The Sun. — London, England, 1836-02-23 00:00:00

lain rises, and the stage, which was all gloom and - horror but so shorl a time before, is. the scene of joke and hilarity. No more of danger—no more of alarm—nothing but jests at the weakness of thai. political party whose power and whose attor.','lties had but just excited such frarful atiticiwatl'ons of public disaster. 'To give an honest Opinion, we must say • that our contemppma sueceuled better in traqedy than in farce.* Its L .,oriairi, though rather of the coarsest — rather too much .111 the 0. Smith" style—were more effective than its efFerts at sprightliness— they are dull. There is I nn one real ;eke brough t forward, and that is borrowed ( w i t h acknowledgment) from old Farquhar. It would have been more prudent to have nostponeu the comic part of the entertainment until better pre r.red for it. The Ministerial artist trusts too - much to the effect of sinprise. It is very well to startle ns by an avowal on the part of a hitherto conf i dent Ad ministration that the affairs of the ccuntry are in a very frightful condition, which the nominal 'conductors piously leave to the deterininP:aon of Providence, not being able to look into horrors with a view o! arriving at their clirr. ax . This does very well ; for, even were we pred,lsposed to believe it, how can we presume to dor:ot such a statement when it comes from the organ of: 'Milliliters themselves ? But the case is different, when the same organ begins to make very wonderful disclosures concerning the state of party to which it is opposed. Our principal men, they assure u s , with uncommon straining after jocose allusion, have deserted us. According to the Ministerial paper, we Conservatives have lost the benefit Sir Robert Peel's assistance. The Duke of Wellington is no longei with us, and Lord Lyndhurst cares nothing about our concerns. Much mirth is attempted to he made out of us on the assumption of the palpable truth of these losses to our party. But the attempt fails, because the foundation fails. A dull and stupid fiction, with out even the colour of truth, or the semblance of authority, will hardly support a joke were it ever so light : and we protest that a heavier joke, or set of jokes, than we are now dealing with it has not been our fate previously to encounter. He must have been but a clumsy fellow, and fit only to handle things in the lump, who ventured upon the statement that the three important personages already named had all, and at the same time, abandoned the Opposition. 131.11 a very little while ago we were assured that the Duke of Wellington had quarrelled with Sir Robert Peel, until the papers announced that the Duke w:As on a visit at Sir Robert's house. Well, that ste'7 could stand no longer. Another was got up respecting serious diffe rences between the Duke P lad Lord Lyndhurst. Most unluckily the next acco:nts from his Lordship which appeared in public came from Stratfieldsaye. Then it was discoverad that the Carlton Club and Lord Lyndhurst rere at complete variance with the late Premier, 'when 10, a Carlton dinner was noticed, at which Sir Robert Peel and Lord Lyndhurst sat to gether the whole evening. Angry w i th th ese reta il newtmongers, who, likeDesdemona— had by parcels something heard, But not intentively-" The " great political engineers" sent them about their business, and etigagA a whole sa l e man , w h o h as swept away these three chiefs' from the party at one fell swoop. He 'is much more held than clever. It would be pleasant, to hear a thorough-going Ministerial man . explain;..igwhat it was that frightened away the Duke of Wellington, Sir Robert Peel, and Lord Lyndhurst from the ranks of their party, in utter hopelessness. Thty are men so apt to be panic-stricken —so liable to br.: overawed by the astonishing capabilities of those to - whom ,they are opposed ! Doubtless th e Duke is mastered by the energy of Lord Melbourne—by his precise knowledge of facts and dates--by the accuracy of his information—the force of his reasoning —and, above all, by the warm flow of candour and urbanity which wins the ready acquie:leence of a large majority of the House to his political views. As to Lord Lyndhurst, how can he be otherwise than struck down by the blazing intelligence, the lightening genius, of the Baron of Cottenham ? The deep and various po litical erudition, of that Learned Lord—the profound ness of his views, and the elevation of his sentiments— the ready vigour of his thoughts, and th e c l ass i c elegance o f his language—all, all, are such as a Lyndhurst may in vain think to compete with. In the splendour of such a political mind as now beams from the Woolsack the radiance of such lesser luminaries as Lord Lyndhurst must be lost. He therefore retires. And in the House of Commons what chance is there for Sir Robert Peel ? How can he stand before speeches at once so condensed in style and so lucid in development, as those of Lord John Russell upon the reform of the English Tithe system ? Must not the manly, bold, English bearing of Lord Palmerston, upon questions of foreign policy, leave him without hope of success, and can he be otherwise than reminded of his own littleness by the unaffected dignity and noble presence of Mr. Spring Rice ? How can he hope ever again to fill the office of Chancellor of the Exchequer, when he sees before him in the daily and nightly sustainment of its duties one who reminds us of Pitt, by his stern elevation of character, and of Canning, by the graceful charm of his demeanour ? We see, then, at a glance—all must see—the kind of overwhelming motives which there are to the retire. ment of these eclipsed Conservatives from a conflict with opponents so superior. We see the sort of rea sonibleness which attends upon the theory of their abandonment of party opposition. But, after all,' theory is but theory, and the fact is (however wonder ful) that they have done no such thing—that the Con servative party never was more united, or more deter mined to act steadily, methodically, and vigorously for the sustainment of good measures, and the defeat and exposure of faction and of fraud.-- Morning Post. ROLLS' COURT-MONDAY. MELLOR. V. WOODS. His Lordship, the MASTER of the ROLLS gave judgmuit to-day in this cause. He stated that the bill was filed by certain persons to whom money was due upon an equitable mortgage created by a deposit of deeds. 0 ".,e of the de fendants was Mr. W. Woods, the surety, of Mr. W. T. Woods, his son, the collector of the aAessed taxes for the East Brixton division of the count y of Surrey. Mr. W. T. Woods, the collector, made default to the extent of 1.8001., and his surety, I\..r. W. Woods, being called upon for the payment of - .chat was due, he prevailed upon the Commissioners of. Taxes, to whom the money was payable, to give liira time ;. and this they were induced to do upon his depositing with them the title deeds in ,question. At the same time a memorandum was signed, by which the purposes for which the deposit was made were set forth. The default amounted to 1,8001., and it was admitted on both sides that the principal sum did not bear interest. This being the case, Mr. W. Woods at a subsequent period, by means of the defendant Gahriel, paid off 1,000/., and consequently only 800/. was left unpaid. The payment of this latter sum being either refused or neglected by the defendant, Mr. W. Woods, the present bill was filed to have the benefit of an equitable mortgage. Mr. W. Woods, by his answer, stated that the sum of 8001. was still due ; but the other defendants, who certainly were not botina by their co-defendant's answer, admitted that a sum was due, and alleged that they did not know what had been paid or what was still due from W. Woods in respect of this liability, and they therefore insisted that an accouret should be taken, as an equitable mortgagee could not b' considered to be in a better situation than a common legal mortgagee. In opposition to this the plaintiffs, the Coramissioners, urged upon the attention of the Court the incomrenience that would arise to themselves and to the lie a further delay in the payment were perm!tted., and iCiev erosequently prayed that th ere m ight be an • ..inmediate sale of the premises, without the time to redeem usually allowed in the case of an ordinary mortgage. When the case was argued at the Bar, he (the Ms ...cer of the Rolls) had in quired whother there 7as . any authority which could be adduce :1 hi favour C )l. + ;ais argument. H e had since looked at tke books, and. tie bad not found any authority which would justify hint in relieving the plaintiffs from the hard ship which further delay would certainly occasion them. The account must be taken of what was due on the mort gage, and he should order that the time usually given to rede em i n common mortgage cases , namely, six months, Should be allowed. If what should be found due were not I) aid withi n that period the plaintiffs might then proceed to an immediate sale. 011111‘16,..N. PLEAS.-MONDAY. rants of his ,own, and dsti suite belonging to the plaintiff (ilastiplo..) Mt'. accommodation required was the discount )f a )3111 io the amount of 4,0001., which when due was duly ,:al. l . Rennie then took up the warrants which belonged to bimself, hut left those which belonged to the plaintiff. lie subsequently stopped payment, being in debt to the &lon. lants, who, on heir)g applied to for the plaintiff 's warrants, i-efived to deliver them, alleging that they had a claitn upon them for what Rennie owed them, to recover which the present action was brought. _Verdict for the plaintiff-3421. I 4A. 2d. BERNARD V. 3tAcINDLRP. This was an action. fur BPI and slander. The was a shipping and t ommission agent at St: DOrningo j tho defendant "'.".0 belongs to a houta t 3 ;,iitAil-Prince, in St. Doß.l'ingo. In 1834 s tit'? hiftl - Se of Cox and Co., of Log don, wrote to 0..? &fondant, whose house is at Liverpool, statiag thlll they understood that they. had tit, ship corn etttrec going to St. Domingo, and would he glad to ship two bales of goods. Cox and Co. received a letter in re ply, stating that, if the goods Were to be consigned to the defendant, they would decline forwarding them, "as he had An aptitude for petty quarrels, and had boot to their office in Port-au-Prince, making a fuss about freieht," and thEy would not wish to have anything to do with him. 'lle slan derous words imputed to the defendant wort s that I.ltt nacj said, on another occasion, that the plainat was a contempti ble man, and he would not ship n oas to him. Evidence of the foregoing facts was , given. The Jury retuned a verdict for the plaintiff—Da. mages 504 EXCHEQUER COURT.-MONDAY. COLES V. TILE CORPORATION OF LONDON. Mr. V. RICHARDS was instructed to move, on the pa r t of Mr. Thomas Coles, treasurer of Bethlem Hospital, for certain ledgers, papers, and other documents, whi c h arc i n possession of the defendants as the Governors of Bridewell and Bethlem. Hospitals, in order that they may be deli vered into the custody of the clerks in Court, with a view that he may inspect them. The bill had for its object to disclose the accounts of the transactions between the par ties ; and it prayed that certain moneys paid in by Mr. Thomas Hudson, the late receiver, may be allowed to the deponent ; and it further prayed that the defendants might be restrained by an injunction from proceeding to the trial of an action which they had brought against the deponent, and which otherwise would be tried to-morrow before a Special Jury at Guildhall, unless the Court interposed its protection. After some ( I: .scussion it was agreed that the account s should 130 inspected at the hospital instanter, and that ap plie.:Ltion might he made to the Chief Justice to-morrow at Guildhall, to postpone the trial. PRESENTATION OF A SILVER TROWEL TO LORD MELBOURNE. (From the Morning Advertiser.) Yesterday the Right Hon. C. Tennyson d'Eyncourt, the Chairman of the dinner upon laying the foundation-stone of the new Licensed Victuallers' School, in Kennington lane, accompanied by a deputation, consisting of Mr. Ward, the Chairman of the Institution, Mr. Corby, the Chairman elect, Mr. Belton, Mr. Lincoln, Mr. Wells, Mr. Liquorish, Trustees, Mr. Blake, the Secretary, Mr. Wire, the Soli citor, and the Editor of this journal, had an interview with Viscount Melbourne, in Downing -street, to present an Address and also a splendid Silver Trowel used by his Lordship on lavin g the foundation-stone of the Licensed Victuallers' School. On one side of the Trowel the Royal Arms are engraved, and on the other side is the following inscription : _ This Trowel was used by the Right Honourable William Lord Viscount Melbourne, Prime Minister Qf England, in laying the Foundation-stone of the Licensed Victuallers' School, in Kennington-lane, Lambeth, in the name of his Most Gracious Majesty King William the Fourth, Patron of the Institution, on Thursday, the 21st day of January, 1836." After the Members of the Deputation had been intro duced to Lord Melbourne by the Right Hon. Gentleman, who had been especially requested so head it, and who at some personal inconvenience very cheerfully undertook the duty, the Secretary read the following address, to which his Lordship paid the most careful and polite attention "MY LORD,—The Trustees and Committee of the Licensed Victuallers' School, in venturing to intrude for a few minutes on your Lordship's time, at a period when the important duties of your high office must necessarily require your undivided attention, beg most respectfully to thank your Lordship for having affordod them this oppor tunity of personally expressing their deep sense of gratitude for the kindness with which your Lordship acceded to their wishes, by laying the foundation-stone of their new School, as the representative of its Illustrious Patron, his Most Gracious Majesty. " The trustees and committee are fully sensible that, at the time when your Lordship fulfilled their expectations, and those of every friend to the institution, the state of your Lordship's health was such as to render the perform ance of the ceremony a task, not only fatiguing and diffi cult, but involving considerable personal danger ; and while they feel that any language they can command must fall in finitely short of their obligations, they cannot but hope that the cordial welcome which your Lordship received from the thousands who witnessed, either wholly or partially, the proceedings of the day, proved to your Lordship how highly your condescension was appreciated, and how much gratifi cation was afforded to the spectators by the patience, ur banity, and good-will with which your Lordship went through the ceremony. " The Trustees and Committee, my Lord, now beg per mission to proffer to your Lordship's acceptance the trowel Which you honoured by using it in laying the foundation stone of the new building, with their sincere wishes that it may long remain in your Lordship's possession, as a me mento of the performance of an act of benevolence, emi nently calculated to stamp additional importance on a valuable Charitable Institution, and to contribute essentially to its future prosperity. " In conclusion, my Lord, the Trustees aed Committee beg to express their hopes that Providence will grant to your Lordship length of days, with the enjoyment of the best health, anal long enable you, in your present exalted situation, to promote, throughout our beloved country, the true principles of liberty, the inestimable benefits of edu cation, and the welfare and happiness of all classes of the corn m unity." Mr. WARD, as Chairman of the Trustees, then handed to his Lordship the splendid trowel already adverted to, which he received in the most grateful manner, and then aldreused th e d eputat i on in the following words : " Gentleraen,—l beg leave to return you my warm thanks for the too flattering terms of this address. " I have great pleasure in accepting this testimony of your approbation and good-will ; I shall preserve it as a me:no•rial of your kindness, and of the gratifying reception which I met with, as his Majesty's representative, upon the occasion to which you allude. " It gives me the most lively satisfaction to learn that my attendance upon that occasion, which subjected me to little or no personal inconvenience, is considered by you to have been beneficial to the objects of your Institution." The deputation then took its leave, after mutual acknow ledgments on both sides, highly gratified with its reception, and the evident expression of pleasure on the part of Lord Melbourne, not only at the reception he had experienced upon the occasion of laying the foundation-stone of the new School in Kennington-lane, but of the affection and regard evinced to him by the deputation. SHIPPING INTELLIGENCE. VESSELS ENTERED INWARDS AT THE CUS TOM-HOUSE, FEB. 22. The Earl of Liverpool, Lomax, from Ostend : Sir Edward Banks, Norwood, Hamburgh ; Brockelbank, Grant, Bou logne ; Harlequin, Ling, Rotterdam ; Nledemblick, Gray, Aredemblick ; Suive, Kuper, Brussels; Earl Clancarty, Wil liams, Rotterdam ; Auguste, 'Saville, Gravelines; Florence, Cundy, Stnyrna; Shannon, Broak, ditto ; John, Bowman, Hamburgh. ENTERED OUTWARDS FOR LOADING, FEM . 22. The Walmer Castle . , Pouchier, for Bombay ; Egham, Turner, Tunis; Dart, Hart, Guernsey ; Liverpool, Hepburn, Lisbon ; Victor, Pearson, Antigua ; John Bagshaw, Hardy, Madras; StrP2 '„ I3roarll.,,rst,Cheape, Cape of Good Hope; Ganges, Mauritius; Britannia, Strannack, Rotterdam; Lester, Hayward, Newfoundland ; Jane, William, St. Thomas's and Nassau ; Cygnet, Rolls, South Australia ; Oeorgiana, Gibson, Trinidad; Hero, Faillant, Calais., CLEARED OUTWARDS WITH CARGO, FEB. 22 The Balelutha, Milroy, for Hamburgh; Bein Venu, Mor., rison, Ostend, Bruges, and Ghent; John M'Kellan, M‘Do nald, Bombay ; Egham, Turner, Turin; Princess Augusta, Dee, Cantor,. CLEARED OUTWARDS IN BALLAST, FED. 22. The Universe, Black, New York; Alida, Guiper, Leer. ARRIVED AT LIVERPOOL, FEB. 21.. The Hindoo, Drigeoe, from Demerara ; Parkfield, M'Auley, Bombay; Don Juan, Johnson, Demerara and Cork ; Esk, Ponsonby, Batavia and Singapore. TELEGRAPHED. Wind, W. —Off pert the Ormrod schooner and the May, in tow by a pilot boat, putting b . ack. The New York packet ship Caledonia, Captain Graham, which sailed hence for New York on Friday, at noon, with a f4ir wind from the north-east, has this day put back with loss of foreyard and jibboom, having come in contact with the May, frost►, Bombay. The latter vessel has . also returned with loss HASTINGS U. ROBARTS AND ANOTIVII? This was an action brought by the pl;i;- file value of certain East Ina). indi' ____________,___ - ( ' , NI: , to thc viG!ent gales which ha,..e prevailed folliwring circumstanc es :-- . The-tlclemlants were in the bal:it of discounting. bills for 3 ome days past from the N. N. and N. W,, the supply of for a merchant of the name o,f llenzie. In the early part of fish, especially mackerel, has been very 1440 i indeed the 1834, being desirous to get certain accommodation to the state of the channel has rendered it itopossiblq Mown (44,0004, he lodged certain E ast I ndia indigo war Brighton Herald, 1 . . ~ : o fish.— tgo war ttit StrN, LONDON, TUEsDA.V, FEfIitIJARY 23, i83(1. IMPERIAL PARLIAMENT. HOUSE OF LORDS, FEBRELdny 22. The Loan CHANCELLOR took his seat on the Woolsack shortly before Five o'clock. ECCLESIASTICAL COURTS BILL. The girl of SHAFTESBURY presented a petition from the Bolicito7s of Lewes; in Sussex, in favour of the Bill for Conso lattice the Ecclesiastical Courts. Lord ELLEN BO ROUG H rrcsented several petitions f.-em Olnucester, N‘orcester, Bucks, and other places, to the same DIStNTERS' lIELIEF BILL. Lord HOLLAND presented a petition from the Dissenting Ministers of the Con2regations within twelve miles of London, in favour of Lord John Russell'§ Bill for the rcligf of Dis fcntcrs, . • .X6IIideLTORAL DISTRESg. Lord WYNFORD preSen:ed a petition from Horneastle, Complaining of Agrieultural DistresS. thiltEß DUTIES:: hurt ASHBURTON presented al tielition from Nova Scotia ; against arly ditrratlon in the Titriber Ditties: He wished id from the Noble Lord dppositti whether it »act intended to make any altvralidik i hoe antics'? Thc Mai•qiiitt f LANSDOWNE said that it was nig the totikult;ll of the Government fo i propom any &Iteration: APPOINTMENT 12A618TRATES. Lord WH A RNCL fPVE deferred his motion on this sub feet till to-morrow. Th e N o bl e L or d pr e sented a petition rom Leicester, complaining of agricultural distress. The Noble Lord said he had another to present on the subject of railways. There were a great many schemes afloat for those railways, and many pills had been introduced into the other House. The prayer of this petition was one in which he could note concur; it was that all railways should be confined as much as possible to the present lines of turnpike roads. Although he did not concur in the prayer of the petition—(Hear, hear, hear)—he would suggest that it was very desirable that some means should be taken previous to these bills being submitted to a second reading, either by a Committee or some other means, to ascertain which was the best line of road. This was a matter for the Government alone, and he had heard with very great pleasure that some measure of this kind was in contemplation. The Marquis of LONDONDERRY thought the sugges tion of the Noble Lord a very good one. He knew instances, and more particularly that of the Stockton and Darlington Railways, in which, in consequence of more than one rail way being allowed to be constructed in nearly parallel lines, they had all of them been greatly injured. The Marquis of L ANS DOWNE expressed his entire con currence and that of his Majesty's Government in the obser vations of the Noble Baron by whom the petition had been presented. He was most anxious that some concurrent enquiry should take place as to the merits of the projects which were brought before Parliament. He (Lord Lansdowne) was interested, as many other Noble Lords were, in the progress of even rival railways ; but in a case of such magnitude, in volving an outlay little short of forty millions of capital, private interest should yield to public good. He believed a proposition was about to emanate from his Majesty's Government in ano ther place, to refer these several projects to a Committee— ( Hear, hear)—and he trusted that the labours of that Com mittee would be attended with the best results.—(Hear.) ECCLESIASTICAL COURTS. Lord ABlldilp;;;nid petitions from Norwich and some other places against the Ecclesiastical Courts' Consoli dation Bill. The Earl of DEVON presented petitions to the same effect from Exeter and various other places. He trusted that the particular clause relative to the total removal of the power of taking Probate in the counties would be again con sidered. _ _ _ The Bishop of LONDON said the point had undergone considerable discussion before the Commissioners, of whom he had the honour to be one. But it was decided that the expense of taking the probate in London would be less than that at pre sent incurred by taking it in the country. Lord ELL ENBOROUG H thought before any deci sion was come to, that the subject alluded to in these petitions should be referred to a Select Committee, more especially as they embraced the whole of the questions in dispute. The LORD CHANCELLOR said the question had ex cited very great interest throughout the country. The sub ject of Probate had been before the Commissioners for a whole year, and he feared that further inquiry would not be attended with any beneficial effect.—( Hear.) The result of all the deliberation that had taken place upon this subject was that there could be no effectual reform in our Ecclesiastical Courts if the taking of Probate in the Local Courts remained as it was. The advantages were more imaginary than real, for the informa tion could be obtained as readily from London as from the local Court, if parties lived in a remote part of a diocese. He had, however, no objection to any further inquiry if that would be the means of satisfying the petitioners. Lord ABINGER explained. The Bishop of EXETER thought the suggestion of the petitioners could not be complied with. Lord DE NMA N was anxious that the Committee should be at once appointed, in order that the question would be the sooner put an end to. He believed there might be some arrange ment made for an index in the country, without disturbing the general Probate in London. Some plan might be ar ranged to reconcile all differences without interfering with the principle of the measure.—(Hear.) There never was a measure which came so highly recommended to their Lordships as the present. The Noble and Learned Lord on the Woolsack was, he believed, the third Lord Chancellor to whom this Bill had been referred. It had been first intro duced by a Noble and Learned Lord (Brougham) to whom the country was much indebted for the many legal improve ments which he had brought forward—( Hear, hear, hear) — that Noble and Learned Lord had introduced it in the House of Commons in the year 1828, and it bad been since very frequently discussed.—( Hear, hear.) He believed, of all the great legal improvements suggested by that Noble and Learned Lord, none would be found more extensively useful than the present, and on these grounds he would support the proposi tion for a Committee. After a few words of explanation from Lords WYNFORD and ABINGER, the Bill was read a second time, and or dered to be referred to a Select Committee, which will meet on Friday for the first time. The House then adjourned. the Committee would lay down some points upon which the Committee was to be governed in affording information to the House; but it would be of no avail to lay down any rules if the List Committee were sitting in the mean time. Colonel SIBTHORP took the liberty of expressing the gratification he experienced at what he heard fall from tVe President of the Board of Trade, viz., that Government con sidered themselves responsible for the good conduct of the House, with reference to rail roads. Anxious as lie was to discharge his duty, he found it impossible to do so from the regular, or rather irregular, proceedings in the smoking room that day. No matter what quarter he went to, he found rail roads brought, in by attorneys' cleiks, —( Hear ) Ile had that day come down to attend a Committee, relative to the Shields' Road, and lie believed that a report would be brought up stating that the standing orders had not been complied with. He should like to know how it was possible for any Member, who felt himself interested, to attend to his ' ' • ---e leavirl l e' the smoking-room two attornies' duties. 41S 110h.._ • ' --eath e r he would con clerks stepped up to him, and asked him e . . - o to r the that c h r e r is k es s ii i l Office, m it o o t o :- belt i Ptitt ttJ this railro a d, He did not .say either that he would const... whenotts. went ie h o e if this system Were artied on, and netnes were surreptitieusly and falsely intr o duc e d, lie should like to know what guard there d fo e u t i l id be h s is aid name nothingln th ; e b d u i t s se was against moving that the standing orders had not been complied with. Right Honourable Gentleman to the second reading of the Bill, he should more the second reading of the London and Brighton Railroad, and he tot - Welted the House would be acting unfairly to individuals, if they postpOned the consideration of it for eight days. He could not sec what was the object of delay, beertitee if the Bill were now read a second time, the committee could not tie fiat) iipten it for ten days. It was a new mode of proceeding to suggest d merit of the second reading, whereas sufficient time could be had for consideration in the interval that must elapse before the sitting of the Committee. Another reason why he pressed his motion was, because he understood there were rival parties, and that would be giving them an opportunity of objecting after the time ordered by the House for pre senting petitions against private Bills, and he was con vinced, when the Committee met, that he would be able to show the superiority of Mr. Stevenson's over every other plan, Lord SANDON suggested a postponement in all eases where there were contending parties, and in the one now be fore the House it was imperatively called for, there being no less than seven different lines in contemplation between London and Brighton. He should support the view of his friend the Mem: ber for Lancashire for the postponment of the question until it had been ascertained by a Select Committee what were the advan tages resulting to the public from it. The House was not called upon to decide upon the merits of the Bill, only to sus peed its judgment. Mr. GISBORNE said his Right Hon. Friend opposite had given notice of his intention to move for the postponement of all Railway Bills, and as a preliminary to that, he now inti mated his wish to have them all referred to a Select Com mittee. That course he considered unfair to the parties who were prepared for the second reading of their Bills on that even= ing,and who might be inconvenienced by allowing parties to come in and object before the second reading, although they had not complied with the standing orders of the House. A delay was proposed for eight days, without, as he conceived, the the least necessity. Sufficient time would elapse for consideration before the Committee, and he hoped the House would not adopt a,course injurious to the individuals before them. He certainly would divide the House upon the second reading of the Bill which he would propose ; and as he intended to sup port the Noble Lord, he hoped the friends of the Noble Lord would remain to support him in return.—(Laughter.) Sir J. GRAHAM fully concurred in the propriety of the course reeommended by his Right Hon. Friend the President of the Board of Trade. When he considered the number of Railway Bills already before the House, or about to be intro duced, and which would require, if they were all carried into operation, a capital of not less than 45,000,0001., the question was one of that magnitude, that it was well worthy the atten tion of the Government, and demanded the serious considera tion of that House.—( Hear.) There was another point also in which these speculations might be viewed. In all other great public works submitted for the consideration of_ Parlia ment, the standing orders bad been well framed, and carefully considered; but with regard to Railways, the standing orders applicable to navigable canals, had been rudely, hastily, and imperfectly brought to act, and none of them had been either carefully considered, or well arranged.— ( Hear.) On these grounds, it was a question whether the whole subject of railways should not be referred to a Com mittee composed of experienced Members of that House. He thought the postponement for eight days a very reasonable sug gestion, and he for one should not be sorry if all those now pro posed were postponed for an entire Session. An appeal from the country drunk, to the country sober, might be beneficial to the interests of all, and he should, therefore, support the pro position of a postponement for eight days. It would be pro bably most advantageous if the Bills were referred to a Com mittee, in order that some additional information might be furnished previous to their being submitted for a second reading to that House. He had heard no answer from the Hon. Mem ber for Derbyshire to that argument. There could be no great inconvenience from the delay of a few days, and the im portance of the question well merited the attention of the House. He thought the Government deserved the thanks of the country for having brought this matter under their consideration. He HOUSE OF COMMONS, FERRUARY 22. The SPEAKER took the Chair shortly before four o'clock. Lord WM. BENTINCK, who was introduced by Sir E. Con- RINGTON and Mr. OSWALD, took the oaths and his seat for Glasgow, amid much cheering. The SPEAKER a petition, complaining of an undue election for the Borough of Dungarvan. was favourable to the course that had been recommended by the Right Hon. Gentleman opposite, and he hoped he would agree with the motion, that the second reading of all these Bills should be suspended for at least eight days, until the Report of that Committee bad been received. If that Com mittee had discharged their duty efficiently, and of that there could be no doubt, they would be conferring a very great benefit on the country. Lord GRANVILLE SOMERSET fully concurred in the proposition of the Right Hon. President of the Board of Trade in every case where there were rival railways to go the same line, but he did not think it desirable that every project for the formation of a railway, whatever its individual merits might be, should be put off for a Session.—( Hear, hear, hear.) He could not help receiving with great suspicion the suggestion of putting off the second reading of the present and other Bills. In cases where there was but a single line to be considered it would be a great hardship upon individuals, after having complied with the standing orders, if they should be met with a proposition like this at the last moment. His Right Hon. Friend said that the parties should be called upon for additional confirmation, but a delay of six weeks or more must be the result of such recommendation, the parties not being prepared for it. It would be a great hardship to the parties if any delay should take place in the second reading of the Bill which he (Lord G. Somerset) would presently propose. He did not mean to say that he would support the proposition of the Noble Lord opposite, but he should certainly oppose any amendment to put it off for even a single week.-4 Hear. ) Mr. CLAY was not the advocate or the opponent of any of the measures that were about to be brought forward ; but he would say, that on ordinary occasions it was not, in his opi nion, wise or just to oppose the second reading of a private Bill. That House was the best tribunal to elicit the truth on any such measures, and in all such cases he thought it would be most just and expedient to refer the matter to a Committee up stairs.—( Hear, hear.) If the Noble Lord pe rs i s t e d in his motion, he (Mr. Clay) must divide against him. He thought the Government deserved much credit for endeavouring to provide (for that House was proceeding without compass), some rule or plan by which they would be able to sift the wheat from the chaff, and separate the good from the bad. It so happened that in one of t he p arishes of that borough, with which he had the honour to be connected, no less than sixteen of these projects interfered—he meant the parish of St. Mary, Whitechapel, and in a single parish within that district no less than 1,284 tenements were scheduled to be taken down. The public were much interested in these concerns, and their interest was the first which ought to be considered by that House, and therefore he thought they should proceed with great caution. There were forty-five millions said to be sub scribed towards these speculations, and it was the duty of the House to see that so much capital was not so employed as to give great activity to l a b our at the first, and then be only so much abstracted from the profitable capital of the country. Mr. C. BARCL A Y was favourable to the motion of the Noble Lord (Lord G. Lennox), that the Bill be read a second time now, because lie did not think that the object of the Right Hon. President of the Board of Trade would be pre eluded by so doing. He was glad that the Government had come forward on this question—they had the interests not only of the public to take care of, but also of the spe culators themselves.—( Hear, hear.) lie would suggest to the Hon. President that it should be an instruction to the Committee to consider whether it would not be a safe and salutary plan to require, as a preliminary to the second reading of these Bills, that 5 per cent. of the estimated expence had been invested in Exchequer bills, so that the public would have some sort of security—it could be no hardship upon- good, and bona fide speculations, but would save the country from those of the opposite character. He did not suppose the proposed Committee would go into the estimates and plans—if so, forty days would not be a long enough term to give them. If the Committee did their duty without fear or favour, these railways might become a source of the greatest benefit to the country. Sir R. PEEL said, when the general question of railways was before the House on a former occasion, there seemed to be a very prevalent opinion that the manner in which Committees were now appointed was not the most satisfactory. That railroads were most important for the welfare and maintenance of the cons mercial prosperity of the country—(Cheers)—was not to be dis puted.—( Cheers.) At the same time, it was impossible to deny that they much interfered with private interests, and it was impossible to deny that both those parties and the public bad a right to demand that each project should be considered on its individual merits. Private interests and the public had a right to demand that. The Hon. Member for Mid dlesex (Mr. Hume) on a former night had suggested that the House was too much occupied with these private Bills, and had sug gested that some other tribunal should be appointed for their consideration. To that suggestion ha (Sir R. Peel) had very great objection. In the last resort no other tribunal could be called upon to decide upon a line of road between London and Birmingham, and what private individuals must sacrifice of their property. On the other hand, he did not like to be called upon to say whether a particular speculation was good or not. He did not like to be called upon to vote on the second reading of a Bill without any knowledge of it— without evidence or argument—that was very unsatisfactory. The proposition of the Right Hon. Gentleman was that a Com mittee be appointed without delay to inquire what course it was expedient for the House to adopt; now he (Sir R. Peel) fully concurred with the Right Hon. Gentleman, that it was most desirable that a Committee should be appointed for this purpose, and that it should proceed without delay to consider the subject. To the main principle of the Right Hon. Gent.'s proposition he was decidedly favourable, and he should accord ingly vote far his motion. He (Sir R. Peel), however, RAILWAYS. Lord GEO. LENNOX presented a petition from Worsley, and several other places, in favour of the Brighton Line of Railway projected by Mr. Stevenson. Mr. HAWES would take that opportunity of stating that he had nothing whatever to do with the petition that was pre sented on Friday with reference to the Brighton Railway. Lord SANDON, seeing the President of the Board of Trade in his place, wished, as there was a variety of rail-road projects likely to come under the consideration of Parliament in a very short period, to elicit from him what course it was the intention of his Majesty's Government to pursue with respect to different railroads having a common terminus. He wished to know what were•the intentions of his Majesty's Government on that subject. Mr. P. THOMPSON said that it was not his intention, on the behalf of the Government, to submit to the House any proposal for favouring any line of railway, or to point out any rules for the adoption of the House on the sub ject. It was, however, his intention, in the course of the evening, to submit to the House the propriety of appointing a Select Committee to consider the best means to be adopted by the House, or by the Committees on Rail roads, for giving information to the House with respect to the various railroads that came before them. He had taken upon himself to adopt this course in consequence of the conversation that took place some nights ago._ It then appeared to be strongly the impression of the House, that it was necessary to adopt some course with reference to the different schemes com ing before them. Many Gentlemen then proposed the adop tion of different courses, but no decided opinion in favour of any particular mode. It therefore seemed to him, and in that opinion he had been confirmed by the conversations he had had with the gentlemen who took part in the discussion, that the better mode would he to have a Committee up stairs. His proposal, therefore would be, not to refer the railroads to any particular Committee, nor to point out any course the Com mittee should adopt, but simply to obtain the attendance in Committee of those Gentlemen who take most interest in the good conducting of Railroad Bills in this House. In a Com a h n et d erh amci s i t oo a dma t e i nm n y g i t t te o hHe p i e i nw n g i bb o e n ewl s hi i ‘ wv v ce l ho i du i el could oh aibwltdeopurptl:adrpko proposition te t ;toai b ncv e c before the whole House—(C r i es o es Com mittee up stairs there w ou ld b e an opportun ity o f putt i ng for ward g, fridi tre s uda moregr ibgsyee anysbt i e o gf r oo i sr good dt a e m ffi f i f—Hear, hear. misunderstanding had gone abroad, a n d h e was anxiousme to state what his object was in moving for this Committee, and to explain that his object was not to refer these rail-roads en tirely to the Committee, but simply that the gentlemen com posing the Committee should have the means of giving to the House some recommendation by which their course of pro ceeding should be guided, subject to the approbation of the House. He thought these - were matters in which the House of Commons must interfere ; it was, therefore, with this view that he ventured to put his notice on the paper of the House, as a Member of his Majesty's Government, because he thought that the Government could not be otherwise than re sponsible to a certain degree, for the good conduct of the H ouse in proceedings of this kind, and perhaps the proposition coming from him, not suggesting any particular course, but seeking the advise and assistance of the House, would be favourably received.—( Hear, hear.) In stating thus much in answer to his Noble Friend, he thought that if the House was inclined to adopt the proposition of submitting to them the nomination of the Committee—he thought it very desirable that the second readings of all railroads should be postponed for a short period. —( Loud cries of " Hear, hear.") He should endeavour to chalk out some rules to be adopted with reference to this sub ject, and more particularly to afford the House the means of judging ultimately on the third reading of the merits of each scheme. He therefore suggested, if, his proposition met with the approbation of the House, that those rail-roads which had been fixed for to-night or to-morrow should be post proceedings otherwise happen post poned only for e i g ht da y s.—( Hear, hear.) He did not believe that any inconve n i e nce could arise from so doing, an d h e was sure with reference to t he o p eration of these Com mittees that it was si m t h p a o t r t t h a this t Committeeso t od o icoHu7;, recommend h e a hear.) . It some might prior to the second reading , but if that had alread y tak en place this would be impossible. Be y ond this it mi g ht ha ppen that thought that the report of the Committee slibetld eiiibtaee other matters, and that it should be•something mord mere report. He thought that the Committee should inquire into the nature of each speculation, the probable grounds of sue , Cess, the number of share-holders in each, the number of land holders on the prOperty through which he_ proposed railways were to pags,•the probable sum which it would take to pu-chase the land required, and on what data the calculations were founded, The House would then have some satisfac tory grounds upon Which they could arrive at a proper coneluslon,- , -( fleet; hear.) The labours of the Committee ; he 'apprehended, would not be of long duration. They might meet immediately, and enter at dike Upon the en quiry, and, in the course of three or foot bays; they might probably be enabled to present their report. lie (6ir Peel) understood that there was also a proposition to post pone, for three or four days, the second reading of the Bills. Now, he thought that this would be a great hardship on the parties, as the delay would subject them to great expense. Mr. POULETT THOM ''ON made some observations .acres the table. Sir PEEL said that be would not then give any opinion on the general questnni. The SPEA KE R said the gut:fan before the House was , that this Bill be now read a ;;;eond time. Mr, POULETT THOMSON „;recd with the Right Hon, Bart the Member for Tamwortb, that it was necessary that the should have the fullest information , at.. that the Committee should inquire into all the details to whici; the Right lion, Gentleman alluded. He thought it extremely desirable that the House should be In possession of this infor mation before it sanctioned the Sills by a second reading, and it wrio ftir this reason he proposed a . postponement for eight days. If his Vrietifi (lt Member for Derby) stated that expense would be the consmitlenVii of the course of proceeding he had proposed, he should not aciViSil be House to adopt it, but lid 441 not believe that any inconvetthoce would result.— (Hear, bear.) uls agreed entirely with the irreportance of these roads, but ltd COneidered in the situation M which he was placed, it was his duty to look a little to the state of the country, and see that its property wits not improvidently squandered. He trusted, therefore, that the House would consent to the proposition of his Hon. Friend, and that he should receive its sanction for the course he had thought it his duty to adopt. Mr. CIJ RTE IS thought it his duty to support the motion of the Noble Lord, the Member for Liverpool, upon principle: With respect to the Brighton Railroad, he did not think be cause Mr. Stevenson's line had got the start, that it ought there fore to be the one adopted. In' his opinion, the House ought id decide upon that which was the best mode without favour or afi'ectlefl, He was however bound to say, that a large meeting had been held at Srighton, at which it vas decided, that another line was better for Prighton than the one now under consideration. He thought the best course was that which would be shortest, and would be attended with the least expense, which he understood the present would not : on gene ral principles he should support the motion of the Noble Lord the Member for Liverpool. Mr. E WART was fully aware that the object of his Right Hon. Friend was information to the House arid security to the public—( Cries of " Hear, hear")—but he was much afraid that the adoption of his proposition for a Committee would not be attended with the effects lie anticipated. It was true the House was bound to protect the public, but at the same time it should be remembered that there ought to be fair competition. He should support only such a course as would give security to the public, and to the parties who had vested their property in the speculation. Mr. D. W. HARVEY was of opinion that the race was not always to the swift. He had suggested the propriety of instituting an inquiry into the various plans of railroads now in progress. That suggestion was received by some with ridicule with some it was thought to go too far—with others, on the contrary, too short—and it was pro posed that all railroads should be allowed to take their course. He believed that great inconvenience and expense would result to the parties by postponing the determination of the House for so lotto- a period as eight days. The Right Ho n. Gentleman should,' he thought, be prepared at furthest on Thursday, to state what was the plan resolved upon by Government, and not, by any further delay, throw a general gloom around all the in terests involved in these speculations. He thought much of the railroad mania was the result of a crude and ill-consi dered speculation, and it would be almost well if all plans of that nature were postponed for another session, to allow time for sober reflection. An HON. MEMBER expressed his wish for the neond reading, and his desire for enquiry. Mr. P. M. STEWART concurred in'the view of the Bight Hon. the President of the Board of Trade. Sir J. GRAHAM said that what he would propose was, first, that the second reading should be postponed, and that in the interval, with respect-to the Bill in question, no petitions should be received against it ; and secondly, if on this day se'nnight the House should consent to the second reading, then that the parties should be allowed to go into Committee in three days, whereas they could not at present go into Com mittee for ten days, and that would place them in exactly the same situation as they then stood.—( Hear, hear.) Mr. GISBORNE and Lord G. LENNOX made a few observa tions, which were inaudible in the gallery, there being loud cries of " Question, question," and " Divide, divide." Captain AL SAGER (amid loud cries of " Withdraw, withdraw," " Divide, divide") said he hoped he might be allowed to say a few words, as he had had the charge of the second Bill from London to Brighton. The Noble Lord, the Member for Sussex, was in error when he said there was not a single dissentient from Brighton up to Croydon. In the course of a day or two be should present petitions from Brighton, Lewei, and Croydon against the Bill. He hoped it would not be permitted to be read a second time, and he should vote for the motion of the Vice-President of the Board of Trade. Sir J. R. REID thought the better plan would be to post pone the consideration of the question for a few days. The Gallery was then cleared for a division, but in conse quence of the new experiment being tried in taking the divi sions of the House, the doors of the gallery were not re opened after strangers bad been ordered to withdraw for fifty minutes. The numbers were as follows : For the second reading For the amendment Majority for the amendment 196 The second reading was consequently postponed for eight days. (as we understood) presented a petition from cer l ra r in ° pa ß rt p parties in favour (we believe) of the Brighton Rail way.—(The noise and confusion caused by Hon. Members re suming their seats and leaving the House prevented the possi bility of catching the exact import of the petition, or hearing the exact tenor of the Hon. Member's observations.) Sir J. GRAHAM was understood to object to the reception of the petition, and to move that it should be first referred to the Committee on railway petitions, pursuant to the Standing Orders of the House. The SPEAKER was understood to suggest the inconve nience of receiving petitions previous to the report of the Com mittee being laid on the table of the House. A conversation then ensued on the subject, in which Messrs. Hutt, Pease, Ingham, Hume, C. Wynn, and other Hon. Mem bers took part. The SPEAKER then put the question—referring the en tire matter to the Committee for revision—which was unani mously agreed to. The House was then occupied for a considerable time by Hon. Members bringing up private Bills, and presenting pe titions, none of which were read--the greater part of which appeared to have relation to rail-roads. We could only catch the titles of two presented by Mr. O'Connell in favour of the Drogheda railroad, and of two from Epsom and Ewing in fa vour of Stephenson's line of Brighton railroad. Colonel VERNER gave notice of his intention to call for a return of all persons in the custody of the Earl of Ossory, High-Sheriff of the county of Tipperary, under charges of murder, robbery, violent assaults, appearing in arms, forcibly seizing arms in dwelling-houses, administering unlawful oaths ; specifying and distinguishing the number of offenders in each class—also for a copy of the address lately adopted by a meet ing of individuals in that county to his Excellency the Lord- Lieutenant of Ireland, and his Excellency's answer (if any) to the same. An Hon. MEMItER inquired whether it was true, as re ported, that the Committee appointed to inquire into the cir cumstances of the affair connected with the Carlow election, and the application of the money alleged to have been paid to Mr. O'Connel for effecting the return of Mr. Raphael, was to be conducted with doors closed against the public ? Mr. M. R. COLBORNE (Chairman of the Committee) replied that the Hon. Member had been correctly informed. It was the unanimous opinion of the Committee that the ends 'of justice would be best promoted by excluding strangers and only admitting Members of Parliament. They had adjourned to next Monday, in the absence of witnesses, whom they hoped by that day to have in attendance, when they should at once proceed with the investigation with the earnest attention which the case demanded, and the House expected. Mr. O'CONNELL said, - I have heard with regret the de termination of the Carlow Committee to exclude the public, and it will be my duty to propose that when they meet again it shall be with open doors.—( Hear. ) TITHES COMMUTATION BILL, On this Bill being announced for reading the second time, Sir E. KNATCHBULL begged leave to impress on the Noble Lord who brought it forward that it would be very de sirable that the House should be afforded further time to consi der its provisions. The details had only been circulated on Wednesday, and had not been laid before the public in an analytic form till Friday. Sir R. INGLIS and Mr. ROBINSON said a few words in support of the propriety of giving further time to the country to consider the consequences of adopting this Bilk Lord JOHN RUSSELL did not wish to press the Bill through the House with any injurious haste—his object at pre sent only was to carry it through the stage of a second reading pro forma. However, it had already been before them for 14 days, up to to-morrow, from the time it had been first pre sented to the House ; so that considerable time had occurred in the ordinary course of delay. The present state of the Bill presented a mere outline, embodying little more than the principle ; and everything which might be desirable to propose in detail could, he hoped, be arranged by Hon. Members in the interim. He had no objection to name a further day than was at present before the House, if the second reading was not unnecessarily delayed. The Irish Corporation Bill would soon occupy thei r a tt ent i on to a cons iderable eaten!, and it would be very d es i ra bl e to comp l e t e this first, if possible. Sir R. INGLIS contended that even to advance so far, the Bill ought to be in the hands of all the members of the House which it was not yet. Lord JOHN RUSSELL said that it was his wish that the House on going into the Bill should have a perfect knowledge of its tendency; and at the day appointed be would willingly nn the mo-. - 13aronet postpone all discussion for 10 or 14 days more, tion, that the speaker do leave the Chair, the Holt/ .- cletliared that further time was nece. After a fert . words from Mr. FLumer ssa a ry g, Mr. SA:vs-oat,' ?lid Sir R. INous, • Mr. BEN ETT said That the subject had , in fact, been be•-• fore the country for the last i:velve months. It had been ver,o fully discussed and explained to the rmuntry, interested in the measure, and yet he had heard of no opposl" tion to the principle. He had had a communication Wit h a clergyman, who declared that he thought it very favourable to which was deee the cle(gy—(01), oh)—more vierfavourabe than they could ef: pect,—( Laughter.) He thought it a y material point Out' the second reading should not be delayed. Colonel TLI OMPS ON thought it would be for the advall" tlgtrof both the mercantile and agricultural intrrests, if t ra c o mmutltlon were to be divided: one half as a corn rate, the other haii as a money rate. Mr. PARROT decidedly favourable to the princ;,^lefer the 13111; but should gi:e notice , that in the Committee ° would move that 10 per cent. of the 25 per cent. reduction composition should go to the tithe Fqyer. Mr. PEMBERTON said that it wag an important questioo to consider whether a composition should be voluntary or corn; polsory, or both, as the Noble Lord had it ht present prov ide° in the Bill. • In this state of things he thoug ht it would 13e better to postpone the second reading. The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER thougV it better for the Hon. and Learned Gentleman, as he was f a " voui-ahle to the principle of the Bill, to wait for a discuss° of the &Jails in the Committee, which would be the P rop.! : occasion for L ,:•nsidering them. The object of reading 0 Bill a second time now was to have sein e amendments 108°_ in it, and have it re-printed and eirculat,Ni throughout On country. e ra s the Sir T. FREMANTLE had no wish whatever' to " f progress of the Bill, to the piiunciple of which he dm a ; vourable ; but he thought there ought to be a lonce r given to Members for communicating with their const.;lle7 on the subject, and then appoint a day for the general (115. • ,cussion. G OUL BURN wished to know if it was m erely in' tended to read this Bill a second time pro forma, preparatorl to going into committee ? Sir M. \V. RIDLE Y had received that morning a let t ° on the subject of this Bill from a very-intelligent Gentle tnel : in the country. The languag e in which the Bill ot described was certainly not very compl imentar y to the /gob!: Lord, for the letter stated the Bill !o b e in its p resent stal totolly unintelligible, and hi no degree creditable to the ft-oel, of it.—( A laugh.) Lord JOHN RUSSELL was desirous that the Bill gold be read a second time, and that the House s i;quid g? Committee on it pro forma. He was not at all sor e* as fettertP language in which the Bill had been described in the ig that had been read by the Hon. Member for Newcas tle, 0 was no easy matter to be perfect in the drawing of every 6 05 of a Bill like this, and he did not pretend to be so. Sir R. INGLIS shoulknot object now to the second read' fog pro forma, but he begged d istinctl y to be understood age not wishing to be included in the observation m ade by th) Hon. and Learned Gentleman near him (Mr. Fembert°,l% when he said that all on that side of the House were agroee the principle of the Bill. Lord J. RUSSELL said that any Hon. Member rnightt with perfect convenience, discuss 4 the Bill in Committee, slit he did not see why the Hon. Member for Oxford could , of bring forward those venerable argumeats which, no doubt, had in store in the Committee, as well as at any other th ee j At the same time he must say that in agreeing to the vel e reading it was understood that the House a ffi rmed the princiP of the Bill. The SPEAKER having read the Order of the lig for the second reading of the Rill Mr. GREENE rose to address the House. We undel; stood him to object to any provision in the Bill that we e allow of any individual landowner of d parish entering in t f . .A composition for his own tithes alone, w i thout being in the general composition of the majority 01 the pari i n du ct sh. It Mr. LENNARD doubted whether the avera n v o f sol e years would be a fair or satisfactory one, because the a e r t it) prices of produce during the last seven years were higher the average of the last twenty years. This would operate ri fairly to the landed interest. Things would ultimately of Pu their level, but he believed the present rate of tithe was ou t t i proportion to the increase in the price of produce. It w ell ' f' be unfair to take a rate of tithe much higher than the rate price. There was a very injurious practice prevailed of ag ree ; ing to a higher rate of rent than was actually paid. It w on the rent actually paid that the tithe ought to be cha r g e r ; The The Commissioners should take care to ascertain what wef . 0 2 e actual terms of agreement between landlord and te nse There was a point in the Bill which he could not clear l y u rn derstand. In one place 60 per cent. was taken, and 7 0 Id another. It would be better to ascertain what was the relic a mount of composition. This Bill had been called t it , Clergymen's Bill, from being supposed highly f avo urable them. There was certainly one provision in it somewhat e); traordinary. If the Rector permitted his tithes to rereela unpaid for two successive years, be might come for t he sece' d , year's tithe on the produce of the land. The utmost the w ble lord could do was to recover one year's ren t . Thus ion Clergyman had a great advantage over the landlord. merelysthrew out these suggestions with a view to the iroprw ls ment of the Bill before it came into Committ ee. The detsl a ought to be closely . watched, and abundant time should allowed for considering the measure. , Mr. BENETT also should call this the Clergymen but it did no more than justice to them. It was a just P s 1 His Hon. Friend said he observed a variety in the valuatiou• He should recollect that here the valuation was taken on tbd gross , j& per cent. being allowed for the risk of collection ar; of seasons. On the whole, 2 5 per cent. was a fair aTc'LTd of deduction. After this being made, the clergy rn e e - wa s be much better off than he was before. Certainly t here bet at present a variation ,?f 15 per cent. on the composition; , 0 perthe e ß e i r l i l t. p , ro it vi w de e d uld tl b ra e f ra wit se 7 the composition was unde r F. 4 per cent., it would be brought down ; 15 per cent. allowed as the expense of coDeCtion, and this certainly not too much. He was satisfied sv to that—where it wasvroaysetrowirs: fr t ., the he Bi ll. in its details proceeded originally net (Sir R. Peel); but this Bill wag an improvement eFf or his, by the introduction of the compulsory clause. It i res _..at the benefit of the country at large, and not solely on accuro of the landowners, that he advocated this msqlLsure. It would r e ight bring a great dea l of land into cultivation. if a man T he Hltocne.ll%. now to lay out 201. on the improvement of wnsi,e hie d s et would have to pay 51. to the titheowner, before he dek-ir.e spe profit from it. The Bill provided a remedy against th:.9.;106 cies of discouragement, and it would have the effect of inch ' men to lay out money in the improvement of land. • 10 Mr. PEMBERTON said, the only point in the princlPo of the Bill with respect to which there could be any differ e t e r of opinion was as to the measure being compulsory or to tary. They ought to he certain that the Bill was lik e eq t he effect the object proposed—that was, the commutation o f tithe for a permanent rent-chrrge. He hoped the result cf t he measure would be to convert, within a reasonable time , fah tithe into a permanent rent-charge by commutation. Se o f however, was the Bill from presenting any certainty„.o attaining that object thaf it would remain as a problernutl'ir after five, or ten times five, years as it was at resent. Dl there was to be compulsion at all, it ought to be the Ce., o lll Pbte sion of the Legislature. He thought h e could show the -17,cta Lord (J. Russell) that the Bill would not effect the o bi he proposed. It provided three several modes of doing t"1 The first was a voluntary agreement between the p a y s 0( tithe and the receivers of them ; the second wa s by Inakithe the agreement compulsory when a certain proportion of the tithe payers and tithe receivers consented; the third wes t .,ber interposition of the Commissioners, in cases wher e the A payer and the tithe receiver could not agree. The law &see, now stood, enabled the tithe payer and tithe receiver t o egr, e .. It seemed an absolute commutation. This Bill went to P h e vent permanence of agreement. Was it probable that • holders of partial interests would entail a burthen on the.";‘, selves for the sake of their successors ? With respectder , the second mode, he was afraid he did not accurately oi l es stand it. It'provided that when throe-fourths of the landoicill be and of the tithe receivers agreed, that agreement s houle ith a binding. When there was difference irt amount, betweci.,,Oi c r, receivers, for instance, between the Rector and the We a r, where the Rector had three-fourths, was he 10 bind the l ee n having only one-fourth ? The Bill made a dist; nc ti o n bet d id those interested in land and those interested in tithe . II they not understand on what principle this proceeded, when I s ed were making arrangements to have a certain proport ion of 00, pay its own proportion of tithes. He did not , however, etbe on g sider this very important. The Noble Lord said he hoped er o l time was not far distant when tithe in kind would n exist. The Bill certainly provided that the Com m „e. e , might interfere when parties could not be brought to ag r bo Upon considering who tithe payers and tithe owners were , `,, t , Noble Lord must see how fallacious this clause would turn ernf and how little likely his hopes were to be realised. 316 ,1 ) ; cases would arise, in which, fr o m age , f rom i n fi r mity, fr°, lll , - ot sense, the tithe receiver will no t b e a bl e , or , if able, Whi n - t or be willing, to undertake the necessary trouble. le_ e iglit cases the owner of the lay tithes might be a minor, he )4'l 0 be absent abroad, or he might be a lunatic. There. Ito provision in the Bill that the committee of the lunatic "' se ,, act, but there was no provision as regarded other ea de r Lands in this country were, in a great proportion, held lease. The owner of the land during the term of the L e t ,itl had in fact no interest, and what inducement therefore c, e o - 13 , he have to take upon himself the liability of tithes? „to posing, however, that all these clauses could be carried ; 0 0 operation, he (Mr. Pemberton) objected to those other CO o r which pointed out the mode in which the compulsory P mont was to be effected. The great object of the measu i re t be self was to establish harmony between the titheowner a n ; di' tithepayer, yet the provision to which he referred tende" tf rectly to interrupt that harmony, by allowing one P er i jot power of compelling the other to do that which he pa ° ; o f cdoismpopseeldlintgo lie d o d b anai pt y nd( .icuidvit a v ootsemgboxrrvrc: adverse; n e yeoe e epi eedpomo e dr tli n orvvabiei t aduect. Pemberton) complain fn,splo? co mmutation,tat n h hhti h y neethvol tc s aefab h nstyo o dhet t u hosehs l hewe d : eornnocl leciutwlehrchldrhdeaegonsi on the ha p ; I,ir o tob b e : 0 55 fbot 'i ot.ihotstil f t oe:: appeared nit o p a glb n t ee d u i allsetreelefrdcdat clergyman)l t e ttoht r h g e e t tyihTelmileai compulsory of a provision, which made the compulsory p owe r lie 01. . 1 00 the law but in th e individual mu st be to cause an interrurtue of that harmony which it , was the professed object e i the r - framers of the, Bill to maintain. The principle was °ei doO r wholly voluntary nor wholly compulsory, but opened the o pt to e endless di ssens i ons . All p ar ti es we re agr e e d that there b le a commutation of tithes.—( Hear, hear.) The SOLICITOR-GENERAL—What were the 183 3 eumstances under which the tithe question stood? I n the and 1834 t wo Bill s were respectively brought befbr. e o of House, having for their object the effecting a co na mutati o tithe, but which, from causes foreign to the present discuss