The Sun. — London, England, 1854-12-20 00:00:00

Tint II TIN, be faultless in talkies. care so to scout that idea, we 'are told so expressly snakes an army invincible, the and again I warn you that the consent of foreign sovereigns is to be obtained for drill, become valueless in alit fi which you cannot have the enlistment of their subjects, that I shall not argue that not to prefer the one ro cv , fc y r , that which you have at en el w d h ; e may point; for Ido not know at this moment any sovereign now without going ) ab Hop l ing that my remarks may not who has benefitted by the partition of unfortunate Poland home. (Hoar, h r ea to the patriotic spirit of th house, to whom you could apply with any hope of success for I have been distasteful wa of amendment to the noble lord's permission to form a Polish legion, and to employ it in the I now move, by e: this bill be read a second time this d ay • that war against Russia. Let me, however, upon this point emotion, cheers.) offer a word of advice to the Government. Whatever is months. (Loud MILNES w 1d to • • • of Mi- 1 Mr. MONCKTON . asg a be able to avail your present intention, seeing that the intentions • hmself of the opportunity to offer some remarks in reply nisters aro more liable to change than those of mere oral- e • - 'which 1 d • • exci e so much admiration, to the speeca nary mortals —(a laugh)—if hereafter you should see the \ an d to arguments hich e were as sincerely offered as they expediency of enlisting a battalion of Poles or other ardor were admirably delivered. (Hear, hear.) He beloved the tanate patriots, I implore you to make up your minds be- forehand what are to be the definite objects of thi s war. \ Principle to be just in itself, because the whole of Europe was engaged in thiswhile adoption of this contest, the (Cheers.) As the war proceeds, if you see your way to satisfy foreigners that the people of England \ bill would the restoration of Poland to her ancient rank among the There were not fighting for any selfish object, but for the libor arefree States of Europe, say so manfully. (Cheers.) . ties of the world dh • • -1 1.1 ) an t e independence of nations. ((J eers. few in England who will not rejoice at such a barrier for past Mr. ADDERLEY had no wish to call in question the to Russian encroachments, and such a reparation . .. _ . than levies necessity of the present war • he only questioned the fact crimes. In that case, the Poles would be more h th tth ' o d - arrived ' • ou aye , a e pen had when it had become necessary —they would be our allie3. (Cheers.) But, i y not prepared to 1 for England to resort to foreign mercenaries. He doubted, no idea of such an enterprise, if you are . to plant your too, theof the noble lord's for proposing the declare that one of the objects of the war is bill, then pause before viz., that it was always at the commencement of a war standards upon the citadel of Warsaw, or excite that assistance • dby this though it put arms into the hands of Polish refugees, , was require country, by you • lities. (Hear, hear.) Nov, Ino means followed that the whole means of the country the hopes of distressed nations. let us look at the n umber of these foreign troops altogether. were exhausted in the first year of the war. He, however, unlimited. Why, it is The bill gives you power to enlist differed with the roble lord, while he thought prudence ' 10,000 men at a time; but as soon as you have drilled them dictated that we should make use of all our national in this co untry, and despatched them to the seat of war, resources that were possibly available at the verylfirst cern ' drill another 10,000, and mencement of war, otherwise the enemy would be apt to you have the power to e nlist and Now, suppose that you were to en- form an inadequate notion of our power. We were not so o , without limit. list a n battalion of Poles, who, when peace was proclaimed, yet reduced to the neceseity of havingrecourse to foreigners, should still have no country, what would become of the and he wanted to know why the Government preferred large number of armed men whom you would leave on the hiring foreign mercenaries to using the national resources ? surface of Europe? Therefore, I say, for the sake of jug. (Hear.) Why should we have recourse to foreigners while tics to Poland, for the honour of E ng l an d, and f or th e the British colonies were offering to reinforce the army in cau se of social order on the Continent, I implore you, the Crimea ? They wer e assured by the Colonial Secretary before you think hereafter of seeking the assistance of the other night that there was no intention whatever by any distressed nationality, to consider well how far you this bill to express distrust in the loyalty and attachment will extend the definite objects of the war. (Hear, hear. of the colonies ; but surely, after the Canadian Parlia- It will be competent for gentlemen who succeed me to ex- ment had made an offer of its assistance, it was, to say tend the discussion of this bill into a survey of the general the least of it, ungracious to accept this measure in prefe conduct of Ministers with respect to the war. I have no rence to their offer. (Hear.) He was assured upon excel such intention. I have no wish to reiterate former charges lent authority that a letter had recentlybeenreceived from nor to bring into adroit display every casual error of negli- a Canadian gentleman, stating his readiness, in conjunc gence that may have occurred. (Hear, hear.) I can as- tion with other gentlemen, not only to raise a Canadian sure the Secretary-at-War that the other night I heard regiment, but to maintain that regiment during the time his eloquent speech with great pleasure, and pleasure more it served with the British army. (Hear.) While such honourable to both of us than mere admiration, for I did offers as these were being made, coming as they did from think that he satisfactorily disproved many charges that Canada, which could furnish the best troops in the world, had been brought against his own department, not, in. did it not convey a feeling of distrust to reject them in deed, byfany gentleman in this house, but which had creme favour of German mercenaries? It seemed to him to be a ated a painful impression out of doors. (Hear , hear.) downright insult to the colony; and being offered at this With regard to the Cabinet itself, I cheerfully recognise time, when the connection between the mother country men who have won that high name in the public service and the colony appeared to be most healthy and firm, was of this country which gives them a deep interest in its exceedingly unfortunate. Why should we prefer the honour and prosperity. Ido not know that there is one assistance of foreigners to that of our own blood and kin, man in the Cabinet, or in all the Government, of whom I whether in the colonies or at home? The other day the should wish to speak in other terms than those of personal noble lord the President of the Council recommended the respect ; but it is not a discordant combination of able members of the Mechanics' Institute to study the decline men that makes the most worthy Cabinet in times of and fall of nations, and remarked that it would be found peace, while the spirited conduct of war requires a prosasp. a sure sign of the decline of a nation when it became nume titude and decision, a rapid and comprehensive foresight, rically inferior to the nations with which it was allied. which can only come from a fixed unity of purpose and Now, if the noble lord was correct in that view, as no object. That unity the conflicting spirit of Ministers has doubt he was, it would almost seem from this bill notoriously belied. Take the last instance. Compare the that England was in the decline ; but he denied that sanguine tone which the treaty with Austria created else- she was numerically inferior to her allies. The nation where with the language and cautions scepticism as to its had ample resources within itself, and in the patriot important results expressed by the organ o f th e Govern- ism of its colonies, to furnish its army with plenty of re anent in this house. (Hear.) On a recent occasion the cruits without having recourse to a measure of this charac- First Ministerof the Crown assumed that the Government ter. The colonies being enfranchised from political di e . had been blamed for their reluctance in going to war, as abilities, had begun to feel a warmer attachment towards exhibited by the preliminary negotiations. That is not the the mother country, and it would be the height of folly to fact. The Government was not blamed for their reluctance weaken that feeling, by rejecting their offers of assistance to go to war; but what we regretted was this, that the in the present war; rather let them encourage it now state of public opinion in this country, which so deeply re- when they could do so with so much advantage to our sented the first disguised aggression upon Turkish rode- nationality, or a golden opportunity for still further pendence, had never fairly been represented to the Russian cementing the colonies to the British Throne would be lost Emperor ; and we stated that if the language used by our to us for ever. (Hear.) What troops could we havebetter Minister at the first, without being at all more threatening, than our own, or better than the Canadian Rifles—the had been much more frank and plainspoken, you would first volunteer force in the world, to whom we owe the have had a better chance of preserving peace than y ou possession of Canada at this moment. (Hear.) The noble could have by complimenting the Czar upon his moderation lord had attempted to make them believe that there were and fairness, after he had secretly proposed the subdivision precedents for this measure, and that if they rejected this of the Turkish dominions, and after he had deceived your bill, it would be a deviation from the teachings of history ; credulity by misrepresenting great military preparations as but, in point of fact, there was not the least appositeness an innocent mode of moral aggression. (Cheers and l a u g h- in the two cases which the noble lord h a d quoted; the ter.) In prosecuting your negotiations with Austria, I most apposite of the two, perhaps, was that of Spain ; but entreat you to avoid the spirit w hi c h p erva d e d y our nego - did the noble lord think England was red uce d t o thsame tiations with Russia. You h a ve h ere an o pp or t un ity o f state as Spain when she called in the assistance of the the most complete success. You have only to consider the British Legion? Were the colonies of spirit of your former negotiations, and to conduct your- position as those of Spain ? Certainly not ; and it would selves in a spirit diametrically opposite. (A laugh.) We be most humiliating to the country, and crushing to her never blamed the Government for not going to war until feelings of self-reliance, if the Ministers on this occasion all parties were prepared for it ; but what we wonder at is were allowed to accept the services of foreign mercenaries this, that the only persons in the three kingdoms who in preference to the noble offers of the colonies. (Hear, were unprepared f or th e war wore h er M a j es ty' s Mi n i s - hear.) Such a measure as this could b e on ly j us tifi a bl e i n tern; and so unprepared were they that the best excuse for the most urgent case of necessity -no such case I had been all of them is that they commenced a war which they now made out, and therefore, without' trespassing find to be protracted, and with a most formidable enemy, the house, he thought he had said quite justifyenoug h on t g o er upon with military preparations little raised above the ordinary his voting for the amendment. (Hear, hear.) establishments of peace, and upon the niggardly priaciple Mr. WATSON would support this and every other pro that its cost should be defrayed out of our ordinary which ca lcula te d re- Position was to carry on the war with venue. (Hear, hear.) The public were disposed to receive efficiency. your tardy assumption of energy at the commencement of Mr. E. BALL, as an opponent of the war, opposed this winter as a partial indemnity for at least your bill, which he thought compare- would only add to the calamities of tive indolence during the previous months of summer and the war. , autumn • but who could foresee efforts of your collective patriotism, reserved for made important a cur- a very announcement at the commence twine so pressing andprodigiousthat it why we are word about it in summoned together, although there was not a bill were defeated, the Government would feel it necessary the speech from the Throne, would be to, resign their offices. After that announcement the The national council is of as 1%0 1 2 i foreignerse question before the house must be approached with consi (Cheers.)order to prepare all its military reamer.... co ' u n o lazs i t e . , t ! e s in dereble difficulty by hon. gentlemen, and he (Mr. Gibson) us that the troops are so numerous that he doesata not too a _ w i l e n ue g ; .1 3:1. himself to protest against that system of over tellsknow what to do with them. Another minister assures thefethat, i ii. deliberate sentiments of the house by telling us that we could have a million, and when we are waiting up their minds—and that, l 111 71 a few hours' notice ? make an iraportant . •Ei to learn what is our actual muster, out comes this riciicu- tive measure—the Government w n ould consider iteeir la a - t. ha M243-011t comes this creeping, this crawling proposi- liberty to retire from office. He could not understand tion to go to some third-rate power for the loan of 10,000 why resignation was to be the consequence of the defeat of men. (Cheers and laughter.) It reminds me of the story this bill. (Hear, hear.)' Had .not hon. members seen in of an adventurer who was boasting to an acquaintance he the course of last session how measures of' domestic policy had picked up in a coffee-house of the enormous wealth ho involving great principles were defeated, although intro possessed, at a distance. He spoke of his castles in Corn- duced by the Government, and how that Government did wall and Yorkshire, of his copper mines in one country not think that those defeats rendered necessary their retire and of his diamond mines in Peru, and when he had ment from office? He maintained, then, that it was not worked up his friend to the highest pitch of expectation a s fair, upon a measure of this character (whi c h was , a ft er to what he might reasonably ex p ec t f rom th e munificenc e all, but a minor proposition with reference to the proposals of the possessor of such boundless resources, he suddenly that had been made for the carrying on of the war), for dropped his hand upon his breeches pocket and said, " I the Government to thre a t e n th a t it s rejection see something nice there at at the bar, have you such a a break up of the Ministry. Whichever way he should thing about you as NO. !" (Great laughter.) Well, vote upon this measure—(laughter)—he should vote with now, I repeat there is no parallel ease or precedent for this reference to its merits his and • s own conscientious convic bill, as I will presently show; but let me call the attention ~ions, and not to the of the house in the first instance to an opinion given upon that it involved a princi • • ple of far more importance than this subject by a great man, which must have the highest the resignation or non-resignation of the " weight and authority with gentlemen opposite. Iwill What was the before Cabinet. (Hear.) measure the house? By it they were real what was said on a similar occasion tothis by invited Mr. to enable her Majesty to enlist foreigners in the Grey, afterwards Lord Grey. (Hear, hear.) Thatßritish greatarmy, to Seta the battles of this . _ , e country, and to man once said, "1 cannot doubt that occasions may arise become the enemies of Russia. He wished to know h when it would be proper to introduce foreign troops into , ther it was consistentwithview w e• a sound of public law this country, but it should never be done except in • cases that Parliament should make • • provisions enabling the Ca of extreme necessity, and never should be suffered to be binet to communicate with the subjects of some neutral done without being watched with that constitutional state? Ought not jealousy which is the best part of the character of this Governments? He appealed to any hon. member in that house, and the best security of the rights and liberties of house to say whether or not it was policy sound to sepa the people. " Now, I appeal to the candour of the majority ratepeoples from t' • S • their Sovereigns, and to give power to of gentlemen opposite, if these words Mr. of at least justify • • .us in the jealousy with which we regard this bill—awljests of neutral States without at all recognising the whether we are right or wrong in that jealousy, Governofthose States? Governments or whether it is overstrained or not, I appeal t o them to What would be our feelings if a foreign state should at- Bay if it does not amply vindicate nsfrom the unworthy tempt to enlist men from England without the consent of charge that we are obstructing the necessary preparations the Queen? It was not consistent w ith soun d pr i nc i p l es n must t n to say, " For the purp ose for our G overnmen t t o a tt e mpt t o en li s t men from. foreign of our own d e f ence we us sometimes employ foreign States without the consent of their S i vereigns or Govern troops ; but still I cannot helpthinking th a t th e wisest ments, and at a time when they were at peace with th a t course for us to pu rsue i s to relyy upon the coura ge an d power w ith w hi c h we were a t war . A n d y e t it a pp eare d (Rear.) Where is your to him that that was the very policy of this bill. Not a case of urgent or proved necessity for this it has not been urged as a case of msure ? Why word was said about any treaty having been entered int o ble lord said not a word about these necessity, because the no- with any for e i g n Government. Not a syllable was s a id foreigneer, troops ear bei ng shout an y a lli ance , or an y un d ers t an di ng , b u t s i mp l y th a t, required for the safety of the nation. (R sir, he was too much of an Englishman for 'that, •a.)ndNl:e, by this bill, her Majesty would be empowered t o g o by means of her recruiting officers to foreign countri es —t o th e only urged itt territories at the most as a question of convenience. Th e of neutr a l State s — an d t o ra i se f orces th ere f or bill is required for the convenience of drilling the t roops in' the . ' this country. Well, then, it being a mere question of Eitaurrgaste of being engaged in the war with Russia. going to be done with the consent of those convenience, I say the convenience is not worth the pier- neutral States, con chase. It has not been unseasonably asked elsewhere, sent or knowleCl ur e. was f g i o t ing to be done without their how will the enemy regard this proposition ? (Cheers.) sent, then they g forfa l tted were hei to be done with their con neutrality. As they were What a pretext you give to the Emperor of Russia to re- prepared to exercise that Y belligerent right against Russia, present to his subjects the correctness of the estimate which they must also be prepared to declare war against Russia. he had formed of the power of the British people. (Hear, But, if they were so prepared, lett hear.) Well may he now refer to the braggart talk of the the face of Europe. (Cheers.) Lot them it openly, and in ene . ii:mter into an House of Parliament—their boast of the popular enthu- alliance with this country, and send forces as siesta—their willingness that the best blood of the nation their contingents in support of the common auxi cause. sthoould be spilt in the struggle ; well, I say, may he refer That course would be straightforward, and con n srsien iE t l w es i r th all these things, and compare all this talk with the sirn- the public law of Europe. But, if it were to be done without pie fact that in the first year of the war we are compelled the consent of these States or against their wishes, then the . to go somewhere else for the loan of 10,000 bayonets. And British Parliament ought not deliberately to sanction any upon what pretence do they seek this • hofpublic • assistance 9 he will ouch course naturally ask. Why, he will sa by th •• their own confession, of Switzerland and of other countries had passed laws to because they are not a military y n ' ation, and have not had prevent the system of carrying on wars by means of mer time since the commencement of the war to drill a suffi- cenaries. The noble lord (Lord J. Russell) might quote clout number of recruits for that ar m y which at th e b a ttl e to the house precedents of past ti mes —h e might go back of Inkerman could only ruusterB,ooe men- (Hear, hear.) to the middle ages—he might quote to them the precedent Sir, I. as an Englishman, am not willing na that the country of employing Indians, with their scalping knives and their should stand thus before the eyes of the ene Still less am I willing to stand thus before enemy. ( e C s h o e;rs.) tomahawks ; but, if the present war was to be carried on ally—(cheers)—while Ido not think it is the besty our as war had been carried on by the nations of Europe mode to in recent times, the plan proposed by this bill could remove the timid hesitation of Austria and Prussia not be adopted (Cheers. I am convinced, in spite of all your omissions, in. ins on war by the house, because the system of carry means of mercenaries had been utterly con spite of all your delay, that we have men still sufficient at 4 damned by tl y n h e w ole course of public treaties and of mu this moment to fight our own battles. (Cheers.) Yon tell nicipal law. (Cheers) It might be contended that every us that you sent ample reinforcements to the Crimea a foreign Power might all ow this country to enlist its sub week, nay, a month, ago ; and I say you have had plenty jade to make war upon Russia, and yet maint •am its non of time and means since for preparing and raising and dril- trality ; but that, he submitted, was a dangerous princi ling more. I say you have had an ample fie ld for raising pie to lay down, for it would justify the Government of a sufficient number of troops in the over - cro wded p o pula - the United States in permitting Russia to O ro Americans tion of the country. (Hear.) I deny altogether the idea that to fight against us in the present contest. (Loud cries of if you draft off in that way the labouring population of the hear, hear.) Ho had heard it said that a country e might rural districts you will disturb the operations of ag ricu l . l end its troops to carry on a war in another country with tnre, because the suspension of the ordinary industri al oc- out forfeiting its neutrality, if th ere were some , cupations of the labouring classes, especially in railway t reaty or understanding to that effect. But if ie existing thl that were works, caused by the war, has released a large number of t he case, ho wi s hed to knew with what country we had a ' • th e most able-bodied portion of ourpopulation. I believe, treaty of that nature? A little diligence moreover able the Go ~ er, you might employ to advantage in your army varnment to inform him what was the name of the large number of marines stationed at Chatham and that country, and he hoped that the Government would ether , Liu ~.maces. Try every other means before you resort to 0 tell him in what country it was that we were enabled to 1 wo n . _ this ; and if I were to presume to offer you advice, enlist men for the purpose of carrying on the war with emit'''. who to you, "Go into the best market for your re- Russia, ? (Hear, hear.) He believed that this bill would het h",,lZe e re you can get spirit and strength." That mar. embark this country in a course of policy most dangerous tonal y o ' n e t e home. Go there, then, and get the best ma- tO its future i °tercets, and calculated to multiply wars be long run, to il : at any cose— it will be the cheapest in the yond all bounds. (Hear.) If this country, by enlistment when the p et . us ee jt 2 Sir, I remember in the year 1779, of men the subjects of foreign States, should involve those hostile ships, ~,Q . . F rance and Spain were bristling with States in war with Russia, it would devolve upon thin Channel with s ten 4 4 3 , riean privateers were cruising in our country to aid - those States against Russia. (Hear.) H e sentatives of Ireia n e Y 4 ' .000 Lord Hertford offered the repre believed that two greet countries like England and France, the enemy would make eo descent foreign troops, in alarm that with the aid of Turkey, ought to be able to carry on the was their answer? sin itwas a upon their coast. What war with Russia, without having recourse to the dangerous refusal. (Cheers.) They .4 if w anly and independent course proposed. by this bill, namely, the employment of a potent to defend ourselves without e...are. not perfectly coin- diminutive sup ply of mercenaries. (Loud cheers.) In worthy cf being defended at ate ir retgn aid, we are not conclusion, the right hon. gentleman said he would vote came the representatives of Ireland ' , sorely that , answer be- against the second hisf the bill, to which he would unbecoming the united Parliament of entireth:it would not be offer every opp osition in power. in (tClheers.) Let me ask you how many of tu. kingdom. Mr. J. G. PHILLIMORE also opposed the bill as a the armaments of Rnesia, who bore with equal who dashed volving a calamity and a degradation to this country. and intrepidity the sufferings and caleini ti __Plat fortitud Mr. SIDICEY HERBERT said—Sir, in the speech the fatigues of the Crimea, how many a u' i 'Ll ,ea tli w se e a r so ant we have just. heard from the hon. gentleman the member B es) Why, then, the material of wbie e h new for Manches'eor (Mr. M. Gibson) he complained that her - British army in the Crimea consists is still to be fo the Aajeaty'a G.)verninent, in the speech of my noble friend amongst the labourers of this country ; and these are u t n b : the Lord Ps esident of the Council, acting as the meals men you should look to for your recruit 3 —men who lies k w )iece of G cvernment, had assumed a touo which their brothers and fellows in the Crimea, would til e r s not jus , eliable, inesmuch as he had attemptee by patient of their own sufferings as they were humane te e e a li r tei of reoignetion to force this house into a decision the wounded. (Loud cheers.) That is the kind of m a I s in )-- en " ut f r i l s rY to his own opinion and conviction. Sir, terial your army is, and should continue to be, made of i neividu e al ri. est) who hold at a high value the rights of You may draw troops from Germany, from Switzerland, in this honsniec-1 chars of Parliament. I hold that every men from Sweden. from Poland, when the absolute necessity e xact ophliot of its a perfect right to act in every case on his for it comes, but I say this is not the moment when, you bronco to en) 4 t e . ts . merits, if he so chooses, without re ought to set aside our own willing and able-bodied, stout- in the merit of the argument consequence. I have that confidence hearted countrymen, in order to arm foreigners for our forward, that • I eak aztem o ent which I am about to bring her of this ha defence. (Cheers.) Depend upon it, they will accomplish 050, a .d d eeie h i alleng e for it, from every mem merit?, moor , on given on conviction of its more for you than whole hosts of foreign soldiers, who line to the have been reluctantly trained to arms under the sway of likewise trues that in an necessity of the case. Bat it is despotic constitutions. • (Hear, hear.) The foreigner may to take what ever coarse they assembly which consists of men free like upon any be well disciplined, hie training may have been perfection, must not be any exception, still less that question, there but he will still lack that strength in his own right arm Ito be her Maje sty's Government—none mthits b e e xception is which has always been the characteristic of the British to forego that policy which they think vital to the public Soldier. (Chee rs .) With ou t that feeling which alone - interest, and. none must be compelled to do thatwhierthleye LONDON, know to be fatal to the public interest, because other gen tlemen choose to take a different view of what is or is not for the public interest. Now let me attempt to discuss this measure in perfect fairness. Ido not moan to insinuate against any gentleman who differs from Government that his motives are factious or hostile to Government, even if they appear to me to be founded on prejudice or misrepre sentation of the measure. I think that there is both in the House of Commons and in the country a desire honestly to give the utmost effect to the war which her Majesty's Government are now carrying on. Well, I think that I may make every allowance for differences of opinion, but I ask you to listen to the arguments which I shall lay before you, and which seem to me to be conclusive, first, as to the danger which it' is supposed will threaten the constitution ; and, secondly, as to the danger which it is supposed will threaten the British army from the ad mixture of foreign troops. Si., with respect to the danger which it is supposed will threaten our social state if we seek for aid in the prosecution of the war--which is 'not an English war, but eminently a European war (hear, hear)—the hon. baronet who moved that this bill be read a second time this day six months made great use of some arguments with reference to the precedents which exist for a bill of this kind. I will not delay the house by going into this subject at length. The precedents which were adduced by my noble friend who moved the second reading of the bill were not, he said, instances in which we were engaged in treaties offensive and defensive, but were mere pretences. Now, sir, as far as this question is concerned, I want to know if ever there was a case in the world in which a European quarrel was entered into which could not by common consent be called a German quarrel also ? Do you mean to lay down this principle—that if the law of nations be broken through —if some great and vio lent injustice be committed by a strong state upon a weaker one, are nations like Franco and England, who pro fess to be the leaders in civilisation, who profess to bo iu a great degree the arbitrators of the conduct of other nations — are they to abdicate their high functions—are they to say that injustice may be committed, that power and might are to make such inroads over Europe, so that at last, when it comes to their turn, they will find themselves unable to re sist it? (Hear.) I tell you that throughout Germany you have sympathy with you in the war, and is this sympathy of Germany to pass away and beax no fruit whatever. Hon. gentlemen say that "you have noinstance of raisingan army in countries not in strict alliance with you. You may go to Hanover, for Hanover is Hampshire. You may go to Prus sia, because Prussia is in alliance with you." These, how ever, are not all the precedents. In 1813 an act of Parlia ment was passed which appears to me not to be so chary of al liances. It appears to me that it is thought right at the end of a war, and not at the beginning of a war no stone should be left unturned ; but what happened in 1813 ? An act was passed to enable his Majesty to do what ? If we had corn. to the house and said—if we had come to Parliament and proposed to introduce foreigners into English regiments, I must say that in my opinion such a proceeding would have been unwise ; but do you think we have not prece dents for asking men to come and serve in our regi ments which former Governments have net introduced ? What do yon think of the act of 1813 ? We proposed to raise the 60th Regiment to ten battalions ; the Bth, 9th and 10th battalions were to be added to the 60th Regiment ; and orders were issued to the officers not to recruit the battalions 'in Russia or in Prussia, but to recruit them from foreigners generally, and to get foreigners from any country they could. You wanted precedents—you have got precedents—but I confess that if you have no prece dents to go upon, where you see a menacing and crying necessity, I say do not let us stand upon mere precedents, but exercise what is far better—oar own common sense. If you see the means of getting assistance and have the op portunity of getting ready trained troops, I say, in God's name do it, and do not talk about precedents. (Hear.) The hon. gentleman who has just sat down has asked what magic is there in being a German or a Swiss which the English recruit does not possess? I say that this is the magic. I say that the English recruit makes the best soldier in the world, and, instead of being made in five months, has been made in three months. You can make a soldier in three months, but can you convert a boy into a man in three months ? (Hear.) Honourable gentlemen ought to have read the letters of the greatest military commander that the world ever saw—l mean the Emperor Napoleon, that great master of organisation. You will find him saying, when he wanted reinforcements in conse quence of the immense consumption of men—you will find that he wrote constantly, and said, " Pick me out older men ; do not seed me boys who consume my rations, im pede my marches, and encumber nay hospitals." (Hear, hear.) I think that you have had experience of this. (Hear, hear.) I will state one fact. We have com mitted errors in sending out reinforcements. The house will feel that in operations of this description after a long peace our armies may be exhausted. Now, the great mass of the recruits which some in are, comparatively speaking boys. The youngest age is 18, and the greatest difficulty is felt in preventing them from passing them selves as 18, when they are much less, so that the greatest mass of recruits come in at the earliest age. Is this the best age for soldiers ? Young men in the higher ranks of life, who have been well-fed and well-lodged, are much more advanced towards the strength of a man than lads taken from the plough, who have had scanty supplies of food and meat not more than once or twice a week. What is the consequence of this ? Ween they are put into rations for a short time you find them to be growing lads. You say that in 1803 or 1804, when the war broke out—what did you do in 1804? For the first five years you acted on the defensive. So long as the army, is kept at home well quartered and well-fed, so long as it is kept in such a posi tion as this youth does not tell against it ; but at the first exposure to hardship and privation the constitution of young lads are not strong enough to bear up against them. When you send out lads of this age, whose constitutions are not fixed and settled, you find that, under the constant exposure to the weather, your reinforcements, man by man, melt away, your rations are consumed, your marches impeded, and your hospitals encumbered. Then yon re cognise the truth which the Mulperor Napoleon uttered. , who knew what he was talking about :—"I say you can make a soldier in three months, but can you convert a boy into a man in three months ?" I have stated without re serve the difficulty under which we labour. It is asked, what is the magic by which the German is excepted from this difficulty ? I think I can easily explain that matter. In Germany all the peasantry are subject to military con scription or military service in some shape or other. Mili tary service expires, generally speaking—l am not allud ing to any state in particular, but in most German states military service expires when the peasant has approached the age of 26 or 27. The German Governments will not give the peasant permission to emigrate until he has core • pleted the period of his military service, and he therefore Linnet leave the country until he is 26 or 27 years of age. We have German emigrants passing through England to the United States, to Canada, and to Australia, to the amount of 30,000 souls every year. Throughout Germany provisions are high, and there are in those states something like the feeling which exists in Ireland of the dedre to emi grate to another hemisphere. The amount of emigration to the English colonies is very great. It would be greater but for this circumstance, that as they are persoes of small property, and possess limited funds, they are obliged to take by preference that passage which costs them the least. Therefore the great mass of emigrants have gone to Canada or the United States, but if they had the means I have no doubt they would have gone to Australia in preference. Again, you should recollect this circumstance. The Ger man Government gives the peasants permission to emigrate as soon as they have satisfied the Government that they have performed their military services. That gives a power of denaturalisation. In England we have no such power. Some hon. gentlemen have said they de not know what number the Government can get, or where they can got them. Never was anything more truly said. I think the Government must be endowed with wonderful powers of prophecy, if they can tell how a measure will work when it is necessary to obtain the sanction of Parliament to that measure before they can put the proposition in any shape before the parties to whom it will bo necessary to apply. (Hear.) It is obvious that the Government cannot pretend to say how many men they will get, or where they will get them from. We may have reasons for forming an opinion on this subject from the statements which have been made to us by persons who have been accustomed to deal with Germans •, but we cannot pretend to say that we are going to take 30,000 men, 33,000 men, or any other number of men. (Hear.) The number, of course, is left very much to the option of honourable gentlemen opposite. The hon. baronet opposite took the case in both ways. He spoke of 10,000 men as something so insignificant as not to be worth mentioning; but when he thought the objection would be altogether fatal, he magnified the number into 30,1.00 or 40,000, and said that the worst part of the mea sure was that there was no limit. (Hear, hear.) There certainly is no limit in one sense. But there is a Parlia mentary limit. I apprehend that year by year the esti mates must be submitted to the house, a n d th e y mus t con no t exceed.ofin(Cheers.)en,which the T G h e o ye ru ru e ieat h wille m Par liamentary limit is therefore in your hands. There is no other limit, except that of the willingness of the parties to come. What we ask you to do is to try the measure. We think if it succeeds that it will be of the utmost value. We tell you we can get recruits faster than we can train them and make them soldiers, and I hope we shall continue to do so. (Cheers.) Bat this I know that if we have the means to enable us to spare these men until they are fit for service, we should make soldiers of them not merely to meet the enemy the first few days after their arrival, and behave as our recruits did at Alma and Inkertuan, but we should have men who would be able, besides fighting a battle, to undergo all the hard shi p s and privations which they may have to endure before meeting with the enemy a second time. (Cheers). When you pro duce a recruit able to meet the enemy in battle, you have not made a soldier of him • and what you have to do is, to o vercome the difficulties Which I have mentioned. I say, any Government, knowing the nature of these recruits, and knowing their extreme youth, knowing the risk to which they are exposed, knowing the certainty of their being laid up by fever or dysentery, in consequence of their inability to stand the fatigue and the change of climate—l say that if any Government, knowing these facts, should, in order to meet the prejudice or a vote of the House of Commons, neglect the means which they may have in their hands for providing auxiliary forces, whose services may give our men time to recruit themselves, that Government would be highly culpable. (Loud cheers.) Well, are we degrading our army by sending out foreigners to combine with them in these operations ? I can imagine the feeling entertained towards men who would fight for either Eng land or Russia, and I wish the hon. and learned gentleman would make himself the agent of the Emperor of Russia, and try his eloquence in Germany for a few days. (Laughter.) Do you think that the men of Germany will come to our standard for the sake of nothing but a shilling a-day? They will not come to those who pay the most. Thera exists throughout Germany a great sympathy with the Western Powers. (Cheers.) Are you going to deny to other countries all share of honest feeling against unjust encroachment ? Do you suppose you have the monopoly of that feeling ? Would our army be degraded by having such men fighting by its side? Did our army feel de graded when the troops of Germany fought along with them ? No, you may say, because these states wore in alliance with us. But do you suppose that the privates in our ranks entered much into the consideration of di• ploinatic reiations ! Do you suppose that Sir Colin Hal. kett, who is now at Chelsea in comfortable retirement, felt degraded when he w as identified with tilos. , men who under the greatest difficulties rendered him such es santial services? (Cheers.) I cannot read the debates of 1501 without seeing that the identical arguments were then ',reduced which are now used, and without a feeling of hu miliation that those arguments have not made one atom in advance. The hon. baronet says we were in alliance with Germany. But the army then raised was the most motley army that ever was seen, and was composed of very many nations. (Hear.) But, it is sail, you are letting these men supersede English soldiers. Now, if you will show me an army of Enelish soldiers consisting of seasoned men whom you may safely send to a foreign clime to undergo td. dangers of a campaign in a pestilential cou ntr y , I will a mit there is something in your argument. Bet y ou do no t attempt to do that. When you talk of supe rsedin g the Bri tish soldier by the German, you assume that the English soldier is a man of years sufficient to insure the stamina of his constitution, and you assume the German to be a mere boy. Bat I have shown you, and I hope satisfactorily, WEDNESDAY EVENING, DECEMBIIIII 901 that that is an error—that the English recruit is a boy— that the difficulty is not to make him a soldier but to con vert him into a man—and that the German is not a boy, but a soldier and a man. (Cheers.) I have no doubt that in the course of a few years you might raise up a great army. You might do so if you were to stand on the dfensive for four or five years. But we want to operate before that time. (Cheers.) Are you propel el to wait until these lads have become men ? We ward to do that now which you wish to have done when it may be too late. That is what we propose to do by this bill. (Cheers.) I do not pretend to say what number of men will come to our assistance ; but we shall he culpable if we neglect the opportunity of aet ting every man we can. (Cheers.) The right honourable e: gentleman says you have no right to complain, because you have got as your ally the most powerful military elation in Europe, and therefore you need not make any great effort to secure men to be produced at the shortest notice. Franco, as the right honourable gentleman justly says, is a very powerful military nation, but it is not the most power ful military nation in point f numbers, because, as far as numbers are concerned, Russia is the most powerful state in Christendom. But you must take into consideration not merely numbers. We will take the French army at 400,000 men. But does France consider a foreign legion such an unnecessary thing ? Does France acknowledge the supe riority of Russia, and her own weakness, in admitting foreign legions into her service ? France from the earliest days has been in the habit of employing foreign troops, and in the days of Turenne she employed Irish, Scotch, and Swiss regiments. France has now in h er p a y a legion composed of foreigners as an auxiliary to her troops. The right hon. gentleman spoke of the march of civilisation, but I confess that my views of the march of civilisation are not com patible with the system that is proposed, of neglecting the means of effectually carrying out our views against that Power which does its utmost to prevent the march of civi lisation. I ask those hon. members who consider that we can raise any number of troops, and render them effec tive in a moment, to answer me this question—What is the number of British troops, ho they 150,000 or 200,000, or bo they more, which would not be stronger or better for the addition of 50,000, 40,000, or 30,000 foreign troops ? (Cheers.) Success in war, after all, is in a great degree, after skill is considered, a question of numbers, and therefore, if you wish for success in this war, you must not neglect any means at your disposal to swell your battalions against the troops of Russia.(Cheers ) Stone persons say yeti have got the Turks at your disposal. I know we have, and they are troops who fight extremely well under certain circumstances. The Tarks fought very gallantly at Silistria. (Cheers.) I wish those gentlemen who talk of the use of mercenaries to recollect how many mercenaries, and German mercenaries, are engaged in the present contest. Wh o was it th a t organ i se d the army of Silistria ? A Prussian officer. Who organized the whole Turkish artillery force ? Prussian officers. What has become of them ? Have their Governments recalled them to their service ? Not at all. Who is Omer Pacha himself ? Omer Packs is of Austrian extraction. (Oh, oh.) He cer tainly is not a Turk.' In the Russian army there are many German officers. I mention these facts to show that we are not introducing a new system, but acting upon one which is in existence at this very moment. But you ask, how do these Turks behave ? What is said of the Turkish army ? It is said of the Turkish army that it is an army which fights very well beleind walls. Now, what is the meaning of the expression, " fighting well be hind walls ?" Why, it is a cautious method of saying that it is an army which will not fight except behind walls. And, therefore, if you wish to strengthen your army, you must strengthen it by men upon whom you can depend. Now, I have a thorough conviction of the gallantry of the German nation, and I deeply regret to hear them spoken of as the scum of Europe. (Hear, hoar, and no, no.) These are not terms which ought to be used to a nation which is manif e sting the greatest sympathy with us, and which must ultimately join us. a Depend upon it this great war cannot be carried on without the intervention of auxilia ries. Whatever may be your dislike to a bill which has excited the prejudices of many gentlemen,we must beware how we attempt to fight the whole battle by ourselves — how we use language and express opinions which may deter other nations from coming to our assistance. (Hear, hear.) This is a Europe= quarrel. Those who talk lightly , about the German nations forget that they are in c!ose proxi mity to Russia. We may have taken the most generous course, and may have been the first on the field ; but they must be forced into the field, and it does not become us to disparage them. (Cheers.) I have endeavoured to explain why we want assistance—l have endeavoured to show that, although we can get men, we cannot produce them in an effective state. I have shown that the assis tance of these German soldiers would be invaluable. I ask honourable gentlemen to vote for this measure upon its merits. lam not afraid of their decision. I tell you you have a right to vote for it. Each member has a right to vote for it, according to his own impression of its merits. All I claim for the Government is, that if you entrust us with the duty of carrying on the war, you will net censure us if we use our best efforts to do so effectually. You will not say, "We chain you to the oar—we do not care what is your opinion of what is right—we are the best and only judges, and it is for you to follow our behests with obe dience." That is a position which no Government can be placed in, and if any Government would consent to accept such a position it would forfeit all public confidence. We have explained our objects. We think that this bill is necessary. It may fail, but if it fails we cannot reproach ' ourselves, as you will not be able to reproach us. If it succeeds, it will be of incalculable assistance to us ; and believing that to be the case, we urge it upon the house as a measure which is necessary to the publicintorests. (Loud cheers.) Lord STANLEY said—l am generally unwilling to ad dress the house, and to-night I should be glad to leave the question under our consideration in the hands of the hon. baronet near me, whose speech was one worthy of his literary eminence. and of the cause which he undertook to advocate. I came up to this meeting of Parliameat, as I believe'almost every gentleman upon this side of the house slid, with the sincere hope that we should separate for the Christmas holidays without the occurrart,s of any circum stance which could tend to disturb the unanimity which at the present moment it is so desirable should prevail. No man who has the interest of the country at heart, or who possesses one particle of public spirit, can desire, at a period of groat public emergency such ae this, to throw any impediment in the way of Government. It is per -1 fectly obvious that any one who in such a crisis finds fault with any measure of a military character, whether offen sive or defensive, which her Majesty's Ministers may pro pose, does not merely expose himself to the customary and inevitable attacks of those who are the supporters of Government, but, what is of infinitely more importance, that he runs no slight risk of being misapprehended and misunderstood by the public at large. (Hear, hear.) There is therefore good reason why we should enter into this discussion with every feeling of reluctance and regret. (Hear, hear.) For myself, at all events, I may say that there is scarcely any measure connected with the conduct of the war, except that under our notice, which I should not have been nio t willing to pass over in silence. Mea sures might have been brought forward which wo could not have thought judicious, which we couhl not have thought the best calculated to secure the objects for which they had been framed; and under ordinary circumstances we might have been willing to content ourselves with pro testing against suck measures, with fixing the responsibi lity of their adoption on the Government, and with that protest we might have suffered them to pass without any further opposition. Bnt in this instance the act of the Government precludes that unanimity which we desire. (Hear.) It would seem as if, after all their professions of the necessity of union in the great struggle in which WO are now en gaged, they wished to secure a victory over ' their political opponents by compelling their opponents to surrender at discretion to their commands. That is the only hypothesis on which I can explain the policy which her Majesty's Ministers have here thought proper to pur sue. They are anxious to show that they have such a superabundance of strength that they can afford to pro voke the universal hostility of the country. (Hear, hear.) In their endeavours to accomplish that object, they have originated a measuro which, among all the multitudes of military projects dieocuss e d in th e course of this year, had :icie under which thi s bill is brought before hear, and a l aug h .) But what never, I believe, been suggested in a ny quarter—they have originated a measure o f which the originality is certainly are beyond orteh dispute.eus Icircumstances is certainly somewhat s i ngu l ar that, sum moned as we were to consider m easures connected w ith the war, and summoned, as were, for the purpose only, we ttohatbrlS.;2egeecfhorwwaasrdnostucfihllead with allusions to have not received i n the Speech from the Throne the slightest intimation of in intention on the part of the measure as this. aGomr (Hear.) tedrn and to one subject only, did it contain allay reference; an d her Majesty's Mi natueYdneettee topics ;4 the e o one subject, not lusters have introduce's)? two bills only for our considera ihfiacsatecuhabrrancutgehrt of the considera tion before we are to separate for the Christmas recess. One of these bills was alluded to in the Speech from the Throne ; e , founded or unfounded—that absolute was passed ever in silence. 'When one the less im portant, measure, and the the notice of Parliament, one is tempted to entertain a recollects the by suspicion—just the bill your object was to smia gglo hastily through the Legislature before the country. at large could have had time to take into consid eratiou — (cheers)—a n d so to extort • • 'mit or unkust, . front Parliament in a moment —I will not say of panic, but n in o ocie s ir which h i i n ch gig i n t in a moment of emergen ey—a sanction. to its provisions, • which - the deliberate jut figment of the nation must have refused. (Hear.) But what is the reasoning by which this measure is defend° I ? I listened to the noble lord while submitting it to the favourable consideration of the house with that respe , etful attention which he is always sure to command, and, I certainly thought—and I was not I believe, the only per -son who thought —that he argued like one who was pert orining a distasteful duty. But what are the grounds on wl tich this bill is defended ? Is it that you have not men eno ugh in this country ? Is it that you cannot got men in time I Is it that the men you do get are not of an eligible class ? Or is it that, all these con siderations apart, yos t consider the measure necessary on some general gre ands of policy ? The noble lord says that there is now a pressure on this country, and that that pressure is alwa: Ts felt by us at the commencement of a war. I have no don bt that such a pressure must exist whenever, in the mi dst of profound peace, a nation is called upon without warning to engage in a great war. But what Was yot it case ? Had you no warning (Loud cries o f " heal e hoar.") For upwards of a year —I will not say beter e any hostilities broke out—but for upwards of a year 'before any hostilities broke out in which you were engaged, was it not—l will not say certain —but was it not more -than probable that the English army would have to cute or the field ? (Hoar.) And if that wore the ease—if you w ere not taken by surprise —if the severe pressure of which we hear so much ought to have been mitigated by more. than a year allowed for preparation, and if of that time :for preparation you did not adequately avail yourselves, th are aro but two possible explanations of your policy—__ y eitl ler—which I believe to be the case— either the GovernnA ant voluntarily declined to employ the resources which thi , public placed, or were ready to place, at their disposal ; ,or else (that which no one asserts -that which no one conk suds for) there was a deficiency of zeal on the part of the country. Has there been the slightest backwardness may rife td s a by the public to prosecute the war with vigour— has there been the slightest indication of a want of enthusiasm on their parts? (Hear, hear.) I thiuk that to Veat question there will be no difficulty in findiug at ones an answer. We arc all aware—what I never for amo meet, doubted to be the case—that there w sin this coilintry a vast amount of l a t en t p u bli c s pi r it ready to hu c Wes i forth whenever the emergency of the moment might re quire it ; but I confess I did not antici pate the general- —the snore than general—the universal enthusiasm with which this war has been taken up by every class of the pew/ he. (Hear.) When we read such stories as that which L saw only the Other day in the newspapers —when we 11)&1_ of poor labouring men coming forward and contributing Vete carefully-hoarded savings of years to the Patriotic Fun ii— (cheers) —when we know, as I know of my ow n Persent4l knowledge, that operatives in Lanca shire, a portion of our people certainly not the most disposed to warlike pursuits, not boys, but men, earning 255. or 30s. sa week in the manufacturing towns of that county, harts left their homes to share' in the ill-requited porils and latig cies of a soldier's life in the Crimea—l think wa. I A v ,l3 5 ufacient evidence—if evidence were Tanted—that the country is willing and ready to devote its best energies to the successful prosecution of this mo mentous contest. (Hear.) If we wish for documentary evidence upon the subject, we have only to look at the statement made by the noble duke the Secretary of War in another place. According to that statement, as soon as it appeared evident that the siege of Sebastopol was likely to be protracted, and that the undertaking was likely to be one of greater hazard than had at first been sup posed--from that moment the number of our recruits had .one on increasing week by week until the last week, when it, had more than doubled that of any preceding week since the commencement of the war, and when we had enrolled six or seven fold the number of men we had enrolled six or seven weeks ago. (Cheers.) That is the evidence we have with regard to the state of public feeling upon this sub ject. I say, that looking at these facts, you need not fear but that you will be able, in the long run, to obtain in this country ample supplies of men for your armies. The noble lord spoke of the drain on the population of 28,000,000 to keep up an army of 200,000 men ! (Cheers.) I believe there are not at this moment in the United King dom less than 6,000,000 or 7,000,000 of male adults—that is to say, of men above 21 years of age. But will it be said that, large ,as that number is, you are withdrawing men from other occupations in which they might be more ad vantageously employed? Well, I meet that argument by a reference to a simple and notorious fact which the noble lord—not accidentally, I think—overlooked. I meet it by a reference to the reports of the emigration commission ers. You tell me of German emigrants—well, I tell you of English emigrants. (Hear.) -It is argued that there are many thousands of- able-bodied persons passing through this country every year whom it is desirable that we should employ in prosecuting the war; but I say, on the other hand, , that this very year, and up to this very time, you have bad not thousands, but hun dreds of thousands of able-bodied Englishmen and Irish men emigrating from our shores. (Hear, hear.) I deny, then, that we have any insufficiency of men, or that by recruiting among our own labouring population you would necessarily be diverting to military pursuits men who would otherwise be more advantageously em ployed. But then it is said, that although we do not want a sufficient number of men, it is impossible for us to get our men ready in time. Now, upon that subject there is, I think, a little discrepancy in the various statements we have hoard from the supporters of this measure. We first heard from an hon. and gallant member opposite a good deal about the time necessary to make a soldier. But the right hon. gentleman the Secretary at War set aside that argument, and told us that it was an antiquated superstition to suppose that one year or two years were required to make a soldier. According to the right hen. gentleman three or four months would be sufficient for that purpose. We have here a high authority upon such a point. But that authority does not stand alone. Two years ago our militia were embodied, and before they were embodied they were drilled for 28 days ; and at the expiration of that period of drilling a military instruc tor, who went about to examine and report on the state of the militia regiments, complimented them on being almost equal in efficiency to troops of the line. Here we must no doubt make some allowance for the language of compli ment, but still it could not have been so exaggerated that those men must not be supposed to have acquired a cam sidorable amount of military discipline. But I am in formed, on good authority. that if you bring your soldiers from abroad yon will not save as much time as you seem to anticipate. I pass over that question of the enlistment of intending emigrants passing through this country, because, after all, the depth of winter is not the time at which emigrants leave their homes. lam much mistaken if, at this particular period, we have among us any very large number of foreigners who- pr6pose to emigrate to 801110 more distant land. (Hear, hear.) I assume, then, that you will have to send over to the Continent for the foreigneis whom you propose to employ in your Majesty's service. You will have to recruit these men, you will have to bring them here, and large bodies are not to be so brought in a day, and even when all that shall have been done, it is evident that the Government do not rely on securing the service of trained soldiers, because they insist on having a further period—a period unlimited in point of time—during which they are to drill and train those men in this country. (Hear, hear.) The question then arises whether the rawness of the English labourer, unfamilia rised as he has been with the use of arms, will be produc tive of more delay in preparing him for foreign service than the delay which you must have to incur in the case of a foreigner, who must be brought here from Germany, and who, after having been brought here, must undergo a certain amount of drilling and training. That brings me to the next argument employed by the right lion. gentle man thst Secretary at War, when ho said that the question was not- so much as to the number of men whom you could &attire or the length cf time that would be required for preptiiing them to take the field, as the amount of hardihooctivhtch they might possess for enduring the la bours of a campaign. Now, I speak with diffidence on military matters ; but it does not seem a very recondite solution of the problem thus put before us, if your rules for enlisting are such that you cannot take men beyond a certain age—it does not seem a very recondite solution of the problem that you should for the moment relax these rules. (Rear, hear.) Why should you not admit men into your army of semewhat more advanced years? Why should you not admit men who, I quite agree with the right hon. gentleman the Secretary at War, will gain in point of endurance more than they can lose in point of activity ? Relax your rules and the difficulty of which you now com plain will disappear. There is another statement of the right honourable gentleman which I venture to dispute, although I must dispute it with some distrust in my own knowledge. He spoke of the landwehr system, with which we are all acquainted ; and I understood him to state, with sufficient , distinctness, that the foreigners whom the Government proposed to employ were men who had gone t'irough their term of service abroad, and who were no longer liable to be called into the field in their-own country; that was to say, you wore to select as recruits expressly on the ground of superior eligi bility the very men whom their own government reject— not absolutely, but as. less fitted than younger men for military service —(hear, hear)—not as unfit for service—l do not wish to indulge in any exaggeration—but as being past that age at which men are considered to make tho most efficient soldiers. (Hear.) The right hon. gentleman spoke of the age of those men as.being about 2 i 0r27 ; but I can state on high authority—l may say on high diplo matic authority—that instead of 26 or 27, the average age of those men is about 33 or 34 (hoar, hear)—or very nearly the age at which the English soldier retires from active service. (Hear.) It has been carefully impressed on us that this was merely a provisional measure, intended to guard against a temporary emergency. But if you want to meet such an emergency, I think you have resources at home of which you have not yet availed yourself. Ido not admire the system of subsidies. I can very well under stand that it would be very unpleasant—that it would be injurious to our national honour to be taking into our pay the troops of France; but if this is really a question of 10,000 men for a few months, I ask what possible objection can you have to call for that number of troops from the French Government, which, by your own admission, will be perfectly ready to grant them? (Hear.) It may, per haps, be urged that the French Government is not able to spare that number of men, or would refuse to send them ; but the noble lord himself said that the only difficulty the Allies experienced was the difficulty of conveying men out to the seat of war. If that is the case, however, I would ask whether it would- be less difficult to send out Germans than to send eut Frenchmen ? And I would -further ask her Majesty's Government why they have not long since applied to that great ally who has, with so much cordiality and sincerity, supported us throughout the whole of those proceedings ? (Hear.) Why have they not applied to him for temporary assistance in order to meet a temporary emergency? Why have they not addressed to him a demand, which would have been granted without the slightest injury to our national honour, and which it, would be perfectly easy for them to repay at some future time in one form or another ? This question has not been argued as a question of cheapness, for no one asserts that the employment of foreign troops would be more economical than the employment of our own troops. I• believe we are all prepared to admit that in a great undertaking there would be no real economy in em ploying second-rate materials. (Hear, hear.) After all, the pay which you give to your own soldiers is hardly more than . sufficient to supply them with the necessaries o f life ; and you could not offer a lower suns to foreigners, to whom even that sum could afford no great inducement to enter your service, and whom it would be your interest to place as much as possible on an equality with the troops of this country. Nothing, therefore, can be gained by this measure in the way of economy. Then comes the question of the military capacity of the foreigners whom you would enlist in the Queen's service. Upon that point we are still at a loss to arrive at any very definite conclu sion, notwithstanding the admissions of the right hon. gentleman the Secretary-at-War. Her Majesty's Minis ters were asked in another place where the new troops were to come from, and to that question the only answer which they gave was, that the Emperor of Russia would be very much obliged to any one who would furnish him with that information. But I confess that that statement appears to me a very insufficient answer. Speaking from conjecture I must say that I imagine you are prepared to treat, not with individuals, but with some foreign government. In considering that question it is impossible wholly to lose sight of the Polish question ; but that question is a very grave one, and I perceive that no member of her Majesty's Government has shown any inclination to introduce it into this discussion. I believe that to expect that we could afford any effectual aid to Polpnd by employing in our ser vice Poles who have for the last 20 years been exiles from their native country, would be one of the wildest dreams that ever entered into the head of man. If yoa wish to restore the nationality of Poland, you must adopt a policy of a character far more decisive—you must adopt a policy in which you cannot but expect the sympathy of the most powerful of your present allies ; and, above all, you must adopt a policy from which there will be no receding. I confess, therefore, that I shall be glad to find that that question is not introduced into the present debate. Is it, then, Swiss or Germans which you mean to employ? lam given to understand that in Switzerland you will not at present find any large supply of men prepared to enter your service, for there is at present a considerable demand for labourers in that country; and I believe, besides, that the Swiss Government has of late years passed a law, not pro hibiting altogether, but in many ways restricting, the en listment of their people in foreign armies. With respect to Germany, I must observe that I do not wish to enter into a discussion of that most invidious topic—the military character of the people of that country. But this 'I must observe, that 40 years have elapsed since the Germans have had any practical experience of war, and that the events of the years 1813, 1814, 1815 can hardly afford a fair trial of their military character. Throughout that period they unquestionably displayed great national enthusiasm in the prosecution of the war which they waged against the Em peror Napoleon. But in that war they had to fight, for the most part, against raw levies, and they possessed in general au immense superiority in numbers over the . enemy. And yet, notwithstanding these advantages, they were not uniformly or even generally successful ; and no thing can bo snore striking than the contrast afforded by their chequered fortunes and the splendid career of the Duke of Wellington throughout the same period at the head of the Engesh and Spanish army. All he contended for was that they could not answer for the conduct in the field of these German troops (we understood). But the ques tion was, What would bo the moral effect of this measure ? The noble lord at the beginning of the debate said, no doubt it would be a lamentable thing if they depended wholly on foreign mercenary troops; but, he added, that the number asked for was so small that no injurious effects could be produced. But then he (Lord Stanleye) asked, 'What effect would this measnre ha ve on _ th public mind? He would consider what woul d be said here if a similar step was taken by the enemy. I f the Emperor of Jimmie was at this moment advertising f or soldiers in every European enarket,what would be the r esult? He the d he have every newspaper and every publi c man say that Was beaten that his cause was unpopular,n that he was driven to his last resource. (Hear.) What he thought would be said and not untruly, in the present case, was, that we were only able to bring into the field a small army —efficient in conduct and c apable of doing its duty— but that as the army wss but small the genius of the country was not for war, and we had no 1110a118—Or no 16164. ~.,., means to a large extent—of repairing our losses by war without the aid of foreign mercenaries. With regard to the general question of employing mercenaries, he approved of the principle of allowing the war to go on with as little interference with commerce as possible. We had a good cause; we wore embarked iu war for the noblest objects, but it would be a degradation if we made war on trade (we understood.) He would not press that argument ;ho would content himself with saying that we ought to be the last to restore that system which Europe was fast abandoning. Then came the question as to German neu tralities. What was proposed by the measure? Was it intended to make foreign alliances by its aid ? Should foreign Governments object, even though foreign soldiers might be willing to enlist, he was very much mistaken if Government would obtain any largo number of soldiers from foreign states. But was this the way to carry on the 1 war? Suppose the case of a small state, who might sym pathise with us and who might at the same time be afraid of the power of Russia—what would become of its nen trality ? If there was any hazard in incurring the hostility of Russia, why, that hostility would be incurred as much by allowing the enlistment of soldiers as by declaring war against Russia. (Hear.) What he suggested was that we should not refuse foreign troops if offered, but if this offer was made by independent states it should be made without aid or assistance from us, and foreign states should do this at their own expense, and share the honour and danger with us. (Hoar, hear.) But this measure appeared to him nothing less than the revival' of practices during the American war, when foreign cut throats were sent to our colonies. It was impossible to expect by this measure to cement a union with Germany. And if the foreign troops should not be found equal to French or English troops their contempt would be added to the existing odium. He must object to the measure on several other grounds, and on the ground especially of public morality, and because sufficient necessity for it had not been shown. They were told if the measure wore not passed Government would not retain office. He would say one word on that. He never doubted the noble lord's sin= cority ; but duriug the period he had been in that house ho never recollected any Ministerial measure of importance being threatened with defeat that that probability of de feat had not been met with a menace of resignation or a threat of dissolution. (Hear.) Now, in his opinion, this did not appear to him a question on which, if Ministers were defeated, they ought to have a dissolution ; nor did a defeat necessarily call for a resignation. For he recalled to mind what had happened last session. In the Queen's Speech, promises of Parliamentary reform, and public education, and other reforms, were made, in all of which Government failed, without considering it necessary to re sign ; but now it was declared that, if 10,000 German mercenaries were refused, Ministers would resign. (Hear, hear.) He had no wish to embarrass Government by any vote he might give—they had the conduct of the war in their own hands, and it was better there should he no divided responsibility, and that Government should be allowed to carry on the war. But if the right hon. gen tleman, the Secretary at War, claimed the right to resign, if defeated, he must have a word to say to the right honourable gentleman on that subject. He did not doubt or dispute the right of any man to guard his own honour, but was it a patriotic or public-spirited course for Minis ters to say, if you assort we have made a mistake, it you do not admit our infallibility in every respect, we will embarrass the country by resigning. (Hear, hear.) He recollected something of the circumstances under which that political party now at the head of affairs came into office. They laid down the principle with great eloquence, and thereby they gained no small share of public applause, • that when any national difficulty or important public mea sure required any sacrifice of individual opinion—he did not say of political character—that it was not only lawful, but necessary in a moment of national embarrassment to make that sacrifice in consideration of national interests. (Hear.) All he would say was, if they were in earnest in the avowal of their principles, now was the time to prove it. They had made a mistake. Their own organs of the press said so, and so did their own supporters in private circles. If they persevered they wouldrousea feeling which would, doubtless, be fatal to their tenure of power, and prove dangerous to the country. Admit for once they were wrong, and in the frankness and honesty of that atonement the people would forget the folly of the design. (Cheers.) Sir J. FITZGERALD, in a few words, justified the wisdom and expediency of the measure from his own ex perience in the Peninsular war, and on the ground that the Emperor of Russia was already having recourse to a similar step in raising an auxiliary force. Lord PALMERSTON and Mr. DRITMMOND rose to gether, but though there were loud calls from the Opposi tion for the latter, he gave way. The noble lord said—Mr. Speaker, I confess I never. was • more disappointed, and, I way say, surprised, when I learnt the course which the party opposite had thought it their duty to pursue with regard to the present measure. Wo have had from them the most unreserved, and, I will do them the justice to believe, the most sincere declaration that they admit to the fullest extent not only the importance of the object for which the present war was begun, but the justice and the necessity of that war. (Hear, hear.) The Govern ment has been reproached by their organ, and frequently by members of their party, of not having conducted the war with sufficient energy and vigour (loud ironical cheerS from the Opposition)—of not having employed all the means they might have employed for that purpose—(renewed Opposition cheers)—and then, sir, when the Government comes to this house, and, for the first time--(prolonged cheers from the Ministerial side of the house)—asks this house to relieve the Government from the difficulties which prevents us employing those means of vigour to which we attach importance, they favour us with disquisitions on what the consider constitutional principle, with the reproduction of antiquated arguments belonging to ages gone by—(cheers)—and we are refused the power to employ an instrument which we think—and with reason and justice—conducive to carrying on the war with vigour and success. (Continued cheering.) • Now, sir, if what we ask were something altogether new and unheard ' of ; if the measure we propose for the purpose of adding to our resources for conducting the war were such as had never been practised by any Government or nation before, I could understand that objections would be raised by gentlemen astonished, for the first time, by a proposition which was likely to serve the purposes of their opposition, and that they might object to the bill on the ground of its novelty ; but, so far from this measure which we now propose to Parliament being a novelty, it is a matter which has been practised, not only by all former Governments in this country, for the purposes of war ' but practised by almost every other nation when engages' in a great and arduous'struggle. (Hear, hear.) With regard to the con duct of this country, it is a matter of perfect notoriety, a m has been explained in detail this evening by my noble friend the President of the Council, and my right hon. friend the Secretary at War, that the Government of Eng land, with the consent of Parliament, in the great'war in which we were engaged with France, employed a great number and variety of foreign troops in aid of, or as auxili aries of the British troops. We had the German Legion, we had the BrunswickiansAwelhad: Portuguese, we had Spaniards, wo had the Corsican Rangers, we had Sicilians, and we had the Chasseurs d'ltalie. I saw, myself, num bers of the latter in British uniforms descending the southern slopes of the Alps, at the conclusion of the peace, on their way to their Italian homes. Sir, these men ac quired credit and distinction in conjunction with the Bri tish troops. anti their services were duly acknowledged by the Governnient in whose cause they had fought. But, sir, the French at the present moment, as has been well stated, have foreign troops in their service. What was even the practice of that great commander Napoleon, who had command over all the resources of the French nation, which was devoted to his cause, and ready to support him in all the wars in which he was engaged ; who had the power of conscription to draw from every province of France any men he chose to have? Why, his army was full of foreigners, fighting side by side with his own legions. (Cheers.) Could it 'be said he was degraded by such em ployment of those foreigners ? (Cheers.) Why, sir, there is no reason why England should not adopt this system, and obtain supplies of foreign troops in the beginning of the war. Foreign Governments differed from us in the prac tice they adopted in an important matter with regard to this subject. In the first Dlace they maintained large mi litary establishments in a time of peace—they are prepared when war breaks out with adequate forces to meet the first exigencies of the public. In England, on the con trary—and I do not dispute tho wisdom of the practice— Parliament insists, on the conclusion of a war, on a reduc tion of our military forces to the lowest amount consistent with the duties and exigencies of a peace. War, therefore, finds us with a peace establishment—with an establishment calculated, not, as in continental countries, on the chances of war. Then, the noble lord who spoke on the other side of the house said, that as we had foreseen the war, we ought to have been prepared to meet it. Why, sir, if, when negotiations were going on which might have led to an amicable settlement, the Government had come down to Parliament and proposed a war augmenta tation of the army, what would Parliament have said to such a proposal? (Cheers.) Well, sir, in another respect also foreign Governments stand in a different situa tion from us. They have the power of conscription—they can issue an edict for any given number of troops—these troops must come within a specified period—they must be of the ages and description which the Governments choose to direct ; and, in this way, these foreign Governments have this the power to make an augmentation of their armies within the shortest possible period. We, on the contrary, wisely, and advantageously in the end, I think, because it makes our army of infinitely better stuff than an army composed of conscripts— (Opposition cheers)—we trust to voluntary enlistment when we want to increase the number of our forces. (Renewed cheers from the Op position benches.) But, sir, that advantage must be ob tained at a certain sacrifice, of time. (Cries of " No, no.") Wo go into the labour market to compete against the in dustry of the country. We have been just told that shave a population of 26,000,000 to 28,000,000. It is known that ono-fourth, on a general statistical calculation of the popu lation, are males, fit and able to bear arms ; and you say to us, " Why don't you get 6,000,000 or 7,000,000 of men o of an age . fit for military duty? Why not at once send ..., the Crimea any number of men whom you may wi,i4 l , t e t se enter the service?" Why, sir, my answer is . this r : :—'These men service men who are of an ago andeonhition fit for of are employed in all the various branches industry a in the take out of the mar e , it whe c te o t u lu nt e r t y ry . , s Y hd ou ev h e a r v y e l t , o ooo go to market ark . et and compete with that enlist into the army,the supply ; and there- ford the e r o. ice of labour, because it increases the demand by process voluntary enlistment, e. foro it is obvious that the i y e e soldier i ::t e s i nder more slow and Urn n arl y u n a n armyg • f wh i ch l while it gives you an iis get him, must necessarily th m e e n nt l at s i a o y n tohfist practice a n n ia y y g h re e at re by the example of all 'c m on a j y nn e ' c a t y io ; n with your em ploying foreign troops own, is a practice consecra e . ci a t u a d rod s . u t d alv den ienlll au this in country, and adopted by the Governments Governments 11. ts of our a les. (Hear, hear.) But it is said, Governmen very good thing, but that may be a , you should keep for it cued of the war. (Hoer, hear.) N ew, if ever there was rose „nee o f putting the cart before the horse, that is au surely it. (Laughter and cheers from the Government supporters.) Why, sir, it is in the beginning of a war, w hen WO are starting with a a peace establishment, and s av ing with that peace establishment to provide for the ex igencies of a large great and arduous campaign, that you want a sufficient force, and not after the lapse of a certain number of years, when youhave, by voluntary enlistment, recruited your ranks and are able to oppose an army of your own equal to the demands of the service to be performed. (Hear.) It is true that one of these acts was passed at a la- ter period of the war, but it was when the war assumed a new development and required all of a sudden a greater augmentation of the means by which it was carried on. Now we are toid, "Oh, this mountain has brought forth but a mouse; you make a great figure of this measure, and you only ask for 10,000 men, and you seem willing even to take a smaller amount if the house should refuse that number." Why, that is a perfect misrepresentation of the measure we propose. All who aro versed in the constitution and the laws of the country, know that the Crown wants no authority from L'arliament to employ any number of foreign troops out of r e#4 l the kingdom. The Crown has power to do that wither any newlaw. All we alk of Parliament is that whichiJ constitution requires Parliament should sanction—the troduction of foreign troops into the kingdom, because it is contrary to the law and constitution—(hear, hear, iron the Opppsition)—without the approval of the Legislature. Well, than, gentlemen, by tho most extraordinary cc nfu sion of mind, say that, because the introduction of foi troops without the consent of Parliament is contrary to the constitution, therefore their introduction is evidently unconstitutional without such consent of Parliament— (~liniaterial cheers )- and therefore the bill is a violation of the constitution, as it permits something which is not allowed by the constitution. (Cheers and counter cheers.) Well, then, it is - said my right hon. friend has shown the greater value of the recruits that will be obtained from Germany in consequence of being men of well-formed constitution, and in a manner capable of supporting those fatigues and exposures which are necessarily incidental to carrying on the war. But gentlemen turn round and add—" Why, if these men are such as you describe, and are trained soldiers, do you want power to bring them into this country to train them?" (bar.) It is then observed, " They are already trained." (Rear.) Now, that is a very g ood civilian argument — (laughter)—but military men, like my gallant and learned friend who has just spoken (Mr. Watson) knew very well that if we get a great number of drilled men, they require being organised or formed into regiments, made acquainted with their officers, clothed, equipped, and armed, and that this force is essentially necessary to convert a number of tredve, however well trained they may be, into regiments fit for service, which must be performed somewhere, and to perform it anywhere but here is a matter ofimpossibility. , But although you limit the number to 100 00 in this bill, the number of the troop engaged on the field is only limited by what may be sanctioned by Parliament in the estimates when they are presented by my right hon. friend There is no limit in this bill except as respects those foreign troops that shall at the same time be within the United Kingdom. But you say, " You don't tell us where you mean to get the men." (Hear, hear.") You have e great curiosity to know that. There is some mystery in all that. (Hear.) Why. sir, my right hon. friend has well stated that, until the Government knew whether Parliament would permit them—(cries of oh, oh) —eve could not engage in negotiation with foreign governments for the raising of these troops. (Derisive cheers.) I should like to know *hat those great constitution reverencers — (a laugh)—would say if they were able to get up and ex tract from Government that we had been in negotiation with foreign governments for the levying of these men - (Ministerial cheers)—previously to the sanction of Parlia ment being obtained for the purpose ? Those who com plain now would, in that case, have had goodright to com plain of our having violated the principles of the constitu tion, and they might then have adopted, if they chose, the doctrine of the noble lord ; they might have punished the Government as he proposed to punish us—(a laugh) — which was not exactly in the manner of the volunteer who wished that Divine justice, if resolved on visiting the Go vernment with vengeance, might punish us, not by send ing us to the infernal regions, but by keeping us to our posts. (Laughter, and cries of oh, oh.) I say, sir, then we have no other course to pursue. Mystery there is none with us, except what you only are able to solve ; how it happens that those who are the first to taunt the Govern went with deficiency of vigour in carrying on the war, should object to the measures for giving us ampler means for prosecuting that war. (Cheers and counter cheers.) That is a mystery on the other side, and not on this, and, therefore, I hand it over again to you. (Cheers and laughter.) I say again, sir, that this proposed -ad dition of Germans, or whatever ether nation it may be (for I shall preserve that mystery)-,-(a laugh)— (to leave the Government in the most perfect freedom to get good soldiers wherever they can), 'it is obvious to any one who dispassionately applies his mind to the matter, that the acquisition of 10,000, 20,000, 30,000 or 40,000 well-disciplined and trained Germans or other: fo reigners, or whatever number which the Parliament, upon the estimates being shown them, may be pleased to sanc tion, such an addition would be of the utmost value to our countrymen now engaged in that arduous service. (Cheers.) I think it is due to them to give them that as sistance. (Renewed cheers.) Deeds. have been performed not only, by our troops, but by the Allied army—for I speak of the French and of the English as equal in distinc tion, each running to the assistance of the other—each (at rivalling the other -I say, sir, their deeds, their gallantrY , their bravery, the achievements of the Allied army, surpass anything which we read of either in history or in romance. (Loud cheering.) But, then, these brave men deserve something at our hands. (Loud and continued cheering from all parts of the house.) Aye, they have shown, as has been well stated by the right hon member for Bucks on a former occasion, that the increasing progtess of civi lisation, the augmentatioi of wealth, everything which conduces to the progress of a country, and the long con tinuance of peace, does not enervate the .Britirth-nation , butelike a field that has lain fallow, has only rendered it more fruitful of the qualities which distinguish a nation in the pursuits of war. (Great cheering.) So many of the highest rank and the most ample fortunes, with every inducement which could detain them at home, derived from the adVantages of birth, of wealth, and of rank, have abandoned all under a sense of Ohne duty to their country in the field. (Hear, hear, hear.) We have seen the humbler classes rivalling the chivalry of those who led them. (Cheers.) We have seen such hon ourable emulation, as made it impossible , to say whether the leader or the led most deserves the applause and the gratitude of the country. (Cheers.) Well, sir, I say again that these brave men deserve that we should do whatever we can to assist them. What'is the enemy with whom we have to contend ? It is a Sovereign who has, comparatively speaking, unlimited means of filling the rattles of his array. We have seen the blue-eyed children of the North, along the Baltic coast, coming, division after division, to swell his army is the field.; and are we to allow the limited means of England and of France, pitted against these in , creasing numbers, to remain unassisted, when we can send them men to their assistance. I say it would be a cruel mockery to pursue that course; it would be an abandon ment of our duty, a violation of what we owe the country, if we tie up the hands of the Government from furnishing our fellow-countrymen with the means of rendering their services with more vigour. I say, therefore, if there be in the house any who have friends and relations exposed to the dangers and fatigues of this war—l say if there be any who mourn friends and relations who have fallen victims to their duty, that they should not allow these friends and relations to have shed their blood in vain, or to have sacrificed their lives to no advantage. (Cries of "oh, oh," from the Opposition, and cheers.) I say, that those who entertain a due sense of what is owing to the national glory will not refuse their sanction to this measure for carrying on the war with more vigour And greater chance of success. But you say to us, " Why did we go to Sebes.. topol Why go to Sebastopol ! Because Sebastopol was the central point of Russia on those waters where wo want to defy his encroachments. If, instead of going to Sebas topol, we had given battle in the plains of central Russia. we must have fallen into a great mistake. But why not wait a year or two ? Why, if we had waited but one year, we never should have taken Sebastopol. Any delay in that expedition would have frustrated the object which we had in view, and that object, if it is to be gained, requires a sufficiency of means. I say again, sir, we have engage d in a peat war with a great power for great objects—(hear , hear)—and it is not becoming this country, it is not suited to the interests or the honour of this country, that this war should end in small and insignificant results. (Hear, hear.) To obtain results adequate to the contest, and eonformably to the interests and honour of the country, recourse must be had to great efforts. (Cheers.) Let not the house deceive itself ; it is not by small de tachments and insignificant forces. (Great cheering from the Opposition.) If that cheer means anything, you will vote in conformity with your cheer. (Counter cheering.) But I say that the results which alone befit the eiresun stances in which the country is placed require gre it and continued efforts. We are making those efforts at home; we shall add to our great army in the East every rein forcement which—having, as I will yet say we have, * noble reserve in the British nation—the people will afterd as in sufficient numbers and condition to be effectual on the field. But in a case of this sort, every effort, every addition which can be made to our available means, it is the duty of Government to make, if Parliament will give them the power ; and I should be sorry to think, in the present condition of this country, in the circumstances in which we are placed, of a Government that would shrink from proposing to Parliament and from asking such means as they should think, upon their responsibility, necessary to the vigour of the operations of the war. • But, sorry ne I would bo to belong to a Government that would abstain from that duty, still more sorry should I be to belong to majority of Parliament who would refuse the Mali of carrying out the very principles which that majority ad vocated. (Prolonged cheering.) Mr. DISRAELI—The noble lord the Secretary of S' $) for the Home Department, in a tone of bantering which he well knows how to assume when he has a very bad cause, has commenced a -reply to the very grave and wellecon siderecl arguments made use of by •my noble friend the Member for Lynn in terms of good-natured abuse, and am only surprised that the noble lord, in alluding to the arguments made use of on that side of the house did not call them " antiquated imbecility." (Laughter and cheers from the Opposition.) I agree, andl think every gentle man will agree, with the noble lord that the country is in a position of extreme difficulty and danger, anti that it is necessary that it shall snake exertions commensurate with that position, but we are to decide to-night, not whether England would wish the house to make efforts• equal to the emergency, but whether the measures which the Go vernment have thought proper to introduce are such as to merit its approbation. (Cheers.) .The noble lord, as well as the Lord President of the Council, has unwisely entered into the general conduct of the war. The noble lord, as well as the Lord President of the Council, Las told us that England is a great naval power, and that theirefforts must o b o e o d o e t v r o y t e o t o l p t h r i e n o c a a 1 0 l y . o t o f m e o a o i li r e t n e n r t t h h e e y s e u l p i r u e d m e a t c o y of t t ho i, o he . portant services of the Baltic fleet. (Laughter, and Oppo• sition cheers.) The Secretary of State, having to defend the proposal of the ministry for the levying of foreign troops and the enlistment of foreign mercenaries. vindicates the conduct of the Government in attacking Sebastopol. It is therefore perfectly open to me to refer to such circum stances connected with that operation as I may wish to dwell on, and I hope neither of those noble lords will shrink from the discussion of the inerits of the questiou which they have proposed. Well, sir, we are at, war with a power which the ministers at length admit to be a mili tary power of great importance--(hear)—and I am bound to say that, although that conviction seems to have reached their minds somewhat late, they lose no opportunity of imparting it to the country. I believe the great fault of their conduct hitherto has been that they have been carry leg on the affairs of the country for a considerable period in total ignorance of the circumstances with which they have had to contend. (Laughter.) I shall say very littleof the constitution further than to remark ;that the noblelord the President of the Council seems to me to have . spoken with much less 'reverence of the constitutio n than is usual agreeable to the country that foreign troop lion of 10,000 listed and trained in this country to the . n with him—(laughter)—but I will say that Ychheatilliebreitwins. but by the feeling and wishes of the country o sident of the Colin uot suppose the noble lord the Lord be Home Department is a question to be decided, not by constttutToint:lellfrylerdso, cif or the Secretary of State for the l en the people of this o arrange country were c would wish the time had arrived w tell], nor would they wit scents contemplated in this exaltation or satisfaction, ness them with feelings of s which are calculated, in for they are not eireumstan o c e cellos] upon witness th excite such emotions Bed a free country like this, I shall not, therefore, dwell on that topic. Brit the conscious noes of the great word:arbor -namely, that they are to conduct greatest military Power much greeter' of which he is a. me noble lord the Secretary o h f ee S fe ta u t e e e , t w o i t t h h e the S War • reseed as ecre ary of as impressed eithr England or France with whom eve upon us, than' to i h are ellied--hae yet ask himself for the means byh-° i a o c r on oi t o e t st of w i i i t o lt h h o e rs, they propose to attack the enemy. The noble lor d= a Government