The Sun. — London, England, 1845-04-24 00:00:00

THE SUN, LONDON, THURSDAY At these times the inconvenience at thebridge would be very much felt. He thought a station at the north of the town decidedly preferable to the one proposed. The danger of the train crossing the thoroughfare would always be consi derable. Mr. MACAULAY, in cross-examination, asked this witness, if he had never signed a memorial to tke Midland Counties Railway in favour of this line, strongly recommending the station at the bridge as the best adapted for the wants of the inhabitants of Stamford. Witness replied that he believed he had, but he did so then because that line was the only one before the public. In doing this, however. he did not con sider it to pledge him to all the details of that measure, so as to shut out. better information afterwards. He believed that the opposition of the Marquis of Exeter to the present line did not commence till after the signing of the memorial, but that had not influenced him (the witness). The CMAIRMAN—The great mass of the people are in fa vour of this railway, principally, because it is an impression of theirs that if this line were successfully opposed they should not get any other. Mr. Phillips, malster, late Mayor of Stamford, and a tenant of Lord Exeter, gave evidence in favour of Mr. Giles's plan for the station. In his cross-examination he admitted, however, there was no certainty of that line going forward it the present were defeated. At the last election excitement ran very high on the sub ject of the railway, and a s , rong feeling was expressed by many inhabitants against Sir G. Clerk, but he did not think that that feeling was general. Mr. Grant followed in a similar course, but without deve loping any new point. In answer to a question, put by Mr. Macaulay, he admitted having voted in the Town Council of Stamford in favour of the present scheme, but he did so in his official character, in deference to the feelings of the in habitants. His private sentiments were against it. Mr. Lawrence, land surveyor, was of opinion that the passing of this line through the valley and across the street in Stamford was highly objectionable. He had never seen anything like it before. Mr. Hill, surveyor in Stamford, gave similar evidence against the proposed crossing, and cited the case of one on the old Warrington and Liverpool line, which had been found very annoying to the people of Warrington. He also considered that the lines passing through the valley would interfere with the drainage, and cause flooding. The Committee then adjourned till to-morrow at twelve o'clock, when the engineering evidence in support of the pe tition will be gone into. Committee (No. 2.) HUDDERSFIELD AND COOPER-BRIDGE LINE. Captain Lewes's cross-examination (in continuation from our Afternoon Edition) —There is no lease between the Caldon Canal Company and the Manchester and Leeds Com pany, but there is some understanding as to the rates. The rates were not doubled when that understanding was entered into, but an addition of about 12 per cent. was made on part of the line. An unusual amount of traffic has been created on the Birmingham line by those gentlemen flying about the country with new projections, but they can't last. — (Laughter.) He saw hundreds of witnesses surrounding this House, in anxious expectation that those projects would be carried out. Mr. WICKHAM—Is a magistrate of the county of York shire and a partner in the Lowmore Iron Works. Das a very large traffic on the Leeds and Manchester Line of ii on, coke, and lime. Is decidedly of opinion that the line proposed by the Leeds Company would be the most convenient to his district, as it would be worked by one Company. Cross-examined—lt was the want of unanimity, caused by many Companies, that caused much delay and incon venience on the Normanton Line. Mr. HAWKSHAW, engineer of the Leeds and West Riding Railway.—Had compared Mr. Jee's estimates, and found that the works on the line he gave evidence of would amount to 781,0001., including a tunnel of three miles of single line ; Mr. Jee's estimate was 638,0001., but if the purchase of two canals was to be included, the cost would be one million ; a single line of traffic through a tunnel would be very dangerous unless the line was single all through ' • if the tunnel were to be made so as to give a double rail the additional cost would be 115.6001 ; it would be less expense to make the double line at once than to make it afterwards ; the second tunnel would cost as much as the first, that was to say 211,2001. Mr. James Thompson, an engineer of great experience in tunnel works in Scotland, deposed that the proposed tunnel on the Huddersfield and Manchester line would be highly dangerous, as it bad but one line of rails, while the road at either end had two. The whole of this witness's testimony went to corroborate that of the last. Several witnesses then were called to show that the inhabitants of Huddersfield were in favour of the Leeds and Manchester line. Mr. TALBOT then stated that was his case in favour if the Leeds and Manchester proposition, and spoke at some length upon it; and hoped the Committee would postpone their de cision until the whole of their case was before them. The CHAIR3fAN said that the Committee could not depart from the rule they had laid down. Mr. TALBOT then said he could not proceed further at late hour. The Committee then adjourned. BLACKBURN, BURNLEY, ACCRINGTON, AND COLNE RAILWAY—(Group D.) (Continued from our Afternoon Edition.) Mr. GREGORY resumed, on behalf of Mr. Parker, and in sisted that a saving clause, or rider, for a satisfactory devia• tion, should be inserted in the Bill for the protection of Mr. Parker's property, and proceeded to call him as a witness. Mr. Parker stated he had nearly 900 yards of ground, part of which was built over, and the remainder he intended letting out on building-leases. Mr. ST. JOHN contended that Mr. Gregory was trying to establish a most unusual precedent, inasmuch as the clause under which he endeavoured to classify Mr. Parker's pro perty was only intended to protect land already built on, and it had not been satisfactorily proved that Mr. Parker's pro perty had been built on to the extent which would warrant the interference of the clause referred to. Several witnesses were then called; but nothing of further importance appeared in evidence. The CHAIRMAN then ordered the room to be cleared, and on our return, stated that the Committee had come to the deter mination of limiting the deviation on Mr. Parker's property at the station and immediate vicinity to ten yards, but the amended clause was not yet to be considered as part of the Bill until one or two points had been cleared up. The final resolution of the Committee would therefore remain suspended until to-morrow. Mr. GREGORY then said that he had intended opposing one or two other clauses, but would not proceed with his opposition. He would leave his client's (Mr. Parker) inte rests in the hands of the Company, only requesting that compensation might be made to Mr. Parker by an annual payment, and not in fee. Mr. Sergeant WRANGIIAM saw no objection to the course proposed ; and the opposition of Mr. Parker was relin quished. The remaining clauses were about being proceeded with when Mr. MEREWETHER stated he was instructed, on behalf of the trustees of the Blackburn turnpike-road, to oppose clause A, and presented a petition from the trustees re questing that the proposed line, where it should cross the turnpike-road, might be carried over by an arch instead of on the level, as was intended. Mr. Sergeant WRANGHAM appeared to support the clause. Mr. Cawley and Mr. Gooch, engineer, were severally examined, and their evidence tended to show that the line could not, without a very large expenditure, be carried over the road otherwise than on the level ; and further, that the construction of an embankment for making the arch would throw the line out of the limits of deviation ; and also that crossings on the level were not dangerous to the public if the line were properly constructed, and the servants of the Company attended to their duty. Mr. Hardcastle was called as a witness by Mr. Mere wether, and said he had seen several accidents resulting from a line of railway crossing the road on the level, and instanced one in particular which happened a short time since on the Bolton and Lee line. Mr. Sergeant Wrangham and Mr. Merewether having mutually addressed the Committee, The CHAIRMAN stated that the Committee were unani mously of opinion that the line should be carried over the road on the level, and that the original clause A should be agreed to. Some of the remaining clauses were then proceeded with, when a messenger from the Commons announced that the Speaker was at prayers. The Committee adjourned till twelve to-morrow. • BARNSLEY JUNCTION RAILWAY. (Continued from our Afternoon Edition.) By this railway the carriage to Selby would be 4e. 3d. a ten, and to Goole 4s. 7 1, /,d. During fourteen days in last De cember he had taken the traffic on the Dearn and Dove Canal, which he found to be in limestone and coal to gether 650,000 tons a year, and on the Wakefield and Barnsley Canal it was 160,000 tons, making a total of 810,000 tons a year. But as this traffic was taken at a pe• riod of the year when the coal trade was in state of great activity, he would reduce the traffic on the Deans and Dove Canal to 540,000 tons a year, and that on the Wakefield and Barnsley Canal to 135,000 tons. Of this quantity 170,000 tons went to Goole, Gainsborough, Grimsby, and Hull ; and the greater part of the remainder to other places to the east. To the inquiries of Mr. Talbot, Mr. Robinson stated that the passenger traffic to the Cud worth station and to Pennistone, at 6,0591. 16s. 10d. ' and the prospective traffic at 3,3681. 16s. 10d., making a t otal of 9,428/. 13s. Bd., a great portion of which was likely to accrue from the abstraction of passengers from the Leeds and Manchester Railway. He believed that the number of persons travelling in consequence of the con venience of this railway would be doubled, and he assumed that a great portion of the mass of the population at Ashton, Staleybridge, and other places, would travel by the Manches ter and Sheffield and the Barnsley Junction, and so on to the North Midland Railway; but he had made no allowance for the traffic likely to be attracted to any of the railways proposed, but yet unformed, in that neighbourhood. By the present line of railway the distance to Manchester from Barnsley was 63 miles, that the journey occupied 4i miles, and the fare was lls 6d. ; while the distance by the new line would be 36 miles, occupying an hour and a half in the transit, and the fare would be 65., making a saving of 27 miles in distance, three hours in time, and in money ss. The traffic westward he estimated at 255,000 tons, that from Barnsley 200,000 tons, and that from Silkestone 55,000 tons. To the inquiries of Mr. Talbot, Mr. Robinson replied that he was aware that a considerable quantity of the Dunkinfield coal, which was found near Ashton, was used in that neighbourhood. The traffic in coal and limestone he estimated at about 35,000 tons more than was now carried on the canal. The carriage to Hull, Leeds, Huddersfield, and York, he calculated both ways at 24,000 tons, and he did not conceive, from the pecu liar nature of the traffic, that any of it would be diverted to any other line. Mr. Jee, the engineer of the line, and acting engineer of the Manchester and Sheffield line, stated that he first le ceived instructions to survey the line in 1841, and that he was requested to select the best line of country, having re spect to the wants of the neighbourhood, and passing as much as possible through the coal district. The difference between the summit of the Barnsley Junction Railway, at Pennistone, and that of the North - Midland, at Cudworth, was more than 500 feet, which he proposed to surmount by a uniform gradient of 1 in 95 ; but he did not anticipate any difficulty in surmounting this bar, which extended through the whole length of the line, which was 9 miles 58 chains, for there were two gradients on the Liver pool and Manchester line of similar or greater steepness; one of 1 in 89 and one of 1 in 95, which extended over planes of about a mile and a half each. There would be two tunnels on the road, one at Oxspring of 500 yards long. another near Barnsley of 440 yards long. There would be two viaducts on the line, one over the Don 156 yards eo l r o fe n snt g ao , ttio a i nd with the greater • height 78 feet ; the other over the valley of the Ilearne, 286 yards long, and h ttwil ai yu i r n s.e.w g e t h i t e s p g l ie n a eni t es e are s ci t oyef h eight 129 feat. He did not contemplate three miles property, lo. withinT hd e e n ir g oei n i nw n e 9teh s sr , ee, considering casunhtdet ffiinaegnlsdo unnecessary , tthha t ern h ord e u m ogAfhlalLniocnrhdelst e,r Tine,as ti e en r d e_ gstionne h ee a rc l ,o f sat a la- m tbee( i id l e t. that f tilet which w,s,ai st t i h v e ea r i e i a w e e ci l r i u N e: h i w n a el drift waysjffiNler's.frLoomckteb,e the Sil k e n e eye. lie had no doubt that the Silkestone Coal with the district and had looked ata Coal- field l e a n en gineers' e e t Ilse- largest unwrought coal-field in England, and he believed that the only obstacle to the fuller working of this field was the want of good railway communication. He had twice sun-eyed that coal••field with a view to open up a commu nication with Goole and the sea, and if that were effected he felt assured that' the coal, which was of very good quality would be brought into competi tion with the coal front the north. He was convinced that the line was the best that could be projected, and that the high line of railway was necessary to carry the coal from the Silkestone-field to Mancheiter and ail parts of the west, and that indeed so necessary was this railway, that it would be only one of several which would be formed after this was made. To the inquiry of Mr. SONES, Mr. Locke stated it as his opinion that coals could not be so cheaply carried by canal as by railway. To the inquiries of Mr. AUSTEN, Mr. Locke expressed his opinion that the formation of the Sheffield and Huddersfield Railway would tend to increase the traffic on the Barnsley Junction Railway, as also would the formation of the latter line increase the traffic on the former, as it would be necessary to go three miles on the Barnsley Junction Rail way to get at the Silkestone coal-field. The gradient was the best that could be got, and with reference to the coal-field the gradient itself was an advantage, and would enable them to form communications with existing lines on both sides of the island, and an extremely desirable line for the district and the consumers of coal both in the neighbourhood and at a dis • tance. Ile would undertake to carry 100 tons of coal with every train, with an engine of no extraordinary power. There was a proffer of a guarantee from the Sheffield Com pany of 5 per cent. upon 200,0001. and of 4 per cent. on 100,000/. of the capital. There would be no difficulty in making tramways from the several pits to the railway, so as to render the coal easily accessible, and the field could not be opened without better railway communication than now existed. In reply to an observa tion in the report of the Board of Trade, Mr. Locke said that there would not be any difficulty in accommodating the future bringing of coal to the level of the railway, and that the line, so far from skirting a coal-field, it never left the Silkestone-field from the moment the coal cropped out at the Oxspring Tunnel till it joined the North Midland Rail way. The CHAIRMAN, having advised with the Committee, stated hat it was the unanimous opinion of the Committee that he preamble of the Bill had not been proved. TATTERSALL'S.-THIS EVENING Six o'CLocK. TWO THOUSAND GUINEAS STARES. 5 to - 4 agst Idas 5 to 4 agst Joint Day's lot. 5 to 1 agst Hedger CHESTER CUP. 5 to I agst Cataract 9 to 1 agst Obscurity 9 to 1 agst Serniscria 9 to 1 agst Ould Ireland 20 to 1 agst Portrait 25 to 1 agst Trueboy 25 to I agst Ratan 25 to 1 agst Wineour 30 to 1 agst Pug 33 to 1 agst Fitz-Allan DERBY. 5 to 1 agst Idas 10 to 1 agst Weatherbit 11 to 1 agst Alarm 14 to 1 agst hedger 14 to 1 agst Pam 20 to 1 agst Clear-the-Way 25 to 1 agst Old England 25 to 1 agst Worthless 50 to 1 agst Ironmaster 50 to 1 agst Libel MPERIAL PARLIAMENT (THIS EVENING.) HOUSE OF LORDS. At half-past four there was a Commission for giving the Royal Assent to certain Bills. The Commissioners were the Lord Chancellor, the Duke of Buccleuch, and Lord Wharnclitre. The Commissioners having taken their seats at the foot of the throne, the Usher of the Black Rod was ordered to summon the Commons to the bar of their' Lordships' House. The SPEAKER soon afterwards appeared at the bar; accompanied by many of the Members. The Royal Assent was then given in the usual form to the following Bills :—The Sugar Duties Bill, the Glass Duties Bill, the Customs Duties Bill, the Mutiny Bill, the Marine Mutiny Bill, the Thames Navigation Bill, and Britton's Divorce Bill. The Commons then withdrew, and their Lordships adjourned during pleasure. Their Lordships reassembled at five o'clock. Messengers from the House of Commons brought up several Bills. MAYNOOTIL The Earl of WICKLOW presented two petitions from the county of Wicklow, one against the grant to Maynooth, and the other in favour of the grant to the Church Education Society. The Duke of BUCCLEUCH presented petitions from several places against the grant to Maynooth. ECCLESIASTICAL COMMISSIONERS. The Duke of RICHMOND wished to know whether the Ecclesiastical Commissioners had come to any reso lution with respect to the sale of the property under their care. Lord WHARNCLIFFE said that they had come to some resolutions, which would be laid on the table. EDUCATION IN IRELAND. The Earl of CLANCARTY presented petitions from Louth, and various other places, in favour of Church Education in Ireland. The Noble Earl also presented three petitions against the additional grant to Maynooth. Ho wished to say a few words in justification - of the vote he intended to give against that measure, should it ever ccme before their Lordships' House. He had no wish to stand in the way of the education of any class of her Majesty's subjects, but he thought that no money ought to be voted by the State to support any system of education, unless the State had un limited control over it, and unless the Govern ment was responsible for whatever was taught The experiment tried in establishing the College of May nooth had signally failed. During the fifty years that the College had been in existence, no one individual celebrated either in literature or science had been edu cated there. Ho believed that there was a general opinion prevalent in Ireland as to the inefficiency of Maynooth College. When the question came before the House, he should certainly vote against it unless a searching inquiry were previously made into the disci pline pursued at Maynooth. The grant was decidedly at variance with the oath of supremacy, and nothing was more likely to increase the Ecclesiastical power of the See of Rome. It was said that the question of principle was disposed of in 1795; but he must remind the Noble Lord that those who used this argument had repeatedly taken the oath of supremacy. To that oath obligations attached, and in his opinion Noble Lords were bound to observe them. The Marquis of NORMAN BY believed it was the general desire of the House that the discussion on this subject should be postponed until the Bill came formerly before the House ; and he merely rose for the pur pose of referring: to the statement made by the Noble Earl in the early par of his address. The Noble Earl stated that the College of Mayneoth had been established for more than fifty years, but since that time it had produced no men of eminence or learn ing. Now, when he held office in Ireland, he made it cliffer w e a n s t ntotit that of his duty to inquire into this subject, and, eertninly, the the p r conduced o o e b Noble r y L r o i r c d h . impression l e ft upon his mind of the religious learning and general instruction to be found and given there was far Every one knows that that institution was conducted on could not suffer the Noble Marquis's sfruucihts,a but t ti h n e g assertion that Maynooth had produced no person of eminence for learning or virtue. The Earl of CLANCARTY explained that the object of his observations tended to inquiry as to what the College had produced. The Duke of WELLINGTON thought it would be better to adhere to the custom of the House of stating the substance of any peti , ion which was presented , and not to speak upon the principle until the regular time for the discussion came on. The Marquis of LANSDOWN, while allowing the general convenience of not speaking upon peti tions, yet conceived that if the privilege of speaking on petitions were done away with much valuable time would be lost. ViiirZt 93bttion Ensign the Hon. Ernest Curzon, 52d Light Infantry, by the Earl Howe. Sub-Lieut. H. D. Streatfeild, on his appointment to the Ist Life Guards, by Viscount Combermere. Lieut. Montgomery Campbell, Madras Army, ;by the Earl of Bandon. Lieut. Robert Edward Smith, Royal Bucks or King's Own Regiment of Militia, by Lord Carrington. Lieut. Walter Kirby, 29th Regiment, on his return from fo reign service, by General Lord Strafford, G. C.B. Lieut. Charles Wallace, 25th Regiment, on his promotion and return from China, by his father, Col. Robert Wallace, K. H. Major Jelf Sharp, on his appointment as Deputy-Lieutenant for Middlesex, by the Marquis of Salisbury. Colonel Sir Joseph Thackwell, K.C.B. and K. IL, 3d, King's own Light Dragoons, on his nomination to be Knight Commander of the Bath, and return from India, by Lieut.- General Lord Charles Manners. Captain Oliver, Royal Horse Guards, on promotion, by the Marquis of Anglesey. Major Lucas and Mr. A. G. Roberts, by the Duke of Buck ingham. Mr. Head and Mr. Frederick Garnett, by Sir F. Head. Ensigns Newmarch and J. Crofton, by Sir F. Smith. Mr. Gaussen and Mr. Frederick Gausaen, by the Earl of Enniskillen. tieutenant Hotham, by Lord Iloiharn. Lieutenants G. A. Young and W. T. Granville, by Sir H. Bayley. Lieut.-Colonel Clarke and Lieutenant B. Walshe, by Sir T Arbuthnot. Lieutenants W. L. Meason and G. B. Jennings, by Sir W. Eustace. Captain F. A. Wetherall and Lieut. A. Aitken, by the Fey. J. Anderson. Messrs. W. H. Gibson and C. R. Gibson, by Col. Douglas. Captain De Butts and Lieutenant De utts, by their father, Sir A. De Butts. Mal or T. T. Pears, on being appointed C.B. ; Captain J. L. Barrow and Lieut. R. R. Litle, on their return from. China, by Lord Saltoun. Capt. H. B. Dickinson, Lieut. W. Bridges, and Ensign T. Pakenham, on their appointments. by Sir H. Pakenham. Lieutenants Rodney, Holliday, and Lennox, on their promo - lion, by Lord G. Lennox. Col. H. P. Burn, and Major A. Roberts, on their return • from India, and Captain G. F. Simpson, by Lord Ellen borough. Col. Priaulx, on appointment as A.D.C. for the Guernsey Militia ; Capt. C. Mackenzie, on return from India, and Professor A. Koelliker, by Sir J. Graham. Captains Jenkins and 11. Jackson, and Lieut. F. Grantham, on return from China, by Col. Weare. :Messrs. Woodcock and Coleman, Aldermen of Norwich, by Lord Douro. Messrs. T. Galton and Spooner, M.P., and Rev. J. Spooner, _ . by Lord Lyttelton. . Mr. E. Thornton, on appointment to the Mexican Mission; Mr. E. Porter and Capt. B. Gordon, on his appointment, by Lord Aberdeen. Lieut.-Col. Ord on promotion, Captains Sandham on appoint, ment, Tireman, F. Mein on promotion, Neville, Lieutenants Thompson on returu from foreign service, Robinson on pro motion, and Mr. J. Little, by Sir G. Murray. Messrs. J. Fraser, A. M. Sutherland, and Acworth, on their return from India: Colonel J. Holborn, Lieut.-Colonel Capon, Major Sotheby, Captain G. A. Tulloch, and G. Anderson, on their return from India; Captain Sir Robert Oliver, R.N., on receiving the honour of Knighthood, and return from India ; Lieutenants A. J. Cattle, N. C. Macleod, J. S. Kembull, J. M. Montagne, and Ensign E. Elderton, on their return from India, by Lord Ripon. Messrs. W. Gray and Egerton, Lieut.-General Sir F. Adam, on return from abroad ; Major-Generals Nicol, Sir H. King, Sir H. Pakenham, and Bell, on their appointments; Lieut.- Colonel Lord W. Poulet, on return from Canada ; Captain Langshavr, and Lieut. De Honey, on his appointment, by the Duke of Wellington. Admiral Sir J. West.snking, appointed Commander-in-Chief at Plymouth ; Commanders Claxton, E. Crouch, Dyke, and Robert Mann, W. Kendall, E. S. Sotheby ' and C. J. Feather stone, on their promotion ; Captains M. Dixon, on his ap pointment ; H. Seymour, on promotion ; Sotheby, Lieuts, J. Tottenham on promotion, and return from Africa, and Hasken, by Lord Haddington. The following noblemen and gentlemen had the honour of pre eating addresses and petitions to her Majesty : The Earl of Powis—From the clergy and laity of Manches, ter, in the county of Lancashire, " entreating her Majesty to consider that the immediate consequences of this measure has already been to deprive Manchester of a bishop during the last ten years,_ and its future effects must be to inflict the same in jury on North Wales for ever." From the dean and chapter, the archdeacons, the rural deans, and the clergy of the diocese of St. Asaph, with 175 signatures, in the district of North Wales. From the archdeacon and clergy of the archdeaconry of Shropshire, in the diocese of Lichfield, in the county of Shropshire. From • the clergy of the archdeaconry of Exeter, in the county of Devon. From the rural dean and clergy of the deanery of Dyffryn Cluyd, in the diocese of Bangor and county of Denbigh. , From the rural dean and clergy of the rural deanery of Pontesbury, in the diocese of Hereford and county of Salop. From the rural dean and clergy of the deanery of Ludlow, n the diocese of Hereford and county of Salop. Prom the clergy and deanery of Cirencester, in the diocese of Gloucester and Bristol and county of Gloucester. From the clergy of the rural deanery of Woodleigh, is tho t archdeaconry of Totnes and diocese of Exeter. From the rural dean and clergy of the rural deanery of Arllechwedd, in the county of Bangor. From the clergy of the deanery of Dursley. From the rural dean and clergy of the western portion of the deanery of Pontesbury, in the diocese of Hereford. From natives of Wales, resident in London. From the grand,jury of the county of Montgomery. From the inhabitants of the parish of West Felton, in the county of Salop. From the inhabitants of the parish of Ellesmere, in the county of Salop. From the inhabitants of the parish of Great Ness, in the county of Salop. From the inhabitants of the township of Dudleston in the parish of Ellesmere and county of Salop. From the inhabitants of the parish of Ruyton in the Eleven Towns, in the county of Salop. From the inhabitants of the parish of Badger, in the county of Salop. From the rector, churchwardens, and inhabitants of the parish of Llanghanfal, in the diocese of Bangor, and county of Denbigh. From the rector, churchwarden, and inhabitants of the parish of Hampton Bishop, in the county of Hereford. From the minister and inhabitants of the parish of St. Chad, Shrewsbury. From the inhabitants of the parish of Shiffnal, in the county of Salop. From the rector, the churchwardens, and the parishioners of the parish of Derwen, in the diocese of Bangor, and county of Denbigh. From the churchwardens and inhabitants of the parish of Llambedr, in the county of Denbigh. From the rector, the curate, the churchwardens, and pa rishioners of the parish of Llanelidan, in the diocese of Bangor, and county of Denbigh. From the inhabitants of the parish of Henllan, county of Denbigh, and diocese of St. Asapb. From the inhabitants of the city of Chester. From the mayor, aldermen, councillors, and inhabitants of the borough of Ruthin. From the vicar, curates, churchwardens, and inhabitants of the parish of Llanfair, Dyffryn, Clwyd, iu the diocese of Bangor. From the rector, churchwardens, and inhabitants of the parish of Efenechtyd, in the county of Denbigh. From the rector , the curate, the churchwardens, and inhabi tants of the parish of Clocaenog, in the county of Denbigb.l From the vicar, the curate, churchwardens, and other in habitants of the united parishes of Llanywya and Gyffylling in the county of Denbigh. From the rector, churchwardens, and inhabitants of the parish of Llangwyfan, D. C., in the county of Denbigh. From the curate, the churchwardens, and inhabita n t s o f the parish of Llandyrrog , in the diocese of Bangor. Praying her Majesty's sanction that so much of the Act of the 6th and 7th William IV, which relates to the union of the sees of St: Asaph and Bangor may be repealed, and that Parliament may be enabled to take such me asures as ma y be deemed expedient to preserve unimpaired the constitution of the Church in North Wales. Bishop of Bangor, from the dean and chapter of Bangor, the clergy of the county of Anglesey, the clergy of the deanery of Llyn, the inhabitants of Lanthalader, praying her Majesty to be graciously pleased, in the exercise of her royal prerogative ? to signify her consent to the progress of such measures as may be submitted to Parliament for re p ealin g so much of the Act 6 and 7 Wm. IV., c. 77, as provides for the union of the sees of St. Asaph and Bangor. Bishop of Hereford, with an address against the union of tl4 sees of Bangor and St. Asaph. • Mr. Charles Wynne, Sheriff for the county of Denbigh, accompanied by Ma. Mainwaring, M.P., with a county address, praying that her Majesty will be graciously pleased to allow a Bill to be brought into Parliament for the repeal of an Act that united the sees of St. Asaph and Bangor. Mr. Mainwaring, M.P., presented two addresses with similar " prayers from the grand jurors assembled at the Spring Assizes, 1845, and at the quarter sessions in March, 1845. Mr. Wynne was presented by the Hon. William Begot. Mr. Marsh, Deputy Mayor of Great Yarmouth, with an - address of congratulation to her Majesty on the birth of the Prince Alfred. Mr. Marsh was presented by Mr. Will . shire, M.P. Mr. John Betts, Sheriff of the City of Norwich, accom panied by Mr. Henry Woodcock and Mr. George Lorick Cole.: - man, Aldermen, of congratulation on the birth of another Prince, from the Mayor, Aldermen , and Burgesses of No rwich. Mr. Betts was presented by the Marquis of Douro. • After the Levee, her Majesty and Prince Albert, attended by the royal suite, returned to Buckingham Palace. Her Royal Highness the Duchess of Kent had a dinner party yesterday at her residence Clarence House, St. James's. The company consisted of their Royal Highnesses the Duke and Diachess of Cambridge, their Royal Highnesses the Here ditary Grand Duke and Grand Duchess of Mecklenburgh- Strelitz, his Serene Highness Prince Ernest of Hesse Philipp , etahl, his Serene Highness Prince Edward of Saxe Weimar ' Mons. Dedel, the N et h erlands Minister ; Count Kielmann segge, the Hanoverian Minister • the Delawarr, the Earl and Duke and Duchess of Buccleuch, the Earl and Countess Countess of Jersey, th e Earl and Countess ss the of E D lu s e lh rr o y usi i e n , Baron d'Arnini, Lard a n d Lady Beauv Waiting to the Duke of Cambridge, Lady A nna e Maria Dawson, the Countess Wratislaw, and Colonel Sir Her Royal Highness the Du c h ess o f Kent Ge orge Coupes art ds evening party. Her Majesty .rid Princ e Albert (attended by the Royal Suite), and the Royal Family, were The following Concert was p er f orme d at present. House, during the evening, in the presence of the Illustrious Circle Fantasia, Pianoforte, Madame Dulcken—Thalberg, Aria, Neapolitana—Signor Laislache. Aria, " L'amor sun mi f e beats," (Roberto Devereux) Madame Grisi—Donizetti. Adelaida, Signor Mario—Beethoven. A r i a , ." Si lo sento," (Fausto), Miss Birch— Spohr. Quartuor, " Ecco quel fiero istante " _ Mesdam es G r i s i ei Birch, Signori Mario t Lablache—Costa. Duo. "to carrel," Madame Grisi et Signor Lablaehe— Mercadante. Lieder Ohnd Worte Tarantella, Pianoforte, Madame Dulcken —Mendelssohn, Chioppen. Preghiera, "'Ave Maria, " Signor Mario—Schubert. Aria, (Manon Lescant) Miss Birch—Balfe. Duo, "Un tenero cuore," (Roberto Devereux), Madame Grisi et Signor Mario—Donizetti. Preghiera, " Dall tuo stelato soglis, (Mosi), Mesdames Grisi - et Birch, Signori Mario et Lablache.—Rossini. CAUTION.—A man of the name of Robert Ward (or at least calling himself so) is travelling about Suffolk with a petition, stating that ho has lost two horses by death, and begging the contributions of the benevolent in order that he may be enabled to replace them. A number of signatures were attached to the one he showed at Ipswich; some of them have proved to be forgeries, and we warn the public against such an impostor. Should any of our readers happen of him, we should re commend them to put a label on his back and direct him to the police, at Ipswich, at whose hands he would be o-ure to get some cheap faro and loding.—lpswich igaptuai SUN OFFICE, Seven o'clock. IXCHEQUER.-(THIS DAY.) TRIAL AT BAR.-THE GREAT DISTILLERY CASE THE ATTORNEY-GENERAL V. GEORGE SMITH. (Continued from our Afternoon Edition.) After an absence of four hours, the jury returned, and their names having been called over, the first witness called was Robert Button, sworn and examined by the SOLICITOR GENERAL—I am a supervisor of Excise, and I was, on the 6th July, 1843, appointed to survey the distillery of Mr. Smith. I was not ordered to survey the rectifying-house. I was on the 18th August ordered to assist Mr. Drinkwater in taking the drip of the receiver. There was a difference of I.loth, or equal to 14 gallons of proof spirits. I also ex amined the cover of the spirit receiver. I had been simi larly experieneed for five years; and I found that the pro duce of the wash in Mr. Smith's distillery was less than in other distilleries. I was on duty on 15th Oct., 1843, on his premises. I examined the liquor pumps which were placed near the feints receiver. I saw the suction-pipe of one of the pumps- laid in the direc tion of the sewer. I took three or four samples of the wash that had been distilled about the time I noticed this. I re• member the morning of the 13th December, 1843. I went to the spirit receiver on that occasion. I had a lamp with me, and I went to the cover of the spirit receiver. I observed boards round the suction pipe; one of the boards was fastened with two nails, but I removed it. I found a hole. The hole was not there when I first examined the place on the 18th of August. I found the men about the premises then, and one of t hem followed me into the street. I gave information of what I had seen to Mr. Drinkwater, and he and I examined it at ten o'clock on the same morning. From two o'clock, when I saw the hole for the first time, till ten, I had been strictly watching it. The boards were in the same state at ten, and they were removed in Mr. Drinkwater's presence. There was a charge taken of the spirits on that night, and there was an excess of stock of twenty-eight gallons and a fraction. The excess was seized by Mr. Drinkwater. The nails were new that joined the moveable board. The hole in the top of the spirit receiver had the appearance of being newly cut. The spirit is pumped from the receiver into the vat by a suction pipe. The suction pipe always remains in the spirit receiver. The covering board is fastened on with white lead. The pumps are locked by the Excise. The hole appeared to be partly cut with a saw and partly by a gouge. There was no white lead round the hole that had been newly cut. The dimensions of that hole were seven inches by two inches and five-tenths. The spirit store is immediately above that part of the receiver where the hole was discovered. A suction pipe could be in troduced from the spirit store to the hole in the receiver, Stock is taken in the store ; it generally takes place once a fort night, but sometimes once a week. The spirit warehouse is generally kept locked by the distiller himself. I never found an increase in the stock, with that single exception. I recollect Mr. Drinkwater telling Mr. George Smith of the hole he had discovered in the spirit receiver. Mr. Smith replied it was the greatest piece of intelligence he had ever heard of. Ile also took a letter from his pocket, saying that he had received an anony mous letter, which informed him that his men had been rub bing him. Ido not remember his saying anything more. I pointed out the hole to Mr. Gill, the foreman, V. ho was pre sent with Mr. Smith. Mr. Smith remarked that the pails had been rusted off. Mr. Gill remarked that the spirits might have floated and wrenched •the boards off. It would require a great deal of water to float the spirit receiver. I was on duty there a considerable time, and I never knew of the spirit receiver floating. If it had done so, I must have known it. The dipping-rod is fixed in a socket, and always at the same point. If, therefore, the receiver had floated, it must have thrown the rod out of its place. I watched the distillery, assisted by two officers of the Excise, named Wallace and Dibble. It was during the seventh distilling period, commencing the 7th January, 1844, and ending on the 15th of the same month, I found an increase over the produce of the former periods of 981 gallons. Mr. KELLY thought that as these particulars were of a complicated nature it would be better for Drinkwater to enter upon the whole of that evidence. Examination of witness continued—The watch was only partial, by examining the premises. I did not watch during the eighth distilling period, but I received orders to watch strictly during the ninth distilling period. I was as sisted by the same officers, and by one or two others. I also with them watched the tenth period. During the eighth period there was a deficiency. On the 9th and 10th there was an excess greater than upon the 7th period. On the 7th of March, 1844, I took charge of the premises in the absence of Mr. Drinkwater. There were recurring disputes on every charge about the dip of the receiver. I took the drip, and I found two- tenths incor rect upon the drip, or twenty-nine gallons gained on every charge. I found the valves in the pump of the spirit receiver loose, and water could be let through. Before I took the drip the Surveyor-General had ordered a lock to be put upon the suction .pipe. . Mr. Smith was not present when I found the increase upon the drip. He was present when the dip was taken ; on that occasion there was an increase in the dip. Mr. Smith remarked that it had occurred from the water falling back through the pump. The pump was afterwards unscrewed and examined. One of the valves was deficient altogether. I went afterwards on the 15th of June and examined the top of the spirit receiver with a lamp. I discovered there another hole which I had not seen before. It was stopped with a wooden plug. It appeared fresh as if recently aut. The hole was circular, and about 1% inch in diameter. It did not arise from a knot in the wood. I am positive the hole was not there on my last examination. When I discovered the hole I tried it with a dipping-rod, and it would not go in. It could not, therefore, be an old dipping bole. The dipping holes are generally square, not circular. I had not charge of the rectifying premises till the 7th March, 1844. The stock there is taken once in six weeks. The strength of the sweetening spirit is declared by the trade. The recti fying house is not open at night. On the 14th of October I went with Cameron, Franklin, and Drinkwater to the rectifying premises. I observed some water running into the still-heads, and some questions were put to Mr. Whitehead on the subject. I went round to the dis tillery, and turned the cocks of the liquor vats. I cut off the stock-cock. I turned on water again, and went back to the rectifying house. I fou n d there Cameron and Mr. James Scott Smith in conversation. The water was then running on the still leads. I returned with Franklin to the distillery, and showed him how I had turned the water off. On the succeeding day I was at the distillery with the same person. I saw Mr. George Smith. Mr. Cameron asked if there was any connexion between the distillery and the rectifying house except the open trough ? Mr. Smith said "Do you wish to catch me, Mr. Cameron, I scorn such ways." Mr. Cameron then said " I don't wish to . catch you, but I dare say your brother told you about the water-pipe yesterday." Mr. Smith then said that there was a water pipe to his house and to the gallery over the way, as well as to every house in the parish. On the 17th Oct. the surveying general examiners attended on the premises, and on that day men were employed to raise the ground. I traced the pipes from the distillery to the rectifying house. In the pipe going across the street there is a stop-cock, which can cut off the connexion. There was a box upon it, bearing the initials of the East London Water-Works. I saw the pipe uncovered towards the granaries. There was no communication between the pipe and the company's main. There was no other com munication, excepting with the pipe which led from the tanks in the distillery. I was not aware of this communi cation between the distillerp and the rectifying house until the ground was opened. the pipes were not in the entries returned by Mr. Smith. On the 22d October I was made to pass spirits between the distillery and the rectifying house. The largest store vat in the distillery is No. 8, and the pipe which runs along the top supplies the vats from the spirit receiver. There is a sink opposite No. 8 vat. I assisted in stopping the communications to the branches along the pipe. The first experiment was by placing a small tub of water above the sink, and that was acted on by means of a syphon, which reduced the water immediately. It was then proposed to substitute water for spirits, and a connexion was effected between No. 8 vat and the pipe over the sink. There was a screwed cock on the pipe at the sink, and another on the pipe at the vat. The quantity of spirits in the vat was ascertained to be 7,399 gallons in bulk, 13-4 per cent. above proof,which would give 8,390 ands fraction proof spirits. In the court e of the evening I went round to the rectifying premises, and on receiving information from Mr. Drinkwater, that all was ready, I took the dip of No. 17 vat, and found it in bulk 67 9-10 gallons above proof. The cock was turned by Drinkwater. Water run for ten minutes, and then spirits commenced to run, weak at first, but at last they ran 11 per cent. overproof. Mr. Cartwright caught samples, and handed them to us. The first dip I took after the spirit had ceased running was 27 inches. The whole quantity run was 700 gallons of proof spirits. It took us about an hour to run that quantity. Rectifiers use water, or, as it is terme(A, spirit, for reducing their liquors. We afterwards run water through the pipe until it no longer tasted of spirits. Five minutes would be sufficient to do away with all taste of spirits. The witness was about to be cross-examined by Mr. Fitzroy Kelly, when The LORD CHIEF BARON said it was time the case should be adjourned until to-morrow. The Court then rose about five o'clock. RAILWAY COMMITTEES (THIS DAY.) . THE BELFAST AND BALLYMENA RAILWAY. (Continued from our Afternoon Edition ) The room was then cleared, and upon our re-admission, Ths CHAIR.HAN said the Committee having deliberated upon the points of the arguments regarding the clause, they considered that the corporation of Belfast were entitled to some security for the protection of their dues. The parties of course would understand that the Committee did not agree to the insertion of the clause, but they were in favour of the principle. They hoped the parties would mutually agree on such a clause, which, while it would confer no fresh powers upon the corporation, would secure therm against parties evading the harbour dues. Mr. ALEXANDER thought such a clause would be ex tremely difficult to frame. There were several persons now entitled to land goods, millers and others, below the limits of the port, and how those persons were to be protected he was at a loss to know. Mr. GREGG said the difficulty would be overcome by a point being fixed, say two miles from the port ; at all events, those now entitled to land goods would not be disturbed in their privileges. The other clauses were then agreed to, and the Committee adjourned the f ur th er heating on the corporation protection clause till twelve o'clock to-morrow. The Committee rose at three o'clock. • Committee, Group T. (Continued from our Afternoon Edition.) Mr. Barton, who was employed to take the traffic across the bridge, was next called—lie was engaged for two weeks. The following was the result for the first week, being from March 24 to March 29, the time being from seven o'clock in the morning till seven o'clock in the evening: —For the week, foot-passengers, 25,730 ; two-horse carriages, 116 ; one-horse carriages, 776 ; men on horseback, 612 ; passengers in carriages, 1,690 ; carts and waggons, 560 ; horses in waggons, 914 ; horses, 216 ; oxen, 52 ; sheep, 1,687. The foot passengers that passed on the Tuesday were 3,485 ; and on Friday, the market day, 6,782. On a fair day, April the 10th, the foot passengers were 7,747 ; sheep, 4,282 oxen, 401 _ _ Mr Jackson, surgeon accoucheur, followed, but nothing of material importance was elicited in his evidence. Mr. Hopkinson, surgeon, and Mayor of Stamford, ex amined—lie thought that the railway crossing the street would have the effect of driving many parties from the town, esp( cially those who lived in the St. Martin's suburb, which the line cut off from the main part of the town of Stamford. Mr. Haycock, a resident of Stamford, said there were six fairs and live cattle markets annually held in the town. Two of the faire lasted two days, the others 0110 day each. MAYNOOTH. Lord BROUGHAM in presenting a petition agains, the grant to Meynooth, took the o pportunity of contra dicting aspositively as words could do, the statement which had been made in the other House of Parliament, that an attack which had appeared in one of the French papers was written by one of the Ministers of France. That statement had given great pain to the individuals to whom it referred, and he was requested to give the rumour the most unqualified contradiction. The Earl of CLANCARTY complained that he had asked the question, to which he had received no answer. The object of that question was to ascertain how her Majesty's Ministers could ;reconcile this grant to May nooth with the terms of the oath of supremacy. Lord MONTEAGLE said, that he conceived that not withstanding what had been said of the oath of supre• macy and the Act of Settlement, he thought that he would he a person of extraordinary ingenuity Ilho could discover within the four corners of the oath of supremacy, anything which at all forbid the grant to Maynooth, though perhaps the Noble Earl's ingenuity was equal to the task. The Earl of CLANCARTY complained that the Noble Lord had attacked him ungener o. usly , and stated that the object of the Bill in 1795 was to provide education for the Roman Catho lics of Ireland, and he conceived that this additonal grant would only tend to increase the spirit of insubordination, which had been encouraged, if it had not been altogther elicited, by the proceedings at Maynooth. Lord BEAUMONT said the Noble Earl had dis played the rnost deplorable ignorance of the Catholic religion if he conceived that one tecet of that religion had been altered. Th e o bject of the gran t in 1795 had been to furnish educati on for the noraan Catholics of Ireland. The people of lrela nd were dependent upon their priest s f or their educatio n, and the object of this grant was t o i m prove the education of the priests, reasons which and consequently o f th e people. The v er y justified the Bill of 1795 justified also the grant of this year, Bet if the Noble Earl wished to make any state ment, a Noble Duke would present a petition to. morrow, and then, in accordance withthe custom of the House, he might enter into a discussion of the p rinciple. RA ILWAYS. Lord BROUGHAM presented a peti tion from seve ral persons in Manchester, Nottingham , and other places, largely interested in railways, c om p laining that their property had been most material l y in j ured by the alterations made in the mode of management by the Directors, and he would take that opportunity of stating that he entirely differed from the petitioners, for he thought if they chose to risk their money in these EVENING, APRIL-1'24, speculations, they should not complain if their trust was abused. CLEFT SITTING.) HOUSE OF COMMONS. The SPEAKER took the Chair at Four o'clock. The Spelsey Road Bill was read a third time and passed. Mr. GROGAN presented a petition from a company interested in the Grand Canal Railway complaining of the standing orders of the Portarlington line. On the motion of Colonel T. WOOD, the London Orphan Asylum Bill was read a third time and passed. LIVERPOOL DOCKS BILL. On the order of the day being read for the third read ing of the Liverpool Docks Bill, Mr. ESCOTT moved the omission of the following clause :—" And whereas doubts have been entertained whether the powers and remedies given to the trust( es for recovering and enforcing payment of the rates and ' duties payable to them under and by virtue of the said recited Acts, are applicable to the recovery of the rates and duties payable by vessels entering the said port and not using the docks of the trustees ; and it is expedh nt that such doubts should be removed ; be it enacted, that if the master of any vessel entering the said pert, and not using the docks of the said trustees, shall refuse or neglect to pay to the said trustees the rates payable in in respect of such vessels, it shall be lawful for any justice of the peace of the counties of Lancaster or Chester, as the ease may require, upon complaint in writing made before him by the person authorised to de mand or receive the said rates, that he had demanded the same from the said master, and that the same were due and unpais , to issue his warrant to take and distrain such • vessel, her tackle, apparel, and furniture, or any part thereof, and to detain such distress until suc h rats shall have been paid ; and in case any of the said rates shall remain unpaid for the space of three days next after any distress so made, it shall be lawful for such persan to cause such distress to be appraised by two or more 1 sworn appraisers, and afterwards to sell the distress and therewith to satisfy the rates so unpaid, and all the ex penses of keeping, appraising, and selling such dirt: ess, rendering the overplus (if any) to the said mas ter upon demand ; and if any dispute shall arise as to the amount of such rates, or of the charges occasioned by such distress, it shall be lawful for the person distraining to detain such distress until the amount of such rates and the charges of such distress shall be ascertained and determined by such justice upon application made to him for that purpose. —lt was re furred to the standing orders of the Committee. Sir Augustus Clifford appeared at the Bar, ard sum moned the House to the House of Peers to hear the Royal Assent given to several Bills (for which see Lords' report). NOTICES OF MOTIONS—AUSTRALIAN FLOUR Mr. I-lUTT gave notice that he would. on this day fortnight, move a rcF•olution to the effect that it was ex pedient to admit wheat flour free in this country from Australia on the same terms a it was admitted from Canada. TOBACCO—ADJOURNMENT OF THE HOUSE FOR THE WHITSUN HOLIDAYS. Mr. BLLWITT sail that he had a motion for to-night, for a Bill to repeal the Act which prevented the growth of tobacco in this country ; but, before he postponed it, he NA ished to know from the Right Hon. Gentleman at the head of the Government whether he had made any arrangement for the adjournment of the House for the Whit::.un holidays ?—( Laugh ter.) Sir R. PEEL said he was sorry to say he had not considered the subject; but, speaking upon the memcnt, he did not think. considering the state of the public business that he could allow a longer time than from Friday to Wednesday or ThursOay. [LEFT SITTING.] LAUNCHING OF HER MAJESTY'S FRIGATE ALARM 26 GUNS, AND THE LADY PETRIE EAST INDlAMAN.—Yesterday there were two splendid launches on the river Thames, one at the Royal Dockyard, at Sheerness, namely, that of the frigate Alarm, 26 f 11115; and the other, a large Indiaman, named the Lady Petrie, at Limehouse. The Alarm was christened by Miss Arthur, the daughter of the captain sui,erintendent of the dock, in the presence of a very large muster of navel and military efficers and a vast con. course of civilians. The weather was beautiful in the extreme, and when the frigate was loosed from the slip the scene was of the most animating description, the several vessels of war in the harbour being gaily decorated with flags. Her dimensions are cor rectly described as follows :—Length between the perpendicu. tars, 131 feet; length of the keel per tonnage, 106 feet incl. ; extreme breadth, 40 feet 6 inches ; burden in tons, 911 12 A 4. She was originally intended to have been launched on the Sth instant, and named by one of the daughters of the late Admiral White, but owing to the sudden demise of that lamented officer, it was postponed. She will be forthwith taken into dry dock, and it is expected will be immediately put in commission. The launch of the Lady Petrie, Indiaman, which is upwards of 600 tons burthen, took place at half-past two o'clock, from the yard of Messrs. Cur ling and Young, at Limehouse. She is the property of Mr. J. Somes, M.P., the extensive shipowner. Lady Petrie officiated in naming the vessel after herself, and as the noble craft glided into old Father Thames, the bands of the Grenadier Guards and the Royal Thames Yacht Club struck up the national anthem. The company then partook of a sumptuous repast provided by the spi riled owner. The Chpneellor of the Exchequer received 9 depu tation from the Irish banks yesterd :y morning, at which, as is reported, the gentlemen who attended received an assurance that the small note currency is not to be abolished. This agreed with what occurred at the Forfarshire meeting of Scotch banks, but there can be little doubt but that the issue of small notes, if it does continue, will be placed under very stringent regulations. EAST INDIA HOUSE.-- Yesterday a Court if Direc tors was held at the East India House, when Henry Dickinson, Esq., was appointed a provisional councillor for Madras, on the vacancy occasioned by the decease of John Dent, Esq. • ESTMINSTER 6C:1001. ANNIVERSARY. — The an nual dinner of the gentlemen educated on this foundation took place yesterday, at the Thatched House Tavern, St. James's street. IMPERIAL PARLIAMENT. HOUSE OF C051,110.N5, April 23. MAYNOOTH-APPROPIZIATION OF THE IRISH ECCLESIASTICAL REVENUES. Mr. WARD (in con intuition from our Third Edi Lion of last night) proceeded to say—Why the ar guments in the pamphlet must be as distasteful to the Hon. Member for Elgin (Mr. C. Bruce) as to the Catholics of Ireland. It went to prove that there was but one true church, and that church was the Protestant Church. Really, if:that argument were to pass current in that House, he (Mr. Ward) could only say that Mr. Percival's ghost, which the Hon. Member for Shrews bury had invoked, was a much more formidable person. age than Mr. Percival himself. In 1807 Mr. Percival had said that it was vain to expect an established church to stand, if the principles upon which that establish. ment rested were cut from under it. But in the very same extract Mr. Percival was represented to admit that the " sad and anomalous" state of Ireland gave rise to very grave considerations.—(Hear.) And the author of the pamphlet went on to quote from the notes of his father, in which he admitted that, although he con sidered numbers gave no right to education at the ex pense of the State, policy might. (The Hon. Member quoted the notes at some length on this point.) Now, he asked, what was the position of affairs after the lapse of forty years? Catholic Emancipation had been granted, and did not every one who was opposed to his (Mr. Ward's) views feel convinced that what they refused long ago would have satisfied them, and that moderate concessions would have prevented them from hearing what they now called exorbitant demands? The Noble Lord the Member for Dorsetshire had made the most statesmanlike speech of any one on his side of the House, and it was remarkable for nothing so much as for the largeness of its admissions. The Noble Lord said the measure was great fir good or for evil, and that if it were pasted into a law it would at some future time be subject to reconstruction. The adoption then of his (Mr. Ward's) motion would prevent that future recon struction which the Noble Lord dreaded, for it would give them an opportunity of dealing with the Established Church of Ireland which there had not been for forty years; and he appealed to those who had for forty years filled the seats of the Government in that House whether they had m t felt the Established Church of Ireland hanging like a mill-store round their necks. (The Hon. Member then proceeded to read passages from the pamphlet, which referred to the strong expression of feeling which had reached the House fi one out cf doors.) Were those feelings out of doors worthy of the respect of that 1-louse? The Hon. Baronet opposite, the Member for the University of Oxford (Sir R. Inglis) told them the other night that there was not a harsh word con tained in the petitions presented to that House ; that there was not a word in them which could not be justi fied from the Homilies, Liturgies, and Articles of the Church of England. He did not think that was a very wise admission ; but if it were the fact, it could only be because the Liturgy of the Church of England contained terms so harsh, that the greatest dealer in vituperation Might be satisfied with them. His Hon. Friend the Member for Finsbury (Mr. T. Duncombe) had asked whether they . were not prepared to show due deference to those petitioners tinder hose petitions the table of that House groaned. The Hon. Gentleman was right in one thing—he was right in defending the clergy of the three denominations, as they were called, fir they were the persons whose views were the soundest, and whose language had been the most moderate. But was that the case with other petitioners ? In a petition presented by the Noble Lord the Member for Liver pool, the petitioners stated that this measure was emi nently calculated to bring down the judgment of God on a Protestant country. There was a petition from Whitby which made use of the harshest terms with re gard to Maynooth, which they considered was especially detrimental to the people of Ireland. There was also a petition from Lancaster, presented by the Chairman of their Committees (Mr. Greene), which stated that no concessions which could be made would satisfy the Roman Catholics of Ireland. There was also a petition presented by the Hoe. Member tJr Kent, which stated that the doctrines of the Church of Rome were unsocial, unchristian, and idolatrous, and inconsistent, and irre concilable with the genuine doctrines of the Gospel. There was also a petition from Elfin which he pre sented himself, and which stated that the petitioners re garded as high treason against heaven, to apply the revenues of a Protestant country to the education of a Popish priesthood.—(hear, hear.) Now, be would ask, in what other country in the world would it be possible to find one half of the population of a country applying such language to the other half, because they were of a different opinion? If they saw such divisions elsewhere, should they not at once conclude that they could have but the same result which it was seen they had in Switzerland. Ile could only say, if the un charitable language he had quoted, came recommended by the sanction of the liturgy, the homilies, and the ar ticles of the Protestant Church, that Church was anything but a blessing to the country over which it ruled.—(Loud cries of " Hear, hear.") He would give his Hon. Friend the Member for Dun garvon some specimens of the sort of eloquence, and of some of the notions which were most rife at these meet ings, and for these they must go to the Evangelical clergymen, and not to the Dissenters, for the peculiar expressions by which the feelings of the party were evinced. At these saturnalia—for he could call them nothing else—an lion. Member of that House had re ferred to arr. M'Neile, of Liverpool, as a highly respect able sample of Christian clergymen ; and yet Mr. M'Neile, in a speech the other day to the Operative Conservatives of that town, had stated that if they sanc tioned the additional grant to Maynooth, they might as well found a college for theft or adultery, and in his opinion the difference between the ministers of the Roman Catholic Church and the Jesuits was nothing more or less than the difference between a highwayman and a pickpocket. And yet the Right Hon. Gentleman the Member for Perthshire (Mr. F. Maule) had moved the thanks of the meeting last night at Exeter Hall. lie had been too wise to hamper him self with any resolution which involved a principle, yet, by giving his silent assent to those which had been passed, he had become a party to all which had trans pired. At that meeting, it had been unblushingly stated that this grant to Maynooth was only putting an additional weapon into the hands of the Popish priests, and they objected to it under the supposition, as they stated, that the increase of knowledge would only tend to made bad men worse.—(Great lau;hter.) The mi nister of St. Mary's Chapel, Reading, had stated that either Sir Robert Peel had never read his Bible, or if he had read it, he did not understand it ; or if he bad un derstood it, he did not believe it.—(Laughter.) Such were some of the statements by which these Hon. Gen tlemen were in the habit of expressing their opinions on their Christian fellow-subjects. At a meeting the other day at Hertford, which had been attended by the Rev. Mr. Bickerstaff, Mr. Trolling, and others, Mr. Bicker staff had not been ashamed to assert the exploded doc trine that Roman Catholics kept no faith with heretics, and stated that there was nothing which in any way justified this fraternization with the Roman Catholics in God's word. Ile did not hesitate to compare this fifty years' grant to the College of Maynooth to Herod's oath, and as that oath led to murder, and there was a prior command in the Scriptures which prohibited mur der, so he should say that it' there was a contract with Maynooth, that contract ought to be broken inasmuch as the principles taught were equally prohibited by the same authority. At that meeting it had been stated that Sir Robert Peel had been met by a beguiling harlot, who, with her soft words and smooth speeches, had forced him to abandon all his principles—(Laughter)—and abide in as tabernacles of sby the pr sentiments phil ee (f m ) f a oe ne ul ts— . b such elnand a t t a tsho s etd b she y eensocu—n persons languagecseenatas false, these—sentiments such aelns endea voured e s tabl e detestable, language and wh bl ic a h m to excite hostility and continued dissensions. And yet it was at this very meeting that a Member of that House took the chair.—(Hear.) A Member whose private character was in the highest degree **Ole, but who, like others who were Members ---- of that House, refrained from expressing their op &In; where they were to be met and refuted, but who, if ill e c did not themselves speak at these meetings, gave a sanction, which, front men of high standing, was of gre° Irnp6rtance, by not expressing their dissent ; and thus attempt was made to excite ill feeling, and undo all the good that Lad been effected in the public mind. BY PI grant of the last fifty years to Maynooth, mcn of tall had lent themselves to it. Persons cf character In° the most ekaggerated statements when heated by 1 0 , 14 , 1 disputes. lie would read fur the House the speech ur !`"" Hon. Member for Newcastle-under-Lyne, eppositroo to the Bill. In that House the Hon. Member wad' ) o f speech, certainly opposcd to the grant, but so. lukewarm, mild, and inoffensive a charactrr, s . ort that one would be inclined to ioubt the I°‘ verity of his dissent, but that Honourable Mean delivered a speech at Exeter-hall which was calculate, to arouse and excite the feelings of the entire P O P ° ! —that speech Iva% printed by the Anti-Maynooth Ass,l elation, and published in a pamphlet of Mr. Lord's, filla in the Churchman's Monthin Review—and which 13 ,a been commented upon and einoted as a text of in fallible authority. If the poor people out of doors knew fior d Mcinben; as %veil as they knew one another they v)„l3a4 not put so much trust in them.—(Hear, hear.) mthe allowance ought to be made for the period, 11 04 ,4$ m atospLere in which these speeches were delive red; the speech was made in 1636; it was publishe d in t Chris chman's Review Mr. Ci )I.QUIIOUN—It was not published by toe• Nlr. WARD—That may be. That speech ws' Ptr, fished by Mr. Lord, and contained the grossest per won of facts regarding Ire!and that he had ever per°';os It stated that at the moment when illaynooth fe!unded, and when Dr. Reilly and Dr. Troy were •ileg he tinting with Mr. Pitt on that subject, they were in nth closest connexion with Wolfe Tone, and labouring °I! 0 him to revolutionise Ire bend, and to sever the con tad between Ireland and England. It further stn ea that the Roman Catholic bishops had never it°lo3o loyally except when they were engaged in s° o s treacherous design—some secret treason which w s s I t / he ripe for execution. There was no question as to reception which ought to be given to a prop,;sition s" °h is testalle. It ought to he met with the scorn willl merited—every lover of his countr—every person cP . :; ing the name of patriot, he would lay down his li fe thous Mr. and lives if he N— had them-- d of COLQUEIOUI did not say a single wet' this. Mr. WARD—Mr. Lord is answerable for this Per ce a r saw, ; hut as to the statements regarding the Ite e3 ,l, Catholic bishops, he would ask the Right Hon. Gn—f man at the heal of the Government. the Chan cellor le the Exchequer, or any authority on that side ofrr;l2 House who was decently conversant wi th . 01 affairs, whether Dr. Troy was not on e ea r the most devoted friends that England ...- had ?—(Hear, hear.) And as to the charge of 1 1.; hellion, it was well known that in 1793 all the Ct' tll ,4% l clergy of Ireland were in a state of terror lest the r e - ' eiplcs of the French Revolution should take root t h e ate . Many of them had bet n expelled from France with en greatest indignity, and the chief exertions of thefer n i e s were to prevent the taint ef the revolutionary Pri ee i; : elf from spreading in Ireland. and out of the whole ho of the Catholic clergy of Ireland there was no t one I'o eined in the rebellion of 1798. The rebellion *II created in the north by the Presbyterians, and 11 , ° !,,, to the Catholics, and the people in the south were driv;eot. insurrection by the tyranny of the Govertlieg This sort of appeal to the popular ought nut to be made by men of Parliatnenao, standing in this ccuntry, and when speeches of ü b- n e ° o Members were quoted, they were not to be relie d ( h t as indisputable facts. If there was any breach of f i • was certainly on the side of England ; becau se it sae cer notori,ets fact that the Union could never have been tied if the Catholics had not been induced to co-er rot" with the Government and the Protestants. Th ere t s to a large body of evidence and many historical f0,e400 prove that prior to the fulfilment of Mr. Pitts P f le hi ed it was intended that the church property of ULM should be alienated. Evidence of this sort wa s :Pelf found in the "Life of Lord Eldon," and he could to see thinking that the nature of this evidence ought te m - ght prevented the executors from publishing it. He t " -11- 0 01 there were things in Lord Eldon's life which oughVeige to have been laid before the world within twentY,l after they occurred. It was stated in that work t",:4eo sole and only obstacles to the fulfilment of these PIO, we s the insanity of the King. l a r ead there was an anti- Catholic spirit. Let any al , t h a the the debates of that period and he would fina the most perfect unanimity existed in Parliament leioot general question and it was proposed that the Ca t h ,. ° g - refi t Ireland should be emancipated and merged into tp e rieto body of the Protestant constituency. He then w i 1,, 1. (0 many affecting details on the same subject. P v i ". the Ward) should like to know whether the Que en ikon ° Emancipation Act did not hold possess i o n of he!,,-ed 1)1 by a firmer tenure than did the King who reigiang coin the rigour of the penal laws? Up to 1810 the opeee' illness was the sole bar to the granting of theeArcap° sions to the Roman Catholics. After that s,tiellths the dissolution of the Ministry. Thus it wee l ' f ie othe r benefits promised by England were one siteer, file lost, and now when they were coming to somettunb ears gib same policy which had actuated them fertY y es dies they were thwarted in their attempts by the Pr Eno e i u ead engendered in the hearts of the Protestants of eslo and Scotland, by the wcrks of Protestant Vr ies ef 9 professed not the Toryism of his Hon. Friend the 'OO her for Oxford, but a principle peculiarly their had spoken of the Hon. Baronet, who stated tha l ' et ter was a religious question. Nothing could be a, g r y o eit absurdity. The interest of the people ever was to their own security, to have tranquillity at he ll 3 - 1, ilaO s power abroad; instead of that, they seemed to tbin a r• 0 .) the whole empire was made for the Church.--("l,,ebe' There were other things to which they should boe' r eat fore they dealt with the measure which the Gore rn- 0 00' proposed. It was opposed by a great class of their notof trynien, who conceived it to be a direct infring etae h og their rights, and he (Mr. Ward) did not know) all t he more dangerous than to connect the conscience w tit be pocket. That was what he wished to avoid, h le IS would say that there were a large body of the Pe e .,Ppaid this country and Scotland who told them that thoo lard their own clergy, and that it would be an act Of gr e w of justice, for the sake of tranquillising another r rti o thof the empire, to tax them for the support of l T d not Church to which they did not belong* con tber• gainsay that argument—he could not . deny tht be was a great deal of force and reason in it,:;;; Il isOSI found that the Presbyterians, Orthodox, and ya" --1. the Independents and the Wesleyan Methodistsflpsrt -11,248 churches, resting entirely on voluntary,Vl ttr e The Independents had twelve colleges, b eside of the Wesleyans, which were supported 9:,,,ed0. animal expense of twenty-four thousand ~19i th ee There could be no doubt, in acting properly, t"8 ought to proceed upon the principle of re stitutioni z igbt had heard, the other night, the speech of the We Hon. Gentleman the Secretary of State for the . Ilse " Department, and he could only regret its conolusli° ll (Hear, hear.) The Hon. Gentleman then went A con: long disquisition on the grievances of Irelan d, 9113 R otd d chided by expressing a hope that these wrong,. sro long be redressed. Ile believed, from 5r 13 ,j 5 0 0 taken place, that it was clearly shown that 1 0 1 sO'$ O' weakness was Ireland's strength. The Rig",: o siti sn Gentleman oppesite had the advantage of an oPr - Isn' which would assist him in carrying out his presentiol; —(Hear, hear.) They were ready to support baleof? carrying out even a more comprehensive pl an Or —and, therefore, he (Mr. Ward) called upon the rib° Hon. Baronet to reconcile his differences with thes,°.elitit supported him on this great question, and to c oati' the motion which he (Mr. Ward) now made. .40% Captain BERKELEY had great pleasure in se' ° ., e - ight the motion. He had voted fur the measure of the Pilot Hon. Baronet., but he had also voted (ever sinc e 11 . e c ipl e the honour of a seat in Parliament) for the P r een ) which was involved in the present motion. -- nt ,sri It would not bo consistent with his past Parliatne-00, conduct, if ho did not support the present 113°- j i illg whether or not he was allowed the honour of se l g3 } it. lie had voted for the appropriation clause I n and he thought that the mode proposed by tes „11 bla Friend the Member for Sheffield was the most reastd,.' and perfect in which the grant could be stllteciro_Aee (Hear, hear.) The Irish church was the great g r e - aow''', of Ireland. It had been declared such by all be s t friends of Ireland for the last century, and th e : friends of the Protestant religion had concurre u i e rse o , opinion. The Honourable Member then r e ai biee to the address of ten thousand persons , asse"-eon: at Mallow, to this Marquis of Normanhl'f hie gratulating that nobleman upon the results ° government of the country as Lord-Lieutcnant•ect, to asked them, how could Gentlemen opposite e%P,,,,ntrt, conciliate Ireland when they had deprived that i. esT e let` of so good - a Governor ?—(Hear, hear.) Nos "P i r eett that, in supporting the present motion, he WM °AOC -- mg the best interests of the country, and of the •."-- to which he belonged. to Os, Sir THOS. FREMANTLE said that in objecting dor amendment, he felt called upon to respect the consistel the Hon. Gentleman the Member for Sheffield, wil e ha et oot• ; hered to his own views upon this question, throngh g goo port and through evil report.—(Hear, hear.) r r h i . e e F rio: Member had lost no opportunity of putting forward t"e,b9 ciple embodied in the present motion—(Loud cheers.„'neirle the present occasion was most inopportune. The P" -- 50 s 11 was too important to be discussed upon the questi on of ob t) grant of 26,0001.—(Cries of " Hear, hear," and " fib ' sak e Many Gentlemen who were opposed to the grant nlib f fu r this opportunity of voting with the Hon. Mem be- a yinS the purpose of defeating the Government. But+ in surteol, this, he (Sir T. Fremantle) was bound to admit the: d 0 0 : and consideration with which the Hon. Gentleman er e sse since the debate was opened.—(Hear, hear.) ! ile a toe ' ' other inconveniences connected with the Hon. °e n " ll otli e f motion—for instance, if this motion were carried, sios Committee would be necessary to vote the particular ; 3 4 the funds out of which the grant should be supplied. In., 0 1 d aa Honourable Gentleman defeated the Ministry b y Pr°r:, 01.74 i this principle. In 1835 the Ministry we r- d r defeated upon it. ( Hear, hear.) In 106 af ,ppts the measures, which included the principle ot 0 00 priation, were rejected. But in 1638, an ant'lspPr °' o r for Bill was obliged to be carried, by the abandourne l4 priation. He wouW therefore put it to the Han. Di::: e llieti Sheffield, whether he would hazard the overthrow e'',:ioo_.,"4 sure now before the House, by pressing again the ti inters appropriation, which had hitherto been fatal to the to measures ?—(Hear, hear.) The Hon. Gentlereee ill proceeded to quote from a speech made by Lord A l° „ r o F t e -is 6 ,, °° opposition to the appropriation principle. The aPP r . o s - ' principle did not succeed in 1838, and it could be g much better grounds now. He quoted this inconos' resee show that the same arguments would do for them at theS e moment. Nothing could be more dangerous to this inef is e 'l e le Or, to tack the appropriation principle to it. Thep rie-r`operw volved the appropriation of the whole of the Church P ot Ol t in Ireland ; and by taking 26,0001. out of it, for t ha t t the n other purpose, they would violate their principles , O A , el% would be left to their future consideration how 0,, 0 7,,, 0 0 they should take.—(Hear, hear.) He wo uld C&" MAYNOOTH GRANT. Mr. EMERSON TENNENT presented petitions from several places in Ireland against the grant to Maynooth. Mr. Hindley presented 12 petions against the grant to Maynooth College, from the following p'aces:—ln • habitants of Botsford, Suffolk; Wyke, York ; Flay( rang Atte Bower, Essex; Protestant Dissenters, Kii;gst,n, Surrey ; Penegroes Whitechurch, Pembroke ; Ashby de-la-Zouch, Loughborough ; Calvanistic Methodists, Llanywniw, Denbigh ; Talynh, Brecon ; teachers of Sunday Schools, Castle-yard, Holland-street, Surrey ; and Frindsbury, Kent. LONDON AND YORK RAILWAY. An HoN. MEMBER, whose name we could not hear, presented a petition in favour of the London and York Railway. CLYDESDALE JUNCTION RAILWAY BILL. Mr. HOPE JOIINSTONE presented petitions, nu merously signed, from Glasgow, Hamilton, Ruthergien, Bothwell, and Blantyre, in favour of this measure. MR. BURKE AND THE MIDLAND RAILWAYS. The SPEAKER in reply to a question from Lord G. SOMERSET, stated that since this matter had been brought under his notice, be had taken an opportunity of looking into the rules of the House bearing upon the subject. He found that some years ago, Mr. speaker Abercromby framed a number of rules fur re gulating the practice of Parliamentary agents, but the only one of any inportance was the second rule, which required that all Par liamentary agents before they were T-milted to practice should make a declaration whereby they agreed to observe ail the rules and standing orders of the House. This rule, however, was not sufficiently stringent, and he had, therefore, framed a rule making every Parliamentary agent personally responsible to the House fur the due observance of the standing and ses sional orders. Lord G. SOMERSET said, under those circumstances he was not inclined to persist in his motion respecting an act of negligence lately committed by a Parlia mentary agent. RAILWAYS. Lord G. SOMEESET moved that every Committee on a Railway Bill shall fix the tolls, and shall determine the maximum rates of charge for the conveyance of passengers (with a due amount of luggage) and of goods on such railway, and such rates of charge shall include the tolls, and the costs of locomotive power, and every other expense connected with the conveyance of passengers (with a due amount of luggage) and of goods upon such railway; but if the Committee shall not deem it expedient to de termine such maximum rates of charge, a special report. explanatory of the grounds of their omitting so to do, shall be made to the House, which special report shall accompany the report of the Bill. Mr. LABOUCHERE said the subject which the No ble Lord had brought wider the consideration of the House was one of great importance, and it was, in his opinion, high time for the House to limit the tolls and rates of charges on railways. Mr. BERNAL, who was almost inaudible in the gallery, was understood to say that some uniform practice ought to be adopted in the Railway Committees, otherwise the greatest confusion would occur, and when the session was about to close there would be no such thing as remedying it. Sir J. Y. BULLER defended the conduct of Mr. Burke, which had been unjustly cotsured. If he had been guilty of some trifling inadvertence, he at once owned it. He would willingly bear testimony to the high character of Mr. Bnrke. Sir W. HEATHCOTE likewise eulogised the general conduct of Mr. Burke, which he considered was en titled to respect and gratitud. His exertions had been of the greatest service in ensuring order and regularity. The O'CONOR DON said he concurred in the ob servations of the Hon. Gentleman who had just sat down. There was a feeling amongst the Committee that no practitioner could discharge his duty with more credit' and satisfaction than Mr. Burke.—(Hear, hear.) His conduct with regard to the clause alluded to ought certainly not to be characterised by a stronger expression than that of inadvertence. The slightest unfavourable impression did not remain in the minds of the Committee with regard to the conduct of Mr. Burk. Mr. GREENE entirely concurred in the testimony which had been given respecting Mr. Burk. Mr. HAWES said he wished to call the attention of the House to the resolution of the Noble Lord (Lord G. Somerset.) He did not think it was necessary to say a word more respecting the uprightness of Mr. Burk. It would be impossible for any person to say, what should be the maximum rate for passengers and pods. The company, and the company alone, could only furnish the necessary information on that point. The hlon.. Member for Devonport had said that this was a clause which should be inserted in order to remedy the defects complained of ; but he (Mr. Hawes) did not think it would be possible for this House to frame any clause by which to fix the maximum rate of charges. The House had not the power to do so, for the public were of necessity in the halide of the railway companies in this respect. For instance, what might be a fair rate of charge on a locomotive line might not be fair upon an atmospheric line; and was this House, then, prepared to say that they could fix the maximum rate of charges for each ? It would be a most arbitrary act to do so, and he would most decidedly divide the House upon any such clause—be deemed it so impolitic—though he might not have the slightest chance of success. Sir GEO. CLERK said ho perfectly concurred with the Hon. Member that it would be a great absurdity to attempt to fix the maximum rate of charges ; but it would be competent for the House to fix the rate of charges to be made as tolls. However, he begged to assure the Honourable Member that in one of the Bills sent before the Committee, the promoters of the Bill themselves had voluntarily introduced a clause by which they proposed to fix the maximum rate of charge. ' Mr. GISBORNE hoped the House would not place any degree of confidence either in that or any other Bill that should contain such a proposition. Mr. JAMES STUART WORTLEY believed that the compensation that had been given was a real and not a temporary one. He considered that the course that had been pursued with respect to this subject was one that ought to be well considered.—(Hear.) Canals would be no longer able to compete with rail ways—the shareholders in them would be ruined by the low rate at which the latter conveyed luggage In this respect, he cordially agreed with the Noble Lord, but th.mght the resolution ought to be more stringent. He would likewise call the attention of the Noble Lord to the high rate of tolls, as also to the high rata of charge on the inter mediate stages on railroads, and to the convenience of having additional stations. The public, by the high rate of changes on intermediate stations were in a worse condition than before railways were established. Mr. PAKINGTON said there were several railways carrying goods at so low a rate of charge as to render it impossible for it to be remunerative. Those companies made up the loss by imposing a higher rate of charge on passengers than they would have been otherwise called upon to pay. Thi was most unjust towards the canal companies, and unfair to all the public. He thought, therefore, that some regulation such as that which bad been proposed ought to be adopted. Lord G. SOMERSET hopes the House would not agree to the amendment which had been proposed, the only effect of which would be to keep up the rate of charge on all description of passengers, and all descrip titn of goods. Mr. SPOONER supported the amendment., and stated that if the motion of the Nuble Lord was acceded to, it would be injurious, as it would tend to suppress com petition. Mr. MORRISON thought it would be advisable to adopt the plan which was adopted with regard to the French railways. When the fares were lowered there, the Companies were nut permitted to raise them until twelve months had elapsed. Sir G. GREY complained that proper notice had not been given of the motion. After a few words from Mr. S. WORTLEY and Mr. STANSFIELD, Lord GRANVILLE SOMERSET gave notice that it was his intention on Monday next to bring forward a precise motion on the subject of the charges for fares on railways. The amendment having been withdrawn, theiresolu tiollW6B agreed to. 110% "Pp , str u MT, .iir, 13 .! ter