The Sun. — London, England, 1838-08-03 00:00:00

Ltir.° °3 ' of ° sub ° , 3, 00 provi s sitY o t r 0°- if $ P I A, be )u,-- TriS" rl i ng a s , Fog l or og h e ir 5 1, r 'ant 4° „ resre vie a I ) k a su 01 1 . • .11 r s ' ilit' l t ' r' era of 1104 s. ° tits r O' • o DPP d s rf. oLlo r e, >leas" ir Th e ' thei l fri isfaC , you aOO, voo' he o re or r to w ere , i , os 0 " t Dal th e gnu bio fight t ) isei De , Ise 0 0; were 0 0 ring' - of „ a tioP o sto i c al f the, n s 0 of not' be t. " - oP übi re pel , •node Via li putasreo ti pc :Mroi-eoo e ° e rO. W 4 °l pe l tbeo be, g oo. ei hare o w Alto il• 1- P rop p ro ,ao3 . w out_ e ce b e 1 ;;oo li° he bet lo ot or zr P pcd ss %' i pressing a doubt that the Commissioners had perft.rmcd their duty in a inost able manner ; yet it appeared there were cases the people interested were not quite satisfied with the lines of boundary they had marked out. They (the Govern • m eet) propo=cd that the Lord Lieutenant—the executive 9flicer —idiould have the power, not of eNcluding any portion, Lett of including, in certain case;, portions of a population who had a claim to be recognised in the municipal boundar). .As the Lords had adopted so inconvenient a mode of proceed ing, the Government had taken the only course open to them. Mr. SMITH O'BRIEN suggested that a power of appeal t° the Lord Lieutenant might be given incases where portions of a population were omitted from the boundaries. The House then divided, when there appeared_ For the amendment ... . Against it Majority for the amendment --8 Lord J. RUSSELL moved, as an amendment upon the pause regul a ti ng: the amount of the qualification, that an al wane.' of one-fourth per cent. should be made to the occu- Pier in lieu of the charges for repairs, insurance, :And other ex enses. lie admitted that the (fleet of this amendment would lie to reduce the qualification from la to about but he f.lt that it was necessary, in order to secure the more effectual operation of the Bil-l. Sir R. PEEL—Sir, I rise for the purposeo_f od expressing 111 Y opposition to the amendment proposed by the N lie has suggested an entirely new principle, totally different from that by which the English Corporation Bill is regulated, and which principle he proposes to extend to Ireland. 1 Proposed to apply the bona fide franchise and qualification Which is now o p era ting in this country to Ireland ; and I shall certainly oppose the introduction of a separate and distinct princiale in this abatement. I proposed to have the franchise a bona fide franchise with a 10/. qualification, and the Noble Lord proposed an amendment which, by granting an abate ment to an extent unknown in England will have the effect of ea reducing the ojeb fr c a t nchise to an amount under 10/.—( Hear, h to the Noble Lord's proposal on two grounds—first, that it includes in the abatement an allow ance for charges that ought properly to he omitted ; and se condly, that instead of applying the reduction to particular eases in such proportions as circumstances might demand, it is proposed to apply an equal and arbitrary reduction in all cases, without any regard to the circumstances which may affect them. I contend that the amendment of the Lords pro tases a just and proper abatement. But the Noble Lord P r oposes to apply the principle equally in all cases. S uppose a claimant for the franchise divided 31. per annum interest from land, and 71. per annum interest from a house, he would be entitled to the 101. franchise. Suppose, again, a Claimant deriving 101. per annum interest from a house, he would also be entitled to the franchise. Does the Noble Lord mean to say that the same rate of reduction ought to be appled in each of these cases? This is manifestly an injus tice, and totally different in principle from the abatement in t his country. Wh y d oes not t h e N o bl e L o rd propose a ruc lion similar in amount and application to that adopted in Eng -14"1? Why do you not give Ireland the benefit of the same Principle ? Why do you not give one unvarying rule? Lord J. RUSSELL instanced the Municipal Bill gene 1311v, as compared with the English. Sir R. PEEL continued—The question we are now discus. Sing solely relates to the mode of ascertaining parochial assess Meats . . and my objection is that it is virtually granting an unfair V, 1 : 1 unjust abatement. An Act passed for England two years ;i d -e a established the principle which Hon. Members at this of the House wished to have extended to Ireland also. In li g l and the A c t declared that the rate should be judged by t he• , annual value of the house or hereditaments, excepting - "e commutation, if any, and all landlord's charges of re- Pairs ' r ates, arid insurance. I propose that a similar reduction a lll aY be applied to Ireland, and that, instead of having that re ,letion fixed or applied indiscriminately, that it should be ap v"ed according to the circumstances of each case. It can- T A be objected to my proposition, that there would be a Acuity in appl ying a different amount of reduction in diff erent cases - and it would be a work of less labour Clad fatigue to' apply an uniform unvarying reduction in all lusts• That difficulty had been got over, fur in the Poor-law , passed th e reserva ti on i s a ppli e d to the separate and dis ``tict c ircumstances of each case. Why, then, do you not apply th e this Bill the same arraneement which has been applied in . h e Poor -law Bill? Why do you make so unjust a distinc tion?, The Noble Lord has said that there is a corresponding cWance in England. I contend that in England the reduc tionhe is totally different, both as regards the amount and su t b. j ln ctle of its application. I have made inquiries upon the ect• and I find that the houses are rated upon the average at Ea far l ower rate. In Bath, and all the towns i n t h e West of gland, th e p r i nc i p l e o f M r. Pottlett Scrope's Act is gene „Y applied, and the average amount of reduction is 15 per cent(fl) In Bristol therea re surveyors is no fixed rate ; there are S urveyor s appo i nte d , who take i nto cons id erat i on the profits ari sing from a h ouse , i ts s it ua ti on , an d o ther circumstances Which are calculated to increase or depreciate its value, and they rate it accordingly. Is not that the just and fair principle the princi le which ought to be generally adopted ?—( Hear. ' ll l 3 Pose the p houses in one parish were not as valuable with re 3Pect to situation and other advantages as those in a parish in a different part of the town, the reduction was increased ac cordingly. In some parishes in that ancient city the abate taent is 10.' s per cent. ; in five parishes of Bristol the reduc tion is 114 ..per cent. ; in seven parishes the reduction is 12 to 43 i • in six large parishes, where there is a great number of small tenements, the reduction is 144- to 16 ; and in the whole city this mak es an average rate, inclusive of all, amounting to not quite 134 p er cent. How is the reduction regulated with respect to land i n that city ? There is an abatement of only 21 per cent. allowed for land. Yet the Noble Lord proposes to allow 25 per cent in Ireland, even in cases where the qualific a ti on arises partly from land and partly from houses. how Jet us l oo k to another city. Worcester the parish of St. P eter ' s is rated at 15 per cent , the parish of .St. Martin's a t 1 5 per cent., two other parishes are rated at 10 per cont., and the a verage is 12, 1 ,- per cen t. I n B r idgewater, the mount is 10 per cen t. ; i n Gloucester it is but 9 per cent. ; an d see i ng this, I totally protest against the prin iPle which the Noble Lord wishes to introduce. If t l r , Bristol the amount be 134 per cent„ in Worcester and in Gloucester 9 per cent. ; and it in those cities a e re is no arbitra r y r educti on a p p li e d without any distinc tion or relation to circumstances, why then should it be 25 Per cent. in Ireland, and applied indiscriminately ? It is ma ilifestlY unjust to make so wide a distinction. I propose to f iv e the same franchise to Ireland as England now enjoy s, and to hav e it a bona fide franchise, not reduced in amount under : 11 11 Y preten ce . I propose to g i ve t h em every b enefit which is t h r Yed in th e E ng li s h towns ; b u t I am oppose d to granting greater extent of reduction. Lord MORPETH felt it was necessary to state the rea i Wil Ch rinipally induced the Government to propose the -mend p Ment now c before them. The Right lion. Baronet had • ed th at i t was unfair to apply the Hriciple of abatement • i t ar all.Y, and that it would be much more beneficially applied af ea t a,ried as might be required by the peculiar circumstances n ient eli case. The decided opinion of her Majesty's Govern asd Was, that this would not be productive of advantage ; Th e o n the contrary, it would tend to muc h i nconven i ence . With re ason why the abatement was on a different principlo b e ii,: e . ,sPeet to the Poor-law was, because in that case the rate ti n e u esimned to aid solely in the practical operation of the law lithe; wide% it had been adopted, far different would be the e I%. as e People applied to the Municipal Corporation Bill. Once it poiiyicertained the effect of the qualification would be to have a sh e "cal wei g h t , t h ere wou ld b e an en d to t h e f ac ili ty w i t h wh i ch a t ) necessary information could be obtained when the rate was in opted for the purpose of gene ra l conv e n ience. Ther e w o uld th e e latterc ase be afforded a temptation to increase or decrease nr not Glatainin of qualification eith er f or th e p ur p ose o f o bt a i n i ng , t i er g, the franchise, and a vast degree of inconve %tan:: w ould necessarily lya the result. Under all circum. could isss they thought a general fixed reduction the best that .a tixiot c , : s adopted. The Ri g ht H on . B arone t ap p eare d very whi ch to have the same principle extended to Ireland as that ri ot a pplied to England, but they (the Government) had i; .. Met much support from that side of the House when e 47 wished to carry the principle of equalisation at an :titer period of the session. The abatement of 25 per b e i li t• proposed would not clearly reduce the Irish franchise ~e ' c'w what it was fairly understood to be fixed at in ac rdance with the systems in practice in Scotland and agland. It was not, therefore, on account of any differ. ice in principle that it was proposed, but in order 17 Prevent hazard. uncertainty, and doubt in the executi on o f the law. Th e G overnment , to avoid these evils, thought " far better to take a given sum, not rising above the Mount of the bona fide ten pound franchise, and by that t T i cans let the people know precisely what they had to pay, an to adopt a course which would lead to uncertainty and ‘4o4lst from the very circumstance of its variety. t uit i t• HUME felt b oun d t o ex p ress hi s regret at t h e course 1 "t e ",hY the N o bl e L or d t h e H ome S ecretary i n regar d to t h e 11 ., 1 ,u'a bef ore t h e H ouse. Wh en t h at N oble Lord found h i s he 2 : b n _ a ble co m p rom i se o f a 5 1 . b ona f id e f ranch i se rejected, the B rid at once h ave i ntro d uce d t h e E ngl i sh franchise into But „ 11 1. One franchise could b e carr i e d as we ll as t h e ot h er. i tlitz" loc Noble L or d was on l y en d eavour i ng to effect an impos svhol)v'; for h e was trying to meet a party on a compromise m., ere never t o b e met. He (Mr. Hume) should b e mos t e Pp_ t 0 have an opportun i ty of vot i ng against both amend hilti:se in favour of the a/. franchise ; but as he bad no alter- Noble' should give his support to the proposition of the Nord rd. STANLEY rose but to advert to one statement made • ) is Noble Friend opposite (Lord John Russell), and re kithl44,,ted _ by the Honourable Member for Kilkenny. It was fr ttleb 7sPrct to the non -adoption of the English municipal Whe,,tse in the Irish Bill for the settlement of Corporations. 440 mer t was right or whether it was wrong, the principle le y) Sat by the side of the House on which he (Lord Stan the at, in regard to this measure, was to fix the amount of 111111 1 1 61)d franchise in Ireland ' a nearly as andpossible the cam e as the Parliamentary franchise in s the mu iltc!pal franchise in Scotland. The Parliamentary franchise tent "gland consisted in a house of the clear yearly value of e Utid&—the municipal franchise in Scotland was derived t r w e „ nl e ?at of a residence of six months, or an occupation of weir t h.7, l l l • To combine both in the Irish Municipal Bill was object • and he hoped that they had now succeeded in e s.i () _ ll3 ,P, e assing 'it by means of the Lords' amendments. The ~ci Lord (J. Russell) and the Hon. Member (Mr. Hume) eat ' tu asked the side of the House on which he (Lord Stanley) wn e s• • ma they not adopt the Engli s h municipal franchise 4 . I . ll o e Irish Municipal Bill. Becau se , i t was quite impossible 30 , was his rep l y ; an d t h ey would come to the same tioolte . lusion w h en they considered the real state of the si " lie should d ec id e dl y vote against the Noble Lord'se pro position. Mr. O'CONNELL said, the only justice that should and icaotitsdhotri be do ne was to g i ve the municipal franchise of Eng hadreland. In E ng l an d every man rated to the poors' rat,: the municipal franchise. Mr, STANLEY —Only when rated three y ears . wir, O'CONNELL—Oh, that's the crotchet, and if you had not that, you'd easily find another. It is never difficult to dis_ rover an excuse when we intend to do an act of wrong. The Hon. and Learned Gentleman then went on to say that though a house might not be rated to the poors' rate, as it could not, because of the non-existence of any law on the subject, it could be rated to the other rates for the necessary period of three years ; and be would, therefore, ask the Noble Lord, was it not a quibble to refuse the English municipal franchise on such a ground as he had stated. Every man who occupied a house in Dublin for the last three years must have paid mu nicipal taxes—and they were heavy enough—did the Noble Lord then mean to exclude Ireland from the advantage of the English franchise, because they had nut paid a tax which never existed—also because they were not rated to the poses' rate? He (ilr. O'Connell) regretted ver✓ much to sec the Government• accede first to a 51. franchise with deductions, as proposed by the other side of the House, an,'. now to an 81. franchise without any deduction; but as he was bound to make his election between both propositions, he should take the lat ter as the better one of the two. The Bill before the House had been sent down from the Lords in mockery. Under these circumstances he ( Nlr. O'Connell) should support the Noble Lord's preposition. Sir. E. SUGDEN, after a few words in reference to the discrepancy of the observations of the Noble Lord the Secre tary for Ireland in the early part of the night, and those made by him at a subsequent period, said that it would be but a delusion, and a mockery to change the clause as amended in the Lords, and that therefore he should vote against the pro position of the Noble Lord the Secretary for the Hume De partment. Mr. O'CONNELL, in reference to the statements of the Right Hon. Baronet the Member for Tamworth. said that in Stockport the number of Parliamentary electors was only 3,000, while the Municipal electors were 9,000. In Leeds also they were as 6,000 to 25,000. Was that justice to Ireland ? Mr. SHEIL said the Right Honourable Member for Tam worth had argued that the plan proposed by the Noble Lord (Lord John Russell) would lead to uncertainty. Could any thing be more certain than the uncertainty likely to ensue if the clause as it stood amended were to be carried into effect ? The Honourable and Learned Member for Exeter objected to the franchise without the test of rating, on the score of its great uncertainty alone. Was the present clause calculated in any wise to reduce that uncertainty or en sure its opposite ? All the evils remonstrated against would be let in by the present plan. It cost some sacrifice of pride and feeling on the part of the Irish Members to accede to the scheme of the Government, and his (Mr. Shiel's) wish, if left to his own free impulse, would be to reject it altoge ther ; and but that he felt agitation was an evil, which nothing but the direst necessity could justify, he would have voted against it, let things take their course. Was all the sacrifice to be on the side of the Irish Members and the Government ? Two years ago they would destroy Corporations altogether ; now they would grant them, because they were compelled by the force of public opinion. The House of Lords had no public opinion to contest them; but was it not the more im perative upon Hon. Gentlemen opposite to make some con cessions for the sake of peace. Under all the circumstances he should support the proposition of the Noble Lord the Home Secretary. Sir R. INGLIS felt bound to deprecate the course of ar gument pursued by the Hon. and Learned Gentleman, and to say, that however eloquent he might be, he was not sufficiently stored with statistical information to grapple with the Right Honourable Baronet the Member for Tam worth. He ( Sir R. Inglis) should support the clause as it stood amended. The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER said, with respect to the clause before the House, he felt bound to say it was the most essential part of the Bill. He did not consider he extension of the franchise in regard to mere numbers a thing to be greatly desired ; nor did he consider that such was the object of the clause as it stood amended ; but yet he fore saw that such would be its effect if passed without alteration.. An opportunity would be afforded by it of extending the Mu nicipal franchise fraudulently ; and that would especially be the case when the stimulus of political excitement was applied to the parties. There was not the slightest doubt on his mind but its pi °visions would be wholly perverted. He had gone through the valuation of houses in Limerick and Cork since the subject came unCer discussion, and be was satisfied that if the original 101 test were adhered to, the rating would be 25 per cent. over the value of the tenement. The House of Lords found out that fact too, and they altered the measure accordingly. In the present sense of the clause the people of Ireland would be entitled at the end of three years to claim the full benefit of the English municipal franchise. There was a disposition on the part of Hon. Gentlemen opposite to con found this franchise with the Parliamentary franchise. Now he (the Chancellor of the Exchequer) argued that if they were permitted to raise one they would, in the process of time, try to raise the other. On any other hypothesis the course taken by Them towards Ireland, in respect of the Bilt before the Hous, was perfectably unaccountable. Mr. TURNER attempted to address the House from the rear of the Ministerial benches, but could not obtain a hearing. The House divided, and there appeared— For the Lords' amendments Against 169 Majority for. Ministers l5 Several verbal amendments were then made in the same clause. On coming to the words " and all other local cesses," The ATTORNEN -GENERAL for Ireland objected to those words as unnecessary. " • Mr. O'CONNELL supported him. The House divided and there appeared— For the above words Against Majority for Ministers " Clause 14. On the Lords' amendment, striking out the pro. visions for payment of municipal taxes at Bankens', Mr. BALL proposed that the sense of the House should be taken. The gallery was then cleared, and the House divided. For the amendment Against it Majority The Lords amendment was then struck out. On the proposal of the amended clause 58, Mr. O'CONNELL proposed the omission. No oath ought to be a dministered to a person accepting civil office. It was but an addition to the insults which had been already of— fered to Ireland. Mr. SHAW could not understand the motive of the oppo sition to this oath. Sir R. H. INGLIS hoped the Hon. and Learned Gentle man would press his motion to a division, to ascertain whether the Government would or would not vote with him. Mr. A. YATES hoped the Government would assent to the proposition of the lion. and Learned Member for Dublin. Lord J. RUSSELL would vote against the oath. lie was always opposed to any clauses in Bills which imposed mote oaths than were necessary. The gallery was then cleared for a division, but none took place, and, as we understood, the omission of the oath was agreed to. The clause providing for the compensation of officers, who would suffer loss from the passing of the Bill, was next con sidered. The specific compensation of the town clerks was, struttk out, and it was decided that the fixing of the amount should be left to the Lords of the Treasury, as under the English Bill. Lt,rd J. RUSSELL then moved that the further con sideration of the amendments should be postponed to to-mor row (this day). OATHS VALIDITY BILL. On the motion of the SOLICITOR-GENERAL, this Bill passed through Committee. After a short discussion, the committal of the Spirit Li• tenses (Ireland) Bill was postponed to this d ty. Mr. FOX MAULE obtained leave to bring in a Bill to facilitate the establishment of District Courts in Boroughs. DUCHIES OF CORNWALL AND LANCASTER. The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER moved for leave to bring in Bills for the regulation of the Duchies of Cornwall and Lancaster. He had divided the subject into three Bills. II , : wished to bring them in in redemption of the pledge he had given, but he would not press the Bills through thil Session unless he found the wish of the House decidedly iu f&vour of his doing so. Mr. G 0 ULBURN strongly objected to the introduction of these Bills at this period of the session. After a few words from the CHANCELLOR of the EX CHEQUER and Mr. DARBY, the motion was agreed to. ABOLITION OF SLAVERY. Lord PALMERSTON obtained leave to introduce a Bill to continue the provisions of the Ist of Victoria until the next Session of Parliament, enabling her Majesty to make Orders in Council to carry into effect the abolition of slavery in her Majesty's colonies. The other Orders of the Day were then disposed of, and the :souse adjourned at a Quarter past One o'Clock. HOUSE OF LORDS, Auausr 2. The LORD CHANCELLOR took his scat on the Woolsack at Five o'Clock. A Message from the Commons brought up the Militia Ballot Suspension Bill, the Dublin Police Bill, the Forms of Pleading Bill, and several other Bills, which were read a first time. _ _ The Earl of CAR LISLE presented petitions from Wake field, Dewsbury, and other places in the county of York, against affording encouragement to idolatrous worship in India.' Lord REDE SD ALE presented a petition from the Glas gow Medical Association, praying for the institution of a Fa culty of Medicine. The Hackney Carriages Bill was read a third time and passed. Lord B RO UG HAM presented petitions against the encour agement of idolatrous worship in India, from Southampton, Andover, and several other places. A petition from the members of the Mechanics' Institution of Maidstone in favour of Mr. Row land Hill's Post.office plan ; a petition from Gringley, in favour of the abolition of the system of negro apprenticeship. A Message from the Commons brought up the Sardinia Slave Trade Treaties Bill, and several other Bills. Lord BROUGHAM then presented a great number of other petitions against the encouragement , of idolatrous wor ship in India, and favour of Mr. Hill's Post - office p lan. A peti tion from Paisley, complaining of the conduct of her Majesty's troops on entering Newcastle-upon-Tyne in a menacing man ner, during a public meeting, and stating, that but for the prudence displayed by Thomas Doubleday, Esq. (the Chair man), and F. O'Conner, Esq., the county would have had to lament over this uncalled-for interference with their constitu tional privileges. The Noble Lord next presented a petition from Montrose, complaining of the gross inequality in. the distribution of the Parliamentary franchise ; and another peti tion from the same place, praying for the repeal of the Corn s. Also petitions from Bath, Huddersfield, Mansfield, Bury, and several other places, against the Beer-law, and in favour of the Bill which he had introduced on the subject. The Earl of Shaftesbury, the Earl of Abingdon, the Ear THE SUN, LONDON, FRIDAY, AVGUST 3, 1838. of Charleville, the BiOrop of Iltr,ford, and several other Peers were deputed to confer with the Commons on the Sheriffs' Court ( Scotland) Bill. The Marquis of LONDONDERRY felt it necessary again to call the attention of the House to the state of the magistracy of the county of Down. There were on the com mission 190 magistrates, and allowing 25 to have died, not less than 50 had been erased from the Commission. Out of 20 to whom he alluded on a former occasion, eight had been restored. Why, he asked had they been dismissed at all ? Mr. Corry's case he had already fully alluded to. He believed the charge against him to have bcen totally unfounded, and must say that he had been treated in a highly improper manner, and that the case reflected the greatest discredit on the Noble and Learned Lord opposite. He moved that all correspondence be tween Mr. Corry and the Iti3ll Government be laid on the table. The next case to which he wished to call the attention of the House was that of the Rev. Holt Waring, who had been dismissed from the Commission merely because there was an Orange flag hoisted on the Church. That could not be construed into a breach of the peace. The next case was that of the Rev. Mr. Sampson ; and if ever there was a case which ought to have - been excepted, it was that of the Rev. Gentleman whose name he had just mentioned. And yet what was the fact ? Why, that he had been dismissed, and not restored, whilst others, upon whom the strongest censure had beeti passed by the Government, had been re stored. In 1834 a memorial was presented to his Excellency the Lord Lieutenant from the parishioners of the parish of Magherally, in which they stated certain grievances and com plaints against the Rev. Mr. Sampson, the Rector, in re ference to the tithes. An inquiry was consequently made into the case, and shortly afterwards a meeting of magistrates was held at Banbridge., at which the follow►ng resolutions were agreed to. The Noble Lord then read the resolutions. These papers and all the communications on the subject had been sent to the Lord Lieutenant, and by him to the Noble and Learned Lord opposite (Lord Plunket), and that Noble and Learned Lord then wrote a letter, which he should read to their Lordships. The letter of the Noble and Learned Lord was addressed to the Marquis of Downshire, Lord Lieutenant of the county, as follows. The Noble Marquis here read the letter in question, and after reading several other documents, he went on to say—Mr. Sampson, that ill used man, who had more claims than most persons of his class, had been taken out of the Commission. That was a statement which displayed gross injustice on the part of the Irish Government ; and if that were the justice to Ireland for which they were to look, he would only say that it was such justice as he should have expected from the quarter whence issued the instructions under which he believed that course of conduct had been pur sued—'lirections which had been hinted at in November last. In that month a remarkable meeting had been held in Dublin, on the occasion of the St. Bridge's Orphan Society's anni versary dinner ; and at that remarkable meeting. Mr. O'Con nell had made an extraordinary speech, which he concluded by saying, " that the magistracy was undergoing a revision in the hands of the Lord Lieutenant, and it could not be in better hands, for he would pledge himself to them that their magistrates next year would be very different from what they had ever been before, and that every partisan justice"—(ex cept his own)—" would be relieved from their labours, and allowed to return into private life." Now, the Noble and Learned Lord appeared to him to have been acting on the instructions to which, doubtless, allusion was then made. He (the Marquis of Londonderry) bad stated those three cases ; and there were several other gentlemen who had been struck out of the Commission, and whose cases he should continue urging on the attention of the Government. He alluded to the cases of Mr. Steel Nicholson, Mr. Boyle, and others. Those were all cases which cried loudly for justice. He should now con clude by moving that there be laid before that House a copy of the proceedings of the investigation held at Newry into the charges against Mr. Trevor Corry, and of any correspondence between the Irish Government and the Lord Lieutenant of the county on that subject. Also for a copy of any opinion given by her Majesty's law officers on Mr. Trevor Corry's case. Likewise for copies of any correspondence relative to the case of Mr. Lindsay, a Magistrate of the county of Down, and be tween any Members of the Irish Government and the Lord Lieutenant of the county of Down. Lord PLUNKET, so far as his own share in any corres pondence went, had no objection to its production • nor had he any objection to produce the letters received from the Lord Lieutenant of the county of Down, if he desired it ; but he held these letters so far confidential that the Lord Lieutenant was entitled to have them so considered ; and, therefore, without the consent of the Noble Marquis, the Lord Lieutenant, he could not agree to their produc tion. With respect to the opinion of the law officers of the Crown, he certainly could not consent to its production ; the production of such a document would be contrary to all prece dent, and was calculated to lead to a very inconvenient prac tice. The Noble Marquis opposite (Londonderry) seemed to think that on a former occasion he (Lord Plunket) had spoken with a degree of sarcasm not suited to the occasion ; but he could assure the Noble Marquis that he never had any dispo sition to apply anything sarcastic or offensive to him. The Noble Marquis had referred to the opinion of the Noble and Learned Lord on the Woolsack, and had said that he had acted in opposition to those opinions; but the Noble Marquis would excuse him for saying that he did not perfectly under stand what had fallen from that Noble and Learned Lord. Be entirely concurred in the observations of the Noble and Learned Lord on the Woolsack ; and he defied any research to find out a single instance in which he had dismissed a magistrate without the fullest investigation, and without first communicating with the individual himself. When any charge was made against a magistrate, the course he uniformly pursued was, if at least the charge was of a nature to require any explanation at all, to write to the individuals accused, and ask them whether they wished to give any explanation in defence of their conduct, and if they did he instituted a more minute investigation; but he apprehended that the case was very different when, on a general revision of the magistracy, the question was whether a certa'n person was to be left out. The Commission could never be completed if, in every case in which a name was omitted from the new Commission, a minute and particular inquiry was to take place. It was very much to be regretted that the case of Mr. Trevor Corry should be so often made the subject of public discussion ; it was extremely painful to him to allude to that case. The death of that highly respec table gentleman rendered the discussion of his case peculiarly painful ; but silence on the subject would now be a condemna tion of his own conduct, and he was, therefore, actually driven, in self-defence, to state the charges made against Mr; Corry. The charges were that he ( Mr. Corry) had, w hil st accompanied by the police force of Newry, and acting in his character as a magistrate in the preservation of the public peace (some persons concerned in the election having secreted certain voters, and prevented them exercising their franchise, a most reprehensible practice, on whichever side employed), that he directed that a person whom be found there should be mana cled, and that that man, who as (Lord Plunket) eats in formed, had committed no breach of the peace, was accord ingly h indcuffed by the police and kept in prison for a consi derable time. Now, that he considered to be a gross outrage on the liberty of the subject, and an act of great injustice. That, however, was a matter on which he did not veature to act, but he gave Mr. Corry the opportunity of defending himself; and the Lord Lieutenant directed an inquiry into the case, at which Mr. Corry was himself present. A barrister, a gentleman of great respectability, was sent down, witnesses were examined, and the result was, that the facts which he had stated were fully established. Other charges had been made against that gentleman, which were not proved; hut the particular fact ahich be had now stated was fully admitted on that inquiry, and the opinion to which the Government came, founded on the report made to them by the gentleman who conducted that inquiry, was, that Mr. Corry ought to be removed. But why had the Government not acted on their dec'sion immediately? Mr. Corry bad expressed his intention to prosecute the persons who gave their evidence on the in vestigation for perjury, and he (Lord Plunket) had thought that it would not be proper to dismiss him whilst the prose cution was proceeding ; and further, that it would be less grating to his feelings to be dismissed on a general revision of the magistracy than on that particular occasion. He be lieved that in so acting he was obeying the dictates of humanity and kindness. Now, as to the case of Mr. Holt Waring, he thought the Noble Marquis had been misled as to the facts, Mr. Waring was a gentleman of respectable family and for tune ; but be was a clergyman, and chaplain to the Grand Orange Lodge of Ireland. If the opinion of the Noble Marquis were correct, the Government had been guilty of more than two hundred acts of injustice, for they had laid down a general principle, and had not thought it necessary to inquire into every case, to see whether it pre sented circumstances of exemption ; for, if they had, it would have been live before the Commission could have been com pleted. But Mr. Holt Waring was liable to be dismissed as a clergyman and the chaplain of the Grand Orange Lodge f ; and it was required of him to show some p articular ground or removing in his case the general disability under which persons in his situation laboured; and he must say here that he did not believe anything had given more general satisfaction than the Sion nnColVaa principle e e l ergym adopted en . by N G o o l s v • Government n t questionw i with was whether t t h o e r t the r a.. d N rn s ring had made out a case to exempt himself from the general rule adopted by the Government. They thought he had not, and accordingly had excluded his name from that Commission; but lie (Lord Plunket) had intimated to the Lord Lieute nant that if the offence were not repeated on the next 12th July he should be happy to restore him to the Commission; and he had expected that he should have received that day intelligence that Mr. Holt Waring had been restored, and he trusted and believed that it would be so. The next case was that of John Lindsay, which the Noble Marquis had coupled with that of the Rev. Mr. Sampson. The Noble and Learned Lord here proceeded to enter into details re specting this case, and then proceeded to refer to some cor respondenca that had taken place between himself and the Noble Marquis the Lord Lieutenant of the county cf Down (the Marquis of Downshire. ) He put it to their Lordships whether in the correspondence that had taken place, he (Lord Plunket) had not shown a proper sense of respect to the feel ings of the Rev. Mr. Sampson, whilst at the same time he bad been anxious to show a proper sense of the duty which was imposed on him, of not dismissing a Magistrate upon sligh t grounds. The Magistrates a c t e d u p on the advice he had given them, and did not refuse to sit with Mr. Lindsay. He continued to sit in the discharge of his magisterial duties for two years after these transactions had occurred. At this time an election occurred, at which Mr. Lindsay took an ac tive part, and up to this time, all demand for his removal had gone to rest. The demand for his dismissal from the magistracy was then renewed, not on the ground of the lan guage lie had made use of, but on the ground of his having actively interfered at the election. With respect to what the Noble Marquis had said about the speech of Mr. O'Connell at St. Michael's, in Dublin, the Noble Marquis must excuse him ( Lord Plunket) for not entering into a discussion of that part of the question. His conduct had never been in any way governed or influenced by Me. O'Connell, but that Hon. Member's name was always introduced whenever it was thought necessary to season a subject.--( A laugh.) Now, with re spect to the revision of the magistrates, it appeared that there had b'en continued on the list from time to time no than 300 names of persons who were dead. The entire list amounted altogether to 4,160 names, which had been reduced to 2,690. Of 1,470 names struck off, the following was the classification:-450 had died between the year 1832 and and the year in which the list was amended ; 252 were mem bers of the police, and were disqualified as such ; 134 were coo neeted with military duties, and ‘vcre:disqualified as such ; aud 23C; w ere c l erg ymen, and Were removed as such—making a total of 1,072. Of the 400 names that were otherwise struck off, 64 were restored, so that the list of those struck off became reduced to 336, making au average of 11 magistrates struck off from each of the thirty-two counties in Ireland. This was the explanation which he had to offer, and he hoped that it would be satisfactory to the House. Lord BROUG HAM of jected on public grounds to the production of this correspondence. It it were produced at all, it should be under protest that the instance should not be drawn into a precedent. But the best kind of protest would be not to produce the correspondence at all. He The a n Marquis thought that his Noble Friend had met the charges of the Noble Marquis most fully, and had shown no disposition to conceal anything. totoproadsukceif the Noble objection wished papers respecting the case of the late Mr. Trevor Corry ? Learned Lord N V had N ISI any I A : Lord PLUNKET (as we understood) would have no objection. Lord ELLENBOROUG II would object to the pro duction of any correspondence of this kind on the ground just stated by his Noble and Learned Friend opposite ( Lord Brougham). Viscount MELBOURNE said that his case (as we under stood) was not included in the present motion. The Marquis of DOWNSHIRE said he held in his hand a printed statement of the case of the late Mr. Trevor Corry. This was a case of a very grievous and painful nature. Mr. Corry had for a long period of time held the commission of the peace, and had been for thirty years a magistrate of the county of Down. In the populous commercial town of Newry his services were felt to be most valuable, and he dis charged his duties in that town and neighbourhood for many years in a manner that was felt to be greatly conducive to the peace and prosperity of the town. Last year during a period of excitement he was made the subject of an accusation, which, from the best information that he (the Marquis of Downshire) could procure, had not been made out.—( Hear.) An investi gation took 'place, and without any communication to Mr. Corry of the result of that investigation, he was removed from the commission of the peace. He applied to the Government to inform him of the grounds of his dismissal, but he was left without any information whatever, and the way in which he was treated preyed upon his mind in such a manner, and had so prejudicial an effect upon his health, that (if we understood the Noble Marquis correctly) he died about a week ago. He had mentioned the matter to the Noble and Learned Lord opposite in private, and he told him that he regretted what had t a k en p l ace, b ut that h e cons id ere d t h at h e (L or d Plun ket) h a d not done more t h an hi s d uty on t h e occas i on. Wh at had o ccurred in this case h a d b een most pa i n f u l to t h e nume . ' rous fri en d s o f Mr. T revor C orry , o f w h om h e pro f esse d him self one. he il h e ad wo r u e l ei would now ask any othoemmNuonblieeatainodn from marntehde Irisho d whether Government respecting the papers in this case? Lord PLUNKET said that some mistake had taken pace with respect to these papers. They had been handed to the Noble Marquis that he might look over them, and he (the Marquis of Downshire) gave them to the Lord Lieutenant of Ireland when he 'teas in town, who sent them to the Irish . Office, in or d er t h at they might be sent to Ireland. He had written to Ireland respecting them, and had not yet received any information respecting them. The Marquis of DOWNS HIRE heard they had been lost. Lord PLUNKET—Oh, no; I trust not. The Marquis of DO WNS HIRE—It was on the 18th of June that he had had a communication with the Lord Lieute nant of Ireland with respect to this case. Mr ith respect to the case of Mr. Ilolt Waring, he had to state that the Noble and Learned Lord had treated him (th e Marquis of Downshire) with every courtesy and attention. With respect to the case of the Rev. Mr. Sampson, upon the investigation whisk took place Mr. Trevor Corry gave his most useful and valuable as sistance, and exerted himself to reconcile the parties. From that investigation it fully appeared that the Rev. Mr. Samp son had acted in a manner highly creditable to him, both as a clergyman and a gentleman. It appeared that he had surren dered a considerable part of his income to quiet some trouble some spirits that had found their way into his parish. He was bound to say that he (the Rev. Mr. Sampson) had been treated in a manner that no gentleman could bear. As far as he was concerned he did not hesitate to say that he would prefer Mr. Sampson to Mr. Lindsay as a magistrate for the county of Down, and he regretted that the Government had not com municated with him, in respect to the inquiry which took place. The Earl of WICKLOW must say that the Noble and Learned Lord opposite ought not, considering the situation which he filled, to have cast upon thoir Lordships the onus of refusing those papers. He ought, on the contrary, to have resisted the motion for their production ; but, instead of which, what did he do? Why, he said that he had no objection to their production, if their Lordships had not. With his expe rience this clearly was not the course which the Noble and Learned Lord ought to have taken as regarded the revision of the magistracy in his own county. With respect to the ex planation of the Noble and Learned Lord in reference to the cases of Mr. Sampson and Mr. Lindsay, he was satisfied, but not as to the cases of Mr. Corry and Mr. Holt Waring. Could there, he asked their Lordships; be an act of greater injustice than refusing to furnish parties accused with the re sult of the inquiry which had been instituted into their con duct ? Yet this was what, in point of fact, the Irish Govern ment had done, notwithstanding they knew that Mr. Corry was on e of the most respectable and influential gentlemen in his county. It never was pretended that Mr. Waring had evinced in the discharge of his magisterial duties anything like party feeling , but b ecause his clerk, who mi g ht have had flag on the steep le of his Church in his absence, Mr. Warin g some remains of Or an g eism about him, had hoisted an Oran g e WAS dismissed. Lore PLUN K ET denied that he had said that Mr. Warin g had been dismi ssed either on the ground 9f his connection with Orange Societies or for having hoisted anOrange flag. What lie had said was that he had been dismissed because the Go vernment had laid down a rule to continue as few Clergymen as possible in the Commission of thi r Peace. The Earl of WICKLOW said it was clear to him that, with respect to Mr. Corry and Mr. Waring, the Noble and Learned Lord had made out no case to justify the cruel and extreme se verity with which those gentlemen had been treated by the Irish G overnment. of r l ii rla o n n d ag Earl of GL ENG AL L said that there was a s t rong feeling the part of the local Magi s t rac y i n t h e south against the interference of the stip en di ary Ma gistratespart he must say, that he would sooner resign th e Commis s i o n of the Peace than allow his conduct to be in qhuis own ired i n inquiries into complaints against them, and for into by stipendiary Magistrates, were a complaint made against him. Viscount MELBOURNE admitted that the Noble Mar quis who had brought forward the motion had acted with perfect candour; but although it had been said th a t M r . i n ignorance of the facts, it appeared to him, what had passed in that debate, that he must have been from well aware of al that had transpired, because he threatened • s fer perjury against the witnesses who had been proceedi ng him. With r espec t to MTT 1, W ar i ng, :, Cor.y exam i ne d a gainst was no objection to him that ho had belonged to an Orange Lodge. li e was dismissed merely because the Government was kept had raid down a rule that it was advisable as muc h as possible to exclude Clergy men from the , Commissi on o f t h e Peace • m a and w ithout at all wishin g to exclude Clergy men f rom secularaffairs, he (Lor d Melbourne) thought this rule a w ise and a part t o th e pro duction minutesu n There less a was os fpe evidencenoci al objectioncase T otank onaen befor e th e i nqu i ry prtcular oc cas i on or strong his i with respect t o the conduct of Mr. Trevor Corry, b ut st i l l he c i rcu mstances to warrant it, it w as not wise on the t of 'the Gove rnment to consent to the p roducti o n of com munications which p ar count i es and the Lord Chancellor. These communications were confidential in the highest degre e, a n d ought , therefore, s mu l u st ta s r a Y y . 0 , 0 f t n t i h e i a e t t o be open and unrestricted ; but how c ou ld they be open and u nrestricted if they were liable to be made public whenever a Noble Lord thought fit to move for their pro. duction ? The Earl of CH ARLEVILLE considered Mr. Corry had not been fairly treated. All Mr. Corry said when he applied to the Government was, " If you put the papers in my hands it will bring a charge of perjury against certain parties ;" but this did not bear the construction which the Noble Viscount bad put upon it. The Marquis of LONDONDERRY replied, and in doing so said that he would give up that part of his motion which related to Mr. Lindsay, and confine his motion to the produc tion of the papers connected with the inquiry which was in stituted with respect to the conduct of Mr. Corry. The Duke of WELLINGTON expressed his strong dis approbation of the manner in which inquiries into the conduct of the Magistrates in Ireland were conducted. They were ex parte proceedings, and, as far as he was concerned he must protest against such tribunals. The Government of Ireland had no right to adopt one mode of proceeding in these eases and the Government of this country another. But be put it to their Lordships, whether an inquiry such as had taken place into the conduct of the Magistrates of Ireland would be tolerated in England,—( Hear, hear.) It was idle to deny that the stipendiary Magistrates were other than partisans, and that being the case, they were most improper persons to be employed for such a purpose. Viscount MELBOURNE expressed his surprise at the observations of the Noble Duke, and said that this course of inquiry had long been prevalent in Ireland —especially when ever there had had been any apprehensions of riot and dis turbance, and he did not see why it was not called for as much in the ease of the Magistracy as in that of any other persons. He did not k now on what ground the Noble Duke should call these sort of inquiries party inquiries.—( Hear.) The Duke of WELLINGTON said that what be objected to was their application to the magistracy. After a few words from Lord PLUNKET and Lord ELLENBOROUGH, The copies were ordered. TITHES (IRELAND) BILL. Viscount MELBOURNE observed that it was his wish to bring on the committal of this Bill to-morrow, as soon as pos. ale after the sitting of the House. REGISTRATION OF ELECTORS BILL. Viscount MELBOURNE moved the second reading of this Bill. The Earl of WICKLOW complained that the Government had abandoned the measure which had been introduced in the other House on this subject. The Bill was then read a third time. INDIA -LAW COMMISSIONS. Lord liGifinquired of Lord Clench , if he had any o bj ec tion t o lay on the table a return, such as had j been granted in the other House of Parliament, relating to the Law Commissions in India? _ _ _ Lord GL E N''' had no objection, and would do so. On the motion of Lord I-1 ATH E R'FON the Recovery of Tenements Bill passed through a Committee, and was ordered to be reported to-morrow (this day. ) On the motion of the Earl of FING A L the Luau Socie ties ( Ireland) Bill also passed through a Committee. The Public Records Bill, and the Fisheries (Ireland) 13111 passed through Committees. KINGDOM OF OUDE. Lerd GLENELG laid v upon the table the papers which were moved for the other evening relative to the succession to the throne of Oude ; also papers relating to the appoint ments made by the Earl of Durham in Canada. Their Lordships then adjourned at ten o'clock NEGRO EMANCIPATION. PUBLIC BREAKFAST IN BIRMINGHAM. On Thursday morning a public breakfast was given, in the Town Hall, to Dr. Palmer, late special magistrate in Ja maica, and Charles Harvey, Esq., solicitor, of Spanish Town, in testimony of the sense entertained by the friends of humanity in Birmingham, of the services they had rendered, and the sacrifices they had made,'in the cause of freedom. At nine o'clock nearly 300 ladies and gentlemen sat down to a sumptuous breakfast, provided by Mr. Lisseter, at which William Scholefield, Esq., High Bailiff, son of one of the Members for the borough, presided. Amongst the gentle men present, we observed Charles Lushington, Esq.,; M.P., B. Hawes, Esq., M. P., Joshua Scholefield, Esq., M. P., Jo seph Sturge, Esq., Samuel Lloyd, Esq., George Stacey, Esq., Josiah Conder, Esq., Edward Foster, Esq., Josiah Foster, Esq., J. Scoble, Esq., Dr. Lloyd, Thomas Harvey, Esq., the Rev. Thomas Morgan, the Rev. T. Swan, the Rev T. Scales, the Rev. Dr. ,Roby, the Rev. T. M. Macdonnell, Lieutenant- Colonel Moxon, besides a large number of influ ential gentlemen of Birmingham and its vicinity. Breakfast having concluded, the HIGH BAILIFF briefly al luded to the object for which they had met together that morn ing. The Ist of August, which they had celebrated in that place on the preceding evening by so noble a demonstration, was a day which would not soon be forgotten, for it was the day on which England's injustice and inhumanity to so large a number of their inoffensive fellow-creatures, had been blotted out for ever.—(Cheers.) He trusted that the fame which their country would derive from this noble event, greater far than all the laurels ever won on the battle-field, would ope rate as an example which would be admired and followed by , every nation on the face of the globe which fostered or per mitted the infamous system of slavery to exist.—( Renewed cheering.) Honour then, he would say, to those who had assisted in achieving the great result which they had met to celebrate, and among those individuals, illustrious in the annals of benevolence and humanity, through whose exertions it had been mainly effected, he alluded to their distinguished guests in whose honour the festivities of that morning had been pre pared.—(Much cheering.) They had exposed their health, their lives, th.dr fortunes in behalf of the injured negro, and they were again prepared to re-visit the scene of their useful labours, that they might assist in finishing the good work which they had so well began. It was a noble task, and one which would need, as he was sure it would receive, all their support. —( Cheers.) He felt it was unnecessary further to recommend them to the good wishes and sympathy of the meeting— their names were already familiar to them ; all he would add would be the expression of a beautiful prayer, that the pro vidence of God might watch over and bless their labours. —( Enthusiastic applause. ) The Rev. Dr. HOBY, in rising to move the first resolution, observed that he little thought upon entering the room that he should have been requested to occupy the post to which he had been assigned. He had rather hoped to have sat quietly amongst them, and after enjoying the ample re past with which they had been regaled, have par ticipated the rich intellectual feast prepared for them ; and above all to have had the hallowed joy of lifting up his heart to that great and glorious God—the God of liberty and justice—and of acknowledging his holy hand and . his arm which had given th e m the victory.—( Cheers.) It was God alone who had directed the friends of humanity ; and they had assembled that morning prepared to exclaim, " What bath God wrought I" Their first and chief desire then was to pay their homage at the footstool of Him who ruled among the armies of heaven and the inhabitants of the earth ; who could change the hearts of kings and rulers, and whose inscrutable sovereignty in the mysteries of his Providential Government had thus wrought so mighty a change in the position of 800,000 of their fellow -creatures, and by means which called forth the homage of all who knew and loved his holy name. But while they thus paid their grateful homage to the King of Kings and the Lord of Lords, there were men before them to whom they would express their heartfelt gratitude. They owed them much, for they were of the " forlorn hope" of their army.— ( Hear, bear, and cheers.) These were the pioneers, who had, if he might term it, cleared the way, and whose devotedness to the great cause had led mainly to this most blessed consummation. In saying this he did not mean to exclude others who had been fellow-labourers with them, and who had achieved so much in the cause of liberty.—( Cheers.) In thus adverting to agents so distin guished and honoured of God as those gentlemen, he knew they ought not to lose sight of those beloved brethren whom they should hear, from the attestation of these gentlemen themselves, had been fervently devoted to the cause, who had suffered much in its achievements, and who were now par ticipating with a most holy joy, in the blessing which had at tended their labours—he meant the Baptist Missionaries of the West India Islands.—(Cheers.) He hoped he should be excused from making use, on an occasion like the present, of a Congregational distinction ; for God, who knew the secrets of his heart, knew that he equally loved those beloved brethren of other denominations, who had been associated with them in the great work of emancipation. But it was well known that the Baptist Missionaries had done more than any other body of men, not only in those islands, but in Eng lent for the accomplishment of the great triumph which they had met to celebrate.—( Much cheering.) He remem bered when the attention of the Christian Churches were beinning, to be directed to the atrocious system, that on one occasion i he stood beside the lion-hearted Knibb, who, in op position to the entreaties and arguments of the more timid who surrounded him, made a solemn vow ou the missionary plat form that he would never cease his holy agitation, till slavery was no more.—( Immense chering.) He thought in these days that there was in the wondrous providence of God a most ex traordinary coincidence—a coincidence which should serve to excite their hopes and inspire their confidence with respect to the growing triumph of man's rights and universal liberty.— ( Cheers.) He could not forbear exclaiming on a recent oc casion in that Hall, with respect to the devotion of their be loved friend, Joseph Sturge, " America, the shouts of our jubilee shall reach your shores across the wide-rolling Atlan tic !" and lie wished to give their present triumphal proceedings a bearing upon that land of cruelty and crime, where every fifth human being they met with was a slave, and where there was an internal slave trade carried on of an equally outrageous character with the African slave trade, including all the hor rors of the middle passage.—( Hear, hear,) When they re membei ed that the African slave trade, as now carried on, involved the sacrifice and enslaving of such numbers of human beings, perhaps of a thousand every day, because, in order to secure 150,000 slaves, it is computed that 150,000 murders are committed before they are landed on the opposite shores of the Atlantic, and they must also bear in mind that the very track of those dealers in human blood is strewed with the bleached skeletons of their victims.—( Hear, hear, hear.) But be assured, frightful and true, alas, as was this pic ture, that the internal slave trade of America, with the re volting system of increasing the numbers of these hapless beings, was the occasion of an equal amount of misery, and destruction of human life.—( Shame, shame.) The coincidences to which ho referred a little time ago were those which related to the agencies which God had called forth for the accomplishment of' his divine purpose. •In England they had their Joseph Sturge —(Cheers)—a name ever to be embalmed in their hearts with those of the highly honoured philanthropists of this and other countries, who had gone to their reward in a better and hap pier world. While, however, Joseph Sturge, and the gentle men associated with him, were employed in guaging the mi sery of the slaves in the West Indies, there was at Ole very same time a deputation from the Anti-Slave r y S oc i et i es o f America engaged in a similar work of Christian philanthropy and love. They also returned after an absence of six months, during which they e xplored the islands of A n ti gua , B ar b a d oes, and Jamaica ; and lie held in his hand the report of those Mis sionaries in the cause of suffering h uman i ty, attest i ng i n all it s c ircumstantial points the reports of Joseph Sturge, and those who had been associated with them.---( Hear, and cheers. ) They were all aware how powerfully Mr. Sturge had wrought on the judgments and feelings of the whole British people, as well as on the heart of every philanthropist in the world, by his affecting and simple narrative of James Williams ; but, per haps, the meeting was not aware that there were two James Williamses—one of whom was an American ; and he held in his hand the narrative of the latter, as taken from his lips. He would not trespass on their time by reading any portion of its me lancholy details out. He could assure them that there was not a paper extant that he knew of, of more stirring and ex citing power than thi s d eep ly a ff ect i ng narrat i ve o f t h e American James Williams ; and while they had their 1,369 Anti- Slavery Societies in that country, all moving on with themselves in the same blessed cause, should they not be in spired with hope arid confidence, and call on the Americans to look at the British nation. Should they not call on the Christian Church to keep its eye on British Christians ; and above all should they not call on those two or three millions of oppressed slaves to move on in the same career of patient en durance for a time, and achieve, as their slaves had done with the co-operation of Christian Missionaries and philanthropists, the same liberty and independence.—( Enthusiastic cheering.) SA NII:FL LLOYD, ESQ., briefly seconded the resolution. Mr. Seelioe begged to say a word or two in explanation of what had fallen from Dr. Hoby, in reference to the American James Williams, and the atrocities of American slavery, as de tailed in the account which he had given to the world. That individual had undergone a most searching inquiry as to the truth .of his narrative, and so satisfied were the Committee of the American Anti- Slavery Society cf its faithfulness and accuracy in every particular, that they had printed and circulated no less than ninety thousand copies of the book. He gave so appalling an account of the ho.rrors. of the cotto n pl an t a ti ons i n th e S ou th ern St a t e s, that his mind was deeply impressed w ith the conviction that they sbou d unite in re f us i ng t o u s e s l a v e g rown cotton as was as w slave grown sugar, until this atrocious system as pt t an end to.—( Loud cheers.) When in Jamaica, he wou'd take that opportunity of observing, that he had not an opportunity of seeing Dr. Palmer, who, he was informed, bad ;one to England to look for redress from the Government at Ilona.. Not being so well acquainted, as it had been said his privilege to be, with the manly fortitude and moral courage which distinguished his character, he confessed, from the sys tem which he knew was generally adopted by the Colonial Office, that he was alarmed at his coming at all to this country ; for the plan pursued by the Government at home wa, when ever they found a magistrate or any other individual of suffi cient influence from the Colnsies likely to make a noise, by disclosing the misdeeds nhU h were perpetrated under the sanction of Bliti:,11 authority, they offered him some conifcr:- able and more lucrative situation in another quarter of the world, and thus endeavoured to stifle the cry for justice.—( Hear, hear, hear.) He expressed this feeling to Mr. Phillips, one of the missionaries, who entirely set at rest his fears upon the subject, and said that he was persuaded Dr. Palmer needed no encouragement to tell the tale of the miseries of the negro, but the conseiousnass that by so doing he would be vindicating his own rights, and the rights of the oppressed slave.---( Loud applause.) He ( Mr. Sturge) had strong reasons to suppose, and if he was stating that which seas not correct, be called on the Colonial Secretary to deny it, that if Dr. Palmer had been disposed to take a situation, and not tell the country what he knew, he might have been provided for.—(" Shame, shame.") But he came before the public and disclosed the atrocities perpetrated under the name of apprenticeship. He perhaps should inform the meeting that the reason why Dr. Palmer was dismissed was that he had " administered the abolition law in the spirit of the Eng. lish Abolition Act." He had come to this country to endeavour to obtain justice ; but Government having refused to afford him that which he sought, and to which be was justly entitled, the friends of the cause had set on foot a private subscription on his behalf, for the sacrifice he had made, and he had the plea sure of informing the meeting that they had collected for this purpose upwards of 1,000/.—( Loud cheers.) Dr. Palmer's sacrifices far exceeded this sum ; for: it was not his personal sufferings only, but his wife and large family had also suffered with him. The resolution having been put to the meeting and adopted, Dr. PALMER came forward amidst great cheering. He con fessed that he never in the course of his life rose with feel ings of such deep emotion to address any assembly as on the present occasion—so deeply did he feel affected by the kindness that was shown to him, that he could not find words to give expression to his gratitude. He felt, however, perfectly conscious that it was rather to the principles which they advo cated, than to any merits of their own, that the flattering com pliments conferred upon them by so large and respectable an assembly had been paid to himself and his friend Mr. Harvey. ( Cheers.) With regard to any sacrifices he might have made, or any privations he had endured, they were far more than outweighed by the splendid victory obtained in the cause to ehich he had been devoted for the last seven years of his life. —(Cheers.) His anti-slavery principles were imbibed in the midst of slavery itself. He went out to Jamaica twenty-three years ago, without any settled principles upon the subject, and he must confess that his first impressions were by no means unfavourable regarding the system which he saw in operation. He saw none of that slavery which had since been so vividly depicted, and by degrees he became inured to all its horrors. Ile was thirteen years in Jamaica before he began to see its true character. Ile had known of cases of atrocity having been perpetrated by individuals, but they were those that might have occurred in any part of the world, and whenever they came to his knowledge he took care to denounce them. But a change soon came over his opinions. The discussion upon the subject in England induced him to look more nar rowly into things, and by degrees he began to see them in a different light. Fact after fact burst upon him, all showing the abominations of the system. In 1831 he brought forward a case of most flagrant cruelty to a mother and her daughter, committed by the custos rotulorunt of the island and his wife, and his advocacy of the unfortunate beings subjected him to much persecution. From that moment he became a marked character, and from that moment he took his stand on those principles which he had since steadfastly advocated.—( Cheers. ) This continued till 1834 when he accepted the office of special justice, and from that time to 1836, when he left the country he never knew what it was to enjoy a respite from persecution. It was a part of the system to crush every man who attempted to take the part of the negro. But they had at length put an end to this system.—(Cheers.) With re gard to the future, when he looked forward to the condition of Jamaica, the prospect cheered my heart to think that that country, the strong hold of slavery, was perhaps destined to be one of the happiest spots on the face of the globe. There were there the elements of happiness as complete as in any part of the universe. In the first place, they had not only destroyed slavery and brought to a termination the sufferings of thos) who were so long oppressed, but they bad also ter minated the slave.ty of the master, and he was persuaded that the Act of Emancipation would have the effect of regenerating the whole frame-work of society in tlk West Indies.—( Loud cheers.) It was a mistake altogether to suppose that there were no good men amongst the planters in these colonies, or to say that the greater proportion of them were innately bad. —(Hear, hear.) On the contrary, he was convinced that there was as large a proportion of good, honest, kind-hearted men (take them out of slavery) as in any part of the world. It was the poison of slavery that paraly zed their generous sympa thies; and he knew of numbers of individuals who would be perfectly shocked at the idea of doing anything dishonourable or cruel—out of slavery.—( Laughter.) Having removed this moral blight from the community, they might speedily expect them to spring into nets of active benevolence, and to join them heart in hand in putting an end to the atrocities of slavery, wherever it was found to exist.—( Hear.) But the happy effects of this great charge would not be confined to the planter. It would extend also to the negro population, who were as susceptible of good impressions as the most favoured portion of the people of this land. If they were once placed in a situation to protect themselves by being instructed in their rights, they would soon be found amongst the foremost and most useful auxiliaries in the cause of universal freedom all over the world.—(Cheers.) The first thing they had to do in order to effect this great object, would be to purify the Courts of Justice—( Loud cheers)—and for this purpose they must create a public opinion. —( Renewed cheers.) Public opinion in the West Indies had hitherto run in one current, and a foul current it had been ; but now a new order of things had been introduced, and he doubted not that honesty and propriety would very soon come into fashion, quite as much a s it was in England.—(Cheers.) All they' asked from the people of England was this—for the space of two or three years to keep their eyes open, to watch their proceedings, and to give them their sympathy and support, by which time he trusted there would be created such a mass of public opinion as would enable them, not only to protect themselves and establish their own liberties, but to organise Anti-slavery Societies (and effi cient ones too) for the protection of the negro wherever he might be found in bondage.—(lmmense cheering.) lie would return to Jamaica with the most cheerful feelings. lie knew full well that there would be manifested at first a spirit of hostility towards him by individual planters. They looked on him as their enemy, because he had been actively engaged in exposing their follies and vices, but he trusted in a short time they would come to look on him in the light rather of a friend than an enemy, as he once more went amongst them without a single feeling of towards those who had pursued him with the most determined hostility.—(Cheers.) Although he had experienced such persecution, he would not hurt a hair of their heads, even of Mr. Gyles himself.— ( Hear, hear.) All the horrors of slavery should be sunk in oblivion ; but if any man came forward and attempted to re establish the system, he would find in him the same consistent and he hoped determined opponent-4 Enthusiastic applause.) . _ Mr. STURGE here observed that as Dr. Palmer had not told them under what circumstances he was going back to Jamaica, he would just mention that the Government had entirely turned their back upon him.—( Shame, shame.) He returned to the island intending to follow his profession, and he trusted he would also have some connection with a Paper there that would be found acting with as much boldness and talent as their own Paper, the British Emancipator, which Dr. Palmer had hitherto conducted, was acting at home:—( Cheers. ) CHARLES LUSIIINGTON, Esq , M. P.. said as he was obliged to leave the meeting in a few minutes to proceed to London, he would avail himself of that opportunity of returning his grateful thanks, not only on his own account, but also to ren der acknowledgment on the part of his brother, Dr. Lusbing ton, for the kindness they had manifested on the preceding evening to them and the other Members of Parliament, wha had performed the delightful duty of coming amongst them. He had listened with the mast lively interest to the address of Dr. Palmer, and he was sure from its closing sentiments nobody would refuse to concur with him that they were highly honourable to the goodness of his heart and to the benevo lence of his character. —( Cheers.) He hoped they would all soon have the happiness to hear of his safe arrival in the West Indies, where he trusted he would have an opportunity of cheering the negrocs by describing the cordial feeling that was manifested for their welfare by the thousands who had as- sembled to celebrate their emancipation on the Ist of August in Birmingham, and also by announcing that at least five or six Members of Parliament were determined not to relax in their exertions till the entire and perfect freedom of the egnroes was achieved.—( Loud applaus.e.) BENJAMIN BAINES, Esq., M.P., next came forward. He said he owed some apology to the meeting for intruding even one word upon them—(" No, no")—as be was altogether a stranger in Birmingham, and came amongst them uninvited. —(Cheers.) At the same :time it was impossible for him not to say that the spectacle of so magnificent a meeting as he had witnessed yesterday evening was one calculated to make a deep impression on his mind ; and if the effect was confined to that it would indeed be a failure, but tb/ moral influence of that meeting would extend beyond the walls of that building—it would penetrate to the hall of many a planter, and strike him with dismay ; and it would also pene trate to the cottage of the slave, and infuse fresh courage into his heart —( Enthusiastic cheering.) This town was distin guished by its vast industrial resources, but it possessed higher claims to their respect, and he felt bound to say, as a Member of Parliament, that he owed the honour of his seat to the great moral courage it had displayed in a moment of imminent na tional peril. He trusted it would long continue to maintain its standing in the moral as well as the political world, and that the great influence which it justly exercised on the feel ings of the country would be long found enlisted on the side of those who sought for justice , and through justic e f or lib erty, and through liberty for the enjoyment of the prin c ipl es o f t h e i r com mon Christial,ity. That they might ever be an i ma t e d b y ef his heart, an d h e apple in s e e ! ) r a .. c A t f i t c e a r l I t e h g e i sI a meeting(t on.— the an these sentiments was the fervent w trusted he would live to see the ' resu l t of such a meeting tri leuanmstiPhluisiefi'alg-settitciinne, and the address of Dr. Lusbington, whose :perch he must say was marked by the very highest characte..i , t!es of eloquence, not only eloquent in itself, but enforced by the conviction that the speaker was sincere, mine rise . it, b e. the Pt 85"