The Sun. — London, England, 1810-03-24 00:00:00

f Y L PARLIAMENT. HOUSE OF PEERS, FRIDAY, MARCH 23. The Bills on the table were for warded in their re speciiv, stages. - . . Tl,s Marine Mutiny Bill was read a third time and pa*sett. , Lord BATHURST gave notice, that on Monday rest he should move the second reading of the Irish Distillery Bill. Several Bills, mostly private, were brought up frac,' ►he Commons, and read a first time.—Ad journed till to-morrow. HOUSE OF COMMONS. FRIDAY, MARCH 23. A Message from the Lords announced their Lord ships' assent to the Royal Marine Mutiny Bill, and several other Bills. A person tram the Commissioners for Auditing Pubic Accounts presented certain papers, which w,re ordered to lie on the table. Mr. H. MARTIN rose, pursuant to notice, to make a motion, that a❑ Address should be made to his Majesty, that he would be graciously pleased to or der the proper officers to make a Return of the Of fices and Employments under the Crown, created since 1780, together with the salaries and names of the persons employed. • Tile CHANCELLOR Of the EXCHEA.UER did not objed to the motion, which was accordingly agreed The Irish Sugar Drawback Bill was read a se cond time, and ordered to be committed on Mon day. BENCHERS OF LINCOLN'S INN. Mr. SHERIDAN (having been called on by the Speaker) rose to make his promised motion relative t,) the Petition from Mr. George Farquharson against the bye-law of the Bencher's of Lincoln's Inn, by which bye-law the Benchers enacted, that no individual writing for emolument for a Newspaper, should be. admitted into their Society. He .had scarcely .uttered a word, however, when he was in terrupted by Mr. WINDHAM, who observed that there. was a sanding order of that House, the propriety of the enforcement of which was perhaps never more ap pmem than on the present occasion. His Hon. Friend, he had no doubt, was prepared with a pa negyric on a set of individuals, some of whom. might perhaps at that moment be in the Gallery of the House. In delicacy to their feelings, therefore, it seetned to him to be desirable that they should not be present during the discussion. The case was .similar to that of drinking the health of the Chair man of a party, ,which was never done until he had opiited the room. Mr. SHERIDAN called his Honourable Friend to order. He appealed to the Speaker whether he lakl not been actually in possession of the House, and whether it. was consonant to the usage of de bate, that he should be thus prevented from pro ceed:rig ? 'I he' observed, that he imagined the Hon. Gentleman (Mr. Windham) alluded to a stand ing order, which was certainly of great importance. In that case hotA ever he must, in conformity to the rules of the. House, confine himself to the enforce ment of that order. It was not in the Hon. Gen tleman's power to enter into any prefatory argu• meet on the subjea. Mr. WiNbeAm was proceeding with some fur ther remarks, when he was again called to order by NT- Sheridan. The SPEAKER repeated to the Hon. Gentleman, that if it was his intention to enforce the standing. erdcr alluded to, he must do so without observation. It was not a question which admitted of discussion. Did the Hon. Gentleman mean•to remark that there were strangers in the House ? After some hesitation, Mr. Windham replied in • the affirmative. _ _ The Gallery was instantly ordered to be cleared. : 0 1: o wing is given in a Morning Paper as the substance of v.hat passed while strangers were excluded ] Mr. SHERIDAN declared, that since the Right Honourable Gentleman had thought proper to en fore one Standing C r he, had very strong inten tiong of enforcing another.; which was, that the Committee of J udicature, which should .sit every Satuiday, should resume its duties. He desired to know from the Speaker, whether, in such case, the teferefice of Mr. F'arquharson's Petition to that C4n nlittee woktki not supersede the necessity of the pre sent motion ? The SPEAKER, according to the uniform practice of the HOuse, declined giving any hypothetical opi nion wh.lre there was not a distinct and specific mo tion before it. Mr. SHERIDAN said, of all people in that House he least expected the enforcement of the Standing Order fair the exclusion of the public from the Right Honourable Gentleman who had come forward on this occasion. He expected he would have eagerly seized this opportunity to recant the false doctrines which he had formerly so unguardedly uttered, and become a convert to the true faith of the freedom of the press. He expected this candid and conciliatory proceeding, particularly as the Right Honourable Gentleman had been so very zealous in the correc tion of his speeches, so very anxious as to the stress of his emphasis, and the modulation of his voice, And so studiously inquisitive as to the happiest atti tudes for giving his sentiments a pantomimic effect, tie was led, indeed, still more strongly into this expectation, which bad been so fatally disappointed, from the information that he had made amicable advances to Mr. Cobbett, and entered into a fair treaty of conciliation. These hints he merely threw otit for the consideration of the Right Honourable Geo;lernan. The parlicUlar object of his present motion was the condemnation of a Bye-law, enacted Iv the Benchers of Lincoln's-Inn, excluding Gen tlemen who wrote for the Newspapers from their society. This law chiefly affected those who re.; ported the proceedings in the Law Courts and in Parliament. Much illiberal calumny had been cast 'upon these Gentlemen, which ie 'has time should now fully be confuted. . He-had to state then, that were were amongst those who replied the . debates of that House no less than 23 Graduates trom the Universities of Oxford, Cambridge, Dublin, and Miptiurgli those Gentlemen were all in their' erg-. gress to honourable professions; and there was no possible course better than that which they had adopted for the improvement of their minds and the acquisition of political 'experience. They had adopted this course from an hottest and honour able impulse, and had to boast the association of many great names, who rose from poverly to reputation. This had long been the employ ment, and indeed chief subsistence, of Doctor Johnson and Mr. Burke. Such were the men at whose depression this legal bye-law aimed ; it was a most illiberal and base proscription of lite rary talent, and he could find no parallel in the his tory of England, except one indeed in the reign of Henry the Fourth, which vt ent to exclude Lawyers from sitting in Parliament. At this, as might be expected, the body who now sought to proscribe others was mightily offended; they branded the Parliament with the epithet of indoctum, and Lord Coke declared from the Bench, there was never a goad law made therein. It was to be feared indeed, if this bye law continued in force, it might as justly , be said hereafter, there was .never a good lawyer educated at Lincoln's bin ! He would, however, leave the individual grounds of the case altogether, and deMand of that House whether it would be wise to take the regulation of the press out of the bands of men of good education, literary powers, and aspiring genin4,- to place it .under the guidance of the ignorant ? Such an attempt had, indeed, been made some time ago in an instance which he would state, and which was frustrated by the enlightened liberality of the then Chief Justice. Previous to the departure of Sir James M'lntosh, the present Recorder of Bombay, for India, he applied tor Per mission, to deliver certain Lectures in one of the Law Halls. The permission was refused him, on the ground that he had once been a writer for a Morn ing -Paper ; but Lord Loughborough interfered, and obtained his desire, with the remark, that he, was happy the press' had fallen to such able guidance. There was not'a single reason for the enactment of this law ; it was a vile anack on the liberty of the press, and a most unjust individual proscription ; lt. was a violatioo of the best principles of our Con stitution ; " for (said Mr. Sheridan) it is the glory. of English law, that it sanctions no proscription, nor does it acknowledge any office in our -state, which the _honourable, ambitious industry, even of the most humble, may not attain." How dangerous was it now to attempt any invidious and unjust dis- . tinetion, when the period might be so immediate which would call for the united efforts of our whole population! Mr. Sheridan concluded by moving, " that Mr. Farqubarson's petition might be referred to the Committee of Judicature." The ATTOTINEY-GENERAL contended that the Judges, as Visitors, should have the controul of the lons of Court, and all matters within their jurisdialion. He quoted the authority of Lord Mansfield. Mr. WINDHAM rose to use the short monosylla ble 41 No !" to every assertion made about him, except as to the correction of his speeches. Abuse all, he never bad descended to any advance or the slightest conciliation with Mr. Cobbett. He would now leave the subjed to tho , e who came for the purpose of discussing it.—(He shortly alter left the House.) Mr. STEPHEN commenced a most manly speech (which we regret our exclusion prevents us from giving as fully as we' could wish), by declaring that he had been a Member of 'Lincoln's Inn for thirty five years, but that he had not the most remote con neelion with tie framing of this most obnoxious bye-law ; he thought it a most illiberal and unjust proscription—a scandal rather to its authors than its objeds. What could be its design but the de pression of laudable exertion ? " I will put a case (said Mr. Stephen) ; I will suppose a young man of education .and of talent contending with pecuniary difficulties—difficulties not proceeding from vice, hut from family misfortune—l will suppose him honestly meeting his obstruelions with honourable industry, and exercising his talents by reporting the -debates of this House, in order to attain a profes sion. Where, I ask, is the degradation of such an employment ? Who would be so meanly cruel as to deprive him of it ? THE CASE WHICH I HAVE SUP- : POSED, WAS THIRTY YEARS AGO, MY OWN. I was then acquainted with eight other Reporters, who have all since risen to the highest eminence in their respective professions, and one of whom has since had the honour of a seat in this House. Of their talents the public would have been deprived, had this illiberal law been in existence. I know well the effe& of attempting to degrade any class of men. I have seen it exemplified during a long residence in the West Indies : and I know when men are sup posed to be debased, they become so in fact, and disgrace that society which, but for a cruel injus tice, they might have adorned. The supporters of the Press ought, aoove all men, to be respected. The power of the Press in a free Government is as great as the power of the Sword in a Military Despotism : let the utmost caution and conciliation be u,ed towards it." If the direction of the Press were sought to be degraded, they would naturally become dissatisfied sAith the established order of things and there was no foreseeing what the con sequences migbt be of offending omen in the posses- Sioll of such a powerful instrument. Sir JOHN ANSTRUTHERL was also a Bencher of Lincoln's Inn, but reprobated the present law ; lie could not sufficiently admire the manly and inde pendent speech of the Learned Gentleman who had just sat down, and whose example was such as to render all argument unnecessary. After what had passed, he was convinced the law would be imme diately rescinded ; it was, indeed, most obnoxious, whether he considered the object it had in view, or the description of men whose exertions it went to impede—men among whom Addison and Steele bad acted in their day. The SOLICITOR GENERAL thought an application ought to be made to the Judges in the first instance, who had power to rescind the bye-law. Mr. CROKER highly disapproved of tha bye-law, and hoped it would be recinded ; he had na doubt, indeed, that this would be the case, provided the Right Hon. Gentleman's motion was withdrawn, which h'edid not think so shaped as to meet its object. Mr. SIIERIDAN in reply, declared, that any person who supposed be "sought popularity on this occasion had been completely mistaken : his only object was to redress injustice. The law of which he complained lad peep ena6ted two years a q, au,' the Ge.ntletneu of Lincoln's-Inn did not want time, however they might ha , e been deficient in inclination, to rescind it. An applie.i lion to the Judges might have the ef fect of rcdres:iinur ' individual injury; but nobody except Parliament and the - Benchers themselves, had the power of totally annulling the law itself. He was content, however, to withdraw his present. motion, on the assurances which had been given him, that the law should betescinded. He had attained his object; he had drawn from all sides of the House a reprobation of the principle upon which this Law was first established'. [The Motion was then withdrawn, on the under standing that the obnoxious Resolution should-be rescinded. Strangers were then re-admitted.] IRISH VOTE OF CREDIT. On our re-admission into the Gallery, we found Sir J. Newport moving for an 'account to be laid be fore the House of the application of the Irish Vote of Credit for the last year; which motion, how ever, after some explanations and observations by Mr. Foster and Mr. W. Pole, the Hon. Baronet was induced to withdraw. Sir J. NEWPORT, adverting to the discussion of the preceding evening, which he considered very unsstisfaclory, gave notice, that on Thursday se'n night he would again c ill the attention of the House to the subject, with the addition of five or six other charges against the Irish Government of a gross mis application of the public money. Mr. Rosa brought in the Linen Exportation Bill and the Sugar Bounty Bill, which were read a first time, and ordered to be read a second time on Mon day. The Message from the Lords requesting that T. W. Coke, Esq. might be allowed to attend the Se lea Committee of their Lordships on Tuesday, to be examined as a witness, was taken into consider ation, and Mr. Coke having signified his acquies cence, it was ordered that an answer be returned to their Lordships, stating the permission of the House to that Hon. Gentleman to attend. ARMY ESTIMATES. The Order of the Day for the further considera tion of the report of the Committee of Supply hav ing been read, Lord PALMERSTONE moved the re-commitment of the Report. Sir 'l. TURTON recommended a great diminution in the military force of the country. By the last returns on the table, it appeared that there were 93,000 regular troops employed abroad i 210,000 militia (including the local),110,000 volunteers, and altogether 552,000 men in arms at home. Abroad there were 122,000 regulars, and 140,000 sailors and marines. It thus appeared that the whole force of the country, naval and military, amounted to ,805,000 men, being a tenth part of the whole male population, and a tourth of the males between 21 and 50 years of age. He thought that 20,000 in fantry and 5000 cavalry might be reduced with per le4 safely, by which reductio'n a saving would be effeded of near a million a year. 'The House then resolved itself into the Com mittee. Lord PALMERSTONE adverted to the returns on the table of the Staff in the several dist' itts and stated the proposed reduction of the General Offi cers on the Suig . to be as follow the. Eastern distrid it was vropo,ed to discontinue one Lieute nant-General, leaving eight Generals, commanding twenty thousand men. In the South-west di s trict it was proposed to discontinue one Lieutenant- General, and appoint a Major-General in his ' room, one General would there command 4000 men. In the Severn district it was proposed to dis continue one Lieut.-General, and the command would consequently devolve on a Major-General. In the Home district it was proposed to discontinue one Major-General, there would remain five Generals to command 10,000 men. In North Britain it was proposed to discontinue one Lieut.-General and one Major-General, seven Generals would then remain in the command of 1 1,000 men. The difference of expence which this reduction of the Staff would occasion was 13,1711. ; as the saving could take place only from the 2501 of March ; but next year. it would be 17,0001.--His Lordship next adverted to a paper on the r, t z .a . spewing i b l l i e, lBos, whccon the e ra s titvaael.y was the s proportion between the troops and the Staff at three distinct periods, % very large, in 1806, when it had been reduced . by re t the last Administration, and in February 1810, be fore the present reduction had taken place. By" this comparatiVe statement ) it appeared that the Staff in February last (beforeroioltritron to present reduction) roop s in p was on a lower scale, in proportion the country, than even in 1806. In 1806 there was one General Officer to 1,971 men ; in Feb. 1810, there was one General Officer to 1990 men. From the 64 Generals on the Stall" in February, 1810, if the six now proposed to be discontinued were de duCted, there would remain 58; or one General Offi cer to 2190 men ; a proportion which, under all the circumstances of the country, could not be consi dered' too great. He concluded by moving a reso lutiOn, That a sum not exceding 457,7241. be granted to his Majesty, for General and Staff Offi cers, &c. Sir G. WARRENDER did not consider the proposed reduclion by any means satisfactory. The Home District, and Scotland, which had been the chief subjects of complaint,were to remain nearly the sane as before. It was with great regret that he was more and more confirmed in the opinion that Ministers had not that coutroul over the public expenditure which they ought to have ; otherwise he was per suaJed they would have made a liery different pro- . position to the House. Mr. CALCRAFT declared that the proposed re-- duction was a mere mockery. The Most eXtrava-; gant districts had scarcely suffered any reduction at all. On a comparison too of the estimates, it ap peared to him that the Noble Lord had mis-stated the saving, which seemed to him to be only 77721. instead of 17,0001. The Gentlemen opposite found those in the Staff whom it was beyond their strength to remove ; and it was well known that if a fat ou rite officer took a house in any part of the country the Staff was made to travel to him. Lord PALMERSTONE, in explanation, said, that the first es►imate for the Staff was 470,8961. and the present 457,7241. making a difference of 17321. Mr. WARDLE lamented that Ministers toad not acted in a manner that could satisfy the country. If the present vote were acceded to, the people would he wholly out of conceit with the House of 94- mons. After some observations on the increased Staif, he proceeded to comment on the appointment of the Quarter Master General, who besides his pay in that capacity of 41..5 S. a-cay had 31. 15s. as a Lieut.- General on the Staff, and two battalions worth at least 1,0031. a-year. The duty of the Quarter Mas ter General was after all done by deputy: He no ticed the circumstance, that. the Statf and contin gent allowances were three years in arrear, a delay which caused the most serious inconvenience to many of the Officers. General Hosea defended the appointments of the Quarter-Master-General, and Adjutant-General on the Staff, on the ground of their long services in the army, the former having been 35 years employed.— There was also an understanding or bargain with the Public, that instead of the allowances of 5001. a-year, they should receive the Starr pay of their ranks. General Lorrus, in allusion to what had fallen from the Hon. Gentleman (Mr. Calcraft) denied that the Staffdistricts were allotted to favour parti• cular officers, and they were allowed to move about at pleasure. General TARLETON, adverting to an assertion of an Hon. Member, that the Surf and contingencies were three years in arrear, declared that. the tad was not so; for that, to his knowledge, they are. never one year in arrear. With respea to an observation made as to the cavalry force, he had again to state his opinion, that any diminution in that force would not only be unwise and injudicious, bat would ren der the country insecure. He deprecated the prac tice of sending cav4ry regiments on foreign service incomplete as to Subordinate Officers; which was the case in three or four Reginients of that description sent to Spain. The Noble Lord had stated, that in attending to fitdifElibir, -- he had taken particular care of the Severn DistriCt, and had reduced the Lieu tenant-General in command there, for which he (Gen Tarleton) Was much obliged to him. He did • assure the Noble Lord he was glad to get rid of the fatigues of duty, bettit the same time he could not avoid informing the Noble Lord; that instead of re" duck& •he should have appointed two Generals to dorthe duty, as the Local Militia of ten counties; The Volunteers, and the French prisoners in Briitol; not less than 8000 in number, came under his care. Reduction might be well applied to the Home Dis trict, for there were ten Generals on the Staff, to none of whom he objected personally; there were the Commander in Chief, the Duke of Cambridge, Lord Heatlitield, Sir H. Burrard, &c. Mr. PETER MOORE was surprised that Ministers had not noticed the two round charges which the Hon. Baronet (Sir T. Turton) had made, viz. that the army which was stated to exist, was not so great in point of numbers, and that being the fact, they were calling for money which they had no right to call for: It was incumbent therefore on them, as guardians of the public purse, to answer these charges. In other times such assertions would not have been passed by with coolness. It had been truly stated by a Right Hon. Gentleman on a former night, that the average expenditure exceeded the in come by 21 millions per annum, consequently Oro country was in a most latnentoble state of distress.--• This was a circumstance worthy the notice of the Chairman of the Finance Committee,. w.hom - ,the Hon. Gentleman conjured to come forward With some system of great retreochment. It was highly . necessary, for Ministers wer e lik e ser v an t s jus t quitting places, indifferent as to the fate of the House. It was then moved, that instead of ;he 800 originally proposed, A sum of 449,0381,1115. tod• be. voted tor toe Staff of the Army, .'being about 80001. Less. This reduction was proposed on account of the appointments of the Adjutant and Quarter• Master-Generals. The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER trusted the Committee would not take it for granted, because Gentlemen on the other side q the House were continually talking of the extravagance of the pre-; sent GoVernmeitt, that therefore the tad was so.-;" On iha contrary, instead of that charge applying with any thing like truth, the estimates of the Arnlf and Staff were reduced from what they were during f the last Administration. If the country was'burthen". ed, it was not by the profusion of the present Go vernment ; the accounts of his Noble Friend shew" ed e lhat nearly two-thirds of the whole Staff were reduced. Mr. WHITBREAD thought the Army sustained no disgrace in 1806, because there was not one ilia General on the Staff. The Duke. of Cambridge, 10 understood, had 40001. per annum 'tor tiothio.- -- Would it be said that that was necessary ? H e lea spoke of the many appointments recently made on the Staff, condemned the principle of the estimates as vicious, and concluded declaring it to be his inters' tion to vote for the amendment. Mr. FIUKISSON thought it better to pay the Officers on the Gold Slick out of the public purse than to place them on the military establishment• Be concluded by making a few observations what had recently been said on what had fallen frual hin► in the course of The preSent Session. Sir T. TuaroN was surprised at the Hon. Ga' tleinan's Liking part with his Majesty's Minister° on suet► an occasion, which he thought inconsistent with his late professions.. Mr. HUSKISSON, in explanation defended his pa" litical condikt, as perieetiy cons►stent with his prom fessions. • . Captain PARKER thought Government most coat- ..- petent to decide on the question before the House. He would, however, at a future d.,y cail their at ) tendon to the situation of officers of the Navy, who It'd. thought were hardly dealt by at pre,eni. - 'LOrd PALMERSTONE 'ankle an animated reply, and I refuted the imputations thrown out against him. After Which a division' took place, when the num% . bens were— For the Amendment • - 6t • Against it • - - 99 Majority —3B The House adjourned at One o'clock this morning. 1'• t I V, S QUIS DICIRR, FAT SI:M AUDEAT?, L 0 D IV , SATURDAY, MARCH '24, 1810. We have made some further extracts from the German Papers which arrived yesterday. Th e re is a report that, another new kin6dom is about to bo : f I ta Di ,‘ll'a ids ° LP I'lol