The Sun. — London, England, 1830-12-17 00:00:00

. 1 to employ the six clerks to assist in taking acenunts. Thr i . next office to which he would advert teas that of t' e Sworn Clerk, whose services might be dispensed with, and no great inconvenience followed. The next office was that of the Accountant General, whose watery had been Stated at 3,184/. It wax not quite so much, however, and be did not think that say reduction ought to be made In ,the salary of that officer, The next office was the Re. ‘ , pdrt Office. Ile tees heter refire astonished than when hr say ire return kept that i Mee, it sae a there copying office, and yet the tillOi:•ance to the laster Of the Report . . ' tillice ;Itit . no !tat than 4,6 80 .. /:a-u au' ' !n ISO enormous, that he scarcely could believe it to be correct ; but if it was correct, it very much rrquired to he corrected. It was absolutely necessary that the Report Office should be in vestigated : it ought to cost no more titan about 1,2001. instead of between three and four thousand pounds a year. He next approached a very important office i.--that of the Registrar—and nothing could be worse than the system there established. The Registrar Was allowed to take any number of clerks, who each paid him ahoht 1,0000. for the Outlier of stlctession, for title / folloWed is rot;ith,O of: 0: the lAgliest filace Without the slightest inquiry into their qualifications. Business had so accumulated that it was absolutely necessary two new Registers should be app•inted ; and what he proposed was, that each Judge in his own Court should name his own Register, taking care that he was properly qualified. Hs was inclined to think that they shined be Barristers i • and not Attornies; but whether the one or the other, their •competence ought to be duly ascertained. He did { not mean to deprive of their claim those hoar entit'ed in t the order of succession, but that their cothpeteace should I be examined, and those only selected who *ere found most capable. The accumulation ,of business prevented the attendance of the Regiatee, and this, non-attendanee , • heti been the subject of just complaint. The phblic ought not to suffer front the appointment of new Registers, anti 1 if four were not sufficient, six must be provided with the same emoluments now obtained by the four. He meant to suggest that the Registers should attend front ten to two in the morning, and from six to eight in the even . • ing. Great part of the expence of a proceeding in Chen ' cery now arose from the prepererous length of decrees, which, instead of merely giving the decision, included . , nearly the whole of the briefs of Counsel, copied at , • the east of the suitors, without the slightest benefit • to them: This evil ought at once to be remedied, by paying the Registers out of a fund to be formed by moderate, yet sufficient fees, to be vested in the ! . public, and to be dealt out , to the Registers in the shape of salaries: The vast price of • office copies ought also to be reduced; and they ought to be made useful to the parties, by being Written in a form which rendered heat legible. , At present only a few words were written upon each pa t ,., so that a bill or answer extended over a vast mass of paper. At present the Registers, in point of emolument, were nearly on a level with the Judges of the land, and it was quite time that they were reduced. He now arrived at a still more momentous point-..the Masters' Offices ; they had been a subject of great and just reproach ; . for though tilledthy most honourable, intelligent, and com petent men, they were the sources of great evil. The Masters were not responsible for the abuses which were of long standing, and had been transmitted and accumulated from generation to generat; on. Their salaries were only two hundred pounds a yeai, so that their principal incomes were derived front fees, and those fees were multiplied in every way by the prolongation of business before them. The first ground of complaint was that the attendance of the Masters was not soda as they had a right to expect from time amount of romuneratiun. The next was that they issued hourly warrants, which occasioned an almost indefinite repetition of them without arriving at anything like a decision. 'Thirdly, the Masters hat, and dismissed matters submitted to them in a private chamber ; and, fourthly, the parties were put to vast expellee, by being compelled to take office copies. He was happy to say that the Masters were so anxious for a reform of their offices, that the House might consider itself legislating with, and I , not against them. The Masters received only nominal ! fees upon the scale of estates, but the expense was never ! theless sometimes enormous. The Masters were called , . upon to attend the Lord Chancellor and the Master of the Rolls, which consumed their time, while it was only a mere matter of empty parade. This lie would abolish, . except in cases where the Chancellor or the Master of the Rolls thought it necessary fur greater dignity to require their presence, as, for instance, on the first day of term. ' Ile did not object to their attendance on the House of Lords, of which they were the proper messengers ; but the first thing lie would do would be to declare their chambere ~,I n , Veil Court, and citable them to sit as Judges, three • "Were at a time, with the assistanee of Counsel, deciding points submitted to diem. He proposed that they should • so sit fur three or four hours two evenings in every week, and that the causes should be regularly set down in the paper. , :The .hours' of business with the Masters had greatly, veried. In remote times lawyers were in West. minater Hall at five in: the morning ; and even in the • reign. of Charles 11. the Masters sat front seven to twelve I ' In the morning, and from two to six in the afternoon.— ! ' In 1798 they attended from ten to three in the day, and j,: faun five to eight in the evening; in 1816 the hours of business had been reduced to seven, and at present l . he believed, that, on an average, they were not more than five. Thus, as the emoluments aug. rotated, the labour was decreased. He wished to ro oters the time of 'sitting twice •tt week to seven hours, and if that were found too much for the present number of the Masters, he would reduce that number, by not supply. ing vacancies as they occurred. On the other four clays ,; of the week he would have the Masters' sit only in the 1.. day time fur six hour', viz. from ten until four. He next t tame to the question of emoluments. In 17 98 the highest ' sum received by a Muter in Chancery was 1 , 6151 ., and • . the low est 976/, but at present the income varied between ' f 3.8004 and 4,000/, His proposal was , that each Master '.• Should hav e a fixed salary of 8, 0001 . per annum , giving : , hint n o i nterest i n t h e pro l onga tion of a cause, and making : it the c ommon i n t eres t o f all to get the business before 1 i h them done. The emoluments of the .clerks had also in 4, creased surprisingly, until they now amounted to about 1 1 ,4001. a year. The regular fees amounted to between 5 001. to 6001. a year, and the rest was made up of gra tuities for supposed expedition. His intention was, that the salaries of the clerks should not be entirely fixed ; that . thershould have a certain income of 600 L, and the means of increasing it to 800/. by fees in matters of importance, , Where peculiar speed is required. Another object was, to Tot an end to the discrepancies in the Masters' Offices; - for although they were under the same roof, in every office different rules prevailed which suitors were bound to , know and observe. He wished the Masters.to meet... . t o itree upon a general body of regulations.-.to submit there to the three Judges of the Courts, and with their e lilirobetieft to establish them for the government of every Office, that in all the practice might be uniform. .He also, highly approved of the establishment of an Accountant's Q ffloit; but he 'wished the Accountant to be an • efficient Ilisora officer,. who might be referred to by the Masters en points of difficulty, and to be liable to appeal only wheasthe sum in dispute was large, or where some ques. t!ion' of principle was involved. By these changes he hoped to make the Masters! Office as much respected as t'• it was now reviled andcensured. He was anxious, also, ' to avoid th e expellee occasioned by the taking of affidavits , i -•' Within twenty miles of London, where the presence of a Master was always required, at the expellee of many pounds, !milks his fee of five guineas; whereas, at a outer distance, a Al at te r E x t ra o r dinary was considered otitheient, fuel time suitor was put to the expellee of only a feu' 'billings. He con s id ere d some of the appointments by the turd Chancellor highly objectionable, and among , .them thos e o f t h e S ecretar i es, w h o acte d as R eg i s t er s. It l • had long been the custom fur the Keeper of the Great Seal ; • to anpoibt attorneys in practice to such situations—he re .: leered particularly to the Secretaries for Lunacy anti Bank. ' . ru PtlY; the first of whom had,. an income of 1,3001. a• e y er, and the last of not less titan 2,700/. This custom ~ 40 $ only led to gr ea t p ervers i on o f j us ti ce , but it rendered . .the suitors dissatisfied with its administration ; and he : thought that the Noble Lard now at the head of the'Court . • of Chancery had much increased the evil, although he cer tainly was not answerable for the introduction of the abuse. lord Illdou had appointed an attorney in great practice a Buret ~ ary and a C omm i ss i oner o f L unat i cs , and et the little little of the app o i ntment not hi ng cou ld h ave g iv e n greater Veillisfaction than the union of those two characters. Lard Lyndhurst had named, as Secretary of Lunatics, it gentleman who was also a solicitor of goat eminence in the profession, of full business and of high character. It jet le mthis opini on , a nd t h at from'which he scarcely imagined . should experienc e any dissent, namely, that no Solicitor s hould hold a situation in the Court of Chancery, which ~: 'night supply a temptation to litigants to employ bioe in - tefertnce to others, from a hope that doing " mi g ht lead .., in . 4 j 4 v.oUrable decision. The appointment of the Secretary ~..."'_iiitnkrupts was particulerly open to the force of , that ob ,:. r r votron. With respect to the lately-appointed Secretary `'.;, tha Bankrupt caws , he had thus much to state, namely, k,thet gentleman did not think himself et liberty to ! Practise,, yet he thought his partner quite free to do so; ':' "uulUlw he would ask t h e H ouse w h e rein the difference !,, Was to be founds between the influence which any man might exert.-lee would Pay might; be suppose d to exert the decisions*by suitors for himself -° alone , yer or b yi .l Pa i rC f ne ti r i . e C°lntirallewerhteitnighteo acted topics, II begged it to be understood that be meant no hostile allusie* to the eharecter or conduct of the present Keeper of the Great Seal. He then, in expressing his •ense of the high qualifications of Lord Brougham, pro fessed that he was not infloinced by any,other qu i p strict ..onsidera ions of public duty.—(llere some remar.:: made !)ehind him called uff the attention of the lion. and Learned Member. )—lie said, he could not avoid hearing the Hon. Member for ABldlesea say, " here's a splash." He contended for his right of making the observations which he was makinv. and in the manner be adopted, without beitig Envie the subjeet of that sort of animad version. if; pot pfa.teetled. td say, that he lioptftl some c ourse would bp. adppted to tacilqate,thq great work of ac lcomplishing a Reform in the ..onreo(Chen9rj6. Nettling, he was 'satisfied, would prove more acceptable to the country at large, than to put the Court df Chancery on a sound and advantageous footing. lie could assure those Hon. Gentlemen on the other side of the House, from whom such a reform was expected, that they should ex perience no opposition on that side, his side of the House. He concluded by moving, 6 6 That there be laid before the House an account of the number of appeal cases, bills, de murrers, exceptions, and further directions, which stood before the Lord gidtteellite or the Vice-Chancellor, on the Gth November, 1.080." Mr. M. A. TAYLOR had ton much compassion— though he felt none for the Finn. Gentlemen who usually sat below him, but who were not now in their places—to detain the House by entering then into the abuses of the Court of Chancery. With the speech which they had just heard, or rather, with the results which it was likely to produce, if there was one man in the country who ought mere thin another to be gratified with them,that man was himself. Of the abuses of the tourt of Chaneery he had told them all,. or rather not all but some, Merely a few; hut now he bid the satisfaction of seeing the Hon. and Learned Geptleman below him, calling upon his Ma jesty's GovernMent to bringforwerd, the necessary alters. lions—now for the first time athiiitted on all hands to be necessary, while it must be full in the recollection of the [louse, that the late Lord Chancellor, in the course of the session, brought in two Bills, which he abandoned, and that the Hon. and Learned Gentleman himself also aban doned his own measures of last year. As to what had been said in reference to the appointments made by the present Lord Chancellor, he had only to observe, that that Noble Lord had done nothing but what had been sanc tioned by the example of every ohs of his predecessors; and why should not be, as they had dote, surround him self with men of honour and character, in whom he could confide? He was enabled to say this—that Mr. Vizard, the Secretary for Bankrupts, assured the Lord Chancellor that he would no longer practise in cases of bankruptcy or lunacy. Once more he would congratulate the House, and he tt listed he might in a peculiar degree felicitate him• self, that at length the country would, by common consent of all parties, enjoy the benefits of Reform. He should move that the debate be adjourned to Monday next. The ATTORNEY-GENERAL, iu seconding the mo tion for adjournment, said, that though his Hon. and Learned Friend had in some respects censured the conduct of the present Lord Chancellor, he had not advised his Noble predecessor, though a Meinber of the same Go vernment with his Hon. Friend the Member for Wey mouth, to avoid that course for which he was now censur ing the present Lord Chancellor. His Noble Friend had, in the several appointments which he made, only followed the example set him by Lords Thurlow and Erskine, by Lord Eldon, and by every Keeper of the Great Seal. It could not he for a moment denied, that the present Lord Chancellor had great difficulties to contend against, and though in meeting those difficulties he had felt himself called upon to appoint those, cud none but those, in Whom he could repose, yet in the case of these two gentlemen connected with his Court, the giving away of whose offi ces would have been to him a source of considerable pi tronage, he had not availed himself of his unquestionable power and authority,. hit had permitted those gentlemen to remain in the situations in which he found them. Not an iota of patronage had he availed himself of for the benefit of any one of his connections. Now more especially with respect to his private secretary, the fact was, that antecedently to that gentleman's appointment, the Lord Chancellor had not the slightest knowledge of him, and merely received him into that office from recommendations which gave him assur ance that the gentleman was well qualified. As to the Other secretaries, respecting whom some observations had been made, he must be allowed to say that the Noble Lord had no other choice but to appoint solicitors. It might be extremely desirable, if barristers could be found to fill them, to appoint gentlemen belonging to that branch of the profession ; bet there were few barrister* who were qualified who would give up their profession for the hazardous situation in question. Under all the cir• cumstances he hoped his lion. Friend would permit him' to say that it would have been rather better for him to have waited a few months, to see what the Lord Chancel lor could do, than thui to appear against him with what he might be perinitted to call premature condemnation. On occasions such as that, other persons having to speak of the present Lord Chancellor under the circumstances in Which be had to mention his name, might feel called on to pronounce a splendid !panegyric—he was, he trusted, incapable of betraying so much bad taste, but be would entreat the House and the country to look to the conduct of the Noble Lord ; and though he might not be sa practised an Equity Lawyer as the Hon. and Learned Gentleman opposite, yet he confessed that he should feel hithself most grievously mistaken if his Noble Friend did not turn out to be one of the greatest Equity Judges and one of the greatest Equity Lawyers that ever presided in the Court of Chancery ; if he did not, in a word, equal all the expectations which that House bad formed of him —if he did not fulfil all that was hoped from a man to whom no subject was too great for his comprehension, nor any detail too minute to elude his research ; of this at least he was certain, that no one ever entered the Court of Chancery with a more sincere and earnest disposition to adVance the great work of Reform, and to put an end to the abuses of the Court of Chancery. He really was unable to comprehend, from what had been said respect ing the "appellate jurisdiction, that it at all applied in any peculiar degree to the present question. That an appeal to the House of Lords would have been an appeal from the Lord Chancellor to the Lord Chancellor any more in present times then it was at former periods, appeared to him incomprehensible. Surely there were as many Law Lords now as at any former periods, and as able. 'There was 'no decision to which the present Lord Chan cellor might come, which, being appealed from, would not come under the consideration of Lords Eldon, Lyndhurst, and Wynford. ' He could not conclude without observing that whatever reforMs might be effected in the Court of Chancery,'all the honour belonged to his Hon. Friend the Member for Durham, and he could not but add to that remark, that if the reforms now so urgently called for by the other side were indispensable now, they Were re quired, thought it might be in a less degree, in the year 1810. He denied that the Cabinet—that the Govern ment, as a Government, had leisure or information to make a plan for the improvement of the Court of Chan cel, though they might willingly support any measure which should have for its object an useful and practical Reform. ------ - Sir E. B. SUGDEN briefly replied. Sir C WETHERELL' said, that the practice always bad been to appoint solicitors to the office of Secretary; and in the case of Lord Macclesfield's impeachment, when . any possible charge was treated upon against him, his ap pointing solicitors to that office was never once mentioned. Mr. HUME begged to explain to the Hon. Member for Weymouth (Sir E. all., Sugden) that what he had said, and what the Hon. Gentleman bad overheard, had been addressed privately to a friend that sat next him, and not at all intended to interfere with his speech. Ills friend had asked him what the motion was ? To which his reply was, that it was not a motion, it was only a splash.—(A largli.) If the Honourable Member for Weymouth wished to know what a splash meant, be would tell him 'he meant a speech on a eubject, but no motion on the speech,—(flear, hear, and a laugh.) He did riot understand how the lion. Member for Weymouth could accuse Lord Brougham, when that Noble Lord had scarcely taken his seat, while the Hon, Gentleman him self had sat for three yeats on the Treasury Reach as a Member of the Administration, and during all that time the House had never heard such a speech as had been made by him that night.. - -(Hear, hear,)-11e. Must say that it would have been more creditable to the Hon. Gen tleman, with all his knowledge and experience, to have called on the Ministry, when be was Solicitor-General, to assist him in remedying those abuses which he had now begun to point out. While on his legs lie would take the opportunity of saying that he 'had never been half so satis fied at any speech made by a lawyer in that House, as that which had fallen that night from the Attorney-General. -- (Ilear, hear.)--It was one which did honour to him as 'a lawyer, and which held out to the public that he would use his best efforts in remedying those evil" which he per ceived to exist. lie would venture to say that the Attor ney-General , w ould not _ be contrast to sit still for three years knotlaing.r,(llear,.bear.)—On the contrary, he had already begun to tell them of those abuses which he thought required amendment. Sir E. B. SUGDEN,begged to explain, that when he was in office lie had pledged himself to this measure, arid, therefore, what he bed: been doing .that night was wily more fully explaining that mown to the House. It was, therefore, too much to say that he had sat for three years on the Alinisterial sine without taking any steps on this subject. _ The debate on this-question was then adjourned to Monday next. .-!. I .I I TIACC i (I 4 ' The CHANCELLOR of the EKCHlV)",tiritidt,t4rd . his Bill to prohibit the growth ottobiceo in'lrelini to this day. • ' TRUCK - SYSTEM. M. LITTLETON brought in his ,Bill for the preven tion of theplyment of labourers' wages by tru c k. I t was. iced d firs t lithe, giiti otdpred to be read a second time on the, 4,l tli 9,1 . .T 4 Mil be &init.', ntlyr,,grtiersot thi,Ljay then (14044 of; Lind the House adjourned at Twenty Rliontes to Oiie: • TRIAL OF 'ii-IP:I*.IVii'MST.EiiS': EXPRESS FROM PARIS. COURT OF PEERS, Winmpsnar, Dr.c. 15. At ten o'clock this morning the important trial of the ex• Ministers commenced before the Court of Peers. The inCrttigg ►has told i airti snowy, consequently unfavourabl e to the congregation of tint Coniiderab i ie crowd in the streets. Numbers had, however, assembled iiefore eight o'clock in the neighbourhood of the Odeon and Luxem bourg, but the great mass of persons visible were Na tional Guards of all legions and grades. They lined every avenue, their bayonets glittered among the gardens of the Luxembourg, and the whole palace was in a state of ►iege. The court-yard was entirely occupied by the civil and mi litary authorities, who, with excellent arrangements, secured prompt ingress for The privileged fert who had ob tained tickets of admission to the interior. At nine o'clock the whole area of the Chamber of Peers was filled by spectators. The. Peers did not take their ieats before ten o'clock. The glanin of ibis belutifol Chamber corresponded with the solemn business of which i Was about to be the theatre; and in the internal arrangements a great alters• tion was made from its ordinary appearance. The Pre sident's chair was entirely removed, and in its place a square ap tce was allotted for a select number of the mem bers of the French bar, who sat to witne's the proceedings. The principal advocates of the Paris and provincial bar Were in attendance. On the right of the place allotted to the French bar, and on tie s'ot usually filled by the clerks of the Howe of Peers, was a commodious box enclosed for the pri soners, with four chairs provided for their accommodation, and a desk and stools for their counsel ; the accusing Ma nagers had a simpler box, on the other aide of the bar di vision. About one-third of the space on the floor was railed off for, the use of the Members of the Chamber of Deputies, who were in full attendance. All the small boxes behind the sears of the Peers were filled by those privileged from the different embassies, and the foreigners of rank who hail tickets. The small semicircular division behind the President's chair, which is commonly left open to admit Peers to converse with the President, was on this occasion enclosed for the use of Peers' sons, and Peers who were not yet of an age to qualify. The public had the semicircular gallery, nearly two thirds of which were railed off for the Journalists—the re mainder was filled by those who had tickets, so that in point of fact for unprivileged strangers there were found only four places. The filinisters of the King sat, as usual, in the front bench upon the floor. Tke Peers wore their full uniform, and among the spectators, officers of the Court, and Journalists, the greater number were in the uniform of, the _National Guard. For the first time in the Chain. ber of Peers, Members had their seats marked, as is the custom on nights of important business in the British House of Commons. The buildint• was completely filled, but tbo distribution of places was so mechanically correct, that not the slightest confusion prevailed. The accommodation for the public Press was on a scale which reflected honour on the Peers, and which struck forcibly, by its contrast, those who had unhappily expe rienced the desagremens attendant upon reporting the proceedings of a contemporary assembly in London. A tribune, or glsllery of two row. of seats, running nearly round the Chamber, was conceded to the Reportels of the various Paris Journals, amounting to fifty. But this was not all—the Grand Referendaire, in the kindest manner, allotted four places for Reporters of the London Journals, two of them for the Morning Herald. A few minutes after ten o'clock, and before the Presi dent took his seat, the prisoners were conducted into the Chamber by four soldiers of the Municipal Guards, pre ceded by Colonel Festamel, the Commandant of the prison of the Luxembourg ; they immediately sat upon the chairs provided for them. They were dressed in black, except Polignac and Peyronnet, who wore brown coats and coloured waistcoats. They entered the Court un covered, and bowed upon entering. Some gentlemen of the bar cordially shook hands with Count Peyronuet. They were not, however, seated more than a minute when, upon some intimation, Colonel Festamel withdrew them across the floor and through the same door of their entrance. As they were retiring in front of the box allotted to the Deputies, a number conversed for an instant with Count Peyronnet, and warmly shook him by the hand. The prisoner., with the exception of Peyronnet (who maintained a firm and cheerful demeanour) were very pale and wan. Chentelauze appeared like a man on the thresh. hold of the tomb. The fortune which had conducted Polignac to his elevation appeared now to have entirely deserted him ; he looked round with evident anxiety, but his eye seemed not to meet a sympathising glance. He is a man of very gentlemanly appearance, and his ravel) , hair gave a sorrowful hue to his aspect. Pulignac is 60 years of age ; Peyronnet 52 ; Chantelarize 43 ; and Geer,. non de Renville 48. At half.past ten o'clock precisely, Colonel Pastime' re conducted his prisoners to the bar; they were now fol lowed by the whole corps of their Counsel ; of the latter, Itlartignao took the lead. He did nut wear the probes sional costume of the defenders of the other prisoners, but wore his court dress as Deputy. As soon as the prisoners were seated, a number of wit nesses were introduced on the, floor at the right of the Court. The President then entered, and all the Peers took their seats in great pomp and order. The prisoners looked steadfastly at their Judges as they passed. Pry ronnet, who is a tall figure, with his arms crossed, and apparently at perfect ease. Polignac followed them atten tively with his eye, but no familiar recognition on the part of the Peers to the prisoners was observed during this ceremony. Polignae, however, at times conlerred with some of the gentlemen of the bar deputation, who were next his elbow. _ _ Silence being proclaimed, the President asked the prisoners in succession, beginning with Prince Polignac, their names, ages, and professions, as follows. The answers were given (except from Peyronnet, who maintained the utmost self-possession and naivete) in a plaintive tone, in particular by Polignac, who was at times scarcely audible. The tone of Chatelauze was that of a man entirely subdued by physical indisposition, The Court of Peers was then called over by the proper officers, and the Peers answered to their names. The Commissioners of the Chamber of Deputies, charged with the impeachment of the Ministers of Charles X., were in full Court dress. As the business commenced all the prisoners were furnished with'paper, pens, and ink, of which they commenced to make immediate use s with the exception of Chantelauze, who was evidently too weak for any personal exertion. The answers to the President's questions to the'prisoners were as follow _ _ . The President, to the Prince Polignac.—Monsieur Le Prince, what is your name, rank, age, and place of na tivity ?., FAIT . sac, name is Jules Amend Marie Prince de F. sae, Peer of France. Your age, Sir 1-50 years. Your dontioilis?.. , ..The reply of the prisoner was given by a sign of the hand, pointing to the adjoining prison, where ho had been so lately domiciled. Your profession ?—I have Mme. The President then put the same interrogatories to Count de Peyronnet, who replied. M. de Peyronnet—Mr. President, before I answer I wish to say, that I have already prefaced my interrolla' tories eliewhere by a protestation, which must be recorded by the Commissioners of the Chamber of Deputies, I wish here to record on your proves verbal, a similar pro. test. My namelis Count de Peyronnet, Peer of France, any nge SS years, ..My former residence and protest are correct)); given in the previous process. - Mr. President—The priejjler (officer of the Court), will take a note of that declaration. The same questions being repeated to Al. Guernon de Renville, and M. de Chantelattze, the former said be was a Deputy for the Aleipe end Loire, agedß )4ars, born , et Rouen; and that ,he wished to,have his protest, recorded it fore the Court in the iliac.. terms as that of. Count,. de Peyronnet. M. deChautelauze gave his age as before (43 year+), sour horn at Caro, formed} , Minister . oLPultlin Instruction, and then residing at the Ministry. lie protested likewise. Prince Polignac then rose and said— ,, t a lso wish to renew my protestations before the Counnissionere, and to have it here recorded," . . -- This conjoint Protestation will against the colPPetincY of the - Court to rpieation their acts by cothroand of the King in Council. ' • The Peers being all called ever, and same Owl' f waif complied with, - the President rose and said, " The De fenders of the prisoners know the terms of the Article 211 of the Criminal Code of Instruction. I desire they f;dl.4:l.lii Anita ta conform to them daring this bid." The Greifler t!teriireg,tl4 rtetfrd pf the proceedings of the Chamber of • Deputies on flee 2Tth,..efitet'ithet, and of the Chamber of Peers on the 28th of l7oVer4e4; to the process against the accused. • Mr. 'President —Accused—You are charged ' with having signed the ordinances of the with of July. You -will now hear this accusation read according to the forms (iresErilifd by the itst', and you will answer afterwards the ipiestioni which drtry to pot td you separately. The priioriers Pofignite add Pe)ireribet intilhed their heeds in Assent to this intiniation.• The set accusation saes then reid in due forM, an(f in the manner in AO has;:e Weed) , published it. It charged the Ministers with conspfrieti tritongli` ihe Moans of the memorable ordinances of -July, to oVeethroW the charter and lihet firs of the Ft ench people. M. l3erenger, the reporter of the Commission of Accu sation of the Chamber of Deputies, then torte - and addressed the Court. He said that the resolution and act of accu-: Seim": which they had just caused to be read against the ex-Minlsterti of "hailed R., It STaq fur them now to pro ceed upon. As the organ of ttie Cdtiiodsaioners, he said he demanded justice for the . violatioii, iyjr that &.! Ministers, of the law of France ; the attempt to (her, throw by an act of athitraty power her institutions; and fir the blood of her citizens so daringly and 'unlawfully shed. In making this appeal in behalf of the people of France, he begged to assure the Court of Peers, that the good cititerts of Pads, who had suffered so much in their struggle, tought for justice only, and th it justice in strict conformity with the law, the- jurisdiction Vf which they had reestablished. Ile had to accuse the ex-lifinisfere of violating the electoral laws, under tt!e form and pretext of a dissolution of the Chamber of Deputies, and to demand • joetwe'egamAt the perpetratcrs of theses crimes. The na tion demands, and had a right to demand this act of jus tice when I proie to you these etithes. It was, ;he knew, necessary that the tribunal which had to adjdge attest - a cause should be independent, that its free deliberation should be secured, and its judgment above all suspicion of being induced by fear or bias. Of this important cause they would so judge as to acquit their consciences with artisfaction to themselves, and then he had no doubt they would secure the according voice of their country and of Europe, which now kept its eye upon their solemn pro ceeding. He concluded by a strong appeal .to the Court to gtivern all its feelings during the progress of this trial, so as to secure the permanent ascend incy of the laws, the liberties of the people, and the punishment of those who should be convicted of crimes which shook, as these did,. the basis of society. The witnesses who had previously entered the Court, and among were M. Cassimir Perrier, M. Lafitte, and other eminent Memb:rs of Parliament, were here com manded by the voice of the Greffier to retire. The President to the Prince Polienac--.-You see, sir, the necessity which is now imposed upon you of repelling, in the best manner you can, this most serious charge. 'You are called upon to do so to clear your own conscience, if you can, and also to acquit the consciences of your Peers. Upon your entrance, on the Bth of August, into the Ministry, had you been for any time previous, acquainted with the intentions of King Charles X. respecting your appointment ?—No. Did you, when called upon, aid or forth that Ministry? —I had a list of persons sulanitted to the King, who chose those who were agreeable to his wishes. Was the formation of that Ministry preceded by several, or by any conferences, and was M. de Chalmers retirement discussed ?—I know of none of these confer ences. TI e selection was made by the King, as I have already mentioned, and the retirement of M. de Chabrol was the consequence, I believe, of differences respecting the person to be named President of the What was the nature of these differences ?—I can say nothing of the particulars which confidentially transpired in the councils of the King. What is the meaning of your distinction ? Justice re quires from you the fullest explanations, it is your duty to give them, both for yourself and your colleagues?—l cannot disclose the secrets of the council,• I have no means of furnishing the particulars which transpired therein. Who dictated the answer to the adaret;q of the Chamber of Deputies ?—I urn ignorant about it. Was there not, I ask you, some opposition in the council respecting it ?—lt necessarily gave rise to some ob servations and discussions. Was not the dissolution a the Chamber a measure long resolved upon?--From what epoch do you wish me to speak ? Was it not determined upon to dissolve the Chamber at the time of the prorogation?--No, it was not. What was the motive which led to the measure of di4ql,-. lotion?--The desire to have, as we hoped we should, a better Chamber. . _ • Why did MM. de Chabrol and Courvoissier retire from the Ministry?--On account of differences in the council, but not because of the oidinaece for the dissolution. Was it not because it was wished to give a new direc tion to the council ?—No. But there were reports made in that Council, were there not, respecting certain circumstances—you have ad mitted that yourself ?—To what circumstances do you par ticularly allude, and to ah it admissions of mine ? Did not M. Coureoi•sicr declare he would take no pert in these violent measures?—lt was after the report was drawn up fur the dissolution that be sail he wished to take no further part in the proceedings : of this Council. Why did you select for the Ministry MM. Montbel, Gi ps!, and Peyronnet ?—it was to give the Ministry inure strength of able speakers. What was the motive of the King to require the electors, by a reclamation, not to be hostile to the avowed wishes of the King I—To secure as far as poseible the inflame of his friends. Who Jrew up the proclamation ?—I don't know. Was it got you who signed it ?—Ye e , it was. [A number of questions to Prince Polignac followed, which were in prec►sely the seine terms as those we have already puhlished in the depositions before the Commis sioners, and related to matters of no groat importance.) Were not the secrets of the electoral votes violated by order 7—No, I believe not. A note being here triad to PidignAc at his desire, which it was intimated implicated him upon his long con sideration upon the ordinances, the Prince said —" I see nothing in this note to justify your suspicion. I see no thing to show that we did net wish to repose upon the forms and principles of the Constitution ; and in a report which I addressed to the King on the 7th of the eerie month, I proved-the necessity of resting upon the Charter. Where, I ask, is the proof that we wished deliberately to violate the Charter ? I see none in this note"—(handing it beck to the officer of the Com t). M. de Peyronnet hero rose, evidently to address the Court, but he was checked, and informed by the President that he could only be heard in his turn, when he should be fully heard. M. de Martignac (Counsel for the defence) rose, anti requested that no interlocutory remarks should be made in this stage of the trial, or indeed until the prOper ,time came when the accused could go fully into their defence, the thread of the interrogatories should not be broken, You have raid, that tip to the moment of publication, no part of the public was apprised of your intention re. specting the ordinances ?—I believe none. Precautions were taken to arrange the local command after their publlatifon ?—Yes • Were not the proper precautions taken?—No. ' Did you not on the 26th of July cause a cominuniCa.4 tient to be made to the King of the-public impression pro duced by the promulgation of the ordinances P—l can make no communication upon that head. Were not several hundred men, 600 or more, drawn up before the Tuileries?--Yea, it Alia I ordered General Wall to make that military deposition, on hearing that crowds were collecting in the streets. What councils did yOu hold during the three days There was Only a Couuthl , held on the Tuesday, the 27th of July. Did you deliver any orders to the military, and to the Prefect of Police?—No; I did'oot. Did you not give orders to the Proeureurtiu Hai, and also to break the presses of the Journals ?—No. Were you informed speedily .of the limiting out of the troubles ?—I was only informed of the opening tumult in the Basis Royal. • nisgrs D cwit;i i ltru4 d rrii y o.j o yn: t : t nu n ,t o ,iei t etiiis o t r . d c er iu t u l td e e o :e l e .li nt e i: y o: the Ord:lancet ? No, that was not in my province. the 27th ?—No. r ea l e v o th rk o t o r Ler y e o es f , th a e n intiaineulf,aucetsu4r,e)t:silvveenr-e. Were you not aware of the protestations of the Deputies tat .:the Tuesday was, Omagh the medium of the public papers. , • Dii! Y 4 14 give orders to arrest the .Deputies who had signed this. protestation?—Nn, 1 . 11141 "i' Did you not cause orders to be given. to the Guard Royal and the gendartnei to rept,' force by force, and put down the tumult in the Palaie !loyal ?—f deplore it* 414111 4 U tiny man can tho blood which has been abed I lament it deeply, and it Wait not caused by any orders of mine ; and I know it will be in proof before you hereafter that I immediately entre ,ted the King to revoke the ordioances, and offered tit once my resignation, as a peace- offoring to the resisting people. This will be proved In evidence. Then (lid 'you not give any tt: the troops to use foree?-11one whatever I declare. But if you bad given no order, there is a great diffieility in believing you could be ignorant that such orders were eiven; and if so, whet were the motives of your non-inter. feriner!'?' Who' galve otdete to the poliee for the illegal proceedings 7' , Z.l`h#lV pfteers, 1< strfrpage. Did you not give the h'ear thern given, to distribute 60 rounds of half cartridges' to`th,i troops ? No ; I had nothing to do with those matter& 'llVeyl were necessarily in the hands of the Marshal in command, Oho had declared Paris in a state of siege. The whole military roc f *as necessarily vested in him. twit it fa trat true you were a p irty to any of these military eiders, or that yen ever said to an officer in nea t-11'1mi, ss 'Volt will lire evety Where where you can and you wish to fire ?"—I never said sn, Did you render any account to the King of wit it passed on the Tu• dly ?—No, for I had no official correapondence upon the subject, mil could not therefore make official communicAtionv to hint reiattte to it. Did you know that the comb it tVat► then every where raging?--NO, I did not. Nor of the number of permits then killed ?—No. Nor that the shop were abut, and the armourers plun dered I—Nothing of the kind. Nor of the tir.. at the Exchange ?—No. Were you not soon apprik.gi of the re-assemblage of the Deputies at the house of M. Casimir Pettier, and of their resolution ?'.—Of none of it. Nor of the formal protest drawn op in their name by MM. Guizat, Dupin, %rifleman', &c. ?—I knew of none of tl ese details until after my arrest. You repeat, you bail no official communication with the king on Tuesday?—•.None officially, but verbally. What communication hitt:yr/I/with your colleagues?.-- We had a council on Tuesday evening. Who was it proposed to place Paris in a state of seigi? —I cannot tell that. Was aere any opposition ?—The proposal to place Parts in a state of edge was adopted. What reason Induerrl its adoption ?—The motives will be assigned in the defence, Wa the Owing Paris in a white of seige spoken of in the Council ?—No. At what boor on Wednesday were you at St. Cloud ? Eight, or half-past eight, in the morning. Were you infor►ned as to the state of Paris ?—No. Did you propose to the King to sign the ordinance plating Paris in a state of siege?--Yes. At what o'clock did you return to Paris ?—At eleven o'clock. Did you inform the Islaishal of the placing l'aeis in a state of siege?--Yes. Were the civil authorities informed of it?--It must have been so. Was it with the Council that the Marshal put himMt•ll in relation ?—With me and with the Council. (A noise having been heard, the President called silence, observing that the voice of the prisoner was weak, and that he could not be heard if the least noiss was mails.) At what o'clock on Wctinctolay did you leave the hotel of the Minister of Foreign Affairs ?--About two o'clock. What induced you to leave the hotel ?—The crowds were numerous. Did you make your determination known to the other Ministeis?—Theru were one or two of them with me et the time. Were, you info! ales! of the resistance made by the in babitants?—The information was not brought to me. Then you (lid not inform the King of what had taken place ?—I could not do so, as I did not know it till late in the day—towards eleven o'clock. I wrote that the movements continued, but I had no positive information to communicate. Did you communicate with.the °Om Ministers ?—Yes. Did you communicate with the Marshal ?—I asked hint what had passed, and what he thought of it. At what hour did you part with the Deputies at head quarters ?—ln the morning. Did the Marshal give you an account of the proceeding of the Deputies?—He made several observations to me on the subject. When I knew that the Deputies were with him, I caused it to be intimated to the Mitohat that I could not see them. He told me that the conditions they insisted on were the withdrawal of the ordinances. I answered that I could not take that upon me, but thst I would communicate with the King. I then sent an officer to the Deputies to say that I would see them ; but when I knew the conditions on which I had already made my answer, I did not think it my duty to see them. Did you take the necessary measures for publishing this ordinance 2-111 quality of Keeper of the Seals, it was i o f duty to send it to the competent authorities. Had the Council any sitting after Paris was placed in A state of siege ?—There was no meeting of Council after the evening of the 27th. Did you do nothing to stop the effusion of blood ? The placing Paris in a state of siege placed all power in the hands of the Marshal. I Could have wished to stop the effusion of blood ; but I repeut that I could do nothing to prevent it. • Were you acquainted with the proceedings of the De puties in regard to M. de Polignad ?—.He told me of 'it afterwards. • Did you inal:e the King acquainted with what was pass ing at Paris?-..N0; but I think the Marshal did. At what o'clock did you rejoin your colleagues on Thursday morning ?-1 cannot say precisely. What did you resolve on with them ?—We resolved to proceed immediately to St. Cloud, to require the recall of the ordinances. Did you not bone orelera to arrest several persons, amongst whom were tome of the Deputies P—Such orders appear, indeed, to have- been given, though not by me, and were revoked an hour after. However, it is not probabla that the Maishid would have taken such a measure of his own accord do not know who gave hint the orders in qui stion. After the departure of the Deputies, were you' not in. formed that the troops were depleting for the people; and did you not then say that the troops of the line ought to he fired itt ?—I do not remember having said any thing to that purpose. In the course of the evening (lid you not assemble your colleagues, in order to deliberate on what was to be done the next day, which was Thursday ?—No Council met since that inontent. Did you take every mesenre necessary to prevent the effusion - of blood?—No measure could he taken; for we confirmed to hope that the disorders would cease. Was the Cone Royale ordered to the Tuileries in conse quence of your directions?--Yes. Was this measure adopted in the Council have already 'observed that no Council was held since the Tuesday. By whom were you informed of the events which were taking piece in Paris N. de Remonville and d'Argoot. On hearing the reports of these two Veers, did you not retire With your colleagues to deliberate on the subject I certainly spoke on the subject with my colleagues, but I declare again that no Council was held. When the repeal of the ordinances and the 'Nominal of the Ministry were (ince decided upon, how did it happen that such a length of time elapsed before this resolution was made known in Paris, and did you make no opposi tion it ?.....When the King signed the repeal of the ordi nances, I immediately retired ; and from that moment I have remained a total stranger to the public Airs. Do you know if Ally tnoney waa given to the troops ? On the Monday they received none ; but I beard that those who were in Paris received some money on %heyday. In virtue of.what ordinance was that money distributed? —ln virtue of an ordinance emanating from the Minister of the Finances. Where, and by whom, were the orders given to dissolve the mil) of Sr. Omer the King, during the night between Wednesday end Thursday. The interrogatm 7 y was then ai4entleti during a quarter of an hour. The President to M. de Peyronnet.—You aro aware of the nature of the charges brought against you; it is highly important that you should answer clearly and without de viation to the questions which are now to he addressed to you. Were you acquainted With the measures which pre ce.led your accession to the Ministry No. Did you hold any conference with your colleagues relit live to the measures which were to be ultimately taken concerning the elections attended one conference pre vious to my accession to the Ministry. Was there not a scheme formed to effect 'au entire change in the system of eleetions?-4 believe that in the procetnlinge there eve moat eVijitylt.proots of the contrary. The only report to the King -0011e:subject is one dated the :14th of April, and which announcer on the part of the Government the formal iateution of maintaining She charter. Thicreport was Made a few days beforel became Minister._ Whit nintivet determined the King to appeal in person to the electors by the proclarnatien which preceded the electione?-4 do not het it toy duty to investigate the in. tedious of the king. However. it is probable that .~.--. ..iry,. hi nuisivl, were the •ami thews Which pr opted Louis XVIII. in 1820. Was The pi ociamation issued by the Council ?—Yee. Who drew it np ?—I am bound t rime no cue« Why wilt it slgntd by the Prince de Parise, and ►of by yourself ?-11eninste is was *might more proper at she moment. Were not many illegal rneasuros taken to influence the electiomt7-4 took no measure of tlts kind you allude to ; on the confrcr:? ; / :their opposed them. I shall avail myself of the prottre op ortonity to beg of the Court to allow my defender to rt's4 fhtt . only circular which D wrote. at the moment of the clectiont Ilennequin, defender of ile - Peyronnet, then read the elrettlor, in which the Alinitter'gave orders to th.t Pre. !facts to take every measure necessery, in order tisa the electors might vote freely, and in perfect security. de Feyroanet—l shall also be leave to enter hors some details, in eritvr to bring to light the sincerity ninny conduct at that period.- Of the Presidents of the electoral colleges, three were chosen id No Court, and now attend the prefent trial ; they thought proper to morph me on the speeches they were to make at tile opening of the Cullegts, and I hope that they will not refine trr shy toe justice by making known my answer to their demand., _ - Wets nn threats made use of against any public bine— tionary tub a should venture to oppose the intentions of the Government?--I can affirm positively that no menace was made use of by me in my relations with the public func tionaries. Were PM circulars addressed to the electors ?—I have been informed that several Prefects did address eirralails to the electors of theft departments, but they acted on this oeca.ion without my orders. Did not many violent disorders take place at Montauban nt the moment of the elections, and what measures did you stlopt to repreis tbetu?—Oa being Wearied that disorders had arisen at Montauban and at Figeac, 1 trammitted im mediate orders for the punishment of those who had dis turbed the public tranquillity. I am truly sorry that the orders in question have not been found, and I have already expressed my regret on that point to the Commission of the Chamber of Peers. The President-4 have myself written to Montauban in order to caua due researches to be made for the letters You affirm having Written, but the Prefect of that town has replied that all investigation has been unetiomumfu'. M. de Peyronnet-4 should wish thAike clerk's s the Ministry of the Interior, charged with that \pert of public business, should be interrogated. In signing the ordinances, did you yield to a superior will which prohibited the use of your reason feel sin cerely grateful fur the sentiment which prompts yens to make this question, and you will I hope do no less justice to the feeling which Obliges sue to remain sikut on that • point. As soon as the ordinances were published, did you inform all the authorities Owed under your orders of that publi cation ?—I did not think that any rigorous InetteUrCe would become necessary. The reports which were made to the Ministry only served to delude it. by a false and fatal seem ity. Were you acquainted with the troubles which took place in Pali* on the Monday evening ?-0n my way home, I saw a few groups, and heard several persons utter different vociferation,. To whom was, the report on the seizure of the printing presses addressed ?--(Ilea the President sent the report to M. de Peyrennet that he might read it. The letter, After examining. it, replied)—the documents reply to the question; I shall therefore beg leave to make no answer. 'Who issued the orders to disperse the Ant gotips?-4 do not know. At what period were the measures in regard to the ordinances concerted ?—Tbe measures were rooked on when the result of die dentinal' was known. Were there not journals which published erticlesbaVing this for their 'deject ?—lt is true there were journals which advocated the principles I bad professed all my life • but I can affirm that at this period the only journal whirl, con . taiued any articles of Imo, incessantly combatted oil coups Which of the Ministers oppoeed the publication of the ortlinancet ?—When this question was first put to me by the Commissioners of the Chamber of Deputies, I kept this silence imposed on me by duty, in regard to all that passed in the Kino Council. 0a the ocher band, it was neces sary to speak in favour of a colleague as unfortunate at myself, and also my friend. The Commissioners saw my reluctance : they triumphed over it. I told the truth. I do not regret it, but I roust add that at this moment silence is a duty. As the circumstances smiler which you listed uo longer exist, it appears to me that yon should now feel yourself at liberty to speak out ?—The oath I have taken is abso lute, end not conditional. I cannot think that misfortunes have absolved me of it. You were one of thou. who oppootil the ordinances eA Tula atotwer that tittrotitm. ilead you any .hart in thy prepsration of the report to the lug ?—Yea. Who was the author of that report can no t answer that question.• Who was the author of the 131%16am:ea at to the eke done ?—lt Was not the illegality of throe onlinsinees dilemma ?...... Even if I dust speak of what passed in the Council, I could ,not answer. Abet question. Who prepared the ordinance which named M. de 'flagon to the ~commend of the first military division h ot .. hut an imperfect knowledge of that ordinance, which was not in my province. Du you know if any 1111111114041 was Made to the people —I du not. Did you know that there wu a rotating of Deputies at Paris?-1 knew it afterwards. Did you moist At the Council ► which ball for its object the putting Perils in a state of siege?--Yes, Was that revolution definitive or eonditionel?—As far as I can recollect, a note was addressed to the Council, on. flouncing that the troubles had I►ce►e appeased. It was than useless to recur to such tt measure, it next day , the troubles had entirely ceased. That is et least what I always understood. Are you aware that measures were taken to make the people of rericacquainted with the fact that the town was placed in estate of siege?.—Ml passed as to t hi s ordinance and its execution is quite strange to me. I was not informed of what had taken plies till Wednesday evening. Did you take the necessary ineasnres for making your. self acquainted with what was posing at Paris?-1 re peat that the ordinance placing Paris i■ It state of siege united the whole power in a single hand. After that pe riod 1 had no means of station, and no communication with the authorities intrusted whit the execution. In returning front St. Cloud on Tuesday, I went to the Tuileries, where I expected to find my colleagues. Not inding them, how. ever, in their usual place of meeting, I learned by a !Ming whom I met et the Tuileries, that they were anombled it head-quarters. I went there, and found that the putting Paris in a state of siege was already resolved on. I had then no weeps of communicating with the Pretest of Po lice, who bad already been driven (runt his 1,,,t0. At what o'clock did you meet your colleagues ?—I can• not specify the hour. What deliberation* took piece at this Council ?—There was no council, for there was not an instant when the seven Alinisters could assemble. To whom was the direction of affairs entrusted cannot answer thst question. • Are you acquainted with an order gin% for the. arrest of certain persons, and particulerly of ieettrin,Peputies ? I was not aware of it actin time army Arst exinstination. It will eerily be seen, on referring to tfurboar, that I could not be acquainted with it. The President—lt is en that amount important to fix the hour precisely at which yen want to headluattere I hastened up stairs to change my clothes, and during that moment a conference took place, which hat been spoken of in the preparatory proceedings, and these who figured in it will probably be been, as wiritesees. After this I immediately set off for St. Cloud, anti on the rend I met the Peers., with whom I exehaused a few words. AI. do Ponytail came up the next moment, and we arrived alto- Whet at St. Cloud. Was not a council held at St. Cloud ?—A council was held on Thursday night, in which the repeal of the mai n/int:es was devilled upon. From diet moment I had no thing more to tin with the direction of pribliti affairs. I ripaireti to the Tuileries, Mitt, I expected to find some of my colleagues ; however, not finding Any there in the mind place of our sittings, I repaired to the lito Major. It was there I first beard that Paris had been pittred in a ,rata of siege; but I had no communication with the official authorities. At what hour did you nest meet your colleagues really du not recollect the tout hour. were your deliberation*, when you had 111411110111. bled ?....-There was some conversation ) but no counc il ; fur we were not all re-united. f the T n o ffa w ir i e l°l o n t tl '“ e a g c e :n e g i t d itn irec ov t i,r °u th: quyetion. Was it not within your kuowletiga that artier* W " givext to arrest several Deputit.s?—N o h it roost bit obvious from auy previous interroprories that I itoutti not liai e known such n circumstance., The 'resident - -1t ioit;pottkint la know ►he Prteim hour when you 'went to the Mjor• 7)41 you reader