The Sun. — London, England, 1833-04-27 00:00:00

as possible, and to increase tl.eir comforts. The Nocli Marquis seemed to suppose that the only taxes had been taken off that at all directly lightened the bur dens of the agricultural interests were those on taxed carts and bailiffs. He had forgotten the lax upon tiles. No body could doubt the taking off of that tax would give the agriculturists, he would not say considerable, but some relief. A notice stood this evening in the paper with respect to the malt tax, he supposed the Noble Marquis considered that that ought to be taken off.—(Hear.) Now the House would recollect when Le brought forward his financial statement, he had stated the grounds o❑ which he thought that tax ought not to be taken off, and with the exception of that be confessed he hardly knew what other taxes the agriculturist would wish to be reduced. He objeCted to the motion, as it would interfere with the progress of the other measures. An Ho N. MEMBER would suggest the propriety of withdrawing the motion, as an inquiry had been promised. Sir THOMAS FREMANTLE would support the resolution of his Right Hon. Friend. Mr. SLANEY would add his humble request to that of the Noble Lord, that the Chancellor of the Exchequer would grant; relief to the agricultural interest in the way suggested, by taking off the duty on insurance of agricul tural stock. He considered that great relief would be afforded by the commutation of tithes. Mr. WASON remarked, that there could he no sounder policy, than that of enabling the manufacturing interests to purchase agricultural produce to a greater extent. It had been argued, that as they had taken off the duty on marine insurances, they were bound to take off that on agricultural insurances. Now, no relief ought to be granted to any particular interest, unless the taxation on that particular class was injurious to the general interest of the country ; and he hoped that every one who sup ported the repeal of the tax on insurances of agricultural stock would be prepared to take upon himself apr Tor tionate share of the additional burdens which would be rendered necessary by that repeal. Mr. HENRY HANDLEY said that, as a Member for a purely agricultural district, he could state that the con dition of that interest was truly deplorable. Since the financial exposition of the Noble Lord (the Chancellor of the Exchequer), he had received letters front the country, containing expressions not merely of disappointment but of despair, at finding deputations from other interests successful in their efforts for the removal of taxation, while their case seemed entirely neglected. An HON. MEMBER (name not known) made a few observations, that the agricultural interest tvas entitled to a corresponding relief to that which had been granted to the shipping interest. Mr. CUTLAR FERGUSSON said that although he approved of the budget taken altogether, and although he thought the selection of the taxes to be reduced was on the whole judicious, be thought the reductions ought to have been carried to a greater extent, and that the agricultural interest—in which the Noble Lord admitted that there could be no doubt of the existence of great distress—had not been sufficiently considered by him. He thought that a portion of the surplus of 500,0001. ought to have been applied to the reduction of taxes bearing principally upon the firming interest.—(Hear, hear.) If they could not abandon a greater portion of the taxes, they ought to ap. propriate the surplus in that way. If something were not done for the reduction of the poor-rates, the whole of the agricultural interest would be involved in one common deatruction. He would concur with the motion of the Noble Lord, but without any view of embarrassing the Government. Sir M. W. RIDLEY said he would not vote for the motion of the Noble Marquis, for the simple reason, that he did not think that the removal of these taxes would af ford to the parties any effectual relief. Mr. SLANEY said lie wished it to be understood that he was not favourable to the motion of the Noble Marquis. Mr. HU:SIE observed that if the Noble Marquis pressed his motion, lie (31r. Hume) should feel it his duty to propose an amendment to leave out the word agricultural and those following it, and to make the motion run—that "If any farther reduction of taxation was considered expedient, the interests of all classes should be considered." The Hon. Member spoke amid considerable noise in the House, and his amendment excited a great deal of laughter. Lord EBRINGTON should vote against the motion of the Noble Marquis, because it was calculated to give an impression in the country unfavourable to the plan for the reduction of taxation which Ministers had laid down. At the same time lie thought it desirable that the duty al luded to on marine insurance should be removed—as it might be done, without any material derangement of the budget—as it would be not merely a boon, but an essen tial relief. Sir JOHN TYRRELL observed, that with regard to the property which the Hon. Member. for Middlesex held in Essex, he could only say that his tenants were offering premiums to get rid of the land they held of him. The lion. Member proceeded to make a few remarks on the extent of the agricultural distress which prevailed at pre sent, and was confident that, if the Noble Lord would only admit the principle of relief, it would be received with great gratiqule. Sir JOHN WROTTESLEY said (as we understood) that he would vote against the resolutions, with an expla nation. —( Laughter.) fie never voted without an expla nation. The explanation was, that he objected to pass a vote for the relief of one particular class, when the distress was general. If his Hon. Friend, the Member for Lin colnshire, had brought forward his motion for the repeal of half the malt tax—(Hear, hear)—he would have voted for that, on this explanation—(A laugh)—that the House consented to re-impose the duty on beer.—(oll, oh !) The reduction of the duty on beer had not benefited the working classes, and had substituted filth for a whole some beverage. Mr. SINCLAIR cordially supported the motion of the Noble Marquis. lie believed that, unless relief were speedily afforded, the landed interest would soon be on the verge of utter ruin. Much was said about the march of intellect, but the proprietors and the occupiers of the soil had to guard Against the march of confiscation.— (Elem..) His constituents were chiefly engaged in agri cultural pursuits, and were distinguished by their intelli gence and industrious habits; but they felt it almost im possible to contend against their present difficulties. In the last letter which he had received from Caithness, he was assured, by a public-spirited proprietor, that " agricultu rists never were more depressed, and that unless public burdens be diminished, they must all stop payment." lie should not at present discuss the sources of the pressure of which landlords and farmers were complaining, but he i em # id ❑ot help considering the monetary system as one grcat and leading cause. Indeed the present distress and the present currency seemed to him as inseparable as the Siamese twins ; whenever you look at the one, the other unavoidably stares you in the face. The success of this proposition would be hailed with satisfaction by the pro prietors and tenantry of Scotland us a❑ omen of approach ing relief. Sir EDWARD KNATCHBULL supported the mo tion. He expressed great surprise and indignation at the imputation which the lion. Member for Middlesex had cast upon the landowners—that they did not come before Parliament with clean hands. Ile altogether denied the proposition of that Hon. Member—that the landowners were receiving so many millions at the expense of the other classes of society. The fact was, that there were many taxes and duties with which they were exclusively charged. It was a great desideratum, that the question of corn laws should he settled ; but whilst such unjustifiable attacks as these were made, he feared it would never be effee.t.d. All that the agriculturists asked, was au equal Abare of protection and relief with other classes of the community. He assured the Noble Lord it was necessary to do something to relieve the existing distress; for, it he imagined that the. people would receive the slightest bene fit from taking off the duty on tiles, or half the duty on soap, he would soon find his opinion most fallacious. Mr. O'CONNELL thought the Hon. Baronet had, attacked his Hon. Friend the Member for Middlesexe without due regard to the meaning of his expressions. It was true his Hon. Friend vas a better hand at arithme tical than at rhetorical figures—(A laugh)—but what he understood him to mean was this—that it being a noto rious fact that the rat and the weasel frequently consumed the corn in stores, for the want of which the people were starving, the agriculturalists had no great right to com plain of distress. He, however, admitted the distress which existed, and as he believed it to extend to Ireland, would vote for the motion. Mr. T. ATTWooDsa l id that, after the resolution to winpll. the Hou se came on vedn eosdlayemaintained night, it was a all utterly impossible that the corn lawss --he therefore felt it his d u ty to ove f giv e notice of his inten tion, on an early night , to any kind,._ (bGoeat fur the r e peal of all r t laughter) corn laws, and of a ll laws o f lion. Gentlemen a pp eared much amused, the him just as they ha d done the other nigi,t ,w y hel thetreated lion. Member for Tainworth quoted a pamphl et oft his, in which he asserted that no rent had been p aid for th e last four years ; at which the House thought proper to laugh without waiting for the exception—v:z., except out of the capital—he moved, then, in addition, for a re peal of all laws affecting the importation of glair), and live and dead stock. __ --- After a few worth from Mr. PRYME, the House divided, when there appeared-- For the resolution of the Marquis of Chando PO Against it IIS Majority MALT DUTY. Lord A LTHORP having again moved that the Speaker do leave the chair. Sir W. INGILI3Y rose to make his promised motion for a reduction of tle duty on Malt. He expressed his conviction that a diminution, if not a total repeal of the duty on malt would be a great relief to the whole country. In the county which he hid the honour to represent, barley was selling at a lower price than the amount of the duty upon it when it was taken to the malt-house. He was at a loss to conceive why the burdens of the country were allowed to press so heavily upon the landlords, and why the fundlords were not to have their share of the weight. He did not think it was possible to find a better subject on which to reduce the duty than malt. If a por tion of that duty were taken off, he was far from being satisfied that the revenue would not be increased rather than decreased; for it had been proved in former cases that in proportion to the reduction of a tax en any article of consumption the consumption itself had been augmented. The object of his motion was to give satisfaction to all classes in the country. He had been asked by the Noble Lord to suggest a tax in lieu of the malt duty. That was not his office. He was not Chancellor of the Exchequer. If ha were, he might, perhaps, in a little time become like other Chancellors of the Exchequer, more afraid of the fundlord than the landlord. The fundlord and the land lord were, he repeated, at present very unequally taxed. While the landlord had his carriage, his horses, and his servants, for all which he was highly taxed, the fundlord might have nothing but an old woman and a cat, for neither of which he was taxed at loud laugh.) He had offered the conduct of this motion to abler hands, but as the subject had been originally brought forward by him, and as he knew it would be a gratification to the Noble Chancellor of the Exchequer, who would have been disappointed if he had not done so—(A laugh)—he had taken it up again. What he required was, a revision of this odiobs impost, and for that purpose he would move, us an amendment, " That the duty on Malt be reduced from 20s. Bd. to 10s. per quarter." Mr. PARROTT seconded the motion. The revenue from the Nlalt Tax naa 4,825,0001. If half the duty were taken off, there was great reason to believe the con sumption would be so considerably increased that the reve,iue would not lose above 1,200,0001. Now, in his opinion, that was a deficiency which could be made up without touch difficulty. Would there be any injustice in reducing all overgrown salaries ? Would there be any injustice in taking away all sinecures, without givinc any compensation to the holders? Those overgrown salaries, and those sinecures, had been granted by a corrupt House Commons; it was the duty of a Reformed House of Corn. mons to cor:•ect the abuse. Three or four hundred thousand Founds might be derived from those sources. The Civil List might also be reduced, and his Majesty might be appl:ed to to allow 200,0001. to be deducted on that score. They heard of some Judges having 10,0001. a year, and other Judges having 5,000/. a year ; might not the most efficient public servants he obtained in that capacity at half the expense ? Why not reduce the salaries of all public servants—not of the inferior class only, but begin ing at the head, and going all the way down ? He had always been a con , cientious supporter of his Majesty's present Ministers ; but he must say, that their Budget had been received throughout t , e country, not with coldness and dissatisfaction, but with scorn and contempt. He supported, therefore, the motion of the Hon Baronet, convinced as he was, that they ought to do everything in their power to relieve the distresses of the country, and above all, that they should take off at least half the Duty on Malt. Sir JOHN SEBRIGHT perfectly agreed with the Hon. Baronet, that the agriculture of the country would derive great benefit from the adoption of his motion. But he had never, during a pretty long Parliamentary carter, considered it his duty to attend to the in'erests of his con stituents exclusively, or of those of any particular class of society. It had al ways appeared to him that he was a representative of the people of England at large, and that he was bound to consider what would he beneficial to the people of England at large. With that view of his duty, he could not support the motion of the Hon. Baronet; for he felt, that with reference to the general interest, this was not the time at which he could sanction any reduction of the national revenue. No clamour would ever induce him to do what he did not consider his duty. Those cla mours were frequently most unfounded ; for instance, the clamours of the shopkeepers for the reduction of the house and window tax—a tax which the shopkeepers never did pay, and never could pay. It was paid by the landlord —on a hcuse, the rent of which was 200/., the taxes were perhaps 90/. To take those taxes off, would be like taking the tithes off the farmer ; the landlord would have a perfect right to add the 501. to the rent. When an Hon. Gentleman came forward with a proposition to take tiff any tax, and the malt tax in particular, he (Sir John Sebright) would be quite ready to support him, if he were prepared with a substitnte. But how the Noble Lord at the head of the Exchequer could take off the malt tax, and yet provide for the service of the country, he was yet to learn. Agreeing, therefore, with the Hon. Baronet, that the reduction of the malt tax would be highly advantageous in itself, not only to the agricultural, but to the other in terests of the country ; yet, feeling that this was not the time at which the revenue could be ssfely reduced, he would not for the mean and discreditable purpose of ob taining propularity, vote fur the motion. Mr. BENETT said that the county, a portion of which he had the honour to represent, was a large barley county ; but that he should be as little disposed as the Hon. Baronet who had just sat down, to vote for any proposition, however advantageous to his constituents, unless he were convinced that its adoption would be bene ficial to the whole empire, He agreed also with the Hen. Baronet, that it would not be proper to reduce any tax, unless some other mode could be pointed out of ren dering the revenue adequate to the public service, and to the maintenance of the public faith. So much had been said upon this last point, that he was bound in justice to himself to declare, that although he voted in all the mino rities—the honest minorities lie would call thern—on the proposition of the lion. Member for NiThitehaven, he had never meant to depreciate the currency dishonestly, nor had he entertained the slightest intention of breaking faith to the public creditor. He had already stated that le agreed with the lion. Baronet who bad just spoken, that they ought not to reduce any tax until they could find an adequate substitute for it. But that substitute he was persuaded he could find. Io fact, but a few nights ago lie had voted for such a substitute. He was persuaded that the only efficient measure which could be adopted, was a commutation of all the taxes on_ productive industry for a tax on property. It was right that those who de rived protection to their property from our civil and military institutions should pay in proportion to the pro tection they received. The taxes at present, how ever, were not on property ; but actually on the ne cessities of the people. The adoption of the measure which he recommended would supply a mode by which the reduction of the Malt Tax, and of many other taxes, might be made up. He wished the Hon. Baronet had moved !or the repeal of the whole tax, as he should have been glad to get rid of the expense of its collection, and of its inquisitorial machinery; but whether whole or half, he would support the motion. He repeated his con viction, however, that we must be shortly be compelled to obtain our resources from property, arid not from the ne cessities of the people. A tax on property had been con sidered a war tax. Ile would reverse the case, and make it a peace tax. The people of this country were too apt to drive the Government into a war; and, as a check to that disposition, he would in war impose a tax on articles of general consumption. In the meanwhile, he would certainly vote for the motion, which would be advan tageous not only to agriculture but to the people at large, by giving them greater facilities for the enjoyment of one of their luxuries. Sir G. PHILLIPS expressed his hope that those who voted against the present or the last motion would not be supposed adverse to the interests of agriculture. No Member could be more anxious than himself that the agricultural and all the other interests of the country should experience relief; but he voted against these mo tions, because he felt that their adoption would embarass his Majesty's Government. He was disposed to acquiesce in the arrangement for the reduction of taxation proposed by his Noble Friend, in whom he placed the fullest confidence. He had a great respect for his Hon. Friend the Member for Wiltshire, but he had no desire to see him Chancellor of the Exchequer in place of his Noble Friend. Certainly he hoped, if any further reduction of taxation could be made, that of the agriculturists should have the benefit, fur he was ready to admit that the distress which existed amongst the agriculturists was greater than that which existed amongst commercial men. There had been many gross exaggerations of the distress, as he was ready to prove. lie had lately seen many persons front Lanca shire, and he could assure the House, that at no period were the labourers in a better condition than at present. —(A laugh.) He could inform the laughers that he spoke from correct information. IF admitted that there was in some parts of Lancashire cocuiderable distress, but that was incident to the transfer from band-loom to power loom weaving._(lleac, bear.) I.lr. WARBURTON was not of opinion that a commu tation of taxes was improper, provided that industry could be relieved by a fair and equitable property tax. But if he saw the Chancellor of the Exchequer with 13,000,0001. derived from a property tax in the Exchequer, he would ❑ot consent to repeal the duty.on malt till be bad first made terms with that great body of country gentlemen who would not assent to a property tax. Of all crops the barley crops were the most uncertain. In 1530, be fore the increase of consumption occasioned by the repeal of the beer duty, the whole supply of malting barley was exhausted. If there was such a difficulty of securing a sufficient supply of barley, that the whole was consumed before the new crops were ready, before the whole of the beer duty was taken off, that difficulty must be increased by the increased consumption, amounting to 900,000 quarters. It was not only one of the most uncertain crops, but only a small quantity of that grown was fit for malting. Of all the barley grown in Scotland, not above one-fourth could be used for this purpose. What, then, would be the consequence of taking off the malt duty ? Why the whole of it would go into the pockets of the barley growers. It would not transfer that duty into the pockets of the consumers of beer, but would put it into the hands of the barley growers. If the Chancellor of the Exchequer, therefore, had his thirteen millions to be derived from a property tax, he for one would not consent to take off the malt duty, till the country gentlemen would allow the duty on foreign barley to be taken off. They need not be much frightened at that. The barley grown abroad was not very fit for malting ; even it good, when shipped, it heated on the voyage, and was unfit for the malster. In 1630, when barley was at 40s. in this country, the best Bohe mian barley could be got at Hamburg for 30s. or 355. They need not, therefore, be alarmed at the influx of fo reign barley. He would, after making terms with these gentlemen, take off the whole duty. By the present pro posal, they would keep up the whole expensive machinery for levying the tax; they would still expose the manufac turer to all the present vexatious interference, and they would raise the revenue which ,vas left at an enormous per tentage. lie hoped, theiefore, to see it removed altogether. An Hon. Member had complained of the trash drunk at the beer shops. It appeared pretty con clusive by the increased consumption of malt (900,000 quarters), that much of that trash must at least be made from malt. He believed the beer was adulterated by the publicans, and it was of no consequence who brewed it, if they adulterated it. Sir EARDLEY WILMOT (we believe) was for taking off the tax, because that would be of the greatest benefit to the morals and happiness of the people. That was, in his estimation, of more consequence than enriching the Exchequer. But he rose less to speak on this topic than to advert to another suhjeet. He entered that House with a determination to support his Majesty's Government, but unless they should alter their system, it was not his in tention to continue that support. He was sorry to see so much vacillation in their conduct, and he hoped they would take a more decided tone. The House, he was sure, was disposed to support them, and every independent country gentleman, like himself, would give them his hearty support if they showed an intention, as it was their duty, to fulfil the promises they had solemnly made. They were getting into a difficult and dangerous state. At the same — time, they might escape by doing justice to the country. They were exposed, on the one hand, to the pitfalls set for them by open hostility; and, on the other, to the snares of pretended friendship. He was sorry to see them seduced into bye paths, in which there was no safety. 111.tjor BEAUCLERK supported the resolution, as he should support every proposition to relieve the burdens of the people. The country was calling out for a re dnction of its burdens, and the Ministry knew very little of the people if they thought they could continue the pre sent burdens. Mr. HARVEY thought that these propositions were suggested only by selfishness, or some wretched theories. Let the Government only allow Hon. Members to express their opinions, and it would find strength in the diver sity of their opinions. They were now called upon to repeal the malt duties—in a day or two, they were to be asked to repeal the assessed taxes ; would the Noble Lord who proposed it support a commutation of taxes, sup posing the Government were to meet the demand for the repeal by such a plan? He was afraid the Noble Lord would be found in the minority. It would be curious and instructive to learn how the Hon. Members would give their votes on such a plan. He should like to know how many of the minority of 90 who went out just now, on the proposition to give relief to the agriculturists, voted the other evening in favour of the motion for a property tax. It was all very well in Hon. Members pressing the Government to recede from its engagements; but he trusted gentlemen would take the financial situation into consideration before pressing for relief. He thought that they might possibly reduce two or three millions, and that such a sum might, by great exertions, be spared out of the seventeen or eighteen millions Government had to spend. That was, however, only to be done by the most searching economy. He conceived that it was pi,ssible that three millions, but not more, could be spared, and keep up the establishments and preserve the integrity of the country; but how was that to be done if three millions were to be taken off for this tax, and four millions for that ? If one day the malt tax was to be reduced, and another the assessed taxes were to be taken off, making together seren millions ? The malt tax amounted to 4,800.000/.—(We only want the half taken off !) He would come to that presently. But assuming that the a.,.riculturists demanded the whole, and the shop. keepers, as the inhabitants of the towns bad been called by an Hon. Member, required 2,500,000/. to be removed.-- here were upwards of seven millions which the Govern ment wrs required to reduce. Those gentlemen who pro posed this had not shown how the Noble Lord was to get out of this financial difficulty. The Hon. Member for Worcester had brought forward a motion fot imposing a property tax in a manner which would not allow that motion soon to be forgotten, and that motion was partly opposed because it was anticipating the Budget. They were asked to wait—told calmly to resign themselves to confidence in the Ministry, and see what a reformer, as Chancellor of the Exchequer, would produce. The esti mates amounted to eighteen millions ; and what would be left to the Chancellor of the Exchequer, if these demands were granted, without some substitute ? As a reformed Parliament, they were no longer the servants, hut the masters of the Ministers ; and he must blame the Mem- bers for taking the law entirely from them. It was their duty to refuse the Exchequer what they thought right not to take everything from the Government. He wished some Hon. Member would, in that sense. move a re-olution, stating that the country required primarily a reduction of taxation to the amount of three millions ; that would be a substantive proposition ; and next that the malt tax and the assessed taxes ought to be taken off, and their place supplied by a property tax. Let them only look at the situation in which the Government would be placed by the repealing these two taxes without some substitute. H e would con•ent to a property tax, and he would consent to the repeal of the whole of the malt duty, without, as the Hon. Member for Bridport proposed, making terms with the landlords. He would vote for the repeal of the whole tax, and he would also vote for the repeal of the as sessed taxes, and he would supply the place of these taxes by a fair property tax. He wished that the Ministers had proposed some definite plan for the imposition of a property tax ; and then, if it had failed, the blame of the failure could not have rested with them, and they would at once have made themselves infinitely popular, and would have silenced such remarks as those which were made upon them this evening. Lord ALTHORP admitted that what the Hon. Mem ber bad just sta.ed was quite true; namely, that if a reduction of taxatit n, such as that which was now pro posed, should take place, it could not do so without a commutation of taxes. He wished, therefore, that Hon. Gentlemen would consider whether, looking at this ques tion fairly, they were prepared to say that the tax which was suggested, and which was pressed upon the House, was one that they thought would be found more advan tageous than those which were proposed to be removed, and whether they would assist in adopting it. There were two modes in which such a tax could be levied One class of persons thought that it should not be levied upon professional incomes, but that it should be made to affect realised incomes, and them alone. If that was to be the case, he asked those Gentlemen who now sup ported the motion, whether sueh an arrangement wa s likely to afford relief to the landed interest ?—(Hear.) He had always been ag inst a property tax, because he had always thought that, as to introducing an equitable property tax, the difficu'ties that lay in the way of it were suc h, that, as far as he had been able to apply his mind to the subject, he had not been able to find his way out o f. Would any Gentleman say that that property tax which was repealed in 1816 was fair and equitable ? He believed that they all agreed that it was not. The sub ject, indeed, was like that of the poor laws. Every one agreed that the present system was bad—but he should like to see a system that all would acknowledge to be good ; and if such a systein could be prepared with re gard to the property tax, so as to be perfectly fair and equi table, he should be happy to adopt it. The Hon. Member for Warwickshire said that the Government had lost the confidence of the country by their vaccination. The Hon. Member had not, however, pointed out any one instance of that vaccination. He (Lord Althorp) was aware that they had sometimes been accused of obstinacy in carrying forward their measur. s, but he did not know that they had been accused of vaccination. If it was true that the Government had lost the confidence of the country, he did not believe that they had lost it on that account. The Hon, Member who introduced thin motion proposed that half of the malt tax should be taken off. M far as the in convenience to the Government was concerned, the whole might as well be reduced as a part, for in both cases it would be equally impossible to carry on the public service. The whole of the anticipated surplus income would be swallowed up, and if it were twice what it was, it would not he sufficient to meet the loss to the revenue which the adoption of this motion would occasion. It was said that no advantage had been given to the agriculturist. He denied the assertion. The tax on beer had been taken off, and the reduction of that was a great advantage to the barley grower, as it had most materially increased the consump tion of the article he produced. As a proof of this, he need only refer to the bushels of malt consumed in the course of three successive years and to the enormous in crease of the amount of that consumption. In 1830, the number of bushels of malt consumed was 28,641 892. ' In 1831 there were 35,160,000 bushels of malt consumed ; and in 1632 the number reached as high as 10,311,000 bushels.--( Hear, hear.) If this motion was carried, it was impossible that he should eff , ct the reductions of taxation which he had already suggested to the House, unless there was proposed some plan of a property tax such as the House could and would adopt.—(Hear.) For these reasons he felt it to be absolutely necessary to oppose the motion. He admitted that it was the duty of the Govern , ment, if the House resolved on reducing a tax, to find a substitute for it, but he confessed that, should the House abolish this tax, he was not able to name a substitute that • would be equally satisfactory with that which was proposed to be taken off. The meeting which took place yesterday • had been referred to as a proof of the evils of giving represen tatives to the metropolitan borotsgha, and they , were told that they had been forewarned of the enormous and overwhelming power they were creating when they proposed to give them representatives. His answer was, that in whatever he had done he had endeavoured to act with perfect impartiality.—(Hear.) His not having done more for the metropolis than he had done in the budget, had, he found, rendered his propositions unpopular in this great city; and his not having done more for the agricul turists, would, he was also told, render them unpopular in the country. He regretted the consequence in both cases ; but such was the fate of all men who took every possible • care to do that which was fair for all pars of the empire alike —(Hear.) However the Hon. Member fur War wickshire might charge him with vaccillation, he should not be found vaccillating now. It was his determination, as lung as he held the situation which he at present occu pied, to endeavour to act fairly between all the different interests of the country—(Hear)—notwithstanding that, by so doing, he might subject himself to the reproach that he did not act as sonic particular interests in the country might wish.—(Hear.) Mr. COBBETT said that before he proceeded to make any observations on this particular question, he must say a word or two about what had fallen from an Hon. Mem. ber respecting the corn laws. The Corn Law Bill had always bad his opposition, not because it was unjust in itself, but because of the eff.-ct it produced on the Govern ment and the country. When that Bill was first brought in, an Hon. Gentleman, who was now Member for the south division of Wiltshire, was one of its chief sup porters. The landlords generally supported it, as they thought it was a boon to the agricultural interest. He had no doubt of their good intentions--they thought the measure would lie of advantage to them.—(A laugh.) They were mistaken. He had addressed, in the course of last year, nearly half a million of persons, and all, or almost all, thought that the corn laws had been passed to tax the people for the benefit of the landlords—that the laws were, in fact, a means for taking out of the pockets of the people a large sum of money to put it into the pockets of the landlords ; and that, therefore, it was most unjust. He had endeavoured, and he believed successfully —(Hear)—every where to show them that that was an injustice towards the landlords. He believed that the landlords would be glad to get rid of these laws. The corn laws were represented to be something new. Why there hail been corn laws in England since the time of Edward the Third, and no one thought then, or long afterwards to talk of the tax on foreign corn as unjust. It was believed to be for the good of the country. Then there was the American Government. Nobody would suppose that that Government would levy a tax to benefit a particular class at the expense of all the rest of the people. Yet there had been a tax on corn in the United States from the first moment of the Federal Go vernment till the year 1824—a tax of 20 cents, upon the bushel of wheat, Winchester measure, and a tax of 10 cents upon the bushel of oats of Winchester measure.— (Hear.) His constituents had desired his colleague and himself to pledge themselves to vote against the corn laws, and they had distinctly told the people that they would not do so, unless some of the burdens were removed from the land.—(Hear, hear.) They would only give the pledge upon that condition. The Hon. and respectable, and, he might add, the venerable—(A laugh)—Member for Hert fordshire, had favoured them with his opinions on this question, and had said that he should oppose the motion, although he represented a county where more barley was grown thou in any other county. To be sure he would; but then Hertfordshire was no more concerned ha it than Lancashire; for though the barley was grown in Hert fordshire, the beer made from it was drunk in Lancashire. The respectable Member for Hertfordshire had said that the outcry against the window tax was most mistaken, for that the landlords, not the tenants, paid the window tax. He might as well say that thelandlords paid the probate duty on the wills of their tenants when they died.—(A laugh.) If that were so, then the landlords paid the male tax too.— (Hear, hear.) Faith, then, we were in error indeed, and when the chopsticks complained of the high price of the beer they were drinking, the boy who served it could say, " Oh, you are wrong, the landlords pay the tax and not you."—(Aliugh.) That was going so near the verge of absurdity, that it might be said to be absurdity, even in the presence of the honourable person for whose age one had so great a respect.—(A laugh.) He had for years past prayed to the Lord to soften the hearts of the Ministers, and induce them to take off the malt tax. He had for years together endeavoured to get them to take off the salt tax, and in that he had been successful. Now, if the Noble Lord would take off the malt tax, he would consent to a compromise with the Noble Lord, but he must take it all off, for half of it would be of no service. It was a most vexatious tax. The Hon. Member for Lincolnshire had told them truly, that in his county, the price of the barley amounted to less than the duty paid on converting it into malt. Suppose the barley was 20s. a quarter, as it was in Narfolk the other day, the duty was 20s. Sd., that made the quarter of malt 40s. Sd., but 'lie malt was selling for 60s. a quarter. There was the injury to the people. That it was which made this tax an object of universal dislike, and that it was which should make the Noble Lord take off this tax in preference to others. It was true that the maltster took some of t.:is 19s. 4d. ; and two or three families of idlers were kept at every malthouse; but whatever the maltsters got, hardly paid the vexation, the tantalization, be experienced from the Excise and its officers. He could not wet the barley as he pleased—he could not put it on the couch when and how he liked—in short, he could do nothing at a time when it was most advantageous or con venient for him to do it. lie had always said that the English Excise was worse than the Spanish Inquisition ; and he was sure that if all the victims of the Exchequer, for the last ten years, were assembled in Palace-yard (if indeed Palace-yard would hold them), the sight of them would absolutely frighten the House. The officers of the Excise, it was well known, were not the most moderate of men; they were, in fact, saucy, rude, overbearing jacks in office.—(Fleur, bear, hear.) The duty ought to be taken off altogether. A bushel of barley would make a bushel of malt, and pay for the malting. The 19s. did not go into the Exchequer ; so that, though the people paid thirteen millions, the Exchequer did not get more than five or six millions, especially after the expense of collecting had been paid. It was a most ruinous and mischievous tax. It was mischievous in its moral effect— it throve young people especially from the larm-house to the public-house; and he had been told by many farmers that they did not keep their men in their houses because of time duty s g qu ntity epcelEtl early uebaiapli them p.ouorffiefons malt.initeeo: taioi: o e dhy f dttl ohfs, marriages —for beer beer -shops, supplying WhenB l ::vi, re v usii n i ni‘pcv n i toorpah g tutp, isey)asits, more gte i sn; n r‘hveathi ia s ch v ei ghselxi farm-houses, u t ispa l etet shns b tet)sin e lssi e i: r ‘wseoe, , %hmonvi f o etf:taehr n hni dreeiat,arndv a nt: c :i s:a c eueksft o tynfflui oungpoßcnwgto,pi they aerdyrtn o ,yonte.,: f m es beer at the farmers occasioned. They might appoint a spy for the police o to f y in u i l u d gi g n o g and me b ri a r c il k i a r t io i o n t police throughout th e country, b ut that would not stop it ❑ g he th h e ae r p e p s y t. s t a T t e i r i e i w Were fifty y ears ago b ut b y a b o li sh i ng t hi s tax. 1 7 , ch no they tya A great tinny books had appeared lately from a Society which had a great functionary at its bead, and which called • itself the " Society for the D ffusion of Useful Know ledge." These books all recommend to the people to use spare c p i e e t t i y pl people o d t r i E t. the diet.—(A England aini Diffusion g h.) di nnooft Useful Knowledge ie t , to he sure ! The l old diet. Their nec ess i t i es f orced them to it. HetobwyuostuehletslpStae'rle-1 them what ought to be done ;—throw all the Useful Knowledge books into the fire, and give them pots of beer.—(Laughter.) The people had grown much poorer within the last few years ; he recollected when he used to see crowds of healthy and strong agricultural labourers in the country churches, each dressed in his clean smock- frock, and looking happy and contented. How was it now ? There was hardly one to be seen in the churches ; or, if there happened to be a few there, they were sure to be found poor and miserable, and without even clean frocks on their backs—(Hear, hear)—and all that was pro duced from the malt.tax.—(Hear.) He could not, how ever, give countenance to a proposition which he did not consider exactly what was required, or which was contrary to his own conviction of what was right. That being the case, he would oppose the motion of the Hon. Baronet because he did not go far enough with it. He only proposed to take one half off the malt tax. That would give neither satisfaction nor the neces sary relief. I f they were only to take 10s. off, the duty and the price of the quarter of malt would still be 50s. ; but let them take 20s. off, and the price would be only 20s. per quarter.—The Hon. Baronet had said that the Government could not spare so much. He (Mr. C.) did not know where the Hon. Baronet got this information, but it was incorrect. He (Mr. Cobbett) was not in the secrets of the Government, but he could tell the Hon. Baronet, that they could spare the whole duty ; and that they would do just as well without it as they do now that that they have it, if the House chose to take it from them. He did not think, that if the motion of the Hon. Baronet were agreed to, the 'mister would take ss. off the price of the quarter of malt, and he would therefore oppose it ; but if he still would agree to alter it, and propose to take the whole duty off malt, he would have his (Mr.Cobbetes) support. If, however, the motion of the Hon. Baronet were carried, he pledged himself on some future day to move for the repeal of the remainder.—(Hear.) Mr. BENNETT explained. He denied the truth of the allegations of the Hon. Member for Oldham. His assertion that evening regarding him was of a piece with other allegations which he was in the habit of making. Mr. CURTEIS called on the Members for all large towns to join the agriculturists in supporting the motion of the Hon. Baronet. He considered the motion of the utmost consequence to the agricultural labourer. It was of greater consequence to the tenants than to the landlord. —(Hear.) He hoped that the motion would be carried, or at all events, that there should be such a respectable minority as would show that the feeling of the whole country was opposed to the tax. Though he always sup ported Ministers when he thought them in the right, he had no hesitation in opposing them when wrong. He wou►d accordingly oppose them on the present question. He hoped that the Hon. Baronet would press his motion to a division. Mr. M. PHILLIPS looked upon the repeal of the tax upon malt as necessary in a moral point ofview. In the manufacturing districts,the effect of the great consumption of ardent spirits was dreadful. He thought it most de sirable, therefore, that it should be repealed, in order to prevent the immense consumptio❑ of ardent spirits, and to bring the people back to the use of a cheap and whole some beverage. He wished, too, to see the people use beer, not in the public-houses, as the present high prices forced them to do, but in their domestic circles. As a Member for a large mercantile constituency, and well knowing their wishes, he could say that they were most anxious for the repeal of the malt tax, not only on ac count of the relief which it would give to themselves, but as an act of justice to the agriculturists.—(Hear.) Mr. R. PALMER said, that it had been insinuated in the former part of the evening, that a motion, brought forward by a Noble Marquis, and seconded by him, had been brought forward with a view to embarrass the Mi nistry. He denied that such was the case. He had seen a statement in the newspapers that morning, however, which, if true, showed that other persons could bring forward motions with the view falsely attributed to the Noble Marquis. But he admitted that he (Mr. Palmer) did ❑ot believe the statement. It was said, that when a deputation lately waited on the Noble Lord opposite (Lord Althorp), to ask for the repeal of the assessed taxes, the answer of the Noble Lord was, " I cannot do it;" and when asked why he refused to repeal those taxes, now that he was in office, while he voted against them when in the Opposition, the Noble Lord was represeuted to have said, '• I did it to embarrass the Government.—(Hear.) If, therefore, the Noble Marquiss had brought his motion forward with the intention of embarrassing the Government, he was not the only one who could do so. He objected to the tax upon malt, because it fell more particularly on the working classes. The rich man had his wines, and did not feel the burden ; but the poor man had nothing but his malt. There was no tax the repeal of which would give so much relief as that upon malt, He was aware of the loss which the repeal of the malt tax would be to the Government; but the time was come when the Chancellor of the Exchequer should try a bold experiment, as the present system did not give satisfaction, to give them a new shape.—( Hear, hear.) It was from this feeling that he, (Mr. P.) on a former night, supported the motion of of the Hon. Member for Worcester. Lord ALTHORP said, with regard to the statement mentioned by the Hon. Member for Berkshire, as having appeared in the ❑ewspapers, the Hon. Member was per fectly right in supposing that he (Lord Altborp) had not made use of the words attributed to him. The facts were there—he (Lord Althorp) was asked by the deputation, why he had voted for the repeal of taxes which he now refused to repeal ? His answer was, that if they looked into his Parliamentary conduct at that period, they would see that he had voted for the repeal of a great number of taxes, which he now considered indispensable, on the ground that he ought to vote against taxes generally, be cause I e thought the expenditure of the Government un justifiable, and that the only way of procuring a reduction of the expenditure was, by a reduction of the taxes.— (Hear, hear.) It should be remembered that there was a large surplus revenue at that time, which he had always thought wrong policy ; and be voted for the reduction of many taxes, in order to get rid of that surplus revenue. Mr. ItUTHVEN thought that the adoption of a pro perty tax was advisable. Mr. BARRON could not vote for a property tax; neither could he, in present circumstances, vote for the reduction of the malt duty, even though he was himself a landed proprietor. He asked bow the expenditure could be reduced to the amount of 2,500,0001., with the pro spect of war in the East, with Holland, and with Portu gal ? He could see no probability of a reduction of the expenditure, and he should, therefore, vote against the re duction of the malt duty. Captain GORDON felt disappointed that no relief had been given by the budget to the agricultural interest. It had been said that the reduction of the duty on tiles and taxed carts was a relief to agriculturists ; but in the part of the country with which he was connected there were neither tiles nor taxed carts—(A laugh)—so that there the relief wAs not felt. He hoped that some reduction would be mule in the duty on malt. Mr. CONNELL said, that the only way to obtain a reduction of expenditure, was by taking away the resources of the Government. Lie thought, besides, that as the consumption would increase on account of the reduction in price, the revenue would not suffer much on account of the reduction moved for by the Hon. Baronet. As he was on his legs, he would say that the impressio❑ on many of the Members of the Deputation which waited on the Noble Lord, was, that the Noble Lord's answer was shaped as stated at the meeting. Mr. HUME reminded the House that when the duties on Spirits and other articles were reduced, the revenue increased. He was sure that the loss to the revenue by the reduction of half the duty on malt, would not amount to more than 800,0001. or 900,000/. He thought that the malt duty should be reduced to the amount which it was before 1802, when it was laid on as a war tax. He would prefer that an additional tax (if necessary) should be laid upon spirits, as he thought it of great consequence to bring back the people to the use of Beer. Mr. LLOYD expressed a hope that, in return for the support which he doubted not the manufacturers would give the agriculturists on this occasion, the latter would unite with them in forcing the repeal of taxes o❑ articles of consumption, and thus compel the Ministers to insti tute a property tax. Mr. HODGES was well acquainted with the feeling of the county which he represented (Kent), and from what he knew of that feeling, he should certainly support the motion of the Hon. Baronet, the Member for Lincoln_ shire, regretting only that it did not go the full extent of a total repeal.—(Hear, hear.) lie must confess, how ever, it was rather curious to hear those gentlemen on the other side of the House, who had for so many years supported every Administration, now calling on the Ministers for remission of taxes.—(Hear, hear.) It would have been much better if, years ago, they had not joined in imposing them. He did not think, however, that Ministers could do better than to take these gentle• men at their words, and to place the establishment of the country on a footing more suited to the desires and neces sities of the people.—(Hear, hear.) Mr. A. BARING, who spoke in so low a tone of voice as to be scarcely audible, said the plan of taxation which Lord Althorp had adopted was nut such an one as was suited to the condition of a great country like this. In voting for the motion of the Hon. B.ronet, therefore, he little h , a li i t a l in n t i a i n a e l d ia . ndo ß n u t t ho a s s e he pr s i a n w cip b l uets chance ehoafd inducingitlierto he Ministry to adopt them, and as it seemed to be a scramble between the Gentlemen who met at the Crown and Anchor and the agricultnral interest who should have the benefit of the anticiFated surplus, and believing that the greater distress existed amongst the agricuhural than amongst the manufacturing population, he should vote for giving the benefit of that surplus to the former. He did not C 1 f o rs i° lowed that the revenue should be red alt ive ° ' De d this on the principle of giving where relief aai6~ uced first place, a reduction of the tsx on wp sl ectt wanted. At the same time h its consumption, and he thought the u ith os place w from the inquiries that were taking Hit be beer shops, that a part of the duqr.lnes thole ! J P tageously apportioned to the liquor sold g , hear.", , —(Lud cries of " No, no," arose` lie!r , . d cr t Lord JOHN RUSSELL amidsteslonis_eo, question. He certainly would not have tr_orP tGe attention of the House, had it not been which he felt at the extraordinary speech a bl e : 0 0 2 o been delivered.—(Loud cheers.) It was 0 ,0 0 4 just observation, that new proselytes alwaY: o greit o tremes ; but that any man should g s &Seiler, 14 treme one way, to so great an extreme For several years past, he had heard the. Essex declare, as indeed he did some nig!'" ~e es p i t l x " r e e d li i e d f deedonly calculated ans o of s av in g et:vine:Cc:is some country t o 1 :::: : t h. : 00.1 ( e C f : large sinking fund, to which not less roan‘ per annum should be appropriated . not burden the people for a sinking fun Friend, taking another course of p -- 01i li ti b r u ;a t lid i :;: , " , the difficulties resulting from a deficit, a,'.roillN surplus of revenue beyond an expenditure o„fr'F..so/1 less." But what said the Hon. Member we nt he say, " keep up the taxes—retain a suffieie somas Oh, no, he said, "If I cannot have 3 .) ,V b,000,000/., let me have a deficit."--(C h , ect : the ing to the statement of his Noble Friend ro bef' there would be a surplus of 1,500,0001• Hie proposed to take off rather snore than 1,00Orropoit? Honourable Member for Lincolnshire, in ,i ) .t ipoe take off half the malt tax, asked for a reol o u. 6oo amount of 2,400,0001. This was the Pr°P o , l , the Hon. Member for Essex—the great Pa ir s l tu sf porter of the sinking fund—thought it en 000 his line of policy to adopt.—(Cheers.) T °B Hots tleman had told them, when the motion of o the, ` , bee for Whitehaven came on for discussio n, but the received many letters from his constituency, ore, which this produced on his mind was only t° , o se' they were grossly ignor a nt : but on the P reee b e he had thrown aside all previous notions"; away all the conclusions of his enlighf e°:a t iee had condescended to become the represents help), worst and most besotted ignorance.--(g etn p ee , of enter on the financial year with the defioi e°, ' lion, was what, he hoped, no Minister of this 0 0 0 , would ever consent to, and what no Houseo„cs of would ever sanction. Tt e necessary consatitbe a proceeding would be, to make the faith°, 010°' suspected at home—to diminish its rePot att i ° d pee ° and to place us in such a situation BS W°° ,,,,bich l(l deprive us of th a t hi g h an d no ble station - hitherto held among the nations of the w orld., ht thought the establishments of the country Ogiopef e l ciently reduced to meet th e d e fi c iency W ei gati , .. g consistent in voting for th e re solution of th e for Lincolnshire. It was, however, equally him, as one of those who brought forWar d d hi eee' o statement for the year—and who had prove 000: not by words, their d e sir e of con ducting ta e t° 910, 0 r of the country in the f u ll s pi r it o f e conotnY' r 6lse e be thought it impossible to make so large 3 fet th e • ,t our establishments as would ena ble us t° ciency which would be occasioned by pase i° ,.gA tion. There was certai n ly one o ther ine t '. - t h 0 00 been sated most fairly—he might say WI t r, , fairness—by the Hon. M e mb er for Cole bes it e o gei llt that this, with som e o th er t axes , m ight be B „ptiie t ri, duced, and a tax upon incom e or property tbe s „ (Hear.) He admitted that it was the duty is" rt after having provided f o r th e nat i on al faith 9° ll l e per to consider what wa y s an d means o f raising the taxation would prove least burdensome ° If the house co ns id ere d suc h mean s less elk l than those which at p resent e xisted , / ige, h oc , course their duty to adopt that suggestion .--- wer e o ; Certainly, if the whol e q ues ti on o f taxation incli n d e be raised for the first time, he said he e igli t s h!e P o favour the sentiments promulgated in a 010 ;: of the late Mr. Huskisaon, in 1830. But '-inefe,, ; - d if they were now to ent e r int o su ch a c°° l- , ife" firmly believed that the hop es o f the 1 1 ° ° ; - ,00 0 disappointed, and that the di scon t en t and iff";bich'‘ would ensue upon the imposition of a ta x deo te e i rience had proved so obnoxious, would preP,° the satisfaction to which it might give r ise pee Upon the whole, then, he would leave th e She r °,; the House, believing, fortified as he was L'Y p 9 0 6 ; ; the other night, that the House would no t on eh dig lend itself to a vo te b y w hi c h the national fa it " rendered liable to suspicion. •„pti9P i , ) Mr. A. RARING explained. He bad dis°„ t ", o A that, in voting for the resolution of the Hon• Y eh be f :, had by no means abandoned the principles g hitherto maintained with regard to the S°,4i ii gi ist e ' j : e But as he found it impossible to convince ' the propriety of adopting his sentiments, be with them according to their own princiffle e * ; Sir C. BURRELL said he s h ou ld vote far 0 0 0 4 , Baronet's motion, but not wi t h an expee teti : would lead to any deficien c y o f th e r e venue; ° lt o)°, teary, he believed that th e inc rease o f the On red'i, malt would be equivalent to the amount of d° , :fapes ° An Host. MEMBER, amidst loud calls of te for o l s t l a ht li i i e, C ( Te l t irh i n t O edt i n a a uF: o s r oe ' to f rsru a ism s so t ie h uri e g a hndtu honest divided,s classes. ingi i w b ) la .s e when e t e e i r t e it 1 1 6 5 3 ; ye on o e tna st kme m ne a lo n t,ff , h aw e sit c hh o e u rn ld iti,ec n iiii e e ti i :: be s t e ;i l then William ioti The Against it announcement.. Majority h a e gai m ns a t i 3 ) l:a l i y ist vv e; 4 ; i : c:p o f f ed i general and prolonged cheering. be „pi Mr. ROBINSON then rose and said, as who voted in the majority on this occasion , 1 - 1 01 ,t e ° isir his duty to state that the vote he had given dictated by any feeling of hostility towards h ', 9 0 10" - h 'i hpy nl not e a l t couldv his e n rn o m v honestlye Government.—(A intention.t n (established, andtaHlbaleuis:vhea.ds)a aware conscientiouslyiaa Gentlemen t tt l hae tb e ts ta tayitisee nf t,: i i g triii : esettb o oe ti fi e roi decision must lead to some embarrassmen t Pf„ in jif er He considered, however, that a most irar' l " li f ° taxation, in its present extent and degree, d jos', t" and he called on the landed gentlemen sarbo 115 ,30 10e :c that the Representatives of the trading and n fds towns entertained an unworthy jealousy t° el ,., r poe t terest, but who had now received their s e r' e sdi i i :( reduction of the malt duty, would be equa ll y " for in a few days, the Hon. Baronet, the Membe r b00., 0 of Lond o n, wou ld propose a tota l repea l of L be tio li j 'l' t • window d u ty, t o l en d t h e i r ass i stance for t'',; these tax es . It wou ld th en , when that noe ss- p of "f,t` carried, be his d u ty—if t h e Government did tioo.cii proposition to that effect—to submit a 1 11 ' r ( le'? adoption of som e means t o supp l y wbafe le „oef might be necessary, a f ter th e en f orce ment of - f or ticable reduction in the public expenditure. the i 0 1 Lard ALTHORP said that he was certai n soo or of the hon. mover of the resolution was not o f bi t f the Govermnant but to carry a measure °ueo i d Notwithstanding, he admitted that what WI is . j 0 that night would place hi s Al a j ee ty' s Minist er j e pifii ° o e oh considerable embarrassment. After the, rit y 0 0 0 the House had just come to, though tbe 114( , ) ,- l ic it very large, he should fe e l a s h ame d o f himse lf rei ° the least opposition or obj ec ti on t o having t'e carried into eff e ct.—(C tieers .) on he aft p The original r e s o l u ti on —" Th a t the d o `,o f" - reduced from 20 s . Bd. to 10 s . a quar ter"!" - ) 5 from the Chair, and carried.—(Loud cheerlsoi e lo Lord ALTHORP po s tp one d th e motion °6ll,tes a Committee of Supply on the Ordnao ce t he 1 Monday next. hist re Sir JOHN KEY pre sen t e d a petition agad„,,, fig and window tax, from th e i n h a bitants of I , °° re.; yesterday. , be The SPEAKER de c id e d th a t it could 00 1 Y 30, as the petition of Sir J o hn Key, the CO3lOO was so read by the Cl er k, am id tile laughter The House adjourned at Twelve o'clock. EXPEDITION.—The early sitti"gst.g ' fey ' of House of Commons, and the exertions of papers, have lately transferred to the olatte P liatai r a 1 3r g ii - taf!', of the interest whic the monopoly f ar telligence formerly enabled the mo rning P 3 P er hid' mind. The lateness and correctness with eening pipers bring down their debates in th e e ", editions is surprising, and The San seems in r ef( spects to outstrip all its competitors. We ha d i ti r gr i i able instance of this in Friday's debate. The I ,'" 0 4 0 ' i of Lou: ALTHORP'S speech was down in Whit e " - di/ ts l i ry : r vn e :i x ba p ye r e. . u ss, ,An b sa u da t en uts on t h ti f iust icor,rn,decinaoa,firotyl:i:c oewuxeresreitnioao)n,fstol,blve,beiloirsfil t‘so Ali-tubers of Parliament seized the latest W l ' 0 0 e y lowed by the post to minute down the par ,en d tb ,11! reduction of taxation and of saving, and to ' , e% their constituents in Whitehaven ; and The Su'otiPil", had Lord ALTHORP'S speech, figures and O ° t l e i ll 4 written out, transferred to type, printed and dil;tr,,ii ' the post clown to within an hour at the vaY i ' time when those two gentlemen wrote.--- ' Herald.