The Sun. — London, England, 1836-06-03 00:00:00

Z -1 -4 • !. . •-t c SUN OFF CE, Seven o'clock. THE LON DON GAZE IITE THIS EVENING. WAR-OFFICE. Juvr 3, 1i336. is Fusilier Guards—Lieut I or:i IV. Ruder to be Lieutenant And Captain, by pnrcha:w. vice Fitzroy, who retires; E. J. Straeey, Gent., to be Ensig3 and Lieutenant, by purchase, vice Lord W. Butler, June 3. 3d Regiment of Foot—ElLiign 11. V. Chamberlain to be Lieute nant, by purchase, vice Jones, who retires ; K. M`Kenzie, Gent., to be Ensign, by purchase, vice Chamberlain, June 3. 16th Foot—J. A. Campbell, Gent.., to be Ensign, by purchase, vice Sparkes, who retires, June I. 25th Font—Second Lieut. W. Abbot, from the half-pay of the Ceylon Regiment, to be Ensign, repaying the clfTerenve,'June 3; Ensign E. R. Priest!ev, from the 45th 'regiment of Foot, to be F.nsigm, r.;.: 0 Abbot, who retires, June 4. 33d Foot —rnsign G. Ersltine to be Lieut.:. nant, by purchase, vice Messy, who I :tires ; C. Mil's, Gent., to be F.nsigo, by pur chase, vice Erskine. itzte 3. 45th Toot—J. G. Stnyil... Gent., to be Ensign, Ey purchase, vice Priestley, appointed to the :sth Regiment of Foot, June 4. 59th Foot—J. Tomline, Gent. t.; be Ensign, by purchase, vice Bell, promoted in the Ist \Vest India Re p ernent, June 4. 62d Foot--Ensign G. J. Fulton, from the 7 7th Regiment of Foot. to be Ensign, vice 3lulock, who exchanges, June 3. -, tith Foot—Lieut. R. C. Lloyd, to be Captain, by purchase, vice Dlarlton, who retires ; Ensign C. S. S. Evans. to he Lieutenant, by purchase. vice Lloyd ; T. Tyild, Gent., to be Ensign, by pur chase; vire Evans, June 3. 77th Foot—Ensign T. E. INlttlock, from the (2d Regiment of Foot, to be Ensign , vice Fulton, who exchanges, June 3. 85th Foot—Mrjor F. Maunsell to be Licutonant-Colonel, with- out purchase, vice 'Warburton, deceased ; Captain FL J. French to be Major, vice I\ launsell, May 23; Lieut. W. IT.Phibbs, from the..9'ith Regiment of Foot, to be Captain, vice French, June 3. gith Foot —Captain R. Keatinge, from the 99th Regiment or Foot, to be Captain, vice Maxwell, who exchanges, June 3. 93d Foot—Ensign W. P. Trevalyan to be Lieutenant, by pur chase, vice Fitz Tames, who retires; G. Studdert, Gent. to be En. sign, by purchase, vice Trevalyan, June 3. - 99thFoLt—Captain M. Ir.axwell, from the 87th Regiment of Foot, to he Captain, v'ce Keatinge, who exchanges, June 3. Ist West India Regiment—Ensign Pinder to be Lieut., by purchase. vice llumfrev, who retires, June 3; Ensign T. Bell, from the 59. h Regiment of Foot,• to be Lieut ., by purchase, vice .1. R. Grant, who retires, June 4. BREVET. Mizior G. Baker, on flebaTf:paiUnattached, to be Licut.- Colonel jn the Army, June 3. COMMISSARIAT. Deputy Ass._ taut Corcmissioniry-General T. C. B. Weir, to be A;sistant Commh:sionarv. Getroral, April 11. MEMORANDUM The date of the ceinm:ssion of the Rev. William Beattie Smith, as Chaplain of Stirling Castle, is Nov. 22, 1835, and not Oct. 23, 1835. The date of Lieut. DonaldOn's commission in the 41st Regiment of Foot, and that of Lient. Vaughan's appointment as Adjutant in nat. Corps, are Sept. 18,1832, and not April 12, 1833. BANICRUTPCIES SUPERSEDED. JOHN PHILIPPS, brewer, Wapping. THOMAS CUFF WEBB, ironmonger, Ilminster, Somerset shire. ROBERT HUNT, silk manufacturer, Steward-street, Spital fields. BANKRUPTS. JOHN SNOW, innkeeper, Timberham, Charlwood. Surrey. WILLIAM TOWNSEND and WILLIAM BROWN, ware to-tsemen Cheapside. WILLIAM BOOSEY, miller, Chatham. JOHN FOLG ATE, grocer, Chichester-place, Gray's Inn-road. ROBERT LUND, joiner, Bridlington, Yorkshire. W ILLIAM JENNINGS, victualler, St. Alban's, Hertfordshire. RICI-LkRD YATES, victualler, Great Wild-street, Lincoln's Inn-fields. • • JAMES Ft - Y!'. AY, leather-seller, Houndsditch. WILLIAM Gii:BS, soap-manufacturer, Liverpool. EDWARD MARLING, victualler, Melksham, Wiltshire. JOHN JEFFREYS ,and WILLIAM BARTON, wine-mer chants, Liverpiiol. JAMES FRANKLAND, elerchant, Liverpool. ROBERT RIDSDALE, horstsdealer, Murton, near Ycrk. MATTHEW ROBINSON LEC 4 GE, common brewer, uates bead, Durham. COURSE OF EXCHANGE.—(THIS DAY.) Amsterdam C.F. 12 OA ILeghorn D.tto, at sight ltotttrdain . U. 12 ttyt, Milan 3l Antwerp l2 hty Venice liaml,urg NI.R 13 14 Naples Altena Paris, 3 days' sight 25 ro LiNbon Ditto ....... .............. .2 Us. 25 941 Oporto 2 6 4 Marseilles. Frankfort ott Maine, Ex. M. 154 , Bahia• Petersbuigh, ruble 3 Us. 10 0 Buenos Ayres - - Berlin Vienna, effective fl °M.IO 11 Cork Trieste ditto lO 12 Madrid "6:ti PRICE OF BULLION, PER OZ Cadiz 37l{ Portugal Gold, coin £0 0 0 Bilboa atrrelona 'fiLi New Daubloons S , ville ';6y4 New Dollars Gibraltar ... THE MARKETS. t CR: ZW Lot[oit Gartent of last ni,-,v,t•-> - . 1-10k'S .—.The sale for Hors continues moderate, but the sup plies pric,as rolymini stcnay. The duty iS esti mated at I C 5,000/. 011..5.—A1.1 sorts of common Fish Oils have been in fair re qmst this week. Sperm is on the advance, and in good de mand. Rape and Linseed Oils in good request. COCIIINEAL is in, good request, mostly for shipping; one parcel of 100 bags son:l on Wednesday by private contract at quoted pries. TOBACCO.—The sales o Tobacco since our last are 120 biis. Virginia, mostly for f ,xport at 4! 5 d. a 51d. and 6-4 d. ; small parcels of Stripts at 81d. h 91d., and some leaf at s.'d. a 61d. Cocoa.—British Plantation is ap;ein cheaper ; 176 bags Trinidad at :public sale went at Is. a !s. 6d. under former rates, fair grey to dark red selling at 6s. a 555. The public sale of H 6 barrels Trinidad, this afternoon, sold at 525. a 545. for dark to good red, Is. lower. AloLas:,Es.—West India have b‘en in good re:pest this week, and higher prices obtained. Sales of good new Deme rara and Vineents, made at 305., and 31s. 6d. for fine To bagos. At public sale to-day 34 casks fine Tobago went at 31s COTTON.—The public sales of 23,000 bales East India ad vertised fur the 24th, mostly of the late arrivals, and which will be increased to 24.000 bales, have prevented much busi ness privately. The purchases this week are, 360 Bengal, bid. a 6d. ; 20 Surat, 7/d. TEA.—This afternoon Congous have finishes, the common ones are -V. per lb. dearer than in March, the fine ones are 2d. dearer, but mid. Is. 3%. a 13. 4d., blackish mixed leaf Is. 41d. a 51(1., rather strong Is. Bd. a Is. 11d., blackish leaf Is. 2d. a 2s. 3d.. di:to rather strong. and strong 2s. 41. 1: 2s. 9d. ; Twankays have began at Is. 6D. a Is. PE B. lAL PA 111, I AMEN I', HOUSE OF LORDS. The LORD CHANCELLOR took his scat on the Wool sack at Pi :e o'clock. LON))0N AND CAMBRIDGE RAILWAY. A mesaagt• from the Commons brought up the London and Cambridge 12 , 1.1wav Bill. DUNDEE BARBOUR BILL. The Dundee Ha.•bqur_ Bill was read a third time and passed. IRIS.'--I FISHERIES BILL. Mr. Ii RYE Y and others from tho Commons brought up the Ifish Fisheries Bill. CAPITAT, PUNISHMENTS. Lord Wll A NC LIF FE pre3entcd a petition from Hull, !ra)ing for the abolition of capital punisliments in all cases ex cept those of murder. IRISH CORPORATION REFORM. Earl GREY presented a petition fiom the Mayor, Alder men, and Common Council of Newcastle upon T)ne, regret ting their Lordships had altered the Irish Municipal Corpora tion Bill, and praying then' to pass the Bill with the same prin ciples in it as those %%Ilia were contained in the English and Scotch Municipal Bills. ABOLITION OF TITHES. The Marquis of CLANRICARDE presen:ed petitions from Kilmore, Galicay, and other places, praying for the total abolition of tithes; al3o a petition in favour of the Irish Muni cipal Reform Bill. The ConAolidated Fund Bill was read a second time. GREAT NORTHERN RAILWAY. The Marquis of LONDONDERRY presented a petition Yom the Society of Landowners residimz in and near Durham, 'u favour of the Great Nattier') Railway 13M. RAILROAD BILLS. The Marquis of CL A NRICA RDE seeing a certain Rail road Lill on the table which had been there for some time, wished to I:now from the promoters of the Bill whether it was their intention to move it a further stage ? He was anxious :hat if should be passed to. nlgiit and receive the Rural assent on The Duke of WELLINGTON wished to say a few w ord::. He hal certainly a very strong feeling respecting all Railroads. He wished they might be all successful, but at the same time it was desirable they should not be per petual monopolies established in the country. Under these circumstances be certainly thought it would be desirable to insert in all Railway Bills s::me clause to enable the , Government and Parliament to revise the enactments those Bills at some future period.—( (lear, hear.) By permitting certain of those measures to be carried into exe cution great injustice had been done to many land proprietors in the country, and they had been forced to submit to great inconvenience, and incur very large expense both in that and the other House of Parlirmient.—(Near, hear,) He had i:Ad :under his consideration for some days a scheme, whereby those Railroad Bills might be brovght under the serious ec nisideration of Parliament at some future period, and he was anxious that other proceedings upon those Bills shouic t ' be postponed for a short time, in order that he might mature :vow measure or clause on the subject. Lord VTIA RNCLIFFF, perfectly concurred in what had fallen from ilee Noble Duke. He woul I propose that the Re port of all Ra:lrouls ought to te printed, and a short time suffered to elapse Wove the third reading. The Marquis d CLANRICA !IDE concurred in almost all L'ult had fallen &oh: the Noble Duke, but this Bill bad passer; through the other House, and so far through the Lords without coposition. It might be allowed to pass to night, when it might hc,vme the law of the land ou Monday, if that oppor tunity was lest. it might not dome for a long time. The pro posed measure• wo:dd, he apprel;ended, be a general measure, and would equ idly affect those Bills which had passed, as well as those in progress:,, Ile would not press his motitst vainst the feelin2- but, under the circumstances, he hoped it might be alowed to be read a third time. The Duke of WELL LNGT ON said the. Noble Marquis was wron:. It would be impossible to make the me:tsure ye t rasrective. After this Bill had become the law of the land the shareholdeas would have a vested interest which Parlia ment could not touch. Viscount.NIELBOURNE agreed in the general principles laid down by the Noble Duke, but still the matter was one of difficulty. It was necessary that Parliament should take care the spirit of monopoly .s,hould be chcckcd. The Government would be alive to the subject, and provide s remedy in their power. The M,.rquis of LONDONDERRY hoped the law which was now proposed would be made- retrospective ; otherwise those Bills which had passed already would have a great ad vantage over others. Lord ELLENBOROUGH thought the best plan would be to appoint a Select Committee to consider the whole sub j.!et. It would not be possible to make a retrospective law. Lord HOLLAND thought the best and most proper plan to adopt would be, after the House had agreed to a clause, to insert it in one NI, and then make a standing order that it be inserted in all future Railway Bills. Lord ELLENBOROUGH did not think that that plan would be a proper one. Some Railways would be content with a lease of 35 years, when others might require 35. It would be better not to fix one absolute rule. Mr. BERNAL, and others from the Commons, brought up a copy of the Report of the Select Committee on the Leith and Newhaven Railway, and several other Bills. BISHOPRIC OF DURHAM BILL. Upon the !notion for the House to resolve itself into a Com mittee on the Bishopric of Durham Bill, The Marquis of LANSDOWNE rose, and was left s, eaking. HOUSE OF COMMONS. The SPEAKER took the Clnir shortly before 4 o'clock. IRISH MUNICIPAL IZEFORM. The SHERIFF of London appeared at the 13. tr, and presented a petition from the Lord Mayor, Aldermen, and Common Council assembled, praying the House to pass a measure fur Corporate Reform in Ireland, based on the provisions of the Bill for the Reform of Corporations in England and Wales. Mr. WOODTHORPE, the town-clerk of the city of London, p -esented a Return of the Police force employed by the city of London. IPSWICH ELECTION. One of the Officers of the Court of King's Bench presented copies of alb lavits relating to cases of bribery in the borough of Ipswich. Lord W. BENTINCK presented the Report of the Com mittee on the Clyde Navigation Bill. GLASGOW BRIDGE BILL. On the motion of - Air. OSWALD this Bill was read a third time and passed. WESSENDEN RESERVOIR. Mr. BLACKBNRNE brought up the Report of the Com mittee on this Bill. MANCHESTER AND CHESTER JUNCTION RAILWAY. Mr. B. WILBRAHAM brought up the Report of the Committee on this Bill. LIVERPOOL DOCKS. Mr. M. PHILLIPPS presented a petition from the, Cliam. ber of Commerce of Manchester, complaining of the present oppressive rate of dues exacted by the Liverpool Dock Com pany. SOUTHAMPTON WATER-WORKS. Mr. DOTTIN brought up the Report of the Committee on the Southampton Waterworks. NEWPORT AND MONMOUTH HARBOUR. Sir J. WROTTESLEY brought up the Report of the Committee on the Newport and Monmouth Harbour. BRISTOL DAMAGES COMPENSATION BILL. On the motion of Sir W. MILES the Bristol Damages Compensation Bill was read a third time and passed. FACTORY BILL. Mr. BAINES presented a petition from the worsted spin ners of Bradford, signed by a large number of manufacturers, praying that children 10 years of age may be allowed to work 11 hours a day in factories ; also a petition from the spinners of the parish of Badleagh, praying that children 9 years of age might be allowed to work 9 hours a day ; also a petition from the Flax Spinners of Leeds, praying that the Factory Bill now before Parliament may be passed into a law. The petitioners stated that although they did not consider their own interests sufficiently protected by it, yet from the amend ments introduced by the Right lion.' Gentleman, the Presi dent of the Board of Trade, all tLe eke:As would be accom plished. Petitions on the same subject were presented by Mr. BLACK- BvssE, Mr. HARDY, and another Hon. Member. Major APNA MARA presented petitions from two parishes in the county of Clare, praying - for the total abolition of tithes. Sir W. GE ARY presented a petition, praying for altera tion in the law of landlord and tenant. Mr. Sergeant WOUL FE presented a petition from Ct shel, praying for a reduction in the Church Establishment. In a district of sixteen parishes, attached to which there was an in come of 7,9171. there were at present only two Protestant Clergymen by whom the entire spiritual duty of the district a as olicient'y performed, although tile uun.ber o. Cfcrgymen wa s r ormer ioen or twelve ; and the petitioners instanced this a s a how much the Protestant Church Establishment millpt be reduced without impairing ks usefulness. Mr. BLACKBURNE presented a petition from the Trustees of a Turnpike Road in the West Riding of York lin, against the Turnpike Act Amendment Bill. Mr. BOWES complainei that the South Durham Railway Committee had not re-wsemb:ed, according to the directions of th 3 House. Mr. PEASE said the Committee bad been quite ready to meet on the first day of the sitting of the House after the recess, but the parties to the Bill had come to some under derstanding for the l rinting of the evidence, which rendered delay unavoidable. They however would meet, iii compli. ante with the orders of the House, very early next week, in order to consider their Report. Mr. LUCAS presented a petition from the Rector ai:d Curate and other inliThitants of Monaghan, praying for pro tection to the Sabbath and the prevention of drunkenness. Also a similar petition from the seceding congregation of tLe same town to the same effect. IRISH CORPORATIONS. Mr. TURNER presented a petition from Blackburne, pray ing the House not to agree with the Corporation (Irish) Bill as sent down by the House of Lords, and not to agree to any measure which is not of equal extent with those passed kr Scotland and England. Dr. BOWRING could assure the House that the whole district near Blackburne were roused upon this question, ar.d were waiting with much anxiety to see what that House wou:d do with the Bill. Mr. HENIZ. Y GRATTAN presented twelve petitions from different parts of Ireland, praying for the total abolition of t;:lies, and in favour of the Irish Corporation 811 as sent up tr. the House of Lords. The last petition was from the High ;,3heriff and inhabitants of the county of Meath. He might state as a fact, that the moment the people of that county heard of the Bill, they saddled their horses and atteaded the meeting, and Sir Wil liam Somerville, who had formerly opposed the Repeal of the Union, in consequence of the conduct pursued by the Lords, declared that lie would support it. PAP . glt DUTIES. Mr. GROTE presented a petition from the persons en gaged in the paper trade in the city of London, praying that the reduction of duty on paper might beeacc;impanied by a drawback equivalent to the stock in hand. IRISH CORPORATIONS. Mr. M. J. O'CO NNELL presented a petition froM Kil larney in support of the Government measure on the Tithe question, and praying the Housibnot to adopt the amendments, as they were called, made by the Lords in the Municipal Cor porations (Ireland) Act, Mr. AINSWORTH presented. a petition from Bolton in favour of Municipal Reform for Ireland. and praying the House not to concur in any measure of Reform that did not recognise the principles of popular elections in Ireland.. EXTINCTION OF TITHES. _ Mr. S. CRAWFORD presented petitions from Elmer Eat in Monaghan, Crscque anl Kelleskin in Queen's County, Lower Kilcoc and Upper Kilcoc, in the county of Dowr, from Magherelone, and from Iskeleen, in the county of Dou gal, praying for the total extinction of tithes, and'foe 'corpo rate reform on the game principles as the Bill passed for Eng land. The petition from Iskeleen prayed that if the Tithe Bill WRS passed the surplus would be given to the farmers. He could assure the House that nothing short of the total extinc tion of tithes would satisfy the Catholics and Presbyterians of Ireland. FACTORIES BILL Mr. M. PHIL LIPP S presented a petition from tO4 woollen manufacturers of Kettering, praying for some altera tions in the Act introduced by his Right Hon. Colleague (Mr. P. Thompson.) It was their opinion that the consequence of that. Act, unless altered, would be that many of the master manu facturers would be compelled to suspend their operations through want of hands, and it was their conviction that children of nine years ofoge might, with great propriety, and with a strict regard to their health, work durinea period of eleven hours. IRISH CORPORATION REFORM. Mr. D. BROWNE presented a petition, praying that the same relief which bad been granted with respeat io tha Cor porations of England, might be granted to Ireland. Alio, a petition from Killeen, prayihg for the total abolition of tithes. FACTORIES. Mr. 110 Y presented a petition from a place in the West Riding of Yorkshire, praying that children under szven years of age might be allowed to work eleven hours in the day. The Hen. Member also presented A petition from Bolton, praying for an equalisation of the duties on East and West India produce. MUNICIPAL REFORM (IRELAND.) l'h,a O'CONNOR DON presented petitions from Kilman au I othar plsees in the county RUSCEorianon, praying that the House of Commons wth4 f l not insult the people of j.reland by agreeing to the Lord amenkkents to the Irish Municipal Bill. Also petitions praying for the abolition of Tithes. Mr. F. FRENCH supported the prays; of the p f ii,i L ips, and presented others on the same subject. Mr, LABOUCHERE presented a petition from the borough he had the honour to represent (Taunton), agreed to at a public meeting of the inhabitants, praying that the House of Commons would not accept at*, amendments to the Irish Municipal Bill, which would have the effect q depriving the King's subjects in Ireland of Municipal institutions to which they considered the people of Ireland as well entitled as those of England. With respect to a petition presented yesterday from the borough of Taunton to a contrary effect, he begged to say, that although the signat . ures , attached to it were hi g hl y respec table still it did not repteseia the feeling s an d wishes of t'ic majority of the inhabitants, and furthermore, it was eot t ip üblie meeting. Lord GRAN VILLE SOMERSET had passed no opinion upon the petit'rm, but had merely borne testimony to the re spectability of the petitioners. Mr. 110 L LAND presented a petition from Worcester, prav i7g fir an extension of time to ray the money borrowel for building workhouses. Mr. CODRINGTON presc:4ed a petition on the sans subject. kr. SCARLETT p - csonted a petition from 280 electors cf ~!-e Bc:ro:►gl► of Lewes against the system of vote by ballot, .vhleh they designa•ed ts subversive of the pr . neiples of the British Constitution. Mr. HUME bad presented a petition from Lewes, hi favour of vote by bAllot, which had be.m agreed to at a public meet ing. lie supposed the present had been got up at a hole.and cwile: meeting. Mr. - SC A IiLETT said the petition which he had ju - t pre sented lad been signed by three times as many electcrs as the one - 0 which tit! Hon. Member had alluded. D:. BO WRING presented a petition from a place in Ayr, corepla:ning of mat-administration of the road trusts ; an pray'rig that statute labour might be aboliilicd ; also peti tions from the same place for the abolition of fkgging in the army and imi.recsment in the navy. Mr. HUME presented a petition from a parish in the county or Cork, praying that the blood-stained impost tithe night be abolished at once, and for ever, and that the Clergy mig'it be obliged to live upon the offerings of their flocks iii t.e same manner as the Catholic Priesthood. Also, one from t!.e chweliwardens and ialiabitsnts of St. Mary-le-Strand, which stated flat for the last 20 years the rector of the parish had annually received 1251. from it, and had only been seen in the parish once or twice. They therefore prayed that the House would not allow pluralities to exist on any account. Mr. A. TREVOR presented a petition from the Clergy of the Archdeaconry and Diocese of Durham against the Ap propriation of Church Property under the Iris Church Bill to other than Ecclesiastical purposes. Mr. G. HEATHCOTE presentedla petition from Lincoln against the General Turnpike Act. COLLEGE OF MAYNOOTH. Sir G. SINCLAIR gave notice, that on the sth of July he would move a suspension of the grant of money to the Col lege of Maynooth. FACTORIES BILL. Mr. SHEPPARD presented a petition from the West Ridirg of Yorkshire, praying that children ten years of age might he permitted to work eleven hours a day. IRISH MUNICIPAL REFORM. Mr. O'LOUGHLAN presented a petition from Dungar von against the Lords' amendments to the Irish Municipal Bill ; also for thu abolition of tithes. MUNICIPAL CORPORATION (SCOTLAND) BILL. At,the request of Sir G. CLERK, The LORD ADVOCATE agreed to postpone this Bill until this day week. TRADE WITH PORTUGAL. Mr. ROBINSON, in pursuance of a notice given on a former instance, had a question to put to the Noble Lord the Secretary of State for Foreign Affairs, whom he did not now see in his place, respecting an act of the Portuguese Government, in raising the duties on British produce with out notice to the merchants of this country. He begged to know whether the Noble Lord the Secretary for the Home Department on behalf of his Noble Colleague was able to afford any information on the subject. No answer having been returned the Hon. Member said he would postpone the question to Monday. Sir R. BATE SON begged to ask the Noble Lord the Se cretary for Ireland, whether he had received any petition from certain magistrates of the county of Londonderry, complaining of the removal of Mr. Gore JOnes? Lord MORPETH had neither received nor heard any thing of such a petition having been forwarded to him. Mr. JACKSON had received a letter from Londonderry, staling that the petition had been forwarded. STAMP DUTIES. Sir JAMES GRAHAM begged to know when his Ma jesty's Government would bring forward the question of the Stamp Duties? Lord JOHN RUSSELL could not fix the day precisely, but it would come on on Friday next, or some day subsequently. COMMUTATION OF TITHES (IRELAND).— _ _ . ADJOURNED DEBATE. The Order of the Day for resuming the adjourned debate having been read, Mr. JACKSON had intended taking part at an earlier stage in the debate, but he did not regret it, as since its com mencement several gentlemen had addressed the House, and he thought they had in its progress the important question now under the consideration of the House justly and truly stated. The question now resolved itself, were they to have an established Church in Ireland or not. Perhaps he had limited the question into too narrow a compass in stating it so, but be believed the question was one affecting not only th 3 into egg of Ireland, but of th t great and extensive empire. The question was no less than this—were they to have an Estabillud Church at all ? And sooner or later it would ome to thi —were they to have preserved to their and their posterity, the blessings of the Protestant religion. That was really the qu2seosat issue between the two sides of the House. It had been openly avowed that the " nuisance," as it was called, was is be abated. Delenea est C. rthago." . and the flon. and L'earnecL.Member for Tipperary past last night, amid the startling exclamation—" down with an insti tution which cannot be sustained save by Old Sarum and Gatton." Others had distinctly stated both within and with out that House, that the nuisance must be abated, and he was quite aware that the Hon. and Learned Gentleman had spoken of the abuses of the Church, but he believed be would be borne out by the gentlemen around him, that he had faithfully stated the Hon. and Learned Member's language. The Hon. and Learned Member had afterwards said perhaps he ought to be understood as confining himself to the abuses of the Irish Church. At the time the Hon. Gentleman was addressing the House, he had made a memorandum as he proceeded of the several topics he urged as bearing upon the Established Church. The first and main charge he preferred against the Esta blished Church was, that Ministers had had the audacity to assert their claims to a legal and incontrovertible right.- -( Cheers.) Now, he would ask if the Protestant Clergy of Ireland had asserted their rights through the laws of the land, were they to be maligned and upbraided for doing so?— (Loud 'cheering.) The property had belonged to the Church for ages, it was the property of the Church by a period of prescription of great duration—it rested not only upon the prescription of ages, but upon one of the most solemn compacts that ever could be made.—( Hear, hear, hear.) He referred to the Legislative Union which was between the two countries.—(Cheers.) It was by express enactment made an indispensable and fundamental part of the union that the united church established in Ireland should be maintained and preserved. It was not to be forgotten- that that was an Act not passed by merely the representatives of a Pro testant unto •, but by the representatives of the people of Ireland, who were in a great measure Catholics. The next charge pre fer: ed was against the body of the Clergy, that they had not only asserted their rights, but they held them by a Indy called the Lay Association.—( Hear, hear.) Hs attended :n h:s place on the d ty in which that notice was moved. It was not moved—it was withdrawn sub silentio. It w s put again on the book on a day • hen his duty compelled him to be in the sister country.—( Hear from the Opposition ) It was, however, o .ly just to say that the Honourable and Learned Member, on his ( Sergeant Jackson's) statement, withdrew his notice for that day. From that time he bad heard nothing rno:e upon the subject. It had never suited the co iveni' ace of the Learned Gentleman to br:ng the question for ward. If lie did bring it forwards, lie ( Sergea:a Jackson) would be prepared to meet him. Ile ecared not but that he would satisfy the House that this asso ciation so far from Icing Mega!, was perfectly warranted by the spirit and the word of the law of the land.—( Hear, hear.) The next top!e which the Hon. and Learned Member had ventured to touch was that the High Court of Exchequer had arrayed itself against the Government of the country. Hon. Gentlemen cheered. Did they think it right that such c•iarges should be made ?—( Loud cheers from the Opposi tion ) Did they think it likely to be useful to the country, or that it w uld produ,:e respect for the law or its officers.— ( Renewed cheering fro.n the same quarter.) Was it to be believed that his Majesty's Ministers should sit and hear such chaiges, and not one of them rise to refute them. —( Loud cheering from the Opposition.) Nothing could be more mischievous than charges of this description. But the charge might be very justly inverted, and it might be said that the Government had arrayed itself against the High Courts of Law.—(Tremendous cheering from the Oppo sition.) Insinuations had been liberally dealt out against the Judges of the Court of Exchequer personally—( Hear, hear)—and, amongst others, it had been said that Baron Smith had attended for the first time after a great lapse of time, when this important Tithe question came before the Court. The Learned flaron had no notion that such a motion was to come toonCoonwl-'Jfidoray and thespe y e e ia t l i p t u ha rp ti osa ri lth as e s u eed although; absent he for P so 4 m nl e e f d o a r ys er b i a p f p e e re ra f r rr he sh e H d o d n in . g an o d f L bl e o a o r d ne i d n a b ri t3 d r and had particularly referral to the Rathcormac slaughter. Every man of common humanity must deplore that molaneholy evont but was this chargeable on th e Ch urc h o f I reland or on the sespeatahle clergy belonging to that Ch urc h. H e too k deny thitt it ;v as c h argea bl e upon the clergy, but t on himself hewould to tell the house who v .- ro:ponsible for the 6100 that had been shed. The Agitators, an d t h e Agi tators o popl weft) the parties upon w h om t h e responsibility must devolve, With pe4papt t.R the Rathcormac affair he denied that the clergyman t' ;/1 ally g ecocfa oigrzegme in the blood that had been shed ; what were the facts it a la.ge arrear of tithe was due by the widow Ryan, and • ot h er par sbiotic/4 to : 1 1 'tst rottegeop%Rider and others; and when he ace.liod fur payment they told hirn p ;g4 l4 be worth a week's purchase if they eernplied wio his dprnand, but that jf be brought the military or police, and showed that they were acting unc l er cpmpulsion, he shoulu haye ever y =billing of his tithes." Under ilies t i FirellTnitsneel the MTh . .. deacon applied for the aid of the military, which the Gove r ri, munt of that day very properly granted it. The soldiers were telilig - ed ~,o fire, in order to preserve their own lives, for hey were hemincd up i n a r iarrn7 lane by the peasantry just like !he unfoi lunge police, whose lives ”re shock. These were the plain facts` of the c'ase, p n 4 lie put to the Holise 1,;;;;;;ther the respectable Clergyman vvasuChfilrge able with the 'inOlalicttoiy 9f life which had unfortu nately taken place.—t Heel, 1 ;; a r . 1 h . ;Fiff.Fr Af the expedients resorted 'to lie %yell! • state ttlIS fact. There wills f4hihited in front of the Colln-dace-room of c.rie of ,he candidates fop the city pf port n Kintinfii or daub,re presentincr the massacre at ktaihcprpo9; 1,1 , 4 op terror and excitement, that the Kings troops were obligle4 to be called out to iwitppt YPteP pirif to the heStings ! ihe Hon. and Learned effM , It d MAR 1 . 1 1 11 'Pith*: mac to L►niscarra, the circumstances connected with which :rcre, so far as regarded the character of the clergyman, more unfounded if possible than the other. That clergyman was stigmatized as a murderer, and in the eloquent language of the Hon. and Learned Member he had been described as wiping the tears from his eyes with hls bloody hands. The only thing was that there was not a particle of t► uth in that statement. Mr. El. G RATTAN said the statement was quite correct. Mr. JACKSON—Did the lion. Member mean to say that the statement of the clergyman wiping his eyes with his bloody bands was literally true ?—( Mr. Grattan again made an observation, but was called to order by the Speaker. ) The Reverend Gentleman was not present at all and the statement that he had pistols was equally groundless, for he never had a pistol.in his house. The lion Member then went into the circumstances connected with lnniscarra affair. To say that it was a wanton firing on the people, was a most grievous perversion of the truth .—( Hear, hear.) A Clergyman had sued an Hon. and Learned Gentleman, a Member of that House, and that Hon. and Learned Gen, tleman wrote a letter to the clergyman, stating he had his option between giving up his seat for Tipperary, and withholding the Tithes.—( Hear, hear, from the Opposi tion.) Was that an excuse for any man living, to with hold that from another which was justly due to him ?—( Hear. ) Was it to be tolerated that a man could not exercise his functions without heir'' under the protection of the soldiers even in the House of God.—( Hear, hear.) —( Cheers from the Ministerial benches.) The Gentlemen opposite cheered him as much as to say they had brought it upon themselves.—( Cries of " No, no.") If the Clergy were no chargeable with it, who was ? It had not happened by chance only, or accident. It was the consequence of causes. The causes were agitation—( Loud cheers)—long• continued and reiterated agitation—agitation and misrepresentation directed to a people who were the most easily excited on the face of the earth. If the Clergy were held up as murderers, if the magistracy were called murderers, if the soldiers were called the instruments of murder, and if the people were con tinually reminded of the blood-stained tithes, was it a matter of surprise that they should be led into excesses ?—( Cheers.) Almost uniformly the Protestant clergymen extend to their Catholic brethren the privilege of exemption from tithe. That had been done in the presentinstanco, and yet this Catholic Cler gymen asserted to his flock that he was to be sent to gaol for not paying his tithes. He had in his hand the letter of that man, expressing his gratitude for that very favour, and yet he had attempted ro point out this clergymaa to his flock as an object of their indignation and hatred. (LEFT SPEAKING.) IMPERIAL PARLIAMENT. HOUSE OF COMMONS, JuNm 2. IRISH TITHES-ADJOURNED DEBATE. Mr. BARRON'S speech continued from our last night's debate. * * Would the House refuse 50,0001. for the education of the people of Ireland, while at the same time they taunted the people with being a brutal ignorant people? How could they be otherwise than ignorant when whole parishes were to be found in which there was not a single school? They told the Irish people that they were not capable of governing themselves, and yet refused them the means of education? He implored the House, for the sake of pro perty, not to drive the people of Ireland to desperation. It was monstrous to tell a whole nation that they must remain in ignorance, and have no share of the means provided for moral and religious instruction. There was now an opportu nity for a rational compromise between the two parties that divided Ireland. Was it worthy of the Right Hon. Baronet opposite (Sir J. Graham) to endeavour to excite the religious feelings of the people of this country against the Catholics of Ireland ? He could tell that Right Hon. Baronet that the days of Lord George Gordon were gone, never to return. The people of England were no longer to be deluded by such means. He could not help thinking that if the Right Hon. Baronet were seated on the Ministerial instead of the Opposition benches, he would not have such a holy horror of Popery as he now professed. Did not the Right Hon. Baronet know that the Roman Catholic religion was the religion of the great majo rity of civilized Europe ? They had already put power into the hands of the Catholics of Ireland, and yet they looked upon them as alien in feelings to their British fellow-sub jects. This was a state of things that was unnatural, and could not last ; and the sooner it was put an end to the better for the peace and happiness of both countries. Mr. G. KNIGHT said it would not have been wonderful if, after the manner in which promises had been broken, after the total failure of that reconcilation which was to have ensued, after the deeply-to-be-lamented conduct of the political priests, and the prostitution of religion to political purposes, he did not think it would have been wonderful if any man had been induced to take up, with regard to that question, an en tirely new position. But it was not these considerations which made him think the Established Church less out of proportion than he had thought it, but because since 1832 its proportions had been materially changed. In 1833 inquiries had not been instituted, and it was confidently asserted that the annual in come of the Irish Church amounted to no less than three mil lions. Since that time the truth had been ascertained. Lord Althorp—whose very name is a guarantee for good faith—had declared in his place that on no subject had he ever known so great a delusion to prevail. The real income of the Irish Church was found to be 800,000/. ; from that amount 60,0001. a year was diverted to relieve the Catholics from tha ccss of whiell they loudly complained. —( Hear, hear.) Ten Protestant Bishops were swept away ; the revenues of the Established Church were reduced, and a large measure of Irish Church reform was carried into effect. This was the explanation of his no longer entertaining the same opinions be had expressed in 1832. He was aware it was said that a part of the Cabinet of Earl Grey had not considered his measure of Irish Church Reform as a final measure ; but in his (Mr. G. Knight's) opinion nothing was so directly the reverse of good government as when great changes were made speedily to return to the charge. Such a practice created a perpetual expectation of change, and gave the public mind a habit of restlessness the very opposite te'that which it was the duty of all Governments to instil. He ventured to ask whether it would be consistent in him to do anything but strenuously to oppose the secular principle which was the ground upon which the Noble Lord the Secretary of State for the Home Department had declared last night he would take his stand It was that principle which met him on the threshold—that principle for which alone the warmest supporters of the Bill avowed they thought it valuable—that principle which per vaded every line of the present Bill, of which the enactments were prepared with as much labour and astuteness as if it had been entrusted to the arch enemy himself. He admitted that his Majesty's present Ministers were in honour bound not to omit the principle from their this year's Bill—but he re.. gretted that abstract principles should be dragged from the closet and ebtruded on legislative assemblies. So brought forward, they were always the symptoms of morbid excite ment, and often the precursors of fatal events. Men went wild about abstract principles—nations are convulsed in their name. The National Assembly of France, in 1789, teemed with abstract principles, and prepared itself with a course of them in a career of crime and of blood—whilst, on the other hand, there was not a single abstract principle to be found in our Bill of Rights, because the Statesmen of that day knew how unwise it was to introduce them. Nothing, it was now clear, would satisfy the disturbers of Ireland but the complete subversion of the Protestant Church, and the establishment of a Catholic Church, and a separate Catholic republic. If these things were desirable, were they possible ? Would the great body of the Scotch and English people ever consent to the establishment of a Catholic Church in Ireland? and if it were established, would that give Ireland tranquillity? Would it not drive to desperation a minority powerful enough to disturb the peace, and certain to do so, if cruelly outraged ? Tran quillity would not be obtained. The scene of agitation would only he changed. He was disgusted with the attempt to get religion done cheap, and lie was astonished to hear the Noble Lord (the Secretary of State for the Home Department) re mind them last night of the miserable pittance received by some of the working clergy of England as a thing worthy of irnita tion. The servants of the altar were not, after all, "hewers of wood and drawers of water." A Minister of the Gospel was not to be bargained for and cheapened, like a damaged bale of goods. He contended that Ministers had no right to cut down the Church for the sake of creating a surplus ; and that, by this Bill they did so cut it down much below the necessary amount, as had been abundantly proved last night hy the Noble Lord the Member for Lancashire, Rut there were two propositions before the House, the Reform of the Church and commutation of Tithes. About the latter there was but one opinion, It was most desirable that the tax should be transferred from the tenant to the landlord, and remove the irritation and collision which arose from the present manner of collection ; and in Ireland, where the collection was so pecu liarly difficult, it was fair to give the landlord a fair coinpen sition, and it was no hardship to make him undertake the risk, because the greater part of the land was in Protestant hands, and therefore it would only be a payment from a Protegam propriotor to a Protestant Minister, in Ireland there roust al selo be Protestant landlords and Catholic tenants. He did not suppose the House would ever adopt the suggestions of the Priest of Carlow, and sanction the ejection of the propriotays of the soil, fa the peonnloy pot of the matter, the landlord was alone concerned, fur evctt tually the tenant ceased to pay in tithe, he would pay in pont, This would assuredly s he the case sooner or later in a country whore there was a greater competition for land than in any other country in the world. The catholic tenants are therefore exactly the persons least con vernal, though they were always brought forward as the stalking-horses on this occasion. It was first represented they would be so much the less poor for every farthing taken from the Church and then they were significantly fcrelP.lo laf ocir nitmPeP-=t4 six 910 1 !clit - 4 weN tit eyer. bytmdished in their faces. 1 But this was nothing but tic argument of physical force = the argtiment of anar;hy--the tocsin cif civil Mir i Ally thi4 wag 4 1 11PTIptit wi l ich th e lintio wc l ttici !mar be in -4401°0. Tint they Were all agreed about tithes i the point a t issue was the prepesal of pettieg down the Church to erect stFPIR. if Ministers really wished 0 do lastiPe to Ireland without introducing an erroneous principle or pandering to 1141 PaAgigliii they really wished to show that they eared for the Catholic population of Ireland, they would with one hand protect the Protestant Establishment, and with the other chnrge the Consolidated Fund with the pay of th.?. Catholic Clery they would provide a Reaiurla tfir PAtho 'ids t iluth, tiere 41 N4 4y r lwas for the treh t y t terians of ti 4 Wort fo . eneduth4e 'the dafhOle'repiron_Liiot as . an establishment—but as a statesmanlike Manner of 'shlig with tlley ere t and pf Otisnititig Nelltigs eserve to he I:9llfWa , as was pnikrofly c1: 0 1 1 , - cY.erY Other 'rro testßnt country of hurope. I-1e was reC c lirincliiig no; log Pitt, Vox, mote had bmi opinionof an 4 more than had beOn once confirmed 1 1.1 , t h a t -fouv. 1:01RIN would co me to the main point—Th e 4p , piiptttOn of the surplus thtit plight aria? from thy (Aura pro perty of Ireland after providing for the spiritual wants of the Irish Protestants. This property was originally wrested from the Roman Catholic Clergy, and given to the Protestant Clergy, with a view to the conversion of the population of Ireland to the Protestant religion. In this they failed, and the proposed object not having been attained, he considered it fully competent to Parliament to apply any surplus of it to purposes best calculated to promote the ,education of the Irish people, guaranteeing, at the same time, existing interests. Ile considered it the duty of the State to provide for the religious education, of all subjeczs, unless they entertained doctrines hostile to the public security. He cared not from what source the means were drawn, from local taxation, from the Consoli dated Fund, or from a surplus of Church property. Ile had looked carefully into the subject, and he must confess be could see no injustice whatever in contributing to the support of the Roman Catholic Clergy, from any surplus income of the Irish Church. lie should have been much better pleased, if, in stead of giving 301. per cent. to the Irish landlords, that sum had been employed to constitute a fund for the support of the 1;-i.Th Catholics. The question here was not as to 50,000/., or any other sum. The great question was whether Catholics were to be placed in all respects on the same footing as Protestants. In his view it made no difference whether the surplus was 10,0001. or 100,000/. The Noble Lnrd ( Morpeth) placed the amount too high at 360,0001. • In Scotland religious instruc tion was provided for a people much more numerous than the Protestants of Ireland at less expense than 300,000/., and it would not be denied that there was nowhere to be found a mere moral, a more exemplary, or a better-educated clergy than those of Scotland. The best course would be to throw all the Church property into a general fund, and let the clergy be paid out of it without any deduction. The Bishops of Ireland were too highly paid. From 4,000/. to 5 000/. a year was too much in so cheap a country as Ireland ; 2,0001. or 3,000/. a year, and 4,000/. to an Archbishop, would be amply sufficient ; an addi tional sum of 1,0001. might be given to such of the Irish Pre lates as had to attend Parliamentary dutieS. The net revenue of the Irish Church was, altogether, 795,0001., and from this a surplus might easily be had of 159,000/. or 200,000/. If ever there could be any excuse for a breach of the peace the tithe payers of Ireland were excusable for refusing to pay tithe. They were led into an error upon the subject. The Noble Lord ( Stanley) announced to them that tithes were extin guished for ever in Ireland. The Right Hon. Baronet (Sir IL Peel), on coming into office, declared that tithes could no longer be levied on the occupier, and the million loan was given up to him to indemnify those who had refused to pay. What was tobe done ? It was easy for Gentlemen opposite to oppose concession. They did not reside in that country, and were not daily alarmed with the dangers which threatened life and property. There were many Protestant Clergymen in Ireland who bitterly rued the course which had been purr' sued by their so-called friends and advocates. • •- • Mr. W. ROCHE said that the amount of tho surplus was not so much the object as the principle ; for, however small might be the amount which could be afforded for the purposes of education, the great point gained by it was that the admis sion of the right of the people to claim it, was evidence of good feeling on the part of the Government of this country towards the Roman Catholics. Mr. J. YOUNG thought that it was the general character of measures, more than their details, which the House ought to look at as important. The general character of the present measure he (Mr. Young) could not but look at as being very strongly marked. It was, in fact, as had been the former appropriation clause, adopted more as a means of humiliation to those who sat on that (the Opposition) side of the House and their supporters, than as being likely to affect the objects which were ostensibly put forward as being attainable by it. Hon. Members on the other side were constantly in the habit of talking of their seven millions, but he (Mr. Young) was convinced that not more than one hundreth part that number ranked themselves with that determined hostility to the Church of Ireland as was pretended by some Honourable Members opposite to be the feeling of the great body of the people of Ireland. Mr. E. BULWER said that much had been said about the smallness of the surplus, and it had even been alleged that there would, in fact, be no surplus at all that could be appro. priated ; but it appeared to him (Mr. Bulwer), assuming this last statement even to be a fact, that it furnished an additional argument in favour of the measure of the Noble Lord the Secretary for Ireland.--( Hear, hear, hear.) But, to come to the merits of the question at issue. Why, if sinecures were abolished on principle in the offices of the State, should they not proceed to legitimate the principle in the Church ?—( Hear.) The Hon. Member for Nottingham shire had admitted the propriety of appropriating a portion of the revenue to the advantage of the Roman Catholics, yet it was argued that it was illegal to appropriate a part of the re venue to the advantage of the whole people of Ireland—alike to Protestants and to Roman Catholics.—( Hear.) What, would posterity believe that the Noble Lord (Stanley), who had declared himself the godfather of the Protestant Clergy, who had promised and declared in their name, would after wards declare that the Church property of Ireland could only be appropriated to the uses of that Church alone? Why, were they not standing on the ruins of the great Catholic Church ? And should they decide adversely to their own title deeds ? Every age possessed abstractedly the right to modify and improve the laws and regulations of all preceding ages, in order to suit the increased or altered wants of the people of their own time; and it was upon this rule of legislation that t saatsa -aes.—ecneets rrortrtsie Aliaibterial Benches.) Talk of -Irish bulls I Why the Church of Ireland was the greatest Irish bull of all, because it was to be the Church of Ireland, .but not to be the Church of the Irish.—(A laugh.) Did the friends of the Church of England imagine they were serving her cause by tying a diseased body to the healthy one ? If they did they were mistaken, for they were only the more surely spreading to the healthy - body the contagion from the diseased one.-_.t Hear.) It had been said that the policy of the Government was one of concession. He denied it. They had succumbed, but they had not conceded. Adherence, obstinate adherence to principles, had ever been fatal to those who occupied the benches opposite. The Duke of Wellington declared against reform, yet schedules A and B very quickly followed upon that declaration.. They now stood up for the Old Sarum of the Irish Church ; but they might possibly, It their present opposition was successful, find that it was only preparing the public mind for measures of a atilt more sweeping nature.—(Cheers from the Irish Members.) The Noble (Stanley) had certainly drawn a most affecting picture of the present state of the Clergy; but what had they to thank fur it ? Why, the advocacy of the Noble Lord and his sup porters I For was there one man to be found who thought that, unless the Reform Bill could be repealed, it was possible to settle the question of tithe in Ireland without introducing the pria ciple of appropriation ? It was the principle on which the Noble Lord and his supporters advocated the cause of the Irish Clergy that had rendered the Church the real big begger man of Ireland.—( Laughter, in which Mr. O'Connell joined ) During the discussion on the Reform gill the Duke of Wel lington had asked how, if the Aiii passed, the Government of Ireland was to be carried on? An answer to that question was afforded at the time, when the Right lion. Baronet op posite, having assembled a House of Commons to wltneas his expected triumph, was told that without this principle of ap propriation the people of Ireland would not be satisfied. • At the same time the Right Hon. Baronet found it was impossible to carry on the Government of the country, unless with the accordance of a majority of that House. They would find that it would be impossible to make any compromise with Go vernments which were of the day only, at the expense of the power of the power of the people, Which was imm or t a l. H e saw nothing to be a l arme d at ih the people of Ireland, but ho saw much to be alarmed at in their discontent. —(Cheers.) Mr, AI AOl a n AN was sorry to h ear f rom the lips of the Hun, Gentleman who spoke last, such sentiments as had fallen from him on the subject of the Irish Clergy, Ile had no right to impute to them motives such as had been attributed to them. He presumed that he must suppose the Hon. Gentle man was not one of those who bad exerted himself for the support of the Irish Clergy? Who had created the cause of the distress of the Clergy ?—( Cheers from the Opposition, and cries of " Hear, hear," from Mr. O'Connell.) He thanked the lion. Gentleman for that cheer, and be (Mr. Maclean) would tell him . that ho believed that he <Mr. O'Connell), and those with whom he acted, wew the cause of that distress, They had been reminded by Honourable Gentlemon opposite, that the unkirtunate affair of Ratheor. mac was awing to the system of tithes. Now, he contended that it PM not owing to the system of tithes, but to the doctrines that had been preached on the subject, that had led to this state of things, (Cheers from the Opposition.) It was observed by the Noble Lord that if Queen Elizabeth had been a Catholic and James the Second a Protestant, there never would have been any security for the liberties of Eng.. land. The Noble Lord expressed a similar opinion, but in stronger language, in a subsequent part of his, book. .( The Hon. Gentleman then quoted an extraot from it, to the effect that in consequence of the Catholics having engaged in so many eeespieaelea against the Gov ernment and tliebeoustitu lknale the reigns of Elizabeth, James 1., and Charles I. and 11., the English Parliament felt itself compelled to adopt re strictive laws respecting them, and that the Legislature was was fully justitied in doing so.) Such was the opinion of the Noble Lard upon all u di ng to what bad occurred in the reign of William and Mary, He said that he could not doubt the wisdom of precaution, and there was no doubt as to the justice of the course pursued. He contended that they should make the Bible, on which the faith of the King was founded, as well as the principles of the national religion, the rule of their conduct. From that book every man might be able to judge for himself, and from the attentive study of which he ses s aid learn sufficient to overcome the sophistries o ;Nato or the Hon. Member for Lincoln.--4" lleer, hear,'A and laught s ois He would t e ll the and Learnt Member fel. gllkenny, who bed cheerer) him in a tone of irony io the course of his -address, that nobody felt more deeply than himself that the Hon. Oelitlerlizilt possessed greet power in Ireland. He (Mr. Maclean) was inns , aware of the prostrate state of Ireland, and he would'tell the lion, Member that there never was a case in which his intlaer e se could be exercised in a more beneficial or satisfactory manner for the advantage of both parties than thiL—(Cries of " Hear, hear.") He would say to him, in the language of one whose memory he knew the Hon. Gen tleman esteemed, Ireland was not dead, but oaly It was in the Hon. Member's power to brisi v --. ss t ‘i ersee4ies of' that country—( Cheer! fr y kffnisteqal, benclies)—and lie entres l s i t , p;' iys Nit? Ii ,t 14e of tliq !looms, to awaken her from the lethargy was slie TKO liear, hear.) Let him etideqedr to set this geessiee at Teat; which might be easily doe l e i toed they vse,al4 thusle ableto. bring out the energies of the coentry. —pear s 444.. Lord J'ctliN RuggE only wised to state that Isis , . . opit44 accoisumie‘ with that stated by Archdeacon POu Au the subject of a Chorch Ratablishment. Mr, MACLR AN explained. Lord MORPETH—Having on a former occasion sub mitted a statement to the House on this subject, I do not now feel called upon to trespass at arty length ott its attention to pflor an ° .llCri atir ni on this measure, except for •• t • „ cno pur- 'e nose of answering some objections which a pp ear to me 1 and to put tae true :risen in the course of the discussion, and in aov state of the case before the House. B that has been urged against the principle, I do not .argument called upon to enter. Because we rest uponbilitv of having irloptedthat principle, we hav e . no desire t o sl.rink fr o m the responsi n He ar ' hear ' ) it ; and it is our intention to act u or heavy, we make no compla;nt ; for I have not renounced An 1 whether the harden of asseiting po t our backs. —( Hear, hear.) Therefore we in the Bill of last this principle, nor have we made any change" to be an improved rear, except to adopt what we conceive t measure. I will machinery for its operation in the pres l e s n i.d it was my inter:- h t at ba p s ri n n b c t i not be diverted from the course which tion to pursue, has reference to spoke last, into that branch of history. whitterch. Pylectbherolikgehnt I must, how' ever, antiquity of the Roman Catholic Ch point of ever, observe, that I had thought that on theleast assailable. I anti quity the Roman Catholic Church was the Church to by following the Hono.uibable Member who admit that I consider it to be the duty of every afford every facility for the reading not conceive that this point is now before the H ,neat) to assert must say I hope that the Hon. Member did not . _ n tt,e, class that Fenelon and Bossuet were not to. be considered i dia!elY of Christians. To turn, however, to the subject imnie for before the House : I find that the Noble Lord the Memberwould the Scripturebsu;seb;ob 1.117,1 North Lancashire stated that his plan he had no doubt not ray be successful. I do not stop Noble Friend's general plan was better than that proposed ue l s. the Bill, but whether he had the power of adjusting the th q at uvr tion without the principle of appropriation ? lam sure .. to inquire whether or .IL cies would be successful. I must remind the House that two spc of Commor,,, Noble Friend would not offer a plan which he did not beiv.A of messages were brought down to the House last night, one by m y N o bl e F r i en d . the Member for .IV.. _ ttt Lancashire, from th e M os t R e verend and Right Reverend e . r n Bench of Bishops of th e I r i s h Chu rc h, stating that ~new were ready to adopt and accept the scheme propo.:,eded by ( 7 . Noble Friend ; the o th er message . wa s d e li vere d by the 11 Member for Newark (Mr. Gladstone), who apparently ! , IP' peared for the whole of the Upper House, and stated that they would never give their consent to any proposition on the sub ject, and this notwithstanding the august communication ,which.o - had been made shortly before.--( Hear, hear.) I believe that nothing that was said was conclusive on the. point; we shall, therefore, procure permits for the introduction of our goods, without further troubling ourselves on this ground.- -- . . ( Hear, hear.) With res p ect to t h e part i cu l ar measure whit! , my Noble Friend opened to the House, I do •not feel touch disposed to quarrel with him, for I think that there are sem° points which we might be disposed to adopt, but we never could bring ourselves to assent to the principle that ,whateve r surplus might arise f rom th e i ncome o f the Ir i sh C hurc h, that must be appropriated exclusively within the pale of the Est,' blishment.—( Hear, hear.) The Noble Lord, and all ssii° followed him, urged very few objections to the inunecLate ar rangement I proposed in the Bill before the House for the commutation of tithes. l am very much obliged to himf or this, for I felt that if th ere was any part of the Bill on whic h ... f I had misgivings, it was on t hi s po i nt, because I was a f r aid .s. t shOUld be told that it b ore h eav il y on t h e c l ergy o f t h e I Church. There is one feature in the scheme proposed by the Noble Noble Lord opposit e whi c h certainly is not to be met with our Bill—that, nam e ly, o f redemption. Upon this point 1 s. shall content myself w ith remar ki ng that when we have GfecTi us a task beset, as the N o bl e L or d acknowledges, win such complicated difficulties as th e commutat i on of t i t h es into a rent charge, it seems h ar dl y expe di ent to cour;,le with it the ba other very complicated quest i on o f redemr? ,tion. It will 1 much better to take the questions separtstely,—( Hear.) " s a have said, I do n o t w i s h to go at l ength into the objections and difficulties which are in the way o f re d empt i on , but I briefly remark, th a t if the rent charge be redeemed by money, if that matey Ise invested in G overnment Securities at 3siderable 1 per t., the parti es w ill fi n d t h emse l ves su bj ec ted t s °, o con reel . oetion ; and if they be invested in land, they would s u ff er a l oss . T he Noble Lord last night said that the vSlue of land v a ried in different parts of Ir e l a nd • but being the case w ou ld on l y mater i a ll y add to the difficulty theof the question. Th e great o bj ect o f our Bill is to re li ev e , mind of the cle rg y man f rom a ll uncerta i nty and suspense aso,', the amount of his income and the receipt of' that ansoun!ii " but if the clergyma n b e converte d i nto a landowner there vit!i, not only be no end t o t h e co lli s i ons between him and t tenants, but his property as suc h w ill b e, of course, sobieca to all the fluctu a ti ons an d casua l t i es which attend laude sf property from bad weather, bad markets, an d a score es other contin genc i es .—(H ear, h ear.) What security c it will he h ave th at hi s tenant w i ll not neglect his land , a n ss? having suff ere d i t to go to waste, throw it upon his hanu i a None at all. I will not go further into this point, but I is repeat that I consider it highly inexpedient to embarras th - already very difficult and complicated question with the /Aa% difficult and compli ca t e d quest i on of redemption.—(le e hear.) Passing to th a t part o f the Bill which relates to ut - future distribution of Church property in Ireland, I may that I last night felt myself greatly relieved at the very . gated tone of opposition which I thought I perceived in the te, speeches of my N o bl e F r i en d and other Gentlemen s,plos i in comparison with the mode in which my Bill of last ye ar w he treated, and in co m p ar i son w i t h the mode is, which i s „ Noble Lord's ow n measure on t h e subject fsi Church rem' poralities was treated by the House:—(Hear, hear.) It'` that one Hon. .L.:....mett the p r esent Let s bavingTesei drawn up by th e arc h enemy of mankind; it was some compensation to find that other Hon. Gentle menhw were not qu i te so h ar d upon me.—(A laugh.) I two promitent grounds of o bj ect i on to t hi s measure appea r to be, first, the num b er o f rea l C hurch purposes which are at pre ' sent incomplete, and which it is urged must be fully accent; plished before we can make any transfer of a surplisa for th epurposes of e d ucat i on ; and, secondly, the alleged tow avers' of income which we assign to the Clergy. of Ireland. In refe r " ence to the subject of the first of these objesai ons , the num ber of real Ch urc h purposes which are left incomplete, 11 ; 1„s state that a nu m b er o f returns, which have been moved I have not as yet been able to lay on the table of the W il l as there has net been sufficient time to make them out, but am in no degree fearful of the strictest inquiry, which crin be made upon the subject ; there is no part of the matter frr which I wish to shrink. Our great argument lies in the mental maxim, the rightful tenure of property, as,d we h°' that we stand equally unassailable whether upon, an a r;t101: upon whi c h we procee d . As I have said, the ecific sp tical bala nce s h eet , or upon the great fundsSnental prinCiP retur n moved for upon thi s su bj ect h ave not as :set been made, bet ' may obse rve th at , f ormer l y, the board of first fruits in Irelan d ' d and the vest r y cess th ere , were intended to p rov id e for, a n t did, to a great extent, provide ;or many real ecclesiast i , ca s purposes ; an d t h at at Presssnt th e " general fund" 11604 under the ChUrch Tem Kralities Act is mad e a ppli ca ble to t" following. purposes :-44 I. To prosido thin gs necessary for the celebration o divine service in the church or chapel of every parish. " 2, To pay all parish clerks and sextons' salaries. . " 3. To defray th e expenses of building, enlarging, or re pairing churches and chapels. " 4. To fence and maintain church-yards. " 5. 'l'o augment small livings to 2001. per annum, and t ° purchase house and land for augmented benefices. " 6. To cotnpensate thu lay patrons of any livings t has may be divided under the provisions of the said Act. "7. To defray the expense of the commissioners, and " 8. To provid e f or t h e ma i ntenance of curates, &e., here tofore provided f or b y vestry assessment, under any statu te ' - law, or cust om ." These are p ur p oses to w hi c h th i s fund is applicable, and I cannot but think that they arc such as to satisfy Hon. Ni e fi hers that th e rea l purposes of the Church are not entirely at nought or neglected.—( Hear, hear.) In lieu of the sourc e of revenue of the board of first fruits, which it merged in a r i ; other board, an d o f t h e vestry cess, which it abolished, t he Legislatu re i n t h at measure thought fit to provide, for P „ - , same purpose s t o w hi ch these had heretofore administere?it other ecclesiastical revenues, which, though they obvioo t b could not fo r a cons id era b le time meet the purposes for c they were designed with out ass i stance from the p u blic tre e, , wry, are peculi ar ly calculated at a f uture period to rea lize . i t considerable surpl us . M y N o b le Friend opposite last nig!), stated that the wh o l e amount of permanent income which tati Commissioners h a d a t t h e i r di spos i tion to meet the permanst' expenditure of 69,009/., was b ut 29,0001. It is true th at I 29,0001. is the a moun t reporte d to have been at the dispocii of the Commissioners last year, but the Noble Lord omit te d to make any mention, as perhaps he ought to have done, what has occurred since last session.-_( Hear.) Two bishor c s have since f a ll en i n , name l y, Ossory, to the amount 3,5001. ; and C or k, to t h e amount of 4,3051 ; together 7,80 0 , Moreover, the p resent Bi s h op of Ferns and Ossory has becom e liable to the tax, on succeeding to the temporalities of time sc ° of Ferns on the demise of the late Bishop. The tax on eeck 9 , l- astical benefices rated by th e C omm i ss i oners last year at 75(9.. has been incr e a se d b y t h e Bi s h op of becoming als o subject thereto, an d by t h e several livings exceeding 300' which fell vacant last year.. The Commissioners, ii, their r c : part of the Ist of August last, state also, that in a p p of clerks to three additional (maces aniotoss . mg to an tire sum of 5971. have been suspended ; and I • am correct in statil that since the date of that report, the sinecure preeentorship ° ,l Elphin, amounting to 263/..,. less been also suspended ; 85 , e the 'lithe Bill provides for • sne suspension of another sinec° : , precentorship, to the ....mount of 1,000/., for the last two yc 2rs s ; so that when all. these circumstances are considered, not r; speak . of t' -„Q interest arising from the temporary investniQn t in ste',A of the moneys realised from the sales of perpcWiti e '' and which will be found for the half year to amount 1 0 1 .5401. ointments the aceessiou .of income under these additional sources for the present year.may be fairly estimated at 5,2001., making in 4 7 for the pr esen t y ear , 42,0 00 / . ; but this is exclusive of 31'/ moneys that may arise fr om th e sale of perpetuities within t,'', ‘ „; present year ; and wh en t h e H ouse hears that no 'lass a st. sotto 166,1511. has bee n rea li sed from this sos. ° a l one to the 25th May last, that is, w i t hi n the last two years. For the firsa ' six months the Co mm i ss i oners sold nothing_ that, indeed, r , ` their first report for the year spAklitrig August. 1y.35, they sr st" they had only sold 2,3C 1 , , - - 4.„( H ear, h eat. ) I will now , the permission of OAP House, proseed to place clear! - re; them th estue IVAlatate of th e prospects of the fund, s "tools the anst of:the funds the bands in the hans,S, ger ; contemplat e d b y the Church TemporaliVm, siastical OellirOisaioners, w he n . a ll the sour , a ' of ment Act, and the pr esen t Tith e ' Act, the c ee s realised I contrasted with the aourees .1, s h a ll h av e by Earl G rey , to ar i se under the u. ec t, rcv n lni.n j, of revenue estinia' PAs t C....hurch Temporalities alone, as foll ows CIIURCH TENIPORAUTIES & CT, 3 & 4 Will. IV., ch. 0 7 ' Revenues as at present contemplated t o arise from .40 I. Produce of suppress,. ,t • see 2. Reduction of the s • • otshopric of De rry , immediate sl and prospective.. 6 3. Futur'. red u ction of Arma g h see 4. rt.• s.aebe-house loan instalments, repayable for the tar fifteen years 7,„„a 5.. Tax on continuing bi s h o p r i cs 6. Tax on incumbent s o f b ene fi ces 793' Ship ben( T th e Jests Term cp me th itt 4.°l4nd THE miITN I LONDON, FRIDAY. JUNE 3 ; v:,36.