The Sun. — London, England, 1821-03-22 00:00:00

touching British commodities, n consequence of the high duties imposed in this country on their timber? It is only since the year 1818, that all prohibitions of the import of British manufactures hive been removed in Prussia, and a complete new system of duties, on a moderate scale, has taken place. The Prussian govern ment at the same time declared, that if the duties on Prussian produce were not lowered, that they should double the duties upon the import of British manufactures. Are the people of Prussia much disposed to the use of British manufactures, if they could get them? Very much so. Did not the same duty on Prussian timber exist in the year 1818, when this more favourable rate of duties on British manufactures was established as exists at pre sent? The present high dutiei did exist at that time, and it was in consequence, that the Prussian goVernment made this proviso, that if the duties on Prussian produce were not lowered, they intended to double the duties on British manufactures. Do you knowat all what was the effect produced in Prussia upon the importation of British manufactures, by the high duties imposed on ,timber in the years 1809 and 1810? The price of timber here in those years was not affected by the duties, the freight, and the expense of bringing timber from Canada at that price, was so much higher than it is now. Are not the restrictions of the importation of corn from Prussia an object of very great importance to that country ? They are Are they alsO the subject of complaint? They are not so much the subject of complaint as the high duties on timber; the high duty on timber is considered merely as a premium to the Canadian and to the ship-owners ; the restriction of the corn trade is contidered as necessary to the existence of the farmers in England, in consequence of the taxes. ilave a vou a general knoWledge of the timber trade between Russia and this country? No, I have not. What is the rate of insurance paid on Piussian compared with British ships? The British ships that used to come into Memel were mostly insured in clubs, they insured one another, and the rate for a twelvemonth amounted, generally, to about five per cent ; now a Prussian ship-owner cannot get his ship insured for a twelve.. month for ten per cent. On What authority do you state that the premium of insurance in the clubs is five per cent ? I state that it has amounted to about five per cent, of course it varies ; my informatiOn is from Mr. Sharp, the ship-broker. You do not know it .of your own knowledge? No ; lam speaking from the information which I have received. Can you state whether there are any local objections which prevent the Prussian ship-owners from associating in clubs, in the manner as practised in the north of England ? There is no local objection ; it is not their practice ; they have not attained to that improvement. James Borthwick, Esquire, called in ; and examined. . . . IN what business are you? A general merchant, but principally in the timber trade at Leith. Can, you state to the committee what the effects of the present duties are, as it relates to deals and timber? The effect, so far as regards Scotland, has been this; it has altogether excluded, or nearly so, the timber of Norway; it has greatly in creased the importation Of battens from Norway and the Baltic : it has in some degree diminished in number the deals imported from the Baltic, but those deals have come of a much larger size ; on the whole, however, I believe that the cubical quantity of the larger sort haS not increased, but a much greater quantity of battens have been imported than formerly. To what effect is this owing? It has been owing to the great increase made in the year 1810, upon the duty on Norway timber. In the year 1810, the duty on Norway timber, not above ten inches square, was only 9s. 3d. per load of 50 cubic feet, while the duty on other timber was 11. 7s. 4d. per load, and on battens, 41. 9s. per htindred pieces ; by an Act passed in that year, the duties on wood in general were doubled, with the exception of Norway timber of the above descrip tiork_which had been so much favoured; that it never had, like other timber, been subjected . to the war duties. In 1811, however, that exception was repealed, and also war duties for the first time were imposed on that sort of timber, whereby the duty thereon was increased six-fold; and in 1813, the duty on all kinds of Wood having received an augmentation of 25 per cent. the duty on the above NorWav timber, which . prior to June 1810-was only 9s. 3d. was now raised to 31.45. I Id. being more than double the cost in Norway. I have mentioned this circumstance, because it accounts for the small deals called in the . language of the customs, batt ens , having been an article of manufacture in Scotland, while the larger sized deals were not, So long as Norway timber was admitted on a lower duty than the manufac tured article, there was one species of timber from which battens could be made in this country with advantage; but when the alteration on the duties aboVe alluded to, took place, the Britiih sawyers were deprived of the only kind of wood ivhich they, could manufacture with advantage; the consequence of which has been that the Norwegians, who used formerly to send great quantities of wood in the form of logs, or timber, now send it in the form of battens. Are you extensively concerned in the sawing timber into deals at Leith ? Yes. Are you acquainted with the relative expense of cutting deals in Russia and Prussia, as compared with the eicpense incurred at your own establishments? No, I am not. presuming a duty per cubic foot was laid on deals, so as to be equal with that paid on square timber, would such an arrangement enable you to cut foreign timber into deals at your establishment, on such terms as you could sell them at the price of deals as imported ? I hold that to be morally impossible. You could not do it ? No ; because it is clear that any man importing a log to cut it into deals, pays a duty upon the cubical contents, a consi.jerable quantity of which is lost in conversion, being either turned into dust by the saw, or loit in the diminished value of the slabs. - Then in order to enable you to manufacture foreign deals at such a relative price in the market, you must be protected by such a proportionate duty; will you state to the committee, to what extent that protection would be necessary? I conceive that what would be a necessary encouragement to the sawyers in this country is 30. per cent. on the existing duty, and upon the freight and charges. What do you ground that opinion upon ? I conceive that necessary, because there is an actual waste of 30 per cent, in the manufacture of deals and battens. Do you mean to that extent upon the timber ? Yes ; the waste upon Norway log, not being die square, is 13 per cent. and the waste occasioned by the saw draft is 8 per cent. The slabs contain 26 per cent. of the cubical contents of the log, and as slabs may either be imported as broken stowage at half freight and duty, or if not worth freight anti duty, would not be shipped to this country, the loss by this is 26 per cent. of which deduct one-half, leaves 13 per cent.; that is, 34 percent. is the actual loss to the manufacturer, upon manufacturing battens. By a similar calculation, the loss upon deals is about 30 per cent.; but it is be lieved, the manufacturers would be satisfied with 39 per cent. as an additional duty upon battens as well as deals; for they would then be able to compete with foreigners in the manufacture of them. Dees not also some loss arise from logs upon being sawed, being found defec tive? It sometimes happens ; but I wish to make my estimate within bounds ; in Norway logs there is little risk. Then, in point of fact, are the committee to understand, that if the duties on deals and timber were put on an equal footing per cubic foot, the sawing of timber into deals in this country, could not be carried on to advantage? Certainly not ;if no extra duty is to be charged in consequence of the waste. Still, would not the mills of this country be employed in cutting timber to a very large extent into other scantlings, for general purposes ? It is not an advan tageous way of employing mills to cut for general purposes. The loss of time in shifting the saws is so great, that saw-mills can only be employed with advantage when a great quantity of pieces of the same size is required, such as deals and bat tens for flooring, &c. Then timber cut into scantlings, so as to be fit for the ordinary purposes of house building, cannot be cat to the Same advantage in saw-mills as by manual labour? Not to so great an advantage as by manual labour; besides there would be com paratively little demand for sawing, even for general purposes, as there would be a great saving of duty, by importing deals in preference to timber in the log, and they can be applied to almost every use. Would not the effect 'of laying a duty of 30 per cent. more on deals than upon timber, be to make dehls 30 per cent. dearer in England? Not exactly so; the deal would be dearer by 30 per cent. on that duty, but government would lose it. How do you mean that government would lose 30 per cent. of its duty ? Be cause the manufacturer must import 30 per cent. more wood, which is lost by the waste in the conversion. But *bind it not, in point of fact, be 30 per cent. dearer to the consumer? No, not quite 30 per cent. of the freight and the duty, not upon the prime cost ; it would be 30 per cent. on the freight and the duty. Taking all the allowances into calculation, would it not be brought to the con sumer at 3() per cent. dearer than if imported in deals ? Supposing it would be so, it would nut only be a gain to the consumer, it would also be a loss to the revenue to that extent. - How comes it, that if there is that difference stated by you against sawing in this country, that any establishment should lit formed for the purpose of sawing foreign timber under the existing disadvantages? B ecause when there was a less duty upon Norway timber than upon battens, there was then a raw material for the emp)ovment of saw-mills, cheaper than the manufactured article. When Was your establishinent formed ? There has been a saw-mill on the spot for upwards of a century, but the present mill was , renewed in 1810 and 1811, and was in process of erecting when the act of parliament alluded to was passed. NlThat number of establishment's are there, which you know of, besides your own house? I know of few others_ but my own, most of the saw-Mills in Scotland having been abandoned since Norway timber was excluded from our market, by the high duty. How many were there ? There were three in Leith alone, besides several others. How many men do you employ ? Six men when in full work ; the object is to employ as few men as possible. Yours is one of the largest ? Yes. Are there any in England? Theie is one in Liverpool, and one in New castle. Are you acquainted with the contents of that paper? (showing a paper to the witness.) I am. Did you draw it? I did. Do you know the facts stated in that paper to be true? I do. [lt was ddiveredin, and read.] REMARKS on,the System of levying Duties on Deals and Pattens, by the hundred of 120 'pieces, and at so low a rate, that the merchant finds it his interest to import deals and battens rather than unsaWn timber; whereby not only the saw mills - of this country, but likewise the sawyers, a valuable class Of labourers, are deprived of employment; with calculations, showing how much the revenue would be increased if deals and battens were charged with duty according to their cub:c contents, and (as being manufactured articles) at a higher rate than timber the raw. material, as is practised in the ease of oak deals, commonly called planks. [NoTE.—In the language of the customs, wood is the general term compre hending timber, deals and battens; when in the form of a hewn tree or log, it is called timber; when sawn into thin pieces, it is denominated hatten, if not above 7 inches broad, and deal when cecceding that breadth. I❑ this paper these terms are so ;used. 1 " According to the present tariff, European fir deals may be said to pay duty by number alone; for the scale by which they are taxed is so wide as to have scarcely any reference to their value. Deals, whatever be their breadth, 8 feet and not above 20 feet in length, and not exceeding 34 inches in thickness, pay 201. 15S. Bd. per hundred of 120 pieces; hence it follows, that 120 deals 10 feet long, 3 inches thick, and 8 inches broad, which contain only 4 loads of wood, pay at the rate of 51. 3s. 11d. per load, whilst 120 deals 20 feet in length, 3 inches in thickness, and 12. inches broad, which contain 12 loads of wood, pay at the rate of only 11. 16s. 74d. per load. A more unequal mode of taxing deals than this, it is hardly possible to imagine ; it is prejudicial to the merchant, because it obliges him to confine his purchases to the markets where large sized deals are to be had, and . , because it makes too much depend on the activity of the foreign agent in securing those of the most suitable dimensions; it is prejudicial to the country, as it enables the merchant, by a judicious assortment of his cargo, to evade the duty, -and to import deals much cheaper than they can be manufactured here, thereby depriving the sawyers and saw mills of work; it is still further prejudicial to this country, as it has nearly annihilated the trade whir Norway, the deals of that country being of so small a size as to be almost prohibited by the unequal mode of levying the tax ; and the trade with Norway was peculiarly valuable, because the Norwegians never drew their returns in money, but took in exchange colonial produce and British manufactures, to the full value of their timber and deals. Any one of these considerations is sufficient to entitle the subject to the serious consi deration of government, and if the.inequality in the rate of duties on timber and deals, so baneful in its effect, be found to exist, they will no doubt apply the most effectual remedy. The pernicious effects of the present mode of taxing fir wood, is but too apparent froth the returns of customs, which shew clearly that two-thirds at least of the European fir wood used in Britain, are imported in the shape of deals and battens, and that consequently large sums of money are annually remitted to foreign countries for the sawing of timber; but it is still more forcibly demon strated by the fact, that the whole of the saw mills which used to be employed in sawing foreign timber, are now, without perhaps a single exception, altogether abandoned, or worked merely to keep the machinery in order until such time as an alteration on the duties shall take place. In calculating the amount of loss sustained by the revenue, in consequence of deals and battens being charged by the hundred pieces, instead of their cubic con tents, the great difficulty is to ascertain with accuracy the average contents of the deals imported into Great Britain. It is not enough to discover that deals usually imported, vary in length from 12 to 20 feet, and in breadth from 9 to 11 inches, and that the average of these dimensions is 16 feet in length, and 10 inches in breadth, for there may be, perhaps, 50 deals imported of 20 feet in length, for 1 of 12 f,:et, and vice versa. The custom-house records can tell nothing, for it is enough for the custom-house officers, that the deals imported do not exceed 20feet in length, and 34 inches in thickness, they have no occasion to enquire how many there are of the different lengths between that and 8 feet ; their ideas on the subject must, therefore, of necessity, be extremely vague. The only way in which the custom house can give information that may at all be relied on, is by an actual survey of the deals in bond, and that, not by a cursory glance, but by actual measurement; unless the whole are measured, and an average of their cubic contents struck, there is a risk of falling into the same error; for the officer of customs who inspects the bonded yard, finding that there are in it deals from 12 to 20 feet in length, and from 9 to 11 inches in breadth, may naturally enough report the average length to be 16 feet, and the average breadth, 10 inches ; whilst, perhaps, the average length of the whole deals, if taken collectively, might be 18 or 19 feet, and the average breadth, IN or 10/ inches. _ _ _ "The importations into Leith of late years, to which the memorialist has paid particular attention, will, he is confident, average little less than 10 loads of timber per hundred deals. He has not access to know, with equal accuracy, the dimensions of deals imported into other parts; but it cannot be denied that it is the interest, and will be the endeavOur of every intelligent British merchant, to import deals and battens of such dimensions, as to come under the lowest rate of duty; nor can it be doubted, that great exertions will be made abroad to manufacture deal's suited to the British duties, since each foot in the length of a des!, makes a difference upon the duty with which. it is charged, of from 10 to 12 per cent of its first cost, and every difference in its breadth and thickness has a Similar effect. It may, there fore, safely be concluded that the deals imported into this country, will average br j loadS of wood per hundred, but to make ample allowance for the difficulty of overcoming habit and prejudice, 8 loads of wood only per hundred deals ; are taken as the basis of the following calculations. " if a hundred deals, which pay a duty of 201. 15s. Bd. contain 8 loads of wood, then the duty which they pay per load is 21. 12s.* and the amount of revenue from deals, divided by 21. 12s. gives, in loads of 80 cubic feet, the quantity of wood impOrted in the shape of deals. " In the parliamentary returns of revenue, deals and deal ends are classed together, and battens and batten ends together; and as in proportion to their cubic contents they pay nearly the same duty, and their number being comparatively small, we shall put the whole together. The whole revenue from European fir deals, deal ends, battens and batten ends, in the year 1818, amounted to 659,7511. 2s. 7d. which, divided by 21. 12s (the duty . on deals per load, reckon ing 8 loads of wood to the hundred deals) gives 253,750 loads as the quantity of wood contained in the deals and battens imported in the year 1818. The revenue from fir timber that year amounted to 407,6521. 19s. Id. which, divided by 3!. ss. (the duty on timber per load) gives 125,432 loads, as the quantity of fir wood imported in the shape of timber. The whole importation, therefore, of European fir Wood, in the year 1818, amounted to 379,182 loads, whereof fully two-thirds were imported in the manufactured state of deals and battens ; and deals and battens, the manufaCtured article, paid 20 per cent leis duty than timber, the raw material; instead of which, to afford reasonable encouragement to the sawyers and saw-mills of this country, deals and battens ought t 6 pay at least double the rate of timber, considering that they contain the most valuable part of the tree, and that there is a very considerable waste in converting timber into deals and battens. indeed, if deals and battens paid according to their cubic contents, it would follow, as a matter of course, that they would be charged at a considerably higher rate per load than timber, for it could never be the intention of government, that the raw material should pay a higher duty than the manufactured article ; and that timber. is now charged with a higher duty than deals, can only be accounted for, by the supposition that at the time the duties were first rated, deals of small dimensions were usually imported. So long as the duties bore a small proportion to the cost of the deal, the merchant would continue to import the most convenient size, without regard to its cubic contents; but when the duty came to be double the cost of the deal, his attention was necessarily directed to the saving of duty, and deals of large dimensions were consequently introduced. The most effectual way of snaking deals pay the proper rate of duty is to charge them (by the load of 50 cubic feet) accord ing.to their cubic contents: it is preferable to a graduated scale of lengths, because it equalizes the duty in respect to breadth and thickness as well as length. The an nexed states shew, in three different views, the probable effects on the revenue, if deals and battens were charged with duty according to their cubic Contents, as is at present practised in the case of oak deals, commonly called planks, by each of which it appears the revenue would be considerably improved. " The first state supposes the duty on timber to remainns at present, at the rate of 31. ss. per load, and deals and battens to be charged at the same rate, accord ing to their cubic contents. "The second state supposes the duty on timber to remain as at present at 31. ss. and deals and battens to lie charged at 61. 10s. (double the rate of timber;) and that one third only, instead of two-thirds of the whole importation of fir wood, will then consist of deals and battens. The third state supposes fir timber to pay only 21. 10s. per load, and dealsl and battens to.be charged 51. being double the rate of timber; and that only one third, instead of two-thirds of the whole importation of fir wood, will then consist of deals and battens. The first view is intended merely to shew how much the revenue suffers from deals and battens not being charged according to their cubic contents, even on the principle of their paying nothing more than timber; the raw material. The second view shews what the revenue would gain by charging deals and battens as manu factured articles, at a higher rate than timber, the raw material. The third view is meant to obviate the objections of Russia and Prussia, who might (however unreasonably) complain of a rise of duty on deals and battens, unless accompanied by a reduction of the duty on timber. No objection is anticipated from Sweden, as any change On the duties must be favourable to her by which deals and battens are made to pay according to their cubic contents. Nor can either the Canadian or the shipping interest complain of a measure, which may benefit but cannot possibly injure them, for even if the duty on timber should be reduced to 21. les. as proposed in the third view, yet it would not tend to increase the importation of European fir wood, if, as proposed, the duty on deals and battens were at the same time increased to 51. per load ; for the importation of deals and battens would be lessened as much as the importation of timber would be increased by the change. "The advantages that would result to the country, from the proposed alterations, are as follow : _ _ _ 4 4 1. The duty will be more equally collected, and the revenue considerably increased. "2. Employment Will be afforded to the sawyers and saw-mills of this country. "3. British manufactures will be again admitted into Norway and Sweden, from which markets they have been excluded, in consequence of their small deals paying as much &AY per hundred pieces as the large-sized deals of Russia and Prussia; a circumstance which has proved ruinous to the trade Of Norway, and highly prejudicial to that of Sweden. "The only objection that can be against the proposed alteration, is the expense and trouble of ascertaining the cubic contents of deals and battens; but considerations of expense or trouble should not be allowed to stand in the way of an improvement, in which the best interests of the country are so deeply involved. Besides, where a high duty is imposed on an article, government ought, in fairness, to be at the expense of levying it equally. Before the year 1809, Norway timber . Bto 10 inches Square, paid only a duty of Os. id. per load. A piece of timber of that description contains, on the average, about seven cubic feet ; so that at that time, the duty on such a piece of tintber came to about is. Sid. Deals, at pre sent, pay 201. 15s. Bd. per 120 pieces, being 3s. 41d. each. If Government did not grudge, the expence of measuring the cubic contents of a piece of Norway tim ber, in order to levy correctly a duty of 1 s. 3 1 2 d. surely they will not now hesitate to incur a similar expence, for levying the larger duty of 3s. 4!.:1..; and it cannot be denied, that from the uniformity of the size of deals and battens, a cargo of these will be measured at one half the expence necessary to measure a cargo of Norway timber; at any rate, indeed, any objection on the score of expence, can have no weight in this case; for whatever additional expence may be necessary, in order to collect the duty on deals and battens according to their cubic contents, it will be nothing in comparison to the increase that will accrue from it to the revenue;. and the difficulty of ascertaining the cubic contents will in - a great measure va nish, When the necessary regulations on the sulject are adopted ; for it is well known, that deals and battens are measured before being slipped, and both the invoice cost and freight are paid according to their cubic contents, the Petersburg standard hundred being a cubic measure, and containing exactly 165 cubic feet. The merchant has, therefore. a regular specification of his deals and battens, which he may be required to produce, as is done by the importers a other goods ; and as if * The exact duty is 21. 11 s. 11 1 2 d. But 21. 12s. is taken for the ease of caculatin,g. there would then be no inducement to import one description of deals in preference to another, cargoes would consist of regular assortments, and the officer of customs would have little trouble in ascertaining their measure, especially as there are already published tables, by which, at one glance, deals may be converted into cubic feet. " The perfect practiCability and even ease of taxing fir deals and battens, ac cording to their cubic contents, is put beyond a doubt, by its being, in fact, the manner in which the shore-dues of Leith are at present charged. The memo rialist has been favoured with an extract from the books of that office, specifying the number and cubic contents of the deals and battens imported into Leith, in the year 1818, which is herewith inclosed. This document is very important, as it fully confirms the annexed calculation, regarding the revenue from deals and bat tens ; for it shows, that the deals imported into Leith that year contained on the average 9;o loads of timber per hundred pieces of deals; and in the annexed calcu lations of revenue, the average contents of the deals imported into Britain is taken at 8 loads per hundred, which is making a very ample allowance for the possibility of less care being taken by the merchants in other parts of the country, to accom modate their importations to the actual state of the duties. " The loss to the revenue from the present mode of taxing deals, cannot be bet ter illustrated than by a reference to the above-mentioned doeument, for it appears from it, that the importation of deals and battens into Leith, inconsiderable as it is, paid 11,6741. 2s. Bd. less than would have been paid upon an equal quantity of wood imported in the shape of logs or unsawn timber. " In the annexed State No. 3, a deduction of 15s. per load is supposed to be made from the duty on European fir timber, as a sort of equivalent for the proposed rise of duty on deals and battens; and it appears that even under that supposition, the revenue of the country would be increased at least 275,5301. 18s. 4d. by the change. If it be desirable that a still larger revenue should be drawn from fir wood, it could be done by imposing a duty of 15s. or 20s. per load on American fir timber, leaving the duty on European timber as at present. This, in so far as European states are concerned, would have the same effect as reducing the duty on their timber 15s. per load, namely, that of preventing the importation of European fir wood from being materially diminished; nor could the Canadians with any propriety, oppose the measure, for they will not surely deny, that their trade is at present more than sufficiently protected; and it is very obvious, that as two-thirds of the fir wood imported from the continent come in the shape of deals and battens, the rise of duty on these articles would fully counteract any effect a duty of 20s. per load on American timber would have on the importations from that country. An additional duty on European fir deals and battens compensated by a duty on American fir wood, is further recommended by the consideration of its being a tax from which a very large revenue might be drawn, without being sensibly felt by the country, whilst it would meet the wishes of all those who have erected buildings during the war, when wood of every description was extremely high priced ; and it is almost superfluous to add, that the shipping interest must be benefited by any change what ever, which induces the importation of unsawn, in preference to sawn timber, as it requires a considerably greater tonnage to bring home the requisite supply of wood when it is imported in the shape of timber, than is necessary when it is manufac tured abroad, and imported in the shape of deals and battens. " The memorialist states these circumstances, to show that relief may be afforded to the sawyers and saw-mill owners of this country, without prejudice to any other party, and not only without loss, but with very considerable benefit to the revenue. He humbly conceives therefore, that as a saw-mill owner, he is warranted in contending, that such an alteration should be made on the tariff, either by reducing the duty on timber, or adding to the duty on deals and battens, as shall make it the interest of the merchant to import the raw material timber, in preference to the manufactured articles, deals and battens but he is willing to confine his demand to this only, that fir deals and battens be taxed according to the quantity of wood they actually contain, or in other words, that large deals may be made to pay more duty than small ones: This can be done in two ways, namely, by taxing fir deals and battens, either according to their cubic contents, Or according to a graduated scale, comprehending breadth and thickneSs as well as length. " The memorialist is satisfied than the present extraordinary state of the timber and deal duties is owing solely to government being misled in regard to the actual dimensions of the deals and battens usually imported into this country; and he is confident, that if they were taxed according to the quantity of wood they contain, His Majesty's ministers would not fail to regulate the rates of duty so as to afford reasonable protection to the sawyers and saw-mill owners, for he cannot imagine that it is the wish of government, either that the owner of saw-mills should be ruined, or that the sawyers (a valuable class of labourers) should be deprived of employment; yet that such is the effect of the duties as they now stand, is made manifest by the circumstance already alltidedto, namely, that more than two-thirds of the European fir wood annually imported into Great Britain, come in the shape of deals and battens, and that immense sums of money are annually remitted to foreign countries for sawing timber, and that too whilst our own saw-mills are un employed, and multitudes of labourers are daily emigrating. Leith, 3 Mayo 1820. James Borthwick. STATE I. " In this statement, the duty on fir timber is supposed to remain as at present, at 31. ss. per load of 50 cubic feet; and deals and battens to be charged according to their cubic contents, at the same rate per load as timber, taking the importations of the year 1818 as the data of the calculations. Timber imported in the year 1818, calculated from the Parliamentary_ returns of revenue as stated in the foregoing paper 125,432 loads Deals, battens, deal ends and bat ten ends L. S. to 253,750 879,182 loads a' 31.5 s per load. Deduct amount of revenue from Euro- L. S. D., pean fir timber in the year 1818, per parliamentary return - 407,652 1 9 1 Ditto from deals and deal ends - 603,385 14 Ditto from battens and batten ends 56,365 8 7 1,232,341 10 - 1,067,404 1 8 Increise of the revenue under this vievil 163,937 8 4 " The proportion of deals and timber imported, would probably be little if at all affected by this change, forNo long as deals and battens pay no higher than timber, it will be the interest of the merchant to import deals and battens in preference, because in order to manufacture deals and battens in this country, he must pay freight and duty on at least one-fourth part more wood, to make allowance for the waste occasioned by slabbing and saw drafts, &c. Note.—ln the above state, the deals imported into Britain, are supposed to aver age only eight loads per hundred; but it appears from the shore dues office returns at Leith, that the importation into that port averaged 94a loads. if the importations into other ports of the country are as well adapted to the duties, the increase of revenue would be 354,61 4L 9s. I Id. s AT 111. " In this statement, the duty on tialber is supposed to remain as at present at 31. ss. per load, and deals and battens to be charged according to their cubic contents, at 61. lOs per load, (being double the rate of timber) and that in conse quence of deals and battens paying a higher duty than timber, one-third only in stead of two thirds of the importation of fir wood, will consist of deals and battens. The importations of fir wood in the year 1818, are here also takenas the data of the calculations. The whole quantity of European fir wood imported in timber L. 5. D. deals, and battens, in the year 1818, as per State I, amounted • to 379,182 loads. Two-thirds of said importation, supposed to consist of timber, give 252,788 loads, the duty on which at 31. 5s per load, amounts to -- - - One-third of said importation, is supposed to consist of deals, deal ends, battens and batten ends, give 1'26,394 loads, the duty on which at 61. 10s. per load, is - Deduct amount of revenue from European fir wood in the year 1818, as per State I. - • 821,5G1 STATEMENT, showing the quantity of European Fin WOOD imported into Leith, in the shape of Deals and Battens, in the year 1818, with the duties paid thereon ; and showing what duty would have been paid on the same quantity of Wocd, if it had been imported in the form of unsawn Timber. ca .-- 1. t.D CV 1 , 0 . 4 .4 N ' 0 .• CP .:1 C'. ...0 ..0) .... G 0 CD s sr K. ''''' Is:: t t • t ° . 1 .... '' C C ti to 0 p ... 1 j t -t.'r• .t. 3 IV ,-3 5. E. , c$ . - c"°;' F•S , .- -- c g" 't. g. R 6 4.• ~. 2, 0 •-< - .. , - 1 .. Fi , 2:- 2 2: 9, ‘< 4 , bg , F.; r< 4.7 0 0 , '' .. - A 6- 2P 2 F. - g l- 8 0: a a_ -, Fe 2, F- Ei. C ..- :ig..o -'.-' ° § aa - ~...a,,,,,:,- ...-Lap..- -it... g=. .-E.E., D) .0 V g• 0 s E . r,•,•"8 - = = p v: c .,•: . = 5 0 a. —,..„ p-F,,,. o„ pl-t, g•=m , ...- f& 5- p r- ,, ,,72..g.,F. ts ri Al fit es: cm i•• . pe , t ,cm ~ n ..... Cr; = • n t.F. 7 .0, • 4gP . '' s' s ' gi*F6 - s . 9 , kq‘fe' -4.Cci , 5 0 5,- -n E'ls:' , `` 6 / 4 -'' t., e t g' ." • 4 q a . 4 .- • ' * C ' 9 4 •-.•- ' ' Lt C . ... S o •* I .* • t s. • c-" • , ",,, AC 4 • r ' 'C A A 2 g-2 `-g2 ,7, a. 2, 0 C.,. .0 .-. Cr .- , ~,,,, , 0 0 '',4* • 00 • • . . 0 5 - . ° rt. , Cr . • in f,, , g •, - • .... •-, t-3 • -, • ,-, 0 .8 t-• r , l'' t''' 2 • r - 5. , cr . q k ____ „ __ ........,.........y.m.' ....,..... , ....y.nr , ,... , .......,,..... ~....,... . , C. ; p ...., • ',..,^' . C' re i: 1 • ' tn . CA 9 . : Ti 7 . ..• . e q ;:: 'F.i, CC 1.4 is; CO h. 7.... .... = O. : • ~T Vt v .- .4 c% :. ts: Ci" , :%, C — 4 ,. ',— .., ... C.., - -or • . .... c• - , v --, ' , 7 - • -4 t.:, oc , co oo . oo ~ I c N ~: oo ?, Co 3 ..,1 .... 0 '', Ca. C") 1 .. -. C 4 I "4 C) ta Z' J.* .... C ...,.,;... it From the above Statement, it appears that the deals imported into Leith in the year 1818, averaged 9.10 loads per hundred, and paid duty at the rate of 21. 2s. 3d. per load, and the battens averaged 5 6 0 loads per hundred, and paid a duty at the rate of 21. Is. 10 d. per load. Note.—The above calculations being made from the returns of the Leith Shore Dues Office, and reckoned as all imported in British-built vessels, will vary a little from the Custom-house returns, but not so much as materially to affect the result. Do you know the extent of capital generally employed in saw-mills ? No, I do not. Calculating from your own establishment, how many men do you suppose were employed when they were all going; the Committee allude to Scotland? da r e say there were not above twenty men employed ; but I would add, that a great quantity of battens was manufactured by hand in Scotland. William Price, Esquire, called in; and examined. Have you resided in Canada ? I resided in Quebec for eleven years. When did you leave that country ? In November last. In what situation were you ? AS a merchant I transacted business myself there for six years. What effect did you find the timber trade produce with respect to the advantage to the country and the landholder ? It is now of great benefit to the landholder, especially to the farmer of Lower Canada. State in what way? In the employment it gives them in cutting and hauling their timber in the winter season, when they cannot occupy themselves on their farms ; and in many instances, from the real value of the timber standing ; likewise from the demand which this trade creates in the cities for agricultural produce; for the supply of the ships, and the large body of workmen employed in the trade. Is the timber cut by the labourers who are employed in agriculture at other seasons of the year? It is entirely so in Lower Canada; it is generally cut and hauled by the farmers, their sons or people. To what timber do you allude? It is principally 12-feet saw logs, which they get out in Lower Canada for the supply of the large saw-mill establishments at Quebec. _ _ What description of wood is cut in this way, in Lower Canada ? White spruce; almost entirely in Lower Canada. The Committee understand, that this timber is principally used for the lacuna consumption of the country? No, for exportation, _ Is it exported to any extent to this country ? Yes ; to a great extent. As compared with the yellow, to what extent? At least to one-third. Are you a proprietor of land in that country? No; I have mills. Are you much acquainted with the interior of the country, and the Manner of conducting the timber business ? I am. Have you been much, through the interior of it ? I have been through every part of it. In what part of Lower Canada are the chief woods, from whence the pine thhber is exported? From the Ottawa, or Grand River. Is that timber usually cut by the farmers? Yes, it is usually cut by farmers. Is not it a common practice to bring in gangs of American axe-men, for the purpose of cutting the timber? It was so many years ago, but it is not so now. How long since? Nine yews ago; I should say it was the custom before the last American war, but it is not so now. Then the business is now carried on by the farmers? Yes ; I should say so de cidedly; and more particularly so in Lower Canada; they cut the timber, and haul it out themselves. Who rafts it? In Lower Canada the farmers raft it, and bring it down them' selves, or people are hired to do it by the merchants. What proportion of the timber comes from Lower Canada? I should say onej• fourth. You mean to state, that one-fourth of the timber comes from Lower Canada? Yes; which is exported from Quebec. Do you know how it is cut in Upper Canada ? , Principally it is cut and hauled to the bank by the farmers in the winter season, who make their payments by this timber to the country merchants, who supply them with goods. What description of people are employed in cutting? The farmers themselves; the Upper Canada people are excellent axe-men, as good as the Americans. That practice of bringing axe-men from the United States,. the .committee un derstand you to say, has ceased? It has ceased entirely; 1 have seen nothing of it ; on the contrary, I know that the inh a bitants of the country cut it themselves. Do the same people raft it from Upper Canada? No; it is the country ma' chants, who hire people to do it; it is generally rafted by French Canadians, v 7116 are hired and sent up from the Lower Province; the timberis rafted at the expen o of the country merchants. and brought down by them. They. employ the French Canadians to work upon their rafts. Has the timber trade given much occupation to the emigrants, who have gong out from this country? Ido not think it has. Then you have been speaking of those who are settlers in the country? Yes, the residents of the country ; the emigrants are generally settled much higher UP the country, where they do not lumber; I have no doubt, however, that Mao% emigrants from this country are employed in the timber trade. The objects of the emigrants then, chiefly, are settlement and agriculture ? Yes , though I have frequently seen them working on rafts. What number of men does a large raft require to bring it down? A very large raft would require about 50 men. What . proportion do you consider the timber shipped from Canada, to bear to the other exportk of the province ? I should say it was full half. How are the proceeds of that shipping paid for? The timber is generally paid for in British goods, either directly or indirectly, at Quebec or Montreal. What proportion of the timber comes from the United States? I •sheuld say about one-third. Do you mean from one or both of the provinces? Altogether; I speak of thO whole. The whole of which has been paid for in British goods? In all cases, a vet; great proportion of it is laid out in British ,goods ; I can state, that two Of the American timber, purchased last year by me for shipment, was paid for'" British goods. Can you state what are the net proceeds of a load of American yellow fi lle timber, at the present market price? I have not shipped any lately on my °II Account, I cannot therefore speak correctly to that point. What in your opinion would be the effect of laying a duty upon timber from th e British Colonies? I ant not prepared to state any thing upon that subject. W hat hasbeen the effect of the expectation of a duty being laid on the America.. timber, or some alteration taking' place in the amount of the duties upon the Bahl timber, on the exportation of the last year or two ? Ido not see that it has Irrs j any effect ; it has always been considered in Canada, that that measure never wont° be adopted. hre e How do . you account for the great increase that has taken place for the l ast t ve years in the exports of America? From the encouragement which the markets 13 .3 0 in that country, in the year 1818, by a great number Of ships going out ; it was t 1 ships coming out that created 'the great demand. I`. ) Has the exportation of timber been profitable to the Canadian merchant , in l and 1820? I have understood in most cases it was a losing trade. Then would they have continued this trade as a losing trade, without s ori l expectation of the kind to which the committee has alluded ? It has been consideocr; that the great loss in the trade has been caused by the great number of ship-ow'' who have entered the trade. Then the trade has been created by the shipping, and the shipping has oct o io be en called for by the natural demand of fire trade ? In some measure it has ; b ut ship-owners have gone.out to seek for freight, or to purchase, which h as occas an increased demand. or.al ncc pt at the Is there not a great deal of timber that would not be export ed, present low rates? No, I think not; think we are getting mor e ard in ' oo f tieular in the manufacturing of timber ; I `think we were more p articular timber last yeat than ever we were before. Then you do not think, that any measure which led to snore care in the selectio n ' and the squaring, and the preparing of the timber, wou ld be beneficial to the trade ? site' I-really am not prepared to answer anv thing that relates to the market otl • n is [7l , te contiutadj LONDON: 'printed by THOMAS DAVIISON, White-friars, an d publish, / by W. A. SCRIPPS, of No. 7, South Moßon Street, xt THE SU' OFFICE, No. 112, Strand. 821,561 1,643,1'22 -- 1,067,404 1 8 575,717 18 4 But as it is supposed in the above calculation, that one-half of the deals and battens formerly imported will now be mann- • factured in this country, a considerably larger quantity of tim ber, at least to the extent of 25 per cent, must be imported' to make up for waste, by slabbing, saw drafts, &c. being 31,598 loads, 31.55. • 102,693 10 Increase of revenue under this view 67P,41 1 8 4 Note.—This statement is likewise calculated at eight loads per hundred deals, but if calculated at 98 (the average of Leith importations) the increase of revenue would be 828,6091. 18s. 4d. STATE 111, ", In this statement, the duty on fir timber is supposed to be reduced to 21. 10s. per load, and deals and battens to pay 51. per load, (being double the rate of timber) and in consequence of deals and battens - then paying a higher duty, only one -third instead of two-thirds of fir wood imported, will consist of deals and battens. The importa tions of European fir wood in the year 1818, are here also taken as the data of the calculations. The whole quantity of European fir wood imported in timber, L. S. D. deals, and battens, in the year 1818, as per State I, amounted to 379,132 loads. Two-thirds Of said importation, sup posed to consist of timber, give 252,783 loads, 21. 1 Cs. 631,970 One-third of ditto, to consist of deals and battens 126,394, do 51. Cs. 631,970 1,263,940 - - Deduct amount of revenue from European fir timber, deals and battens, as per State I. - - - 1,067,404 1 8 196,535 18 4 Duty on additional importation of.titnber, necessary to allow for loss of slabbing, saw-drafts, &c. on deals and battens, sup posed to be manufactured in this country, instead of being im ported, as per State II ; 31,598 loads, at 21. 108. 78,995 Increase of revenue - under this view 275 ; 530 )8 : 4 Note—ln thii state, as well as in the two foregoing, eight loads are supposed to be the average of each hundred deals, but if 9:t loads (the average of - Leith importations) arc taten as the basis of the calculation, the increase of the re venue would be 391,0751. 1 s. 4d. i i