The Sun. — London, England, 1836-06-15 00:00:00

IMPERIAL PARLIAMENT. ROUSE OF COMMONS, JUNE 14. The SPEAKER took the Chair at 4 o'Clock. The Southampton Water-works Bill, and the Preston and Longridge Bill were read a third time and passed. SMITHFIELD MARKET BILL. Mr. PALMER presented a petition from the farmers and graziers of Essex, against the Smithfield and Islington Market Bill,' MANCHESTER AND CHESHIRE RAILWAY. Captain PAGET presented a petition from Beaumaris in favour of the Manchester and Cheshire Railway. WESSENDEN RESERVOIR. On the motion of Mr. BLACKBURNE, the Wessenden Reservoir Bill was read a third time and passed. KILKENNY PETITION. The SPEAKER informed the House that the recogni zances in the case of the Kilkenny petition had not been entered. _ The order was then directed to be discharged. TRALEE CANAL AND HARBOUR. - ........._ _ Mr. MORGAN J. O'CONNELL moved the further con sideration of the Report in the Tralee Canal and Harbour Bill. BEER TRADE. Mr. BROTHERTON presented a petition from the beer retailers of Salford, complaining of the inefficiency of the present law, and praying for alteration. CHURCH RATES. Lord ALBERT CONYNGHAM presented a petition from the Dissenters of Canterbury, praying for the abolition of church rates. TURNPIKE TRUSTS. ~, ~ •~ Mr. BROWNR iGG presented petitions, praying for the consolidation of turnpike trusts. Mr. SHARMAN CRAWFORD presented a petition from Drogheda signed by 6,410 persons, praying that tithes may be abolished—that the revenue of the lands of the Established Church may be so economically managed as to supply a fund for the relief of the poor—that the lands of Ireland may be relieved from any charge, and That the House will not sanction any Municipal Bill for Ireland, which does not confer the corporate rights as those which have been granted to Eng land and Scotland ; also petitions from the parishes of Fabans and Dysteterny, County Donegal, and from Drumgooland, County Down, praying to the same effect. there appeared to be a sudden sense of duty sprung up in the office, and these poor petitioners were the victims. These were encroachments undoubtedly, but they were encroachments of 30 years standing, and the Attorney-Gene ral was so eminent in the law as to know that no encroach ments could be questioned in a Court of Law after 20 years' enjoyment, except by the prerogative of the Crown. He would make further inquiry into the matter, and if the facts were as stated, of which he had no doubt, he would certainly adopt the course suggested by the Hon. and Learned Member for Kilkenny, and move for a Committee. After some observations from the ATTORNEY GENERAL, which were inaudible in the Gallery, the petition was ordered to lie on the table. _ _ 111 r. HOPE presented a petition from Gloucester, praying for the abolition of death in all cases. Mr. JARVIS presented a petition from Chester, praying for an alteration of the timber duties. Mr. HODGES presented a petition from the Gravesend Steam Navigation Company, against the Steam Navigation Bill now before the House. Also, a petition from Frome and Dartmouth, against the Consolidated Turnpike Act. TITHES. Mr. H. GRATTAN presented six petitions from parishes in the county of Meath against Tithes, and against the Lords' Amendments to the Irish Municipal Corporation Bill. Pk-!! THE SUN, LONDON, *EDNESDAY, JUNE 15, 1836. Mr. SC ARLETT rose to order. He real considered this manner of arguing a question, and this species of con duct, was the best excuse that could be offered for the repeal of the Union.---( Hear, and cheers from the Opposition Mem bers.) He appealed to Hon. Gentlemen sitting on the other side, whether it was possible that language of this description could be permitted to be used ; when an Hon. Gentleman in speaking used language which was repudiated by the House, he was immediately told it was language so familiar to him, that he did not know it was improper.—( Hear, and cheers from the Opposition Members.) He called upon the Speaker. He begged for his interposition, and to use his authority at a time when he perceived that Hon. Members were becoming disorderly. Mr. O'CONNELL—BehoId I a third advocate. Another cause for congratulation to the Hon. Member for Berkshire I do not believe a fourth could really be found in this House. —(Laughter.) The Hon. Member for Knaresborough makes use of offensive expressions, I say that I do not require any apology for them, whereupon the Hon. Member for Norwich— Mr. GO ULB URN—It is not for the purpose of making a commentary that I now rise to order, but I submit to you, Sir, whether if this species of discussion is continued it is calcu lated to insure respect to this House ?—( Cries of " Order.") Mr. O'CONNEL L—l have done with the subject. I thought, indeed, that a fourth could not be found. I forgot the Right Hon. Gentleman, I forgot that in this House a fourth could be found.—(Laughter, and cries of " Order.") If any gentleman calls me to order I shall immediately sit down—to find a fifth is impossible.—( Hear, laughter, and cries of " Order.") And now, Sir, I hope I may be allowed to go on. Mr. Sergeant JACK SON here rose to order. Mr. O'CONNELL (pointing to Mr. Sergeant Jackson) — Oh, oh !--(Loud laughter and cheers.) Mr. Sergeant JACKSON, having waited for the cheers and laughter to subside, took the liberty of submitting to the Speaker whether such conduct as this should be persevered in ? --(Cries of " Order.") If it was he should certainly move the House should adjourn the debate. Lord JOHN RUSSELL—I must agree in what has fallen from the Right Hon. Gentleman that any personal expression is, in itself, irregular, and oug ht no t to b e persevere d i n .— (Hear, hear.) No interruption of the kind ought to be per mitted, but the debate should be allowed to proceed. Now I cannot help remarking that the last time the Hon. Member for Kilkenny met with an interruption it appeared to use that he was about to proceed with what is the proper subject for discussion.—( Hear, hear.) The SPEAKER was at all times unwilling to lay hold of particular expressions ; what he had always endeavoured to do, and often, he was sorry to say, not very successfully, was to promote as far as in his humble powers lay, that these debates should be maintained with discretion, order, and conduct, and in such a manner as would be consistent with the dignity, cha racter, and honour of that House.—( Hear, and cheers.) Mr. O'CONNELL—The speech of the Hon. Member for' Berkshire, to which I was adverting when interrupted, con tains three subjects. The last was the poor-laws, the last but one the Church question. Upon that I have shown his utter inconsistency. Whatever that person's inconsistency may be, it is not my fault. I have nothing to do with it—it is no act of mine if a man becomes a renegade to the one side or the other—but when a man does so it is natural that he should have, at least, the sympathy of those who are also renegadoes, and have abandoned principles they formerly professed. It is matter so completely personal that it is not to be accounted for.--(Hear, hear.) The inconsistency of the Hon. Gentle man is, however, a matter of very little importance in itself; it certainly has very little to do with the public interests. He has attacked all the Protestants—he has done so in identifying them with the wretched Corporations.—( Hear, hear.) Why, he has done this in utter ignorance of the fact that the num ber of Protestants in those Corporations was so miserably small.—( Hear, hear.) And, besides this, there is the evi dence before this House that those Protestants who from their intelligence and education belonged to the class of politicians, were as decidedly and as strictly excluded from the Corpo rations as the Roman Catholics themselves.—(Hear, hear, hear.) So totally ignorant is the Honourable Member for Berkshire upon this subject, that even this fact, so notorious to most others, he is not in the least de gree aware of it.—( Hear.) He is, too, doubly igno rant, when he founds an argument upon the assumption that the corporators have been the representatives of the great body of Protestants. Now, in connexion with the Hon. Mem ber for Berkshire, I have made observations upon the Times newspaper. The Hon. Member for Knaresborough, for the first time in his life, is perfectly correct.—( Cries of " Order " from the Opposition Members.) Well, then, he was not per fectly right—( Hear and laughter)—but in principle he was right, and if there is a denial in this House that the individual is not connected with that paper, the moment I have heard that denial I shall never again say a word on the subject. But lie is right. Let there be, as there ought to be, in this House, a disclaimer of any connection with an instrument of false hood, foulness, and calumny—of one that affords an instance of the most abandoned, and certainly the greatest degradation of talent—of one that has lowered literature, and debased the character of public writers—that has shown them up as mar ketable commodities—that has only done this, that the higher they rise in public estimation, the more ready are they to be bought, and the greater must be the price paid for them.— ( Hear.) If there be any human being, one of this House— recollect I speak of a man not in the House—who continues to earn the wages of public prostitution ; if there be such a man as 1 describe, then I say he is too despicable for further no tice. I leave him to pocket a portion of the wages of his pensioned writers. Those who poison the waters that even an enemy in a hostile country drinks of, are accounted guilty of a crime most abhorrent to civilized life ; but what are we to say of those who poison the first sources of literature, who stigmatise the character of a nation, and debauch the instruments of learning—theirs is the worst mode of earning the wages of villainy, for theirs is the most abominable of all prostitution.— ( Cheers.) They are those who argue for a question, and turn against it ; who hope for one thing to-day, and hate it to-morrow.—( Hear. hear.) Does this touch the Hon. Mem ber for Berkshire ? I hope not. I really hope that he has no connection with an instrument of that kind. It has been sug gested by the Hon. Member for Knaresborough that he has not. I adopt the suggestion. I believe at once that the fact is, as the Hon. Member has stated, and then every word I have said is merely in reply to that base instrument which has at tacked me so long. But if my words do apply, I mention no name, I say qui caput ille fecit. Let him who chooses take them up—if any man wishes to find them, and in the vulgar phrase " the cap fits him," I cannot help it.—( Hear, hear, and laughter.) The people of Ireland are not so degraded as the Hon. Member for Berkshire has suggested, that they are incapable of managing their own affairs. What is the ground, what is the pretext for saying so? Is is because they are Catholics? That is not a topic which suits this House, though it might read well elsewhere. It is as British subjects they claim their rights.—( Hear.) Does any man contend that this measure alone will pacify Ireland ? I shall not do so. Refuse it, and you create agitation, because you afford additional materials to the grievances which the people al ready endure—( Hear, hear, hear)—grant it, and you advance another step, for I admit you have already commenced, in giving to the people of Ireland equal rights with every other part of the empire. Why should not a measure like this be adopted towards Ireland, and which tends so much to the pa cification and tranquillity of all.—(Hear.) It is for these reasons I have risen to repudiate the speech of the Hon. Member for Berkshire, and to call again for justice to Ire land.—( Hear, and cheers.) Mr. WALTER considered that he was quite justified in the views he entertained upon the subject that had been re ferred to ; notwithstanding the remarks that had been made by the Hon. and Learned Gentleman who had just sat down. There was, he thought, great inconsistency in the statements of Hon. Members as to the amount of Church revenue.— ( Cries of " Question.") The SPEAKER observed, that the opportunity was afforded to the Honourable Gentleman of explaining anything which he thought might refer to himself, but not of again referring to the question before the House. Mr. WALTER hoped he might be allowed at least to re ply to that part of the case which related to his having changed his seat in the House. He must be permitted to observe that this charge, coming from the quarter it did, appeared to him a most extraordinary one. When he looked about he saw many Hon. Members who, two sessions ago, sat on the Op position side of the House, and who now sat on the Ministe rial side, although the same Ministers were now in power who had been then ; surely, then, if there were a charge of inconsistency to be raised upon the mere fact of having changed one's seat, that charge applied to the Hon. Mem bers in question as well as to himself.--( Some Hon. Mem bers cried " Votes, votes.") There were only two occasions on which he had thought it his duty to vote against Minis ters, and on those occasions he had been guided, as he hoped he should at all times be, by the best consideration he was able to bring to the subject. If on any particular question new arguments or facts presented themselves which caused him to doubt the accuracy of his previous view of the sub ject, he was always open to conviction, and ready to give his vote accordingly. As to the charges which the Hon. and Learned Member had brought against him, he had only to say that he should continue the course he had hitherto pursued, without reference to that of the Hon. and Learned Member, in the same way that he had hitherto endeavoured to do. He had not obtained his seat in that House in the way represented by the Hon. and Learned Member, nor did he continue to sit there for hire or gain wrung from the most wretched and dis tressed classes of his countrymen, whose ignorance might render them the dupes of false pretences. The SPEAKER said it would perhaps now be convenient to the House if he stated the question which was before it.— ( Hear, hear.) The question was, whether Bandon should be included in schedule C or not ? After a few words from Mr. F. SHAW, which were inau dible to us, Sir J. C. HOBHO USE said there had been no wish or intention on the part of himself and the friends of the Govern ment to disturb the House by a debate upon the question now before it, which was, whether Bandon should be included in the schedule or not ; and if the Hon. and Learned Member for Bandon had not volunteered his services in that way, he felt convinced that his Hon. Friend behind him would not have found a seconder to his proposition. He regretted to see that there seemed to be a determination on the part of Members on the opposite side of the House, that whatever. business might be doing, on any Irish question, nothing sbou_ l . 4 peaceably, amicably, and according to the usual Parliamentar course.—( Hear, hear, hear.) There were rnanyhfeutlemen u lit that on his (the Ministerial) side of the House who d t Ministers had not made a sufficiently determined stand upon this question. He could only assure the House, however, that whatever had been done by them, had been resolved upon after the best consideration, and with the _firrn and honest conviction that they were doing t h e best eh, under cir cumstances, could be done for Ireland.—( r, hear.) He thought that the thanks of the country were due to the Go- I vernment for having adopted a course which he thought wouldt lead to an honourable compromise, and affo rd au o pp ortunity of bringing- this great question to a settleme nt. (Hear.) He regretted extremely that any thing of a persona l nature had occurred in the course of the debate. He would express a hope, also, that his Hon. Friend behind him would see the importance of not continuing the discussion further. He trusted his Hon. Friend would see the great advantage which would result from this Bill being sent up to the other House in its altered form, without any division upon it whatever. He begged his Hon. Friend to consider this, and not to permit himself to " listen to the voice of the charmer, charm ho never so wisely." (Hear, and a laugh.) Mr. Sergeant JACKSON explained. Colonel BUTLER merely rose to say that it was his inten tion to have seconded the motion of the Hon. Member for Dundalk, when he was anticipated by the Hon. and Learned Member for Bandon in so doing. Mr. G. F. YOUNG, in reference to the argument of the Hon. Member for Berks, that the proposed measure of muni cipal reform would throw all the political power of the Cor porations into the hands of one party, and that the most nu merous one in the place, begged to make one observation — namely, that the political power in the new system was to be distributed, not simply according to population, but upon the basis of a property qualification. Now it happened that the property of Ireland was divided amongst the Protestants and Catholics, nearly in the inverse ratio of their numerical force— ( Hear, hear)—and there were at least two millions unfortu nately in a state of beggary, and who, of course, could take no part in the political powers created by the new measure. — (Hear, hear.) He had only one other observation to make upon this question. He (Mr. G. F. Young) would be one of the last men to dispute the powers and the perfect inde pendence of the other branch of the legislature ; but at the same time he begged the House to consider the position in which this question stood. The original question mooted by the House was, whether Ireland should have corporations or not ?—( Hear, hear.) The House of Commons declared its opinion that she ought, but the House of Lords had since said that she ought not have these institutions. What had since been done with this ? The House of Commons, which originully set down the number of the proposed Corporations at fifty, now consented to reduce them to twelve, and so showed that it had every disposition to effect an amicable compromise on the subject with the other House. If the Lords after this should persist in rejecting the Bill when sent back to them, they would show that they were not disposed to listen to any terms of compromise with the Lower House, and the country would behold them (the Lords) asserting the principle that the House of Commons had nothing to do but to yield entire and unconditional submission to their superiority. (Hear.) He hoped, however, that this would not prove to be the case ; he hoped, and trusted that when this Bill went back to the House of Lords it would be received by them in the spirit of fair and amicable compromise with which it had been treated in this House ; so would this great question eventually be settled without throwing this great, happy, and now pros perous country into political convulsions, which under different circumstances would threaten it. Mr. WALKER hoped his Hon. Friend near him would not press the House to a division on this question. Mr. SC A RLETT said that he did not deny that Irishmen were fit to enjoy political liberty and political institutions, but he thonght that these must be given them by different means to those adopted in England, on account of the difference in the socidl characteristics of the two nations. He did n ot mean to say that Irishmen were inferior to Englishmen-- ( Hear)—On the contrary, he thought that in many particu lars they were their superiors, as in their great vivacity and quickness of apprehension. (The Hon. and Learned Member continued to address the House for some minutes, but amidst such confusion and impatient interruption as to be quite in audible to us). Mr. WALL ACE felt strongly the insult which was offered to the Irish people by the House of Lords ; but still he hoped that his Hon. Friend, for whom he entertained great respect, would withdraw his motion. Dr. BALDWIN said that it was not to be supposed that he did not feel strongly the insult which was offered to his country by the House of Lords ; but he trusted his Hon. Friend would not bring division into the camp of the Reformers, by pressing a motion which was calculated to embarrass that Administration which seemed to him determined to do justice to his country.—( Cheers.) He would not argue the question ; all argument upon it was exhausted ; but he rose merely for the purpose of asking his Hon. Friend not to persevere in his proposition. Mr. D. ROCHE also asked his Hon. Friend to withdraw his proposition. Mr. S. CRAWFORD said he would consent to withdraw it if he heard any just reason for his doing so; but in the ab sence of all argument in favour of the course which he was pressed to adopt, he must persevere. The House then divided, when there appeared— For Mr. Crawford's amendment Against it Majority against the amendment —l4O On the motion of Lord J. RUSSELL, the following Com mittee was appointed to draw up reasons against acceding to the amendments by the Lords : Russell, Load John Howick. Lord Bernal, R. Rice, T. S. liobliouse, Sir J. C. O'Connell, D. Merpeth, Viscount Campbell, Sir John Sheil, R. L. O'Loghlen, Sergeant Rolfe, Sir R. M. Wrottesley, Sir J. MARRIAGES BILL. On the motion of Lord J. RUSSELL, the House went int° the committee on the Bill. The several clauses of the Bill having been agreed to, the chairman reported progress. Report to be considered On Thursday next. EXCISE LICENCES (IRELAND) BILL. On the motion of Lord MOR PETH, the House went into committee on the Excise Licences (Ireland) Bill. In the clause for regulating the hours during which public houses shall be opened on Sundays, Lord MORPETH moved that the words from " two in the afternoon till nine at night" be inserted, which was agreed to. In the 7th clause, which applies the provisions of this Bill to all societies in which oaths are administered, ' Lord MORPETH said that he should introduce an amend ment hereafter in order to except " Freemasons" from the operation of the Bill. Colonel PERCEVAL hoped the Noble Lord would els ° except the Friendly Brothers; it not, he should move en amendment to that effect. The other clauses were agreed to, and the House resumed • The other Orders of the Day were then disposed of, and the House adjourned at two o'clock. HOUSE OF LORDS, JuKR 14. ARREST FOR DEBT. The Duke of RICHMOND presented a petition from an individual who had recently visited the prisons in London , praying for an alteration of the Law of Arrest for debt. Lord ROSSLYN presented a petition, praying for protec" tion to Herring Fisheries. . _ . HOLYHEAD STEAM PACKETS. The Earl of LICHFIELD seeing a Noble Marquis (Westmeath) in his place, who had put a question last nigh t to the Noble Lord the Chief Commissioner of Woods and Forests, with regard to the Post-office packets on the Hob . head station, wished to make a few observations. That Noble Marquis had said the steam packets were in a dangerous state, and were not provided with the means of extinguishing fir e should such an occurrence happen. Now the first answer to that was, that by the Bill which would be brought befor e the House all those evils would be remedied, by transferring those packets to the Admiralty; but until that period arrived, not only their Lordships, but the public, should be assured that , the packets were in an efficient state, and that there had been no apprehensions of any accident occurring by fire. They were provided with firebuckets and all necessary means of extinguish ing fire. During the time they were in harbour, a large fir e engine was constructing in the dock-yard. That was not the most suitable occasion for going into the subject of the latt er part of the Noble Marquis's question. A more convenient op portunity would be afforded for that when the report then ur n their Lordships' table came under consideration, and then he should be ready to afford any explanation upon these points' The Earl of WICKLOW enquired when the reports would be likely to be taken into consideration by the House. The Earl of LICHFIELD 'said, intimation had already been given of the intention of his Majesty's Government to introduce two Bills founded on the reports. The Marquis of WESTMEATH said his attention had been called to this subject by having read the re; ports on the table ; and certainly the Comm issione t r who had been employed had entered most satisfactorily in _ 6 ' the subject. They laid very great stress in their report " uP :at the want of fire-hose on board vessels to put out fire t might take place at sea. With respect to the malversat ion an ' t peculation at the Dock-yard at Holyhead, he had only referre: to that as part of the Report. The Commissione rs had d ote their duty, and he was sure the matter could no t be in he tt e hands than theirs. The Duke of RICHMOND could not suffer the converstr tion to drop without making an observation. Ther e had been two packets a day for the last ten years passing backwards t!__. forwards on this station, and he had not heard of one bet e tt lost ; that of itself would have been sufficient to show th e was no very great danger to be apprehended. With_ ,! 5 speet to the fourth report he begged to give notice of intention on Friday next to call their Lordships' at s _ the subject, for such a Report he thought he had never st e i t_T . placed before any House of Parliament, and backed by c' evidence as it was. .he had understood of the Ca p tains had not ha The Marquis of WE STME AT H said the rep due s theset e n t io n I . lolH yh e e , a d p on sea v o c k ra o l ta oc h ca a s d ion h s e , e w n h v il e e ry a pnansosaesnygeorno board, and fibndoajord gA had as were not prope r p recautions a g ainst fire on n . a t a ; as usual when a landsman asked q uestions of a seatna ,got a very short answer.—(Hear, hear, and ive laughtern.t)radiction g a The Duke of RICHMOND begge d to co twins to the statement that the represent ations of tne Cape on the Holyhead station had not met wit h attention from their e i ma p s r t o e s r o s n General. tations. He He had had always seseen every given p e a v p e o r r y a a d t tdernetsisoondt o t 0 him e ir h or is t N o ob bi l s e Friendpredecessor Earlin Lichfield)and he would had n t no odnofiurbmt t h h i In a in the statement, that every letter or General, who signed his name on the back o Department was un iformly communicated to iPt,ost:iitashtehri; opinion thereon no vessel had actually been destroye fire and one no The Earl of WICKLOW rdemhyarfikreed,,yetthaetvela.lythpoauokgeht lees than three tinaes.—(Cries of that station was reported to have been on , became known it would injure not on y Government therefore the also the revenues of the country ; d the Government ~ Hear, hear- ) it. He hope ought immediately to remedy t description of packets I that statiolnf that by establishing would followuopn tthheatrsetcaotmiomn aenddi altogether.with reg ard to fire different n n of the Commissioners, The Earl of LICHMLD said that PAPER DUTY. Mr. SCHOLE FIE LD presented a petition from the paper • manufacturers of Birmingham, praying that they might be al lowed a drawback on the quantity of paper they had on hand at the time of lowering the duty ; and another petition, nume rously signed, also from Birmingham, praying for the total repeal of the duty on Newspapers. The Hon. Member also presented another petition, in favour of the Cheshire Junction Railway. Mr. 'CHALMERS presented a petition in favour of the Irish Municipal Bill, as it originally passed that House. Sir S. WHALLEY presented a petition from Essex, pray ing for a mitigation of the severity of the Poor Laws Amend ment Bill, as regarded the extension of relief to the poor. Colonel CONOLLY presented a petition from the diocese of Cloyne, against the Ecclesiastical Revenues Bill. Mr. O'CONNELL presented a number of petitions from the North of England and Ireland, in favour of the Irish Mu nicipal Reform Bill as first passed by that House. The Hon. Member gave notice that in the Committee on the Irish Church Bill he would move clauses to increase the per tentage from 30 to 40 per cent., and to provide for the repayment of the 10 per cent. from the Consolidated Fund, in order to cover the collection, &c. Also, that he would move clauses in the Committee on the Registration of Votes' Bill. Mr. T. GLADSTONE presented a petition from Leices ter in favour of the Lords' amendments to the Irish Munici pal Bill. Mr. POTTER hoped the Hon. Member was aware that there had been a most numerously signed petition to a con trary effect, which was agreed to at a public meeting, already on the table of the House. WOODS AND FORESTS. Mr. HARVEY was glad to see the Attorney-General in his place, for he had ans important petition to present, which he had deferred from last Friday, in the hope of his presence. This was a petition from the poor to the rich. The petition was signed by seventy persons, who, with five exceptions, were all labouring poor. They represented that they had lived and were born in the county of Radnor, which till a late period was, at least the greater part of it, the property of the Crown. In 1826, the Commissioner of the Woods apd Forests sold a great many of the manors in that county, chiefly, he regretted to say, by private contract. In that year one of those manors was purchased by private contract for 12,000/. by Mr. Watt, of Birmingham. From the statements of the petition it appeared that it was a custom immemorial for the poor of the district to inclose small por tions of waste ground which sloped the hills and rallies of the county, and out of their labour they built cottages which many of them had occupied for upwards of 30 years without interruption, but the Gentleman to whom he had 41- luded, by purchasing one of the manors, had instituted an action at law to recover one of those cottages and a small piece of ground. In that action a verdict was found for the plaintiff, subject to a special case to be argued before the Court of Common Pleas. Thre e is sue s we r e discussed befo;'e the judges of that Court, first, whether the Crown had the power to sell ; secondly, if it had, whether the wastes would pass under the conveyance ; and thirdly, whether the enclosures having been made for more than thirty years, the action could be maintained. The unanimous opinion of the Court was, the Crown had not the power to sell the waste; that if they bad the poser, the waste could not pass under the deed, the Lord Chief Justice (Gibbs) observing that the law and justice of the case lay with the defendant. Since then the Attorney- General, at the instance of the Commissioners of Woods and Forests, had issued a writ to establish, if possible, the right of the Crown. Whether this was an experiment or not on behalf of the Woods and Forests, was a matter of little or no mo ment, because these persons who were in possession of their little property were sought to be displaced by a most expensive, and a most dilatory process.—( Cries of " Hear.") It was clear that these proceedings were at variance with the first principles of justice, and uncalled for by the law of Par liament. For by the comprehensive Act passed a few years since, consolidating all the Acts of Parliament with reference to inclosures, the Commissioners were empowered to sell, by public or private contract, the property committed to their charge. But it went on to state, that as there were many im provements wheie it would not be expedient to disturb the pos sessors, it provided that where parties had been in possession of these encroachments for twenty years they were not to be in terfered with, but where it was for a less time, the Commis sioners had power to grant leases. This showed a solicitude to protect persons in this unfortunate condition. By the proceed ings instituted by the Crown in one instance an individual had been driven from his little home and his little all—from the rugged soil that he had tilled with the sweat of his brow—from the cottage, the work of his own hands, to find no other home but in the workhouse.—( Hear.) He had another petition on the same subject, which showed how cruelly and severely these proceedings acted upon the poor. The peti tioner stated that he was 78 years of age ; that in 1801, he enclosed from the Crown of waste lands 20 acres of land, tin which he erected a cottage. Proceedings were taken against him, and having no means to defend the action, he let judg ment go by default. He was thus swept away from his cot tage, and thrown upon the wide world. The Commissioners of Woods and Forests were only exercising their rights, from a sense of duty ; bat he trusted that that House would manifest such a strong expression of feeling which would operate on the kind feelings of the Attorney-General, with a view to induce him to dispense with further proceedings. (Loud cries of " Hear, hear.") The ATTORNEY-GENERAL said, that in consequence of the notice he had received from the Hon. Member, he had thought it his duty to attend in his place, and to inquire be forehand into the facts of the case. He had received infor mation on which he could place the greatest confidence, and he would state what the facts of the case were, on which he thought the House would agree with him, that nothing'had been done that gave just cause of complaint. As the Hon. Member had stated, the Crown was possessed of extensive manors in Radnorshire, and a large portion of this which was public property had been taken in enclosures. In 1826 these manors were to be sold.—(Cries of " Hear.") It was the duty of the Commissioners of Woods and Forests, at that time, to dispose of the interests of the Crown. The property was public property, and it was for the public interest that the property should be disposed of. Every one had ac knowledged the title, except Mr. Parsons an attorney, and con sequently the action which had been alluded to was brought. Upon that action it had been clearly proved the Crown had a title. Mr. Parsons had refused to acknowledge the right of Mr. Watts, and bad stirred up those who before had ac knowledged his right, to deny that be had a title to any part of the manor. Under these circumstances Mr. Watts had, as between himself and Mr. Parsons, laid his case before the Commissioners of Woods and Forests. An information had been filed against Mr. Parsons for this act, which would be tried at the next assizes of Hereford, when the question would be decided. Mr. O'CONNELL did not think that Mr. Watts had evinced any liberality in the case, because he exacted a rent which gave him dominion over their property, and which en abled him to turn those poor people out, after they had im proved and cultivated the land. In his opinion the Hon. Member for Southwark should move for a Committee, and if necessary, address the Crown ou the subject. Mr. ORMSB Y GORE could assure the Hon. Member that cases of equal hardship existed in North Wales; and he now gave notice that he would move for certain documents when the Report of the Woods and Forests was laid on the table. Mr. F. LEWIS could not agree with the Hon. Member who had just sat down that there were many such cases. On the contrary, the prerogative of the Crown was in too many cases neglected, and advantage was taken of that circumstance.—(Hear.) He would venture to say that no landed proprietor in Wales would allow of encroachment upon his property for a single day; but the Crown allowed an enjoy ment of its property to a certain extent, arid must, therefore, enforce its rights. If the Hon. Member would move for a Committee to inquire into the rights of the Crown in North and South Wales, he (Mr. Lewis) would second it with plea- j sure. Mr. TOOKE defended the conduct and character of Mr. Watts, which had been alluded to in rather harsh terms by the -1-1 - 67 - n. and Learned Member for Kilkenny. , - mr.. OICONNELL explained. "..;:' - Mr. 11 y. HARVEY complained that the Attorney-Ge new had - deucrously handed o ver t h e pet i tioners to grapple . r . ._ withi mriParons, the attorney. lie only wished the Atter :- ley' Genaviind his predecessors h a d b een as careful of the -‘ i','..,',"` --- -", b u tili c ...Ci.own property in bygone times as they now seemed "ft r " 4 - _tore. co nduct of the Woods and F orests h ad been 41bit :t live and flagitious, even to the extreme; but a o A that tne otnce wow(' tie uegracieu. PARLIAMENTARY PAPERS. Mr. HUME presented a petition from an individual, stating that a considerable advantage had arisen from the opening of an office for the sale of parliamentary papers in England, and praying that a similar convenience might be afforded to Ireland. o.i railways generally went cut and immediately sold off his shares.—( Laughter.) Mr. WA SON had heard nothing against the Bill. If the Bill were thrown out now, Committees would be useless, for these statements might have been given there in evidence. After a few words from Lord ROBERT GROSVENOR and Mr. E. DENNISON against the Bill, Sir W. MOL ES WO RTH said that this Bill had received the unanimous assent of the Committee—no opposition what ever had been made to it, and he appealed to the House whe ther they would nnw throw out the Bill. That a harbour was wanted for the coast was clear, from the fact that in one season no less than 23 vessels bad been wrecked on the coast for want of a harbour. Mr. HUME was altogether ignorant of the merits of the Bill, but as many Hon. Members stated that it was wanted, he thought that, rather than run the risk of defeating the Bill, it should be postponed for a week, till the subject was more fully inquired into. He should be sorry, without fur ther inquiry, to reject the Bill. Sir HENRY HARDINGE said that if parties at their own expense were willing to erect a harbour where it appeared to be so much wanted, he for one was content to take the harbour so constructed.—( Hear.) He very much doubted if the parties would pay, but if they were ready to sink their money in the scheme, he would not prevent them. Under these circumstances, if the question were pressed to a division, he would support the Bill. Mr. A. SANDFORD, Mr. P. THOMPSON, and Mr. C. But,- LER, supported the Bill. The gallery was then cleared for a division, when there appeared— For the Second Reading 124 Against it 5l Majority The amendments were accordingly further considered, and the Bill was ordered to be printed. MANCHESTER AND CHESHIRE JUNCTION TAXES ON KNOWLEDGE. The HoN. MEMBER also presented a petition from the work men in the employ of the Messrs. Williams and Co., of Isling ton, praying for the total repeal of the Stamp Duties upon Newspapers. The Hon. Member proceeded to state that he wished to ask a question of the Right Hon. Gentleman the Chancellor of the Exchequer on a subject on which there ex isted considerable anxiety, viz., when the arrangements with France on the subject of the Post-office regulations were likely to come to a termination ? The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER said, that in the course of last week he had received a letter, stating that the treaty was almost completed—it was in fact signed, but it had not yet been sent over. He could also state that steps had been taken, in conjunction with the Admiralty, to carry into effect that part of the Report of the Commissioners which referred to the steam packets, which was the most press ing and urgent point. He could not, however, state the par ticular day on which he would be able to lay the treaty on the table of the House. PRISONS OF THE HOUSE. Sir F. TRENCH said he had a complaint to make, and the House and the Speaker would be surprised to find that the complaint he had to make referred to him (the Speaker). —( A laugh.) He ( Sir F. Trench) had had the misfortune to be the first inhabitant of the prison of the House of Com mons.—( Loud laughter.) He did not complain of the new apartments or of the new paint; but what he did complain of was, that from the construction of the prison, it was owing to a mere accident, that he and the Hon. Member for Ipswich had not been confined together in the same apartment.—(Great laughter.) The prison was so constructed that it would have been impossible for them to have remained there without im propriety or indecency, as one Member to get out would 4ave been pbliged to pass through the apartment of the other. He was very much indebted to fortune, because the Hon. Member for Ipswich, instead of being on the road to Dover or Calais, happened to be in his own apartment.—( Loud laughter, and a cry of hear, hear, from Mr. Wason.) He was not therefore subjected to the necessity of running the risk of a disagreeable collision with him.—( Loud laughter.) The Hon. Member remained in his lodgings, and he ( Sir F. Trench) occupied apartments in prison.—(Renewed laugh ter, and hear.) But: he must state that he was sure the Honourable Member for Ipswich would have treated him with all possible courtesy—(" Hear," from Mr. Wason, and a laugh)—as he ( Sir F. Trench) would have treated that Hon. Member with similar courtesy ; but still he would have been under the necessity of passing through the Hon. Member's apartments, as he ( Sir F. Trench) had the misfortune to he labouring at the time under severe in disposition.—( Loud Laughter.) This, it was obvious, would have been attended with extreme inconvenience. He begged oho to state that this prison was a very bad place to send quarrelling Members to—in fact, he never knew any thing more idle. The keeper was placed outside, and the Hon. Members were left together inside. He did not pre tend to be an architect, but it was obvious to any person that this was extremely inconvenient. He feared very much from the tone of the debates in that House of late, that a greater number of cells ought to be prepared.—( Laughter.) Accord ing to the adage that " a burnt child dreads the fire," he should endeavour to conduct himself in future as not to incur the displeasure or the Speaker.—(Cheers and laughter.) M. R. WAS ON complained of the Order of that House, which could direct any Member to be taken into custody with out having transgressed the rules of the House. He had also some right to complain of the Noble Lord, the Member for Norwich, who at•;; o'clock in the morning had, contrary to all precedent, moved that he be taken into custody. Lord STORMONT was about to address the House, but was interrupted by the SPEAKER, who said there was no ques tion before the House. BREACH OF PRIVILEGES OF THE HOUSE. Mr. JOHN A. SMITH had to apologize to the House for a breach of its privileges oa Saturday morning last, in coming into the House after the question had been put from the Chair. He felt that in doing so he had committed a great irregularity, for which he trusted the Speaker would express to the House his extreme regret.—( Hear.) There was another person connected with the affair, for whom he also felt bound to crave the indulgence of the House, and he regretted that that person, who was one of the messengers, had been induced through his (Mr. A. Smith's) anxiety to vote on the question, to admit him; and as he was the party principally to blame, he hoped the House would not visit that individual with punishment. Mr. AGLIONBY felt very anxious upon this subject, for the sake of the Messenger who was implicated, as he was from the county with which he (Mr. A.) was connected. He was a eery simple and very good natured man, who out of good nature• had broken the orders he had received. This was the first occurrence of the kind which had taken place with him, and he (Mr. A.) would beco.ne his surety that it would not occur with, him again. Under these circumstances he trusted the House Would consider that he had suffered enough of punishment from the intense anxiety he had felt since the • occurrence, and begged that they would not Visit him with their displeasure in any higher degree.—( Hear. ) Sir G. CLERK, having been appointed one of the tellers on the division on Saturday morning, while performing his duty, was informed that several Members had voted who were not present when the question was put from the Chair. Of course, he had felt it his duty to mention the circumstance at the earliest opportunity. The usual course was, that the fact being mentioned, Members who had voted in that way deelareeso, and their vote was struck off.—( Hear.) He had no wish that anything further should take place than that the Hon. Member's vote should he struck off. He joined in the recommendation of the two Hon. Members, that no further notice might be taken of the conduct of the Messenger. He trusted that the Speaker would take such steps as would pre vent such a proceeding from happening in future. The SPEAKER said that he should certainly take such steps as would prevent such a course being adopted in future. Mr. AGLIONBY hoped the House would intimate to the Chair that sufficient had been done without calling upon the Speaker to interfere further.—(Cheers.) Sir JAMES GRAHAM bore testimony to the excellent conduct of Mr. Bailey. He thought the best course to adopt would be to reprimand the individual and let the matter drop. Mr. W YNNE thought a the House was bound in general cases to visit severely any - dereliction of duty on the part of any of its officers; but he thought, in the present instance, some leniency should be shown.—( Cheers.) The SPEAKER considered that he should have committed a great offence to the House, if he had retained in his service a person who had disobeyed the standing rules of the House, without bringing the subject of the individual's conduct before it. As, however, it appeared to be the wish of the House that no further notice should be taken of the subject, ho of course should bow to the wishes of the House, feeling confident that the course the House had adopted would do more to convince the individual that he had acted wrong, than any punishment they might inflict.—(Cheers.) The subject then dropped. TREMOUTHA HARBOUR. Sir W. MOLE SWORTH moved the Order of the Day, for taking into further consideration the Report on the Tre moutha Railway and Harbour Bill. Mr. CHARLES BULLER said that this was rather a singular measure, for it was for the purpose of establishing a railway over a sterile country to a non-existing harbour, on an inaccessible coast.—(Laughter.) He thought it important also for the House to know how the railway had been got up.—(Hear.) There appeared an advertisement in the public papers of a public meeting, in which it was stated the county Members attended andimoved the resolutions : would the House believe that not a single Member bad been there— (Cheers)—and he, as a member of the Committee received a paper making that statement. He should move that the re port should be taken into further consideration on that day six months.—(Cheers.) Mr. F. FRENCH seconded the motion. Sir E. CODRINGTON could not understand how it was that opposition .was made to the Bill now, when there was no objection made in the Committee. After a few words from Lord EBRINGTON against the Bill, Mr. G. YOUNG, being one of the Members alluded to, would merely say that the names of eight Members of that House were put forth as having moved resolutions in favour of the Railway at the Crown and Anchor; their names were put upon the provisional committee, and immediately the shares were at a premium. They insisted upon a public retractation, which was given ; but still the original prospectus was circulated. Some thing of a similar nature had taken place with the Ship-owners' Society. The Secretary to that Society took some shares in the Company on his own account, and signed himself " Agent." His name IN as then put down as proprietor of shares in the concern, as Agent and Secretary to the Ship-owners' Society, thereby making it appear as if that Society favoured the con cern. He hoped the House would instantly kick the Bill out of the House. Col. SIBTHORP was very glad to hear what had just fallen from the Hon. Member; he had nothing to blame him self with, as he had all along prophecied that such would be the end of these bub bles. The stat ement just made would open the eyes of the public to the system of humbl',- which was going on—it was sheerhu mbug.—(Laughter.)He was informed that a gentleman iat hearing s s t t ib a few under ds t w he or Gal f l r e o r m y who him was possessed of 20 .hares , bvu 10 this Pardailian is a distinguished officer ;he commands the Fabert Courier. RAILWAY. Mr. WILBRAHAM moved that the report on this Bill be now taken into further consideration. Sir OSWALD MOSLEY moved as an amendment that the report be taken into further consideration on that day six months. After some discussion the amendment was withdrawn, and the report was received. SPAIN AND THE SOUTH AMERICAN STATES• Lord MAHON wished to ask a question of the Secretary for Foreign Affa'rs relative to a subject which he had ques tioned him about last year—he meant the negotiations that were being carried on between Spain and the South Ame rican States respecting the recognition of the independence of the latter Powers by the former. When he put the ques tion to the Noble Viscount on a former occasion, his reply was, that Senor Mendizabal had dissolved the Cortes, and the consequence was, that it had led to an interruption of the negotiations. The Noble Lord might now make him the same answer, for the present Prime Minister of Spain had dissolved the Cortes in a similar manner. He understood, however, that Senor Isturitz, when a Deputy, said, in his place in the Chamber of Procuradores, that he did not think that the determination of the question rested with the Cortes, but that it was part of the prerogative of the Crown, and therefore the Crown should direct the proceedings ; in short, that the Crown should settle the matter without the interven tion of the Cortes. If this was the present opinion of Senor Isturiz, which be had given as a Deputy, he hoped the Noble Lord would be able to say that it was probable that the parties would come to a satisfactory settlement of the question. He did not complain of the Noble Lord or of the Government; but when he recollected that it was a year and a quarter ago since the late Administration sent over General O'Leary and General Soublette, as deputies from the South American States, to Madrid, he thought that he was justified in again putting a question on the subject to the Noble Lord. Viscount PALMERSTON did not think that the slowness of the negotiations could in any way be attributed to his Ma jesty's Government. The Noble Lord must be aware that his Majesty's Government had nothing to do with the nego tiations, for they had not been invited by either party to inter vene in the matter. He could, however, assure his Noble Friend, that his Colleagues and himself were extremely anxious to sec the differences between Spain and her South American colonies at an end; and, as far as Great Britain could interfere, between independent States, without being called upon, the Government would exert its influence to pro mote this object. He hoped. there was every probability that the negotiations would be brought to a satisfactory termination. natural disposition in man to abuse the power with which he k was entrusted.—(lronical cries of Hear.) In his opinion the Act of the 9th Geo. IV. gave every advantage that could be required in the towns of Ireland. He believed that neither this measure, nor the Tithe Bill proposed by Government, would, is carried, tend to the pacification of Ireland. He no more expected peace to be restored by those two measures, than it was by emancipation of which the same wished for con sequence was predicted. Mr. O'CONNELL—I object, Sir, to the introduction of such such questions as the Church Bill and the poor-laws upon this occasion.—( Hear, hear.) On the poor-laws we have al ready read enough in the Times newspaper.—( Hear, hear, and laughter.) We had discussion after discussion upon them. The Times is the mighty thunderer upon the poor laws, and the Hon. Gentleman, I believe, really thinks that he is writing a paragraph instead of making a speech.— (Laughter.) And then as to the Church question, as to what he calls the robbery of the poor man's week; why, the first time that question was stirred in this House, it was by the Hon. Member for Tipperary ; there were then only twenty-seven Members who voted for that spoliation, and one of the most prominent of them was the Hon. Member for Berkshire. (Hear, hear, and cheers. I have read his name in the list—the list published in The Times, so that he cannot renege from that.—( Hear, and laughter.) I wish to Heaven the Hon. Member would take himself from this side of the House. I scented him in the past session, as " the last rose of summer," and yet he still remains amongst us. I wish he would go the side upon which he votes, and not remain where he ought not to be.—(" Order, order," from Colonel Peel.) I now leave it to the Hon. and Gallant Colonel whe ther he could think it right himself to act in this way? I leave it to him, as a man and a gentleman, whether he would condescend to pretend to be one thing, and yet be another.— ( Hear, hear.) We have then his dissertation upon the Church question. Why does he not in this conform with the columns of the paper, I have referred to.--( Hear, and cries of " Or der.") Has that paper observed the slightest decency towards me, and as an earnest of the wages of its iniquity has it not done this, and shall not I now be permitted to retort upon— Mr. WALTER and Mr. KEARSLEY rose to order. In reply to the general call of the House, Mr. KEARSLEY proceeded to address the House. Sir, said he, if his Majesty's servants, for they are Ministers no longer—(Laughter)—l say, Sir, if his Majesty's servants can submit—if they are so humiliated as to submit--to the bully ing conduct of the Hon. Gentleman, I shall not submit to it. (Laughter.) I wish to know, Sir, is this proper conduct in the House ?—( Hear, and laughter.) I'll divide the House upon it.—( Continued laughter.) Mr. O'CONNELL—I wish the Hon. Member for Berk shire joy of his ally.—( Laughter.) There could not be two more competently suited to each other.—(Laughter.) I may perhaps indeed be permitted to express my astonishment at this; what an excellent constituency it must be that is re presented by the Hon. Member for Wigan.—( Hear and laughter.) But to return ; I have here the division of ' the Bth July, 1833, exactly as I have said. If it is wished by the Hon. Gentleman opposite, I will read the con tents of it. On the Bth July, 1833, exactly as I have stated, the Hon. Member for Berkshire voted for the spoliation clause.—(Hear, hear.) I have now done with that part of his speech which referred to poor-laws, and also that referring to the spoliation of Church property ; we then come to the question before us. He then says that the prophecy was wrong which declared that emancipation would procure the pacification of, Ireland. Why so it would if it had been ho nestly followed up. I did not say that emancipation would be a final measure; on the contrary, I always said that it must lead to others ; that it was only the means, and not the end itself.—(Cheers.) It was to be one of the means working to this end—the amalgamation of all parts of the British em pire into one consolidated body, enjoying equal rights and equal privileges.—( Hear.) When emancipation passed that did not follow ; why ? because the Emancipation Bill itself was stingily, and I may even say, with individual exceptions granted. What then followed ? The people. of Ireland, as they had every right to do, looked to their own resources ; they called for the repeal of the union, and,...they would have the right still to insist upon it, if theri; was not given to them a distinct pledge that they should have equal rights and privileges with the people of England. Does any man say, that if this measure be granted it will pacify Ireland ? No, but it will be one step taken by the British Government to confer upon them those rights—it will be ad vancing, and they have advanced to that end. The Hon. Member for Berkshire, however, says, you arc still to continue to make an exception as regards Ireland—that having nomi nally emancipated the Catholics, they are still to be actually unemancipated, as they must be, until they enjoy equal rights and privileges with other British subjects.—( Hear.) He states that abuses have already existed. Is that the reason that they are to continue ? He says that the Corporation was essentially a government of Protestants for Protestants. Why the Protestants of Ireland are in number 850,000 ; there are 600,000 of the persuasion of the Dissenters. Now of the entire there were but 13,000 members of the Corporation ; and of the entire 13,000, but 1,100 of the governing body. That was the representation of the Protestants of Ireland ; it was no more a representation of them than of the Roman Catho lics. Thus, then, we perceive there were no more than 1,100 of the governing body of the Protestants. I wonder that the Hon. Gentleman does' not read the same thing as well as he writes.—(Laughter.) I submit to him that a writer ought, or is at least expected, to read a little.— ( Laughter.) Because power is taken from a miserable party, the people themselves are to be treated as a party . Those who assert this are utterly ignorant of the Constitution. The people were not a party—as individual interests universally predomi nate when these individual interests accumulate in the majo rity, so is it necessary that the interests of the great majority never can be that of a party. The speech, however, upon which I am remarking, was not pronounced for this place—it was composed to be published for the miserable purposes of a party, and that it may appear amongst those things with chich he is so much disgusted.—( Hear, hear, and cries of order.) Yes, disgusted—justly disgusted with a tergiversa tion of principle the most astonishing that ever occurred.— ( Hear, and cries of order.) The most disgraceful, too, that ever yet occurred. My:. RIC HA RDS called the Hon. Member for Kilkenny to order. An attack was made upon the Hon. Member for Berkshire as if he were connected with the Times newspaper, when he (Mr. Richards) contended that the Hon. Member for Kilkenny had not shown any connection between the Hon. Member for Berkshire and that paper. The Hon. Member for Kilkenny could not be permitted thus to browbeat and ruffianise, if he might use the expression ; it was not consis tent with the order of the debate.—(Hear, and cries of " Order.") Mr. O'CONNELL—The Hon. Member for Berkshire has reason to rejoice in his second defender.—( Hear and laughter. ) Mr. WALTER—I do not wish to interrupt the Hon. and Learned Gentleman ; I only ask the favour of being permitted to reply.—( Hear, hear.) rne SPEAKER considered it would be most desirable if Hon. Members would only refer to what occurred in the course of the debate. Mr. 0' CONN E L L—Certainly ; and therefore I only wish to conn•ratulate the Hon. Member for Berkshire upon his second defender.—(Laughter.) I think nothing can be more flattering to him than the first—except the second—( Laughter) —one, too, so especially remarkable for his exceeding delicacy and extreme polish, which make him shrink from anything that belongs to the kennel.—( Laughter). Mr. RICHARDS—I rise to order, Sir. It is not right to bring into this House the manners of a blackguard, instead of those of a gentleman.—( Long-continued cries of " Order 1") The SPEAKER would conjure the Members, for the sake of that House, not to indulge in language inconsistent with propriety. Mr. O'CONNELL—I care not for his expressions. As to mine, I only talked of hopping over the kennel, and I think it was not inapplicable to the occasion.--( Hear, and laughter). Mr. N. FITZ SIMO N—l think that the debate cannot con tinue. The Hon. Member for Knaresborough has used most offensive expressions. He has made use of a word which I am almost afraid to repeat, but which you, I am sure must have heard, as every Hon. Member near me has heard it. I must, then, request of the Hon. Member for Knaresborough to withdraw, before this House, his exceeding offensive ex pressions. —( Hear. ) The SPEAKER observed that words had undoubtedly fallen from the Hon. Member for Knaresborough, which ought not to have been used. The inference was, that if they were not directly applicable to the Hon. Member for Kilkenny, they were intended to apply to him. Mr. O'CONNELL—Oh 1 I do not remember them. Mr. RICHARDS—I hope that upon all occasions I shall bow to the Speaker. I understood the Hon. Member for Kil kenny to say, that the words used by me were brought from the kennel.—(No, no, from several Hon. Members, in which Mr. O'Connell joined.) Understanding it so, if he did not use the word kennel, I withdraw the expression. The SPEAKER understood the Hon. Gentleman to have said that the words savoured of the kennel. Dr. BALD WIN remaked that, in the first instance, the Hon. Member for Knaresborough had used the word " ruffia nise.” He left it to the House to say whether that was a pro per expression to be used. Mr. RICHARDS—If the word was not applied to me, in the manner I understood it, I withdraw the expression. Mr. N. FITZ SIMON—I think that the Hon. Member for Knaresborough has no right to enter into a compromise upon this subject. I think he should be called upon once to with draw the offensive expression as indefensible.—( Hear.) Mr. O'CONNELL—I do not do so, feeling the compli ment that has been paid to me by the Hon. Member for Knaresborough. Dr. BALDWIN—But the other Irish Members do feel it. I call upon the Hon. Member to explain the expression ruffian ism. Colonel PEEL—The Hon. Member, I am sure, will with draw the expression ; but I appeal to the Hon. Gentleman opposite, whether the tone in which he has conducted this debate is not calculated to call forth angry expressions. (Hear, hear, from the Opposition Members). Mr. RIC H ARDS—As it appears to me I must have been under a mistake, in the application of the word kennel, I am at once ready to withdraw the expressions objected to. Mr. O'CONNELL—I was arguing upon three points in troduced into his speech by the Hon. Member for Berkshire; one on the Poor-laws, the other the Church, upon which he has voted against his colleagues ; the third is the real ques tion before the House, and I was proceeding to comment upon it, when I was called to order by the Honourable Member for Wigan, who was very disorderly in doing so, and who sat down extremely quietly, as he usually does when he is in the wrong.—(Laughter.) I was then next called to order by the Hon. Member for Knaresborough, who got into that species of language which is so familiar that, until it was proved to him, he did not know it was improper. —(Hear, laughter, and cries of order.) ctujvui - ucu. ENGLISH TITHE BILL. In answer to a question from Mr. BARLOW HOY, Lord J. RUSSELL hoped that he should be able to pro ceed with the Marriages Bill that evening, and with the Eng lish Tithe Bill early on Friday evening. Oa the motion of Mr. BUCKINGHAM a Select-Com mittee was appointed to inquire into the causes of the in creased number of shipwrecks, with a view to ascertain whe ther such improvements inight not be made in the construction.. equipment, and navigation of merchant vessels., hs would greatly diminish the unusual loss of life and property at sea. Lord CLENIENTS presented a petition from the county of Leitrim, praying the Hotlse to reject the amendments in troduced by the House of Lords into the Irish Muncipal Bill. Mr. SMITH O'BRIEN presented similar petitions from the county of Leitrim; and Mr. WALKER one from Wex. ford. Mr. SHAW asked when the Noble Lord (Lord J. Rus sell) intended to proceed with the Irish Tithe Bill? Lord JOHN RUSSELL replied that he, could not then name a day. He ws ankious to forward the English Tithe Bill as well as the Registration of Births and Marriages Bill, all of which had been introduced it , to the House in February. lie would in the course of a few days state when he would go on with the Irish Tithe Bill. MUNICIPAL CORPORATIONS (IRELAND) BILL. On the motion of Mr. O'LOGHLEN, the House pro ceeded with the further consideration of the Lords' amend ments in this Bill. Several of the amendments having been agreed to, Mr. SHARMAN CR AWFORD rose to bring forward his motion for the restoration of the towns to the present Bill, which were in schedule Cof the original Bill. lie said that, according to the proposition of the Noble Lord, twelve towns were to have mayors and town councils. The seven first towns were in the original Bill in schedule A ; the others were to be found in schedule B, to which Carrickfergus and Derry were added. The effect of the Noble Lord's proposition would be, to exclude four towns with a population of 10,000, and four others with a population of 9,000. Why they were to be excluded, while Derry, with only 10,000, and Carrickfer gus, with only 8,000, were included, he could not understand, unless it was on the principle of it concession to the other House. The proposition lie had to make was, that the towns which were placed in the old Bill in schedule C, should 1:w restored to the honourable position of Corporate towns. The toAns to which he alluded were as follows:—Bandon, 12,617 ; Athlone, 11,362 ; Wexford, 10,673 ; Dundalk, 10,078; Youghal, 9,603; Armagh, 9,189; Carlow, 9,111; Tralec, 9,562; Ennis, 7,711 ; Cashel, 6,971•; Kinsale, 7,312; Portarlington, 3,091 ; New Ross, 5,011 ; Enniskillen, 5,270 ; Colerain, 5,752 ; and Dungannon, 3,515. He objected to any such compromise as that of abandoning these towns. The Bill, as it had come from the other House, was an insult to the people of Ireland ; and a British Government should refuse to be a party to it. What was the use of talking about ,• a repeal of the Union, and a reform of the House of Lords, if they flinched from maintain ing the ground which they had resolved to take? For him self he never held language of that kind without being in earnest. It now rested with the representatives of Ireland to do their duty with firmness, and insist on their rights; it was in vain for them to make bold professions, if at the moment when it was necessary for them to act they shrank from doing so. He was apprehensive, however, that he stood alone in making this proposition, or at all events that there was little prospect of its success. He particularly regretted that the great leader of the Irish people was not present to sup port him. He should be sorry to be acting in opposition to the feelings of that Hon. and Learned Member, but while he entertained every respect for him, his own honour would not allow him to compromise his own opinions for the sake of following the opinions of any individual.—(Hear, hear.) He did not exactly know how he had better frame his motion so as to accomplish his object; but he was disposed in that respect to attend to any suggestion that might be made to him. If he moved that the towns be included in schedule A, they would have the 101. franchise ; perhaps they had better be included in a clause by themselves, giving them the Si. franchise. The Hon. Member concluded by moving that the town of Bandon be included in towns which were to have a mayor and council. _ _ The SPEAKER—Who seconds the motion ? Mr. Sergeant JACKSON (after a pause) could not sit and hear it proposed that the town which he had the honour to represent should be included amongst the towns which were to have Corporate honours and privileges extended to them without rising to second the motion.—(Great laughter.) If there were to be any additional towns included he should cer tainly very respectfully put in his claim for the very respect able town of Bandon.—(A laugh.) When the Hon. Gen tleman opposite declared that he would not compromise his opinions, he certainly did cheer the Hon. Member, because whether in this House or out of it, in his humble judgment, a more honourable man was not to be found.—( Hear, hear.) He begged to add a word on another subject. The Hon. and Learned Member dor Kilkenny had on a former occasion re ferred to an inscription which he said he had seen on entering the town of Bandon. Now he had received letters this morn ing, stating that there had been neither a gate nor any walls at the entrance to the town of Bandon within the last cen tury. He seconded the present motion. air E. WILMOT was opposed to the introduction of any new towns. Mr. WALTER, after much observation and experience, entertained a strong conviction that this Bill would do no such thing as establish peace in Ireland.—(Cries of " Oh !" and " Order !") Nor did he concur with those who maintained that the rejection of Corporations in Ireland was the rejection of the Irish people from those rights which were possessed by the people of England.—(Cries of " Oh !" and loud cries of " Order !" from the Opposition benches.) Before any rights were conferred, those to whom they were imparted ought to be capable of exercising them for the general benefit. The Corporations in Ireland had hitherto been made an instrument of abuse, which one party had enjoyed for the oppression of the other.—(The Hon. Gentleman here paused for several seconds, as if endeavouring to collect his thoughts. After a burst of encouraging cheers from the Opposition benches, he put his hand into his pocket, and brought out a sheet of paper, which he perused very deliberately, amidst cries of " Read, read," and shouts of laughter from the M i n i sterial benches. He at last proceeded.) They would by th is m easure transfer this instrument of abuse into the hands of a nother party, who observations,would e h g e u al m e a a b n u t s e n i o t. — d (Loudlaughter.) ect tolreand, or to By these the Catholics ; he meant simply to urge, that there was a I —French Paper.