The Sun. — London, England, 1838-05-16 00:00:00

to the Noble Lord —when it was his intention to bring forward a mea- Ure NI the subject of Irish tithes, and whether that measure would in. velve the principles set tbrth in the resolutions of the Houv.r. t Corn. tz.rons which he h ad read ?—(Hear, hear.) There WAS a prospect, he ( t usted , of coming to a settlement on the Irish Poor L aw Bill : he for O ), Vished i t were possible to arrive at such P. settlement with respect 11„: ot her question s o f t h e Irish Corpora!,;ons and the Irish Che:Cli-- 4 hear, hearl—but he felt hire . s e lf b oun d t o repea t wh at h e h a d Churl: said, that h e thought a security for the Stability of the Irish mush say, b e an etv'zritial condition of such a settlement. made 5-- Y , then , coupt'alg what I said in 1837 and the declaration from t ' ri . Me in 1835 ' that I am not chargeable with making declarations a rnembck..ar strat'“gem, and th a t I h ave no t pl ace d th e N o bl e L or d, as questio n. er tte Government in a more unfavourable position on this NV" • What was the course which the Noble Lord had taken ? • li'as the nature of his resolutions ? Ido not wish to reciprocate 8 1 , A The other side of the House hard words. Ido not think it advise. 4 i i d e lk) r an?' P u rpose.—(Cheers.) I heard the speech of the Noble Lord ; rel the temper of it with deep regret.—(Loud cheers from the Op 'tian.) It is in v a i n f or t h e No b le L or d to say that we w i l l not con ci, r . al a satisfactory settlement of this question, when at the same time f::!°PPosing insuperable obstacles to its settlement by rousing every d ger pride—by telling men like the Irish clergy, men who havebeen e Prtved of their tithes for the last four or five years, men who have subMitted to —to Poverty and oppression, and who now say they are ready —a ke further concessions for the sake of peace, provided you ttr i n .,, tai L n the integrity of the Establishment; that such men, at. A ,"" Privation and suffering, should be told by a minister of ,who,rorn that they set a price upon the value of peace—these men /r e l. 'N ' lr ct to give up 15 per cent. for the purpose of insuring peace in ph an d these men, who have in many cases abandoned their just right, h ave been d e p r i ved of their tithes—these men, who have l i ved upon u nds doled out by charity—that they should be told that they are in. r ns ible to th e peace of Ireland—that their constant anxiety and deep j te rest for th e Establishment arise from mere mercenary motives—that they think more of their pockets than of the tranquillity and peace of the " " n trY—l say, Sir, such charges open difficulties in the way of a settle. snt o f ' this question n so full, that any authority or counsel of mine — if har itY I have --must fail to produce a satisfactory settlement.—(Loud cheers.) " Of all the ills that harass the distressed Nee l Here, the most bitter is a scornful jest " *lle e hSe cheering.) Th en th e N o bl e L or d comes w ith this ques ti on, et eth er We are ju s tifi e d i n mov i ng f or resc i n di ng t hi s reso l u ti on. I d o not e ellit to co ncea l , and i f I d i d I could not, that i t i s diffi cu l t for a Go- I° rna lent to c onsen t t o th e f orma l resc i n di ng o f it s own reso l ut i ons. i t i nk, for the character and honour of public men of both sides, that n" ri ght that th e p u bli c s h ou ld k now w h a t are the pr i nc i p l es on w hi ch e Proce e d ; and if I said that the rescinding of this resolution would Boe be a severe blow to the Government, I should be guilty of hypocrisy. `,. I saY that it was open to t h e N o b le L ord to have avoided this dis e-auss_li o• This I say, on my own part, that if the Noble Lord held this `ss on the language he held last session—if he had come forward and tal l. "we will attempt the settlement of this great question of Irish t bi thes, in w hi c h Irish conflicts arise—we will propose a measure, and a easmiable measure, with respect to Irish tithes, and we will ask you to co nsent to an I r i sh Corporation Bill founded on the principle of popular election t o and if the Noble Lord bad said that he would abandon the notea Solution of 1833—(A lau g h)—if th e N o bl e L or d h a d s aid he would brink from the unpopularity of that course, if he had proposed a settlement on thi s f oot i ng and sa i d that he would not guaran t ee th a t e , arran gement should be final against f u t ure a tt a cks, but that he would Pled ge himself t o use the full weight and influence o f G overnmen t , e ? make it final; and if the Noble Lord should g i ve up th e pr i n . P ' e of the resolution of 1835, I do not believe that the Noble Lord 0 findt whatdcourse doesmi a great ntheoritNoble Lord take ? y to insist upon the resolution.--(Cheers.) Does he take the manly ars e f li on declaring that he will not retain the resolution of appropria.. Quite th e reverse. Th e N o bl e L or d h as taken a course with t"Peet to his proposed Tithe Bill and the nature of his resolution which 4pepoaletiltl.ated to excite suspicion and alarm.—(Loud cheers from the tip en , t ea.) The Noble Lord made no speech in laying his resolutions rbitt the table of the House in explanation of his motives, but he per ekueed the resolutions to go to Ireland without any explanatory speech. ,g i ' w hat were the resolutions ? I read the resolutions over and over tieann ornd I now doubt whether they contain the principle of appropria- Of epe 3 t. 1 am inclined to believe that they do contain the principle is th' 4o O r iation.—(Cheers.) Am I singular in that opinion P What k eut e t. / anguage of the Noble Lord's own supporters? What said the e nd ' l er for Wiltshire? He said that he had read the resolutions over tin I . oe r again, he dev o t e d wh o l e d ays t o th em, b u t it was no t ti e , " t night that he discovered that they did not contain appropria speeeb(A laugh)—and, be it observed, this was not till after the th e • of the Noble Lord opposite (Lord J. Russell). The Noble Lord, the Secre tary of State for the Home Department, the mover of le jeesolutions, made a speech of one hour and a half's duration, and i u t n ee hever told us whether the principle of appropriation was contained it , s 2 . in or not. lie left us more bewildered at the conclusion of his t ' v e h than at the beginning. He must say that he never before knew an insta an d , nee of a m an h o ldi ng th e s i tua ti on o f S ecre tary of St a te leader of the House of C o m mons di scuss a grea t question upon Wh et h, t o 8 , Meant to be the found a ti on o f it s settlement, and never e iigh ` t ate what h e meant. It was not till the end of the debate last b oiev t hat the Noble L or d t h e S ecretary for I re l an d to ld us th a t h e t int. ed the appropriation principle was not included in the resolu eh- aloud cheers.) What said th e Honour a ble Member for Isis (Mr. Wa r d), th an w h om on the wording of the resolutions no et u in the House was a higher authority? He had been the mover , 4 2 e solution s o f hi s own, and was a good judge of what the resolutions to re intended t o b e. W ith all the Hon. Member ' s experience of re. e, nti ens, what said he of the vagueness of these resolutions of the ssoble Lord ? He said that on reading the resolutions his first im- Pre ssion was that they were vague and ambiguous, but on reading them stain he said he thought he discovered in them the germ of appro- Pri et • ion.— (Loud cheers.) This w as th e cons t ruc ti on th e H onoura bl e G entlem an put upon them. Those were his own phrases. What C ours e does the Noble Lord ask us to pursue ? I will not say whether k !h ere is any s t ra t agem or tr i c k ; I have no right to impute motives, but this I will say, that never was a proposal made so calculated, though t erh aPs not Intended, to entrap us into difficulties, for he asks us to i iii in t° Committee upon those resolutions, without first stating what is - e Pr oPosition respecting lookoutapprriation.—(Cheers.) Let rne ask how h, i ,rnPartial man would this question 1 I do believe, after all e n - ii : ll as been said on the subject of Irish tithes—l do believe, after ( : )," i ng this a popular instrument by which you have heaved a former esse'rernment from office-1 do believe, after all the division in the 4—hinitotry Upon the subject, for the honour and credit of both sides, it i t i, d be distinctly understood whether the question . of appropriation i s l ' t. those resolutions affirmed or not.—(Loud cheering.) Now what j ur e t e Position in which we are placed by the Noble Lord ? We are te t e d in Committee to express in the first place an opinion " that charg e tithe composition of Ireland should be commuted into a rent aarge, at the rate of seven-tenths of their amount." Now what mendment could be proposed to the first resolution, but one purely of 4detail and of amount, as, for instance, to give seventy-five per cent ins tead of 70 ? But after having exhausted as discussion in matters L f detail on the first resolution, there was this sixth resolution hanging "' h ind :—" That it is the opinion of this Committee that the rent_ ch arges for ecclesiastical tithes should be appropriated by law to certain l ocal charges now defrayed out of the Consolidated Fund and to educa_ tion, the surplus to form part of the Consolidated Fund." Now, I ask, supposing we had assented to this resolution, would not there have gone forth one universal impression throughout this country and Ire land that wo had abandoned the principle of appropriation?.—(Hear, f rom the Opposition.) Why, what was said upon the subject of these re solutions by the Hon. arid Learned Member for Dublin? What cons truction did that Hon. and Lear ne d M em ber put upon these reso elons ? I think his w or d s u p on thi s su bj ec t o f grea t i m p or tance ; and s e ex pressed these in a letter which he published soon after these ? !sol utions were promulgated. The Ri g ht Honourable Baronet then !excel an extract from the letter in qu e s tion to the following Prod - Such was the plan of Lord John Russell. It held out the e e ,,lPect of an immedi a t e ame li ora ti on t o th e ex t en t o f thi r ty per eru 'es which, however, was scarcely adequate to what was required; le , Cher amelioration which it promised was the appropriation of the sur. . it ' as , ut. these rent charges to county burdens which had hitherto pressed fu,,,i'oealitios : and lastly, it speedily offered a direct appropriation of toeti 6 „ fr education." The Honourable and Learned Member's latter Jo ti ed by stating, that " He certainly did not concur in all Lord f utur s ar rangement, but at he thought it contained the germs of a eitiene_arrangement, and amore perfect and final settlement."—(Oppos s uch cheers.) I say, Sir, that when the people of Ireland are told by foe , 111 gh authority as that of the Honourable and Learned Member they Provide that these resolutions are chiefly to he (esteemed because S see - f Provide a direct appropriation for the purposes of education, and k rrse they are the germ of a future arrangement and more perfect f -. final settlement, they are warranted in drawing two conclusions— lio.`, that the principle of appropriation is contemplated in these rem). eie-,l°,n.secondly, that even this arrangement is not to be etio,"_' settlement, but was only to be used as a stepping-atone to ta a arr angements.—(Hear, hear.) On these grounds, Sir, I con aldr it qtie s d ero to be absolutely necessary to arrive at a satisfactory un "ding upon this point before we proceed further in this stru t ti ht e en h • Three courses were open to us by which this understanding In a , , have been attained : either the Noble Lord might have made a fe ,,'i r i and frank avowal that, finding it impossible to pass this measure f e tter he With the principle of the resolutions of 1835, he was prepared ti,.., sacr ifice the approp r i a ti on c l ause i n or d er t o arr i ve a t a sa tisfactory ,Tinstrnent of th e ques ti on , or we m i g ht h ave b roug ht f orwar d an eh -I,:act resolutio n o f our own, con d emnatory o f t h e pr i nc i p l e o f appro ati"; but that was a course w hi c h appeared us obnoxious to the e h l abs tract urged a ga i ns t your own reso l ut i ons o f 1835 , th a t th e y w ere °street resolutions, fettering the practical consideration of a particular l'u f b j e et ; or, lastly, the means were open to us which we have adopted, n ° ,. - ° braining the feeling of the House upon this question, and of showing 1;r faithful adherence to the principles which we formerly defended by " l og the rescinding of those resolutions of 1835, as being calculated t, . obs truct the satisfactory settlement of this great practical question. e forwarded put off this discussion would not in the least have the practical result at which we aim. We could b si ° 4 h ave discussed these resolutions in Committee without giving to to it ; or if your course had been by Bill, the very preamble . tr tb e Bill would have raised the question ; and, therefore, on the ie h : le it aPPeared to us most satisfactory that as a preliminary proceed k 0 We should elicit the opinion of the present Parliament upon this te r f ea t Point at issue, and show that our opinion remains unchaned in e , u er t ence to it. These are the grounds Upoll which I oppose thesere dt al ia t ens, being unable to lend my aid to the passing of a measure which h. o tend to the alienation of Church property. .The grounds upon 'e i, h I act are not any dictates of false pride, which the Noble Lord e a " ° f; but because I conceive that to alienate Church property to eiar purposes will inevitably shake the foundations of that Establish en„'i, The Noble Lord referred to the Act of Union, and said that he t e „,,. °lv ed to maintain tho Church Establishment because it was guaran. e , -m hi the Act of Union. I, Sir, adopt te same principle. The Noble - l eis that to disturb the Church would cuts rent in the Act of Union. ei a p r rent. agre e with th e N o bl e L or d , an d I say th a t if we a d o pt the p r r e in : e, e O f alienating the p r ope r ty of the Church, we create that d l ie e question, Sir, with me now is this—is the Church of Irelan hi ae li to enjoy more of stable freedom under the existing state of the to W 4 or by purchasing a short respite from persecution at a cost o f some e re ' 134 or 60,0001. ? A n d my op i n i on i s, th a t unsa ti s f ac tory as is the ~l ' a en t state o f the Church, it is less to be deplored than i t wou ld be fr,,er purchasing a small portion of goodwill, or, rather, a brief immunity ni attack on these terms. It is not the amount of the money that I , Ptak t e e t; but the principle which is involved with it. What have we p re ' r ge in favour of th e ma i n t enance o f th e Ch urc h E s t a bli s hment at th: en i t ? The national compact entered into at the time of the Union— tests°'etan guarantee given to the Protestants of Ireland that the Pro ch:nt faith should be the established faith of that country, that their nie r , e ll should b e the Established Church. All the details and state ments wh ich are now advanc e d aga in s t the propriety of this arrangement a t,"" m there fully considered—the relative numbers of the Protestants ,i'theatholics o f I reland were taken into account b y the S tatesmen th eir at Period —the poverty of the Roman Catholic population, and prey Poor ability to supply the means of religious culture, were all ap- Ch aged; but still the principle was adopted and declared, that the -erch of day vr the minority should be preserved. The Legislature of that e eusid a s not blind to the anomaly of the arrangement, but with full they i!ration of the objections to which it was liable they determined as je et ' ltd*--(Hear, hear.) There is another Act connected with this sub toli; l ' l ean the Act for the Relief of the Disabilities of the Roman Ca ttle „ ' The Noble Lord was pleased to taunt me for the part I took in tef fe ' -asd og of this measure. I can only say that I hear with perfect in ject . ' f ee any taunts w hi c h may b e th rown ou t ag ainst me on thi s su b. di d ' l .. o '°r, I feel th a t , i f I had taken any ot h er course th an th e one I p r i de r i t he Purpo se o f gratifying any feelings o f persona l am bi t i on or b e , '. ' s hould hav e b een so ashamed of my con d uc t th a t I s h ou ld h ave incl ined at on ce t o ret i re from public l i fe. I b roug ht f orwar d t h at measur e, a on acc ount of the state of the public mind of the people of Eng tineks_rto t hat period, appre h ending more danger from t h e f act o f rang i ng l aii ,i r th testant s of this country in hostile feeling against those of Ire. entert • from the p r i v il eges con f erre d b y t h a t enac t men t . 1 I. ..,searined that the ; I submitted it to the Crown ; and was der having ,0 done, to go out of office, and for the sake of an appear. ante of public consistency to offer a sham opposition to the very measure I had just recommended to the King because I had always hitherto done so, and yet permit It to be carried ? In my opinion, Sir, such conduct would have been dishonourable and dishonest to the fullest extent.— (Opp'Oaition cheers) In truth it would have been much more convenient to me at that period to have gone out of office, and allowed the Hon. Gentlemen opposite to pass this Bill ; but having advised the King to pass this Bill, and the King having adopted my advice, I felt bound to sacrifice all personal considerations of every kind, and to assist in passing it. Some may say that I should have come to this decision earlier than I did, but no one can say that having adopted that opinion I left office, or shrunk from any ofthe personal responsibility which that opinion en. tailed upon me, including the sacrifice of party ties in which I had hitherto been bound up, and the risk of losing the confidence of those with whom I had been always accustomed to act.—(Cheers.) Would any one say that it was any purpose of party power or aggrandisement that induced me to abandon what had been the chief pride of my life, the representation of the University of Oxford?—(Cheers.) The Noble Lord, when he taunts me for my change of conduct in respect to the Roman Catholic Relief Act, and when he taunts my Noble Friend near me for now acting in concurrence with me on this and other questions, can surely not forget the very evident rejoinder to which he subjects himself. The Noble Lord can surely not forget the year 1827, when, on the great subject of Par liamentary Reform, he published an opinion that he saw no necessity for such a measure. But I will not pursue this further.—(Opposition cheers.) These are too important subjects to be trifled with in this manner. I will not retort upon the Noble Lord any of his taunts. Ido not, in fact, feel anything of the kind that has been said, because I know that any imputations of the sort, whether upon myself or my Noble Friend, are unjust and unfounded. Ido not feel them, they make no impression on me, and therefore I shall not reply to them.—(Opposition cheers.) I was speaking of the Roman Catholic Relief Bill, and I said that at the time of the Union we had a guarantee that the Protestant Church should be maintained as the Established Church in Ireland; and although the passing the Roman Catholic Bill was not in the nature of a compact, yet I am convinced that every person in the country believed that civil equality to Roman Catholics might be conceded by that measure with perfect security to that Establishment. If, at the time of debating that proposition, the Hon. and Learned Member for Dublin had told us that the measure of relief world yet be incomplete—if he had told us his story of the Scotch going up the mountain armed with swords, and informed us that the first consequence of the Roman Ca tholic Relief Bill would be the spoliation of the Church of Ireland, let me tell him that that measure never would have been passed.--(Loud Opposition cheers.) No ; the people of this country would never have consented to the removal of those disabilities, if they had known that the inevitable consequence of it was to be the alienation of the property of the Church. So far from such a result being contemplated, I refer to the opinions of Lord Plunket, Mr. Grattan, Lord Carbery, and others, who distinctly denied that such would be the case. I refer also to the preamble of the Bill, which stated that the removal of the civil disabilities of the Roman Catholics would tend to strengthen and maintain the Irish Church.--(Hear.) This is our posi tion now; but the moment you wish us to depart from it, and to pur chase a little diversion of hostility from the Church, at a cost of 50,0001. or 60,0001, that very moment the principle upon which we stood is abandoned—the Act of Union no longer guarantees the inviolability of the Church of Ireland—and we admit a principle of appropriating the revenues of the Church to purposes of education, but of education ex clusive of the Establishment.— (Hear, and Oh.) Ido not mean to say that it would become illegal for a Protestant father to give his children the benefit of this instruction, but it cannot be denied that in bringing forward an indiscriminate system of education we imply that it is to be a course of instruction not in the principles of the Established Church ; and, therefore, the whole state of things in that respect would be at once changed.—(Hear, hear.) With respect also to your amount as applied to your principle. You say that 400,0001. is too much far the revenues of the Church—(Hear)—and you propose to abstract 50,0001.; but surely if you cannot defend the maintenance of that Church upon the grounds of morality and reason, do you think that the Catholics of Ireland will be satisfied with an eighth only of these reve nues ? The principle of the Noble Lord is at once fatal to the Establish ment, whilst it has not the advantage of purchasing even present peace. On these grounds, therefore, I think that the present position of the Church of Ireland is better than it would be by accepting any such com. position The Noble Lord says that the question now before us is a question between two distinct principles of government. lam ready, with the Noble Lord, to come forward to give all civil privileges to the people of Ireland, provided we can do so, still adhering to the prin ciple of maintaining the integrity of the Established Church. This was the condition upon which I agreed to, and the people of England al lowed of, the Roman Catholic Relief Bill; and unless we now have satisfaction on this head—namely, the senility of the Church of Ireland—we shall prefer the satisfaction of awaiting the devolution of the new powers which may be directed to undermine its strength, to voluntarily giving up an eighth of its revenues, to be diverted to purposes foreign to its objects.—(Hear, hear.) With reference to edu cation, I should like, I must confess, to see the country so circumstanced as to allow of a system of education being conducted by members of the Church Establishment.—(oh, oh.) Hon. Members who laugh at this observation, can surely not rightly understand its import. I said that I should like to see the country so circumstanced as to allow of that principle of administering instruction ; but I am too well aware that that cannot be the case in Ireland if any doctrines of the Established Church, or of any section of Dissent, are made a sine quo non in the room of in struction.—(Hear.) I am perfectly ready, however, to allow of instruc tion being provided for the Roman Catholic copulation in general subjects of education ; for I conceive that the interests of the country would be better consulted by making them educated, instead of ignorant.—(Hear, hear.) The alternative, therefore, is not between a course of Protestant education or of Catholic education, but a third course is open to us of general moral education, which I should willingly adopt. I certainly prefer a general course of instruction of this kind; and so far as the duties of the State are concerned in it, I should not ob ject to allow thegrant of any sum of money which might be deemed neces sary for the purpose. And here, in fact, there is no real difference of opinion between me and the Noble Lord. It is just as well that this instruction should be paid for direct and at once out of the Consolidated Fund, as by the complicated machinery of your sixth re solution, which, in fact, is a mere delusion.—(Opposition cheers ) And whilst I object at all to the principle of alienating the funds of the Church from strictly ecclesiastical purposes, I still more strongly object to applying such alienated funds to a course of education from which the principles of Protestant faith are excluded. The principles on which I object to this mode of appropriation are these.—(Cries of " ques. tion," and " order.") By this measure no satisfactory arrangement can be arrived at; it will alienate a part of the property of the Church, whilst, at the same time, it will still not give satisfaction to the Roman Catholics of Ireland. In passing such a measure as this you would be abandoning your duty as a Protestant Legislature, by allowing a prin ciple which will in itself undermine the Protestant Church, or at least give the means, by future agitation and discontent, to bring it to state of ruin. Upon these grounds, therefore, I give my cordial support to the amendment of my Honourable Friend, in order to show my consis. tent maintenance of a principle which I ever defended in office, and which I still adhere to in Opposition.—(Cheers.) The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER commenced by ob serving that the disadvantage of rising to address the House at so late an hour on the second night of an adjourned debate was not diminished by the circumstance of his having to reply to the Right Hon. Baronet opposite, whom all admitted to be the leader in point of ability and elocu tion, as he was the leader in station, of the great party of the Opposi tion. He felt, however, that as the question upon which the house had to decide, when disencumbered of the extraneous circumstanc; t pressed into the service—by no speaker with more profusion than the Right Hon. Baronet himself—was a very simple one, it would not be neccs. nary for him to occupy their attention for any length of time ; and that, confining himself to the real merits of the particular point at issue, but a plain, easy, and simple duty awaited him. No one could more regret than he did that either angry feeling or party bias should have been introduced into the present debate. But who was responsible for its introduction ? What had led to it ? Why, he took it on the showing of the Right Hon. Baronet himself, for he could require no stronger au thority than which his (Sir R. Peel's) words afforded. The Right Honourable Baronet admitted that the proposition which had been made was one in which, he well knew, her Majesty's Government could not be expected to acquiesce.—(Cheers.) Why, then, had it been introduced at the present moment ? If the resolutions on the table had involved the question of appropriation, he should not have quarrelled with the Honourable Baronet for saying to the House " Before you discuss those resolutions, I will have you discuss the resolutions of ap propriation which they include." But how stood the case ? Did the resolutions of his Noble Friend (Lord John Russell) contain the prin ciple of appropriation ? The Right Hon. Baronet seemed to say he was uncertain as to whether they did or not; but he (the Chancellor of the Exchequer) defied any man, who came to the discussion of the subject with the smallest practical knowledge, to entertain a doubt on the point.—(Hear, hear.) If there had been doubt on the subject, whydid not the Hon. Baronet the Member for North Devon, or some other Member of the opposition, rise in his place and seek information from the Government as to whether or not it was their in tention to include the question of appropriation in their resolutions? No, that course would not have suited the designs of the Hon. Gentlemen opposite.—(Cheers ) They well knew that what was wanted was a trial of strength on the matter—they came to it, and he for one thanked them for thus giving the House an opportunity of reconsidering the matter.—(Cheers.) He regretted the course that had been taken by the Opposition, but he did so on higher and better grounds than any connected with party discussion.—(Cheers.) He re. gretted the course that had been taken, because he saw the effect of it must be to deprive the Government of the chance of having brought the question to an unanimous discussion.—(Cheers.) He would put an analogous case to the flight Honourable Baronet opposite upon another subject on which the two parties in that House were at issue—the question of Municipal Corporations for Ireland. Suppose the Right Honourable Baronet had carried a resolution that it was inexpedient to establish Municipal Corporations in Ireland, and that the existence of corporations in Ireland was dangerous to the Protestant Church, and that subse quently he had determined to bring forward a measure for the settlement of the question, would he have thought it generous, wise, or statesmanlike if they had said to him—" No, before you do this you must recind your resolution, you must humble your. self into the dust before us, and then when you have done so we will listen to you."—(Cheers.) The case was perfectly the same, except that the Right Hon. Baronet, fortunately for them, never had an opportu. nity of carrying such a resolution, while they had the benefit of carry ing theirs.—(Hear, hear, hear.) The Right Hon. Baronet had referred to some observations of his on a former occasion. It was perfectly true that on that occasion he had told him (Sir R. Peel) that the more direct and more manly course would have been to move the recinding of the appropriation resolutions. But why did he do so ? Why, because the Bill they were at that time discussing did involve the appropriation prin ciple, and if the resolutions now on the table involved it equally, he for on e s h ou ld not have objected to •r disapprove d e f th e course adopted on t h e cheers.) present occasion by the Opposition.—(Loud We re the Gentlemen opposite forgetful of what had al ready taken place on this subject ? Did they forget that in 1834 a Bill for the settlement of the tithe question in Ireland was sent up to the House of Lords, which Bill did not contain the appropriation clauses ? And yet the very party who were now so anxious to rescind the resolutions of that House with respect to the appropriation were the party who in 1834 rejected the Bill in which the appropriation clauses were not inserted.—(Hear, hear.) Words had been frequently and they had be en used by several gentlemen on the other side, repeated by the Right Honourable Member for Tamworth, to the effect that the appropriation resolutions had been got up in 1835 for the purpose of effecting a change in the Ge vernment.—(Hear.) Now, suppose that that had actually been the case, surely there was nothing more politically dishonourable in getting up those resolutions for the purpose of effecting a change of Govern ment than there was in moving to rescind those resolutions for the pur pose of effecting a change of Government. —(Hear, hear.) But lie was prepared to show, on evidence entirely incontrovertible, not only that the assertion that the appropriation resolutions were got up for the purpose of effecting a change of Government was not only not true, but that it was the very reverse of the fact. The witness whom he should call into Court was the Hon. Baronet the Member for North Warwickshire. On the 12th of June, 1834, that Hon. Baronet addressed a letter to his constituents, in which he com municated to them the fact that Ministers had promised to apply any surplus that might be derived from the ecclesiastical revenue in Ireland to the moral and religious instruction of the poor in that country of all denominations.—(Hear) That letter was written by the seconder of the motion of the Hon. Baronet the Member for North Devonshire. — (Hear, hear.) It was distinctly stated in that letter, that in 1834, when the present Ministers were in power, they were preparing steps so to appropriate the surplus, if any, of the ecclesiastical revenue in Ire land ; and yet the House was now told that the appropriation reso lutions were taken up in 1835 for the purpose of depriving the Right Hon. Baronet the Member for Tamworth of power.—(Hear.) Never was any charge more completely refuted by evidence. He mlelit be asked, "as your present resolutions do not :Arm the proposition contained in the appropriation resolutions, why refuse to rescind the appropriation resolutions ?" In the first place, because to do so would involve a loss of character. In the second TIM SUN, LONDON, WEDNESDA N), MAY 16, 183 P. place, if he negatived those resolutions he should be negativing an cpinion which he was ready now, or at any other time, to reaffirm.— (Hear, hear.) His present opinion with respect to the expediency of the appropriation resolutions was precisely that which it always had been. But he was ready to say fairly, that if he could procure the settlement of this great question, by inducing a large party in the State to relinquish their opposition to that settlement, he should be happy to adopt a measure for that purpose, founded on the basis of his Noble Friend's propositions,—(Hear, hear.) He did not think that the ar rangement proposed by his Noble Friend was the best that could be de. vised ; but he was prepared to adopt it, because he thought that it was the only one which was practicable. What did his Noble Friend do in the proposition which he had made on the subject ? Having no hopes of carrying the measure as he originally wished it to be framed, his Noble Friend, with a feeling of generosity and respect towards those from whom he differed on the subject, submitted to Parliament a measure leading to a settlement of the question, without calling upon those who were opposed to appropriation to depart from their principles.—(Hear.) This his Noble Friend did for the purpose, as lie conceived, of obtaining concord and harmony on the subject But " we," said the Gentlemen opposite, " we will not take your prac. tical proposition into consideration, but we will call upon you to degrade yourselves by rescinding resolutions to which the House at your in. stance came three years ago."—(Hear.) It might be a good game to degrade a political opponent, but the Gentlemen opposite were exceed ingly mistaken if they thought that the Members of the present Go. vernment would voluntarily degrade themselves. For the purpose of endeavouring to degrade them, however, the Gentlemen opposite had thrown the torch of discord into the House of Commons. Stich a course might have been as easy in their own cases, if it had been pursued with respect to them. On a former occasion, the Noble Lord the Member for North Lancashire had made use of a phrase, in his (the Chancellor of the Exchequer's) opinion, correctly. The Noble Lord had spoken of " the extinction of tithes." Every body must recollect the cheers with which that phrase was received by one side of the House, and the taunt, with which it was met by the other. Suppose the Noble Lord had embodied that phrase in a resolution. What would lie have said if he had been told by his present friends that they would hear of no proposition from him until he had first degraded himself by agreeing to rescind that resolution.—(Hear, hear.) The Noble Lord had put the case in the shape of a dilemma, He (the Chancellor of the Exchequer) would reply by another dilemma. The question was, did the resolutions now proposed by her Majesty's Government involve the appropriation clauses or not ? If they did, why not propose to amend them, by striking that part out ? If they did not, then the motion of the Honourable Baronet the Member for North Devenshire was perfectly unnecessary, except for party purposes.— (Loud cheers.) Her Majesty's Government had hoped to settle the question by mutual concession ; but when the Right Honourable Baro net opposite tendered a settlement of the question, when the Duke of Wellington stated in the House of Lords his wish to see the question settled, was it to be supposed that the settlement was to be preceded by a condition to which her Majesty's Government could not honestly ac cede ?—(Hear, hear, hear.) What reason was there to suppose that they would submit to any such indignity ? He was glad, however, that the question had been brought to a direct issue. He had : t un : 4 aot,t,fihsenradyat acknowledged different ,y r o o wnml those hgttohehsdeien thing declarationshwat from. twihneeor poriginalo ,i opposedt o io f n p a tro o o m prto c oe:i ct H ilti, o , id: . those oieu,srreoapsbrarel appropriation satisfaction o t rn l n es e s m ,ovl to affirm them. The Right Hon. Gentleman had not dealt fairly with the expression of his Noble Friend. It was only to one particular portion of the Irish clergy that his Noble Friend had referred. That Irish clergy was ill represented by those who put themselves prominently forward as its supporters. It would be most important hereafter to recollect if no hope of a settlement of this question was left, that they had the autho rity of the Member for North Lancashire to maintain that the clergy were satisfied with their condition—(Cheers)—that it would be a sacri fice on their parts if any adjustment was made; and if the Government, from the impossibility of carrying any measure, should allow matters to remain as they are, the Noble Lord must not taunt them with having deserted the clergy, but bear in mind that he himself declared that nine tenths of the clergy wished for no legislation whatever on this !subject,— . . _ Ferguson, Sir R. A.—Londondei ry Ferguson, IL—Kirkaldy ergusson, Right Hon. R. C.—Kirk cudbright Finch, F.—Walsall Fitzgibbon, Hon. IL—Limerick Co. Ftzroy, Lord C.—Bury St. &Ins. ' leetwood, p. H.—Preston Fort, J.—Clitheroe French, Fitzst ephtn-2oscommon Gillon, Wm. D.—Linlithgow Gordon, Robert—Windsor tr.ng, H. I).—New Shoreham Grattan, James—Wicklow Co. Grattan, Henry—Meath Greenaway, Charles—Leominster Grey, Sir t harks Fdward Grey, Sir George—Devonport Grosvenor, Lord IL—Chester rote, George—London Guest, J. J.—Merthyr lydvil . 1 fail, Benjamin—Mary lebone "anyburton, Lord D G.—Forfar shire Ilindley, Henry—Lincolnshire Harland, W. C.—Durham Harvey, I). W.—Southwark /lathe, Archibald —Paisley Hawes, Benjamin—Lambeth Hawkins, J. H.—Newport, I, Wight tlayter, W. G.—Wells ileathcoat, J.—Tiverton Hector, C. J.—Petersfield Ileneage, E.—Grimsby Heron, Sir R. —Peterborough Hill, Lord A. M. C.—Evesham Hindley, Charles—Ashton flobhinise, Right lion. Sir J. Cam Nottingham Robhouse, T. B.—Rochester Hodges, T L.—West Kent Hollond, Robert—Hastings Horsinan, Edward—Cockormoutit Hoskins, K.—Herefordshire Howard, F. J.—Youghall Howard, P. H.—Carlisle Howard IL—Wicklow Co. Howick , Visc.—Northumberland Hume, Joseph—Kilkenny Humphery, John—Southwark Hurst, It. H.—Horsham Mitt, W.—Hull Hutton, Robert—Dublin James, William—Cumberland Jephson, D. o.—Mallow Jervis, J.—Chester Jervis, S.—Bridport John s on ' W. Augustus—Oldham Labouchere, Right Hon. Henry—' Taunton Lambton, IL—North Durham Langdale, Hon C.—Knaresborouk Lefevre, C. Shaw—North Hants Lemon, Sir Charles—West Cornwall Leveson, Lord—Morpeth I is - ter, E. Canliffe—Bradford Loch. James—Kirkwall Philipps, Sir IL—Haverfordwest Philips, Mark—Manchestor - Philips, G. R.—Poole Phillpotts, John—Gloucester Pinney, W.—Lyme Regis Ponsonby, C. F. A. C.—Poole Ponsonby, Hon. John—Derby Potter, R.—Wigan Power, James—Wexford Co. Power, John—Waterford Price, Sir R.—Herefordshire Protheroc, Edward—Halifax Pryinc, George—Cambridge Pryse, Pryse—Cardigan Pusey, Philip—Berk: hire Ramsbottom, J.—Windsor Redington, T. N.—Dundalk Rice, Edward Royd —Dover Rice, Right Hon. T. S.—Cambridge Rich, IL—Knaresborough Rippon, C.—Gateshead Roche, E. B.—Cork Co. . Roche, William—Limerick Roche, David—Limerick Rolfe, Sir R M.—Penrhyn Rumbold, C. E.—Yarmouth Rundle, John—Tavistock Russell, Lord John—Stroud Russell, Lord—Tavistock Russell, Lori C. J. F.—Bedfordshire Salwey, Lieut.-Col.—Ludlow Sanford, E. A.—Somersetshire Scholefield, J.—Birmingham Scrope, Poulett—Stroud Seale, Colonel—Dartmouth Seymour, Lord—Totneas Sharpe, General—Dumfries Shell, Richard Lalor—Tipperary Shelborne, Earl of—Caine Slaney, R. A. —Shrewsbury Smith, J. A.—Chichester Smith, Benjamin—Norwich Smith, Hon. R.—Wycombe Smith, R. Vernon —Northampton Somers, J. P.—Sligo Somerville, Sir M. W. —Drogheda Speirs, Alexander—Richmond Spencer, Hon. F.—Midhurst Standish, Charles —.Wigan Stanley, W. Massey—Pontefract Stanley, NV. o.—Anglesea Stansficid, W R. C.—Huddersfield Staunton, Sir George Thomas Stewart, James—Honiton Strangways, Hon. John—Dorset Strickland, Sir G.—West Yorkshire Strutt, Edward—Derby Stuart, Lord J.—Ayr .'Stuart, Villiers—Waterford Co. Style, Sir Charles—Scarborough Talbot, C. It. M.—Glamorganshire Talbot, J. H.—New Ross Talfourd, Mr. Serjeant—Reading I Tancred, H. W.—Banbury Thomson, Right Hon. C. P.—Man chester Thornely, Thos.—Wolverhampton Townley, Rd. G.—Cambridgeshire Troubridge, Sir 'l'. E.—Sandwich Timer, Edmund—Truro Turner, W.—Blackburn Verney, Sir H.—Buckinghsra Vigors, N. A.—Carlow Co. Villiers, C. P.—Wolverhampton Violin, Major Charles—Bodmin Vivian, John Henry—Swansea Vivian, Sir It. H.—East Cornwall Wakley, Thomas- Finsbury Walker, C A.—Wexford Walker, IL—Bury, Lancashire Wallace, Robert—Greenock Warburton, H.—Blidport Ward, H. G.—Sheflield Wemyss, Captain—Fifeshire Westenra, Hon. H R.—Monaghan Westenra, Hon. J. C.—King's to. White, Andrew—Sunderland White, Luke—Longford White, Lieut .Col. Saml.—Leitrim Wilbraham, George—Cheshire Wilde, Mr. Serjeant—Newark Wilkins, Walter—Radnorshire Williams, William—Coventry Williams, W. A.—Monmouthshire Wilshere, William—Yarmouth Winnington, T. E.— Bewdley Vsinnington, IL J.—Worcestershire Wood, Charles—Halifax Wood, Sir Matthew—London Wood, G. W.—Kendal Wo,sley, Lord—Lincolnshire Woulfe, Mr. Serjeant—Cashel Wrightson, W. B.—Northallezton Wyse, Thomas—Waterfora Yates, J. Ashton—Carlow L'ashington, Dr—Tower Haml. Lushington, Charles—Ashburton Lynch, A. H.—Galway M'l.cod, R.—lnverness M'Namara, Maj. W. N.—Clare Ca. M'Tageart, John—Wigton Maher, Jno.—Wexford Co. Marshall, Wm.—Carlisle Marsland, Henry—Stockport Martin, John—Tewkesbury Manic, W. H.—Carlow Mauls, Hon. Fox—Elgin Burghs Melgund, Viscount —Hythe st.i a o i l t l o n n —Winchester Morpeth, Lord—Yorltshire Morris, D.—Carmarthen Murray, Right Hon. J. A.—Leith Moreton,l l i l t d o m n a , o A P r st . _ H. lt Muskett, George A.—St. Alban's Nagle, Sir 11.—Westmeath Cornelius—Clare O'Brien, W. S.—Limerick Co. o'Callagban, Hon C.—Dungarvan O'Connell, Daniel—Dublin O'Connell, John—Athlone O'Connell, M. J.—Kerry O'Connell, Morgan—Meath O'Connell, Maurice—Tralce o'Ferrall, Richard M.—Kildare Ord, W.—Newcastle-upon-Tyne Paget, Lord Alfred—Lichfield Paget, Frederick—Beaumaris Palmer, Charles Fysbe—Reading Palmerston, Viscount—Tiverton Parker, John—Sheffield l'arnell, Sir H.—Dundee Parrott, Jasper—Totness Pattison, James—London Pease, Joseph—South Durham Pechell, Captain—Brighton I'endarves, E. W.—W. Cornwall (Loud cheers.) He was unwilling that that should be the solution of th ' Is question ; he wished it to be settled; but he asserted if there was no pros pect of an amicable arrangement in that House or the other, let it be borne in mind that it was the suggestion of the Noble Lord, not recommended by himself, but stated as the wish of the Clergy of Ireland, that they wish to remain precisely as they are, without any legislative interference to disturb their condition.—(Cheers.) He was glad that the Noble Lord had made this declaration, because it might justify one of the alterna tives which the course taken by Honourable Members opposite might force upon them. They had brought forward these resolutions in good faith and in a kindly spirit. They knew they should be attacked in a friendly manner, no doubt, by such supporters as the Hon. Member for Sheffield for their abandonment of the appropriation clauses ; but they were willing to encounter such taunts, and much more, if they could bring this question to a settlement ; and but for the mischievous motion of the Honourable Baronet, from whom, of all men, it most surprised him that it should come, there was a chance of discussing, in an ami cable and friendly spirit, that arrangement which was now completely set aside.—(Loud cheers from the Ministerial benches, and ironical cheers from the Opposition.) Hon. Gentlemen opposite wished it to be understood that anger and asperity were altogether placed cut of their consideration, and yet the Right Hon Baronet, their leader, declared that he knew the proposition made by the Honourable Baronet (Sir T. Acland) was one in which the Government could not acquiesce. (Cheers.) Was that the way to the amicable settlement which they professed?—(Renewed cheers.) If they wished to fight the battle of principle on the resolutions, why not have taken issue on them? But that would not do, that would not answer the object he would not say of the Hon. Baronet (Sir T. Acland), for his motives were, he was sure, perfectly pure and unimpeachable, but it would not answer the intention of those who cried out, " Success on Montlay."—(Loud cheers.) If a course were to be taken to deprive Parliament of an opportunity of calm legislation, Ireland of a chalice of peace, and to shut out all hope of reconciling the two Houses of the Legislature, now in so discordant and disunited a condition, that course would be no other than that adopted by the Hon. Baronet—that which the Conservative party, as they called themselves, pursued.—(Loud cheers.) Conservatives of what? Of confusion and riot.--(Loud cheers.) lie said boldly, that be the individual who he may, or the party what it might, who intercepted and prevented the adjustment of this question by raising a party discus soit for party objects, on those individuals must rest the responsibility of the diminution in the means for the support of the clergy, of improv. g their usefulness, and of protracing that disunion which had already led to such awful effects —(Vehement cheering ) He was not disposed to reargue the resolutions of 1855, which they were driven to reaffirm by the indirect means taken to rescind them in the Parliament of 1835. It was the Honourable Gentleman opposite who had called forth those topics of dissension, most appropriately if their object was to prevent a just settlement of this question; but they really were the friends of peace—if they were the real friends of that church of which they assumed to be champions, the opposite course was that which they should have taken.—(Cheers.) They ought to have been contented to go into committee—to adopt those parts of the Government plan of which they approved, and to reject those which they condemned; but still they should have undertaken the inquiry in a spirit of good will, peace, and candour, instead of introducing into the discussion all the moat angry passions, all the most formidable divisions, and doing what Mr. Plunkett once said in that House was the greatest of all dangers—. " chaining men to opinions which practically they were disposed to aban. don."—(Loud ironicle cheers from the Opposition,) Well, had gentlemen opposite any great triumph from that expression ? He bad said no more than the resolutions; he was ready to take the second best instead of the best ; but they would never be so base or false as to put a negative on their own resolutions, which they believed in their consciences to he founded in nothing but what was just.—(Cheers.) If the Noble Lord opposite had, on some occasion, said, " Abandon your resolutions, they have served your purpose sufficiently well, and now that you have no use for them, fling them aside :" would not such a course, if adopted, expose the Government to just obloquy and condemnation ? No ; they held to the resolutions, although if those opposed to them made a proper concession, they would found no measure on their principle, and would never taunt them with have altered their opinions, or move any preli_ minary resolutions on the subject of Municipal Corporations, being sa tisfied with having secured a practical object, and not wishing to intro duce into these discussions the asperities and heats which had charac terised that debate.—(Loud cheers.) The gallery wasthen cleared for a di•ision, when the numbers were: For Lord John Russell's motion For Sir Thos. D. Acland's amendment Majority for Ministers ----19 TELLERS. Stanley, E. John—North Cheshire Steuart, Robert —Haddingtou MINORITY— Acland, Sir T. D.—N. Devonshire Acland, T. D.—West Somerset A'Court, Captain—Tainworth Ad ,re Lord—Glamorganshire A ford, Viscount--Bedfordshire Alsager. 'l.—Surrey Arbuthnot, Gen.—Kincardineshire A rchdall, Gen. M.—Fermanagh Ashley, Lord—Dorsetshire Ashley, Cooper, Hon. A. H.—Dor -NOES, 298. Houston, G. J.—Renfrewshire Howard, Hon. W.—Suthcrlandshlre Hughes, W. B.—Carnarvon Hurt, Francis—South Derby Ingestre, Viscount—Staffordshire Ingham, R. -South Shields Inglis, Sir It. H.—Oxford University I rton, Samuel—Cumberland Irving, John--Antrim Co. Jackson, Mr. Serj.—Bandon Bridge -lames, Sir W. C.—Kingston-on-Hull Jenkins, Richard—Shrewsbury Jermyn, Earl—Bury, Suffolk Johnstone, J . J. I r,—Pprofries-shire Jones, John—Carmartkenshire Jones, T.—L , ndonderry Co. Kelly, Fitzroy—lpswich. Kemble, H.—West Surrey Key,- I lavid—llownpatriek Kerrison, Sir Edward—Eye Kit k, Peter—Carrickfergus Knatchbull, Sir E.—East Kent Knight, H. G.—Nottinghamshire Knightley, Sir C. —Northamptonsh. Lascellcs, ft on. W. S.— Wakefield Law, Hon C. E.—Cambridge Univ. Lamy, Rt. Hon. T.—Dublin Ifni- cheiter Atwood, W.—Orcenw:ch Attwood, 131.—Whitehaven Bagge, W.—West Norfolk Bagot, Hon. W.—Denbighshire Bailey, Joseph—Worcester Bailey, .1. D.—Sudbury 13aillie, H. I).—Honiton Baker, Edward—Wilton Baring, F.—Thetford , taring, W. B.—North Staffordshire Barneby, John—Worcestershire Barrington, Lord—Berksh , re Beeson, Sir 13..—Londnirderry Bell, Matthew—S. .!;orthumberland Bentinck, Lord G.—Lynn Bethell, IL—East Yorkshire Illackburne, I. J.—Warrington Blackstone, W. S.—Wallingford Blair, J. Wigtoushire BlaViernore, Richard—Wells Biandford, Marquis of—Woodstock Blennerhassett, A.—Kerry Bolder°, Reny G.—Chippenham Bolling, W.—Bolton Bradshaw, James—Canterbury Brainston, T. W.—Esses South Broadley, Henry—East Yorkshire Broadwood, Henry—Bridgewater Blownrigg, J. S.—Boston Bruce, Lord E.—Marlborough Bruges, W. H. L.—Bath Buller, Sir J. Ya,de—Devonshire Burdett, Sir F.—North Wiltshire G Grant,ror i hi Grant,a. n, Burr, D. H. D.—Hereford Burrell, Sir C.—Shoreham ' Burroughes, 1-1. N.—East Norfolk Calcraft, John Hales—Warehar n Canning, Right lion. Sir S.—King's ...Lynn Cantilupe, Viscount.—Helston .Cartwright, Wm. R.—South Nor thamptonshire Castlerearli, V isct—Down Co. Chandos, Marquis of—Bucks Chapman, Aaron —Whitby Chisholm, A. W.—lnverness-shire Chute, W. L. W.—West Norfolk Clerk, Sir G.—Stamford i Clive, Viscount—Lu dlow Clive, It. H. South Shropshire Cadrington, C. W.—Gloucestershire Cole, Hon. Arthur H.Eniskillen Cole, ViscountFermanagh Colquhoun, John C.—ltenfrew Compton, FL Combs —Hampshire Conully, 'Edward M.—Donegal Corte, Sir C.—Queen's County Copeland, W. T.—Stoke-upon-Trent Corry, Hon. 11. L.—Tyrone Co. Courtenay, P. —Bridgewater Cresswell, Cresswell—Liverpool Crewe, Sir George—South Derby Cri,,ps, Jose, h— Cirencester Dalrymple, Sir A.—Brlgliton arby, George—East Sussex Darner, Hon. G.—Portarlington Dulington, Earl of—Shropshire Davenport, Joh n—Stoke-ui on-upon t De Homey, S. H.—Newcastle-under Lyme: Dick, QUilltlil—Mal cion D'lsraeli, B.—Maidstone Dottie, A. R. —Southampton Douglas, Sir C. G.—Warwick Douro, Marquis—Norwich Dowdeswell, W. —Tewkesbury Duffield, Thomas —Abingdon I)ugdale, W. S.—Warwickshire D,inbar, George-13elfat Duricombe, Hon. W.—Yorkshire Duncombe, Hon. .A.—East Retferd East, James Buller—Winchester Eastnor, Viscount —Reigate Eaton, K. J.—Cambridgeshire Egerton, W. Tatton—heshirs Lgerton, Sir Ch e P— . Lord Francis—Lanca,hire Eliot, Lord—East Cornwall Ellis, John —Newry Estcourt, T. G. 13.—Oxford Univ. Estcourt, F. Junior—Devizes Farnham E B.—N. Leicestershire Farrand, 'Robert— Stafford Fector, James Minet—Maidstone Feilden, W. J.—Blackburn Fellows, Edw.—Huntingdonshire Fffiner, Sir E.—West Kent Fitzroy, Hon. Hcnry—Lewes Fleming, John—Hampsire Foley, E. T.—Herefordshire F,liett, Sir W.—Exeter Forester, Hon. G.—Wenlock Fes, G. Lane—Beverley Gr G (G °G( G : rail .° ( 1 . 0 "Yab i r l ds :t h i le i ) :1 10 :: ::: ' se,llialhAr.:j°.vmsm. W.E.—Newark-on-Trent s: s l o e NlPVl — P'eesiew C : vii :la : it :C I:I k ki ia 6n d - ra T r e n t bridge University R.—Kidderminster Hon. W.—Aberdeenshire buYr'Nl Hon, ar C ;a 1 on e I Gore, Orm , .. Carnarvonshire ' l b iL — h S t ali gon H.—Cam. Sir James — Pembroke Y Greene, Thom , qua of—Stamford Grimsditch, T.:— :Vdsc i ount—Hertfordshire . Gr ii r a i i i f n o s r t d o n ,d Thomas—Lancaster Ic,.E . aistigteeini rdsh ir e .Harcourt, G !Harcourt, Hale, il.iine.7 o ir ld:',. ,,u t e L s — tei S B t i . ,i A re lban's iHardinge t—Lei.:estershire ceston .—Oxfordshire ,Hight Hon. Sir H.---Laun ceston G. S.—Bucks The announcement of the numbers was received with triumphant cheering, which was continued for a considerable time. The Speaker having left the chair; and the House being in Committee, Lord JOHN RUSSELL said—After the decision which the House has just come to, I shall immediately propose that the Chairman report progress, and that the Committee sit again on Monday next, when I will state to the House the course which I shall then pursue. The House resumed, and the Chairman reported progress, and obtained leave to sit again on Monday next. The other orders of the day were then disposed of, and the House ad journed at half-past one o'clock. Hawker, Thomas—Dudley Hayes, Sir E.—Donegal Heathcote, Sir W.—S. Hampshire Henniker, Lord—East Suffolk Hepburn, Sir T. B.—Haddingtonsh. Herbert, Hon. S.—South Wilts Herries, Right HOH. J. C.—Harwich Hill, Sir Rowland—Shropshire Hillsborough, Earl:of—Down ilinde, John liodgson—Newcastle won-Tyne Hodgson, Frederick—Barnstaple Hodgson, ltd.—Berwick-on-Tweed Hogg, .Lunes Weir—Beverley Holmes, lion W.—lsle of Wight Holmes, W.—Berwick-onTweed Hope, G. W.—Weymouth Hotharn, Lord—Leominster Houldswortt, T.—Nottinghamshire TILLLEMS. Fremantle, Sir Thomas —Bucks Baring, I. B. Marlboro versity Liddell, Hon. H.—North Durham Lincoln, Ear! of—South Notts Litton, Edward—Coleraine Lockhart, . Dl.—Lanarkshire Lowther, Colonel—Westmoreland Lowther, Viscount—Westmoreland Lowther, J. H.—York Lucas, Edward—Monaghan Lygon, Hon. Colonel H. B.—West Wor.estershire Mackenzie, Thomas—Ross-shire Mackenzie, W. F.—Peeblesshirc Maclean, Donald—Oxford Mahon, Viscount— Hertford Maidstone, Visc.—North Northamp tonshire Manners, Lord C. s—Leicestershire Moreland, Thomas—Stockport Marton, Geo.—Lar.caster Master, Colonel—Cirencester Matthew. G. B.—Shaftesbury Maunsell, T. P.—Northampt-nehire Maxwell, Henry—Cavan Meynell, Captain H.—Lisburne Miles, William—Somersetshiro Miles, Philip John—Bristol Miller, Wm. H.—Newcastle-under. I.yme ,Miloes, R. M.—Pontefract !hlonypenny, T. G.--ityr Moraaunt, Sir John—Warwickshire Morgan, C. M. R.—Brecon Neeld, Joseph—Chippenham John—Cricklade • Nichol], J —Cardiff Norrcys, Lord—Oxfordshire Northland, Viscount—Dungannon O'Neill, Hon. J. B. R.—Antrim Ossulaton, Lord—N. Northumber land Owen, Sir J.—Pembrokeshire Packe, Chas. Wm.—Leicestershire Pakington, J. S.—Droitivich Palmer, Robert—Berke Palmer, George—Essex Parker, Montagu—Devon Parke-, 11. T.—Preston Parker, I'. A. W.—Oxfordshire Patten, J. Wilson—Lancashire Peel, Right Hon. sir R.—Tamworth Peel, Col. Jonathan—Huntingdon Pemberton, Thomas—Ripon Perceval, Colonel—Sligo Co. Perceval, G. J. West Surrey I Igot, Robert—Rridgenorth Planta, Joseph —Hastings Polhill, Frederick —Bedford Pollen, Sir J.—Andover rollock, Sir F.—Huntingdon Powell, Colonel—Cardiganshire Powerscourt, Viscount —Bath Praed, W. M —A7lenbury !Price, Richard—New Radnor Pringle, Alexander—Selkirkshire Rae, Right Hon. Sir Wm._Bute Reid, Sir J. Rae—Dover Richards, Richard—Merionethshire Rickford, W.—Aylesbury Rolleston, Col.—South Notting ram Rose, Sir George—Christchurch Round, C. o.—Essex Round, John—Maldon Bushbtooke, Colonel—West Sulk Rushout, George Bowles—Evesham St. Paul, Horace— Worcestershire Sanderson, Richard—Colchester Sandon, Lord—Liverpool :Scarlett, lion. J Y.—Guildford Shaw, Rt. Hon. F.—Dublin Univer. Sheppard, Thomas—Frome Shirley, E. .1 —Warwickshire Sibthorp, Colonel—Lincoln Sinclair, Sir G.—Caithness-shire Smith, Abel—Hertfordshire Smyth, Sir G. H.—Colchester Somerset, Lord G.—Monmouthshire Spry, Sir S. T.—Bodmin Stanley, Edward—Cumberlaud Stanley, Lord—North Lancashire Stewart, John—Lymington Stormont, Viscount—Perthshire Stuart, Henry—Bedford Stun, Henry Charles—Dersetehire Sugdeo, Sir E.—Ripon Teignmouth, Lord— Marylcbene. 'ferment, J. E.—Belfast Thomas, Colonel—Kinsale Thompson, Ald.—Sunderland !hornbill, Geo.—Huntingdonshire Trench, Sir F. —Scarborough Trevor, Hon. G. R.—Caermarthensh Vere, Sir C. B.—East Suffolk Verner, William —Armagh Co. Vernon, G. H.—East Retford Villiers, Viscount—Wcyrnouth Vivian., John Ennis—Truro Waddington, H. S.—West Suflbik Wall, C. Baring—Guildford Walsh, Sir John —Sudbury Welhy, Glynne Earle—Grantham Whitmore, 'l'. C.—Bridgenorth Wilbraham, Hon. R. B.—Lance chire Williams, Robert—Dorchester Williams, Sir J . ee Prs—Marlow Wilmot, . E.—Warwickshlre Wodehouse, Edmund—Norfolk Wood, Colone l T.— B recknocksh i r e tWood, Thomas—Middlesex :Wyndham, Wadhani—Salisbury Wynn, Sir W. W.—Denbighshire iWynn, Right lion. C. W.—Mont gorneryshire 'Yorke, Hon. E. r.—Cambridgeshire Young, John—Cavan Young, Sir W.—Bucks __— The Earl and Countess of Shrewsbury will give a grand entertainment in Stanhope-place, on Saturday the 26th instant, to his Royal Higlinass the Duke of Sussex, and several of the Ministers. Mr. Cooper's now naval novel, " Homeward Bound ; or, The Chase," is delivered to the public this day. A circumstance occurred Saturday morning which we are truly glad to mention. Two ladies who were coming along Pic cadilly in a small close carriage were placed in imminent peril of their lives by the unmanageable violence of their horse, and the consequences might have proved fatal but for the manly intervention of Prince George of Cambridge, who succeeded in rescuing them. His Royal Highness was at the time (3 o'clock in the morning) returning from the Duke of Devonshire's ball, and was accompanied by two gentlemen. The circumstance oocurred exactly oppose the Green-park hotel, and we ought to add that great admiration was expressed by all who wit. nessed the conduct of his Royal Highness.--Observer. PARLIAMENTARY DIVISION. TITHES (IRELAND.) From the Votes and Proceedings of the House of Commons.) TUXSDAT, MAY 15. Order for Committee read ; Motion made, and Question pro posed,—" That Mr. Speaker do now leave the Chair :" Resolutions of the House, of 7th April, 1835, read, as follow : " Resolved, That any surplus revenue of the present Church Es tablishment in Ireland, not required for the spiritual care of its members, be applied to the moral and religious education of all classes of the people, without distinction of religious persuasion, providing for the resumption of such surplus, or of any such part of it as may be required by an increase in the Number of the members of the many Church." " Resolved, That it is the opinion of this House, that no mea sure upon the subject of Tithes in Ireland can lead to a satisfactory and final adjustment, which does not embody the principle contained in the foregoing Resolution." Amendment proposed, to leave out from the word " That" to the end of the Question, in order to add the words " the said Resolu tions be rescinded," instead thereof :—(Sir Thomas Arland :) Question put, " That the words proposed to be left out stand part of the Question :"—Tho House divided : MAJORITY—ATES, 317. Abercromby, G. R.—Stirlings hire Cave, Robert Otway—Tipperar 7 Acheson, Lord—Co. of Armagh Cavendish, Hon. C.—East Sussex Adam, ear. Adm. Sir C.—Clack. Cavendish, Hon. G. H.—N. Derby mannan Cayley, E.S.—N. Yorkshire Aglionby, H. A.—Cockermouth Chalmers, Patrick—lnverbervie Aglionby, Major F.—Cumberland Chapman, Sir M. L.—Westmeath Ainsworth, P.—Bolton Chester, Henry—Louth Co. Alston, Rowland—Hertfordshire Chetwynd, Major W.—Stafford Andover, Viscount—Malinsbury Chichester, J. P. B.—Barnstaple Anson, Lieut. Col.—Staffordshire Childers John W.—lVlalton Anson, Sir G.—Lichfield Clay, \V.—Tower Hamlets Archbold, Robert—Kildare Clayton, Sir William—Marlow Attwood, Thos.—Birmingham Clements, Visc.—Leitrim Co. Bainbridge, E. T.—Taunton Clive, Edward B.—Hereford Baines, Edward—Leeds Codringten, Sir E.—Devonport Ball, Nicholas—Clonmell Collier, John—Plymouth tiannerman, A.—Aberdeen Collins, W.—Warwick Barnard, E. G.—Greenwich Colquhoun, Sir J.—Dunbartons hire Barron, H. W.—Waterford City C ra i g , W. G.—Falinburglishite Barry, S.—Cork Co. Crawford, W.—London Beamish. F. B.—Cork Crompton, S.--Thirsk Believe, R. M.—Louth Currie, Raikes—Northampton Benett, J.—South Wiltshire Curry, William —Armagh Bentirck, Lord W —Glasgow Dalmeny, Lerd—Stirling Berkeley, Hon. F. H.—Bristol Dashwood, G. H.—Wycombe Berkeley, Hon. G.—Gloucestershire Davies, Colonel—Worcester Berkeley, Hon. C.—Cheltenham Denison, W. J.—West Sussex Berna I,Ralph —Rochester Denistoun, J.—Glasgow Bevies, I.' —Plymouth Blackett,C.—South Northumberland Blake, Marlin J.—Galway D' L E a y m ic b o e t t i h rt, Right Hon. C. T.— Divett, Edward—Exeter Blake, W. J.—Newport Duckworth, S a muel—Leicester Blewilt, Reginald—Monmouth Duff; James —Banffshire Blunt, Sir Charles—Lewes Duke, Sir James—Boston Bonin ' J. J.—Galway Co. Duncan, Viscount —Southampton Bowes, John—South Durham Duncombe T. S. —Finsbury Brabazon, L ad—Dublin Co. Dusalas, e. W. D.—Flint Brabazon, Sir William—Mayo Co. Dundas, J. Deans —Devizes Bridgeman, Hewitt—Ennis Dundas, Frederick —Orkney Briscoe J.l.—Westbury Dundas, Hon. J. C.—Yor k Procklehurst, J.— Macclesfield Dundos, Hon. T.—Richmond Brodie ,W. B.—Salisbury Easthope, J —Leiccstrr . rotherton, J.—Salford Ebrington, Viscount—N. Devon Browne, R. D.—Mayo Edwards, John—Montgomery Bryan, Maj. Geo.—Kilkenny C o. Eliot, Hon. J. E.—Roxburghshire Buller, E.—North Staffordshire Ellice, Ca pt. A Harwich I) • . Bulwer, E. L.—Lincoln Ellice, Right Hon. E. —Coventry Busfield, W.—Bradford Erle, Wm.—Oxford Butler, Hon. P.—Kilkenny Co B. Etwall, Ralph—Andover Byng, George—Middlese x F. t .;zi i i . : : Sir . Li_ . 1 l i te b L ; j a n c (allaghan, D.—Cork City Evans, William— N or th Derby Campbell, Sir John—Edinburgh Faz.tkerley, J. N.—Peterbor ou g h ( :ampbell, W. F.—Argyle s hi re F enton, J o h n —R oc hdale I Car nag, Sir James R.—S an d w i c h F erguson , Si r R. C.—Noningliant Bvng, Right Hon. G S —Chatham C v— ou l ti V t e ; tminstt:r NEGRO EMANCIPATION. GREAT MEETING AT BRISTOL. (BY EXPRESS.) A very respectable and crowded meeting of the Inhabitants of Bristol and its neighbourhood took place yestc relay at tine 9iii!dhall, for the pur pose of considering the propriety of petitioning Parliarn:nt for the im mediate extinction of the negro apprenticeship system in iL'e British Colonies. The meeting was convened by a requisition addressed to the Right Worshipful the Mayor of the city, and signed by fifteen members of the Town Council, and a number of the merchants and other influ ential inhabitants without distinction of sect or party. At one o'clock, the hour appointed for commencing the proceedings, the Hall was crowded in every part, and among the auditors were a large number of ladies. Shortly afterwards the Mayor, John Kerle Haberfleld, Esq., entered the Hall, and was greeted with loud and general cheering. Among the gentlemen around the chair were Richard Ash, Esq., Joseph Reynolds, Esq., J. E. Lunen, Esq., W. Harwood, Esq., Nehemiah Moore, Esq., and Rev. Messrs. Bunting, J. Crisp, W. Lucy, W. Roper, S. Waring. Esq., W. Poole, Esq., J. Wood, Esq., E. Thomas, Esq., J. H. Saunders, Esq., Joseph Eaton, Esq., J. Addinton, Esq., W. Saunders, Esq., &c Ste. On taking the Chair the MAYOR said—Fellow-citizens, I feel much pleasure in acceding to the requisition which I have read, arid which has been so numerously and so respectably signed. I should have thought it not only disrespectful to the requisitionists, but a gross breach of my duty as Chief Magistrate of this city, if I had not freely and instantly assented to their request. I feel highly honoured on taking the Chair this day on such an occasson. I may well distrust my ability to fill the honourable situation to which you have called me in a manner answerable to your wishes, and the very interesting and im. portant occasion that has called us together.—(Cheers.) I am, I con fess, " little versed in the set phrase of speech," and the cause in which we are now engaged needs no common eloquence to describe it in all its varied details, and with a force and energy of expression which cannot fail to draw your attention, and solicit your approval.—(Hear, hear.) To give liberty to the captive—to emancipate from an ignominious and degrading bondage a class of beings who have just claims to our sym pathy and benevolence—these are indeed subjects of serious considera tion to every intelligent mind, and of more than wonted interest to every feeling heart.—(Much applause.) They will, I am sure, be placed before you in the most favourable and in the most attractive perm—(Cheers)—and by artists (if I may be allowed the term) every way qualified to depict them, with equal truth and fidelity of colouring.—(Cheers.) It only remains for me to unite with you in the hope that this day's meetiv may, under the Divine blessing, and with the aid of similar associations, be productive of a happy issue, and ul timately lead to the adoption of measures that will be found accordant with the principles of justice, humanity, and religion.—(Loud cheers.) To the master-hand of Parliament is left every great work—every work of delicacy and hazard. I shall be much mistaken if the people of Eng land will long leave the question doubtful. They are a just people—a loyal people—a proud people—and a grateful people. They will not with hold their confidence from the men who labour to procure them justice —from the men who adorn England, by presenting her to the world as the champion of humanity.—(Cheers.) No laws can be trusted which are made to regulate slavery, because none of those laws ever did or ever could carry along with them the executory principle—that is to say, Fitch a principle as would enable them to execute themselves.—(Hear, hear.) Nothing could be more obvious, for it was plain that all mea sures of this description must be executed by the whites with respect to the blacks—must be executed by a superior, predominant against and over, and to the subjugation of an inferior and servile class, and these Iwo classes, thus separated from each other by the relation of master and apprentice, were all unhappily separated by contrast of colour, diversity of habits, and difference of race; so that to think of procuring an effectual and an Unman tialjustiee, by trusting the happiness, the comforts, and the rights of the one class exclusively in the hands of the other class, was about as hopeless a dream as was ever indulged in. It comes to this,—the remedy must be in the words of a celebrated orator, " Free the blacks, emancipate the apprentices, abolish the intermediate or qualified state of slavery which was yet permitted to remain, and then the executing principle would be procured, for the negro would then have the staff in his own hands—would then be able to work out his own safety—would then be able to free himself from his master, to 1111 an independent station, and play an independent part.—(Cheers.) As soon as that was effected— as soon as the negro became his own master—as soon as that happy change was effected, every thing would fall into its right place, and there would no longer remain a greater difficulty in having the laws well executed, or in securing the rights, the comforts, and the enjoyments of the inferior classes in the West Indies, than there was on the part of the peasantry of this country in procuring protection against the upper classes, sf which all mixed societies must be partially com posed.—(Loud cheers.) I heartily hope the kind-hearted British people, and the Bristelians especially, will succeed in effecting all the objects they have inn view. I shall now feel pleasure in listening to any observations from those friends who always take an active and prominent part in acts of benevolence, and goodness, and charity.— ( Much cheering.) Mennen]) Assn, Esq , in moving the introductory resolution, observed that the inhabitants of Bristol having from a remote period taken a pro minent part in upholding the abominable system of slavery, it was pe culiarly incumbent on them to endeavour, to the utmost of their power, to wipe away the stain, and to undo the evils which had been inflicted. It appeared from ancient records that when slavery existed in Great Britain, Bristol was the emporium for the sale of human beings from all parts of England ; and that in the public markets rows of young persons of both sexes were tied together for sale. Long after slavery had been abandoned in England it was introduced into her colonies, and Bris tolians took the lead in the horrid traffic in the African race. At length the British slave trade, slier long and mighty struggles, received its deathblow. It was deeply to be lamented that when the Bill for the Abolition of Slavery passed, a fatal error was committed by the enormous sum of twenty millions having been agreed to be paid as a compensation to the planters before any amount of loss had been ascertained, anti with out any security having been given for the performance of the contract, whilst the arrangement for carrying the measure into effect were left to the Colonial Legislature. The British public hoped the iniquitous sys tem of slavery in the colonies was at an end, but it was soon found to be virtually continued under another name ; and the condition of the negro was in some respects worse than before. It should be recollected that inn proportion as the period for emancipation advanced, the planters had a greater interest in increasing the labour of their apprentices, without regard to what might become of them at the expiration of the term; and, if the system were to continue, there was reason to fear that many of these unhappy beings, instead of being prepared for the enjoy ment of freedom, would only be prepared for an early grave. Let not the Colonial Legislature and the planters rely too confidently on the peaceable and submissive conduct of the apprenticed slaves, but consi der what might be the effect of persevering in the system after the Ist of August next—when the apprentices who were registered prmtlials, and who constituted the vast majority, would entrust their condition with that of their more fortunate brethren—when a numerous class who looked forward to the enjoyments of freedom, would aid themselves dis appointed in consequence of fraudulent registration—when the appren. tices on the estates of the Marquis of Sligo, and others, would be set free —and when It was known then inn Antigua and the Bermudas free dom was enjoyed by the negroes without their having endured tine evils attendant on the preposterous system of apprenticeship. As he should be followed by gentlemen who were well qualified to enlighten the Meeting, he would only call on them to make one more vigorous effort in behalf of their oppressed fellow-subjects; and if their Legislators were not deaf to reason, blind to policy, and callous to every feeling of humanity, they might yet be induced to undo tine heavy burthen—to let the oppressed go free, and to break every yoke.—Cheers.) The Rev. Mr. Bueristes then came forward He said he recollected hearing an anecdote of an Irish candidate for parliamentary honours, addressing his constituency on the first occasions in the following man ner :—" Gentlemen—Nothing appears to me so difficult in the concep. lion of a speech as to know how to begin it properly and gracefully , and I have therefore come to the resolution that my speech shall have no beginning at all."—(Laughter.) And having merle that extraordinary beginning he proceeded forthwith to business.—(Hear.) He (Mr. B.) should not attempt so impracticable a part as that of making a speech without a beginning; but he should endeavour at once to address him self to the purposes for which they were assembled. He begged of them to believe that nothing would have induced him to make a journey of 240 miles, and absent himself twenty days from duties of importance, if he had not hoped in the absence of some disinterested friends, to have been enabled to submit a few facts anti arguments for their consideration that had not previously occurrent to the respectable assemblage he saw before him in support of tine great cause of negro emancipa tion. He was not an orator, and had not the power of making a compact and perspicuous statement of facts ; but if he succeeded through their indulgence in getting his meaning into the minds of his auditors, he would fee l himself amply compensated fur any em barrassment or pain which his present position might inflict won him. He considered it to be of considerable importance, and indispensably necessary now, when the policy of their opponents was to distract atten tion to points of minor consideration--he conceived it of great import ance that they should recur to and rally round their first principles.— (Hear, hear.) Because, if they impressed upon the minds of all men, as the motion which he had the honour to second assumed, that slavery was essentially an umnitigable evil, they had but to ask themselves from year to year, and from day to day—had they got rid of the evil? had they discharged their responsibility ?—were they free from the pres sure of that of which their consciences had so long complained?—and if they found that it was not so, then they had precisely the same re sponsibility imposed upon there as when they had first embarked in the emancipation enterprize.— (Hear and cheers.) He should not, while recurring to the principl es o f th e i r t ru ly h a ll owe d un i on, attempt to bring forward any arguments aga i ns t th e p r i nc i p l e an d circuistanees ofnegro slavery, because they were in every man's mouth and in every good man's heart —(Hear, and cheers.) He:was a man—he loved liberty, and therefore he hated, with all the hatred of which his nature was capable, human slavery in every form, and negro slavery in all the widely extended sharacters of barbarity, cruelty, and licentiousness which it assumed.—(Cheers.) So instinctive was the love of liberty, that he had been sometimes led to conclude that those who abetted slavery were not men, but an inferior order of beings--perhaps, they were monkeys—(A laugh)—but he appealed to that meeting, solemnly and deliberately, whether the taint of an inferior and degraded nature was not more justly applicable to those who were so palpably devoid of the natural instincts of humanity than those, who, although their skin was black, did not exhibit the paleness of guilt, the purple hue of intem perance, or thejaundice of dissoluteness and disease?—(Hear, hear.) But as an unworthy minister and professor of religion, he felt that it was from religion he drew the strongest and most direct arguments against the system.—(Cheers) It was in the lustre of religion that he saw its greatest evil, and that it appeared a direct interference, not only with the rights of man, but also with those of Almighty God, and the fruitful source of all crime and wickedness.—(Hear.) "God has made man of one blood, and all the nations of men free to dwell upon the face of the earth." That was a direct reproach to the paltry and selfish distinctions of clime and colour, and the atrocious system of confining men as slaves to ono spot of earth when God had given it as the birthright of all men.—( Hoar, and cheers.) Perhaps he might here, without impropriety, refer to the great enterprise of evangelizing the colonies, now so popular, and in which, he was aware the people of Bristol had always taken so prominent a part.—(Hear.) He thought that enterprizee bound them the more firmly to support the great cause of negro emancipation. Nothing could be snore contradictory in principle than labouring to introduce Christianity into the Colonies, and at the same time abetting the system of negro bondage. What had they done in the first :instance ? Under the pretext of colonization they had actually depopulated hundreds of thousands of acres, and after having exterminated the last aboriginal tenant of the soil, they passed over to another coast, under the pretext of commerce, and stole from thence myriads of human beings that they might compulsorily cultivate the soil for their own peculiar benefit, and then seek to justify or sanctify, or somethingify the theft by introducing a system of Chris tianity.—(Hear, hear.) The thing was preposterous, it was idiotic; their Christian establishments, their missionary schemes for education had done great good, but that could never justify them as a Christian nation i❑ doing evil.—(Cheers.) To :christianize the slave while they connived at rapine and wrong might be likened to " doing good by stealth," and well might they " blush to find it fame." The very ex istence of Christianity in many colonies, and the eagerness of many of the planters to introduce it, had long seemed to him to amount to a complete concession of the grounds of right, honour, and necessity, upon which the system of slavery attempted to support itself —(Hear, hear.) Upon what plan could slavery be vindicated? Upon what ground could they defend the iniquitous system which placed a yoke round the neck of their fellow men, whom, by education and moral instruction they had made Christians, and had rendered susceptible of the restraints of morality, and entitled to the blessings of religion ? Had not every man an inalienable right to civil liberty ? and was not the negro a man ? Let them ask those missionaries and those So cieties, one of which had recently held its anniversary in that town — ask them if that man was not capable of being made a Christian, and if he had not a right to all those domestic priliileges and comforts—to those' legal securities—to that personal freedom which was the true right of very man ; and were not his claims to freedom equally strong, when for hi benefit they had set up .an expensive (he did not mean too expen sive) establishment of Clergy, wit.`' their diocesans; and when they In. t minced missionaries into the coloni.", and projected he knew not how many schemes of religious amelioration ?—(liear.) By the introduction of Christianity the system of West India Elairery had laid its bosom bare to receive the coming dcath.lilow ; and if C'ey acted consistently with the spirit of their missianary labours, and tin.' Principles of Chris. tianity, the monster of slavery, already mortally wounded, 'would, bye and and bye, fall lifeless at the feet of the ti t 'titgn geilitis of oligion, The 'mete& s themselves felt the absurdity ana „'acansistency of attempting to christianize men who were held in a state of ,hondage— it was putting a .7ible into their hands while they fastened the manacles on t;aeir wrist.—(-hear, hear.) On the principle of this West' India philosophy what bad 01,7 been doing ? They had been supporting' not congregations of men but r i Nnagetjes.—(Hear and laughter.) He h heard of a family of monkeys in the Zoological Gardens of Liverpool, consisting of a grandfather end grandmother, father, mother, and chil dren, and it was not more preposterous or absui - d to appoint a Govern ment Chaplain to the monkeys in the ,Liverpool Zoological Gardens, than to set up a Christian establishment among a re `pie whom, by con tinuing In a system of infamous and illegal bondage, th ay virtually pro nounced to be something less than men.—(Loud cheers.) If they gave . fiecdom to those unhappy people it would be far more ,grateful to extend to them the blessings cf Christianity ; tut having ennforrecl on then) Christianity - , they were bound in justice to give them freNdona, and let them not be teaching religion at the expense of morality, but henceforward let them r a `eounmend morality and religion by example as well as precept. They had ;tow awakened to a true sense of their post- , tion—they had beseeched Parlilament with petitions and remonstrances against the continuation of the system of slavery which had been so very touchingly depicted in the memoirs of Wilberforce, lately pub. licked ; and they had been promised ;‘,' satisfactory adjustment of a claim which pressed heavily on the national Conscience. Mr. Stanley intro duced a measure for that purpose in a speech memorable for its eloquence and moral feeling, which promised much, but was never realised. He would now ask any gentleman present whether the terms of the resolu tion he held in his hand were not strongly hastified by the tact, that even under the name of apprenticeship slas'ery still ,existed in full force ? He denied that the system of apprantie,aship even professed, except prospectively, to abolish the systrm of slavery. It repealed the name—it abolished some of its most revolting and often.) stye enactments, but it legalised it for the first time in the history of British legislation, and prolonged some of its very worst oppressions.— (Loud cheers.) It was unnecessary to refer to the various arguments that had been brought forward to establish that feet, but he would refer to one which would not be the less acceptable because it had emanated from the venerable Wesley. Upon one occasion, Mr. Wesley was asked wherein consisted the difference betwen freedom and slavery ? and lie had answered, " herein, that you and I in England, go where we will and enjoy the fruits of our labour—this is freedom; the negro does not, and this' is Fla er y. " — (Cticers.) He would now call the attention of the meeting to the setitim,nts of Lord Howick a nobleman of great Intelligence and integrity, of whom he should always speak with the highest respect, although he direred from him upon political matters. On the occasion when Mr. Stanley introduced his Bill, Lord Howick observed that slavery did not consist in a name—that the House should not allow itself to be imposed on by ... words—the real distinction between slavery and freedom was, that. in one state men worked because it was their interest to do &I ; but in the other they were compelled by a system of tyranny and cruelty, but with. out remuneration. If, as ha believed, that was the distinction be tween a state of slavery and freedom, he would ask, how had his Right Honourable Friend got lid of slavery? He would maintain that what his Right Honourable Friend proposed was in effect, wiiat. ever it might be in name, a virtual retention of the principle of slavery, acting by compulsory means—not for the benefit of the negro, but for the benefit of his master. After depicting the horrors of slavery, It was for him to show what were the advantages arising from the sys, tern, which was nothing more nor less than a continuation of the prin ciple of slavery. He felt it his duty to enter his protest against the centinuance, for however short a time of the existing system which worked only for the benefit of the planter. So strong was the cotevic. lion of the Noble Lord upon that point, that a few days rifierwasds he abandoned his seat in the Government, rather than be a party to what he considered a nefarious and unrighteous arrangement.—(Cheers, and hear, hear..) Was not the system of apprenticeship a system of compulsory and uncompensated servitude? He never heard that denied, and then he would say, that the enactments of the apprenticeship system were essentially the principles of slavery.— (Loud cheers.) He (Mr. B.) was present in the House of Commons' when Mr. Buxton proposed that even so small a sum as a halfpenny a day would be paid to the negro as a recognition of his right to wager; but Mr. Stanley insisted that the uncompensated principle was a vital part of his plan—he declined to accept of Mr. Buxton's proposition, and the House negatived it without a division. If there had been any thing like an attempt to cure slavery by the apprenticeship system, it must have been on the homeopathetic system—that principle of medicine which, if he understood it rightly, administered in a state of disease these drugs which would produce that disease in a healthy state, and assuredly the negro inhaled the system of slavery very plentifully under the apprenticeship system.—(A laugh.) Could they forget that a Christian negroes, the member of a Baptist Church, was, some twelve or sixteen months ago, sentenced to fourteen clays' im prisonment on the treadmill, for the specific crime indorsed on her committal of taking Morrison's pills?—(Laughter.) He would ask, what did the men deserve, whether in their personal or official capacity, he cared not, who had been guilty of that system of quackery with the bodies and sou't, with the lives and liberties of 800,000 of their fellow beings ? But then, it was universally acknowledged that the apprentice ship, with all its eseential defects, contained humane and mitigating they had abundant proofs t hat these p rovisions . , ir e o r v e is s i e o l i f i s d . feateciby Unhappily the mischievous clauses of the apprenticeship code which devolved the arraogement of the details upon the Colonial Legislatures. How had they heislated P They had heard statements of their maladministration long be; ore the public of that country had been roused to make a stand against .'he system. 'I hey were all aware that Lord Glenelg's speech on introduclieg n is Bill was based entirely on the statement of those abuses. lie shouiol be sorry to detail) the meet.. ing, and sorry to trouble himself by going ove s - the grounds wl:ich he had felt it necessary four or six months ago to ga _over in demenstration of the breach of the contract between the Imperial To - Bement and the Colonial Legislature and the ma'..administration of til'e system of ap prenticeship in regard to the division of labour—in regard . to the punish. inents inflicted for the purpose of coercing the negroes—in regard to this etude(' and scanty Allowances of food—in regard to the restraint , upon the time of the negroes—in regard to the inhuman treatment of the female part of the population—in regard to the corrup'ion in the courts of justice, and the constitution and conduct of the courts of ap. appraisement. All these had been long L'efore the public, and Lord Glenelg had expressly stated , In his hearing in 'the House of Lords, elthough that statement had never yet been putelished, " that the case of the abolitionists, as a case of facts, was fully esta,:stished." They had protested against the apprenticeship system and its a:wises, and against the arrangement by which the Brit i s h p ublic had been clofrausied of 2.0,000,000 e of money and six y ears of the uncompeneatee t eervices of the negro population. By the way, that commereial arrangement and its results had been well illustrated to his mind by an advert isemeet which had lately appeared in the Morning Herald. He never thesught of the twenty millions without thinking of that advertisement, " Any gentleman having 0,0001. to dispose of, may be placed in a moat el,ga nt position, only he must not expect to receive mere than four per cent:* r his money."—(Hear, hear, and a laugh.) Contrasting that with the apprenticeship system it would read thus :—" Any nation having twenty millions to dispose of; may be placed in a most elegant position, only, it muse not expect to receive more than next to nothing for its money."—(eLech laughter.) In that elegant position they were placed, and he congrat,dated them upon that extraordinary instance of liberality on the part ~'a Liberal G over nment. A more libera l arrangement, and he sincerely :selieved a better intentioned one, was never made; and at the same thew he thought that one more unhappily conceived, or more signally done ted was never witnessed in the history of that country —Loud cheen.n) A few months ago, finding out in the more true than elegant lan-' guage of Mr. O'Connell, that they had been bamboozled, they protes. ted against it ; and here again he sincerely congratulated them on the success of that effort. He was aware that they had sustained a tempo rary defeat, hut he would maintain that their cause 1 ad at the same time received a moral triumph in Parliament, as well as without. He might refer them with very great pleasure to what took place in the interval between the presentation of their petitions for the abolition of the apprenticeship syeiem in the latter part of last year and the debate which decided the question against them. He might refer with great gratification to the procee.'tings of the Committee In London, of which lie had the honour of bcie'g a member. The bar_ inonious feeling of that Committee, and their unanimous resolution, on which he might conscientiously say they inveriablet acted to merge and postpone to the great cause of emancipation all party considerations and prejudices was highly honourable to that body.—(Vehement cheering.? He had never acted with a class of men from many of whom he poll. tically and religiously differed, in whom he met greater consistency in the prosecution of one object—great singleanindedness—les's of religious sectarianism, or a more firm resolution to merge everything in the one great object. He Wight refer them to the interviews which the Cone mittee hatf with distinguished Members of both Houses of Par liament, including Lord Brougham and Sir George Strickland but be felt particularly coiled on to allude to their interview with two bishops connected with diocees:s immediately contiguous, namely, the Bishop of Bath and Wales, and the Bishop of Exeter, from both of whom, merely on a statement of this case, they had received the warmest sympathy and the most cordial aesurance of support That might be taken as a sufficient answer to a parag:.'ph which he regretted to have seen in a Bristol paper of last week, in whneh there was an insi nuation that their object was too liable to be mixes Up with party feeling. He could assure the respectable editor of that p.Wer that he (Mr. B.) was not one of those who would mix himself up wails such a cause, and a mere statement of the na mes of the p ersons by eseeen their case was supported in both Houses of Parliament would be a sufficent refutation of such a charge. They had in the House of Commons the Mae quis of Chandos, and Mr.Byng, the fat her of that House, one of the most consistent supporters of the Government; and on the Radical interest they had Mr. O'Connell ; while in the House of Lords they had the Bishop of Exeter, the Marquis of Sligo, and Lord Brougham; and he wondered what point of sympathy those distinguished individuals could find, or what common ground of political collusion or concert was emirs them ? —(Hear, hear, and cheers.) On the other side, they had opposed to them Sir Robert Peel, who apprehended great danger from emancipating the negroes in 1840, as well as in 1838—Lord John Russell, and Mr. Hume; and in the House of Lords they had against them, he fettled, the great Captain, Lord Melb entice and Earl Radnor. It required are exuberance of fancy, and great strength of ingenuity, to discern what point of political sympathy or consistency existed between those distin guished individuals.—(Hear, hear.) Every circumstance of their connection with the Abolitionists divested it of every political feeling, and showed that they had embanked in a contest for the moral improvement of their fellow-creatures, without reference to any such paltry feeling. He would refer to the whole tenor of the debate to establish that—he would refer to the speech of Mr. Pease, which the Times declared to be a most temperate and able ono—lie would refer to the impassioned appeal of Dr. Lushington—and he would go farther, and contend that their case had been established by the speeches of their opponents. Had they forgotten Sir Edward Sugden's denunciation of the outrageous in fraction of the contract on the part of the planters ? He would refer also to the speech of Sir George Grey, as a striking proof of the want of har mony between him and the Chief Secretary ; and it he wante.l to answer Sir George Grey's speech, he would place Lord Glenelg's in a parallel position to it.—(Cheers.) He would refer to the memorable admission of Lord Howie's, that that very Bill of Lord Glenelg's would render the apprenticeship system so impracticable and unprotit aide to the colonists, as to induce them to break it up altogether.—(Loud cheers.) That called up Dr. Lushington, who could not resist the temptation of animadverting upon such an admission, instead of waiting, as he in tended, to reply to Mr. Gladstone, and thus then were deprived cf their triumph by a manosuvre on the part of thick opponents, and a want of dexterity and promptitude en their side. In that position they again wanted to make an appeal to the people of Bristol and the country. He believed, if the question was placed upon fair grounds It must pre vail. Their cause had made such progress as would render it absolutely resistless; and when the question next came on there would be perhaps 100,000 nomprmdials and other negroes who had been voluntarily manu mitted by eight or nine West India proptietors, who wetild be all libe rated, It would be impossible to convince that (art of the negro popu lation who were stiti held in botudsge that they were not as legally entitled to their freedom as those V.IIJ received it, and that accu mulation of moral and physical power would speedily render their cause triumphant.—(Cheers.) 'their great object now wits not so mudh to insure succe 5, but to hove their principles sec eenised in Parliament, that they who had committed a false step shoul.l Lave the credit of re tracing it, and if they did not, it would be effected without interposi tion.—(Great applause) As a Christian man, he now more earnestly i n fluencing the minds of their most respectable members, an d emphatically than ever entreated of that meeti ng i.ot only by petitions, t eiroes to seem c a re rose t b o ut Li b e y thir iltat:en et' the conrctons and feelings of that gr&tf C hiislia t conithy, ahe. !Mal induce Puiliement to do that which would otherwise be dune without it. He had come prepared with a large quantity of documents, but net one of which he