The Sun. — London, England, 1854-12-19 00:00:00

THE SUN, LONDON, TUESDAY EVENING, DECEMBER l9, 1854 IMPERIAL PARLIAMENT. HOUSE OF LORDS—(YESTERDAY.) . Their lorclihips met at five o'clock. DISHONOURED BILLS OF EXCHANGE, &c., BILL. Lord BROUGHA.M, in asking leave to introduce a bill to permit the registration of dishonoured bills of ex change and promissory notes in England, and to allow execution thereon, took occasion to lament that he should now see this country involved in a war of civili sation against barbarism, and also regretted the attack made in that house and elsewhere again st a powerful empire—Austria—whose position was so peculiar that we should not blame her for her tardiness in joining the Western Powers against Russia. Leave was given to bring in the bill. THE VOTE OF THANKS TO THE ARMY AND NAVY. On the motion of the Duke of NEWCASTLE the names of Generals Estcourt and Airey, and of Admiral Stopford, were added in the vote of thanks which their lordships had passed to the army and navy. The Earl of ELLENBOROUGH expressed a hope that this motion would not be drawn into a precedent. COLONIAL AND WAR DEPARTMENTS. Earl GREY moved for an address for copies of any orders made by her lelajesty in Council with respect to the appointment of a fourth Secretary of State, and the division of the Colonial and War Departments, and of any correspondence between the different departments of her Majesty's Government with reference to the changes w hi c h may have been made in the arrangements for transacting the business of the army in consequence of the above division. The Duke of NEWCASTLE said there was no ob jection to the motion. The motion was accordingly agreed to. THE MILITIA. The Earl of GLENGALL wished to know from the Government how many regiments of Irish and Scotch militia they intend to embody. He would rather have seen the whole of the Irish and Scotch militia embodied than that we should have recourse to the aid of foreign mercenaries. The Duke of NEWCASTLE•justified the course which the Government had taken. Nine regiments of militia in Ireland had been embodied which would produce from 7,000 to 8,000 men, while other regiments had been only enrolled. A. similar complement of men would be raised in Scotland. Lord DESA.RT was exceedingly glad to hear that the Government intend at length to embody the militia upon an extensive scale. At the same time it was to be re gretted that they had lowered the military character of the nation by having recourse to a foreign enlistment bill, which had, as was to be expected, met with unusual condemnation. English honour and English interests could be protected without having recourse to hired foreigners. ENLISTMENT OF FOREIGNERS' BILL. The Duke of NEWCASTLE moved the third read ing of this bill. The Earl of ELLENBOROUGH said, as his noble friend the noble duke had not intimated, in moving the third reading, that it was his intention to propose any further amendment, he presumed they might under stand that the bill was to go down to the House of Commons in its present shape. That being the case, and, as very few of their lordships were present on Saturday—(hear, hear) —it was but right he should state to the house what the material alteration was which the bill had sustained in its progress through the house. That alteration was confined altogether to the substitu tion of 10,000 for 15,000 foreigners. No doubt, that was a very material concession on the part of the Govern. ment. It was one which did not do any very great credit to the forethaught and mature consideration which ought to have presided over the concocting of a bill of this great importance, inasmuch as it appeared to them a matter of very little consideration whether the number of foreigners to be employed in this country was to be 10,000 or 15,000. But was there no other improve ment Because there could be no doubt, under the second clause, ill-worded as it now was, under the head of bodies of reserves, it was possible for the Ministers to retain in this country, as reserves of foreign troops employed abroad, a very large proportion of the 10,000 men whom the Crown was permitted to have in Eng land. It was a remarkable circumstance that, while it. was declared to be the intention of the Government that t!ee reserves of the British regiments employed in the Crimea should be established at Malta, or some place convenient to the Crimea, it was proposed that the reserves of the German battalions should be re tained in England. Now, that being the case, it seemed to him very unnecessary that those Germen recruits should be brought to this country at all. (Hear, hear.) It was sa id th ere wou ld be inconvenience, danger, and r i s k, i n emp l oying and embodying zac,7i t s l o ie n s s e . foreign troops in he r M a j es t y ' s M edi terranean But from what did that arisel From distrust ' —(hear, hear) —and if they were distra c t e d i n one of themt garrisons of the Mediterranean, h ow could t'nere be 0.1,3 r security in employing them in the Crimea, with, he would not say, every probability, but with every risk, that after having been raised, disciplined, and clothed by the English Government, they might transfer their services to the enemy whom they were engaged to attack. Tne noble duke had j ust stated that there were not enough bar racks in the country for the militia. Where, then, were the German recruits to be placed in the event of their being brought here ? If they were to be placed in the existirg barracks it could only be through the exclusion of the militia, and the Government must defer embodying the militia until such recruits are sent out in succession to the Mediterranean. (Hear.) But there was one point - which had not been adverted to ; it was containul in the sth clause, and appeared to him to be of very great importance. (Hear.) By that clause her Maje-ty was empowered to make supplementary articles of war, which were to apply to the German and other foreign troops which might be engaged. Now, by the Mutiny Act, hei Majeety's articles of war were transmitted to the judges of the superior courts, and they were bound judicially to take notice of them. The judges of the superior courts would, therefore, be compelled to take notice judicially of two totally different sets of articles of war, applying to two different bodies of soldiers in her Majesty's service, via., foreign and English soldiers. But that inconvenience was nothing to having in our service foreign and English soldiers subject to different articles of war. The same offence, committed at the came time, and in the company of each other—the Englishman and the foreigner—would, under different articles of war, be punished in a different manner ; and none could fail to see that the effect of this on the feel ings of the troops and the people might he of a most serious character. He thought he saw present his noble and gallant friend the Commander-in-Chief, and he begged to ask whether this clause had been suhmitted to him before it was laid ou the table ? He put th ques tion to him on this ground : Wh en he was Governor- General er- General of India, his noble a nd gallant frienras if not d anger, o f havinga7 the extreme inconvenience, two sets of distinct articles of war —one applyin g to the native troops, and the other to the Britistitroop , 4—. and he altered the for mer and made th em conformable to the latter. Now, the practice of flogging was bell in reserve for the maintenance of discipline in her Ma jesty's forces, but it did not prevail in the German army. They had a different system—but whether established by law, as in this country, or by practice, he knew not —of inflicting punishment by the stick. (Laughter.) There was another question, also of very great import ance. From whence were those foreign troops to come ? He had already stated the satisfaction with which he should hear of aey arrangement with his Majesty the King of Hanover by whiob he could place at the dis posal of her Majesty, by becoming a party to the war, those magnificent troops whose assistance in the Penin sula was universally admitted to be of the greatest pos sible advantage to the British army. But the value which he placed upon the troops which could be ob tained from the other small German Powers was ex tremely little, and, unless he was greatly misinformed, the opinion generally of officers who had served in the Peninsula, and were acquainted with the relative merits of foreign troops, although favourable to the employ ment of the German Legion, which was formed of men who were subjects of our own Sovereign, was decidediy against the introduction into her Majesty's service, to fight by the side of our own soldiers, of German and other troops, obtained from anywhere in any foreign country. He (the Earl of Ellenborough) adhered to the opinion that there were no troops in the world equal to the British troops, under whatever circumstances they were placed. lie did not believe that any Germans could equal the British soldiers under such circumstances as those at Inkerman, and under such circumstances as might again exist in the difficult posi tion in which our army was now placed. (Hear, hear.) A chain cable formed in part of wrought and cast iron might prove equally as good as one made entirely of wrought iron in smooth water, and might hold a ship and preserve it frem the rocks, but as soon as the strain of the storm acted upon it, it would give way where the links were weakest, and the vessel would be lost. That was precisely the view he took of the unequal line of a battle where equal confidence could not be reposed in all the regiments engaged. If one gave way in any Place, the p os iti on was forced, and the greatest possible calamities might follow. His wish was that the whole British a Irny should be formed of wrought iron—that I every man opposed whom they to the enemy should be a man on depend under any circumstances. (Hear,. hear.) A.na4 ,, fter all, there was a great differ ence between the world, soldier ld and the soldier of any other country in the man, r f e own did constitution not whene ex aggerated the advantagyers l ie said it gave to ever rool the highest to the lowest, a sentiment of personal _dignity which it was im possible Government in any other a Un p d r - i e de in bein g an r possible tolioebiti a Englishman,cosvardh and country ; that if he acted the part of he knew be hooted at when he returnee home —that his comrades look world shun hint, and that not a, "man laugh. ) Wh y that it was that at him. which made rnthaede men fight—those w ere the reasons m defy the enemy and preserve the position entrusted them. How different was the case with the foreigners to whom it was proposed t o employ 3 Disgraced, aban doned, driven with contumely from the army, th e y anything .about them, would go back to their own country jtit as well off as they were before. No one knew et d as had assumed, though they had disgraced the arms which they h assumed, they remained quite as much respe vv e they were formerly on the banks of the Elbe, the eiser, or wh there the Danube. He asked the ot her ni g ht whet h er erman small was any however G understanding with any o f the Powers, but he received no answer. There, _ , must be some understanding. There were two asehs of foreigners from whom we could recruit--eneu cl - charged from the military service, and men in service. Those discharged from service were absorbed in agricul- D.....!••••. ture and trade, and other occupations, and therefore it was in the last degree uncertain how many men could be obtained from that class. It was different with re tard to the men now in service. He would like to know what consideration was to be given to the German princes for selling the blood of their subjects ? Would any little German prince put himself to the inconvenience of giving us the privilege of enlisting his subjects in our ranks without being paid for it ? That was the consi deration ; and, in common sense and common truth, was there any difference, in fact, in the consideration we gave to a little German prince for selling us the ser vices of his subjects, and the consideration the buyer of slaves gave to the King of Dahomey. He did not see how the Government could act on different principles on the banks of the Conde and in the banks of the Elbe. If they insisted as far as possible, and by all the means i❑ their power, upon that detestable traffic being put down on the coast of Africa, was it to be endured that they should come to Parliament for a bill to enable them to establish that very traffic in the interior of Europe ? For what was it but that? (Opposition cheers.) If these princes would join the alliance—(hear, hear)—then he saw no reason against others endeavouring to induce them to send their subjects to assist in the conflict ; but if, without joining the alliance, they would only take the money to sell the blood of their subjects, he must say that it was a traffic which pli.cei them on a level with the lowest and most debased princes on the coast of Africa. He (Lord Ellenborough) was ready to admit the extent of the wealth and the industry of this country, and the value of these in a time of peace, and that it was most de- irable to give a large amount of attention to the attainment of these objects ; but he said that he had given his attention to what he considered the attainment of greater objects—the maintenance, namely, for the country of which he was a subject, of its strength, and to give it security against foreign States in defence of its liberty. One of the best and wisest of minkind had told us that one of the most material points in a state was to maintain a body of military men ; but to the extent that we employed foreigners, to that extent we were slighting the principle and depriving ourselves of the advantages which were promised to an opposite course; for it was an advantage that was incalculable which that system gave us when the peace was concluded, if ever it should be concluded, in having in every Tillage of the country men who had seen war, and who were liable to be called out at any time on military service. He believed that her Majesty's Ministers could not do anything more injurious than to introduce foreigners instead of British soldiers. He sail instead, because the more easy they found it to get foreigners, the less trouble would they take to obtain Englishmen. The Government had gone to war upon the current finances of the year, they bad gone to war with out animals, they had gone into war without a moveable army—a preparation which was indispensable to suc cess, and without which a victorious peace was im possible. He said it was impossible, because if they went to war upon these conditions, it was contrary to all the theory of war—contrary to all the expe rience of ages, and to common sense, that they should ever attain to that success which would give them a safe and an honourable peace. But we were told by the noble lord that our reserve is the people of Eng land. Some represented that noble lord as being of all others, from his previous knowledge of the war, the best person to conduct the hostilities. He (Lord El lenborough) knew that a reserve was a body of dis ciplined soldiers, who were ready trained to undertake the active prosecution of the war—(cries of "hear, bear," from the Opposition)—but to speak of having a reserve in the people was to show contempt for the reasoning powers of the people. (Cheers.) But, however, if that were still the opinion of the Government, let them make their appeal to the people of England, and not to the people of Germany. (Renewed cheers.) Moreover, the time for that was a time of difficulty. But that we should now be in difficulty was entirely owing to the incites of the Government, who had neglected to make that necessary provision without which success in the war could not be obtained. There was point on which he had not yet addressed their lordships, but on which he thought it would yet be necessary to ask their atten tion, he meant the general conduct of the war. He thought it would be his duty at the earliest possible moment to state his sense of what had been done, his opinion of what ought to be done, and his deep convic tion that, unless the war were conducted on military principles, the conflict would be most fatal, and the re sults would not only disappoint the people, but bring the greatest calamities on the country. (Cheers.) The Marquis of LANSDOWNE said that, although he had taken no part in the debates on this bill, and as he had accidentally heard all the speeches of the noble earl, he was induced to take this last opportunity of this bill being before the house to state the grounds on which he supported it, seeing the importance which was at tached to it—not an undue importance in one sense, but a very undue importance in another, from the incredibly exaggerated apprehensions (cries of " Hear, hear," from the Government)—which apprehensions, the more they were looked at, sifted, and observed—apprehen sions which, when the phantom of fear paraded on this subject came to be analysed, when the light was held to the spectre which the noble lord had raised, would be found to vanish into air in the came way that the best accredited spectres— (laughter)—had always vanished. (Hear, hear.) Upon this bill he was anxious to state his opinion on both the points of view which had been observed in the noble earl's criticism, both of them of great importance. He would take the first point to which the noble earl in his first speech in opposition to the bill seemed to attach the greatest importance, but of wEcli the house had heard less in all hie subsequent op , position—(cries of Hear," from Ministerialists)—viz., the constitutional objection. They had rather less of that objection that night than they had hitherto been aecustomed to hear from the noble earl. (Laughter.) They might hear a good deal of it out of doors, be ceepe the people di l not understand the provisions of the bill ; and, that being so, he honoured and re spected the people for it. Such a thing in this house was ridiculous, but he honoured and respected the people for their jealousy lest, through means of this war in which they had engaged in defence of their censtitu tion, that constitution should be destroyed--especially when they were told by noble lords in that house that they were about to be tyrannised over by a body of Germans. (Cries of " Hear, hear," and laughter.) That was the phantom. The noble lord had forgotten that there was no period (luring a war with this country when the constitution had not been violated in the very man ner proposed by this bill, and violated without all the precautions taken here against ultimate injury—from the wars of the Duke of Marlborough to the wars of the Duke of Wellington, which comprehended a very con siderable space of time—during which time every bril liant action, every successful campaign, owed its success to the very means which were again proposed. But did the Duke of Wellington or the Duke of Marlborough de precate the use of such troops I It stood to reason, and accorded with the very nature of war itself, that when we took part in a great military struggle, considering the habits of this country, and the means which it pos sessed—which, thank God, had never been a great war like country with a large standing army—when called on to begin the war, we must begin it with the means on which we could immediately lay our hands. He was rather surprised that the noble earl, among his great employments, and the high subjects which engaged his attention, should take notice of what had fallen from so insignificant a person as he (Lord Lansdowne) was— (laughter)—but it did so happen that in the course of the last session, in describing to the house his sense of the magnitude, importance, difficulty, and possible duration of the war, he did take the opportunity to state his opinion, and to find that, on all these points, the noble earl agreed with him. And now, whatever differences existed before, the whole world were agreed upon the immense difficulty of the war, and the power of the enemy, too much overlooked at first, with whom we had to contend. We were now become aware of the great resources which the enemy possessed ; but he be lieved we were equal to him in the power of our navy— equal to him in the extent of our wealth, and the amount of our resonrcee. But here he must say that, when the noble earl treated the pursuits of commerce and sound political economy with so much contempt, he must remind him that those were the means from which Parliament derived the power with which they had entered into the great conflict for national honour. (Cheers.) We were, he said, equal in respect to those things which he had pointed out, but there was one re spect in which Russia surpassed us, for Russia bad population—she had numbers. It was not for the pur pose of enabling us to meet Russia that we had had re ' course to this measure, but that we might turn outnum bers against numbers. Therefore, when it was asked by what means we were to oppose that great warlike po tentate, he answered, by all means—in every way. (Ministerial cheers.) Gallant was the army which Eng land had sent out to the Crimea, and almost incompar ably superior to every other army which we had ever sent out, but did it possess numbers equal to the con flict ? Did the noble lord think that this country could turn out an equal number of armed soldiers to fight the legions of Russia! (Hear, hear.) We had never had a war in which we had not employed auxiliaries ; and always with the greatest advantage to success, and with out any inconvenience whatever. But then, though that were so, they were told, that te employ such auxi liaries was, first, highly unconstitutional ; and, secondly, that it was highly inexpedient. Why were they to be deterred from employing such forces ? It was not the object for which these men were to be employed which was to deter us, but the possible use which might be made of them by her Majesty Queen Victrrla— deeply interested in the war with Russia, and in the suc cessful prosecution of that war—if she should suddenly divert these means from their purpose, awl, the better to disorganise the means, should launch from the depots the men which occupied them against the people of Eng land. But, in the opinion of the noble lord, the British yeomanry and the people of England would be found to be no match for these foreigners in defence of their liberty. (Loud laughter.) Why, if the noble lord had stated his thoughts out of doors to the barber of any village, or the farmer of any district, ho would be told that that was the substance of his apprehension. (Cries of "heir," and laughter.) He might remind them that, during the time of King William the Third, the Dutch Guards were very gladly employed in the war without any fear whatsoever as to the constitution of this coun try. But the first mention of that apprehension was to be found upon the accession of the House of Hanover, when men dreaded the adoption of principles which were inconsistent with the British Constitution ; then it was military much exertions, further thein that th e fi rst enactment against the enlistment of foreign troops was passed. B u t, b e f ore th e coun t ry cou ld en gage anecweassity war that r f e o q re u i i g r n ed tr a o n ops any great immediately felt, and Parliam en t h as t ene d t o make enunpro vision f or their , tr employment. The noble earl not on ly wished thi s it would h e a ytoio ev er ythi ng a l one, b ut sa i d that degradation to th e British. soldier to have a foreign force, perhaps somewhat inferio r , fi g hti ng b y our side. Surely the trained and disciplined force ---either might see a well German, Spanish, or Dutch —fighting by their side without any feeling of degradation. The Earl of ELLENBOROUGII- 1 assure the noble marquis I never said so. The Marquis of LA.NSDOWNE begged the noble earl's pardon. The remark was ❑ot made by the noble earl, but by some other noble lord. With regard to the employment of a foreign force, he would go back to that remarkable scene of British glory, the battle of Minden. On that occasion the English army was extremely in ferior in numbers to the mercenaries in our pay, but they were not on that account, at all discouraged in the battle. Threeßritish regiments made a charge, which he (the noble marquis) mentioned now because they were regiments which had transmitted their glorious name and character to their descendants—he meant the Innis killings, the Blues, and the Scots Greys. *When they were permitted to advance under a brave and gallant leader, they made the celebrated charge of the day, and they certatnly did not enter the conflict with less hope, confidence, and satisfaction, because they saw associated with them in their bravery and glory, and animated by the same spirit, regiments of Germans, Hanoverians, Hessians, and others. (Hear, hear.) It was the infinite importance of bringing every well-trained Englishman into the field, and to procure every means of carrying on the war, that the Government now felt themselves called upon to pass this bill. It was intended for the purpose of enabling them to engage in the contest on the most extensive scale. In 1806 his Majesty was ex pressly enabled to do what her Majesty wished to do by this act—to alter the war regulations so as to make them of service to the nation. He therefore trusted there would be no objection on the part of any of their lordships to this bill. It only gave a small extension to the privileges which her Majesty already enjoyed, and would be attended with great service to the public. (Hear, hear.) The Earl of DERBY—My lords, having already, on a former occasion, expressed at considerable length my objections to the bill, I should not have thought it neces sary to trouble your lordships on the present occasion but for the speech just delivered by the noble marquis. I must be permitted to say that I cannot but think the noble marquis, is commenting on the speech of the noble earl (Ellenborouh), and on the speech which that noble lord delivered on a former occasion, has departed from that courtesy which generally eharacterises him. (No, no.) When he talked about arguments used in this house as being positively absurd, and stated that what ever respect he might entertain for opinions of the kind used by the noble lord out of doors, he entertained no respect whatever for the expression f such opinions in doors. The noble marquis, in using that language, took up a position which, I think, even his high character does not entitle him to hold, nor do I think he has been exceedingly happy in the ridicule he has sought to throw upon the constitutional argument of my noble friend . He made it a sort of charge, in the first instance, that we had heard little of the constitutional argument, as if my noble friend was unable to make two speeches with regard to the same bill, without feeling it necessary to reproduce the same arguments ; and having complained that my noble friend did not on this occasion lay any stress upon that argument, the noble marquis pro ceeds to cast the whole power of his ridicule on a consti tutional argument and a constitutional objection, but cer tainly not on one like the argument and objection urged by my noble friend. With regard to the constitutional argument, my noble friend did lay great stress on a former occasion upon the substitution of foreign troops in this country, and their employment in this country, to the exclusion of our own troops. It was to the employment here of a foreign force that the constitutional argument of my noble friend applied ; not that he apprehended eight or ten thousand foreigners in this country would make themselves masters of Britain. What my noble friend said was, that it was contrary to the constitutional principles upon which this country had proceeded, to give to any Government power to employ foreign troops at home in exclusion of the troops of the country itself. If that constitutional doctrine be an absurdity, I hum bly be g that I may take my full share of the absurdity which has been cast on my noble friend. I say in ex clusion of British troops, because it has been admitted over and over again, that you do not embody the militia now, in consequence of not having room to quarter them, and yet you are to embody in the country, I presume in barracks—but it would be more objectionable if bil leted—a large body of foreign troops for the purpose of training, and, as the bill states, "keeping up a perma nent depot," at least so long as this war lasts, and occu pying these barracks which are not sufficiently exten sive to accommodate your own troops. The argument which my noble friend used with regard to " expedi ency" went against the adoption or incorporation in the British army of these foreign troops at all. He was first of all charged with having said that it was a degra dation to the British troops to fight by the side of foreign troops. Nobody said any such thing. What really occurred was this. A statement was made by a noble friend of mine not now present, that it was a humiliating and degrading idea to the people of this country, that for the purpose of peace or war its own soldiers were at the very outset of the war insufficient— (hear, hear)—and I think it is a humiliation and degra dation to the country. (Hear.) Nobody said it was a degradation to British troops to fight side by side of foreign troops ; but if it be necessary to have these foreign troops—if we are to be subject to that humiliation—still there was no occasion for this bill for the purpose of rais ing them. The necessity arising for the bill is that you must drill and train these troops in England, and this necessity especially arises from the fact that you are about to let in foreign troops without the consent and authority of their own Sovereigns—to pick up the refuse from all quarters of the globe. The noble marquis says, that for many of our celebrated victories we have been indebted to the co-operation of foreign troops. I ad mit it ; but it the noble lord will follow out his historical investigation, he will find that, in almost every instance, the troops so co-operating were either fighting under the banners, and with the sanction of their respective Sove reigns, or they were fighting in a national cause. At the battle of Minden we might be considered not so much the principals as the auxiliaries. It was fought much more for the German than the English cause. But this is not the case with a body of mercenaries, not act ing under the control of their Sovereigns, but merely paid with your money. My lords, with regard to such troops, I agree with my noble friend, they are not the materials I should like to put by the side of the British army. The noble marquis tells us that he was long ago persuaded that this was about to be a great war ; I wish he had impressed that feeling upon his colleagues. My noble friend does not complain of your disciplining fo reign troops, but of training them in this country, and employing them without any sanction of their own so• yereigns. No doubt the Duke of Wellington employed Portuguese and Spaniards during the Peninsular war, but could any one say those troops were not acting in their own national cause ? Two objections have been raised to this bill ; one is, that it is an unconstitutional principle to admit of the continued residence, drilling, and training of organised foreign bodies in this country with a view to their permanently remaining here ; the second is, that as a matter of expense it is unwise to in troduce these foreign troops. First, from the manner in which it is proposed to raise them, we can have no just confidence that they will not betray the trust re posed in them ; and next, because for the paltry purpose of obtaining ten, or fifteen, or twenty thousand German troops, you make a declaration in the face of Parliament and of the country that cannot but give the greatest dis couragement to those efforts which would be made with out stint by your own country, if you did not discourage their coining forward in the manner they propose to do. We have not heard from my friend the Commander in- Cuief in what respect he conceives it is necessary to intro duce a difference in regard to punishments in the prac tice here from the practice in India. The English army is subject to corporal punishment, and yet it is proposed that these German troops shall not be subject to the same corporal punishment. I think there ought not to be any distinction of that kind drawn. I cannot con ceive anything more objectionable than such a distinc tion being drawn • and not drawn by the authority of Parliament directly given, but by the authority of the military departments, acting under a general power given to them by Parliament to alter the articles of war and the regulations of the service. One word more before I sit down, upon a subject which has not been adverted to on the present occasion, but which, I think, deserves the serious consideration of her Majesty's Government. You are looking to every quarter from whence you may draw your troops; you don't want money, but you !want men ; you may have, without stint, any amount of money if you will only make use of the resources of the country. I would ask whether you might not, for the purposes of this war, advantageously use any of the na tive force in India ? If troops not strictly English are necessary, those soldiers are at the present time most available ; nor do I think that there could be any solid objection to the introduction of the Indian native troops, in conjunction with the English troops, to the battle fields of Russia. From that quarter you might derive aid without delay. But I wish to ask whether, in the prosecution of this war, we are to look for men or money from our colonial possessions? I saw that the Le gislata re of Canada voted a sum of 20,0001. to be applied towards the amelioration of the hardships suffered by our armies in the present war. Ire joiced to see Risk, and hailed it as an indication of friendly feeling and sympathy towards us. But your lordships will see that it was only given as a mark of sympathy. This is obviously the case ; for the 20,0001. was to be applied in equal parts between our armies and the armies of our ally the French. Ido not complain of this—far otherwise ; but I recall it to your lordships' recollections that you many see that the gift was made simply out of sympathy, and was in itself no mark of the allegiance of Canada. It was a mark of sympathy to the cause, but not of sympathy to the coun try. The North American provinces now arc in every respect as independent of this country as Ireland was previous to the Union. They are, it is true, under the same Sovereign as this country, but their affairs are con ducted by Administrations of their own, under respon sible Governments. They are not liable to contribute towards the payment of the debts of this country, nor are they subject to its laws, but are left to their own local government. They enjoy the same independence as Ireland di lat the time I have referred to. But was there ever a war engaged in by this country towards the prosecution of which, in conjunction with England, Ire land was not ready to contribute both her money and her men ! (Hear.) Now, with regard to many of the colonies, I am willing to admit that the scarcity of their population, and the nature of their employment, might prevent them contributing in men largely towards the maintenance of the war. But this dues not apply to the British colonies of North America. They are at the present time in a state of great prosperity and we belialteveh, and with an ever-absorbing population ; an I that towards the carrying on this war the North American colonies would, if requested, readily contri bute without payment, if necessary; but if you have the money ready, then, I believe, with payment, you would be able to raise immediately in those colonies a certain amount of force to be officered by persons now resident in Canada, and then added to the British army, not as a local contingent, for that would be in accord ance with a system which I do not approve of, but as part of the British army. I verily believe that nothing, would gratify the North American colonies more than to be allowed to raise, say, three or four regiments, to be in every respect placed npon the same footing as the British army, subject to this difference, that the periods of service which are n ow assi gned to the British army to be passed in this country should, in their case, be so altered that it should be passed in their own country — such service being considered as home service whilst th e ir service in this country should be considered as foreign service. In ail other respects these North Ameri can i egiments would be on the footing of other regiments of the British army. I throw this out for the conside ration of her Majesty's Government, and I must say that, looking to the position of these colonies, looking to the prosperity and privileges they enjoy, their immu nity from contribution towards the debts of this country, and the obligations they are under to this country, it does not appear too much to me to ask that they should be ready to testify their allegiance to our Sovereign in joining us in carrying on a war, one effect of whioh may eventually be to render neces'ary the defence of those colonies as part of the British empire. (Hear, hear.) I believe they would be rejoiced to supply troops to be considered as representing and forming a portion of the British army ; and such an addition to our forces would not be, and could not be, considered by any one as being an addition of foreigners to our army. I have only thrown this suggestion out for the consideration of her Majesty's Government ; and with regard to the bill itself now before the house, I have only to say that, retaining all my objections to the bill, notwithstanding the speech of the noble marquis opposite, I shall confine my further opposition to saying " no" to its third read ing, in case it goes to a division. I shall not, how ever, divide the house upon it, as your lordships have already, though by a narrow majority, approved of the principle of the bill—and the principle is all that there is in the bill. After a few words in explanation from the Marquis of LANSDOWNE, Viscount HARDINGE explained the regulations which he had adopted with regard to the Sepoy and her Majesty's regiments during the time that he was Gover nor-General of India. With respect to the clause in the bill which was so strongly objected to by the noble earl opposite (Ellenborough), he stated that her Ma jesty already had the power, without the sanction of Parliament, to alter any part of the articles of war, so far as such alterations did not militate against the provisions of the Mutiny Act. It was advisable at once to raise additional troops, and he thought the Govern ment had adopted the wisest course by bringing in the present bill. The Earl of ELLENBOROUGH said that the ma terial question was whether, in the same army, two regiments Serving under the same general, one being composed of Germans and the other of Englishmen, the same military law and government would be applied to both ? Viscount tiARDINGE said that lie had known, under similar circumstances, a different law to be ap plied to each regiment, without any inconvenience re sulting from it. The Earl of ELLENBOROUGH said that may have been the case where the regiments were under separate commanders, but the application of such a system to the case of different regiments under the same commander could not be attended with success. Viscount HARDINGE said that he once held a command in Portugal, in the course of which he had observed the system he had referred to successfully adopted. Earl GREY said that the clause which was so much objected to by the noble earl opposite was introduced merely as a copy of a similar clause out of an old act of Parliament, and he thought as it was, in fact for all purposes, an ineffectual enactment, it would be as well to omit it. All objections to the clause, and also to the bill itself, as an unconstitutional one (if any there were), had, however, been removed by the alterations which had been made in the same since the bill was introduced into the house. The Earl of ELLENBOROUGH thought it right, after what had fallen from a noble lord respecting the Indian army, to say a few words on that subject. Where the Indian troops were brigaded with the British, and the officers of the British. regiments had confidence in them, and the Indian troops had confidence in the Eng lish troops, they were, to the extent of their personal strength, equal to the British soldiers. The 31st native regiment, which served with the Queen's 13th at Jellal abld, arid so with other regiments in many other cases, had shown themselves to be most excellent soldiers, and deserving the greatest praise. The Earl GRANVILLE said, that the noble earl (Earl of Derby) had complained of his noble friend (the Marquis of Lansdowne) being discourteous in using the term "ab surd" to the arguments of the noble lord opposite ; but he would like toknow whether it was not equally discourteous in that noble earl to speak of the bill as being " debasing " and " degrading I" (Laughter) He remembered reading some very remarkable evidence given by the noble earl (Earl of Ellenborough) before a committee in the other house, in which he told them he had not consulted Sir H. Peel upon the subject. (Hear, hear.) That certainly appeared to him rather injudicious, not to obtain from Sir R. Peel, his colleague and leader, his opinion upon such a question. He supposed be knew, by intuition, his views, and therefore thought it was not worth while to trouble him with any communication. But this he (Earl Granville) knew—that he had stated to that com mittee that he had consulted the Duke of Wellington, and he had heard him (the Earl of Ellenborough) express in the most touchingtones that he ever heard a noble lord express himself in that house his opinion of the sagacity and wisdom of that great man. He would read a passage from the speech made by the Duke of Wellington, upon the occasion of the Militia Bill of 1852 being discussed in that house, to show the value which the noble duke set upon the foreign troops under his command. He said, " Everything has its commencement, and this is only a .commencement. If you have a corpa of reserve, you must have a commencement, and even that corps would take some months before it would be ready for service. Those British armies which have so re peatedly received the thanks of your lordships, and which have served the country tio well—your lordships are much mistaken if you suppose they were composed of more than one-third of their whole numbers of real British subjects of these islands. No such thing. Look at your great services ; look at the East Indies. I say that of the soldiers there, not one-third are British sol diers. Look at the Peninsula, not one-third of those employed there were British soldiers. But I tell your lordships to ob serve the servi ces those soldiers performed —they fought great battles against the finest troops in the world, and they must be prepared to face every thing, and to be successful, or else this country would not bear with them. They are aided by troops—brave, if you please—for I hold every man to be brave—but certainly well ordered and well disciplined. Look at the battle of Waterloo—look at the number of British troops in that battle, aided by others. I can tell noble lords that, in that battle, there were 16 battalions of Hanoverian soldiers—recently raised militia, under the command of a Hanoverian nobleman now in London, the Minister from Hanover to this Court—who be haved admir abl y . There we re other troops in that b a ttl e —and that was a battle of giants. An operation was performed there which w as folowed by the peace pa rticularly British dis c ipli ne d troops, I t e ll y must not supp ose th at e i ther cannot b e v Such was the descripti on g i ven o f troops s o h ef andoo r uvv E iei ;lei more e r oeaa o rrtb p e l e I y admire British troops, di sc i p li ne d t roops , e; y , u which has now lasted f or 37 years. I say, which were now described to be the refuse and offscour. logs of all nations ; and such, he believed, was the view which the Duke of Wellington would now take of the bill then before the house. troops, The The Earl of M ALMESBUR Y said that there was no led d by their own officers, a having made ex a gg erated ar g ume nts, and exciting un necessary alarm. H e could onl y say, that if there had been any exagge ration, and an y fe ars bad been enter aandalomgeyre between inercena such r. enter tained, it was in consequence of the course which the Government had adopted in bringing in this bill, and the suddenness with which they had called Parliament together. Lord REDESDALE thought the most serious feature to be considered was, how these foreign troops were to he officered? When foreign troops had fought with our s they had been officered by the elite of the country to which they belonged. 1 The Duke of NEWCASTLE explained that he had made some alterations in the bill to meet objections made to it in reference to the Queen's prerogative to enlist foreigners in her Majesty's army, The bill was then read a third time, and passed. ADJOURNMENT FOR THE RECESS. In reply to a question put by the Earl of 11.... f ALMESBURY The Earl o f ABERDEEN said that the hou se , at i ts rising for the Christmas recess, would adjourn to the 23d of January. Their lordships then, at ten minutes past eight o'clock, adjourned to this day. HOUSE OF COMMONS—(YESTERDAY.) The SPEAKER took the chair shortly before four o'clock. PETITIONS. Several petitions were presented praying that the war may be carried on with ♦igour, with a view to a speedy and honourable termination. Captain SCOBELL presented a petition from Bath, praying for a committee of inquiry into the operations of the duty on stage carriages. INCOME TAX AND OFFICERS IN THE ARMY. Mr. J. O'CONNELL wished to ask if her Majesty's Government would consider of bringing in a bill to exo nerate from liability to income tax on their pay officers of every branch of her Majesty's service in employment at Vie seat of war, while there employed ? The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER said it was exceedingly disagreeable to him to give an answer in the negative to any question which implied a grateful feeling to the army in the Crimea ; but at the same time he was bound to say it was not the intention of the Government to bring in any such bill, and simply for this reason—in the first place they did not think the time had arrived for taking into consideration the ques tion of the reward due to the army in the Crimea. But there was a strong objection to a proposal of this kind, and that was the admitted fact that rewards for public services ought not to be given in the shape of exemp tion from the payment of taxes. (Hear, hear.) Besides, it Wag of importance that the rewards offered to the army in the East should recognise no distinction be tween the services of the officers and men. (Cheers.) THE THETIS. Admiral WALCOTT wished to ask the First Lord of ;ho Admiralty on what grounds an exchange had beet effected with the King of Prussia of the Thetis frigate for two gun-boats ? Sir JAMES GRAHAM said the exchange had not yet been effected. It had been contemplated, and was still contemplated. The circumstances were these—in the month of June the Prussian Government applied to her Majesty's Government to know if they were willing to exchange two gun-boats, made in this country, of peculiar construction, with a light draft of water, calculated to carry heavy guns, and capable of being steered either fore or aft, for two old corvettes. The English Government saw no objection to such an exchange, and they sent over Mr. Scott Russell to Dantzic to inspect the gun-boats. That gentle man reported that they were peculiarly suited to the Baltic service. Some delay, however, took place, and it was not until the middle of September that the Prussian Government agreed to the proposal of her Majesty's Government, that instead of two corvettes an old frigate should be given. In September there was no very great necessity for the change, but the Prussian Government contended that the faith of the British Gove , -iment had been pledged to the exchange, and therefore when the two gunboats arrive in this country the Prussian Government would be al lowed to take the old frigate in exchange. (Hear.) Sir G. TYLER asked what was the draught of these gun-boats ! , . Sir J. GRAHAM did not know exactly, but lie was told 17 feet. was to prevent the disembodiment of that portion of a militia regiment which was not sent abroad. Mr. S. HERBERT said there was nothing in the act tending to such disembodiment. Mr. BANKES thought that after that explanation the noble lord might safely withdraw the clause. Lord LOVAINE would not press it. Mr. BANKES moved a proviso, to the effect that not more than 15,000 militiamen should be sent abroad. Lord PALMERSTON did not think it was likely that so many a 515,000 would be required to be sent out, but he thought it would be better not to fix any particular limit. There appeared to he an apprehension, for which there was no foundation, that the whole of the militia would be sent abroad. No limit was fixed in the Militia Act of 1814. Mr. BANKES said that a limit was fixed by that act; and that the number was 30,000 ; and, as he wished to show that the house was not less vigilant than the Parliament of 1814, he therefore proposed to fix a limit. (Laughter.) The proviso was negatived. Mr. FITZROY moved a clause, the object of which was to make subalterns iu the militia of five years' standing eligible to the rank of captain, without property qualifica tion. Mr. H. HERBERT thought that a standing of three years ought to be considered sufficient. Mr. C. BRUCE thought that it would be better to with draw the clause. Lord PALMERSTON said it should be borne in mind that past service would be counted in the five years, and, as there had only been 28 days' service in the first year, he did not think that five years should bo considered too long a probation. Mr. J. G. SMYTII thought that some retiring allow ance ought to be made to subalterns in the militia. Mr. BANKES thought that barracks not in the actual occupation of the line ought to be placed at the disposal of the militia. At Weymouth and Dorchester there were such barracks. Lord PALMERSTON said, that in making arrangement with the Quartermaster -General for the quarters of the militia, it had been his anxious desire to find barrack accom modation for them. But, unfortunately, at the conclusion of the last war, many barracks were sold or pulied down, or given up, and the amount of such accommodation now in the country was very small indeed. His first object had been to put into barracks the depots of those regiments which were occupied in raising recruits for foreign service, but when a few regiments of militia ware embodied, the Government took care not to embody any that could not be accommodated in barracks. But that could not be done now. The barracks at Weymouth and Dorchester weie designed for cavalry, and if they were altered for infantry the expense would be verygreat, and the barrackswould be disqualified for their original destination. However, that matter was under the serious consideration of the Govern ment, who would do everything in their power for the sake of discipline, and for other considerations, to provide the militia as far as possible with barrack accommodation. Col. ARCHDALL inquired whether county officers in Ireland were eligible for commissions in the militia? Lord PALMERSTON said that no one would bedeemed eligible who had duties to perform incompatible with his militia duties. Col. SIBTHORP inquired whether colonels of militia remaining at home would be superseded by those who acted as colonels while the regiment was on foreign duty ? Lord PALMERSTON replied in the negative. The rank of those who held the position of full colonels, like the hon. member, would bo in no respect affected, but would remain just the same on the return of such members of the regi ment as had been serving abroad. The bill then passed through committee, and was re ported, and ordered for second leading this day. THE ANSWER TO THE ADDRESS. Viscount DRUMLANRIG appeared at the bar, in the uniform of the Comptroller of the Household, and rought up her Majesty's gracious answer to the Address :A'!" Your loyal and dutiful address has afforded me much gratifica tion, and I thank you for the assurance of your support to those measures which I consider necessary for the vigorous prosecution of the war, and which I trust, with your as sistance, and under the blessing of the Almighty, may lead to the re-establishment of peace upon a sure and lasting oundation." FINANCIAL STATEMENT. In reply to a question from Sir H. WILLOUGHBY, Lord J. RUSSELL said that it was not the intention of the Chancellor of the Exchequer to make any financial statement before the recess. SLIGO BOROUGH. Mr. WHITESIDE moved for a copy of the indictment found at the late assizes for the county of Sligo against Michael Gethin, Henry Simpson, and James Simpson, directed by this house to be prosecuted for certain grave offences by the Attorney-General for Ireland. After a few words from Sir J. YOUNG, the motion was withdrawn. Mr. WHITESIDE obtained leave to bring in a bill to amend the laws relating to juries in Ireland. CLERGY RESERVES. Mr. NAPIER moved for a _copy of the Clergy Reserves Bill, now before the Canadian Parliament. Ordered. PRINTING. Mr. FITZROY moved for a select committee to assist Mr. Speaker in all matters which relate to the printing executed by order of this house, and for the purpose of selecting and arranging for printing returns and papers presented in pursuance of motions made by members of this house :—Mr. Strutt, Sir J. Young, Mr. G. Hamilton, Mr. J. Greene, Mr. Wilson, Mr. Beckett, Mr. Divett, Mr. Gas kell, Mr. Hume, Mr. Vernon Smith, and Mr. Sotheron. Three to be the quorum. THE FOREIGN ENLISTMENT BILL. On the motion of Lord J. RUSSELL, this bill was read a first time, and ordered to be read a second time to-morrow. Mr. DlSRAELl—Concluding that the printed copies of this bill will be in the hands of hon. members to-morrow morning, I shall, for the sake of facilitating public business, not object to the bill being read a second time to morrow evening ; but, in saying this, I shall be sorry for the nobl9 lord to conclude that I approve•-of the measure, as I intend to offer to its passing my most uncompromising opposition. (Hear, hear, and Opposition cheers.) The house adjourned at a quarter past eight. SPORTING INTELLIGENCE. TATTE RSA LL'S—MONDAY. Subscribers mustered numerously, and business exhi bited a marked improvement. Some of the investments on the Derby were to a large amount, and two or three important changes were produced. At the commence ment, 11 to 1 was taken to 2001. about De Clare ; but the silent indifference with which the taker heard the same odds repeatedly offered afterwards at length in duced two or three bookmakers to try the effect of a Point more—their offers were then caught up with avi dity, until he had increased his investments to upwards of 5001. The movement was sufficiently significant, and, after a brief pause, De Clare became distinctly the leading favourite, 1,000 to 100 being taken twice. Meanwhile 500 even was betted on him against Grrecu lus Esuriens, and 11 to 1 was currently offered against the latter "outright." St. Hubert was backed at 12 and 11 to 1, and had an advancing tendency at the close ; 12 to 1 was taken to 2001. about The Lord of the Isles, and 15 to 1 to 2001. about Rifleman ; Oulston, close up to him, was firm, notwithstanding the support which was given to St. Hubert; 1,000 to 45 was taken about Wild Dayrell; 20 to 1 to 3001. about Poly dore ; 40 to 1 in fifties about Aurifer ; and 1,000 to 15 about The Bison. The quotations at the close were as CHESTER CUP. 1,000 to 25 agst The Reiver (taken) 1,000 to 20 agst Wild Huntsman (taken) 1,000 to 10 agst Llanforda (taken) 1,000 to 10 agst Homily (taken) 1,000 to 10 agst Brinklow (taken) DERBY. 10 to 1 agst De Clare (taken) 10 to 1 agst St. Hubert (11 to 1 taken) 11 to 1 agst Grmculus Esuriens (offered) 12 to 1 agst Lord of the Isles (taken) 15 to 1 agst Rifleman (taken) 15 to 1 agst Oulaton 22 to 1 agst Cruizer 22 to 1 agst Wild Da,yrell (taken) 30 to 1 agst Polydore (taken) 40 to 1 agst Aurifer (taken) 1,000 to 15 agst Bison (taken) 1,000 to 10 agst Claret; 1,000 to 5 also laid twice, 1,000 to 10 agst Hickleton 1,000 to 10 agst Marco Spada taken in one bet, 1,000 to 10 agst Elvaston 1,000 to 5 agst Pugnator (taken) 1,000 to 5 agst Kingstown (taken) THE PATRTOTIC FUND.—The subscriptions forwarded by John Day, jun., from the Danebury Stable, amount to 22/. 17s. 6d. RACING -FIXTI MA.' 'RES FOR 1855. Warwick Spring Epsom Spring Northampton Croxton Park Malton Newmarket F S Coventry Salisbury Doncaster 13 Thifsk l5 Al?: Newmarket C 9 Cat terick Bridge 11 York Spring 17 Chester Spring Newcn4rket S S 8 *Shrewsbury 10 Bath Ascot Hampton Bibury .. _.13 -.20 JU _ Newmarket Carlisle Worcester *Lancaster AUG North Staffordshire...... 7 Brighton .................. 8 Brighton Club ............ 10 *Wolverhampton .........13 *Reading .................. 14 SEPTE *Manchester Stockbridge Winchester Newcastle LY. Liverpool '"Stamford Nottingham Goodwood UST. Warwick ......•••"' D0nca5ter............ *Leicester .............. OCT, ..11 •Chester 2 *Wrixbain 4 *Lewes York *Egham .... *Derby .... :MBER. Newmarket F 0 * Nortballerton .. I BER. *Warwick Autumn ......16 *Richmond- Bedford 4 New mar k e t H Ifvr e osarket S 0 NOVEMBER. *Liverpool ................ 6 ( * Shrewsbury, The meetings to which a• asterisk is prefixed are given in accordance with the periods at which they usually take place, but have not been officially an nounced. • IRISH RACING FIXTURES FOR 1855 APRIL Curragh April JUNE Curragh June JULY Monkstovrn Bellewstown 4 Balleigh 23 Carlow -.24 .26 THE AUSTRIAN TREATY. Sir H. WILLOUGHBY observed that the second article of the Austrian Treaty referred to a treaty be tween Austria and the Porte ; he should be glad to know if their would be any objections to produce a copy of the treaty alluded to Lord J. RUSSELL replied there would not, PROMOTIONS IN THE ARMY, ----- - Col. LINDSAY wished to ask the Secretary at War if ho had any objection to lay on the table of the house her Majesty's warrant for regulating promotion and retirement in the army? Mr. S. HERBERT was quite willing to produce the warrant. TRADE WITH RUSSIA. Lord J. RUSSELL said the hon. and learned member for Plymouth (Mr. Collier) had given notice for to-morrow night of his intention to call attention to the present state of our trade with Russia. Now, as that was a matter likely to giVe rise to considerable discussion, he put it to the hon. and learned gentleman whether it would not be better to postpone it until after the recess, rather than allow it to interfere with measures of a pressing and urgent character. (Hear, hear.) Mr. COLLIER said the state of the Russian trade was of so much importance at this peculiar time, that he wag extremely anxious to call attention to it ; but, of course, after the direct appeal of the noble lord, he had no alternative but to give a reluctant assent to the noble lord's proposal, and postpone his notice until after the recess. (Hear.) VOTE OF THANKS TO THE ARMY AND NAVY. On the motion of Lord J. RUSSELL, the names of Generals Estcourt and Airy, together with that of Admiral Stopford, were ordered to be added to the vote of thanks which had been passed to the army. There names had been accidentally omitted from the original votes. MILITIA. On the motion for going into committee on this bill, Colonel SIBTHORP adverted to certain amendments which he intended to propose in committee. In all other respects he approved of the measure. Mr. BRADY called the attention of the house to the injury that would arise to the militia corps upon being sent abroad, if they were to be deprived of the ser vices of their regular surgeon, and in lieu of a gentleman who knew the habits and constitutions of the men, an imperfectly educated and inefficient surgeon was sent out ; and he trusted that no such injustice either to the men or to the medical profession would be permitted. The house then went into committee upon the bill. ; Mr. BANKS moved as an amendment, that the num ber of militia asked to volunteer upon foreign service should not in any case exceed three-fourths of the num ber actually serving in any battalion, corps, or regiment of any such militia. Lord PALAIERSTON said that the country were too sensible of the great obligation that was due to the militia, and those gentlemen who commanded such corps ; but as it would be difficult to fix the actual num ber serving, he would not object to accede to a proposal to fix the number asked to volunteer to three-fourths of the actual establishment. After some conversation, the amendment was agreed to. After some discussion and explanations, clause one was agreed to. On clause 2, Col. SIBTHORP called attention to the circumstance that the bounty to be given to volunteers was not fixed by the bill, and that the period of service was too undefined, being for the remainder of •the war, or six months after its termination. He believed it would be far better to fix the bounty at once, and also to fix some period for the pro bable length of service required. Mr. S. HERBERT said it was the business of the Sec retary at War to fix the amount of the bounty, which could not be fixed by Act of Parliament, as it varied ac cording to the circumstances under which the men were enlisted. Air. DISRAELI reminded the honourable gentloin that, - in the year 1814, the bounty was fixed by Act of Parliament. Mr. S. HERBERT—Yes, but that was a very special Case. Mr. HILDYARD suggested that the wife and family of a militiaman, serving abroad, should not bo removable during the period of his foreign service. He thought that the expense of maintaining the wife and family ought to be borne by the Consolidated Fund, and in that case it would operate as a bounty to induce men to volunteer for foreign service. Lord PALMERSTON sail it was a mistake to suppose that a greater number of militiamen were married than of men serving iu the line. He believed that the contrary was the case. The preference was given to unmarried men volunteering to go abroad in the militia service. In reply to Mr. HENLEY, Lord PALMERSTON said he would propose to substi tate " five years" instead of an indefinite period, such as " during the remainder of the war," as the period of ser vice for volunteers. The amendment was then a g reed to. Col. SIBTHORP moved to leave out the words, " that such bounties as shall be from time to time fixed by the Secretary at War," and to insert, "that it should be dis tinctly and definitely fixed as the full amount of bounties to be given to each non-commissioned officer, drummer, and private soldier who shall be disposed to volunteer his services. _Mr. S. HERBERT said he thought it would be unwise to fix either the maximum or the minimum of these bounties. Mr. DISRAELI said that he thought that the Govern ment ought to be left unfettered in this respect, and, there fore, he hoped that his hon. and gallant friend would not press his amendment. The amendment was then withdrawn, and the clause was agreed to. Clauses 3,4, 5, and 6 were agreed to. On clause 7, Col. SIBTHORP moved that the clause be struck out. Viscount PALMERSTON said that he could not agree to the motion of the hon. and gallant gentleman. Ho had no doubt that colonels of militia, like his hon. and gallant, friend, would be quite in their place as colonels of batta lions abroad. But inconvenience had been found to arise when a full colonel of militia was in garrison with a lieu tenant-colonel of the line, and, therefore, he had laid it down as a rule that militia regiments should only bo com manded by lieutenant-colonels. Col. SIBTHORP said he wished to know in what posi tion he was to be placed ? Viscount PALMERSTON said that a gentleman of the rank, influence, and social position of his hon. and gallant friend, would, he thought, be more beneficially employed at home than abroad. (Hear, hear.) He should have *very confidence in his gallantry at the head of his regiment if it went into action, but his services might be more va luable at home. (Hear, hear.) Col. SIBTHORP said that this oplnion of the noble lord would give but little encouragement to militia officers. Lord HOTHA.M said that he wished to put a question_to, the noble lord. It was now intended to send certain militia regiments to serve in foreign possessions, and there were many officers in that force who held her Majesty's commis sion in the army. In all cases of regimental duty the senior officer of the militia took the command ; but it was a com mon thing for a major in a militia regiment to have su perior rank in the army to the lieutenant-colonel. The rule of the service was, that in general duties the officer of higher army rank took the command. Her Majesty's Go vernment had encouraged old officers of the army to enter the militia; and, after having so encouraged them to serve, it would be unjust to place them in an inferior position to that which they would have occupied if they had remained in full pay in the regular army. He did not wish to cast any reflection on the militia officers, bat he thought that the position of officers in that force, holding her Majesty's commission, should be recognised just, as if they had re mained on full pay. The noble lord concluded by moving e proviso embodying his proposal. Lord PALMERSTON apprehended that the proposal of the noble lord would not be consistent with the established law and practice of the army. The noble lord (Hotham) was aware that all officers in the militia who had been in the army must be upon half-pay, and that they could not accept positions in the militia except upon that condition. He apprehended, therefore, that, upon that ground, no such officer could exercise military authority under the Mutiny Act over any portion of the army that might be stationed at any foreign garrison. The provisions of the Mutiny Act would require an entire change if the proviso of the noble lord were adopted. No officer on half-pay could exercise military authority unless he was upon that staff. That, he (Lord Palmerston) conceived, was of itself a sufficient reason why the proposal of the noble lord ought not to be adopted. The arrangements which had been proposed in the bill were precisely the same as those that were made with regard to the militia in 1814, and he was afraid that any advantages that might arise from the pro position would be more than counterbalanced by the incon veniences that it would occasion. Lord HOTHAM would not press his proposal if her Ma jesty's Government were not disposed to agree to it. He begged to observe, however, that the noble lord him self had admitted that there was no partiality whatever between the present state of things and that of 1814. Tho arrangements were totally dissimilar. He conceived that he had simply asked for justice with regard to those half pay officers that might serve in the militia at foreign garrisons. Col. NORTH submitted that the officers in question would be placed by the Mutiny Act in exactly the same position as the officers of the line. Cul. DUNNE did no t apprehend that half-pay officers would suffer much by the omission of the pr o p osal of Lord Hotham, because he did not think that many, half-pay offices e would accept in the militia a position inferior to that which they held in the army- (Hear, hear.) After some further observations, the proviso was nega tived. Clauses 7, 8 and 9 were agreed to. ,Clause 10,wap omitted. Clause 11, 12, 13, 14 and 15 were agreed to; Clause 16 was omitted. Lord TAO VAINA moved clause, the (Nod If which CO UN: TT& CHELMSFORD-DEC. IG. The better samples of wheat realised an advance of 2s per qr ; for inferior qualities there was a rise of is per qr. The same may be said of barleys. All else unaltered in value, with a fair business at those prices. Wheat, white, old, per s. s. eir.62 83 I Oats, new 65 83 Peas, red, old 58 76 new 58 76 28 35 30 38 ~24 -70 74 Chevalier s. 0. per qr 2B 34 Partridge 37 4L White. 39 42 Boiling 45 51. Dun 36 39 Beans, Tick 42 47 Harrow ticks 47 49 I Mazagan 40 42 Ditto, new 39 42 Barley Chevalier Grinding Malt COLCHESTER- DEN. 16. Only a moderate supply of wheat, which realised 2s per qr. above last Saturday's prices ; barley, of all descriptions, was is per qr. dearer ; beans were more plentiful, and ls per qr. cheaper ; hog peas were also is per qr. cheaper. Prices to-daffy were as follow :—Wheat, white, 80s to 86s : Fed, 72s to 78s ; barley, 31s to 37s ; oats, Ws to 32 < ; bear's INlazagan, 423 to 45s ; middle and small, 44s to 489 ; pens, white, 56s to 60s ; grey, 40s to 41s. Official Statement of the Quantities of Corn, &a., receiv' d in the port of London, from the following ports, frout the 10th to the 16th Dec., both inclusive: ' 4 -4 -- A F-1 1 4 g 1 3 4 44 olcliester 285 43.418 , 377 288' 804', 200 Leigh Nlaldon . - - - 1 43 1 - 95 1036- 32 -- 101, KIRK' ;LLDY—Duc. 16. To-day a moderate supply of all kinds. Sales slow. Fins wheat at nearly last day's rates. Wheat. Barley. Oats. I Beans. I First Second Third his Oct 335 Oct 26s Od I Os va COAL MARK/ Prices of Coal per ton at t' a. d. Buddlo W. Hartley lB Carr's Hartley lB 0 Cooksou's Hartley 1 C Hasting's Hartley lB 0 Holywell 22 0 Howard's West Hartley Netherton lB I Lou ;ridge's Wst Hartley 18 3 Portland Hartley lB 0 1 New Tanfield 17 3' Canfield Moor l7 C Tanfield Moor Butes 17 3, Walker Primrose l7 3 Wylam 19 Wallsend, Gosforth l9 6 ET.—DEc. 18. ,be closo of the market. Wallsend, &c. s. d. .Eledley .19 0 Northumberland lB 0 Eden Main 20 0 Tetton 22 0 laswell 22 6 0 Pl ummer 2O Richniund l9 6 , itewart's 22 0 Whitwell lB 6 'Hough Hall 20 6 South Kelloo 20 6 Tees 22 0 Whitworth l9 0 Cowpen 18 0 Derwentwater Hartley 18 0 Cassop 20 0 SEABORNE MAILS. (N signifies that the mails are sent from the General rest-office by the night—and M by the morning—despatch.) Day whim m a.i. L. 2 From w 1 at When COUNTRLES. in General Post- Port due 1 2 0111ce, London.' Dispatche . Ens and. --........ -------- - America(byßrit.paek)N Every Friday ... Liverpool ... Sac k 11°3 America (by United Sts. packet) ........N Nov. 14.... • .... Liverpool ... Jan. 3 America (by U States packet) ...... ....N 'NOV. 62 .. ....... Australia (via South-s Southamptor. ampton) .........mjan. 4 ..... .....• Southamp ton Feb. 7 Ditto (via Marseilles) . 'Jan. 9 - Ditto (via Cape of ~lope I ... Uncer tain Hope) •• •• •• •O •• ••N Decol . .. •• Africa ( West Coast)... , :30 of the month .. Plymouth .. Alexandria.-- .... N 1•1, 9, 21, & 30 of ii.. Dover ..... . uexandr i a.• • • • • • • • • Allah & 20th of moi , . • Anittiaiiipioi Bahamas ...........Ml7th of the month Amtharnntor. Belgium .........• —NI L'allY • • • • • • • • • • • • Dover .....• pauf,,,, Brazil ..............M 9th of the month— ioutriainpi• 1. DM i' Buenos Ayres ....Al I9th of the month.. iouthano. 1. Cape of Good slope ..N Various peril Uncertia Cape of Good Hope ..N Cape do Verds •.•. • • N 9th of the month 3outhamptoi. Ceylon (sec Inlia) Ceylon ...... • .......N • b Sat Channel Isles-- • • ..N2 Mon.,Wed.,&Frll. S ou th am pt o n Cu.T • M 2d & 17th of moat! iouthampton China (see India) Constantinople ......N 4,13,18,23,&28 of n Dover .....• Constantinople .. ••• . •• 4th !lc 20th of moo Southampton Cont.i of Europe M & N Twice daily ...... Dover ...... fwicedeilf Egypt (see India) France ...... .. 31 &IS Twice daily.... • . D over ..... I'wiceslsill .labraltar ..........M 1,7, 17,20, 27 of in iouthamptoi Dee 20 Greece (see India) Greytown •••• • • • • ml2nd & 17th of mon. ionthampter. krrlyed Hamburgh ..........N . Tuesday & Friday London ..... ilavannah .• .•.. . . ai 2nd of the month Soutliarnpu li Doe. 16 Holland .... ••• • • • •• M Daily.. .... ...... Dover ... .. DAVY Honduras .......... M 17th of the month. Southampton India (viaSouthampt.)ai 4th & 20th of mon. PlymOuth .. Dec. 16 India (via Marseilles)/11 9th&2sth of moutl Dover ...... lonian Isles (see India) 7, 17, & 27 of mon D0ver...... Ireland ........M & N Twice daily ...... (lois head •.• rwi ec(lll Lisbon...... • ....... b) 7 , 9 , 17, & 27 of m. iouthamp t e n Dec. 16 Aadeira ............M 9th of the month Southampton riadoira ............N l 23d of month .... Liverpool ... nee. 16 Malta (see India) Malta ..............N 13, IS, &23 of mon. Do v er ...... Dee' 2) rtauritius (see India) 1 rtauritius •••••••••• h 14th of the month Mexico ............M 2nd of the month.. gouthampeei Dec. 10 Naples ..... ........ N s t llls th2sthormon. Dover ...... Sew Granada ......:111,2d & 17th of month Southampton .n 1 Now Zealand ..........IBy private sidp .. Various port Uncerts. Papal titatoi ........N -, tlllsthr , thofmon. Dover ..... Peninsula .......... N; f ill I 70127thofinon. iouthampte; Peru ........ ~ .. ~,, 51 ill & 27th of mon. 4outhamptoi Port Natal ...... .... N By private ship.,. Variaus ports Doodah ? • Sicily • • ............N sthloth2.sthoinion, Dover .....• Tuscany ........ .. •• 1; itlilstei2;tholinon. Dover ..... Verinuela ..........N1 2d&l7th of month Southamptoi Dec..'l6 Van Diemen's Land (tie, Australia) • ‘ • • • • •• Pe r !Vest Indies .. • ......lie tit t 17th 01 moats ,3outhamptei 'Dec., l6 • : 13outhamptei td t 17th o; niont When any of these date',fall o i a Sunday, the mails will be de 'IA !patched on the following d iy, w i th the cxceptlen o f th e 111---- At , Southampton), and the Malta. both of which will be despatched thi preceding da,. WIND AND WEATIIEit REPORT• MONDAY, Dec. 18. Stations. Course of Wind. State of Weather. Greenwich ...... ... 5.W.,, Overcast—Rain. Lothbury Dublin N.N.W ..... , Rain—Windy. Liverpool Holyhead Bangor ' York Glasgow • W............ Frosty. Edinburgh N. Frosty. Berwick N.W. Perth Greenhill N.E. Hard frost. Stirling .. W Frost. Aberdeen N.E. Snow. Forfar W. Very cold. Darlington N.W. Kirkcaldy N. Hard frost. Dundee Hull W Rain—Sleet. Bridlington Scarborough Whitby Manchester Sheffield N.W ......... Rain—Snow. Wakefield Maryport Stoke-on-Trent Lancaster Swansea N.W Cloudy. Haverfordwest ... S.W Cloudy. Cardiff N. Gloucester S W Foggy. Bath Taunton W Windy. Torquay N.W.Muck rain. Plymouth Bristol N.W Much rail. Carlisle - Cold. Bradford ~ N.E... Snow. Leeds 'l . -. N. ~, . .0 -Stormy. Yarmouth • W. .. . Rain. Brighton N.W Rain. Leamington W Much rain. Ipswich Normanton W.N.W. ... Rain. Derby N.E. Rain. Stamford W Rain. Chesterfield N.W.lain. Leicester W. Rain. Burton-on-Trent W Nottingham Lowestoft W. Rain. Southampton N.W. Cowes N. W. Portsmouth Poole Dorchester .... ..... S.W Rain. Boston S. W Rain. Great Grimsby ... N.E Rain. Newcastle Hague S.W Rain. .20 22 27 29 22 - GOVERNMENT EMIGRATION TO AIISTRALIA.—It is 26 understood that Government have chartered the fine ship .11 Nashwauk,l Captain M'lntyre, belonging to Mr. J. .17 Cross and others of Liverpool, for the conveyance oz 1,1 betweenem 2 emigrants to anoAd 300 adults.delaide,nx t month. She will carry 3 ___.—......! .16 BIRTHS. .22 OF A SON. .28 On the 14th init., at Crocken - hill,.the wife of the Re'. ,28 W. Gardner. OF A DAUGHTER. 25 On the 18th inst., at 33, Lowndes-square, the lady of 27 Sir Henry St. John Mildmay, Bart. MARRIED. On tho 16th inst., a Wilmington Church, H. gew•t• Esq., of Blackheath-park, to Jane eldest daughter of Walton, the George Russell, Esq., of Wilmington-h'sll, Kent. On the 14th inst.. at Holy Trinity Church, daughter of Mr. Wm. Ashe, Rev. John Wood Kewley, of Wavertree, to Mary Jane, of Baines -place, Everton. __--..--.--.................".‘....." DIED. On the 15th inst., at 103, Ebury-street, Eaton-square, Charles Long, Esq., late of her Majesty's Household, aged 66. On the 13th inst., at Appleby-castle, BethisMary, eldest daughter of the lato Sir Win. Ehott, Bart., of Stobs-castlel in the county of Roxburgh. : Printed and Published by AIURDO YOUNG, LONDON of No. 112, Strand, Printer, at The Sun Office, No• 112, Strand, in the Precinct of the Savoy, in the county cf T►ie4day, December J. 9, 1.851