The Sun. — London, England, 1831-02-12 00:00:00

IMPERIAL PARLIAMENT. ROUSE OF LORDS, FEBRU Rr 11. The Earl of SHAFTESBURIT presented a petition from Gloucester, praying for a repeal of the duty on coals carried coastwise. The Earl of RADNOR presented a petition from East wood, in Renfrewshire, praying for retrenchment and the extension of the elective franchise in Scotland. His Lord ship also presented a petition from a place in Berkshire, praying for an alteration in the tithe system. A petition was presented from Bridlington, in the East Riding of the county of York, praying for a repeal of the assessed t txes. A petition was presented from Mr. Johnson, praying for an extension of the time allowed him for prosecuting his claim to the Annandale Peerage. The Earl of CAERNARVON presented a petition from magistrates, landowners, &c. of a district in the county of Meath, against the granting of large pensions by the Crown, and praying for a revision of the pensions already granted ; and for a repeal of the assessed taxes. REFORM. Lord FARNHAM presented a petition from Navan, in the county of Meath, praying for Reform in Parliament, but upon a principle in which he could riot concur—he meant vote by ballot ; and the petitioners prayed that the duration of Parliaments should be confined to three years, and that all householders should have the right of voting. He seized the occasion which the presenting of this peti tion offered him to say a few words on the subject to which it related. He was not one of those who held the opinion that the actual distresses of the country arose out of the want of Parliamentary Reform. But he was satisfied that an opinion that such was the case did prevail very generally throughout the country; and be had no objection that the subject should be considered. The Noble Earl at the head of the Administration had notified, on the first night of their Lordships' meeting after the recess, that 3linisters had taken up the subject, and had prepared a measure which, as they conceived, would effectually at tain the desired object of Reform, without giving any just cause of alarm to those who were anxious to preserve the institutions of this country. He did not at present ask from the Noble Earl any information respecting the details of the measure; and it was not with a view to elicit anv such information that he now adverted to the subject. But then it was of the greatest importance that their Lordships should have the fullest and most accurate knowledge of the present state of Parliamentary representation, and that the Most authentic information on that head should be lairs before them, before they were called upon to decide on the merits of the new plan. It was to be lamented that in.. formation of this description had not already been pro duced on their Lordships' table; but as it was not already these, no time ought to be lost in procuring it, in case the Ministers still entertained the purpose of bringing their plan before the Legislature at the period which had been alrea•ly mentioned. He did not know whether, in order to precure the information required, a Committee of Inquiry ought to be appointed, but he was convinced that some thing ought to he done to bring the present state of the representation in the fullest and most authentic manner before the House without delay. He was aware of only two ways in which the object could be accomplished ; the one was by appointing a Committee of Inquiry—the other was by procuring the most ample supply of documents re lative to the subject, so that when the new measure came before them they might be enabled in the most effectual way to compare the present state of the Parliamentary re- presentation with that which would he established by the plan now to be proposed by his Majesty's Ministers, in case it should be adopted by the Legislature. It would be, therefor e, very gratifying to him if be could learn from the Noble Eal that he intended to lay on their Lord ships' table this desirable information before they were called upon to discuss the new measure, in case it should pass the other House, and come into that of their Lord ships. Unless the most ample information should he laid before them by Minister?, lie himself would be dis posed to move for the necessary documents. He should be very sorry to be obliged to interfere with the course which the Ministers wished to pursue in reference to this subject, but he did think that it was desirable that their Lordships should have better information than that which was to be collected from newspapers, or from Red Books or Black Books. There was a great variety in the elec tive qitalifieations of the electors for the great bodies of counties, as to which last alone their Lordships had already sufficient information. But in many places there was a great variety of qualifications, and there were perhaps com paratively few who had an accurate knowledge of scot and lot, potwalloping, and other qualifications of that sort ; and it appeared to him that they ought to have a full view of the whole. As he had already said, he should have no objection to have the question considered ; but he should certainly be disposed to stop the progress of the new men. sure until their Lordships were in possession of the infor mation which he had mentioned. Earl GREY—Nothing could be more proper, or more coneiderate, than the resolution of the Noble Lord to ab stain et present from requiring any information froth his Majesty's Ministers as to the details of their me isure on the subject of Parliamentary Reform before it came regularly under the consideration of this House, when the whole of the plan might be fully and fairly discussed. If he, (Elul Grey) had thought that any more 'preliminary infermation was requisite than that which the Legislature must have acquired in the course of the forty years, during which the subject had been under discussion, he should not have failed to call for such information. But although there Axas a great veriety of elective qualifications in different places, he considered that the whole was now sufficiently well known to enable the two Houses of Parliament to com pare the two systems, and to come to a sound conclusion on their merits ; and he was, besides, of opinion, that he could not bring before their Lordships accurately in the shape of returns the description of information which the Noble Lord required. But if the Noble Lord did think it de/dr:age that such information should be had, and would move for such documents as might appear to him best cal culated to elicit that information, he (Earl Grey) would be inclined to give his assent to the motions—provided, however, that they did not interfere with the progress of the measure, which in every view ought to be submitted to the consideration of the Legislature with as little delay as possible. Unless the motion of the Noble Lord for documents should occasion an unrea sonable ielay in the consideration of the subject, he should not be disposed to stand in their way; but it was of the highest importance that at this moment no delay that could be avoided should take place in bring ing under the attention of the Legislature a subject which, according to the Noble Lord's own admission, had made a deep and general impression throughout the empire. It was obviously highly desirable that the matter should be speedily and thoroughly investigated and settled, that men's minds might be set at rest on the subject, and the general agitation composed. As to the other course of proceeding mentioned by the Noble Lord, viz., that of an inquiry by a Parliamentary Committee, that was a mode to which be confessed he felt considerable objection. It was a course which he himself bad often proposed, and the objection that had always been made to it was, that tliic would be only setting on foot an interminable investigation, calcu lated to loosen opinions, without any great chance of lead ing to any precise or beneficial result. He thought at the time that there was much in these objections, and it had therefore become the object of Government to keep clear of these objections, and with that view they late thought it best to submit the measure at once to the Legis lature in the shape of a Bill. That Bill would be dis cussed on its merits, without keeping the public mind in suspense on a subject which had made a deep impression on the great mass of the community; so that public con fidence might be restored, and an additional impulse given to the causes of public prosperity. It was on these grounds that the Ministers acted, and it was for these reasons that they had adopted this course in bringing the measure under the consideration of the two Howes of Parliament—first under the consideration of. the other House, where it was, in every view, des i rable that it should originate, and next under the consideration of their Lordships, whose sanction he hoped it would receive. The Noble Lord had referred to what he had said on the first night after the recess, and he now repeated that the measure had the unanimous approbation of the Ministers, and the sanction of him, without whose approbation they, as Ministers of the Crown, could not have brought it forward. And he did entertain a san guine hope that the measure would be found effectual for its purpose, and at the same time restrained within such moderate bounds as to be susceptibl e of being carried into exe cution without danger to th e institutions of the State. The Noble Lord himself had the temp er and good sense not to call for any information as to particulars etpere:eonutici and such informa tion, i f it hail been called for, he not have been disposed to give ; and neither on this nor on any future occasion would he say more on the subject until the Bill should come under discussion is its regular progress through Parliament. He repeated that if the Noble Lord thought proper to move for documents, if the linotioa should not produce :endue delay, and interfere with the progress of the measure in contemplation, he would in terpose no difficulty in their way. A petition was presented from the parish ot f e t L Andrcws i , Norwich, praying for a repeal of the Assessed Taxes, Fed a petition from a district in Norfolk, praying for an quiry ireto the condition of the labouring classes, and for the regulation of the wages of labour according to the price of corn. Lord FARNHAM presented a petition from the cork cutters of Dublin, praying for a repeal of the Union. He found, be said, that he had mistaken the object of the peti tion from Nayan, in the county of Meath, which prayed fortheimposition of a tax upon absentees. Lord GOWER presented a petition from Milton, in Staffordshire, and from a place in Devonshire, praying for retrenchment and the reduction of taxation. All the petitions presented in the course of the evening were laid on the table..—Adjourned till Monday. HOUSE OF COMMONS, FEBRUARY 11. Several private Bills were forwarded a stage, and a number of petitions for the repeal of the duty on coals were presented. LUNATIC ASYLUMS. Mr. BRISCOE moved for a return of the number of private and public lunatic asylums, and' the number of persons confined in each.—Ordered. Alderman WOOD presented petitions from the Ward of Cripplegate, praying for a reduction of taxation and Re form in Parliament, and one fi om Malmesbnry, which stated that the petitioners were of opinion that the House of Commons was badly corrstituted, and praying for a com plete radical Reform. —(Laughter.) The Hon. Member presented another petition from the farmers and graziers visiting the Annual Cattle Show, praying for relief from tithes. A New Member took the oaths and his seat. Mr. EVANS presented a petition from Leicester, pray ing for the abolition of capital punishments. Sir M. S. STEWART presented petitions from Stir ling, Greenock, and several other places, praying for a Reform in Parliament. IRISH AFFAIRS. On Mr. LEADER'S presenting a petition from a parish ; in Ireland (the name of which we could not learn), on the 'subject of distress, . An Irish Member gate notice that be also should be • obliged in a few days to present a similar petition from his constituents, complaining that they were actually perishing for want of food. O'GORMAN MAHON should take that opportunity to question Government respecting a late affray with the police in the west of Ireland, in which a life had been sacrificed. He had already stated that 3,031 individuals were suffering under absolute starvation in the county of Mayo, and he had now to add, that at a time when the people were in a state of natural excitement under the influence of such dreadful privations, the Magistrates of the country were aggravating their calamities and rousing their indignation, by acts of ferocity and despotism. rn the county alluded to a Magistrate, only a few days ago, had threatened to shoot the Rev. Mr. Hughes, a Ca tholic Clergyman, whom he had the impudence to call " a bloody rebel" publicly, although the Rev. Gentleman was at the time doing his utmost to preserve the peace in his parish, and promote the tranquillity of the country. Such exertions, however, he feared, would prove unavailing, when the recent bloody declaration which had emanated from the Treasury bench came to be known generally throughout Ireland.—(Cries of " No, no.")-- The Member for Limerick might bawl " no, no," but he would say, "yes, yes ;" for torrents of blood most indubitab'y would flow if the House did not interfere betimes to pre vent it.—(Coughing and blowing of noses.) Another Mayo Magistrate had threatened to rush, at the head of a band with " open arms," into any assembly that should meet with a view to petition for a repeal of the Union. Was language like this to be any longer endured by a people possessing the slightest particle of bravery and spirit? It assuredly would not, but he trusted that Go vernment was not prepared to follow up the prosecution of Mr. O'Connell and his friends under a bad, bloody, and unconstitutional act.—(Loud cries of " Hear.") • He fully understood the conciliatory spirit which was conveyed by those cheers, but would nevertheless conjure Ministers to stop these abominable prosecutions, and retract their bloody minded expre ssions .--( Order, order ! Chair, chair!) The SPEAKER here rose, and addressed the Hon. Member, who he was sure would perceive that such lan guage was highly offensive, indecorous, and unwarrantable. —(Cheers.) O'GORMAN MAHON had not meant any offence, but merely employed the phraseology which most appositely expressed the sentiments which he honestly entertained to. wards his Majesty's Ministers. Their declarations were, in his opinion, [goody declarations; but God forbid that he should think the gentlemen from whom they had proceeded more bloody-minded than himself. If Ministers imprisoned Mr. O'Connell, he would be look-•d upon as a martyr by his fellow-countrymen, and the table of the House of Commons would creak beneath the weight of petitions for his libera tion. Fully 7,000,000 of hearts would insist on going into prison along with him, but it was to be hoped that Govern ment would relent, in consideration of his being the father of a family. Mr. STANLEY was sure the House would not deem it necessary that he should reply to the speech of the Hon. Gentleman.—(Hear.) He presumed, however, that the Hon. Member intended to ask a question touching the death of a certain individual to whom he had made allusion. On that subject he had only to state, that the party in question was one of a band, some of whom were armed, and that the result of the coroner's inquest left it very doubtful whether the police were at all implicated in.his death. O'GOIIMAN MAHON then referred to the expressions of the magistrates already noticed. Mr. STANLEY disclaimed any previous knowledge of the language complained of. Mr. BROWNE also denied having heard that any Mayo magistrate had said what the Hon. Member ascribed to them, and therefore doubted the correctness of his infor- ma!ion. O'GORAIAN MAHON replied that what he had men tioned was publicly stated in a Mayo paper, with the addi tion that Mr. St. George, the first magistrate, had actually stigmatized the priest of the parish by the epithet of " mad dog."—(oh, oh.) Sir S. O'Mealey was the other; and Government would do well to remember that it was by letting out such tyrants as these that the people were driven into insurrection in the year 1798. [The truth of this assertion was questioned by another Hon. Member, whose name we could not learn.] Lord EBRINGTON insisted that gentlemen in the com mission of the peace, if accused at all, ought to be ar raigned on a specific motion, and not attacked with vague vituperation in an incidental discussion of this nature.— (Hear.) The measures in prcgress against Mr. O'Con nell were, in his opinion, absolutely necessary, and he was quite willing to abide by his full share of the responsibility incurred by their adoption.—(Cheers.) After a few words from Sir J. BURKE, the petition was ordered to lie on the table. [The Hon. Member for Clare has returned, since Tues day, to the Opposition side of the House.] THE FINANCE. The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER moved the Order of the Day for the whole House to go into a Committee of Supply. The SPEAKER having left the Chair, and the whole House having resolved itself into a Committee, The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER said, I rise, Sir, on the present occasion with great diffidence. I feel I am undertaking a task, which gentlemen, however much accustomed to it, might have felt extremely difficult, but which I, who have not been accustomed often to enter into a statement of long detail, fee' more peculiarly difficult. I am quite certain the Comm.ittee will give me credit for saying, I shall not be inclined to detain them longer than is absolutely necessary. At the same time 1 am afraid henourable Members are aware I shall not be able, during the time I may detain them, to relieve the dryness of the financial details. It is my intention to state to the Committee, on the pre sent os;.easion, the financial plans which are to be submitted to the ronsidirution of Parliament. I have taken a very early opportunity of d oing this, knowing the anxiety of the House and of the country to be informed upon the s ubject. I have taken the opportunity so early, that on taking what is the statement of the expenditure of the present year, I find the estimates of the whole are not yet before the House but, nevertheless, I shall be able to state the rough totals we intend to name as composing the finan cial statement. Before, however, I go into the statement, and detail tie aiteeation in the financial state of the country which it is nty intention to submit to the House, I shall take the liberty of stating ,-he.t . rthe Government have been about with respect to reductions since they have been in office. We have not been in office long enough yet to be able to propose to the House all the reductions which we hope to have it in our power to make ; hut already have we ascertained that there are many reductions we shotrld be able to effect more im mediately, but the greater part undoubtedly requiring le gislative measures to enable us to carry into execu tion. I shall state to the House now some of the names :i of the offices we thi n k we can re d uce without detriment to tiro public pert/ cp, j[ shall stat e th em , Si r,—and 1 wash' the House to understand me not as stating them in the way of producing any general immediate saving to the public— still as producing something —not, however, so greitt a something as might have been expected, for undoubtedly it will be necessary to provide for the persons thrown out of office by making them an allowance. I shall state them and submit them to the House, principally as effects the patronage of the Crown. The offices of the vice -treasurer of Irerand, the lieutenant. general, the clerk of delivery of the ordnance, the auditor of the civil list, the treasurer of the Military College, the treasurer of the Military Asylum, and the resident sur veyor,—iM all 63. Then tite King's stationer of Ireland, and four clerks of the privy seal, with other hands on the establishment, two victualling board commissioners, two commissioners of the navy, the superintendent of trans port,t, the paymasters of the marines, seven officers of the dockyards, besides seventy-one persons in the dock-yard, holding places of from 601. to 6001. per annum, the hus band of the 41 per cent. duties, one inspectorship of stamps, owing to a vacancy at Manchester, the receiver general of Scotland, forty-six receivers-general of Eng land, the commissioner of sequestration for the claims of the sufferers of St. Domingo, and the paymaster of the American and Dutch officers,—in all 210 places, which might be reduced by the assistance of the legislature.— (Cheers.) My Noble Friend at the bead of the Colonial Department considers that he can adopt -all the recommendations we may suggest as to inquiring into the colonial establishment of the country, and he is also sure that in going through the other offic a similar reductions can be made. The Lord Chancellor is like wise of opinion that very considerable reductions can be made in his department. Thus far, as regards the patronage of the Crown; and when I have been taunted with sayingl thought tbeGovernmentought not to be carried on any longer on the principle of patronage, this is the answer I make to that statement. Having said so much, I now apply myself to the financial statement. The mode in which I estimate the supplies is the usual mode— that is, I shall compare the supplies with the revenues of the last year, and then make such propo sal as seems to me right. The amount of charges for the present year are 46,850,000/. I mean with the interest of the debt, Exchequer Bills, and the whole of the charges. The income of 1830 amounted to 813,060,0001. ; but from this there was to be deducted the amount received for taxes on beer, cider, and a part of sugar during the last year, which will not be received this year, which would reduce it to 47,150,0001. Then deducting from that 47,150,000/, the charge which I have stated of 46,850,000/., the sur plus which remains is 300,000/. Sir, I have never been an advocate for a large sinking fund, or a large surplus revenue, but I do admit that 300,0004 is coming rather too near the mark. I know that lam about to address the House under an expectation on the part of the country that great reductions of taxes are be made—an expectation which, though not founded upon the state of the revenue, is nevertheless well founded upon the ne cessities of the country ;—and as much as possible a considerable reduction of those taxes must be made which press on the country. I do not know that there ever was a period within my memory in which a reduction of taxes might be made with much greater effect, and with far greater relief, than at the present moment. It is when the manufacturing industry of the country is going on in a steady progressive state of improve ment, that a reduction of taxes affecting that class of people must be productive of great stimulus and encouragement. Now the object I have in view is, of course, to relieve as much as I can the poor labouring classes. How, then, is this to he done ? Is it possible to do this by taking off taxes that press directly on them ? lam sorry to say it is not, for I re gret to state that their situation is such that they con sume but few taxable commodities. I believe the b.st mode of relieving the labouring classes of this community, or of any community, is by giving them employment; and the only reduction of taxes there can be made is to reduce those that can be conducive of affording them that employment. It is with this view I have considered attentively the whole of the taxation of the country, and though it is impossible for me, in the present state of the finances, to reduce to any large extent taxation, yet, I hope, I shall be able to propose such an altera tion of the mode in which the taxation is levied, as will give great relief to the industry of the country, and promote the prosperity of all our industrious classes. Looking at the taxes I have classed them three ways. The first etas that requires the attention of Government are those taxes which by . their largeness in amount diminish the receipt of the revenue; that is to say, where they are so large as to diminish the consumption of the article. These are the first that ought to be attended to. The second class is that which is composed of those which press unequally on the population —taxes which press on one part of the community and not on the whole. The third class of taxes impor tantly requiring to be attended to, are taxes interfering with the manufacturers, and taking much more from the people than they can allow. It is upon these three classes any man considering the state of the country will lie of opinion we ought to' act, if he wishes to reduce taxation for the improvement of the state o f the rottntry. Having stated these as the ge neral views on which I mean to make the financial statement, I should not do justice to the Hon. Member Apposite for Queen's County if I did not acknowledg e that I have taken a great deal of my statement from his calculation. I shall now first enumerate the taxes! mean to reduce, and then state the amount which the revenue will be reduced by taking them off. In the first class the first tax, which by its amount does not produce so much as it ought, I• clearly think is tobacco. On looking through the receipts of the to bacco tax, the House mill find it has varied in a most ex traordinary manner, exactly according to the increase or diminution of duty upon it. I propose to make a considerable reduction in the tax upon this article. It is not only that by making this reduction the revenue will suffer but very little in comparison to the relief that will be afforded, but it will have the effect pretty nearly (indeed as far as my in formation goes entirely) of putting a stop to smuggling. Great relief will be afforded by this reduction not only to England, but particularly to Ireland, where the article is con sumed to a great extent by almost all the lower classes of society. I propose then to reduce the duty on raw tobacco, which is 3s. to Is. 6d. ; and a duty upon manu factured tobacco which is 9s. to 4s. 6d. Before Igo farther, I may just advert to a motion of mine, which is before theHouse,respecting the growth of tobacco in Irelanil. I do not mean to prohibit the growth of tobacco in Ireland ; nor do I mean to afford it additional protection to what it now has. To afford it protection would be to encourage the growth of it; and I do think it could be encouraged without affording it great protection.—(Hear, hear.)=- Now, Sir, there is another tax whi c h I mus t con f ess I have always strongly objected to, thouai it does not imme diately press on the industry of the labouring classes, yet a tax which presses a good deal on the diffusion of knowledge. I refer to the stamp duties on news papers, and the duty on advertisements. I propose, Sir, with reference to the tax on newspapers, which now is 4d., with a discount of 20 per cent., to reduce that duty to 2d. without any: discount. With reference, Sir, to advei tisements, the duty on which at , present is 3s. 6d. . I propose to reduce that as follows :--On every advertisement not exceeding ten lines, I propose that one shilling duty be paid ; above ten lines, a duty of half-a-crown.—(Hear, hear.) I now come, Sir, to speak of those taxes that press considerably on the lower classes : and th e fi rst t ax t o which I have to call attention is, the duty on sea-borne eo4l.—(gear, bear.) This, Sir, is a tax that bears di-. rectly on the labouring classes, by increasing the expense of their fuel, and it presses in a much greater degree on the growth of manufacture. In considering this tax we must look to it as affecting England and Ireland, and I trust that in taking off this tax, I shall not be considered as having placed out of view the interests of Ireland. I in tend, Sir, to tal:e off the whole of this tax.—(Great cheering.) —Th e House will see by this, and what I have further to say, that I have considered those taxes which press on the lower dames and the manufacturing interest. I shall now refer to a tax which produces far less revenue than what it takes out of the pockets of the people. I refer to the tax on tallow candles. This tax, I also propose to repeal altogether. The next tax is one that also contains every objection which can by possibility attf ch to any tax; I refer to the taxes on printed calicoes. This produces a revenue of two millions, placed on the productive interest of the country, while the article, of which it is composed only produces 500,000/. This, Sir, is a tax affecting that particular class to which 1 have been refrgring.-- It is consumed by the poorer classes, and I have no doubt the House will think with me that it is a tax which ought to be taken off. Another tax to which I have applied myself with great attention, as it is a tax on productive in dustry, is the tax upon glass ; and I doubt not when this article is removed from the trammels of the Excise that the manufactory of an article so important in life will go on with prosperity when combined with a reduction of the taxes on sea-borne coals. In this case, the manufacturer must pay duty on the whole body of the article he manu factures, whereas when he has any thing ornamental to produce he must cut away a great deal of that commodity on which he has paid duty. These, Sir, are the taxes that include the reductions. There are several small taxes— about 163 I believe—which do not produce above 2,0001. those will be taken off. Of these I will only men tion the auction duty on the sale of land ; from this the revenue derives little benefit, while it is productive of much inconvenience to the individual. Now, Sir, I shall first state the amount, as it would appear, of the money that has been received on these taxes. The receipt arising from the duty on tobacco amounted to 2,800,000/. ; the reduction of one half left 1,400,0001. The receipt on newspaper advertisements amounted to 389,000/. ; Oil stamps, 150,000/. ; the . reduction on there will be 190,000/. The repeal of thesduty on coal and slates-- t hy-the-bye, I forgot to mention that I also projansed to take off the duty on slates)—but this repeal occasions a reduction of 830,0001. On candles, of 420,000/. On printed calicoes, of 500,000/. On glass, 600,000/. On auction duties on the sale of laud, 60,000/. On the miscellaneous taxes, 80,0001.: making in the whole a reduction and relief to the people of 4,080,000/. I now come, Sir, to where I shall state the mode in which this deficiency to the revenue will be provided for. In endeavouring to provide for this, I have been anxious to pursue a course that would not interfere with the productive industry of the country. The first tax which 1 propose to increase in lieu of the taxes which I have taken off, is that on wine. At the present time, French wine pays a duty of 7s. 3d. per gallon. Other wine 4s. 10d., and Cape wine 2s. sd. Now, I propose to equalize the whole of this duty at ss. 6d. Although by this means there will be a considerable rise in the duty on Cape, ) et, I believe, gentlemen are aware that that is a wine of which the consumption is but small. The consumption of wine in consequence of this tax will not be diminished, and I consider that the whole of this duty of ss. 6d. will give about 1,840,0001. Now, heretofore the average receipt of those duties amounted to 1,585,000(. Therefore there would be an increase to the revenue of 250,000/. I can then fairly take this sum from the re ductions I have stated—namely, one half on the tobacco duties, 1,400,000/. ; on newspaper advertisements and stamps, 190,000/. ; on coals and slates, 830,000/. ; on candles the reduction, by the way, will not be 420,000/.. because, in consequence of representations made to me by the manufacturers respecting the heavy loss of stock which would be caused to them by any sudden alteration in our system, I have been induced to defer the repeal of this tax until the 10th of October; the reduction, then, on this article may perhaps be taken at 200,000 i. ; that on printed calicoes at 500,000/., on glass at 600,000/., on small miscellaneous taxes and the auction duty 140,000/. The next tax is of an objectionable nature. It is a tax which I most strenuously advocated se veral years ago on the Committee of Foreign Trade. I have always thought it a tax that ought to be increased. I refer, Sir, to the tax on timber. At the present moment that tax stands thus. On rough European timber there is at the present moment a tax of ss. per load. On Canadian timber 10s. ; but, strange to tell, when this same Euro pean tim b er is cut up into deals, it pays 455. a load, while that of the C icadas, in the same condition, pays only ss. 9d. a load. It is quite true that, speaking upon prin ciple, timber is not a fit object for taxation ; but as the custom of taxing it has prevailed so long, and as it is one of those articles exceedingly difficult to smuggle—(Hear, hear, and a laugh)-1 think lam justified in maintaining it. I propose, however, to modify it; raising the ss. per load on rough European timber to 20s. (thereby continu ing the advantage to the Canada timber), and thinking it a bad arrangement to have a heavier tax on the rough in t terial than on the manufactured article, I propose to ad vance the duty on the Canada timber in deal to 30s.— three times the duty on it in the rough state. This change I calculate will go to increase the revenue to 760,000/., or say 660,000/. These, Sir, were taxes interfer ing smith the manufacturer. I now propose a tax, the greater part of which will be drawbacks, for I would be sorry to touch a staple manufacture in any way which could be hurtful to it. I have decided upon taking off 500,000/. which pressed on part of a manufacture, and now my object is to spread it over all. I propose, with this view, to impose a duty of Id. a lb. on raw cotton im ported into this country, and to allow a drawback of Id. a lb. on all manufactured cotton exported. I have ewer tained from those possessing practical knowledge on such subjects, that there will be no difficulty or expence in the collection of this duty, and therefore no objection can be urged against it, founded upon an apprehension of such contingencies. lam aware that there is an objection to laying a tax on raw production, and true it is, the greater part of the duty on the raw cotton will be drawn back. This will leave an amount of taxation of 497,000/. The next tax I intend to alter, and from which I expect considerable revenue, is the tax on the exportation of coals. As the tax at present stands on that article it is 17s. 6d. upon large coals, and 41. on small. Now what I propose is, to equalize this by imposing a tax of 10s. on all coal exported. I ex pect, Sir, a revenue from this to the amount of 100,000/. The next tax, Sir, which I propose will be on steam boat passengers—(Cries of hear and laughter)—the tax that I mean to lay on is for passengers under twenty mi'es Is. a head; from 20 to 30 miles 25., and from 30 miles and upwards 2s. 6d. This tax, Sir, I expect will produce 100,000/. annually.—(Hear.) -1 cannot see what forcible objection there can be to this tax. I have con sulted a gentleman, who I consider a good authority on this subject (Mr. Deane, of the Custom-hous e ) and he considered there would be no difficulty in collecting it— neither does he see any objection to it. I now have to take another view on a different point, I allude to auctions on the sale of all landed property, I cannot see the pro priety that there should be, as at present, a less tax on the sale of small estates than there is on larger ones; I there fore intend to lay a tax of one half per cent. on the transfer of all landed property by public auction.—(Hear, hear, hear.)—l do not see why the higher classes should not be taxed to the full extent of all others, neither do I see why the transfer of one kind of property should be taxed and not another, I therefore propose to lay a similar tax on all sales of the public funds.—(Hear, and cheers from all parts of the House.)—Th e tax that I mean to propose is half per cent., or ten shillings, upon every hundred pounds bona fide transfer of stock.—(Hear.) But, Sir, it is not my intention to tax the transfer of stock, where it is only done for the purpose of giving security to raise a loan of money. lam aware of the delicate nature, and the excessive difficulty of the subject. It may be fancied that danger may arise from this. Ido not think so. Ido not think this proposition affects the interests of the country more than the income tax. Before that tax was imposed as now, the property in the funds was pro tected by the same words, declaring that no taxes, impo sitions, or charges whatsoever, should be laid upon it. And yet Mr. Pitt, when speaking upon the income tax, argued that there was no infraction of pub:ie faith when he did lay on the tax, and declared that the property in the funds should pay its share. It may be said, Sir, that this is only a beginning, but we have the security that we lay the same tax on land as we do on the funds. We do not tax land to the exclusion of the funds, as on transfers of all descriptions of property the same tax will be levied. The House will bear in mind that Ido not propose to tax the transfer of stock, when it is only transferred as a security for a loan of money. If I did, it would be a great inconvenience to the com mercial world. I therefore give the privilege of excep tion in such cases. It now, Sir, becomes me to state what I expect ti derive from these taxes. From the tax on the transfer of landed and funded pro perty, I calculate will be derived a sum of 1,200,000/. From the tax on transfer of stock about 800,000/. and from land somewhat under 500,000/. From wine, 250,000/. ; from timber, 600,000/. ; from cotton, 500,0001. ; from coal, 100,000/. ; from steam-boats, 100,000/. ; making in all 2,730,000/. To recapitulate —the income 1830 was 47,150,000/. This is the in come as reduced from the 50 ,056,616/. by the taxes which were repealed. The estimated expenditure of this year we take at 46,700,9001., leaving a surplus of 450,000/. I showed my plan to a man this morning, and lie observed that the moneyed interest would not like it, but that the manufacturing would. I replied that I should be happy to give satisfaction to both parties ; but that if it was only destined to satisfy one, I should feel great pleasure in finding that one to be the manufacturing interest, which was so intimately connected with productive industry. I hope the House will consi der that the taxes to which I have applied myself— namely, the duties on coals, candles, printed calico, glass —have been well selected, as impeding manufactures, and preventing the employment of the labouring classes. I trust I am not wrong in making a bold experiment (I ad mit it is a bold one), but still one attended with no real danger. All calculation seems to prove that the plan I suggest will succeed ; and, if it does, it will raise the pros perity of the country to a great extent.—(Loud and am. '. ~: tinned cheers.) The Noble Lord then moved a vote of 2,000,0001. as t rans f er o f a id s; also, to vote 25,577,600/. to pay off Exche quer Bill s charged on aids 1830 and 1831; also, 38,800/. to p a y off Ex c h equer Bill s i ssued for public works and building churches. Mr. GOULBURN said, he felt exceeding difficulty in approaching a subject branching out into such a great variety of heads. The proposition he had just heard greatly astonished him. He never thought that he should have heard such a proposition from that Bench. .He felt the deepest regret at the Noble Lord's proposing a breach of faith with the public creditor ; he was sure, if the Noble Lord had read the clause in the contract between the creditor of the people and the State—a clause repea'ed in every act—he (Lord A.) would never have made such a proposition. The Noble Lord observed, that the exten sion of the income tax to the fundholder was in defiance of the protection he was entitled to by the bond. H e (Mr. Goulburn) admitted it. He would call the atten tion of the House to a subsequent clause in one of the statutes, referring directly to the subject now under consideration. le that clause, after describing the mode in which property of this kind should be assigned and transferred, it was stated, as a condition that no charge whatever should be made on such property. The words were, " And that no other mode of assignment or transfer of such property shall be good and available, and no stamp duties whatever shall be charged on such trans fers or any of them, any Act of Parliament to the con. trai'y notwithstanding."—(Hear, hear.)—Could there be a more specific engagement cm the part of any Government? Could there be a more binding contract than that which he had just feadin the words of this Act of Parliament— (Hear, hear) ?—Did it not seem that the lender of money to the Government, foreseeing that his money might at some time or other be made the subject of duty, had thought it necessary to stipulate for this particular condi tion in his favour, and to prevent the imposition of a duty that would diminish the value of his property thus ad vanced for the purposes of the government ? In his opi nion the fundholder had foreseen that attempt, and had tried to pi event it ; and as long as he (Mr. Goulburn) had a voice to raise in the fundholder's behalf, he would raise it to declare that the fundholder was entitled to the benefit of this exemption, and he would enter his protest against any imposition of duty on property of this nature. —( Hear, hear.) In his opinion this measure was a viola tion of public faith—it was an act of injustice; and, like all measures of that kind, it would prove as impolitic as it was unjust, and would be productive of nothing but injurious consequences to the Government.--(Hear.) Had the Noble Lord considered the extent to which these trans fers would go ? It was likely that he had, because by the estimate he had formed of the probable amount of the tax, he had proved his knowledge of the rapidity of the trans fer of such property.—(Hear, hear.) What, he could not refrain from asking, what was it that gave a value to funded property in this country over the funds of other countries but the readiness of transfer ? Was it not the facility with which individuals who held that property could, without loss, bring their property into the market and dispose of it ? It was that which gave to the funded property of this country a sort of character of a circulating medium, and made it a source of internal prosperity. When the Noble Lord recollected that, did be think that that tax would not interfere with the present condition of funded property, and of the arrangements made with respect to it ? that it would not have the effect of placing our stocks in the same position as stocks of other countries ? and, finally, that it would not interfere, not only with the value of funded securities, but of every species of mercantile secu rity in the country ? He called on the Noble Lord to look how this change would operate on those institutions which that House had often thought it their duty to en courage.—(Hear, hear.) The Parliament had thought fit too, by the provisions of a Statute, to hold out pro tection to certain institutions formed for the benefit of the poorer orders of the community. They had directed that the collections of Savings Banks should be in vested in the funds, and that from time to time tl.ey might be bought in or sold out as the necessities of the case and the advantages of the institution required. The Noble Lord must be aware that the whole proceedir.g consisted of buying in when it would be proper to do so, and selling out when the party was in need and dif ficulty. The Noble Lord should remember that at pre sent these purchases and sales might be made for the benefit of the poor man five or six times a year, and then he should consider whether these sales would continue, and what inducement beyond the mere pleasure of buying and selling could now remain, and that every other ad vantage was to be sacrificed for the supposed benefit of the Government. He thought, indeed, that the amount of benefit the Government would receive would be hut small, while he was convinced, that, not only with reference to those institutions to which he had referred, but to others, the tax would be a serious evil. That evil, too, would affect all private persons, who, possessing capital, did, under the present system, invest it from time to time, and dispose of it again as their particular exigencies required. The tax would operate not only as a cheek to the great moneyed interest, but it would repress those very in terests which the Noble Lord, by the remission of some parts of taxation, had stated, and he (Mr. Goulburn) be lieved had stated truly, he wished to relieve.—(Hear, hear.)—He was convinced that the operation of these measures would be more to repress the industry and we?- Lie of the classes the Noble Lord intended to relieve than the reduction of taxes would give them assistance and be nefit. He should therefore implore the Noble Lord to re. consider th it part of the arrangement which he now sub mitted to the House—to pause before he adopted a depar ture from the strict adherence to contracts made by the Government with the public creditor—an adherence always the characteristic of this country, and which had made the funds of this country, not only with these who resided here, but with those who were natives or residents in all other countries, to be considered the safest and the best public funds in Europe. What he had said upon this subject had not been well connected and digested, because he had had no opportunity of considering the sub ject and preparing himself, but objections appeared to him to arise in every direction. The Noble Lord mu.t see that one of the effects of this tax was, that it would give an advantage to the dealer in foreign securi ties. Let the Noble Lord inquire how interest in fo reign funds was transferred here, and how, in making these tranfers, they avoided that taxation which the Noble Lord was about to impose upon ours. In this latter poin of view he was naturally drawn to another branch of subject, to which it was impossible he should not call the attention of the House. The Noble Lord proposed tha; we should commence the prtsent financial year with the prospect of only possessing at its termination a surplus of 450,0001.—a surplus to be obtained, not by taking known sums of revenue, and showing their amount to exceed the known expenditure of the country, but by estimating what would be the produce of the new taxes, and of those which had not been abolished or reduced. He must say, that he thought this was a very dangerous c.mrse.—(Hear, hear.)—About this time last year the Hon. Member for Callington had thought that he (Mr. Goulburn) acted in a most hazardous manner when he withdrew a certain amount of taxation. That H o n. Me m b er t o ld hi m that he was making a hazardous experiment with the resources of the country in leaving so small a surplus ; and that in so doing he was departing from the precedent afforded by all former Chancellors of the Exchequer. He hid an swered that accusation by showing that, from the sources of revenue on whi,:h his calculation was founded, the sur plus would be, not 450,000/., as stated by the Noble Lord, but 1,600,000/. ; and that, if be was not much de ceived, that estimate of the surplus would be found to be still higher from the augmented gross amount of those duties on which reductions had taken place.— (Hear, hear.)—He must, however, remind the Noble Lord that he then admitted, that if he did not receive the augmentation he expected, it would be the duty of Parlia ment to look to the state of taxation ; for lie acknowledged that they were bound to take care that there was at least a probability of the Government having a surplus of at least three millions at the close of the year. It would certainly be difficult and hazardous to say that the Noble Lord was able to calculate for the first time what would be the result of the revenue for the present year; but he must say, that if the House should sanction the project of the Noble Lord he believed at the end of 1831 it would be found that we were without a surplus at all, and that we should be under the necessity of raising Exchequer Bills to meet the demands on the Government. —(Hear, bear, bear.) He feared that the Government would entail on themselves that which of all others was the worst system of carrying on the finances of the country. The mode adopted by ..the Noble Lord would be gratifying to the classes of people in the country whom it appeared to relieve, but who would afterwards find that fresh burdens must of necessity be imposed upon them in order to 'move too close a competition between the reve nue and the expenditure. He felt sure that the Hon. Member for Callington, to whose opinions he had before adverted, would not heslUte on this occasion to lend the sanction of his authority in support of the objections which he (Mr. Goulburn) had just stated—(Hear, hear)—and would join with him in urging the Noble Lord to adopt a course that would he likely at the end of the year to place before them a picture more consistent with the public in terest. When two topics of such pre-eminent importance arose out of the speech of the Noble Lord, it was scarcely possible to enter into a minute exami na ti on as to t h e parti cular taxes which be proposed t o remove , or as tQ those which he now recommended them to Prill e : rs i details m us t come separately un d er the OW the House at a future period, and he Should !l e o , self till that ti me b e f ore h e attempte d t o 0; , g 1 aminition of th e d eta il s. B ut w i t h reePe c ti - 'pi the matt ers i n th e N o b le Lord ' s speec h he nitilrieblel he thought there was, in the arguments-of thcAi;lito s )me degree of inconsistency, when he exP pr o ble removal and his i m p os i t i on o f taxes . The „„ Raid b e remove d t h e taxes on printed eott°44 ti l l t ,xes press e d h eav il y on the limn- clase.ea:i, „tie; same time, the Noble Lo i d s t a t e d his inteotti tlx a duty o n raw cotton. Th e N o bl e Lord toel ° o e% duty because it w as b ur d ensome , th ou gh i S that it could only affect one garment of the Po toto i while he imposed a duty on all the plain c°t ' s vo, country ; and be did not think that the [W r aro ceive half the benefit from the one that they " 7° st d injury from the other. Nor was the ar guele op $ 1 Noble Lord as to the inconvenience of keePing, bs t li, establishm en t f or t h e co ll ect i on of a sma ll duty, 'eV paid the expense of collection, quite consisteegool by which he defended the imposition of 3 dil t ;tl 3t ! cotton. Wh en h e propose d t hi s re d uct i on °r 010' a relief to those articles which were the P 1740 indestry of the people, his arguments could ec7,odel conciled to what he did w ith respect to the t' for, on i ncreas i ng the duties on timber he tenors the labour and the comfort of the peoP le ; e e duties cou ld on l y add to the expence 0 h ob, With respect to the repeal of the taxes on gla g4 t ier, say nothi ng more t h an that he took it, thatii lll o. 0 gained in gl ass wou ld b e lost in timber.-7(Vf e 0 laugh.)—His obj ec t i n r i s i ng t h en was W ea1 : 1 64 loss of time, the a tt en ti on o f t h e House to P 4L- 0 I duty which h e h a d fi rs t b roug h t under t b e i r 11 V1 entreated the Noble Lord t o rea d t h e S ta tute ' t o, 070 1 tsined the contract between the Government ed . , ~, holder, and, before he conclusively deterroi' posing this d u ty, t o see w h et h er h e cou ld s atist/Z o i ti '' satisfy that H ouse , or , w h at ' was more di", whether h e cou ld sat i s f y t h e country, that it '..tlittal with a d ue regar d f or t h e public faith, and 0I f ie j , mercial and m one y e d i nterest o f the country, t°Slro duty on th e t rans f er o f property in the public...lV Mr. WARD said he w as t a k en b y sur p r ise Ur. positions of the Noble Lord,. so that he wa s i t collect his ideas i n suc h a manner as to e xprees i ll s "j fully on this subject; but he was able to asselli , assert, that it was not possible for any one-,tmeasure with more de c id e d h os tili ty than he ~,(r, pose this tax on th e t rans f er o f f un d ed prop ertP,,, ill hear, h e ar.)—H e t oo k th at opportun i ty o f ste°P:io, all the bold measures he had ever heard proPr it the walls of Pa r li amen t, th at tax was the boitl,e6;ol present conv u l se d s t ate Of Europe, that the u 4 , should cont en t themselves with a surplus ine°:__., ° i 400,000/., w as a ma tt er o f t h e greatest aston is h even if lie were assured of the continuance o f t should say that it was part of a peace polier eP surplus of a more decided kind: Such bad beelL IP ciple on whi c h Pi t t, F ox, an d Tierney brit.? proceeded ; and i n 1819 a reso l ut i on of I';'sie had declared, " That, to provide for the;,;d of the public service, the reduction of the no --- if S'; Plti4-e'trett and the relief of public burdens, it was absolu te soD' tat t' 0 the sary that there should be a surplus of not le°, der ei 1 acth - millions." The last Committee that had CO'n , 11', et ea e Prl subject had taken the amount of necessary s°ll ;,, 11 15 :, 41 1 , / three millions, and that opinion of theirs had he etl f d,,' t cNl,„,: 4t en up to the present time. The object of a sinkingt I ,,t' Iss t , ,, - rew not only for the benefit of the public creditor, it: bi t, 4 ti v' I advantage of the country at large, by means O', if i)'. ' lll O ‘',',":. , !urplus income, that at those periods when the 1° 0 ( 6 ! r ise - leel in-erest rermitte , r, Alinisters should be able O f pcpi ' l 4p or ' t 5 d tountry a considerable annual expenditure, by e • it ll ' ' b °4l ltri e e d v 11 change in the pu'•lic funds, as they had done , f t , .}' tl ' last year, when they effected a saving of three-9u Or Is th 'e I' a million, and as they had done in other insta n i c qt r' t i h ,t li oi , W „ e the saving amounted to one million and a hal f ' ,09 , 4 to o - " peated hia strong objection to the tax on the t r. " . 1t4 . 4 de , Ri se Ald funded property. Mr. Alderman WAITHAIAN said that the sl i t :/) k e ° t o c a . °ll :titu of the Noble Lord opposite had been disting u ll ' 9 , i ,7 ; tl lat ir'g great candour; and for the reductions which t ee tr 4 / e ti„ t Arc Lord had effected he felt most grateful. With t i, tl li ter h tad the tax on timber, he differed from some n t. ,, t , e A - i q es ti, ' " r l Gentlemen near hire ; for he did not think Clo t i i tli„, I ,!' etaa r to throw away our colonies, or treat theist l 'g e t , 1, 1 , 14 41 N : e t they were governed properly, we must benefi t rt o', l . ' i t Pett y - 'l and even at present they afforded us the best r. c ie I .4 ''Cluld an foreign trade. There was some of the Cane t4 frae l e i s,1 1 , 1( loe ati e , for instance, that was equal to any that eant e ,,,,ool 14,, ° "41: Baltic. The House had recently been occur - c,F,r a s'iti o , l el sidering a grant on account of improvements i P oO f :the t :' t ' The question was whether the country should thr e f/ t i i: t kOrl h - 5 5 : 5 more money on that colony. He thought that t i i ,d, (4 ° ,, eth e ,, a s votes on that subjeA had been wrong, but he t 0 4,1 14,, 4, he:, would be very absurd, after spending so much o gst ,) Ite r Ntio n ' the colony, to throw it away altogether. Then' ,wirl t a II': but , duty on wine -except the trade we carried on • ) I 'e th e ' tax on colonies, the best part of our foreign tradewl t sv o lt rfi 1 4 ti i '- : t tetry tugal. Yet now we were called on to sacrifice .- t a ,r i e , kit e ,: 4a o , e by equalising the duties on wine. W e had alr e l ro c, ,, f N !'tioo at many sacrifices to France in our conimere ia t i l e ~ ratio 3 . IV] we had sacrificed our manufactures by allowing r fire,s ;4 4 4 kfi n , petition of theirs, and cow we were going to s3c , o fi r sf ic"te ti le pi a , trade with Pot twal, and give a further advantag e r fit ~r tt i ,P l . h e Iv hem/ which we had rtc ived none at 65 '° l l 1 1 ' 4 t ' :,,t I ' o % With respect to the Noble Lord's propositilsit. i o 4 '44 1 ' of ot duty on printed cottons, he highly approved t : c or e r i s ,e; Ne tt g I teeo saw no objection to the penny duty on raw e° t '' t hee d ri It tet,„ °. 'end e , cialiy with the advantage of the reduction °l ea prerda Propeltlllied He thought the taxes on the transfer of land r tl'y tre i rtv. wrong; but that on the transfer of funded PIO ~ lie a h; th o, impracticable and unjust. He did not know I )° , o wt , e 1 1 4', tt 'lsr s t d stood in that respect; but when he considered, ' ,V 0 0 l .i t ''tl '' t th at of these transfers there were in one day, an d ° a d e " i ' "N 4 , 40 su e , limy it was that such transfers should be rapid l Y 4 l Pe s ii ttsie e : t " at a made, he could not but think that the tax sO tt 0 4,0 Pollee` etatt upon distress, as that owp imposed on insuranedeo 0 , it tg t , tv if ~, fire was a tax upon prudence.-(Hear.)-WhY (00 f. , 1 1 h , 4 it ,' l t. elY e Government impose a property tax at once? --- eirc rt i t . : 1 34, 4 - ;4itt 1,, Men of large landed property, who were in g oa d . I . pra fel ' ' :4 4 ,' n g h stances, and who were not required to sell the!. et ! tt' , o, \ , t , th Plat, would escape the tax, while those who were nh il t gyir e ti 1 , 1 15 4 ' ngo, their property in order to make a settlement on hi Pt/ btu tt,"tilic dren, on the marriage of a son or daughter, %O u ove rif 1 ,0 0 tli t N rs' l eur e , pay this tax. There was one other class of P r „ O O ,l V at t hat would altogether escape the tax-be meant g r- ti tsr ~ Oi l . Zat ( and property secured by mortgages. G r ound 11 01 R. 11 cially in the neighbourhood of London, had ° ,,,s‘ l or pros awe Pr e doubled, while every other species of propel' e h O lt / tf °l 'e,el r rins ciated ; and yet they would remain untouelithey 0 f i t, Risi r , to h t too, were the absentees to escape? Why sc'en'e f th e / 4 1k ' ! t he be taxed ?-(Hear, hear. -A late Chancellor' °f ts ij i, i‘ , tti w ell sn chequer, who was now in the other House , i r . a l a 1,1 e 0t ; 4,: 4t (1 4 ' ,"0 tart, had stated that there were two millions 3- opt if ; 1 1 ' i, t . tt,, r - Rr i money annually expended by absentees on th e or bit' oa rf' ~,;4 6 (r r tl, He believed that the amount was double th at o at t , l l lei; LNly ~4 tat, had just stated; but taking that to be the tr vv,ve Green 4,rive, he wished to know why they were to escape t o cl'I; ( I f °4t 1,4 4 4 , hear.)--He wished the Noble Lord had put 3 it:'sf ts%' /1! qktL'4ate persons, and had repealed the house and wit ° inaiott' i ( tly 4 l l' it was a tax of the most partial and gricvn ° ,',,,ed sr, tli e 4 , t 'tri lte 'Po had presented many petitions against the 55 "" a i t io''', ~ ,,,l'ese ht wia and from the unequal manner of their in ) P ° l , e t he 1 4, 4% 4 44, 4 Yu t other circumstances, he did believe them tit oe° \' 4. 4 tilt 41 t vexatious kimi of taxes, tile P f ' V ''). l 4)e(i '°4 Mr. JOHN SAIITII felt great anxiety n fl , ier' S o lot; c.,, i ,e,a t ,, 4 ] occasion. No loan in the House ha d w ith ell pe 'l et ,'t b t " 1 •1 formation of the present Governmen t e '3 l o f:i",, l ' i a , 4 6" t lir satisfaction than himself, bee ruse he had seen e k es Iv 's,, t , r ev e4 Y Or of it pledge themselves to certain Ine ttsl ;i, t ° ,,f ,/ 'abet,, Noe I. if they conducted with prudence ":_°..° t ori °- o t r /1 ,1 Ns Wa: eh opinion be of the highest service to t"',.,,, g , t di , , 4 , p tll t' N Count He, however, was under the: necessity of ea)" - ht f' o gl' illh, 4, 11. 1 . , ... . _ . , sti e 00 6 a t . it fo _ certainly thought that one of the measures D iu ;,,t1 this night was ill-advised, dangeroot w oo o, l ' :ik t s t ,, l .), fie the hit h 1 4 • IA . not to be persisted in. -(Loud cheers.) , e to iti j k lo itt 'Ili ) , i } the liberty of calling the attention of the 11 ° ° .,, ti tie tj d ot e or ~,414 f' it, ,„ 4 ject, making a few observations which his l' i ' o d yr f t ,t'4,l, de r e, enabled him 0 offer. The Noble Lad e f u oilei, r ii / ti t , t ittA t 'Pe o 4 e a tax on the transfer of stock in t _ i) e vislt we' i r ,i It' t° tap to the his own part, he was one of the last tu, , y ie ,o $ O/ , 4. 410 ly u thing like seeing tile honour of the trount i 7 eo c lo t / 14 4 1 N '4l e ,i ) , (Hear, hear)-but if they should be d e an s, t r ieb.,,fr t,, 1, Pk l , l , i thing like it, they had always one Inft the o rre o l, k,,,N, If it 14,`, certainly resorting to the property 0 6 se as :,, 5 (3 ,0 ti v i Iv l . 'l „ f tlai r To be able to have money in the fun e to P' l o l‘e, 4 o 5 e ,,,.. 4 0 t ' 4 4 b ee ingly useful ; but, if for instance, a man w e ir r i ut ide t ,',4 ' l O ll,lsi,,ge , p re for transferring 100,000/. Consols, he wt ° ",,y t ij i , 1 0 11, t 'Ias e I '4o t " gar that that any man would not, ud i r ofe , soce s t he Ei ) N 4 ) all alMary circumstances, make tire tra „ ati v t o a) 11 1 4 ,'°(10; dl well known that bankers make larg - ta aee. ii Ir ? its,' tq c ,„ , 11 0 , stoek, which was of the highest ta r , e ly, f l o nii erj o i 14 4 °1 4" esa,k community. In that dreadful crisis, vt . 1 1',.. ot '4,, f a t 4 1 i k 'N1, 4 t ,Ikri r4 and 1826, what was the situation of the t' o t t .' nto t ‘ e d,lY o •, I :N I 4 S e "st t i Individuals then sold large sores o f tire 5 o tO t r ot 14 01 Nt bu t advanced the money. 'With the produce t he 0 ,,, te e n t,,, °n the assisted their friends in London, irt ,r, f o r 00 1 0 4 0 ca l ''t t ,, rat%) and every where; and had it not bee e xtra i av olo 1 1, , v t1i 1 a soy exertions made by individuals, above all, t l i e n divi d 13/dit I ;lri t i l t i /' 4 . 4 4 ~, and excellent conduct of the meritorious r of th e , : ,,l'e_,l, !ik l ,„ N. th e i it that period of time filled the c har ii an d ee n' gv, lt,:k e Y t oo , his own opinion was that universal au . _,, h t i th 4 - 11,', 4 th e e 4 Hari ° le ' Jr° he" ` tat I would have extended over England. hurl f 0 ,9 yak de or oe , 0 /31 hy Co , to have been paid for the transfer ' „ ser ioa sand Consols at that time, for a l' oarc ely ortCr: 2 a month, or longer, or eh