The Sun. — London, England, 1818-04-21 00:00:00

1 i 1 he la b . fl ~C, `4l ..111 _tile hargain .l hail made with `Le bank' that- supposing.. the -.sum then at t'eWed could be -repaid by the . public by some ,tfi,t',ture loan, the saving %emelt' be considet'able•ff— ill' re ' '. t ' • O( the Funds, some, y, spect to toe Klee rsrsons bpd thought that the 3 per cents. would :not -be not-b e nt less than 80 per cent: if there-ha.d,hetletne :ff7 l oan for two years ; but if they were at- 7, " srence between funding 6,0,00,0001. between ' . t e ac t il a nd How, would be 2,000,0001. !le had now -n'Y to say, that he had been Able to proviie in - the ee, pt ole for 16 ,000,0001. of Unfunded "ebet• ti'tig considerably more than he then 111010! he e n N l :l he able to do. Gentlemen might not per the in 'tll:l3s' rec•oliect the progrees t het had been made ouid Arlie Plinded. Debt since the peace, but he c i till the n th a t the capital Ltd been reduc ed 4 bo . 1. ' ' l' (1" fifty millions from November, 1915 ; that l b' the amount of the Debt on the Ist of Novern - pre , ,: r, 1815), was fifty milliotts highet than at g -rit. e This reduction of the Unfunded Debt to sop 0 1. , - : t ,•4n amount, must have had the effect e o . f he I, the market, and removing the aPPr ni , i '''nons arising front sti ge eat an expence;a _ i l l • Ie l : In'"l-ntrtion as the apprehension of a loan b i e e Present and succeeding years wou ld t. nn""eished, the public confidence must incress •to th i s could not but co;isider, that with respec t le''s• 'arrangement, . a-most important point h ad .. • ,c,n, gained. lie should now state the I)rtn 01;te e-tvhich the plait . had been adopted. T he • Air,l'jr"dprieciple which 'lklittiseers wished to oth :i t 't . . i; a , s , , to raise-„ considerable sum of money by cre. l ie )g „ n nt ot the:; •stock one which should . per cent . this the Conr I"i't's-. ► LI iwer est of 31 per cent. By ii,t(ttee `£e th at • a :eery considerable poin t l( be d & been gained, Bs . -it large sum of e money la be l ti '''-`)4oteined for the public service, without t . ece'''ssilY of inr')o ine my new barthett e for this 1 1; 11 e r '''si' . sn'elt s i to s eie%: l 4, - deemed better adapted /I '-.. t tl i - i 'Y r‘ teethiCt inn of the 5' or the 41 per cent s. 'e 3;1.- wtnid. rise .to pas : much' sooner t itere s k per v: el. ceil ts• . ; while ou the other hand, it die 6 s - "etc In he'redticid to 4, • there might bean elirele-e,ien tt?nt ttieNemiget 1 .! .011 (millet re : ' 4 . 0 4 :1 ' l t a future time, which might create an On li kt i: v (." al '-"•"', .The object was th e refore snore Tp j 14 be at'tained byilre c,:0.'1t.: rkat bad been ••Stl... e ' .4 ilbpilt t l 7 l, d to., The an.',l,,,,afimt, which he va e e. 11,4!aree wonlee „ve.,l,- uewarels of 27-000J°°U1* :3411e -!,k ! 1-r,, _T.() would precinct; !, 4 4%1' 4 , ,: Pet cent. r ti1.n.,..11 ~. , " . bt . it- the 1,-,..°' 4,000,0001. of the N3"°"''. '-'-`• ' ~ t , Jle..e-Lett had heee contracted for at prest l o lt. ita,.l,lle,lltioer, of the 97,000,00 • 11e- nk ' .l- ` 11)t-1 '` lie . "l'iell related . ii) the''firtiditt-: t,f EXeheqtter 11l 3. The term's had :already. been .made pub lic. eeeei ''''bseriber would have:to pay 11 Iter omit ,for. • au3:11,,T-P...sto'rk, for the difference - between' the it& retire, tieredcoast -).1 Per cents. The tee ital di ti I ~_-,, 2 11,1 34 lie telti of 'an. an loin, lime t : e ! , !1'.. 1 ' 1 .,": II „'1 Per cent. fund, - weeel ha,e' beeto . , vet en stitei,e4'er Aves,madt.„ IS Per " e "''' 1.1-141 il..'"''''B.l7Yi; • 44(1;)i"g tht Pi'lCe to be 75. in. 1 ! )e.- 0 1. 4.' tk - , bet 1 • 1 : , e , he Mis sea; lield'i)iit: 'of 2 r per ce i t ,.. , t..., , •„ar .. ,. 1 otect on AI% ell. II: '1 he'cir cionstetice'ot'the i'r , , . Ix, , 1,1 ' 1 '46 ` - ' 4 l' Ter' c.... t; I. tit'e difference wools; be this t3teee.Y::l:4ll.. li e e, as eeee,teraged to r ~inake. (4. tr ' . i -" l ee' , from the powe'r he Obtained . leisl I Y r e i -'! i t i . -.'"4 d'is l ieiri ''4 . tin' 3 )er•certre Sock Otto s • e2,,'ir,rvr:"-, preCisete rite ,hue Il e 1 ' 6 4! of „, e' ~ -,, o t _the e.nminel:capieei , 1: tl- S „ 1: le.:n''''' i in. his '„pilliori by the • 111:10c - h it. I "tip Col,a,l'!"' .- 1 I. 11bC01) 1 1 4 )1(' I. .i', :',,! 1;:id r,' ,erred. t -i.o . Al' - " "%ir l''' t`" .. ,,,,, ii!rt at e tfoort half a 18i1 . 11011 t ill (51)11(Itt 4lnillil,„ ; tee Sebieriberelefeving only e . le 1 1 (H t . Ilene. p;e10 . with interest in Dubin) in 11*e r)Ft_ln I.o''rulori, - for the' 'saZtifice , they ha d 44 tre: ? l e had thought, therefore, that a•"l . lrre n e 14 tit 114- '''teek - would he oceeplweti in Lonilo id . a ilf - t i e tik)tice elven to the iiank it was only he ld . )te ''' . "( 1 114 ' 41 !)seriberel a d the option of paying Ill itie ai:•• Peri . o dsediffere n t from•those in.thefAi,n)Ff ° F th e ' '`'t the purpos e tat raising a fart of Sop?ly., the -e Year e thei•efere• it was proposed . to giy . e s : 4 'l l'ar e t „ 4 , s I : li e - of/lion of,lo titling L f eeh . egger Bill ie r i f e --, ette or double the amount of 'the t rans' Alit;lh et(l:eiir Sto'Ck. To'shew lime Ict . cOorably this l en , la - ')ett received, he cottlth assure the . Coto '',ltlee'' that. in th e first • three d ,ys 6,900.0°°1* t!ell ' llbs ribell ; so-that the opportunity Was . fte,l7,ltheen of increasing their subset iptioes ant f t ' 2'7 3 - 0 ' ( 1 ) g' I, increasing },ills to \ the amount (3, 'het „ °°l3l . , This 'was. so much approved o f, 'l'lle 'flec i -ea rlY the whole sun") had been raised, eilt- tsvottitt be to crem e a a e ' - toek' to, the amount of 27,2.72 t iee 'rt :. e ,Per cent. Stock given "..ee °rid 2,0001. and a p n e d r as, a compensa ; ; 1.90,1.,(n* xcliequer 'Bids, to the amount 0 tit, ",0001. ;..troin which tif f i re tllt'unt or the •Bilfs was to , be d, ducted so - taertae real emol i n i tt 411 (1. t , thr ee Per cente..wondtt be - 7 or 8,000,00° ' the '-'lle total suet funded three and a ]salt. 'l.O 14 4,i t " r ee per cent; Stock would be extended the 'vle et c ge er a transfer to the Irilt 31' per cent., • 4 f i t el i he believed were now at about il3, being c 'tlt s eol . ll l 3 aret lee proportion tO t be ' Brl g ilsh ' 3 P e e e r e t tea tei , r•Clie total amount of ' the Stock • to ~,e , t he el peas. 34;999,0601.- being 27,272,0001. in tki)t,2. cents. and the remeiteler in the 3 tier i th 3 eee T he total amount of interest would be i n '‘‘'ee ' tr . , cents. 1,0-1 7, 9 071. and the differeuce be ' Nile ' ( "e 3 and 31 per cents. teas ! be 1,30e-3161. l'l,, l 'g a totel charge er . finterest crf 1,183,1351. Ilteetentlibitted rat o'f, let creet r 'received: . by-the ee ti e tetor would be.on the-whole operation of Bills I li ser , c . ttli n 1.1). loos i ts money' 31, 18S. 21. a rate - ex- N I . -111Y1ow compared ‘t . it h the magnitude of the iht. IsCetiott. Ot t ti : e uw 3 ter cent seereated, a Si" k - 41 3 ' 'and prose,ar • which was calculated, in the Act of .. 11l'h e ' Q f 1 cent; and had a charge rf: 431,4121. ,020tal. charg e au the whole operettion was 'tt aii 4 ,oooe ; so that 'compared with many former sttisnctions h. this kind, 'the difference nil-IR:area of th in g iodeed. It wae about, the saute distance 435 ate after the American war, that MrePitt,- in 111,41' I nlnled the Exchequer Bills e but -he funded of tl in, the fiv e pet Cents. ; but the actual price oek'e t hree per Cents. was then 56-or 57, and he lt)lett,,Ylitrtetetitaleuya bargai n for 1 , 0 ,000,0001. while %ye concluded ne e for 30 ,000,0001. at 78 ftee.9. lire he'd riodoubtedly l' ''' the I • been able to do this ' 1 , 4 e tigh opinion entertained of the Sinking 1 ` ) I, Its al)Plieatiou - enabled GOVetement lef :•,nnituand in a 'great degree .the opeiatioos , ' l ke i.. •e 1 e•eney mai ket, and of which .a:1 I age Ile 'ad already steted his hones tO tile 1-IThis*--- te a _ . . u e e evtare of.one ci retonstatr7e, :but it mde, e theterial if me 0 t , e ect o n the t ratisactien. There wee 1) t m left to the subscribers n beater they would or not accept the offer of funding Exche quer Bills ; but he believed this to. he the inn3l effectual mode, and he never recollected a lo.: 11 bekngcontracted for, in which th e contracting parties shrUnk•froin'doing their .ntinost to carry ti 4 arrangements into effect, or concluding the optional part of it, It only remained for him to state the means by which this additional charg,! remained to be &frayed. It would . be remem bered, that when the plan of 1813, relative to the interest of the Sinking Fund, was laid before the House, he . suentioned the propriety of having a reserved Fund of 99,000,0001. for fu' are hoe rests, and of which about 84;000,000I. hail nil - ready been advertised in the Gazette. He should not recommend materially to reduce the Stock in the tiantis of the Commissioners ; but be only wi s h e d t o shew that we were not driven . to the necessity of imposing any new burthens 4in the people, for meeting the charge of the present year. This was, however, au anticipcion of the question that had been put-to him as to the mode in which the charge was to be Provided for ; arid he had answered it by pointing out the source tram which it would. be derived.. The following summary would give a clear idea of the compara, tive amount of the Supplies and Ways and Means of the present, as cficafasted with those of the last year, to all the items of which be had alluded in the course of his observations : - Granted for SUPPLIES.-1818 • • 1117. 4'9,412,373 A rmy(exclusive of Tioops in France)CB,97o,ooo 7,596,022 Nary 1,27:0,696 Ordnan. e 1,795,111)0 Nliscellaneoui 20,074,091 Total Supplies hitt rest tm Exchequer Bill s 2,000,000 4,23o,oooi sin , iin _ gg Fund nu ditto :560,000 .- 2,560,000 22,304,091 20,952,400 EXTRAORDINARY PAYMENTS. Fortificatiops in the Ne therlands 795,681 12 3 (No provi.i.i.,ll is intended to he made for this sum s VOlkil is to be defrayed Out of la e pecuniary papi , )le by France.) Spanish Tr, ay • 4914000 Dvficicm..3'ot Ways and Menus, - 1817 - 659,681 By repayment of Unizinded Debt .... 15,932,062 k 37,544,149 WAYS ,AND MEANS £3,000,000 Annual. I),nliCS • Excise Duties;` ...... 3,500,000 • • 250,000 L ottery 25,0,000 400,000 . Old tiri,rc • 1,5014000 Arrears of = -. l tojierey Tax received and not d. or t‘; i)e received .• -..befor, rre ath 250,000 lloney re , • at the d t spr,itikm of i'..e:,,ootnit; in'respect of Fzuins paid into the Exeheouer, ity the • C:ommissiontri-1,1- he _manage /. ;ruent' of Cumin:l . 4A Excht-quer Bids . 21,443 7,271,459 Subccripfinn Loan • 3,000,000 By .11:xkliequer.linli funded 47,272,700 ' - • 30,272,700 • • ,C:37,544;148 The Itigh t non, Gentleman then proceeded to congratulate the ilouse the,very gratifying im .provement in the principal branches of the reve nue. It would be seen, when- the isecounts.shonld be *produced . of the different branches of the Ex , .cise, in the last year, asconi.pared with the pre that.-in . 7 1 revenue of 4.800,0001. there had been in the last quarter an improvement of 515',0001. or . more that - , 10 per cent. on the whole amount of the 1 - 4;xcise. A great improvement had taken place in the Excise Duties. In the present .9nat ter 'hoe was an excess of •121,0001. over the corresponding quarter of the last year. This alone • he considered sufficient to cover the difference be tween the sum received for war duties in ihe.last year, and that which he calculated upon as their produce in this. ;hie circumstance he might refer to, from Which a fair judgment might be formed of the improvement likely to take place in this branch of the revenue. A bonus had been offered to those who paid the duties on sugar before the sth January, 1818, and a considerable sum was paid into the Exchequer by the time specified. Notwithstanding :his, the produce of the present quarter exceeded that of the corresponding quar ter, in 1817, by 5 or 600,0001. When this in crease in the Customs was found to have taken place under such circumstances, it would be seen the improvement in the present quarter would have been very considerable, if the duties had not been anticipated. Looking, for Ward to the pro- duce of tire' present year, he could not but ealcui s , late that the revenue arising front its navigation and . internal industry would he slid] as to give a considerahle surplus the Consolidated Fund. For the charges thrown on the Consolidated Fund this year, he should propose no new taxes. lie „would at all events abitain from doing so till next year, and i 0 the interim he - hoped the circum ,' stances of the year, or the consequences of the `,great* measure now submitted to the House, would Jurnish the incians Of'pt Ovidiog for them, in a man nee the • most satisfactory to the public. The kloniturable . Gentleman concluded by mov fits fiesolution, which stated in d e tail th e terms on which the SubseribetS Cu the New Three and a llalf per Cent. Stock were to be admitted. Mr,. BRoUGHANI observed, that after the great inultipliciry' of tid ail - , and even variety of princi ple,-displ ye , l in the Right lion. Gentleman's exposition of his views with regard to the finan sithation of the country, it was quite' impos ,sible'ou this occasion to follow him, or discuss ef fectually all the branches of hiS argument. It ap peared to hint, however, upon a general view of the subject, that the plan note submitted for the service of the year was calculated mainly to conceal the true nature of those ()aerations to which tire flight floo Gent, propoed to have recour s e, The st.atement of'tacts I esolved itself into this, that upon a comparison of the revenue with the charges upon it, there was a clear dcficit of 14.000,0001. which it was necessary to neik'e up sonic how or other. By the present pian it was proposed to borrow this sum, but not iii the ordinary mink. A new form of proceeding had been invented, the loan was' to be cast into a different shape, and the interest pay able'nPon it, amounting to 1,200,0001. per atm., was . , it seemed, to be charged 011 the Sinking Fond. - This being the trite result of all the Hight Hon Gentle Man's calculations, and the upshot of .he case being, that iu the third or fourth year of peace we were still to burrow; to this enormous . . extent, he could not, fo7 one, join in those,flat tering congratulations which the ['wise had re c;:lvod on the growing pi asperity of the coantry. So fair, *misted, was the co-intry from any prospect Of 111-,kiug the ,wo ~ .nds of ex,pctice and reven ue meet, that new nt-ans (mist be provided, for aischargiug the interest of Loads, and to the old War Taxes were rim vire dry, it ,had become necessary to apply to tile .!•inking P.tni. He really deemed it wi.te and prudent in such circumstances to abstain from any ex• pressi , ns of trotinph At tire flourishing state at tire nation ii finances The Right Hat). Gentleman lad seemed to treat his present plan as a sort of halt-way-house for the conversion, in their pro gress downwards, of the 5 and fire 4 p:r. cents. Now, if he expected that the holders of ibe 5 per cents. would he willit4; to transfer their claims to the, accuptance of stock heat::tg a lower rate Of interest, he lutist think that t! !e p-rsoas disposed to this commutation would prefer the four to the three and a half per cent. stock. He was aware, that it was pretended the stockholder would hav- a greater confidence in the 3 . A Oct cent. fond, from its being less liable to be reduced; hut lie could: only say for himself . , that• he should certaittlY prefer, with all i , s chances, an interest of 4 to an interest of 3i per cent. He would not 'conclude three few desultory remarks without protesting once more against that part of the Ways end' Means which provided for a ,portion of the supplies by another lottery. He wasnot more struck with the paltry anti contemptible snip which was raised in this manner, than by the inconsistency ) the grOss awl palpable inconsistency, •which it presented with one of the articles of the supply. The Right Hon. Gentleman, in his defence of Lotteries on other occasions, had been driven as it were to his last subterfuge, and unable to deny the evil he Iced maintained that the financial %tants of the . coons try did not permit this sacrifice to its morals. The. answer given to the appeals of his Hon: Friend (Mr. Lvttleton) on this subject was, that the mo tley could nor be spared ; and yet by this very scheme 00,0001. were to, be given away to Spain . ,is a compensation to tier for abolishing the Slave Trad e . H e had not. found fault with the treaty by which we entered into this engagement ; on tlre contrary, he had s'ood by tlre light Hon. Gentleman it) his defence; but he deemed it at the sante time fitting to express his sense of the incon sistency, and was happy to take this early op portunity of declaring what the general impres sion was which tire statement of the Right Hon., Gentleman had produced in his own mind. Mr. GRENFELL disapproved of the bargain made by the Chancellor of the Exchequer, (and this he had taken an opportunity Of previously stating to the Right Hon. Gentleman) as extravagant and injin ious to the country. The Right Hon. Gen tleman had raised a loan at all .interest of four and a half per cent. when he might have proc.lr ed one on more favourable.terms. He had raised 3,000,0001. tor which he gave an annuity which cost he contractors 1, , !t 661. arid he funded his ExclietpierTllS t 791. The Right Hon: Gen tlernan•thos mole a sacrifice of 131. on 661._ which MIS nearly ta: tie late of 201. I►rr cent., and o.tiq o►i the 3,000,0001. tl►cre w:►s a loss of 600,0001: _ . —He objected to Lids, as the advantage expected from it was only continwnt, and might_ never be realised. The plan of the Chancellor of the Ex chequer seemed to be founded on the prospective, and surely he might say the doubtful prospect; of being able, at the end of 10 years, to induce_ the bolsters of the three and a 1)411 per Cent. Stock, to take three per cent. for their money - . —This could not be effected unless the price of Stocks should rise very high. :The option given to the parties with whom this bargain bad been made to fund Exchequer Bills now, or to wait to do so till\ the 2d May, he thought improvidently conceded. The advantages thus, given to then, were incalculable. If Stocks should, rise, they Would then fund their Exchequer Bills but if they should fall to 79, for instance, they would hen made their how, and have nothing to do with his Exchequer Bills or with him. The Right Hon. Gentleman had said, that he never knew an instance of the parties falling back when the time arrived for making it good ; but he (Mr. Grenfell) contended there would be nothing dishonourable in their doing so, when the option was thus for mally secured .to theta. Mr. MABERLY believed that the Right Hon. Gentleman had a right to congre . tulate himself on the bargaiN which he-had negociated. He thought that the Right Hon. Gentleman had made a tu , st advantageous bargain for the public, and a disad vantageous oue for the subscribers. That part of the bargain which gave . .an option to the sob= scribers he considered bad, as it might leave: the subscriber to fund or not. He would rake the liberty of asking the Right ; Hors . Gentleman what was the amount of the deficiency of the Consoli dated Fund for this year He wished to know this, because, if he_underst . ood the fact correctly, the interest of the national debt was charged on the Consolidated Fund, and if there was any defi ciency,. he shbuld be glad to learn where it was to be met. The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER would avail himself of this opportonity to say a few words in reply to some of the observations of the Hon. Member ivlio had just sat down, and of the Hon. Gentleman who had preceded him. The one had stated, that there was a deficiency to be pro, %Idea, for of 14,900,0021.; but it must be remem ,bered that a very con..iderable part of that sum arose froM extraordinary charges, and which h'agl been growing from the increase of the unfunded debt. Under that head the charge for the hist year was 1,600,0001.. Next year we might confidently- expect that the amount of quer Bill, would not exceed 40,000,0001 . 'in stead of 60,000,0001. and 'then the .Charg . e be reduced 900,0001. • As to •the deficiency the consolidated fund in the last year, he begged to inform the other lion. Member, that if Wi something less than 2,000,0001. The' Floii.:'thicP Learned Gentleman who first addressed tile filviie had expressed all opinion, that the subscribers had no reason to confide in the hope that oO'fritith6 reduction would be made in' the stock. • NoW, the Honourable Gentletban who spoke last but one had said that the stibicribers would be guaranteed for 10 years, and it was not likely that the fubd would be reduced after that. time. He should himself entertain no fear on that head. As to the option respe:.-tingthe Excliegner begged to observe, that he never tentembeird an ittstanCe in which • subscribers had declined fnhfilli g an optional - engagement; and the reason why lip:) , bad not 5o declined was obvious enough, namely, beecitise these eng7tgenient were g_etiortllv - very beneficial to thew, arnl tie Was inclined to that they would consider it very advantageous in the. present instance. Mr. 17 LEWIS e.ntered at considerable length into the Merits of the proposition. lie contended it was imprudent policy indeed, when, money in private. life could be had at tour per ceut. that Governm e nt should be f oo li s h enoug h to g i ve f oor and a half for money for the public Although it iticreased -the interest, it provided for no reduc tion unlit this new stock was :thov;:. 90 per cent. the :iverage of thethreeand a lt,tlf pet' etnt. Com pared tt ith stock 1 now', ;.eii; 871. 10s. Though t the reduction Of course was desirable, lie contend ed, it was nor desiraWe in thin waY. Filially, he objected to it, as it rennered the Sioking Fund a were nominal avail inefficient piece of machioery, productive 01no gew.ral benefit. Mr. 11. - DAvis. approved a‘t the proposed Pian; and saw po prjudieial consequences likely to exist: from the,inereaied rate of interest. lii reply. to fi question from Mr„ edrieun4o SHAW,. 'C IA: of thr! . F./XCHEGIIYEIL Steieci; that ,the Cominissionets fur reducing the debt •woulli of course purchase such stock as was (invest it) !lit - rrii ket. • • Sir JouN NEwronT expressed himself anxious to hear E whaller, as the creation of 311 per rent. Stock was secured from redempftm for leo years, tiny ne,v additio;i to that Stock -wotild be entitle it to` the same privilege I 01 was a Hoe of distinc tion to be• drawn between tli one anti the o;her ?• Mr. - HUSEIssoN observed, that though a Sink ing Fund of 1 per cent. was to be applied , to the 32 per cent. yet the Commissioners for the te demption of the Public Debt n ere not precluded from. applying .a greater portion, whenever _the Stock had.reached the level, and is hen it nould he advantages to the public to redeem. With respect to some observations that had talleofrom his Mott. Friend (Mr. Lewis), he must 14y, that they ap peared-paradoxical. Ile had called the plan of his Honourable Friend, the Chancellor of 'the Exche quer, a close loan. It was rather a curious tern' to apply to a proposition, which gave 'thrice to every man who could purchase.2oool. 3per cents. to become subscribers. It was also objected, by his Honourable Friend, that the Government were paying 41. I Os. whilst individuals could horror, the sane money •at 41. per cent. Ile was happy to hear that such a facility in getting money on. interest now existed. But if, by thc s opt . rat ion of the new plan, the 371 per cent. should soon be . nearly at par, thecoutmiou of the 5 per cent-s. Stock would he butte .adv:antageonsly and, easily effected. He considered, therefore, the benefits of the plan to be evident, inasmuch as it went to produce a great deduction in the nominal auioubt of the debt, whilst , . hit the vim of 3,00.,0091. it afforded a saving of 21,0001..1 o the Consolidated. Fond. The Comtnittee would also recollect, wile. ther in a period of peace the floating debt had not reached an amount which rendered it neccssaty to fund a certain 'portion of it. It would other wise be impossible justly to ascertain what the compat ative _scale was . between,. our .expet , diture and revenue, or .what might ultimately be the Peace Establishment of the Cotnit ry. But he protested against,: the doctrine that there existed no • Sioking Fond. It was true, that, wirh the winding up of the expellees of the war, its operation had been contracted, but when . lite country Was relieved from certain charges that ceased with the •Ytell',. and we had ar, rived - at the permanent peace' arrangement, the Sinking Fond would then exert its influence in the most beneficial' manner. • It would I,ot, Ito, ever, be wise, by a too extensive operation of the Sink ing FUnd, to force up the price of the Funds ; ‘i•e, should endeavotir to regulate the system, so that even. in the event .of a change of our external re lations, no very , iolent fluctuation might foltow. time of peace theee'tkas nothing imperative on. the ChancellOr of the . Exchequer to accelerate a permanent arrangement. Therefore, should any disinclination Manifest itself, it was in his power to avail himself of Other expedients to nit et the service of the pre s ent year. Indeed, it would, under all Citctimstances, be desirable to postpone A permanent arrangement, moil the• House could see what would he the Moult!' of the charges upon the country, and of the revenue. to sustaitt them. Mr. J. P. GRANT could not admit. thr value of the benefit which the 1-16 n. Gentlemen assumed, when they argued on the decrease of the nominal amount of the Debt. The fact was, that the-coun try dealt lu annuities. The question (1.1411 was, what was the, price at which they purchased, with the Funds in the hands of the Commissioners for the Redemption of the National Debt, compared with what they now paid to these who transterred their subscrivtions to the 31 per cent. Fund ? If H aley now paid 4). 10s. for money, which. others could borrow at a much lesser rate (If interest, it . was as clear as the light of the sun that the bar gain-was disadvantageous to 'the pnhlic.- The Hots. Gentleman (Mr. Huskisson) talked of a say ing,front the permanent expenditure of ft million and a half, arising out of the interest *lid Sinking Fund now paid on Exchequer Bits. But coin pared with this'reduction, what would 'he the charge on the 'sanded . Debt ? How was that charge to . he' met, but by'the application Of the Sinking 'Fund The great admission at length 'was this,ilhat the Sinking Fend was ,now to he applied to the payment of the interest, and no longer to the reduction of the debt. (IRAN? insisted that there was " nothing. Oovetbr Unprecedented in the arrangement of his 'llrgtit' Hon. Friend: . It was the same that had been acted upon on' a larger scale by Mr. Pitt,, 114''great author of , the Sinking Fund, when he 'eselittaFtite 5 per Cents. and altered the hillier iteet''sitid • impolitic plan tof increasing the no plan_ without a closer reference to the aMOttnt of "06' real debt. By the proposed plait 80,','000,0001„'was raised, by creating a capital 'something exceeding; 34,000,0001. The expellee was* the rate of 1281, stock though by dui lather 'plan, and taking the stocks in the most favourable light at 80, would have cost at •Ile , rate of 1381. It was unfair to take the gene.'