-LAWS. The Hon. MEMBER also presented a petition from Dum fries against any alteration in the Corn-laws. Mr. W. DUNCO.VIBE presented forty petitions from Yc.rksbire, signed by between 2,000 and 3,000 persons, against any alteration in the Corn-laws. Mr. D. W. HARVEY—I beg to give notice that on the The SPEAKER—The Honourable Member cannot give notices yet. The notice paper is not yet on. Mr. HARVEY—But my name is on the paper. The SPEAKER —But this is not the proper time for calling that paper. Mr. HARVEY—That is one of the inconveniences of being out of the House for a week.—(Laughter.) I was not aware of the rule before. The SPEAKER--.The rule alluded to by the Hon. Member is much older than a week. It was acted upon during the whole of last Session. Mr. Sergeant JACKSON presented six petitions from places in Ireland, praying that the House would not agree to any alteration in the Corn-laws. Also, peti tions from Kilkevan, and other parishes in Connaught Pro ince, complaining of the present system of National Edu cation in Ireland. As the Scriptures were excluded, it was impossible for the Protestants to send their children to the schools, and praying for an alteration. Col. GRANT presented a petition from the county of Ross, praying for Church Extension in Scotland. CORN-LAWS. Petitions praying the House not to interfere with the present Corn-laws, were presented by Mr. Alston, from Ashley and other places ; by Mr. Barneby, from the pro prietors, occupiers, and many labourers in Hereford ; and by Mr. Etwall. Mr. ALSTON presented petitions from Baldock and other races, praying that the pu.nishment of death, in all cases except those for murder, might be abolished. METROPOLIS IMPROVEMENT. Mr. CLAY presented a petition from the rector, churchwardens, and inhabitants of the parish of St. George, Bethnal-green, praying that their district might be in cluded in the places about to be improved. Also one to the same effect from the inhabitants of the parish of St. Matthew, Bethnal-green. BEER ACT. Colonel DAVIES presented a petition from the Li censed Victuallers of Worcester against the Beer Act. Colonel ROLLESTON presented a petition from Nottingham to the same effect. CORN-LAWS. The GALLANT COLONEL also presented a petition from the same place against the Repeal of the Corn Laws. Mr. CLIVE presented a petition from Salop to the, 1 same effect. CHURCH EXTENSION (SCOTLAND). Captain GORDON presented several petitions in fa vour cf additional Cinirch Extension in Scotlinti." Mr. CHALMERS presented a petition from Forfar against any additional endowments to the Church of Scotland. Mr. GAL L Y KNIGHT presented a petition from the N‘Atingham Association against the superstitious ant ido latrous praciees in India. Mr. LEADER presented a petition from Bridgewater, praying for the entire abolition of the Corn-laws. Lord ELIOT gave notice that on the 14th of March he wculd move for a " Select Committee t) inquire into th, statements contained in the petition of William Snow Harris, Esq , F. R. S., relating to the protection of ships from the effects of lightning." Sir JAMES DUKE gave notice that on this day fort night he would move for a return of all vessels em ployed for the conveyance of convicts during the last throe years ; also for a return of the vessels employed as transports durit.g the same period. Mr. WARD postponed his notice of motion respecting the petition of W. H. Burnand till this day fortnight, on which day he would move for leave to bring in Bill to regulate the disposal of all Crown lands in th, Colonies upon such an uniform plan as would a proper emigration fund. SEATS IN DANGER. Mr. HARVEY gave notice that t 11:.! would move an address to her Majesty, praying that. she would be graciously pleased to cause to be laid on the table of the House copies of any appointments made by the Earl of Durham previous to his departure from England, as well as while in the province of Ca nada, stating the dates, the amount of sPlaries paid, or to be paid, and the duties to b.' performed by each officer. It was proper that he should state to the House that his object was to take ulterior measures, which most probably would affect the seats of the Hon. Members for Liskeard and St. Andrew's.— (Loud laughter and cheers.) Mr. HAWES postponed the notice he had given re specting the Ecclesiastical Courts till Tuesday next, when he would move this resolution—" That in conformity with the reccommendation of the Commissioners upon Ecclesi astical Courts the jurisdiction in those Courts be abolished without delay." CAPE OF GOOD HOPE. Mr. GO ULB URN said, seeing the Under-Secretary for the Colonies in his place, he wished to put a question respecting the settlement at the Cape of Good Hope. It appeared from accounts which had been published, that there had been an attempt on the part of the Government to disarm certain settlers upon the frontier who were apprehensive of Caffre incur sions, and that, in consequence of the attempt, there had been a contest, attended with considerable loss of blood. He was anxious to know whether the Government had re ceived any intelligence of this affair? Mr. 14 ABOUCHERE said he was aware considerable anxiety had been excited by the reports which had found their way to this country upon this subject. The latest official accounts were dated one day previously to this al leged occurrence, but those accounts, so far from giving any confirmation to the rumour, led to the supposition that it was very improbable. The best way would be to read the last letter from the Governor of Cape Town to Lord Glenelg, dated the 28th of December :—" As the vessel is now leaving, I have only time to write a few lines, in forming your Lordship that we have received despatches from the officer commanding the expedition up to the 12th, and private letters up to the 14th. All the stores had been landed without any accident. The Ehors had sent a force against the Caffres, and had been victorious. 1 hope to be able to send despatches on the let or 2d of next month."—( We believe this was the letter as read by the Right Hon. Gentleman.) It was quite natural that anxiety should prevail in the public mind to have a confirmation or a confutation of the painful ru mours which had been circulated as to the failure of the expedition. He could add nothing more to what he had said. —em hers—ho w ,1 place to place, and it were ‘vera said MARINES. Captain BOLDERO wished to ask the Government whether there would be any objection to lay on the Table of the House a copy of the Order in Council, dated 12th July, 1837, which provided that no marine should receive a pension tor a length of service under 21 years, and that two years service ashore would reckon only as one afloat. Mr. P. THOMSON said there was no Lord of the Admiralty then in the House. Captain BOLDERO would, then, give notice that he would introduce the question on Monday next, when the estimates would be brought forward.—( Cries of " Hear, hear.") PRIVATE BUSINESS. Mr. P. THOMSON rose to call the attention of the House to the Report which had been placed in the hands of Members, relative to Committees on Private Bu siness. He did not intend to address the House at Lily length. During the last Session of Parliament, and for some days in the present Session, the Members of the Committee to whom this matter was referred, sat and deliberated with the greatest possible attention upon the lists. After hav ing given all the attention which so important a subject deserved, after hearing evidence and viewing the subject in all its bearings. the Committee came to the Report that was now submitted to Honourable Members. Any Gentle man who had attended to private business would, he thought, hot object to the first resolution which he he held in his band, namely, that the present mode of conducting the business up stairs had not given satisfaction to the public, and that it would be advisable to amend it.--( Hear, hear.) Two plans were brought before that Committee, one for the amendment of the present construction of Com mittees by regulating the representation of local interests, and the other recommending that a judicial body should be established excluding altogether local inte rests. • The Committee had deliberated upon that, and as it was stated in the Report, they wet e of opinion it was not advisable to exclude local interests altogether from Committees, and upon that decision the report was founded. That being the state of the decision they proceeded to consider how they could effect a remedy, and they had done that in this way—although it was embodied in the resolution it would perhaps be as well that he should shortly state it :--they proposed to allow certain Members to be placed on the list, and the first re solution called upon the Speaker to take care to reduce as much as possible the number of Members who had local interests. They then proposed, in order to avoid too great a reduction in the number, and to allow local interests to be represented, where good ground was shown for such represen tation, that there should be a Committee of Selection, con sisting of a certain number o: gentlemen, who were to select what Members should serve, avid when those Memb e r s were selected they must consent to perform their duties, because no Member had a right to take upon himself the duties of a Member unless he was willing to discharge all the duties which he was liable to be called upon by the House to perform. He proposed that the Members of the Selection Committee should consist of the Chairman of the Standing Order Committee, ' the Chairman of the Committee on Petitions, and the Sub- Chairman. Those Gentlemen he thought would be well qualified for the duties they had tr perform—indeed, he doubted if a better body could be found for the purposes for which they were constituted. Having thus briefly stated what the objects of the resolutions were, he would conclude by placing them in the hands of the Speaker, trusting that he would be allowed to offer any observations in reply to the resolution of his Hon. Friend, the Member for Kilkenny. The SPEAKER then put the question on the first reso lution. Mr. I - lUNIE said that as the first resolution proposed by the Right Hon. Gentleman was merely preltminary he would not object to it. On the question bin put as to the second resolution, proposing to carry into effect the measures contained in the report of the Select Committee on Private Business. Mr. HUME said that the attention of the flu.. been for a series of years directed to the tmti.- rcet the abuses consequent upon the, forward private Adls. He - • NI Ol 44$ to ask OP 71ware of the ”- ...se had ....ivour to cor manner of bringing ty referred to Honourahlß lictiter they were not all ..ecessity that exi-ted for the correction ,muses? Public opiniou hild long isince called on ..at House to erect a tribunal of a more efficient and sa tisfactory nature than any that at present existed for this purpose. He was anxious to see the HJus. u. , dert:ike the erection of sonic such tribunal, and at once grapple boldly with this mzv>ter grievan,:o.—( Har, hear.) When the Commiitee on Pr . v,de Bills w:!s first appo]ntcd three years ago he had proposed that t'.ie ahuscs should be remedied by reducing the number of the Members of these Committees, arid taking away all local interests, 4s he felt convinced that this was the only way in which a Court of Judicature of this nature could be erected which would do justice to the parties concerned or give - satisfaction to the public. This was the sort of tribunal that he had wished to see established three years - :ago, and he should move resolutions embodying these sentiments in opposition to the resolutions embodying the recommendations of the Committee which had been pro posed by the Right Hon. Gentleman, and on these he would take the sense of the House, and see how far they agreed with him as to the necessity of taking away local interests and applications as regarded this meortant trial. The Right Hon. Gentleman had told the House that these resolutions had been agreed to by a ma jority of the Committee; they certainly had been agreed to by a majority of the Committee, the numbers having been 7 to 5 ; but one of those gentlemen who had voted in favour of the resolutions and against the exclusion of local interests, had the previous year expressed himself most strongly in support of his ( Mr. H.'s) proposition, and if he had not voted in opposition to his previously declared opinion, the numbers would have been equal, and the decision would have been left to the Chairman. He therefore opposed these resolu tions which had been proposed to the House by the Right Hon. Gentleman, on the recommendation of a majority of seven to five, and move the following resolutions in their place, upon which he would take the sense of the House. He intended to propose a resolution which five of the Committee had adopted, namely, that Members represent ing loc a l i n t eres t s s h ou ld b e exc l u d e d f rom Committees in which such interests were concerned.—( Hear, hear, hear.) He was anxious to press that question on the House, b e c ause h e cons idered its Commit tees in the light of judicial tribunals.—( Hear, hear.) He put it to the House whether the rule was not well recognised, that when a case came before a Jury for its decision each party had the right of challenge. He was aware that Members of Parliament ought not to be challenged, as such a course would be derogatory to their character and dignity. If there could be any doubt as to the impolicy of the present mode of p ro _ erodin g he would refer the House to the evidence t a k en before the Committee. Honourable Members were aware that there were certain persons connected with that House who acted as agents in conducting PdPrivate Bills through it. The Committee examined severa l of the most:distinguished of these gentlemen, and frankly and creditably unfolded the abuses eonm.. , - with Private Bills. They had shown '- carried by canvassing Hon. mr hunted about fr"— • or theso ..OW ,Lea t'ti P. r^ " a division is going to take place. For God's sake go in and vote or I shall be defeated." The coo; -,=ene nee we : dolt re en who had never horn a word • of the evidence frequently turned_ the scale by th e ir v o t es . I n d ee d, no one coul d dispute the practice that had so long existed in that House. He had before him the evidence of the Duke ef Richmond, who stated that the proceedings before Committees wes formerly much longer than necessary, end that the nature of the attendance was very unsatis: factory. On the 6th July, 1887, the House passe d several resolutions, one of which was to the effect that Lords be exempted from s e rving on Committees on Pri vate Bills wherein they have a ny interest. The Nobl e Duke stated that arrangement had given great satisface. tion, cad tittle the House would see that the principle 01 keel interests lie excluded had been recognised by the House of Lords. The Hon. Member then referred to evidence given by Mr. Smith and Mr. Crampton, which was to the same effect. He could read the evidence of nine or t, ,n wititeses, to show that the practice adopted Lerds cf excluding local interests, had given sa t,,saetion very generally, and their- Committees were no longer likely to b characterised as private tribunals. As this was a question of great importance to the character Of the House, he hoped the House would give is deliberete opinion upon the subject, and he begged to !neve, in ord, r that tee opiiiion of the House might no t be douto,,,t, into it is :•xpAinv: that Members, repro tenting local interests, should be excluded from Com mittees on which such interests ere concerned." If the Heuse agreed to that, the resolutions which be bad proposed might be applicable to Committees formed on that principle. It wituld eot, therefore, render the la' hours of the Committee up to this time useless, but, on the contrary, it would form part of the same system which the House of Lords had adopted for regulating their proceedings. Sir GEORGE STRICKLAND seconded the ma" Lion. He had had some experience with regard to the . working of Committees of that House, and he coul d assure the House that the public would feel a very lively interest in the discussion of that evening, b e ,' cause whatever might be the dissatisf ac ti on which ha" been expressed, in respect to those Committees , be could assure the House that that dissatisfaction wa s felt much more strongly out of doors. This subject had been forcibly brought to his mind only yesterdaY' by a circumstance which would illustrate what the feel ing of the public was. One of his old constituents, ° highly respectable person, having seen the re solutio n handed about yesterday, came t o hi m w ith grea t anxiety, and expressed his alarm that this alteratiott should be contemplated ; f or s a id h e , " A nx i ou s as 1 am, and fearful as I am, of the Committees as TO, constituted, I have much more a p pre h ens ion tba' the local interests which will be established in the new formation of C om mitt ees w ill b e muc h : more overpowering, and we shall h ave l ess me an ; of obtaining justice at the hands of the Ho use d He must say that after every attention which he h a given to the subject, the result be had come to fa this, that unless they were prepared to go the length of that which was proposed by the Hon. Me m ' . her for Kilkenny, it w ou ld b e f ar b e t ter to l ea ve the evil as it stood. He would en d eavour i n a verYi,,,t words to explain his me an i ng upon t hi s su bj ec t. jer dislike to these Committ ees cons i s t e d i n t hi s , that 3 Bill was brought before a Committee, there was er i overwhelming local interest to obtain the attendanc e 0 Members.—(Hear. That l oca l i nterest was in 0 ° 113 ' ,, degree qualified by Members who were put in for a di j r, Lance, but generally speaking, local interest was powerful, and sometimes it acted all in one direction.'" (Cries of Hear.)—Take for example a Railway clu. eP e tion. The promoters of a railway were anxious to se l di , on individual property and to pay for it, but the in o t yidual was reluctant to part with it. That individ u . s he would suppos e , as i n a case t h at h a d come to his knowledge, w as a p erson w h o h a d no l oca l con nesi° a with the Railroad, except by having property th ere ; All the Members sitting upon the Committee wen those in th e i mme di a t e di s t r i ct. Th ey h a d em barke d themselves in the case of the Railway, and it was el ; ceedingly diffi c ult f or an y i n di v id ua l to ga i n atten tion! . that committ ee , w h ose o bj ec t was to overpower or bi t lance that l oca l i n t eres t. Th e quest i on w as w heth ei, the House should adopt the plan of the Right Honour; able Gentleman, and amend the present prac tice ; whether it sh ou ld a dh ere t o t h e o ld one , I n hi s o pluic n if the plan of th e Ri g ht H onoura bl e G ent l em an was i e adopted, it would make m a tt ers worse . That 12.:lieal° was to lessen the nu m b er o f persons har local interest ; but at the same time it must be rotte n) ; hared that, by adopti ng t h a t course, t h ey wou ld les, ae ,, e the number o f th e C omm i ttee . Wh en t h at numb was lessened, the inter , q might go in one directio n ' af a r so that a stringer, havi n g no i n fl uence over t h os e se- - bars, had very little c han ce o f j ust i ce . If t h e Ha iz t, adopted die proposition of the Hon. Member for ld kenny, and excluded l o c a l i n t erest a l toget h er , it wa t , l be only follow the example o f th e H ouse o f Lords, 311d.:1d, course adopted with r es p ect t o j ur i es . He slid • therefore, strongly ur ge up on t h e H ouse, unlesait 0. were prepared to adopt th e p ropos i t i on o f the 11 ° t. Member for Kilkenny, to let the present practice Clig he He was stron g ly, h owever , i nc li ne d to urge upo n t e House to adopt th e reso l ut i on o f t h e Hon. Mem b e r 1 :f Kilkenny, b ecause t h ere was a strong feeling ou t doors, that Committees of that House did not perfl their duty p ro p er ly— t h at t h ey gave votes hastily, and that those votes often worked great injustice. The original resolution and amendment having bee° put from.the Chair, N et l eru hdeirrtl.sytFed RESHFIELD rose and . sa id as h e had bee: f alluded thato t ie to by Housethe Hon. would M el i em o w h i b Memberfor I 11 a r e a 's few ex pl anat i ons. The Hon. Member bad stoated on the division in the Committee, the majority wa s °P hil for ex c l u di ng l ocal i nterest, but that small as it wa il s t extraordinary circumstance occurred, that one Membe r w h o h a d vote: : for the exclusion of local 'a.; rests upon f ormer occas i ons had in the present s e t voted exact! ) , the contrary way. In the last Session Parl'eement, there was strong evidence o f th e incoDl e e r e ence of the p resent system. There was one plan be the Co mm i t t ee f or t h e cure o f the evil. It was les cussed at great length, but it was argued that it he r not enough to o bj ec t t o one p l an, b ut t h at some °- of should be brought before the Committee. The lateue se o l the period of the Session prevented that being doneP t %er they had h a d b e f ore t h em t hi s S ession the qu o • whether they should adopt the plan of exclusion of interests altogether or not. He (Mr. F.) WI of strongly satisfied at that time of the inconyesien% o i the prese n t s y s t em , th at h e state d he . would be rillitee to recommend the t o t a l exc l us i on rat h er than ..c'esed things as th e y were . Th e su bj ect was fully disew'ofe before the Committee, and it was considered not a s it to recommend th a t pl an . N o di v i s i on however , has been represented by the Hon. Member for e dl kenny, took place, and the proposition rema ined 0 0 undecided. In the present Sessio again discussed, and he for (".,e was of opinion tb a ` a itli exclusion of l . ocal, intp great inconvenieno% :ests would be attended roe power c , :f the subject bade and that the House had O t ho si• ng Members of conducting the he 3 • their constituencies. Upon that grouou ci be .ad voted in the majority, and upon that grou° ooo , should now vote against the amendment of the it. Member fir Kilkenny, if lie divided the House te tta ti, Mr. AGLIONBY th oug ht t h at t h ey we re b° having once broken through the old system, t° a, much good as possible under the new "e' the dioueht the public were much more prejudiced by tie ;Admission of loc ;1 interests than by their exclusiouo;ight ivas in hopes. e however, that some m e dium plan kite' he adopted. He objected to pla ce p ersons in that te e e ation, who had an interest in the question ga l e e a', binding as a pecuniary interest. Would the Hous e of of nit that there existed a necessity for the exclus i Meilib , rs having a direct pecuniary interest in the : er e sion of the questions before the Committee. The re f r oie o interests which biassed the minds and feelings ° vi o l 1 0 quit,! as much as a pecunia r y o ne , an d h e w ould oo exclude all Members on whose minds you could tristcheir interest at all likely to bias them, so as to preveXt ere eto conning to a just decision, wheth er those int o 0 were consequent upon their connection a.i tlee' particular locality, or upon any oth er causes.( t he hear.) The answer to th e fi rs t quest i on put trate Committee to the Duke of Ri c h mon d, wou ld ilia" lied , his meaning on this subject. Tine Noble Duke l o ra ) when asked as to the practice o f th e H ous e Of per/ upon this subject, th a t th e f ee li ng o f t h e H o use of s was so strong as to the impropriety of Peers 13 1 11;;ioo local interest in Private Bills, having any el s eitli with the Committee s .on t h em , t h at if a Peer 'Cif such an interest were appointed to one of thes e to re",, mittees, he would feel hi mse lf b oun d i n h o nour d ot' fuse to serve. This system had been found Ic f e ellel well in the House of Peers,. and if such was & he re of that Hou,e, he would put it te, *Hon. Mel9-as dC this House to say,whether they cent to serve, because them; elves or their cou ati o eb Y had an interest in the "....i'nject. He thought the se tir f sion of Members 'lns circumstanced, tumid gi C r ies o t faction to t't rigShtirconsidered it v r . to etit s de country and to the House.--% • " Question.") it ' reg the ROBER THO P. GentlemanEE L woul d t ask o eel v l tvhbuestb.,fonerr it,hries. e at : r ' el'asion of local interests from Committees t i v vv bette" I Bills. In the first place, he greatly doubt eu e to t h : that House had a constitutional right to ° l 'd, 1V ,:j• constituencies of this kingdom that they w au lass mintt i e ll e; . resolution of that House, proscribe a whole Cour their representatives from serving on Pril ate oa ld h e — a m (C os h t ee d r u s t . l ) gero H u e s pcio.eneteedneduetdtothat it rr a r ose' come t ° w ider' 1 lution of such a character. They would have _ perms able difficulty in determining what constitutq.lci6eni tO sons! interest which should be considered in ttee 013 ; prevent a Member from serving on a Comm'. Private Bill. The Hon. Gentleman had stateader,b,aist were questions referred to Committees on Private 1 5 , u_l e ' d t his assertion e a r j ti u o d n i c o i l f t c h taracter, He.very muc h q uestcU t t her i e e Election Ctonnuttee a this of a judicial character ; hear l " an ous st-taco, were of this nature—(Hear, n ers e certain Private Committees lusion v • j. tt ees was a reason for the most rigid exc C G o e m n t m l t m t e a ens. wHheicwhorne.hrliedr'itfj:irvi actuated by local interests from those Lic)"__ Bills they was ilr" .