The Sun. — London, England, 1838-08-10 00:00:00

SPIRIT OF THE PUBLIC JOURNALS. We have inserted elsewhere a copy of the Canada Govern ment Act Declaratory Bill introduced by Lord Brougham, of which he moved the second reading last night. That Lord Durham has no power of deporting to the Bermudas, and that the ordinances could not operate beyond the limits of the pro •inces over which his authority extends, was admitted last night by the highest legal authority (the Lord Chancellor), and is, indeed, sufficiently obvious. But on the supposition that we are living under a Monarchy—that her Majesty's Ministers are alone responsible for the acts of the Government, throughout the wide extent of this empire—it is no doubt something new that Peers of Parliament, having no responsibility, should so far interfere with the Government as to give a second reading to Bills limiting the powers of Governors of Provinces. We can understand why Peers dissatisfied with Ministers should ap proach the throne, and tell her Majesty that they have no con fidence in her present advisers, and should refuse their as sent to measures of which they disapprove ; but we cannot understand on what principle reconcilable with monarchy a majority of Peers should say to Ministers, " We allow you to remain the confidential advisers of Majesty—we allow you to incur the responsibility of conducting the admi nistration—and yet we will force upon you laws to compel you to govern, under circumstances of the greatest difficulty. extensive and valuable provinces agreeably to our notions." That Lord Durham is responsible to Parliament for the exer cise of the powers confided to him is a proposition which no one would think of combating; but the Lords do not call on him for his defence, but interfere with his government, while he is all the time responsible for it. The second reading was carried by a large majority. But the principle of such an interference with the Executive is open to grave objec tion ; for alowirg that Lord Durham has not been suffi ciently guarded in these ordinances, it was for Ministers, end not for Opposition, to propose the remedy. If his Lor.h,hip and al those oho may be conceinedlin re n:ovhor the persons named in the ordinances to the Pcrinud.ss, and detaining them there or elsewhere out of C. , nada, lay themselves open to suits, both civil and Parliament will not be slow on the application of Minis ters ta protect the public servants in the conscientious dis charge at their duty, by such indemnity as has usualiy been accorded in similar cases. :Ministers are the judges of the ne c,ssity for tt.is indemnity, and not Lords Brougham and L'inlhurst. Much of Lord Brougham's diffuse and declama tory speech was irrelevant, much assumptions of fact, on no othrr o id, nce than private information. On the faith of such intormation he contradicted the averments in the ordinances. in the onlim.nces it is stated that Wolfred Nelson and his associates had confessed their guilt. " Not so." says Lend Brougham ; " thair fl lends peremptorily denied their phnline guilty or conressieg—they confesed to their having. leaca gull:) , of resistance to Government, but they positively de nhol that they had traitorously, or even seditiously or rebelliously resis.ed the - Go , ernment." If they confessed to their resist :ince to Government, is not that treason ? And if they ac quiesce in their deportation, what is the use of disputing about their understanding of what amounts to treason, the treason itself Leing unquestionable? Then the Noble and Learned Lord had been supplied with a list of correctives of the names of parties, of which, had they been tried at the Old Bailey, good use might have been made by their counsel; and Lord Durham and his Council had not, previous to passing the ordinances, followed the precedents set by the British Le gislature in cases of attainder ; end he onetad the proviso in troduced into the Canada Bill by Sir William Follett, ex pressly declaring that no law or ordinance should be passed by the Governor in Council which should re• peal, cusp nd, or alter any Act of the British Patha n-lent. It was jastiv observed by Lord Gleneiga that. whatever might he Lord Broueiam'a persuasion whir re spect to the circum , tenees stated by him, they had his word a o e fur them ; but it was proclaimed i n t h e ratoacs tl.at the perti, s kid nation it abed red pr , ,xhiirne:l themseiv, a guilty ; lie for the Covarement of (;,:na.lit not t) be condemned on an autLerity knoisn to the liable and Learned Lord alone, and in complete contrz..l;c -tion to t' e wet.]: of the ordinances. He pointed cut at the v.me time the inconsistency of the Noble and Learned Lord, &rho, while his speech was one centineed denuncietion of the Government of Canada for measures disgrneeful it, them seiver. end at variarct csith jtwtice, British honour, and British law, declared in the see)nd chtiFe of hi; ‘‘ whieh ordinances eantot be justified by lay, but are so pmch . for the service of the public that they ought to he justi tiad by en Act of Parliament." W,tit respect to the proviso introduct d by Sir Wili;ant Follett, he observed that— " Duriuz the discussion of this question in the other llous 0 vern nent was asked by some Nicelbers or. the opposite benches, weethet they )neon t taat tee net should authmise the Governor in Council to alt.; the Act of 1791, or any Act relating to tenures ; to this question Govern ment repl.ed, that they had no suet) intention, but they tttmi ht that the period w.:::11.1 be so short that the Governor and Council wculd not interfere with the subject at ail ; upon witch it was ohserved that, as there was no such intention, the clearest and best way weld,' be to in. sett a proviso un the subject in the 1011, so as to remove aft possible doubts. It was clear, from the terms of the Frot - i.o, that it was in. tended to have a limited operation. Tl,e Act of 1791 gave the local Legislature the power of varying or repealing the law respecting Clergy r,serves There was an Act of the Imperial Parliament, of 1524 or Ji3IN, which gave the nest Legislature power to alter the Tenures Art, and there was an Act of Ste local Legislature which did alter the Tv. mires Act; and it appeared to him (Lord Glenelg) very apparent, from the Semis of the proviso itself, that it was simply intended that these Acts should not come within the power of the Governor in Council. He (Lord (Venelg) cculd see no grounds for doubting the legality of these 07dInances With . rk,Rrenee to %Wm ...wwl4ba.2? Ilia Lordship observed also, that it certainly did appe . ar t o him very extraordinary, that after diving Lord Durham the large powers rendered necessary by the peculiar and perilous circumstances under which he went to preside over the pro %ince, any attempt should be made to narrow his powers, or abridge his capabilities for usefulness ; and he concluded with an impressive exhortation to their Lordships to beware how then lent encouragement by their measures to the many per son's in Canada who were ready to seize the first favourable moment to poison the minds of the Canadian peaple, and to delude them once more into acts of rebellion. The Lord Chancellor observed that there could be no doubt as to the legality of the ordinances within the limits of the province, while Lord Brougham's Bill prceeeded on tine supposition of A doubt as to whether the Act as it stood did or did not authorise the proceedings which had taken place in the pro vince and the acts of attainder which had been made. The question as to whether the nature of each case was such as to justify the Governor-General was quite different, and on that question neither their Lordships nor Government pos sessed any information. The Noble and Learned Lord quoted the Canada Act, which in so many words r, cited, " That it shall be !owlet], after proclamation made, for the Governor of the Lower Province of Canada in Council to make such laws or ordi nances for the peace, welfare, and good government of the said pro. vince as the Legislature of Lower Canada, as now constituted, is em_ powered to make; and that all laws or ordinances so made, subject to the provisions liereinacter contained for disallowance thereof by her Ma. jesty, and for receiving certain laws or ordinances for the signification of her Majesty's pleasure therein, shall have the like force and effect as laws passed Lefore the passing of this Act by the Legislative Council and Assembly of the said province of Lower Canada, and assented to by her Majesty." There could be no doubt, he said, that this clause gave to the new Governor in Council the same powers which the Legisla ture of the province formerly exercised. With respect to the proviso prohibiting the impus!ng► any new tax, or to change the Constitution of the Legislature, and declaring "nor shall it be lawful by any such law to repeal, suspend, or alter any provision of any Act of the Imperial Parliament of Great Britain, or of any act of the Legislature of Lower Canada, as now constituted, repealing or altering any such Act of the Imperial Parliament," the object for which these words were introduced was so obvious that he could not have believed that they could be misconceived. The words re ferred to in this proviso had no restraining power, and were there difficulties in the case the Declaratory Bill of Lord Brougham would leave them untouched, " for he had pro. posed to enact that they should not make any laws or ordi nances respecting individuals, but at the same time proposed that the power should be continued as regarded the multi tude." The Noble and Learned Lord showed that in other respects the Bill of Lord Brougham was a tissue of incon sistencies : " The second clause of the Bill of his Noble and Learned Friend was cf the most extraordinary nature ; and after declaring that cer. fain acts of the Governor of Canada were illegal, it went on to make them legal, and to allow such proceedings to take place for the future. It would be most extraordinary for Parliament to declare that these acts were illegal, and then to say that the Governor of Canada or any person under him might continue to act upon them. The proposed indemnity, therefore, was for what was clearly considered an excess of power, and it.was proposed at the same time to continue this excess of power. lie would then ask, did Noble Lords really feel that there were serious doubts as to the construction of these Acts, and as to the power in the hands of the Governor of Canada to pass Acts of at tainder? If this power was to be taken from that Noble Earl, they would leave his Government less than was possessed by the Government of the Upper Province, from which it was not thought necessary to take away the Legislative Assembly." _ . .. . But really, in a case of this kind, it is a waste of time to pursue further these legal objections. There can be no doubt, as was forcibly observed by Lord Melbourne, " that the course pursued by their Lordships upon that occasion, that the encourag ement afforded by them to the motion before the f fouse,was is the speech highest degree perilous." The whole of his Lordshi p's admirable, and we are sure that it will teo far more on fire country than the legal trifling of Lords Lyndhurst. Brougham and There was much reason for his warning their Lordships that • part of L or d Du r ha m impossible the course of pr.-eke..ding on the rham and his Council could have been adopted front ienornce . and, therefore, that it would be wise in them, before they cond emned the conduct of the Council , to ascertain what the Melbourne, for it were : " Their Lordships," added Lord , o :: i were to consider that iliary state, but for a Le 3ia to . this t'oe? wet c not legislating for a country in an corner,' in a very different state, bath with respect (Lord so peculiarly is country and to other countries which bordered upon it. l o e u l b 4 o b i t e r i o n r e e ) ill suc h pe ecliar circumstances as regarded it , elt and for a country sittr , ted As regarded other countries he must say that it required that their Lordships should bekeracuotl‘ni they came to a decision which might involve much beav than they were aware of —(Hear, hear.) He had a Very , rea se t Cue "" respect for the profession of the b w —(tlear)—tlicug‘i Noble Lords always said he was very i gn ,ot o f it. —(flear, bear, and a taugh.) But this 11 must say, that let men Ire what they would, let them have by nature the greatest possi' le powers and the most enlarged understanding, the pro_ fessif,n ofthe law did little better than fetter their understanding 111 Va • riahly —(Hear, hear, and much Laughter.) Ile thought that the House had suff e red in 1.0 ;mar degree from that fetterine of the urnierstinditig in the discussion upon the present qu, satin —(frear, hear —and when they I,rat an insurrection in the colonic:, when thei t.ad encouraged 4 feeling of disapprob:rtion as to the crmrse purweil to ,uppre , s that in_ Auricetion, when they Iral done their Ltmoit (wEtho:it the intention of co doing) to encoulage those who were the enemies of the country, it rsvould, he thought, b e h u t a very poor c ois ,, h ~ rtion, when the wrst c , , , m ... e to the worst, to know that they had head the vtry best special i i.leati;rg upon tine subjeat.--(lfear, h-0 - '" I And he couclutled wio , b , ' * ) .1 c. nit! ting, that with respect to th e licrinud., r, 1 •t 1 ' I . (.1( ;10. . - ep,ncar to !Lila necessary a t that frne to aka a Bill of h:m idei . i.t . y, and that " when ire consickre:l the I moral effect which such a law lima have in Canada—when ho saw that it amounted, in point of fact, to nothing more nor less than a strong and direct condemnation of the policy pur sued in that country, he could not, either in his conscience, or from a regard to the interests and welfare of the empire, con sent to become a party to it.—( Hear.)" The Duke of Wel lington entered into a laboured, but by no means effective, vindication of his own consistency, in first eagerly joining in conferring large powers on Lord Durham to meet the difficul ties of his situation, and then turning round on the Govern ment on some captious legal objection started by factious law yers, to cramp and embarrass the Government, and replunge Canada in fresh troubles. The Noble Duke, supposingtome of Lord Melbourne's observations directed against himself, which his Lordship afterwards declared they were not, allowed his self love to get the better of his judgment. We regret to think that the Noble Duke should have been so ill-advised as to lend his support to a Bill which tends so much to paralyse the Go vernrac\ot. The vote of last night was most unconstitutional, a violation of the principles held in most regard by all friends of the Monarchy. It tends to anarchy. Be as rigorous, we say, as you please to all men in authority—call there to as severe an account as you please, but do not afford them any plea which shall enable them to shake themselves free of their responsi bility, by charging you with paralysing them by interfering with them in the due exercise of their functions. The House of Lords and the Duke of Wellington have said,..by their vote, that they are determined not to control, but to conduct the Government. The majority of 54 to 36 reflects anything but honour on the House of Lords. Well might Lord Melbourne reproach them with being lawyer-ridden. —Morning Chronicle. Often, very often, have the Queen's Ministers made a sorry figure during the present Session of Parliament—habitual, and most familiar to their natures, are meannesses, and abase ments of the most humiliating kind—yet never, we will ven ture to allege, did these shuffling and despicable personages undergo so large a measure of that castigation which they deserve, as they did last night in the House of Lords, during the discussion on Lori Brougham's Bill, declaratory of the law in regard to the Government of Canada ! Lord Brougham himself, in an opening; speech of great clearness and power, established, beyond dispute, the arbitrary and indefensible cha racter of the acts of Lord Durham and his Council—whilst in his reply, he scattered to the winds the shallow sophisms, and impudent assumptions of Lord Cottenharn and Lord Mel bourne. The Whig ex-Chancellor, in short, enjoyed last night ample compensation for the slights and contumely, and calumny, which his old associates have, for years past, heaped upon him. He held up to the derision of the House, the Lord Chancellor's ignorance of constltutional law ; and mangled Lord Melbourne in a spirit, undoubtedly, the reverse of that approved of in the Christian code. Lo.d Lyndhurst strengthened the reasonings of Lord Brougham, with his customary brilliancy, power, and comprehensivencs ; whilst the Duke of Wellington—(the protector, as he has oft:n proved himself, of the Whigs, frog)) the consequences of their own imbecility and di istiesty of p'irpose) .dieted upon tae Premier, a well-merited rebuke fur the impudent rwurn which that functionary made to the forbearance of t're Conservative party during the whole of the present sessi,en The iilustrieus Duke, indeed, while he condemed as illegal and "intolerable," the ordinances of Lord Durham, made, in some sort, the aniende to the Conservative party for the tenderness with which he Las during the present session, treated the Govern ment, by declaring that " he believed he had been wrong in doing so." Ministers, therefore, were cut off last night, from vmpathy and succour at the hands of the great leader o 7 the Conservative party. They were left to bear the brunt of battle, as be3t they might—and they bore the shock as men unprovided with ail means of effective resistance rn he expected to do. Feeble as they habitually are, their ordinary measures of feebleness rises to the rank of absolute vi (sour, when compared with their imbecility of last night. Lord stessd, easy min ! seemed the very genius of di Lord Cottenhem spoke simply as a lawyer ; and he might have , paescel muster beret-a the as.,; which he achlres.sed, if leas '..:5E( . 1:11 , 1y had not c7,lvained men vz.t...al - )10 of }nosing his Lordship's ti:e vrort.s,ed to en ! ound. But Lord !lelbournce made, unques!iona!,iy, the le:,st enviable figuie of the tine e ! His Lordship is a persen of ser passieg shrewdness. He has not spent his life in Ceti, ts, and in office, without acquiring a deep insight into the weaknesses of human nature. He is gifted with a species of prudence or cut:nine (as by that less Platt( ring title, some might be dinposid to describe his Lordship's dis tinguished characteristic) which often enables lion to parry with t fleet the ettacks of men possessed of a much higher measere of pure intellect, than himself ! Yet, last night, Lord Melbourne's prudence left him. Last night, his custor: ary shrew disefes was forgotten. He cont,iseel, with sine.u)ar infe lieitv, to nctgravate traild, all the difficulties of his difficult posltion—( for it ie a difficult thing to defend even the ordinary actions of such a pc rsin as Lord Durham) by handling his very bail materials, in the very worst possible fashion. So silly was the Noble Viscount as to talk of the Conservative Peers la i in "u trap" fur Lord Durham, by the fact cf having sanctioned his a;.pointment 1 So forgetful was the Premier of what lie owes to popular support, as to sneer at the Paces of Eng:and, an the ground of their rorembling "a lour and truculent derno- cracy S head of the " Liberil" Go- ernMont approrts himself on the subject of the great Consti tutional : of BritiAi subjects, as to pret,,m.l to regard as technical quibbles all the objecti. as taken io Lord Dnrintrn's u,urped t ight to it,fliet the pains of high t: eson on men who had net, cr been tried,nor oven cited to appear in a court of law ! The Duke of Wellington's reply to the charge ofklying a " trap" for Lord Durham—and Lord Broughatn's comn.en tary on the Premier's notions on the subject of " lawyer-like clufbblee• will not 90011 be t.legotten by tbe Yacmcabars.-ol ttua present Cabinet I The Government was beaten by a large majoriv, on this question—a question which Lord Melbourne described as one of the gravest importance—as cm: involving consequences, by possibility, of the most serious kind beaten on such a question, can Lord Melbourne and his friends' —spiriticss as they have on all occasions, approved themselves to be—tenacious of place as they have shown themselves, to a de gree absolutely incompatible with the assumption that they pos se 33 the faintest spark of honourable pride, or of self-respect can these men, creeping and parasitical as they are, remain in office, after the House of Lords has, by its public and solemn act, censured as illegal and unconstitutional, the ordinances of a great Whig functionary, armed by the Whig Government with extraordinary powers—powers, the abuse of which, the members of that Government have deliberately defended, on the ground of expediency? But even supposing the crawling occupants of office to be content to retain their pcsitions after the vote of last night, can it be imagined that Lord Durham will consent to remain Governor of Canada, after being branded by the House of Peers, as the author of unconstitu tional outrages on the liberty of British subjects? Nay, had the House of Peers abstained from passing sentence upon his . . misdeeds, can it be imagined that LOrd Durham would have endured the censure implied in even that partial reversal of his ordinances, contemplated by the Government itself ? " We intend (observed poor Lord Glenelg with an air which the Maw.worms of the stage might envy, " we intend to send to Bermuda and let the Governor know that he has no right to de tain in custody the persons sent to his care as prisoners from Ca nada." Could Lord Durham, we ask, have held office after even such a mitigated sentence of condemnation had been passed upon his conduct by his Whig allies? Can be, with the incalcula bly heavier weight of censure contained in the vote of the House of Lords last night, retain for one moment, (after the history of last night's debate shall reach him) those great powers, which he has so grossly abused, or that high station, which he, perhaps, of all living public men, is least fitted to fill with advantage to the country ?—lf Ministers shall resign, they will confer upon the country the only benefit, which can, by any stretch of imagination, be connected with their ignominious career 1 If Lord Durham shall resign, the country may rest assured, that that Noble Earl will take speedy steps for dragging into the obscurity which becomes them, the Members of that Cabinet, to which he ow es hi s (a; we trust it may prove) short-lived Dictatorship l-2lforning Herald. That mockery of justice—that insult to the people of Ire land—the Irish Corporation Bill—was last night, on the mo tion of Lord John Russell, postponed for three months, that is, rejected for the present session, amidst the acclamation of the House of Commons. Thus, even supposing the three great measures proposed for the tranquillization of Ireland to be as full and satisfactory as could he desired, thanks to the Lords, there is in the delay of a just and equitable municipal law for Ireland, preserved abundant leaven for future agitation. In moving that the amendments of the Lords be taken into con sideration that day three months, Lord J. Russell stated, that as the compromise proposed by the Government, in reference to the franchise, had been rejected, Ministers did not feel justified in making any further concession. The difference between the amount of qualification proposed by the Lords and that conceded by Ministers not being more than the rates and taxes, which on the 101. qualification would not average more than 103., we do not suppose that Ministers would, after making such large concessions, have rejected the measure on this trivial difference, if it were not from a thorough con viction that they had already conceded so much as to render the measure utterly inadequate to its professed purpose—the establishment in Ireland of Municipal Institutions on the basis of popular election. The refusal of the Lords to allow the amount of rates and taxes in the qualification, after Mi nisters had consented to raise thequalification from 5/. to 10/., proves what already has been but too conclusively proved— the absurdity and futility of expecting any fair or equitable arrangement from hereditary domination. This refusal, however, has afforded Ministers an apportunity of escaping from the responsibility of a most defective and unjust mea sure, while it must, at the same time, have convinced them of the utter impossibility of carrying any satisfactory measure of Re firm by yelding to Tory aggression. Had the Lords passed the Bill as last agreed to by the Commons, the responsibility of its operation. which would necessarily be of an exasperating character, would have devolve i on the Government, and popu lar discont( at might vent itself rather against those who had cemented to, than those who had committed the infliction ; bot, by rejecting all compromise, the Lords have afforded Ministers an opportunity of honourable retrea t f rom an awk werd and ungracious position. Great anxiety has been pro fessed by ell parties to set at rest the graver questions of Irish 'Kiley. In these professions tin? Peers themselves have been most prominent, but the progress and fate of the Irish Mun7ci pal Bill furnish a curious commt n'ary on the sincerity of this desire of laying the basis of Irish tranquillity on measures of justice and sound policy. The Commons first propose a 5/. fe,nehise ; next the Lords preemie a 101. franchise, allewieg repairs and insuraiice ; to this the Commons consent, but c f tern ellowanee elso for rates and taxes, which the Lords re tst with reelet, but with use, and the Bill is consigned to tie tomb of the Ce ulets ..ouame for inciderral igtennies r a wasel i fic l tr t es a ti lr ,r l . 0 p o ' s f e h c i i s s b y y ' s P t em of Lord was calculated t.,.);:fford orpoitunit for • Lyndhurst, and, as m ight be allroomm.a.nnitesrpoarfed7c,eg;_, tion and imposture, awl would at best Y serve ' and conalse the operation of the qualification ' clause.ito c,mi\tvl.cate Lat ever the qualification, the amount, if any be fixed, con siLt iu sonic single and distinct sptciii cavon, aid not in a variety of items. The practical difference between the Lords and Commons was about 10s., the average amount of rates and taxes—a difference as important as that of twoedledum assd twcedledec. With an acuteness of perception to be found only . in the House of Peers, it was discovered that though the franch ise might be safely extended to all whose rent, repairs, and in surance amounted to 101., it would endanger the safety of the kingdom to have the rates and taxes taken into this account; and on this discovery the amendment of the Commons is scouted—they in turn scout the re-amendment, and Ireland is relieved from one legislative imposture for another Session: It would have been a curious occurrence if the two Houses had come into collision on the question whether 81. or 81. 10s. should form the qualification for the municipal franchise of Ireland. The Irish people would no doubt be highly amused to see their hereditary and representative guardians at logger heads about a matter of this kind, while the more vital prin ciples of policy were left to be settled by the doctrine of chances. One good effect, however, of rejecting the Bill will be the opportunity which the rating under the Irish Poor law will afford of assimilating the Irish corporations to those of this country, which we trust will be done in the next Session.—Morning Advertiser. When a few months ago, there appeared on the part of the Ministers an indication of a desire to quiet the sore i ques tion of Irish corporations by acceding to such an increase n a qualification for burgesses as might place the municipal fran chise in the hands of the more respectable inhabitancy of the towns, instead of consigning each municipality to the most ignorant and excitable classes of the population, we were so fully impressed with the importance of bringing the matter to a settlement, that our belief was greatly influenced , by our wishes, and we felt anxious to persuade ourselves tnat the declarations even of a Whig Government might possibly Le sincere. We acknowledge that experience bad laid no foun dation for such a faith ; that their conduct in every depart ment of their Ministry—the principles they have abandoned, and the alliances thcy have adopteLl—thcie cross upon the Ballot —their tergiversation upon the Tithe Bill—their evasions upon the Irish registration—their misrepresentations of those whom they cannot impeach—their servility to those whom they loathe—that all these things have made it difficult to believe in their integrity upon any given point. But in every party theme are men who act from better motives than the herd ; and among those whose errors were supposed to spring from im pulses less ignoble than those of vulgar place-bunters, there has bean a aseneral inclination to rank the nobleman at the head rf the Government. He has been regarded as averse front the baser associations and meaner compliances to which many of his colleagues have submitted. He has been thought to have avoided the personal contact of what was discreditable, though be may have been somewhat too facile in profitting by it. It was believed that a certain generous gallantry in his mate e induced him to look upon the young and inexperienced l..dv whom chance had thrown into his guardianship as a sacred and personal charge, imposing duties upon him not merely as a statesman, but as a gentleman and a man of honour. Vie only cloud upon her prospects appeared to he that which bung over her Irish dominions. For her sake it might be an object of pride and good feeling with him to disperse that danger. For himself it might he an object of legitimate ambition to have efikeed in his time the settle ment of questions so important, and now so inveterate, as those by whieh Ireland is convulsed. On some or all of these grounds it was judged, by men of high minds and clear under siaedings, tot irrational to infer that on the subject of Irish adjustment the first Minister of the Crown might probably be zealous, and h:s follovie:s therefore possibly sincere. Against all these coesidcrat'ons, no doubt, there are other reasons, lean romantic, but a good deal more pungent, that have spirited up doubts and eusp:cions, and cast a certain riiienle oil the readiness of precipitate eaedeur. Thiough f our S ess i ons of Parliament the Irish questions have been the sole stock of the. Miuistry—their only fuel and food. If they are still to govern, it must be by conti nu i ng st ill to agi tate. To remove an Irish grievance would be to bury a friermd. The tithe quo-tem has lost ie ; ens,y 1 . , u2.Ca toe she portions of it v.eich vmere useful te gnverernetit —the ap propriation naciae no—can now no longer be meinteiimed even in the House of Co,ninons : and if fie. Corporations ere also to be settled, there remains to the Whigs no one topic on which tLey can affect to be more liberal than the Conserva tives. They arc sheeted enough to see and understand all his. Trey know that if as Administration is to be chosen fur its enowlede, its talents, ite xperience—for its ability in de bate, or for the mepeeetion of its leaders—the Whig placeraeo have riot half an hour's life. Th e y are k ept i n oflice solely by truer i, id character, by the opiehin thet they are readv to dot the diserenitlble work of their hard masters. But when all that sort of work shell be wound up, how are they to earn their weges? 'lle-every dullest of their supperters, the ign o ra n t broad c,ast Re:heels, denounce th em as i nca p a bl e arid aristocratical tne Irish tail disdain tl.c:n for their subserviency. The moment the Ir ish demands arc disposed of, so are the Willies. While time are is k. pt running, their exist .ncc lingers on ; but close the i,sue,and they perish. Whatever be the personal feelings of th first Minister, there are coarser persons about him to ieculeate these practical considerations—to represent that he le,s a cuty to his party—that the first object of all true states men should be to keep the Conservatives out—that the Weige. if de.'estesi now, arc defeated for ever. What eif.,:t these sinister interpusitioris may have had with his better ea ture we Lace riot the' means cf kreetving; Lut they seem to have sounded not altogether idly on his ear, if we may judge by the careless tone amid temper ie which he conducted the discussion of Tuesday night on tile amendments of the Commons, espe cially on the reduction of the value in the qualification. He had too much the air of a man who meant to- show anet miittered little what the Lords might think fit to do, because there was a determination, doggedly made up, that unless Ministers could have the Bill, their own way, they would not have it at all. We will not say that so scandalous a resolution has been actually taken, because the charge is too heavy for us to bring upon merely circumetantial evidence; but the appearances are, to say the least, very ambiguous, and the motives of interest very power ful. They arc motives however, which, fortunately, the public understand. The fact that the Whigs are kept in place by the non- completion of the Irish Municipal plan, and that the settlement of it would deprive them of their only hold upon a large section of their scornful supporters, is quite .. no tot ions to the world. If, therefore, after the hopes of aajust mere which they have been holding out, they now balk the matter, there is not a man beyond the circle of Brookes's who will not denounce them as sacrificing their professions to their places. The Tories, contending as they do th a t the agita tion in Iceland about the Corporation measure 13 a fictitious one, may fairly decline to pass the Bill until they find it satis factory in all its points: to them it is perfectly open to say, " We have offered you a compromise on the long vexed sub ject of the quali fi cation, by allowing, with the insurances and the repairs, a rating of 9/. to avail as a qualification of 10/. ; but when you ask that we should lower that 9/. to 8/., we are bound to tell you that we will not b e b ea t e n down from that substantial ground on which you intimated your disposition to conclude the bargain. Another pound deducted may appear to you a small matter ; but in our view of the Bill it is a great one, and we will not give way." These are the arguments which the Tories, if you blame th em f or re f us i ng any f ur ther concession, are fully entitled to use in their vindication. But w hat pre text have the Whigs f o r a re f usa l to conce d e th e dispute be t% cen the 81. and the 91. ? They have contended that Ireland' s only chance of paci fi cation depends on the passing of this Bill ; and yet they now withhold it for the mere difference between 9/. and 81. Th e y h ave h e ld ou t t h e stronges t expectations that the Bill should pass, and yet for the difference betvreen 9/. and 8/., they dash those e xpe c t a ti ons w ith d e f e at. For the diffe rence between 9/. and 8/.? —no, but for another session of office. Now, you cannot retaliate on the Tories. They may e be right, o r th e y ma y b e wrong , i n d ec li n i n g to concede 20s. in dispute; but you cannot allege that they hold out for the sake of place. If place had been their object they would have passed the Bill with the 8/. qualification. They wou ld have disarmed the Whig foe of his on ly weapon by acquiescing in his large demand. They would have opened for themselves the path to government by settling the only question that ex cludes or embarrasses th em . B u t they h av e disda ined to pave their way to office by concessions which their consciences con demn. You m a y quarre l w i t h t h e i r po li c y if you will, but in point of h ouesty , t h e i r case d e fi es y o ur recrimina tion. One word on the "absurdity" which Lord Mel bourne and others imagine themselves to perceive, as between the Municipal Bills of England and Ireland , in the requisition of the higher qualification for the poorer . country. A moment's reflection will dispel this error. Why is a quali fication of property acquired either by the Municipal or the Reform Bill ? Because. as the Whigs told you when they began their Constitutional Reforms, property may be assumed as being in the rough, a fair and convenient test of intelligence and education. But, according to that test (and other tests concur in the result) education and intelligence in Ireland are not at so high a level as in England. Now, the deficiency of the nation in general so far affects the several classes which compose it, that among a thousand 5/. occupiers in any Irish town you will find fewer men of competent information than among a thousand five-pound occupiers in any Eng lish town of the same population. But your object in attempting to equalize the Municipal Institutions of England and Ireland is not, of course, to s%lnvjui intel ligence numbers ng b bfeo: e ievr r er s ae r o is. tdof municipalrt burgesses eiundrg.create equal s n s na e glm s nl botheanl Ireland doe,w i wu rahalet countries, )reacemoakof n b ucon u a , w t nt t o bring u o gc u e t a o s tp.s' i eu t o n l snr m e p. E oi qualificationrloleofdt popularg l e i av a e rid th y civili zationhich are more diffused ; and in Ireland, therefor e , to obtain an equal fitness, you are driven t o t a k e a higher qualification. This we humbly offer as a short answer to Lord Melbourne's charee of absurdity, and a clear j us tifi cat i on of ' the amount at which the qualification was fixed by t h e C ons ervatives. The rejection of the Bill last night by Lord J. Russell, tough not unexpected by us at least, and though perfectly charac teristic of him and his party, will conv i nce the country that there is no abyss of meanness too low fur the frightened slaves of O'Connell to descend to.—Tinmes. The Hanoverian, American, and Austrian Ambas sa on tramacted business yesterday at the Foreign Department. PROTECTION OF THE PERSON. —A Bill has re cently passed the House of Representatives, which imposes a tine of 6,000 dollars for every I:fe lost in steam-boat explosions. Let this example be follow( d in Eogland, and there will be no need of inspectors. Let it be extended to all modes of public conveyance; and we shall speedily cease to witness such calamitous events as we have too often, of late, had occasion to record. '1 h g ± who take upon themselves oc..;upat ions in w hi c h t h e s ,,fey of her 3.1. j?sty's subjects is involved, m ust b e cet ,terit tutbear the re y o nsibility befitting such a trust.—Bright Gazctle. Though there are at present 140 barristers be:ong ing to the Northern Circuit, at rho Durham Assiz es last week there were but 17 civil and 11 c: intiord causes tried. •r•!1 -e disparitybetween the number of wigs aid briefs w.:s still greater at Newcastle and C..r. 161•.—Netem.rytle Journal. T EN ACITY OF LIFE.—Mr. John H ar d, v , of (;os.iirth, has, at the present time, a number of young kittens which were co vered up wit it 15 car: loads of hay fur upward:: of ei4ht da)s, and ..fterwa rds g ut out alive.— Whachaven Herld, THE SUN, LONDON, FRIDAY, AUGUST 10, 1838. IMPERIAL PARLIAMENT. HOUSE OF COMMONS. AUGUST 9. The SPEAKER took the Chair at the usual hour. Papers were presented from the Poor-law Commissioners, by Mr. Parker, and from the Trinity House Corporation. Lord GRANVILLE SOMERSET gave notice that he would, on Monday, present the Report on the Cirencester Hundred Court Bill. Lord J. RUSSELL remarked that he did not think the House would sit on Monday. Mr. O'CONNELL presented apetition from Sir G. Steven, complaining of the trade now carried on in Hill Coolies. On the motion of the HON. and LEARNED MEMBER, the Mi- nutes of the proceedings had before the last Dublin Election Committee were ordered to be printed. Captain AL SAGER presented a petition from some indi viduals in East Surrey complaining of the system under which Beer Shops were now licensed. Sir E. CODRINGTON presented a petition from Captain James Wilson, praying to be heard at the bar of the House in favour of the claim of Mr. Rowland Milner to be restored to the rank of Lieutenant in the Royal Navy. POST-OFFICE. Mr. WALLACE presented a petition from Commercial Travellers, complaining of the present high rate of postage, and stating that they would send 60,000,000 of letters a-year that did not now pass through the Post-office, if a moderate rate of postage was adopted.—( Hear, hear, hear.) The Hon. Member then gave notice that he should, early next Session, move for a Committee to inquire into the system of conducting the Scotch Law Courts. He should also move for a Select Committee to inquire into the management of the Post-office; and would introduce a 13111 to improve ton veyancing in Scotland, as recommended by the Lord Ad vocate and Lord Conyngham. LOTTERIES. Captain PECHELL gave notice that in consequence of what was taking place throughout the country, he would early next session bring in a Bill to repeal the 6th and 7th of William IV., fur the purpose of putti ng d ow n the practice of advertising foreign lotteries. CORPORATE PROPERTY (IRELAND). Lord MORPETH brought up the Report of the Commit tee on the Corporate Property (Ireland) Bill. The Private Bills Deposit Bill was reported. The following Bills were read a third time, and passed : The Consolidated Fund (Appropriation) Bill ; the Exchequer Bill.: (11,044,5501.) Bill ; the Exchequer Bills (Public Works) Bill ; the Four-and-a-Half per Cent. Duties Bill ; the Slave Trade Treaties Bill ; the County Treasurers' (Ireland) Bill ; the Coal Trade (London) Bill, the Church Building Acts Amendments Bill, the Duchy of Cornwall (Tin Duties) Bill, and the Corporate Property (Ireland) Bill. On the motion of the LORD ADVOCATE, the Lords' Amendments to the Courts of Session (Scotland) Bill were agreed to. Sir WILLIAM FOLLETT presented a petition from Stockport, against idolatrous worship in India. Lord EBRINGTON moved for a return of the Bills sent up to the House of Lords, which had been agreed to or re jected during the present Session. Sir R. INGLIS thought the return should be laid on the table in the next Session of Pdrliament.—Agreed to. On the motion of Lord JOHN RUSSELL the considera tion of the Lords' amendments to the Public Records Bill was postponed till to-morrow (this day) SPIRIT LICENSES (IRELAND) BILL. Mr. O'CONNELL moved to bring up the Report on this Bill, which had stood on the paper yesterday, but which he nas by accident prevented from moving. Mr. SHAW and Col. PE RC EVA L objected to the motion on the ground of irregularity. Captain PECHE LL thought the Bill ought to be consi dered in the light of a dropped Order.—(The feeling of the House was entirely in favour of bringing up the Report.) The SPEAKER said, the Ili:age was not to receive the re port until the next day ; but it was for the liou , A! to say what e , ..urse ought to be adopted under pre , ient eireinistances. Mr. O'CONNELL then moved that the Report be brought up. Mr. SHAW strongly objected to the motion. The gallery was then cleared for a division, Wien the num bers were— For bringing up the Report Against it -20 Majority The Roport was accordingly brought up. CONFERENCE WITH THE LORDS. The CuANrcELLon of the EXCHEQUER, with other Members, proceeded to minage the conference with their Lordships on the Benefices Pluralities Bill. On their return, The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER stated that the managers for the Commons had left the Bill, with the Commons' reasons, in their Lordship? hands. MUNICIPAL CORPORATION (IRELAND) BILL. Messengers from the Lords brought up the Public Works Bill, and the Bill for the more eircetual Recovery of Fines; end requested a Conference with this House on the subject of the Municipal Corporation (Ireland) Bill. A Conference was accordingly directed, when Lord Mon PET II and several Members immediately proceeded to the Committee Room, No. 5. Lard llortrurn and ethers appeared at the bar, and stated that they had had a conference with the Lords, which was managed on their part by the Earl of Shaftesbury, who reported that their Lordships had taken into consideration the reasons of that House for not agreeing to the amendments of the Lx/rtin in ill, Irish Corporation Bill—that they adhered to some of the amendments—had agreed to others, and had made amendments upon others to which they desired the con currence of that House. On the motion of Lord J. RUSSELL, the reasons given by the Lords were read by the Clerk. On the reading of the last amendment, Lord J. RUSSELL said that the House might gather from what had been read the general purport of the amend ments made and insisted on by their Lordships. It appeared that they had so far agreed to the amendments of that House as not to insist upon that provision which they had made re specting charitable trusts, further than that the present trustees should continue until October, 1840. It appeared also that they had not insisted upon the retention of the other trusts. There were, besides, other amendments introduced by them which they now relinquished.—( Hear.) But with respect to the principal clause, that regulating the franchise, they wished to retain that exactly in the same form as they had sent it before down to that House.—( Hear.) He (Lord J. Russell) thought that question alone of such importance, that, seeing no hope of inducing the Lords to recede from the franchise they had themselves proposed, and not being disposed himself to go any further in the way of concession—( Cheers from the Ministerial Members)—and having made many important con cessions already—(Ministerial cheers)—he had no other course than to abstain from carrying the controversy any fur ther with the House of Lords, and to postpone the Bill to another Session of Parliament.—( Repeated Minis terial cheering.) The Lords gave, as one of their rea sons for differing from the amendments made in the Com mons that it was not desirable to adopt a new franchise differ ing from that which was already known and in practice. Now he (Lord J. Russell) thought the adoption of the fran chise laid down in the Reform Bill was the most wholesome as well as the most constitutional one which Parliament could adopt. The Lords stated that they were precluded from adopting the English franchise, because it was inapplicable to the state of Ireland, giving no other reason for the opinion which they formed. This circumstance, however, would render it advisable to take the subject into consideration in another Session of Parliament, and to ascertain whether the mode which the Lords conceived was novel and unparliamen tary could not be avoided, and some other course adopted which would be sanctioned by Parliamentary forms. This was a question, however, into which he did not at present propose to enter, and he merely alluded to it in consequence of the reasons of the Lords which the House had just heard read. He would not, however, at present enter into further particulars with respect to the Bill. If, indeed, there appeared to be any chance of agree ment between that House and the House of Lords as _ regarded the franchise, there were points of difference on which it would be prudent for Ministers to give way ; but as their Lordships insisted on adhering to their franchise, any further attempt at arrangements were out of the question.— (Ministerial cheers.) Considering, then, that the Lords re quired a higher rate of franchise than was known in England, and seeing, for his part, no reason why such should be insisted on, it appeared to him that if Parliament passed this measure it would be considered in Ireland that the distinctions which had been alleged to exist between the two countries, when the Bill was discussed on a former occasion, were still taken for granted, and that that was the reason why so high a franchise was retained in the Irish Bill. The measure, as it at present stood, would, he felt satisfied, prove unpalatable to the great mass of those towns in Ireland to which it was proposed to extend Corporations ; and, instead of being considered by them as a boon, would be looked upon only with suspicion and distrust.—( Hear, hear.) Under these circumstances he felt that he could adopt no other course than to move the further consideration of the Bill that day three months.— ( Ministerial cheers.) He was sorry to be compelled to make this motion : but seeing that all legislation was hopeless during the present Session, he felt he had no other resource; he, however, had the gratification to think that the discussions which had taken place this year would not prove altogether fruitless. They had got rid of some of the objections which had previously been made to the measure. In the first place, they had got rid of the objection to making the Corporations elective in Ireland ; and, in the second place, the Lords and Commons had agreed upon many of the provisions of the Bill. Under these circumstsnces he was induced to hope t'iat iri a ny future legislation upon the subject the two Houses of Par. liament would not differ so widely upon the disputed points as they had hitherto done. -Mr. SHAM' could not help expressing his extreme surprise at the course which the Noble Lord had thought proper to adopt. He did not expect in so thin a House, and upon so short a notice, to have a proposition male for so summary a rejection of the measure. No time had been given for a con sideration of the reasons which the Lords had so elaborately drawn up for adhering to their amendments. Scarcely was the House apprised of the conference when, without an opportn „ity of knowing. o r time for consilering m the reason s w h y the Lords ci:nred fro m t h at Houss, they were czll e d uooa in the most summary mliiner to r , j,.ct the Mit. The Nob!e Lord, in mahing• this proposition, must be content to take upon himself the whole te,ponAibilitv for the c:mse quenees.—(lAughtcr from the Ministeiial benches.) Members might kugh, but he woul , i ask, were not all the concessions made from that (the Opp riiti.m) side of the ! louse ?--( Cries of "Oh ") y es , t' otyrlt the Nob''‘ o- - I 1 • he would repeat it, and „ /a. npc..en so much of conces siol:s which he had made, it was only throw;nf, dust in the eyes of tile Irish Foofle. Upon one other Irish queslicn, indeed, the Noble Lord had made concessions, and he (Mr. Shaw) did not blame him for so doing ; for in doing so the Noble Lord had only followed the course which his duty and the interests of the country required ; but with respect to the Irish municipal question, so far front concession being made by Ministers, all the important ones had been made by those on his (Mr. Shaw's) side of the House, and made, too, at a great expense of feeling and opinion, not only by the leading persons in this country who were opposed to the present Go vernment, but more especially by the same class in Ireland, who found it exceedingly difficult to procure a general assent to the concessions which it was proposed to make..---(Hear.) The Noble Lord had spoken of a 5/. franchise, but he should not have forgotten that he himself proposed a 10/. franchise in his own Bill of 1836. This was all that he (Mr. Shaw) and those who concurred with him contended. for. If, as the Noble Lord bad said, the difference between them was so tri fling, why did he not give way, and not oppose those who found the only obstacle to the Bill in that point, and in that point only T— (Cheers.) They required that there should he nothing but a bona fide 101. franchise, and in making the rate paying clause they adopted the best test of that. In Dublin a valuation and taxation under the Police Act had taken place, and he had no doubt but that the valuation thus made would be found to be taken at more than the real value. This had been tried by appeals, and the appeals confirmed his opinion. As the Noble Lord had taken the responsibility of throwing out the measure, lie (Mr. Shaw) would not, at so late a period of the Session, divide the House. For his own part he still was of opinion that it would be better to do away altogether with Corporations in Ireland, and have their funds administered by Commissioners. There never had been any strong feeling on this subject in Ireland, except inasmuch as it had been con nected with other exciting topics, but that incidental feeling was now rapidly subsiding. He did not altogether regret the postponement of the measure, because, in his opinion, the de tails were not sufficiently considered. It was made too much a question of party contest to have local arrangements taken sufficiently into account. He (Mr. Shaw) protested against the course taken by the Noble Lord, not so much with re spect to the proposition which he made as to the summary manner in which the amendments of the other House were dealt with. He regretted that the Noble Lord refused to accept the large concessions which had been made by that (the Opposition) side of the House, and he would conclude by again entering his protest against the unceremonious manner in which reasons that had been so carefully drawn up by the House of Lords had been treated. After a few words of explanation from Lord J. RUSSELL, The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER said that two objections had been made by the Right Honourable and Learned Gentleman opposite. geThe first was that the H o us e had been taken by surprise. Now the Right Hon. Gentle man should remember that the course taken was the same which had been taken in 1836. and it was, therefore, not right to taunt Government with having adopted it. No other course could by possibility have been anticipated, for if it had there certainly would have been a greater attendance of Members at the other side of the House. lie could not suppose that the Right Honourable Gentleman was serious in expressing surprise at the adoption of the course which had bsen pursued in 1836. So much for the Right Hon. Gentleman's formal ob jectien. With respect to the Right Hon. Gentleman's substan tial objection to the course pursued, he (the Chancellor of the Exchequer) begged leave to say that the object of the Bill was to afford content to the people of Ireland, and in his opi nien it was much better to postpone the further consideration cf the question than, under the colour of bringing in a Bill for the avowed purpose of bringing content, to press forward a measure which would have a directly contrary efface It would be an insult to the House, rind it would be an insult to the country, if Ministers should press forward this Bill, fce!ieg, as they did, that it was not calculated to produce content in Ire land. The Right Hon. Gentleman said that Government were responsible for withdrawing this measure. Now, if Go vernment, under the colour of Reform, brought forward a measure which really WAS not a me. vae of Reform, they weeld indeed be deeply respensible, and the motives of their conduct, together with the good faith of their proceeding, might be fairly called in question. Ile did not undervalue the advan tage of that House preserving a good understanding with the other House of Parliament, but he felt assured that in the course of time they would be able to procure a better Bill for Ireland. There appeared to be no objection to the principle of the Bill, and the difference as to details would, he felt as sured, be hereafter adjusted. The Right Hon. Gentleman accused Ministers of a disposition to leave the question open as a bone of future contention. To that imputation they might have been liable bad they continued to persiat in the s'. franchise, but, yielding upon that point, they were not fairly liable to the charge. The Right Hon. Gentleman had him self admitted that the difference between them was but a slight one, and when Ministers-had made so large a concession upon the point of the pecuniary qualification, surely the Lords were wrong in persisting in a provision which opened the way to all kinds of false swearing and tampering with the surveyors. If it were only on this account alone, he should prefer the fran chise established by the original Bill. With respect to the late valuation in Dublin, upon which the Right Hon. Gentle man had laid so much stress, it should be remembered that it was a valuation taken upon a quite different standard than that proposed by the Lords' amendments. If the Right Hon. Gentleman could show that an equally fair velution could take place by making the poor-rate the standard of value, his argument would hold good. By these grants. therefore, he thought a postponement of the measure was the best course which Government could adopt. It would lead to a better ad justment of the measure finally, by showing that Ministers had made every reasonable and just concessiosi that could be made without departing from the. principle of the Bill. Sir R. INGLIS said he hoped, if the measure wore to Le brought forward in another session, that more consideration would be taken of the time of the House; - and, as Acts of Par liament had been entered as read which never had been read, he hoped that speeches would be considered spoken which never would be made.—(Laughter.) Mr. O'CO N NELL, as representing the capital of Ireland, begged leave respectfully to thank her Majesty's Ministers for the course they had adopted on this occasion. He thanked them for the unceremonious manner in which they got rid of the Lords' amendments to the Bill, and if there was any course which could be considered more unceremonious he would have been happy to see it adopted. The Bill thus amended was an insult to the people of Ireland, and it was clearly intended that it should be such.—(" Hear, hear," from the Lish Radical Members.) He could not help ad miring the gravity with which the Right lion. Gentleman op posite (Mr. Shaw) spoke of the concessions which had been made on the other side, and the manner in which he would lead the House to suppose that he was the instigator of those concessions. That was not the particular merit attri buted to the Right Hon. Gentleman by his friends in the old municipal bodies. What concessions—concessions for sooth 1 The people of Ireland only sought their just rights, and he, on their part, treated with ineffable coistempt any ar gument or assertion which went to say that they were not en titled to the same rights and privileges as the people of England or the people of Scotland—(Radical cheers)—and it was nothing less than robbery, downright robbery, to withhold them. Let them disguise it as they might he cared not, but those who refused to the people of Ireland their just rights were the greatest enemies the Crown had, and did more than any others to sever the people of Ireland from their allegiance to the throne. They were the Repealers in rea lity, for the Union was but a parchment, and which never could bo lasting if an equality of rights were not granted to Ireland with the other parts of the empire. They talked of concession on tithes. He was one of those who had advocated the putting or contriving to put a million of money into the pockets of the tithe owners, but he now bitterly regretted that he had done so ; and if, as he believed, the measure with respect to tithes would coma down again to that House with its most im portant clause altered, be hoped the Ministers would serve the Tithe Bill in tile same way in which they disposed of the pre seat measure. He agreed with the Right Honourable Gen tleman that the present Municipal Bill did contain a clause creating a fictitious franchise, but when the Bill came again before the House he would take care t o correct the error. If the Right Hon. Gentleman suggested such a clause next year —for he hoped no such clause would be introduced into the Ministerial Bill—he would certainly oppose it. The clause which he alluded to was the continuance of the power of creating fictitious freemen. He hoped to find introduced, next session, a Bill with a franchise similar to that in Eng land; and if that was not found extensive enough, Ireland would have no reason to complain, as she would be placed on - the same footing as the people of England. The Right Hon. Gentleman said the people of Ireland were not sensitive upon the subject. To be sure---they had so many other crying evils, that they could not be peculiarly emphatic upon this point. They had tithes, and other grievances ; but he would not allow it to be said that Irishmen were not sensitive on the municipal question, for base indeed would they be if they were not so. The present corporations in Ireland were a mere mockery. They were institutions with which the people had no sympathy, and were given up and abandoned even by their own friends. He hoped by the delay to get a much better Bill. The people of Ireland would accept of a Bill similar to the English one. They sought for no more, and would be con tent with no less. Mr. D'ISI2. AE LI complained that the Session had now been of nine months' duration, and yet but little progress had been made in the public business of the country. The reason given for the length of the Sessions lately was the attention which Government was obliged to give to Irish measures. They brought forward questions which were not called for by the necessities of the country, but mooted merely for the pie-- pose of keeping a party in power and making trials of strength. Notwithstanding the length of time that Parliament had been sitting, they were now about to separate, leaving Ireland in a state of smouldering insurrection.—( Hear, hear.) The No'ile Lord, as one of the last Ministerial acts of the Session,, had just pronounced the funeral oration of his own favourite mea sure. Was this tile result of their nine months' labour, the usual period of gestation ?—( Fleur, hear, and laughter.) The Noble Lord had only produced an abortion, or, at least, was about to strangle his own offspring. What answer would Mem bers give to their constituents when asked what business had been done during the Session ? The Noble Lord had not been able, even with his strange allies, to carry out to a conclusion the melancholy farce which the Session presented. Parliament was .bout to prorogue, leaving Ireland in the same state of smouldering insurrection as it was when they opened. They had emancipated tite . Catholies,. and . they coerced thorn— they excharm•ed a miser able mino ity tj adopt a treasonable m•4j(rity—they denounced the _Honourable and Learned . _ Gentlem , :n oppoiit, and then otired Itiai the hiOrest legal °file, in the country, in refusing which he conquered and triumphed over them. Coul I they thick of going on in the sane manner ye it after year ? If he would only sly, in the lanuwage of the and Learned Member for Dublin—and in followirg that lion. and Lertr,:ecl Member he of course could not violate the privileges of the House—that the course of poliey which Ministers pursued was a most profligate one. Sir H. VIVIAN s:rid, in answer to the question of what they could say to their constitmnits, that, for his part, Owe by whom he w:;s to that House were most a,,zious to sec justice done to Ireland, and they would say the Bill met the fate it merited. Mr. A. YATES said the conduct of the Lords with re spect to this fill was an insnit to the people of Ireland, %l b° would never be c on t en t unt il th ey h ad l oca l se lf- g overun'icnt• He hoped a b e tt er measure wou ld b e i ntro d uce d nex t s ession. The Bill was th en or d ere d to b e rea d t h at d ay t h ree months'On the m o ti on o f L or d J. RUSSELL , t h e Bill, as re turned by the L or d s , was or d ere d to b e pr i nte d. Captain WOOD gave notice that he would on the next meeting move for an alteration of the duties on pears, apple , grapes, and other foreign fruit. The House adjourned at a Quarter to Seven o'Clock. HOUSE OF LORDS, .Auausr 9. The Earl of SHAFTESBURY took his seat on the Woolsack a few minutes before Five o'Clock. Mr. BERNAL and others from the Commons appeared at the Bar, and presented the Royal Exchange Rebuilding Bill, the Court of Session (Scotland) Bill, and several other Bills with the Lords' amendments agreed to ; also the Exchequer Bills (11,014,550?.) Bill, the Exchequer Bills (Public Works) Bill, the Duchies of Cornwall and Lancaster Bill, the Slave-trade Treaties Bill, the Four-and-a-Half per Cent. Bill, Corporate P ro p er t y (I re l an d) Bill , t h e Canso" (Tin Duties) Bill, and some other Bills, to which they de sired the concurrence of their Lordships. CONFERENCE WITH THE COMMONS. Messengers from the Commons appeared at the Bar, air . demanded a conferen ce w ith th e i r L or d s hi ps on t h e a men meets made in the Benefices Pluralities Bill.—Agreed to. The Bank of Ireland Repayment Bill was read a third time and passed. The Duke of RICHMOND presented a petition from th e ss Guardians of the Poor o f C ro yd on i n f avour o f t h e P o or-law Bill, and in favour of the Rating of Small Tenements Bill. The following Peers w e re thee appointed to manage tr e Coeference with the Commons, and proceeded to Committee Room, No. 5, for that purpose :—The Duke of Richmond, the Earl of Effingham, the Bishop of Hereford, Lord Son des ' Lord Rayleigh, Lord Bexley, and Lord Strafford, Oa their return, the Duke of RICHMOND acquainted the House that they had been to the Conference, which was n'' d reanagad on the pa r t o f th e C ommons b y L or d J . R uss ell at n , others, and that the Comm ons h a d l e f t t h e i r reasons for •s , agreeing with certain amendments made by their Lordships. The reasons were ordered to be taken into consideration'; morrow. The Earl of El ADDINGTON moved that the amendment; made by the C ommons t o t h e S c h oo l s (Scotland) Bill he agreed to, as the amendments were very judicious. Viscount STRANG FO RD gave notice that on MendaY it ! should call the attention of their Lordships to the pretests striae of their commercial relations with South America. Lord LYNDHURST gave notice that early next Se's'? he should bring in a Bill relative to the Custody of Infel l ' b similar to that .hick had been rejectad a few nights ago. Lord BROUGHAM ob s e r v e d th a t th ere were sever al mdse objectionable clauses in that Bill. As he was on his legs begged to ask the Noble Lord the Secretary for the Colon li s whether the G overnmen t h a d rece i ve d a copy of any ordiasur s : or proclamation r e l a tiv e t o th e p ersons w h o h a d b ee n C O nected with the rebellion in Upper Canada ? Lord G L ENE LG, we understood, replied in the negative' CONFERENCE WITH THE COMMONS. ebe The following P e er s were t h en appo i nte d to manage "ds, Conference with the Commons, on the subject of the ame n .. , metes made to the M un i c ip a l C orporat i ons ( I re l an d) Bill'. os The Earl of Sh a ft es b u ry, th e E ar l o f H awarden, a flood, Bislion of Hereford, Lord Sondes, Lord Redesdale,e Lord CANADA GOVERNMENT ACT DECLARATO BILL. Lori BRO UG HAM, in rising to move the Order of t h e I)ay for the second reading of the above Bill, said that ;Jo c'l),:to, or t.:they the incidental conversation, w hi c h had t 8 piece in this House on this matter, sufficiently evinced the e citemeut which ex i s t e d h ere , an d h e believed elsewhere, elf, this subject, a n d th e d eep i mportance of the subject itschis He felt it to b e hi s b oun d en t h ough painful duty to br i n g t matter before their Lordships in consequence of the IS s o , which he h a d a l so f e l t i t hi s duty to take in resisting, darlitra all its stages the passing of the Canada Coercion Bill. , s e Clough his opinions- upon this measure still remained the ga fi li, —although anything- which Lad happened since, and, ahevet4- the matters whi c h h e was now about to consider, had str, e s it theeed rather th an wea k ene d t h ose op i n i ons—and althougd "Oe the intermediate time which he had given to reflection ' l i r., a the practical e ff ec t o f thi s measure h a d confirmed hire,ed conviction as h os til e against it as he ever entertained,oce led bins to wish mor e earnest l y t h an ever that n°, t his: measure had ever be en a d opte d b y t h e L eg i slature 0' that country--yet, having entered his prote s t against measure, he begge to say that he now wee!t to t eat dismiss alt oge th er hi d f ee li ngs o f h ost i l i ty against his measure, avowing, that he thought he should best dischar: e s a duty as a Member of Parli amen t, as a goo d su bj ect , and t of patriotic citiz e n o f thi s emp i re , b y avo idi ng a ll retrosrefsteel the past, anclehe ample ground s o f diff erence w hi c h e''' su es beta can himaelf. and many of their Lordships upon th is co ula ject, and pr ocee di ng a t once t o consider hots the Ivy ere now best be aecomplished and carri e d i n t o suc cessful o .l ) , c if Lion. Parliament, in its w i s d om , h a d d eeme d i t absols n io necessary, under the state of circumstances ex sty Canada—for nething short o f an absolute case of ne e of could justify such an Act—to suspend th e Constituti on Canada. Why? Because so universal and wide-sr e s a ss se feeling of dis con t en t ex i ste d i n t h ose prov i nces , an d beu' a i s a the Legislative Ai , cretnbly representing the people s°, i iie turbed and p ar ti a ll y di sa ff ecte d , so conveyed and kept ' O . 0 that feeling of discontent, that it was felt that, a s loMe ths the Constitution remained as it then was, so long a s o it Legislative Assembly was allowed to meet, there w as loaf were a focus of resistance and disaffection in the ee se which would for ever be blowing up the flames into °P en o• hellion, and preclude a ll h ope o f al l ay i ng the existing the the pular di scontent. That was the conviction, that we soli feeling, i n w hi c h t hi s measure took its rise ; and, with asibeel, of meeting th e c i rcumstances of the case he had so deseistipg e *whilst th e measure i tse l f extinguished the then rs of Constitution of these provinces, it provided ample Pe vr d e t hesl Government to supply this inevitable deficiency, an powers were entrusted to the Governor-General and s' f t his now resident at. Quebec. Now, looking at the whole 0 0e proceeding, he would venture to say that there was % s tf° . thing more self-evident—the Bill itself was entitled an 0 0 4 the " temporary Government of Canada," and giving P ..t sae of an extraordinary nature, limited, however, acto r see with that title to a fixed period, namely, the year joie' there was no one thing more self-evident, he would w a d i bis than that in passing that measure the Parliament 4 00 country 'coked forward to the restoration of the Cons t os eett of the Canadas, and of the ordinary powers of Gove r pecr with the ordinary restrictions upon the power of the t ab' the, as soon as peace and quiet should be restored there'to take as pointed by t h e very words of this Bill, was expected self' place in the year 1 840. Now, this being admitted 1 1 4 is oe s evident from the very title of the Bill, did there not fel ° f est ° corollary as self-evident, as he had taken the liberty t e s d th e the above proposition itself to be, namely, that it behovrt:casose Government created during this interval for the perf e ta eli sb ; of the temporary provisions necessary for the r e-es a th ment of the Constitution of Canada—that it beho" e ao sil hands to w hi c h t h ese extraordinary powers were t° the this interval con fid e d a l ways to look forward o 0 )d 1840, when it s temporary ar bi trary powergl°o .0 chase, and the o ld C onst i tut i on of the provinces oa.e, e 0 resume its place, an d so a d m i n i ster i ng the aut horl • which it was endowed as to give a chance, nay more, ho tev ao a great, a n d an ev id ent probability, and, as far a g ar I 840 effairs could be so, an absolute certainty, that in the i e bo tes 6c o r a hearty reconc il ement should once more take Peelto: w the pr ov i nces an d the parent.state ? Now, to the •Itt a " .so/a e s e this end t wo ru l es o f conduct appeared to hire t°,iog il y , evidently necessary. The first and most important y' wards this object was manifestly this, to execute as ; Pant and as parsimoniously as possible the extraordinary P ity vested in the temporary Government under the ant: w aeti Parliament. It was intended by the Bill to seisPlY. the a supreme power, which the Bill itself in the first ins"' of `, s suspended, in consideration of the absolute exigen c y t eali case ; and this supreme power, which he would n o , even dictatorship, because he wished to .avoid every le e ssn or gesture, every expression, which could possibly " o t o hostility or warmth, was accordingly conferred ';'P r Governor- Gen era l w h o was sent out to these provinees.ordilp, could be no doubt, however, that these powers, e itra ve et to as they were, were intended to be, and ought to l' a o sea, t io e exercised as sparingly as just to enable the Gove r eall'it carry itself on, and no more; arid that every P a r soggso, which reas on , mo d erat i on, and good temper COn' o alcl should have b een a d opte d to conciliate, a s far a 5 apPesrbe the public feeli ng to w h at must at first sight have 0 1 ser an arbitrary proceeding-, and to regain the affection s eetito people as speedily as possible. He would not II ; of ef' upon the question of the probability, or, ind ee ss lSont I b° advantages or disadvanges, of an eventual seP a eee o lr fected without incurring a rancorous w ou nd, h to oil colony an d t h e pareat state, although he beggeooesste serve that h e st ill entertained the same opinio n t he 'O l , oint as When he last addressed their Lordships h e 0 ject. Th e case was now different, however, a l l d ~iei° ic b now abaut to speak, not according to Isis one riot' policy, but according to tho policy of P a rliain e , os ee c o d was to strengthen and render ,ermanents the " s $ g between this country and its colonies ; for, as gif:011! subject, and . a patriotic Citizen, he felt bounu i to r:hic" his own opinion to that of the Legislature, nnu s , h r, "c.') . " l with it how the empire could best be held togu`„, e are; could only be in iris opinion by means and In c " fle. so s s ciliated to reconcile the affections of the poo ple ou yeP o t, it therefore, to be absolutely incumbent uP 3 : t ee° hod ° ennuited with extraordinary powers of Oev er- 'tY 0 4' asbuhtti thet all extraordinary and needless acts of autlo r a t i s t g tfe rit , be altogether avoided ; and, secondly, that the e ° P a tb t ; t p l ei , o u a s m p c l a e r e o s: :. ( e ) r u s i d „dare 1 10 equally convinced of' the truth of, that even Bill ; aed, the third place., it wan a ex( d its ample limits a k e c o n ,,s i l d io c t re t ti o , exceed t b y soa actine o se ° to e powers of this 13111, and taking the most scrupLl)l,u.,i t he 'i v " to' se:ccectsunc should.-it uttennal tpoo"'s.uvaexsretsc'oguttievseutifilliiebciyit.iitighthis.bl3uatill'tilhialiin'a4;l3:l:tjeliceirrailt:ii a meneee with ar extreme caution, and as g r f e j : e r; l .,g e e' t i to the has sle ular ciscurnstances of the case, and !w e in e- or'. sheik, in as e mstitutional a spirit as it was poi's' t po,ro Lea peen: sin themselves uacorufitutional. If t yli lie 10; 1 "g is• ! 4icnt In.td leen git ea nod xcrcised,pat • to he it, tirec aecution of that :sewer whit as it ,then eessity of th e case did not require-41e t only o 'v t odif , g t P l o fo safer and more prudent, in t a t , pails so'r tie, t as r iv a ii )t i le h li r t e o c o o". t n y ch n , aig hu t c.otenc;