The Sun. — London, England, 1845-06-04 00:00:00

AILWAY COMMITTEES. (YESTERDAY.) GROUP A. LONDON, CHATHAM, AND NORTH KENT R.AILWAY. The Committee met at twelve o'clock, and resumed the examine t on of witnesses in support of the Bill. Mr. Brunel, the eminent engineer, gave evidence strongly in favour of Mr. Vignolles' plan. Hi• denied that there was any danger whatever to be apprehended for the powdtr.mills at Fever sham from the proximity of the railroad. Mr. Rendle, civil engineer, had examined the line, and corrobo rated the previous evidence in its favour, but the details were re petitions of that evidence. Mr. Miller, also an engineer, who had been engaged in the con- struction of most of the railroads in the north of England, gave similar evidence, and stated his opinion that in many important points of comparison the Vignolles' line was superior in engineering merits to the South-Western. Mr. Finch, from the office of Mr. Stephenson, put in voluminous details of the population along the line. Mr. Miller, civil engineer, gave evidence of precisely the same character, and equally favourable to this line. The cross-examination elicited nothing material. Mr. Thornton, an extensive contractor, had surveyed the whole of the propoged line, with a view to contracting for the works. He had examined the subsoil in all those parts where any supposed difficulty existed with respect to the foundations of ♦iaducts, &c., and he found that there was no difficulty throughout the line which would raise the expense higher than Mr. Vignolles had estimated. He had offered to take the whole of the works at Air. Vignolles' prices, and he was now in negotiation for the con tract with the Company on those prices. Mr. Miller, in answer to the Chairmain said, that the Paisley and Glasgow Railway having to compete with a very excellent water carriage upon the Clyde, was consequently not very remu nerative. Mr. Tite, the president of the Architectural Society, and archi. tect of the Royal Exchange, was examined, to prove that the value of the land would not exceed the estimate of Mr. Vignolles, which was about 215,0001. Hr. Locke, civil engineer, was also examined, but his evidence was again substantially no more than a corroboration of the pre vious engineering testimony in favour of the North Kent line. He considered that the line was very fortunate indeed in having but one crossing on a level. Mr. B. Sherwood, a contractor for railway works—Had had considerable employment and experience in the construction of works upon railways in France and England. He had examined the schedules of Mr. Vignolles, and would be very happy to take the contract for all the works at the prices of those schedules. Mr. MERREWETHER, in cross-examination of the witness, re quested to see the schedule of prices at which he (Mr. Sherwood) was willing to take the contract. To this there was some opposi tion, which gave rise to a somewhat angry discussion. The docu ment was ultimately put in, and was found to correspond correctly with the schedules already before the Committee. The Committee then adjourned till twelve o'clock to.morrow. GROUP AA. '7.HE GREAT SOUTHERN AND WESTERN (IRELAND). This Commttee met at twelve o'clock, Mr. Hindley in the chair. Sir John M`Neill's examination went to show that there was no engineering difficulty in the line. The cost would not exceed that from Dublin to Thurles, in the county of Tipperary. The cost of the line would not be increased, except in bad weather ; an addi tional engine would be then required. The cost of the entire branch would amount to one million, forty.seven thousand, and ninety.two pounds. Several clauses were passed. The Committee cleared the room nn a clause of Sergeant Murphy's in favour of the corporation of Cork, which was rejected, the standing orders not being complied with. GROUP 88. DUBLIN, WEXFORD, AND CARLOW RAILWAY. The Committee met to-day at the usual hour, and resumed the examination of witnesses. Mr. Cololuhoun, chairman. Sir John MiNiell cross-examined—He had prepared a table re. quested by Mr. Alexander the previous evening, respecting the cuttings and embankments, whieh he now handed in. He had yes te, day said that the whole construction of the line would be for a double line, except the laying down of the rails, but he begged to correct this. The viaducts, bridges, and land would only be con structed for a double line. The cuttings and embankments would only be for a single line. At any future period, if a double line of rails was to be laid down, and additional cutting and embanking, there would be no difficu:ty in doing this, as it hid been done by him on the Coitness Railway. The iatttr was tell miles. The gauge of the line was to be similar to what was already generally used in Ireland. The engines wculd be about sixteen tons, and the tender six tone, twenty-two tons in all. He had made his esti mate for rails at 71, per to,. The price was now about 91. 10s. A month ago it was as much as 121. He did not think iron rails could be delivered at present for less than 91. Bs., as the freight and delivery would be about Bs. per ton. He had set apart n part of the estimates for improving the harbour of Wexford. He had, however, framed a plan for the improvement of the harbour, and he had no doubt it would be carried into effect. At present, vessels drawing nine feet of water could be admitted, and of a ton nage from 100 to 200. He had no doubt that a vessel of 200 tons could be water borne in the harbour at low water. The water over the bar was about eleven feet at high water, and six or seven feet at low water. The harbour was a large estuary inside of the bar. The line passed on a level a hundred feet above the quay of Ennis. corthy. Thetown of Enniscorthy was built on the side of a hill. The distance from the station to the quay was 2,400 feet. The corn market was about half-way between the two. Mr. Jeffers was examined as to the ascents and descents of the has, which be described as of a much more favourable character than those on the coast or opposition line. Mr. Carr put In the traffic tables, founded upon the evidence already given. Mr. Carr, Deputy_ Chairman of the Great Southern and Western Railway, and Mr. Waddy, the Parliamentary agent, were briefly examined upen the case for the projectors of this line. The Committee then adjourned till to-morrow at twelve o'clock, when the case for the opposition to a coast line will be gone into. GROUP DD. IMPORTANT DECISION. THE CALEDONIAN, THE GLASGOW, DIME. PRIES AND CARLISLE RAILWAY. The Committee re-assembled this morning at twelve o'clock, and shortly after proceeded to the consideration of the proposed new branch from the Dumfries line through the Delvine Pass. Mr. HILDVARD called on Mr. Miller, the engineer, to explain to the Committee the nature and route of the intended branch. He exhibited a plan and section of the proposed line, and explained to the Committee the course of the branch. The survey had been made in a couple of days, and if longer time were allowed a more correct and a better line would be obtained, and he had no doubt that by extending the point of separation further south a more fa vourable gradient might be obtained. There was a gradient of 1 in 75 in a tunnel of two miles in length. It was pro. posed to deviate from the Dumfries line a little to the north of Carron.bridge, and carry its termination to a place called Elvine Foot. The distance between these two points was 15 miles, and of that portion there was a plane of 51 miles long, on a gradient of I in 75, and another plane of 4 miles in length, where there was a gradient of 1 in 90, which no doubt could be improved to 1 in 100, by carrying the point of departure farther south. There would be also a tunnel 2 miles long through the rock, the strata of which was composed of greywhacke. He had estimated the c,,st of the tunnel at 401. per yard, and considered it a fair value. The total cost of the tunnel would be 140,0001. Comparing the proposed branch with a similar length on the Cale dotian line, on the south side the gradient would be as 1 in 70, 1 in 75, lin 80, and lin 100. On the north side they would be as lin 150, and 1 in 100. There would be curves at each end of the tunnel, averaging from half a mile to a mile in radius, and neither of these would be objectionable in a tunnel with a double line. If more time for further inspection of the locality were given, a shorter line, arid a less curved tunnel, could be obtained, and it would n - it be necessary to introduce more severe gradients. Neither would the execution of the works take up more time. He hasL no doubt, from his experience as an engineer, that an easier line might be obtained if more time were given. The whole estimate of the expense of executing the 15 miles of railway through the pass was :315,0001. It appeared that the saving, in point of expense, as compared with the construction of that por tion of the Caledonian line extending from Elvan-foot to Carlisle, taking the proportion of Mr. Locke's estimates, amounted to 512,000/. Oa cros:,:xamination by Mr. CocitauaN, Mr. Miller Said he had instructed Mr. Blythe to make a survey of the Deivine-pass last week. A iurvey of the 410, ad had been executed last year, but the section was confined to the turnpike road through the pass. He had not given this up in despair, and he should pre.f , r it it I.e had the choice of a line to Edinburgh. The -a i,gina, gradient had been 1 in 70, but it had sub cquently been altered to 1 in 75. The height of the mountain through which the tunnel passed was 1,150 feet above the level of the sea, and is the highest summit on the line. In reply to a question by Mr. HILDYARD, the witness said that additional distance on the proposed branch, as compared ,Ith the dis_ tance between Carlisle and Elvanfoot, was from nine to ten miles. Mr. Blythe stated he had proposed the plans and sections which Mr. Miller had explained to the Committee, and perfectly agreed with Mr. Miller as to the practicability of making the proposed branch, but thought that it was susceptible of improvement. Mr. COCKBURN then called Mr. Locke, the engineer for the Caledonian line, to give evidence. He said he had sent down several gentlemen last s iek to survey the pass, and read a letter of instructions which he had transmitted for their guidance in making the surveys from which it appeared they were not to confine their investigations to the line already made out, but to examine generally the district, and to make aliewances for having engineering works. A distance of 10 miles in the direct line would be lost by taking the branch through the Delvine.pass, and there would be several other strin. gent objections to the scheme. One of the principal disadvantages, as compared with the Caledonian line, was the necessity of having a tunnel. He considered the curves in the tunnel were highly objectionable, and taking also the circumstance of the gradient being 1 in 75 into view, there was no doubt this passage through the tunnel would be attended with great inconvenience, if not with danger. He was of opinion that the tunnelling could not be executed for less than 501. per yard. The increased ex pense of working the line the whole distance to Edinburgh would be ten per cent. The proposed detour would not, in his opinion, afford any corresponding advantages to the great inconvenience and expense that would be. incurred, and would destroy the objects of the Caledonian Railway as a direct trunk line into Scotland. Mr. Foster, mining engineer, deposed that he had had consi derable experience in mining affairs, and was satisfied, from the p tb ec e neliear nature of the strat a th roug h w hi c h t h e propose d tunne l i n lvine would pass, that its construction could not be estimated at less than 601. per yard. Mr. 1 1`Phee, who had surveyed the intended branch, entirely corroborated Mr. Locke's evidence. Mr. Pare was then called to show the influence which the con. struction of the Delvine branch would have on the general traffic of the trunk line. The evidence on both sides having b een c l osed, The Cnsiitmee said he had been desired by the Committee to state, as the pre,ent inquiry had b een ma d e to afford them sum_ cient informati..n in arriving at that r t h e h y , wished to expr ess their satisfactiond steproper at the decision, Creditable either which the engi neers on either that had h been conducted their su rveys, and at the ready evinced by the diffe rent competing parties in falling in with the views entertained by the Committee. Mr. HILDYARD then proceeded toaddreescthe Committ ee on be oiany. It wa s ob jected the Edinburgh and Glasgow Railway on their behalf that th e f orks on the Caledonian line had been carried farther north in th e i r point of divergence been contemplated by the Com m i ss i oners appointed for Ole purpose alone of interferin g w i t h the traffic on Government than had on trheernEredeiln't burgh and Glasgow Railway. It wou ld b e recollected that the - dividends on that line since its construction did not ave rage more than five per cent., and it would also be remembered by the Committee that the Union Canal Company had been appointed carriers to compete with it. Two alterations had been proposed by the parties for whom he appeared, which consisted in the formation of a junction at Croy and another at Ratho, and it had been intimated by the Committee that this was a good arrangement. Looking also at the differential arguments as between the Caledonian and the Dumfries Railways it would be recollected by the Committee that a line had al. reedy been laid down to Kilmarnock and Dalkeith—that a Bill for making a line to Hawick would be read a third time this very day. The preamble for making a railway from Kilmarnock to Cumnock had been passed; it could not in his opinion be pos- I Bible for the Committee to entertain any doubt that the distances i between Hawich and Carlisle and Cunnisok and C4rliale must I necessarily in a very short period be connected together. As re opected the effect of e line through the Delvinelaso, it Wu evident • respect to what had fallen from Mr. Walker, who had gone some little out of his way in eulogising the conduct of the London and Birmingham Company, for their punctuality in de. livery and their willingness to accornmodatethe public ? Now, what said Mr. Huish in support of the complaint against the London and Birmingham Company ?—why, that that Company had refused to regulate their tolls in conformity with the wishes of the Grand Junction Comp..ny. Now, why should this be the grounds of acorn plaint against his clients ? and this was brought as an argument in favour of competition. The London and Birmingham Company came before the House offering to make a trunk line, and by so doing they were setting an example to the other great railway companies in the kingdom. If the Honourable Chairman and the other Honourable Members of the Committee were in the habit of sitting on Canal Committees, they would find the London and Birmingham Railway Company were now offering to carry out, though not compelled, the wishes of the Legislature in railway extension. The ques tion of competition, sor as he should say, the question of rivalry, did arise in the present case, and it was for the Committee to decide which of the two lines would be of most advantage to the public. In his opening speech he laid bare the whole subject—he pointed out the gr,•at advantages that would result to the large tract of country through which the London and Birmingham line would run. His arguments on these grounds were not refuted by any of the arguments advanced the day before by his Learned Friend. True, he talked much of competition. The competition talked of by Mr. Cockburn would in effect!)e this, that it would enable the stronger company to demand terms which it would not be for the interest of the public, because it would not be for the interest of the smaller company, to accept. For instance, in the case of the broad gauge being laid down to Liverpool, the Grand Junction would be enabled to demand terms from the London and Bir mingham Company which it would not be for the interest of that Company, to accept, and upon the terms being rejected the result would be, that blow trains would be placed on the narrow gauge rails to Liverpool with quick trains upon the broad gauge. That would be the effect of the competition talked of by the other side. The Grand Junction Company, in complain ing before the Committee of the London and Birming ham, would make it out that they had no interest in the carrying the Great Western scheme. How was this proved ? Was it by purchasing the Crewe and Chester and the Crewe and Man chester line, and then whipping up their fares after they had got the traffic into their hands ? They had raised their tolls and charges after getting this line into their hands; and so also would the Great Western, if they were fortu. nate enough to get this line; and they would then be acting in conjunction with the Grand Junction Company. This was a pretty example of the competition so much talked of. Much had been adduced on the other side about the line to Holyhead or Portdynllaen, so as to fom a station for the connexion with Ireland. It was an argument of no weight; it was an argument fully answered by the already ex isting line to Holyhead. The Government proved by the contract with the Chester and Holyhead Company that the advantages spoken of by the Learned Counsel for the Great Western Company were of no consideration, in fact of no available benefit to the connexion with Ireland. They had amply proved it by entering into two contracts with the existing line to Holyhead —one for seven years and one for five years. Would Government enter into such contracts for the conveyance of the mails, which was a matter of the greatest consequence? The arguments for this scheme of connecting the county by a nearer communication provided, said a few of his Learned Friend's witnesses, that it would be found that Portdytillaen was nearer to a part of Ire land than Holyhead. Here was the subject of the North Wales line left in Juturo, all depending on contingencies —one of those contingencies being the carrying of the line tow under consi deration. It was well to suppose that such contingencies would act very much in their favour with the Committee, because an important portion of their good intentions hinged upon the result of this inquiry. He was sure the luring argument s regar di ng thi s _ . connexion with Ireland wou'd have no weight with the Right Hon. Chairman, nor with any Hon. Member of the Committee. The result of the inquiry would be, he felt satisfied, on the merits of the question. It was sought to make it appear that this North Wales line was an object of national importance. If it were, indeed, an object of national importance to make Port dyullaen a packet station for communication with the sister country, let the Government take it up, and pay the ex penses of the scheme out of the public funds. But it was not to be supposed that the Committee would allow the Great Western Com pany to carry out their intentions, however theoretically valuable in their minds, at the expense of the people of Worcester. Let rot the people of Worcester be plundered by the scheme, but, as he said before, let the national object be carried ont by those who had the interests of the nation really at heart. The Learned Counsel then remarked that the traffic on the North Wales line would never pay the Great Western nor any other Company. With regard to the difference of gauge and the superiority of the broad gauge engines over the narrow, it had been proved by Mr. Stephenson, the very first engineer of - this country, that there were engines on the London and Birmingham line which, in point of speed, equalled the broad gauge engines. The Learned Counsel then went into the engineering merits of the line, and concluded by calling on the Committee to reject the scheme for the Great Western Company, and declare the preamble of the Bill for the London and Birmingham Com pany proved. The room was then cleared, and after some time occupied In deliberati,,n, it was announced to the parties that the decision would be given at twelve o'clock to morrow. The Committee then adjourned, GROUP FF. THE EDINBURGH AND NORTHERN naxLway. The Select Committee en this group re-assembled this morning at twelve o'clock, when the general evidence in favour of the Edin. burgh and Northern Railway was proceeded with. Mr. Machray, an extensive coach proprietor, residing in Aber deen, said an arrangement had lately been come to between the mail contractors and the Pust•ofice for carrying the mails to Perth by way:of Fife and Burntisland instead of by way of Queensterry. He had a share in the Defiance coach, running from Edinburgh to Perth. The road taken by that coach had lately been changed from Queensferry to Burntisland, and the result of this change had proved highly successful—indeed, it had had the effsct of in. creasing the traffic by 1,6381. On cross-examination, the witness said that the route of the De fiance coach had been changed from Queensferry to Burntisland, not because it was the best road to Perth, but because it was the best paying road to Dundee. The Defiance did not now run to Dundee. Captain Berkeley, the celebrated pedestrian, and an extensive faliner at Alladyce, proved that the greater quantity of cattle wassent from Aberdeen to Edinburgh by steamboat, by way of Granton pier, and thence by land. The journey at present occu. pied three days. Considerable inconvenience was occasioned by embarking the cattle at Aberdeen ; but if there was a railway, of course all these difficulties would be removed, and the journey would be reduced to seven or eight hours. Like the last witness, he was one of the proprietors of the Defiance coach, which was first started in 1829. In March last the route of the coach was changed from Queensferry to Burntisland, and since the change the coach had paid better than ever it did before. The coach was ferried across Burntisland without any difficulty. On cross-examination, he admitted that the direct through route from Edinburgh to Perth was by way of Queensferry, but it was much more favourable for a coach or a railway to run by way of Burntisland, because the traffic by that route was considerably greater than by way of Queensferry. Mr. Melville, a landed proprietor in Fifeshire, said the majority of the inhabitants of that county, which is one of the most popu. lous in Scotland, were decidedly in favour of this raiway, and for his own part he thought it would afford more advantage to th• north of Scotland than any other contemplated or suggested line. The line would be injurious to his property, but nevertheless he preferred it "for a' that." Mr. Marshall, an accountant at Edinburgh, proved that the ag gregate amount of population on or near to the whole line was— towns, 303,645 ; counties, 966,980 and parishes, 74,401. Mr. It. Barlis, an experienced land valuer and factor, proved that the value of he land to be taken and permanently occupied by the railway was 40,017/. 2s. Id. The sewerage land would cost 5,4521. Is, Sd. The estimated damage which would be done to houses and buildings on the line would be 8,4761 and the value of the growing wood on the line, which had nearly arrived at maturity, he estimated at 975/. 18s. 2d. He estimated the temporary damage which would be done to property adjacent to the line a: 5,4911, 10s. ld. The remainder of the day was occupied with the cross.examina tion of Mr. Gardner, the engineer, whose evidence in chief was givenyeAerday. This witness was cross-examined at great length by Mr. Sergeant WRANGIIIM, with the apparent object of showing the Committee that the line would:materially interfere with the residential mansions and domains of sever , ' of the nobility and gentry living in the 0 aghbeurhood of the railway. The Committee adjourned shortly after four o'clock till to morrow. GROUP OG. SCOTCH RAILWAYS. GLASGOIXT TAICT. This Committee met today, for the first time, in the Sessions Court, Guildhall, Westminster, Mr. Evans in the chair ; with whom were Mr. Newdegate, Mr. Miles, Mr. untz, and Lord Grimston. There were seven Bills to be considered. Of these two were withdrawn—the Greenock branch, and the Glasgow, Dunbarton, and Lech Lomond lines. The Glasgow, Garnkirk, and Coutbridge line, together with the Monkland and Kirkintn , lach line were unoppo►ed. The Committee took the latter first ; and the preamble having been agreed to, and the clauses gone through seriatim, they re. solved to report it to toe House. The Committee then took the Glasgow, Garnkirk, and Cant bridge line, which being also unopposed, was passed and ordered to be reported, as was a brancd of the Glasgow, Kilmarnock, and Ayr linejextending to Cumnock—a total distance of eighteen miles, at an estimate of 350,0001. GLASGOW JUNCTION RAILWAY. Mr. Sergeant ANDREws then opened this case for the promoters of the Bill. He described the object of the projectors as being in tended to connect the Edinburgh and Glasgow Railway on the north side of the Clyde at Glasgow with the Glasgow, Kilmarnock and Ayr on the south side. The extent of the intended line was only a mile, and he would briefly describe that portion of the city of Glas gow through which it passed. The Learned Counsel then ex. plained that the lice was intended to pass through the_ town by tunnelling, and in some cases on piers, and it was proposed to cross the Cl 5 de at a point immediately above the shipping station. There were many opponents to the Bill, but he hoped that none of their objections would be found of a serious description. Mr. Thomas Phillips, of Leith, w,, then called to prove the advantages of the proposed line. His examination was just corn. menced when the Committee adjourned till to.morrow. GROUP K. DIRECT NORWICH LINE. The Committee on this line resumed their sittings this morning at the usual hour, Viscount Sandon in the chair. Sir John Rennie examined by Mr. LEE—IS engineer engaged in the construction of the Direct Norwich line between Bury and h e tTfohreds station n ßury l will l b be be t twelve Bishop milesS t o andtf or d t . hreTehfeurllionnegsbientwleenen Thetford Brisby-gate, on the Bury highroad, on a level with a small street connected with that road. At Thetford the terminus be at the east side of the C roc k s t one roa d. The steepest gradient is one in a hundred for a short distance. The highest embank ment is forty-six feet, crossing the valley of the Larke about 4 furlongs ; th e d eepes t cutt i ng i s 32 feet, extending only, 3 furlongs ; the extent of earthwork will be 993,335 cubic yards, at a cost of 56,6731.; there will be '22 bridges required, and 3 viaducts, the latter at an expense of 30,6241. ; the permanent way will amount to 59,679/. ; the fencing 5,4191. ; and contin gencies, estimated at 10 per cent., 17.2991. Ss., making a gross total of 1 90,1721. A single line of rail would cost 27,6001. less than the preceding estimate of 190,172/. A junctien could with great facility be made with the Bury and Ipswich line. Cross.exarnincd by Mr. WHATELEY, Q.C.—To effect the junc tion with the Bury and Ipswich line, a slight alteration in the level, and a further length of lin e b ac k would be necessary, for the purpose of making the viaducts, by sinking piles of fifty feet, and jectionabl e; thus making the ba se, now very inferior, good and Unob aabi v e m e s b e a v n e k n m t y e ifiet.et high.O nth e ruGhreeaet. p‘Ae'nesseteorfnr rails will l y b e t h l e o r is r t o o n n e the feet I s not a very great height for included in Mr. P e t o ' s contract The slopes are I to i, p c e vholl; dnobjcctionable, considering the nature of the country. Richard Till, examined by Mr. GIRDEN—Is Secretary of the Norwich and Brandon and Yarmouth and Norwich lines, n amalgamated. These co m p an i ts have been authorised by ' the sanction of their Directors to lease the Thetford and Bury line, if constructed—four per cent, and a share in the profits being, as usual, the terms. A formal recapitulation of Sir Jchn Rennie's evidence was than given to prove ccindliance with the standitsg orders, and contirma.. lion of the traffic, distance, and time tables made, and the Com mittee adjourn 4 GROUP KK. LIVERPOOL AND DUET LINE. The Committee resumed at the usual hour, whereupon Sir C. Lemon, the Chairman, on behalf of his colleagues, expressed im patience at the continuation of the line of evidence wl.ich had been pursued on the previous day respecting the same facts. Mr. TALPOT said it was quite as painful to Counsel as to the Committee to examine witnesses to the same facts, but as the other side disputed the amount of traffic he had no alternative. The CIIIAIRMA N said the Committee had no objection whatever to hear all evidence which could be in any degree necessary, but he hoped Counsel would use discretion in apportioning the evi. deuce. The Committee were, of course, willing to undergo any amount of labour, and were only anxious for the saving of time. Mr. Chandler, a butcher in Bolton, who had lived there for the last 30 years, said he represented the opinions of that class of tradesmen there. The amount of meat brought from Liver pool to Bolton annually, was as follows :—Fat cattle, 2,600 ; sheep, 5,200; lambs, 2,600 ; fat pigs, 5,100; horses, about 1,000 ; lean cows, 2,000; lean pigs, 3,000. The cattle were generally driven from one place to the other at present, by which the meat suffered great injury. This witness highly approved of the pro jected line, which he considered would be very advantageous to Bolton. There was an equal trade with the easterly towns of Wakefield, Skepton, Gi‘horne, and other i,laces collectively. Mr. Ilenry Ashworth, a cotton spinner, residing at Turton, near Bolton, and a magistrate, stated that he employed 1,000 hands. The people of Bolton were very anxious for the projected line, and he had been deputed at a public meeting of the people of Bolton to express their opinions in favour of the line. The prin cipal business of Bolton was engrossed by half a dozen trades, whose traffic he would mention. He would mention the amount of traffic from Liverpool to Bolton only. The cotton brought from Liver. pool to Bolton was 11,698:t0n5; materials for bleachers, 8,831 tons; China clay, 1,200 tons; metal used by iron -founders, 19,404 tons; timber, slates, and building materials, 14,000 tens ; groceries, 5,400 tons; flour and corn, 19,200 tons; oil, 840 tons; cattle, 2,900 tons—the total 83,373 tons. The cost of carriage varied at present from Bs. 3d. to 1 Is., and would average 10s. 2d. per ton. The total cost of carriage, therefore, was 42,5521. He had not spoken of the traffic of the paper-makers of Bolton, nor of the pas senger traffic, nor of numerous other articles which people use. The cost per ton by the projected line of railway would be at the maximum rate of 7s. 9d. per ton. The total saving would be 10,2451. The total amount of coal consumed by the mills at Bol ton yearly was 118,779 tons; the iron.founders annually, 31,381 tons; the bleachers and chemists, 189,987 tons; paper-makers, 12,000 tons; making a total of 352,177 tons of coal annually. The house coal consumed by the inhabitants of Bolton, who were about 100,000 in number, including the union, was 150,000 tons, allowing a ton and a half as the con sumption for each individual. The grand total of coal used an nually was 482,177 tons. The selling price of coal at the pit's mouth was Sc. Bd. per ton. If the proposed line of railway were carried out, Wigan coals could be had for 4s. 3d. per ten, and they were 21 per cent- better than the Bolton. The saving to Bolton from the opening of the projected line and of the Wigan coal-pits would be 30,136/., and then adding the 21 per cent, for better quality, which was 22,7691., the whole saving would be 52,9051. The sum total of saving on traffic would be more than 10,0001. The sum total of saving to the inhabitants of Bolton by the pro jected line would be 63,0001. Ther e was great delay in the present postal arrangement, and not sufficient communication between Bolton and Liverpool. The projected line would afford a remedy in this respect. Bolton was about thirty miles distant from Liver. pool and twelve from Wigan. This witness was cross-examined at great length by Mr. Su E, counsel for Lord Francis Egerton, but his direct testimony was in no degree shaken. Mr. Asuivoarn gave evidence on his direct examination, show. ing that frequent delay had occurred on the Liverpool and Man. chester line, so that his goods were often detained four or even six days ty the railway, and he was consequently subjected to great losses. Sometimes his machinery was idle, waiting for his goods, when he wished to execute large continental orders, in which dis patch was of the last importance. Mr. George Gordon, land agent at Bury, was well acquainted with the Liverpool and Bury line, all the way from Wigan to Rochdale. A considerable quantity of hemp and twist were sent from Bolton and Bury to Wigan fur manufacture. The people of Stand sent cotton to Wigan to be woven. Bury obtained most of its provisions from the Bolton market. The cost of travelling from Bury to Wigan at present was 6s. 6d., and occupied two hours and a half. The distance was thirty miles by the present mode of communication—by the road it was only seventeen miles. A great number of people go upon pleasure excursions at Whitsun tide from Bury to Bolton, 3,000 or 4,000 a week. Here the Chairman of the Committee left to give evidence upon another railway Committee. Upon his return the witness proceeded to state that with a cheap railway intercourse the third_class passengers between Bury, Bolton, and Wigan would be immense. Approved of the projected line. Bury was a very thriving place. The amount of raw ma terial imported from Liverpool to Bury was 41,778 tons, the carriage of which was 22,7981. Bs. at the present rate, which was I Is. per ton. The coat of carriage by the projected line was Bs. 3d., so that there would be an annual saving to the town of Bury in this respect of 5,7441. 9s. 6d. When he spoke of Bury, he in. eluded a circle of three miles around it. The present price of coal at Bury varied from 10s. 2d. to ss. per ton ; at Wigan from ss. to 2s. The carriage by the projected line would be only Is. 6d. per ton, so that the difference would be saved to the people of Bury by the new lino. The works and domestic consumption in and about Bury would be 469,203 tons yearly, and the saving from using Wigan coal by the proposed line would be 16,9201. Esti mated that the new line would, in point of traffic, be an annual saving to the people of Pury in importing goods from Liverpool and coal from Wigan of 23,6901. ss. 9d. Mr. BRANDI' cross-examined the witness on behalf of Lord Francis Egerton, but nothing material was elicited. Mr. Walker, M.P. for Bury, had been a manufacturer of steam engines at Bury. There were five or six such works in Bury and its neighbourhood, as well as many large print-works. Considered the present line would be advantageous to Bury. The people of Bury were in favour of the projected line, and presented a petition on the previous evening in favour of the line, signed by 1,850 persons, comprising the most respectable of the inhabitants. Man chester was, however, the great absorbing market in that part of the country. Mr. Hutchinson, a cotton-spinner at Bury, gave evidence in favour of the projected line, but said nothing new or important, except that the postal arrangements between Liverpool and Bury were inefficient, and that the proposed line would remedy the Mr. W. Walker. a cotton manufacturer at Bury, and brother to the Member for Bury, confirmed the testimony of the last witness in every respect. Mr. Thomas Stetten, agent to Lord Denby—Knew the line of country through which the projected line would pass. Consi dered it would be highly advantageous to Bury and Wigan, as well as to the agriculturists near Bury, as it would enable them to obtain large quantities of the best lime and flag-stones. There was a dense population along the whole line, from Liverpool to Bury, The inhabitants of Bury were almost universally in favour of the line. Wakefield would be greatly benefited by the line, as the inhabitants were at present very badly supplied with coal. Mr. Maydon said the line would greatly benefit the Rossendale Valley, which was rather densely inhabited. Agreed with the for mer witnesses in the opinions they had expressed in favour of the line, and in their calculations generally. The Committee adjourned when this witness had concluded his evidence. GROUP L. PORTSMOUTH ATMOSPHERIC RAILWAY. The Committee resumed the inquiry this morning, Mr. E. B. Denison in the chair. Mr. Denny, a proprietor of East India ships, stated that a direct line to Portsmouth would be a great convenience in shipping their passengers, as the vessels of the firm to which he belonged all called at that place for that purpose. Mr. Chambers, a merchant at Portsmouth, testified to the charge for carriage by the South-Western Railway. His evidence con firmed that of the previous witnesses, with the addition that there was a less charge made to ceptains of ships than was made to other persons. By goods carrnd coastwise there was a charge of lgs. fid. a ton, while by railway they cost '2 s. 6d. a ton. To the cross-examination of Mr CI'ItNEV, the witness replied that a hogshead of s-g .r, R hicl, weighed 18 cwt., was sent ton (is. by water, but Ss. a ton by railway would be a sufficient iuuuce ment to send this sort of heavy goods by rail. On the re-examination by Mr. TALBOT, Mr. Chambers stated that there was a considerable delay in the carriage by water, and that the expenses in addition rendered a railway communication very desirable. Vice-Admiral Sir John Ommaney testified to the general feeling at Portsmouth, and the favourable nature cf the country proposed for the Atmospheric Railway. The population was considerable on the line, and there was now no coach for the accommodation of the public. On that line there tv zo the forest of Woolner, which had for merly been disforexted in consequence of the obstacles which existed to the carriage of the timber from or to Portsmouth. It had, how ever, lately been inclosed, and it would be very desirable to obtain a good means of access to the south, co that the timber that was grown there for the navy might be easily obtained_ He thought that it was very desirable that there should be a communication with Deptford and Chatham, and also along the coast from Dover to Plymouth, so as to give a facility for the conveyance of troops and artillery to any particular point. Major White, Town-major of Portsmouth for 22 years, whose business was to circulate the orders for the defence of the port_ He had had considerable experience in the removal of troops, es pecially during the war. One great instance, the arrival of the troops from Corunna, showed the inconvenience of the want of sufficient communication with the interior. Had they possessed railway communication at that time, the shipping would not have got in shore, and the men would have been moved into other quarters without the sickness and loss at ':lat time sustained To the examination of Mr. WADDINUTON, Major White replied that Portsmouth could not hold out long with its present garrison, but an increased garrison might be obtained by a railway along the coast. In the event of a descent by a hostile steam navy this convenience would be absolutely indispensable. There was a great want of conveyance for troops. During the com mand of Sir Hercules Pakenham there had been only one regiment moved from Chatham to Portsmouth, but there had been considerable communication with Winchester and Weedon, and he thought that the circulation of troops on the coast was about 16,000 a-year. It would be a great saving to be able to send troops by land. There was great delay at present in going round by the coast, he himself having when engaged in the expedition to Sicily been detained six weeks, and his family who were with the store ships were detained 17 weeks, the stores at that time being very much wanted in the Peninsular. Mr. Hoskins, formerly a merchant and now assistant tide-keeper at Portsmouth, testified to the utility of the London-bridge station, and the great convenience whioh the third-class trains would be to sailors paid off at the port. The mercantile intercourse had greatly decreased since the establishment of the railway to Southampton and the establishment of the docks. The Gosport branch had, in his opinion, been an injury rather than a benefit, and in his expo i. ence the Southampton line was the dearest and the worst in the kingdom. Before the competition the second.class carriages espe cially were of a very miserable description. The witness also gave testimony respecting the termini similar to that of all the other witnesses. The houses building at Landport would bear the comparison with those in course of erection at Portsca. On the whole he thought the atmospheric line passed through a district far superior to that through which the other line went. Mr. Wyse, Mr. T. Whyte, a ship.builder at Portsmouth, Mr. Prlng, Mr. Colebrook, and Mr. Russell all gave similar testimony as to the utility of the proposed line, and the facilities which it offered for the communication ',with the Isle of Wight, but there was nothing of any particular moment elicited, and the Committee was adjourned till twelve o'clock to-morrow. GROUP LL. THE LONDON AND SOUTH-WESTERN (METROPOLITAN EXTENSION). Mr. HILL opened, this morning, the case for the directors of this line of railway. The object of the promoters was to extend the line, the terminus of which was now at Nine-elms, to a point which would be equally distant from Water. 100, Hungerford, and Westininster.bridges. It would be of great benefit to the pnt , lic, and he considera that the directors of that railway had only in strict accordance with their duty in having laid this Bill on their table. Mr. Win. Reid was then called and examined in favour of the ex tension, by Mr. Saiinit E—He stated that he was lately the Managing Director of the Rout„ and Paris line of railway. He afterwards became Managing Director of the South-Western line, and was identified with it when it was first introduced into Parliament. As to the position of the present terminus the disadvan. tagea were :very great, in c onsequence o f i ts great distance from hawse. When it was, on a former occasion, sought to cobtain the sanct i on of the Legislature for this extension it was refused, because railways were not then as well received as now, and it was n o t t h ought necessary to extend it, as it would in terfere with house property. It was desired by every Company, and generally supposed to be benetietal, further to extend all rail ways, the termini of which came .1 tc London. It was evident that passengers would receive great benefit from this extension to some place equallydistant from Waterloo, Hungerford, and Westminster.. bridges. The original terminus of the Birmingham Railway was at Camden.town, and it v 4 a , contemplated to bring it still nearer to London. On cross-examination by Mr. M. CHAMBERS, he said that he would recommend the plan to be carried out at the expense of one million of money, but he did not think it would be worth while to go to any further expense. The passengers from Wandsworth to town generally went by water. The witness was then examined as to the comparative expense of time and money of those men of busi. ness who travelled to town from that locality by omnibuses and by water, and those who would travel by the proposed extension. Mr. Burchard, a private gentleman, residing at Wandsworth, was then examined as to the public advantage that would arise from the extension of the present line to a terminus at a short dis tance from Hungerford, Waterloo, and Westminster-bridges. On cross-examination, his evidence was in no way shaken. ** ' Mr. Mangles was called, and stated, on examination, that it would be of immense advantage to the inhabitants of Guildford to be brought to a terminus as near London as possible. As to tolls there was a great inconvenience arising from turnpikes near Nine-elms, which it was necessary to keep in order to get to certain parts of the town from the present one. A terminus near Waterloo-bridge would be very favourable to the Dover and Kent Railways if it were hereafter found prac ticable to cross the river and make a central terminus at the other side, but, nevertheless, they would deriVe great advantage. After the witness was briefly cross-examined by Mr. MONTAGUS CIIANDERIA, the Committee rose GROUP N. CORNWALL ItAILWA.Y. The Committee assembled at the usual hour. Mr. Thomas, the only opponent to the proposed railway, was called and examined by his counsel, Mr. Rows—He said he was an engineer, and had resided all his life in Cornwall, and that he had great local knowledge of the county. He was well acquainted with the towns of Falmouth and Penryn, and had surveyed the comity with the view of constructing a railway from Falmouth by Penryn, the trade of which was considerable, towards Truro. He had taken the levels carefully. The extreme inclination would be one in sixty, and the extreme curve twenty chains radius. Following the curve of such a line to its destination, and, speaking from his perfect knowledge of the country through which it would pass, it would be far preferable to the coast line; the gradients were not steep, and the line might be constructed as cheap, as the proposed line would be four miles and a quarter shorter. Cross-examined by Mr. Sergeant KiteotAxE---Had made the Hayle Railway. Was fighting the public battle at his own ex pense. He did not expect to be repaid, but hoped he might be. Mr. Rendalls, civil engineer, said the floating bridge on the Hamoaze, from Tirpoint on the one side to Devonport on the other, was constructed by him, and that the plane on the Tirpeint aide was 1 in 8, whilst on the other it was easier, 1 in 10 or 1 in 12. The bridge was worked by two chains. The traffic was very great over the bridge in boat, and in stormy weather he had seen the sea dash over it. He was quite satis fied that, with some improvement, a railway train might be carried over on it with safety. Five piles might be erected at equal distances, on which a roadway might be placed, so that the trains conld run across on a level, and the boat could be drawn across between the piles with great precision. Of course, such a mode of transit would occupy much time, and could not be effected without much mechanical arrangement. The trains cou'd not be conveyed across in the boat in ten minntes. From four to six minutes would be necessary to get them on board, eight minutes to cross, and four to six minutes to land them. That would fairly represent the time which would be required for crossing the Hamoaze, the distance being half a mile. The delay and the expense of working this apparatus would be about equivalent to the expense of working fifteen or sixteen miles of a double locomotive line. With inspect to the safety of the electrical telegraph (which is to,be worked in an iron tube, placed at the bottcm of the Hamoaze), he conceived that ships dragging their anchors might get them fouled on tbetube and destroy the telegraph, By Mr. Sergeant KINGLAKE-Had seen the boat or bridge crowded with carriages, coaches, market-carts, &c. If a bridge were to be made over the Hamoaze, at Saltash, it would be a most expensive one, as it would cost from 100,0001. to 200,000/., and would have to be upwards of a hundred feet from the water that ships of 800 or 600 tons might pass under it, but he would not recommend the carrying of a railway over the Hamoaze, at Saltash. Mr. Joseph Locke, engineer to the South-Western Railway, examined by Mr. Rowe—Considered that the line could not be worked in some places as a double locomotive line with precision, economy, nor safety. It was unquestionably the most dangerous line he had ever seen. He was ignorant of the county, and gave his opinion on the sections which had been submitted to him. At Penryn the gradient was 1 in 40 for two miles, and at some places there were radii of 15 and 17 chains. On such gradients as those, and on such sharp curves, thirty miles an hour could not be worked with safety to those in the trains or to whatever was in them. The gradients going up from the water to Eldad were 1 in 29 and )in 30. A floating-bridge could not be otherwise than a most inconvenient thing on a railway, and he would rather go miles round than cross a river in such a way. The dividing of the train would occupy from five to ten minutes at least, and the loss of time in accomplishing the whole passage would occupy half an hour, measuring it by railway time. By Mr. Sergeant KINGLAHE—Never was over the ferry as a consulting engineer to one of the proposed Cornwall railways. Mr. Robert Stevenson, C.E., considered that the line could not be worked with any regularity from the irregular nature of the inclines. Gradients only used on extreme occasions by engineers were repeated on the line over and over again, and trains could not go with safety at a greater speed than twelve miles an hour. He was opposed to the line passing the Hamoaee, as proposed, and would rather carry a line fifteen miles in another direction than cross it. The central line did not contain the irregularities he had specified in the coast line. No greater speed could be safely attained on an incline of 1 in 60 than fifteen miles an hour. Mr. Bidder, C.E., corroborated a great portion Of the preceding evidence. Captain Plumridge, M.P. for Falmouth, was of opinion that the carrying of a railway by a draw-bridge across Penryn creek would offer great obstacles to the navigation. Trains would most likely be running over at high water, when it was necessary that the ships should pass on their route without delay. The construction of their terminus on the Mylor side, in the event of the Ordnance refusing their consent to the bridge, would also offer an obstruction to the navigation. His constituents were averse to both. The Coternittee then adjourned. GROUP R. The Committee met to-day at twelve o'clock ; Mr. Gibson Craig in the chair. The CHAIRMAN inquired what witnesses were to be examined against that portion of the Belfast Junction proposed to be formed from Drogheda to Kells 7 Mr. MiLLEY, who appeared for the Great North. Western pro ject, intimated that the only witness he had to bring before them was Mr. Cubitt, the engineer. The CHAIRMAN said, the Committee were of opinion that the evidence already given before them was quite sufficient to decide their minds. aavnues Ke:18. The room was then cleared; and, on o ur re t urn, The CuatassaN intimated that th e C ommittee had decided that the preamble of the Belfast Junctio n was proved, as far as it re lated to the line between Dro g h ed K a e a li n s bl a P s or fa ta r d a o s w ic ri, av a a n n d , to the out that portio n o f th e b ranch pse h eir r gon a bp : eto c ds h me dt p en r teb o : y p bs o bte s hn e fer d otrc f m r oo o ef, i nd n mt fbrieot tne: ee r alDroghedaev, n tos proposed. Th e li ne t h us as_ __......,. . . Mr. Murphy then proposed to the Committee that, in the event of steps not being taken to form the inland line from Dublin to Armagh, during the present session, thatppoortwtoenrsosfhtohueldbbreanrceisterlvinede against entertaining the proposition. . proceededitlosforntothheear the case of Mr. Smith, pen b s y a t t i h o e n r 3 fo i i r w a d y a7 damage but, that afte r was te omitted,i n TT hh the: Belfast Committee Committee from tda h e,tecnti doedK Bill e ttytee decided that there was no g o r f oi, D m r i o r g , l , i r e t d h a e , e i i n Th r n eg se a t rt i l ipc t i o )obrmoy c p T lrjr. smith. hearingalleged t o o t. b e r e i d ti , i e e e : to h h e i s It was at this ,tage of the binitiess suggested that, before going further, the Cronioittee had better o into the subject of the agree ment entered into betoters Sir lihn NPNeill nod Sir John Rennie, and referred to in a former report. The agree ment, according to the statement of Counsel for the Bcl. as far as the standing orders fast Junction, was only to bind that Company not to oppose the iy e l c oa d f ings in Parliament. Counsel for the latter was, both engineers, the Committee wt N he e aAr vi, te ' firterhaandde concernedreference Enniskillen, eh eto: statement aaa a tls n el ntt bh v eee :c ptr e oo t p , f c ci decided thut they did not tink the agreement extended further than the suspension of opposition in regard to the Standing Orders Committee. The CHAIRIIAN said that if these two Companies could not come to an arrangement before the meeting of the Committee to-morrow, they would proceed with the Dundalk and Ennis killen line. -• The Committee then adjourned till to-morrow at twelve o'clock, GROUP S. Thi s c orm ittes reassembled this morning at twelve o'clock. Mr. S. Wortley in the chair. LONDONDERRY AND COLERAINE RAILWAY. The Committee passed the clauses in this Bill, which was ordered to be reported. This was the only Bill remaining before the Committee. The Committee adjourned early. GROUP SS. The Select Committee on this group re-assembled at the usual hour this morning, and proceeded with the engineering evidence in the case for the promoters of the COVENTRY,I3EDVVORTN, AND NUNZATON RAILWAY. The examination of Mr. Addison, the engineer to the Company, was resumed by Mr. MAKAULUY. The principal details of his evidence were given yesterday. His testimony this morning was of a general nr ture, and only went to show the proposed line was the best that could possibly be marked out. The witness was cross-examined at some length by Mr. DANIEL, with a view of showing that the progress of the line would inter fere with a place ca:led Gosford-green, where the poorer inhabitants of Coventry resort for exercise and recrea tion. The witness admitted that the line would pass through the green on an embankment of from 9 to 10 feet in height, but there was a more important resort of the poor of Coventry, called Friar's.green, which would not be interfered with, although it was near to the station of the proposed railway. The witness admitted that there was a succession of three curves on the line within a mile and a half of the station, but as they were on a branch, and not a main line, they were in no wise objection. able. The line passed near to but not through, a place called Stoak-green and Stoak-heath. He was not aware whether the inhabitants of Coventry had a right of common on these places, nor was he aware that cattle strayed uninterruptedly from the Heath to the Green. The line would certainly pass through Barrow's-green but the deviation line would not in the least affect Stoak-green. He had heard, but was not aware of his own knowledge, that there was a right of pasturage on these greens, but in whom the right was vested he did not know. He proposed to protect Barrow's -green by a gate and a man, and there would, consequently, be no obstruction to the pro gress of the cattle from the Green to the Heath. The deviation line commenced at the junction on the Birmingham line, and ex tended to a place called Stoak, a distance of about a mile and a quarter. This deviation had been marked out to meet the views of the Corporation of Coventry, who objected to the original line. On one part of the li ne i n the eighbourhood the land had sunk 14 feet, but he was not aware that it was still sinking. Every precaution, however, would be taken against contingencies of this nature. The witness was cross-examined by sir. SPARKESON, on behalf of the London and Birmingham Company, with a view of showing that the line originated with himself, and not with any persons re sident in the district through which the line will pass. He said he had never constructed a railway under his own sole and imme diate superintendence, but had frequently and repeatedly acted as a sub.engineer. He admitted being the engineer to three new schemes coming before Parliament next session. The cross-examination had not terminated when the Committee adjourned. GROUP W. BRAYTON AND GOOLE RAILWAY. The Committee on this line reassembled to-day at twelve o'clock Present—Mr. Pakington (in the chair), Lord Seymour, Mr. Max well, Mr. Bouverie, and Mr. Whitmore. The examination of Mr. Arthur Maude was then resumed— Knew most of the persons at Goole who signed a petition in favour of the proposed line. They were all respectable persons. Many of them signed the petition after they knew that Mr. Hudson had leased the Hull and Selby line. The CLUIVAN tald that he would like to ascertain, previous to the erass-.examination of this witness, what course the promoters of the line intended to adopt with regard to the additional evidence they would bring forward. He did not wish to be understood as prescribing or dictating to the Di>arned Counsel the course proper for them to adopt, but if he might be permitted to say so at this stage of the proceedings, he considered that the direct examination of the last witness served the competing line (the Pon tefract and Goole line) as much as the proposed one (the Brayton and Goole). Mr. PICKEI,ANG begged to know why the Chairman entertained that opinion ? The CHAIRMAN said, that from the evidence given yesterday by the witness, it appeared that the principal traffic he referred to was sugar—that he sent annually 1,900 tons to Yorkshire, Leeds and Bradford. Of that quantity he stated that only 100 tons went to Leeds, and 150 tons to Bradford—the rest went to Halifax and Huddersfield. Now the Pontefract and Goole line was, in his opi. nion, as much served as the proposed line, for the difference be tween the two as to gradients and distance, according to the evi. dence they had yet heard, was, in all these points, as favour. able a line for the conveyance of the traffic referred to. Mr. KNowLes said that he was prepared to prove that the Brayton and Goole line was In every respect superior, more convenient, and would afford greater accommodation to the in-. habitants of Goole. It would also open up the large collieries, & c Mr. George Hammond, a flax-spinner, at Leeds, was then ex. amincd. He imported flax largely from the ports of the Baltic, Belgium, and France. All his flax came to Hull. The cost from Hul , to Leeds was 6s. Bd. per ton. If the proposed line were laid down, and the same rates charged for the conveyance of flex as on other hnes, the saving in carriage would be 2s. 6d. per ton from Goole. By Mr. Witaiins— Was a shareholder in the Midland ounties. Mr. Rand was a worsted spinner end manufacturer at Bradford. Employed 1,600 banes in his business. Imported 4,000 bales of wool from Germany and other places. The cost of the carriage of the colonial wool bought in the London market, by canal to Leeds,was Is. 6d. per cwt., or sOs. a ton. This witness went on to say how much _ _ more convenient it would be for him, as well as cheaper, if the proposed line ware laid down, by enabling him to bring his colonial wool to Goole instead of Hull. Mr. Picliar, exporter of yarns—Lived at Bradford. Exported 800 tons annually at Hull. He gave similar evidence as the last witness with respect to the port of Goole. Cross-examined by Mr. WILKINS— The reason why he thought the Brayton and Goole line was preferable to the Wakefield and Goole line, was the better gradients which it afforded. Knew that by the sections. The sections he saw were Mr. Birkenshaw's. Mr. Holt, examined by Mr. KNowt.Es— Was a wool merchant at Leeds for twenty-five years. Purchased large quantities of wool yearly from Germany. Imported 3,000 to 4,000 bags. It was brought partly by water, partly by rail, but latterly he had had it all brought by the rail. There was a large traffic to Leeds from Goole. His wool came to him by Hull He confirmed the evidence of the two last witnesses with regard to the superiority of the port of Goole to that of Hull in respect to the accommodation it would afford. Thought the proposed line would be a much better line than the Wakefield and Goole line. Mr. Passevant was a manager of a house at Leeds, largely en gaged in the exportation of linen and worsted yarn, which was all shipped at Hull. The evidence of this witness was nearly a repetition of what had been already deposed to in reference to the superiority of the port of Goo:E. to Hull, and to the advantages which the proposed line would confer in cheapness and accommo.. dation, &c. Mr. John Strickland, corn.factor near Snaith, had bought corn and sold it at Leeds in preference to Wakefield. The facility of going to Wakefield was as great as to Leeds. The reason he pre ferred Leeds was that he got cash in Leeds, and was obliged, if he sold his corn at Wakefield, to take a three.months' bill. Cross-examined by Mr. WILKINS—Had signed a petition in favour of the Wakefield and Goole line, but did so under the im. pression that the Brayton and Goole line was thrown out by the Committee on Standing Orders. By Mr. Buss—The average quantity of corn which he pur chased weekly was 100 quarters. (A petition was here handed to witness against the proposed line.) The people whose signatures were attached to that petition were respectable, but he should like to know whether those who signed it knew what it was they were signing? In his part of the country they never read any petition they signed. He never in his life read any Parliamentary petition he signed.— (A laugh.) Mr. Douglas, lived at Draa. Was a cattle and hay dealer, and butcher; occasionally took his cattle to Leeds and Wakefield. Sent a proportion of ten to one of them to Leeds. The CHAIRMAN thought it unnecssary to pursue the line of exa mination with regard to the advantages which the proposed line would confer en those who lived in the immediate neighbourhood ~ f the &strict though which it passed. He thought that was self. evident, and that it might be almost assumed, except, of course, dis sentient landowners. Mr. KNOWLES then said he would ask the witness no further questions. Mr. Douglas, cross.examined by Mr. Buss—Sent 500 beasts yearly to Leeds, and the produce of two acres of potatoes. Mr. Samuel Wiikinscn lived at Harrogate, and had also lived at Knaresborough. There were a great many flax mills in that neigh bourhood. If the proposed line were made it would confer immense advantages on the valley of the Nidd. The Wakefield and Gocle line would be of no use to them—it went in another direction. Knew the town of Wetherby, and all the country in that neigh. bourhood. This line would benefit all that district. By the CHAIRMAN—The quantity of flax imported into the dis. trict was from 3,000 to 4,000 tons annually. Cross-examined by Mr. WILKINS—AII the flax did not come by Hull ; some came by Stockport and Liverpool. Mr. Joseph Jackson, omnibus driver from G oele to the Howden station, was five times to and fro every day between those places; another omnibus went four times. Upon an averaze lie carried 240 passengers a week to and fro for the last twelve months. The principal part of the passengers he took to the Howden station went to the west trains. Thomas Dunhill wasa coachman and coach proprietor at Wake field. Knew the traffic between Wakefield and Goole and Wakefield and Hull cp to 1838. His coach did not pay. There was not traffic sufficient to support a conveyance unless the individual who was proprietor of it also acted as coachman. There was only one conveyance at present on the market day, which went to Pontefract. Cross-examined by Mr. WlLLiNs—There was no coach between Leeds and Goole at the time he referred to. Mr. Joseph Bottomley, lived near Pontefract, and was a lime burner, coal carrier, and farmer. Burnt his lime at Hudders field. He did not consider that the statement made by the witnesses who had deposed to benefits which the competing Wakefield and Goole line would confer on the lime trade of Knottingley and neighbourhood were correct. So far as he was concerned he would nut use it, nor did he consider it would be generally ad vantageous to the interests of the community of that district. He thought the Wakefield and Goole line was a preposterous one. Cross-examined by Mr. Wimilers—Charged from I4s to 16s. per ton at Huddersfield for his lime. It was sold at Knottingley at the pit at 6s. to 7s. per ton. Did not know the Manchester and Leeds line delivered this lime at Brigghouse (via Huddersfield) for 6s. 6d. per ton, Mr. Sherriff was called to prove that the rates charged on:the Hull and Selby line were less than those charged by the Manchester and Leeds line. Cross-examined by Mr. WILKINS—The Leeds and Selby and Hull and Selby carried at these reduced rates, notwithstanding the badness of the gradients on those lines. The cross-examination of this witness was interrupted by the announcement of the Speaker being at prayers. The Committee then adjourned till twelve o'clock to.morrow. GROUP V. TIM DIA.NCHESTER., SHErPIELD, AND CHESTER.FORD RAILWAY. The Committee, consisting of the O'Conor Don, chairman, Sir John Rae Reid, Sir D. Norreys, Mr. Hope Johnstone, and Mr. Davies, met to-day at half-past eleven, when Mr. Hawkshaw, C.E., was re-called and examined with re gard to the proposed line. He corroborated the evidence of Mr. Vignolles and of Mr. Gibbs, given on a previous day, with respect to the advantages o f the line, and the few engineering difficulties to be met with. He was in the habit of working much more severe gradients than those on this line. James 'Choim,ol.—Was au assistant in Sir John M`Neill's °thee, and was well acquainted with the working of the mineral lines in the neighbourhood of t3lasgow. There wire many heavier lire than on this lie might iuslance one, the Ballochney line, where heavy coal.trains were worked on an incline of 1 in 70. He saw not the least difficulty in working this line. Mr. Rastrick, civil engineer, gave exactly similar evidence. Wiliam Fairbank—Had had considerable experience in the making of estimates on railway lines, and he had done so in this case. He had assisted Mr. Vignolles, and returned the whole expense of the line at 400,0001. Mr. J. Nowell had been a contracter for many years in works of this nature, and had, therefore, great experience in those mat ters. He had carefully examined the estimates furnished in this case, and was convinced that they wet e exceedingly correct. He should be very happy to contract for the tunnel at 42/ 10s. per yard, as he was convinced that the stratum through which it passed was most favourable for en gineering purposes. He should be equally ready to under take any of the other works at the estimates for which they were taken. He spoke from experience acquired in such extensive works as the Bristol and Gloucester, and other great lines. The witness was under examination when the Speaker was announced at prayers, and the Committee adjourned. GROUP X. LONDON AND TORN MINE. The Committee havingassembled in the Committee room, Ne. 8. at the usual hour, Mr. Hawkshaw, engineer, was called and exarni , ied—ls the engi neer of the Manchester and Leeds, and several other lines. That part of the London and York line between Bawtry and Wakefield and Bawtry and York was laid out under his superintendence. Considers the prices for the work •ery high, and higher than any he has heard this session. The line presented no peculiar difficulty. Did not think it possible that the iron for the London and York line could cost the price put down for it, namely, 12/. I Os. Has bought iron himself recently at WI. and 101. per ton, delivered. Iron was an article that fluctuated very much in price ; but the present rate was as high as he had known it for many years. This witness underwent a long exa. mination upon the abstract principle, as to the amount of extra power required by trains ascending inclines of various gradients, from 1 in '2OO i‘pwards; he also deposed that the station proposed to be made at York was to cross the York and North Midland station at a level, and it was the only eligible mode that could be adopted, taking all circumstances into consideration. He was cross-examined by the counsel for the different competing lines for the purpose of ascertaining the mode by which passengers were to be accommodated with conveyances along the different branches from the main line, assuming that a certain number only of trains started from London—in answer to which, the witness proposed to avoid the difficulty by increasing the number of trains. He was next asked in reference to the carriage of heavy goods ; assuming that the carriage of goods conveyances by the London and Birmingham line cost 3,4001. per mile, and did not carry coals, the Counsel wished to know from the witness whether his opinion was that 3,000/. per mile on the London and York line would be sufficient to cover the expense of carriage conveyance, taking into account that 500,000 tons of coals per annum were to be conveyed by this line, as well as a vast quantity of manure, stone, lime, &c., and the Company finding their own carriages. The witness said at first he thought 3,000/. a mile a fair sure; but he subsequently saiu he could not tell without going into a lung calculation, and the Counsel did not press the question. Mr. J. K. Brunel, engineer —Had examined the estimates for all the works on the London and York line, and considered all the prices very liberal. Knew of no difficulty or danger in crossing the York and North Midland station at York. To Mr. TALBOT—Has found London clay very troublesome. . - "After a few unimportant questions from the other counsel, The Committee adjourned at halfpast four. STANDING DRIERS COMMITTEE. This Committee assembled to-day shortly after two o'clock. The decisions were all respecting amendments to Bills, conse quently the fate of no Bill was involved. LONDON AND BRIGHTON RAILWAY.—It is with regret we learn that Mr. Mackenzie, the Secretary of this line, is about to retire from the post in which we are sure that he must have commanded the respect of all who had occasion to communicate with him. Mr. Mackenzie quits his post with the warmest wishes of the Directors fur his success in the profession which he has in view. ROYAL SAPPERS AND MlNERS.—Captain Haworth, Royal Engineers, and the 9th company of Royal Sappers and Miners, recently stationed at Woolwich, embarked on Monday at the Royal Arsenal, Woolwich, in the Gilbert Anderson hired barque, for a pas sage to the Cape of Good Hope. The company is not sent out for the purpose of relieving another company, but to he stationed at Port Natal, several hundred miles from the Cape, for the purpose of con structing fortifications and strengthening that port. The men who embarked yesterday appeared in excellent order, and marched to the Royal Arsenal, headed by their braes band, playing the air, "The girl I left beltad. me." IMPERIAL PAtiLIAMENT. HOUSE OF L 01? DS, June 3. The LORD CHANCELLOR took his seat on the Woolsack at the usual hour. iIIAYNOOTEL Petitions were presented against the Maynooth grant by the Bishop of Llandaff, from places in Llandaff; the Bishop of Cashel, from Armatri. zr.nd Kildare ; Lord Cl a nclarty f rom Cork, Kilmore, and D r op , '1,1; Lord Kenyon ; Lord Campbell, from congregations of the Fr ee Church ; Lord Fitchardinge, from ',3loucester and Heretordshire ; Earl of Yarborough ; and the Earl of Roden, from different places in England. INDEMNITY BILL. On the motion of the Duke of BUCCLEUCH, the In demnity Bill was read a third time and passed. Earl FORTESCUE presented petitions for and against the grant to Maynooth. The Bishop of WINCHESTER presented sixty-nine peti tions against the grant. The Marquis of BREADALBANE presented 113 petitions against the grant to Maynooth in particular, and several against all State endowments of a religious character, comprising more than 10,000 signatures. Lord BROUGHAM presented numerous petitions against the grant to Maynooth. SMALL DEBTS BILL. The Nor.LE and LEARNED Lour) then moved that the Small Debts Bill be re-committed. The Bill was satisfactory to every one who had petitioned except to one person. The Bill was re-committed accordingly. 111 A YNOOTH GRANT.—ADJOURNED DEBATE. On the motion for the order of the day being read for the re sumption of the adjourned debate, The Earl of HA RDWICK E claimed the indulgence of the House whilst he touched upon the important points in the measure. He was unconnected with Ireland, and only ac quired the knowledge he had from the customary sources of information ; but, if he had this d;sadvatitage, he was also free from all local prejudices. He would not enter into any portion of ti'e history of Ireland, except that por tion of it which was necessary for the elucidation of the Bill before their Lord-hips' House. It was a principle in the legislation of this country to consider and weigh well all matters connected with the subject of religion before coming to a decision on any particular case He would abstain far the present in making any reference to the agitations which had been and were still geing forward in Inland, except to say that he felt certain the present unhappy state of political parties tended much to increase the difficulty of car rying out the good intentions of the Government towards her Majesty's subjects in that country. Not only did the state of agitation do this, but it rendered a great portion of the people of this country disinclined to assist in the good measures thus proposed. He spoke thus more in sorrow than in anger. But the case was clear it would have been much easier to have carried the intention of the Government into execution had agitation been abstained from by the people of that country. He had been much struck with the narrow grounds on which the debate was placed the previous night. The debate extended itself no further than the walls of the College of Maynooth, and having reference entirely to the religious doc trines and opinions taught there. No one in reviewing this question could deny the great steps that had taken place in the road of conciliating the Roman Catholics during the last fifty years. Step by step had they gorse steadily forward, despite the greatest difficulties and dissensions, aiding the people of Ireland, and the religion of the great body of the people of Ireland, till that country was nearly on an equality in political privileges with this.—( Hear, hear.) Before going further into the general question, he would refer to the condition of the College. On this subject they had been fur nished with the most explicit evidence. The Noble Duke had given a clear and detailed account of the origin and progress of that Institution, and he had shown that from the great increase of population the state of things had so changed, as to render something necessary to be done. There were only three courses left them to pursue. First, to keep it as it was; second, to abolish it altogether ; third, to improve it in an efli cient manner. With rrgard to the first, it was impessibl,f to continue it in its present state. By the document placed upon the table of the House a few days ago it was shown that the arrangements for the education of the students were of the most imperfect character, and the accommodation of such a nature as scarcely to accord with the rules of common de cency. It was evident the institution could not remain as it was. The second course could not be entertained, as they were under an obligation on the subject to the Roman Catholics of Ireland, and to do so ould be to stop the amelio ration going forward in that country. The only course left them was the third, and tat-.t. he was persuaded, was the best to take in the circumstariees of the country, as it would only be carrying out the original intention, when the grant was first made—the principle of endowing and incorporating a college for the education of the priesthood of the Roman Catholic Church of Ireland.—( Hear, hear.) Was it alto gether so new, or so extremely alarming in itself, that they should at this time place the College on a right foot ing, or bestow upon it an endowment? The Right Reverend Prelate who had first addressed the House last night (the Bishop of London) stated that the students of Maynooth were takers from a very low class. Of that fact he was not aware; but, on the contrary, was rather led to believe, from an extract of the minutes of a re p or t f urn i s h e d b y the Corn. missioners of Inquiry on Education in Ireland, that the school education necessary to an entrance into the College of May. nooth was both important and expensive. It was incumbent upon a candidate for admission into that College to have been pr viously and thoroughly versed in Caviar's Commentaries, Sallust, the Eclogues and first six books of the lEneid of Virgil, the Cicero de Oratore, the Greek Grammar, the Dialogues of Lucan, and the Cyclopedia of Xenophon— a rather expensive education he should thick. He would not press any further the demands of the College itself, but that important part of the Bill introduc ing a new principle towards the Catholics of Ireland, that which granted an endowment when endowments bad entailed such important benefits on the Church of England, the system must be for the benefit and advancement of religion generally. But to this it might be answered that the principle should be applied according to the tenets of the religion to be endowed— such, however, he could not admit ; it was better to try and inculcate a better than eradicate all principle. Had they not given power and wealth and recently a much greater step had been taken, the sanctioning the endowment by private indi viduals of the Church in that country ? That was not new in reference to endowments. A Right Rev. Prelate, whom he regretted not to see in his pla ce , h a d state d last night that Ca nada and Malta were exceptions to that rule, but he could state that in all their colonies it was carried out. On that subject it was only necessary to show that in Mauritius the Protestant Charch received 1,200/. a year, and the Catholic Church 2,500/. ; in St. Lucia the English minister received 300/., the Roman Catholic 440/.—and in a similar manner was the same principle to be seen in British Guiana, Trinidad, Gibraltar, and their other colonies. The principle was not new, though in Ireland it might be consi dered as introduced for the first time. He felt ready and wil ling to see measures of amelioration carried out in Ireland to the fullest extent, and felt convinced they could not shake the stability of the Protestant Church in Ireland. Far from it. They would rather strengthen it. It had not been shown that the Roman Catholic Church was desirous of taking away the property of the Established Church, or unwilling to give over a sufficient power from that Church to the State. Doctor Doyle and Mr. O'Connell had been examined before a Com mittee of that House, and they were both favourable to the in fluence of the State on the Roman Catholic Church, in a temporal point of view. It had been said in opposition to this measure, on the part of the Dissenting bodies, that the effect of endowments was to support each other, and that was alleged as an argument to induce the Roman Catholics of Ireland to repudiate the endowment of their Church, as it would tend to support the Established Church. But, on the other hand, it had been said in that House, that two antagonist Churches could not long co-exist. Now, he was inclined to agree with the former opinion, and to Amit that the two endow.non t 5 supported each other. Ile had a strong opinien indeed that they do support- each other. It was in he nature of all endov. men's to take an anti-democratic tea d,nc3. The endowment of the Roman Catholic Church in Ireland would have the effect of separating the Roman Cathodes from the other Dissenters, in opposition to the Established Church. He denied that the disposition of the Roman Catho lics was adverse to the endowment of their Church. On the contrary, he believed that the well-disposed classes in Ireland had always shown a readiness to accept the patronage, and to admit the reasonable co n t ro l o f th e S ta t e .; The Noble Lord then said, in a tone more audible and emphatic than the rest of his address—" It is a grave question to ask, whence should the funds for the endowment of the Established Church be derived ? I will not assert —as it has with some show of reason been asserted-estbat they should be abstracted from the funds of the Established Church. I do not know it of my own knowledge, but I have it upon authority which has been laid before your Lordships, that there are 151 parishes in Ire land in which there is not a single Protestant, and that the ag gregate revenue of these parishes is 58,0001.—(Cheers.) I say, that such a state of things is so monstrous, that it is not astonishing, in the present state of human education, the minds of men should consider it was time that this monstrous state of things should be put an end to.—(Cheers.) This, I say again, is a state of things which, if it does exit, should no longer be suffered to exist.--(Hear, hear ) Those, my Lords, are my own opinions, and not the opinion of anybody else,f and have no connexion with the opinions of others. ( Hear ' hear. ) These are opinions that hav e ar i sen i n my own mind from my knowledge of the history of that cuttotry, and from viewing the state of it at a distance. They are opinions that I have formed from being convinced that the endowment of the Ro man Catholic Church would not be followed by results such as I have heard predicted, and from the conviction that no settle ment of the grievances of Ireland can be called such until it is such a settlem - ent as will enable the people, not ofthat country but of this, to view with satisfaction the state of things in Ireland.—( Hear, hear.) The Noble Lord then called attention to the state of the law as it affected different religious persua sions in differies countries on the Continent. The Protestant and Catholic churches were seen to go hand in hand in those countries. In Austria the Roman Catholic was the church of the State ; but there also the Protestant faith was in jserfect security. in Bavaria, the Catholic, the Presbyterian, and the Lutheran, enjoyed p rivileges all alike, and were on terms of per fect equality. In Prussia there were eight millions of Pro testants and five millions of Catholics. The King of Prussia was the head of the Protestant Church, but he was also the actual though not virtual head of the Roman Catholic Church in that country.—( Hear, hear.) In Hanover the Roman Catholics were eligible to all the public offices, and the Roman Catholic churches were endowed by the State. Throughout the whole of Europe they had this spectacle, but in Ireland they had it not. This was a monstrous state of things. In no other country could they find the same. In the whole world was not to be found such another misgoverned nation.—(Cheers.) In taking a review of the state of Ireland it was impossible not to remember the growth of power of the Roman Catholic people in Ireland. Parliament had at last . . given them property, and they had acquired wealth. They had given them privileges equal to their own, and yet they re fused an alimentary support to their church---a support that might be useful in extending education to the people. He was as sincerely attached to his own church as any Protestant in the empire, and because he was sincerely attached to his own church he objected to any inquiry into the state of education taught at Alaynooth. Before he sat down he should wish to draw the attention of the House to a statement made by a Noble Lord whom he did not then see present, who en- .—.—.- ....-... deavoured to charge the crimes of the country on the instructors of the priesthood. He should read a few extracts taken before a Committee of that House, in the year 1839. The Noble Lord then proseeded to read from the report of the Committee to show that Major Warburton, Mr. J. H. Hamilton, and other witnesses gave evidence, proving that the Roman Catholic priests in Ireland were most efficient pro moters of peace and obedience to the law, and that the charges of sedition urged against them were infamous and unfounded. The Noble Lord concluded by giving his support to the motion. Lord CARNARVON said, that if the Government were to follow out their own p - iliey they would give an equal mea sure of justice to Ireland that they gave their coLnies. He thought they wt re especially bound to do so, because Ireland was more immediately at their mercy, an d un d er the i r con trol. Surely it was unjust that they should refuse to Ireland what they had granted to Cana is —(Cheers.) The Noble Lord who had introduced the subject had told them how great was the increase in the Roman Catholic population of Ireland, since the first establishment of the College of Maynooth, and the House might see that that vigour was not vonfined to the ph)sical energies of the country; for if they looked to the Bar or the Bench, or to the other House of Parliament, they found ample evidence of Ireland's intellectual growth also. If they refused to the growing number and power of the Catholic people in Ireland that meaaura—a mama that was the nearest and dearest to their hearts-the refusal Wineinele sooner or later raise a storm which would in 11 . 15 .°P to , threaten the very existence of the Protestant Church . l e u ...et , lardd.--( Hear, hear.) If they could establishChu thet....Vbc, rim lay between the Catholic and Protestant eharc..iliti tween truth unalloyed on ore side, and truth pure and ''' on the other-but turn the matter as they question was whether they would permit the Catholic eptrili have inadequate instruction or iristruc•ion in a sufficient form' The idea expressed last night that an educated p a r: , ~ : t 4 t ' e l less practical and more dangerous man than an e° &r iled 05 one was a doctrine abhorrent to his mind, for it pro 11 _, mistaken assumption that a Roman Catholic priest wa!!."tho ble of the influences of education. But do what they tingl u ir i;i are and must remain the religious instructors of the Ad people.-( Hear, hear.) The question was whether they T o have them conciliated or opposed to them-attaoch. °,.4 migt, the practical arrayed in hostility.-( Hear, hear. ) The Noble Lre .. 7 1 ,, that the measure would not pacify Ireland. But he wi c 5 1,`,.0 feetly convinced that it would have a beneficial . o P t h, and to suppo s e the contrary, wa s to fIY ' : ts g, face of all experience and human nature , .. pe d And they were to believe that, because one maneatal the gift proffered his country; and for that they e r tl . „: 0 , nate a nation ungenerous, because an individual wasutoeLA ful. And as to the political question, if it were a sin r p, a large, it was an equal sin to bestow a smaller or any ,_°,. Tot ment. But as to the objection started by a Rev. Frelai i : se s , night, that men who held one religion to be true. Inu:'- ea f t e, the other to be false, he wholly dissented from it.. „...s ` elf iie was a strong term. Was there no medium ? for "' w olf believed that the Church of Scotland chffered mor e _IA from the tenets of the Church of England, than the " Vi r ee of Rome did from the Church of England. Be did not with the Right Rev. Prelate who addressed the li ar fre pi night. H e did not believe the Catholic faith to be f ree to ld error ; but he was inclined to improve that which n,e bed t 0 not alter.-( Hear, hear. ) Another point he w i ,", t he! allude to. To be consistent in the P", r e r he y bel had been pursuing they should pass this ineasur,e. ..e-id nor -l' appointed Roman Catholic priests to their gams "ban are' houses-(Hear. hear)- and surely that was more to es cognition of the Roman Catholic faith. Surely t ia bef te the criminal, whose w ap h p e o ,e i ntlassutcshanedhsapolaf inafowretrheeywacsotujoldg p a o w t ayat. l i:teds t a t ; should have no religious consolation unless be 'v 1 ,1,...,40 0 receive that only which the State would give on 0 , at I° hear.) There was another point touched upon lag , , e ; t i e d/ which he would refer, and that was the disloyalty 10,11.'vretibr of Maynooth. To this he would answer that when I . l r` fl ossa terians of the North were excited into rebellion. we e. s Catholic priesthood rallied round the tbrl to ole° s p th ri t e e s a t t s ene a d lso to sto in o v d ade by th t is he co G n o n v tr e y rr Government when t _ c _.io when . h o _!' 0 . 0 of the Nore took place, the priests of that relnl ne u ero !rf, their best influence to induce the deluded 0 4 .! o e sio a Butt "Dios return to their allegiance.-( Hear , hear. ) re rev e r this was not the case now that the priests we hiter, and disaffected persons-mere political agitator:at: b., the aco was true in this charge could easily be ' 7 pot on e" tumely and neglect which had been manifested, 2ens wards the Roman Catholic religion, but to all t w the WI; belief in it.-( Hear, hear.) The treatultl eicte d to bad Catholics had received was, in his opinion, Caw All that pa' Irish people away the most ardent loyalty into the bitterest hate. 0, Ireland ~ taken place in reference to the Roman CathanSLTot n o Of I:, of such p a nature as to turn the feelings and the sa;._bt bay" 1 8 bets from this tiountry. n o. ..„, been said of the doctrines taught at 51aynootb• I_ 4 _ w itb I proved that they were of an immoral nature ; a' i o n o t ' h ", spect to the people of Ireland, much as th_ e l untr y whe re ret ily fled, it would be difficult to point out a c° mo re fa, e c p is people were more moral, or the marriage " vi i., Irish rtpolt respected. Was it to be wondered at that.te,..„dthipsteo, should be irritated and disaffected, when their.i';l bee n ,l e of into consideration the way in which their creel' l o ae" - t bst represented and reviled, and when it was kne a w dd j e d uP?, n „ a nd laws, the product of a former time, had be e° _ ch r istia °l `' f° Whate.terbia . ) • country, repugnant to every principle of trn iecr, bear. div ot , sound and enlightened political policv?---(r'nd the el bad this was to be ascribed that state of ft:ding' 2 ,, tiale P l° ' dal o c h i' . a p r a a r e t t y e „ r i that sed at th theat unhappy present ctime/andcountry . for 5 7 opobette.: Jetta B u t p oesy j had dawned; and a Government who won' e sd Pei tart community, were note qual to the task° a ver es govern Catholic Ireland upon such I be fot • for a gre j grounds, however well qualified they rat e g" i s latieg_trels e ' 0 01; pool empire like this, and especially for see!' a a ra to ' o f the Is d with its large Catholic ppulatiorn Willie t aajes t !„ - daceal a „ n a meetings that had been held in Ir,:land. was ''; a anu e. . s l had been vindicated, a better state of feeliiting tri e d hsvor e t p i o o l n ie s y co in ul h d is no gov the effect of a conciliatory policy was n o v l k ind a°„ ale distir ic ; „ - an i cr, eun to tb w ie,, esi s li nd el i e°3f ( i Lord-Lieutenant, who had, as yet, shoal s VT, went `; elongerrnm government of maintainedlre I and . . agreement with Irish interests and 'lrish sY a n d just , ce Panay, way, directly and indirectly, endeavouring " 1 „,, , tba P e i watt partially towards the people of that coull" , , l ec eed. - ' on ce! rosperity of Ireland could not be g reat sto be hear.) The present measure was g a , jtts 0 doing and a debt of deep ratitude „ v/ s od i li n dsege ri ft present Government for introducing',' , _..,d e _Kr sacrificing friends, suffering misconstruction i fs of t he a + dis ip. f their popularity. These were ° l many Fr t f or age ° t ore: which ought to be paid them r their ' uch a °Not°, bee terestedness in submittina• to Parliament 5 h e ar.) bad 0 1. ` justice to the people of Ireland.-( Hea r , ' nor Oa! WI standing the loss of supporters and the elar ° " oe eeeilr o atic", Pr et ° i JP raised out of doors against their e nlighten e drest a ct of e, e j would have the reflection of having done 3 e so d Pelt bteo under very trying circumstances to an °Pr, a e OA would command the approbation arid esteem e. eo r and liberal minds.-( Hear, hear.) with to o i r wh o The Earl of WINCHILSEA never ros t e , emoo jali oot bl dieting feelings than at the present flo rae ; - til to 9°l ;d ° n o ( he found himself opposed, on public great' , _,,d a iienl, tief regarded in fact as Ministers of the country, ',' e pales" f r iel those with hom he had hitherto lived in w f t hose 4. se friendship ; r and he trusted that when 0 3 saY that° nig" 'aof looked back, in years to come , upon the vote 0, __ore, _ te e the two subsequent votes that'would ratify the 1 °„ h!!„, tatestn*l.test nc r might not t h ee] that remorse which many a 5 hi§ . 1 ,0 °i, for the fatal measure of 18 9 9 experienced % fo to u`-ti it's -( Hear, hear.) How had the question h' pence w oe sior y cussed-how had its greatest d ablest saical ejj ") - ' the other House ? B all of j e sai b e ar bito and mystified sophistry- a(Crtrieasje of 'if est iroae bt e el' which, after reading and reperusing, °l o re b eeP t its , to the conclusion that its propounder o ust , ra ies ttio cated in a seminary of Jesuits. 1e rotestscoho: pole; 0 the name of the Protestants of Engi el ; ci ' Ot her 0 0 00 P e e r a it crowded their table, and in the , 00, ~,,. aes, 411 " II P" . 1 amounted to more than 11,000, sigae - „ 0 el' ~ob sons. He protested, however, against it. "„ o Chwiote, grounds-that, as a national endowment 01 the oleo of Rome, it was in opposition to their Gods of th e C l i i a tea taine doctrines taught in the class-books 1430 o p : o w , Maynooth were so monstrous that no Man. „ t i o nslY t mea t° tenets of the Anglican Church, could conscie,i;tion °f e del them-the supremacy of the Pope, the rese r .orio, the aif inculcated by the principle of salvo jure se, no r n j Of ration of the superiority of the ecclesiastical.eisuotion a s ration power -were doctrines sts ..bhorrent to Prot! latter nos aoss, of the it bad 0 1 principles of the realm, that no member .„. _ t oe le could possibly consent to their promulganhe e din'., e ati t ; said that this grant of 30 , 0001 . would render_ _ t w hit rot:, Maynooth less exclusive and more liberal...eP_loniee°e a '.,' had they that such would be the case? 1! t r i , oi eg ecs ) sa l ; would be a mental delusion if they Pass e ' d Beau ° 0 1 nt he called upon the .Noble Lord behind (L°r e tbe if elle in tb other Noble Lords to stand forward and sa: ~,o b t $ ll tl of the Irish people from the principle '4' c a tbob e s oo O le os seminary. Let them give to the Rowena _ Atte att o t a r n , require excepting this support to a system _ o 7 e d to t r et i, England conscientiously believed to be oln' t i in por hst GS worship of God. It was, indeed, a 111 7 ,d f a irlr y wet s , seri-u„, qu,qth.m. hut let them do honest!): aired froi n ,bo ' c ot their eon ,eienc, ,, , and their country, e5 (l H i ; hard' o bip , ; I v (Ch , ers)-and let liet leave the i,..stle "'their Let ban t 4 1)i,, to ”3. , ,e them. woeld call upon mild ''Y' tbs ° ter to abandon thitr sacred dutie, and he W,_ .. , to ther d.e Sti r Right Reverend Priate who spoke last, tn e d by .. ,w, e ntfr or doctrines so opposed to Christianity recor,:is u tin . (_' ctr ; I!„ he should with him raise his voice, and O E ,:; 31 tbe :,late; tor t ; o yours to sever the Protestant Church Iri_ cte d. A OO e l would he rest until that severance were e 4 f o gl3 o . r hyd r o sure could not pass, for the Protestantisol:.,cate fircoaces!eg strong to allow the Government toe e ducate iinu_ s idero6 priests without the people making Lordship, to coP oa t . 0 . _oh or stand against it. He prayed theirarouse OP' b 15 ld arou vi , . c ere they pas-ed a measure which hostile feelings _iingg O i rdsh , o length and width of the country hostile le. h e ir t ° e tie l el not again be easily allayed. that whe ° r , all I° o o The Marquis of NORMA NB Ysaid trusted °- the' p recollected the part which he had alwaYs ted ha trt ls- „, 11 _0e/ 0 ' connected with the state of Ireland, e - , t h a t bus - ale pardon his trespassing on their attention b nor a tbeir lrffed, aware how difficult it would be to engaq tie nt 01 1 . t i e ia 70. sideration after the energetic and the eie s q..o, di! ~h o st,o g Noble Earl who had just sat down-ael; whien;eoortio, too, for the depth of the religious co coul d no t beep l oof a : no ised it. But he (Lord Norrnanby) hs ,j jus!,,,olten i ad that from the Noble Lord opposite, who h ad jos ti r est ioe the amendment, down to the Noble Earl who 4be ~f a th e ie 4 - e "- Noble Lord who had adopted that vie': io o ool o of once addre-sed himself to the real qu,s_r isist io ..eig at er ; Noble Duke-namely, that this was a le g to seili o ble or justice to seven millions of Irish Catho I LT -; the to the c od the population of a great are ] " dullest° he Selged made reference to the state of igious .e , r _ ien d t __ re 0 1) . o f nies, he was oblige, to refer to his Noble . 1 ;!,,, we n o sen...o of State for the Colonies for the fact ir Ei tab!' . :" t he °L o to maintain other churches than th e e _,_ so lr id ioe t i _ lit. England. It was proved in those . ' force re 1 14 t . ° lo , of Ireland, that it was utrrly imPib'•aestiouill °Pertbeiffall a large mass of people w o were con*V ,_d said 4 h„ or e With regard to what the Noble Ear/. ?"_ t Ajo ynet io ,(l , .. it i montaine doctrines alleged to be tau gh!.,' d pear R e sto',., Nob l e nor . t be de e. answer had been given by the ot ela un Vet& said Beaumont). The Romish Church did n asal o f a ef re ir _ .so to release from an oath-not even an_ aothorSofeb oe (Hear, Lear.) The Church claimed th e , of th ° oacis' life' from a vow, to which the authonti.eitereot g ro e ic ,e j, parties. An oath stood upon quite d 11 _ I'rof3.'43_ 0103!:,!;3. Rev. Mathias Croly, who had been at a_ having s (it, t 0 nooth, and was now a Protestant clergy, _f t ' c d, be . lo :; e fe : 0 0 what were called the errors of PoperY , °T . t hat e, st be e m _ e re mittee of the other House of Parlistne%coth, trl_,. er e a r (A taught to believe, when a student of 3 18 Y other oatb• T here D ot any - •n he e 1 P" , violate the oath of allegiance or . _ w nic t taell _ or ats l many books read in Maynooth Colleg rie d (bat a t defend. But it had been truly ealut.„ o o or „ e de o s were made class - books for the avowed pi I:, oun g nio!,,,t Ir,_ o t duct of ale 7 a il au ee sinu g study.-( Hear, hear.) The conduct of __‘, ga m ,rbe lid po in that College proved that there . 1 Efear, heaf•)..etion b_,.dielf the course of study taught there.- - ( e , ...„. 115 ipstru_ e, s aesej o s. of the people also showed that the r_ I,TBl"There w oe an immoral tendency.-( Hear, hea r ' i e pinst P a e on s ea t to to the official returns, seven % crimesulation ntr i ri t h resP were nutted in England -taking t e P°P , bear.) lo ° lo l ll thirty committed in Ireland .'-( }pear, bear . t h a t the_,„ e r „,,1 to be denied f 11 a 1 ""' is ""- ) temperance, it was not • to that o .was heir. now in a position superior a that (hear t •abee )-"" • sts • - - " the b' we in the world - (Hear , hear ) tie- prie- •,, a g - e o rr a proof of the useful influence oLoed opposite 'P ewi t ol, icg , It had been said by a Noble the e na Me e ' bath e ' I conferences n est , t , settled in their period ic al b fore their teasels, /Har. which was to be committed estrous a rnigstso- t -•"k s, (Hear, hear.) That was so rn?n . y , isoo a g ees od v ett would not detain their Lordships D . d here b °- re bs robe mit that t ut th e re a ._ hear.) He was ready to ad I s t year- 13 , a w ith t ri ....se l' increase of crime within. the %bout arrnes_, the Way': fle to account for it, wi itribte" ries ° 0S many causes wcastle), who a o f the Pd to .„14 Duke (the Duke of Ne nd the conduct _ w oe o ebe'd the conference of bishops, a constant and violence'uuw too hse could bear testimony to the to restrain ._ env . Prelate (th of the Roman Catholic order.riests---(flesrp' e n v. , eib u i. immorality , and to inculcate Right .- ~,,, to 01 1 wool" h of the son 1 •ty V. , . heard with regret the spf•ec chart 004 Bishop of Cashel) last night , w hich s• ;.9 of syloP ath ,,. 7 :noni O w atet td bited by no means ase I .sis am Rev. p r ole „or Christians, Res. row • millions of his fellow The Bight . to the ,P. c lergl ~ was ordained.-( Hear, hear.) ent mauo bs U l '• et IP appointo . tec i to egi on es . that there might be some be ett1, ec ...,,0 roa ° sen which would his ° f ships in Maynooth , , tions were ase- - o in - ot. o _ Suppose it were ? Objec He had an i n stao . , no i s tine i . OOP elevation of an individual. m ade to a" 16 r , Sso u ' r :- 0° perience of objections being a....e ~......th, I,,t,lear, heae)ciergy cl,•rgymari in every respect qu lin 0 bishopric.--(11_03 to d i isolatr° he had recommended to a . , ellent mkt Rev. would contrast the charge of tbaL of t h e Bir .000 of his diocese with the last charge !t o 000 opposite. CALL olds th at The Bishop of Ai** 1 i .1 0r l 1 t i ' ii 0 01 I 0 ~t tj p ti, ' 4 !It •h • In ti tli , th ri; r,, h e , 4 dp ii., tl l ttl It _THE SUN, LONDON, WEDNESDA I MORNING, JUNE 4 1845. I