The Sun. — London, England, 1821-04-06 00:00:00

PARLIAMENT, HOUSE OF LORDS, APRIL 5. The House sat in a Committee of Privileges on the Strathmore Peerage ) at three o'clock, when Mr. Hart opened the case. The Committee then adjourned to this day se'nnight.—Ors the motion of the LORD CHANCELLOR, the judgment of the Court of Sessions in Scotland, on the case of Thnuistoun v. HP, was confirmed by their Lord ships.—Mr. Mason, frOm the Directors of the East India Company, presented the third Re port of the Resolutions of the Directors for grant iac.g Salaries, Pensions, and Compensations. Laid cn the table.--Sir James Graham and other :Members brought up the Regent's Canal Bill, and several Private Bills from the Commons. I. , rad a first time.—The Innkeepers' Rates Bill -e eut through a Committee and was reported. ROMAN CATHOLICS. Viscount i'tfv.TvrLLE presented a Petition from fivt. Council of the Royal - Burgh of Queensferry, against the Catholic Claims.—Laid on the table. The Archbishop of CANTER.BURY presented a Petition from the Dean and Prebend of ete Cathedral Church of Canterbury.--Laid on at table. to Archbi,hop of CANTERBSIRY then said, that he had a similar Petition to present from the D?an and Prebend of Norwich, and thought it ,roper to state how that Petition bad come into hznits Right Rev- Friend the Bishop i)1; Norwich had undertaken to present it, but not •fleng able to come to town immediately, had re ciaested him to lay it before their Lordships.-- e (the Archbishop of C.) had only to add, that the Petition was siffoied by men with whom h a had lived on the most intimate terms, for venom ht entertained the highTst respect, and with wham he had been connected with great satis faction to himself during his long residence in the see of Norwich. The Petition was then lead atd laid on the table. The ili,hop of CiltiTEß. presented Petitions from the Clergy of the Diocese of Gloucester, alld from two Deaneries in the said Diocese, against the catholic Claims. Laid on the table. Lord RAILLE presented a similar Petition from tke Rector and Churchwardens of the Parish of George, at Exeter. Laid on the table.— Adjourned. HOUSE OF COMMONS. 1 . 41 t. DOWNIE presented a. petition from the Corn Mer e:4o:s ma others of Stirling against the Bill for the Regulation cf (.rn Averagoso'—Ordered to lie on the table. Serjeant ON'SLO W presented a petition from certain Soß wr.-.orzi end Attorneys of Ireland, praying that the provisions of a Bill now in progress through the House for facilitating the ae=ission into the profession of such Gentlemen as have ob .at..-.oed degrees from tire English Universities, might be extend to Gentlemen in Ireland who have obtained degrees from -Trinity College, Dublin. The Honourable Member at the -vome tome gave notice, that he would add a clause to the Bill it- - conformity with the prayer of the petitioners.—The petition w - a 4 ordered to lie on the table. The Regent's Canal Bill was read a third time and passed. :dr. J. MACKINTOSH gave notice, that on Tuesday next, he would move - for leave to bring in a Bill for the Reformation cri the Critniria) Code. The Honourable and Learned Member stated, that he would on that day merely move to have the:Bill „load a nut time, reserving the discussion of the question to ; - ... - otarsday, the 3d of May. ;An MONTEITH presented a petition from the Corn Mer e:Oa:its of Glas g ow, against the Bill for Regulating the Corn itrerages.—Ordered to lie on the table. r , fr. F. PALMER presented a petition from Owners of Land a Biggleswade, complaining of agricultural distress—Referred o the Agricultural Committee. On the motion of Sir J. NEWPORT, an Account of the Zr.-kie and Custom Duties collected in Ireland was ordered. ;vi . BASTARD presented a'Petition from certain Occupiers of :brand in Devon, complaining of agricultural distress.—Re lerted to the Committee. Mr. CLIVE brought up the Third Report of the Commis se:Omen-for inquiring into the state of Weights and Measures.— C.`o -- d'ered to lie on the table. Xr. C. CALVERT moved for a return of the number of P4ooners confind under the Orders of the Courts of Requests, in :;outhwark, in the Borough Compter, for the last three roars. distinguishing the number confined in each year, and ti:.t'„!o'mount of the debts, &c.—Ordered accordingly. ..Er. HUME postponed his motion which stood for Wednes tia.Llast, but which dropped in consequence of the House not htenno; met on that day, to Tuesday next, rest eeting the Dis vt--a'ification of Officers belonging to the Ordnance Department m sitting in that House. • Air. LUSHINGTON brought up an Account of the Pro- • elute of the Excise Duties, which was ordered by the House. GAME LAWS. CRANBORNE rose to bring forward his promised melon on the subject or the Game Laws. The Noble Lord slid, that it was far from his intention to trench upon theopri •vileges of any class of society; but in contemplating tit effects of.taz Game Laws upon the people of this country, it was but too obvious that those laws encouraged crime, and tended to foil the N jails with the-unfortunate. The oble Lord proceeded to rtake shme•further observations, which were inuabiWe in the fosaero, and oontiuded:by moving for a Committee to inquire ;zit: the State of the Oame Laws. SEBRltriffi"rose to second the motion. He said that. he did not know. exactly what were the changes which tare Noble Lard intended to make : but he was sure that any would be for the better ; a• set of laws more !absurd cer more unjust never disgraced any country. With respect to the elfecta of the Game Laws, he had no • hesitation in !.4.. : .- ft. - g„ that they tended to demoralize the people. It was his ..14;pon, that game should be put upoutho same footing as tx4117--property. • • • • :::or J. SHELLEY said no one in the House would be less than he xas to.treat with disrespect whatever fell from to iooble Lord (-Lord Cranborne), but when it was recollected &at a Bill respecting the Game Laws had been brought in by fire !Cottle Lord, late Member for Hertfordshire (Loid Deere), ;;44 el forced by all his eloquence and popularity, and yet had :a did not expect much from the present motion. How eTio-, the Noble Lord hid said, to use sporting language, " tliotioh Lord Deere missed fi , e, I'll whip up hil jacket, and • Lave a, shot' at the Game Law." The Game - Laws had not I,catfairly treated by the Noble Lord ; for there was no set of ;.fir that might not be open to objection, if their bad effects otir were conridered. If the game were destroyed, the great iiidacement to coo otry Gentlemen - to reside on their estates would be taken. away. • JOSEPH YOP.KE said, that though he was not a Itltir of game, he was an eater of that nice aiticle ; but since the Bill bro.:light in by the I-lon. Member for Corfe Castle•had parsed f hz had.never been able to get a second course.—(A la.ugli..)—He hoped, whatever Bill the Noble Lord brought an, there would. be a clause in it to - Provide, that when an humble - individual like him - seff was about to give a dinner, and .natu raiii• said 'to - his " iViy dear, let us have some game"—• iaugh),--he might not be met with the unpleasant diffi culty, where shall we get it? „ W. W YriN said a feW' words, which were not dis,:nctly •r• • . audible in the • Nr..BANITCS was g1. , 01 his Eill'had been so effectual, as • 'his it. Friend (Sir J. Yorke) had said. if that Bill destroy, •*; ed . .T'oachiog; it would .destroy the great nest of evil from • ! I .4l:ach greatvart of the evil of the country originatecL He ob ;octed to a Committee which would take up the time of. the a rtfour.e without adding any thing to its inforroatiOn., Astbe subject was not new, the Noble Lord might at once move for Ifa•Ototo•bring in a Bill. As to the Game Laws themselves, no qr./ 1 , CouV. deny that a great number of persons were: at present in I•;riaon4hi amount of the Game Laws, and nothing .would be •' • rnors4raoy thantoput an-end to this, by abolishing the Laws. rut th;..s might be said of any other law. TheY all lameattd the rouin'.'es cf petrfithinehta for-forgery. Nothing was mere ' easy. than to put an, end tolte laws against it. But what then .tocarlv of- tileproperty of t country ?So they might abolish the “.atne .Laws, but what then became of the Game of the t cknittry ? The general permission to shoot would: - only make. •Xit cnuntty peopleltr. thnes.motevicious and .indolent.; 'and ht. siz months the Game would be•destroyoct, and•the bitter classes of poople•wuld •be left without thelfathdiarbent, Which at tached them to the mintry. He recommended the Noble ' Mover, if he wanted any information, to move that the Report of 1816 be reprinted.. Colonel WOOD said, he was the unfortunate individual who moved for the Committee - of 1816—(A laUgh).—When he had got into that Comujittee, he found that they would agree to no thing:that he propoSed. He had proposed to the Committee to examine to that extent the evil of poaching had gone, and to consider a remedy. This the Committee refused, and said they would take for, granted there was a great deal of evil from poaching. So that after much discussion the only resolution the Committee came to was this—" That it is the opinion of this Committee that Game should be the property of the person on whose ground it is found :" and so they reported. As for the remark of his Honourable Friend (Sir Joseph Yorke), that no one in London could get a second course, he could only say that his Honourable, Friend was not so much in the confidence of the Poulterers as he was. He (Colonel W.) found no dif ficulty in getting it to any extent ; and if his Honourable Friend would give them a dinner, he would undertake to buy game for him--(A laugh.)--He could not help thinking, that it was of importance that the Committee should be appointed, for he was confident that poaching now went on' to as great an extent as ever it did. The Poulterers were forced to encourage it, even against their own will. What they said was, "to cut off the supply altogether, or let it be legalized." As to the ramedy two courses were open—(A laugh.)--Either they might re-tread their steps, and return to the state in which they were .till the, latter end of the reign of George ll.' when the sale of .Game was legal, the rest of the laws remaining the same ; or they might (to which he was more inclined) adopt a new course, making Game the property of the occupier of the land. Ha recommended also a 'revision of the law as to qualifications which was now enforced only against the Poor. 'The Certifi cate might be raised to 51. and all qualifications taken away.— He was very anxious the co:-:Au Gentlemen should have every inducement to reside on their estates, but it was their interest to consider the question with liberality, and to put down an evil which filled the jails with peasantry, and laid the foundation 'of 'it, many crimes. Mr. DOUGLAS said, poaching had not increased more than other offences. He opposed the motion. Sir. C. BURRELL defended the Game Laws, and argued against the proposal for making Game property, which would lead to more bloodshed than the present system. Mr. LOCKHART objected to the appointment of:a Com mittee, for which he saw no grounds, and in which he could ex pect no union of Opinion. He thought much evil would arise from making game property. It wasto be recollected that great part of the country was . yet .in common field. In those places also, where the country was divided into small freeholds, the law would then be migatory.: - Mr. BENETT (of Wilts) thought the Game Laws requir ed revision. There were very few persons, he observed, who stole sheep who did not first begin by poaching. If game was put upon the samefooting as other property it would be the interest of the occupiers of the land to preserve it ; it was now their interest to destroy it. it might be then sold so cheap that it would not be worth the poacher's while to sell game. .It might be then sent to London cheaper than any kind of poultry. . Mr. COE:E, jun. was in favour of the Amendment of the Hon. Baronet. The tendency of the motion was to degrade the character of County Gentlemen by mixing up with their sports and pleasures a sordid and mercenary spirit. He was not an unqualified admirer of the Game Laws ; but if they only induced-Gentlemen to reside on their estates, they accomplished much benefit. He thought it impossible to put an end to the crime of poaching, which was not at all looked upon as a moral offence : the purchasers of game were the abetters of poaching. Mr. WARRE was convinced that whatever penalties might be inflicted, game would still be purchased, and in large quan tities. He should vote for the Committee, as the present Laws were the parents of much crime. Lord LOWTHER opposed the motion, as he was sure that no advantageous result could arise out of inquirir.' Mr. 1-1.1 BO RD admitted that poaching.ought to be put down ; but as the present Laws did not put-it down, he thought an alteration might be made which would be more effectual.— A great moral evil existed, and inquiry might possibly lead to a remedy. As to residence in the country; he did not think much would be lost by the absence of those Gentlemen whose only object was to shoot pheasants. Lord CRANBORNE replied, vindicating the motives that had induced him to submit the proposition for a Committee. The House then divided : For the Committee - - 52 _I Against it - 86 When re-admitted, we found Mr. HumE•on his legs ask ing some question regarding the Navy Estimates ; but it was inaudible. AGRICULTURAL HORSES. Mr. Cuawam rose to bring for Ward his motion regard;ng the Agricultural Horse Tax. He-was satisfied that the repeal of this impost would not be attended with any considerable relief to the distressed farmer; but it would; at the same time, be gratifying; to the feelings of the ikm , pers of land, and there never was a time when it was mere proper for Ministers to give them hope and alleviation. The tax was on all accounts objectionable ; it fz,ll most unequally, most heavily upon the poorest lands, while grass farms paid scarcely any thing : small clay farms also suffered .severely ; and in not a few instances the occupier was obliged to pay for a saddle-horse, though he never used one. The Agricultural Horse Tax was often one-sixth part of the rent upon steril soils, while it did not reach half that amount in better situations. It was a cruel, op pressive, and grievous tax upon the little farmer : and if the' Chancellor of the ExChequer would not condescend to notice what he said, he (Mr. Curwen) hoped that the Noble Lord would take the distresses of Agriculture into consideration, and as far as possible assist them : a fair oppor tunity or so doin7, though in a slight degree, was now afforded. He would mention a circumstance which occurred in the country some time•ago : There was a man near 70 years .of age ; he was on his way to market loaded with i,packs and goods ; a fox crossed the road ; the, old man had been a sportsman, and, unable to resist the ar dour of the chase, he threw down his packs and pursued the unlooked-for chase with all . the ardour which mig,itt be expected froth- a younger man and a better horse. The circumstance occasioned considerable.amusementat the time ; but, being' talked of, an excise-officer got scent of the'af fair and informed against.the pedlar, who had to pay the tax and the surcharge for his newly-dub bed hunter '--(A, laugh,)--: . -The time must speedily come when the Chancellor of the Exchequer must relieve the. poor"man, who •had nothing to pay, from taxes which it was cruel to impose upon him.. This reani - ssien Wriuld, operate a saving 'of 6d. a • Week. in every artithlOof his consumption. Ile (Mr. Curwen) was aware that it *its the -moSt .difficult of all task. • to require of. ministers to give up any. part of therevenuein its present di lapidated state;. : but the Princi - ple`of this tax was altogether' erroueOus,and itasconsequences altoge ther fatal and destruCtive: , He could assure the Chancellor of. the :EXchequer that The idea - of throWittg the poor grounds-,-those of inferior qua, lity—:nirt of .cultivation; •Was -the• most disastrous that.,could be entertained,,. 'Would the -Chan cell"or of the-Exchequer- - Lt. surprised when he told him who were OW the,grea.t speculators in corn 'and grain Wort hi* he believe him when he saidL-:Ahe MonarchS of Europe ?—(Hear!),-:•And in, August last' the greacer.part• of , the immense importation which'tooit place_ Was. from stares of the of SUreden aild if Aye ever eXpe rieneed a.,acarcity,Hwirich God forbid.! hand Nl4O id require a sudden, importation of 'grain, there Was tlX.4ingOf-Deninark reatly..to supply us with,enormous quantities, -- which we collected in Holland on, his account, inAlie,e,yent ,demand being made'. 7. -(ffear might . Observe. that :metallic,springss - , - apinied: to, ottS,.,,badr,been' - :faipfcL to saman4riftneiasitrof labour ; yet, the mornent this was done, the owner of the cart was liable to pay for it as a gig ; and hence arose a variety of Vexatious sur charges. lie hoped the Noble .Lord would use his influence with the Chancellor of the Exche quer to induce him to withdraiv impositions so grievous as these were. They were the more iii:. tolerable as they attacked the poor and indus trious farmer, and were most hard where the un genial nature of bad soils demanded the most lenient visitation of Government in the way of taxes. For his own part, he would venture to recommend,'as the most equitable and least vex atious of all taxes, a tax upon income.--(llear.) If a moderate tax of 51. per cent. upon income were so levied as to include in its operation the fundholder and the laudholder—for that was the fair and proper principle—and if it should be, im partially applied, he (Mr. Curwen) would give it his most hearty support. If the Chancellor of the Exchequer adopted this course, lie would no doubt find himself enabled to remit the leather tax, a large portion of the salt tax, and the last tax on malt, as well as that upon soap and can dles ; and thus every body in the country would be benefited excepting the Government.-(Cheers and laughter.)—Yet, when he said this, he was by no means certain that the revenue would not be increased, from the decreased charge of collection and other circumstances. The only real loss would be, perhaps, a loss of that extensive patronage on the part of Ministers, of which it would be difficult for any man to show what had been the.benelicial result. If he needed to adduce any additional circumstances on the state of the country to induce a compliance with his motion, he would refer the House to this me lancholy fact—that no less a sum than 2,000,000/. was annually paid for paupers.—(Bear!)—This enormous amount was advanced by the country to pay their proportion of the taxes. Out of 8,000,0001. of poor's rates, 2,000,0001. was paid to the Government in the shape of taxes for those individuals who had nothing wherewith to pay them. He maintained that the country had a right to call upon the Right Hon. Gentleman to change his system, and he entreated the Noble Lord to second the demands of the country upon that Right Hon. Gentleman (the Chancellor of the Exchequer) to avert from it a catastrophe to which the course he was pursuing was now rapidly leading it. In proportion as the value of land had fallen, the quantum of poor rates had become more heavy on the small farmer, the townsman, and the shopkeeper. The Right lion. Gentle man might begin, therefore, by giving to the far mer a boon in acceding to this motion, which would be most gratefully felt and produce the most extensive. benefit. This might be the com mencement of a system of amelioration,which might yet effect a change in the aspect of this kingdom, of the most healthful and advantageous descrip tion. He (Mr. Curwen) had already ventured to suggest in what manner this course of improve ment might be followed up, and once again he earnestly recommended these observations to the serious attention of the Hon. Gent. opposite. As for this particular tax, it was evident and notorious that its rigour was most painfully and most justly felt in the northern coun ties of England, and in North Wales, where, from the nature of the soil, the employment of horses in agriculture was matter of absolute and indispensible necessity. lie should therefore move'' for leave to bring in a Bill to repeal so niuch of the Acts of the 48th and 52d of George and of the 2d of George IV., as imposes certain duties on horses employed for agricultural purposes, and for the conveyance of lime, coals, and certain merchandize." Sir W. W. WYNN, in seconding, the motion, urged the hardship to which the farmers upon poor lands were subject under the existing tax ; for, in proportion as those lands were poor, they were obliged to carry to it an additional quantity of manure, which of course rendered necessary the employment of more horses. But still he Could not help expressing a wish that his Hon. Friend had postponed his motion until the. Re port of the Agricultural Committee were laid be fore the House•—(Hear, hear, on the Treasury Bench.) The motion having-been read by the Speaker, Sir. C. BURRELL rose, and after declaring his concurrence with the principle of the motion,. ex pressed a wish, as the seconder had done, that it had been rather . postponed until the Report of the Agricultural Corrimittee were brought up. The unequal pressure of the existing tax, especially with respect to inferior lands, could not be de nied by any one acquainted with agriculture. For instance, where land required lime, which was particularly the case with lands of inferior quality, :additional horses must- be employed to carry it, for oxen, although they answered the purpose of agriculture, in the field, could not carry great weights for any distance upon the roads. The lion. Member detailed some further disadvantages to which the occupier of inferior lands was liabliclnd which made it necessary . for him to employ more horses than could be required for good lands. Hence, the Farmer was pecu liarly aggrieved by the existing tax. Under all the circumstances,. he trusted his Hon. Friend Would consent to postpone his motion until•after the Report of the Agricultural Committee. • Mr. DAVENPORT would also support this pro position, and trusted - the Hon. Member f-.;• Cum berland would not postpone it. Mr. 13NNNETT warmly advocated the motion of. his _Honourable Friend, and, with the 'last Honourable . Speaker, could see no necessity for its. poStponement. lie thought a tax on hot houses wonld defeat its own object, by'occasioning an instant • reductio.n:of their number. Lord. BEr.onAvE (we believe), from under the galleryi also supported . the motion, and took the opportUnitli - Oe'asking: the' Chancellor of the Ex- Chequer-whether it, was true that the colleges and pnylit I.eminaries 'did not. contribute their portioßto.the windowtax. If. it Avere, he should shortly subriiit.a motion on the subject, conceiv ina that the exemption )vas entirely improper. CnANbpE.Loii of the Exon EQ EIC said, un ;doulitedly the Cidleges did pay window tax, beineratekinproportion to the number of apart ruentsin:ocpupation. . • IV.I:CiIIIWENi seeing the temper of the House, and on an Understanding that, Upon the bring ing., up of the report, the Chancellor :of the Exchequer would be disposed to extend relief to the agricultural interest, by a modification of taxes which bore most heavily and mischiev ously on them, would have no hesitation in with drawing his motion.—(llear, hear? from Lord Castlereagh.) The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER said he wished to know the degree of importance which the Committee of Agriculture would be disposed to attach to the repeal of this Tax. Unless they - considered its repeal of great importance to the agricultural interests, he thought no benefit aris ing from it could equal the inconvenience which would result in a financial point of view, from the subtraction of so large a sum as 500,0001. a year from the revenue. Sir T. LETHBRIDGE was satisfied that the coun try would consider the repeal of the Husbandry Horse Tax as a great relief. He did not wish to undervalue the opinion of the Committee up stairs ; he must say that he thought it would be much better for the House to grant this small boon to the Agriculturists at the present mo ment, without waiting for any thing.—Such a step would produce a favourable effect upon the country in general. • Mr. Girrs thought the motion would come with greater weight after the Report of the Agri cultural Committee. Mr. RICAnno said he should support the pre sent motion, though he did not think that either this Tax or the Tax upon Malt, for the repeal of which he had also voted, pressed very parti cularly upon the agricultural interests. They fell rather upon the consumer than upon the agri cultural interests, and he voted for their repeal upon the general principle of economy.. While he consid(fred that any reduction might be made in the public expenditure, he should vote for the repeal of this and any other tax whatsoever. With regard to the national debt, the whole pro perty of country was pledged to pay the in terest of that debt. It was absurd to contend that the whole pressure of taxation fell upon the agricultural classes. The taxes pressed gener ally upon all classes of the community, and the fundholder paid a large portion of them. Before he sat down, he wished to make one observation with reference to what had fallen from the Hon. Member for Cumberland. The Honourable Gentleman said, that the King of Sweden and other Monarchs were the first corn merchants in Europe, and that we were in fact dealing with them, and not with common mercantile men. If so, he (Mr. IL.) thought we had a better chance of making a good bargain with them, than with the common importers of Corn. The Honourable Gentleman said the King of Sweden would not be content to exchange his Corn for our manu factures, he would take nothing but bullion, and that bullion was not to be acquired. If so, the Honourable Gentleman's apprehensions as to ex cessive importation were groundless, and his own arguments afforded a sufficient security for this country growing its own Corn. Mr. BAILING regretted that the Hon. Mem ber for Somersetshire (Sir T. Lethbridge) had though proper to introduce some observations in the course of this discussion, which were perfect ly uncalled for by the question before the House. Such observations came with peculiarly ill grace from Gentlemen, who, like the Hon. Member for Somersetshire, had never in a single instance re fused their support to his Majesty's Ministers, and who, after having eased themselves of the bur thesis of the public expenditure, lay borrowing money of others, were now ready to cheat the public creditor (for he could use no,otlier lan guage) of the money which had been advanced for their relief. He did not apprehend, however, that the opinions of the Hon. Member for Somerset shire srere likely to be much countenanced, or to make much progress in the country. Ile could not but express some surprise to hear his Hon. Friend behind him (Mr. Ricardo) who advocated the sound principles on the subject of the Nation al Debt, declare his determination to vote for the Repeal of any Taxes as long as the Sinking Fund remained, for his argument went that length. If he had objected only to the mode of keeping the accounts of the Sinking Fund, he IL) was perfectly ready to concur with him, for it was calculated only to puzzle and con fuse. But to say that a Sinking Fund ought not to be maintained, was in 'effect to say that the country should go on borrowing, as lorr,s as fools enough could be found to lend their money, and that no security should be offered to the creditor.—(Hear, hear !)—With respect to the repeal of the present Tax, he did not think it was calculated to afford much relief to the agri cultural interests ; nor did he think that much more information than Honourable Gentlemen al ready possessed' upon the subject, was likely to be obtained by waiting for the Report of the Committee. For his ownyart, he had always con sidered the maintenance of the finances of the country an object of essential importance, and he thought the country would be better able to engage-in any contest, or cope with any difficul ties, with a strong finance than with a strong snilitary or naval establishment. Mr. CALcitasse said, he was as desirous to keep up the financial credit of the country as his lion. Friend the Member for Taunton could possibly be, but . with respect to the question of keeping up a Sinking Fund, it was necessary to consider how far the comforts and means of the people would enable us to do so. Such was the state of the country, and such the situation of particular classes of the community, that it was better, even with a view to keeping up the national credit, to relax a certain part of the public burthen, than to, press the good people, to extremity. Let our army and navy establishments be reduced, and that reduction would afford the very means of keep ing up the Sinking Fund. Ile did not object to the Sinking Fund, but to the manner in which the Sinking Fund was erripl,:yed. The Sinking Fund was in fact a hoard of money kept up at a great expence, and taken from the people at in convenient periods, and by hard means. It was a large treasure amassed under the name of asSink jug Fund, and lavished at pleasure by the Go vernment. Was that the way to economise, or to save the resources of . the people ?, The money would be much taro. ) he contended, in the pockets Of the people, both as a security for themselves, and a resource for the State, than it was even in the hands of the Commissioners for discharging the public debt. With respect to the motion before the House, he should certainly support it if his Hon. Ffiend thought proper to press it to a division ; but he could not help wishing that he would consent to postpone it until after the Report of the Agricultural Com mittee. Lord MILTON did not' believe that the .dis tresses of the agriculturists were properly appre ciated by the Members of that House, and especially by the Members of his Majesty's Government. Though a Committee had Peen appointed to inquire into the present agricul tural distress, he was led to believe, from the rumours which were abroad, that Ministers had come into the Committee in domt as to the exis tence of that distress. On this subject he thought they ought to have made lip their minds before granting the Committee. The Bill his Hon. Friend wished to introduce he thought might be brought in, and it could then be suspend ed in its stages till the Committee made their Report. He then described the distressed stale of the Southern Counties, and described large tracts of land to lie unoccupied with little pros pects of their landlords finding tenants. lie considered the tax to press severely on the agri culturist, and should therefore vote for its re peal on a principle different from that on which on a former evening he should have voted for the repeal of the Malt Tax had he been present. He should vote for, the repeal of the Agricuhural Horse Tax to relieve the landed interest ; for the repeal of the Malt Tax he would have voted on the principle laid down by the Member for Port• arlington, and on that contended for by the Mem ber for Rippon, to compel the Ministry to have recourse to a system of retrenchment andeconomv. The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER explained- Mr. CURWEN understanding the Right lion. Gentleman to say, that in the event, of the re moval of this tax being strongly recommended by the Committee in their report . , he would be dis posed to consider of the point of conceding the boon. Understanding this to be the intention of the Chancellor of the Exchequer, he undoubtedly should think it his duty to give way. He how ever begged to state, that if the Committee fail ed to make their report till a very late period of ,the Session, he should feel himself at liberty to bring the subject forward again. The CHANcELLoa of the EXCHEQUER thought nothing more fair than that the llon.'Gentlerna.° should have in his own breast the right of resit . ' ing the motion, if the Report of the Coromitte ° should be so long delayed, as to make it pre" bable that waiting for that, no practical meaitl could be adopted in the course of the prese° Session. He then repeated what he had Prf,i viously stated as to the course which he 010' 4 feel it to be his duty to pursue on the R e port the Committee being made. Mr. H. BRIGHT thought it right to state, thJ if in the event of the Malt Tax being repo,,, the Chancellor of the Exchequer should prel ) 7 t . o a substitute for it, he should feel it his dot , I oppose it. He would not consent to the reoW va ' s. of a tax from one class, if it was intended -to ito' pose it on others. The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQVER TeserV e to himself the right of proposing another tax as substitute for the Malt Tax, if it should be 1 5 : pealed, and it would then be for the fic ul to determine which would be th e l e ast opPre'sive After a few words from Mr. Alderman SMITH, Mr. D. BROWN, and another Honourable Member, Lord ALTHORPE said, if the Right Hollong; ble Gentleman pledged himself to take off tax, if this should be recommended irr flit' port of the Committee, he would consent to t o f motion being withdrawn, but if the Chancel l°r e the Exchequer declined giving such it pledge should wish the question to be pressed to _. vision. Mr. F. LEWIS rose, but the call for th e 0 1 tion being very loud, the Hon. Member xe s 00vv his seat, and the Gallery was cleared. We ho o d ever, understood thil no division took plac e ' that the motion was withdrawn. BANK CASH PAYMENTS BILL. - - - • ow ed tb : & • The CHANCELIAHt a the EXCHEQUER ..T.,,;liiitV order of the day for the House resolving its into a '''.. •., On the Bank Cash Pay•ments Bill. .irS trl v i ,t Mr—BARING rose for .the purpose of moving. n- be I - loc i ': . o t s i ac O cr n ya . s t ri o oo I !: i ;h e ibm : tt ol i.tae Committee . iccoezitsze ' 1 1 1 eu t dc l h v t o bo t e l f h it i nhee n at o siu t n , rl; l i to e o f o b li teh s c oe r n li c o; oo t j i :iii , e sc o taii n t ,:f e : . i . i t i h n e p c o o r t t l a n n t ce ry, to th t a h t e h ct e m e i 0 1117 i ty n , o i t n st t i h ff e el p re thiset i o t p d p is u tr , :7:., ,) , t , 0 , , t F;:. 4 ,, _,,,,,a , ..,,, c..... tn the without recording hiasent i m e n t s upon it. The P r ..triitY — e , f sid , .red the last time he should have that opPeif . rt,ie l ' — ,,ll () progress of the bill before -the 'House. The inef,, - -i v t 'e tect bY. ---' frequent changes in the currency was felt and s-",:;aioull Since the House had determined that .the DO:tosUre whict i • gold, members must have been considering 0' r - ps of the c°l' o " it would lyi iiltely to have upon the diffueiat ells doubts d ou bts munity ; -and every Gentleman who entertaine","'cfini in wi'j, to the efficacy of the measure , ought to join w ito econs p e rf r inq that the whole of the subject should now be _ r i , b e an -,,,,: TheMemb,er ConclUded by r i te ti of his 11 1 2,e struction to the Coim.ittce to reconsider t'' - 'e Act ') ~,l e; for l' o f M-kiesty (Chap. , W), nth a view to amend the 5 , — ,,, ta a1ti0u. ,„ purpose of alleviating the pressure which the stric, s ‘ c or, pubil' that Act would have on the vari,Jus branches '''''' interE.st. The CHANCELLOR o the .E7c-C" Q b t er : e would oppose the motion of f the floo. MeL,,„,`1.„,„6 whi,ch..h.atti would be no necessity cf goivg bsck td..ll l V-T yas a probahllt Y, been already discus , ,,:ed. IlowLver, as t.ll( i , r ieole t i m e, and . 3 3 that this qu , stion would occupy a eonli iv i ii h was exPee t 'f, , , there was other business before toe flocs' id Propoe, that t.,„ to be gore through with to-night, be ill b c Fotpoped till order for going into the Committee on t ' lc. 10 Monday. Mr. ,FiLLIqF, . . 1 _ -This proposition, after a few words fr°lnf the Elteltr,tlL. ~ H. G. BENNET, and the CIIAI{CELLOR 0 a to tponc was agreed to. was also pos 'll The Irish Bank Cash Payments Ili Monday. • „,,7 ! ADE.' 4 • D at ... J.... he MERCHANTS TN TET Tl' — t'tion front t • . e t 1 Mr. BANI NG pl'esented a the North 0 . • a i n o- to,e Merchants of London .tr ,• •,. eat 0.1. rat Europe, adjutrn at buTittllere Europe praying for such a • Duties on • tv. ....1V interests of the con-In:um ~ whet h er „. , idled to know ,ior Mr. J. I'. GRANT W -Arnbassa-- been maue . .. of the 0, representations had a the -subjeut , . of Sweden and Norway o 5 ii re presel.:; Timber Trade.been here had . . I promote toe acne Duties as sh• Id Mr. AVALLAGE.,9id, t, tations on the subject.- . Mr. Attna-yArr Yishea to ,know yhether representations had- en made . on the Fart o be . . on, to Pat