The Sun. — London, England, 1830-02-06 00:00:00

IMPERIAL PARLIAMENT. HOUSE OF COMMONS-(LAST NIGHT.) The Src.ticra took the Chair precisely at Four o'clock, when he informed the Members present that, agreeably to the wish of the House, a list of Private Committees had been drawn up. COURT OF CHANCERY. The SOLICITOR-GENERAL moved for a return of the number of persons that had been committed to prison fer contempt within the last ten years ; awl also for an account of the number at the present time in confine went—Ordered. Mr. D. W. HARVEY gave notice, that on the 25th instant he should move for a Committee to inquire into the revenues arising from Crown Lands Mr. G. BANKES moved for a return of the Fees charged in the Courts of Fort George and Fort William, Bengal. Mr. Alderman WAITHMAN moved for several returns connected with the Cotton Manufactures, enumerating the duties paid and drawbJeks allowed since the year 1814. Mr. O'CONNELL presented a petition front Killarney against the Sub-letting Act ; and another from the Roman - Catholics of Kilkenny to flee same effect. The Hon. Member then presented another petition from the Roman Catholics of the parishes of St. Michael's and St. John's, Dublin, against the Vestry Act. The peti tioners complained that persons of the Roman Catholic Religion bad not a right to be compelled to pay towards the support of any other religion. They were quite willing voluntarily to contribute towards the support of other re ligious sects, as a proof of which, from a sense of Chris tian charity, he would mention the fact, that on a recent occasion a Roman Catholic Archbishop, he meant Dr. Murray, gave a most liberal subscription towards the erec tion of a Methodist chapel.—(Hear, hear.)—The Hon. Member then presented a petition from the same parish against the Sub-letting Act. LORD ELLENBOROUGH'S LETTER. Mr. SPRING RICE had a petition to present on a subject which was likely shortly to engage the attention of the H iuse, it wee respecting the East India Com pany's Charter. But before he presented that petition, he wished to ask a question of his lion, and Learned Friend opposite, and to that question he wished to call the particular attention of the House, as it was of great importance. A letter had lately appeared in the public prints bearing the signature of the Noble President of the Board of Controul, which he had not yet contra dicted. That letter stated matters of vast importance, and intimated very broadly the intentions of Go vernment. The question, therefere, that he then took the liberty to ask was, whether that letter was or was not genuine, and also whether it received the sanction of Government, and whether there would be any objection to lay the letter before Parliament. Mr. G. BANKES had no hesitation in giving all the information in his power respecting the letter alluded to by his Hon. Friend. But he must beg to say, that on ac count of an afflicting circumstance in the family of the Noble Lord (Ellenborough) he hall not had an opportunity of seeing hint on the subject. tie could take on himself, however, to -ay, that if the letter was genuine it was a pri eve and confidential communionion, and never for a moment intended to meet the public eye. No copy of the original letter having been made, he could not take upon himself to say whether or not the one published in the public papers wan or was not correct. But this he would say, that it was a letter such as one gentleman would write to another in confidence. He was sure Sir J. Malcolm had never sanctioned its publicity. On the contrary lie had ex preneed the deepest regret that it had been published, and by whatever means it had become public it was a breach of the greatest confidence. He, however, must again postively state that he could not say whether or not the published copy was correctly given. The Noble Lord had been in the habit of corresponding with Sir J. Mal colm, and this was one of those letters of which no copy sees kept. He had no means of informing the House of any further particulars respecting the letter, but if any Honourable Member wished to ask any questions, be could assure them that he felt no disposition to shrink from inquiry. He should have been able to give them more information on the subject, had it not been for the eliritressing affliction in the Noble Lord's family. lir. BROUGHAM made a few observations, bnt in so low a tone that it was impossible to catch the tenor of them. Mr. M. A. TAYLOR considered that the letter, what ever it might be, was such as to call on the House to Lave before it clearly and distinctly stated whether it was ass authentie document or not? Mr. GEORGE BANKES—I stated expressly n.y belief was that the Noble Lord could not state whether that what had appeared in the public papers was an accurate copy of the letter which he wrote or not. He stated to me that he had sent off the letter without keeping any copy of it, hut that it was strictly and confidentially a private communication, and that it had only been made public by a most base violation of that confidence. Mr. TRANT said that whatever might be the senti ments contained in a letter that had been communicated to the public in the way which this letter had, he should he very sorry if his Honourable Friend with whom he was euttnected should attempt to found any proceeding upon such a document. If confidence was to be violated in the manner which it bad been on the present occasion, there would be attend to the most important c ommunications both friendly and otherwise, aid be could not conceive that any gentleman could think it right to proceed on a docu ment made public in this manner. He meant not to give any opinion at all upon the contents of the letter; but lie pretested against proceedings being taken upon a letter weideutly written in the most private manner from one gentleman to another, coming before the public by the most aeriosse breach of confidence. Knowing a good d ea l o f East India matters as he ,he could state that papers must occasionally be placed is the keeping of per sons who might be induced to make an improper use of them ; but surely no one would think of making this the stepping-stone or foundation of any future act. Mr. SPRING RICE wished to inform the Hon. Mem t4rfor Dover, that with respect to the mode in which this vapor had come to the knowledge of the public he :.othiz,g. The paper was before the public ; and raking the liberty of asking the question of the iloaasareble Gentleman, which he bad done, he had taken the kindest course of proceeding it was pos eihle for hien to adopt, because it gave the Hon. Gentle loan the opportunity of denying the authenticity of that fottenne The autbenticity had taut been denied, the letter was neer before the public—it was a document from a public' mats, and be the disgrace of its coming before the pu bli c u p on ;Thom it might, because cf betraying COl2 fidenee, disgeeae would certainly zest on the Meiribees of that House, in his opinion, were no notice now taken of it by them. In private proceed teinfidenne teas always sacred ; but he had no -idea of private and confidential communications being Pea Tied to the present extent. Private communications iseteitt to be treated by all with confidence and respect; but when Gentlemen came to deal with the situation of c ommunications were being made so mate. aielly affecting the governors of a territory such as was new the case, it was in vain to talk of the same confi dence surrounding that communication that belonged to a private -communication between one individual and another. Whatever might be the means by which the letter had now before the public, there it was, and in some way or ,ANer there it must stand or there it must fall. Jtene HUME rather thought that if the doctrine of the 11:; e rj„ Geneitenan opposite were to be admitted es a wend dectsine, tin/ 'douse must expect to remain in almost total jeonrance of a n 4 - 4 11 duct of this Government with respect t he affairs of Indin, It happened that a large portion of the business of Inds was conducted under private although puUix tlespatches were at the same time purported to be sent cif. Ile (Mr. Hume) lwl not the slightest hesitation ill avowing himself to •*e in possession of a copy of the letter in question vvh.isfa}tad been forwarded directly to him from Cg.'ostta, 'The letteil had been publiehed in every n ewopaper 14 Cdi, cutta, and c i rc ulated throughout Bombay, the undoubted object of which was to give to Sir J. Malcolm the opprtu siity of saying that he had triumphed over the King's Court; alien the King's Court was no longer to be considered the prote t 4or of the natives of India, the object for which it eves eetanlielied, but that he (Sir J. Malgoltn) was to he considered as the supreme Government, lent any man should hereafter dare to express a free and public opieion coo wary to his notions- Sir John Dewar, or whatever his "me was—(Laughter)--hod been appointed Chief Jus tice, because he had entertained notions of the law that Sir John Malcolm did, that is, that he was considered to truckle to the ob j eete of the Government, whatever might be th e ori l eis from the King's Court. Thie hed spread dismay throughout the whole colony of Bom bay, because it was believed that unless the natives truckled to th e v i ews o f the Government, whatever theb oninions might be, that they were to have no peace and no protection from the Judges, inasmuch as they were told, that by two Seniors and one Jursior being sent out, they might be capable of leading the refractory Judge there, like a wild elephant between two tame ones!—(Muck laughtet.)—Considering that this was calculated to interrupt the orders of the King's Court, the Member thought it a subject calling for imme diate interference, and he trusted that his Noble Friend below him, so well able for the task, would not hesitate to • what took place is that House bad teen productive of the bring the matter before .the House at a convenient greatest good to all, and he submitted to the good sense time, that Hunourable Members might find out whether of the House whether they would not for one year allow the upon the principles of this letter they could expect to have suspension of this order, whereby the experiment might justice done with respect to the affairs of India. It was be tried whether any evil would result from it. By well known that Sir John Malcolm must have made this adopting such a course, the House would show that they letter public, in order that he might be considered the King were not ashamed of their acts, and lie should think there. He was to act as the Sovereign there ; Sir J. Dewar that there was not an honest Member but would feel proud was to kneel before him, and lie was to say—" Rise, Sir of having been accessary to the abolition of such an order. John, I create you a Knight."—(Great laughter.)—ln all The accommodation the public at present had was so bad, the communications that he (Mr. H.) had seen take plees that lie should be exceedingly happy if any course between this country and India, he lead never seen one could be adopted to render it more suit tble ; hut contain so great a violation of principle. If the House, as that (could not be thought of. He trusted that the it was bound, meant to protect the native. of that county) , House would join with him in endeavouring to expunge ft out the most oppressive acts, it was absolutely necessary this order, which was so little attended to. that this letter should be enquired into, because no native Mr. Secretary PEEL could not accede to the Ho,a. could expect justice under the promulgation of such prin- Member's proposition. How could the House, without cipies.—(Hear, hear.) uutice, abandon so important a privilege? The lion. Mein- Mr. BANKER—Sir, I do not know what doctrine of bet's speech itself was a strong confiernation of the impol.cy mine the lion. Gent. who has just sat down has spoken of his measure, for he had stated that the oriler was a of. lam not aware, when I rose to answer the question mere dead letter. He trusted Hon. Members would not of the Hon. M mber opposite, that I laid down any doctrine part with so great a privilege, at least without some cos_ whatever, unless it were this, if doctrine it can be called, sideration. These who would read the debates in tl e that a man ought not to be judged of so severely for his public papers, would see access was given to every body, private and confidential communications, as if that had and that the complaint of tile Hon. Member was totally been intended to be made public, and was avowed to have unfounded. He (the Right Hon. Secretary) doubted very been a public document. That is the doctrine I have laid much whether, if the measure proposed by the Hon. Mem down—that is the aetmost of my doctrine, which I think ber was enforced, that decorum due to the House would be will bear the test of every good man's feeling. I 'hall not maintained as hitherto. He thought at least, if the Hon. be led on this occasion, by what the Hon. Gent. has said, Member intended to press this subject, he ought net to do into a discussion of the Learned Judge's conduct, to whom it precipitately, but upon consideration. the letter alludes, for that may be made the subject of After some observations between Mr. HOME and tats inquiry toe inquiry hereafter. The Hon. Member has referred to Right Hon. Secretary, copies of this letter directed to him from . Cal- Mr. HUME would not press the subject at present, but roue : it is very true that copies of this letter take another opportunity of bringing it forward. appeared first in Calcutta; it is true also that copies of it STAMP DUTIES. appeared in the London papers, differing in most materi d Mr. E. DAVENPORT moved for a return of the parts front those published in Calcutta ; and he thought Stamps on Bills of Exchange during the last: four it was impossible for the Hon. Member to say whether years inclusive. After a few observations from the any and which of them was correct. Chancellor of the Exchequer and Mr. Hume, Mr. Daven- Lord ASHLEY scarcely knew what course to take port agreed to withdraw his motion. upon the present occasion. He hail certainly been in- Mr. ROBINSON wished to put a (pastime to his formed that the communication in question had been Majesty's Secretary of State for the Home Department, written most strictly confidential. As to the observation and that question was, whether any negociations were that private communications were in contradiction to pending between this country and the United States of public despatches, he could only say, that during the period North Attie' ica, with a view to renew a direct intercourse he bell office, he never knew any such circumstance take hetweeen the United States and his Majesty's possession, place. in the West holies. Mr. BROUGHAM said, admitting the communication Mr. Secretary PEEL stated that communications had to be confidential, he could not but view with alarm such been received from the Minister of the United States, and a confidential proceeding. It was no very pleasurable idea that communication was still under the consideration of that had bees produced in his mind by the perusal of such a his Majesty's Government. letter, public or private, written by a Minister of the UNREPRESENTED TOWNS. Crown. It was in fact to say to a Judge, that the more Lord J. RUSSELL gave notice that he should, on the disposed he was to act in strict conformity to the civil 231 instant, make a motion for giving Manchester, Bir and military Government—the more disposed he was to have mingbam, and Leeds the right of returning Representa no will of his own—but the more anxious he was to meet Lives to sit in Parliament. the Government views, the better he was adapted for the THE ADDRESS. office. He did not understand how such a very important Lord PALMERSTON wished, before the Report was communication upon a very important subject, between a bought up, to make a few observations on the subject of Minister of England and the Official Government of India, the Address. It was natural that, when Parliament met was to be considered so private and confidential. No doubt at a moment of such universal pressure, they should on their no expression of contempt or abhorrence could be suffi- first day of assembling devote themselves to the considera cient to convey the feeling of a gentleman against the con- tion of that distress which was so generally felt. He, how duct deny individual who hail made the letter public, if ever, trusted that the House would not forget the other it had really been intended to have been so strictly con- topics to which the Speech had averted, which, though fidential ; but still that did not exculpate Lord Ellen- they did not come so directly home to the business of borough from the fact of writing such a letter. He could men, were nevertheless of great national importance. He not suppose or imagine that Sir John Malcolm himself had did not wish to express despair, or concur in the measures banded over that letter to the press, but it was certainly from which some expected to obtain relief. But lee did highly probable, as the letter was altogether in favour of not think with any feelings of despondency of the prospe- Sir John, and altogether against his antagonist—holding rity of the country, when he saw the millions of indus him up, and knocking down his opponent—it was highly winos; men who enjoyed the advantages of a genial climate probable that Sir John, enamoured o f being thus elevated, and fertile soil. It was impossible that such a cenanu might have shown the letter to one friend, and then to nity should not go on annually increasing. The distress another, and that one of those friends having taken a copy now prevailing must mainly have arisen front the rota of the letter, might have di erred it worth sending forth to autos adopted with regard to the currency. Any Mem the public.—(Hear, hear.) her who had voted for those measures, without reflect- Mr. PEEL said, that the authenticity of the letter ing on the consideration of the pressure they would had yet by no means been established. No man wi.o had produce, hail voted not understanding the principles on read the Calcutta publication, and also the English publi- which the House had returned to a metallic standard cation of the letter, could fail to see the difference in certain for the currency, followed by a certain contraction of parts. He asked his Noble Friend whether the copies that the circulation. While transactions of business were had appeared, or either of them, were copies of the letter he taking place, and bargains of trade making, those had written? The Noble Lord declared that it was who bought or paid at the new standard while others utterly impossible for him to say ; he had written it were soiling at another standard, were exposing themselves hurriedly, awl strictly confidential, and had kept no to considerable lose. This, in many instances, produced a copy of it. He (Mr. Peel) did not mean to say that great pressure, which absorbed the profits of the trauseacet a public officer was indiscriminately to write on tion altogether by the change thus created. If the House public affairs, as, he might say, confidentially, and then contrasted the pressure now existing with that period of afterwards screen himself from public animadversion under distress, ruin, and bankruptcy, which occurred at the the plea of having written privately ; but certainly a public moment of the panic, when desolation was spread over the officer might be at liberty when writing strictly privately country, we should see that a temporary pressure like this and confidentially to allude to public affairs; and was better than an unsound currency, and that its evils , this joke—indiscreet jest or joke, as it might be—was not were lighter than those of the other /system. The cowntry t to be considered so serious a circumstance as to form the was in the condition of a patient labouring under a ifiseaee foundation of future proceedings. for which there were no means of cure but by a fatal ope- Lord JOHN RUSSELL could not doubt that the let- ration. This was the choice of evils before this country. ter had been hastily written, and on that account, without If we had not strength of mind to undergo the pain neces any other, reflected great discredit on the writer. It was sary to the cure, we should endure more pain. at itliout any evident that the Noble Lord did entertain certain senti- benefit. He did not think there was no salvation for the ments, and his holding them afforded a presumption tilt country, though it was stated that we had made no ap he was not fit to conduct such an office as that at th e proximation towards it by adhering to a metallic currency. head of which he was placed. He surveyed with great satisfaction that part of his Ma- Mr. BROUGHAM wished to know whether any thing jesty's Speech which called on Parliament to adhere to the hail been done relative to the return of Sir J. Grant. measures they had adopted with regard to the currency. Mr. BANKES observed that the subject had been under The best way of giving relief to the country would be to discussion when the illness of the Noble Lord at the head open the channels for the employment of our native in of the Colonial department intervened. dustry. At the same time let the shackles be removed, by Sir J. MACKINTOSH considered the Judges in India giving a stir and aiding the efforts of the capitalist, and entitled to the special attention of the House. They were bring more shoulders to bear the weight of the public bur a body of men separated from the great belly of the lithe- diens. He would nut say that those parts relative to our bitants of India, having no means of gaining popularity but foreign policy had given satisfaction. '1 be principles of being often placed in circumstances that rendeted them ex- foreign policy pursued by this country were exceedingly tremely unpopular. It was said this was a private letter, but unpopular. We hail followed a system injurious to the he did rot see that a letter written to a Governor in India honour and interests of the country. This opinion was could be considered as any thing but a public Act. It not peculiar to a few; but he would appeal to any Hon. was true it might be considered as the secret opinions of Gentleman of that House, who hail passed beyond its those who administered the affairs of India. The charac- limits, whether they had not observed, in the course ter of Judges was not to be considered as such a trifling of their intercourse in other countries what might lead thing that persons were to take upon themselves to write them to form the pante opinion. A tittle, however, letters with respect to them, and then to say that they would come for the discussion of all these topics, which did not remember what they had written. Such other- were not very interesting at present. But be was anxious rations as " a wild elephant hieing best between two tame to enter his protest on the present occasion ; for if the ones," were not easily forgotten. It was hut a poor de- Address had passel in entire silence, it might have been fence for any party to use to say that he had forgotten understood to imply a general approbation. He con what he had written. feud that this House would have approved of any foreign Sir R. INGLIS, though he differed from Iris Hon. policy that would have led us to interfere more with the Friend, considered the Hitless of the Noble Lord at the affairs of the Continent. He objected to the policy of head of the Board of Controul, as twine excuse for not making the integrity of the Turkish dominions in Europe recollecting the Ist:list:ince of the letter. as essentially necessary to the interests of Christian and Mr. BANKES wished to make some ohservation upon civilised Europe. He did not wish to see Tut key gar what had fallen from his Hon. Friend who had said so risoned by Russians, nor the Russians frontier ext e nded much on the forgetfulness of the Noble Lord at the head in that line. Indeed, such an extension would not 1 of the Board s.f Controul. The friends of that Noble be fur the interests of Russia, and he was sure it Lotd would but ill serve him, and badly discharge their would not be for the interests of the rest of Europe. trust, if they rested his defence upon his forgetfulness. Was there no alternative between putting Russia into Even the expressions of the letter as they appeared in the possession of Turkey and the cessation of the existence newspapers in En g land, had been a good deal misrepre- of Turkey as an European power ? He must conclude that sented. the Ressian war had not ended satisfactorily to our Go- Mr. S. RICE wished to say that he had prefaced the vernrneut. We had two courses to pursue : one was out subject by a question, whether the letter which had of the question ; but if we had net aseisted Tom key openly, been published was to be considered as genuine or we might, by inducing her to make timely concessions to not. ' His reasons for asking that question were, just &amide, have avoided the war. He was deeidedly on account of the l e tter dating what the intentions of his of opinion that Government should have used all meats to Majesty's Qoveenment were with respect to the East iniloce Turkey to avoid that war which must finally end, India Company's Charter. After a few observations from in leer humiliation. He would hot, jtowove ,r go further other Members, the petition was read and ordered to lie bite the subject th it evening, Ix-creme he Oeffe::Wed-thitt-Co on the table. vcrnment had been unremitting in their efforts to execute Mr. WM. PEEL presented certain Returns respecting the Treaty of London. Some documents were to be laid the state of Gauls, which were oi dered to lie on the table. before the House, which he should examine. He would MALT DUTIES. take leave to state that he trusted when those papers were Load F. OSBORNE gave Relief, that on Thursday inspected, they would be very unlike the correspondence after the recess he should make a motion for the House to which appeared at the end of the last papers which had go into a Committee on the subject of the duties on Malt been laid bef o re the House. That was a meagre, unsatisfac and Beer. tory, and partial exposition of transactions. He trusted that THE CANADAS AND THE UNITED STATES. those papers would. not merely give reports, but on Mr. ROBINSON—I have 4 question to ask of the the contrary, documents, which would show the views, Right Hon. Secretary for Home Affairs of great public policy, and i ns t r u e tiens of the British Goverment durin importance; and I truer. that he will have no difficulty iia the course of these transactions. He did trust that Govern giving such a reply as will remove the uneasiness that ment would execute the Treaty of London in the fair and exists among parties in this country who are interested in obvious sense in which it was contracted. Ile trusted the point, and others who live in the Canailas. My glees- there would he nothing done to restrict the limits of the tint) is, whether any negociation is pending between this New State so as to endanger its power of self existence. couotey !sod the United States, with a view to the renewal 'lime Greek state world in that cue be incapable of main of a direct intercourse b e tw ee n the United States and our Mining its political existence if any leotinacious opinions possessiotts in Gouda? were allowed to prevail so as to inclose it within narrow Mr. PEEL—My answer to the non. Gentleman's limits. It was worthy of great approbation that the question is this—that a communication has been received question was still under consideration, since the peace, from the itrnieter of the Unit e d States on t h at important what should be included within the limits of Greece. subject; and that this COMMUllleation is still under the It was a matter of little importance to Turkey, iu her consideration of his Mejesty'e Government. present condition, whether this or that island or valley ANCIENT ORDER. teas taken from her and assigned to Greece. But Mr, HIJME called the attention of the House to one it wes of importance to Europe that the New State of its mist Ancient. ortlers—(Laughter)—he meant th a t should be capable of maintaining itself in a state which went to exclude pet zone 6'04 1 being present dor- of independence, as it would exist under the ing the discussions in the lloure.--e (Hear, hear.)-- dread daily and hourly of attacks front Candle It was well known that if any Member of the House and other islands left to the Turks, in the spirit , sloauld signify his wish th it the gallery should be cleared, which the termination of the war must have it:- that wiela must be complied with without the sense , fused into them. The character of the Greek State shou ld of the House being taken upon it. Some time ago, Ibe not merely sufficient to pr serve its revenue, but to when an Honourable Friend of his was about I protect it from reaction. He was anxious now to advert to make a motion relative to the enormous !to that part of the Speech in which his Majesty announce s expenditure of Buckingham Palace , an Honourable ! his anxious desire to recognize the present usurpation of Member got tip and moved that the gallery be cleared, I Dots Miguel. He did not object to recognize him as the thereby preventing the truth going forth to the public. 1 actual Sovereign—as merely having, ascended the throne, As long as the resew order was a standing one not by the regular and legitimate course in which the up n the Journals of the llou t e, it was impossible for any Crown was attained in other nations. But this country individual to object to suds a course being taken. He had nothing to do with the question; we bad no right to had long made up his milt(' that the making vuli.is of . inquire whether his title was legitimate or not; but, cer- till*, he eouceived that with the title of Ns Miguel was in some degree involved the hoticiur of this country.— (Hear.)—He would not go into the particular details, which, he had no doubt, were fresh in their minds ; but he, trusted, whenever the recognition was made, it would be\tshown to be 'absolutely necessary, or it would deeply affect the honour and interest of this country. If Don Miguel was the undisputed Sovereign of Portugal ; if he exercised his sway peacefully over an undivided people ; if he had returned into the scabbard the sword he hell ever the heads of his people; if he had unlocked the doors of the dungeons in which thousands and tens ef thousands of the victims of surprise and tyranny were immured ; if really all these thing, were ac complished, there might be grounds on which it was impossible to avoid the recognition of Don Ali guel. At the present moment,' it should be recollected, we have been told that there are differences between the Princes of the House of Braganca as to the succession to Portugal. Let us bear in mind what is going on within the dominions of Portugal. There are two Governments existing in what is called the integral dominion of Portu gal. There was a Military Government in the Isle of Terceira, which was an integral part of the Portuguese dominions, holding it in the name of the young Queen, Maria da Gloria, whom our Government acknowledged as the rightful Sovereign. It was impossible, while this state of things continued, that Don Miguel could be said to be the undisputed Sovereign of Portugal. This was a subject which would come under the notice of the House, and he merely on that occasion entered on it that he might request Government to pause long, and well consider be fore they resolved on the recognition of Don Miguel. They would take care, he hoped, how they involved the fate of BO many persons, who were led into jeopardy by the course of foreign policy we had followed. There was one subject which was nut fit for discussion that evening; but as he should not advert to it on any other occcasion, he would say a few words then. He meant the recent invasion of the territory of M- xico, by the Spanish expedition from I Cuba. This expedition sailed lately, but it was several years in a coarse of preparation. The Government of Mexico wished to anticipate the attack of Spain by a previous descent on Cuba. But England told Mexico that she would not consent to permit them to make the attack. He said if it was so—if Mexico, by the in ,lietrference of England between Spain and her Colonies, was prevented from taking a step to keep off an evil that was coming on her people, it was a most unfair proceed ing. Government ought never to have begun on the prin ciple of non-interference, or they should carry it fairly and impartially through. When they said to Mexico, you shall not attack Cuba, they should also have said to Spain you shall not attack Mexico ; else it was a gross act of par tiality between two contending parties, and a direct viola tion of the system of neutrality on which Government pro fessed to act. This transaction happened when many of these, now Members of Government, were, at the time, also in the Cabinet. He sow called on Government to explain the transaction, in justification of the equal neu trality from which in Parliament they had argued they were so much afraid to depart. On all the other topics which would come under the detailed consideration of the Hone—but he would not trouble them further. He would have been sorry to have omitted an opportunity of recording his opinion as to the system by which the coun try has been brought into disrepute abroad. Mr. Secretary PEEL thanked his Noble Friend for owning that this was not a fit occasion to enter on the im portant subjects on which he had touched. The import ance of each of them entitled them to a separate discus sion; but as his Majesty had declared his intention, when the opportunity arrived, of laying full information before them, in order not to provoke discussion by those who .--were not in possession of adequate information, lie con curred with his Noble Friend that this was not a fit occa sion of promoting a discussion on these questions. By concurring in the Address, he approved of the propriety of allowing an ample opportunity of discussing the foreign policy of the Government. Those Hon. Gentlemen who concurred with him in supporting the Address would nut preclude themselves from folowing any course as to our foreign policy. On a general view, he must express his dissent of the opinions his Noble Friend had expressed ; and as to the policy the Noble Lord advocated, he must say, that his Noble Friend's policy, were it acted upon, would involve us very erepeedily in wee. That policy his Made- ForiOnd had advo cated last Session, though be had not so distinctly avowed it. Yet, a doctrine of this sort, if reduced to practice, would involve this country, and, in six months, involve Europe, in a general war. Our policy, said the Right lion. Gent., at least is to maintain peace, and it is our wish and intention to spread over the world the invaluable hir4sipg of general peace. It consists best with the main tenance of a just influence on the part of England and its honour. My Noble Friend bad adverted to the impolicy of our course as to Turkey ; but he taunts us for having asserted that the maintenance of the integrity and indepen dence of Turkey is essential to the preservation of Euro pean tranquillity. But Ido approve of the perfect and entire maintenance of a great Power which has long ex isted. Its extinction is a subject greatly to be considered. We are attacked as if we admired the system of internal Government in Turkey. In former and more remote periods this power was an ()reject of meterial inte rest, and this country even undertook to guarantee the integrity of its extensive territory in 1799. This was a measure of policy pursued by Mr. Pitt, who then presided over the Government, though he did not admire the system of Government in Turkey, yet thought that greater evil would arise from the dismemberment of Turkey than from its continuance as an integral state. Does my Noble Friend know the opinion expressed by e Mr. Fox, in the year 1806? He recommended that the lnarantee should be given at an early period. Prince Talleyrand was then the Minister of Foreign Affairs in the French Government, and he was told that the bite grity of the Turkish empire was an object of great im portance to us. The question respecting Turkey, how ever, led nearly to the breaking off the negociation. The answer was, that as the object of sustaining the integrity of Turkey was as dear to France as to England, the ob ntacle was removed. We did not require the assistance of Turkey ; but we had no objection to see her power and authority advancing in civilization and improvement. But how could we continue at peace, if, in the event of the dismemberment of any portion of Europe, we were in danger of going to war ? God forbid that the peace of this country should depend on the decisions of the Divan ! When Turkey gives Russia a fair ground of war, whether the conclusion be satisfactory or not, it is not for us to interfere. But my Noble Lord asks on what ground ? Why did we not recom mend Turkey to conciliate Russia, by carrying into effect the concessions prescribed by the existing treaties? This was our advice to Turkey. If she would have done what Russia had a right to require, there would have been no war. We were bound by no express or implied obliga tion to give assistance to Turkey. We never led Turkey M believe that we should support the Turkish cause. We offered advice up to the commencement of the contest. So far from Turkey being countenanced by England, for some time previous to the war the British Minister had been withdrawn from Constantinople, in consequence of the re fuel to listen to our conciliatory councils. That shows Roily little right the 'Tucks bad to depend en tke assistance of this country. We gave counsel to Turkey for moderate and just concession. When the result of the first campaign was known, the extravagant hopes of the Turks from what they called their success did not delude us. When Turkey had gained these advantages, as they were con sidered, there was less disposition to decide the contest, except by arms. Those who refused to go to war for Turkey acted for the real and permanent interest of this country. As to Greece, my Noble Friend says he hopes to see the Treaty of London carried into full effect. I can assure him, that in the course of events that have fol lowed, we have laboured diligently in the strict execution of the Treaty, and in no instance has there been a devia tion from that Treaty, unless it was in favour of Greece. He will find this statement fully borne out by the official documents. My Noble Friend says that, in the present state of Turkey, one island or another valley are of very little importance to her, and may be granted to Greece. My Noble Friend's principles seem somewhat lax here : it may be a convenient doctrine to apply to a great Power in an abject state ; but we have never aided Greece in any measure not in conformity with those principles of ho nour and justice which we have always regarded. With respect to Portugal, my Noble Friend has only repeated what he said last Session ; but his advocacy meant, if any thing, " Go to war for the purpose of dispossessing Don Niguel." But if the population of the country cared nothing about the possessor of the Throne, why were we to interfere ? If, at the period that may be selected, we. should determine on his recognition, it will be a pure question with relation to the Treaties between the coun tries. In his Majesty's Speech there are some parts in which the recognition is mentioned. I have never concealed my opinion of the conduct of Don Miguel. Ile dial not keep the faith he plighted to this Govern ment. But it is an important question whether his personal character will alone justify us in refusing to recognise hitn. Don Miguel practically exercises the powers of government in Portugal, and his rule takes place apparently with the general eonsent; every attempt to dispossess him bas failed ; at as early period he called together the ancient Catlett, and had their assent to his accession. This Wes a bay venerable for its antiquity, and its decisioo gave his title a sanction in the eyes of the people. They looked on that decision as the expression of the general will. The island of Terceira is a military garrison, which has declared for the young Queen Maria, but it is a small island, far detached from Portugal, and not in the slightest degree influencing that kingdom. Would that fact authorise us to force a Sovereign on the people of Portugal ? We desire that she may ascend the Throne in obedience to her father's will; but if the people of Portugal will not support her claim, it will fall to the ground. There were great doubts whether Dun Pedro bad the right to give the crown to his daughter ; and all the Por tuguese lawyers have decided in favour of Don Miguel. Higher considerations than those of mere personal character must rule the course of policy which a country like this will follow. We are not authorised to force a rejected Sovereign on any country. Don Miguel is in no shape sub ject to our authority. If we once commence a war of opinion, we can never circumscribe its scope. My Noble Friend, however, is so anxious, that he asks why we have not fitted out an armament to prevent Spain from invading Mexico? Now really he must take leave t o say, that if the principle of interference required by his Noble Friend was to be carried into full operation, it would involve this country in wars with almost every nation with which it was allied or bound by treaties. The Noble Lord (Palmerston) had, however, asserted that the Government of this country should have inter fered to have prevented the invasion of Mexico by the Spaniards from the island of Cuba. Now he recollected very well that his Right Hon. Friend (Mr. Canning), at the time he put forth those able and powerful State Papers which were demanded from him in the fulfilment of his duty as Secretary of State for Foreign Affairs, always admitted the right of Spain to fit out and undertake any expedition she pleased for the conquest of her Colonies, al though he denied to other nations the right of interference, which might be exerted, not for the purpose of re-assune ing the legitimate authority of the Parent State, hut fur the purpose of assisting either party, as it might suit their interests to obtain an advantage over the other. This he was satisfied was the tenor of . the principle laid down by his Right Hon. Friend, and recognised by the House. But then the Noble Lord asserts, that although the right of interference was not exercised by the Govern ment to protect Mexico from the Spaniards, it was exer cised on a former occasion to preserve Cuba from the at tacks of the Mexicans.—(Hear, hear.)—Did the Noble Lord, however, not understand that there might be some circumstances so peculiar, and some considerations of such overwhelming importance, with regard to the connections sad relations of England with the Isle of Cuba, as to jus tify a great departure from the rules which governed other portions of her policy, and not to be defended on general principles.—(Hear, hear, hear.)—The Noble Lord ought to have a thorough understanding of every thing con nected with the peculiar situation of this country sad Cuba before he ventured to illustrate his argument by a reference to the case of Cuba. On every ether oc casion he repeated that the Government had invariably governed itself by the principles which it had recog nised ; and although they had not, as the Noble Lord seemed to thick they were bound to do, gone to war for the purpose of preventing every act of which they might disapprove, yet he trusted it would be found that they had not done any thing to forfeit the character or compromise the honour or station of the country. The Right Hon. Gentleman concluded by observing that he should not enter further into the various topics connected with our foreign policy, because the Address did not pledge the House in any manner to approve of, or adopt it ; and if Hon. Members would hut suspend their opinions until the papers connected with it were before them, they would have ample opportunity of expressing their opinions on its soundness and propriety.—( Hear.) Lord PALMERSTON, in explanation, denied that he councilled war, as the Right Hon. Gentleman asserted. On that point he had been quite ru;sconceived. All he wished to convey, was, that by assuming a firmer and more decided tone, the country, without the slightest risk of war, might have secured advantages of which it has been deprived. Mr. C. GRANT said, his Right Hon. Friend seemed to have wholly mistaken the observations of his Noble Friend, who merely stated, in the most temperate manner, that Ministers seemed to have made a distinction in the conduct they pursued towards Spain and Mexico. He said it was reported- that when Spain was preparing to attack Mexico, the latter, in order to protect herself, meant to have invaded Cuba, but England forbad the expedition. His Noble Friend did not state that this was really the case, bat he asked whether it was the fact? And he argued, that as England saved Cuba from Mexico, so she ought to have saved Mexico from Spain. The Right Hon. Gentleman said the interests of England rendered it necessary to prevent the invasion of Cuba. Now he would demand whether there were no British interests connected with Mexico? He would contend that there was a very great balance on the side of Mexico. His Noble Friend did not call on Ministers for interference; but he complained that interference was resorted to in a single instance—that there was a partial interference — an interference in favour of those who hated freedom. Lately, however, they had been told that that illustrious usurper had been misrepresented—that he had had the mis fortune to become the innocent victim of calumny. But that trial, it appeared, had passed, and, from what had been said in another place, to which he must not allude, Don Miguel would, no doubt, shortly be called to take hie seat among the Sovereigns of uci Europe. rr ---Inum ego ldas mire sedes, ducere nectaris Snccos, et ascribi quietia Orclininus patiar Deorum," was the languge they wound next hear, he supposed, with regard to Don Miguel.—(Cheers.) It might be true, if they pleased, that France had secured herself,—that Russia had secured herself,—hat what had England ? A party to the Treaty of the 6th July, 1827, and, as it was rumoured, about to place a prince of their own coun try on the throne of Greece, Englishmen had, nevertheless, scarcely secured to themselves one feeling of gratitude. Nay, they were reproached with being parties to another and a very different kind of policy. How it happened that, throughout Europe, this feeling existed toward Eng land, it was not for him to say. Ile hoped there was no foundation for it ; but when the promised papers were laid upon the table, they should be able to judge. For the present he must be allowed to say, that if it were possible to allow Greece to choose her own Monarch, she should not be interfered aa ith in her choice. If that were not possible, then came the more important question, was the Government of Greece to be a free constitution, or was it to be a despotism ? He did not press for an answer to this question now, but he felt assured the House would consider it a most important question, and one that must be satisfactorily answered.—(Cheers.) if the Govern ment of Greece were to be a despotism, then the worst suspicions of Europe would be confirmed, and it would he proved that, although Englishmen were known to abhor despotism in any shape, an English Ministry had consented to establish despotism elsewhere, in obedience to the wishes of a power which dreaded the appearance of freedom in any country, however distant.—(Cheers.) Lord JOHN RUSSELL could not help expressing his satisfaction that there was nothing in the address which pledged the House to approve of the foreign policy of Ministers. The Right Hon. Gent. said, " what would we have .had them do in the war between Russia and Tur key?" They had, said the Right Hon. Gent., given their a dvice, which was all they could do. Perhaps so ; but, for his own part he would have given that advice in a very different tone. He would have told Turkey that if she did not agree to the terms offered, the treaty of the 6th July should be immediately carried into execution without her consent. From all that he had heard of the Turkish cabinet, he believed that if this tone had been adopted, it would have produced :the desired effect, and that peace between the two Powers would have been concluded, not in the plains of Adrianople, but before the Russian army had reached Vat na.—(Cheers.)—Russia then would not have been in the poesession of the key of Turkey, nor com pleted that view of aggrandizement which it was evident had been her policy ever since the days of Catherine.-- (Hear.)—With respect to Portugal, if we had never in terfered in the affairs of that country, it would have been easy for us, like America, to acknowledge Don Miguel as king de facto ; but we bad given and received pledges, and then we had withdrawn ourselves entirely,—saying, :ivent an unarmed body of the Queen of Portugal's subjscts t t h h e dr y w a i r n r g el iosurirsoetltien‘g, wet l u i f act N ua o l t ly c i o n n te te r n fe t ,.e w d it t h o t ir ,u e : proceeding to Terceira. Ile could entertain no doubt of e i x ll i e ; g la a i l n ity w o h f y t i h t is l s r t a e s p p ; re a t n en d d i e f d ar iz one elsethe injustice could, let an4 that the Ad m iralty order that an attack was about to be m a d e u p on Terceira. 'Was this true? Was it any thing like true? W as not Terceira filled with the Queen's friends, and w e re n ot the unarmed men , who were proceeding to Terceira, also friends of the Queen ?—(lltar.)—lt was his firm belief that the character of this country had suffered greatly by the late transactions, both with respect to Por tugal, to Turkey, and to Russia. Sir JOSEPH YORKE said, he was so extremely hoarse that he could hardly make himself heard, and that the very eloquent speeches they had just heard must be his apology for attempting to speak. Eloquent speeches were very well calculated to excite the House to take part in any war, and he was not surprised that, in times past, eloquent speeches had produced that effect. The country, hoWover ; bad paid very dearly for ;such spevelte,---(Heur, and laughter. )—He gave the Noble Duke at tinimaa 6l the Government great credit for k e eping them ort. 4 'e ,var ; and he begged to remind the Hon. Gentlemen 8 01 vere so fond of the " high ton e " in f o r e ign policy, that eats to that " high tone" that the country was incleble . or its enormous debt.—(H ea r, and l a ughter. )-e•l f . e t rusted that Ministers would drop the " high tone ;" * e a hey would look at what their predecessors had done, eu e .ow the country had been bamboozled out of its mout le trusted that Ministers would think of these thing. , a n d Ace warning. He recollected very well, when Mr. Via. ,ing came down to the House and proposed that we she u pend that 2,000,0001. for the sake of keeping Portage n order for a little while ; that the Hon. Member for , Aberdeen was the only person who said, " Wait a 1; 0 , 4 don't be in a hurry ; adjourn the debate till next vfe" .. .," :nd, in the mean time, turn the matter over in Y. minds, or else, gentlemen, depend upon it, you'll get yeu r. delves into a confounded scrape." Such was the language of the lion. Member for Aberdeen—(Hear, and laughre L) —and it did him very great credit. The Noble fear (Palmerston) below him complained that we had 0 , 7 fered and prevented the Mexicans from sending an exP al : Lion to Cuba. For his own part he believed that if cirri expedition had been allowed, there would have been a counteraction, and that Cuba would have been in I" ' possession, not of the South Americans, even if kg had gained it, but of the North Amer i cans. He I ‘ ll in no state secrets, and though his Right Honourable Friend (Mr. Peel) below him, was, yet a Cabinet Miuiste t could not set himself off to great advantage as be (S it J. Yorke) could set him cff—(Hear, and laughter) -" 4r this very reason;—that a Cabinet Minister was not allao:7 A to tell all he knew. Now as to the Address, he be4h leave to say, that he quite concurred in it, although th e Speech said nothing about Ireland. Why should it? I:1 Hon. Member for Clare (Mr. O'Connell) had threateln for some time past, to make a speech upon Itiand, .8e", what necessity was there for two?—(Hear, and laeghre" He had observed that Hon. Member last night real something,—a state paper, no doubt,.—and the instant I.'' Right Hon. Friend (the Chancellor of the Excheqee r) mentioned Ireland, down went the paper the Hon. MO' ber for Clare was reading—off went his spectacleser e ? went his hands—open went his mouth,—and he ejac e ; lated something about " cases in the desert."—(Hear eau laughter.)—The Hon. Member for Clare had told theta that some of his countrymen were subsisting on Ar es halfpence a day. Why, the Government could not OP! that ; and if the fact was so, these Irish paupers, 8 1, ( 46 ,_ mighty beautiful strong Paddies—(Loud laughter)--aeli Hon. Member called them, must not come over here a p p ' eat up our potatoes.—( Hear, and laughter.)—For his 0 0 ; part, he was glad that Ireland had not been mentionel la the Speech from the Throne. Why should Ireland be ways mentioned as if it were an independent corral ) though it might contain all these green !rallies which the Honourable Member for Clare was always blarneying:l omen countrymen about?—(Cries of " Oh ! Oh l" laughter.)—He must treat these subjects with sound I"), sense—(Cries of " hear, hear")—and must not be away by eloquence. He was sure the Honourable glea • ber fee Clare had solid sense enough, as . well a l eloquence. Now that we had consigned to the Wl' of the Capuleta all differences between Catholic / 0 "i Protestant, he did think it was time to talk rat a : ally about Irish affairs. And now, for the curter'', question. Tha Hon. Member for Abingdon (Mr. Pr ? berly) said to them—" I will give you such sterling tie as never existed before in this blessed and laughter. j—Now he was well acquainted with the gessuity of the Hon. Member for Abingdon. He ke e " that that Hon. Member ouuld contract at the proper tiO e d i and cut his c at according to hie cloth, as well or bel t ' then any body else. Indeed, he - believed that the IP"' Member had made a large fortune bye, doing ; but Ilia /. the Hon. Member fur Abingdon could produce-such - 1 11 r te as he promised, he must be allowed to d ou b t . Did , Hon. Member mean to say that he could work V' sterling paper of his to the consistency of pasteboard , a"., then cut it up into coin, with th e S overe i gn ' s heed L one side, and his own tail on the other ?—(Loud ter, and cries of " Oh, oh.")—lf that were meant cheer, it was not at all well executed—(Hear, and leah", ter;)—and if it were meant as a groan, h e must say / lea , he did not see what had called for it. The Hon. 111 .e 1 . 1 ; bey ir had said, in a Parliamentary way, that he would then paper which should be as good as any inetall: good as gold, silver, or pietism; and, on the other bands 4 (Sir Joseph Yorke) said, in a Parliamentary way that he did not believe it. Bet as to these complik about the currency. 'Now the Duke of Wellington BAOI last night, in the House of Lords--(Laughter, and ale.% is " Order")—" Really," continued the Gallant Member, Ilma i hytan s ione o a auortnt eh m ne etype o rievil l are t pcnriseaow e e x ewi L i r i A s II listentyt l. supposei naHrtoyowtthitelehivnaevgtro:wi voice will owfd a l uot aesaayci charmer, o rs sui t, e t) r e y i v , holding a high official station,—l suppose there is notb' e .W disorderly in that—(Hear, and laughter,)—it was ewe ' 1• 1 ; 'weanhdadbdyut r h in a g t th p e e ß s person, that rteisstartictwinen Will 0 $; ° ;,: : 65,000,000/. in circulation, which is upwards of a til l ; ° ,l satisfy gentlemen ? If it will not, Ido not know 4'l - The Hon. and Gallant Member conclude! , b e l d saying, that if the House and the Government proceft„ with caution, he had no doubt all distress would ttt moved, and that the Ministers would have no OCOaaidt: t walk about in suits of deep mourning, w ith w hite pow hankerchiefs to their eyes.—(Hear, and laughter.) Dr. LUSHINGTON said he could not help obser. ll4 i that every year the tone of o ur G overnmen t b eca me 1 0 ,1 and lower in reg a rd t o th e f ore i gn re l at i ons o f t h e couatu o Averse as he was to war,—muc h as he should depre re o war in the present conditi on a the country, yet he ' l , convinced that the only way in which w e could pre/ B ' l 4 ourselves in peace was to hold up our heads, and ce t t „ ourselves with courage, with honour, and with good fai t The conduct of England towards Portugal had not te e 4o that which became a great nation. It would have le • better if we bed continued to maintain a strict n eu which would not have prevented an act of hospital' s towards Donna Maria. lie feared, however, that Cala had been shown to Dun Miguel, and that his suc cessii in eh , „ the throne of Portugal would be recognised. The Br io Hon. Gentleman said that there was no such passage ( time Speech. True, there was no such passage; but .V 1 other meaning was intended to be conveyed by the intilr tion that his Majesty had not yet deemed it expedieu r of re-establish our ancient relations with Portugal, but the embarrassments arising from the interruption!: c• creased his Majesty's desire to effect a termination of evil? With respect to our conduct towards the Pig States of America, he (Dr. Lushington) could not if ° upon our vacillation, and upon our anomalous rela 9 r„k with them, without shame. He could not forget 1 4 the late Lord Londonderry had circulated proclame o 4 . throughout the Spanish colonies, that if they would tbr e ee of their allegiance, Great Britain would r en d e r theia; fectusl support. What was done next? In 1E44 ,i same Nobleman put his signature to the most infidel treaty which had ever disgraced this country, wher e , England was made to express her earnest desire that l' o Spanish Colonies, which were endeavouring to vindk . t their liberty at our bidding, would retorts to their 5• 1 giance to Spain. On the subject of Cuba the Right HI Gentleman had expressed himself doubtfully; he was t 0 1 glad of this, and he should be glad if, eventually, Ete:l' should come out of this question fairly. Mr. MABERLY begged to make a few observation.) reply to what had been said of him, whilst absent, 114 HOIL and Gallant Member (Sir Joseph Yorke). 1 0 4 Hon. and Gallant Member, with ref e r ence t o what fallen from him (Mr. Alaberly) on the preceding nigh 4 lative to his plan of a paper currency, had said that he v r, not believe it. The Hon. Member ought to have Avi i till he had heard the details of time plan before he spclO v ii it with such a want of courtesy. But the lion. Me o r e had made some other remarks. If he meant by those ,)l marks any insinuation with respect to his (Mr. Alabert character and station in life, he hurled back the insinut i with the contempt it deserved. The Hon. a n d GO, Member had hardly kept within the line of Perliarmact o l, decorum ; but, perhaps, as the Hon. Member was i 3 l c/ habit of indulging in a vein of irony, the House migha: o l ; have been su alive to the impropriety as in the case of If other Member. The lion. Member might not be pers t i 4 f, but if he was not personal, what did he mean ? He (Fp( Mahem ly) felt called upon to niche there observation' , no Gentleman could say that he ought to sit quiet 0 0 what had fallen from the Hon. Member. ed3 l Sir J. YORKE said, that if he had used any expre ; 0 which were disorderly, the Speaker would have calla Vta," to order. lie (Sir Joseph Yorke) had positively the Hon. Member say last night, that he would furoi 7 0 , paper currency that should be quite equal to a neL 4 currency. The lion. Member now gets up and 8 did 1 mean to be personal ?" I have no Ifeeitatioe saying would have called me to order, and there arc Honour'? mean to to be you, p erso, S ia i l r, ; ad if n l t h o ad the been Ho p u e s r e s , o n t a lf l a , t ' , I iends about me who would have tugged me by the e laugh.)—l am sorry if 1 did use any expreuii, offensive to the Hon. Member, for whom I entertain' . mere respect. otl Air. MABERLY—I beg to assure the Hon. and w !ant Member that I am perfectly satisfied. tJ Mr. SADLER observed, that be had had no op? 1 eity yesterday of delivering his sentiments, nor shoo' 'de so now ; Lad it not been for the Bight Hun. a leenntr ?admitt ' lHe oh Miters 'Ping ti Tie Si t t he St 4 rtke ar ttlias it pitals Petted iinan be fe tould linty W* u 41 4E14 itnies I htfor e this (Mr. furd ec RAI RI SUrrd r•porl Va. Ti. ( pro ea 1(1 ) lay Past inci pop, per it lon oon Ce tI 4 trt gad eo / th, r g_tt th, t he pro th( • ow ' his ' - tti Lo ou Pr( r Ch th, ti kti Al t Lt fai