The Sun. — London, England, 1844-07-17 00:00:00

CTIOY' te a r triuMpll ha 9 [E POLL. ,iej ithorities it poll-book' , rAt 'eted that t as I non-elector,,s;uoo d Mr. SP'"ll'e;tire by their;ff„, d oi e greates t m " - i o the ghoul. Pi g a nte Torn the .attead proclairrred• ce t o to annaull ...... 20 5 ...... 1,7 . 1 5 6 ...... lard spooll,e, i e borougn r 3, the - 4° ' sed Bl let 3ot - toured hi"' louse of rotary 0 , any 0 „ any fat,tiou ein't esen t GoVertiDlL,o 1 woull ( 1 1 9 a 0 position.. bt ode lecessard",°,,t t ot :ornmonsi tot vas necessa,r.:o. 1, he wogia„Zogb ability. ,Juro forget the I , ,,,t e itte j 1 they su u .,, u otio him as anl,,, l " in bJ bmitted to 1 ,- -2heers.) t . ch was bbeilY, that ther n `bo n of Birnig. i n ,se e, the nleet9l' OF FINE e 0 addressed 1 , °OO Commiisillogo 4' the rie3 4 dig' s o clear a' il ia f the sublect' 1.11/1,•••47 7 0 t 3 six Stlbjel:' ~ill'c~~'f . x)111 L'• lac I ise• i s given to xds fle iw ne GasoolY e receiving.no, n to 3.1 . r. t h o ugh tb e among t llB ,0 e 0 0 , artist is w tr es , liberty t° t ott the one SU neral col:OP1i; the sielle. 00$ tided; and t i. Co be coroPe ervant , , Secretal, L of this le o r an ena ltil / 4 ..,1r , the C° ln 'otte , the best 4, ibtless 01 0 1% a !ned, vtil' [MS. sag to ny sugg es ', )eing Pr e l 3 iO 3 , two o e c to e the go tta I not rn St. 31s t r h till ti iable thirty from then e eoc f , rff, from th il di h e Secr e t of hour, a° ir bo . y RerS °ll to urning w it as asked g for s t o c t ice/ ,ed the 0 p ert 7 notices 'op ould he wt. t a t oi3 13S $ 1 , ntinn In if late, ' ti t ied to r'" of clai@ f ir ut u e of 6 4 ' 6 lone to :sot, client ser e s, f. JAg.' cN la erj 3hareho fi r i t the P(';., the ll ,s had l ' o lf' r the .. 110 3 vable fo„ P ' fot )ireetor r e , of the be i t uence anent of y j i e ,ad, 1111eio s ce. # uul A fter l , an d t o these, to his c sattl o c o'cl °cl‘ rst .en t ( 6 t DS. at'W Esql )e fore tin9fiae )V ~ut d S t er w hat, 'e co— t b, le rlg ral se ve y ho,iinad te 1a seeimed min u ell a c c ier k• of , e sl i o ll t a e reAt ''' .'-'' ":''. ~. ? :. ...•' A rL F A '.l tf. \ )F S, .14dy 16 The I,.:tD t h.s I,oni 12, .11.: fivou r of th,• petlLlUil ;1 I,onl 71 I pimp! w an 4 tippn,k • • a Bill for the The object of the .=fined charters, they wer ..ra nrivil:",e•. 'rho ii i second The I • of the tittitti.:;.;• • After a few; w:,rds • • ; . Was read a first tim". P.% : 7 • -- - . . E. 31.1 • .• Was the inteniLm ..1 •. . for the suppresAiot- 3)f p.•..t - • if sn, wheth- r it was th3;ir • , should extend to cerain ivew ;3, - which had Ist: le sprunz Lord WHAIiNCLIFFE .3;.; the - BiL had been intro duced in the other H ;use, h; •n it cane up to their Lordships' House any clause couki be inserted which their Lordships should thi ,- ,le fit. ail a CASE OF MR. O'ORISCOLL. Earl FORTESCUE then rose to move for information respecting the grounds upon whAi Mr. Alexander 0 1 Driscoll had been restored to the commission of the peace. Mr. O'Driscoll was a maiistrate in the county of Cork. It appeared that, while our, hunt; , g, he saw two or three boys on a portion of his land, who upon seeing Mr. O'Driscoll, run away. Mr. O'Driscoil pursued them and overtook one of the boys, upon whom he inflicted severe punishment with his whip. The matter was brought before the other magistrates, and Mr. O'Driscoll was fined £2 and costs. Upon this decision being announced, Mr. O'Driscoll declared that his brother magistrates had not done him justice, and some altercation ensued, and the result was that the matter was brought under the consideration of the Lord Chancellor of Ireland, and Mr. O'Driscoll was dismissed from the magistracy, but was ultimately reinstated in the commission of the peace. It was respecting this restora tion that he (Earl Fortescue) moved for information. Lord WHARNCLIFFE did not think the Noble Earl bad laid any Parliamentary groulds for the production of papers relating to this case. He would not, however. meet the case upon technical grounds. He thought it Would be evident to every one who had read the letters that had passed between the parties in this case, that much exaggeration had taken place. There ceuld be no doubt that the boy in question had been made a tool of in order to get up a case against Mr. O'Driscoll. There could be no doubt that Mr. O'Driscoll had been guilty of excessive warmth of temper. It would, howev.T, bc remembered that he was interrupted in his field sport , , by a lot of boys, and their Lordships must all feel hew very annoying it was to be treated in the way these boys had treated Mr. OTriseoll.—(Laughter.) Mr. O'Driscoll was, however, removed from the bench ; hut.. after having been suspended for some time, the Magis trates of the county memorialised the Lord-Lioui n prayin g for his res'oratit.n to e.e ceintriissoo of the Pease. After this it wes not hou •h;, tat Mr. 'VP,' a cull was unfit to li oil a and h e wa teen f e u t‘ee., Pettee. .le (Lora ty harni•liife .) ••• the in ti.n. The Marquis of NOICMANIIY gas surprised at t',(.• Speech which the N tile Lord hail just delivered. He totally differed from his Noble Fri-nti when he said that no P(irliamentar‘ t:ro,tild 11,1(1 been laid for the produc tion of the papers. 'acts st •ted br his Noble Friend Fortescue) h no• contradicted, nor ad it been actemp•ed to meet them any way ; and illtreft,re tiat. ample gr evel h ,d been shown for lite !notion which his N •11:e Friend nad iii'. With IlleAe ft, 1.4 , t. i e or• him, he ((he NiArqui, N.wrt.nby) 'would oever lime restored such a man •,(s Mr. (el triscoil Ito, the trench,told !le rksferred to the course which he 'lad taken when in oftii!e with respect to the case or Colonel Verner. Lord WHAIINCLIFFE if the Noble Earl very Leh wished for tie produet:oo of these papers, hs would Pr<duee the m.—(llear, hear.) The Earl of RIPON would not defond the conduct of O'Driscoll. but he thought there was considerable :Palliation in his ca-e. The Earl of 'WICKLOW eulogised the government of 4 -arl de Grey, and contended that her Majesty's Govern ment„ were justified in restoring Mr. O'Driscoll to the Detach. He thought it would have been unjust to have subjected this gentleman to degradation for life merely 41 1 3 011 the circumstances which had been detailed with '.respect to his conduct. The Marquis of CLANRICARDE contended that O'Driscoll had been replaced on the bench to suit Party views and party purposes. He thought there had not been the shadow of an excuse offered for the conduct of this gentleman, and therefore he was of opinion that his restoration to the bench was unjustifiable, and nut to be defended. The Earl of BANDON said he had signed the me snorial to the Lord Lieutenant of Ireland, praying for the restoration of Mr. O'Driscoll, and to that memorial Vet* attached the names of two Peers agreeing in poli ties with Noble Lords opposite, Lord CAMPBELL throught from what he had heard, that Mr. O'Driscoll was a person who was unfit to be re tained is the commission of the peace. The Earl of GLENGALL said there were a lot of * Paltry, contemptible, pettifogging lawyers in Ireland, who were in the habit of frequenting courts of petty sessions,ofe,ouitn order to pick up charges against the magis trates Itaatcfi:t3. of which they can gain something in the shape Mr. O'Driscoll was one of the men who s et their face against the repeal agi • -11 ' and the consequence was that he had made matter, for obnoxious. He asserted that this was a party for the charge against Mr. O'Driscoll had been merely trumped up to suit party purposes. Mr, O'Driscoll was an enlightened Roman Catholic,and be• c ause he had opposed the repeal conspiracy, every cir cumstance was laid hold of, in order, if possible, to do him an injury. The Earl of MOUNTCASHEL defended Mr. O'Dris "l4 as a gentleman who had well performed his magis. terial duties for a great number of years, and as a gen tleman every way calculated to exercise judicial func tions. Mr. O'Driscoll lived in a part of the country where .entkmen were very scarce—(Laughter)—and h ence he was looked upon with anything but kindly feeling, The LORD CHANCELLOR defended the Lord Chancellor of Irel:nd, • , nd st.id tio,t man had ever Act . i.inibtered justice in contort with greater ini- Partiality. 11, wa- w the -aloe ;.pinion with Noble Lords on that (the Minist,ri.o) of the House. that t his charge had been got up in consequence of Mr. VDriscoll being a Roman Catholic, at Conservative, and an anti-repealer. It appeared from the papers which !lad been laid on their Lordships' table upon this sub .leet, that the assault on , he b.,y was anything but of an a r Fgravated chdracter. tie (Ha not mean to justify Mr. `-''priseters Coh. 4 11(!!; but this he would say, that a great deal of exagaeratitai had teen indulge din with 7eSpeet tt. it. .i'he Earl of RADNOR 1 npon this case. as a most I mportant (me, and one upon which they ought to have . t. tile fullest informatinn. If the boy who was assaulted by Mr. O'Driscoll had assaulted that gentleman, the case w ould not have been treated as a petty assault, but the () Y wou'd have been sent to pri,on. There ought to equal j us ti ce t o r i c h aad pour, ant in viii matter jus tice had not been obtained. Lord WHARNCLIFFE explained. Lord CAMPBELL rose, hut was interrupted by The E ar l o f WICKLOW. w h o appea l e d to their o rdship s whether it was in order for the Noble and ''earned Lord to address their Lordships twice in the latille debate. Lord CAMPBELL said he only rose to explain. o T he Earl of BANDON said, the memorial to the f Lieutenant of Ireland, praying fur the restoration O'Driscoll was sign-d by parties, of all shades of politics, the numbers being almost equally balanced. Earl PORTESCUE replied. The motion was then aereed to. CHARITABLE DONATIONS AND BEQUESTS (IRELAND) BILL. Lord WHARNCLIFFE then moved that the report on this Bill be received. Several amendments had been made in the Bill in Committee, and he confidently hoped Irel the measure would prove a very beneficial one to tch and. There were, however, still some amendments it was thought expedient to make, and for this ~,• P Pose he would move hereafter that the Bill be recom -,d• The Noble Lord then proceeded to explain the eet of th e Bill, w hi c h was i nten d e d to sett l e t h e l aw 'withN respect to charitable bequests in Ireland. It pro 9i4d that a commission should be established in Dublin, efonsisting of five Protestants and five Roman Catholics, e the purpose of holding; charitable bequests in trust. believ e d t h at t h e Bill would meet with the general approbation o f t h e peop l e o f I re l an d , an d h e con fid ent ly rec ommended it to their Lordships. The M arqu i s of NORMANBY tendered hi s t h an k s 2, 'll. t.he Government f o r h av i ng i n t ro d uce d thi s measure, 2 h he cons id ered a very conciliatory one. ▪ Lord BEAUMONT expressed his satisfaction with 'no measure. , Lord C AMOYS thanked the Government for having Introduced the Bill. oerrt:tieafriLen: tanae a o s b hort conversation the report was received, e nd p ine n n t t e s d. were proposed, and the Bill was CoT intn he Customs Duties (I s l e o f M an ) Bill passe d t h roug h itee. Tile remaining Bills on the table were advanced a sta ge, and their Lordships adjourned. 110 USE OF COMMONS, July 16. The SPEAKER took the Chair at Twelve o'clock. METROPOLIS IMPROV ENIENT BILL. tf , t 4. The Earl of L1N!".70 A !,N ti :.econd rea g. din of le!r: polls Impr , weinent Mr. HAWES ~ ..resllv iii,sporov,l of the Bill, and protested atraitist b ile way in it was now broute,ht before the 80u.,e. Th,>re had b. en nearly one hundred alterations made in the Bill, and these within a day or tw°No perso n could have had ti me p roper l y to look the Bill in the oh3pe in which it was then presented to the liouse. If the aiwtopt to carry the Bill further at that time were p. , rsist, d in, ht should feel hinvieif -It:stale:l in e lo o„ g or e vio,s qu,s Th. Earl ~f LINO C 'owe he hail had a teat ttttt Ilotke he , had l A ya:d a. IA.II to to Prue an::;;.. Bill tha i i that of the •90. lik•iuber tb r Lawny th, and t IV UTI. 'Si r, as a preliminary one, coming tuu from such a luar tor; but of the hundred alterations which the Hon. ‘l.-.11%,er h,el bete , made in the Bill, there were not 'inofe tio,n of ti;e , o hilt what. were in nly verhai ametkimenti. l'he=e afflendmonts he (Lord Lincoln) had had prin;el and eireuba.:d, with a view to the eon venif.np- of nr.?er ro , he 11,, ):,. , aid I • t . , to go n 1 . ); ;.y , t• , l. • . at.out tia.f• • 1. Gentlemin had informed h:m (Lord Lin ' e fOrtl-11,•• OF tfOrldrYli.-”1:S to ,iia• • . 1:•,4 , -1, ) ',..,1 'lot o.;t• o' • hem. •') %V a . .h ”.;1 O,H ' re Lsva oc • . ti Inc ,rt.' 11, 7. w t. 7; e:+u ,~.~ .. . .zh ; it .. ;~~. ,V,;. e .t., t .!1 :Va .11, .r . s tits ;.tt in, say. at -U, t.o. en. re the !lain era 1 fit :.,:indtie-eittg in any e•te-er -In.) - ed.; ite h•• .). ' !: FJ . '•tei a:f e-ded an ace. nmolaitee , he wleieh cite Gentb had not been gracieus ••nout.Th to •If.irci.—( 611% ) Havieg given the House ever: fac:lit res e ect to thi t her tie could. he indulged he too.- than a ..bae censideration would net be denied to it. Under slice eircumseances. he should re 4; et, even for tee Hon. Gentleman's own sake, if ite Flu - .uld seriously endeavour to ino-Tfore with the progress of a measure which he (Lord Lincele) ha.! reason to suppose would be certainty a..ceetable out ofd .ors.—(Hear.) Mr. HAWES said be had told the Neble L ref, three or four rneliths ago, that he had many amendments to propose to this Bill ; and he had told bim to again at a later period, certainly under the expectation that the Noble Lord w-uld have invited him to lay those amend ments before him. He did not do so. and there let the matter rest. He would accept the invitation of the Noble Lord, and proceed to state, as precisely as he could, his general objections to this Bill. He begged to say, then, that he conceived this Bill neither more nor less than making - w -a on the whole trade of London. It was, altogether, of so vexatious a character, that if the public understood its real character, the Hous would be inundated with petitions against it. It involved alterations not only as regarded the construction of the buildings, but of a sanatory character of the most extraordinary descrip tion ; and like all the other Bills of the •present Government, it was distinguished above all of its other bad qualities for the enormous amount of patronage it created for the Government. He trusted the Noble Lord would be able to state the real expenses which the public would have to bear under this Act—an Act of the most over-reaching and tyrannical character, which ab solutely interfered so alike with the rich landlord and the poor one that neither of them would be able to alter or improve their premises as they liked. If the present Bill passed it would have the effect of put • ting a stop to that desire for building which was so pre valent at the present mneent, for no party would be enabled to build engine-houses or otter plaees for rail small bridge over a fancy pi.-.c•• of water, er even a wall, unless they sent for a London surveyor, and asked if' he approved of it. If they did not adopt, this course th• y would !;e subject to a fine of 5001. ; added to this, in cases of buildiugs rererred to hi the Ace it required thst a ecood foundation sh-uld be found. Was ~e t. t hat, absurd ? Boe ,u-e it ,upp•se, - 1 that all srehite.es .0 surv.-yors, unless under toe sane.- Hon ef the t e eoee , e(av topororio deties .4" tlt, , r A:1 'oo , L:< - s of poYi(7 tho the --- -C i' - fe:iti:. , rs c. :e its t.;.e rati ; and, all .1.1 , to that, the- m Bid would have the 0 11,i .1 t e !im , , 4 a,',ay votes ft “,i those who oeciipi,sl ch,.sni.ors of the value of 101. and upwards. Now, such a irr:tte ,- was a steject of grew con .ideration. in ihe r'ity of Lon-I 'n. l'here was anwh• r pert of the Bill to whioh h. wished to call the attention of th,,, [loose. It wa,, provided :hat tho salaries of the of referees and registrars should be paid out of Ow county rate ; and ho felt bound to congratulate the county of Kent—that county, which produced hops and apples, always had the greatest benefits. for w bile Alittilesax paid 1,0001. to the county rat• s, and Surrey 30oL, Kent only paid SOL In his opinion, pioceedings under the Bill were by far of too summary a character'. Under this Bill builders were liable to be called before justices of the peace, and even workmen were liable to a line of 50s. if they Iwted contrary to the provisions of this Act. The 43d clause was also very objectionable, and he hoped it would be struck out. Under all these circumstances he would ask if this was a proper Bill to proceed with at such a period of the session? The public had not had sufficient notice of the contents of the Bill, and he thought it might be postponed with advantage to the public. He should therefore move the previous question. Mr. MACKINNON seconded the motion. He ad verted .to the recommendations of the Committee for securing better ventilation and drainage, and stated that many of these recommendations were omitted from the Bill altogether. The whole Bill must have originated with some builder, desirous of putting any unfortunate per sons erecting a house to as much expense as possible. It contained a vast amount of legislation that was totally unnecessary, and he strongly recommended that it should be postponed. The Earl of LINCOLN said he never saw a more practical illustration of the saying that extremes meet, than the opposition of the two Hon. Gentlemen to the Bill. The Hon. Member for Lambeth made a slashing attack on the Bill, and said it went too far, and his t H la o ee n ba o em u g r aeog amendment, m e ht oci F enrh r te : I t i n t ihe d nadtw s h a tahi i ss d elai i ro t e et: Icon. recommendation did nbi not eeenrnddf oawr formed i g hoo o endh f a a d r s e e e n 0 0 n U d g e h d . the h the e b asCom mitteebasis o f the Bill introduced by Lord Normanby ; but it was found so impractical that it was obliged to be abandoned. There was no provision to prevent building back to back. He thought buildings of that character might be made consistent with the health of the inhabitants ; neither were there many provisions with regard to drainage, be cause a Commission was sitting upon that subject now, the result of which would be that there would be general legislation on the subject next year. The Hon. Gen tleman, the Member for Lambeth, had asked that the Bill should be postponed. He could not see the advantage of that, as the subject had been most maturely consi dered. Most eminent architects had been consulted, and therefore there was no further necessity for delaying the Bill. If the provisions of the. Bill were bad, let it be rejected ; but if good, let it be passed now. It was not a war on the trade of the metropolis, as the Honourable Member for Lambeth had said, but a Bill to prevent the faulty construction of buildings, and to promote the health of the metropolis. He thought he had a right to say that the public not only understood the Bill, but approved of it. The sanatory regulations constituted one of the most powerful arguments in its favour, The Hon. Gentleman coin plained f way in which the Bill was drawn, and spoke of its ridiculous minittenes. Whatever the Government did, it appeared, was wrong.—(Laughter.) He had often heard the Hon. Gentleman, who was a great critic in his way, complain of the vagueness of Government Bills; but when a Bill was broul,ht forward, which he who ran might read, he made a different sort of complaint. He also complained of many of the enactments as being too extensive, particularly that which referred to the British Museum. This was r4t!ier unfortunate, sinet the trustees of that institution had themselves requested that it might be included. The Hon. Gentleman said that if this Bill had been in existence some time since there were many puhlia buildings which could not have been constructed. this was an unfortunate objection, because within the last few months an accident had happened at the Brick layers' Arms, which would have been prevented if this Bill had been in operation. The Hon. Gentleman com plained also that places of public resort were placed under supervision. Did he recollect that such a thing had occurred as a theatre falling down in the metro. polio ?—( Hear.) Again, the Hon. Gentleman complained of the patronage given by this Bill. He must say that if any Government was less exposed to observa tions of this kind it was the Government then in power. He would defy the Hon. Gentleman to frame a Bill of this sort without the appointment of the officers ap pointed under the Bill. He had been told that the num ber of referees appointed under it was insufficient ; but he had refused to increase their numbers, and had only appointed two. It would be their duty to act as arbi trators, and to render the stringent enactments of the Bill as harmless as was consistent with the public safety. The Hon. Gentleman had complained of the increase in the county rates, but the expenses would be defrayed by the districts benefited. Every endeavour had been made to make the appointments as fair as possible. With regard to the objection to clauses 18 and 19, as no doubt that Hon. Gentlemen would attack them in Committee, he should then be prepared to defend them but the Hen Gentleman would find that those clauses existed in the present Act. He considered the principle of the Bill so good, that he would not detain tke House longer by defending it ; and he trusted that no further obstacles would be thrown in the way of the House re solving itself into Committee. After a few words from Mr. MACKINNON, Mr. TUFNELL complained of the late period of the session at which a measure of this importance was brought forward ; and he thought the Hon. Member for Lambeth was perfectly justified in opposing it. It affected every building in the metropolis, and was a most unwarranted interference with the rights of property. No doubt the surveyors were in favour of the Bill, as it brought them a vast additional amount of business. There was no provision whatever to prevent any one of those official referees from being the agent of one of the large proprietors in the metropolis. He was somewhat sus• picious as to the parties who were to be appointed official referees. There had been an alteration in the wording of the clause relative to the qualification of these officers. Lort.l LINCOLN—It is a purely verbal alteration. Mr. TUF.NELL thought the alteration most sus picious ; the original words were " ar. architect or sur f architect or surveyor." That looked as if a job were in preparation for seine person now in the office, who had ! perhaps studied architecture for a short time man y years ago. He believed that, under this Bill, a person coitil not niter even a window or a door without sending for the Government surv,yov, Considering all things, , he hought it better that the present Bill should be with dr.,e n, in order that a perfect Building Bid, In 4,3perd • :ince with a good Sewerage Bill, might be introduced at an early period of the next session. The Yawl of LINCOLN briefly explained : Tire gillery was them cleared for a division, Okeu ti . 4 numbers were— - - For going into Committee Agaiast it Majority The ;louse then went into Committee upon the Bill, and the preamble teas postpone!. Clauses 1,2, 3,4, 5,6, 7,8, 9, 10,11, 12, and 13, were agreed to, with a few verbal amendments. On clause r' being put, cu? cut u;• THE SUN, LONDON, WEDNESDAY MORNING, JULY 17. 1844. Mr. El A WES moved an amendment, that the district surveyor should be subject to costs us well as the build-r. The Earl of LINCOLN made a few observatloni that were inaudible in the gallery. Mr. HA WES withdrew his amendment, and the clausi •Nr:.• 4..Tr•e41 ( • (in 15 bein iuA3osed, . Mr HA WES obj' c:, , tl to the amount of the po,,Alty. 5001. a-d,ty was monstrous, and 114 hoped the Noble Lurd would reconsider it. The Earl of LINCOLN would consider the subject. iie was ari-aid, however, that :It would be necessary to maintain the high penalty. He would, however, dever -I.d a thy matter upon the report. I'm ih quest;on that the clause stand part of the Bill, Nle. HA ES objected to the clause extending to all si.e• ie. Tu.- Earl of LINCOLN suggested that the objection ul C uett,r at another part of the Bill. T.:e elsuse was then agreed to. Claa , ..es 16 and 17 were ag-eed to without discussion. ',law,' 18 was agreed to, after a short discussion. On clvuse 19 being proposed, HA WES moved that it be expunged. The Earl of Ll;\ COLN supported the clause. A i.er a short conversation the clau,e was agreed to. Clauses 20 t 33 inclusive were, after a few verbal amentimen s, agreed to. Clau:es up to. 51 were then adopted without discussion, ~x eep t on verbal points. he CHAIRMAN then reported progress and obtained leave to sit again. The House then adjourned till half-past five o'clock. The House resumed at Half-past Five. Messengers from the Lords brought down certain Bills. REVENVE COMMISSIONERS' REPORT. „ ------- The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER pre sented the Report of the Commissioners of Revenue In quiry, which he moved should be printed. As the evidence contained matter tending to criminate individuals, he thought it would be better that the evidence should not be printed, but it would remain upon the table for Hon Members to refer to. Mr. T. DUNCOMBE thought that neither the House nor the country would be satisfied without the publica tion of the evidence. How could they tell whether or not the report was well founded unless the evidence were published ? The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER said that the evidence would remain upon the table, so thnt Hon. Members could refer to it at any time. Mr. T. DUNCOMBE asked why it could not be printed for the use of Members ? In the case of petitions containing supposed libellous matter it was frequently the case that they were printed for the use of Members only. Wy could not this course be adopted in the pre sent instance ? The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER thought it would be better to adopt tqe course which he had pro posed. The evidence wou!d be accessible to every Member of the House, and they would avoid the risk which they would run if they were to print it. After a few words from Mr. V. SMITH and Sir D. NORREYS, Mr. T. DUNCOMBE said he should move as an amt ndment that the evidence be printed. The CIIANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER would in that case withdraw his motion, and give notice of it for to- 111,1 Nit.. I'. DUNCOMBE moved that the debate be ad- -: - ;ANCELL 4 .IR. :.he EXCHEQUER—No, ry,t! I k,-iti_draw my owtion.„ ,&}Lity, was !h , ll. :clthtirawn. .pres,nten a petition &wit the at of Tiverton agair,st the l',A,r-law Bill. G Ult Pitt..SENTMENT (DUBLIN) BILL. M , ..) H HANIILTON mov-d nominat, the Sel, et Committee on the Grand Jury PreNentment (Dublin) Bill :—Lord Eliot, Sir Ralph Howard, Mr. Young, Mr. Be:4-w. Mr. Gregory, Mr. Archbold, Mr Grog,an, Col. Henry White, Mr. Hamilton, Capt. Taylor, and five to be nomatated by the Committee of Seleeti.m. GARNSIIRK, GLASGOW, AND COATBRIDGE seven years of ale, were put aside as unable to march in the caravan. Infants were torn from their mothers' bre gists, children of six or seven years of age were wrung from the grasp of their parents. What then ? To rnainealn them was costly, to leave them to perish cn the ceast was cruel—they were dis patched, and they were the least to be pitied. The caravan set out, men, women, and children, half naked and barefoot. The weakly were driven on by the lash, the strong were restrained from flight by ropes and chains. Thus they marched hundreds of miles, across the burning sands of the desert, some tortured by agony of mind; some fell down dead, others perished by linger ing disease ; others were knocked on the head ; and intelligent travellers had stated that you might track the slave-caravan through the pathless wilderness by hun dreds and thousands of human skeletons. At length they arrived at the coast, where they were obliged to wait for the slave-ship. Disease, superinduced by fatigue and ill-treatment, speedily thinned their numbers. The slave ship at length arrived. The captain made his selection, and chose those whose strength sickness had least im paired ; the sickly were rejected. How were they dis posed of ? They were either put out of the way or allowed to perish by famine. An equal number to those embarked had perished by famine, disease, or violence, and for every five hundred that went on board the slave-ship five hundred more had perished before they reached it. But what were the horrors which pre ceded the voyage to what these unfortunate beings were fated to endure during that fatal transit? It was well known that a quarter or one-third more were put on board the slave -ship than would be tolerated on board any other vessel. The result was, they fell victims to disorder, and died a horrible death, if they were not thrown overboard. The captains of these slave-ships invariably took more negroes than the vessel could hold, for the purpose of making up any deficiency in consequence of death. If death ensued from these cruelties, the dead bodies were thrown overboard; but that was not all, for sometimes the living were thrown overboard too, for when the slave-trader thought, from the look of the slav es , th at t h ey cou ld not out-live the voyage, that fate was sure to await them. This was by no means an uncommon occurrence, and that had been even done by Englishmen, when years back the slave-trade was tolerated in this country. The consequence of all this was, the raging of disease on board the vessel ; and instances had been known where opthalmia had raged to such an extent, that no person on board could steer the ship, and the vessel had been lost. The space allotted to slaves on board ship was so small, that the negro had not as much room as a man in his coffin. In moderate weather air was given to the negroes from the hatch way; but when storms arose, and the hatchways were ' obliged to be closed, it was horrible to contemplate the condition of the negroes, hundreds of whom died from suffocation. From all these various causes it was reckoned that one-third of the negroes embarked on the coast of Africa perished before they arrived on the coast of America. The ravages thus committed in the popu lation of Africa could not be less than from 400,000 to 500,000 every year. Let any man calculate from that the amount of devastation which must have followed during the last fifty years on the population of Africa. He would venture to say, that if all the other crimes which the whole human race had com milted, from the creation of the world till the present day, were brought into an aggregate, they would not equal—certain was he they could not exceed—the amount of the guilt of the African -lave trade.—(Hear, hear.) Was it not, therefore, the duty of every'Government, and of every nation on whom Providence had bestowed the means of putting an end to this monstrous traffic, to employ those means to the utmost extent ?—(Hear, hear)—and, if ever there was a a Government or a nation upon which that duty was mere peculiarly pressing, that Government was the Government of England, and ours was that nation.— (Cheers.) He admitted that much had been done. The British Government and the British nation could look hack with satisfaction to the efforts which the country had made in this cause. Partial success had certainly been obtained. The late Government had done their duty in this respect.—(Hear, hear.) When they came into office, in 1830, they inherited the fruits of the labours of those who had gone before them. The slave trade under the British flag had been abolished, and was utterly extinct. Under the French flag it had been prohibited, and existed only to a partial extent, although great use was made of that flag to cover the slave trade. With regard to Spain and Portu gal, and the Brazils, we had treaties with Spain and Portugal—the treaties were insufficient. Those coun tries had passed a law prohibiting their subjects from engaging in the slave-trade; but that law was a dead letter. We had likewise treaties with the Netherlands, and Sweden, and Denmark. There was no great slave trade curried on under the flag of Holland, and none at all under the flags of Sweden and Denmark. When they came into office important events had just occurred in France. The Sovereign of that country had suc ceeded to the Crown from the free choice of a free peo ple. Power was in the hands of men deeply imbued with the spirit and the principles of liberty. That being the case, it appeared to them that the Government of France might be induced to enter into engagements with the Government of England on that subject—their views had been met. The French Government had joyfully and readily accepted their pro posals for a treaty, by which the right of search should be reciprocally granted by each nation in their certain latitudes for the purpose of putting an end to the slave-trade. That treaty, as far as the slave-trade was concerned, had been undoubtedly successful. It was not correct, as had been asserted, that in that instance the sacrifice had been all on one side. There was a national feeling in France that France had been called upon to make concession to England which England had not made to France. He knew of no quality more honourable 'hen that national feeling which so pre eminently distinguished the French nation.—(Cheers.) But as great a sacrifice had been made on the part of Great Britain, when she permitted her commercial navy to be visited and searched by the ships of war of France; as had been made by France in permitting her ships to be visited and searched by the ships of war of England —(Hear, hear) —and, except to accomplish such a beneficent purpose as the abolition of the slave-trade, it was a sacrifice that no British Minister would have dared to propose ; but they had laid aside all feelings of jealousy for th e attainment of this benevolent object,. In Spain similar events had happened. There the ordi nary course of the succession had been changed. There a contest had arisen between a Queen supporting free constitutional principles, on the one hand, and a Prince supp aled by the party of despotism on the other. Eng land, sympathising with the struggles of a great people to obtain freedom, had thrown her weight into the ..sale of the Queen and Constitutional Government, and, from the support thus given to that cause, it had triumphed. They telt that the Spanish Government of that day owed them a debt of gratitude, and they had called on them to pay it, not by giving to them any sordid advan tages, political or commercial. No; but they had said " Give u.s a better treaty for the suppression of the slave. trade. We call upon you, who have so recently engaged in a glorious struggle to obtain constitutional freedom for yourselves, to co- opeeate with us in rescuing the na tives of Africa ft om a thraldom worse than that under which you yourselves have been suffering. His Noble Friend Lord Clarendon, then Mr. Villiers, who was at that time our A m b assador i n Spa i n, had exerted that zeal and knowledge for which lie was so remarkable, and a treaty had been signed, in 1835, which gave us full powers to enforce on Spanish subjects obedi ence to those laws which had been enacted in relation to this matter as long ago as 1817. That treaty had produced a great effect in discouraging the slave trade to Cuba. In Cuba, in 1835, the number of slaves imported averaged 40,000 a year, and in 1838 that num ber had been reduced to 28,000. Events similar to those which had taken place in Spain had likewise taken place in Portugal. There the dispute was a Queen and Constitutional maxims on the one side, and a usurping Church and despotism on the other. The course which we had adopted in Spain we had adopted in Portugal. We had exerted our influence on the side of liberty, and through our assistance the cause of liberty had tri umphed. We had made to the Portuguese Government the same appeal that we had made to the Spanish Go vernment, but not with the same success. The slave traders were stronger in Lisbon than they were in Madrid—though he would say, that if the appeal had been made to the Government of Cuba, instead of to the Government of Madrid, he believed we should have had as little success as we had met with at Lisbon. The Government had then come down to Parliament and stated the engagements which Portugal had entered into, and the manner with which she treated those engagements. The Parliament was of opinion that the cause was a good one, and gave them by law those powers which the Portuguese Go vernment had refused to give them by treaty. That was a great step gained, as it gave them the power of check ing the slave-trade, carried on under the Portuguese flag, in a manner which, before that, they had been unable to do. The naval officers on the coast of Africa, for the purpose of destroying the slave-trade with the native chiefs, had landed, and taken possession of the slave ba- I racoons. 'They had given up th e property f oun d t h ere to the chiefs, and had taken the slaves to Sierra Leone and liberated them. The Government had authorised them to do this. That step had struck the greatest dis may into the slave traders of Cuba. He had reason to know that, in consequence, they had been about to with draw their capital from the slave-trade, as they could no longer carry on the traffic with any hopes of success. The result of those operations, to judge from the official returns, had been to produce a great diminution in the number of slaves landed on the islands and coasts of America. The number of slaves landed in 1838 was—in Brazil 94,000, and in Cuba 28.000, making a total of 122,000, while, in 1840, two years afterwards, the number imported into Brazil was 14,000, and into Cuba 14,100, making a total of 28,700, instead of 122,000, which it was i n 1838, showing a diminution of 83,00 J in the number of slaves imported, as compared with that year- This was not a sudden and casual diminution. It had been stated by Mr. Vandeler that from the years 1817 to 1835 the number of slaves imported into the island of Cuba had been from 39,000 to 40,000 every year ; in 1838, 9 8,000; in 1839, 25,000 ; in 1840, 14,000 ; in 1841 it was believed to have been only 11,000; and in 184.2 those impeded was stated to have been diminished to 3,000. The number imported into Brazil in 1838 was ; in 1539 , 56, 000 ; in 182, 14,Q00. As fur as the information which Parliament had'received would enable them to judge, a great diminution had taken place in the number of slaves tranq?ortsd from Afriett to America. Treaties had been concluded with ahncist every American state, except the northern one—when fie treaties with the other powers of Europe were signed iil v iht ee ded to go furt4r. The treaty with France con tained' an ariic!f.'' by Y!Thiely those powers hati engaged to request.' of such of the ether powe rs to a c c ed e to a treaty FR - the stßpre.so9 or the slave-tracle as' were parties file 'treaties of 44 -l a - Chapplie. These Powers ; said they would adhere to the spirit of their previous declarations—they engaged to sign the treaty which had been signed between England and France, but f wished, as a matter of diplomatic form, to have a new treaty drawn up. To this England and France formally assented. The English Government wished to afford the French Government an oppOrtunity of remedying an imperfection in the French treaty, for in that treaty there was only a zone of sixty miles round Cuba, Porto Rico. Brazil, Madagascar, and along the western coast of Africa. in a latitude of 15 deg. N., to a lat.'of 15 dez. S. But these limits excluded a considerable. portion of the southern coast, in both of which the slave-trade was carried on vigorously. It was proposed to the French Government to include both these parts; they acceded to it, and the new treaty would include the whole African coast as well as the West Indian seas. The new treaty was drawn up, and presented to the Austrian, Russian, and Prussian Governments, and when the late Government were going out of office, and after a good deal of negotiation, the treaty was within a few days of being signed. Russia started a few trifling points, but these the English Government were willing to accede to. The treaty would have been of great advantage, and it was the ultimate object of the British Government, when all the Great Powers of Europe had signed the treaty, to present it the Northern States of America, and he thought he had a right to assume that the application could not have been altogether unsuccessful.--(Hear, hear.) When Austria, Prussia, and Russia, as well as England and France, submitted to the right of search, there were strong grounds for believing that America would not refuse ; at all events something might have been done by the United States Government to assist and co-operate. He considered that, as far his know ledge extended, things had not gone forwards but backwards, and that great strides had been made by their Government, not towards the suppression, but towards the revival of the slave-trade. The Noble Lord then went on to say that he expected the treaty between England and the Five Powers would have been signed immediately after the late Government left office, but such was not the case ; it had not been signed for four months after, and when signed, the French Government, because of an address from the French Chambers, re fused to ratify—a thing unprecedented in the annals of diplomatic intercourse, and which the British Govern ment should not have passed over without recording their solemn protest against it. Nothing could justify a Government receding from the terms agreed upon and signed by its Plenipotentiary, except that it was proved that a Plenipotentiary acted against or beyond his instructions. The next blow the cause of freedom received, was that letter of the Lords of the Admiralty, in May, 1842, in which blockade on the coast of Africa was forbidden, although the Right Hon. Baronet opposite (Sir R. Peel) afterwards declared that the blockade of the coast of Africa was the mode de vised by the Government as the most effectual for the suppression of the slave-trade.—(Hear, hear.) The British Government, in that unfortunate Ash • burton negotiation, not only to a great ex tent surrendered that portion of territory which rightfully belonged to this country, but gave up all claim on the American Government for the fulfilment of that article of the treaty of Ghent which they would have been otherwise bound to fulfil. There was, therefore, no ground for calling on the American Government to do anything further towards the suppression of the slave trade. He had been informed that in 1843 a greater number of slaves had been imported into the West Indies and Brazil than for many preceding years. He believed in the sincerity of the Govern ment to put down slavery, but differed very widely from them as to the efficacy of the measure. He feared that the blockading of the entire coast of Africa, as sug gested by the Government, was physically impossible ; nor would, he felt assured, experienced naval officers concur in the practicability of such a scheme. He be lieved that the whole naval force which the American, French, and English Government could collect on that coast would be altogether insufficient. Just let the House consider tit immensity of the distance, from north to east, along the coast—why it was out of the question. In addition to the distance, it should be observed that on many parts of the coast there were clusters of islands, so that a cruiser might be within a mile of a slave-ship and not see her. And then when a slaver had escaped outside the zone, which the anti-slave squadron watched, she was quite safe until she reached her desti nation. But there was a still further difficulty. Ten degrees south latitude below the equator, and all along the western coast, there was no mutual right of search established between France and England. A vessel bearing the French flag would not, therefore, be searched in this region, but this would not signify if the right of search prevailed on the coast of the Brazils ; but one defect of the treaty of 1841 was, that the right of search was not guaranteed on that coast. He would not allude to the question of slave grown sugar, which had so recently occupied the atten tion of the House. They had been told by the Govern ment that there was the most cordial assurances and feelings of friendship between this and the French Go vernments. No man rejoiced more heartily at it than he did, but certainly he must say, that there had been as yet no very brilliant or beneficial results from this union—the fruit was not worthy of the tree. — (Hear, hear.) He found that it was a combination on the part of France rather to put down popular institu tions, and erect in its stead a military despotism. He feared the two countries had rather combined to enslave the free than to free the enslaved. It was said that Brazil and Portugal had been assenting parties to a recent treaty. Those two powers had entered into contracts of a most stringent character with this country not to carry on the slave-trade, and yet, in spite of those contracts, they had done so. Only let England and France, if they were united as it had been said they were—let them go to Spain, and use the whole weight of their united influ ence, and if they did so, he did not hesitate to say that they would obtain from Spain and Portugal the engage ments they had a right to expect, but which had hitherto been withheld. He thought it was in the power of those two countries, if they chose to be in earnest, to obtain, if not an immediate suppression of the slave-trade, something that would ere long ensure so desirable a re sult. The rulers of Spain had done something them selves towards putting an end to slavery. i'erdinand VII. had made an order that all ships carrying on the slave-trade should be confiscated, and their captains sent for ten years to the Philippine Islands. He hoped that the union between France and England, of which they had heard so much, would be directed to the accomplish ment of an object that would redound to the glory of both. The Right Hon. Baronet had stated on a former occasion that one of the great inducements for him and his colleagues to take office was the desire and hope of obtaining posthumous fame, and he did not ex clude from that the approval of conscience, which was the highest reward. But the Right Hon. Baronet said that one means by which they hoped to obtain future fame was by conferring benefits on their countrymen and on mankind generally.—jfear.) The present Government were placed in that situation that they could not do the first. They could not emancipate the industry of the country, because they were prevented from doing that by the prejudices of their supporters. — (Hear, hear.) They could not give content to the six millions of Catholics in Ireland, because they were pre vented from doing that by the obstacles which they had in former times placed in their own way. With respect to the improvement of the condition of the country, the vessel of the State was following in the wake, and not leading other nations. But there was one field still open to them, in which they might gather unfading laurels— they might abolish the slave-trade. If they attempted to do so they would have the country unanimous with them, and the powers of so great a country, when exerted in so noble a cause, would be sure to succeed. If the present Government could say that they had in their time put an end to crimes which their predecessors could not effect—if they could have that to say they would bequeath to posterity a name that would exist to the most distant ages.—(llear, hear.) But if it should be recorded of them that the slave-trade had been put down in the time of their predecessors, but that it raised its odious head again in theirs, they would obtain a fame compared with which the most absolute oblivion would be preferable. The Noble Lord concluded an eloquent speech by moving for a return, showing the total number of African negroes landed for the purposes of slavery on the islands and on the continent of America, from the year 1815 to the year 1843, both inclusive ; distinguishing the number so landed in each of those years, and distinguishing also the number landed in each year on the territory of each separate state or power, so far as the same can be made up from the documents in the posses s ion o f h er Majesty s Government. Sir R. PEEL would have cordially concurred in the motion of the Noble Lord, had he not been convinced that it had been brought forward for the purpose of that I rhetorical display which they had just witnessed. The Noble Lord, having passed the greater portion of dip session in inactivity, roused himself at the close.—(Hear, hear.) He had exerted himself to find out a motion on which to make a speech, which the most captious Mi nister could not raise any objection to. The Noble Lord, on the 11th of March, gave notice of a motion, the ob ject of which was very important, calling upon the House of Commons to pass resolutions compelling the Government to reject any proposals that might be made by France for the modification of the existing laws. He believed the Noble Lord met with little sanction on that motion from his own side of the House ; and the result was, that he shrunk from the motion, for week after week he kept postponing it, still declaring that he should bring it on, and when he made that declaration, the countenances of those who sat around him plainly showed their disappro- bation. But, however, the Noble Lord stated his determination to persevere, and the House was counted out on the day when he was to bring the subject for ward. Now he would ask whether that was not indicative of the opinion of the House on the subject? The Noble Lord seemed to be greatly alarmed by what had taken plane, and he had good sense enough to abstain from bringing forward the motion. Now, in considering the question, he would separate all those parts of his speech with re spect to the slave-trade from those which had relation to the conduct pursued by the Government, because it was important, that upon the first point in which they all concurred, that that concurrence should be expressed in a way that could not be mistaken, not permitting party differences to detract from the weight of them. In the whole of the first part of the speech. of the Nellie. Lord, he most cordially concurred. lit believed that the slave trade was the moat iniquitous traffic that was ever thotight of by the, mind ornian, and that it engender e d nlore misery and crime than any pulalio act of any nation. He did not think that the Noble Lord.: had in the sli4htest degree aver-rated the • miseries and horrora that had arisen from the traffic in the blood and sinews of men. There were two countries, and two only, who were now mainly ro snonsible for the continuance of this enormous crime. *hero was, on t h e part'6ysry'ovqr ci v ilised coun t r y, with the eXceP l tion of two, a desire to co-operate in the suppression of the trade in ruen.--(Rear, hear.) If Spain agfl Prazil would zealously apply themselves to the sup pression Of the slave-trade in those parts of the world over which they exercised jurisdiction, the slave-trade would be suppressed. France, Portugal—Denmark, to her honour, led the way—this country, the United States, Prussia, Russia, Austria, and every Power, were ready to co-operate in this great work, while those two Powers opposed the suppression of the slave-trade, and effectually stopped the progress of so great a work. Spain and Brazil were the only countries that lent their sanction to this barbarous traffic. They were the only countries that were deriving profit from it. They had the power to suppress it, but without their good-will it was impos sible, whatever sacrifices they might impose upon the people of this country, effectually to succeed. They might do much towards its suppression, but they , could not insure perfect success without the assist ance of. Spain and Brazil, because they were con stantly counteracted and defeated by the connivance of local authoritiei. - It would be easy to show that Spain and Brazil could suppress it. Brazil made the attempt in 1840 and 1841, and the effect produced there was most astonishing and immediate. During the period the Government of Br az il ac ti ve l y interfered to dis courage this traffic there was a great diminution of the number of slaves imported to Brazil. With respect to Cuba, the last two years proved that it was in the power of an active Government, notwithstanding all the , excitements of avarice, to take effectual measures for its suppression. He thought it greatly to the credit of the person who lately exercised power in Spain—he meant General Espartero—that he had appointed an officer to take the command in Cuba, General Valdez, who re fused to participate in the gain of his predecessors, or to connive at it. He discarded the traffic, and the result was extraordinary. During the period that General Valdez was in Cuba, in 1842, the importation of slaves into Cuba did not exceed 3,100, but when he assumed the government it was upwards of 14,000. During the first years of his government it was 8,000, and in the last year it was only 3,000. If Brazil had honestly exerted itself in 1840 and 1841 the slave-trade would have been effectually suppressed. He hoped, after the statements that had been made by the Noble Lord, confirmed as they had been by his successors in office, that the Government of Spain would feel that they had a grievous responsibility cast upon them—that the eyes of the whole of Europe were turned towards them ; and that such being the case, he trusted they would re-consider the course they had been pursuing, and turn their minds to humanity and justice. But if these higher motives would not prevail, then he must warn the Government of Spain to look to the con dition of Cuba, a country where their tenour of power was of so precarious a description. The black population of that country were determined to rid themselves of the sufferings and torture they were enduring. There seemed to be a settled and deep determination to eman cipate themselves from the state of slavery in which they at present existed. Those who took part in this had been recently brought from the coast of Africa, men who were unenlightened, and who could not have com bined, but who had come there smarting under a sense of wrong. What he had stated was the truth, confirmed from many sources well entitled to credit ; and if any thing did occur, no suppression of it could be hoped for, except by the most determined application of military force. He trusted, however, he had said enough to show that the public men of this country were not disunited on that great question which the Noble Lord opposite had expressed himself so strongly about, and that on both sides of that House they were but the representatives and organs of public opinion —that public opinion re acting on almost every other part of the civilised world.—(Hear, hear.) He (Sir Robert Peel) now proceeded to that part of the Noble Lord's ad dress wherein he drew an invidious contrast between the course taken by her Majesty's late and her Majesty's present Government—their principles and their opi nions on this question of the slave-trade; and whatever the Noble Lord had said should not provoke him (Sir Robert Peel) to conceal that which was due to him for the assiduous attention which he had ever paid to this subject.—(Hear, hear.) He had done every thing that could be done to invite other nations to co operate with this country for the suppression of the slave trade ; but having admitted thus far, he came pre pared to defend the present Government from the impu tations sought to be cast upon it by the Noble Lord. The first ground of imputation chosen by him was the conduct of the Government to the treaty which had been signed with France, in the year 1841. In the year 1838 France had conferred with this country as to the policy of inviting other countries to adopt, along with them, measures for preventing as much as possible the continuance of the odious slave-trade. France had then, no doubt with the greatest sincerity, united with this country to get other countries to join them in that ex cellent effort. She was willing at that time to concede the right of search—no objection had been made—none at least, of a very strenuous nature—for no sacrifice was asked from her which we were not prepared and willing to make to a much greater extent, and most certainly anything that might be supposed to have the effect of touching her honour, must also have equally touched the honour of England. As to the question of the right of search, where one visit would have had to have been made to the French naval force, several would of course have to be made to ours—our own honour, therefore, was at stake to a much greater extent than the honour of the French flag ; but France gave to our proposals at that time, not a reluctant, but a cordial and hearty assent. The treaty was signed by the representative of France, who was armed with full power for that purpose. There was no allegation whatever that that representative had at all exceded the powers entrusted to him. We had every right to expect that a treaty so signed by a repre sentative having full powers would have been justified, and so far as the King of the French and the Govern ment of France were concerned, he (Sir R. Peel) be lieved that every honest effort had been made in order to the fulfilment of the expectations which they had ii right to form, and the proper anticipations of that treaty.—(Hear, hear.) But certainly feelings of na tional pride did show themselves to a most extraordinary, perhaps, to an almost alarming extent, and to this circum stance alone did he (Sir R. Peel) attribute the non ratification of that treaty. For the rousing of those feelings he held the Noble Lord himself (Lord Palmers ton) responsible.—(Loud Ministerial cheers.) Between the engagements entered into and the ratification of the treaty embodying them, an important event occurred which terminated the reign of cordial and friendly feel ings which had hitherto prevailed between France and this country. He (Sir IL Peel) would not enter into the policy of the treaty of July the 15th—nor yet of the policy of the Syrian campaign ; but this he would say, that the engagements entered into by England with the three other Powers, to the exclusion of France—whether justifiable or not—were the cause of those feelings which arose in France, and which induced insuperable objec tions to her ratification of the treaty. It was not the fault of the Government of France that the treaty had not been ratified—they had a bona fide intention in re ference to it—but it was the representation of nationa anger in the popular assembly of that co u nt r y, w hi c hl debarred them from ratifying the engagements which their Minister had entered into.—(Hear, hear.) Could the Noble Lord have forgotten the de bates that took place on this subject in the Chamber of Deputies? Did the Noble Lord forget the part taken by so many of the public men of that coun try? Did he forget the speech made by M, Thiers, the very Minister under whose auspices the negotiation of the treaty was carried on? He distinctly stated in the Chamber that they stood very differently then than they did when the original arrangements for the. treaty were made—that the feeling iu 1838 and 1839 was very different towards England than after the treaty of July, 1841, and the slight thrown on France by it.—(Hear, hear.) That Hon. Deputy also stated that they had a right to attempt at a previous date, in conjunction with England, many things they could not, at a subsequent period, even think of venturing upon ; that in 1831 and 1833 there might have been motives sufficient to justify concession that he could never admit under after cit. cumstances. That language was, in 1842, also the lan guage of Berryer, and of many others of the most emi nent men in the Chamber. Then he (Sir R. Peel) said he was justified in charging upon the Noble Lord alone (Lord Palmerston) the non-ratification of the treaty, and the subsequent estrangement and ills that had fol lowed between France and this country.—(Trea sury cheers.) The Noble Lord might pride himself on his Syrian affair, if he liked ; but he (Sir R. Peel) should tell him plainly that he was the last person who ought to taunt the present Government with difficulties, which, in fact, he (Lord Palmerston) ha-1 himself created.—(Cheers.) Why, for year after year, the Noble Lord, at the opening of Parliament, had taken, credit, in the Queen's speech, on account of the main tenance of a cordial and intimate friendship and good understanding between this country and France. It was for the Noble Lord himself to state—and he never vet had stated—what was the reason that this good under standing, of which at one time he was so prone to boast, no longer existed.—(Loud Ministerial cheers.) But, whatever was the cause of the non-ratification of the treaty, there was no occasion at that moment to inquire. He trusted time, and the proper influence of moderate men on both sides of the channel, were rapidly wori-I nz their way to a better state of feeling, and, Gnat bad passions were rapidly sinking to rest.--iTheers.) The next point on which the Nobl e L or d h a d chosen to attack the Government ':;as becausethey , did not think it right to adopt hie (L or d Palmerston s) views, with respect to the destruction of the baracoons on the coast of Africa, He (Lord P.) said he had given orders for the destruction of these baracoons, without paying any great regard to what the laws of other countries were. The Noble Lord's'only object was to restore the slaves to liberty, no matter how, or by what means. Now he (Sir R. Peel) must say that he thought the far better course in all these matters—whether in our transactions with civilised or with savage nations—was toadhere to certain principles—(Hear, hear)—established by the natural laws of equity and justice. There was no doubt we were a powerful country—there was no doubt we could easily enough land upon the coast of Africa, and do almost as we liked ; but he asked the House, he asked the coml. try, did the law of nations justify us in such proceedings? —(Cheers.) Why, savage nations might make no de weed for redress, or, if they made .t, we might take no heed of it ; but were there b.',.4t civilised P owers who had interests on the coast of Africa, and who might have to decide whether we were justified in wrongs we might commit, and whether reparation for them ought not, in fairness, to be asked for? The ordinary course in all these matters was the proper one for a Government to take—it was to take the opinion of that legal au thority whose especial office it was to advise the Government in these cases, and to see that its I policy was kept untainted by wrong or illegality, The Queen's Advocate-General had been applied to fur his advice, and he had replied, " If you have a treaty with a native Prince on the coast, then you may interfere, het not having tiucli treaty, you are clearly not at liberty to, destroy the baracoons, and if a murder is committed in your attempting to do so, you are clearly responsible for it." tinder those cireurestances e the Governinent•ewer tainly thought it their duty to give notice to the naval i officers on the coast af - yeioa to refrairtfrorn such acts ; but they kttcl, at the same time, empthVered them, and urged them to take every opportunity in their power of making such treaties with the native Princes.—(Hear, hear.) He asked the House,, then, if there was any ground for imputation upon the Government in thus ex hibiting this country as anxious to respect, both with savage and with civilised powers, those rights which s e • , ever insisted on should be respected in our proper inte , rests.—(Ministerial cheers.) He believed the instruc tions given to the cruizers were consistent with law, and such as would command the approval of that House and i of the country—(Hear, hear)—ane that the whole con . duct of the Government was perfectly consistent with a sincere and honest desire to suppress the slave-trade on the coast of Africa, and where • ever else the legitimate influence of England might be made to extend.—(Cheers.) The next point on which the Noble Lord attacked them was as to a measure which he appeared to think amounted to a blockade of the coast of Africa. The term blo c k a d e could hardly be properly applied to this service—in his (sir R. Peel's) opinion, that was not a proper form. What was contemplated was an increase of the naval three, in order to prevent the departure from the coast of Africa of vessels laden with slaves. The Noble Lord greatly diapproved of this plan; but he (Sir R. Peel) entertained strong hope of its success, from the eircuiri , stance that it had been recommended by distinguished officers who had served on the coast of Africa, and who all concurred in expressing their confidence in its effi ciency, for the object to be attained. Captain _Matson, an officer well known for his experience and services— (" Hear, hear." from Sir C. Napier)—and who was most competent to give an opinion, highly approved of the plan. The Noble Lord, by signs, seemed to think an officer disqualified from giving a sound opinion if he happened to have served on the coast of Africa. That eallant officer, and others of equal weight, had ex plained to the Government how the slave-trade WRA carried on from the variety of sources whence sieves -vele supplied to the coast, and from the constant and careful watch which was kept on the !British cruizers, so as that the moment they moved from one point, the shipment and transmission of these un happy beines might instantly be commenced from it. They stated that if the English Go. vernment would sustain a permanent force of greater amount, and under a direct superintending control-- , taking care that no information should ever get abroad where those ships should be stationed—they would, in. two years, do more for the suppression of the slave. trade, than if they employed five times the amount under the present system. Captain Deaman, an officer of great judgment and experience, fully concurred in the views of Captain Matson, as did also Captain Tucker, another name eminent in the naval records of the coun try. Those officers had all given these opinions ; and that it should be kn own w ith out any concert with each other, these suggestions had not been handed over to civilians alone for consideration and for decisiten, but they had been submitted to his Gallant Friend near him (Sir G. Cockburn, we presume), who, after having taken time, as he always did, for considertion, had come to the conclusion, not that they would absolutely succeed, but that they promised a greater chance of success than any of the plans which they had hitherto acted upon. Again, then, he asked the H ouse w h et h er the imputations at tempted to he cast by th e N o bl e Lord (Palmerston) upon the Government were not unfounded and unjust ? (Hear, hear.) He (Sir R. Peel) would not weary the [louse upon other points attempted to be tortured into charges against them ; but would now say a word or two its to the withdrawal, under the new plan of action on the coast of Africa, of vessels from the coasts of Cuba and Brazil. No doubt, at times there might be requisition made of those ships for other points, should events oc cur suddenly to require an extra protection to British interests At the present moment, for instance, there were differences between Buenos Ayres and Monte Video, which might call for even a still stronger shield to British property and lives. But when requisition should be made of any part of such force, it would only be a temporary withdrawal of any part of it from the coast of Cuba. He (Sir R. Peel) did not contemplate any permanent discontinuance of the force on the coast of Brazil and Cuba, nor did he think he should here after, at all events for some time to come, advise that any such step should be taken. If there were any feelings of pride or honour in the Governments of Cuba and Brazil, they would induce them to act as this kind of police on their respective coasts. At the present moment England was absolutely peforming the duty of a police upon these coasts, a duty which feelings of pride and honour ought to lead them to discharge themselves, to relieve others from the necessity of it. The Noble Lord had referred to the good understanding between this co un t r y an d France. He said he was gad to observe it, but still he spoke of it in terms not much calculated to impose or strengthen it. He (Sir Robert Peel) had always been of opinion that this good understanding could not be preserved by any compromise that would be dishonourable to this country.—(Hear.) i But if it could be continued with a due regard to national honour, he believed it was an understanding essential to the interests of civilisation —essential to the peace and welfare of the whole civilised world.—(Cheers.) Ile believed it was the earnest wish of the great body of the people of this country to maintain that understanding ; and he could say for the present Government, that though it might be subjected to occasional taunts on the subject, he believed that the predominant feeling both in this House and the country was in favour of the main tenance of that good understanding, subject to the con ditions he had alluded to. The House must be aware of the difficulties to which the Governments of France and England were exposed in preserving that steady and temperate course. In this country they were taunted with making concessions to France, and the F renc h Government were taunted with making Concessions to England. There seemed to be parties ;.n both countries who were continually throwing every impediment in the way of that course, and prevented the continuance of mutual good feeling. He geese credit to the Government of France for being actuated by a sincere desire to abolish the slave -trade. But whether France united with them in inculcating on Spain and Brazil the necessity of observing their treaties, or whether it did not, he could assure the Noble Lord that those treaties would not be neglected by the Government. They had brought before the Government of Spain the conduct of the present Government of Cuba, and they had placed it in dishonourabie contrast with the conduct of the late Governor-General Valdez. The Government would insist on the performance of that treaty by Spain according to its conditions, for some of which it had received an equivalent from England. The Government were determined to adopt such measures as would lead. to the abolition of the slave-trade. The Noble Lord had. expressed a wish that England would combine with France for the purpose of rescuing the oppressed from. their fetters, rather than for the purpose of enslaving the free. Enslaving the free ! Why, where did the Noble Lord find any ground for the imputation ? Where did he find the ground for asserting that there was any com bination between France and this country for that pur pose ? Did the Noble Lord think that it was for the. interests of France and England—to the countries governed by free institutions—that any people should be subjected to a despotic form of government. He (Sir R. Peel) insisted that Spain was governed by free institutions. He believed that such institutions, com bined with a limited monarchy, would elevate Spaia to her place among the nations of the world; but he apprehended that we ought not to enforce such a. forms of government on Spain. Ought England to have interfered to maintain the Government of Espar. tero ? He believed that Espartero was an ho nourable man, desirous of doing his duty towards Stafes and determined to do it without assuming an uneonsti. tutional power. He believed that that forbearance and honesty, in a state.of society perhaps unsuited to them, had led to his fall. But whatever might be his grateful acknowledgment to Espartero for his public conduct—. whatever respect he might have for his personal quell.- ties, for the forbearance he had shown, and his determi nation to act according to the Constitution of the tome. try—yet, if the Noble Lord thought they ought to have actually interfered for the purpose of maintaining his oe• any other form of. government in Spain, he must say he totally differed from the Noble Lord. He believed that no nation would more resent such au interference than the people of Spain. The people of Spain were the best judges of their domestic Constitution. It was the ditty of this country to assist him with advice when it wail called for, and by friendly relations as long as the inter. course existed, hut he totally differed from the Noble,Lordl in supposing that they were actively to interfere in the nternal affairs of that country, He did not recollect any other point of the Noble Lord's speech to which he would refer, with the exception of that peroration whielt he believed was the main object of the speech itself-. (Hear, hear.) He believed th a t th e Noble Lora admired it very much, and would h ar dl y h ave made such a trumpery motion as the present one hut for the purpose of' introducing it. The moment he had seen thee terms 01 the NobleLeieTs motion, he had g i ven diree tiara to have O . s information prepared. H e wou ld even add t,(..; it more than the Noble Lord asked. The Noble Zoe' might take the number of condemnations' gnat had been made at Sierra Leone during the pas,e year. He wished to show Foreign Powers, that not withstanding their party divisions, they were united its considering the manner in which the slave-trade might; be put down. He had answered all the charges in the Noble Lord's speech, with regard to the treaty osl 1841, to the efforts making on the coast of Africa and Brazil ; and had shown that the Noble Lord had non one single ground for the accusation he had made against the Government. But the Noble Lord wee justly proud of his peroration, which ought to have been. spoken in the mouth of March last; but he had, tie doubt, said he would found his oratorical reputation upon, it—that it would make a great impression upon the House and the country, and therefore he was not sur prised that the Noble Lord could not forego the temp tation. That peroration was founded on something that he (Sir Robert Peel) had said two years since, to the effect that those who consented to make private sacri fices to undertake public duties did not do so for the mere pecuniary compensation, but from a hope of establishing a claim to the gratitude of the public. 'The Noble Lord then said that that desire for fame could not he that which rested on human opinions only, but that which had regard to the higher sense of duty. He (Sir Robert Peel) thought that all fame that de pended upon temporary popularity, was exceedingly evanescent. He believed that the only way of insuring true fame was, regardless of popularity to do that which a sense of duty dictated. When he said, therefore, that public men looked to permanent reputation for the re ward of their public labours,' he meant those labours. which were conducive to the welfare of their country, and dictated by a sense of duty. But the Noble Lord said that to them most of the avenues of fame were stopped up. To increase commerce and to loosen the , shackles of trade, that the Noble Lord said was impos sible to the present Government, on account of the party connected tetthbie,l3et, at any rate, it h a d d one more C asa the':Mslsl6 Lord, ► and ten eimes more than he ever con templated till his dying moments, when it 'became ne "Cessary to make some desperate efforts to prolong his political existence. Not till then did the Noble Loot become a free-trader. Not till 1841, when the Minis terial existence was greatly perilled, had they heard. anything of those magnificent declarations in favour ott' commercial liberty which the Noble Lord said the pre, RAILWAY BILL. The Lords' amendments to the above Bill were agreed to. RIOTS IN DOMINICA. Mr. HAW Es said he wished to put a question to the ble Lord the Secretary for the Colonies, on the sub ject of the late riots in Dominica. He had received a letter, which stated that in consequence of some mis %lnd, r..tanding on the part of the black population, as to the objet of taking the census, a riot had taken place, in w hich those persons had been treated most disgrace fully. It was stated that 150 men had been arrested and dragged to gaol; that three had been killed and nine wounded; and that one had his head severed from his body and placed on a pole. He believpd that mar tial l'iw now existed, and what he wished to ask of the Noble Lord was, whether a dispatch, which was written in 1839, had not continued in force? Lord STANLEY said that on the 3d of last month a disturbance had taken place in the island in consequence of an absurd notion on the part of the blacks that the census of the population about to be taken was for the purpose of taking some steps to restore them to the condition of slaves. He believed that the revolt was principally owing to some refugees from the French and other colonies. The disturbances continued for four or five days, but they were put down at last, and he had no doubt that martial law would be put an end to, and that the persons who were taken would be tried by the ordinary tribunals. The dispatch of 1839, to which the Hon. Gentleman had referred, was applicable only to Jamaica. THE SLAVE TRADE. Viscount PALMERSTON said that he wished to make a few observations on the slave trade itself before he entered upon the motion of which he had given notice. It was a subject of great importance not known to that House, and it still continued to engage the atten tion of Parliament and the country. Many of the most enlightened men on both sides of the House and out of the House had exerted their talents to put an end to slavery, and they at length succeeded in rescuing this country from the foul stain of slavery, but that great result was not completed without much labour. They must, therefore, look with tenderness on the errors of other countries who had not yet resolved to follow in their footsteps, remembering the long and painful efforts which it had cost them to wean themselves from such pursuits.—(Hear.) If there were those who had con tracted relations with them, the object of which was the suppression of the slave trade, they would make themselves participators in the crime if they relieved them from the engagements into which they had entered. The in vestigations which had taken place, with their disgusting details, had brought round the minds of men in this country to determine that Enzland at least should adhere to such treaties. The details were well nigh forgotten, though perhaps all men had a general notion that the slave trade was a cruel thing ; that it was barbarous to tear men by violence from their homes, their families, and their country ; to transport them across the sea, and to doom them to pass the remainder of their short lives in pain and toil, under the lash of a foreign tyrant : though these things were known and felt by all, yet he believed there were few who at that time of day had any adequate conception of the cruelties of which the slave trade was the cause. It was difficult to make, with any degree of certainty, a cal culation of the number of persons who were annually taken to the islands and continent of America for the purpose of being consigned to slavery. The returns for which he was going to move would, it was true, furnish some information, but that information was received from their own consular agents.—(Hear, hear.) The Govern ments of the countries into which these negroes were imported:published no returns. Although those Governments were bound by engagements with Eng land, to prohibit the slave trade, yet many of them—the Governments of Spain and Brazil notoriously —set those engagements at defiance—(Elear, hear.) In some places they even derived revenue from the violation of the treaty. Of one thing they must be assured, that all the accounts fell short of the truth.--(Hear, hear.) Exceed it they could not ; and it was reasonable to be lieve that they fell short of it. Now, what were the numbers calculated as the annual importation into the islands and continents of America ? Mr. Vandernell, in his able work, compiled from official documents, calculated the numbers of those annually landed at from 120,000 to 130,000. Sir Fowell Buxton, in his most interesting and valuable work, stated the number to be abont one hundred and fifty thousand, and whatever calculation they took,what an enormous amount of human misery and of human crime did that simple statement involve. When they looked at abstract general statements of numbers, represented by figures on paper, the mind was apt not to embrace, in all its details, the extent of the fact thus ascertained.—( Hear, hear.) But let any man consider, in his own mind, what 150,000 people were. Let any man who had seen a large army, amounting to 150,000 men, assembled at one time, imagine that he saw that number assembled together on a plain; let him consider that they were travelling fast to wards their doom—that that mass of human beings were going to painful and premature death, and under every variety of bodily and mental torture. Why would not any man who witnessed such a sight invoke the vengeance of Heaven upon the authors of such an enormity ? But if any man looked only at the number of victims actually sacrificed from the population of Africa to the avarice and the cruelty of men—he would not call them Christian men, but men belonging to Christian nations ; he would be far indeed from arriving at the truth. It was calculated, and, he believed, not without good data, that for every negro who had been landed two others had perished in the previous stages of the slave trade ; that whatever number was landed three times that number had been sacrificed on the passage, and before they reached the ship. It was well known that the negroes did not collect in the immediate neighbourhood in which they were embarked. Many were imported from a great distance, hundreds of miles. Some were taken captive in the wars. The greater number was the result of slave hunting or mar.-stealing, which prevailed over the interior of Africa. When the time of year came round for sending the slaves to the coast, some peaceful African village, whose unsuspecting inhabitants were buried in that repose which Nature iiinppy bestow s on man to fit him for the useful oecnpatioris end innocent enjoyments of the succeeding day—that village in the dead of night was surrounded by armed ruffians, the population were Foused from their sleep by the flames which enveloped their dwol4ngs, and e—Lleavoured to escape, some by flight, some Isy re:•istance, but all in vain, for they were overpowered, afid either slain or saptwet Sometimes the village was o# w aforde,d emit natural facilities for yheß,pe, and . many Of * tshe ur} rtungtg creatures buried die4441m.,i4 caverns, hit ihcsq they sysre Oinpelkcd evai toe their MutmoOrsoers Made a . nre At 'the 1;0 only the choice mouth of the ca;," n ' '"' jt the y Thus all were owns between suffocation and cap,:i vf:Y. polled to yield. Then came the selection. These who were pale and unhealthy, children six or * 1 • IP -;